# Tanahashi Says He Will Ask for an AEW Title Shot if He Beats Jericho at Wrestle Kingdom



## 5 Star Giulia ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ (Apr 21, 2014)

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1209164287769563137
*This is actually huge, and the kind of positive publicity AEW needs after everything going wrong lately.*


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Okada wants it, the Ace wants it

It'll happen in 2020

NJPW v AEW will be a game changer for both promotions

something tells me they're both waiting for Harold to fuck-off


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## 5 Star Giulia ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ (Apr 21, 2014)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> Okada wants it, the Ace wants it
> 
> It'll happen in 2020
> 
> ...


*Indeed, and it's absolutely necessary because many people are tired of The Elite getting punked by no names. Cross promotion with New Japan would do wonders to curb the feeling of no star power in AEW.*


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Would AEW let Jericho get pinned clean by Tana at WK without such a return match in an AEW ring? Without this talk their match was a foregone conclusion to be a schmozz finish without a pin either way - so this talk at least sells the idea there could be a finish. I don't think anything comes of it though and there will be a DQ finish as AEW can't let their champ get pinned even in a non-title bout and can't trust NJPW to then allow Jericho to get the win back on AEW television before February 29th when Mox should be taking the title.


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## Taroostyles (Apr 1, 2007)

The door is being cracked, let's hope its blown open at WK.


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## MarkOfAllMarks (Apr 7, 2018)

MAKE THIS HAPPEN. Tanahashi is the man. Tanahashi as AEW champion would be a great thing.


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## Psychosocial (Jul 13, 2018)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> Okada wants it, the Ace wants it
> 
> It'll happen in 2020
> 
> ...


AEW only needs a handful more names before business can really pick up, they don't need a whole roster added to the equation which would take time away from a lot of their guys.

Not to mention I don't think Harold/Gedo would be too thrilled with having to put over or sell for Dark Order, Stunt, Kiss, Cassidy, etc.


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## DoctorWhosawhatsit (Aug 23, 2016)

Cross promoting is in both companies best interests.

My chief concern with AEW's founding was the splitting up of the top international talent.


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## Mutant God (Sep 9, 2015)

Soon it'll be AEW vs NJWO lol


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Psychosocial said:


> AEW only needs a handful more names before business can really pick up, they don't need a whole roster added to the equation which would take time away from a lot of their guys.
> 
> Not to mention I don't think Harold/Gedo would be too thrilled with having to put over or sell for Dark Order, Stunt, Kiss, Cassidy, etc.


Harold’s out the door brother

When I say invasion - i mean 3 - 6 stars sporadic

Culminating in Kenny v Ibushi

Title vs title in a stadium ?‍♂

The stories with Lij, G.O.D, Okada, Ishii and Ibushi alone - over the course of 2 years will be wrestling world shaking


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

I’m very skeptical. I can see Tanahashi vs. Jericho, but I don’t see the cross-promotion.


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## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

I wouldn't mind as long as NJPW keeps their identity and doesn't merge with them. I don't even really want them to have a partnership anymore. What I DO want is for them to have a loose working affiliation where they occasionally interact and have some cross promotional matches but they both keep their separate identities the same. I don't want AEW's weird/dorky whatever you want to call it "culture" to bleed into NJPW, which is why I don't want them to be too familiar with each other.


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## IronMan8 (Dec 25, 2015)

So they’ll trade wins in their respective promotions and the NJPW guys will be the Dolph Zigglers of AEW, and the AEW guys will be the Dolph Zigglers of NJPW.

Cross promotion is predictable.

I guess it performs the same function WWE gets from using past legends for that woahhh imagine this moment. 

The only difference is AEW needs to job their guys out in Japan, whereas a past legend doesn’t need the 50/50 deal to make it work.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> Harold’s out the door brother
> 
> When I say invasion - i mean 3 - 6 stars sporadic
> 
> ...


If they do enough in the way of story-telling to explain the Kenny-Ibushi history to an American audience, then you could potentially have the greatest match on American soil in history.

Do it well enough, and you can replicate the Okada-Omega image of grown men crying in the stands.


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## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

BigCy said:


> I wouldn't mind as long as NJPW keeps their identity and doesn't merge with them. I don't even really want them to have a partnership anymore. What I DO want is for them to have a loose working affiliation where they occasionally interact and have some cross promotional matches but they both keep their separate identities the same. * I don't want AEW's weird/dorky whatever you want to call it "culture" to bleed into NJPW,* which is why I don't want them to be too familiar with each other.


Yeah it's not like NJPW doesn't already have that.........


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

If AEW and New Japan were working together, why wouldn’t this just be a title match? Also, Moxley will either have to lose before Revolution or go into the PPV as US Champion. At some point, one of the AEW guys going into their next PPV main event either having jobbed or jobbing before they lose in Japan. Something isn’t right here.

I think this might just be New Japan going into business for themselves and setting up the idea of Tanahashi challenging to make AEW look like the heels when it doesn’t happen.


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## Lorromire (Jun 17, 2014)

Now I hope Jericho loses at WK (he 99% likely is anyway) just so we can get Jericho vs. Tanahashi on AEW television. I'm fucking pumped.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Lorromire said:


> Now I hope Jericho loses at WK (he 99% likely is anyway) just so we can get Jericho vs. Tanahashi on AEW television. I'm fucking pumped.


Prediction: Tanahashi wins, but there is no AEW follow-up and wrestlers and fans actually respond rather poorly to it, leading to more Twitter nonsense from the AEW—some of it sideways snark at Jericho, who they have probably known for months is losing and done nothing to prepare for.


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## ReekOfAwesomenesss (Apr 6, 2012)

I don't want to see them as partners. Okada and Tana can work with them if they want and actually can. I wont really care since Naito will rule the land with iron fist.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

It’d be such an odd fit. I can imagine them wanting the TNT exposure. But does it help their perception? They can keep their talent separate from, say, Joey Janela, but it’s such a weird clash.


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## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

rbl85 said:


> Yeah it's not like NJPW doesn't already have that.........


Mind being more specific? AEW can be hard to get through while NJPW flows really well and I can watch all of it without rolling my eyes.


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## FaceTime Heel (Sep 1, 2016)

The Wood said:


> Prediction: Tanahashi wins, but there is no AEW follow-up and wrestlers and fans actually respond rather poorly to it, leading to more Twitter nonsense from the AEW—some of it sideways snark at Jericho, who they have probably known for months is losing and done nothing to prepare for.


Remaining true to form I see


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## FaceTime Heel (Sep 1, 2016)

I'd like to see this but I don't want it to be to the detriment of either promotion. AEW should focus on carving out their niche/identity for a few more months IMO. They still has some technical issues that they have to iron out production-wise at the bare minimum before I'd hop on board if I was NJPW. On the flipside, that exposure can only help NJPW's US expansion. 

I think we might be jumping the gun on this one but I would still love tho see this happen when the time is right.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

I don't think the cross promotion helps the numbers much. But I do think if it happens then fans are in for a treat story and match wise. I definitely want Suzuki vs Pentagon if this partnership pops off. Not to mention AEW would have the chance to show the American fans what Kenny is all about if the put him against Okada or Ibushi. This is one of those moments that might not have instant results, but is totally worth doing.


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## Ham and Egger (Dec 13, 2005)

Having New Japan guys show up on their programming will be a shot in the arm and seeing cross promotion on a large platform will do will for both companies.


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## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

Tanahashi is going over, and NJPW isn't partnering with AEW. Thats about it.


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

BOSS of Bel-Air said:


> *Indeed, and it's absolutely necessary because many people are tired of The Elite getting punked by no names. Cross promotion with New Japan would do wonders to curb the feeling of no star power in AEW.*


The problem is "The Elite" ARE no names to a US audience and other than Cody have been booked to demonstrate that. Every time the announcers say something ridiculous like "The Young Bucks are the best tag team in the world" the bell rings and those watching TNT see a bunch of choreographed BS. You have to build someone up to be believable. Maybe Kenny Omega had some of the best matches in Japan, but almost no one watching Dynamite has seen them. He has not been presented to the audience they want to create and keep in the US as a top star. The Elite lived in their own little bubble for years and believed their own hype from Melzer and company but their bubble is being popped. Japan is not the US, and I like Japan. The same would happen if several people from the US decided to make a new Japanese wrestling promotion. How do you think THAT would go over there?


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## Hangman (Feb 3, 2017)

The sooner Mox gets the belt the better.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

FaceTime Heel said:


> Remaining true to form I see


Well, if they end up partnering up then they end up partnering up and you can say I was wrong. But if I end up right, then yes, it is true to form. 



RainmakerV2 said:


> Tanahashi is going over, and NJPW isn't partnering with AEW. Thats about it.


I'm not the only one who thinks this, it seems. The Orton tweets are going to be amazing.


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## Ratedr4life (Dec 18, 2008)

Okada to hold the IWGP & AEW World Heavyweight Titles in 2020


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Here is a question to everyone who is in favour of putting the belt on an Okada or a Tanahashi...

If AEW already struggles for TV ratings because Jericho and Moxley are the only known national stars why would they put the belts on talented but generally unknown competitors from Japan? It certainly seems like an AEW thing to do. "This man is our champion because he wrestle good!" but there would be no return on it expect building a fan base in Japan which AEW probably already has due to Omega.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Here is a question to everyone who is in favour of putting the belt on an Okada or a Tanahashi...
> 
> If AEW already struggles for TV ratings because Jericho and Moxley are the only known national stars why would they put the belts on talented but generally unknown competitors from Japan? It certainly seems like an AEW thing to do. "This man is our champion because he wrestle good!" but there would be no return on it expect building a fan base in Japan which AEW probably already has due to Omega.


Not an incoherent point, but both Tanahashi and Okada have charisma and are wonderful workers. They would be new to people, but a wonderful and fresh experience.

I’m not in favor if it from a pro-NJPW side. But I can see points for this idea in terms of just how good Tanahashi and Okada are.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

The Wood said:


> Not an incoherent point, but both Tanahashi and Okada have charisma and are wonderful workers. They would be new to people, but a wonderful and fresh experience.
> 
> I’m not in favor if it from a pro-NJPW side. But I can see points for this idea in terms of just how good Tanahashi and Okada are.


They are both good but to the casual fan or even a WWE fan they don't care if Okada is coming to work the main event of AEW and is defending against Omega. AEW needs to try and hook the casual wrestling fan or the wrestling fans of old that haven't watched in 15 years. Jericho is a good face for the brand because he can bring those people back but I'd say under 1 million people in the United States know who Okada and Tanahashi are and the majority would already be watching AEW.

They need to keep it on Jericho or Moxley. Keep the belt on recognisable faces that might attract a casual wrestling fan or an old wrestling fan that no longer watches. An expensive Okada is not the answer.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Chip Chipperson said:


> They are both good but to the casual fan or even a WWE fan they don't care if Okada is coming to work the main event of AEW and is defending against Omega. AEW needs to try and hook the casual wrestling fan or the wrestling fans of old that haven't watched in 15 years. Jericho is a good face for the brand because he can bring those people back but I'd say under 1 million people in the United States know who Okada and Tanahashi are and the majority would already be watching AEW.
> 
> They need to keep it on Jericho or Moxley. Keep the belt on recognisable faces that might attract a casual wrestling fan or an old wrestling fan that no longer watches. An expensive Okada is not the answer.


I completely agree with the details of what you’re saying. I probably wouldn’t put the AEW World Title on them and pretend they are already huge stars (like they do with Omega), BUT...

The presence of these guys is pretty visceral. You do a big entrance for Okada with that coin dropping, and explain what a big star he is—maybe even try to rope in Pharrel Williams to be a part of his entourage and whatever, he is going to _feel_ like a star, even if people don’t _know_ him, per se.

If they ran Okada vs. Omega, I’d be more inclined to do it over the IWGP Title though. Not the AEW one. Set it up as a separate promotion with their own intentions and that also provides a casual hook for fans who will understand that they don’t know them just because they don’t yet know this promotion.

But you are right: just acting like they are already gods would be a mistake and would alienate fans who don’t feel included.


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Ratedr4life said:


> Okada to hold the IWGP & AEW World Heavyweight Titles in 2020


Who?
- "Everyone in the US."

That is a big problem.


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## Ratedr4life (Dec 18, 2008)

Lheurch said:


> Who?
> - "Everyone in the US."
> 
> That is a big problem.


Okada headlined a sold out show in MSG earlier this year. Among wrestling fans Okada is pretty well known.


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Ratedr4life said:


> Okada headlined a sold out show in MSG earlier this year. Among wrestling fans Okada is pretty well known.


My point exactly. He is known by hardcore fans, not your average US fan and certainly not by the fanbase AEW needs to build for TNT.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Lheurch said:


> My point exactly. He is known by hardcore fans, not your average US fan and certainly not by the fanbase AEW needs to build for TNT.


I agree. He COULD be, but you can’t throw him into a match and expect massive numbers. I said the same thing about Kenny Omega.

If you don’t book them credibly and give them a way to connect with audiences who DON’T know them, then they will not get over.


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## V-Trigger (Jul 6, 2016)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Tanahashi is going over, and NJPW isn't partnering with AEW. Thats about it.


LOL if you think that Gedo, longtime friend of Jericho is gonna make him lose at the Dome being the top champion of another promotion against a Tanahashi that's on the New Japan Dad role nowadays.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

If Jericho loses, they have plans to work together. Jericho would never agree to it.


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

bdon said:


> I agree. He COULD be, but you can’t throw him into a match and expect massive numbers. I said the same thing about Kenny Omega.
> 
> If you don’t book them credibly and give them a way to connect with audiences who DON’T know them, then they will not get over.


Yes, exactly. The vast majority of people watching TNT have no idea who Kenny Omega is, and they have booked him as a 50/50 WWE guy.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Lheurch said:


> Yes, exactly. The vast majority of people watching TNT have no idea who Kenny Omega is, and they have booked him as a 50/50 WWE guy.


If you’re turning on Dynamite, having never watched any of these guys, then can anyone tell me what would lead anyone to believe that Omega is any bigger of a deal than Trent Baretta? Scorpio Sky has been painted as more of a star on weekly television than Omega.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

bdon said:


> If you’re turning on Dynamite, having never watched any of these guys, then can anyone tell me what would lead anyone to believe that Omega is any bigger of a deal than Trent Baretta? Scorpio Sky has been painted as more of a star on weekly television than Omega.


Exactly. Hence why AEW is struggling. Everyone but Jericho and to a lesser extent Cody and Moxley aren't really big stars and are quickly becoming "just another guy" on the AEW roster.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Everyone should have credibility. I get that, but there are ways to book sensibly without making guys seem like jobbers or making matches last 15-20 minutes against your top dogs.

They have done a TON of things right, but they’ve done a piss poor job of making Omega the superstar he should be, along with mishandling the Lucha Bros, Hangman Page to a lesser extent, and PnP.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Okada looks and carries himself like a star - he’ll be over in no time with people who don;t know him


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

Why does NJPW hate Omega & Bucks


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Gh0stFace said:


> Why does NJPW hate Omega & Bucks


They left them high and dry after NJPW had given them significant pushes.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Gh0stFace said:


> Why does NJPW hate Omega & Bucks


I'd assume it's because they were big names for NJPW and NJPW expected to be able to use them as they went into North America.


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## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

bdon said:


> They left them high and dry after NJPW had given them significant pushes.


When you're a wrestling company and you really want to keep certain wrestlers then you don't wait until the very last moment to renew their contracts.

NJPW acted like Omega and The Bucks were their pets.


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

Oh well, hope they still find a way to work together. Would love to see Will Osprey in AEW


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## Tony1973 (Dec 24, 2019)

Psychosocial said:


> AEW only needs a handful more names before business can really pick up, they don't need a whole roster added to the equation which would take time away from a lot of their guys.
> 
> Not to mention I don't think Harold/Gedo would be too thrilled with having to put over or sell for Dark Order, Stunt, Kiss, Cassidy, etc.


Ridiculous

Aew brass isnt dumb enough to even ask new japan to do that


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## MarkOfAllMarks (Apr 7, 2018)

On contrary NJPW loved Kenny Omega... it just hurt them that he left I would assume. How can you say they didn't love him. He was the first non Japanese wrestler to win the G1. He main evented 2 WKs. He was the one to defeat the unstoppable Okada and win the Heavyweight Title. Okada was invincible during his time as the world champ.

I don't think they liked the Young Bucks that much... but Kenny Omega I can assure they loved him in New Japan. They desperately wanted him to stay.

The thing is Kenny Omega was way more interesting in Japan. He is an executive and has more creative control in AEW but he seems to not be interested in pushing himself. He looks a little complacent. Which is great and all but he needs to be a top guy... he's easily one of their top talents if not the best. I like him a lot more then Moxley. And I really like Moxley.


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## Lethal Evans (Dec 18, 2013)

If Mox wins v Jericho at Revolution we will see Omega hit that level we all expect of him and he'll take the belt from Mox and become AEWs ace.
Women's division will be established by then and we'll be seeing a complete roster for AEW.

It's their first year, heck their first 6 months and they're doing very well. With Revolution, we know have an idea of their PPV schedule (they said they only wanted 4) Double or Nothing, All Out, Full Gear, Revolution. (Names to change probably) with All In being their 'Mania event where they can book other independent stars to show up. 

Let's not forget we have The Match Beyond coming. Once Jericho loses the belt and other storylines finish we will see The Elite (including Marty) v The Inner Circle allowing world & tag title programmes their own space.


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## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

bdon said:


> They left them high and dry after NJPW had given them significant pushes.





rbl85 said:


> When you're a wrestling company and you really want to keep certain wrestlers then you don't wait until the very last moment to renew their contracts.
> 
> NJPW acted like Omega and The Bucks were their pets.


There's quite a bit to the story and 2 sides to it. 

I think they both kind of did each other dirty. Omega claims that NJPW was kind of smug about him, almost like they just assumed he was going to keep resigning and he felt they low balled him and didn't appreciate him enough for his drawing new US fans. He was also salty they didn't air his video game shit at WK for more than a few seconds.

On the flip side NJPW pretty much made Kenny and strapped the rocket to him and they in turn felt he betrayed them by ducking out on them, especially before the MSG show. That kind of thing is a no-no in Japanese culture. 

Bucks tried to get dual contracts with NJPW AND Roh and tried to get greedy, they felt they were worth a lot more than they were. They were never all that over in Japan.

Bottom line...I think The Elite overestimated their drawing power and tried to make a squeeze play on NJPW and NJPW just didn't think they were a viable enough to throw the wallet at and got blinded slightly when AEW was announced. 

Most wrestling fans want them to "kiss and make up" mostly for AEW's sake so they can actually get some more good wrestlers on their show, not to mention an "invasion" angle if done right, could probably get a lot of eyeballs on the product. I was all for this at the beginning but now I just want them to barely be affiliated with one another unless AEW wants to develop the NJPW style and leave the hijinks and stupid crap out of it. 

Harold Meij is leaving NJPW. No one really has said why but I'm assuming since NJPW; America is starting they feel they no longer need him and the fact that AEW started up they may be trying more of a slow burn and Harold Meij wouldn't work in the long


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

bdon said:


> If Jericho loses, they have plans to work together. Jericho would never agree to it.


Unless Jericho doesn’t give a shit because he is riding the Tony Khan vanity project while it lasts. Or if he wants to do his friend a solid. Or he promised to job to Tanahashi when he first entered the promotion.

Those who don’t think Jericho is losing: Mox will also have to lose or else go into a main event with one of New Japan’s belts. New Japan don’t give a _fuck_ about All Elite right now.



Gh0stFace said:


> Why does NJPW hate Omega & Bucks


They used Wrestle Kingdom as a platform to launch their rival promotion and strung along New Japan in negotiations. They’ve also spoken out publicly about the company. New Japan is doing better since they left. 



rbl85 said:


> When you're a wrestling company and you really want to keep certain wrestlers then you don't wait until the very last moment to renew their contracts.
> 
> NJPW acted like Omega and The Bucks were their pets.


That’s not how things work in Japan.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> Okada looks and carries himself like a star - he’ll be over in no time with people who don;t know him


Read the same thing when people expressed concern that Omega might not be the star in AEW that he was in NJPW.


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## I'mTheGreatest (Aug 3, 2019)

Besides hardcore fans nobody gives a shit about Tanahashi


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## TripleG (Dec 8, 2004)

(Reads topic title)


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## eriknesss (Jan 29, 2014)

Chris Jericho on Instagram: "Getting ready to fly to #Tokyo on my private jet and I read your comments in #TokyoSports! And I agree...if you can beat me in the #TokyoDome on Jan 5, I will give you a shot at the @allelitewrestling World Championship! #forbiddendoor #Bakahashi @flyexclusive"


Chris Jericho shared a post on Instagram: "Getting ready to fly to #Tokyo on my private jet and I read your comments in #TokyoSports! And I agree...if you can beat me in the #TokyoDome on Jan 5, I will give you a shot at the @allelitewrestling World Championship! #forbiddendoor #Bakahashi...




www.instagram.com


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## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

well I guess I have to watch wrestle kingdom now that it's part of AEW canon.


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## CenaBoy4Life (Jul 31, 2013)

Tanahashi just looks and carries himself like a mega star. Same with Okada. Both would instantly elevate AEW.

Issue is though how often can they show up. You dont want another Riho situation.


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

CenaBoy4Life said:


> Tanahashi just looks and carries himself like a mega star. Same with Okada. Both would instantly elevate AEW.
> 
> Issue is though how often can they show up. You dont want another Riho situation.


They have not even built Omega up to be a star on AEW TV. I have been on the LA to Tokyo flight many times and it is brutal even in First Class. I cannot imagine having to do it even once a month let alone more often. Most of their current and potential audience does not know who these guys are and they have not shown they are able to build them up to be such. If they really think this is the answer instead of building up their own guys who are there every week like Moxley and Hangman, they really are out of touch.


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## Reggie Dunlop (Nov 2, 2015)

Lheurch said:


> They have not even built Omega up to be a star on AEW TV. I have been on the LA to Tokyo flight many times and it is brutal even in First Class. I cannot imagine having to do it even once a month let alone more often. Most of their current and potential audience does not know who these guys are and they have not shown they are able to build them up to be such. *If they really think this is the answer instead of building up their own guys who are there every week like Moxley and Hangman, they really are out of touch.*


Who says it has to be one or the other. Why can’t they do both? 

They’re trying to do something positive, and you still have to piss on it. One again, making shit up to whine about. 

Now don’t forget to call me a AEW stan or whatever the fuck who can’t handle a little criticism while reminding us all how much you want AEW to succeed.


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Reggie Dunlop said:


> Who says it has to be one or the other. Why can’t they do both?
> 
> They’re trying to do something positive, and you still have to piss on it. One again, making shit up to whine about.
> 
> Now don’t forget to call me a AEW stan or whatever the fuck who can’t handle a little criticism while reminding us all how much you want AEW to succeed.


They could do both, but there is no evidence that they will based on what they have done so far.

When a company you want to succeed does something dumb, you call them out on it so they improve. That is how criticism works. Bringing in a Japanese star most of their audience does not know at most once a month does not help. Look at where their women's division is. We have not seen Riho defend the title in months and they changed their title match at the last minute so the challenger could go wrestle in front of 18 people for a guy whose gimmick is literally sexual assault. Good job.


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## RKing85 (Mar 22, 2010)

at first glance I thought the headline I saw said the title was on the line on Jan 5 which I would have hated. Him just putting a title shot on the line I am fine with.


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## Reggie Dunlop (Nov 2, 2015)

Lheurch said:


> They could do both, but there is no evidence that they will based on what they have done so far.
> 
> When a company you want to succeed does something dumb, you call them out on it so they improve. That is how criticism works. Bringing in a Japanese star most of their audience does not know at most once a month does not help. Look at where their women's division is. We have not seen Riho defend the title in months and they changed their title match at the last minute so the challenger could go wrestle in front of 18 people for a guy whose gimmick is literally sexual assault. Good job.


There’s no evidence that they won’t do both, either. They haven’t done anything dumb here, it’s only you saying it’s dumb, which, in case you weren’t aware, doesn’t automatically make it dumb. Matter of fact, I’ve come to realize that if you think it’s dumb, it’s probably actually brilliant. If they do something dumb, I’ll be right there calling it out — but just once, because I hate repeating myself. You just like to bitch and moan. It’s really fucking tiresome. Might be time to update The List.


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Reggie Dunlop said:


> There’s no evidence that they won’t do both, either. They haven’t done anything dumb here, it’s only you saying it’s dumb, which, in case you weren’t aware, doesn’t automatically make it dumb. Matter of fact, I’ve come to realize that if you think it’s dumb, it’s probably actually brilliant. If they do something dumb, I’ll be right there calling it out — but just once, because I hate repeating myself. You just like to bitch and moan. It’s really fucking tiresome. Might be time to update The List.


There is plenty of evidence. Look at how Omega has been booked so far. I call things dumb just as you claim to do. We can have differing opinions. And AEW clearly does plenty of dumb things and a lot of people call them out on it. No company is perfect, and I have said several times in defending AEW that every episode of RAW or Nitro back when it was great had at least one dumb segment on the show. It did not make the product bad overall. AEW is in the same boat. Is this really that hard to understand?


----------



## Darkest Lariat (Jun 12, 2013)

I'mTheGreatest said:


> Besides hardcore fans nobody gives a shit about Tanahashi


Tanahashi will be the most respected wrestler on Earth once Liger retires. This take couldn't be any more bs. Everyone understands the importance of his contributions to wrestling. New Japan would be gone if not for Tanahashi. No New Japan, no 5* Kenny, no AEW.


----------



## I'mTheGreatest (Aug 3, 2019)

[


Reggie Dunlop said:


> There’s no evidence that they won’t do both, either. They haven’t done anything dumb here, it’s only you saying it’s dumb, which, in case you weren’t aware, doesn’t automatically make it dumb. Matter of fact, I’ve come to realize that if you think it’s dumb, it’s probably actually brilliant. If they do something dumb, I’ll be right there calling it out — but just once, because I hate repeating myself. You just like to bitch and moan. It’s really fucking tiresome. Might be time to update The List.


Fuck your list, Reggie! nobody cares the ones added to your list are the real ones anyways.. Enjoy your circle jerk!

Nothing more annoying than a bunch a beta males threatening to ignore random forums users like they are supposed give two shits.


----------



## kingfrass44 (Sep 19, 2019)

I'mTheGreatest said:


> [
> 
> 
> Fuck your list, Reggie! nobody cares the ones added to your list are the real ones anyways.. Enjoy your circle jerk!
> ...


Tony is not stupid
Will hand over the title to Jon Moxley


----------



## MarkOfAllMarks (Apr 7, 2018)

Tanahashi and Okada would do wonders for AEW. They are established megastars. Maybe not in the United States but they are Global International stars. Most hardcore fans know who they are and most of AEW crowds are hardcore fans. They would get huge massive reactions. And a complaint for some fans is that most of the guys on the AEW roster are cruiserwieghts/ very small. I don't personally care about size but a lot of people do. Tanahashi and Okada are big heavyweight guys who are amazing wrestlers and have a ton of personality and charisma. 

Tanahashi as AEW champion to me would be an amazing thing. Tanahashi is an established legend and veteran much like Chris Jericho is. It gives prestige and value to the title immediately. If I were AEW I would want my title on Tanahashi it makes the title more important.


----------



## 5 Star Giulia ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ (Apr 21, 2014)

bdon said:


> If Jericho loses, they have plans to work together. Jericho would never agree to it.


----------



## nailz1 (Sep 12, 2012)

If it happens it would be great for AEW. Tanahashi vs Jericho for the title would defiantly be a step in the right direction for the company and would hopefully lead to working agreement between the two


----------



## zkorejo (Jul 2, 2010)

bdon said:


> They left them high and dry after NJPW had given them significant pushes.


In their recent Room Service video they stated they offered to be with NJPW with everything just not full time. NJPW are the ones who denied the collaboration because they are butthurt. 

There's nothing wrong with wrestlers wanting to move on, it wasnt like WWE exclusivity. Both companies could have worked together and flourish. Its not like they are direct competitors. Japanese business culture is stupid like that.


----------



## Taroostyles (Apr 1, 2007)

So looks like NJPW is officially recognizing this now as a stip. Come on Tana!


----------



## The Masked Avenger (Apr 18, 2018)

Nice this might be the way to screw Mox out of his title shot in Feb. I figured Jericho would volunteer to be in the Match Beyond to avoid Mox as long as possible but this would be a good alternative.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

People really still believe random people are going to tune into a wrestling show, not named WWE, and stick around for whatever reason. 

This isn't 1999 anymore. 

To millions of wrestling fans, NJPW vs AEW would be fresh, exciting and different. It's about AEW getting those million on their product and hoping to keep THEM there.


----------



## kingfrass44 (Sep 19, 2019)

MJF said:


> People really still believe random people are going to tune into a wrestling show, not named WWE, and stick around for whatever reason.
> 
> This isn't 1999 anymore.
> 
> To millions of wrestling fans, NJPW vs AEW would be fresh, exciting and different. It's about AEW getting those million on their product and hoping to keep THEM there.


Not even millions of wrestling fans 
They are an audio minority
They are the same people and this will not bring anything new With the possibility of stealing a title


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

TheMaskedAvenger said:


> Nice this might be the way to screw Mox out of his title shot in Feb. I figured Jericho would volunteer to be in the Match Beyond to avoid Mox as long as possible but this would be a good alternative.



I don't think it's actually going to happen. I think Jericho worked with Gedo and Tony Khan for them to push the possibility. Since doing that brings more stakes on Jericho/Tanahashi at Wrestle Kingdom. 


While it also gets AEW name out there as well. I believe Jericho will win and the match will never happen for AEW title. But maybe this would be a start. That could lead to AEW and New Japan doing some cross promotion shows together.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

Taroostyles said:


> So looks like NJPW is officially recognizing this now as a stip. Come on Tana!


Jericho has mentioned when he was New Japan IC champ. He pushed to Vince to do New Japan IC champ vs Seth Rollins WWE IC champ. But Vince wasn't interested. 


I'm sure AEW would be fine with Tanahashi coming to AEW for a night. But I'm not sure New Japan would be cool with him coming to AEW and lose to Jericho on tv. Maybe they trust Jericho enough they will allow just that one match. If things go well then it could turn to relationship. We will see but I think it's more likely Jericho wins. And this was all just done to hype of Wrestle Kingdom and AEW title.


----------



## V-Trigger (Jul 6, 2016)

imthegame19 said:


> I'm sure AEW would be fine with Tanahashi coming to AEW for a night. But I'm not sure New Japan would be cool with him coming to AEW and lose to Jericho on tv. Maybe they trust Jericho enough they will allow just that one match. If things go well then it could turn to relationship. We will see but I think it's more likely Jericho wins. And this was all just done to hype of Wrestle Kingdom and AEW title.


Jericho is longtime friends with Jado and Gedo aka the bookers of New Japan.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

All the official NJPW accounts tweeted this out..... it‘s happening. The dawn of a new age 


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1211315944037003267


----------



## Whoanma (Apr 5, 2016)




----------



## MetalKiwi (Sep 2, 2013)

That's a good start towards a working relationship.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Darkest Lariat said:


> Tanahashi will be the most respected wrestler on Earth once Liger retires. This take couldn't be any more bs. Everyone understands the importance of his contributions to wrestling. New Japan would be gone if not for Tanahashi. No New Japan, no 5* Kenny, no AEW.


Yes, he said hardcore fans. 



imthegame19 said:


> Jericho has mentioned when he was New Japan IC champ. He pushed to Vince to do New Japan IC champ vs Seth Rollins WWE IC champ. But Vince wasn't interested.
> 
> 
> I'm sure AEW would be fine with Tanahashi coming to AEW for a night. But I'm not sure New Japan would be cool with him coming to AEW and lose to Jericho on tv. Maybe they trust Jericho enough they will allow just that one match. If things go well then it could turn to relationship. We will see but I think it's more likely Jericho wins. And this was all just done to hype of Wrestle Kingdom and AEW title.


Heard this reported like they are officially working together. I will laugh if Tanahashi wins and is then like “Nah.”


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

The Wood said:


> Yes, he said hardcore fans.
> 
> 
> 
> Heard this reported like they are officially working together. I will laugh if Tanahashi wins and is then like “Nah.”


Of course that's what you would want to happen. Thanks for showing us all once again your bias dislike for the company and that you are rooting against them. You have been exposed once again.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

imthegame19 said:


> Of course that's what you would want to happen. Thanks for showing us all once again your bias dislike for the company and that you are rooting against them. You have been exposed once again.


I want my New Japan to be kept pure, thanks. I don’t want to see Okada fucking around with Orange Cassidy. At this point, yes, I am biased against AEW. That’s not a bad thing. That’s just my response to the way they have treated me as a wrestling fan. I don’t like my intelligence insulted. They like Joey Janela. It’s not “exposing” to not like something.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

The Wood said:


> I want my New Japan to be kept pure, thanks. I don’t want to see Okada fucking around with Orange Cassidy. At this point, yes, I am biased against AEW. That’s not a bad thing. That’s just my response to the way they have treated me as a wrestling fan. I don’t like my intelligence insulted. They like Joey Janela. It’s not “exposing” to not like something.


Yeah imagine lower card wrestler who barely wrestles being booked to face main event talent Okada.
I mean damn. Horrendous booking. AEW insulting our intelligence as per normal, booking this comedic lower card talent as main event ? 

This ain’t no reach. Orange Cassidy who is lower card and barely appears, will be put in a program with Okada. fuck.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

optikk sucks said:


> Yeah imagine lower card wrestler who barely wrestles being booked to face main event talent Okada.
> I mean damn. Horrendous booking. AEW insulting our intelligence as per normal, booking this comedic lower card talent as main event ?
> 
> This ain’t no reach. Orange Cassidy who is lower card and barely appears, will be put in a program with Okada. fuck.


I don’t want him on the same fucking show. Why do people say “comedic lower card talent” like it’s a necessary fucking thing. He’s also not funny.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

The Wood said:


> I want my New Japan to be kept pure, thanks. I don’t want to see Okada fucking around with Orange Cassidy. At this point, yes, I am biased against AEW. That’s not a bad thing. That’s just my response to the way they have treated me as a wrestling fan. I don’t like my intelligence insulted. They like Joey Janela. It’s not “exposing” to not like something.


Okada vs Orange Cassidy at Tokyo Dome would be great! Hope Okada doesn't get squashed too fast tho. If Joey Janela insults your intelligence then it deserves to be insulted. Thanks for confirming your bias and agenda. Good riddance.


----------



## Jazminator (Jan 9, 2018)

If you don’t like a wrestling company or show, then just stay away and don’t watch it. Common sense.


----------



## reyfan (May 23, 2011)

Sounds good in theory but kinda shits on the W/L/D record keeping.


----------



## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

The plot thickens. I'm with @The Wood that I prefer NJPW be kept as is because they do sports oriented the right way but I wouldn't mind if AEW tried to be a lot more like NJPW. Now if AEW can lose the hjinks and buffoonery, get a good solid and coherent plan that works like NJPW and become more sports oriented (sound familiar?) like NJPW already is and possibly let Gedo do some of their booking (I know it won't happen) then I would be excited with them working together, but that would be the only way I would want to see them mixing. I have a guilty pleasure though of wanting to see Stunt vs Suzuki aka "Murder Grandpa"


----------



## V-Trigger (Jul 6, 2016)

BigCy said:


> The plot thickens. I'm with @The Wood that I prefer NJPW be kept as is because they do sports oriented the right way but I wouldn't mind if AEW tried to be a lot more like NJPW. Now if AEW can lose the hjinks and buffoonery, get a good solid and coherent plan that works like NJPW and become more sports oriented (sound familiar?) like NJPW already is and possibly let Gedo do some of their booking (I know it won't happen) then I would be excited with them working together, but that would be the only way I would want to see them mixing. I have a guilty pleasure though of wanting to see Stunt vs Suzuki aka "Murder Grandpa"


He prefers it that way because he's an anti AEW guy. Literally everybody wants this to work out.


----------



## The Masked Avenger (Apr 18, 2018)

imthegame19 said:


> I don't think it's actually going to happen. I think Jericho worked with Gedo and Tony Khan for them to push the possibility. Since doing that brings more stakes on Jericho/Tanahashi at Wrestle Kingdom.
> 
> 
> While it also gets AEW name out there as well. I believe Jericho will win and the match will never happen for AEW title. But maybe this would be a start. That could lead to AEW and New Japan doing some cross promotion shows together.


I don't think NJPW would acknowledge it at all if they hadn't talked about it.


----------



## Oracle (Nov 9, 2011)

Even if it doesnt happen its a good tactic by both parties to get more eyes on wrestle kingdom. 

100 percent cant deny theres more to there match now.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

reyfan said:


> Sounds good in theory but kinda shits on the W/L/D record keeping.


Records are reset.... so...... ?‍♂


----------



## Taroostyles (Apr 1, 2007)

Sounds like it could just be a tactic to increase interest or it could be something more, we wont know for a few more days. 

If they can reach a deal and the plan is to have NJPW talent over here for NJPW America then we could really be in for something special.


----------



## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

I think a lot of you are going to be disappointed.

Jericho and Tanahashi are just building up their match


----------



## IronMan8 (Dec 25, 2015)

How‘s Meltzer’s framing it?

If he’s downplaying it, he could be helping them work everyone to increase excitement for when it happens.


----------



## Hephaesteus (Aug 20, 2018)

Don't see Jericho eating the L. Jericho's building up prestige so when he finally loses, the person who takes the belt will be a made man.


----------



## Taroostyles (Apr 1, 2007)

IronMan8 said:


> How‘s Meltzer’s framing it?
> 
> If he’s downplaying it, he could be helping them work everyone to increase excitement for when it happens.


Basically said it could be something, but it could just be a promotional tactic. 

But he also said back when AEW aired that Kenny video with the Ibushi mention that they wouldn't do that without a payoff somewhere down the road.


----------



## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

Taroostyles said:


> Basically said it could be something, but it could just be a promotional tactic.
> 
> But he also said back when AEW aired that Kenny video with the Ibushi mention that they wouldn't do that without a payoff somewhere down the road.


Meltzer didn't properly understood the meaning of the video.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Jazminator said:


> If you don’t like a wrestling company or show, then just stay away and don’t watch it. Common sense.


That's what most people seem to be doing. 



V-Trigger said:


> He prefers it that way because he's an anti AEW guy. Literally everybody wants this to work out.


There are plenty of fans who don't want to see the two worlds colliding. There are even some in here that are cautious about it. 

There are definite upsides to getting eyeballs on guys like Tanahashi and Okada. If Tony Khan is going to put in a word to try and get them on TNT or some other Warner property, I can see the sense in New Japan saying "fuck it" and working with AEW -- at least for the short term. 

I'll believe it when I see it though. 



IronMan8 said:


> How‘s Meltzer’s framing it?
> 
> If he’s downplaying it, he could be helping them work everyone to increase excitement for when it happens.


Meltzer doesn't think it's happening. He's also completely taken the AEW talent that fucked over New Japan's side. 

My gut is still telling me that is just Gedo being a genius and using Jericho to get something back for New Japan. It wouldn't surprise me if Jericho and Mox are both lying on their backs coming out of the Dome, and that's the Revolution main event told. 

Tanahashi didn't actually mention AEW by name until very recently, and when Jericho goes to promo, what's he going to say? It's drummed up more interest in the match. I see Jericho losing and then Tanahashi either disavows the shot or Jericho says that Tanahashi will never get a title shot, he was just lying. 

If Gedo were interested in protecting the AEW guys, why would he put Mox in a US Title program just before he goes in to an AEW main event? It makes zero sense. Either you beat Mox or Mox potentially loses while he's one of your champions with a belt that you are probably going to market in the US. Moxley has to lose to either Lance Archer or Juice Robinson prior to that main event, which means he heads into Revolution a loser anyway. You want him losing on your soil first. You also probably want the star power Mox brings to the show, and you don't want to risk anything looking too suspicious or mean prior to the Jericho job, so you probably have him beat Lance Archer. That means Juice is probably beating Mox January 5 and on that same show you've got your ace wrestling Jericho? Yah, I think Gedo is going to put his stars over the top AEW talent. Then the promo will be that Tanahashi will never get a title shot and Tanahashi is all "Japan knows I am the true champion" anyway. 

And while fans like to think that kayfabe is dead, I think it will matter to people. Some fans will be mad at Jericho for jobbing while he's got the belt. Others will feel disenchanted. Wrestlers like Randy Orton will jump all over this. At least one EVP will put their foot in their mouths either blasting fans for caring about fake wrestling results or will take a swipe at Jericho for not being a team player, even though they've likely known about this result for months. That's why I think some of the early months in 2020 are going to be very interesting. 

As Jericho sometimes says -- AEW needs assholes and they can be too nice. I can see him giving them an anatomy lesson. If that happens, it will be interesting to see what actually does ripple in AEW. And I cannot lie -- I love a good shit-show.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

The Wood said:


> That's what most people seem to be doing.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I'm loving all your clouded bias opinions here. I'm gonna ignore all that hater wishful thinking nonsense. But I will let you know how wrestling is in 2020. Will people on the internet bitch if Moxley and Jericho both lose this weekend? Sure they will, people bitch about everything. Even if it doesn't really bother them.


Will it matter though or hurt AEW. Of course not, because anyone watching NJWP shows. Are only hardcore wrestling fans. Who are all smart enough to know this is all fake and they are only losing because they aren't full time New Japan guys.


Just like when WWE had Drew McIntyre kick Dean Ambrose/Jon Moxley ass every week on his way out. Did that make his appearance in AEW like 6 weeks later. Were people like oh AEW signed that jobber or where they like Holy shit he actually went to AEW!


Let's also not forget that Jon Moxley was pinned 3 times in G1. When we saw Moxley next in AEW how did those loses effect Moxley? How about Jericho losing to Okada when he was number 1 contender vs Page at All Out? Did that hurt Jericho title win at all?


Wrestling changed, fans are too smart to let guys losing in different companies devalue them. If Jericho and Moxley lose this weekend. It won't matter on February 29th for Revolution. That said I think it's possible that both could win still this weekend. Reason is? New Japan probably wants to keep using these guys for big shows. Having Moxley or Jericho lose in Japan only devalues them among New Japan fans and doing more high profile matches there.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

It's all about emphasis and perception. If the fans want it to matter, it will matter. If talent call it out, it will matter. I don't follow New Japan enough to know that Moxley was even in the G1. I also didn't know that Jericho and Okada had a match. Those sorts of losses may not matter. The whole wrestling world is going to be watching Wrestle Kingdom though -- or at least being made aware of the news coming out of it.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

The Wood said:


> It's all about emphasis and perception. If the fans want it to matter, it will matter. If talent call it out, it will matter. I don't follow New Japan enough to know that Moxley was even in the G1. I also didn't know that Jericho and Okada had a match. Those sorts of losses may not matter. The whole wrestling world is going to be watching Wrestle Kingdom though -- or at least being made aware of the news coming out of it.


Or you mean you want it to matter or hoping for it to matter. This is just more of your hater nonsense and rooting against AEW. Like I said it won't matter or be remembered or talked about 3 weeks from now if it happens. Jericho loss to Okada was on their second biggest show of the year. While Moxley G1 got huge attention especially when he got pinned in his final 3 matches of the tournament(last two matches clean). Which ended less then 3 weeks before Omega vs Moxley was suppose to happen at All Out.


Either of them losing on January 5th or whatever will have no effect for a ppv on February 29th. But again it might be best interest of New Japan if neither lose. Especially Moxley since there's a lot of big matches left for him to do in Japan.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

We shall see about that.


----------



## IronMan8 (Dec 25, 2015)

imthegame19 said:


> Or you mean you want it to matter or hoping for it to matter. This is just more of your hater nonsense and rooting against AEW. Like I said it won't matter or be remembered or talked about 3 weeks from now if it happens. Jericho loss to Okada was on their second biggest show of the year. While Moxley G1 got huge attention especially when he got pinned in his final 3 matches of the tournament(last two matches clean). Which ended less then 3 weeks before Omega vs Moxley was suppose to happen at All Out.
> 
> 
> Either of them losing on January 5th or whatever will have no effect for a ppv on February 29th. But again it might be best interest of New Japan if neither lose. Especially Moxley since there's a lot of big matches left for him to do in Japan.


The difference is Tanahashi has publicly stated he’ll challenge for the AEW championship if he wins.

That draws AEW fans to watch.

If Moxley and Jericho both lose, it’ll mean more to AEW fans than it did last year before All Out.

It would be like Brock and Roman both losing a month before Wrestlemania 34 after someone from New Japan said they’d challenge the winner for the Universal Title if he wins.

All about perception.

I know nothing of New Japan, but if they wantes exposure in the US then they’ll put the US title on Moxley for a long time anyway (longer than his AEW reign).

The question is: Can New Japan be trusted to play fair with AEW right now?


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

The Wood said:


> We shall see about that.


How so? Will there be bitching on Twitter or on here if they lose? Like I said yes. People love to make big deal out of nothing like Kris Statlander thing. But like I said by Jericho cruise it will be forgotten. Especially with legend like Jericho and such a fan favorite like Moxley. 


Because again people are wise to politics of pro wrestling. They know Jericho/Moxley are full time AEW guys. So New Japan isn't going to book them as their top guys and they will lose some big matches. Plus at the same time. It's possible that Naito could walk out Wrestle Kingdom double champion and Moxley/Jericho both have wins over him.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

IronMan8 said:


> The difference is Tanahashi has publicly stated he’ll challenge for the AEW championship if he wins.
> 
> That draws AEW fans to watch.
> 
> ...


Excellent post. You also know that wrestlers are going to post about it, and cite it as being incompetently run and all that. If Orton doesn't tweet a gif of Tanahashi pinning Jericho and pull some of his antics, I will be _very_ surprised. 

And it does bury AEW to the wrestling world, and that can do damage to fan perception. It's certainly going to knock the wind out of a few fans who think Jericho loves AEW too much to let himself lose, for example. If it affects even the viewership slightly -- it's all just so important now. 

The big damage it does, in my opinion, is it really adds fuel to the fire that they do not know how to organize themselves. I think even Meltzer will start calling it then, because you just shouldn't have your champion working other shows. Even if TNT are the ones who demand Jericho is champion and Tony Khan's hands are completely tied, I think people are still going to instinctively know that this just shouldn't happen when you are supposed to be in charge. 



imthegame19 said:


> How so? Will there be bitching on Twitter or on here if they lose? Like I said yes. People love to make big deal out of nothing like Kris Statlander thing. But like I said by Jericho cruise it will be forgotten. Especially with legend like Jericho and such a fan favorite like Moxley.
> 
> 
> Because again people are wise to politics of pro wrestling. They know Jericho/Moxley are full time AEW guys. So New Japan isn't going to book them as their top guys and they will lose some big matches. Plus at the same time. It's possible that Naito could walk out Wrestle Kingdom double champion and Moxley/Jericho both have wins over him.


I'm not going to forget it, that's for sure. I'll be reminding people "Remember when Jericho went to New Japan as their World Champion and lost?" when people try to argue that they've got their professional practices in order.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

IronMan8 said:


> The difference is Tanahashi has publicly stated he’ll challenge for the AEW championship if he wins.
> 
> That draws AEW fans to watch.
> 
> ...


Again majority of AEW fans who are going to watch this knows how stuff work. Didn't we see Bobby Lashley kick Ambrose/Moxley ass and throw him through announce table in front of his wife. Then a month later he was showing up in AEW kicking Jericho and Omega ass?


Was it less effective? Or where wrestling fans smart enough to know why Ambrose/Moxley was losing. We already saw Jericho and Moxley losing in Japan this summer didn't matter. Its 2020 fans are smart and know why people lose. If their own company has them lose a lot. That's when fans lose faith. Other wise it won't effect people from watching them in AEW at all. Little more attention on this show isn't going to make a difference. That said I don't think both will lose.


My guess is Jericho wins. Then there's some type of inference in Moxley/Archer match. With Moxley having the match won then he gets attacked(Suzuki?) and doesn't answer 10 count. Which will set up Moxley next feud when he returns to Japan. That way Jericho wins and Moxley protected by not getting pinned or really beat. That would probably make the Wood very upset and be a nightmare scenario for them tho lol.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

The Wood said:


> Excellent post. You also know that wrestlers are going to post about it, and cite it as being incompetently run and all that. If Orton doesn't tweet a gif of Tanahashi pinning Jericho and pull some of his antics, I will be _very_ surprised.
> 
> And it does bury AEW to the wrestling world, and that can do damage to fan perception. It's certainly going to knock the wind out of a few fans who think Jericho loves AEW too much to let himself lose, for example. If it affects even the viewership slightly -- it's all just so important now.
> 
> ...


Jesus Christ what a awful post. Ok yes this will damage AEW and embarss them. They will lose bunch of viewers, ticket sales and ppv buys because of it. I wish I could win the lottery too. It's hilarious how you come up with these ridiculous scenarios in year head of AEW looking bad lol. You are one hopeful hater that's for sure haha.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

imthegame19 said:


> Jesus Christ what a awful post. Ok yes this will damage AEW and embarss them. They will lose bunch of viewers, ticket sales and ppv buys because of it. I wish I could win the lottery too. It's hilarious how you come up with these ridiculous scenarios in year head of AEW looking bad lol. You are one hopeful hater that's for sure haha.


Yeah, they might actually. The scenarios you are comparing them two are not perfectly analogous. Meltzer is going to be on his radio show talking about how it's not a good look. This is following a lot of other not good looks. It would certainly go further to busting the AEW myth that they've done a good job of doing themselves.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

The Wood said:


> Yeah, they might actually. The scenarios you are comparing them two are not perfectly analogous. Meltzer is going to be on his radio show talking about how it's not a good look. This is following a lot of other not good looks. It would certainly go further to busting the AEW myth that they've done a good job of doing themselves.


The only thing that will happen is talk and criticism for a few days. Because thats what people do in this day and age about everything. That crap blows over after a few days. It won't stop AEW fans or wrestling fans from watching AEW, who wanna watch AEW. People aren't going to value Jericho or Moxley any less. Because it's 2020 and fans are smart.


----------



## IronMan8 (Dec 25, 2015)

imthegame19 said:


> Again majority of AEW fans who are going to watch this knows how stuff work. Didn't we see Bobby Lashley kick Ambrose/Moxley ass and throw him through announce table in front of his wife. Then a month later he was showing up in AEW kicking Jericho and Omega ass?
> 
> 
> Was it less effective? Or where wrestling fans smart enough to know why Ambrose/Moxley was losing. We already saw Jericho and Moxley losing in Japan this summer didn't matter. Its 2020 fans are smart and know why people lose. If their own company has them lose a lot. That's when fans lose faith. Other wise it won't effect people from watching them in AEW at all. Little more attention on this show isn't going to make a difference. That said I don't think both will lose.
> ...


We all know how it works, but wins and losses still matter to the hardcore audience, especially if your two top guys are losing in other promotions.

They’re hardly the most “elite” wrestlers in the world if they can’t even win mid card titles in the 2nd biggest wrestling promotion.

It defines AEW down the same way Omega losing too much upsets those same fans who want him presented as a top star.

Losing matters to this audience. It changes how they are perceived and that’s simply a fact.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

IronMan8 said:


> We all know how it works, but wins and losses still matter to the hardcore audience, especially if your two top guys are losing in other promotions.
> 
> They’re hardly the most “elite” wrestlers in the world if they can’t even win mid card titles in the 2nd biggest wrestling promotion.
> 
> ...


Losing matters how they are perceived in their own company. Your Omega example is totally different because it's his main company. When Omega loses Triple A title outside of AEW are those same people going to care the same? Nope, just like they didn't when he won the title. Jericho wrestles like twice a year for New Japan.


Fans know why they wouldn't want him to beat their top Japan guys. Same with Moxley going forward he might only wrestle 3 to 5 matches a year for Japan going forward. So they know why Japan isn't gonna make him their next big star. If either guy was full time New Japan guys. Both guys would be booked and treated differently. Fans know that when they see these guys just show up for big events and leave. Then they are on AEW every week.


The funny thing is I think Tony Khan would be ok with Jericho losing. Because he knows how smart fans are more then anyone these days. With negativity blowing over after a few days. But I do think Jericho too old school to allow it. He would fear backlash on himself for allowing it, rather then backlash falling on AEW.


But again if it does happen remember number 1 AEW contender Jericho lost to Okada. Jon Moxley was pinned by Jay White, Hirooki Goto and Juice Robinson weeks before his scheduled match with Kenny Omega at All Out. Had no effect on AEW what's so ever. Which ends this discussion.


----------



## IronMan8 (Dec 25, 2015)

imthegame19 said:


> Losing matters how they are perceived in their own company. Your Omega example is totally different because it's his main company. When Omega loses Triple A title outside of AEW are those same people going to care the same? Nope, just like they didn't when he won the title. Jericho wrestles like twice a year for New Japan.
> 
> 
> Fans know why they wouldn't want him to beat their top Japan guys. Same with Moxley going forward he might only wrestle 3 to 5 matches a year for Japan going forward. So they know why Japan isn't gonna make him their next big star. If either guy was full time New Japan guys. Both guys would be booked and treated differently. Fans know that when they see these guys just show up for big events and leave. Then they are on AEW every week.
> ...


Again, those matches weren’t marketed towards AEW fans by New Japan.

Tanahashi has now put stakes on his match for AEW.

That draws AEW fans to watch, pay attention, and/or care about the result.

My Omega example was simply to demonstrate that hardcore AEW fans do care if their top stars lose too much - it lowers how they’re perceived.

Both top stars getting pinned would lower their perceived value in the eyes of AEW fans.

This makes AEW look weak. 

Unless you’re arguing wins and losses don’t matter?


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

IronMan8 said:


> Again, those matches weren’t marketed towards AEW fans by New Japan.
> 
> Tanahashi has now put stakes on his match for AEW.
> 
> ...


Wins and loses don't matter when booking them in outside company. Because we know the reason why they would lose. When Moxley, Jericho or Omega lose in AEW that's wins and loses matter.


Just like AEW fans don't take it as some big accomplishment that Omega is Triple A champion. Or how Moxley wrestled Janela and Spears in AEW as New Japan US champion. If Jericho beats Tanahashi and Moxley walks out US champ beating Archer and Robinson. Is it going to make Jericho and Moxley look anymore special? No and losing doesn't make them look any worse. You can't have it both ways.


Tanahashi and Jericho putting stakes on the match isn't all of the sudden going to put ton more eyes on the match then they already had.


If anything AEW fans might be rooting for Jericho to lose. Since they are hopeful it leads to New Japan partnership. But the AEW fans also knew about Moxley losing in G1 or Jericho vs Okada. So is no different this time around. Fans who watch AEW are smarks they know how it works. While some causal fan isn't going to watch this or hear about it.


The only different between this week and when these guys lost in June or August. Is that Jericho on actual champ now and AEW on tv every week.

So certain haters and complainers on social media will try to make a thing about it. Which will last 3 or 4 days or to next Dynamite and then it will be forgotten. Since last time AEW wasn't on weekly t.v. and in weekly competition. So those haters and complainers stuff didn't go anywhere. But it's not like more AEW fans are gonna hear about this then they heard about Moxley in G1 or Jericho vs Okada.


This whole argument is likely a waste of time anyways. Because I don't think Jericho going to lose. Unless there some type of agreement to have Tanahashi do one off AEW match with Jericho. Other wise I don't think Jericho would agree to do the match. If he was going to lose cuz he wouldn't want to face that 3 or 4 days of social media backlash.


While Moxley match is a gimmick match when the guy loses when he can't answer the 10 count. There's no pin falls or submissions. So that tells me someone like Suzuki is going to attack Moxley when he has Archer beat. Which will lead to Archer getting up putting Moxley throw some table or something and not answer 10 count.


When Moxley returned to New Japan last month. He attacked Archer and Suzuki. While Moxley/Suzuki is match a lot of fans and Including Moxley want. So I can see them setting that up for when Moxley returns next. While protecting him in defeat here. Not for AEW but for future appearances for them. At some point they will wanna use him in bigger matches then US title stuff.


----------



## Dibil13 (Apr 29, 2016)

I don't think anything will come of this. They're just trying to add some intrigue to a match that otherwise wouldn't have much going for it.


----------



## IronMan8 (Dec 25, 2015)

imthegame19 said:


> Wins and loses don't matter when booking them in outside company. Because we know the reason why they would lose. When Moxley, Jericho or Omega lose in AEW that's wins and loses matter.
> 
> 
> Just like AEW fans don't take it as some big accomplishment that Omega is Triple A champion. Or how Moxley wrestled Janela and Spears in AEW as New Japan US champion. If Jericho beats Tanahashi and Moxley walks out US champ beating Archer and Robinson. Is it going to make Jericho and Moxley look anymore special? No and losing doesn't make them look any worse. You can't have it both ways.
> ...


It’s all about perception though.

If we all watch Brock Lesnar dominate in UFC and then we watch CM Punk lose in UFC, it matters.

Can’t ignore external losses, it’s the visual of it, the idea, the shink in the armour and most importantly the status of AEW as a brand in the world pecking order. 

We want them to feel like a big deal.


----------



## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

Moxley lost matches in Japan and yet that didn't change the perception that people have of him.


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## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

IronMan8 said:


> It’s all about perception though.
> 
> If we all watch Brock Lesnar dominate in UFC and then we watch CM Punk lose in UFC, it matters.
> 
> ...



You are talking about something real vs fake. When we see Brock kick ass in UFC. It adds to the myth of his character because he's doing it for real too. While CM Punk always thinks so highly of himself. So when he got destroyed it made a lot of people laugh at him.


Moxley and Jericho are doing a fake fight with another company deciding who wins or loses. Fans know and are smart to it. Remember Jericho last run in WWE he was in mid card US title stuff. We saw Moxley job out to Drew McIntyre like 3 or 4 times, Ec3, and Elias during his last two months with WWE.

Yet when they went to AEW that was ignored and their track record of being former World Champs and main eventers is what is remembered. Fans love both guys because of their great characters , status they created in WWE and good matches they had. 


As already seen this summer with both guys taking pins in Japan it won't matter and be forgotten(as it was before we started talking if one if them lost at this show). 

What matters is Jon Moxley AEW version has yet to be pinned at all in AEW. He's going to be facing AEW Chris Jericho who has yet to be pinned in a singles match. While fans know if Okada came to AEW part time. He would be the won losing big matches too.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

rbl85 said:


> Moxley lost matches in Japan and yet that didn't change the perception that people have of him.



Exactly fans know it's a fake fight and booker decides who wins. They understand guys who aren't full time with Japan arent going to win all the time. If Jericho or Moxley were full time New Japan guys and loss. That would bring their value down. But they are AEW guys and make special appearances in New Japan. In AEW Moxley and Jericho are the only ones undefeated in singles matches. Losing in AEW could only devalue them.


Do you think if Okada and Tanahashi had it in their contract that they could wrestle in some AEW events. Would AEW job out AEW roster to them every time they wrestled in AEW? Of course not and both guys would lose. Fans need to understand times have changed and fans are too smart to let stuff like this devalue a wrestler.


Just like when Moxley having competitive match with Janela. Fans and haters of Janela will try to make case it's hurting Moxley value. Yet the matches both have done good numbers and Moxley doing just fine lol. This is silly outdated way of thinking just like this whole topic. Yes haters and certain fans will use it as fuel to complain for a few days. But it doesn't really matter or impact AEW.


----------



## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

imthegame19 said:


> Again majority of AEW fans who are going to watch this knows how stuff work. Didn't we see Bobby Lashley kick Ambrose/Moxley ass and throw him through announce table in front of his wife. Then a month later he was showing up in AEW kicking Jericho and Omega ass?
> 
> 
> Was it less effective? Or where wrestling fans smart enough to know why Ambrose/Moxley was losing. We already saw Jericho and Moxley losing in Japan this summer didn't matter. Its 2020 fans are smart and know why people lose. If their own company has them lose a lot. That's when fans lose faith. Other wise it won't effect people from watching them in AEW at all. Little more attention on this show isn't going to make a difference. That said I don't think both will lose.
> ...


This got me thinking a bit too but I might be wrong. What if NJPW will book Mox to lose on night 2 to Juice and Jericho to lose to Tanahashi as you predict. In a way this could be seen as a pretty elaborate plan for NJPW. Think about the perception this creates with NJPW: America starting up. This basically says "Our guys just beat AEW's best, come see the REAL Elite when we come to USA." or something along those lines.

@imthegame19 - I do like reading your posts even though I typically disagree because you offer good insights on the opposite side of the spectrum. I think you make a few good points in this regard. I agree in that I don't think it will be a deal breaker or put AEW out of business or anything but it's the little things that can cascade into bigger things. I think AEW will still be fine but it kind of pushes the narrative that "NJPW is better than AEW" in a subconscious and very meta way. I think it will more increase NJPW subscribers and viewership more than it will hurt AEW's to be honest but I think it will have a little impact either short and/or long term Of course if Jericho wins then that all kind of goes out the window I suppose. Or if they split it Jericho wins, Mox loses or Jericho loses Mox wins then I guess that could be them "splitting the difference" and coming to a mutual agreement to make each other look good.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

BigCy said:


> This got me thinking a bit too but I might be wrong. What if NJPW will book Mox to lose on night 2 to Juice and Jericho to lose to Tanahashi as you predict. In a way this could be seen as a pretty elaborate plan for NJPW. Think about the perception this creates with NJPW: America starting up. This basically says "Our guys just beat AEW's best, come see the REAL Elite when we come to USA." or something along those lines.
> 
> @imthegame19 - I do like reading your posts even though I typically disagree because you offer good insights on the opposite side of the spectrum. I think you make a few good points in this regard. I agree in that I don't think it will be a deal breaker or put AEW out of business or anything but it's the little things that can cascade into bigger things. I think AEW will still be fine but it kind of pushes the narrative that "NJPW is better than AEW" in a subconscious and very meta way. I think it will more increase NJPW subscribers and viewership more than it will hurt AEW's to be honest but I think it will have a little impact either short and/or long term Of course if Jericho wins then that all kind of goes out the window I suppose. Or if they split it Jericho wins, Mox loses or Jericho loses Mox wins then I guess that could be them "splitting the difference" and coming to a mutual agreement to make each other look good.


Because no fans are tricked to think New Japan guys are better based on what happens on this show. Just because they got wins over Jericho and Moxley on one show. It's gonna be 2020 fans know it's fake outcomes and smart to that stuff . The era of worrying about that is dead.


Based off that theory New Japan guys are already better. New Japan world Champion Okada already beat Jericho in June. While Moxley couldn't win G1 and become number 1 contender in New Japan. Yet that's what he will be in AEW. How has that effected AEW?


They know if they lose its because their not full time New Japan guys. Nobody is going to think Lance Archer or Juice Robinson are better then Moxley based off the show no matter what the outcome is. Jericho once last to Fandango at Wrestlemania. He's gonna be devalued now for losing to Tanahashi?


----------



## Saintpat (Dec 18, 2013)

BigCy said:


> This got me thinking a bit too but I might be wrong. What if NJPW will book Mox to lose on night 2 to Juice and Jericho to lose to Tanahashi as you predict. In a way this could be seen as a pretty elaborate plan for NJPW. Think about the perception this creates with NJPW: America starting up. This basically says "Our guys just beat AEW's best, come see the REAL Elite when we come to USA." or something along those lines.
> 
> @imthegame19 - I do like reading your posts even though I typically disagree because you offer good insights on the opposite side of the spectrum. I think you make a few good points in this regard. I agree in that I don't think it will be a deal breaker or put AEW out of business or anything but it's the little things that can cascade into bigger things. I think AEW will still be fine but it kind of pushes the narrative that "NJPW is better than AEW" in a subconscious and very meta way. I think it will more increase NJPW subscribers and viewership more than it will hurt AEW's to be honest but I think it will have a little impact either short and/or long term Of course if Jericho wins then that all kind of goes out the window I suppose. Or if they split it Jericho wins, Mox loses or Jericho loses Mox wins then I guess that could be them "splitting the difference" and coming to a mutual agreement to make each other look good.


Yeah but Omega was a god over there and he isn’t cutting it in AEW (kayfabe, W/L-wise).

They could (and I’d argue should) make that part of Kenny’s story arc in AEW — big in Japan, indie darling but he’s struggling to compete in America where the competition is so much better (I’m not saying it really is, but you can certainly sell that in telling his story — most U.S. viewers haven’t see many Japanese wrestlers presented as top-tier guys in America).


----------



## Lethal Evans (Dec 18, 2013)

Saintpat said:


> Yeah but Omega was a god over there and he isn’t cutting it in AEW (kayfabe, W/L-wise).
> 
> They could (and I’d argue should) make that part of Kenny’s story arc in AEW — big in Japan, indie darling but he’s struggling to compete in America where the competition is so much better (I’m not saying it really is, but you can certainly sell that in telling his story — most U.S. viewers haven’t see many Japanese wrestlers presented as top-tier guys in America).


... That's literally the ongoing story with Kenny


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

imthegame19 said:


> The only thing that will happen is talk and criticism for a few days. Because thats what people do in this day and age about everything. That crap blows over after a few days. It won't stop AEW fans or wrestling fans from watching AEW, who wanna watch AEW. People aren't going to value Jericho or Moxley any less. Because it's 2020 and fans are smart.


It depends if people want to drop it or not. It depends if fans sit okay with that sort of organization structure and the (fuck, I hate this term) "beta" nature of a company that can't keep its World Champion clean. 

That whole "everybody bitches" line is so old and cliche. No, not everybody does. And no, it's not new. Things get criticized when they suck. Yes, you do get tall poppy syndrome, but the people who genuinely believe this is most of the world have some sort of superior complex they need to get sorted out. Also, bitching because a company you've been told values you, then basically says "Ah, it doesn't matter -- fake shit" is perfectly valid if that's what you want to do. Holding content providers to a standard of consumer respect is not a negative thing. 

It might stop people from watching AEW if they no longer want to watch AEW though. They've had some fucking rough weeks. That Dark Order stuff was _universally_ panned. And has been from the start. And they keep jamming it and jamming it. The same with Brandi Rhodes. People are starting to realize the "we listen to the fans" shtick is bullshit. Something like the AEW World Champion doing a clean job at another company's WrestleMania could gain traction with wrestlers, with commentators and with fans (casual and hardcore). 

People _still_ talk about Hogan burying the WWF Title in favor of the IWGP Title in that promo he did in many corners. Those corners are now connected to one another and can talk, and just as easily as things were stirred up in favor of AEW, just because people are sick of WWE, they can turn around and be trashed. 

You say fans are "smart." Are you trying to use insider terminology here or a simple descriptor? People have always known there is something going on with wrestling. It's a modern day, elitist, smug, classist, arrogant attitude to think that the fan circle you consider yourself part of is inherently better than another group of fans. And there are members of that second group who would point out that smart wrestling fans stopped watching this shit YEARS ago, and would scoff at the idea of the current crowd being either smart or intelligent. 

And you talk about people bitching and then go on to say they are smart. Think about what you're betraying here. There are some wrestling fans who talk about a wrestler being "buried" if they lose a single match. You don't think they are going to react to it a certain way? 



Dibil13 said:


> I don't think anything will come of this. They're just trying to add some intrigue to a match that otherwise wouldn't have much going for it.


I think you're probably right with this, come to think of it. It's just the cleanest way of getting through. It's kind of...annoying though. Not because I want to see AEW working with New Japan, but because it does kind of spoil the outcome and it's a very soft ending to something at your biggest show when you are really trying to launch outwards.

Nah, I'm going to go with it. Gedo is just in such a plump position. I don't know how they get around the title shot -- maybe they spin off Tanahashi into something really urgent really fast, but I just don't see the benefit to putting Jericho over here. Unless the plan is to scooch up to Tony Khan for some television exposure/possibly their own deal, so it makes sense to string him along. 

There's just too much hilarity in Tanahashi and CJ Parker going over Jericho and Moxley at Wrestle Kingdom. It's just too rich. They've got this New Beginning USA thing and they're going to want to position themselves as big dogs. And you can always work with _every other wrestling promotion_ and possibly even with NXT/WWE, who will probably get the biggest kick out of their "competition's" champion going to New Japan and basically look like he's at least willing to throw them under the bus for money. 

After Omega, Cody and The Bucks got so smug after the AEW announcement last year, it'd just be a fitting thing to put them in their place a bit and remind them that they don't really know the first thing about promoting. 

New Japan to beat Jericho and Mox and try and look for a deal with Warner anyway, even without Tony Khan's help. Meltzer will call it one of Gedo's strokes of geniuses, because it gets them noticed and plays to their existent and loyal Japanese fan-base. They also start to refuse anyone (outside of Jericho and Mox) who sign with AEW at all, which gets wrestlers like Brodie Lee, Jeff Cobb and even Marty Scurll to think twice about signing with them. 



rbl85 said:


> Moxley lost matches in Japan and yet that didn't change the perception that people have of him.


So? Some people can still watch Kevin Spacey movies but can't stand Bill Cosby. That's whatever it is. People aren't always going to treat Situation A like Situation B. Timing, context, the perceived stakes, etc. That all goes into something. 

Moxley was not the AEW World Champion when he lost in G1. He had also not yet wrestled a match for AEW. It was him coming in after being Dean Ambrose, upper mid-carder, forever and a day. It's not the same thing as the AEW World Champion flat-backing for the winding-down ace of a wrestling promotion.


----------



## Mister Sinister (Aug 7, 2013)

The way to make a cross-promotional thing like this work is to crown an undisputed world heavyweight champion (Jericho would be a great choice thematically due to his history as the original double champion).

The downside of working with NJPW is that the ratings would actually go down because of all of the Japanese wrestlers appearing on TNT.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

The Wood said:


> It depends if people want to drop it or not. It depends if fans sit okay with that sort of organization structure and the (fuck, I hate this term) "beta" nature of a company that can't keep its World Champion clean.
> 
> That whole "everybody bitches" line is so old and cliche. No, not everybody does. And no, it's not new. Things get criticized when they suck. Yes, you do get tall poppy syndrome, but the people who genuinely believe this is most of the world have some sort of superior complex they need to get sorted out. Also, bitching because a company you've been told values you, then basically says "Ah, it doesn't matter -- fake shit" is perfectly valid if that's what you want to do. Holding content providers to a standard of consumer respect is not a negative thing.
> 
> ...


It's the internet people just bitch to bitch and don't actually care about what their bitching about it. Either way I'm done trying to educate you. I already explained enough and told you what would has happen and what will happen if it does happen. I'm not going to waste my time reading or replying to your silly 1991 opinions. 


I think majority of this forum is going to make that our new years resolution. Considering all the PMs i get from people on here who tell me to ignore you or troll you back.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Don't think the ratings would go down any more than the usual trend. Okada and Tanahashi, especially, are such good workers that they could lure in North American crowds if they're there. You don't act like they are draws, because they are not, but they are fantastic fucking workers and you can present the company like a star. Or like this best kept secret you are missing out on. 

But the only value New Japan really have is if you make them look better than your side, which is risky because fans are already getting disenchanted with how much guys like Kenny Omega are losing.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

imthegame19 said:


> It's the internet people just bitch to bitch and don't actually care about what their bitching about it. Either way I'm done trying to educate you. I already explained enough and told you what would has happen and what will happen if it does happen. I'm not going to waste my time reading or replying to your silly 1991 opinions.
> 
> 
> I think majority of this forum is going to make that our new years resolution. Considering all the PMs i get from people on here who tell me to ignore you or troll you back.


If they don't care about AEW, then that's AEW's fault. Like, imagine trying to make this your argument: People don't care about AEW -- it will be fine! 

Educate me? Get a load of the ego on this one. Your reasoning is usually incoherent. Your arguing tactics usually resort to insults. Is that how you think you "educate" people? 

And look at you trying to resort to the anonymity of the crowd. The appeal to general opinion. I get PMs from people telling me that they appreciate what I do here too. They tell me that it's so frustrating to come to these boards, because you want to have an honest discussion about wrestling, but then someone starts calling you a WWE troll because you don't like AEW as much as them. They also appreciate that I explain my reasoning behind the things I say, and that the people arguing with me usually have to resort to "I'm just going to ignore you and you aren't popular with my friends!"

You don't need to educate anyone other than yourself, son.


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## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

The Wood said:


> If they don't care about AEW, then that's AEW's fault. Like, imagine trying to make this your argument: People don't care about AEW -- it will be fine!
> 
> Educate me? Get a load of the ego on this one. Your reasoning is usually incoherent. Your arguing tactics usually resort to insults. Is that how you think you "educate" people?
> 
> ...


???


----------



## Saintpat (Dec 18, 2013)

Lethal Evans said:


> ... That's literally the ongoing story with Kenny


I don’t ever remember them framing it as ‘now he’s facing a completely different and much tougher level of competition in the U.S.; welcome to American wrestling Kenny, you’re not in Japan facing pushovers anymore.”

What they’ve said is “Kenny has lost his mojo, he hasn’t yet captured his form in AEW.” They’ve said he’s one of the best in the world rather than ‘He made his mark against a lower level of opposition, maybe he can’t cut it here.’


----------



## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

I wish @The Wood and @imthegame19 would get along better. You're both good posters who bring up good points. I wouldn't call either one of you trolls, you both just represent a different side of the equation which is fine. I would hate it here if everyone just had the same opinion. You're better than this @imthegame19, no need to throw personal insults at Wood, I noticed that Wood doesn't throw insults at people unless they attack him first. I guarantee he's not a troll and I hope you don't block him because I've been enjoying your back and forth discussions.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

They're one of the better blind-defenders of AEW, I'll give them that.


----------



## Jedah (Jul 16, 2017)

This was real interesting from Meltzer, et al today.

TL;DR, probably no deal yet, but at least now both sides are beginning to talk to each other. They'd have to or the Tanahashi angle wouldn't be happening.

It's really a no brainer. A partnership would inject AEW with buzz and give fans a number of dream matches. Every time a crossover event occurred it would be a special attraction.

Meanwhile, NJPW would get some of their guys TV exposure in the US on a major network. Since they're trying to expand in the US, you'd think that's just a given that they'd want.

I'm not betting on it, but hopefully Tanahashi wins tomorrow. It would be a huge deal to do Jericho vs. Tanahashi at Revolution. And meanwhile, it would prolong the Moxley feud and add another wrinkle into it where Jericho is avoiding Moxley for as long as possible. I've always said one PPV cycle is too short for this feud. It should be the defining rivalry in AEW in 2020.


----------



## Whoanma (Apr 5, 2016)

Jedah said:


> This was real interesting from Meltzer, et al today.
> 
> TL;DR, probably no deal yet, but at least now both sides are beginning to talk to each other. They'd have to or the Tanahashi angle wouldn't be happening.
> 
> ...


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

IronMan8 said:


> It’s all about perception though.
> 
> If we all watch Brock Lesnar dominate in UFC and then we watch CM Punk lose in UFC, it matters.
> 
> ...



Comparing sports to entertainment now ?


----------



## The Dude (Jan 1, 2020)

A partnership with NJPW will do one thing for AEW.

Continue to placate their already existing fanbase of hardcore wrestling marks and alienate everyone else who can care less about Tanahashi and the rest of NJPW.


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## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

AEW looking strong at Wrestle Kingdom. Jericho showcased the AEW title and beat/tapped out Tanahashi. While Moxley won US title against Archer and successfully defended it against Juice Robinson. So much for the haters hoping this show would make AEW look bad. It's really was the opposite lol.


----------



## Roxinius (Jul 21, 2014)

Well shit Jericho won so no go


----------



## Oracle (Nov 9, 2011)

cry


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## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

Oracle said:


> cry


It was too soon for them to do something that big. But the fact they did this stip. Along with having AEW title on Wrestle Kingdom. Well I think they will end up doing some type of partnership or special show together in the next year or so.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Roxinius said:


> Well shit Jericho won so no go


It’s happening. AEW was put over a MASSIVE way.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

Naito is also double champion. Who both Jericho and Moxley have beaten.


----------



## Oracle (Nov 9, 2011)

They did put AEW over in a big way even if Jericho won. 

Him coming out with the belt talking about them on commentary. 

things are going in the right direction


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

NJPW put over AEW big time. I'd definitely like to see Suzuki vs Moxley (which is happening anyway) during normal eastern standard time and Suzuki vs Pentagon so if they partner up it's cool. 

Though I wonder what's the real benefit for AEW. I can't imagine there's too many fans in the US that either watch or are knowledgeable about NJPW that don't also watch AEW already. Plus with them being so new, do they want to give NJPW a big look when they're allegedly still looking to start a branch of the promotion in the US. 

If they do it this would be more so pleasing the fans and talent than what I'd imagine being a more for growth.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RapShepard said:


> NJPW put over AEW big time. I'd definitely like to see Suzuki vs Moxley (which is happening anyway) during normal eastern standard time and Suzuki vs Pentagon so if they partner up it's cool.
> 
> Though I wonder what's the real benefit for AEW. I can't imagine there's too many fans in the US that either watch or are knowledgeable about NJPW that don't also watch AEW already. Plus with them being so new, do they want to give NJPW a big look when they're allegedly still looking to start a branch of the promotion in the US.
> 
> If they do it this would be more so pleasing the fans and talent than what I'd imagine being a more for growth.


It will help with the increased international exposure. US yea I can’t see any real benefit. But worldwide will help. AEW will go international virtually overnight. It will help with them getting better TV deals.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

optikk sucks said:


> It will help with the increased international exposure.


I can't speak internationally. It just feels like if you're the type that knows NJPW you know AEW seeing as NJPW pretty much made The Elite famous. I'm sure it'll be more positive than negative. Just outside of the fun for fans, I wonder if the positives are enough to justify building your closest rival you know.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Imagine being able to give US fans who have HEARD about these wonderful matches that occurred in NJPW, but are more casual and never looked into how to watch those matches, a chance to see Okada/Omega 5 on US soil. Maybe in MSG. Or any other handful of matches. You have a TON of former WCW fans who remember NJPW sending guys over to WCW. And now they hear NJPW is coming to work with AEW.

That’s one more way of legitimizing and putting eyes on AEW through the lapsed fans who watched the Dynamite premier, didn’t know anyone, and just assumed it would be TNA part 2.


----------



## kingfrass44 (Sep 19, 2019)

bdon said:


> Imagine being able to give US fans who have HEARD about these wonderful matches that occurred in NJPW, but are more casual and never looked into how to watch those matches, a chance to see Okada/Omega 5 on US soil. Maybe in MSG. Or any other handful of matches. You have a TON of former WCW fans who remember NJPW sending guys over to WCW. And now they hear NJPW is coming to work with AEW.
> 
> That’s one more way of legitimizing and putting eyes on AEW through the lapsed fans who watched the Dynamite premierwatched the Dynamite premier, didn’t know anyone, and just assumed it would be TNA part 2.


former WCW They do not know NJPW 
lapsed fans watched the Dynamite premier not know NJPW 
You alone heard from Twitter Hardcore Or wrestling news sites
There are many that they do not know


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

The long-term benefit is combined contracts that can compete with WWE and all the other promotions

Get Japan talents to scratch that US itch, without going to WWE limbo

Get AEW talents more dates outside their one a week

And combined supershows would be awesome


----------



## Jedah (Jul 16, 2017)

RapShepard said:


> Though I wonder what's the real benefit for AEW. I can't imagine there's too many fans in the US that either watch or are knowledgeable about NJPW that don't also watch AEW already. Plus with them being so new, do they want to give NJPW a big look when they're allegedly still looking to start a branch of the promotion in the US.


If nothing else it gives them a lot of buzz back, which died down after the launch (which is typical of anything). Periodic special attractions can up levels of anticipation and attention and get some buzz at will.


----------



## Chairshot620 (Mar 12, 2010)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> The long-term benefit is combined contracts that can compete with WWE and all the other promotions
> 
> Get Japan talents to scratch that US itch, without going to WWE limbo
> 
> ...


It could help NJPW with their mini-tours of the USA by sprinkling in some AEW talent, since AEW doesn’t tour.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RapShepard said:


> I can't speak internationally. It just feels like if you're the type that knows NJPW you know AEW seeing as NJPW pretty much made The Elite famous. I'm sure it'll be more positive than negative. Just outside of the fun for fans, I wonder if the positives are enough to justify building your closest rival you know.


The thing also is will it make AEW a more attractive employer? As an employee, the idea of going to Japan occasionally to do my job would sound fantastic. Maybe this is grasping at straws, but to me it will help with that. It helped get Moxley in. It will help others.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

RapShepard said:


> NJPW put over AEW big time. I'd definitely like to see Suzuki vs Moxley (which is happening anyway) during normal eastern standard time and Suzuki vs Pentagon so if they partner up it's cool.
> 
> Though I wonder what's the real benefit for AEW. I can't imagine there's too many fans in the US that either watch or are knowledgeable about NJPW that don't also watch AEW already. Plus with them being so new, do they want to give NJPW a big look when they're allegedly still looking to start a branch of the promotion in the US.
> 
> If they do it this would be more so pleasing the fans and talent than what I'd imagine being a more for growth.



It would still create a hot invasion angle for AEW. Yes it won't bring them 2 million viewers. But having New Japan guys invade AEW and do a ppv with them. Can give them a big ratings boost and ppv can do big buys. It's AEW way to be able to do this type of angle. That we get to see from Raw and Smackdown guys invade NXT.


That said it's gotta be a special thing for it to work. You send New Japan guys over to AEW to appear on tv and do ppv once a year. While AEW send talent to Japan to do big New Japan show once a year. So you keep it two shows with matches per year. That way it keeps it special.


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

So when wcw had mexican and njpw wrestlers it was hot as hell and brought amazing characters and wreatling. Now its aew catering to marks instead of widening a needed variety of wrestlers and style of wrestling in aew

JR is right, wrestling fans are a joke these days


----------



## DOTL (Jan 3, 2012)

Oracle said:


> They did put AEW over in a big way even if Jericho won.
> 
> Him coming out with the belt talking about them on commentary.
> 
> things are going in the right direction


And it was deliberate too. Notice how Jericho was wearing a shirt over the belt at first and then reveiled the title in the ring. They got a huge close up of it too, and it looks great as always. The stipulation was a work, but the fact this happened at all and the title was put over, now that is the real indication of a future relationship between the brands.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Quite uninspired outcomes at Wrestle Kingdom. New Japan are playing it very safe, probably out of desire for TV exposure — the one thing Tony Khan can offer them (other than money).

Things are looking positive for a relationship between the two, which kills my interest in New Japan, frankly, but I guess it makes sense to placate the niche audience that is there. So uninspired though, lol.

What would be inspired is if New Japan use a budding relationship as leverage to pair with NXT and maybe even get some FOX exposure (which is infinitely better for them). I’d take Bryan vs. Okada over Omega vs. Okada.


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

DOTL said:


> And it was deliberate too. Notice how Jericho was wearing a shirt over the belt at first and then reveiled the title in the ring. They got a huge close up of it too, and it looks great as always. The stipulation was a work, but the fact this happened at all and the title was put over, now that is the real indication of a future relationship between the brands.



Ita interesting to see the belt in a different atmospwhere. It really shows how good of a job they did at designing it.It looks very prestigious and important and i think this exact belt will be around for a very long time which will built its history. Tag belts on the other hand are good but more just good nothing insanely special. LOL i can imagine all the buget went into the world belt which im fine with.


----------



## Jedah (Jul 16, 2017)

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1213785828469530625
Jericho is also now openly saying he wants to see a partnership. It'll take a while but I think this is going to happen within the year now. There's just too much opportunity for them to squander it. They're gonna do the right thing for business in the end.


----------



## Ratedr4life (Dec 18, 2008)

It would be stupid to not have a partnership and share talent like this for big shows.

We're getting Okada vs Omega on US soil within the next year.

OR

Imagine Okada wins the G1 Climax tournament as IWGP Champion, shows up at an AEW PPV and challenges Omega for a rematch at Wrestle Kingdom...


----------



## Jedah (Jul 16, 2017)

There's a good chance we're gonna get Okada/Omega V for the AEW Championship at some point. Maybe this year, maybe next.

Moxley will take it off Jericho.

Omega will eventually take it off Moxley.

The partnership should be in place at some point by his reign, I imagine.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

We will get Okada / Kenny V
Okaka / Mox
some faction invasion
Kenny / Ibushi

i’m sure its happening - too much $$$$


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

WWE would probably feel some type of way since they pride themselves on their relationship with Japan. Didn’t trips go over and meet their bigger stars a couple years ago?


----------



## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

The Wood said:


> Quite uninspired outcomes at Wrestle Kingdom. New Japan are playing it very safe, probably out of desire for TV exposure — the one thing Tony Khan can offer them (other than money).
> 
> Things are looking positive for a relationship between the two, which kills my interest in New Japan, frankly, but I guess it makes sense to placate the niche audience that is there. So uninspired though, lol.
> 
> What would be inspired is if New Japan use a budding relationship as leverage to pair with NXT and maybe even get some FOX exposure (which is infinitely better for them). I’d take Bryan vs. Okada over Omega vs. Okada.


I understand the concern but I will see how they play it out first. There's that hopeful chance that AEW gets more "serious and truly sportlike" like NJPW is as a result and starts to adopt that style instead of...whatever they want to call their random style now then that would be a net positive all the way around. I wouldn't want a direct partnership but a loose arrangement and a couple super shows a year could be great for both but personally I would want this ONLY if AEW becomes a lot more like NJPW and not the other way around.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

BigCy said:


> I understand the concern but I will see how they play it out first. There's that hopeful chance that AEW gets more "serious and truly sportlike" like NJPW is as a result and starts to adopt that style instead of...whatever they want to call their random style now then that would be a net positive all the way around. I wouldn't want a direct partnership but a loose arrangement and a couple super shows a year could be great for both but personally I would want this ONLY if AEW becomes a lot more like NJPW and not the other way around.


If AEW becomes more like New Japan, I will give them credit, because that’s what I’ve been craving from the start. If the reverse happens, I will cringe, but I don’t think New Japan would do that to themselves.


----------



## The Dude (Jan 1, 2020)

The Wood said:


> If AEW becomes more like New Japan, I will give them credit, because that’s what I’ve been craving from the start. If the reverse happens, I will cringe, but I don’t think New Japan would do that to themselves.


For all the people that idiotically think we’re the same person this ones for them— I respectfully disagree with you on this point.

Depending on how you think they should be more like NJPW, I think that will hurt them more than it will help them.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

I honestly do not see how NJPW would work in the US with their current roster. A big part of wrestling and getting people over is promos. Almost none of their current roster is known in the US and if they cannot deliver English promos how can they be successful? Having a few non-English speakers can work great like Asuka/Kairi but it will not work if the majority cannot speak English. And it is not like there is an abundance of available unsigned US talent for them to sign. Almost everyone decent is signed by WWE/NXT, AEW, Impact, NWA, MLW, ROH. They have no beachhead in the US, no developmental program. They also are not going to fly their talent between the US and Japan constantly. That flight, even in first class, is draining. A few times a year is OK, but even once a month is crazy.

I think the only way it would work is if they buy one of the smaller promotions and cultivate it over time to be their US brand. Then they can bring in a few of their heavy hitters from Japan to mix with the US talent. Starting from scratch I do not think it will work.


----------



## V-Trigger (Jul 6, 2016)

NJPW removed the post match comments video from Jericho on Youtube.


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

Aew needs to come up with a yearly event that feels big time and has a good name. Would be sweet to see aew guys at wrestle kingdom and njpw guys at aew version

People cant possibly think a ppv called double or nothing or All out aound remotely prestigious. 

Im sure they will have a new one im 2020!

AAA and njpw in AEW would be sweet. 

For me personally i iust dont think they should do a bunch of indy dates outside of aew


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Jedah said:


> If nothing else it gives them a lot of buzz back, which died down after the launch (which is typical of anything). Periodic special attractions can up levels of anticipation and attention and get some buzz at will.


Buzz I can see for the initial part. 



optikk sucks said:


> The thing also is will it make AEW a more attractive employer? As an employee, the idea of going to Japan occasionally to do my job would sound fantastic. Maybe this is grasping at straws, but to me it will help with that. It helped get Moxley in. It will help others.


Lol I think it would be a huge get for a quirky few for sure. But idk what wrestlers want is random. Look at all the unhappy WWE re-signings 



imthegame19 said:


> It would still create a hot invasion angle for AEW. Yes it won't bring them 2 million viewers. But having New Japan guys invade AEW and do a ppv with them. Can give them a big ratings boost and ppv can do big buys. It's AEW way to be able to do this type of angle. That we get to see from Raw and Smackdown guys invade NXT.
> 
> 
> That said it's gotta be a special thing for it to work. You send New Japan guys over to AEW to appear on tv and do ppv once a year. While AEW send talent to Japan to do big New Japan show once a year. So you keep it two shows with matches per year. That way it keeps it special.


I'm not talking unrealistic numbers like 2 million in just talking realistic boosts. I mean WWE could only get NXT up about 150k when they were sending Raw and SmackDown talent with much more exposure. Given NXTs frankly small exposure gained from their dabblings with Raw and SmackDown I can't imagine on the business end NJPW is going to do much for AEW. 

The matches will be fire, but for AEW is it worth it. 




shandcraig said:


> So when wcw had mexican and njpw wrestlers it was hot as hell and brought amazing characters and wreatling. Now its aew catering to marks instead of widening a needed variety of wrestlers and style of wrestling in aew
> 
> JR is right, wrestling fans are a joke these days


Different world then as the average WCW fan or fan in general wouldn't have knew the luchadors. Then on top of that the luchadors were a nice side dish, not a main dish. You were coming for folk like Hall, Nash, Hogan, Luger, Sting, Savage, and Ric the cruiserweights were just a nice addition.


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

RapShepard said:


> Buzz I can see for the initial part.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I get that for sure and yeah its a different time but if you wanna be a global brand you gotta have a variety of wrestlers. Look at NJPW for an example,They have grown because of bringing in wrestlers from other parts of the world.

Not saying it will benefit AEW at all because north american is indeed one strange market.But it cant hurt !


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

shandcraig said:


> I get that for sure and yeah its a different time but if you wanna be a global brand you gotta have a variety of wrestlers. Look at NJPW for an example,They have grown because of bringing in wrestlers from other parts of the world.
> 
> Not saying it will benefit AEW at all because north american is indeed one strange market.But it cant hurt !


I definitely concede the international exposure point. Maybe it's just a product of being American, but I definitely wasn't even thinking about the benefits globally it might has intially. I was strictly thinking of what it does here.


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

RapShepard said:


> I definitely concede the international exposure point. Maybe it's just a product of being American, but I definitely wasn't even thinking about the benefits globally it might has intially. I was strictly thinking of what it does here.



If it happens then we will know if it helps.Never helped with TNA but nothing really did lol


----------



## DOTL (Jan 3, 2012)

shandcraig said:


> Ita interesting to see the belt in a different atmospwhere. It really shows how good of a job they did at designing it.It looks very prestigious and important and i think this exact belt will be around for a very long time which will built its history. Tag belts on the other hand are good but more just good nothing insanely special. LOL i can imagine all the buget went into the world belt which im fine with.


i'm curious how the belt will be viewed in the future. Hopefully, one day, it will be like the American equivalent of the IWGP HW Championship.


----------



## Taroostyles (Apr 1, 2007)

So all the stuff I've read and can tell, it sounds like AEW is fully on board with Tony Khan and Jericho leading the charge. I'm sure the Buvks and Kenny will get on board too.

Sounds like Dave is saying this isnt happening yet cause of Harold Meij and his team. Gedo and Rocky are both on board as well it would seem. The amount of money and attention both sides would get seems too hard to pass up.

I agree with that timeline someone else mentioned. Moxley will take the title from Jericho at Revolution. Omega will take it from Mox at All Out 2. Okada could win the G1 in October and the stars could align for WK. 

Theres just too many great stories they could tell. Imagine when they get to the match beyond and The Elite are down a man like Dustin gets taken out or something and fucking Ibushi comes out as a surprise partner? 

This partnership could be the thing that gives them that anything can happen element that could take them to new heights.


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

DOTL said:


> i'm curious how the belt will be viewed in the future. Hopefully, one day, it will be like the American equivalent of the IWGP HW Championship.



This is why we need a true company in the states that acts as a Global company.wwe is far from a real global company,Sure it does 1 tour a year in other places of the world and has its shows play but its exclusive. AEW could be a strong brand if it does almost like what NJPW does having the belt feel important to the outside world of its country and have outside people come in. You need a belt that is the top belt you wanna have that is not feeling insanely restrickted. Lol im rambling sorry but im sure you get my point. 

They have a LONG WAY to go to even consider that as an option but they can start any time to work towards it


----------



## IronMan8 (Dec 25, 2015)

Taroostyles said:


> So all the stuff I've read and can tell, it sounds like AEW is fully on board with Tony Khan and Jericho leading the charge. I'm sure the Buvks and Kenny will get on board too.
> 
> Sounds like Dave is saying this isnt happening yet cause of Harold Meij and his team. Gedo and Rocky are both on board as well it would seem. The amount of money and attention both sides would get seems too hard to pass up.
> 
> ...


Agree. AEW is definitely more interesting with the NJPW connection coming to fruition. Both AEW stars going over was a great sign.


----------



## DOTL (Jan 3, 2012)

shandcraig said:


> This is why we need a true company in the states that acts as a Global company.wwe is far from a real global company,Sure it does 1 tour a year in other places of the world and has its shows play but its exclusive. AEW could be a strong brand if it does almost like what NJPW does having the belt feel important to the outside world of its country and have outside people come in. You need a belt that is the top belt you wanna have that is not feeling insanely restrickted. Lol im rambling sorry but im sure you get my point.
> 
> They have a LONG WAY to go to even consider that as an option but they can start any time to work towards it


Agreed. I wonder what the next step is. 

I'd say they need a midcard belt and, sadly, not lean so much on the bingo hall type acts. The next round of pick up need to be people who NJPW or WWE would want to pick up.


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

DOTL said:


> Agreed. I wonder what the next step is.
> 
> I'd say they need a midcard belt and, sadly, not lean so much on the bingo hall type acts. The next round of pick up need to be people who NJPW or WWE would want to pick up.


i thought a TV belt coming


----------



## DOTL (Jan 3, 2012)

shandcraig said:


> i thought a TV belt coming


Oh. That's good. I know Powerr has one, I didn't hear that about AEW.


----------



## TKO Wrestling (Jun 26, 2018)

The Wood said:


> Quite uninspired outcomes at Wrestle Kingdom. New Japan are playing it very safe, probably out of desire for TV exposure — the one thing Tony Khan can offer them (other than money).
> 
> Things are looking positive for a relationship between the two, which kills my interest in New Japan, frankly, but I guess it makes sense to placate the niche audience that is there. So uninspired though, lol.
> 
> What would be inspired is if New Japan use a budding relationship as leverage to pair with NXT and maybe even get some FOX exposure (which is infinitely better for them). I’d take Bryan vs. Okada over Omega vs. Okada.


Lol why? Omega is the best wrestler in the world.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

The Dude said:


> For all the people that idiotically think we’re the same person this ones for them— I respectfully disagree with you on this point.
> 
> Depending on how you think they should be more like NJPW, I think that will hurt them more than it will help them.


I think we've briefly discussed this. I don't think we fundamentally disagree here, it's more on the specifics. When I say more like New Japan, I'm mainly talking credibility and treating guys seriously. I'm not suggesting that having puroresu, inherently, is going to be a draw. Hell, that's not even the case in Japan. 



Lheurch said:


> I honestly do not see how NJPW would work in the US with their current roster. A big part of wrestling and getting people over is promos. Almost none of their current roster is known in the US and if they cannot deliver English promos how can they be successful? Having a few non-English speakers can work great like Asuka/Kairi but it will not work if the majority cannot speak English. And it is not like there is an abundance of available unsigned US talent for them to sign. Almost everyone decent is signed by WWE/NXT, AEW, Impact, NWA, MLW, ROH. They have no beachhead in the US, no developmental program. They also are not going to fly their talent between the US and Japan constantly. That flight, even in first class, is draining. A few times a year is OK, but even once a month is crazy.
> 
> I think the only way it would work is if they buy one of the smaller promotions and cultivate it over time to be their US brand. Then they can bring in a few of their heavy hitters from Japan to mix with the US talent. Starting from scratch I do not think it will work.


Eh, there's an appeal to Japanese culture. Anime does alright. There's that whole otaku culture. I mean, I wouldn't suggest they run without promos or English content at all, but I think the resistance to pureresu because it's Japanese is a bit high in 2020. That being said, I would take the elements that work in New Japan, and bring them over. I wouldn't exactly copy New Japan. There's New Japan for that. 



V-Trigger said:


> NJPW removed the post match comments video from Jericho on Youtube.


Not a good sign. Very odd times. It could just be a bit of hard-ball, but I really think that there might be a few curveballs coming in this story. Hell, if I'm Triple H, I'm in a conference with Harold Meij, Gedo, Tiger Hattori and whoever else is important over there, with William Regal also sitting in. I'd be trying to get that New Japan co-operation myself. And don't tell me that Cesaro in a G1 is not something that would be fucking awesome. 



Taroostyles said:


> So all the stuff I've read and can tell, it sounds like AEW is fully on board with Tony Khan and Jericho leading the charge. I'm sure the Buvks and Kenny will get on board too.
> 
> Sounds like Dave is saying this isnt happening yet cause of Harold Meij and his team. Gedo and Rocky are both on board as well it would seem. The amount of money and attention both sides would get seems too hard to pass up.
> 
> ...


A lot of the AEW guys mean very little in Japan though. The Bucks were basically a comedy act. Jericho and Moxley are already working there. The crossover will make them more accessible to North American audiences, but let's not pretend that The Elite vs. anyone is really something of interest in New Japan. They'd want Omega back, which they can get anyway, but it would be as the returning gaijin that threw New Japan under the bus. He'd be the backstage story of Shibata on-air, and you better believe he'd be putting over everybody. 



TKO Wrestling said:


> Lol why? Omega is the best wrestler in the world.


He's absolutely not. And that comes down even further when you consider him as a worker. I'm not saying he sucks or anything, but when he's been displayed weekly, it's kind of exposed how overrated he is. His facial expressions are awful, his psychology can be non-existent, and his theatrics are laughable. He doesn't connect anywhere near as well as people think he does, and that is crucial.


----------



## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

shandcraig said:


> Aew needs to come up with a yearly event that feels big time and has a good name. Would be sweet to see aew guys at wrestle kingdom and njpw guys at aew version
> 
> People cant possibly think a ppv called double or nothing or All out aound remotely prestigious.
> 
> ...


I would like it if AEW does something like a Round Robin or Single/Double Elimination Tournament that they have every year and talent from both companies can participate.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

I would like to see a round robin tournament somewhere in the US, but you have to be tight with that shit. I'd be concerned that it would fall apart very quickly. Whether it be injuries, or just this need to feel like you need to "shake things up." I actually think it would suit NXT a lot better at this point.


----------



## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

shandcraig said:


> i thought a TV belt coming


Apparently that was a rumor and the "new belt" was that stupid diamond ring. Pretty underwhelming. I hope they reconsider and get something legit.


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

BigCy said:


> I would like it if AEW does something like a Round Robin or Single/Double Elimination Tournament that they have every year and talent from both companies can participate.


I love those and i agree. The best serivor series wwe ever had was when the entire ppv was a elimination tournament for the world championship. The entire ppv had a storyline from start to finish as well.It was excellent.


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

BigCy said:


> Apparently that was a rumor and the "new belt" was that stupid diamond ring. Pretty underwhelming. I hope they reconsider and get something legit.


Well im pretty sure its more of a short term storyline.Its a complete lie that the ring is 40k.


----------



## Jazminator (Jan 9, 2018)

I've only watched a bit of NJPW, so I'm not entirely familiar with the talent there. If AEW could "borrow" one NJPW talent for a PPV or two, who do you think it should be? Okada? Tanahashi?

I really like Kota Ibushi.


----------



## Jedah (Jul 16, 2017)

Jazminator said:


> If AEW could "borrow" one NJPW talent for a PPV or two, who do you think it should be? Okada? Tanahashi?


They'd probably want to do an Okada/Omega match on US soil, if I had to guess, but there's many possibilities.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Kenny has said multiple times that there is another match he and Okada have in them. Some things they left on the drawing room floor if you will.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Jazminator said:


> I've only watched a bit of NJPW, so I'm not entirely familiar with the talent there. If AEW could "borrow" one NJPW talent for a PPV or two, who do you think it should be? Okada? Tanahashi?
> 
> I really like Kota Ibushi.


Probably putting Okada over Omega.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

The Wood said:


> Probably putting Okada over Omega.


Just after that, he’ll put over Ibushi. Then Cody. And on down the line.


----------



## IronMan8 (Dec 25, 2015)

shandcraig said:


> i thought a TV belt coming


Moxley brings in the NJPW United States title as AEW's mid-card belt


----------



## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

IronMan8 said:


> Moxley brings in the NJPW United States title as AEW's mid-card belt


I was half thinking that actually. I mean AEW's belt was on air so maybe NJPW let's Mox bring it out? I'm guessing not but if they do then you know both companies don't hate each other at least. Good start.


----------



## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

BigCy said:


> I was half thinking that actually. I mean AEW's belt was on air so maybe NJPW let's Mox bring it out? I'm guessing not but if they do then you know both companies don't hate each other at least. Good start.


It sounds more like the agreement was to allow AEW title to be mentioned to hype up Jericho/Tanahashi match. AEW agreed to it as long as they put over the title on the show. They did and that looks like the end of it for now. 


AEW hasn't mentioned anything about anything that happened at Wrestle Kingdom on their social media or anything. So there's no way Moxley going to come out as Japan US Champion. Especially when he's number 1 contender for AEW title. Even if there was some type of agreement I don't think Tony Khan would want Moxley bringing out that title right now. Just like Omega doesn't bring out his Triple A title on Dynamite. On AEW Dynamite you want the focus to be on AEW titles.


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## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

imthegame19 said:


> It sounds more like the agreement was to allow AEW title to be mentioned to hype up Jericho/Tanahashi match. AEW agreed to it as long as they put over the title on the show. They did and that looks like the end of it for now.
> 
> 
> AEW hasn't mentioned anything about anything that happened at Wrestle Kingdom on their social media or anything. So there's no way Moxley going to come out as Japan US Champion. Especially when he's number 1 contender for AEW title. Even if there was some type of agreement I don't think Tony Khan would want Moxley bringing out that title right now. Just like Omega doesn't bring out his Triple A title on Dynamite. On AEW Dynamite you want the focus to be on AEW titles.


I see. I didn't know the details of Jericho showing off the title at WK. I did an "oh shit!" when he took off the shirt and the AEW title was revealed thinking there might have been something deeper but if that's all it was then yeah pretty much no chance seeing NJPW US title on Dynamite. That AEW belt looks absolutely gorgeous on NJPW cameras and lighting.


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## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

BigCy said:


> I see. I didn't know the details of Jericho showing off the title at WK. I did an "oh shit!" when he took off the shirt and the AEW title was revealed thinking there might have been something deeper but if that's all it was then yeah pretty much no chance seeing NJPW US title on Dynamite. That AEW belt looks absolutely gorgeous on NJPW cameras and lighting.


Yeah there's no deal with New Japan and AEW now. Hopefully this is step one of partnership maybe a year or so down the line.


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## Benoit's Weight Machine (Dec 28, 2019)

I wouldn't hold my breath for any sort of deal between the two companies. NJPW has nothing significant to gain from a formal arrangement. They already have Jericho and Moxley signed to separate deals. Kenny and I believe the Bucks are still under contract however they are not using them due to bad blood over their NJPW exits.

NJPW is a threat to AEW rather than an ally. If NJPW gets their American venture up and running by the time Moxley's AEW deal is up, he's as good as gone.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Benoit's Weight Machine said:


> I wouldn't hold my breath for any sort of deal between the two companies. NJPW has nothing significant to gain from a formal arrangement. They already have Jericho and Moxley signed to separate deals. Kenny and I believe the Bucks are still under contract however they are not using them due to bad blood over their NJPW exits.
> 
> NJPW is a threat to AEW rather than an ally. If NJPW gets their American venture up and running by the time Moxley's AEW deal is up, he's as good as gone.


These were Jericho’s last dates for the time being

and now way in hell Mox is leaving - they bout to give him the ball


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## Bloody Warpath (Jan 6, 2020)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> These were Jericho’s last dates for the time being
> 
> and now way in hell Mox is leaving - they bout to give him the ball


Maybe the prospext of performing more than once a week is what entices him to leave? If NJPW establishes some sort of TV deal in the US, will Khan still allow him and Jericho to work NJPW but only shows that take place in Japan? Or would it be too risky since NJPW could still air footage if him. It could be a slippery slope.


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Bloody Warpath said:


> Maybe the prospext of performing more than once a week is what entices him to leave? If NJPW establishes some sort of TV deal in the US, will Khan still allow him and Jericho to work NJPW but only shows that take place in Japan? Or would it be too risky since NJPW could still air footage if him. It could be a slippery slope.


what makes you think NJPW will run more than one weekly show though? They'll be in the same boat as AEW is currently.

Moxley is getting that money playing his own character and writing his own promos. He also gets to spend time with his family. Sounds like a win win to me.


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## Bloody Warpath (Jan 6, 2020)

optikk sucks said:


> what makes you think NJPW will run more than one weekly show though? They'll be in the same boat as AEW is currently.
> 
> Moxley is getting that money playing his own character and writing his own promos. He also gets to spend time with his family. Sounds like a win win to me.


I am guessing there will only be one weekly show that most likely will not be live. But NJPW runs a lot more shows on a yearly basis than AEW. I would not be surprised that there would be a good bit of cross-talent use between Japan and the LA Dojo. Will be interesting to see how it plays out.


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## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

imthegame19 said:


> Yeah there's no deal with New Japan and AEW now. Hopefully this is step one of partnership maybe a year or so down the line.


I've said this elsewhere but I would actually be against a formal partnership UNLESS AEW started to be like NJPW. This is kind of selfish of me but NJPW is easily my favorite promotion and I would personally like it if AEW was more like them. All in all though I want what's best for business so if the majority of fans want something else and it grows the companies then I'm all for it.



Benoit's Weight Machine said:


> I wouldn't hold my breath for any sort of deal between the two companies. NJPW has nothing significant to gain from a formal arrangement. They already have Jericho and Moxley signed to separate deals. Kenny and I believe the Bucks are still under contract however they are not using them due to bad blood over their NJPW exits.
> 
> NJPW is a threat to AEW rather than an ally. If NJPW gets their American venture up and running by the time Moxley's AEW deal is up, he's as good as gone.


I mostly agree although NJPW could gain from the TV exposure. Imagine getting their guys on TNT, it would help grow their NJPW: USA brand quite well. But it's for this reason that I don't think they will do anything together except for maybe make a couple joint shows and share talent on occasion. I doubt they will do a full on partnership.



optikk sucks said:


> what makes you think NJPW will run more than one weekly show though? They'll be in the same boat as AEW is currently.
> 
> Moxley is getting that money playing his own character and writing his own promos. He also gets to spend time with his family. Sounds like a win win to me.





Bloody Warpath said:


> I am guessing there will only be one weekly show that most likely will not be live. But NJPW runs a lot more shows on a yearly basis than AEW. I would not be surprised that there would be a good bit of cross-talent use between Japan and the LA Dojo. Will be interesting to see how it plays out.


Whoa whoa whoa now let's slow down a bit. NJPW: USA is not going to be doing television at all or anytime soon at least. They will still keep to the touring schedule but will tour inbetween the Japanese tours. They are starting it with their New Beginning in the USA tour. From what I understand they will have shows pretty much all year round now instead of all year with a 2-4 weeks between each tour. We'll be getting a constant IV drip of our NJPW crack.


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## TD Stinger (May 9, 2012)

_*



"That was just a rumor. Nothing is happening. I think [Chris] did that to get the internet to talk a bit more about the situation. The door has not opened up at all. We wish them luck in what they're doing. A lot of our friends work in NJPW and if something came along, we'd be open, but nothing is happening right now,"

Click to expand...

*_


> said Nick Jackson.


So yeah, there's that.

On one hand you could look at what they did at WK as a a positive. The AEW stars were made to look good, commentary referenced AEW with deep insight on them, they did a close up of the AEW Championship.

But at the same time, you can look deeper into all of those things. Yeah, Jericho and Mox won all their matches. But they already had history with NJPW before this show. Hell, Mox won his 1st title during his 1st match in AEW. Chances are they always would have won their matches. And as much as NJPW talked about AEW going into this, that could easily be explained as them just taking advantage of the buzz for 1 night and never talking about it again.

At the end of the day, NJPW is the same company that 10 years and 10 regimes later refuse to work with Impact over not using Okada well. So I'm not expecting anything any time soon to come of this.


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## The Masked Avenger (Apr 18, 2018)

I really think people overestimate how the average American wrestling fan will take to NJPW America. The main NJPW roster will not be on these tours. You will not see Okada, Ibushi, Osprey at a lot of these shows. Maybe one offs but it will be the lower guys and North American indy wrestlers with the NJPW logo slapped on it.


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## 304418 (Jul 2, 2014)

It’s obvious to me at this point that there being no alliance between AEW and NJPW is PC talk. The spoiler that proves this is Dragon Lee working WK14 this past weekend. It’s significant because Dragon Lee has both worked with AAA and is a part of Los Faccion Ingobernable, a new Los Ingobernables faction created by Rush in AAA that has a branch in ROH. We know that a NJPW-AAA partnership will never happen because it would upset NJPW's current partners CMLL, but CMLL is probably okay with NJPW using a single wrestler from AAA only, especially one that is working for another NJPW partner in ROH. It’s probably a similar case with AEW; a full partnership with them would upset ROH (even though ROH looks like they’re near the end), so NJPW gets around that by using only a couple of AEW stars, those being Jericho and Moxley.

Basically there will be no AEW vs New Japan World Order kind of scenarios for fans to tune into on a weekly basis on Dynamite. I don’t even know if that’s a bad thing, because both promotions only need certain stars.

AEW would benefit from Okada, Tanahashi, Ibushi, Ishii, Goto, Ospreay, Suzukigun (Suzuki, Zack Sabre Jr, Archer), Bullet Club (Jay White, KENTA, GoD, and maybe Fale, Ishimorii and ELP), and LIJ.

NJPW would benefit from Omega, Cody, Young Bucks, Lucha Bros, Hager, Spears, and SCU, alongside Jericho and Moxley. There are a bunch of maybes too, with Guevara, Sabian, the tag team division in general, and the women division in general for the purpose of women’s matches that can be aired during WK and for US/UK tours to face stars from Stardom only.

Plus AEW themes being altered during NJPWWorld streams are going to be annoying AF to deal with anyways.




BigCy said:


> I've said this elsewhere but I would actually be against a formal partnership UNLESS AEW started to be like NJPW. This is kind of selfish of me but NJPW is easily my favorite promotion and I would personally like it if AEW was more like them. All in all though I want what's best for business so if the majority of fans want something else and it grows the companies then I'm all for it.


I agree here. I feel that an NJPW influence is the only thing that will prevent AEW from repeating the mistakes of WCW and TNA. A lot of my suggestions are influenced by Japan, from presentation to new ideas to video games for this very reason.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Who from AEW would New Japan realistically want? I mean, they can book Omega if they want to. There's no reason an Ibushi vs. Omega match or Okada vs. Omega V can't happen. The TV exposure might be good, but at this point are AEW kind of preaching to their own choir? Is there anybody who would watch Dynamite and think "Yeah, I'm going to go to that New Japan house show in Nashville?" 

I've heard Alvarez say that New Japan needs the deal more than AEW, but I really don't think they do. New Japan's cards for the American shows actually look really solid. I'm not sure TNT exposure or getting Jericho and/or Moxley for them is really going to appreciably push them into a new threshold. They'll be fine filling those venues and they're not going to go bigger. Jericho and Mox would just be gravy.


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## Jazminator (Jan 9, 2018)

I would like to see PNP beat down Omega, and then have Omega bring in Kota Ibushi to tag with him against the duo. That would be pretty cool to see.

Also, I'd love to see Will Ospreay in AEW, if only for a short run.


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## Jazminator (Jan 9, 2018)

Cody recently did an interview with the New York Post. Very interesting! A snippet:



> I think the thing that was strange to me was people were asking for this partnership. I don’t know what a partnership would look like other than what you saw. Chris Jericho was part of one of the main events of Wrestle Kingdom, Jon Moxley as well. They both were successful. What did he call it? The forbidden door?
> 
> The forbidden door. It may be forbidden, but clearly the door is opening and closing and opening and closing. It’s public knowledge that some guys here, myself included, have exemptions to work New Japan Pro-Wrestling. But I know that New Japan Pro-Wrestling’s focus is New Japan and AEW’s focus is AEW.
> 
> ...


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## Chairshot620 (Mar 12, 2010)

Tokyo Dome and Wrestle Kingdom both got mentioned in the last segment of Dynamite last night. Keeping my fingers crossed. 


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