# cody & orange cassidy complainers get in here & eat your crow



## PushCrymeTyme (May 23, 2019)

well what do u know its like the man who owns aew & is booking the show knows what the audience wants
but no he should listen to you same 5 people in the aew section who make thread & posts after post complaining & crying everyday about cody & oc
numbers dont lie 










__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1317040336896544768


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## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

AEW TV Ratings, PPV Buys & Ticket Sales Thread Part III


OC rated highly because top of the hour straight up. Also I don't want Cult's question to go ignored. What draws you guys specifically to Cassidy? I can't imagine a grown man laughing at Orange kicking someone in the shins for the 96th time. Ah so they're deliberately trolling then?I am not...




www.wrestlingforum.com


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## P Thriller (Jan 6, 2016)

Just because a lot of people watch something doesn't make it good lol. The main roster beats the crap out of AEW every week in the rankings, it doesn't mean it is a better show. Good for them though I guess...crazy to think that 900,000 is something to brag about. That isn't even TNA level ratings.


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## PushCrymeTyme (May 23, 2019)

El Hammerstone said:


> AEW TV Ratings, PPV Buys & Ticket Sales Thread Part III
> 
> 
> OC rated highly because top of the hour straight up. Also I don't want Cult's question to go ignored. What draws you guys specifically to Cassidy? I can't imagine a grown man laughing at Orange kicking someone in the shins for the 96th time. Ah so they're deliberately trolling then?I am not...
> ...


no it deserves its own thread 
just like the cody & ic complainers making 20 threads a week in the aew section


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## PushCrymeTyme (May 23, 2019)

P Thriller said:


> Just because a lot of people watch something doesn't make it good lol. The main roster beats the crap out of AEW every week in the rankings, it doesn't mean it is a better show. Good for them though I guess...crazy to think that 900,000 is something to brag about. That isn't even TNA level ratings.


its 2020 every live cable show is suffering
even the nba finals arent getting tna 2010 numbers


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## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

PushCrymeTyme said:


> its 2020 *u idiot* every live cable show is suffering
> even the nba finals arent getting tna 2010 numbers


Settle down


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## Marbar (Dec 20, 2019)

I am proud to say I'm not one of them watching it. Maybe I'll begin watching again when Tony figures out how to book a legitimate show. So many talented individuals on the roster and they continuously push garbage like OC, Cody and Jericho. If this is what you want to watch congratulations. I prefer not to be one of the lemmings that they are leading to the proverbial cliff.


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## PushCrymeTyme (May 23, 2019)

Marbar said:


> I am proud to say I'm not one of them watching it. Maybe I'll begin watching again when Tony figures out how to book a legitimate show. So many talented individuals on the roster and they continuously push garbage like OC, Cody and Jericho. If this is what you want to watch congratulations. I prefer not to be one of the lemmings that they are leading to the proverbial cliff.


well it must be working because the target audience demo numbers r insane


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## Eva MaRIHyse (Jun 20, 2014)

So people should base their personal enjoyment off of ratings then...

And that Lana/Lashley/Rusev angle was amazing TV then?


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## CM Buck (Sep 2, 2012)

If you guys hate chip for being a smug prick, don't do it back. Two wrongs don't make a right. You're just going to make him more annoying when aew does something stupid. 

His fun to converse with when his not gloating stop giving him ammo to gloat


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## Marbar (Dec 20, 2019)

The demo numbers may be insane at the moment but that doesn't mean the garbage comedy angles and poor booking isn't going to come back to bite them on the ass. You can only insult someone's intelligence for so long before they lose interest.


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

The match sucked and Trashidy sucks too. Bad rating for your one year anniversary special. No spinning that fact.


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## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

I am here, just wondering if this is the thread where you answer our queries about ratings such as how people who weren't watching knew to turn the channel at that exact moment, or maybe you'll respond to the positioning of the match being placed in a normally high part of the show? Can't wait to discuss this.


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## Ham and Egger (Dec 13, 2005)

Big match Cody and OC bringing in the big numbers. They had a great match so I'm glad they were the highest rated segment of the night.


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## CM Buck (Sep 2, 2012)

Well the bait thread succeeded


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## Jazminator (Jan 9, 2018)

Let AEW worry about ratings. I will never understand fans getting so worked up about this kind of stuff. Just sit back and enjoy (or don’t enjoy) the show.


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## Jazminator (Jan 9, 2018)

Ham and Egger said:


> Big match Cody and OC bringing in the big numbers. They had a great match so I'm glad they were the highest rated segment of the night.


I agree it was a great match. Cody and OC work well together.


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## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

What?! It's almost like this forum generally has trash opinions that no one should take seriously or something.


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## KingofKings1524 (Aug 27, 2007)

It wasn’t a bad match, but OC needs to go back to where he was on the card. I just can’t take him seriously.


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## Klitschko (May 24, 2020)

2020 version of the Rock and Stone Cold right there. When those two locked up, it brought back the memories of Hulk Hogan fighting Andre the Giant from Wrestlemania 3 to me.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Cringeworthy thread. It rated highest because it was in the quarter that often rates highest.

"Buh Toni knos wat hes doin11!!!1"



Firefromthegods said:


> If you guys hate chip for being a smug prick, don't do it back. Two wrongs don't make a right. You're just going to make him more annoying when aew does something stupid.
> 
> His fun to converse with when his not gloating stop giving him ammo to gloat


 Oh damn we've been thinking you were one of the good ones all this time but you're now doing a Pippen by throwing personal insults


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## Hephaesteus (Aug 20, 2018)

Klitschko said:


> 2020 version of the Rock and Stone Cold right there. When those two locked up, it brought back the memories of Hulk Hogan fighting Andre the Giant from Wrestlemania 3 to me.


Cant believe these dumb fucks wasted such an epic match on free tv


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

With them being such huge draws, why don’t Cody and OC go 60 minutes?


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## Klitschko (May 24, 2020)

Hephaesteus said:


> Cant believe these dumb fucks wasted such an epic match on free tv


Dumb fucks, or genius? Did you see the ratings the match pulled? Next boom period for pro wrestling coming up thanks to these two fighting for the ACE title in the company.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

bdon said:


> With them being such huge draws, why don’t Cody and OC go 60 minutes?


They're building to it, first twenty then 40 then the big 60 on PPV. Darby "don't call me Sting" Allin as special guest enforcer


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## Hephaesteus (Aug 20, 2018)

Klitschko said:


> Dumb fucks, or genius? Did you see the ratings the match pulled? Next boom period for pro wrestling coming up thanks to these two fighting for the ACE title in the company.


I stand corrected. OC needs to main event every show culminating with his defeating moxley in a brutal orange mimosa match at the biggest ppv of the year.


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Hephaesteus said:


> I stand corrected. OC needs to main event every show culminating with his defeating moxley in a brutal orange mimosa match at the biggest ppv of the year.


And make it ON A POLE!


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## Klitschko (May 24, 2020)

You know its funny actually. I really like someone tiny like Darby Allin and would want to see him as world champion some day. He has been built up well and even though he's smaller then OC, it somehow works for him. But seeing OC have a competitive match with people just pisses me off for some reason and I can't stop myself from thinking he's too tiny.


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## Hephaesteus (Aug 20, 2018)

Its cuz oc wrestles tiny and doesnt even wrestle seriously half the time while Darby takes legit risks so his wins come off as more believable. Now if people can convince darby not to do stupid shit like that body bag thing, he'd be even better.


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## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

bdon said:


> With them being such huge draws, why don’t Cody and OC go 60 minutes?


Based on oc's ratings a 60 minute on dynamite probably adds 150k viewers to show.


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## The Raw Smackdown (Jan 8, 2017)

The Freshly Squeezed Draw...Damn. I love to see it!


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Klitschko said:


> Dumb fucks, or genius? Did you see the ratings the match pulled? Next boom period for pro wrestling coming up thanks to these two fighting for the ACE title in the company.


Yep. We’re finally starting to understand this wrestling thing.


Hephaesteus said:


> I stand corrected. OC needs to main event every show culminating with his defeating moxley in a brutal orange mimosa match at the biggest ppv of the year.


All of this.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

PushCrymeTyme said:


> its 2020 every live cable show is suffering
> even the nba finals arent getting tna 2010 numbers


Nba Finals averaged a 4.0 and 7.45 million viewers on average. Way above any wrestling the last 15+ years


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Pippen94 said:


> Based on oc's ratings a 60 minute on dynamite probably adds 150k viewers to show.


Exactly! He needs to be front and center, left and right. Push him to the moon! 60 minutes per episode! Fuck making time for those who struggle to draw like Kenny Omega and Adam Page, Dorky Allin, etc.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

bdon said:


> Exactly! He needs to be front and center, left and right. Push him to the moon! 60 minutes per episode! Fuck making time for those who struggle to draw like Kenny Omega and Adam Page, Dorky Allin, etc.


Why not 90? We can get a weekly recap of what OC has been up to followed by a match


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Why not 90? We can get a weekly recap of what OC has been up to followed by a match


They could do a few recaps of his weekly D&D sessions. Each one should add about 150K i would think.


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

I don’t follow the ratings as it seems like a lot of effort but can somebody tell me if all OC’s segments cause a ratings spike and are the biggest draw of each show?

For example, he’s recently had matches against Jericho, 10 and Brodie Lee, did those matches also draw the biggest ratings for the shows that they were on?

The reason I ask (and firstly I’ll admit I hate OC being competitive with AEW’s stars but can see how his gimmick is over) is because if he is the company’s biggest draw then they should be getting the mid card title (TNT) on him straight away to capitalise on his drawing ability because his gimmick does have a shelf life.

I personally think a TNT title reign will ruin the prestige of the title in the long run but this is business and if he’s making more money than anybody else and constantly bringing in more ratings than anybody else it can’t really be ignored.


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## Garty (Jul 29, 2007)

Marbar said:


> The demo numbers may be insane at the moment but that doesn't mean the garbage comedy angles and poor booking isn't going to come back to bite them on the ass. You can only insult someone's intelligence for so long before they lose interest.


You're absolutely right, talking about, "insulting your intelligence", but I just want to point out a little tidbit for you. These same, poor and helpless, "cranial neuropathy" users here on the forum, have said this same shit, every day, since October 2nd 2019... and they're still here.

So, maybe they're right after all? Maybe it has insulted their intelligence? Now that it seems it has brought down their PHD IQ's, to where they've lost so much brain function and although the year has passed, are now just too stupid to remember or realize that.


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## TheDraw (Jun 27, 2019)

PushCrymeTyme said:


> well what do u know its like the man who owns aew & is booking the show knows what the audience wants
> but no he should listen to you same 5 people in the aew section who make thread & posts after post complaining & crying everyday about cody & oc
> numbers dont lie
> 
> ...


My eyes don't lie. He sucks and is a circus act 😂. You might get a few bumps here and there on the ratings switch the way he's been booked....but the point is, acts like him are turn away far more potential long term viewers away than the amount gainee by pushing them. Because his gimmick and look do so much damage to the overall product making it look like a backyard wrestling show.


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## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

"The demo god"


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## NathanMayberry (Oct 11, 2019)

The mere fact that you're celebrating 920,000 viewers on a special episode that was advertised for weeks and had every single title defended shows just how hard you're coping..Do y'all really think this is sustainable? 

If Orange Cassidy is the most watched segment of a wrestling show... how fucking bad is your wrestling show? Can you imagine more people tuning in to watch Rico or The Hurricane than Austin or Taker?


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## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

Hitman1987 said:


> I don’t follow the ratings as it seems like a lot of effort but can somebody tell me if all OC’s segments cause a ratings spike and are the biggest draw of each show?
> 
> For example, he’s recently had matches against Jericho, 10 and Brodie Lee, did those matches also draw the biggest ratings for the shows that they were on?
> 
> ...


Yes


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

That is a big jump from the rest of the card before it, and won’t be ignored

i thought it was a 3* match that became a 4* one in the last 5 minutes

what astounds me as that people still think its rHHHodes and that OC is a ‘comedy gimmick’

i’ve never seen such a continued wilful ignoring of what is happening on the screen in a long time 

its bordering on strange now - luckily it seems the general audience is not under this ‘spell’ and likes both just fine


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Hitman1987 said:


> I don’t follow the ratings as it seems like a lot of effort but can somebody tell me if all OC’s segments cause a ratings spike and are the biggest draw of each show?
> 
> For example, he’s recently had matches against Jericho, 10 and Brodie Lee, did those matches also draw the biggest ratings for the shows that they were on?
> 
> ...


Pippen's previous answer of yes is dishonest. Not sure why he's blatantly lying.

It's pretty mixed tbh. There was a match with Jericho on TV which tanked the ratings and a fair few main event segments with him that tanked ratings.

But then some weeks he does rate highest.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Its not difficult to see why the various pushes are happening. Just look at this forum to start

even haters are tuning in and talking (even if illegally or just on youtube) - just to see what some of these guys are doing now that they’ll hate - controversy creates cash as a smart man said


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Pippen's previous answer of yes is dishonest. Not sure why he's blatantly lying.
> 
> It's pretty mixed tbh. There was a match with Jericho on TV which tanked the ratings and a fair few main event segments with him that tanked ratings.
> 
> But then some weeks he does rate highest.


It does baffle me how actual wrestling fans would tune in for the OC vs Cody match but wouldn’t stick around for a Mox vs Archer match as they tore it up in NJPW.

If OC is a better draw than Cody though then Cody should drop the belt to him otherwise it’s just like WWE where people who get themselves over get held back (Yes movement, Rusev day etc)


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## PushCrymeTyme (May 23, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> Nba Finals averaged a 4.0 and 7.45 million viewers on average. Way above any wrestling the last 15+ years


aka the lowest nba ratings of all time


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Hitman1987 said:


> It does baffle me how actual wrestling fans would tune in for the OC vs Cody match but wouldn’t stick around for a Mox vs Archer match as they tore it up in NJPW.
> 
> *If OC is a better draw than Cody though then Cody should drop the belt to him* otherwise it’s just like WWE where people who get themselves over get held back (Yes movement, Rusev day etc)


well, they were both in that match

Cody is also popular and a draw - been proved before


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

PushCrymeTyme said:


> its 2020 every live cable show is suffering
> even the nba finals arent getting tna 2010 numbers


This is what I responded to



PushCrymeTyme said:


> aka the lowest nba ratings of all time


The NBA Finals averaging a 4.0 rating and 7.45 million viewers is many times more than 2010 TNA numbers. No need to lie to make shitty defensive points because you're upset some don't enjoy Orange Cassidy.


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## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

Of times aew's minute by minute rating has exceeded 1 million oc has featured more than any other wrestler


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Hitman1987 said:


> It does baffle me how actual wrestling fans would tune in for the OC vs Cody match but wouldn’t stick around for a Mox vs Archer match as they tore it up in NJPW.
> 
> If OC is a better draw than Cody though then Cody should drop the belt to him otherwise it’s just like WWE where people who get themselves over get held back (Yes movement, Rusev day etc)


Yeah this is kind of where the excuses for OC stop. When someone suggests OC get a title run the loyalists run.


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> well, they were both in that match
> 
> Cody is also popular and a draw - been proved before


But if OC’s matches against Jericho, 10 and Brodie are out drawing Cody’s matches against other people then it proves that OC is the bigger draw and should have the belt


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Yeah this is kind of where the excuses for OC stop. When someone suggests OC get a title run the loyalists run.


It’s got to happen at some point though otherwise there’s no point pushing him as a competitive singles wrestler if you never actually plan on putting a singles title on him


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## Kopros_The_Great (Jun 26, 2014)

Yea OC is a draw.


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## CM Buck (Sep 2, 2012)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Cringeworthy thread. It rated highest because it was in the quarter that often rates highest.
> 
> "Buh Toni knos wat hes doin11!!!1"
> 
> ...


No? That's how I talk with my mates. Literally my best mate and I call each other cunt as a term of endearment.

Don't police my speech dude. If I had a problem with you I'd tell you.


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## fabi1982 (Jun 28, 2011)

Cult03 said:


> I am here, just wondering if this is the thread where you answer our queries about ratings such as how people who weren't watching knew to turn the channel at that exact moment, or maybe you'll respond to the positioning of the match being placed in a normally high part of the show? Can't wait to discuss this.


Yeah I asked it twice now and I am really interested to know how it works. All I know is 5 mins count as a viewer for a whole show. So if the Q3 does 900 and Q4 does 700 does that mean Q4 lost viewers or they already left in Q3 but stayed longer than 5mins?

And I was always interested why Cody books himself either in Q1, Q4 or Q8, but I think this is somethings AEW fans dont want to know...


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## La Parka (Oct 28, 2008)

Eva MaRIHyse said:


> So people should base their personal enjoyment off of ratings then...
> 
> And that Lana/Lashley/Rusev angle was amazing TV then?


Yes. 

By the logic of AEW super fans the WWE cuckhold angle was in fact better than anything AEW has ever done. 

time to eat crow haterz! cucks draw!


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## Mercian (Jun 26, 2020)

U Guyz R Haters dont no that OC is gr8, Dyna💪 did nearly 1 million viewers now who is


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## fabi1982 (Jun 28, 2011)

La Parka said:


> Yes.
> 
> By the logic of AEW super fans the WWE cuckhold angle was in fact better than anything AEW has ever done.
> 
> time to eat crow haterz! cucks draw!


Maybe thats why they put Miro in a similar cringeworthy story in AEW now, because they know it draws!!


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Hitman1987 said:


> But if OC’s matches against Jericho, 10 and Brodie are out drawing Cody’s matches against other people then it proves that OC is the bigger draw and should have the belt


Cody has very high rated segments too

and metch and online etcetc

not like they are going with an unpopular over a popular


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> Cody has very high rated segments too
> 
> and metch and online etcetc
> 
> not like they are going with an unpopular over a popular


Even if that is true (I can’t say either way) the world title plan seems to be set in stone (Mox/Omega/Hangman/MJF) so the TNT title is the only title up for grabs (the FTW title means nothing) and at this moment in time if OC is the biggest draw in the company then he should be the TNT champion.

Does it really make sense to give your biggest draw 3 title shots in 2 months, possibly 4 if there is a triple threat at full gear, and not have him win any of them?

That will just make people think there’s a glass ceiling and it reverses any credibility OC gained by beating Jericho


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> That is a big jump from the rest of the card before it, and won’t be ignored
> 
> i thought it was a 3* match that became a 4* one in the last 5 minutes
> 
> ...


You’re doubling down that he is not similar to HHH after he just fucking told the world his TNT Title was never going to be a midcard title, after he just fucking told you that the TNT Title is “THE title in professional wrestling”?

Goddamn you’ll eat the shit straight out of the bleach blonde dipshit’s asshole.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Hitman1987 said:


> Even if that is true (I can’t say either way) the world title plan seems to be set in stone (Mox/Omega/Hangman/MJF) so the TNT title is the only title up for grabs (the FTW title means nothing) and at this moment in time if OC is the biggest draw in the company then he should be the TNT champion.
> 
> Does it really make sense to give your biggest draw 3 title shots in 2 months, possibly 4 if there is a triple threat at full gear, and not have him win any of them?
> 
> That will just make people think there’s a glass ceiling and it reverses any credibility OC gained by beating Jericho


personally i would like to see Darby take it off Cody

he is just as popular as OC and they have a long-running story

OC has lost zero credibility - he is in an around the title and is presented as someone who fights above his perceived level.

make no mistake, at some point he’ll win the TNT championship - maybe from Darby? That’ll be na epic match


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

I just...

I mean...

I don’t know how anything can be epic about someone not trying for a quarter of the match. Is it not supposed to look like competition?


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Hitman1987 said:


> It’s got to happen at some point though otherwise there’s no point pushing him as a competitive singles wrestler if you never actually plan on putting a singles title on him


They could use him as a special attraction but when he wrestles every week it's hard to establish that.



bdon said:


> I just...
> 
> I mean...
> 
> I don’t know how anything can be epic about someone not trying for a quarter of the match. Is it not supposed to look like competition?


No stupid, you're talking about when wrestling was popular and drew big money. This is AEW and we're all about catering to one very niche part of the wrestling fan base.


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> personally i would like to see Darby take it off Cody
> 
> he is just as popular as OC and they have a long-running story
> 
> ...


OC is apparently the biggest draw in the company though and more over than anybody else and the people who he is bringing in don’t seem to care about his appearance or lack of wrestling ability so what more can he possible do to justify a title run. He just went over the company’s first ever champ and future hall of famer.

If he brings in the most viewers then he should be the face of the show and hold the title named after the show.

You mention Darby holding the title, which I agree because it should be a mid card title that allows people like MJF, Sammy, Starks, jungle boy to shine, but Darby draws less than the current champ and OC so that isn’t really good for business.

I think my argument is that TK cannot say that OC is the best thing in wrestling, make him credible by giving him rubs against credible opponents but not give him the titles that go with it. That’s how yes movements happen.


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## TeamFlareZakk (Jul 15, 2020)

I enjoyed it! Orange almost had it if it wasnt for the time running out! Looking forward to seeing what happens with the next bout!


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

Chip Chipperson said:


> They could use him as a special attraction but when he wrestles every week it's hard to establish that.
> 
> 
> 
> No stupid, you're talking about when wrestling was popular and drew big money. This is AEW and we're all about catering to one very niche part of the wrestling fan base.


He was used perfectly as a manager who gets involved now and then and the crowd pop.

From day 1 they should have told him to get in the gym and bulk up and work on his wrestling ability therefore when the inevitable push came he wouldn’t look so out of place against guys like Cody who isn’t even that big.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Hitman1987 said:


> He was used perfectly as a manager who gets involved now and then and the crowd pop.
> 
> From day 1 they should have told him to get in the gym and bulk up and work on his wrestling ability therefore when the inevitable push cane he wouldn’t look so out of place against guys like Cody who isn’t even that big.


I'd never have put him with Cody, if the meme is the draw I'd have him wrestle very rarely to keep things fresh and exciting for when he does wrestle.

I agree completely that as a manager who runs interference or the occasional six man tag partner he'd be good. They could've done a whole heap of amusing angles with him as well and just had him be a vignette guy.


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

Chip Chipperson said:


> I'd never have put him with Cody, if the meme is the draw I'd have him wrestle very rarely to keep things fresh and exciting for when he does wrestle.
> 
> I agree completely that as a manager who runs interference or the occasional six man tag partner he'd be good. They could've done a whole heap of amusing angles with him as well and just had him be a vignette guy.


They’ve hot shotted him to the TNT Title scene without proper build and he’s now being overexposed as he’s had 3 titles shots in a month or so.

If he doesn’t win any of them then the additional viewers he brings will boo or switch off because their favourite is getting the glass ceiling treatment.


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## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

If OC is the biggest draw in the company then they need to pack it up and head home. What a joke


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## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> Its not difficult to see why the various pushes are happening. Just look at this forum to start
> 
> even haters are tuning in and talking (even if illegally or just on youtube) - just to see what some of these guys are doing now that they’ll hate - controversy creates cash as a smart man said
> 
> View attachment 92073


That 'smart' man is not employed by a wrestling promotion and helped run WCW out of business. So how smart is he really


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## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

Cult03 said:


> If OC is the biggest draw in the company then they need to pack it up and head home. What a joke


I'll tweet Tony now


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## Garty (Jul 29, 2007)

Some of you need to choose a lane for OC and stay within it. Your "opinions" contradict each other.

*1. Majority of the time...*
Orange Cassidy sucks, he's not over, he's not a draw, he's a comedy goof, he's insulting to pro-wrestling, he can't wrestle, he's too small, he's an indie geek, you can't take him seriously, etc.

*2.Put up or shut up...*
If Orange Cassidy is their #1 guy, the fans love him, he does draw TV ratings, #1 merchandise seller, etc. put a belt on him. If Tony Khan has that much faith in him, he should be pushed to the moon. TNT or World Championship it doesn't matter. Strike now while he's hot. I can't believe they gave him a Title run.

*3.If it were to happen...*
See "opinion" number one.


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

Cult03 said:


> If OC is the biggest draw in the company then they need to pack it up and head home. What a joke


Well that’s another problem altogether, if your comedy act is drawing more than the rest of your roster that contains established stars (Mox/Jericho/Miro) and your anniversary show is maxing at 1million (which TNT May be happy with) but other shows which have been declining for decades are doubling that then something must be wrong.

AEW has the money, infrastructure and roster to compete with and surpass WWE but it hasn’t managed that yet.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Garty said:


> Some of you need to choose a lane for OC and stay within it. Your "opinions" contradict each other.
> 
> *1. Majority of the time...*
> Orange Cassidy sucks, he's not over, he's not a draw, he's a comedy goof, he's insulting to pro-wrestling, he can't wrestle, he's too small, he's an indie geek, you can't take him seriously, etc.
> ...


It’s pretty ducking simple: if he’s a draw, go with it. Test your faith in him. If you don’t do it, it is ONLY due to the fact you KNOW it will run off a large portion of the fanbase within a year.


----------



## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

Garty said:


> Some of you need to choose a lane for OC and stay within it. Your "opinions" contradict each other.
> 
> *1. Majority of the time...*
> Orange Cassidy sucks, he's not over, he's not a draw, he's a comedy goof, he's insulting to pro-wrestling, he can't wrestle, he's too small, he's an indie geek, you can't take him seriously, etc.
> ...


One of those is a statement, the 2nd one starts with the word "if" implying it is heavily based on a set of variables. 

He's not really a draw, he's not really over, he's definitely a geek and I can't take him seriously, but IF you guys actually believe him to be those things then why shouldn't they put the title on him?


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Cult03 said:


> One of those is a statement, the 2nd one starts with the word "if" implying it is heavily based on a set of variables.
> 
> He's not really a draw, he's not really over, he's definitely a geek and I can't take him seriously, but IF you guys actually believe him to be those things then why shouldn't they put the title on him?


I'm not one of the blind super supporters of OC but I do believe there is a spot for him on the card, just not in the main event. Hes more apt to Too Cool, Santino etc. They were super over and popular but they were never world champion main event talent. AEW fucked up by giving OC a 3 month blood feud with Jericho in that sense. 

However there is definitely a balance to be found of having OC featured but not at the expense of top stars. I feel like quite a few people on both sides of the argument are too extreme in their opinion on OC.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

sim8 said:


> I'm not one of the blind super supporters of OC but I do believe there is a spot for him on the card, just not in the main event. Hes more apt to Too Cool, Santino etc. They were super over and popular but they were never world champion main event talent. AEW fucked up by giving OC a 3 month blood feud with Jericho in that sense.
> 
> However there is definitely a balance to be found of having OC featured but not at the expense of top stars. I feel like quite a few people on both sides of the argument are too extreme in their opinion on OC.


Cult and I both used to defend Cassidy. He has a spot on the card.

The “AEW can do no wrong“ began thumping their chest about Cassidy as he rose further and further up the card.

So, again, if we were wrong in wishing he’d stay in the undercard, then AEW needs to put their fucking money on the line and go for broke.


----------



## ReekOfAwesomenesss (Apr 6, 2012)

Cassidy being a bigger draw than Omega. lol gotta love it.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

bdon said:


> Cult and I both used to defend Cassidy. He has a spot on the card.
> 
> The “AEW can do no wrong“ began thumping their chest about Cassidy as he rose further and further up the card.
> 
> So, again, if we were wrong in wishing he’d stay in the undercard, then AEW needs to put their fucking money on the line and go for broke.


The thing hurting AEW the most is their blind super fans. How ironic


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

sim8 said:


> The thing hurting AEW the most is their blind super fans. How ironic


Reminds me of TNA, near the end they had their loyal million or so fans who thought the show was amazing no matter what they did and would defend anything but without that general casual fan interest (Which AEW doesn't have either) TNA could never really grow.

However they kept pumping money into trying to attract that casual fan and pump those ratings up (Like AEW does) which lead to the company losing money and having to sell up.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Reminds me of TNA, near the end they had their loyal million or so fans who thought the show was amazing no matter what they did and would defend anything but without that general casual fan interest (Which AEW doesn't have either) TNA could never really grow.
> 
> However they kept pumping money into trying to attract that casual fan and pump those ratings up (Like AEW does) which lead to the company losing money and having to sell up.


I see the similarity there but thankfully AEW isn't as bad as TNA. Things do need to improve though


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

sim8 said:


> I see the similarity there but thankfully AEW isn't as bad as TNA. Things do need to improve though


Eh, I dunno man, I went back and rewatched TNA 2010 earlier this year and whilst the wrestling wasn't great the stories and promos were pretty good.

I stopped watching TNA regularly in 2014 or 2015 (Whenever they were doing the lame Hardys Vs Team 3.D Vs The Wolves deal) but even then at least the shows were entertainingly bad as opposed to just bad like AEW offers up.

I doubt they would've had say Kurt Angle have an anniversary match against Shark Boy or something...


----------



## Christopher Near (Jan 16, 2019)

Total bellas has beaten both nxt and aew in ratings. Does that make the show good


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Eh, I dunno man, I went back and rewatched TNA 2010 earlier this year and whilst the wrestling wasn't great the stories and promos were pretty good.
> 
> I stopped watching TNA regularly in 2014 or 2015 (Whenever they were doing the lame Hardys Vs Team 3.D Vs The Wolves deal) but even then at least the shows were entertainingly bad as opposed to just bad like AEW offers up.
> 
> I doubt they would've had say Kurt Angle have an anniversary match against Shark Boy or something...


Wasn't 2010 the year with Abyss and the magic ring and the 'they are coming'. Maybe I just remember the bad stuff though. 

You held on to TNA a lot longer than I did

With AEW, I still have overall good feelings


----------



## Christopher Near (Jan 16, 2019)

DJ Punk said:


> What?! It's almost like this forum generally has trash opinions that no one should take seriously or something.


So your opinion is the good and only good one?


----------



## izhack111 (Aug 9, 2016)

It's time for Oc vs Mox for the belt and Oc needs to win...it will break the raiting easy 1 mill


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Christopher Near said:


> Total bellas has beaten both nxt and aew in ratings. Does that make the show good


This is the dumbest post I’ve seen today. the show is fantastic for their target audience and in their eyes absolutely. Everything can be looked at subjectively.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

sim8 said:


> Wasn't 2010 the year with Abyss and the magic ring and the 'they are coming'. Maybe I just remember the bad stuff though.
> 
> You held on to TNA a lot longer than I did
> 
> With AEW, I still have overall good feelings


Yeah it had the dumb Abyss angle, a lame Four Horsemen reunion, "They" etc but also a lot of good stuff like AJ as TNA World Champion, a good year from Angle, Jeff Hardy doing well, Van Dam etc.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Yeah it had the dumb Abyss angle, a lame Four Horsemen reunion, "They" etc but also a lot of good stuff like AJ as TNA World Champion, a good year from Angle, Jeff Hardy doing well, Van Dam etc.


AJ Styles as Nature Boy 2.0, right? Not sure if I would classify that as good. But fair enough, glad you enjoyed it at least


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

sim8 said:


> AJ Styles as Nature Boy 2.0, right? Not sure if I would classify that as good. But fair enough, glad you enjoyed it at least


Match quality wise it's AJ so of course it was great. I didn't like that Flair came in and had a mini me in AJ I think it should've been Hogan + AJ all along taking on Flair and Desmond Wolfe in a blood feud but for whatever reason Hogan saw potential in Abyss as top babyface star.

And look at AJ now...


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Match quality wise it's AJ so of course it was great. I didn't like that Flair came in and had a mini me in AJ I think it should've been Hogan + AJ all along taking on Flair and Desmond Wolfe in a blood feud but for whatever reason Hogan saw potential in Abyss as top babyface star.
> 
> And look at AJ now...


Oh no, never doubted AJ Styles as a talent. But even the greatest talent can't overcome stupid ass booking.


----------



## Christopher Near (Jan 16, 2019)

optikk sucks said:


> This is the dumbest post I’ve seen today. the show is fantastic for their target audience and in their eyes absolutely. Everything can be looked at subjectively.


Exactly. I'll use another example

The lana and lashley wedding did good numbers despite many fans online saying "they don't care"


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Christopher Near said:


> Exactly. I'll use another example
> 
> The lana and lashley wedding did good numbers despite many fans online saying "they don't care"


Because we are the minority. The complainers and IWC are usually the minority.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Any normal person if they don’t like something they’d tune out.


----------



## fabi1982 (Jun 28, 2011)

optikk sucks said:


> Any normal person if they don’t like something they’d tune out.


But thats what they did, if OC/Cody was above everyone else ratings wise, the viewers decreased after that. So basically everything/everyone after Cody and OC can be canned.

Edit: and then again can you tell me how the ratings work? People sit there and wait for the OC tweet that he is on? Or maybe top of the hours stay for 5 mins and then went on?


----------



## yeahright2 (Feb 11, 2011)

Ham and Egger said:


> Big match Cody and OC bringing in the big numbers. They had a great match so I'm glad they were the highest rated segment of the night.


Nah. The headline clearly says it did 920.000 for the Matt Hardy interview


----------



## qntntgood (Mar 12, 2010)

P Thriller said:


> Just because a lot of people watch something doesn't make it good lol. The main roster beats the crap out of AEW every week in the rankings, it doesn't mean it is a better show. Good for them though I guess...crazy to think that 900,000 is something to brag about. That isn't even TNA level ratings.


Thank you saying it,but why didn't they post the whole thing.becuase moxley and archer was the biggest draw on the whole show, and notice you don't hear about the DVR numbers anymore since meltzer was force to report they have dropped by more then half both aew and nxt.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

To think Orange Cassidy is AEW's polarizing split the fans John Cena figure is hilarious. 

"Oh he draws, he should be used. So suck it haters"

"So the ratings still suck and he sucks nobody takes this serious because of him" 

Paired with how Cody beating Brodie was received, this next year of AEW reception is going to be telling. Some have been vocal on what they dislike (sometimes overly vocal). But more and more are starting to lose the new toy shine and be more critical. This section is going to be even more fun in the coming months.


----------



## validreasoning (Jul 4, 2012)

Like Hornswoggle and Santino Marella OC no doubt generates interest but wwe were heavily critised for pushing the aforementioned duo despite their popularity among fans but they never had them at top of the card either. Technically Hornswoggle was in mainevent program as Vince's son in late 2007 and sueing dx in 2009


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

Christopher Near said:


> So your opinion is the good and only good one?


"Generally"

Reading comprehension, my friend.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

RapShepard said:


> To think Orange Cassidy is AEW's polarizing split the fans John Cena figure is hilarious.
> 
> "Oh he draws, he should be used. So suck it haters"
> 
> ...


Fun times ahead..people are so impatient


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

The Definition of Technician said:


> Fun times ahead..people are so impatient


That's just life in general these days lol


----------



## CMPunkRock316 (Jan 17, 2016)

I thought all the title matches were good except the women's one but Swole is not the best.

I actually think a draw was a good place as you don't really want to have OC go over Jericho and immediately lose 2 Title matches in a row.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Hitman1987 said:


> OC is apparently the biggest draw in the company though and more over than anybody else and the people who he is bringing in don’t seem to care about his appearance or lack of wrestling ability so what more can he possible do to justify a title run. He just went over the company’s first ever champ and future hall of famer.
> 
> If he brings in the most viewers then he should be the face of the show and hold the title named after the show.
> 
> ...


ahhh.... hyperbole


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

sim8 said:


> That 'smart' man is not employed by a wrestling promotion and helped run WCW out of business. So how smart is he really


i dunno - about 99% smarter than everybody who never did it?


----------



## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> ahhh.... hyperbole


We can revisit after the next Cody vs OC match.

My prediction is Cody retains and moves onto his full gear feud with Darby (as they have history) as I think OC only got the second title shot, straight after the first title shot, as they didn’t have any other way to get him into a prominent spot of the anniversary show and the time out was their way of trying to protect him before his inevitable loss.


----------



## midgetlover69 (Nov 27, 2016)

PushCrymeTyme said:


> its 2020 every live cable show is suffering
> even the nba finals arent getting tna 2010 numbers


Aew and tna from any year dont even get a quarter of the nbas ratings

Wrestling is just trash now. If it was good, people would watch it


----------



## Demoslasher (Jun 22, 2010)

For what it’s worth, I hope you’re right about Orange Cas...because AEW has invested a heavy amount in him, given him shit tons of network tv time, two wins over Y2J including at a ppv, and just basically beat Cody even if the bell rang at 2 1/2...if it doesn’t work...that’s going to really hurt them. Thing is, you poor that much resources into anyone and they will feel like a main eventer even if they’re not.

personally I don’t like him, tried to give it a chance, just doesn’t do it for me. He’s a generic small indy guy in his look, Does nothing that a thousand guys bigger than him can’t also do, not a great seller, not a great promo...literally the only people who seem to like him are the snarky fans that think the pockets shit is funny. Same people that were all about captain dick flip a few months ago before he was outed as a sexual predator...Just my opinion though,


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> i dunno - about 99% smarter than everybody who never did it?


Erm no. That's like saying Dixie Carter is 99% smarter than everybody who never did it. Don't mix privilege and opportunity with actual talent. The world doesn't work like that. Plenty of fantastic people never get a chance in their field while plenty of shit dumbasses do.


----------



## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

Cult03 said:


> I am here, just wondering if this is the thread where you answer our queries about ratings such as how people who weren't watching knew to turn the channel at that exact moment, or maybe you'll respond to the positioning of the match being placed in a normally high part of the show? Can't wait to discuss this.


Not sure why I expected a response. This happens far too often, you guys just back down and disappear when questioned or insult people. The AEW fandom is toxic as fuck


----------



## Freezer Geezer (Jul 15, 2020)

Cult03 said:


> Not sure why I expected a response. This happens far too often, you guys just back down and disappear when questioned or insult people. The AEW fandom is toxic as fuck


They're probably running scared due to your incredible intellect, wit and unshakeable belief in your own debating abilities.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Freezer Geezer said:


> They're probably running scared due to your incredible intellect, wit and unshakeable belief in your own debating abilities.


The desire to actually debate a valid issue seems not to warrant a personal attack.


----------



## Freezer Geezer (Jul 15, 2020)

Two Sheds said:


> The desire to actually debate a valid issue seems not to warrant a personal attack.


No, I'm in agreement. It's a stupid point that was made. He would rinse them on it.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Freezer Geezer said:


> No, I'm in agreement. It's a stupid point that was made. He would rinse them on it.


My sarcasm detector just caught fire. You owe me a new one.


----------



## Freezer Geezer (Jul 15, 2020)

Two Sheds said:


> My sarcasm detector just caught fire. You owe me a new one.


Not at all. The level of debate we have witnessed in recent times regarding OC being a massive draw due to one single segment is bordering on trolling from some people. It's not really a point anybody with any sense can debate. Cult's got them, hence why they aren't replying. Yourself, Chip and Cult have these folk on the run for the most part.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Freezer Geezer said:


> Not at all. The level of debate we have witnessed in recent times regarding OC being a massive draw due to one single segment is bordering on trolling from some people. It's not really a point anybody with any sense can debate. Cult's got them, hence why they aren't replying. Yourself, Chip and Cult have these folk on the run for the most part.


It was weird phrasing then I guess.


----------



## Freezer Geezer (Jul 15, 2020)

Two Sheds said:


> It was weird phrasing then I guess.


The fact I'm in agreement doesn't change the fact that bumping a topic to show how great you are and how stupid others are is an extreme act of self fellatio. An act that is bordering on obnoxious, in fact. It's done for no purpose other than to bait and big themselves up. Not actually for the purpose of debating a topic.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Freezer Geezer said:


> The fact I'm in agreement doesn't change the fact that bumping a topic to show how great you are and how stupid others are is an extreme act of self fellatio. An act that is bordering on obnoxious, in fact. It's done for no purpose other than to bait and big themselves up. Not actually for the purpose of debating a topic.


Oh, I see. So I did read it right.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Two Sheds said:


> Oh, I see. So I did read it right.


Lmao


----------



## Freezer Geezer (Jul 15, 2020)

Two Sheds said:


> Oh, I see. So I did read it right.


50/50.


----------



## Freezer Geezer (Jul 15, 2020)

Two Sheds said:


> The desire to actually debate a valid issue seems not to warrant a personal attack.


I would also point out, referring to the "AEW fanbase" as "toxic as fuck" seems to quite clearly be hoping for a reciprocal exchange of abuse. Hence the sarcasm in response to highlight what was clearly the aim of the post.

You're all quality posters, there's no need to bait and troll in the hope of an exchange with one of these "toxic as fuck" AEW fanboys just for the purpose of an ego massage because you're right. And you are right on this very topic. Sleep soundly in that knowledge.

It's the sort of shit that is starting to make this site unreadable unfortunately. Two sides bantering and flinging shit at eachother across no man's land.


----------



## ripcitydisciple (Dec 18, 2014)

Firefromthegods said:


> If you guys hate chip for being a smug prick, don't do it back. Two wrongs don't make a right. You're just going to make him more annoying when aew does something stupid.
> 
> His fun to converse with when his not gloating stop giving him ammo to gloat


He's going to gloat with or without ammo.

Why?

Because he is a smug prick. Like the rest of them.

This thread makes no difference.


----------



## Freezer Geezer (Jul 15, 2020)

ripcitydisciple said:


> He's going to gloat with or without ammo.
> 
> Why?
> 
> ...


And here we have the same sort of abuse from the other side. 

You're better than this, too.


----------



## ripcitydisciple (Dec 18, 2014)

Freezer Geezer said:


> And here we have the same sort of abuse from the other side.
> 
> You're better than this, too.


Am I? They act like their opinions are fact and like its written law and anyone who doesn't agree with them is the stupidest mother fucker on the planet. 

So fuck them.


----------



## .christopher. (Jan 14, 2014)

sim8 said:


> I see the similarity there but thankfully AEW isn't as bad as TNA. Things do need to improve though


It depends.

If you're comparing AEW to TNA post hiring Hogan and Bischoff then you may have a point.

However, if you're comparing AEW to pre Hogan and Bischoff TNA then I completely disagree. AEW has never come close to how good TNA was before Dixie, Hogan and Bischoff killed it.


optikk sucks said:


> Because we are the minority. The complainers and IWC are usually the minority.


If you compare how many millions that have stopped watching wrestling to how many still watch and new fans created then, no, the "complainers" aren't the minority.

The majority realise wrestling sucks now. That's why it's dying.


----------



## Freezer Geezer (Jul 15, 2020)

ripcitydisciple said:


> Am I? They act like their opinions are fact and like its written law and anyone who doesn't agree with them is the stupidest mother fucker on the planet.
> 
> So fuck them.


I've enjoyed your posts in my time here so I do think you're better than responding like that, yeah.

But by the same token I really enjoy reading Lheurch, Cult and Chip's post on here too. We're all wrestling fans and we all offer different perspectives on things that all have value and merit and are worth reading for that reason alone.

But when people choose to be abusive, bait or outright troll all it does is pollute this place. Any time you go for a swim here you're gonna get the taste of shit in your mouth with the amount of baiting and trolling that's going on from all angles. I'm not claiming to be above anyone else here, either. I've succumbed to the occasional moment of responding with piss and vinegar when people troll. But it made me realise, if you honestly don't like what people are saying, block them. Block trolls or whatever you consider to be a troll.

What makes it harder though is when good posters begin resorting to baiting in order to either boost their ego or to point score. And that is happening way too much lately from both sides. Look at the state of the OP for instance. It's descending into entrenched view points and I don't know about you, but it makes this place a lot less enjoyable to read.


----------



## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

Klitschko said:


> You know its funny actually. I really like someone tiny like Darby Allin and would want to see him as world champion some day. He has been built up well and even though he's smaller then OC, it somehow works for him. But seeing OC have a competitive match with people just pisses me off for some reason and I can't stop myself from thinking he's too tiny.


That is my feeling as well. Darby has something special and I would mind not him becoming Champ even for his size. He has that Jeff Hardy quiet charisma. But I just cannot buy OC higher than Mid-card.


----------



## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

Freezer Geezer said:


> The fact I'm in agreement doesn't change the fact that bumping a topic to show how great you are and how stupid others are is an extreme act of self fellatio. An act that is bordering on obnoxious, in fact. It's done for no purpose other than to bait and big themselves up. Not actually for the purpose of debating a topic.


It was simply a reminder to those who obviously missed my initial question, in the hope they would respond this time. It's definitely something I want to discuss but I'm noticing a pattern with these guys when questioned. I think the pattern is obvious but I am only here for discussion. Also this entire thread is a bait thread, we bit, now where's the response?


----------



## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

.christopher. said:


> It depends.
> 
> If you're comparing AEW to TNA post hiring Hogan and Bischoff then you may have a point.
> 
> ...


I liked TNA 2012 personally. It's like Bishoff/Hogan pulled back on the bullshit with gazillion angles and groups and it was mainly about Bobby Roode's run as Champ for the first half. It was simple solid booking and it worked. I've never seen anybody been that well booked as Champ in any company since. I don't know who booked that but it was good.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

ripcitydisciple said:


> He's going to gloat with or without ammo.
> 
> Why?
> 
> ...


You've got it all figured out. Good to see Freezer trying to peace keep but it's hard when insults are thrown for no reason


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Haha, I can’t believe that people are excited about 920k viewers.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

sim8 said:


> Erm no. That's like saying Dixie Carter is 99% smarter than everybody who never did it. Don't mix privilege and opportunity with actual talent. The world doesn't work like that. Plenty of fantastic people never get a chance in their field while plenty of shit dumbasses do.


lol, Dixie is 99% smarter than everybody who never did it

you guys really suffer from ‘arm-chair coaching’ where you think this shit is easy.

writing 1 fantasy show on a board is easy - run a wrestling company weekly and tell me how it feels after a year. All the money in the world can’t solve all your problems that brings


----------



## Mercian (Jun 26, 2020)

Thought about this last night, Ive said countless times about the absurdity and anarchy of the booking but are there any positives? Yes

Eddie Kingston V Moxley- originally brought in as a one shot, Kingston despite two losses on TV has kept strong and whilst other people who have faced Mox have hit midcard this has been kept relevant and good on them for doing so! I never lost, I never quit.

FTR- Have been booked as a great Arn/Tully team, great matches, good mic spots

Will Hobbs- Enhancement talent chance for stardom, he hasnt beaten anyone major yet but he's had a rub and getting over

Allin V Team Tazz-although Starks has lost in a TV match the feud has thankfully carried on


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

.christopher. said:


> It depends.
> 
> If you're comparing AEW to TNA post hiring Hogan and Bischoff then you may have a point.
> 
> ...


The complainers are the minority. The majority are the people who just stop watching. AEW haven’t lost the majority.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

optikk sucks said:


> The complainers are the minority. The majority are the people who just stop watching. AEW haven’t lost the majority.


October 2019 rating: 1.4 million

October 2020 rating on heavily anticipated one year anniversary card: 800,000 and some change.


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

Chip Chipperson said:


> October 2019 rating: 1.4 million
> 
> October 2020 rating on heavily anticipated one year anniversary card: 800,000 and some change.


Smackdown debut on fox 3.9 mill
This week 1.9 mill
Debuts get bigger ratings - learn how TV works Herb


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> lol, Dixie is 99% smarter than everybody who never did it
> 
> you guys really suffer from ‘arm-chair coaching’ where you think this shit is easy.
> 
> writing 1 fantasy show on a board is easy - run a wrestling company weekly and tell me how it feels after a year. All the money in the world can’t solve all your problems that brings


You forget many knock it out of park when booking on video games


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Pippen94 said:


> You forget many knock it out of park when booking on video games


i hear there are some fig feds drawing massive numbers


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Pippen94 said:


> Smackdown debut on fox 3.9 mill
> This week 1.9 mill
> Debuts get bigger ratings - learn how TV works Herb


Mhm, so the majority stopped watching Smackdown also. What's your point, Pips?


----------



## Freezer Geezer (Jul 15, 2020)

Cult03 said:


> It was simply a reminder to those who obviously missed my initial question, in the hope they would respond this time. It's definitely something I want to discuss but I'm noticing a pattern with these guys when questioned. I think the pattern is obvious but I am only here for discussion. Also this entire thread is a bait thread, we bit, now where's the response?


You kind of lost any ability to claim the moral high ground when you called the AEW fandom toxic as fuck, hence why I sarcastically replied to you pointing out that's the sort of reply you would get when your post was antagonistic in nature. You can't say that and then just claim you're only here for discussion. The opening post is stupid. Responding in kind benefits nobody. Whether you agree or not, you are better than that as you're a quality poster. You don't need to lower yourself to the level of responding with bait.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Chip Chipperson said:


> October 2019 rating: 1.4 million
> 
> October 2020 rating on heavily anticipated one year anniversary card: 800,000 and some change.


not very good at maths then my guy. That’s approx 60% or so - majority.
So my point still stands lol


----------



## reyfan (May 23, 2011)

And the video of the guy shooting himself with a shotgun had millions of views.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

optikk sucks said:


> not very good at maths then my guy. That’s approx 60% or so - majority.
> So my point still stands lol


At least 2 million fans choose to watch some form of wrestling per week. Roughly 40% choose AEW. Try your math again, “my guy”.

And this is ignoring the nearly 8 billion people on this planet who refuse to watch period.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

bdon said:


> At least 2 million fans choose to watch some form of wrestling per week. Roughly 40% choose AEW. Try your math again, “my guy”.
> 
> And this is ignoring the nearly 8 billion people on this planet who refuse to watch period.


don't be such a fool bdon. the argument chip made is that the majority of the original audience of 1.4million have tuned out of aew. when that's obviously wrong. please read the context before you reply.

and your second statement is the most ridiculous and dumb thing i've read today. almost 40% of the world live in extreme poverty - meaning they can't even access wwe/aew if they wanted to. don't be such a nincompoop and come back when you start acting your age of 36.


----------



## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

Freezer Geezer said:


> You kind of lost any ability to claim the moral high ground when you called the AEW fandom toxic as fuck, hence why I sarcastically replied to you pointing out that's the sort of reply you would get when your post was antagonistic in nature. You can't say that and then just claim you're only here for discussion. The opening post is stupid. Responding in kind benefits nobody. Whether you agree or not, you are better than that as you're a quality poster. You don't need to lower yourself to the level of responding with bait.


Nah fuck that noise, I asked for an answer and the same people did the same thing they usually do and avoided answering and were rightfully called out. The fan base is toxic. I am here for discussion and I rarely get it, therefore the fan base needs to be called out for what it is.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Cult03 said:


> Nah fuck that noise, I asked for an answer and the same people did the same thing they usually do and avoided answering and were rightfully called out. The fan base is toxic. I am here for discussion and I rarely get it, therefore the fan base needs to be called out for what it is.


aren't you the adult teacher who created an alt account to shit on AEW?

and AEW's fanbase is toxic? LMAOOOOOOOO.

goofies EVERYWHERE. you make your buddies look bad


----------



## kyledriver (May 22, 2020)

This forum is depressing 

Sent from my POCOPHONE F1 using Tapatalk


----------



## Freezer Geezer (Jul 15, 2020)

kyledriver said:


> This forum is depressing
> 
> Sent from my POCOPHONE F1 using Tapatalk


I think I'm done now in honesty. I don't get any enjoyment coming here anymore. Rather sad when former quality posters choose to engage in baiting, whilst claiming they only want discussion. Tired of constantly having to wade through shit to find good discussion. It's been nice, all the best to everyone on here who has engaged in thoughtful discussion over the past few months.


----------



## Klitschko (May 24, 2020)

Cult03 said:


> Nah fuck that noise, I asked for an answer and the same people did the same thing they usually do and avoided answering and were rightfully called out. The fan base is toxic. I am here for discussion and I rarely get it, therefore the fan base needs to be called out for what it is.


The fanbase isn't that toxic, cmon now. This entire section is flooded with majority of people shitting on AEW, including me lately. Nothing they do pleases most of the people in this section. The people that actually defend them are the minority now. You get one guy coming in a thread and saying he likes something and then you get 10 guys jumping on his back. Hell, im guilty of doing this too.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> lol, Dixie is 99% smarter than everybody who never did it
> 
> you guys really suffer from ‘arm-chair coaching’ where you think this shit is easy.
> 
> writing 1 fantasy show on a board is easy - run a wrestling company weekly and tell me how it feels after a year. All the money in the world can’t solve all your problems that brings


Where did I say here I can do better? I just said Dixie and Eric Bischoff couldn't do well when they had the opportunity. You're taking two people who had legit opportunities to become major players in the wrestling game (one of who actually managed it before realising he's a one trick pony) and both failed and then either left the business or were pretty much fired from it. 

You can sit here and tell the world how great they were but history has shown both are failures. This isn't 'I can do it better than them' thing. This is a 'they can't do it' thing


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

.christopher. said:


> It depends.
> 
> If you're comparing AEW to TNA post hiring Hogan and Bischoff then you may have a point.
> 
> ...


TNA at its peak was great but AEW first year is better than TNA first year


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

sim8 said:


> Where did I say here I can do better? I just said Dixie and Eric Bischoff couldn't do well when they had the opportunity. You're taking two people who had legit opportunities to become major players in the wrestling game (one of who actually managed it before realising he's a one trick pony) and both failed and then either left the business or were pretty much fired from it.
> 
> You can sit here and tell the world how great they were but history has shown both are failures. This isn't 'I can do it better than them' thing. This is a 'they can't do it' thing


they both did it for years / effectively. They both had more continued success than a billion arm chair bookers and many of their actual peers. 

why are we even talking about this? You just pointed out that he ‘wasn’t a smart man’ - which he was

and derailed the thread - what’s the point of this conversation?


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> they both did it for years / effectively. They both had more continued success than a billion arm chair bookers and many of their actual peers.
> 
> why are we even talking about this? You just pointed out that he ‘wasn’t a smart man’ - which he was
> 
> and derailed the thread - what’s the point of this conversation?


Nothing has been derailed. Debates and discussions evolve as people share ideas and viewpoints. It's how it normally works mate.

And the point of this conversation is because you think controversy creates cash as a way to justify OCs mega push, and the man who really used that as the basis of his booking of Eric Bischoff and WCW died. Fingerpoke of Doom, Starrcade 1997, Goldberg being Taszered to end his streak. All controversial moves and all contributed to the end of the last true competitor of WWE. So if that is the basis of your argument for OC being in top feuds then it's quite frankly a shit argument.

And Dixie Carter is the epitome of a money mark. No understanding of wrestling as a form of entertainment or as a business. No self awareness of nobody wants to see her as a central figure on Impact. I understand you wanting to defend Bischoff and there's an actual discussion to be had about his impact in wrestling but defending Dixie and trying to make her out to be effective is just wrong.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

sim8 said:


> Nothing has been derailed. Debates and discussions evolve as people share ideas and viewpoints. It's how it normally works mate.
> 
> And the point of this conversation is because you think controversy creates cash as a way to justify OCs mega push, and the man who really used that as the basis of his booking of Eric Bischoff and WCW died. Fingerpoke of Doom, Starrcade 1997, Goldberg being Taszered to end his streak. All controversial moves and all contributed to the end of the last true competitor of WWE. So if that is the basis of your argument for OC being in top feuds then it's quite frankly a shit argument.
> 
> And Dixie Carter is the epitome of a money mark. No understanding of wrestling as a form of entertainment or as a business. No self awareness of nobody wants to see her as a central figure on Impact. I understand you wanting to defend Bischoff and there's an actual discussion to be had about his impact in wrestling but defending Dixie and trying to make her out to be effective is just wrong.


To Dixie's credit at least she spent millions signing experienced wrestling people who knew what they were doing. I don't think she became actively involved in story lines for 7-8 years either.

She's a money mark but Tony is THE money mark


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

Klitschko said:


> The fanbase isn't that toxic, cmon now. This entire section is flooded with majority of people shitting on AEW, including me lately. Nothing they do pleases most of the people in this section. The people that actually defend them are the minority now. You get one guy coming in a thread and saying he likes something and then you get 10 guys jumping on his back. Hell, im guilty of doing this too.



Because the show sucks. It wasnt like this here 4 or 5 months ago even. Their refusal to pull the trigger on any major angle and the constant Cassidy push has turned a lot of people.

Their booking is flat out lazy. It is what it is. You have this Omega vs. Page story, and how do you get to the match? A tournament full of 20 minute matches. Its bullshit. Do you know why its done that way? Because Khan is lazy. Instead of creating set pieces, vignettes, videos, promos to build up Omega vs. Page and just do the match, he has to book a bunch of "wrestling matches" to get to it. Oh, Im sure Meltzer will cream over it. Awesome.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Chip Chipperson said:


> To Dixie's credit at least she spent millions signing experienced wrestling people who knew what they were doing. I don't think she became actively involved in story lines for 7-8 years either.
> 
> She's a money mark but Tony is THE money mark


AEW actually has some brilliant minds under contract in all fairness. Just need to utilise them better


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

sim8 said:


> AEW actually has some brilliant minds under contract in all fairness. Just need to utilise them better


In fact I wanna add, I think AEW has everything it needs to be successful for may years to come. They got a great roster, they got some great minds backstage, tv, money, infrastructure. Their creative at times has been good too. Just need it to become more consistent and find itself and we have a winner.

That's what makes it so frustrating. AEW has the ingredients. Just need to put it together now.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Because the show sucks. It wasnt like this here 4 or 5 months ago even. Their refusal to pull the trigger on any major angle and the constant Cassidy push has turned a lot of people.
> 
> Their booking is flat out lazy. It is what it is. You have this Omega vs. Page story, and how do you get to the match? A tournament full of 20 minute matches. Its bullshit. Do you know why its done that way? Because Khan is lazy. Instead of creating set pieces, vignettes, videos, promos to build up Omega vs. Page and just do the match, he has to book a bunch of "wrestling matches" to get to it. Oh, Im sure Meltzer will cream over it. Awesome.


Yup, he books a lot of long matches because he/his team don't want to produce content. Easier to just book a 20 minute match to fill time instead of filming 1 backstage interview and 4 vignettes to fill that same time.



sim8 said:


> AEW actually has some brilliant minds under contract in all fairness. Just need to utilise them better


They've got some great minds but unfortunately none of them are hired in the creative or management positions.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Freezer Geezer said:


> I think I'm done now in honesty. I don't get any enjoyment coming here anymore. Rather sad when former quality posters choose to engage in baiting, whilst claiming they only want discussion. Tired of constantly having to wade through shit to find good discussion. It's been nice, all the best to everyone on here who has engaged in thoughtful discussion over the past few months.


So, those pretending that Cassidy’s push is deserved and calling him the GOAT aren’t part of the problem. It’s just those willing to point out stupid shit?

Don’t let the door hit ya, where the good Lord split ya! ✌🏻


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

sim8 said:


> Nothing has been derailed. Debates and discussions evolve as people share ideas and viewpoints. It's how it normally works mate.
> 
> And the point of this conversation is because you think controversy creates cash as a way to justify OCs mega push, and the man who really used that as the basis of his booking of Eric Bischoff and WCW died. Fingerpoke of Doom, Starrcade 1997, Goldberg being Taszered to end his streak. All controversial moves and all contributed to the end of the last true competitor of WWE. So if that is the basis of your argument for OC being in top feuds then it's quite frankly a shit argument.
> 
> And Dixie Carter is the epitome of a money mark. No understanding of wrestling as a form of entertainment or as a business. No self awareness of nobody wants to see her as a central figure on Impact. I understand you wanting to defend Bischoff and there's an actual discussion to be had about his impact in wrestling but defending Dixie and trying to make her out to be effective is just wrong.


you're cherry picking one line from the overall point I was making

my whole line:"
Its not difficult to see why the various pushes are happening. Just look at this forum to start

even haters are tuning in and talking (even if illegally or just on youtube) - just to see what some of these guys are doing now that they’ll hate - controversy creates cash as a smart man said"

fact - this forum can't stop talking about OC (as pointed out in the screenshots of my original post'
fact - OC is in high rated segments
fact - he is in high viewed youtube vids and is always a-buzz on twitter, positively and negatively
and finally, fact - controversy does indeed create cash, not just in wrestling, but in all things. Why do you think 'clickbait' is a thing?

You are derailing the conversation making it about Bischoff's ability because of my throw-away line, when in fact the line still applies, even without Bischoff saying it.

OC has nothing to do with Bischoff, Dixie or anything else - so, pointing at their failings in business in order to devalue the truth of the initial statement is pointless - the statement stands, no matter who said it

u savvy m8?


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Chip Chipperson said:


> They've got some great minds but unfortunately none of them are hired in the creative or management positions.


Utilise them better, just like I said. We are in agreement


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> you're cherry picking one line from the overall point I was making
> 
> my whole line:"
> Its not difficult to see why the various pushes are happening. Just look at this forum to start
> ...


You don't want to talk about Bischoff despite being the one to allude to him first? You don't want to talk about relevant history that AEW should learn from, rather than repeat? Okay, fine. But you're still wrong for all the reasons I have already said. Controversy does not always create cash. Just because something is spoken about and gets views does not make it good. That is some simple ass backward thinking.

Firstly, people talk about the failures of wrestling just as much as the successes if not more. There are just as much discussion in wrestling forums and twitter about Austin's heel turn are Mania 17, Goldbergs shitty end to his undefeated run, Starrcade 1997. These were controversial decisions that did massive numbers but the effects of those decisions weren't felt until weeks and months down the line after some space from the event. And the effects were negative. Yet people talk about them.

You say controversy creates cash because haters are watching illegally/on youtube. Or they are coming to forums talk about it. Illegally and forums create zero cash for AEW. YouTube revenue is so small for WWE they don't even highlight it in financial statements and quarter calls. And AEW don't come close to the number of views WWE get which means not really generating cash via youtube either. 

You say OC is in high rated segments? Okay, but as others have pointed out he is put in segments that usually get a bump anyway. I personally think he has done okay but six months of doing okay doesn't make him this big success story for AEW. A true success story and a true draw is made over time with sustainability and consistency. OC could turn out to be nothing but a fad because he is a one note character that isn't evolving. If a major blood feud with Jericho isn't going to make him evolve then what will?!

And how are you trying to twist negative reactions to an act into a positive. That sounds like the type of bullshit WWE pulled with Cena when commentary would try to paint him as a super divisive megastar everytime he came out.

That led to ratings falling over the years. If you are going to start twisting negative reactions to segments and acts into a positive then it's easy to believe AEW is perfect. And good on you for being able to live a fallacy. But I actually want AEW to succeed, and for that they need to get their head out of their asses and actually learn from genuine criticism.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

sim8 said:


> You don't want to talk about Bischoff despite being the one to allude to him first? You don't want to talk about relevant history that AEW should learn from, rather than repeat? Okay, fine. But you're still wrong for all the reasons I have already said. Controversy does not always create cash. Just because something is spoken about and gets views does not make it good. That is some simple ass backward thinking.
> 
> Firstly, people talk about the failures of wrestling just as much as the successes if not more. There are just as much discussion in wrestling forums and twitter about Austin's heel turn are Mania 17, Goldbergs shitty end to his undefeated run, Starrcade 1997. These were controversial decisions that did massive numbers but the effects of those decisions weren't felt until weeks and months down the line after some space from the event. And the effects were negative. Yet people talk about them.
> 
> ...


Bravo sir!

Now prepare to be ignored whenever you bring up salient points they dislike going forward.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

bdon said:


> Bravo sir!
> 
> Now prepare to be ignored whenever you bring up salient points they dislike going forward.


I'm so bloody annoyed. I love AEW. I really do. I was this close to walking away from wrestling completely before AEW came along. It's most likely the last chance for wrestling to keep me as a fan. I got so much emotional investment in AEW which is why when AEW do something that legitimately sucks, it is particularly annoying. But it's a new company and they will stumble and fall before they can run. Just need to be patient sometimes. What doesn't help are the blind loyalists defending every little thing which makes Cody and Tony say stupid ass shit in public about how great they are doing. 

Be better AEW. You can fucking do it.


----------



## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

sim8 said:


> I'm so bloody annoyed. I love AEW. I really do. I was this close to walking away from wrestling completely before AEW came along. It's most likely the last chance for wrestling to keep me as a fan. I got so much emotional investment in AEW which is why when AEW do something that legitimately sucks, it is particularly annoying. But it's a new company and they will stumble and fall before they can run. Just need to be patient sometimes. What doesn't help are the blind loyalists defending every little thing which makes Cody and Tony say stupid ass shit in public about how great they are doing.
> 
> Be better AEW. You can fucking do it.


Before you give up on wrestling try the Ring Of Honor Pure championship tournament


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

sim8 said:


> I'm so bloody annoyed. I love AEW. I really do. I was this close to walking away from wrestling completely before AEW came along. It's most likely the last chance for wrestling to keep me as a fan. I got so much emotional investment in AEW which is why when AEW do something that legitimately sucks, it is particularly annoying. But it's a new company and they will stumble and fall before they can run. Just need to be patient sometimes. What doesn't help are the blind loyalists defending every little thing which makes Cody and Tony say stupid ass shit in public about how great they are doing.
> 
> Be better AEW. You can fucking do it.


Exactly why we get upset. We _actually_ care about wrestling. It isn’t just something we latched onto when it was good to be like the cool kids, and we only enjoy the random stupid shit to pretend we like the ridiculousness of it, fearful of the backlash we’d get for saying, “Yeah, I love pro wrestling.”

Look at everyone’s goddamn list of top 5 best matches in AEW: not a single fucking bit of comedy was portrayed. Yet they will SWEAR that the comedy stuff is so good and awesome.

Truth is they hate the fact that pro wrestling can still work them into a frenzy like Omega kicking out at 1 from the Golden Trigger, the rHHHodes’ brothers’ tearful embrace, etc. They HATE that they can still be worked, so they goddamn LOVE when they can once again be like the cool kids and say, “Oh, it’s so fake. Look at Cassidy. Ha ha! Such a kidder!! Ha ha! Oh boy! Leg slapping good stuff there! High five!”

Passive aggressive bullshit.


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

sim8 said:


> You don't want to talk about Bischoff despite being the one to allude to him first? You don't want to talk about relevant history that AEW should learn from, rather than repeat? Okay, fine. But you're still wrong for all the reasons I have already said. Controversy does not always create cash. Just because something is spoken about and gets views does not make it good. That is some simple ass backward thinking.
> 
> Firstly, people talk about the failures of wrestling just as much as the successes if not more. There are just as much discussion in wrestling forums and twitter about Austin's heel turn are Mania 17, Goldbergs shitty end to his undefeated run, Starrcade 1997. These were controversial decisions that did massive numbers but the effects of those decisions weren't felt until weeks and months down the line after some space from the event. And the effects were negative. Yet people talk about them.
> 
> ...


TV ratings went down because all TV ratings across the board are down & will continue to go down regardless if it's wrestling or not. Cena had millions of fans & sold lots of tickets & merch (probably moves merch to this day). Wwe wished they had him back hence trying to force Roman Reigns into that role. What you're doing comes off as concern trolling


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

sim8 said:


> I'm so bloody annoyed. I love AEW. I really do. I was this close to walking away from wrestling completely before AEW came along. It's most likely the last chance for wrestling to keep me as a fan. I got so much emotional investment in AEW which is why when AEW do something that legitimately sucks, it is particularly annoying. But it's a new company and they will stumble and fall before they can run. Just need to be patient sometimes. What doesn't help are the blind loyalists defending every little thing which makes Cody and Tony say stupid ass shit in public about how great they are doing.
> 
> Be better AEW. You can fucking do it.


Yeah, I agree with this 100%. The blind loyalists who defend every single dumb thing drive me nuts. They seem to think that if you criticize ANYTHING at all, that means you hate them. Such black and white, childish thinking. Criticizing bad things is how one improves and every entity and company makes mistakes. Blindly excusing and praising absolutely every single thing someone does is a religion.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Hitman1987 said:


> Before you give up on wrestling try the Ring Of Honor Pure championship tournament


I've given ROH and NJPW a go in the past. Interested to see ROH do going forward but not able to really commit to watching it. NJPW has my favourite wrestler today in ZSJ but I have really come to dislike Gedo as a booker which I know is an unpopular opinion online.

MLW is the one I'm looking to really get into. They got a tv deal with England now so as soon as they premiere here, will try and see what the hype is all about.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Pippen94 said:


> TV ratings went down because all TV ratings across the board are down & will continue to go down regardless if it's wrestling or not. Cena had millions of fans & sold lots of tickets & merch (probably moves merch to this day). Wwe wished they had him back hence trying to force Roman Reigns into that role. What you're doing comes off as concern trolling


Are you for real? I'm trolling because I argued against a stupid ass blanket statement like 'controversy creates cash'. 

And what the fuck is 'concern trolling'. Are you guys actually creating new phrases to write off people who dont agree with you now


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

bdon said:


> Exactly why we get upset. We _actually_ care about wrestling. It isn’t just something we latched onto when it was good to be like the cool kids, and we only enjoy the random stupid shit to pretend we like the ridiculousness of it, fearful of the backlash we’d get for saying, “Yeah, I love pro wrestling.”
> 
> Look at everyone’s goddamn list of top 5 best matches in AEW: not a single fucking bit of comedy was portrayed. Yet they will SWEAR that the comedy stuff is so good and awesome.
> 
> ...


Wrestling has always worked best when it makes you emotionally invested. There is a spot for comedy on the lower card


----------



## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

sim8 said:


> I've given ROH and NJPW a go in the past. Interested to see ROH do going forward but not able to really commit to watching it. NJPW has my favourite wrestler today in ZSJ but I have really come to dislike Gedo as a booker which I know is an unpopular opinion online.
> 
> MLW is the one I'm looking to really get into. They got a tv deal with England now so as soon as they premiere here, will try and see what the hype is all about.


I’ve never watched ROH before but Cornette praised it so I thought I’d try it out and it didn’t disappoint. If you are a fan of ZSJ and like matches like the one he had against Tanahashi (Japan cup I think) then I’d highly recommend. I only knew 2 of the wrestlers but it didn’t matter as they were all booked like credible threats via video packages and commentator build.

Is MLW where MJF came from? If so I’ll be keeping an eye on that.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Hitman1987 said:


> I’ve never watched ROH before but Cornette praised it so I thought I’d try it out and it didn’t disappoint. If you are a fan of ZSJ and like matches like the one he had against Tanahashi (Japan cup I think) then I’d highly recommend. I only knew 2 of the wrestlers but it didn’t matter as they were all booked like credible threats via video packages and commentator build.
> 
> Is MLW where MJF came from? If so I’ll be keeping an eye on that.





Hitman1987 said:


> I’ve never watched ROH before but Cornette praised it so I thought I’d try it out and it didn’t disappoint. If you are a fan of ZSJ and like matches like the one he had against Tanahashi (Japan cup I think) then I’d highly recommend. I only knew 2 of the wrestlers but it didn’t matter as they were all booked like credible threats via video packages and commentator build.
> 
> Is MLW where MJF came from? If so I’ll be keeping an eye on that.


You know what, I may look into it. Is ROH actually still running shows during the pandemic. I genuinely dont know for sure. 

And yeah. Tbf I keep hearing a few names from MLW that are meant to be good so looking forward to it whenever it does start here


----------



## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

Hitman1987 said:


> I’ve never watched ROH before but Cornette praised it so I thought I’d try it out and it didn’t disappoint. If you are a fan of ZSJ and like matches like the one he had against Tanahashi (Japan cup I think) then I’d highly recommend. I only knew 2 of the wrestlers but it didn’t matter as they were all booked like credible threats via video packages and commentator build.
> 
> *Is MLW where MJF came from? If so I’ll be keeping an eye on that.*


Keep an eye out for Hammerstone, Fatu, and the Von Erichs in particular.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

sim8 said:


> Are you for real? I'm trolling because I argued against a stupid ass blanket statement like 'controversy creates cash'.
> 
> And what the fuck is 'concern trolling'. Are you guys actually creating new phrases to write off people who dont agree with you now


Disregard Pippen he hates anyone who says anything bad about AEW and will blatantly manipulate statements to make people look bad.

He's only young though so maybe it'll change


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

sim8 said:


> Are you for real? I'm trolling because I argued against a stupid ass blanket statement like 'controversy creates cash'.
> 
> And what the fuck is 'concern trolling'. Are you guys actually creating new phrases to write off people who dont agree with you now


You 'care' about wrestling & using that concern to bag aew. Dynamite has existed for a year - show has found fan base & going with what works. From your post you're speaking as lasped fan & miss wrestling as it once was but aew is a business & it makes no sense to target older fans - long term much better to gain new fans.


----------



## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

sim8 said:


> You know what, I may look into it. Is ROH actually still running shows during the pandemic. I genuinely dont know for sure.
> 
> And yeah. Tbf I keep hearing a few names from MLW that are meant to be good so looking forward to it whenever it does start here


Also dude, definitely check out MLW's Pulp Fusion series on Youtube when you have the chance; it basically recaps and highlights various stories going on in the company and would be great for catching up. They're only about 10 minutes a piece as well, so they're easily digestible. Anyway, that's all.


----------



## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

sim8 said:


> You know what, I may look into it. Is ROH actually still running shows during the pandemic. I genuinely dont know for sure.
> 
> And yeah. Tbf I keep hearing a few names from MLW that are meant to be good so looking forward to it whenever it does start here


I believe this pure tournament is their first show since pandemic and they’ve pretty much gone back to basics and are presenting a technical, sports based product with selling and rules, perfect for a ZSJ fan. It’s free if you got FITE TV.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Pippen94 said:


> You 'care' about wrestling & using that concern to bag aew. Dynamite has existed for a year - show has found fan base & going with what works. From your post you're speaking as lasped fan & miss wrestling as it once was but aew is a business & it makes no sense to target older fans - long term much better to gain new fans.


Tell that to Cody and Tony then. They spent the first year talking about all the lapse fans they want to bring back. Maybe they could learn from you expertise


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Disregard Pippen he hates anyone who says anything bad about AEW and will blatantly manipulate statements to make people look bad.
> 
> He's only young though so maybe it'll change


Not true - I just know it makes no sense for new company to focus on desires of lapsed fans. There's no future in the past


----------



## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

El Hammerstone said:


> Keep an eye out for Hammerstone, Fatu, and the Von Erichs in particular.


Any ideas how I can watch MLW? I got FITE TV but haven’t seen it on there


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

El Hammerstone said:


> Also dude, definitely check out MLW's Pulp Fusion series on Youtube when you have the chance; it basically recaps and highlights various stories going on in the company and would be great for catching up. They're only about 10 minutes a piece as well, so they're easily digestible. Anyway, that's all.


Sweet, that will definitely help. Cheers


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Hitman1987 said:


> I believe this pure tournament is their first show since pandemic and they’ve pretty much gone back to basics and are presenting a technical, sports based product with selling and rules, perfect for a ZSJ fan. It’s free if you got FITE TV.


I'll try and give it a watch this week. Thanks for letting me know


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Pippen94 said:


> Not true - I just know it makes no sense for new company to focus on desires of lapsed fans. There's no future in the past


It would be foolish to automatically write off an entire fan base that has previously shown interest. It is less work overall. And amazingly a company could be and SHOULD be doing both attracting lapsed fans and building new ones. It is not a black and white choice.


----------



## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

Hitman1987 said:


> Any ideas how I can watch MLW? I got FITE TV but haven’t seen it on there











MLW Inks Multi-Platform Media Rights Deal In UK & Ireland


MLW has announced it has signed a multi-platform media rights deal with the Sports Channel Network exclusively in the UK & Ireland




lastwordonsports.com




.

Every Saturday, 6:00 PM ET on YouTube.com/MajorLeagueWrestling.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Pippen94 said:


> Not true - I just know it makes no sense for new company to focus on desires of lapsed fans. There's no future in the past











Tony Khan Hoping AEW Can Attract Lapsed WCW Fans


Tony Khan has an interesting target audience.




www.thesportster.com





Tony Khan is a dumbass, according to Pip then. Guess we can all agree now that TK isn't perfect. Oh gee, I wonder what else he may have got wrong...


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

sim8 said:


> Tell that to Cody and Tony then. They spent the first year talking about all the lapse fans they want to bring back. Maybe they could learn from you expertise


They want any fan they can get but if Orange Cassidy appeals to younger demo they'll run with that because TV is so important to their existence. Not mention younger fans will be around longer..


----------



## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

El Hammerstone said:


> MLW Inks Multi-Platform Media Rights Deal In UK & Ireland
> 
> 
> MLW has announced it has signed a multi-platform media rights deal with the Sports Channel Network exclusively in the UK & Ireland
> ...


Thanks, not all heroes wear capes


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

El Hammerstone said:


> MLW Inks Multi-Platform Media Rights Deal In UK & Ireland
> 
> 
> MLW has announced it has signed a multi-platform media rights deal with the Sports Channel Network exclusively in the UK & Ireland
> ...


Just need the start date to be announced now, thanks!!


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Pippen94 said:


> They want any fan they can get but if Orange Cassidy appeals to younger demo they'll run with that because TV is so important to their existence. Not mention younger fans will be around longer..


Will they? That was the argument for having Super Cena. All those kids would be sticking around and....nope. Lowest viewership and fans left by the millions. They grew up and realized he was a geek.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

sim8 said:


> Are you for real? I'm trolling because I argued against a stupid ass blanket statement like 'controversy creates cash'.
> 
> And what the fuck is 'concern trolling'. Are you guys actually creating new phrases to write off people who dont agree with you now


This is exactly how they act. Any negative discussion is met with the fire of a thousand suns.


sim8 said:


> Wrestling has always worked best when it makes you emotionally invested. There is a spot for comedy on the lower card


Of course it has and still does. Even these blind loyalist type fans who claim to love the goofy comedy shit being in prominent roles; when put to task, their favorite things are the very serious matches and angles.

But they HAVE to have the goofy shit as justification for watching it, fearful the cool kids will stuff them in trash cans for watching wrestling in 2020.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Pippen94 said:


> They want any fan they can get but if Orange Cassidy appeals to younger demo they'll run with that because TV is so important to their existence. Not mention younger fans will be around longer..


You're making some assumptions that may not be correct

1) younger fans may not become life long fans so may not be around longer.

2) the younger fans live in an era of tik tok and memes where there is something new every week that is being talked about. OC may just be the thing of the month before they find something new

3) you're making the assumption the demos of younger fans and older fans have completely different tastes. There is an overlap. Find something that appeals across the demos to find lasting success


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

bdon said:


> This is exactly how they act. Any negative discussion is met with the fire of a thousand suns.
> 
> Of course it has and still does. Even these blind loyalist type fans who claim to love the goofy comedy shit being in prominent roles; when put to task, their favorite things are the very serious matches and angles.
> 
> But they HAVE to have the goofy shit as justification for watching it, fearful the cool kids will stuff them in trash cans for watching wrestling in 2020.


Absolutely man

I've been judged to like wrestling my whole life. I've had to tell people why I watch the fake crap and the examples I use are always moments and matches with real stake and emotional investment. I would never show a skeptic a clip of OC or Santino or Too Cool to show why I'm a life long fan even if I do enjoy all three acts.


----------



## Hephaesteus (Aug 20, 2018)

On the plus side aew has managed to wear down cornette. His rants have gone from long and angry to just short and bewildered. So theres that


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Hitman1987 said:


> I believe this pure tournament is their first show since pandemic and they’ve pretty much gone back to basics and are presenting a technical, sports based product with selling and rules, perfect for a ZSJ fan. It’s free if you got FITE TV.


Just had a look and I need to watch episode 471 to watch the tournament from the start. Glad to see i can watch the first few weeks in one go. Defo going to try and fit it in. I love a well booked tournament...and yes that's a shot at AEW


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

sim8 said:


> You're making some assumptions that may not be correct
> 
> 1) younger fans may not become life long fans so may not be around longer.
> 
> ...


Tv ratings based on demos - do poor there & get canned


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Pippen94 said:


> Tv ratings based on demos - do poor there & get canned


You really answered all three points there, well done.


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

sim8 said:


> You really answered all three points there, well done.


That's the only thing which is important. Don't expect company to change to accommodate your tastes


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Pippen94 said:


> That's the only thing which is important. Don't expect company to change to accommodate your tastes


So a company that expects me to buy their PPVs, pay to watch their weekly show on Fite because their UK deal is so shit, and buy their merchandise, wont cater to my - a paying customer - tastes?

And you were trying to tell everyone what a business should and shouldn't do?


----------



## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

sim8 said:


> Just had a look and I need to watch episode 471 to watch the tournament from the start. Glad to see i can watch the first few weeks in one go. Defo going to try and fit it in. I love a well booked tournament...and yes that's a shot at AEW


Don’t worry you won’t see Joey Janela in this tournament


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Hitman1987 said:


> Don’t worry you won’t see Joey Janela in this competition


Haha I dont mind Joey to be honest. The only person I really hate in AEW who I just don't want to see is Big Swole.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

sim8 said:


> You say controversy creates cash because haters are watching illegally/on youtube. Or they are coming to forums talk about it. *Illegally and forums create zero cash for AEW. YouTube revenue is so small for WWE they don't even highlight it in financial statements and quarter calls. And AEW don't come close to the number of views WWE get which means not really generating cash via youtube either.*


Its staggering how confident you are while obviously knowing nothing about how modern marketing works - every bit of online info gets fed into seo and search algos - every negative comment or even illegal viewing raises all the numbers and metrics on OC - hell, every thread here has an ultimate positive impact on his numbers. 

I'm trying to figure out what your stance is on this - OC is a draw, he is fine in the mid to upper-midcard

nothing that I have seen has dissuaded that. Nothing with him is failing - so, what are you on about in the end?

Say you don't like the guy and leave it at that - nothing else after that needs to be said.

No matter how much gnashing of teeth there is on this board - the course is set and the way is clear - the dude is here to stay and is doing good business. When that changes, their course can change - but why fuck around with it now?

this has turned into such a silly conversation with no point


----------



## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

sim8 said:


> Haha I dont mind Joey to be honest. The only person I really hate in AEW who I just don't want to see is Big Swole.


How you feel about Swole I feel about ‘dildo stunt’


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> Its staggering how confident you are while obviously knowing nothing about how modern marketing works - every bit of online info gets fed into seo and search algos - every negative comment or even illegal viewing raises all the numbers and metrics on OC - hell, every thread here has an ultimate positive impact on his numbers.
> 
> I'm trying to figure out what your stance is on this - OC is a draw, he is fine in the mid to upper-midcard
> 
> ...


It's funny how you can write so much to tell me I'm wrong without ever being specific about it. A true talent, that.

I keep giving you examples and breaking down your point one by one to explain why you're wrong but you cant do the same. Keep using buzzwords like 'modern marketing' and 'search algotherims' to seem intelligent but honestly you're not fooling anybody.

You do you though. Stay blind to AEWs issues. Thank God your opinion doesn't matter in the real world.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

sim8 said:


> It's funny how you can write so much to tell me I'm wrong without ever being specific about it. A true talent, that.
> 
> I keep giving you examples and breaking down your point one by one to explain why you're wrong but you cant do the same. Keep using buzzwords like 'modern marketing' and 'search algotherims' to seem intelligent but honestly you're not fooling anybody.
> 
> You do you though. Stay blind to AEWs issues. Thank God your opinion doesn't matter in the real world.


tell me mate - what do you think should happen with OC?

let's have a listen


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> tell me mate - what do you think should happen with OC?
> 
> let's have a listen


Orange Cassidy is an one-note comedic act that works best in front of a crowd that plays along so the most important thing to do with such a character is not to over use him. We gotta keep the one joke as fresh as possible to ensure it doesn't lose its charm. This means no 3 month feud with Jericho. An one off match, absolutely but do not drag it out. If OCs character actually changed due to the feud then it makes sense but he didn't so it is a waste of tv time.

Now, I'm not the most creative booker around. I don't normally do that type of thing but since you're asking, I'm going to have to think on the spot to put something half decent together. Hopefully it reads well and not just a jumbled mess.

Wrestling works best with stakes and emotions. I would probably do something where during the Santana and Ortis vs Best Friends feud this past Summer, have Santana and Ortis injure Chuck Taylor and take him out. Trent challenges them to a tag team match to avenge his partner Chuck who is now out indefinitely. Trent chooses OC as his partner. 

Spend half the build up to the match having different babyfaces telling Trent to let them partner with him to avenge Chuck. They all like OC but think he's not the correct partner in such a match. But Trent stays firm; he's partnering with OC. Have Santana and Ortis act like it is a glorified handicap match because Orange Cassidy is a joke. During all this, we don't really hear from OC as he is too lazy to answer questions from Alex Marvez so we don't really see what he is thinking. This also keeps him off TV for most weeks, to keep his appearances fresh and special.

Come match time, Santana and Ortis mock OC but Orange Cassidy tries and actually wrestles, to the shock of everyone. OC and Trent win with the story being told is OC is actually a semi decent wrestler that caught P&P by surprise.

P&P and Best Friends can then continue their feud to that great parking lot brawl while Cody who was amazed by OCs performance wants OC to challenge for the TNT Title in the Open Challenge.

I would have commentators openly question if OC can win a match against Cody now hes lost the element of surprise. Everyone has seen what OC is capable of but Cody is a top athlete so how can OC compete. Even have the commentators question why Cody would want a match against OC and if it is just an easy win for Cody. That can help sow some seeds for a Cody heel turn. 

Cody vs OC will have OC return to form of the light kicks and hands in the pocket gimmick. This will lead to Cody getting pissed off at OCs lack of trying. Cody gets more and more aggressive during the match but can't put him away. Match ends in a draw and Cody keeps the title. But Cody isn't happy with this. He feels disrespected by OC. OC didn't even try to give his maximum effort and Cody still couldn't beat him. That doesn't bode well for Cody. I would have Cody beat the shit out of him, leading to a rematch where OC promises to actually try, which is enough for Cody to be worried as it's been proven Cody couldn't beat lazy OC in 20 minutes so he will struggle against an OC that tries. 

I personally wouldn't have Cody lose to OC in the sequel as giving OC a title automatically puts a bigger spotlight on him which puts more pressure on a one note character.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

sim8 said:


> Orange Cassidy is an one-note comedic act that works best in front of a crowd that plays along so the most important thing to do with such a character is not to over use him. We gotta keep the one joke as fresh as possible to ensure it doesn't lose its charm. This means no 3 month feud with Jericho. An one off match, absolutely but do not drag it out. If OCs character actually changed due to the feud then it makes sense but he didn't so it is a waste of tv time.
> 
> Now, I'm not the most creative booker around. I don't normally do that type of thing but since you're asking, I'm going to have to think on the spot to put something half decent together. Hopefully it reads well and not just a jumbled mess.
> 
> ...


nice write-up / but you misunderstood or i didn’t ask clearly

what would you do with OC now? He’s proven he can wrestle against Pac, he’s won a feud with Jericho and he’s hanged with Cody and Brody

so, that has all been established - what would you do next?


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> nice write-up / but you misunderstood or i didn’t ask clearly
> 
> what would you do with OC now? He’s proven he can wrestle against Pac, he’s won a feud with Jericho and he’s hanged with Cody and Brody
> 
> so, that has all been established - what would you do next?


Oh not a clue if I'm honest. I'm a fan of the gimmick but feel bored of it now after 3 months of Jericho. He feels too stale to me. They need to evolve the character some how but I dont know how personally. Thats a conundrum for much more creative heads than me.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

sim8 said:


> Oh not a clue if I'm honest. I'm a fan of the gimmick but feel bored of it now after 3 months of Jericho. He feels too stale to me. They need to evolve the character some how but I dont know how personally. Thats a conundrum for much more creative heads than me.


fair play👌


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

sim8 said:


> So a company that expects me to buy their PPVs, pay to watch their weekly show on Fite because their UK deal is so shit, and buy their merchandise, wont cater to my - a paying customer - tastes?
> 
> And you were trying to tell everyone what a business should and shouldn't do?


If expect a company to appeal to all of your specific tastes you'll never be happy - most ppl realise this


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Pippen94 said:


> If expect a company to appeal to all of your specific tastes you'll never be happy - most ppl realise this


A good company caters to the broad tastes of their desired fan base. I want good wrestling with high stakes and an emotional investment, the way it's been day for decades upon decades. What I don't  want is a one note comedic wrestler feuding with the biggest name in the company for 3 months with no real change to either character, negating the past 3 months to nothing but just a waste of time.

I really don't get what you are struggling to understand here. If companies want customer to pay for their product, you give them something they want to see. Yes, not everything will appeal to me but you still should have something on the show to have me excited week to week. And right now they have nothing. 

Omega vs Page seems to be set up via tournament rather than a story driven angle which would probably be more effective of not stalling momentum on a story well told until now

Bucks are turning heel to face a heel FTR, in what will ruin the dynamics of a legit dream match for many

The womens division is dead

Brodie needs rehabbing as a character

Cody vs OC with Darby Allin waiting in the wings is full of logic holes

A killer brute like Miro is a video gaming player side kick to Kip Sabien

AEWs ability to tell week to week stories with compelling characters seem non existent right now.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

sim8 said:


> Oh not a clue if I'm honest. I'm a fan of the gimmick but feel bored of it now after 3 months of Jericho. He feels too stale to me. They need to evolve the character some how but I dont know how personally. Thats a conundrum for much more creative heads than me.


There's nowhere to go except putting the belt on him.


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

sim8 said:


> A good company caters to the broad tastes of their desired fan base. I want good wrestling with high stakes and an emotional investment, the way it's been day for decades upon decades. What I don't want is a one note comedic wrestler feuding with the biggest name in the company for 3 months with no real change to either character, negating the past 3 months to nothing but just a waste of time.
> 
> I really don't get what you are struggling to understand here. If companies want customer to pay for their product, you give them something they want to see. Yes, not everything will appeal to me but you still should have something on the show to have me excited week to week. And right now they have nothing.
> 
> ...


I understand exactly what you're saying; you don't like product & I am telling you it's not going to change. If company stops pushing certain acts it won't be on TV anymore.

Of course you'll keep watching - live thread is almost exclusively full of returned lapsed fans who hate show - go figure


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> Its staggering how confident you are while obviously knowing nothing about how modern marketing works - every bit of online info gets fed into seo and search algos - every negative comment or even illegal viewing raises all the numbers and metrics on OC - hell, every thread here has an ultimate positive impact on his numbers.
> 
> I'm trying to figure out what your stance is on this - OC is a draw, he is fine in the mid to upper-midcard
> 
> ...


He should have stayed in the midcard as an occasional wrestler, mostly used as a feature CHARACTER. The wrestler fucking sucks, but the character WORKS. There is a massive difference here.

Go back to what I said when his push as a WRESTLER became apparent: he has to EVOLVE. The character got you to the dance. Now it is time to evolve and show your skills. He is “trying”, but goddamn he really lacks any kind of technical skill and strength to do the most basic of maneuvers. Cody was trying his ass off to help Cassidy, but it was like watching two mf’ers practice moves with Cody telegraphing everything everything in an effort to walk Cassidy through the shit.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

bdon said:


> He should have stayed in the midcard as an occasional wrestler, mostly used as a feature CHARACTER. The wrestler fucking sucks, but the character WORKS. There is a massive difference here.
> 
> Go back to what I said when his push as a WRESTLER became apparent: he has to EVOLVE. The character got you to the dance. Now it is time to evolve and show your skills. He is “trying”, but goddamn he really lacks any kind of technical skill and strength to do the most basic of maneuvers. Cody was trying his ass off to help Cassidy, but it was like watching two mf’ers practice moves with Cody telegraphing everything everything in an effort to walk Cassidy through the shit.


I actually saw one match of OC as Fire Ant in CHIKARA and he was actually quite good. The gimmick hinders him I think


----------



## yeahbaby! (Jan 27, 2014)

I actually thought the match was quite good with a good home stretch. Something I thought I'd never say about any OC match. Not a fan of the gimmick and never will be but he can go it seems. I was hoping Brodie would come out and cost Cody the belt but the whole show was missing anything creative like that.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> nice write-up / but you misunderstood or i didn’t ask clearly
> 
> what would you do with OC now? He’s proven he can wrestle against Pac, he’s won a feud with Jericho and he’s hanged with Cody and Brody
> 
> so, that has all been established - what would you do next?


I honestly think they should keep him in the TNT title picture. At this point just make him a lethal joke character. To avoid staleness just add to his "mind games" with different things besides the lackadaisical stuff. Have him copy opponents attire and accuse them of copying him, steal moves, instead of randomly being in bathrooms have him randomly at opponents home or in their car. Have it to where by the time a match with him comes most opponents are just glad to get a chance to get away from him. 

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

optikk sucks said:


> The complainers are the minority. The majority are the people who just stop watching. AEW haven’t lost the majority.


The majority of wrestling fans prefer WWE. That should tell you someth



RainmakerV2 said:


> Because the show sucks. It wasnt like this here 4 or 5 months ago even. Their refusal to pull the trigger on any major angle and the constant Cassidy push has turned a lot of people.
> 
> Their booking is flat out lazy. It is what it is. You have this Omega vs. Page story, and how do you get to the match? A tournament full of 20 minute matches. Its bullshit. Do you know why its done that way? Because Khan is lazy. Instead of creating set pieces, vignettes, videos, promos to build up Omega vs. Page and just do the match, he has to book a bunch of "wrestling matches" to get to it. Oh, Im sure Meltzer will cream over it. Awesome.


I’m not sure if TK is lazy or this is honestly how he thinks things should be done.



LifeInCattleClass said:


> you're cherry picking one line from the overall point I was making
> 
> my whole line:"
> Its not difficult to see why the various pushes are happening. Just look at this forum to start
> ...


I don’t think you know what a fact is.



bdon said:


> Exactly why we get upset. We _actually_ care about wrestling. It isn’t just something we latched onto when it was good to be like the cool kids, and we only enjoy the random stupid shit to pretend we like the ridiculousness of it, fearful of the backlash we’d get for saying, “Yeah, I love pro wrestling.”
> 
> Look at everyone’s goddamn list of top 5 best matches in AEW: not a single fucking bit of comedy was portrayed. Yet they will SWEAR that the comedy stuff is so good and awesome.
> 
> ...


Holy shit, yesssssss. Tell ‘em, bdon.



Two Sheds said:


> It would be foolish to automatically write off an entire fan base that has previously shown interest. It is less work overall. And amazingly a company could be and SHOULD be doing both attracting lapsed fans and building new ones. It is not a black and white choice.


Yeah, I’ve got no clue why people think appealing to wrestling fans is a bad idea for a wrestling company.

Glad to see ROH and MLW getting some love. I’m predicting a big year for wrestling in 2021. I’m hoping that the industry gets a major cash injection and that ROH and MLW are major benefactors of this. Sinclair have got the money to play. MLW are ambitious and have rich partners. Brock Lesnar and CM Punk are free agents. Ronda Rousey’s deal comes up in Q2 2021. The stars are out there for anyone who wants to get serious.


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

Remember when Verne Gagne wouldn't put belt on Hulk Hogan because he wasn't sold on his wrestling skills?? Bet he was glad he kept fans who didn't like modern phoney stuff


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Pippen94 said:


> I understand exactly what you're saying; you don't like product & I am telling you it's not going to change. If company stops pushing certain acts it won't be on TV anymore.
> 
> Of course you'll keep watching - live thread is almost exclusively full of returned lapsed fans who hate show - go figure


Hold up, are you insinuating Orange Cassidy is the reason AEW is on TV right now? Wow

When did I say I hate AEW. Having criticisms and concerns about something you love is a thing people do


----------



## Mercian (Jun 26, 2020)

Pippen94 said:


> Remember when Verne Gagne wouldn't put belt on Hulk Hogan because he wasn't sold on his wrestling skills?? Bet he was glad he kept fans who didn't like modern phoney stuff


That is a really interesting one, do you stick to your principles? Reckon Verne in hindsight would change things? Good thread for the CW section

For me not putting the belt on Hogan wasnt the end of the AWA, they missed a payday granted! But they still had or would have Road Warriors, Freebirds, Midnight Rockers, Scott Hall, Baby Bull (Vader), The Patriot, Jimmy Snuka, Curt Hennig, Sgt Slaughter, Jerry Lawler etc on a very talented roster over the years
Portraying 60 year old Wrestling legends in their main events beating young talented guys didnt help, Hogan probably didntfancy losing to Larry Hennig et al !


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Pippen94 said:


> Remember when Verne Gagne wouldn't put belt on Hulk Hogan because he wasn't sold on his wrestling skills?? Bet he was glad he kept fans who didn't like modern phoney stuff


You do realise there is a middle ground of giving OC a spot on the card but not in the main event, right? It's not either make him the biggest thing in AEW or get rid of him completely. There is a middle ground. And OC is a lot of things but he isn't Hulk Hogan.

Why are people unable to have a rational logical conversation about a topic without being extreme in their opinion?


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Daniel Bryant, John Cena, Austin, The Rock, and now Hulk Hogan.

These are wrestlers you fucking people have used to compare Orange Cassidy.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

bdon said:


> Daniel Bryant, John Cena, Austin, The Rock, and now Hulk Hogan.
> 
> These are wrestlers you fucking people have used to compare Orange Cassidy.


I'm happy to admit i know shit about wrestling if OC ever becomes a star on the level of Daniel Bryan, let alone Austin and Rock


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

sim8 said:


> I'm happy to admit i know shit about wrestling if OC ever becomes a star on the level of Daniel Bryan, let alone Austin and Rock


If that happens, I’m not watching anymore.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Pippen94 said:


> Remember when Verne Gagne wouldn't put belt on Hulk Hogan because he wasn't sold on his wrestling skills?? Bet he was glad he kept fans who didn't like modern phoney stuff


Wrestlers I've seen Orange Cassidy compared to on this forum:

Gorgeous George

Hulk Hogan

The Rock

---

Jesus Christ...



Mercian said:


> That is a really interesting one, do you stick to your principles? Reckon Verne in hindsight would change things? Good thread for the CW section
> 
> For me not putting the belt on Hogan wasnt the end of the AWA, they missed a payday granted! But they still had or would have Road Warriors, Freebirds, Midnight Rockers, Scott Hall, Baby Bull (Vader), The Patriot, Jimmy Snuka, Curt Hennig, Sgt Slaughter, Jerry Lawler etc on a very talented roster over the years
> Portraying 60 year old Wrestling legends in their main events beating young talented guys didnt help, Hogan probably didntfancy losing to Larry Hennig et al !


Yeah, AWA had plenty of other opportunities away from Hulk although he's the most interesting "what if?" scenario by far. Verne was just stuck in the past unfortunately, AWA had a phenomenal run and a really good shot at being the number 1 company.


----------



## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

bdon said:


> If that happens, I’m not watching anymore.


LOL I won't say that just yet. Need to see it play out first


----------



## stew mack (Apr 24, 2013)

Klitschko said:


> Dumb fucks, or genius? Did you see the ratings the match pulled? Next boom period for pro wrestling coming up thanks to these two fighting for the *ACE title in the compan*y.



ACE as in the other term for asexual because AEW is for EVERYONE (including jobbers and 7 year old kids)


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Did I really just see a comparison between Orange Cassidy and the AWA dying out? History is pissing all over itself.


----------



## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

Maybe Orange Cassidy is popular because his matches are easy to follow with a focus on making cool faces and having an entertaining persona, instead of doing complex sequences of movez.

I think that sometimes what is exciting to us as hardcore wrestling fans is actually a little overwhelming to a casual audience. Like if you look at music, extremely technical genres like jazz and metal are niche, while the most popular music is very simple, with tons of repetition.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

sim8 said:


> Hold up, are you insinuating Orange Cassidy is the reason AEW is on TV right now? Wow
> 
> When did I say I hate AEW. Having criticisms and concerns about something you love is a thing people do


It is amazing how several people cannot understand that people criticize something because they want it to be better. No one spends time criticizing things they hate outside of Twitter,


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## Mercian (Jun 26, 2020)

The Wood said:


> Did I really just see a comparison between Orange Cassidy and the AWA dying out? History is pissing all over itself.


Perhaps with the lazy character Orange Cassidy plays they could book him to fight on his back like Inoki against Ali againt Mike Tyson?


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Cassidy would put the “bomb” in “Boma Ye.”


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## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

sim8 said:


> You do realise there is a middle ground of giving OC a spot on the card but not in the main event, right? It's not either make him the biggest thing in AEW or get rid of him completely. There is a middle ground. And OC is a lot of things but he isn't Hulk Hogan.
> 
> Why are people unable to have a rational logical conversation about a topic without being extreme in their opinion?


This is not extreme - it's crux of what's being argued. When aew does over a million viewers in minute by minute rating Cassidy is usually on screen. Cassidy moves most merch. You should emphasize most popular performers but you guys want to move him down card. Similar to Gagne not running with Hogan - shooting self in foot business wise


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## sim8 (Oct 21, 2017)

Pippen94 said:


> This is not extreme - it's crux of what's being argued. When aew does over a million viewers in minute by minute rating Cassidy is usually on screen. Cassidy moves most merch. You should emphasize most popular performers but you guys want to move him down card. Similar to Gagne not running with Hogan - shooting self in foot business wise


You truly believe in your heart of hearts that Orange Cassidy can carry a television show by being the centre piece player in a way Hulk Hogan and Stone Cold have done? You believe Orange Cassidy can headline PPV after PPV and make it a creative and financial success? 

Then we simply are never going to agree. Let's see it all play out and in a few years time, we will all know the answer.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Shooting yourself in the foot is emphasising a comedy act that caps you at 1 million viewers. Shit like this is why stars like CM Punk, Randy Orton and Brock Lesnar would never get into bed with an AEW. Would you rather take Orange Cassidy or Punk, Orton and Brock. One is a much smarter business decision than the other.


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## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

The Wood said:


> Shooting yourself in the foot is emphasising a comedy act that caps you at 1 million viewers. Shit like this is why stars like CM Punk, Randy Orton and Brock Lesnar would never get into bed with an AEW. Would you rather take Orange Cassidy or Punk, Orton and Brock. One is a much smarter business decision than the other.


You speak to those guys?? Mjf when interviewed out of character said person he'd most like to work with is oc. Don't put words in people's mouths just to support some theory you invented


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Pippen94 said:


> You speak to those guys?? Mjf when interviewed out of character said person he'd most like to work with is oc. Don't put words in people's mouths just to support some theory you invented


Well MJF can go on the scrap heap too. I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he was in character and OC would be the easiest wrestler to beat up though. But if that’s the way he genuinely wants to go, fuck him.


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## Prince Devitt (Mar 21, 2020)

I like OC, and have no problem with him having a 5-10 min match every other week, low on the card, bring in some kids sell, some merch and have him be best friends mascot when he doesn't have a match, but no way should he be having time limit championship matches(or any title match) or going over guys like Jericho


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## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

http://imgur.com/8yBTJ8w


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Pippen94 said:


> http://imgur.com/8yBTJ8w


Yeah brilliant. Up there with Hogan and Rock.


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Pippen94 said:


> http://imgur.com/8yBTJ8w


Never knew you to be posting something in support of how dumb he is


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## La Parka (Oct 28, 2008)

Pippen94 said:


> http://imgur.com/8yBTJ8w


Randy Savage?!


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Randy Savage?!
[/QUOTE]

Ohhhhhh nooo


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## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

The Wood said:


> Cassidy would put the “bomb” in “Boma Ye.”


Bro. Nakamura and Orange Cassidy would actually be a cool matchup. They're kinda similar in a lot of ways.

OC has his shin kicks and Nakamura has the thing where he rests his head on his opponent's chest, plus the corner boot thing. (So actually, when you think about Nakamura has TWO spots where he disrespects his opponent with obvious soft offense. Talk about exposing the business)

Also, they have somewhat similar characters.


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## Marbar (Dec 20, 2019)

Yeah they both suck and have no business in the ring


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## Bit Bitterson (Sep 18, 2020)

Pass me the ketchup. I was wrong.


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## 5 Star Giulia ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ (Apr 21, 2014)

*Even Cornette had no choice but to admit Cassidy is ratings. Fuck Cody though. 





*


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Pippen94 said:


> http://imgur.com/8yBTJ8w


HAHAHA! He said he was going to do a cool move, then he just fell down! Hahaha! It’s funny because he doesn’t try! Haha!

You have to be a fucking moron to find that funny. Especially after you’ve seen it 100 fucking times.

God dammit, wrestling fans are the worst sometimes. Imagine taking a friend along to see a show and there’s a room full of fat, white virgins laughing at that.

This is why we can’t have nice things.



Geeee said:


> Bro. Nakamura and Orange Cassidy would actually be a cool matchup. They're kinda similar in a lot of ways.
> 
> OC has his shin kicks and Nakamura has the thing where he rests his head on his opponent's chest, plus the corner boot thing. (So actually, when you think about Nakamura has TWO spots where he disrespects his opponent with obvious soft offense. Talk about exposing the business)
> 
> Also, they have somewhat similar characters.


If you cannot tell the difference between Nakamura cheekily giving his opponent his head while he is in control of the match as it to say “go on, take a shot” and Orange Cassidy doing choreographed “Lol! I’m not even trying!” spots, I cannot help you. You just don’t get it, and you likely never will.

Nakamura is seriously one of the best to come along in 20 years. That’s why he has a sturdy job in the biggest company in the world, being given lots of kayfabe achievements and is constantly featured on the most watched wrestling show in the world, even if a lot of wrestling fans are stupid enough to think that is a bad thing. And it’s why Orange Cassidy has to make fun of the business he’s in to get noticed and a novelty contract from a rich boy running a vanity project for those geeks.

Comparing Cassidy and Nakamura is seriously like comparing Gillberg to Steve Austin just because they’re both bald and wore black gear. But Duane Gill could probably work (haven’t seen much of his stuff, to be honest). OC can’t.


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## Mercian (Jun 26, 2020)

Wont get many replies today, they have serious business at weekends


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## Hephaesteus (Aug 20, 2018)

If you're reliant upon oc just to have a decent rating, you're in trouble.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Hephaesteus said:


> If you're reliant upon oc just to have a decent rating, you're in trouble.


Yeah, people don’t really think about what the ratings mean. What impression are you giving the people watching at that moment in time? And what do they think of everything else?


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

The Wood said:


> HAHAHA! He said he was going to do a cool move, then he just fell down! Hahaha! It’s funny because he doesn’t try! Haha!
> 
> You have to be a fucking moron to find that funny. Especially after you’ve seen it 100 fucking times.
> 
> God dammit, wrestling fans are the worst sometimes. Imagine taking a friend along to see a show and there’s a room full of fat, white virgins laughing at that.


It'd be like the time a friend begged me to go to Rodney Rude with him because he had nobody to go with. He paid 60 bucks for me to attend and I sat with 500 people, I laughed, turned to my friend and said "This is the whitest room I've ever been in" upon arriving.

Also, show was fucking awful and friend was upset that I didn't find Rodney Rude's shitty jokes funny. I imagine that'd be a OC fan and his non OC fan friend. "How could you not find it funny when he put his hands in his pockets bruh?!"


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## Hephaesteus (Aug 20, 2018)

Chip Chipperson said:


> It'd be like the time a friend begged me to go to Rodney Rude with him because he had nobody to go with. He paid 60 bucks for me to attend and I sat with 500 people, I laughed, turned to my friend and said "This is the whitest room I've ever been in" upon arriving.
> 
> Also, show was fucking awful and friend was upset that I didn't find Rodney Rude's shitty jokes funny. I imagine that'd be a OC fan and his non OC fan friend. "How could you not find it funny when he put his hands in his pockets bruh?!"


I think oc could actually work, I found gillberg funny enough. Just not in your damn main event. Like 5-10 minutes a month of his shananigans should be plenty of time for such things.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

I would like to see a Gillberg-esque parody of Orange Cassidy where theu waltz out a guy named Purple Kennedy and he has his hands in his pockets and he gets beaten up and cries. 

I want to see Orange Cassidy in the Zach Gowen spot with Brock Lesnar.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

@bdon


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

RapShepard said:


> @bdon


The sad thing is he probably actually believes this.


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## NathanMayberry (Oct 11, 2019)

BOSS of Bel-Air said:


> *Even Cornette had no choice but to admit Cassidy is ratings. Fuck Cody though.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


We're living in a world where <900,000 viewers (or 1 million twice in 1 year) is considered "ratings"


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## 5 Star Giulia ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ (Apr 21, 2014)

RapShepard said:


> @bdon


*Way to completely bury your World Championship. Cody is a tone-deaf fucking moron.*


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> @bdon


Goddamn I hate this motherfucker. He needs to fucking retire and only be a booker. He’s worse than goddamn Nash, HHH, Jeff Jarrett, etc combined. They at least booked themselves to be the top dog holding the top championship. He’s out here as an EVP doing everything he can to bury his company’s World Heavyweight Championship title.


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

I hate Cody but I do wonder if this a work (or has become a work as a result of the negative reaction from people stating he’s burying his own champ). I have no doubt that he is capable of subtly burying his world champion to look better as he has done by hogging the TV spotlight and giving himself loads of feuds/gimmick matches, but in his recent promo he mentioned he was looking to become a heavyweight so I do wonder if he is lining up a champ vs champ storyline or planning on dropping/vacating the TNT title and is using these Twitter posts to provoke Mox into giving him a title shot.

Cody is arrogant but surely he is not dull enough to blatantly bury his world champion twice on twitter in the same month.

After seeing his 5 week return though anything is possible with this guy.


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## Wolf Mark (Jun 5, 2020)

Hitman1987 said:


> I hate Cody but I do wonder if this a work (or has become a work as a result of the negative reaction from people stating he’s burying his own champ). I have no doubt that he is capable of subtly burying his world champion to look better as he has done by hogging the TV spotlight and giving himself loads of feuds/gimmick matches, but in his recent promo he mentioned he was looking to become a heavyweight so I do wonder if he is lining up a champ vs champ storyline or planning on dropping/vacating the TNT title and is using these Twitter posts to provoke Mox into giving him a title shot.
> 
> Cody is arrogant but surely he is not dull enough to blatantly bury his world champion twice on twitter in the same month.
> 
> After seeing his 5 week return though anything is possible with this guy.


I guess it may be the built up for a title vs title feud. I think Cody really believes that his TNT title is the top belt cause he cares about it and that has been his goal to make it so by gazillion 20 minutes + matches. I think he thinks that's just a little friendly banter to have said this but his ego is so big that if there's no angle it is essentially pretty innapropriate. At the end of the day, it reveals that they essentialy made the title for him cause he could not be World champ anymore. So it's a big cop out storyline-wise. It reveals the big love fest of All Friends Wrestling, a bunch of spoiled brats, basically. 

But about a heel turn, we've been wondering if he's turning heel for ages and it never does. It's just him having a big ego.


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

Wolf Mark said:


> I guess it may be the built up for a title vs title feud. I think Cody really believes that his TNT title is the top belt cause he cares about it and that has been his goal to make it so by gazillion 20 minutes + matches. I think he thinks that's just a little friendly banter to have said this but his ego is so big that if there's no angle it is essentially pretty innapropriate. At the end of the day, it reveals that they essentialy made the title for him cause he could not be World champ anymore. So it's a big cop out storyline-wise. It reveals the big love fest of All Friends Wrestling, a bunch of spoiled brats, basically.
> 
> But about a heel turn, we've been wondering if he's turning heel for ages and it never does. It's just him having a big ego.


If it isn’t an angle then essentially it’s an EVP using his power to shit on the biggest title and biggest star in their company so it’s hardly a good look to other stars who may consider joining AEW in the future.

If it is an angle and results in Cody getting a world title shot then Cody will be proving that wins and losses don’t matter as he lost his right to challenge for the world title.

I agree with you though, he definitely believes that it is the top belt and that he’s “Mr Dynamite“ because he holds it.


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## Shock Street (Oct 27, 2020)

Cody saying he will never be a heel *is* a heel move at this point


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## La Parka (Oct 28, 2008)

BOSS of Bel-Air said:


> *Way to completely bury your World Championship. Cody is a tone-deaf fucking moron.*


Why does he keep pretending like he's a face when he posts shit like this? I just don't get it.


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## yeahright2 (Feb 11, 2011)

La Parka said:


> Why does he keep pretending like he's a face when he posts shit like this? I just don't get it.


He´s not a face. Cody is a heel by default by making what could have been a good thing for wrestling as a whole into "The Cody and friends show"


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## fabi1982 (Jun 28, 2011)

Two Sheds said:


> The sad thing is he probably actually believes this.


He definitelly believes that and will push it down our throats until we believe as well.


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## fabi1982 (Jun 28, 2011)

Hitman1987 said:


> If it isn’t an angle then essentially it’s an EVP using his power to shit on the biggest title and biggest star in their company so it’s hardly a good look to other stars who may consider joining AEW in the future.
> 
> If it is an angle and results in Cody getting a world title shot then Cody will be proving that wins and losses don’t matter as he lost his right to challenge for the world title.
> 
> I agree with you though, he definitely believes that it is the top belt and that he’s “Mr Dynamite“ because he holds it.


Or even worse, beat Mox in a non title match to proof he could be world champ, but cant because he „never can challange for the title“...this sounds like a really stupid idea, but it is Cody at the end.

Or after a year he hopes everyone has forgotten about the thing wirh him not being able to challange for the title.


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

fabi1982 said:


> Or even worse, beat Mox in a non title match to proof he could be world champ, but cant because he „never can challange for the title“...this sounds like a really stupid idea, but it is Cody at the end.
> 
> Or after a year he hopes everyone has forgotten about the thing wirh him not being able to challange for the title.


Mox wouldn’t allow that, he didn’t walk out on Vince and an easy ride at the top of the biggest company in the world to be told what to do by Cody.

I think Cody turns heel (proper heel and not dark hair heel) and challenges for the world title and passes it off as a heel action.


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## fabi1982 (Jun 28, 2011)

Hitman1987 said:


> Mox wouldn’t allow that, he didn’t walk out on Vince and an easy ride at the top of the biggest company in the world to be told what to do by Cody.
> 
> I think Cody turns heel (proper heel and not dark hair heel) and challenges for the world title and passes it off as a heel action.


As long as he can be the first to hold both belts, everything is fine for Cody, even ignoring what he said a year ago  maybe a tag run with his brother first to be the first triple crown champ. Whatever it takes to cody, as @bdon would say


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## Hephaesteus (Aug 20, 2018)

That feels more kayfabe then cody actually being serious about that tweet if im being honest. He's an executive, so I dont think hed be stupid enough to devalue the company's main title


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## Carter84 (Feb 4, 2018)

God ffs its still better than watching miz v otis , at least Cody can wrestle and knows psychological mind games and gets the little crowds involved , on we were entertainment we get crowd noise pu in , ffs its each to there own, its a bloody bait thread.


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## Carter84 (Feb 4, 2018)

Jazminator said:


> Let AEW worry about ratings. I will never understand fans getting so worked up about this kind of stuff. Just sit back and enjoy (or don’t enjoy) the show.


Same or drawing as if its coming out there pocket and costing them only in shares lol, good post jaz


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## Hitman1987 (May 25, 2020)

fabi1982 said:


> As long as he can be the first to hold both belts, everything is fine for Cody, even ignoring what he said a year ago  maybe a tag run with his brother first to be the first triple crown champ. Whatever it takes to cody, as @bdon would say


A triple crown for the prince of pro wrestling 🤮


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## fabi1982 (Jun 28, 2011)

Hitman1987 said:


> A triple crown for the prince of pro wrestling 🤮


I can see the tshirts already 😂😂


----------



## Klitschko (May 24, 2020)

RapShepard said:


> @bdon


Fuck you Cody.


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

bdon said:


> Goddamn I hate this motherfucker. He needs to fucking retire and only be a booker. He’s worse than goddamn Nash, HHH, Jeff Jarrett, etc combined. They at least booked themselves to be the top dog holding the top championship. He’s out here as an EVP doing everything he can to bury his company’s World Heavyweight Championship title.


My favourite wrestling podcast is Squared Circle Gazette Radio. Please, don’t anyone let their opinions of me get in the way of giving this show a listen. They’re VERY good listens, more so than any podcast with “outsider” takes I’ve listened to. Back when they were running weekly, they won the UK Fan Forum Podcast of the Year beating everybody — from Steve Austin to Jim Cornette.

I bring them up because they have been very optimistic about AEW. They’ve been quiet (pandemic, Liam writing another wrestling book [he won Observer BOTY for his Pillman one], maybe just wrestling burnout), but hearing them talk about the brilliance of Cody and Jericho and getting the judges involved and how that is going to lead to the judges being an important device later, and Cody will now make people BEG for him to win the World Title, because that’s what these stips in wrestling are for. They’re smart guys, passionate guys, reasonable guys. They ALMOST had me convinced AEW would go this route, hahaha.

The judges have never been back. Cody created his own belt. No one is begging for Cody Rhodes - World Champion. I feel bad for these guys (and some of them might completely disagree with my assessment), because the stuff they thought was really “pro-wrestling” about AEW has largely been taken away.

I got out early. I saw them fucking around with their booking on that Double or Nothing show and got bad vibes. Then I saw the Battle Royal. But I feel sorry for the wrestling fans that really believed in this and saw all the right moves, only for the board to be cleared.

I’m trying to work out where the point they stopped trying was. And I think I’ve narrowed it down to two different points that have this roll-on effect:

1. Matt Hardy coming in.

2. Cody no longer having crowds to ham in front of.

I was down on AEW before this point, but going back to Jericho and Mox, you could at least see the attempts for a WWE style main event angle. The eye thing smelt of wrestling, although it had that sports entertainment “Haha! I was faking!” twist! Which made zero sense.

After that, Matt Hardy comes in and does his shit with Jericho, which was AWFUL. Jericho and Matt are buddies. Meltzer would have assured them that shit was hot. The company basically had to apologise for it. And this is one of the first times Jericho has taken that sort of criticism. And he’s been letting it get to him ever since. He’s developing an obsession with his critics — his “digs” at Cornette, him trying to prove he can sing. The ego is wounded and the best thing about AEW is tailspinning.

When it comes to Cody, he was great. But he’s just stopped even trying to be “I love you. I love wrestling. This matters so much. Look how hard I’m forcing this affectation.” He’s got no 40,000 to feed the bread and fish to. He can’t do it without them. He was probably the second best part of AEW, and now he’s just a



Wolf Mark said:


> I guess it may be the built up for a title vs title feud. I think Cody really believes that his TNT title is the top belt cause he cares about it and that has been his goal to make it so by gazillion 20 minutes + matches. I think he thinks that's just a little friendly banter to have said this but his ego is so big that if there's no angle it is essentially pretty innapropriate. At the end of the day, it reveals that they essentialy made the title for him cause he could not be World champ anymore. So it's a big cop out storyline-wise. It reveals the big love fest of All Friends Wrestling, a bunch of spoiled brats, basically.
> 
> But about a heel turn, we've been wondering if he's turning heel for ages and it never does. It's just him having a big ego.


Creating your own belt so you can do title vs. title is pretty bush league though. There’s no history to the feud.

I’m not saying they won’t do it, but damn



La Parka said:


> Why does he keep pretending like he's a face when he posts shit like this? I just don't get it.


In his mind, he’s challenging the WWE myth of championships that are magically behind the World Title for some reason. Like, why do they exist? JR called it out on that Wrestle Kingdom he called. And honestly, why have a belt for fourth best in the world? It is fucking stupid.

And that is why the belt is stupid. It has no reason to exist. I don’t like the North American Title in NXT either. At least if NXT UK got NXT Title defences, I could see why.

I haven’t seen this comparison, but I’m trying to set it apart from the WWE’s IC and US Titles so much, what he has actually done is subconsciously create a world where you’re presenting two World Champions. Who does that sound like?

And yeah, he doesn’t get that he comes off like he’s stepping on the World Champion.

If they were going to do a TNT Title, the way to do it would have been Arn, a legendary TV Champion to come out and talk about the importance of TV, and wrestling to TV. How it brings families together, provides memories, is the media background of America and most places in the world.

But then you still have the World Champion all the time. It’s just...ugh. They didn’t need this belt and it’s helping _no one_. They’ve introduced a device that doesn’t help anyone _on purpose_.


----------



## yeahbaby! (Jan 27, 2014)

What's the big deal, a champion bigging himself up. FFS.

If Randy golden boy Orton did this clearly referencing he's better than Reigns everyone would've swallowed his cum already.


----------



## Shock Street (Oct 27, 2020)

The idea of the belts being equal doesn't bother me, but I think it's impossible with no prestige attached to either of them, and with both of them having the exact same identity.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

The Wood said:


> My favourite wrestling podcast is Squared Circle Gazette Radio. Please, don’t anyone let their opinions of me get in the way of giving this show a listen. They’re VERY good listens, more so than any podcast with “outsider” takes I’ve listened to. Back when they were running weekly, they won the UK Fan Forum Podcast of the Year beating everybody — from Steve Austin to Jim Cornette.
> 
> I bring them up because they have been very optimistic about AEW. They’ve been quiet (pandemic, Liam writing another wrestling book [he won Observer BOTY for his Pillman one], maybe just wrestling burnout), but hearing them talk about the brilliance of Cody and Jericho and getting the judges involved and how that is going to lead to the judges being an important device later, and Cody will now make people BEG for him to win the World Title, because that’s what these stips in wrestling are for. They’re smart guys, passionate guys, reasonable guys. They ALMOST had me convinced AEW would go this route, hahaha.
> 
> ...


1) I thought the judges thing would be a great story-telling device to use on every World Heavyweight Title match, multiple occasions for it to never come into play, then you save it for Moxley vs Omega II. You could use the judges to set up the 3rd match.

2) I also hated Hardy coming into the fry. He immediately took a top billing...to oppose Jericho. Bye bye Omega, bye bye Page, Moxley, Jungle Boy, MJF, etc.

It was at that point that the show became strictly the Cody and Jericho show.


----------



## The_It_Factor (Aug 14, 2012)

“Wet Ass Pussy” is also one of the biggest songs of 2020..... that doesn’t mean it’s a good song or exemplifies what the art of music truly is, it just means people are retarded nowadays.


----------



## reyfan (May 23, 2011)

The_It_Factor said:


> “Wet Ass Pussy” is also one of the biggest songs of 2020..... that doesn’t mean it’s a good song or exemplifies what the art of music truly is, it just means people are retarded nowadays.


I think it's this generation is into "memes" that song is meme how bad it is, OC's act is a meme also, it will be popular until day people just get over it and it's not, the shooting star meme was popular for a while then dropped off the face of the earth.


----------



## Greatsthegreats (Apr 15, 2015)

who doesn't like to see their enemies take eachother out if not just one?


----------



## Aedubya (Jul 12, 2019)

What's the tweet Cody wrote that is making people mad?


----------



## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

Aedubya said:


> What's the tweet Cody wrote that is making people mad?


He said that the TNT Title is the #1 belt in wrestling or something, burying the World Title.


----------

