# Omega stole the AEW World Title



## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

A pale imitation of CM Punk in the WWE.


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## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Fucking great match.

Interested to see where this ends up - I still think this is more than just Impact and it all somehow leads to Japan.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

That finish was shit, imagine beating your year+ undefeated in singles competition world champion via a fucking microphone. This is the shit people still mock WCW about when it comes to Goldberg's first loss. That was dumb. 

Getting hype about the Impact partnership I'd get (though most here were dismissive of it until 20 minutes ago). But that finish wasn't great. Match was still damn good. But that finish was pretty damn dumb.


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## Raye (Jul 23, 2018)

Wolf Mark said:


> A pale imitation of CM Punk in the WWE.


How? Lmao dude this is why I don't come to this forum much at all anymore, the level of intellect is on the decline more and more every year.


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## midgetlover69 (Nov 27, 2016)

Im not seeing how they "stole" anything. That was the most minimal interference as you can get in wrestling and they act like they did this man dirty all of a sudden?


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## Raye (Jul 23, 2018)

RapShepard said:


> That finish was shit, imagine beating your year+ undefeated in singles competition world champion via a fucking microphone. This is the shit people still mock WCW about when it comes to Goldberg's first loss. That was dumb.
> 
> Getting hype about the Impact partnership I'd get (though most here were dismissive of it until 20 minutes ago). But that finish wasn't great. Match was still damn good. But that finish was pretty damn dumb.


He didn't "just hit him with a microphone". He hit him with like 6 V-Triggers and one of the most protected finishers in wrestling, but ok.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Oh and I told y'all Tony will be a character. They made sure to mention he blew Tony off lol


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## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

Imagine ending a year long undefeated title reign and then doing the follow up angle on a dead promotions show on AXS TV which most people probably dont even know they have in their cable package.


And people actually defend it and mark for it. I feel like im in an alternate dimension here. Can someone help me understand? What am I missing?


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## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

Raye said:


> How? Lmao dude this is why I don't come to this forum much at all anymore, the level of intellect is on the decline more and more every year.


Poor baby. This is exactly what it is, though. Punk won the WWE title as his contract in the WWE run out and he left in the crowd! And then he showed up with it at different places. It was much better and more realistic than this. 

It made sense cause Punk was already pissed off with the WWE too. Compared to here where the finish sucked and we know for sure that TK must have a partnership with Impact and Kenny is an executive at AEW so it's all make-believe.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Raye said:


> He didn't "just hit him with a microphone". He hit him with like 6 V-Triggers and one of the most protected finishers in wrestling, but ok.


And Goldberg got Jackknifed after the stun gun shot, nobody ever mentions that. They mention the absurdity of beating a champ in such a way. Beating Moxley via a microphone is fucking dumb. That's what happened he got hit with a microphone of all weapons and was done for. Shit was bad


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Wolf Mark said:


> A pale imitation of CM Punk in the WWE.


That's the only thing you took away from it? lol



RapShepard said:


> That finish was shit, imagine beating your year+ undefeated in singles competition world champion via a fucking microphone. This is the shit people still mock WCW about when it comes to Goldberg's first loss. That was dumb.
> 
> Getting hype about the Impact partnership I'd get (though most here were dismissive of it until 20 minutes ago). But that finish wasn't great. Match was still damn good. But that finish was pretty damn dumb.


You're tripping bro that shit was awesome, he didn't win with a mic lol why do you keep saying that, he won because he hit 5 V Triggers and a One Winged Angel. The mic started it. This makes Kenny a true heel and it expands the AEW Universe. Now they also have a reason to do Mox/Omega III at Revolution.


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## midgetlover69 (Nov 27, 2016)

Raye said:


> He didn't "just hit him with a microphone". He hit him with like 6 V-Triggers and one of the most protected finishers in wrestling, but ok.


ok so why the fuck are they running off like they just pulled off mission impossible 9? Tf do they need to explain??


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## Raye (Jul 23, 2018)

RapShepard said:


> And Goldberg got Jackknifed after the stun gun shot, nobody ever mentions that. They mention the absurdity of beating a champ in such a way. Beating Moxley via a microphone is fucking dumb. That's what happened he got hit with a microphone of all weapons and was done for. Shit was bad


Let me bash your head with a microphone and let me see how okay you are after?


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## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

midgetlover69 said:


> ok so why the fuck are they running off like they just pulled off mission impossible 9? Tf do they need to explain??


Because Jon Moxley would probably try to kill them?


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

RapShepard said:


> And Goldberg got Jackknifed after the stun gun shot, nobody ever mentions that. They mention the absurdity of beating a champ in such a way. Beating Moxley via a microphone is fucking dumb. That's what happened he got hit with a microphone of all weapons and was done for. Shit was bad


No its just heel shit, how many title reigns have you praised in WWE that have all ended with fuck finishes lol


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## bigwrestlingfan22 (May 19, 2015)

That was really really bad. Why did the announcers react perfectly normal right after the match ended then within 2 minutes were claiming it was the biggest screw job ever? Then wtf was going on with Kingston? Who booked this shit.


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## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Imagine ending a year long undefeated title reign and then doing the follow up angle on a dead promotions show on AXS TV which most people probably dont even know they have in their cable package.
> 
> 
> And people actually defend it and mark for it. I feel like im in an alternate dimension here. Can someone help me understand? What am I missing?



Can ANYONE help me here?


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## midgetlover69 (Nov 27, 2016)

Geeee said:


> Because Jon Moxley would probably try to kill them?


LOL WHAT? He just knocked him the fuck out and pinned him


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## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

RapShepard said:


> And Goldberg got Jackknifed after the stun gun shot, nobody ever mentions that. They mention the absurdity of beating a champ in such a way. Beating Moxley via a microphone is fucking dumb. That's what happened he got hit with a microphone of all weapons and was done for. Shit was bad


To be fair, no one gave a shit that Goldberg got stun gunned at the time - I remember LOADS of people thinking it made Goldberg look like a badass that it took a stun gun and a jackknife to put him away with loads of people excited as to what could happen going forward.

It wasn't until the whole thing was booked like shit going forward that gimmicks like the stun gun got laughed at.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

prosperwithdeen said:


> You're tripping bro that shit was awesome, he didn't win with a mic lol why do you keep saying that, he won because he hit 5 V Triggers and a One Winged Angel. The mic started it. This makes Kenny a true heel and it expands the AEW Universe. Now they also have a reason to do Mox/Omega III at Revolution.


Because that's what it was, he lost via microphone. Let's put it like this, if come TLC AJ's body guard distracted Drew McIntrye and then he got hit with a Phenomenal Forearm, nobody's saying "Drew lost via Phenomenal Forearm" we're saying he lost via distraction.


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## midgetlover69 (Nov 27, 2016)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Can ANYONE help me here?


feel like they wrote this in 10 minutes


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Raye said:


> Let me bash your head with a microphone and let me see how okay you are after?


Hmm, what would hurt more, a microphone, a steel chair, or being thrown into a portable industrial heater? I will take the mic any day.


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## La Parka (Oct 28, 2008)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Can ANYONE help me here?


Everything AEW does is amazing. 

Always.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Raye said:


> Let me bash your head with a microphone and let me see how okay you are after?


We've seen Moxley survive way worse than getting hit with a fucking microphone, you're reaching here. Of wrestling weapons to end a match this is up here with Chyna getting knocked out via book to the head.


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Can ANYONE help me here?


You're missing a mind that won't let itself be entertained. This ending creates controversy and it creates a heel turn that is must-see. Tony working with NWA and Impact then most likely NJPW will change the industry. Partnerships like this were impossible before. Jesus you people are miserable sometimes lol.


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## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

midgetlover69 said:


> LOL WHAT? He just knocked him the fuck out and pinned him


Well I think Kenny is setting the stage for being a Ric Flair-esque heel character. He's gonna be running from babyfaces for a while


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

prosperwithdeen said:


> No its just heel shit, how many title reigns have you praised in WWE that have all ended with fuck finishes lol


Heel shit is fine, it's the fucking microphone that's hilarious. Of all the things they could've used brass knuckles, a chair, a low blow, a gun, a fireball (that would've been fire actually) they went with microphone. That's why it's hilarious. We've seen Moxley go through tables, chairs, and stages. But a microphone is his undoing.


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## bigwrestlingfan22 (May 19, 2015)

Seriously can anyone explain why the announcers acted like it was a legit normal title win at first then two minutes later started claiming it was the biggest screwjob in wrestling history?


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## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

prosperwithdeen said:


> That's the only thing you took away from it? lol


Well yes. AEW are supposed to be original. Them doing this is essentialy your kid brother trying to do a lay up in your living room in a small net aftter you did one for real in the gymnasium at school during a real Basketball match.

Also if you want a great power meaningful swerve watch Bobby Roode-James Storm in 2012 when Roode turned heel. Now THAT was a well executed swerve. Esp. since we never saw that coming. Whereas AEW waited so long for Omega to turn that we always expected it. And THIS was it? yawn


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## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

prosperwithdeen said:


> You're missing a mind that won't let itself be entertained. This ending creates controversy and it creates a heel turn that is must-see. Tony working with NWA and Impact then most likely NJPW will change the industry. Partnerships like this were impossible before. Jesus you people are miserable sometimes lol.


Wrestling is not a logical thing, but that doesnt mean moronic shit should just be swallowed for the fuck of it. You can have partnership with them without giving them the first appearance of your new world champ who just broke a year long title reign. Its dumb. Why do I have to not call it dumb?


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## midgetlover69 (Nov 27, 2016)

bigwrestlingfan22 said:


> Seriously can anyone explain why the announcers acted like it was a legit normal title win at first then two minutes later started claiming it was the biggest screwjob in wrestling history?


Shit just doesnt make sense LOL

It was a normal ass match


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Erik. said:


> To be fair, no one gave a shit that Goldberg got stun gunned at the time - I remember LOADS of people thinking it made Goldberg look like a badass that it took a stun gun and a jackknife to put him away with loads of people excited as to what could happen going forward.
> 
> It wasn't until the whole thing was booked like shit going forward that gimmicks like the stun gun got laughed at.


I'll take your word I was 7 so I thought that was bull shit. I just know as far as our bubble it's super mocked despite the fact that hey that's a reasonable way to stop a monster. 

I don't think Moxley is ruined he's Moxley. But I don't think him getting laid out with a microphone is what they should've gone with


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

RapShepard said:


> Because that's what it was, he lost via microphone. Let's put it like this, if come TLC AJ's body guard distracted Drew McIntrye and then he got hit with a Phenomenal Forearm, nobody's saying "Drew lost via Phenomenal Forearm" we're saying he lost via distraction.


If he wins with a Phenomenal Forearm immediately after then yes, but if he hits a Styles Clash twice and 2 Phenomenal Forearms after and makes it stretch for a couple minutes, then no its not because of the big guy. So essentially, yes the mic hurt, but if he had tried to pin him after, he would have kicked out. So hitting 5 V Triggers and the most protected finisher in wrestling after the mic changes all that.



bigwrestlingfan22 said:


> Seriously can anyone explain why the announcers acted like it was a legit normal title win at first then two minutes later started claiming it was the biggest screwjob in wrestling history?


Because they were speechless at what was transpiring?


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## midgetlover69 (Nov 27, 2016)

prosperwithdeen said:


> You're missing a mind that won't let itself be entertained. This ending creates controversy and it creates a heel turn that is must-see. Tony working with NWA and Impact then most likely NJPW will change the industry. Partnerships like this were impossible before. Jesus you people are miserable sometimes lol.


I actually liked what they are going for but the execution makes zero sense


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## Thomazbr (Apr 26, 2009)

I thought the mic thing worked. People always say its the one glancing strike that you aren't expecting that fucks you up, and that kinda dazed Moxley enough that the for sure kill barrage that followed felt decisive enough but clearly like heelish enough because Kenny for sure after all that talk about gentleman's agreement cheated to win.
I also dug the two chair Necro Butcher spot. Choose Death.

However I'm not too excited for the Impact partnership. Out of that roster I only really like The North. I really don't care about the Knockout's Division but I guess that's something that Tony Khan has to look to fulfill whatever promise he made relating woman's wrestling.

well that's my 2cents I guess.


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## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

RapShepard said:


> I'll take your word I was 7 so I thought that was bull shit. I just know as far as our bubble it's super mocked despite the fact that hey that's a reasonable way to stop a monster.
> 
> I don't think Moxley is ruined he's Moxley. But I don't think him getting laid out with a microphone is what they should've gone with


Yeah - it's mocked because of what came afterwards.

The Finger Poke of Doom was literally a few weeks later - they could have done so many things. Instead they did the FPOD, nWo reunions and just stupid gimmicky bullshit that meant Goldberg getting stungunned before the finish sort of got lumbered into it as something hokey and bullshit. Whereas if booking was smart and storylines were logical for the next few months after, it would have been looked at in a better light (in my view).

Come on, losing to a fucking stun gun is pretty cool way to go out.


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## Raye (Jul 23, 2018)

Wolf Mark said:


> Poor baby. This is exactly what it is, though. Punk won the WWE title as his contract in the WWE run out and he left in the crowd! And then he showed up with it at different places. It was much better and more realistic than this.
> 
> It made sense cause Punk was already pissed off with the WWE too. Compared to here where the finish sucked and we know for sure that TK must have a partnership with Impact and Kenny is an executive at AEW so it's all make-believe.


Kennys contract isn't running out? Wrestlers showing up on a diff show isn't exclusive to CM Punk? You must've just started watching this year lmao, it's ok kid


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## Raye (Jul 23, 2018)

RapShepard said:


> We've seen Moxley survive way worse than getting hit with a fucking microphone, you're reaching here. Of wrestling weapons to end a match this is up here with Chyna getting knocked out via book to the head.


Damn bro you're right, Kenny should have used a gun


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## Scissor Me Daddy-O!! (Apr 13, 2011)

There was an unsatisfying bit of interference, but it had a purpose to allow Kenny and Don to escape.

If this turns into a full partnership and war then we'll all look back on the finish with rose colored glasses.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Erik. said:


> Yeah - it's mocked because of what came afterwards.
> 
> The Finger Poke of Doom was literally a few weeks later - they could have done so many things. Instead they did the FPOD, nWo reunions and just stupid gimmicky bullshit that meant Goldberg getting stungunned before the finish sort of got lumbered into it as something hokey and bullshit. Whereas if booking was smart and storylines were logical for the next few months after, it would have been looked at in a better light (in my view).
> 
> Come on, losing to a fucking stun gun is pretty cool way to go out.


I get it as the payoff ended up shitty. But my main point is until tonight I've never seen so much ignoring of the fuckery that caused the finish lol



Raye said:


> Damn bro you're right, Kenny should have used a gun


I've been advocating the use of guns for months. But yeah that would've been much better than "Moxley is dead from a microphone"


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Wolf Mark said:


> Well yes. AEW are supposed to be original. Them doing this is essentialy your kid brother trying to do a lay up in your living room in a small net aftter you did one for real in the gymnasium at school during a real Basketball match.
> 
> Also if you want a great power meaningful swerve watch Bobby Roode-James Storm in 2012 when Roode turned heel. Now THAT was a well executed swerve. Esp. since we never saw that coming. Whereas AEW waited so long for Omega to turn that we always expected it. And THIS was it? yawn


How is this not original? Punk wasn't actually going to go to another show for one. Omega is this Tuesday. Tonight's match didn't have the stipulation that Punk/Cena had, it was just a major angle they decided to run. Nothing about the build up suggested that Omega was running away with the gold. It was just something that happened in the moment. This is way different from the Punk angle. 



RainmakerV2 said:


> Wrestling is not a logical thing, but that doesnt mean moronic shit should just be swallowed for the fuck of it. You can have partnership with them without giving them the first appearance of your new world champ who just broke a year long title reign. Its dumb. Why do I have to not call it dumb?


Having Omega show up on Impact real quick and running a mega heel angle from it is moronic? Mox lost via fuckery and it sets up a third match. 

Stuff like this never happens. Omega won the gold and he going to a different show. This is wild and fresh in the world of wrestling and you can't enjoy it. That's crazy.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

prosperwithdeen said:


> If he wins with a Phenomenal Forearm immediately after then yes, but if he hits a Styles Clash twice and 2 Phenomenal Forearms after and makes it stretch for a couple minutes, then no its not because of the big guy. So essentially, yes the mic hurt, but if he had tried to pin him after, he would have kicked out. So hitting 5 V Triggers and the most protected finisher in wrestling after the mic changes all that.


He was only able to hit all of that because of why? If this was like Thunder Rosa vs Serena were he hit Moxley then Moxley went back on offense I'd agree. But he got clocked then hit with Sigs and finishers. So that's on the mic. 

Again I don't think he's dead, but holy hell I'm not agreeing with anybody saying the mic wasn't silly.


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## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Garbage and low rent budget partnership im sorry. Impact from what i remember went down hill lately. Some may fancy up to the women vs men angles they have, but that is what turned me off from Impact wrestling, along with the silly weed smoker team and RVD's chick acting trashy.


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## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

prosperwithdeen said:


> How is this not original? Punk wasn't actually going to go to another show for one. Omega is this Tuesday. Tonight's match didn't have the stipulation that Punk/Cena had, it was just a major angle they decided to run. Nothing about the build up suggested that Omega was running away with the gold. It was just something that happened in the moment. This is way different from the Punk angle.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Its a dead promotion on AXS TV thats currently held in a setting with zero fans virtual or real and the atmosphere of an empty church. It is utterly stupid to give them that type of publicity when they have nothing to give you back. Rich Swann is their world champ. Give me a fuckin break.


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## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Imagine ending a year long undefeated title reign and then doing the follow up angle on a dead promotions show on AXS TV which most people probably dont even know they have in their cable package.
> 
> 
> And people actually defend it and mark for it. I feel like im in an alternate dimension here. Can someone help me understand? What am I missing?


Not missing anything. You are right.


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Impact Wrestling has nothing though. I don't see what AEW gains from it. It only helps out Impact. I mean I guess it's good for the wrestlers for job security and the like. But Impact's roster is pretty crud.


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## midgetlover69 (Nov 27, 2016)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Impact Wrestling has nothing though. I don't see what AEW gains from it. It only helps out Impact. I mean I guess it's good for the wrestlers for job security and the like. But Impact's roster is pretty crud.


I swear to god they are just doing this because it sounds cool

Tony must have come up with this the other night


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## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

Raye said:


> Kennys contract isn't running out? Wrestlers showing up on a diff show isn't exclusive to CM Punk? You must've just started watching this year lmao, it's ok kid


 The way it was done is pretty much a rip off on what happened with Punk, though. Not Medusa! lol And yes Kenny is still under contract. 

What I mean is that there's no way for anybody to believe this is not an angle. And of course TK probably has a deal with Impact. That is what made the Punk incident work so well, cause there was a possibility that it could be real. 

Another time where it worked well was when AJ Styles won the TNA title and left the company. He also didn't have a contract. And the amazing thing was he never resigned with them after.


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## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

Wolf Mark said:


> The way it was done is pretty much a rip off on what happened with Punk, though. Not Medusa! lol And yes Kenny is still under contract.
> 
> What I mean is that there's no way for anybody to believe this is not an angle. And of course TK probably has a deal with Impact. That is what made the Punk incident work so well, cause there was a possibility that it could be real.
> 
> Another time where it worked well was when AJ Styles won the TNA title and left the company. He also didn't have a contract. And the amazing thing was he never resigned with them after.


I don't think they were hinting that Kenny Omega was leaving AEW?


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## MarkOfAllMarks (Apr 7, 2018)

He didn't lose via microphone. Holy shit some of you are ridiculous. He stunned him with the microphone just enough to finish the job with the v trigger into one winged angel. Some of you act like he got pinned straight after the microphone shot with no more offense.


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## Whoanma (Apr 5, 2016)

MarkOfAllMarks said:


> He didn't lose via microphone. Holy shit some of you are ridiculous. He stunned him with the microphone just enough to finish the job *with the v trigger* into one winged angel. Some of you act like he got pinned straight after the microphone shot with no more offense.


With the V-Trigger*s*.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

A few things:

1. This section for months (And possibly years) has been criticising Impact Wrestling saying it's poorly run, looks bad, glorified independent etc. I gave them a chance and liked the product for 2-3 weeks earlier in the year then bailed when they started doing Wrestle House but a large majority of the people here shit on me for it.

Now AEW and Impact are working together and suddenly this is awesome news and Impact is great. So...which one was it? Is Impact irrelevant and bad or is Impact relevant and good but people were giving me a hard time for no reason before?

2. How has Don Callis of all people suddenly become this second coming of Paul Heyman? I love Don Callis but I legit saw someone in another thread say that at one stage he was one of the best microphone workers in the world. It's Don Callis not The Rock, people have lost their minds over this.

3. As someone else pointed out, Omega celebrating his title win (Plus the possible confrontation with Mox) plus Sting talking next week plus whatever else they've got going on would have been great for their ratings. Why give this to Impact?


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Its a dead promotion on AXS TV thats currently held in a setting with zero fans virtual or real and the atmosphere of an empty church. It is utterly stupid to give them that type of publicity when they have nothing to give you back. Rich Swann is their world champ. Give me a fuckin break.


So what if Tony just wants to help Impact and the industry as a whole? Is that a catastrophic mindset to have? Why does it always have to be about what this or that person can give you in return?

That's where we have a disconnect in the way we perceive this and possibly life in general. It's OK to help a dead promotion. AEW doesn't gain anything but they don't lose anything either. But the industry is healthier for it. Fans will be back eventually so getting them exposure now is only good for them. 

You're acting like Omega is going to Impact permanently. He's going for an angle and he'll be right back on Dynamite to continue the Moxley feud or whatever.


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## ElTerrible (Feb 8, 2004)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Impact Wrestling has nothing though. I don't see what AEW gains from it. It only helps out Impact. I mean I guess it's good for the wrestlers for job security and the like. But Impact's roster is pretty crud.


That´s why I said Kenny needs to steal some talent from AEW and bring them into a new independent group that just go where they want, whenever they want. Doesn´t matter Impact, Dynamite, NWA, NJPW.

AEW needs to pick some of their own underutilized talent and sende them with Kenny to sell the betrayal. And then Hangman makes the perfect AEW icon to chase Omega all over the world to bring the belt back to Dynamite permanently.


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## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

prosperwithdeen said:


> How is this not original? Punk wasn't actually going to go to another show for one. Omega is this Tuesday. Tonight's match didn't have the stipulation that Punk/Cena had, it was just a major angle they decided to run. Nothing about the build up suggested that Omega was running away with the gold. It was just something that happened in the moment. This is way different from the Punk angle.


It's not completely like the Punk angle cause the Punk angle actually had a lot of meat to the bone. The only reason it's not completely like the Punk thing is cause AEW are lazy, always been, there is nothing to what they are doing. So all we are left to the Punk angle is the guy winning and leaving stealing the belt to appear on another place. Which is not very original.

Also what is the point? Wrestlers are cheating all the time. Ric Flair has been doing it for years. Kenny doesn't have to leave just cause he won by trickery lol


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## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

prosperwithdeen said:


> So what if Tony just wants to help Impact and the industry as a whole? Is that a catastrophic mindset to have? Why does it always have to be about what this or that person can give you in return?
> 
> That's where we have a disconnect in the way we perceive this and possibly life in general. It's OK to help a dead promotion. AEW doesn't gain anything but they don't lose anything either. But the industry is healthier for it. Fans will be back eventually so getting them exposure now is only good for them.
> 
> You're acting like Omega is going to Impact permanently. He's going for an angle and he'll be right back on Dynamite to continue the Moxley feud or whatever.



You can help them but this is unnecessary. What if someone only watches Dynamite? What if they dont get AXS? What if they forget Impact is Tuesday? Why do your viewers have to watch another show to see a new champions first appearance? Thats dumb. I think you know its dumb.


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## ElTerrible (Feb 8, 2004)

Wolf Mark said:


> It's not completely like the Punk angle cause the Punk angle actually had a lot of meat to the bone. The only reason it's not completely like the Punk thing is cause AEW are lazy, always been, there is nothing to what they are doing. So all we are left to the Punk angle is the guy winning and leaving stealing the belt to appear on another company's show. Which is not very original.
> 
> Also what is the point? Wrestlers are cheating all the time. Ric Flair has been doing it for years. Kenny doesn't have to leave just cause he won by trickery lol


 WWE is so cheap, they can´t even invest some money in a VPN, so all these new WF members and avid AEW haters are all getting tagged as Canadians and Australians.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

MarkOfAllMarks said:


> He didn't lose via microphone. Holy shit some of you are ridiculous. He stunned him with the microphone just enough to finish the job with the v trigger into one winged angel. Some of you act like he got pinned straight after the microphone shot with no more offense.


Yes and HHH didn't win all those matches via interference from Evolution and Sledgehammer shots, they just gave him just enough to get in a fair pedigree [emoji23]


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## Whoanma (Apr 5, 2016)

RainmakerV2 said:


> You can help them but this is unnecessary. What if someone only watches Dynamite? What if they dont get AXS? What if they forget Impact is Tuesday? Why do your viewers have to watch another show to see a new champions first appearance? Thats dumb. I think you know its dumb.


That’s the only thing I don’t like. Forcing me to watch Impact to follow the storyline (btw, is Impact free to watch outside the States any way?).


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## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

Geeee said:


> I don't think they were hinting that Kenny Omega was leaving AEW?


But he's leaving with the title going to another show on another company. I'm betting the angle will be that Kenny is holding the belt hostage.


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## ElTerrible (Feb 8, 2004)

RainmakerV2 said:


> You can help them but this is unnecessary. What if someone only watches Dynamite? What if they dont get AXS? What if they forget Impact is Tuesday? Why do your viewers have to watch another show to see a new champions first appearance? Thats dumb. I think you know its dumb.


 Well either you want to sell an angle or you don´t. If Kenny Omega is now an actual independent contractor, then why would he care what Tony Khan thinks or what show he appears on. It´s his decision. You are mixing up the wrestling story with the real life business aspect. So maybe you lose one short-term moment, but you gain long-term.


----------



## Raye (Jul 23, 2018)

Wolf Mark said:


> The way it was done is pretty much a rip off on what happened with Punk, though. Not Medusa! lol And yes Kenny is still under contract.
> 
> What I mean is that there's no way for anybody to believe this is not an angle. And of course TK probably has a deal with Impact. That is what made the Punk incident work so well, cause there was a possibility that it could be real.
> 
> Another time where it worked well was when AJ Styles won the TNA title and left the company. He also didn't have a contract. And the amazing thing was he never resigned with them after.


I thought I could trust a Canadian fan to be a bit more intelligent tbh


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

ElTerrible said:


> Well either you want to sell an angle or you don´t. If Kenny Omega is now an actual independent contractor, then why would he care what Tony Khan thinks or what show he appears on. It´s his decision. You are mixing up the wrestling story with the real life business aspect. So maybe you lose one short-term moment, but you gain long-term.



An independent contractor? Even in Kayfabe hes one of the VPS OF THE FUCKING COMPANY. The fuck?


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Wolf Mark said:


> It's not completely like the Punk angle cause the Punk angle actually had a lot of meat to the bone. The only reason it's not completely like the Punk thing is cause AEW are lazy, always been, there is nothing to what they are doing. So all we are left to the Punk angle is the guy winning and leaving stealing the belt to appear on another place. Which is not very original.
> 
> Also what is the point? Wrestlers are cheating all the time. Ric Flair has been doing it for years. Kenny doesn't have to leave just cause he won by trickery lol


But why are you now implying that it should have been like the Punk angle through AEW not being "lazy" when you suggested at first that its wrong for them to copy?

They weren't trying to re-create the Punk angle in the first place. There aren't enough deep similarities.



RainmakerV2 said:


> You can help them but this is unnecessary. What if someone only watches Dynamite? What if they dont get AXS? What if they forget Impact is Tuesday? Why do your viewers have to watch another show to see a new champions first appearance? Thats dumb. I think you know its dumb.


Let me put it this way. If I was making the decision I would have Kenny's first appearance be on Dynamite then the 2nd on Impact, but I would definitely still have Kenny make the appearance on Impact by at least week two. Don Kallis and Kenny running away like that though makes it fine if you think about it. He's a heel who's screwing AEW.

As far as channels, they're gonna stream it like you and I did tonight.


----------



## RFalcao (Jul 11, 2011)

I think Impact Wrestling has the best women division right now.


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Whoanma said:


> That’s the only thing I don’t like. Forcing me to watch Impact to follow the storyline (btw, is Impact free to watch outside the States any way?).


This is a big problem as well. AEW just doubled their "ask" time commitment from fans.


----------



## Buster Baxter (Mar 30, 2015)

That was good match by Moxley and Omega. I've only watched impact about 1 time in the last six years and I didn't really care for it so I don't know how I feel about the crossover, I might check it out.


----------



## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

Raye said:


> I thought I could trust a Canadian fan to be a bit more intelligent tbh


The less intelligent ones are usually the ones going for insults. And you went there pretty quickly.


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

prosperwithdeen said:


> But why are you now implying that it should have been like the Punk angle through AEW not being "lazy" when you suggested at first that its wrong for them to copy?
> 
> They weren't trying to re-create the Punk angle in the first place. There aren't enough deep similarities.
> 
> ...


No, it makes no sense at all. Why would he screw over a company hes VP of that has a multi million dollar deal on TNT to help a company thats on its deathbed on AXS TV? Because Callis is his "uncle?" Miss me with that please.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Wolf Mark said:


> But he's leaving with the title going to another show on another company. I'm betting the angle will be that Kenny is holding the belt hostage.


What gave you that impression at all?

Tuesday comes before Wednesday - hence why they're going to tell the world on Tuesday. They mentioned Tuesday to shock people for a split second to say to themselves "Eh? Do you mean Wednesday?" - what they say Tuesday we'll find out.

No, holding belt hostage. No leaving with the title to go to another show on another company. It's no different to him appearing at AAA shows, like he has done or Jericho appearing at NJPW whilst the world champion.

Why would he want to leave AEW or hold the belt hostage, when he's a pretty prominent EVP of said company and now on top of it? And gets what he wants when he wants?


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

RainmakerV2 said:


> No, it makes no sense at all. Why would he screw over a company hes VP of that has a multi million dollar deal on TNT to help a company thats on its deathbed on AXS TV? Because Callis is his "uncle?" Miss me with that please.


Well Tony was yelling at him backstage as he was running away, so he's screwing them because he's running a heel angle in kayfabe. He's not actually screwing the company. You're mixing the two.


----------



## ElTerrible (Feb 8, 2004)

RainmakerV2 said:


> An independent contractor? Even in Kayfabe hes one of the VPS OF THE FUCKING COMPANY. The fuck?


Oh and you can´t quit your job anymore? That´s like illegal now? Trump did a lot of damage to America, didn´t know he also brought slavery back.


----------



## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

prosperwithdeen said:


> But why are you now implying that it should have been like the Punk angle through AEW not being "lazy" when you suggested at first that its wrong for them to copy?
> 
> They weren't trying to re-create the Punk angle in the first place. There aren't enough deep similarities.


Of course they tried to copy the Punk angle. It is the same concept, leaving with the title. What I mean is the only reason why they did not completely copy it is cause that would have taken too much effort.

Cause it takes a lot of effort and work trying to REALLY swerve the crowd and make something appear real and AEW does not have it in them to do it.


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

Fuck Kenny Omega


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

ElTerrible said:


> Oh and you can´t quit your job anymore? That´s like illegal now? Trump did a lot of damage to America, didn´t know he also brought slavery back.


Why would he risk a 7 figure job on TNT to go be on AXS TV on a near dead promotion? What the fuck? Do what?


prosperwithdeen said:


> Well Tony was yelling at him backstage as he was running away, so he's screwing them because he's running a heel angle in kayfabe. He's not actually screwing the company. You're mixing the two.


You're the one who said "hes screwing AEW." Not me.


----------



## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

Erik. said:


> What gave you that impression at all?
> 
> Tuesday comes before Wednesday - hence why they're going to tell the world on Tuesday. They mentioned Tuesday to shock people for a split second to say to themselves "Eh? Do you mean Wednesday?" - what they say Tuesday we'll find out.
> 
> ...


What is the point, then? Leave with the World title(with a supposedly pissed TK), go to Impact for one day and do a promo there, come back to Dynamite? That's it?


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Wolf Mark said:


> Of course they tried to copy the Punk angle. It is the same concept, leaving with the title. What I mean is the only reason why they did not completely copy it is cause that would have taken too much effort.
> 
> Cause it takes a lot of effort and work trying to REALLY swerve the crowd and make something appear real and AEW does not have it in them to do it.


I don't know man tonight's angle was a great swerve that felt damn real. They have been planning this angle since Kallis made his first appearance on commentary a while back. The angle here so far is that Kallis came into AEW on good terms with Tony and took some commentary appearances, but the whole time he had been planning something with Kenny. Punk had an angle with Vince McMahon not giving him what he wanted. The only parallel is running away with the title but it's not like they're not allowed to run an angle like that without it automatically being about attributed to Punk.



RainmakerV2 said:


> You're the one who said "hes screwing AEW." Not me.


In kayfabe.


----------



## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

prosperwithdeen said:


> I don't know man tonight's angle was a great swerve that felt damn real. They have been planning this angle since Kallis made his first appearance on commentary a while back. The angle here so far is that Kallis came into AEW on good terms with Tony and took some commentary appearances, but the whole time he had been planning something with Kenny. Punk had an angle with Vince McMahon not giving him what he wanted. The only parallel is running away with the title but it's not like they're not allowed to run an angle like that without it automatically being about attributed to Punk.


Well all I have to say is I'm glad you liked it, I wish I did. Maybe I'm too demanding.


----------



## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

Kenny was on the phone the other week when Marvez interviewed him leaving the building - some suspected that was to Callis. Mox was jumped, probably by an assassin(s) sent by Callis... the Good Brothers?

It's the old 'sold his soul to the devil' storyline, probably stemming from doubts he could beat Mox clean and knowing if he didn't win the title here, then he'd never return to his former heights.

Kenny hasn't seceded from AEW is my thinking, he's just formed a pact with a devious mind who ensured he won the title... and now wants Kenny on his show in return. Omega and Callis have a long history so it does make sense and it will also help Kenny if Callis can be his mouthpiece, as he's a very effective scumbag heel.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Wolf Mark said:


> What is the point, then? Leave with the World title(with a supposedly pissed TK), go to Impact for one day and do a promo there, come back to Dynamite? That's it?


Why don't you just fucking watch how it unfolds?

Show's barely been off the air for an hour.

People fucking bitch and moan about storylines in wrestling - yet some idiots can't even wait 6 days to see how one of them unfolds.


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

Erik. said:


> Why don't you just fucking watch how it unfolds?
> 
> Show's barely been off the air for an hour.
> 
> People fucking bitch and moan about storylines in wrestling - yet some idiots can't even wait 6 days to see how one of them unfolds.



Who cares how it unfolds when its not on their show?


----------



## Undertaker23RKO (Jun 11, 2011)

So is Mox going to take time off or go nuts?


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Who cares how it unfolds when its not on their show?


Everyone who is a fan of AEW. People are going to Youtube the segment or stream it.


----------



## Whoanma (Apr 5, 2016)

I think Impact can be watched for free on Twitch. Nice.


----------



## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

Erik. said:


> Why don't you just fucking watch how it unfolds?
> 
> Show's barely been off the air for an hour.
> 
> People fucking bitch and moan about storylines in wrestling - yet some idiots can't even wait 6 days to see how one of them unfolds.


Well AEW has lost my confidence has far development of storylines. Hopefully this one doesn't take forever. It's like their matches, it takes forever and when the finish happens I don't care.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Wolf Mark said:


> Well AEW has lost my confidence has far development of storylines. Hopefully this one doesn't take forever. It's like their matches, it takes forever and when the finish happens I don't care.


Yet, you still watch.

Good going. You're more of a fool than I originally gave credit for.


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

prosperwithdeen said:


> Everyone who is a fan of AEW. People are going to Youtube the segment or stream it.



So Impact gets a bump in YouTube views for a week. Okay?


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Undertaker23RKO said:


> So is Mox going to take time off or go nuts?


Revolution is still pretty far away, I think he takes time off first then comes back to go nuts for Mox/Omega III.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

RainmakerV2 said:


> So Impact gets a bump in YouTube views for a week. Okay?


Youtube, illegal streams, Twitch, etc. Exposure through 3+ mediums.

They just need to make sure they put on a banger of a show to retain some people who are fans of indy wrestling. Then when crowds return, I'm sure more people will be willing to give them a chance if they do. I have never watched a full episode of Impact, but I will be doing so this Tuesday. I have been looking for an excuse as to why I should give them a watch. I hear the womens division is great. How many more like me? I'm sure theres a good amount.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Undertaker23RKO said:


> So is Mox going to take time off or go nuts?


Does anybody know how far along she is? If she's like 2 to 3 months pregnant he could leave after revolution and she'd still have 3-4 months to go


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

prosperwithdeen said:


> Revolution is still pretty far away, I think he takes time off first then comes back to go nuts for Mox/Omega III.


Revolution is in Feb, right?

I reckon Moxley takes time off to spend time with his wife - however, I am not sure the baby will even be born by then, so will be interesting to see what happens. Moxley is an EXCELLENT chaser and seeing a pissed off Moxley want back at Omega for the outcome of this match could be really fucking good.

I think even if we do get Omega/Moxley III - Omega will go over anyway.




RapShepard said:


> Does anybody know how far along she is? If she's like 2 to 3 months pregnant he could leave after revolution and she'd still have 3-4 months to go


I reckon, just through experience and guessing based on bump, she's probably close to 4 months. Meaning about 5 months to go. That takes it up to May, right in time for Double or Nothing...


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

Undertaker23RKO said:


> So is Mox going to take time off or go nuts?


I want to see Mox hunt down Kenny to the ends of the earth. Every promotion.


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Can ANYONE help me here?



Youu can't help people that actually still believe wins and loses matter


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Erik. said:


> Revolution is in Feb, right?
> 
> I reckon Moxley takes time off to spend time with his wife - however, I am not sure the baby will even be born by then, so will be interesting to see what happens. Moxley is an EXCELLENT chaser and seeing a pissed off Moxley want back at Omega for the outcome of this match could be really fucking good.
> 
> I think even if we do get Omega/Moxley III - Omega will go over anyway.


Yep February 27th I believe, 3 full months way essentially. Mox is definitely an amazing chaser. I can't wait to see how pissed off the guy will be whenever he shows up next. It's gonna feel like the night he debuted, just out for blood. Imagine they re-create that one segment (in a slightly different way of course) with Omega turning around slowly to see a pissed off Mox behind him. Holy shit.


----------



## Undertaker23RKO (Jun 11, 2011)

RapShepard said:


> Does anybody know how far along she is? If she's like 2 to 3 months pregnant he could leave after revolution and she'd still have 3-4 months to go


She doesn't look that pregnant but who knows.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Undertaker23RKO said:


> She doesn't look that pregnant but who knows.


Then he should probably be around a good while. I know Becky announced hers after MitB and she didn't have a baby bump and Seth just left the week before last. But maybe Mox is a better dad and leaves earlier lol


----------



## Klitschko (May 24, 2020)

RapShepard said:


> That finish was shit, imagine beating your year+ undefeated in singles competition world champion via a fucking microphone. This is the shit people still mock WCW about when it comes to Goldberg's first loss. That was dumb.
> 
> Getting hype about the Impact partnership I'd get (though most here were dismissive of it until 20 minutes ago). But that finish wasn't great. Match was still damn good. But that finish was pretty damn dumb.


I must have missed the part where Moxley got pinned right after he took that microphone shot. But I kind of see your point.


----------



## PhenomenalOne11 (Oct 2, 2016)

Finish was underwhelming as hell, pretty sub par match in my opinion, not a fan of Kenny as champion, he's not the kind of guy you want at the top of the company.


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

PhenomenalOne11 said:


> Finish was underwhelming as hell, pretty sub par match in my opinion, not a fan of Kenny as champion, he's not the kind of guy you want at the top of the company.



I agree, but SuperMox was stale as shit. It was time.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Klitschko said:


> I must have missed the part where Moxley got pinned right after he took that microphone shot. But I kind of see your point.


When have wrestling fans ever deemphasized the cheap shot that lead to the finish? This is a brand new thing people are trying to night. Kenny doesn't hit those moves if be doesn't knock him stupid with a microphone.


----------



## PhenomenalOne11 (Oct 2, 2016)

RainmakerV2 said:


> I agree, but SuperMox was stale as shit. It was time.


Yeah I guess so, I'm assuming this is gonna open up that The Good Brothers attacked Mox


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

I just remembered AJ Styles kicked Moxley in the nuts to win the WWE title.

Two wrestlers who are regarded as the best in the world (Styles and Omega) had to cheat to beat my guy for the world title.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

DJ Punk said:


> I just remembered AJ Styles kicked Moxley in the nuts to win the WWE title.
> 
> Two wrestlers who are regarded as the best in the world (Styles and Omega) had to cheat to beat my guy for the world title.


HAHA Don't worry I think Moxley is getting a 2nd reign for sure.


----------



## MoxAsylum (Jan 9, 2020)

prosperwithdeen said:


> HAHA Don't worry I think Moxley is getting a 2nd reign for sure.


I hope Mox gets a second reign and is not regulated to the mid-card


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

MoxAsylum said:


> I hope Mox gets a second reign and is not regulated to the mid-card


Nah Mox is definitely staying in the upper card for most of his AEW run. He will have some mid-card feuds in between PPV's as others get pushed too, but his real stuff will always be close to the top of the card or in the main event.


----------



## Mifune Jackson (Feb 22, 2013)

The only thing I find questionable is the Impact crossover. It better be going somewhere good, because I’m skeptical. Impact needs AEW more than vice-versa right now.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

DJ Punk said:


> I just remembered AJ Styles kicked Moxley in the nuts to win the WWE title.
> 
> Two wrestlers who are regarded as the best in the world (Styles and Omega) had to cheat to beat my guy for the world title.


I love you, man. Your posts are cracking me up. Haha


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

bdon said:


> I love you, man. Your posts are cracking me up. Haha


I haven't been this worked by kayfabe since Rollins betrayed The Shield. He's gonna be a great heel...


...fuck Omega


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

DJ Punk said:


> I haven't been this worked by kayfabe since Rollins betrayed The Shield. He's gonna be a great heel...
> 
> 
> ...fuck Omega


Haha

My brother is 32 years old, and he legit said, “Fuck this bullshit. That was a weak ending!”

Until he realized Callis was a VP at Impact, then he said, “This shit might be real!!! I feel like the NWO again where I’m not sure how much of that was a work!” Haha

Wrestling is so goddamn fun when it really works you.


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

bdon said:


> Haha
> 
> My brother is 32 years old, and he legit said, “Fuck this bullshit. That was a weak ending!”
> 
> ...


It sure is. My wife was cheering for Omega the whole match while I was cheering for Moxley and she freaked out when he won. Now she wants to buy the new shirt and everything. And I'm just like "...my money's not going in that cheater's wallet" haha


----------



## CHAMPIONSHIPS (Dec 14, 2016)

I agree that the ending was kind of dumb and overbooked. Is it anywhere near as bad as late-stage WCW? No, that's ridiculous. But it was a regrettable ending. 

I don't think it should've been clean but I don't understand why Don Callis got involved and had to grab a micorphone and speak and do all that extra shit. It should've just been Kenny using brass knuckles or something else that he intentionally executed. 

But the match itself was tremendous. 

Also if the Cleaner is really coming back then Kenny needs to do some sit ups for real


----------



## HBK Styles Ospreay (Jan 15, 2020)

Undertaker23RKO said:


> So is Mox going to take time off or go nuts?


If he's going to wrestle in Tokyo on January 4th he's going to have to go into quarantine pretty soon...


----------



## stevem20 (Jul 24, 2018)

Wow, a more bland champion you'll struggle to find. 

Kenny Omega as your world champion? FFS, they're not even giving themselves a chance.


----------



## The Sheik (Jul 10, 2017)

If it leads to a working relationship with AEW and Impact then I'm good with it.


----------



## zkorejo (Jul 2, 2010)

This is not The Cleaner. This is something different, something new and I'm loving it already.


----------



## Patrick Mercier (Nov 29, 2019)

CHAMPIONSHIPS said:


> I agree that the ending was kind of dumb and overbooked. Is it anywhere near as bad as late-stage WCW? No, that's ridiculous. But it was a regrettable ending.
> 
> *I don't think it should've been clean but I don't understand why Don Callis got involved and had to grab a micorphone and speak and do all that extra shit. It should've just been Kenny using brass knuckles or something else that he intentionally executed.*
> 
> ...


Basically, Callis went in there with the "intention" of asking the ref to stop the fight because Kenny got knocked loopy outside the ring by Moxley. I honestly have no idea how the mic ended up so far away in the ring after Moxley popped Callis but it is what it is. I'm also of the perception that from a kayfabe standpoint, Mox was caught off-guard from the mic and Kenny took advantage of it with the V-Triggers and the One Winged Angel.

As to the Impact crossover, I'm definitely intrigued as I would assume that Callis will also shed light on who attacked Moxley before the contract signing 2 weeks ago....and the connection with the Good Brothers because of the Bullet Club ties entirely makes sense.


----------



## Brad Boyd (Jan 28, 2020)

RapShepard said:


> And Goldberg got Jackknifed after the stun gun shot, nobody ever mentions that. They mention the absurdity of beating a champ in such a way. Beating Moxley via a microphone is fucking dumb. That's what happened he got hit with a microphone of all weapons and was done for. Shit was bad


Microphones a decent weapon. Who was it who was beating Austin with a microphone back in the day bloodying him up? Big Bossman or some shit...


----------



## Bland (Feb 16, 2016)

Impact partnership/talent exchange could be perfect for both, as it allows fresh feuds and cool temporary talent exchanges eg The North for AEW and then FTR for Impact, plus you have Best Friends, Jurassic Express, MCMG, Good Brothers etc. Basically open up tag divisions and potentially best tag division in Wrestling. 


As for the match, yes I'd prefer a better cheating than a microphone but it's still better than either low blow or chair shots that have been so over the top lately in Wrestling.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

What a fucking great ending to Dynamite. Omega has taken the title to IMPACT. holy shit.


----------



## PhenomenalOne11 (Oct 2, 2016)

Maybe it's just me but I still can't see what appeal Kenny Omega has to an American audience, he's a good wrestler but unless you've been following his career in NJPW nobody is gonna understand what The Cleaner gimmick is all about. It doesn't help that he doesn't have a look of a top champion, he looks more like a doughy video game geek compared to a beast at the top of the card. I'm not going to tune into Impact because personally I have no interest in anyone on that show, but can someone possibly explain what kind of appeal Kenny has to an audience?


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

RapShepard said:


> That finish was shit, imagine beating your year+ undefeated in singles competition world champion via a fucking microphone. This is the shit people still mock WCW about when it comes to Goldberg's first loss. That was dumb.
> 
> Getting hype about the Impact partnership I'd get (though most here were dismissive of it until 20 minutes ago). But that finish wasn't great. Match was still damn good. But that finish was pretty damn dumb.


why da fuq are you saying the mic spot was dumb? Many a match was won dusty with a mic shot

its a fucking wrestling staple - how in the world does that make it shit? would a lowblow or chair have been better? Same result

c’mon man, you harp on about the weirdest stuff


----------



## kamaro011 (Jan 3, 2012)

PhenomenalOne11 said:


> Maybe it's just me but I still can't see what appeal Kenny Omega has to an American audience, he's a good wrestler but unless you've been following his career in NJPW nobody is gonna understand what The Cleaner gimmick is all about. It doesn't help that he doesn't have a look of a top champion, he looks more like a doughy video game geek compared to a beast at the top of the card. I'm not going to tune into Impact because personally I have no interest in anyone on that show, but can someone possibly explain what kind of appeal Kenny has to an audience?


He only appeals to hardcore wrestling fan that also watch NJPW stuff.

For casual fan and non wrestling people if they been asked if they know who Kenny Omega was they will have no clue who that guy was.

It's going to difficult to explain his gimmick and making it to be over with casual audience and that's always will be his biggest problem.

Not AEW, not AEW fan, not casual fan but Kenny himself to make such a niche gimmick that difficult to explain.


----------



## volde (Apr 9, 2007)

Hey I watch NJPW and I'm not sure if I understand what this cleaner gimmick is supposed to be.


----------



## PhenomenalOne11 (Oct 2, 2016)

kamaro011 said:


> He only appeals to hardcore wrestling fan that also watch NJPW stuff.
> 
> For casual fan and non wrestling people if they been asked if they know who Kenny Omega was they will have no clue who that guy was.
> 
> ...


Exactly, so honestly, I don't really see the point of putting the world title on a guy who's not gonna draw a damn thing. Unless we're gonna go with the narrative that AEW don't wanna grow an audience (which would be incredibly stupid) and just wanna keep it to their small hardcore fanbase.


----------



## CM Buck (Sep 2, 2012)

ElTerrible said:


> WWE is so cheap, they can´t even invest some money in a VPN, so all these new WF members and avid AEW haters are all getting tagged as Canadians and Australians.


Cut it out


----------



## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

PhenomenalOne11 said:


> Exactly, so honestly, I don't really see the point of putting the world title on a guy who's not gonna draw a damn thing. Unless we're gonna go with the narrative that AEW don't wanna grow an audience (which would be incredibly stupid) and just wanna keep it to their small hardcore fanbase.


So only wrestlers who can grow the audience can become world champion ?

There is no wrestler in the world capable of that


----------



## PhenomenalOne11 (Oct 2, 2016)

rbl85 said:


> So only wrestlers who can grow the audience can become world champion ?
> 
> There is no wrestler in the world capable of that


Not at all, but a company like AEW which is fresh and trying to grow an audience should look to put the belt on someone who could grow the audience.


----------



## Gwi1890 (Nov 7, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> Heel shit is fine, it's the fucking microphone that's hilarious. Of all the things they could've used brass knuckles, a chair, a low blow, a gun, a fireball (that would've been fire actually) they went with microphone. That's why it's hilarious. We've seen Moxley go through tables, chairs, and stages. But a microphone is his undoing.


a microphone 5 Vtriggers and the most protected finisher in all of wrestling doesn’t seem dumb to me


----------



## kamaro011 (Jan 3, 2012)

volde said:


> Hey I watch NJPW and I'm not sure if I understand what this cleaner gimmick is supposed to be.


I also doesn't understand it either.


----------



## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

PhenomenalOne11 said:


> Not at all, but a company like AEW which is fresh and trying to grow an audience should look to put the belt on someone who could grow the audience.


Which wrestler in AEW can grow the audience ?


----------



## Pentagon Senior (Nov 16, 2019)

kamaro011 said:


> He only appeals to hardcore wrestling fan that also watch NJPW stuff.
> 
> For casual fan and non wrestling people if they been asked if they know who Kenny Omega was they will have no clue who that guy was.
> 
> ...


I'm not saying Omega is a massive star however I like him a lot and I've never been a NJPW viewer, so yeh. I also already understand his past as the 'best wrestler in the world' because the internet exists and it's easy to find out. It's been touched upon several times in Aew too. My one complaint is that the build to this match should have been longer and Omega's history emphasised more, but as someone who never watched NJPW I don't feel lost at all and see him as a good choice for champ.


----------



## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

3venflow said:


> Kenny was on the phone the other week when Marvez interviewed him leaving the building - some suspected that was to Callis. Mox was jumped, probably by an assassin(s) sent by Callis... the Good Brothers?
> 
> It's the old 'sold his soul to the devil' storyline, probably stemming from doubts he could beat Mox clean and knowing if he didn't win the title here, then he'd never return to his former heights.
> 
> Kenny hasn't seceded from AEW is my thinking, he's just formed a pact with a devious mind who ensured he won the title... and now wants Kenny on his show in return. Omega and Callis have a long history so it does make sense and it will also help Kenny if Callis can be his mouthpiece, as he's a very effective scumbag heel.


Yes this is exactly how I saw it. With the Punk angle, he made it clear that he was leaving WWE with the belt for weeks before he won it. I never interpreted this as Omega leaving AEW. 

What they have been hinting at for weeks is AEW working with other promotions. To me, this is more like Shane McMahon showing up on Nitro than Punk leaving with the belt.

IMO The Punk angle had an awesome start with the pipe bomb and great John Cena match but ended up really flat with Punk coming back almost immediately and putting over Alberto Del Rio, HHH and... Kevin Nash.


----------



## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

Hey if they are copying the Punk angle which also had a "whodunnit", then I guess Moxley attacked himself backstage


----------



## patpat (Feb 17, 2019)

Whoanma said:


> That’s the only thing I don’t like. Forcing me to watch Impact to follow the storyline (btw, is Impact free to watch outside the States any way?).


Come on they will 100% recap It on aew's show. They always do this, just like they recap omega vs fenix in AAA when he won the belt before starting to introduce omega as the AAA champ in aew 
I know this section is very good at convincing people it's the case. But no, the people running the company arent THAT stupid

Also the people asking what impact gives have a very short term mind. If this works out well and leads to a fire very good angle then they got something from it. And presenting omega as the bastard who fucked over everyone and became the "king" in two promotions is great for them. Wreslting is all about iconography and representation, I dont give a shit about impact, didnt care before wont care but the shit is cool so I am gonna follow it. And yes it's ok to do something just because its fucking cool in wrestling. I watch to see cool shit


----------



## Dizzie (Jun 22, 2019)

Wolf Mark said:


> A pale imitation of CM Punk in the WWE.


Not really when punk never actually went anywhere else with the title and the build up to this match was never about omega threatening to take the title elsewhere, this was more of a double cross angle.


----------



## Whoanma (Apr 5, 2016)

patpat said:


> Come on they will 100% recap It on aew's show. They always do this, just like they recap omega vs fenix in AAA when he won the belt before starting to introduce omega as the AAA champ in aew
> I know this section is very good at convincing people it's the case. But no, the people running the company arent THAT stupid
> 
> Also the people asking what impact gives have a very short term mind. If this works out well and leads to a fire very good angle then they got something from it. And presenting omega as the bastard who fucked over everyone and became the "king" in two promotions is great for them. Wreslting is all about iconography and representation, I dont give a shit about impact, didnt care before wont care but the shit is cool so I am gonna follow it. And yes it's ok to do something just because its fucking cool in wrestling. I watch to see cool shit





Whoanma said:


> I think Impact can be watched for free on Twitch. Nice.


Don’t take me wrong, I’m definitely going to watch it because I’m invested/interested, it’s just that I wish they’d show everything in Dynamite, as well as the BTE stuff that’s relevant to what’s happening and the video packages that storyline the rivalries.


----------



## kamaro011 (Jan 3, 2012)

Pentagon Senior said:


> I'm not saying Omega is a massive star however I like him a lot and I've never been a NJPW viewer, so yeh. I also already understand his past as the 'best wrestler in the world' because the internet exists and it's easy to find out. It's been touched upon several times in Aew too. My one complaint is that the build to this match should have been longer and Omega's history emphasised more, but as someone who never watched NJPW I don't feel lost at all and see him as a good choice for champ.


You are neither casual fan nor non wrestling people which is the far bigger market AEW should their product to target for, to increase their fanbase instead the current stagnant fanbase they have right now.


----------



## Stellar (May 30, 2016)

I enjoyed it and didn't think that it was overbooked. Overbooked is if they did that screwy finish (between the microphone hit, v-triggers and one winged angel) and then Mox still kicked out after getting pinned and then went on to defeat Omega. They have done something dumb like that on Dynamite before.

I liked the story that they were telling with the One Winged Angel too. Omega tried multiple times but couldn't pull off the move on Moxley until he hit Mox with the mic. Even on the last attempt I was watching Moxley's hand placement to see if he was going to poke Omegas eyes or do something else to get out of it but he didn't.

Callis getting involved was a way of establishing the partnership between Impact and AEW. It was a way of establishing that perhaps Callis had an influence on Omega winning in dirty fashion.

I will say that AEW does need to do a better job of telling the whole story of everything on Dynamite. Pretend as if everyone that watches knows very little of these wrestlers. They should have been doing that for the first year of AEW at least. Not everyone watches BTE and Dark. Like the whole Cleaner thing with Omega. The only people that knows about that are hardcore NJPW viewers.


----------



## Gwi1890 (Nov 7, 2019)

Now that he’s a double champion I hope he brings the AAA mega championship out with him he used to bring his Iwgp belt to Roh


----------



## Whoanma (Apr 5, 2016)

Southerner said:


> *I will say that AEW does need to do a better job of telling the whole story of everything on Dynamite.*


----------



## Pentagon Senior (Nov 16, 2019)

kamaro011 said:


> You are neither casual fan nor non wrestling people which is the far bigger market AEW should their product to target for, to increase their fanbase instead the current stagnant fanbase they have right now.


Well I hadn't watched wrestling regularly since the Attitude Era until AEW as with many others, that counts for something. I've picked up a lot of the history about TNA, NJPW etc by osmosis just by getting involved again after many years. I'm honestly not sure how many non wrestling fans there actually are out there who would suddenly flock to AEW if they had a better champ than Omega...but I guess if a superstar like the Rock or Austin were found somehow it could potentially move the needle.


----------



## kamaro011 (Jan 3, 2012)

Pentagon Senior said:


> Well I hadn't watched wrestling regularly since the Attitude Era until AEW as with many others, that counts for something. I've picked up a lot of the history about TNA, NJPW etc by osmosis just by getting involved again after many years. I'm honestly not sure how many non wrestling fans there actually are out there who would suddenly flock to AEW if they had a better champ than Omega...but I guess if a superstar like the Rock or Austin were found somehow it could potentially move the needle.


If you even remotely know wrestling knowledge outside WWE and actively seeking it then you're not a casual fan. Almost if not all casual fan that i know off, is they only know and watch WWE no matter how bad the product is currently right now.

There will never be another The Rock and Stone Cold in our lifetime anytime soon, not because the potential (the potential for another superstar like them is there). It's just difficult to cultivate and ingredient to become a superstar like they are isn't there anymore.

Mind you i'm not talking the current political climate where you have to watch to what you said before for a risk offending people but also the sorrounding enviroment that shapes them to be a great man and unleash their true potential isn't there.

Back then wrestling backstage is far more hostile than currently today, everyone isn't keen to friendly to each other and pushing each other to down to keep their spot on the card. So person with potential like Stone Cold and The Rock must do absolutely very best of their performance each and every week or else they risk someone like The Kliq that actively trying to sabotage their sucesss for moving up their card.

Today wrestling enviroment isn't that hostile to work with compared to the past, so the wrestler with potential today isn't actively trying hard (compared The Rock and Stone Cold) to earn their hardwork all the way to top spot.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Brad Boyd said:


> Microphones a decent weapon. Who was it who was beating Austin with a microphone back in the day bloodying him up? Big Bossman or some shit...


The microphone is a shit weapon to use as the catalyst for a world title change


----------



## Pentagon Senior (Nov 16, 2019)

kamaro011 said:


> If you even remotely know wrestling knowledge outside WWE and actively seeking it then you're not a casual fan. Almost if not all casual fan that i know off, is they only know and watch WWE no matter how bad the product is currently right now.
> 
> There will never be another The Rock and Stone Cold in our lifetime anytime soon, not because the potential (the potential for another superstar like them is there). It's just difficult to cultivate and ingredient to become a superstar like they are isn't there anymore.
> 
> ...


So you're saying with a different champ than Omega those fans who only tend to watch WWE (who you refer to as casuals) might be tempted to switch to AEW? Or are you saying they'll never watch anything but WWE in which case what does it matter if Omega is champ?


----------



## Pentagon Senior (Nov 16, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> The microphone is a shit weapon to use as the catalyst for a world title change


You should have mentioned that sooner 🤣

I kinda get your point tbf another weapon would've been better, although I don't see it as that big of a deal because of what came after. Overall though I've just enjoyed your rampage about it lol.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> why da fuq are you saying the mic spot was dumb? *Many a match was won dusty with a mic shot*
> 
> its a fucking wrestling staple - how in the world does that make it shit? would a lowblow or chair have been better? Same result
> 
> c’mon man, you harp on about the weirdest stuff


Rattle off the praised matches that ended via microphone shot. I'll wait since this is an allegedly a normal thing that happens.

As far as how does it make it shit, weapons matter. If you're going to use a weapon to cause a world title change and beat an undefeated streak using one that isn't shit should be top of the list.



Gwi1890 said:


> a microphone 5 Vtriggers and the most protected finisher in all of wrestling doesn’t seem dumb to me


He got hit with a fucking microphone all the "but but the V triggers" is bull shit covering up for the fact they ended a year undefeated streak with a fucking microphone


----------



## kamaro011 (Jan 3, 2012)

Pentagon Senior said:


> So you're saying with a different champ than Omega those fans who only tend to watch WWE (who you refer to as casuals) might be tempted to switch to AEW? Or are you saying they'll never watch anything but WWE in which case what does it matter if Omega is champ?


Omega isn't good enough to draw a casual viewer that only watch WWE stuff let alone non wrestling people that don't watch wrestling at all. So no, not at all. Omega being a champ is not going to make any difference at all.


----------



## Pentagon Senior (Nov 16, 2019)

kamaro011 said:


> Omega isn't good enough to draw a casual viewer that only watch WWE stuff let alone non wrestling people that don't watch wrestling at all. So no, not at all. Omega being a champ is not going to make any difference at all.


Can you think of a current wrestler that could do so and realistically could be signed by AEW (or already within AEW)?


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Pentagon Senior said:


> You should have mentioned that sooner 🤣
> 
> I kinda get your point tbf another weapon would've been better, although I don't see it as that big of a deal because of what came after. Overall though I've just enjoyed your rampage about it lol.


Of all the weapons in wrestling, match wise it's hard to take it serious. Like I'm sure getting hit full force with a glass pepper shaker would stun somebody. Doesn't mean I'd suggest it as the instrument to end lead to a title change. Microphone is more promo beat down shit.


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

It wasn't a mic shot and then a roll-up. THAT would be ending the title reign with a mic shot. Four V-Triggers and OWA finisher, the most protected finisher in the business at this point - is what pinned Moxley. As has been pointed out many, many times.


----------



## Pentagon Senior (Nov 16, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> Of all the weapons in wrestling, match wise it's hard to take it serious. Like I'm sure getting hit full force with a glass pepper shaker would stun somebody. Doesn't mean I'd suggest it as the instrument to end lead to a title change. Microphone is more promo beat down shit.


Yeh I don't disagree tbh it just didn't ruin it for me because of the following moves and angle. I'm not arguing with you just enjoying your campaign of hate against the poor microphone 😏


----------



## kamaro011 (Jan 3, 2012)

Pentagon Senior said:


> Can you think of a current wrestler that could do so and realistically could be signed by AEW (or already within AEW)?


MJF immediately comes in my mind, his not in the level of The Rock and Stone Cold. But i can see the potential on him someone like John Cena in his early day and that's not a bad thing.

If only his work out to atleast closer to John Cena look in physique, then i can see his potential to be break out star to mainstream audience is alot higher than it currently he have right now.


----------



## Pentagon Senior (Nov 16, 2019)

kamaro011 said:


> MJF immediately comes in my mind, his not in the level of The Rock and Stone Cold. But i can see the potential on him someone like John Cena in his early day and that's not a bad thing.
> 
> If only his work out to atleast closer to John Cena look in physique, then i can see his potential to be break out star to mainstream audience is alot higher than it currently he have right now.


Fair shout. I could see MJF being the main heel and Hangman Page the main face in around 12/18 months. I'm a fan of both and see a lot of potential in them if they're built properly.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Pentagon Senior said:


> Yeh I don't disagree tbh it just didn't ruin it for me because of the following moves and angle. I'm not arguing with you just enjoying your campaign of hate against the poor microphone [emoji57]


That ending just gives me the same feel Dragon Ball Resurrection of F did. Just s big really lol.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> It wasn't a mic shot and then a roll-up. THAT would be ending the title reign with a mic shot. Four V-Triggers and OWA finisher, the most protected finisher in the business at this point - is what pinned Moxley. As has been pointed out many, many times.


It is was a fucking mic shot. Why are we changing up the way people discuss match endings because it's AEW. 

Nobody says "Goldberg loss to Nash via Jackknife" they say he loss because of a stun gun. 

When HHH beats people via interference, sledgehammer, and Pedigree. Nobody goes "oh he won via pedigree" it's "he won because of DX/Evolution and the fucking sledgehammer".


----------



## ste1592 (Dec 20, 2014)

RapShepard said:


> *When have wrestling fans ever deemphasized the cheap shot that lead to the finish?* This is a brand new thing people are trying to night. Kenny doesn't hit those moves if be doesn't knock him stupid with a microphone.


Because it leads to the finish, but it's not the finish.

I mean, liking ot disliking it is an entirely different (and subjective) matter, but Moxley didn't lose *to *a microphone, he lost to a microphone and several signature moves followed by the most protected finisher in AEW.

Is it dirty? Well, yeah, but I don't know who really expected Moxley to lose his first AEW match clean. I had no doubts going in that Moxley would lose the title and Omega would cement his heel turn by winning it in dirty fashion.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

ste1592 said:


> Because it leads to the finish, but it's not the finish.
> 
> I mean, liking ot disliking it is an entirely different (and subjective) matter, but Moxley didn't lose *to *a microphone, he lost to a microphone and several signature moves followed by the most protected finisher in AEW.
> 
> Is it dirty? Well, yeah, but I don't know who really expected Moxley to lose his first AEW match clean. I had no doubts going in that Moxley would lose the title and Omega would cement his heel turn by winning it in dirty fashion.


When people speak on Goldberg losing his title and undefeated streak do they say he lost via Jackknife Powerbomb or stun gun. I'll answer for you they say he lost via stun gun. Why because that's the point of the cheating.


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

RapShepard said:


> It is was a fucking mic shot. Why are we changing up the way people discuss match endings because it's AEW.
> 
> Nobody says "Goldberg loss to Nash via Jackknife" they say he loss because of a stun gun.
> 
> When HHH beats people via interference, sledgehammer, and Pedigree. Nobody goes "oh he won via pedigree" it's "he won because of DX/Evolution and the fucking sledgehammer".


It was interference. It wasn't clean. It was a distraction. No argument there. Moxley was stunned and that set up up to eat the four v-triggers which left him decimated for the OWA finish. My issue is you are seemingly contending that Moxley was finished by the mic shot. Moxley getting hit with the mic and then pinned would have been terrible and I'd be right there with you but that isn't the case. He wasn't finished by the mic shot. Full stop. Omega cheated to win. Absolutely. That is the story. But the deathmatch veteran didn't eat a mic shot to finish him as you want to keep implying. If Kenny went to pin Mox off the mic shot, Moxley would have kicked out. 

Mox was protected as hell with that finish - weapon shot, four v-triggers (including one flush to the side of the head unprotected) and then the OWA. 

Kenny absolutely cheated to win. That's the storyline they're going with. 

Moxley didn't get pinned by a mic shot.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> It wasn't a mic shot and then a roll-up. THAT would be ending the title reign with a mic shot. Four V-Triggers and OWA finisher, the most protected finisher in the business at this point - is what pinned Moxley. As has been pointed out many, many times.


Those offended by the Mic Spot won’t hear you.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> It was interference. It wasn't clean. It was a distraction. No argument there. Moxley was stunned and that set up up to eat the four v-triggers which left him decimated for the OWA finish. My issue is you are seemingly contending that Moxley was finished by the mic shot. Moxley getting hit with the mic and then pinned would have been terrible and I'd be right there with you but that isn't the case. He wasn't finished by the mic shot. Full stop. Omega cheated to win. Absolutely. That is the story. But the deathmatch veteran didn't eat a mic shot to finish him as you want to keep implying. If Kenny went to pin Mox off the mic shot, Moxley would have kicked out.
> 
> Mox was protected as hell with that finish - weapon shot, four v-triggers (including one flush to the side of the head unprotected) and then the OWA.
> 
> ...


All of this. I’d be fucking pissed if they just used the mic spot to end the match. They didn’t. Kenny cheated like he dastardly heel that he is, and he ran off to Impact with a family friend like the prick coward that he is.

Damn good heat, IMO, and great sympathy for Moxley. (If we ignore the stupid sit down musical chair spot when Mox could/should have at least feigned an attempted pinfall victory)


----------



## Brad Boyd (Jan 28, 2020)

RapShepard said:


> The microphone is a shit weapon to use as the catalyst for a world title change


Why though? Because its not a common weapon to use in terms in context of title changes?


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> It was interference. It wasn't clean. It was a distraction. No argument there. Moxley was stunned and that set up up to eat the four v-triggers which left him decimated for the OWA finish. My issue is you are seemingly contending that Moxley was finished by the mic shot. Moxley getting hit with the mic and then pinned would have been terrible and I'd be right there with you but that isn't the case. He wasn't finished by the mic shot. Full stop. Omega cheated to win. Absolutely. That is the story. But the deathmatch veteran didn't eat a mic shot to finish him as you want to keep implying. If Kenny went to pin Mox off the mic shot, Moxley would have kicked out.
> 
> Mox was protected as hell with that finish - weapon shot, four v-triggers (including one flush to the side of the head unprotected) and then the OWA.
> 
> ...


I'm implying what happened he got finished with a mic shot. All the "but but all the V-triggers" is just to deflect the fact the turning point that caused defeat was a fucking microphone.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Brad Boyd said:


> Why though? Because its not a common weapon to use in terms in context of title changes?


Because it's microphone and the world title. We've seen him go through tables, barb wire, rammed into the steel guard rail, and all types of shit. So a microphone leading to his downfall is just silly.


----------



## ste1592 (Dec 20, 2014)

RapShepard said:


> When people speak on Goldberg losing his title and undefeated streak do they say he lost via Jackknife Powerbomb or stun gun. I'll answer for you they say he lost via stun gun. Why because that's the point of the cheating.


Well yeah, but then why do you care if it's a mic or a brass knuckle?

If the point is cheating, Omega cheated and managed to create an opening that lead to the finishing sequence. I have no problem with a mic used to create an opening. I would have had a problem if the mic ended the match.

If you're implying that a year long undefeated streak shouldn't have been ended like that, maybe you're right, but I don't think it's that bad, given the circumstances.

Edit. I just saw your explanation. To each its own I guess; to me,a microphone is still a blunt object and can be pretty damaging if shoved right into my face. And yes, we've seen him go through worse, but if we apply that logic, why would any wrestler lose to a finisher when they get thrown through tables, barbed wire, concrete every two weeks?


----------



## zkorejo (Jul 2, 2010)

RapShepard said:


> I'm implying what happened he got finished with a mic shot. All the "but but all the V-triggers" is just to deflect the fact the turning point that caused defeat was a fucking microphone.


But it didnt end with a mic shot. Had he pinned him right after the mic shot then you would have been right. Mic shot was more of a "Kenny is officially a heel" thing than the end of the match. 4 vicious V-triggers after that and the most protected finisher in wrestling right now is what ended the match.


----------



## Brad Boyd (Jan 28, 2020)

RapShepard said:


> Because it's microphone and the world title. We've seen him go through tables, barb wire, rammed into the steel guard rail, and all types of shit. So a microphone leading to his downfall is just silly.


Thats a reasonable explanation. Tough guys have been brutalized by microphones before thats why i mentioned Austin but yes Mox did work in CZW as well. So its understandable for Mox to be withstanding lots of pain.


----------



## kamaro011 (Jan 3, 2012)

RapShepard said:


> Because it's microphone and the world title. We've seen him go through tables, barb wire, rammed into the steel guard rail, and all types of shit. So a microphone leading to his downfall is just silly.


Agree something like baseball bat to the head should been enough, but microphone is kinda weak to me.


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Brad Boyd said:


> Thats a reasonable explanation. Tough guys have been brutalized by microphones before thats why i mentioned Austin but yes Mox did work in CZW as well. So its understandable for Mox to be withstanding lots of pain.


It really isn't. Because the mic shot didn't finish Moxley. He got hit in the head with it and it opened him up - that is all. It was an opening created for the finish but it wasn't the finish. Mic Shot + four v-triggers + OWA finished Moxley. He would have kicked out of the mic shot.


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

RapShepard said:


> I'm implying what happened he got finished with a mic shot. All the "but but all the V-triggers" is just to deflect the fact the turning point that caused defeat was a fucking microphone.


A turning point is not "finished by". The cheating created the opening. It bought Omega the time and space to hit the v-trigger, and then another one, and then another one, and then another one and then hit the OWA for the pin. 

The turning point is Kenny Omega's full heel turn and outing being in cahoots with Don Callis. The turning point was Omega admitting he couldn't win clean so he needed to cheat. Omega cheated to win. He didn't use a mic shot to finish Moxley.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> A turning point is not "finished by". The cheating created the opening. It bought Omega the time and space to hit the v-trigger, and then another one, and then another one, and then another one and then hit the OWA for the pin.
> 
> The turning point is Kenny Omega's full heel turn and outing being in cahoots with Don Callis. The turning point was Omega admitting he couldn't win clean so he needed to cheat. Omega cheated to win. He didn't use a mic shot to finish Moxley.


Moxley has been beat down with weapons before and didn’t lose. I get that, but he has never been beat with weapons that ultimately lead to the One-Winged Angel. Brass knuckles would have been better, but the story of the feud is that Omega had to cheat to hit Moxley with the OWA.

This does 3 things:

A) Omega cheated. Holy shit, the best bout machine used plunder to get a win! = Instant heat

B) Reiterates Moxley’s resiliency. He refuses to stop fighting for anyone and was still standing after being bloodied and eating 5 or 6 (which was it) V-Triggers. And finally...

C) It establishes to the audience that even Jon Moxley drops to the One-Winged Angel. Moxley will eat another and fail to kick out in the future with Omega not needing to cheat.

The payoff of all this is that Hangman WILL one day kick out of the One-Winged Angel.


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

I would also note that Omega didn't even go for the cover. He knew it wouldn't finish Moxley. He's been in an unsanctioned death match with Moxley, he's studied Moxley. He didn't try to go for the quick pin after the mic shot. He knew it wouldn't be enough to finish him. It wasn't meant to in that moment. He pulled down his knee pad and hit a clean v-trigger and then again didn't go for a pin and he calculated that wouldn't still be enough. Then he hit another v-trigger and no pin attempt, and another v-trigger and again no pin attempt and then further hit one more and rather than even hitting four v-triggers and thinking that would be enough to get the pin and win he hit his ultimate finisher, the OWA, and only after hitting that clean in the middle of the ring did he finally decide he did enough to pin Moxley.


----------



## TomTom94 (Oct 18, 2013)

Don Callis Looks like a dweeb lol


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

TomTom94 said:


> Don Callis Looks like a dweeb lol


So did Bobby Heenan, Jimmy Hart, Jim Cornette etc.


----------



## TomTom94 (Oct 18, 2013)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> So did Bobby Heenan, Jimmy Hart, Jim Cornette etc.


Those guys actually have microphone skills and a stage presence.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> I would also note that Omega didn't even go for the cover. He knew it wouldn't finish Moxley. He's been in an unsanctioned death match with Moxley, he's studied Moxley. He didn't try to go for the quick pin after the mic shot. He knew it wouldn't be enough to finish him. It wasn't meant to in that moment. He pulled down his knee pad and hit a clean v-trigger and then again didn't go for a pin and he calculated that wouldn't still be enough. Then he hit another v-trigger and no pin attempt, and another v-trigger and again no pin attempt and then further hit one more and rather than even hitting four v-triggers and thinking that would be enough to get the pin and win he hit his ultimate finisher, the OWA, and only after hitting that clean in the middle of the ring did he finally decide he did enough to pin Moxley.


It was a cold, calculated, dastardly sequence of events by someone whom many claim doesn’t understand psychology.

The brutality and suddenness of this heel turn makes the (mostly heartless) match with Page make sense. Omega didn’t have to go Cleaner on Drunk Page. One day he will, but Full Gear was not that day.

And further into the future, every heel tactic WITH the One-Winged Angel will not be enough to stop Page’s resiliency.


----------



## Pentagon Senior (Nov 16, 2019)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> I would also note that Omega didn't even go for the cover. He knew it wouldn't finish Moxley. He's been in an unsanctioned death match with Moxley, he's studied Moxley. He didn't try to go for the quick pin after the mic shot. He knew it wouldn't be enough to finish him. It wasn't meant to in that moment. He pulled down his knee pad and hit a clean v-trigger and then again didn't go for a pin and he calculated that wouldn't still be enough. Then he hit another v-trigger and no pin attempt, and another v-trigger and again no pin attempt and then further hit one more and rather than even hitting four v-triggers and thinking that would be enough to get the pin and win he hit his ultimate finisher, the OWA, and only after hitting that clean in the middle of the ring did he finally decide he did enough to pin Moxley.


Yeh that's why I don't have a major problem with it either. Omega had to chip away at Mox relentlessly before he even thought of pinning him, making Mox look strong. The mic shot was merely the first step and was just as much about disorientating him so that the opportunity to do the sigs and finisher was there. He needed to cheat in order to gain that opportunity. They could have used a straight up distraction but that's essentially what the mic was for and wouldn't have made Mox look any stronger. A brass knuckle would have been cooler but the mic didn't spoil it for me due to it being such a small part of the whole package.


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## Undertaker23RKO (Jun 11, 2011)

bdon said:


> All of this. I’d be fucking pissed if they just used the mic spot to end the match. They didn’t. Kenny cheated like he dastardly heel that he is, and he ran off to Impact with a family friend like the prick coward that he is.
> 
> Damn good heat, IMO, and great sympathy for Moxley. (If we ignore the stupid sit down musical chair spot when Mox could/should have at least feigned an attempted pinfall victory)


To be fair, that chair spot perfectly fit into the story of the match but he absolutely should have gone for the cover first.


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

TomTom94 said:


> Those guys actually have microphone skills and a stage presence.


Callis absolutely had mic ability. I'd argue similar stage presence as Cornette.


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## TomTom94 (Oct 18, 2013)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Callis absolutely had mic ability. I'd argue similar stage presence as Cornette.


Not even close.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Everybody in the chat, raise their hands for a video of @RapShepard asking a mate to bonk him in the head with a mic to show us how much it doesn’t hurt

🙋‍♂️🙋‍♂️🙋‍♂️🙋‍♂️🙋‍♂️🙋‍♂️🙋‍♂️🙋‍♂️🙋‍♂️

lolz

c’mon Rap, do it you legend


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Knux vs mic I think comes down to deniability - both in the moment and longer term story. When Omega picked up the dropped mic folks still didn't know if he was passed to him on purpose. We saw Omega cheat to win, but we didn't yet know the depths to his turn. Did he just take advantage of the situation, out of certain desperation? Maybe. 

If it was knux we'd have known from the moment Callis passed them off and Omega picked them up that they were in a conspiracy together.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Knux vs mic I think comes down to deniability - both in the moment and longer term story. When Omega picked up the dropped mic folks still didn't know if he was passed to him on purpose. We saw Omega cheat to win, but we didn't yet know the depths to his turn. Did he just take advantage of the situation, out of certain desperation? Maybe.
> 
> If it was knux we'd have known from the moment Callis passed them off and Omega picked them up that they were in a conspiracy together.


this - if Callis came with a chair, the jig was up

imo, the mic shot worked in the context of what was going on


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Knux vs mic I think comes down to deniability - both in the moment and longer term story. When Omega picked up the dropped mic folks still didn't know if he was passed to him on purpose. We saw Omega cheat to win, but we didn't yet know the depths to his turn. Did he just take advantage of the situation, out of certain desperation? Maybe.
> 
> If it was knux we'd have known from the moment Callis passed them off and Omega picked them up that they were in a conspiracy together.


This actually seems like the most likely scenario and falls perfectly in line with The Elite’s style of story-telling.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

zkorejo said:


> But it didnt end with a mic shot. Had he pinned him right after the mic shot then you would have been right. Mic shot was more of a "Kenny is officially a heel" thing than the end of the match. 4 vicious V-triggers after that and the most protected finisher in wrestling right now is what ended the match.


All that's great he still got did in with a fucking microphone



Brad Boyd said:


> Thats a reasonable explanation. Tough guys have been brutalized by microphones before thats why i mentioned Austin but yes Mox did work in CZW as well. So its understandable for Mox to be withstanding lots of pain.


It's just the weapon for me that's goofy 



kamaro011 said:


> Agree something like baseball bat to the head should been enough, but microphone is kinda weak to me.


Super weak



DetroitRiverPhx said:


> A turning point is not "finished by". The cheating created the opening. It bought Omega the time and space to hit the v-trigger, and then another one, and then another one, and then another one and then hit the OWA for the pin.
> 
> The turning point is Kenny Omega's full heel turn and outing being in cahoots with Don Callis. The turning point was Omega admitting he couldn't win clean so he needed to cheat. Omega cheated to win. He didn't use a mic shot to finish Moxley.


He used a mic shot to finish


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## HBK Styles Ospreay (Jan 15, 2020)

PhenomenalOne11 said:


> Exactly, so honestly, I don't really see the point of putting the world title on a guy who's not gonna draw a damn thing. Unless we're gonna go with the narrative that AEW don't wanna grow an audience (which would be incredibly stupid) and just wanna keep it to their small hardcore fanbase.


Well to be fair Moxleys been champion since like February, and the audience hasn't grown at all since then. At some point he had to lose the title and who else were they going to put it on besides Kenny? They've got to try and see if they can recapture his glory from Japan before it totally fades away...


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## HBK Styles Ospreay (Jan 15, 2020)

RapShepard said:


> It is was a fucking mic shot. Why are we changing up the way people discuss match endings because it's AEW.
> 
> Nobody says "Goldberg loss to Nash via Jackknife" they say he loss because of a stun gun.
> 
> When HHH beats people via interference, sledgehammer, and Pedigree. Nobody goes "oh he won via pedigree" it's "he won because of DX/Evolution and the fucking sledgehammer".


Maybe because Goldberg never actually sold the jackknife? He got hit with the stun gun took the jackknife and the pin and then got up and started having seizures from the stun gun again.

Moxley got stabbed between the eyes with a mic and busted open. But then he took like six f**** knee shots to the head and then got dropped on his head and stayed down bleeding away? Kenny didn't beat him with the mic, it just turned the tide and weakened Moxley so he could knee him in the head. The mic shot doesn't even stand out to me, the multiple v triggers do though, and that's plenty to put away Moxley


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

HBK Styles Ospreay said:


> Maybe because Goldberg never actually sold the jackknife? He got hit with the stun gun took the jackknife and the pin and then got up and started having seizures from the stun gun again.
> 
> Moxley got stabbed between the eyes with a mic and busted open. But then he took like six f**** knee shots to the head and then got dropped on his head and stayed down bleeding away? Kenny didn't beat him with the mic, it just turned the tide and weakened Moxley so he could knee him in the head. The mic shot doesn't even stand out to me, the multiple v triggers do though, and that's plenty to put away Moxley


Goldberg sucking as anything more than a mark for himself is the problem with the stun gun. He literally had nothing to do but win. And in 2020, it is all he can STILL do. Fuck that fucking guy.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

HBK Styles Ospreay said:


> Maybe because Goldberg never actually sold the jackknife? He got hit with the stun gun took the jackknife and the pin and then got up and started having seizures from the stun gun again.
> 
> Moxley got stabbed between the eyes with a mic and busted open. But then he took like six f**** knee shots to the head and then got dropped on his head and stayed down bleeding away? Kenny didn't beat him with the mic, it just turned the tide and weakened Moxley so he could knee him in the head. The mic shot doesn't even stand out to me, the multiple v triggers do though, and that's plenty to put away Moxley


"But but the V-triggers" he got hit with a mic. All this "but but the V-triggers" isn't changing my stance. It was goofy and that's where I'm at on it


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> "But but the V-triggers" he got hit with a mic. All this "but but the V-triggers" isn't changing my stance. It was goofy and that's where I'm at on it


Good on ya!


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## thisissting (Aug 14, 2018)

I was just thinking this match is a bit of an anti climax they need to do something here. And they did! I knew callis would get involved as soon as we saw him weeks ago on a promo. I think I also called the tna aew partnership as soon as callis at that point. Forget about this match and omega this is huge for wrestling some great matches between aew tna nwa njpw possible. No doubt folk will still find a reason to slag off Tony Khan but he was sure right about wrestling industry changing! Game changer. One small niggle the mic shot looked crap who goes down being hit by the soft end of a mic and get busted open. Should have thrown omega brass nucks or a chain and he should have really clobbered him.


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## Upstart474 (May 13, 2018)

Omega brings credibility to the title.


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## tower_ (Nov 19, 2020)

Whole match was typical Kenny shit. Nobody cares about Jim Callis or knows who he is same as nobody cares about his career in Japan but it's just assumed the audience is supposed to. Why wouldnt he take down Mox - a guy whose last big match was an "I Quit" hardcore match against a kayfabe street fighter and who previously suplexed HIMSELF into a bed of barbed wire - with a microphone? Makes total sense in the land of make believe!

The angle where he runs off to a show on AXS TV (whatever that is) that had to recently vacate their title from a woman is interesting in the same way a car driving off a cliff is interesting

What I'm guessing is since theyve had this result telegraphed since basically January (or whenever it was Hangman previewed a turn during the Bucks feud) and they've said things are booked years in advance my assumption is they had planned to have NJPW bought in by now, and he was originally going to run off with Gedo or Ibushi or whatever, and since that never materialized they just ran with the same story with a joke fed instead


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Trigger them, Kenny! Trigger them all!!


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## 3venflow (Feb 3, 2019)

Callis was with Kenny today, I wonder if he'll accompany him to Triple Mania next week.

Callis is now calling himself 'The Invisible Hand' on Twitter. I really hope he's about to join AEW full-time, the guy has a wealth of experience and is great as the slimy heel.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1335590847526658049


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