# 04/29 AEW Dynamite Discussion Thread: TNT Championship Tournament Semi-Finals



## Clique (Sep 9, 2007)




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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

How can a card be so good and so bad at the same time


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## Oracle (Nov 9, 2011)

optikk sucks said:


> How can a card be so good and so bad at the same time


Its starting to get stale now no? 

I like Kib Sabian and Best friends but do i like them to the point i want to watch them every single week? no 

Its getting really boring watching the same crew.


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Good promo from Jake as usual and Schiavone is MUCH better than JR in those sitdown interviews. He and Darby seemed very natural in their back and forth. 

I assume both these videos would have aired on Dynamites if they were not abandoning the rest of their tapings to go back live next week and stretched the two semi final matches out a couple more weeks. 

I still think it's 80% chance Cody wins setting up Cody vs Archer for the TNT title. But I don't like Darby losing again to Cody either. 

With DoN II having only three more shows after Wednesday's last in the can one timing is weird to have the finalists known near a month out. It's not enough time to build a new Cody blood feud he has for every PPV match though, which is why Cody vs Archer is likely, with Allin vs Guevara still simmering and could be added to the PPV with a gimmick match of some sort. 

Hopefully Mox has a sitdown interview with Schiavone rather than an in-ring promo to just the camera. I've been disappointed with all his fan ass kissing promos since he has become champ. He needs some edge back. With Hager vanquished, maybe just have him issue an open challenge for DoN II that can then be answered over the next live shows or something. 

Brodie vs Marko does nothing. We just saw him squashed by Archer. Maybe have #10 wrestle the match or something. I think we can all agree that Marko is the third wheel of Jurassic Express and is very detrimental to it. I've been thinking about how he could be peeled off from the group and still have a role with the company - what about pairing him with Colt Cabana? Colt is midcard, and silly enough a character that he could work with Marko with him. Something as simple as Colt making the save when Vance or Brodie won't pin/stop beating on Marko or something would be enough.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Cody/Darby, Dustin/Lance and the Moxley promo should all be at least decent. Marko Vs Mr. McMahon and the comedy tag can kindly fuck off.


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## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

Predictions for what Moxley has to say? My guess is something about it being for the fans.

Cody and Darby will be good and there is only one person who should win that match. And if he doesn't he should pack it up and head home because he's done.

Archer and Dustin will also be a good match. Archer will probably do something heinous to get Cody's attention. Oh god, what if Archer and Cody both lose their matches to rush a match between themselves? I hope not.

Mr. Brodie and Marko Stunt is going to be dumb and we all know it. I actually think they're going to do the exact same thing as the Archer/Dustin match to get Luchasaurus's attention. I hope they're very different segments.

And that tag match just doesn't matter. They'll get 20 minutes and everyone will get their shit in and nobody will remember it afterwards. 

Like usual we will have some really good stuff and some absolutely terrible stuff. Let's hope there's no more Brady Bunch crap and The Young Bucks can explain to those who don't watch BTE why they were fighting each other. No goofy Kenny shit and Matt Hardy being normal will add many positives to the show. Hopefully they've delivered some recording equipment to Hangman so he can do something and MJF gets on TV again.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

I mean, i can do without the 6-man - but you gotta fill the time somehow i suppose

card looks good otherwise!


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## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> I mean, i can do without the 6-man - but you gotta fill the time somehow i suppose
> 
> card looks good otherwise!


It's not a six man. Just a tag with their managers


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> I mean, i can do without the 6-man - but you gotta fill the time somehow i suppose
> 
> card looks good otherwise!


Could have used a gimmick I reckon.
Oh wait it has one. but I meant something a bit more significant - winner gets a tag title shot later down the line? Or something along the lines.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

optikk sucks said:


> Could have used a gimmick I reckon.
> Oh wait it has one. but I meant something a bit more significant - winner gets a tag title shot later down the line? Or something along the lines.


i think we’re all watching for OC anyway?


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> i think we’re all watching for OC anyway?


Really hoping he gets involved


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## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

optikk sucks said:


> How can a card be so good and so bad at the same time


-covid-19
-Marko Stunt


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> I mean, i can do without the 6-man - but you gotta fill the time somehow i suppose
> 
> card looks good otherwise!


Seems a straight up tag match with OC and Penelope on the outside to provide some shenanigans of course.


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## Dizzie (Jun 22, 2019)

I doubt it will happen because aew dont like doing screwy finishes ( to their detriment at times imo) but how would people feel if archer screws of cody in his match and then cody returns the favour, which then leads to 2 matches at double or nothing of Dustin putting over Darby in the TNT championship final to help push Darby and the obvious match between archer and cody?


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Geeee said:


> -covid-19
> -Marko Stunt


you wash your mouth out!

Mr Brodie Lee killing Marko is going to be spectacular!


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## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Dizzie said:


> I doubt it will happen because aew dont like doing screwy finishes ( to their detriment at times imo) but how would people feel if archer screws of cody in his match and then cody returns the favour, which then leads to 2 matches at double or nothing of Dustin putting over Darby in the TNT championship final to help push Darby and the obvious match between archer and cody?


I wouldnt particularly like it as I think Archer being established as the TNT Champion would be the smart choice. 

Just have Cody appear fazed by Archer/Jake who appear at ring side or in the stands. Darby gets his win and after that interview on the latest 'Road to', I hope he does. 

Then have Cody be out there to support Dustin only for Archer to destroy him infront of his face. Id be all for blood in that much to show the emotion but without a crowd I'm not sure it works. 

Then have Cody look up at Archer with Dustin head in his arms whilst Archer looks down on him in a Bloodsport/Rocky 4 style visual. 

Archer vs Darby - MOTN contender at DoN for the belt.


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## AEWMoxley (May 26, 2019)

If Moxley addresses MJF's statement about becoming world champ and then sets up a feud between the two in this promo.


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## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Dizzie said:


> I doubt it will happen because aew dont like doing screwy finishes ( to their detriment at times imo) but how would people feel if archer screws of cody in his match and then cody returns the favour, which then leads to 2 matches at double or nothing of Dustin putting over Darby in the TNT championship final to help push Darby and the obvious match between archer and cody?


I was thinking this morning about this.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

AEWMoxley said:


> If Moxley addresses MJF's statement about becoming world champ and then sets up a feud between the two in this promo.


Then he can pull a Champion Moxley and have 3 great weeks worth of build with a shit payoff.

But boy oh boy will it be fun watching the ultimate “screw the fans” heel in MJF vs the ultimate “I DO IT FOR THE FANS” ass-kissing babyface in Moxley.

So excited!


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## AEWMoxley (May 26, 2019)

bdon said:


> Then he can pull a Cody and have 3 great weeks worth of build with a shit payoff.
> 
> But boy oh boy will it be fun watching the ultimate “screw the fans” heel in MJF vs the ultimate “I DO IT FOR THE FANS” ass-kissing babyface in Moxley.
> 
> So excited!


That would actually be great. A tremendous build followed by a "shit match" would ensure more meltdowns from you. Even more so if MJF wins and a 24 year old gets a world title reign before any of the EVPs.

But I think they will just go the safe route and give Moxley a filler feud since we're still doing empty arenas. Something like Moxley vs Jericho 2 or Moxley vs Omega 2. Or maybe they'll surprise us and put Cody in there.


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Sucks that PAC, Lucha Bros, Bucks, and Hangman Page can't be there every week. Tired of seeing the same guys, especially Kip Sabian. They have to keep using the same talent. Hopefully with the new set of tapings they do, they have more of their roster ready to go. The Mox segment and the semi-finals should all be great.


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## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

AEWMoxley said:


> That would actually be great. A tremendous build followed by a "shit match" would ensure more meltdowns from you. Even more so if MJF wins and a 24 year old gets a world title reign before any of the EVPs.
> 
> But I think they will just go the safe route and give Moxley a filler feud since we're still doing empty arenas. Something like Moxley vs Jericho 2 or Moxley vs Omega 2. Or maybe they'll surprise us and put Cody in there.


cody can’t fight for the title.


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## AEWMoxley (May 26, 2019)

Danielallen1410 said:


> cody can’t fight for the title.


It's wrestling. None of these stipulations mean anything long term.


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## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Danielallen1410 said:


> cody can’t fight for the title.


You just wait until he turns heel, gets the Cody Rhodes trademark and tells the booing audience that Cody couldn't compete for the title but Cody Rhodes can. 

Because, wrestling is stupid and should be treated as such.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

He just finalised the TM for Cody Rhodes, didn’t he?


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## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

Looking forward to both tournament matches, and the hype package around them was very well done. The Brodie-Stunt thing, I'm not even going to bother commenting on.


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## MaseMan (Mar 22, 2020)

I like the idea of Marko turning heel and acting as Brodie's impish annoying pet. I don't think they can get much more life out of the current Jurassic Express S-M-L gimmick.


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## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

MaseMan said:


> I like the idea of Marko turning heel and acting as Brodie's impish annoying pet. I don't think they can get much more life out of the current Jurassic Express S-M-L gimmick.


A whole repackaging of Marko Stunt as "Cupid Stunt" where he just does stupid stuff that ultimately just gets himself knocked out by wrestlers would be high entertainment


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## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

This Dynamite should be def better than last weeks!


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## zkorejo (Jul 2, 2010)

Good card.. This seems like the first proper AEW show in weeks. Im looking forward to it.


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Cant wait for tonight


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## Whoanma (Apr 5, 2016)




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## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

I forget but the finals will be at DON ppv right ? if it happens


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## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

Watch Cody win for the lulz


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## Jagaver (Aug 11, 2019)

Well, I'm excited about this. Was bored. Made this.


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Watch Cody win for the lulz


you think cody will lose against darby?

wHo bOoKs ThIs sHiT


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## Stellar (May 30, 2016)

Notice that Dustin isn't putting his career on the line now. No chance that he is beating Archer of course but it should be a good battle between them.

I'll agree that it's starting to feel a little stale with the same small group of people. At least Penelope Ford is on my screen more often I guess.


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## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

optikk sucks said:


> you think cody will lose against darby?
> 
> wHo bOoKs ThIs sHiT



I would assume thats the point of matching them up again.


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Watch Cody win for the lulz


Cody is winning for sure. He is already feuding with Lance Archer, who's probably gonna beat the shit out of his brother Dustin tonight. Darby will continue to feud with SG probably with a Part 3 stip match at DON.


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RainmakerV2 said:


> I would assume thats the point of matching them up again.


nah this will lead to something greater down the line for sure. long term booking. Darby WILL get his win against Cody one day, but this match isn't it.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

optikk sucks said:


> you think cody will lose against darby?
> 
> wHo bOoKs ThIs sHiT


I’ve said all along that the tourney bracket looked way too predictable for AEW to not have a swerve planned.

Archer is introduced wanting Cody. Cody NEEDS a title and has openly discussed in the past how he wanted to make secondary titles just as important like they were back in the day with Macho and Steamboat. You have Darby who has yet to pickup a big win, 0-1-1 against Cody. Darby barely beats Sammy with the fluke roll up.

This is a Darby Allin story inside of the larger Cody-Archer angle, IMO.

Or so I hope. Otherwise, this tournament was shit, because anyone with a modicum of wrestling intelligence could have predicted every match all the way to the finals. I like to think AEW is better at throwing a swerve.


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## TD Stinger (May 9, 2012)

At first I was sold on Cody winning but the closer we get to the match it makes me think they’ll have Darby win.

If Darby wins, he’s losing to Archer in the Finals but will look great in defeat and you can save Cody vs. Archer for a later date.

Or Cody wins and loses to Archer in the finals and Cody has to redeem himself later on.

Either way, Archer is winning this thing. Or at least he should.


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

bdon said:


> I’ve said all along that the tourney bracket looked way too predictable for AEW to not have a swerve planned.
> 
> Archer is introduced wanting Cody. Cody NEEDS a title and has openly discussed in the past how he wanted to make secondary titles just as important like they were back in the day with Macho and Steamboat. You have Darby who has yet to pickup a big win, 0-1-1 against Cody. Darby barely beats Sammy with the fluke roll up.
> 
> ...


Why have Darby win just to go on to lose to Archer though? Darby doesn't really have a story here. His story is with Sammy. The tourney is for Archer and Jake the Snake. Predictable is not always bad. Cody vs Archer in the finals is fine by me. Its a bigger main event match worthy of a spot on a PPV that people are paying 50 bucks for. The swerve would be Cody beating Archer by a fluke and then having Archer beat him to a bloody pulp after the fact.


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Cody is winning the semi-final match because he would have nothing else to do for DoN II. Cody always has big blood feuds going into PPV's. Only way I could see Darby winning is if they go Blood and Guts at the PPV and thus Elite vs Inner Circle gives Cody his big focal point feud/program. And the War Games match would suck in an empty arena venue - save that for when crowds are back - whenever that is. 

There is three Dynamite shows that will be taped live 6, 13th and 20th before DoN on May 23rd.

Cody vs Archer for TNT Title and Allin vs Guevara falls count anywhere match for DoN II.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

prosperwithdeen said:


> Why have Darby win just to go on to lose to Archer though? Darby doesn't really have a story here. His story is with Sammy. The tourney is for Archer and Jake the Snake. Predictable is not always bad. Cody vs Archer in the finals is fine by me. Its a bigger main event match worthy of a spot on a PPV that people are paying 50 bucks for. The swerve would be Cody beating Archer by a fluke and then having Archer beat him to a bloody pulp after the fact.


Because I don’t trust Cody to continue any story beyond a single PPV match. I think he can lose here and help Darby win at the PPV. Archer and Cody can feud without a title, and people will watch. Giving Darby the title now allows him to work a program with Sammy and many of the other midcard guys that NEED that prop to their story.

But hell, you’ve talked me into it. Cody is going to bury Darby further, and he’ll likely be done with Archer after May.

Because...Cody.


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Cody has a brewing/future story with Darby. They’ll clash properly one day. 
I believe that one day, Cody will be heel and world champion. Darbys first ever title opportunity will be against Cody.


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## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

bdon said:


> I’ve said all along that the tourney bracket looked way too predictable for AEW to not have a swerve planned.
> 
> Archer is introduced wanting Cody. Cody NEEDS a title and has openly discussed in the past how he wanted to make secondary titles just as important like they were back in the day with Macho and Steamboat. You have Darby who has yet to pickup a big win, 0-1-1 against Cody. Darby barely beats Sammy with the fluke roll up.
> 
> ...


i thought sammy would beat Darby.


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Danielallen1410 said:


> i thought sammy would beat Darby.


Sammy vs Archer would never happen though so it would have really made the semi-finals a foregone conclusion.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

I hope Darby wins, but I am in the camp of ‘its not happening yet’

i’m fine with him being like 0-4 against Cody, and then with some high stakes, finally taking the win sometime in the future / cementing main event status


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Sammy vs Archer would never happen though so it would have really made the semi-finals a foregone conclusion.


sammy is one of the guys Archer mentioned multiple times he wants to work with - fellow texan and he likes him

won’t happen now, but will happen in future for sure


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> sammy is one of the guys Archer mentioned multiple times he wants to work with - fellow texan and he likes him
> 
> won’t happen now, but will happen in future for sure


Right. I'm, of course, referencing the TNT Tournament finals. Heel vs heel, no crowd etc.


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## TD Stinger (May 9, 2012)

prosperwithdeen said:


> Why have Darby win just to go on to lose to Archer though? Darby doesn't really have a story here. His story is with Sammy. The tourney is for Archer and Jake the Snake. Predictable is not always bad. Cody vs Archer in the finals is fine by me. Its a bigger main event match worthy of a spot on a PPV that people are paying 50 bucks for. The swerve would be Cody beating Archer by a fluke and then having Archer beat him to a bloody pulp after the fact.


Darby’s story is more with Cody than anyone else right now. He’s beaten Sammy twice already, he’s never beaten Cody, and that still eats away at him as shown in his interview with Tony.


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## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Archer distracts Cody, Darby wins, BAH GAWD!!

Didn't Tony Khan say today was going to be fucking great with a tweet the other day?


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## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Damn. Just realized how much I miss PAC. What an awesome wrestler.


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

bdon said:


> *Because I don’t trust Cody to continue any story beyond a single PPV match.* I think he can lose here and help Darby win at the PPV. Archer and Cody can feud without a title, and people will watch. Giving Darby the title now allows him to work a program with Sammy and many of the other midcard guys that NEED that prop to their story.
> 
> But hell, you’ve talked me into it. Cody is going to bury Darby further, and he’ll likely be done with Archer after May.
> 
> *Because...Cody.*


He hasn't been doing that for years and years lol



TD Stinger said:


> Darby’s story is more with Cody than anyone else right now. He’s beaten Sammy twice already, he’s never beaten Cody, and that still eats away at him as shown in his interview with Tony.


I must have missed that interview, was it on Youtube?


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## TD Stinger (May 9, 2012)

prosperwithdeen said:


> He hasn't been doing that for years and years lol
> 
> 
> 
> I must have missed that interview, was it on Youtube?


It’s the video in the OP.


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## rexmundi (Apr 1, 2012)

I think that Archer and Dustin go before Cody/Darby and Archer damn near Apollo Creeds Dustin. Cody is shaken by this and Darby exploits that for the win and a date with Archer. Gonna be a good show.


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

TD Stinger said:


> It’s the video in the OP.


Just watched it. Yeah you're right, that interview does create a story and kind of set the stage for a possible swerve.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Cool opening video package. Really hypes the match this is something AEW is very strong at.


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## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

Even tho it's obvious they're building Archer/Cody for the finals at DoN2 I really feel Darby could use the W here.


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## taker1986 (Sep 14, 2016)

Surprised this match is opening the show. I thought they would've started with Archer/Dustin and saved this for the main event.


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

rexmundi said:


> I think that Archer and Dustin go before Cody/Darby and Archer damn near Apollo Creeds Dustin. Cody is shaken by this and Darby exploits that for the win and a date with Archer. Gonna be a good show.


This has been my thinking as well. That would be more Rocky III though, at least the first half.


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## Bosnian21 (May 27, 2019)

I think Jericho referenced the Cody Rhodes-Xavier Woods wrestling match in high school! Lol


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

I liked Cody trying to bridge out and injuring himself that way. Pretty unique.


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Pretty good so far, fuck commercials


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## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

taker1986 said:


> Surprised this match is opening the show. I thought they would've started with Archer/Dustin and saved this for the main event.


Probably planning something big for the finish of Archer-Dustin.


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## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)




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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

How come Cody isn't selling the knee? Not even a little?


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Bosnian21 said:


> I think Jericho referenced the Cody Rhodes-Xavier Woods wrestling match in high school! Lol


He did. Xavier Woods real name is Austin Watson. Woods has told that story in the past as well and used it as motivation.


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## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

Chip Chipperson said:


> How come Cody isn't selling the knee? Not even a little?


He has been


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## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Chip Chipperson said:


> How come Cody isn't selling the knee? Not even a little?


he is although darby keeps forgetting which one.


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## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

Commercials ruining a really solid match..


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

This match is nice, I think Cody gets too much flak for in-ring.


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## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

I'm thinking MJF & Wardlow attack Moxley tonight


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## Whoanma (Apr 5, 2016)




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## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)




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## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

This is great storytelling how Darby just can’t beat Cody.


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## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

WTF, i thought DARBY won?


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Fucking Christ they couldn't have had him win that any worse lol. They picked the option where nobody looks good


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

I feel like they should've put Darby over in this one. Match dragged a little but generally good.


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## punkypower (Mar 2, 2020)

Holy crepe!! What a finish!! I was so confused when I heard Cody's music, I thought Darby Allin had won!


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## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

Good match mucked up by a finish I'm still trying to wrap my head around.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Like bruh who thought "yeah you hit me with your finisher, and I just drunkenly roll you up" was the right finish lol


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## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

El Hammerstone said:


> Good match mucked up by a finish I'm still trying to wrap my head around.


darby hit the coffin drop, but left his shoulders on the mat and got pinned.


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## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

Danielallen1410 said:


> darby hit the coffin drop, but left his shoulders on the mat and got pinned.


I know, I meant it in terms of why they would choose a finish like that.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

El Hammerstone said:


> Good match mucked up by a finish I'm still trying to wrap my head around.


It was just convoluted. Like I get that the story being told was supposed to be "hey Darby almost beat Cody" but the way it played out, he just looks dumb. 

He'll be fine, but that was silly.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

My only issue with the finish is that it makes Darby look weak. Goes to the top, hits his finisher and within a second or two Cody is able to roll him up for the three count? Maybe if Darby hit it in the first minute of the match but Cody was tired and weak as well. Makes Darby look bad and Cody doesn't look good coming out of it either.


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## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

That looked like a sloppy fucked up finish. Not good. Darby got him and i legit thought he won, what the heck lol


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## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> Fucking Christ they couldn't have had him win that any worse lol. They picked the option where nobody looks good


I thought the complete opposite.


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## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

I mean if Cody was going to win by stealing it like that why not just book it so he reaaaaally steals it?

Plant those seeds for the inevitable heel turn. 

Nuetralizing finishes make no one look good. Good match besides that.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Danielallen1410 said:


> I thought the complete opposite.


Who do you think looked good and why?


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## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Makes sense that MJFs pet is a rat.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> Fucking Christ they couldn't have had him win that any worse lol. They picked the option where nobody looks good





RapShepard said:


> Like bruh who thought "yeah you hit me with your finisher, and I just drunkenly roll you up" was the right finish lol





El Hammerstone said:


> I know, I meant it in terms of why they would choose a finish like that.


Goddamn Cody Rhodes fucking sucks. He has no fucking clue how to put a match together. Goddamn. What the fuck was the point in a goddamn water bottle spot!?

And that fucking finish? Way to make you both look like shit. Stole that finish from HHH vs Jeff Hardy according to a friend.

Cody Rhodes fucking sucks. Keep him out of the ring and just let him do promos and that other shit. Piece of shit.


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## TD Stinger (May 9, 2012)

Match was alright from what I saw but kind of a ho him finish, especially for Darby with this being his 3rd big chapter against Cody.

These segments with MJF remind of those segments Orton did when first debuted and got hurt.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Good Sky video package and a good MJF promo. Good show thus far...


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## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> Who do you think looked good and why?


I felt they both looked good throughout the match.

i thought the finish was great storytelling how darby keeps getting close to beating Cody, was very creative, but only my opinion.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

bdon said:


> Goddamn Cody Rhodes fucking sucks. He has no fucking clue how to put a match together. Goddamn. What the fuck was the point in a goddamn water bottle spot!?
> 
> And that fucking finish? Way to make you both look like shit. Stole that finish from HHH vs Jeff Hardy according to a friend.
> 
> Cody Rhodes fucking sucks. Keep him out of the ring and just let him do promos and that other shit. Piece of shit.


I like Cody in the ring. But the bottle spot was pointless and the finish was super dumb.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

TD Stinger said:


> These segments with MJF remind of those segments Orton did when first debuted and got hurt.


Yeah that's the vibe I got as well. Doing Orton's schtick


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Opener was good, just a shitty ending. Oh well. And now Wardlow, lets squash this guy lol


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Jericho just say it..."STUPID IDIOTS!!!!"


----------



## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

AEW really has something here with Wardlow.


----------



## 2Short2BoxWGod (Mar 13, 2013)

The ol’ HHH vs Jeff Hardy No Mercy 2008 finish


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Archer vs Cody obvious


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Nice F5 from Wardlow


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Wardlow could be a future star for AEW. Has a great look.

I'm surprised WWE never picked him up he seems totally up their alley.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Danielallen1410 said:


> I felt they both looked good throughout the match.
> 
> i thought the finish was great storytelling how darby keeps getting close to beating Cody, was very creative, but only my opinion.


I think it makes him look terrible. I mean how do you get pinned by a guy who just coffin dropped into your knees, that you then coffin dropped yourself. 

Darby didn't have to win the match, and I get wanting to protect him. But in execution that was just terrible. 

Also he hasn't ever been close other than this one. Remember he was about to get counted for 3 in the first, got pinned out right in the second, and now lost after hitting his finisher lol


----------



## Bosnian21 (May 27, 2019)

Wardlow fucked up Musa with the knee to the face.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Although I liked the finish I didn’t get the point in the brandy spot but I’m overanalysing.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Did Wardlow win with the infamous outside object...A FUCKING WATER BOTTLE!?


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Glad we are getting a NO DQ match but am I missing something? Why do these 2 teams hate each other?


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Just throwing it out there but it makes absolutely no sense that Dustin's career was on the line last week but this week it isn't...


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

prosperwithdeen said:


> Glad we are getting a NO DQ match but am I missing something? Why do these 2 teams hate each other?


There was a run in and brawl last week...so I guess that warrants a no disqualification match


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> I think it makes him look terrible. I mean how do you get pinned by a guy who just coffin dropped into your knees, that you then coffin dropped yourself.
> 
> Darby didn't have to win the match, and I get wanting to protect him. But in execution that was just terrible.
> 
> Also he hasn't ever been close other than this one. Remember he was about to get counted for 3 in the first, got pinned out right in the second, and now lost after hitting his finisher lol


The story of the second one was that Cody won due to arns coaching.

fsir enough if you feel the finish was poor, I disagree though. All depends on perspective, I felt it is a great way to continue the story and Darby sold the fact he had made a mistake post match.


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

Wtf did I just watch


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

This is so fucking stupid.


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Actually that was a fucking creative video, i enjoyed it!!


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Holy shit Vickie lol


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

After last weeks debacle that was an entertaining bubbly bunch segment


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Danielallen1410 said:


> After last weeks debacle that was an entertaining bubbly bunch segment


How?

Not only does it make zero sense but it also had zero reasoning behind it.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Hopefully this turns into garbage wrestling, I want thumbtacks and barbwire


----------



## Braylyt (Jan 19, 2015)

These dorky Jericho segments are the only reason I watch AEW live


----------



## ManiaSeason2017 (Jan 30, 2017)

Who was that moderately buff looking guy who looked like a cross between disco Inferno and Marc Cuban? He was in the middle of the melee spoof.


----------



## punkypower (Mar 2, 2020)

After Peter Avalon, the only people I recognized were Vickie, Virgil, Kevin Smith, (edit: Jericho's Dad) and....

I had the EXACT reaction as Jericho did "Was that Lou Ferrigno??"

Who the heck was everybody else??


----------



## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)




----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Did they have Swoggle in that video to try and make Marko look less ridiculous?


----------



## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)




----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Lheurch said:


> Did they have Swoggle in that video to try and make Marko look less ridiculous?


Yeah, Hornswoggle doing the worm. High-larious!


----------



## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)

M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 said:


>


----------



## Bosnian21 (May 27, 2019)

Enjoyable match so far.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Yeah, Hornswoggle doing the worm. High-larious!


Jericho's dad was pretty funny but the rest was a bit silly.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

This has been pretty entertaining


----------



## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)




----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

not my cup of tea this but they certainly give something for everyone.


----------



## Jet_420 (Oct 22, 2019)

punkypower said:


> After Peter Avalon, the only people I recognized were Vickie, Virgil, Kevin Smith, (edit: Jericho's Dad) and....
> 
> I had the EXACT reaction as Jericho did "Was that Lou Ferrigno??"
> 
> Who the heck was everybody else??


I think for celeb wise beside Lou Ferrigno, there was Corey Taylor, Kevin Smith, Jay Mewes, Gabriel Iglesias, and Brad Williams in it.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Jericho asks the right question: "what are they fighting for?"


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

This match has been awesome for what it is.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 said:


>


I love this.


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Chip Chipperson said:


> How?
> 
> Not only does it make zero sense but it also had zero reasoning behind it.


As much sense as the Wrestlemania Bray vs Cena, right? lol


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

RapShepard said:


> This match has been awesome for what it is.


Was very fun and watchable!


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

That was awesome, great overall show so far, we still got Moxley and Archer vs Dustin ayeee


----------



## punkypower (Mar 2, 2020)

Thanks, @Jet_420!!

I couldn't even pay attention to the match, been driving me crazy!!

I saw Silent Bob, but not Jay.

According to Twitter, also had Duff from GnR (!!), Wee Man from Jackass (!), the narc from Tiger King..


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

This should be a signature if not a finisher -


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1255661985255096321
F-10 just looks too sloppy on the landings.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

I love that the inaugural TNT Championship is not being won in a match on TNT.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Chan Hung said:


> Was very fun and watchable!


 Kip and Havoc are a good random pairing honestly. They should flesh that out some, you hardly ever see a heel version of an odd couple team.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Chip Chipperson said:


> How?
> 
> Not only does it make zero sense but it also had zero reasoning behind it.


It was entertaining and funny in my opinion


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

RapShepard said:


> Kip and Havoc are a good random pairing honestly. They should flesh that out some, you hardly ever see a heel version of an odd couple team.


Its probably the best thing for both of them. It's so random, yet it sort of works.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Lheurch said:


> I love that the inaugural TNT Championship is not being won in a match on TNT.


Would make sense, but I think it makes more sense to stack the PPV. The crowning or celebration on TNT is good enough.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Chan Hung said:


> As much sense as the Wrestlemania Bray vs Cena, right? lol


Don't know. Didn't see it. Don't like WWE because of silly shit also.


----------



## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)




----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

We finally get to see the dentist office!


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

Surprisingly good match. 

Outside of the dreadful Cody/Darby finish this has been a good show.


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

DR BRIT, HOLY SHIT THIS IS AWESOME


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

RapShepard said:


> Kip and Havoc are a good random pairing honestly. They should flesh that out some, you hardly ever see a heel version of an odd couple team.


They're legit flatmates as well. So a lot of hijinks and hilarity with living arangement footage. Especially if/when Penelope is spending the night.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Holy shit Rebel looks heaps different now from her time in TNA...


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Mox better cut an awesome promo tonight after that shitshow with Jake Hager


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Britt Baker is honestly one of the highlights of the show everytime she's featured.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Trolling on Tony is so good.


----------



## Jet_420 (Oct 22, 2019)

Is Rebel a free agent?


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

That was a fucking great segment by BRITT, Holy fuck that was awesome!


----------



## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

That tag match was brutal.


Jet_420 said:


> Is Rebel a free agent?


No she's the one doing the make up in AEW.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Im loving Britt Baker lol


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Erik. said:


> Britt Baker is honestly one of the highlights of the show everytime she's featured.


One of the best parts of the show. Her in ring isnt great but even vs WWE girls, she is coming through on the mic and with a better gimmick than most of them now.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

I like Britt Baker and feel she's a good character but wouldn't it make sense for Britt to bully an active AEW talent leading into a feud as opposed to an announcer?


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Chan Hung said:


> One of the best parts of the show. Her in ring isnt great but even vs WWE girls, she is coming through on the mic and with a better gimmick than most of them now.


Character > Ring work. 

Always has been, always will be.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Chip Chipperson said:


> I like Britt Baker and feel she's a good character but wouldn't it make sense for Britt to bully an active AEW talent leading into a feud as opposed to an announcer?


The chemistry she has with Tony is so good though. Hopefully she will have new targets too soon.


----------



## Bosnian21 (May 27, 2019)

I like how he was defending his face instead of taking those punches.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Chip Chipperson said:


> I like Britt Baker and feel she's a good character but wouldn't it make sense for Britt to bully an active AEW talent leading into a feud as opposed to an announcer?


She was actually getting ready to feud with Big Swole before COVID happened


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> They're legit flatmates as well. So a lot of hijinks and hilarity with living arangement footage. Especially if/when Penelope is spending the night.


Didn't know that, so yeah they definitely should get on that lol.


----------



## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)




----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Chip Chipperson said:


> I like Britt Baker and feel she's a good character but wouldn't it make sense for Britt to bully an active AEW talent leading into a feud as opposed to an announcer?


They were working towards that before all of the talent went MIA due to the pandemic. She and Big Swole has a very interesting back and forth on Dynamite.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Spears with the best music in all of wrestling


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

I feel like Spears would be a good tag team guy. Not sure why.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Aight World Champion time, this better be a fire promo


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Chip Chipperson said:


> I feel like Spears would be a good tag team guy. Not sure why.


Because you're at least sure he's a meh fucking singles guy. He has to excel at something right lol


----------



## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)




----------



## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

Chip Chipperson said:


> I feel like Spears would be a good tag team guy. Not sure why.


Funny you say that because he's been doing a months long angle on Dark where he and Tully are searching for the perfect tag partner for him, which hasn't actually gone anywhere.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> Because you're at least sure he's a meh fucking singles guy. He has to excel at something right lol


I think he's an okay singles guy just lacks character. If he was the quiet angry type and teamed with someone with some charisma he could be good I think.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Chip Chipperson said:


> I feel like Spears would be a good tag team guy. Not sure why.


Watched him on DARK working as a heel, and he started pounding the turnbuckle like a babyface waiting for the hot tag. You’re a heel. Just go in there and cheat.

He is what he is.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Good shit from Taz, more of these


----------



## Jet_420 (Oct 22, 2019)

punkypower said:


> Thanks, @Jet_420!!
> 
> I couldn't even pay attention to the match, been driving me crazy!!
> 
> ...


Your welcome, I didn't see wee man though.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Love these Taz segments


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Lol self aware Marko


Chip Chipperson said:


> I think he's an okay singles guy just lacks character. If he was the quiet angry type and teamed with someone with some charisma he could be good I think.


Basically be like the Cesaro and get somebody he can play off of.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

These Taz move breakdown segments are a good addition


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Are they legitimately giving a hype package for Marko Stunt?


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Jim Cornette's favorite character is coming out.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

I don't but it Jericho, but good building him up


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

This better be a straight up squash


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

I am watching Dynamite with my wife for the first time. She saw Marko come on and just started laughing and said "that kid fights?" I said "not really."


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

"I now have respect for Marko Stunt"

- Chris Jericho


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Marko using the Rugrats logo is smart


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Jericho about Jim Ross being part of the Dark Order is fucking hilarious!


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

At this point Marko should be dead.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Brodie is huge


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Marko and Colt could be a good on-screen pairing. Colt could make it work.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

So dumb.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

He's not some goofy southerner lol


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Jericho is a treasure.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Of course Marko beats the 10 count. He's superhuman


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

He literally did look like a ragdoll at the end there. Did this match have a point? Does it add anything to a story or develop anyone?


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

The craziest part is Marko is his biggest scalp he's got


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

That was a good enough squash, Brodie doesn't come off looking weaker thankfully


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

What a waste of time. Can't wait to see Marko in the crowd next week challenging Wardlow to a fight.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Fucking Christ Moxley is really the dreaded Vince type Babyface lol.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

At least Mox will be live next week.


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Love the scenary! Good Promo


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Chip Chipperson said:


> What a waste of time. Can't wait to see Marko in the crowd next week challenging Wardlow to a fight.


That would make sense for his current character.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

I LOVED THAT LOL Mox is the man


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

That is going to be a long drive for Mox if he really does it.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

I like Moxley he reminds me of an old school territory babyface


----------



## taker1986 (Sep 14, 2016)

This has been a really good show. Hopefully the main event delivers. If you said to me at the start of the year that Dustin would main event two Dynamites in a row I would've called you crazy.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Shit like this just confirms that wrestlers are just as out of touch and lacking creativity as Vince lol. That promo sounds like it came straight from Dean Ambrose via Vince McMahon.


----------



## MoxAsylum (Jan 9, 2020)

This show is terrible


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Chip chipperson would insert triple h angry gif after this tweet 😂😂


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1255670104286728199


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

RapShepard said:


> Shit like this just confirms that wrestlers are just as out of touch and lacking creativity as Vince lol. That promo sounds like it came straight from Dean Ambrose via Vince McMahon.


Come on man it wasn't on THAT level lol


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

RapShepard said:


> Shit like this just confirms that wrestlers are just as out of touch and lacking creativity as Vince lol. That promo sounds like it came straight from Dean Ambrose via Vince McMahon.


Nawh. Started off that way but he elevated it and took it into a different direction as things transpired. 

It was a solid promo overall. Most importantly he will be there.


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

I suspect we get Brodie Lee vs Luchasaurus at DoN II. No other reason to have that Marko match so soon after the Archer one.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

MoxAsylum said:


> This show is terrible


The troll has arrived! Welcome troll


----------



## punkypower (Mar 2, 2020)

As much as I don't buy Marko, I thought it would have been cool if Brodie would have recruited him to the DO after.

I'll keep my comments about Mox to myself because I think I'm the only one to not really care for him..especially as champion..

BRING ON ARCHER!!


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Mjf and Moxley next week, things are picking up


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Lheurch said:


> He literally did look like a ragdoll at the end there. Did this match have a point? Does it add anything to a story or develop anyone?


None. Other than maybe Archer and Brodie just wanted to throw someone around to make themselves look larger.

But now I’m on the bandwagon. This shit with Marko vs Archer and Brodie Lee was dumb as fuck.


And now I’m forced to watch Moxley pander to fans like a 50s babyface and joking about calling our grandmothers. Stupid as fuck.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Next week looks a really good show.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

I hope Le Sex Gods tear up the building.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Looks like a good card for next week. Frankie Kazarian Vs Jon Moxley has a heap of potential.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

HOLY SHIT thats a PPV level main event Street Fight next week


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Hahaha Archer just beating up a random dude. I love it. That guy sold more than Marko too.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Brandy is sexy as fuck


----------



## AEWMoxley (May 26, 2019)

Looks like Moxley is done with the Inner Circle. 

We might get Moxley vs MJF after all.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Im hyped for that Street Fight Kenny Omega is the fuckin GOAT


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

prosperwithdeen said:


> Come on man it wasn't on THAT level lol






PavelGaborik said:


> Nawh. Started off that way but he elevated it and took it into a different direction as things transpired.
> 
> It was a solid promo overall. Most importantly he will be there.


It was completely Vince Babyface, Mox being a good talker doesn't change the Vince content. Mans ended it talking about "don't forget to call your grandma", after hitting the WWE classic of "aw shucks you fans it's all about you" lol.


----------



## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1255671746373447680


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

An hour ago Brandi was limping so badly that she struggled to move and now she is fine.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> Fucking Christ Moxley is really the dreaded Vince type Babyface lol.





RapShepard said:


> Shit like this just confirms that wrestlers are just as out of touch and lacking creativity as Vince lol. That promo sounds like it came straight from Dean Ambrose via Vince McMahon.





punkypower said:


> As much as I don't buy Marko, I thought it would have been cool if Brodie would have recruited him to the DO after.
> 
> I'll keep my comments about Mox to myself because I think I'm the only one to not really care for him..especially as champion..
> 
> BRING ON ARCHER!!


Moxley is proving why he doesn’t win many world championships. He’s better in the chase and has no fucking clue how to BE a champion.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

I am excited for the street fight. Just please do not have anyone teleporting.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

This is bad forward planning. Why is Brandi fine?


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

prosperwithdeen said:


> Im hyped for that Street Fight Kenny Omega is the fuckin GOAT


Jericho has been working toward Kenny for a while. Way too much Jericho chatter involving Omega on Twitter and commentary.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Chip Chipperson said:


> An hour ago Brandi was limping so badly that she struggled to move and now she is fine.


ive a feeling this was originally planned to be on next weeks show but now they can go live it’s been moved to this week.

would have been better to have Cody vs Darby in the ME really.


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Looks like a good card for next week. Frankie Kazarian Vs Jon Moxley has a heap of potential.


Agree. That should be solid. Next week should be awesome.

Hey today's show has flown by rather quick.


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

RapShepard said:


> It was completely Vince Babyface, Mox being a good talker doesn't change the Vince content. Mans ended it talking about "don't forget to call your grandma", after hitting the WWE classic of "aw shucks you fans it's all about you" lol.


Mox was whining about smelly people in WWE brah.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Chip Chipperson said:


> This is bad forward planning. Why is Brandi fine?


Taped different days.


----------



## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)




----------



## Jet_420 (Oct 22, 2019)

People in the Manitoba Melee

Ortiz
Sammy G
Jake Hagger
Santana
Peter Avalon
Jungle Jack Perry
Sonny Kiss
Luther
Ted Irvine (Chris' Dad)
Lou Ferrigno(with a taser)
Corey Taylor
Duff McKagan
Jay Mewes
Kevin Smith
Gabriel Iglesias
Brad Williams
Don't know
Virgil
Don't know(looks a little like Alex Jones)
Vickie Guerrero

edit: the two I didn't know after Brad Williams was Ryan Niemiller and after Virgil was James Garretsons


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

The DUSTY BLEED!! YESSS


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

I knew Dustin was gonna bleed tonight lol, Cody gonnn be madddddddd


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Someone help. I'm confused. So next week is legit live? Or what is happening? Was today then the last of the tapings?


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Dustin got some color. We have 20 minutes left. Going to be a war.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Chan Hung said:


> Someone help. I'm confused. So next week is legit live? Or what is happening? Was today then the last of the tapings?


Assuming they are still in GA, they are allowing most businesses to reopen so they have no legal hurdles now.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Chan Hung said:


> Someone help. I'm confused. So next week is legit live? Or what is happening? Was today then the last of the tapings?


Yeah, I think they had one more taping filmed hence both semis tonight.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

bdon said:


> Moxley is proving why he doesn’t win many world championships. He’s better in the chase and has no fucking clue how to BE a champion.


I don't know if it's that or something else. But I can't imagine if folk were being honest, they'd say they thought a Vince free Moxley would be thanking the fans weekly and telling folk to call grandma.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

bdon said:


> None. Other than maybe Archer and Brodie just wanted to throw someone around to make themselves look larger.
> 
> But now I’m on the bandwagon. This shit with Marko vs Archer and Brodie Lee was dumb as fuck.
> 
> ...


Lol You're taking this shit too seriously dude, Mox was just having fun with the segment


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

So far I've been more into Lance than into Brody. But both are big fucks. Good job for AEW for hiring more big men.


----------



## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

RapShepard said:


> I don't know if it's that or something else. But I can't imagine if folk were being honest, they'd say they thought a Vince free Moxley would be thanking the fans weekly and telling folk to call grandma.


Yeah I expected him to keep being the Tweener character he was during the chase.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> I don't know if it's that or something else. But I can't imagine if folk were being honest, they'd say they thought a Vince free Moxley would be thanking the fans weekly and telling folk to call grandma.


They won’t be honest.

Moxley has no clue how to live his character. Why must the character change when you become a champion? Be the no-holds-barred, don’t-care-about-anyone live wire. Stop thanking the goddamn fans, stop being a good guy, etc. 

He is a great wrestler and great character who is currently pretending to be champion.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

PavelGaborik said:


> Mox was whining about smelly people in WWE brah.


Both can be ridiculous. 

Question though, was this the Moxley you were expecting to get when he was free from Vince? Would you have guessed he'd be dedicating his belt to the fans weekly and telling folk to call grandma as if Vince wrote his promo?


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1255671842729271337
I thought it was fine. I mean give Cena the same material and it would have been syrupy pandering but the setting and Mox's edge made it work better. I'm not a huge fan of the baby kissing face Mox, but it's what he wants to say right now.

And they're setting up for somebody, maybe MJF, to call him out on it I think.


----------



## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)




----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

prosperwithdeen said:


> Lol You're taking this shit too seriously dude, Mox was just having fun with the segment


As was Matt Hardy. As was Kenny Omega in a match with Nakazawa. As was Jericho with all of these stupid Bubbly Bunch segments.

They’re fucking stupid and don’t work for the character’s history.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1255671842729271337
> I thought it was fine. I mean give Cena the same material and it would have been syrupy pandering but the setting and Mox's edge made it work better. I'm not a huge fan of the baby kissing face Mox, but it's what he wants to say right now.


agree.


----------



## MoxAsylum (Jan 9, 2020)

I'm tired of seeing Aubrey Edwards, she annoys me


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

prosperwithdeen said:


> Lol You're taking this shit too seriously dude, Mox was just having fun with the segment


Agree, it’s. A pandemic and they were just doing a little something for the fans.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

too many commericals bruh wtf


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Damn, this show flew by.


----------



## AEW_19 (May 15, 2019)

This was a good show


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Lheurch said:


> Yeah I expected him to keep being the Tweener character he was during the chase.





bdon said:


> They won’t be honest.
> 
> Moxley has no clue how to live his character. Why must the character change when you become a champion? Be the no-holds-barred, don’t-care-about-anyone live wire. Stop thanking the goddamn fans, stop being a good guy, etc.
> 
> He is a great wrestler and great character who is currently pretending to be champion.


Yeah it's clear that he doesn't know how to make his character a good guy, without going full blown good guy. Like it's not even that he's cutting bad babyface promos, it just doesn't match with his character or what he said he didn't want his character to be. 

Idk maybe he's closer to Mankind than Austin. Where he's a goofball with a high pain tolerance and not so much a classic anti authority rebel


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

RapShepard said:


> Both can be ridiculous.
> 
> Question though, was this the Moxley you were expecting to get when he was free from Vince? Would you have guessed he'd be dedicating his belt to the fans weekly and telling folk to call grandma as if Vince wrote his promo?


To be fair - No. But I do think he pulled that promo off quite well overall. He does pander more than I would've expected, but he also has a lot more depth to his character overall then say a bland John Cena.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Tony Khan might actually have been right for once when he said this was the best no audience show ever.

For once.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Erik. said:


> Tony Khan might actually have been right for once when he said this was the best no audience show ever.
> 
> For once.


100 per cent it’s been really good.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Erik. said:


> Tony Khan might actually have been right for once when he said this was the best no audience show ever.
> 
> For once.


Wouldn't go that far.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Id love to see Jake Roberts at ringside during Archer's matches, but I guess with his age and Covid he needs to stay at home?


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

Why is this thread full of anti aew trolls?


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Lance Archer is pretty fucking good isn't he!?


----------



## AEW_19 (May 15, 2019)

HOLY FUCK!


----------



## ManiaSeason2017 (Jan 30, 2017)

[email protected]! Missed the main event, it's looking good last five minutes. Interesting choice to end the show.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

PavelGaborik said:


> To be fair - No. But I do think he pulled that promo off quite well overall. He does pander more than I would've expected, but he also has a lot more depth to his character overall then say a bland John Cena.


But what depth does he really have though, being edgier than Cena doesn't equal more depth. The only depth he's really received in AEW is that he was kind of jealous of Omega and wanted to see what the hype was. But other than that there's been no real build to the Moxley character. Other than he's the same silly, but violent guy he's been since the Shield turned face in 2014. 

Cena while being for the kids has way more character depth than Moxley.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

It's quite upsetting that it took until 2019 for Archer to truly break out. And at his age.

This guy is going to be a star for AEW. I'm pleased for him and that he's got that oppertunity.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Ok.

Now THAT was a great finish. I loved that towel spot with Cody stepping in to stop it.


----------



## ManiaSeason2017 (Jan 30, 2017)

When they talk about "you still got it", nobody exemplifies that more than Dustin Rhodes.


----------



## MrThortan (Apr 9, 2018)

Fun show. They made Archer look like madman.


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

Typical Cody melodrama. Its jumped the shark at this point.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Wouldn't go that far.


Can’t think of one better


----------



## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)




----------



## Buhalovski (Jul 24, 2015)

Why is Archer not at least 10 years younger....


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Brilliant show, deserves a good rating.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Tsvetoslava said:


> Why is Archer not at least 10 years younger....


He’ll be good to go for 5 years.


----------



## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

bdon said:


> As was Matt Hardy. As was Kenny Omega in a match with Nakazawa. As was Jericho with all of these stupid Bubbly Bunch segments.
> 
> They’re fucking stupid and don’t work for the character’s history.


I mean rating Wise they seems to work.


----------



## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

Tsvetoslava said:


> Why is Archer not at least 10 years younger....


Always thought the tramp stamp held him back, not even kidding.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Great main event and a great show. Lance Archer is a fuckin beast. Cody is taking ANOTHER L at DON lol.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Typical Cody melodrama. Its jumped the shark at this point.


He has a lot of shit in his matches, but I enjoy it most of the time personally. Did think the whooping from MJF went OTT


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

Archer needs to win the TNT title. 

And I don't even know who takes it off him


----------



## Jazminator (Jan 9, 2018)

Great show. Awesome way to finish!

When is Cody-Archer happening? At the PPV or before?


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Erik. said:


> Lance Archer is pretty fucking good isn't he!?


Probably my favorite character in AEW currently. Eveb


RapShepard said:


> But what depth does he really have though, being edgier than Cena doesn't equal more depth. The only depth he's really received in AEW is that he was kind of jealous of Omega and wanted to see what the hype was. But other than that there's been no real build to the Moxley character. Other than he's the same silly, but violent guy he's been since the Shield turned face in 2014.
> 
> Cena while being for the kids has way more character depth than Moxley.


I really appreciate the honesty. I thought I was the only one seeing it. Omega and Jericho made his first year in AEW look far better than he has ever done on his own.

Oops. Did I say that out loud!?


ManiaSeason2017 said:


> When they talk about "you still got it", nobody exemplifies that more than Dustin Rhodes.


Dustin is legitimately one of the best in-ring storytellers ever. Cody could learn A LOT from him.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Jazminator said:


> Great show. Awesome way to finish!
> 
> When is Cody-Archer happening? At the PPV or before?


At the PPV


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Damn - Archer is amazing. Looks so legit

great episode tonight

wish Darby won - but he’s getting closer to beating Cody - next time he will


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

RapShepard said:


> He has a lot of shit in his matches, but I enjoy it most of the time personally. Did think the whooping from MJF went OTT


I usually enjoy it, but its too much. Of course Brandi has to bump within 2 minutes and then the finish is a contested roll up after Brandi comes back out with water, and now theres gonna be a secondary story of why he didnt throw the towel in and yadda yadda yadda. Like okay.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

Erik. said:


> Archer needs to win the TNT title.
> 
> And I don't even know who takes it off him


Probably Luchasaurus once he starts getting pushed


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Typical Cody melodrama. Its jumped the shark at this point.


Again. I thought I was the only one arguing this point for MONTHS.


----------



## M1M2M3M4M5M6M7M8 (Dec 15, 2004)




----------



## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

Well, I didn't bother watching the middle portion of the show, but the two tournament matches were good at least.


----------



## Jazminator (Jan 9, 2018)

RapShepard said:


> At the PPV


Thanks!


----------



## taker1986 (Sep 14, 2016)

Erik. said:


> Archer needs to win the TNT title.
> 
> And I don't even know who takes it off him


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

El Hammerstone said:


> Well, I didn't bother watching the middle portion of the show, but the two tournament matches were good at least.


Middle portion was good. This show flew by quick honestly. Watch the Britt Baker promo and check out Best Friends vs Havoc and Sabian as well. 

The squashes were squashes so you could probably spend 10 minutes in worse ways lol.


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

The fact that Archer is 43 years old means they need to strap a rocket on him honestly, the guy will probably retire in the next 3 years. I say give him the TNT Title now and maybe a World title run right before he calls it quits


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

taker1986 said:


> View attachment 85636


God, that'd be fucking awesome.


----------



## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

El Hammerstone said:


> Well, I didn't bother watching the middle portion of the show, but the two tournament matches were good at least.


The tag match was way better than expected.


----------



## Buhalovski (Jul 24, 2015)

taker1986 said:


> View attachment 85636


----------



## punkypower (Mar 2, 2020)

prosperwithdeen said:


> Id love to see Jake Roberts at ringside during Archer's matches, but I guess with his age and Covid he needs to stay at home?


I posted a couple of updates in the "Lance Archer is cool" and "Video thread."

Basically, Jake left the safety of DDPs house bc he was "scared of losing (his) place in line with AEW" and quarantined himself in a hotel so that he could do promos for Dynamite.

However, quarantine was really getting to him and he made some alarming tweets about sobriety, depression, etc.

DDP had told him if he left, he was on his own bc of having a newborn in the house. However, after seeing the tweets, DDP took him back into the "recovery crib." If you get a chance, look at DDPs and Jake's Twitter accounts! Especially the Easter video, I teared up on that one.


----------



## Asuka842 (Jul 19, 2016)

Cody vs. Darby was a really good match, except for the finish. Interesting idea for a finish, but the execution was poor. It didn't look like anything was keeping Darby from getting up, he pinned himself basically. Also not a great camera angle, Darby's should way clearly way off of the mat.

Also Darby needs to start winning matches against the top guys soon. He always loses them and that was fine at first, but it's gone on long enough now.

The tag match was insane, I loved every second of it. RIP Trent's back.

Manitoba Melee was hilarious.

Archer looked like a beast.

Good show aside from the Cody match finish.


----------



## Rated-R-Peepz (Aug 4, 2010)

Good main event. Real good show overall.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

RainmakerV2 said:


> I usually enjoy it, but its too much. Of course Brandi has to bump within 2 minutes and then the finish is a contested roll up after Brandi comes back out with water, and now theres gonna be a secondary story of why he didnt throw the towel in and yadda yadda yadda. Like okay.


Aye he learned from new age HHH well. Don't book yourself at the tippy top. Just put your fingers in everything else lol.

Cody really does have like 16 stories tho lol. On one hand its great they have overarching feuds and rivalries, on the other it's like damn spread the wealth to someone else.


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

of course i missed the last 5 fucking minutes lol.Who won ? final match


----------



## Alright_Mate (Jul 21, 2014)

Shame Darby didn’t win but at least we aren’t getting a Cody vs Dustin final, as good as their previous match was, they shouldn’t face each other again, especially over something like the TNT title when it’s the perfect opportunity to give the spotlight to others.

Now they got the first bit kind of right, it’s now in their hands to make Lance Archer a star.


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

RapShepard said:


> But what depth does he really have though, being edgier than Cena doesn't equal more depth. The only depth he's really received in AEW is that he was kind of jealous of Omega and wanted to see what the hype was. But other than that there's been no real build to the Moxley character. Other than he's the same silly, but violent guy he's been since the Shield turned face in 2014.
> 
> Cena while being for the kids has way more character depth than Moxley.


Cena had absolutely no edge to his character - so yes, he most certainly has more depth than Cena just based on that alone. Also - Moxley has seen extremely limited screen time lately - judging him solely based on 1-2 minute video promos isn't exactly the best example of his character. 

Mox plays the psycho character extremely well, sure he may pander to the crowd more than I anticipated but he's also delivered significantly better promo material since leaving the WWE. 

He's legitimately unloaded at times while on the mic - something he never would've been able to do in WWE. The man was literally chewing on sandwiches with a face full of mustard and wearing a gas mask because he was afraid of smelly people in the audience in the WWE. To act as if his character in AEW hasn't changed is simply wrong. 

Even the little bit of edge he had to his character in WWE he wasn't able to actually follow through with during matches. 

Do you remember his edgy video package promos/segments leading up to his match against Brock with the barbwire bat? They legitimately got me hyped up as well. They were solid segments.....and then the match happened. It wasn't long after that Dean became a goofball comedy character with only a couple of memorable feuds left before he left the company.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> Middle portion was good. This show flew by quick honestly. Watch the Britt Baker promo and check out Best Friends vs Havoc and Sabian as well.
> 
> The squashes were squashes so you could probably spend 10 minutes in worse ways lol.


Agreed. It was a great show.

Low points are Cody thinking a water bottle spot is a good idea, the shit finish that makes Darby look stupid, Moxley’s lack of understanding on how to be himself and BE the champion vs acting like what he THINKS is a champion.

The No DQ tag match was a lot of fun. Trent is a fucking stud. He has some Dustin in him in that he can really, really make a lot of guys look great with his selling in-ring.

And while I hate Cody’s melodrama, I thought that towel spot with him stopping QT Marshall was BEAUTIFULLLLLL storytelling. That is some great goddamn depth to the character. I fucking loved it, and I normally hate Cody’s smoke and mirrors BS.

My hats off to whoever thought of that spot with the towel. Legitimately has me fucking pumped. MORE OF THAT!!!!


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

To be honest having Cody win kinda makes sense. Hes the face boy and he needs to start the trend that this belt will be a competitors defending belt but means something.So Cody can fight people a lot and have his fucking weekly match that he always has to book himself and make himself look like a winning champion and start this belt off right


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> Aye he learned from new age HHH well. Don't book yourself at the tippy top. Just put your fingers in everything else lol.
> 
> Cody really does have like 16 stories tho lol. On one hand its great they have overarching feuds and rivalries, on the other it's like damn spread the wealth to someone else.


This is nothing new. I was saying this in November when the BBB debuted to awkward silence.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

That tag match was a lot better than i thought it would be - enjoyed it

enjoyed Brodie v Marko

enjoyed all of it - Mox promo was fun

Darby has to beat Cody next time. Archer has to win the belt


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

Tsvetoslava said:


> Why is Archer not at least 10 years younger....


Big men tend to age well. He's a significantly better performer today than he was 5-10 years ago.

AEW would be stupid not to run with him now. Dude is a better version of Braun.


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

Of course we will see how this belt comes off but the name TNT could work since that is a bit of the theme for the company. Dynamite ect. As long as its a weekly defending belt that u wanna fucking have im in


----------



## Prosper (Mar 25, 2015)

shandcraig said:


> of course i missed the last 5 fucking minutes lol.Who won ? final match


Lance Archer. QT was about to throw in the towel but Cody stopped it. Lance won in dominating fashion.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Show this week was good:

The Pros:

- Cody/Darby was really good apart from the finish which makes Darby look bad and does nothing for Cody.

- Video packages throughout the night apart from Marko Stunt were good. Scorpio Sky is becoming more and more compelling whilst the opening build to Cody/Darby was also pretty great.

- Warlow squash was great. Wardlow looking like a beast and has plenty of potential in AEW.

- No DQ match wasn't really warranted for a simple run in brawl the week prior but it was an okay match up. Not too fond of random gimmick matches on TV for no reason though.

- Britt Baker was great.

- Spears has potential but it's not in the spot they have him in currently. He needs a tag team partner with some personality 

- I enjoyed babyface Moxley because it reminded me of a 70's babyface in a local territory telling the kids to be good and do their homework and come out to (Insert arena here) to see them challenge for the World Title. I do understand the people that were critical of it though because Moxley is meant to be this bad ass babyface. I think he came across really relatable here though and a man of the people which is good.

- Next weeks show looks good I am genuinely interested in Kazarian/Moxley and if the Jericho tag has no shenanigans it should be good fun. Big step up for Sammy Guevarra working some pretty big names on a pretty big show. 

- Dustin and Archer was fine but probably too long.

The Cons:

- Finish for Cody/Darby was poor.

- The Bubbly Bunch segments are stupid and don't make sense. They're all having a social distancing brawl through their phones and all these random people are involved in it most of them being unrecognisable. The segment serves no purpose, doesn't build to anything and doesn't result in anything. It only exists because AEW absolutely cannot go one show without some lame comedy skit. Worst part of this weeks show.

- A hype package for Marko Stunt of all people trying to paint him as this sympathetic babyface who fights against the odds. Getting this guy over just isn't going to happen and it was cringe inducing to hear former AEW World Champion and wrestling legend Chris Jericho try to put him over by saying he respects him and he's a great wrestler who uses his size to his advantage. 

- Brodie Vs Marko should've been done after Brodie smashed his foot into his face 30 seconds in. It wasn't as silly as the Archer/Marko match but suffered from some of the same issues. If Brodie Lee kicks me in the face full force I'm most likely knocked unconscious but somehow Marko is alive and moving around within 10 seconds. Anywho...

- Main event starts with Archer beating up a backstage worker. He's done this a few times now why hasn't he been fined, suspended, cautioned etc about this behaviour? It makes it look like that in AEW the inmates run the asylum and there are no rules.

- Why isn't Brandi hurt? I understand from a real life perspective that they probably planned this match earlier on in the TV airing schedule or later on (Someone said next week?) but you've put some pretty heavy emphasis on her getting hurt in the opening match and then she waltzes out in the main event and is completely fine? It makes things look really bad and is an absolutely horrible continuity error on AEW's part and it'd have been so easy to fix as well by simply swapping the opener and main event.

- Match was fine although I feel a bit long. A 10 minute brawl with those guys would've been awesome but Dustin isn't a big enough star in 2020 to be taking large amounts of TV time like this and Archer is a new character so he probably shouldn't either.


In closing a fun show and next weeks edition looks like it'll be pretty awesome also. Not sure I'd say it's the best show this year or whatever Tony Khan was blabbering on about but definitely one of AEW's best since the COVID-19 situation.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Lance really never looked in trouble

laughing like a madman.

who knew before the last G1 that he would become one of my faves


----------



## TD Stinger (May 9, 2012)

Cody vs. Darby was solid from what I saw, but the bad finish didn’t help things. The tag was good harmless fun.

And the real gem of the show was the main event. Archer really got to spread his wings and show what he could do and Dustin was the perfect opponent for this match.


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

Danielallen1410 said:


> He’ll be good to go for 5 years.



40 is new 30


----------



## Asuka842 (Jul 19, 2016)

Bitch heel Britt is great. Turning her was a fantastic move. And damn that knee spot with Wardlow looked devastating.


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

Sounds like a great show - modern fans don't get finishes which protect losers like foot or ropes or shoulder up.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

PavelGaborik said:


> Cena had absolutely no edge to his character - so yes, he most certainly has more depth than Cena just based on that alone. Also - Moxley has seen extremely limited screen time lately - judging him solely based on 1-2 minute video promos isn't exactly the best example of his character.
> 
> Mox plays the psycho character extremely well, sure he may pander to the crowd more than I anticipated but he's also delivered significantly better promo material since leaving the WWE.
> 
> ...


Except being edgy isn't depth though, not real depth. It's just "ah this feels more mature" . Character depth is something like 

Knowing why Darby wears his face paint is depyh

Knowing Hangman Page wants to leave the Elite and was so annoyed by them refusing to let him leave. 

Cena easily has more depth than Moxley even if we added in the Ambrose character. We know exactly what makes Cena tick in kayfabe. We know what he likes and hates, how he responds to losses, how he responds to triumph, we even know his ego can get the best of him. Cena has depth, not liking it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. 

With Moxley even if you add in Ambrose we know he's a "weird cat" but really that's it. You used to be able to blame a lot of that on the subpar WWE writing, but now he has no real excuse. It's not that he's a bad promo cutter, he can do that in his sleep. But where are all these cool ideas that Vince was passing on, where's this character depth that fans have been claiming Vince was missing. 

You say he's cutting better promos, but didn't name not one of these better promos. You can't name one, because he's giving the same good but not memorable promos he always has. 

You talk about goofy WWE shit he did, which he certainly did some goofy shit. But is that anymore goofy than wearing a fucking eyepatch for the majority of a title match when you didn't need it. Is it any more goofy than "lol Call your grandma". 

The more and more he does his own thing it becomes clear to me, that him and Vince both had bad ideas lol.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Show this week was good:
> 
> The Pros:
> 
> ...


Might want to save this for the next time someone calls you a WWE Fanboy.


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

Lheurch said:


> Assuming they are still in GA, they are allowing most businesses to reopen so they have no legal hurdles now.


Nice!! Back to reality-ish


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

bdon said:


> Might want to save this for the next time someone calls you a WWE Fanboy.


I never take those people seriously anyway. I've not watched WWE regularly since 2006.


----------



## TKO Wrestling (Jun 26, 2018)

AEW really has something with Archer & Wardlow. They need to continue pushing them both.


----------



## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

bdon said:


> Ok.
> 
> Now THAT was a great finish. I loved that towel spot with Cody stepping in to stop it.


Loved how he was like Fuck off Cody with the Towel at him. Nice way to heel it up at the end!!


----------



## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

Lo who saw MJF crush someone insulting him on twittee. Such a good comeback.


----------



## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

bdon said:


> Might want to save this for the next time someone calls you a WWE Fanboy.


It won't matter, it will be forgotten about almost instantly.


----------



## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

So Omega and Hardy vs. Jericho and Guevara, Moxley vs. Kazarian, and MJF returns. Thank the wrestling Gods, we're starting to get some guys back again.


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

RapShepard said:


> Except being edgy isn't depth though, not real depth. It's just "ah this feels more mature" . Character depth is something like
> 
> Knowing why Darby wears his face paint is depyh
> 
> ...


Literally off the top of my head without even thinking his small but simple backstage paradigm shift promo was significantly better than any promo I can remember him cutting in WWE in recent memory.

And yes - I would say slobbering and drooling on yourself while eating a chicken sandwich and having an entire gimmick where you wear a mask because you're afraid of "smelly people" is significantly worse than telling people to call their Grandma during a pandemic that is generally affecting old people.

Let's face facts - Dean became a comedy act in WWE. Mox has some comedic elements (which I personally like) I enjoyed the Ambrose character as well for quite some time. He just eventually became this wannabe hardcore guy full of empty threats to the point where he eventually became comedic relief.

You have to deliver on your threats in promos(at least to a degree) on at least on a semi-regular basis to be taken even remotely seriously in my view.

The character didn't fit the WWE mold - hence why he ended up becoming a generic geek. Ambrose had a great heel turn and a fantastic feud with AJ Styles that showed his potential....other than that the last few years were nothing short of an abysmal waste of talent.

PS : Adding any type of element to an individual characters traits certainly classifies as "depth" for better or for worse.


----------



## taker1986 (Sep 14, 2016)

El Hammerstone said:


> So Omega and Hardy vs. Jericho and Guevara, Moxley vs. Kazarian, and MJF returns. Thank the wrestling Gods, we're starting to get some guys back again.


This match also just announced, although not as excited for this one. Overall the card looks really good though.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

PavelGaborik said:


> Literally off the top of my head without even thinking his small but simple backstage paradigm shift promo was significantly better than any promo I can remember him cutting in WWE in recent memory.
> 
> And yes - I would say slobbering and drooling on yourself while eating a chicken sandwich and having an entire gimmick where you wear a mask because you're afraid of "smelly people" is significantly worse than telling people to call their grandma Grandma during a pandemic that is generally affecting old people.
> 
> ...


I'd put his promo after the Shield break up against the Paradigm Shift promo. And Jon delivered on the Paradigm Shift promo, by being the same silly, but violent guy he claimed Vince was making him be. He's certainly higher up on the card, but he also went to a smaller pond. Its easy to be the star when you're a WWE grandslam champion surrounded by a bunch of folk getting their first national exposure in North America. 

I think it comes down to folk are willing to accept and excuse Moxley pandering and being a silly goose, because well at least he's being zany in the main event and not in the upper midcard. I mean seriously he by choice that it was a good idea to where an eyepatch for 90% of a title match, just to reveal he didn't need it lol.

We both know if he had cut the promo he did tonight in WWE, folk would be going on about how Vince was trying to make him a Cena clone with the pandering, never give up, and grandma jokes. 

All this is besides the point. Moxley is still awesome, it's just funny that Vince's version of him and his preferred version of him aren't nearly as different as he or fans would like to admit.


----------



## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

taker1986 said:


> View attachment 85637


🤢🤮


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

RapShepard said:


> I'd put his promo after the Shield break up against the Paradigm Shift promo. And Jon delivered on the Paradigm Shift promo, by being the same silly, but violent guy he claimed Vince was making him be. He's certainly higher up on the card, but he also went to a smaller pond. Its easy to be the star when you're a WWE grandslam champion surrounded by a bunch of folk getting their first national exposure in North America.
> 
> I think it comes down to folk are willing to accept and excuse Moxley pandering and being a silly goose, because well at least he's being zany in the main event and not in the upper midcard. I mean seriously he by choice that it was a good idea to where an eyepatch for 90% of a title match, just to reveal he didn't need it lol.
> 
> ...


I wouldn't. There was significantly more emotion and more of a genuine feel to his Paradigm shift promo. 

I think you're overanalyzing a simple video package - I rarely watch WWE these days but if that 2 minute Mox package was a low point I would consider it one of the best non-PPV shows I've watched in years. The main issue was he portrayed himself to be this "violent character" that WWE simply wouldn't allow him to be. He was a fraud to the point where he essentially just became a geek. The same way that they've booked the glass man Samoa Joe. Cutting badass promos repetitively just doesn't cut it when you've failed miserably to back it up time and time again. Vince may have "portrayed" Mox as being a violent badass with some of his promos, but that's certainly not the way the majority of the actual feuds played out. He became a geek full of empty threats. 

The difference is Mox is able to afford being a tad goofy in AEW - because he's been booked as a legitimate badass in who's able to back up his talk with violent matches WWE would never allow these days. 

I'm not going to get into WWE and their terrible "put 60 year old Goldberg over our most over star so Roman can look strong" booking beyond what I just said. 

You're right - this is semantics.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

PavelGaborik said:


> I wouldn't. There was significantly more emotion and more of a genuine feel to his Paradigm shift promo.
> 
> I think you're overanalyzing a simple video package - I rarely watch WWE these days but if that 2 minute Mox package was a low point I would consider it one of the best non-PPV shows I've watched in years. The main issue was he portrayed himself to be this "violent character" that WWE simply wouldn't allow him to be. He was a fraud to the point where he essentially just became a geek. The same way that they've booked the glass man Samoa Joe. Cutting badass promos repetitively just doesn't cut it when you've failed miserably to back it up time and time again. Vince may have "portrayed" Mox as being a violent badass with some of his promos, but that's certainly not the way the majority of the actual feuds played out. He became a geek full of empty threats.
> 
> ...


How much of a geek is a grand slam champion. Let's be honest here, Ambrose career is better than about 95% of folk that ever wrestled for WWE. Shawn Spears was a geek loser nobody in WWE. Moxley was a guy, he just wasn't thee guy. 

Even Mox is violent in matches, that's a super overstatement at this point. He's had 2 extreme matches the last one being in October. Unless you're going to say the Hager match was violent. 

But we won't agree which is fine so whatever lol


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> How much of a geek is a grand slam champion. Let's be honest here, Ambrose career is better than about 95% of folk that ever wrestled for WWE. Shawn Spears was a geek loser nobody in WWE. Moxley was a guy, he just wasn't thee guy.
> 
> Even Mox is violent in matches, that's a super overstatement at this point. He's had 2 extreme matches the last one being in October. Unless you're going to say the Hager match was violent.
> 
> But we won't agree which is fine so whatever lol


The Hager match was no hold’s barred! Moxley grabbed Hager’s ankle! And Hager didn’t do anything but look at him! Mox has had 5 star matches! Look them up!! I swear it!!!


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Great opener. I love that rivalry and Darby's character development. Can't wait to see what's next.
The tag match was fun af. Good stuff. 
Absolutely loved the main event, great match. Dustin is phenomenal in face in peril role and Archer is a freaking beast, unbelievably good considering his age and size. Archer was an awesome signing and he's living up to the hype. Him vs Cody feels like a big match.

Awesome show! And next week should be even better. AEW are back on track.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

bdon said:


> The Hager match was no hold’s barred! Moxley grabbed Hager’s ankle! And Hager didn’t do anything but look at him! Mox has had 5 star matches! Look them up!! I swear it!!!


I'm still surprised that match didn't get the Edge vs Orton response lol



EmbassyForever said:


> Great opener. I love that rivalry and Darby's character development. Can't wait to see what's next.


What character development?


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

Quick thoughts:

Cody and Darby was fine. Typical Cody shenanigans, whatever. I like these two together in the ring. 

Moxley is a nerd. Get the title off this guy.

Britt Baker is the best thing on TV in either company.

Brodie vs. Stunt wasn't an abomination, but it still went too long.

4 geeks..(well Trent isnt a geek he just hangs out with geeks and doesn't seem to have any other aspirations), beat on each other with furniture for 20 minutes..
Whatever.

Archer looked really good, but the whole thing went too long and got way too melodramatic (Cody, cough) by the end. I didnt like Dustin kicking out of the moonsault. That would have been a cool finish.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

RapShepard said:


> I'm still surprised that match didn't get the Edge vs Orton response lol
> 
> 
> 
> What character development?


He keeps losing big matches, each time in the most frustrating way (Hager, Arn) which makes him more determined and vicious afterwards.
This time he actually had him beat, but still lost. Should be interesting to see how it's going to play out.

Personally I'm a sucker for redemption stories (Davey Richards before winning the ROH title, DB before WM30, Naito...) so I'm loving this storyline and Darby's struggle.


----------



## Pippen94 (Jan 10, 2020)

I like both endings to tournament matches. You can play off both to further / create angles - this is what TV matches should do


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

RapShepard said:


> How much of a geek is a grand slam champion. Let's be honest here, Ambrose career is better than about 95% of folk that ever wrestled for WWE. Shawn Spears was a geek loser nobody in WWE. Moxley was a guy, he just wasn't thee guy.
> 
> Even Mox is violent in matches, that's a super overstatement at this point. He's had 2 extreme matches the last one being in October. Unless you're going to say the Hager match was violent.
> 
> But we won't agree which is fine so whatever lol


Being a grand slam Champion in the WWE doesn't hold as much weight in 2020 as it once did.

Bayley by definition - is literally a grand slam Champion. Ambrose had a better WWE career than 95% of current WWE geeks? Nawh. A better peak? Certainly. He was given pushes at certain points, but always felt like an afterthought. Relative to his potential certainly felt underutilized, particularly after his Styles fued. Let's not pretend the WWE Tag titles (or even their mid card titles) are worth a damn these days. They're hot potato filler trash and we both know it.

Besides his AJ Styles feud, did you really think mustard face was being utilized to his potential getting pinned by the likes of the fucking Miz and sucker punched by 300 Nyla the whale? Oof.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

PavelGaborik said:


> Being a grand slam Champion in the WWE doesn't hold as much weight in 2020 as it once did.
> 
> Bayley by definition - is literally a grand slam Champion. Ambrose had a better WWE career than 95% of current WWE geeks? Nawh. A better peak? Certainly. He was given pushes at certain points, but always felt like an afterthought. Relative to his potential certainly felt underutilized, particularly after his Styles fued. Let's not pretend the WWE Tag titles (or even their mid card titles) are worth a damn these days. They're hot potato filler trash and we both know it.
> 
> Besides his AJ Styles feud, did you really think mustard face was being utilized to his potential getting pinned by the likes of the fucking Miz and sucker punched by 300 Nyla the whale? Oof.


This is the funny thing about that though, people try to have it both ways. Folk on one hand say WWE titles mean nothing... But then the get upset if their favorite has no titles lol. You say being a grand slam champion, but if he had no title wins you'd decry them for that. 

To me I look at it like this, WWE is the only company where fans look at it as "if you're not thee guy you're a nobody". To me I'd say Moxley was essentially in the spot Cody is in right now. Cody isn't the guy in AEW, but it's clear he matters. Same with Ambrose, he wasn't the guy, but it was clear he mattered. 

Hell even digging deeper just like Cody, Ambrose lost his fair share of feuds, but there was usually some Tom foolery or something going on to where sure he lost, but it wasn't clean. 

So being used to his potential I'd say yes and no, yes in position, but no in the sense of story. But that wasn't an Ambrose thing, they just have had a hard time doing anything besides "that was cool" storylines for everybody. I mean I like Reigns, they clearly like Reigns, and it's not like even he can get them to write great storylines.


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

RapShepard said:


> This is the funny thing about that though, people try to have it both ways. Folk on one hand say WWE titles mean nothing... But then the get upset if their favorite has no titles lol. You say being a grand slam champion, but if he had no title wins you'd decry them for that.
> 
> To me I look at it like this, WWE is the only company where fans look at it as "if you're not thee guy you're a nobody". To me I'd say Moxley was essentially in the spot Cody is in right now. Cody isn't the guy in AEW, but it's clear he matters. Same with Ambrose, he wasn't the guy, but it was clear he mattered.
> 
> ...


Are you implying I was jumping up and down for joy at the prospect of Dean winning the tag titles and US Titles? The reality is neither titles carry much weight in today's Wrestling climate. No, I would not bitch and moan if Ambrose hypothetically never carried the tag titles (but that would be weird)or US Championship. Him winning the WWE title was certainly nice but his reigns were relatively lackluster.

I don't agree with your Cody/Mox analogy. How many singles matches has Cody lost without some sort of fuckery taking place? Everything that Cody is involved in right now feels like the big deal and he's come out looking just as strong if not stronger in every major feud he's been involved in thus far.

Hell - I wouldn't be surprised if he went the extra mile and beat Lance Archer at DoN2 at this point. I mean why not?

I'm personally not fan of "four move" Roman myself.


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

bdon said:


> The Hager match was no hold’s barred! Moxley grabbed Hager’s ankle! And Hager didn’t do anything but look at him! Mox has had 5 star matches! Look them up!! I swear it!!!


Extremely difficult to take you seriously if you're incapable of recognizing Mox/Omega as a great match regardless of what end of the spectrum you're on regarding those type of matches.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

PavelGaborik said:


> Are you implying I was jumping up and down for joy at the prospect of Dean winning the tag titles and US Titles? The reality is neither titles carry much weight in today's Wrestling climate. No, I would not bitch and moan if Ambrose hypothetically never carried the tag titles (but that would be weird)or US Championship. Him winning the WWE title was certainly nice but his reigns were relatively lackluster.
> 
> I don't agree with your Cody/Mox analogy. How many singles matches has Cody lost without some sort of fuckery taking place? Everything that Cody is involved in right now feels like the big deal and he's come out looking just as strong if not stronger in every major feud he's been involved in thus far.
> 
> Hell - I wouldn't be surprised if he went the extra mile and beat Lance Archer at DoN2 at this point. I mean why not?


No I'm implying that we all know folk say one thing that don't actually mean it. I mean when fucking Shawn Spears was on his way to AEW, people were heavily discussing how he was misused because he was the type of guy who deserved to be a midcard title mainstay. So I'm calling bull shit that you and others wouldn't have been upset if he spent 7 years on the main roster and had no titles to his name. 

But there's very little to disagree with the Cody and Ambrose analogy. I mean simply put, Ambrose wasn't the world title story or maybe even co main story, but he was always a pretty important story for his brand just like Cody is in AEW. You can down his position all you want, but his feuds were presented as one of the bigger deals more often than not.


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

RapShepard said:


> No I'm implying that we all know folk say one thing that don't actually mean it. I mean when fucking Shawn Spears was on his way to AEW, people were heavily discussing how he was misused because he was the type of guy who deserved to be a midcard title mainstay. So I'm calling bull shit that you and others wouldn't have been upset if he spent 7 years on the main roster and had no titles to his name.
> 
> But there's very little to disagree with the Cody and Ambrose analogy. I mean simply put, Ambrose wasn't the world title story or maybe even co main story, but he was always a pretty important story for his brand just like Cody is in AEW. You can down his position all you want, but his feuds were presented as one of the bigger deals more often than not.


Sean Spears can still be a solid mid carder moving forward. I was a never a huge fan of his personally, but he's okay.

I mean you aren't wrong in the sense that if he didn't win any championships it would've certainly added more fuel to the fire that he was misused. The issue is his title reigns almost always felt like insignificant filler. Dean never truly felt like a "top guy" for a significant period of time and eventually became a glorified mid card comedy act.

He's better than that.


There's a lot to disagree with regarding your Cody analogy - the obvious being that Cody hasn't lost a single feud clean to date while Dean was coming up on the short end of the stick(clean) against mid carders more often than not to end his tenure.

Again - I wouldn't be shocked to see Cody beat Archer with the way he's been booked.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

RapShepard said:


> But there's very little to disagree with the Cody and Ambrose analogy. I mean simply put, Ambrose wasn't the world title story or maybe even co main story, but he was always a pretty important story for his brand just like Cody is in AEW. You can down his position all you want, but his feuds were presented as one of the bigger deals more often than not.


Idk do you remember when he was WWE champion, beats The Shield, Feuds with Cena and Styles, only for 5 months later to be on the pre-show at Mania. A lot of times they pulled the rug under him like he didn't matter.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

The Definition of Technician said:


> Idk do you remember when he was WWE champion, beats The Shield, Feuds with Cena and Styles, only for 5 months later to be on the pre-show at Mania. A lot of times they pulled the rug under him like he didn't matter.


 Yes I remember how even in your "well what about this situation" example, he was still put in a position of importance by being an IC champ. Him being on the preshow at 33 is less about him being not important, but more about the card.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

PavelGaborik said:


> Extremely difficult to take you seriously if you're incapable of recognizing Mox/Omega as a great match regardless of what end of the spectrum you're on regarding those type of matches.


Omega vs Moxley was great. 

Hager vs Moxley was stupid. Just like his pandering to the fans like he’s some sort of clean cut babyface and talking about visiting grandmothers.
The shit is stupid. He feels like less of a champion with the title than he ever did in the chase to the title.



The Definition of Technician said:


> Idk do you remember when he was WWE champion, beats The Shield, Feuds with Cena and Styles, only for 5 months later to be on the pre-show at Mania. A lot of times they pulled the rug under him like he didn't matter.


Does it not occur to anyone that people typically lose the title when you can’t present yourself as THE top guy? Omega lead the dance for all of Moxley’s most memorable spots that first year. It was Omega’s idea for the poker chips to be built. It was Omega’s call for the sugar glass table spot. We know Jericho leads the dance in everything he is involved in.

They have now groomed him for the spot and left to his own devices, he cuts the stupid babyface promo at Revolution and the next night at Dynamite. Multiple times there after he has pandered to the fans. Jericho said it best the very first Dynamite after Revolution, “I don’t need a damn belt to be LeChampion!” Moxley has one and still doesn’t feel like a champion.

It’s like Moxleyhas insecurities, and he doesn’t feel comfortable just being himself, turned up to the Nth degree, while holding the title. He was PERFECT in the chase, but as a champion...he’s directionless.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

On a more positive note, I hope this pandemic has shown them ways to utilize the undercard/midcard talent in more meaningful ways. I always felt the key to WCW winning the ratings war was the midcard guys, the cruiserweights with that hot opening, etc. The minute WWE started utilizing more of their midcard and undercard guys, it was over. Then WCW lost all their midcard guys due to the glass ceiling, and they were out of business.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

RapShepard said:


> Yes I remember how even in your "well what about this situation" example, he was still put in a position of importance by being an IC champ. Him being on the preshow at 33 is less about him being not important, but more about the card.


They would destroy their WWE title's credibility by having Mox drop even lower than that so quickly. It still shows that there were many times they didn't care for him or try to listen to him or let him have organic moments.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

bdon said:


> On a more positive note, I hope this pandemic has shown them ways to utilize the undercard/midcard talent in more meaningful ways. I always felt the key to WCW winning the ratings war was the midcard guys, the cruiserweights with that hot opening, etc. The minute WWE started utilizing more of their midcard and undercard guys, it was over. Then WCW lost all their midcard guys due to the glass ceiling, and they were out of business.


Touching on this I thought that was the point of the alliance with OWE in China. Get a bunch of never seen before guys who are masters of the high-flying style and open up your TV shows hot just like WCW did. Give the Dragon Gate or OWE guys 8 minutes in a six man tag to open up an episode of Dynamite and you would get a phenomenal match. Instead CIMA was just a random midcard guy and then stopped getting booked.

AEW probably knows it needs to utilise the midcard better but how many midcard guys do they have that people care about? Dustin, Jungle Boy, Luchasaurus, MJF and maybe Darby + Sammy? The only future stars in that line up are possibly Jungle Boy and MJF and even those two need more time to get into the main event scene.


----------



## zkorejo (Jul 2, 2010)

Darby vs Cody delivered. Really love their matches. Next time he will win. 

Where had he been hiding, Archer can be THE top heel for AEW easily.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Great show. No complaints at all.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

PavelGaborik said:


> Literally off the top of my head without even thinking his small but simple backstage paradigm shift promo was significantly better than any promo I can remember him cutting in WWE in recent memory.
> 
> And yes - I would say slobbering and drooling on yourself while eating a chicken sandwich and having an entire gimmick where you wear a mask because you're afraid of "smelly people" is significantly worse than telling people to call their grandma Grandma during a pandemic that is generally affecting old people.
> 
> ...


also.... and this is critical - he never won. He must’ve been 50/50 at best

a goof that loses is a super goof

here he doesn’t lose

a goof that wins and can kick your ass is a whole different prospect


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

Brodie vs Marko and Archer vs Marko are great examples of how Marko should be booked in matches. If they continue to book him in matches like these then I have 0 problem with the dude.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

DJ Punk said:


> Brodie vs Marko and Archer vs Marko are great examples of how Marko should be booked in matches. If they continue to book him in matches like these then I have 0 problem with the dude.


The thing is, nobody should have any issues with him in the first place.

they’re worried about wrestling being taken less seriously.....

It’s 2020, wrestling hasn’t been taken seriously since 2001.

And prior to the pandemic, he was the guy who used to take the beatings for Jurassic Express. He’s always only ever been a jobber


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

optikk sucks said:


> The thing is, nobody should have any issues with him in the first place.
> 
> they’re worried about wrestling being taken less seriously.....
> 
> ...


exactly this. People talk as if he was in the main event.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Danielallen1410 said:


> exactly this. People talk as if he was in the main event.


They don’t watch AEW so they don’t really know anyway.


----------



## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

Danielallen1410 said:


> It was entertaining and funny in my opinion


Just saying this doesn't make it so. If you're able to explain why you think things less people will argue with you.


----------



## Zbagint (Jul 25, 2018)

This is probably the least interested I've been in AEW since it started on TNT

Exactly how long are they gonna play this "close but no cigar" with Darby? I didn't really mind it before and thought it was a good way to build people up, but he's clearly over but this is the 5th time he's been in a match like this and not gotten a win.They're really starting to give me TNA vibes where they insist on pushing their golden boys and don't care who else is over. The best a Darby Allin or a Luchasaurus could ever do is "hey, remember when they had a close match with that main eventer? You know, the kind that 1/2 their roster has!"

Secondly, when they have a big guy like Wardlow who is actually explosive and innovative, what exactly is the point of getting two generic, slow big guys including Brodie Lee who honestly isn't even that great of an actor.I know there's a pandemic going on, but these guys are likely going to be featured weekly so is this what's going to be here every week? Wardlow has a moveset, but every match with those two is exactly the same no-selling, clotheslines, etc.

I really love AEW but the more i'm seeing, the more I'm worried this is going to turn into a WWE reject wasteland where they build absolutely no one beyond the mid card and any bland ex WWE guy with even 1/10th of a name can come in and instantly main event.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Cult03 said:


> Just saying this doesn't make it so. If you're able to explain why you think things less people will argue with you.


huh? I have to explain why I found something funny? I just did. And there aren’t many people who do argue with me, just 3 or 4 of you.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Zbagint said:


> This is probably the least interested I've been in AEW since it started on TNT
> 
> Exactly how long are they gonna play this "close but no cigar" with Darby? I didn't really mind it before and thought it was a good way to build people up, but he's clearly over but this is the 5th time he's been in a match like this and not gotten a win.They're really starting to give me TNA vibes where they insist on pushing their golden boys and don't care who else is over. The best a Darby Allin or a Luchasaurus could ever do is "hey, remember when they had a close match with that main eventer? You know, the kind that 1/2 their roster has!"
> 
> ...


Darby has an ongoing storyline with Cody. I wouldn’t even be surprised to see him cost Cody the match at DoN.

Darby is going to be TNT champion by the end of the year.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Zbagint said:


> This is probably the least interested I've been in AEW since it started on TNT
> 
> Exactly how long are they gonna play this "close but no cigar" with Darby? I didn't really mind it before and thought it was a good way to build people up, but he's clearly over but this is the 5th time he's been in a match like this and not gotten a win.They're really starting to give me TNA vibes where they insist on pushing their golden boys and don't care who else is over. The best a Darby Allin or a Luchasaurus could ever do is "hey, remember when they had a close match with that main eventer? You know, the kind that 1/2 their roster has!"
> 
> ...


I think Darby will get that big win against Cody at some point, likely when crowds are back to get a huge pop and it’ll be his break out moment. i think at the moment it’s good storytelling.

Wardlow was criminally underused first few months.

It’s a shame you feel that way about dynamite because I personally can’t wait for next weeks show, I’m excited for live shows again.


----------



## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

Another late one. Some of this could be very good. A lot of it will be terrible. Let's go.


Fuck Darby Allin
Why wasn't the bottle a DQ?
The right person won woo
Glad they've started getting MJF on the show. Can't believe it took them this long to do it though
Wardlow has the right look and has a big future
Did Jericho create that or was it something TikTokers are using already? It could be pretty big
Turns out half the roster could be cutting promos at home. Their phones record well enough for television
This tag match is literally worthless. Serves absolutely no purpose
Does every AEW match need shenanigans or a stupid spot? What the fuck. That match was stupid
Britt Baker has actually fully won me over. She's a really good heel.
Buttttttttt, Britt randomly being mean again. Nobody has been able to explain why they were being nice to each other the week after she bullied Tony on TV?
Spears needs an adult haircut. You're 39 and your gimmick isn't a biker. Grow up, dork
Seriously can't believe this is happening. I don't feel sorry for him whatever happens here
Um, that was the biggest fucking waste of time ever. What did Stunt bring to the table that literally any other wrestler in the world couldn't?
Dean Ambrose debuted on AEW this week. I just don't see it anymore. He literally does not have it in him to be a top star anymore. He could have been anything in this business..
Can the bloke who Archer punched in the face give The Young Bucks some tips on selling? Holy shit
Archer's pop rock entrance theme definitely doesn't suit him
Marko Stunt got some offense on Archer, Jericho
Lance Archer should be feuding for the World Title at this point. And winning it. Can anyone believe that he could do this to Dustin but barely hurt Stunt?

AEW has a few stars in Wardlow and Archer. Hopefully they can build on what they've got now because they are almost the only bright lights of the Covid-19 thing ruining AEW's shows. 

Like I said at the beginning, some good and some terrible. Like usual.


----------



## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

Danielallen1410 said:


> huh? I have to explain why I found something funny? I just did. And there aren’t many people who do argue with me, just 3 or 4 of you.


Yeah, because saying "I like it" every minute adds nothing to a conversation. But saying why does. The same 3 or 4 who argued with Garty?


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Cult03 said:


> Yeah, because saying "I like it" every minute adds nothing to a conversation. But saying why does. The same 3 or 4 who argued with Garty?


its hard to explain why you find something funny. It’s a matter of taste.

my explanation for liking it was that I found it funny. Hope that clear things up.


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Moxley was solid in Omega feud and Jericho feud - two EVP's on creative. He's not directionless as champ as all the EVP's focus on booking their own shit. I'd suspect it's Tony Khan booking Moxley now given Mox's baby kissing promo's and how Khan put over Moxley v Hager as some special match. 

I also think there is an issue with AEW not sure who Moxley is going to feud with, so he doesn't have the direction as to who to cut a promo on and target so you get the generic "We'll get through this" Cena promo last night. 

Jericho vs Moxley II could happen BUT it looks like they're going with Elite v Inner Circle still. I wonder if there could be the War Games match at DoN II, sides still work with Cody vs Archer booked as Nick Jackson will be back from "injury" and thus Matt Hardy still has a spot - Omega, Page, Hardy, Bucks vs Jericho, Hager, Guevara, Ortiz/Santana. Issue with this is the self-distancing and size of group restrictions. That is 10 + referee + cameramen if local restrictions are still 10 max then it of course can't happen. 

If it's not Jericho vs Moxley II then it's probably Moxley vs MJF, and if this is the direction than I think it's possible that these Moxley promos are being done for MJF to call out Mox on them. I guess time will tell.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

rexmundi said:


> I think that Archer and Dustin go before Cody/Darby and Archer damn near Apollo Creeds Dustin. Cody is shaken by this and Darby exploits that for the win and a date with Archer. Gonna be a good show.


Archer did Apollo Creed Dustin. 1/3 is not bad, but impressive that you used the Apollo creed reference.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Danielallen1410 said:


> its hard to explain why you find something funny. It’s a matter of taste.


Humour is actually quite easy to explain.

For example, I like Howard Stern, Opie and Anthony etc. Why were they funny? They said outlandish things and made fun of one another which is what amuses me.

I think Kurt Angle was funny back in the day as Austin's sidekick because it was amusing seeing the situations he'd get into and Austin's reaction.

It's really not that hard to explain why something is funny.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

optikk sucks said:


> Archer did Apollo Creed Dustin. 1/3 is not bad, but impressive that you used the Apollo creed reference.


I think we all saw that coming though.

I even called a Rocky IV or Bloodsport type visual where Cody comes in and holds Dustin, covered in blood, whilst Archer just looks menacingly at him.

In the movies however the good guy prevailed. Archer HAS to win.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Humour is actually quite easy to explain.
> 
> For example, I like Howard Stern, Opie and Anthony etc. Why were they funny? They said outlandish things and made fun of one another which is what amuses me.
> 
> ...


you are odd.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Danielallen1410 said:


> you are odd.


That's deflecting. Easier to try and throw insults rather than explain why the segment is funny.

I've asked a few people who have put it over why it's funny and nobody can tell me why. What is amusing about 20-30 people punching their cameras in unique ways?


----------



## NathanMayberry (Oct 11, 2019)

Chip Chipperson said:


> That's deflecting. Easier to try and throw insults rather than explain why the segment is funny.
> 
> I've asked a few people who have put it over why it's funny and nobody can tell me why. What is amusing about 20-30 people punching their cameras in unique ways?




__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1255660050842083328
It has 28 thousand views, <600 retweets and <2000 likes on Twitter in over 12 hours.. which is really low for a segment that featured AEW's biggest star and was on National TV and was supposedly trending organically.

For context, there are random tiktoks featuring no name women putting on makeup and getting dressed with millions of views.. same with people kicking toilet paper, dancing, etc..

If you're an AEW fan, I guess this is funny, I don't think this is the case objectively though.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

NathanMayberry said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1255660050842083328
> It has 28 thousand views, <600 retweets and <2000 likes on Twitter in over 12 hours.. which is really low for a segment that featured AEW's biggest star and was on National TV and was supposedly trending organically.
> 
> I think the main thing required to find this funny is to be a die-hard AEW fan.




__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1254742089193197568
As opposed to this from the WWE, which stars two of their biggest stars of the modern era, posted three days ago which has less than 16 thousand views. <300 retweets and <1500 likes


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

Chip Chipperson said:


> That's deflecting. Easier to try and throw insults rather than explain why the segment is funny.
> 
> I've asked a few people who have put it over why it's funny and nobody can tell me why. What is amusing about 20-30 people punching their cameras in unique ways?


I just find you over analysing of everything odd.

If I say I find it funny why do I have to explain why? Why can’t I just say I find it funny and leave it at that?

I find friends funny, I can’t explain wht, sorry for that. I thought when asked what I liked about it, saying I found it funny would be enough and I find someone who has to challenge that and ask for an explanation to justify it odd.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

NathanMayberry said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1255660050842083328
> It has 28 thousand views, <600 retweets and <2000 likes on Twitter in over 12 hours.. which is really low for a segment that featured AEW's biggest star and was on National TV and was supposedly trending organically.
> 
> I think the main thing required to find this funny is to be a die-hard AEW fan.


humour is subjective.

I found it funny, but note at no point when someone has said they don’t have I demanded an explanation, or told them they are wrong for not finding it funny.

I have merely said I find it funny, but the negative posters can’t accept that.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Danielallen1410 said:


> I just find you over analysing of everything odd.
> 
> If I say I find it funny why do I have to explain why? Why can’t I just say I find it funny and leave it at that?
> 
> I find friends funny, I can’t explain wht, sorry for that. I thought when asked what I liked about it, saying I found it funny would be enough and I find someone who has to challenge that and ask for an explanation to justify it odd.


You keep using the word overanalysing but I don't think you know what it means.

For me to overanalyse it I would say would be me watching it at least 5 times, picking up on tiny little bits and pieces to mention or bring up. It being designed to be a funny segment isn't an overanalysis it's a first time analysis of what they're trying to do.

I never said you had to explain why I just asked you as a person who says it's funny. You can't explain why it's funny, cool. I think it's more of a "AEW is my fave so I'm going to laugh when they say laugh" thing but if you legitimately got a chuckle out of it that's awesome for you.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Erik. said:


> I think we all saw that coming though.
> 
> I even called a Rocky IV or Bloodsport type visual where Cody comes in and holds Dustin, covered in blood, whilst Archer just looks menacingly at him.
> 
> In the movies however the good guy prevailed. Archer HAS to win.


Yes i really hope Archer wins the title.

Cody needs to reach breaking point and turn heel.


----------



## NathanMayberry (Oct 11, 2019)

Erik. said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1254742089193197568
> As opposed to this from the WWE, which stars two of their biggest stars of the modern era, posted three days ago which has less than 16 thousand views. <300 retweets and <1500 likes


There's a difference between a video that every WWE fan has seen hundreds of times vs something fresh off of Dynamite.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

NathanMayberry said:


> There's a difference between a video that every WWE fan has seen hundreds of times vs something fresh off of Dynamite.


It also has more viewers, likes and retweets than anything NXT, their competition, has posted too.

Were you the one who laughed at the fact that when The Rock retweeted something from AEW it barely got a million views but then didn't reply when you were told that barely anything The Rock retweets or posts himself video wise barely gets a million views (or anywhere near what AEW got when The Rock retweeted it)?


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

See, this is the issue with AEW and it's fans.

Your guys put on a great show and every "AEW hater" has said it was a good show but you're instead focused on arguments about views on Twitter and defending the worst segment on the show. Bask in the fact that this week was a good show and next weeks is looking even better.

Not everything mentioned by the "AEW haters" needs to be an argument. Everyone is so defensive around here.


----------



## MaseMan (Mar 22, 2020)

Not much to add that hasn't been said. I did think the ending of Cody vs Darby left a bit to be desired. Cody didn't look like he was really leveraging Darby in that pinfall. Other than that, it was a great match.

Musa looked pretty good. I could see him being a good addition to the AEW roster, which still needs some more diversity. 

Tag match was a lot of fun. I wouldn't mind seeing the Best Friends continuing to feud with Sabian and Havoc for a bit.


----------



## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

optikk sucks said:


> Yes i really hope Archer wins the title.
> 
> Cody needs to reach breaking point and turn heel.


What if Cody become the new leader of the inner circle ?


----------



## NathanMayberry (Oct 11, 2019)

Erik. said:


> It also has more viewers, likes and retweets than anything NXT, their competition, has posted too.


Congratz, last I checked, NXT wasn't trying to parody a viral social media trend though..



> Were you the one who laughed at the fact that when The Rock retweeted something from AEW it barely got a million views but then didn't reply when you were told that barely anything The Rock retweets or posts himself video wise barely gets a million views (or anywhere near what AEW got when The Rock retweeted it)?


I remember making that post and continuing on with my life.. was I literally supposed to wait hand on foot for your reply on a stupid thread discussing how bad an actor Cody is?

I also wasn't laughing, just making an observation of how a lot of AEW's presence on Social Media seems manufactured. If you wanted me to respond to you, you should have just PMed me next time.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

rbl85 said:


> What if Cody become the new leader of the inner circle ?


I think you're more likely to get a double faction turk with the Inner Circle turning face and the Elite turning heel.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

NathanMayberry said:


> Congratz, last I checked, NXT wasn't trying to parody a viral social media trend though..
> 
> 
> I remember making that post and continuing on with my life.. was I literally supposed to wait hand on foot for your reply on a stupid thread discussing how bad an actor Cody is?
> ...


Nope, I did expect you to ignore something when you got put in your place though. So not too surprised. 

I'll PM next time, just to prevent the embarrassment.


----------



## NathanMayberry (Oct 11, 2019)

Erik. said:


> Nope, I did expect you to ignore something when you got put in your place though. So not too surprised.
> 
> I'll PM next time, just to prevent the embarrassment.


Lmao.. not really sure how I was put in my place... when 20 year old clips are getting more views in a month:

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1241803480538513409 than what was supposedly "the best promo in a generation" in 6 months.

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1192254321049526272
----
There is a disconnect between the praise AEW receives and how the public receives it.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

NathanMayberry said:


> Lmao.. not really sure how I was put in my place... when 20 year old clips are getting more views in a month:
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1241803480538513409 than what was supposedly "the best promo in a generation" in 6 months.
> 
> ...


What are you talking about?

The Rock praised the promo. I don't even remember it. Why are you comparing an ESPN tweet with an AEW one? Odd comparison. Considering both companies history and reach.

I for one am absolutely SHOCKED I tell you, SHOCKED that a clip showing two of the greatest wrestlers in history have more views than an AEW clip.

Why do you care about the public when the public don't care about you?


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

^^ Imagine being so butthurt you're comparing one twitter with 35m followers to another with 200k.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

NathanMayberry said:


> Lmao.. not really sure how I was put in my place... when 20 year old clips are getting more views in a month:
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1241803480538513409 than what was supposedly "the best promo in a generation" in 6 months.
> 
> ...


not sure I’m missing something but The Cody promo has way more views 🤣

Edit I was looking at likes.


----------



## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

So, I finally got around the watching the full show:


Cody vs. Darby was very good, as matches between these two have been. I understand what they were trying to do with the finish, but it just ended up making Darby look stupid for not realizing his shoulders were down; if Cody had rolled up Darby in that spot as some are saying, that's not the way it came across, either way, not a fan of the ending but a good match nonetheless.
The stuff with Scorpio Sky is exactly what I want to see more of; regardless of what anyone may think of his particular story, this is the right approach to take.
Shawn Spears match was what it was.
Always good to see MJF, and I'm very much looking forward to seeing him back in the flesh next week.
Wardlow coming across looking like a monster; AEW made a nice find here.
Britt Baker has been terrific, and considering this is someone I saw nothing in at the beginning, I'm happy to eat crow; still has some work to do in the ring, but her character has been on point.
Was not looking forward to the tag match but it ended up being a lot of fun; though I still don't get how the street fight aspect was warranted, I won't complain.
Not finding these Bubbly Bunch segments very funny; hopefully when Santana/Ortiz are back, we can put an end to these.
Brodie vs. Stunt was exactly what I thought it would be, I'm not even going to bother going into this any further.
Jon Moxley promo was fine. I'd like to see a bit less pandering from a guy like him, but I wasn't too bothered by it.
Card for next week looking like a real full fledged Dynamite card, for the first time in weeks. Thank the wrestling Gods, we're finally getting some guys back.
Archer vs. Dustin was great. It wasn't the cleanest or crispest match, but it didn't need to be; it did exactly what it needed to do. Coming from someone who believes the Rhodes family drama can be too hamfisted a lot of the time, I though the towel spot was great.


So yeah, a good show this week for the most part.


----------



## Runaway (Feb 14, 2020)

Really enjoyed Dynamite this week, probably their best COVID era show yet. Having a few people making noise in the crowd makes so, so much difference. The Bubbly Bunch is exactly the type of shit we should be seeing more of in this environment. Really silly, light fun to take your mind off stuff. Loved the Britt Baker segment as well, what a turnaround it's been for her. Dustin vs Archer was superb. Dustin's one of the best sympathetic babyface's that's ever lived and Archer's been on fire ever since he debuted. The no DQ tag was crap but I'm not sure what else you can get when Kip, Havoc and Chucky T are in the same match. The most interesting people in that match were the seconds.

Brodie Lee has been a major disappointment so far hasn't he? Bad look, shit faction and his squashes have been overshadowed by Lance Archer's and even Wardlow's superior work.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Erik. said:


> I think we all saw that coming though.
> 
> I even called a Rocky IV or Bloodsport type visual where Cody comes in and holds Dustin, covered in blood, whilst Archer just looks menacingly at him.
> 
> In the movies however the good guy prevailed. Archer HAS to win.


I’m going to lose my shit if Cody wins THIS match after losing to Jericho and MJF. I’d have stomached him beating either of those guys FAR MORE than I will him beating Archer.

I’m glad people are getting to see this side of Lance Archer. This is what I had hoped from Kenny Omega. Just this random dude, you may or may not have heard of, showing up and looking like the star he has been SOMEWHERE OTHER THAN WWE. 



optikk sucks said:


> Yes i really hope Archer wins the title.
> 
> Cody needs to reach breaking point and turn heel.


Cody as a heel will fucking shine. He’s got the mic skills for it.

Just don’t let him offer ideas for putting the match together. I can’t put up with anymore Water Bottle spots. Jesus Christ.



El Hammerstone said:


> So, I finally got around the watching the full show:
> 
> 
> Cody vs. Darby was very good, as matches between these two have been. I understand what they were trying to do with the finish, but it just ended up making Darby look stupid for not realizing his shoulders were down; if Cody had rolled up Darby in that spot as some are saying, that's not the way it came across, either way, not a fan of the ending but a good match nonetheless.
> ...


I am now your biggest fan.

I legit hate the Rhodes’ penchant for overdramatizing everything, using smoke and mirrors, etc, but I won’t fucking lie: when QT got ready to throw the towel, I had flashbacks and was hoping Cody would stop him and allow Dustin a sneaky roll-up pinfall. (Granted that was heat of the moment and legitimately being worked by Archer’s beatdown and the sympathy Dustin had built for himself)

When I seen Cody showing up to stop the towel spot, reality hits me again, and I’m thinking, “Of course Cody has to be the one to throw the towel in, he’s...MY BROTHERRRRR.”

When he DOESN’T throw it, and Archer just DESTROYS Dustin? I marked out. I ain’t sure whose idea that was as it seems too perfect to be solely on Cody, but props to all involved.

THAT was beautiful pro wrestling.


----------



## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Scorpio Sky is just too nice a guy - he needs some menace to his character in-ring. I mean he has a brief amateur MMA career so he's somewhat legit - why not see more of that in his matches? He reminds me of UFC fighter Uriah Hall, dude has all the skills but it looks like he feels bad when he's out there trying to win. Is Sky too nice to be Fuckin' Legendary? 

If Scorpio is going singles where does that leave Kazarian? Sure Daniels is still around, but he's head of talent relations and 50 yrs old. Kaz turns 43yo himself, but that is still in wrestler prime(albeit the tale end). 

Shawn Spears showing more character - is Tully ever coming back, and if so with Spears? How would Tully like the butt flexing/twerking for example? Also Spears maybe it was just me but more was made of Spears being Canadian last night, and then he topped it off with the Sharpshooter. 

Barron Black didn't look terrible - surprised this was his only jobber duty and we've seen Captain Dean, Big Shotty Lee multiple times. Along with Sugar D, I wonder of any of these enhancement guys who put in the work these tapings gets signed or just happy for the paycheck and work. 

Wardlow is very limited in the ring, squashes are like highlight reels of draft prospects. That being said I lived the hangman knee and even think that should be his finisher. His entrance music absolutely BLOWS though. 

"The Superbad Death Squad" is seemingly a full time team now according to a twitter post-match interview exclusive. Name is cheese, but it's supposed to be. Odd couple pairing could work as Kip and Jimmy are flatmates in real life - there is potential for hijinks and hilarity if they shoot footage of their living arrangement. Tag division is getting really full though and not sure either will get much more an opportunity here than they were getting in singles.


----------



## WolvesofBabylon (Feb 6, 2018)

Enjoyed the show.

-Brit Baker has the best "character" in womens wrestling in my opinion right now. She needs to start winning some matches and tightening up her in ring work but this heel turn for her has been great. Feels like its natural

-Archer is the real deal so far. I loved the ending. Didnt use his finisher.Just pounded his head into the mat to get the win. Will be excited once/if Jakes comes back to be his mouthpiece

- I've always been indifferent towards Moxley honestly. Dont hate but dont like him

-Jericho is gold on commentary

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

rbl85 said:


> What if Cody become the new leader of the inner circle ?


Don't really want this.

i'm imagining Inner Circle vs The Elite vs The Nightmare Family

all inside war games

holy fuck


----------



## iamjethro (Oct 3, 2019)

,Really beginning to wonder if there is a Cody/Archer swerve coming? 
Archer came in with Jake saying they were gunning for Cody. Never went directly at him though. Then Archer about to permanently disable Dustin, and Cody does not throw the towel when others are trying to do so. Is it all a big work that puts Cody and Archer working together. Cody accomplishes his heel turn in a big way there, at his brother's expense.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

The Definition of Technician said:


> They would destroy their WWE title's credibility by having Mox drop even lower than that so quickly. It still shows that there were many times they didn't care for him or try to listen to him or let him have organic moments.


No it just goes to show that even when he was allegedly so unimportant he was still a champion.


----------



## NathanMayberry (Oct 11, 2019)

Erik. said:


> What are you talking about? The Rock praised the promo. I don't even remember it.


Is it my fault you and many others here seem to have the memory of a goldfish? That promo had people all over the IWC calling it the greatest promo of this generation. 

Here's proof:

__
https://www.reddit.com/r/SquaredCircle/comments/dsq789
Oh and here's Meltzer and Alvarez: 




"The New Hard Times" they called it.. 
"All Time Great" Meltzer said. 
"Greatest babyface ever" Alvarez proclaimed, "Not ever, but bbu tbut uuh he was Tanahashi level though" Meltzer corrected

Yet now, only 6 months later you talk about not remembering it, and I'm sure there are many others like you. How many more of these "greatest things ever" that have come out of AEW are like that too? 




> Why are you comparing an ESPN tweet with an AEW one? Odd comparison. Considering both companies history and reach.


Here is your post talking about how the Rock barely getting 800 K views of a video he re-tweeted. My post, is a direct response to that. 




> I for one am absolutely SHOCKED I tell you, SHOCKED that a clip showing two of the greatest wrestlers in history have more views than an AEW clip.


Its supposed to be the gold standard of AEW, you know the company Dave Meltzer and all the other ones who want to be like him swears dominates the youth demographic and trends every week.. 

Yet when it comes to organic or even objective measures, nothing points to that. As you will see in a few hours, the only thing that actually matters to most AEW fans is beating NXT.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

RapShepard said:


> No it just goes to show that even when he was allegedly so unimportant he was still a champion.


relative to what. If there's 30 people ahead of you, but you're more important than 90, should you be happy if 3 months earlier u were top 5?


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

The Definition of Technician said:


> relative to what. If there's 30 people ahead of you, but you're more important than 90, should you be happy if 3 months earlier u were top 5?


Dude was clearly a top 10 usually a top 5 full time guy for years. The issue is like I said folk go FotC or bust in WWE. People just don't use their common sense when it comes to WWE.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

RapShepard said:


> Dude was clearly a top 10 usually a top 5 full time guy for years. The issue is like I said folk go FotC or bust in WWE. People just don't use their common sense when it comes to WWE.


bottom top 10 full-timer that gets shoved aside when the part-timers come back. After he put over Styles in late 2016, he became just another guy.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

The Definition of Technician said:


> bottom top 10 full-timer that gets shoved aside when the part-timers come back. After he put over Styles in late 2016, he became just another guy.


Yes just another guy in some of the bigger stories and winning titles lol


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

WolvesofBabylon said:


> Enjoyed the show.
> 
> -Brit Baker has the best "character" in womens wrestling in my opinion right now. She needs to start winning some matches and tightening up her in ring work but this heel turn for her has been great. Feels like its natural
> 
> ...


that is his submission finisher

the ‘EBD ‘Claw - everybody dies claw

but he uses it to pin guys, which is great - so.... i guess not a submit finisher at all


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

RapShepard said:


> Yes just another guy in some of the bigger stories and winning titles lol


You got Rollins, Joe, Miz, Reigns, KO, Bray, Braun, AJ, Nakamura ahead of him guys like Brock/Goldberg/Taker/HHH from part-timers.


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

optikk sucks said:


> The thing is, nobody should have any issues with him in the first place.
> 
> they’re worried about wrestling being taken less seriously.....
> 
> ...



Because we weren't the ones who said the company was gonna be like a sport where no one like Marko Stunt would ever be allowed to compete. That wasn't us.


----------



## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

NathanMayberry said:


> Is it my fault you and many others here seem to have the memory of a goldfish? That promo had people all over the IWC calling it the greatest promo of this generation.
> 
> Here's proof:
> 
> ...


What's other people's opinions got to do with me?

Let's not back track now buddy. You posted a video The Rock comment retweeted and said it should have got more views because he himself has millions of viewers.

I said most of the videos The Rock comment retweets, meaning the ones that show up on HIS twitter to HIS viewers barely get half a million viewers to debunk whatever weird obsession you have.

I am truly pleased for you though that you managed to find one though of AEW losing on the TWITTER RATINGS WAR to the Attitude Era. Again, shocked.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

The Definition of Technician said:


> You got Rollins, Joe, Miz, Reigns, KO, Bray, Braun, AJ, Nakamura ahead of him guys like Brock/Goldberg/Taker/HHH from part-timers.


Saying Joe who's won 0 titles on the main roster, was over Ambrose is laughable

Saying Nakamura is over him is bull

Saying Braun who didn't win a title until a year after Ambrose left is wild

Saying KO and Miz were over him is also wild. 

But that's what's funny about folk. I would never say those guys I listed weren't pushed. But it's amazing how you can recognize that say Braun was push despite him losing pretty much all his big feuds and winning no titles, yet you can't acknowledge that Ambrose was pushed strong seeing he was a grand slam champion and the wins he had.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

RapShepard said:


> Saying Joe who's won 0 titles on the main roster, was over Ambrose is laughable
> 
> Saying Nakamura is over him is bull
> 
> ...


I simply look at how well they're protected. Braun was very well protected and above him on numerous levels, you can't deny that, look at EC 2018. Nakamura was protected in 2017 and feuded with AJ for the WWE title after winning the 2018 Rumble. I'd say he was on that same level with KO-Miz but KO was more protected and Miz actually made to WM. Ambrose was just another mid-carder who could lose at any point, there weren't any effort to protect him or keep him always relevant, despite him being one of the most over on the roster.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

The Definition of Technician said:


> I simply look at how well they're protected. Braun was very well protected and above him on numerous levels, you can't deny that, look at EC 2018. Nakamura was protected in 2017 and feuded with AJ for the WWE title after winning the 2018 Rumble. I'd say he was on that same level with KO-Miz but KO was more protected and Miz actually made to WM. Ambrose was just another mid-carder who could lose at any point, there weren't any effort to protect him or keep him always relevant, despite him being one of the most over on the roster.


Yet he's more decorated than everybody on that list I pointed out save Miz. Thing is folk want to see Ambrose as some jobber loser and they'll make him one regardless of the fact that he had a great career, even if he wasn't booked like Reigns and Rollins. I mean seriously you're trying to argue he was under Nakamura come on now lol


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

RapShepard said:


> Yet he's more decorated than everybody on that list I pointed out save Miz. Thing is folk want to see Ambrose as some jobber loser and they'll make him one regardless of the fact that he had a great career, even if he wasn't booked like Reigns and Rollins. I mean seriously you're trying to argue he was under Nakamura come on now lol


Of course he was more decorated because of his 2012-2016 run, but in 2017-2018 Nakamura was more protected and on a higher level even if he didn't win the title, he won the rumble, SD title match at Wrestlemania, feuded for months for the WWE title, and after he lost they feud to Aj, he quickly became US champion.
Dean was mid-card in 2017, absent half of 2018, meh tag team in when he returned in 2018, failed heel turn, won the IC title but he decided to leave and started losing left and right then.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

So, he had 4 years worth of push and hasn’t figured out how to act like a champion...to this day!?


----------



## PavelGaborik (Oct 30, 2015)

Zbagint said:


> This is probably the least interested I've been in AEW since it started on TNT
> 
> Exactly how long are they gonna play this "close but no cigar" with Darby? I didn't really mind it before and thought it was a good way to build people up, but he's clearly over but this is the 5th time he's been in a match like this and not gotten a win.They're really starting to give me TNA vibes where they insist on pushing their golden boys and don't care who else is over. The best a Darby Allin or a Luchasaurus could ever do is "hey, remember when they had a close match with that main eventer? You know, the kind that 1/2 their roster has!"
> 
> ...


Lol @ calling Brodie Lee slow. Dude is quite agile, especially for a man his size.


----------



## WolvesofBabylon (Feb 6, 2018)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> that is his submission finisher
> 
> the ‘EBD ‘Claw - everybody dies claw
> 
> but he uses it to pin guys, which is great - so.... i guess not a submit finisher at all


Thanks for the info. I didnt know about him at all prior to AEW. 

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Because we weren't the ones who said the company was gonna be like a sport where no one like Marko Stunt would ever be allowed to compete. That wasn't us.


in a sport, not everyone looks like wardlow, though.

and i mean they seemingly dropped the sports presentation when everyone complained about lack of promos and the win/loss thing. now y'all clamouring for that presentation again lmao fickle asses


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

The Definition of Technician said:


> Of course he was more decorated because of his 2012-2016 run, but in 2017-2018 Nakamura was more protected and on a higher level even if he didn't win the title, he won the rumble, SD title match at Wrestlemania, feuded for months for the WWE title, and after he lost they feud to Aj, he quickly became US champion.
> Dean was mid-card in 2017, absent half of 2018, meh tag team in when he returned in 2018, failed heel turn, won the IC title but he decided to leave and started losing left and right then.


In 2017 Ambrose had a 5 month IC title reign and won the tag titles with Rollins becoming a Grand Slam champion during the Shield reunion which obviously was a big story. Then he got injured.

He came back in late 2018 and immediately was in a top storyline with his Shield Bros, he won another tag title, and then got a big heel then which got time

Yeah that reads so much like a guy they were doing nothing with. I really don't get wrestling fans at time lol. Y'all can see the clear build and importance of a Darby and Sammy despite them losing all the damn time, but then turn around and call a grand slam champion a geek lol


----------



## taker1986 (Sep 14, 2016)

The thing with Ambrose and his WWE run was that he was pushed, but certainly not as much as he could've/Should've been. 

I remember the first couple of months of 2016 he was the most over guy in the company, they really should've just strapped the rocket to him and pushed him to the WM main event, instead what we got was one of the most forgettable WM main events ever with Roman/hhh. What should've happened was either a triple threat with Ambrose included, which would've been far more interesting given the history with him and Roman, or Ambrose beating Brock, but instead what we got was Ambrose losing to brock in a glorified squash match, which completely screwed his momentum, then they completely fucked up his WWE title reign. Seriously 2016 could've easily been his year as the top guy, instead he was overshadowed by AJ, Jericho and KO that had better years. I can easily see how he lost interest and wanted out after that. 

So Ambrose to a degree was pushed and will no doubt be in the HOF one day, but he never reached his full potential given the handcuffs he had on him. Now in AEW he's got that chance and is now a far bigger star now than he ever was in WWE because he actually has freedom and creative control over his character and no WWE handcuffs to restrict him from reaching his potential.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

taker1986 said:


> So Ambrose to a degree was pushed and will no doubt be in the HOF one day, but he never reached his full potential given the handcuffs he had on him. *Now in AEW he's got that chance and is now a far bigger star now than he ever was in WWE* because he actually has freedom and creative control over his character and no WWE handcuffs to restrict him from reaching his potential.


So what evidence is there that he's a bigger star than he was? Because no actual metrics point to that. Not that AEW has terrible ratings, but it's a stretch to say Moxley is a bigger star than ever when he's being seen by less than half of the audience he used to be seen by. 

Him being a bigger star than a bunch of folk who have little to no national exposure is not the same as him growing in star power. Him being higher up the food chain in a smaller promotion doesn't equal growing star power either.


----------



## taker1986 (Sep 14, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> So what evidence is there that he's a bigger star than he was? Because no actual metrics point to that. Not that AEW has terrible ratings, but it's a stretch to say Moxley is a bigger star than ever when he's being seen by less than half of the audience he used to be seen by.
> 
> Him being a bigger star than a bunch of folk who have little to no national exposure is not the same as him growing in star power. Him being higher up the food chain in a smaller promotion doesn't equal growing star power either.


After DoN last year people were regularly saying that he was the "hottest thing in pro wrestling" there's no doubt after that he's been a far bigger deal than he ever was at WWE.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> So what evidence is there that he's a bigger star than he was? Because no actual metrics point to that. Not that AEW has terrible ratings, but it's a stretch to say Moxley is a bigger star than ever when he's being seen by less than half of the audience he used to be seen by.
> 
> Him being a bigger star than a bunch of folk who have little to no national exposure is not the same as him growing in star power. Him being higher up the food chain in a smaller promotion doesn't equal growing star power either.


well mainly because he is the biggest star in this company.

may be a case of big fish small pond, but in the context of this company he’s a much bigger star than in the context of WWE.

ofcourse overall anyone is bigger in WWE as it’s a worldwide known company with years behind it.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

taker1986 said:


> After DoN last year people were regularly saying that he was the "hottest thing in pro wrestling" there's no doubt after that he's been a far bigger deal than he ever was at WWE.


So your basing this off the opinions on forums and YouTube? What's hot to hardcore fans is not the same as being a big star.


Danielallen1410 said:


> well mainly because he is the biggest star in this company.
> 
> may be a case of big fish small pond, but in the context of this company he’s a much bigger star than in the context of WWE.
> 
> ofcourse overall anyone is bigger in WWE as it’s a worldwide known company with years behind it.


No there's no question about it he's not a bigger star. He's moved up the card. But he's certainly not grown as a star by any actual metrics.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Because we weren't the ones who said the company was gonna be like a sport where no one like Marko Stunt would ever be allowed to compete. That wasn't us.


I’ve just googled, aew says small wrestlers won’t be allowed to compete and I can’t find it.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> So your basing this off the opinions on forums and YouTube? What's hot to hardcore fans is not the same as being a big star. No there's no question about it he's not a bigger star. He's moved up the card. But he's certainly not grown as a star by any actual metrics.


as I said in the context of aew he is a bigger star than he was in the context of wwe,

I presume you know what i mean by that?

he is the top guy in aew right now

in wwe even as champion he never felt it.


----------



## taker1986 (Sep 14, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> So your basing this off the opinions on forums and YouTube? What's hot to hardcore fans is not the same as being a big star.


He's easily a bigger star than when he was in WWE. In WWE he never reached his full potential. WWE fucked up big time with him. Now he's a bigger deal than he's ever been and has far more of a star presence in AEW.


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

optikk sucks said:


> in a sport, not everyone looks like wardlow, though.
> 
> and i mean they seemingly dropped the sports presentation when everyone complained about lack of promos and the win/loss thing. now y'all clamouring for that presentation again lmao fickle asses



Im not clamoring for anything. Just repeating what the people in charge of the company said.


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

Danielallen1410 said:


> I’ve just googled, aew says small wrestlers won’t be allowed to compete and I can’t find it.



Theres a difference between a small pro wrestler and a child.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Danielallen1410 said:


> as I said in the context of aew he is a bigger star than he was in the context of wwe,
> 
> I presume you know what i mean by that?
> 
> ...


The issue with that is it doesn't make him a bigger star though. If you want to say his role is larger in AEW then sure. But that's not the same as him being a bigger star. 



taker1986 said:


> He's easily a bigger star than when he was in WWE. In WWE he never reached his full potential. WWE fucked up big time with him. Now he's a bigger deal than he's ever been and has far more of a star presence in AEW.


That's not how stardom works though lol. How can he be a bigger star while playing to a much smaller crowd. By your logic if say Darby Allin left AEW to go be Impact champ he'd be a bigger star.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Theres a difference between a small pro wrestler and a child.


He’s 23


----------



## taker1986 (Sep 14, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> That's not how stardom works though lol. How can he be a bigger star while playing to a much smaller crowd. By your logic if say Darby Allin left AEW to go be Impact champ he'd be a bigger star.


I know that. What I'm saying is he's a far bigger deal in AEW than he ever was in WWE because he's a bigger star now and is being used to his full potential. More people are talking about him and has been talked about as the hottest pro wrestler on the planet in his time in AEW, something no-one said about him in his entire WWE run, he's a bigger star now than he was 2 years ago, it's as simple as that. And if Allin left AEW for impact and people were calling him the hottest wrestler in the world the same would apply.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Im not clamoring for anything. Just repeating what the people in charge of the company said.


Yeah and in sports you get big guys and small guys

Btw where did Tony Khan say that it’ll be presented like a sport? If they did a genuine sports-like production, it would have weight classes etc. nobody would watch. I wouldn’t. Who wants to watch a predetermined sport? that’s why they moved away from that.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

taker1986 said:


> I know that. What I'm saying is he's a far bigger deal in AEW than he ever was in WWE because he's a bigger star now and is being used to his full potential. More people are talking about him and has been talked about as the hottest pro wrestler on the planet in his time in AEW, something no-one said about him in his entire WWE run, he's a bigger star now than he was 2 years ago, it's as simple as that. And if Allin left AEW for impact and people were calling him the hottest wrestler in the world the same would apply.


Except more people aren't talking about him, that's what you're not getting lol. Something being hot where hardcore fans dwell is not the same as it being a thing in wrestling fandom in general. If you think say he's more talked about in AEW the. He was during say the Shield break up, his WWE title win, the HHH mini feud, or his heel then you're bugging. 

Evidence just doesn't support this idea that he's more talked about and a bigger star than he ever was in WWE


----------



## NahFam (Sep 12, 2016)

Any discussion regarding how people are performing currently, or how big of a star they are is a bit redundant currently surely. Given everything that is going on, everything we're watching is wrestling's equivalent to treading water. Can't really have a discussion about how well Moxley is doing until he gets a chance in front of live crowds again imo.


----------



## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

-Darby Allin needs to cut more promos. His promo was great this week
-Were Darby's jorts actually tights? They seemed shiny in the lights.
-we've seen a lot of squash matches on these shows and Wardlow's are routinely the best ones
-all the name vs name wrestling matches were really solid.

Glad we're getting back to "canon" next week.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Danielallen1410 said:


> as I said in the context of aew he is a bigger star than he was in the context of wwe,
> 
> I presume you know what i mean by that?
> 
> ...


Whonsays he is the top guy in AEW? That fucking belt? He isn’t the top guy in AEW. He was one of the top 2 guys in AEW on his chase to the title, but unfortunately for him, he has no clue how to present himself as a champion.

BORING!


----------



## Dizzie (Jun 22, 2019)

Man aew really need to rethink having stunt as a wrestler on their show, seeing him in the same ring with Brodie gives off a horrible carny vibe


----------



## NathanMayberry (Oct 11, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> Except more people aren't talking about him, that's what you're not getting lol. Something being hot where hardcore fans dwell is not the same as it being a thing in wrestling fandom in general. If you think say he's more talked about in AEW the. He was during say the Shield break up, his WWE title win, the HHH mini feud, or his heel then you're bugging.
> 
> Evidence just doesn't support this idea that he's more talked about and a bigger star than he ever was in WWE


See this is the disconnect I was alluding to earlier. 

People want these echo chambers where they are surrounded by like minded folk who agree with every asinine thing they say and then they get mad that people and reality doesn't agree with their opinions.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

NathanMayberry said:


> See this is the disconnect I was alluding to earlier.
> 
> People want these echo chambers where they are surrounded by like minded folk who agree with every asinine thing they say and then they get mad that people and reality doesn't agree with their opinions.


Yeah idk how folk constantly forget that a small minority of fans make up the people on forums and YouTube. Just because something is forum popular doesn't mean it's the biggest thing going tho.


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

optikk sucks said:


> Yeah and in sports you get big guys and small guys
> 
> Btw where did Tony Khan say that it’ll be presented like a sport? If they did a genuine sports-like production, it would have weight classes etc. nobody would watch. I wouldn’t. Who wants to watch a predetermined sport? that’s why they moved away from that.



Theres no athletic commission in the country that would sanction Marko Stunt in any kind of fight vs any normal sized human.

And they moved away from that. Awesome. Whats their identity? Cody is trying to do 3 over the top Memphis style angles at once, the rest of the Elite are still doing comedy bits and having matches with Nakazawa to jerk themselves off, the Dark Order angle seems to have no mobility to it other than Brodie Lee acting like Vince in skits, Matt Hardy is still Matt Hardy, Moxley is acting like a total weirdo and has no clue how to be a world champion. It feels like each show is booked on TEW with each VP and star guy getting their shit in.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

RainmakerV2 said:


> t feels like each show is booked on TEW with each VP and star guy getting their shit in.


Hey now, some of us take our TEW booking seriously.


----------



## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

NathanMayberry said:


> See this is the disconnect I was alluding to earlier.
> 
> People want these echo chambers where they are surrounded by like minded folk who agree with every asinine thing they say and then they get mad that people and reality doesn't agree with their opinions.


Are we reading the same forum? If anything every Dynamite thread is an echo chamber of negativity.


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

optikk sucks said:


> The thing is, nobody should have any issues with him in the first place.
> 
> they’re worried about wrestling being taken less seriously.....
> 
> ...


I'm starting to respect the dude a lot more than I did previously since he can go in the ring and take mad bumps. However...he really shouldn't be getting offense in on others. I know wrestling shouldn't be taken so seriously, but that only goes so far.

In his early AEW matches, he was getting way too much offense at times and that's just stupidly laughable considering his size (I'd have a hard time believing he'd win a fight against the average highschool freshman). But they've been doing pretty good with him now and I believe he's about earned his place in AEW.


----------



## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Geeee said:


> Are we reading the same forum? If anything every Dynamite thread is an echo chamber of negativity.


When they put on a bad show people are negative when they put on a good show people are positive.

Should we lie and say shows are great when they're not?


----------



## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

Chip Chipperson said:


> When they put on a bad show people are negative when they put on a good show people are positive.
> 
> Should we lie and say shows are great when they're not?


And the rest of the time people are both positive and negative. We will be happy with Cody VS Darby (Despite him being a cunt) but complain about Marko Stunt. There's very few people on this forum that can't say anything positive about AEW and that's because they've been so disappointed with the direction of the company.


----------



## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

Chip Chipperson said:


> When they put on a bad show people are negative when they put on a good show people are positive.
> 
> Should we lie and say shows are great when they're not?


Nah. It's just clear most weeks you and a bunch of other forum regulars don't like the show, which is fine. It just gives this place a negative vibe is all.

Personally, if I didn't like a show I'd stop watching it but it's your time and you're free to do with it as you wish. 

If you said r/squaredcircle was an echo chamber of AEW positivity, you might have more of a point IMO


----------



## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

Geeee said:


> Nah. It's just clear most weeks you and a bunch of other forum regulars don't like the show, which is fine. It just gives this place a negative vibe is all.
> 
> Personally, if I didn't like a show I'd stop watching it but it's your time and you're free to do with it as you wish.


This is a dishonest take and perpetuates the notion that people who don't suck The Elite and Tony Kahns dick constantly hate the show. The show is about 50/50 in regards to what is good and what is fucking terrible.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

RapShepard said:


> *In 2017 Ambrose had a 5 month IC title reign and won the tag titles with Rollins becoming a Grand Slam champion during the Shield reunion which obviously was a big story. *Then he got injured.
> 
> He came back in late 2018 and immediately was in a top storyline with his Shield Bros, he won another tag title, and then got a big heel then which got time
> 
> Yeah that reads so much like a guy they were doing nothing with. I really don't get wrestling fans at time lol. Y'all can see the clear build and importance of a Darby and Sammy despite them losing all the damn time, but then turn around and call a grand slam champion a geek lol


And Yet he was still part of the pre-show at Wrestlemania? Why are you trying to make it seem like it's not a big deal if he's not at WM, especially given he was WWE champion a few months before?

we all know they'd rather have any match on that show instead of being an irrelevant champion for month, because let's be damn clear, WWE has devalued its title and the IC and tag title mean nothing and are just pacifiers, they only mean something if they care about protecting the champ

WWE presents their roster like shit. Darby and Sammy are presented as legit.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

The Definition of Technician said:


> And Yet he was still part of the pre-show at Wrestlemania? Why are you trying to make it seem like it's not a big deal if he's not at WM, especially given he was WWE champion a few months before?
> we all know they'd rather have any match on that show instead of being an irrelevant champion for month, because let's be damn clear, WWE has devalued its title and the IC and tag title mean nothing and are just pacifiers, they only mean something if they care about protecting the champ


Just to prove how silly your point is I'll point to this. Britt Baker didn't make the main card for Full Gear nor Revolution, but we both know she's still been a main player in the women's division despite her losses and the fact she hasn't been champion yet. You're making terrible points to play it off like Ambrose was booked like Cesaro,


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

RapShepard said:


> Just to prove how silly your point is I'll point to this. Britt Baker didn't make the main card for Full Gear nor Revolution, but we both know she's still been a main player in the women's division despite her losses and the fact she hasn't been champion yet. You're making terrible points to play it off like Ambrose was booked like Cesaro,


Dude you seriously can't compare a show that's been on for a few months to one that's been on for years. Ask any wrestler, any anyone with a little bit of knowledge and they'll tell you being at WM means more than whatveer seconde rate shitty title WWE throws at you. If you are a top 5 most over guy who was WWE champion recently, you do not get left off WM unless WWE doesn't think much of you. And they didn't.

You have a terrible example with Britt. Dude, AEW is a new company still trying to put the pieces together to figure out what works and what doesn't.

Again, you shurgg off the fact Ambrose lost to Elias, Joe, Miz in single's matches within 5 months.. do you know WWE booking? how is that not Cesaro level strength wise? there are hierarchies and if you're losing to those guys you aren't going up to seth or braun or roman's level, and def not on the part-timers level.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

The Definition of Technician said:


> Dude you seriously can't compare a show that's been on for a few months to one that's been on for years. Ask any wrestler, any anyone with a little bit of knowledge and they'll tell you being at WM means more than whatveer seconde rate shitty title WWE throws at you. If you are a top 5 most over guy who was WWE champion recently, you do not get left off WM unless WWE doesn't think much of you. And they didn't.
> 
> You have a terrible example with Britt. Dude, AEW is a new company still trying to put the pieces together to figure out what works and what doesn't.
> 
> Again, you shurgg off the fact Ambrose lost to Elias, Joe, Miz in single's matches within 5 months.. do you know WWE booking? there are hierarchies and if you're losing to those guys you aren't going up to seth or roman's level, and def not on the part-timers level.


No, you're just playing stupid, when you're not stupid. You're picking and choosing when you have common sense. You want to pretend Ambrose was this unused jobber geek loser, so you're ignoring all the accolades and feuds that suggest otherwise. Because you know if you actually admit that "sure he wasn't The Guy but he was a top guy" your argument is dead.

This is you speaking on Braun 



The Definition of Technician said:


> I simply look at how well they're protected. Braun was very well protected and above him on numerous levels, you can't deny that, look at EC 2018.


You're speaking on a Braun who fell short time after time. A Braun who had won nothing in WWE save an Andre the Giant Trophy. Somehow you have the common sense to see that Braun not being a champion didn't mean he wasn't important. Yet with Ambrose you're trying to argue a guy that was a grand slam champion and in important feuds until it was clear he wouldn't resigns was a geek.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

RapShepard said:


> No, you're just playing stupid, when you're not stupid. You're picking and choosing when you have common sense. You want to pretend Ambrose was this unused jobber geek loser, so you're ignoring all the accolades and feuds that suggest otherwise. Because you know if you actually admit that "sure he wasn't The Guy but he was a top guy" your argument is dead.
> 
> This is you speaking on Braun
> 
> ...


Again. I am speaking on the 2017-2018 time-frame.

I maintain my stance. Wrestlemania is a big indicator to me how WWE sees someone. WM 32, Ambrose was treated like a geek by Lesnar despite decent built and Ambrose getting endorsed by legends, but nope, he got squashed, you wouldn't see top guys like that (Balor, Bryan, AJ showed more fight). Braun in 2017-2018 had only lost to 2 people.

WM 33, the guy WAS NOT ON THE SHOW on the show despite being WWE champion a few months earlier.
He missed WM 34 due to injury and they still didn't see any value in putting him at WM 35.

nobody cares man about being Grand Slam champion if I know 100% he was never gona break the glass ceiling and the rankings of Seth/Roman/Braun and if you have Orton, Cena, HHH, Taker, AJ, KO, Shane McMahon and others 100% ahead of you.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

The Definition of Technician said:


> Again. I am speaking on the 2017-2018 time-frame.
> 
> I maintain my stance. Wrestlemania is a big indicator to me how WWE sees someone. WM 32, Ambrose was treated like a geek by Lesnar despite decent built and Ambrose getting endorsed by legends, but nope, he got squashed, you wouldn't see top guys like that (Balor, Bryan, AJ showed more fight). Braun in 2017-2018 had only lost to 2 people.
> 
> ...


Make up your mind what year are you talking about. You say you're only talking about 2017-2018 which I already pointed out everything he did in 2017-2018. 

Also why would they put him on at Mania 35 when he had already made it clear he wouldn't re-sign? Does that even make sense to you. Facts is Ambrose was always doing something of importance, people just comically undervalue it because they're salty he wasn't Reigns or Rollins on the pecking order.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

RapShepard said:


> Make up your mind what year are you talking about. You say you're only talking about 2017-2018 which I already pointed out everything he did in 2017-2018.
> 
> Also why would they put him on at Mania 35 when he had already made it clear he wouldn't re-sign? Does that even make sense to you. Facts is Ambrose was always doing something of importance, people just comically undervalue it because they're salty he wasn't Reigns or Rollins on the pecking order.


Since you're not a big fan of him, it's okay for you that he's 5-6 guys behind even Roman/Seth level in 2017/2018.
I already told you all those accomplishments means little to nothing if his aura is of that of a guy that could be beaten by anyone, which that's how it was. He was IC champ trading wins and losses with Baron Corbin, Elias, and The Miz. And then he was a tag team guy with Rollins, but we all know that don't mean they're equal.
At the end of the day, if you aren't important enough to make it at the main card of mania despite being WWE champion within the year prior, it's pretty big low blow IMO.


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> In 2017 Ambrose had a 5 month IC title reign and won the tag titles with Rollins becoming a Grand Slam champion during the Shield reunion which obviously was a big story. Then he got injured.
> 
> He came back in late 2018 and immediately was in a top storyline with his Shield Bros, he won another tag title, and then got a big heel then which got time
> 
> Yeah that reads so much like a guy they were doing nothing with. I really don't get wrestling fans at time lol. Y'all can see the clear build and importance of a Darby and Sammy despite them losing all the damn time, but then turn around and call a grand slam champion a geek lol


I was a big Ambrose fan, but even I couldn't recall really any memorable moments from most of his title reigns. The most memorable was his US title run but that's because those were the early Shield days and he never even defended the damn thing. His IC title run had him feuding with great talent like Wyatt, Owens, and Harper but I can't seem to recall what any of those feuds were even about.

The Ziggler vs Ambrose feud when Ambrose was WWE Champion had a great build, but the match flopped and then he was involved in bs comedy segments with Ellsworth shortly afterwards (which shouldn't have a place in a world title feud at all mind you).

So sorry, I don't really see your point at all as a guy who's followed Ambrose/Moxley's career pretty closely. His title runs in WWE were booked like shit in hindsight when they had so much potential. The best he was booked outside the Shield was when he was chasing Rollins for the Money in the Bank briefcase and the WWE title, but he kept getting screwed by Corporate Kane over and over which got old real quick.

Edit: I don't think he was IC champion when he feuded with Wyatt, actually. But the point remains. I don't remember anything about that feud when it should have written itself (just like his terrible botched bootleg Bane heel turn).


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

The Definition of Technician said:


> Since you're not a big fan of him, it's okay for you that he's 5-6 guys behind even Roman/Seth level in 2017/2018.
> I already told you all those accomplishments means little to nothing is his aura is of that of a guy that could be beaten by anyone, which that's how it was. He was IC champ trading wins and losses with Baron Corbin, Elias, and The Miz. And then he was a tag team guy with Rollins, but we all know that don't mean they're equal.


My favorite wrestler of all time is Kane. I was able to enjoy him whether he was the top guy or not. While I can certainly understand wanting somebody you like to be champ, because I would've loved for Kane to have had Taker booking or what not. But what I can't understand is pretending that a guy that was always being used was a nobody, just because you're upset he wasn't Thee Guy. 

Somebody making the argument that they think Ambrose deserved more I can get. But pretending that a grandslam champion, who was constantly on TV and, in one of the more important feuds on his brand was a nobody geek is ridiculous.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Moxley with a flop of a match? Not many memorable moments? Surely you jest.

Either AEW is booking him like shit in the way Vince did, orrrr...


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

DJ Punk said:


> I was a big Ambrose fan, but even I couldn't recall really any memorable moments from most of his title reigns. The most memorable was his US title run but that's because those were the early Shield days and he never even defended the damn thing. His IC title run had him feuding with great talent like Wyatt, Owens, and Harper but I can't seem to recall what any of those feuds were even about.
> 
> The Ziggler vs Ambrose feud when Ambrose was WWE Champion had a great build, but the match flopped and then he was involved in bs comedy segments with Ellsworth shortly afterwards (which shouldn't have a place in a world title feud at all mind you).
> 
> ...


Either you just checked his Wikipedia to see who he feuded with, or I'm going to have to call you a liar lol. Because it's weird to say "I totally don't remember what happened during his title reigns" while naming who he was feuding with lol.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Theres no athletic commission in the country that would sanction Marko Stunt in any kind of fight vs any normal sized human.


Look up Demetrious Johnson

if Marko Stunt wants to be taken seriously and not just job his whole life, he needs to add muscle and go for the ground and pound MMA style.


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> Either you just checked his Wikipedia to see who he feuded with, or I'm going to have to call you a liar lol. Because it's weird to say "I totally don't remember what happened during his title reigns" while naming who he was feuding with lol.


What? I meant I don't remember the context of the feuds or who he even lost some of his titles to. I just remember he had some good matches with other wrestlers I liked at the time and what belt he was holding during it. How am I a liar for remembering he feuded with Owens (my second favorite at the time) over the IC title, but don't even remember any segments, promos, or what the feud was based around? WWE's just that lazy to where it all blends in and you can only remember small details because nothing stands out.


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

optikk sucks said:


> Look up Demetrious Johnson



When did he fight 7 foot tall heavyweights?


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

DJ Punk said:


> What? I meant I don't remember the context of the feuds or who he even lost some of his titles to. I just remember he had some good matches with other wrestlers I liked at the time and what belt he was holding during it. How am I a liar for remembering he feuded with Owens (my second favorite at the time) over the IC title, but don't even remember any segments, promos, or what the feud was based around? WWE's just that lazy to where it all blends in and you can only remember small details because nothing stands out.


I'm just saying that's it's weird if you remember these feuds with no assistance if they're so unmemorable for you. 

Do agree there's some pretty meh lazy stories being told from them though.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RainmakerV2 said:


> When did he fight 7 foot tall heavyweights?


He didnt, but you said “Theres no athletic commission in the country that would sanction Marko Stunt in any kind of fight vs any normal sized human.”

7 foot is not “normal” in any country. The average height of Americans is 5’9.

Furthermore, DJ has fought bigger guys.

and yeah so your point, but idk what point you were making, is void.


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> I'm just saying that's it's weird if you remember these feuds with no assistance if they're so unmemorable for you.
> 
> Do agree there's some pretty meh lazy stories being told from them though.


Well I suppose I too drank the WWE koolade at one point and bought into the "titles are important" mentality for a good while. So I would commit to memory when my favorites feuded or won a title. But thinking back now, it's sad how I can't remember anything from the Ambrose vs Owens feud besides the fact that it was for the IC title. Those two dudes were my favorites and I guarantee they'd have a memorable great feud in AEW if the opportunity ever came by. 

Moxley has already had two great unique feuds in AEW with Omega and Jericho. And his feud with Omega created a plethora of memorable moments I'll still look back on years from now while his title runs in WWE will easily be forgotten because WWE booked them either terribly or bland. Really proves how titles don't mean much in wrestling if the promotion doesn't do anything to make them matter.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

DJ Punk said:


> Well I suppose I too drank the WWE koolade at one point and bought into the "titles are important" mentality for a good while. So I would commit to memory when my favorites feuded or won a title. But thinking back now, it's sad how I can't remember anything from the Ambrose vs Owens feud besides the fact that it was for the IC title. Those two dudes were my favorites and I guarantee they'd have a memorable great feud in AEW if the opportunity ever came by.
> 
> Moxley has already had two great unique feuds in AEW with Omega and Jericho. And his feud with Omega created a plethora of memorable moments I'll still look back on years from now while his title runs in WWE will easily be forgotten because WWE booked them either terribly or bland. Really proves how titles don't mean much in wrestling if the promotion doesn't do anything to make them matter.


Calling them 2 great feuds seems like a stuck in the moment I'm glad my guy is finally Thee Guy hyperbole. 

His 2 feuds in AEW have been a mixed bag. Omega had a meh build with a good match, Jericho had a good build with a meh match. 

I feel like a lot of Moxley fans are highly overrating everything he's doing in AEW just because he's finally the top guy even if it's in a smaller pond. That's not to say he's having a bad AEW run, because he's not. But Christ you'd think he was on some ATG run right now, when really it's just a solid run.


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> Calling them 2 great feuds seems like a stuck in the moment I'm glad my guy is finally Thee Guy hyperbole.
> 
> *His 2 feuds in AEW have been a mixed bag. Omega had a meh build with a good match, Jericho had a good build with a meh match.*
> 
> I feel like a lot of Moxley fans are highly overrating everything he's doing in AEW just because he's finally the top guy even if it's in a smaller pond. That's not to say he's having a bad AEW run, because he's not. But Christ you'd think he was on some ATG run right now, when really it's just a solid run.


I agree with the second statement, but not the first. Omega vs Moxley had an epic build and an epic match (mixed reviews on it due to the nature of it, so I know it's not everyone's cup of tea). But to say their build was "meh" is underselling it quite a bit.

Moxley debuted at Double or Nothing and took out one of the biggest names in AEW and perhaps the biggest name on the entire indy circuit: Kenny Omega. It was a straight up fight for dominance and it turned into several weeks of constant beat downs, staredowns with weapons in hand, and involved constant mayhem that culminated in a brutal bloodbath. The story was a simple one, sure. But the execution was brilliant. I felt like their segments always stole the show up until Full Gear.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

DJ Punk said:


> I agree with the second statement, but not the first. Omega vs Moxley had an epic build and an epic match (mixed reviews on it due to the nature of it, so I know it's not everyone's cup of tea). But to say their build was "meh" is underselling it quite a bit.
> 
> Moxley debuted at Double or Nothing and took out one of the biggest names in AEW and perhaps the biggest name on the entire indy circuit: Kenny Omega. It was a straight up fight for dominance and it turned into several weeks of constant beat downs, staredowns with weapons in hand, and involved constant mayhem that culminated in a brutal bloodbath. The story was a simple one, sure. But the execution was brilliant. I felt like their segments always stole the show up until Full Gear.


The execution was okay. Moxley attacked Omega, then they brawled a couple times. Sounds like the bare bone laziness you were just rightfully getting on WWE about. 

The feud started off well with the debut. The Moxley saying why he attacked Omega and Omega's promo on Moxley being out of All In were good follow ups. But for me they really dropped the ball once TV came. I don't see how you could call that build epic. It's not awful, but epic is certainly not the type of word that should be associated with that. 

For me the only epic story being told in AEW is Hangman's story.


----------



## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

optikk sucks said:


> Look up Demetrious Johnson
> 
> if Marko Stunt wants to be taken seriously and not just job his whole life, he needs to add muscle and go for the ground and pound MMA style.


Let's be real, Marko Stunt is more Hornswoggle than Rey Mysterio and the shows would be better if he wasn't on them and Jurassic Express would be better if he wasn't with them


----------



## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

Geeee said:


> Let's be real, Marko Stunt is more Hornswoggle than Rey Mysterio and the shows would be better if he wasn't on them and Jurassic Express would be better if he wasn't with them


This is literally all that needs to be said. Doesn't make anyone a hater or a sycophant, it's just honest.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Geeee said:


> Let's be real, Marko Stunt is more Hornswoggle than Rey Mysterio and the shows would be better if he wasn't on them and Jurassic Express would be better if he wasn't with them


he does his job as the jobber. Nobody has ever compared him to Rey Mysterio, at least I hope so. even AEW does not treat him like Mysterio.


----------



## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

optikk sucks said:


> he does his job as the jobber. Nobody has ever compared him to Rey Mysterio, at least I hope so. even AEW does not treat him like Mysterio.


Yeah he seems like a really nice guy. I hope he gets a fat check from Vince McMahon and they put him on SmackDown (which coincidentally I never watch)


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> The execution was okay. Moxley attacked Omega, then they brawled a couple times. Sounds like the bare bone laziness you were just rightfully getting on WWE about.
> 
> The feud started off well with the debut. The Moxley saying why he attacked Omega and Omega's promo on Moxley being out of All In were good follow ups. But for me they really dropped the ball once TV came. I don't see how you could call that build epic. It's not awful, but epic is certainly not the type of word that should be associated with that.
> 
> For me the only epic story being told in AEW is Hangman's story.


There's a difference between typical WWE lazy boring beatdowns which usually involves lackluster punches followed by the occasional chairshot with a chickenshit heel running away and this:


























They both sold us on just two dudes wanting to beat the ever living hell out of each other. When's the last time WWE did a build like this?


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

RapShepard said:


> My favorite wrestler of all time is Kane. I was able to enjoy him whether he was the top guy or not. While I can certainly understand wanting somebody you like to be champ, because I would've loved for Kane to have had Taker booking or what not. But what I can't understand is pretending that a guy that was always being used was a nobody, just because you're upset he wasn't Thee Guy.
> 
> Somebody making the argument that they think Ambrose deserved more I can get. But pretending that a grandslam champion, who was constantly on TV and, in one of the more important feuds on his brand was a nobody geek is ridiculous.


You said his feuds more often than not were presented as a big deal. But in WWE, as a mid-carder you're behind 2 world champs, at least one of the woman's champs, and probably a couple of non-title feuds.
Back when Kane was a mid-card/upper-card, things WERE more enjoyable because they did more things with the mid-card. And then seeing him lose single matches to just about anyone in the mid-card/uppercard (Joe, Miz, Elias), I would say it's fair to say he wasn't really always given focus. With a few months in AEW he's already overdone his memorable moments of the year he would have had in WWE, big time.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

DJ Punk said:


> There's a difference between typical WWE lazy boring beatdowns which usually involves lackluster punches followed by the occasional chairshot with a chickenshit heel running away and this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


None of those brawls are special though lol. Like I said you being a Moxley fan are giving it extra points because "omg Moxley is the guy now" 



The Definition of Technician said:


> You said his feuds more often than not were presented as a big deal. But in WWE, as a mid-carder you're behind 2 world champs, at least one of the woman's champs, and probably a couple of non-title feuds.
> Back when Kane was a mid-card/upper-card, things WERE more enjoyable because they did more things with the mid-card. And then seeing him lose single matches to just about anyone in the mid-card/uppercard (Joe, Miz, Elias), I would say it's fair to say he wasn't really always given focus. With a few months in AEW he's already overdone his memorable moments of the year he would have had in WWE, big time.


Nah Moxley fans are super overrating his current run and super under playing his WWE run. He wasn't the top guy, but he was damn important. I bet you Cesaro fans and Harper fans would've loved for them to have that Moxley unimportant booking.


----------



## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

RapShepard said:


> None of those brawls are special though lol. Like I said you being a Moxley fan are giving it extra points because "omg Moxley is the guy now"
> 
> 
> 
> Nah Moxley fans are super overrating his current run and super under playing his WWE run. He wasn't the top guy, but he was damn important. I bet you Cesaro fans and Harper fans would've loved for them to have that Moxley unimportant booking.


I don't even think Moxley had a problem with his booking. All of his complaints on Talk is Jericho were about having to do stupid comedy skits and make insensitive comments about his friend's cancer. From what I can tell, he felt stifled creatively, not underpushed.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Geeee said:


> I don't even think Moxley had a problem with his booking. All of his complaints on Talk is Jericho were about having to do stupid comedy skits and make insensitive comments about his friend's cancer. From what I can tell, he felt stifled creatively, not underpushed.


Yeah his main issue did seem to be Vince ideas lol


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> None of those brawls are special though lol. Like I said you being a Moxley fan are giving it extra points because "omg Moxley is the guy now"


To each his own I guess..I enjoyed those brawls quite a lot and loved how it wasn't your standard face vs chickenshit heel dynamic. I'd take all of that over this crap:











But if you enjoyed the wacky looney tune Ambrose whose heel persona couldn't stand the stench of the smelly crowd then good on you I guess. I prefer the current incarnation of Moxley's singles career over anything he's done as Ambrose in all his years in WWE personally.

Plus, the matches he's been having in NJPW (vs Juice Robinson, Lance Archer, Suzuki) are pretty sick too.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

DJ Punk said:


> To each his own I guess..I enjoyed those brawls quite a lot and loved how it wasn't your standard face vs chickenshit heel dynamic. I'd take all of that over this crap:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Bruh is still a Looney Tune calling grandma and playing pirate lol. And didn't they jump each other from behind like 3 different times lol

And






Is just as good as any of the Kenny segments you posted.


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> Bruh is still a Looney Tune calling grandma and playing pirate lol. And didn't they jump each other from behind like 3 different times lol
> 
> And
> 
> ...


The initial heel turn was fine, but everything after that fell flat. 

And pretty sure "playing pitate" told a good story and was the deciding factor when he revealed his eye wasn't injured all along which inevitably lead to him winning the world title from Jericho (props to him for selling that "injury" in NJPW too).

Plus, Kenny and Mox jumped each other from behind, sure. But when given the chance to hit a downed Kenny (after he brought the weapon for Mox to use) from Pac's attack, Moxley decided against it. 

As for the segment telling us to call Grandma, God forbid we have a little comedy in our life during a worldwide pandemic happening lol. The occasional joke or comedic comment doesn't mean his character is a wacky looney tune the way he was quite often portrayed in WWE. 

Why do I feel like you would be trying to convince Moxley himself that WWE wasn't that bad and that everything he stated in his podcasts were mere overreactions and exaggerations?


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

DJ Punk said:


> The initial heel turn was fine, but everything after that fell flat.
> 
> And pretty sure "playing pitate" told a good story and was the deciding factor when he revealed his eye wasn't injured all along which inevitably lead to him winning the world title from Jericho (props to him for selling that "injury" in NJPW too).
> 
> ...


The eye story was good, until he revealed mid match he didn't need it. That's dumb and you know it. 

Personally on my end I don't get why Mox fans are acting like he's some whole new character now, that's my issue. I get them enjoying him being further up the pecking order. But all of these Mox things, are things that Ambrose could've done. It's not hard to imagine Ambrose stopping mid promo to tell people to call grandma nor is it hard to imagine him wearing an eye patch longer than necessary for "reasons". 

At least with someone like Matt you can see the vast difference between how he creatively wants to present himself and how Vince wanted to, with Mox that creative difference is minimal. With Moxley he's still the violent weirdo he's always been, especially when you add in NJPW. He has a fucking comedy sidekick for fucks sake lol.


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> The eye story was good, until he revealed mid match he didn't need it. That's dumb and you know it.
> 
> Personally on my end I don't get why Mox fans are acting like he's some whole new character now, that's my issue. I get them enjoying him being further up the pecking order. But all of these Mox things, are things that Ambrose could've done. It's not hard to imagine Ambrose stopping mid promo to tell people to call grandma nor is it hard to imagine him wearing an eye patch longer than necessary for "reasons".
> 
> At least with someone like Matt you can see the vast difference between how he creatively wants to present himself and how Vince wanted to, with Mox that creative difference is minimal. With Moxley he's still the violent weirdo he's always been, especially when you add in NJPW. He has a fucking comedy sidekick for fucks sake lol.


I think that's kind of the main issue though. The current Moxley is what we all wanted him to be in WWE, but they wouldn't allow him. Ambrose had his good moments, but they never reached their full potential. I feel like the Omega vs Moxley match was what I wanted Lesnar vs Ambrose to be years ago. 

He didn't have to entirely reinvent himself because the foundation was already there to begin with. I actually enjoy his comedy bits because he can actually pull it off, but some of it was just done to death in WWE. He shouldn't be having a shot stuck in his ass during a live promo shortly after his long awaited heel turn.


----------



## La Parka (Oct 28, 2008)

optikk sucks said:


> Look up Demetrious Johnson
> 
> if Marko Stunt wants to be taken seriously and not just job his whole life, he needs to add muscle and go for the ground and pound MMA style.





optikk sucks said:


> The thing is, nobody should have any issues with him in the first place.
> 
> they’re worried about wrestling being taken less seriously.....
> 
> ...


This attitude is why wrestling has such terrible viewership and is constantly beat in the ratings by cooking shows and lego reality television. 

If you don't take your product seriously, why should I? whats the point of even having the show? 

Sure its a scripted program but all other forms of entertainment take themselves seriously unless its a comedy.There's nothing funny about AEW or WWE. You don't see robert downey jr wink to the audience and tell everyone that he's not really iron man and this is all silly bullshit and everyone in the movie is just in spandex. 

Stunt is an embarrassment. Who the hell wants to watch a grown man who looks like hes 12 floss during a fight? Game of Thrones got ripped to pieces for being shit and its not even close to the silliness that goes on in wrestling on a weekly basis. Hes not just the guy who is used for beatings. He got a decent amount of offence on one of the best tag teams in the world in the Lucha Bros and made them look horrible by doing his stupid floss dance during the match. Two killers like the Lucha Bros should make someone like Stunt cower in fear!


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

DJ Punk said:


> I think that's kind of the main issue though. The current Moxley is what we all wanted him to be in WWE, but they wouldn't allow him. Ambrose had his good moments, but they never reached their full potential. I feel like the Omega vs Moxley match was what I wanted Lesnar vs Ambrose to be years ago.
> 
> He didn't have to entirely reinvent himself because the foundation was already there to begin with. I actually enjoy his comedy bits because he can actually pull it off, but some of it was just done to death in WWE. He shouldn't be having a shot stuck in his ass during a live promo shortly after his long awaited heel turn.


I guess I kind of get that. But for me when I hear him on the Jericho podcast and all the talk about how he had this great ideas. Or hear fans talking about how he was being held back. I personally was expecting more than this from a character stand point.


----------



## DJ Punk (Sep 1, 2016)

RapShepard said:


> I guess I kind of get that. But for me when I hear him on the Jericho podcast and all the talk about how he had this great ideas. Or hear fans talking about how he was being held back. I personally was expecting more than this from a character stand point.


Still early on. Almost been a year and in that time, he's been cementing himself as a dominant hardcore ruthless badass. I'm sure he'll probably turn heel after eventually losing the title (probably to Omega) and he may mix in elements of his old FCW (dark, psychological) character with his current. I'd love to see that. He's one of the best face characters I've seen in wrestling tbh, but that could be due to me having only WWE to compare with.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

TheAppler said:


> This attitude is why wrestling has such terrible viewership and is constantly beat in the ratings by cooking shows and lego reality television.
> 
> If you don't take your product seriously, why should I? whats the point of even having the show?
> 
> ...


wrestling is a combination of comedy, seriousness etc. flossing was part of meme culture. massive with the zoomers.

lots of wrestling fans are out of touch with culture. OC went viral and lots of people wanted aew to get rid of him. imagine wanting to get rid of someone who can bring you some young fans

WWE are losing fans because they target boomers who are dying off


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

optikk sucks said:


> He didnt, but you said “Theres no athletic commission in the country that would sanction Marko Stunt in any kind of fight vs any normal sized human.”
> 
> 7 foot is not “normal” in any country. The average height of Americans is 5’9.
> 
> ...



Dude. You know the point Im making. I exaggerated a little for emphasis but Jesus Christ. DJ has fought bigger guys? Uh..not in the UFC. I dont know if hes done some circus fights against guys 100 pounds heavier than him in some underground promotions or another country, but major American MMA has a thing called weight classes. Sure, guys may have been bigger in stature than him, but they all weighed the same at the weigh in. Of course you're a smart guy and know all this but for some reason you're making me type this much and I dont like carpal tunnel.

A sports oriented show would never book Lance Archer vs. Marko Stunt. Thats some super carny pro wrestling shit. You say thats not their identity anymore. Like I said. Awesome. And Ill ask again, what is?


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Dude. You know the point Im making. I exaggerated a little for emphasis but Jesus Christ. DJ has fought bigger guys? Uh..not in the UFC. I dont know if hes done some circus fights against guys 100 pounds heavier than him in some underground promotions or another country, but major American MMA has a thing called weight classes. Sure, guys may have been bigger in stature than him, but they all weighed the same at the weigh in. Of course you're a smart guy and know all this but for some reason you're making me type this much and I dont like carpal tunnel.
> 
> A sports oriented show would never book Lance Archer vs. Marko Stunt. Thats some super carny pro wrestling shit. You say thats not their identity anymore. Like I said. Awesome. And Ill ask again, what is?


but they are not sports orientated.


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

optikk sucks said:


> but they are not sports orientated.


Ok. What are they? Im not asking you to get inside Tony Khans brain. Whats their identity to you? When i watch NJPW, I know what Im getting, when I watch WWE, I know what Im getting. If a lapsed fan sits down and watches it for the first time, I can pretty much get them through what shit is about. How would you describe AEW to a lapsed fan? What is it exactly?


----------



## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Ok. What are they? Im not asking you to get inside Tony Khans brain. Whats their identity to you? When i watch NJPW, I know what Im getting, when I watch WWE, I know what Im getting. If a lapsed fan sits down and watches it for the first time, I can pretty much get them through what shit is about. How would you describe AEW to a lapsed fan? What is it exactly?


This has been my mindset for a while now. If I were to recommend AEW to a friend, how would I go about enticing them to watch? Because I don't think going on about Vince McMahon being a jerk would get the job done.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Ok. What are they? Im not asking you to get inside Tony Khans brain. Whats their identity to you? When i watch NJPW, I know what Im getting, when I watch WWE, I know what Im getting. If a lapsed fan sits down and watches it for the first time, I can pretty much get them through what shit is about. How would you describe AEW to a lapsed fan? What is it exactly?


firstly, what do you get with wwe? PG boomer shit is what comes to me. all their fans are dying.

AEW you know you can get the "wild west" terminology that has been described the product is unfiltered and creatively-uninhibited. no head honcho with relaxed refereeing and a hot crowd. you could also argue that they're aiming for a teenage market with their internet marketing and meme culture. soon, they may have the internet championship

you can argue that it's unfiltered garbage. of course you can. it's freedom of speech. but to say that you are having trouble identifying AEW's "character" then maybe you are choosing to be ignorant. well that's on you


----------



## Aedubya (Jul 12, 2019)

A very good episode
Will be interesting to see what matches they have recorded in the can for next weeks abandoned pre recorded show (that they now cant use obviously) and if they use them on Dark instead


----------



## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

optikk sucks said:


> firstly, what do you get with wwe? PG boomer shit is what comes to me. all their fans are dying.
> 
> AEW you know you can get the "wild west" terminology that has been described the product is unfiltered and creatively-uninhibited. no head honcho with relaxed refereeing and a hot crowd. you could also argue that they're aiming for a teenage market with their internet marketing and meme culture. soon, they may have the internet championship
> 
> you can argue that it's unfiltered garbage. of course you can. it's freedom of speech. but to say that you are having trouble identifying AEW's "character" then maybe you are choosing to be ignorant. well that's on you



So its cool to be directionless and random and call it "the wild west". Lol. Ok. Even you've liked posts Ive made about how theres way too much randomness and too many stories overlapping each other and now you're gonna act like its a good thing and its just being "creatively unhibitied." Alright lol. Gotcha.


----------



## Danielallen1410 (Nov 21, 2016)

El Hammerstone said:


> This has been my mindset for a while now. If I were to recommend AEW to a friend, how would I go about enticing them to watch? Because I don't think going on about Vince McMahon being a jerk would get the job done.


A mainstream wrestling company.

similar to wwe but working their way up.

I don’t understand this indentity obsession.

wwe and wcw were pretty similar in identity, they just did things slightly different.


----------



## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

DJ Punk said:


> There's a difference between typical WWE lazy boring beatdowns which usually involves lackluster punches followed by the occasional chairshot with a chickenshit heel running away and this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...





DJ Punk said:


> I think that's kind of the main issue though. The current Moxley is what we all wanted him to be in WWE, but they wouldn't allow him. Ambrose had his good moments, but they never reached their full potential. I feel like the Omega vs Moxley match was what I wanted Lesnar vs Ambrose to be years ago.
> 
> He didn't have to entirely reinvent himself because the foundation was already there to begin with. I actually enjoy his comedy bits because he can actually pull it off, but some of it was just done to death in WWE. He shouldn't be having a shot stuck in his ass during a live promo shortly after his long awaited heel turn.


I thought the Moxley and Omega stuff was the best stuff on wrestling, even if I never quite understood the reason behind the anger toward each other.

Omega’s little touches with the poker chip spot, the sugar glass table, using the sugar glass at Full Gear, etc...all of that was great booking that made Mox look as legit as they come.


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RainmakerV2 said:


> So its cool to be directionless and random and call it "the wild west". Lol. Ok. Even you've liked posts Ive made about how theres way too much randomness and too many stories overlapping each other and now you're gonna act like its a good thing and its just being "creatively unhibitied." Alright lol. Gotcha.


where did i say that AEW is directionless? The direction is clear; AEW want to be a product for the youngsters and the teenagers. A product that's well versed in pop culture. I'd say so far they are doing fairly well. They know what goes viral. They seem to understand what the youngsters want. Sure, there's kinks. If they get a chance to iron out those kinks, i'd say the sky is the limit.

you said there's no clear definition of AEW. I proved you wrong. I also said that you are fully in your right to say that it's a shit direction and that's fair enough. I like posts that make well thought out arguments, which you do occasionally make when your bias isn't showing.

You still haven't said what you get when you watch WWE.


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## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

I thought early Moxley was brilliant. I do think one thing that was an issue (for me anyway) was that DoN was May and the TV show wouldn't start for another 4 months.

So alot of the momentum was halted following what was a very hot debut when Moxley was the most talked about wrestler on the planet. I'm not surprised they struck when the iron was hot though and wanted to end DoN with a bang instead of waiting until live TV to debut Mox. 

Then he pulled out of All Out due to injury and it just looked to be fizzing out. But then he was hitting it again when live TV came round.

He's ultimately a better chaser but I'll judge him again when he's got a hot crowd either side of him and a new heel to feud with.


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## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

optikk sucks said:


> where did i say that AEW is directionless? The direction is clear; AEW want to be a product for the youngsters and the teenagers. A product that's well versed in pop culture. I'd say so far they are doing fairly well. They know what goes viral. They seem to understand what the youngsters want. Sure, there's kinks. If they get a chance to iron out those kinks, i'd say the sky is the limit.
> 
> you said there's no clear definition of AEW. I proved you wrong. I also said that you are fully in your right to say that it's a shit direction and that's fair enough. I like posts that make well thought out arguments, which you do occasionally make when your bias isn't showing.
> 
> You still haven't said what you get when you watch WWE.



Well shit. I know when Im with my boys there aint shit I like more then men rubbing oil on themselves and doing Brady Bunch parodies and one of their big new stars making fun of Vince Mcmahon over and over in 2020 (wow so original, God damn pal.) Im just out of touch and thats my fault. Back to my boomer cave.


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Well shit. I know when Im with my boys there aint shit I like more then men rubbing oil on themselves and doing Brady Bunch parodies and one of their big new stars making fun of Vince Mcmahon over and over in 2020 (wow so original, God damn pal.) Im just out of touch and thats my fault. Back to my boomer cave.


firstly, every time nakazawa is on TV, there's a ratings boost lol. You must've forgotten the car crash tele that was called the attitude era. 
secondly, that brady bunch parody is based on tiktok and memes. it's zoomer humour
thirdly, only the internet goofs will think of Vince. The casual viewer won't think "oh wow so Vince". They'll think "oh man this guy is nuts. who's going to stand up to him?"

so yeah, back to your out of touch boomer cave.


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## RainmakerV2 (Nov 8, 2017)

optikk sucks said:


> firstly, every time nakazawa is on TV, there's a ratings boost lol. You must've forgotten the car crash tele that was called the attitude era.
> secondly, that brady bunch parody is based on tiktok and memes. it's zoomer humour
> thirdly, only the internet goofs will think of Vince. The casual viewer won't think "oh wow so Vince". They'll think "oh man this guy is nuts. who's going to stand up to him?"
> 
> so yeah, back to your out of touch boomer cave.



Then why they'd just lose 80K viewers after advertising two semifinal tourney matches and Moxley?


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Then why they'd just lose 80K viewers after advertising two semifinal tourney matches and Moxley?


i never said that they're perfect. i don't think you understand what i'm trying to get at here. kinks bro. once they fully understand their target audience, sky's the limit.


and actually you've made a good point. basic 20 minute wrestling did the opposite - it did _not_ draw.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

RainmakerV2 said:


> Then why they'd just lose 80K viewers after advertising two semifinal tourney matches and Moxley?


Then why did Moxley in a no-hokds-barred match, his supposed specialty, lose some 60k viewers?

And I’m not even arguing for Nakazawa as I absolutely despised that stupid fucking match, but...it did draw.


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## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

optikk sucks said:


> firstly, every time nakazawa is on TV, there's a ratings boost lol. You must've forgotten the car crash tele that was called the attitude era.
> secondly, that brady bunch parody is based on tiktok and memes. it's zoomer humour
> thirdly, only the internet goofs will think of Vince. The casual viewer won't think "oh wow so Vince". They'll think "oh man this guy is nuts. who's going to stand up to him?"
> 
> so yeah, back to your out of touch boomer cave.


How do know it was Michael Nakazawa that drew, and not Kenny Omega, or the Best Friends, or Orange Cassidy who sells a shit load of merch? I saw several people in the thread for that episode that didn't even realize Nakazawa wrestled the way he did.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

El Hammerstone said:


> How do know it was Michael Nakazawa that drew, and not Kenny Omega, or the Best Friends, or Orange Cassidy who sells a shit load of merch? I saw several people in the thread for that episode that didn't even realize Nakazawa wrestled the way he did.


I mean, the obvious answer is that it was Kenny Omega and, to an extent, Orange Cassidy.

Since January 1st, Omega segments have typically been draws.

I was just being a dick in my argument that the Nakazawa comedy tag was the high draw of the evening. Lol


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

El Hammerstone said:


> How do know it was Michael Nakazawa that drew, and not Kenny Omega, or the Best Friends, or Orange Cassidy who sells a shit load of merch? I saw several people in the thread for that episode that didn't even realize Nakazawa wrestled the way he did.


Oh so what you’re saying is Nakazawas gimmick is perfectly fine as it did not push viewers away?


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## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

optikk sucks said:


> Oh so what you’re saying is Nakazawas gimmick is perfectly fine as it did not push viewers away?


People find it hard to look away from train wrecks, but will they come back the following week to witness the train wreck again? Doubtful. But hey, if you're into an oiled up, middle aged, no talent pulling out his thong and shoving it into another man's face, which is then followed up by a goofy group hug spot in a company where wins and losses matter, I'm not here to kink shame.


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

El Hammerstone said:


> People find it hard to look away from train wrecks, but will they come back the following week to witness the train wreck again? Doubtful. But hey, if you're into an oiled up, middle aged, no talent pulling out his thong and shoving it into another man's face, which is then followed up by a goofy group hug spot in a company where wins and losses matter, I'm not here to kink shame.


Didn’t happen with Perry Saturn and moppy, that got over.
I guess the armchair experts have no idea what the people want.


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## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

optikk sucks said:


> firstly, every time nakazawa is on TV, there's a ratings boost lol. You must've forgotten the car crash tele that was called the attitude era.
> secondly, that brady bunch parody is based on tiktok and memes. it's zoomer humour
> thirdly, only the internet goofs will think of Vince. The casual viewer won't think "oh wow so Vince". They'll think "oh man this guy is nuts. who's going to stand up to him?"
> 
> so yeah, back to your out of touch boomer cave.


That's because he's often on TV with Kenny. Also, ratings don't actually matter in 2020.
You're too old to be using zoomer and boomer unironically
AEW viewers are internet goofs. They don't have casual fans.


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## BlueEyedDevil (Dec 26, 2019)

I was super impressed by the intestinal fortitude Brandi showed after getting crushed into the guardrail to bravely come back out with that water bottle while still in excruciating pain so Cody could rehydrate himself. She soldiers on later in the evening ignoring the agony caused from the injuries she sustained taking the attention away from herself to fully support her brother-in-law. Bravo!


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

TheAppler said:


> If you don't take your product seriously, why should I? whats the point of even having the show?


This is perfect.

If every major star you have is some jokey "Now you laugh" guy how can I ever invest in them having a serious feud? The "awesome" writing of Tony Khan truly on display here.



optikk sucks said:


> where did i say that AEW is directionless? The direction is clear; AEW want to be a product for the youngsters and the teenagers. A product that's well versed in pop culture. I'd say so far they are doing fairly well. They know what goes viral. They seem to understand what the youngsters want.


How do you get this vibe at all?

I don't know how old you are but the youth of today aren't into grown men doing embarrassing Tik Tok's or people throwing oil at one another that's very much the geeky indy style of wrestling that guys in their late twenties to early forties are into. 

The sporting youth of today are into MMA which is obviously as real as it gets whilst the general youth are into meme culture, gigging, social media, YouTube etc. AEW is aimed at the geeky smart mark who downloads NJPW once a month and laughs at wrestlers doing silly things but can't explain why it's funny. I put the question out there on Thursday (Wednesday USA time) asking why The Bubbly Bunch segments are funny and nobody answered except for one fella who said "Because it is".



optikk sucks said:


> secondly, that brady bunch parody is based on tiktok and memes. it's zoomer humour
> thirdly, only the internet goofs will think of Vince. The casual viewer won't think "oh wow so Vince". They'll think "oh man this guy is nuts. who's going to stand up to him?"


So you're telling me that the segment based around 50 year old Chris Jericho named after a TV show that hasn't aired since the mid 1970's is all about attracting people born in the late 1990's/early 2000's? The latest one included not one person who is relevant in pop culture today and included many people who were last relevant 40-50 years ago.

AEW has no casual viewers they drove them all away in the early weeks of Dynamite because of their "zoomer humour" and stupid antics. It's now just die hard independent wrestling fans and wrestling tragics such as myself who are hoping it gets better.



optikk sucks said:


> Didn’t happen with Perry Saturn and moppy, that got over.
> I guess the armchair experts have no idea what the people want.


I've just been watching WWF 2001 so I can give you some fresh insight into the Moppy angle.

It was a comedy segment but it was comedy in wrestling done properly. It wasn't insulting or stupid. Saturn had the slow build of taking continued shots to the head and all the concussions piled up giving him some form of permanent (Or maybe temporary. I haven't got up to whether he recovered and don't remember if he did) brain damage that caused him to become infatuated with a mop. Perry went from a boring wrestler with no character to having a reason for being on the show and everyone treated him like the weirdo that he is and used it to fuck with him. 

Compare it to what AEW is doing currently with Matt Hardy. This is insulting and stupid. Hardy has no slow build or reason to think he is 4000 years old and is named Demarcus or whatever the fuck his name is. He somehow has the ability to teleport and control the pyro in the arena and he for whatever reason has a strange accent that we recently learned he can turn on and off along with his whole "broken" character which also can be turned off. Everyone treats Matt Hardy as if he is normal when he isn't and almost every single aspect of the character has remained unexplained which confuses people. I'm a pro wrestling tragic and if someone asked me to explain Matt Hardy I would not be able to. This is a great example of comedy in wrestling done badly.

See the difference? One character had motivation and reasoning to fall in love with the mop and it was constantly mentioned on air that this guy was crazy and not acting right. Meanwhile, the other character has just popped up acting insane and nobody has ever so much as said he is crazy and demented except the top heel of the company.

One is piss easy to explain the other one makes no sense.


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## El Hammerstone (Jan 11, 2020)

Chip Chipperson said:


> I've just been watching WWF 2001 so I can give you some fresh insight into the Moppy angle.
> 
> It was a comedy segment but it was comedy in wrestling done properly. It wasn't insulting or stupid. Saturn had the slow build of taking continued shots to the head and all the concussions piled up giving him some form of permanent (Or maybe temporary. I haven't got up to whether he recovered and don't remember if he did) brain damage that caused him to become infatuated with a mop. Perry went from a boring wrestler with no character to having a reason for being on the show and everyone treated him like the weirdo that he is and used it to fuck with him.
> 
> ...


Perfect. The only thing I'd add is that Perry Saturn was also a very talented wrestler (vastly underrated in the annals of history imo) who had a great look, was a technician through and through, and could rival most of the cruiserweights with his high flying ability; while Michael Nakazawa is Michael Nakazawa.


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Cult03 said:


> That's because he's often on TV with Kenny. Also, ratings don't actually matter in 2020.
> You're too old to be using zoomer and boomer unironically
> AEW viewers are internet goofs. They don't have casual fans.


AEW approximately have 200-300k causal viewers who don’t watch every week. Of course I’m basing this on the known facts.


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Chip Chipperson said:


> This is perfect.
> 
> If every major star you have is some jokey "Now you laugh" guy how can I ever invest in them having a serious feud? The "awesome" writing of Tony Khan truly on display here.
> 
> ...


of course this post is too long, but the general gist I got from skimming is you wonder how AEW are trying to get young people watching. This is based on what execs have said before during interviews. Of course, this might have changed since they said it; but at the end of the day, the Tiktok memes and the push for internet-based things tells me they’re aiming for the young market. I mean even if you look at their Instagram, it’s all memes.
But yeah, go off. And remember the key words: kinks. Once they find the winning formula to regularly go viral, oof.


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## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

optikk sucks said:


> AEW approximately have 200-300k causal viewers who don’t watch every week. Of course I’m basing this on the known facts.


You mean ex-viewers right?


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Cult03 said:


> You mean ex-viewers right?


possibly. But I anticipate an eventual return of thee fans. The same thing happened back in November, with those fans returning at the end of the year. But hey, I’m only speculating based on facts and not on any subjectivity.


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## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

optikk sucks said:


> possibly. But I anticipate an eventual return of thee fans. The same thing happened back in November, with those fans returning at the end of the year. But hey, I’m only speculating based on facts and not on any subjectivity.


You don't know that they are the same fans though. You can guess that they are, but you don't know and therefore can't say that they're "known facts". The whole ratings thing is flawed anyway. What if all of those fans now watch at their friends house?


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## Dizzie (Jun 22, 2019)

BlueEyedDevil said:


> I was super impressed by the intestinal fortitude Brandi showed after getting crushed into the guardrail to bravely come back out with that water bottle while still in excruciating pain so Cody could rehydrate himself. She soldiers on later in the evening ignoring the agony caused from the injuries she sustained taking the attention away from herself to fully support her brother-in-law. Bravo!


It's a shame that both semi final matches were tarnished imo by brandi "look at me" Rhodes, her insistence on getting TV time to please her own ego has hurt aew shows on quite a few occasions.

If she just has to get her face out their on TV then cody needs to go heel and have her as his manager, that's about as good as it's going to get in terms of damage limitation.


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Cult03 said:


> You don't know that they are the same fans though. You can guess that they are, but you don't know and therefore can't say that they're "known facts". The whole ratings thing is flawed anyway. What if all of those fans now watch at their friends house?


That’s why I said speculation. You’re absolutely right.


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

BlueEyedDevil said:


> I was super impressed by the intestinal fortitude Brandi showed after getting crushed into the guardrail to bravely come back out with that water bottle while still in excruciating pain so Cody could rehydrate himself. She soldiers on later in the evening ignoring the agony caused from the injuries she sustained taking the attention away from herself to fully support her brother-in-law. Bravo!


Cody/Allin and Dustin/Archer were originally taped to air on separate nights. Last 2-3 weeks worth of tapings combined down to Wednesday's show as AEW goes live again next week. So she wasn't selling during the Dustin/Archer match because that was supposed to be a week later.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Dizzie said:


> It's a shame that both semi final matches were tarnished imo by brandi "look at me" Rhodes, her insistence on getting TV time to please her own ego has hurt aew shows on quite a few occasions.
> 
> If she just has to get her face out their on TV then cody needs to go heel and have her as his manager, that's about as good as it's going to get in terms of damage limitation.


She thinks she is the Stephanie McMahon of this operation but fact is Stephanie was a great heel who was genuinely hated whilst Brandi has almost zero to offer.


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Brandi can be on my TV as much as she wants.


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

optikk sucks said:


> Brandi can be on my TV as much as she wants.


You can have hot women on TV who actually offer something as well. Wouldn't that be better?


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Chip Chipperson said:


> You can have hot women on TV who actually offer something as well. Wouldn't that be better?


I never thought of it like this in all honesty lol


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## Erik. (Mar 17, 2014)

I see Vince Russo said this was the best ever episode of Dynamite and also called the Manitoba Melee the best segment in wrestling since Total Nonstop Deletion. Which was 3 and a half years ago. 

Praised the amount of segments the show had building character and loved that they have plenty of big guys on the roster who are being kept apart.


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## Carter84 (Feb 4, 2018)




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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

I see a lot of Mox posts.

from my point of view - Ambrose came in as someone I was super hyped for in his teased feud with Foley. I hunted his old promos and tried to watch all his FCW stuff

then it didn’t happen and i was bummed - fast forward to his debut with shield, and he was back on top, exuding attitude, beating up everybody and cutting great promos. He was IMO the shield standout

up until their breakup - and never before was potential so squandered. You had a young, chip-on-his-shoulder promo guy, but they third-wheeled him and then midcarded him.

i honestly do not remember details of his title reigns or notable feuds. Lacklustre to the max - massive wasted potential.

is AEW Mox better? Hard to answer - he is older, and happier, lost his chip I would say. Good wife makes a guy calm down - so i doubt i’ll ever see the Mox i wanted.

but is he living up to his current potential? I would say so. As his potential is lower these days With the more chill outlook. Did he live up to it during his prime after the shield And his singles run in wwe?

only a madman would think so


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Erik. said:


> I see Vince Russo said this was the best ever episode of Dynamite and also called the Manitoba Melee the best segment in wrestling since Total Nonstop Deletion. Which was 3 and a half years ago.
> 
> Praised the amount of segments the show had building character and loved that they have plenty of big guys on the roster who are being kept apart.


It makes me laugh that because Vince Russo praises AEW that he is some kind of wrestling genius now. For 20 years he has been treated like the scum of pro wrestling but when he puts AEW over he suddenly knows his shit.

Jim Cornette said The Bubbly Bunch was the shits.


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## Piers (Sep 1, 2015)

They booked that tournament perfectly. The outcome of Archer vs Goldust made the final personal for Cody and the match itself was surprisingly good. Archer has been very solid so far.

They even managed to make Baker entertaining, I loved the practice segment and I was surprised to see Rebel in AEW.

I just wish they had waited a little before debuting Brodie Lee. The pandemic is seriously limiting what they can do with the Dark Order and he should have debuted in front of a crowd anyway.


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