# What do you think of MJF's new faction on night one?



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Predictable and uninteresting. A mock Four Horsemen isn’t going to help anyone.


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

Great debut for them and make a lot more sense than MJF-led Inner Circle to elevate Max. Just hope they give them a cool name.

People are complaining about Spears, but you need someone to drop the falls and Spears' weaknesses could be well hidden in a faction. He has a good look usually (the blond needs to go), has a kickass entrance theme, and is solid in the ring.

It was probably the most unpredictable swerve in a long time, as AEW convinced everyone MJF would depose Jericho. Instead, they turn the entire IC face and replace them with a group that looks darker and more serious. I doubt there'll be much joking around with these guys...


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Tully and Spears aren't need the rest of the pieces are fine and it makes MJF look like the cerebral assassin. But I really dislike Spears and can't give a fuck about Tully so that hurts it a lot. But if it gets MJF to a title and we get the Batista style turn from Wardlow it's worth it. Hopefully Spears and old man Tully are short term original members.


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## KingofKings1524 (Aug 27, 2007)

I love the idea. Let’s see how they execute. Wardlow needs to go over eventually, though. This group should all be built around his turn in the future. Much like Batista finally wrecking HHH after Evolution disbanded.


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

P.S. I say again, MJF is a pro wrestling treasure!


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1369860239504379904


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## Stellar (May 30, 2016)

I literally was like "what the heck." when the reveal happened. That was totally unexpected.

I do like the group overall. Makes more sense than Blade and Butcher joining Matt Hardy honestly.

Spears has a direction again and it gives FTR something to do while not number 1 contenders for the tag team titles.


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## $Dolladrew$ (Jun 15, 2020)

3venflow said:


> Great debut for them and make a lot more sense than MJF-led Inner Circle to elevate Max. Just hope they give them a cool name.
> 
> People are complaining about Spears, but you need someone to drop the falls and Spears' weaknesses could be well hidden in a faction. He has a good look usually (the blond needs to go), has a kickass entrance theme, and is solid in the ring.
> 
> ...


Pretty much all non flippy guys.If I were booking I'd make them the arrogant oldschool guys FTR started out as when they joined but on steroids.Go out insulting all the indyriffic shit saying they are going to clean out the garbage in AEW.


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## CMPunkRock316 (Jan 17, 2016)

Love it. 

Maybe this is our "Blood & Guts" Inner Circle vs MJF's Heathens


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## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Was i the only one wishing Hammerstone was going to appear haha


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## WrestleFAQ (May 26, 2020)

They look great together. They just fit. And they all fill a role.

Leader: MJF
Muscle: Wardlow
Team: FTR
Tag Along: Spears
Manager: Blanchard

As for why Spears is there . . . I suppose they still see some potential in the guy. He's not bad -- decent look and performer -- so I don't mind it. A fifth member also allows them to match up perfectly with the Inner Circle, which works for feuds and the obvious Blood & Guts match.

Jericho => MJF
Hager => Wardlow
Santana & Ortiz => FTR
Sammy => Spears


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Great except for Spears. I hate 5 on 5 matches but if they do it ONCE as a major match that actually means something then cool. Blood & Guts could work for that but not if we see them 5 on 5 eight times before that. Do it War Games style so they do not all just start in the ring and just create a big mess like the cluster matches always turn out to be. Slow it down and tell a story.

I would keep Jericho out for a bit and honestly just have this new group beating ass and taking names for a long time to get them over as THE dominant faction. Keep the IC away from them because they are not at full strength. They will not miss you if you never go away. Build that eventual clash up down the road.

You have the easy feud of Hager vs Wardlow. They have been wanting to really see who was the best the whole time they were in the IC and it makes sense for them to square off. Normally I would tease it in a multi man match. Have them only get a minute or two with each other to make everyone really want to see the one on one match. I know it is Hager and he is eh at best but you have to use this to start Wardlow as a true member of equal status in the group and not just the bodyguard/lackey. Obvious babyface turn Batista style way down the line.

FTR and Santana and Ortiz should lead to some good matches at least. Now comes the first part of why it is not going to be as good as it should be. The IC jacked around with the janitor for half of 2020 and turned Santana and Ortiz into goofs who always lost. Why would I believe they were threats? They need to give Santana and Ortiz some big matches almost every week on Dynamite and give them definite wins over other good teams to do their best to rebuild them as an actual force and not guys who want to do the backstroke in a pool of juice.

They obviously have to give us Sammy and MJF at some point since that has been about the only real and good tension in this group before now. The only part that I hate about this is I really like Sammy and want him to get to that next level, but he is still second fiddle to Jericho here and cannot be beating MJF as the new leader of the other group. Getting a fluke win could work though to piss MJF off more.

If this had taken place nine months ago we would be having a whole different conversation. Goofy Jericho needs to get back to business and now. They should really give him a month off after the "table" spot and have him make a real face return to save the group after awhile off. I would have a big rematch (no singing, no dancing) between him and MJF and have Jericho win. That infuriates MJF and leads to the setup of Blood & Guts. I would have Tully cut the promo of his life giving the history of the idea and how unforgiving the cage is, etc. You know Tully can do it too.

SO that leaves Spears. No one likes him and he is 40. He does not match up with Sammy at all. They should have picked one of their 74,632 signed talents to strap the rocket to here. They had four established guys. Having a fresh face would have been great. Of course I would want it to be Starks (Where was Team Tazz tonight?). Put that cocky bastard in there who knows how to style and profile if you know what I mean. Some Sammy and Ricky matches would be awesome. But no, we have All Friends again. I honestly cannot think of anything interesting for him to do except be the silent killer...but they already have Wardlow for that who is better in every way.

OK so that all leads up to Blood and Guts and you have to have the new group go over here. IC has had their run. Doing this could get Sammy over as a big babyface and a new singles star after the breakup. I would want to see Santana be a singles star too and see what he can do, but if they stay a tag team I am sure they could do something too. The new team wins the match definitely and they put Jericho OUT all bloody and dead. That puts him off screen for, I dunno, months? Then he can come back for one last singles run, have a few big matches and then retire putting someone over on the way out.

That is loosely how I am thinking the next many months go.


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## The True Believer (Oct 19, 2013)

Can’t really say that I’m a fan, but that’s because this a kneejerk reaction to having yet ANOTHER anew stable/tag team forming in AEW. Most of them don’t really operate under consistent cohesion and although I can’t say that this is what we’ll get here, I’m cautious nonetheless.


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## TheFiend666 (Oct 5, 2019)

Spears is such a geek and then him dying his hear blonde is embarrassing


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## PhenomenalOne11 (Oct 2, 2016)

Agree with it except for FTR and Shawn Spears, all three are channel changers of the highest order. Should have taken Santana and Ortiz. Just get rid of Spears completely.


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## DZ Crew (Sep 26, 2016)

Oh goodie, another faction. We definitely needed one. MJF is fine on his own. He doesn't need his own jobber squad.


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## CM Buck (Sep 2, 2012)

@bdon Bet you're relieved. Mjf as leader and not Cody

Im also thrilled about this because FTR and spears are incapable of goofy comedy


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## La Parka (Oct 28, 2008)

Him joining the innercircle was largely pointless. He could’ve easily made this group without months of that.

Shawn Spears and his stupid blonde mohawk have no business involved in this faction.

FTR, MJF and Wardlow should work well together.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Firefromthegods said:


> @bdon Bet you're relieved. Mjf as leader and not Cody
> 
> Im also thrilled about this because FTR and spears are incapable of goofy comedy


You fucking read my mind, didn’t you!?


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Firefromthegods said:


> @bdon Bet you're relieved. Mjf as leader and not Cody
> 
> Im also thrilled about this because FTR and spears are incapable of goofy comedy


As an aside, this actually would actually make Cody’s world title win palpable given MJF is the champion and running the Four Horsemen: a Rhodes going over the Horsemen for his first and only (very short) World Title reign?

I could get behind that.


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## 5 Star Giulia ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ (Apr 21, 2014)

Prosper said:


> That was a nice swerve ending and now we got MJF leading a faction with Wardlow, FTR, and Shawn Spears. I like the make-up of the faction. Dominant slimeball heel leader, dominant tag team, a beast in Wardlow, and a slimy heel in Shawn Spears who can be the fall guy. I like the formation. I do think that they need to break up the IC after this 5 v 5 feud ends though. We all thought we were getting a reiteration of the 4 Horsemen, but this actually comes off better. What's crazy is that I do remember some people calling this when the Horsemen conversation was at its highest point last year. Some said Cody would lead, some said they would like MJF, and some said Hangman would join up with FTR and turn on Kenny. MJF it is. What do you think based on night one?


*I'm going to be completely honest here, I never expected this, and I was pleasantly surprised. Since like November, we all thought it was going to be a generic angle where MJF overthrows Jericho, but they triple swerved us in the span of a minute, and it wasn't ridiculous. It actually makes sense, and I'm relieved that Cody isn't a part of it. MJF is back on track to being the top heel in wrestling.*


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Firefromthegods said:


> @bdon Bet you're relieved. Mjf as leader and not Cody
> 
> Im also thrilled about this because FTR and spears are incapable of goofy comedy


I expect Cody to have a match with Michael Jordan or Tom Brady as a result of him not being in the Horsemen.


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

bdon said:


> As an aside, this actually would actually make Cody’s world title win palpable given MJF is the champion and running the Four Horsemen: a Rhodes going over the Horsemen for his first and only (very short) World Title reign?
> 
> I could get behind that.


Headline: @bdon supports Cody Rhodes as world champ!


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## bizil (Dec 16, 2020)

Personally, I dug the debut of MJF's crew. The hints that MJF was EVENTUALLY gonna be involved with FTR, Tully, and Spears were happening MONTHS AGO in various ways. MJF, Spears, and Tully associating in the crowd. MJF saying he looked up to Tully. MJF quoting the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. And FTR being managed by Tully BY ASSOCIATION only added to the hints. Let alone the Horsemen hand gestures being thrown up.

The group could simply be called The Horsemen since they have five in ring competitors. BUT if they consider Wardlow's key role as a BODYGUARD, they could actually go by The Four Horsemen. However, the group DOESN'T need to be called either name.


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## Rhetro (Feb 14, 2015)

The Wood said:


> Predictable and uninteresting. A mock Four Horsemen isn’t going to help anyone.


I think you need to watch less wrestling and more hbo if you didn’t enjoy that. You can let your hair down and enjoy something once in a while it’s a great way to live life.


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## stevem20 (Jul 24, 2018)

Like it. I liked the whole ending to the show, with his new faction and the Inner Circle. Some of AEW's best work right there.


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## Lorromire (Jun 17, 2014)

3venflow said:


> P.S. I say again, MJF is a pro wrestling treasure!
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1369860239504379904


See THIS stuff is why MJF gets called a good talker, cause he can talk. I just wish he would learn HOW to talk instead of doing troll mannerisms that take away from the actual substance. Hopefully, he becomes less internet troll with the new faction.

I don't mean none/less comedy, comedy is fine when it's actually done well.


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## .christopher. (Jan 14, 2014)

Reminds me of when I played with my WWF action figures as a kid. Factions, factions, factions.


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## Outlaw91 (Mar 31, 2011)

The Wood said:


> Predictable and uninteresting. A mock Four Horsemen isn’t going to help anyone.


You predict a lot of things here but I never heard you predicting this. 
Going for a mock of the Four Horsemen is ridiculous. By this logic every stable that appeared after them is a mock of the Four Horsemen. 



I am glad this happened, especially that Cody is not involved. Good way of turning the Inner Circle face and cimenting MJF as a top cleaver heel.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Outlaw91 said:


> You predict a lot of things here but I never heard you predicting this.
> Going for a mock of the Four Horsemen is ridiculous. By this logic every stable that appeared after them is a mock of the Four Horsemen.
> 
> 
> ...


They literally showed the four fingers at the PPV. They’ve been alluding to this stable for months. I think I even said it would be better than Cody taking over the group back when people were begging for heel Cody because he was burying himself as a face.

Instead they did the Inner Circle crap just to come back to this. It was pointless, and beyond that — rushed and pointless. MJF appeared at one PPV as a member of the Inner Circle. Then it’s over the next week.

The group has a bunch of talented guys in it (and Shawn Spears), but it’s hard to care when the story is so shitty.


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## Outlaw91 (Mar 31, 2011)

The Wood said:


> They literally showed the four fingers at the PPV. They’ve been alluding to this stable for months. I think I even said it would be better than Cody taking over the group back when people were begging for heel Cody because he was burying himself as a face.
> 
> Instead they did the Inner Circle crap just to come back to this. It was pointless, and beyond that — rushed and pointless. MJF appeared at one PPV as a member of the Inner Circle. Then it’s over the next week.
> 
> The group has a bunch of talented guys in it (and Shawn Spears), but it’s hard to care when the story is so shitty.


Then it must be hard for you to force yourself watching so much AEW shit without even carrying. 
I still wait for you to point out where you predicted the Inner Circle turning face and MJF getting his own group to take them down. 
As I know it was some kind of general agreement here that MJF will eventually kick Jericho out and take over the IC. I can see all the threads about AEW being the worst if the IC just turned on Jericho last night. 
As I said before, there is not a single thing they can do so you say something positive about them. Even if they will call it a day and close the promotion, you would still come out with something like they let the fans down or whatever. 
There are a lot of critics here and it is everyone's right to say their opinion but I never heard you say anything positive about them, all they do is bad. Even MoxAsylum, who usually makes threads about how they suck still has some few posts here and there where he praises some things. 
Why do you even still watch if you think they suck so much?


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## Alright_Mate (Jul 21, 2014)

They would have instantly been my favourite stable in AEW if Spears wasn’t involved.


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## thorn123 (Oct 10, 2019)

Awesome... how good is wardlow ...


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## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Wouldn't surprise me if they turn on Spears eventually. 

They need to be seen as ruthless and carrying losers like Spears will not prove to be their downfall. He'll perhaps lose a match or two and MJF will get Wardlow to destroy him.


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## Outlaw91 (Mar 31, 2011)

Alright_Mate said:


> They would have instantly been my favourite stable in AEW if Spears wasn’t involved.


Agreed, but even Spears showed some attitude for once with that curb stomp through the chair on Sammy's head


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## Geert Wilders (Jan 18, 2021)

Erik. said:


> Wouldn't surprise me if they turn on Spears eventually.
> 
> They need to be seen as ruthless and carrying losers like Spears will not prove to be their downfall. He'll perhaps lose a match or two and MJF will get Wardlow to destroy him.


Cody will join the faction and boot Shawn Spears.

This will harken back to MJF and Cody's bitter feud. Cody will see the error of his ways.


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## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

From last year...

Also, from an interview 4 months ago with MJF:

“That’s another thing fans [are] looking in between the lines. They want The Four Horsemen,” MJF noted. “I am not somebody that likes to repeat history. I like to forge my own path.
However, I will say this. I think those guys are immensely talented. I think Shawn Spears is one of the greatest work horses in our business right now, and he’s an unsung hero, soon to not be unsung. I think he’s not going to be a secret much longer especially with all the amazing things he’s doing right now on Dynamite as of late. I think FTR is clearly the best tag team in the world.

“I wish them nothing but the best, but again, I’m not looking to to repeat history. I have zero interest in that. The only thing I’m interested in is becoming the AEW World Champion, leading our generation for the next 25 years on AEW Dynamite and cementing myself as the greatest professional wrestler of all time, but I wish those other guys the best of luck. I think they are so immensely talented.

I don’t respect a lot of people. I respect the three guys you just mentioned.”


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## zkorejo (Jul 2, 2010)

Now that was a swerve I didn't see coming at all. I thought the 4HM thing was Cody's for sure but I'm kind of glad they gave it to MJF. I suspect, they will be the serious Cornette-esque group that hates everything modern wrestling. 

This smells like Stadium Stampede 2. I'm looking forward to this very much.


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## Bland (Feb 16, 2016)

Perfect, I actually love that it isn't a carbon copy of Four Horsemen and Evolution. We have 3 Stars, 1 mid card, 1 future (who also the muscle) & a legend in manager role:

MJF - Perfect leader, lead speaker and future world champion.
FTR - Top class tag team
Spears - Mid card, 'chairman' gimmick is perfect as a hit an and also be the fall guy
Wardlow - future break out star and perfect muscle
Tully - Old hand, perfect as wise legend to hopefully help the younger guys.

Plus, there is no Cody so future feud of vs Nightmare Family is already there and you even have the throwback to Rhodes vs Horsemen-esque, maybe as future world title feud.


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## TD Stinger (May 9, 2012)

I like it overall. MJF is a guy who should be leading his own group and I'm glad that he will now be distanced from the silliness that at time comes from the Inner Circle. It is a swerve in the sense that for weeks (months even) MJF was trying to get all the IC members to turn on Jericho. So his stable here, in kayfabe, feels like something he put together on the fly. But, that is the nature of a swerve I guess.

It will be interesting to see 2 heel factions go at it. I still consider the IC a heel group because, well I mean Jericho just 2 weeks ago was beating up Papa Buck. And no one else from the group felt any remorse about it.

Finally, whether at DON or a special episode of Dynamite, I hope they finally have that Blood & Guts match.


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## famicommander (Jan 17, 2010)

I think Spears, Wardlow, FTR, and Tully are just going to hold MJF back. Spears is hot garbage and I think FTR is vastly overrated. Wardlow never does anything so I don't have much of an opinion on him.

MJF doesn't need these clowns.


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## MyronGainsBrah (Jan 20, 2020)

MJF 5 horsemen V inner circle blood and guts... Wrestle mania weekend I think


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Spears is respected by all the boys. FTR are very high on the guy and very likely pushed for his inclusion. Cody is a big time backer as well. When WWE wrestlers were coming back from injuries they'd near always ask Spears to work with them at the PC to get them ring ready because he's so safe and good. He'll never be the centerpiece or top guy but he's good for this faction standing in the back, adding some size. MJF's relationship with Wardlow has been a business one where he pays him to be his muscle. Wardlow ultimately doesn't fit here - but was included more for his eventual write out and face turn from it. You can bet that is already written, just depends on when they pull the trigger - however many months or year+ down the line. 

I hope Wardlow gets his first name back. One name is too WWE. I'd even take this opportunity to diminish "MJF" and rebrand as Max Friedman a bit. But that might be a change for a little later in his career when he goes solo finally. But I digress...


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Outlaw91 said:


> Then it must be hard for you to force yourself watching so much AEW shit without even carrying.
> I still wait for you to point out where you predicted the Inner Circle turning face and MJF getting his own group to take them down.
> As I know it was some kind of general agreement here that MJF will eventually kick Jericho out and take over the IC. I can see all the threads about AEW being the worst if the IC just turned on Jericho last night.
> As I said before, there is not a single thing they can do so you say something positive about them. Even if they will call it a day and close the promotion, you would still come out with something like they let the fans down or whatever.
> ...


Don’t know where I said it, but I know I’ve said I could see them throwing a swerve and having MJF start his own group to go to war with Jericho.


Outlaw91 said:


> Then it must be hard for you to force yourself watching so much AEW shit without even carrying.
> I still wait for you to point out where you predicted the Inner Circle turning face and MJF getting his own group to take them down.
> As I know it was some kind of general agreement here that MJF will eventually kick Jericho out and take over the IC. I can see all the threads about AEW being the worst if the IC just turned on Jericho last night.
> As I said before, there is not a single thing they can do so you say something positive about them. Even if they will call it a day and close the promotion, you would still come out with something like they let the fans down or whatever.
> ...


It was somewhere in the thread where people were talking about Cody turning heel. Thinking back, maybe all I said was that MJF would be a better choice. But the idea was certainly discussed in there, unless I am crossing threads. Pretty sure I remember people talking about this exact stable including Shawn Spears not really belonging.

I talk wrestling because I love talking wrestling. I love unwinding with a coffee and just shooting the shit as I breath in some nice air. Why are you so obsessed with my reasoning?


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## Jman55 (Nov 21, 2016)

I liked the ending segment a lot and am very intrigued by this new faction (though Spears being in it is a bit off for me I dunno I like him more than most but he's still a lower midcard put people over kinda guy for me a valid role but not a star). Had some very traditional pro wrestling ridiculousness with the long pause before the "holy shit inner circle are still together" and the lights off lights on reveal of the other members. But that little over the top stuff is what drew me to wrestling in the first place plus the actual beatdown was brutal enough to really make that segment pop for me. Hopefully this ends up leading to blood and guts as IC were meant to be in the first one anyway.


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

Kayfabe-wise, this is the strongest faction AEW has put together I think.

Even the weak link of the group, Spears, has a formidable win-loss record despite not being featured for a long time.

The amount of falls the five of them have dropped in the past year can be counted on two hands. Seven by my count.

MJF to Moxley (1)

FTR to Bucks, Dax to Jungle Boy (2)

Wardlow to Cody, Luchasaurus in a tag (2)

Spears to Dustin, Cody (2)

I'd be disappointed if AEW doesn't mention this since they like to go on about wins and losses mattering and keeping a record of everything.


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## Piers (Sep 1, 2015)

Funny that he got three WWE rejects at once, but I like the stable.


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## Outlaw91 (Mar 31, 2011)

The Wood said:


> Don’t know where I said it, but I know I’ve said I could see them throwing a swerve and having MJF start his own group to go to war with Jericho.
> 
> 
> It was somewhere in the thread where people were talking about Cody turning heel. Thinking back, maybe all I said was that MJF would be a better choice. But the idea was certainly discussed in there, unless I am crossing threads. Pretty sure I remember people talking about this exact stable including Shawn Spears not really belonging.
> ...


OK, good to know you predicted because you think you did. You seem to be the only one here, since most posters in this thread said they didn't see it coming.
I'm actually curious why you are so obsessed with AEW, you find them as being the worst in anything they do and in any matter that is related to them, even just a little bit related. You sound like they kicked you out of your home, fired you from your job or did something cruel to you or to someone close to you. Yet, you keep following their product. 
If you say you do this while unwinding with a coffee, I don't even want to imagine what you would do to someone who did something that really affected you personally.


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## Gwi1890 (Nov 7, 2019)

bizil said:


> Personally, I dug the debut of MJF's crew. The hints that MJF was EVENTUALLY gonna be involved with FTR, Tully, and Spears were happening MONTHS AGO in various ways. MJF, Spears, and Tully associating in the crowd. MJF saying he looked up to Tully. MJF quoting the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. And FTR being managed by Tully BY ASSOCIATION only added to the hints. Let alone the Horsemen hand gestures being thrown up.
> 
> The group could simply be called The Horsemen since they have five in ring competitors. BUT if they consider Wardlow's key role as a BODYGUARD, they could actually go by The Four Horsemen. However, the group DOESN'T need to be called either name.


Yeah remember Spears and MJF betting on matches in the crowd? MJF promos in the past have been critical of “flippy” stuff we have 5 traditional style wrestlers in a group, and to be fair the only way you get all the talent on tv in AEW is through factions


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## Gwi1890 (Nov 7, 2019)

They Call Him Y2J said:


> Funny that he got three WWE rejects at once, but I like the stable.


yeah real funny, I thought exactly the same when Stunning Steve, Mark Calloway, The Radicalz and Chris Jericho all WCW rejects joined WWF to


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## Bubbly2 (Jan 15, 2021)

Spears does his best to ruin it tbh.


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## yeahright2 (Feb 11, 2011)

Let´s overlook the months of time wasted with the Inner Circle and MJF
There´s potential in the 4 of them. If we want to go down the 4 Horsemen analogy we have MJF as Flair and Wardlow as Arn. FTR can be Ole and Tully.. They can even keep Tully as manager.
And then there´s the waste of space called Shawn Spears. He doesn´t belong.. Each of the other 4 brings something to the table, but he´s completely expendable.. I don´t even buy the premise of them needing to have a "fall guy". The 4 horsemen didn´t win ALL their matches.


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## Outlaw91 (Mar 31, 2011)

yeahright2 said:


> Let´s overlook the months of time wasted with the Inner Circle and MJF
> There´s potential in the 4 of them. If we want to go down the 4 Horsemen analogy we have MJF as Flair and Wardlow as Arn. FTR can be Ole and Tully.. They can even keep Tully as manager.
> And then there´s the waste of space called Shawn Spears. He doesn´t belong.. Each of the other 4 brings something to the table, but he´s completely expendable.. I don´t even buy the premise of them needing to have a "fall guy". The 4 horsemen didn´t win ALL their matches.


Can't they just be a heel stable with Tully as manager? And probably Spears the fall guy?
Yes, Tully is former Horseman and FTR are marks for old school wrestling, especially Minnesota Wrecking Crew and Arn 'n Tully. But they shouldn't be and I think they won't be just a Four Horsemen rip-off.


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## yeahright2 (Feb 11, 2011)

Outlaw91 said:


> Can't they just be a heel stable with Tully as manager? And probably Spears the fall guy?
> Yes, Tully is former Horseman and FTR are marks for old school wrestling, especially Minnesota Wrecking Crew and Arn 'n Tully. But they shouldn't be and I think they won't be just a Four Horsemen rip-off.


They sure can, but everyone has been waiting for a 4 horsemen type of stable. Those 4 comes closest if they want to do a rehash. Personally I don´t think they need to do it, there has been plenty of both Horsemen and NWO rip-offs in the past. But if they gotta do it, they gotta do it, so get it done and we can all move on 

A stable doesn´t need a fall-guy to constantly take the pins. Even X-Pac in DX had a strong run on his own, and that guy sucks just as bad as spears (123 Kid is another matter, he was a pioneer at his time). If Spears is always the one to take the fall, it´ll make him look bad because he never wins, and the rest of the group looks like fools for allowing such a weak member in their ranks.


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

Dunno why people are acting like Spears is Mongo McMichael. He's an adequate heavyweight wrestler who is seen as a safe pair of hands, and him being in a faction could help hide his solo weaknesses. Thematically, he suits the group since he's been very dark and serious since Tully's pep talk which led to a long winning streak on Dark and Dynamite win over Scorpio Sky.

He's also on a big contract so it'd be wasteful for AEW to just give up on their investment. This is his last chance to make a statement, but at worst he'll be the lowest ranking henchman of the group... think Norton or Adams (nWo), Bossman or Test (Corporation), Neidhart (Hart Foundation), Fale (Bullet Club).

Not every group is the Horsemen. Look at the Dangerous Alliance (one of the most underrated and criminally short-lived stables ever) for example... they had similarities to the Horsemen, including Arn as a member, but were just an asskicking group with Rude, Arn, Eaton, Zbyszko and the up-and-coming Steve Austin.


----------



## $Dolladrew$ (Jun 15, 2020)

Two Sheds said:


> Great except for Spears. I hate 5 on 5 matches but if they do it ONCE as a major match that actually means something then cool. Blood & Guts could work for that but not if we see them 5 on 5 eight times before that. Do it War Games style so they do not all just start in the ring and just create a big mess like the cluster matches always turn out to be. Slow it down and tell a story.
> 
> I would keep Jericho out for a bit and honestly just have this new group beating ass and taking names for a long time to get them over as THE dominant faction. Keep the IC away from them because they are not at full strength. They will not miss you if you never go away. Build that eventual clash up down the road.
> 
> ...


Wardlow already beat hager in a singles match though...


----------



## Prized Fighter (Aug 31, 2016)

I personally love it, even if I think AEW has too many stables, factions, group, etc. I don't understand people disliking the group simply because Spears is in it either. It isn't like he is Luther or Marko Stunt. He is a capable wrestler, who is good on the mic and has a good look.

MJF is much better in this group then the IC. Less goofiness and everyone in the group has a more old school feel, which fits MJF really well. This is also a great move for Wardlow. He was never really a member of the IC and was just kind of there. Last night he looked like a beast and fit in as a member of this new group.


----------



## yeahright2 (Feb 11, 2011)

3venflow said:


> Dunno why people are acting like Spears is Mongo McMichael. He's an adequate heavyweight wrestler who is seen as a safe pair of hands, and him being in a faction could help hide his solo weaknesses. Thematically, he suits the group since he's been very dark and serious since Tully's pep talk which led to a long winning streak on Dark and Dynamite win over Scorpio Sky.
> 
> He's also on a big contract so it'd be wasteful for AEW to just give up on their investment. This is his last chance to make a statement, but at worst he'll be the lowest ranking henchman of the group... think Norton or Adams (nWo), Bossman or Test (Corporation), Neidhart (Hart Foundation), Fale (Bullet Club).
> 
> Not every group is the Horsemen. Look at the Dangerous Alliance (one of the most underrated and criminally short-lived stables ever) for example... they had similarities to the Horsemen, including Arn as a member, but were just an asskicking group with Rude, Arn, Eaton, Zbyszko and the up-and-coming Steve Austin.


.. Safe pair of hands...








If he can´t even figure out how to swing a chair..
I know Cody tried to get him off the hook for the incident, but it wasn´t Cody who held the chair.
And that big contract? He can be future endeavored, WWE does that all the time.


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Is five man faction the new four man faction? Omega, Bucks, Good Brothers also make up a five man. Hardy, Private Party and now Butcher and Blade make up a five man. 

I can't imagine Cody not being involved in the inaugural Blood and Guts match.


----------



## Shock Street (Oct 27, 2020)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Is five man faction the new four man faction? Omega, Bucks, Good Brothers also make up a five man. Hardy, Private Party and now Butcher and Blade make up a five man.
> 
> I can't imagine Cody not being involved in the inaugural Blood and Guts match.


Oh god theyre going to do a fucking five man tournament arent they

"Bullet Club"
MJF group
Inner Circle
Matt Hardy Brand
Eddie, Mox and Death Triangle
Dark Order
Nightmare Family
Maybe Team Taz adds Sky or someone and Hook wrestles

Noooooooo


----------



## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

yeahright2 said:


> If he can´t even figure out how to swing a chair..
> I know Cody tried to get him off the hook for the incident, but it wasn´t Cody who held the chair.


ONE mistake almost two years ago. Watch his matches, he's almost always safe and executes his moves crisply. He does nothing exciting, but also does nothing wrong. If you were going to give Tony Khan a list of workers safe to work with Sting, Spears would be on it despite the chairshot botch in 2019. For as vanilla as he can be, I can't recall Spears blowing any spots since then. He's very fundamentally sound and owns his own wrestling school.



> And that big contract? He can be future endeavored, WWE does that all the time.


Like it or not, it does not seem to be Tony Khan's way to cut wrestlers from their contracts early. He's fired pretty much no one yet, besides Jimmy Havoc. When contracts reach their natural end, you'd think/hope he then lets guys go because even with the content expansion, AEW can't keep adding wrestlers without freeing some.


----------



## LittleMissSisterBliss (Feb 25, 2021)

Classic heel turn at the end 
You think they have taken the element of surprise out of the equation only to be hit with the true surprise moments later.
MJF played his part to perfection and the stable itself looks decent enough to give the inner circle a decent feud that should last over the summer months and come to a end around September/October.
It reminds me when the nwo split into two factions but at least we know that the outcome with this will not be MJF rejoining the inner circle.


----------



## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

Everything about this segment was so well done.


MJF's facial expressions and tonal change at the start.
Dax smashing the bottle over Hager's head.
Spears bringing back the 'Chairman' gimmick and putting Sammy head-first through it.
PnP getting handcuffed and spike piledriven.
MJF sat on the turnbuckle like the king of the world.
Jericho trying to reach the bat, MJF standing on his hand and a bloody Jericho lifting himself before MJF hits him.
Wardlow powerbombing Jericho through the table.
The new group standing in a line over the fallen, bloodied body of Jericho.

On every level, A+ booking and presentation because it put over each member of the new group as a vicious heel and saw each member of the Inner Circle systematically destroyed one by one.

This seems to have been planned out for months, too.

MJF in early November last year: "That’s another thing fans [are] looking in between the lines. They want The Four Horsemen,” MJF noted. “I am not somebody that likes to repeat history. I like to forge my own path. However, I will say this. I think those guys are immensely talented. I think Shawn Spears is one of the greatest work horses in our business right now, and he’s an unsung hero, soon to not be unsung. I think he’s not going to be a secret much longer especially with all the amazing things he’s doing right now on _Dynamite_ as of late. I think FTR is clearly the best tag team in the world."

AEW should also retcon this from March 2020 as part of MJF's masterplan. I know they like their long-term stories, but this was probably a mere coincidence that could now be used as something more.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1369879513086255106
All this. 
Allthis.
Alldis. 
Aldis. 

One can dream.


----------



## Klitschko (May 24, 2020)

Two Sheds said:


> I expect Cody to have a match with Michael Jordan or Tom Brady as a result of him not being in the Horsemen.


Cody vs Donald Trump maybe?


----------



## yeahright2 (Feb 11, 2011)

3venflow said:


> ONE mistake almost two years ago. Watch his matches, he's almost always safe and executes his moves crisply. He does nothing exciting, but also does nothing wrong. If you were going to give Tony Khan a list of workers safe to work with Sting, Spears would be on it despite the chairshot botch in 2019. For as vanilla as he can be, I can't recall Spears blowing any spots since then. He's very fundamentally sound and owns his own wrestling school.
> 
> 
> 
> Like it or not, it does not seem to be Tony Khan's way to cut wrestlers from their contracts early. He's fired pretty much no one yet, besides Jimmy Havoc. When contracts reach their natural end, you'd think/hope he then lets guys go because even with the content expansion, AEW can't keep adding wrestlers without freeing some.


27 matches in 2020. 17 of those on Dark, which tells me he´s not as good as people think.

Tony NOT cutting wrestlers before their contract is up is yet another thing he needs to learn. Their roster is bigger than RAW and Smackdown combined.


----------



## Riddle101 (Aug 15, 2006)

I notice a lot of people shitting on Shawn Spears, however, I think he is a very good hand and you need wrestlers like him at every level of wrestling. He'll probably never be a main eventer, but I'm satisfied with him being in the group and possibly challenging for the TNT Championship. 

In any case, I like the swerve they did with MJF, since most people probably thought MJF was going to turn on Jericho and take over the Inner Circle it was a nice touch to have him turn on the whole group and join the new faction. 

Also, Wardlow looked like a monster last night. I could see him becoming the Batista of AEW.


----------



## Necrolust (Mar 4, 2015)

Wardlow and FTR in the same faction, sign me up! Spears, meh, but maybe being a tag along will do him good. He’s not strong enough on his own. Still looks great and is fine in the ring. MJF will come out looking better than ever.


----------



## $Dolladrew$ (Jun 15, 2020)

yeahright2 said:


> 27 matches in 2020. 17 of those on Dark, which tells me he´s not as good as people think.
> 
> Tony NOT cutting wrestlers before their contract is up is yet another thing he needs to learn. Their roster is bigger than RAW and Smackdown combined.


Did you watch them or are you just looking at statistics?

The beginning was spears searching force tag partner,which turned into him kinda sputtering and losing leading to him being with Tully and getting the black glove.Then spears went on a run of squashes to get him on Dynamite.

Spears under Tully has gotten a mean streak and has always been a solid worker. Aew does have some dead weight to cut but spears is CLEARLY not one of them.


----------



## bizil (Dec 16, 2020)

The Inner Circle is a tremendous start for this new faction. BUT at some point we know Cody and Arn are gonna be involved in the storyline at one point. FOR ME, that's when its gonna get real interesting.


----------



## yeahright2 (Feb 11, 2011)

$Dolladrew$ said:


> Did you watch them or are you just looking at statistics?
> 
> The beginning was spears searching force tag partner,which turned into him kinda sputtering and losing leading to him being with Tully and getting the black glove.Then spears went on a run of squashes to get him on Dynamite.
> 
> Spears under Tully has gotten a mean streak and has always been a solid worker. Aew does have some dead weight to cut but spears is CLEARLY not one of them.


I´m not watching whatever happens on Dark as it should be irrelevant for Dynamite. If something or someone is important enough to be on TV, it should be on the show they´re paid to do by TNT.
I saw his Dynamite matches, and while being a "solid hand" he´s very expendable, and only has a job because Cody. He has been directionless from day one in an attempt to find _something _to justify him being on the roster. (as with a lot of other guys)


----------



## Pentagon Senior (Nov 16, 2019)

Loved the segment and the swerve, big fan of this new faction. I like the 'old school' vibes and hope they play up to that. As someone who's never been into Spears I actually think he fits well with this group, in terms of style, but also you need someone to take the occasional loss/pin and he's ideal for that. Can't wait to see MJF do the talking for this new group!


----------



## TKO Wrestling (Jun 26, 2018)

The most excited I have been in a long, long, long time for pro wrestling. Amazing swerve, no one could have predicted it, and then MJF + Wardlow just looking like absolute studs in the process. The part where MJF stepped on Jerichos hand was epic.


----------



## Strike Force (Sep 14, 2015)

It makes everyone involved more important, which is the entire purpose of factions. 

Getting kicked out of the Inner Circle and striking out on his own would have felt like a step back for MJF. Now, he actually feels bigger than he did a week ago. Wardlow isn't ready to solo yet, so this works for him, and FTR makes sense in this group. Shawn Spears also exists.


----------



## Mindy_Macready (Jun 12, 2014)

MJF with bunch of jobbers like Shawn Spears & Ftr. nobody wants a stupid 4 horseman 2020


----------



## Sbatenney (Jul 3, 2018)

Sorry it has Shawn Spears in it and honestly anyone saying that Shawn is equal to Sammy in MJF's group is kinda fooling themselves. Sammy is the heir to the Inner Circle really, he is the person being molded into a big star via his group, Shawn Spears is at best a mid carder and he isn't really a young up and comer. In an ideal world, I would have replaced Spears with Miro, getting Miro away from the stupid shit he is doing with Kip.


----------



## deadcool (May 4, 2006)

Fantastic segment. Everyone did their jobs very well. MJF is a future mega star.

The stable feels new and not a rehash like how most WWE stables not named New Day are.


----------



## omaroo (Sep 19, 2006)

Awesome debut of this new faction.

MJF leading it is the icing on the cake. Hope both MJF and Wardlow become bigger stars from this.

Only downside is Spears, he is bland and really poor overall but oh well.


----------



## FabioLight (Jan 31, 2011)

It was a nice serve. I just wish that AEW wasn't this full of factions and stables. I love stables but right now there are too many factions/stables going on.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Spears is respected by all the boys. FTR are very high on the guy and very likely pushed for his inclusion. Cody is a big time backer as well. When WWE wrestlers were coming back from injuries they'd near always ask Spears to work with them at the PC to get them ring ready because he's so safe and good. He'll never be the centerpiece or top guy but he's good for this faction standing in the back, adding some size. MJF's relationship with Wardlow has been a business one where he pays him to be his muscle. Wardlow ultimately doesn't fit here - but was included more for his eventual write out and face turn from it. You can bet that is already written, just depends on when they pull the trigger - however many months or year+ down the line.
> 
> I hope Wardlow gets his first name back. One name is too WWE. I'd even take this opportunity to diminish "MJF" and rebrand as Max Friedman a bit. But that might be a change for a little later in his career when he goes solo finally. But I digress...


Being respected by the boys means jack and shit if you can’t put it together in front of the camera. Brad Armstrong was respected by the boys. Mike Bell was respected by the boys. The Rock asked to train with Curtis Axel. Let’s put him in a top faction in AEW too



3venflow said:


> Dunno why people are acting like Spears is Mongo McMichael. He's an adequate heavyweight wrestler who is seen as a safe pair of hands, and him being in a faction could help hide his solo weaknesses. Thematically, he suits the group since he's been very dark and serious since Tully's pep talk which led to a long winning streak on Dark and Dynamite win over Scorpio Sky.
> 
> He's also on a big contract so it'd be wasteful for AEW to just give up on their investment. This is his last chance to make a statement, but at worst he'll be the lowest ranking henchman of the group... think Norton or Adams (nWo), Bossman or Test (Corporation), Neidhart (Hart Foundation), Fale (Bullet Club).
> 
> Not every group is the Horsemen. Look at the Dangerous Alliance (one of the most underrated and criminally short-lived stables ever) for example... they had similarities to the Horsemen, including Arn as a member, but were just an asskicking group with Rude, Arn, Eaton, Zbyszko and the up-and-coming Steve Austin.


Lol, why would you sign Spears to a large contract in the first place? He’s not very good. All those names you listed are HORRIBLE. Those factions would be better off if those guys weren’t there. 



3venflow said:


> Everything about this segment was so well done.
> 
> 
> MJF's facial expressions and tonal change at the start.
> ...


Okay, I gave this a go since it was right in front of me. Holy fuck, that wa me fucking AWFUL! You go a minute without watching much wrestling and you forget how jarring it is.

* MJF’s delivery is good. The (paid?) fangirl reacting like that? Not so good.

* The lights out gimmick FUCKING SUCKS! It makes NO fucking sense! Why is production HELPING Maxwell Jacob Friedman? Why doesn’t Jericho beat up all those fucks next week?

* These guys looked pretty lame in all black. Like, I guess The Shield had turtlenecks when they all debuted. But this wasn’t like “Whoa! Holy shit!” It was like a squinting and a “Who?” They looked small and very non-threatening with this presentation.

* Excalibur is the worst on commentary. Just the worst. “The Chairman Shawn Spears...” shut the fuck up.

* Sammy Guevara’s awful sell job of the chair.

Nope, I’m out. I had to stop watching after this. I even like some of the talent involved, but this was just...sterile and hokey. It was very WWE in this unsettling way. This “I want this to be good, but it’s really, really not...what happened to wrestling?” sort of way.

Was blocked out way too much too. For an angle it wasn’t chaotic enough. You can tell guys have to be in certain places and a layperson can tell it’s rehearsed.

MJF is talented, I love FTR, Sammy has potential...but this fucking sucked.


----------



## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

Just finished the show and this new faction hit me like an RKO out of nowhere.

It’s nice to see some real men on the show that beat people up and leave a trail of bloody carcasses in their wake. No goofiness, just old school tough guys.

The booking isn’t very logical but the segment itself was awesome. I’m not sure why MJF would join inner circle, spend months trying to disband them, then debut his new faction thus giving them a reason to band together again. What if PnP/Hager hadn’t turned, MJF would have a faction of 8 people right now. This wasn’t predictable because it didn’t really make sense, for me it’s more a reset than a swerve.

That being said, the ends justify the means for me and I can’t complain because MJF is now where he should be, the leader/mouthpiece of the best faction on the show with the best hoss and tag team (and Spears). 

I think Spears is a good hand but his booking, whether his fault or somebody else’s, has been terrible. Chairman and slug glove gimmicks, which were both good gimmicks, went nowhere and there’s also the tully pants, the fact he got pinned by a figure 4 by Cody and the terrible Mohawk. If he’s going to keep the mohawk he needs to get somebody to cut it properly or just lose it altogether. He has the size and is a decent worker but it’s hard to care about him after his booking since day 1, they either need to drop him as the weak link or build him up with credible wins.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

It’s not just the what but the how and the why for me. Context is important. Why would MJF join the Inner Circle in the first place? That’s all a mess. This also feels rushed and like it was done for the swerve.

I couldn’t get through the whole thing, but even the thing with Sammy Guevara. Shouldn’t that be a weeks’ long story? Didn’t he just leave The Inner Circle? Why was he even back? Lol. You could have had Jericho’s group get fucking dismantled due to a numbers advantage (explaining why Sammy was taken out by MJF). Then you can have MJF target Sammy, on his own, and do the chair thing there. Then there’s a clear path for Sammy to go after Spears and eventually MJF. It also gets people BEGGING to see Sammy back.

Jericho could have cut a promo where he says that after 30 years in this business he’s finally got to put his ego aside and tell someone something. Then he can apologise to Sammy Guevara and reference the early promo he did with MJF where they kept trying to get the other to express interest in MJF joining the Inner Circle. And Jericho can flat-out tells Sammy he wants him in the Inner Circle.

You want to do Jake Hager getting smashed with a bottle? Have Cash challenge him to a fight on Dynamite. Maybe too gimmicky, but maybe put it in a cage given Hager’s MMA background. You can inject some comedy in here, if you can’t help yourself. Cash can say “Ask Bret Hart how bad my right is. He saw it up close.” Tully can coach Cash on Cage Matches throughout the show. “Remember when I ripped Magnum TA apart at Starrcade?” JR can hype it up as being a probable massacre in favour of the heavyweight from Oklahoma, only for Cash to swig a beer out of nerves before getting in then using that bottle to smash Hager at the onset of the match, maybe even before the bell. Do an angle where Hager blades and both he and Cash are important.

Actually make these guys babyfaces. Actually play off history and have a rhyme and reason behind these things happening. BUILD TO SHIT!

This was like a billion angles all in one night, and none of it, specifically, is going to matter or be made to make sense, because the “swerve” is more important. The swerve is only a swerve because it doesn’t make sense. And when you’re trying to use surprises to get your shit over, it’s too often because you don’t trust it to get over on its own.


----------



## Randy Lahey (Apr 14, 2014)

Don't like it because MJF doesn't need to be leading a faction. He's far more entertaining as a singles guy


----------



## Gwi1890 (Nov 7, 2019)

Sbatenney said:


> Sorry it has Shawn Spears in it and honestly anyone saying that Shawn is equal to Sammy in MJF's group is kinda fooling themselves. Sammy is the heir to the Inner Circle really, he is the person being molded into a big star via his group, Shawn Spears is at best a mid carder and he isn't really a young up and comer. In an ideal world, I would have replaced Spears with Miro, getting Miro away from the stupid shit he is doing with Kip.


Miro doesn’t suit the group he shouldn’t be a henchman to MJF


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Riddle101 said:


> I notice a lot of people shitting on Shawn Spears, however, I think he is a very good hand and you need wrestlers like him at every level of wrestling. He'll probably never be a main eventer, but I'm satisfied with him being in the group and possibly challenging for the TNT Championship.
> 
> In any case, I like the swerve they did with MJF, since most people probably thought MJF was going to turn on Jericho and take over the Inner Circle it was a nice touch to have him turn on the whole group and join the new faction.
> 
> Also, Wardlow looked like a monster last night. I could see him becoming the Batista of AEW.






3venflow said:


> ONE mistake almost two years ago. Watch his matches, he's almost always safe and executes his moves crisply. He does nothing exciting, but also does nothing wrong. If you were going to give Tony Khan a list of workers safe to work with Sting, Spears would be on it despite the chairshot botch in 2019. For as vanilla as he can be, I can't recall Spears blowing any spots since then. He's very fundamentally sound and owns his own wrestling school.
> 
> 
> 
> Like it or not, it does not seem to be Tony Khan's way to cut wrestlers from their contracts early. He's fired pretty much no one yet, besides Jimmy Havoc. When contracts reach their natural end, you'd think/hope he then lets guys go because even with the content expansion, AEW can't keep adding wrestlers without freeing some.






3venflow said:


> Dunno why people are acting like Spears is Mongo McMichael. He's an adequate heavyweight wrestler who is seen as a safe pair of hands, and him being in a faction could help hide his solo weaknesses. Thematically, he suits the group since he's been very dark and serious since Tully's pep talk which led to a long winning streak on Dark and Dynamite win over Scorpio Sky.
> 
> He's also on a big contract so it'd be wasteful for AEW to just give up on their investment. This is his last chance to make a statement, but at worst he'll be the lowest ranking henchman of the group... think Norton or Adams (nWo), Bossman or Test (Corporation), Neidhart (Hart Foundation), Fale (Bullet Club).
> 
> Not every group is the Horsemen. Look at the Dangerous Alliance (one of the most underrated and criminally short-lived stables ever) for example... they had similarities to the Horsemen, including Arn as a member, but were just an asskicking group with Rude, Arn, Eaton, Zbyszko and the up-and-coming Steve Austin.


Spears is trash when the best thing you can say about somebody is they're safe then you're really just saying they're damn near worthless. The dudes just not worthy of being in a featured spot in a major wrestling promotion. There's a reason his compliments are so generic.


----------



## Chris22 (Jan 7, 2010)

The faction has FTR, MJF & Wardlow so I'm instantly interested to see how it all goes. I don't really mind Shawn Spears either.


----------



## thisissting (Aug 14, 2018)

Nicely done by mjf but I can't help thinking God not another faction! I was also getting I to the new horsemen thing and this kind of ruins that. Now we get inner circle as faces I guess which means loads of bad comedy I am afraid. I'd have preferred it if they had just turned the inner circle on jericho and he had gone face.


----------



## NathanMayberry (Oct 11, 2019)

The Wood said:


> Predictable and uninteresting. A mock Four Horsemen isn’t going to help anyone.


Right... shouldnt ftr be focused on the tag titles instead of this nonsense?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

NathanMayberry said:


> Right... shouldnt ftr be focused on the tag titles instead of this nonsense?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Why is this happening now? Shouldn’t they have been brought in by MJF, or joined him very soon thereafter? Why are they being plucked from obscurity for this?


----------



## Brad Boyd (Jan 28, 2020)

Honestly not the biggest fan of Shawn Spears and his blonde hair, but at least this will do something for the guy. I'm pretty stoked to see him paired up with FTR though. I think these guys could use a bit more charisma to give them some relevance. I really enjoyed that segment and I'm looking forward to seeing how their faction plays out. Kinda serious to know how long the stable will last too.


----------



## TD Stinger (May 9, 2012)

I don't really care for Spears at all myself but as like the least important guy in a group like this who will probably be there to eat the pins when necessary, he doesn't bother me in this group.


----------



## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

I just saw this. What is this AEW finally doing something I like? MJF not being involved in goofy comedy shit? The Four Horsemen-like group we wish would happen finally does? Man even Shawn Spears looked good. MJF with his idol Tully Blanchard. Tully with an awesome old school jacket, looking like an old school rotten Evil manager like Paul Jones. Wardlow looking like a freakin monster. All of this dressed in black. And a cool theme song.

"We Don't Wear White Hats, We're Not Nice Guys, Heads are Gonna Roll!"

Bloody Fucking Amazing. 🤩 🤩 🤩


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Name will be key. Needs a company wide all hands on deck approach to getting it right.


----------



## NapperX (Jan 2, 2014)

Why all the hate on Shawn though? I mean just call him Shawn "Da Spare" Spears because he's the spare at this point. Interesting to see where the group heads, and why MJF wants a stable so bad if he trying to convince the world he is so good.

FTR obviously the tag-team, Wardlow, the enforcer, Tully, the old manager role, MJF, the leader, but Shawn is still the spare, a fill-in type roll in case MJF gets injured, but a solid mid-range type of guy in AEW. The future is still MJF, and eventually leaves everyone to the side in the stable. 

Does anyone know what the name of the stable will be?


----------



## bizil (Dec 16, 2020)

Wolf Mark said:


> I just saw this. What is this AEW finally doing something I like? MJF not being involved in goofy comedy shit? The Four Horsemen-like group we wish would happen finally does? Man even Shawn Spears looked good. MJF with his idol Tully Blanchard. Tully with an awesome old school jacket, looking like an old school rotten Evil manager like Paul Jones. Wardlow looking like a freakin monster. All of this dressed in black. And a cool theme song.
> 
> "We Don't Wear White Hats, We're Not Nice Guys, Heads are Gonna Roll!"
> 
> Bloody Fucking Amazing. 🤩 🤩 🤩


DAMN RIGHT! The next BIG THING I'm waiting for is Arn joining the crew at some point!! That makes is complete for me. The interesting thing is HOW he gets there. And how Cody ties into it.


----------



## bizil (Dec 16, 2020)

Randy Lahey said:


> Don't like it because MJF doesn't need to be leading a faction. He's far more entertaining as a singles guy


With that logic, Flair didn't need to be in the Horsemen. Hogan didn' t need to be in the nWo. No HBK in D-X. No Bockwinkel in the Heenan Family. WHEN YOU ARE A HEEL, the more ways to draw heat THE BETTER! Plus factions provide SO MANY storylines that can make sense. And it plays on real life... MANY of us have a crew of friends. Or have played on a team. In wrestling where you have multi man matches, it makes TOTAL SENSE for guys to be in factions. ESPECIALLY a heel like MJF!


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## Prized Fighter (Aug 31, 2016)

I think my favorite part of the segment might have actually been JR putting over Wardlow. 

"Wardlow is the big money in this whole damn operation."

"Someday we are going to be saying Wardlow's name first."


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## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

bizil said:


> DAMN RIGHT! The next BIG THING I'm waiting for is Arn joining the crew at some point!! That makes is complete for me. The interesting thing is HOW he gets there. And how Cody ties into it.


Yea and I would love for it to be played like we talked before in this forum like Cody is closer to joining the group and Arn turns on him saying "you think we would invite a Rhodes in our group?".


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## Randy Lahey (Apr 14, 2014)

bizil said:


> With that logic, Flair didn't need to be in the Horsemen. Hogan didn' t need to be in the nWo. No HBK in D-X. No Bockwinkel in the Heenan Family. WHEN YOU ARE A HEEL, the more ways to draw heat THE BETTER! Plus factions provide SO MANY storylines that can make sense. And it plays on real life... MANY of us have a crew of friends. Or have played on a team. In wrestling where you have multi man matches, it makes TOTAL SENSE for guys to be in factions. ESPECIALLY a heel like MJF!


To each their own, i've always hated factions in wrestling. Never got into Survivor series because of it. I like seeing 1 on 1 competition, 1 guy roasting another on the mic. If wrestling was a movie, then MJF is a leading man. You don't put a leading man in an ensemble piece.


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Wardlow needs to go by Michael Wardlow. Single name is too "WWE". Give him a monicker to go with it. He's been referred to as War Dog/Dog of War or even use JR's "Big Money. He doesn't fit in this faction, but he's likely not too long for it. These guys are old school/traditionalist types, Wardlow is a body guy and more a brute force type than technician. He's there just to eventually break away into a big face push IMO. 

I really hope he drops the F-10.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

bizil said:


> With that logic, Flair didn't need to be in the Horsemen. Hogan didn' t need to be in the nWo. No HBK in D-X. No Bockwinkel in the Heenan Family. WHEN YOU ARE A HEEL, the more ways to draw heat THE BETTER! Plus factions provide SO MANY storylines that can make sense. And it plays on real life... MANY of us have a crew of friends. Or have played on a team. In wrestling where you have multi man matches, it makes TOTAL SENSE for guys to be in factions. ESPECIALLY a heel like MJF!


They’re not all the same thing. I don’t have a problem with this group, on paper, but they’re not building the company around MJF. 



Prized Fighter said:


> I think my favorite part of the segment might have actually been JR putting over Wardlow.
> 
> "Wardlow is the big money in this whole damn operation."
> 
> "Someday we are going to be saying Wardlow's name first."


It was a bit on the nose for me, which makes me think it was a directive and they’re going to rush the split, but it may have just been JR going into business for the guy. He’s definitely a top prospect. I do like it when commentators are clearly behind a guy and pay attention when they are out there.


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## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

Randy Lahey said:


> To each their own, i've always hated factions in wrestling. Never got into Survivor series because of it. I like seeing 1 on 1 competition, 1 guy roasting another on the mic. If wrestling was a movie, then MJF is a leading man. You don't put a leading man in an ensemble piece.


Bro, you and me are the complete opposite. lol But AEW has never done a really good one and they have had too many. But this one might work.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

I’m coming around to Shawn Spears in the group. The promotion is struggling, and the upside to giving the talent you’ve brought in shots to keep getting over is that it might entice other talent to come in, especially if they have been told they have a ceiling. This coupled with smart booking and focusing on ring psychology now that Christian is there could really turn things around for them.


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## $Dolladrew$ (Jun 15, 2020)

The Wood said:


> I’m coming around to Shawn Spears in the group. The promotion is struggling, and the upside to giving the talent you’ve brought in shots to keep getting over is that it might entice other talent to come in, especially if they have been told they have a ceiling. This coupled with smart booking and focusing on ring psychology now that Christian is there could really turn things around for them.


Hey hey we got a Spears fan lol thought I was alone!!

Christian and Paul wight cam definetly help groom the next generation and both signed to AEW partly because they want to share knowledge.Christian will be a great asset backstage and Wight already mentioned wanting to help the big guys like Luchasaurus and wardlow with conveying emotion and the little mannerisms that go a long way in the ring.

Both are great signings for multiple reasons.


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## Klitschko (May 24, 2020)

I like them. I think they have a lot of potential together.


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## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Only reason i'm okay with this group is it highlights MJF more as a central main heel. He's a solid talker and a real heel. Not a tweener. That's the problem with AEW too many tweeners or big shows in the company turning back and forth...for example you have lance archer who was just a face turn heel. what the fuck lol


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Wardlow needs to go by Michael Wardlow. Single name is too "WWE". Give him a monicker to go with it. He's been referred to as War Dog/Dog of War or even use JR's "Big Money. He doesn't fit in this faction, but he's likely not too long for it. These guys are old school/traditionalist types, Wardlow is a body guy and more a brute force type than technician. He's there just to eventually break away into a big face push IMO.
> 
> I really hope he drops the F-10.


‘The Dogs of War‘ would’ve been a pretty decent name for the faction.

A bad-ass rogue stable who doesn’t give a shit about AEW hierarchy and does what it wants, when it wants.

The only things they believe in are titles and the fundamentals of old school wrestling (psychology, selling, kayfabe etc)


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## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

Hitman1987 said:


> ‘The Dogs of War‘ would’ve been a pretty decent name for the faction.
> 
> A bad-ass rogue stable who doesn’t give a shit about AEW hierarchy and does what it wants, when it wants.
> 
> The only things they believe in are titles and the fundamentals of old school wrestling (psychology, selling, kayfabe etc)


Been thinking about this, since Jericho called for a "War Council" to take care of business and everything turned on him, I think MJF could call their group exactly that to mock the Inner Circle. War Council essentialy means a tactical exercise in preparation for war. Since this group are a bunch of thinkers and ass kickers, that would be perfect. But I agree they should do something about Wardlow's name. Maybe modify it in conjonction with the War Council name or at least give him a real name. 

But anyway, I was thinking that if this leads to a Blood & Guts match with the Inner Circle, AEW could do something where there are real casualities during this match. And my pick for it would be Shawn Spears. The guy would get slaughtered. And this could lead to him disappearing for a while and they could replace him with Ethan Page.


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

Wolf Mark said:


> Been thinking about this, since Jericho called for a "War Council" to take care of business and everything turned on him, I think MJF could call their group exactly that to mock the Inner Circle. War Council essentialy means a tactical exercise in preparation for war. Since this group are a bunch of thinkers and ass kickers, that would be perfect. But I agree they should do something about Wardlow's name. Maybe modify it in conjonction with the War Council name or at least give him a real name.
> 
> But anyway, I was thinking that if this leads to a Blood & Guts match with the Inner Circle, AEW could do something where there are real casualities during this match. And my pick for it would be Shawn Spears. The guy would get slaughtered. And this could lead to him disappearing for a while and they could replace him with Ethan Page.


Have you read the spoilers yet? I have so I won’t comment regarding faction name as may give something away. Happy to discuss in spoiler thread though 👍

I hated Wardlow’s name at first but I think changing it now wouldn’t make sense, I think he just needs a nickname similar to “The animal/the beast/the mountain” something that references his size. He is the future of AEW, there’s no doubt about it.

Is Ethan page any good? first time I’ve ever seen him was this week’s dynamite, he seems old school which I like but couldn’t really tell if he has anything else to offer from a character/promo stand point.


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## validreasoning (Jul 4, 2012)

So MJF and Jericho were buddy buddy past few months including singing Broadway musicals. But in the background MJF was secretly plotting to overthrow Jericho and become leader of the inner circle.

Inner circle knew about this and planned to immediately turn on MJF once he revealed this..but MJF knew that inner circle would turn on him and he would unveil his new faction..most of whom aside from Wardlow we have never seen him interacting with on screen in any capacity.

Ok the whole thing I have an issue with. There hasn't even been a tease regarding this new group, even Russo would have given us that. Why, how, where and when. Every single one of those questions need to be addressed.


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

@Wolf Mark Now that I’ve had a beer and I’m thinking more clearly I know exactly what I’d do with Wardlow:

I’d start calling him the executioner (it may have been used before, I’m not sure) and make him start using his top rope knee to the face as his finisher and call it the ‘guillotine‘.

Then after every match one of MJF’s new faction is involved in, the whole stable comes to the ring at the end and Wardlow puts the opponent on the top rope and MJF sits atop the rope in opposite corner (like he did this week) and does the thumb up/thumb down thing that Joaquin Phoenix does in gladiator (See below).

If MJF gives thumb up then wrestler is let go, if MJF gives thumb down then the executioner drops the guillotine and knocks them out. Tully could even do the honours in tag matches by doing the double spike piledriver they used on Santana & ortiz this week.


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## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)




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## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

Hitman1987 said:


> Have you read the spoilers yet? I have so I won’t comment regarding faction name as may give something away. Happy to discuss in spoiler thread though 👍
> 
> I hated Wardlow’s name at first but I think changing it now wouldn’t make sense, I think he just needs a nickname similar to “The animal/the beast/the mountain” something that references his size. He is the future of AEW, there’s no doubt about it.
> 
> Is Ethan page any good? first time I’ve ever seen him was this week’s dynamite, he seems old school which I like but couldn’t really tell if he has anything else to offer from a character/promo stand point.


Yea Ethan is a pretty good talker. Maybe Wardlow could use his real name but his surname would be War-loaded.


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

validreasoning said:


> Ok the whole thing I have an issue with. There hasn't even been a tease regarding this new group, even Russo would have given us that.


There have been possible clues here and there. Or at least things that could be interpreted as them now.

The earliest, which is probably more by coincidence than design, is him speaking with Tully and Shawn Spears at ringside in March 2020 at one of the first crowdless shows. Wardlow was also in the background. Even if this wasn't related (and it probably wasn't unless they had all this on a storyboard well in advance) it's something they should retcon as part of MJF's grand plan.










After losing to Moxley at All Out last year, MJF said on Dynamite that maybe it was time he 'joined a wolfpack' after referencing all the factions in AEW. He could have been referring to the Inner Circle there, but again maybe he had a grand plan to start his own as it was always clear he'd never want to be the #2 guy in a group.






MJF said this in November 2020, but it wasn't on TV.

"That’s another thing fans [are] looking in between the lines. They want The Four Horsemen. I am not somebody that likes to repeat history. I like to forge my own path. However, I will say this. I think those guys are immensely talented. I think *Shawn Spears* is one of the greatest work horses in our business right now, and he’s an unsung hero, *soon to not be unsung*. I think he’s not going to be a secret much longer especially with all the amazing things he’s doing right now on _Dynamite_ as of late. I think *FTR* is clearly the best tag team in the world."

Then there was Spears cutting a disgruntled promo with Tony Schiavone and mysteriously disappearing from TV.

The main questions that need to be answered are what went on in between then and him forming his new faction. It seemed like he was genuinely trying to take over the Inner Circle - did he want to lead it or ruin it? Did he do 'Le Dinner Debonair' to suck up to Jericho considering this new group looks like it'll have no time for fun and games?

And did PnP and Hager know that Sammy planted that camera last week? (answer is probably yes considering they all turned around to face MJF)


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## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

I dont know why Spears gets so much hate. Hes no top guy main eventer or anything, but hes a solid worker and promo and at least looks like a grown athlete. Hes fine with me.


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## Arm Drag! (Jul 21, 2020)

1. You have to call them *The Apocalypse*. They have been *'brought into' AEW by Tully/Arn/JJ (i.e. The Horsemen *OF THE APOCALYPSE). So have them be a development of the horsemen instead of just another knock-off. *The HM bring the apocalypse*. Its also a great name for a heel group and a bunch of destroyers.

2. *MJF is so Ric Flair.* You couldn't get closer if you tried. I was saying like a week ago he reminds me of Flair the most, with his use of cheating, the arrogance and the happy-to-beg type of style.
FTR are a great choice for the tag teams and should really change thier name now.* 'Fear The Revelation' works GREAT as the HorseMen actually come from 'THE BOOK OF REVELATION'.*
3. Spears is a fine choice. He's olid enough to look strong when needed and take pins when needed. He's a bit like the AEW Cesaro if used right. The Chairman gimmick will allow him to interfere in matches too.
*
3. DO NOT PUT WARDLOW IN THE APOCALYPSE. Sell his connection as an 'Insurance Policy'. He still 'works for MJF' and not AEW so it will work. Also lets you keep The Apocalypse together after Wardlow turns.*


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## Arm Drag! (Jul 21, 2020)

Call them ANYTHING ELSE and Im starting a riot.


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