# Is AEW starting to have attendance issues?



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Im starting to wonder on why its happening? There could be several reasons. Here is last night, despite the company claiming it was sold out.


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## AttitudeEraTom (6 mo ago)

Good. People are actually having some common sense to not spend a cent on this trash. 

Hopefully everybody else can follow suit, and all these shitty Indy geeks can go back to working for minimum wage at rinky dink school gyms where they can do a double moonsault and break their neck for 10 fat slobs in the crowd.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## KrysRaw1 (Jun 18, 2019)

Probably the only thing good the camera did was not show this but instead the infamous key botch. This photo is an example of where the company is headed with its trashy booking. You can't defend it. Fans are starting to take note.


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## HookedOnThuganomics (10 mo ago)

Chan Hung said:


> Im starting to wonder on why its happening? There could be several reasons. Here is last night, despite the company claiming it was sold out.
> 
> View attachment 128196
> View attachment 128197


What's happening is all of the bland guys that Tony continues to push has killed a lot of interest, the Japan stuff didn't help either


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## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

HookedOnThuganomics said:


> What's happening is all of the bland guys that Tony continues to push has killed a lot of interest, the Japan stuff didn't help either


Probably. Add booking errors, lack of good talent, most are very green and not ready for TV, last night's, botchamania, etc.


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## La Parka (Oct 28, 2008)

I think whats worse is the people that actually did show up got treated to a big pile of dog shit for their efforts.


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## THE_OD (Nov 21, 2016)

Well. A lot of WWE stars left for AEW. I guess tarp will soon join them xD

Nah. I wouldnt come to any conclusions based on a few pictures.


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## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

Seems to me the attendance for Dynamite is similar to Raw and SmackDown if you believe the numbers.

How come whenever AEW plus on a Dynamite that people don't like, it gets so doom and gloom in here?


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## Geert Wilders (Jan 18, 2021)

Starting?


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

That's the hardcam side isn't it? You can see people with cameras there. WrestleTix had 5,000+ tickets sold before his vacation.

Their attendances are generally as normal. Bigger numbers for bigger shows, smaller for the medium sized Dynamites. Next week's show has moved 5,500 thus far.


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## KrysRaw1 (Jun 18, 2019)

And after last night, those poor souls who paid won't return when they come back to.their city. Tarp is back.


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## hardcorewrasslin (Jun 29, 2016)

I mean that is where the hard cam is located.
Maybe the city they were in wasn’t a wrestling city, I was at blood and guts and it was packed out


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## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

hardcorewrasslin said:


> I mean that is where the hard cam is located.
> Maybe the city they were in wasn’t a wrestling city, I was at blood and guts and it was packed out



If this was the WWE section you wouldn't have all these excuses lined up. You'd make some 3 word remark about releases or Vince having sex.


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## Kishido (Aug 12, 2014)

Naaah they are demo gods and everything is fine. If not Tony will get Batista or something


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## Lenny Leonard (Dec 17, 2016)

You mean this riveting action isnt selling out

__
https://www.reddit.com/r/SCJerk/comments/w4kcqu


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## hardcorewrasslin (Jun 29, 2016)

RainmakerV2 said:


> If this was the WWE section you wouldn't have all these excuses lined up. You'd make some 3 word remark about releases or Vince having sex.


Yes, and your point being?


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## DRose1994 (Nov 12, 2020)

Well, I’m not sure what their attendance consistently looks like, but this was a good show for a lot of people to decide to not show up. It was awful.


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## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

hardcorewrasslin said:


> Yes, and your point being?


I think he's suggesting your biased and dont call a spade a spade.


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

Their average attendance on the road has generally been in the 6,000 territory. They have had the #1 (Kia Forum) and #3 (Detroit) most attended TV events in North America this year, so their higher crowds offset the lower ones and vice versa. They have two bigger TV tapings coming up too at the Target Center (August 10) and Arthur Ashe Arena (September 21).


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## Cooper09 (Aug 24, 2016)

So the guys who couldn't draw in WWE also can't draw in AEW. Who would have thought it?


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## D Z (Nov 30, 2019)

They had these half empty attendances for awhile now. Even during Hangman page run. Also khan does sell tickets so cheap.

Wrestling is very niche now


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## hardcorewrasslin (Jun 29, 2016)

Chan Hung said:


> I think he's suggesting your biased and dont call a spade a spade.


 I attended an AEW event a few weeks ago so I can tell you how my experience was and if I say it was lacklustre in attendance then I’d be liar.


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## the_flock (Nov 23, 2016)

3venflow said:


> That's the hardcam side isn't it? You can see people with cameras there. WrestleTix had 5,000+ tickets sold before his vacation.
> 
> Their attendances are generally as normal. Bigger numbers for bigger shows, smaller for the medium sized Dynamites. Next week's show has moved 5,500 thus far.


I was waiting for the "hardcam" comment.


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

I mean, it's a real thing. They nearly always leave hardcam empty except for some production kills.


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## the_flock (Nov 23, 2016)

3venflow said:


> I mean, it's a real thing. They nearly always leave hardcam empty except for some production kills.
> 
> View attachment 128216



There's a noticeable difference. On the WWE hard cam side, the crowds begin again at the corners, on the AEW side they are still empty going around.


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## Tell it like it is (Jul 1, 2019)

Let's see a 7000 capacity with 5000 in attendance. Yup AEW is definitely going to go out of business this time for sure. While you're at it how about you post where WWE did 3k.


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## hardcorewrasslin (Jun 29, 2016)

That section was purposely isolated, If you think this is how ticket sales work then you’re stupid.


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

the_flock said:


> There's a noticeable difference. On the WWE hard cam side, the crowds begin again at the corners, on the AEW side they are still empty going around.


It varies show by show. WWE has plenty of half-empty buildings too, look at some of their recent MSG shows. Last night was about 5,100 in a 7,000 configuration so yeah, there were empty seats. It's still a fine crowd for a mid-sized TV taping though.

AEW is doing fine on the attendance front, generally speaking. There are peaks and lows, but you look at the averages and they're good. As stated, they have the #1 and #3 most attended TV events in America this year and that's before Grand Slam.

If they started to do TNA numbers, then that's a worry. Their highest ever in the U.S. was 6,700 for Lockdown 2013. AEW has outdone that more times than I can count at this point.


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## Ger (Jul 20, 2018)

Chan Hung said:


> Im starting to wonder on why its happening? There could be several reasons. Here is last night, despite the company claiming it was sold out.


Cornette was right all the time!


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Who wants to pay to watch Eddie Kingston be in multiple fucking segments!?


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## Seafort (Jun 5, 2014)

AttitudeEraTom said:


> Good. People are actually having some common sense to not spend a cent on this trash.
> 
> Hopefully everybody else can follow suit, and all these shitty Indy geeks can go back to working for minimum wage at rinky dink school gyms where they can do a double moonsault and break their neck for 10 fat slobs in the crowd.
> 
> ...


Indeed. The industry as a whole is so much better off - for the various sports entertainers - as well as creatively when there is only one high value promotion there. It was such a happier time in 2018 within the industry. People did not have to worry about options, about creativity. They just did exactly what they were told, even if plans changed 5 minutes before the bell.

“You want a vision of sports entertainment? It’s the boot of WWE standing upon it, forever.”


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## grecefar (Dec 19, 2017)

Lenny Leonard said:


> You mean this riveting action isnt selling out
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/SCJerk/comments/w4kcqu


I swear, I thought sammy turned on jericho that moment.

Lol it was so bad...


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## MonkasaurusRex (Jul 3, 2016)

3venflow said:


> That's the hardcam side isn't it? You can see people with cameras there. WrestleTix had 5,000+ tickets sold before his vacation.
> 
> Their attendances are generally as normal. Bigger numbers for bigger shows, smaller for the medium sized Dynamites. Next week's show has moved 5,500 thus far.


The hardcam doesn't take up several sections of the lower bowl of a building. If you're selling out a show legitimately the hard camera like eliminates a small section of seats. When you see multiple sections of the building tarped off it's an indication of an attendance issue.


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## Stellar (May 30, 2016)

Considering that only one person has really gone in to great detail over the attendance history in AEW so far in this topic ill believe their word. We have all been on here long enough to know that sharing pictures of empty seats most of the time is shenanigans to fit a certain narrative that someone's pushing of the product. Surely we can all be better than that. If this topic was about WWE id say the same thing because I try to be fair to all products.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

5000 - 8000 on average for normal shows

seems ok to me, same as the much vaunted attitude era or WCW that everybody seems so enamoured with


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## ThunderNitro (Sep 16, 2021)

If the arena is half empty I cannot focus on the action that is happening inside the ring.


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## Upstart474 (May 13, 2018)

Attendance and ratings are declining, who would have thought. Hook ain't helping either.


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## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

AEW just did it's bigger crowds and the average number have never been this good but of course some dumbass are going to act like something terrible is happening....

You're pathetic


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## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

Upstart474 said:


> Attendance and ratings are declining, who would have thought. Hook ain't helping either.


No they're not, every metrics are up


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## Geert Wilders (Jan 18, 2021)

rbl85 said:


> No they're not, every metrics are up


ratings are up compared to the forbidden door era. However, they’ve struggled to reach a million. They were doing a million with their eyes closed at the beginning of this year


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## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

Geert Wilders said:


> ratings are up compared to the forbidden door era. However, they’ve struggled to reach a million. They were doing a million with their eyes closed at the beginning of this year


What were the numbers last year at the same period ?


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## PhenomenalOne11 (Oct 2, 2016)

Of course they're not selling out, nobody with a brain is buying an AEW ticket because they know it's going to be shit.


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## hardcorewrasslin (Jun 29, 2016)

grecefar said:


> I swear, I thought sammy turned on jericho that moment.
> 
> Lol it was so bad...


i assumed he tried to protect Jericho from Eddie’s finisher no?


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## adamclark52 (Nov 27, 2015)

I’m sure once they hit 1 million in the ratings it’ll change


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## CM Buck (Sep 2, 2012)

They're missing Omega, punk, MJF and.....sigh....Cole. and the main event was a feud people are tired of. The crowd size seems about right


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## .christopher. (Jan 14, 2014)

La Parka said:


> I think whats worse is the people that actually did show up got treated to a big pile of dog shit for their efforts.


I dunno, man. We all know what we're getting with AEW now. A bad show is to be expected. They probably enjoyed it anyway because we know there's a big portion of the fan base that will eat up everything AEW produces.


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## CM Buck (Sep 2, 2012)

.christopher. said:


> I dunno, man. We all know what we're getting with AEW now. A bad show is to be expected. They probably enjoyed it anyway because we know there's a big portion of the fan base that will eat up everything AEW produces.


That's cause they don't want it to die


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## .christopher. (Jan 14, 2014)

Firefromthegods said:


> That's cause they don't want it to die


But if they keep cheering and accepting nonsense, which will ultimately run off more fans/potential fans than bring in new ones, it's not going to help AEW in the long run.

We've got Orange Cassidy killing everybody's credibility left, right and centre, and it's happening because Tony hears the fans. Stuff like this - in the long run - is going to come back to bite them in the arse.


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## Lorromire (Jun 17, 2014)

You people are weird. Who cares if others don't like it, just watch what you enjoy.


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## CM Buck (Sep 2, 2012)

.christopher. said:


> But if they keep cheering and accepting nonsense, which will ultimately run off more fans/potential fans than bring in new ones, it's not going to help AEW in the long run.
> 
> We've got Orange Cassidy killing everybody's credibility left, right and centre, and it's happening because Tony hears the fans. Stuff like this - in the long run - is going to come back to bite them in the arse.


That's fan mindset. Like in the English premier league. Even if your teams terrible for a season they still get support. Or in all my team is sucking with a 2 15 record yet I still watch weekly and cheer minor accomplishments like not losing by over 50 points, or a footballer achieving 700 career goals 

The vocal minority that defends everything don't want to be stuck with WWE. So they will cheer everything until the announcement aew is done. Same reason why impact has a fanbase despite being consistently inconsistent.


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## .christopher. (Jan 14, 2014)

Firefromthegods said:


> That's fan mindset. Like in the English premier league. Even if your teams terrible for a season they still get support. Or in all my team is sucking with a 2 15 record yet I still watch weekly and cheer minor accomplishments like not losing by over 50 points, or a footballer achieving 700 career goals
> 
> The vocal minority that defends everything don't want to be stuck with WWE. So they will cheer everything until the announcement aew is done. Same reason why impact has a fanbase despite being consistently inconsistent.


Actual sports is different, though. You know your team tries their best and, sometimes, there are just better teams out there.

However, if you feel like your team isn't trying their best, the fans make it know. For my team, there have been plenty of protests. For Barcelona, attendance has dropped significantly because they're not happy with how they're run.

With AEW, they just can't be arsed putting on a good show.


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## GarpTheFist (8 mo ago)

Wait so aew lied about being sold out? Can't wait for all the YouTube channels to ignore it unlike how they parade this around as if the sky is falling. All the aew shills are already defending the bad attendance lol, what a sad sight.


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## CM Buck (Sep 2, 2012)

.christopher. said:


> Actual sports is different, though. You know your team tries their best and, sometimes, there are just better teams out there.
> 
> However, if you feel like your team isn't trying their best, the fans make it know. For my team, there have been plenty of protests. For Barcelona, attendance has dropped significantly because they're not happy with how they're run.
> 
> With AEW, they just can't be arsed putting on a good show.


They can they are just woefully inconsistent. Like WWE


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## BLISSED & LYNCHED (Dec 21, 2021)

Chan Hung said:


> Im starting to wonder on why its happening?


Why? Its the worst major promotion to exist in the last 25-30 years.

Looks like AEW night benefit from moving into The Impact Zone 🤣


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## DUD (Feb 21, 2021)

This lieing about attendances has gone on far too long and needs to stop. I can't believe they treat us like we're so stupid. Vince is.... wait.. this isn't about WWE? But Tony's a great guy? Somebody must have misinformed him. Let's move on.


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## Irish Jet (Nov 15, 2011)

DUD said:


> This lieing about attendances has gone on far too long and needs to stop. I can't believe they treat us like we're so stupid. Vince is.... wait.. this isn't about WWE? But Tony's a great guy? Somebody must have misinformed him. Let's move on.


Forbidden Door set records. Trust me bro.


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## Dickhead1990 (Aug 31, 2016)

All silly "they suck" comments aside...cost of living crisis? Surely that has to have an effect on crowd numbers for weekly shows.


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## Ultimo Duggan (Nov 19, 2021)

Irish Jet said:


> Forbidden Door set records. Trust me bro.


So..because you don’t like something THEY must be lying? You guys are delusional. Just support what you enjoy. If you don’t enjoy anything don’t watch. There is no law stipulating that you must like the alternative to WWE. TV wrestling is NOT the only game in town. There are DECADES of quality wrestling out there that can be consumed and enjoyed. We are not obligated to support the disputed better option. 

The numbers don’t support your theory for how wrestling SHOULD look. It hasn’t become popular again like it was over twenty years ago. We people who don’t like current wrestling - OBVIOUSLY we know how to fix things. We aren’t the ones buying the tickets so they MUST be made up numbers.

Wrestling doesn’t need to be popular for you to enjoy it again guilt free. If all that makes wrestling great is tied in directly with something new that we haven’t seen yet we can’t really complain much when new results aren’t exactly what we envision pro wrestling should be. It is much easier to watch and complain like clockwork every single week that there is no modern pro wrestling that tickles our specific wrestling fancy.

No,it must be some sort of grand conspiracy. People we don’t respect make up numbers that we don’t believe about wrestlers and wrestling that we never enjoy.

Yeah, it’s modern wrestling that has the problem.


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## Irish Jet (Nov 15, 2011)

Ultimo Duggan said:


> So..because you don’t like something THEY must be lying? You guys are delusional. Just support what you enjoy. If you don’t enjoy anything don’t watch. There is no law stipulating that you must like the alternative to WWE. TV wrestling is NOT the only game in town. There are DECADES of quality wrestling out there that can be consumed and enjoyed. We are not obligated to support the disputed better option.
> 
> The numbers don’t support your theory for how wrestling SHOULD look. It hasn’t become popular again like it was over twenty years ago. We people who don’t like current wrestling - OBVIOUSLY we know how to fix things. We aren’t the ones buying the tickets so they MUST be made up numbers.
> 
> ...


They're lying because promotors lie. Vince, Bischoff, Dana, Tony - They're all the same. Get a grip.

Tony is the guy who said most of those who dislike AEW are bots. He has zero credibility and anyone believing a word he says when it comes to the company's fortunes is delusional.

Quit with this cultish shit. They literally claimed on the broadcast that this show was sold out and we know that's nonsense. You are the one believing what a billionaire says uncritically. I have no idea what the rest of your incoherent rant is referencing or how it's relevant.


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## A PG Attitude (Nov 5, 2012)

Wrestling fanbase is so toxic. The stuff people get mad and worked up about on here is ridiculous.


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## Ultimo Duggan (Nov 19, 2021)

Irish Jet said:


> They're lying because promotors lie. Vince, Bischoff, Dana, Tony - They're all the same. Get a grip.
> 
> Tony is the guy who said most of those who dislike AEW are bots. He has zero credibility and anyone believing a word he says when it comes to the company's fortunes is delusional.
> 
> Quit with this cultish shit. They literally claimed on the broadcast that this show was sold out and we know that's nonsense. You are the one believing what a billionaire says uncritically. I have no idea what the rest of your incoherent rant is referencing or how it's relevant.


Well, my incoherent rant is telling people that their wrestling interests are probably better served elsewhere. Find wrestling you enjoy and support it. If that is what passes for incoherent in 2022 then some of you are less wrestling fans than you are reactionaries disliking something because it isn’t exactly what you are used to watching. I think that is pretty self evident by the minor uproar in here during the buildup for the Forbidden Door PPV. 

it is rich that the concept of promoters lying is adhered to now. For years TK’s quotes have been thrown back in his face like those critics have locked him inside some sort of logic trap that proves AEW never meant a word of their initial press conferences.

Obviously promotions lie. However, AEW’s first press clippings are scrutinized like it’s a legally binding agreement they are regularly contradicting. They don’t adhere to colourful language that is meant to distance themselves from the other behemoth in American pro wrestling they will be regularly compared with. Yet they are regularly held to those first few statements…although you apparently concede that they do lie because that is just what the wrestling business is.

Believing that all the wrestling media coverage is also in on this big lie of AEW numbers is what sensible people would call extreme paranoia. Building up an opponent for the evil WWE wouldn’t and doesn’t get as much business for newsletters, podcasts and websites that a healthy and prosperous WWE would and has garnered in the past. I was online during the crappy Attitude Era. The wrestling landscape online was much healthier when most wrestling media thought WWE was doing a good job.


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

Ultimo Duggan said:


> I was online during the crappy Attitude Era.


Were you on RSPW? In the late 90s/early 00s I used to be a regular on there and posted news updates from Japan and such when it was harder to get news (using my shoddy translation skills).

The WWF vs. WCW wars existed but to me often felt more play fighting than some of the venom I see on these forums (although nothing on WF will ever top Chad Bryant vs. Alex Cain but that had nothing to do with WWF/WCW). Same with Meltzer, the Cenation generation (basically, what I call the generation that only ever knew one major company) despises him on a level that never existed previous. He used to get mild criticisms back then (some saying he was pro-WWF but that was generally because WCW was sliding and he knew it), but nowadays it feels personal, as if people can't stand the idea of anyone liking anything that isn't the one company they've known. Stockholm Syndrome is real.


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## 5 Star Giulia ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ (Apr 21, 2014)




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## Prized Fighter (Aug 31, 2016)

Those pictures are from the hard cam side and it continues to boggle my mind the amount of people who fall for these photos.

Just check WrestleTix on Twitter. The numbers are in the same area as previous years, with the occasional big venue for TV. I do think AEW could stand to test themselves a bit more and go for bigger venues more often. Even if they don't sell out the bigger arenas, it is worth seeing where their ceiling is in each market. The PPVs should never be in a venue with a capacity less then 25,000. Meltzer mentioned that AEW is looking to have their first Canada show in Toronto and could run the Rogers Centre. That place holds over 53,000 people, so they could easily have a wrestling set up for 40,000+. They could push that higher if they do the WWE thing and count everyone in the building (suites, vendors, etc). If they ran Full Gear there and it was their Canada debut, I could see them getting 30,000+ easily and possibly even filling it.


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## Ultimo Duggan (Nov 19, 2021)

I was on RSPW originally. That place, like twitter today, was a place of insane contradictions. It had the most varied discussion online anywhere for wrestling. It also had a lot of people who seemed to live in RSPW and it became a microcosm for society like those things usually end up being in any format or community of fans. The DVDVR forum and website would eventually branch off of USENET and that’s where I saw the most varied discussion of wrestling styles and promotions for the next two decades or more.

Ultimately RSPW did seem more like play fighting when compared to the extremes that any argument is subjected to in 2022. It was a much more idealistic time everywhere online back in the late 90s.


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## Ultimo Duggan (Nov 19, 2021)

The Legit Lioness said:


> View attachment 128248


Bischoff is quite the opposite boss that TK is said to resemble. EB’s motives and inspirations are nothing like TK’s. 

I don’t think Eric could offer TK much in the way of easily transferable advice at all. Bischoff’s major problem was allowing some wrestlers to have too much say in how they are booked. Does he ever bring up that reality which he allowed to fester and stonewall major storylines his entire career working with Hogan or others? When everyone is a team player it doesn’t matter how many wrestlers you may have hungrily hired or hired to keep away from the competition. 

I doubt the salaries in AEW are even at the inflated heights they reached when EB was signing them cheques. Hogan doing Sting dirty, sabotaging the Bret/Flair feud/team and the lazy as hell Goldberg World Title reign did more to hurt WCW than ten superfluous or rainy day wrestler signings ever did. Had things worked out with NWO Nitro WCW would have required a larger roster with many of the stockpiled talents being more prominently featured than they inevitably wound up becoming in reality.


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## 5 Star Giulia ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ (Apr 21, 2014)

Ultimo Duggan said:


> Bischoff is quite the opposite boss that TK is said to resemble. EB’s motives and inspirations are nothing like TK’s.
> 
> I don’t think Eric could offer TK much in the way of easily transferable advice at all. Bischoff’s major problem was allowing some wrestlers to have too much say in how they are booked. Does he ever bring up that reality which he allowed to fester and stonewall major storylines his entire career working with Hogan or others? When everyone is a team player it doesn’t matter how many wrestlers you may have hungrily hired or hired to keep away from the competition.
> 
> I doubt the salaries in AEW are even at the inflated heights they reached when EB was signing them cheques. Hogan doing Sting dirty, sabotaging the Bret/Flair feud/team and the lazy as hell Goldberg World Title reign did more to hurt WCW than ten superfluous or rainy day wrestler signings ever did. Had things worked out with NWO Nitro WCW would have required a larger roster with many of the stockpiled talents being more prominently featured than they inevitably wound up becoming in reality.


*What's that have to do with anything he said about Tony Khan's excessive signings failing though? Y'all like to deflect by attacking the messenger instead of addressing the message.*


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## Ultimo Duggan (Nov 19, 2021)

The Legit Lioness said:


> *What's that have to do with anything he said about Tony Khan's excessive signings failing though? Y'all like to deflect by attacking the messenger instead of addressing the message.*


Your kind doesn’t know a thing about me. I thought my point was pretty clear.

All Bischoff said related to the ratings. Why did he ever think TK’s fiftysomething signings since the pandemic were specifically brought in to raise the ratings? Only Bischoff (probably Russo too, tbh) would think that just nearly doubling the roster size would improve the ratings.

Whether it is exactly related I’m not sure. The signings HAVE meant more money for AEW. The PPVs have been more popular than they were before the slew of signings throughout the pandemic. They came out of the Daiky’s Place era doing very strong live attendance figures.

Unless we don’t believe the numbers…if you feel that way, fine. We just can’t have this discussion about Bischoff counting customers for AEW.

Did TK ever insinuate that the bigger his roster is the higher the ratings will reach? It seems like a safe bet that he signed who he did to improve the quality of the shows, first and foremost. The wrestling and the non-wrestling segments have improved considerably since the wave of signings began in 2020. 

My quoted post was describing the difference between EB and TK. Unless he said otherwise TK didn’t sign everyone for a ratings bump. He wanted to create a new wrestling company that was owned and operated differently than the other big name company. AEW had different types and different looking wrestlers not on the other promotion’s programs. They wanted to work with international promotions without taking them over and reducing them to a mere shell of their former selves. For a new company they want to establish ties with those promotions while eventually running important events in those international markets. While they assuredly do want to compete with WWE it isn’t their raison d’être.

TK wouldn’t reduce his company to being so obsessed with ratings. That line of thinking cost Eric his job in WCW the first time. He should know by now that it isn’t the most productive way to improve your company.


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## 5 Star Giulia ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ (Apr 21, 2014)

Ultimo Duggan said:


> Your kind doesn’t know a thing about me. I thought my point was pretty clear.
> 
> All Bischoff said related to the ratings. Why did he ever think TK’s fiftysomething signings since the pandemic were specifically brought in to raise the ratings? Only Bischoff (probably Russo too, tbh) would think that just nearly doubling the roster size would improve the ratings.
> 
> ...


*Tony Khan literally gets on Twitter and brags about ratings every time he hits 1 million. He's radio silent when he has record lows and even raged at a fan for predicting he would get 800,000 viewers. Of course he's obsessed with the f** ratings. Of course he expects a return on his massive investments, which is why he constantly brags about CM Punk paying for his contract in one day, yet no one else has produced a fraction of that.*


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## Shaz Cena (9 mo ago)

Irish Jet said:


> They're lying because promotors lie. Vince, Bischoff, Dana, Tony - They're all the same. Get a grip.
> 
> Tony is the guy who said most of those who dislike AEW are bots. He has zero credibility and anyone believing a word he says when it comes to the company's fortunes is delusional.
> 
> Quit with this cultish shit. They literally claimed on the broadcast that this show was sold out and we know that's nonsense. You are the one believing what a billionaire says uncritically. I have no idea what the rest of your incoherent rant is referencing or how it's relevant.


I agree with this take. One of the best ways to tell how fake Tony is, is when you hear him in the media scrums. The guy calls any shitty match great. Tony is a mark of his own product. He will never tell you anything negative about it. So his take on the amount of numbers AEW did is all fake unless we get actual proof of them. He is a salesmen when doing PR why would he tell you anything negative?


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## TKO Wrestling (Jun 26, 2018)

Hardly lol. They just drew over 5k for Dynamite this week. Two months ago Raw had two shows under 5k. It is just the nature of touring.


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## TKO Wrestling (Jun 26, 2018)

Smackdown in Boston this week with Lesnar advertised is going to be 2/3rd empty. They are in the 6000s, Dynamite on a Wedneday in July in a city that WWE doesn't even run just drew in the 5000s. Hardly an issue.


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## TKO Wrestling (Jun 26, 2018)

What AEW SHOULD do though is use tarps like WWE does. It really helps the look v empty exposed seats.


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## AttitudeEraTom (6 mo ago)

Ultimo Duggan said:


> Bischoff is quite the opposite boss that TK is said to resemble. EB’s motives and inspirations are nothing like TK’s.
> 
> I don’t think Eric could offer TK much in the way of easily transferable advice at all. Bischoff’s major problem was allowing some wrestlers to have too much say in how they are booked. Does he ever bring up that reality which he allowed to fester and stonewall major storylines his entire career working with Hogan or others? When everyone is a team player it doesn’t matter how many wrestlers you may have hungrily hired or hired to keep away from the competition.
> 
> I doubt the salaries in AEW are even at the inflated heights they reached when EB was signing them cheques. Hogan doing Sting dirty, sabotaging the Bret/Flair feud/team and the lazy as hell Goldberg World Title reign did more to hurt WCW than ten superfluous or rainy day wrestler signings ever did. Had things worked out with NWO Nitro WCW would have required a larger roster with many of the stockpiled talents being more prominently featured than they inevitably wound up becoming in reality.


You write a lot of bullshit to try and deflect from questions.

Tony just wants to play mindless dumb mark, he thinks every lame match is this genius level shit and he goes crazy for everything like he’s autistic (maybe he is actually). Dude does not belong anywhere near running and booking a major wrestling company, a gas station would be a decent start.

People like you and the other AEW stan weirdos need to stop gargling his nuts. Or keep doing it, and watch as they keep losing viewership. Hello PopTV while pockets plays fiddle with World Champion Adam Cole


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## MonkasaurusRex (Jul 3, 2016)

Prized Fighter said:


> Those pictures are from the hard cam side and it continues to boggle my mind the amount of people who fall for these photos.
> 
> Just check WrestleTix on Twitter. The numbers are in the same area as previous years, with the occasional big venue for TV. I do think AEW could stand to test themselves a bit more and go for bigger venues more often. Even if they don't sell out the bigger arenas, it is worth seeing where their ceiling is in each market. The PPVs should never be in a venue with a capacity less then 25,000. Meltzer mentioned that AEW is looking to have their first Canada show in Toronto and could run the Rogers Centre. That place holds over 53,000 people, so they could easily have a wrestling set up for 40,000+. They could push that higher if they do the WWE thing and count everyone in the building (suites, vendors, etc). If they ran Full Gear there and it was their Canada debut, I could see them getting 30,000+ easily and possibly even filling it.


You don't block off multiple sections of an arena for the hard camera. It's something that takes up a portion of the centre section of the lower bowl in a building.
In this picture from an episode of RAW you can literally see people seated directly to the left(right in the picture) of the hard camera.









Seriously, do people think the hard cam is the size of a small building or something? It's a TV camera on a tripod/stand. If AEW could have filled the seats at their show they would have same with every WWE show that blocks off several sections of seating. They couldn't get people on the door to fill them it's that simple.

Stop using the hard cam as an excuse for a large portion of the lower bowl being empty at shows its bullshit and everyone with a brain knows it.


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## AttitudeEraTom (6 mo ago)

Dickhead1990 said:


> All silly "they suck" comments aside...cost of living crisis? Surely that has to have an effect on crowd numbers for weekly shows.


Deflect and deflect and deflect and deflect.

Where does “booking a better show” come into the picture? Before or after worrying about how many simpletons watch The Challenge?


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## TKO Wrestling (Jun 26, 2018)

AttitudeEraTom said:


> Deflect and deflect and deflect and deflect.
> 
> Where does “booking a better show” come into the picture? Before or after worrying about how many simpletons watch The Challenge?


The show has been extremely enjoyable so that can't be it lol. Might have to do with running towns that WWE with 40 years experience know better to run for TV? WWE ran this arena ONE TIME for a PPV in 2004, Armageddon, and ran....wait for it....5000 people lol.

Try harder.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armageddon_(2004)


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## DMD Mofomagic (Jun 9, 2017)

3venflow said:


> Were you on RSPW? In the late 90s/early 00s I used to be a regular on there and posted news updates from Japan and such when it was harder to get news (using my shoddy translation skills).
> 
> The WWF vs. WCW wars existed but to me often felt more play fighting than some of the venom I see on these forums (although nothing on WF will ever top Chad Bryant vs. Alex Cain but that had nothing to do with WWF/WCW). Same with Meltzer, the Cenation generation (basically, what I call the generation that only ever knew one major company) despises him on a level that never existed previous. He used to get mild criticisms back then (some saying he was pro-WWF but that was generally because WCW was sliding and he knew it), but nowadays it feels personal, as if people can't stand the idea of anyone liking anything that isn't the one company they've known. Stockholm Syndrome is real.


Meltzer has a lot of enemies now because wrestlers, promoters, and etc have more of a voice. 

There are a lot of wrestlers people trust that say Meltzer has been full of it for awhile.

And his perceived AEW bias does not help him. Also, he doesnt know how to talk to people on Twitter and obviously says things that can be taken out of context or are just not accepted.

I am not a Meltzer fan in any way and thinks he has done more harm than good, but the idea that his hate comes from nowhere is not true.


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## Ultimo Duggan (Nov 19, 2021)

The Legit Lioness said:


> *Tony Khan literally gets on Twitter and brags about ratings every time he hits 1 million. He's radio silent when he has record lows and even raged at a fan for predicting he would get 800,000 viewers. Of course he's obsessed with the f** ratings. Of course he expects a return on his massive investments, which is why he constantly brags about CM Punk paying for his contract in one day, yet no one else has produced a fraction of that.*


Well, go ahead and obsess about a promoter bragging about higher ratings. Why would he brag when they are lower than what you guys expect them to be? I guess he could just comment every week about AEW ratings. Context be damned! People here would just mock TK for not showing any perspective if he did though. He can’t ignore the importance of ratings completely though. It is actually part of his job. 

It definitely isn’t on our pro wrestling fan resume. Nor should it ever be much of a concern for us poor folk. Personally, all I care about are the quality of the matches and the non-wrestling segments that make up all the other moments on a wrestling program. More fans should really give give it a try.

A few weeks ago I touted the live gate and live attendance weeks ago because so many critics questioned the purpose of doing the Forbidden Door PPV. Too many just ignored the potential quality of the show and the matches when TK supposedly didn’t give some critics enough of a reason to enjoy it. I appealed to those who might care about pro wrestling finances. Today I see threads disputing the facts and figures. Do they have some of those “alrernative facts” we heard about potentially existing a few years ago? THAT is what I would call shooting the messenger.

I am no talking head or pundit trying to improve my brand. Explaining a point more clearly shouldn’t be confused with moving the goalposts, pivoting or attacking the messenger.


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## 5 Star Giulia ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ (Apr 21, 2014)

*This was in response to Vince retiring. I rest my case. Tony Khan is an absolute clown.

 https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1550578379543437314*


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## $Dolladrew$ (Jun 15, 2020)

The Legit Lioness said:


> *This was in response to Vince retiring. I rest my case. Tony Khan is an absolute clown.
> 
> https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1550578379543437314*


It's facts Bruh


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## AttitudeEraTom (6 mo ago)

TKO Wrestling said:


> The show has been extremely enjoyable so that can't be it lol. Might have to do with running towns that WWE with 40 years experience know better to run for TV? WWE ran this arena ONE TIME for a PPV in 2004, Armageddon, and ran....wait for it....5000 people lol.
> 
> Try harder.
> 
> ...


The show being enjoyable to stans does nothing for its success. They are DOWN across the board in ratings from a year ago, try and spin that shit any way you can but those are facts. 

Yet people are going to sit in their delusions of growth. How much of Tony’s semen are your eyes caked by so you are so blind to this shit?


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## sideon (Sep 18, 2008)

3venflow said:


> *Their average attendance on the road has generally been in the 6,000 territory.* They have had the #1 (Kia Forum) and #3 (Detroit) most attended TV events in North America this year, so their higher crowds offset the lower ones and vice versa. They have two bigger TV tapings coming up too at the Target Center (August 10) and Arthur Ashe Arena (September 21).


Source? Because outside of a few shows here and there this is not unnatural for them. AEW is not publicly traded so they can lie about the numbers all they want to, WWE inflates their numbers but legally they have to give the real numbers during the investor calls.


$Dolladrew$ said:


> It's facts Bruh


Except it's not bruh


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

sideon said:


> Source? Because outside of a few shows here and there this is not unnatural for them.


WrestleTix, which isn't official but has his own software and studies ticket maps and sales like no one I've ever seen. I'm subscribed to his Patreon and I've never seen such detail with section by section breakdowns of some shows. He covers WWE (all of their house shows), AEW, IMPACT, NJPW Strong and some indy events. Well worth the couple of bucks per month. Most of his numbers are backed up by the company (when they release attendances) and WON when they have numbers.


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## $Dolladrew$ (Jun 15, 2020)

sideon said:


> Source? Because outside of a few shows here and there this is not unnatural for them. AEW is not publicly traded so they can lie about the numbers all they want to, WWE inflates their numbers but legally they have to give the real numbers during the investor calls.
> 
> Except it's not bruh


Hes the longest tenured CEO in wrestling.......what's there to dispute lol


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## Dickhead1990 (Aug 31, 2016)

AttitudeEraTom said:


> Deflect and deflect and deflect and deflect.
> 
> Where does “booking a better show” come into the picture? Before or after worrying about how many simpletons watch The Challenge?


Yes that's it, because it's just a black and white issue and that's it!


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)




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## .christopher. (Jan 14, 2014)

Firefromthegods said:


> They can they are just woefully inconsistent. Like WWE


Hand on heart, do you think they put 100% into every episode? I personally don’t. There are times I wonder if they even put in 50%.


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## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

Now that attendances are shit as well, it's becoming less and less like a viable operation. I mean it never really was but when all the sources of revenues are cut, it become just a plaything for a Billionaire who overpays to keep it alive. The Turner deal is not that good either. And productions cost for TV are getting bigger and bigger.


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## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

Ultimo Duggan said:


> Bischoff is quite the opposite boss that TK is said to resemble. EB’s motives and inspirations are nothing like TK’s.
> 
> I don’t think Eric could offer TK much in the way of easily transferable advice at all. Bischoff’s major problem was allowing some wrestlers to have too much say in how they are booked. Does he ever bring up that reality which he allowed to fester and stonewall major storylines his entire career working with Hogan or others? When everyone is a team player it doesn’t matter how many wrestlers you may have hungrily hired or hired to keep away from the competition.
> 
> I doubt the salaries in AEW are even at the inflated heights they reached when EB was signing them cheques. Hogan doing Sting dirty, sabotaging the Bret/Flair feud/team and the lazy as hell Goldberg World Title reign did more to hurt WCW than ten superfluous or rainy day wrestler signings ever did. Had things worked out with NWO Nitro WCW would have required a larger roster with many of the stockpiled talents being more prominently featured than they inevitably wound up becoming in reality.


You blame Bischoff for doing the same thing as Tony is doing, letting guys to do what the Hell they want. 

If anything EB would be great at showing TK that sometime it's useful to being an asshole. The wrestlers are not your friends. I mean sure Hogan had more freedom but EB was not opposed to firing guys and speaking the guys in their faces. He was not friends with all of them like TK is with the AEW roster. FTR creaming themselves over TK finding theme a good music theme was facepalming. You have to keep your distance with the talent.


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## GarpTheFist (8 mo ago)

The Legit Lioness said:


> *This was in response to Vince retiring. I rest my case. Tony Khan is an absolute clown.
> 
> https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1550578379543437314*



Things like that makes me question if he really is a nice guy or just doesn't have a clue about how to conduct himself in a social setting.


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## 5 Star Giulia ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ (Apr 21, 2014)

GarpTheFist said:


> Things like that makes me question if he really is a nice guy or just doesn't have a clue about how to conduct himself in a social setting.


*Both. He's an asshole with no social skills.*


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## Beetlejuice84 (Oct 5, 2021)

Is TK really the only one writing the Shows because it would be insane to do it all by yourself and not get help from guys that are already in your company.


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## Jersey (Jun 24, 2014)

The Legit Lioness said:


> *This was in response to Vince retiring. I rest my case. Tony Khan is an absolute clown.
> 
> https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1550578379543437314*


Dixie Carter wasn’t even this delusional to say such thing. The guy’s only been here for a cup of here, he should humble himself before everything backfires on him.


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## zodiacF5 (Apr 3, 2017)

3venflow said:


> It varies show by show. WWE has plenty of half-empty buildings too, look at some of their recent MSG shows. Last night was about 5,100 in a 7,000 configuration so yeah, there were empty seats. It's still a fine crowd for a mid-sized TV taping though.
> 
> AEW is doing fine on the attendance front, generally speaking. There are peaks and lows, but you look at the averages and they're good. As stated, they have the #1 and #3 most attended TV events in America this year and that's before Grand Slam.
> 
> If they started to do TNA numbers, then that's a worry. Their highest ever in the U.S. was 6,700 for Lockdown 2013. AEW has outdone that more times than I can count at this point.


Defend till the end.. 👏


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## No Chance in Hell (6 mo ago)

Push NXT guys and draw NXT numbers. The only question is how they are selling a single ticket. Who are these few dozen people purchasing a ticket to watch Kyle O'Reilly and Keith Limitless Stomach Lee?


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## Randy Lahey (Apr 14, 2014)

AEW’s ticket sales are phenomenal. Them running so often in Chicago and still drawing is huge plus.

Forbidden Door did a million dollar gate.

Their ticket sales are actually doing far better than their demo ratings. Which makes sense bc the people going to shows are the base audience and given Forbidden Door and even the ROH show there is a huge demand for AEW style wrestling. 

I don’t think anyone is excited to go see a WWE event. I see way more energy in an AEW crowd


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

zodiacF5 said:


> Defend till the end.. 👏


Nothing to defend, AEW has done incredible numbers for a young promotion. Numbers TNA could only ever have dreamed of. In two separate months I believe, they even did higher averages than WWE. The problem with this board is people don't look at the data, they see a few photos and make shitty hot-takes. Speaking of defend till the end, look at YOUR own post history.


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## Sin City Saint (Feb 4, 2006)

Chan Hung said:


> Im starting to wonder on why its happening? There could be several reasons. Here is last night, despite the company claiming it was sold out.
> 
> View attachment 128196
> View attachment 128197


Depends on the market (area they are in). Where I’m at AEW sells out (or nearly). WWE hardly gets anyone in the upper bowl. I would actually say AEW usually does better attendance in most markets at the moment (though they do less shows and WWE can run stadiums based on decades of brand name PPV live events like WrestleMania and SummerSlam). I can show empty arenas for WWE if we are going to do the whole AEW versus WWE thing but I’d hope some of you aren’t idiots…


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## AttitudeEraTom (6 mo ago)

Dickhead1990 said:


> Yes that's it, because it's just a black and white issue and that's it!


Classic AEW stan with zero comeback. 

Don't you have Dark to watch?


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## Dickhead1990 (Aug 31, 2016)

AttitudeEraTom said:


> Classic AEW stan with zero comeback.
> 
> Don't you have Dark to watch?


What a lazy buzzword comment! Calm down you sad act.

I bet you're a rejoiner too!


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## Hunter's Penis (Apr 10, 2020)

OP is a AEW hater

you can clearly see fans on that side came dressed as chairs, hence we can't see them.


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## AttitudeEraTom (6 mo ago)

Dickhead1990 said:


> What a lazy buzzword comment! Calm down you sad act.
> 
> I bet you're a rejoiner too!


Bro I came here because squaredcircle is a dumpster fire, it makes here look like sunshine and rainbows, even if you still get a bunch of blind AEW fanatics like yourself.


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## 5 Star Giulia ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ (Apr 21, 2014)

3venflow said:


> It varies show by show. WWE has plenty of half-empty buildings too, look at some of their recent MSG shows.




__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1551638233079058438


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

Well, I did say recent, not the upcoming one. 6,800 for their traditional Xmas show there in 2021 (usually one of their hottest tickets), 7,000 for Smackdown in 2019, but 13,000 for Smackdown last year. WWE's TV attendances have gone up just recently. This was a couple of years ago:










The G1 Supercard (16,534) is still the biggest attendance at MSG since WWE's network special in 2015 (when they claimed 19,000).


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## Dickhead1990 (Aug 31, 2016)

AttitudeEraTom said:


> Bro I came here because squaredcircle is a dumpster fire, it makes here look like sunshine and rainbows, even if you still get a bunch of blind AEW fanatics like yourself.


Blind fanatics? What a completely self-absorbed idiot you are! 

If you can't take people enjoying things, then that's your problem, not mine.

Best go back there where you belong perhaps?


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## AttitudeEraTom (6 mo ago)

Dickhead1990 said:


> Blind fanatics? What a completely self-absorbed idiot you are!
> 
> If you can't take people enjoying things, then that's your problem, not mine.
> 
> Best go back there where you belong perhaps?


I'm plenty okay with people enjoying things.

But I have major problems with people thinking everything is great and any criticism is unwarranted and an attack on your precious AEW, which you and a select bunch seem to think. 

So nah, I'm here to stay bucko.


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## Dickhead1990 (Aug 31, 2016)

AttitudeEraTom said:


> I'm plenty okay with people enjoying things.
> 
> But I have major problems with people thinking everything is great and any criticism is unwarranted and an attack on your precious AEW, which you and a select bunch seem to think.
> 
> So nah, I'm here to stay bucko.


I'll give you a fortnight before you're banned. 

So yes, you basically do have a problem with people having opinions and enjoying things then. Nice own goal basement dweller!


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