# The true crime thread.



## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

Well then. A few people have been asking for it, so here it is. 

Before I begin, a few people may not like the idea of discussing serial killers or murder cases so if this is not your cup of tea, simply press the back button on your browser and go join the pokemon discussion thread or debate which CM Punk haircut is the best.

I have been following murder cases for a few years now. It always intrigued me. What possesses someone to kill? Are they merely a product of their environment, or is it genetic? A lot of them are quite intricate in the detail and some are quite messy. Some are all about the fame and want to be noticed whilst others are more introverted.

Even those without an active interest can't help but have heard of the likes of Charles Manson, Ed Gein, Ted Bundy, William Gacy and Jeffrey Dahmer.

To get the ball rolling, I thought I would post a quick blurb in my own words about a serial killer I found quite interesting.

*Richard Kuklinski Aka "The ice man"*

His name was Richard Kuklinski. (also known as the iceman) He was a Mafia hitman. He was a big scary looking man standing at 6'5 and about 300 pounds. He had a variety of unique ways of killing his victims, e.g. strangulation, shooting, even poisoning. Whilst he was committing these atrocious acts he was still maintaining a normal and healthy relationship with his wife and kids. He was convicted for only 5 counts of murder, though he has admitted to a lot more. He maintains that he only killed so he can provide for his wife and daughter. Although he does seem to be a lot different to your stereotypical serial killer in that he maintains that he doesn't get any kind of satisfaction from the killings, sexual or otherwise. He was very meticulous and would get close to his victims in order to perform the murders. For example on one particular occasion he went to a gay club and dress as a homosexual in order to get close enough to a victim to preform the kill. Even though he maintains that he doesn't get satisfaction, he does seem to express joy in some of the killings. He was imprisoned December 17 1986 and stayed imprisoned until he died under suspicious circumstances on march 5 2006. The reason it was thought of to be suspicious was because he was due to testify against a member of the infamous gambino family.

Here is an interesting youtube video of an interview with The Iceman.











You could also read about him on wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Kuklinski

What cases do you find interesting? What cases do you find the creepiest? Post your stuff here.

Oh and I guess it goes without saying, don't post crime scene photos/videos as violent images aren't allowed on this site.


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## Expectnomercy316 (Dec 14, 2011)

Nobody beats John Wayne Gacy nobody. Oh and Ed gein the man who was based on classic horror movies!!!


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

I half-wrote a novel (as in, wrote half, it remains unfinished) about a guy who might have/would have become a serial killer and I delved into the mindset of that kind of person quite a bit, or at least one kind of that kind.

I might post a passage or two depending on how the thread goes, but for now I shall offer up one of my favourite Youtube videos of Charles Manson:






That was not how he normally was though, and here's another that gives a better insight into his charisma:


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## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Great topic Bully. It's been a interest of mine for years, I've read about, and watched (through documentaries and films) cases on many famous criminals and serial killers. The most interesting case for me is Ted Bundy, he's the most interesting person I've ever read about. I've got three films on Bundy, the 1986 The Deliberate Stranger film being by far the best and most accurate film on his life. 

Charles Starkweather, Charles Manson, Bonnie and Clyde, Richard Ramirez, David Berkowitz (Son of Sam) also very much interest me.

Wikipedia articles for all the people I've mentioned, have a read for yourself, it's very interesting:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Bundy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Starkweather
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Manson
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonnie_and_Clyde
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Ramirez
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Berkowitz


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## Meki (Dec 25, 2011)

Case of Javed Iqbal. Killed 100 boys in a span of 18 months and showed absolutely no regret afterwards. One of his quotes

''“I am Javed Iqbal, killer of 100 children … I hate this world, I am not ashamed of my action and I am ready to die. I have no regrets. I killed 100 children.”

He's truly the creepiest guy I've ever seen. Not only did he just kill the boys. He sexually assaulted them before killing them by strangulation. He had a diary where he planned the murders and later made drawings of their dead bodies. Committed suicide before he could be hanged by the authority. Truly despicable.


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

I honestly believe that they have Charles Manson drugged up when it comes time to do interviews in order to make him seem crazy and erattic. It seems to be quite at odds with how he seemed in his interviews, very articulate, intelligent and well spoken. 

I think that the powers that are genuinely worried about what he might say. I read a book that charles Manson co-wrote as well. Very interesting man, he also fancied himself as a bit of a musician too, and spent a bit of time with Dennis Wilson. He even helped write songs with the Beach Boys.


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

I feel like we'll retread on a lot of familiar territory from the Birthday thread, but F it, hopefully it takes a life of it's own.



Richard Kuklinski is a good choice to start. Not sure how credible his kills are since most of them are from the horses mouth, but you could tell that this guy was a cold Bastard. Just the stories about him setting people on fire in cars and leaving a guy to be fed by rats in a cave is bone chilling stuff. Always wondered how a man can disassociate himself from his familly life to commit these types of crimes, you have to be completely desensitized to kill like that methodically. Hell, he's so notorious for being cold hearted that Steve Austin himself based his gimmick after him.


Have you ever heard of this? Probably one of the strangest True Crime cases i've ever come across


http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/criminal_mind/psychology/sex_slave/index.html

It's about a couple that kidnapped a young woman and kept her in a wooden box for 7 years. Absolutely crazy stuff. The abducters would occationally let her out and scare her into thinking that there'd be a secret organisation that would hunt her if she escaped. It's really sad what they did to this poor woman, to me this type of thing is just as bad if not worse than going on a serial killing spree. Can't even imagine how she managed to cope with the ordeal after she escaped. I know she had a severe case of stockholm syndrome and didn't have any ill will toward her captors. Can't even begin to comprehend this, but i've also never been in that situation.


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## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

BULLY said:


> I think that the powers that are genuinely worried about what he might say. I read a book that charles Manson co-wrote as well. Very interesting man, he also fancied himself as a bit of a musician too, and spent a bit of time with Dennis Wilson. He even helped write songs with the Beach Boys.


Have you heard some of Manson's songs? They're pretty good, and who knows, if he didn't go down the road he did, he might of made a name for himself in music. There's many more of his songs on YouTube, but here's two I like:


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## Callisto (Aug 9, 2009)

I began looking into Jeffrey Dahmer after watching The Monster Within documentary on the History Channel. The graphic, bizarre nature of his crimes always sends chills down my spine. Dahmer is truly up there as one of the (if not the most) creepiest individuals to ever set foot on this planet.






The trial was also a bit uncomfortable to bare, particularly this reaction.


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

BULLY said:


> I honestly believe that they have Charles Manson drugged up when it comes time to do interviews in order to make him seem crazy and erattic. It seems to be quite at odds with how he seemed in his interviews, very articulate, intelligent and well spoken.
> 
> I think that the powers that are genuinely worried about what he might say. I read a book that charles Manson co-wrote as well. Very interesting man, he also fancied himself as a bit of a musician too, and spent a bit of time with Dennis Wilson. He even helped write songs with the Beach Boys.


You can't do what he did without being an incredibly charismatic person. It's not admiration to say so, it's not bigging him up, it's just accepting the truth and understanding exactly what happened.

Christians will understand, what with their Jesus and all.

Charisma. Some politicians stand for this, some politicians stand for that, but make the people look up to you and admire you for who you are and you don't have to stand for fuck all.


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## Meki (Dec 25, 2011)

Also Lam Kor-wan. He worked as a taxi driver, when picking up female passengers he would strangle them with electrical wire and take them to his family's home and dismember them. The guy hoarded sexual organs in tupperware containers. He took pictures and made videos of his crimes (I won't post any of them as they are not allowed) where he performed necrophilia on his victims. 

Lam lived in the same room as his brother, who was unaware of his activities. He disposed of the bodies with his taxi.

He was sentenced to death by hanging but later his sentence was commuted to life inprisonment. 

Truly creepy guy


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

blarg_ said:


> I feel like we'll retread on a lot of familiar territory from the Birthday thread, but F it, hopefully it takes a life of it's own.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh yeah, lol that completely slipped my mind. Kinda glad they went with "Stone Cold" and not some of the other names that WWE were pitching. 






blarg_ said:


> Have you ever heard of this? Probably one of the strangest True Crime cases i've ever come across
> 
> 
> http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/criminal_mind/psychology/sex_slave/index.html
> ...


Am familiar with Ed. Another big man, although I haven't read that article. Will read now. Like Dahmer and a lot of other S/k. He started as a young child torturing and murdering animals. And had a torrid (to say the least) upbringing. What he did to his own mother? Sickening.


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

I could do quite a few here









One read of the book _Killer, a journal of murder_ will tell you what a terrifying motherfucker *Carl Panzram* was,unrepentant serial murderer/rapist/thief, the book is his memoirs collected in his final years by a sympathetic prison guard and the first book of its kind to explore the mind of a killer first hand, it took almost 40 years before anyone would publish it.

Panzram was a huge, imposing guy, as a career thief he'd spent years in and out of the toughest prisons imaginable. Escaping in 1920 he went on a murder/rape spree that streched from New York to Angola, at least 20 confirmed murders and 1000 claimed rapes.
Finally captured he was sentenced to 25 years(this was 1928) he met the young guard and started getting his every depraved though and memory down on paper, shortly later he murdered a prison worker and was sentenced to death by hanging.
his last words are pretty damn badass -

"hurry it up you hoosier bastard, I couldve hung 10 men in the while youre screwing around"


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

BULLY said:


> Oh yeah, lol that completely slipped my mind. Kinda glad they went with "Stone Cold" and not some of the other names that WWE were pitching.


Wow, didn't know there was an actual video of this. I remember reading about it in an interview Steve did a while back. This pretty much confirms it.


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## razzathereaver (Apr 2, 2012)

I've always been fascinated with Jack the Ripper and the hysteria that surrounded him during the late 1800s. It intrigues me because of how he didn't just strike fear into one small area of East London, but the entire Western world. Just one guy did that. He was kind of a myth, like vampires and the boogeyman, because no one knew the identity of this killer. That's part of why he had such an enigmatic legacy. He had an ominous presence everywhere and everyone was scared. 

Granted, much of the legacy was created by the very early forms of the media, as it was the first true media craze. The letters that were sent were creepy as fuck. One, I think it was "Dear Boss" promised to "clip the ladys ear off", and three days later, a woman was murdered and found with an earlobe missing.

Also, this was in the Victorian East End, a horrible shithole that hosted constant crime and ethnic conflict, so I'd say the killer was definitely a product of his environment.

Even though he only has a confirmed kill-count of 5, his name is and will be more remembered than most other serial killers.


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## Glass Shatters (Jun 14, 2012)

Carl Eugene Watts, likely the most prolific serial killer in American history with 80-100 suspected murders committed by his hand. Was diagnosed mentally retarded at a young age and had an IQ of 75. Was gifted a football schoalrship despite his horrid grades. Started stalking girls at a young age and committed his first murder at 20 years old. Has confessed to 12 murders, claimed 40, but alluded to there being over 80 victims.


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

Nostalgia said:


> Have you heard some of Manson's songs? They're pretty good, and who knows, if he didn't go down the road he did, he might of made a name for himself in music. There's many more of his songs on YouTube, but here's two I like:


Ive got a cool book about Mansons connection to and eventual influence on music(_Music, Mayhem, Murder_by Tommy Udo), really interesting stuff, he gets referenced all over the place through they years by so many cool bands.
His musics ok but probably wouldnt be notable if it wasnt Charlie, pretty typical folky blues of the day, nothing special imo. I saw an interview with Neil Young though who also said he met him back in the day and thought he couldve been huge if he had the right band behind him.


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

Hanoi Cheyenne said:


> Ive got a cool book about Mansons connection to and eventual influence on music(_Music, Mayhem, Murder_by Tommy Udo), really interesting stuff, he gets referenced all over the place through they years by so many cool bands.
> His musics ok but probably wouldnt be notable if it wasnt Charlie, pretty typical folky blues of the day, nothing special imo. I saw an interview with Neil Young though who also said he met him back in the day and thought he couldve been huge if he had the right band behind him.


Charles Manson was also a huge Beatles fan:


http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/manson/mansonbeatles.html


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

Hanoi Cheyenne said:


> I could do quite a few here
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Another interesting one. This man was the biggest misanthropist I think I've ever heard of. He has even gone on record to say that he hates the entire human race including himself. He was truly a product of the terrible environment he was raised and that was around the time of the depression. And he got gangraped at the age of 14. Literally doesn't have a single feeling in his body. Though he was intelligent and very philosophical. Thank god for Henry Lesser who was the only person to treat him like a human being, and helped him to write his book.

Yeah, was an evil sonabitch basically.



blarg_ said:


> Charles Manson was also a huge Beatles fan:
> 
> 
> http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/manson/mansonbeatles.html


What gave it away was it the whole "helter skelter" written in blood on Tates wall? 

Granted they spelt it wrong

Edit: interesting interpretations on display there. Quite warped.


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

Misanthropy pretty much sums up most Serial killers. They go through a series of dissociative experiences throughout life, left with pretty much a nihilistic outlook since they failed to connect with many if any people on an emotional level. It's usually a mix of confusion, anger and misguidance that leads to that sort of thing. Then you have the megalomaniacs who are closely linked to that, but are doing it to feel powerful at other people's expense, and manipulating/taking a life is one of the greatest examples of power. It's like that BTK killer Dennis Rader, he wouldn't just kill out of a desire to quench his killing need , he'd roleplay with his victims for hours and enjoy their suffering. Then, he'd go on to lead his normal everyday life without anyone in his community suspecting a thing. It's fucked up how they're able to play double roles.

Then there are the guys like Gary Heidnik who to me are beyond any type of classification. A certified Genius according to his IQ test, but the guy exhibited the worse type of methodical evil you can even imagine. He was highly intelligent, but used that intelligence to do supremely irrational things. Much like Bundy which used his cunning charm only to lure his victms. Dude technically could've lived a sane and active social life but decided to use his tools to inflict harm. That type of duality is what fascinates me most about this sorta shit.



BULLY said:


> What gave it away was it the whole "helter skelter" written in blood on Tates wall?
> 
> Granted they spelt it wrong
> 
> Edit: interesting interpretations on display there. Quite warped.


Ha, the Helter Skelter correlation is legendary, but Charlie spoke of the Beatles in some of the interviews he did if I recall. Yeah his view was warped, it's strange how much he thinks the Beatles music has something to do black people. I mean, some songs might've been based on racial conflicts, but not to the extent he's taking it.


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## jtyrone (May 1, 2012)

TehJerichoFan said:


> I began looking into Jeffrey Dahmer after watching The Monster Within documentary on the History Channel. The graphic, bizarre nature of his crimes always sends chills down my spine. Dahmer is truly up there as one of the (if not the most) creepiest individuals to ever set foot on this planet.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


his case has always intrigued me for some reason. in a lot of the documentaries they like to make it seem as if he had a normal upbringing which was so far removed from the truth. he was a repressed homosexual+social outcast, could've turned his life around but lost all sanity the day he killed his first vic, the hitchhiker. to add to his creepiness i dont think ive ever seen this man smile, not even an evil sneer, it was just odd to me like he was completely incapable of feeling human emotions.


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## Expectnomercy316 (Dec 14, 2011)

Don't you guys think Charles Manson was a little overrated? the man is far from the "horrible antichrist" that the media makes him out to be. He had never killed anyone personally, all he did was convince other people to kill for him. There are people who aren't even filling a life sentence who have committed worse acts than him. I think his victims and his inspiration is the reason why his "family" and the murders were so publicized. He acts crazy intentionally just to get more attention. If you watch his interview in msnbc.com, he talks about how he "should have killed hundreds of people" then he says he never killed anyone. He lives for the attention.


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## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Expectnomercy316 said:


> Don't you guys think Charles Manson was a little overrated? the man is far from the "horrible antichrist" that the media makes him out to be. *He had never killed anyone personally, all he did was convince other people to kill for him.* There are people who aren't even filling a life sentence who have committed worse acts than him. I think his victims and his inspiration is the reason why his "family" and the murders were so publicized. He acts crazy intentionally just to get more attention. If you watch his interview in msnbc.com, he talks about how he "should have killed hundreds of people" then he says he never killed anyone. He lives for the attention.



The bold part is what makes him even more dangerous, a puppet master pulling strings without getting his hands dirty. He's seen through a warped perception and that blinds his followers/family into commiting horrids acts they possibly wouldn't have done themselves.


I've been interested in Adolpho Constanzo since I saw low budget horror movie called Borderland that was inspired by him and his cult.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolfo_Constanzo

Edit: Damn. The crime library showed a picture of his and others' bodies. Can't show it here.


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

Expectnomercy316 said:


> Don't you guys think Charles Manson was a little overrated? the man is far from the "horrible antichrist" that the media makes him out to be. He had never killed anyone personally, all he did was convince other people to kill for him. There are people who aren't even filling a life sentence who have committed worse acts than him. I think his victims and his inspiration is the reason why his "family" and the murders were so publicized. He acts crazy intentionally just to get more attention. If you watch his interview in msnbc.com, he talks about how he "should have killed hundreds of people" then he says he never killed anyone. He lives for the attention.


Depends what you mean by overrated but you could certainly make that point, as a gruesome mass serial killer? of course, he doesnt even qualify (though he likely did kill a couple of people and was prosecuted for 2).
As a cultural icon of chaos and the death of 60s idealism hes still pretty untouchable, they'll never let him out of prison and if they did you can guarantee every edgy holywood celeb will be wanting their picture taken with him. 
All the time and hype and books written make everything seem bigger than just a guy convincing a bunch of tripping hippies of his delusions of starting a race war.
He does act crazy in interviews but he's always had nuggets of inteligence in his ramblings, I think his ATWA theories still form the basis of a lot of radical environmentalism.


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## Expectnomercy316 (Dec 14, 2011)

It was pretty crazy, but lots of people do things like that and don't get near as much media attention. The fact that he had the women under his 'control' and that high profile people were the ones that were murdered is what made this case the case it turned out to be. I mean, how often is that poor couple they murdered mentioned by name? Not often.


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

Not sure if he's a genius puppet master, or he just recruited some really stupid people. Wouldn't be surprised if they were drugged out of their minds most of the time.


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## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

He had to have been charismatic, luring in the weak minded and downtrodden. Same thing with the Davidians in Waco and Guyana with Jim Jones.

Edit: Drugs are a possibility too.


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

Charismatic, yes. Though i'm not sure how much effort and mind control it took to get them to commit those murders. My guess is that they was already severely mentally disturbed, and it didn't take much coaxing to push them over the edge. I'm still interested to know exactly what went down during the bonding process, but I sure as hell didn't see the genius side of him during interviews. Overly Paranoid Schizophrenic? Check. Charismatic and sometimes quirky? Check. Genius? Uncheck. Master persuader? Unsure, but all he persuaded me to do was change the channel halfway into his interview with Geraldo Rivera.


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## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

blarg_ said:


> Charismatic, yes. Though i'm not sure how much effort and mind control it took to get them to commit those murders. My guess is that they was already severely mentally disturbed, and it didn't take much coaxing to push them over the edge. I'm still interested to know exactly what went down during the bonding process, but I sure as hell didn't see the genius side of him during interviews. Overly Paranoid Schizophrenic? Check. Charismatic and sometimes quirky? Check. Genius? Uncheck. Master persuader? Unsure, but all he persuaded me to do was change the channel halfway into his interview with Geraldo Rivera.



I agree with whether or not his followers were already mentally disturbed and adding to that other elements which created a toxic thought process or lack thereof. I'm pretty sure he's no mastermind genius but he must of known, even if it didn't hit him in the face, that they were mesmerized by him and they would do anything he told them to do.


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## JasonCage (Nov 26, 2010)

razzathereaver said:


> I've always been fascinated with Jack the Ripper and the hysteria that surrounded him during the late 1800s. It intrigues me because of how he didn't just strike fear into one small area of East London, but the entire Western world. Just one guy did that. He was kind of a myth, like vampires and the boogeyman, because no one knew the identity of this killer. That's part of why he had such an enigmatic legacy. He had an ominous presence everywhere and everyone was scared.
> 
> Granted, much of the legacy was created by the very early forms of the media, as it was the first true media craze. The letters that were sent were creepy as fuck. One, I think it was "Dear Boss" promised to "clip the ladys ear off", and three days later, a woman was murdered and found with an earlobe missing.
> 
> ...


Have you ever seen the Johnny Depp movie "From Hell" where Depp is an inspector after him by chance?


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## Expectnomercy316 (Dec 14, 2011)

Ahh i almost forgot, what about Josef Fritzl? that man surely belongs there!


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

My guess is that he's all hype. they painted him as this Hannibal Lecter type Maniacal Genius when in reality he's just a bogeyman. The reason this whole thing snowballed was because of the people involved. Sharon Tate and Roman Polanski were two of Hollywood's biggest names, and the nature of the murders shocked the world. It's human nature to create patterns in our mind and we tend to blow things way out of proportion. When I look at it, I see a bunch of mentally disturbed stoned slackers sitting around a campfire listening to Charlie's warped ramblings for hours on end. Drug enduced, they probably developed some wacked out theory and purpose that lead them to the murders. The only reason Manson's case is so interesting is that he didn't actually commit the murders, but for all we know, maybe he had a smaller influence on them than were lead to believe. If he was talking in the same manner to them than on his interview, then they're clearly stupid if they lead themselves to be influenced by this shit.


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## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Fantastic post. Was liking this back and forth but I'm mentally spent.


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

Haha.. thanks. I could be wrong, but there's also a very good chance that i'm right.


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

I essentially agree blarg but its easier to see all that 4 decades removed, the actual crimes of the family were so tied up in the zeitgeist of the times, they were in the right place at the right time and summed up everyones worst fear about a new generation of kids rebelling against an old order. Its not like people at the time were worried Manson was gonna kill everyone but rather that kids could be so easily led by anyone at all. And isnt taking drugs and coming up with wacked out new ideas pretty much the story of 60s anyway?
Mostly all hype sure, but its interesting multi-layered hype.


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

Yeah I can agree to that, the implications and the culture of the times played a huge role in the magnitude of this case. People likely started to fear copycats, and the fact that these kids were so apparently susceptible created an aura of intrigued around Manson who had his hands clean, but also appeared completely atypical.


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## Jesus_Hong (Feb 8, 2013)

Best thread on this forum. 

Bundy always fascinated me. While all of my friends at school were writing essays on sports stars or teams I was writing them on Ted Bundy. 

Anyone heard of "The Rostov Ripper" Andrei Chikatilo ( I think that spelling is correct). Look him up, it's a great read


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

Jesus_Hong said:


> Best thread on this forum.
> 
> Bundy always fascinated me. While all of my friends at school were writing essays on sports stars or teams I was writing them on Ted Bundy.
> 
> Anyone heard of "The Rostov Ripper" Andrei Chikatilo ( I think that spelling is correct). Look him up, it's a great read


I was kinda the same with Manson and a few others, my folks always had loads of trashy true crime mags and books around, lost interest for a while but one of my best friends now is studying criminology and is full of fascinating info.

Yeah I knew Chikatilo would show up ITT, someone with a stronger stomach can cover that one:lol


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## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Yeah, I'm just gonna let someone else handle that guy too. Same thing with Albert Fish. I read what he said about eating...something. Very disturbing.

Has any one read up on Mary Bell? A 10 year old girl killed three younger boys.


Edit: Just read some stuff about her life before the killings. Horrible life with her mother. Also had a friend participate too.


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## Glass Shatters (Jun 14, 2012)

So who here knows a lot about the Channon Christian and Christopher Newsom murders?


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## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

I just looked that up Glass Shatters...I'm done with the crime stuff for now. Someone else can help you. Sorry.


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## Glass Shatters (Jun 14, 2012)

SpookshowTony said:


> I just looked that up Glass Shatters...I'm done with the crime stuff for now. Someone else can help you. Sorry.


Oh, I'm not looking for help. I was just wondering if with all of the infamous and highly publicized criminals in here if anyone had ever heard of the absolutely gruesome methods and sadistic murders of two people for absolutely no reason. It wasn't highly publicized or put on the mainstream media, but I had never heard of such sick and demented methods.


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## Rush (May 1, 2007)

Hanoi Cheyenne said:


> Yeah I knew Chikatilo would show up ITT, someone with a stronger stomach can cover that one:lol


You mean the douchebag who could only achieve an orgasm from slashing up his victims which were all women and children? :side: Amazing how he evaded capture for so long.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

I'm surprised no one's mentioned Robert Pickton, Canada's imfamous Pig Farmer. Willie, as he was know, went about bringing home prostitutes from Vancouver's impoverished Downtown Eastend – girls who were unlikely to be missed – and killed dozens, though he was only convicted of 6. He claims to have fed the remains to his pigs. 


http://Wikipedia on Robert_Pickton
http://Criminalminds wikiRobert_Pickton

For whatever reason, tonight I can't get the youtube embed tags to work so here's a link instead:
Documentary on Willie the Pig Farmer




razzathereaver said:


> I've always been fascinated with Jack the Ripper and the hysteria that surrounded him during the late 1800s.


Oh, me too! Here's the most amazing Ripper site I've come across, in case you haven't seen it. 
http://www.casebook.org/


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## Jesus_Hong (Feb 8, 2013)

He's a right sicko. 

There is a great channel on sky digital (uk). The crime channel (553). It has all kinds of documentaries about series killers. There's always fascinating stuff on it


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

Pickton's crimes did have one positive come of them, and that was the media attention focused on how law enforcement paid little heed to signs of a serial killer at work until it was too late for so many women. He had abducted and injured sex trade workers who lived to report him, yet he continued to comb Eastside streets for vulnerable girls unimpeded. That Serena Abbotsway, who was already a bit famous for having survived a different brutal attacker, and who helped organize a protest during the disappearances, was then killed at the farm herself made the situation even more pathetic.

That many of the poorest people in the neighborhood he prowled are of First Nations decent also didn't go unnoticed. A lot of people felt there was both class discrimination and racism involved in the early stages of the investigation.


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## Oxidamus (Jan 30, 2012)

My 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th grade IT teacher.

Not really, but apparently he's a murderer.


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## Meki (Dec 25, 2011)

Glass Shatters said:


> So who here knows a lot about the Channon Christian and Christopher Newsom murders?


They weren't the murderers in the story were they? Their names sound familiar. Can't connect them with anything atm


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

Here's another case that I found intersting. Don't think I've seen his name come up yet.

Alexander Yuryevich "Sasha" Pichushkin (born 9 April 1974 in Mytishchi, Moscow Oblast), also known as "The Chessboard Killer" and "The Bitsa Park Maniac", is a Russian serial killer. He is believed to have killed at least 49 people and up to 61–63 people in southwest Moscow's Bitsa Park, where several of the victims' bodies were found.

Pichushkin committed his first murder as a student in 1992 and stepped up his crimes in 2001. Russian media have speculated that Pichushkin may have been motivated by a macabre competition with Russia's most notorious serial killer, Andrei Chikatilo, who was convicted in 1992 of killing 53 children and young women in 12 years. Pichushkin has said his aim was to kill 64 people, the number of squares on a chessboard. He later recanted this statement, saying that he would have continued killing indefinitely if he had not been stopped.

Pichushkin primarily targeted elderly homeless men by luring them with vodka. After drinking with them, he would kill them, hitting them on the head with a hammer. He then stuck vodka bottles in their skulls to ensure that they did not survive. He also targeted younger men, children and women. He would always attack from behind to avoid spilling blood on his clothes. He claimed that while killing people he felt like God as he decided whether his victims should live or die. "In all cases I killed for only one reason. I killed in order to live, because when you kill, you want to live," he once said. "For me, life without murder is like life without food for you. I felt like the father of all these people, since it was I who opened the door for them to another world." 

Experts at the Serbsky Institute, Russia's main psychiatric clinic, have found Pichushkin sane.
Pichushkin, once apprehended, led police officers to the scenes of many of his crimes in Bitsa Park. He demonstrated a keen recollection of how the murders were committed, often acting them out in great detail, which has been committed to film. He also revealed that a number of the murders he committed were not done in his preferred method (hammer blows to the back of the head), but by throwing his victims down into the sewers underneath Bitsa Park (although one of his victims did survive the ordeal).

The murder of Marina Moskalyova, 36, in the summer of 2006, was his last. When a metro ticket was found in her possession at the time her body was found, authorities were able to view the last footage of her alive from surveillance tapes of the Moscow metro system, where she was walking on the platform accompanied by Pichushkin.

Pichushkin was arrested on 15 June 2006, and convicted on 24 October 2007 of 49 murders and three attempted murders. He asked a Russian court to add an additional 11 victims to his body count, bringing his claimed death toll to 60 and 3 surviving victims. During the trial, he was housed in a glass cage. It took Judge Vladimir Usov an hour to read the verdict: life in prison with the first 15 years to be spent in solitary confinement.

When he was arrested, they found a chess board in his apartment. With the victims taking up each square.


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## Meki (Dec 25, 2011)

Any documentaries on that guy BULLY?


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

Check this one out.


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## Meki (Dec 25, 2011)

Thanks (Y)


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

BULLY said:


> Here's another case that I found intersting. Don't think I've seen his name come up yet.
> 
> Alexander Yuryevich "Sasha" Pichushkin (born 9 April 1974 in Mytishchi, Moscow Oblast), also known as "The Chessboard Killer" and "The Bitsa Park Maniac", is a Russian serial killer. He is believed to have killed at least 49 people and up to 61–63 people in southwest Moscow's Bitsa Park, where several of the victims' bodies were found.
> 
> ...




Good read. I remember the Chessboard killer vividly. His delusional God Complex and reasoning as to why he needs to kill is some of the strangest shit ever. Almost acted like a living reaper only picking people at random.

Reminds me of that movie '5150 Rue des Ormes' where the killer was obsessed with Chess, and the ending of that had to be inspired by Alex's case, only this was much more extreme.


http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/serial_killers/history/joe_ball/3.html

Here's another one. Joe Ball owned Bar in Elmendorf. Apparently, he'd bait women and feed them to his pool of Alligators in the backyard. If this is true, it's the stuff of nightmares.


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## samizayn (Apr 25, 2011)

I'm quite interested to see what prompted Oscar Pistorius actually.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

Pistorius? He's rumoured to have quite a temper. He's had incidents in the past, though nothing as extreme as this. I don't know many details about the shooting, only that he's claiming self defense. I find it hard to believe he'd hear a noise in his bathroom, not think his girlfriend might have gone to the toilet, and start firing at the door to kill an intruder. It doesn't sound right.


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## lucklove1101 (Feb 11, 2008)

jtyrone said:


> his case has always intrigued me for some reason. in a lot of the documentaries they like to make it seem as if he had a normal upbringing which was so far removed from the truth. he was a repressed homosexual+social outcast, could've turned his life around but lost all sanity the day he killed his first vic, the hitchhiker. to add to his creepiness i dont think ive ever seen this man smile, not even an evil sneer, it was just odd to me like he was completely incapable of feeling human emotions.




"completely incapable of feeling human emotions"... Isn't that the definition of a sociopath? I am no expert, but I remember briefly going over that in psychology. Don't they generally also start by killing animals?


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## jtyrone (May 1, 2012)

what i meant was even guys like bundy at least showed some sort of facial expression, this guy looked like he's never even cracked a smile a day in his life or even frowned. i dunno it was just creepy to me even knowing that he is a psychopath. 

also, dahmer never actually killed animals. he picked up roadkill and dismembered them, this was a hobby of his.


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## MrMister (Mar 11, 2005)

Three pages and no mention of the Zodiac Killer. The Zodiac Killer scares the shit outta me. It's probably because he was never caught. 

I'm not convinced any serial killer isn't born the way they are. I don't think traumatic experiences matter really. People go through all manners of horrors and they aren't driven or compelled to murder people left and right.


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## lucklove1101 (Feb 11, 2008)

SpookshowTony said:


> The bold part is what makes him even more dangerous, a puppet master pulling strings without getting his hands dirty. He's seen through a warped perception and that blinds his followers/family into commiting horrids acts they possibly wouldn't have done themselves.
> 
> 
> I've been interested in Adolpho Constanzo since I saw low budget horror movie called Borderland that was inspired by him and his cult.
> ...



I am not saying this in a mean way, but I don't understand your way of thinking. Look up cognitive reasoning.


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

jtyrone said:


> what i meant was even guys like bundy at least showed some sort of facial expression, this guy looked like he's never even cracked a smile a day in his life or even frowned. i dunno it was just creepy to me even knowing that he is a psychopath.
> 
> also, dahmer never actually killed animals. he picked up roadkill and dismembered them, this was a hobby of his.


A lot of killers didn't show much emotion as they didn't know how to. They expressed themselves through their killings. To some the act of killing itself as an art


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## reDREDD (Oct 12, 2008)

CM Punk's best haircut was his new nexus one

duh


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

MrMister said:


> Three pages and no mention of the Zodiac Killer. The Zodiac Killer scares the shit outta me. It's probably because he was never caught.
> 
> I'm not convinced any serial killer isn't born the way they are. I don't think traumatic experiences matter really. People go through all manners of horrors and they aren't driven or compelled to murder people left and right.


There does seem to be a pattern though, if you look at the majority of s/k and their childhood. Genetics probably play a part in some cases e.g. if your mother/ father have a history of mental illness, but I think that if you have the right support that it can be managed. They don't seem to have that support, grow up filled with hatred for the human race, then that hatred manifests itself into murder.

The zodiac killer certainly was an interesting one. The way he was mocking the police with those cryptic letters and messages, (somer of which haven't been deciphered) he even made phone calls to radio stations, although it's debatable if that was even him as there were some copycat zodiacs out there, e.g. eddy seda. A guy did about a year or so ago that may be him but it hasn't been confirmed. I assume he'd be dead by now as it's estimated he'd be into his 90's.


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

MrMister said:


> Three pages and no mention of the Zodiac Killer. The Zodiac Killer scares the shit outta me. It's probably because he was never caught.
> 
> I'm not convinced any serial killer isn't born the way they are. I don't think traumatic experiences matter really. People go through all manners of horrors and they aren't driven or compelled to murder people left and right.





BULLY said:


> There does seem to be a pattern though, if you look at the majority of s/k and their childhood. Genetics probably play a part in some cases e.g. if your mother/ father have a history of mental illness, but I think that if you have the right support that it can be managed. They don't seem to have that support, grow up filled with hatred for the human race, then that hatred manifests itself into murder.
> 
> The zodiac killer certainly was an interesting one. The way he was mocking the police with those cryptic letters and messages, (somer of which haven't been deciphered) he even made phone calls to radio stations, although it's debatable if that was even him as there were some copycat zodiacs out there, e.g. eddy seda. A guy did about a year or so ago that may be him but it hasn't been confirmed. I assume he'd be dead by now as it's estimated he'd be into his 90's.


I've actually spent some considerable time thinking deeply about this, though for different reasons. It wasn't that I was interested in serial killers, but I was writing a story about someone who might have become one, or at least a mass murderer.

The character's descent into what normal society would call madness started with him becoming estranged from society, then developing a depression which would result in a suicide attempt, the failure of which cleared his mind of all the nonsense that had filled it and gave him just that one clear thought, that he was free. 

He knew he wanted to die and he knew he had the courage to do it as he had genuinely tried and the failure was an accident of circumstance, thus the burden of life was lifted from his shoulders. The story begins with the suicide attempt and subsequent regaining of consciousness and then follows him as he re-enters the world unburdened by laws and rules and all the things that had held him down.

It was to do with consequences, and when you are happy to die then there is no other consequence that really matters as you have already accepted the ultimate one. He would wonder to himself about being one of those maniacs that pop up every now and then.

He'd wonder if they were really mad, or had just realised there is another way to live other than being confined by other people's expectations.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

I've mulled over the idea of writing something, most likely short form fiction, from a serial killers pov, but I think I'm scared to admit I might understand them a bit too well. Of course, I was thinking more along the lines of His Father's Son by Bentley Little, which isn't at all ambiguous about becoming a killer, though the motivations are muddy.


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

@Anark - its worth reading up on serial killer characteristics, I think the most typically used method for finding motive is the Holmes Typology, i think investigators still use it.

Breaks motive into two types :Act-focused and Process-focused
Your character sounds like he'd fall into the former, which is those who kill quickly and its about the act itself, in this group theres vissionary (who hears voices Randy Orton style) and missionary (who believe they must rid the world of certain people).
Process-focused are those who kill slowly for lust and power, hedonistic thrill seekers who play god

then theres also categories of Organized and Dis-organised groups.

the animal cruelty in childhood thing mentioned is part of the McDonald triad with bed-wetting and arson as things common to most thrill-killers, there are exceptions to all these rules of course.


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

Hanoi Cheyenne said:


> @Anark - its worth reading up on serial killer characteristics, I think the most typically used method for finding motive is the Holmes Typology, i think investigators still use it.
> 
> Breaks motive into two types :Act-focused and Process-focused
> Your character sounds like he'd fall into the former, which is those who kill quickly and its about the act itself, in this group theres vissionary (who hears voices Randy Orton style) and missionary (who believe they must rid the world of certain people).
> ...


Rather interesting. I'll have a proper look into that.

I've had a look at psychopath tests online and done a few, and you'd be surprised how many of my answers would likely indicate I am one.

Don't worry though, you're probably all completely safe.


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

I really like Anark's idea. I explained it in detail one of my posts on this thread, but the act of killing usually starts with a complete dissociation from dogmatic princibles, and desensitization of fundimental human emotions. The emotions are sometimes there, but they're triggered by negative experiences and suppressed memories.

My question about Anark's transcending character is what caused the isolation to begin with. Is the character a Misanthrope? A Nihilist? Those are serious questions to ask if you're going to determine whether a man surviving suicide would be inclided to go on a killing spree. It's one thing not to care, but it's another to WANT to take the life of another. Seems to me like that'd be act of depravation rather than a natural outcome given the character's depression.


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

Good thread topic. 

My Mother and older brother always found this stuff interesting, and when I got to an age when they would let me watch things with them it always interested me as well. I struggled to go very deep into it as I, for some reason, thought it was very wrong to be interested in this type of thing. Don't get me wrong at all, I know it's interesting from a morbid fascinations to psychological sense, and even from a science sense, but I'd never really gone out of my comfort zone and remembered watching and I just thinking about it lately I have found out why. I've found the reasons why it interests me so much, and why I feel wrong doing it. I don't want to bring up why, because oddly the reasoning was brought up on either this forum or anything forums "anything" section and I was called a liar by some troll that affected me strongly.

Recently though, I've touched on the surface and began watching documentaries and I can vouch for the Crime channel also. Downloaded a few books to read as well.

Kuklinski is a place I started at and a place to start this thread off. I didn't know about the Steve Austin thing, very interesting, but I can't be the only one who thinks that Richard Kuklinski reminds them of Jake Roberts. I watched the Iceman tapes on Youtube recently and days later was watching Jake Roberts youtube video about needing donations for a new hip, and my girlfriend asked me why anybody would give a serial killer money for hospital treatment. She thought it was the same mane. Scary thought! 

(I also think he looks like Jack Swagger for some reason, but that may simply be them both in my head molding into one.)

Kuklinski is a very, very interesting man with some serious issues. I heard him say on the video he would never hurt a child, nor probably a woman, when his wife and children have came on record, supposedly, saying that he told them that he'd have to kill them if he ever went too far when he was hitting his wife. He even broke her nose at one point. 

Has anybody read anything about him suspecting he was being poisoned in jail and ended up dying before he was about to give evidence in a trial against a Mafia boss?


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

blarg_ said:


> I really like Anark's idea. I explained it in detail one of my posts on this thread, but the act of killing usually starts with a complete dissociation from dogmatic princibles, and desensitization of fundimental human emotions. The emotions are sometimes there, but they're triggered by negative experiences and suppressed memories.
> 
> My question about Anark's transcending character is what caused the isolation to begin with. Is the character a Misanthrope? A Nihilist? Those are serious questions to ask if you're going to determine whether a man surviving suicide would be inclided to go on a killing spree. It's one thing not to care, but it's another to WANT to take the life of another. Seems to me like that'd be act of depravation rather than a natural outcome given the character's depression.


The character's base is an old friend, sort of, I knew when I was a teenager. He got himself sectioned and lived for about six months or so in a mental home before he eventually admitted that he lied about hearing voices. Even so, he was given a flat by the government and lived on a bigger benefit than ordinary jobless people get because he supposedly had mental problems, even though he had admitted to us that he didn't.

He lost all his friends eventually, and though I know he was still close to his mother, for the story I imagined and extrapolated on what would have happened to him if he became estranged from his family as well. This guy just lives on a lie, putting on a show of mentalness whenever required to by the authorities, but his actions drive everybody away and he is left alone on his free ride.

Occasionally he has to question himself about whether or not he really is lying about being mental. There would be other issues, such as his flat being a shit estate populated with scum bags who cause him a lot of grief etc, and eventually he just has enough and decides to kill himself. He fails, wakes up after the attempt and gets all philosophical with himself, which leads to him leaving the flat and attempting to explore his newly realised 'freedom'. 

Whether or not that ends up as a mass killing, or just a very public suicide I haven't actually decided yet. I've only written about half the story and still don't know how it will end. His first act after leaving the flat is an attempt at robbing a bank, which goes hilariously wrong and is mostly an attempt to lighten the story up a bit as it's quite dark at the beginning (starts with him standing on a chair and slipping the noose on, so).

I call the story '_Through the Eye of a Noose_' which I happen to think is really clever and fuck anyone who disagrees.

As for the real guy the character is based on, last I saw him he had sorted himself out and was now actually working _for _the government in the local civic centre. That's life for you. You ask for apples, deserve lemons, and you get a banana.


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## Meki (Dec 25, 2011)

BULLY said:


> Check this one out.


I watched the vid. Highly recommend it. The way he remembered every singe detail of his 61 murders was truly creepy


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

Anark said:


> The character's base is an old friend, sort of, I knew when I was a teenager. He got himself sectioned and lived for about six months or so in a mental home before he eventually admitted that he lied about hearing voices. Even so, he was given a flat by the government and lived on a bigger benefit than ordinary jobless people get because he supposedly had mental problems, even though he had admitted to us that he didn't.
> 
> He lost all his friends eventually, and though I know he was still close to his mother, for the story I imagined and extrapolated on what would have happened to him if he became estranged from his family as well. This guy just lives on a lie, putting on a show of mentalness whenever required to by the authorities, but his actions drive everybody away and he is left alone on his free ride.
> 
> ...



Very interesting stuff.


Seems like your character could be fundamentally good and incorrupt, but the folies of the outside world made him want to off himself. The circumstances you described about your friend/character do leave someone into a rut. It's probably hard to live in that sorta of bubble and having to create a web of lies(lies you may misconstrue as being facts) in order to feel accepted socially. and escaping that rut requires a huge paradigm shift like your friend eventually made. Unfortunately for your character he took a much different route. 

The fact that he's robbed a Bank seems to be the character's toe dip into newfound megalomania, almost the God Complex feeling of not giving a fuck and using your environment as your own personal playground. That could obviously lead to greater acts of mischief if he doesn't off himself, since he could build an obsession in seing how far he could take it without necessarily having a deep disdain for the human race. That could be an interesting direction, the gradual buildup from a man that suffered, to succumbing suicide and having an epiphany, to exercising his new found freedom until he becomes the very thing that he deplores. The feeling of omnipotence becoming his inevitable downfall. So many interesting directions to take it.

It has potential for an extremely interesting character study, and the parallels between your friend and the character gives you a good idea how to set things up. I really think you should go through with it, i'm one of those people that love reading up on existential based character driven stories with a tangy zip of sarcasm and irony. You're one of the funniest dudes on this Forum, so i'm sure you could incorporate that element brilliantly. (Y)


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## Expectnomercy316 (Dec 14, 2011)

Richard Ramirez "the night stalker" what a fucked up guy.


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

blarg_ said:


> Very interesting stuff.
> 
> 
> Seems like your character could be fundamentally good and incorrupt, but the folies of the outside world made him want to off himself. The circumstances you described about your friend/character do leave someone into a rut. It's probably hard to live in that sorta of bubble and having to create a web of lies(lies you may misconstrue as being facts) in order to feel accepted socially. and escaping that rut requires a huge paradigm shift like your friend eventually made. Unfortunately for your character he took a much different route.
> ...


Some of my favourite books were first person narratives where the character was a little insane, or potentially nuts etc. Like A Clockwork Orange, Catcher in the Rye, books like that. I've always wanted to to write my own story like that and this was the guy.

I've contemplated giving him a happy ending, but quite how that would happen I don't know. I think the build-up of the character's persona might demand a big send-off, which is unlikely to be happy. I'm one of those writers who likes to fuck his readers over at the end by killing everyone or having the villain win, so that's probably what will happen.

When I think about it I get quite excited as I'm really wrapped up in the story and I really want to know how it ends. I should get to it. This thread could provide some inspiration.


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

Anark said:


> Some of my favourite books were first person narratives where the character was a little insane, or potentially nuts etc. Like A Clockwork Orange, Catcher in the Rye, books like that. I've always wanted to to write my own story like that and this was the guy.
> 
> I've contemplated giving him a happy ending, but quite how that would happen I don't know. I think the build-up of the character's persona might demand a big send-off, which is unlikely to be happy. I'm one of those writers who likes to fuck his readers over at the end by killing everyone or having the villain win, so that's probably what will happen.
> 
> When I think about it I get quite excited as I'm really wrapped up in the story and I really want to know how it ends. I should get to it. This thread could provide some inspiration.



Based on the books you brought up, you should definitely check out William Blatty's 'The Ninth Configuration' novel. It's terrifying and convincing journey into the human psyche, and the plot eventually spirals into madness. It's about a an ex black ops soldier coming into a sort of mental institution for ex war vets that suffer from post traumatic stress disorder and other serious folies. He's assigned to be their psychiatrist on hand whenever they need help. Won't spoil anything, but the story takes an unexpected turn. They also made a great movie of the same name, and Blatty directed it himself.


It's funny, in these cases I see the villains as the heroes. In a weird way I end up relating to them on some fucked up level and hope that they escape their agony. Usually these types of stories are multi faceted and no one ends up winning. Seriously, who the fuck ever wins when you really think about it, that seems more like a conceived illusion. Not to be a pessimistic cunt or anything lol


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## TheFranticJane (Dec 22, 2012)

Has anyone heard of the Doodler?
He was a killer who operated in San Francisco. Apparently, he would strangle or stab his homosexual victims to death and then leave the police a nice sketch of their festering corpse.
Hence the name.


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

Is that William Blatty the same guy who wrote The Exorcist? Probably not actually.

I agree with the nobody winning in the end comment, deffo. I don't think there's anything to be won. You don't win happiness and contentment, you can achieve it through understanding of life and yourself, but a winner implies a loser and one person's happiness cannot be dependent on another's misery, or there are surely issues that remain.

As for all the serial killers in real life, I'll have to look into that Holmes theory you mentioned. I wonder if all recorded killers fall into one of those categories, or if there are some that defy all the current logic and understanding.



TheFranticJane said:


> Has anyone heard of the Doodler?
> He was a killer who operated in San Francisco. Apparently, he would strangle or stab his homosexual victims to death and then leave the police a nice sketch of their festering corpse.
> Hence the name.


Nope. How many did he kill and are his sketches online anywhere?


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

Anark said:


> Is that William Blatty the same guy who wrote The Exorcist? Probably not actually.
> 
> I agree with the nobody winning in the end comment, deffo. I don't think there's anything to be won. You don't win happiness and contentment, you can achieve it through understanding of life and yourself, but a winner implies a loser and one person's happiness cannot be dependent on another's misery, or there are surely issues that remain.
> 
> As for all the serial killers in real life, I'll have to look into that Holmes theory you mentioned. I wonder if all recorded killers fall into one of those categories, or if there are some that defy all the current logic and understanding.


Yeah it's the same William Blatty that wrote the Exorcist novel. He also wrote Legion (which turned out to be the plot for the underrated Exorcist 3 movie), also an awesome book if you're into the sacrilegious stuff. 

Completely agree. Most people are in the persuit of happiness, but they never fully achieve this. We achieve fragments of pleasure, but that's just what it is, a momentary chemical secreted by the brain. In the end, all we really win is restricted to the superficial structures we create for ourselves. Winning implies the successful end of something, but life is ongoing until the ambiguity of death. It's nice to give our lives meaning and purpose, but let's not kid ourselves into thinking that there's a peak to be reached.


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## Oxidamus (Jan 30, 2012)

TheFranticJane said:


> Has anyone heard of the Doodler?
> He was a killer who operated in San Francisco. Apparently, he would strangle or stab his homosexual victims to death and then leave the police a nice sketch of their festering corpse.
> Hence the name.


So because he killed _gays_ they called him the doodler right?


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

blarg_ said:


> In the end, all we really win is restricted to the superficial structures we create for ourselves.


Aye, and I think my story will explore what happens when those structures collapse around us.

Or we tear them down ourselves.


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## Meki (Dec 25, 2011)

More activity in this thread than I thought would be possible. Keep it up amigos


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

Known/Convicted Serial Killers by Country:

*Australia*
•	David and Catherine Birnie: also known as "Moorhouse murders"; couple from the suburban Perth area responsible for the murders of four women
•	Gregory Brazel: shot dead a woman in 1982 armed robbery and murdered two prostitutes in 1990
•	John Bunting, Robert Wagner and James Vlassakis: also known as "Bodies in the Barrels Murders"; convicted of the Snowtown murders of 11 people between 1992 and 1999
•	Eric Edgar Cooke: also known as "The Night Caller"; killed at least 8 people; last person to be hanged in Western Australia
•	Bandali Debs: convicted of murdering two police officers and two prostitutes in the 1990s
•	Paul Denyer: also known as "Frankston Killer"; murdered three women in 1993 in the Melbourne suburb of Frankston
•	Peter Dupas: serving three life sentences for multiple murders and rape charges
•	Kathleen Folbigg: murdered four of her infants
•	Leonard Fraser: also known as "The Rockhampton Rapist"; convicted of killing four women in Rockhampton, Queensland
•	John Wayne Glover: also known as "The Granny Killer"; British immigrant who killed six elderly women on Sydney's North Shore; committed suicide in 2005
•	Caroline Grills: also known as "Auntie Thally"; serial poisoner of five family members
•	Paul Steven Haigh: sentenced to life imprisonment without parole for the murders of six people in Victoria in the late 1970s
•	Matthew James Harris: strangled a friend's brother, a female friend and a male neighbour to death over five weeks in 1998 in Wagga Wagga
•	Thomas Jeffries: Tasmanian penal colony escapee responsible for the murders of four people; executed in 1826
•	William MacDonald: also known as "the Mutilator"; killed at least five men between June 1961 and April 1963
•	John and Sarah Makin: late 19th century baby farmers who killed and buried 12 children at a succession of their homes
•	Ivan Milat: killed at least seven tourists in Belanglo State Forest, New South Wales; suspected in similar disappearances in Newcastle
•	Martha Needle: poisoner of four family members and boyfriend's brother
•	Martha Rendell: killed three stepchildren with hydrochloric acid in the 20th century; last woman to be hanged in Western Australia
•	Arnold Sodeman: also known as the "School-girl Strangler"; killed four children in Melbourne in the 1930s
•	Christopher Worrell and James Miller: also known as the "Truro Murderers"; convicted of killing six victims


*Canada*
•	Paul Bernardo: also known as "the Scarborough Rapist"; a Toronto man who killed three teenage girls (including his wife's sister) with the aid of his wifeKarla Homolka
•	Wayne Boden: also known as "the Vampire Rapist" killed 4 women between 1968–1971; died in prison 2006
•	John Martin Crawford: convicted in 1996 for the murders of three women
•	Léopold Dion: also known as "Monster of Pont-Rouge"; raped and killed four young boys in 1960; murdered in 1972
•	William Patrick Fyfe: convicted of killing five women in Montreal; suspect in several other murders
•	Gilbert Paul Jordan: killed between eight and 10 women by alcohol poisoning; deceased (2006)
•	Allan Legere: also known as "Monster of the Miramichi"; killer of five individuals
•	Michael Wayne McGray: Killed 7 people, including a woman and child and a cellmate, claims to have killed 11 others.
•	Clifford Olson: murdered 11 children in British Columbia; died in prison 2011
•	Robert Pickton: charged with the first degree murders of 26 women; allegedly confessed to 49 murders; convicted December 9, 2007 of six charges; reduced to second degree murder
•	Russell Williams: former Colonel in the Canadian Forces convicted in 2010 of two counts of first-degree murder, two counts of forcible confinement, two counts of breaking and entering, and sexual assault,[1] and another 82 charges relating to breaking and entering.[2]
•	Peter Woodcock: murdered three children in 1956–1957 and a fellow psychiatric institute patient in 1991


*France*
•	Marie-Madeleine-Marguerite d'Aubray, Marquise de Brinvilliers: French poisoner; executed in 1676
•	Pierre Chanal: serial killer of 17 boys between 1980 and 1987 who committed suicide in 2003
•	Michel Fourniret: also known as Ogre of Ardennes confessed to nine murders of young girls; allegedly killed 10 more between 1987 and 2001
•	Guy Georges: also known as the "Beast of the Bastille"; serving a life sentence for seven murders between 1991 and 1997
•	Francis Heaulme: serving a life sentence for 20 murders between 1984 and 1992
•	Hélène Jégado: domestic servant who poisoned at least 23 people between 1833 and 1851; executed in 1852
•	Henri Désiré Landru: killed 11 people; inspired the character of Monsieur Verdoux played by Charlie Chaplin
•	Émile Louis: preyed on young handicapped women (seven murders) in 1970s
•	Christine Malèvre: nurse sentenced for the murders of at least 30 terminally ill patients
•	Thierry Paulin: also known as the "Beast of Montmartre"; preyed on the elderly in the 1980s and Murderer of 21 old women
•	Marcel Petiot: doctor who killed 63 would-be refugees from the Nazis; executed in 1946
•	Gilles de Rais: 15th century satanist and child killer (400 killed)
•	Joseph Vacher: also known as "The French Ripper"; 19th century serial killer of 11 people
•	Jeanne Weber: convicted of the murders of 10 children
•	Eugen Weidmann: German who strangled and robbed American dancer Jean de Koven, shot a former accomplice, and shot dead and robbed four other people around Paris in 1937


*Germany*
•	Jürgen Bartsch: killed four, one escaped; died by wrongful overdose during castration surgery
•	Karl Denke: cannibal; allegedly killed 30–40 people in the 1920s
•	Volker Eckert: accused of 19 murders between 1974 and 2006
•	Christman Genipperteinga kept registry of the 964 persons he claimed to have murdered from 1568-1581
•	Gesche Gottfried: serial poisoner who murdered 15 people in Hanover and Bremen; publicly executed in 1831
•	Karl Grossmann: killed women and sold their flesh on the black market
•	Fritz Haarmann: preyed on young men and boys; executed in 1925
•	Fritz Honka: murdered four women in Hamburg and kept the bodies in his apartment
•	Joachim Kroll: also known as the "Ruhr Cannibal" and the "Ruhr Hunter"; claimed 13 victims over three decades; died in prison in 1991
•	Peter Kürten: also known as the "Vampire of Düsseldorf"; executed in 1932
•	Stephan Letter: male nurse who killed 29 patients; arrested in 2006
•	Marianne Nölle: female nurse who was convicted of killing seven patients between 1984 and 1992; suspected of killing 17; sentenced to life imprisonment in 1993
•	Paul Ogorzow: also known as the "S-Bahn murderer"; SA sergeant convicted of raping and murdering eight women by throwing them off trains in Berlin during blackouts in 1941 and 1942
•	Norbert Poehlke, also known as 'The Hammer-Killer': police officer, bank robber and serial killer
•	Peter Stumpp: self-proclaimed werewolf who killed 16 people during the 16th century
•	Sophie Charlotte Elisabeth Ursinus: Berlin aristocrat convicted of poisoning her aunt with arsenic at the turn of the 19th century; boyfriend and husband died similarly
•	Elisabeth Wiese: also known as the "Angel Maker of St. Pauli"; baby farmer who poisoned her grandchild and four others with morphine and burned their bodies in a stove in 1902 and 1903
•	Anna Maria Zwanziger: Bavarian poisoner; killer of four people; executed in 1811


*India*
•	Joshi-Abhyankar Serial Murders: quartet committed around 10 murders
•	Thug Behram: alleged to have killed over 900 people; executed in 1840
•	Surender Koli: convicted of raping and murdering four children in Delhi in 2005 and 2006 with another 12 cases pending
•	Raman Raghav: killed homeless people and others in their sleep
•	Auto Shankar: murdered nine teenage girls in Thiruvanmiyur, Chennai during a six-month period in 1988; executed in 1995
•	Charles Sobhraj: killed at least 12 Western tourists in Southeast Asia during the 1970s; imprisoned in India (released) and Nepal (in prison)
•	Motta Navas: killed pavement dwellers in their sleep during a three-month period in 2012


*Japan*
•	Sataro Fukiage: raped and killed at least seven girls in the early 20th century
•	Hiroaki Hidaka: killed four prostitutes in 1996; executed on December 25, 2006
•	Miyuki Ishikawa: murdered an estimated 103, but could have been up to 169 infants in the 1940s
•	Kiyotaka Katsuta: firefighter who shot and strangled at least eight people, some during robberies, between 1972 and 1982
•	Yoshio Kodaira: rapist thought to have killed 11 people in Japan and Chinese people as a soldier
•	Genzo Kurita: killed six women and two children and engaged in rape and necrophilia
•	Hiroshi Maeue: also known as "Suicide Website Murderer"; lured people from suicide clubs promising to kill himself with his victims
•	Futoshi Matsunaga and Junko Ogata: also known as "House of Horror"; tortured and killed at least seven people between 1996 and 1998, including Ogata's family
•	Tsutomu Miyazaki: also known as "The Otaku Murderer", "The Little Girl Murderer" and "Dracula"; killed four preschool-age girls and ate the hand of a victim; executed in 2008
•	Seisaku Nakamura: also known as "Hamamatsu Deaf Killer", murdered at least nine people
•	Akira Nishiguchi: killed five people and engaged in fraud
•	Kiyoshi Ōkubo: raped and murdered eight young women over a period of 41 days in 1971


*Mexico*
•	Sara Aldrete: also known as "La Madrina"; cult follower of Adolfo Constanza; convicted in 1994 of murdering several individuals during her association with Constanza
•	Juana Barraza: also known as "Mataviejitas" ("Old Lady Killer"); operated within the metropolitan area of Mexico City until January 25, 2006
•	José Luis Calva: cannibal; police found the remains of multiple female victims in his house; committed suicide on December 11, 2007
•	Adolfo Constanzo: also known as "The Godfather of Matamoros"; serial killer and cult leader in Mexico; committed suicide in 1989
•	Delfina and María de Jesús González: also known as "Las Poquianchis"; killed a total of 91; arrested and sentenced to 40 years in prison in 1964
•	Raúl Osiel Marroquín: also known as "El Gato Imperial"; killed four male homosexuals in Mexico City
•	Francisco Guerrero: also known as "El Chalequero" ("The man of the vests"); he`s the first serial killer clocked in Mexico; he was guilty by approximate 20 murders between 1880 and 1888, and one more in 1908.[3][4]
•	Magdalena Solis: religious fanatic, proclaimed "The High Blood`s Priestess", killed to 8 persons in rituals sacrifices.[5]
•	Abdul Latif Sharif: also known as "The Ciudad Juárez`Predator"; he was an Egyptian migrant responsible by unknown female homicides in Ciudad Juárez,[6] maybe 15 murders but only he was convicted by one. He died in prison.


*Russia*
•	Valeriy Asratyan: arrested in 1990 and convicted of three murders and dozens of cases of sexual abuse; executed
•	Andrei Chikatilo: also known as "The Rostov Ripper"; killed 52 women and children throughout the Soviet Union; arrested, convicted and executed in 1994
•	Sergey Golovkin: also known as "The Fisher" killed 11 boys between 1986 and 1992, executed 1996.
•	Vasiliy Kulik: killed 13 people aged between seven months and 75 years; executed
•	Maxim Petrov: also known as "Doctor Killer" and "Doctor Death"; doctor who killed 12 patients
•	Alexander Pichushkin: also known as "Bitsa Maniac", "The Chessboard Killer"; convicted of 48 murders; confessed to killing 63
•	Sergei Ryakhovsky: also known as "The Hippopotamus"; convicted of the murders of 19 people aged between 14 and 78
•	Darya Nikolayevna Saltykova: 18th century noblewoman who tortured and killed serfs on her estate
•	Anatoly Slivko: convicted of killing seven young boys; executed
•	Alexander Spesivtsev: cannibal convicted of the murders of 19 women
•	Alexander Tchayka: also known as "The Fur Coats Hunter"; Ukrainian man who killed 4 women dressed in fur coats in Moscow; sentenced to life imprisonment
•	Sergei Martynov: accused of murdering as many as nine women between 1992 and 2010.


*South Africa*
•	Sibusiso Duma: murdered 7 people in the Pietermaritzburg area of KwaZulu Natal in 2007
•	Cedric Maake: also known as the "Wemmer Pan Killer"; serial rapist; murdered at least 27 people from 1996–1997
•	Jimmy Maketta: also known as "Jesus Killer" convicted on 16 counts of murder, 19 counts of rape from 1996–1999
•	Johannes Mashiane: also known as "The Beast of Atteridgeville" 13 counts of murder, 12 counts of sodomy from 1982–1989
•	Daisy de Melker: poisoner; killed two husbands and one son from 1923–1932
•	Jack Mogale: also known as the "West-End serial killer"; convicted of raping and murdering 16 women in Johannesburg in 2008 and 2009
•	Elifasi Msomi: also known as "The Axe Killer" murdered 15 people under the influence of the Tokoloshe from 1953–1955
•	Nicholas Lungisa Ncama: murdered 6 people in the Eastern Cape, 1997
•	David Randitsheni: also known as "Modimolle Serial Killer" raped and murdered 10 children (kidnapped and raped more) from 2004–2008
•	Gert van Rooyen: allegedly abducted and murdered at least six girls from across South Africa from 1988–1989
•	Samuel Sidyno: also known as "Capital Hill Serial Killer" murdered 7 people in Pretoria from 1998–1999
•	Norman Afzal Simons: also known as "Station Strangler" raped, sodomised and murder 22 children on the Cape Flats from 1986–1994
•	Moses Sithole: also known as "ABC Killer"and The South African Strangler raped and killed at least 38 young women in Atteridgeville, Boksburg and Cleveland from 1994 - 1995
•	Thozamile Taki also known as the "Sugarcane Serial Killer"; robbed and killed 10 women in KwaZulu Natal and three in Eastern Cape, dumping their bodies in sugarcane and tea plantations
•	Sipho Thwala: also known as the "Phoenix Strangler"; raped and murdered 19 women in the sugarcane fields of KwaZulu Natal from 1996 to 1997.
•	Stewart Wilken: also known as "Boetie Boer"; raped, sodomised and murdered at least 7 victims from 1990–1997
•	Elias Xitavhudzi: also known as "Pangaman" murdered 16 people in Atteridgeville in the 1960s
•	Christopher Mhlengwa Zikode: also known as "Donnybrook Serial Killer" murdered 18 people in Donnybrook KwaZulu Natal from 1994–1995


*England*
•	Stephen Akinmurele: also known as the "Cul-de-sac killer"; committed suicide in Strangeways while awaiting trial for the murders of five elderly people in Blackpool and the Isle of Man
•	Beverley Allitt: also known as "Angel of Death"; paediatric nurse who killed four babies in her care and injured at least nine others; sentenced to life imprisonment in 1991
•	Levi Bellfield: also known as the "Bus Stop Stalker"; convicted of the 2002 Murder of Amanda Dowler and two fatal hammer attacks on young women in South West London in 2003 and 2004
•	Ian Brady and Myra Hindley: also known as "Moors Murderers"; murdered five children, aged between 10 and 17, and buried them in Saddleworth Moor
•	Mary Ann Britland: poisoned her daughter, husband, and the wife of her lover in 1886
•	Peter Bryan: institutionalized for fatal hammer attack on woman in 1993; reapprehended for cannibalizing a friend in 2004 but able to batter a fellow patient to death months later
•	George Chapman: poisoned three women; suspected by some authors of being Jack the Ripper
•	John Christie: gassed, raped and strangled at least five women from 1943 to 1953, hiding the bodies at his house 10 Rillington Place in Notting Hill, London; also strangled his wife Ethel andTimothy Evans' wife Beryl and their baby daughter Geraldine.
•	Robert George Clements: doctor who committed suicide when due to be arrested for poisoning his fourth wife. His other three wives all died suspiciously during the interwar period
•	Mary Ann Cotton: British Victorian killer; said to have poisoned more than 20 victims; hanged in 1873
•	Thomas Neill Cream: also known as "Lambeth Poisoner"; began his killing spree in the United States then moved to London; hanged in 1892
•	Frederick Bailey Deeming: in 1891 killed his wife and four children in Britain; remarried and moved to Australia, and then murdered his new wife
•	John Duffy and David Mulcahy: also known as the "Railway Killers"; killed three women near railway stations in the 1980s
•	Amelia Dyer: murdered infants in her care; executed in 1896
•	Kenneth Erskine: also known as "Stockwell Strangler"; sentenced to life imprisonment in 1988 for murdering seven pensioners
•	Catherine Flannigan and Margaret Higgins: Two Irish women known as The Black Widows of Liverpool, they killed at least 4 people by poisoning in the 1880s in order to obtain insurance money
•	Steven Grieveson: also known as "The Sunderland Strangler"; murdered three teenage boys in Sunderland, Tyne and Wear in 1993 and 1994
•	Stephen Griffiths: also known as the "Crossbow Cannibal"; convicted of murdering three prostitutes in Bradford, England in 2009 and 2010
•	John George Haigh: also known as the "Acid Bath Murderer" and the "Vampire of London"; active in England during the 1940s; convicted of six murders, but claimed to have killed nine; executed in 1949
•	Anthony Hardy: also known as the "Camden Ripper"; convicted of three murders; suspected of at least four
•	Trevor Hardy: also known as The Beast of Manchester killed three teenage girls in Manchester from 1974 to 1976
•	Philip Herbert: also known as the "Infamous Earl of Pembroke"; 17th century nobleman convicted of manslaughter but discharged; later killed the prosecutor and pardoned for a third murder
•	Colin Ireland: also known as "Gay Slayer"; killed five gay men in the early 1990s
•	Robin Ligus: drug addict convicted of robbing and bludgeoning three men to death with an iron bar in Shropshire in 1994
•	Michael Lupo: also known as "Wolf Man"; convicted of four murders and two attempted murders
•	Patrick Mackay: charged with the murders of five individuals, convicted of three; confessed to killing 11 people
•	Robert Maudsley: also known as "Hannibal The Cannibal"; killer of four; killed three in prison
•	Raymond Morris: also known as the "A34 Killer"; convicted of one murder, considered to have committed at least two more
•	Robert Napper: also known as the "Green Chain Rapist"; killed two women and a child in the 1990s
•	Donald Neilson: also known as "Black Panther"; killed four people, including heiress Lesley Whittle
•	Dennis Nilsen: killer of 15 (possibly 16) men between 1978 and 1983
•	Colin Norris: nurse convicted of killing four patients in Leeds hospitals
•	William Palmer: also known as "Palmer the Poisoner"; doctor suspected of numerous murders, convicted of one; hanged on June 14, 1856
•	Amelia Sach and Annie Walters: murdered an unknown number of babies put up for adoption
•	Harold Shipman: also known as "Dr.Death"; doctor convicted of 15 murders; a later inquiry stated he had killed at least 215 and possibly up to 457 people over a 25-year period
•	George Joseph Smith: also known as "The Brides in the Bath"; killer of three women
•	John Straffen: child killer and Britain's longest serving prisoner until his death on November 19, 2007
•	Peter Sutcliffe: also known as the "Yorkshire Ripper"; convicted in 1981 of murdering 13 women and attacking seven more from 1975 to 1980
•	Thomas Griffiths Wainewright: artist considered to have poisoned four people
•	Fred West and Rosemary West: also known as "House of Horrors" murderers; she was convicted of 10 murders; both are believed to have tortured and murdered at least 12 young women between 1967 and 1987, many at the couple's home in Gloucester; he committed suicide in 1995 while awaiting trial
•	Catherine Wilson: nurse considered to have poisoned seven people in the 19th century
•	Mary Elizabeth Wilson: also known as the "Merry widow of Windy Nook"; convicted of murdering two husbands by poisoning and considered to have killed two others
•	Steve Wright: also known as "The Suffolk Strangler"; killed five women in six weeks around Ipswich in late 2006
•	Graham Young: also known as "The Teacup Poisoner"; killed three people from 1962 to 1971


*Scotland*
•	Robert Black: Scottish schoolgirl killer; convicted of four murders, suspected of many more
•	William Burke and William Hare: notorious body snatchers in Edinburgh in the 19th century
•	Archibald Hall: also known as the "Monster Butler"; killed five in the 1970s, three with accomplice Michael Kitto
•	Peter Manuel: Scottish murderer of seven, suspected of killing 15; executed in 1958
•	Edward William Pritchard: English doctor who poisoned his wife and her mother in 1865. Two years earlier their maid had died in a mysterious fire
•	Peter Tobin: killer of three women


*Wales*
•	John Cooper: also known as "The Wildman"; and "The Bullseye Killer" Pembrokeshire burglar responsible for the robbery and shotgun double-murders of a brother and sister in 1985 and a couple in 1989
•	Peter Moore: businessman who killed four men at random in Wales


*United States*
•	Charles Albright: also known as "The Eyeball Killer"; convicted of murdering three prostitutes in Dallas, Texas; sentenced to life imprisonment in 1994
•	Rodney Alcala: also known as "The Dating Game Killer"; convicted rapist and serial killer
•	Amy Archer-Gilligan: poisoned a husband and four of her nursing home's residents with arsenic or strychnine in Windsor, Connecticut in the 1910s; total could possibly be 48 to 60.
•	Benjamin Atkins: also known as "The Woodward Corridor Killer"; mission-oriented killer who raped and strangled eleven women in Detroit in 1991 and 1992
•	Joe Ball: also known as "The Alligator Man"; killed at least 20 women in the early 20th century in Texas
•	Velma Barfield: two husbands and two boyfriends died mysteriously with two proving to be arsenic poisoning; confessed to killing three more including her mother
•	Herb Baumeister: suspected of killing 20+ men along I-70; fled and committed suicide after remains of 11 were found on his Westfield, Indiana property
•	Bloody Benders: family who killed guests at their inn in Labette County, Kansas in 1872
•	Robert Berdella: convicted of killing six men in 1988 in Kansas City, Missouri; sexually tortured and dismembered his victims
•	David Berkowitz: also known as "Son of Sam"; convicted of killing 6 people in New York City in 1976-1977
•	Kenneth Bianchi and Angelo Buono Jr: also known as "The Hillside Strangler"; killers of 12 women and possibly involved in three other killings
•	Richard Biegenwald: convicted of killing five people in the early 1980s in the Asbury Park, New Jersey area; suspected in at least six other murders
•	Arthur Gary Bishop: Utah man who murdered five young boys; executed in 1988
•	Lawrence Bittaker and Roy Norris: kidnapped, tortured, raped and murdered five girls in 1979
•	Terry Blair: Kansas City serial killer and rapist; active 1982–2004
•	William Bonin: also known as "The Freeway Killer"; with several accomplices, claimed the lives of 20 boys in California
•	Dallen Bounds: killed two strangers, his girlfriend and her ex-husband in 1999
•	Gary Ray Bowles: beat and strangled six men to death to steal their credit cards in 1994
•	Briley Brothers: three brothers and an accomplice responsible for 11 murders in the 1970s in Richmond, Virginia
•	Jerry Brudos: also known as "The Lust Killer" and "Shoe Fetish Slayer"; killed at least 4 women in Oregon
•	Judy Buenoano: poisoned her husband, boyfriend and son with arsenic in the 1970s; drowned the son in 1980 but caught in 1983 after poisoning and car bombing a fiancee
•	Ted Bundy: law student who raped and murdered more than 35 women in six states; escaped from prison twice before being executed in Florida State Prison on January 24, 1989
•	Ricardo Caputo: also known as "The Lady Killer"; visionary Argentine bluebeard who strangled four women across North America in the 1970s becoming one of the FBI 10 Most Wanted
•	Harvey Carignan: also known as "The Want-Ad Killer"; raped and beat four young women to death in 1972 and 1973 having escaped hanging for a 1949 killing on a technicality
•	David Carpenter: also known as "The Trailside Killer"; murdered five women on San Francisco-area hiking trails between 1979 and 1981
•	Michael Bear Carson and Suzan Carson: nomadic hippie killers involved in the counter-culture movement; suspects in 12 homicides; sentenced to life imprisonment for three San Francisco Bay Area murders in 1983
•	Dean Carter: murdered at least four women
•	Richard Chase: also known as "The Vampire of Sacramento"; murdered six people in California the 1970s
•	Thor Nis Christiansen: shot dead and committed necrophilia on four young women in Isla Vista, California in the late 1970s
•	Joseph Christopher: also known as "The Midtown Slasher"; racist who killed 12 African Americans in 1980 and 1981, mutilating two of them
•	Douglas Clark and Carol M. Bundy: also known as "The Sunset Strip Killers"; killed at least seven people during 1980
•	Hadden Clark: aka "Kristen Bluefin". Cross dressing murderer of a child and a Harvard University student. He was also a suspect in the famous 1974 Cape Cod "Lady in the Dunes" murder case.
•	Cynthia Coffman and Gregory James Marlowe: kidnapped four women by ATMs before accomplice strangled them in five weeks in 1986
•	Carroll Cole: killed 16 people between 1948 and 1980; executed in 1985
•	Alton Coleman: multi-state killer whose killings took place during two months in 1984; convicted of murder in three states
•	John Norman Collins: also known as "The Co-Ed Killer"; committed murders in Ypsilanti and Ann Arbor between 1967 and 1969
•	Ray and Faye Copeland: oldest couple ever sentenced to death in the United States at the ages of 75 and 69; convicted of killing five men; modus operandi was to hire unskilled drifters as farm hands and later kill them
•	Dean Corll and Elmer Wayne Henley: committed the Houston Mass Murders in the 1970s
•	Juan Corona: California killer convicted of murdering 25 men in 1971
•	Tony Costa: killed, dismembered and mutilated four women in Cape Cod in the late 1960s; linked to at least four other deaths and disappearances
•	Richard Cottingham: also known as "The Torso Killer"; convicted of murdering six women around New York City between 1967 and 1980
•	Juan Covington: shot dead three people including his cousin and a co-worker in Philadelphia in 1998 and 2005
•	Andre Crawford: a convicted serial killer, who killed 11 women between 1993 to 1997
•	Charles Cullen: nurse in New Jersey and Pennsylvania who killed as many as 40 patients through lethal injection
•	Andrew Cunanan: shot dead two friends and two strangers in two weeks in Spring 1997; killed Gianni Versace two months later before committing suicide
•	Jeffrey Dahmer: Milwaukee, Wisconsin cannibal who kept heads, skulls and body parts in his apartment for sexual gratification; convicted of 15 murders, but was responsible for two others
•	Albert DeSalvo: Convicted and sentenced to life for the "Boston Strangler" killings. DeSalvo confessed to killing 14 women between 1962 and 1964 though doubts remain as to whether he was the actual killer. He was murdered in prison on November 25, 1973
•	Thomas Dillon: serial sniper who killed five men in southeastern Ohio between 1989 and 1992
•	Westley Allan Dodd: raped and murdered three boys in 1989; executed on January 5, 1993
•	Ronald Dominique: confessed to raping and murdering at least 23 men in Louisiana; sentenced to eight life sentences in 2008
•	Nannie Doss: also known as "The Giggling Granny" and "The Jolly Black Widow"; serial poisoner who killed 11 family members
•	Brian Dugan: convicted of murdering two girls and a woman between 1983 and 1985
•	Joseph E. Duncan III: abducted and murdered a boy in 1997; bludgeoned three people to death in 2005 home invasion to abduct two more children, one of whom he shot weeks later
•	Paul Durousseau: murdered seven in southeast United States between 1997 and 2003; may have killed while stationed in Germany with the Army
•	Edward Edwards: shot a young couple in 1977 and stabbed and strangled another in 1980; died months prior to execution for shooting his foster son in 1996 insurance murder
•	Mack Ray Edwards: convicted of murdering three children after confessing to the murders of six in Los Angeles County between 1953 and 1969; claimed at one point to have killed as many as 18
•	Walter Ellis: also known as "The Milwaukee North Side Strangler"; convicted of killing seven prostitutes in Wisconsin between 1986 and 2007
•	Scott Erskine: convicted of raping and murdering a woman in 1989 and the torture-murders of two boys in 1993
•	Donald Leroy Evans: convicted of two stranglings and police closed the file on another; suspected of another dozen murders but recanted confessions to over 50 more
•	Gary Evans: antique thief who shot to death two shop owners and three accomplices who he suspected of stealing from him between 1985 and 1997
•	Richard Evonitz: abducted and killed three girls in Spotsylvania County, Virginia in 1996 and 1997
•	Larry Eyler: also known as "The Interstate Killer"; convicted of murdering two young men and confessed to stabbing and mutilating 20 more in 1982 and 1983
•	Raymond Fernandez and Martha Beck: also known as "The Lonely Hearts Killers"; killed at least three women and one child in the 1940s but suspected in up to 20 murders in New York and Michigan
•	Albert Fish: also known as "The Werewolf of Wisteria"; sadist and pedophile who cannibalized several children; convicted of one murder, confessed to 2 others, claimed to have molested 100 children
•	Wayne Adam Ford: also known as "Wayward Wayne"; confessed to murdering four women; believed to have killed others
•	Kendall Francois: serial killer from Poughkeepsie, New York who targeted prostitutes; after strangling the women, he would store them in various crawl spaces in and around his home
•	Joseph Paul Franklin: racist serial killer who targeted interracial couples and attempted to assassinate Larry Flynt and Vernon Jordan; convicted of 11 murders and confessed to nine others
•	John Wayne Gacy: also known as "The Killer Clown"; killer of at least 33 men and boys; kept bodies buried under his Chicago home. Executed in 1994.
•	Gerald and Charlene Gallego: also known as "The Gallego Sex Slaves Killers"; kidnapped, raped and killed victims in the late 1970s; most of them were teenagers
•	Carlton Gary: convicted of the murders of seven elderly women in Georgia
•	Donald Henry "Peewee" Gaskins: also known as "The Meanest Man in America"; convicted of nine murders; confessed to more than 200; executed on September 6, 1991
•	Ed Gein: From La Crosse, Wisconsin; Ed Gein committed his crimes in Plainfield, Wisconsin ; two known victims, one suspected victim, four missing persons; elements of Gein's life and crimes have inspired, at least in part, the films Psycho and The Texas Chain Saw Massacre, and the novel/movie The Silence of the Lambs
•	Janie Lou Gibbs: Georgia poisoner who killed five family members
•	Bertha Gifford: found not guilty of three arsenic poisonings by reason of insanity and suspected of 14 other killings, mostly of children, in Missouri
•	Kristen Gilbert: also known as "The Angel of Death"; nurse convicted of killing four by epinephrine injection
•	Sean Vincent Gillis: convicted of killing and mutilating seven women in Baton Rouge in competition with Derrick Todd Lee between 1994 and 2004
•	Lorenzo Gilyard: killed up to 13 prostitutes in the Kansas City area 1977 to 1993
•	Harvey Glatman: also known as "The Lonely Hearts Killer"; Californian rapist and killer of three women; lured women to pose for "bondage photographs"; executed September 18, 1959
•	Billy Glaze: mission-oriented killer convicted of raping and murdering three Native American prostitutes in Minneapolis in 1986 and 1987
•	Billy Gohl: union official linked with the disappearances of over 40 sailors in Aberdeen, Washington in the early 20th century
•	Mark Goudeau: also known as "The Baseline Killer"; convicted of nine murders in Phoenix, Arizona
•	Gwendolyn Graham and Cathy Wood: Michigan duo who murdered five elderly nursing home residents in their care and claimed to have killed another
•	Dana Sue Gray: convicted of murder of three elderly women and attempted murder of a fourth in California
•	Ricky Gray: killed his wife days after his nephew came home from jail; eight weeks later they killed seven people in home invasions in Richmond, Virginia in the first week of 2006
•	Vaughn Greenwood: convicted of nine counts of murder, including eight of the "Skid Row Slasher" killings in southern California
•	Belle Gunness: Norwegian-born murder-for-profit killer who killed her suitors and children in Indiana
•	Anna Marie Hahn: German-born murder-for-profit killer who poisoned five elderly men; executed in 1938
•	William Hance: also known as "The Forces Of Evil"; soldier who used the murders of Carlton Gary as an excuse for killing four women around military bases in 1977 and 1978
•	Robert Hansen: Alaskan baker who killed prostitutes at his cabin; convicted of four murders but admitted to 11 others
•	Harpe Brothers: also known as "Bloody Harpes"; Micajah "Big" Harpe (1768? – August 1799) and Wiley "Little" Harpe (1770? – January 1804), America's first known serial killers were credited with the murders of 40 men, women, and children.
•	Donald Harvey: also known as "The Angel of Death"; hospital orderly; confessed to more than 80 "mercy killings" with 37 confirmed killings
•	Charles Ray Hatcher: convicted of two child murders in 1978 and 1982 having killed another in 1969; also stabbed to death a fellow inmate and another man 20 years apart
•	Dale Hausner: Convicted of killing 6 people in random drive-by shootings in 2006 in Phoenix, Arizona
•	William Heirens: also known as "The Lipstick Killer"; confessed to three murders spanning from June 1945 to January 1946
•	Loren Herzog and Wesley Shermantine: also known as "Speed Freak Killers"; California duo initially convicted of 7 murders, and suspected in the deaths of as many as 15 people from 1984 to 1999
•	Johann Otto Hoch: also known as "The Stockyard Bluebeard"; German who married dozens of US women around the turn of the 20th century, before poisoning them with arsenic
•	Dr. H. H. Holmes: active from 1890 to 1894 during Chicago's 1893 World's Columbian Exposition; convicted of only one murder but definitively tied to at least eight more and confessed to a total of 27
•	Waneta Hoyt: New York woman who murdered her five children
•	Michael Hughes: killed six women and a schoolgirl in the South Los Angeles area between 1986 and 1993, including a Southside Slayer victim
•	Leslie Irvin: also known as "Mad Dog"; convicted of killing six people in Indiana in the mid-1950s; his Supreme Court case set a precedent for fair trials of highly publicized defendants
•	Phillip Carl Jablonski: killed at least four women in California and Utah
•	Keith Hunter Jesperson: also known as "The Happy Face Killer"; killed 8 women between 1990 and 1995
•	Martha Ann Johnson: convicted of smothering three of her children in Atlanta between 1977 and 1982
•	Vincent Johnson: also known as "The Brooklyn Strangler"; a homeless crack addict who killed at least five prostitutes
•	Genene Jones: Texas pediatric nurse who poisoned infants in her care; convicted of only one murder but suspected of 10 or more others
•	John Joubert: also known as "The Nebraska Boy Snatcher"; stabbed three children to death in 1982 and 1983
•	Joseph Kallinger: with his son as an accomplice killed two children including another son in 1974; also killed a woman during a robbery in 1975
•	Edwin "Mike" Kaprat: also known as "The Granny Killer"; confessed to and convicted of the rape, murder, and home arson of 5 elderly women between August and September 1993 in Hernando County, Florida. Sentenced to death February 28, 1995 stabbed to death by two inmates on April 19, 1995.
•	Patrick Kearney: necrophiliac convicted of 21 murders in California and admitted to seven other murders
•	Edmund Kemper: also known as "The Co-Ed Killer"; started killing when he was 15 years old in Santa Cruz, California; convicted of six murders and implicated in four others
•	Scott Lee Kimball: also known as "Joe Snitch"; FBI informant who pleaded guilty to two of at least four murders in Colorado including those of his uncle and three female acquaintances
•	Tillie Klimek: Chicago woman who poisoned five husbands; sentenced to life imprisonment
•	Paul John Knowles: raped and murdered 18 people
•	Randy Steven Kraft: convicted of the murders of 16 young men and boys; suspected of 51 others in California
•	Timothy Krajcir: confessed to killing more than nine women—five in Missouri and four others in Illinois and Pennsylvania
•	Peter Kudzinowski: killed children in New Jersey in the 1920s
•	Leonard Lake and Charles Ng: ex-Marines and survivalists; killed at least 11 people and suspected of 25 in Wilseyville, California; collected and murdered female sex slaves
•	Derrick Todd Lee: also known as "The Baton Rouge Serial Killer"; convicted of two murders; linked by DNA evidence to five others
•	Bobbie Joe Long: also known as "The Classified Ad Rapist"; killed 10 women in Tampa Bay, Florida in 1984
•	Henry Lee Lucas: convicted of 11 murders and confessed to approximately 3,000 others, although most of his confessions are considered outlandish; a task force set up to investigate his claims suggested that the true number of his murders may be as high as 213
•	Kenneth McDuff: also known as "The Broomstick Killer"; death sentence for 1966 triple-murder commuted; killed three days after 1989 parole and ten further times in Waco, Texas until 1992
•	Orville Lynn Majors: nurse convicted of murdering six patients in Clinton, Indiana; suspected of 130 killings between 1993 and 1995
•	Richard Laurence Marquette: first 11th name on FBI 10 Most Wanted for killing, mutilating and dismembering woman in 1961; killed two more with same MO upon 1973 release
•	Lee Roy Martin: also known as "The Gaffney Strangler"; killed two women and two girls in South Carolina in 1967 and 1968
•	Rhonda Belle Martin: Alabama poisoner who murdered six family members; suspected of poisoning at least nine; executed in 1957
•	David Mason: strangled four elderly neighbours in 1980 and his cellmate in 1982 having been imprisoned on lesser charges; suspected of shooting dead his boyfriend
•	David Edward Maust: convicted of killing five teenage boys; one in Germany in 1974, another in 1981, and three he buried in his basement in Hammond, Indiana in 2003
•	David Meirhofer: killed three children and an ex-girlfriend between 1966 and 1974; first serial killer apprehended by offender profiling
•	Frederick Mors: Austrian who killed 17 elderly patients by poisoning in New York
•	Herbert Mullin: schizophrenic in Santa Cruz, California who killed people to prevent earthquakes; convicted of 10 murders and confessed to three others
•	Earle Nelson: also known as "Gorilla Man"; necrophiliac convicted and hanged for one murder; implicated in about 20 others
•	Marie Noe: murdered eight of her children between 1949 and 1968
•	Gordon Northcott: also known as "The Wineville Chicken Coop Murders"; California man who confessed to kidnapping, raping and murdering young boys with the aid of his mother, Sarah Louise Northcott in the 1920s; convicted of 3 murders, suspected of perhaps 20, executed in 1930
•	Carl Panzram: murderer, rapist and arsonist; convicted of two murders; confessed to 19 others; executed in 1930
•	Gerald Parker: also known as "The Bedroom Basher" raped and murdered five women and killed the unborn baby of a sixth woman in Orange County, California
•	Louise Peete: convicted of murdering a man and woman decades apart, four other acquaintances died suspiciously and four husbands committed suicide
•	Steven Brian Pennell: also known as "The Corridor Killer"; convicted of torture-murdering two women, pleaded no contest to two more and suspected of a fifth in Delaware in 1987 and 1988
•	Christopher Peterson: also known as "The Shotgun Killer", confessed to shooting seven people with a shotgun in a killing spree spanning from October 30, 1990 to December 18, 1990 in Indiana
•	Craig Price: also known as "The Warwick Slasher"; teenager who stabbed two women and two children in Rhode Island in the late 1980s
•	Cleophus Prince Jr.: also known as "The Clairemont Killer"; raped and killed six women in San Diego in 1990
•	Dorothea Puente: convicted of three killings in Sacramento, California during the 1980s; suspected of six others
•	Dennis Rader: also known as "The BTK Killer"; killed ten people between 1974 and 1991 in Sedgwick County, Kansas
•	Richard Ramirez: also known as "The Night Stalker"; terrorized Los Angeles in 1984 and 1985; convicted of 14 murders
•	David Parker Ray: convicted of rape and torture and sentenced to 224 years in prison; FBI believes he was responsible for the deaths of 60 women in Truth or Consequences, New Mexico
•	Melvin Rees: also known as "The Sex Beast"; shot and defiled a woman in 1957, torture-murdered a family of four in 1959 and suspected in four other killings
•	Paul Dennis Reid: killed seven people during armed robberies between February and April 1997
•	Ángel Maturino Reséndiz: killed nine people in Texas, Kentucky, and Illinois
•	Gary Ridgway: also known as "The Green River Killer"; convicted of murdering 49 women in Washington state
•	Joel Rifkin: murdered 17 women in the New York City and Long Island areas
•	Harvey Miguel Robinson: teenager who stalked, raped and killed three women in Allentown, Pennsylvania in 1992 and 1993
•	John Edward Robinson: also known as "The Cyber Sex Killer"; lured victims through the internet; convicted of murdering six women in Missouri and Kansas
•	Dayton Leroy Rogers: murdered at least six women in Oregon
•	Danny Rolling: pleaded guilty to murdering five students in Florida; executed in 2006
•	Michael Bruce Ross: raped and murdered seven women in Connecticut; executed May 13, 2005
•	Efren Saldivar: respiratory therapist who killed six patients, possibly as many as 120
•	Altemio Sanchez: also known as "The Bike Path Rapist"; responsible for three murders and numerous rapes spanning a 25-year period in Buffalo, New York; currently serving three consecutive 75 years-to-life sentences for the murders
•	Gerard John Schaefer: Florida police officer who killed up to 34 women and girls
•	Charles Schmid: also known as "The Pied Piper of Tucson"; murdered three teenage girls in 1964 and 1965 and buried them in the desert
•	Helmuth Schmidt: After he committed suicide in jail April 23, 1918 in Detroit Michigan evidence linked to him to four missing women as a murderer and a bigamist in New Jersey and Michigan although speculation is that possibly the body count was as high as thirty.
•	Heriberto Seda: New York City copycat killer of the "Zodiac Killer" active from 1990 to 1993; convicted of shooting eight individuals, killing three; sentenced to life imprisonment in 1998
•	Tommy Lynn Sells: convicted of only one murder; admitted to murdering dozens of people across the United States, possibly in excess of 70 although only six are confirmed
•	Arthur Shawcross: also known as "The Genesee River Killer"; convicted of 12 murders; confessed to one more
•	Anthony Allen Shore: also known as "The Tourniquet Killer"; convicted of strangling a woman with an unusual ligature in 1992 and confessed to killing three girls including two with same MO
•	Robert Shulman: convicted of murdering five prostitutes between 1991 and 1996
•	Daniel Lee Siebert: convicted of 1979 manslaughter; killed nine people across America in three months in mid-1980s including two children and a Southside Slayer victim
•	Robert Joseph Silveria, Jr.: also known as "Sidetrack"; freight train rider convicted of beating to death four fellow transients in 1995 and confessed to dozens more
•	Lemuel Smith: confessed to the murders of five people, including an on-duty female prison guard
•	Morris Solomon Jr.: handyman who killed six young women between 1986 and 1987 in Sacramento, California
•	Lyda Southard: first and fourth husbands' 'typhoid' deaths due to arsenic; first husband's brother poisoned and daughter died; two other husbands died of 'flu'
•	Anthony Sowell: also known as "The Cleveland Strangler" and "The Imperial Avenue Murderer"; convicted of raping and murdering 11 women between 2007 and 2009, leaving their bodies in his house in Cleveland
•	Timothy Wilson Spencer: also known as "The Southside Strangler"; raped and killed five women in Virginia between 1984 and 1987
•	Jack Owen Spillman: also known as "The Werewolf Butcher"; killed two girls and the mother of one of them in Washington State in 1994 and 1995
•	Edward Spreitzer: also known as "The Chicago Rippers"; as part of a satanic cult, raped and mutilated at least four women and also killed a man in Chicago
•	Gerald Stano: convicted murderer of 41 women; executed in 1998
•	Charles Starkweather: murdered 11 people throughout Nebraska in two months the late 1950s with his girlfriend; executed in 1959
•	Cary Stayner: killed four women in Yosemite, California
•	Paul Michael Stephani: also known as "The Weepy-Voiced Killer"; killed 3 women in the cities of Saint Paul and Minneapolis, Minnesota
•	William Suff: also known as "The Riverside Prostitute Killer"; killed 12 women near Riverside, California
•	Michael Swango: physician and surgeon who poisoned over 30 of his patients and colleagues
•	James Swann: also known as "The Shotgun Stalker"; schizophrenic who killed four people in drive-by shootings in Washington, D.C. in 1993 because he heard the voice of Malcolm X
•	John Floyd Thomas, Jr.: also known as "The Southland Strangler" and The "Westside Rapist"; convicted of raping and murdering seven elderly women in Los Angeles between 1972 and 1986 and suspected of 10-15 more
•	Marybeth Tinning: New York woman who smothered nine of her children to death
•	Ottis Toole: Henry Lee Lucas' accomplice; convicted of six murders in Florida; confessed to but never tried for Adam Walsh's murder
•	Jane Toppan: nurse and lust murderer who poisoned at least 31 patients and relatives in Massachusetts up to the turn of the 20th century
•	Maury Travis: St. Louis area torture killer of 12–17 prostitutes from 2000 to 2002
•	Chester Turner: convicted of murdering ten women and a viable unborn baby in South Los Angeles between 1987 and 1998
•	Julia Lynn Womack Turner: "Anti-Freeze Killer" convicted of killing fiance and husband with anti-freeze. Turner committed suicide in prison in 2010 from overdose of high blood pressure medication.
•	Henry Louis Wallace: Charlotte, North Carolina killer of at least nine young women from 1992 to 1994
•	Faryion Wardrip: killed five young women around Wichita Falls, Texas between 1984 and 1986
•	Karl F. Warner: convicted of murdering three teenage girls, in two separate incidents (between 1969–1971), in the San Francisco Bay Area communities of San Jose and Saratoga
•	Coral Eugene Watts: convicted of two murders; admitted to killing 80 people in Texas and Michigan; possibly guilty of 100 murders
•	Nathaniel White: convicted of stabbing to death six women in the Hudson Valley, New York area from 1991 to 1992
•	Christopher Wilder: also known as "The Beauty Queen Killer"; millionaire Australian realtor who killed eight women in seven weeks in 1984
•	Scott Williams: killed and mutilated three women between 1997 and 2006
•	Wayne Williams: convicted of two murders; police claim his arrest solved 23 in the string of 28 Atlanta Child Murders
•	Randall Woodfield: also known as "The I-5 Killer" and "The I-5 Bandit"; convicted of one murder and linked by DNA to six others; believed responsible for an additional 14
•	Aileen Wuornos: shot six men dead in Florida; executed in 2002
•	Robert Lee Yates: murdered at least 16 women in Spokane County, Washington


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

Unidentified United States Serial Killers (inc. suspect charged but not convicted):

*Alphabet murders*: also known as "The Double Initial Murders"; murders of three young girls in the Rochester, New York area during the early 1970s.
*Ann Arbor Hospital Murders*: pavulon poisonings of ten patients at the Veteran's Administration Hospital in 1975
*Axeman of New Orleans*: killer of at least eight people in the New Orleans area from May 1918 to October 1919
*Boston Strangler*: 1960s deaths of 13 women (five young, eight older), mostly with their own stockings as ligature. Albert DeSalvo confessed to the murders, but was never indicted, and DNA evidence has suggested his innocence in one of the cases
*Charlie Chop-off*: murders of five boys in Manhattan in 1972 and 1973. A mental patient confessed to one slashing death. Four stabbings also involving mutilation remain unsolved
*Cincinnati Strangler*: raped and strangled seven mostly elderly women in Cincinnati, Ohio between 1965 and 1966
*Cleveland Torso Murderer*: also known as "The Mad Butcher of Kingsbury Run"; responsible for 12–13 murders in the Cleveland, Ohio area in the 1930s
*Colonial Parkway Killer*: believed to have murdered at least eight people in Virginia between 1986 and 1989; left three couples dead and one couple missing and presumed dead
*Connecticut River Valley Killer*: stabbed at least six women to death in New England in the 1980s, severely injured one [2]
*Daytona Beach killer*: murdered four, possibly five, women in Daytona Beach, Florida between 2005 and 2007
*The Doodler*: sketched then stabbed to death 14 gay men in San Francisco in the 1970s
*Edgecombe County Serial Killer*: murders of nine women and disappearance of another since 2005 around Rocky Mount, North Carolina. Antwan Pittman has been convicted in one case
*Frankford Slasher*: allegedly responsible for nine murders in the Frankford neighborhood of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania; Leonard Christopher was convicted of one murder; another murder was committed in same style while he was incarcerated; believed to still be at large
*Freeway Phantom*: raped and strangled six young women and girls in Washington, D.C. in the early 1970s, dumping their bodies by freeways
*Grim Sleeper*: also known as "The Strawberry murders"; one man has been charged after DNA evidence linked him with ten murders in Los Angeles since 1985.
*Honolulu Strangler*: raped and strangled five young women in Hawaii in 1985 and 1986
*Long Island serial killer*: suspected of killing eight women, a man and a child since 1996 and dumping their bodies along remote beaches in Suffolk and Nassau County, New York. The killer has been referred to as the Gilgo Beach killer because of the location where the first bodies were found.[3]
*New Bedford Highway Killer*: murders of nine women and disappearance of two others between 1988 and 1989
*Oakland County Child Killer*: also known as "The Babysitter"; responsible for the murders of four or more children in Oakland County, Michigan in 1976 and 1977
*Original Night Stalker*: also known as "The East Area Rapist"; killer and rapist who murdered ten people in Southern California from 1979 through 1986
*Phantom Killer*: believed to have committed the Texarkana Moonlight Murders in Texas between February 23 and May 4, 1946
*Servant Girl Annihilator*: also known as "The Austin Axe Murderer"; responsible for at least seven murders in Austin, Texas between 1884 and 1885
*Smiley face murder theory*: theoretical serial killer(s) thought by some sources to have drowned college-aged young men across the northern part of the country since 1997; most experts suggest that the deaths were accidental
*West Mesa murders*: remains of 11 women, who disappeared between 2003 and 2005, found buried in desert in Albuquerque, New Mexico in 2009 and attributed to a bone collector
*Zodiac Killer*: operated in northern California during the 1960s; five known victims; claimed to have killed as many as 37 people


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

Might want to check out Ivan Milats case from the australian serial killing listing. He is known as the "backpacker murderer" he murdered 7 backpackers before finally being caught. He would stab them in their spinal column rendering them helpless, then rape them then decapitate them, leaving them in the australian bushland. It's very well known case in Australia, and although there was a lot of speculation that his relatives (nephews) helped him that was never proven. His relatives would later be convicted of a murder, after Ivan Milats arrest, of the very same crime, in the exact same bushland that Ivan performed their murders, Matthew Milat and Cohen Klein (both aged 19 at the time of their sentencing) were sentenced to 43 years and 32 years in prison respectively,whilst Ivan is serving 7 life sentences. The case has been open for a long time and just added to the notoriety, due to the constant appealing by Ivan due to technicalities and other such nonsense, he has also cut off his little finger, in a bid to post it to a high court judge, and even starved himself for a few weeks because he wanted a playstation in his cell. He's crazy as bat shit basically, as are the rest of his family. They even made an aussie movie based on his crimes called "wolf creek" definitely worth a watch.

Here's a link about him if you're interested. http://murderpedia.org/male.M/m/milat-ivan.htm


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

Regarding the Dennis Nilsen guy on the England list (killed a lot of gay fellas). I remember my history teacher in high school telling us about how years before he had been discussing the Nilsen case with his class, and unbeknownst to him, one of his pupils was the son of one of Nilsen's victims.

Luckily the pupil had been a baby when it happened and had never been told the truth about his dad.


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

Fuck. Small world. I'm sure he would have found out the truth eventually though.


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

Anark said:


> Regarding the Dennis Nilsen guy on the England list (killed a lot of gay fellas). I remember my history teacher in high school telling us about how years before he had been discussing the Nilsen case with his class, and unbeknownst to him, one of his pupils was the son of one of Nilsen's victims.
> 
> Luckily the pupil had been a baby when it happened and had never been told the truth about his dad.


Wow, not only does he find out that his Father was murdered, but that he was murdered by a serial killer who was notorious for killing homosexuals. I wonder if the student went out to seek out the teacher after her found out, just to say, or if the teacher found out years later and felt terrible.


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

Long time ago for me now, so I can't really remember the details, but I think his mother obviously knew and may have informed the teachers to keep an eye on him as he might have been considered vulnerable should he or other kids find out what happened to his dad. It wouldn't have been common knowledge as the teacher himself didn't find out until afterwards. Maybe he mentioned that they had discussed the Nilsen case in the staff room and another teacher who knew had a word with him.

Brings a whole new meaning to that 'that moment when' awkwardeness.


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## TheFranticJane (Dec 22, 2012)

Dennis Nilsen eh? I remember that case.
Didn't the cops go to question him about someone disappearing, take one look at the guy and basically say 'Stop fucking us around, where's the body?'

Like they could _instantly_ tell he was a killer.


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

> Russell Williams: former Colonel in the Canadian Forces convicted in 2010 of two counts of first-degree murder, two counts of forcible confinement, two counts of breaking and entering, and sexual assault



Now THAT is one seriously fucked up case. Not only did this Buffalo Bill wannabe crackpot shock the world, but he left Canada's Armed Forces with serious eggs all over their faces if they didn't have enough of that already. Just wow when you think that this guy was one of the highest ranked people in the Military by day and played night stalker by night entering people's homes and fucking with their heads psychologically. Kudos on the brilliant job by the FBI agent that lead him to confess






btw, almost quoted the entire post just to make this the longest scroll in WF history :troll


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

> • Fred West and Rosemary West: also known as "House of Horrors" murderers; she was convicted of 10 murders; both are believed to have tortured and murdered at least 12 young women between 1967 and 1987, many at the couple's home in Gloucester; he committed suicide in 1995 while awaiting trial


man those ugly fuckers were bogeyman when I was a kid, remember that case, they just kept finding bodies hidden all over the house.

away from serial killers for a moment but still baffling true crime, this story is so bizzarre, a 14 year old boy enticed a 15yo to stab him through an elaborate shceme, its the age of them that freaks me out, pretty good reason to worry what kids get up to on the net
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/manchester/3758209.stm


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

Hanoi Cheyenne said:


> man *those ugly fuckers* were bogeyman when I was a kid, remember that case, they just kept finding bodies hidden all over the house.


What you talking about? Fred West was a handsome devil and here's the evidence:


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

Appropriate Adult!


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## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

Watched both HBO Documentaries on the Iceman.
He said the most sadistic murder was when as one victim was praying, richard told the victim he could pray for 30 mins and if god came down and stopped him the man would live. 
Hearing it for the first time really messed with my head. 



> Paul Bernardo: also known as "the Scarborough Rapist"; a Toronto man who killed three teenage girls (including his wife's sister) with the aid of his wife Karla Homolka.


"The Ken & Barbie Killers" Paul Bernardo & Karla Homolkawas my first detailed look into the graphic cases of infamous serial killers, their story was apart of a documentary called "Autopsy".

I remember it so well because it was yet another case where the courts search for justice brought about injustice.
With no evidence they took her word as gospel and gave her a plea bargian, but the difference between this case and others like it is they found video evidence of their crimes with her having a larger role.

I know of other cases where people were given plea bargains or weren't prosecuted at all for their testimony, but i still can't wrap my brain around it.
This shouldn't happen let alone in the cases of rape and murder.



> Dorothea Puente: convicted of three killings in Sacramento, California during the 1980s; suspected of six others


The discovery of Dorothea Puente's victims was crazy.
The police go to her home to ask about a missing tenant and notice some disturbed soil on the property, they start digging and discover a body.
As they dig and find one body after another they realize she went to go get coffee and hasn't come back.


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

Anark said:


>


absolutely broke my heart to learn Jimmy McNulty speaks with a plummy posh english accent irl.
He did once invent a serial killer though so I guess he fits ITT


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

Stringer Bell's British accent really caught me off guard when I watched an Idris Elba interview. Dude plays a convincing American drugdealer kingpin on the Wire, who woulda thunk it?


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

There's a scene in one of the first two seasons (can't remember which) of The Wire where McNulty puts on a fake English accent for a joke and it sounds really corny like a real American might do.

I'd also like to know what Americans think of Hugh Laurie's House accent. So fucking bizarre seeing the posh boy from Blackadder and all the other shows he did with Stephen Fry looking all stubbly and talking like he's from New Joisey.


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)




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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

That's the one. Not for a joke then, but you know what I meant.

Back to serial killers, what do you reckon the best serial killer films are? There's one I've always wanted to see but never got around to it. Now that I've thought of it, I really want to see it as it stars Michael Rooker (Merle from _The Walking Dead_) - also the best character in _Days of Thunder_ (the wheelchair racing scene is epic). 

_Henry: Portrait of a Serial Killer_ it's called, and I remember hearing good things about it but never got round to it. I think it's based on a true story but I'd have to check that.


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

Carcetti has a proper Dublin accent irl too, and Dominic West(McNulty) did attend trinity college which must be where he learned to master those whiskey drinking scenes.

now someone re-rail this thread back on topic plz.

edit - good man^
Henry is ok but you need to see MAN BITES DOG asap, one of the sickest killer movies
edit2 - and BADLANDS too


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

Henry's a pretty good movie. The guy that plays Henry is really good in playing the mentally disturbed character. It has a level of realism to it in the way it's filmed.

Some good ones i'd recommend as good character studies:

Man bites Dog: A sort of Mockumentary movie where a serial killer in France finds a film crew to film him killing his victims. Probably one of the most charismatic killers i've ever seen on screen, but terribly fucked up.

I Stand Alone: Very interesting story of a man's descent into madness. Anark, you might like this one since it has many similarities to your story.

Manhunter: The original Red Dragon and the first ever movie featuring Hannibal Lecter. Very well done, though it has a bit of a Miami Vice feel to it.

Memories of Murder: Sorta like a Korean Se7en where they hunt down a serial killer, one of the best for a foreign film

Angst: REALLY visceral serial killer movie and super realistic. It's about a man that enters a home and terrorises a familly. This one is a bit hard to watch, never finished it, but if you have a tough stomach it's well done and one of the very first of it's kind

Peeping Tom: Taboo crossing for a 60's movie, and since has become a classic. Serial killer that works as a photographer. Hunts down women, attacks them and films their expressions as they die.


Those are the one's that instantly came to mind. Ether I have an unhealthy obsession with serial killers, or i've watched far too many movies haha


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

I'll probably try and have a look at Man Bites Dog this weekend.

@Blarg, that's a good list to check out. It got me feeling all










^^Would have been an epic wrestling character.


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

He sorta already was.. lol


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

well Dean Ambrose in the Shield gives me an Anders Breivik vibe, what with the SWAT gear and psychosis and talk of righting societys injustice an all.
and mostly just the haircut.


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## Timber Timbre (Aug 11, 2011)

Lets not forget Waylon Mercy being a play off of the Max Cady character from Cape Fear. Fictional, but still a serial killer.


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

I mentioned it before, but anyone else hear Jake Roberts when watching Richard Kuklinski? 

I could sit and watch documentaries from the Crime channel all day, but one docu that sticks in my head was something the BBC made in what must have been the late 90s/early 00s and was about Mary Bell. She was a child killer, literally 10 years old when she murdered 2 other children, and if I remember correctly she was discovered through a drawing she did in school which described a scene nobody but the victim, murdered and police had seen, and they reckoned that she was actually hiding in the room when the body was discovered by the police, or whoever it was. 

Still gives me chills to this day.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

Re Mary Bell: I'd actually never heard of her before, and so I did a quick google search. The fact that she went on to be a mother and grandmother after release from prison is intriguing as well. I want to know more now; the psychology of a child killer who seemingly returns to society as a somewhat normal young woman – she was released at age 23 – would have to be interesting.


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

Issues_Sunshyne said:


> *I mentioned it before, but anyone else hear Jake Roberts when watching Richard Kuklinski? *
> 
> I could sit and watch documentaries from the Crime channel all day, but one docu that sticks in my head was something the BBC made in what must have been the late 90s/early 00s and was about Mary Bell. She was a child killer, literally 10 years old when she murdered 2 other children, and if I remember correctly she was discovered through a drawing she did in school which described a scene nobody but the victim, murdered and police had seen, and they reckoned that she was actually hiding in the room when the body was discovered by the police, or whoever it was.
> 
> Still gives me chills to this day.








Hmmm maybe a little... yeah I see it

A good show to watch for true crime is "Beyond the Darklands" 

Here is a video of a case here in Australia of a woman Katherine Knight, A woman raised in a rough environment, with an alcoholic father that would beat and rape her mother, worked in an abbatoir where she learned how to be handy with the knives. She had been in quite a few relationships, sometimes abusive (she was usually the abusive one) and was often very jealous. Her last husband (john price) refusal to marry her angered her and she stabbed him 37 times and then skinned him (with the skills she had learnt from the abboitoir) and decapitated him, cooked him and was preparing the dinner to feed to their children. Luckily the police came before that happened. She was the first woman in Australia to receive life in prison without the possibility of parole.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

^ I'm sure I've seen her story on Deadly Women. 

I was right. Here it is.






The other women featured in this episode include Blanche Taylor-Moore (poisoner) and the Austrian nurses who killed elderly patients during night shift.


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

Some true crime that needs a little more exposure in this thread is one of my favourite kinds: international jewel thieves.

Here's a nice one, a suave loner marvelously named Doris Payne, with a 50-year long career:



> She is 75 now, and she remembers the things she has done with amusement. Yes, she says, that was me, and she throws back her head and laughs.
> 
> There was the February day, eight years ago, when she strolled into the Neiman Marcus store on the Las Vegas Strip and asked to see a pair of diamond earrings.
> 
> ...


Full article: http://www.nbcnews.com/id/10072306/#.USsv2KX2-So


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

GothicBohemian said:


> Re Mary Bell: I'd actually never heard of her before, and so I did a quick google search. The fact that she went on to be a mother and grandmother after release from prison is intriguing as well. I want to know more now; the psychology of a child killer who seemingly returns to society as a somewhat normal young woman – she was released at age 23 – would have to be interesting.


You know GB, I suppose it's not a big story on the grand scheme of things, all things considered. I think the reason why I remember it so much was the documentary on it. Very well put together, massively interesting and ghastly in it's nature. I'm sure it's not very well known, it just stuck with me continually.

It's definitely intriguing how she's able, and allowed, to have a life of anonymity. Is there a sentence enough for a convicted murderer? The fact she was released and even her daughter didn't know is startling, could you imagine learning something like that? 

It's something that's been brought up a lot where I live recently due to something that happened in the early 90s, and now the murderers are either free or back in jail for other crimes and therefore breaking the rules of their release, but both have been given complete anonymity. Is it wrong? Do they deserve it? Do they deserve normal lives? This case is very dear to me, but it turns my stomach to see pictures and names of the supposed new identities and you see 3 pictures and 3 names of separate people all supposed to be the one monster. Should something happen to the wrong person, which it has in the past, what can there be done? You can understand the mind of the person avenging the life this person has taken, and you can understand the people spreading it around for the same reasons, but can you understand the people releasing this information that isn't always 100%? It's just crazy.

*EDIT:*

Just found this video on Youtube about the case. I've not watched it so can't be sure it's the same one I watched, but here it is:


----------



## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

The granting of anonymity upon release to those convicted in emotionally charged cases is based on the notion of them having 'served their time', or paid back what they owed to society and thus should not be subjected to further punishment, be that in the form of harassment or vengeance. One problem, of course, is the differing opinions as to what is just punishment for the crime, which usually varies depending on one's viewpoint and proximity to the case. Murders where the perpetrator is a child or, to a lesser extent, female (or both, as in Mary Bell's case) also have the likelihood of being influenced by socially conditioned reluctance to impose harsh penalties. 

Then there's the question of how much incarceration leads to reformed behaviours. This is every bit as iffy and open to case by case judgement. A contentious example of this from Canada involves Karla Homolka – who, along with her husband, was involved in the deaths of two young teenage girls, and probably also that of her own sister. She was treated differently from him by the legal system, served her 12 year term, and was released, having decided to live and interact with the media in French, when she'd previously spoken English, and with a potential new career, in psychology, no less, after earning her degree while in prison. 

Karla wasn't granted parole because she had been deemed a potential risk to reoffend based partly on her behaviour while incarcerated, including pursuing a relationship with a fellow convicted murderer. When there was no choice but to release her, she was placed under various restrictions including no contact with children and a requirement to notify police of her social contacts and whereabouts. This was soon overturned, and she was able to live more or less freely, though not wanted in their neighbourhood by the majority of Canadians. She then embarked on a campaign to have her name changed in order to entirely separate from her past, finally leaving Canada after the birth of her first son. When last seen, she was living with her current husband (her lawyer's brother) and their three children in Guadeloupe under her new name, Leanne Bordelais.

A minute long news segment on Karla's being found in the Caribbean.


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

GothicBohemian said:


> The granting of anonymity upon release to those convicted in emotionally charged cases is based on the notion of them having 'served their time', or paid back what they owed to society and thus should not be subjected to further punishment, be that in the form of harassment or vengeance. One problem, of course, is the differing opinions as to what is just punishment for the crime, which usually varies depending on one's viewpoint and proximity to the case. Murders where the perpetrator is a child or, to a lesser extent, female (or both, as in Mary Bell's case) also have the likelihood of being influenced by socially conditioned reluctance to impose harsh penalties.


good post, dont know if youre familiar with the James Bulger murder?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_James_Bulger#Appeal_and_release

was a huge deal in england at the time how the young perpetrators would be punished and now released, still causes a tabloid shitstorm when their names and supposed right to anonymity comes up (just the other day the attorney general took action over pics of them appearing online).

Just finished watching that Katherine Knight doc, that was so fucking grim, the abbatoir angle gives it a real horror movie vibe, will watch that Mary Bell stuff later after I watch some Police Academy and Airplane to balance things out.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

Hanoi Cheyenne said:


> good post, dont know if youre familiar with the James Bulger murder?
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_James_Bulger#Appeal_and_release


That's really the classic modern case of children killing children for no clear motive aside from the murder itself. It often still gets mentioned when people get to discussing young offenders and violent crime, even over here. 

There's so much unpredictability involved when dealing with killers who start very young and with such vague reasons. Mandatory release and sealed records give children who have committed serious crimes a second chance, but who knows which ones are able to take advantage of such an extremely generous deal or if any of them really should be permitted to. I know I certainly knew you don't abduct, torture and bludgeon preschoolers to death when I was 10 years old, and I find it hard to imagine any but the most severely traumatized or insane child would be any different. I'm quite sure I wouldn't be comfortable with such a person entering my life anonymously as an adult.


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

The case you're both mentioning is very dear to me. I still live 5 minutes from where he was taken and I was in the strand with my Mum, as a toddler, the same day. 

I mentioned in an earlier post about a discussion where I got called a liar, this was why. An American has received the e-mail about it and posted it up, and people were saying all kinds of facts that were wrong, and in explaining how close I lived to it I got called a liar. Shocking.


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## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

GothicBohemian said:


> There's so much unpredictability involved when dealing with killers who start very young and with such vague reasons. Mandatory release and sealed records give children who have committed serious crimes a second chance, but who knows which ones are able to take advantage of such an extremely generous deal or if any of them really should be permitted to. I know I certainly knew you don't abduct, torture and bludgeon preschoolers to death when I was 10 years old, and I find it hard to imagine any but the most severely traumatized or insane child would be any different. I'm quite sure I wouldn't be comfortable with such a person entering my life anonymously as an adult.


I agree with you.
I don't want my life put at risk because someone else decided that they're normal now and have been "cured".
I've seen enough cases of supposed "normal" people doing horrible acts to know that looks are deceiving.


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## Meki (Dec 25, 2011)

One of the boogeymans of my childhood


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

Issues_Sunshyne said:


> The case you're both mentioning is very dear to me. I still live 5 minutes from where he was taken and I was in the strand with my Mum, as a toddler, the same day.
> 
> I mentioned in an earlier post about a discussion where I got called a liar, this was why. An American has received the e-mail about it and posted it up, and people were saying all kinds of facts that were wrong, and in explaining how close I lived to it I got called a liar. Shocking.


I heard a while back that the Venables lad had been re-arrested on charges of having child porn on his computer. Not sure what's happened to him, but I'm pretty sure he went back inside for breach of parole at least.


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

Anark said:


> I heard a while back that the Venables lad had been re-arrested on charges of having child porn on his computer. Not sure what's happened to him, but I'm pretty sure he went back inside for breach of parole at least.


I believe he's in prison yes. 

It was he who's picture I've seen on Facebook, twitter etc, saying it was "definitely him". 3 separate pictures of different people, man, all "definitely him," it's scary.


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## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

Meki said:


> One of the boogeymans of my childhood


For the past couple of years i've not understood why people continue to have such faith in authority figures, more and more we find out authority figures are doing horrible acts while being protected by their associates.
When their feet are put to the fire they're going to protect themselves and what they have.


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

bme said:


> For the past couple of years i've not understood why people continue to have such faith in authority figures, more and more we find out authority figures are doing horrible acts while being protected by their associates.
> When their feet are put to the fire they're going to protect themselves and what they have.


With what I have seen over the course of my life I have almost zero faith in authority figures.


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

This thread was very lively for a few days, and a really interesting read, so just thought I'd add something to bump and remind people it's still here.

I recently watched West of Memphis, very interested, has anyone seen it?


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## jtyrone (May 1, 2012)

remember this sicko
Luka Magnotta






latest update.

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Luka+Magnotta+accused+infamous+bodyparts+case+preliminary/8077694/story.html


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

Issues_Sunshyne said:


> I recently watched West of Memphis, very interested, has anyone seen it?


Been meaning to see that, saw the 3 Paradise Lost films and followed that case for years.
From what ive heard WOM gives the whole gives the whole story upto their release and focuses more on Terry Hobbs, the stepfather yeah? 

recent interview with Damien Echols here, poor fucker went through hell
http://www.avclub.com/articles/west-memphis-three-subject-damien-echols-on-his-mu,91268/

there used to be a forum dedicated to claiming the documenteries were all hoaxes and the 3 guys convicted were really guilty but it doesnt seem to exist anymore, it was a interesting read the week they got released, total rage.


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

Yeah I've been following that case too:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/luka-magnotta-trial-live-cannibal-1756421

Hopefully the trial is streamed live online somewhere.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

^ Canadian courts usually invoke media bans with high profile murder cases. I'll be surprised if it streams online since that would require media cameras in the courtroom, which would violate the likely ban. Not to say it won't happen but it would be a departure, and entirely up to the judge as to how much information, and in what form, can be released. 

Honestly, I expect the same as usual, with most information available outside the country and very little beyond the minimum reported here until the trial is finished, which is not necessarily a bad thing.


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## Patrick Bateman (Jul 23, 2011)

Best anything thread ever.


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## MoxleyMoxx (Sep 24, 2012)

Interesting thread, but lack of Richard Trenton Chase is surprising tbh. 



> Nicknamed "The Vampire of Sacramento," Richard Trenton Chase was most famous for drinking the blood of his victims and eating parts of their bodies. He killed six people over the course of one month in northern California in 1977. Chase spent time in a mental hospital after being caught capturing small animals and devouring them raw, sometimes blending the corpses with Coca Cola in a blender to make a milkshake. After being treated with anti-psychotic medications he was released, and that's when he started killing humans.
> 
> Chase murdered six people, including two children, and engaged in sex with their bodies after he murdered them. He would also drink and bathe in their blood and eat their internal organs. Chase was finally caught in 1979 after murdering an entire family. His defense tried to get him a lesser charge due to his history of insanity, but a jury found him guilty and he was sentenced to death by the gas chamber. Chase then killed himself in jail in 1980 by saving up his prescription antidepressent medicine and taking a lethal overdose in his cell.


I've been intrigued by serial killers/murderers for a long time now. It really is fascinating to try and think what was going on in their heads when they did what they did,why, and what drove them to do that


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

*Serial killers what do u remember*

What do ppl on here remember about the serial killers here in the usa. Like gacy Bundy dalhmer?

Any stories or anything ppl need to never forget what happened IMHO


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## Walls (Apr 14, 2004)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

I'm hugely into serial killers and their mindsets, I think it's fascinating. I have Manson's prison art work on my walls throughout my house and have tons of books and documentaries on him. He was/is a fascinating dude. I don't condone anything that any of them ever did, however.


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## kespineira11 (Mar 20, 2013)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

The sniper guy from about 2002-ish who killed a bunch of people in the DC area i believe. genuinely scared me


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## CamillePunk (Feb 10, 2011)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

Misleading thread title, guess I won't weigh in then.


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## Mithro (Oct 14, 2011)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*



Premium Walls said:


> I'm hugely into serial killers and their mindsets, I think it's fascinating. I have Manson's prison art work on my walls throughout my house and have tons of books and documentaries on him. He was/is a fascinating dude. I don't condone anything that any of them ever did, however.


In high school I did an English report on serial killers, I got a look, or two. I don't get what's wrong with being interested in serial killers.


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## Walls (Apr 14, 2004)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

I did the exact same thing. I did it on the Manson Family. If I remember correctly, I got a B+.


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## Gandhi (Sep 15, 2012)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

I'm not a serial killer.....honest.....


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## Hennessey (Jan 1, 2012)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

Chris Benoit.


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## kespineira11 (Mar 20, 2013)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*



Sparta101 said:


> Chris Benoit.


:lmao

awful, but still


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

What I've learnt from this thread is people don't know what serial killers actually are.

Neither Chris benoit or Charles manson are serial killers.

Anyway if you're interested in this sort of thing, feel free to post in my true crime thread, it could do with more posters in it. http://www.wrestlingforum.com/anything/699097-true-crime-thread.html


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## Walls (Apr 14, 2004)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

Manson isn't one but he headed a cult that killed people on more than one occasion and most people refer to that cult as a bunch of serial killers. By direct definition, he isn't himself.


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

Today TJ Lane, 18, has pleaded guilty to shooting at students in February 2012 at Chardon High School, east of Cleveland. 

Investigators have said he admitted to the shooting but said he didn’t know why he did it. He was given three life sentences for shooting to death three students in an Ohio high school cafeteria. 

He wore a ‘killer’ shirt to court, while smirking and making obscene gestures and comments. When asked to make a statement he said “fuck all of you”.

Here are some shots of it:


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

^ Judging from the courtroom pics – I know nothing else of him – he seems more like an extremely angry kid than a psychotic killer. He says he doesn't know why he did what he did; I imagine that's true, but I'll bet there's a motive of pure fury and a desire to be seen inside there somewhere. Shame no one noticed him before he lost it and decided to kill for infamy. Very likely he's a lost cause now.


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## Smif-N-Wessun (Jan 21, 2012)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

I live in DC, and I remember the sniper incident pretty vividly. I didn't really pay that much mind to it, but I was a lil more cautious during that time.


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

BULLY said:


>


Something tells me he's not gonna have a good time when he hits gen pop.


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

I was past the area where the dc sniper was caught it was a spooky feeling.

I don't see what's wrong with being interested as ppl should know as it history too.

I was hoping maybe some guys would recall Bundy or dalhmer . I seen the crime scene photos and wow


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

Nobody else here remembers


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

^check the true crime thread a couple pages back

edit- bully linked it on last page


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

I'll check it out but really only looking for serial killers


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

well then youre in luck cos thats what 90% of it is


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## WHAT DA HELL (Nov 10, 2011)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*



kespineira11 said:


> The sniper guy from about 2002-ish who killed a bunch of people in the DC area i believe. genuinely scared me


This is the only one I have memories of. I was in 4th grade and it happened only a couple of hours from where I live. I was terrified because I thought they were going to come here or something


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

That's sweet ill check it out. It's not sweet it happened just I like to know the regular appearing ppl and what can really happen.


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## Nafstem (Sep 22, 2005)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

The only thing I can remember that comes within the realm of a serial killer would be the DC Sniper.


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## Rick Sanchez (Dec 30, 2012)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

A serial killer is traditionally defined as an individual who has killed three or more people over a period of more than a month, with down time (a "cooling off period") between the murders, and whose motivation for killing is usually based on psychological gratification. Some sources, such as the FBI, disregard the "three or more" criteria and define the term as "a series of two or more murders, committed as separate events, usually, but not always, by one offender acting alone" or, including the vital characteristics, a minimum of two murders. Often, a sexual element is involved in the killings, but the FBI states that motives for serial murder include "anger, thrill, financial gain, and attention seeking". The murders may have been attempted or completed in a similar fashion and the victims may have had something in common; for example, occupation, race, appearance, sex, or age group.

Serial killers are not the same as mass murderers, nor are they spree killers, who commit murders in two or more locations with virtually no break in between; however, cases of extended bouts of sequential killings over periods of weeks or months with no apparent "cooling off" period or "return to normalcy" have caused some serial killer experts to suggest a hybrid category of "spree-serial killer."

According to the FBI, for individuals, mass murder is defined as the person murdering four or more persons during a particular event with no cooling-off period between the murders. A mass murder typically occurs in a single location in which a number of victims are killed by an individual or more. With exceptions, many acts of mass murder end with the death of the perpetrators, whether by direct suicide or being killed by law enforcement.

A mass murder differs from a spree killing, in that it may be committed by individuals or organizations, whereas a spree killing is committed by one or two individuals. In terms of individuals, mass murderers are different from spree killers, who kill at two or more locations with almost no time break between murders and are not defined by the number of victims, and serial killers, who may kill numerous people over long periods of time. Mass murder is also not synonymous with genocide because genocide requires distinct elements.

Mass murder may also be defined as the intentional and indiscriminate murder of a large number of people by government agents. Examples are the shooting of unarmed protestors, the carpet bombing of cities, the lobbing of grenades into prison cells, and the random execution of civilians. The largest mass killings in history have been governmental attempts to exterminate entire groups or communities of people, often on the basis of ethnicity or religion. Some of these mass murders have been found to be genocides and others to be crimes against humanity, but often such crimes have led to few or no convictions of any type.


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## Skermac (Apr 6, 2012)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

One of them ate people but I forget his name, Ted Bundy?


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## 189558 (Aug 18, 2009)

One case that really caught my eye was the Sylvia Likens case back in the '60s in Indianapolis. Living in Indiana and so close to the Indianapolis area all my life. I never knew about the case until about two or so years ago. My mother rented the film _An American Crime_ and I sat down and watched it. Since then I've read up on the case. The main points of the case was Likens and her sister were staying at their babysitters home. And Sylvia ended up getting tortured, murdered by the babysitter, her children and neighborhood children. Articles are still going around about the case. One of the daughters moved to Iowa and changed her name. Just last year she was fired from her job at school for not mentioning this case.

Here is a 1985 radio broadcast over the case.





Video of inside the home before it got demolished.





It's completely messed up, but interesting in the same sense.


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## Jesus_Hong (Feb 8, 2013)

I've seen the movie. It's VERY disturbing. Cheers for the link for the radio broadcast its brilliant


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## Jesus_Hong (Feb 8, 2013)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*



Skermac said:


> One of them ate people but I forget his name, Ted Bundy?


You're thinking of Jeffrey Dahmet


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## alejbr4 (May 31, 2009)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

i remember reading crime journals, and theres some killers from other countries that got over 100, there was a guy in peru who i believe got caught in like 91 ish he was killing tourists in the rain forest for like 12 yrs


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## Endors Toi (Mar 29, 2010)

I don't know if anyone has posted about him on this thread yet but one who interested me was Richard Ramirez (aka Night Stalker).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Ramirez - makes for interesting reading!

Great thread - I too find this sort of stuff fascinating!


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## Jesus_Hong (Feb 8, 2013)

Maidenrugby said:


> I don't know if anyone has posted about him on this thread yet but one who interested me was Richard Ramirez (aka Night Stalker).
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Ramirez - makes for interesting reading!
> 
> Great thread - I too find this sort of stuff fascinating!


This guy was lethal. There's a great early 90s low budget movie about him that you should check out. (actually called "The Nightstalker"). It's ironic that the police ended up saving his life


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

Yea that same guy has been released apparently too


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## alejbr4 (May 31, 2009)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*

Pedro Alonso López was the guys name


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

Convicted 1980 released 1998 so he walks among us


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## Shadowman (Mar 22, 2013)

I'm a big true crime reader. I love watching shows like Forensic Files and I read up on a lot of cases. One of the most disturbing I've read is the David Parker Ray case, which you can read about in the books Slow Death and Cries In The Desert. Fair warning if you decide to read up on it, as it's unbelievably vile what that man did to his victims. I get sick just thinking about it.


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## Jesus_Hong (Feb 8, 2013)

My facebook profile picture is me with a Peter Sutcliffe look alike (The Yorkshire Ripper). If you non UK posters haven't heard of him, please look him up. He killed 13 prostitutes in England in the early 80s. 
Anyways, I saw this bloke at work and told him who he looked like and asked him for a pic

You guys should look up Andrei Chikatilo the Rostov Ripper. He's a bad man


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

The guy who gets off killing its amazing he had a kid wonder if his son knows yet


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## Jesus_Hong (Feb 8, 2013)

*Re: Serial killers what do u remember*



alejbr4 said:


> Pedro Alonso López was the guys name


I just read a biography on this guy. Wow. Amazing read


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## Rick Sanchez (Dec 30, 2012)

The Monster of the Andes.


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

Jeffrey might be the most messed up though


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## Mountain Rushmore (Feb 8, 2013)

There's a guy whongoes to my school named Alexis who'd stolen (no lie) 40 or 50 cellphones before he got caught.


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## Quasi Juice (Apr 3, 2006)

The chick from the movie Monster would classify as a serial killer too right?

One common thread seems to be a fucked up childhood. Mother being beaten every day, or child molestation etc. It leads to children not giving a fuck about other human beings 'cause they were raised that way. 



blarg_ said:


> Now THAT is one seriously fucked up case. Not only did this Buffalo Bill wannabe crackpot shock the world, but he left Canada's Armed Forces with serious eggs all over their faces if they didn't have enough of that already. Just wow when you think that this guy was one of the highest ranked people in the Military by day and played night stalker by night entering people's homes and fucking with their heads psychologically. Kudos on the brilliant job by the FBI agent that lead him to confess
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm always surprised how "unprotected" the interrogators are during moments like this. He's basically giving Williams no other option than to confess 'cause he has clear cut evidence. But we're talking about a sick, probably aggressive guy here who murdered people and he's sitting there and he feels trapped. What stops him from just grabbing the officer and snapping his neck or something? 



THE TEACHER said:


> One of the boogeymans of my childhood


Mine too, somewhat. He was active in Belgium and I'm Dutch, but still. Sick thing is that the Belgian police took so fucking long to finally capture him and sentence him because he was being funded and helped by people in the government I believe and other powerful people in Belgium and France. Yeah, there are a lot of paedophiles in this world, it's sick.



jtyrone said:


> remember this sicko
> Luka Magnotta
> 
> 
> ...


Oh right, I remember watching a doc on him a while ago, he creeps me the fuck out. There's actually a video of him on YouTube auditioning for something about plastic surgery. He was a gay model and kept trying to perfect his look. He comes across as such a normal, flamboyant gay guy in that interview, yet he's completely insane.



Charlie Bronson said:


> The Monster of the Andes.


What baffles me is that he got released twice by the police? WHY?


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

The really big question is does the world need this too happen too keep order in balance.


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## Jesus_Hong (Feb 8, 2013)

Are you nuts?


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

No I'm not but think about it for every good thing in the world there has to be 1 bad ti keep the balance


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## Lady Eastwood (Jul 10, 2006)

Does it make anyone feel fucking weird to have the hots for a murderer?

I mean, shit, I get weird looks over my desire to pound Bugsy, I just don't see how that is strange to think someone is hot, even if he killed people. I even named my cat after him.

Fine piece of fucking ass, I say.











Serious question, though.


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

Ok that's goofy but I can see it


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## Jesus_Hong (Feb 8, 2013)

Is that Bugsy Siegel?


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

if you think theyre hot just cos theyre hot then its no thing, if you think theyre hot cos of what theyve done its another thing, lots of killers tend to be charismatic, attractive types too to gain trust. Ramirez had tons of groupies, he even married one of them

check this out

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybristophilia


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## Lady Eastwood (Jul 10, 2006)

*shudder*


Yeah, the whole killing thing is not a turn on at all, lol.

I think most people just get the image in their mind that if you think someone who committed murder is attractive, you must be some kind of fucked up asshole who enjoys murder as well. Ehhh, no.

@Jesus, yes, it's Bugsy Siegel <3


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## Jesus_Hong (Feb 8, 2013)

Catalanotto said:


> *shudder*
> 
> 
> Yeah, the whole killing thing is not a turn on at all, lol.
> ...


Sadly, it happens though. How else can you explain someone as ugly as Rose West getting engaged while she's in prison?


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## MOX (Dec 6, 2011)

This doesn't count as a serial killer or anything, but something screams at me about this.

You've heard of that Survivor show? Load of twats get put on a island and they do stuff and things until whatever? Well the French version recently had a lad die on it, about ten days ago, from a heart attack I think. He collapsed and the doctor and crew tried to calm him and shit, and even though he asked to be taken to hospital, they still tried to treat him on the island. Eventually, after he got worse, they did get him to a hospital, about two hours after he actually collapsed. And yes, he dies shortly after arriving.

That's not the story though. Here's the story, just found out today that the doctor who treated him on the island has killed himself. He left a note apparently that he couldn't take the shit that was coming his way (my words, no idea what his actually were, he wrote them in foreign, but that was the general jist).

Thing is, I just can't shake it out of my head that the TV company was about to get fucking destroyed by their incompetence and now all of a sudden they are home free, with this dead doctor cunt taking all the flak.

I smell a rat. And it smells of cheese and surrender.


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## dan the marino (Oct 22, 2006)

Neat thread. I always find this stuff interesting to read about... :side:. Messed up, but interesting.

Anyone ever hear of the Mad Gasser of Mattoon? Nothing as crazy as a serial killer but some guy allegedly running around in a town during WW2 spraying poison gas into houses, freaked a bunch of people out. Nobody was ever caught and they still aren't sure if it was just mass hysteria or some loner chemist who was suspected. Stuff like that I find fascinating to learn about.


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## AlienBountyHunter (Jan 22, 2013)

Anark said:


> This doesn't count as a serial killer or anything, but something screams at me about this.
> 
> You've heard of that Survivor show? Load of twats get put on a island and they do stuff and things until whatever? Well the French version recently had a lad die on it, about ten days ago, from a heart attack I think. He collapsed and the doctor and crew tried to calm him and shit, and even though he asked to be taken to hospital, they still tried to treat him on the island. Eventually, after he got worse, they did get him to a hospital, about two hours after he actually collapsed. And yes, he dies shortly after arriving.
> 
> ...


:hmm: That is intriguing. Did the police not follow up on the suicide and find anything suspicious, I'm assuming it's still ongoing?


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## Trifektah (Nov 21, 2011)

Reading 'Under the Banner of Heaven' about disgusting pedophile polygamist Mormons. It's appalling that these people can get away with it so often.


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## Weed Duck (Mar 19, 2013)

I've done extensive research over the years on subjects ranging from rampage killers to crimes of passion and take great interest in these sorts of things. 

Something to ponder: Are killers generally "made" through bad upbringing and/or traumatic events in their past, or are they generally born with behavioral disorders or a hypothetical "murder gene"?

I, personally, think that most killers are pushed to it by society. An example on the serial killer side is Henry Lee Lucas, who was beaten and abused sexually and physically throughout childhood and went on to murder up to 350 people, though he was only ever charged with 11.


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

I think its how your treated . If ur abused and just get the total shits of ppl and don't care and just wanna do as I please then u just kill kill kill till u get caught.


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## AJ (Apr 8, 2011)

Mental issues are often very different and at the heart of impulses I'd say, but unless with some 'mental disorder', I disagree that anyone is, or can be, 'pushed to it', interesting topic specifically though.


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

If you look at the majority of serial killer cases in detail, a great number of them were abused as children, came from broken homes etc. whilst that is certainly no justification for what they did, it does at least provide an insight into why they grew up hating the world, especially as children when they are in their developmental stages, where it shapes them for the rest of their lives, untreated these problems snowball as they get older, and without an outlet for their aggression, they grow up hating the world; and becoming nihilistic, psychopathic misanthropists. Aileen Wuornos was a prime example of this. (The basis for the movie monster, IMO the best serial killer movie that was based on a true story) Beaten and raped for much of her childhood and conceiving a child at the age of 13. there are exceptions to the rule of course.


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## AlienBountyHunter (Jan 22, 2013)

^ Nice mention of the film Monster, that's pretty great. The documentaries on Aileen Wuornos (Selling of a Serial Killer & Life and Death of a Serial Killer) are also both very intriguing. You've probably seen them Bully, but just throwing them out there for anyone who hasn't. Definitely worth a watch.


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## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

I've sort of got back into the true crime interest after showing a friend recently one of my Bundy movies. True crime has always been a general interest of mine since I first discovered it in 2008, I think I first started to learn about it when we studied Jack The Ripper in history class. And for a couple of years it was a big interest of mine and I would spend a good part of my time often reading up and watching documentaries and films about all these famous killers and stuff, it was very interesting. 

By far the most interesting person I've read about is Ted Bundy, as I said on the first page, it's why I have three movies on him. He's the most interesting person I've learnt about period. The story of how a guy who was so smart, who was a law student, who was active in politics, and who was respected by all his peers, would turn out to be one of worst serial killers of all time. It was because of his crimes that the term ''serial killer'' came about. His good looks and charm enabled him to get the attention of women, and his intelligence enabled him to come up with so many tricks to lure victims, such as wearing a fake cast to pretend that his arm was broken to gain the sympathy and trust of the victim, before killing them. His intelligence also is why he was able to evade police capture for 4 years and how he was able to escape prison twice. I'm currently just having a little read through his Wikipedia article again, it's just so interesting: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Bundy

Edit: some Ted Bundy documentaries:










And an interview with Bundy before he was executed:


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## Arya Dark (Sep 8, 2006)

*Richard Kuklinski is fascinating. He was a hit man for the mob. Great documentary on him here.





*


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## Meki (Dec 25, 2011)

BULLY said:


> If you look at the majority of serial killer cases in detail, a great number of them were abused as children, came from broken homes etc. whilst that is certainly no justification for what they did, it does at least provide an insight into why they grew up hating the world, especially as children when they are in their developmental stages, where it shapes them for the rest of their lives, untreated these problems snowball as they get older, and without an outlet for their aggression, they grow up hating the world; and becoming nihilistic, psychopathic misanthropists. Aileen Wuornos was a prime example of this. (The basis for the movie monster, IMO the best serial killer movie that was based on a true story) Beaten and raped for much of her childhood and conceiving a child at the age of 13. there are exceptions to the rule of course.


Same goes for some 'evil' leaders. Napoleon and Hitler both had a rough childhood. Hitler's dad beat him on a daily basis something which scarred him for life and actually laid the fundementals for the person he'd become. The envirement in which they grow up in often shapes them and makes them hate humans as a species.

Sent from my GT-S7500 using VerticalSports.Com App


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## Meki (Dec 25, 2011)

LadyCroft said:


> *Richard Kuklinski is fascinating. He was a hit man for the mob. Great documentary on him here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I posted that one earlier in the thread I think. It is indeed great.

Sent from my GT-S7500 using VerticalSports.Com App


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

If you guys are interested in childhood symptons common to serial killers you should look into the Mcdonald Triad I mentioned earlier in thread, it includes - animal cruelty (the most common one), pyromania and bed wetting in childhood as things common to a lot of killers. Should mention not all fit into the category and its validity is much questioned nowadays but its still interesting reading
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macdonald_triad

heres another weird one









^this woman Juana Barraza, a former lucha named La Dama Del Silencio is currently serving 759 years in prison for the murder of 11 elderly ladies in Mexico (thats the official number, its likely up to 40), robbing them and even messing with the bodies afterward. Unsurprisingly she also had a horrible childhood
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juana_Barraza


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## Chip Kelly (Feb 14, 2012)

Hanoi Cheyenne said:


> Been meaning to see that, saw the 3 Paradise Lost films and followed that case for years.
> From what ive heard WOM gives the whole gives the whole story upto their release and focuses more on Terry Hobbs, the stepfather yeah?
> 
> recent interview with Damien Echols here, poor fucker went through hell
> ...


Im not sure if this is what your talking about but this site http://wm3truth.com/ isdedicated to proving their guilt. It has an enormous amount of evidence and links to all the court and interrogation transcripts. It made me question their innocence , the most damning to me is jessie miskelly`s confessions. He gave about 5 or more confessions that were all consistent with the crime and to a bunch of different people including the arresting officers, the interrogation team, his own defense attorneys and investigators that he came forward to on his own against his attorneys wishes. 

The fact that they eventually let them go( but didnt exonerate them, they took a plea bargain deal and all plead guilty, while still maintaining their innocence) is why i dont know what to think because its hard to believe they would let three people convicted of the crimes they were free. The only real argument is the justice system couldnt deal with all the pressure and high price legal team the support from the paradise lost films brought.


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

Few people talking about horrible childhoods being the main reason why serial killers end up the way they are,

Just wanted to ask people who know subject better than I do; Have there been many instances of serial killers who had normal, happy childhoods? 

Does anyone here watch the Crime Investigation channel in the UK? I'm addicted. I can site there for 5 hours and not move watching show after show.

Last night, there was a story of a woman who met a man and fell in love, then when they got married He became such an evil man and beat her and abused her mentally. She fell pregnant and ended up losing the baby after, what she said was a riding accident. It ended when the wife had too much and, self defensively, stabbed the husband to death.

Then it all came out...

They were never legally married, HE just wanted her to tell everyone so; She was Never pregnant, HE just wanted her to say she was, and she never miscarried after a riding accident, he had done the worst thing imaginable to her to make her lose the baby.

Then, this came out...

HE wasn't a HE, and was actually a butch woman. She used a fake penis and made up a story of being burned and having to use the fake one, and created an entire cherade that she was a man and convinced, not only the way she "married", but the entire town. They just had a short comment saying she was never pregnant, but alluded to the fact that the "husband" had wanted her to tell everyone she had miscarried.

Crazy story.

- Has anyone seen The Imposter yet??


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## Meki (Dec 25, 2011)

Issues_Sunshyne said:


> Few people talking about horrible childhoods being the main reason why serial killers end up the way they are,
> 
> Just wanted to ask people who know subject better than I do; Have there been many instances of serial killers who had normal, happy childhoods?
> 
> ...


For some reason that story cracked me up. 

And to answer your question. Anders Breivik, the man of the murders in Norway had a perfectly fine childhood. There are others too but he was the first one to come to mind.

Sent from my GT-S7500 using VerticalSports.Com App


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## Jesus_Hong (Feb 8, 2013)

Issues_Sunshyne said:


> Few people talking about horrible childhoods being the main reason why serial killers end up the way they are,
> 
> Just wanted to ask people who know subject better than I do; Have there been many instances of serial killers who had normal, happy childhoods?
> 
> ...


That story is brilliant. I also watch a lot of that channel. This is the best thread on WF


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## Patrick Bateman (Jul 23, 2011)

Issues_Sunshyne said:


> Few people talking about horrible childhoods being the main reason why serial killers end up the way they are,
> 
> Just wanted to ask people who know subject better than I do; Have there been many instances of serial killers who had normal, happy childhoods?
> 
> ...


That's some sick shit. unk


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## Rick Sanchez (Dec 30, 2012)

*Speaking of Kuklinski, can't wait for The Iceman to come out. Michael Shannon looks badass in that film.*


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

Just watched one now.

A prisoner who, as part of his sentence and in an early attempt at "rehabilitation" was forced to clean the electric chair. At this time, in 1904, the electric chair wasn't the most humane way of killing people, and rather than a current running through someone as they sat there, it jumped from chair to flesh as the limbs and moved with the straps off the chair itself; literally incinerating and burning the victim alive. Knowing this was happening, the prisoner who cleaned the chair every day developed the steel straps that kept the limbs in place and helped the current run through them, which in turn made a more humane and less painful and quicker way to kill the person sitting at the chair.

In doing this, helping further develop the electric chair, his sentence was cut in half and as he had already served 8 years of a 20 year stretch, he was released.

A few months later, he was re-arrested for apparently murdering a man whilst stealing food from a farm, and although he maintained that he was innocent, he was sentenced to death by the Electric Chair. 

He was electrocuted to death in the very chair for which he had developed the shackles which gained him his freedom.

Crazy.



Dexter Morgan said:


> *Speaking of Kuklinski, can't wait for The Iceman to come out. Michael Shannon looks badass in that film.*


Me too! Definitely. As much as I would love to sit and watch the actual man speak, I think Shannon is an excellent choice and it is a really interesting story.


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## Trublez (Apr 10, 2013)

Gary Ridgeway murdered numerous women and girls in Washington state during the 1980s and 1990s. Most of his victims were alleged to be prostitutes. The press gave him his nickname (the green river killer) after the first five victims were found in the Green River; his identity was not known. He strangled the women, usually with his arm but sometimes using ligatures. After strangling them, he would dump their bodies throughout forested and overgrown areas in King County, often returning to the dead bodies to have sexual intercourse with them. His count was originally at 49 murders, but during trial he has admittted to killing nearly a double amount of other women.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Ridgway


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## JackieLackey (Feb 4, 2013)

I typed out a story earlier about the Original Night Stalker/East Area Rapist. Can't believe he has never been caught let alone identified after almost 4 decades.


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

Am I okay to re-up this thread as it's a few months old?

I came to find it and didn't want to make a new one as there is so much interesting stuff in this one.

Anyone see Iceman? How was it?

Did anyone see The Imposter documentary?


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## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Think it's ok to bump this good thread. 

Haven't seen The Iceman film, though it looks intriguing. Seen a few documentaries on Richard Kuklinski before.

I've been interested in seeing this new movie The Frozen Ground, which is a movie about serial killer Robert Hansen. Just reading about the film it's good to see a true crime movie with a big budget and a solid cast for a change, most serial killer movies tend to be low budget, inaccurate, poorly acted pieces of crap.


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

thanks for bumping the thread. Got permission to from the mods a little while back but forgot to do it. Haven't seen iceman yet have you? I actually put it in my cue of movies to watch after talking to someone in rants, I think it was shortly after james gandolfini died and I expressed my disappointment that he didn't get to play the role of the iceman as I thought he'd be perfect. but apparently the actor who was in the movie did a really good job and it has Ray Liotta so....

Here in australia one of our most infamous child killers has passed, derek percy. he was victoria's longest serving prisoner having spent over 40 years in prison. he ended up dying of cancer but there were still unsolved murders that he was suspected of that he took to his grave. truly a real piece of shit scumbag, I hope hell exists just for him. I actually knew someone who was effected by what he did. here is an article if you're interested.

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/derek-percy-takes-his-secrets-to-the-grave-20130724-2qiay.html


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

Kinda interested to see the frozen ground now and maybe crossface even thought they shouldnt make that


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## redwingsfan72191 (Jan 29, 2010)

Hanoi Cheyenne said:


> I could do quite a few here
> 
> 
> One read of the book _Killer, a journal of murder_ will tell you what a terrifying motherfucker *Carl Panzram* was,unrepentant serial murderer/rapist/thief, the book is his memoirs collected in his final years by a sympathetic prison guard and the first book of its kind to explore the mind of a killer first hand, it took almost 40 years before anyone would publish it.
> ...


you win this thread carl panzram would make any of these other guys his bitch


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## MoxleyMoxx (Sep 24, 2012)

Investigation Discovery f'n rocks. So much good programming IMO like Couples Who Kill, Great Crimes & Trials etc. But the thing I've noticed is that almost every murderer or other criminal they've covered in their shows has a background of being abused as a kid or they have alcoholic parents or something like that. 

I'll definitely watch Crossface when/if it comes out.


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## Hollywood Hanoi (Mar 31, 2011)

good to see this thread back (Y)



Issues_Sunshyne said:


> Anyone see Iceman? How was it?
> 
> Did anyone see The Imposter documentary?


found the Iceman movie very meh tbh, Michael Shannon is great in the lead role but the film itself is pretty much by the numbers hollywood dark biopic. Its worth a look if youre into the story but doubt id watch it again, that hbo doc is still the best work on the subject.

Been meaning to watch the Imposter for ages, a few people were raving about it in the movie thread a while back and Id forgotten about it, might watch this week, story is great.


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## Green Light (Sep 17, 2011)

Anyone seen "Cropsey"? Thought it was pretty interesting


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## Schmeeb (May 21, 2011)

What is it with Americans and their morbid fascination with serial killers?

PS Ted Bundy is the boss of the genre.

Edit - Actually, scrap that. Jack the Ripper.


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

For me i just like knowing the truth and evils of life. Everyone knows the joys and goods but evils are different


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## Schmeeb (May 21, 2011)

96powerstroker said:


> For me i just like knowing the truth and evils of life. Everyone knows the joys and goods but evils are different


I was only joking about the American thing. It is a worldwide phenomenon, more correctly a human preoccupation.

I do find the Jack the Ripper case to be the most fascinating though. It has been romanticised beyond recognition and that might be part of the attraction but objectively it is still thoroughly interesting.


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

Guys who can live double lives or escape the police for the longest time are impressive. Think about It most ppl even then couldn't avoid a speeding ticket and wanted killers escaping prison unheard of.


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## Zen (Nov 11, 2006)

I'm pretty convinced that all serial killers are made either with sexual abuse or psychological abuse at a young age


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## 96powerstroker (Mar 13, 2013)

Yea cause even If u wanted to u at a certain know that u cant do It and live with urself


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

Hanoi Cheyenne said:


> good to see this thread back (Y)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ahh that's sad. When I read they were making it I was a bit negative on the whole thing. The documentaries and especially the Kuklinski interviews were as good as it got, but when I seen Michael Shannon as the lead I thought it had legs. 

This the third time at least I've read that Shannon was great in the role but the film was average.

I'll watch it this week sometime, but suppose waiting this long was worth it.

Imposter is great. Massively interesting. 

The actual person it's based on told me to kill myself on Twitter because I said, in speak with a friend that had told me his Twitter handle, that surely it can't be the real him because for such a wild story winning all the plaudits, he had less than 1000 followers. I was merely shocked given the nature of it all, his reply was he didn't want the attention, was the real guy and to go kill myself. The irony of this guy of all people becoming offended because somebody suggested he may not be who he says he was wasn't lost on me. He LOVES the attention, but hates to admit it.

Great, interesting story, mind.



Schmeeb said:


> What is it with Americans and their morbid fascination with serial killers?
> 
> PS Ted Bundy is the boss of the genre.
> 
> Edit - Actually, scrap that. Jack the Ripper.


I'm English too, but what peoples fascinations with this type of thing, I honestly don't know. Myself included. There isn't just books, TV shows and movies on the subject, there are actual multiple 24 hour TV channels dedicated to this type of thing, as well as things such as magazines and collections, just bizarre. It's murder, and you can find out so much about it if you are just interested in it; You don't need to be studying it to build a career around it to have access to pretty much everything.

It's crazy. There are people obsessed with it, and although it's strange, I don't think it's a bad thing. It's a morbid interest no question though, and I can never get to deep into certain things.


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

Anark said:


> This doesn't count as a serial killer or anything, but something screams at me about this.
> 
> You've heard of that Survivor show? Load of twats get put on a island and they do stuff and things until whatever? Well the French version recently had a lad die on it, about ten days ago, from a heart attack I think. He collapsed and the doctor and crew tried to calm him and shit, and even though he asked to be taken to hospital, they still tried to treat him on the island. Eventually, after he got worse, they did get him to a hospital, about two hours after he actually collapsed. And yes, he dies shortly after arriving.
> 
> ...


Just did a little retread of this thread and came across this.

Anyone have anymore information on this??


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## Biast (Nov 19, 2012)

Punk with that Charles Manson t-shirt. Now that I think of it, it's probably what CM stands for and he has fooled us all along. :lmao


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## Mountain Rushmore (Feb 8, 2013)

You know, I'm not a serial killer or anything but once in awhile I fantasize about just saying "fuck it" and getting some friends together to start a criminal enterprise/hit man's guild. I'd use my dirty money to finance a Presidential campaign and I'd win. unk

Double life like that just seems really fun.


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

Biast said:


> Punk with that Charles Manson t-shirt. Now that I think of it, it's probably what CM stands for and he has fooled us all along. :lmao


Haha, Charles Manson Punk. Amazed he got away with wearing that on TV. Doesn't bother me or anything, just very surprising he wore it.



Boxes-With-Gods said:


> You know, I'm not a serial killer or anything but once in awhile I fantasize about just saying "fuck it" and getting some friends together to start a criminal enterprise/hit man's guild. I'd use my dirty money to finance a Presidential campaign and I'd win. unk
> 
> Double life like that just seems really fun.


Ahh, not sure if it's the serial killer fantasy or a power fantasy there. I'm the same though, I don't think I could ever do anything heinous but do wonder what it would be like to outsmart police. Think the only way I'd ever do it is by writing something because I don't have it in me to do anything like that.

Touchy subject, but has anyone every have any serious true crime happen near them? Nothing too heavy or in too much depth, but anyone have any real life experiences with this stuff? Seems like there are so, so, so many stories. Not the worst things imaginable, I mean anyone have an uncle who robbed a bank or an Aunty who stopped one? haha


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## Eduard Khil (Feb 13, 2012)

Been reading a lot about the Robert Pickton murders. Vancouver BC.
A sick dude.


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## MoxleyMoxx (Sep 24, 2012)

Watched True Crime with Aphrodite Jones as the subject was none other than OJ Simpson. It's absurd how he got away with the murder case at first. They had so much evidence, that I'm sure that if he wouldn't have been a famous person like he was, he would've gotten a death penalty or at least been sentenced to life in prison.


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## MoxleyMoxx (Sep 24, 2012)

Got the the green light from the mod to bump this so lets get this thread back on track.

anyone have any stories about the lesser known serial killers?

edit:

I'm guessing that at least some of the Aussies in here have heard about Martha Rendell. Talk about an evil mother-in-law. I mean if swabbing a childs throat with hydrochloric acid isn't considered sick, then I don't know what is.


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## youowemesomething (Nov 29, 2013)

What an awful thread. Why are you people glamorizing criminals?


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## FBrizzle (Sep 19, 2013)

MoxleyMoxx said:


> Got the the green light from the mod to bump this so lets get this thread back on track.
> 
> anyone have any stories about the lesser known serial killers?
> 
> ...


Never heard of this one but definitely sounds sick.

On a related note, I just watched Henry: Portrait of a Serial Killer on Netflix.

Saw it years ago but wanted my girlfriend to see old school Michael Rooker lol.


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

Okay to bump this old thread? I don't know if we don't bump old threads because they aren't relevant or something to do with the age and the servers or whatever, but if it's relevance I thought it worth to get this one back as it has a lot of good stuff for new readers.

Just to get the ball rolling again; 

I was in WH Smith before, a shop that has probably the best collection of magazines in the UK, and seen there are quite a few mags on Serial killers and such like. Wondering if anyone has ever bought any of these? I have seen them for a long time, at least 20 years as my Mum used to buy them.

How do you go about buying them? Up until recently I was embarrassed to buy a wrestling mag - is this embarrassing or what? I know buying porn has the stigma but surely buying that type of mag is even worse. Porn is bad but it's there, murder is just a bit odd to be buying stuff about for some people.

Carrying on with that and saying my Mum used to read them, (Her friend ran the shop over the road that stocked them and they both had an interest so it wasn't really strange,) how did you go about getting interested in True Crime? For me it was watching Channel 5 documentaries about this stuff, and a couple of things that happened about 100 yards from where I lived, one which is one of the most brutal in British history, sparked something. I have an interest, but more of a marcabre fascination as there is still some I can't delve too far into.

So what's everyone's story? What sparked the interest? Ever bought magazines, how did you handle that stigma attached?


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## MrMister (Mar 11, 2005)

You could've made another thread, but it's fine. This is one of the better threads in Anything.

It'll probably die again. Zodiac keeps killing it.


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## Issues_Sunshyne (May 12, 2009)

MrMister said:


> You could've made another thread, but it's fine. This is one of the better threads in Anything.
> 
> It'll probably die again. Zodiac keeps killing it.


Yeah, I was thinking of a new thread to just ask my question but didn't think it was thread-worthy, so thought I'd ask in this thread whether it was okay to bring it back. I tried to use common sense rather than just another thread asking a subjective question.

Good man, thanks for the feedback.

I'm going to try keep it up for a little while as we managed a good while with it and it's something a few of us seem open to discussing, however strange it is.


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## Loudon Wainwright (Jul 23, 2014)

Speaking of criminals. I'd totally fuck Casey Anthony and Jodi Arias.


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## Skermac (Apr 6, 2012)

This is scary. I never realized there were so many!

John Douglas, a former chief of the FBI's Elite Serial Crime Unit and author of "Mind Hunter," says, "A very conservative estimate is that there are between 35 and 50 active serial killers in the United States" at any given time. Often, Douglas told me, they will, "kill two to three victims and then have a 'cooling-off' period between kills."



http://www.creators.com/opinion/diane-dimond/serial-killers-how-many-are-there.html


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## Rick Sanchez (Dec 30, 2012)

Townes Van Zandt said:


> Speaking of criminals. I'd totally fuck Casey Anthony and Jodi Arias.


Well Jodi killed her last boyfriend, so bring protection...and I don't mean a condom. :cool2


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## AliFrazier100 (Feb 2, 2019)

Bumping this thread because of the recent court appearance of Joseph James DeAngelo, aka the Golden State Killer. 

Has anyone heard of this guy? He was known as the East Area Rapist and Original Night Stalker, or EAR/ONS until he was given the GSK moniker in 2016. He was active in the 70's and early 80s in different parts of California. Throughout his different crime sprees he broke into over 200 homes, committed 50 rapes and killed 13 people. I remember seeing this case on Unsolved Mysteries and Cold Case Files and for the longest time I wanted this dirt bag to be caught, but I truly never believed he would be identified. In 2018 he was tracked down using a genealogy website, and turns out he was a police officer during most of his crimes. 

They're now saying the preliminary hearings will happen in May.


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## njcam (Mar 30, 2014)

Loudon Wainwright said:


> Speaking of criminals. I'd totally fuck Casey Anthony and Jodi Arias.


You have to get past these 2 first...


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## Jesus_Mike (Nov 3, 2021)

Eduard Khil said:


> Been reading a lot about the Robert Pickton murders. Vancouver BC.
> A sick dude.


Yes Robert Williams Pickton murders dozens prostitues From Vancouver.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Pickton


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