# Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Old Thread: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/general-wwe/907817-official-dvd-match-show-discussion-thread.html

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I AIN'T DONE YET MOTHERFUKKAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!


Vladimir Kozlov Vs Ezekiel Jackson - ECW 05/01/2010

Let's hope THIS is the slugfest I was hoping their last match would be!

Well not so much a slugfest. Jackson is targeting the leg of Vlad, no doubt advice from Regal on the outside who will have advised Jackson to target a limb rather than go head to head with a guy as strong as Vladimir. Smart stuff and shows how good it is to have Regal on your side.

Kozlov then powers out and starts mauling Jackson while ignoring the leg stuff except for the odd shake here and there, which looks terrible tbh lol. Then Jackson MURDERS him with a clothesline :mark:.

Finisher from Zeke and this is done. Better than their previous match lol, but still not that good. LET THEM PUNCH EACH OTHER IN THE FACE DAMMIT.

Rating: *

CM Punk Vs Mark Henry - ECW 05/01/2010

Heel Punk Vs Face Henry. Not exactly the best set up, but hey, I'm not complaining that much!

Henry absolutely POWERING out of a waist lock at the start was :mark:. Punk gets a bunch of kicks in, then Henry grabs his leg and OH SHIT Punk is incredible as he desperately tries to escape while Henry holds on to the leg!!!

The power of Henry allows him to dominate the early going, but the cunning of Punk allow him to get in control. I love how they make Punk hitting a basic move like a neckbreaker seem like a HUGE struggle because of the sheer size and strength of Henry.

Damn, Henry takes on hell of a fucking bump off a kick, while he was on his knees! A near fall from it, but then as Punk starts throwing more kicks, Henry just gets MAD and everyone on the planet is glad that they aren't CM Punk!

Finish sees Gallows hit a ROUNDHOUSE KICK on Henry from the apron, which sends Henry right into a roundhouse kick from Punk! CM Punk is the finale winner of the Homecoming tournament to enter the battle royal next week!

Decent stuff. Henry as a heel and Punk as a face is where their real chemistry is, but they do a good job here anyway.

Rating: **1/2

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Fine, I'll add THE CAL SCALE here. Stop bugging me about it now, ok? Ok.

The Cal Scale

NO = -1
DUD-* = 0
*1/4-** = 0.5
**1/4-**3/4 = 1
***-***1/4 = 2
***1/2 = 3
***3/4 = 4
**** = 5
****1/4 = 6
****1/2 = 7
****3/4 = 8
***** = 9


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## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Old thread only lasted a couple of months :lmao


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## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Hahaha you actually did it I'm impressed.

I've seen a really damn good Matt Hardy vs Mark Henry match in ECW, but I can't remember if it was late 2008 or early 2009. I haven't seen it pop up in your reviews yet so I was just wondering if you happen to know which one I'm talking about.

Is 2004 pretty much the best year out of 2004-2008 for PPVs? Those are the 5 years I wasn't watching much wrestling so I missed stuff and had to watch after the fact. I've seen almost everything Eddie/Benoit from those years on PPV and the bigger Raw/Smackdown matches.


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## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Wow, the old thread lasted what, three months? 

Cal, I'm sorry to tell you but what exacly were you expecting out of a Kozlov/Zeke match? I know big guy slugfests are awesome, but Zeke only delievers with a better opponent and Kozlov isn't exacly a Mark Henry either. So yeah. :side:


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## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'd been meaning to make a new thread every since it hit 10,000 posts but kept forgetting .

The only Henry/Hardy match from ECW 09 was this one:

Matt Hardy Vs Mark Henry - ECW 06/01/2009

How awesome is Henry's theme? SUMBODY GUNNA GET THEY ASS KICKED. SUMBODY GUNNA GET THEY WIG SPLIT. BEAT EM UP BEAT EM UP BREAK HIS NECK BREAK HIS NECK.

Henry dominates from the start, but on the outside Hardy is able to send Henry knees first into the steel steps, then take advantage in the ring with a little bit of leg work before Henry powers his way back in control. I seem to recall leg work being a big part of their great PPV match the previous year, right? I should check that out at some point, been ages since I saw it.

Henry sells the great great while on offence, even though Hardy hadn't done anything to it for a while. No short term selling from the WWE's Strongest Man (this was 2008... so WSM will have been... Mariusz Pudzianowski, with Big Z the Arnold Strongman winner for like the billionth time in a row. Henry would have NEVER won the 2002 competition had Big Z and any other credible strongmen been involved. What was I talking about?)

Henry is fine on offence, nothing overly special as he has a habit of sitting in a nerve grip hold, but he dishes out some goodness any time he's cutting Matt Hardy off. And he's STILL selling the leg which is awesome, and Matt every now and then sees a chance to hit it even if it doesn't get him back on top.

Nice little finishing stretch, and Henry loses clean to a Twist of Fate! Well, Matt IS the champion after all! Good match, plenty to like.

Rating: ***1/4

They likely had at least one more in 08, as well as their great No Mercy match in 08 too. 

04 isn't very good at all for PPV's from what I remember.

Edit: I was expecting just that, A SLUGFEST. But we never got it, which is why I was disappointed with the 2 matches from them .


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## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Should all place a bet on how soon The Primer/HayleySabin/Cody/Obfuscation/Other reaches 1,000 posts in _this_ thread :side:


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## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I bet it'll be AFTER me. I gave up my title to him in the last thread and ALLOWED him to overthrow me. But I started coming back in the last month and worked my way up to second place BECAUSE I AM GOD.


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## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

I watched Punk/Lesnar + Cena/Bryan from SummerSlam this year. Both awesome matches.

I honestly can't pick one that I like the most overall. Punk/Lesnar was great in terms of a fight and storytelling & stuff but Cena/Bryan was great in terms of just straight-up wrestling and just technical wrassling. So both are equally as good but I give a slight edge to Cena/Bryan because DAT HEEL TURN AT THE END. :HHH2 rton2 :vince5


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## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Punk/Lesnar is still my MOTY.


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## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

WTF ?? The last thread started in like July :lmao

Calling it now the top post counts will belong to :
Cody
Cal
Me
CJack


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## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Last thread was fucking shit. ** 1/2*.

Anywhoways, since Cal can upload RAW 2004 in excellent quality, can we get the December Batista/HHH Vs Jericho/Benoit tags & the 10/11 six man tag from the UK that I remember being a piece of AWESOMENESS.

& for the 45372628th time, here's a Wrestlemania card prediction that seems to be a lock at this point;

Unification Match ~ WWE Champion Randy Orton Vs WHC John Cena Vs Royal Rumble Winner CM Punk
Control of the Company ~ Triple H Vs Daniel Bryan w/ Vince McMahon
The Streak ~ The Undertaker Vs Brock Lesnar

I mean, that card just makes the most sense. It just DOES.


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## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Last thread was fucking shit. ** 1/2*.
> 
> Anywhoways, since Cal can upload RAW 2004 in excellent quality, can we get the December Batista/HHH Vs Jericho/Benoit tags & the 10/11 six man tag from the UK that I remember being a piece of AWESOMENESS.
> 
> ...


I'll see if I have/can upload those matches for you...


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## Shepard (Apr 30, 2011)

Callamus said:


> I'd been meaning to make a new thread every since it hit 10,000 posts but kept forgetting .



I can't wait for you to forget again with this thread so i can swoop in and make a new one before you :side:


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## H (Aug 15, 2011)

DAT NEW THREAD. Last thread was cool, but clearly got gassed quickly. :rock
_________________________________

Hell in a Cell 2012

Alberto Del Rio vs Randy Orton - ***1/2
Team HellNo vs Rhodes Scholars - Tag Titles - **3/4
Kofi Kingston vs The Miz - Intercontinental Title - **1/4
Antonio Cesaro vs Justin Gabriel - US Title - **3/4
Rey Mysterio and Sin Cara vs PTP - **1/2
Big Show vs Sheamus - WHC - ****1/4
Eve vs Layla vs Kaitlyn - Divas Title - **
CM Punk vs Ryback - HIAC for the WWE Title - *3/4

ACK. So this is a two match show (one match show, depending on what people think of the opener). Show/Sheamus is the still FUCKING TITS, and I really enjoyed Orton/Del Rio. They really like for Orton to hit his RKO from outta nowhere, and he did here, with Del Rio missing his signature enziguri and Orton catching him on the way down. 

Everything else is so meh. Cesaro is of course really good - dat uppercut. Divas match had some fun things in it, but that fucking story they had. SHOOT ME PLEASE. 

I totally forgot about the Cena/AJ scandal. Sweet Jesus that was terrible. Remember this?









_______________

So, we discussed the gimmicks PPV idea near the end of the old thread and pretty much agreed that HIAC having it's own show pretty much kills the idea, and 2012 was pretty much the icing. It was unfortunate for WWE that Cena got hurt, because Cena/Punk inside the cell was probably to be the big blowoff match, but instead Cena went down and so heroically gave his spot to Ryback. 

Cena/Punk/Del Rio is easily the best HIAC match on any of the HIAC events. Show/Sheamus is easily the best non-HIAC match from any of the events. 

That wraps that up. Thinking about watching the Rock/Austin Wrestlemania trilogy. :mark:


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## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I have the tag match, but the two Elimination matches I have are from 06/14 and 08/02.


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## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I absolutely DO NOT want a 3-way Title match on Wrestlemania of any sort. With all the talent they can assemble for one show (Bryan, Punk, Cena, Orton, Taker, Lesnar, Sheamus, Del Rio, Ziggler, etc.) I don't want them to put together some shitty 3-way. I'm not gonna predict anything and ATF, I have no idea how you come across all these "locks" and definite matches that are gonna be on PPV. 

I'll go way outside the box and say we get Lesnar vs. Bryan for the WWE Title. :yes


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## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Last thread was fucking shit. ** 1/2*.
> 
> Anywhoways, since Cal can upload RAW 2004 in excellent quality, can we get the December Batista/HHH Vs Jericho/Benoit tags & the 10/11 six man tag from the UK that I remember being a piece of AWESOMENESS.


Ill upload the Jericho/Benoit vs Batista/HHH tag match (RAW 12/6/04) tonight, saves Cal some time


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## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Lesnar/Taker @ Mania = :mark:

Bryan/HHH @ Mania = :mark:

Don't really care what else takes place as long as these two matches happen. Throw in Punk/Cena and some other high profile match and I'm sold. 

Change of topic: Anyone ordering HIAC this weekend? I think I might. Haven't ordered a PPV since MITB (I went to SSlam live), but this one seems promising.


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## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

That Sheamus/Big Show match is so great. I was in shock at how good it was because I'm not a hue fan of either and thought the match would be just like Cena/Big Show. Glad I was wrong. 

However the match with THE MEGA CHAIR is one of the dumbest things I have ever seen.


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## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> I absolutely DO NOT want a 3-way Title match on Wrestlemania of any sort. With all the talent they can assemble for one show (Bryan, Punk, Cena, Orton, Taker, Lesnar, Sheamus, Del Rio, Ziggler, etc.) I don't want them to put together some shitty 3-way. I'm not gonna predict anything and ATF, I have no idea how you come across all these "locks" and definite matches that are gonna be on PPV.
> 
> I'll go way outside the box and say we get Lesnar vs. Bryan for the WWE Title. :yes


You shouldn't anyway. 8*D

I'm considering either a Benoit/Regal or a Angle/Taker project :hmm:


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## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> Change of topic: Anyone ordering HIAC this weekend? I think I might. Haven't ordered a PPV since MITB (I went to SSlam live), but this one seems promising.


I was gonna order it, then I learned I'll be working out of town so that went down the shitter. Which sucks because I'm like, really liking this card.

- Orton/Bryan has so much potential to be a top tier HIAC match, or least a top tier one from the PG era. If Orton is FINALLY able to figure out he's a heel and needs to work super aggressive against the much smaller Bryan, then it can be great. There's so many cool things they'd be able to pull off and make the match memorable. Imagine Bryan going for his signature suicide dive to the outside and he misses and goes head first into the cell. :mark: Imagine Bryan diving off for the headbutt attempt, but Orton catches him in mid-air for the RKO. :mark: Imagine all the shit they can do with steel steps and tables. T-bone suplexes, middle rope DDTs, superplexes and super back-suplexes, etc. Just give me SOMETHING better than their last two encounters. Unfortunately there's probably gonna be Big Show and/or Triple H shenanigans.

- Cena/Del Rio should be so good if Del Rio continues to work aggressive and attacks Cena's left arm. As long as Cena's able to sell it well and he doesn't go into SuperCena mode for the finish, I have confidence in this one. Crowd's gonne be red hot too.

- Shield/Usos/Rhodes Bros is gonna be madness. Absolutely pure fucking madness. Bodies will be flying everywhere, there' gonna be disaster kicks, superkicks, flying knees, spears, top rope splashes, shit's gonna be wild. I REALLY wish it was elimination, but I'm sure one fall will still be a great match.

- What's the rest of the card?  Really though, I don't care about Punk vs. Ryback/Heyman in the Cell at all. AJ/Brie just happened last month. Langston/Axel is on the pre-show so yeah. Is Real Americans vs. Los Matadores official? That could be fun time filler.


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## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I basically agree with everything you said about those three matches. I think Orton/Bryan has enormous potential, especially when you consider all of the variables (HBK being the biggest). I agree with Cena/ADR. Crowd should be on fire and Del Rio has been on a roll as far as in-ring performances go. Aggressive ADR = . I, too, wish the tag titles match was an elimination match, but it should still be utter chaos and tons of fun.

Don't care about Punk/Ryback at all, and I wish it wasn't HIAC because I fear that may cheapen the stip once Bryan/Orton happens. Where's the PPV taking place?


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## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Orton's record for HIAC events (in the cell, I mean) is so weird. 2009 against Cena is just so dreadful. So much dragging, and Orton was a tad over the top with his motions. I did like how Orton just choked Cena out and punted him for the win. Then in 2010, he gets in there with Sheamus and they did really well. Then the Henry match in 2011, which wasn't too bad. 

I'm concerned about Bryan in the cell. Just don't see him doing well in there.

Don't really know if Trips will get involved. Only if Show does, of which the odds are likely, so there you go.


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## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> Where's the PPV taking place?


Miami.


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## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

HIAC: Yeah don't really care. Tag titles match has potential but with the Uso cunts being involved it takes a lot of potential away. Orton/Bryan I have ZERO faith in because they have no chemistry together and Orton just isn't good any more. Outside of tag matches involving THE SHIELD (and his part in those matches honestly was minimal in terms of them being good), the guy hasn't done ANYTHING I've enjoyed since the Christian matches. Well the Goldust match, but that was Dustin. Orton sucks and Bryan has no chemistry with him. Doubt being inside a cell or HBK being a referee is gonna do ANYTHING for them. Cena/Del Rio... meh. I'm not high on Rio still, and Cena honestly outside of a couple of people doesn't do it for me any more. Could still be good but I'm not expecting much atm. Maybe low expectations will help with it. The rest of the card can fuck off too.


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## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Bryan has a mean streak that's pretty much made him adapt to any match type or circumstance over the years. He's been in countless Street Fights, Cage matches, hardcore matches, etc. over his career to where I think he's gonna be fine for his first time in the Cell. I'm more worried about Orton holding up his end, tbh. He REALLY needs to get more vicious and heelish.

Miami should be rockin. I expect the crowd to be 50/50 for Cena/Del Rio, since there's a good amount of latino folks.

Cal's just bein pissy. There's nothing wrong with the Usos, fellas.


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## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Iirc the last show that took place there was the 1st SD of the year, the one with the excellent Show/ADR LMS match.


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## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I think Bryan will be fine inside the Cell. He has proven to be pretty fearless when it comes to throwing his body around and taking a beating, so I can envision the suicide dive miss into the Cell and going to any lengths to prove himself as a worthy champion. As JE187 said, I'm more worried about Orton holding up his end of the bargain. 

I'd prefer Shield/Rhodes as well, Cal, but at least The Usos will provide some entertaining SPOTS.


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## Raw2003 (Dec 20, 2012)

My Cyber Sunday 2006 Review:







. 1. Umaga vs Kane
*Surprisingly the crowd was really into this one, it was a solid match and pretty enjoyable 3.5/5


2. Carlito vs Jeff Hardy- WWE Intercontinental Championship

* a Really Amazing match where both Wrestlers were given enough time, there were plenty of near falls and top quality moves, very enjoyable 4/5

3. Mickie James vs Lita, WWE Womens Championship Diva lumberjack Match
* a Decent both are capable of a lot better but it was a solid match and was enjoyable 3.4/5

4. Ric Flair & Roddy Piper vs Spirit Squad World Tag Team Championship
* a decent match not too much to say it was what you'd expect but it was still an enjoyable match to watch 3.5/5


5. Rated RKO vs D Generation X, Special Ref: Eric Bischoff
* a Really amazing match these 2 teams have always gelled we together and put on an entertaining match and having Bischoff as the ref just added to the excitement & entertainment value of the match, just brilliant 4.5/5

6. John Cena vs Big Show vs King Booker World Heavyweight Title Triple Threat Match
* a decent match not really all that entertaining until the final 5 minutes, a good finish but not worthy of closing the show 3.4/5, Now to the extras we have Flair & Piper partying with the Divas, a post match interview with Umaga & finally we have a Match the next night on RAW with Ric Flair & Roddy Piper defending their tag titles against Orton & Edge, Overall a Great show with decent extras 4.3/5 for me.


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## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Orton not holding up his end is exactly why I'm not looking forward to the cell match. Bryan is great but he and Orton don't have chemistry so it doesn't matter how good Bryan is or can be. He just isn't gonna have a great match with Orton. I hope I'm proven wrong, but I'm not expecting to be .

Just a quick friendly reminder TO NOT POST ANY FUCKING SPOILERS WITHOUT USING SPOILER TAGS. I do not want to know ANYTHING planned for the RR or WM 30. Ok?


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## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

You and I clearly never watched the same Cyber Sunday 06 dude :lol


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## Raw2003 (Dec 20, 2012)

ATF said:


> You and I clearly never watched the same Cyber Sunday 06 dude :lol


Well I'm just giving my opinion of it, just watched it back for the first time in 7 yrs and thought it was solid.


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## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Old thread gets *** for me. I guess it was decent for the time it got. 

I'm done with classes for the week, so once I get home, I'm finally gonna be able to watch my SummerSlam DVDs :mark:. Debating between 2001 and 2002 right now.

Oh, and has anyone seen the newest WM rumor?



Spoiler: MANIA



CENAWINSLOL :cena2 :cena3 :cena4 :cena5


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## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

New thread already? ffs! 

Excited for HQ 2004 shit! :mark:

And to comment on the Jake Roberts documentary now that I'm only 20 or so minutes from finishing it: Wow, he had a fucked up upbringing. I've heard people say bad things about him as a person but after hearing his story, I can't ever say a bad word about him because he was man enough to get out of this awful situation in his younger years and make something out of himself. He fucked up after that but 20 something years later, we are seeing him recover thanks to the great DDP and hopefully he does get his wish and...



Spoiler: Cal hates this



APPEARS IN THE 2014 ROYAL RUMBLE!



He should also get inducted into the Hall of Fame next year.


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## Bronx Bomber (May 31, 2007)

Random HBK ratings: 
HBK/Mankind Raw '97- ***1/2
HBK Bulldog ONO- ***
HBK/Taker RR'98- ***3/4
HBK/Jericho WM19- ****
HBK/Flair BB'03- ***

Really liking this HBK My Journey DVD. Seriously though, HBK/Taker can do no wrong. Every match between the two is just stellar. 


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## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Raw2003 said:


> Well I'm just giving my opinion of it, just watched it back for the first time in 7 yrs and thought it was solid.[/color]


I thought it sucked. You imo went a little too generous on some, like Jeff/Carlito and Lita/Mickie. Imo both sucked. Hard. DX/Rated RKO was the saving grace.


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## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Cover revealed for _The Best PPV Matches of 2013 _dvd:

http://www.wrestlingdvdnews.com/wwe-best-ppv-matches-2013-dvd-cover/53428/

Pretty sweet cover although a little misleading with so much attention to Punk, but in the end no one cares because the blu ray was cancelled in the U.S. :no:


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## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Why is :rock on the cover of something with the words "Best Matches" and "2013" on the cover?


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## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Punk there ain't no big issue tbh, since he was in imo the year's Top 3 matches (vs Taker, vs Lesnar and vs Cena)... but The Rock in the cover? Over at least one member of The Shield? Hell, not even Lesnar's there :lmao


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## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Cool cover. Punk better have at least three matches on that set. vs Taker/Cena/Brock.

If they put any of the Punk/Rock matches instead of one of the aforementioned matches fpalm


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## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cena wouldn't make any sense since it's for *PPVs*.  The other two will obviously make it, though. As will Royal Rumble with The Rock probably. :lol


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## Raw2003 (Dec 20, 2012)

Here's an amazing new DVD coming out http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00ES...2&redirect=true&ref_=as_li_ss_tl&tag=wdn0d-20 it's got 20 full RAW episodes including the 1st raw Austin Mcmahon dude love, the 15th anniversary show, Bret's return and many more in their entirely


Jack Evans 187 said:


> Cover revealed for _The Best PPV Matches of 2013 _dvd:
> 
> http://www.wrestlingdvdnews.com/wwe-best-ppv-matches-2013-dvd-cover/53428/
> 
> Pretty sweet cover although a little misleading with so much attention to Punk, but in the end no one cares because the blu ray was cancelled in the U.S. :no:


Looks great


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## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Punk vs. Cena was on RAW, brah. Won't be on there. I'm sure Royal Rumble vs. Rock will be the 3rd choice along with matches against Taker & Brock.


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## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Fuck me fpalm

I'm actually pretty sure Rock/Cena makes this set. Trips/Brock from Extreme Rules needs to be on there, imo.


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## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

If it's PPV, then they have to put dem 3 SummerSlam matches y'all know. Please?!


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## Raw2003 (Dec 20, 2012)

PGSucks said:


> Old thread gets *** for me. I guess it was decent for the time it got.
> 
> I'm done with classes for the week, so once I get home, I'm finally gonna be able to watch my SummerSlam DVDs :mark:. Debating between 2001 and 2002 right now.
> 
> ...


I'd say whatch 2001


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## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Considering it's just a 3 disc dvd, with no blu ray as of right now, and last year's edition had ONLY 11 matches, I have low hopes for this set and you know there's gonna be glaring omissions. All 3 Summerslam matches will not make it. Willing to bet there will be only one Shield match if you're lucky, that being Battleground. Del Rio vs. Ziggler won't be on there at all I'm guessing since they'll probably go with Punk/Jericho.


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## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Have a massive test later today, soo head out the library because I talked the girl with the higher grade in the class to help me who also is good looking rton2. catch you guys later

The top ppv of 13 cover is pretty badass, only complaint is they should have acknowledged ziggler/adr instead of the rock or something, I know there not high on the guy but as of October 24, adr/ziggler PB is still my MOTY runner up


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## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Don't give a flying monkey fuck who is on the cover or what it looks like. The cover doesn't influence my perchase at all. I won't be getting it because Fremantle are thieving cunts .


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## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^ Forgot to edit that post, that was horrible grammar 

Yea I will just wait till watchwrestling has it


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## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Punk/Jericho? Plz no. If Punk/Jericho makes it over Punk/Taker or Punk/Lesnar then GTFO. Del Rio/Ziggler should be there, and the Shield EC match, but yeah, the Battleground match will likely be up there. They'll probably throw Del Rio/Show from the Rumble on it, and we'll see what comes later this year.


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## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Last thread was solid, lots of good ramblings from yeah1993 and some hilarious Cal reviews, plus funnyfaces clash reviews and Jack Evans doing half the Kane set then stopping before he gets to the good stuff  ***3/4 from me.


When the flying fuck is Zayn gonna get a call up? With as thin as the roster is right now, you're telling me they can't find a "spot" for him?

If I'm making a Best PPV Matches of 2013 set, I'm going with
1. Punk vs Taker from WM
2. Punk vs Lesnar from SS
3. Bryan vs Cena from SS
4. Del Rio vs Ziggler from PB
5. Rhodes Bros vs Shield from Battleground
6. Cena vs Henry from MitB
7. Shield vs Usos from MitB
8. Christian vs ADR from SS
9. Rising Stars MitB match
10. Trips vs Lesnar from ER (not a personal fave of mine but I know I'm in the minority)

Then have matches like Rock/Cena, Bryan/Orton NoC, and some other bigger name matches that in reality suck but in WWE universe terms are "Best"


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## H (Aug 15, 2011)

There was a report posted in a thread (in General or Raw section) that said that he is liked but they want him to stop climbing the ropes and pandering to the crowd because Vince hates that. 

:kobe

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/gener...-asks-wwe-if-he-can-move-texas-zayn-news.html


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## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Hahaha. I'll go back to the Kane set someday, long after the Del Rio project is finished. 

Del Rio/Christian will be the one left off the PPV Matches set. Here's my predictions considering they rarely put more than 4 matches per disc on these:

Punk/Rock from the Rumble
Elimination Chamber Match
Punk/Taker from Mania
Cena/Rock from Mania

Trips/Lesnar Steel Cage
Punk/Jericho from Payback
Either Del Rio/Ziggler or 3 stages of hell from Payback
MAYBE Cena/Henry from MITB
WWE Title Money in the Bank match

Punk/Lesnar
Cena/Bryan
Shield/Rhodes Bros from Battleground OR one of the Orton/Bryan matches is they don't put the HIAC match on
Orton/Bryan HIAC OR Cena/Del Rio

These are NOT my picks by any means, this is just what I'm assuming WWE will put on looking at their recent trends.


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## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> There was a report posted in a thread (in General or Raw section) that said that he is liked but they want him to stop climbing the ropes and pandering to the crowd because Vince hates that.
> 
> :kobe
> 
> http://www.wrestlingforum.com/gener...-asks-wwe-if-he-can-move-texas-zayn-news.html



Yea because going to the top ropes and pandering to the crowd never worked out for Rey Mysterio. And as far as pandering to the crowd, no one beats Cena. He is CONSTANTLY looking out to the crowd and giving those dumb looks. I like Cena but If Vince actually doesn't like pandering to the crowd he must HATE Cena.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Hahaha. I'll go back to the Kane set someday, long after the Del Rio project is finished.
> 
> Del Rio/Christian will be the one left off the PPV Matches set. Here's my predictions considering they rarely put more than 4 matches per disc on these:
> 
> ...


I have a feeling their putting HHH/Lesnar mania on it, its the only one haitch won so yea, I dont see that being left of

it will probably be

punk/rock rumble
shield/superfriends ec
punk/taker

hhh/lesnar II
something from ex
aj/Katylin PB 
ziggler/ADR PB

mitb all stars
cena/bryan
punk/lesnar
orton/bryan noc
shield/rhodes bros. battleground

It needs a WHC match too so idk


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Still haven't seen Punk/Jericho from Payback. Is it really that bad?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

It feels like it finishes, then continues for another 15 minutes. Match on the whole feels long, and it's just a lot of moves. I was really excited at the start, but the match had no flavor.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> Still haven't seen Punk/Jericho from Payback. Is it really that bad?


Nah. Both men had 0 story to tell (the feud was non-existent and the build up was just about Punk's return in his hometown) and all they really did was a bunch of MOVEZ and finisher spams that Chicago jizzed for, but nothing illogical or Davey-bad, far from it. It's a very fun, if all over the place match. They did improvise on the no-story scene by simply turning Punk's usual sloppiness and making a "he isn't into it" case, which was odd but whatever. That was just a substory though.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

So Punk's sloppiness was masked as ring rust? LOL. I might have to watch this just to see why it gets shat on so heavily. Didn't Meltzer rate it super high?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Lady Killer said:


> So Punk's sloppiness was masked as ring rust? LOL. I might have to watch this just to see why it gets shat on so heavily. Didn't Meltzer rate it super high?


Meltzer rates everything that sucks super high.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Lord Meltzer gave it ****1/2 iirc.

I in my view don't think it remotely deserves the (obviously ignorant) universal praise it gets outside of the WF, but it too doesn't deserve the drizzling shits reputation around here either.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

redskins25 said:


> I have a feeling their putting HHH/Lesnar mania on it, its the only one haitch won so yea, I dont see that being left of
> 
> it will probably be
> 
> ...


Well they put HHH/Lesnar on the Thy Kingdom Come blu ray so they'll probably drop that for the Cage match. The Elimination Chamber match is pretty much a lock though. It's been on every set the past two years. They like their gimmick matches. I completely forgot about AJ/Kaitlyn, yeah that will make it too for the Divas to be included. Great match so that's ok.



The Lady Killer said:


> Still haven't seen Punk/Jericho from Payback. Is it really that bad?


Yeah I didn't like it whatsoever. It's just a lazy battle of finishers with no sense of direction or story whatsoever. In the beginning it was submissions and rest holds, then it's all over the place with no real climax, it just keeps going and going with the same shit. It's a DUD for me.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Lady Killer said:


> So Punk's sloppiness was masked as ring rust? LOL. I might have to watch this just to see why it gets shat on so heavily. Didn't Meltzer rate it super high?


Yea he gave it over **** I think.

They used a ring rust story because Punk had been off for a while, they needed him back to sell a PPV in Chicago, and Jericho was the only credible Main Eventer not engaged in a feud.


I really liked it the first time I saw it, but on rewatches it got worse and worse, the hot hot crowd tricks you when you watch it live and are psyched to see Punker back in action.

I think I gave it **3/4 on my 3rd and final watch. Not horrendous, but not up to snuff for 2 guys who put on an absolute masterpiece at WM28.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I think I'll still give it a go. I do enjoy hot crowds. Were they as hot during it as they were at MITB 2011?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Same rating as cjack here. It's not bad, but it relies just on fun and crowd, but you'll love it if you enjoy those finisher fest-like matches you see from Davey Richards. But it was surely a dissapointment. WM 28 rocked, Extreme Rules rocked. Hell, they had a (at the time) MOTYC the night after RR this year. Oh well.

And no, not MITB hot. ER hot at best. At the beggining, it's actually kinda dead.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

My top 10 from 2013 so far 

1. Punk/ Lesnar SS. ****3/4
2. Ziggler/ Del Rio payback. ****1/4
3. Cena/ Bryan SS ****1/4
4. Punk/ Taker WM ****1/4
5. Punk/ Cena RAW ****
6. HHH/ Lesnar cage ****
7. Punk/ Jericho Payback ***3/4
8. Ziggler/ Del Rio ME. ***3/4
9. Bryan/ Cesaro Raw ***3/4
10. Christian/ Del Rio ***3/4


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> Still haven't seen Punk/Jericho from Payback. Is it really that bad?




Gets too much hate I think it's worth a watch, the match was pointless that's why I think it gets hate.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Kurt Angle & Davey Richards are ATF's two favorite wrestlers. It's SO obvious. :lol


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I'm still confused about Meltzer rating Punk/Rock from the Rumble **** :lmao


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

He was super high on Cena/Rock matches too iirc.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Kurt Angle & Davey Richards are ATF's two favorite wrestlers. It's SO obvious. :lol


I don't even talk about Richards that often, you know :vince

Though I do have a thing for talking about guys I dislike a lot. That's my tic I guess 

How about we talk about another match that gets undeserved hate - this year's E. Chamber?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Batista/HHH Vs Jericho/Benoit tag


*Chris Jericho & Chris Benoit vs. Triple H & Batista (RAW 12/6/04)*

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-m...ple-h-batista-raw-12-6-04-a.html#post25510785


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I laughed so hard at the ref bumps in Rock/Punk II. The second ref overselling worse than Ziggler. :lmao


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> He was super high on Cena/Rock matches too iirc.


I'm in the minority that thinks Cena/ Rock I was actually pretty good. Easily rocks best match since his 2011 return.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I don't even know which was Rock's best match since his return. But that's like picking the best turd out of a bucket of shit anyway so who gives a fuck?


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

ATF said:


> I don't even talk about Richards that often, you know :vince
> 
> Though I do have a thing for talking about guys I dislike a lot. That's my tic I guess
> 
> How about we talk about another match that gets undeserved hate - this year's E. Chamber?


Boy do I AGREE on that one. I will say nothing special happens in the first half, but once Henry steps in and dominates it's a pretty awesome match. His monstrous offense, selling, and laying everyone out after being eliminated is wonderful. Then the final 3-way with Orton/Jericho/Swagger just rocks your socks off. My rating dropped to *** 1/2 on my last watch, but it gets shit on for no reason. I think people are just mad that Henry didn't win.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

2013 PPV cover is very nice. Cool theme. As for what's actually going to be on it, a whole bunch of crap most likely. Raw has been where it's at for top quality matches this year if you ask me so I'll be more interested in that set. For this one we're probably likely to get a bunch of shit and repeats. If I had to guess:

1 Punk/Rock match
Rock/Cena
1 EC
Taker/Punk
HHH/Brock Mania
Punk/Brock SS
Bryan/Cena SS
Punk/Jericho PB
1 Orton/Bryan match
Ziggler/ADR PB
1 MITB match
1-2 Shield matches

I hope they surprise us and DONT put a bunch of repeats on there but I'm not too hopeful. If it has the Shield 6 man from EC and Brock/Trips cage though I might consider it. Above all else hopefully when it gets released it reduces the price of the Best of 2012 set so I can pick that up.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I enjoyed Rock/Cena (WM28) a lot. If Meltzer gave it a good rating, it's deserved.



Cactus Jack said:


> I really liked it the first time I saw it, but on rewatches it got worse and worse, the hot hot crowd tricks you when you watch it live and *are psyched to see Punker back in action.*


I guess that explains why I realized that it sucks on the same night it happened.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

I'm a fan of Rock/Cena I. I'm pretty much a fan of every and anything that happened at Mania 28 because it was by far the best wrestling experience I've ever had and I can't separate my bias. I have even warmed to Punk/Jericho considerably since I was too exhausted to pay any attention during the show itself. Orton/Kane is a hidden gem imo, it often gets overlooked. Mania 28 is definitely a GOAT Mania for me and Rock/Cena was a very very special moment. The match isn't horrible by any means either, just a bit too long.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

That End of an Era match is a polarizing motherfucker. Every time I watch it my feelings can fluctuate, it's the ultimate WWE main event style match. On the first watch I thought it was one of the greatest matches I have ever seen but I think it'll be one of those matches that we'll end up nitpicking to death and not able to have enough fun with what they watch. Triple H ruled, Undertaker ruled, HBK was HBK, I'm a fan. 

It's no Punk-Jericho though. That match is something else.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

HIAC >>>>>>

Honestly, that match had everything I look for in a match:

1. 4 years of storyline arc coming to a head
2. Emotion out the wazoo
3. Logic
4. Brutality (necessary in that environment tbh)
5. Crowd involvement


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Cal you need to make more videos because this one was hilarious: 






*posting it to give it more exposure. 8*D 



The Lady Killer said:


> Change of topic: Anyone ordering HIAC this weekend? I think I might. Haven't ordered a PPV since MITB (I went to SSlam live), but this one seems promising.


Nope. Nothing on the card appeals to me. I don't think I'll even watch it tbh - because to watch it I'll have to stream it because I'm useless when it comes to downloading things, and the last time I tried to stream a PPV it totally failed so I might not even bother this time.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Thanks lol . Planning on doing one about WADE BARRETT next week.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

^^^^^ I appreciate the Taker shirt, Cally. Big Cal marking for Big Mark... :side:

By the way, I absolutely did not intend to start another Trips/Taker WM27/28 discussion with my previous post lol.

I'm debating getting HIAC, TLK. I get paid tomorrow and I've been studying pretty hard this week so I might treat myself. We'll see how I feel on the day although I'm thinking keeping the money for Survivor Series might be the better option, especially if GAME ends up having a match.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Watched it for the third time now and never paid attention to it but lol @ the spinner belt laying there. :lol

On the subject of WM28, HIAC, Cena/Rock and Jericho/Punk are all great matches. Kane/Orton is the solid undercard match that gets overlooked. The rest can go, though.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

True, S. Series might be worth saving for if you're tight on money, but after two DUD PPVs, I think WWE needs to (and will) deliver this Sunday.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Callamus said:


> Thanks lol . Planning on doing one about WADE BARRETT next week.


Why Barrett? Dammit Cal. Do one for *BOOKAH* instead _(don't ever actually do the Barrett one because it's unfair and sadic to hate on that guy)_


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

The Lady Killer said:


> True, S. Series might be worth saving for if you're tight on money, but after two DUD PPVs, I think WWE needs to (and will) deliver this Sunday.


Somebody needs to blade in the cell. That will make it all worth it. Watch it be Heyman :lol.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Starbuck said:


> ^^^^^ I appreciate the Taker shirt, Cally. Big Cal marking for Big Mark... :side:


Only wore the 'Taker shirt because I couldn't find the one for my show . But now I have 3 new ones that I just got made so yey .



Choke2Death said:


> Watched it for the third time now and never paid attention to it but lol @ the spinner belt laying there. :lol


Mu wrestling hating Uncle bought me that Spinner Belt as a joke present at Christmas a few years back. Figured I might as well use it :lmao. I also randomly have a spinner belt clock too, still in the box never opened :lmao. My family buy me some dumb shit :lmao.



ATF said:


> Why Barrett? Dammit Cal. Do one for *BOOKAH* instead _(don't ever actually do the Barrett one because it's unfair and sadic to hate on that guy)_


Oh I'll get to Booker T. But Barrett shall be done first!


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Oh and btw, prepare to take on the hate from YTubers when you get to guys like Rock and Booker :lol

You should also do a Top 5 Reasons I Love... series, though it is more fun to shit on than praise


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I don't plan on just doing top 5 reasons I hate videos. I'll be mixing it up. Doing one on my DVD collection this week (was hoping today but nope, no time to record lol). I'm only really putting vids on youtube as a way to advertise my site and my other videos on blip .

Oh man, I didn't even THINK of a Rock video. Though I do have a Rock hat that my dad found on the bus... oh the possibilities!!!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Oh hey new thread.

MENG MENG MENG


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> I enjoyed Rock/Cena (WM28) a lot. If Meltzer gave it a good rating, it's deserved.
> 
> 
> 
> I guess that explains why I realized that it sucks on the same night it happened.


Oh come on dude, I'm not a blind Punk mark, I happen to enjoy him now because he is one of the few bright spots on a ridiculously thin roster. I feel the same way about Ziggler, Sheamus, etc. My true favorites are all either dead (Benoit and Eddie) retired (Foley, Bret Hart, Vader) or only wrestle a few times a year (Brock, Rey, Taker). I'm not stupid, I know if Punk was on the roster in 2004 he wouldn't be above the lower mid card. But this isn't 2004, I have to have someone that interests me, so Punk, Bryan, Henry, Ziggler and Cesaro are the guys I pull for these days. I like Cena and heel Orton too, but rooting for them almost feels like being a Patriots/Miami Heat/Yankees fan, unless you've been rooting for them since day one.


On another topic, what's everyone's favorite Mr. Perfect match that doesn't involve Bret Hart or Flair on Loser Leaves Raw?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Does it have to be Perfect via the gimmick or can it be that excellent match vs Nick Bockwinkel that went 60 minutes? b/c that's basically my answer either way.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Just watched Vince/Stephanie from No Mercy 2003, actually a fun match :lmao never really thought about that but Vince knows how to work the crowd in his matches really good. Now I want to watch Vince/Gowen, Vince/Punk and Vince/Shane.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

I don't mind Barrett, but I want to see a Cal video on Barrett just because of how much Cal hates him. :lol

Rock video would be even better because of all the Rock fans.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Vince vs Steph is amazing.

omg Vince vs Punker too. One of the best moments of last year. So damn molten.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Does it have to be Perfect via the gimmick or can it be that excellent match vs Nick Bockwinkel that went 60 minutes? b/c that's basically my answer either way.


Damnit, I should have included that one too. I own that match on the Perfect set and it's pretty amazing. I wonder how many of today's wrestling fans can appreciate a match like that, where there are tons of real submissions and actual "wrestling", not Sports Entertainment. The final minutes in that Showboat match are as intense as any you will find in wrestling, Hennig busted open trying to hold on while Bock the wily vet is trying to teach the young Buck a lesson. I'm not one of those people that think one or the other is better, I like 80s stuff as much as I do modern matches, a good match is a good match no matter the era.

I'm just trying to find some new Mr. Perfect stuff to watch,

Edit :mark: at Vince vs Punk. Love when Vince is standing over the belt with a kendo stick daring Punk to come in. Aside from Vaders come back squash of Slater, that was probably my second biggest mark out moment of 2012.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Never seen Vince/Steph but I can only imagine :lmao


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Oh come on dude, I'm not a blind Punk mark, I happen to enjoy him now because he is one of the few bright spots on a ridiculously thin roster. I feel the same way about Ziggler, Sheamus, etc. My true favorites are all either dead (Benoit and Eddie) retired (Foley, Bret Hart, Vader) or only wrestle a few times a year (Brock, Rey, Taker). I'm not stupid, I know if Punk was on the roster in 2004 he wouldn't be above the lower mid card. But this isn't 2004, I have to have someone that interests me, so Punk, Bryan, Henry, Ziggler and Cesaro are the guys I pull for these days. I like Cena and heel Orton too, but rooting for them almost feels like being a Patriots/Miami Heat/Yankees fan, unless you've been rooting for them since day one.


What's your point? I'm not a blind Punk hater either. What I meant is that my indifference towards his existence causes me to see things for what they are easier compared to his hardcore marks (or haters for that matter). For instance, I thought Payback was totally shit when it was over and conversely, I thought very highly of both the Taker and Brock matches once they were over.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> Damnit, I should have included that one too. I own that match on the Perfect set and it's pretty amazing. I wonder how many of today's wrestling fans can appreciate a match like that, where there are tons of real submissions and actual "wrestling", not Sports Entertainment. The final minutes in that Showboat match are as intense as any you will find in wrestling, Hennig busted open trying to hold on while Bock the wily vet is trying to teach the young Buck a lesson. I'm not one of those people that think one or the other is better, I like 80s stuff as much as I do modern matches, a good match is a good match no matter the era.
> 
> I'm just trying to find some new Mr. Perfect stuff to watch,
> 
> Edit :mark: at Vince vs Punk. Love when Vince is standing over the belt with a kendo stick daring Punk to come in. Aside from Vaders come back squash of Slater, that was probably my second biggest mark out moment of 2012.


I have to own the Hennig set just for that match. All the rest + doc too, but WWE including that piece is fabulous. Great to see something like that get appreciation. And timelines are timelines. Good wrestling comes from it all.

Vader's return. Haha. Brilliant. DDP & Backlund showing up too was on the same level for me.

Punk vs Vince was one of those moments that just clicked in a mega way & the fans latched on. Vince was effective as ever and in a face role of all things, while Punk was rolling as the dick heel. Loved the characters, loved the "match", loved the moment.



The Lady Killer said:


> Never seen Vince/Steph but I can only imagine :lmao


you HAVE to see it. WWE drama at its finest.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Tazz's commentary is Steph/Vince is something that has always stuck with me. "GO ON GIRL! GO ON!" :lol There's also an awesome near fall in the match too where it really looks like Steph is going to win. Fun match.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Punk vs Vince was great. Vince puts in a hell of a performance and the pop Ryback gets when he saves Vince at 3:45 was star worthy. Back when Ryback actually looked promising...






Just watching it again and hearing JR on commentary :mark: 4:15 was classic JR.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I was going to post a bunch of pictures of the Miz's face to annoy Cal until I realised:

A) I hate his face more than death.
B) every picture of his face is an annoying picture of his face (seriously tell me you don't want to die while searching 'he Miz' in google images). 

----

Wade Barrett is so much worse than Booker is comical to pretend otherwise. I don't even see how Booker's bad....at all (as a wrestler - he's a pretty......'iffy' commentator). Barrett should only be loved by scientists and doctors looking for an insomniac cure. Or people who are watching him chronologically and haven't gotten past the first month of when the Nexus started.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> What's your point? I'm not a blind Punk hater either. What I meant is that my indifference towards his existence causes me to see things for what they are easier compared to his hardcore marks (or haters for that matter). For instance, I thought Payback was totally shit when it was over and conversely, I thought very highly of both the Taker and Brock matches once they were over.


Lol you misunderstood man, I wasn't saying you were a blind Punk hater, I was just saying I'm not the type of person who loves anything and everything Punk does. That's a good phrase, indifference to his existence. Kind of how I feel about ADR and Barrett, sadly. It's just a mildly entertaining finisher fest with no substance and sloppy work. I'll take Rock/Cena I over it any day.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Agreed. Never knew what people (Pyro) saw in Barrett.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

^ Pyro's over the top love for Barrett is hilarious. He hates on guys like Sheamus, Bryan, Orton and calls them uncharismatic but loves Barrett and fantasizes about him being a World Champion. Makes zero sense.



Yeah1993 said:


> I was going to post a bunch of pictures of the Miz's face to annoy Cal until I realised:
> 
> A) I hate his face more than death.
> B) every picture of his face is an annoying picture of his face (seriously tell me you don't want to die while searching 'he Miz' in google images).


Here you go... and Cal too. (one of the first things that came up after searching "he miz" )


(changed size because it annoys me too, lol. Click if you wanna punch your screen!)



> Wade Barrett is so much worse than Booker is comical to pretend otherwise. I don't even see how Booker's bad....at all (as a wrestler - he's a pretty......'iffy' commentator). *Barrett should only be loved by scientists and doctors looking for an insomniac cure.* Or people who are watching him chronologically and haven't gotten past the first month of when the Nexus started.


:lmao



> Lol you misunderstood man, I wasn't saying you were a blind Punk hater, I was just saying I'm not the type of person who loves anything and everything Punk does. That's a good phrase, indifference to his existence. Kind of how I feel about ADR, sadly. It's just a mildly entertaining finisher fest with no substance and sloppy work. I'll take Rock/Cena I over it any day.


Ah yeah, my response to you was just a tongue-in-cheek comment. (not the one you quoted, the one before)


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Cal 1 - The Miz 0.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

:lmao Vince with a total disregard for his body, even at age 69, or however old he is. Jumping over the commentary at Punk. :

Heyman begging Vince for mercy is so :lol And apparently he just dies from that one slap he took.

And fucking Cole. Punk hits the low blow. "Oh, AN UPPERCUT!" At least JR corrected him.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I swear, if WWE wants to do some serious ratings, take away Miz's god awful talk show "the most must see show in blah blah blah" and instead just have Miz come out and while all the fans get to vote on who gets to punch Miz in the face this week. Miz: The Most Must Punch Face in WWE History!

Tell me you guys wouldn't be all over that. They'd have to call Regal up from NXT because I think every real wrestling fan is dying to see Miz eat a nice stiff knee trembler in the grill.


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

I completely didn't notice there was a new thread. With that said, I'm going to do an In Your House project, all 28 of them.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

A Barrett video would be hilarious. Even a Rock video (I'm a fan but Cal is always funny when he bashes the Rock ).

Just read the Kurt Angle vs Rock NM 2000 review in Cal's site to see what I mean :lmao


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I'm down for any kind of asskicking with Miz on the receiving end, especially if Miz's dad is there not giving a shit.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I like Wade. Don't see how he's bad like some think, so that's a thought process which goes both ways. I feel like the company could showcase him more as a "rugged" worker, tbf. Throw more strikes and just be nasty.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

^ That'd be fine, but as it is he bores me to tears.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Remember that "fans revenge strap match" from TNA between Joe and Jarrett? Have that. Every week. With Miz.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

The Primer said:


> I like Wade. Don't see how he's bad like some think, so that's a thought process which goes both ways. I feel like the company could showcase him more as a "rugged" worker, tbf. Throw more strikes and just be nasty.


Agreed. Don't see why people find Barrett "bad". He's a mediocre worker but he gets the job done when he needs to (Orton 2010 matches aside when he was truly bad in the ring), and even then his mic work more than makes up for it and the fact he carried the Nexus angle to the heights it went speaks volume to that and his charisma (which isn't huge, but it's there).

I think people, especially in this thread, struggle to get past the fact he's not good in the ring and I think that's where all the "boring" stuff stems from. Oh well, this thread is mostly about IN-RING WORKZ anyway, so it makes sense. Then again, I have seen some say they don't think his mic work is anything special either, so to each his own I suppose.

All that being said, I very much look forward to Cal's video on Barrett. I'm sure it'll be awesome!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cal, nobody wants to remember that Joe vs Jarrett strap match.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Speaking of Miz, is he the worst Wrestlemania main eventer ever or what?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That's...kind of an unusual question to ask. He's had one match.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I mean, as a consistent worker throughout his career is he worse than say.... SID (even though I'm a Sid guy)?

Excluding Lawrence Taylor of course.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'd say it's just easier to compare the match with all the other main events and see how it ranks there. Which would be low. Very low.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Best Goldust SINGLES match? As the Goldust character, so not just Dustin .


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> On another topic, what's everyone's favorite Mr. Perfect match that doesn't involve Bret Hart or Flair on Loser Leaves Raw?


Henning :mark: LOVED THAT GUY #5 fave all-time he NEED more lovin, flair/Perfect raw 93 is my favoite Henning/Perfect match in general, I like it better than both Bret's. Two of the all-time favs tiring the house down :mark: ( Jesus Ziggler, Flair, Henning ? I most have a fetish for beach blonde guys ? :lmao


Corporate KingOfKings said:


> That End of an Era match is a polarizing motherfucker. Every time I watch it my feelings can fluctuate, it's the ultimate WWE main event style match. On the first watch I thought it was one of the greatest matches I have ever seen but I think it'll be one of those matches that we'll end up nitpicking to death and not able to have enough fun with what they watch. Triple H ruled, Undertaker ruled, HBK was HBK, I'm a fan.
> It's no Punk-Jericho though. That match is something else.


Dont want to turn this into another hhh/taker debate, this match fluctuates for me MORE than any other for some reason. I have watched it more than any other match in the past 2-3 years for some reason. I always think its good but I go from its :mark: ***** to its ok every time. I tried to watch it again in early October because the streak DVD was being taken off and I couldn't finish it, idk if its bad or Ive seen it so many times I'm tired of it


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Shoooot. Off the top of my head I'm very big on the Regal matches from 2010 & the Sheamus matches from 2009.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Best Goldust SINGLES match? As the Goldust character, so not just Dustin .


Hmm. That's a good one. The Regal match I saw from ECW was fantastic. If we are talking early days Goldust, his match with Razor at the Royal Rumble was excellent. And that Piper match at Mania, man, I don't even know what to say about that one hahaha. It started off great and then the OJ chase happened :lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Piper match is top notch. Didn't even process that as I was going into his '96. Even the Undertaker matches are blurry for me. Wouldn't mind a run through to see what I like. In regards to everything; not just Undertaker matches. Worked vs Bret in '96 & '97 too.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Undertaker/Goldust matches were all disappointing. The two never clicked .


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Callamus said:


> Best Goldust SINGLES match? As the Goldust character, so not just Dustin .


People underrate/overlook his 1996. Good series with Savio Vega, Ahmed Johnson (KOTR or something match I though was very good), Razor Ramon and Taker. And that goddamn awesome Piper brawl. That could be the answer. Could be whatever the best Regal match is, too (8/12/10? One of them in 09 [IDR those too well]?). I felt like mentioning that his 90s is nowhere near as bad as some people think it is. Even in 98/99; Shamrock matches, Val Venis matches, Marc Mero matches, and OTHAZ.

EDIT - I LIKED THE TAKER MATCHES. MORE THAN CAL! ACHIEVEMENT UNLOCKED. THIS WASN'T SUPPOSED TO BE IN CAPS BUT I AM NOT RE-TYPING IT.

EDIT2 - ooooh I really like a Bret/Goldust from 97 w/ Bret working the leg. And there's a great Lawler/Dust where Lawler is a jerk.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Do you know the dates of those Bret and lawler matches ?

Sandrone I see you on do you know the date of christian/sandow me ?


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

google'd "bret hart vs goldust" and it came up with 7/7/97 and 9/22/97; I think it was 9/22/97. Don't think I saw the other one. Not sure at all, though. I watched absolute dozens of not-Dustin Goldust matches last year in the span of a month and they can't all stick out to me. Lawler match is 5/26/97.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

redskins25 said:


> Do you know the dates of those Bret and lawler matches ?
> 
> Sandrone I see you on do you know the date of christian/sandow me ?


July 3rd, 2013.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

You know something we don't talk about in here enough? Tag matches.


What are some of your guys favorite straight 2 on 2 tag matches? I'm in the mood for a good hot old school style tag.

Think I'll watch the Harts vs Demolition tag from Summerslam 1990, unless someone on here gives me a better suggestion. Just watched Harts vs Killer Bees (glorious) and Harts vs Bulldogs (splendid) Brainbusters vs Rockers (excellent) Rockers vs Harts (awesome) and Midnight Express vs Rock n Roll Express Mid South


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Royal Rumble 2002 review should be up by tomorrow morning, really depends on of I can get my ass outta bed an hour early to finish before school. 

Anyways I'll be watching a lot more after next week, been quite swamped the past few weeks. Once I finish RR 2002 I think I'll get a shitty KOTR 2002 over with. Just one more step to SS 2002!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I know I'll dig the Taker vs Goldust matches whenever I relive em. Just saw Goldust vs Lawler happens in '97 so :mark: if I can find it.

Who doesn't talk about tag matches? I bring it up 9/10 along with various plugs towards Meng. So, it's often. Prefer tags over singles as it is.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> I know I'll dig the Taker vs Goldust matches whenever I relive em. Just saw Goldust vs Lawler happens in '97 so :mark: if I can find it.
> 
> Who doesn't talk about tag matches? I bring it up 9/10 along with various plugs towards Meng. So, it's often. Prefer tags over singles as it is.




I didn't say we didn't talk about tags in here, I said we don't discuss them ENOUGH 

I love tags too. More than singles? I don't know, I like them both the same, as long as they are good. Duh. I just get in moods for a hot tag matches sometimes and binge on them for days. 

Think I will watch the Survivor Series 2002 Elimination Tag, Edge/Mysterio vs Los Guerreros vs Angle/Benoit. The finishing stretch in that match is just off the charts insanity.

Speaking of Meng, got any good Islanders or FoF tag reccomendations?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That's a fun one. Watched it a ton. Go with the six man tables from that show too. The hilarious Rico botch is cut, so it looks like a near perfect match too.

This feels like a nice time to plug what is no doubt the most underrated match of 2008 - Kane & Batista vs Great Khali & MVPorter from Smackdown 2/29. It's actually really good. And that's a comment you'll not hear with MVP for most of his career.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Royal Rumble 2002 review should be up by tomorrow morning, really depends on of I can get my ass outta bed an hour early to finish before school.


Interested in reading your thoughts on Regal/Edge from that event. That match would have easily stole the show if Rock/Jericho didn't rule so much.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Watching that entire raw episode with Bret/Goldust 9/22

:lmao @ this hbk/taker segment, hbk to taker " Do you know who the hell I am ?.... Deadman unless you are a real Hot Mama, which you aint ! I dont not lay down for any one , Gotta love 97 hbk :hbk1


Cant talk about tag matches without hbk/scsa vs. owen/davey GOAT tag


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Dudleys vs Spike & Tazz is a total blast too. Seriously underrated sprint. Solely b/c I fear the length leaves some thinking it can't be put over. I mean it. As daft of a thought process that could be. Love that Jericho vs Rock match for days on the show too. Rock's best year may have actually been 2002 just b/c his PPV matches were all great _(minus vs Undertaker - wtf @ that fact, but true)_ & he had two tags on Smackdown there owned.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

SLIM SHADY LP™;25527241 said:


> Interested in reading your thoughts on Regal/Edge from that event. That match would have easily stole the show if Rock/Jericho didn't rule so much.


I liked it, definitely didn't beat out Rock/Jericho though and this rumble match has ruled through the first 25 minutes. Totally didn't see Maven Eliminating taker coming. 

Here's a topic, top 10 rumbles ever? 

1: 1992
2: 2001
3: 2004
4: 2007
5: 2009

Thoughts on that?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Rumble '02 is meh. It's probably the biggest offender of the _"five guys only matter and the rest don't"_ mantra & it goes WAY too long. Undertaker + Maven stuff was the best part. Along with Goldust's & Mr. Perfect's pops.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> Watching that entire raw episode with Bret/Goldust 9/22
> 
> :lmao @ this hbk/taker segment, hbk to taker " Do you know who the hell I am ?.... Deadman unless you are a real Hot Mama, which you aint ! I dont not lay down for any one , Gotta love 97 hbk :hbk1
> 
> ...


I own that tag on DVD, it's on this Monday Night Wars documentary I got for $4.99 in the discount bin. It's an absolute blast, and one of the better Raw tags of the 90s. Never understood the GOAT hype it gets though, that's just me.

I'll have to check out that Dudleys vs Spike/Tazz match, short matches never bother me or would cause me to underrate something, if anything it's the opposite. There are more matches that would benefit from being shorter than they are than matches that are short that would benefit from being longer, if that makes any sense. I'll always take a hot short sprint over a 15 minute match that could have accomplished the same in 7 minutes.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Rumble '02 is meh. It's probably the biggest offender of the _"five guys only matter and the rest don't"_ mantra & it goes WAY too long. Undertaker + Maven stuff was the best part. Along with Goldust's & Mr. Perfect's pops.


YOU SPOILED PERFECT BITCH :lmao

Rumble 2000 is biggest offender of that IMO, shit was terrible, thank god for HHH/Foley from that show


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Top 10 Rumble Events:

10. 1991 Royal Rumble - 11.5
9. 2007 Royal Rumble - 12
8. 1996 Royal Rumble - 13
7. 1992 Royal Rumble - 13.5
6. 2009 Royal Rumble - 15
5. 1995 Royal Rumble - 15.5
4. 2005 Royal Rumble - 17
3. 2000 Royal Rumble - 17
2. 2002 Royal Rumble - 17.5
1. 2001 Royal Rumble - 20

Top 10 Non Rumble Match Matches:

10. William Regal Vs Edge - ***3/4 (2002)
9. The Dudley Boys Vs The Hardy Boys - ***3/4 (2000)
8. 123-Kid & Bob Holly Vs Bam Bam Bigelow & Tatanka - **** (1995)
7. Bret & Owen Hart Vs The Quebecers - **** (1994)
6. Bret Hart Vs The Undertaker - **** (1996)
5. Shawn Michaels Vs The Undertaker - **** (1998)
4. The Orient Express Vs The Rockers - ****1/4 (1991)
3. Bret Hart Vs Diesel - ****1/2 (1995)
2. Chris Jericho Vs Chris Benoit - ****3/4 (2001)
1. Triple H Vs Cactus Jack - ****3/4 (2000)

Top 10 Rumble Matches:

10. 30 Man Royal Rumble Match - ***3/4 (2003)
9. 40 Man Royal Rumble Match - **** (2011)
8. 30 Man Royal Rumble Match - **** (1991)
7. 30 Man Royal Rumble Match - ****1/4 (2007)
6. 30 Man Royal Rumble Match - ****1/4 (1996)
5. 30 Man Royal Rumble Match - ****1/2 (2001)
4. 30 Man Royal Rumble Match - ****1/4 (2004)
3. 30 Man Royal Rumble Match - ****1/2 (2002)
2. 30 Man Royal Rumble Match - ****1/2 (2009)
1. 30 Man Royal Rumble Match - ***** (1992)

And on the subject of the 02 RR:



Spoiler: RR 2002 Ramblings



2002 Royal Rumble

Original theme was "cocky" by Kid Rock. But of course the Anthology set gives us some crappy generic shite in place of it.

Match 1 - The Dudley Boys Vs Tazz & Spike - Mmmmmm Stacy. LOL Tazz gets a back suplex/neckbreaker double team move done to him on the floor. Then Spoke gets it in the ring. He's neck is fooked from being 3-D'd in the parking lot last week. Tazz it out on the outside. Instead of the back suplex/neckbreaker combo... why not a 3-D and get it over with? Because they wanna FUCK him up, that's why! DICK MURDOCH MENTION. Spike takes one hell of a beating, but not for too long unfortunately. Tazz gets the tag and SUPLEXES THE SHIT out of The Dudley Boys. TAZZMISSION ON STACY. TAZZMISSION ON D-VON. Match is over. Well this was fun. Very short, but The Dudley's put on a great beating on Spike in the time they got, then Tazz fucked shit up when he got in and managed to retain the tag titles. With more time this could have been pretty awesome. **3/4.

Match 2 - William Regal Vs Edge - A VERY underrated series of matches. They wrestle at Vengeance, her, then NWO and have 3 great, physical matches. Ref finds some brass knucks down Regal's groin region. KNEE TREMBLER about a minute into the match. Not his finisher yet though, so Edge doesn't sell it like death lol. I like how Edge goes after Regal's nose early on, since he destroyed it with a DDT on a chair a while back. Regal has some of the most awesome suplexes ever that we don't really ever see anyone else do, at least not in the likes of WWE and TNA. Maybe Japan. Man, if you don't come out of this match loving Regal, then you suck! Or don't like this kind of unique physical style. Either way you suck lol. DOUBLE ARM UNDERHOOK POWERBOMB. DDT ON THE APRON. Honestly don't think Edge ever wrestled this physical before or after the series with Regal, which is a shame because he probably looked better in these matches than he did for the majority of his career imo. I wish Regal had more of a chance to work with upper mid-card/main event guys in his career. A 15 minute competitive match with Cena? Would probably be some of Cena's best stuff. Match with Lesnar? Eddie Guerrero? UNDERTAKER? Man, the possibilities. Shame we didn't get to see those. BREAK HIS NECK REGAL! Gotta love the fans. A second pair of knucks, and BAM, out goes Edge. NEW CHAMP. Great match. ***3/4.

Match 3 - Jazz Vs Trish Stratus - Women's title. Trish has a bad hand. PURPLE PUPPIES. A BIG SPLASH RIGHT ON THE PUPRPLE PUPPIES. Another physical match, this time from the women! Jazz is one of the more TOUGH female wrestlers, so Trish has to take some hard shots and big bumps here, and she does it all well. Then Trish wins with a bulldog (ordinary one, she did the Stratusfaction one from the ropes earlier and Jazz kicked out). Short, but decent. **.

Match 4 - Ric Flair Vs Mr McMahon - Street fight between the two owners of the company. I remember this sucking. Hope I like it this time around. 1992 RR winner Vs 1999 RR winner! Both former WWF champions too! Flair hasn't wrestled in nearly a year, and Vince has the POWER advantage allowing him to control the early stages. But it seems that Vince having the upper hand just motivates Flair to come back, until the power of Vince comes back into play. LMAO at Vince's face while he's getting chopped. Flair bleeds because, you know, he's FLAIR. Vince is a great DICK with his beatdown on Flair, doing it in front of his family and shit. Then using the figure four too. PIPE. LOW BLOW. SHOT TO THE HEAD WITH A MONITOR. Love how they show the replay of the monitor shot with a second monitor that Flair grabs and throws down. Great shot. Vince is bleeding now, and he drags him over to his kids and gets them to take photos. Awesome. PIPE TO VINCE'S HEAD. FIGURE FOUR. FLAIR WINS. FLAIR WINS. This was great. Crazy to think that I didn't like it before. ***1/4.

Match 5 - The Rock Vs Chris Jericho - First and ONLY time the Undisputed WWF Title was defended at the RR! I remember trying to watch this back when it happened, then again a couple of times when I bought the Anthology box set. I kept falling asleep legitimately and could never get through it. Not because it sucked, but because for some reason I always got tired when watching it (actually yawned while writing that LOL). Jericho tells Rock to bring it. Rock punches him in the face. LOL. Poor Jericho. His title run was just so bad. He was made to look like shit. The entire build up to this match was built around EVERYONE assuming that Rock was gonna win, so they would tell him they looked forward to facing him at WM when they won the RR. Then nobody saw him beating Austin at NWO. Then the HHH WM match was build around HHH and Stephanie, with Jericho being Steph's bitch. ASK HIM. Jericho in control isn't really interesting, but there is more back and forth stuff than a Jericho control segment anyway (because Jericho can't look better than The Rock for too long...). Christian & Storm try to interfere, Rock takes them both out but walks into a Rock Bottom! People's Elbow attempt from Jericho too, but Rock launches him out of the ring instead, and then BAM, Rock Bottom through the table. HE LOOKS LIKE THE SCORPION KING! Match just seemed to go on and on and on and on and was in finishing stretch mode for like half of it lol. Lots of good stuff, but not nearly as great as I remembered. ***1/2. 

Match 6 - 30 Man Royal Rumble Match - One of the most star studded RR matches ever. Undertaker, Kane, HHH, Austin, Angle, Big Show, Mr Perfect, Booker T, RVD, Goldust etc. Some great talent, some great returns (Goldust and Perfect being the best, shame Perfect got fired a few months later), and some great moments. Rikishi is #1, and the returning Goldust is #2. Goldust might be the only person who wants to get a Stinkface. BOSSMAN. He returned not too long ago. Not really sure why. BRADSHAW. Love him just running over people with the Clothesline from Hell. STINKFACE TO BOSSMAN. I remember when he "threw up" on Michael Cole I think it was after taking one. He doesn't throw up here, but he does end up being eliminated. Ring fills up a bit and OMG WHAT A CLOTHESLINE FROM HELL TO STORM. So yeah, ring fills up a little but everyone there are just jobbers for UNDERTAKER to dominate. Storm and Al Snow have a nice little battle on the apron. Undertaker as a heel was beyond EPIC in late 01/half of 02. One of my all time favourite runs of any wrestler ever. Matt and Jeff are the next 2 entrants, returning to action after Undertaker too them both out (and LITA too). He eliminates them both, but along with Lita they don't leave and end up distracting the Dead Man enough for MAVEN to dropkick the Phenom out of the ring! Maven looks like he's king of the world... then he realises just what he's done and oh man... Undertaker KILLS that kid. Awesome brawl. Scotty 2 Hotty comes out during this, and gets a right hand from Undertaker that knocks him out for a while LOL. Match essentially starts again now as we go back to just 2 people and then slowly fill the ring up until Austin channels his 1997 self and dominates. Then HHH comes in and IT'S ON. They fight each other, then work together to eliminate anyone else who comes in. Stuff with Hurricane is hilarious. MR PERFECT. Love his theme. Guy in 2002 was still better than most of the roster. Once he gets in, the ring begins to fill up again rather than being eliminated one by one by Austin and HHH. Austin, HHH, Kane, Big Show, Perfect and Angle are all in the match at the same time at one point. Kane picks Show up, walks him to the ropes and dunks him out! Impressive elimination, but it took so much out of Kane that Angle hits a modified Angle Slam to eliminate him. Angle and HHH are the final 2, and HHH wins. Extremely predictable finish, but yeah, a great fucking match still. One of the best Rumbles ever. ****1/2.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Ive only seen one rumble in my life- 2013


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

redskins25 said:


> Ive only seen one rumble in my life- 2013


YOU POOR BASTARD .


----------



## Bronx Bomber (May 31, 2007)

Speaking of good tags, earlier I watched Steamboat/Douglas vs Windham/Pillman from Starrcade '92 for the first time. Really enjoyed it and thought Windham and Pillman worked well together as a team. I really love watching Windham, everything he does comes across really crisp. Solid tag, ***3/4 from me. 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Callamus said:


> Top 10 Rumble Events:
> 
> 10. 1991 Royal Rumble - 11.5
> 9. 2007 Royal Rumble - 12
> ...


NO CENA/ UMAGA!?!?!?!?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> Ive only seen one rumble in my life- 2013


Jesus Christ man, Flair is your guy, go watch 1992 like right NOW. Seriously.

I've always had a soft spot for 2004, Benoits performance was just incredible, I think he has the record for longest time in the Rumble.

Hayley- that tag was great. Love how the Dudley's focus on Spikes neck early and pretty much stick with it throughout the match, and Spikes selling was excellent. Loved how Taz came in on the smoking hot tag, started doing generic clothes lines, then said fuck this and started suplexing everything in sight, he hit 3 different kinds of suplexes back to back to back. Stacey looked so hot in that camo.....wait, that's pretty weird to say. Fun fun tag, I agree with you doesn't NEED to be any longer it definitely got the job done.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> YOU SPOILED PERFECT BITCH :lmao
> 
> Rumble 2000 is biggest offender of that IMO, shit was terrible, thank god for HHH/Foley from that show


BUT HE WAS ANNOUNCED IN THE HYPE VIDEO BEFORE THE MATCH. :$


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Oh shit, new thread. Was looking for the old one. :argh:

Rewatched Raw and I really liked Ambrose/Bryan and even Punk/Big E vs Heyman Guys for what it was. Really looking forward to Big E as a face.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Spoiler: overrated match



John Cena Vs Umaga - It be a LMS match for the WWE Title. Considered as a classic by many, but not me. Didn't like it much on a last watch. The finish still haunts me as one of the dumbest things I've seen in a match, and a high profile one at that. I THINK UMAGA IS SCARIER THAN KING KONG. That's for that Lawler. Nice to see your commentary was still on top form in 07... Anyway. Cena has bad ribs. Umaga does a nice job destroying them some more. And then Cena picks up the steel steps (which according to the announcers over the years, weigh quite a lot) and THROWS them at Umaga. A bunch of times. With BAD RIBS. Cena, the huge babyface he is, gets some encouraging chants while Umaga is beating the fuck out of him: "WE WANT TABLES". Oh wait no, those aren't encouraging, are they? LOL. Cena gets busted open: "CENA SUCKS!" LMFAO. Man, first half of this match, any time Cena attempts a comeback his offence is STUPID. He has bad ribs, so what does he does? Steel steps as mention. CROSSBODY from the top rope. Five Knuckle Shuffle (not bad on the ribs, but the dumbest thing he could do lol since it doesn't really affect anyone). Towards the end he builds a little momentum by simply AVOIDING Umaga and forcing him to crash and burn so that's good at least. And then we have the finish. FUCK THIS FINISH. Estrada uses a METAL SPANNER to take apart the top rope so Umaga can use A BIT OF METAL from the turnbuckle on Cena. Which is ONLY done so they have an excuse for the ropes to be broken so Cena can choke Umaga out. BULLSHIT. Overall this has it's good points and bad points. Good us usually Umaga who looks GREAT on offence. Bad is mostly Cena who uses stupid offence. And then the finish outright BLOWS. Still, better than I remembered it, but not by much. ***1/4.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> Hayley- that tag was great. Love how the Dudley's focus on Spikes neck early and pretty much stick with it throughout the match, and Spikes selling was excellent. Loved how Taz came in on the smoking hot tag, started doing generic clothes lines, then said fuck this and started suplexing everything in sight, he hit 3 different kinds of suplexes back to back to back. Stacey looked so hot in that camo.....wait, that's pretty weird to say. Fun fun tag, I agree with you doesn't NEED to be any longer it definitely got the job done.


(Y)

Was fast & furious. They knew what they could do in a short amount of time and did it. Workers & management working in sync there.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The Primer said:


> BUT HE WAS ANNOUNCED IN THE HYPE VIDEO BEFORE THE MATCH. :$


Oh yeah I skipped that :lol.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Well shit, man...

At least you got to experience the Maven moment unspoiled. :hb


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah that was pretty :mark: 

Then taker just beats the shit out of him for like 10 minutes :lmao

EDIT: all the comments on that video are just about how bad biker taker was, I wasn't watching around this time, but even though the deadman gimmick is better, was it THAT bad? or is it just youtube marks?


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> On another topic, what's everyone's favorite Mr. Perfect match that doesn't involve Bret Hart or Flair on Loser Leaves Raw?


As Cody has said, My personaly favorite is most definitely the 60 minute draw with Bockwinkel in AWA. Don't remember the exact date but it's on Perfect's dvd. He had some other great AWA matches against Lawler too. In the WWF the only one that is poppin up is an IC Title match against Tito Santana from a Saturday Night's Main Event.



Cactus Jack said:


> You know something we don't talk about in here enough? Tag matches.
> 
> 
> What are some of your guys favorite straight 2 on 2 tag matches? I'm in the mood for a good hot old school style tag.


WONDERFUL TOPIC. Some of my favorites:

World's Greatest Tag Team vs. Rey Mysterio & Billy Kidman (Smackdown 8/14/03)
The Midnight Express vs. The Fantastics (Great American Bash '88)
Ricky Steamboat & Shane Douglas vs. Barry Windham & Brian Pillman (Starrcade '92)
Rey Mysterio & Batista vs. MNM (2 matches in December '05 on Smackdown)
Edge & Rey Mysterio vs. Kurt Angle & Chris Benoit (No Mercy '02)



redskins25 said:


> Ive only seen one rumble in my life- 2013





Callamus said:


> YOU POOR BASTARD .


Yeah what he said. Seing as you're a big fan of Michaels & Flair, you should probably get on '92, '95, and '96 soon.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Starrcade '92 tag. If you haven't seen it, you haven't lived.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Bunch of awesome tags that made my top 100 WCW list:

Arn Anderson, Bobby Eaton, Larry Zbyszko & Rick Rude Vs Sting, Barry Windham, Dustin Rhodes & Ricky Steamboat - Saturday Night 22/02/1992
Southern Boys Vs Midnight Express - Great American Bash 07/07/1990
Brian Pillman & Barry Windham Vs Ricky Steamboat & Shane Douglas - Starrcade 28/12/1992
Hollywood Blonds Vs 2 Cold Scorpio & Marcus Bagwell - Worldwide 08/05/1993
The Rock ‘n’ Roll Express Vs The Midnight Express - WrestleWar 25/02/1990
The Steiner Bothers Vs The Nasty Boys - Halloween Havoc 27/10/1990
Cactus Jack & Maxx Payne Vs The Nasty Boys - SuperBrawl IV 20/02/1994
Arn Anderson & Larry Zbyszko Vs Dustin Rhodes & Ricky Steamboat - Clash of the Champions XVII 19/11/1991 
Steamboat/Rhodes/Koloff Vs Anderson/Zbyszko/Eaton - Saturday Night 23/05/1992
Cactus Jack & Kevin Sullivan Vs The Nasty Boys - Slamboree 22/05/1994
Stars & Stripes Vs Arn Anderson & Vader - Saturday Night 15/04/1995
Mortis & Wrath Vs Glacier & The Cat - Bash at the Beach 13/07/1997
Big Van Vader & Steve Austin Vs Ric Flair & Arn Anderson - Saturday Night 13/11/1993
Sting & Ric Flair Vs Vader & Rick Rude – Clash of the Champions XXVI 27/01/1994
Steve Williams & Terry Gordy Vs The Steiner Brothers - Clash Of The Champions XIX 16/06/1992
Ric Flair & Sting Vs Great Muta & Dick Slater - Clash Of The Champions VIII 12/09/1989
Arn Anderson & Larry Zbyszko Vs Barry Windham & Ron Simmons - Pro 09/11/1991


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:homer

Too many great tags there. I'd chuck in Faces of Fear vs Eddie & Jericho + Faces of Fear vs Mortis & Wrath _(Fall Brawl)_ from '97 too.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> WONDERFUL TOPIC. Some of my favorites:
> 
> 
> Yeah what he said. Seing as you're a big fan of Michaels & Flair, you should probably get on '92, '95, and '96 soon.





Cactus Jack said:


> Jesus Christ man, Flair is your guy, go watch 1992 like right NOW. Seriously.
> 
> I've always had a soft spot for 2004, Benoits performance was just incredible, I think he has the record for longest time in the Rumble.


hate my parents for not buying me and my brother ppvs when I was younger DAMN YOU :batista3, yea gots some papers to do so I probaly cant watch a whole rumble tonite but tommorrow or sat or.... monday. so far I have cena/y2j svs 08 and rumble 92 to watch


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

If it helps, the 1995 Rumble is the shortest in history at only about 38 minutes. That could be easy to cram. End result would be very pleasing for yourself, too. One of the most infamous finishes.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Might be super short compared to most other rumbles, but it's a pile of wank so not worth sitting through 38 minutes of it .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

But it has MANTAUR in it + another random appearance of Rick Martel.

and one aspect that's cool aka Dick Murdoch showing up. Think he got to punch a few guys before falling into the mess that was about 15 guys in the ring at one time towards the end.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

is the 1995 any good ? I wanted to rewatch hbk/scsa vs. owen/davey and write some thoughts


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Rumble match is terrible, undercard is AMAZING.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

have any of you guys ever subscribed to dirtsheets like the observer and PWtorch? If so, is it worth the 10 bucks a month?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's fun to see the cast of characters. Plus, Shawn carries the match so for your fandom, that's about the best thing you could have asked for. It's generally reviewed as one of, if not the weakest Rumble match for most though. I don't care to rank 'em outside of about five specific matches, so, yeah.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

FUCK IT, let's just drop in some other great tags while we're at it:

Steve Austin & Ric Flair vs. Sting & Ricky Steamboat (WCW Saturday Night 7/30/94)
DX vs. Legacy (Summerslam '09 & Breaking Point '09)
The Rock n Roll Express vs. The Russians (NWA Worldwide 7/9/85)
The Steiner Brothers vs. Hiroshi Hase & Kensuke Sasaki (NJPW/WCW Supershow 3/21/91)
Bret & Owen Hart vs. The Quebecers (Royal Rumble '94)
The Rockers vs. The Orient Express (Royal Rumble '92)

TAG MATCHES :mark:

-----------------------

Rumble '95 is a really good ppv as a whole. Yeah the Rumble is full of jobbers but I LOVED the story of it always coming down to Michaels & Bulldog while they were tossing out no-names left and right. Plus Dick Murdoch? Of fuck yeah. I thought it was a fun 38 minutes tbh, not a classic but I gave it *** on the last watch and probably seen it 2-3 times. Undercard is rockin with Bret/Diesel and the Tag Title match. I think Razor/Jarrett is on there too.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Since rumble discussions are going on. Top 5 rumble participants? Austin, HBK, Kane, Cena, The Rock 

My top 5 rumbles would be: 

1. 01
2. 92
3. 07
4. 02
5. 04


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Razor vs Jarrett is on there. Best. Jarrett match. Ever. _(with the Shawn one the same year)_

BOD tags can all get a mention here. Did they have one that wasn't at the very least fun? Don't recall any. vs Finlay & Booker is so good.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

BOD Vs Kai-En-Tai on Heat when Undertaker is teaching Kane the Last Ride is GOAT.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Primer said:


> BOD tags can all get a mention here. Did they have one that wasn't at the very least fun? Don't recall any.


Maybe against "Porter" and Kennedy?


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Michaels has to be Mr. Royal Rumble, I don't see how anyone can dispute that due to his performances in '92, '95, '96, and '07. I'd put Austin right behind him because I fucking love '01, then probably Triple H. He's been able to put together some strong performances a few times, mainly in '06. Other than that, there's Benoit & Mysterio.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Benoit's '04 performance is probably my favorite if I took the time to care. I'd probably give it to Undertaker though solely b/c the ending to the '07 one is my favorite and will never be trumped.

Totally not biased.


----------



## Bronx Bomber (May 31, 2007)

Top 5 rumbles for me: 
1) '92
2) '07
3) '01
4) '02
5) '04

Top 5 rumble participants
1) HBK
2) Steve Austin
3) Taker
4) Kane
5) ? Not a clue Maybe Punk? His work in '10 and '11 was amazing. 
EDIT: See wasn't sure how to go here. Wasn't sure if we were basing it on overall rumble performance or on a single rumble performance. Because obviously Benoit for '04 and Mysterio for '06 should get a mention. 

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Mentioned it in the old thread, but BOD/Power Trip from Backlash 2001 is pretty hot. I also just saw Mysterio/Batista vs Jerishow from HIAC 2009 - nice match there. 

Most any Evolution tag match in 2004 is the TITS.
_______________

Rumble talk? I need to watch more Rumble matches, but won't until we're closer to the time of the PPV. I find that watching past events when were close to it is pretty cool.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Michaels has to be Mr. Royal Rumble, I don't see how anyone can dispute that due to his performances in '92, '95, '96, and '07. I'd put Austin right behind him because I fucking love '01, then probably Triple H. He's been able to put together some strong performances a few times, mainly in '06. Other than that, there's Benoit & Mysterio.


Agreed with Michaels, but HHH over Kane? I'm pretty sure at the end if his career Kane will have most eliminations ever.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Has Undertaker done anything memorable in a Royal Rumble match other than '07? Can't think of anything at the moment. I can see Kane's inclusion since he's been in like 15 now.  Still holds the record for eliminations too I believe.

EDIT: Triple H for sure because he was THE MAN in the '06 match, plus he's been involved in the final minutes like 3 other times.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Evolution tags :mark:

HIAC '09 tag is superb. Big man + cruiserweight partner duos were rad. Gave both teams such a slick wrinkle to play off of. I liked the JeriShow vs World's Strongest Tag Team match from Breaking Point the month prior too. DX vs JeriShow on RAW (forget the specific date, might have been the night after HIAC) was good too. Much better than their TLC which was poor.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Most any Evolution tag match in 2004 is the TITS.


Yep, those tags never get old. I've been rewatching quite a few of them recently and there's still plenty I have yet to go through again.

So much goodness that I might do a 2004 project.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Yeah, Kane's record of 11 eliminations may never be broken. 

MARK HENRY needs a cool Rumble time. Just let him go in and wreck shit.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

In 02 he came in and completely cleared the ring, then had one of THE most memorable eliminations ever before going GOAT and mauling Maven. 03 he had one of the best RR returns ever. 04 he had a memorable moment without even being there. 07 he had the epic finishing stretch with Shawn and won. 08 he and Shawn started and worked a great story into the Rumble until they both got eliminated. 09 he was GOAT'ing it up with Big Show + he kicked a midget.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

2001 Rumble is boring outside of Kane. Don't care for it at all.

Undertaker hasn't had too many Rumble matches iirc. But these last years when he's been it, he's look good. Usually has a memorable moment or two. '08's when he killed Snitsky owned.


----------



## Bronx Bomber (May 31, 2007)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Has Undertaker done anything memorable in a Royal Rumble match other than '07? Can't think of anything at the moment. I can see Kane's inclusion since he's been in like 15 now.  Still holds the record for eliminations too I believe.
> 
> EDIT: Triple H for sure because he was THE MAN in the '06 match, plus he's been involved in the final minutes like 3 other times.


Honestly after his '07 performance the next most memorable probably is his elimination by Maven. But that '07 ending is so great, which is why I included him in my top 5. 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

EVOLUTION TAGS.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> EVOLUTION TAGS.


Which one of them do others consider the best?

I can't decide between the 8 man tag before Backlash and the elimination 6 man after Bad Blood.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Evolution tags :mark:
> 
> HIAC '09 tag is superb. Big man + cruiserweight partner duos were rad. Gave both teams such a slick wrinkle to play off of. I liked the JeriShow vs World's Strongest Tag Team match from Breaking Point the month prior too. *DX vs JeriShow on RAW (forget the specific date, might have been the night after HIAC) was good too*. Much better than their TLC which was poor.


Oohhh I was gonna include that one too. October 5. Really good match on the Best of RAW '09 set.



Callamus said:


> In 02 he came in and completely cleared the ring, then had one of THE most memorable eliminations ever before going GOAT and mauling Maven. 03 he had one of the best RR returns ever. 04 he had a memorable moment without even being there. 07 he had the epic finishing stretch with Shawn and won. 08 he and Shawn started and worked a great story into the Rumble until they both got eliminated. 09 he was GOAT'ing it up with Big Show + he kicked a midget.


Well there ya go. Still haven't seen '08 yet outside of the finish and didn't recall the '09 stuff at all. Not sure how I forgot about '02...



The Primer said:


> *2001 Rumble is boring outside of Kane. Don't care for it at all.*
> 
> Undertaker hasn't had too many Rumble matches iirc. But these last years when he's been it, he's look good. Usually has a memorable moment or two. '08's when he killed Snitsky owned.


Stop lying to yourself, please.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I don't really remember too much with what Undertaker did in the 2003 rumble outside of making it till the end. Hate myself for that. I've only seen that match about twice; that explains it.

Corey, Rumble '01 is like the No Mercy '02 tag of Rumble matches. 8*D


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Eight man tag before Backlash is a thrill to watch.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I hate when this happens. Now I wanna go watch a bunch of Royal Rumble matches. :lol But at the same time I really need to get caught up with PWG & ROH keeps calling me to come back and watch them again... give them another chance. 

Cody's saying some hurtful things tonight.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The one with Foley, eh. Yeah, that one was a comer. Loved Foley working RAW as if he was going to stick around for a bit.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Primer said:


> I don't really remember too much with what Undertaker did in the 2003 rumble outside of making it till the end. Hate myself for that. I've only seen that match about twice; that explains it.


Well he entered last so he wasn't there for long. But GOD DAMN I mark out like fuck for his return. Made my top 10 RR moments in my RR special video I does believe.



The Primer said:


> Corey, Rumble '01 is like the No Mercy '02 tag of Rumble matches. 8*D


Exactly. REALLY FUCKING GOOD .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Callamus said:


> Well he entered last so he wasn't there for long. But GOD DAMN I mark out like fuck for his return. Made my top 10 RR moments in my RR special video I does believe.
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly. REALLY FUCKING GOOD .


Need to check it out again.

and hilarious. No Mercy tag can suck a huge dick. Hate that overrated crap. Especially when the opener is a tag match too and 100x stronger. Goldust >


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Almost done with this fucking paper, hopefully I can finish the rumble tonight! 

Dont count on it though


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Pfft, putting wrestling off so you can finish some form of school work. I was more active on here and watched more wrestling when I was at Uni than I am now I'm unemployed :lmao.

Probably explains why I quit Uni :lmao.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Schoolwork has kept me from watching wrestling so many times, but watching wrestling has also kept me from doing schoolwork probably twice as much 

Just watched SummerSlam 2001. Angle vs. Austin is still one of my favorite matches ever, Rock vs. Booker seemed pretty by-the-numbers and formulaic, RVD vs. Hardy was botchtastic, Jericho vs. Rhyno was fun, and TAJIRI :mark:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Well, I'm done with the paper so Im watching the show, but I'm very tired...


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yea this english paper buc/panthers aint allowing me to watch anything wrestling, holy shit there are soo many jobbers in this rumble match but Shawn is killing it :mark:


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Best match at the Rumble event that wasn't the Rumble? Trips/Foley 2000? Benoit/Jericho 2001? 

I actually liked Angle/Trips from 2001 until the fuckery started.

Wow, I had no idea that the 2006 Rumble was the third from the last match on the card. Didn't even get the penultimate spot. Rumble was just buried on that card.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

RR 06 booking meeting:

HHH: So am I fucking going over in the RR match?

Vince: No, Rey is winning in memory of Eddie.

HHH: And I have to last HOW LONG in the match to not even win it? Fuck that, place it on the middle of the card.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

He only said that after a failed 20 minute pitch to win the rumble right?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

That's actually pretty funny. But my question though.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Best match at the Rumble event that wasn't the Rumble? Trips/Foley 2000? Benoit/Jericho 2001?
> 
> I actually liked Angle/Trips from 2001 until the fuckery started.
> 
> Wow, I had no idea that the 2006 Rumble was the third from the last match on the card. Didn't even get the penultimate spot. Rumble was just buried on that card.


Benoit/Jericho easily.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Callamus said:


> Top 10 Rumble Events:
> 
> 10. 1991 Royal Rumble - 11.5
> 9. 2007 Royal Rumble - 12
> ...


I'll just point ya'll back to this post I made like half an hour ago . HHH/Cactus is #1 .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Oh yeah Benoit/Jericho, HHH/Foley only wins # 1 by a hair anyways

Goddamit this rumble match is long, I'll finish the last 25 minutes tomorrow morning.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Awesome (Y)

I was gone for a while and didn't look back too far when I came back. Guess I know what I'm watching around Rumble time.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Nothing else in Rumble history beats Angle/Benoit :angle


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Nothing else in Rumble history beats Angle/Benoit :angle


Shit, with all the bashing in here, I am forgetting it more often than Cal forgets his rating for Angle/Lesnar from SummerSlam. :lol


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Best match at the Rumble event that wasn't the Rumble? Trips/Foley 2000? Benoit/Jericho 2001?


Other classics = Rockers vs Orient Express, Kid & Holly vs Bigelow & Tatanka, Razor vs Jarrett, Hardys vs Dudleys tables, Jericho vs Rock, Hardys vs MNM, Cena vs Umaga, & Undertaker vs Mysterio.

That's eleven, but meh, close enough to a top ten.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I watched one or two of the Regal/edge matches sometime recently and was put off by what I saw. Leave it to Edge to make a William Regal match boring.



The Primer said:


> Starrcade '92 tag. If you haven't seen it, you haven't lived.


Also this is truth.



The Primer said:


> No Mercy tag can suck a huge dick. Hate that overrated crap. Especially when the opener is a tag match too and 100x stronger. Goldust >


How many times do I have to agree with you? I'm actually glad we have differing views on things like the Usos and Wade Barrett or else we'd be too goddamn similar.



HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Best match at the Rumble event that wasn't the Rumble? Trips/Foley 2000? Benoit/Jericho 2001?


I see this question pop up a fair bit and I have to ask - would anybody actually say a Rumble match is the best match to happen at a Rumble PPV?

I choose Cena/Umaga, fwiw.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm more bothered by you liking The Usos than disliking Barrett, tbf.

Wished it wasn't true. They're such the unlikable twonks.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Now you know how I feel re: Chuck Taylor.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Not liking his humor seems logical. I can understand that being off putting. He isn't a douchebag who's trying to act like a stereotype of a completely different race, unlike the Usos. You're not black, fuckheads. And those taped up boots to represent the Samoan wrestlers who just wore tape over their barefeet. ahhhhh. bunch of idiots.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

He yells like a little girl and tries to be funny when 'selling' German suplexes. And, like the Miz, has the most horribly detestable face which I would rip the skin off with my bare hands. I feel lighting him on fire should be involved too. 


I don't like this track of negativity we're on.  Let's talk about tag matches. You watch Steiners/Quebecers 9/13/93 if you haven't and I'll watch the Fall Brawl 97 MENGMENGMENGMENGMENG tag.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Oh the face thing for ya. That's a Langston factor for me. Seriously thinking of boycotting WWE for months knowing that piece of shit will have a championship. Fuck that jobber.

K, I'm done. Blood boiling & who needs that. 

Tag team exchange? I can do that. Leaves me to also try a mission and see if Quebecers had one good match during their jobber WCW tenure. I'm not sure they did. Hmm. PS: MENG.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

What are peoples' thoughts on the Can-Am Express? I don't think I've seen much outside of their WWF tenure, like matches against Bulldog/Owen.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

They weren't really around for long, iirc. At least in WWF it didn't feel that way. Martel is solid and Zenk had good matches, mostly in WCW. I know I had fun with them from the WM 3 match, and that seems to be the only WWF match that ever makes the rounds, so I'm fine with the union. Better than the Young Stallions.

I have to get in a Roma & Powers joke in there somewhere.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I think he meant Furnas and Kroffat? Martel and shitty Zenk were the Can-Am Connection. To answer the question, Furnas and Kroffat were five million stars. Especially Kroffat. There were points where I thought he looked like possibly the best wrestler in the world. Two guys I want to see more of for sure.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

NXT taping last night for episode airing 27 Nov:



Spoiler: I hope you're sitting down



Sami Zayn Vs Neville (PAC) in an alleged super-great match (duh)

And...

. . . . . . . . . .

REGAL VS CESARO TEASED!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> I think he meant Furnas and Kroffat? Martel and shitty Zenk were the Can-Am Connection. To answer the question, Furnas and Kroffat were five million stars. Especially Kroffat. There were points where I thought he looked like possibly the best wrestler in the world. Two guys I want to see more of for sure.


Good friggin lord you are right.

I have never been at the lowest point of being a wrestling fan till right now. God dammit and I won't blame lack of sleep. I'm just an idiot tonight.

Furnas & Kroffat were gods of wrestling. Watch everything you can from them. Jesus how did I not acknowledge the Owen & Smith reference by Zep in the first place...ugh @ my fail.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

He he, I did think to myself why you mentioned Martel

I need to see some of their much lauded Japan stuff, don't know much about their US matches outside of WWF tbh.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

D'oh. Well, at least I got a random way to joke about those Young Stallions. 

Go watch any match you can find with them in Japan. The big obvious pick is one you've probably seen & that's vs Kobashi & Kikuchi 5/25/92.


----------



## hanshanshans911 (Mar 17, 2009)

So is Payback worth getting on bluray with Bryan/Rollins and Shield vs Hell No & RKO. And how is MITB 13? Missed almost everything except Mania and Summerslam


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Primer said:


> D'oh. Well, at least I got a random way to joke about those Young Stallions.
> 
> Go watch any match you can find with them in Japan. The big obvious pick is one you've probably seen & that's vs Kobashi & Kikuchi 5/25/92.


Someone recently uploaded, for the first time, the FULL MATCH on Youtube, ill see if its still there..


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

hanshanshans911 said:


> So is Payback worth getting on bluray with Bryan/Rollins and Shield vs Hell No & RKO. And how is MITB 13? Missed almost everything except Mania and Summerslam


Bryan/Orton vs. Shield doesn't get that much time, but it's still fun. Punk vs. Jericho is...polarizing, Ziggler vs. Del Rio is really really good, AJ vs. Kaitlyn's great for a diva's match and the main event isn't too bad, but I hate Ryback, so yeah 

As for MITB, both ladder matches and Cena vs. Henry are pretty good, but Ryback vs. Jericho is shit :side:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Primer said:


> D'oh. Well, at least I got a random way to joke about those Young Stallions.
> 
> Go watch any match you can find with them in Japan. The big obvious pick is one you've probably seen & that's vs Kobashi & Kikuchi 5/25/92.


For the FIRST TIME COMPLETE:


----------



## Cactus (Jul 28, 2011)

*Dustin Rhodes Vs Big Van Vader (16/11/1994 WCW)*
Vader is one of my favorite wrestlers and if I keep seeing Dustin Rhodes performances like how he was in this match and at Battleground, Dustin will be one of my favorites in no time too. It goes without saying that Vader is simply fantastic in the bully role and this is one of his best performances yet. Vader toying with Rhodes by spitting, jabbing and trash-talking him during the opening moments was awesome and it made Dustin's first attack feel even more satisfying. When Vader goes down for the first time, the crowd erupts and the two brilliant workers have them eating out of the palms of their hands. It may be a little rough around the edges, but it's two greats doing there thing in front of a molten-hot crowd. It never dragged at any point of the match and it's well worth a watch.

★★★¾


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Cactus said:


> *Dustin Rhodes Vs Big Van Vader (16/11/1994 WCW)*
> Vader is one of my favorite wrestlers and if I keep seeing Dustin Rhodes performances like how he was in this match and at Battleground, Dustin will be one of my favorites in no time too. It goes without saying that Vader is simply fantastic in the bully role and this is one of his best performances yet. Vader toying with Rhodes by spitting, jabbing and trash-talking him during the opening moments was awesome and it made Dustin's first attack feel even more satisfying. When Vader goes down for the first time, the crowd erupts and the two brilliant workers have them eating out of the palms of their hands. It may be a little rough around the edges, but it's two greats doing there thing in front of a molten-hot crowd. It never dragged at any point of the match and it's well worth a watch.
> 
> ★★★¾



The fuck man, your name is Cactus and Vader is one of you're favorite wrestlers? Weird. I didn't know there were 2 of us.

Watching Steamboat/Douglas Starrcade 1992 Tag right meow.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Woah, Cactus is in here. Haven't seen that guy post in ages. 



zep81 said:


> He he, I did think to myself why you mentioned Martel
> 
> I need to see some of their much lauded Japan stuff, don't know much about their US matches outside of WWF tbh.


Definitely check out any of their matches against the British Bulldogs in Japan. 5/12/89 is a great one.



hanshanshans911 said:


> So is Payback worth getting on bluray with Bryan/Rollins and Shield vs Hell No & RKO. And how is MITB 13? Missed almost everything except Mania and Summerslam


Both of those are definitely worth getting on blu ray. The bonus matches on Payback make the whole thing worth it, plus you get AJ/Kaitlyn and ADR/Ziggler on the main show. I even thought Cena/Ryback was fun.  Shield vs. Orton & Bryan is decent too.

Money in the Bank on the other hand is an awesome all around show. Both MITB Ladder matches, Cena/Henry, and ADR/Ziggler II are great, plus you get an Orton/Punk match from RAW on the blu ray that's pretty darn good.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Cactus, where you been biach? You handing in a Top 100 MOTD list? Because like, the poll is done at the end of the month!


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Which decade is this and where can I see some lists? 


edit: I'm currently watching one of the ADR/Cara matches from the Mexican tour and it's quite hilarious how different the loudness of pops are. For someone as big a draw as Mistico was, it's almost funny seeing a heel ADR bringing the cheering crowd response upon his entrance and not Cara.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Best of the 00's, and no lists yet. They'll be handing them in to me at the end of the month, then I'll put together a definitive list like the WWF/E and WCW ones we did . Just wish I didn't give up on it half way through, but I just couldn't get into it like the previous two. Shall be interesting for me to see what the top 100 is though!


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

JR is so fucked on the commentary for HHH's match against Batista at Vengeance 2005. 

"OHH YEAH! THE HELL IN A CELL IS GETTIN' ITSELF SOME NOW!"
"BAH GAWD! TRIPLE H MAY BE A NO GOOD BASTARD IN MANY PEOPLES EYES, BUT WHAT A KICKOUT!"

What a fucking war though, arguably my favorite match ever for a reason, and that reason is that the intensity contained in that bout is one of the most fantastic displays of hatred that has been displayed in the 21st century. They kill each other with every conceivable object, including the BARBED WIRE FUCKING CHAIR which Batista use to maim HHH and rip The Game's skin to shreds. HHH's selling of Batista's offense is some of HHH's best work here, mainly because I think at least 50 percent of his pain is totally legit and that he has a reason to go insane like a madman the entire time. The match is just two animals in a cage beating each other down with whatever they can find to prove whoever the better man is, brilliant.

The ending is my favorite ever though. How HHH almost pulls the trigger with the sledgehammer only to be Batista bombed out of the WHC picture once and for all? Fucking suspense at it's finest. Every time I watched the match as a kid I kept saying to myself "HIT HIM HAITCH! COME THE FUCK ON!" only to be met with disappointment every time .

***** 3/4*


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I thought I was the only one that liked that punk/orton raw match ? the crowd is dead silent but its doesnt affect it

I really want to re watch Payback now bar that IC triple threat but I so far have these matches to watch this weekend :
92 rumble
95 rumble
cena/y2j svs 08

btw zep do you have cena/y2j svs 08 ? if so I'd like to make my official first request to you


----------



## Cactus (Jul 28, 2011)

Callamus said:


> Cactus, where you been biach? You handing in a Top 100 MOTD list? Because like, the poll is done at the end of the month!


Someone noticed I was gone?! 

I just haven't been in much of a wrestling-watching mood as of late and as a result, my forum activity kinda dwindled too. I'm trying to get myself back into watching and posting here. 

I didn't even know you guys were doing a list. Sorry, but I couldn't really submit a list without throwing one together from memory.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Ahhh, when HIAC matches meant something .


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Cactus said:


> Someone noticed I was gone?!
> 
> I just haven't been in much of a wrestling-watching mood as of late and as a result, my forum activity kinda dwindled too. I'm trying to get myself back into watching and posting here.
> 
> I didn't even know you guys were doing a list. Sorry, but I couldn't really submit a list without throwing one together from memory.


Well we've been doing it for the last 2 years, maybe I'm confusing you with someone else on the forum that was doing it but disappeared too . Either way, get yo ass back on the forum and start posting again ya cunt! We'll be thinking of the next poll soon .


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Barrett/Miz/Axel from Payback does NOT deserve hate at all. Regardless of how much I dislike Moz and Axehim (I personally love Barrett though, fuck you :side, this match was pretty damn fun, fast-paced and well executed for a generic Triple Threat. The crowd was awesome too, the ending was very creative, and Axel winning the IC Title on Father's Day was a nice feelgood moment. So yeah. 



Callamus said:


> Best of the 00's, and no lists yet. They'll be handing them in to me at the end of the month, then I'll put together a definitive list like the WWF/E and WCW ones we did . Just wish I didn't give up on it half way through, but I just couldn't get into it like the previous two. Shall be interesting for me to see what the top 100 is though!


How does that work? Can anybody can send you their own Top 100?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Nope. Just the guys who have participated in the TWO YEAR project I'm afraid. It's a pretty ELITE group.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

redskins25 said:


> I thought I was the only one that liked that punk/orton raw match ? the crowd is dead silent but its doesnt affect it


I didn't even know it existed until I got the blu ray.  One of the really good RAW matches from this year that gets overshadowed by all the Shield and/or Daniel Bryan stuff.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

That Batista vs Trips HiaC match is absolutely brutal. Love it, it's my favorite non Foley Trips singles match and easily Batista's best match ever. God the carnage. I have that on the KoK set, I need to watch that one again. If I were to rank Cell matches, the only one that is definitively better is the original Bad Blood 1997 one. I personally would also put Brock/Taker and Foley/Trips above it, but that's it.

It is almost enough to make me cry, to see what WWE has done to Cell matches. They just MURDERED the best gimmick match ever.

One cell match I've never seen, Jericho vs Trips. Is it any good?

What's the better feud ending gimmick match: Hell in a Cell or Last Man Standing?


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Batista/HHH Hell in a Cell is one of my favorite matches ever. KOK basically summed up my thoughts on it, but one of the parts I really like that wasn't mentioned is when Triple H brings out that huge steel chain and starts whipping Batista and then choking him with it while Batista's hanging from a rope, that part almost got hard to watch. It's my favorite Hell in a Cell match for how far they go and the brilliant story being told.








ATF said:


> Barrett/Miz/Axel from Payback does NOT deserve hate at all. Regardless of how much I dislike Moz and Axehim (I personally love Barrett though, fuck you :side, this match was pretty damn fun, fast-paced and well executed for a generic Triple Threat. The crowd was awesome too, the ending was very creative, and Axel winning the IC Title on Father's Day was a nice feelgood moment. So yeah.


Agreed. I surprisingly liked it despite the fact I hate The Miz and don't care for Axel at all.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Jericho/HHH is kinda poor. Shitty in a lot of ways tbh. Just a mess.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I remember somebody saying that Orton/Punk match was complete and utter shit, so I decided not to watch it. Think it was Choke2Death who said it.

WWE just needs to go on a gimmick match freeze soon or something; no more gimmick matches until they know how to use them. I guess Punk Vs Heyman & Bryan Vs Orton are in the right direction of course, It's just that I never felt the hate between Bryan and Orton & I wish that they would have made their feud more about them and creating a unique atmosphere for each other instead of going about it in such a "Bryan Vs HHH GOON" way.

TLC can stay though, that show ALWAYS has a bunch of fun on it. Or atleast a little fun. I remember 2009 sucking though.

& OH THAT STEEL CHAIN SPOT. It's violence done in the perfect WWE Main Event style setting; eat it up motherfuckers. Always thought the Jericho cell was good but was missing a ton of necessary ingredients in order to be great.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Whatever, I'll do my own Top 100 of the Decade too. That is a pretty elite list too 

Is it wrong if I say that imo even though both are ***** worthy, I prefer Rock/Austin II to Austin/Angle? :side:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yep, very wrong. Mainly because only one is ***** and the other isn't even the best match they had together . Angle/Austin > Rock/Austin III > Rock/Austin II.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

#CalKnows

Austin/Benoit is better than all three though.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Nope. Angle/Austin *****. Austin/Benoit ****3/4.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Speak for yourself and others, WM 19 NEVER had me in pure chills and goosebumps like 17 did. Sure enough, 19 as a pure story was more flawlessly executed, but few times a match hooked me with sheer drama alone as much as Rock/Austin II. Not to mention, every move felt big and had purpose, the crowd was NUTS, and the finish, even if did kinda suck, was still shocking for what it was. But who the hell am I to talk, I have Taker/HHH III at ****3/4


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Nope.

**** 3/4 for both, with Austin/Benoit SLIGHTLY edging it out. Both, alongside Benoit/Jericho at the Rumble, happen to DESTROY anything on WM X-7 though.

Doesn't Cal love the End of an Era match just as much though?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Taker/HHH II and Taker/HHH III are both ****3/4 imo.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

#NW 1992 royal rumble

Davey just eliminated Dibiase and now the wrestling GOD walked in

Rock/scsa wm 19 is the best out of the three , I just watched them for the first time


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I have Taker/HHH at ****3/4 too .

I personally get CHILLS from the WM 19 match rather than WM 17. WM 19 was the big final chapter in a somewhat epic saga that had built up over years. Austin's last match (which wasn't known at the time but looking back adds sooo much to the whole thing too), Rock desperate to get that big W over Austin at WM after failing on two occasions; just everything about it. The WM 19 documentary plays a big part it making the whole thing seem huge too. Wish they'd do a WM documentary every year, it's one of my favourite DVD extras ever.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Was furious that Dibiase was out so early. (N)

edit The WM 19 doc as an extra to the WM20 DVD is awesome. Really enhances the Rock/Austin story.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

HHH wasn't around in 1992.

:HHH2


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I've got to rewatch Mania 17, but Rock/Austin at 19 is so brilliant. I can't stress enough the importance of Rock's character in that match. If it had just been same old face (which isn't the worst), it wouldn't have been as great. Hollywood Rock blew just about anything he had done out of the water, in my opinion.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> HHH wasn't around in 1992.
> 
> :HHH2


Pretty sure he was wrestling "Flying" Tony Roy in high school gymnasiums in the North East around that time :trips. DAT TERRORIZER


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Thank God I'm not alone 

I kinda facepalm at those who shit on it because of "how overdramatic it was" or because "it lacked use of the Cell". Sure, Shawn's not exactly a good actor, but then again, he did his job fine for what it was. Sure, the HIAC's brutality relies a lot on the Cell itself, but not always. And they DID use the Cell a couple of times - on the first few minutes  Plus, up until then, my wrestling mentality was that of those young kids when they first watch wrestling - spots and fast paced stuff are the coolest shit ever, fuck those slow Mark Henry storyline matches. It wasn't until I first watched Taker/HHH III as it happened (it was my first streamed WM ever ) that I realized how stupid I was being.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I thought Shawn only added to the match. Sure it was a bit over the top at times but it's fucking pro wrestling.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Pretty much everything about 19 was better in every single way. Pacing was better, selling was more grounded and less all over the place, the match was more concise and more organized in it's storytelling and it really helped. Rock had a career performance and carried a half-dead Austin to the MOTN on the greatest Wrestlemania of all time, who the hell would have guessed that?

Just you wait until time travel is invented & the main event of Wrestlemania 50 is Terra Ryzing Vs Jean Paul Levesque Vs Hunter Hearst Helmsley Vs Triple H for the Undisputed Championship of the world. Buys, baby .

End of an Era is fucking great unless you take your pro graps too seriously and can't have fun with it. I may be overgeneralizing things with that statement though, if it's not your cup of tea then it isn't your cup of tea, I get it.

TBH, I haven't watched that much Wrestling on TV lately because it just hasn't interested me apart from what HHH is doing. I don't care about Punk/Heyman until the cell match actually happens and Heyman is getting destroyed because the feud peaked with Punk/Brock like it should have and all of this Axel/Ryback nonsense seems a tad overdone. We need WWE Champion HHH/Punk/BROCK in order for me to find myself fully immersed again in all honesty, Cena's coming back and that's got me a little excited but I doubt he does much until Rumble season.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> HHH wasn't around in 1992.
> 
> :HHH2


:flair3

When I brought up End of an era yesterday, didnt get 1 response, I see who is drawing up here :argh:

Shawn only added to the match dont let anyone tell you otherwise, HAKU in now :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Lady Killer said:


> I thought Shawn only added to the match. Sure it was a bit over the top at times but it's fucking pro wrestling.


Exactly :agree:.

I also don't mind the whole "not much use of the cell" crap because the WHOLE POINT of a HIAC match is simply to keep the wrestlers in and everyone else out. That was the original concept of the match.

I do feel kinda sad when the match is brought up though, because for me it WAS the end of an era. I'm not sure I'll ever witness a match like that again in my lifetime. To have such an emotional connection to wrestlers (Undertaker and HBK, HHH to a much lesser extent), a period of time (well, multiple. Golden Era, beginning and end of AE) and to the who story arc (Undertaker/HBK, Undertaker/HBK career on the line, Undertaker/HHH, Undertaker/HHH with Undertaker looking to redeem himself after not being able to walk out of the ring the previous year, THE STREAK)... I honestly don't think I'll ever get THAT kind of feeling and emotion from any match and any pairing of wrestlers again, as much as I like a lot of current guys. I genuinely don't see how CM Punk Vs Daniel Bryan for instance, in 10 years time could have a match of that magnitude regardless of how it could be presented on TV. The magic has gone in a way .


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

A Cell match doesn't have to use the cell in a physical manner, it just needs to be a feud intense enough that it can warrant not using it. For instance; fuck Orton Vs Sheamus in the cell. I say this because the match was essentially a WWE propfest in a cell without any true hatred behind it. No nearfalls or great chain sequences could make me change my mind on that match, fuck that one for now.

I enjoy Punk/Ryback because it's Punk running away from a monster and being a real pussified piece of shit. End of an Era was an EXPERIENCE though.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I like End of an Era, but jesus christ it's so long. There's like 19 chokeslams, tombstones, and pedigrees. 



Cactus Jack said:


> What's the better feud ending gimmick match: Hell in a Cell or Last Man Standing?


It's most certainly Hell in a Cell. That match used to be SO important when it came around. Now, it can be used in a 3-week rivalry. :no:



Corporate KingOfKings said:


> I remember somebody saying that Orton/Punk match was complete and utter shit, so I decided not to watch it. Think it was Choke2Death who said it.


Nah, the July 8th match was actually really good imo at least. I'd check it out sometime, put it right behind their Mania 27 match personally.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

EVERY TIME (which is now like 5-6 times) I watch End of an Era, that Sweet Chin Music/Pedigree combo with Taker KICKING THE FUCK OUT, I fall out of my chair. Shawn's emotions only add that much more to it. Then at the end when H goes for the sledgehammer but Taker steps on it, and looks down and with his eyes, says, "Nope". That final crotch chop from Hunter before he walks into the tombstone says it all. Plus this:


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

So, according to loldirtsheets, WWE will be bringing back Bash at the Beach next year as a PPV.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Rather see them do Bash at the Beach then change the name of the May/June PPV every damn year


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

The atmosphere for Taker/Punk was insane though. Punk's entrance in particular just felt massive.

The lights going out when Punk's in the ring screaming like a madman "COME ON!" is some of the most boss imagery of 2013 WWE.

Then Taker rises... & OH SHIT. I just love it because it's the final stand for the CM Punk heel character in his quest for immortality, one of my absolute favorite characters ever and a manifestation of nearly two years of character work from Punk ever since the pipebomb & the quest for respect.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

The report said they'd be dropping HIAC or Battleground and adding another PPV to June. They need to drop HIAC, but REPLACE Payback. Two PPVs in one month is stupid.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> I like End of an Era, but jesus christ it's so long. There's like 19 chokeslams, tombstones, and pedigrees.


Well, it WAS End Of An Era. And it WAS Triple H and The Undertaker. It certainly wouldn't take one Tombstone to kill H at all, let alone at Mania, even if it is Taker :HHH2

Oh and yeah, when I first watched the SCM/Pedigree combo, I entered in cardiac stoppage.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Callamus said:


> Exactly :agree:.
> 
> I also don't mind the whole "not much use of the cell" crap because the WHOLE POINT of a HIAC match is simply to keep the wrestlers in and everyone else out. That was the original concept of the match.
> 
> I do feel kinda sad when the match is brought up though, because for me it WAS the end of an era. I'm not sure I'll ever witness a match like that again in my lifetime. To have such an emotional connection to wrestlers (Undertaker and HBK, HHH to a much lesser extent), a period of time (well, multiple. Golden Era, beginning and end of AE) and to the who story arc (Undertaker/HBK, Undertaker/HBK career on the line, Undertaker/HHH, Undertaker/HHH with Undertaker looking to redeem himself after not being able to walk out of the ring the previous year, THE STREAK)... I honestly don't think I'll ever get THAT kind of feeling and emotion from any match and any pairing of wrestlers again, as much as I like a lot of current guys. I genuinely don't see how CM Punk Vs Daniel Bryan for instance, in 10 years time could have a match of that magnitude regardless of how it could be presented on TV. The magic has gone in a way .


This x a million. Seriously, I know for a FACT I'll never feel that way after a match again. I was definitely emotional when they were walking up the ramp together, and you can tell they were too (was Undertaker teary eyed?!?). Having grown up watching them from the beginning, and then the 4-year story arc culminating with a hug at the top of the stage was just priceless. Doesn't hurt that they're my 3 favorite wrestlers of all time.


----------



## Raw2003 (Dec 20, 2012)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> The report said they'd be dropping HIAC or Battleground and adding another PPV to June. They need to drop HIAC, but REPLACE Payback. Two PPVs in one month is stupid.


Not if done right.


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

It can't work any other way than one of the PPVs being a lead in for another, which in theory is incredibly stupid and leads to us getting shows like Battleground 203, fuck that style of booking and thinking unless you have the patience and the talent to pull it off. 

It's something they did with Undertaker's feuds quite frequently; kept them alive via shenanigans until Taker gets his ultimate revenge against heel X. That's because Taker had the talent to go out with nearly anybody and make it a compelling program and/or get a wonderful match or two out of it. Motherfucker brings the best out of everybody he goes up against and that's a huge quality when talking about Undertaker being the greatest ever.

I don't think I'd be able to dispute it with anybody in a WWE realm.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Hey, Battleground still gave us *SHIELD/CODYDUST*. For what it was worth, it was still a better show than the fucking Royal Rumble this year. Good sweet Jesus. The RR match blinked out last year's but it was still underwhelming in RR match terms, the undercard wasn't horrendous but it was beyond unmemorable, and Punk/Rock was an abomination. At least BG still had the most badass PPV tag since Shield/Hell No & Ryback.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

You would be correct sir.

Royal Rumble still gives me fucking nightmares. Sure, the Rumble match was okay/good, but it couldn't save that fucking piece of shit show with one of the worst main events in recent history. It's a shame because Punk was on such a performance high, after the TLC with Ryback I was so optimistic about his ability to get a good match out of Rock. Then that match happened and it made me rage like I was 12 & HHH was losing or something.

I watched full three hour RAWs because I wanted to see if Punk would drop another all time classic promo or segment with Heyman, and he ALWAYS fucking delivered, even in the Rock feud. It's just the match quality was DISGUSTING and how the result meant Punk wouldn't go on last like he deserved enraged me. MEH, Punk-Taker ruled so I shouldn't care.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I really want WM29 so I can watch Punk/Taker in all its glory again.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Callamus said:


> Best of the 00's, and no lists yet. They'll be handing them in to me at the end of the month, then I'll put together a definitive list like the WWF/E and WCW ones we did . Just wish I didn't give up on it half way through, but I just couldn't get into it like the previous two. Shall be interesting for me to see what the top 100 is though!


Well, that would be much help to me. I'll go through that list and another I found to flesh out my Japanese best of 2000s to make the definitive list.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Indeed. I was very optimistic too, Punk was just off probably the best year of his career ever, in both character and in-ring performance wise (especially in-ring, he just couldn't have a bad 1-on-1 match in 2012). It gave me a lot of hope that Rock's ring rust (and DEEP lose of cardio) would be masked by a very pump-up, storyline based badass contest. The first few minutes of it are pretty decent - the brawling and Punk's gritty attack on Rock's injured ribs and the latter's convincing selling made for a good start. Unfortunely those moments were the peak of that piece of shit. Rest holds, no-selling, rest holds, sloppiness, rest holds, WORST FINISH EVER... did I mention rest holds? The good parts were totally overshadowed by the bad, to the point a DUD wouldn't be enough.

But speaking of optimistic, now that he's confirmed to be in the 20th Anniversary Of Raw DVD, if we ever got a new Benoit DVD or blu-ray (though it would just be Hard Knocks 2 tbh), what matches would make it? I doubt anything from 2007 would be there. I'd guess some of his WCW work with Malenko or Eddie, as well as a Jericho match, the Ladder match if I'd have to guess, definitely the 2004 RR and WM 20 Triple Threat, probably the Orton match, and (ugh) one or two Angle matches.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

We're never getting a Benoit DVD, so I can't fantasize about it only to be ultimately let down.

Allegedly we could be getting a big Mysterio doc in 2014 which would be AMAZING.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

New Rey DVD :mark:. About time he had a proper doc released too. His 619 one or whatever is HILARIOUSLY BAD as its mostly done in Kayfabe :lmao.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Rey deserves much more than just a new DVD. He deserves the fucking Hall Of Fame NOW. I think he might be the leader of the 2015 HOF. It would be glorious to see Rey's legacy right up there with his hermano Eddie's.

Oh yeah, WWE, now here's a Greatest Rivalries DVD you HAVE to do - Eddie vs. Rey. The history between those two expands MUCH beyond just WWE. You talk about over a decade of history together, that doesn't just come done thanks to backstage politics, Iron Man matches and Montreal Screwjobs :side:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

A greatest rivalry DVD on Eddie/Rey wouldn't really work without Eddie being there .


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

you know you spend to much time here when you send out a text and write " : lmao" thinking it will be this :lmao 

Yea I havent experienced the same feeling after watching a match since hhh/taker HIAC, I literally thought it was the best thign ever after it


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Shit. Just watched Rock/Austin from 17. To start, Austin gets that monster Texas pop. This is just a sweet fucking brawl, with some moves thrown in. Around the time the length of the match was starting to bother me, Vince comes down and the finishing sequence is initiated. Rock's unwillingness to stay down and Austin's frustration, combined with JR's GOAT announcing makes for an awesome fucking ending. ****3/4


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Callamus said:


> A greatest rivalry DVD on Eddie/Rey wouldn't really work without Eddie being there .


Make a computerized version of him, play some recordings of his voice and it's done 

Just kidding, it really wouldn't be the same, but oh well. Bret and Shawn together isn't the same without them fighting either and look where that went.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Okay, that's one thing that's better from X-7; JR's commentating. HOLY FUCK he's great in that match.

Speaking of JR, I'll always remember him for having that connection with HHH when HHH was on top of the wrestling world, that feud reminiscent of Heenan/Hogan back in the day when Heenan used to be on commentary bashing Hogan for every face thing he did, except the heel/face dynamic was reversed obviously. JR getting a pinfall victory over HHH must have been the sweetest thing ever, I'll remember it for me bitching at Batista through the TV for ever letting that incident occur. Just how JR sold HHH's devious heel tactics through his commentary, and how he did it with such emotion... Will we ever have THAT dynamic again? I doubt it.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

If they ever do another greatest rivalry documentary, they'll definitely have to change up the format imo. A sit down with each other and JR probably wouldn't work the same for anyone else as with HBK and Bret they DID have a real life, genuine rivalry and dislike for each other for so many years. Having them sit down together and JR grilling them was perfect, but doing it for anyone else would seem extremely forced most likely.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Hell no. JR is far and away the play by play commentator the business has ever seen. His ability to communicate a story and call the action at the same time without having to repeat exclamations is just tremendous. 

Example: DX vs the ShowMahons at Unforgiven 2006 inside the cell. Not the greatest match ever, but JR made it sound like a fucking classic. 

I was glad he got the last word in at End of an Era. Cole still tried to ruin it with "Streak's over! Streak's over!"


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> I've got to rewatch Mania 17, but Rock/Austin at 19 is so brilliant. I can't stress enough the importance of Rock's character in that match. If it had just been same old face (which isn't the worst), it wouldn't have been as great. *Hollywood Rock blew just about anything he had done out of the water, in my opinion*.


Agreed.

We've agreed on that in the past too,

I dont think people understand how brilliant and fresh of a character that was. How that all came together was just smart planning overall.

Still mad I didn't get to see 2003 Rock square off with Michaels.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Absolutely. Rock had been getting boo'ed in 2002 before he left, so they capitalized on it, and when he returned they turned him, which exactly what they need to do with Cena instead of having him smile and laugh it off every night. And Rock wasn't even on top half as long as Cena has been.

Cena coming out after Mania 29 and talking about a "heel turn" is so fpalm.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Hell no. JR is far and away the play by play commentator the business has ever seen. His ability to communicate a story and call the action at the same time without having to repeat exclamations is just tremendous.
> 
> *Example: DX vs the ShowMahons at Unforgiven 2006 inside the cell. Not the greatest match ever, but JR made it sound like a fucking classic. *
> 
> I was glad he got the last word in at End of an Era. Cole still tried to ruin it with "Streak's over! Streak's over!"


I remember JR owning in this match big time actually now that I think about it.

Speaking of that match; I'm a fan. Think I gave it **** 1/4* on the last go around, and alot of that is due to Big Show being a complete boss throughout the entire thing and owning everybody. Michaels' bumping was superb as well. DX Vs Legacy on the other hand? I thought it was quite dull given the circumstances.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Absolutely. Rock had been getting boo'ed in 2002 before he left, so they capitalized on it, and when he returned they turned him, which exactly what they need to do with Cena instead of having him smile and laugh it off every night. And Rock wasn't even on top half as long as Cena has been.
> 
> Cena coming out after Mania 29 and talking about a "heel turn" is so fpalm.


True.

Ya know speaking of Cena,

The redemption story with Cena actually could have been so boss if built properly through the 2012/13 year. It really could. Had a TON of potential.

With Brock coming back though, not sure how they would have hand;ed the night after Mania though.

Oh and I totally got you and KingofKings mixed up in reference to Hollywood Rock talk :lmao

Damn HHH accounts lol


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Unforgiven Cell is super fun. Not the best match ever but I found it to be really entertaining.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

HHH marks unite. Now all we need is Starbuck in here banning the haters and we've got ourselves a revolution folks.

Official DVD/Match/Show/HHH Discussion thread.

We needed JR when Brock came back. Cole's "Oh My!" does nothing for me.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Official DVD/Match/Show/HHH Discussion thread.


:mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Starbuck ain't got the balls to fuck with my thread. Literally.

OFFICIALLY UNDERTAKER DISCUSSION THREAD + SOME DVD STUFF TOO.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Agreed CAL.

Remember when Triple H carried Undertaker at Wrestlemania XXVII?

8*D


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

HHH carrying Taker at KOTR 2002 was even better :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The only time HHH carries people is when he's moving their corpse to the grave to BURY them 8*D.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Anyone reckon we will see Lesnar vs Sheamus some day?

I really need that match in my life.

I hope Im not alone in that.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Brock vs Sheamus. Jesus. Please a million times over.

I don't see it, but I'll always hope.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Brock/Sheamus would be fucking sweet, but I want Taker/Brock and Brock/Bryan before that.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

All three would leave me :mark:

Brock vs Bryan actually has a good chance to happen these days. Which is one back in 2012 I didn't think could possibly go down.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Yeah all three of those sound REALLY good.

Even if Taker/Brock has happened in the past, I think it would be great. Especially with Brock being a whole new beast and Taker being his usual deadman, bad ass self.

Brock/Bryan is self explanatory. Another match I would love to see

But man, Sheamus/Brock just has so much GREATNESS written on it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

vs Taker would be epic & def iconic with the status Brock has reached.

vs Bryan would be the most immense underdog story around. If vs Punker delivered in something that immense, vs Bryan has all that potential. Possibly more.

vs Sheamus, oof. The kind of war where it'll leave you sore just after watching. I can see Brock trying to dominate, and succeeding, but not without Sheamus being a force giving Brock a taste of his own medicine in the process. He'd be the great white shark who wouldn't let go. Brock would be glad once it's over. I can map out the fun in my head.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

BROCK/Bryan would be fucking amazing.

Brock/Taker will be great if it indeed happens.

Brock/Sheamus would of course be a hard-hitting BEAST FEST.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

You guys are making me excited for three matches that wont even be happening any time soon. FUCK.


When is Sheamus due back by the way?

And speaking of returns, hopefully Brock shows his face soon. 

Its exciting to think of what his next match up will be. 

Still a lot of possibilities.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

BROCK vs Orton and BROCK vs Sheamus... :mark: These matches happen and my life is complete!



Corporate KingOfKings said:


> We're never getting a Benoit DVD, so I can't fantasize about it only to be ultimately let down.


You'd be pleased to find out that WWE has hinted at a "Best of Benoit" on bluray for 2014.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I expect Brock back beginning of Feb tbh 

Come the fuck back for crying out loud.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Sheamus is probably gonna be a surprise return for the Rumble. Only my guess.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Sheamus is due back early 2014 I believe. Probably a surprise Rumble return. 

BROCK plz. 

edit FUCK Cody


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Well if Early 2014 is the plan. yea he's def making a Rumble return. Should be cool.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

I'd love a Lesnar/ Sheamus fued, but I doubt we get one  

Lesnars next 3 or 4 opponents 

Cena or punk again 

Taker 

Bryan 

The Rock


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> Sheamus is due back early 2014 I believe. Probably a surprise Rumble return.
> 
> BROCK plz.
> 
> edit FUCK Cody




Sheamus demolishing fools in the Rumble will be legit as hell.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

BROCK VS SHEAMUS makes me feel funny in my testicles. Hope we get it at some point. Seems like the perfect SummerSlam match. Summer = beach. Beach = shark. Sheamus = great white. Great while = Lesnar F-5'ing a shark during a SummerSlam commercial way back when. All together = PERFECT FEUD. :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

SummerSlam? OMG PLEASE. I COULD POSSIBLY EXPERIENCE IT LIVE.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Callamus said:


> BROCK VS SHEAMUS makes me feel funny in my testicles. Hope we get it at some point. Seems like the perfect SummerSlam match. Summer = beach. Beach = shark. Sheamus = great white. Great while = Lesnar F-5'ing a shark during a SummerSlam commercial way back when. All together = PERFECT FEUD. :mark:


lol, it would be funny if they cut promos based around Great White Sharks. "Fella, you F5'd a shark years ago, I don't think you can F5 me at SummerSlam. Because THE GREAT WHITE SHEAMUS will not give you the chance when I Brogue Kick your arse!"

I miss SHEAMUS.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Speaking of Sheamus, this made me laugh today:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Sounds like someone specific. :kane


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

With the discussion being Shemus, who else loved his HIAC match with Orton? I think it's pretty fucking underrated.


----------



## Raw2003 (Dec 20, 2012)

ATF said:


> Rey deserves much more than just a new DVD. He deserves the fucking Hall Of Fame NOW. I think he might be the leader of the 2015 HOF. It would be glorious to see Rey's legacy right up there with his hermano Eddie's.
> 
> Oh yeah, WWE, now here's a Greatest Rivalries DVD you HAVE to do - Eddie vs. Rey. The history between those two expands MUCH beyond just WWE. You talk about over a decade of history together, that doesn't just come done thanks to backstage politics, Iron Man matches and Montreal Screwjobs :side:


Yeah like in WCW with the LWO


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Not like Mysterio's impact on wrestling means nothing if he's not in the HOF yet. Small potatoes until they finally follow through. I wouldn't say it holds any real stock.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Callamus said:


> Starbuck ain't got the balls to fuck with my thread. Literally.
> 
> OFFICIALLY UNDERTAKER DISCUSSION THREAD + SOME DVD STUFF TOO.


Is that right? 

:HHH2


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

FUCK


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

:jpl

For proof before I change it back


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cal cal'ed up big time here. His heart was in the right place, at least.

Undertaker plz.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Official HHH & TAKER ARE TEH BESTEST EVA Discussion Thread???...


----------



## Shepard (Apr 30, 2011)

/the why kurt angle sucks thread :side:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'll compromise more with Shep's, tbhayley.

:usangle


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

I changed it back to keep the peace. Don't want a war erupting in here but that will teach that Cally fella not to question my modthority again... :side:


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Literally loled when I saw the new title of this thread. My mom was like, what is it? :lol



xdoomsayerx said:


> With the discussion being Shemus, who else loved his HIAC match with Orton? I think it's pretty fucking underrated.


ME. Blew away my expectations when I watched it from Orton's dvd. Gave it ****. Should probably watch it again soon. And I'll say it before anyone else does, the Irish Curse backbreaker on the steps was stupid.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah it was stupid but the rest of the match was really good. Always been big on it.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Did ATF start that thread :troll


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I see you waited until I was offline to do it. NO BALLS~!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cal which Undertaker vs Big Show match did you like the most from 2008? I swear nothing can touch the No Mercy match. And the LMS & Cages are great themselves.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Probably No Mercy... but I could do with watching their LMS again. Just for the hell of it . Cage is below the two but still really, really good. Sad that their casket match blew so hard .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Wished I had Cyber Sunday '08 on DVD. Want to watch the LMS again too + Hardy vs Bourne.

Casket match never happened.

I want to check out their Smackdown 2009 match for fun. Don't remember it well other than the finish, which was shades of No Mercy.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I gots SD 09 on my PC so I could upload it if you can't find a link for it.

Wanna watch that LMS match now. Just gotta figure out if I have it on a disc somewhere. Doubt I own CS 08... Undertaker release? Bugger, just the cage on DVD. TO THE INTERNET!


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Someone should do an Undertaker vs. Big Show project. They had a pretty good match on the 8/14/03 edition of Smackdown too, the same one I always pimp with the great WGTT vs. Mysterio/Kidman match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well if anyone does, I happen to have a handy list of all their TV matches together. You know. Just because .

SD
August 26th 1999
September 9th 1999
September 16th 1999
April 12th 2001
January 3rd 2002
August 14th 2003
August 28th 2003
October 23rd 2003
December 5th 2008
February 6th 2009
February 13th 2009


Raw
May 3rd 1999
June 7th 1999
July 12th 1999
July 26th 1999
August 2nd 1999
August 23rd 1999
August 30th 1999
September 13th 1999
September 20th 1999
March 12th 2001
April 9th 2001


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Might just go ahead and ask for the upload instead of trying to look for it online.

I'll do the project. If I find everything. Those '99 matches - all two minutes of something. Stupid attitude era.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I have all their singles matches bar LMS, Casket and NWO 03 . Might be my next project, which can work into my UNDERTAKER MEGADEADMAN PROJECT or something.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Woooo! I sparked a project.  Hopefully I'll have the same influence on people's opinions of Del Rio when this project is all said and done. 

Cody which ones are you looking for?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Boo seems my list includes some multiman matches two. SD 09, one is a tag the other is a 4 way .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Woooo! I sparked a project.  Hopefully I'll have the same influence on people's opinions of Del Rio when this project is all said and done.
> 
> Cody which ones are you looking for?


Del Rio the great.

Shoot. All, really. Don't own any of tv ones on DVD. I'd have to try and look on the streaming sites atm to see which are available first. Haven't done that yet.



Callamus said:


> Boo seems my list includes some multiman matches two. SD 09, one is a tag the other is a 4 way .


I remember digging the tag when it aired & the four way is quite a bit of joy iirc.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

redskins25 said:


> Did ATF start that thread :troll


*Fuck*... you got me :side:

Everybody talked about Bork/Bryan, Bork/Taker or Bork/Sheamus... why no mention of *Bork/Cesaro*? I'd shit my pants w/that.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

b/c that one has no chance of happening. We kept it briefly on par with reality opposed to simply being Brock vs "this guy" dream match that makes our pants soggy.

but of course that would be insane to witness.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Callamus said:


> I see you waited until I was offline to do it. NO BALLS~!


8*D

Brock/Seamus would be immense. I'd love to see that.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Cesaro powering Lesnar around would be :mark:. Imagine Lesnar's reaction to the giant swing!!!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

They would exchange giant swings. That'll be half the match.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Where's the Official Match/Show/DVD/Stories About Haku No-Selling Tasers Thread that I was promised in 2011 (prove me wrong)?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Cowboy Bob Orton & Haku Vs Tasers would be the GOAT squash match ever.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I heard Meng threatened Cal he'd eat The Streak at breakfast if that happened.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

IT'S ON


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Brock vs. Sheamus I unfortunately don't see happening because I really think they're gonna bring Sheamus back as a heel. Idk for sure, but the company is in desperate need of top heels atm if you ask me. Yeah you've got HHH & The Shield (notice I skipped Orton because he hasn't convinced me yet) along with Del Rio but it doesn't get much deeper than that. HHH isn't wrestling yet either. Bryan, Punk, Cena, Rhodes Bros are on top of the world right now. Well, Cena will be soon. The 'E needs some more heels.

Brock vs. Bryan could honestly top Brock vs. Punk imo. Since Bryan will work much more stiffer.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yeah, y'all talk about dream matches?

*Brock vs. Meng in a Kill Or Be Killed match.*


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Between now and WM 31 (2015) Brock probably has 3-4 matches left since he only does Mania, Summerslam and a third PPV. It'd be great if they could resign to a similar deal after the current one runs out.

With the limited number of PPVs left, the only real given is putting him with Taker. There's no telling what they'd do with him after that. I know what we'd do, but WWE? No telling. That said, Brock/Sheamus or Bryan would rock on so many levels, and each would be unique matches.

As it relates to Cena, if they wanted to really make the redemption story real, he should have lost to Brock at ER, a result that would have benefited everyone. Brock losing his first match? fpalm fpalm NOT WON SUPERSTAR OF THE FUCKING YEAR. At least he failed the MITB cash-in, and kept losing to Punk, and got pinned by Laurinitis. LOL at them blaming Rock for dat divorce.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I'd prefer a taser on a pole match so Meng would have the clear advantage. Even if Brock got the taser. If Meng gets it he shocks himself in the neck and becomes an electrically-powered super villain.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Babyfaces are good in the main event area. However in the midcard they're the biggest pile of shit around. Not counting guys like Tons of Funk or PTP's b/c they're never used well enough. All the other ones who are...oh lord. Tear my eyes out.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Sheamus, Christian, & Mysterio just all need to come back now. I'm tired of seeing Ryback, Axel, Kofi, & Truth on PPVs.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Shit. Truth? Kofi? Santino? Khali? GOAT midcard faces.

I'd love to see Mysterio back. Axel and Ryback need to fuck off to where ever I can't see them on television.

Oh yeah, Henry MUST be back. His fake retirement is still one of the greatest segments this year.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Why list those heels though? They'll be around b/c regardless. The other two, yeah. They can be replaced with talent. Damn injuries. Don't forget Henry either.

Still like Ryback and it seems the company does too so :hb


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

How'd I forget Henry? Jesus. I'm still not sold on Ryback at all. Where he should've been throwing Punk around like a ragdoll, he decides to lock in restholds. At least his Cena series was better than expected and TLC with Punk was fun, plus the Bryan matches. Look at who his opponents in all of those were though. Axel can go away forever. I have NO idea what anyone could see in him.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I wish JoMo would come back, always liked him as a mid card face, and he blows guys like Kofi, Truth, Santino out of the fucking water.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Skip Sheffield was pretty good. (In-ring) Ryback needs a Dazzler to survive or he fails. :dazzler

Good thing he as a character has been working. DA BIG GUY~ :ryback

EDIT: Forgot to say as of now I'll forever refer The Miz's F4 as *The Figure Leg Attack Lock* _(thanks Cal)_ 8*D


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> How'd I forget Henry? Jesus. I'm still not sold on Ryback at all. Where he should've been throwing Punk around like a ragdoll, he decides to lock in restholds. At least his Cena series was better than expected and TLC with Punk was fun, plus the Bryan matches. Look at who his opponents in all of those were though. Axel can go away forever. I have NO idea what anyone could see in him.


Won't deny that, but that's usually saved till the end once he works vs Punk. Which is too bad, but at least he's still a solid big man worker. Opposed to someone like Michael Elgin who's shit with it. Ryback isn't going around working like three different types of wrestlers while having a reputation of strength behind him. That stupidity is mind numbing.

Ryback works like a beast vs Danielson. So lucky there. Not gonna say having the benefit of good workers doesn't assist him either. Nothing wrong with that. He has the leads do their job and he pulls his weight too. That's fair game. Christian did it with Ezekial Jackson and we're all glad for it.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Skip Sheffield? They've tried to rip off two character with each incarnation of Reeves. Just terrible.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Ryback needs to go, no one has given 2 shits about him for almost 7 months. As for heels throw guys like Sheamus , Kane and Henry back.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

ATF said:


> Skip Sheffield was pretty good. (In-ring) Ryback needs a Dazzler to survive or he fails. :dazzler
> 
> Good thing he as a character has been working. DA BIG GUY~ :ryback



I'm on record as being a fan of Ryback, and I still believe he can end up being a Batista-esque worker in the ring. He just seems uncomfortable in the ring at times, like he's not exactly sure what he should be doing and why he should be doing it. Trips feud with Dave really brought him out of his shell and allowed him to grow as a character and performer. I think Ryback needs a prolonged feud with a good vet who can help him out. Just my .02 cents. I feel like his charisma and look are too good to waste, the WWE needs to help him every way possible. Maybe a nice long feud with Henry, Big Show, Kane, or Sheamus could do the trick.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Ryback Vs Rey should happen.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Is the Batista comparison meant to be a compliment? b/c that's not nice...

:hayley3


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

:lmao This shit


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Is the Batista comparison meant to be a compliment? b/c that's not nice...
> 
> :hayley3



Oh hush you. I meant it as he could become the kind of guy who can be carried to fantastic matches by great workers, and can hold his own with average guys.

Batista has 5-10 matches that I consider absolutely great. His Taker series alone is :mark:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Callamus said:


> Ryback Vs Rey should happen.


Can't really be much different than the Bryan Danielson vs. Ryan Reeves matches, can it? :hmm:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> Oh hush you. I meant it as he could become the kind of guy who can be carried to fantastic matches by great workers, and can hold his own with average guys.
> 
> Batista has 5-10 matches that I consider absolutely great. His Taker series alone is :mark:


WRESTLEMANIA 23


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> WRESTLEMANIA 23



I can't decide which is the best, Mania, LMS, or HiaC for the Taker vs Tista series. All are **** + bad ass matches. They stole the show with that match at WM though, very difficult to do when "Mr. Wrestlemania" (how Undertaker isn't known as Mr. WM I will never know) is on the card with a capable opponent like Cena.

Edit- anyone have thoughts on the Evolution vs Benoit/Jericho/Edge match on Raw? Or the Los Guerreros vs Angle/Benoit tag from Rebellion 2002?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Cactus Jack said:


> I can't decide which is the best, Mania, LMS, or HiaC for the Taker vs Tista series.


The answer is Cyber Sunday .

Well it's my fav anyway. WM 23 is probably the BEST but CS is super fun and right up there with WM in quality too.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> The answer is Cyber Sunday .
> 
> Well it's my fav anyway. WM 23 is probably the BEST but CS is super fun and right up there with WM in quality too.


Doh, I always forget about that one. I prefer WM/LMS/HiaC to that one though, but it absolutely should have been mentioned as I think it deserves ****+ too.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

WrestleMania for me.

Don't like the HIAC match. Never clicked with me. A bit on the boring side.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> I can't decide which is the best, Mania, LMS, or HiaC for the Taker vs Tista series. All are **** + bad ass matches. They stole the show with that match at WM though, very difficult to do when "Mr. Wrestlemania" (how Undertaker isn't known as Mr. WM I will never know) is on the card with a capable opponent like Cena.
> 
> Edit- anyone have thoughts on the Evolution vs Benoit/Jericho/Edge match on Raw? Or the Los Guerreros vs Angle/Benoit tag from Rebellion 2002?


HIAC is my least favorite of them. CS and Mania are battling for #1. Cage match deserves more love, though.

The Evolution tag is wonderful, both of them, specially the elimination version of that line-up. Rebellion 02 is good too, not as great as NM with Edge & Rey.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

:mark: watching the SD main event. ALL DAT POTENTIAL!!!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Potential only if the fuckhead stays out.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Cyber Sunday for,,,,,, I don't hate their mania match, but I'll always disagree with anyone that says it stole the show that night. My boner for HBK/ Cena is through the roof lol.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Honestly not sure which one you consider the fuck head :lmao.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> I wish JoMo would come back, always liked him as a mid card face, and he blows guys like Kofi, Truth, Santino out of the fucking water.


JoMo plz 



The Primer said:


> Is the Batista comparison meant to be a compliment? b/c that's not nice...
> 
> :hayley3


THE ANIMAL

Batista/Taker series :mark:

edit I love HBK/Cena too.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:lmao

Here's a hint, it's not Randal. I'm cool with him.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

ARE YOU REFERRING TO BIG E LANGSTON?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well it could be worse... the other guy could have been kept in the match. 

Crowd are fucking SHIT for the match. I swear they ONLY make noise if someone hits a big move. Everything in between = SILENCE which makes the match a little dull to sit through .


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Big E is it then?


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Was gonna post something about the Smackdown main event, then I realized I'd be spoiling something. Stay tuned!

Ok never mind, everyone else has already spoiled it. 



The Primer said:


> Won't deny that, but that's usually saved till the end once he works vs Punk. Which is too bad, but at least he's still a solid big man worker. Opposed to someone like Michael Elgin who's shit with it. Ryback isn't going around working like three different types of wrestlers while having a reputation of strength behind him. That stupidity is mind numbing.
> 
> Ryback works like a beast vs Danielson. So lucky there. Not gonna say having the benefit of good workers doesn't assist him either. Nothing wrong with that. He has the leads do their job and he pulls his weight too. That's fair game. Christian did it with Ezekial Jackson and we're all glad for it.


Oh god yes, Ryback certainly works better formulas than Elgin. Talk about a guy that has LOADS of potential but is not being taught or working with the right people whatsoever. No wonder no one will pull the trigger with him...


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Smackdown crowds usually aren't anything special. The last good one was VEGAS. 8*D

SD's on in less than three hours here, and I just woke up and haven't even gone to the gym yet. This is what I get for watching my SummerSlam DVDs until 5 this morning :ziggler1


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> ARE YOU REFERRING TO BIG E LANGSTON?


AHHHHH



Jack Evans 187 said:


> Oh god yes, Ryback certainly works better formulas than Elgin. Talk about a guy that has LOADS of potential but is not being taught or working with the right people whatsoever. No wonder no one will pull the trigger with him...


No kidding. While I dislike him and loathe AR Fox, I approached their PWG match with some possible potential in the realm of the every fun big guy vs little guy formula. Instead it was a total farce of a match and not even worked like how it should. Even Excalibur made the point on commentary to say this: _"Huh. this is a lot more even than I was expected. *chuckles*"_ Says it all.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

So I was invited to a Halloween party tonight and I'm not going because I'd rather watch wrestling on my only off day in a 10 day span. Is this normal? :lol



The Primer said:


> No kidding. While I dislike him and loathe AR Fox, I approached their PWG match with some possible potential in the realm of the every fun big guy vs little guy formula. Instead it was a total farce of a match and not even worked like how it should. Even Excalibur made the point on commentary to say this: _"Huh. this is a lot more even than I was expected. *chuckles*"_ Says it all.


Wait, so you've watched TEN already? Did I miss your thoughts somewhere? Last I remember reading was you surprisingly enjoying Is Your Body Ready.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I hate costumes, so I don't think that's weird at all to dodge a Halloween party.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I don't think I posted 'em except for a brief bit on the insanity that was the main event. Or maybe I did b/c I think I crapped on Elgin vs Fox already somewhere too. Wait, that was only in the last wrestling match watched thread. Not in the indie thread.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> So I was invited to a Halloween party tonight and I'm not going because I'd rather watch wrestling on my only off day in a 10 day span. Is this normal? :lol


I'm considering skipping my university's homecoming/rivalry game carnival, parade, and pep rally to eat pizza and watch wrestling, so I'd say that's normal 

I'll still probably end up going, but I'll end up eating frozen food or leftovers instead of pizza while watching some WRASSLING.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Pep rally!? Who goes to those?  jk brah. You go to Nevada?



HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> I hate costumes, so I don't think that's weird at all to dodge a Halloween party.


Same here. Glad I'm not alone.



The Primer said:


> I don't think I posted 'em except for a brief bit on the insanity that was the main event. Or maybe I did b/c I think I crapped on Elgin vs Fox already somewhere too. Wait, that was only in the last wrestling match watched thread. Not in the indie thread.


Hmm, I think I remember you saying something about the insane main event. Oh well. I need to get on that show soon. Maybe tonight? I don't fucking know. There's too much wrestling, not enough time.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Fuck parties. Fuck social events. Fuck crowded places. Fuck people.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

I'd rather wear a suit than a costume at a halloween party.

Although I would wear the 97-99 Kane costume if I had one  :mark:


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I wasn't gonna dress up in the slightest if I were to go anyway. Hosters would've called me a "party pooper."


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I'm going downtown for a MONSTER'S BASH event tomorrow.

I'm dressing as Flo from the Progressive commercials :lmao


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I'll stand by youuuuu

FLO :lmao Fuckin great.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Hmm, I think I remember you saying something about the insane main event. Oh well. I need to get on that show soon. Maybe tonight? I don't fucking know. There's too much wrestling, not enough time.


My rundown:

Opener was classic PWG FUN~! Loved it and the ideal match to start the anniversary show. That's what has been missing from PWG a lot this year.

Cage vs Nese = (Y) Good debut match for Nese in the company.

Hooligans vs RockNES & FIST vs London & Kendrick were solid, but that's at best. Nothing that's worth seeing, but they're not bad. FIST vs London & Kendrick did start off in brilliant fashion, tbhayley.

O'Reilly is growing on me. Had himself a real nicely wrestled bout vs the underrated TJ Perkins here. If he's controlled, he's good. Less Davey BS and more of what he produced with & vs Cole.

Elgin vs Fox was a DUD. Why are these morons booked in PWG?

Guerilla Warfare was fast and nutty. Not as great as the previous with Callihan vs Younger, but one moment in it was honestly the craziest thing I may have ever seen in my life.

Ladder match was 100% exactly how you'd expect it to be. Good friggin lord. Madness. Rich Swann's body was in the most pain. You'll see eventually.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Pep rally!? Who goes to those?  jk brah. You go to Nevada?


Yep. I've always wanted to participate a pep rally because I was on the football team in high school (wasn't very good), so I missed out 

Hm..to watch wrestling or get my ass into the gym? Ugh, decisions.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> I'm going downtown for a MONSTER'S BASH event tomorrow.
> 
> I'm dressing as Flo from the Progressive commercials :lmao


:lmao

Too much.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

PGSucks said:


> Yep. I've always wanted to participate a pep rally because I was on the football team in high school (wasn't very good), so I missed out
> 
> Hm..to watch wrestling or get my ass into the gym? Ugh, decisions.


Well I had a shitty day at the gym and it's cold as balls outside, so just watch some wrasslin. I recommend some DEL RIO to tide you over until this weekend. 

Notice that you live in Nevada and I'm in Virginia, so there's probably a massive difference in the weather. :lol


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> S*o I was invited to a Halloween party tonight and I'm not going because I'd rather watch wrestling on my only off day in a 10 day span. Is this normal? :*lol


Bro ?

I'm trying to be either a construction worker or Bret Hart for one :lol I think I have all the stuff to

I need to get my ass in a gym as well


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Corey what's been your favorite Del Rio match during his WWE tenure?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Can someone atleast ask me how the hell I am being bret hart plz


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

redskins25 said:


> Bro ?
> 
> I'm trying to be either a construction worker or Bret Hart for one :lol I think I have all the stuff to
> 
> I need to get my ass in a gym as well


BRO, I'm not single so the party scene just isn't for me sometimes. Plus my last experience with liquor waas SO BAD that I've drank nothing but beer ever since. :lol BRET HART!?



The Primer said:


> Corey what's been your favorite Del Rio match during his WWE tenure?


If we're talking his whole tenure, than as of right now it's probably the Summerslam match with Christian or Payback vs. Ziggler. I actually think pretty highly of his Main Event match with Ziggler too, so there's a sleeper pick.

If we're talking just what I've gotten through in the DEL RIO PROJECT thus far, the Ladder match with Christian is the highest rated at *** 3/4 but my personal _favorites_ would be RAW 8/22 vs. Morrison, Mania 27 vs. Edge, and the 10/8/10 Smackdown match against Mysterio. All 3 are so much fun. You obviously know I like the Kofi match from EC 2011 too.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Gonna wear a batman shirt, leather jacket & ratty jeans?

We're in agreement on his overall favorites. Del Rio vs Christian & Del Rio vs Ziggler from PPV this year are without a doubt his best work. Both of those blow my mind. The Christian match is breathtaking.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Gonna wear a batman shirt, leather jacket & ratty jeans?





Jack Evans 187 said:


> BRO, I'm not single so the party scene just isn't for me sometimes. Plus my last experience with liquor waas SO BAD that I've drank nothing but beer ever since. :lol BRET HART!?


I'm joking with you Corey, I'd do that same if I had 10 day of work ahead of me and I'm not a massive drinker so agree to

I have my sister's pink shirt that somehow fits me, black sweats a leather jacket,long white socks, and I wonder if they sell those sunglasses. It will probably look terrible so I'll just go back to being a construction worker, got the hard hat and every thing. Its cold as fuck up here so idk

debating if I should watch sd or payback again ?


Favorite Del Rio match has to be Payback with zig zag, I love their main event as well


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I go as Cactus Jack every year and people bitch because it doesn't look like I've dressed up at all, since I wear that Wanted: Dead shirt and a red flannel all the time anyway.

I was "the most interesting man in the world" from the Dos Equis commercial last year though, and my accent slowly devolved to Eddie Guerrero Chicano the drunker I got.

My best was when I got a priest costume from Party City, put that on, then got a cabbage patch doll from my friends sister, put a dog collar and leash on the baby doll, and drug it around behind me. Good times.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

I'll be joker for the 3rd year in a row


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I need to pop on some wrestling atm. Got that ol tough decision of what to pick per usual.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Me and my friends are being the ZOLTAN guys from "Dude, where's my car?" :lol.

Just getting really high here tonight with a few, drinking's reserved for tomorrow's huge fucking bash downtown.

****** for the hell of it.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Del Rio/Punk/Cena is certainly one of his best matches in the 'E. Payback is of course really good, but him with those two in the cell is just sweet. Survivor Series vs Punk is also a fun watch.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Random pick: Evan Bourne vs Chris Jericho from Fatal Four Way sounds worth my time atm.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> I need to pop on some wrestling atm. Got that ol tough decision of what to pick per usual.



When you've already seen every match ever, I bet it would be difficult to decide 

I'm watching Evolution vs Edge/Jericho/Benoit from Raw right before Summerslam 2004. Fun fun stuff, Naitch is just the best, period. I will never get sick of that man.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Might decide to cram an Evolution tag or two. Wait, I should watch Steiners vs Quebecers per arrangement from last night. Yeah, that's gonna work.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> When you've already seen every match ever, I bet it would be difficult to decide
> 
> I'm watching Evolution vs Edge/Jericho/Benoit from Raw right before Summerslam 2004. Fun fun stuff, Naitch is just the best, period. I will never get sick of that man.


^^ could you provide a link sir, and yes he is

:lmao @ Evan I'm picturing it right now, that fucking movie


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> ^^ could you provide a link sir, and yes he is
> 
> :lmao @ Evan I'm picturing it right now, that fucking movie




Here you go chief

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mmVKQHO_GSQ


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Quebecers just totally outworked the Steiners in that one. Granted Scott's frankensteiner and strength to toss around PCO is amazing.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Words cannot describe the awesomeness that is Finlay vs Benoit Smackdown 5-5-06 ( KotR tournament). Good grief. How physical was THAT. I adore the match they had after this at Judgement Day, but man, this might be better. I reccomend to any and all fans of tough, hard nosed, stiff mat wrestling. The things these guys allow the other to do to them is inhuman. That shot Finlay gives Benoit that opens him up hard way would have knocked me out.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

How was the Taker/HHH match on SD a few years back? I don't recall a single thing about it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

FINLAY. All day.

Their WCW match from Slamboree '98 is just as amazing. Nobody seems to remember it or know it exists though. It even has the first time Benoit took the chair to the head spot via tope in it.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> Words cannot describe the awesomeness that is Finlay vs Benoit Smackdown 5-5-06 ( KotR tournament). Good grief. How physical was THAT. I adore the match they had after this at Judgement Day, but man, this might be better. I reccomend to any and all fans of tough, hard nosed, stiff mat wrestling. The things these guys allow the other to do to them is inhuman. That shot Finlay gives Benoit that opens him up hard way would have knocked me out.


Link plz


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Lady Killer said:


> Link plz


Uploaded the full show a while back since it's not available anywhere else. (around 37 minute mark)






They also have another excellent match before Survivor Series that year.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x25wch_smackdown-24-11-2006-chris-benoit-v_sport


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> How was the Taker/HHH match on SD a few years back? I don't recall a single thing about it.


I got it on the smackdown 2008 torrent, but I'm not at that point yet to know. I can watch it later tonight as I'm curious myself. Their matches aren't too special overall, but Undertaker was better than usual throughout 2008 so there is a chance things could have clicked.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> Uploaded the full show a while back since it's not available anywhere else. (around 37 minute mark)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Thanks.



The Primer said:


> I got it on the smackdown 2008 torrent, but I'm not at that point yet to know. I can watch it later tonight as I'm curious myself. *Their matches aren't too special overall*, but Undertaker was better than usual throughout 2008 so there is a chance things could have clicked.




---------------------->


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Their 2002 matches + WM 27 are some of the worst things ever.

WM 17 is fun & the HIAC is only good b/c of Taker. That's about it.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Their 2002 matches + *WM 27* are some of the worst things ever.
> 
> WM 17 is fun & the *HIAC is only good b/c of Taker*. That's about it.


------------------------------------------------------------------------>


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Benoit/Finlay from Slamboree 98 is so damn good. That crowd was HOT for both guys. I don't understand why people don't consider it to be a high-level match. Definition of underappreciated.

Paramore fan, go watch all the Jericho/Eddie WCW tag matches. Everyone actually should do that.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> ------------------------------------------------------------------------>


:taker



funnyfaces1 said:


> Benoit/Finlay from Slamboree 98 is so damn good. That crowd was HOT for both guys. I don't understand why people don't consider it to be a high-level match. Definition of underappreciated.
> 
> Paramore fan, go watch all the Jericho/Eddie WCW tag matches. Everyone actually should do that.


aka random ploy to get folks to watch a specific MENG match. Down.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Lady Killer said:


> ------------------------------------------------------------------------>




Here's a YouTube link, if you need it. Pretty good quality
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9E0EcmxR_3Y


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

C2D posted it above. Thanks though. 

Just watched it. Pretty stiff match as you'd expect from those two. :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Finlay winning makes it about 100x more :mark: tbhayley


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Agreed. I didn't remember who won that so it was a pleasant surprise.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

5/5/06 blew me away like never before a few months ago.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

There's always that challenge of watching KOTR first round followed by Judgment Day back to back. If possible to contain that much goodness in a row. I've actually never done it yet.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I posted this 7 months ago and I'm gonna repost it since people are deciding to talk about the match now (except for Cody, he probably mentioned something when I reviewed it ):

*WCW World Television Championship
*Fit Finlay (c) vs. Chris Benoit (_Slamboree '98_)

It's Benoit vs. Finlay, how can it not be great? Total Finlay show on this one as he wrestles an almost perfect match. There's some great mat wrestling in the early going and a funny moment where Benoit actually chops one of Finlay's straps completely off his shoulder. Finlay eventually takes control and dominates most of the match with weardown holds. Remember that spot in the Benoit/Jericho Ladder match where Benoit dives out headfirst into the chair? Well THIS MATCH HAD IT FIRST.  Really though, I thought that was cool as hell. That was one of the couple times where it really looked like Benoit would make a comeback but Finaly cut him off at the VERY last second (beautiful counter on the triple Germans too). I won't spoil the finish for anyone who wants to watch but I will say it tied in very nicely to the current storyline and the last desperation pinfall was really well done. Total gem here that I don't think I've ever heard anyone mention. Really great crowd too. **** 3/4

*
I watched it on VHS, but here's a youtube link for anyone interested:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I probably did, tbhayley. 

Match is the definition of a gem. Which is odd considering how talked up their matches in WWE are. This one just flew under the radar. Kind of the story of Finlay until 2006, really.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

That show also has one of the most hilarious moments in Chris Jericho's career as he's announcing the participants in the Cruiserweight battle royal. :lmao 

Shame that Hart vs. Savage sucked.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The El Dandy line was always the best one.

Bret Hart in WCW = fail. His match vs Hennig at Uncensored was crap too.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

This guy's name is Silver King. If he wins 12 more matches, he'll upgraded to Golden King! hahaha


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao at Jericho's introductions for Juventud Guerrera and Damien 666. 1998 WCW was the greatest midcard ever.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:lmao

Heat Jericho got that entire year was wonderful. SuperBrawl his music hits and it's an instant chorus of boos. That audience was pro-nWo too.


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

WWF: IN YOUR HOUSE
As Vince kills his throat over the card, we find out we have a chance to win a house, a whole house.

Bret Hart vs Hakushi
This was Bret's first match of the night since he was working double duty. This wasn't one of his best showings though. The match felt very rough and it was filled with lots of stumbling around. It was still fun to watch though. I will have to see their match on Raw to see if it was better. Bret rolls Hakushi up with the victory roll but tweaks his knee. **1/2

Razor Ramon vs Jeff Jarret and The Roadie
The first handicap match in ppv history, is it? I always thought it was the main event of Summerslam '90. Anyways, Roadie stayed in the corner for most of the match. It was ok, nothing to write home about. Razor pins Jarret after the Razor's Edge and then gives one to the Roadie. **1/2

Adam Bomb vs Mabel: KOTR qualifying match
I was expecting a squash but I wasn't expecting Adam Bomb to do the squashing. Pretty much most of the offensive comes from Adam Bomb with a few hits in by Mabel. Mabel catches Adam Bomb off the top rope and delivers something that looks like the World's Strongest Slam. *

Owen Hart and Yokozuna vs The Smoking Guns: Tag Team Championship Match
Something that I wish was around more often now is tag team moves. This was a really fun match but like most the matches on the ppv, really short. Owen and Yoko retain. **3/4

Bret Hart vs Jerry Lawler
I wish this match was longer because I was enjoying it. Apparently a little ice fixed the knee of Bret and he looks 100% for this match. Nice work from both sides here. Also this match has an awesome ref bump where the ref goes through the ropes and gets his foot tied up and hangs upside down. Hakushi interferes and Lawler picks up the victory. ***

Diesel vs Sycho Sid: WWF championship match
Where do I even start? You know someone's bad when Diesel of all people is doing the carrying. Lots of overselling from Diesel. Sid looks green as ever. The camel clutch spot lasted what felt like an eternity. Sid gives the worst chokeslam I have ever seen (even worse than the one done to Hogan by Taker). Diesel kicks out of the powerbomb and delivers one of his own, but before he goes for the pin he gets attacked by Tatanka. A crappy finish to a crappy match. *

This is where the ppv would end but there are some bonus matches still.

Kama vs The Undertaker
Undertaker looked great in this match. Kama not so much. Basically another slow plodding match. Half of the match is just Kama having Undertaker in the bear hug (more like bear cub). A chokeslam followed by a tombstone mercifully ends this. *1/2

Bam Bam Bigelow vs Tantanka
I wasn't looking forward to this but it did surprise me. Bam Bam looked great here and the match had a nice pace. All I can say it was pretty fun. Although it wasn't exactly main even material, it still was one of the better matches on the card. ***


Short review but the ppv was pretty forgettable, hopefully the next one will have something nice.​


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Bret vs Hakushi is one of my favorite Bret matches around.

Really dig the handicap match too. More I think about it, only the main event was bleh on that show.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm back now, what was I suppose to do watch ?

oh the evolution tag


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Does somebody have a review/write-up on Extreme Rules 2010? I've watched maybe half of it and aside from boring me to tears I'm not sure I can even write about most of it. I either need to watch it again (not happening) or a memory jog.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Hart/Hakushi is **** IMO

Watching my ECW one night stand DVD, one of the easiest PPVS to sit through ever. RVD's best promo is on now :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> Does somebody have a review/write-up on Extreme Rules 2010? I've watched maybe half of it and aside from boring me to tears I'm not sure I can even write about most of it. I either need to watch it again (not happening) or a memory jog.


:lol I was going to last week but was told to watch extreme rules 2011 because you were watching 2010


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> Does somebody have a review/write-up on Extreme Rules 2010? I've watched maybe half of it and aside from boring me to tears I'm not sure I can even write about most of it. I either need to watch it again (not happening) or a memory jog.


Triple H takes about 10 brogue kicks before he stays down. It's awful despite the goodness that is Sheamus literally kicking his ass for 15 minutes. In real life it looks great. In wrestling life, it looks iffy.

Punk vs Mysterio should be on your good side. Skip the five minute gauntlet, but you probably would have with Miz cutting a promo before it. Orton vs Swagger & Jericho vs Edge always end up being blurs; that kind of says it all. Cena vs Batista is good. Dunno if you'll dig it, but I think it's cool beans. Has the tape on the post finish. The same that was used this year against Big Show. Only it was awesome here b/c it pissed a lot of Cena haters off. Show is kind of bleh on the over-under. The format worked a lot better in 2012 with the bigger matches + the short undercard bouts.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I second Hayley, Bret vs Hakushi is wrestling bliss. An absolute kick ass match, still holds up til this day. Don't understand the "stumbling around" comment, match seemed very crisp with a good structure that made Hakushi still look good while giving Bret the victory. And that Shinja guy is a complete nut.

Definitely like Punk vs Mysterio, that's the match where if Punk loses he has to have his head shaved, right? Excellent bout.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I gave Bret/Hakushi *** when I watched the IYH set. I somewhat agree that I don't think the two were on the same page at first, seemed a little sloppy. Picked up and got pretty fun by the end, but I prefer their RAW match by a fair margin.



Yeah1993 said:


> Does somebody have a review/write-up on Extreme Rules 2010? I've watched maybe half of it and aside from boring me to tears I'm not sure I can even write about most of it. I either need to watch it again (not happening) or a memory jog.


The tag gauntlet isn't worth your time. The Strap match most certainly isn't worth your time. Sheamus/HHH is a REALLY long extended squash. It got to the point where I didn't care about Triple H at all, then he tries to make comeback and loses. It sucked. Mysterio/Punk is a whole lot of fun as they always put together. Dusty finish even made sense and was pretty cool at the time. *** 1/2 for that. Orton/Swagger was pretty meh. Predictablly standard PG Era "hardcore" match with a trash can and a kendo stick. Nothing special whatsoever.

I'm pretty much in the same boat as you, seeing as I still haven't seen Edge/Jericho or Cena/Batista yet. I was just underwhelmed by the first half so I never finished it, and I even have the show on dvd.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

AWESOME/TANAKA IS ON!!!

Such a beautiful match.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Feel like that Punk vs Mysterio match was their weakest around. Yet, still really good. That ol chestnut of them being better than everyone else so even the lesser matches are still worth watching.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I really liked that rey/punk, no cjack thats otl, they have a very good sd match too

watching this evolution tag but I want to watch hbk/scsa vs. owen/davey tonite too


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

What are some thoughts on Benoit/Trips No Mercy 2000? I remember Cal wrote a review of it but I don't recall if he liked it or not.

Edit- oh, thanks skins I guess I haven't seen Extreme Rules yet.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nah, skins, he's right. the Stip at ER was that if Punk lost he would have to shave his head. Just like at WM if Mysterio lost, he'd join SES. Then came the final match at OTL with both stips on the line.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Nah, skins, he's right. the Stip at ER was that if Punk lost he would have to shave his head. Just like at WM if Mysterio lost, he'd join SES. Then came the final match at OTL with both stips on the line.


Haha! Thought I remembered it being that one. Good match. Don't believe I've seen OTL, just WM and ER. Which is the best in your mind?


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Rey/Punk series:

Capitol Punishment - ****
Over The Limit - *** 3/4
Extreme Rules - *** 1/2
Wrestlemania 26 - ***ish (haven't seen it since Mania aired)

They had a really good Smackdown match in February 2010 too I believe, plus a bunch of other TV matches throughout 2010-11.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

OTL is solid, only match I've seen from them though. Its on Punk's set if you have that DVD.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Got that ol tough decision of what to pick per usual.


Me too. Gonna pull a Yeah1993 move, and say that the first person to pick what to watch out of these choices, I'll go with:

HBK vs. Taker WM 25
End of an Era
JBL vs. Cena
Lesnar vs. Cena
JBL vs. Eddie
Jericho vs. Benoit Ladder Match (RR)
Whatever the best Batista vs. Taker match is
Edge vs. Taker WM
Shane vs. Kurt Angle
Any Jeff Hardy or Hardy Boyz Match (pick)


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Over the Limit is my favorite. Even with the slight pause from Punk being cut open hard way. That only provided to add the match with the best spot and that was Punk becoming pissed and chucking Mysterio all around ringside. A must watch from a show that didn't have much to offer.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Cena vs. Lesnar!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

LilOlMe said:


> Me too. Gonna pull a Yeah1993 move, and say that the first person to pick what to watch out of these choices, I'll go with:
> 
> HBK vs. Taker WM 25
> End of an Era
> ...


Jeff Hardy vs The Undertaker ladder match ftw.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Cena vs. Lesnar!


k, watching it now. So happy you picked one that actually seems exciting! :lol


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Jeff Hardy vs The Undertaker ladder match ftw.


That sounds awesome! Don't know if I'll have time after, but if not, I'll watch it tomorrow and post my thoughts. :thumbsupsmileycan'tfinditrightnow


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> Me too. Gonna pull a Yeah1993 move, and say that the first person to pick what to watch out of these choices, I'll go with:
> 
> *HBK vs. Taker WM 25*
> End of an Era
> ...


2nd best match in company history goo for it !

Yea sorry forgot, I remember their was a barber sit in the ex match


hbk/taker wm 25 is almost a obligation as a wrestling fan tbhayley


Edit: Cjack is right Naitch is killing it in this match

Edit 2: Yea I told myself I was going to watch cena/lesnar again this week


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Ladder match is awesome. Top ten match in 2002, tbhayley.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> 2nd best match in company history goo for it !
> 
> Yea sorry forgot, I remember their was a barber sit in the ex match
> 
> ...



So true, seems like in a lot of the Evolution tags I've seen Naitch some how always manages to steal the show, no matter who he's up against. Considering he's over 50 in all of those matches, that's remarkable. He had one of my 20 favorite matches ever with Trips in the Steel Cage at 50+. Why is there even a debate about who is the greatest ever? I have guys I like more than Naitch, but I'm certainly not comfortable saying they are BETTER.


**** for Los Guerreros vs Angle/Benoit Rebellion 2002. Damn good match. Angle/Benoit are coming off the historic No Mercy 2002 tag match and they manage to have another classic match only a week after. This isn't far behind the NM tag, and has a less spotty structure. I dig it.

Man, I've been on a tag binge today, I think I've watched 7-8 tags today alone. All have been ***1/2+. I call that a successful day.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> So true, seems like in a lot of the Evolution tags I've seen Naitch some how always manages to steal the show, no matter who he's up against. Considering he's over 50 in all of those matches, that's remarkable. He had one of my 20 favorite matches ever with Trips in the Steel Cage at 50+. Why is there even a debate about who is the greatest ever? I have guys I like more than Naitch, but I'm certainly not comfortable saying they are BETTER.


Samez well actually only one, Oblivously anybody that even remotely pays attention to my posts ( and my sig/avi) know who my favorite of all-time is :hbk1. but there is not doubt who the actual GOAT wrestler is which just happens to be my second all-time favorite :flair3

Good lord you are making me want to go watch hbk/flair wm 24 right now


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> What are some thoughts on Benoit/Trips No Mercy 2000? I remember Cal wrote a review of it but I don't recall if he liked it or not.


I see this was ignored. 

Cal didn't like it from what I remember. Like pretty much everything Trips did on PPV in 2000, I dig this. Good technical wrestling in the beginning, then a lot of leg work from Trips. The argument is that the leg work doesn't go anywhere, and that holds water.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

skins do you care about any of the Michaels' promos you see lately? I'll ask a mega fan that b/c I know I couldn't care less if he showed up ever again. Once he retired, that was the end of it. Of course my favorite time with him ended in 1992.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> I see this was ignored.
> 
> Cal didn't like it from what I remember. Like pretty much everything Trips did on PPV in 2000, I dig this. Good technical wrestling in the beginning, then a lot of leg work from Trips. The argument is that the leg work doesn't go anywhere, and that holds water.


Ah, yea that can be annoying when it happens, but if a match is good it won't out and out ruin it for me. Sure it'll cause me to dock a few of DEM STARZ but whatever. Not every match needs to be a deep thinking exercise.

Thanks dude.

Edit-Hayley, I'm not an HBK mega-fan, though I do consider myself a fan of his. I can honestly say baby face HBK not wrestling and only cutting promos does absolutely nothing for me. Even when baby face HBK WAS wrestling, his promos really weren't that special, so now that I'm not getting to experience his in ring brilliance, I'd rather he just fuck off or take Lawlers spot on commentary


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm certain it's only a "big fan" mentality who cares to see Michaels these days. He comes out and it's usually an instant fast forward bit for me.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> skins do you care about any of the Michaels' promos you see lately? I'll ask a mega fan that b/c I know I couldn't care less if he showed up ever again. Once he retired, that was the end of it. Of course my favorite time with him ended in 1992.


Are you just talking about this recent one monday night ? Or during those taker/hhh feuds ?

I mean I will always love when he shows up during mania time, I get giddy everytime the begining of sexboy starts, but I can see people other than hbk marks not caring.

I liked the mysic of those taker/hhh promos were the wm 27) he didnt think hunter would win and then in wm 28) OMG what if HBK screws taker ?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah all of them count here. Basically the answer I expected. I'm the same in caring for Foley when he shows up. Although, I can't see how anyone wouldn't be excited for Foley. Huge fandom or not; the man behind the stick is gold and something that should be seen as often as possible.

Biased response. You damn right.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Now for something I DO CARE ABOUT

Christian vs Regal Breaking Point :mark: :mark: :mark:

Cal having me watch there ECW match in England the other night got me in the mood to watch this masterpiece again. When I saw the England match, as much as I loved it, I remember thinking Breaking Point was better. Let's see if my memory is correct.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

haha I love foley as well but that last ryback/foley promo was meh :lol Biased response accepted


I'm actually really curious this time with Michaels as what route does he play in this RTWM ? does he turn on bryan ? Does he do the right thing ? How will his relationship with Hunter and co go ? Will we see HEEL HBK :mark: or better yet will hbk get back into the ring :mark: :mark:






































Find out next time on dragonball Z


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Cena vs. Lesnar!


k, watched this. First of all, Lesnar is fucking amazing. I think that a lot of those long sections of one wrestler dominating, might have caused people to get antsy in a lesser wrestler's hands. He just fills it with such presence that it's absolutely mesmerizing. 

I've heard people complain about the way that this match was booked, and I agree, but not due to Cena winning. It was the way in which he won that seemed completely pointless to me. At least have him mount a real comeback (that makes sense), or do a last desperate surprise that actually works or _something_. It was like this tour de force performance from Lesnar, and then _that_. I was expecting for Cena to really will it out or something. Just felt those last few minutes could have been booked so much better. They had an amazing story going on for much of it.

**** 1/4, and if the ending felt more powerful, I'd have it in the **** 3/4 range, I'm pretty sure.

When Lesnar went over the rope, that was a botch right? If so, it was the most spectacular looking botch ever.

Lesnar's performance was one of the best I've seen from a single wrestler. He just had everything you could possibly want here.




redskins25 said:


> hbk/taker wm 25 is almost a obligation as a wrestling fan tbhayley


I know, that's why I've been purposely waiting on it. It's like an obvious good thing to save.



The Primer said:


> Ladder match is awesome. Top ten match in 2002, tbhayley.


Checking it out now!


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Checking out a few Batista matches at the moment, wanted to see how good the guy was in 2005 by checking out two personal favorites of mine; Vs JBL at Summerslam and Vs Eddie Guerrero at No Mercy in Eddie's last main event stand. 

Speaking of big guys, might go back and watch Goldberg's entire year with the company in order to gain a better look at what he was like then. LOVED the Henry match, saw the HHH matches and thought they weren't very good, his performance in the chamber was markworthy, the match with Jericho at Bad Blood was great, matches with Rock & Brock were shitty... Need to watch more of his TV stuff for sure.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Still dunno why people hate Rock/Goldberg. 


Thanks for the ER responses. I'm trying to write something for Swagger/Orton and Trip/Sheamus now and I think I just need to find a video and jump around because I watched it a few days ago. 

Also FWIW I'm skipping nothing. I am vowing to watch every match on the PPVs I watch. Remember this if I said I skipped anything. REMEMBER THIS.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

We should be so lucky to get a heel HBK in 2013. The whole "H-B-Schizzle" stuff was along the lines of Rock's 2013 promos. When he gets serious, he's better, but HBK's face comedy is generally not great. In 2005 he channeled his 1997 self and ripped Hogan to shreds like the boss he is.

Foley's promo with Punk right before HIAC was damn fine.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Batista Vs JBL from Summerslam 2005 is a decent WWE style propfest that features two men beating the crap out of each other for nearly 10 minutes. The belt shots, the use of the steps, all the way down to the barricade spear, this is spotfest 101 but a ton of fun is added with the big man vs big man dynamic. Just a short, fun match. *****

Batista Vs Eddie Guerrero from No Mercy 2005 on the other hand was pretty great as well, with Batista selling an injured back really well coupled with a brilliant Eddie performance that has you on edge the entire time. The finish is kind of out of nowhere and is kind of WTF, but Eddie's work in this one is just too good to bog down the rest of the contest anywhere else. **** 1/2*


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

LilOlMe said:


> k, watched this. First of all, Lesnar is fucking amazing. I think that a lot of those long sections of one wrestler dominating, might have caused people to get antsy in a lesser wrestler's hands. He just fills it with such presence that it's absolutely mesmerizing.
> 
> I've heard people complain about the way that this match was booked, and I agree, but not due to Cena winning. It was the way in which he won that seemed completely pointless to me. At least have him mount a real comeback (that makes sense), or do a last desperate surprise that actually works or _something_. It was like this tour de force performance from Lesnar, and then _that_. I was expecting for Cena to really will it out or something. Just felt those last few minutes could have been booked so much better. They had an amazing story going on for much of it.
> 
> ...


That's where we disagree, because I thought Cena's comeback was pure desperation and incredibly believable, which is pretty rare to come across when it comes to Cena comebacks. A steel chain to the forehead that splits a man open followed up by an FU on steels steps is some pretty serious stuff. It's ridiculous that some fans still can't see that (not directed to you). Idk how people cannot like that match.

I guess Lesnar's dive was a botch but it was a wonderful botch that came into play in a major way for the finish as he got too cocky and went to the well one too many times. I gave it **** 1/2 by the way,


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Well, all due respect to Capt. Cal, I do believe I was correct in my original statement, Breaking Point>ECW England for the Regal/Christian series. This is my favorite match from either guy in 2009, and possibly, no probably, my favorite ECW match ever. So much Regal goodness and yet another fantastic face performance from Capt. Charisma. When people rave about Christians 2009, I only have one thing to say to that: believe the hype. I've seen around 10-15 of his matches from 2009 so far and there ain't a bad one in there.

That Regal-Plex is so damn vicious looking. My god, it's a serious wonder he hasn't paralyzed someone doing it.

****1/2 for Regal/Christian Breaking Point, ****1/4 for Rega/Christian ECW in England.

Edit- as for Cena/Lesnar, I went from giving it ***3/4 on the first watch, to ***** on the second watch! to ****1/2 on the third. Usually my 3rd rating is when I have a good opinion on it. Anyways, I liked the finish, if the finish had to be Cena winning. I would have preferred Cena to just be destroyed, fire up that quick come back, then get crushed for good by Lesnar with an F5 onto the steps. It would have fit the story of Cena being in a funk better, and would have helped Brock more.

That said, if Cena had to win, that was the way to do it. Losing didn't really hurt Brock at all, and winning didn't help Cena too much because of how badly Brock thrashed him.

Top Brock Matches:

1. Vs Punk SS *****
2. Vs Taker HiaC ****1/2
3. Vs Cena ER ****1/2
4. Vs Angle IronMan ****1/2
5. Vs Angle SS ****1/2


Longevity aside, if we are rating wrestlers on how good they were at their peak, no one can deny that Brock is one of the best workers ever. He can go flat out amateur mat wrestling style, hardcore hell in a cell style, monster heel trash everything in sight, anything. A Brock Lesnar heel control segment ranks right up there with Eddie, Vader, and Taker as the best control segments in wrestling history.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Lesnar licking Cena's blood off his gloves is so :mark:


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Brock Vs Cena is one of the greatest matches ever.

Second only to the original cell, and I haven't compared both in a while. That Extreme Rules match is a fucking masterpiece, with Brock channeling his inner beast and Cena being reminiscent of a early 1980s Bob Backlund.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> *Still dunno why people hate Rock/Goldberg. *
> 
> 
> Thanks for the ER responses. I'm trying to write something for Swagger/Orton and Trip/Sheamus now and I think I just need to find a video and jump around because I watched it a few days ago.
> ...


Because nothing really happens, it's just there.

Plus it didn't live up to the HYPE.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I guess I would like it more than most because I didn't have any hype before it (also the fact I'd heard it was sucky from just about everyone helped; I think sterling was the only one who said it was good). I like those guys a lot at their best but I'd hardly expect them to put on a really GREAT match together. Maybe it's just me but I thought the Rock was phenomenal in chunks of it. Probably just me. EVERYONE SEEMS TO HATE HIM NOW.

OOOOH I'm remembering more of Swagger/Orton as I type. If only I could do the same for HHH/Sheamus. Probably shouldn't have been fiddling with the 3DS while it was on.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I haven't watched Rock/Goldberg all the way through, but I'd be willing to because of Hollywood Rock. I was praising that character hard around the middle of this thread/earlier today.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Jeff Hardy vs The Undertaker ladder match ftw.


What a great babyface performance by Hardy. A star-making performance, really. I feel like this is the type of match that you could show a casual, and have them actually be invested in who wins. That's how you know that they pulled off exactly what they wanted to pull off!

Loved the little comebacks Hardy mounted, and the defiant spirit. 'Taker was great in that aftermath as well, of course.

Hardy's selling was great also, I thought.

Thanks for that, I enjoyed it!




Jack Evans 187 said:


> That's where we disagree, because I thought Cena's comeback was pure desperation and incredibly believable, which is pretty rare to come across when it comes to Cena comebacks. A steel chain to the forehead that splits a man open followed up by an FU on steels steps is some pretty serious stuff. It's ridiculous that some fans still can't see that (not directed to you). Idk how people cannot like that match.
> 
> I guess Lesnar's dive was a botch but it was a wonderful botch that came into play in a major way for the finish as he got too cocky and went to the well one too many times. I gave it **** 1/2 by the way,


The usage of the chain is a good point, but I think that it would have felt far more powerful if Cena was down on his knees and getting badly beaten and down to his last legs so to speak. There was a big gap, he hit him with it, and then just did his thing. It didn't feel desperate at all to me. Or at least he didn't sell it that way _at all_. It was just so anti-climatic to me. Again, it's also a testament to Lesnar's great performance and the booking of that great performance that I felt that it deserved more. Guess it's one of those agree to disagree things. I did still really enjoy it (in fact, I came here to write "this is phenomenal!" about six minutes into the match, but then decided not to get side-tracked too much).

Well then our ratings were around the same range!




HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Lesnar licking Cena's blood off his gloves is so :mark:


Loved that. Also loved his smile after he ran Cena into the steel steps.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Finally got to the Faces of Fear vs Jericho/Eddie Tag Hayley reccomended earlier. That was a fun tag, Jericho plays the FIP for the most part while Barbarian and MENG take turns delivering that punishing offense. Eddie gets the smoking hot tag, clears house, but Malenko comes in the end and screws Eddie costing them the match. Good stuff all around ***1/4


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Taker/Hardy is great. That match also features some memorable JR sound bytes. "Climb the ladder, kid! Make yourself famous!"

I think I'm a hardcore JR mark. Honestly can't find anything he does wrong. He doesn't make stupid jokes, didn't talk during GOAT entrances. Knew the business like none other, and communicated the ring psychology unlike Cole. "Oh, great throw" or "so and so just planted so and so."


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Taker/Hardy is great. That match also features some memorable JR sound bytes. "Climb the ladder, kid! Make yourself famous!"
> 
> I think I'm a hardcore JR mark. Honestly can't find anything he does wrong. He doesn't make stupid jokes, didn't talk during GOAT entrances. Knew the business like none other, and communicated the ring psychology unlike Cole. "Oh, great throw" or "so and so just planted so and so."


Yes! That was something I wanted to mention in my post, but forgot it due to wanting to address the Brock stuff. See how easily I get side-tracked? :lol

But yeah, that was almost chill-inducing. Perfect commentary at that point, that really helped make the moment seem special.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I've honestly in the past 2 days started 5 matches and haven't finished one Dat ADD

Yea cena/lesnar is phenomenal, not let the ppl down there cloud you judgement on the match, no it wasn't a Brock squash


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

JR was shit when he kept making those inside references that no one would get unless you look into the dirt about wrestling. Bringing all of his variables behind his backstage job to light. Didn't care for those. Ruined the fun of things too. He's good for the majority.


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

MITB 1 had a really good babyface performances by Benoit, was the initial launcher of my underlying Edge hate.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Top ten HIAC matches, per WWE.com: 



> 10. DX vs ShowMahons - Unforgiven 2006
> 9. Shawn/Trips - Badd Blood 2004
> 8. Brock/Taker - No Mercy 2002
> 7. Batista/Trips - Vengeance 2005
> ...


My opinion: Shawn/Trips is not top 10 by any means. Brock/Taker is top 5 easily. Taker/Mankind is 7th, at best. Batista/Trips is top 3. 6 man would barely make my top 10. Shawn/Taker should be first. Trips/Foley should be 2.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I really want them to scrap the HIAC PPV. I hate the fact that instead of the right feud getting a HIAC to whatever is happening in October getting a HIAC. Same goes for every other themed PPV other than maybe EC/MITB, although I'd rather MITB be at Mania.


----------



## Vader (Jul 31, 2006)

Top 4 for me would be;

1. Shawn/Taker
2. Brock/Taker
3. Triple H/Taker
4. Triple H/Foley

After that I'm a little hesitant due to a piss poor memory of the rest.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Damn just realized Trips is on that list 6 times, which is probably 2 too many. Maybe 3 depending on where the Armageddon 6 man falls on people respective lists., which I still really dig, but not sure if it's a top 10 match. 

Also, just realized that Taker/Orton isn't on that list. Also, surely Batista/Taker is better than Shawn/Trips. Orton/Sheamus is certainly better than Shawn/Trips. Cena/Punk/Del Rio shits all over Shawn/Trips. 

I guess since it's 45 minutes long and uses a bunch of weapons, it's automatically a classic.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Lol at Shawn/HHH being on the list. I'm a fan of both, but that match and their 3SoH are the stuff of nightmares.

Just watched some Daniel Bryan and Kane and/or Orton against Shield matches. Always good stuff. IMO the Payback tag is underrated. Yeah, Orton's FIP segment drags a bit with the rest holds, but the hot tag to Bryan rules and the last few minutes are really fun.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The WeAreProWrestling guy rates the Trips/Shawn HIAC at ****3/4 :lol: He claims "shitting over the match because of its lenght is stupid, because it's such a great match" without any kind of argument as to why is it. To that argument, I call BS because the lenght is EXACTLY the biggest issue about it. About 20 minutes too long. They could've done all the 'epic' shit they did in half the time. It's a solid match imo, with some convincing hate between the two and some cool spots but Jesus the Elektra film bothered me less in terms of "how fucking long is this going to last".

Hell RKNo/Shield matches were all good, be it the 2-on-2 (including the underrated RKNo/Shield @ Payback), be it 3-on-3. People tend to rate the Raw match higher, but imo the Smackdown one was so much superior. Not only for *three* big feelgood moments of it being the blow-off of the Hell No/Shield feud, Bryan finally beating the Shield (despite his 1-on-1 victories over them before) and the Shield's first 3-on-3 loss, but the whole match couldn't have been better structured and paced. Plus, DAT ending sequence :mark: Hell RKNo/Shield from Raw got ***1/2, Smackdown got **** in my view.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Watching the Ladder Match DVD, Benoit/Jericho was so goddamn good. 

Next is MITB I. Seen this before but I'm hyped.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Ladder DVD rocks....

WWE put Eddie/Rey Havoc 1997 on their YT channel. Any good?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Watch that right now. That gets my highest recommendation and is one of my all-time favorites. :mark:


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

WWE put Kane vs Mankind HiaC match on their YT channel too. God, that was an awful bout


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I'm finishing this fucking RR 2002 PPV before I go somewhere all day. Will watch it tonight though!


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Catching up on Smackdown now. That :dazzler and :HHH2 staredown was :mark:

I'm definitely warming up to the idea of Bryan vs. HHH at Mania.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

***1/2 for the 8 man tag match from last night. Bryan was just awesome


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Royal Rumble 2002 review​**Match # 1: the Dudley’s vs Spike Dudley and Tazz ( tag team titles)*

Should be a solid match here, all 4 can go in the ring although Tazz was a little old here, as he would be on SD commentary in like 6 months. Best thing about this match was that it never felt boring, the match was going at a really good pace that helped me keep my interest, which can be hard at times. Anyway really solid opening tag, its not memorable by any means, and doesn’t live up to the Dudleys/Edge and Christian opening match from one year before, but it kept me entertained. ** ¾*

*CAL SCALE: 1
*
*Match # 2: William Regal vs Edge( IC title)
*
This should be :mark:. Both guys are very different but are both excellent workers. Fun match, but once again nothing to write home about. Match kind of dragged on somewhat and maybe 5 or so minutes long but other than that nothing to complain about. These two couldn’t have put on a better match and really stole the show in terms of surprising matches. Some Regal marks will like this just because its regal getting a victory in a title match on PPV but Regal’s GOAT facial expressions might be better than the match itself, also nice to see him get a title. *** ½*

*CAL SCALE: 3
*
*Match # 3: Jazz vs Trish stratus
*
Fuck it no way I don’t feel like watching shitty divas . NO

*CAL SCALE -1
*
*Match # 4: Ric Flair vs Mr. McMahon
*
Could be SOO shitty, or it could be really fun as Vince is so up and down in the ring. Kind of a waste of Flair but its whatever, at least it made sense with the co-owner storyline. Which might have been shitty in its own right for all I know, I’m just here for the match :lol. This has the stip of a street fight and its pretty cool that they use that stip to its full advantage as this is a pretty good hardcore brawl with shit like trashcans and chairs being used. Vince heelin it up with Ric’s family was pretty awesome too, another reason I hope he comes back as a heel and not a face, man is one of the GOAT heels. Anyways crowd was really into this one and rightfully so as this was awesome hardcore fighting, especially for Vince being involved. *** ½* 

*CAL SCALE: 3
*
*Match # 5: Chris Jericho vs the Rock (undisputed title)*

The first title defense in the undisputed title’s brief history, but apparently this is a good match, so pretty high expectations going in. This was a pretty good match, These two seemed to click really well, Jericho is a great heel in this match and conversely the rock is a great face a, as is usual. Crowd also really into this match compared to the first two matches for which they were pretty dead for. Beautiful match, might not be MOTN because of how awesome the rumble usually is. A lot of good finisher kick outs and the Rock’s RB on the ref was pretty comical when he realized it cost him the match :lol. Jericho wins dirty via roll up with feet on the ropes. But awesome match! ****

*CAL SCALE: 5
*
*Match # 6: THE ROYAL RUMBLE MATCH! 
*
I’m a huge rumble mark, I even enjoy the 2013 and 2012 rumble even though the rest of those shows were shit, because IDGAF . Man, this is gonna be a long ass rumble, we are only halfway through the show! Rikishi starts out, interesting because he was number 30 the year before. Next out is GOLDUST, who I think is making his return? Fuck HHH, HE should win this! Bossman is out at # 3 and I’m still paying attention to Goldie only, as he is the only one I give a shit about. Really long pauses between entrances, I think this was 2 minutes, WAY too long. Rikishi does some gross stuff with his ass and thankfully eliminates Bossman, who sucks shit . Bradshaw and Lance Storm come out at 4 &5 and its currently Goldie, Rikishi, Bradshaw, and Storm after 5 men. 

Al Snow comes out at #6 to a surprisingly loud pop, isn’t he a jobber? Another washed up star in Billy Gunn comes out at 7 and star power is starting to decrease fast, as its all midcard guys right now. Bradshaw is out and its Snow, Gunn, Rikishi, and Goldie. TAKER is out at 8 and all these guys will probably be buried and get eliminated :lol. Yep, he does and after 8 men come in its just taker left in the ring, well at least we have a legit Main guy now! Matt Hardy and Lita are out next at 9 and they actually have a fun little brawl for 2 minutes before Jeff Hardy comes out at 10! JR says every number I a random and even the marks know that’s not true :lol. Taker eliminates them both and after 10 its still just taker. 

Maven is out at 11 and a squash is inevitable. Lita is still out here and Matt and Jeff rejoin just to be dicks I guess. WAIT WHAT THE FUCK MAVEN ELIMINATED MAVEN!! What an awesome moment! Well Taker just beats the shit out of him and Mavens moment in the sun is over. Christian is out at 12 with his terrible fucking music that goes: CHRISTIANNNN! In some shitty opra voice. So its him and Scotty 2 hotty while Maven is still getting the shit beat out of him :lol. HEY! DDP is out at 14 which is fun! This was prolly DDP’s only rumble right? Yeah that makes sense. DDP eliminates Scotty while Chuck comes in Irrelevantly at 15. 

Nothing happens for 2 minutes until the godfather comes out! With all his hos! Man, he has like 15 of them! :lol. He takes like 5 minutes to get to the ring as he spends the time dancing with the hos. Alert is in after that at 17 and fuck its jobber/midard central here. Must mean that Austin or trips will come in soon, thank god. Godfather eliminates Albert quickly and even though he is a joke now, he always was I guess . Godfather is eliminated next and we’re down to Christian and Chuck as Perry Saturn comes in at 19, and man this is going south quick, I need a non-midcard guy! YES! AUSTIN IS IN at 20! Ring to be cleared shortly! 

Yep Austin clears the ring and gloats for a little bit. Until Val Venis comes out! He’ll stop Austin right? Probably not haha. Test is out at 22 and they try to put up a fight but don’t, shocker there. Both are out while Austin waits for # 23 to come out. Trips is coming out at 23 and this is the guy that wins it all tonight, but wait we don’t know that yet! Austin and Haitch brawl until HURRICANE comes out at 24 and attempts to take on the two biggest guys in the company….unsuccessfully FAROOQ is out at 25. 
Farooq Is also out quickly so with only 5 guys left to enter there is only Austin and HHH and MR PERFECT is out! HE SHOULD WIN!!! Luckily he does get sacrificed by the burying machine. ANGLE comes in at 28 and Big Show is out at 29. Kane is out at 30 so we’re down to the final 6 guys. It eventually comes down to HHH and Angle before HHH wins his only rumble, solid ending to a solid PPV. 
This was a great rumble, my 5th favorite all time now. **** ½* 

*CAL SCALE: 7
*
*TOTAL CALN SCALE: 18 
*
*CURRENT: PPV MOTY: Kurt angle and Chris Benoit vs Los Gurreros( rebellion)
*
*CURRENT PPV RANKINGS
1: rebellion(20)
2: The Royal rumble(18)
3: Unforgiven(15)
4: Backlash(11.5)​*


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Ladder DVD rocks....
> 
> WWE put Eddie/Rey Havoc 1997 on their YT channel. Any good?


Wow it's really weird that I actually just watched that specific match yesterday. It was mentioned in an article on 411mania. Very good match. 

Would have been nice if that video went up on the WWE channel a earlier, as the one I was watching wasn't the greatest quality.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

smitty915 said:


> WWE put Eddie/Rey Havoc 1997 on their YT channel. Any good?


I've not seen enough WCW to give it the praise its received (one of their best matches ever), but it's a really great encounter between two great wrestlers. Eddie is phenomenal in outworking Rey at every turn and plays so well into their backstory.

Fuck it, I'm rewatching it now.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Srdjan99 said:


> ***1/2 for the 8 man tag match from last night. Bryan was just awesome


YES. Every time Daniel Bryan gets a hot tag, it's like lightning striking the tip of my dick.

Wait, does that even make sense?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Foley vs Trips HIAC isn't even THAT grand. that's one of those matches I've always liked, yet never loved. Doesn't come close to their Street Fight. However, I won't deny the general chemistry among the two that remains a constant. Not one of my personal favorite HIAC matches.

Kane vs Mankind HIAC is good. Better than the average match from 1998.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Does anyone else forget that the last two pages now actually contain new posts? I'm surprised when I leave the thread and see that there are new posts, due to me not reading the last two pages. :lol


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Well, we're 50 pages in after only two days.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

21 for me. :hayley1


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Kane/Mankind HIAC is whatever in my books. SVS '97 rules though.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> Ladder DVD rocks....
> 
> WWE put Eddie/Rey Havoc 1997 on their YT channel. Any good?


It's only one of the best matches in WCW history. 



Rah said:


> Well, we're 50 pages in after only two days.


What browser are you using? haha. We're on page 22 for me.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Depends on your settings. It's auto set up for 15 posts per page I think. Us with 25 per page only have 22 pages for the threat atm .


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

2 matches I haven't seen in years and years and years:

*Taker/HBK, Bad Blood ’97 - *****

Taker/Foley, KOTR ’98 – ***1/2* (I find it hard to rate this match for obvious reasons)


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

ATF said:


> Kane/Mankind HIAC is whatever in my books. SVS '97 rules though.


Agreed, SVS is a really good match, Foley works his ass off in that one trying to make Kane look unstoppable.

My Favorite HiaC

1. HBK vs Taker *****
2. Taker vs Brock ****1/2
3. Trips vs Batista ****1/2
4. Foley vs Trips ****1/2
5. Foley vs Taker ****1/2
6. Edge vs Taker ****1/2
7. Armageddon 6 Man ****1/4
8. Orton vs Taker ****1/4
9. Batista vs Taker ****
10. Trips vs Taker ***3/4


I'm sure I've forgotten an important one that's gonna make me feel stupid. Oh well. Undertaker is in 8/10 of them. :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

There is like nothing wrestling related on netflix


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

It's kind of amazing how truly scary the HIAC used to be and now it's like meh. Talk about diluting your brand/image. They have well and truly destroyed what so many guys literally bled to create. Madness. The PPV has to go, it just has to.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I remember how OH MY JESUS I used to be when the words "Hell In A Cell" were said in announcement for a match. Now... ugh. Still, even in the HIAC PPV Era, we got one of those moments when Trips said it to Taker. I marked hard for that.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Watched the End of an Era HIAC last night since it was getting talked about. Still loves it, but I do think less of it on every watch. Started off at ****3/4 and MOTY. Then Bryan/Punk overtook it as MOTY. Now it's closer to being ****1/2 for me lol.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Smackdown main event was really good. ****1/2* and just loads of fun as always. I don't understand why there are people here that detest Big E Langston. Dude is exciting and has knocked it out of the park this past week. I'm certainly sold on him, and it looks like the crowd is as well.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

b/c he's a walking pile of shit? If that's knocking it out of the park then someone quick, get me a pair of wrestling boots. I'm good enough to be the next Intercontinental Champion!


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Primer said:


> b/c he's a walking pile of shit? If that's knocking it out of the park then someone quick, get me a pair of wrestling boots. I'm good enough to be the next Intercontinental Champion!


Somebody told that to Axel too already.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

His daddy did. And having good matches helps too. Only they've been away from the PPV. Oh that WWE booking.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Meh, I haven't seen enough good or bad out of Langston to have an opinion on him yet. Never saw his NXT stuff, and he really hasn't had a 10-15 minute singles match with a decent opponent on the Main Roster for me to judge him either way. He's always in tags and just hits a few power moves and that's that. It's part of the problem with today's booking, so many 5 minute matches that it's really not enough time for a guy to establish his character.

You know who gets slept on when "all time great heels" are brought up? The mother f'ing Iron Sheik. Putting in the Boot Camp match with Slaughter now. He was in a different era so I'm sure his matches don't appeal to everyone, but no one used to get the heat like Sheiky baby. Great heels don't necessarily have to be the most exciting or best workers anyway.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Should have just put over Slaughter instead, imo. Now that's an underrated worker. Dude is the tops.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

His daddy was perfect _(you had to get that)_ and he was in good enough position to be confident about his son's future. He's a good wrestler but a door has more charisma or character. You want that as IC Champion or Heyman guy for Christ sake? At least Big E isn't just a decent wrestler, but he's explosive and seems to, you know, have a personality.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

dont EVER compare Curtis Axel to his father NEVER


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

You really think I'm gonna agree with anything you're going to say? For crying out loud, I dislike the mong. Get over it people.

Axel is about as interesting as a wet mop & booked as strongly as one. But I don't mind b/c I don't expect personality from him. That's why Heyman is there. He's had some matches I've liked, therefore he wins in this situation. If it was up to me I'd slap that strap on someone like Goldust or Cesaro. That's my answer.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Should have just put over Slaughter instead, imo. Now that's an underrated worker. Dude is the tops.


I thought that was already abundantly clear. Along with his famous WWE matches, people need to recognize his excellent tag bouts with Don Kernodle in Crockett. The Steamboat/Youngblood and Briscoes had some great great matches with those teams.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

In order to make sure he doesn't remain underrated we keep him as a constant of discussion. There's a method to the madness.

but really it's kind of crazy how he's known well by a lot of fans, but never quite as appreciated. If that scenario makes sense.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

ATF said:


> I remember how OH MY JESUS I used to be when the words "Hell In A Cell" were said in announcement for a match. Now... ugh. Still, even in the HIAC PPV Era, we got one of those moments when Trips said it to Taker. I marked hard for that.


I had the same feeling and it's probably going to be the last time we get something like until they get rid of the PPV


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

God bless Heyman, even him working his ass off to put over Axel can't make me like him. Axel immediately undoes Heyman's hard promo work just by opening his mouth and saying something retarded. I like him in the ring a bit, but he just doesn't have "it" that can get him over as a heel with the crowd. 

I'll never forget him and Otunga with the tag belts and making their entrance. Dat ball cap :lmao


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I marked hard as fuck for the HHH Vs Undertaker announcement. 

"WE'RE GOING ALL THE WAY DEADMAN!" :mark: :mark: :mark:.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

There was an announcement involving The Undertaker?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

In 2012 before End of an Era.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

?? what is going on


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Primer said:


> You really think I'm gonna agree with anything you're going to say? For crying out loud, I dislike the mong. Get over it people.
> 
> Axel is about as interesting as a wet mop & booked as strongly as one. But I don't mind b/c I don't expect personality from him. That's why Heyman is there. He's had some matches I've liked, therefore he wins in this situation. If it was up to me I'd slap that strap on someone like Goldust or Cesaro. That's my answer.


Well it's your opinion so be it like that. But I personally find it amusing how anyone, even if they do dislike him, cannot prefer Big E over Axel. But to each is their own.

But I really disagree on the "that's why Heyman is there" statement. That is what Axel comes down to - Heyman. Lesnar has looks, ability, presence, charisma, etc. and his only weakness was the mic, which Heyman covered. Ryback sucks in the ring, however his character is good and simply _aided_ by Heyman. Axel is 99.9% all Heyman. Heyman IS Axel essentially, he isn't just Axel's manager. That should be minimally worrying for him.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Amusing that one's opinion differs? It's that kind of logic which makes conversations among folk not even worth it.

You disagree with my statement, even though that's what the fact is. How does that make sense? We all know Axel is zilch without Heyman - hence the union. Hence why he's going to drop the strap and probably move onto nothing following. This is all known. Which is why I made the statement I did in the first place. Plus, why did you bring up Ryback's wrestling as a fault, but then when comparing Axel with Heyman, his wrestling work wasn't mentioned as a positive? C'mon man. Dislike the guy all you want, but lets not leave facts out if we're going through a rundown.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Can we just both agree that Big E & Curtis Axel absolutely suck and move on :lol?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Point here is why do some care about another's opinion to ask questions via being "baffled". It's pointless.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Asinine indeed.

So I just watched the Punk Vs Taker Breaking Point match and I actually thought it was pretty good. The way they strike it out and the various exchanges throughout the match were great, Taker looked like he could kill Punk at any second & Punk sold that fact so well. Obviously the screwjob finish is meh and the fact that it's so short is MEH but overall I really, really enjoyed it just like I enjoy all of Punk & Taker's work. Solid ***** for the Breaking Point match I think, twas impressed.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Amusing that one's opinion differs? It's that kind of logic which makes conversations among folk not even worth it.
> 
> You disagree with my statement, even though that's what the fact is. How does that make sense? We all know Axel is zilch without Heyman - hence the union. Hence why he's going to drop the strap and probably move onto nothing following. This is all known. Which is why I made the statement I did in the first place. Plus, why did you bring up Ryback's wrestling as a fault, but then when comparing Axel with Heyman, his wrestling work wasn't mentioned as a positive? C'mon man. Dislike the guy all you want, but lets not leave facts out if we're going through a rundown.


Well that is my personal opinion, not trying to crap over yours. I ain't a "your opinion sucks cause it's different than mine" guy by any means.

I get why the union exists. But the union was what opened everyone's eyes regarding Axel's flaws in the first place. He sucks bad enough with Heyman, God only knows without. And Ryback has a couple of positives - character, presence, charisma and OK mic skills. Axel's wrestling is the other 00.1% of good about him that doesn't involve Heyman's work. And that's basically it. Nothing else. Not a question of ignoring facts, because if I would, I'd be shitting hard on Ryback too, but I admitted his good too instead.

But like KOK said, let's just move on


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's the shenanigan riddled finish + short duration which I think turned folks off. Honestly, I feel it's good too. Work put in was quality and you take away the mentality that every main event "has" to be long, it's not bad. Following a match like Cena vs Orton was too bad in consideration to how good that one was, but I won't judge it's match quality on some questionable card placement/booking.

We're square, ATF.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Punk/Undertaker BP was decentish. My review of their series in 09... and the awesome '10 match too since its in the text document .



Spoiler: punk vs deadlyman



So with rumours of a potential Punk/Undertaker match at WM, I thought I'd FINALLY get off my arse (figuratively anyway, my arse stayed in the chair the entire time I searched and downloaded the matches lol) and watch their 09 series for the first time since... well 09.


CM Punk Vs The Undertaker - Breaking Point 2009

Match is submission only. Undertaker has NEVER lost via submission. The match takes place in Montreal. Lets face it, everyone and their drunken scottish friend knew there was gonna be a screw job at the end, but that doesn't mean the match can't be really good!

Punk gets some strikes in early on, and looks cocky as shit, only for Undertaker to shake everything off and begin to maul the WHC with rights, lefts, and boots to the face. I'll go to my grave calling the Dead Man the best "striker" (as WWE likes to call him) of all time. Not because WWE say he is, because he legit fucking IS.

Anywho, Punk gets a little control on the outside in a nice spot with Undertaker doing the old "running boot gets caught on the ropes" routine, only he gets caught on the barricade instead and it looks pretty painful. 

Punk gets bits of offence in here and there with Undertaker mainly keeping control of the match, but any time Punk DOES get something in, its big. The superplex for one, and the HUGE kick to the head. Just before the kick, Undertaker is beating the hell out of Punk and signals for a chokeslam, and you can actually see him with a huge silly grin on his face like he's having the time of his life lol.

So Punk kicks 'Taker, but when reaching down, Punk gets caught in Hells Gate! Tap out! New champ! New champ! New champ! STONE COLD. STO... UNDERTAKER! UNDERTAKER!

Dammit, worst GM ever, Teddy Long, has to remind us that Hells Gate was suspended back in fucking 2008 by Vickie Guerrero so the match will continue. Screw job on its way! 

Last Ride attempt is reversed, and Punk locks in the Anaconda Vice and the ref calls for the bell! Punk wins! Punk wins! Punk wins! STONE COLD! STON.. UNDERTA... PUNK! PUNK! PUNK!

Match is fairly short and has the screw job finish which is all kinda fast and comes out of nowhere. Its not a BAD match in any sense of the word, but it isn't exactly a classic either lol. Doesn't get time to develop into anything special, and the finish kinda takes away from it too.

Rating: **1/2


CM Punk Vs The Undertaker - Hell in a Cell 2009

Watching the video package before the match makes me remember how fucking silly some of this shit was. "WHERE TO, TEDDY?" :lmao and of course, the reasoning behind the whole thing from Teddy Long: "I have a family" :lmao. I still don't think they ever explained WHY Vince had helped Punk screw Undertaker lol.

Man, Punk is great in this. From being so scared early on that he falls to the floor and rolls out of the ring, to how he takes his beating on the outside being thrown into the cell and whatnot, to him gaining the upperhand and going after the leg. Crowd are hot for this one, chanting for BOTH men.

Love Punk's running knee to the face on the apron rather than how he's do it in the ring, then Undertaker countering the follow up bulldog buy launching Punk into the side of the cell. 

'Taker is great too of course, and takes some bumps into the cell, as well as continuing to sell the leg work from Punk all through the match. Also, I think he may be wearing white underwear . 

Damn, match is just barely over 10 minutes, and holy fuck is it WAY better than I remembered. Despite Punk losing the belt, he looks great throughout. Undertaker sells the leg incredibly well, and the whole match is genuinely really good. With everything they did in the match, it felt twice as long. Wish I'd gotten around to re-watching this sooner!

Rating: ***1/2


CM Punk Vs The Undertaker - Smackdown 10/23/2009

Teddy Long and Scott Armstrong are out for this match with Punk. Teddy at ringside and Armstrong as the referee, with Punk basically saying he's gonna screw Undertaker again and regain his title. Submission match too!

I remember this match being the best of their 09 series, so I can't wait to see it again!

Oh yeah, anyone remember the theme song for SD during this time? Loved it. Way, way better than the shite they have now.

Punk looks fucking GIDDY on the outside because he has his plan. Undertaker while handing over the title to Armstrong gives the ref a look that would kill him and his entire family. Little things. Gotta love em.

Oh man, the exchange early on where Punk almost locks in the Vice and UNDERTAKER looks desperate to escape then backs away while looking at the ref is like, fucking AWESOME. Wonderful storytelling from such a simple exchange :mark:.

Shhhiiiiiit, that bump from Undertaker where he gets his leg caught up in the ropes? DAMN. Undertaker wasn't 100% during his 09 title run, but fuck, aside from his matches not being too long, you really couldn't tell. He still bumps like a motherfucker, and you just HAVE to respect him for that. He might not be 100% but dammit he gives 100%.

Punk being just as desperate while escaping from Hells Gate as Undertaker was earlier is a neat little callback from the beginning of the match .

Punk gets control of the match again, and gets Teddy Long and Armstrong to give him a chair so he can hopefully finish the match and get his title back. Except Undertaker blocks the chair shot and takes out the ref with a chokeslam!!! Teddy runs away as Punk locks in the Anaconda Vice, signaling to Teddy to ring the bell. Teddy calls out another referee because apparently he can't end a match, and the new referee isn't biased! Undertaker counters into Hells Gate, and the Dead Man retains!

Yeah, this is great, and definitely their best 09 match together, yet still behind their 2010 match which is pretty fucking AWESOME. Well worth a watch for sure, bitches!

Rating: ***3/4


The Undertaker Vs CM Punk - WWE Smackdown 10/09/2010

Not often I get the "big match feel" from a TV main event these days, but they managed to do it here thanks to the great promo at the start of the show between these two men, and the fact that Punk sent the SES to the back so he could do this on his own.

Punk is determined to make a statement tonight against The Undertaker, while The Undertaker is here to show his brother Kane that despite not being 100%, and having not wrestled for a couple of months, he can still go. Pretty high stakes for both men in terms of storylines (Undertaker) and character (Punk).

Pointed this out in the SD thread, but I gotta mention it again; the pop Undertaker gets for doing nothing more than taking off his hood and rolling his eyes back is EPIC.

Undertaker is taking things slowly, not rushing into anything straight away, because he realises he isn't at his best, and Punk IS a dangerous man. Despite a slow start though, Undertaker gets in control as he begins to work over the arm, setting up to Old School and then something bigger. However, in his weakened state, Undertaker isn't able to keep his balance and falls on the ropes. Punk looks a little shocked at what just happened, but doesn't waste much time in taking advantage.

The awesomeness that is Punk comes out now, as he starts working over the arm and screams "how do you like it?" at Undertaker. Undertaker makes Punk look like a million *insert currency here* with how he takes Punk's offence and how he sells it too. Not often you see Undertaker getting dropped from a single Punk, especially not from a smaller guy, but it happens here. Undertaker knows exactly how his character should be acting due to the circumstances, and he plays it better than maybe anyone else in the world could. Going back to what Clique said about Undertaker being the best seller ever, matches like this prove that he might very well be the best seller in the world RIGHT NOW at the very least.

We get a few Undertaker hope spots, but between Punk cutting him off, and Undertaker simply not being able to follow up, Punk continues to control this match and looks certain to win.

Punk continues to look extremely strong in this match even when Undertaker is making a comeback, mainly during the part where he goes punch for punch with the Dead Man in the centre of the ring for longer than anyone Punk's size should, and also kicking out of a Chokeslam!

The finish keeps Punk looking strong too, as he finally hits the GTS, but can't follow up straight away due to taking the Chokeslam a few moments ago. When he finally crawls over for the cover, Undertaker pulls out THAT SUBMISSION HOLD and gets the victory. Like I said, keeps Punk looking strong due to kicking out of the Chokeslam and managing to hit his finisher, and then showing us that The Undertaker can still pull out the quick win when it comes down to it. Helps with the build to the NOC match with Kane too.

This is one hell of a match. Undertaker sold his "condition" incredibly, and Punk looked fantastic with his offence and how he controlled 90% of this match, and came sooooo damn close to actually winning. Kept both men looking strong, and continued the great build up to Kane Vs The Undertaker. Not sure if I would call it the current TV MOTY, but its real close.

Rating: ****


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Watching all of their matches now I think.... Underrated chemistry here for sure, overall probably better chemistry between Taker & Punk than there is between Taker & HHH .


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Does anybody remember McIntyre/Teddy from SD in 2010 aka probably the peak segment of Drew's career?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Hahahaha. Forgot the match was restarted b/c the old ruling of Hell's Gate being "banned" was brought up. He used it later in 2008 for crying out loud. :lmao


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I'm baffled as to why I haven't seen Bret vs Diesel Royal Rumble until now. I'd only seen their KotR and SVS matches until this point. Survivor Series was amazing, and superior to Royal Rumble I think, but not by that much. Very very quality bout, run in shenanigans aside. They told a good story, and stuck to it. Bret couldn't stand and bang with Diesel, anytime he tried he would be overpowered. So he attempted to use submissions and wrestling moves to ou maneuver Diesel and help chop him down. Diesels selling of the leg was actually pretty good. Bret kept going back to the figure 4 to weaken the leg, and it really didn't feel like he was spamming the move, just that it was the most effective way to work his leg until he found an opening for the Sharpshooter. 

****1/4


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

*Shawn Michaels and Stone Cold Steve Austin vs. Owen Hart and Davey boy Smith* *Raw is*_ *War 5/26/97 *_

-Ok so I have claimed that this is the GOAT tag match IMO, some (most on here refute this notion) so what to do ? REWATCH. In a hot crowd, after months on the self after a knee injury and "losing his smile" the great hbk returns to action to team with Scsa to take on Owen and Davey. This match is only about 11 minutes long but its so action packed throughout and does not have 1 slow point. I counted only 2 rest holds applied by Owen this entire match. I love this because its amazing to see how much they got done in soo little time. The rest of the Hart foundation come out to the stage to see the action for themselves. I love the tag team strategy but hbk/scsa as they work the arms or davey/owen and quick tag as much as they can. The match is almost flawless, and to quote JR "great atmosphere, great match" After the ref is distracted in the corner, hbk hits davey with the SCM, scsa pins him and its over

Yep, I still think this is the GOAT tag match as to how unique it is and it being almost flawless within 11 mins. I probably think this is a top 10 raw match, but I have to watch some matches again to make that claim​


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I was told recently how Bret vs Diesel is kind of shitty thanks to the run-ins. Got it on a DVD here so I can watch it for myself one of these days to see my opinion on it, but the way it sounds is kind of dreadful. Like the work put in for the majority of the match was for nothing with the non-finish.

Survivor Series 1995 match on the other hand...:lenny


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

*Trips/Foley, NWO '00 - ****1/2

6 Man HIAC, Armageddon '00 - ****1/4*

Just to say, I hadn't seen the 6 man in a LONG time. Holy shit was that match a thrill ride. Admittedly the beginning was just a whole bunch of punching but when it finally got going was it ever awesome. Horrible finish though, that actually bothered me because I wasn't ready for it to end quite yet. The AE in all it's crazy ass glory. FUN.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

RR match is epic, better than SVS imo. Andy agrees with me too. Even when he's sober! Run ins are crazy but honestly I don't think they take anything away from the match. In a weird way they ADD to it, though a proper finish would have been nice.

Well I was gonna spend tonight editing a youtube video, but my footage is terrible so I gotta re-shoot 2morrow. I think I shall watch some of that wrestling stuff.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Now I have to watch it tonight.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

The Primer said:


> I was told recently how Bret vs Diesel is kind of shitty thanks to the run-ins. Got it on a DVD here so I can watch it for myself one of these days to see my opinion on it, but the way it sounds is kind of dreadful. Like the work put in for the majority of the match was for nothing with the non-finish.
> 
> Survivor Series 1995 match on the other hand...:lenny





Callamus said:


> RR match is epic, better than SVS imo. Andy agrees with me too. Even when he's sober! Run ins are crazy but honestly I don't think they take anything away from the match. In a weird way they ADD to it, though a proper finish would have been nice.


Yeah, oddly the run-ins actually made it more fun to me. Usually, that would probably be annoying, but it almost came off as comical to me, in a good way. Especially the way that the ref responded to it. It had a mad hatter's feel to it, which I quite enjoyed.

SvS is still vastly superior, though, imo. RR is more "fun" to me, but I can see how people would find it annoying.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Bret/nash svs >>>rr

Bret's selling and babyface performance was superb


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Bret Vs Diesel:

KOTR - ****1/4
RR - ****1/2
SVS - ****1/2

Cage match... I watched and rated it for the top 100 WWF/E Matches but fuck knows what I rated it at. I think I liked it anyway . Not enough for the top 100 list of course but seem to think I thought it was good.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I like madness in wrestling so this could be right up my alley. Got big shoes to fill if it can come close to the Survivor Series match.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I'll give bret/diesel rumble a watch right now


Oh yea forgot to add hbk/scsa vs. Owen/davey is TVMOTY of 97 for me, but that was clear


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Is Undertaker/Yokozuna RR 94 any good? I remember laughing at it the last time I watched it. However, the last time I watched it, I hated Mark Henry and thought Kurt Angle was the GOAT. Royal Rumble 94 in general looks like a good PPV.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

RR 94? 



Spoiler: rr 94



1994 Royal Rumble

McMahon and DiBiase on commentary. Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

Match 1 - Tatanka Vs Bam Bam Bigelow - Why on earth was Tatanka undefeated for so long? Did he ever really get any kind of push? Bigelow has his MAIN SQUEEZE Luna with him. That's how they announce her lol. God damn motherfucking BEAR HUG. Stop using this move people. STOP IT. It's just murders any momentum you have going in the match. The fans could be loving what you are doing... right up until you lock in a Bear Hug and the fans just stop caring. Happened in Rock/Cena too (though a Bear Hug certainly wasn't the only thing wrong with that pile of turd), and it was in Rock's fucking home town or whatever. Aside from the Bear Hug spot though, this is good. Bigelow is a great big man, and while I don't think Tatanka deserved the long undefeated streak or anything he was solid too and could pull out some good stuff. **1/2.

We see the history of the Hart Brothers and their issues that started back at the Survivor Series. Bret refuses to fight his own Brother. Guess Owen is gonna have to put him in a casket and set him on fire. Wait, I may be confusing this with another feud. They are friends now. Kinda. Tag match coming up.

Match 2 - Bret & Owen Hart Vs The Quebecers - RR seems to have a great history up to this point of really good tag matches. I think there has been at least one good one on each event so far. And I already know it continues here, and goes into 1995 as well. But that's for 2morrow. This is today, and I can't wait to re-watch this one. Ha, Raven is the manager of the Quebecers. Johnny Polo at this time. I *think* he's supposed to be like some rich guy who golfs and shit. Fuck knows. Don't care tbh. Though I do think Raven was at his best in that role lol. Never was a fan of the Raven character and always thought his promos were overrated to hell. Great back and forth action for about 10 minutes, then we transition into a full on FIP segment with Bret having his leg taken out and the Quebecers take full advantage. They work over the injured Bret, then Bret finds an opening... and decides to attempt a Sharpshooter rather than tag his brother! He can't apply the hold, and the referee decides that Bret cannot continue, giving the match to the Quebecers. Owen is PISSED. Bret chose to try and win the match himself rather than tag in his brother. So Owen KICKS HIS LEG FROM OUT OF HIS LEG. That'll teach him. ****.

Match 3 - Razor Ramon Vs I.R.S. - IC title on the line. Rotunda went from being a great wrestler... to being the dullest bastard on the face of the planet the moment he put on a suit and became the Tax Man. Maybe that was the point. Tax Men are portrayed as being the dullest people on earth, so maybe he HAD to change his style to rest holds. Huh, JR and Monsoon are on commentary now. JR is awesome. IRS is literally DRIPPING WITH SWEAT. Eeeewww. Doesn't help that he's wearing a white shirt. It's practically see through by the end of this. HBK attacks Razor with HIS IC title belt (He was IC champ, got suspended and refused to give up the title belt. New one was made, Razor won it, HBK came back with his, feud began and they have the ladder match at WM), and IRS gets the win! New champ! Until Earl Hebner comes out and tells the ref what happened. Match restarts and Razor wins. I never understand how they can do that one match then let anything slide in another lol. Decent match. **.

DOUBLE WIDE, DOUBLE DEEP CASKET. Paul Bearer promo. Loved those segments showing Undertaker making the casket and shit lol. Undertaker's "Ho. Ho. Ho." might be the creepiest christmas thing ever.

Match 4 - Yokozuna Vs The Undertaker - Casket Match for the WWF Title! Undertaker looks like an unstoppable zombie early on, taking Yoko apart, but the fear of being put in a casket encourages Yoko to fight back. Did anyone other than Undertaker and Bret get good singles matches out of Yoko? They do some fun shit together until Undertaker lands a massive chokeslam and puts Yoko in the casket, but CRUSH shows up to prevent the title from changing hands. Kabuki and fucking TENRYU show up to help out Yoko too. Then Bam Bam. They keep having to bring out guys because Undertaker is unstoppable lol. Fuji steals the urn but Bearer steals it back and decks Fuji and Cornette over the year with it lol, and Undertaker fights back once again. ADAM BOMB comes out to even the odds... for the heels because 5 guys isn't enough. Neither is 6 apparently as Jeff Jarrett shows up. LMAO Undertaker STILL fights back and another few guys come out including Diesel... and it STILL isn't enough yet! Not even Cena could overcome these odds for this long. Yoko gets the urn and levels Undertaker with it, and then green smoke escapes from it. Everyone starts attacking Undertaker individually and Undertaker is DONE. And then he cuts a promo from inside the casket, and "floats up to heaven" or something. Crazy, weird, strange, but kinda cool. Fun match, but I think the beatdown on Undertaker lasts longer than the Undertaker/Yoko parts lol. **3/4.

Match 5 - 30 Man Royal Rumble Match - #1 is Scott Steiner. #2 is none other than Samu. What a dull way to start the rumble. I wonder if everyone gets entrance music this year. Had to have started soon, right? Nope. Not this year. GOD FUCKING DAMMIT. This year instead of having someone last 40+ minutes and puts in a great performance, we have Diesel simply DOMINATE the match for a short period of time, eliminating the most men up to that point, before he's eliminated by a group effort. Backlund puts up one hell of a fight using his great amateur skills to use by keeping low to the ground and closing in on Diesel's legs, and holy fuck does it look like he's trying to SHOOT eliminate the big man lol. Might be the most convincing non elimination ever. You know how when someone is trying to throw someone else out, and you can clearly see them basically helping to make sure he DOESN'T go out? Well not here lol. Backlund looks like he wants to throw Diesel out and win this thing legit. Then he gets eliminated. Dammit. Virgil is a replacement for someone (I forget) and Diesel looks like he's trying to stiff the shit out of him before throwing him out haha. The two favourites to win this are Lex Luger and Bret Hart. Hart has the leg injury from the match earlier in the night, and Luger got attacked backstage by Kabuki and TENRYU. You ain't lived until you've seen TENRYU threaten people with a broom, then put it down and walk past everyone like he's the fucking BOSS. Because he is. ALL HAIL TENRYU. Anywho, yeah, 2 favourites, both with injury angles to overcome. But only ONE of them can win. Right? Nah, both win. Match is mostly good. Gets a little dull towards the end for me though. **3/4.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Is Undertaker/Yokozuna RR 94 any good? I remember laughing at it the last time I watched it. However, the last time I watched it, I hated Mark Henry and *thought Kurt Angle was the GOAT*. Royal Rumble 94 in general looks like a good PPV.


:usangle :usangle :usangle

After my school's game today, I think I'm gonna start a project of sorts. I'm thinking Daniel Bryan, but that'd be too easy


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

After Smackdown I'm feelin some Cesaro.. what would everyone consider his best match so far?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

His matches vs. Sami Zayn (2/3 Falls) and Daniel Bryan are a must-watch


----------



## mk92071 (Aug 17, 2011)

WWE Royal Rumble - 1/27/08​
I haven't watched much 2008 in the last few years bar WrestleMania 24 so why not? 

*Career Threatening Match*
Ric Flair vs. MVP 
So I remember this match as not being too good. I don't have ratings down for any part of this show so it has definitely been a few years. Flair cuts a promo sucking up to the crowd and MVP's music interrupts him to almost no reaction. The match starts with a pretty slow pace, but the crowd is into it, woooing for all of Flair's offense. Not a lot exciting here. MVP does a poorly executed roll up reversal to the figure four. The fake 3 count spot was alright with Flair's roll up attempt being a believable ending. Half of Flair's moveset is knife edged chops. Flair does an alright counter into a figure four for the finish. This was a nothing match. Probably around *1/2. Very, very skippable.

Vince is backstage with Hornswoggle. Vince talks about his and Hornswoggle's heritage and says he shouldn't trust anyone, including Finlay. Vince expects him to win. Finlay walks in and Vince emphasizes that Hornswoggle and Finlay can't trust each other. Pointless? Pointless.

Mike Adamle debut? Seems like it. Awesome. This guy is hilariously bad. Everyone is probably wondering who the fuck this guy is. HYPE VIDEO. The premise of this feud seems kind of silly. But its JBL and Jericho so this better be good. 

Chris Jericho vs. JBL
No limo, the entrance area is too small. Still a glorious theme song. This seems to be really serious. JBL gets some cheap shots after Jericho wins starting lock ups. Jericho is super aggressive. Dem kicks to the gut. JBL swung for the lariato but ended up in the walls. This match got much faster paced. JBL drops Jericho throat first on the ropes and kills him with a couple lariotos. I hope JBL can keep up this focused work on the throat. Really dug JBL using the sleeper hold for some reason. Jericho gets thrown into the ring post, like the shoulder first kind of spot, but his head gets busted bad. Jericho is bleeding fast. This makes JBL look like a real asshole. Jericho's default comeback move is a forearm. Oh this comeback is horrible. Dat botched bulldog. Cactus clothesline and they're on the floor. Jericho dents JBL's skull with a chairshot for the DQ. That finish was out of nowhere. Jericho is still on JBL post match and is getting revenge with the chord. This was getting good but Jericho's big comeback was horrible and the finish was out of nowhere. **1/4 Solid, nothing spectacular.

Ashley is knocking on Maria's door backstage and Santino comes out. It was so hard to care about this. HYPE VIDEO.

*World Heavyweight Championship*
Edge (c) vs. Rey Mysterio
I miss Edge's theme. La Familia minus Chavo (and Bam if he was a thing yet) out after Edge. Mysterio looks super serious with a Spartan helmet on over his mask. Rey using his quickness to get the upperhand early on is nice. Rey dude is roll through spot but ended up eating a boot anyways. Hawkins and Ryder get ejected whem the referee catches them about to attack Rey. Edge kicking Rey's knee when he wason the second rope was :mark: . Rey hopping around is great, and Edge even applies a stretch muffler for a few seconds. Rey's roll through kick to the head is a great nearfall and his whole comeback sequence is awesome. He constantly sells the injured leg. Rey did a freaking double stomp! Rey's offense in this match is really unique, but to be fair I haven't watched much Rey Rey recently so I might not have realized how awesome he is. Vickie gets involved with the finish in an interesting way, and Edge catches Rey with a mid air spear. Jesus. This was 12 minutes of awesome. Rey did a fantastic job selling the leg for the most part. They did a great job teasing a Rey win, and the interference added to the drama in my opinion. ***3/4 Really good match and probably will be MOTN. 

Flair and Kennedy are backstage. Kennedy implies that he wants to face Ric but Shawn Michaels comes in and interrupts him. Kennedy leaves. Batista and Triple H come into the scene, they are all hyping the rumble saying the best man will win. Shawn shills his shirt and H and Batista leave. What. Ew. I have to watch a Jeff Hardy match. 

Oh wait Maria is coming out. They are doing a kiss cam. Why? This is on Pay Per View. Ashley comes out. Ashley says Hugh wants Maria in Playboy, and Santino comes out. Santino gets cheap heat and says Maria won't do it. Ashley leaves it up to Maria, and Maria doesn't make a choice still. Santino has a special friend and its Big Dick Johnson in Patriots gear dancing. Ashley beats him up. Wow these segments suck. Theres a horrible WrestleMania video. 

Adamle has a microphone again. He calls Jeff Hardy, Jeff Harvey. Hype video.

*WWE Championship*
Randy Orton (c) vs. Jeff Hardy
Starts off pretty basic. Jeff ends up taking things to the floor with a drop kick and suicide dive. Orton is grabbing his belt like he is going to leave, but Jeff cuts him off with punches and gets him back in the ring. Jeff eats a dropkick from Orton sending him back to the floor. Orton hits a suplex on the floor and brings things back to the ring. ORTON STOMPS. Lames signature in an SVR game. Hardy sends Orton to the floor and hits a diving clothesline on Orton. His offense doesn't last long since he shoulders the ring post. Running powerslams will never stop being cool. Hardy is doing his come back, I really don't like the Whisper in the Wind. It just looks bad about half the time if not more. Randy rolled away from a swanton attempt but ends up eating a dropkick to the floor. Jeff does a moonsault from the top turnbuckle to the floor. Orton reverses a twist of fate into an RKO out of nowhere to win. Wow. That ending was out of nowhere. I didn't like how most of Hardy's offense was dives to the floor. It just got old. Orton didn't do anything of note. Really average. **

By the numbers video. Michael Buffer tells us to get ready to rumble. Sure. 

*Royal Rumble 2008*
I honestly don't know if I've ever seen it. Undertaker is out first :mark: . Shawn Michaels out second! Why did I not know that this would happen? Well. This better be awesome. Shawn bumping around for Taker is so fun to watch. Santino is out next. He eats a superkick and Taker throws him out. Michaels tries to get Taker with his back turned. Michaels has a good reversal to old school. Taker hits a chokeslam as Khali comes out. Chop. Khali ends up missing a chop and gets thrown over after about a minute of Khali shittiness. Hardcore Holly is in next. Michaels tries to sneak eliminate Taker again, but Taker counters it. Holly ends up stomping at Taker and nobody is eliminate. John Morrison is #6. He is hot for a second but Taker and Michaels team up on him. A nice near elimination. Michaels connects with a top rope elbow on Morrison and sets up for Sweet Chin Music. Morrison countered and hit a sweet kick of his own. Dreamer is out next to a pop. Its at the point where everything is just brawling. Batista in at #8 and takes out everyone but Taker. Teased staredown that Dreamer tries to interrupt results in Dreamer getting eliminated. Morrison gets speared. Hornswoggle is out next. Why did he have to be a thing? Hornswoggle goes under the ring. Chuck Paulombo out next. #11 is Jamie Noble, so they are building up the Noble/Chuck feud. I suprisingly remember that feud. Noble gets manhandled and eliminated by Noble. Morrison has almost been eliminated about 100 times so far and keeps barely hanging on. Punk is out next. He kills everyone with corner knees until he eats a lariato from Undertaker. Punk eliminated Chuck with a knee when he was on the apron. #13 is Cody Rhodes. This is when he was a CAW. I think someone is going on a rampage soon and clearing the ring. Umaga comes out and mauls everyone. He thumbs Holly over the top rope. Michaels teased a piledriver on Rhodes. Snitsky is #15, and I forgot he existed. Cody Rhodes flies onto Snitsky's back and almost gets them both eliminated. The Miz is out next so Miz and Morrison are teaming up on Punk. Shelton Benjamin comes in to hit 2 big spots and then eat a sweet chin music that eliminates him from the match. Old man Jimmy Snuka is in next. He headbutts a bunch of people. Oh and Roddy Piper is next. He makes a long entrance. Him and Snuka get in an exchange while everyone else just watches. Kane is ot at #20. I feel like he's about to eliminate a ton of people. He eliminates Piper and Snuka. Chokeslams Miz. Undertaker teases chokeslamming Kane, but he ends up grabbing Shawn by the throat. He gets out of the predicament, and Carlito is out next. A fun little exchange following a counter to Carlito's back elbow. Mick Foley is here! Its getting real. He fights off practically everyone in the match. Taker hits Batista with a powerbomb, Umaga hits Taker with a samoan drop. Morrison's hits the flying chuck to Foley, that spot always looks great. KENNEDY. Hits a mic check on Miz. He gets in an exchange with Taker and eats a chokeslam. Big Daddy V is next. There are a ton of huge men in this match. Snitsky gets eliminated by Taker, Taker gets eliminated by Michaels. Taker lands on his feet and stares at Michaels who gets eliminated by Kennedy! Undertaker angrily beats up Snitsky. Rhodes did a sweet huricanrana to Kennedy for a near elimination. Henry is in too at #25. Hornswoggle comes out from under the ring and helps eliminate The Miz before going back under the ring. Chavo is coming in next and gets into it with Punk. Hornswoggle tries to eliminate Henry and gets pulled into the ring. Mark, Big Daddy V, and Chavo try to beat him up and Finlay runs in and saves him, swinging his hammer thing around. Finlay and Hornswoggle walk out, don't think they were eliminated. It says Elijah Burke is #28 so I think that means, Finlay was #27? Batista may have been eliminated. Chavo eliminates Punk. Batista didn't get eliminated, shows the replay. #29 is Triple H. He eliminates Rhodes with ease. Throws at Big Daddy V. He's in an exchange with Foley and eliminates Foley and Burke. Pedigree on Umaga. CENA RETURN. Triple H's face is great. Cena throws out Chavo, Carlito, and Mark Henry. Cena is face to face with Triple H. The crowd is really pumped which makes this so fun to watch. Umaga ruins their exchange and Batista spears Umaga. Batista eliminates Umaga and Kennedy. Batista and Triple H eliminate Kane. IT IS DOWN TO THREE. After a brief taunt off, they just start going at it. Signatures everywhere. At this point I'm going to go on a limb and say that Hornswoggle and Finlay aren't still legally in. Batista gets clotheslined over by Triple H. POINTING AT THE SIGN. The finishing stretch was good and the crowd was electric. It's really tough to rate a royal rumble match. Its fun and didn't drag, but it isn't a fantastic wrestling match. Some slower parts than others. Always good. I think it's around a ***1/2.

Alright show overall. The opener was meh at best but the rest of the card was solid at the worst. I really liked Rey vs. Edge and the rumble is always good. ​


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> Bret/nash svs >>>rr
> 
> Bret's selling and babyface performance was superb




See I think Bret actually heeled it up quite a bit in their SVS match, and that's why I liked it so much. He said in his book the whole purpose behind that match was trying to get Diesel some sympathy. I mean he tied his leg to a ring post and beat Diesel mercilessly, that's some pretty heel stuff. Probably the best match Bret had that didn't involve Austin, Owen, or Hennig. Beautiful story telling and selling, from start to finish.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I'm a fan of quoting outsiders' lists p) and I found this interesting if questionable list here... from Bleacher Report of all places. The Top 10 HIAC PPV matches ever:



> 1. Sheamus vs. The Big Show, 2012
> 2. John Cena vs. CM Punk vs. Alberto Del Rio, 2011
> 3. John Cena vs. Randy Orton, 2009
> 4. Randy Orton vs. Sheamus, 2010
> ...


The Top 2 were never in question. The rest is sorta OK too but Cena/Orton is way, way too high.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Is it weird I sorta enjoyed the CM Skunk beating?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

"Jeff Harvey. Hardy." Adamle the GOAT.

:ti Bleacher Report. Orton/Sheamus is on Bossman/Taker levels of shitty.

Editing because I type too fast and don't check things. I mean Cena/Orton sucks. Like, really sucks.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> See I think Bret actually heeled it up quite a bit in their SVS match, and that's why I liked it so much. He said in his book the whole purpose behind that match was trying to get Diesel some sympathy. I mean he tied his leg to a ring post and beat Diesel mercilessly, that's some pretty heel stuff. Probably the best match Bret had that didn't involve Austin, Owen, or Hennig. Beautiful story telling and selling, from start to finish.


Sorry not babyface performance, meant big guy/little guy type match, either way I remember bret selling Nash offense beautifully, unless I'm talking about a different match ? Pretty sure it's svs95


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> "Jeff Hardy. Harvey." Adamle the GOAT.
> 
> :ti Bleacher Report. Orton/Sheamus is on Bossman/Taker levels of shitty.


Taker/Bossman shitty? That's not even harsh, that's a downright insult to *any* match . Haven't watched it in a while but I recall digging the hell out of it - except for the puke-worthy Irish Curse on the steps spot.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Damn it. I meant Cena/Orton. Cena/Orton is on Bossman/Taker levels. Orton/Sheamus, I liked. I still don't understand the backbreaker on the steps.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

If you all watch Bret/Nash RR '95, make sure you keep watching until after the final decision, because more stuff happens afterwards.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Hart Brothers vs. Quebecers is really really good. Reminds me of a match I saw in my COTC project involving Eddie Gilbert and Ron Simmons vs. The Fantastics. In that match, both Gilbert and Bret pulled off beautiful babyface performances, but they made the crucial mistake of not tagging in their partner. Post-match stuff was awesome too. Man that Owen/Bret feud was perfect. ******


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Cactus Jack said:


> See I think Bret actually heeled it up quite a bit in their SVS match, and that's why I liked it so much. He said in his book the whole purpose behind that match was trying to get Diesel some sympathy. I mean he tied his leg to a ring post and beat Diesel mercilessly, that's some pretty heel stuff. *Probably the best match Bret had that didn't involve Austin, Owen, or Hennig. Beautiful story telling and selling, from start to finish.*


I think that I agree, outside of tag matches. I'm still super high on Steiner Brothers vs. Hart Brothers, dammit! Godly.

Speaking of Owen & Bret, I'm not as high on the match against the Quebecers as everyone else is. I think that's one I'll have to give a re-watch to. I did love the turn, and thought it was executed beautifully. Loved Owen ranting righteously on the big screen, as Bret was being taken out on a stretcher.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Undertaker vs Yokozuna is fun in the biggest sense of old school WWF. Action is solid and the numerous amount of run-ins to destroy Taker is worth a chuckle, but not in the most negative of fashions. It's just like "woah, they really put Undertaker over big time here needing over ten dudes to knock him down." Of course I'm pro the shenanigans. Even if he didn't get the Championship.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

I'd put Bulldog on that list as well, Cactus Jack, as Bret's match vs. Bulldog at IYH would be ranked about the same as vs. Diesel at SvS for me.

_ETA_:

I rated Bret Hart matches I'd rate *** 1/2 & above for a Bret Hart thread. I'll post it here:



Spoiler: spoiler



FIVE STARS:

Hart Brothers vs. Steiner Brothers Wrestle Fest '94 *****

Bret Hart vs. Owen Hart WM X *****

Bret Hart vs. Owen Hart Summerslam '94 *****

Bret Hart vs. Steve Austin WM XIII *****


FOUR & 3/4 STARS:

Bret Hart vs. Mr. Perfect KOTR 93 **** 3/4

Bret Hart vs. British Bulldog IYH '95 **** 3/4

Bret Hart vs. Steve Austin Survivor Series '96 **** 3/4

Bret Hart & Hart Foundation vs. Team Austin Canadian Stampede IYH XVI - **** 3/4


FOUR & 1/2 STARS:

Bret Hart vs. British Bulldog Summerslam '92 **** 1/2

Bret Hart vs. Diesel Survivor Series '95 **** 1/2

Bret Hart vs. Shawn Michaels WM XII **** 1/2

Bret Hart vs. Undertaker One Night Only '97 **** 1/2

Bret Hart vs. Chris Benoit Nitro Oct '99 - **** 1/2


FOUR & 1/4 STARS:

Bret Hart vs. Mr. Perfect Summerslam '91 **** 1/4

Bret Hart vs. 123 Kid RAW '94 **** 1/4


FOUR STARS:

Bret Hart vs. Randy Savage SNME Nov '87 ****

Hart Foundation vs. Brain Busters Summerslam '89 ****

Bret Hart vs. Bob Backlund Survivor Series '94 ****

Bret Hart vs. Hakushi IYH1 ****

Bret Hart vs. Jean Pierre Lafitte IYH III - ****

Bret Hart vs. Steve Austin IYH XIV ****

Bret Hart vs. Ric Flair Souled Out '98 ****


THREE & 3/4 STARS:

Bret Hart vs. Ted Dibiase SNME April '91 *** 3/4

Bret Hart vs. Roddy Piper WM VIII *** 3/4

Bret Hart vs. Shawn Michaels Survivor Series 92 *** 3/4

Bret Hart vs. Razor Ramon KoTR 93 *** 3/4

Bret Hart vs. Jerry Lawler Summerslam '93 *** 3/4

Bret Hart vs. Bob Backlund Superstars '94 *** 3/4

Bret Hart vs. Diesel Royal Rumble '95 *** 3/4

Bret Hart vs. Hakushi RAW July '95 *** 3/4

Bret Hart vs. Steve Austin Kuwait '96 *** 3/4

Bret Hart vs. Shawn Michaels Survivor Series '97 *** 3/4


THREE & 1/2 STARS:

Bret Hart vs. Mr. Perfect Toronto '89 *** 1/2

Hart Foundation vs. Demolition Summerslam '90 *** 1/2

Bret Hart & Macho Man vs. Ric Flair & Shawn Michaels July 20, 1992 *** 1/2

Bret Hart vs. Yokozuna WMIX *** 1/2

Bret Hart vs. Bam Bam Bigelow KOTR 93 *** 1/2

Bret Hart vs. Diesel KOTR 94 *** 1/2

Bret Hart vs. Undertaker Sumerslam '97 *** 1/2

Bret Hart vs. Booker T Nitro January '99 - *** 1/2


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> Sorry not babyface performance, meant big guy/little guy type match, either way I remember bret selling Nash offense beautifully, unless I'm talking about a different match ? Pretty sure it's svs95




Oh no you're right he definitely did. That's what made Bret's performance so masterful, he managed to heel it up, beat on Diesel and get him sympathy, while at the same time not turning heel himself and keeping his top baby face spot. It's really a tour de force performance with a perfect match structure. (In my best Vince McMahon voice) I'm not so sure there are any other wrestlers who could have pulled that off.

Does it bug the ever loving shit out of anyone else how Vince always says "I'm not so sure" and "Oh! He got him!......no he didn't"


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

"ONE!...TWO!...oh no, he kicked out."

Hearing his excitement die after the kick out gets me every time.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Ahhh Vince on commentary. I still crack up when he calls the Sweet Chin Music on Sid in the HBK/Sid SVS 96 match :lmao.

"THURREBURERREDUGH! SWEET CHIN MUSIC! HUREEBUGHEDUD!"


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:lmao

SOMEONE ELSE NOTICED, OMG YES


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Fairly certain he blew his load over it :lmao.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Vince probably jizzed for Shawn in 96 the way he probably jizzes over like, Ryback, which is a strange comparison.

Remember WM 12 and Shawn's entrance: "SHAWN MICHAELS, AH NAH, LOOK AT THAT!!"


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> "ONE!...TWO!...oh no, he kicked out."
> 
> Hearing his excitement die after the kick out gets me every time.


Lol I actually do like that, but the "He got him! No he didn't!" gets old, and it's like he has a complete lack of grammar sense with the "I'm not so sure so and so isn't the best blah blah blah". Vince. It's called A DOUBLE FUCKING NEGATIVE. THAT MEANS WHAT YOU JUST SAID NEGATED ITSELF AND YOU SOUND LIKE A SIMPLE MINDED FUCK FACE. Sorry, my mom is an English teacher, I can't take intentionally poor grammar over and over. It just bothered me so much when Vince had JR AND Heenan at the same time and still put himself in the booth. That's like WWE deciding to add The Great Khali and make an Eddie vs Benoit match a triple threat. Ugh.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Remember WM 12 and Shawn's entrance: "SHAWN MICHAELS, AH NAH, LOOK AT THAT!!"


:lmao 

I could hear that vividly in my head, thanks to you.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Vince's heart stopped mid-SCM call. Had flashbacks to the days where he was with Sunny, started to mumble.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I think these Bret/Nash matches are underrated as fuck tbhayley

Underrated in a sense most think there good but always say the owen's, stone cold's, perfect's match are much better than it. These two are on the same level as most of those IMO maybe besides mania 13



He loves him some Shawn :draper2


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

On the subject of HIAC, YTuber WeAreProWrestling's HIAC match ranking:



> 1. The Undertaker vs. Shawn Michaels (*****)
> 2. The Undertaker vs. Mankind (*****)
> 3. The Undertaker vs. Triple H (*****)
> 4. Brock Lesnar vs. The Undertaker (*****)
> ...


:lmao at some of these.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Ziggler & Swagger? Umm.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Bret/Bulldog matches kinda suck.

Needed to be said.

Especially their SS match.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Oh my God I threw up a little. All those 5* ratings. :lol

Oh yeah, Cena defended the belt inside HIAC, in a DARK MATCH. Da fuck Vince?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Ziggler & Swagger? Umm.









HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Oh my God I threw up a little. All those 5* ratings. :lol


You think this is bad? What if I showed you his *entire* ***** library? :lol


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Callamus said:


> Bret/Bulldog matches kinda suck.
> 
> Needed to be said.
> 
> Especially their SS match.


The SS match has gone down a tad for me too, but i still love the IYH match :yum:


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

:lmao They had a HIAC match six days before the actual HIAC PPV.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Dark HIAC match wtf.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

zigg/swagg ?

And yea I agree Cal, bret/davey ss 92 is the cure to insomnia , but the iyh 95 match is just :mark: all love


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Bret/Bulldog matches kinda suck.
> 
> Needed to be said.
> 
> Especially their SS match.


Bah humbug you Scrooge, I don't think they suck at all. Summerslam is one of the best carry jobs ever and IYH is actually really good, in my opinion.


Summerslam 1992- ***1/2
IYH: SB ****1/4


If Davey hadn't spent the entire summer smoking crack with Jim Neidhart and was actually in shape, SS could have been absolutely epic. All those rest holds just killed the flow. But that insanely hot crowd, plus the great story, makes me still think fondly of it. I can watch it all the way through without getting bored.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Lets just call it like it is and put over Smith's best match & that's vs Owen in Germany.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Lets just call it like it is and put over Smith's best match & that's vs Owen in Germany.


If that's the match they had for the European Championship then you would be correct, sir. Although I think IYH is real real close. Plus he had some fantastic tags with the Harts when he teamed with Dynamite.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Owen/Bulldog - ****3/4 and I don't think any Bulldog match comes close.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Does anyone have a good link to that match? The one I have has the commentary in friggin German so I've only watched it once.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

ATF said:


> You think this is bad? What if I showed you his *entire* ***** library? :lol


Plz no. I'll be there are at least 57 ***** matches, all of which are WWF/E matches. I can probably guess most of them too, as I've now seen how he overrates stuff. 

Need to check the Smackdown main event now. :mark:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Plz no. I'll be there are at least 57 ***** matches, all of which are WWF/E matches. I can probably guess most of them too, as I've now seen how he overrates stuff.
> 
> Need to check the Smackdown main event now. :mark:


I'll PM you that list later just for you to be shocked


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Crazy how Owen/Bulldog occurred on what was for a long time considered one of the worst RAWs ever. So bad that the WWE immediately made changes across the board. It is my favorite RAW match ever and only behind the big three Smackdown matches in best WWE TV bouts (Taker/Angle 03, Eddie/Rey, Benoit/Angle 01). I can't find the other Owen/Bulldog match for the life of me.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Owen/Bulldog imo is the GOAT Raw match. Can't think of any that come close to it either tbh. Unless I'm forgetting something (what? ME? FORGET? LIES!).


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Ill upload *Owen/Bulldog* tomorrow if anyone needs it


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Zep I dont know if you saw my post a couple days ago, do you have cena/y2j svs 08 by any chance ?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

redskins25 said:


> Zep I dont know if you saw my post a couple days ago, do you have cena/y2j svs 08 by any chance ?


Yeah, its on the History of the WHC Set (i think), ill sort it out tomorrow


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^ your a GOD

finishing bret/diesel rumble and getting my costume ready for tonite


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

zep81 said:


> Yeah, its on the History of the WHC Set (i think), ill sort it out tomorrow




Yep I own that set as well, awesome documentary and a damn good match selections (Vader vs Steamboat Saturday night :mark: :mark

Thanks in advance for the bulldog/Owen upload sir, watching it on mute sucked.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Checked out the Smackdown main event. Match is pretty fun, with good isolation from the Shield on Cody and Goldust. Bryan does his normal thing with the drop kicks on everyone when he gets in, which I still like. I continue to enjoy Reigns a ton, but I wish they would have let him fight out of the surfboard thing, since he's the powerhouse of the bunch. 

Last couple minutes are pretty hot, like most of the matches involving these folks have been. My problem is that after all the flying around and crazy stuff, Orton gets tagged in and just kills the momentum, which his "slithering". I know that's his thing and all, but in this situation it bothers me. Still think the match is good, and the finish makes me thing Orton wins the strap tomorrow.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Checked out the Smackdown main event. Match is pretty fun, with good isolation from the Shield on Cody and Goldust. Bryan does his normal thing with the drop kicks on everyone when he gets in, which I still like. I continue to enjoy Reigns a ton, but I wish they would have let him fight out of the surfboard thing, since he's the powerhouse of the bunch.
> 
> Last couple minutes are pretty hot, like most of the matches involving these folks have been. My problem is that after all the flying around and crazy stuff, Orton gets tagged in and just kills the momentum, which his "slithering". I know that's his thing and all, but in this situation it bothers me. Still think the match is good, and the finish makes me thing Orton wins the strap tomorrow.



That seems to be Ortons problem lately, he's in matches with guys like Bryan who are all energy and get the fans pumped up, and he can't adapt and keep the energy level sustained.

I think the biggest issue is we aren't really seeing true heel Orton. We are seeing an amalgam of his heel Legacy character mixed with the face Viper character, and it's just leaving fans a bit confused. The slithering Viper bit is a pure face action ment to connect with the crowd, so why is he doing it as a heel? He needs to drop all of the Viper character work in his matches and get back to that vicious, ruthless, self entitled prick Orton character from 2009. 

The other issue is that this feud is mainly Trips vs Bryan, Orton is just being presented as the goon. As a result, we aren't seeing the HATE in these matches you'd expect from a top rivalry that has been going on for near 3 months now, where one guy cost the other guy his chance at glory. I just want to see an Orton control segment where he just loses it and starts beating the holy hell out of Bryan. Enough of the robotic clothes lines and stupid grins, just be a vicious arrogant cunt already and go full blown heel. Working the way he has been is not only hurting himself, it's hurting Bryan. We need to believe that there is no chance for Bryan to beat Orton straight up, so when he does make that comeback in the match it's all the more inspiring and meaningful.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Let's hope that's what we get tomorrow, right? 

I have high hopes for tomorrow's cell match. Battleground was an improvement over Night of Champions so hopefully they've just been saving the best for last and go all out inside that structure.


----------



## Cleavage (Apr 19, 2005)

So I watched WrestleMania 19 last night



Spoiler: Don't click here



*WWE Cruiserweight Championship: Matt Hardy (w/Shannon Moore) vs. Rey Mysterio*
Mattitude.com says “Matt is appearing in his 4th WrestleMania; Matt often wonders how they did WrestleMania without him” Rey Mysterio comes out in Daredevil themed attire, Shannon Moore tries to distract Mysterio, but gets chased out and Hardy’s attempt to jump Rey from behind but is met with a backdrop sending him to the floor. Rey takes both men out with a corkscrew plancha and throws Hardy back inside for a two count. Hardy charges into Rey in the corner but runs head first into a boots of Rey. Rey would then hit a hurracanrana followed by a dropkick. Rey tries to sunset flip, but Moore breaks it up with a kick to the gut. This allows Matt to drop Mysterio on the security wall, and throws him back inside for two. Pumphandle slam gets another two count. Matt begins to choke Rey on the second rope, and when the ref pulls him off Moore gets a couple of cheap shots in. Matt tries to drop down on Mysterio, but Rey springboards off the second rope, but gets kicked in the mid-section. Matt goes for a twist of fate, but Mysterio counters into a sunset flip for two. Matt then whips Rey into the buckle and hits a side effect for two; he then connects with a snap mare, and then locks in a double wristlock but Rey kicks out. Mysterio puts the boots up in the corner on another Hardy charge, and goes into the ring post shoulder first. Rey springboards in with a seated senton, and then another springboard crossbody for a close 2 count. Mysterio hits a hurracanrana and a DDT for a two count and Rey sets up for the 619, but Moore trips him up for the floor. Matt would then connect with twist of fate, but Rey kicks out at two. Rey hits a super hurracanrana and as Rey covers, Moore puts Hardy’s leg on the bottom rope to break the count. Moore comes up to the apron, and Hardy tries to attack Rey from behind but ends up taking out Moore. Rey then hits the 619 and he goes for the west coast pop, but Hardy ducks it. Rey tries for a victory roll, but Matt sits back on it and grabs the bottom rope for the win. Way too short, but it did a great job for me getting me hyped with all the face paced action. **3/4

*The Undertaker vs. The Big Show & A-Train*
As Train & Show makes their way down to the ring, A-Train stops to spit on Taker’s bike. That allows 
Show to try and attack Taker from behind, but Taker pulls down the top rope and sends him to the floor. Train tries to sneak in, but gets met with a chokeslam for an awesome near believable finish. Show pulls Taker off during the count and brings him to the floor. Taker delivers a right hand and heads back inside, Show whips Taker into the corner, but Taker fires out with a big boot and begins to punch away but Train tags in and a shoulderblock. Train hits the ropes again, and this time after a leapfrog gets an armdrag. Taker delivers old school to Train, and knocks Show off the apron. Taker then turns around and walks right into the derailer, but instead of covering A-Train throws him to the floor. Show rams Taker into the ringpost, and then press slams him into the barricade. Show sends Taker back inside, and Train slingshots him into the second rope for a two count. Show tags in and stomps at the knees of Taker, but Taker fires back with a back elbow, but runs into a chokeslam attempt. Taker reverses that into a Fujiwara armbar :mark: as Train tries to break it up, but Taker locks him in a cross armbreaker. Show breaks that up with a legdrop and now Train and Show begin to double team stomp Taker. Show delivers a series of headbutts, and locks in an abdominal stretch. Train comes in putting the boots to Taker, and then locks in an abdominal stretch of his own. Taker delivers a right hand, and then reverses the abdominal stretch. Taker delivers a back suplex. Train comes right back with a clothesline after Show delivers a cheap shot from the apron, that seemed to PISS! Taker off so he comes firing back with a punches, and delivers a DDT off the ropes. Show breaks up the count at two, and Taker delivers a series of strikes to him. He now goes for a chokeslam on Show but he delivers a big boot to Train, and follows up with flying clothesline to Show. Taker then turns around into a big boot from Train, and Show connects with a chokeslam. Nathan Jones runs out, and meets Show in the aisle with a spin kick. Train goes for the cover and gets two. Jones runs into the ring and delivers a big boot to and Taker finishes him off with the tombstone for the win. I seemed to enjoy this more than people would, the stretch was quite boring but everything else was just fun for me. But the only real thing that bothered me the most was Why Jones was allowed to run into the ring when the match has been changed into a 2-1 match. **1/2 - **3/4

*WWE Women's Championship: Trish Stratus vs. Jazz vs. Victoria (w/Stevie Richards)*
That was a really good divas match. They worked well together and added some fun nearfalls, Trish has clearly taken huge jumps in terms of her ring skill. Jazz was her normal “Mike Tyson” like self with aggression. As for Victoria she had her moments but on some stuff she seemed to be a little off in places. I must be nerves; anyway Trish hits the Chick Kick for the win. **1/4

*WWE Tag Team Championships: Team Angle vs. Los Guerrero’s vs. Chris Benoit & Rhyno*
All 6 guys brawl to start, that goes on for a brief time and Chavo and Haas start out. Chavo connects with a backdrop and then a back suplex. Haas counters a backdrop with a dropkick and tags in Benoit who gets met with an armdrag. Eddie tags in, and follows a back suplex with a springboard senton. Eddie and Benoit trade corner chops. Rhyno tags in and Eddie hammers him down with forearms before sends him into the turnbuckle. Rhyno delivers a powerslam, and Eddie tags in Shelton in. Shelton whips Rhyno and delivers a back elbow for a two count. Shelton then again whips Rhyno into the buckle and Haas tags in. Double dropkick gets a two count when Chavo breaks it. Benoit tags in and chops Haas in the corner, before delivering a snap suplex for two. Back suplex connects for another two count and Benoit tags in Rhyno. Charlie locks in a front face lock, and tags in Shelton who comes in with a knee lift. Rhyno whips Shelton into the corner, and hits a shoulderblock. Snap mare gets a one count for Rhyno, and Eddie tags Shelton. Eddie comes in with a dropkick and stomps away at Rhyno. Eddie gets thrown into the corner and Rhyno tags in Benoit. Eddie hits a back suplex, and heads to the top rope but Benoit comes up to meet him and delivers a superplex which gets two when Shelton makes the save. Eddie hits the ropes and Benoit flap jacks him into a Crossface but Haas makes the save, and Eddie comes back with a brainbuster getting a two count when Haas again makes the save. Chavo tags in and delivers a clothesline to Haas and a hurracanrana to Shelton. Chavo then turns around and Benoit goes for the Crossface. Chavo blocks that so Benoit delivers the triple Germans instead. Chavo makes the tag to Shelton during the Germans and Shelton delivers a superkick, but Eddie breaks up the count, and then he and Benoit collide head to head as Shelton comes back in as he is still legal and delivers a bodyslam to Benoit. Legdrop connects for Shelton but Eddie breaks up the pin with a frog splash. Chavo tags Benoit, but gets met with a belly-to-belly from Haas. Rhyno comes in and delivers a GORE! To Haas and another one to Shelton, Eddie pulls Rhyno to the floor and this allows Shelton to crawl on top of a fallen Chavo for the win. It was too short for my liking, it felt like a Smackdown top of the hour match. But with that being said a shot Smackdown match > Raw tag scene in every possible way. ***1/4

*Shawn Michaels vs. Chris Jericho*
During Shawn Michaels entrance he tries to fire the pyrotechnics/confetti guns but most of them don’t seem to be working :lmao headscissors then a armdrag by Jericho, Shawn gets out. And taunts him by posing on the top ropes, Jericho applies a wrist lock, but Shawn hip toss him to get free, takedown by Jericho, but Shawn pushes him off. Now a Side headlock is applied by Shawn, but Jericho rolls it into two. Jericho breaks out with elbows, criss-cross and delivers slaps across the face of Michaels. Shawn takes acceptation to that and punches him in the face then throws him out. Shawn goes for a plancha dive, but Jericho ducks so Shawn goes back in the ring and nails him with a baseball slide on the floor. Instead, Cross body by Shawn, but Jericho rolls through for two. Into the ropes, Jericho gets a spinning heel kick then follows up by punching and chopping away, hard whip into the turnbuckle sends Shawn to his knees and Jericho goes for a running bulldog, but Shawn reverses it so that Jericho goes groin first into the middle turnbuckle. Shawn applies the figure four but mid-way through Jericho reverses it. Kneebreaker, and the figure four is applied again, but Jericho sends him shoulder first into the ring post. Jericho tries to throw him out, but Shawn skins the cat and takes Jericho out with a headscissors. And this time Shawn manages to connect with the plancha. Outside the ring, Shawn goes for a dropkick that Jericho reverses into the Walls. He sits in it until the eight counts, and then breaks up the count. Michaels goes back first into the ring post. And Jericho begins to work on the back. Jericho hits the springboard dropkick from inside the ring onto Shawn on the apron and throws him back in the ring. He then connects with a back suplex, then the standing vertical suplex for two. Backbreaker by Jericho who does the DICK! pose pin for two. Jericho goes for a back body drop, which is reversed into a DDT for the double knockout spot. But they do manage to get to their feet before the count of 10 and Jericho gets a flying forearm and the nip up followed by an HBK flex pose :mark: OH SHIT! Michaels then nips up! And delivers a forearm, nip up, atomic drop, clothesline, and back body drop, AND JR IS ON COMMENTARY! For this part Jericho runs into a Michael’s boot and then the standing moonsault for two for Michaels. Both men do the reversal pinning spots before Jericho attempts the Walls which gets reversed by into the Northern Lights suplex by Shawn bridges up, and nails him with a clothesline. Facecrusher by Jericho then the Lionsault for two Shawn goes for a hurracanrana but instead Jericho counters into the Walls of Jericho as Shawn gets the ropes. Jericho goes for the Walls again, but Shawn reverses into an inside cradle for two! Double underhook into a backbreaker by Jericho who then hits a reverse elbow off the top rope and starts warming up the band OH SHIT! He hits SOME SWEET CHIN MUSIC OF HIS OWN :mark: for an epic near-fall. Shawn then fights him off to nail a crossbody and they trade punches. Shawn going for the Walls, but changes his mind into a slingshot on the turnbuckle for two. Jericho sets him up on the top rope, he goes for the backsuplex, but Shawn counters it into a crossbody! For a two count, Shawn goes up top, but Jericho kicks the ref into the ropes as Shawn gets crotched. Superplex reversed, Jericho lands face first. Top rope elbow drop by Shawn and he now begins to set up for the superkick. Jericho ducks and puts him in the Walls of Jericho, but Shawn gets to the bottom rope. Jericho shows signs of anger and begins to yell at the ref, Jericho the turns right around and runs back into SWEET CHIN MUSIC! Shawn is slow to cover though and only gets a two count. Shawn gets whipped into the corner, and Jericho delivers a shot to the lower back. Jericho goes for a back suplex, but Shawn counters into a reverse victory roll for the win. Post-Match: Shawn sticks out his hand for Jericho to shake it. Jericho hugs him but then kicks him in the balls! Then he shoves him down. FUCK YEAH!








*WWE World Heavyweight Championship: Booker T vs. Triple H (w/Ric Flair)*
Triple H is debuting the purple trunks tonight, what a guy! Booker blocks a right hand and delivers a chop. They trade chops and HHH gets whipped into the buckle. Booker hits a backdrop, but a second charge hits a reverse elbow. HHH goes to the top rope, but gets slammed off by Booker going to the floor and Booker goes out after him throwing Hunter into the ringpos. Back inside the ring, Hunter catches Booker with a boot on the way in, and delivers a shoulder block. Booker blocks an armdrag, and connects with a clothesline for two. Booker delivers a pair of kicks, but Hunter ducks a spin kick and backdrops him to the apron. He now begins to ram Booker into the ringpost, which sends him to the floor. Hunter follows to the outside and this time he gets some revenge by throwing Booker head first into the ringsteps. Booker rolls inside and gets met with a series of stomps. Hunter again slides to the floor and delivers an elbow to the throat with Booker on the apron. Neckbreaker connects in the ring for a two count. Booker comes back firing backing Hunter into the buckle, but runs into a spinebuster for two. Booker gets whipped to the corner, and Hunter follows him in with a clothesline for two. Triple H begins to choke Booker on the ropes but as Hunter lets him go. Booker comes firing back with a series of chops, but Hunter comes right back with a knee to the gut, but Booker counters that with a suplex into a DDT. They trade exchanges with Booker getting the better of it. Booker delivers a sidewalk slam, and follows up with a forearm off the ropes for two. Booker delivers a knee to the gut, and goes for scissor kick. But Hunter counters into a sleeper, but Booker quickly counters sending him into the buckle. Booker hits the ropes but runs into the high knee, which gets two. Hunter hits the ropes and connects with a facebuster, and a spinebuster from Booker for two. Booker charges into the corner, but Triple H gets the boots up. Triple H comes charging out but runs into a superkick, which picks up a two count. Kick to the gut sets up a scissor kick from Booker. Hunter ducks that again, and pulls the ropes down on a heel kick attempt sending Booker to the floor. Hunter distracts the ref allowing Flair to drop the knee of Booker on the ringsteps. Booker rolls back inside and Triple H locks in an Indian Deathlock. Fuck yeah! Booker is able to pull himself to the ropes; Hunter drops his knee down onto the already weak knee. Hunter tries to whip Booker to the corner, but Booker can’t even put weight on his knee and collapses in the middle. Booker counters a kneebreaker into a sunset flip to get two. And Hunter goes right to the pedigree, but Booker counters and gets shoved into the ref. The ref doesn’t get knocked out but stops short of delivering a clothesline to the official allowing Booker to roll him up for two. Hunter comes off the ropes and runs into a back elbow from Booker and NOW he hits the scissor kick, but still can’t put weight on the leg and is slow to cover and Hunter kicks out at two. Booker heads to the top rope, and Flair provides a quick distraction, which allows Hunter cut him off. He goes for the superplex, but Booker fights him off. Flair tries to stop Booker, but gets shoved off, Booker then hits the FUCKIN’ Harlem Hangover, but again Booker is slow to cover and Flair puts Hunter’s foot on the rope to break the count. Booker tries to hit the ropes for the scissor kick, but he can’t put weight on the leg and collapses. This allows Triple H to hit the pedigree, and both men are down. Hunter lays there for at least 12 seconds before he finally crawls over and pins Booker for the win. I love the psychology of the match especially during the beginning part with Triple H being conservative on offense because just over a week ago Booker beat him clean. Oh and the story-telling with the knee is top notch, seriously Booker’s selling is some of his best work ever. ***1/2

*Street Fight: Hulk Hogan vs. Vince McMahon*
f Hogan loses the match he “MUST” retire, They stare down and Vince slaps Hogan; so Hulk takes him down. Big clothesline and Hogan punches away on the mat then stomps in the corner. Vince hits a clothesline out of the corner and shoulder blocks Hogan in the corner over and over. Vince applies a hammerlock, he wraps it around the ringpost back in the ring this goes on for a while with Vince in control. What is it with Vince in control during his matches, JESUS! Hogan fights to his feet, but Vince fires away with a kick to regain the control. Vince finally fires Hogan to the floor, and follows him outside. Vince rams Hogan into the barricade, and then fires him shoulder first into the ringpost. Vince grabs a steel chair from ringside, and takes a swing at Hogan but misses. Hogan fires back sending Vince into the ringpost, then destroying Vince with a chair shot. Vince is bleeding as Hogan works the cut. Hogan grabs another chair and hits Vince in the back and shoulders with it. Hogan goes for his head but Vince ducks and Spanish announcer take the chairshot :mark: Vince fires back with a blow, and then slams Hogan in the face with the chair. Vince grabs a ladder from underneath the ring and sets it up at ringside. Vince slams Hogan into the Smackdown announce table, and then into the barricade. OH! THE SPANISH ANNONCER IS NOW BUSTED OPEN :lmao Hogan is also bleeding as Vince hits him with a monitor laying him out on the table. Vince comes off the ladder legdropping Hogan through the table. Vince throws Hogan inside the ring, and covers for a two count. Vince goes outside, and finds a lead pipe under the ring. DAT VINCE FACE! Vince goes for a shot with the pipe, but Hogan fires back with a low blow. Suddenly Roddy Piper appears out of nowhere, and spits on both guys while they are down. Piper grabs the pipe and nails Hogan with it and leaves. Vince crawls to Hogan, and covers for a two count. Vince goes for the pipe, but referee Brian Hebner tries to stop him so Vince tosses him to the floor and grabs the pipe, and motions for Sylvain Grenier to come down. Referee Mike Sparks tries to come down as well, but gets blasted by Grenier on the floor. Vince blasts Hogan with the pipe, and drops a leg on him but only gets a two count as Hogan kicks out and hulks up! Hogan beats up Granier and tosses him over the top. Vince tries to attack with a double axe handle, but Hogan no-sells it. Three punches, big boot, and three legdrops is enough for the win. They worked hard for two old guys so I give them credit for that. **1/2








*The Rock vs. Stone Cold Steve Austin*
The story here is “HOLLYWOOD” Rock has accomplished everything in wrestling except beat Stone Cold Steve Austin @ WrestlerMania he’s currently 0-2 in mania matches against him and is currently 0-6 all-time against Austin in one-on-one matches :lmao But it that build wasn’t good enough for you Rock had the Rock in concert on the go-home edition of Raw :mark: But not everything was good news here as Austin suffered a panic attack the night before and spent the previous night in the hospital, but knowing this was his final match was able to gut this one out  Austin’s entrance still gives me Goosebumps, it’s just the visual of the camera behind Austin and you see him taking that final walk down that aisle. Rock’s Hollywood theme is pretty great two, no brawl to start was mad weird but I liked it as Rocky knew every time he played into Austin’s game of brawling he lost so as soon as he felt Austin starting to control the match he would bail to the outside and Austin goes out after him meeting him in the aisle with a clothesline. Austin fires Rock into the guardrail, and then to the ringsteps, and Austin follows up dropping Rock on the security wall. A clothesline from Austin sends Rock into the Smackdown table, and Austin again drops Rock on the security wall. Austin then whips Rock into the ringsteps, and then fires him back into the ring. Austin continues to assault him until Earl Hebner gets in his face allowing Rock to clip the knee. Austin bails to the floor, and Rock sneaks out with another chop block. Rock slams the front of the left knee on the Smackdown announce table. Back in the ring, Rock stomps on the left knee. He drags him around the post where he wraps it around. In the middle of the ring, Austin comes back with a flurry of punches, but Rock gets control again thanks to a hard kick to the left knee again. Sharpshooter by The Rock near the ropes. Austin gets to the ropes after about a minute. Rock wraps Austin's leg around the ring post again. He puts on Austin's vest, grabs a bottle of water and takes a drink and Lawler calls it “Hollywood water” Anyway the cockiness of the Rock allows Austin to begin his comeback and totally ignores or forgets the knees, I know he was nervous but C’MON! Austin that’s wrestling 101. Rock ducks a clothesline, and hits a leaping clothesline of his own. When he gets up, Rock nips up and taunts the crowd by clapping and pointing at his head, I remember you could do that in “Here Comes The Pain” :mark: Anyway once Rock is done taunting the crowd, turns around and walks into a Rock Bottom from Austin for two. Rock still has the vest on. Austin goes for a Stunner; Rock blocks the kick and hits his own Stunner for a two. Rock hits three punches in a row and on the fourth Austin ducks and scores with the stunner but Rock kicks out at two. Austin throws the referee out of the way, and Rock delivers a low blow to regain control. Rock goes for the peoples elbow, but that misses. Austin goes for the stunner, but Rock blocks it and delivers a spinebuster. Rock finally takes off Austin’s vest, and delivers the peoples elbow, which gets a two count. Rock delivers a Rock Bottom, but Austin again kicks out at two. Rock gets in position, but Austin spins out. And Rock regains control and hits another Rock Bottom for a two count. HOLY SHIT! Austin finally gets to his feet again and turns into a third Rock Bottom and that finally gets the win for the Rock. Post-match: Rock right next to or is it over top of Austin and they exchanged some words. It was a mutual respect. Rock then goes out of the ring into the crowd and greets his mother and then wife before leaving Austin to have his moment in the ring. Really AMAZING! Way to finish this rivalry, both men just went out and did something that they didn’t do in their previous match and spent the majority of the match without resorting to a lot of brawling. Most of it was done in the ring. I think they proved once again why they can always have good matches together. ****1/4

*WWE Championship: Kurt Angle vs. Brock Lesnar*
I always forget Angle found out he needed neck fusion with about 3 weeks to go until Wrestlemania, I always think it’s during the match he fucks up his neck. So yeah Angle wrestles 20 minutes with a BEAST! With a broken freakin’ neck, so much respect for him. Angle grabs a hammerlock, but switches to a frontface lock. Lesnar firemans carries out, and grabs an armbar. Angle reverses with a firemans carry into an armbar of his own, Lesnar applies a headlock takeover, but Angle counters with a headscissor. Angle grabs a headlock takeover and hits the ropes and but runs into a shoulderblock. Angle takes him down with a single leg, and Lesnar hits a quick reversal but Angle elbows out, Angle hits the ropes, and runs into a back elbow. Lesnar follows up with a series of shoulderblocks in the corner and powerslams Kurt down for a two count. Angle ducks a clothesline and delivers a German suplex. Lesnar pops right up and delivers a clothesline. And bails to the floor, Lesnar chase Angle back into the ring but gets met with a boot as he tries to get back in. Lesnar stops an Irish whip attempt and delivers a press slam to Angle. Lesnar now Irish whip Angle to the corner, and goes charging in but Kurt gets the boot up. Angle delivers a German suplex into the top turnbuckle, and Lesnar rolls to the floor. Angle goes outside after him and drives Lesnar into the barricade before rolling him back in. Angle connects with a back suplex for a two count and grabs a bow and arrow submission, but Lesnar stands up with it driving Angle back first into the turnbuckle. Brock stomps Angle down in the corner, but Angle reverses an Irish whip sending him into the corner before connecting with a belly-to-belly suplex, and delivers a pair of knees to the ribs sending Lesnar to the floor. Back in, Kurt runs into a spinebuster as both men struggle to their feet, and Lesnar delivers a clothesline, and then several shoulder blocks in the corner. Lesnar is now in full comeback mode with a pair of belly-to-belly suplexes for two counts. But Angle reverses a go behind from Brock and delivers four rolling Germans. Angle goes for the Angle slam, but Brock counters into an F-5 attempt, Angle then counters to an inside trip and locks in the ankle lock. Lesnar rolls through so Angle switches to a half crab. Lesnar reaches the ropes to break the hold, and Angle delivers another running knee to the ribs. That isn’t enough so Kurt charges again, but Lesnar delivers a backdrop sending Angle over the top to the floor. Angle comes back with a phenomenal release German suplex that picks up a two count. Kurt connects with the Angle slam but that only gets a two count. Kurt sets up for another Angle slam, but Lesnar counters and connects with the F-5, but is slow to cover and Angle kicks out at two. Lesnar picks up Angle, but Angle grabs the leg and locks in the ankle lock. Kurt grapevines the legs, but Lesnar is still able to drag him to the ropes. Angle tries to go back to the ankle lock, but gets kicked off. Lesnar goes for another F-5, but Kurt counters into a small package for two. He now goes for the Angle slam, but Brock counters into the F5, but decides not to pin him instead he decides to go to the top rope. And goes for the FUCKIN’ SHOOTING STAR PRESS! But lands on his FUCKIN’ head damn near breaking his neck. Kurt covers, but Lesnar gets out at two. Lesnar is able to deliver the third F-5 for the win. Post-match: Kurt shakes Brock’s hand and shares a hug. Lesnar is clearly concussed and I give credit to Kurt for getting him through the final F-5. ****


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

****3/4 for Eddie/Ray HH 97. One of my favorite WCW matches ever. 

Watching a 2002 PPV now, gonna do Armageddon, uh oh, HBK/HHH 3SOH


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Everyone drop what you're doing and watch the AAA lucha showcase from Rumble '97. It's the worst steaming pile of garbage ever and it's funnier than most comedies put in theaters today b/c of it. How could you go wrong? Perro Aguayo walk to the outside in lazy retirement home fashion dives ftw!


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Everyone drop what you're doing and watch the AAA lucha showcase from Rumble '97. It's the worst steaming pile of garbage ever and it's funnier than most comedies put in theaters today b/c of it. How could you go wrong? Perro Aguayo walk to the outside in lazy retirement home fashion dives ftw!


:lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Hate to single him out b/c he wasn't too bad compared to his crummy partners, but that moment was the cream of the crop within the match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

From my RR 97 Ramble:

Héctor Garza, Perro Aguayo & El Canek Vs Jerry Estrada, Heavy Metal & Fuerza Guerrera - They're in Texas, so they decide to throw in a random Mexican 6 man match. Wow this fucking SUCKED. I actually used to think very highly of this match. I must have been high. Except I don't get high. So I was drunk. That's it. 2 guys flip about. Slowly and with little shit given. They each tag out. Repeat the flipping about slowly while not giving a shit. Tag out. They do that a few times, then someone randomly gets a win. The fans are silent until the match ends. They cheer because they are glad it's over. DUD.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Brilliant review. Spot on.

Hector Garza was so much shit in his career.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Garza had a good showing here and there. I'd say he was closer to good than bad, but I'm not really a fan regardless. Maybe I should watch his stuff more/again/nipples.

I remember loving that Rumble 97 tag. Doubt I've watched it since 2008.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

YOU GUYS JUST DON'T GET LUCHA


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

@Jheri - idc if you're a lucha aficionado, there's almost no way you could like it. Is there? Pacing is atrocious. Even compared to some often times sloppily paced lucha out there.

I swear I've never seen a good performance from Garza so he can suck a dick. It sounds bad b/c he just died, but I'm not gonna soften my opinion due to that. All he had was the Torneo. Everything else in the match was fluff & lacked any sign of actual offense unless it was an arm drag.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Thought he was really, really good in a tag in 2004 (which itself is an excellent match). There has to be more of him I actually like somewhere (I suspect on WCW syndicate shows), but, yeah, I've never really been a fan. I don't dislike him, but I've never cared for his stuff either. He's just there.


EDIT- WAIT A MINUTE. He was in the incredible 96 Santo v. Casas tags and did some cool stuff there. I knew there was a reason I felt I had to bring him up in a moderately positive way.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Can't let Cleavage's WM review go unnoticed. Great write up, and I pretty much agree with the ratings. I think you left off the Jericho/Michaels ratings, though. Trips/Booker is pretty nice until the finish. Last two matches are great also.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> Thought he was really, really good in a tag in 2004 (which itself is an excellent match). There has to be more of him I actually like somewhere (I suspect on WCW syndicate shows), but, yeah, I've never really been a fan. I don't dislike him, but I've never cared for his stuff either. He's just there.
> 
> 
> EDIT- WAIT A MINUTE. He was in the incredible 96 Santo v. Casas tags and did some cool stuff there. I knew there was a reason I felt I had to bring him up in a moderately positive way.


Let me see it. b/c out of everything from the US, Mexico, & Japan seen, he's a laughable fiend. Feels like I'm stuck hating a lot of successful folk from Mexico b/c they're outright hacks. Konnan & Mil Mascaras being two others. Shocker is tripe too. Then there is the positives with Parka, Psicosis, ***** Casas, and basically everyone else who was shown to me via American wrestling TV. Do like a good portion of modern day characters too - such as Mascara Dorada. ALSO MINIS.

I went from negative to positive pretty quickly here.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I love WM 19 Long Time. Except Hogan/Vince. That match can go to hell. HHH/Booker is Booker's GOAT singles match. Finish makes me lol.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Replace Hogan vs Vince with Angle vs Brock* and that's my Cal-esque review on WM 19.

*except I don't hate it. It's only ok, but grossly overrated. That match had a shit finish too, btw.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I forget if he was already there or not (with the company) but LOL at Piper showing up in that match. I guess his feud with Hogan all those years ago made it work.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I was going nuts during that moment. FRATS.

_"GET UP, JUNIOR"_


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

The Primer said:


> Let me see it. b/c out of everything from the US, Mexico, & Japan seen, he's a laughable fiend. Feels like I'm stuck hating a lot of successful folk from Mexico b/c they're outright hacks. Konnan & Mil Mascaras being two others. Shocker is tripe too. Then there is the positives with Parka, Psicosis, ***** Casas, and basically everyone else who was shown to me via American wrestling TV. Do like a good portion of modern day characters too - such as Mascara Dorada. ALSO MINIS.
> 
> I went from negative to positive pretty quickly here.


I can't find it online, the match is "El Hijo Del Santo y ***** Casas vs. Hijo Del Perro Aguayo y Hector Garza (LLA 8/29/04)"

Have you seen the Mil Mascaras v. the Destroyer matches? Classics. I hate Konnan and Vampiro. Completely worthless wrestlers, no idea how they got famous.


Two matches left for ExRules 2010.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Had to get rid of a virus on my laptop, so just starting Armageddon 2002 now, really not looking forward to this. 

I've never seen 3SOH, but I can only imagine how terrible it is


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I'm in the minority, I think Austin/Rock and Jericho/Michaels both get ****1/2, but that Jericho/Michaels was SLIGHTY better and my personal MotN. Just an epic epic event all around, every match delivered about as well as can be expected. I hated the finish to Booker/Trips as much as anyone, and think it will go down as one of the worst finish tragedies in WWE history. It was just so damn unnecessary, anyone that claims Haitch is a benevolent deity can look to that match as damning evidence to the contrary. I like Angle/Brock, but their Summerslam match absolutely blows their Mania match out of the water, botched finish or not. The IronMan was better by a country mile as well.

Cal- Booker had a better singles match with Benoit in WCW, the final match in their best of 7 series for the #1 contendership to the TV title at GAB. At least that's my opinion on the subject . I think they had another excellent match on Nitro from that same series, it's on this random Monday Night Wars documentary I have.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The final match in the best of 7 series with Benoit is imo the only good match they had together. And still not better than the HHH match .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> I can't find it online, the match is "El Hijo Del Santo y ***** Casas vs. Hijo Del Perro Aguayo y Hector Garza (LLA 8/29/04)"
> 
> Have you seen the Mil Mascaras v. the Destroyer matches? Classics. I hate Konnan and Vampiro. Completely worthless wrestlers, no idea how they got famous.
> 
> ...


Noted.

Nah. But if Mascaras actually sells in it I'll eat a scoop of peanut butter. And I'm allergic to peanut butter.

Hey one of those is the LMS. I can't wait to see how you'll feel about another Jericho vs Edge match.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I'm reading Foley's book right now and their is like two whole pages on why he hates Mil Mascaras :lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Mick > life.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> Had to get rid of a virus on my laptop, so just starting Armageddon 2002 now, really not looking forward to this.
> 
> I've never seen 3SOH, but I can only imagine how terrible it is


Look on the bright side, Benoit vs Eddie is ruling.



Callamus said:


> The final match in the best of 7 series with Benoit is imo the only good match they had together. And still not better than the HHH match .


vs Benoit from 21 Oct 2005 is great too. The one with this legendary botch:


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

When JBL returned late last year, he buried Mil Mascaras every week for like the first month. :lol


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Look on the bright side, Benoit vs Eddie is ruling.


That and this fun opening tag are legit the only matches I'm looking forward to TBH, though Show/Angle might not be that bad.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I liked Show/Angle. Show throwing Angle around is :lol


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

+1 on Show vs Angle. Really good match. So, there's three matches to be glad you saw.

Rest - skip. Skip again, and skip some more. Edge vs A-Train would have been fine if they didn't try and make it feel as if they crammed everything into a short span. But they did; so it's no good.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Jericho has a solid 2 plus pages in his book on why he hates mil mascaras too, and a solid 3-4 pages on why he hates Vampiro :lmao


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

HHH/Booker is OK. Booker carried the match but it wasn't enough. He's had plenty of better singles, imhodxftwwtfbbqeesdesesesrdt.

Mascaras sells in those matches. Pretty sure, anyway. Well...they work the mat mostly, so it's not like he can shrug off strikes and such. Can't say I remember THAT well.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Only match I'm gonna skip is the divas shit, for the sake of the project and my feeling I need to experience 3SOH so I can chime in on it when you guys shit on it :lol.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

You're not enticing me much to check it out. :hmm:


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I'm generous. Gave 3 Stages of Hell **. It's one of Hunter's favorite matches, so why shouldn't it be good? :HHH2


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> I'm generous. Gave 3 Stages of Hell **. It's one of Hunter's favorite matches, so why shouldn't it be good? :HHH2


Hunter also thinks his HBK series are classics among his best matches. :hhh2

With that said, the 3SOH is at least kinda fun to watch because it's so all over the place.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Best fall was exactly how it specifies - when Shawn fell off the ladder to end the match. 8*D


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Not classics, but not the worst matches ever. Jim Ross does a lot to mask some of the shittiness of those matches. Trips + Shawn + JR = :mark: :mark: :mark


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I'm guessing Tista vs Kane sucks too right


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I choose to never watch them again except for the 2003 RAW match & Taboo Tuesday bout. Rest aren't worth talking about unless fun jabs are made while crapping on as seen on this page.

smitty, that match is a train-wreck. Batista botches an uncanny amount of times.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

SUBJECT CHANGE

Watched two of the three main event matches from Backlash 2003 in Lesnar/Cena and the six man tag. Face Lesnar and Heel Cena create an interesting dynamic, in a good way, I think. Pretty good match on the whole. Brock just firing up and hitting the F-5 was cool. Cena was still a bit green, but did well, I though.

Six man tag is meh. Shawn and Jericho do well, and Naitch gonna Naitch. Nash in 2003 is mostly :lol


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Debating on whether I should do 2003 after 2002 because their is just so much SHIT in 2003, from the HHH/Steiner matches in the beginning of the year to the Nash shit in the middle of the year. 2003 was a really bipolar year.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Six man tag was sloppy at points. Ends in chaos, which I have fun with. Nothing special; although I don't mind it. Brock vs Cena is fairly mediocre. Has a good start, then the middle/end goes to hell once Cena randomly locks in his body vice. It's Brock's head that's taken the licking. You could tell it was Cena's first main event.

That show is all about both tag team championships & Show vs Mysterio. :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I HOPE HBK SCREWS ORTON AND HELPS BRYAN WIN THE TITLE AT HIAC SO HE CAN COME OUT OF RETIREMENT TO FACE HHH AT WM AND MAKE THE BIG HHH AUTHORITY FIGURE ANGLE ABOUT THEM INSTEAD OF DANIEL BRYAN.

UK peeps... did the clocks go back tonight? Normally like, someone informs me of these things. Parents and shit. But they haven't said anything and one second it was 01:59 and then it went back to 01:00 and I like, got scared.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

US clocks change next weekend. UK isn't the same?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

WrestleMania 30 - THE CLIQUE CRUMBLES

if only it was in Atlantic City.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

UK is different to the US. In many wonderful ways.

WM XXX - HHH VS HBK - UNDERTAKER SPECIAL GUEST REFEREE.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Callamus said:


> UK peeps... did the clocks go back tonight? Normally like, someone informs me of these things. Parents and shit. But they haven't said anything and one second it was 01:59 and then it went back to 01:00 and I like, got scared.


Don't know about UK, but over here east of UK, clock just changed a few minutes ago.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

WHO DOES UNDERTAKER THINK CAN END THE STR...WIN THE LAST MATCH?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The fuck isn't youtube working? its not loading the video!! 

this makes me mad. because all the other videos fukinng work


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

The Primer said:


> WrestleMania 30 - THE CLIQUE CRUMBLES
> 
> if only it was in Atlantic City.


It almost makes HIAC a lose-lose situation. If Bryan wins he's the fucking champion but him being involved in a Triple H match seems really unlikely. But I don't want him to lose because he's the man but him losing and getting screwed over almost gives him a shoe in for a Triple H. I don't want to say it opens the possibility of Shawn coming out of retirement but if he screws over Bryan I have a hard time seeing how that doesn't happen.

Despite the fact that I know a loss might be better in the long run for Bryan there is no way that I'm going to be able to root for him. 

I really do hope that they step things up. Their previous PPV matches have been good but not great. And I really don't understand why they haven't been able to click. I still think Orton is very good in the ring and Bryan is amazing. On paper they should be having amazing matches on PPV and at this point they've literally been working with each other every night for months now (when you look at all the dark matches and house shows) and it just hasn't been clicking. I don't know if Shawn being the ref and a big cage will really do anything to change that. I still have some hope for the match as Bryan is amazing and I've seen him have great matches with everyone. Also it's the ending that I'm looking forward to a ton and not knowing what's going to happen can really make a good match seem great on a first viewing.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Just finished Smackdown. lol @ CM Skunk.

The main event was fun to say the least. Orton should definitely win with him eating the pin here.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Eddie vs Benoit= :mark: 

cant believe a boring chant broke out...


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

WTF WE FUCKING LOST TO OUR IN-STATE RIVAL FOR THE FIRST TIME IN 8 YEARS FUCK LAS VEGAS. 

Okay, now time to watch wrestling after I eat. Or while I eat. I'm pissed. :side:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Just finished Smackdown. lol @ CM Skunk.
> 
> The main event was fun to say the least. Orton should definitely win with him eating the pin here.



I had the exact same thought but forgot to bring it up today, with Bryan winning the tag match pinning Orton, does that mean he is definitely losing tomorrow? I like Bryan and want him to be as big of a star as he can possibly be, it will only help the WWE having more full time main eventers. I think at this point the ideal scenario for Bryan is for him to get screwed tomorrow and for Orton to win. I'm not sure if HBK screws him or if it's someone else, but I just don't see the big payoff for this feud being at Hell in a Cell. It doesn't feel right. One of those reasons is that they didn't build Orton up enough. Bryan essentially won at NoC and won at BG before Big Show showed up, those two finishes did fuck all for Orton, as well as fuck all for Bryan. Essentially the last 2 months have been Shitty Booking: 101. Orton should have been built up way more so when Bryan finally beats him clean it means something. Whooping Miz's ass on a few Raw matches doesn't count as building Orton, because Miz is essentially the most well known jobber in WWE these days. They might as well of had Orton whooping on the Brooklyn Brawler or George South for all it did.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

So I told my brother to pick out a DVD for me to watch and he grabbed my bootlegged version of WCW Road Wild that I bought from the sketchy guy at an indy show for $5. It was no surprise that the disc won't play past the 22 minute mark. Which means that 4 years ago I spent $5 and all I got was this match in rather poor quality. 

*Vampiro and The Insane Clown Posse w/Raven vs. Rey Mysterio, Eddie Guerrero, and Billy Kidman *

This really could have benefited from having Raven wrestle instead of one of the ICP members. I'll give the ICP some credit as they were better than I thought they would be (I mean one of them took a superplex) but the fact remains that Vampiro was the only guy that could really take offense from Eddie, Kidman, and Rey. Due this unforunate fact this was so slow. They worked a control segment on Eddie and than worked another one on Rey right away. You had 2 all time greats and one solid worker on one team and this ended up being boring. How does that happen? 
**1/2*


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Cactus Jack said:


> I had the exact same thought but forgot to bring it up today, with Bryan winning the tag match pinning Orton, does that mean he is definitely losing tomorrow? I like Bryan and want him to be as big of a star as he can possibly be, it will only help the WWE having more full time main eventers. I think at this point the ideal scenario for Bryan is for him to get screwed tomorrow and for Orton to win. I'm not sure if HBK screws him or if it's someone else, but I just don't see the big payoff for this feud being at Hell in a Cell. It doesn't feel right. One of those reasons is that they didn't build Orton up enough. Bryan essentially won at NoC and won at BG before Big Show showed up, those two finishes did fuck all for Orton, as well as fuck all for Bryan. Essentially the last 2 months have been Shitty Booking: 101. Orton should have been built up way more so when Bryan finally beats him clean it means something. Whooping Miz's ass on a few Raw matches doesn't count as building Orton, because Miz is essentially the most well known jobber in WWE these days. They might as well of had Orton whooping on the Brooklyn Brawler or George South for all it did.


I *want* Orton to win tomorrow. Having Bryan's pay-off happen in October on a B-PPV (and the third one in like six or seven weeks at that) would destroy my soul. With the way things have been booked, the title will still be held in ABEYANCE~! come Monday. :cole3


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> I had the exact same thought but forgot to bring it up today, with Bryan winning the tag match pinning Orton, does that mean he is definitely losing tomorrow? I like Bryan and want him to be as big of a star as he can possibly be, it will only help the WWE having more full time main eventers. I think at this point the ideal scenario for Bryan is for him to get screwed tomorrow and for Orton to win. I'm not sure if HBK screws him or if it's someone else, but I just don't see the big payoff for this feud being at Hell in a Cell. It doesn't feel right. One of those reasons is that they didn't build Orton up enough. Bryan essentially won at NoC and won at BG before Big Show showed up, those two finishes did fuck all for Orton, as well as fuck all for Bryan. Essentially the last 2 months have been Shitty Booking: 101. Orton should have been built up way more so when Bryan finally beats him clean it means something. Whooping Miz's ass on a few Raw matches doesn't count as building Orton, because Miz is essentially the most well known jobber in WWE these days. They might as well of had Orton whooping on the Brooklyn Brawler or George South for all it did.


Well said, their abysmal booking since Night of Champions has been inexcusable. Almost killed my interest in the angle. With Orton winning tomorrow, they'll redeem themselves imo. Bryan should win the Royal Rumble and then the title finally at WM. Or alternatively, feud with HHH after HIAC all the way into a singles match at WM where he wins.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Wrestlemania 19 rules. I'm glad Brock is still alive. 

I want the Taker's streak to end just to see the epic meltdown the IWC will have haha. 




The Primer said:


> Undertaker vs Yokozuna is fun in the biggest sense of old school WWF. Action is solid and the numerous amount of run-ins to destroy Taker is worth a chuckle, but not in the most negative of fashions. It's just like "woah, they really put Undertaker over big time here needing over ten dudes to knock him down." Of course I'm pro the shenanigans. Even if he didn't get the Championship.


Fantastic promo and underrated rivalry. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHkCiLbiQPQ




redskins25 said:


> I think these Bret/Nash matches are underrated as fuck tbhayley


Agreed.....Their Survivor Series match was great


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

So I did a tally to see how many Trips matches I currently have at *** or higher and I'm at 79, though I admit I need to go back and rewatch some things, because in the 4-5 months I've been doing this, I've altered my thoughts on some of his work. 

LOTS of TV matches to watch now, with most of his PPV stuff knocked out.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Well said, their abysmal booking since Night of Champions has been inexcusable. Almost killed my interest in the angle. With Orton winning tomorrow, they'll redeem themselves imo. Bryan should win the Royal Rumble and then the title finally at WM. Or alternatively, feud with HHH after HIAC all the way into a singles match at WM where he wins.




I think the best thing that could possibly happen tomorrow that can save all the screw ups they have had, is if Orton comes out like a world beater, just straight trashing and beating on Bryan and using "his experience in previous cell matches" to constantly gain the advantage. Bryan can have small hope spots throughout but the first 20 minutes or so need to be split 75-25 in favor of Orton, really establish him as a legit ass kicker again and not just some Triple H lackey. He just needs to bring the HATE. Then after 15-20 minutes Bryan can start his come back, make it as epic as possible without killing Ortons credibility, then have him slip on the proverbial banana peel/get screwed in the end. Orton wins the title and that's that.

Trips can come out on Raw and run Bryan down some more and everyone can talk about how he blew it and he's just a B+ and blah blah blah. This forces Bryan to revert back to his "weakest link" complex and he just starts tearing through people in matches on Raw week after week. He enters the Rumble as one of the first 3 entrants and ends up lasting the entire time whooping a serious amount of ass while he's at it.

After that, where they go, it's up to them. But that's the way I'd book things.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The Primer said:


> I was told recently how Bret vs Diesel is kind of shitty thanks to the run-ins. Got it on a DVD here so I can watch it for myself one of these days to see my opinion on it, but the way it sounds is kind of dreadful. Like the work put in for the majority of the match was for nothing with the non-finish.
> 
> Survivor Series 1995 match on the other hand...:lenny


I'll vouch for their Royal Rumble match, one of my favorites. I recall Bret heeling it up in that one by attacking the leg without any remorse or obeyance for the rules. The run ins only helped things imo. Probably at the **** 1/4 mark for me. 



funnyfaces1 said:


> Is Undertaker/Yokozuna RR 94 any good? I remember laughing at it the last time I watched it. However, the last time I watched it, I hated Mark Henry and thought Kurt Angle was the GOAT. Royal Rumble 94 in general looks like a good PPV.


That match is FUCKING AWESOME. It's not something that's gonna get high ratings from anyone but it's so much fun. Two big heavyweights sluggin it out, then the locker room empties out, shit gets crazy, urns are involved, Taker's on the big screen. OMG I love it. :mark:



Cactus Jack said:


> That seems to be Ortons problem lately, he's in matches with guys like Bryan who are all energy and get the fans pumped up, and he can't adapt and keep the energy level sustained.
> 
> I think the biggest issue is we aren't really seeing true heel Orton. We are seeing an amalgam of his heel Legacy character mixed with the face Viper character, and it's just leaving fans a bit confused. The slithering Viper bit is a pure face action ment to connect with the crowd, so why is he doing it as a heel? He needs to drop all of the Viper character work in his matches and get back to that vicious, ruthless, self entitled prick Orton character from 2009.
> 
> The other issue is that this feud is mainly Trips vs Bryan, Orton is just being presented as the goon. As a result, we aren't seeing the HATE in these matches you'd expect from a top rivalry that has been going on for near 3 months now, where one guy cost the other guy his chance at glory. I just want to see an Orton control segment where he just loses it and starts beating the holy hell out of Bryan. Enough of the robotic clothes lines and stupid grins, just be a vicious arrogant cunt already and go full blown heel. Working the way he has been is not only hurting himself, it's hurting Bryan. We need to believe that there is no chance for Bryan to beat Orton straight up, so when he does make that comeback in the match it's all the more inspiring and meaningful.


Quoted this for the absolute truth. This is what I've been saying for a while now. Orton needs to drop all this stupid shit and get mean in a hurry. Preferably tomorrow night.



The Primer said:


> Everyone drop what you're doing and watch the AAA lucha showcase from Rumble '97. It's the worst steaming pile of garbage ever and it's funnier than most comedies put in theaters today b/c of it. How could you go wrong? Perro Aguayo walk to the outside in lazy retirement home fashion dives ftw!


OH MY GOD YES. Someone else finally watched that pile of shit. It's a total dud and a shame to lucha wrestling.



TaylorFitz said:


> YOU GUYS JUST DON'T GET LUCHA


That's exactly what Austin101 tried to tell me when I reviewed the show. :lol He loved it for some strange reason...


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> I'll vouch for their Royal Rumble match, one of my favorites. I recall Bret heeling it up in that one by attacking the leg without any remorse or obeyance for the rules. The run ins only helped things imo. Probably at the **** 1/4 mark for me.
> 
> 
> OH MY GOD YES. Someone else finally watched that pile of shit. It's a total dud and a shame to lucha wrestling.


Watched Bret vs Diesel before the DUD. Think it's quite fabulous. All the run ins worked for the story they wanted to set up. It was build for their eventual No DQ match come Survivor Series. Watching those incorporate the callbacks and hints from before & after is radical. Makes both end up looking like a million bucks. Run-ins in this are very hectic, but sometimes a match causes for a little bit of chaos, you know?

the six man tag is just...:lmao all day.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm BACK !, halloween bash was a success, tried as shit

Whats have all you gents been watching ?


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

That wasn't a serious post at all. I don't think you really need to have special knowledge to "get" any type of wrestling. I've seen a lot of stuff from all over the world and aside from some confusing rules in other promotions wrestling is really not complicated. A good match should be able to overcome a cultural difference. I don't think the "You don't get lucha" is actually a valid argument. Or at least one that can't just apply to lucha. There are certainly matches out there you appreciate more with some back story (like a Kenta Kobashi match that ends in a Burning Hammer) I think you could still enjoy them to an extent without the back story. 

Austin101 is still out there posting reviews. I came across when fairly recently actually. And they are still very long and talk about matches move by move.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Lucha fallacy is a hang up the preferred marks want to cling to once their product doesn't go over well with others. :carl

but it's easy to know when you're watching worthwhile lucha - it blows your mind.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Carrie - ***3/4*
Arcade Fire - Reflektor - *****1/4*

This Undertaker/Yokozuna RR match is loads of fun. I don't remember the pace being this rapid. :lol at the way Undertaker no-sold the steel steps and the way he threw ringside attendees around. :lol again at Yokozuna blinding a fan with the powder. And then Mr. Fuji is waving the flag of Japan in the background and Jim Cornette is standing around for no reason. And then the biggie and the fattie punch each other and toss each other around. And then the entire locker room comes in to attack Taker a la IYH: Buried Alive. Holy crap this is good. ****1/2*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Great Kabuki & Tenryu being two of the many heels to beat up Taker is _probably_ my favorite part.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Need a nice not too lengthy match to watch atm, may pass out any minute


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Backlash 2006: Carlito vs Chris Masters


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

YOKOZUNA. Time to watch him squash some jobbers and team with Owen. Right after I watch that supposedly dreadful Lucha tag match. Souled Out 98 it was not.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

William Murderface said:


> Backlash 2006: Carlito vs Chris Masters


(Y) you never fail me muderface with you sigs and all


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Backlash match is a good shout. So weird how that's a legit good Carlito match. Those never happened.

I recommend Tajiri vs Mysterio from January 2004.

the lucha match - lordy. Any WCW match with their talent pool of Luchadores it was not.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

redskins25 said:


> (Y) you never fail me muderface with you sigs and all


It's what I do :angle

Kane/Big Show vs Masters/Carlito is another fun Carlito match, DAT OPENER :mark:


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Yokozuna & Owen Hart are in the running for being my favourite tag team ever. Everyone knows about Owen but Yoko is the fucking incredible ('the fucking incredible' makes no sense but I wanted to say 'the fucking' and 'incredible' and when realizing I couldn't have both without adding something I didn't want to, I shunned proper English). 


Only the main event to go for ER2010. Way too many words coming SOON. I haven't finished the show and there are already nearly 3000 words. At the very least it isn't play-by-play. Well I obviously have words that are describing the match and what's happening, but I like to think I type it in a way that tells you what I'm thinking about said moments in the match and not just the moments. So I guess there's a tiny bit of play-by-play? I mean, you need that. You don't want me going 'this was bad and sloppy and no psychology NOT ADDING'. You want me to be SPECIFIC, right? So you want SOME play-by-play, but not JUST play-by-play. You can have play-by-play and not play-by-play in the same thingy and be satisfied. It's like, do you want crunchy or soft tacos? And the little girl goes 'por que no los dos?' AM I GETTING YOU PUMPED!?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

And then the rest of his career happened 8*D

His best match in WWE has got to be that rad cruiserweight type match vs Bourne on Superstars in early 2010.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> Yokozuna & Owen Hart are in the running for being my favourite tag team ever. Everyone knows about Owen but Yoko is the fucking incredible ('the fucking incredible' makes no sense but I wanted to say 'the fucking' and 'incredible' and when realizing I couldn't have both without adding something I didn't want to, I shunned proper English).
> 
> 
> Only the main event to go for ER2010. Way too many words coming SOON. I haven't finished the show and there are already nearly 3000 words. At the very least it isn't play-by-play. Well I obviously have words that are describing the match and what's happening, but I like to think I type it in a way that tells you what I'm thinking about said moments in the match and not just the moments. So I guess there's a tiny bit of play-by-play? I mean, you need that. You don't want me going 'this was bad and sloppy and no psychology NOT ADDING'. You want me to be SPECIFIC, right? So you want SOME play-by-play, but not JUST play-by-play. You can have play-by-play and not play-by-play in the same thingy and be satisfied. It's like, do you want crunchy or soft tacos? And the little girl goes 'por que no los dos?' AM I GETTING YOU PUMPED!?


That fun ME 

Probably gonna watch NWO 2004 tonight, I hope people don't underrate this show still.

Since I am watching NWO 2004 I'm gonna being doing a'lot of this tonight :mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

redskins25 said:


> I'm BACK !, halloween bash was a success, tried as shit
> 
> Whats have all you gents been watching ?


PWG!



TaylorFitz said:


> *That wasn't a serious post at all*. I don't think you really need to have special knowledge to "get" any type of wrestling. I've seen a lot of stuff from all over the world and aside from some confusing rules in other promotions wrestling is really not complicated. A good match should be able to overcome a cultural difference. I don't think the "You don't get lucha" is actually a valid argument. Or at least one that can't just apply to lucha. There are certainly matches out there you appreciate more with some back story (like a Kenta Kobashi match that ends in a Burning Hammer) I think you could still enjoy them to an extent without the back story.
> 
> Austin101 is still out there posting reviews. I came across when fairly recently actually. And they are still very long and talk about matches move by move.


Don't worry, I know it wasn't. (Y) And my god at A101 still posting reviews. I bet there's still 8 line gaps between paragraphs and 4 pictures for every match too. :lol



funnyfaces1 said:


> Carrie - ***3/4*
> Arcade Fire - Reflektor - *****1/4*
> 
> This Undertaker/Yokozuna RR match is loads of fun. I don't remember the pace being this rapid. :lol at the way Undertaker no-sold the steel steps and the way he threw ringside attendees around. :lol again at Yokozuna blinding a fan with the powder. And then Mr. Fuji is waving the flag of Japan in the background and Jim Cornette is standing around for no reason. And then the biggie and the fattie punch each other and toss each other around. And then the entire locker room comes in to attack Taker a la IYH: Buried Alive. Holy crap this is good. ****1/2*


So glad you liked it. Did you see the postmatch stuff too? Gave me chills as a kid, still think it's absolutely incredible.



redskins25 said:


> Need a nice not too lengthy match to watch atm, may pass out any minute


Why not just go to sleep? 



funnyfaces1 said:


> YOKOZUNA. Time to watch him squash some jobbers and team with Owen. Right after I watch that supposedly dreadful Lucha tag match. Souled Out 98 it was not.


Yoko vs. Savage on RAW '94 for the WWF Title. :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jheri has got me pumped more than his hair's volume.

NWO '04 and that underrated tag team sprint. APA vs WGTT brings the goods.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Just finished the RR 97 lucha tag match. :lol at JR telling Jerry that he wishes Jerry was from Mexico so that he can wear a mask. This is not bad at all. I don't know what you fools are thinking. Not very different from your typical great WCW lucha tag. The height on some of these flips are awe-inspiring, and the execution is on point.


Spoiler: lolwhat



LOLJK this match was downright terrible



Yoko/123 Kid is really fun. Owen and Yoko are a near perfect fit. Almost as perfect as Jericho/Eddie (somewhat subtle plug).

EDIT: APA/WGTT! Loads of fun. "Yeah the APA is crap" :lmao


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Finished watching Jericho vs HBK last man standing for the first time. Nothing great but a decent match. ★★★¼. Haven't seen Judgment Day and Unforgiven yet, as it is, NM stands tall above the rest.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

HA

Bravo on the spoiler tag. Was about to be baffled for days. DAYS I TELL YA.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> Finished watching Jericho vs HBK last man standing for the first time. Nothing great but a decent match. ★★★¼. Haven't seen Judgment Day and Unforgiven yet, as it is, NM stands tall above the rest.


Watch Judgment Day now, please. It's my 2008 MOTY... right now at least.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Watch Judgment Day now, please. It's my 2008 MOTY... right now at least.


Been meaning to watch for a while. Can't now because I gotta get some sleep. Will try tomorrow.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Still haven't watched it yet...but Smackdown build is rising for that PPV on the horizon. Edge just won a battle royal without having to work. Comical ending and bleh booking with the championship aside, this Smackdown was really good. Every match match my "cool beans" list. Finlay got Porter to a match I didn't hate :mark: _(only the finish but that's not their fault)_


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Funnyfaces had me sold that he actually enjoyed it 

I really love the work Hector Garza puts into the match :lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao at this Smackdown classic at 8:38. "Damn damn damnity damn!"


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Charlie Haas started his gimmick about having gimmicks a few years early it seems.

WWE trying to play it safe by having Shelton being JBL & Haas as Simmons. Then the joke is killed when Shelton actually sounds like Bradshaw on a few lines. :hmm:


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Gonna try and finish this dynamite show, I am talking about Degenertaion-X IYH, clearly this show has not been dynamite, more like atrocious.

Austin vs Rock here we go.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

TELL me you liked Taka vs. Brian Christopher please? That match is awesome.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Hbk/shamrock ?


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Someone recommend me a STARRCADE match to watch. 

STARRCADE, the GOAT PPV name :mark:


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

redskins25 said:


> Hbk/shamrock ?


Don't think he's made it there yet, but yeah that one's pretty good. Would've been better with a real finish. JR helped things by selling the shit out of Shamrock's offense on commentary. 



Alim said:


> Someone recommend me a STARRCADE match to watch.
> 
> STARRCADE, the GOAT PPV name :mark:


Steamboat & Douglas vs. Windham & Pillman from '92 or Luger vs. Flair from '88.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> TELL me you liked Taka vs. Brian Christopher please? That match is awesome.


That has been match of the night, what's with that photo you sent me? 



> Hbk/shamrock ?


I'm about to watch it right now 

Rock/Austin was short and chaotic just like I remember.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Damn, first Sheamus got rid of the lobster head look. Now Mark Henry's wig has split. unk3

Yoko/Savage was very good. Thanks for the rec, man whose format I stole for reviews.

Go watch Ultimo Dragon vs. Dean Malenko from Starrcade 96.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Everyone should rep me, I have a very unpleasant photo that I have to look at right now because of JE187 

HBK vs Shamrock time though.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

William Murderface said:


> That has been match of the night, what's with that photo you sent me?


Hahaha. Fuck if I know. The gif you sent was random as shit, so I went with something random as shit to follow.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Damn, first Sheamus got rid of the lobster head look. Now Mark Henry's wig has split. unk3
> 
> Yoko/Savage was very good. Thanks for the rec, man whose format I stole for reviews.
> 
> Go watch Ultimo Dragon vs. Dean Malenko from Starrcade 96.


Literally was just about to say something about this. Check out the new pics of the BALD Mark Henry, fellas. My god he looks even more badass. Ready for a comeback now.

If you wanna dive into something a little longer, I'm a big fan of Yoko vs. Bret from 11/29/93. Think it was an episode of Superstars.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

At least mine was funny haha.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Rude...

I'll try better next time.   :woolcock

I need to go to bed now. Everyone sleep tight. Dream of woolcocks.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Steamboat & Douglas vs. Windham & Pillman from '92 or Luger vs. Flair from '88.


What a tremendous match, just finished watching. I need to get that Starrcade dvd


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

We interrupt your [^^^^ thissss] for [vvvvv thisssss]. Feel free to ignore it as there are too many words. 

----------------

Extreme Rules 4/25/10

Live (three years ago) from somewhere again.

HHH and Sheamus are supposed to open with the street fight, and I am baffled that they are started the show with a HHH match. Of course they ACTUALLY didn’t because Helmlsey couldn’t take that and asked Sheamus to injure him until the main event. I should note that Michael Cole’s acting during the ‘where is HHH?’ parts was awful. ‘uhfh ladies and gentlemen I don’t know what’s going on here…’, like he was a talk show host on a ludicrously obvious planned skit where an actor hatched from an egg or something. And the brawling in the back didn’t make me want to see a street fight between the two. Why does HHH say ‘DOOH!’ and ‘BOOJ’ every time he throws a punch and gets hit? Like, the same noise for both things. This paragraph is probably longer than what my actual write-up of the match well be. 

So we get to the ring and the Big Show’s music hits! I’m excited. Oh, wait, shit, there’s the Miz. Whoopy. Have I said how much I fucking hate those ‘mix’ names? ‘ShoMiz’!? As in, ‘Show Biz’? Who’s the not-at-all-clever wanker coming up with those and who is the dickhead allowing them on TV (Word believes ‘unclever’ is not a word so ‘not-at-all clever’ is my response)? ‘JeriShow’ is the worst one by fucking far. I am at my keyboard struggling to come up with words to truly tell the two people reading this how much I fucking hate ‘JeriShow’. ‘Hey guys, great fuckin’ idea – Jericho is pronounced ‘Jeri-KO’, right? Well ‘Show’ – as in ‘BIG Show’, rhymes with ‘KO’ – AS IN JERICHO! We can call it JeriShow!!’ Drop dead. Air quotes. OK so aside from a tag team name that has nothing to do with this PPV, the Miz is running his mouth and it’s boring and Teddy Long comes out and it’s boring and then the Big Show puts his hand over the Miz’s mouth which is cool and funny but I just don’t want to see the Miz. Teddy Long announces they have to go through three matches. Um, thanks. Like, I get you’re punishing THEM, but I don’t want to sit through three Miz matches in a row. What did I do?

Tag Gauntlet
This realistically didn’t have to be three matches long, but once you saw them beat the first team you would had to have known. Teddy said they were facing three teams in a row and which ever team beat them (if any did) would get a tag title shot the next night on the 3-hour draft Raw. The first team was Morrison & R-Truth who had the Mania match with the champs (hey, it WAS Truth), so I could buy them winning. Found it weird that they used R-Truth’s music, but I think that’s likely because Truth dancing like he has a fish biting his willy wouldn’t look terribly cool in slow-motion. I don’t really remember the match. Well I remember the Miz having some nice back-clubs, Show looking really good for a second, and Morrison and Show doing the double hot tag thing while I was sitting there wondering how the fuck they were going to pull that off in Morrison’s favour. Shitty punches is how. Really, really, shitty punches. Morrison gets DQ’ed for not letting go of the rope submission…well that’s some dumbass finish. So they weasel out of that and I hear MARK HENRY’S MUSIC! I get pumped for the potential Show/Henry interaction and get way disappointed because the only cool thing that happens between them in Henry eating a big boot really well. The Henry/Miz part was completely sucky other than the Miz realising he is up shit creek when Henry grabs him. Henry throws Miz into the corner, the Miz dodges a stinger splashish thing, and Henry has to tag out….for that. Could you make him look like any more of a useless gorilla, maybe? He was selling it, but it was a kind of ‘fuck man I can’t take this, I don’t live up to my hype at all’ selling, where you expect people to call him a chicken and say their grandmother could have kept going after that. The Big Show tumbles outside the ring embarrassingly then hits a pretty poor looking ‘I’mma hit yo face’ on MVP while outside. So they win that too (duhhhh). Last team is Smith & Kidd and they win immediately after a new-Hart-Attack-thingy. Then, for whatever weird-ass reason, Mark Henry gets back in the ring…? Oh never mind it’s Bret. NOT ADDING.

Rey Mysterio v. CM Punk
Honestly I didn’t get this. I would add it if pressed but it wouldn’t be very high and I felt ‘off’ while watching it. I can’t help but think that’s largely to do with the mood I was in, and, well, I’m not even sure what to say about it. Some of that is due to memory, but….damn, IDK. I’ll give this a full write up when I watch it next. Let’s see. 

The Guy From Cryme v. The Other Guy From Cryme Tyme
Me: “strap match? What strap match? Is the WWE or world title match a strap match?” Then random music plays and the big dude from Cryme Tyme comes out, with the announcers talking up about the break-up of a ‘great’ tag team. Fuck? OK so they broke up and they’re mad at each other and hey think the other was holding them (/him whatever shitty grammar etc etc) back. You’d think they’d be more about hate, but Big Cryme Tyme seemed to go straight to the ‘touch the turnbuckles’ part, wanting to end the match quickly. JTG ends up stopping a tug o’ war by putting his leg over the strap and punching away, and you immediately know that Big Cryme Tyme will jerk the strap and yank JTG’s nuts. Well you think wrong and when Big Cryme Tyme (let’s call him BCT) yanks the strap, JTG goes apeshit on the bump and tumbles awkwardly nutty on the mat. Cool spill. There’s a pretty stupid spot where BCT throws JTG out and then realises it was dumb as shit to do so because he can’t reach the buckles from where he is. Um, dude, you’re tied at the wrist. They go the route of heel tapping the turnbuckles with babyface tapping them afterward, and I can’t help but think that shouldn’t work. Maybe I’m wrong, but I’m making the assumption that the rules were that the turnbuckle count is broken up if one guy makes some form of combat contact with the dude touching the buckles. Wouldn’t BCT pulling JTG by his THROAT the entire time count as that sort of contact? Also I’m surprised in a PG Post-Benoit World they even let that hanging slide. Maybe that’s why these two never got their chance. Or because they aren’t very good. Did this even happen? I ate some candy before this, was it spiked with hallucinogens? Did I accidentally eat some sort of cocaine pez and imagine this whole thing? How is a Cryme Tyme split up getting a gimmick match on PPV in 2010? How has nobody mentioned it as ‘why the fuck did this even happen?’? NOT ADDING.

Jack Swagger v. Randy Orton
The thing about these PPVs in 2010 is that I have little idea of what’s even on the card. I was sort of watching WWE in 2010, but I was focused on the undercard, and the world title picture is an entire blur up until the worst feud I think I’ve ever seen in Kane/Edge. So I get at least a tiiiiiiiiiiiiiny bit of excitement when the world title match is announced because I’m no sure who’s even facing who. Unlike WCW B-shows shows, though, I’m not expecting a great surprise like seven minutes of Villano IV v. Barry Windham. Instead I can usually expect Randy Orton for what feels like forty minutes. Problem is I don’t buy Orton in that role at all. I mentioned a while back how I watched the Breaking Point match with Cena and thought it was the most upsettingly pathetic attempt at acting like a psycho I’ve seen (I’m thinking of him triyng to roll his eyes back in his head and want to omit when I do). Like, I hate Edge and think he’s the shittiest actor on Earth but I’m not sure I can remember a single specific match or moment where he was as hilariously bad as Breaking Point Orton. My reasons for bringing this up is that Orton didn’t come close to that level of shitty, but at the same time I just don’t think he’s fit for that role at all. Hell he wasn’t even bad here, and I think I disliked him more than I thought he was out-right not-good, but watching a guy back away from Orton like he’s some sort of psychopath…I don’t see it. Still, it is what it is and I’m forced to stretch my imagination when seeing something like this. OK, Orton is a psycho. I’ll pretend for however long I gave to. Swagger did a fine job selling hat Orton was dangerous; there was a cool moment near the beginning with Swagger getting a chair and Orton scaring it off or something IDK it was days ago. Orton didn’t eat moves very well; he’s so average on selling, and it’s, God, what d say here? Inorganic, maybe. I don’t buy it. It feels like he’s there to do his job as a performer and not do hi job as a wrestler. If that makes teh sense. He’s also horrid with cut-off spots. Swagger runs at him viciously with the belt and the best thing he can come up with to stop it is a boring ass kick in the mid-section. Fuck, man. Do something else? Dropkick his gut? Sweep his leg? Duck and uppercut? Your uppercuts aren’t bad…why a kick in the gut? For all the crap I’m giving Orton, at least his weapon offense brought energy to this; the trash can shots especially were rough and powerful and felt meaningful and I wish this was the whole match. OK, so I don’t really buy Orton a psycho, but if I’m forced to for this, then I wish the match ws Swagger constantly running away and Orton trying to throw shit at him. That this wasn’t though. I’m at the point where I almost don’t want to watch Orton any more. Well, late Orton. Speaking of which, is there any 2010 Orton on TV people like? I’m kind of hoping no, but I’ll watch whatever. I didn’t think I’d write this much about a match I said I didn’t even remember. NOT ADDING. 

HHH v. Sheamus 
HHH is ready to fight! Who could have seen this triumphant return coming!? I think I said something about him being too tired and selling boringly in the Mania match, but at least here the pre-match (pre-show) assault gives him reason to act like this. Still, that doesn’t hide the fact he just isn’t good at selling like this. Soooooo boring. I mean I dislike 2010 Orton more than 2010 HHH, but I’d say Orton is clearly better. Similarly though they both aren’t convincing working like this and they both stop big moments with regular stomps to the mid-section. Trip takes like 18 finishers before finally going down, though I didn’t expect Sheamus to win the match like he did so whatever. I was kidding when I wrote “This paragraph is probably longer than what my actual write-up of the match well be” but there is just nothing else to say about this. Can Sheamus move on to someone else now? NOT ADDING.

Michelle McCool v. Beth Phoenix
OK so there was a spot where McCool grabbed the iron and the cord didn’t reach where she wanted it to, and a bucket being used a weapon is stupid and clearly not as effectively as a fist (at least Beth threw it), but honestly I flat out LIKED this. Like, ‘liked’ it. Like, I would honestly be totally fine with watching again. Most of it is based around offense with an ironing board and I thought it was pretty cool; just a bunch of whacks, throws, and a really cool double STOMP with the board. McCool is eventually sent off of the apron (somehow, IDR) and probably hits her head on that fucking table o’ stuff they have on the outside (camera doesn’t catch it and the commentator s say she did but for her sake I hope they were exaggerating). Beth rolls her over the table after McCool accidentally uses hairspray against Layla and Vickie (using on Beth to get control of the match earlier, which I liked). Both women get on the second turnbuckle and Vickie starts hitting Beth’s leg hilariously with the sweeper part of a broom, and that comedy turns into disgust when Beth takes a pretty hideous tumble onto the ironing board. I don’t think anybody there realised how much that may have actually hurt. There are like, metal bars and everything. This just did a nice job of powerful hero v. bitchy skinnier bitch. I never even considered considering this for the list and I have no idea if anything I just wrote came off as anything that anybody would want to see, but I just found it fun. I’m almost inclined to say this was a legitimately better match than Edge/Jericho at WrestleMania. Eat shit. NOT ADDING.

Chris Jericho v. Edge
I am so glad this was boring. I knew there was approximately zero chance of these two at this point in their overrated career where they both sucked ass having a likeable, decent match. So I thought that this would either be boring or frustrating, and I would much, much, much rather be bored than frustrated (their Mania match was way frustrating, just in case you missed me bombing a country b/c of my hatred for it). The pre-story shit here got me less excited than last time because I knew these two would pretty much ignore it and wrestle their same vanilla bullshit that anybody who works on the indies can do. Jericho said he will end Edge’s career and something about the Achilles, and Edge said he won’t escape the cage – he’ll go after Jericho. Well what do you fucking know? Edge didn’t once try to leave the cage. That was nice of him to keep his word. It was also nice of him to not make any contact on punches, stomps, and gingerly fluffy clotheslines so Jericho wouldn’t go through any pain. What a great guy. And My God, that part where he goes to send Jericho into the cage and it looks as fake as anything I’ve ever seen. Now that dear wrestling fans, is how you protect a man. At the very least I can say I saw Edge try to limp a couple of times, and that his slow boringassness can be explained by the fact he doesn’t want to put pressure on his Achilles. Still…..shouldn’t force you to throw punches and clotheslines that’d make Kofi Kingston laugh at you. Also shouldn’t make you give a babyface-atr-the-bottom performance that makes HHH and Orton on this PPV look like Ricky Morton and Jerry Lawler. Jericho doesn’t keep true to his ‘I will end Edge’s career [or whatever]’ word and instead constantly runs away and is hesitant to even get into the cage. I can say there were some decently entertaining moments where he tried run out of the cage, like after landing on his feet on the missed lionsault. And another, but I forget. They do the fakey ‘he’s not really trying to escape it’s obvious’ shtick really poorly, and Edge trying to be tired b/c of injury should add to the drama, but instead just makes Jericho looks like he’s waiting for Edge to grab him. Later on there’s a part where Jericho (after running away several times) is on the steps, about to leave, and he goes back in. ??????????????? Whatever. I’m not coming up with an explanation for this shit. He attacks Edge’s foot literally ONCE, btw. FUCKING ONCE. He tries to swing a chair at it but Edge moves out of the way. ONCEEEE. Edge attacks Jericho’s foot five thousand times more than Jericho did in either match, to the point where - when Jericho starts begging off - you actually think Edge is doing it for no reason. Naturally Edge makes stupid spear faces somewhere in their, and by this time they had become ‘HE’S GONE TO THAT PLACE HEARING VOICES’-esque bullshit. I feel like I should mention fifteen other things wrong with this but I don’t recall them and I think I’d rather forget about the four hours I spent watching it anyway (and the eighteen hours between watching the entrance and the actual match b/c I wasn’t ready for this shittery). This was obviously a worthless match that went too long, in case I haven’t made my opinion clear. I don’t understand how anybody can watch this and see two above average wrestlers. Please let this end now. NOT ADDING.

John Cena v. Batista
Goddamn I thought this was totally fucking excellent. I can’t remember many Cena Is In Trouble matches that I got behind as much as this. I’m also really tempted to say this is Batista’s career performances and match. I’d definitely put this ahead of the HHH Cell, and I’d need to watch the Taker matches again. Batista and Cena two are big bulky dudes so the proper start to a big bulky dude LMS is to have both guys get moves in and then wait just in case the other got up, so they could go for them again. Batista, being the bigger and bulkier dude, gets the upper hand and after a great thingy where he’s sort of standing on Cena’s head, he randomly works the leg. Had no idea what to think of that until Cena pulls a fucking monster sell job. Man alive he was good – getting up and hopping around brilliantly to avoid Batista, and reversing the irish whip into the steps with this fucking fantastic struggling look on his face, like it was taking all of his power to not fall down (and then he falls down after that- SEE?). I’ll make a quick mention that Cena’s faces were perfect through the whole match. Don’t think I remember him ever conveying emotion as well as this, from struggle, to frustration, to confusion, to disappointment, to pain…all of it was great. I wish the leg thing wasn’t brushed off out of nowhere because there was nothing more deflating than seeing Cena hit his shoulder blocks and five knuckle shuffle like he did. He at least shook the leg after that a little, but he did such a cool sell of it that I was sad to see it end like that. I couldn’t be bothered by it too long for a couple of reasons (a) I wasn’t really expecting the match to be based around that, and (b) the big moves were awesome. There are only so many gigantic things wrestlers can do before you get to the point where you want one of them stay down, and goddamnit I didn’t think they ever got there. Every move felt important and like a potential match-ender. Batista got most of them in (throw through the barricade and the table spot were badass), but not once did I think Cena was being, you know, ‘Superman’. He took his time getting up each one, and if he pounced he did in it that sort of jump that puts him in more pain than he was in before so he collapses to the ropes. There was a great one where was on the apron and instead of bothering to get up he just rolls to the outside on his feet. Batista and his great murderous rampages of dickness (yay @ him throwing the monitor at Matt Striker and telling that little boy he hates him) were stopped really well. Seemed like every thing Cena did had more and more of an impact, and Batista’s ten count get ups were just as buyable as Cena’s. The announce table FU one in particular was five million stars, especially with Cena yelling at people. I want to mention that the pre-match video had me confused. I thought this was one of those classic Cena deals where the heel said Cena got a ‘fluke win’ at the previous PPV, and decides to add a gimmick so Cena can’t do that again. I was confused because Cena got the STF on Batista later in the same video, and Batista stayed down for ten. Where’s the suspense if I know it can keep him down? The whole point is Batista can’t lose by tap out, but he won’t stay down for ten. Well I soon realised it was a total home-run of genius, because when Batista got up from that STF ten-count and Cena dashed for the tape I blew my fucking head. Some people hate the finish, don’t they? I loved it. This is John Cena, the man that kicks out of everything, that gets up form everything, the man that runs at his opponent with this stupid shoulder blocks no matter how much pain he’s been through, and here he is giving up and using this method. He can’t keep Batista down; he even used something that HAS kept Batista down for ten, but this behemoth’s going to keep coming. By using that tape he goes ‘fuck it, fuck it, fuck it. I give up. He won’t stay down unless I literally tie him to the floor’. The sight of Batista trying to pull out like a leashed leopard was fantastic. God this was sooooooo great. ADDING. 

Current list:



Spoiler: WHATTUP?



1.	Rey Mysterio v. CM Punk (SmackDown 2/12/10)
2.	John Cena v. Batista (Extreme Rules 4/25/10)
3.	Christian v. Drew McIntyre (SmackDown 7/16/10)
4.	Christian v. Ezekiel Jackson (Royal Rumble 1/31/10)
5.	Christian/Kane v. William Regal/Ezekiel Jackson (ECW 1/26/10)
6.	Shawn Michaels v. The Undertaker (WrestleMania 3/28/10)
7.	William Regal v. Evan Bourne (SuperStars 3/4/10)
8.	The Undertaker v. Rey Mysterio (Royal Rumble 1/31/10)
9.	Drew McIntyre v. Kaval (SmackDown 9/10/10)
10.	Rey Mysterio v. CM Punk (WrestleMania 3/28/10)
11.	d
12.	d
13.	d
14.	d
15.	d
16.	d
17.	d
18.	d
19.	d
20.	d
21.	d
22.	d
23.	d
24.	d
25.	d
26.	d

Other contenders:


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

So did you like the show?

Well Taka/Christopher was MOTN for me, but I did enjoy HBK/Shamrock, not a classic but not bad either.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Let it be known that 'If that makes teh sense.' in the Swagger/Orton write-up was intentional. I mention this because I didn't realise how littered with spelling mistakes the Swagger/Orton one is. I also somehow deleted entire sentenceS. Well....not like you're expecting sense out of me anyway, right? 



William Murderface said:


> So did you like the show?


If this was directed at me (I'm not sure b/c mestoopid), then, not really.


----------



## Sids_chickenleg (Jul 19, 2011)

Started watching Hogan's Anthology DVD via Netflix. First match on it is Hogan as a heel with Freddie Blassie as his manager against Andre in WWWF. I've never really seen Andre around this time and it was incredible with how well he could move for his size. He even attempted a Warrior like splash on Hogan. Was very impressed with how he moved. Only 1 disc in but I've already enjoyed his match with Bockwinkel in AWA. Hogan was incredibly over and Bockwinkel/Heenan were perfect heels. Great match.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

YES1993! That Cena/Batista review made me happy. I need to watch that again soon. Was planning on watching the whole show but it looks quite bad. Edge/Jericho was indeed shitty if memory serves correctly. Maybe I should watch it so I can give it the crappy write-up it deserves (crappy write-up as in the match was crappy, the write-up itself would be great).


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Was that the "extreme" hair match they had? I just had it lined up to watch some time this week, as I saw it had some great reviews. I guess not, then.



Callamus said:


> From my RR 97 Ramble:
> 
> Héctor Garza, Perro Aguayo & El Canek Vs Jerry Estrada, Heavy Metal & Fuerza Guerrera - They're in Texas, so they decide to throw in a random Mexican 6 man match. Wow this fucking SUCKED. I actually used to think very highly of this match. I must have been high. Except I don't get high. So I was drunk. That's it. 2 guys flip about. Slowly and with little shit given. They each tag out. Repeat the flipping about slowly while not giving a shit. Tag out. They do that a few times, then someone randomly gets a win. The fans are silent until the match ends. They cheer because they are glad it's over. DUD.


I cannot believe there's a match with Canek in it and the shit gets flung onto Garza. That's the guy who needs it most. As for Garza he wasn't at all bad in the last pre-2013 CMLL match I dipped into. Which is a mini feat of greatness considering he was wrestling Canek, Rayo De Jalisco and Black Warrior.



Yeah1993 said:


> Mascaras sells in those matches. Pretty sure, anyway. Well...they work the mat mostly, so it's not like he can shrug off strikes and such. Can't say I remember THAT well.


I've plugged that Mil/Destroyer match before to Hayley, and he shrugged it off all the same. Ended in the same discussion of him being a no-selling turd. He'll watch that match one day, I hope. Even "bad wrestlers" have good matches, sometimes.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Rah said:


> Was that the "extreme" hair match they had? I just had it lined up to watch some time this week, as I saw it had some great reviews. I guess not, then.


Who? Which match? Not sure what you're talking about here.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Mysterio/Punk at ER 2010.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

FINALLY Cena/Batista LMS gettin' dat love. I just creamed at the sheer aggressiveness and ruthlessness displayed, they bounced the other through everything like pinballs but one's power was too much to be simply laid down like that. Awesome stuff and I ain't lying, I have it at ****1/4 personally.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Rah said:


> Mysterio/Punk at ER 2010.


It was for Punk's hair, yeah. I've heard from pretty much everyone that it's great too, which is why I'm reserving my actual judgment for another watch. Not sure why but it just didn't click with me.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

ATF said:


> FINALLY Cena/Batista LMS gettin' dat love. I just creamed at the sheer aggressiveness and ruthlessness displayed, they bounced the other through everything like pinballs but one's power was too much to be simply laid down like that. Awesome stuff and I ain't lying, I have it at ****1/4 personally.


I've always loved it and I don't want to hang out with anyone who doesn't think it's great. Cena/Batista is an underrated pairing. Good chemistry there. Batista was the man during that heel run. There's a match with HBK that I remember being really fucking good. I want to say it was a stretcher match but I'm not 100% sure.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Since we're heading to Survivor Series, I decide to rate all WWF/E Title matches in SVS history:

Hogan/Taker: **
Bret/HBK I: ***3/4
Bret/Backlund: ****1/4
Bret/Diesel: ****1/2
HBK/Sid: ****
Bret/HBK II: ****
Rock/Mankind: ***1/4
Austin/HHH/Show: *1/4
Angle/Taker: ***1/4
Lesnar/Show: ***1/2 _(for 5 minutes this was spectacular)_
JBL/Booker: **
Cena/Angle: **1/4
Orton/HBK: ****1/2
HHH/Edge/Kozlov: DUD
Cena/HBK/HHH: ****
Orton/Barrett: **1/4
ADR/Punk: ***3/4
Punk/Cena/Ryback: ***1/4

Not a bad record it seems.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Huh, I'm ACTUALLY STRUGGLING to get 5 reasons I hate Wade Barrett :lmao. Managed to get 3.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

> Lesnar/Show: ***1/2 (for 5 minutes this was spectacular)


This is one of my favorite short matches ever. I love the match and I don't even care that it doesn't last for a long time.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Expect a GOAT HiaC match from Bryan and Orton tonight, to make up for their Battleground clusterfuck. That match was awful, even without Show's interference


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I've learned ever since their first match together not to expect anything from Bryan/Orton.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Their NoC one was really good, imo ***3/4 but their Battleground one barely reaches **1/2 in my book.

*** for Cena/Orton HiaC match, rewatched it on WWE's YT channel


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'm not expecting much from anything at HIAC tbh.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I keep forgetting HIAC is tonight :lol. 

Watching Angle/Show right now on Armageddon 02, really fucking good, review should be up within an hour or 2. After that gotta get some work done so I can watch HIAC tonight :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Rah said:


> I've plugged that Mil/Destroyer match before to Hayley, and he shrugged it off all the same. Ended in the same discussion of him being a no-selling turd. He'll watch that match one day, I hope. Even "bad wrestlers" have good matches, sometimes.


That's awesome. Don't even remember that. He's the Edge to Yeah1993 for me.

Oh hey Jheri I read it all. Best line being _"for some reason Mark Henry rolls back in the ring. Oh wait, that's Bret Hart."_

And I feel really swell about telling you the main event was good. Although you ended up loving it so even better. :hb


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I've stopped taking Dominic seriously now since he's got Batista/Cena above HBK/Undertaker from WM 8*D.

But in all seriousness, I'm not a fan of Batista/Cena. Any of their matches really. Need to see SS again because I DID used to like it but I loved their WM match more and I disliked that on my last watch.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Extreme Rules
SummerSlam
WrestleMania 26
Over the Limit

That's my order. OTL match is awful. Desperately flat. Replaced all the nifty elements behind the LMS for run of the mill WWE tripe.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Armageddon 2002 review​*
*Match # 1: Booker T and Goldust vs. Lance Storm and William Regal vs. The Dudley Boyz vs. Chris Jericho and Christian*

Oh this should be sick! These tag matches have all been :mark: so far. Best year for tag wrestling on PPV? Probably. No idea why they don’t just have 4 people in the ring instead of people fucking taggingin their opponents, never got that shit. This match is all sorts of fun, such an awesome pace and I think I am legit a fan of everyone in this but Booker T, and his weaknesses are never evident when GOLDUST is with him. This is an Elimination match apparently and it comes down to Jericho and Christian vs Bookdust. Really solid opener here, with a lot of cool spots combined with good wrestling. The final two teams are the MVP’s here as they go 2 on 2 for the majority of the match and the end has a lot of good near falls. Crowd is crazy behind Bookdust here and all 4 guys are at their very best. Awesome match, and 2002 tag wrestling keeps getting better. Match surprisingly goes a long time at over 20 minutes but it doesn’t feel too long, also nice to see Bookdust FINALLY get the tag titles. ****

*CAL SCALE: 5*

*Match # 2: Edge vs A-train*

What a fuckfest this shit will be. Edge went from being the co main event of PPVS to fucking fighting A-train in a filler match in like 2 months. This might be the shittiest match yet this year if it wasn’t for Hogan. Such a slow match and it just didn’t work. Albert was so much better when he was T&A with Test in 2000 because it hid hi weaknesses. The guy just cant work a very good match and this is a perfect example of that. DUD

*CAL SCALE: 0 *

*Match # 3: Eddie Gurrero vs Chris Benoit
*
I just watched their ECW one night stand match last night, lets see how those two compare. I doubt these two have EVER had a bad match, two of the best workers in WWE history, sad as fuck their gone . This is pretty fucking great- better than that opening tag IMO. I nearly broke my computer when I realized the fans we’re chanting BORING and HBK chants, those fucking cunts. Once again this is gonna be MOTN easily, some good shit here. They start out with some really fun mat work and transition to a good brawl flawlessly. Really solid nearfalls and a dramatic ending make this a shoe in for MOTN, and pretty sure this beats out that rebellion tag for my current MOTY. **** ½* 

*CAL SCALE: 7 *

*Match # 4: Batista vs Kane*

GREEN BATISTA? NO FUCKIN THANKS!! NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1*

*Match # 5: divas shit*

DIVAS? NOT HAPPENING! NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1*

*Match # 6: Kurt Angle vs Big Show *

Really fucking good match, like maybe even better than Eddie/Benoit, alright not that good but still really fun. Crowd was super into this and so was I. I wish it was a lttle longer but its NBD, because they do a great job packing in some awesome moves with some fun classic wrasslin too. It WAS going great until fucking a-train decided he wanted to fuck up more than one match tonight and nearly cost Angle the match, fucking cunt. But wait! ITS BRAAACK LESSNAR! He F-5’s Show and this extremely fun match is over. **** 

*CAL SCALE: 5*

*Match # 7: HHH vs HBK 3SOH*

The only good thing about this match might be that the “stages “are actually really solid. First fall is street fight, second is a steel cage match, and a third is a ladder match. Better than the payback shit. I really want to like this match so much, just because I love HBK and Haitch can be great at times. Only match I have seen from these two is the Summerslam match, but it was a long time ago so who knows what I thought about. Alright, lets get into this 45 minute clusterfuck. 

First Fall​
This will be the most basic of the falls I guess, considering its just a no DQ match, so will this be the best fall? Most likely yes. Really low expectations going into this siply because everyone loves to shit over this . This wasn’t too bad TBH, but I hope this isn’t a flat out DUD. First fall was actually mildly entertaining, it wasn’t a classic or even really good by any means but I didn’t really have a tough time getting through it TBH, which came as a relatively large surprise considering that I went in thinking this was gonna be hell on earth. ** ¾* 

Second fall​
I think Haitch one the first fall, don’t know for sure because I wasn’t really paying attention to the final moments of the match TBH. So this fall will be contested inside of a steel cage. Since HHH likes to be a jerk he throws all of the weapons from the first fall inside the ring, making this a carbon copy of the forst fall only with a cage. I guess you can always call on hunter to suck the creativity out of a match :lol. This wasn’t as good as the first fall even though HBK winning is cooler. HBK jumping off the top of the cage is :mark: and is the only reason this fall is not a flat out DUD. But besides the HBK spot, it sucks. * 

Third fall​
There is only 8 minutes left in this video by the time this fall, a ladder match, starts, so this is bound to be shitty. LOLWTF is this 5 minute ladder match, porbably the shortest and shittiest ever TBH. Fuck this fall and this match. DUD 
Overall this is terrible, street fight is decent, but the rest is stupid rushed. * ¼* 

*CAL SCALE: 0.5
*
*TOTAL CAL SCALE: 15.5*

*CURRENT PPV MOTY: Chris Benoit vs Eddie Gurrero (Armageddon)*

*CURRENT 2002 PPV RANKINGS

1: rebellion(20)
2: The Royal rumble(18)
3: Armageddon(15.5)
4: Unforgiven(15)
5: Backlash(11.5)*​


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Glad Eddie/Benoit AM '02 got some love. It's no Vengeance '03 but it's close.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

What are the opinions on Team Angle vs Guerrero/Tajiri ladder match from JD'03?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

On the talk of it, OTL 2010 was awful overall. Orton/Edge was nightmare bad. Thank God Punk/Rey and Harts/JeriMiz existed or it would've been one of the WOAT PPV.

zep, that is probably the most underrated Ladder match ever.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cool, on paper it does sound rather ace. I'll hope to watch it later...


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> ]*Match # 2: Edge vs A-train*
> 
> What a fuckfest this shit will be. Edge went from being the co main event of PPVS to fucking fighting A-train in a filler match in like 2 months. This might be the shittiest match yet this year if it wasn’t for Hogan. Such a slow match and it just didn’t work. Albert was so much better when he was T&A with Test in 2000 because it hid hi weaknesses. The guy just cant work a very good match and this is a perfect example of that. DUD


Ok, while this match was bad, the theory about A-Train being better with Test over singles isn't one that fits, imo. A-Train would go on to have a pretty productive 2003. Then his work in Japan is great. Shows how underrated of a wrestler he is. I'll be forever alone in feeling this. Sad face.



ATF said:


> Glad Eddie/Benoit AM '02 got some love. It's no Vengeance '03 but it's close.


I actually prefer the Armageddon match be a large margin, personally.



zep81 said:


> What are the opinions on Team Angle vs Guerrero/Tajiri ladder match from JD'03?


Tis good. Team Angle have a few awkward moments with the ladders, although it smooths out as the match goes on. Before you know it, it ends up being good & def worth a look. Far cry from their matches that would go down on Smackdown though. Now those bouts were tremendous.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

To each is their own. Vengeance was a fucking classic, it wasn't a Steve Jobs-smart logicfest like a Punk/Lesnar or a Taker/Shawn but everything they did still had somewhat of a purpose and didn't come off as a loud spotfest by any means. Not that Armageddon was either, but still.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Vengeance comes off as a large blur minus the great Eddie shenanigans. That's why I'm never high on it like most folk. And that's a show I know like the back of my hand too. Yet nothing about the finals sticks ou. Probably the only match between em I don't get jazzed up for along with the boring ONS '05 affair.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah that ONS match was a real disappointment TBH. Good think the rest of the PPV rules.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

There's so much great shit about that show. Aside from Eddie/Benoit, you have the APA Funfest, WGTT/Rey & Kidman, Taker/Cena and Lesnar/Angle/Show all delievering.

Though imo it's only 2nd to NWO '06 as the best SD PPV ever.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Exactly. Everything about that show is a win. Even Noble vs Gunn b/c the match doesn't offend and the vulgar shenanigans are outlandish to the point where I can't believe WWE did it.

I got plenty I'd take over NWO '06 8*D


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The Primer said:


> I got plenty I'd take over NWO '06 8*D


I was gonna say the same thing.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

TensAlberTrain is a good singles worker. At times could be great too. His T&A run was super too.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> I was gonna say the same thing.


:mark:



Callamus said:


> TensAlberTrain is a good singles worker. At times could be great too. His T&A run was super too.


:mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Planning on watching a random PPV from my collection tonight for a PPV Ramble. Got ALL my DVD's out on my floor atm as I was doing a video with them but hated it so I'm gonna re-shoot when I have a few hours alone in the house. So anyway I have easy access to them so I just need to pick one out and watch it. Was thinking maybe No Mercy 02. I wanna see the BookDust tag match mainly, and I think outside of like, SummerSlam 02 (they had one there, right?) it's the only tag match of theirs on PPV I own on disc.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> *Armageddon 2002 review​*
> *Match # 1: Booker T and Goldust vs. Lance Storm and William Regal vs. The Dudley Boyz vs. Chris Jericho and Christian*
> 
> Oh this should be sick! These tag matches have all been :mark: so far. Best year for tag wrestling on PPV? Probably. No idea why they don’t just have 4 people in the ring instead of people fucking taggingin their opponents, never got that shit. This match is all sorts of fun, such an awesome pace and I think I am legit a fan of everyone in this but Booker T, and his weaknesses are never evident when GOLDUST is with him. This is an Elimination match apparently and it comes down to Jericho and Christian vs Bookdust. Really solid opener here, with a lot of cool spots combined with good wrestling. The final two teams are the MVP’s here as they go 2 on 2 for the majority of the match and the end has a lot of good near falls. Crowd is crazy behind Bookdust here and all 4 guys are at their very best. Awesome match, and 2002 tag wrestling keeps getting better. Match surprisingly goes a long time at over 20 minutes but it doesn’t feel too long, also nice to see Bookdust FINALLY get the tag titles. ****


This match reminds me of the tag team division on RAW was so much quality back in 2002 with these three teams and the Dudleyz (even though they were beyond stale at that point). Skip to RAW in 2003 and we have the never-ending Dudleyz vs La Resistance feud. :argh:

At least Kane and RVD were great to watch at the start of 2003 before being split up. Test and Scott Steiner were a solid tag team as well.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

They had THE tag back at SummerSlam 2002 vs Christian & Storm. Praise aside, yes. They have a match there.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The main reason I decided to do PPV reviews for 2002 was because of Bookdust 

Don't know which PPV I am doing next, I know I wanna save Mania, NM, SVS, and SS last. Thinking either NWO or KOTR. Thoughts on those shows?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Big warning for you on the main event of King of the Ring. It might have Undertaker, but it also includes lots of bad stuff & Triple H. Which means the point Yeah1993 made about having to hear "DHOO" & "BOOJ" after every punch throw or taken by him is in full effect. And it sucks.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> The main reason I decided to do PPV reviews for 2002 was because of Bookdust
> 
> Don't know which PPV I am doing next, I know I wanna save Mania, NM, SVS, and SS last. Thinking either NWO or KOTR. Thoughts on those shows?


Never seen NWO but I don't recall KOTR being anything special outside of an awesome Jericho/RVD match. Somehow Eddie Guerrero vs. Ric Flair is on that card and I don't remember ANY of that...

You and Cal should both do No Mercy.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Eh, I like Vengeance 03' slightly more than Armageddon 02' for Eddie/Benoit mostly for Eddie's character work, he really came into his own with the lying, cheating, and stealing. The beginning 5-7 minutes are nuts, then it slows down a bit and Eddie has a fantastic control segment. The last 5 minutes or so are completely nuts again. Just a whole lot to like for me. Other than their Best of Super Juniors match in 1996, it's probably my favorite they had that I've seen. Armageddon is absolutely superb too, I only have it as 1/4* less than Vengeance. Watching Eddie sit up, poke the ref, the flop down again is just :lmao. Same with when Rhyno gores Benoit and he just shrugs his shoulders, hits the frog splash, and gets the win. Oh Eddie.

Just watched:

Benoit vs HBK vs Trips Backlash 2004-Great match, the hometown Edmonton crowd was HOT. Not as good as the WM20 match, but it's still a fantastic watch. HBK's completely ridiculous miss on that dive to the outside through the table was a little much, he had no chance in hell of hitting Benoit or Trips. Plus HBK applied the UGLIEST sharpshooter this side of Rockys. Seriously for all the amazing and great things Shawn does, dude can not apply a single submission hold properly other than the short arm scissors, it's almost comical how bad his figure four is. Other than those gripes, everything else was damn good. ****1/4

Batista vs Undertaker Cyber Sunday- Cal brought this up and claimed he liked it just as much as WM, I didn't remember it being quite that good so I decided to give it another watch. Taker spends a lot of the match working the shoulder, which is cool but Batista totally stops selling it. Cena doing that in his WM23 match with HBK is what caused me to give Taker/Tista the MotN, so I'd be a hypocrit to not mention it. Otherwise, damn fine match and there really isn't a thing I'd change about it. The ending with Taker requiring 2 straight Batista Bombs is just :mark: ****1/4


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

:mark: the tag match opens No Mercy 02 :mark:.

KOTR 02 main event is ok. But not even 6 minutes long. They had a better match at Vengeance.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Just going through random PPV cards to see if any matches interest me: What's Chavo/Rey NWO 04 like? Says it's 17 minutes, which kinda' puts me off, but it's Chavo vs. Rey ffs. Thoughts?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Alright I'll do NM, Cal's review will be better though :lol.

Not watching right now though, I gotta go get a haircut


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Best Chavo Jr match ever. Yet a match I never watch to see again.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Lesnar/Test from KOTR was a solid slugfest too, and iirc Hogan/Angle is watchable. Everything else is a blur or sucks.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Callamus said:


> :mark: the tag match opens No Mercy 02 :mark:.
> 
> KOTR 02 main event is ok. But not even 6 minutes long. They had a better match at Vengeance.


The main event on KOTR was Taker vs Trips, not Brock vs RVD, remember? 8*D



FluxCapacitor said:


> Just going through random PPV cards to see if any matches interest me: What's Chavo/Rey NWO 04 like? Says it's 17 minutes, which kinda' puts me off, but it's Chavo vs. Rey ffs. Thoughts?


Awesome match. Not as great as GAB, but plenty strong for their normal chemistry.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

zep81 said:


> What are the opinions on Team Angle vs Guerrero/Tajiri ladder match from JD'03?


Team Angle vs Los Guerrero's at Backlash 03 is :lenny


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Hell and a Cell is tonight right ?


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Yes it is, skins.



FluxCapacitor said:


> Just going through random PPV cards to see if any matches interest me: What's Chavo/Rey NWO 04 like? Says it's 17 minutes, which kinda' puts me off, but it's Chavo vs. Rey ffs. Thoughts?


Awesome match. Worth a watch.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

CENA in only a few hours. It's been too long John-boy...

:cena3


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Primer said:


> The main event on KOTR was Taker vs Trips, not Brock vs RVD, remember? 8*D


LALALALALALALALALALALALALALALALALA NOT LISTENING LALALALALALALALALALALALALALALALALA


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Watching the Austin documentary. An Austin/Rock rivalry set like the Bret/HBK one NEEDS to happen. It just makes too much sense. The sit down could be with someone like Jericho. Obviously there is not the personal drama like there was with Bret and Shawn but Austin/Rock was just off the charts. The match listing would be damn good as well. Finally the main event in Survivor Series 2001 can be released on a set.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

John -boy is gonna elevate the world title :agree:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

John boy , Del rio , bryan and HEARTBREAK :mark: cant wait

That Cena/Batista LMS is a MUST WATCH for me, their Otl is that bad Cody ? I'm pretty high on their mania match and ss 08 was very good also


Cena = WHC :mark:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

In his video Cal forgot about the main reason most people dislike Barrett - because he's English :evil:

But yeah, I would contest since I'm a Barrett mark myself (one of about two or three in this thread) but instead, two other reasons I'd expect there - both his finishers aren't good, *especially* the Wasteland which is awful; his unfortunate (lack of) personality.

Next should be Top 5 Reasons Cal Loves Taker/Austin BL '02 8*D


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Callamus said:


> LALALALALALALALALALALALALALALALALA NOT LISTENING LALALALALALALALALALALALALALALALALA


:hayley3



redskins25 said:


> John boy , Del rio , bryan and HEARTBREAK :mark: cant wait
> 
> That Cena/Batista LMS is a MUST WATCH for me, their Otl is that bad Cody ? I'm pretty high on their mania match and ss 08 was very good also
> 
> ...


Yep, OTL match is trash.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I kinda felt the finishers fit into the ring work and lack of personality kinda fit into #4 . And "people" might not like Barrett because he's English but my list isn't "top 5 reasons OTHER PEOPLE hate Wade Barrett" so there! 

Well NM ain't doing well on the CAL SCALE so far. 2 matches in and we are at -0.5. MINUS ZERO POINT FIVE. LOL.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

redskins25 said:


> Cena = WHC :mark:


While I foresee Cena winning, too, wanna take a bet how many people flip their lids when Cena wins after ADR locks in his armbar on that "recovered" arm?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

redskins25 said:


> John boy , Del rio , bryan and HEARTBREAK :mark: cant wait
> 
> That Cena/Batista LMS is a MUST WATCH for me, their Otl is that bad Cody ? I'm pretty high on their mania match and ss 08 was very good also
> 
> ...


*John Cena vs Chris Jericho - Survivor Series 2008*

'From the History Of The WHC Championship DVD':

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-m...icho-survivor-series-2008-a.html#post25621985

There you go Skins


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Yep, OTL match is trash.


Disappointing 


Murderface, I returned the favor via rep after the marvelous one that is in my cp now rton2


Edit: @ Zep Thank you soo much man

@ Rah you cant imagine the wwe section tomorrow


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Out of curiosity, people prefer SummerSlam 2011 or 2013?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

And for Cactus Jack:

*Owen Hart vs British Bulldog - WWF Raw 03.03.1997*

The fabulous match from German for the Euro Championship

'From the Hart and Soul DVD':

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-m...ulldog-wwf-raw-03-03-1997-a.html#post25622081


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

ATF said:


> Out of curiosity, people prefer SummerSlam 2011 or 2013?


very tough question, 2011 is on of my favorite ppv of all time, loved the build and some of the match on it

I'll say 2013 by a hair

best Summerslams are 1) 2002 2) 2013 3) 2011 4) 2001 IMO


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

zep81 said:


> And for Cactus Jack:
> 
> *Owen Hart vs British Bulldog - WWF Raw 03.03.1997*
> 
> ...


Your the best Zeppers thanks a lot! 

P.s. That Bam bam/Vader vs Steiner's tag you sent me was absolutely fantastic, much appreciated.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Agree 100% with redskins' list. 2002>2011>2013>2001. We really take 2011 for granted.

What NM is KillaCal reviewing?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

2002 motherfuuuuukkkaaaaaaaaaaaaa


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Agree 100% with redskins' list. 2002>2011>2013>2001. We really take 2011 for granted.
> 
> What NM is KillaCal reviewing?


skins' list had 2013 > 2011.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

DEL RIO to pull out a shocking victory tonight please.



ATF said:


> Out of curiosity, people prefer SummerSlam 2011 or 2013?


2013. The power of the double main event outdoes the power of 2011's versions. Plus Christian/Del Rio was better than anything else on the 2011 card.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Wow did I tweak out or what? I meant to put 2013 above 2011. Foolish me ique2

I thought I was crazy when I enjoyed a Ryback/Khali match. But I think I actually like two Public Enemy matches. It's shocking enough to only like half a Public Enemy match.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Another funny Cal video.

When you were talking about his fans it was like you were calling out Pyro. :lol


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Pyro did come to mind .


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Y'all just watch this:






Not a SierraHotelIndiaEchoLimaDelta fan.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Just finished Owen vs Davey Boy EC Match on Raw. I can safely say that's the best match Bulldog ever had, that tops Seasons Beatings for me. I also think it might be my new favorite Raw match ever. Having JR on commentary instead of that harsh German made all of the difference in the world. My favorite Raw matches to this point have been:

Mr. Perfect vs Ric Flair Loser Leaves Town
HBK vs Marty Jannety IC Title
Bret Hart vs 1-2-3 Kid
Owen/Davey Boy vs HBK/Stone Cold
Mankind vs Owen
Owen vs Davey Boy European Championship 
Cactus Jack vs Hunter Hearst Helmsley FCA MSG
Mankind vs The Rock (sentimental reasons, Foley winning the title is my number 1 mark out moment of all time)
Jericho vs Trips WWE Title 2000
Jericho/Benoit vs Two Man Power Trip
Jeff Hardy vs Taker Ladder Match for WWE Title
Eddie vs RVD Ladder Match IC Title
HBK vs Trips 2003
HBK vs Shelton Benjamin
Trips vs Shelton Benjamin
HBK vs Benoit
HBK vs Cena 2007 England
Punk vs Regal IC Title Chicago
Mark Henry vs Punk No DQ
Cena vs Punk Raw 2013
Rhodes Bros vs The Shield Raw 2013

Edit- ATF that's priceless :lmao

ITS STILL REAL FOR HIM DAMMIT!!!!


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Which HBK/Jannetty match?  I can never remember which is which but one of them is always pimped as being ZOMGAMAZBALLS and the other forgotten about, and I MUCH prefer the forgotten match.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Which HBK/Jannetty match?  I can never remember which is which but one of them is always pimped as being ZOMGAMAZBALLS and the other forgotten about, and I MUCH prefer the forgotten match.



It's probably the one you hate, hahaha, that seems to be the trend here, I really like something and you hate it haha. It's the one where HBK being the arrogant cunt that he is comes out and says he will defend his IC title against anyone anytime anywhere. Marty comes out in a hooded sweatshirt, when he pulls the hood back the roof blows off and shit is just ON.

What's the forgotten one? I'd like to see it if it's so much better, because I think I've only just seen the one.

For the record, I don't think it's OMGBALLZ, If I was ranking the list of matches I just typed it would probably be near or at the bottom, but it's still one of my 15 or so favorite Raw matches.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

There's the May 17th match which I *think* is the one people jizz over. Marty wins the IC belt so probably. Then there is the Jul 19th one where HBK beats Marty.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> There's the May 17th match which I *think* is the one people jizz over. Marty wins the IC belt so probably. Then there is the Jul 19th one where HBK beats Marty.




Yea, Marty wins in the one I was talking about. Let me see if I can find that July 19th match anywhere to compare.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

It's 5/17 cal, adore that match, nice list cjack, makes me smile others love that match too, you know what I really don't like that hbk/Shelton gold rush match


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Forgot to pimp Punk vs Regal for the IC title on Raw, that's a good one too.

I dig that Trips/Shelton match, love the underdog story they tell. When Shelton does that "this close" gesture to Hunter and Trips makes that "oh shit" face? :mark:

Edit: fuck me I forgot a MAJOR one, Cactus Jacks big return at MSG vs Hunter in 1997 Falls Count Anywhere :mark: :mark: :mark: That 3 faces of Foley promo before the match is one of my favorite things ever, and that entire match is just one giant mark out moment after another for me. That's top 5 for my favorite Raw matches/moments, easily.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Punk/Regal IC title match in Chicago is :mark:. I remember seeing them at the time and being a little disappointed with them. And then I got Punk's Bluray and watched the Chicago match again and was all :mark: because it's actually awesome.

I still love HBK/Shelton. Always pleasantly surprised that the entire match holds up as being great instead of it JUST being a match with THAT FINISH. HHH/Shelton matches are tons of funk fun too. First is great. Been ages since I watched any of them though.

WWF tag title match is up next on NM 02 :mark:.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Yea I feel like a tool for forgetting that Cactus Jack match when my FUCKING USERNAME is Cactus Jack, and that Punk IC title match in Chicago was when I really started liking Punk, I didn't follow the indies and only saw a few of his ECW matches during that time, that match with Regal made me realize he was a keeper in WWE.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

The Texas 10 man is my favourite Raw match ever. Encapsulates everything I love about pro wrestling.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Texas Tag is sweeeeet.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cena/Y2j svs 08 was excellent, a story driven match so it was right up my alley, I finally understand why you guys praise it : it is very good, excellent neck work by Y2j and babyface perfermance by Cena


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> Cena/Y2j svs 08 was excellent, a story driven match so it was right up my alley, I finally understand why you guys praise it : it is very good, excellent neck work by Y2j and babyface perfermance by Cena



Yep that match is tops. I'm hoping we get something in that league from Cena/ADR HiaC tonight. ADR cannot for the life of him make me give the slightest fuck about his character, but the dude can work, more specifically he can work a body part. I'm hoping he brings the viciousness from PB 2013 to this match.

Edit- what's the Texas 10 Man? I'm betting it's something obvious but I'm drawing a total blank....


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Not too sure what the Texas tag is but it might be the 10 man tag match on Raw a week or two before No Way Out 2000. Radicalz & DX vs Rock n Sock & Too Cool



zep81 said:


> *John Cena vs Chris Jericho - Survivor Series 2008*
> 
> 'From the History Of The WHC Championship DVD':
> 
> ...


Can you upload Rey Mysterio vs Orton from that DVD? I already have the Smackdown show but if the DVD version is in better quality, then it's good to have. Thanks in advance. 



ATF said:


> Out of curiosity, people prefer SummerSlam 2011 or 2013?


2013 easily. The former has Orton/Christian which rules but nothing else really stands out the same way 2013 has two excellent MOTY candidates plus another great title match and a wonderful ending. :mark:



Callamus said:


> I kinda felt the finishers fit into the ring work and lack of personality kinda fit into #4 . And "people" might not like Barrett because he's English but my list isn't "top 5 reasons OTHER PEOPLE hate Wade Barrett" so there!
> 
> Well NM ain't doing well on the CAL SCALE so far. 2 matches in and we are at -0.5. MINUS ZERO POINT FIVE. LOL.


Just watched that Barrett video. :lmao I wish there was more than 3 but #3 was hilarious. Barrett fans are admittedly part of the reason I love seeing him get buried.

Benoit/Angle vs Rey/Edge and HIAC should redeem NM with ease.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I always get mixed up between those two Marty/HBK matches lol, think i like the one that is on the Raw: The Beginning Set (whichever date that is).


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah the DX/Radicals Vs Rock & Sock & 2 Cool & Rikishi is the TEXAS TAG. Molton crowd, great action, super tag.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Not too sure what the Texas tag is but it might be the 10 man tag match on Raw a week or two before No Way Out 2000. Radicalz & DX vs Rock n Sock & Too Cool


Yep, check my sig 



> Can you upload Rey Mysterio vs Orton from that DVD? I already have the Smackdown show but if the DVD version is in better quality, then it's good to have. Thanks in advance.


Yeah mate, ill try and get it sorted tomorrow. I was taking a break lol but ill squeeze a couple in this week


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Starting NM 2002, only match I have seen from here is the ME. Which was fabulous.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

smitty915 said:


> Starting NM 2002, only match I have seen from here is the ME. Which was fabulous.


Well you are certainly in for a treat! A mediocre treat, but a treat none the less!!!


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Really? card looks great


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

MEH.

The only matches that interest me are SHIELD & Cena/Rio.

Our chain gang commander is making his triumphant return, y'all excited?

:cena3


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

zep81 said:


> Yep, check my sig


Thanks, is the quality better than the ones that are up on YT and DM?



> Yeah mate, ill try and get it sorted tomorrow. I was taking a break lol but ill squeeze a couple in this week


Cool. Looks like your break will never take off. 



smitty915 said:


> Starting NM 2002, only match I have seen from here is the ME. Which was fabulous.


Be prepared for two new MOTY candidates!


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The opening tag is fantastic and the Benoit/angle vs edge/Rey tag is all sorts of fun. Solid show no doubt. That main event though :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

You know there was a point in my life I really was apart of cenation :lol, not saying it like I dislike him not which isnt the case, but I was apart of the chain Gang


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I liked Cena when I watched wrestling when I was like 10-13( 08-2011) but then I stopped watching for 2 years. Now I'm 16 and cant stand the guy's character


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

From where I sit, Cena has 4 MOTY's (2007, 2008, 2011, 2012) and is a member of multiple classic matches every year; he's one of the greatest ever and I don't think that it's too disputable at this point without mentioning Cena's "character". One of the true legends in the history of business and the biggest wrestling legend of our current era, that's retty fucking cool.

Also, he's been in two of maybe the 6 or 7 all time AMAZING contests that WWE has had over it`s inception. BOSS.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Our chain gang commander is making his triumphant return, y'all excited?
> 
> :cena3


:kenny

Got some beers reserved for tonight and tomorrow night. Usually makes things better with a little buzz. Pretty sure Shawn doesn't turn heel, but still counts the pin with Orton winning.

I'd dispute the Cena 2012 MOTY though. For me personally, Trips/Taker and Punk/Bryan are better. I like Cena/Lesnar a lot, but I still can't get over the finish. Ruined the redemption story a bit, also.


----------



## Emotion Blur (May 7, 2012)

Picked a random match to watch on Youtube and went with:

*JBL vs Big Show - Barbed Wire Cage Match - No Way Out 2005*

Please note, this is like 1% review and 99% fun. I know wrestling shouldn't be taken seriously, it's fake and I'll never enjoy the product if I try to make sense of things, wrestling wouldn't be fun if it always followed logic, I have way too much time on my hands, blahblahblah. I don't have any emotional attachment to this match and I don't do it for every match, so yeah...



Spoiler: Long read, had no idea I typed that much



While I loved the brutality behind the match, I think it moved at an awkward pace with a lot of stopping-and-starting and psychology was almost non-existent. The false finishes halfway through the match were anti-climactic and were followed with crickets rightfully. Big Show gets clobbered with bolt cutters and a CFH--lazy kick-out at 2. JBL gets hit with the chokeslam--lazy kick out at 2. It was like they went "well we have to make them believe we can't pin each other, let's just get our finishers out of the way." 

The biggest problem I had with the match was that clearly the selling point the match is the barbed wire, but it's only at the very top of the cage where the only way it could hurt you is if you make the effort to climb up to it and hurt yourself on purpose. It makes any spots up there damn near impossible--you can't throw your opponent up there, you can't push your opponent over them without fear of losing the match. Even standing on the top ropes, the best they could do was hit their heads on the cage itself. So literally the only "spot" involving the wire was when JBL tried to cut it with the boltcutters. And since they couldn't use the wire, they had to blade more to compensate. I get that the wire was meant to make it 10000x more difficult to escape over the cage, but that difficulty equates to some slow "I'm up here, now what" moments. _(Side-questions: If JBL's Cabinet had boltcutters, why didn't they just cut the chain to the door? And what was Orlando Jordan hoping to accomplish by immediately climbing up the cage and dangling from it?)_ 

The chokeslam through the ring spot was beautiful, but it was followed by 20 minutes of Show stalling then going "oh, I should probably try and win the match now." Even Cole calls Show out on why he just doesn't pin JBL, but okay, let's pretend that for some reason, Show can't put his foot on JBL for three seconds. But the "celebrate slowly before I've actually won" spot? Aughhhhh. It didn't look like Show was struggling to get out of the cage (which I'd buy even though it never felt like Big Show was truly on the losing end during the match), so there was NO excitement or drama to be had from his escaping the cage _(side-question: If Show has the ability to break steel chains with his bare hands, why didn't he do it earlier in the match? Is it like his WMD where it's easy to do, but requires some build-up)_. By the time he FINALLY lands his foot on the floor, you could hear a pin drop (now I don't know if it was because no one gives a shit about Show, or if the crowd was aware of the impending screwy finish). Regardless, it was a bit convoluted that the bell would ring EXACTLY when Show's foot hit and yet the announcer was so quick to call JBL the winner. So we have a few scenarios *(CONSPIRACY TIME)*:

a) JBL and Show escaped at the exact same time and JBL gets the victory due to a draw.
b) Show hits first, the bell rings, the ref sees JBL escaped and just assumes JBL was out first. The ref then immediately guns it to Chimel and tells him that JBL won before the wrong call is made.
c) JBL escapes first, just as the ref gets to the timekeeper telling him to ring the bell, Show's foot hits and it just seems like the bell was ringing for him.

One problem with the scenarios is the fact that the Timekeeper was so dead on in timing the bell with Show and the refs at no point acknowledge that. If Show and JBL escaped at roughly the same time, shouldn't the refs have discussed the finish to decide if MAYBE one guy hit before the other? Presumably there was a ref (and the rest of the world) watching Show and another ref watching JBL crawling out. I'm not talking Instant Replay, but how many times have there been "two winners" where the refs bicker over who won? So since no one bickered, it must've been obvious to ALL the refs that JBL escaped first (even though seemingly only one had a vantage point of JBL). But that doesn't explain why the bell rang EXACTLY as Show hit (because, again that brings us back to the point of them escaping at the same time!). It's also possible the refs were all able to agree within milliseconds that JBL and Show hit undoubtedly at the same fraction of a second, therefore a draw, therefore JBL retains, no bickering necessary (a tad unlikely though).

The replay of JBL escaping from the under the apron tells us nothing besides the fact that there was no ref watching him for the most part. Just as a ref DOES see him, the replay ends, giving us no indication of when the bell rings or how the refs react. Though it should be noted that you can't see JBL's feet touching the floor at all during the replay, which is pretty much the golden rule of all "escape the ring" matches.

Breaking this down, this finish is an absolute clusterfuck factoring in incompetent refs, beautifully-timed bell rings, Tony Chimel's lightning-fast announcing, misleading camera angles (and the ability for all of those things to be in-sync with each other so well). Augh, this all could've been avoided if the bell had run a few seconds earlier while Show was on the steps, if they had showed JBL escaping, if they showed a ref talking to Chimel, if the refs had a discussion, etc. Wouldn't have changed Show's belief that he won initially and we'd get the same ending. None of this is helped by the fact that Big Show looks more bored at the idea of being WWE Champion than he is "I just went through a war, I can't sell happiness right now," making it obvious he knew he wasn't the winner. And the fact that the cameramen conveniently knew not to show JBL crawling out.

The match ends with The Cabinet running out again to save JBL (I guess Teddy doesn't give a damn now since the match is over). For some reason Orlando Jordan is now shirtless. Batista comes out to a nice pop to clean house. Cena comes out for no reason (beyond being No. 1 contender) to beat the hell out of a limping, tired JBL, who's just trying to leave and won his match fair and square. The show closes with Cena's music. Show/JBL ends with Batista/Cena taunting each other :lmao


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Can't think of any year myself where Cena has had the MOTY . He's still really good though, but a lot of times these days he's stuck in a formula that's kinda shitty and without a superior opponent to work off he doesn't deliver much.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Just rewatched the SS '13 Triple Main Event, and it's still as :mark: as ever. Wonder if it's comparable to ER 2012's :hmm:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

What's your 2011 MOTY cal? Most I've run in to say its Cena/Punk MITB..

Fuck, its TRips/Taker isn'T IT?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Aye, Undertaker ruling the planet once again. MOTY from 05-2011 .


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Aye, Undertaker ruling the planet once again. MOTY from 05-2011 .




Cal, I think it's officially time to take you out back and put you down. It's Old Yeller time. You just said Taker/Trips WM27 > Punk/Cena MitB. That's it, let me go get my 12 Guage and bring you out behind the barn so we can get this over with


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Wow. I like Trips/Taker, but I really think Punk/Cena is so much better.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

Just watched the Dustin Rhodes/Big Van Vader match that Cactus pimped out in this thread. Vader toying with Dustin Rhodes at the start, leading to Dustin Rhodes exploding on Vader. In the end, Dustin gets distracted by Harley Race which leaves Vader to capitalize on Dustin and win the match. Awesomely worked match. Tempted to give it ★★★★ but I'll leave it at ★★★¾. 

Reminds me a bit of the Daniel Bryan vs Mark Henry match from Smackdown 11/4/11 (a match that should be checked out if you haven't seen it yet). Different match-formulas of course along with a different type of finish to it but similar in regards of the babyface trying to find ways to keep the monster heel down. 

Now in the mood to watch some Barry Windham.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao at Cactus Jack forgetting about not one, but TWO Cactus Jack RAW matches. And :lmao at KillaCal's fandom of Taker carrying on for 2011 but not 2012 for MOTY choices. I would have thought that 2011 would be the one year where Cal picks a non-Taker match as the number one choice.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> :lmao at Cactus Jack forgetting about not one, but TWO Cactus Jack RAW matches. And :lmao at KillaCal's fandom of Taker carrying on for 2011 but not 2012 for MOTY choices. I would have thought that 2011 would be the one year where Cal picks a non-Taker match as the number one choice.


I am hating myself for it more and more as each moment passes. My excuse? I was distracted by this dreadful Giants game where my Gmen pulled out one of the ugliest wins in recent memory. That's my story and I'm sticking to it 

P.s. You're crazy, Henry's new look is so much more badass than before, and that's hard to accomplish considering how mean he looked before. KIMBO SLICE AINT GOT SHIT ON ME!!!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nobody hates really hates John Cena. Secretly everyone's favorite wrestler.

The big shirts, the cargo shorts, the HUSTLE. Man is who we all want to be.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

HUSTLE.

LOYALTY.

RESPECT.

He's elevated himself over everybody else to be arguably the greatest WWE Champion ever in the ring, that's special. When I say he's the "Greatest WWE Champion Ever", I mean when you just judge his work in WWE Championship matches, there's nobody better. Cena's WWE Championship matches that I have at four stars or over;

Vs JBL (Judgment Day 2005)
Vs HHH (Wrestlemania XXII)
Vs HHH Vs Edge (Backlash 2006)
Vs Umaga (New Year's Revolution 2007)
Vs Umaga (Royal Rumble 2007)
Vs HBK (Wrestlemania XXIII)
Backlash 2007 Fatal Four Way
Vs Randy Orton (No Way Out 2008)
Vs Randy Orton (Breaking Point 2009)
Vs HHH Vs HBK (Survivor Series 2009)
Vs Batista (Extreme Rules 2010)
VS CM Punk (MITB 2011)
Vs Rey Mysterio (RAW 2011)
Vs CM Punk (Summerslam 2011)
Vs Alberto Del Rio (Vengeance 2011)
Vs CM Punk (Night of Champions 2011)
Vs Mark Henry (MITB 2013)
Vs Daniel Bryan (Summerslam 2013)

:cena3


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> HUSTLE.
> 
> LOYALTY.
> 
> ...


Not hard to do with the amount of lengthy reigns he's been given. :cena5


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

CURTIS AXEL IS INJURED!! PRESHOW CANCELED!! 

This is a glorious day! Let's hope he is stripped of the title! 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...tle-match-pulled-from-wwe-hell-in-a-cell-card


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

MOTY TALK! YAY! LIST TIME! :mark: :

03: Benoit/Angle RR
04: Eddie/JBL JD
05: Batista/HHH Veng.
06: Taker/Angle NWO
07: Taker/Batista WM23
08: Taker/Edge SS
09: Taker/HBK WM25
10: Taker/HBK WM26
11: Punk/Cena MITB
12: Punk/Bryan OTL
13: Punk/Lesnar SS (so far)

Taker ruled the lists 2006-2010. Punk's been ruling 2011-2013. Wonder who Punk will have MOTY with next year? unk2
Cena's had maybe two matches I'd consider classics, certainly not two of the best seven or whatever.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Inb4 they pull an *18 secondz* on Axel/Big E if it happens 8*D


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Cal, I think *it's officially time to take you out back and put you down. It's Old Yeller time.* You just said Taker/Trips WM27 > Punk/Cena MitB. That's it, let me go get my 12 Guage and bring you out behind the barn so we can get this over with


Where have I heard this besides the movie ? Oh yea :hbk2 :flair

I like Cena, he has had MOTY 3x IMO in( punk/cena, cena/hbk, cena/lesnar) however I havent seen that much 2007 and punk/bryan otl really went up on last watch


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> From where I sit, Cena has 4 MOTY's (2007, 2008, 2011, 2012) and is a member of multiple classic matches every year; he's one of the greatest ever and I don't think that it's too disputable at this point without mentioning Cena's "character". One of the true legends in the history of business and the biggest wrestling legend of our current era, that's retty fucking cool.
> 
> Also, he's been in two of maybe the 6 or 7 all time AMAZING contests that WWE has had over it`s inception. BOSS.


I don't have the previous years to go back on, but he was definitely in my MotY for 2011, and Cena/Lesnar was a fantastic pairing that should be very, very high on the list for that year. As for this year, he's in three of the top 10 matches (#1 Punk, #3 Bryan, #7 Henry). The only guy close to that is Punk with two (#1 Cena, #2 'Taker), who I'd say has had more poo-poo in terms of week-in-week-out performance. If we're going to count performance when it matters, though, then I'd agree with that statement. He nails it on the big-times.



Callamus said:


> Can't think of any year myself where Cena has had the MOTY . He's still really good though, but a lot of times these days he's stuck in a formula that's kinda shitty and without a superior opponent to work off he doesn't deliver much.


Guy delivers well with bland opponents. Khali makes a sad wave toward you. He's been in far too many good matches, with better performances to boot, to be leveled as only good when he has better opponents. Though I feel this thread (well, past iterations) have had this discussion before.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I mean, I'm going back and comparing Cena's list of classic Championship matches and it isn't even close; nobody touches the guy.

That might be unfair due to the fact that Cena has been in so many WWE Championship matches, but I can't knock him for that.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Thoughts on Kane/HHH from NM 2002? I know they had a fun match at one point, forget where it was though.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Their NM bout is a big DUD for me. It was a long garbage match

If you want to watch something from NM02 watch the Tag Team 2002 MOTY ****3/4 for it


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

NW# Ric Flair and The Four Horsemen :mark:


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Holy crap, all this Cena talk just reminded me that he's returning tonight! That tonight's Hell in a Cell! I'M MARKING OUT BRO!



Oh wait, no I'm not. <_<


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

It fucking sucks, like most HHH/Kane matches do.

Their Mask Vs Title match is one of the worst HHH matches ever, those two have no chemistry at all apart from the Backlash 2001 tag & the Judgment Day 2001 chain match which was really fucking fun. Everything else is fucking trash though.

WHO KNOWS? Maybe Cena can win the belt and carry Sandow to something finally worth watching 8*D.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> WHO KNOWS? Maybe Cena can win the belt and carry Sandow to something finally worth watching 8*D.


Or maybe he just drops it to Sandow via cash-in and Cena fucks off so I don't have to have a heart attack every time they face each other for the belt thinking Cena's gonna cut Sandow's reign short. 

Sandow and Cena did actually have a match together though on Main Event about a year ago. I haven't seen it since then, but don't remember thinking much of it.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

A Sandow vs Del Rio vs Cena match at Survivour Series would make me pretty happy. Or a Del Rio vs Ziggler vs Cena, with Sandow cashing it after it ends


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

NAH I already like Sandow's work with Sheamus, he's okay in my books for now.

I'm thinking they do Cena/Sandow/Del Rio at the Survivor Series. Just a HUNCH.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Or Sandow/ADR/*Rey*. Or Sandow/ADR/*Henry*. Or Sandow/ADR/either Real American.

See, possibilities are endless.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Rah said:


> Guy delivers well with bland opponents. Khali makes a sad wave toward you. He's been in far too many good matches, with better performances to boot, to be leveled as only good when he has better opponents. Though I feel this thread (well, past iterations) have had this discussion before.


I agree with that completely... BUT that was a couple of years ago. I did say in my post that recently he has been unable to do that. It's only the last 2 years maybe that without a genuinely good-great worker, he just can't pull out anything special. Hell half the time it looks like he isn't TRYING to pull out anything special. Just some generic super Cena formula that bores me to shit .

And yeah, Undertaker/HHH WM 27 > Cena/Punk MITB 2011. COME AT ME BITCHES. WM 28 would have continued Undertaker's MOTY STREAK had it not been for Bryan/Punk. This year Punk beats him again thanks to LESNAR.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> That might be unfair due to the fact that Cena has been in so many WWE Championship matches, but I can't knock him for that.


Perhaps I'm not thinking this through but, surely if he has more matches than others, he has more opportunity to be shown out for being less talented? I suppose it's rather about ratios (#good:#bad) but we don't much time to do that for everyone.



Callamus said:


> And yeah, Undertaker/HHH WM 27 > Cena/Punk MITB 2011. COME AT ME BITCHES.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

WWE screwed Sandow up, he won MitB wayyyyy to early and now he can't win the WHC without taking an even bigger crap on the legitimacy of that belt. It sucks, because I like Sandow as a character but he needs a lot more seasoning in the ring before I see him pulling off a ****+ match in a main event. They jump started him with the win then buried him on TV for weeks, it makes ZERO sense. Cody should have won, and I think that's blatantly obvious to all parties right now. 

I hope Cena wins tonight and has the WHC for a few months atleast, add some credibility to it after ADR took another big crapperoo on that beautiful belt.


When is WWE gonna realize that in order for titles to have legitimacy, the BEST guys need to have the belts? This is a problem that's been going on for a while. The top full time guys right now are Cena, Punk, Orton, and Bryan. Them right below them are Sheamus, Henry, and Big Show. Only those 7 guys should have the top 2 titles. They need to build guys and get them up to that level before handing them a belt. Sandow, Cody, ADR, Cesaro, etc need the slow constant push to the top. This isn't rocket science.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Yeah, the only Trips/Kane singles match worth watching is probably the chain match, which is pretty fun.

Also, I decided since I've watched the HIAC events, that I'll check out some other HIAC matches. Starting with Orton/Taker. After the atrocity that was Cena/Orton in 2009, I'm pretty sure that Legend Killer Orton > Viper Orton inside the cell.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Cactus Jack said:


> WWE screwed Sandow up, he won MitB wayyyyy to early and now he can't win the WHC without taking an even bigger crap on the legitimacy of that belt. It sucks, because I like Sandow as a character but he needs a lot more seasoning in the ring before I see him pulling off a ****+ match in a main event. They jump started him with the win then buried him on TV for weeks, it makes ZERO sense. Cody should have won, and I think that's blatantly obvious to all parties right now.


See, I think Sandow is already more than capable of having **** main event matches, and I don't think it was a mistake to have him win over Cody. I'd put him comfortably over Cody in every category of the business except in-ring work. He can certainly carry a feud and I have no doubt we'd get many entertaining segments with him as champion. Match-wise though he rarely gets more than 5 minutes. When he's World champ though, they might actually give him 10+ minute matches and we'll see what he can really do consistently. 

The problem with Sandow getting the world title though is and the true mistake on WWE's part (which might not even be a mistake for all we know), as you said, is they buried him right after the win. In fact, you'd be hard-pressed to find a win on his end since winning MITB. That's WWE's fault though, not Sandow's. It looks like they've started giving him some wins on Main Event and Superstars, even having him defeat Ziggler on Main Event last week (although he's getting jobbed out now himself, but it's still his most notable win since winning MITB). Obviously it would be nice if they gave him wins on Raw and Smackdown, but I'd rather they keep him off the main shows and have him win on the smaller ones, than wrestle and lose all the time on those big shows.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> I'm pretty sure that Legend Killer Orton > Viper Orton inside the cell.


I'm also pretty sure Legend Killer Orton > Viper Orton in pretty much everything. rton2 :rko2


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

:rko2

Orton's GOATing inside the cell right now. His selling is pretty awesome. He lost this ability somewhere around 2007-2008.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Sandrone said:


> See, I think Sandow is already more than capable of having **** main event matches, and I don't think it was a mistake to have him win over Cody. I'd put him comfortably over Cody in every category of the business except in-ring work. He can certainly carry a feud and I have no doubt we'd get many entertaining segments with him as champion. Match-wise though he rarely gets more than 5 minutes. When he's World champ though, they might actually give him 10+ minute matches and we'll see what he can really do consistently.
> 
> The problem with Sandow getting the world title though is and the true mistake on WWE's part (which might not even be a mistake for all we know), as you said, is they buried him right after the win. In fact, you'd be hard-pressed to find a win on his end since winning MITB. That's WWE's fault though, not Sandow's. It looks like they've started giving him some wins on Main Event and Superstars, even having him defeat Ziggler on Main Event last week (although he's getting jobbed out now himself, but it's still his most notable win since winning MITB). Obviously it would be nice if they gave him wins on Raw and Smackdown, but I'd rather they keep him off the main shows and have him win on the smaller ones, than wrestle and lose all the time on those big shows.




I'm certainly not going to argue with you about whether or not Sandow is capable of having ****+ Main Event matches, I'm sure you've seen a ton more of his work than I have. That said, I have seen 10-15 of his matches, but none of them really went the distance. I think the best root for him as far as in ring success goes is to use more of that mean streak we've seen lately. Instead of always being the coward, he needs to keep getting pissed and just beating down opponents with strikes, like I've seen him do lately. As I said, I am a fan of his character, and think he could be a real asset in the future, I would just prefer to see a guy establish a legacy of quality matches and high caliber feuds before he wins the WHC.

None of this is Sandows fault. WWE has been doing an awful job developing mid card feuds for the past several years. It's like they can only handle 1-2 story lines at a time, with no time left for the mid card or tag team division. Luckily, they have been putting more work into the tag team division this past year, but that really hasn't gone beyond the Hell No-Shield and Shield-Rhodes Bros feud. We need teams and mid carders wrestling for more than just the tag team belts/IC title/US title. That's the one aspect of the AE I like more than today, they had story lines and feuds for all the divisions and levels of the card.

At any rate, my point is, I think the WWE has the talent they need to be successful for a lot of years, they just need to show a more consistent effort developing and establishing said talent and quit doing this stop/start push thing. Poor Dolph has been messed around with so much these past 2 years it's almost criminal. Punishing wrestlers for comments or backstage actions by burying them on TV is the most self defeating, idiotic, thing ever. The only people who suffer when that happens are the fans, the whole reason you have the freaking WWE. They should just fine guys for the smaller offenses, or if it's bad enough, fire them. Burying them just hurts us, the fans. So dumb.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Cal you should have mentioned Barrett's entrance. I want to punch him in the face when he does that thing with his mouth and moves his head up and down and randomly shakes his fist and then goes 'boom' (...or whatever, it's annoying as fuck) while punching.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> :rko2
> 
> Orton's GOATing inside the cell right now. His selling is pretty awesome. He lost this ability somewhere around 2007-2008.


He's still boss when it comes to selling, but he's more subtle and doesn't bounce around like he used to.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah1993 said:


> Cal you should have mentioned Barrett's entrance. I want to punch him in the face when he does that thing with his mouth and moves his head up and down and randomly shakes his fist and then goes 'boom' (...or whatever, it's annoying as fuck) while punching.


TBH I probably should have done... any research before I did the video. I haven't watched anything the guy has done in like, a year outside of finishes to matches . Plus I was in a rush to get something down so I could record it in the 30 minute window of time I had.

2 matches left on NM 02. Took a break after Kane/HHH .


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> He's still boss when it comes to selling, but he's more subtle and doesn't bounce around like he used to.


I've said this before, when Orton gets hit in the head with a knock out shot, be it a chair, stairs, a kick, punch, whatever, his "Out on his feet" selling is the best I've ever seen. The way he just slumps over then crumples to the ground in a heap looks so damn good. The best knockout shot I've ever seen is when Foley clocks him in the head with that lid at Backlash 2004. So beastly :mark:


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Watched Cal's top 5 reasons for hating Barrett, I was not disappointed! :lmao Great work Cal, even though I disagree with just about everything you said.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

*Cena/Edge LMS Backlash 2009 - **** DAT FU INTO DA FANS* :mark: :mark: :mark: 

*Cena/Trips/Orton NOC 2009 - ***1/2 DAT DOUBLE TAP OUT *

HIAC tonight. Will watch in the morning. I welcome the fuckery. It's happening no matter what. 

Everybody loves Cena. We will all rejoice when he is our new world champion. Join the CeNation. Hustle. Loyalty. Respect. 

:cena2


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

TBH, whether Sandow cashes in or not, I am hoping Cena takes the title off Del Rio. He's the lesser of those two evils, and Del Rio's title reign has gone on long enough.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Still a lot of love for Orton/Taker inside the cell. Taker beats ass early, but Orton gets time to work over Taker. Bob Orton sure is dedicated - guy wasn't even inside the cell when he got busted open. (Doesn't he have Hep C or something?) Love the finish, with Orton hitting the Tombstone and Taker sits up, and Orton keeps knocking him back down and Taker keeps sitting back up, and just when Taker is struggling to get back up and Orton think he's won it, his look of relief quickly changes to a look of disbelief and fear when Taker wraps his hand around his throat. Still ****1/4 for me. 

Gonna watch HBK/HHH again. Don't even care. JR will make sound like a classic.

Also, Starbuck sometimes I wish I could take back the rep I send. Your Cena love almost completely counters your Trips love. :HHH


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Angle/Benoit vs Edge/Mysterio up next :mark: :mark: 

This might be my new MOTY! 

Too bad this show has sucked so bad outside of the opening tag, only at 2.5 at the cal scale :lmao


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Also, Starbuck sometimes I wish I could take back the rep I send. Your Cena love almost completely counters your Trips love. :HHH


You got a problem with the Chain Gang? Take it up with our lord and saviour, he'll show you the way.

:cena5

On a serious note, Sandow can fuck off with a cash in. He shouldn't have ever won MITB to begin with imo. He's not ready and they haven't made him ready. I swear if Cena wins and Sandow cashes in they may as well all stand in a circle and crap all over the world title. It won't be worth the leather and metal its made out of after that.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

If Sandow cashes in :lmao :lmao


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Don't get me wrong, in a few years I look forward to a Sandow reign but right now this has disaster written all over it. After nearly a whole year of Del Rio in irrelevant WHC matches the last thing we need is a champ even further down the totem pole. 

CENA OR BUST DAMMIT CENA OR BUST


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I'd say Sandow holding the briefcase solidifies one of two things: 1) No unification bout anytime soon. or 2) He has cashes in and has a one month reign, with Cena winning it right back. 

If he doesn't cash in by TLC, he probably won't until after Mania, like Ziggler. It could be like Sheamus where he wins it very late in the year, gets by the Rumble, then drops it in the Chamber. Either way, with Cena in the WHC picture, Sandow's either being made to be a geek or won't cash in at all.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> I've said this before, when Orton gets hit in the head with a knock out shot, be it a chair, stairs, a kick, punch, whatever, his "Out on his feet" selling is the best I've ever seen. The way he just slumps over then crumples to the ground in a heap looks so damn good. The best knockout shot I've ever seen is when Foley clocks him in the head with that lid at Backlash 2004. So beastly :mark:


Yeah, the stumbling on his feet whenever he takes a headshot is fucking awesome every time. The way he sold Rey's 619 in their Smackdown match was godly. His selling of concussions is the best. HHH match at Royal Rumble and Capitol Punishment with Christian come to mind. Think he also sold it in a match with Tomko and his face was really red to the point you'd be really worried about his health.

Gonna watch that cell match with Undertaker myself now. Kinda weird that Orton ditched the colored trunks heading into 2005 (except New Year's Revolution) and then he brought them back for one last time here. Wish he had kept the haircut he has from this match forever. Looks funny on him in a good way.


----------



## TheStig (Jan 3, 2012)

Starbuck said:


> You got a problem with the Chain Gang? Take it up with our lord and saviour, he'll show you the way.
> 
> :cena5
> 
> On a serious note, Sandow can fuck off with a cash in. He shouldn't have ever won MITB to begin with imo. He's not ready and they haven't made him ready. I swear if Cena wins and Sandow cashes in they may as well all stand in a circle and crap all over the world title. It won't be worth the leather and metal its made out of after that.


Ye the mitb holders before had 10x times the cred sandow have I mean what has sandow done to be a world champ?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Fuck it. Trips/Shawn has just fallen off the Top 100 Hunter matches. Can't even get through half of it anymore.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Is this the Summerslam match? or one of their other matches?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> Is this the Summerslam match? or one of their other matches?


Probably their cell match, which is perfectly understandable as that match is the cure for insomnia.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Hell in a Cell. First 15 minutes made me turn it off. :kobe at this shit

Also, I say it fell off. I had it in the low 50s, which is how much I though of it.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

*"those people that claim Vince is biased against Englishmen, just because Vince doesn't throw every title at him and put him in the main event doesn't mean he is biased against Englishmen. It just means Wade Barrett sucks and Vince knows it" *

:lmao is that a dig at Pyro :lmao


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Main event for NM 02 now :mark:. 10 minutes left on the PPV.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Brock/Taker HIAC is about to begin on NM 2002, what a perfect match to watch before tonight's PPV. 

Also- that tag match might actually top HIAC as MOTN, that was beutiful

EDIT: Me and Cal will post our reviews only like an hour apart :lol.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Main event for NM 02 now :mark:. 10 minutes left on the PPV.



One of my all time favorite Heyman moments is in that match. When Heyman has been busted open, blood all over his face, looking down at Taker getting beat on by Lesnar and he just says "YOU SON OF A BITCH! YOU SON OF A BITCH!" Then he gives Brock his belt :lmao

God Heyman is so great. Does anyone doubt that he has supplanted Cornette/Bearer/Jimmy Hart as the SOLID #2 GOAT manager of all time? Behind only our lord an savior himself, Bobby Heenan.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*WWE No Mercy 2002*

Love how the PPV starts. Kane sits down next to Undertaker and simply asks "how was your week?" :lmao. Obviously helps if you remember what was going on during the shows at the time haha .


*Chris Jericho & Christian Vs Goldust & Booker T - World Tag Team Championship Match*

Goldust :mark:. Christian :mark:. Jericho (not quite mark worthy). And then Booker T. 3 out of 4 ain't too bad .

Jericho attacked Booker and busted him WIDE OPEN a couple of weeks ago, so when Booker starts the match he wants Jericho but gets Christian, so he beats up Christian and goes right for Jericho, allowing Christian to attack him from behind and... lose control immeditately with Goldust getting tagged in .

Goldust is awesome :mark:. He makes smashing people in the face with his arse LOOK CREDIBLE. 

:lmao at Lawler on commentary fantasising about Cole and Tazz getting squashed if the HIAC fell down. THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU JERRY?

Good team work from C2 to keep Goldust from making the hot tag. GREAT hope spots from Goldust before he finally gets the hot tag. Wish his FIP segment had lasted waaaay longer though . Booker is fine as the hot tag guy at least. His big kicks DO kinda look cool even if I think he's average as fuck at best .

:mark: tag to Goldust. SHATTERED DREAMS TIME BABY!!! No Christian Jr I guess.

WALLS OF JERICHO. KICK TO JERICHO'S FACE. SCISSORS KICK. COME ON GOLDUST PIN HIM!!! Bah, that no good Christian broke it up . 

:lmao Jericho attempts the Lionsault and the rope dies. Everyone looks baffled but they recover nicely with Jericho hitting a full on MOONSAULT for the win.

Well this was... decent. Disappointing tbh. Didn't get all that much time and they steered a little too far from the good old STF for my liking. Short FIP from Goldust followed by a prolonged finishing stretch which honestly isn't thrilling. Ropes breaking luckily doesn't kill it off or anything as it happened at the end and Jericho was able to recover fine. Still, I liked it enough to not call it horrible or anything .

*Rating: ***
*CAL SCALE - 0.5*


FUNAKI. SMACKADUWN NAMBUR WAN ANNUNCER! My god this "interview" goes on far too long with Funaki barely speaking English and Al Wilson being a horrible actor :lmao. At least we get to see Dawn Marie clips a bunch of times.


*Dawn Marie Vs Torrie Wilson*

FAP FAP FAP? Well yes, but I'm gonna skip it anyway.

*Rating: NO*
*CAL SCALE - -1*


*Ric Flair Vs Rob Van Dam*

Wooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo. The greatest of all time Vs the flippy dude who smokes a lot of weed.

RVD is PISSED and goes right after Flair and they fight on the outside. Big kick to Flair's face and Flair takes an epic bump over the barricade right onto a couple of kids :lmao.

:lmao Flair goes for the FLAIR BUMP over the turnbuckle and he seems to realise while upside down still that he ain't gonna make it, so he just SCREAMS "AARRHGHKGHDAJFSFJ!!!" in disgust at himself :lmao.

Leg work from Flair. RVD... is selling it REALLY FUCKING WELL.

Come on Flair. BREAK HIS LEGS. End his reign of flippy shit forever!!! *realises this took place 11 years ago and RVD is still flipping about* 

Urgh, RVD, stop. Stop throwing those fucking elbows. They are on par with HHH's punches. You know, where he has to hold his opponents head first before he throws them and it takes like 20 seconds between each shot which absolutely KILLS any back and forth striking between him and his opponent?

Lawler: "DO YOU THINK PREGNANT WOMEN ARE ATTRACTIVE?"

:lmao WHERE THE FUCK DID THAT COME FROM?

The fuck is Flair doing? STOP STEALING MIZ'S FINISHER HOLD YOU OLD BAST... oh wait, no. This looks to be some modified version of what Miz does 8*D.

Flair is GOAT'ing all over the place with his leg work on RVD and those RIGHT HANDS to the face too. Do people talk about Flair's punching much btw? I always really liked his punches. They always looked really fucking good.

Oh hey, RVD no selling the leg work. I AM SHOCKED AND OUTRAGED THAT SOMEONE AS GOOD AS RVD WOULD DO SUCH A THING!

:lmao Flair sells the 5 Star Frog Splash like the true GOAT he is. Flops around like a fish out of water until RVD covers him. RVD wins.

Match is mostly solid. Flair controls most of it and works the leg really well. Would have been better had RVD like, sold the leg work during his comeback at the end.

*Rating: **3/4*
*CAL SCALE - 1*


Big Show has his thumb up his arse.


*Jamie Noble Vs Tajiri - Cruiserweight Championship Match*

:mark: please let this rule the planet.

Oh my god I think I'm in love with Tajiri :mark:. Guy RULES in this. RULES. MOTHERFUCKING FUCKING RULES THE FUCKING WORLD AND EVERY FUCKER IN IT. Why? This:










Noble rules too. Not as much, but he's still damn great. Love him shouting random shit and adding "BOY" at the end of everything . His offence is really good, focusing on the back of Tajiri. Looks nice and NASTY too. Speaking of NASTY, wouldn't mind getting NASTY WITH NIDIA.

:mark: that awesome sequence with Tajiri going for a Moonsault, Noble moving, Tajiri landing on his feet and going right into a tornado DDT :mark:.

OH SHIT, Tajiri goes fucking INSANE with a flurry of kicks. HE GONNA KILL HIM.

ORGASMIC counter from a kick by Noble... right into another kick TO THE FACE anyway :mark:. And then THAT GERMAN. THIS IS AWESOME *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*.

NIDIA kisses the lucky referee in order to distract him from a pin attempt after Tajiri KICKS NOBLE'S HEAD OFF. Then she helps him get the win to retain the title. 

TAJIRI KISSES NIDIA. She likes it! What a slut! Noble's revenge is showing him how to really kiss her :lmao. SO Tajiri kicks him in the back of the head.

This was GLORIOUS. Had to look up the time because I *thought* it got like 10+ minutes, but it only got about 8! Felt longer in the best way possible.

*Rating: ***3/4*
*CAL SCALE - 4*


Benoit is backstage finding Eddie to tell him that Angle is beating the shit out of Chavo Jr. Eddie thinks the screams are coming from a little girl. He's right. And so is Benoit. Angle is beating the shit out of little girl Chavo Jr. LOL. Best thing Angle has done!!! FINLAY sighting :mark:.


*Triple H Vs Kane - Winner Takes All World Heavyweight Championship Match*

The IC title merged with the Hardcore title, and now the winner of this is gonna merge the IC title into the WHC. Because... ummm... I guess they wanted to make the main brand titles mean something more than usual for about half a year before they decide to bring this back and bring the US title to SD .

KATIE VICK~! DEATH~! RAPE~!

Lawler: "IT'S NOT COOL TO BE A FREAK!!!". Be a star you fuck.

HHH has never beaten Kane in a title match. Except for that time when HHH and Austin beat Kane and Undertaker for the tag belts. LOL.

HHH looks odd as fuck without facial hair. Makes his nose look bigger. BIGGER.

Early going is mostly fun with Kane going crazy on HHH because, ya know, he accused him of murdering Katie Vick then raping her corpse. Is it still rape if the person is dead? I mean, they can't tell you either way. Stop talking now? Yeah ok.

So early going. Kane is rocking HHH with big shots and it's all pretty bossy. :lmao though at the spot where Kane is running at HHH in the corner and HHH is supposed to get an elbow up. Kane practically STOPS before he gets to HHH then walks into the elbow :lmao.

Nice transition spot into HHH's control segment; thumb to the eye (FLAIR~!) followed by a knee to the back which sends Kane head first into the ring post .

Shame HHH's control segment isn't as good as the transition spot into it lol. Dull dull dull dull dull dull dull. Thankfully it doesn't last too long. I spent most of the time laughing at the commentary. JR and King talking about MURDER :lmao.

FLAIR~! :lmao he runs into the ring, spazzes out, the ref gets taken out then Flair gets taken out. Quality.

BELT TO THE FACE. KICK OUT. THE HURRICANE~! :lmao forgot he and Kane were partners at this time. Seemed odd for a few moments when I forgot and Hurricane came down to attack Flair :lmao.

PEDIGREE ON THE FLOOR~! Hurricane averted!

Kane sits up in the ring and looks to finish THE GAME now. Flair on the outside smashing his fists on the steel steps then threatening fans is GOAT. He's been at ringside for like 2 minutes and he's already the most entertaining thing in this match.

:lmao oh man Flair trying to go toe to toe with Kane is another GOAT moment.

HHH THROUGH A TABLE~!

Kane is UNSTOPPABLE in this. Kicking out of everything, taking out Flair, putting HHH through a table, blocking a sledgehammer shot by Flair. Chokeslam. But the numbers game and the sledgehammer eventually prove too much. Pedigree and this one is finally over. HHH unifies the WHC and IC title.

Match isn't horrible... but not that good either. HHH is dull controlling things but luckily that doesn't last long. Whole finishing stretch makes Kane look unstoppable but is overbooked clusterfuckery and eh, I'm not too high on it. Maybe if they'd had Flair at ringside from the start and spread out those spots throughout the entire match it might have come across better.

*Rating: **1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 1*


CONFIDENTIALLY... YOU'RE A LYING BITCH.

:lmao Undertaker rules.


*Chris Benoit & Kurt Angle Vs Rey Mysterio & Edge - WWF Tag Team Championship Match*

Bangle Vs Redge :mark:.

Watching the build up video makes me wanna watch the whole tag tournament again. Might have to at some point.

Match starts, Angle grabs Rey and throws him across the ring. Then tells him to tag Edge because LOLREY. Rey sees it as disrespect and doesn't tag out, instead he takes it to Angle and uses his speed and high flying ability to make Angle look like a complete and total tit! :mark: SUPER fun start!!!

And once Rey gets Angle all frustrated... he tags in Edge :lmao.

Edge and Benoit roll around on the mat for a few minutes and it's kinda dull, then we get a few nice spots with Angle getting involved on the apron, Edge getting a revenge spot and then Angle getting a revenge for revenge spot spot!!! And that leads to the first control segment for Bangle.

:lmao at Mysterio standing on the ropes and screaming for Edge to get up and make a tag, and Benoit just kinda stops what he's doing to Edge, walks over and stares at him before going back to work on Edge.

HOT TAG TO MYSTERIO~! Guy is on FIRE!!! Loved that springboard drop kick to Benoit who was laying face up in the ropes! Incredible near fall!

CROSSFACE~!

619~! Benoit catches him! MISSILE DROPKICK FROM EDGE AND BENOIT IS CRUSHED! 1...2... KICK OUT!!!

Rey climbs the ropes to try and finish Benoit off... and Angle shows up from out of nowhere for the super over head belly to belly!!! Probably the only time that move has made sense and wasn't some random spot simply to set the move up!

:mark: now it's time for REY to be the FIP :mark:. One of the things I've always liked about this match is how we got Edge as FIP and then a hot tag and what would normally be an incredible finishing stretch... that only leads to ANOTHER heel control segment with Rey as the FIP! Just when you think the match is going into the final stretch they slow things down again and build up more suspense for the ACTUAL finish.

Huh, hot tag to Edge already. That didn't seem to last long . Another big finishing stretch, but Edge off the hot tag isn't as good as Rey .

:mark: Edge just gave Rey an over head belly to belly to send him right into Angle :mark:. Logic behind it is DUMB AS FUCK but damn it looked good!

619 to Benoit while he's applying the Crossface!!!

ANGLE SLAM TO REY~!

ANKLE LOCK TO EDGE~!

SPEAR TO ANGLE~!

ANKLE LOCK TO EDGE AGAIN~!

ANKLE LOCK TO ANGLE BY EDGE~!

ANKLE LOCK TO EDGE BY ANGLE AGAIN~!

TAP OUT~!

Well. I mean. I.

I used to love this. Even when my wrestling tastes changed and matches with MOVES~! and shit all went down for me... this remained great. Until now. It just fell a little flat for me. The Edge FIP was short and kinda meh outside of a few spots. Rey hot tag was INCREDIBLE. Then the Rey FIP was... short as fuck with little happening, and honestly I think my biggest disappointment with the match is there. I mentioned that I loved the match for having the 2 FIP segments in it, but this time both were kinda shitty and I wish we'd just got one long Rey FIP with some substance to it. First finishing stretch was good, but the actual finishing stretch was kinda shitty.

Overall... the match is ok, good even, but seems to have completely fallen apart for me compared to my last watch. And that makes me sad .

*Rating: ****
*CAL SCALE - 2*


*Trish Stratus Vs Victoria - WWE Women's Championship Match*

Yeah, sorry. No.

*Rating: NO*
*CAL SCALE - -1*


*Brock Lesnar Vs The Undertaker - WWE Championship Hell in a Cell Match*

:mark:

Build up video is awesome. God I loved the feud. Always great too when you can remember watching it as it happened.

Lesnar uses his power early on to hit a HUGE powerslam on Undertaker for a near fall mere minutes into the match. So Undertaker decides to use the cast as a weapon to even things up and Lesnar DOES NOT like that! Being a rookie and his first time inside HIAC, he starts to panic and wants to get out, because it's only NOW that he realises exactly what he's gotten himself into; a confined space with THE UNDERTAKER who has a cast that can be used as a WEAPON.

LESNAR IS BLEEDING. And Undertaker is DOMINATING the WWE Champion inside the cell. Lesnar takes some killer bumps face first into the cell.

Undertaker does his apron leg drop... then climbs to the top rope and looks to do the same... only he kinda falls and turns and apparently did a knee drop. :lmao it looks dreadful tbh .

Heyman on the outside is amazing. :lmao at him pushing his arm through one of the gaps to try and get at 'Taker. Undertaker boots him in the face, then grabs him by the tie and smashes his face repeatedly into the cell!!! HEYMAN IS BLEEDING!!!

It seems that Heyman getting busted open ANGERS Lesnar who gets a second wind and just smashes Undertaker into the cell and ring post, ending with all 3 men laying on the floor, beaten and in some cases bleeding... and we aren't anywhere near done yet!!!

Heyman proves to be a valuable asset even outside the cell, handing Lesnar his belt to tie around the broken hand. Heyman grabs the other and and makes sure Undertaker's hand is going nowhere, allowing Lesnar to SMASH IT TO FUCKING BITS with a steel chair!!!

Heyman: "YOU'RE GONNA DIE NOW! YOU'RE GONNA DIE NOW!" :mark:.

I love how this match went from Lesnar panicking and running from Undertaker, getting MAULED even at one point, to Lesnar in firm control with a clear target. All thanks to PAUL HEYMAN. Guy really is the third man in this match. Amazing how much he can do outside of even a cage. Kinda like the HHH/Lesnar cage... except Heyman was the only good thing about that match :lmao.

THE CAST IS OFF!!!

Fuck me, Undertaker's legs are COVERED in blood. And he ain't even bleeding! Good job he's wearing dark trousers lol.

SUICIDE DIVE~! BY THE UNDERTAKER~! Gotta love how even Undertaker is having to resort to shit like that. Lesnar is proving to be a HUGE threat in this match and Undertaker gotta do whatever he can to beat him.

:mark: at Undertaker trying to pick up the steel steps, but letting go because his hand is fucked :mark:.

Undertaker is BLEEDING. From 2 INCREDIBLE shots to the face with the steel steps. Heyman saying "YOU ARE THE MAN" and high fiving with Lesnar at the side of the cell is more :mark: from Heyman. Has any manager EVER added so much to a match simply being on the outside?

Undertaker is bleeding on Eddie Guerrero JD 04 levels now. HOLY FUCK.

:mark: at Undertaker instinctively punching Lesnar with his right hand, only to end up screaming in pain because it's the hand that was broken :mark:.

:mark: at Undertaker getting a little revenge by stomping away on the hand of Lesnar. NOBODY BREAKS THE DEADMAN'S HAND WITHOUT PAYING.

Tazz: "THE UNDERTAKER HAS NEVER BEEN PINNED. HAS NEVER SUBMITTED.". Ummmm... WHAT?

F-5! No! Countered into a chokeslam!!! People complain about that because he uses his injured hand. Whatever. He hits it out of desperation to avoid an F-5. As soon as he hits it he just falls on Lesnar for a pin, and from there HE CONTINUES TO SELL THE HAND. So fuck off you numpties.

LAST RIDE OUT OF THE CORNER~! I love how Undertaker wasn't able to hit it from the normal position. His hand wouldn't allow him to flip Lesnar up onto his shoulders, and Lesnar was able to counter and send 'Taker to the ropes, where Undertaker could simply walk forward and slam Lesnar down with the Last Ride rather than get him up there himself.

Oh fuck at THAT FINISH. Tombstone countered into an F-5 by Lesnar, which includes Lesnar absolutely POWERING Undertaker out of a Tombstone position, onto his shoulders and into an F-5. Incredible. BROCK LESNAR retains the WWE Title against Undertaker in Hell in a Cell. During his FIRST YEAR on the active roster. Incredible.

And speaking of INCREDIBLE, that is exactly how I would describe this match. Brutal, bloody, intense, shocking. THIS is the kind of thing Hell in a Cell was made for. Such a great match to watch. Always considered it to be the 2nd best HIAC (behind the GOAT MATCH of course), and it isn't going to move up to the #1 spot, but dammit it's moving up in another way...

*Rating: ******
*CAL SCALE - 9*



*Overall CAL SCALE - 15.5*​


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

NO! The Goldust tag is superballs. Probably like the 3rd best Goldust/Booker v. Jericho/Christian tag that year, but still superballs. I do think it was too short, though.

I'm glad the love for that other tag seems to be dwindling down. Not bad, but overrated as all hell. Gets Observer MOTY and I think I'd put it like 4th MOTN. "Bangle and Redge" is what should most be remembered about the match.


I wasn't all that bothered by Taker's hand selling in the cell. What did kind of irk me is how he used the broken hand to punch instead of the other perfectly good hand.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

The first five star rating I've ever seen for that cell match from a (somewhat 8*D) respectable reviewer. Mad props and some BALLS for that rating, as well as rating that tag match far lower than most like it should be rated. It's far more overrated than Benoit/Angle and the fact that people cite it as a MOTY kind of makes me snicker a little bit when it isn't even the second best match on the fucking show .

WILL GIVE LIVE STARS TONIGHT. YEAH.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*No mercy 2002 review​*
*Match # 1: Goldust and Booker T vs Chris Jericho and Christian *

:mark:, I swear every time Bookdust is in a tag match it’s a MOTNC, shit is always soo good. Now, when you add Christian and Y2J to the mix, shit just keeps getting better. This match is great just like all the rest, nor did I expect it not to though, as these two seem unable to have a bad tag match. This match was really good, but not as good some like the Armageddon and Unforgiven opening matches. But These 4 guys had great chemistry and this really is good tag wrestling. Solid match, but most likely not MOTN. *** ¼* 

*CAL SCALE: 2
*
*Match # 2: Dawn Marie vs Torrie Wilson *

Was gonna skip this, but right before I skipped, it ended :lmao, DUD

*CAL SCALE: 0

Match # 3: RVD vs Ric Flair*

I like both guys, but Flair sucked ass in 2002 so not expecting much at all. I mean, if he cannot work a good match with FUCKING JERICHO than I don’t expect much against RVD. Then again Flair had just turned heel at Unforgiven so who knows if he had more confidence once the plans were set for Evolution. Yeah this was okay, but pretty sure it was under 10 minutes. Kind of a disappointment that this 8 minute match was the huge payoff for Flair costing RVD the title. ** 

*CAL SCALE: 0.5*
*
Match # 4: Jamie noble vs Tajiri*

God I love cruiserweights, so fucking good! Tajiri is one of my favorites but this match just isn’t as good as the awesome match he had with Billy Kidman at Backlash, which is one of my favorite matches so far in 2002. That being said, this is still VERY entertaining, but a little slower. I’ve maintained that Tajiri>Kidman>noble, but Noble did have a fun match with Tajiri and Rey at Rebellion. This match is short and didn’t have much to it, but still fun nonetheless. *** 

*CAL SCALE: 2*

*Match # 5: HHH vs Kane*

Yeah, word of mouth says this match is shit, I don’t really feel like watching garbage. NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1*


*Match #6: Kurt Angle and Chris Benoit vs Rey Mysterio and edge*

Expecting a GOAT tag match here, and I bet I will not get disappointed. What a fucking match this is, wrestling at its finest. I legit focused only on the match and closed my laptop from the start of the match until the very end, and I never do that. Anyways I’m in such shock of what I just watched that I really don’t know what to say. Amazing stuff from start to finish, and a must see match to ANY wrestling fan IMO. ****

*CAL SCALE: 5 *

*Match # 7: Trish Stratus vs Victoria*

I’m not waiting for HIAC any longer, final answer. NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1*

*Match # 8: Brock Lesnar vs the Undertaker*

:mark:, This should beat the last match by a hair, as on the last watch I remember it being one of the best HIAC matches ever, so high expectations for this rewatch. Is the Cell roof really low or is it just me? Anyways the match starts out and I am legit getting weak at Heyman screaming NOOOO, for like 5 minutes :lmao. Goddamn this is good, I think it beats out the tag match, as this seems so much better on the rewatch. I don’t remember this much blood in this match but it doesn’t take the fact away that this is my second favorite HIAC match EVER after the original one, it just is fantastic from start to finish and this and the tag save what looked like a disaster of a PPV. **** ¾* 

*CAL SCALE: 8 
*
*TOTAL CAL SCALE: 15.5
*
*CURRENT PPV MOTY: Brock Lesnar vs Undertaker HIAC( No mercy)​*
CURRENT 2002 PPV rankings
*1: rebellion(20)
2: The Royal rumble(18)
3: No mercy(15.5)
4: Armageddon(15.5)
5: Unforgiven(15) 
6: Backlash(11.5)
*​


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

:lmao we still ended up with the same CAL SCALE rating .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Great timing too, time to eat and then watch the PPV!


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Since the Broncos vs. Redskins game is pretty much over at this point, I shall also eat and then watch the PPV and Sunday Night football


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

BANGLE/REDGE ftw. Don't care if it's another "classic" that will lose its reputation in this thread. I will stick by it no matter what. Like smitty, I concentrate entirely on the match and never end up focusing on something else mid-watch like with some other matches. It's just fun all the way through and the near 30 minutes go by a lot faster than normal.

Nearly 10 minutes into Orton/Undertaker HIAC now.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

PGSucks said:


> Since the Broncos vs. Redskins game is pretty much over at this point, I shall also eat and then watch the PPV and Sunday Night football


Fuck you , so many probelms with this team thought we were going to beat Denver and Show the World !!

Something is not sitting right with me with that "flair sucked in 02" for some reason


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Starting KOTR 2002, most likely going to sleep when the PPV ends so that means I'll just finish it tomorrow or Tuesday.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lol On this pre-show match, Kofi Kingston is wrestling like those luchadores in that horrible RR 97 lucha tag we all watched last night.

EDIT: REY MYSTERIO IS HERE


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Missed the preshow, Mysterio? SOMEBODY TELL ME WHAT HAPPENED?


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

LOLKOFI.

When I heard he was on the pre-show I decided NOT to watch it. He's an automatic NO rating.

Fuck him. Figuratively.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Renee Young :kobe4 

Ambrose/Big E tonight :kobe6


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Streams not working FUCKKKKKKK


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Finished Undertaker vs Randy Orton inside the cell just in time for the PPV. ★★★★½ and holds up pretty well.

Now it's on to the show! :mark:

ORTON/BRYAN HIAC! :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Thanks bud


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

HOLY SHIT THIS TAG MATCH RULES


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Give these guys a TLC match. Add The Real Americans and we have a MOTYC.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Great opener to HIAC 

***3/4


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

**** 3/4* for the opener I think.

SPOTS. REIGNS. CREATIVE FINISH. YEAH.


----------



## ArnoldTricky (Jan 3, 2012)

Great match there.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

**** imo. Loved every second.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Dat opener. :mark:

Trips/Shawn :mark:


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

★★★★ for the Triple Threat Tag match. :banderas


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Kanes pyro is set up on the ring posts! 

:mark


----------



## ArnoldTricky (Jan 3, 2012)

Ring possibly set up for Kane interference?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

KANE!!!!

And Miz gets buried!


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Dat botch!


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

:lol @ a Kane/Miz segment in 2013.

Now Fandango? Mixed Tag Match? Fuck this shit.

KHALI :lol. Fuck you WWE for putting this shit on PPV.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

:lol. You can see people getting up in the background 
#pissbreak


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

They could have placed this match somewhere between the two cell matches and the Cena match and it wouldn't be as bad.

I doubt the fans need a piss break after a half an hour, this is just disgusting .


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I still like that Bangle vs Redge NM02' tag, I don't care what you all say! It gets **** from me and I'm sticking to it.

Crazy to see that Lesnar/Taker rating from Cal, though not ALL that crazy as I consider it Takers best match outside the 3 HBK matches, and Lesnar's best match outside of Vs Punk at SS13'. I think I gave it ****1/2 on last watch. It's as close as you can get to perfection in a cell match without ACTUALLY being perfect. Can't say enough good things about it, Heyman truly adds so much to that match, as he does in any contest he's apart of.

Just for shits and giggles, top 5 Daniel Bryan matches before tonight:

1. Vs Punk OTL ****3/4
2. Vs Cena SS ****1/2
3. Vs Sheamus ER ****1/2
4. Hell No Ryback vs The Shield TLC ****1/2
5. Vs Punk MitB ****1/4


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I thought it was major BALLZ from Cal to give it that rating, I guess he just really wants to add to Undertaker's legacy in his own mind because the match is indeed flawed enough to NOT be five stars, regardless of how fucking awesome it is .

It's a top 25 match in WWF/WWE history for me, but it has enough flaws to be out of that five star range though.

PS: *NO RATING* for that last match. FUCK THIS SHIT.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Disgusting that the show-off is on the talking panel 

Atleast the show-Stoppa is in the house


----------



## ArnoldTricky (Jan 3, 2012)

Kind of hope that Big E wins this.


----------



## ArnoldTricky (Jan 3, 2012)

Shame the match ended right when it started picking up.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I honestly went from I want to see what Ambrose can do >>> this is ok >>>>> This is kinda boring >>>> I never want to see this again >>> Take this off NOW !


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Pretty fun match, solid story at the beginning and I'm glad to see Big E is slowely getting over.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

★ for the Big E/Ambrose match. Would've given it a DUD if it hadn't been for that awesome spear.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Hmm...I actually liked that match. Langston still has a lot to work on, but I can't wait to see him become a midcard champion soon. Poor seller, but nice power spots and he has that "bounce" in his step that a powerhouse face needs.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Shit match, Big E still can't work & Ambrose has still done NOTHING noteworthy in the ring since his debut as a singles competitor. I don't like the future for either of these guys, but it seems as if the E is dead set on pushing both.

SIGH. *1/2 ** or some shit. Some LOW rating that's not really a DUD but cha know.

CELL TIME.


----------



## DFUSCMAN (Mar 13, 2010)

Wow that was ehh, Ambrose hasn't been blessed with working with the best of opponents but wow that was a big pile of meh.

Ambrose's strength is when the match has a story he can work that story really well, i.e. regal and rollins matches, ambrose just can't work that 10 minute match.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Only match I have properly watched so far has been the opener.

Now it's Punk time which means I'm gonna leave to the kitchen and return in about 15-20 minutes.  (BG match looked boring with Ryback constantly using headlocks so I'm not hoping for anything here)


----------



## ArnoldTricky (Jan 3, 2012)

Hopefully the feud is over after this.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

HEYMAN :lmao


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Punk/Ryback wasn't that bad. Best of their three PPV matches IMO


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Match itself wasn't anything special, although I did like how they used the cell structure itself. Post-match stuff was :mark:


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Punk GTS'ed Heyman. Feud over, I guess.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

Match was pretty good, I thought. I enjoyed it more than any of their other PPV matches. Not as good as their great TLC match though.

Ryback/Punk:

HIAC I: **1/4
TLC: ***3/4
Battleground: **
HIAC II: **3/4

The post match stuff, I loved. Happy to see the program end.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

This was all about the angle. Middle of the match itself sucked but the beginning and end were both pretty fucking solid. Worse than last year's bout between the two and I'm glad that this feud is seemingly over so that we can move the fuck on.

*** 3/4* for the cell match. CM GOAT did what he could do to salvage such an overdone angle and succeeded. PUNK BLESS US ALL.

RYBACK/PUNK

HIAC I ~ *****
TLC RAW ~ **** 3/4*
Battleground ~ *** 1/4*
HIAC II ~ *** 3/4*


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Punk/Ryback:

HIAC I: ***
TLC: ***1/2
Battleground: **
HIAC II: **


----------



## ArnoldTricky (Jan 3, 2012)

botch ref missing the tag killed that ending. lol.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

Fun match between the Real Americans and Los Matadores. Reminded me of a CHIKARA match.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

This show has been horrible so far not a match over *** so far SAVE US_Cena/ADR;Orton/Bryan/HBK


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

SAVE_US_CENA.

Seriously. This either needs to be a classic or the next two matches have to be really, really good or this show tanks for me.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Really? imo it's good. Been better than BG and NOC, that's for sure.

And now... CENA! :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

This is Cesaro's world. Every other wrestler on the planet is just working their way to reach his level. What a carryjob of a tag match. Sub-main event #2 next :mark:. Can't believe I'm this excited.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

:mark:

CENA


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Skins, didn't like the opener? I think that was *** 3/4 for me. 

Surprisingly loud pop for CENA


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

There first HIAC match was awful. Probably the worst since the new cell debuted. This one was nothing special either. 

**1/2


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

FUCK YES.

Del Rio targeting the arm & Cena's selling :mark:.

THIS NEEDED TO BE LONGER BUT **** 3/4* anyways. 14 world titles. Beast.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

Cena's selling was dope. Good match. Probably go ***1/2 for it. 

Cena vs. Punk, World title vs WWE title, Wrestlemania XXX. 

:mark:


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

YES.

DO IT.

It's funny because I don't even think I care about who wins the main event.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Cena's selling was dope. Good match. Probably go ***1/2 for it.
> 
> Cena vs. Punk, World title vs WWE title, Wrestlemania XXX.
> 
> :mark:




I hope so. 

***1/2 for me as well.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Very good match, but Cena's selling was not as good as I expected. What separates a good seller from a bad one is the ability to sell the injury on offense as well as on defense, and Cena did too many moves with his injured arm to call it good selling. Del Rio was fantastic in his control segments as usual now. Would have loved it more if a non-finish occurred with/without a cash-in, but good match nonetheless. ****1/2*


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

YES YES !

I'll go *** 1/2 on first watch,

@smitty its was ok *** range, I'll have to rewatch that too


Orton/Bryan is gonna get a FUCK LOAD of time, hope it doesnt go bad


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Only watched two matches so far, so stoked for the main event. :mark:

Triple Threat Tag - ★★★½
Cena vs Del Rio - ★★★½ (Tornado DDT, dropkick, Crossbody... Cena doing some different stuff and Del Rio working on the arm)

Bryan, Randy... please give us something ★★★★ worthy! :mark:


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Who are these GEEKS in the main event? 

We have Punk & Cena wrestling in the midcard, with Daniel Bryan & Randy Orton in the main event.

:lol Kidding. Kind of. I guess.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Who are these GEEKS in the main event?
> 
> We have Punk & Cena wrestling in the midcard, with Daniel Bryan & Randy Orton in the main event.
> 
> :lol Kidding. Kind of. I guess.


The GOATs decided to tone it down and share the spotlight during the yearly down time, so they could be 100% to headline the part of the year that actually matters. 

unk :cena3


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I can actually imagine HHH/Taker/Brock alongside Punk & Cena thinking in their minds "LOL just wait until Wrestlemania season".

I think Bryan's a slam dunk to be in a big match, but as for Orton I'm not really sure.

BOB FUCKING BACKLUND.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Only watched two matches so far, so stoked for the main event. :mark:
> 
> Triple Threat Tag - ★★★½
> Cena vs Del Rio - ★★★½ (Tornado DDT, dropkick, Crossbody... Cena doing some different stuff and Del Rio working on the arm)
> ...




With their chemistry it isnt likely. The highest rating I gave for them was ***1/2. Just seems they don't click very well.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

xdoomsayerx said:


> With their chemistry it isnt likely. The highest rating I gave for them was ***1/2. Just seems they don't click very well.


I give the street fight ★★★★. Battleground is their best match outside of that (excluding the 2012 stuff) and I give that ★★★½ too.

Still, maybe the best has been saved for this.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Beautiful video package for HHH Vs HBK, really psyched to see those two young whippersnappers go at it for the first time :mark:.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

Triple H and Shawn Michaels. :mark:

What's the use for the other two clowns though?


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

ORTON :mark:


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

Kicksamania runnin' wild.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

More like CHAIRSAMANIA, brother :lol.

:hogan

OKAY SO. The storyline which was all about HHH is now all about HHH & HBK. The fuck?

Match was decent.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

This sure to be STAR MAKING ANGLE continues....


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Interesting end. Love to see HBK wrestle SOMEONE at SVS or mania, but that just makes me sound like a mark 

*** 1/2 for Bryan/Orton, better than NOC and BG at least.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I actually liked the ending. I wanted Orton to retain to set up a long Bryan vs. HHH feud that'll culminate at Mania, and whoever didn't expect fuckery and run-ins at the end was kidding themselves.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Match wasn't as good as I hoped it would be. Started off great and more fast paced then when Orton took control, it slowed down but was still fine. Shenanigans were to be expected but Orton won so I left this show very happy! ★★★½ for this one too.

11 TIME CHAMPION, BITCHES! rton2


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Totally marked way too hard for all of that. Marked for Bryan hulking up and kicking Hunter. Screamed my head off for Shawn to kick Bryan. Marked like a child when he did. 

:mark: :mark: :mark: :rko2 :rko2 :rko2 :hbk3 :trips2

Pretty forgetful show otherwise.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Glad to see the feud continue over SS. Orton the champion once again!


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

*Hell in a Cell 2013*

Kofi/Sandow: ****
Triple Threat Tag: ****3/4*
Mixed Tag: ***
Langston/Ambrose: ***1/2*
Punk/Ryback-Heyman: ***3/4*
Los Matadores/Real Americans: ***3/4*
Cena/ADR: ****1/2*
Brie/AJ: *NO*
Bryan/Orton: ****3/4*

Based on star ratings, this doesn't look very impressive, but I enjoyed myself. I have no clue what is going to happen tomorrow, but let's all pray that Punk/Heyman is over.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Three decent matches on this show make it the best show since SS at the very least

***3/4 for opener
***1/2 for WHC and WWE title matches


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Opener and main event were the best matches of the night for me. Cena vs. ADR wasn't quite as good as I hoped it'd be, but I enjoyed it. But Punk vs. Heyman seems to be over and AJ retained, so I'd say I enjoyed the PPV overall. 

:lmao :lol :ti :hayden3 at the amount of butthurt and complaining presumably going on in the PPV section.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Heel HBK :homer

Otherwise ** for the wwe title match


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

Why is everyone saying this will turn into HHH/HBK?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Yeah, Shawn didn't turn. You could see his face after he kicked Bryan. 

The look on Trips' face when he saw Orton had won. :bron2


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Kofi/Sandow: **
Triple Threat Tag: ****
Mixed Tag: N/R
Langston/Ambrose: **1/2
Punk/Ryback-Heyman: **3/4
Los Matadores/Real Americans: **1/2
Cena/ADR: ***3/4

I need to rewatch the main event, thought it was really good but I had some problems with my TV after the superflexes on the chairs so..


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Arm-Bar1004 said:


> Why is everyone saying this will turn into HHH/HBK?


Because it always turns into HHH/HBK. Look at 2004.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

Arm-Bar1004 said:


> Why is everyone saying this will turn into HHH/HBK?


It already has son. Just like the Summer of Punk turned into HHH V Nash

Somethings hot in wrestling? gotta HAITCHIFY it


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Hey guys, it's been a while since I posted in here and what better night that to make my first post in some time in the night of a PPV.

The opening match was lots of fun. Given the names involved, all 6 men lived up to my expectations. Nice little throwback spot to the 6 man tag on Superstars a few years ago with the superplex to the outside. Not sure if the the spot's been done elsewhere (it's probably been done a gazillion times already) but the first time I saw it was in the 6 man Superstars tag.

I found Cena's selling to be, quite frankly, dog shit. Normally, i put Cena over for his selling ability. Tonight is an exception. Also, I hate the idea of Cena being so damn close to the Naitch in title reigns.

I have no problems with the main events and was entertained in the last few moments and even participated in the Yesery. I'll say again what I said in the HIAC discussion thread. It's such a shame that wrestling fans in 2013 don't have the patience to appreciate this storyline. Also, the irony of fans complaining that they can't stand a heel's guts and want to see the babyface kick his ass.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Predictions for SVS?

Show-HHH
Team Bryan vs Team Steph/HHH 
Punk/Orton
Kane/Wyatt


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Opening triple threat tag: ***3/4
Punk vs. Ryback/Heyman: **
Cena vs. Del Rio: ***1/4
Bryan vs. Orton: ***

Bryan/Orton started off really well, and then once the chairs came into play things went down crazy fast, and then the botching of Bryan's finisher and SCM, each missing by a country mile, didn't help things. Overall it was good, but again, for Bryan, another disappointing main event to add to his resume.

Hopefully Bryan/Orton is done, because even though Bryan should end the feud as WWE Champion, these two need to get away from each other. The whole angle is dead anyway. We've just rewinded back to where we were right before NOC. No progression at all except now HBK is there... but if he's never going to compete again, he doesn't add much in the grand scheme of things. 

Oh well. The silver lining in all of this is we may just end up seeing Orton drop the title to Punk after all... that's the best case scenario at this point. Get them in a feud together, have Punk take the title, Bryan wins the Rumble, and we get Punk/Bryan for the belt at Mania... well, that would be easy to say, except for the fact Bryan/HHH has to be a lock for Mania at this point after the promo on Raw. So even if Punk took the belt, who would he defend it against at Mania? By that time, Punk/Orton would already be done. A Punk/Cena unification match doesn't interest me... or that match happening at Mania after it's happened so much in the last few years at all doesn't interest me. Lesnar looks like he'll be occupied by Taker. The biggest match for Punk I could think of after all of those would be Punk/Sheamus for the title... but fuck, that can't be the WWE Title match, can it?

So because of that, if Punk ever takes the title from Orton, it'll be at Mania. But maybe Bryan/Orton does happen again and Bryan wins the title... again, but HHH intervenes and strips Bryan of the title and awards it to himself or challenges Bryan right then and there like an MITB cash-in and takes the title at that point, which leads to HHH being champ and Bryan going after HHH for Mania. Or maybe...

... meh, fuck it. I'm too tired right now. If there's one good thing WWE did coming out of all this, it's make the road to Mania very unpredictable... well mainly how the WWE Title will play out on the show. There's so many ways they could end up using it. Damn, maybe Hulk Hogan just comes back, buries Bryan, Orton, Punk, HHH, and Cena and becomes the WWE Undisputed Champion and closes out Mania. :lol:


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

One of the people I watched this with tonight was someone who didn't know that wrestling was fake (this was her first time ever seeing it). Long back-story on why, but basically an ultra-religious background that basically had her cut off from the world, and naivety. When she first was questioning whether it was real or not, we all picked up on the fact that it'd probably be more fun if she thought it was real. So that's what we told her.

Therefore, I have no idea how to accurately judge the matches, because her believing that it was real made it seem much more fun, and colored the way I would judge things.

For instance, by far the most interesting thing to her was the Cena/Del Rio match. She bought the storyline of Cena returning from his injury, hook, line, and sinker (again, we sold it like it was totally real). I totally see now why kids love Cena, because the whole "overcoming the odds" thing really is powerful when you believe it, apparently. That match was like a **** 1/2 match if you were to judge by her reaction.

This is also why I need to re-watch the Orton/Bryan match without all of that, because the whole time I was thinking about the fact that Shawn would probably screw Bryan, and in my head I'm like "how are we supposed to explain that so it's plausible? :lmao " So I was sooo hoping for a clean finish, for that reason alone. Though I knew it wasn't coming.

But FWIW, that was her second most invested match, and probably because we explained about how Bryan isn't the typical champion, and has to fight harder, etc., etc. Again what this drove home was how powerful the Bryan storyline could have been, if it were done correctly. Because without her knowing of all of the shenanigans, just the message of that story alone, was powerful enough for her to get pretty invested damn invested in the match right from the start.

Also, she thinks the usage of the kendo sticks are barbaric. :lmao


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^ wtf :lol 

Did I watch the same ppv as most of you ? 

My ratings first watch

triple threat tag ***
Mixed Tag DUD
Ambrose/Big E **
Punk/Ryback **
Cena/ADR ***1/2
divas N/A
orton/bryan *


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Some thoughts from tonight:

Rhodes Brothers vs. Shield vs. Usos:
First off, CODY. :mark: Finishing stretch was great and woke the damn crowd up. I felt that the beginning and middle portions weren't anything special, and the FIP segment for Goldust wasn't as good as it was at Battleground or the RAW match.

Mixed Tag:
Did not fucking watch. Sunday Night Football sucked tonight, but it was still better than this.

Ambrose vs. Big E Langston:
Nothing really ever clicked for me in this match. Pretty dull overall.

Punk vs. Ryback and Heyman:
IDK if it was just me, but I found Ryback's control segments so dull. Elbow through the table was cool, but wasn't enough to save this match. Hopefully the post-match means that the Punk vs. Heyman feud is over. Who thought that a Punk vs. Heyman feud would drag this much?

Los Matadores vs. Real Americans:
DID NOT FUCKING WATCH.

Cena vs. Del Rio:
Honestly, this wasn't as good as I was expecting/hoping. I was a bit disappointed by Cena's selling of the arm after he did a really good job at SummerSlam. I never really got the feeling that Del Rio was gonna win. I'd definitely take Del Rio vs. Christian from SummerSlam over this.

AJ vs. Brie Bella:
I want to Thesz Press AJ with no clothes on. Oh, and this match sucked.

Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan:
First half of the match was really good IMO. Once Bryan started throwing the hundred chairs into the ring, it started to drag and I didn't really like the superplex spot. Match needed more intensity, brutality, near falls, just SOMETHING to set it apart. This basically shows that Orton and Bryan have awful chemistry too. I actually didn't hate the ending, and my stream was crap so I didn't notice Shawn missing SCM or Bryan missing the KneethattookoutJohnCena, like others have pointed out. 

PPV gets a 6/10 because I enjoyed it for the most part. Definitely better than NoC and Battleground. Hopefully Survivor Series picks it up, and TLC is usually a solid show. Then the RTWM starts :mark:


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

is hhh's dvd good?


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

KENSENBERG said:


> is hhh's dvd good?


I enjoyed the doc. Not worth it for the matches.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

I only watched the main event and gave it ***, it reminded me why I don't even bother with WWE these few years. Orton and Cena scooping dose titlez, biyatch! They have 25 top titles in WWE combined. :lmao


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

Holy shit;

HIAC rates

Pre-show: RENEE 8*D
Tag Team (SHOULD HAVE BEEN TORNADO RULES DAMMIT) : *****
Mixed tag: ***
Big E/Ambrose: ***
Punk/Ryback: **1/2*
Cena/Del Rio: *****
DBry/Orton: ***

Urgh, three awful PPV's in a row, thank god i don't pay for them 8*D


----------



## Shepard (Apr 30, 2011)

Went to sleep after the Cena match so it was like he main evented :cena3


Opener was like ***1/4. WHC title match was around ***1/2-3/4. Rest isn't really worth mentioning and it doesn't look like I missed much after Cena anyway.


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

Really? People are giving the main event a * rating? Were we watching the same match? Even if you didn't like the ending (which I suppose is fair), I struggle to understand how you can give that match a *. Some of you guys really seem to love exaggerating.

I don't know exactly what rating I would give but it would be in the ***1/2 to **** range. I thought it was great, and thought the finish was fine, though I would have much preferred to see Orton hit his own finisher this time.


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

Main event was so boring, nothing we haven't seen before, had to try not to fall asleep and i watched it this morning 8*D


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Numberwang said:


> Holy shit;
> 
> HIAC rates
> 
> ...


I'm glad I didn't even watch then. Just reading the results the only good things that happened are Cena winning the title (can't believe I'm saying this, but I'll take him over Del Rio and finally Del Rio's reign is over) and Orton beating Bryan. Night of Champions and Battleground were terrible PPV's, this doesn't look much good either, and they really need to make up for this by having a great Survivor Series PPV but I'm not getting my hopes up about that.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Cena/ADR after a rewatch is really weird. On one hand, Del Rio was incredible. Man now has a great understanding of not just execution and limb targeting, but also crowd interaction and pacing. He actually made the crowd care about him too. Cena on the other hand gave a horrid performance that nearly ruined the match. Very poor selling throughout the entire match and nothing like SvS 08. I won't call it a carryjob, but Del Rio saved that match from turning into Cena/Edge RR. Hopefully this terrible Cena performance is not a regular thing.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Opening tag was :mark:. Skipped everything else and based on the thoughts from the other place I'm glad I didn't bother with anything else.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Don't wanna DL the whole show by the sounds of it, but wouldn't mind seeing the opening tag.

Knew the main events wouldn't amount to much, seeing Cena lift that WHC title though lol.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Kingston/Sandow- **
Triple Threat Tag Match- ****
Khali&Natalya/Fandango&Summer Rae- DUD
Ambrose/Big.E- **
Punk/Ryback- **1/2
Matadores/Cesaro&Friend- *1/2
ADR/Cena- ***1/4
AJ/Brie- *
Bryan/Orton- ***3/4

-


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Watched the HIAC matches again, not fucking good at all.

Punk/Ryback ~ ****
Bryan/Orton ~ ****

BLAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Disappointing event imo. Opening 6-man was great. Nice way to open the show. Unfortunately, that was the highlight of the entire 3 hours. Both HIAC matches were boring imo, and I fell asleep during the Cena match :lmao


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Twisted14 said:


> Really? People are giving the main event a * rating? Were we watching the same match? Even if you didn't like the ending (which I suppose is fair), *I struggle to understand how you can give that match a **. Some of you guys really seem to love exaggerating.
> 
> I don't know exactly what rating I would give but it would be in the ***1/2 to **** range. I thought it was great, and thought the finish was fine, though I would have much preferred to see Orton hit his own finisher this time.


:draper2


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Orton/bryan was terrible, I feel like I'm overrating it by giving it a *, very disappointing . You know what Here goes


*[Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan w/ HBK as guest ref HIAC- Skins's random thoughts​*
-Ok going in I wasn't expecting a ****1/2 classic, but I was expecting something good, Their best match IMO was their sd match, with the rest being meh at best besides battleground. I saw improvements in the BG match probably because instead of working from behind most of the time, Bryan was mostly in control. Onto the HIAC, this match was horrible. The match started off well, we say a Orton show some viciousness and take it to Bryan right off the bat, good Pacing. That is were the "GOOD" ends. 

For match that its feud was the only thing wwe seemed like it cared about outside of Rhodes/shield since summerslam, There was not intensity at all. No hatred felt, no passion, no feeling at all really. This match was SOO LIFELESS and dull, it was almost like they were sleepwalking. This wasnt brutality at all. :lmao at them making the "OUT OF THE WAY SHAWN" seem like this was heated. On top of that the 50 chairs spot was one of the dumbest things I have EVER seen. The superplex was terrible and he only hit one chair I think. WWE for fucks sake DONT MAKE THIS PPVs anymore or do away this this gimmick as you dont know how to structure this match anymore. The match was so dull and boring, I couldn't even :mark: at my lord and savior heeling it up like its 1997.

In all honestly at the end of the match, I was hoping in some way HBK won the title, Hell I wanted HHH to win. I NEVER WANT to see orton/bryan in the same ring ever again or Im changing the channel.

** wanted to give it a DUD tbhayley​*


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

HBK didn't turn heel.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

It didn't seem that way when the show ended but if you read all his twitter shit then it's a bit more believable.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

So HBK didn't turn heel then? Didn't watch the PPV so what exactly happened?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

HBK took the obligatory ref bump, so HHH demanded the Cell be opened so he can check on Shawn. HHH was promptly met with a FLYING KNEE. HBK didn't take too kindly to this so he gave Bryan SCM but looked CONFLICTED afterward and was hesitant to make the 3-count. After he counted Bryan out he didn't celebrate with HHH/Orton, but rather exited the ring and walked backstage alone.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> HBK took the obligatory ref bump, so HHH demanded the Cell be opened so he can check on Shawn. HHH was promptly met with a FLYING KNEE. HBK didn't take too kindly to this so he gave Bryan SCM but looked CONFLICTED afterward and was hesitant to make the 3-count. After he counted Bryan out he didn't celebrate with HHH/Orton, but rather exited the ring and walked backstage alone.


Oh right, thx. Then nah IMO, doesn't sound like a heel turn of any kind, there is not much point anyways.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

He was trolling his followers on twitter pretty badly afterward, so who knows if he'll fully turn or not. It appears as of now that he'll be in HHH's corner (since he came to his aid when Bryan attacked Hunter), but not fully against Bryan either. We'll see what he says tonight.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

My HIAC review:

Opener - ****
Ambrose/Big E - **1/2
Punk/Ryback - ***
LM/Real Americans - **1/2
Alberto Del Rio/Cena - ***3/4
Orton/Bryan - ***1/2

Really good show, not as good as SS or MITB but still much better than BG and NOC.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

*Shawn Michaels vs Shelton Benjamin
Raw - May 2, 2005
Gold Rush Tournament Match​*
Never seen this match, actually, but it's on the Raw 15th Anniversary set so I'm checking it out after hearing so many great things about it.

The look on Shelton's face when HBK's music hits: PRICELESS. JR and King marking out also does it for me. :lol Match starts with a good deal of mat wrestling, at which Shelton and Shawn are obviously very proficient. Don't know what this says about me, but I honestly love those deep arm drags, like JR says, ala Ricky Steamboat. Grrr, commercial break. Back, and Shawn has Shelton up on the top turnbuckle looking for a suplex, but Shelton turns himself in mid-air and makes it a cross body. Shelton hits a very nice looking Samoan drop, followed by an inverted backbreaker, which Shawn sells very, very nicely. Off Shawn's flying clothesline, both men are down for an extended count, but following Shawn's kip-up, Shelton does the same. The two then exchange near falls, and back and forth we go. Michael's missed a super kick, and Shelton drills HBK with one of the more vicious spinning heel kicks I've ever seen. Michael's hits his elbow from the top, and looks to set up for Sweet Chin Music, which Shelton blocks again. This time Shelton hits a standing kick to the side of Shawn's head. Both men are back up following another near fall, and Shelton hits a cross body, causing another near fall. Shawn sends Shelton over the top rope, or so Shawn thinks. Shelton springboards off the top rope and Shawn catches him coming down with the super kick for the 1-2-3. ****


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Didn't Shawn said that since he is God's son or something like that he can't play a bad guy anymore?


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

The Lady Killer said:


> HBK took the obligatory ref bump, so HHH demanded the Cell be opened so he can check on Shawn. HHH was promptly met with a FLYING KNEE. *HBK didn't take too kindly to this so he gave Bryan SCM but looked CONFLICTED afterward and was hesitant to make the 3-count*. After he counted Bryan out he didn't celebrate with HHH/Orton, but rather exited the ring and walked backstage alone.


someone should post a GIF of this which is sure to be ridiculously horrible acting to the point of laughter.


I remember Michaels saying he didn't want his kids seeing him heel.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Sandow/Kofi - **
-------------------
Rhodes Bros/Shield/Usos - ***3/4
Mixed Tag - DUD
Ambrose/Big E - *3/4
Punk/Ryback & Heyman - *** _(Very good storytelling imo)_
Real Americans/Matadores - **1/2
ADR/Cena - ***1/2 _(WTF'ing myself for the ****1/4 I gave it, it's very good but the ending caught me totally off guard and the arm hunting by Berto was dissapointing)_
AJ/Brie - **
Orton/Bryan - huh... *** I guess

Expected a little better.

EDIT: For being an overrating asshole.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Was ADR/Cena that good? It was the only match I missed.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> Was ADR/Cena that good? It was the only match I missed.


No. Del Rio was tremendous, but Cena was pretty awful. Good match, but gets worse on rewatches.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Lady Killer said:


> Was ADR/Cena that good? It was the only match I missed.




No, the selling by Cena was horrible. He only sold when he was on defense, he'd completely forget anytime his offense started, it was WM23 all over again. Except that was 6 years ago, Cena should know better by now.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

(N)


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> someone should post a GIF of this which is sure to be ridiculously horrible acting to the point of laughter.
> 
> 
> I remember Michaels saying he didn't want his kids seeing him heel.


He more of a "very conflicted, I like Daniel Bryan, I though him everything, but I have to listen to HHH and the higher up and do what's best for biz" than he is a Heel

Cole and co didnt even play up the SCM its was just "Oh Michaels kicks Bryan, Orton wins" or the ashamed walk backstage by HBK, such a bad ppv


Edit: Thats way to high for cena/adr


----------



## Cactus (Jul 28, 2011)

My quick HiaC thoughts...

- The opener blew my expectations completely away. The triple threat stip made the match really shine and stick out from the other already-good Rhodes Dynasty/Shield matches. The Usos didn't get involved into the epic finishing stretch but them being on the apron made for some unique and interesting Goldust hot tag teases. MOTN by a landslide. 

- Big E/Ambrose sucked. I'm a fan of both guys which made it even more underwhelming. Crowd didn't like it either. Crappy finish didn't help matters either. 

- Punk/Ryback was alright. A step-up from their last snoozefest, that's for sure. Having Heyman not work the match was a welcoming twist and would of only of slowed things down if they had him and Ryback beating Punk for what would of felt like an eternity. Punk continues to phone it in, but the match was moderately entertaining. A decent way to wrap up a pretty poor feud. 

- I'm already a fan of Los Matadores after one match. A great way to repackage Primo & Epico. I love their new move-set too. The match was heaps of fun due to both teams making an effort. 

- Cena/Del Rio was just there. Wasn't bad, but wasn't good. I didn't find the schtick with Cena's arm all that compelling but the match didn't drag and had a decent-enough finish.

- The main event was pretty passable. Probably the best match in the Orton/Bryan series even though that's not saying much. I enjoyed parts, and hated others. I thought the overall finish was horsecrap and was handled pretty poorly too. Once they started getting violent with strike exchanges and chairshots, the match was just about to get good but not before things came crashing down with the blown superplex spot. I hope that's the end of this Bryan/Orton feud. 

A lot better than the last two crappy PPVs but when all the big matches underwhelm me, it's hard to call this a good PPV. Two gems in the undercard, but the rest is forgettable.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Just finished the rise and fall of ECW doc, really sad ending with Paul E talking about how it was his dream to overtake WWF and WCW, but it just never happened 

Really good doc though, I recommend it


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Wow. The WeAreProWrestling guy gave the Triple Threat Tag a whopping ****1/2. Jesus Christ.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

I thought the Los Matadores/Real Americans match was good as well. It felt like a CHIKARA match with it being a fun, harmless match. Cesaro selling for El Torito post-match was :lol


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

I just want Cesaro to stay with the Real Americans long enough for Rey to get healthy so I can one of my dream matches in Rey Mysterio vs. Claudio Castagnoli. If they let Cesaro work with Rey and Rey can be thrown around the ring a lot it would be all kind of amazing.

I miss how often he would get to wrestle smaller guys before he got signed. It used to happen all the time on the indies for obvious reason and he was so great against smaller workers because he would sell for them but also show off how incredibly strong he is.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao They are STILL continuing Punk/Heyman.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> :lmao They are STILL continuing Punk/Heyman.


Yes but this is DEFINITELY the blow off. I hope. Please god let this be the blow off.

I voted for a Street Fight, let's hope to God that's what it is. I don't think I can take a Ryback vs Punk Tables match.


Edit- THIS JUST IN. GOD MADE WATER FREEZEABLE IN ORDER TO AID JOHN CENAS RECOVERY FROM ELBOW SURGERY. Just thought you all should know, in case you are wondering :lmao


Edit- that was the best thing Sandow has done in his entire career. Seriously. That was AWESOME. "RISE ABOVE THIS" (throws him arm first into the steps) :mark: :mark:

Edit- CASH IN BABAY


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao a commercial break during a cash-in. Oh my goodness, does this company have no shame?

EDIT: LMAO another commercial break during a cash-in AND JBL forgot that Cena tried cashing in on Punk. If this is what tonight will be like, I'm gonna suffocate due to laughter.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> :lmao a commercial break during a cash-in. Oh my goodness, does this company have no shame?



Seriously. The fuck man.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

No way sandow is winning


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Finished HIAC and was incredibly unimpressed.

Tag titles 3-way - ***3/4
Punk/Ryback - **
Matadores/Real Americans - **1/2
Cena/Del Rio - *1/2
Brie/AJ - **1/4
Orton/Bryan - *1/2

Fucking hell, the three biggest matches of the night blew dick. And if Trips/HBK ends up happening I can honestly say I've never watch the company again because god knows 11 more years from now it'll be the same damn thing. On a scale of GREAT FOR BUSINESS to TERRIBLE FOR BUSINESS this show is pretty close to the bottom. (N)


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Brye said:


> Finished HIAC and was incredibly unimpressed.
> 
> Tag titles 3-way - ***3/4
> Punk/Ryback - **
> ...




Quoted for the absolute truth. That's the ironic thing about Hunters "Best for Business" catch phrase, the WWE has been spending the last 3-4 years doing the exact opposite of that. 

Sandow just used the Crippler Crossface! Cena's selling is bossy right now, where was that last night??

Sandow lost, I don't think that's the worst thing that could have happened. He wasn't ready for the title, let him marinate a bit more, maybe a mini feud with Cena will do the trick. Either way, Cena just gave Sandow a great rub, that was easily the best match of Damien's career ***3/4


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Watching the World Series but if Cena/Sandow is good I may need to give it a look.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao at the burial of Sandow. Oh my goodness, Starbuck and gang must be having a blast at how hilarious this RAW is. That match was actually pretty good. Maybe even better than Del Rio/Cena, but that's not a slight at ADR. Cena actually gave a damn tonight.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> :lmao at the burial of Sandow. Oh my goodness, Starbuck and gang must be having a blast at how hilarious this RAW is. That match was actually pretty good. Maybe even better than Del Rio/Cena, but that's not a slight at ADR. Cena actually gave a damn tonight.




Oh I think it was EASILY better than ADR/Cena, by a considerable margin actually. I gave ADR/Cena **3/4 and Sandow/Cena ***3/4. Best match of Sandows career I think. Cena's selling was bossy, he definitely gave a fuck tonight.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

★★★¾ for Cena vs Sandow. Sandow was kinda buried but holy fuck, what an amazing performance by both. Marked hard for the Crippler Crossface. :mark:

Even though you can say he's buried, Sandow has never looked this good in a match either.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Wouldn't say Sandow got buried as I think this will lead to a future title win but my god, they did ruin the chance to make this the most unpredictable and best successful cash in. Cena did well, as he was expected to, in the match. Selling the injury and also making sure not to use his injured arm when on the offense but this sort of booking annoys me. It took Sandow a brutal beatdown before the match, two finishers, attacks on the arm including a cross face yet Cena still overcomes that. Still a good match and the best for Mr Sandow.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Haven't seen a Super Cena performance like that since that Cena/Ziggler match where Cena kicked out of all of Ziggler's finishers and Big E's finisher and beat Ziggler with a simple AA, just like Cena beat Sandow tonight with a simple AA.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

All this time surrounding himself with great workers has really rubbed off on Roman Reigns. Did you guys see how he sold that DDT? It's also helped The Usos become very entertaining, much to the chagrin of many others here. Two ★★★ matches to start the night with another burial on the way unk3 :ryback :mark: at that double spear!


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Sandow looked good, but he only looked good against a one-armed Cena, and he wasn't exactly the complete dominant force in the match or anything, which he should've been given the circumstances around the match. Sandow also hit all his signatures and finishers on Cena and he still lost. 
.
Match gets ***3/4. Great match and as I thought, when Sandow is given the opportunity, he produces the goods in the ring.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I don't think they "buried" Sandow at all, Cena just gave him his best match ever, that's hardly a burial. If anything, it's just gonna lead to bigger and better things for him, I hope. That MitB briefcase was doing him no good, with how he had been booked, it would be impossible for him to win without it becoming a joke. Maybe he can get a mini feud with Cena out of this.

Roman Reigns is a fucking wrestling GOD. :mark: :mark: at that DOUBLE SPEAR

***3/4 for Sandow/Cena; ***1/4 for the Shield/Usos Big E Tag.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

OMG HEEL HBK :homer your are a A++++++


SHAKE HIS HAND


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Just when I was thinking the Wyatt's were starting to grow stale and not doing anything :mark:

HELL NO REUNION VS THE WYATTS. PLEASE GOD MAKE IT HAPPEN FOR 1 NIGHT ONLY!


----------



## blink_41sum_182 (Apr 9, 2011)

Fuuuuuu

That said, best match of Sandow's career. *** 3/4 and better than anything from the PPV. Wow.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

I'm hoping that the Wyatt Family beatdown on Daniel Bryan leads Harper/Bryan encounter somewhere down the line. :mark:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> I don't think they "buried" Sandow at all, Cena just gave him his best match ever, that's hardly a burial. If anything, it's just gonna lead to bigger and better things for him, I hope. That MitB briefcase was doing him no good, with how he had been booked, it would be impossible for him to win without it becoming a joke. Maybe he can get a mini feud with Cena out of this.
> 
> Roman Reigns is a fucking wrestling GOD. :mark: :mark: at that DOUBLE SPEAR
> 
> ***3/4 for Sandow/Cena; ***1/4 for the Shield/Usos Big E Tag.


Being like the worst booked MITB holder in WWE history and then losing the cash-in makes him look so shit. He attacked Cena who already wasn't 100%, hit him so many times in the arm with the MITB briefcase, crushed his arm on the steel steps, and continued to work on the arm in a competitive match and Sandow still loses. It doesn't matter how good the match was, it was booked so badly, just like the Cena/Ziggler match I mentioned, that match made Ziggler look terrible, and this match did the same to Sandow. 

Sandow/Cena feud? What's the point after Cena just showed he can be ambushed and destroyed by Sandow, and then comeback with one arm and easily beat him?


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Cactus Jack said:


> Edit- that was the best thing Sandow has done in his entire career. Seriously. That was AWESOME. "RISE ABOVE THIS" (throws him arm first into the steps) :mark: :mark:
> 
> Edit- CASH IN BABAY


Yeah, I've been saying for forever that I have yet to see a single Sandow match that I've liked. That has just changed.

I missed Bryan getting attacked by the Wyatts. What was the deal with that? Was anything said?

Not for nothing, but Stephanie has been giving some of the best promos and acting of this entire angle, IMO.


ETA: Shouldn't have said "for forever", because in fairness, Sandow may have had some good stuff from before I started watching again. But that's been my feeling since I've seen him. However, I thought that he was quite good tonight, so maybe he shines more with a storyline type of match, similarly to what some people say about Ambrose? I dunno, but I did quite enjoy that match. Kudos to the both of them.


----------



## birthday_massacre (Jan 30, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> :lmao a commercial break during a cash-in. Oh my goodness, does this company have no shame?
> 
> EDIT: LMAO another commercial break during a cash-in AND JBL forgot that Cena tried cashing in on Punk. If this is what tonight will be like, I'm gonna suffocate due to laughter.


they had two breaks

and it went like this AD break 3 mins of match another ad break


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Oh my goodness, that tag team match was awesome. Hopefully this will all lead to the 4-way TLC match that I'm thriving for at TLC.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Well that was tremendous, need to rewatch ASAP and watch cena/sandow since my back was turned that entire match :lmao

Who ever is booking Raw tonight keep them


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Incredibly surprised by the lack of pages this thread has produced since I've been gone for two days and since we had a relatively major ppv last night. Guess it's cause a few of us haven't been in a while. BUT, it made it much easier to read everyone's opinions from HIAC. Decided I'll just download the whole show and watch the Tag Title match, Americans vs. Mexicans, Cena/Del Rio, & the HIAC. I'm not gonna lie, pretty excited to watch the main event reading about bits and pieces about the ending. 



funnyfaces1 said:


> Cena/ADR after a rewatch is really weird. On one hand, Del Rio was incredible. Man now has a great understanding of not just execution and limb targeting, but also crowd interaction and pacing. He actually made the crowd care about him too. Cena on the other hand gave a horrid performance that nearly ruined the match. Very poor selling throughout the entire match and nothing like SvS 08. I won't call it a carryjob, but Del Rio saved that match from turning into Cena/Edge RR. Hopefully this terrible Cena performance is not a regular thing.


This post really makes me happy... then it pisses me off. So Cena sold better for Sandow on RAW then for Del Rio on PPV? :no:



ATF said:


> Wow. The WeAreProWrestling guy gave the Triple Threat Tag a whopping ****1/2. Jesus Christ.


Stop bringing this guy up!


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yea this thread has been DEAD since sunday morning

Dont get your hopes up for the main event

I guess I cant draw like you Cody, Cal and co in this thread


----------



## GREEK FREAK (May 17, 2012)

EDIT: wrong thread


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Ohhhhh my. Steph's tits in that sweater though... :lenny :homer


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Great RAW tonight. So many questions that need to be answered the next couple of weeks.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Ohhhhh my. Steph's tits in that sweater though... :lenny :homer


FOR REAL :kobe4

Raw is Fuckery tonight for sure. I swear, I don't care who Orton feuds with next as long as it's not Show. 

Ryback with dat :buried big time.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Orton's feud with Show is probably just gonna take us to 2014. I have no problem with Show being used to get Orton over as a heel champ.

Bryan and Punk vs. The Wyatts intrigues me. Include :ziggler3 in the Survivor Series match too please.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Big Show to take the belt off of Orton & HHH to take the belt off of Big Show at the Rumble :mark: :mark:.

The chances of HHH as WWE Champion just SKYROCKETED. Although if we get Orton Vs Show, CENA will end up main eventing as it`s in his hometown anyways.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I welcome Orton vs Show as long as Show doesn't win the title.



Jack Evans 187 said:


> Ohhhhh my. Steph's tits in that sweater though... :lenny :homer


Other than that summer photo shoot, I've never seen her look anything less than SMOKING!


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Ugh Orton/ Show? 

YAWN.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Orton/Show sounds better than Orton/Bryan, who have absolutely NO fucking chemistry whatsoever.

Face Show is intriguing, SHOW VS HHH FOR THE TITLE THOUGH :mark: :mark:.

HHH Vs Cena Unification Match, just wait.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

xdoomsayerx said:


> Ugh Orton/ Show?
> 
> YAWN.


Tell me about it. 

I'd be kinda bummed if we don't get Orton vs. Bryan TLC, that one still intrigues me. But after tonight, idk what the fuck they're gonna do with anything.

Orton vs. Show would be on fine for a RAW Main Event Title match, but I wouldn't want it on ppv whatsoever.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Orton/Show sounds better than Orton/Bryan, who have absolutely NO fucking chemistry whatsoever.
> 
> Face Show is intriguing, SHOW VS HHH FOR THE TITLE THOUGH :mark: :mark:.
> 
> HHH Vs Cena Unification Match, just wait.




Show/ Orton haven't had nothing special either though.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Stephanie's rack gets ***** tonight. :hhh2

I missed the Cena/Sandow deal (I'm actually not pissed that Sandow lost his cash-in for some reason) and the Bryan/HBK segment, but I still enjoyed what I saw of RAW tonight.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Orton/Show sounds better than Orton/Bryan, who have absolutely NO fucking chemistry whatsoever.
> 
> Face Show is intriguing, SHOW VS HHH FOR THE TITLE THOUGH :mark: :mark:.
> 
> HHH Vs Cena Unification Match, just wait.


Fuck that. I'm so down for Show taking the title from Orton and then dropping it to H but for the love of God, they have to do HHH/Bryan. HHH/Cena is so unnecessary and does nothing for the future of the company.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

The meltdown if Trips wins the title. Gotta stay even with Cena though :HHH2


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Please don't give the title to HHH. I'd rather he fuck off altogether at this point if I'm brutally honest, but while I expected his injection into Bryan's rise and the inevitable matches he will have with whoever it may be, I don't expect him to win the title. And I don't see why he should ever again.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

2013: The year that Rock, Cena, Orton and HHH all won the WWE title. IWC's worst nightmare lol.

(HHH will probably win the title in early 2014 though).


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

The crazy part is that HHH will still be around long after everybody else currently in the WWE is gone :mark:.

Like, barring some horrific accident, HHH is a lock to be around come Wrestlemania 50... Isn't that fucking insane? He'll be 64 come Wrestlemania 50, and I honestly wouldn't doubt it if he's involved in some sort of wrestling capacity because even VINCE wrestled until he was 65.. & he was in a prominent match then...

TRIPLE H VS RANDY ORTON WRESTLEMANIA 50 :mark: :mark:.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> The crazy part is that HHH will still be around long after everybody else currently in the WWE is gone :mark:.
> 
> Like, barring some horrific accident, HHH is a lock to be around come Wrestlemania 50... Isn't that fucking insane? He'll be 64 come Wrestlemania 50, and I honestly wouldn't doubt it if he's involved in some sort of wrestling capacity because even VINCE wrestled until he was 65.. & he was in a prominent match then...
> 
> TRIPLE H VS RANDY ORTON WRESTLEMANIA 50 :mark: :mark:.


THE SILVER ANNIVERSARY'S GOLDEN ANNIVERSARY REMATCH. A FEUD THAT SPANS 30 YEARS. :rko2 :hhh2 :mark:


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

What's funny is that it wouldn't surprise me if Cena main events another 7-8 Wrestlemanias and amasses 25 world titles before it's all said and done.

#OneManDynasty

:cena3


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

After tonight, I wouldn't surprised if they start building Cena as bigger than God. 

Sandow kicked Cena's ass before that match, and nearly tore his arm off, and he still wins. 

:cena4


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

That's what Sandow gets for fucking with the GOAT though.

They're actually acknowledging Cena's superman gimmick. GOD HELP HIS HATERS at this point.

Anywhoways, anybody else actually really like the Cena-Rock feud leading up to Wrestlemania XXVIII like I did? I thought Cena's promo work was fucking OUTSTANDING and him able to pretty much own Rock on the mic at every point was fucking amazing. The match was good too so then there's that.

YEAH. I JUST SAID I LIKED CENA VS ROCK. POLARIZING SHIT.


----------



## OML (Feb 14, 2009)

I have been reading this thread for sometime and I must say it is so nice to read. It isn't like the other section with marks bitching about people losing if Somethig is good it's good who cares who wins lol. Thought raw was good tonight and I'm really excited at that thought of real Americans/ Usos/ Shield/ Rhodes Bros in tlc wow that would be something


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I thought Paramore fan lost it when he couldn't bother giving credit to The Usos when credit was due. Then I thought ATF lost it when he gave Cena/ADR a *****1/4*. But Evan has gone too far :cena :cena3

Lost in all of tonight is the potential of Punk/Bryan as a tag team. Move over Owen/Yoko, Jericho/Eddie, Hogan/Warrior, and any other star tag team. Punk/Bryan is a walking five-star tag combination!


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

As good as a match as Punk/Bryan Vs Rollins/Reigns would be; I'll take Punk back in the main event PLZ & thank you very much.

Still holding out hope on that HHH Vs Punk WWE Championship match at Wrestlemania XXX although I think it'll be HHH/Cena or HHH/Bryan though.

Two Cena matches in 24 hours and two really impressive showings that would fall in his Top 100 bouts ever probably. He's just been beasting and he's at his best when placed in a bunch of flash feuds against heels lining up to take his belt. Cena Vs Del Rio Vs Sandow seems like it'll main event Survivor Series which is pretty intriguing, but I don't like the idea of Sandow & Del Rio, it just doesn't feel right. Let Cena take on one of the two, not both. CHRISTIAN VS CENA maybe? There's a fresh feud, but I think a long term Sandow-Cena feud would work fine.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Punk/Bryan Vs Rollins/Reigns deserves to main event. Let us hope that we get a Shield/Punk filler feud before Mania after Punk wins the Royal Rumble. Shield vs. Punk/Bryan/INSERTFACEHERE in the Elimination Chamber? :mark:

I've given up hope on Punk/HHH ever happening again. :HHH2 successfully buried my hopes and dreams :jpl


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

It's so nice to have Punk in the midcard, been so much easier to enjoy Raw post-WM.



Corporate KingOfKings said:


> They're actually acknowledging Cena's superman gimmick. GOD HELP HIS HATERS at this point.


I like Cena but I fear they'll embrace the Superman gimmick and just have him streamroll over everyone and anyone. As entertaining as it will be to see the meltdown of his haters, it will become boring fast and doesn't do anyone any favors.



> YEAH. I JUST SAID I LIKED CENA VS ROCK. POLARIZING SHIT.


What, seriously? You still rate it awfully low or what? That first match is easily worthy of Top 100 Cena matches list yet you omitted it.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2013/1028/566837/video-of-hhh-mass-firing/

Triple H ordering the crowd to leave :mark: :mark:

"JBL call the police" :mark:

"Hey, get this fat guy outta here first." :lmao


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

It's not like Cena's the focus of the show anymore anyways (that's reserved for HHH), but it would be nice to see him steamroll the likes of Del Rio/Sheamus now. Maybe a Cena Vs Wyatt feud at some point or something? T'would be MEH because Bray sucks between the ropes it seems,but it's just a fresh feud for Cena much like this Sandow thing seems to be. I'm all for building up heels and feeding them to Cena at this point as long as Superman stays away from burying Punk for a while.

Knowing WWE though, they'll probably do a Orton Vs Big Show TLC main event :lol.

& Cena-Rock is kind of fucked for me, depending on what mood I'm in my rating for it fluctuates like crazy. I've seen it like 6 times I think, and it's went from ****** to *** 1/4* to **** 1/2* to **** to *** 3/4* to **** 1/4* again. It was on a downward spiral when I did the Cena list, I really regret not putting it on their though. Might prefer the XXIX match simply for THE WIN AND THE MOMENT at the end to be honest. XXVIII is vastly superior in quality of course, but I can't remember going as insane live over the result of a wrestling match as I did for Rock-Cena II. So it did it's job I guess.....

Fuck The Rock though (formerly The Roid).


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Punk is probably the only Cena burial I would mark out for and enjoy.

Orton vs Big Show in a TLC match sounds awesome. Imagine an RKO from the ladder! :mark:

Hopefully Cena vs Orton in a unification match does happen at WM with Cena randomly mentioning Orton tonight.

Cena-Rock II along with Lesnar-HHH II was some of the most unexciting endings ever. Maybe if you passionately hate ROCK the former worked but for me, I saw it coming (as did everybody else) and the first thing crossing my mind was simply "Still beats having Punk in the main event".


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Wrestlemania XXX is looking unpredictable as fuck, I can't even try to guess the card until the Rumble at this point. 

I love HHH and even I can tell you that Cena-Rock & HHH-Brock were like COMPLETE opposites; was excited for Cena ending Rock's reign of terror but thought the match fucking sucked, was glad HHH didn't retire (hated the match on first watch but ended up adoring it) but felt Brock's balls were cut off in that losing effort.

CM Punk Vs Rey Mysterio from Capitol Punishment coming up. I think I know what guy I'm targeting for my next big fall/winter wrestling review project .


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Sandow/Cena from tonight ******

Wonderful arm work by Sandow with a bunch of cool nearfalls. I thought Sandow was actually going to win at some points. Cena with a great babyface performance as well.


----------



## Hennessey (Jan 1, 2012)

So what exactly was wrong with the main event that made it deserve 1 star from a lot of people. I watched it last night and it was a great match. I felt the intensity from the two and I thought the pace was great. Sure the supperplex on the chairs didnt work out that much, but it wasn't a total match killer. Honestly I think people would have rated this match much higher if Daniel Bryan had won. I personally have the match at 4 stars. I really loved it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cena vs Sandow tonight was > most, if not everything from HIAC last night. The trend continues. And Cena vs Del Rio was the only high point worth talking about from HIAC. CENA. _(Sandow was good too, tbhayley)_

Also: REAL AMERICANS :mark:


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Real Americans next tag team champions :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Could we actually get something this good booked? Almost don't want to get ahead of myself.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

It's possible, I mean they gave us Shield vs Rhodes.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

But Rhodes Dynasty had the advantage of being in a big angle. Real Americans were used before this as talent fodder to enhance lesser teams. The clean win looks promising, but lets see how long the legs are for this to go. I'll be at least content with the PPV match, but I smell it being on TV thanks to the initial gimmick the PPV will hold. _(if they work vs each other in an elimination - that'll be acceptable)_


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

CODEH


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

KENNEH

You seen the great stuff lately? Shield vs Rhodes x2 etc.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

If they start putting Cesaro and Goldust in the ring together I may have to actually watch WWE programming. Well, that part of it anyway. I'll avoid the rest of the HHH Show. Man I can't say I actually dislike the guy, but I've just never been so sour on HHH before. I used to be such a huge fan and even if I knew that was going to inevitably dwindle, I didn't think I'd actually just want him to go the fuck away. I pretty much absolutely detest knowing he's even on TV at this point. Does he think his addition to stuff like Punk in 2011, Lesnar in 2012, and Bryan in 2013 ADDS to it? Or does he want to kill the momentum because he knows he can? Or does he just not want anything important to happen without him? I am not starting another goddamn HHH talk but I felt like shitting on him for a second. /over



On a massively, massively, massively positive note - I want Cesaro v. Goldust for at least 12 minutes of air time. Just...just IMAGINE.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I won't support another tiresome discussion on the guy, but man, it's some kind of emotional reaction that I can't quite figure out that he's the definitive heel meanwhile Orton is some geek left in the dust. Trips should just be the champ with the way this booking is done. I expected this from the start, but it still throws me off.

Cesaro vs Goldust. Please. I can't handle it. About went to the brink of ecstasy tonight just from their tag team encounter. Singles match pinned on Main Event as the premiere match. Holy bejezus it could happen.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

PGSucks said:


> Stephanie's rack gets ***** tonight. :hhh2


Dunno how long we've had it, but this smilie made me laugh.


Only watched a bit of HIAC:
Opening tag - *** 1/2
Punk/Ryback - * 3/4
Orton/Bryan - ** 1/2


Didn't bother with the Cena wins lol and all the filler matches. Saw Miz being gang raped but that was about it. 

Tag match was slow to get going but the second half was unbelievable. Hats off to all 6. Punk/Ryback managed to be worse than last year. At least 12 months ago we had the luxury of wondering what the finish would be; this was just dull. Doubt Ryback will ever have a good match that doesn't have Bryan involved. Speaking of Bryan, the main event was rather ordinary and about on par with the other two main events with Orton. The street fight was probably my favourite of all their matches and I'm not just saying that because of a conclusion finish. Kinda wish this was in February and last night you got Bryan challenge HBK to one final match at WrestleMania and 'steals his crown' so to speak.

Punk & Bryan stuck with the Wyatts now and no doubt an Orton/Big Show feud is coming :kenny


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

As much as I'd love to see Cesaro vs. Goldust, and I would...

WE'RE ONE STEP CLOSER TO HARPER VS. BRYAN


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> That's what Sandow gets for fucking with the GOAT though.
> 
> They're actually acknowledging Cena's superman gimmick. GOD HELP HIS HATERS at this point.
> 
> ...


Yessss! 

I love Cena. Really do. And it joys me to see so much hate around him. Makes me love him more to see him pretty much be the GOD Troll.


On Rock/Cena, I hope you are talking about that final 6 week lead in to the match.

The year long build up was tiresome. Rock was too jokes and Cena rambled to much about how hes here every week. It got old fast. Especially looking back at it. Rock's return and Cena's comeback promo the next week were all that mattered at the start.

Still lol at Cena spit orgasm over saying Rock's name for SS11 though. :lmao I guess it did have its moments.

Those final 6 weeks were good though. Starting with Cena's promo alone one week before Rocks return, then the wrist notes the next week as silly as it was was decent on Cena's half. Rock finally got serious on Cena in Boston face to face, good promo in Philly, and the two had a great go home promo together. 

Its just a shame so many folks were burned out from the two by the time the match came. 

I still felt like they had better promos this years. Serious and to the point. Less jokes.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Survivor Series right now is looking like shit. What's the main focus? Orton/Show? :lmao

And then we have Cena/ADR and Punk-Bryan against The Wyatts to be main event feuds as well? Hell, those two matches feel like a bigger deal than the WWE Title match right now. :lmao 

Or that's what it looks like it's going to be. Who knows? Maybe Show/HHH still happens and Orton joins The Wyatts to face Punk, Bryan, and two other guys in a 4-on-4 elimination match. 

Looking forward to Punk and Bryan teaming up at least. Crowd should go crazy when the two are finally in the ring together.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Havent cared much about the WWE since August.


Im ready for Rumble-Mania season.

Looking forward to.. 

Royal Rumble :mark:
Sheamus Return :mark:
Mark Henry Return :mark:
Brock! :mark: :mark:
Taker :mark: :mark: :mark:
Wrestle-Fucking-Mania XXX :mark: :mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Forgive me but, what was the point of Punk/Ryback on Raw? Just for the Wyatt beatdown?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Cena's promo was so damn lame last night. Just standard Cena Superman fare. I respect Cena and geuinely enjoy him in the ring (when he gives a damn), but I'm a 26 year old man. Most of his promos and goody two shoes Boy Scout behavior have grown irksome. It's a shame too, because when he had that fire and more importantly has a reason, he's one of the best on the mic. It's just too often we him ramble about the same damn shit, never quitting, hustle loyalty respect, etc, and it all seems without purpose.


I'm not naive enough to think we will ever get the Cena heel turn. There are too many factors (many of them monetary) that makes it an outright impossibility for Cena to turn right now. The only way it would ever be possible is if another baby face came along that surpassed Cena's immense drawing power/merch sales, social relevance, etc. Essentially a guy who could supplant Cena as the face of the WWE. Seriously doubt that happens, therefore I seriously doubt a Cena turn is ever gonna happen. Not to mention, we don't even know if Cena has that evil character in him. By all accounts he's pretty much exactly the character he portrays, just a good dude who works extremely hard and is extremely loyal to the WWE.

That doesn't mean Cena needs to stay the exact same forever. I'd relish more of a mean, angry, pissed off and bad ass Cena. He could "mature" his character while remaining a face, and also add some fans over 18 instead of just monopolizing the 13 and under market. Why WWE doesn't consider doing this, I'm not exactly sure, maybe they are scared with messing with an already good thing. However, my only hope is that some day the incessant booing of Cena turns into indifference. As soon as the Lets Go Cena/Cena Sucks chants are replaced with crickets, that's when I think we might get a change. WWE has shown they are quite comfortable going on forever with Cena's current 50/50 split of cheers and boos, because he still gets the biggest reaction out of anyone on the roster. Only when Cena's character has grown so stale that people can't even be bothered to boo anymore will there ever be the slightest possibility of change.

All of this is just a really long way of saying, I wish I could be a Cena fan because I respect him and really enjoy his ring work, but I can't because his character is far too childish and not even marketed toward my age group. WWE didn't create the current Cena character to draw in fans from my 18-34 year old demo, so why would I root for something that was created to ignore my wishes?


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Orton Vs Show may have the biggest focus at the moment because it's HHH's storyline, but don't be mistaken; Punk/Bryan Vs The Wyatts & Cena Vs WHOEVER are both much bigger matches. I don't even think I need to explain myself here, they just are. 

"Rise Above Hate" Cena in late 2011 to Wrestlemania XXVIII is probably my favorite Cena on the stick. The Rock did his job I guess because he brought more out of Cena from a promo standpoint than anybody else besides Punk & Brock. Cena just seems bored when he's working with anybody else, it's weird. That's why I'll always say that Punk Vs Cena is this generation's greatest feud (besides the obvious polar opposite factor); they both bring the best out of each other in ever single conceiveable way, where as Edge seemingly brought down Cena's in ring presence while at the same time not bringing out nearly the amount of quality from Cena as Punk did.

Punk deserves better than this Wyatt feud, it's fucking shit. I get that they don't want him involved in the main story since he'll be ANOTHER person who overshadows the title, and they don't wanna put Orton over him at the moment I guess, but The Wyatt's? They couldn't do Punk Vs.... WOW.

I just realized that there's literally NOBODY better for Punk to face that isn't involved in the Authority storyline in some capacity. LOLWWEROSTER. It's just that there's barely anybody on Punk's level in terms of star power to the point where I'll believe it's a legit feud. There's Cena/HHH/Rock/Taker/Brock but it's like... He's already worked with those guys. What the fuck is next?


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

So, people hated RAW last night? Am I the only one who's enjoying the Bryan/HHH/Orton/Stephanie/Big Show/ And now apparently Kane and Wyatt fuckery? Isn't this what people have been asking for all the time? Intricate storylines involving multiple people and angles?

Anyway, I would also like to point out that WWE's tag division is sweeeeeet. Shield, Usos, Real Americans and Rhodes brothers are tearing it up every single week. I really hope the Shield don't split though, They were hinting at it last night. Why does every faction need to split? For Christ sake, they could still have single careers and be a faction still. At least give them a solid two years.

If there's one ting I absolutely HATED last night, was the Cena and Sandow fuckery. No, just no. Fuck no.

And one more thing, anyone else impressed with Summer Rae last night? She had that ROOTHLESS ARGRESSION!!


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> I just realized that there's literally NOBODY better for Punk to face that isn't involved in the Authority storyline in some capacity. LOLWWEROSTER. It's just that there's barely anybody on Punk's level in terms of star power to the point where I'll believe it's a legit feud. There's Cena/HHH/Rock/Taker/Brock but it's like... He's already worked with those guys. What the fuck is next?


A :show heel turn? Finally getting his win back over :jpl? 

I could see Survivor Series going with Punk and Bryan vs. The Wyatts in whatever form they see fit (I'm hoping a 5 on 5), Cena vs. Sandow vs. Del Rio for the WHC, and Orton vs. Show.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Anyone else joining Punk/Bryan is a let down, but it'll probably be Miz and someone else. Punk and Bryan not tagging in Miz would be so :lol

Still :lol'ing at dat Ryback burial.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

PUNK HAS MADE IT TO THE BIG TIMES BABY. BURYING MOTHERFUCKERS :mark:.

Hopefully this is used to get Punk involved in the Authority storyline in a main role come Wrestlemania season, the Austin to Bryan's Mankind PLZ and thank you very fucking much. I just think it's kind of fucked up how WWE had their two biggest full timers out of the main event picture since Summerslam. 

That's just fucking weird.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

PHIL WITH ALL DAT BACKSTAGE PULL. :mark: unk6

I could see Punk possibly taking the title off of Orton at Mania as well (the damn RTWM is gonna be unpredictable, which I welcome). However, where would that leave Cena? John boy's gotta close the show :cena5


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> I just realized that there's literally NOBODY better for Punk to face that isn't involved in the Authority storyline in some capacity. LOLWWEROSTER. It's just that there's barely anybody on Punk's level in terms of star power to the point where I'll believe it's a legit feud. There's Cena/HHH/Rock/Taker/Brock but it's like... He's already worked with those guys. What the fuck is next?


 Kane? Unless he becomes the corporate Kane again and helps Orton win at SS which will lead to a Kane/Big Show feud. Still don't know the story behind his unmasking other than "unleash the monster again". Maybe that's that.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

lol @ people thinking Wyatt's vs Punker & Danielson is a drawback. Good lord. Can't even make a new heel group a force without dissing it before it begins. Oh, ok. Obviously Punk & Danielson have to have something else to do before the WM build kicks in. And it aids the Wyatt's in growing. How is this bad? It's something fresh.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

The Primer said:


> lol @ people thinking Wyatt's vs Punker & Danielson is a drawback. Good lord. Can't even make a new heel group a force without dissing it before it begins. Oh, ok. Obviously Punk & Danielson have to have something else to do before the WM build kicks in. And it aids the Wyatt's in growing. How is this bad? It's something fresh.


Basically this. It's not a step down for Bryan/Punk by any means, but a major push for Wyatts, who have been doing fuck all since debuting. I thought people were sick of Wyatts not doing shit. Now they become involved with 2 of the 3 most over babyfaces and it's garbage? I don't understand, but oh well.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Awesome Sandow/Cena match, last night ***1/2


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I immediately thought the majority would go insane knowing Punk & Danielson are destined to team up at least once in their mega over states atm. Meh. I'm very into it. All that matters at the end of the day.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

If it concludes with Bryan/Punk at WM, I'm fine with whatver they do with them


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Punk fans should not be complaining, no one gave a flying fuck about him/Ryback. Wyatts are a lot more interesting than that waste of space.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

My only concern is that they'll end up foregoing Bryan/HHH. :sad:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

The Primer said:


> lol @ people thinking Wyatt's vs Punker & Danielson is a drawback. Good lord. Can't even make a new heel group a force without dissing it before it begins. Oh, ok. Obviously Punk & Danielson have to have something else to do before the WM build kicks in. And it aids the Wyatt's in growing. How is this bad? It's something fresh.





The Lady Killer said:


> Basically this. It's not a step down for Bryan/Punk by any means, but a major push for Wyatts, who have been doing fuck all since debuting. I thought people were sick of Wyatts not doing shit. Now they become involved with 2 of the 3 most over babyfaces and it's garbage? I don't understand, but oh well.


Agreed with these posts. The Wyatt Family needs something to do now that they've apparently dropped the Kane storyline, and The Wyatt's feuding with two top stars is a great way to establish the group. Just like The Shield got established from feuding with top guys. I noticed they got some good heat when they were beating down Punk last night, that was good. As a fan of Bray Wyatt I'm all for this, and maybe now one of my favorites in the company will finally be doing something relevant. I really wish they would do something with Ziggler though atm. :side:


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

We gotta wait and see, him no locking hbk isnt the end of it imo.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Has Ziggler even been on TV lately?

edit That's true, doom.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

This is why I don't like to plan around WM season. You never know what will be up their sleeve. Only thing I got cooking up is either Punk or Danielson could win the Rumble. After that; it's fair game with anyone.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

xdoomsayerx said:


> We gotta wait and see, him no locking hbk isnt the end of it imo.


I said it yesteray before RAW that i'm sure now that we will get a Shawn/Bryan match eventually.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Srdjan99 said:


> I said it yesteray before RAW that i'm sure now that we will get a Shawn/Bryan match eventually.


I just can't see that 'One more match' from HBK, not even for Bryan. IMO.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Last Dolph match on TV was vs Sandow on Main Event last week. Worked vs Orton on RAW the same week too.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'm half and half on the situation right now. One the one hand... PUNK AND BRYAN AS A TEAM. It could lead to them teaming against THE AUTHORITY too. However, like TLK said... they could end up forgetting the whole thing and this could be used to phase Bryan out. He was JUST screwed out of the WWE title. For like the 3rd time in a row. And now he's seemingly randomly gonna be fighting with The Wyatt Family who have done fuck all for 90% of their time on the main roster. Yeah, this benefits the WYATT family, but what does it do for Bryan right now other than push him down for a while? I'd have preferred Kane Vs Bryan, with Kane now the Corporate Monster or whatever. Have HHH and Steph sick him on Bryan, with Bryan having to go through Kane to get another title shot or whatever. They have the history and shit so it would make sense. PUNK against the Wyatt family on his own could be better imo. For starters it gets Punk the fuck away from Heyman and Axel (the fuck is up with him anyway?) and Ryback, and him having to battle those 2 monsters to get to the leader... wait fuck that, it sounds like the same thing he's just done :lmao. A team might be better, but I'm not sold on the fact it should be BRYAN. Ziggler maybe would have been better? Like, the fuck is he doing? I think I kinda lost my original point with all this rambling.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Don't think HBK ever comes back for a match, but if this whole thing leads to HHH coming to the aid of his friend like HBK did for him @ HIAC, then :mark:.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

I don't see the point of Shawn's biterness if not. We have to wait and see, but I am kinda sure that hbK will deliver one more match


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

We'll probably get Bryan Vs HHH with HBK as a referee AGAIN :lmao.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Callamus said:


> We'll probably get Bryan Vs HHH with HBK as a referee AGAIN :lmao.


You know what, i could totally see this as a possibility. :|


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

^^ shawn screwed Bryan when he fought Orton, wonder what he will do when Bryan fights his BF


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Probably true. Would still :mark: for that match regardless.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's just a transitional phase for Danielson following the Championship picture b/c we all knew he'd be away from it for a tiny bit. Of course the booking went immediately haywire and now it's so damn poor that they basically screwed up the Danielson vs Authority angle from the beginning, but this recent event doesn't surprise me. I still think he'll do his thing for two more months (maybe less) & then he'll be back in the thick of it. Or perhaps he'll never go away. That's not written in stone either. Wyatt's "Devil made me do it" slogan could even be Triple H or Vince at the helm for all we know.

Or Heyman b/c he called himself the Devil - or Satan for more specifics - at HIAC. Yeah, conspiracy theorist all up in here.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Only Daniel Bryan could get HBK boo'ed like that last night. :ti

Curious to see if Shawn shows up again or he just vanishes.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah, he said "The Devil made me do it" after attacking them both, and the commentators even brought attention to it, so I can see one of the authority figures behind this. Also, if they tease a Shield split/turn, the Wyatts can replace The Shield in the corporation and we can have many more months of 6-man tags! :mark:


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Oh shit, just realized where Wyatt assaulting Punk stems from!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Was thinking The Wyatt's might overtake the Shield these days. Then Shield owned the jobbers last night and made me believe - get it? - that they'll remain just fine the rest of the year. Which is good. b/c I'm not so sure a breakup just yet is for the best. Could be wrong, but hey, the unit is so damn golden, why would you want to stop it?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

REIGNS DOUBLE SPEAR :mark:


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Cool photo from last night.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

2 Big Show vs randy orton PPV's matches in a single year would be too painful to watch..


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Reigns wins matches all on his own. My love for this beast is endless.


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

Shield legit could have a 3 disc set devoted to their first year, more than enough amazing matches to put on it. 

Hopefully someone on XWT makes a custom one or something, but seriously WWE, make that shit.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Numberwang said:


> Shield legit could have a 3 disc set devoted to their first year, more than enough amazing matches to put on it.
> 
> Hopefully someone on XWT makes a custom one or something, but seriously WWE, make that shit.


Well Seabs did a Vol.1  hopefully he does further volumes...


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Reigns wins matches all on his own. My love for this beast is endless.


Love how jacked up he gets after he destroys people too. :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:mark:

REIGNS


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Dat powerbomb setup :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

REIGNS


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Will we ever see a more perfect in-ring debut than The Shield's? 

Unbelievable that that was their first ever match as a unit and it's perfect.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah, that match really was perfect. It was almost a surreal atmosphere in a way, with their badass entrance and then BRYAN going fucking crazy in a comeback attempt.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

No. I feel soooo comfortable saying that too. There's no way. TLC last year was utter gold. One of the most likable matches I can ever remember.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Just remembering different moments of the match makes me all giddy and wanting to watch it again, so that's exactly what I'm going to do.

THE BLACKOUT ON THE CHAIR. I squealed a little bit when I saw that.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

BLACKOUT on the chair was so awesome. I legit yelled "OHHHHH!" when it first happened. Then Rollins nearly dying at the end. TRIPLE POWERBOMB THROUGH TABLE TO WIN~! :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Greatest spot ever seen in the history of something that I feel like putting over.

holy SHIT


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

The Lady Killer said:


> Has Ziggler even been on TV lately?
> 
> edit That's true, doom.


Uh not much, I have no idea what they're doing with him. He had a little feud with Ambrose over the US Title, they had a quite a few matches together but nothing became of it. Then he recently had a few matches with Sandow and hasn't done anything since. Originally Ziggler had a role in the main storyline alongside Bryan and Big Show as a minor face against the authority, but now they've pushed too many guys into the storyline to the point where they've totally forgot about Ziggler. I feel Ziggler should be in Cody Rhodes's position now, that of a fresh popular face with momentum and a relevant position on TV, but they're just not using him, probably because he's still got backstage heat on him, but damn it's sad to see how much Ziggler's fallen. His face turn earlier in the year was so much better and meaningful than Rhodes's, and he had good momentum and was getting over nicely until WWE killed his momentum.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

The cash in on ADR and ensuing double turn @ Payback was a great way to have Ziggler emerge as a top face. Crowd was behind him and it was fresh. Must've pissed off all the wrong people backstage.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Lady Killer said:


> The cash in on ADR and ensuing double turn @ Payback was a great way to have Ziggler emerge as a top face. Crowd was behind him and it was fresh. Must've pissed off all the wrong people backstage.


Couldn't keep his mouth shut and that got him into trouble. The concussion obviously didn't help him in any way.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

You guys do realize that every match we talk about after now will just be a let down?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Dolph 

It's too bad. Hate it.

Rhodes :mark:

thank holy science I have this to counter act. + GOLDUST.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Punk/Bryan vs Wyatt Family intrigues the shit out of me. However nearly everything else (other than Shield & Rhodes Bros) doesn't at all. Both main event scenes look dreadful at the moment.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm into Big Show messing shit up with the crowd going nuts. That's about it there.

World Championship being Cena & Del Rio is :lenny


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Feud wise everything is great, it's just when it comes to the pay per view matches it is usually a let down


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I just want to know where Sheamus fits in when he returns.

SHEAMUS VS CENA?

:homer


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Potential 4-way tag title match @ S. Series could be GOAT.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I can't really see Orton/Show being too good on a PPV. I didn't really care for their match at Payback and this will be roles reversed. 

Cena/Del Rio have good chemistry though. I'm just not interested in the idea of that feud again. Sheamus could spice that up when he returns, though.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> Potential 4-way tag title match @ S. Series could be GOAT.


NO! NO! NO!

Fuck The Usos, they need to be relegated back to Superstars.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Brye said:


> I can't really see Orton/Show being too good on a PPV. I didn't really care for their match at Payback and this will be roles reversed.


I think the reversal of roles will help the match quality. Orton is a better heel and Big Show can work pretty well as the face who dishes out punishment against despicable heels.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

I could see this happening. 5 man tag. 

Roman + Rollins 
Wyatts

Vs 

Punk 
Bryan 
Cody 
Goldust 
Ziggler 

Show/ Orton. With Kane interference helping Orton retain and being the corporate monster.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> Has Ziggler even been on TV lately?


No, and it makes me very sad, I can buy he is in the doghouse, but I cant buy the "they have nothing for him" as of the top of my head I can think of atleast 4 feuds to place him in, whatevs


I think last night pretty much confirmed Heartbreak isnt wrestling again, and as much as it pains me he shouldn't. Had the perfect send-off and if he did the " career match" at mania would lose ALL creditability.

After last night I'm guess it is going to be orton/show svs and then hhh/show rumble


And to add to what was said yesterday, Stephanie was looking just some kinda of fine


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Usos aren't that bad imo.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> Usos aren't that bad imo.


But you hate Punk? 

You are an enigma


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Usos arent that bad tbhayley, much worse talent out there


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

William Murderface said:


> But you hate Punk?
> 
> You are an enigma


I'VE NEVER SAID I HATED PUNK.

I just wanted him to lose against BROCK. :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

lol @ at a four way tag. Sounds awful over a straight up Real Americans vs Rhodes Dynasty match.

why would the jobbers aka Usos even be in it to begin with? Losing to the Shield since late June has ran it's course. Die already.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> I'VE NEVER SAID I HATED PUNK.
> 
> I just wanted him to lose against BROCK. :mark:


I stand corrected, my bad haha.

the 5 people I wanna fire from the WWE are The Usos, Kofi, Langston & Santino because they are all useless!!


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

So, if we're lucky, this is how SVS will look if they don't fuck with something else:

HHH/Show _(Orton/Show just don't have chemistry, plus Cena defending the WHC in Boston is big 'nuff on it's own)_
Cena/ADR _(maybe /Sandow in a TT or w/some stipulation)_
Team Bryan _(Bryan, Punk, Miz, Big E &... idk, Ziggler?)_/Team Orton _(Orton, Corporate Kane & Wyatts)_
Rhodes/Shield/Usos/Real Americans _(OR, though unlikely, Team Rhodes (Rhodes, Usos, Matadores & PTP)/Team Shield (Shield, Real Americans & 3MB) in one of those old school all-Tag Team/Stable SVS match)_
AJ/Natalya
Some other shit.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Show is obviously getting a championship match. that's his way of dropping the lawsuit & getting his job back.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I don't know who I currently have more of a MAN CRUSH on. Roman Reigns and his DOUBLE SPEAR, or Tajiri and his KILL YOUR FACE KICKS. Tajiri/Noble from NM 02 started it... and well I may have decided to do 2002 PPV's now after all and I've started another event that has another KICK filled Tajiri match.

Tajiri/Reigns as a modern day Tajiri/Rhyno match. FAP FAP FAP.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I still think HHH/Show is gonna happen at Mania, but that's just me.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Is sandow/cena that good ?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

redskins25 said:


> Is sandow/cena that good ?


It was a very good match :agree:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I almost started various no **** comments on REIGNS the last page. Will power stopped me. Now Cal has reawakened it. Oh no.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

I can see them saving Show/ HHH for the rumble.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

William Murderface said:


> I stand corrected, my bad haha.
> 
> the 5 people I wanna fire from the WWE are The Usos, Kofi, Langston & Santino because they are all useless!!


Replace Langston with Khali. Guy can barely walk.



redskins25 said:


> Is sandow/cena that good ?


Yes.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Also, Del Rio keeps sayin he's gonna break cenas arm, I sense Cena/ Del Rio submission or I quit match for SS.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

But at least that's why Khali sucks. Why does Langston suck? b/c he's a pile of shit that the company is force feeding down my throat. Goodness it's the pits.

Hell I've seen Khali have better matches though so he wins regardless :hb


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Langston's spear on Ambrose through the ropes > Khali's entire career.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

On the talk of his namesake, Khali/Kane/Batista @ GAB '07 was that year's Sheamus/Show-like sleeper hit.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nah. Good matches > being a limited chump.

He wouldn't know that though.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> Replace Langston with Khali. Guy can barely walk.


But at least he has a valid excuse for sucking, Langston has no excuse for being awful, so therefore he has to go.

Plus Khali is a retard


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

You brothers are ganging up on me AND I DON'T LIKE IT. 

edit Hornswoggle can GTFO too.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

You won't win. The blood that boils here is killer.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Well don't enjoy crap "athletes" like The Usos & Langston.

Just talk about BROCK :lenny


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

3 AINT ENOUGH MAN I NEED FIVEEEEEEEE !!!

NW# cena/sandow cash in


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

William Murderface said:


> Well don't enjoy crap "athletes" like The Usos & Langston.
> 
> Just talk about BROCK :lenny


I wouldn't go as far to say I enjoy them; they're just not that bad.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Those great athletes in the world of wrestling. I love finding that cop out so much. But it baffles me how or why companies book wrestlers when they're clearly limited. I mean seriously. What in the hell is the point - especially when they're not even a success.

Cena vs Sandow ruled. Even with the hilarious notion of a commercial during a cash-in.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> I wouldn't go as far to say I enjoy them; they're just not that bad.


If it's not hate were not on the same level my friend, but to each's own man.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

TWO commercials. One commercial to give Cena time to regain his composure and one during the match.

Everyone see Khali take like, a minute to get off the ring apron before Nattie's match last night? :ti


----------



## ArnoldTricky (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Reigns wins matches all on his own. My love for this beast is endless.


Said consistently he's the most likely to be a main eventer out of the three.

He just has the look and build for it. Rollins is still my favourite but Reigns will go the furthest.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

He very well could. And I would be 100% for it.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Those jumping Cross Rhodes that Cody's been doing recently look awesome every time.



William Murderface said:


> If it's not hate were not on the same level my friend, but to each's own man.


:lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

b/c not caring about other's opinions on who they do like/dislike is funny stuff, huh? 8*D


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I have my door shut at work and the lady in the office across from me keeps saying something into the phone that sounds like "ASS WHORE". Just thought you all might like to know that. Shows you were my mind is during my last hour of the day.

As for the previous discussion, I'm cool with a Punk/Bryan vs the Wyatt's mini-feud. I was starting to grow a bit impatient with the Wyatt's booking. Yea Brays promos are excellent and lord knows I love watching those tags, but what the hell was their PURPOSE? Bray randomly kidnapping/beating people, telling non sensical stories about Icharus, etc. I was just worried they would just drift around aimlessly without a real feud or purpose.

Well that problem seems to have been solved, so I'm happy about that. This isn't a demotion for Punk/Bryan, it's a well deserved boost for the Wyatt's. Plus I'm just DYING to see Bryan eat one of Harpers boots + clothes lines. Good god that could be amazing :mark:


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

If the WWE handle this correctly, Punk/Bryan vs. The Wyatts could be one of the best feuds to happen in a long time. So many factors to cater for your modern day wrasslin' fan: fantastic mic workers; fantastic ring workers; big tough brawlers; Bray's mind-fuckery and psychology...there may be more added to this mix after a little while (Kane etc) but I'm going to love this.


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

I straight up couldn't enjoy Cena/Sandow last night because i knew what was coming. I seriously don't see how this will help Sandow in any way, i'm seeing people say this will raise him up but i seriously doubt that. It's like they gave him the case for the Rhodes feud which was okay but didn't garner any crowd reactions whatsoever, luckily for Rhodes it somehow worked out for him, but Sandow's been lost in the shuffle, last night was the writers crossing Sandow's name off of possible problems in Cena's future.

But he's baaaaaaaack.

Cena's obviously been shifted over to "operation save Smackdown's attendance figures"

Mr. No Days Off :cena3


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Numberwang said:


> I straight up couldn't enjoy Cena/Sandow last night because i knew what was coming. I seriously don't see how this will help Sandow in any way, i'm seeing people say this will raise him up but i seriously doubt that. It's like they gave him the case for the Rhodes feud which was okay but didn't garner any crowd reactions whatsoever, luckily for Rhodes it somehow worked out for him, but Sandow's been lost in the shuffle, last night was the writers crossing Sandow's name off of possible problems in Cena's future.
> 
> But he's baaaaaaaack.
> 
> ...




I think this raises Sandow because he just had a VERY good, possibly GREAT match with the WWE's top guy. That has gotta impress the office of WWE, so I think they will show more faith in the future with Mr. Sandow and maybe give him more of a push. He spent the past few months after winning the briefcase getting buried and jobbing out, so while losing isn't great, it's better than losing to ADR like he did last week. If Sandow had to lose, be glad it's to a top guy. That match was 85% Sandow 15% John Boy. He had a great showing on national television, the office will have to notice that. They finally gave him the time with a top guy and he delivered big time. That's gotta count for something in their eyes.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> I think this raises Sandow because he just had a VERY good, possibly GREAT match with the WWE's top guy. That has gotta impress the office of WWE, so I think they will show more faith in the future with Mr. Sandow and maybe give him more of a push. He spent the past few months after winning the briefcase getting buried and jobbing out, so while losing isn't great, it's better than losing to ADR like he did last week. If Sandow had to lose, be glad it's to a top guy. That match was 85% Sandow 15% John Boy. He had a great showing on national television, the office will have to notice that. They finally gave him the time with a top guy and he delivered big time. That's gotta count for something in their eyes.


 I don't think he is buried completely as we need to be patient and see what happens in the future but his recent booking that gives me no optimism in the future. He wasn't credible before his MITB win, during his run and now, he failed to win the world title. If he can't beat an injured Cena then how are we supposed to believe that he can beat a fully fit and ready Cena?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

ADR with no existing injuries or pre-match assaults defeating Sandow clean is nowhere near as bad as Cena with *one arm and an injured leg* defeating Sandow clean. The bold part is the reason why I and others are considering it a burial. 

Now just because Sandow was buried doesn't mean they can't make something out of this. He was the one, after all, who gave Cena that vicious beating before the match, and he did it on his own, without resorting to an attack from behind. They could salvage this travesty and make Sandow a big threat to Cena in the future by having him turn up the intensity and becoming more ruthless and dangerous because of the humiliating loss... but I'm not holding my breath with how WWE has booked Sandow... and everyone else not named Cena, Punk, and Bryan.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> I think this raises Sandow because he just had a VERY good, possibly GREAT match with the WWE's top guy. That has gotta impress the office of WWE, so I think they will show more faith in the future with Mr. Sandow and maybe give him more of a push. He spent the past few months after winning the briefcase getting buried and jobbing out, so while losing isn't great, it's better than losing to ADR like he did last week. If Sandow had to lose, be glad it's to a top guy. That match was 85% Sandow 15% John Boy. He had a great showing on national television, the office will have to notice that. They finally gave him the time with a top guy and he delivered big time. That's gotta count for something in their eyes.


That's what I think too. I was really impressed with his performance and any doubts of his in-ring abilities was over for me after that match. I'm probably not the only one who thinks this. Surely the higher-ups in WWE were also impressed enough to give him a chance in the future to be in the title hunt? After all, he's got the mic skills, charisma and now we see the wrestling abilities to be a main eventer.


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

I do by the way do not think that it was a burial as such just a bad choice, it just seemed like they remembered they had Sandow holding the case and needed to get him out of the way because there would always be an underlying realisation that during whatever matches the champion has, that Sandow would be expected to cash in, a burial would have been in the ring and straight away an AA to finish it. 

I think they just needed Sandow out of the way and thoughts of the fans. Now it's plain sailing for whatever they want to do with Cena and the big gold belt.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Sandrone said:


> ADR with no existing injuries or pre-match assaults defeating Sandow clean is nowhere near as bad as Cena with *one arm and an injured leg* defeating Sandow clean. The bold part is the reason why I and others are considering it a burial.
> 
> Now just because Sandow was buried doesn't mean they can't make something out of this. He was the one, after all, who gave Cena that vicious beating before the match, and he did it on his own, without resorting to an attack from behind. They could salvage this travesty and make Sandow a big threat to Cena in the future by having him turn up the intensity and becoming more ruthless and dangerous because of the humiliating loss... but I'm not holding my breath with how WWE has booked Sandow... and everyone else not named Cena, Punk, and Bryan.



That last part of what you said is why I don't consider it a burial. It's not like he cashed in immediately after the ADR/Cena match when Cena's arm had already been worked. He waited until Cena came out perfectly fine right after he gave his "ready to take on the world, the champ is here!" Speech. He himself, with help from no one, beat and abused Cena and worked his arm. He did all that, it's not like Cena had only 1 arm to begin with.

I also disagree with your first statement. Losing to Cena in a World Title match, no matter what the circumstances, is better than jobbing to ADR in a nothing match. I'm sorry I just think it is. Hey we all have out own opinions, but ADR isn't even in Cena's stratosphere as far as legacy, star status, or importance in "WWE Universe" terms. 

If Sandow couldn't beat Del Rio in a non-title match, how in the hell was he supposed to beat him when the Gold was on the line? Title matches will always carry more signicance than the same match as a non-title affair, but then you swap ADR for Cena? I feel like that's not even in the same league, hell the same sport.

For me, without looking too much into and as a guy that happens to like Sandow, I feel like this was a necessary "step back" in order to take 2-3 steps forward. He just proved to me and everyone else if you give him 10+ minutes with a Main Event player, he will deliver. That sort of stuff matters in the grand scheme of things, and I would like to think the people in the WWE "office" think that matters too.

Think of it this way, he just had a match with Cena that blew away the match he had had with ADR only 24 hours prior. The "office" supposedly LOVES ADR. To anyone that knows a damn thing about wrestling Sandow/Cena>ADR/Cena. So Sandow out shining the offices "boy" will force them to recognize Mr. Sandows ability.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Cactus Jack said:


> That last part of what you said is why I don't consider it a burial. It's not like he cashed in immediately after the ADR/Cena match when Cena's arm had already been worked. He waited until Cena came out perfectly fine right after he gave his "ready to take on the world, the champ is here!" Speech. He himself, with help from no one, beat and abused Cena and worked his arm. He did all that, it's not like Cena had only 1 arm to begin with.
> 
> I also disagree with your first statement. Losing to Cena in a World Title match, no matter what the circumstances, is better than jobbing to ADR in a nothing match. I'm sorry I just think it is. Hey we all have out own opinions, but ADR isn't even in Cena's stratosphere as far as legacy, star status, or importance in "WWE Universe" terms.
> 
> ...


We'll just have to agree to disagree then. A one-armed anybody, even Cena, should be beaten by anyone except maybe the bottom-feeding jobbers, and that's it. Losing to ADR, while not great, ain't anywhere near as bad. Again, we'll just have to agree to disagree.

As for your last paragraph, that's how it should be, but not how it is. Vince loves ADR and because of the specific demographic he attracts (the only demographic that gives a shit about him), so even if Sandow had a better match with Cena than Del Rio, it doesn't make a difference. Only if the crowd starts reacting to Sandow week in and week out will we maybe see something happen. Having a better match though doesn't guarantee anything. And honestly, while Sandow was getting good reactions when he first came on the scene in his first few Raw appearances (when he was feuding with Brodus Clay), it's still not set in stone that Sandow can successfully draw a ton of heat on a consistent basis.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I agree that despite the good showing Sandow made in that match, it was pretty absurd for Cena to still come out on top. It was reminiscent of Cena taking like 3 Ziggler finishers and Big E's finisher and still winning that cage match. Granted, Sandow hasn't exactly been booked all that great, and a good showing against Cena is likely only a positive for him even though he came up short. Still, it was pretty ridiculous.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

AHH all you girls can stop your crying about Sandow being buried :lol


You want to know what being buried means " Go from turning face after an amazing and Show-Stealing match, receive good reactions in June to being placed in a meaningless feud for the US/IC ( The nxt title is worth more at this point),being on the guest panel, and now doing as much as Justin Gaberial in not even being on cards anymore

















Yes I'm talking about Sin Cara :troll


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I don't think Sandow was necessarily buried. It was moreso standard Cena OVERCOMING ALL ODDS fare. Commentators slobbering all over his dick during the match didn't help.


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

JBL creaming over Cena hurts me a little,

2005 JBL, REMEMBER?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

JBL been putting over Cena since 2006. There are certain people JBL always puts over on commentary and that's legends and top guys. But it's hilarious whenever he starts hating somebody and bashes them all the time. MIZ 2006 was the only thing making Moz segments bearable.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Whats the date of the Chavo/Bourne match Yeah1993 always pimps? I've been watching a lot of Chavo today and I'm kinda' warming up to him (Hi Cal ) and a match vs. Bourne sounds pretty swanky.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Folks, if he wasn't before, he is now. CM Punk is officially a current day global pop culture icon.






unk unk2 unk3 unk4 unk5


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

FluxCapacitor said:


> Whats the date of the Chavo/Bourne match Yeah1993 always pimps? I've been watching a lot of Chavo today and I'm kinda' warming up to him (Hi Cal ) and a match vs. Bourne sounds pretty swanky.


I believe it's 7-15-08, that's a darn good one I can think of. Not sure if Yeah pimped it or not, I know they had 1 or 2 other matches but I haven't seen those.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Wouldn't say Sandow was buried. More of a victim of circumstance. Cena is in the World Championship picture to give him something important to do without taking the heat off of guys feuding vs The Authority like Danielson & Show. Sandow had a great showing no matter the impactful loss. I don't think he's ruined by any means, b/c he was never close to Cena's level to begin with. This could be used as a way to keep him relevant in that section of workers. Still not a lock that he's out of the picture too. Cena & Del Rio rematch is upcoming, but it could be with another guy in the mix. Sandow is still in a solid place with the company. He's got room to rise. Until he starts getting Ziggler treatment, that's when you start to worry. Hate saying it like that, but that's the truth.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I don't think Sandow losing was that bad because the match was very solid.

Just don't quite understand the logic though.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Sandow was already pretty low on the totem pole so a good showing against Cena can only enhance his status. That being said, it's typical Cena OVERCOMING THE ODDS with a bum arm and knee.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

FluxCapacitor said:


> Whats the date of the Chavo/Bourne match Yeah1993 always pimps? I've been watching a lot of Chavo today and I'm kinda' warming up to him (Hi Cal ) and a match vs. Bourne sounds pretty swanky.


NO. YOU STOP RIGHT THERE. NOBODY WARMS UP TO CHAVO FUCKING GUERRERO JR.

Also, hi .

Watching BACKLASH 2002 right now. Yeah, I'm doing 2002 PPV's now . No Mercy 02 got me in the mood. DAMN HIAC MATCH!!! Ended up just downloading the 02 PPV's I don't own (like, all but 5) from youtube. Quality isn't amazing but they were small files, quick to download and I can at least watch them so they'll fucking do.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Everyone falls to Cena like that so it isn't a knock on Sandow in the slightest. That's how WWE does their business. Cena is the big name. Simple as that. Was with all the other big names in the past.

Cal how's that opener on Backlash treating you? :mark:

Also curious to know how you'll take to Angle vs Edge. That one really dropped for me. It's nothing more than flashy moves. Their Judgment Day match (and steel cage) >>>


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Opener is :mark:. I'm up to the GOAT UNDERTAKER VS AUSTIN match already.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Oh not this again 8*D

I'll just support the constant - UNDERTAKER


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

FluxCapacitor said:


> Whats the date of the Chavo/Bourne match Yeah1993 always pimps? I've been watching a lot of Chavo today and I'm kinda' warming up to him (Hi Cal ) and a match vs. Bourne sounds pretty swanky.


10/14/08



> Chavo Guerrero v. Evan Bourne (ECW 10/14/08)
> I have Taker v. Show LMS to re-watch** and it's been a while since I saw Show v. Maywether, but as of now this is probably my WWE 2008 MOTY. They open up with some snug and tight looking grappling, the kind of Jamie Noble stuff that doesn't look like the two guys were watching tapes and just mimicking what they see for fun. Chavo had this really awesome headlock that he wrenched and tugged on; reminded me of Orton's chinlock in the 04 Benoit match. Bourne starts to stand up and fight back, so Chavo switches to an armbar, which gives Guerrero leverage from a different side. Bourne hits beautiful arm drags, has a spectacular 'LOOK NO HANDS' dive, and plays an excellent babyface. I really don't know what else WWE want from him. OK, so he looks like a skinny midget Patton Oswald dork with goofy faces and crappy finger poses. Ignoring that, what else do they want from him? In this match I found myself saying 'I don't see that very often' or 'I've never seen that before' on certain spots. The best one was Bourne going for a top rope hurricanrana and Chavo sprinting out of the way so Bourne goes ass-first into the turnbuckle and crashes onto the mat. Amazing spot. There was a cool Liger-like kappo kick from Chavo here too and a really good and different looking roll-up from Evan. Maybe it was the video quality I was watching, but I swear there was an Irish whip where Chavo tried to poke Bourne in the eyes but failed. If that actually happened that was amazing as well. Bourne gets to hit the rana he didn't earlier in the match (does it by jumping from the mat to Chavo's head while Chavo is sitting on the top rope), Chavo makes the 'positioning oneself for opponent's finisher' not look awkward, and the match comes full circle. All right sons of bitches this is a Chavo match and I don't know what there is possibly not to like about it. Well, he does the three amigos which I've always been iffy about, but Bourne counters the third amigo by kneeing Chavo in the goddamn head while being held vertically. Great match.


**Note that I saw Taker/Show Cyber Sunday after this and thought that this was clearly, clearly, clearly better. 

HYAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH CHAVO FANS UNITE :mark: A new breed of evil is coming.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Angle/Edge BL is a little more than flashy moves imo. I felt Edge's performance and selling and stuff did have an undying heart. I'm a sucker for 'in your face' moves by an underdog, so I :mark: when Edge Belly-to-Bellied Kurt as beautifully as the former. My opinion though. Totally agreed with JD being superior btw.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Callamus said:


> Opener is :mark:. I'm up to the GOAT UNDERTAKER VS AUSTIN match already.


Never seen it before and watching it now. Flair's red shoes :lol


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

> Maybe it was the video quality I was watching, but I swear there was an Irish whip where Chavo tried to poke Bourne in the eyes but failed. If that actually happened that was amazing as well.


Why did this put a smile on my face? Damn you, Jheri & your pez.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Never seen it before and watching it now. Flair's red shoes :lol


Dude, Cal fooled you. *Bad.*


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Is Backlash the match with Flair as guest referee and he screws up the final count then they play the clip backstage and he says "Oh shit" as he walks away? Or is it the one with Kane's marathon run to save Undertaker?

I watched Judgment Day 01 and Backlash 02 back to back so I have a hard time distinguishing them.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

First Blood match is the best (and I think possibly only good) match Undertaker and Austin had. Not to big on Backlash or Summerslam.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Cactus Jack said:


> First Blood match is the best (and I think possibly only good) match Undertaker and Austin had. Not to big on Backlash or Summerslam.


JD 01


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yep. Judgment Day 2001 is far and away their best match. It's tremendous.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Yep. Judgment Day 2001 is far and away their best match. It's tremendous.



I will need to watch that again I suppose, I always really dug Fully Loaded, I can't remember anything from Judgement Day.


I just noticed something.

I was watching Flair vs Steamboat WrestleWar89' for about the fifth or sixth time, and I noticed for the first time that Flair totally no-sells all of Steamboats arm work. That's the "story" to start the match, Steamboat is working on that arm to set up for the chicken-wing, the move Flair submitted to before. However, after 5-7 minutes of arm work, it's all forgotten and Flair doesn't sell it all. Steamboat even goes back to that arm after 15-20 minutes, and again Flair totally forgets it and doesn't sell a thing. The only time he sells it is when he's in the hold.

My question, why have I never noticed that before? When it happens in matches like Benoit/Trips NM00 or HBK/Cena WM23, it sticks out like a sore thumb and takes away from my feelings on a match. This WW89' match is one many people consider the greatest match in wrestling history, how has this not come up before? And why does Flairs no-selling not change my opinion of it at all, but it bothers the shit out of me when Cena did it last night to ADR? Has anyone else noticed this? Why am I asking so many questions?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Austin/Taker Backlash :jay

I mean, a chore to sit through. X-Pac wearing Kane's mask though. :kobe


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Never noticed it myself, however there was always something behind their WrestleWar match for me to claim it my least favorite of their trilogy in '89. Obviously, still up to that quality which every fan puts it at, but always thought COTC _(duh, it's like the greatest match ever)_ & Chi-Town Rumble were better. In my eyes. Which isn't universal as the energetic first match always seems to get the lowest pecking.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

So i finally tracked down the *Randy Savage vs Ted DiBiase match from Wrestlefest 1988* i've been after 

Ill try and upload if anyone wants it too.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Before or after the Steel Cage in MSG/SummerSlam? Either way, don't think I've actually seen it.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Great, my Backlash 02 DVD seems to go out of sync during the Undertaker/Austin match and continues for the rest of the event .


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Before or after the Steel Cage in MSG/SummerSlam? Either way, don't think I've actually seen it.


After mate - July 17th i think.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Gonna have to side with Cal on the Chavo hate.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Callamus said:


> Great, my Backlash 02 DVD seems to go out of sync during the Undertaker/Austin match and continues for the rest of the event .


You know you aren't missing anything. :hayley1



zep81 said:


> After mate - July 17th i think.


Rad. The lost match it seems.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Rad. The lost match it seems.


Yeah, i believe it was only on the Macho Madness VHS. Ill up it tomorrow (Y)


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Never noticed it myself, however there was always something behind their WrestleWar match for me to claim it my least favorite of their trilogy in '89. Obviously, still up to that quality which every fan puts it at, but always thought COTC _(duh, it's like the greatest match ever)_ & Chi-Town Rumble were better. In my eyes. Which isn't universal as the energetic first match always seems to get the lowest pecking.



I would agree that the New Orleans COTC is superior to WrestleWar, I haven't seen the Chi-Town Rumble in a while (it's the only one of the series not on the Flair set I have) so I don't want to say it's better. I've also seen a fantastic match they had at a house show near my house in Landover MD. Would need to rewatch, but I remember thinking at the time it was as good as any of the matches in that entire series. Apparently Jim Cornette filmed it haha, god bless him.

PSYCHED for that Savage/DiBiase upload :mark:


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I have a Warrior/Dibiase title match on VHS from forever ago. Wonder what event that was. Think it was for the title, so I'm guessing it was 1990.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

zep81 said:


> Yeah, i believe it was only on the Macho Madness VHS. Ill up it tomorrow (Y)


(Y)

I still have yet to watch the The Rock vs Triple H iron man you upped too. 



Cactus Jack said:


> I would agree that the New Orleans COTC is superior to WrestleWar, I haven't seen the Chi-Town Rumble in a while (it's the only one of the series not on the Flair set I have) so I don't want to say it's better.
> 
> PSYCHED for that Savage/DiBiase upload :mark:


Got to get Rise & Fall of WCW. It's on there. :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Think it was actually 1988-07-31 It is the right match lol as it comes right after the Cage match


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> I have a Warrior/Dibiase title match on VHS from forever ago. Wonder what event that was. Think it was for the title, so I'm guessing it was 1990.


Ted DiBiase v. The Ultimate Warrior (Ted attempts to win the WWF Title from the Warrior - SNME 11/23/90 )

Yep.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

There you have it. I remember coming across it YEARS ago and wondering what was on the tape. Then I turned it on and it was Warrior/Ted. :mark: No idea where it is now, though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I have a million regrets for not taping much wrestling when I was younger.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

You know Ive never seen the COTC one, only ww 89 and most of chi-town, odd, the ww match is usually the majority's favorite, but Ive hear each as the best of the series from different people, idk if I phrased that right

I have heard the landover MD is the best from some katz as well, Is it watchable from a camera isnt shaking like a madman type of way ?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I'm sure I have more late 80s/early 90s stuff somewhere, but I didn't start regularly taping until Summerslam 95.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Since you all were talking about it earlier.....

Gonna watch the GOAT introductory match, Shield vs Hell No Ryback TLC. And although I know CAL disagrees, my pick for the GOAT TLC match


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

There is a giant stash of 2002-2003 SD and RAW episodes on VHS somewhere in Las Vegas. :side:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's a TLC match that was effective on all points. Only one that I'd say competes strongly with it was the original from SummerSlam 2000. Another perfect match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

TLC III competes with it and BEATS it .


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I get confused on the numbering of the TLCs. Is 3 the one where Benoit eats shit on the table and BREAKS HIS FREAKIN NECK, or is that 4?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Aye that's 3 .


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

4's the one where Kane wins..on his own.



William Murderface said:


> I still think HHH/Show is gonna happen at Mania, but that's just me.


Don't think there's a chance it'll last that long. I think, like others, their story will conclude at the Rumble. 

I saw this idea in the WM 30 prediction thread and it's not bad: Show takes the title from Orton at TLC, Trips uses kayfabe (or is it :hhh2) politicking to take the title from him at the Rumble and Bryan wins the Rumble itself. And if they insist on Taker/Lesnar then have Cena keep the world title until Mania and face Punk. Sure it's not a mouthwatering Mania based on those matches but get a very good undercard (something they've sincerely lacked for a long time at WrestleMania) and it doesn't matter so much.

Definitely (like 99%) think the top 3 matches at Mania will involve those six. No Austin, no Rock.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Four is the stellar psycho fest on RAW in 2002. Everyone dies in it. I needed an excuse to put it over b/c I love it.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Those are all on the Ladder DVD right? I need to find where I put that set because there are some GEMS on it.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

TLC III is freaking amazing. Glad it made The Ladder Match set just in time. Agree with CAL on it being the best TLC match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

THE SHIELD Vs CODUST Vs THE REAL AMERICANS needs to happen at TLC in a TLC. A TLC for the Tag Team Titles for the one year Anniversary of THE SHIELD'S debut match at TLC in a TLC match :mark:.

Anyone got Vince's private number so I can call him and ask? He seems like the kind of fellow that would respond well to a fan giving him booking ideas .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> Those are all on the Ladder DVD right? I need to find where I put that set because there are some GEMS on it.


Yep. All the first TLC matches made it. The four tags & the two singles at the time - Cena vs Edge & Edge vs Flair.



Callamus said:


> THE SHIELD Vs CODUST Vs THE REAL AMERICANS needs to happen at TLC in a TLC. A TLC for the Tag Team Titles for the one year Anniversary of THE SHIELD'S debut match at TLC in a TLC match :mark:.
> 
> Anyone got Vince's private number so I can call him and ask? He seems like the kind of fellow that would respond well to a fan giving him booking ideas .


DFLEVJOEIFNEOIFEOIRHIDDSLKNFEOIGH

If this doesn't happen, I'll...do something. Idk. Please.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Omg Rollins in a TLC or ladder match....

Have Ziggler take the ic title and have a 20 minute Ziggler/Rollins ladder match :mark


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

So I watched Cena/Sandow. Good match but the commercial breaks were a fucking joke and so was the finish. Kinda makes me forget about the selling performance from Cena and the good showing from Sandow...



The Lady Killer said:


> Usos aren't that bad imo.


Don't worry, I'm on your side. Usos & Lansgton haven't done anything to make me hate them yet at all. Completely serviceable.



xdoomsayerx said:


> Also, Del Rio keeps sayin he's gonna break cenas arm, I sense Cena/ Del Rio submission or I quit match for SS.


:mark: :mark: :mark: Please make this happen so Cena can't win with the AA. Submission match, that is. Fuck that I Quit shit.



HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Everyone see Khali take like, a minute to get off the ring apron before Nattie's match last night? :ti


Hahaha. I did! I was like, wtf is he doing? This isn't a tag match.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Khali becoming an impressive running joke is too much.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Khali eliminating himself in a battle royal is still his greatest achievement :lmao.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> :mark: :mark: :mark: Please make this happen so Cena can't win with the AA. Submission match, that is.












:cena4


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Cena's Stepover Chinlock is so fpalm

And fpalm at :lawler last night when Sandow locked on the Crippler Crossface that Cena could lose to his own move.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

He can't lock it in if Del Rio destroys the arm like Sandow did. Or should I say if Cena sells it like he did for Sandow.

:delrio


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cena steals both HIAC & RAW. Bless him.

Face of the company for a reason. Soak it in.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The YouTube channels where I have been getting all of my 2002 ahows was blocked 

fortunately the remaining shows are on other channels, but it looks like my 2003 project is canceled for now. 

BTW- my next DVD goal is to get all of the 2004-2005 PPVS and add them to my collection, might take a while but I would totally be up for a 2004 and 2005 PPV review.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> He can't lock it in if Del Rio destroys the arm like Sandow did. Or should I say if Cena sells it like he did for Sandow.
> 
> :delrio


He can still go for a Sharpshooter or Figure Four, though. :cena5


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> He can still go for a Sharpshooter or Figure Four, though. :cena5


I strangely wanna see this just to see how bad they end up looking.  Can't be much worse than Rock's sharpshooters over the past couple years.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yea the was the stupids part of cena/sandow :lmao Sandow puts Cena in a crossface, and Lawler goes " He(Cena) may tap to his own submisson"


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I'll be perfectly frank, when I saw Sandow lock in the cross face, I completely lost my shit. I haven't seen that move since the Crippler did it (someone correct me if I'm wrong) and I thought that WWE would HAVE to acknowledge the name of the submission. Nope. Jerry calls it "Cena's own submission" and completely deflates my hype. Krispen goes back to not existing. Damnit.

Can one of you respectable fellows reccomend something to watch? I'm putting on Austin vs Taker JD01' right now, but that will be the end of the massive 89 match playlist I have stored on my 35" YouTube TV. Very sad. Even sadder? It only took me about 2 weeks to watch them all :lmao


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

I already wanna get in the mood for survivor series, hard to believe this is still considered a big 4 or is it? Imo MITB has surpassed it. 

I only have 98, 99, 02, 03, 04, and 06. Definitely NEED 01, and definitely won't bother rewatching 08-12 on YouTube . All have been disappointing. And probably won't bother watching 06 with the awful burial of team rated rko


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

HBShizzle and I *think* HHH have both used the Crossface since Benoit died. Might even be someone else too.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> I'll be perfectly frank, when I saw Sandow lock in the cross face, I completely lost my shit. I haven't seen that move since the Crippler did it (someone correct me if I'm wrong) and I thought that WWE would HAVE to acknowledge the name of the submission. Nope. Jerry calls it "Cena's own submission" and completely deflates my hype. Krispen goes back to not existing. Damnit.


The move has been used plenty of times since Benoit's death. HBK, HHH and Cena have used it numerous times and occasionally, they have actually called it the Crossface. But I hate it when they go silent if the move is locked on or one of those idiots call it an STF.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Bah, Backlash 02 going out of sync has really put a damper on my 02 project. I cba finishing the event off with the sound being so shit. Trying to sync it with media player classic causes the video to skip around. Looks like I'll have to convert it to a video file and stick it in Adobe Premiere and sync it up myself just so I can watch the second half of Taker/Austin and then such classic matches as AL SNOW & MAVEN VS BILLY & CHUCK and the GOAT Main Event HHH VS HOGAN.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Now that you mention it, I remember Cena doing it and Cole calling it the "STFU" :lmao

Benoit vs Regal NM06' up next


Edit- MY FUCKING GOD DID YOU HEAR THAT HEADBUTT????!!!!! :mark: :mark:


That was a work of friggin art. Good lord. Regal and Benoit just beat the piss out of each other for 12 minutes. One of my new favorites from Regal. ****1/4


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Bah, Backlash 02 going out of sync has really put a damper on my 02 project. I cba finishing the event off with the sound being so shit. Trying to sync it with media player classic causes the video to skip around. Looks like I'll have to convert it to a video file and stick it in Adobe Premiere and sync it up myself just so I can watch the second half of Taker/Austin and then such classic matches as AL SNOW & MAVEN VS BILLY & CHUCK and the GOAT Main Event HHH VS HOGAN.


The year does get better, any show post Summerslam is solid and has at least one good match,pre-Summerslam is meh, really dont feel like watching KOTR, NWO, or JD because but once I get those done I can focus on the last 3 PPVS, Veangence, SVS, and SUMMERSLAM :mark:. 

This does remind me to keep watching KOTR, only 1 match in and Jericho/RVD is bounf to be MOTN


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Cena steals both HIAC & RAW. Bless him.
> 
> Face of the company for a reason. Soak it in.


:cena3

Seconded. Possibly the greatest face the company has ever had with a legit case to be in that ELITE CLASS before it's all said and done. Just watch him go out in his hometown for Survivor Series and steal the show then too. Carries Rock at Wrestlemania 28 in an awesome display, and then the same month he wrestles in the arguable GOAT match with Brock at Extreme Rules. Remarkable.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Just rewatched Cena vs Sandow. Not quite as exciting as watching it live but still a wonderful match. (Y) Definitely the best cash-in match so far. Only competition comes from RVD vs Cena and I'm not sure if that one will hold up quite as much on a rewatch.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The Usos had a far better performance these past couple days than Cena.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

I think the tag division in general has stolen the show for a while. I'm really into most teams besides 3MB and Matadores tbh.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Just rewatched Angle vs Edge hair vs hair from JD 02..... FUCKING GREAT! 

****1/4


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Watched a little of WM 14 today. Completed the first three matches and not a bad show thus far. The opening match was a battle royale involving tag teams which the LOD won and it was a shit match with a dumb concept. If one tag member gets eliminated then the other member must go. The other two matches (Taka vs Aguilla and HHH vs O. Hart) were very good though. Liked the story in the Hunter vs Owen match with HHH going after the injured ankle which was sold very well by Owen. He even shows the affects of his injury when executing an inziguri. Didn't get the part with Chyna getting handcuffed outside of the ring though.

And the Rock interview on what he would do if he ruled the US was awesome. Amazing how in WM 13, he was sucking so badly as Rocky Maivia and a year later, he makes the Nation of Domination interesting and becomes one of the best parts of the RTWM 98. :rock


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Just bought the history of the WWE championship on Amazon, looks like an AMAZING set.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

xdoomsayerx said:


> Just rewatched Angle vs Edge hair vs hair from JD 02..... FUCKING GREAT!
> 
> ****1/4


I don't care what others say about Angle and Edge; They had some AMAZING matches. 


Also Austin and Undertaker had a great match at Judgement Day 2001? Are you guys trying to get me to risk taking my most valuable DVD out it's case to watch? It's a good show from what I remember. I think I liked the chain match and Benoit/Angle is on the card. 

If I do that though I will be obligated to re-watch Backlash 2001 as well.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> :cena3
> 
> Seconded. Possibly the greatest face the company has ever had with a legit case to be in that ELITE CLASS before it's all said and done. Just watch him go out in his hometown for Survivor Series and steal the show then too. Carries Rock at Wrestlemania 28 in an awesome display, and then the same month he wrestles in the arguable GOAT match with Brock at Extreme Rules. Remarkable.


Wouldn't say he carried Rock since that match fell apart in the second half, but hey, the rest computes. Funny to me how he gets his constant hate despite the company booking him next to no different than any big name prior. Said that a million times, yet it still falls on deaf ears. Oh well.

JOHN-BOY


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I do wonder if people would hate Cena less for his SUPERMAN COMEBACK + 1 AA = PIN if he had a finisher than actually looked half painful. A lot of times I often see people complaining that he only hits ONE finisher and apparently that's not enough. So if it was something more devastating would that be better? Like, if Undertaker came back and did the exact same thing but won with a TOMBSTONE, would anyone bar Ubertaker haters complain?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*Backlash 2002*

The last WWF PPV!


*Billy Kidman Vs Tajiri - WWF Cruiserweight Championship Match*

:mark: seems like a good way to start the PPV! Actual card for this show looks AMAZING on paper (bar the main event which no matter what would always look awful on paper lol). Hope the undercard holds up!

Poor Tajiri. His kip up is cursed. Every time he does one, Kidman knocks him back down again .

TORRIE chant. She's not so FAP FAP because Tajiri has her covered up and shit. BOOOO.

Oh man, the referee starts bitching at Tajiri for not breaking a hold in the ropes... so he rolls around and just kicks the absolute FUCK out of Kidman's face and rolls back in again, as if to say "hey ref, that was YOUR fault". Tajiri rules.

Tajiri rules in control. Kicks, back work, kicks. Being Tajiri. Awesome.

:mark: at Kidman countering the back spring elbow thingymabob with a dropkick. Tajiri flips RIGHT INTO it too. Looked GREAT. 

Holy flerking shizzle at that near fall! Kidman should be DEAD after a kick like that! But he kicked out!

SSP! Miss! KICK TO THE FACE! Tajiri wins! No!!! Kidman kicked out! Kidman kicked out!!! :mark:

Fans really get behind Kidman after that kickout. KIDMAN BOMB off the ropes! KICKOUT BY TAJIRI!!!

Kidman sets Tajiri up for another powerbomb and Tajiri spits the red mist into his eyes! Cleaver cover up during the pin, and Tajiri wins the CW title!!! ALL HAIL TAJIRI!

Great match! Tajiri is KING.

*Rating: ***1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 3*


*Scott Hall Vs Bradshaw*

The fuck is that music? Oh, apparently it's the NWO music. Except it's not. Was it edited out on the DVD or did they have a chance in music?

X-Pac is out with Hall (because Hogan left the NWO and Nash got "suspended" aka tore his quad walking :lmao ), and with the numbers game against Bradshaw, it looks like it's gonna be a long night for him. NO! FAROOQ! RON SIMMONS! The brand split might have split up APA as a team but they are FOREVER FRIENDS. Until Farooq gets fired for drugs and Bradshaw turns heel in 04.

I remember watching this show live and hoping we'd get a TAG TEAM MATCH made. But Teddy Long isn't a GM so no chance in hell of that happening .

Hall throws his toothpick at Bradshaw and bursts out laughing. So Bradshaw decks him in the mouth :mark:.

Hall stalling for AGES before turning around on the outside with Farooq behind him is :mark:. Farooq decks him, then attacks X-Pac and throws Hall back into the ring and THE REFEREE DOESN'T SEND HIM BACKSTAGE. The fuck ref? Teddy Long would have. If he didn't make it a tag match first.

X-Pac in Kane's mask is :lmao. He totally should have run with that as a gimmick. KANE-PAC.

Both guys pretty much just PUNCH EACH OTHER IN THE FACE for the majority. And since both guys throw some wicked punches I'm cool with that lol.

CLOTHESLINE FROM HELL~!

X-Pac puts Hall's foor on the ropes, so Farooq chases him around. Bradshaw watches then Hall low blows him for the win.

Nothing amazing here, but watchable. 2 guys punching each other in the face will always have a place in my heart lol.

*Rating: **
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*Trish Stratus Vs Jazz*

No thanks. Molly looks FAP FAP FAP with brown hair though. She cut a promo or something.

*Rating: NO*
*CAL SCALE - -1*


*Brock Lesnar Vs Jeff Hardy*

:lmao Heyman playing with LITA'S thongs is disturbingly hilarious.

Lesnar's first theme sucked.

Jeff gets some shots in early... and then LESNAR KILLS HARDY. An extended PPV squash match. And it's fucking EPIC. Lesnar is big and powerful and Jeff is happy to take crazy fucking bumps, so it works out wonderfully :mark:.

LITA looks incredible on the outside.

Damn, those multiple backbreakers are IMMENSE. Not only does Lesnar hold on to Jeff to do about 3 in a row, but he absolutely powers Jeff up nearly over his shoulders every time before he drives his back down onto his knee.

SWANTON BOMB~! LESNAR FUCKING POWERS OUT~! FUCK YOU AND YOUR FINISHER, JEFF!!!

F-5! Heyman screams "DON'T PIN HIM. HURT HIM!!!" so Lesnar hits a fucking DOUBLE POWERBOMB. And then a HUGE spinning powerbomb. And the referee has to stop the match because Jeff is DEAD.

:mark:.

*Rating: **1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 1*


*Kurt Angle Vs Edge*

Huh, Angle... doesn't suck here! Transition spot into his control segment is a sweeeet German Suplex, and from there he slows down the pace rather than going all out with MOVES~!, taking his time to mock the crowd and really play up being a heel. His suplexes work as nice cut off spots for Edge's hope spots too.

Well damn, even the super over head belly to belly spot is done well! Edge is making a comeback and trying EVERYTHING to keep Angle down, but nothing works. So he goes to the ropes for a Missile Dropkick, and as such Angle IS already on his feet, so no crazy "jumping up from the mat and not selling anything" crap! Instead as Edge is waiting on the ropes for Angle to get in position, Angle quickly realises what's coming and leaps up for the suplex!!!

They even do a nice little call back to that super belly to belly spot too, which Edge hitting a big Crossbody to Angle on the outside, rolling him in and THEN landing the dropkick because Angle is much more hurt this time!

ANGLE SLAM~! KICKOUT~! ANKLE LOCK~! ROPE BREAK~! Then just like it seems we are going into some big crazy finisher fest, Angle levels Edge with a clothesline and things slow down! Then Angle decks himself in the head with a chair (lol), Edge looks to hit a Spear and Kurt kicks the fuck out of him for a counter (!!!) and into an Angle Slam for the win.

Match is kinda odd actually. I'm unsure what I actually think of it. It isn't BAD. At all. It isn't GREAT either. Good, absolutely. I guess. Lol. Angle's shitty move crap is kept to a minimum and his suplexes make for great cut off spots. The finishing stretch isn't overkill either, but honestly there seems to be something missing. Mainly from Angle's control segment. Like I said, his cut off spots are good... but outside of those I honestly couldn't tell you anything Angle did. Like, AT ALL. Just a giant void of WHATTHEFUCKHAPPENED in between cut off spots :lmao.

So overall, its good in the sense that it isn't your typical crazy Angle MOVES~! match but it doesn't get a huge rating because there wasn't much to this one beyond cut off spots and the finishing stretch, both of which were good though.

*Rating: ***1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 2*


Jericho promo. Bitching about being left off BACKLASH (He's not good enough for BACKLASH? JOEY STYLES SHOOT~!) while Kidman and Maven have matches. Anyway, he does have a point. He was in the MAIN EVENT of WM a month ago, and now he's doing bugger all.

ARN ANDERSON :mark:. RIC FLAIR :mark:. UNDERTAKER :mark:. Undertaker just shows up and stares at Flair before leaving. :mark:


*Rob Van Dam Vs Eddie Guerrero - WWF Intercontinental Championship Match*

BATTLE OF THE FROG SPLASHES~!

:mark:. I remember the first Raw brand show when Eddie Guerrero returned and powerbombed RVD. I was still young and had no internet so I didn't know why Eddie disappeared for a year or anything. So seeing him returned was :mark:. Always liked the guy even as a heel when I wasn't so "smart" to the "business" for lack of better terms. Now I appreciate the guy a bazillion times more :mark:.

Eddie is now 100% clean and has his life back in order, and when Eddie is CLEAN, Eddie is one of the best EVER. Not even Mr Flippy can fuck that up!

:mark: 1 minute into the match and Eddie is already bumping around and selling RVD's offence like a fucking GOD. I like how Eddie makes RVD fight to get shit in, and while it's not the GRITTY style like Finlay and Benoit, it's still damn good.

Dammit RVD, STOP WITH THE SHITTY ELBOWS.

Aside from those terrible, terrible elbows, RVD's offence looks really good for a chance! Even his kicks are less sloppy. Eddie is such a good worker he's having a positive effect on RVD's ability!!!  Or maybe RVD respects Eddie enough to like, put some fucking EFFORT into his shit for a chance lol.

RVD controls the early part of the match with Eddie getting a few things in here and there, but it's the TILT-A-WHIRL backbreaker than puts RVD on defence. From here Eddie focuses his attack on RVD's back like a BOSS.

GORY SPECIAL :mark:.

The longer Eddie works over RVD, the more cocky he gets, going for fancy high risk moves and playing to the crowd, and it nearly costs him. He takes far too long going for a Frog Splash, allowing RVD to get up, but Eddie is still able to counter and hit a SICK sunset flip Powerbomb!!!

Ref bump, and Eddie hits a neck breaker on the IC belt, and then it's FROG SPLASH TIME BABEH! New IC champ! Eddie wins!!! :mark:.

Really good match. Eddie is on top form, RVD looks better than usual, and we end up with a pretty great match :mark:.

*Rating: *****
*CAL SCALE - 5*


*The Undertaker Vs Steve Austin - Special Referee Ric Flair - #1 Contenders Match*

:mark: FUCK THE HATERS I LOVE THIS. I hope . If it sucks for me on this watch then I'm gonna cry!

Undertaker is BOOGER RED. Austin is a RED NECK. And Flair is wearing RED SHOES. And I'm a RED HEAD. Therefore I cannot hate this match. IT'S SCIENCE, BITCHES!

Undertaker claimed before the match that he will OUT-WRESTLE, OUT-BRAWL and OUT-CHEAT Austin to win this match and go to JD for a title shot.

Stare down and trash talking to start things off. These two have a long history and know what's on the line here so they aren't about to rush into anything.

Undertaker immediately goes for a headlock, and Austin can't escape. When he does, Undertaker shoulder blocks him down and does his cocky boxing footwork as Austin rolls outside to take a break. Undertaker is OUT-WRESTLING Austin. Just like he said he would!

Austin now gets a headlock on Undertaker, and when Undertaker escapes Austin attempts a shoulder block but the Dead Man ain't budging! More cocky foot work from Undertaker, so Austin pays him back in kind by dropping down and doing some press-ups! Undertaker ain't getting into Austin's head!

They re-work the same sequence again, but this time when Undertaker goes for a shoulder block, Austin DECKS HIM with a clothesline, then gives him the finger!

:lmao they go to tie up again and Austin gives Undertaker the finger one more time and Undertaker is FUCKED OFF! He's angry and rushes at Austin, allowing Austin to use his own momentum against him, and it's AUSTIN out-wrestling The Undertaker! :mark:

So out-wrestling didn't work for 'Taker, so it's time to fucking BRAWL. Big rights from the Dead Man and a boot to the face, and Austin goes down!

OLD SCHOOL~!

VINTAGE OLD SCHOOL UNDERTAKER. Cole stole VINTAGE from JR!!! Shame he couldn't steal his talent too.

Undertaker looks to have things in hand thanks to his BRAWLING skills... until Austin takes him down with the Lou Thez press and pummels the fuck out of his face with right hands! They fight on the outside with Austin staying in control. :lmao at Austin punching Undertaker over the barricade right into an old women.

Good punches by Austin and Undertaker in this one, a MASSIVE step up from their SummerSlam 98 match when neither of them seemed to give a fuck.

Hall and X-Pac randomly show up at the top of the ramp, and even Undertaker looks pissed at them. If they screw with this match he'll probably kill em!

Austin does a great job selling HIS FACE when Undertaker pummels him with punches, knees him in the nose and even smashes it against his bike!

APRON LEG DROP... except to the BACK of Austin's neck rather than the front! Looks awesome that way.

LEG WORK~! Cool to see Undertaker, the taller guy in the match, work the legs of Austin rather than the other way around. Austin has knee braces on BOTH legs so it's good strategy to go after them.

Yey the audio just went out of sync. Which apparently was a common problem because they dubbed Undertaker's entrance theme for the event and it seems to have fucked shit up for the rest of the event now. Bah. Putting the DVD on my PC so I can (hopefully) watch it with media player classic and mess about with the audio timing. Can't do it from disc as it seems to make the video stutter lol, so hopefully having the files on my PC will solve that problem. HOPEFULLY.

Well that didn't quite work so I converted it to avi and stuck it in Adobe Premiere and manually put it in sync :lmao.

FUCK ME at the speed Undertaker gets to do the leaping lariat!

Undertaker hasn't been able to put Austin away yet with WRESTLING or BRAWLING. Time to cheat!!! He exposes the turnbuckle, but Austin sends Undertaker into it back first and that gives the Rattlesnake a chance to recover and build momentum!

REF BUMP~! STUNNER~! NO REFEREE~! LOL~!

LOW BLOW~! Undertaker taking advantage of Flair being down. CHOKESLAM~! And Austin KICKS OUT!!! Undertaker's face when Austin kicks out is amazing :lmao. He looks down at Austin as if to say "the fuck did you just do?".

STEEL CHAIR~! Flair takes it away and Austin lows blows Undertaker... who retaliates with a kick to the face :lmao.

STUNNER~! COUNTERED~! FLAIR GETS TAKEN OUT AGAIN~! STEEL CHAIR TO AUSTIN'S HEAD~! Undertaker is doing everything he can to OUT-CHEAT Austin for sure, but Austin will NOT stay down!

Tombstone signal :mark:. But he was going for the TAKER CARE OF BUSINESS instead. Austin counters and tries to use it on Undertaker! Undertaker doesn't like that so he goes for the chair again, only to be met with huge lefts and rights from Austin. Austin grabs the chair, Flair tries to take it away, Austin gives him the finger... and turns around into a big boot! Chair right to the face! 1..2..foot on the ropes...3 anyway!!! UNDERTAKER WINS! UNDERTAKER WINS!

:mark: This still rules. Fuck the haters. Which is like, everyone on the planet bar about 3 of us :lmao. Match told a great story of Undertaker trying to out-wrestle Austin, then when that doesn't work he tries to out-brawl Austin, and when THAT fails, he manages to get the win by out-cheating him!

*Rating: *****
*CAL SCALE - 5*


Flair walks to the back and Coach shows him footage of the finish with Austin getting his foot on the ropes. His reaction? OHHHH SHIT! :lmao


*Billy & Chuck Vs Al Snow & Maven - WWF Tag Team Championship Match*

:lmao at JR making gay jokes.

MAVEN GETTING ABUSED BY THE TAG TEAM CHAMPIONS. Poor Maven! 

:lmao teased hot tag to Snow, but Billy and Chuck prevent it... and Al runs in anyway :lmao.

Referee: "WHAT ARE YOU DOING? YOU GOTTA TAG!" :lmao

Huh, so AL is the guy playing FIP tonight. Instead of, you know, THE ROOKIE. Seems kinda backwards to me lol. Surly it would have made more sense for them to isolate the ROOKIE because he'll be easier to beat and shit, and then have the teacher just come in for a hot tag? I though that's what they were gonna do originally but Maven lasted about a minute as FIP lol.

MAVEN SETTING UP FOR HIS FINISHER... THE CROSSBODY. IN 2002. LOL. What kind of absolute LOSER or a wrestler would use that as a finisher in the 00's? 

Maven gets his head kicked off and loses.

Match is... stuff. Things. Whatever.

*Rating: 1/2**
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*Triple H Vs Hulk Hogan - WWF Undisputed Championship Match*

I wanna just say NO and move on. BUT... I kinda feel like I NEED to watch the MAIN EVENT TITLE MATCH for every show no matter what. Which sucks for me. Hogan in his prime Vs HHH in his prime doesn't appeal to me. Hogan over 10 years past his prime Vs out of his prime and muscled up to fuck preventing him from being remotely good HHH makes me wanna puke my eyes out.

Oh god. The bell rings to start the match and we have TWENTY FIVE MINUTES left on the event. 25 minutes of OAP Hogan and Steroid HHH.

OMG HHH SHOWS THAT HE'S STRONGER THAN AN OLD MAN THIS IS FUCKING AWESOME. Kill me.

Fuck me. They spend the first FIVE MINUTES just pushing each other around in a collar and elbow tie up. Plus the knuckle lock spots too. At least the crowd is hot for the match. I guess someone has to be.

:lmao at the chop blocks to the knee by HHH. HHH nearly MISSES the first one, and Hogan was anticipating the second one and almost took the bump too early :lmao.

Fuck me... how many does HHH need to do? Hogan just keeps getting up and HHH keeps doing it. I swear for a second I thought part of the match was on a loop :lmao.

Leg holds. Sleeper hold. REST HOLDS~! Oh wow this is just exciting shit...

Jericho shows up. A chair gets involved. I think. I was still kinda phased out from the bullshit 10 minutes of rest holds or however long it was.

HOGAN MISSES THE LED DROP. PEDIGREE. 1...2... UNDERTAKER DECKS THE REFEREE!!! CHAIR TO HHH'S FACE! Undertaker picks up Hogan and tells him to cover! Hogan declines and takes out 'Taker, then hits a Legdrop and gets the win anyway :lmao.

My god this was horrible. I mean... the best part of the fucking match is UNDERTAKER INTERFERING AT THE END. I have nothing positive to say about it.

*Rating: DUD*
*CAL SCALE - 0*



*Overall CAL SCALE - 16*​


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Yeah, Cena's Fireman Carry has never really done it for me. Even when Cole puts "thunderous" in front of it. The Stunner, for instance is different. Same with the RKO, and Sweet Chin Music. Moves that can come from nowhere and have great impact.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Although I'm not a fan of Undertaker/Austin, I love that KillaCal always takes the time to show his support for it. We all deserve one guilty pleasure that we can justify. That's why I will never join the rest of you in thinking that Punk/Jericho Payback sucked. unk2 :jericho


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Although I'm not a fan of Undertaker/Austin, I love that KillaCal always takes the time to show his support for it. We all deserve one guilty pleasure that we can justify. *That's why I will never join the rest of you in thinking that Punk/Jericho Payback sucked. *unk2 :jericho


*High Five*

Though I have that, and the two Punk/Rock matches as guilty pleasures (not that I think they're great, but much better than the DUDish ratings everyone else on the planet seems to think they are).


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

lol @ Punk/Rock. :lol

I can never outright hate those matches but I don't _like_ them like I used to anymore. They are pretty much comedy matches to me at this point. On the topic of guilty pleasures, I honestly can't think of a match that I have this feeling about. Maybe Orton vs Lashley from ECW. Every time I've watched it, it's been enjoyable enough.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Cena's fireman carry had it's time. I still dig the STF (If he only he did it right dammit!) but I think it's time he gets a new power finisher.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

sharkboy22 said:


> Cena's fireman carry had it's time. I still dig the STF (If he only he did it right dammit!) but I think it's time he gets a new power finisher.


The STF has become a stepover chinlock. Nowhere near a crossface anymore. 

My guilty pleasure used to be Trips/Shawn HIAC. Then I started it again last week and couldn't stand it.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

So I was just looking at the RAW section and what the hell. Do people seriously think that Daniel Bryan has been reduced to mid card status. So too is Punk. And Big Show has been elevated to main event status?

1)Bryan is still an upper midcard guy
2)So too is Punk
3)Big Show will continue to be upper midcard as well. 

Also, no one mentions the fact that Cena's walking around with a (let's face it) midcard title. If anyone has taken a slight decline in their position on the card it's Cena who, by the way, is at the moment and upper midcard guy. 

Just because you're not in the title picture doesn't mean you're suddenly a main event guy. I don't get how the same people who complain that Wrestler A is always in the main event and in the title picture are the same ones who complain that Wrestler B ISN'T always in the main event and in the title picture. I'm fully convinced now that this place is just about arguing "My Guy vs Your Guy.....And why My Guy is better"

Right now, I think WWE is doing a storyline so big that it's getting over more than one person at the same time. You have to wonder what part the Wyatts and Kane now have in all of this. Plus, at some point down the road you know Punk is gonna get involved. Not to mention Kane and Daniel Bryan's past and how it would play into the story. Man this is the kind of storyline I've been begging for from the 'E'. It's really one massive storyline in which several wrestlers are intertwined. You can't ask for better than this. And goddamit, I should have made this post in the RAW section.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

sharkboy22 said:


> So I was just looking at the RAW section and what the hell. Do people seriously think that Daniel Bryan has been reduced to mid card status. So too is Punk. And Big Show has been elevated to main event status?
> 
> 1)Bryan is still an upper midcard guy
> 2)So too is Punk
> ...


You shouldn't have made this post in the RAW section, or else you'll have markedfordeath complaining about you calling Daniel Bryan a midcarder, a bunch of people talking about how HHH and Big Show are ruining everything, and then the typical trolls and hypocrites criticizing CM Punk for no reason outside of possible jealousy.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> You shouldn't have made this post in the RAW section, or else you'll have markedfordeath complaining about you calling Daniel Bryan a midcarder, a bunch of people talking about how HHH and Big Show are ruining everything, and then the typical trolls and hypocrites criticizing CM Punk for no reason outside of possible jealousy.


Don't forget the clowns with a fixation for CM Punk bragging about how he's a bigger mega star than Hulk Hogan, The Rock and Stone Cold in their peaks combined. 8*D


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

sharkboy22 said:


> So I was just looking at the RAW section and what the hell. Do people seriously think that Daniel Bryan has been reduced to mid card status. So too is Punk. And Big Show has been elevated to main event status?
> 
> 1)Bryan is still an upper midcard guy
> 2)So too is Punk
> ...


Jesus fuck man, why'd you call Bryan a mid-carder? If WWE would just push him, he'd be such a big success. He gets high ratings and is really over with the crowd!

U know, it's all HHH and Big Show's fault! HHH always inserts his big nose into big angles and then ruins them because he's married to the Vince's daughter, and Big Show... he just ruins all angles, period. They both suck and they're stealing the spotlight so they can have a WWE Title match, a rematch from what will be 14 years ago come January. They both ruined everything!

And Punk's jus' some tatoo'd ugly looking vanilla midget who can't draw and was pushed down everyone's throats last year and he fucking sucks!

Edit: Oh funnyfaces, you said something?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> Don't forget the clowns with a fixation for CM Punk bragging about how he's a bigger mega star than Hulk Hogan, The Rock and Stone Cold in their peaks combined. 8*D


I like Punk a lot and all, and he is really over, but damn at this.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

:lmao

You guys are too much. Man, I missed you guys. Don't know what happened the past few weeks but for some reason I was genuinely disinterested in posting. here. Maybe it's because RAW has just been so damn good as of late that the last thing I wanted to do, was to come on here and be greeted with 20 "HHH is burying Daniel Bryan" threads.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

sharkboy22 said:


> :lmao
> 
> You guys are too much. Man, I missed you guys. Don't know what happened the past few weeks but for some reason I was genuinely disinterested in posting. here. Maybe it's *because RAW has just been so damn good as of late *that the last thing I wanted to do, was to come on here and be greeted with 20 "HHH is burying Daniel Bryan" threads.


Could you link me to these said Raws ?


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

redskins25 said:


> Could you link me to these said Raws ?


Check, for the most part, every RAW leading up to Summerslam and thereafter.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

So after watching both Cena/ADR and Cena/Sandow within a few hours of each other, I can definitely say the Del Rio match was better. Not hating on Sandow's match, but Del Rio's picked up ridiculously well down the stretch. My "review" of HIAC coming soon. Too much fucking filler though, that's for sure...



smitty915 said:


> Just bought the history of the WWE championship on Amazon, looks like an AMAZING set.


(Y) One of the best sets the WWE has ever put together.



Callamus said:


> I do wonder if people would hate Cena less for his SUPERMAN COMEBACK + 1 AA = PIN if he had a finisher than actually looked half painful. A lot of times I often see people complaining that he only hits ONE finisher and apparently that's not enough. *So if it was something more devastating would that be better?* Like, if Undertaker came back and did the exact same thing but won with a TOMBSTONE, would anyone bar Ubertaker haters complain?


I think that sentence explains why a lot of people hate the AA. Normally when he hits just one out of nowhere, it bothers me. It doesn't have the impact or shock factor of an RKO and it's an extremely simple way to land. Moves like that & Wade Barrett's Wasteland are just terrible. Plus whatever Big E uses.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Sandow/Cena> Cena/ADR for me.

Cena's selling was atrocious in his match with ADR. Totally took me out of it. His selling his in his match with Sandow wasn't any better either tbh. There's one point where Sandow's dropping his knee on Cena's arm and Cena doesn't even react.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Cena's selling was FAR better in the Sandow match, but I'll get into why the lack of selling in the Del Rio match didn't bother me _too _much when I type everything out in a bit.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

I rewatched Cena/Del Rio and I'll settle on *** for it. It was a fine match, but no where near Sandow/Cena. Sandow/Cena>>>>>Cena/Del Rio for me.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Why does Evan/CorporateKingOfKings constantly disrespect Bret Hart? And why don't we have a Bret smiley?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

does Punk fan really think bret hart is the GOAT babyface ?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

redskins25 said:


> does Punk fan really think bret hart is the GOAT babyface ?


No. The GOAT babyface is Rick Rude unk

EDIT: This Lakers/Clippers game is a solid ****** match. The Lakers made a very nice babyface turn from the looks of things. These no-names are pretty hilarious.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Callamus said:


> I do wonder if people would hate Cena less for his SUPERMAN COMEBACK + 1 AA = PIN if he had a finisher than actually looked half painful. A lot of times I often see people complaining that he only hits ONE finisher and apparently that's not enough. So if it was something more devastating would that be better? Like, if Undertaker came back and did the exact same thing but won with a TOMBSTONE, would anyone bar Ubertaker haters complain?


You hit the nail on the head. It's something so simple, yet sustained among the "big face" within WWF/WWE over the year, that you'd think it would stick by now. Cena hits the FU once and that's it. Much the same with Hogan's big boot or Austin's Stunner. I know there are the occasions when Austin had to hit it more than once - and there has been those for Cena too - but it's all relative. For some reason the Superman definition seems defined by Cena in the modern age opposed to back then. I guess with Austin. It was pretty high with Hogan. Not that I mind. That was the biz and I'm a Hogan supporter.

--------

The guilty pleasure comment is intriguing. Have to think of what mine will be. Something I personally feel is strong, meanwhile the lot don't enjoy it. I don't feel that's one of those Khali matches I like. I feel that's just not giving the lad a chance b/c of his track record of being immobile and crummy. I'll have to sit on this for a tiny bit and come back to it.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Bret is one of my all time favorites, I just think that Cena has reached that level and I use Bret as an example. Nothing but love for Bret, one of the greatest in the ring ever from where I sit. Fantastic babyface in peril and excellent heel work in the Hart Foundation & especially 1997. 

Match with Austin was one of the greatest professional wrestling matches ever, Canadian Stampede was BOSS, his best match ever with Shawn at the Survivor Series, carrying THE PATRIOT to an awesome match at one point, delightful work with the Undertaker. Yeah Bret was fucking amazing.

I just want Punk in the main event scene year round, is that too hard to ask of 8*D?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Hmm...so apparently Rick Rude had a run as a babyface in Florida. Has there been anyone with a 10+ year long career that stayed heel?






Roddy Piper's return in 1986 was a really fun match. Although he took his hiatus as the top heel in the company, he was cheered like crazy when he returned. How can you not love some Roddy? Has anyone seen his matches with Chavo Guerrero? Apparently it's his best work.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Did he really carry The Patriot? b/c that dude was boss himself. I have to chime in here.

Don't like the final match vs Shawn. I'm actually anti-Bret in '97 for the majority. Not much I like. He started to get real dull that year. Of course, within the dip in personal interest he still had a perfect match vs Austin at WM, so he can get put over in the same vein. A whole lot of others...eh. I feel '97 on the whole isn't what it's cracked up to be for WWF barring a few personalities. Lot of PPVs were terrible.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

*WWE Hell in a Cell 2013 (lots of words...)

**WWE Tag Team Championship
*Cody Rhodes & Goldust (c) vs. Roman Reigns & Seth Rollins vs. The Usos - *** 1/4

_I don't understand why people were losing their shit over this? haha. The first half of this was actually really slow and I'm not one who normally EVER complains about a good STF formula. Unfortunately here the weardown of Goldust really didn't comprise of anything memorable. I thought it was nifty that the Shield took out everyone Goldust could tag, but obviously the interesting parts of this match took place after the hot tag. Cody Rhodes vs. Seth Rollins could be a future World Title feud in another year or two and the segments those two put together in this were absolutely fantastic. Superplex spot to the outside was NUTS. Only Rollins would take that bump. Super hot last few minutes makes this one good in my books, just not MOTN like everyone else seemed to be saying.

_*World Heavyweight Championship
*Alberto Del Rio (c) vs. John Cena - *** 3/4

_This is the one I was looking forward to the most from this card, and I was only mildy disappointed. Del Rio brought his working boots (as he always does, to be frank) and was looking to put on a great match and unfold a wonderful story of Cena's injured arm, but in the first several minutes all Cena wanted to do was smile and play to the crowd like he wasn't even wrestling the current World Heavyweight fucking Champion. That really bothered me that he didn't seem to be taking things seriously, then all of a sudden Del Rio caught him with the enziguri on the top rope and it kicked into another gear from there. The biggest thing people bring up in this is Cena's selling, and I'll admit it was almost non-existent, but hear me out. I don't think they wanted to go for the usual route of Del Rio working an arm and someone having to sell it to put the match over. In this instance I think they/Cena just wanted to show that he was somewhat fully healed and that he didn't come back too early, so it came off as more of a superhuman performance instead of no selling. I think he just wanted to show his arm was doing great instead of exposing it as a weakness and I know people are gonna say the selling was better in the Sandow match the next night on RAW, and that would be completely true. But here's thing. At that point when the bell rang for Cena/Sandow, Cena had already had his arm worked on the night before by Del Rio then ultimately had it destroyed by Sandow, so he pretty much HAD to sell it at that stage. 

Let's get back to this match though as I'm getting off topic._ _I really really liked what they were able to string together in the last several minutes of this. Del Rio went after the arm just at the right times when you were starting to forget about the injury, and the little touch where he pulled down the elbow pad_ _while he was in the cross armbreaker was pretty sweet. Of course it didn't really matter because Cena just muscled him up from there, but oh well.  I can't really explain why but I thought it was really cool when they got the closeup of Del Rio only getting two fingers on the ropes to escape the STF. Seemed like a major thing. Loved how Del Rio constantly escaped all the AA attempts until he was finally caught with one out of nowhere. That's about the most positive thing I can say about Cena winning with an AA, at least it was worked in well and not spammed 30 times or used totally out of context. All in all, a great match despite Cena's lack of kayfabe selling, but his ability to still "feel" the pain when he needed to._

*WWE Championship Hell in a Cell Match w/ Guest Referee Shawn Michaels
*Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan - *** 1/2

_YES! YES! YES! I really liked this to my pleasant surprise. Why the hell were people giving this *? The first like 10 minutes of this were fast paced, high impact, well worked action as they pretty much traded control segments back and forth. Orton FINALLY started to show some signs of viciousness with the repeated headbutts and kicks to the head to go along with the mean streak when using the Cell & chairs as weapons. Bryan adapted extremely well in his first ever HIAC match and I thought they were actually working pretty well of of each other, which is a lot more than I can say about their other two PPV encounters. Take into account that I wouldn't put either one of those matches any higher than ***, but I certainly liked this one. Bryan throwing all the chairs into the ring brought back some fond memories of Chicago Street Fights in ROH, so I dug that a lot. Orton's selling of the pain in his shoulders and back after being thrown into the cell and hit with the chairs was pretty immense I thought. Superplex into the chairs was pretty cool, even though they didn't hit quite 100%. Still got a good reaction and came off pretty creative for a WWE match. I thought everything was going swimmingly until Triple H came down the ramp, then it just fell flat._ _All the attention_ _was turned to Hunter and we lost track of everything that was going on the ring. Everything that unfolded from there was cool in a sense that Bryan was able to get a small bit of satisfaction against the authority, and I somehow marked when seeing Shawn superkick Bryan. Despite KNOWING it was coming, I still thought it was pretty exciting. If there was a way to screw Bryan, I guess this was the best choice. 80% of this match was really good so I'm gonna give it a favorable rating. Could've done with some legitimate false finishes, but I guess it wouldn't have suited the booking they wanted to go with._​


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Good lord you liked Danielson vs Orton? Legit shocked.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Any of you guys read my review of orton/Bryan HIAC ?

See Hart 97 is pretty much the only year I like from him , his best character and I loved that he changed his moveset a bit


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Repost it skins.

That would make two of us, Cody. Forgot to mention some other things I watched:

Why is the Great Khali on PPV, but Dolph Ziggler is not? :bs:

Langston nor Ambrose know how to work a match... at all. But moreso Langston. That guy's dangerous.

Did the Matadores just seriously beat the Real Americans despite doing a bunch of nothing and winning with some sort of basic double team move? Jesus... at least we got an aweosme Cesaro Swing.

That finish to Punk/Ryback was pretty damn flat, huh?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It was the only year where Bret Hart actually had a character other than "wrestle straight down the middle, fair and square guy". Which worked, but the change was welcomed. In the ring I lost interest, but as a personality he improved. Bret got pissed. Let it show on screen. I like it.

Corey, I echo everything you just posted. Los Matadores win was pitiful. Like seriously was all Real Americans until they lost by a generic move. Thankfully the booking on RAW appears to have moved them in a proper direction. Americans, that is.

Punk did a TON to Ryback to keep him down, but yeah, def flat. Whole match was. Sort of there. Feared it would be too b/c I just can't get into anything done inside HIAC basically. Unless it's Undertaker whooping ass.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I was enjoying the cell match throughout but I do wish they had done some more stuff before heading towards the end. Combining the work from Battleground with HIAC would have made it the best Bryan/Orton match. It sucks that their chemistry is not that great. I don't think any of their matches has been bad but every time it feels like something is missing. Even as a mark, I wish Orton would switch it up by not being so damn slow and bring out some more intensity.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I somewhat enjoyed Orton/Bryan HIAC aswell :agree:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I did like Orton's selling points while he took some of the bumps on the outside. He made it look like the most painful experience ever. Someone could think it was a bit much. I liked the sensationalism. At least he was trying to make HIAC look like a dangerous match. Annoyed on how the chair riot superplex was botched. That could have owned.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The whole last 6 minutes of that match was a total botch.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

REPOST

*Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan w/ HBK as guest ref HIAC- Skins's random thoughts*


-Ok going in I wasn't expecting a ****1/2 classic, but I was expecting something good, Their best match IMO was their sd match, with the rest being meh at best besides battleground. I saw improvements in the BG match probably because instead of working from behind most of the time, Bryan was mostly in control. Onto the HIAC, this match was horrible. The match started off well, we say a Orton show some viciousness and take it to Bryan right off the bat, good Pacing. That is were the "GOOD" ends.

For match that its feud was the only thing wwe seemed like it cared about outside of Rhodes/shield since summerslam, There was not intensity at all. No hatred felt, no passion, no feeling at all really. This match was SOO LIFELESS and dull, it was almost like they were sleepwalking. This wasnt brutality at all. at them making the "OUT OF THE WAY SHAWN" seem like this was heated. On top of that the 50 chairs spot was one of the dumbest things I have EVER seen. The superplex was terrible and he only hit one chair I think. WWE for fucks sake DONT MAKE THIS PPVs anymore or do away this this gimmick as you dont know how to structure this match anymore. The match was so dull and boring, I couldn't even at my lord and savior heeling it up like its 1997.

In all honestly at the end of the match, I was hoping in some way HBK won the title, Hell I wanted HHH to win. I NEVER WANT to see orton/bryan in the same ring ever again or Im changing the channel.

* wanted to give it a DUD tbhayley​I agree with you about the triple threat tag, decent but I dont understand why people where jizzing over it, I saw some **** in this thread sunday
__________________


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

As far as the Orton/Bryan PPV matches go for me, it's Hell in a Cell (*** 1/2) > Night of Champions (***) > Battleground (** 1/2ish). Hell in a Cell as a whole PPV had 3 quality matches (and a bunch of filler garbage, but that's not the point), which by default means it's better than NOC & Battleground combined. 

Nice to see the brothers don't agree on EVERYTHING. :lol

Did I not call that sequence where Bryan would dive headfirst into the cell?

EDIT: Jesus skins, harsh much? haha


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> As far as the Orton/Bryan PPV matches go for me, it's Hell in a Cell (*** 1/2) > Night of Champions (***) > Battleground (** 1/2ish). Hell in a Cell as a whole PPV had 3 quality matches (and a bunch of filler garbage, but that's not the point), which by default means it's better than NOC & Battleground combined.
> 
> *Nice to see the brothers don't agree on EVERYTHING. :lol*
> 
> Did I not call that sequence where Bryan would dive headfirst into the cell?


We sure as hell don't agree on Edge/Orton from Vengeance 04 or most HHH/HBK matches.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

William Murderface said:


> We sure as hell don't agree on Edge/Orton from Vengeance 04 or most HHH/HBK matches.


Sooo, that means you like Edge/Orton and don't think that HHH/HBK at Summerslam is boring, yeah? Cause Cody's super wrong in not liking that non-sanctioned match.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Definitely 
Here my HIAC rating just cuz

Triple threat ***
Mix tag DUD
Ambrose/e *
punk/ryback **
Tag match **1/2
Cena/ADR ***1/2
Diva n/a
HIAC *

Very disappointed


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Sooo, that means you like Edge/Orton and don't think that HHH/HBK at Summerslam is boring, yeah? Cause Cody's super wrong in not liking that non-sanctioned match.


I DESPISE that Orton/Edge match, Cody loves it.

But I tend to enjoy the HHH/HBK matches.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

It seems that WWE has completely gone away from trying to create great cards as a whole, now they're just advertising 3 or 4 big matches and tossing in filler for half the card to kill some time. Not sure who's gonna want to pay for that...

Cody (among others on here) are impossible to predict.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> It seems that WWE has completely gone away from trying to create great cards as a whole, now they're just advertising 3 or 4 big matches and tossing in filler for half the card to kill some time. Not sure who's gonna want to pay for that...
> 
> Cody (among others on here) are impossible to predict.


Cody can be very unpredictable, but most of the time we are on the same page.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

William Murderface said:


> *I DESPISE that Orton/Edge match*, Cody loves it.
> 
> But I tend to enjoy the HHH/HBK matches.


Does the same go for their Raw matches? Because I really can't find a good reason to hate those whereas I understand it for Vengeance.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> Does the same go for their Raw matches? Because I really can't find a good reason to hate those whereas I understand it for Vengeance.


I have no recollection of any of those matches.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The copy and paste didn't take thr :mark: and :lmao "a so it's alittle differcult to read but you got the point , harsh :lol try after tr ppv when ppl were posting in here most err giving it ***1/2-34 and I drop the * then a couple others followed suit , pretty polarizing show

Yea you and Cody do agree on a lot of things , shocked on this one :lol


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

William Murderface said:


> I have no recollection of any of those matches.


They're definitely worth a watch. Went through them with your brother a while back and he really liked them.

Dates are 10/5, 7/19 and 12/13.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm trying to win him over on the Vengeance match. The 2004 matches between Orton & Edge are :mark:


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

redskins25 said:


> The copy and paste didn't take thr :mark: and :lmao "a so it's alittle differcult to read but you got the point , harsh :lol try after tr ppv when ppl were posting in here most err giving it ***1/2-34 and I drop the * then a couple others followed suit , pretty polarizing show
> 
> *Yea you and Cody do agree on a lot of things , shocked on this one :lol*


We have a keen eye for talent 



> Dates are 10/5, 7/19 and 12/13.


Nevermind, Cody just answered my question


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Talent like Seth Roll. :rollins

I swear I never use that smiley. Might have to splurge in pseudo-obnoxious fashion.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

:delrio:reignspunk4wyatt:steiner2:bryan2

Just because I love all of them :ex:


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Definitely gonna tune into SD for the main event. With a few exceptions here and there, SD's been delivering DAT MATCH QUALITY pretty consistently since summer.

For those who haven't seen:


Spoiler: DAT MAIN EVENT



Cena, Goldust, and Cody vs. Sandow, Swagger, and Cesaro :mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Almost tempted to click...

I'll avoid. Keep a little bit of fun. Who knows. I might even hate it. :hayley1


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I'd safely say there's pretty much no way you'd hate it 

I'm so tempted to watch some matches, but I have an exam tomorrow. Then again, I AM posting on here instead of studying...:ziggler3


----------



## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Too lazy to read through the past 30 pages, but some of the ones that were giving Orton/Bryan <**, yikes. Don't think Redskins typeout even justifies what he thinks. Entire finish was a botch, sure. But the match was of good quality until that stage. **1/2 at least, imo. I'll go with like, idk, ***ish territory. Enjoyed it up until that terrible ending.

Tag was a bit overrated, as stated by JE187. Was fun and decent, not a great or classic. And del Rio/Cena was under average. Thought Matadores/Americans were equal and better respectively than those two.


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

Finished WM 20 last night. That triple threat was an all out war, I think it does deserve the ***** everyone seems to give it. Also I'm halfway through IYH 2 and I already found a hidden gem.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Talking about Triple Threats, am I the only one who rates the Punk/Cena/ADR HiaC match ****1/4. It had a great time wathcing it, dat table spot :mark:


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

I haven't since it aired but I remember it being a good match nevertheless.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

The best part of the HIAC tag was the crazy suplex spot. Yes we've seen it before but it doesn't make it any less crazy. The guy taking the suplex is falling like, 165ft? (5+ ft to the turnbuckle + the wrestler giving the suplex is like 6ft + whatever the apron to the floor is). Imagine if you have some klutz catching you and he doesn't, or whatever. Fuck.

Is tat the first time we've seen that spot since the Superstars 6 man in 2011? A match which definitely needs a watch/rewatch by everyone because it rules, by the way.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

*Ted DiBiase vs Randy Savage - WWF WrestleFest 1988*

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-m...vage-wwf-wrestlefest-1988-a.html#post25788569


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

FluxCapacitor said:


> The best part of the HIAC tag was the crazy suplex spot. Yes we've seen it before but it doesn't make it any less crazy. The guy taking the suplex is falling like, 165ft? (5+ ft to the turnbuckle + the wrestler giving the suplex is like 6ft + whatever the apron to the floor is). Imagine if you have some klutz catching you and he doesn't, or whatever. Fuck.
> 
> Is tat the first time we've seen that spot since the Superstars 6 man in 2011? A match which definitely needs a watch/rewatch by everyone because it rules, by the way.


You mean The Usos & Barreta vs Kidd, Gabriel & Slater?

Yup. That was *epic*.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

:lmao


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Arm-Bar1004 said:


> Finished WM 20 last night. That triple threat was an all out war, I think it does deserve the ***** everyone seems to give it. Also I'm halfway through IYH 2 and I already found a hidden gem.


HBK/Jarrett?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Lady Killer said:


> HBK/Jarrett?


If that's the match he meant then it definitely isn't a hidden gem . 

God help us if he thinks one of the other matches is though :| .


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

lmao yeah I was going to give him the benefit of the doubt and assume HBK/Jarrett even though it's far from hidden.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Then again maybe he really likes Bret Vs JPL. I hear it getting good praise here and there so not much of a stretch I guess lol.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

They had another good match on PPV that year iirc.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Maybe that's the one I'm thinking of then. Fuck knows.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Arm-Bar1004 said:


> Finished WM 20 last night. That triple threat was an all out war, I think it does deserve the ***** everyone seems to give it. Also I'm halfway through IYH 2 and I already found a hidden gem.


(Y)

The GOAT match imo.



Srdjan99 said:


> Talking about Triple Threats, am I the only one who rates the Punk/Cena/ADR HiaC match ****1/4. It had a great time wathcing it, dat table spot :mark:



Probably. Don't think I would go higher than ****3/4* for it. I preferred the Punk/Miz/ADR TLC match over the Punk/Cena/ADR HIAC I think.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I love that triple threat HIAC match.

But MOTN on that show is clearly Sin Cara vs Sin Cara 8*D


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I know the bizarro world match was def my favorite.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I don't think I actively like ANYTHING from HIAC 2011. Yet I own the Bluray :lmao. Still unopened though . Mainly got it because I was buying Bluray events cheap from SV before they died and got Henry's WHC run. Plus, the Raw & SD Bluray extras look better than the event :lmao. Christian Vs Cena, Del Rio Vs Punk, Sheamus Vs Rhodes, Orton Vs Christian :mark:.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cena vs Christian isn't a match. Punk vs Del Rio might be the short one. Sheamus vs Rhodes is good. Orton vs Christian is meh. The PPV >>>>


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Sheamus vs. Rhodes interests the hell out of me. That will be getting a watch right now me'thinks


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

You guys are nuts with your dates and TV match knowledge etc etc. I CAN'T KEEP UP.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

*Ted DiBiase vs Randy Savage - WWF WrestleFest 1988*

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-m...e-vs-randy-savage-wwf-wrestlefest-1988-a.html


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Callamus said:


> I don't think I actively like ANYTHING from HIAC 2011. Yet I own the Bluray :lmao. Still unopened though . Mainly got it because I was buying Bluray events cheap from SV before they died and got Henry's WHC run. Plus, the Raw & SD Bluray extras look better than the event :lmao. Christian Vs Cena, Del Rio Vs Punk, Sheamus Vs Rhodes, Orton Vs Christian :mark:.


I'd like to own that


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

There was a joke Tyler made about me. Where he said about 5% of my mind deals with life and that stuff. Then the rest is processed all behind wrestling and wrestling only. I imagined it was the same for most of us out there.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Tyler's no slouch either, though. You're just one of a kind.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> Tyler's no slouch either, though. You're just one of a kind.


I do what I can


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That's true. Universal


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

5%? That seems a little high for me... .

BOOOOO at Cody killing my interest in those TV matches on the HIAC Bluray.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

zep81 said:


> *Ted DiBiase vs Randy Savage - WWF WrestleFest 1988*
> 
> http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-m...e-vs-randy-savage-wwf-wrestlefest-1988-a.html


:mark:



Callamus said:


> 5%? That seems a little high for me... .
> 
> BOOOOO at Cody killing my interest in those TV matches on the HIAC Bluray.


Kind of had to. The PPV is good! But yeah, I can't let another get fooled by Cena vs Christian like how I did back in 2011. Having all those RAW & Smackdown's on DVD sort of put an imprint on my memory. You _might_ like the Orton vs Christian match more. A lot of their matches did nothing for me.

Dude just watch the Sin Cara match b/c your review on it would be priceless.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Haven't seen the Real Americans/Rhodes Dynasty match from this Monday, any good?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Srdjan99 said:


> Haven't seen the Real Americans/Rhodes Dynasty match from this Monday, any good?


Very good :agree:


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

*** good?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Can't wait for a possible Rhodes vs. Real Americans rematch at Survivor Series :mark:

And a TLC match with those two teams plus The Shield in December would be too much. :woolcock


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

HHH made his dream come true, the Tag Team title picture becamme better than the WWE one


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Shield in another TLC match this year or GTFO.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> Shield in another TLC match this year or GTFO.




Not looking likely..... let's hope they don't split until 2014 though. I think before WM would be a perfect time around Elimination Chamber time.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

I'd like to see a Ziggler/Ambrose Ladder match this year only for the spots


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Srdjan99 said:


> I'd like to see a Ziggler/Ambrose Ladder match this year only for the spots




Fuck that...... Ziggler/Rollins!!!


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I'll shed a little tear when The Shield splits up.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Ziggler/Rollins ladder match would be insanity. WHO CAN NOT DIE FIRST?!?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Savage vs DiBiase Wrestlefest 1988 :mark:

Zep, you did it again! Thank you sir, will watch as soon as I get home.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Damn you guys, you just made me dream of a Rollins/Ziggler Ladder match that has no chance to happen for at least an year


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Hell in a Cell had Alberto Del Rio defeating Punk pretty much clean during Punk's hot phase. What the fuck was that shit?

The event overall was okay I guess. The three way cell match is good, the Henry-Orton cell match is good, ummm... I don't remember anything else so I guess the show was shit .


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

I remember Christian/Sheamus being a decent ***1/4 match and a ***1/2 between Air Boom/Ziggler&Swagger


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

If **** 1/4* is decent it probably equates to **** to me because I don't remember either of those matches at all .

TLC that year though. Holy smokes what a bunch of fun .


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> HBK/Jarrett?


I wouldnt say this is hidden at all, top 10 Michaels match ****1/2 on last watch

Whats this cena/christian ,didnt they have a raw match in 2011


Edit: and fuckk alll that ziggler/michaels or bust


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Well I know it isn't hidden, but it's really the only "gem" on that PPV.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I'm sitting hear bored at work listening to the Stone Cold podcast with Kurt Angle, so funny to hear Kurt shit all over his cage match with Benoit on Raw. He actually admits it's a spot happy fuck fest and that he hated the match when he watched the replay, but Stone Cold apparently loved it because it was just SO fucking crazy he was actually in awe while doing commentary. These Stone Cold podcasts are actually pretty cool. Kurt comes off as being wayyy more self aware than you would think. He says that he can't watch a lot of his early matches with some obvious exceptions because of how different he wished he had worked them.

I haven't seen any of his TNA stuff, is he actually working any smarter these days?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Nope. Though he has his gems. The stuff with McGuinness/Wolve in e.g..


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

:lmao Angle hasn't worked smart in about 11 years .


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

And here we go again :kurt


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

The Primer said:


> Cena vs Christian isn't a match. Punk vs Del Rio might be the short one. Sheamus vs Rhodes is good. Orton vs Christian is meh. The PPV >>>>


Isn't Cena/Christian when Cena destroys Christian and writes him off TV because of his injury? Yeah, that sucked. 



Srdjan99 said:


> Haven't seen the Real Americans/Rhodes Dynasty match from this Monday, any good?


I wasn't really paying attention just like I do during most of RAW, but I've heard good things. I did catch the finish though and I was pretty surprised to see The Real Americans go over Rhodes and Goldust clean, I guess they needed new challengers for the Tag Titles.



The Lady Killer said:


> Shield in another TLC match this year or GTFO.


After they put on the MOTY for me last year at TLC I'm all for this.



The Lady Killer said:


> Ziggler/Rollins ladder match would be insanity. WHO CAN NOT DIE FIRST?!?


:mark:


Srdjan99 said:


> I remember Christian/Sheamus being a decent ***1/4 match and a ***1/2 between Air Boom/Ziggler&Swagger


I remember both of these matches, both were decent to good, would probably agree on these ratings. Though I remember not liking the direction of Christian at the time after he fell out of the World Title picture, Sheamus winning was so obvious, still a good match though.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

According to a spoiler read of mine, this week's SD ME is one of the best Tag matches in recent history. :mark:



Spoiler: SD ME for who wants to know



Cena & Codust vs Sandow & Real Americans


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I read that too :mark:


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Hell in a Cell had Alberto Del Rio defeating Punk pretty much clean during Punk's hot phase. What the fuck was that shit?
> 
> The event overall was okay I guess. The three way cell match is good, the Henry-Orton cell match is good, ummm... I don't remember anything else so I guess the show was shit .


The whole booking of that angle between the night after MITB and Survivor Series (before the actual event) was strange. They should have kept Punk away maybe as long as Survivor Series, let Rey hold the title until Summerslam, then Del Rio cashes in on him. Rey/Cena/Del Rio could have been interesting, then Cena goes off and does his thing with the Rock, and Del Rio/Punk still have their match. 

Either way, three way HIAC in 2011 was tons of fun, and Christian/Sheamus is really enjoyable also.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nostalgia said:


> Isn't Cena/Christian when Cena destroys Christian and writes him off TV because of his injury? Yeah, that sucked.


Don't believe so. Think that match was the one that went three minutes and Cena slammed through Christian like he was a lower card chump. Which was dissatisfying all the same.

HIAC 2011 is a good show outside of Sin Cara vs Sin Cara. I'll stand by that.

Sheamus vs Christian. Air Boom vs Perfect Americans. Rhodes vs Morrison in a match that was still good despite Rhodes working in "street" clothes. Women's match was fine iirc too. Nothing special, but not a DUD. Show turned out well for only two weeks build. Unlike this year's where it all felt like filler pardon one match. And that's the World Championship, btw.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Don't believe so. Think that match was the one that went three minutes and Cena slammed through Christian like he was a lower card chump. Which was dissatisfying all the same.
> 
> HIAC 2011 is a good show outside of Sin Cara vs Sin Cara. I'll stand by that.
> 
> Sheamus vs Christian. Air Boom vs* Perfect Americans*. Rhodes vs Morrison in a match that was still good despite Rhodes working in "street" clothes. Women's match was fine iirc too. Nothing special, but not a DUD. Show turned out well for only two weeks build. Unlike this year's where it all felt like filler pardon one match. And that's the World Championship, btw.


Its Zigg Swagg man


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Its Zig Zag Paddy Swagg, actually.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Callamus said:


> :lmao Angle hasn't worked smart in about 11 years .


Angle vs. Lesnar from SummerSlam was only 10 years ago. :usangle


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

If we're listing our own names for it then I would have chimed in on changing Air Boom's b/c that one is atrocious. Although I could never found one that popped well. So I always settled on High Energy II. Not original in the slightest capacity, yet >.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

American Perfection


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Best duo ever thanks to all the names that are coming up.


----------



## ArnoldTricky (Jan 3, 2012)

ATF said:


> According to a spoiler read of mine, this week's SD ME is one of the best Tag matches in recent history. :mark:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


:mark:

That's saying a lot seeing as we've had quite a few awesome multi-man matches (mainly with The Shield) that have happened over the last year.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

The Primer said:


> If we're listing our own names for it then I would have chimed in on changing Air Boom's b/c that one is atrocious. Although I could never found one that popped well. So I always settled on High Energy II. Not original in the slightest capacity, yet >.


look at this thread. Its one of my favourites that's ever been on the forum. http://www.wrestlingforum.com/raw/569803-your-name-choice-bourne-kofi.html


edit - also did you see my post about Taker v. Haku in the Classic thread yesterday? HAVE YOU SEEN THAT MATCH!? (I haven't btw)


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The zig zagg Vick swaggie pack (Y) I'm done 

Want a little series of matches to watch


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Are you a fan of two big bastards getting in the ring, forgoing any sort of attempt at a civilized wrestling match, and instead doing everything in their power to try and STRAIGHT MURDER each other? Do you enjoy watching one 300 pound guy try to knock another 300 pound guys head off? Do you like wild bloody brawls with a HOT crowd and Jim Ross on commentary? Well you're in luck! I have just the match for you!

Hacksaw Jim Duggan vs Mad Dog Buzz Sawyer in November of 85', off the Blu-Ray extras on the Legends of MidSouth set!

That was one hell of a watch. Anyone else seen it? BAH GAWD, SAWYER IS BLEEDING PRO-FUSELY!!


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> look at this thread. Its one of my favourites that's ever been on the forum. http://www.wrestlingforum.com/raw/569803-your-name-choice-bourne-kofi.html
> 
> 
> edit - also did you see my post about Taker v. Haku in the Classic thread yesterday? HAVE YOU SEEN THAT MATCH!? (I haven't btw)


Is it a Bulldog/Haku match i've heard decent things about? Never seen it i don't think


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Yeah Duggan/Sawyer rules Earth. Is Sawyer/Reed dog collar on the Mid-South set? Here it is if not. Watch it, it also rules Earth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMEnQEsGdRU http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4U8Hwr9KNM


No tag team name will ever top Zig Zag Paddy Swag. Ever.

EDIT - the Undertaker v. Haku from 1992 WAR/WWF show. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-aq_cjKpbCw


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Been thinking about the best Randy Savage matches, besides a few obvious ones.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

A few things:

1)Where is that list of top 100 John Cena matches, that someone in this thread made? You all were talking about this earlier.

2)Jack Evans 187, I just read the discussion in the Classics section. I'm a Bret fan who is not as high on Summerslam '97 vs. Taker as even non-Bret fans are, which is funny. I loved, however, their One Night Only match together (easily ****+, imo. I gave it **** 1/2). Whenever you may get a chance, please watch that and let me know what you think. I'm curious about your opinion on that. 

As for their Royal Rumble '96 match, yeah, that one was weird, and I can 100% see why people would absolutely despise that match. I found it to have a weirdly engrossing quality, but I would never outright recommend it, because I'm pretty certain my opinion wouldn't fall in with the majority on that.

3)What was that convo between CKOK & funnyfaces1 about? I feel like I missed an entire conversation that was being referenced. 


ETA: Here's the link to Taker vs. Bret at One Night Only if you want to watch in the future:
http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/7KeySsZMjjs/


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^ I was in that convo too, it was about the best babyface in wwe history KOK said Cena and Punk fan thinks Bret hart


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah1993 said:


> Yeah Duggan/Sawyer rules Earth. Is Sawyer/Reed dog collar on the Mid-South set? Here it is if not. Watch it, it also rules Earth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMEnQEsGdRU http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4U8Hwr9KNM
> 
> 
> No tag team name will ever top Zig Zag Paddy Swag. Ever.
> ...


As good as my invention of that tag name was, I still feel the name for the team that never was in Undertaker and HBK is better .

DEAD SEXY~!

Downloaded that Taker Vs Haku match. No idea if I've seen it or not, but who cares? I'll fucking watch it anyway :mark:.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> ^*I was in that convo too*, it was about the best babyface in wwe history KOK said Cena and Punk fan thinks Bret hart


I know, but it seemed like they were referencing something the two of them had a convo on previously. I searched some posts back, and I see now that it was just based on CKOK making a comment about Cena being the best face in history. I understand now.

CKOK, I see that it was your John Cena list I was talking about a little while ago. By googling, I find pieces of it, but I haven't found it all in one place. Do you have the whole list?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

:lmao what the FUCK is that noise in the background on Undertaker/Haku? Sounds like someone is legit MASTURBATING it the match :lmao. In fact, I think it might be Haku making the noises :lmao. Whoever the fuck it is they are enjoying this WAY too much .

Match for like 5 minutes is ungodly fun. Undertaker going all ZOMBIE on the toughest man alive, then Haku going all TOUGHEST MAN ALIVE on the zombie. Exactly what I was expecting from them :mark:. Did they have a singles match in 2001? When BOD were feuding with Haku and Rikishi? Seems like a possibility.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Since we giving random team names, I present to you the name of a Taker/Khali team:

*The Walking Dead.*

8*D


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

zep81 said:


> Been thinking about the best Randy Savage matches, besides a few obvious ones.



The obvious one that everyone will say is WM3 vs Ricky Steamboat. While I will definitely give that match it's due, as far as being revolutionary will all the near falls, false finishes, and back and forth action, personally I don't think it's Macho's best match.


The best thing Randy ever did, in my opinion, was carry the Ultimate fucking Warrior, a guy who went down in history as probably the worst worker ever to hold the WWE title, to a 5-Star, certified classic at WM7. I love that match, and consider it one of the 5 best Mania matches ever. It tells a perfect story that's easy to understand, and the psychology of how Randy built that match makes the drama just build and build throughout. That match doesn't have peaks and valleys, it's just 1 long steady crescendo that builds all the way to the finish. A work of art, if I do say so myself.

That DiBiase vs Macho Man you just uploaded is absolutely tops. Those are two absolute masters in the ring, I love how both guys work for the entire match plays exactly into their character, and that there is absolutely no fluff: every move is done for a purpose. I will say the finish wasn't the best. One gripe I have a lot of times is, 2 wrestlers will throw absolutely everything in their arsenal at each other, all their signature moves, finishers, etc. We get a bunch of false finishes, then finally one guy beats the other guy with a small package. The fuck? That always brings me right back down to earth and reminds me what I just watched wasn't real. 

It didn't bother me as much in this match because Randy hadn't really thrown every move at Teddy in that match, it was more a desperation "this is my only shot so I'm taking it" small package attempt. He'd just taking a chair shot to he dome by Virgil and barely kicked out, so it makes sense to finish the match that way. I think I just talked myself into liking the finish :lmao


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I need to watch Savage/Steamboat for the first time in...........fucking years  And to my shame, i still havn't gotten round to watching Savage/Lawler (Loser Leaves Town)


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

There was a time when I thought savage/steamboat was not only ***** but like a top 5 match in company history

Look at Cjack with tge DVD thread lingo ( that match was absolute tops :lmao)

I agree savage/warrior is incredible


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Downloaded the MITB anthology to watch the first match and see how they've fucked it up. Wow, it simply ruins one of the most exciting matches ever. The editing is horrendous on this one. Every piece of commentary mentioning Benoit is muted (so there'll be a loooong gap in the last couple of minutes with only two or three sentences uttered all this while). They also do a close up on Kane after the diving headbutt and keep it on the hard camera when Benoit and Shelton suplex Kane on the outside so you almost completely miss the move being executed. It is funny to hear Benoit's loud moaning when selling the arm injury, though. They show Edge standing on the ramp with the briefcase while Benoit can still be heard.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah not gonna get the MITB anthology, just gonna get the events themselves


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> Downloaded the MITB anthology to watch the first match and see how they've fucked it up. Wow, it simply ruins one of the most exciting matches ever. The editing is horrendous on this one. Every piece of commentary mentioning Benoit is muted (so there'll be a loooong gap in the last couple of minutes with only two or three sentences uttered all this while). They also do a close up on Kane after the diving headbutt and keep it on the hard camera when Benoit and Shelton suplex Kane on the outside so you almost completely miss the move being executed. It is funny to hear Benoit's loud moaning when selling the arm injury, though. They show Edge standing on the ramp with the briefcase while Benoit can still be heard.


Just saw this on watchwrestling. I actually own the WM 21 DVD so I've got that match before it was edited. 

Fucking aye, Miz is hosting it. They couldn't have had Christian or Jericho or someone who's actually done a ton of ladder matches. (Side note: Christian's theme during this time was pretty hot.)

His entire entrance was actually cut. WOW, the points where the commentary is muted sounds stupid, especially after Benoit's German on Jericho and when he's got Kane in the crossface. Then the same when he locks in the crossface on Edge. SILENCE. Then a ton of silence when Benoit climbs up for the ladder, except when JR says something about Kane, them more silence. You'd think the commentators would be going crazy (which they were) with a man on top of a ladder seemingly about to jump off, but it's silent, and the moment is just kind of there. Then yeah, like two minutes of no commentary, and some of it with Benoit yelling hard.

fpalm at that editing. Way to fuck that up.

This should answer your question as to whether or not they put the WM XX main event on the new HBK DVD. If they do, imagine what they'd do to that one.

Also, REALLY glad they got the matches from this year on it. That Smackdown MITB is :mark:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

ATF said:


> According to a spoiler read of mine, this week's SD ME is one of the best Tag matches in recent history. :mark:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Eh, I don't care for that match. :side: It's a match that will probably be repeated on the next RAW anyway, because WWE repeating matches on RAW from Smackdown seems to be common thing these days because WWE thinks no one watches Smackdown, which I can't blame them seeing as nothing happens on Smackdown usually. 



The Primer said:


> Don't believe so. Think that match was the one that went three minutes and Cena slammed through Christian like he was a lower card chump. Which was dissatisfying all the same.


Oh, well the booking of Christian always seem to be dissatisfying.  The guy's never been booked to his true potential, he should of been a WWE Champion in 2005 when he was the best thing in wrestling. And when he finally wins the World Title his reigns were some of the worst booked ever. At least TNA booked Christian right for a while...


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm not important enough to have a discussion with CKOK. No argument, I just thought he legit forgot about Bret.

I pimped out Sawyer/Duggan a couple months ago. Incredible fight, especially the backstage portion. Can anyone find the No DQ Duggan/Dibiase match?


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> *I'm not important enough to have a discussion with CKOK.*


8*D.

Think I`m going to pick up a few DVDs tonight to watch & review over the next couple of days. Watching random ass matches on Youtube gets fucking boring after a while and I need some quality in my life, too bad I can`t find the Goldberg DVD at any local stores and that the WWE has too many "Repeat" releases that are comprised of far too many repeat matches. So we'll see how that goes, maybe I'll pick up a few cheap PPVs, who knows?

& maybe I'll go see Carrie tonight since tomorrow's Halloween? DECISIONS.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> This should answer your question as to whether or not they put the WM XX main event on the new HBK DVD. If they do, imagine what they'd do to that one.
> 
> Also, REALLY glad they got the matches from this year on it. That Smackdown MITB is :mark:


Legit wondering over how they'll do the finish. Will they show HBK on the outside, do a close up on HHH's face or just show it like it is with the commentary muted?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> Legit wondering over how they'll do the finish. Will they show HBK on the outside, do a close up on HHH's face or just show it like it is with the commentary muted?


With the muted commentary, it'll be the most awkward ending ever, especially since Trips spends a good amount of time in the crossface.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm still trying to find a series (smaller like 2-3 matches) to watch for this evening on mischief night


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Watching KOTR 2002 still, really tough PPV to get through, RVD vs jericho was good but didn't really like BORK vs TEST TBH


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Just realized most of you dont say "mischief" night as only my area calls it that, Im guess most of you call iy devil night whatevs

still dont know what to watch


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> Just realized most of you dont say "mischief" night as only my area calls it that, Im guess most of you call iy devil night whatevs
> 
> still dont know what to watch


Hell in a cell 2011 triple threat or Piper vs Bret


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> Just realized most of you dont say "mischief" night as only my area calls it that, Im guess most of you call iy devil night whatevs
> 
> still dont know what to watch




We call it mischief night here too.

Hmm, good 2-3 match feud that can be watched?

God this is tough all the feuds I'm thinking of are atleast 4 matches....

how about Eddie vs Edge? Summerslam 2002, I think Unforgiven 2002 right after, then the TREMENDOUS Smackdown No DQ. All matches are less than 20 minutes. You can also go RVD vs Eddie, Backlash 2002 then one of the top 5 singles ladder matches ever on Raw. Both matches get over **** for me.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Does the MITB anthology have SD 2010 on it?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

All MITB matches are on it, including this years. 

Hey skins, check out Brock/Edge from Rebellion 2002.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

punk/adr/cena right ? I'll give it a watch as it seems to have sparked discussion the last couple of weeks

eddie/edge ?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

sharkboy22 said:


> Does the MITB anthology have SD 2010 on it?


It has all of them 


@skins didn't realize you were talking about a feud :lol. Cactus Jack is right on with the Eddie/Edge ratings, I support that.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> punk/adr/cena right ? I'll give it a watch as it seems to have sparked discussion the last couple of weeks
> 
> eddie/edge ?


BOOOOOO Edge vs Eddie all the way 

Nah if you haven't seen 2011 HiaC it's worth the watch, very fun match, I gave it ***3/4 last watch.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Can't believe my Red Sox could actually win it all tonight, will be watching KOTR 2002 while watching so review shall be up tonight or tomorrow! 

Eddie/Flair is up next :mark: PLEASE LIVE UP TO POTENTIAL!


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

I remember triple threat HIAC 2011 being fun. Won't say it was great or anything but at the time I remember being entertained by it.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

People were talking about great Savage matches right? Or just forgotten ones? The one that instantly pops up for me is the SNME match against Bret Hart. My goodness what a sell job on that leg. Wonderful match.



Callamus said:


> I don't think I actively like ANYTHING from HIAC 2011. Yet I own the Bluray :lmao. Still unopened though . Mainly got it because I was buying Bluray events cheap from SV before they died and got Henry's WHC run. Plus, the Raw & SD Bluray extras look better than the event :lmao. Christian Vs Cena, Del Rio Vs Punk, Sheamus Vs Rhodes, Orton Vs Christian :mark:.


You guys fucking suck for getting EVERY ppv released on blu ray. If they did that here in the states this company would get so much more money from me. I have every ppv they've done this year in the US on blu ray aside from Wrestlemania & Royal Rumble. I'm a sucker for all the extras. 



Cactus Jack said:


> I haven't seen any of his TNA stuff, is he actually working any smarter these days?


HELL no.



redskins25 said:


> The zig zagg Vick swaggie pack (Y) I'm done
> 
> Want a little series of matches to watch


Well since I did so well last time with Punk/Batista, let me give it another shot. How abouttttt.... Orton vs. HBK in '07 or all the major Bryan vs. Barrett bouts?



Cactus Jack said:


> Are you a fan of two big bastards getting in the ring, forgoing any sort of attempt at a civilized wrestling match, and instead doing everything in their power to try and STRAIGHT MURDER each other? Do you enjoy watching one 300 pound guy try to knock another 300 pound guys head off? Do you like wild bloody brawls with a HOT crowd and Jim Ross on commentary? Well you're in luck! I have just the match for you!
> 
> Hacksaw Jim Duggan vs Mad Dog Buzz Sawyer in November of 85', off the Blu-Ray extras on the Legends of MidSouth set!
> 
> That was one hell of a watch. Anyone else seen it? BAH GAWD, SAWYER IS BLEEDING PRO-FUSELY!!


Well I own that but for some reason I never watched the blu ray extras. I'll certainly have to get on that sometime. (Y)



LilOlMe said:


> A few things:
> 
> 1)Where is that list of top 100 John Cena matches, that someone in this thread made? You all were talking about this earlier.
> 
> ...


You MAY have just figured out what I'll be watching tonight. Keep your eyes posted in the Classic Thread (to make it easier to find) for my review of one or more Bret vs. Taker matches.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Corey, I'm finally gonna watch Judgment Day 2008 with HBK and Jericho I think.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Good choice :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yea that one of Bret's best matches IMO

"I about to put on cena/punk/adr"

I see Corey's post, I think I'll do bryan/barrett singles just looked on cagematch so it is :
ss 11
sd cage
sd NO DQ
Saturday morning

They have like 3 under 5 min match but they seem stupid soo I'll skip


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> Corey, I'm finally gonna watch Judgment Day 2008 with HBK and Jericho I think.


Wonderful choice! Now let's see if anyone can enjoy it as much as I did. 



redskins25 said:


> Yea that one of Bret's best matches IMO
> 
> "I about to put on cena/punk/adr"
> 
> ...


Another wonderful choice! haha. The No DQ match is all kinds of fun. Love a little mini feud inbetween a bigger one, a la Punk/Henry last year.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I remember the cage match being :homer


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Red sox are winning!!! 

About to start the ME of KOTR 2002


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Wonderful choice! Now let's see if anyone can enjoy it as much as I did.


★★★¾-★★★★ for this one. It started off slow but really picked up towards the end after the Sweet Chin Music on the apron. Otherwise, I thought it was just a basic match expected from these two so I didn't enjoy it as much as you do.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*King of the ring 2002 review ​**Match # 1: Chris Jericho vs RVD*

This should be entertaining; I enjoyed their RAW match from this year, so this should be just as good. This match was a good choice for an opener as it might be one of the more entertaining matches of the night. Both men do good jobs of working in this match, and as usual, heel Jericho is brilliant. This is a KOTR semifinals match and the winner of this match goes on to face the winner of Test vs Brock, which I fully expect to be a squash . I did love the ending of this match as it had some fun spots and near falls. Jericho and RVD have really good chemistry too. RVD moves on to the KOTR finals. *** ¾* 

*CAL SCALE: 4*

*Match # 2: Brock Lesnar vs test *

This should be a decent match, haven’t really seen much from test besides his run with Albert in T&A which I really liked. Obviously Bork is great too but he might be a little green here, but then again I really liked his match against Hardy from Backlash. For some reason I have no interest in this match, no idea why. Really MEH match overall, not too bad but CLEARLY nothing to write home about. Last 2-5 minutes picked up but kind of a boring match overall. * 1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 0.5 *

*Match # 3: Jamie Noble vs Hurricane *

*sigh, why the fuck is Tajiri left off this card but the HURRICANE is on it? I honestly forget if hurricane is good but his gimmick as a fucking superhero is up there as a WOAT gimmick. Oh well, at least Noble can be fun at times, but its upsetting that the cruiserweight match is more filler on this PPV as cruiserweights are second only to tag matches as the best part of 2002. Awesome chant from the crowd chanting HES A MANWHORE! At Jamie Noble, but this match really aint too bad, not as good as some other Cruiserweight matches from 2002 such as Kidman vs Tajiri from backlash which I think I am obsessed with its so good. OK so this wasn’t a filler match I guess, because it went a good 10 minutes :lol. Really fun match, not MOTN but a close second. ***

*CAL SCALE: 2*

*Match # 4: Eddie Gurrero vs Ric Flair *

Unfortunately Flair’s only good match was against vince at the rumble of all people. Then again eddie can carry anyone so expecting something fun here. But come on, FUCKING EDDIE AND FLAIR IN A MATCH!! :mark:. So excited for this and I refuse to be disappointed! This was another OK match but not as good as it could’ve been. I mean, can you imagine both of these guys duking it out in their prime? That would be like, the best match EVER. This is still an extremely fun match and Flair looks to be having a lot more fun in this match than he did with his Jericho and RVD matches, probably why this was better than all his other 2002 matches except maybe the great Mcmahon match. *** ¼* 

*CAL SCALE: 2*

*Match # 5: Molly Holly vs Trish Stratus *

If I haven’t made this clear enough, I HATE WOMENS MATCHES! NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1 *

*Match # 6: Kurt Angle vs Hulk Hogan*

OK, heard that this is actually pretty decent, so I wont put a NO on it like I will some other Hogan matches. Angle is getting me weak with his amateur headgear on :lmao, so great. The pre match promo + entrances actually takes close to 10 minutes which is crazy haha. This was a pretty fun match, but it follows the pattern of this show as good, but nothing great. It’s a good nostalgia pop for Hogan fans and it one of Hogans better matches in his 2002 run but that really isn’t saying much. Angle and Hogan have good chemistry and the crowd is CRAZY into this one, really fun stuff. ***

*CAL SCALE: 2*

*Match # 7: RVD vs Brock Lesnar*

Most predictable KOTR finals match? Probably TBH, but it still should be a fun match. Looks to be on the short side of things but that is honestly just what I need before going into the Main event. This was really fun actually, but man was it short! It was only like 7 fucking minutes! This should have gotten more time and the fact that it got less than 10 minutes really shows that the KOTR had diminished greatly in value, so BORK would be the last KOTR till Booker T in like 2006, but this was the last KOTR PPV. Anyways decent match but once again had the MEH feeling coming out. ** 

*CAL SCALE: 1*

*Match # 8: HHH vs the Undertaker *

Holy shit I can’t believe I actually sat through this match, it made WM 27 look like a fucking ***** match, and I fucking hate that match. Legit the only good part about this shit was the part when the Rock interfered at the end, but that really didn’t make the match. Yeah don’t see this match EVER, and don’t watch this joke of a show that is bound to be the worst show of the year for 2002. DUD

*CAL SCALE: 0 *

*TOTAL CAL SCALE: 10.5 *

*CURRENT 2002 PPV MOTY: Eddie Gurrero vs Chris Benoit(Armageddon)*


*CURRENT 2002 PPV rankings 
1: rebellion(20)
2: The Royal rumble(18)
3: No mercy(15.5)
4: Armageddon(15.5)
5: Unforgiven(15) 
6: Backlash(11.5)
7: King of the ring(10.5)​*


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I always forget that Trips/Taker from KOTR exists. I actually try to forget most of Trips' 2002, save for Summerslam and a few other things.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yep, they have another match at Insurrection 2002 this year too, really not looking forward to the next three PPVS I have to review. NWO(might be decent though), JD, and Insurrection. luckily then I get Vengeance, SVS, and SS to end the project. 

Thoughts on SVS 2012? thinking about buying the DVD cheap on Amazon..


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> ★★★¾-★★★★ for this one. It started off slow but really picked up towards the end after the Sweet Chin Music on the apron. Otherwise, I thought it was just a basic match expected from these two so I didn't enjoy it as much as you do.


Well that's ok, at least you gave it a favorable rating. I just absolutely love the storytelling they portray and the mind games both guys play towards one another. The fakeouts, the sudden finishers, and submission work are all top notch. **** 1/2 for me. Total classic.


EDIT: Ok I forgot half the card but I've not seen anyone speak _too_ highly of SVS 2012.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

It has dat SHIELD debut.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

REDSKINS.

WATCH THE PUNK VS HENRY 2012 SERIES.

NOW.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah, I'll pass on buying it, even though the ME is ***3/4 IMO

Starting NWO 2002, going to sleep when the world series game is over after I cry tears of joy for a little bit :lol.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

SvS 2012 had four good matches, but it's a perfect example of a PPV with good matches, but just didn't feel that fun. Something was missing and it didn't feel like a big four PPV.

Punk/Henry series is greatness. Their post-WM match is one of my all-time favorite matches. I can honestly say that given the time and situation, they wrestled a perfect match. Not near-perfect, but legit perfect.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Funnyfaces your a sox fan right? WE WON!


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> REDSKINS.
> 
> WATCH THE PUNK VS HENRY 2012 SERIES.
> 
> NOW.


Will watch this tomorrow, as I dont have morning classes and I got wade/bryan cage on atm,


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Skipping a CM Punk & Mark Henry bout for Wade fucking Barrett?

Some fucking people .


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

:lol I told Corey I would watch this whole series, Im a man of my word ( insert Ledger smiley) and this cage match is pretty good,


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

skins is just doing what's best for business. :vince5

As much as I don't care for Barrett, you could argue Bryan is his best opponent.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

You don't even need to argue. The only competition for Barrett's best opponent is Sheamus. Bryan, Sheamus, and Christian are the best guys on the roster when you want to get the most out of someone. Ah, I can't believe it, but I'm starting to miss Sheamus. As long as he doesn't main event or is champion, I'm ok with him.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Well I think some people will claim Cena as one of Barrett's best opponents too, but I've never seen any of their matches... so yeah.  Sheamus & Bryan with Orton wayyy down on the list.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I'd actually probably go Cena as Barrett's best opponent. HIAC + TLC were class acts, especially the fantastic former.

Watching more CM GOAT at the moment, Survivor Series w/ Del Rio incoming. Finkel entrance gives me all kinds of chills as WWE rights their initial wrongs, kickstarting the GOAT WWE title reign :mark:. That's it; I'm starting this Punk shit with his 434 day title reign.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

They had a good match at HIAC 2010, but they had an awful one last year on television. I also thought their chairs match was a DUD, but the Cena apologists here see something in it.

Edit: Good Lord, a top 100 CM Punk project :mark:. Surely this will make C2D a fan.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> You MAY have just figured out what I'll be watching tonight. Keep your eyes posted in the Classic Thread (to make it easier to find) for my review of one or more Bret vs. Taker matches.


(Y)

Will be getting to some of your Del Rio stuff soon, by the way!

CKOK, I think you missed it, but I asked you if you can link me to your Cena list, please.


----------



## JY57 (Jul 31, 2012)

Metzler's HIAC Ratings:

Sandow vs Kofi - **
Cody/Goldust vs The Usos vs The Shield - ****
Fandango/Summer Rae vs Natalya/Khali - 1/4*
Langston vs Ambrose - *1/2
Punk vs Ryback - **1/4
Los Matadores vs Real Americans - *1/2
Cena vs Del Rio: ***
AJ Lee vs Brie Bella - **
Orton vs Bryan - ***1/2


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> I'd actually probably go Cena as Barrett's best opponent. HIAC + TLC were class acts, especially the fantastic former.
> 
> Watching more CM GOAT at the moment, Survivor Series w/ Del Rio incoming. Finkel entrance gives me all kinds of chills as WWE rights their initial wrongs, kickstarting the GOAT WWE title reign :mark:. That's it; I'm starting this Punk shit with his 434 day title reign.





Jack Evans 187 said:


> Well I think some people will claim Cena as one of Barrett's best opponents too, but I've never seen any of their matches... so yeah.  Sheamus & Bryan with Orton wayyy down on the list.


Was thinking about Cena but I only had the HIAC match for my argument. Haven't seen the chairs match, but with TLC in December, I may check that event. Bryan has likely had better matches with Barrett on the whole. Cena and Barrett hooked up on Smackdown in early 2011 and Barrett was squashed in like, 3 minutes. Didn't even get a chance to fight out of the AA.

LOVE Finkel at Survivor Series. Bugs the shit out of me that Cole and Lawler crapped all over him. Pretty sure Vince was in their ear telling them too.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Guess I'll go ahead and post this in here too for the other peeps:

*WWF Championship
*Bret Hart (c) vs. The Undertaker - ***
_Royal Rumble 1996

_So I've seen this match two times prior and my rating has went down on every watch now.  This is just a very odd match. On one hand, some people might highly appreciate the work that Bret puts on Undertaker's leg and might enjoy the slower pace, but in this case I'm not one of those people. I'm always one to enjoy a good bit of limbwork and psychology during a match, but honestly this got pretty boring at times. Bret taking off Taker's protective mask thing was pretty cool I guess. I felt like they went unnecessarily long just for the hell of it though because the PPV went WAY short of the full 3 hours. It's essentially a 28 minute No DQ match with an ass ton of legwork that doesn't play into anything because of an eventual dq finish. Quite the strange way to build to a Wrestlemania match between Taker & Diesel considering it ruined what was about to be a pretty cool finish, but whatever. Does anyone know if Taker ever got a rematch and if it was any good if he did?

+++++++++++++++++++++++

*WWF Championship Match w/ Special Referee Shawn Michaels *
The Undertaker (c) vs. Bret Hart - *** 1/4 - *** 1/2 (can't decide)
_Summerslam 1997_

Hmmm. I don't know if I've ever seen this match in full, so we'll just call this my first viewing. This one was incredibly similar to their Rumble match, in fact a couple of the sequences were exactly the same. I think this was probably more exciting due to to Shawn being the guest ref and Bret being full on heel. I think Bret did pretty well throughout the whole match at working heel and doing everything he could to win. Unfortunately there was more damn legwork that went on forever and ever and wasn't that exciting. I was a little bothered by Taker's selling, especially when he was in the Sharpshooter. He just layed there motionless, no reaction to anything. My two favorite parts of this match that _weren't _the finish was the time where Bret was trying to run the ropes and Taker just reached across and grabbed him by the throat while he was running at full speed along with the superplex spot. In this case I actually liked how shaky Taker appeared when climbing the ropes, then Bret kicked the top ropes to make him collapse. I loved how much of a struggle it was to actually hit that superplex after Taker had already fallen off the top rope on the first try. It was odd that the chokeslam over the ropes didn't get a bigger reaction. I liked the last few minutes of this quite a bit and thought the finish was pulled off extremely well. Shawn's reaction was fantastic. I'd like to rate it a little higher but once again it's 28 fucking minutes and half of that isn't all that exciting. The appearances from Bearer, Pillman, & Owen really didn't add much of anything outside of Shawn missing the count after the chokeslam, but the beginning and end are both excellent though.

++++++++++++++++++++++++

*WWF Championship
*Bret Hart (c) vs. The Undertaker - *** 1/4
_WWF One Night Only

_What the hell is up with these guys going 28 minutes every match? Weird. I'm not gonna lie, this is was pretty tough to sit through. After watching both of their other LONG ass matches back-to-back, I was _hoping_ they'd switch up the way this one was worked. Unfortunately for me, they didn't. It was the same legwork, same pacing, same story, same sequences, SAME SAME SAME. hahaha. Really though, I wanted to fast forward everytime I saw Bret go for the leg because I was so tired of it. This match probably has the best crowd, so that's a positive. There was one sequence that I really liked where Taker tried to drop the leg but Bret caught him and reversed into the sharpshooter, then Taker powered out of it. That was really where I thought the match peaked, then they just kept going until we got a really shitty finish. If I hadn't watched the other two before this, I _may _have enjoyed this a little more, but I still would've known it's pretty much the same damn match as the other ones. All in all a pretty overrated series if I'm being honest. My favorite match of the three would probably be Summerslam but that's not really saying that I love it. As it stands, their Madison Square Garden match in '92 from the Dungeon Collection set is still their best encounter by a long shot. That one's a real gem and doesn't have any fucking legwork. :lol


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> look at this thread. Its one of my favourites that's ever been on the forum. http://www.wrestlingforum.com/raw/569803-your-name-choice-bourne-kofi.html
> 
> 
> edit - also did you see my post about Taker v. Haku in the Classic thread yesterday? HAVE YOU SEEN THAT MATCH!? (I haven't btw)


Oh shoot, a Pyro post that legit made me laugh right on the first page. Classic.

Speaking of Classic, I'll head on over there right now..._(I have seen it btw; if it's the one from Japan)_


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Guess I'll go ahead and post this in here too for the other peeps:
> 
> *WWF Championship
> *Bret Hart (c) vs. The Undertaker - ***
> ...


RE: Royal Rumble, yeah, like I said, seeing a terrible rating for that match wouldn't surprise me, and I'd get it.


Here is what I said about it before, though, after someone commented on it in the Bret thread:



Spoiler: spoiler






Forever Unchained said:


> What are people's thoughts on the Undertaker match from Royal Rumble 96? I remember loving it at the time - Taker looked like a monster and Bret was probably his first genuine 'normal' opponent in years. I liked how Bret wrestled the Phantom mask off. Ending sucks and it made Bret look weak (a feature of that title run with him barely eeking out a Cage victory against Nash the following month). The Cliq should've stayed out of that one. A Bret v Owen PPV title match prior to Mania XII would've been awesome. Something like a ladder match would've been GOAT. Owen was so terrible underutilised


I personally really liked it, and I agree with all of your thoughts. It's another one of Bret's matches that felt cinematic to me. I can totally understand why people hate it though, and maybe it benefited from lowered expectations for me. It _was_ slooow, definitely the slowest of Bret's career, but I thought that it worked perfectly for Taker's creepy character, and his entire methodical approach. 

Also, I understand it, because I think that this was the first big, long, match that Taker ever worked. Before then all of his shit was under 12 or so minutes, and he had been feuding with the likes of Mabel.


Basically, I agree with these posts:


> I long considered this match underrated. Think I even wrote a long review of it somewhere (maybe the SC board). It's a smartly worked match if you can get past the absurdity of a "techincal" wrestler going up against a Zombie. One of the only times 'Taker had a chance to go up against a technician during this phase of his gimmick, which makes the match interesting in and of itself.





> Watching Bret on the 95 yearbook and here, he really does a lot of heelish shit to keep his belt -- you can see some of the mannerisms that made him so entertaining as a heel during the Hart Foundation run in the next year.





> I just watched this in full to review for 411, I gotta say I was pleasantly surprised by this. I'd always heard this match get absolutely panned, but I thought it was actually quite good, once you get past the early portion of UT trying to smother Bret. This is basically Bret working his type of match (wrestling based) and Taker working his sort of match, but it actually comes off pretty well.
> 
> Bret works in some nice heel touches, and even the FIVE MOVES OF DOOM works here, with Bret using them trying to keep UT down, but he keeps sitting back up. UT had spent almost four years stuck working with monster heels (Kamala, Gonzales, Yoko, Bundy, and Mabel) where all he had to do was let the heel work him over and work in his basic spots.



It's definitely an acquired taste, and I can't say that I'd outright recommend it, because I know that many would hate it. There are definitely points against it. But if you can get by the really slow pacing, there's definitely some money stuff in this match. The whole vibe, aura, and presentation were top-notch to me. Riveting enough that I could ignore the slow moving nature of it all (and in some ways I think that added to it, though it did get to the point where it took away from it).


Oh, and this kind of sums it up, LOL:


> Spoiler: spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> good but by no means great title match with a junk finish redeemed somewhat by an obscene hand gesture


And Taker's mask was cool, btw:















As for Summerslam, the atmosphere was pretty good, and I loved Bret's heel entrance and whole vibe he had going on at the time. The actual match itself had none of the qualities that I really love, though, so I was meh on it. Your rating is the same as mine. 

Surprised about your One Night Only comment, and I do think that watching them all in a row may have negatively effected your opinion toward ONO. I actually thought that they wrestled it in a totally different way from their other two major matches. They were both ultra-aggressive, right from the start, and that was Taker's best ever selling during that time period.

I was about to say more, but I'll just link to my previous comments on this:



Spoiler: spoiler






TripleG said:


> My Top Ten Favorite Bret Hart Matches (for the sake of simplicity, I am listing only singles matches).
> 
> 10) Bret Hart Vs. The Undertaker for the WWF World Heavyweight Championship at One Night Only 1997 = It is a fantastic match up that is exciting and perfectly captures the type of chemistry that these two could have together.













*Bret Hart vs. Undertaker at UK One Night Only PPV 1997*


I watched this last night as well, and I agree with you, it is fantastic. It was one of the most fast-paced, immediate, matches that Bret's ever had. Kind of surprised me, because I expected it to start off more methodical, with a guy like the Undertaker. I loved Bret's heelish sort of vibe, and the crowd was absolutely rowdy and engaged. Undertaker impressed me with his selling abilities. I feel like he hit just the right perfect tone, as far as selling. It's kind of hard to straddle that line, with his character, but he did it. 

Bret's approach as far as the leg work was an absolute thing of beauty. Particularly because it felt like it had a sinister vibe to it, rather than just simply trying to wear the Undertaker down. The unspoken psychology of it all was so interesting to watch, especially with the way that Bret was subtlety playing to the crowd at certain points. 

The way both wrestlers reacted & intercepted both of each others' moves, was great to watch. It really felt like a battle, and like each of them knew where the other was going for almost the entire matchup. It became more about are they capable of putting a stop to it before it happens. I LOVED that aspect of it.

Great match, and one I feel that I could watch many times over, and could notice new angles of. The crowd, the intensity, the psychology, and the actual wrestling were all top-notch. 


Here's some of what other people have to say:


> Bret Hart vs. Undertaker, One Night Only (9/20/97)
> I had heard a lot of hype about this for awhile and finally had the chance to see it when Undertaker’s DVD was released, and it surpassed my already high expectations. Overall, this match had more depth than their Summer Slam match, it’s a superior match. It had the same great psychology, with more back and forth action between the two, and was also quite lengthy. The execution and selling were both excellent. The crowd added to the enjoyment of this match as they were split between the 2 wrestlers and were very responsive from start to finish. This is arguably Undertaker’s finest match [_note: This was written in 2007_] and one of the finest WWF Championship matches. What a crime this was buried in WWE's archives for all these years and wasn't aired in the US.





> Bret Hart vs The Undertaker: WWF Championship
> Wow wow wow, What a match. This is one of the best Undertaker matches you will ever see, Bret does an amazing job here and shows why he deserves to be considered one of the greatest in ring performers of All Time.... Back in 1997 Undertaker wasn't considered a great worker, as a matter of fact, Other than a Gimmick matches I don't recall Undertaker having a truly great match up to this point. This is probably the best traditional Undertaker match you will see. I absolutely love this match and its a must see. If you wanna see why Bret Hart is considered The Greatest of All Time, Watch this match. RATING ****1/2





> Many consider this match the best in the epic Undertaker-Bret Hart saga, and I definitely do.
> 
> I hold their Summerslam match in high regards but despite this one’s finish it is almost perfection.
> 
> ...





> One of the dumbest finishes to one of the most tremendous matches you’ll ever see.
> As close as it comes to perfection.
> 
> This is one of those matches that you just can’t get enough of. Play by play couldn’t really tell the story for me here even though I usually go in-depth using that style when reviewing a match but as for this one at One Night Only, it’s suggested you watch it yourself rather then reading about what happened. So check it out, you’ll not regret it.
> ...





> The result was an amazing match, as both men were hellbent on sticking the card up Vince McMahon, and Shawn Michaels, ass. Taker even pulls off some moves he used in his previous persona, WCW’s Mean Mark Callous, that made my jaw drop. Watch for the heart punch. And make no mistake: this is the BEST Undertaker-Bret Hart match ever, and if it was given a proper finish, would have been an all-time classic. As it is, it is Bret Hart’s final WWF masterpiece.





> This is easily the best performance of the Undertaker's life [_note: Written in 2005_], for several reasons. The first of which is that he shows his ability to work holds, both doing them and having them done to him. There is a struggle for all of his offense, and he makes Bret struggle for all of his offense as well. The second reason is that he shows how great of a seller he can be when he chooses to be, and he tows the line far better than you'd expect, as he remembers his stature as a big guy without sacrificing the credibility of his opponent. Finally, he pulls it all together by staying consistent with his character -- he still does his trademark zombie sit ups and comebacks, but he doesn't stop selling while he's doing them, and they're far more believable and engaging as a result. Bret is the same great Bret Hart he almost always was, knowing the strengths and weaknesses of his opponent and crafting a match that caters to the style of the Undertaker.
> 
> Watching this match, it's fascinating how much Bret Hart has influenced the current style, but the more frustrating aspect of that is how some of the great spots have been overdone now. I can't count the number of WWE matches I've seen where the turnbuckle is exposed, or where someone goes crashing into the steel steps at ringside. Had those spots not been used to the point of overkill since, I probably would have enjoyed them more here. It was also slightly frustrating watching 'Taker show that while he's better than he often lets on, he's also very much a product of the WWF working style, as a large part of his comeback centers around choking and big, loose punches. That said, they both accomplished more within that style than almost anyone has, and this is the last classic match Bret Hart ever had in the promotion that was truly his for much of the 1990s.
> 
> ****1/4





> Detailed match review. I was going to say someting about this match after I watched it but I knew I'd be there for forever and a day trying to give it justice. This is a very interesting match and has a lot of stuff to talk about within it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





> This was a fantastic match. If the match would have ended on a clean pin, we would be talking a MOTY contender.





> These two had an awesome match and was the clear match of the night in this writer’s opinion.





> Tremendous match here. I’m a fan of their other matches, but this is definitely the best of the bunch. Awesome work from Undertaker when he changes his style to more of a “Bret Hart” style once the exposed turnbuckle puts Bret down, and great leg work from Bret as he tries to get back into the match. Plus I really loved the finish too.
> 
> Rating: ****1/2





> Given a pinfall or submission that’s a MOTYC, but it probably wouldn’t have mattered given the low exposure and Hell in a Cell a month later. ****1/2 It was also Bret’s last truly great match (not involving Chris Benoit), although he had some pretty good ones in WCW.





> Bret Hart Vs Undertaker (One Night Only) Man from the dark was made to limp, struggle, and so was our Hitman. The match didn’t really have much hype going into it, but what was produced was a showmanship of nihilistic valour. They matched each other step to step, dime to dime in a match where fortunes swung faster than a pendulum.







I'll have to check out that '92 match. I'd heard terrible things about one of their earlier matches, and had always assumed that that was the one. Did they have more than one back then? Well, I guess I'll find out!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> They had a good match at HIAC 2010, but they had an awful one last year on television. *I also thought their chairs match was a DUD, but the Cena apologists here see something in it.*


That's a bit much. C'mon now.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Well seeing what aspects you enjoy so much from their Rumble '96 match makes me pretty confident that you'll at least "like" their MSG match, Lil. The date is 1/31/92 by the way. It's completely all about Zombie Taker vs. underdog Bret and it's a total joy. Gave it **** personally but that's the highest rating I've ever seen. 

I do agree about the aggressive nature of the two in their ONO match, especially in the early and final minutes. That whip into the stairs by Taker was fucking intense. They just really lost me during the middle portions of it. I can attest it to being sick of seeing leg work. Taker's selling was fairly consistent though, I just don't know why he;s completely emotionless while being locked in a sharpshooter.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Part of his gimmick at the time, most likely. Didn't want to express much pain. He rarely did prior. Except vs Mankind, which is one aspect that put Foley over in a huge way back in '96.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Before I forget, Cody what did you think of Survivor Series 2012? After smitty brought it up and funnyfaces said there were *4* good matches, it peaked my curiosity. Then I looked up the blu ray and saw there's a RAW match between Cena & Punk on the extras. TELL ME MORE.


----------



## Dark Church (Jan 17, 2005)

The triple threat tag at HIAC was insanely good. **** and the best tag title match in a long time.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Dark Church said:


> The triple threat tag at HIAC was insanely good. **** and the *best tag title match in a long time*.


I've thought we've had two this year that were better.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Before I forget, Cody what did you think of Survivor Series 2012? After smitty brought it up and funnyfaces said there were *4* good matches, it peaked my curiosity. Then I looked up the blu ray and saw there's a RAW match between Cena & Punk on the extras. TELL ME MORE.


Team Foley vs Team Ziggler match was awful. Thanks to it being SO flat. Not even really worth it for the Dolph win. _(it kind of is, but shame the match had no heat behind it.)_ Divas was bleh, but that doesn't count.

K, bad stuff out of the way...

Main event was good. Probably the most underrated Punk match of 2012 thanks to it never getting mentioned. It was good. Unless you're like Yeah1993 & generally dislike Triple Threats, it isn't for you, but if you have no gripes with the gimmick, there isn't a way you wouldn't think it was at the very least good. Drama was there and they put over Punk losing as a possibilty the best they could. Debut of The Shield blowing the minds of everyone and all that jazz. Good match. One I thought was better than originally expecting.

Cesaro squashes R-Truth. Truth or not, it's got substance to it thanks to Cesaro being Cesaro.

Big Show vs Sheamus II is pretty much the weakest of the four in 2012. Yet still a great match. You can't go wrong there. The DQ finish was plausible and added to keep the feud alive, yada yada.

Opening "bonus" Elimination match is such a gem. It was worked super well. Made you feel there is hope to have these traditional matches remind you of the "older days" in where they're explosive, great showcases for most of the talent involved, and a whole mess of fun. So unusual to see WWE give all these lower card workers - minus Mysterio - the time of day to produce a bout like this. Wished it happened more often. Watch & watch again. I dig it a lot. Can say it's probably a clear cut MOTN. I only love Show vs Sheamus' slugfest to be held off on that. Put it pretty much remains. I'm just trying to put it over a lot, basically.

It's not a bad show. Much more good than bad on here. Which is puzzling as the build for this was SO lackluster & felt as if the company could give a damn about the staple PPV. Most put on their work boots to create a PPV that was effective in its entertainment. Would have been a really good one if the "main" elimination match actually delivered.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

John Cena sounds so 2005 in his promo from Monday :lol :cena2

Since tomorrow's pretty much my last day of classes for the week, I'm probably gonna watch a shit ton of matches. I like the idea of Punk's WWE title reign. Perhaps his PPV matches...


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I thought only my bro & I noticed how Cena was sounding Thuganomics-esque on Monday, haha.

*I wrote "could give a damn" in my last post. Ugh. Hate that. Not fussed to edit it for something pointless, but I just saw it and yeah. Had to mention it. Talk among yourselves.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Yeah now that you bring it up I remember Seabs plugging that opener in the MOTYC thread last year while no one else said anything about it.  Assuming that Punk vs. Cena from 11/12/12 is good as well, I may try to grab that blu ray sometime. Like I've said before, I'm a sucker for WWE blu rays and their damn extras...



PGSucks said:


> John Cena sounds so 2005 in his promo from Monday :lol :cena2
> 
> Since tomorrow's pretty much my last day of classes for the week, I'm probably gonna watch a shit ton of matches. I like the idea of Punk's WWE title reign. Perhaps his PPV matches...


Yeah what the hell was up with that? He went back to his gangster days and used a Boston accent. :lol


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm sure the Punker vs Cena match holds some merit. That's one of the extras you'd like to see on the sets. The SummerSlam 2013 Blu-ray extras made the purchase more worth it. As if it wasn't already. But the Danielson vs Wade matches are a lot of fun + it has the Miz TV segment with Danielson & Cena too. At least Blu-Ray has extras on it. DVDs don't and I find that to be awful. I remember when the older ones had near full Sunday Night Heat episodes on it.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Or full matches like Brock vs. Hogan on Summerslam 2002 or that old Andre/Killer Khan Stretcher Match on JD '03. One of the reasons why I love blu rays, along with the crystal clear picture quality. haha


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Picture still blows my mind. You can see _everything_...VIVIDLY. All I need in life is ultra enhanced picture with my wrestling.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Wwe shop has a sale on right now on various DVDs and blu rays ranging from $5-10. Curse that website for its absurd shipping rates

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

It probably says a lot about me as a person that I buy stuff from WWEShop with some regularity. :side:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

What do y'all think of Armageddon '05 as a whole? Iirc it was decent, other than Taker/Orton you had Benoit/Booker and MNM/Mexicools ruling.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Man, seeing that KOTR 02 review reminded me of how utter shite the event is. Not looking forward to re-watching it . My next 02 Ramble is Insurrextion 02, which the first of the shitty Undertaker/HHH 02 matches! Yey!


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

MNM vs. Mexicoolz? I'M ON THAT. Kash/Juice and Hardy/Jibbles sound great as well, but a twenty minute Booker T match sounds horrid, Benoit or not.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Picture still blows my mind. You can see _everything_...VIVIDLY. All I need in life is ultra enhanced picture with my wrestling.


I always get blown away when I go from watching matches on the YouTube app on my TV to putting in a Blu-Ray. I swear, you can see the individual drops of sweat on the wrestlers, it's like going into the land of Oz from Kansas.

Btw- I watched Jericho vs Trips LMS from Fully Loaded last night. That used to be my favorite Jericho match, then I went to thinking it's overrated, now it's back to being my favorite Jericho match in the WWE (still like some of his WCW stuff, especially FB97' with Eddie, better). Jericho's baby face selling in that match is just top notch. He never forgets about the ribs, and I love how all of Hunters big impact moves are based around rib work. He was selling his ribs so well that I actually cringed when Hunter put his knees up on that lionsault, that's when you know a guy is selling right. I'll have to rewatch Foley/Rocky Valentines Day Massacre again to be sure, but right now I feel this is my favorite of all the LMS matches. ****1/2


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Fell Asleep after I finished so I'm writing ups now

*Wade Barrett vs Daniel Bryan Series : Singles matches​**Summerslam 2011*
- Wow this match was awesome, seems like 2011 was a life time ago nowadays and its sad because I view that year with red roses ( is that the expression ? who cares you get it). So weird seeing Bryan look like this, as he barely has hair and just has a normal goatee, not even that long. :lmao Cole while burying him actually said a line along the lines of Bryan has trouble growing facial hair.

Anyways about the match, its awesome, there is a point in this match that it shifts gears and goes from good to fucking great. IMO Barrett's best match
*****+
*
*Saturday Morning Slam*
- I said I was going to watch all their major ( got substantial time) match and this is one soo dammit I will. This episode of the SNMS was actually pretty funny, it had ziggler/aj , team no ,and others going to the show to petition to be its GM, :lmao @ Ziggler and Kane on commentary, made it funny but Generic Josh Matthews brought the fun down. The match sucked but it was destine to , IDK if any of you guys watch this show, it so retarded, they cut the camera in the middle of the action every 5 seconds for some reason, something about Neck holds so something IDK, soo yea
***

*NO DQ sd 8/13*
-I didnt like this one and really didnt give it a *. Its not that its bad, just your run of the mill wwe DQ match, very ho hum
*N/A*


*Steel Cage 8/13*
- This was pretty good, and I remember really digging it live, simple structure : beat the shit out of each other, no label lock or any types of holds, just strikes and kicks the way I LOVE it, Worked very well
****3/4*


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Bryan/Barrett have great chemistry together, but then again doesn't Bryan have chemistry with everyone (except Orton seemingly). That doesn't mean I'm not fond of Barrett's in-ring ability, hence I'd be lying :side: Cena and Sheamus are Barrett's 2nd and 3rd best opponents, then idk.

I kinda wanna rewatch the AWESOME Bryan/Show No DQ match from last year now.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

In our never ending quest to find gems, I find one. Six criminally underrated workers wrestle a simple yet effective five minute six man and it's pretty great. It's The Mexicools' debut match and they go up against two jobbers and the CW Champ. The majority of the match consists of them bullying S2H who's the sacrificial lamb, using underhanded tactics and cutting off poor Scotty whenever he looks to build momentum. Funaki is pretty much irrelevant the whole match and the bulk of the contest focuses on Scotty getting the hot tag to London, which he eventually does and the champ gets a bit of time to shine before faling to the numbers game and dirty tactics. Extremely simple but very enjoyable, and a cringeworthy 450 at the end from The Juice which looks like it could have killed poor London. WATCH.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Isn't almost anything involving Paul London and Funaki a gem in its own right? 

For example, London had a 4 minute match with Kazarian on Velocity in 2004 that absolutely rules the fucking world. Everybody watch that.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I kinda' wish Paul London stuck around post Londrick. I think he would have done well on ECW in 2009/2010. Matches with Regal, Kozlov/Zeke, Christian, Helms, Tatsu and Swagger make me salivate slightly. Fuck. Swagger vs. London. FUCK. Paul really is an underrated cat by anybody who only really knows about the WWE. The man is a lunatic and deserves compliment after compliment just for almost killing himself every time he goes in the ring. The back bump on the arena floor that he takes in the NM 06 tag match makes me cringe horrifically.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

London vs Kazarian my STARS yes. Great match.

Mexicools too :mark: 

Too bad Kash was only around for a spell in WWE. Not even a full year. Ah nuts. Guess it's better than the length Kazarian was around haha.

Oh, and I have fun with Armageddon '05. Show is real easy to sit through. Worth it once the main event happens too. Don't remember Benoit vs Booker, but always knew I'd have to take a deep seat, b/c while most of the show are swift matches, that one goes an extended amount and it can feel like such. Only match I'm not 100% clear on. Which is odd seeing how the rest of the show is clear as day in my memory. I'm probably not a fan of it; that's why.


----------



## GOON (Jan 23, 2010)

Daniel Bryan and Wade Barrett's in-ring chemistry is pretty awesome, although I'd disagree with your rating for their No Disqualifications match. I found it to be rather fun and the wacky overbooking made it even better tbh. I think I had it rated at either ***1/4-***1/2, although I've only watched it once and that is when it first aired.

And yeah, Wade also has pretty good chemistry with the likes of John Cena and Sheamus as well. I find it funny that people claim that he's "bad" in the ring, seeing as there is much evidence to the contrary. He's not the GOAT obviously, but he's solid. It's a shame that he was de-pushed to the extent that he was, because he could have been a solid performer in the upper mid-card and even an occasional main evener. He would have been preferable over Randy Orton in the current storyline, if only so we could have had three more great encounters between him and Daniel Bryan.

Seeing as we've had projects of people reviewing the Pay Per Views from 2000, 2001, and 2002, I might take up a 2003 Pay Per View project in the coming days. I'll need to be informed of what the CAL SCALE is, though.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I don't find Wade to be bad in the ring - he's definitely solid. I just can't get behind him as a character. Nothing about him sticks out to me. It's kinda like ADR. He can obviously go in the ring, but I just don't give a shit about him as a character.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Danielson vs Barrett No DQ match is kind of a blast. Wouldn't object to seeing more matches like it on WWE TV. 

Wonder what Barrett will do upon a return. I hear the company likes him, yet has no idea how to book him. Sorry, but how does that compute? It's your job to book, isn't it? Way Orton is being booked in the main event picture, this could have easily been subbed out for Barrett; b/c while taking a backseat to Trips wouldn't be a full blown positive, it'll be easier to acknowledge with Barrett behind him _(as he could rise up the ranks in years to come via benefiting from holding the Championship in this scenario)_ & have Orton being a heel doing something else & without the need of feeling utterly irrelevant currently. Instead Orton is champ while it doesn't feel that way in the slightest & Barrett is MIA.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

He doesn't even have a character to begin with. In that aspect he's just... there. At least since the day the Nexus died.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

He had his "I do it for the money" crap. Which wasn't a character. 

Then the "Barrett Barrage". Which again, isn't a character, but it gave him a slogan and a reason to be pushed.

Injured.

Returns with the slogan in tact, but a new essence. Instead of acting like a sly, apparently affluent mentality Englishman, he's dipping into his pool of hard-nosed bare knuckle fighting. Complete with new finisher and all. Sort of a character. Basically only acting on what he did in the past that was always mentioned on commentary. They should have embraced it more. Like wanting to challenge fellow wrestlers to bare knuckle fights backstage or even during matches. Eventually that bit wore off and he started wearing his coat again and being without anything.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Where's Cal with all this Barrett talk, he's missing out.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Been waiting for him to pop up any time now. :hayley2


----------



## GOON (Jan 23, 2010)

I think the main thing that has hurt Barrett is that they took away his biggest strength, which is his mic work. I can't remember the last time they allowed him to cut an actual, serious promo in the ring since his Nexus days. Unlike Del Rio, you can give Barrett a substandard character and he'll still make it work because he's a very good talker. His promos during the Nexus angle were proof enough that he could play a great villain when given the opportunity. The problem is, however, that he hasn't been given this opportunity since his Nexus days.

Actually, I think the last time he was given a fair amount of time to cut a serious promo was in 2011 during Triple H's Vote of Confidence as COO.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

GOON The Legend said:


> Daniel Bryan and Wade Barrett's in-ring chemistry is pretty awesome, although I'd disagree with your rating for their No Disqualifications match. I found it to be rather fun and the wacky overbooking made it even better tbh. I think I had it rated at either ***1/4-***1/2, although I've only watched it once and that is when it first aired.


I was pretty drained when I watched the DQ so it may have affected my opinion abit, however I watched the steel cage right after and thought it was stellar

Wade is a odd situation. I see most of you would have liked it they went further into the "bare-knuckle, fight club" gimmick he had when he came back. See I disagree, that just seem so generic to me English guy -- rough brawler meh, and he grew a goatee which almost 90% of the roster has so once he came back he just became mister generic.

I would have preferred if they sticked with the clean-shaved slick back hair "barrett barrage" gimmick


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I still stand by my James Bond villain character for Del Rio. Have him progressive go full blown psycho once things don't go his way. Would be fabulous.

Wade cutting a promo. Sheesh. That is a while back. Not many are given that time in this day and age & it's too bad. You have to be at a certain level before they give you sufficient mic time. Which defeats the purpose. If you have the skills, let them build you up. Seems that only applies for Bray Wyatt these days.


----------



## GOON (Jan 23, 2010)

redskins25 said:


> I was pretty drained when watch the DQ so it may have affected my opionons abit, however I watched the steel cage right after and thought it was stellar
> 
> Wade is a odd situation. I see most of you would have liked it they went further into the "bare-knuckle, fight club" gimmick he had when he came back. See I disagree, that just seem so generic to me English guy -- rough brawler meh, and he grew a goatee which almost 90% of the roster has so once he came back he just became mister generic.
> 
> I would have preferred if they sticked with the clean-shaved slick back hair "barrett barrage" gimmick


I really dug their steel cage match as well. I think I have it around the same rating (***1/4-***1/2) as their no disqualifications match, although I can see how some might prefer their steel cage match over their no disqualifications match. I have both matches on my old computer and I'll probably give them a re-watch once I transfer them over to my new computer.

The "Barrett Barrage" gimmick probably would have allowed him to become the upper-midcard/occasional main-event talent that he has the potential of becoming. I've wondered what they had planned for him at that year's Wrestlemania, because it seemed they were pretty high on him at the time.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Rumor was MITB return so he can get the briefcase. Which is why I think the multi-person tag happened instead.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Wade Barrett sucks poo.

Insurrextion 02 is terrible so far.

The Cal Scale

NO = -1
DUD-* = 0
*1/4-** = 0.5
**1/4-**3/4 = 1
***-***1/4 = 2
***1/2 = 3
***3/4 = 4
**** = 5
****1/4 = 6
****1/2 = 7
****3/4 = 8
***** = 9

For the GOON that asked .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

There he is. :curry2


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I would have been here sooner but I was catching up on some CSI. Learning everything I can to cover up my eventual murder of Miz and Barrett 8*D.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Teach me so I can do away with the ones I hate. :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

4 matches in to Insurrextion 02... and it's MINUS ONE on the CAL SCALE :lmao. Main Event likely isn't going to add ANYTHING to it either :lmao. This might end up being one of the worst PPV's ever at this rate .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

RVD vs Eddie is bleh? 

I know I like the Hardys tag, so by near default that may be the MOTN. Nothing else popped out at me.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Unfortunately . RVD murders the match in cold blood, unfortunately. Watching the Hardy Boys tag now.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Wade has just been the victim of terrible booking. It's hard to stay over when they book him as a joke. He becomes the leader of a Nexus (gains heat from the crowd) but his momentum was destroyed afterwards. He wasn't that bad after Nexus because he wasn't jobbing a lot and was still winning matches against the likes of Sheamus and Orton but it just wasn't great. His 2012 return to present was crap though. They start the 'I'm open for business' line yet it gets ignored the following weeks. Then he won the IC champion and became the least credible IC champion of all time (how many matches did he win as a champion?) and they made it even worse when they announced the IC tournament then ignored it. They clearly had no plans for him. He hasn't even had good amount of mic time either. Only time he was getting decent amount of mic time was during his mini feud with Sheamus/Miz where he talking about his movie 'career'


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Hmm. Wonder if this is Cal not liking RVD or honest to goodness bad RVD. I have to find it.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Just looked at the Insurrextion 02 card, a few matches look like fun. Bradshaw/Pac, Spike/Regal and Eddie/RVD. Might check them out, especially the first two.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

If they ever do Hayley's idea and have ADR turn into a full blown Bond character heel, they could make some AWESOME vignettes for him.

Have him sitting in a leather arm chair in a fancy study with the shadows covering his face, all you can see the outline of his body and the cigarette he is smoking, which is in one of those long cigarette holders. He has a small Chihuahua on his lap that he is absentmindedly petting. Very neo-noir. He talks in a very soft but matter of fact way, about the amazing diabolical plot he has concocted to control the WWE universe. He really needs to work on his evil laugh, so when the promo ends and he's uttering his last "go home line", the camera can zoom on his face and you can finally see his features while he laughs maniacally.

God I put way too much thought into that, but damn that could be some good shit. He should take a look at the character Javier Bardem plays in Skyfall for his speech pattern, that guy was a psycho.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Ric Flair vs Ryback at Mania 30 thread. :kenny

I've been holding this in (I think. Can't remember). I like Barrett. I actually like him a lot. Not Pyro levels or anything, but I enjoy the guy. His injury before Mania last year ended up costing him a MITB win it sounds like, which is too bad. He was the only one from Nexus that in my eyes really stood a chance of being someone. 

So unfortunate that Slater is the one on TV every week, albeit as a true jobber. Even Otunga is getting air time again.

Oh, and don't start me on Ryberg/Skip Austin.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

He should just be Damien Moreau from Leverage. Del Rio looks like the guy who played him, and it would be a great heel character. Rich, cocky, arrogant and believes he can get away with anything because he's rich. Have him hire a bunch of GOONS to back him up and there we go.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> If they ever do Hayley's idea and have ADR turn into a full blown Bond character heel, they could make some AWESOME vignettes for him.
> 
> Have him sitting in a leather arm chair in a fancy study with the shadows covering his face, all you can see the outline of his body and the cigarette he is smoking, which is in one of those long cigarette holders. He has a small Chihuahua on his lap that he is absentmindedly petting. Very neo-noir. He talks in a very soft but matter of fact way, about the amazing diabolical plot he has concocted to control the WWE universe. He really needs to work on his evil laugh, so when the promo ends and he's uttering his last "go home line", the camera can zoom on his face and you can finally see his features while he laughs maniacally.
> 
> God I put way too much thought into that, but damn that could be some good shit.


Hahaha. Awesome. I probably wouldn't have him go so old school in terms of the character _(a la Blofeld)_, but I could get behind that too. Was feeling more like Silva or Sanchez - suave and psychotic. Where his outer appearance would look suitable for society, but inside he'd be everything that is wrong with the human race.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

https://twitter.com/TheMarkHenry/status/395989654647734272

Seems Mr. T puts on some weight.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

My stars he did the Rick Ross look. 

Absolutely AMAZING.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

The disturbing thing is that Rick Ross shows off his body a lot more than Mark Henry does. :jay


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I don't know what Rick Ross is, but Henry looks Mark BOSS.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The wannabe Mark Henry, Cal.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I hate him already. MARK HENRY > YOU, BITCH.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Dude, KIMBO Slice like a mother fucker


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT

I just saw far too much cleavage from Linda McMahon. Slut. No wonder Vince likes her.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

> TheMarkHenry ‏@TheMarkHenry 38m
> 
> Me as Rick Ross pic.twitter.com/iBENudP9Wr


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

:lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I was about to say halloween is overrated nowadays, but after seeing that :lmao I take it back


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

FluxCapacitor said:


>


This is incredible.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Halloween permits Mark Henry matches to be watched and discussed from here on out.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yea I got punk/henry's on deck tonight


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*sigh* Insurrextion main event time. Just looked up a review I already did for it. I was tempted to just C&P it because nobody would likely know .


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> Yea I got punk/henry's on deck tonight



Just watched their whole mini feud 3 days ago, absolutely superb stuff. HENRY:clap

Cal- YouTube "KIMBO Slice Street fight" videos and you will know what I'm talking about. Imagine a leaner more ripped Mark Henry actually fist fighting with dudes in the ghetto with thousands of dollars on the line to the winner. People would put up $20,000 to try and take him on and win in a bare knuckle fight. That was the Kimbo Slice phenomenon. In one video, he's fighting a guy every bit as big as him in someone's back yard with a satellite dish, and he straight breaks the dudes orbital bone with one of the meanest right hooks I've ever seen, dudes eye is almost falling out of his head. Scary.

What's you're guys vote for the 5 best HENRY matches? I want to watch some HENRY right now. Not including his tremendous series with Punk, as I've seen those maybe 5 times a piece by now.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Feel like I want to review a show just once with the CAL scale. Although I don't rely on star ratings these days. Bah. Perhaps I'll always always wonder.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*Woah. Gone for a week and there's a new thread. :lmao at that Henry picture...what a boss.

In response to Catcus in regards to Henry's "best" matches:
vs. Rey (SD 2006)
vs. Hardy (No Mercy 2008)
vs. Orton (Night of Champions 2011)
vs. Michaels (RAW 2003)
vs. Show (Vegeance 2011)

I also like his big man/little man matches with Bourne.*


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*Insurrextion 2002*

I remember nothing of this event. Except the Main Event. Which I wish I could forget.


*Eddie Guerrero Vs Rob Van Dam - WWF Intercontinental Championship Match*

Their BL match was great. Their ladder match on Raw later on is great. Not sure about their JD match, I'll get to that soon. But this? No idea. Hope it rocks though!

:lmao they do a spot where RVD tries for a leg sweep, but he COMPLETELY MISSES... and Eddie has some crazy delayed reaction and still "jumps" to avoid it... after RVD did it :lmao. Legit burst out laughing at that one. :lmao

Eddie works the neck of RVD in this one, as it was a NECK BREAKER on the IC title belt at Backlash that led to Eddie winning the belt. So smart for him to focus on it this time around. Plenty of brutal elbows to the back of the neck, and a sleep hold too that makes sense to use rather than to rest. RVD gets his foot on the ropes and the ref does a 5 count and Eddie is a complete cunt and only just let go before the bell was gonna get rung lol. Yeah, he could have retained his belt there, but Eddie wants to retain by BEATING RVD to prove he's better and he has the better FROG SPLASH too.

Just as Eddie is really working over the neck, RVD starts a comeback with those big kicks, so Eddie dropkicks the knee, see's RVD is hurting and goes right for it! Normally when someone switches up their focus in a match it sucks, but when there is a good reason, like here, I love it . Shows that Eddie will capitalise on ANYTHING if he finds an opening.

Aaaand RVD just killed the ENTIRE match by completely 100% no selling EVERYTHING to make a comeback. Not even so much as a shake of the leg. NOTHING. Eddie is fucked off and gets himself DQ'd. Don't blame him .

Ok, so th DQ was most likely because he realised that after everything he'd done to RVD, the guy still came back and was THIS close to taking the title.

:lmao at Eddie chasing the referee after he DQ's him.

Match isn't that good. RVD's lack of everything ruins it. Eddie was great though.

*Rating: **
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*Trish Stratus & Jacqueline Vs Molly Holly & Jazz*

NO.

*Rating: NO*
*CAL SCALE - -1*


*Bradshaw Vs X-Pac*

Guessing this is payback for the Backlash match when X-Pac helped Hall beat Bradshaw.

X-Pac should have totally worn the Kane match in his matches. Looked awesome on him lol.

:mark: DAMN at that first right hand Bradshaw connects with on X-Pac's face.

DAMN at X-Pac dishing out one hell of a beating to Bradshaw! Kicks to the leg to take him down, then he SMASHES his face repeatedly into an exposed turnbuckle and busts the big Texan open!

:mark: at Bradshaw's comeback. PUNCHES THE FUCK OUT OF X-PAC'S FACE. Again. SHOULDER BLOCK OFF THE ROPES~!

X-Pac nearly flies through the ropes after Bradshaw POWERS OUT of a pin. Awesome. FALL AWAY SLAM~!

Hall shows up even though X-Pac told him to stay backstage. Prevents Bradshaw from doing a powerbomb, then clocks Bradshaw with NUN CHUCKS and BRADSHAW KICKS OUT!!!

CLOTHESLINE FROM HELL! X-Pac ducks and Bradshaw keeps on going and decks Hall! X-Pac ends up getting the win in the end though.

This was pretty good. Bradshaw is awesome and beating people up, and X-Pac is good on offence + making Bradshaw bleed helped make him look like a credible threat to the big Texan.

*Rating: **1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 1*


UNDERTAKER INTERVIEW :mark:. Probably better than his match later tonight. *sigh*


*Steven Richards Vs Booker T - WWF Hardcore Championship Match*

:mark: Hardcore title match!

:lmao Booker T comes out and he looks CONFUSED AS FUCK during his entire entrance :lmao.

:lmao Richards hits an arm drag and celebrates like he won the match.

TRASH CAN LID TO THE BACK OF STEVEN'S HEAD :mark:. Makes one hell of a SICK sound .

:lmao GOAT bump from a trash can to the face from Richards.

:lmao at Booker throwing the trash can at Steven then kicking it... except he misses the trash can and just connects with a normal kick :lmao. Has Maffew uploaded this entire event as a Botchamania video yet? 

:lmao WHAT THE FUCK WAS THAT? Steven was in the ropes, Booker walks over to him... then somehow ends up going over the ropes but Richards put like, zero effort into doing... anything .

Why is there a fucking SLEEPER HOLD in my hardcore match? GTFO with that bollacks.

Urgh, Lawler spouting out random "English" phrases and words. Getting the meaning wrong half the time or just sounding like a twat 100% of the time.

Huh. This is unusual. I'M BORED DURING A HARDCORE MATCH. 

HOLY FUCK at Steven's superkick!

Book End and Booker T wins the hardcore title. :lmao then CRASH HOLLY shows up and wins it. :lmao then Booker hits a Scissors Kick while he's celebrating and wins it back. :lmao then Dreamer and Credible show up and attack him. Booker fights back and keeps the title this time. Then Jazz shows up with Steven again and they botch a table spot, have to re-do it, then Steven wins the belt back :lmao.

Well overall this blew giant chunks. Botches, dumb spots and a fucking SLEEPER HOLD DURING A GOD DAMN HARDCORE MATCH. Too much Booker T and not enough weapons. Got DULL during parts, and the stuff AFTER the match originally ends is more exciting.

*Rating: 1/4**
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*The Hardy Boys Vs Brock Lesnar & Shawn Stasiak*

THE FUCK IS STASIAK DOING IN THIS? How does he still have a job after his Invasion crap? :lmao

Stasiak is the original VIPER. THE VOICES ARE TALKING TO HIM.

:lmao Heyman basically tells him he's shit and says the plan for the match is for him to stay on the apron while Brock does everything. Turns out Heyman handpicked him to actually just STAY ON THE APRON :lmao.

LITA is unable to be on the show because he just had neck surgery after she broke it filming Dark fucking pile of shit Angel.

:lmao Stasiak runs down to the ring like a "special person" decides to start things off!

Lawler: "I DO WHAT THE VOICES IN MY PANTS TELL ME TO DO"... the fuck is wrong with you Jerry? What the fuck is wrong with this entire fucking show for that matter? 

Lesnar finally tags in and starts to FUCK SHIT UP in a good way. A very fucking good way :mark:.

:lmao Lesnar goes into the ring post, and Stasiak starts spazzing out as the voices tell him to TAG. So he does. And gets his arse kicked. Seriously, why was this guy kept around DURING the Invasion... never mind AFTER.

Stasiak gets pinned. LESNAR LOST! Just not by being pinned. Did they mention this as a loss for him? I only seem to recall them bringing up getting DQ'd against RVD at vengeance as his first "official" loss.

Lesnar kills everyone after the match including Stasiak. Match was fun mostly.

*Rating: *1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 0.5*


*Spike Dudley Vs William Regal - WWf European Championship Match*

SPIKE is the European champion. Yeah. No wonder they got rid of it :lmao.

"REGAL, YER MUM'S A LIZARD!" ahhhh, classic signs .

Regal Rules. Spends the first minute or so of the match just smashing his knee or boot into Spike's face.

Dropkick.

Dropkick.

Dropkick.

Dropkick.

Huh, when did this turn into a Chavo match? 8*D

Spike goes for the DUDLEY DOG, Regal pushes him off and poor Spikey hurts his lickle leg. AWWWWWWWW. I don't care.

Trainer comes down, cuts open Spike's boot because untying it seems like too much work. THE MATCH IS STILL OFFICIALLY GOING TOO BTW.

Spike is getting taken to the back and Regal grabs him and brings him back into the ring BECAUSE THE MATCH IS STILL FUCKING GOING. Ah well, we get Regal being all fucking BOSSY as he attacks it, and the English fans are LOVING REGAL FOR IT. :mark:

Powerbomb. And Regal picks him up after 2, claiming he isn't done. Spike rolls him up and wins. Fans BOO. Regal decks him with the Brass Knucks. Fans CHEER.

This was mostly ok, but the ankle injury crap lasts as long as the ring action and kinda kills the momentum.

*Rating: *1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 0.5*


*Steve Austin Vs The Big Show - Special Guest Referee Ric Flair*

Well actually Flair is referee #2. He's just gonna stand there and prevent the NWO from interfering. Show joined the NWO btw. This is before Flair's heel turn and alliance thingy with the NWO. Whole thing was a mess. NWO in WWE blew.

Reeeeeeeeaaaaalllllllyyyyyy slow start to this one. Stalling, then a bunch of collar and elbow tie ups with Show powering Austin into the corner, then slowly building up to Austin finally knocking Show down. It's ok I guess, but eh, don't feel the match needed as much stalling and shit at the start. Was like they were trying to force this to be something big and special when really it's Big Show Vs Austin with Show not the most motivated he's been and Burnout 2002 Austin too.

Jerry Lawler. Shut the FUCK up. Why do they have to do it every fucking time. LOLZ WE IN TEH ENGLUND LETS SAY RANDOMLY ENGLISH SHIT WITHOUT A FULL UNDERSTANDING OF THE CONTEXT OR THE FUCKING LANGUAGE. Annoying as shit and actually distracts from matches.

Austin works the legs a little, then Show uses his power and a big clothesline to take Austin down and from here it's pretty much all Big Show. With some hope spots by Austin, 90% of which are cut with a clothesline. Yawn.

Speaking of yawn... BEARHUG. Big Show has his hands locked in such a convincing way I honestly think Cena's STF looks better. Urgh.

Big comeback from Austin, Stunner, but the ref is dead. Flair goes for a count but the NWO show up so he buggers off after them. TEASING DAT HEEL TURN. That gets forgotten about like a month later anyway :lmao. Then he turns heel again later in the year.

KEVIN NASH!!! HOLY FUCK I THOUGHT HE WAS INJURED! I legit thought his "suspension" was a way to cover up his injury! He doesn't help in the slightest. 2 Stunners from Austin and he gets the win finally.

Match is... watchable, I guess. Kinda slow, kinda dull, but they did have a decent story thrown in there for the match... it just wasn't executed too well. Not the worst thing on this show but I'll never watch it again.

*Rating: **
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*The Undertaker Vs Triple H*

I wanna say NO and be done with it. But it's a PPV main event so I'm gonna watch it no matter what. No matter what. No matter what. No matter what. SOMEONE SHOOT ME. No matter what.

I've already reviewed this in the past. Can I just post that and be done? Please?

Fine. I'll watch it again. For you. You cunts.

Undertaker's punches are :mark:.

HHH's punches are SHIT.

"HHH JERKING THE UNDERTAKER OFF... THE TOP ROPE!" :lmao JR is at it again.

Stop it. STOP HOLDING THE GUY'S FUCKING HEAD BEFORE YOU PUNCH. IT LOOKS TERRIBLE. Best striker in the WWE Vs one of the worst.

Undertaker goes after the leg that put THE GAME out of action for 9 months. PUT HIM BACK ON THE SHELF, DEAD MAN!!!

Rope breaks and poor Undertaker looks to really hurt his back on it when it happens. Facing HHH in 2002 does not agree with him it seems.

Ahhh, a rest hold. The secret ingredient to making this match good no doubt!!!

Fuck me, HHH does not want to give up control of the match to Undertaker. Undertaker NEVER gets in any real full control. You can just imagine their conversation during the match...

Undertaker: Ok, time for me to get some heat.

HHH: BABYFACE SHINE!

Undertaker: Fine.

*2 minutes later*

Undertaker: Right, I should get some heat now.

HHH: BABYFACE SHINE!

Undertaker: Urgh, fine!

*2 minutes later"

Undertaker: Give me some fucking heat NOW.

HHH: I'M FUCKING STEPHANIE MCMAHON AND WILL RUN THE COMPANY SOON.

Undertaker: ...

HHH: BABYFACE SHINE!

This whole match is just a terrible, terrible mess. And I know I'm like, always biased when it comes to THE UNDERTAKER, but seriously, HHH is the MAJOR problem in this match. He never gives up control and never lets Undertaker get any heat, and his strikes are just god awful and he keeps fucking doing them. Oh and of course he WINS too.

HHH: Oh hey, Undertaker is getting the title at the next PPV. Can I pin him tonight? He's getting the title anyway .

He probably did the same in 01 with Austin at NWO. 

HHH: Austin gets to win the title at WM . Can I beat him the PPV before? PWEETTY PWEASE? Yey!

This match can fuck off. And so can this entire PPV. FUCK OFF.

*Rating: DUD*
*CAL SCALE - 0*



*Overall CAL SCALE - 0*​


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Bradshaw/X Pac sounds ace, gonna check it out now.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I'm down for anything with a HALL appearance.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yea the couple of times Ive cal scaled ppvs I feel like I shit on it and score it pretty low

scratch punk/henry (  I have seen it a couple of times so its not like I'm avoiding it) I think I going to watch vengeance 2011


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Undertaker vs Triple H...MY EYES. Undertaker deserves so much better than that nonsense. To make things worse, the company put it on PPV again following that travesty.

Randomly watching Over the Edge '98. It's a '98 PPV so that means if I did a Cal scale atm, it'll be shit until the main event. 8*D _(and yeah this show is dreadful so far)_


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Insurrextion is officially the worst PPV ever so far on THE CAL SCALE with WM 2 just barely ahead with 0.5 .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

oh my science at Rock vs Faarooq. THIS promotion was killing it in the world of wrestling? How is it possible?

I'm just glad Taka & Bradshaw vs Kaientai was good. Talented cats being awesome + Bradshaw killing little guys = :mark:


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

YES. Embrace the Hate-Watching. Insurrextion 2002 was complete CRAP...I was going to do it but thankfully Cal took one for the team. Against All Odd 2010 and Capitol Punishment 2011 reviews will be up soon though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

AAO 2010 was actually done. You're more man than me, headless ponch. One time is more than enough for that show.

Over the Edge just gave me the worst Kane & Vader match ever from their careers, so it isn't too far behind. Amazing how this show had the '98 MOTY on it with Austin vs Dude Love, yet all the rest of the abortion occurred.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> AAO 2010 was actually done. You're more man than me, headless ponch. One time is more than enough for that show.
> 
> Over the Edge just gave me the worst Kane & Vader match ever from their careers, so it isn't too far behind. Amazing how this show had the '98 MOTY on it with Austin vs Dude Love, yet all the rest of the abortion occurred.


The best matches Austin ever had, in my opinion, were OTE with Dude Love and SS01' vs Angle. Both matches are about as perfect as it gets. God I love that OTE match, Vince + The Stooges were just absolutely priceless during that entire thing. Plus you had big bad TAKER at ringside as Austin's enforcer, how does it get any better than that? Seeing Briscoe and Patterson eat those choke slams through the tables was just the best thing ever :lmao


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Wow why don't I remember A THING about Austin/Dude Love? I'm gonna need to find my recorded VHS of Over the Edge quickly.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> Wow why don't I remember A THING about Austin/Dude Love? I'm gonna need to find my recorded VHS of Over the Edge quickly.


Or just check my sig (think its there)


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I have sigs turned off so I may have to fix that.  Thanks.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Never seen foley/austin


----------



## ArnoldTricky (Jan 3, 2012)




----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

:mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Nice

@ The rep Cjack, Yea I listened to that the day it came out as I was still marking out from that 2k14 panel, excellent listen indeed. The guy could tell old stories for days, and has had the most interesting career and nobody comes close IMO, He literally has done it all, Bless the nature boy !wooooo. Have you listened to the Lawler one ? Is it any good


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

"That's Dude's teeth" :lol


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Is it just me or does Foley no sell the Stunner right after Vince is knocked out. He pops back up and gives Austin the Mandible Claw :lmao


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

You people and your not seeing OTE Austin Vs Foley. YOU PEOPLE MAKE ME FUCKING SICK.

As punishment I want you all to review Insurrextion 2002 as well. NOW. I AM A MOD DO AS I SAY!


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

All of those Del Rio character scenarios sounded pretty badass. Not sure why they can't pull the trigger on something like that.

All of this Wade Barrett talk makes me feel like watching matches of his for some reason... weird.



The Primer said:


> Danielson vs Barrett No DQ match is kind of a blast. Wouldn't object to seeing more matches like it on WWE TV.
> 
> Wonder what Barrett will do upon a return. I hear the company likes him, yet has no idea how to book him. Sorry, but how does that compute? It's your job to book, isn't it? Way Orton is being booked in the main event picture, this could have easily been subbed out for Barrett; b/c while taking a backseat to Trips wouldn't be a full blown positive, it'll be easier to acknowledge with Barrett behind him _(as he could rise up the ranks in years to come via benefiting from holding the Championship in this scenario)_ & have Orton being a heel doing something else & without the need of feeling utterly irrelevant currently. Instead Orton is champ while it doesn't feel that way in the slightest & Barrett is MIA.


I'm pretty shocked I'm saying this but I think that would've been a pretty wonderful idea. Not only would the matches most likely have been better, but Barrett would've actually _gained _something out of this whole endeavor. I can't really say the same for Orton thus far.



The Primer said:


> Feel like I want to review a show just once with the CAL scale. Although I don't rely on star ratings these days. Bah. Perhaps I'll always always wonder.


Tell me again why you scaled away from stars?



rjsbx1 said:


> YES. Embrace the Hate-Watching. Insurrextion 2002 was complete CRAP...I was going to do it but thankfully Cal took one for the team. Against All Odd 2010 and Capitol Punishment 2011 reviews will be up soon though.


Good luck with that shitstain AAO, but I never understand why people think so poorly of Capitol Punishment. It wasn't awful at all. In fact it had two very good matches in Orton/Christian and Punk/Rey plus I think some other watchable stuff for sure.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

IDK if I have just been listening to you guys too much and your opinions are rubbing off on me or I'm just becoming a :woolcock but I really found myself liking Cena' in-ring ablity alot lately. He really is great when motiviated, what has come of me ?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> IDK if I have just been listening to you guys too much and your opinions are rubbing off on me or I'm just becoming a :woolcock but I really found myself liking Cena' in-ring ablity alot lately. He really is great when motiviated, what has come of me ?



1st of all, shame on you, how have you NOT seen Foley/Austin OTE? If we were to say the "Attitude Era" began in January of 1998 and ended at WM17, then that match would be my pick for the best of that entire area. It almost flawless.

2nd of all, totally agree, I can listen to Naitch tell stories and talk about wrestling literally all day and never get tired of it. Dos Equis really shoulda just hired Flair to be their spokesman, because he is the true "most interesting man in the world", and no one else really comes close for me. Naitch is just Naitch.

3rd, well of course if you learn to put aside stereotypes and general public opinions, you are gonna see that Cena, when motivated, is one great worker. That doesn't excuse him for all the times he comes out flat and unmotivated, because the true GREATS don't have that problem. Really, if Cena is trying, he can have a good to great match with anyone, and that's a fact. The public perception of him as a guy that "can't wrestle" or sucks in the ring is misinformed at best, or outright biased and wrong at worst.


Edit- just watched Eddie vs JBL at JD2004 for like the 5th or 6th time in the past 3 months. This match is in my top 5 for goosebumps inducing moments, and might be my number 1 overall. When Eddie starts no-selling JBL's punches, and instead starts to do his dance around the ring covered in blood while JBL has that amazing look of shock/disbelief makes me :mark: :mark: HARD every time. I cannot believe 4 months ago I had never watched this match all the way through. It's probably my most shameful and disgraceful act as a wrestling fan. How I went through my life with Eddie as my favorite wrestler and never seeing that match all the way through is abhorrent.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Good LORD I am so taking advantage of this sale immediately. Time to buy a bunch of shit!

http://shop.wwe.com/DVD-Sale/dvds-s...Affiliate&utm_campaign=CJ&utm_content=3922536


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> 1st of all, shame on you, how have you NOT seen Foley/Austin OTE? If we were to say the "Attitude Era" began in January of 1998 and ended at WM17, then that match would be my pick for the best of that entire area. It almost flawless.
> 
> 2nd of all, totally agree, I can listen to Naitch tell stories and talk about wrestling literally all day and never get tired of it. Dos Equis really shoulda just hired Flair to be their spokesman, because he is the true "most interesting man in the world", and no one else really comes close for me. Naitch is just Naitch.
> 
> ...


First of all : your right  idk how I havent, I'm 15 mins in and its :mark:

Second of all: your right again, he truly is I was about to say that about the Dos Equis reference, NAITCH

3rd, Yea he can be pretty bad when unmotivated, but I truly was never apart of the "Cena sucks" gang tbhayley, I remember vividly marking hard back when he was feuding with Edge, forgot the year.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Too bad it costs 7 fucking dollars in shipping to buy from WWE.com, no idea why they cant just have 4 dollars like Amazon


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I miss DVD sales . FUCK YOU WWE, AND FUCK YOU FREMANTLE.

WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP* WE WANT SILVERVISION *CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP*


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Yeahhh, I was gonna make an order then I realized shipping would be the same price as one of the blu rays I wanted. I think I can wait another month for the Black Friday sales.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> First of all : your right  idk how I havent, I'm 15 mins in and its :mark:
> 
> Second of all: your right again, he truly is I was about to say that about the Dos Equis reference, NAITCH
> 
> 3rd, Yea he can be pretty bad when unmotivated, but I truly was never apart of the "Cena sucks" gang tbhayley, I remember vividly marking hard back when he was feuding with Edge, forgot the year.


Thoughts on the match?

I've got a great question, why the hell hasn't WWE given JBL the 3 disc documentary + matches treatment? This guy is in my opinion one of the 5 greatest heels ever, he has a bunch of awesome matches on his resume, and he was 1/2 of one of the more entertaining/badass tag teamss ever, the Acolytes/APA. Give this man his due. For what it's worth, in my opinion (which ain't worth shit but whatever), JBL>>>HHH as a heel. He was truly one of the best.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

*@Cactus Jack* Eddie vs JBL @ Judgement Day is a top ten match in company history IMO. Absolutely phenomenal.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Personally, If I am buying DVD's I either go to some movie store like FYE or use Amazon, I personally have never had trouble with Amazon purchases.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Wtf is the last page not working for? 

Think I'll watch Royal Rumble 97 tonight to continue the AE project.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/gener...h-show-discussion-thread-17.html#post22104353

BEST MARK HENRY MATCHES. READ & ENJOY.

Watched a few Punk matches today (SS Vs Del Rio, RAW Vs Del Rio, RAW Vs Ziggler, W/Orton Vs Miz/Del Rio) from November/December 2011 and I have to say that Punk was killing it every week back then, maybe on a higher level than 2013 Bryan. Then he had the 3 Way Triple Threat TLC and holy smokes CM Punk looks like fucking God.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

I'm torn... I really want to add a few more DVDs to my collection and WWESHOP has a good sale going on right now where you can get a bunch of DVDs for $5-10 each. 

- Mick Foley Greatest Hits and Misses
- CM Punk Best in the World
- Wrestling's High Flyers
- Shawn Michaels Heartbreak and Triumph
- The Rock Most Electrifying Man in Sports Entertainment
- Ladder Match 2 Crash and Burn
- Greatest Cage Matches of All Time

Are all in my shopping cart including a retro Macho Man t-shirt, but the total comes to nearly $80 with shipping which is a whopping $18

Should I do it?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Alim said:


> I'm torn... I really want to add a few more DVDs to my collection and WWESHOP has a good sale going on right now where you can get a bunch of DVDs for $5-10 each.
> 
> - Mick Foley Greatest Hits and Misses
> - CM Punk Best in the World
> ...


- Mick Foley Greatest Hits and Misses - Hardcore Edition? The normal 2 disc edition is boss too so yeah.
- CM Punk Best in the World - Bluray? If not. Get Bluray. Don't have a Bluray player? Get a Bluray player. The Bluray extras are needed. They are awesome. Almost like, a full hour of extra documentary footage, plus you know, matches in HD.
- Wrestling's High Flyers - Meh, some good stuff on there, go for it if the match listing appeals to you.
- Shawn Michaels Heartbreak and Triumph - Yeah
- The Rock Most Electrifying Man in Sports Entertainment - :lmao
- Ladder Match 2 Crash and Burn - Bluray? If not... that's ok too. But Bluray is better.
- Greatest Cage Matches of All Time - Nah, match selection is kinda shitty if I is remembering right.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

I have a PS3 to play blu rays on but not all the sets I want have the blu ray version on sale. The only blu ray that is available that I actually want is ladder match 2.

Foley's Hits and Misses is hardcore edition. That alone makes me really want to pull the trigger because I've never seen that set for under 20 bucks around here. 

CM Punk BITW blu ray isn't on sale unfortunately


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well wait for it to go on sale before you get it . Get the rest.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Cage match DVD has a bunch of stuff I've never seen before, but it doesn't have the HHH/Flair classic

I only want to get The Rock's DVD because he's The Rock even though I've seen the majority of the stuff on there


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Alim said:


> Cage match DVD has a bunch of stuff I've never seen before, but it doesn't have the HHH/Flair classic
> 
> I only want to get The Rock's DVD because he's The Rock even though I've seen the majority of the stuff on there


 The Epic Journey of Dwayne Johnson is better than the Rock DVD in your shopping cart.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Oliver-94 said:


> The Epic Journey of Dwayne Johnson is better than the Rock DVD in your shopping cart.


The match listing is better on the other one but the one you say has a doc and is in blu ray... decisions decisions


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Rest assured; the "Electrifying" DVD has MUCH better fucking matches, including Backlash against HHH :mark: :mark: :mark:.

The Epic Journey of Dwayne Johnson is pretty shitty, TBH.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Wtf is the last page not working for?
> 
> Think I'll watch Royal Rumble 97 tonight to continue the AE project.


(Y) That Rumble match was pretty fun, from what I remember. Basically is the genisis of the Austin/Bret feud, and IIRC, it had some fun stuff involving some miscellaneous characters.

I also didn't realize that Fake Diesel was fake when I recently ff'ed through it. :lol




Jack Evans 187 said:


> Well seeing what aspects you enjoy so much from their Rumble '96 match makes me pretty confident that you'll at least "like" their MSG match, Lil. The date is 1/31/92 by the way. It's completely all about Zombie Taker vs. underdog Bret and it's a total joy. Gave it **** personally but that's the highest rating I've ever seen.


I will check this out tomorrow!


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Alim said:


> The match listing is better on the other one but the one you say has a doc and is in blu ray... decisions decisions


 There is also those Hollywood Rock concerts on the DVD I recommended :mark:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

FluxCapacitor said:


> *@Cactus Jack* Eddie vs JBL @ Judgement Day is a top ten match in company history IMO. Absolutely phenomenal.



Totally agree. I had an accident with a circular saw when I was younger and I lost a ton of blood and had to be rushed to the hospital. Knowing that Eddie almost died in that match made me queasy for a while, and I couldn't get passed the part where a fountain of blood shoots out of his head the first time I watched it, so I never really tried again. Fast-foreword 8 years and I joined this forum and saw Hayely pimping it as an all time great match, so I sat down and tried to watch it again. To say I was blown away would be an absolute understatement. Eddies baby face performance will go down in the pantheon of the all time greats, and JBL was in top form as a heel, to say the least. It's one of my 5 favorite matches ever now, and I agree, one of the 10 best matches in company history. It's a perfectly executed story. Tazz at one point references it being a work of art when he's on commentary when their is a camera shot of all the blood on the ring, he says something to the effect of "that's Eddie and JBLs artwork on the canvas". 

Am I just a biased Eddie fan, or does Latino Heat have five matches that could be worthy of 5-stars?

1. Vs Rey HH97'
2. Vs JBL JD2004
3. Vs Benoit BoSJ96'
4. Vs Rey SD 6/23/05
5. w/ Art Barr vs Octogon & El Hijo del Santo

+ that masterpiece with Brock at NWO2004.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Don't think that tag match is ANYWHERE NEAR *****. Like, at all. It's decent and nothing more imo.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

Mick Foley's Greatest Hits And Misses is a MUST buy. Essential purchase for any wrestling fan.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> 3. Vs Benoit BoSJ96'


Is this the one that ends with a brainbuster from the top rope? If so, I have to say I was disappointed watching it the other day. And the reason was believe it or not, Benoit. He kept going for that damn sleeper numerous times and it slowed down the pace several times. The finishing sequence was incredible, though. (Y)


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Don't think that tag match is ANYWHERE NEAR *****. Like, at all. It's decent and nothing more imo.



I would agree with you 1000%, there is no psychology and just tons and tons of botches. The ref screwed that match up, it just seemed like a free for all fuck fest, I give that match *** personally. I have just seen it given 5-stars by a ton of people so I put it on there.


C2D- that's the one, and that's why I loved that match. They work the entire match around the sleeper hold, I thought it was genius. They beat the absolute SHIT out of each other. That's the old Buddy Rogers style, grab a hold, work high spots around it, grab a hold again. If done right, it can lead to the drama building and building. If done wrong it can become dull and annoying. I guess it's up to everyone to form their opinion on whether it was done right here or not.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> C2D- that's the one, and that's why I loved that match. They work the entire match around the sleeper hold, I thought it was genius. They beat the absolute SHIT out of each other. That's the old Buddy Rogers style, grab a hold, work high spots around it, grab a hold again. If done right, it can lead to the drama building and building. If done wrong it can become dull and annoying. I guess it's up to everyone to form their opinion on whether it was done right here or not.


I still enjoyed it but it simply wasn't what it was described to be. I heard some say it's a candidate for Benoit's greatest match ever in his entire career, and that it was not. I guess that's why I'm not feeling it as much as others since I'm not much of an old school guy when it comes to wrestling styles. Working matches around headlocks just don't do much for me which is why I'm not crazy about Flair's old matches either. Maybe it can grow on me so I'm not automatically dismissing it all.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> I still enjoyed it but it simply wasn't what it was described to be. I heard some say it's a candidate for Benoit's greatest match ever in his entire career, and that it was not. I guess that's why I'm not feeling it as much as others since I'm not much of an old school guy when it comes to wrestling styles. Working matches around headlocks just don't do much for me which is why I'm not crazy about Flair's old matches either. Maybe it can grow on me so I'm not automatically dismissing it all.



Eh, everyone has their preferences I suppose, it's right up there with Vengeance 03' vs Eddie, the Pillman Tribute Show vs Regal and the WM20 Triple Threat as my favorite Benoit matches. Also a huge huge fan of Benoits work with Finlay, the Slamboree, Smackdown, and Judgement Day matches are all terrific. Love the Stone Cold SD match too. I can't say which one I like best, but they are all in contention as my favorites.

Ah, forgot. Ladder match with Jericho probably would be right near the top.


Benoit has so many matches that warrant a minimum of ****, it's hard to choose a favorite. He's the best worker ever, what are ya gonna do?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Benoit's WWE title matches on SD against Austin and against Lesnar are some of my favorite TV matches ever. DAT NOSTALGIA.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Benoit has so many matches that warrant a minimum of ****, it's hard to choose a favorite. He's the best worker ever, what are ya gonna do?


Damn right. If I would ever become a wrestler, I think my entire style would be a carbon-copy of his, including all the moves. Watching his matches simply never gets tiring.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Speaking of Vengeance '03, gave the Eddie vs Benoit match a whirl to see why I wasn't so keen on it. It's so blah. I have a better formulated opinion (with words) after I watched it, but didn't say anything about it a few days ago. Everything remains how I originally felt: the opening chain wrestling bit is good - things become a I don't care about it signature move fest in the long middle - and once Eddie gets the shenanigans in tow I like it again. Don't like the Rhyno heel turn either. That's...wtf level. Can't even remember Benoit & Rhyno having that issue resolved or why it happened in the first place. Ok match for me. Should have been better with those two.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Watched two matches today

Zig Zag Paddy Swagg vs Air Boom vengeance 11
- Holy shit this is great, fucking awesome and one of the best tag match Ive ever seen. Soo underrated, a nice blend of wrestling styles clashed in this one. Ziggler wearing a singlet :mark: ( Why did he do that btw ? it was during the I am perfection day too) and Swagger showcased their wrestling abilities well, while air boom showed off with the high spots. This match is just great and I wished was a bit longer. For those saying the rhodes/shield match were the best tag match in the past 4-5 yrs have clearly not seen this and need to ASAP


Foely/Austin over the edge 98
- Just a very smartly worked AE brawl, not much more I can add as most of you have already seen it and love it. My eyes were glued the whole time and enjoyed this alot. TBHayley Stone Cold brawling + MICK FOLEY WRESTLING GOD = great match. I have a question for those saying its MOTY of 98 and the best AE match, is it a testament to the match being fucking epic or AE having not been that stellar in the match wise department ?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Oh yeah. The matches that were actually worth seeing in say 1998 - or a large portion of the late 90's Attitude Era - were few and far between. Austin vs Foley not only being watchable, but just about perfect was a total joy. They could have put in half the effort and still stolen the show. Instead the both have a career match with a crowd that was hanging on every moment they saw. Undertaker was bossy in it too and all he did was stand around for twenty minutes until the chokeslams happened. :mark:

I'm with you on the Vengeance 2011 tag team championship match btw. Find it to be terrific.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Speaking of Vengeance '03, gave the Eddie vs Benoit match a whirl to see why I wasn't so keen on it. It's so blah. I have a better formulated opinion (with words) after I watched it, but didn't say anything about it a few days ago. Everything remains how I originally felt: the opening chain wrestling bit is good - things become a I don't care about it signature move fest in the long middle - and once Eddie gets the shenanigans in tow I like it again. Don't like the Rhyno heel turn either. That's...wtf level. Can't even remember Benoit & Rhyno having that issue resolved or why it happened in the first place. Ok match for me. Should have been better with those two.



I never really concerned myself with the purpose of the Rhyno shens, Eddies reaction to it was pure gold and him winning that match the way he did essentially springboarded him into contention as a top baby face. 

Agree to disagree I suppose, I'll ride or die with that match, I think it's absolutely fantastic.

And skins- that's a subjective question. I'm sure there are plenty of people that loved all the wild brawls and screw finishes of the attitude era. As a rule, I'm generally not one of them. Although I feel I need to point out that what Mick Foley did in his matches back then could be categorized as typical of the AE to some. I don't agree with that, Micks matches were so much smarter and almost always had a story behind them. He had a rhyme and reason for what he was doing.

There are maybe 10-15 notable really really good matches from the AE. But for the most part I don't consider myself a fan of the in ring product back then. The RA era of 2002-2007 is my favorite, with today's, New Gen, and Golden Age following in some order after.

Oh, guess I didn't answer your question really. That Foley/Austin match really is just that damn good. It would be near the top for me for any era. But no, there isn't a laundry list of classic matches from the AE, atleast in my estimation.

All due respect to Taker, Austin, Rocky, Trips, etc. Mick Foleys stuff was easily the best part of the AE for me. I don't think that's just my massive Foley bias speaking either. He really was the best.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Foley was kind of the most consistent guy in the Attitude Era when you look at it. If not Undertaker or Austin. In regards to 1997, 1998, & 1999.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Vengeance 2011 was really good. Except for the Punk/HHH vs. Awesome Truth match. The GOAT tried to carry three very bad workers to a good match, but his valiant effort only led him to look like a fool by eating the pin. I wouldn't call it a bad match (***1/2*), but it's Punk's second worst PPV match in the past two years.

EDIT: Foley was the MVP in-ring in 1998, and surprisingly enough, I thought The Rock had a very good in-ring 1999 (comparatively very good of course). Horrible time period for good wrestling. WCW was where it was for in-ring work in 1998 (GOAT midcard), and in 1999, WCW had a very good tag team division.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Rhyno's heel turn was explained on Smackdown on that week. He appeared on the titantron after Benoit beat Doink the Clown (played by Nick Dinsmore aka Eugene) and said that he turned because he was tired of being in Benoit's shadow. A basic explanation with very little teasing preceding it other than a few accidental bumps.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Gosh WCW in those years was actually AWESOME. It took a dip in the late '99 area, with some constants keeping the curve up, but so much of 1997, 1998, & 1999 tore it up.

Somehow I figured that's what Rhyno's reason was. Yawn. Stupid. Didn't even go anywhere. Whatever on that plot, WWE.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Gosh WCW in those years was actually AWESOME. It took a dip in the late '99 area, with some constants keeping the curve up, but so much of 1997, 1998, & 1999 tore it up.
> 
> Somehow I figured that's what Rhyno's reason was. Yawn. Stupid. Didn't even go anywhere. Whatever on that plot, WWE.


It did result in I *think* a very good Rhyno vs Benoit match on SD. Haven't seen it in ages but I remember it being very solid.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

More irked by letting the bottom fall out for Rhyno. He turned heel, then got nothing out of it. Makes you ask what the point of it was. Do love that four way from SummerSlam 2003. Didn't need him to go heel for it, but no bother. Great match.


----------



## jacobdaniel (Jun 20, 2011)

Don't know if anything's been posted about this or not, but check this out:






Coming out on November 19th. Supposed to be a 2 hour documentary plus a lot moments and at least 10 matches. Should be interesting IMO.


----------



## Paul Rudd (Oct 23, 2010)

Currently watching the new MITB DVD. Miz's hosting is so awful and forced; it's really bringing down the whole DVD imo.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Giving the Hogan/Warrior WM VI match a watch. Going to follow that up with Savage/Warrior WM VII. Despite the praise for WM VII, I thought it was decent but not extremely orgasmic due to Mr. Warrior Warrior bogging down the match whenever he was in control.


----------



## jomo17 (Apr 2, 2012)

So i'm still getting on my project of watching '97 onwards, and hit a brick wall, in the shape of OTE '99. Now obvisouly I know why it never got released, but damn is it gonna piss me off if I don't get hold of a copy. Anyone know where I can procure one?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

jomo17 said:


> So i'm still getting on my project of watching '97 onwards, and hit a brick wall, in the shape of OTE '99. Now obvisouly I know why it never got released, but damn is it gonna piss me off if I don't get hold of a copy. Anyone know where I can procure one?


Well you can watch it online:

P1 - https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x14cho0_wwf-over-the-edge-1999-part-1_sport?search_algo=2
P2 - https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x14cjjx#user_search=1
P3 - https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x14cl0b_wwf-over-the-edge-1999-part-3_sport
P4 - https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x14cmm2_wwf-over-the-edge-1999-part-4_sport


----------



## jomo17 (Apr 2, 2012)

Callamus said:


> Well you can watch it online:
> 
> P1 - https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x14cho0_wwf-over-the-edge-1999-part-1_sport?search_algo=2
> P2 - https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x14cjjx#user_search=1
> ...


Wanted a bootleg copy on DVD if I could, just to say I own all the PPV's from that time frame. Thought this may be the place to ask as mu burning skills are non-existent xD

Cheers anyway though!


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> Wtf is the last page not working for?
> 
> Think I'll watch Royal Rumble 97 tonight to continue the AE project.


Good luck with that. Pretty mediocre ppv with a god awful Lucha match. 



Alim said:


> I'm torn... I really want to add a few more DVDs to my collection and WWESHOP has a good sale going on right now where you can get a bunch of DVDs for $5-10 each.
> 
> - Mick Foley Greatest Hits and Misses
> - CM Punk Best in the World
> ...


The majority of those are pretty great choices, even the first Rock set. The only one I'd consider dropping may be the Cage set, simply because the match listing doesn't look _as_ good it could've, but that's your call. Everything else is excellent and PLEASE make sure you get Wrestling's Highest Flyers.



SpookshowTony said:


> Giving the Hogan/Warrior WM VI match a watch. Going to follow that up with Savage/Warrior WM VII. Despite the praise for WM VII, I thought it was decent but not extremely orgasmic due to Mr. Warrior Warrior bogging down the match whenever he was in control.


Hogan/Warrior - **** 1/2
Savage/Warrior - **** 1/4

I love both of them immensely.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

1997 RR is mediocre and crappy as hell, but there are still SEVEN RR events alone I would place below it lol! And the 97 RR only gets FIVE on the CAL SCALE! We've had some really, really bad RR events... most of them have happened in the last 5 years :lmao. And yet I still look more forward to that event every year than any other .

:mark: PHENOM edition of WWE 2K14 arrived about half an hour ago. Just recorded an unboxing video .

Also started NWO 02 for my 2002 PPV Rambles. Already ahead of Insurrextion 02 and I've only watched 1 match :lmao.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Callamus said:


> :mark: PHENOM edition of WWE 2K14 arrived about half an hour ago. Just recorded an unboxing video .


You could make a video review of WWE 2K14 once you've had it for a bit. I'm on the fence about getting the game myself and I know others are.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I plan on reviewing it at some point, but for now I'll likely just do a first impressions video.

And it ISN'T -1 ya half wit . It's CAL SCALE - 1. If it was MINUS 1 it would be CAL SCALE - -1 . LEARN TO READ .


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Yeah, I edited that part out of my post when I read it properly. :lol


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I did find it funny that out of all the things wrong with that HORRIBLE disgrace of a PPV... you simply pointed out a potentially wrong CAL SCALE rating :lmao.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Well I've never seen that PPV before so I can't comment on it. I do enjoy reading your PPV reviews though because they're nearly always funny, especially when a match gets a NO rating and it's nearly always a divas match. :lol


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

NEARLY always funny? NEARLY? Well that just hurts .


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

8*D

So have you got anymore ''top 5 reasons why I hate'' videos planned Cal?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Nope! I don't JUST want to do negative videos and top 5/list videos so I'll be staying away from those for a little while. Uploading my unboxing video for WWE 2K14 PHENOM edition, and I'm editing together a video on my wrestling DVD & Bluray collection just now. After that it'll be Weekly Wrestling Roundup Episode 91 (nearly 100 eps :mark: ) on Monday hopefully, and then a WWE 2K14 first impressions video at some point next week too.

And MOAR 2002 PPV Rambles too. Should get NWO 02 done today hopefully.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

NWO 02 was as heartbreakingly dissapointing as Cal hating on Barrett imo


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Since there was some WWE2k14 talk,

Hey CAL, remember this video game gem?







:lol Those Warzone rants are classic


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Eddie vs Angle from Smackdown 6/05 is MONEY. Easily the best match they ever had, although that's not saying much as SS was trash and WM, while still good, was disappointing. Love the story telling bit in the end that leads to the heat turning up in the Rey/Eddie rivalry. The crowd was hot, and these two had some sick false finishes. ****1/4


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Which is the 05 one? I love their 2 out of 3 falls match... is that from 04? Or is that the 05 one? Either way that's the best Angle/Eddie match of the bunch for me.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Man I'm watching Punk-Ziggler from the Rumble in 2012 and I'm just realizing now how epic Punk's burial of Ziggler is. Literally the last 6-7 minutes of the match is Punk defeating Ziggler numerous times with Ziggler looking like the biggest chump in the universe. He gets like one big move the entire match and Punk just SQUASHES the motherfucker. I need to find more PUNK burials as this one was fucking awesome. 

*****


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Man I'm watching Punk-Ziggler from the Rumble in 2012 and I'm just realizing now how epic Punk's burial of Ziggler is. Literally the last 6-7 minutes of the match is Punk defeating Ziggler numerous times with Ziggler looking like the biggest chump in the universe. He gets like one big move the entire match and Punk just SQUASHES the motherfucker. I need to find more PUNK burials as this one was fucking awesome.
> 
> *****


I felt so fucking conflicted during that match because I love punk (2nd current fav) and we all know my thoughts on Ziggler, :lol I remember being like " Ok... should I be ok with this" "


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Ziggler needs to avoid matches at the RR unless its the actual Rumble. He doesn't have much luck otherwise... especially with title matches :lmao. For a "showoff" who wants to steal the show every night, he sure had mediocre matches 2 years in a roll at the RR. The Edge match I can understand... it's against Edge. But Punk? Shame on them both tbh lol.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Am i the only one excited to see tonight''s SD Tag match main event?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Nope . Which reminds me, I should go download it .


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Callamus said:


> Ziggler needs to avoid matches at the RR unless its the actual Rumble. He doesn't have much luck otherwise... especially with title matches :lmao. For a "showoff" who wants to steal the show every night, he sure had mediocre matches 2 years in a roll at the RR. The Edge match I can understand... it's against Edge. But Punk? Shame on them both tbh lol.


Agreed, didnt he get eliminated by Khrama in one rumble match too fpalm

Yea that punk/ziggler match is rather flat, disappointing because of the talent involved. At least they gave ups the TV MOTY two months earlier and a decent raw 1/2 match


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

I rewatched today the Team Demolition vs Team Powers of Pain from Survivour Series 1988. ****1/2 for tha one, one of the best Survivour Series matches that I have seen 42 minutes of non-stop action and an amazing face turn at the end.

The main event from the same SS gets a *** from me


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Edge/Ziggler RR 2011 was great...


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

I was disappointed by the two previous Punk/Ziggler matches, so their RR match wasn't a shock at all.
Who came up with Ziggler challenging for gold at that point anyway ?
How many people really thought Ziggler would win either title match ?

I liked his match with Edge a bit more cause at least they finally picked it up towards the end.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Edge/Ziggler was a hobo's HBK/Orton SVS 07. Hobo's you say? It's the level below Poor Man's. That's how shite it was. I as immensely disappointed with how they handled the stipulation of Edge not being able to use the Spear.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

nah edge/ziggler was kinda weak, just flat mostly Edge is fault though

You didnt like any Punk/ziggler matches ? Thought the raw ones were pretty good. At one point I thought there was a chance but it was probably the mark in me


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

My fucking lord....has anyone here seen the Tag Ladder match from Armageddon 2006??? Joey Mercury's face EXPLODES when he gets that ladder shot, blood shoots out everywhere and his nose is like non existent when they show a camera shot of him right before he goes to the back. I've never seen a legit FOUNTAIN of blood like that other than JD04'. Sooooo nasty when you know it's 100% legit and not a blade job. I wonder how badly he was fucked up, within seconds both of his eyes were swollen shut and his nose was like gone.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah, that match is great, but that spot is nasty. Fairly sure they did away with the teeter totter spot after that. Also, I think that was why his career ended - he got addicted to pain killers after that iirc.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Armageddon 06 is pretty :mark:.



Spoiler: Armageddon 06 stuff



*Kane Vs MVP - Inferno Match - Armageddon December 17th 2006*

Yeah, can't say I am expecting this to be good. I believe I mentioned before that you would have to have a Eugene IQ to expect greatness from this .

The match starts, and MVP begs for Kane to not kill him. Surprisingly... it doesn't work .

Looking back, I really think that putting MVP in this type of match so soon into his SD and WWE run (debuted in October) showed that WWE had confidence in the guy and expected him to be a big player in the future as well perhaps. I still think he could be if they gave him a real chance.

Kane is having fun, beating up MVP and getting ready to set him on fire. MVP on the other hand is fighting for survival, but it isn't working for the most part.

:lmao at one of the sides going out, followed by another one right after they get it lit again.

:lmao at MVP almost landing on the turnbuckle padding that Kane took off and set on fire. Match could have ended right there! Also, holy shit at how close MVP came to the fire AGAIN when he was trying to baseball slide Kane into it, and Kane moved. How he stopped himself I will never know.

Oh hey... one of the sides has gone out. AGAIN. Can WWE do nothing right?!?!?! 

Why is that that all inferno matches HAVE to go outside the ring for someone to get set on fire? Can they not figure out a way for someone to get set on fire IN the ring?

Its not too long after going to the outside that MVP's back is set on fire, and this one is over.

Its not great, but given the circumstances (FIRE~!) its probably one of the better ones (better. Out of 4. 4 matches with FIRE~!). I was entertained by it .

And completely random(ish)... I love Kane's theme by Finger Eleven.

*Rating: ***


*Brian Kendrick & Paul London Vs William Regal & Dave Taylor Vs MNM Vs The Hardy Boys - Tag Team Title Ladder Match - Armageddon December 17th 2006*

Another one of those "I hate it but I love it" matches. I hate it because I wanted to see Londrick Vs Team England, but I love it because its one of the better ladder matches. Grrrr!!!

Until I watched all of SD 06, I actually thought this match was where MNM returned, but it turns out they were back before this, and they had a nice little match with Londrick .

Ok, time to get down to business. This is spots. SPOTS~! and plenty of them. And when it comes down to it, its probably the BEST pure SPOTS~! ladder match. Its even better than the SPOTS~! TLC matches. I'd only put a handful of Ladder/TLC matches above this one, and that's because those ones are more than just spots.

There really is just so much greatness here. From little things like Londrick and The Hardys clearing the ring and then looking at the titles before getting it on, to one of the most brutal spots in any ladder match... Mercury having his face destroyed. When you think of Hell in a Cell, odds are the first thing you think of is Foley being thrown off the top. When you think of ladder matches, THAT spot is what I think of.

Regal & Taylor are funny as hell in the match, when it turns out both of them are afraid of heights :lmao. They make up for that with their brutality though, especially Regal and THAT suplex on the ladder. Might not be as remembered as the Mercury spot, but it might very well be my favourite spot of the match.

Just an amazing 20 minute rollercoaster ride of a ladder match. I think it made it on my list, but I won't know for sure until I look again .

*Rating: *****


*Gregory Helms Vs Jimmy Wang Yang - CW Title - Armageddon December 17th 2006*

Helms has perhaps become complacent over the last few months or so, since he rarely defended the CW title (at least on SD and PPV), and when someone like Yang comes along and challenges him for it, he probably doesn't think he is in any danger of losing it because he has held it for so long.

Yang gets the early advantage, taking Helms by surprise maybe, or maybe he is just really motivated to win the belt. It takes a little time, but Helms finally gets focused and the match turns in his favour.

Now that Helms is more focused, he starts getting more and more confident. He takes his time and taunts the crowd, because he believes nothing can stop him now. Yang does a nice job with his comeback; always was a big fan of his offence, especially that awesome looking running heel kick in the corner where he goes over the ropes too.

Only thing to really dislike about this match is the crowd. Apparently good wrestling is boring. So ummm... why did they come to a wrestling PPV again? 

Wanna know how Helms wins the match? One word... CODEBREAKER! Jericho stole it from Helms! And Helms probably stole it from someone else... but yeah, Jericho stole it!!!

Great match, another great showing from Helms on PPV. Man was the backbone of the mid-card PPV matches in 2006.

*Rating: ****


*The Undertaker Vs Mr Kennedy - Armageddon December 17th 2006*

They've had a singles match on PPV which ended in a DQ. Then they had a First Blood match on PPV which ended in controversial fashion. So the only way to end it in a definitive way? Last Ride Match! Ok, maybe not the match I would have picked, but it was only the second Last Ride Match ever at the time (has there been any more? I honestly don't remember lol), and hell, I'm all for newish matches than them using a way overused match instead (HIAC would have been a decent option for this match, but even that had been overused by this point in time, and had continued to get worse over the last few years lol).

A similar start to this match compared to their First Blood match, with Undertaker going right after Kennedy and just beating the shit out of him. A couple of nice small spots too, like Undertaker throwing Kennedy onto the table (and Kennedy bascially doing a flip onto it), and then Undertaker launching Kennedy from the table face first to the ring apron.

But Kennedy, as we have seen in all of their previous matches, is pretty resilient, and he manages to reverse Old School, and then goes after Undertaker like a wolf after a wounded sheep (well, that comparison sucked lol).

Its only moments later than they end up at the Hearse, with Kennedy showing Undertaker in and trying his best to close it! Its not happening though, not just yet, as Undertaker boots Kennedy in the face and goes right back to work on the "future of Smackdown" ( :lmao not any more he ain't).

Undertaker's offence is pretty great here, though I'm sure that's all opinion based. I love his elbows, kicks and then legdrop on the apron, and I know some people don't like it too much (screw them!  ). Plus I love his strikes too. Oh, and the man his a pretty stellar looking superplex when he pulls it out.

Out of nowhere Kennedy applies a sleeper hold (OMG ZIGGLER STOLENZ KENNEDYS MUVE!), and Undertaker appears to be out! Into the Hearse he goes, and the door shuts! Kennedy goes to get in the driver's seat... and Undertaker pops out instead! Now Kennedy is pretty pissed. He has had 2 chances to get Undertaker in the Hearse for good, and both times Undertaker has escaped. So what to do next? Steel chair .

Undertaker takes numerous chair shots... and sits right back up!!! Kennedy doesn't seem to have any more ideas, so he runs! Where to? The top of the Armageddon stage of course, where else!?!?

SPOT! And no, its NOT Kennedy that takes it! Undertaker is thrown off the stage after a short brawl. I have to say, even though you can see how soft the landing is AFTER he has landed, the camera angle for the fall makes it look pretty fucking awesome.

After the spot, it looks like Kennedy has this one in the bag, and who could argue with that point right now? Undertaker is dragged to the Hearse and stuffed into the back, and Kennedy gets behind the wheel. Cut to a camera inside, and we see Undertaker sit up and drag Kennedy to the back and out of the door!

Now Undertaker is pissed. Really pissed. How often do you see Undertaker grab a steel pipe to attack someone with? A few steel chair shots later (the pipe only manages to break a window  ), and Kennedy is bleeding. This one is nearly over, but not before Kennedy is Chokeslammed on the roof of the Hears! And not in the shitty way JBL was Chokeslammed through the limo in 04! If that wasn't enough though, Undertaker makes damn sure this one is going to be over, because even though he is in control again, he knows that Kennedy took the fight right to him and almost won a couple of times, so he finishes him off with a Tombstone on top of the Hearse!

The Dead Man then drives off with Kennedy in the back, and this one is over!

A good match, but like their First Blood match... its not on the level as their non gimmick matches. I think they work better without weapons tbh. Their NM, Germany House Show and SD 07 matches are all better than this and their First Blood match imo, and they were all under regular rules. However, this is still a good match, around the same level as their First Blood.

Overall, I really enjoyed this series between Undertaker and Kennedy. 2 ****1/4 matches, a ***3/4 match, and now 2 ***1/2 matches. Good stuff! And I'm really glad I went back and watched these again, but I don't remember any of them being as good.

*Rating: ***1/2*


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Lady Killer said:


> Yeah, that match is great, but that spot is nasty. Fairly sure they did away with the teeter totter spot after that. Also, I think that was why his career ended - he got addicted to pain killers after that iirc.


I feel like that was mostly Matt Hardys fault, he held his head down like that and didn't give him a way to bump properly and protect himself. At least that's how I saw it. Normally when you take that spot you either bump backwards as the ladder is coming up or you get a hand up to protect yourself, with Matt holding him down the way he was I don't see how Mercury could have done either of those.

That's really shitty to hear that caused him to have a PK addiction. With all the surgeries and bone breaks I've had in my life as a snowboarder/skateboarder, I can vouch for how easy it is to get hooked on that stuff. Atleast he got himself in order and Punk brought him back....

Speaking of, who else would like to see Punk bring the SES back when he turns heel in the future? If WWE actually backed him while he was doing it, it could be a big deal. Obviously they can't do it any time in the immediate future because Bray Wyatt kinda has a lock on the Cult Leader gimmick.

Edit- Great review Cal, I'm a big fan of BoD vs Book/Finlay. Bad ass match. All the double sit ups, boots, goozles, etc are pretty :mark: That Mercury spot is one of the nastiest things I've ever seen. God that must have hurt so bad, I tear up when I get hit in the face with a basketball when I'm playing with my friends, I can only imagine what it feels like to have your face completely destroyed by a ladder.


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

redskins25 said:


> nah edge/ziggler was kinda weak, just flat mostly Edge is fault though
> 
> You didnt like any Punk/ziggler matches ? Thought the raw ones were pretty good. At one point I thought there was a chance but it was probably the mark in me



None, not even their SD match last year.
Actually there are more series I dislike then ones I like, for example ADR/Show, Ziggler/Sheamus, Show/Sheamus, Orton/ADR and the worst of them all... ADR/Sheamus.
Except for ADR/Sheamus they weren't bad but they weren't good either.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

bme said:


> I was disappointed by the two previous Punk/Ziggler matches, so their RR match wasn't a shock at all.
> Who came up with Ziggler challenging for gold at that point anyway ?
> How many people really thought Ziggler would win either title match ?
> 
> I liked his match with Edge a bit more cause at least they finally picked it up towards the end.


Ziggler got a title shot because he had beaten Punk on TV like 3 weeks in a row or something, so he clearly deserved a title shot. Obviously no one thought he'd win at the Rumble because the whole thing was more about Punk/Laurinaitis, but I still thought the match was pretty fun, even if Ziggler did get buried. For the record I liked the Edge/Ziggler match too. Both are certainly ***+ for me.

Btw, pretty much all those series you just listed are A-okay with me. Except Orton/ADR cause I haven't seen those yet. No clue how someone can not like Sheamus/Ziggler and Sheamus/Show...



Cactus Jack said:


> My fucking lord....has anyone here seen the Tag Ladder match from Armageddon 2006??? Joey Mercury's face EXPLODES when he gets that ladder shot, blood shoots out everywhere and his nose is like non existent when they show a camera shot of him right before he goes to the back. I've never seen a legit FOUNTAIN of blood like that other than JD04'. Sooooo nasty when you know it's 100% legit and not a blade job. I wonder how badly he was fucked up, within seconds both of his eyes were swollen shut and his nose was like gone.


Of course we've seen that match. It's like ridiculously fucking awesome.  Somehow one of the more forgotten ladder matches (I guess because it was just randomly thrown in) but I love how they got to incorporate every team in something memorable. Mercury's laceration and Hardy falling throat first onto the top rope will never be forgotten. Plus you had Regal & Taylor suplexing everyone into ladders.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

bme said:


> None, not even their SD match last year.
> Actually there are more series I dislike then ones I like, for example ADR/Show, Ziggler/Sheamus, Show/Sheamus, Orton/ADR and the worst of them all... ADR/Sheamus.
> Except for ADR/Sheamus they weren't bad but they weren't good either.


Wait, you disliked Ziggler/Sheamus and Show/Sheamus? Damn, opinions.

Agreed with Sheamus/ADR though did have a great showing at NOC 2012. That match worked really well in so many levels, though it could've been even better had they kept the Brogue Kick banned.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

bme said:


> None, not even their SD match last year.
> Actually there are more series I dislike then ones I like, for example ADR/Show, Ziggler/Sheamus, Show/Sheamus, Orton/ADR and the worst of them all... ADR/Sheamus.
> Except for ADR/Sheamus they weren't bad but they weren't good either.


Wait a second. Del Rio vs. Sheamus is the worst of them all, but they're not that bad? I'm not following.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

That AdR/Sheamus trilogy from last year was so boring that I only remember that moment when Sheamus stold Del rio's car


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Seriously ? Adr/show, show/sheamus, and sheamus/ziggler are all pretty good IMO


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

MITB 2012 was very good too when you pay attention, ADR's armwork was priceless in that one... but the dead crowd *kills* the whole thing. _(Kills! Get that? 8*D)_


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

ADR/Show matches sucked balls.

Show/Sheamus matches were :mark:. Especially HIAC and the Lumber Jack Frost match :mark:.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Callamus said:


> *ADR/Show* matches sucked balls.
> 
> Show/Sheamus matches were :mark:. Especially HIAC and the Lumber Jack Frost match :mark:.


Still adore that sd 1/13 match


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Disliked everything they did together.


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Ziggler got a title shot because he had beaten Punk on TV like 3 weeks in a row or something, so he clearly deserved a title shot. Obviously no one thought he'd win at the Rumble because the whole thing was more about Punk/Laurinaitis, but I still thought the match was pretty fun, even if Ziggler did get buried. For the record I liked the Edge/Ziggler match too. Both are certainly ***+ for me.
> 
> Btw, pretty much all those series you just listed are A-okay with me. Except Orton/ADR cause I haven't seen those yet. No clue how someone can not like Sheamus/Ziggler and Sheamus/Show...
> 
> ...


I know storyline wise why he got the shot but who in the creative meeting thought Ziggler should be part of the RTWM two years in a row.
All I remember from Punk/Ziggler is that the time between Punk hitting GTS and the ref counting the three felt like an eternity.

Show/Sheamus (HIAC) & ADR/Sheamus (NOC) I'm torn over cause I was watching them thinking " I should be enjoying this".
Show/Sheamus were killing each other and ADR was destroying Sheamus' arm.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Show vs Sheamus HiaC is where it's at. That's up there with Show/Taker NM, Show/Lesnar Stretcher Match, and Show/Eddie SD as my favorite big Show singles matches ever.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Title matches at Royal Rumbles I feel like are never truly a part of the road to Wrestlemania, considering how many times things change the next month at No Way out or Elimination Chamber. When you look at the past few years, Punk/Ziggler, Miz/Orton, Edge/Ziggler, Orton/Hardy, Taker/Mysterio, Orton/Sheamus, etc. never really played into anything. They all sort of felt like filler defenses but at least some of them turned into decent matches.

Rock/Punk is the obvious exception to what I posted though.


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Wait a second. Del Rio vs. Sheamus is the worst of them all, but they're not that bad? I'm not following.


Oh no ADR/Sheamus was bad, the rest of them were OK.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

bme said:


> I know storyline wise *why he got the shot but who in the creative meeting thought Ziggler should be part of the RTWM two years in a ro*w.


Dont know who's it was but I pray they hire him/her back to the company ASAP


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

redskins25 said:


> Dont know who's it was but I pray they hire him/her back to the company ASAP


Hahaha. Pretty bad when Khali has been on PPV the past couple months but Ziggler's been MIA on the main show. I pray they jump start him back into something come Survivor Series and beyond. Even if he takes the US Title off of Ambrose, that's something at least. Although I'd rather see Christian do that honestly... if he ever comes back.


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

Forgot the Punk/Orton matches through the years, their WM match felt alot like HHH/Orton.
They should've been trying to kill each other that night.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Hahaha. Pretty bad when Khali has been on PPV the past couple months but Ziggler's been MIA on the main show. I pray they jump start him back into something come Survivor Series and beyond. Even if he takes the US Title off of Ambrose, that's something at least. Although I'd rather see Christian do that honestly... if he ever comes back.


You and me both, yea I'd like CHristian to have that or the IC, I'd say have him have ONE MORE MATCH, but there are other guys I'd like holding that belt at the moment and Im more than happy with the current holder ( skins you cena lovin son of a bitch)

I have to be honest with you, its so bad for ziggles atm, I rather him being off TV instead of jobbing and in pointless feuds with Ambrose, yea plug him into the corporation storyline 



bme said:


> Forgot the Punk/Orton matches through the years, their WM match felt alot like HHH/Orton.
> They should've been trying to kill each other that night.


We are just disagreeing today arent we haha punk/orton mania is their best match IMO, heard they had a good raw one too,


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

The ME from this weeks SD is really great.


Spoiler: .....



Cesaro is the king. Cesaro vs Cena now must happen.


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

Right in the mood for Steve Austin :austin2

Anyone got a top 10, 50 or 100 match list.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I'd like to see them put the IC & US straps back onto some credible champions, even if they have to drop guys out of the main event scene. Axel has been winning clean for the most part, but he's just not cuttin it. I don't know of very many people that wanna see him defend at all, let alone against Kofi Kingston, R-Truth, or even Big E. Langston in some eventual case. 

Ambrose has been having shitty match after shitty match or just putting on some really average performances. Matches against Big E and Kane were completely forgettable, and even the NOC match against Ziggler didn't feature much. He clearly needs to be involved in lengthier matches against the right opponent (Bryan is about the only one that's given us something good) to put on something worthwhile. 

An IC/US Title scene with the likes of Christian when he returns, possibly Mysterio if he ever comes back, Cesaro & Swagger, MAYBE Henry if they don't wanna push him to the big boy Title scene, along with mid/uppercarders like Ryback, Ziggler, and Van Dam when he comes back would be a MASSIVE improvement over what we have now.


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

redskins25 said:


> We are just disagreeing today arent we haha punk/orton mania is their best match IMO, heard they had a good raw one too,


Will never forgive WWE for their WM buildup to the match, every week seeing Orton punt an NXT member :no:.
Then they had Punk attack Ortons knee.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Completely forgot to mention Orton vs. Punk. Somewhat of an odd main event pairing, but they've done enough good together to make me enjoy their matches. Wrestlemania 27 and their RAW match right before MITB this year were both very good. Their LMS match from Extreme Rules 2011 was decent as well, just not their best encounter. I'd be curious to see what they could produce in a 20 minute main event match.



YoungGun_UK said:


> Right in the mood for Steve Austin :austin2
> 
> Anyone got a top 10, 50 or 100 match list.


Just watch his series with Angle. RAW January '01, Summerslam '01, Unforgiven '01, and RAW October '01. As a bonus check out his 3-way with Angle & Van Dam from No Mercy. Actually just watch everything Austin did in '01.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

How many 2013 matches would be in a Top 50 TV matches ever? :hmm:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

ATF said:


> How many 2013 matches would be in a Top 50 TV matches ever? :hmm:



Just 1, Punk vs Lesnar. You could argue Punk vs Cena from Raw and Ziggler vs ADR from Payback I suppose, but only Punk vs Lesnar is a sure fire top 50 match ever in all of wrestling. If we are talking just WWE? I still think just Punk vs Lesnar makes the cut. There is just so much good stuff out there man.

I've watched Cena/Punk MitB recently, I might be crazy, but I think I prefer Punk/Lesnar to that match now. It's just so perfect in every way, can't get enough of that one.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

YoungGun_UK said:


> Right in the mood for Steve Austin :austin2
> 
> Anyone got a top 10, 50 or 100 match list.


By googling, I found that Clique did a list awhile back:
http://www.wrestlingforum.com/general-wwe/636577-steve-austins-50-greatest-matches.html

Don't know how many of the obvious ones you've seen, but some ones I'd recommend prioritizing are Austin vs. Hart at SvS '96, WM 13, and Austin vs. Rock at WM 17 & WM 19. Also, Austin at Canadian Stampede In Your House is one of his strongest performances ever. Crazy, crazy, environment.

Glad to have found that list. There's some stuff I'm definitely going to have to re-watch/watch when I get the chance.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Thems some odd TV matches Cactus .


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Just 1, Punk vs Lesnar. You could argue Punk vs Cena from Raw and Ziggler vs ADR from Payback I suppose, but only Punk vs Lesnar is a sure fire top 50 match ever in all of wrestling. If we are talking just WWE? I still think just Punk vs Lesnar makes the cut. There is just so much good stuff out there man.


I said "*TV matches*" :lol


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

ATF said:


> How many 2013 matches would be in a Top 50 TV matches ever? :hmm:


To be honest, probably not as many as you'd think. I know there's been a lot of good shit out there, but a top 50 TV matches list from just the 'E would probably all be ****+ stuff. I imagine that from going by what I've seen, Cena/Punk from 2/25, Team Hell No & Kofi vs. The Shield, and maaaaybe one or two other Shield matches would make the cut. Tag Title match vs. Rhodes Bros being one. Again though, 20 years of TV matches and I'm sure there's still plenty more that's not as well knows as others. Unless we're counting before RAW was on the air, then shit gets REAL tough.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Has SD leaked anywhere yet? I'm curious about the main event.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Its been on wrestling torrent sites for hours now.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Jack, *All* counts if it was aired on TV 

funnyfaces PM'ed me on that I should be doing a project, I think I might have something here - WWF/E's Greatest TV Matches :mark:


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I guess a more appropriate question would be: Has anyone watched the main event?


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

ATF said:


> Jack, *All* counts if it was aired on TV
> 
> funnyfaces PM'ed me on that I should be doing a project, I think I might have something here - WWF/E's Greatest TV Matches :mark:


Well then no way, doubt it would be more than 3 tops. RAW, Smackdown, Saturday Night's Main Event, Superstars, ECW, Action Zone, Shotgun Saturday Night, Main Event, NXT, Sunday Night Heat, Velocity. WAY too much good shit out there.

Doing a project like that would probably take years.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Well, no way that only epic matches passed before 1992 ended, so there's that 

*Fuck it, I'm throwing myself into the wolfpit. Top 100 or 50, one of them. I'm no Christian, but Jesus help me...*


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I'll believe it when I see it.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Oh, you will believe it. Sooner than expected. 8*D


----------



## GOON (Jan 23, 2010)

***1/2-**** for the six man tag on Smackdown. I don't want to to say much about it in an attempt to not give anything about the match away, but it's p. great. It goes about seventeen minutes, too.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Someone should do a write up on the terrible and short lived, Ultimate Warrior WCW run.

Just for shits and giggles.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I cut Codustena/Real Intellectuals into ***1/2-3/4. All I can I say is *Goldust*. And *Cesaro*.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Dude why did you spoil it


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

GOON The Legend said:


> ***1/2-**** for the six man tag on Smackdown. I don't want to to say much about it in an attempt to not give anything about the match away, but it's p. great. It goes about seventeen minutes, too.





ATF said:


> I cut Codustena/Real Intellectuals into ***1/2-3/4. All I can I say is *Goldust*. And *Cesaro*.


:mark:


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Hulk Hogan (c) vs Ultimate Warrior (c) "The Ultimate Challenge" Wrestlemania VI (1990) 8-8.5/10*

*Macho Man Randy Savage vs Ultimate Warrior "Retirement Match" Wrestlemania VII (1991) 9/10*

*Shawn Michaels (c) vs Diesel "No Holds Barred" In Your House 7: Good Friends, Better Enemies (1996) 8.5-9/10*





Jack Evans 187 said:


> Hogan/Warrior - **** 1/2
> Savage/Warrior - **** 1/4
> 
> I love both of them immensely.



I don't know what happened the first time around with Savage/Warrior, but this time I found myself being immersed throughout the whole match.

I kept going back on whether or not Hogan/Warrior should be seen due to previous negative views involving Mr. Warrior Warrior, but I'm glad I did.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Savage vs Warrior from WM VII. Lets talk about it for days. :lenny


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

Just finished the SD main event. It was alright, definitely wouldn't go more than ***1/4 for it.

Cesaro kills it every single time though.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Warrior needs to go in the HOF soon for carrying Savage to Savage's best match ever. How he managed it I'll never know. ULTIMATE CARRYJOB BY THE ULTIMATE WARRIOR RRRRAARRGHGHGHH.

8*D.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Tempted to skip to the main event and let that be the only thing I see from Smackdown this week. Not worth watching everything like before. Old hobbies soon die.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Man I'm watching Punk-Ziggler from the Rumble in 2012 and I'm just realizing now how epic Punk's burial of Ziggler is. Literally the last 6-7 minutes of the match is Punk defeating Ziggler numerous times with Ziggler looking like the biggest chump in the universe. He gets like one big move the entire match and Punk just SQUASHES the motherfucker. I need to find more PUNK burials as this one was fucking awesome.
> 
> *****


I suppose they had to make up for Ziggler making Punk look like a chump with having him beat Punk every week on RAW until the Rumble. I mean, one win over the champion was good enough to earn a title shot, but they had Ziggler beat Punk like 3 times before The Rumble, making it so obvious that when it came to the PPV Punk would retain. The whole feud was Punk/Laurinaitis though, and for me that took way from their Rumble match with him being featured as the special guest referee and getting involved too much imo. Punk/Ziggler had better matches on TV. 



redskins25 said:


> Agreed, didnt he get eliminated by Khrama in one rumble match too fpalm


No, Ziggler eliminated Kharma but got eliminated by The Big Show. Ziggler had a decent showing in the 2012 Rumble match, but his best performance was in the 2013 Rumble when he lasted longer than anybody by lasting 49 minutes. :mark: 



Jack Evans 187 said:


> Hahaha. Pretty bad when Khali has been on PPV the past couple months but Ziggler's been MIA on the main show. I pray they jump start him back into something come Survivor Series and beyond. Even if he takes the US Title off of Ambrose, that's something at least. Although I'd rather see Christian do that honestly... if he ever comes back.


It's awful, they really need to do something with Ziggler. 

I'd rather see Christian win the US Title too and it's something I've wanted to happen for a while. Christian's my all time favorite, but at this stage of his career he's better off in the midcard scene (plus WWE will never push him in the main event anyway...). And the US Title is one of few titles that Christian has never won, and I think Christian/Ambrose could be a good match up. The rising star Ambrose against a respected veteran and former World Champion in Christian is a feud I want to see. 



Jack Evans 187 said:


> I'd like to see them put the IC & US straps back onto some credible champions, even if they have to drop guys out of the main event scene. Axel has been winning clean for the most part, but he's just not cuttin it. I don't know of very many people that wanna see him defend at all, let alone against Kofi Kingston, R-Truth, or even Big E. Langston in some eventual case.
> 
> Ambrose has been having shitty match after shitty match or just putting on some really average performances. Matches against Big E and Kane were completely forgettable, and even the NOC match against Ziggler didn't feature much. He clearly needs to be involved in lengthier matches against the right opponent (Bryan is about the only one that's given us something good) to put on something worthwhile.
> 
> An IC/US Title scene with the likes of Christian when he returns, possibly Mysterio if he ever comes back, Cesaro & Swagger, MAYBE Henry if they don't wanna push him to the big boy Title scene, along with mid/uppercarders like Ryback, Ziggler, and Van Dam when he comes back would be a MASSIVE improvement over what we have now.


Agreed with all this. (Y)


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Your guys' optimism that the WWE would actually put the US championship on someone talented atm is making me envious. I fear the worst is already set in stone.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

You have to look at the glass half full sometimes in wwe land Cody

IC needs to be elevated by the likes of Christian, Rey, hell even Cesaro if they dont put him in the whc title picture


yea you guys are right warrior/savage is tops


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

It's not something I see happening currently, especially with Christian still being out and WWE never knowing what to do with him when he's not injured, but it's just something I would want to happen. 



The Primer said:


> Your guys' optimism that the WWE would actually put the US championship on someone talented atm is making me envious. *I fear the worst is already set in stone.*


Big E Langston as the new US Champ? 8*D


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I feel there is no need for wishful thinking when the company is mapping out something right in front of your eyes. I'm a jaded person at life, though.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm messing with you, I'm as jaded as can be, and my current favorite is supposedly only seen tonight sellng wwe mech like he is R-truth :ziggler3

Just watched ADR/Cena HIAC again, went up for me, very good match. Cena's selling isnt as bad as some say and it did a nice job building and building to the end and then AA !! clear cut MOTN on that ppv


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

MOTN by a mile at HIAC. Which is what I expected with Cena vs Del Rio on paper.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

I haven't watched anything from Hell in a Cell.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Random things:

1)Cal, I just did what you asked for in your sig. (Y)

2)Warrior vs. Hogan is love. Still stands up after all of these years. Still one of the best atmospheres ever too. Why do people think that Hogan/Rock had a better atmosphere? The split crowd for Warrior & Hogan made it more exciting, IMO.

3)'skins, did you watch Sandow/Cena? What did you think?

4)Also, 'skins, next time you're in the mood for a Hart match, please watch Bret vs. Roddy Piper, and let me know what you think. It's short. Only about 12 or 13 minutes, from what I remember.
http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/c0XtzlIDElw/

5)HayleySabin, what would you say is your favorite and/or greatest WWE match of all-time? Your taste seems hard to predict sometimes, that's why I'm curious.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Waiting to watch Warrior/Hogan until my History of the WWE championship DVD arrives, really wanna see it in HD :mark: 

Watching NWO 2002, only one match in and its fun enough


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Nostalgia said:


> I haven't watched anything from Hell in a Cell.


one match show tbhayley in cena/adr, the triple tag is OK but just that, real Americans/matadors started off well but fell flat 


LilOlMe said:


> Random things:
> 
> 1)Cal, I just did what you asked for in your sig. (Y)
> 
> ...


I did, thought it was pretty good, nice arm work but Sandow and selling by Cena, got it around the ***3/4 range because I know you like that. And its funny you said that because I saw the scsa list you linked earlier and the bret/scsa revenge of taker popped out, I actually started watching it but my computer died


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Great match that (Austin/Hart ROT 97). I liked their street fight on RAW where Austin injures Bret's leg and attacks him inside the Ambulance. Heel Bret Hart was awesome, shame it only lasted for a couple of months (and never had a clear ending due to the screwjob). 

About Ziggler, I'm shocked to see him drop this low. I guess those Cena criticisms really affected his position.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Oliver-94 said:


> Great match that (Austin/Hart ROT 97). I liked their street fight on RAW where Austin injures Bret's leg and attacks him inside the Ambulance.
> 
> About Ziggler, I'm shocked to see him drop this low. I guess those Cena criticisms really affected his position.


Hart Foundation 1997 :mark:


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> I did, thought it was pretty good, nice arm work but Sandow and selling by Cena, got it around the ***3/4 range *because I know you like that*.
> 
> And its funny you said that because I saw the scsa list you linked earlier and the bret/scsa revenge of taker popped out, I actually started watching it but my computer died


:lol

Good match, though I think I'd know your comments.




Oliver-94 said:


> Great match that (Austin/Hart ROT 97). I liked their street fight on RAW where Austin injures Bret's leg and attacks him inside the Ambulance. Heel Bret Hart was awesome, shame it only lasted for a couple of months (and never had a clear ending due to the screwjob).
> 
> About Ziggler, I'm shocked to see him drop this low. I guess those Cena criticisms really affected his position.


Owen was killing me with his antics during that. "Watch his knee, you idiot!" he screams with obnoxious passion, when the EMT legitimately, accidentally, hits a bump too hard. :lmao

Bret said in his book that he was trying to stifle his laughter at Owen's antics too during this. It's funny, because I specifically was looking to see if he mentioned that, because that's exactly how I felt. wen

I love Davey Boy trying to get in on the action, and actually show some personality. "A million dollars sitting right here on a towel, and he _SHOULDN' BE!_"

As for Ziggler, yeah, it's ridiculous, since they have so few baby faces that could legitimately get over with the crowd. It's a business, and you'd think they'd care more about that than punishment, but whatever. People are talking about Kofi and Kingston pairing with Bryan & Punk vs. The Wyatts. Who the fuck wants to see that? It'd be more exciting with Ziggler, IMO.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Looks like my 2002 project may be on hold for this weekend, heading down to redbox soon to rent WWE 2K14, And I will most likely be playing that A LOT. 

Quick thought, If I were to get one WWE PPV from 2005, which one should it be? I'm thinking SS,


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

LilOlMe said:


> Random things:
> 
> 1)Cal, I just did what you asked for in your sig. (Y)


:mark: Awesome, thanks! 

Just been playing WWE 2K14 (yeah, got it this morning, only just played it now lol). SPEAR! SPEAR! SPEAR!!! Reigns Vs Lesnar lol. CATAPULT SPEAR!!! LESNAR KICKS OUT! SPEAR! REIGNS WINS! :mark:

Might get back to NWO 02 . Only watched 2 matches... started the event yesterday :lmao.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> Owen was killing me with his antics during that. "Watch his knee, you idiot!" he screams with obnoxious passion, when the EMT legitimately, accidentally, hits a bump too hard. :lmao
> 
> Bret said in his book that he was trying to stifle his laughter at Owen's antics too during this. It's funny, because I specifically was looking to see if he mentioned that, because that's exactly how I felt. wen
> 
> ...


 Owen was pretty underrated on the promo department IMO. Watching him and Bulldog argue before forming the Hart Foundation was hilarious. There was an interview on Shotgun Saturday between the two where Owen talks about their European title match, in which he lost, and he says he didn't try hard and he let Bulldog take the win. 

Hart Foundation 1997 were brilliant. The whole logic and timing of the group was just perfect. Bulldog/Owen bust up nearly lost them their tag titles but then Bret comes in and reminds them that they are all family and America is trying to turn them against each other. Bret's heel turn too. I loved his promo after his cage match with Sid. It feels like that was the moment where he truly turned heel (that show was week prior to WM 13) even though he officially turned against Austin. He was getting screwed by Taker, Austin and HBK so he finally decided to snap and blame the fans for his frustrations. Pillman's introduction to the group was odd (he was the only American in the group) but I guess he joined due to his background with Austin. 

Kofi pairing with Bryan/Punk? It might also be the MIZ :lmao


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

smitty, you've never seen Hogan/Warrior before, or you're re-watching?

Jack Evans, forgot to say that I'm waiting on watching Bret/Taker from '92, because I ordered the Dungeon Collection, so I'll just wait until I get that to watch that.

For those who missed it, WWE.com is having a sale that ends today. $4.99 to $9.99 for a bunch of great DVDs. Plus, if you sign up for email, you get $5 off your order.


Opinions on these DVDs, please, people?:

The John Cena Experience
Edge: Decade of Decandance



Spoiler: spoiler



DISC 1 - Documentary

John Cena on Troops
Tribute to the Troops
John Cena on TV Appearances
Psyched Up
John Cena on Sports
This is ESPN
John Cena on Fiesta Bowl
Fiesta Bowl Parade
Fiesta Bowl Invitational
Fiesta Bowl Pre-Game
Fiesta Bowl Game
John Cena on Movies
Legendary Performance
John Cena on Mattel
John Cena on being a WWE Spokesman
It's Going to be a Late Night
John Cena on Music
Hustle Loyalty Respect
John Cena on WrestleMania
WrestleMania Arrival
WrestleMania Golf Tournament
The Mania Before Mania
Make a Wish Pizza Party
WrestleMania Rehearsal
WrestleMania
John Cena on Cars
Barrett Jackson
John Cena on Gilette
Start Your Engines
John Cena on Responsibility
Cup with a Cause
Raw and Uncut

DISC 2 - Matches

Match #5 in the Best of 5 Series for the United States Championship
John Cena vs. Booker T
No Mercy - October 3, 2004

#1 Contenders Match for the WWE Championship at WrestleMania 21
John Cena vs. Kurt Angle
No Way Out - February 20, 2005

Triple Threat Match for the WWE Championship
John Cena vs. Kurt Angle vs. Shawn Michaels
Taboo Tuesday - November 1, 2005

WWE Championship Match
John Cena vs. Edge
Royal Rumble - January 29, 2006

John Cena vs. Edge
Tribute to the Troops - December 25, 2006

World Tag Team Championship Match
John Cena & Shawn Michaels vs. Edge & Randy Orton
RAW - February 26, 2007

Falls Count Anywhere Match for the WWE Championship
John Cena vs. The Great Khali
One Night Stand - June 3, 2007

DISC 3 - Matches

WWE Championship Match
John Cena vs. Bobby Lashley
Great American Bash - July 22, 2007

WWE Championship Match
John Cena vs. Randy Orton
SummerSlam - August 26, 2007

John Cena Returns!
Royal Rumble - January 27, 2008

WWE Championship Match
John Cena vs. Triple H
Night of Champions - June 29, 2008

John Cena vs. Shawn Michaels
RAW - January 26, 2009

John Cena vs. Jack Swagger
RAW - April 13, 2009

John Cena vs. Big Show
Judgment Day - May 17, 2009

Night of Champions Tournament Semi-Finals Match
John Cena vs. The Miz
RAW - June 29, 2009

Triple Threat Match for the WWE Championship
John Cena vs. Triple H vs. Shawn Michaels
Survivor Series - November 22, 2009





Spoiler: spoiler



DISC ONE

A Boy and his Dream

Breakdown September 27, 1998
Edge vs. Owen Hart

Terri Invitational Tournament- Ladder Match
New Brood vs. Edge & Christian
No Mercy October 17, 1999

8 Pounds of Gold

Triangle Ladder Match for the World Tag Team Championship
Dudley Boyz vs. Hardy Boyz vs. Edge & Christian
WrestleMania April 2, 2000

WWE Intercontinental Championship: Lance Storm vs. Edge
SummerSlam August 19, 2001

Championship Unification Match: IC vs. US - Edge vs. Test
Survivor Series November 18, 2001

Singles Superstar

Edge vs. Mr. Perfect
Sunday Night Heat March 3, 2002

Hair vs. Hair Match: Kurt Angle vs. Edge
Judgment Day May 19, 2002

Steel Cage Match: Kurt Angle vs. Edge
SmackDown! May 30, 2002

World Tag Team Championship: Billy & Chuck vs. Edge & Hollywood Hulk Hogan
SmackDown! July 4, 2002

Edge vs. Eddie Guerrero - Unforgiven September 22, 2002

Extras

* The Totally Awesome Best of Edge & Christian

DISC TWO

Injury - Return!

WWE Intercontinental Championship: Randy Orton vs. Edge
Vengeance July 11, 2004

Street Fight: Shawn Michaels vs. Edge
RAW February 28, 2005

Gold Rush Tournament Final: Kane vs. Edge
RAW May 16, 2005

Love Triangle

Street Fight: Matt Hardy vs. Edge
RAW August 29, 2005

WWE Championship: John Cena vs. Edge
New Year's Revolution January 8, 2006

Overrated

Hardcore Match: Mick Foley vs. Edge
WrestleMania 22 April 2, 2006

6- Person Tag Team Match: Terry Funk, Tommy Dreamer & Beulah vs. Mick Foley, Edge & Lita
ECW: One Night Stand June 11, 2006

Triple Threat Match for the WWE Championship: Rob Van Dam vs. John Cena vs. Edge
RAW July 3, 2006

Extras

*Adam Copeland vs. Christian (WWF tryout)
Cornwall, ON November 10, 1997
Commentary By: Matt Striker & Edge

* Intercontinental Championship: Jeff Jarrett vs. Edge (Never before seen Edge surprise- even to him - IC title win)
Toronto, ON July 24, 1999
Commentary By: Matt Striker & Edge

DISC THREE

"I Equal Ratings!"

WWE Championship: Edge vs. John Cena
SummerSlam August 20, 2006

I Persevered

Money in the Bank Qualifying Match: Rob Van Dam vs. Edge
RAW February 19, 2007

Randy Orton vs. Edge
RAW April 30, 2007

Money in the Bank - Again!

World Heavyweight Championship Match: Undertaker vs. Edge
SmackDown! May 11, 2007

Last Chance World Heavyweight Championship: Edge vs. Batista
Vengeance June 24, 2007

World Heavyweight Championship: Edge vs. Rey Mysterio
Royal Rumble January 27, 2008

My Speciality

Tables, Ladders & Chairs Match For the Vacant World Heavyweight Championship: Undertaker vs. Edge
One Night Stand June 1, 2008

Hell in a Cell: Undertaker vs. Edge
SummerSlam August 17, 2008

What's Next - Sequel?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Cena Experience has probably THE worst documentary ever made. Match listing isn't much to write home about either. Couple of good ones but not worth buying the entire set for.

Edge DVD has a bunch of good matches but it all depends on how many of the PPV ones you already own and if you wanna get it just for the TV matches or not.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> :mark: Awesome, thanks!
> 
> Just been playing WWE 2K14 (yeah, got it this morning, only just played it now lol). SPEAR! SPEAR! SPEAR!!! Reigns Vs Lesnar lol. CATAPULT SPEAR!!! LESNAR KICKS OUT! SPEAR! REIGNS WINS! :mark:
> 
> Might get back to NWO 02 . Only watched 2 matches... started the event yesterday :lmao.



Lmao that would be a bad ass match. I like the big guy vs small guy matches better, so I'd like to see Reigns vs Ziggler and Rollins vs Lesnar. OR if it was two big guys, Mark Henry vs Lesnar :mark:

Sorry ATF, apparently I can't read for shit :lmao

Watching Brainbusters vs The Rockers Boston Garden right now. Tully/Arn are probably the most underrated tag team by the general public. Real wrestling fans know about them, but the casuals will never understand that these guys are a top 5 heel team ever. They have tons of good matches against the Rockers, Rock n Roll Express, Etc.

I'm gonna whine and complain until WWE gets off their asses and makes a good Cena doc/set and a good JBL doc/set.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

That Cena DVD is pretty weak looking at that match list only 2-3 goodies on there. As for the edge DVD, not a edgehead per say but it looks like all his "cream of the crop" minus cage w/hardy matches are on there so give it a go

Good Lord Cal beat me


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Lilolme: FIRST TIME! :mark: really looking forward to it. Hopefully the DVD can get its ass here tomorrow so I can watch it.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Cal, is there a better Cena DVD out?

I have nothing of Edge's. I have nothing of anyone, really ('cept for the Orton & Punk DVDS, which I recently bought). I don't collect. But since everything is dirt cheap, I figured I'd get a few that had some matches that probably would interest me.

The Cena match listing seemed pretty extensive to me, which is what caught my interest with that DVD.




Oliver-94 said:


> Owen was pretty underrated on the promo department IMO. Watching him and Bulldog argue before forming the Hart Foundation was hilarious. There was an interview on Shotgun Saturday between the two where Owen talks about their European title match, in which he lost, and he says he didn't try hard and he let Bulldog take the win.
> 
> Hart Foundation 1997 were brilliant. The whole logic and timing of the group was just perfect. Bulldog/Owen bust up nearly lost them their tag titles but then Bret comes in and reminds them that they are all family and America is trying to turn them against each other. Bret's heel turn too. I loved his promo after his cage match with Sid. It feels like that was the moment where he truly turned heel (that show was week prior to WM 13) even though he officially turned against Austin. He was getting screwed by Taker, Austin and HBK so he finally decided to snap and blame the fans for his frustrations. Pillman's introduction to the group was odd (he was the only American in the group) but I guess he joined due to his background with Austin.


Owen was always great on commentary. The best being when Austin and Bret were facing each other in Sun City. Very dry delivery, that makes me laugh, and is totally different from the way he presents himself in promos and during matches.

lol at "and he says he didn't try hard and he let Bulldog take the win."

As for the Hart Foundation, yeah, it's amazing to think of what WCW could have done, if they could have gotten all of them. Have Benoit join, and have them really run shit in WCW, and cause mayhem. I remember a thread about what WCW could have done differently, and it was filled with a million different ideas that could have been used. Oh well.

As for Pillman, didn't he train with the Harts? Not sure on that, but he played football up in Canada, and in Calgary specifically, so that explains that connection alone. Neidhart isn't really from Canada either.


@ smitty, cool, let us know your thoughts once you watch!


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

No good Cena DVD available. They all suck.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> Owen was always great on commentary. The best being when Austin and Bret were facing each other in Sun City. Very dry delivery, that makes me laugh, and is totally different from the way he presents himself in promos and during matches.
> 
> lol at "and he says he didn't try hard and he let Bulldog take the win."
> 
> ...


 Just searched for that interview and found it  

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x11z2pr_wwf-shotgun-saturday-night-03-15-1997_sport (skip to 24.00 for the Owen interview)

On Pillman, yeah he did train with the Harts. Never knew that he played football in Canada so I guess that explains that. Always thought he joined the Harts because they were feuding with Austin at the time. Died too soon unfortunetly and during his Goldust feud. Marlena would have turned on Goldust but instead, we saw Goldust turning on her and becoming a joke (he was dressing up as different wrestlers for the most of late 1997 and he was feuding with Mero for WM 14). Attitude Era would have been perfect for Pillman though. That psychotic entrance music and character were made for that time period.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cena hasn't gotten a straight up Doc, iirc. Or when he did it was WAY too soon for it. So now he's stuck with about 2-3 mediocre ones. Boourns.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Lots of good matches on that Edge DVD, LilOlMe. I own both Edge DVD's - and Decade of Decadence is much better for matches - and his other DVD (You Think You Know Me The Story of Edge) is more documentary based. I reviewed most of the matches on his Decade of Decadence DVD and posted them on here when I was doing my Edge project, but those posts would be several threads ago now as they were a while ago. 

Best matches on that DVD in my opinion are the ladder matches teaming with Christian, steel cage with Kurt Angle, street fight with HBK, street fight with Matt Hardy, hardcore match with Mick Foley from WrestleMania 22, and the 6 person hardcore match from One Night Stand 2006. There's also a few underrated matches on that set such as the triple threat from RAW between Edge, Cena and RVD when Edge wins his second WWE Title.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Oliver-94 said:


> Just searched for that interview and found it
> 
> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x11z2pr_wwf-shotgun-saturday-night-03-15-1997_sport (skip to 24.00 for the Owen interview)
> 
> On Pillman, yeah he did train with the Harts. Never knew that he played football in Canada so I guess that explains that. Always thought he joined the Harts because they were feuding with Austin at the time. Died too soon unfortunetly and during his Goldust feud. Marlena would have turned on Goldust but instead, we saw Goldust turning on her and becoming a joke (he was dressing up as different wrestlers for the most of late 1997 and he was feuding with Mero for WM 14). Attitude Era would have been perfect for Pillman though. That psychotic entrance music and character were made for that time period.


Watched, yeah, Owen was usually good. Shame his character sort of meandered about, toward the end there.

The Austin feud helps explain Pillman's involvement, but I do think a lot of it was the Hart training connection.

And yes, Pillman was perfectly suited for those times. He was an absolute blast to watch during the Canadian Stampede match. Worked the crowd like he was having the time of his life! And he was! From Meltzer:



Spoiler: spoiler



The greatest night of [Pillman's] career was July 6, 1997. The WWF was producing a less than two hour "In Your House" PPV from the Saddledome in Calgary.

The main event was the Hart Foundation facing usual babyfaces Austin & Goldust & Ken Shamrock & The Road Warriors. It was supposed to be a throwaway show, but instead was probably one of the greatest PPV shows in wrestling history.

He called after it was over, admitting he completely misread the landscape, absolutely loved being a babyface in Canada, and said nothing he had ever done in the business, the matches with Liger or Flair, the turning on Sting, compared to that night.




As for Bret's promo after the Sid match...that was the "this is bullshit!!!" promo, right? I remember that actually being really shocking at the time. At school, most people thought that that was real. I think that what made it most shocking was the fact that Bret's character was not one you'd expect to have an outburst like that. So it seemed really real at the time, especially since worked shoots weren't a popular part of the public's consciousness at that time.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Thanks, Nostalgia! I'm gonna go ahead and get it, and I'm saving your post, so I remember which matches stood out.

To you have a link to your old reviews? I'm not gonna read them first, though, because I generally don't like to be spoiled. I'd like to have them so I can go back and read them after I watch.


That other documentary looks interesting too. That might be one I get later, as it's not on sale right now.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Anything that's Edge vs Matt Hardy circa 2005 is worth owning.

Hands down.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> Thanks, Nostalgia! I'm gonna go ahead and get it, and I'm saving your post, so I remember which matches stood out.
> 
> To you have a link to your old reviews? I'm not gonna read them first, though, because I generally don't like to be spoiled. I'd like to have them so I can go back and read them after I watch.
> 
> ...


No problem - and I might see if I can find some of my old reviews for you.

Edge documentary is great btw. 



The Primer said:


> Anything that's Edge vs Matt Hardy circa 2005 is worth owning.
> 
> Hands down.


Yep, even though their best match inside the steel cage at Unforgiven 2005 isn't on either Edge DVD. But it's a good thing I own the greatest steel cage matches DVD to enjoy that classic match.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> Watched, yeah, Owen was usually good. Shame his character sort of meandered about, toward the end there.
> 
> The Austin feud helps explain Pillman's involvement, but I do think a lot of it was the Hart training connection.
> 
> ...


 That Meltzer quotation came from this article right here; http://www.wrestlingforum.com/class...-brian-pillman-long-interesting-sad-read.html

Very interesting article (It's long but definitely worth the read IMO). 

Agree on that Bret promo. Felt real and passionate from him. Well delivered as well, probably his best promo that year for me. The only real incident apprantly was when Vince and Bret had a fight outside of commentary when HBK announced himself as the special guest referee for the SS match between Bret and Taker. Not 100% sure if it was real but reading some reviews on 1997, some fans say it was legit.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nostalgia said:


> Yep, even though their best match inside the steel cage at Unforgiven 2005 isn't on either Edge DVD. But it's a good thing I own the greatest steel cage matches DVD to enjoy that classic match.


That's why I snag all the PPVs. Sets are only appealing to me for TV matches.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Quick thought, If I were to get one WWE PPV from 2005, which one should it be? I'm thinking SS,


Get Vengeance. It's one of only three PPVs that year that I felt was good from beginning to end. And my goodness, was it awesome even if my opinion on HBK/Angle and Cena/Jericho/Christian went down.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Unforgiven 2005 itself is a good PPV. Edge/Hardy and HBK/Masters are both excellent and solid, respectively. Cena/Angle is also alright even with the DQ finish. Admittedly, I'm drawing a blank for the rest without looking them up on wikipedia.

2005 PPVs in general were largerly enjoyable. No Mercy and Vengeance are two of the more consistent ones. The big four ones all delivered too.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

RR 05 rocks. WM 21 is half incredible and half shitty, overall great. Vengeance is definitely :mark:. Most of the other events have one, maybe 2 great matches on them and then a forgettable or bad undercard. But the GREAT PPV matches in 05 are fucking tremendous anyway. Worst show I can remember from 05 is probably ONS. Shitty original ECW crap.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Funny. Most would dub ONS as one of the best shows of the year. Standard Cal.

The year was really consistent. Even shows like GAB provided you with something worth seeing like Eddie vs Mysterio and Benoit taking Orlando Jordan to what I am 100% certain his best match. Yeah1993 put overs aside, still have to find those matches he was talking about with Jordan.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Oliver-94 said:


> That Meltzer quotation came from this article right here; http://www.wrestlingforum.com/class...-brian-pillman-long-interesting-sad-read.html
> 
> Very interesting article (It's long but definitely worth the read IMO).
> 
> Agree on that Bret promo. Felt real and passionate from him. Well delivered as well, probably his best promo that year for me. The only real incident apprantly was when Vince and Bret had a fight outside of commentary when HBK announced himself as the special guest referee for the SS match between Bret and Taker. Not 100% sure if it was real but reading some reviews on 1997, some fans say it was legit.


Yep, I read it. That's where I got the quote from!

Whenever Hart/Michaels/Vince were on screen, it was always interesting to watch the dynamics.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Primer said:


> Funny. Most would dub ONS as one of the best shows of the year. Standard Cal.
> 
> The year was really consistent. Even shows like GAB provided you with something worth seeing like Eddie vs Mysterio and Benoit taking Orlando Jordan to what I am 100% certain his best match. Yeah1993 put overs aside, still have to find those matches he was talking about with Jordan.


Most people would be morons . ONS had a hot crowd and a bunch of shity matches. Best parts of the show were all the SHOOTS~! and JBL beating the shit out of Blue Meanie :lmao.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

What about Sandman begging people for a beer as he was seemingly checking on Tommy Dreamer? Which proceeded to see Austin get annoyed and finally give him one of his own.

WHAT ABOUT THAT?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Sandman sucks.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Haven't watched the event in a while (I'm not a huge ECW guy), but wasn't Eddie vs. Benoit pretty BLEH compared to their usual matches? Hell, I don't even like Vengeance 03 THAT much, but I still think it's way better than their ONS match.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah, Eddie vs Benoit is bleh. Vengeance isn't too special, but that's a lot more interesting overall.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I <3 their Vengeance 03 match. Looking forward to seeing their Armageddon 02 match again soon. Main event of NWO 02 time! I'm one of the few who like the Jericho/Austin match so I'm looking forward to watching it again .


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Haven't seen NWO 2002 in forever. I remember being PISSED as a little kid because Angle won Triple H's WM shot at that PPV and then ended up wrestling Kane at Mania. :side: :angle2 

Currently deciding on what to watch now that I'm done with school for the week.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

More love needs to go to their incredible Nitro match from 1995.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Since it's now November, does that mean all the pink shirts and pink ring ropes can finally go away? Please?

Edit-.Hayley I give that match all the love in the world. It's my pick for the best sub 10 minute tv match ever. Amazing that they manage to work in an incredible control segment in that short time. And that power bomb Benoit gives Eddie :mark: :mark:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

2005 was a great year. I'm probably one of biggest marks for the WrestleMania 21 PPV here, three great matches (MITB, Orton/Taker and HBK/Angle) and I thought even Batista/HHH was good. You also had good segments such as Piper's pit and Hulk Hogan returning to take out Muhammad Hassan. The only bad points of the PPV were the sumo match, the women's match and the JBL/Cena match imo.



Cactus Jack said:


> Since it's now November, does that mean all the pink shirts and pink ring ropes can finally go away? Please?


Hopefully.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Eddie Guerrero Vs Chris Benoit - Nitro 16/10/1995 is :mark:. Was #23 on my WCW list. GOAT NITRO MATCH.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Eddie Guerrero Vs Chris Benoit - Nitro 16/10/1995 is :mark:. Was #23 on my WCW list. GOAT NITRO MATCH.



There is a fantastic Finlay/Benoit match from nitro that deserves some love too, but I'm with you there it just might be the best Nitro match ever.

Eddie and Rey had a fantastic Nitro match too, the one with Rey wearing the highlighter yellow gear.

Edit-Nostalgia, . Guess no such luck on that awful pink crap

Edit 2- Cena really is thuggin it on these promos lately.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Well, I'm guessing that SD only had pink because the show was taped in October. I'm really hoping that it all goes away soon.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

I have a lot of liquor left over from Halloween. I'm going to consume it while watching Royal Rumble 95 later tonight, wish me luck!


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Edit 2- Cena really is thuggin it on these promos lately.


I have a hard time feeling it with that awful pink shirt. Can you imagine Thuganomics Cena rapping about his opponents wearing that?

But hopefully he sticks to talking early 2005 style and gets rid of the pink after this week.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Only get drunk each time a new jobber enters the Rumble match. Rest of the show is fabulous.

and people need to quit dissing the pink rope. That's the best thing about watching WWE these days. Wished they were pink 24/7.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> I have a hard time feeling it with that awful pink shirt. Can you imagine Thuganomics Cena rapping about his opponents wearing that?
> 
> But hopefully he sticks to talking early 2005 style and gets rid of the pink after this week.



God me too. The pink ring rope is bad enough, but those fucking shirts have gotta go. It's a joke.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Cena with DAT BOSTON ACCENT and DEM JOKES on SD :cena4


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Jericho/Austin NWO 2002 is very good, so I can agree with KillaCal on that. ONS 2005 was also very good, so I cannot agree with KillaCal on that.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'll be honest I haven't even noticed all the PINK~! stuff in WWE :lmao. I skip the "employees talk about cancer" videos and don't seem to notice anything else .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Pink makes some of those shirts rad. Like Orton's. Holy crap I need it b/c of the pink.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I gotta be honest.....


I AM FUCKING PSYCHED FOR THE 6-MAN TAG ON SD TONIGHT!!! CENA/RHODES BROS VS SANDOW/REAL AMERICANS!!!! So happy I don't read spoilers, this should be EXCELLENT.

:lmao at Cena talking about Cesaros nips.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Almost certain that was done by John-boy before. Could be getting that mixed up with a joke my friend made instead.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Almost certain that was done by John-boy before. Could be getting that mixed up with a joke my friend made instead.


I think you might be confusing it, but maybe not. When Zeb came out he said "we haven't been formally introduced, but I'm Zeb Colter and we are the Real Americans"

I've made that comment before to my girlfriend though, also about Jericho's microscopic nips. Wow I spend way too much time thinking about wrestlers nipples.


Edit- booooo, why did they take REIGNS out and replace him with Ambrose? GIVE THE PEOPLE WHAT THEY WANT. GIVE THEM REIGNS.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I must say, the pink on Orton's shirt doesn't look nearly as bad as I'd expect. But then again, that's probably because the base color is not pink as that would just kill it like it has every other awful looking shirt the wrestlers are wearing.

lol @ thinking about wrestler's nipples. :lol Only time it has crossed my mind was the Survivor Series segment when some girl squeezes Orton's nipple and Flair goes "Aaaaaaaaaaahhh".


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*No Way Out 2002*

Show kicks off with the debut of the NWO in WWE! The NWO at NWO. They claim they are friendly.


*Scotty 2 Hotty & Albert Vs Christian & Lance Storm Vs The Hardy Boys Vs The Dudley Boys Vs Billy & Chuck Vs The APA - Tag Team Turmoil*

We go from the NWO to THE WORM AND THE HIP HOP HIPPO. Apparently the winning team gets a tag title shot at WM. I seem to recall a 4 way tag match at WM though :lmao.

GIANT SWING~! But Cesaro isn't in this match .

SPLAT. That's the noise made when Storm took a bump over the ropes. Ouch.

How on earth did Scotty last as long as he did in WWE lol? I mean, he survived talent cuts when Vince bought WCW and brought in some of those guys, he was out injured for a year and actually managed to come back... and he even held the tag titles in 04 going into WRESTLEMANIA 20 and retained them too!

Ah well, he and Albert are gone first, and next out is the Hardy Boys. AND FAP FAP LITA FAP FAP!!!

Standard stuff and then Christian and Storm are gone. Yawn.

STACY FAP FAP KEIBLER! Oh and that tag team she manages.

These 2 teams have been feuding since 2000. And JR continues to confuse Matt and Jeff, just like 2000!

RUSSIAN LEG SWEEP COMBINED WITH A SIDE EFFECT :mark:.

STACY AND LITA FAP FAP FAP FAP.

LITACANRANA~!

Matt escapes D-Von's finisher and rolls him up for the win. This part of the match was super fun. Both teams have amazing chemistry still and they get decent time given the kind of match.

Afterwards Matt gets attacked in the ring, and then Jeff gets a 3-D on the floor! Billy & Chuck are next in and they essentially have a handicap match against Matt!

SUPERKICK by Chuck is so devastating it knocks HIM down too! Fameasser and Matt is done.

APA :mark:. It all comes down to this!

If Billy & Chuck didn't get stuck with the **** tag gimmick, they could have been a really good team. Well they WERE still a good team but didn't have longevity with the gimmick nor were they taken too seriously. You have the veteran Billy, multi time tag champ and all that shit, then you have Chuck who is young with RAW POWER, a ton of potential, and takes direction well from Billy. A good combination allowing them to take on ANY team.

They do well controlling the APA, but in the end the APA are just too much with their power and insane love for FIGHTING. HOLY FUCKITY FUCK at the Clothesline from Hell to end the match! APA win! WM tag title shot!!!

Fun match. Doesn't hold a candle to the great 01 TTT at JD, but this is still good.

*Rating: **3/4*
*CAL SCALE - 1*


FLAIR~! UNDERTAKER~! TEASING WM MATCH~!


*Goldust Vs Rob Van Dam*

:mark: GOLDUST.

So this is the match that made me a Goldust fan as far as RING WORK goes. I'd only seen bits of his AE run and the matches I did see weren't very good (Vs HHH, mostly). It was only after he returned at the RR a month earlier and then had THIS kind of match with RVD that I became a fan. Just hope the match holds up now!!!

Goldust wastes NO TIME going after RVD, clotheslining him over the ropes the moment he steps into the ring! Well, takes him 2 attempts because RVD isn't able to go over the first time apparently :lmao.

The KICKS of RVD put him back on the offensive after being thrown over the ropes, so Goldust has to use those MIND GAMES to get back on top. He rolls out of the ring, then starts to leave, while RVD doesn't know what's going on. PLUS is stops the momentum that RVD was starting to build.

:lmao at Lawler talking about American Pie and how "One time, at Bandcap, I stuck a flute in my pussy" is his favourite movie line :lmao. 

:lmao at JR sounding disgusted by the question of whether or not he's seen American Pie :lmao.

Goldust's MIND GAMES didn't work out as well as he's have hoped... so Goldust takes a page out of Van Dam's book and flies off the ropes to the floor with a BIONIC ELBOW!

ASS BUMP TO THE FACE. RVD takes a good ass in the face! 

Holy fook, Goldust bending RVD's back over the ring post is BRUTAL :mark:.

Good back work from Goldy, though :lmao at him groaning while applying a hold, with RVD shaking around. Looks like he's humping him :lmao.

Comeback from RVD is stellar just because of how awesome Goldust takes all his offence and how he bumps from it all. 

5 STAR FROG SPLASH~! MISS~! DDT FROM FUCKING HELL!!! RVD takes a good ass in the face and is great at falling head first into the mat too! :lmao

CURTAIN CALL~! COUNTERED~!

Fun little finishing stretch between the two, then RVD wins with the Frog Splash with makes me sad.

But what doesn't make me sad is that this match still rules :mark:. ALL HAIL GOLDUST!

*Rating: ***1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 2*


*Test & Booker T Vs Tazz & Sipke Dudley - WWF Tag Team Titles Match*

Nice fast start to this one, with Test trying to kill Tazz. I find it pretty :lmao that Tazz is crawling to the ropes and the guy he gets to tag to save him is SPIKE DUDLEY. Might as well have a bloody handicap match .

Spike gets killed for a few minutes. Booker T sucks. Nothing new here lol.

Match ends a while later. Tazz and Spike win. This was crappy tbh. Tazz looked sloppy as fuck. Booker sucked. Test was the best guy in it. Spike took a decent beating but nothing special or worth mentioning from him.

*Rating: 1/2**
*CAL SCALE - 0*


Rock cuts a promo. GENERIC ROCK RAMBLINGS~!


*Edge Vs William Regal - Brass Knucks on a Poll WWF Intercontinental Championship Match*

:mark:. Their Vengeance match is amazing. Their RR match is amazing. I do remember this being the weakest of the 3... but still fucking great.

VICIOUS EDGE is nice to see again. I seem to recall a great deal if not all of his 02 after the Regal series as being more of ATHLETE EDGE with counters and reversals and finishing stretches rather than trying to fucking maul his opponent.

He's pissed off because Regal caused some INTERNAL BLEEDING a few weeks back. So he's taking the FIGHT to Regal to try and end this quickly, but Regal gets some shots in and then begins to work the mid section over which will further exasperate the injuries :mark:.

:mark: Edge takes one hell of a bump off the top rope onto the barricade. DOUBLE UNDERHOOK POWERBOMB ON THE FLOOR :mark:. EDGE IS BLEEDING INTERNALLY :mark:.

REGAL STRETCH~! DOUBLE UNDERHOOK POWERBOMB~! Regal can't get the win via submission or pinfall with those moves... so he finally decides to climb the poll, only to end up crotch first on the ropes!

Regal goes for a powerbomb ON THE APRON, and Edge gets a sort of hurricanrana counter when he holds onto the ropes and just rolls his legs forward and flips Regal over onto the floor! LOOKED NASTY.

ELBOWS TO THE STOMACH :mark:. ELBOWS TO THE FACE :mark:. REGAL GRABS THE KNUCKS!!! But Edge gives him a back superplex before he can use them!

Both men are down and the knucks are in the middle of the ring for anyone to grab! Regal kicks them outside away from Edge, then ends up getting SPEARED!!!

With Regal down, Edge goes outside for the knucks, but Regal decks him when he gets back in and gets the 3 count! Regal had a pair in his penis!!!

:mark: Not as lengthy as I would have liked, but they gets lots of great stuff in, work the gimmick nicely and Regal attacking the injured Edge is :mark:. Good stuff no doubt, but still definitely the weaker of their PPV trilogy.

*Rating: ***1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 3*


KURT ANGLE IS GONNA BE HHH'S DADDY.


*The Undertaker Vs The Rock*

:mark: UNDERTAKER :mark:.

2002 Heel Undertaker = :mark:.

Undertaker TOMBSTONING ROCK ONTO A CAR = :mark:.

Rock runs down to the ring to take it straight to the Dead Man, and does well for about 20 seconds until he runs face first into the boot of the GOAT.

:mark: Undertaker driving his forearm into the back of Rock's head and crushing it into the mat looks SICK. This is what happens when you DISRESPECT THE DEAD MAN.

Undertaker is working the HEAD of Rock, smart stuff since he Tombstoned him on the car just a few days ago I believe it was. Plus it means plenty of strikes to Rock's head :mark:. CAVE HIS FUCKING SKULL IN :mark:.

Undertaker: "YOU WANNA GET UP?" *Kicks Rock in the head* "YOU WANNA GET UP?" :mark:.

Rock starts to get on a roll, and he begins to focus on UNDERTAKER'S head now as revenge. Undertaker selling shots to his head is :mark:.

:mark: Undertaker crotches Rock on the barricade then just sits on the ring steps and looks on at him disgusted :lmao. UNDERTAKER IS AMAZING. Then he sets Rock up for a HUGE right hand, looks around at the "people" and then cracks him in the face and sends him over the barricade to the concrete floor.

:lmao at the little spot with the doors. Fairly certain Undertaker was just fucking with the camera man :lmao.

Have I mentioned that UNDERTAKER FUCKING RULES? Because he does, ya know.

Well, it has happened. Someone made the BEARHUG rule. Guess who? UNDERTAKER YOU DUMB FUCKS.

Rock makes his comeback, and even hits a LOW BLOW right in front of the referee... who does fuck all.

JR: "UNDERTAKER JUST GOT HIT IN DEATH VALLEY" :lmao.

CHOKESLAM~! 2 count only . So Undertaker goes to "sit" on his bike, looking all suspicious. The ref comes out to see what he's up to and ends up flying into the steel steps :lmao.

LED PIPE! Flair comes down to stop him and gets DECKED in the face! Rock recovers enough to counter and locks in the Sharpshooter type move he does!

VINCE MCMAHON~! He distracts the referee and The Rock, but then Flair cracks 'Taker in the head with the pipe! Rock Bottom! Rock... wins? BOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!! 

Aside from this finish, this rocks!!! Undertaker is just fucking incredible ever second of the match. Rock holds his own too btw. And his Sharpshooter actually looks the best it's ever looked as well!

*Rating: ****1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 6*


*Triple H Vs Kurt Angle - Special Guest Referee Stephanie McMahon - WrestleMania Title Match on the Line*

FAP FAP FAP FAP STEPHANIE FAP FAP FAP FAP. She looks AMAZING in some super short shorts and a referee top with her tits hanging out.

Match starts and Angle keeps trying to roll up HHH with Stephanie going down quick (hahahahahFAP) to make the count.

:lmao the crowd are chanting "take your shirt off" to Stephanie. PERVERTS.

Shitty brawling. Shitty brawling. Kurt accidentally knocks Stephanie over the ropes and she died or something. HHH waves her off with his crotch in Angle's face. LOL. Normal referee now. Boooo. Tim White isn't nearly as FAPABLE as Stephanie.

Shitty brawling. SUPLEXES~! MORE SUPLEXES~! A COUPLE OF EXTRA SUPLEXES JUST FOR GOOD LUCK~!

YEY SLEEPER HOLD!!! Ah well, a rest spot at least cuts down on the shitty brawling and SUPLEXES for a minute or so .

STEPHANIE FAP FAP IS BACK . Aaaand gets knocked out again straight away. Booooo.

Ref bump. Ref bump. Ref bump. Ref bump. Shenanigans. Suplexes. Shitty brawling. Steel chair. Screwjob. Angle wins. And that is the entire match summed up. Also, shit.

HHH cums out of his mouth at the end of something.

*Rating: 1/4**
*CAL SCALE - 0*


Rock mocks the NWO. I hope they run into him with a big truck or something.


*Chris Jericho Vs Steve Austin - WWF Undisputed Championship Match*

First 5 minutes or so see Austin in control mostly. Plenty of punches and chops lol. Jericho keeps getting some shots in but Austin cuts him off all the time.

BRAWLING UP BY THE STAGE~! Austin seems to be treating this more like a 99/99 AE match lol. Which sucks. 

Austin trying to superplex Jericho from every corner is :mark:. Wish more people would try that these days lol. Would probably work well for Daniel Bryan.

Poor Jericho. His entire title run was booked with him as the underdog champion. Which isn't good for a heel :lmao. This reminds me a little of Undertaker/HHH from Insurrextion with Austin never giving Jericho THAT much heat, but at least he does give him SOME. HHH fucked Undertaker far too much in their match. So Undertaker beat him 2 years in a row at WM 8*D.

LOL Austin totally rules this match. Not in the awesome way, I mean that he dominates everything and survives EVERYTHING Jericho throws at him including the Walls, Lionsault and a BREAKDOWN ON THE BELT.

STUNNER~! Ref is out though (how many ref bumps in the last 3 matches lol?), so the NWO show up and maul Austin. Jericho picks up the win.

I used to like this . Now I don't. Boooo.

*Rating: *1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 0.5*



*Overall CAL SCALE - 12.5*​


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> Edit- booooo, why did they take REIGNS out and replace him with Ambrose? GIVE THE PEOPLE WHAT THEY WANT. GIVE THEM REIGNS.


b/c...oh, well you'll see. It's inevitable guys. 

----------

Now Cal Naughton Jr. doesn't like Austin vs Jericho. Awesome :lmao


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Cactus Jack said:


> I've made that comment before to my girlfriend though, also about Jericho's microscopic nips. Wow I spend way too much time thinking about wrestlers nipples.


I'll never look at Chris Jericho the same again. :jericho


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Aint going out today, sick of wearing my costume already

On schedule
DAT sd main event
Gta 5
and.................... some other type of wrestling I dont know at this point


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I looked up some of my old reviews, turns out I did a lot of 2002 before. Gave Kidman/Tajiri from Backlash **1/2 last time :lmao.

Undertaker so far in 02 is :mark:. 6 PPV's down, and he's in the entire top 5 for the year so far! One match is the RR, but he did awesome in it during his time so I have no problem using it as an example of his awesomeness . Can't see anyone beating him for PPV Wrestler of the Year in 02 when I know the uber fun triple threat is coming up and the Unforgiven match with Lesnar. Shame he'll also be in 2 of the biggest stinkers too though .


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Ugh. Hopefully they don't pull the trigger on Reigns too early. If you're watching SD right now, you'll know what I'm talking about  :reigns


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I wasn't nearly as keen on the Rock match as you. Thought it was solid, but suffered from a real uninteresting middle. Undertaker had a patch there in the first half of 2002 on PPV that I didn't care for. Rock match being what it was, then the DUDs vs Austin & Triple H. Once Vengeance happened it was smooth sailing.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

I remember NWO 2002 as the PPV with the two big ass trucks as a stage prop


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The fuck man. A Shield split already???? Damn man.

If anything, they shouldn't have a real split, they should just go off into singles contests and bring the band back together every once in a while when it calls for it.

I don't understand why Reigns is being positioned for the face turn. They should turn Rollins face and Reigns heel. They need more MONSTERS in the WWE, and I feel like Reigns can be a terrific, glorious, ass hole heel. Rollins bumps/sells too well to be a heel for long. His bumps just give him too much sympathy. Ah, oh well, I'm just old school like that. This is the same company that had a Kane vs Xpac match where Xpac was the heel and Kane the face.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Reigns bursting through right now is making me look at WWE as if they're seeing the next Batista. Big dude, has his traits that they like, etc. Only Reigns' presence >>>>> So he has that strong suit lasting for him. _(never bought into Batista until he finally went heel)_ Fear he'll get pushed too soon, too. While I like his work much more from a personal standpoint, there is the risk of letting him wing it when he clearly isn't 100% ready to lead just yet in the singles game. Looked stellar vs Danielson. That's vs Danielson, of course. They all look at their best with him. I see no reason why he shouldn't remain with Rollins for a bit longer as he continues to grow. Or Ambrose even to keep him a heel. Rollins or Reigns both have their appeals as a babyface, but if I had to chose one role for the other, I'd play it safe and keep Reigns the beast that he is & let Seth branch out to get the fans behind him. 

All in all I'm not feeling the split right now. It's been nearly a year, yet it still feels a bit too soon.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

About the pink shirts, I cant decide between the ziggler/cesaro/swagger/bryan to buy


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Reigns bursting through right now is making me look at WWE as if they're seeing the next Batista. Big dude, has his traits that they like, etc. Only Reigns' presence >>>>> So he has that strong suit lasting for him. _(never bought into Batista until he finally went heel)_ Fear he'll get pushed too soon, too. While I like his work much more from a personal standpoint, there is the risk of letting him wing it when he clearly isn't 100% ready to lead just yet in the singles game. Looked stellar vs Danielson. That's vs Danielson, of course. They all look at their best with him. I see no reason why he shouldn't remain with Rollins for a bit longer as he continues to grow. Or Ambrose even to keep him a heel. Rollins or Reigns both have their appeals as a babyface, but if I had to chose one role for the other, I'd play it safe and keep Reigns the beast that he is & let Seth branch out to get the fans behind him.
> 
> All in all I'm not feeling the split right now. It's been nearly a year, yet it still feels a bit too soon.




Couldn't have said it better myself, my feelings exactly.

Another thing, WWE is finally getting the Tag team division popping, why get rid of Rollins/Reigns now? That's their best team, and along with Hell No one of the best teams they have had in a LONG time. I think they should let the Shield marinate some more, it's only been a year, and Reigns has the least amount of experience out of all of them. Maybe let him have occasional singles contests just to build his craft, but I think the Shield should be together for another 6 months minimum. They just rule on all levels, and along with Danielson, Heyman, Punk, and Rhodes Bros are my favorite part of the show these days. So many things are geared toward the kids, Shield is definitely for that 18-34 male demo I'm a part of. Throw us a bone.

I worry they will do the same thing with Cesaro. That man absolutely needs to be pushed as a top heel, not turned and thrown to the bottom of the baby face heap.

On another note, I fucking love Luke Harper. That guy has a future. His clothesline and big boot are just :mark: :mark: Looks like WWE likes him too, as he seems to finish all the matches and get the pinfalls


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cesaro shirt is bossy. I don't mind the cause, but the text on the back is the only buzzkill. His logo in pink is just too cool.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Ah shit I just noticed that ( on shop.com rn) what is wwe fixation with putting crappy designs on the back of their shirts


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Fuck a shield split happened on SD? good thing I recorded it . WAIT WHAT THE FUCK REIGNS IS A FUCKING FACE....

Decided to wait until tomorrow to get WWE 2K14 so I can watch wrestling tonight. Watched a little bit of my WM 23 DVD

MITB match: ***3/4
Kane vs Khali: DUD 
MVP vs Benoit: ***1/4
Taker vs Batista: ****1/2

Tempted to go ****3/4 on Taker/Batista but stuck with 41/2, such a fucking good match. Benoit/MVP was FUN as shit, and I always liked the MITB match. Will most likely finish tomorrow, not doing a write up though. 

Anyways, watching NWO 2002, Goldust/RVD is on, review shall be up later tonight. Doing the Fuckfest called Insurrection next, then JD. Then its onto Vengeance and the big 3 :mark:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

They better chill on letting Orton bury Miz, if he keeps going it's going to turn him completely baby face :lmao

Nothing is better than watching Miz get verbally buried then beaten down on his own stupid show. Best gimmick ever. It truly is what's best for business.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao :lmao :lmao

Why ziggles ? why ?


Pumped for the main event though


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I'm yet to reach Orton's burial of Miz. Finished the Shield match and now Sandow just interrupted the Cena/Real Americans segment. Been enjoying the Cena promos this week, hope he keeps this instead of that shitty "humble guy" gimmick he's been using in the past few years with that "I am who I am, boo me if you want" crap.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> I'm yet to reach Orton's burial of Miz. Finished the Shield match and now Sandow just interrupted the Cena/Real Americans segment. Been enjoying the Cena promos this week, hope he keeps this instead of that shitty "humble guy" gimmick he's been using in the past few years with that "I am who I am, boo me if you want" crap.



Ugh, those promos are the worst. "sometimes they boo and sometimes they cheer but they always know that I give everything I have in the ring!" Fuck off Cena, who do you think you are, a 1980's white meat baby face? He's so much better than that. Dude can talk with the best of them when he wants, he doesn't need to be doing that kinda crap.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

smitty915 said:


> Fuck a shield split happened on SD? good thing I recorded it . WAIT WHAT THE FUCK REIGNS IS A FUCKING FACE....


No split, just a tease.

My body is ready for this main event. :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Ugh, those promos are the worst. "sometimes they boo and sometimes they cheer but they always know that I give everything I have in the ring!" Fuck off Cena, who do you think you are, a 1980's white meat baby face? He's so much better than that. Dude can talk with the best of them when he wants, he doesn't need to be doing that kinda crap.


Exactly. This one was a good example of it. Him just being out there having fun and cracking jokes, that's the kind of Cena I enjoy as a face.

Just got done with the MizTV segment. Orton's burial of The Mike was hilarious. :lmao "Nobody cares about your stupid MizTV", hahaha.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Didn't catch Orton burying Moz because I was busy.

SD's attendance looks great. Wonder why... :cena5

EDIT: CESARO.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Exactly. This one was a good example of it. Him just being out there having fun and cracking jokes, that's the kind of Cena I enjoy as a face.
> 
> Just got done with the MizTV segment. Orton's burial of The Mike was hilarious. :lmao "Nobody cares about your stupid MizTV", hahaha.




I could seriously watch people bury Miz all day. The guy is probably the biggest fluke of a champion ever, and had one of the worst WM main event matches ever. He got all the chances in the world and blew it. Nobody is a fucking Miz fan, yet he gets twice the exposure and TV time of guys like Cesaro, Ziggler, etc. You know, guys with talent. All of this is to say, I will never ever feel bad for Miz while I watch him get verbally buried and squashed by guys like Orton. His career has been 10x better than what he deserves. 

It's too bad they can't get a time machine, bring back 2003 Hollywood Rock, and have him come out every week on MizTV and cut a promo on him. Or better yet go back to 1985 and just bring the Hot Rod out :lmao. "YOU DO NOT THROW ROCKS AT A MAN WITH A MACHINE GUN!"


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Six-man tag main event on SD was really, really good. I'm all for Real Americans being involved in long six-man tags 

The Cesaro/Cena sequences in particular were :mark:. I hope they work with each other for the WHC down the road.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Got an hour left in NWO 2002, Looking to be very bad on the CAL scale, which makes me scared about how bad Insurrection will be,considering it got like 0 on Cals review :lmao. 

HHH/Angle starting...now. Not looking forward to this


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

PGSucks said:


> Six-man tag main event on SD was really, really good. I'm all for Real Americans being involved in long six-man tags
> 
> The Cesaro/Cena sequences in particular were :mark:. I hope they work with each other for the WHC down the road.



God how refreshing would THAT be, a guy who absolutely deserves it getting a spot to shine. 

***3/4 for the 6 Man Tag on SD. I'm a sucker for Main Event tags with long FIP segments and smoking hot tags. Cody Rhodes has one of the prettiest moonsaults I've ever seen. Just absolutely perfect form, looks great every time he does it. Props to him for continuing to add to and establish a varied move set. He's got all the ability in the world in the ring.

I feel it needs to be said, Jack Swagger is criminally underrated in the ring by the majority of the viewing audience. The guy is a great worker, I hope he succeeds in the future and keeps his personal life in check.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*No way out 2002 review​*
*
Match #1: tag team turmoil, Scottie II Hottie & Albert vs. Christian & Lance Storm vs The Hardy boys vs the Dudleyz vs Billy and Chuck vs the APA *

Man this should be fun as shit, I love these types of matches, even liked the one from the NOC kickoff a lot, possibly my MOTN for that train wreck of a show TBH. Yeah this match is pretty fun, but I really am biased because tag wrestling is one of my favorite things ever, although I do think all teams in at once>separate teams, I just like the chaos better. Anyways this is fun but it isn’t…great by any means. Its honestly just a bunch of average little matches with different competitors, I still like it though . ** ¾* 

*CAL SCALE: 1 *

*Match # 2: Goldust vs RVD*

:mark: this should be awesome! Cal gave this a good score in his review so Ihope or good things here! Yeah this shit is fucking good, nothing that screams out at you TBH but a very solid match overall. I love both guys in the ring and I think this might be a RVD match that is a little underrated, as I never hear anyone talk about it. I would say the same for Goldie but the fact is that he is just UNDERRATED AS FUCK in general, well up until this current run at least. Goldust made his big return at the RR last month, which he was excellent in, just like this one. Goldie better be on the fuckin mania card, but from memory he isn’t . Anyways the match is a solid one IMO and is a good recommendation to fans of either guy. ***1/2

*CAL SCALE: 2*

*Match # 3: Booker T and TEST vs Taz and Spike Dudley *

Fuck I don’t want to watch this, but I really don’t want to slap a NO on a match that could potentially be solid. Wait who am I kidding? This will suck shit, it’s fucking Booker T and Goldust isn’t here! Man, I must be like some sort of magical being, because this was fucking garbage! The difference is so obvious here of when the tag division started getting good, Okay the opener was decent, but tag matches would be getting **** ratings later on in the year, shows you that the company was so fucked up at this point and once Austin split they got desperate, thank God for LESNAR and HBK. ¼* 

*CAL SCALE: 0 *

*Match # 4: Edge vs William Regal*

:mark:, doubt that this will be as good as the awesome RR match considering it’s a ….BRASS KNUCKLES ON A POLL MATCH? The fuck is that supposed to mean? WHY CAN’T THIS BE A REGULAR OR NO DQ STIP? . Anyways this should still be good nonetheless, but I am going in with lower expectations than I did the RR match. Yeah so the stip for this seems to me like you have to grab brass knuckles off a pole to win? That’s fucking dumb but whatever. Oh I guess I was wrong, the brass knuckles are just their to be there and win by pinfall, ok.., still kinda stupid TBH. Well this match is actually good thank goodness and the stip was unnecessary as shit but didn’t really take away from the match too much. *** ½* 

*CAL SCALE: 3 *

*Match # 5: the Rock vs undertaker*

According to CAL this is a great match, I call bullshit because simply he is A UNDERTAKAH MAHK! This should be OK though, I love taker but lately have been WAY down on some Rock matches, guy simply is inconsistent in my mind. Ironically this match was the same exact thing, INCONSISTENT! Fuck, it would drag me in, then bore the absolute shit out of me, but it was decent overall. Definitely disagree with cal’s praises simply because its average at best in my mind, it had nothing that really dragged me in unfortunately, which is rare for a taker match TBH. The ending to this match was awesome though, and swear it makes it go from a OK match to a really good match, the last 5-10 minutes of the match were :mark: all the way, got the crowd hyped too. ***1/2

*CAL SCALE: 3 *

*Match # 6: HHH vs Kurt Angle*

I actually like these two at the Rumble in 2001, it’s a solid ***3/4 match IMO. Cal hated this match, si I’m guessing its not as good, which is unfortunate . Anyways Stephanie looks hot as FUCK, I don’t usually point that shit out in reviews, but god damn shes looking good . I personally thought this wasn’t too bad, it definitely wasn’t good by any means, but it wasn’t bad either, maybe it was the fact that I went it with CRAZY low expectations or I just have bad taste /. Anyways I really don’t get the DUD or ¼* ratings for this match as I thought it was decent TBH. ** ½* 
CAL SCALE: 1

*Match # 7: Chris Jericho vs Stone Cold Steve Austin*

Alright, one more match here and I can move on to something else! I’ll be honest and say that I don’t really have a ton of interest in this match. I don’t know why, but I just am dreading watching it. But since I do not want to slap a NO on the main event just for shits and giggles I’ll just watch it. The only thing that really caught my attention in the very beginning of the match is the fact that the WHAT thing is way more over than it is now, but it’s not shitty because it had just started so it was bound to be over. Anyways I actually liked this. Don’t get the hate here as well and liked the ending as well with the NWO costing Austin the match, which would eventually set up Hall vs Austin at mania. *** ¼* 

*CAL SCALE: 2* 

*TOTAL CAL SCALE: 12
*
*CURRENT 2002 PPV MOTY: Brock Lesnar vs the Undertaker HIAC(No mercy) *

*Current 2002 PPV rankings 
1: rebellion(20)
2: The Royal rumble(18)
3: No mercy(15.5)
4: Armageddon(15.5)
5: Unforgiven(15) 
6: No way out(12)
7: Backlash(11.5)
8: King of the ring(10.5)​*


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

***3/4 for the 6-man tag. Excellent match... though it wouldn't make my top 10 and I'd put several tag matches above it this year. Just goes to show what an awesome year we've had. But it's definitely worth a watch.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Sandrone said:


> ***3/4 for the 6-man tag. Excellent match... though it wouldn't make my top 10 and I'd put several tag matches above it this year. Just goes to show what an awesome year we've had. But it's definitely worth a watch.


Absolutely, I definitely think Battleground and the Raw afterwards between Rhodes Bros/Shield was better, possibly Shield/Usos MitB Opener, possibly Hell No/Shield Raw in May. Damn, we have had a ton of good tags this year. Thank god too. Singles matches will always get the publicity and shine, but it's hard to beat a well executed tag that uses that old school FIP/Hot Tag formula I love so much.

The Shield, Hell No, and Rhodes Bros revitalized a dead tag division this year, and god bless em' for it. Even teams like Real Americans, Wyatt Family, and (ugh) The Usos helped out. Shame Henry/Show never got off the ground and I've yet to form an opinion on Los Matadores.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

It's interesting to think whether or not the Shield would still hold the tag titles and if their break-up would be teased at this point if it weren't for the Rhodes catching fire. I don't think Black and Wight would've taken the tag titles. :rollins :reigns :ambrose


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

PGSucks said:


> It's interesting to think whether or not the Shield would still hold the tag titles and if their break-up would be teased at this point if it weren't for the Rhodes catching fire. I don't think Black and Wight would've taken the tag titles. :rollins :reigns :ambrose



That's fucking excellent, :lmao Black and Wight. I had been calling them Black Show because I couldn't think of a better name, but Black & Wight kills it.


----------



## GOON (Jan 23, 2010)

Just started watching the 2003 Royal Rumble for my 2003 Pay Per View project. Big Show/Bork Laser is dope.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

GOON The Legend said:


> Just started watching the 2003 Royal Rumble for my 2003 Pay Per View project. Big Show/Bork Laser is dope.


Looking forward to your project, hope your Steiner/HHH review is hilarious :lol.

SD ME: ***3/4

watching Mankind/taker HIAC, I legit haven't seen it yet, Maybe I'll start Insurrection 2002 after this...


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

Main event on Smackdown was fun. I will be upset if Cody and Cesaro don't become main event stars.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Watching Insurrextion 20002, only one match in and its pretty bad, but most likely will wind up MOTN. I really want to get this shit over with so I might have a review up later tonight, but I probably will just flick on a different PPV to watch and finish this tomorrow. 

Thinking about watching SVS 2009, thoughts?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Smackdown main event was pretty enjoyable. So much talent in that ring. I really hope we see Cesaro vs Cena in the future. ★★★½.

Rewatched Orton burying Moz and it's still extremely funny. :lol A ★★★★★ segment right there!


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Watched a pair of Punk/Big Show matches that time and DAMN these two have some good david Vs goliath chemistry, Punk sells Show's superior size like no other. The match these two have in the summer of 2012 is bossy as all fuck and a great **** 1/4*. Some more ratings for PUNK matches I've watched recently for this little project of mine:

CM Punk Vs Daniel Bryan (Over The Limit 2012) ~ ***** 1/4*
CM Punk Vs Alberto Del Rio Vs The Miz (TLC 2011) ~ **** 3/4*
CM Punk Vs Daniel Bryan (RAW 1/30/2012) ~ **** 1/4*
CM Punk Vs Jack Swagger (RAW 1/9/2012) ~ ****

This week's Street Fight with Ryback then I'm open to suggestions, Punk matches I should watch?


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Watched a pair of Punk/Big Show matches that time and DAMN these two have some good david Vs goliath chemistry, Punk sells Show's superior size like no other. The match these two have in the summer of 2012 is bossy as all fuck and a great **** 1/4*. Some more ratings for PUNK matches I've watched recently for this little project of mine:
> 
> CM Punk Vs Daniel Bryan (Over The Limit 2012) ~ ***** 1/4*
> CM Punk Vs Alberto Del Rio Vs The Miz (TLC 2011) ~ **** 3/4*
> ...


Watch Punk/ Kane from Smackdown in 2012. Much better than the ryback match if you're looking for Punks matches with big men. And of course his Raw match with Henry as well.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Thinking about watching SVS 2009, thoughts?


Havent seen the whole event but the triple threat is glorious


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Watched a pair of Punk/Big Show matches that time and DAMN these two have some good david Vs goliath chemistry, Punk sells Show's superior size like no other. The match these two have in the summer of 2012 is bossy as all fuck and a great **** 1/4*. Some more ratings for PUNK matches I've watched recently for this little project of mine:
> 
> CM Punk Vs Daniel Bryan (Over The Limit 2012) ~ ***** 1/4*
> CM Punk Vs Alberto Del Rio Vs The Miz (TLC 2011) ~ **** 3/4*
> ...


Watch the Hardy series! 

GAB
NOC
SS
SD cage 

All of those are FUN

@skins: think I'll watch the whole thing and review soon, especially if the ME is good.

EDIT: 2 matches in and Insurrextion 2002 is -0.5 on the cal scale :lmao. looks like bradshaw vs X-pac wont do much either..


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Watch the Hardy series!
> 
> GAB
> NOC
> ...




That's always fun. 

GAB ?
NOC ***3/4
SS: ****
Cage: ***3/4


How was their GAB match?  I don't remember much of it. I only remember the ABSOLUTE AMAZINGNESS of Jericho/ Mysterio that night which still holds at ****1/2 :mark


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I honestly forget too, I remember liking it though.

I remember Jericho/Rey and how bad HHH/Orton 3SOH was :lol.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Punk vs Hardy Steel Cage. One of the pinnacle Punk matches within WWE. +1 on that.

I need something to watch myself. Not sure what. Could be more 1998 for a nostalgia trip, even if it's poor work wise. I'm not sure. Open to suggestions now. Knowing I got some Chikara on the horizon atm too.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Punk vs Hardy Steel Cage. One of the pinnacle Punk matches within WWE. +1 on that.
> 
> I need something to watch myself. Not sure what. Could be more 1998 for a nostalgia trip, even if it's poor work wise. I'm not sure. Open to suggestions now. Knowing I got some Chikara on the horizon atm too.


Bret vs Owen series :lenny

Was gonna list but you know them


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

WM X
SummerSlam '94 Steel Cage
Action Zone '94
RAW '95 No Holds Barred
RAW late '96

This can be done. :hmm:


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Punk Vs Kane from Smackdown 6/1/12 was sick, sick shit. Punk going out there and showing exactly why he was WOTY in 2012 by playing the babyface in peril to a tee when it isn't even his strong point. Punk ALWAYS delivers against big men seemingly on a Rey Mysterio like level, checking out the 6/4/12 RAW match between the two now with Bryan on commentary, ***** for the Smackdown one .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The Primer said:


> WM X
> SummerSlam '94 Steel Cage
> Action Zone '94
> RAW '95 No Holds Barred
> ...


Is action zone one of the two Owen vs bret matches(along with WM X) on the older Bret set? if not, add that one immediately, great match. I think it was in like White plains NY?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That's the one. Match I've watched the most from 'em. Fabulous. Def my personal favorite.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I haven't seen the two RAW matches you listed, are they any good? I'm assuming they are because its like the best goddamn chemistry ever.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

No Holds Barred is really good/borderline great iirc. A rewatch will be good to relive my opinion on that. The final match in '96 is good, but probably their weakest by sheer default of being only nine minutes & ending in DQ. You still can't go wrong with them having a sprint.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Hmm, will have to watch and review them all once I'm done with these 2002 reviews, that'll be a short project but Its one I need to do. 

Speaking of 2002 PPVS, I HATE INSURREXTION 2002. Only like an hour in but its fucking terrible. I honestly do not think a match will go above **


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I have to watch Eddie vs RVD & Bradshaw vs X-Pac still. Watched the rest of it on a whim a few months ago. Only thing I liked was Hardys vs Brock & lolStasiak. Brock killing the Hardys was always a good time; Hardys were good first foils for him.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Eddie vs RVD and X-pac/Bradshaw are both ** right now, tied at MOTN


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

That Raw NHB 95 is all love , just watched it :homer, why do more pimp it, haven't seen the wm X match in ages but that's Way better than the cage

Love the action zone match as well


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Two less than positive reviews on Eddie vs RVD isn't putting the odds in their favor. That's a shame.

I'm expecting Bradshaw vs X-Pac to be fun. Got a lot of factors behind it I look for in a match. Last Bradshaw vs juniors match I watched was a a good bit of fun, so it's a formula I'm confident in.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Big problem for Eddie/RVD is the finish TBH, and the fact that most of it is pretty boring. 

This Stasiak/lesnar vs Hardyz is fun though


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

(Y)

Brock was a winner from day one. Early work was about as good as anyone I can remember.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Have you seen any of his work from OVW? I haven't but I know some people(Punk) can have good gems in OVW too

Tempted to just throw a NO on the rest of this show


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Seen bits and pieces. Punk's run down there is something I've seen the most of as far as a pre-WWE tenure circa OVW goes.

That might be for the best. Undertaker vs Trips is off from the moment the bell rang. Finish is so out of nowhere b/c I think they felt after fourteen minutes, they had no idea what to do.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Think I'll watch Spike/Regal to see if Regal is buried in his home country :lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'll be awaiting the answer I expect in about five minutes.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

DAMN. Spike like breaks his foot and STILL wins. Fuck that haha


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

WWF/WWE always crapping on the hometown guys. It never fails. Punk should believe in luck after he's won two big PPV matches in Chicago.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Royal Rumble match 1995 is not that bad at all. Just finished watching it. It's actually pretty fun.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I don't mind it either. Apparently the field of people in it turn folks off. Which is weird. I know there are a lot of goofy gimmicks in it, but I swear, the sooner people realize the Rumble is only about five guys tops, the sooner some wouldn't have a gripe like that. But, that's just me.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:show properly buried Punk in Chicago in 2010. Then rton2 almost finished the job. Thankfully, the good heart of :cena2 ended Punk's misery.

I hated Rock/Taker and HHH/Angle every time I watched them. Maybe a rewatch is in need, but all I remember from those matches were horrible babyface performances.

Punk/Hardy at The Bash is really good. I have a feeling that years from now, people will appreciate it's greatness. Evan, go watch Punk/Sheamus tag matches from 2012.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

****1/4 for the 6 Man SD Main Event. This was some amazing work by Cena, he gave Sandow his best match ever and put over the RA. Also, Goldust hitted some nice moves too, Cody kinda invisible here


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Oh I could name the times Punk fell in Chi-town, but once he reached the level he did he got his wins there to make up for it. Toss in the losses to Jericho in 2008 _(when he was World Champ)_ & to Ziggler in the final RAW of 2011. Classic WWE.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

SpookshowTony said:


> I kept going back on whether or not Hogan/Warrior should be seen due to previous negative views involving Mr. Warrior Warrior, but I'm glad I did.


Hogan/Warrior is probably my #1 favorite WWE Title match in Mania history. Such an incredible match with an incredible atmosphere. False finishes were amazing for 1990.



LilOlMe said:


> smitty, you've never seen Hogan/Warrior before, or you're re-watching?
> 
> *Jack Evans, forgot to say that I'm waiting on watching Bret/Taker from '92, because I ordered the Dungeon Collection, so I'll just wait until I get that to watch that.*


Tell me, did you get the blu ray? Cause I hope you got the blu ray. 



smitty915 said:


> Watching Insurrextion 20002, only one match in and its pretty bad, but most likely will wind up MOTN. I really want to get this shit over with so I might have a review up later tonight, but I probably will just flick on a different PPV to watch and finish this tomorrow.
> 
> Thinking about watching SVS 2009, thoughts?


Survivor Series '09 is a pretty decent show. Opening SVS match is pretty solid with a lot of new faces at the time, next SVS match is a good one with Kofi vs. the heels, and the main event is fantastic. World Title match is pretty forgettable though and Rey/Batista was nothing.



Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Watched a pair of Punk/Big Show matches that time and DAMN these two have some good david Vs goliath chemistry, Punk sells Show's superior size like no other. The match these two have in the summer of 2012 is bossy as all fuck and a great **** 1/4*. Some more ratings for PUNK matches I've watched recently for this little project of mine:
> 
> CM Punk Vs Daniel Bryan (Over The Limit 2012) ~ ***** 1/4*
> CM Punk Vs Alberto Del Rio Vs The Miz (TLC 2011) ~ **** 3/4*
> ...


That the Show match before Summerslam that got cut short? Liked that one myself but god I wish they were able to have a finish. Could only give it ** 1/2. Watch his match with Orton from the RAW before MITB this year. (Y)



Alim said:


> Royal Rumble match 1995 is not that bad at all. Just finished watching it. It's actually pretty fun.


THANK YOU. Great story, fun match.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I give the SD Main Event ***1/2 after a rewatch. Those last 10 minutes are really, really awesome (reminiscent of the Bryan hot tag sequences when in a 6-Man Tag with the Shield), but everything before, while smartly worked, just didn't captivate my interest too much tbh. Thought that Cena/Sandow on Raw was much better, despite the shameful outcome of it all _(even more shameful is that, according to my trust site on this stuff, Vince fed the Sandow MITB cash-in on Monday *JUST to help out the fucking ratings. YES, RATINGS* were the reason Sandow's MITB was killed.)_


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Picked up some tickets for a house show next week. THE SHIELD IN DA HOUSE. :mark: :mark: Really excited about that since I haven't seen them live before.

:rollins :ambrose :reigns

DAT SPEAR live in person 

:mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

And on another rewatch, Cena/Sandow I'm divided between ***3/4 and ****. It was certainly 1/2 burial thanks to that tasteless outcome, however it was another 1/2 the making of a star. Sandow looked awesome there, better than any other time ever. Sandow sistematically SHATTERED Cena's arm, from the pre-match beatdown to the constant work of it with ruthless knees, elbows and whatnot like a dangerous pitbull smelling bones in a 3 year old child. And unlike HIAC, Cena did gave a shit about making his arm injury REALLY look like a jeopardy, as his selling was very good here. And you can't say you didn't mark for the Crippler Crossface, it was the best looking of its kind since the one of Chris Benoit himself tbh. And no, the LeBell/Yes/No Lock does NOT count.

And as a Sandow mark myself, I felt like every Daniel Bryan fan in the world back on April 1, 2012 when you know what happened. However, it also gave me hope. The fact that someone like Sandow, who was on jobberland for months despite holding on MITB since July and having the best midcard feud in years with Cody on Summer, got to look as good as he did against someone like John Cena, injury or not, gave me a glimpse of hope that they do want something with him. What happened to Bryan was the best thing EVER for his career. I'm hoping this applies to Sandow too. I hope. Only hope.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

The Primer said:


> Oh I could name the times Punk fell in Chi-town, but once he reached the level he did he got his wins there to make up for it. Toss in the losses to Jericho in 2008 _(when he was World Champ)_ & to Ziggler in the final RAW of 2011. Classic WWE.


Haha I love that Ziggler match just because of Ziggler's post match celebration with the title, even though he didn't win it. I remember marking out hard when this happened:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Ladies and gentlemen, the Cal Scale has now a new, more modern bloodcousin... sort-of. It's the new big deal, it's the Windows 8 to Cal's Windows 7. ATF's invention, copyrights here folks. Even though it really is just the Cal Scale modded down, but fuck it it's still a masterpiece anyway :side: I call it... the *MEDAL SCALE*.

...don't you even try in making Kurt Angle jokes.

It's simple: every PPV has AT LEAST one watchable match. In the Medal Scale, you rank (according to your opinion), the top three matches on the card. From best to worst, you attribute Gold, Silver and Bronze medals to those three matches. From there, you simply use the actual Cal Scale to rate the matches based on their starz. Here's an example of the Medal Scale with my rankings of the 2013 PPV's:



> Royal Rumble 2013:
> GOLD: 30-Man Rumble (***1/2)
> SILVER: ADR/Show (**1/2)
> BRONZE: Hell No/Rhodes Scholars (**)
> ...


I might be a little too generous with some ratings but that's what I am. 

Imo the Medal Scale might be a little more sophisticated in rating the PPV's than the Cal Scale. Because it only rates a PPV's strong points (if it has them). If only three matches can achieve a Cal Scale of 20 (like SummerSlam did), it proves just how good that show actually is... even if it had nothing else to the table.

Spoiler alert: imo, 2013 actually scores higher than 2002 on the Medal Scale.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Honestly that just looks like the CAL SCALE V0.5 which slight variations .



Spoiler: CAL SCALE BETA



Came up with a way to rank the WWE PPV's this year.

Points System:

Solid - 1
Good - 2
Great - 3
Epic - 5
MOTY - 2

--------------------------------------

*Royal Rumble - 3*

Bryan Vs Show Vs Henry - Solid
Punk Vs Ziggler - Good

*Elimination Chamber - 0*

:lmao I literally didn't like ANYTHING from this show. Last Chamber match I liked was probably back in 2010.

*WrestleMania - 11*

Kane Vs Orton - Solid
Undertaker Vs HHH - Epic
Punk Vs Jericho - Epic

*Extreme Rules - 11*

Sheamus Vs Bryan - Epic
Punk Vs Jericho - Good
Cena Vs Lesnar - Epic

*Over The Limit - 7*

Punk Vs Bryan - Epic & MOTY

*No Way Out - 6*

Sheamus Vs Ziggler - Great
Christian Vs Cody - Solid
Punk Vs Kane Vs Bryan - Good

*Money in the Bank - 2*

Punk Vs Bryan - Good

*SummerSlam - 6*

Jericho Vs Ziggler - Solid
Bryan Vs Kane - Solid
Punk Vs Show Vs Cena - Solid
Lesnar Vs HHH - Great

*Night of Champions - 7*

Orton Vs Ziggler - Good
Eve Vs Layla - Good
Punk Vs Cena - Great

*Hell in a Cell - 4*

Team Rhodes Scholars Vs Team Hell No - Solid
Show Vs Sheamus - Great

*Survior Series- 2*

Sheamus Vs Show - Good

*TLC - 3*

Shield Vs Team Hell No & Ryback - Great

--------------------------------------

*Ranking The PPV's*

12. Elimination Chamber - 0
11. Money in the Bank - 2
10. Survior Series- 2 (preferred Show/Sheamus to Bryan/Punk from MITB)
09. Royal Rumble - 3
08. TLC - 3 (TLC match > Both RR matches combined)
07. Hell in a Cell - 4
06. No Way Out - 6
05. SummerSlam - 6 (SS had an extra match that I liked, plus HHH/Lesnar > Sheamus/Ziggler)
04. Night of Champions - 7
03. Over The Limit - 7 (Has my MOTY so beats out NOC on that alone)
02. WrestleMania - 11
01. Extreme Rules - 11 (2 Epics and a Great > 2 Epics and a solid)


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Well, that was essentially the idea. A tweaked Cal Scale.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

It sucks though . Taking into account only the good fools people into thinking there is nothing bad about the show. If a PPV has 2 great matches and gets a good CAL SCALE rating but the other 7 matches are all DUDs then you are just LYING to the people. LYING.

Should I watch Global Warning Tour for my 02 PPV Rambles? Not bothered if its good or bad, just wondering if everyone considers it a PPV in the same way Insurrextion and Rebellion are.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I know. And it's *genius*. They're put through torture thanks to me! And they say Darth Vader was evil 8*D

I'd say yes regarding Global Warning.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Insurrection 2002 review​*
Well, here we go, this is most likely going to be the worst PPV of my 2002 reviews, and I have been avoiding it, but IT’S TIME! 

*Match # 1: Eddie Gurrero vs RVD *

Okay, I would be excited about this shit, because its EDDIE VS RVD! But Cal says it sucks a horses ass, and frankly, the way this PPV looks like, that is gonna become a pattern. This was pretty meh TBH, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it was MOTN, the beginning is decent and actually kind of fun but all of a sudden it turns to utter shit. It does pick back up for little while but then ends in a shitty DQ finish. This wasn’t too bad, but really? Having the opener end in DQ? What booking is this? **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5 *

*Match # 2: Divas shit*

This looks like its 20 minutes long! FUCK NO

*CAL SCALE: -1*

*Match #3: X-PAC vs Bradshaw*

God they booked the NWO angle Terribly in 2002, couldn’t it be a Main event storyline? How about getting new guys like taker or someone like that who could still work? Nah, instead we get a filler match against Bradshaw, pathetic for one of the greatest angles in not only WCW history, but pro wrestling history. This wasn’t as bad as I thought it would be. I honestly thought this would be one of the biggest DUDS of the year but that wasn’t the case, it was actually MEH, which is an improvement and is possibly MOTN so far, but RVD/Eddie is MEH too. Solid, yet unsatisfying to an extent. **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5 *

*Match # 4: Steven Richards vs Booker T*

The fuck? Hardcore title involving Booker T? and some guy I forget? Sigh, pretty sure the creative team held their meetings in some skanky European tavern on this European tour, because this is pathetic. Maybe It’ll be good, most likely not. Jerry Lawler actually has a quote that makes sense today! 

* “Why are we starting out a hardcore match with an arm drag?”*

This basically sums up the whole match, I don’t think a single weapon was used, IN A FUCKING HARDCORE TITLE MATCH!!!! Ughh I hate this shit. Even JR and King know this sucks ass. Their should be no 2 minute sleeper holds in hardcore matches…period. Also, don’t ask me about the title changes AFTER the match. Must have been the 24/7 thing. * 

*CAL SCALE: 0* 

*Match # 5: Brock Lesnar and Shawn Sean Stasiak vs The hardy boyz *

Hmm, this should be interesting, probably MOTN even though I do not know who Stasiak is. Well, Brock buries him by telling him to stay out of the ring :lol. Heyman is great here, per the usual, he is yelling at Stasiak and telling him to get out :lmao, too funny. Anyways this is a great 8-10 minute match that is easily the best so far tonight, even if the competition isn’t too tough . Really energertic all the way through and never seemed boring, recommendation to check out this gem. ***

*CAL SCALE: 2 *

*Match # 6: William Regal vs Spike Dudley *

Well, I think Regal is gonna job to SPIKE in is home country, for the EUROPEAN title. Typical mistreatment of REGAL. Well, Spike fucking breaks his foot but REGAL takes him back! The match is back on! Well, on one foot Spike rolls up Regal in ENGLAND and Regal looks like a POS. Poor Regal . DUD

*CAL SCALE: 0 *

*Match # 7: Stone Cold Steve Austin vs The Big Show*

OK, I’m going to legit give this a try, IDK why, but what the fuck, it can’t get much worse right? Well, the GOAT Ric Flair is out to be the special referee. Yeah this is pretty shitty, and this is in contention for the WOAT PPV, except for maybe some TNA PPV in 2013 . It wasn’t DUD bad, but it was pretty crappy. Big thing for me that it just didn’t feel special at all, which is not something you want in a match involving your most over star and the face of the company. It did have some good points but unfortunately 90% of the match just wasn’t good. Ending was fun and got a big pop but in the end this just felt like a 25 minute RAW match. * 

*CAL SCALE: 0 *

*HHH vs the UNDERTAKER*

Ugh, I watched their KOTR shit, not this time! NO NO NO

*CAL SCALE: -1
*
*TOTAL CAL SCALE: 1*

*CURRENT PPV MOTY: Brock Lesnar vs the undertaker HIAC *

*Current 2002 PPV rankings 
1: rebellion(20)
2: The Royal rumble(18)
3: No mercy(15.5)
4: Armageddon(15.5)
5: Unforgiven(15) 
6: No way out(12)
7: Backlash(11.5)
8: King of the ring(10.5)
9: Insurrection(1)​*


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

You gave it 1 point too many imo .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

:lmao, worst show I have ever watched possibly

Turning on Judgement day 2002, never seen the HIAC match or anything else from this show


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'm about to start JD as well lol.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

One match in and this show is already double the score of Insurrection :lmao


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Thoughts on the Clash of Champions DVD ? which matches are good


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

KillaCal, didn't you give Insurrextion 2002 a 1 as well? I recall you miscalculating the score for that PPV. Not that it matters though, sentimentally that PPV deserved to be in the negatives. Don't recall Judgment Day 2002 being very good either, but Eddie/RVD was REALLY good.

Cena/Rhodes Brothers vs. Sandow/Real Americans is as good as everyone says it is. Shield/Usos was also good as well. God damn how can you not love The Usos? unk2

COTC DVD looks pretty good. Except for Disc 3.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Nope, gave Insurrextion a 0. Someone couldn't read properly and thought I had miscalculated .

Just up to the JD HIAC match now. Not a fan. Maybe things will change. Interested to see what smitty thinks to the handicap match.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

0-1+1+0+0.5+0.5+0+0 ≠ 0


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Kotr 95 vs insurrection 02

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## RadGuyMcCool (Jul 31, 2013)

I find the way they handled Benoit's participation in the first MITB match in this anotholgy DVD to be hilarious.
No entrance, no mention of him on commentary, he is a nameless man who suddenly jumped into the match.
And they leave his spots in, so its just weird.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

funnyfaces1 said:


> 0-1+1+0+0.5+0.5+0+0 ≠ 0


Huh... looking back I may have made a small mistake . Still, 1 on the CAL SCALE is terrible . But now it's only the second worst PPV I've done .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I had finished the handicap match right before I went to the mall.

I personally thought it was garbage


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nostalgia said:


> Haha I love that Ziggler match just because of Ziggler's post match celebration with the title, even though he didn't win it. I remember marking out hard when this happened:


I got a kick out of the moment too. Couldn't believe Ziggler won. So much heat on that night for anyone who tried to stop Punk. Awesome. Plus, it worked out b/c Punk thwarted Swagger right before that so it gave fans hope that he'll defeat everyone slated in the gauntlet to get his hands on Ace. Instead he fell to the second guy. Good stuff. TV matches were better than the Rumble bout, yet I'm glad it happened all the same. Purely b/c I'm big on both dudes and it was fun seeing him vs each other for the WWE Championship on PPV. It's a big deal when you look at it - so


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Nostalgia said:


> Haha I love that Ziggler match just because of Ziggler's post match celebration with the title, even though he didn't win it. I remember marking out hard when this happened:


:lmao I remember it well, back when he got afros after matches

^^ Yea agree on all the points you said, was shocked yet pleaed they had a feud, their TV matches were better than the rumble match but I'm also glad it happened. Very fond of that feud (both of the favs duking it out) although for those not a fan of them its was pretty much filler


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

HIAC starting now on JD 2002, might not make it through the PPV if history of the WWE title gets here!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Eh, Punk needed something to do. As did Ziggler. Nothing wrong with giving them a month long program along with Ace in the mix. Better than the filler nonsense that plagued the company during the Elimination Chamber build. Now those matches were so filler.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Decided to join the Premium Club 

May have a rare match to upload to celebrate....


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^ I will to soon, spend enough time on here, just have to create a paypal account

Watching some nitro matches


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

redskins25 said:


> ^^ I will to soon, spend enough time on here, just have to create a paypal account
> 
> Watching some nitro matches


You may like the match i *MAY* upload, most if not all have seen it but some maybe not...


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I've download like 5 matches off of you in the past 2 days so I'm more than ready and why do I have a feeling I haven't seen what your taking about


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Judgment day 2002 review​*
*Match # 1: RVD vs Eddie Gurrero *

No idea how good this will be, I liked their backlash match on the rewatch a lot, no idea why I gave it **1/2 the first time around. However, their Insurrextion match sucked shit, so theirs a 50-50 chance this could be good. I would not say this was as good as their backlash bout(gave it ***3/4 on rewatch) but its certainly better than the match at Insurrextion, which might be there worst match together. This was IMO the perfect length too at only 11 minutes but it never came across to me as boring and I genuinely had some fun with it. God opener and I think it accomplished its goal of getting the crowd hot for the rest of the show and then some *** ¾*
*
CAL SCALE: 4*

*Match # 2: Stacie Keibler vs Trish Stratus *

As hot as this is, it will suck still. NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1*

*Match # 3: The Hardy boyz vs Brock Lesnar and Paul Heyman *

HEYMAN IN A MATCH? Are we in 2013 or do storylines just keep recycling every 11 years :lol. Anyways this should be fun because Heyman is awesome, so is Brock, and I the Hardyz are cool too! So, this means that if this match isn’t decent I ill be very surprised. This was really short but fun for the time it got I guess. I did prefer the Insurrextion match pretty much because there just isn’t much here TBH. I did like how Heyman got the pin and acts like he is on top of the world, that was pretty funny. This seemed like a filler to put brock over TBH, but it wasn’t bad. **1/4 

*CAL SCALE: 1*

*Match # 4: The Big show and Ric Flair vs Stone Cold Steve Austin *

No wonder Austin quit, he was in a meaningless feud with Flair and Show, and this match will most likely continue the string of underwhelming matches in this underwhelming feud. Yeah I don’t know if this is just me but I thought this was fucking TERRIBLE. Even if all 3 guys can work it jut didn’t click tonight. It also went an insane amount of time, this should have been like a 10 minute Austin squash TBH, but ended up going nearly 20 minutes, which was insane. Yeah this is the stinker of the night so far, hope the rest of this show improves because if not we could be looking at another low score. ½* 

*CAL SCALE: 0 *

*Match # 5: Kurt Angle vs Edge *

Apparently this is really good, which might make this PPV an actual good one, because I know for sure the ME is not going to help the score. I personally like Angle better when he was bald compared to how he looked with hair. Yeah so the stip is here the loser must get his head shaved, cool I guess. Yeah this is a really fun match, probably MOTN because I’m not expecting much from the HIAC or Hogan/Taker. But anyways these two work good together and have a fun match that the crowd is into like crazy. The best part about this match is the fact that it isn’t too long and NEVER feels boring. Last 10 minutes are AWESOME as shit, with some good near falls and finishers. Yeah this might just make this PPV a lot better than it looked, as this is a great match. ****

*CAL SCALE: 5 *

*Match # 6: Chris Jericho vs HHH HIAC *

This might be the most forgettable main event level HIAC match out there, as it seems like no one ever talks about it. This must mean it sucks dick, not too surprised considering their Mania match got bad reviews too. Pretty decent match, nothing relatively memorable about it but it was solid nonetheless. I honestly didn’t think this was too bad, and I hope that their Mania match is better but I doubt it. Not much to say besides that regarding this match. It certainly didn’t feel rushed and I thought 30 minutes was a good time length for this, being the co Main event. *** ¼* 

*CAL SCALE: 2*

*Match # 7: Billy and Chuck vs Rikishi and Rico*

I don’t know what the fuck this mess is, Rico is the manager of Billy and Chuck but Mcmahon picked him be Rikishi’s partner. This was so fucking bad. DUD

*CAL SCALE: 0*

*Match # 8: Hulk Hogan vs the Undertaker *

These guys faced each other in 1991 and it sucked, can only imagine the level of shit in 2002, when Hogan was old and apparently could only work a fun match with the Rock of all people. This was pretty bad, but definitely not as bad as I thought. Most of the match just felt like filler and it didn’t even feel like a PPV match TBH, just a long RAW match . So Hogan loses after A Vince distraction and one of the worst title holders of the 21st century loses the belt to taker, who would go on to have a terrible reign as well . *

*CAL SCALE: 0 *

*TOTAL CAL SCALE: 11*

*CURRENT 2002 PPV MOTY: Brock Lesnar vs Undertaker HIAC(no mercy)* 

*Current 2002 PPV rankings 
1: rebellion(20)
2: The Royal rumble(18)
3: No mercy(15.5)
4: Armageddon(15.5)
5: Unforgiven(15) 
6: No way out (12)
7: Backlash (11.5)
8: Judgment day(11) 
9: King of the ring(10.5)
10: Insurrection (1) 

Only 4 more shows left! Doing Vengeance next! TRIPLE THREAT :mark: ​*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Zep goes purple.

Austin quitting did us all good. He was pissed & deeply unmotivated those last few months. He came back and gave us a fun squash vs Bischoff & a fabulous final match vs The Rock. That made up for it.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Hogan/Warrior is probably my #1 favorite WWE Title match in Mania history. Such an incredible match with an incredible atmosphere. False finishes were amazing for 1990.
> 
> 
> Tell me, did you get the blu ray? Cause I hope you got the blu ray.


It's definitely up there.

No, I didn't. I don't have a blu ray machine, and from my understanding, you need one for those to work, correct?

It was a huge price differential too, btw. $6.99 for the normal one, and $27.99 for the blu-ray.

I do see that the blu-ray extras on that DVD look really cool. Oh well. 


Just to let you all know, WWE.com is running another sale:
$10% off of orders of $25 or more
20% off of orders of $50 or more
30% off of orders of $100 or more


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

LilOlMe said:


> It's definitely up there.
> 
> No, I didn't. I don't have a blu ray machine, and from my understanding, you need one for those to work, correct?
> 
> ...


Ah ok, you took advantage of the Halloween Sale. Good call, and yeah you need a blu ray player or a PS3 for blu rays. Shame though because the blu ray extras have two great matches against Yoko & Hakushi. Oh well.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well I can see me and Smitty are gonna DISAGREE IMMENSELY with one particular match on JD . Watching the HIAC match now.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Did you like the Handicap? 

I can't imagine that your blind taker markship will make you like the ME right?


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Ah ok, you took advantage of the Halloween Sale. Good call, and yeah you need a blu ray player or a PS3 for blu rays. Shame though because the blu ray extras have two great matches against Yoko & Hakushi. Oh well.


Yeah, I like that RAW Hakushi match. It also seems like the blu ray comes with a lot more of Bret's commentary on the matches, right?


I know you guys have discussed this before, but I didn't pay attention because at the time it had no relation to me. How are the two Ladder match DVDs?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Im still on DVD


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

LOLDVD. Get Blu or fuck off! 

Ladder Match sets are pretty awesome. 1st is obviously better, second has a lot more "unknown/rare" matches which some people may or may not like as much. BLURAY version is where it's at.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I own the first ladder set, some fun shit there. Second one is on netflix if you have that, its okay but I will not be buying it due to the fact that I have already seen it on Netflix. 

WWE title DVD didn't come in the mail, so I guess I will be watching Veangence 2002 tonight and starting mania 18 possibly.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I have heard Ladders 1 has alot of good matches on it so go ahead. I have netflix so and have watched Ladders 2 many times. Outside of hbk/razor mania, christian/adr ex 11; Jomo/sheamus and its meh


I watched bret/piper btw, its ok but it didnt feel that special or :mark: to me, the length wasnt really a factor either just I found myself looking at my phone a couple of times during it. Ive seen ppl praise it, could you explain what you/they see in it ?

And unfortunately I couldn't get into bret/scsa svs 96, I usually take it off 10 mins in, about 25 minutes in but just couldn't this time as well , its one of those match I really want to like but I cant maybe next time. Dont want to goo all hate on Bret as I'm still :homer over that nhb raw match with Owen I watched last night

And that was about my 5th attempt at bret/scsa svs 96 :lmao


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Some Highlights of ladder set are 

HBK/Razor SS 95
E&C vs the Hardyz
ALL 4 TLC's 
Benoit/Jericho RR 
Hardy/taker 
first MITB 
Eddie/rey SS 05
Flair/Edge TLC 
Cena/Edge TLC 
Armageddon 06 ladder match

Awesome set


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*Judgment Day 2002*

:mark: Undertaker in the main event for the title :mark:.


*Eddie Guerrero Vs Rob Van Dam - WWF Intercontinental Championship Match*

Backlash was :mark:. Insurrextion was . I remember this being really good though . PLEASE HOLD UP. Sick of matches I used to like being shit on a rewatch lol.

RVD rocks Eddie early on and LATINO HEAT gets HOT. Things get worse for him when RVD makes him look like a fool, faking a dive off the ropes, causing Eddie to STOP AND DROP so RVD can land a split legged moonsault!!!

Nice to see RVD going after the back of Eddie, just as Eddie did in their Backlash match. He even busts out some of the same moves too!!! 

Eddie's control segment starts off with a PUNCH TO THE FACE which makes me smile . Similar to Insurrextion, Eddie focused on the head and neck of Van Dam as it was the NECKBREAKER on the IC title that brought Eddie the win.

:mark: Eddie keeps selling the back while on offense, and RVD even goes after it again during a comeback. Those shoulders he does to someone in the corner? He does that to Eddie while he's stomach first in the turnbuckle, so he's driving his shoulder into the BACK of Eddie. Both guys seem to be on top form, even if I'd likely guess that Eddie was putting the majority of this match together .

POWERBOMB :mark:. Just like how Eddie returned on Raw in 02, and goes to follow up with THE SUPERIOR Frog Splash, but he wastes too much time and RVD escapes! Now it's time for HIS version of the Frog Splash and holy fuck Eddie BARELY gets out of the way!!!

Oh man, then the big STARE DOWN and shit when both guys make it to their feet, knowing that they BOTH missed their Frog Splashes :mark:. They ain't happy so they just CHARGE at each other.

Backlside by RVD and holy fuck Eddie BARELY kicked out! RVD goes for a spinning kick and Eddie counters that into a backslide of his own, gets the feet up on the ropes and EDDIE WINS! EDDIE WINS! :mark:

Loved this a ton. Always thought their Backlash match was superior, and well it still kinda is, but damn this is VERY close. Loved it more on this watch :mark:.

*Rating: ***3/4*
*CAL SCALE - 4*


*Trish Stratus Vs Stacy Keibler - WWF Women's Championship Match*

FAP FAP FAP FAP FAP FAP FAP.

No.

*Rating: NO*
*CAL SCALE - -1*


:lmao Vince goes to see Flair to congratulate him on turning heel on Austin. Arn in the background is AMAZING. Giggling like a girl and his head going all over the place looking at Vince, looking at Flair, looking at their hands as they tease a handshake. ARN.


*The Hardy Boys Vs Brock Lesnar & Paul Heyman*

Well Lesnar's partner here is a HUGE step up from Planet Stasiak lol.

Lesnar doesn't even make it to the ring before JEFF flies over the ropes... only to get CAUGHT!!! Baseball slide from Matt and Lesnar goes down. Hardy's chase Heyman, allowing LESNAR to come in from behind and his DOMINATION begins :mark:.

GOLDBERG chants for Lesnar :lmao. Unlike Ryback those chants didn't last long because he QUICKLY became something different the more and more his WRESTLING skills showed.

I like how Brock uses his sheer power to absolutely dominate, but he's still very much a rookie in the company and every now and then makes a small mistake that guys like the Hardy Boys can capitalise on momentarily just to SURVIVE.

HARDYS GET HEYMAN~!

F-5! And Heyman starts screaming TAG ME, so Lesnar does. Then Heyman falls over the ropes trying to get in :lmao. Heyman rules. And he pins JEFF HARDY. He truly is THE BEST IN THE WORLD.

Fun fun fun fun fun fun fun :mark:.

*Rating: **1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 1*


Booker T is in the NWO now. His wife (we don't know it's his wife obviously) shows up and gives him her hotel key or something.


*Steve Austin Vs The Big Show & Ric Flair*

OH MY GOD THE FIRST FEW MINUTES OF THIS ARE UNGODLY AMOUNTS OF FUN. The stuff with Show is like their Insurrextion match on 30x fast forward, plus you have Flair in their eating a ton of shots to the face. :mark: at Austin locking the Figure Four in on Show, then as Flair comes in to break it up, Austin sits up and punches him in the face :lmao. Then Austin puts FLAIR in the Figure Four, and Show goes for an elbow drop so Austin rolls onto his side to avoid it!!! And then we have some STEEL CHAIR SHENANIGANS~! FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN.

:lmao at Austin walking over to Show on the apron, punching him in the face and then screaming WHAT? WHAT? WHAT? at him :lmao. Everyone in this just looks like they are having the time of their fucking lives. The crowd are HOT for everything too. :mark:

:lmao Flair is fucking awesome too. He literally drags Charles Robinson over to him, shows off his GUNS and while the ref is busy looking at some MUSCLE, Flair's other arm is smashing up against Austin's balls. Then Flair hits on some girls in the front row :lmao.

AUSTIN IS SCREAMING IN PAIN AT THE HANDS OF 2 MEN~!

Things slow down as they work over the leg of Austin, but Flair constantly talking shit makes everything tons more interesting :mark:.

STUNNER ON BIG SHOW~! Show didn't even fall over! SUPERKICK BY X-PAC~! Austin dodges and Show is down! STUNNER TO FLAIR~! And Austin wins.

Well damn. DAMN. I HATED this last time I saw it. Now I fucking LOVE it. Pure fun.

*Rating: ***1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 2*


*Edge Vs Kurt Angle - Hair Vs Hair Match*

WELL FUCK ME SIDEWAYS AND CALL ME MARY. That overhead belly to belly suplex OVER THE ROPES was epic. EPIC. Edge takes a fucking KILLER bump off it. Now THAT is how you transition into a control segment. Good god!

:lmao at Lawler saying Edge has a head the shape of a Dinosaur. HE DOES HAVE AN ODD SHAPED HEAD!!!

Stuff happens for a while, honestly feels like filler until Edge begins his comeback, which is pretty sweet in all honesty. Baseball slide to Angle's legs to knock him off the apron is amazing with Angle smashing his fucking FACE on the apron on the way down is fucking :mark:.

MONSTROUS German Suplex. No wonder Edge needed neck surgery after his 2002 if he keeps up taking insane bumps like that lol.

BRIAN HEBNER takes a killer bump off a SPEAR. With the referee down, Kurt bring out a chair and ends up getting a Spear instead!

Bunch of finishers now for some NEAR FALLS~! In the end Edge catches Angle with a roll up after escaping the Ankle Lock. ANGLE IS GOING BALD.

Match is fine, kinda reminds me of their Backlash match, just with some better SPOTZ~! lol. Lots of fun to be had but nothing overly special.

*Rating: ***1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 2*


Booker T in bed with his wife. LIGHTS GO OUT. Weird noises. GOLDUST~! This was all a plan to get Booker T to leave the NWO :lmao.


*Triple H Vs Chris Jericho - Hell in a Cell Match*

Apparently BERRYING~! Jericho at WM wasn't enough; HHH needed to do it inside the cell too!!! 

Might I just say right now, FUCK YOU. I'm not sure who you are but you know who you are and that's what matters. I'm about 30 seconds in and all I can hear is HHH making retarded noises every time he punches or gets punched. AARRGHH!!! 

Might I also just say right now, that HHH is still a terrible fucking brawler. Those punches make me cringe. Combine the awful execution with THOSE NOISES he makes and I wanna stab him.

They fight on the outside. Throw each other around into the cell. And then for some reason Jericho brings out a ladder. Uuuuhhhh... why? To use as a weapon? Ok... but why a ladder? It's big and bulky and wastes time and energy to use it. Why not a steel chair? Simple and probably MORE effective. Using a ladder in a LADDER MATCH is fine because after you deck your opponent with it, you can try and CLIMB it. Inside the cell though? It's fucking DUMB. Edge made good use of it in 2008, but he had like, legitimate reasons for it. THIS AIN'T A TRIPLE CAGE JERICHO. NO NEED TO CLIMB ON TOP OF THE CELL THROUGH A HOLE IN THE TOP.

Fuck me, the ladder ends up on the outside and Jericho actually goes out to bring it back in. Only to get hit with a STEEL CHAIR that HHH wisely brought in, because fuck fucking about with a ladder when you can swing a chair a bazillion times easier.

Oh just fuck off Jericho. What does he go ahead and do next? GETS THE FUCKING RING STEPS INSIDE THE RING. He is struggling to pick them up. LAWLER on commentary even wonders what the fuck he's doing. HHH JUST BROUGHT A CHAIR INTO THE MATCH. HE USED IT ON YOU EFFECTIVELY. USE IT ON HIM YOU DUMB FUCKING CUNT.

:lmao at Tim White telling them to "KEEP IT IN THE DAMN RING!". It's a HIAC match Timmy. They are gonna do whatever they want. Dumb or otherwise, it seems. Besides, you better shut your mouth Tim. Careers can end in HIAC ya kn... aaand there goes Tim White. GOAT HIAC bump. Flies off the apron, SMASHES into the side of the cage and he is DONE. Literally. Off to attempt suicide every week on TV!!!

SLEDGEHAMMER TO THE FACE~! Lol, HHH is a moron. Using a sledgehammer. Should have set up the ladder, struggled to the top carrying the ring steps and dropped them onto Jericho or something!!! This match isn't about BERRYING Jericho, its about making him look like the dumbest motherfucker on the planet apparently! :lmao

Now we are outside the cell (they had to go get Tim), and Jericho gets DDT'd through a table, then runs away from HHH who has a 2x4 wrapped in barbed wire. Sorry, he doesn't run away, because that might be SMART, and this match is all about making Jericho look DUMB. He climbs to the top of the cell, where obviously HHH can't get at him...

WALLS OF JERICHO ON TOP OF THE CELL. :lmao and the new referee climbs on top of the cell to check on HHH. Because you can WIN on top of the cell now apparently. A rule that has NEVER BEEN MENTIONED BEFORE, in fact I seem to recall them SPECIFICALLY mentioning in a previous HIAC match to this that you CANNOT WIN ON TOP OF THE CELL. More bullshit thrown at us in this match.

PEDIGREE attempt, and HHH gets back body dropped, but the cell doesn't break . This match might have been saved by an insane HHH Cell Bump. Nah, fuck that shit. PEDIGREE TO JERICHO ON TOP OF THE CELL and this is done. Thankfully.

Urgh. Pile of uber shite. Retarded use of retarded weapons by a seemingly retarded wrestler. Retarded rules made up seemingly on the spot for a retarded match. RETARDED AS FUCK. Didn't like this at all. Can't think of anything good to say about it.

*Rating: DUD*
*CAL SCALE - 0*


:lmao at Angle running and hiding from Edge to avoid getting his hair cut.


*Billy & Chuck Vs Rikishi & Rico - WWF Tag Team Championship Match*

Sorry, NO.

*Rating: NO*
*CAL SCALE - -1*


*Hulk Hogan Vs The Undertaker - WWE Undisputed Championship Match*

:mark: Undertaker I believe debuts his new theme song here. Basically "You're Gonna Pay" instrumental version. It's awesome :mark:.

Undertaker is wearing a belt of his own coming into this match; a bright yellow Hogan weight lifting belt! And he starts whipping the Hulkster the moment he steps into the ring!!! Hogan takes a bunch of shots, makes a comeback and starts giving it right back to 'Taker!

The referee takes the belt away from Hogan and officially rings the bell.

"HOLY SHIT DID YOU SEE THAT OMG!!!" :lmao I don't know who that is but that fan is amazing . That was his reaction to Undertaker taking his big bump over the ring steps btw.

HOLY SHIT DID YOU SEE THAT OMG? That was MY reaction to Hogan hitting a SUPERPLEX. In 2002. A HOGAN SUPERPLEX. Damn lol!!!

'Taker goes for the legs of Hogan and things slow down and not in a good way, but thankfully it doesn't last too long before Hogan makes a comeback. LEGDROP~! COUNTERED INTO A HALF BOSTON CRAB~!

:lmao at Hogan struggling to even take a chokeslam. Oh he can do a superplex, but take a chokeslam from Undertaker? LOLNO.

HULK UP~! Undertaker looks at Hogan like "fucks sake, didn't this all die like 11 years ago?" :lmao

LEG DROP~! UNDERTAKER KICKS OUT OF THE LEG DROP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Vince McMahon shows up, just as Undertaker grabs a chair, but Hogan kicks it back in his face just like Undertaker did to Austin a month ago! Leg Drop! McMahon gets involved and gets a Leg Drop!

CHAIR TO HOGAN~! CHOKESLAM~! NEW WWE CHAMPION!!! UNDERTAKER WINS!!!! :mark:

I still remember marking out like FUCK when I watched this live :mark:. Seeing Undertaker win his first major title since 1999 was :mark:. Undertaker posing while he gets the referee to put the title belt on him is :mark:.

Match is decent, nothing more. I get more enjoyment out of it than most no doubt .

*Rating: ***
*CAL SCALE - 0.5*



*Overall CAL SCALE - 7.5*​


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

YES! Thank you KillaCal for showing the rest of these fools why Jericho/HHH was so awful. Legitimate DUD and second worst HIAC match ever. Maybe third if I rewatch HHH/HBK.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Some Highlights of ladder set are
> 
> HBK/Razor SS 95
> E&C vs the Hardyz
> ...


So you're saying those are the best for both dvds, or just the first one?

I think I'll get 'em. (Y)



redskins25 said:


> I have heard Ladders 1 has alot of good matches on it so go ahead. I have netflix so and have watched Ladders 2 many times. Outside of hbk/razor mania, christian/adr ex 11; Jomo/sheamus and its meh
> 
> 
> I watched bret/piper btw, its ok but it didnt feel that special or :mark: to me, the length wasnt really a factor either just I found myself looking at my phone a couple of times during it. Ive seen ppl praise it, could you explain what you/they see in it ?
> ...


What was good about the Piper match was that it was different for its time. I could see how people might be underwhelmed now, because so many people have done take-offs of that formula since then.

You can see how invested the crowd was, even though it was a simpler match than Bret usually works.

Weird that you still couldn't get into Bret/Austin SvS, even though you got pretty far along into the match.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I probably enjoy Hogan/Taker from JD more than everyone else in here. Would give it ***+.



funnyfaces1 said:


> YES! Thank you KillaCal for showing the rest of these fools why Jericho/HHH was so awful. Legitimate DUD and second worst HIAC match ever. Maybe third if I rewatch HHH/HBK.


Jericho/HHH is definitely not worse than HHH/HBK.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> YES! Thank you KillaCal for showing the rest of these fools why Jericho/HHH was so awful. Legitimate DUD and second worst HIAC match ever. Maybe third if I rewatch HHH/HBK.


I did PM ya but 

*Ted DiBiase vs Hacksaw Duggan (Street Fight) (7.29.83)*

From Mid South

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-m...ggan-street-fight-7-29-83-a.html#post25906497


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

LilOlMe said:


> So you're saying those are the best for both dvds, or just the first one?
> 
> I think I'll get 'em. (Y)


Thats only the first one! second one includes 

Razor/HBK WM X
Mankind/Rock
RVD/hardy 2002
Team angle/Tajiri and eddie
WM 23 MITB
Jericho/Michaels 
MITB WM 25
MITB 2010 RAW 
Morrison/Sheamus


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

...How on earth do you find these matches?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I need a ppv to watch, and no 2002


----------



## -AJ- (Aug 15, 2013)

*SmackDown! 11/1/13* John Cena, Goldust & Cody Rhodes vs. Damien Sandow, Jack Swagger & Antonio Cesaro ******

One of the best six man tag matches all year. It's right up there with many of the Shield's trio matches. It's really an ideal TV main event- something that won't headline a PPV, so it's not like they gave away anything too big, but had all the parts for a great match.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Can someone upload that SD! ME please?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> I need a ppv to watch, and no 2002


Summerslam 2005 

GO!


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

> Might I just say right now, FUCK YOU. I'm not sure who you are but you know who you are and that's what matters. I'm about 30 seconds in and all I can hear is HHH making retarded noises every time he punches or gets punched. AARRGHH!!!


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I'm still bitter about Austin leaving in 2002. Yea he was unmotivated and burnt out at the time, but he deprived me of a personal dream feud, Eddie Guerrero vs Steve Austin. It had already been booked, the vignettes were shot, and they had started working on their chemistry at house shows! Dammit, why couldn't WWE have tried to make Austin job to Lesnar 2 months later so we could atleast have gotten a PPV match. Ugh. Like I said, still bitter about that one, apparently their matches at the 3-4 house show events were so good that they caused Vince to finally give Eddie his singles push that he deserved.

Gonna watch the Matt Hardy vs Edge Cage match at Unforgiven, just watched their Street Fight and Ladder matches from Raw. I remember the cage match being the best of all, hope it holds up.

Edit- If you hate Trips making noises when he punches, you must HATE Mick Foley. I personally love all the Foley noises and grunts he does, especially the ones when he has a guy down and starts rolling off those Foley piston-like forearms to the head "likedislikedatlikedislikedatlakedatdatdatdat" is I believe what he's saying


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Thoughts on Jeff Hardy's "My Life, My Rules" DVD? Does anyone have it?

And is it worth getting, if I'm also getting the WWE Ladder DVDs?


Here's the listing for the Hardy DVD:



Spoiler: spoiler



Jeff Hardy has stunned the WWE Universe with amazing highlights in the ring and controversial moments out of it. Now fans can explore both sides fo this unconventional Superstar. Jeff Hardy: My Life, My Rules contains a revealing documentary packed with never-before-seen interviews from Jeff and both his closest confidants and biggest rivals. Recorded on the eve of beginning a new chapter in his life, Jeff discusses his tumultuous existence in 2008 and 2009, including his astounding rise to both the WWE and World Heavyweight Championships and his challenging personal struggles. Through the 27 matches on this 3-DVD set, fans can retrace Jeff's remarkable career, including a rare match from 1994, his tag team partnership with brother Matt, and battles for the Intercontinental, World Heavyweight and WWE Championships.

Phoenix, AZ - August 25, 2009

Jeff Returns

August 25, 2009 - 9:59 PM

Jeff and Matt Reunite - The Hardys!

August 25, 2009 - 10:03 PM

Opportunity Knocks

August 25, 2009 - 10:07 PM

Dark Days

Road to Redemption

August 25, 2009 - 10:12 PM

Sacrifice is Rewarded

August 25, 2009 - 10:15 PM

Brother vs. Brother

Living for the Moment

August 25, 2009 - 10:18 PM

Jeff's Omega?

Special Features

* Jeff's Faves

* Motocross

* Third Gear, Wide Open

* Jeff's Art Gallery

* Remembering Jack

* The Original Hardy Boy

* Will O' The Wisp

* Behind the Paint: Jeff Prepares for SummerSlam

* Gas Chamber Ink

* The Hardy Show

Matches

Jeff Hardy vs. 1-2-3 Kid
Superstars - June 25, 1994

Triangle Ladder Match for the World Tag Team Championship
The Hardy Boys vs. The Dudley Boyz vs Edge & Christian
WrestleMania 2000 - April 2, 2000
(Alternate Commentary with Jeff and Matt Hardy)

Steel Cage Match for the World Tag Team Championship
The Hardy Boys vs. Edge & Christian
Unforgiven - September 24, 2000

Hardcore Championship Match
Jeff Hardy vs. Mike Awesome
SmackDown! - July 12, 2001

Ladder Match for the Hardcore Championship
Jeff Hardy vs. Rob Van Dam
SummerSlam - August 19, 2001

Jeff Hardy vs. Matt Hardy
Vengeance - December 9, 2001

Jeff Hardy & Shawn Michaels vs. Chris Jericho & Christian
Raw - February 17, 2003

DISC 2

Jeff Hardy vs. Edge
Raw - August 21, 2006

Intercontinental Championship Match
Jeff Hardy vs. Johnny Nitro
Raw - October 2, 2006

World Tag Team Championship Match
The Hardys vs. Lance Cade & Trevor Murdoch
Backlash - April 29, 2007

#1 Contender's 4-Way Elimination Match for the Intercontinental Championship
Jeff Hardy vs. Shelton Benjamin vs. Santino Marella vs. William Regal
Raw - July 16, 2007

Intercontinental Championship Match
Jeff Hardy vs. Shelton Benjamin
Raw - September 17, 2007

Ladder Match for the Intercontinental Championship
Jeff Hardy vs. Carlito
Raw - December 10, 2007

Winner Receives a WWE Championship Match at Royal Rumble
Jeff Hardy vs. Triple H
Armageddon - December 16, 2007

Intercontinental Championship Match
Jeff Hardy vs. Randy Orton
Raw - January 14, 2008

WWE Championship Match
Jeff Hardy vs. Randy Orton
Royal Rumble - January 27, 2008

Jeff Hardy vs. Shawn Michaels
Raw - February 11, 2008

DISC 3

Falls Count Anywhere Match
Jeff Hardy vs. Umaga
One Night Stand: Extreme Rules - June 1, 2008

#1 Contender's Match for the WWE Championship
Jeff Hardy vs. John Cena
Raw - June 2, 2009

Jeff Hardy vs. John Morrison
SmackDown! - July 4, 2009

WWE Championship Match
Jeff Hardy vs. Triple H
No Mercy - October 5, 2008

Extreme Rules Match
Jeff Hardy vs. Undertaker
SmackDown - November 14, 2008

Triple Threat Match for the WWE Championship
Jeff Hardy vs. Triple H vs. Edge
Armageddon - December 14, 2008

Extreme Rules Match
Jeff Hardy vs. Dolph Ziggler
Raw - March 23, 2009

Stretcher Match
Jeff Hardy vs. Matt Hardy
SmackDown - April 10, 2009

World Heavyweight Championship Match
Jeff Hardy vs. CM Punk
Night of Champions - July 26, 2009

Steel Cage Match for the World Heavyweight Championship
Jeff Hardy vs. CM Punk
SmackDown - August 28, 2009


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The third disc of that DVD looks :mark: 

thinking about Buying Vengeance 2005 and Backlash 2004. I know Vengeance 05 is great, how is BL 04 outside of Orton/Foley?

EDIT: one match into Vengeance 02 and the opener is already better than any match from the last 4 shows I have reviewed except for maybe RVD/eddie and Angle/Edge!


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> The third disc of that DVD looks :mark:
> 
> thinking about Buying Vengeance 2005 and Backlash 2004. I know Vengeance 05 is great, how is BL 04 outside of Orton/Foley?


AMAZING triple threat main event with Benoit, HHH and Shawn. Almost as good as WM20. Worth it for those two matches alone but you also get a solid Shelton/Flair match and the rest of the card wasn't bad IIRC.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

LilOlMe said:


> Yeah, I like that RAW Hakushi match. It also seems like the blu ray comes with a lot more of Bret's commentary on the matches, right?
> 
> I know you guys have discussed this before, but I didn't pay attention because at the time it had no relation to me. How are the two Ladder match DVDs?


Yeah more commentary and different little interviews and fan questions as well. He talks about his artwork along with his favorite matches and opponents. Both Ladder match dvds are great, but the first one is definitely superior.




zep81 said:


> Im still on DVD


NERD!












redskins25 said:


> I need a ppv to watch, and no 2002


Summerslam 2005? Backlash 2007? No Way Out 2008?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Damn You Yeah!!!

Plenty of guys make noises when throwing punches and shit, but HHH just seems to be the worst of the worst.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Speaking of punching noises, who has the best of them? Benoit's intense yelling when chopping/punching or hitting an impact move is always awesome. Sheamus sounds funny when doing it repeatedly (specially when doing the rope clubbing). I also get a kick out of an Orton punch-fest because it sounds like he yells "douche" with every punch. If you don't know what I'm talking about, go watch any of his 2004 matches and listen when he repeatedly punches a guy, lol.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Cal, what 2002 ramble are you doing next? I think you should have to go through the travesty that is HBK/HHH 3SOH, because that show has BOOKDUST and Eddie/Benoit!


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

There are probably too many vocal things in wrestling I hate, and I think the one I hate the most is how a wrestler will ALWAYS put his teeth together and breathe outward with a stupid 'angry' face when doing choking somebody on the ropes. Well, generic shitty wrestlers like Ted DiBiase Jr seem to do it. And I have no idea why they do it. It's like the boring 'continuous stomp to use as heel beat down'; like they were taught this at wrestling school and went 'NOPE! THAT'S IT. That's what I've learnt and I'm doing anything creative with it.' Do they think they come off as more vicious? Personally I think they look ridiculously stupid and annoying and I want to throw bricks at their testicle. 



Cactus Jack said:


> Edit- If you hate Trips making noises when he punches, you must HATE Mick Foley. I personally love all the Foley noises and grunts he does, especially the ones when he has a guy down and starts rolling off those Foley piston-like forearms to the head "likedislikedatlikedislikedatlakedatdatdatdat" is I believe what he's saying


Oh God yeah. I know the noise. 'WAHDEH WAHDEH WAHDEH WAHDEH WAHDEH'


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Not sure what I'm gonna do next. Might go for KOTR, then watch Survivor Series so I can follow up a god awful main event with a super duper fun PPV, then back to some of the lesser ones before ending with SummerSlam.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

As for noises, Lex Luger makes the most hilariously over the top ones. This has been discussed here before, but I was watching one of his matches recently, and was thoroughly entertained by that alone. For a guy who self-admittedly didn't put much into becoming a great worker, he did seem to put a lot of effort into selling the shit out of something verbally. 

"AHHHH, OWWWWWWWWWWWW. AGHHHHH. OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!"


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Choke2Death said:


> Speaking of punching noises, who has the best of them? Benoit's intense yelling when chopping/punching or hitting an impact move is always awesome. Sheamus sounds funny when doing it repeatedly (specially when doing the rope clubbing). I also get a kick out of an Orton punch-fest because it sounds like he yells "douche" with every punch. If you don't know what I'm talking about, go watch any of his 2004 matches and listen when he repeatedly punches a guy, lol.


I thought I was the only one who noticed Legend Killer Orton's punches :lol rton2

The GOAT noise during matches is Jericho's yelling after just about everything. IDK how to even spell it, but everyone should know what I'm talking about


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Nothing beats Flairs noises when he's selling "oh, Jesus, oh god, you mother fucker, ahhhhhh Jesus Christ"

Actually I take that back, Terry Funk is right up there with Flair "Ah GAWD, Lawler you bastard, my eye, oh my eye, Lawler god damn you". Or when he's fighting Mick "Cactus, please, please don't do that, AHHH GOD YOU DID IT" :lmao


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Not sure what I'm gonna do next. Might go for KOTR, then watch Survivor Series so I can follow up a god awful main event with a super duper fun PPV, then back to some of the lesser ones before ending with SummerSlam.


Watch Rebellion soon, great show all around, got a whopping 20 on the cal scale

2 matches in and Vengeance has been great


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Not sure I'll like Rebellion as much as you . Hmmmm... seems I don't even have it. Must have accidentally deleted it while deleting one of the 02 shows I had watched . *downloads it again*


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Nothing beats Flairs noises when he's selling "oh, Jesus, oh god, you mother fucker, ahhhhhh Jesus Christ"
> 
> Actually I take that back, Terry Funk is right up there with Flair "Ah GAWD, Lawler you bastard, my eye, oh my eye, Lawler god damn you". Or when he's fighting Mick "Cactus, please, please don't do that, AHHH GOD YOU DID IT" :lmao


:lmao I was literally was just about to post this haha


my computer has been fucked up for the past two weeks, is does anybody else YouTube videos stop playing at random times ?c


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

It has an actually good Booker T match though! and a great CW match as well as a PHENOMANAL Angle and benoit vs Los Guerreros tag. Bork/Edge is OK too.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I might still end up liking it, but 20 on the CAL SCALE will put it as one of the top 10 PPV ever based on the events I've watched so far, and honestly I just don't see that happening . Hope the tag holds up though as I always loved that.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Are you watching it now?

Yeah tag is great but looking back at my review I'm pretty sure I went about 1/2* too high on the CW match, which would bring the score down to 18


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Nope, download it atm lol . Probably won't get to another 02 PPV until Monday, got other shit to do 2morrow!


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I am hoping to get my 2002 project done by Tuesday. Might not get another one done after tonight until Monday night when I'll probably do mania, and then get SS and SVS done and finish. 

Then Again, depends if the WWE title DVD comes Monday :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

MR. TOUCHDOWN APPEARANCE. I peaked. So did the thread.

Mick Foley's sound effects in matches is awesome. I often do them. What.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Primer said:


> MR. TOUCHDOWN APPEARANCE. I peaked. So did the thread.


Who? 

8 more 2002 PPV's to watch. Fuck me, 8? Feels like I've already watched a bunch of them, even with missing out RR and WM cos I did them earlier in the year :lmao.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Someone you should know. :mark:

Are you holding off on SummerSlam b/c it's godly & want to end on a high note? I think that's your way of doing it.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yep, saving the best until last .

Only person that has shown up and posted in here was Yeah... but I don't understand how the MR TOUCHDOWN would apply to him so fuck knows . Then again I also have no idea what your "nicknames" for me actually mean that you repped me with. YOU CRAZY.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Me crazy? Nah...Shoot. I was hoping you would have known. Watch *Talladega Nights: The Ballad of Ricky Bobby* and then come back to me. Magic Man.

Mr. Touchdown can apply to anyone. He's not Chuck Taylor so Jheri has no reason to hate him. Now with him being brought up, I await a rare, jerk riddled Seabs appearance. It's inevitable.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I understood nothing of that post.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Awesome. :lmao

K, UNDERTAKER. Now we're back.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

UNDERTAKER :mark:. His heel character in 2002 has to be my all time fav heel character along with 05 Eddie.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

All about that respect. Beating up David Flair to coax Flair into a match at WM. How isn't he everyone's favorite wrestler? :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Build up to the Flair match is GOAT. Attacking ARN too. Only for ARN to come back at WRESTLE-FUCKING-MANIA and get a Rock/Hogan type reaction for the SPINEBUSTER :mark:.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

ARN. Spinebuster was so boss too. Fans legit thought that was gonna be it for Taker. Everything about that was :mark:

Kind of hits you after it happens that it was UNDERTAKER vs FLAIR at WrestleMania. The coolest. Glad that was Taker's opponent when he was heel during that bit.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

For me, Undertaker Vs Flair will ALWAYS be the BIGGEST match on the WM 18 card. Undertaker beating Flair to get to *10* at WM is pretty :mark: too. Love how he stands on the apron at the end and counts on his fingers how many WM wins he had.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> UNDERTAKER :mark:. His heel character in 2002 has to be my all time fav heel character along with 05 Eddie.


Agreed, although I'd add late 80s Rick Rude, 1998 Jericho, and 2011 Mark Henry to that list. Love that Wm18 build :mark:

Alright, I'm not sure if there are any other dorks like me in this thread who like to read books (my god, who does that?) but if there are any, I have something for you.

David Shumacher, who writes wrestling articles as "The Masked Man" on Grantland.com and formerly "Dead Wrestler of the Week" on Deadspin just released his first book, "The Squared Circle". It's both a history of wrestling, and also a biography of several wrestlers, from Eddie, Benoit, and Macho Man, to Curt Hennig, Bruiser Brody, and Andre the Giant. It just came out on Oct. 31 and I'm already half way through. I think it's absolutely tremendous, he does a terrific job of covering the earliest days of wrestling and showing how we ended up where we are today, while also selecting a dozen or so wrestlers who in some way helped the sport evolve and move along. I highly reccomend it to anyone, you can find it on Amazon right now http://www.amazon.com/The-Squared-C...qid=1383439086&sr=8-1&keywords=Squared+circle


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)




----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

This is my favourite conversation in this thread ever







. Undertaker after WM threatening to "reach into his bag of WM tricks" to get Flair to do shit for him was :mark:.

I LIKE WRESTLING BOOKS. Got a bunch of autobiographies. Even started writing my own a few years back, but some rather serious personal issues caused me to give up and I never got back into it.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

That's funny, the first thing that jumped to mind when you mentioned heel 02' Taker was the Flair build/match at Mania, and while I was writing that post you guys jumped in and brought it up before I could hit "reply"

I'll take Flair vs Taker ANYDAY OF THE WEEK over Rock vs Hogan as far as goosebumps inducing moments. That moment when Arn comes out and gives Taker a spine buster trumps anything that happened in Rock/Hogan for me personally. I'm getting goosebumps just thinking about it.

Edit- Cal then I highly reccomend that book to you, you seem like a pretty intellectual guy, and that book is most certainly for the intelligent wrestling fan. It's only $10 if you have a kindle/tablet


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I find it amazing how much I marked the fuck out for ARN hitting the Spinebuster back in 02, when honestly I didn't know anything about Arn, hadn't seen much of Flair at all, and was in full on UNDERTAKER MARK mode too . THE POWER OF ARN~!


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Here ya go Cal (and the rest of you NERDS out there!)


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I thought Rock vs Hogan hit all the sweet spots, but no doubt Taker vs Flair meant more to me & was one I've always thought more of at the end of the day. It was built up so well. Flair the semi-retired legend being forced into a match after feeling like his time was done. Taker being the ultimate bully prick making things as personal as possible. Then the war they ended up having. Ah. Bliss.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> I find it amazing how much I marked the fuck out for ARN hitting the Spinebuster back in 02, when honestly I didn't know anything about Arn, hadn't seen much of Flair at all, and was in full on UNDERTAKER MARK mode too . THE POWER OF ARN~!



I'm from Virginia, so I grew up on both WWE AND WCW. WWE has always run in DC which is like 45 min from my house, and WCW always put on shows in Baltimore which is like 1 hour 15 min from my place. We have both Hulkamaniacs and Four Horsemen territory here, and we always had both shows on cable. So the significance of seeing Arn come out was double huge for me, the last time I remembered seeing him was when he gave Curt Hennig his spot in the Four Horsemen on Nitro in 97' I think.


Fuck it, I'm watching that match now. I had Rhyno/Jericho SS01' on tap but this trumps it.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

After I finish 2002 PPV's I might go through Undertaker's entire heel run. Got all the TV shows from when he turned in late 01 to when he turned face so yeah, can be done :mark:.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'll pop on the ladder match vs Jeff Hardy and allow that to suffice for the lack of TV shows I got with him being heel at the time.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

UNDERTAKER.

His early years are often considered crap so do the experts (CAL) know if he has any great matches prior to 1996? I kinda wanna go through his whole career (as THE UNDERTAKER that is) but it's way too massive.

And CAL, you ain't forgotten the 04 stuff, have you?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> UNDERTAKER.
> 
> His early years are often considered crap so do the experts (CAL) know if he has any great matches prior to 1996? I kinda wanna go through his whole career (as THE UNDERTAKER that is) but it's way too massive.
> 
> And CAL, you ain't forgotten the 04 stuff, have you?




I'm not Cal, but one match that immediately jumps to mind is Taker vs Diesel WM12. Very very good big man match. If you want only matches before 1996, then I'm at a loss. Some really like his Yoko match at RR.


It wasn't Takers fault for having a lot of sub par matches early in his WWE time, look who WWE was putting him with.

I feel like the Mankind feud was the first time Taker was given a good opponent to have a series of matches with.

Oh yea, he has a good match with Bret Hart in MSG in 1992.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well the ladder match is certainly one of the biggest highlights of his heel run .


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Great matches prior to 96? Well it depends on what you consider to be GREAT. ****+ kinda matches? ***1/2+? The DIESEL WM match is definitely up there. He had some super fun matches with FLAIR in 92. There is a Bret match from 92 as well I think that everyone raves about. I'm not as high on it as others but still worth a watch. SNME tag with Flair against Hogan and Sid is pure fun. Handicap match with Hogan &... Warrior maybe (?) against Undertaker, Slaughter and Adnan is fun fun fun too. Yoko matches are better than they have any right to be. 

And I haven't forgotten about the 04 matches. I'll try and get them online in the next few days .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Ladder match is too great. One of the best from 2002, imo.

Undertaker was good in his early years. Even with the morbid zombie gimmick stuck to him. A good portion of the time it was his opponents who held him down. They're still fun & that good stuff. I may be the only guy who likes the Hogan matches - especially the Tuesday in Texas bout. Some of his best matches around those days off the top of my head seem to be all of his casket matches. vs Yokozuna, Kamala (iirc), & vs King Mabel. Got to see that Bret Hart gem Corey (JE187) always plugs.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yep, basically ★★★ or higher. Even ★★½ stuff like the Hogan Survivor Series match. (one of the few I've seen)



Cactus Jack said:


> I'm not Cal, but one match that immediately jumps to mind is Taker vs Diesel WM12. Very very good big man match. If you want only matches before 1996, then I'm at a loss. Some really like his Yoko match at RR.
> 
> It wasn't Takers fault for having a lot of sub par matches early in his WWE time, look who WWE was putting him with.


What about his work against Ultimate Warrior?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

A lot of no-selling happens in those matches. Undertaker b/c it was his gimmick and Warrior b/c Hellwig is insane. Bodybag match wasn't special, but I'm ever so slightly biased to the point of saying watch all the oldies for yourself and see what tickles your fancy.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'll defend Undertaker to my GRAVE (sorta no pun intended ) as being a good worker at the very least for the first half of the 90's. The bullshit notion of him being a bad worker makes me :lmao. He worked his gimmick PERFECTLY. He got one of the most ridiculous gimmicks ever OVER and kept it OVER for over 20 years now. He worked his gimmick into his matches PERFECTLY. He could SELL extremely well, especially within the limits of the gimmick. And he was able to get watchable matches out of some of the most useless, terrible, immovable fat/tall fucks ever. Yeah, he wasn't having ***** every week in the early 90's, but come on, does anyone HONESTLY think guys like FLAIR or HBK would have gotten anything better out of Giant Gonzales or Mabel or Kamala? I often see everyone claim FOLEY made Undertaker, when really all it was is that WWE FINALLY started giving Undertaker competent workers in 96 (started with Bret at RR, Diesel at WM... as surprising as that may seem), and Foley was the MAIN one. They had a big feud and Foley could WORK and it allowed Undertaker to finally show everyone what he CAN do when he isn't against some megafatty who struggles to fucking walk.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Cody already mentioned it and Cal dropped it in as well, but yes. The MSG match agsinst Bret from 1/31/92 is the best pre-96 match I've ever seen from the Undertaker. The Casket Match with Yoko from Rumble '94 is an absolute blast as well.

Due to his gimmick his matches obviously weren't all that competitive in the early years. I mean, how long did it take for the guy to beat Hogan for the belt? Like two months?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It took Undertaker a year to win the championship, mate. Haha.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Looks like there's much more TAKER stuff from early 90s to dig through than I would've expected. Right now I have RR 97 on tap so a match with Vader will be coming up.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Is the WM 8 match against the snake any good? I thought I heard somewhere that it was fun..


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Undertaker Vs Roberts:



Spoiler: WM 8 match



Match 2 - The Undertaker Vs Jake Roberts - A lot had changed since the last WrestleMania. The Undertaker was now a babyface, and also a former WWF Champion! The Undertaker and Jake had a short alliance, with The Undertaker helping Jake in his feud with The Ultimate Warrior. Eventually though, The Undertaker turned on Jake, helping out Randy Savage and Elizabeth when Jake was about to attack them. The pre-match promo by Jake was great, as he talked about his recent actions on the Funeral Parlour (The Undertaker & Paul Bearer’s “talk show” segment). Jake trapped The Undertaker’s hands in a coffin, and proceeded to DDT Paul Bearer, then hit The Undertaker in the back with a steel chair, not once but twice! However, The Undertaker did not go down, which would have any normal man worried. Jake, however, was not normal. He claimed that once he lands the DDT, not even The Undertaker can survive! A very different start to this WrestleMania match for The Undertaker. He begins by stalking his opponent, missing numerous attempts at grabbing Jake, and taking a lot of punches. All of which had no effect. Jake sends The Undertaker over the ropes, but he lands on his feet, drags Jake out and throws him into the ring post! Roberts is persistent though, and continues to dodge The Undertaker’s attacks and keeps throwing quick jabs at him. Throughout all of this, The Undertaker seemingly has just one direction; forward. No matter what Roberts does to him, he keeps moving forward, moving towards Jake, until he finally gets his hands on him (or rather hand on his neck ). The pop The Undertaker got last year as a heel when he landed his leaping lariat is nothing compared to the one he gets now as a face. A Tombstone looks to be next for Roberts, but he reverses it into a DDT! The Undertaker is OUT! Roberts takes his time, looking very pleased with himself, but The Undertaker SITS UP! Jake doesn’t waste any time, as he lands a second DDT! With The Undertaker down a second time, Jake thinks he is out for good, and goes after Paul Bearer! AGAIN The Undertaker sits up, and goes to the outside to save his manager. TOMBSTONE PILEDRIVER ON THE FLOOR! By today’s standards, that’s pretty brutal, but for 1991, it was EPIC. And a little fun fact, the Tombstone was supposed to take place inside the ring, but Jake changed the finish as to make him seem “stronger” on his way out, as he wouldn’t be beaten with a finisher in the middle of the ring. The Undertaker drags a lifeless Jake back into the ring, and The Streak continues! Not exactly a technical classic, but the way both guys play to their characters is great. The Undertaker wants his hands on Jake for what he did to him and Paul at the Funeral Parlour, and Jake knows he needs to avoid The Undertaker and wear him down as much as possible so he can land the DDT. Speaking of the DDT... it might be a basic move these days, but back then, it was death. When Jake hit the DDT, a match was OVER. So for The Undertaker to sit up from not one, but TWO DDT’s, that was impressive as hell, and showed the world that The Undertaker was someone to watch. Certainly not one of his best WrestleMania matches, but probably a personal favourite of mine, since I love both guys, and felt they did an awesome job too. **.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The Primer said:


> It took Undertaker a year to win the championship, mate. Haha.


:lol Shit, my b. Didn't know you turned Australian either. 



Choke2Death said:


> Looks like there's much more TAKER stuff from early 90s to dig through than I would've expected. Right now I have RR 97 on tap so a match with Vader will be coming up.


Nowhere near as good as their Canadian Stampede match. Did you watch that lucha match by chance?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

THREE DDTS. TOMBSTONE CITY.

Redundant but idc - fun match.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Nowhere near as good as their Canadian Stampede match. Did you watch that lucha match by chance?


Haha, not yet. Only watched Goldust vs HHH a couple of nights ago and haven't gotten to the rest yet. That lucha match sounds entertaining for all the wrong reasons. :lol


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I think Im stopping my summerslam 05 viewing, my internet is fucking pissing me off, YT and DM is always laggy and the video just stops randomly and goes down to 144-240p, fuck should actually buy some DVD I guess


Too add to the convo somewhat

flair/taker mania is :homer, I have to admit Ive always been a flair guy, but over the years Ive started to love Arn, the ENFORCER :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm geographically ambiguous, Corey. :hayley1

You're gonna have a field day with laughter once you watch the Lucha mess. Brought me to near tears.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

After Flair/Taker I got sidetracked and ended up watching Xpac/Tajiri SS01' just for shits and giggles.

Two things:

1. Is this Sean Waltmans best match as Xpac? I know the Bret Hart match on Raw is better, but he was 1-2-3 Kid there. I'm tempted to say yes, this is XPAC's best match.

2. Did WWE pipe in loud boos to go along with his entrance music, or is that just part of the song? Every time that particular entrance song hit (The Xfactor song, not the DX song) it sounds like there is the same really really loud booing in the background.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Just watched your unboxing video Cal. Your rant on The Rock being on the cover was the best part. :lol You would think with the Phenom Edition of the game one of the most obvious things they would do would be to give you a Undertaker cover of the game, but nope.  How much did the Phenom Edition cost btw?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Don't know WWE to pipe in anything on PPVs unless it was to cover up Holy Shit chants on later releases. So it's probably a no. X-Pac usually got really good heat.

Best X-Pac match? Might be. Trying to piece everything together. Feel my mind is clouded. Eh, it's def top five. And it's fabulous. I know that much right now.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Nostalgia said:


> Just watched your unboxing video Cal. Your rant on The Rock being on the cover was the best part. :lol You would think with the Phenom Edition of the game one of the most obvious things they would do would be to give you a Undertaker cover of the game, but nope.  How much did the Phenom Edition cost btw?


£59.99.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Ah, thought it would be more than that. I was in HMV earlier and saw the game going for £40 and I was actually tempted to buy it, but I didn't. IF I get the game it will probably be around December time when the game hopefully drops in price a bit and more DLC will be available. I've bought a WWE game each year for god knows how long now, but this year I've lost interest (much like I've lost interest in wrestling in general these past few months) but I'll probably end up getting it eventually lol.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Aren't the only "new" additions on the game The Shield & Cesaro? Remember reading the roster and not caring about having all the same people again.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Cesaro was in last year's game as DLC. Shield are new this year though, so are The Prime Time Players. Also guys like Big E and Fandango are new this year but they're DLC.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I literally have played my wwe 13 about 5x and 3 of them was with my big bro, soo boring, I liked svr 11 though. Listening to Gaga after see the John wall commercial for the 50x day, dont judge

I guess back to nitro mat


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Roster rarely changes in WWE so it kills the fun in looking forward to the roster each year. Seems like the only thing they change a lot year by year are the legends.

Need to watch something to remove the video game talk.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Got two matches left on Vengeance 2002, really looking forward to the ME! 

Thinking about doing a mania project after this just get all of them reviewed. I have reviewed some but will just do it all again or else I get bored.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

UnAmericans vs Hogan & Edge is a nice match. I like it. Apparently I'm the only one.

Brock vs RVD & the Triple Threat are tons of :mark:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Main event time, Hogan tag was meh, gave it **


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

What am I seeing that no else is? I'm not sure. Think I'm just a really big Hogan fan.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I might actually finish No Way Out 2004 tonight 8*D


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Struggling to finish when you're on the MOTN. 8*D


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao come on muderface Eddie/Brock :mark: it's venomly good (too much ?)


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Hey I have barely been home lately, so get off my case


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

LilOlMe said:


> As for noises, Lex Luger makes the most hilariously over the top ones. This has been discussed here before, but I was watching one of his matches recently, and was thoroughly entertained by that alone. For a guy who self-admittedly didn't put much into becoming a great worker, he did seem to put a lot of effort into selling the shit out of something verbally.
> 
> "AHHHH, OWWWWWWWWWWWW. AGHHHHH. OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!"


The hell did I forget Luger? William Regal screams like that sometimes, but his is more manly and incredible. Luger's are hilariously incredible. 



PGSucks said:


> I thought I was the only one who noticed Legend Killer Orton's punches :lol rton2
> 
> The GOAT noise during matches is Jericho's yelling after just about everything. IDK how to even spell it, but everyone should know what I'm talking about


HOW DID I FORGET JERICHO TOO!? He makes the exact same noise every time he runs to do something. Yeah...it isn;t possible to write it in words.



The Primer said:


> Me crazy? Nah...Shoot. I was hoping you would have known. Watch *Talladega Nights: The Ballad of Ricky Bobby* and then come back to me. Magic Man.
> 
> Mr. Touchdown can apply to anyone. He's not Chuck Taylor so Jheri has no reason to hate him. Now with him being brought up, I await a rare, jerk riddled Seabs appearance. It's inevitable.


I agree with Cal that almost nothing in this post makes sense, but it's one of my favourites in a while. :side:

EDIT - was meant to be a mark smiley ad not a side one but I'll leave it because it makes little sense. 



Callamus said:


> Yoko matches are better than they have any right to be.


They should be better, to be frank. YOKO.




I was hoping in Cal's unboxing video when he says 'assuming it is what I think it is' that he was wrong and it'd take him two hours to open the box and find out there was a moose plushy in there or something.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

So I finished watching that lucha match from RR 97. Hahaha, what the fuck was this? I don't think there's a single thing they do in this match makes any sense. :lol


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

So, I was bored and decided to work on a beat (I make hip hop and electro beats as a hobby) and I ended up sampling "Just Dance" by Gaga for a hip hop beat. I don't know if it's the best beat I've ever made or the worst, but it sure is interesting :lmao

Just found a Benoit match I haven't seen, Benoit vs Jericho Fall Brawl 1996. Bout to watch it, anyone else seen it?


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> So, I was bored and decided to work on a beat (I make hip hop and electro beats as a hobby) and I ended up sampling "Just Dance" by Gaga for a hip hop beat. I don't know if it's the best beat I've ever made or the worst, but it sure is interesting :lmao
> 
> Just found a Benoit match I haven't seen, Benoit vs Jericho Fall Brawl 1996. Bout to watch it, anyone else seen this?
> 
> Btw- just read that Bryan is done with the WWE title picture for the foreseeable future. Are you kidding me? That's the best they could do for a Bryan push? Really?? I can't believe I allowed myself to think for one second that all this Trips burying would leave to Bryan finally getting the upper hand in the end and making him tap at Mania. Trips put the stop on the Summer of Punk, and now he's cooled Bryan's jets. Does this man have no shame?


I strangely wanna hear this beat... 

As for the last part I think it would've been best to put it in spoiler tags (even though it's pretty obvious they're going the Orton vs. Show route) seeing as I know there's some folks in here that don't like to read any of the spoilers or dirt sheets or whatever. BUT, in response I don't like it at all because Orton vs. Show puts me to sleep. Let's look at it on the positive side and remember what happened to Punk in 2011. He lost at a couple PPVs in a row, then won the big one and went on to have a 434 day WWE Title reign. If the similar thing somehow happens with Bryan at maybe TLC or the Rumble, none of us will be complaining anymore.  Not saying Bryan would hold the belt that long though, nowhere close.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I'm fine with Daniel Bryan floating around the upper-midcard for a bit before his payoff at WrestleMania. We already have enough BRYAN DANIELSON IS SO STALE threads. 

Thinking I'm gonna watch something after the Nevada vs. Fresno game


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yea I would prefer if you guys put that stuff in spoilers as I read NONE of that stuff, but in this case it was fairly obivs so care on 


Watching the first wargames with ghostbuster on in the background

Watch some real football Pg, like fsu/miami , a friend of mines on the FSU team


----------



## GOON (Jan 23, 2010)

Oh, man. I'm about to witness the encounter between BIG POPPA PUMP and THE GAME from the 2003 Royal Rumble for my 2003 Pay Per View project :mark:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Shit that's my bad fellas, I don't even know how to do those fucking spoiler tags, I'm a complete idiot when it comes to forum stuff. Can't even post a YouTube video.

I just deleted it sorry about that. It was fairly obvious, and I was pretty sure that's what they were doing, but when some guy just posted it in the main section I couldn't help myself so I read it.

I never read Spoilers either, I like to be surprised.

Edit- for the record, this Benoit/Jericho FB96' match is GLORIOUS. Their best singles match outside RR 2001. Perfect Cruiserweight style match ****1/4


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

redskins25 said:


> Yea I would prefer if you guys put that stuff in spoilers as I read NONE of that stuff, but in this case it was fairly obivs so care on
> 
> 
> Watching the first wargames with ghostbuster on in the background
> ...


That's actually really cool. My teammate in high school (QB who stole the girl I liked :side is gonna play DI (UNC I think), so that's the closest I can come to that 

Okay, Nevada's about to get hosed. Time to peruse YouTube...

EDIT: MAYBE NOT :kaep


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah, so for some reason my computer kept freezing and the video just wasn't loading for some reason. Did a virus scan and it turns out I got a BAD virus from downloading a torrent yesterday. So, just starting the Vengeance main event now, really pumped for it!


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Spoiler: bryan etc



I'm not really surprised that Bryan isn't truly going anywhere, but it still kind of hurts. HHH can get fucked.



Spoiler tags are just 



Spoiler: something



whatever you wanna write





Youtube videos are a pain in the ass to post here, though. I've been here five years (ffs.....) and still have to quote someone who's already done one to figure it out.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Nah I'm just messing with you I HATE CFB, can watch nfl/mlb/nba/college baskball etc.. just not that, and I just know someone on the team not close friends with yadda yadda



May watch some more wargames after this one


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Copy everything in the Youtube URL that comes AFTER the = sign and insert it inbetween this:

[*youtube][*/youtube]

Normally it's just gonna be a bunch of random letters and numbers. Just remove my stars.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Skins I hear ya, College Football is terrible unless your AT the game. 

This triple threat is brilliant so far


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

redskins25 said:


> Nah I'm just messing with you I HATE CFB, can watch nfl/mlb/nba/college baskball etc.. just not that, and I just know some on it the team not close friends yadda yadda
> 
> 
> 
> May watch some more wargames after this one


I don't get how people will try to tell me that CFB > NFL. fpalm

I think I'm gonna watch some :eddie after this game.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Vengeance 2002 review​*
*Match # 1: Spike and Bubba Dudley vs Eddie Gurrero and Chris Benoit tables match* 

:mark:, I’d prefer a normal match between these 4 but whatever, this will still be awesome. So nice to see Benoit back after the last 4 shows I have reviewed he was MIA due to injury. Yeah this match is pretty fucking awesome, and a great start to the night. Funny how WWE had 4 bad shows in a row leading up to this but when BENOIT returns the shows become awesome again, GREATEST WORKER EVER? Anyways even Spike and Bubba are great and I wish D-von was here. but he was stuck doing that shitty priest gimmick right? Definitely check this out. *** ¾* 

*CAL SCALE: 4 *

*Match # 2: Billy Kidman vs Jamie Noble *

:mark:, I’ve been needing some good cruiserweight action after NONE of it besides the shitty Booker T match in like the last 4-5 shows. Yeah this match is good like seemingly all cruiserweight matches in 02 NOT involving Booker. Really liked Nobles Gimmick here TBH because he is like some ******* fromThis isn’t on the level of Tajiri/Kidman from backlash but it is still pretty fun. ***

*CAL SCALE: 2*

*Match # 3: Jeff Hardy vs William Regal*

On paper this sounds awesome, but Regal has gotten no respect for some reason in 2002. This match is like a5 minute squash all the way through, and to make it worse, Regal cries after, he’s like Big Show in 2013 :lmao. Anyway, nothing special here, just disrespect of Regal. * 

*CAL SCALE: 0*

*Match # 4: Chris Jericho vs John Cena *

CENA PPV DEBUT! God, he looks even more like a loser in 2002 . Cena might be the most frail looking heel I have ever seen because in 2002 he had like NO muscles, which is basically the entire basis of Cena’s character today except for the hustle crap. Decent match, but really nothing special TBH, it was quite short but it got the job done, to put Cena over and shove Jericho back to the midcard. This was Cena’s debut and I thought he did a decent job, but I’m pretty sure his first must see watch was vs Brock at BL 03. **
'
*CAL SCALE: 0.5 *

*Match # 5: RVD vs Brock Lesnar *

KOTR rematch here, think I had that match in the 2-3 stars area, hopefully they’ll be given more time here as the KOTR match was less than 10 minutes long IIRC. Yeah this was solid, MUCH better than their KOTR match considering they got at least 15 minutes. Really solid back and forth match that kept me thoroughly entertained for its position on the card. I honestly didn’t mind the finish because you didn’t want to give Brock a clean loss and obviously since hes getting the title shot at SS there is no need for him to get the belt. Brock stands strong at the end anyways and RVD can say he was the first person to beat BORK. *** ½* 

*CAL SCALE: 3 *

*Match # 6: Big Show vs Booker T *

OH HELLLL NO

*CAL SCALE: -1 *

*Match # 7: Christian and Lance storm vs Hulk Hogan and Edge*

Pretty sure Hogan left soon after this and the NWO gimmick was over as it was HULKAMANIA again. Hope this OK and not a flat out DUD. Well Lance Storm and Christian are in it so that’s AWESOME. This was pretty much just your standard filler tag match that happened to involve the biggest name in wrestling history. Match was kind of just there, and nothing much to say about it TBH. **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5 *

*Match # 8: Kurt Angle vs the Rock vs the Undertaker *

HERE WE GO! I’ve been looking forward to this for a while! This match is supposed to be very good, so high expectations going in. This is Rock’s big return to PPV as he has been MIA since his mania match with Hogan. Man what a fucking match this was, one of the better triple threats in WWE history IMO. Obviously the HHH/Benoit/HBK matches are better(well at least mania is) but this might be #2 or #3. Then again, I haven’t seen nearly enough of them to justify that, but whatever. Who is the star in this match? I’d prolly say taker, as he is the most consistent throughout the match. But seriously, all three men do a phenomenal job in this match. This is just further cementing the possibility of taker being WOAT, but SO MANY FUCKING CHOICES! Anyways check this out! **** ¼* 

*CAL SCALE: 6 *

*TOTAL CAL SCALE: 15 *

*CURRENT 2002 PPV MOTY: Brock Lesnar vs The Undertaker HIAC *

*CURRENT 2002 PPV RANKINGS
1: rebellion(20)
2: The Royal rumble(18)
3: No mercy(15.5)
4: Armageddon(15.5)
5: Vengeance(15) 
6: Unforgiven(15) 
7: No way out (12)
8: Backlash (11.5)
9: Judgment day(11) 
10: King of the ring(10.5)
11: Insurrection (1)​*


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Benoit really has that effect. The Attitude Era for me got good after January 2000, which was when Benoit debuted. Then it got really good in 2001 when he was main eventing. Then it tailed off after he broke his neck, but that was due to Invasion being botched. Smackdown was the best brand when he was on it, and then immediately when he switched to RAW in 2004, it went from the worst show on television to the best.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

BENOIT FTW! 

watching Cena/Jericho SVS 2008, really solid so far, maybe I'll start WM 18 after, or maybe I'll watch something else IDK


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Watching more CM PUNK :mark:.

Punk-Hardy series tonight :mark:.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Have any of you guys had the privilege of seeing The Undertaker's entrance live and in person? That's one thing I need to cross off my bucket list at some point


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

No. unk3 It really sucks because I went to a SD in 04 and they teased him, but he didn't show up.

Bray Wyatt's entrance is pretty cool live though. Oh, and Bryan's too just because of DEM YES CHANTS.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Watching more CM PUNK :mark:.
> 
> Punk-Hardy series tonight :mark:.


:mark: Please join me in the club of people that think Punk/Hardy Bash 09 is awesome. Criminally underrated, just like so many other "feud-advancing" matches (Undertaker/Lesnar Unforgiven 2002, Undertaker/HBK IYH: GZ, Lesnar/Show SvS 02).

And then go watch some CM Punk tag matches, starting with the FUN 6-Man tag with Bryan, Jericho, Ziggler, Otunga, and Henry. Then watch the Punk/Sheamus tags, and end it with Punk/Cena tags.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Punk tag matches, ya say? You should pop in _Best in the World_ and watch the match where he and Kofi win the tag straps from Rhodes & Dibiase. Underrated stuff that's totally better because it's uninterrupted on the dvd.

EDIT: I just wasted so much of my life by watching an Orton vs. Sandow match from the go-home RAW to Summerslam. Got so much time and it was a bunch of nothing. Nothing I tell ya! What a predictable finish too. Thankfully Cody Rhodes was entertaining on commentary.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

PGSucks said:


> No. unk3 It really sucks because I went to a SD in 04 and they teased him, but he didn't show up.
> 
> Bray Wyatt's entrance is pretty cool live though. Oh, and Bryan's too just because of DEM YES CHANTS.


Yeah, Wyatt and Bryan are sooo epic


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

OK, I don't usually come in this thread, but I just checked out a match recently and...well, I have a part review/part clarification in my post here.

First, the match.

WCW/AAA When Worlds Collide. Los Gringos Locos vs Octagon and El Hijo Del Santo. 

Got the idea to watch it from Meltzer, as he apparently rated it 5 stars. I find that Dave's opinion is usually at least in the ballpark of mine, so if he rated it so highly, I figured I'd check it out. Never saw it before, Eddy Guerrero is in it playing a heel...couldn't be that bad.

I can honestly say that I didn't get this match...like, at all. That's where the clarification part comes in. Perhaps some of you can check out the video and help me get it because I'm not seeing how this is anywhere close to 5 stars. Hell, I've seen some call it one of the greatest tag matches in history and I honestly thought it...well, sucked. Did I get the right video?






Anyway, where to begin...

First, this is a masks vs hair 2/3 falls match. Sounds straight forward enough.

So a few minutes in, Art Barr gets Del Santo on his shoulders like in a Doomsday Device position, while Eddy gets on the top rope and delivers a Hurricanrana to him. Del Santo couldn't get fully over Barr's head and instead of taking the flip bump off of Barr's shoulders, took a nose dive and face planted Eddy's crotch. Didn't look good, I thought. Anyway, he gets pinned. Alright, the Gringos are up 1-0.

Then a Superplex is delivered to Octagon by Eddy, while Barr follows it up with (I admit) a pretty sweet frog splash and pins Octagon. OK, so I figured the match was over.

Wrong. Mike Tenay informs us that in this 2/3 falls contest, BOTH members on a team have to be pinned for there to be 1 fall. I was very confused. First of all, this is like no other 2/3 falls rule I've heard before, and second, they didn't explain it before the match very well. It was after the first fall when the match ended that they made told us, and I thought it was done at that point. Badly laid out.

We continue. After another few minutes of some pretty crisp work, particularly from the Gringos, Del Santo is eliminated again. So...he just goes and chills on the outside. I'm confused again. Apparently, when you're pinned, you can't wrestle again...until the fall is over, at which point it resets and you CAN wrestle again? 

So Octagon is in there by himself, getting beaten up. He makes a comeback, Barr kind of catapults him over his head onto Eddy's shoulders, which Octagon turns into a Hurricanrana and pins Eddie. Then he gives Barr a Russian Leg Sweep which he transitions into a submission move and Barr IMMEDIATELY tap. We're tied, 1-1.

These two falls took place within a span of...8 minutes or so. My question-what was the point of them? They were so fast, they felt hardly built up to. There felt like no psychology or storytelling at all. They just traded really quick falls and it felt meaningless. Not to mention Mike Tenay and Scott Hudson (sounded sort of like him) felt so emotionless when the babyfaces evened it up. It was like calling another move.

We continue. At this point the match just sort of fell apart for me. Eddy gets Del Santo in a camel clutch. Octagon casually strolls in and kicks him in the face. The ref stands by and just says "meh". Octagon poses and helps Del Santo up, then walks back to the corner. Del Santo gets Eddy in his own camel clutch. Art Barr comes in the ring casually, lines himself up and gives a savat kick to the back of Del Santo's head. Ref again says "meh" and does nothing. Then Art Barr takes over for Eddy and starts beating Del Santo down. Keep in mind, no tag has been made-the heel has just entered himself into the match to relieve his partner just because. 

Well, Octagon figures two can play at that game. So he again casually strolls in, sets himself up and kicks Barr in the ribs. The babyfaces then double team the heel in front of the ref. Again, ref is fine with this, but he does have the time to go over to Eddy and tell him he better not get in the ring. The storytelling felt so off. 

Eddy then breaks up a pinfall attempt by Del Santo, who then rolls out of the ring. So Octagon, with no tag made again, just gets in and replaces him, laying into Barr with kicks. Once more, ref is totally down. Eddy takes exception and comes in just to thumb Octaon in the eye so blatantly in front of the ref (I admit, I laughed). He then gets Octagon up in a fucked up looking Gory Special where he can't hook one of the legs. But that's OK, because Del Santo comes in again to replace Octagon, once more, without a tag.

Anyway, this is a shitty WWE version of the match and part was cut out. Barr hits a Tombstone to Octagon, which Tenay identifies as "there's that move!" Octagon is eliminated. Barr hits a clothesline to Del Santo, while Eddy transitions that into a German suplex with a really ugly looking bridge. 

Only Del Santo is left. The Gringos hit their Superplex/frog splash combo. This pinned Octagon before. Del Santo kicks out. Why? This same move eliminated his partner before in a nothing fall, but now Del Santo can kick out after 10 more minutes of wrestling have gone by? Wouldn't it make more sense to kick out of the earlier one and just get pinned by the later one?

Blue Panther interferes and helps Del Santo eliminate Barr. 1 on 1 now. The next few minutes I really didn't like. It felt very fragmented. Eddy would hit a move, then go for a pin, which Del Santo would kick out of. Then...Eddy would hit a move, then go for a pin, which Del Santo would kick out of. They did this same exact thing like...3-4 times. Then, after Del Santo has been getting pummeled for several minutes straight...he hits a forward roll into a cradle...and gets the clean pin. WHAT? Totally out of nowhere, no real build up to it or a comeback of any sort, it was just like "boom match over." Did NOT like the finish.


So yeah, I am puzzled beyond belief how this match got a 5 star rating. Look at the description in the video:

"Double Mask vs Hair Match. One of the greatest lucha matches of all time. 2 of the biggest faces against 2 of the best heels in lucha. Watch alongisde the electrified LA Sports Arena one of the decade defining matches of all of wrestling"

One of the greatest lucha matches of all time? Nitro routinely put out better matches than this. Decade defining matches in all of wrestling? Did I miss something? What did this define? All I saw was a **1/2 match AT BEST. I gave it this rating because I did enjoy the Gringos heel work, with some being legitimately laugh out loud, and the in ring work was, in general, pretty decent (again, particularly from the Gringos). But the rest of the match was just a giant WTF to me.

Am I just...completely missing something? What the hell was so great about this match, it felt like a total mess.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

On last watch I found the AAA overrated as hell (though still pretty good). I can think of a match el Hijo del Santo had that same month that's probably better. I have no idea why, of all lucha matches that could to be popular among the journalistic types, it's *that* one that's constantly given five stars and appreciated over everything else. 

I should mention lucha tags often don't need an actual physical 'tag'. Helps stuff like trios or 4 v. 4 matches get more loony and berserk and incredible. The break up sounded kind of dumb, though. Lucha tags also have bizarre pinning rules sometimes, though IDK why the 'pinning both partners' thing would be a bother. Tenay probably would have said something at the beginning of the show about that (the opener was the Rey/Fuerza/Psicosis tag, IIRC?)

Also FWIW the tombstone was illegal in Mexico and Art Barr was notorious for fucking around with it.




> Wouldn't it make more sense to kick out of the earlier one and just get pinned by the later one?


No.....the first fall didn't have his mask on the line.



I saw Taker live. He wasn't wearing his hat or coat during the entrance, though.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

I saw 'Taker live at Wrestlemania XI, when I was just a little kid. 

I still remember it vividly, though. It's a whole spectacle, and was the highlight of the evening. I see why he's so over with crowds, because you get caught up in the display, even if you're not a massive fan.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Yeah1993 said:


> On last watch I found the AAA overrated as hell (though still pretty good). I can think of a match el Hijo del Santo had that same month that's probably better. I have no idea why, of all lucha matches that could to be popular among the journalistic types, it's *that* one that's constantly given five stars and appreciated over everything else.
> 
> I should mention lucha tags often don't need an actual physical 'tag'. Helps stuff like trios or 4 v. 4 matches get more loony and berserk and incredible. The break up sounded kind of dumb, though. Lucha tags also have bizarre pinning rules sometimes, though IDK why the 'pinning both partners' thing would be a bother. Tenay probably would have said something at the beginning of the show about that (the opener was the Rey/Fuerza/Psicosis tag, IIRC?)
> 
> ...


Well the Tombstone being illegal is probably why they had Octagon do a stretcher job after taking it.

See, half of this stuff I'm not aware of since I was like...6 when this happened and I didn't watch it until...well, recently. I didn't mind the pinning both partners thing, but when watching the match they only mentioned it after the first entire fall had happened, and I'm conditioned to think American/Canadian style where one guy being pinned counts as a fall for both. I said "well both guys got pinned...is the match just over now?" I was completely confused, but the match went on. My interest got hurt from that. Same with the tag thing, to me it just made no sense and made the match come across as comically bad, to me.

I do appreciate the clarifications. Makes a bit more sense now, but still...no idea how that got 5 stars. I feel like everyone who gave it 5 stars is in on this secret thing that makes the match 50 times better (PCP?) and I'm one of the few who doesn't get it. And I don't even feel that its worth a rewatch at any point, either. Its interesting how one bad viewing of something can kind of screw up your perceptions of it forever. The only thing I'm going to remember about the finish now is that the first time I saw it, it was super weak. Doesn't matter how many more times I see it, that's what I'll remember. To call this the greatest lucha match ever is...so insulting to other way better lucha matches. Rey/Eddy from Halloween Havoc 1997 was INFINITELY better than this, for example.

I'm open to suggestions for some AAA matches that people feel are better than this (which to me is almost anything). Oh and suggestions on some of the lesser known, but still good WCW Cruiserweight matches, particularly from 1996-1998.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Punk tag matches, ya say? You should pop in _Best in the World_ and watch the match where he and Kofi win the tag straps from Rhodes & Dibiase. Underrated stuff that's totally better because it's uninterrupted on the dvd.
> 
> EDIT: I just wasted so much of my life by watching an Orton vs. Sandow match from the go-home RAW to Summerslam. Got so much time and it was a bunch of nothing. Nothing I tell ya! What a predictable finish too. Thankfully Cody Rhodes was entertaining on commentary.


You didn't know Orton vs Sandow matches are the worst offenders of Orton's piss poor stylings as a face over the last few years? They make the Barrett matches (ALL OF THEM) look good. I should have warned you to skip.

And while I love Benoit _(and Eddie & Bubba)_ I hated that Vengeance 2002 tables match. So much stupidity in it. Formula was aggravating. The great talents didn't do anything so great in that one.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Fuckin daylight savings ending. Ah well, this gives me an extra hour to watch matches :troll

Decided I'm gonna do a mini-project: DANIEL BRYAN WORLD/WWE TITLE MATCHES. :dazzler I've only seen some of the matches once (No Way Out triple threat, triple threat cage match at RR12) and I haven't seen some either (both Elimination Chambers he's been in), so looking forward to this.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Chamber match is good. Santino crap is...crappy. Fans bought into it so meh, at least it had a reaction. Rest of the match is good. I liked it the most on my last watch not too long ago. Before it was only half ago or so, really delivered this time around. Wade Barrett had a stretch where he ruled during it.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

KO Bossy said:


> I'm open to suggestions for some AAA matches that people feel are better than this (which to me is almost anything). Oh and suggestions on some of the lesser known, but still good WCW Cruiserweight matches, particularly from 1996-1998.


Could try; 

Santo/Octagon/Rey v. Blue Panther/Psicosis/Fuerza Guerrera 3/16/95 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45xoYAB8pls
Santo/Octagon/Rey/LA PARKA v. Psicosis/Blue Panther/Fuerza Guerrera/Pentagon 6/18/95 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVwgCvayIK0
Santo/Octagon/Rey/LA PARKA v. Psicosis/Jerry Estrada/Fuerza Guerrera/Pentagon 7/8/95 [can't find this - the other two are way better anyway and if you don't like them then this probably isn't worth your time).


I think there are big, big bunch of AAA better than the WWC tag, but if you don't like these then you probably won't like any AAA tags. I don't think AAA is really the best lucha anyway, but it often did multi-man tags from 93-95 really well and as far as I've watched, those first two tags are the best of AAA tags. There are great singles like Satanico v. Morgan (best overall AAA I remember seeing but I've shamefully not seen Park v. Mesias or Mascarita Sargada v. El Espectrito Jr), Panther v. Astro, Panther v. Mariachi, Rey v. Psicosis but I thought I'd list tags.


I hate daylight savings. I like darkness, rain, cloud, rain, and rain.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

A Mascarita Sagrada match you haven't seen? Get right out of town.

and I didn't even know it was daylight savings time. Does it mean it isn't really almost two AM? I don't want to calculate it. AHHHH


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

*Daniel Bryan World Title Matches Part 1: THE HEEL TURN*

I’ll be doing a Top 5 at the end, and since this will be the first time watching quite a few of these matches, my top 5 will constantly change. Without further ado…









*Insert joke about AJ and “toys”. :cena5*

World Heavyweight Championship Steel Cage Match
:bryan vs. Mark Henry (November 29, 2011 SD):
Should be good stuff with Hall of Pain Henry and face Bryan. Hm, this YouTube video comes with pre-match segments. AJ in a Santa’s Little Helper outfit just made me forget my name. What am I watching again? Oh right, Cage match. I’m guessing Henry’s leg injury is gonna come into play during the match. Pretty simple David vs. Goliath formula here Henry being HENRY and good baby face comebacks from Bryan supplemented with nice leg work by Bryan. Submission sequence was really good and got the crowd into the match, as were Bryan’s escape teases. A bit on the short side, but still a lot of fun to watch. I usually don’t like star ratings, but I guess if I’m doing a top 5, I have to use them  
(***)










World Heavyweight Championship 
:bryan vs. Big Show (January 3, 2012 SD):
I personally loved Bryan’s slow heel turn. :lol at his gloating during his entrance. Henry’s commentary is glorious BTW. Interesting match here with Bryan as a heel and Show as a face, so the David vs. Goliath formula is inverted in a sense with Bryan using his speed and quickness to wear down and control Big Show with Big Show landing high impact moves to switch the momentum. Bryan’s counter of the Chokeslam into the Guillotine and then the transition into the LeBell Lock was awesome, and :lmao at the ending and Bryan’s post-match celebration. Another short but fun match with some really nice Bryan offense, but the lack of a conclusive ending brings the match down a bit.
(** 1/2)










World Heavyweight Championship No DQ Match
:bryan vs. Big Show (January 10, 2012 SD):
AJ! :mark: Uh, gonna be hard to fap to something with The Big Show, Daniel Bryan, Jack Doan, and Booker T’s voice in it too, but I’ll make do. Awesome spear by Big Show to Bryan diving off the top, but if it’s No DQ, why is there a rope break? Or does that only count for submissions? Damn you, Jack Doan! Big Show dominates until Bryan grabs hold of a steel chair, and then the pace starts to quicken. Steel chair’s used as an equalizer of sorts (along with DEM KICKS) for the rest of the match and then the finish with Big Show running AJ over comes not too long after. Uh, I didn’t like this too much. I thought their match the week before was a fair bit better. Ending sucked, but at least it kept the reign of THE GOAT going. What asshole whistled while the trainers were coming to check on AJ? How dare you! What a chauvinistic…AJ’s ass in jeans :homer
(** 1/4)









*Wade Barrett clearly attempting to get his Drew McIntyre on.*

World Heavyweight Championship Lumberjack Match
:bryan vs. Mark Henry (January 17, 2012 SD):
What’s up with all of these title defenses week after week for mah boy D Bryan? I forgot about Wade Barrett’s god awful long hair. I’m gonna take off a quarter snowflake just for that. Scratch that, since Dashing/Undashing hybrid Cody with the WHITE TIGHTS is one of the lumberjacks. :lmao at the lumberjacks while we’re at it. The only ones I see that aren either out of the company or complete jobbers are The Usos, Cody, and I guess Primo and Epico. :mark: for Bryan actually hitting the roundhouse to the head on Henry and also for Bryan getting turned inside out on a clothesline from Henry. Another inconclusive ending to keep the title on Bryan, and I didn’t think this match really got going until a couple of minutes before the fuckery started. Nothing too bad, but nothing too special.
(**)​
Daniel Bryan World Title Matches Part 2: The Road To WrestleMania, coming soon!


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Bryan/Show No DQ is quite badass imo.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I don't think their No DQ match is bad by any means, but I liked their first match better


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

They do have nice chemistry together. Though I prefer the Henry/Bryan stuff, especially their Cage match. *** is very low for folks around here 

On a sidenote, we need two more for the History Draft Game IV.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I think I might've been a bit low on the STARZ, but I usually don't give out star ratings and I'm being a bit conservative because his later matches are even better in comparison.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Fair enough. No Sherlock by saying the later Bryan stuff is better, but the same imo can apply to Henry too. Iirc KOK placed the Bryan Cage match at #1 in his Top Henry matches, but I'd put at least three matches over, Punk/Henry I for e.g..


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

smitty915 said:


> *Match # 6: Big Show vs Booker T *
> 
> OH HELLLL NO
> 
> *CAL SCALE: -1 *


What the fook you doing, man? If there was ever a Booker T match from 02 PPV to watch that wasn't a tag with Goldie then it was THIS!!! It's what, No DQ/NHB or something and both guys beat the shit out of each other with weapons, some crazy table spots and THE FINISH is :mark:. I DEMAND YOU GO BACK AND WATCH IT.



Alim said:


> Have any of you guys had the privilege of seeing The Undertaker's entrance live and in person? That's one thing I need to cross off my bucket list at some point


:mark: Yep. Back in 2009. He was WHC too . Facing Jericho in their FIRST EVER singles match together .


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Alim said:


> Have any of you guys had the privilege of seeing The Undertaker's entrance live and in person? That's one thing I need to cross off my bucket list at some point


Wrestlemania 25, 26, 27 & 28. And countless live shows too. 

His 29 entrance is probably the best of the bunch though. That was just :mark: on so many levels and definitely one of the greatest special entrances of all time imo. I really loved it and it was the only one of the last few years I wasn't there to see. HBK descending from the heavens at 25, Cena with the Cena army at 25, Miz YOU CAN HATE ME NOW at 27, Taker AINT NO GRAVE at 27 and of course Trips FOR WHOM THE BELL TOLLS at 27 are some of my other favourite entrances I've seen live. Can't forget about the HIAC having its own theme music at 28 either. That was epic. Oh and BROCKS entrance the night after Mania 28 in Miami was GOAT. BROCK.


----------



## Cleavage (Apr 19, 2005)

Watched the Jake the snake doc last night, it was the first time since the DVD came out that I watched it. Man it was so messed up in places but really worth the watch even if they skipped quite a few stuff out. If WWE was to redo it today I think it could be top 3 of all time.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

You come out of watching the Jake doc and just think......fuck. Depressing, thought provoking stuff.


----------



## Cleavage (Apr 19, 2005)

i had to put the bottle of Jack down after 5 minutes of watching.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> What the fook you doing, man? If there was ever a Booker T match from 02 PPV to watch that wasn't a tag with Goldie then it was THIS!!! It's what, No DQ/NHB or something and both guys beat the shit out of each other with weapons, some crazy table spots and THE FINISH is :mark:. I DEMAND YOU GO BACK AND WATCH IT.


Just watched it, fun match, too bad I skipped it on my initial review. gave it ***

Turning on WM X8 now, doubt I'll get through it today though


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I think that later today, I will make the official presentation of my Top 50 WWE/F TV Matches ever.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Damn, Bryan defended the World Title on TV 3 weeks in a row? Was not aware of that. Talk about a fighting champion!

------------

Had a thought last night while watching the Summerslam blu ray. It's crazy to think that we got our best PPV of the year _without _The Shield being on the main card. It was only the 2nd PPV of the year (Royal Rumble) that didn't feature at least one member of the Shield in a match on the main card. 

Could you imagine if they threw the Mixed Tag on the preshow and had a 6-man instead? The Shield vs. RVD, Henry, & Big Show. That could've propelled it to all time great status for PPVs. Or if we actually got the fatties vs. Roman & Reigns. Either way without it the show still turned out pretty darn well.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

By this time, it is safe to say that, had Kane/Wyatt been correctly booked and had Shield/Black Show happened, SS would've been the GOAT.

Speaking of pre-show, do those count as TV matches?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

No because they don't air on TV ya daft numpty .


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

I love that Henry/Bryan cage match. I sat through a long and terrible live Smackdown and I didn't regret it after that match.



Starbuck said:


> Wrestlemania 25, 26, 27 & 28. And countless live shows too.
> 
> His 29 entrance is probably the best of the bunch though. That was just :mark: on so many levels and definitely one of the greatest special entrances of all time imo. I really loved it and it was the only one of the last few years I wasn't there to see. HBK descending from the heavens at 25, Cena with the Cena army at 25, Miz YOU CAN HATE ME NOW at 27, Taker AINT NO GRAVE at 27 and of course Trips FOR WHOM THE BELL TOLLS at 27 are some of my other favourite entrances I've seen live. Can't forget about the HIAC having its own theme music at 28 either. That was epic. Oh and BROCKS entrance the night after Mania 28 in Miami was GOAT. BROCK.


The Miz's at Wrestlemania 27 was actually really cool. I thought it was one of the better video packages they put together. I was there live for it as well and I wasn't really looking forward to the match but his video package really got me excited for the match. Than the match happened...


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao at the 10 man battle royal on RAW in February 2012. Big Show pulls off one of the worst performances of all-time. Worse than HHH against Taker in 2002.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Callamus said:


> No because they don't air on TV ya daft numpty .


Thank you, ya petty bastardization of a human


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Sunday Night heat counts though


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

And also this: I'm only counting stuff that is aired on a certain show. So that excludes the likes of Rockers/POP and Savage/Shawn


----------



## GOON (Jan 23, 2010)

Just have to watch the 2003 Royal Rumble to complete this show. Sadly, I have no desire to watch a nearly one-hour match. 

The show isn't _bad_ by any stretch, despite the low rating on the CAL SCALE it'll probably receive. Two matches end up being p. good, and I assume the Rumble match will make it three.

I'll probably end up watching some 2003 stuff from Raw and Smackdown in an attempt to round out this 2003 project. I'll probably scour Youtube for some gems outside of the obvious (Lesnar/Benoit, HHH/RVD, etc).


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

2003 Royal Rumble - 7.5

Yeah not too high on the CAL SCALE overall but a fun event with nothing too horrendous aside from the women's match and Steiner/HHH :lmao.


----------



## GOON (Jan 23, 2010)

Steiner/HHH crossed the line from "so bad it's good" to "this is pure shite" once HHH tried to be Ric Flair and run away from his challenger. From that point on, the match just dragged. Until that point, it was hilarious watching Steiner punch the air and listening to the crowd shit on Steiner's p. innovative offense.

I've only watched one match from Hunter in 2003 and I can already tell he wants to be Ric Flair so damn bad.

I was originally planning to go in order, but I might skip around and watch/review No Mercy 2003 next. I looked at the card and it looks p. good with Brock/Taker, Cena/Angle, and Eddie/Show.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

HHH has said numerous times that he wanted to be a Flair like heel with the title lol. Shame he didn't have a 10th of the talent to pull it off lol.

NM 03 is really good imo. Cena/Angle is tremendous, Eddie/Show is fun, Brock/Taker is really good but it gets very mixed reviews. Has nothing on either 2002 PPV match though. Mysterio/Tajiri is sweet, Benoit/A-Train is good and Vince/Stephanie is one of those "you just gotta see it" matches lol.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Only three matches into Mania 18, but taking a quick break to relive all of the Punk/Hardy matches 

GAB
NOC 
SS TLC
SD cage 

Am I missing one?


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> :lmao at the 10 man battle royal on RAW in February 2012. Big Show pulls off one of the worst performances of all-time. Worse than HHH against Taker in 2002.


*Was that the one where Barrett broke his arm cause Show launched Ziggler at him like sack of potatoes?*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Had a thought last night while watching the Summerslam blu ray. It's crazy to think that we got our best PPV of the year _without _The Shield being on the main card. It was only the 2nd PPV of the year (Royal Rumble) that didn't feature at least one member of the Shield in a match on the main card.
> 
> Could you imagine if they threw the Mixed Tag on the preshow and had a 6-man instead? The Shield vs. RVD, Henry, & Big Show. That could've propelled it to all time great status for PPVs. Or if we actually got the fatties vs. Roman & Reigns. Either way without it the show still turned out pretty darn well.


Please don't remind me. I was expecting that all day until the pre-show ended. Sad face.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Callamus said:


> 2003 Royal Rumble - 7.5
> 
> Yeah not too high on the CAL SCALE overall but a fun event with nothing too horrendous aside from the women's match and *Steiner/HHH :lmao.*


THE BELLY TO BELLY SUPLEX!


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Ive seen neither HHH/Steiner match 

After all the talk, i suppose i should go through the misery of seeing the Rumble one. (the other being NWO?)


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The other is No Way Out.

No Way Out is a solid show, until you get to the last 3 matches


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Watch 'em both. Awful performances by each that makes you wonder how both had a job following. Steiner working like he had no idea what to do & Trips doing the worst bulked up Ric Flair impersonation ever seen. Chills.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Don't forget to play the STEINER SUPLEX DRINKING GAME when you watch the RR match! 12 I believe was the total number lol. Went through and counted them all for my "by the numbers" parody video .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Always wanted to do that. I usually just get shitfaced as a I watch per no game, so when the shit happens, I'm properly distorted.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Havent seen both Steiner/HHH matches too, in time I will I'm sure


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*The Steiner/HHH tragedies :mark: 

The NWO match was a little more hilarious because the Montreal crowd was on Hebner and Steiner's ass.*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Steiner got so much heat on that show. :lol


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Halfway through the Punk/Hardy series, got GAB and NOC done and wathing TLC now, should do more projects like this, when I'm done with 2002 of course


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I only call 2 good matches from Royal Rumble 03: the 30-Man Rumble and Lesnar/Show.

GOON, what did you thought of the _much beloved_ WWE Title match? 8*D


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

smitty915 said:


> Halfway through the Punk/Hardy series, got GAB and NOC done and wathing TLC now, should do more projects like this, when I'm done with 2002 of course


They have some really good matches together. I'm a huge fan of their cage match and, despite its length, NOC was good from what I remember as well.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Punk/Hardy series *​
*GAB: ****
NOC: *** ½* 
SS TLC: *** ¾* 
SD Cage: **** ½*​*

The GAB match may be the most underrated of the series, as it was an awesome 15-20 minute match. In the end it heats up a little bit, but the pace was lightning fast for most of the match anyway, this is easily my second favorite match of the series. I was not as big of a fan of the NOC match, thought it was A LOT more slow and was quite bored for the majority of the match, however, it was still pretty fun. 

TLC is usually the most talked about match of the series, but I do think it is a tad overrated by some. For a TLC match and their weren’t a ton of SPOTZ like most. The obvious exception is the Swanton onto the table from the monster ladder. But my favorite part of the match is the undertaker return. IMO it is a top 5 return ever, HUGE CROWD POP and the whole fashion where Punk is confused when the lights turned on and taker is where Hardy was! MARKED SO FUCKING MUCH! 

The steel Cage match, what a way to go out for Hardy, such a good fucking match and easily the best one of the series, but they are all good IMO. JR makes this match one of the best commentated matches EVER IMO, he is even better than usual IMO. Everyone must watch this! Not too long too at only like 15 minutes.​


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*RJSBX1 Hate-Series: Captiol Punishment 2011*










First of all, the theme for this was :mark:. Just goes to show you, you don’t need some grungy rock song for all your PPV’s. That’s probably the nicest thing I can say about this PPV though. Also, HEEL TROOF= AWESOME. Wish, it didn’t end so soon.

*United States Championship: Dolph Ziggler vs. Kofi Kingston*

For the 1,000 time THAT year we get a Kingston-Ziggler match. I don’t mind them but I mean…shit.
The ropes are red white and blue for MURICA and…why is Kofi introduced first…he’s the champion.

:lmao Booker’s on commentary. SO. MANY. QUOTES. Booker: “I’m glad Ziggler got rid of that mullet.” :lmao It wasn’t even a mullet, Book. 

For two guys who face each other A LOT…the had some awkward and sloppy spots like the screwed up shotgun spot…an awkward looking backslide. Other than it pretty quality stuff.
The timing of this match though. Premature ejaculators have better timing.

This was when Dolph Ziggler had the DREADED…Sleeperhold. If this was 1986, I could buy that as a legit finisher…but not in 2011.

One thing that irks me about Ziggler’s selling is it sometimes just looks stupid…he sells a crossbody…but he JUMPS into it. :lmao :lmao That actually makes no sense. What could Dolph accomplish by jumping in place when a guy is doing a high cross body? 

:lmao :lmao the ending of this match + the announcers not knowing what’s going on.
Ziggler locks on sleeper hold and Kofi reaches ropes. Ziggler drags Kofi back out to lock on the sleeperhold and Kofi passes out and then the bell rings. 

Apparently they tried to protect Kofi…for what… because he’s the mid-card GAWD.
By the way, Booker thought it should have been a DQ. :lmao

*-**3/4 Decent opener, some weird spots and that dumb finish, but these two can put on a much better match. *

CRAZY TRUTH SEGMENT. YES. He comes out of this limo and “Fake Tan” says she doesn’t even know who Truth is anymore. She also doesn’t know her real skin color because she looks orange as fuck. 

Miz says Riley’s a joke…he’s awesome…blah blah blah. 

*The Miz vs. Alex Riley*

Cole: “Everybody’s been talking about this match for weeks…” Yeah, okay. 

Is the Inflatable Awesome sign necessary for a guy who isn’t main eventing anymore? :lmao :lmao from main event-ing at WrestleMania to fighting Alex Riley. Miz is carrying a briefcase for …no reason at all really. :lmao

Riley comes out and gets a DECENT pop but King translates it as if it’s Austin at Backlash 2000. :lmao

What do you get when you mix vanilla offense with equally vanilla offense. This match. 

"You're a bad boy."- Miz. :lmao :lmao trash talk or sweet seduction…you make the call.
Booker wants the ref to stop the match after Miz hits another big boot. :lmao :lmao. For once I agree with him…although for different reasons. Imagine if this match did end with a Big Boot from a Miz…:lmao.

DOUBLE AXE HANDLE and Booker thinks this is too much. :lmao :lmao WAIT WHAT. Booker T is ready to call an ambulance to ringside. Someone gets this man an IV, stat!
Riley hits some move and goes “AHHHHHH” Crowd goes mute. :lmao :lmao

Cole starts screaming at Riley and then Riley drags him over the table…and Miz takes advantage. Miz tries to use the briefcase but refs all like nah. Riley hits a double arm DDT and wins.

Okay. Miz was the former WWE Champion, main evented a Wrestlemania. Alex Riley wasn’t even good enough to win NXT. Riley wins clean. Just think about that for a second. :lmao

***- Looking back on it now, it’s funny how these two have fallen. Miz is a midcarder and Riley doesn’t even wrestle anymore. DULL DULL DULL for the most part until the end.*

PRESIDENT OBAMA…look-a-like. Sarge is here too (for no reason). :lmao :lmao. Vickie Guerrero comes in wanting to sing and secret service attacks her. Oh, more fake Obama segments please?! 

*Alberto Del Rio vs. The Big Show*

So. Del Rio “accidentally” hits show with the car. Cause you know…Show’s a tricky little guy to see sometimes. 

So. RATINGS comes out and attacks Big Show before the match…lays the whoop-ass on him and then out comes Del Rio.WSM through the Espanol Table. One of these days, they are just going to open the PPV with the Spanish announce table already broken, and that's not fair. 

The ref starts counting Big Show out…but the bell never actually rang so you can’t do that. :lmao They should just have a WWE Rulebook or something to explain stupid things like this.

Big Show fights his way back into the ring to beat the referee’s count while Cole screams something stupid about Del Rio winning by forfeit if Show can’t do it….huh? What a moron.Once, Show gets back and then the ref rings the bell…SO WHY DID YOU COUNT? 

Your standard gimpy-giant-vs-chicken-shit-heel match…but it’s more of angle than a match. So really kind of unnecessary for Show to even mount a comeback given he’s a gimp. Yet, for a guy who just went through a table and had his knee destroyed…he’s getting a lot of offense. Then again…this guy NO-SOLD death at HH ’95. 

Show can sell his giant ass off when he wants but the match end when the ref stops it because why not? 

SO. He got run over by a car then was attacked by the Ratingz AND had a leg submission applied on a supposedly crippled leg AND he still couldn’t tap out. :lmao :lmao


**1/2 So…pre-match attack + 2 mintues of actual in ring time + non-finish. More angle than an actual match…but RATINGZ moves it up a notch. Del Rio didn't get any favor by Gimp Show not tapping out. *

MORE CRAZY TROOF :lmao :mark:

*Intercontinenal Championship: Wade Barrett vs. Ezekiel Jackson*

So. Wade Barrett for all his flaws—does his best work on the mic. If you give the guy a good 5-10 minutes with the mic he’d have a solid niche as a upper-card heel. ANYWAY. He tears into ‘Merica but the crowd kinda doesn’t give a shit though :lmao]

The fans are chanting USA…but Ezekiel is from Guyana. :lmao :lmao dumbasses. Booker: “Well he looks American” :lmao :lmao 

Pretty methodical match, Zeke really isn’t any good and Barrett shouldn’t be the one carrying anyone to a match. So it's basically: kick-kick-punch-punch-big boot-kick-body slam. REPEAT.

“We Want Ryder” chants…Ah, 2011 :no:. 

MORE "U.S.A.! U.S.A.! U.S.A.!" chants from the crowd, but I have no idea who it's for. Maybe Zack Ryder?

Zeke Jackson’s offense: SLAM. SLAM. SLAM. TORTURE RACK. WIN. 

King interviews Zeke about winning the belt and he says "liberty and the personification of domination"... :lmao WHAT.

*- Well, I gave you the play by play. It was that interesting to read so..it's not that interesting to watch. This would be the start the most “Who?”-iest of IC title reigns ever behind Dean Douglas. Crowd kind went into a chant fest and can’t blame them. 

The WWE would like to remind you to please not be a bully. Seriously.

Kelly x2 and Santino meet fake Obama and Santino wants to show him his Cobra (which is on a Miz-Riley level of homoerotic) but the “Secret Service” pounce on him….I miss Monty Brown… 

*CM Punk vs. Rey Mysterio*

This is the MOTN and honestly their best match together and that’s high praise. Starts a little slower than normal matches but Mysterio was really banged up at this point. I mean dude has NO knees. 

They head outside and Mysterio tries flying headscissors off the apron but Punk dumps him face-first on the ring barrier…very nice.

This match has…PSYCHOLOGY. WHAT? Punk keeps working on the jelly like legs of Mysterio. 

Punk says “HAPPY FATHER’S DAY” :lmao :lmao shades of their 2010 feud. The little things matter sometimes. 

HUGE REY ASAI MOONSAULT. :mark: Too bad these’s idiots ringside no-sold it like it was a Alex Riley finisher. 

REVERSALS ON REVERSALS ON REVERSALS. :mark:

During a Punk near fall… Booker: “Rey gotta kick out here” :lmao The Tim McCarver of the WWE ladies and gents. 

GTS. NO. 619 YES….NO GTS. Punk wins. :mark: Awesome finishing sequence.

*****- Great story, great psychology. If Rey was 100% who knows how great this match could be. Of course the next PPV, Punk would be on his way to the ME. *

*Randy Orton vs. Christian*

The feud of the Summer continues. Christian did perfect the whiny little bitch heel to perfection. Angry Randy Orton with strikes and then Lou Thesz Press---cause when I’m angry…I resort to Lou Thezs presses. 

Not as good as their OTL match but very good nonetheless. Booker’s read his WebMD today is diagnosing Orton with a concussion. :lmao

Cole keeps calling Orton’s powerslams…scoop slams because he’s Cole.

Match picks up toward the end with some near falls aplenty. 

Christian to the top rope and …RKO out of where? NOWHERE. Christian foot’s IS CLEARLY under the bottom rope but ref’s like “Fuck him, he ain’t Edge.” Stevie Wonder could've seen that shit. Then again, Stevie Wonder would've used his sixth sense to avoid this PPV altogether.

HEEL Cole is the voice of reason and talks about Christian’s foot under the rope while Book says it was a judgement call….(what?) :lmao

****- Not as good as their OTL…but better than their next PPV match which had the idiotic title changes via DQ thing. *

The Bellas (before Nikki smuggled some balloons under her shirt) talks to some doofus. :lmao couldn’t for the life of me tell you what’s going on and I don’t care.

*The 4:20 Challenge: Jack Swagger vs. Evan Bourne*

This is a special attraction match. For who? Rob Van Dam? 

Basically, Vince saw Swaggie and Bourne backstage and said…”So…can y’all have match? We need to fill time.” WAIT. Of all the people not schedules like Bryan, Rhodes, DiBiase, Botch Cara (who they were super pushing). They picked Swagger?!

Booker thinks the match should stop as Swagger is boringly applying basic midsection moves. :lmao Bourne looked pretty good…I miss him too. 
Crowd doesn’t give a SHIT about this match.

Bourne misses AirBourne..Swagger goes for the ankle lock but gets rolled up and pinned. Okay, then. 

**- It was a match. They didn’t really do anything bad or anything too exciting. They probably both blazed up after this anyway.


Here we go: IT’S THE OBAMA IMPERSONATOR. There are actually some fake soldiers at ring side saluting him. :lmao Booker looks more like Obama than this guy. HE also sounds like Kermit the Frog. So there’s that.

WHAT. (Insert corny joke) WHAT (topical joke) WHAT. That’s basically the segment. 

Faux Obama: "If I was we'd be seeing a lot less Michael Cole and a lot more Jim Ross. God, I love that fat bastard." 

Booker grabs the mic and….:lmao…oh no. Take a wild guess as to where this is going.

It makes me laugh that Booker would (in theory) would call the POTUS…homey. :lmao :lmao Booker says he’s the first President to win a Nobel Peace Prize…which is incorrect. :lmao but the again Booker was the first eliminated on Weakest Link so no surprise. :lmao

Booker asks if he can do a Spinaroonie…and of course...I mean that was awful. His attempt was SO bad it I don't know if it was supposed to look that awful. but BOOKER CAN and in a Footloose moments...teaches him how to Spinaroonie. Can you dig that, sucka? 

*WWE Championship: John Cena vs. TROOF *

The video package for this was awesome. Heel Truth was awesome. Cena just got out of that MIZ-erable feud with Miz so it was a little fresh to this. BUT who actually thought TROOF would win. The Barack impersonator had a better chance of winning this match.

Cena is just BLATANT with the spot calling and Truth is still kind of boring in the ring. 

BOOGIE WOOGIE legdrop dance > Five Knuckle Shuffle

Truth’s on offense and the crowd greets him with the enthusiasm of a heel Diva working the concession stand match. Speaaaking of…who was Diva’s Champion at this time?! There wasn’t even a Diva’s match on the card. :hmm:

ZZZZZZZZZZ. Oh , Cena’s still in peril….ZZZZZZZ. 

This match is just BORING.

The AA counter into the Shut Up was actually awesome. Cena rolls to the outside and here’s where it gets “Stupid. Stupid Stupid.” to quote Randall Orton

TROOF find this dweeb-ish Chuckie Finster looking kid and gets all in his face and take his ugly hat and puts it on. Either because he’s afraid of black people or he’s socially inept, he throws a cup of soda in his face. :lmao :lmao shouldn't his family be kicked out for that (in theory)

Truth stagger into the ring---BLINDED by the power of the water and Cena hits an AA and CENA WINS. 

Okay. Let’s review this. In the main event of a Pay-Per-View: Truth hits his finisher…instead of inbounding the KO'd Cena to pin his ass and win the title…he messes around with some kid. The kid throws a some water in his face…and somehow Truth turns into Ray Charles and walks RIGHT into an AA.

HE BASICALLY JOBBED TO A CUP OF AQUAFINA. :lmao :lmao. 

**- The match was BORING. The finish was STUPID. It boggles the mind that the hottest heel act at the time had to sell water hitting him in the face and it would cause him to lose the main event of a major PPV :lmao *

*34/100- Honestly, I’ve seen worse. Rey-Punk is a must-see…Ziggler and Kofi was aiiight. But the rest of this…should be burned. Burned. However, MITB 2011 would change things drastically.*​


----------



## GOON (Jan 23, 2010)

ATF said:


> I only call 2 good matches from Royal Rumble 03: the 30-Man Rumble and Lesnar/Show.
> 
> GOON, what did you thought of the _much beloved_ WWE Title match? 8*D


It was fine. I could see how some people, especially when they watched it live way back in the day, could find it to be fantastic. But for me? Eh. I wouldn't go past ***1/2 for it, although that might even be pushing it for me.

The people who say it's ***** and one of the best WWE title matches ever need to scram, though.

EDIT- Watching the 2003 Royal Rumble match, and Chris Nowinski just died on that double dropkick spot.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Nice to see you weren't overly harsh on Capitol Punishment, cause it's not _that _bad of a show. Not even the worst show of 2011 (which is Over The Limit by a fucking country mile). I'm even higher on Orton/Christian and also enjoyed Dolph/Kofi.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Starting an Undertaker project, just for shits and giggles, I'll have the first post done today, but don't worry, I'll get back to 2002 tomorrow, just not in the mood today.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

My CP review:

Ziggler/Kofi - ***
Miz/Riley - *1/2
ADR/Show - N/R
Barrett/Jackson - DUD
Rey/Punk - ***1/2
Orton/Christian - **3/4
Truth/Cena - *

Pretty horrible show as you can understand :angel OTL was shit too. Thanks god the second half of 2011 was so much fun.


Anyway, just watched Kidd/Mysterio from SuperStars. I think it was around/after WM. Really good match (***1/4-1/2), here's a link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_v89qz3JbRE (btw, Gallwos vs Mysterio from the same link looks pretty good, worth my time?)

Barely seen anything from Superstars and ECW. Wish I had more time for wrestling


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Survivour Series 1991:

Team Flair vs Team Piper- SS91 
Team Slaughter vs Team Mustafa- DUD
Underaker vs Hogan- *
Team Rockers vs Team Nasty Boys- *3/4


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Capitol Punishment:

Ziggler/Kofi - ***
Miz/Riley - ***
ADR/Show - **
Barrett/Jackson - DUD
Rey/Punk - ****
Orton/Christian - ***3/4
Bourne/Swagger - **3/4
Truth/Cena - DUD

On paper, a PPV with four good matches should be held in high regard, but this is another perfect example of a bad show with good matches. The atmosphere of this PPV was so dull. OTL 2011 was also very bad except for that glorious classic.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I think I'll go watch Punk/Hardy BASH

And I will always have a love/hate relationship with CP 11 as during that build is when I got back into wrestling since 06

And arguably the best Punk/Rey was on that show


----------



## GOON (Jan 23, 2010)

​*Royal Rumble 2003 Review*

*Brock Lesnar vs. Big Show*- This was a blast to watch. Lesnar’s German and belly-to-belly suplexes onto Big Show were impressive in their own right, as well as the nasty bump Lesnar took to the outside of the ring in the early stages of the match. I also really liked Lesnar’s counter of Big Show’s first attempt at the choke slam. For a six (or so) minute match, this was really good, especially if you enjoy watching Lesnar throw 500 pound men around the ring like they’re Cruserweights. *Rating: ***1/4. Cal Scale: 2
*
*Dudley Boys vs. William Regal and Lance Storm- WWE World Tag Team Championship- *This looked p. great on paper, but it ended up being just your basic tag match and nothing really happened that was really noteworthy outside of the title change. The only thing that I really liked about this match was the finish but outside of that, I can’t really think of anything to write about for this. This was a match. *Rating: **. Cal Scale: 0.5*

*Torrie Wilson vs. Dawn Marie*- Nope. *Cal Scale: -1*

*THE GAME vs. BIG POPPA PUMP- WWE World Heavyweight Championship-* Oh, man. I’ve never seen this match before, but I’ve heard some p. nasty remarks about it so I’m excited to watch it, if only so that I may bask in its shiteness. The first minute or so of the match consists of BIG POPPA PUMP clobbering THE GAME in the corner with some p. awful looking punches and KNIFE-EDGE chops. Earl Hebner would finally back Steiner out of the corner. As he backed up, Steiner would yell triumphantly “I’M THE MAN~!”
The two GOATS brawl to the outside of the ring, and Steiner continues to throw some awful punches, some of which are so bad that it’s blatantly obvious they don’t even connect. Steiner was so horrendous in this match. His entire offense consisted of belly-to-bellies and weak punches, most of which just connected with the air. The ONE time he tried a different variation of a suplex, he botched it so badly that a quiet but audible “you fucked up” chant sprung out in the crowd, which by this point had all but turned on Steiner. 
This was deep-fried dog shit, man. There isn’t anything good about this unless you’re the kind of guy who sits at home on a Saturday night, gets roaring drunk, and you decide you want to watch something sad whilst crying over your ex-girlfriend with a bottle of Smirnoff in your hand. *Rating: DUD. Cal Scale: 0*

*Chris Benoit vs. Kurt Angle- WWE Championship*- I remember when I first started surfing pro graps all those years ago, and I vaguely remember seeing random geeks pimping this match as the GOAT or some shit like that. All of this praise perked my interest, so I picked up The Best of the WWE Championship DVD, popped in disc three of said DVD, and watched this match. After watching the match for the first time, I had one message to all of those GEEKS who said this was the GOAT match.
“FUCK OUTTA HERE, B”
However, that’s not to say that this match is bad. On the contrary, it’s actually pretty good. I can totally get how some people, watching it live, might think it’s the MOTY or whatever due to all of the near falls and reversals. However, watching it nearly eleven years later, the drama the match had back then doesn’t hold water now. It’s still pretty good, though. *Rating: ***1/2. Cal Scale: 3*

*The 2003 Royal Rumble Match*- This was a pretty great Rumble. It started off good with Chris Jericho attacking Shawn Michaels from behind, which would set the stage for their encounter at Wrestlemania 19. Speaking of Chris Jericho, I felt he was the MVP of the match. Outside of that, nobody’s individual performance stood out to me, although Rey Mysterio’s brief stay in the match in the early goings was good enough to note in this review. 
A whole lot of wacky and fun stuff happened in this match as well, whether it was Tommy Dreamer bringing weapons into the ring with him during his entrance and and briefly turning the Rumble into a hardcore one, or Shannon Moore sacrificing himself for Matt Hardy on multiple occasions during Hardy’s extended run in the match. 
The match, however, would get a tad boring once we were at the late-teens and the early-twenties. Outside of Shawn Michaels returning to the ring to get an ounce of revenge on Chris Jericho, it wasn’t until Brock Lesnar’s entry at number twenty-nine that the match would pick up again. Him coming in and just killing geeks was a magnificent thing to watch. I also really liked the callback to the 2002 Royal Rumble match, where Maven eliminated the Undertaker after delivering a drop-kick whilst Undertaker had his back turned. Maven once again tried this spot in this match, but the drop-kick didn’t faze the Undertaker, and Undertaker would get his revenge from last year and eliminate him. *Rating: ****. Cal Scale: 5*

*Overall rating on the Cal Scale: 9.5*


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

GOON The Legend said:


> especially if you enjoy watching Lesnar throw 500 pound men around the ring like they’re Cruserweights.​




Which i do 

Makes it extra nice in the pleasure Brock gets in doing that to Show, as he tells tales in his book about Show acting all 'big' (pardon the pun ) whilst he was in OVW.​


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*I'm shocked you didn't watch that GOAT Stepdaughter-Stepmother match. That feud had more of a build than both title matches :lmao.

Which BTW, R.I.P. Al Wilson.*


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

After seeing a WM XXX Duscussion elsewhere and Hogan may come back, and if they have Warrior in the HOF or something, Hogan/Warrior interaction at Mania :mark:





*No, i am NOT talking about a match*


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

DVD and Blu Ray extras for Hell in a Cell 2013 released:

*Special Features

* - *Hell in a Cell Kickoff Show Match*
Kofi Kingston vs. Damien Sandow

- CM Punk Reflects on Hell in a Cell
- Exclusive 1st Interview with John Cena since Returning From Injury 


*Blu-ray Exclusives*
* _The Blu-ray edition is likely to be exclusive to the UK and European market._

*Monday Night RAW – October 14, 2013*:
- Shawn Michaels Promises a New WWE Champion at Hell in a Cell

*- WWE Tag Team Championship No Disqualification Match*
- Seth Rollins & Roman Reigns vs. Cody Rhodes & Goldust

*SmackDown – October 18, 2013*:
- CM Punk vs. Big E. Langston

*Monday Night Raw – October 21, 2013*
- Daniel Bryan vs. Randy Orton Contract Signing

*SmackDown – October 25, 2013*
- Michael Cole Interviews Triple H

-------------------------------------------------------

Pretty jealous of you UK fuckers. Incredible set of blu ray extras with the Tag Title match and the contract signing.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Pardon my ignorance but what is this CAL scale and how does it work?

@Yeah Thanks for the links, I'll check them out. I love La Parka so I'm excited already. I'll post my thoughts later.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

KO Bossy said:


> Pardon my ignorance but what is this CAL scale and how does it work?


Its just a Scale to weight the Value of a show, called the CAL scale because it was created by cal. 



Spoiler: CAL SCALE



NO = -1
DUD-* = 0
*1/4-** = 0.5
**1/4-**3/4 = 1
***-***1/4 = 2
***1/2 = 3
***3/4 = 4
**** = 5
****1/4 = 6
****1/2 = 7
****3/4 = 8
***** = 9




Loving this taker project so far! :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

THE CAL SCALE. Give points to matches based on their rating, then add em all up at the end to give an overall PPV rating and shit:

The Cal Scale

NO = -1 (given to matches you REFUSE to watch)
DUD-* = 0
*1/4-** = 0.5
**1/4-**3/4 = 1
***-***1/4 = 2
***1/2 = 3
***3/4 = 4
**** = 5
****1/4 = 6
****1/2 = 7
****3/4 = 8
***** = 9


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Should stick that in the first page, or in the F.A.Q Section.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

And who is CAL, curiously?


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

KO Bossy said:


> And who is CAL, curiously?


 Callamus


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Goddamn I miss The Chosen One gimmick  such an epic entrance and Drew looks like the real deal. Matt Striker is soooooooo annyoing man. Can't say I miss him at all. Damn good match, Mcintyre did a very good job Christian sold everything like a champ. Wish that was a PPV match, tho. Finish made sense but felt flat to me. Still good TV match.

***1/4


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Obviously, this isn't too long ago, but I remember this as a very good match. Christian, who is very good in the ring, mixing it up with Cody, who is also very good in the ring. Was a pretty fast paced match, at least at the beginning, and the crowd in NYC seemed to be slightly in favor of Christian. Was a good match with a constant flow, and in the short Cody-Christian feud, you could see they don't really have tremendous chemistry, but they have chemistry good enough to deliver, making a midcard match a highlight of a PPV. 

One of Cody's best matches, I'd say. His other great matches have been some of his matches with Mysterio, Orton, Del Rio, and Jericho, as well as some of his recent Tag Team matches, and the ladder matches he's participated in. There's really no reason to say Cody's average in the ring, he is quite certainly above average.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

We're not too far off from seeing Cody's #1 singles match, I say. But he may surely last quite a bit more than *30* days w/the Tag Team *gold*. 8*D


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Undertaker project post # 1​*
*this project will not follow any timeline, just random taker matches I have wanted to check out/rewatch

*Match # 1: Shawn Michaels vs the Undertaker HIAC(bad Blood 1997)*

Well, I do feel that this will be a good match to start this project off with one of the greatest matches of all time, and the first HIAC match ever. HBK is doing some great character work with clamoring for HHH and Chyna once he realizes he cannot get out of the cell :lol. Every single moment of this match is badass, each moment just feels so awesome, and this is a top 10 match ALL TIME IMO, maybe top 5 IDK. Heel HBK is just so awesome in this especially when he just starts beating the shit out of a cameraman :lmao, so great. Great thing about this match is that it went a relatively long amount of time at about 30 minutes but it certainly never felt way too long, as it just never was dull. Anyways this is a MUST WATCH for ANY fan of Pro wrestling, these two could do no wrong together. The ending might be one of the best ever, and easily the best debut ever! LONG LIVE KANE! ***** 

*Match #2: Rey Mysterio vs the Undertaker (Royal Rumble 2010) *

I’ve wanted to see this for a little while, as I LOVE both guys. Really hope this lives up to the expectations that I want, as seems like a classic David vs Goliath match. Nice video package too before the start of the match highlighting Rey’s first WHC reign in 2006 and then his path to this match here and his feud with Batista. This match is pretty good, obviously nowhere near as good as the match I reviewed prior to this but 99% of matches shouldn’t so its all good. This is surprisingly slower than I thought it would be, but its only really slow during the first few minutes of the match. I wonder if the SD matches they had are better than this match, even though they look a lot shorter, will have to review those in another post or maybe even this one. This was pretty fun, ending was :mark: with a 619 reversed into a piledriver for taker to retain. *** ¾* 

*Match # 3: Undertaker and Kane vs Stone Cold Steve Austin and HHH(backlash 2001)*

Man, how have I not seen this yet? Apparently its one of the best Backlash matches ever and man does it look awesome on paper. So all titles are on the line here, and HHH is the IC champ :lmao, he must love that after being WWF champ not too long ago. Obviously Austin is the WWF champ(apparently their chums now) and the BOD are the tag champs. About time we get an ABA taker match on this post, because he’s ROLLIN ROLLIN ROLLIN. Also great so far is the fact that HEYMAN is on commentary. Another GREAT match by taker, he usually has shitty matches with Austin but even the parts of the match involving Austin and taker are good, if not great. This was REALLY good in the first 10 minutes of the match but the middle was still good, but not as good as the beginning and end of the match, so some might get bored there. Last like 10 minutes are :mark: and make this an awesome tag match. ****


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

ATF said:


> We're not too far off from seeing Cody's #1 singles match, I say. But he may surely last quite a bit more than *30* days w/the Tag Team *gold*. 8*D


Hmm.

Wouldn't quite say best singles match. A few of his matches with Orton were great, probably a bit better than this one. Cody probably has the best chemistry with Orton out of all the guys on the roster.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Nah Cody has also been good in-ring, its just he is in the main spotlight nowadays and is being able to show it off


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

I'm starting to see a trend. I just don't get these matches. In ring, they're good, but aside from that, I'm lost.

Let's begin. One thing I noticed is a definite pattern. The guys wrestle for like...a minute to 90 seconds straight and then just start playing to the crowd for a bit. It takes me out of the match because it really eliminates tension and drama, I find.

I've gotten used to the lack of tags, but this match made more problems apparent. Could just be that I don't understand Mexican wrestling, so if I'm making an ass out of myself by getting things wrong, let me know.

I'm convinced right now that Rey Mysterio is probably the best guy in history at playing the babyface in peril. His size and selling just make it come naturally to him. Beat up on him, and the crowd will hate you. That simple.

As noted in my other review, there just didn't feel like any real storytelling or psychology. It kind of felt like an exhibition of moves being done so the fans can cheer. 

I really enjoyed the sequence between Del Santo and Blue Panther starting at about 6:20.

At 7:38 Rey hit a crazy flip over the top rope into a Hurricanrana onto Psychosis on the outside. Looked really good, but Rey couldn't rotate his body fully and looked like he smacked his head on the floor. Good thing it was padded.

Then about 1/3 of the way through, Del Santo pins Panther, after which Rey hits a nice Hurricanrana onto Psychosis and pins him. Aside from it not being really built up to, after these 2 pins, the babyfaces pose and the match just resets. Quite confused, how is one supposed to win? 2 guys just got pinned but now we're acting like that didn't happen?

Oh, did I mention there are 2 referees in this match? Yeah, there are. Octagon kicks one at one point, after which Fuerza (who is on his knees) hugs his leg like a protective child. Kind of funny.

Then Psychosis hits a twisting Senton onto Rey from the top rope to pin him. Panther then rolls up Del Santo at 13:50 and pins him. Both referees count this pin simultaneously (which I was confused by). Then Panther holds this roll up on Del Santo for like...30 seconds straight. It looked sort of like a partial submission but nobody was paying attention while Del Santo's arms were moving around. He grabbed the ropes twice, no rope break. So finally Panther said "ah fuck it" and let go.

The match then resets again after this. Still wondering why, the video didn't indicate it was multiple falls. Maybe the commentary did, but I don't speak Spanish.

Ending 5 minutes was probably the strongest. Finish was Octagon getting his Russian Leg Sweep into submission combo on Fuerza. Didn't really get why that ended the match, but the other pins didn't. Maybe it was elimination pinfall, where your team won when everyone else on the other team was pinned, but I thought it was confusing. 

Final rating-***

Better than the Gringos vs Del Santo/Octagon match, I thought. Mainly because I thought the in ring was really good. The mental elements I didn't get, unfortunately, so it was hard for me to get more into the match. Its worth a watch for some very crisp in ring, though.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> *Match # 3: Undertaker and Kane vs Stone Cold Steve Austin and HHH(backlash 2001)*
> 
> Man, how have I not seen this yet? Apparently its one of the best Backlash matches ever and man does it look awesome on paper. So all titles are on the line here, and HHH is the IC champ :lmao, he must love that after being WWF champ not too long ago. Obviously Austin is the WWF champ(apparently their chums now) and the BOD are the tag champs. About time we get an ABA taker match on this post, because he’s ROLLIN ROLLIN ROLLIN. Also great so far is the fact that HEYMAN is on commentary. Another GREAT match by taker, he usually has shitty matches with Austin but even the parts of the match involving Austin and taker are good, if not great. This was REALLY good in the first 10 minutes of the match but the middle was still good, but not as good as the beginning and end of the match, so some might get bored there. Last like 10 minutes are :mark: and make this an awesome tag match. ****


IMO, the second best video package hyping a match in WWF history (behind the My Way WM17 one).






How can you watch it and NOT want to go and immediately check out the Backlash 2001 tag? God, I loved the Power Trip. Some of the best heel booking I've ever seen, they made Hunter and Austin come across as monsters that were flat out assholes.

Then Hunter got hurt and they had nothing else for Austin, so...when in doubt, bad comedy.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> *Undertaker project post # 1​*
> *this project will not follow any timeline, just random taker matches I have wanted to check out/rewatch
> 
> *Match # 1: Shawn Michaels vs the Undertaker HIAC(bad Blood 1997)*
> ...


It's really hard for me to pinpoint the GOAT match or GOAT anything or top fives of anything for that matter (although its clear to me flair is GOAT wrestler) but hbk/taker hiac is definitely a GOAT match candidate, haven't seen it in a while, need to get on that

If your a fan of that rumble match, check out their sd match iirc it was a fatal 4 way qualifier


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> It's really hard for me to pinpoint the GOAT match or GOAT anything or top fives of anything for that matter (although its clear to me flair is GOAT wrestler) but hbk/taker hiac is definitely a GOAT match candidate, haven't seen it in a while, need to get on that
> 
> If your a fan of that rumble match, check out their sd match iirc it was a fatal 4 way qualifier


YES! Was just about to check out that in post #2 which so far will include BOTH 2006 Taker/Angle matches. 

Also might check out a short Taker/Tajiri SD match from 2002.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Check out the 03 Rey/Taker match from SD too while you're at it. It's under 5 minutes and part of a #1 contenders tournament just after WM. TONS of fun and very much a shorter version of their RR match, but Rey is younger and faster and Undertaker is the ABA.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Tbh am I the only one wishing for a major 15-20 minute Kane/Bryan match in the future?


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

redskins25 said:


> :lmao come on muderface Eddie/Brock :mark: it's venomly good (too much ?)


Nope. It's THAT good. 



Cactus Jack said:


> I make hip hop and electro beats as a hobby


Badass!!



PGSucks said:


> I don't get how people will try to tell me that CFB > NFL. fpalm


I think a lot of it depends on where you grow up. If you grow up in Nebraska, Oklahoma, Alabama, Columbus Ohio, Austin Texas, etc it is a big deal here/there. If you grow up in an NFL town the NFL is obviously king. I'm not saying the level of play in college is better. That is just silly. I do enjoy college football way more than the NFL though. I think I like it because so many teams are different. In the NFL I feel like most teams run the same offenses and do the same things and I'm much more of a running football than passing football oriented person but I'm old school. If I don't have a rooting interest I prefer college. The pageantry is the tits. 



Cleavage said:


> Watched the Jake the snake doc last night, it was the first time since the DVD came out that I watched it. Man it was so messed up in places but really worth the watch even if they skipped quite a few stuff out. If WWE was to redo it today I think it could be top 3 of all time.


It's super sad. It's amazing Jake is alive. I agree if they made it now it would be right up there with the Punk and Foley docs. The Punk doc is one of the best docs I have ever seen. 



ATF said:


> I think that later today, I will make the official presentation of my Top 50 WWE/F TV Matches ever.


Sweet! I love lists!



ATF said:


> And also this: I'm only counting stuff that is aired on a certain show. So that excludes the likes of Rockers/POP and Savage/Shawn


Well fuck!! No Savage/Shawn? Boooooooooooo. :hhh2 



smitty915 said:


> *Punk/Hardy series *​
> *GAB: ****
> NOC: *** ½*
> SS TLC: *** ¾*
> ...


One of my fave feuds ever and their matches delivered. 



GOON The Legend said:


> ​*Royal Rumble 2003 Review*
> 
> *Brock Lesnar vs. Big Show*- This was a blast to watch. Lesnar’s German and belly-to-belly suplexes onto Big Show were impressive in their own right, as well as the nasty bump Lesnar took to the outside of the ring in the early stages of the match. I also really liked Lesnar’s counter of Big Show’s first attempt at the choke slam. For a six (or so) minute match, this was really good, especially if you enjoy watching Lesnar throw 500 pound men around the ring like they’re Cruserweights. *Rating: ***1/4. Cal Scale: 2
> *
> ...


I giggle when someone calls someone else a geek on a message board. Aren't we all geeks? It's not like that is a bad thing either. No offense, duder. 



KO Bossy said:


> Pardon my ignorance but what is this CAL scale and how does it work?


I don't really get it either. How does one get a scale? 



KO Bossy said:


> And who is CAL, curiously?


Ripken. Obviously. 

Wow...nerd alert!!


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> It's really hard for me to pinpoint the GOAT match or GOAT anything or top fives of anything for that matter (although its clear to me flair is GOAT wrestler) but hbk/taker hiac is definitely a GOAT match candidate, haven't seen it in a while, need to get on that
> 
> If your a fan of that rumble match, check out their sd match iirc it was a fatal 4 way qualifier



Yea I would second that sentiment, I think it's tough to beat that original Cell match. My personal favorite and my choice for the GOAT match is Austin/Bret WM13, but Bad Blood is a close close second. Flair/Steamboat Nashville would be 3rd I guess.

Anyone know where I can find Cena/Batista LMS?...I've been looking through YouTube all day and can't find it.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Gather round, friends, for we are about to go on an adventure. Be forewarned. As Mick Foley once said, what you are about to see is truly hideous...










I present to you: Iron Sheik and Nikolai Volkoff vs the Bushwhackers.

This match got -459 stars from Meltzer. Far as I know, its the lowest rated match in history.

Now...does this match REALLY deserve to be the lowest rated match ever? In other words, is this truly the worst match in history? Let's remove any tempting sharp objects from within the vicinity and take a look.

So they start out with the usual Sheik/Volkoff shtick of reciting the national anthem and bitching about the US. Iron Sheik in particular looked fucking dreadful with his massive gut. Sheik then picks up two weight lifting clubs for a demonstration. Maybe this is actually hard to do but it looks pretty unimpressive, honestly. Plus, Sheik looked gassed right after. Not a good sign...

Anyway, on to the match. As the Bushwhackers make their way down to the ring, the commentator introduces them as "Luke and Dutch", which I part groaned/part laughed at. Sheik is basically immobile so Volkoff works 95% of the match. We're talking the most basic of offense-punches, kicks, Irish whips...nothing looked very good. The Bushwhackers hit a double clothesline to Volkoff, which, dare I say, was the high spot of the match. Volkoff just kind of tips backwards to bump for it. The Bushwhackers then double clothesline Sheik, who basically just crumples in a heap. Sheik's stomach impairs his ability to exit the ring under the bottom rope. TONS of stalling, including Sheik saying he'll leave if the crowd continues chanting USA.

The heels almost get counted out, but make it back in time. Sheik could barely get onto the ring apron again. Luke takes a boot to the gut off of an Irish whip and stumbles onto his back. Lots of kicks, stomps and knees. Sheik and Voklkoff double team Luke. Sheik whips Luke into the ropes and...I think he tried going for a clothesline, but instead just sort of pushed him. Looked atrocious, but I couldn't help but laugh (its at 1:22 of the 2nd video). 

It continues with some boring and kindergarten level offense, including a dreaded boot to the chin by Sheik that must be seen (2:35). I thought Sheik tore his hamstring doing it. Luke has been selling for 5 minutes straight at this point and its unbelievably dull. Sheik then tries a Camel Clutch on Luke. Had he bent over an inch more, 2 things were going to happen-a) his singlet was going to tear right along the ass crack (thank god that didn't happen, his trunks must have been sewn together with Kryptonite to withstand as much as they did) and b) his back was going to give out. Butch breaks it up and crawling back to the corner, Sheik looks like he's about to have a heart attack. Luke gets the tag in to Butch...I hesitate to call this a hot tag...more like tepid. Butch cleans house. Sheik is almost dead from fatigue. Then with the ref distracted, Sheik holds Butch while Volkoff tries to clock him with brass knuckles. Butch moves, Volkoff hits Sheik. Sheik topples over, seemingly imitating a beached whale, and takes the pin. Dissension is teased after as Sheik shoves Volkoff but they make up.

So, there you have it. Worst match ever? Well...I don't think so. Bad? Undoubtedly. Everything looked like crap, Sheik in particular. It was ungodly slow and boring. However, it really started getting into the "so bad its funny" territory, so I can't call this the worst match I've ever seen. That honor still goes to Jenna vs Sharmell. That match actually offended me.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Cactus Jack said:


> Anyone know where I can find Cena/Batista LMS?...I've been looking through YouTube all day and can't find it.


http://www.wwe.com/videos/john-cena...championship-last-man-standing-match-26015951

Looks like YT does not want me to watch Angle/Taker NWO 06, guess I'll watch it tomorrow.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^ nice, I just found a vid on YT, but the quality is pretty shitty, and my internet is fucked up again tonite


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

I wasn't watching wrestling during the AE, but I have want back and watched a ton of AE and early Ruthless Aggression Era videos. Here is one from the Ruthless Aggression Era I like and am sure a lot of you like. It's Rock VS Brock as SummerSlam '02.






This match is great, undoubtedly. The feeling of importance associated with SummerSlam combined with a great crowd creates a great atmosphere. The Rock against The Next Big Thing Brock Lesnar. An overall great match, not bad in ring wise, and the crowd absolutely added to it. The healthy amount of smarks rooting for Lesnar, the future, at the time, and those who liked the Rock, rooting for he who has entertained them very much for years prior. Ending is very well executed. Series of good reversals and surprise finishers and "Brock" Bottom. :lol An overall good sequence. All the way up to a Lesnar victory. Even watching now, I feel this sort of vibe at the end from Lesnar's big victory and first WWE Title Reign's start. Great match, IMO. 

:clap


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*@KOBossy- Ah! You just reminded me to put/prioritize Heroes of Wrestling on the Hate-Watch list. I'm not even going to bother watching that until I'm ready. :lmao at -459 stars.

@RhodesForWHC I saw that match live, one of my favorite matches from a personal stand point. The crowd going on smark was confusing for me at the time, but awesome match from those two. Then again that whole Summerslam 2002 was a great show to be at.*


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Heyman to Brock: "You have to pin him inside the ring" :mark:


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

KO Bossy said:


> Gather round, friends, for we are about to go on an adventure. Be forewarned. As Mick Foley once said, what you are about to see is truly hideous...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Any match with Sheiky baby automatically gets 3 stars just because he is in it.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

pretty short post here, but its whatever 

*Undertaker Project post #2*​
*Match #1: Kurt Angle vs the Undertaker (SD 3/03/06)*

Apparently some say this is better than their NOW bout, and I haven’t seen either of them( soon though), Really hoping for another AWESOME match from the dead man, and I doubt that I will be disappointed. I have seen their FL 2000 match and that is it, and I personally thought that match sucked dick, but Angle was much better at this point than he was in 2000. This match has an interesting pace. It starts out as a mat based match but slowly morphs into a straight up fight. This is beautiful, just brilliant. This is all I want in a match, a little bit of mat wrestling blended with a lot of a brawl too, a perfect clash in styles. My eyes were legit glued to the screen from the beginning of the match to the end. My current 2006 MOTY. Also, the ending wasn’t great but who cares! **** ½* 

*Match # 2: Rey Mysterio vs the Undertaker (SD 2003)*

I loved their RR match and this video is only 6 minutes long so why not, also off a recommendation from KILLACAL. You know, this is pretty fucking good for a match that goes less than 5 minutes. This was great because even though it was short it did not look like a squash at all. Another funny thing is that the 619 is reversed just like in the RR match, only here its into a last ride. ***

*Match #3: Rey Mysterio vs the Undertaker ( SD 2010)*

To finish out the trilogy of the Taker/Rey matches is the fatal four qualifying match that would be Takers return match but I think it was the only one before he left again. IMO this was the weakest of the three despite #2 being VERY short. At least that one had some fun SPOTZ and was quicker paced. I don’t know if it was just me but it felt like they were just going through the motions and it was kind of clear that taker was still kind of hurt, it wasn't too bad though. ** ½* 

*Match# 4: CM Punk vs the Undertaker HIAC ( HIAC 2009)*

Never seen this, but Have heard that its not too great, bummer because I like their WM 29 match and it’s a top 5 MOTY for 2013 so far. I think this might have actually opened the show to this PPV. Really? A HIAC match fucking OPENING the show? Who the fuck booked this? Punk was red hot ATM because he had just come off of that :mark: level feud. However, the supposedly bad(haven’t seen it) breaking point match. Punk would lose ALL steam after this feud and never recover until the summer of Punk really. Anyways this was pretty fun, and nowhere near the level of shit that Cena vs Orton HIAC from this event was. I thoroughly enjoyed myself but it’s not something you NEED to watch TBH. *** ½*

EDIT: I JUST FOUND BENOIT'S NAME ON WWE.COM! http://www.wwe.com/classics/titlehistory/worldheavyweight


----------



## Hennessey (Jan 1, 2012)

Any thoughts on Unforgiven 2007?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> EDIT: I JUST FOUND BENOIT'S NAME ON WWE.COM! http://www.wwe.com/classics/titlehistory/worldheavyweight


lol, it's nothing. His name is not removed from the title histories. (although the summaries are)

My best Benoit discovery in WWE.com was finding a shitload of pics from the Raw/Smackdown archives. (and another large pic they uploaded last year in a Stephanie pic collection)


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

If they're gonna do that they might as well not edit the shit outta the MITB match. Hell. I have teh EC set that was released in 2010, his appearence in the NYR 2005 match is completely unedited.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> If they're gonna do that they might as well not edit the shit outta the MITB match. Hell. I have teh EC set that was released in 2010, his appearence in the NYR 2005 match is completely unedited.


They never mention him in any articles nowadays, though. All the left in mentions and pics are from before his death save for a few republished event results like most Wrestlemania's. He's always excluded in every list they make and if he's included, (i.e. Texas tag in greatest Raw matches) they downplay him by zero mentions. They have "erased" him in a few instances too. Go to Eddie's page and he's edited out of the Radicalz pictures as well as the Hall of Fame induction. (they say Rey and Chavo inducted him)

MITB has not been edited "physically" other than a few camera angles changed and his entrance removed but all the commentary to do with him is muted which is annoying. I don't get that either because I'm sure the War Games DVD has at least one or two pieces of commentary where they mention his name.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

smitty915 said:


> pretty short post here, but its whatever
> 
> *Undertaker Project post #2*​
> *Match #1: Kurt Angle vs the Undertaker (SD 3/03/06)*
> ...


If you liked this, you'll definitely like their 2003 SD and NWO 2006 match. Their Undisputed Championship match from 2002 is worth a watch as well. :kurt :taker


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Watching NWO 2006 right now, no idea why I didn't try dailymotion when YT kept buffering :lol.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> DVD and Blu Ray extras for Hell in a Cell 2013 released:
> 
> *Special Features
> 
> ...


Only the UK? The hell is this shit?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Fuck the UK, it's all about MERICA!


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Only the UK? The hell is this shit?


It's BULLSHIT is what it is. They've been dropping blu rays in the US left and right and I hate it. I'd pick up HIAC in an instant if we got those extras here in the states, and I'd probably eventually get Battleground too considering that has another Del Rio/Ziggler match. At least on that dvd there's the 6-man with Shield vs. Rhodes & Bryan that gets changed to No DQ and Orton interferes.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Battleground actually has a DVD bonus match in full? Feels like that's a first since Survivor Series 2010.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

William Murderface said:


> Fuck the UK, it's all about MERICA!


:lenny soo true

Serious what is up with YT recently ? my videos buffer/stop playing almost everything, cant watch my wrasslin


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Really? I've watched some PPVs on there recently and it's been smooth sailing for me.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Battleground actually has a DVD bonus match in full? Feels like that's a first since Survivor Series 2010.


Yeah, toss in the bonus match with the fact that it's only $9.99 pretty much everywhere means I _may _actually buy it sometime. Shield/Rhodes Bros, ADR/RVD, and the possibility I may enjoy Orton/Bryan more on a 2nd watch seems enough to warrant a purchase on top of the rest.

What's on SSeries 2010? Miz's cash in?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'd buy it for ten bucks + the bonus DVD. Or at least welcome it as a gift. Damn sure over HIAC or NOC. Which I felt were much weaker overall. I liked Punk vs Ryback too, so plus one for me. I have to own Shield vs Rhodes Dynasty & there is no way getting around that. _(btw I saw NOC for ten bucks at Best Buy today.)_

Yep. Orton vs Barrett WWE Championship rematch + Miz vs Orton cash in with all the aftermath.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Finished NWO 06 Taker/Angle, classic match. Done with projects for tonight, putting on Shield/Ryback and hell no TLC for the second time, another awesome match.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Miz cashed in on RAW, not SS.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Oliver-94 said:


> Miz cashed in on RAW, not SS.


Duh 

Ok i will legit finish Brock/Eddie tonight :lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's an extra on that DVD from RAW...


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Is the horrible tag match from RR '97 that you guys were talking about, the one that contains these people?:


> Héctor Garza, Perro Aguayo, and El Canek






redskins25 said:


> :lenny soo true
> 
> Serious what is up with YT recently ? my videos buffer/stop playing almost everything, cant watch my wrasslin


Did you delete all of your cookies, temporary files, and history? That will probably do the trick.

Also, try using a different browser than the one you're using. If it's not a problem on the other browser, then it's something related to the browser you're using.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

You MERICUNTS can complain all you want about us getting BLURAYS and shit, but fuck me at your prices!!! $10 for a PPV only a couple of months old? That works out at around £6.30... and we pay DOUBLE that over here! At least the Blurays (for PPV's) are only £1 extra, but I still refuse to fucking buy ANYTHING from Fremantle until they decide to have a fucking sale.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The Primer said:


> I'd buy it for ten bucks + the bonus DVD. Or at least welcome it as a gift. Damn sure over HIAC or NOC. Which I felt were much weaker overall. I liked Punk vs Ryback too, so plus one for me. I have to own Shield vs Rhodes Dynasty & there is no way getting around that. _(btw I saw NOC for ten bucks at Best Buy today.)_
> 
> Yep. Orton vs Barrett WWE Championship rematch + Miz vs Orton cash in with all the aftermath.


Hopefully they keep the price drop for PPVs full time, although I have a feeling they dropped them temporarily because of all the negativity that surrounded the two shows (NOC & Battleground). Thought NOC was terribly underwhelming and that has no dvd extra, so that's certainly not getting a purchase.

Huh, I have that dvd and I've watched the whole PPV before but never the extra. Can't imagine it's that great anyhow.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Callamus said:


> MERICUNTS


Love it!


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

What browser are you using, btw, 'skins? I feel like I had that same problem before on Firefox. I had to download an update of Java or something, and then it started working correctly. Let me know if you're using Firefox when this is happening, and if so, I'll find out exactly what I did before to make it work.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Callamus said:


> You MERICUNTS can complain all you want about us getting BLURAYS and shit, but fuck me at your prices!!! $10 for a PPV only a couple of months old? That works out at around £6.30... and we pay DOUBLE that over here! At least the Blurays (for PPV's) are only £1 extra, but I still refuse to fucking buy ANYTHING from Fremantle until they decide to have a fucking sale.


Pipe down, Cal. 8*D



Jack Evans 187 said:


> Hopefully they keep the price drop for PPVs full time, although I have a feeling they dropped them temporarily because of all the negativity that surrounded the two shows (NOC & Battleground). Thought NOC was terrible underwhelming and that has no dvd extra, so that's certainly not getting a purchase.
> 
> Huh, I have that dvd and I've watched the whole PPV before but never the extra. Can't imagine it's that great anyhow.


I dug RVD vs Del Rio quite a bit, but again, that's purely reserved for a gift only or else I'll never own it. Not worth it. WWE's own fault for pumping out terribly bland & poorly build PPVs.

I like it, b/c the Miz moment was something I was cool with. Couldn't believe they pulled the trigger and he won the WWE Championship. Of course, the quality about it is the only main appeal for me. Got the whole RAW on DVD already, only the quality isn't as good, haha.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> Did you delete all of your cookies, temporary files, and history? That will probably do the trick.
> 
> Also, try using a different browser than the one you're using. If it's not a problem on the other browser, then it's something related to the browser you're using.





LilOlMe said:


> What browser are you using, btw, 'skins? I feel like I had that same problem before on Firefox. I had to download an update of Java or something, and then it started working correctly. Let me know if you're using Firefox when this is happening, and if so, I'll find out exactly what I did before to make it work.


I just deleted all that stuff and turned it off, on comp #2 atm, I'm using firefox, but I tried using internet explorer and was having the same problems, 5 min matches werent even loading


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

My YT was not working like an hour ago, watched something on dailymotion and now it works 

Make sure you don't have a virus skins, I downloaded Avast yesterday and it got rid of a virus I had from downloading a PPV and now my PC runs a lot better.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The Primer said:


> *I dug RVD vs Del Rio quite a bit*, but again, that's purely reserved for a gift only or else I'll never own it. Not worth it. WWE's own fault for pumping out terribly bland & poorly build PPVs.
> 
> I like it, b/c the Miz moment was something I was cool with. Couldn't believe they pulled the trigger and he won the WWE Championship. Of course, the quality about it is the only main appeal for me. Got the whole RAW on DVD already, only the quality isn't as good, haha.


As did I (aside from the finish). (Y) You and I are probably the only ones who have that as MOTN cause some other folks in here shat on it heavily. Unfortunately the next best match was Orton/Bryan and everything else was nothing special.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> As did I (aside from the finish). (Y) You and I are probably the only ones who have that as MOTN cause some other folks in here shat on it heavily. Unfortunately the next best match was Orton/Bryan and nothing else was anything special.


Yeah, Danielson vs Orton by near default. Which isn't the positive trait behind it. Tag championship match was one I liked, but was FAR too short to be anything noteworthy. No real point to even give Primetime Players the shot like that for it to feel like utter filler. Card placing on the show was the dirt worst too.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> As did I (aside from the finish). (Y) You and I are probably the only ones who have that as MOTN cause some other folks in here shat on it heavily. Unfortunately the next best match was Orton/Bryan and everything else was nothing special.


I am offended sir, RVD/ADR was MOTN for me aswell.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Still have yet to see a single match from NOC and ain't running to either


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

You should watch RVD/ADR though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Watch Del Rio vs RVD. Then you'll be square.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

William Murderface said:


> I am offended sir, RVD/ADR was MOTN for me aswell.


SORRY! You must not have posted anything in here after the show. Make that 3 people. 



redskins25 said:


> Still have yet to see a single match from NOC and ain't running to either


Well, no need to really. Del Rio vs. RVD was really good but the finish sucked balls. Orton vs. Bryan was pretty decent, but again the finish sucked balls. So yeah, just act like it never even happened and you'll be fine. OH but Kofi did give Axel his best IC Title defense to date, which isn't saying much. :lol


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Watch Del Rio vs RVD. Then you'll be square.


Beat you too it! :angle



> SORRY! You must not have posted anything in here after the show. Make that 3 people.


I probably didn't, but at least you know


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Eh, didn't think much of RVD/ADR, *** at the most for me, which means, yes, its MOTN


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Corey, your last sentence...argh. :hayley2


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

> OH but Kofi did give Axel his best IC Title defense to date, which isn't saying much.


Are you kidding? :|


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*I actually dug that Axel-Kofi match and I'm not fond of either guy. RVD-ADR was *** range*.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Quick Question for you guys, is Shield/Ryback and hell no the best TLC match ever? Only one I can think of that I like more is the 3rd one on SD after WM 17


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> I just deleted all that stuff and turned it off, on comp #2 atm, I'm using firefox, but I tried using internet explorer and was having the same problems, 5 min matches werent even loading


If it's happening on both browsers, it sounds like it might be your internet connection then. Have you noticed that pages are ever so slightly slower than before?

1)Take these three speed tests and tell me what your results are (don't do anything else on your computer while you're running the tests. Don't worry, they don't take long). If they're significantly slower than average, it's probably your internet:
http://www.speedtest.net/
http://www.internetfrog.com/mypc/speedtest/ (let me know what color you fall under)
http://speedtest.comcast.net/

If that's the case, unplug and reset your modem. If you see orange lights instead of all green on your modem, that means your internet is slower than it should be (at least in my case, that's what it meant for me).

For me, it cleared itself up within a few days on its own. Your internet company will probably never admit that it's a problem on their own end. But if you tell them that your speeds are that much slower than the average, and you can't even watch videos, they'll send someone out (you'll have to say you already made sure there wasn't a virus, and it's only been happening in the past few days, and nothing changed with your computer).


2)Also, in Firefox, go to Tools, then Add-Ons, then Plugins, and click on "check to see if your plugins are up to date" in blue on top. Update all of your plugins that haven't been updated.

3)Lastly, click on "Help" on top of your Firefox, and then "About Firefox" and then "Check for Updates". Update to the latest version of Firefox (I'm on it, and it works great for me).

I really think that it's your internet speed, though.


ETA: Do you have this same problem with Dailymotion and other videos, or just Youtube?


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> Quick Question for you guys, is Shield/Ryback and hell no the best TLC match ever? Only one I can think of that I like more is the 3rd one on SD after WM 17


*Summerslam 00 or WM17, for me in terms of multiman TLCs.*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I put the Shield TLC match in top flight regard. I wouldn't argue anyone wanting to put it on top of the heap. It's basically #2 for me overall with the original still placed at #1. Both are flawless.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Corey, your last sentence...argh. :hayley2





William Murderface said:


> Are you kidding? :|


Hahaha. I didn't say it was great or anything but it's definitely the best defense I saw from him. Slightly over the Miz match from MITB and miles better than the Truth matches. Don't know of any other defenses he's had on TV.

Don't worry guys, I'm not a Kofi Kingston fan all of a sudden.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Hahaha. I didn't say it was great or anything but it's definitely the best defense I saw from him. Slightly over the Miz match from MITB and miles better than the Truth matches. Don't know of any other defenses he's had on TV.
> 
> Don't worry guys, I'm not a Kofi Kingston fan all of a sudden.


I believe he had an Intercontinental Championship match with Jericho on SD. Wasn't too bad. But it was with Jericho, who's a great in ring worker.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The Primer said:


> I put the Shield TLC match in top flight regard. I wouldn't argue anyone wanting to put it on top of the heap. It's basically #2 for me overall with the original still placed at #1. Both are flawless.


Think I'll watch the original three TLC's again right now, thank god for the ladder set!


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Rhodes_For_WHC said:


> I believe he had an Intercontinental Championship match with Jericho on SD. Wasn't too bad. But it was with Jericho, who's a great in ring worker.


Well if he did that's probably the best by default.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm in the SMALL _(but I write it big?)_ minority who liked the Axel vs Miz match. Although I haven't disliked an Axel match as much as I have the one vs Kingston at NOC. Thought both were flat out horrendous in it. Axel did nothing; felt that's what most see when they watch him. Kingston was more obnoxious as a "worker" than usual.

Axel's best matches during his time in the sun have been when the gold isn't on the line. vs Rhodes, Ziggler, & I think someone else. Might have been the Miz match, but I recall liking another TV match. Jericho ones were fine. Nothing exciting, but fine. More pop to 'em than vs Punk. Which still baffles me how there is zero chemistry there.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> Quick Question for you guys, is Shield/Ryback and hell no the best TLC match ever? Only one I can think of that I like more is the 3rd one on SD after WM 17


Summerslam is pretty awesome. TLC 2012 is at least behind that one for me, and probably behind WM 17.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

WM 17 isn't special, for me, when it comes to a bulk of TLC matches thanks to it being a lot of recycled spots from the original. The interference was the touch it had to give it something different, although so much of the others is nothing we haven't seen done the first time around. I'd put all the other multi man bouts over it. It's still a fun spectacle of course.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

The Primer said:


> I'm in the SMALL _(but I write it big?)_ minority who liked the Axel vs Miz match. Although I haven't disliked an Axel match as much as I have the one vs Kingston at NOC. Thought both were flat out horrendous in it. Axel did nothing; felt that's what most see when they watch him. Kingston was more obnoxious as a "worker" than usual.
> 
> *Axel's best matches during his time in the sun have been when the gold isn't on the line. vs Rhodes, Ziggler, & I think someone else.* Might have been the Miz match, but I recall liking another TV match. Jericho ones were fine. Nothing exciting, but fine. More pop to 'em than vs Punk. Which still baffles me how there is zero chemistry there.


I agree. Axel's two matches with Rhodes, I believe on Main Event and SD, were both decent. Their Main Event match more so. They had quite a few good reversals in the match, and it was fairly long, with a good sequence at the end. Rhodes' selling of Axel's moves was top notch, especially the Back Suplex and the Hangman's Facebuster.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Axel's match with Kofi in Minnesota on Smackdown was probably his best match in recent memory.

Of course creative is entirely stupid with the way they decided to end that match, _knowing_ that Axel was going into a PPV with Punk.

Inexplicable, really.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

I still maintain that the best TLC match is the unofficial one from WM2000 (technically named the triangle ladder match, but it was exactly a TLC match without the name). Everything there was fresh, novel and it made the careers of 6 guys. Summerslam and WM17 were also very good, and the idea with them felt like they were constantly trying to top what they'd already done, which was interesting. And of course, the SD one was excellent as well (still remember that insane headbutt Benoit did through a table).

The TLC 2012 one...it was alright. I'm at the point where most things I see in plunder matches really don't feel that incredible to me anymore, so the effect has worn off. I mean it was a pretty good match but I wasn't wowed by anything. I did think it was funny that they took Ryback out early to keep him from blowing up. The best part is that it helped the Shield look strong coming out of it. The actual match itself...solid, but nothing epic, I thought.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

ADR/RVD was the MOTN at NOC. It was ok. In other words it was the thinnest girl at fat girl camp.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

KO Bossy said:


> The actual match itself...solid, but nothing epic, I thought.


That one spot in the end with Rollins was pretty good, I thought. Nothing too extravagant, as it was pretty simple, but the bump itself was noteworthy.



MachoMadness1988 said:


> ADR/RVD was the MOTN at NOC. It was ok. In other words it was the thinnest girl at fat girl camp.


Agreed. The match itself OK, in my opinion, but the rest of the matches at NOC were even more disappointing. That is really what separates Battleground from NOC to me. Though they were both crappy PPV's a a whole, Battelground had a great match in Rhodes Brothers VS Rollins/Reigns, backed by a solid storyline, whereas NOC's best match was unremarkable.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Callamus said:


> You MERICUNTS can complain all you want about us getting BLURAYS and shit, but fuck me at your prices!!! $10 for a PPV only a couple of months old? That works out at around £6.30... and we pay DOUBLE that over here! At least the Blurays (for PPV's) are only £1 extra, but I still refuse to fucking buy ANYTHING from Fremantle until they decide to have a fucking sale.


You are gonna make a fantastic old guy!


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Rhodes_For_WHC said:


> That one spot in the end with Rollins was pretty good, I thought. Nothing too extravagant, as it was pretty simple, but the bump itself was noteworthy.


Agreed, it was the highlight of the match, I thought. Rollins solid it well, he looked totally concussed (though he actually may have been, not sure).


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

I might give Summerslam 2002 a watch tonight


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

LilOlMe said:


> Axel's match with Kofi in Minnesota on Smackdown was probably his best match in recent memory.
> 
> Of course creative is entirely stupid with the way they decided to end that match, _knowing_ that Axel was going into a PPV with Punk.
> 
> Inexplicable, really.


What made it stupider is that Axel had just beat Cody twice, who was a fresh babyface with good momentum after beating Sandow twice, to look strong for his match with Punk, and was then beat by Kofi, who has been directionless for years.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Watched most of The Great American Bash 2008 a few days ago. I was somewhat pleased in overall.

Jericho VS Michaels match was :mark:. These two have great in ring chemistry. The storytelling during the match was great, IMO. In fact, just about all of their feud that I've watched is great.

The rest of the PPV, that I watched wasn't nearly as good as Michaels VS Jericho, didn't really catch on to any of the other matches. But the Jericho Michaels match more than made up for that, for me.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Loved the TLC 2012 match. All six men had a great performance (yes, even Ryback) and Ambrose's facial expression after he sells the chokeslam is hilarious :lmao. It also had a good story with the Shield members protecting one another all the time so that showed what a strong unit they were. Favourite moment is probably the WWE 13 spot (that's what I call it now) when Reigns spears Kane through the barricade.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

C2D, are you still viewing the Royal Rumble '97? I just re-watched the Rumble match and Austin was GOAT'ing all over the place in that. 

Still don't understand the whole HHH is the GOAT heel stuff, when you watch Austin back in those days. He didn't need a mic, and he didn't even need to be wrestling to be able to have the crowd in the palm of his hand. He was so good that he basically redefined the lines between heels and faces.

It was all organic too. He did it all on his own. 

His mannerisms were so fucking top-notch too...I love watching him the most when he's not even wrestling. Just his presence alone is a show on to itself, back in those days.

You could feel the crowd turning, the more he performed, btw.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man (Feb 8, 2013)

LilOlMe said:


> C2D, are you still viewing the Royal Rumble '97? I just re-watched the Rumble match and Austin was GOAT'ing all over the place in that.
> 
> Still don't understand the whole HHH is the GOAT heel stuff, when you watch Austin back in those days. He didn't need a mic, and he didn't even need to be wrestling to be able to have the crowd in the palm of his hand. He was so good that he basically redefined the lines between heels and faces.
> 
> ...


Ironically, I'm watching it right now as we speak.:lmao

And yeah, Austin is GOAT in the Rumble match. Good showing from Taker and LOL at how corny Rock was at the Time. Looking at that Rock compared to what he would become is mind boggling. Complete 180 transformation.:lmao


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> C2D, are you still viewing the Royal Rumble '97? I just re-watched the Rumble match and Austin was GOAT'ing all over the place in that.
> 
> Still don't understand the whole HHH is the GOAT heel stuff, when you watch Austin back in those days. He didn't need a mic, and he didn't even need to be wrestling to be able to have the crowd in the palm of his hand. He was so good that he basically redefined the lines between heels and faces.
> 
> ...


I was gonna watch it yesterday but was too tired and went to sleep. Austin had just entered when I paused it, will continue it from there now.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Billion Dollar Man said:


> Ironically, I'm watching it right now as we speak.:lmao
> 
> And yeah, Austin is GOAT in the Rumble match. Good showing from Taker and LOL at how corny Rock was at the Time. Looking at that Rock compared to what he would become is mind boggling. Complete 180 transformation.:lmao


Amazing the transformation Rock went through in just a year, even in terms of crowd reaction. I recently re-watched his entrance during his RR '98 match, and this was back when he was still with the Nation of Domination. Still, he had such a fucking presence, and the crowd was totally reacting to him. Just shows you that when you let someone fly with their real personality, it's always better. 

lol at someone with "The Rock does NOT suck" sign.

On a side-note, KingLobos always mentions how The Rock's walk back then was even different (slower, more badass and cocky). I agree, and I loved it.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> I was gonna watch it yesterday but was too tired and went to sleep. Austin had just entered when I paused it, will continue it from there now.


I think that there was only about six minutes from the time when Austin came in.

It's interesting how much things pick up, just from his presence. LOL at one of the NOD side-kicks clapping for Austin as he entered. Breaking of kayfabe?


----------



## Billion Dollar Man (Feb 8, 2013)

LilOlMe said:


> Amazing the transformation Rock went through in just a year, even in terms of crowd reaction. I recently re-watched his entrance during his RR '98 match, and this was back when he was still with the Nation of Domination. Still, he had such a fucking presence, and the crowd was totally reacting to him. Just shows you that when you let someone fly with their real personality, it's always better.
> 
> lol at someone with "The Rock does NOT suck" sign.
> 
> On a side-note, KingLobos always mentions how The Rock's walk back then was even different (slower, more badass and cocky). I agree, and I loved it.


Yep. I've been rewatching a lot of AE years as of late. Started with 1999, then 2001, 1998, and now I'm watching 1997. Plan on watching 2000 and 2002 sometime after. 

I was watching 1998 and Austin was so red hot, I kept think to myself, this is ridiculous how fucking over this guy was. Awesome how the Rock was able to climb up and reach that apex with Austin.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Billion Dollar Man said:


> Yep. I've been rewatching a lot of AE years as of late. Started with 1999, then 2001, 1998, and now I'm watching 1997. Plan on watching 2000 and 2002 sometime after.
> 
> I was watching 1998 and Austin was so red hot, I kept think to myself, this is ridiculous how fucking over this guy was. Awesome how the Rock was able to climb up and reach that apex with Austin.


You should watch some of '96 too, since that was the start of Austin's rise. Can't speak to the quality of PPVs, since I usually remember individual matches more than anything.

Yeah, Austin's pops were always insane. It helps that his music has a little signal before it starts, lol. It's almost Pavlovian, the response.

The Rock's ascent was phenomenal. He actually seemed more popular than Austin in his prime to me. Like, I remember him being talked about far more. I'm sure that maybe it was the opposite in other parts of the country/world, though.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Austin has made it ten times better since entering. lol @ Bart Gunn botching twice while being in the match for less than a minute.










Just awesome.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Is there any one better than Kurt Angle making a near fall look legit? I don't think so.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Austin has made it ten times better since entering. lol @ Bart Gunn botching twice while being in the match for less than a minute.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Told you!

You could tell that Lawler geniunely got a kick out of that moment in the picture, btw.


:lmao at Michaels wearing a cowboy hat, with that boy toy outfit. It looks so diametrically opposed. It's crazy how as a kid, I didn't understand why people thought that Michaels' outfits came off as gay. Ass chaps!!!!


Reminds me of this HBK/HHH interview:


> MT: Did you get a lot of crap in the locker room for this song?
> 
> HBK: No, it was just 30-year-old guys going, "What are you dancing to this music for?" We joked about it, but it was just one of those things that caught on. When I first started doing it, I was a heel, so it was OK, but then it got to a point where it was so stupid.
> 
> HHH: He's so fashionably challenged, and he was coming out to a song that called him a boy toy while wearing leather assless chaps and a motorcycle hat, and he thought he looked fine.


Don't have much memory of this HBK/Sid match at all, so maybe I'll watch this now.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Alim said:


> Is there any one better than Kurt Angle making a near fall look legit? I don't think so.


Angle actually kind of annoys me with that. He doesn't move a muscle until the absolute very last second, sometimes not even kicking out until the ref has stopped himself from hitting the 3 count. It's pissed the crowd off on a couple different occasions.  But I can see how someone would love it though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah, I was gonna say that trait about Angle is god awful.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

I love it. There's never a dull moment with a Kurt Angle match.

Jeff Jarrett does the same thing once in awhile.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man (Feb 8, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Austin has made it ten times better since entering. lol @ Bart Gunn botching twice while being in the match for less than a minute.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


When he won, it felt rewarding despite him being the heel.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'd say the opposite with Kurt Angle matches. 8*D


----------



## Billion Dollar Man (Feb 8, 2013)

LilOlMe said:


> *You should watch some of '96 too, since that was the start of Austin's rise.* Can't speak to the quality of PPVs, since I usually remember individual matches more than anything.
> 
> Yeah, Austin's pops were always insane. It helps that his music has a little signal before it starts, lol. It's almost Pavlovian, the response.
> 
> The Rock's ascent was phenomenal. He actually seemed more popular than Austin in his prime to me. Like, I remember him being talked about far more. I'm sure that maybe it was the opposite in other parts of the country/world, though.


I might eventually.

And yeah, Rock had a bigger crossover appeal and that garnered him more fans.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Michaels just rubbed his ass on Vince. :lmao

And Vince loved it. :vince2


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

1997 Royal Rumble is now finished! Main event still to come but that'll be done tomorrow.

Ratingz:

Goldust vs HHH - ★★¼
Ahmed Johnson vs Farooq - ★★
Vader vs Undertaker - ★★½
Lucha stuff - ½★ (the bad stuff are simply hilarious!)
Royal Rumble - ★★★¼ (Stone Cold aside, most of this was forgettable tbf. This was all about him!)
HBK vs Sid - N/A


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Vader/Taker from Canadian Stampede is where it's at. Probably both of their most underrated match. Undertaker's comeback is so good.

Ratings for some matches I watched today:

Lesnar/Show RR 03: ***
Cena/Show WM XX: ***
Cena/Angle/Show NWO 04: ***1/4
JBL/Eddie: ***1/2
Punk/Hardy Bash 09: ****
Benoit/Regal 2000: ****1/4
Jericho/Goldust Superstars: ***1/4


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

No date next to it Eddie vs JBL. Goodness, I hope that's not Judgment Day.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Oh no, I'm not that dumb. It's GAB. Now I'm watching JBL/Angle LMS. Kurt Angle's 10 count usage here is just like his typical pin count nearfall selling/behavior.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

bama4 

Close call.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

LilOlMe said:


> Michaels just rubbed his ass on Vince. :lmao
> 
> And Vince loved it. :vince2


Vince squirting his love juice everywhere while commentating Shawn's matches in 96 was insane. Seriously, dude wouldn't shut the hell about him. He must have been in love.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That's the Vince I know and love. Force feeding till the day he dies.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Some would say Cena is a prime example of that. 8*D


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

I wish we could have Vince back on commentary


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Billion Dollar Man said:


> Ironically, I'm watching it right now as we speak.:lmao
> 
> And yeah, Austin is GOAT in the Rumble match. Good showing from Taker and LOL at how corny Rock was at the Time. Looking at that Rock compared to what he would become is mind boggling. Complete 180 transformation.:lmao


 Agree on the Rock. Also happens to be one of the best character progressions of all time. Starting off as a rookie who got booed then joining the nation of domination and starting to insult the fans on booing him. The rest is history. Watching his 97-98 heel character, I can see why some hate on his Hollywood rock gimmick because it was totally different to the late 90s rock. I still like the gimmick but his mic work in the late 90s are far better than Hollywood rock.

I'm going to watch unforgiving later (1998). So many wrestlers debut after mania; x-PAC joining dx, funaki and we get a Val Venis promo lol


----------



## TheeJayBee (Aug 24, 2011)

Watched the documentary on the new HHH DVD the other night. A brilliant documentary - really eye-opening and whilst I know these things can be produced in such a way that allows the representation of people in them to be controlled and manipulated, I can't help but feel the WWE is in safe hands when 'The Game' takes full control. I am going to watch some of the matches later and may drop some reviews in here


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Gonna finish wrestlemania 18 this afternoon when I get home, maybe even start SVS 02 

Hollywood Rock sucked, his NOD character though :mark:


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*That Austin-Dude Love match from that PPV is :mark:. The rest was kind of meh
*


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Austin/dude is awesome, but just wait until you watch the OTE match? First inferno match is OK, nothing special but not too bad. 

Can't remember a thing about the rest of that show 


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----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> Gonna finish wrestlemania 18 this afternoon when I get home, maybe even start SVS 02
> 
> Hollywood Rock sucked, his NOD character though :mark:
> 
> ...


lol. Wouldn't go that far. Was a well worked character for the time period given the real life circumstances with Hollywood.

Blows anything hes done since his return out the water regardless.

If anything a Hollywood Dwayne Johnson character would have done wonders these past few years.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Hollywood Rock is the only time I found Rock to be anything close to entertaining. As a gigantamous Rock Hater that says it all really .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Rock has been terrible since his return, only good match is wm 28

SVS 2011: DUD 
Vs cena WM 28: ***1/2
Vs punk RR: DUD
VS punk EC: haven't seen it
Vs Cena WM 29: DUD 

So out of the matches I've seen 75% of them are DUDS :lmao 


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----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Thing with the 2011-13 Rock is that it's not great for the Rock's standards (97 - 2003 Rock is miles better) but for today's standards, where almost all babyfaces use corny jokes, he wasn't THAT bad. Still one of the best mic workers in the roster today. CM Punk is definitely ahead of him, Y2J and Bray Wyatt are both arguable.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I'm refusing to talk about Rock anymore.

Punk Vs Brock for my PUNK watchings. GOOD LORD I'm fucking pumped for this.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Hollywood Rock > Punk & Brock tbh, even though I love BROCK. Hollywood Rock ruled the world. One of my favourite characters of all time.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Starbuck said:


> Hollywood Rock > Punk & Brock tbh, even though I love BROCK. Hollywood Rock ruled the world. One of my favourite characters of all time.


Since you mentioned The Beast himself Brock on top of Hollywood Rock,

Ive always wanted to see how their 2003 rematch went at a house show in Miami. Brock vs Hollywood Rock indeed happened.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

The first concert never gets old. His version of 'Kansas City' :lmao


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

I enjoyed all the Rock concerts pretty much, even the latest one. His line about the divorce lawyers was :lol. I know it's an unpopular opinion around these parts, especially in this thread but I miss Rock. When he was actually on the show I was entertained. That's all that matters to me.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Well FUCK.

That's all I can say about Punk/Brock, it's quite undoubtedly the MOTY and for good reason, as both Brock and Punk just go out there, give it their all, and leave EVERYTHING they have out there in the ring on that night. Brock's bullying of Punk, Punk's initial onslaught that catches Brock off guard, the damn near perfect use of a chair, the build to the final G2S and the collective "OH NO HE DIDN'T!" when Heyman screws Punk out of the biggest win of his career, all complete genius and an indicator of what happens when you take the most naturally gifted performer in the ring EVER in Brock Lesnar and match him up with one of the biggest innovators the business has ever seen in CM Punk.

There's like a few minor issues that keep this from perfection as far as I'm concerned, but it still runs away as my MOTY with two months left to go; I don't see any combination surpassing it at that point TBH, especially since the likely Survivor Series card is MEH and December doesn't have a history of classic WWE matches anyways. The use of the chair though, that's how you should use a weapon in a wrestling match. Let it build and let it keep building up until you pull the trigger in the match and take the story to a different plateau, magnificent. This gets ***** 3/4* for me and it could very well be Punk's best match if Punk/Cena doesn't get the whole five for me. I can pretty much guarantee it's spot in the top three Punk matches though, unless there's something I REALLY enjoy.

Speaking of Punk, anybody else notice that post Payback return he has had like... ONE great match? Sure he has a string of good contests here and there but everything besides the Lesnar match is ultimately forgettable. He's wrestled 30 TV/PPV bouts this year with a trio of all time AMAZING fights w/ Cena, Taker, & Brock, two really good TV matches with Ryback & Jericho, but the rest of his year has been forgettable from an in-ring standpoint. Same goes with Cena's year to be honest, a whole bunch of forgettable or bad matches on TV, and a few AWESOME bouts such as the Punk match and the Bryan match.

All Punk needs is to be matched up with somebody he actually cares about working with, he just seems so unmotivated in the ring when he's not matched up against a first or second tier guy, another CENA staple as of late. Maybe the Wyatt's can get something out of him, or maybe he'll see it as another small match and not try as hard? IDK.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

DA BEAST

Most likely overlooked but I love the spot where Lesnar grinds his knee into Punks kidneys, and the camera shot makes Lesnar look like a legit fucking monster torturing the little, valiant baby face, and all you hear is the Ref asking Punk if he wants to quit and he just keeps screaming "NO!"

Best babyface performance in Punks career


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Best part about that gif is the REF ducking out of the way as Punk flies over him :lmao.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

I really should rewatch that match as I didn't think it much close to Cena/Bryan and that Punk had better personal performances before in the year, too. Lesnar was an animal in it, though.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

I love that .gif of Brock just fucking man handling Punk. Hilarious.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I'm a huge fan of Punk but I wouldn't come anywhere close to calling him an innovator of the wrestling business. I'm not exactly sure what's done to innovate or change the whole spectrum of wrestling outside of the pipe bomb promo and shattering that imaginary glass ceiling or whatever you'd like to call it. His moveset is new to the mainstream WWE audience simply because most fans had never seen it before, but a lot of it is just ripoffs of KENTA if we're being honest. When I think revolutionary superstars, I think of Rey Mysterio, Chris Benoit, & Eddie Guerrero. Guys who changed the entire landscape of wrestling by showing you didn't have to be the biggest guy to be on top. Mysterio especially because he essentially brought that Lucha Libre style to the United States. Ric Flair, Hulk Hogan, & Stone Cold are another big 3.

I credit Punk's hot and cold year post-Wrestlemania simply due to the fact that he's been wrestling subpar guys. Axel & Ryback aka Heyman Guys 2.0. I'm not sure what went wrong in the Jericho match but that was just an abomination.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Yeah, the best babyface work of Punk's career for sure.

Punk & Cena both having career matches against Brock AND against one another? Seems like an odd triangle of fucking amazing matches to me. If Taker and Brock get to have a match at Wrestlemania XXX then I'm pretty sure it'll be a slam dunk MOTY contender, both guys are the two greatest in the universe from match to match.

When I call Punk an innovator I'm drawing a quote from something Bret Hart said earlier this year. Bret talked about how if you watch Punk wrestle in North America, he seems to wrestle "smarter" in the sense of his matches are never utterly ridiculous (BAR Payback 2013, the Rock matches weren't Punk's fault AT ALL) and his moveset, despite being completely ripped off seemingly, is completely unique to the rest of the WWE landscape. It's no surprise that Punk worked two "If Taker/Punk get DQ'ed, they lose!" matches at Wrestlemania in a row in two completely different and opposite roles; he can just DO IT. I don't know anybody else face or heel who can wrestle the same match in two different roles and have both matches come out as all time classics.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

*Tonight, the Top 50 WWE TV countdown BEGINZ.*

_#ATFFTW_


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Punk/lesnar gets the full five for me, you can nit-pick about the ending but its such a little fault in a rather modern day classic, top 15-20 match


And about the Michaels convo a couple pgs back- :lmao Vince did cream every time he was out there in the right, was a little over the top

And there was only a couple of attire that HBK that I that were uber gay, the iyh w/ owen and another one I forget


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I might be the only one who didn't hate Punk/Jericho from Payback. Then again, I am a Kurt Angle mark  

I'm guessing Punk will take time off after this angle with the Wyatts and DB, and hopefully he's healthy and motivated for the RTWM. I'm expecting a classic out of unk at WM for a third straight year :mark:


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

redskins25 said:


> Punk/lesnar gets the full five for me, you can nit-pick about the ending but its such a little fault in a rather modern day classic, top 15-20 match
> 
> 
> And about the Michaels convo a couple pgs back- :lmao Vince did cream every time he was out there in the right, was a little over the top
> ...


Well Bret thinks that HBK and Vince had a fling with each other quite often.

Would explain why Vince is such a mark for him and let him get away with shit all the time


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Punk/Lesnar is my definite MOTY. Cena/Bryan right behind. Nothing else comes close as far as I'm concerned. It took us long enough to get a ****1/2 star match this year and then we got two in the same night along with a really good WHC match too. Summerslam 2013 > Wrestlemania 29 by a country mile with the former being :mark: and the latter mostly being a pile of uneventful crap. Sorry if this post starts another MOTY and/or Mania 29 discussion .


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^ well maybe if you ever watched dolph/adr you would not think that 



Ok guys here is my MOTY list #3234455














































:hhh2, I actually havent made one yet actually :lmao


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

Starbuck said:


> I enjoyed all the Rock concerts pretty much, even the latest one. His line about the divorce lawyers was :lol. I know it's an unpopular opinion around these parts, especially in this thread but I miss Rock. When he was actually on the show I was entertained. That's all that matters to me.


Agreed, I suspect its probably for the best he's stayed away for atleast a bit, I suspect crowds were ready to turn on him post WrestleMania this year, the wait will do him good and he'll return for his final program with a monster pop and reaction.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

And so it begins. HHH Vs Undertaker. KOTR 2002. Have mercy on my soul.




Wait, I'm ginger. I should be fine 8*D.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Tell you what, skins, when I get off over Xmas break I'm going to re-watch all the shit on the list of 2013 stuff I've been compiling and I will finally watch Ziggler/ADR. There. 

:hhh2


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Yeah, the best babyface work of Punk's career for sure.
> 
> Punk & Cena both having career matches against Brock AND against one another? Seems like an odd triangle of fucking amazing matches to me. If Taker and Brock get to have a match at Wrestlemania XXX then I'm pretty sure it'll be a slam dunk MOTY contender, both guys are the two greatest in the universe from match to match.
> 
> When I call Punk an innovator I'm drawing a quote from something Bret Hart said earlier this year. Bret talked about how if you watch Punk wrestle in North America, he seems to wrestle "smarter" in the sense of his matches are never utterly ridiculous (BAR Payback 2013, the Rock matches weren't Punk's fault AT ALL) and his moveset, despite being completely ripped off seemingly, is completely unique to the rest of the WWE landscape. It's no surprise that Punk worked two "If Taker/Punk get DQ'ed, they lose!" matches at Wrestlemania in a row in two completely different and opposite roles; he can just DO IT. I don't know anybody else face or heel who can wrestle the same match in two different roles and have both matches come out as all time classics.



In reference to you last sentence, I was talking about this a while ago. My answer to "who else can wrestle the same match in both roles and have them both come out as classics?" was-

1. Ric Flair
2. Eddie Guerrero
3. Jerry Lawler
4. Terry Funk
5. CM Punk


....and that's it. Want to know what numbers 1-4 have in common? They are all either dead or retired from wrestling full time in the ring. So that makes Punk the only active guy alive who can work face/heel equally well. While I don't think Punk is anywhere near the level of the other four dudes listed, he's also only been in the big leagues since 2007. So he's only had around 6 years, the other guys had decades to establish their legacy. Punks got a lot more years left (I hope).

I want more Brock Lesnar in the WWE. The WWE should throw the kitchen sink at him to try to get him to wrestle 6-7 events a year instead of the 3 he's been doing.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

You STILL haven't watched Ziggler/ADR? You really are a total BRICK. I'm here watching Undertaker Vs HHH KING OF HELL match and you can't even be arsed to watch one of the better matches of 2013, a year so far filled with some truly top notch matches? ARRGHH!!!


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Oh pipe down PITCH. Ziggler and ADR bore the fuck out of me and I have little time enough as it is. I have them down on the list for the end of the year and I will watch it if only to shut you all up. 

More BROCK would be awesome but I definitely have the impression that he's happy to get paid buckets of $$$ for minimal work. I can't say I blame him but being totally selfish, yes, I'd love to have him be more full time than part time. I'm :mark: because I get to see him have a match at Mania next year and most likely against Taker. It doesn't get much better than that.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Callamus said:


> You STILL haven't watched Ziggler/ADR? You really are a total BRICK. I'm here watching Undertaker Vs HHH KING OF HELL match and you can't even be arsed to watch one of the better matches of 2013, a year so far filled with some truly top notch matches? ARRGHH!!!


Thats what I'm saying


Watching some Daniel Bryan 2010 stuff


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

:lenny music to my ears, you HAVE too watch it, it is whats best for..................:HHH2


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Starbuck said:


> Oh pipe down PITCH. Ziggler and ADR bore the fuck out of me and I have little time enough as it is. I have them down on the list for the end of the year and I will watch it if only to shut you all up.
> 
> More BROCK would be awesome but I definitely have the impression that he's happy to get paid buckets of $$$ for minimal work. I can't say I blame him but being totally selfish, yes, I'd love to have him be more full time than part time. I'm :mark: because I get to see him have a match at Mania next year and most likely against Taker. It doesn't get much better than that.


You lucky bastard. :HHH I'm mildly entertaining the idea of going to WM30 just because it's WM30 and to finally see Taker live. Then again, it IS New Orleans. If WM31 does go to Santa Clara, I'm 100% going


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

MOTY for me is whatever I watched last between Punk/Brock and Taker/Punk. Punk might not be consistent like Bryan, but he makes the big plays when they count at least. 

And despite how much Mania 29 sucked, everything about Taker/Punk made WM29 worth going to. The pre-match video package, Punk's entrance with Living Colour playing live, Taker's GOAT entrance, the classic match itself, the electric crowd, and even the aftermath with Taker looking as emotional as ever as he was shown the utmost respect by us in the crowd.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Punk is kinda lazy in the TV matches if you ask me, but delivers on a big scale against an important opponent


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Punk is definitely a big match/PPV wrestler imo. vs Cena/vs Taker/vs BROCK are all great matches, but I can't remember much else from this year that was worthwhile (though I'm sure the AFICIONADOS of this thread will tell me otherwise).


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

I can only remmeber his TLC match from january agains Ryback as a ***3/4 very good TV match. But that was kinda big and important too in a way


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

From what I can remember of it, Punk/Taker isn't in the same stratosphere as Punk/Lesnar. Not even close. But to be fair I really do have to watch it again to make a proper judgement.

Well if :HHH2 thinks Ziggler/ADR is best for business then I'm sold. 

I'm really looking forward to Mania XXX regardless of what the card ends up being. It's likely to be my last one and I've always wanted to go to NOLA. Should be a great trip. So long as most of the guys I mark for perform or are there in some capacity I'll be happy. And it's the 30th anniversary so they're bound to go all out. I'm hype.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I agree that Punk/Lesnar definitely trumps Punk/Taker.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Punk/Taker was incredible seeing that Punk worked the match with a bad knee and Taker with his advanced age and lots of injuries. And Lesnar brutality bring *** stars automatically to any match :mark:


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Well Brock/Punk is my MOTY but we all know Punk/Taker was GREAT as well.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Punk/Taker was great, ****1/4 for that, but I still have Punk/Lesnar over it at ****1/2 for my MOTY.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Both Taker/Punk and Punk/Brock have immense pros with little to no cons. Top-notch action that kept me on my feet, an amazing story being told, and great character portrayals by all men in both matches. There isn't much of a difference from my end. Punk/Lesnar I'd give as the bigger match, but there weren't any great near-falls in that one, where with Taker/Punk, a heel Punk kicking out of the tombstone still always gets me. I don't know how someone could say "one trumps the other"... I guessdifferent strokes for different folks ( or however that saying goes).


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

I don't feel right giving Punk/Taker a rating just yet because I've only seen it once but I'm absolutely confident that Punk/Lesnar is better.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I haven't watched Punk vs. Lesnar in about a month and I watched Punk vs. Taker a couple of weeks ago, but Punk vs. Lesnar is still better by a comfortable margin to me. I thought Punk vs. Taker was awesome, but Punk vs. Lesnar was on another level and will be MOTY barring any surprises.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

William Murderface said:


> Well Brock/Punk is my MOTY but we all know Punk/Taker was GREAT as well.


Basically this.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Well in any event, both Taker/Punk and Brock/Punk sit at the top of my MOTY pile by a comfortable margin. Nothing else would come close.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

You didn't care for Bryan/Cena or Punk/Cena, or they're just not nearly as high as the two you named?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

*ATF's Top 50 WWF/E TV Matches Ever

NOTE: No MSG or VHS matches here... oh, and it's my opinion - but lemme know if I forgot something

Honorable Mentions:
Bret Hart vs. Owen Hart, Raw 3/27/1995
Mankind vs. The Rock, Raw 2/11/1999
CM Punk vs. Mark Henry, Raw 4/2/2012

(****)
#50: Drew McIntyre vs. Chris Masters, Superstars 5/9/2011









#49: The Miz vs. John Morrison, Raw 1/3/2011









#48: Edge vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 6/8/2007









#47: Chris Benoit, Shawn Michaels, Mick Foley & Shelton Benjamin vs. Evolution, Raw 4/12/2004









#46: Triple H vs. Chris Jericho, Raw 4/17/2000









#45: Team Hell No & The Undertaker vs. The Shield, Raw 4/22/2013









#44: Rey Mysterio vs. Jamie Noble, Velocity 5/1/2004









#43: Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 9/9/2005









#42: Shawn Michaels vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 7/1/1996









#41: Doink The Clown vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 6/21/1993






*


Spoiler: list



(****)
#50: Drew McIntyre vs. Chris Masters, Superstars 8/27/2010
#49: Mankind vs. The Rock, Raw 2/15/1999
#48: Edge vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 6/8/2007
#47: Chris Benoit, Shawn Michaels, Mick Foley & Shelton Benjamin vs. Evolution, Raw 4/12/2004
#46: Triple H vs. Chris Jericho, Raw 4/17/2000
#45: Team Hell No & The Undertaker vs. The Shield, Raw 4/22/2013
#44: Rey Mysterio vs. Jamie Noble, Velocity 5/1/2004
#43: Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 9/9/2005
#42: Shawn Michaels vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 7/1/1996
#41: Doink The Clown vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 6/21/1993


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

#50 starting out at ****? This list is either going to have a ton of **** matches or the high end is going to be full of snowflakes. 

Great start though.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

The Lady Killer said:


> You didn't care for Bryan/Cena or Punk/Cena, or they're just not nearly as high as the two you named?


Oh, I loved those two matches, especially Bryan/Cena. Love a lot of Tv matches this year as well that I wouldn't put in the same league as those two. I'd rate them: 

1) Punk/Brock- ****3/4
2) Taker/Punk- ****3/4
3) Bryan/Cena- ****1/4

Those are my top 3, and Punk/Cena would be a little further down at ****.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Will be interesting to see for how long will the WWE keep Bryan and Cena apart


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

As of this very moment, I have the big 4 matches from this year at **** 1/4. Cena/Punk, Punk/Taker, Punk/Lesnar, and Bryan/Cena. The first two are the only ones I've seen twice so I need to watch Summerslam again to differentiate all of them. Honestly at this moment I'd say Cena/Bryan is my MOTY.

-----------

Well I can already tell I'm not going to agree with a lot of this list.  #45 and 43 are WAY too high imo. Neither one would make my list at all. The majority of the rest of those I don't remember or even knew they existed, but hell of a look on that Doink/Jannetty match, even if I still have it rated lower. What's up with the Kid picture though? :lol


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Starbuck said:


> #50 starting out at ****? This list is either going to have a ton of **** matches or the high end is going to be full of snowflakes.
> 
> Great start though.


Well there are more ****1/4 matches than over that and some **** stuff *combined*. I think I'm too fucking generous tbph. 



Jack Evans 187 said:


> Well I can already tell I'm not going to agree with a lot of this list.  #45 and 43 are WAY too high imo. Neither one would make my list at all. The majority of the rest of those I don't remember or even knew they existed, but hell of a look on that Doink/Jannetty match, even if I still have it rated lower. What's up with the Kid picture though? :lol


THN & Taker/Shield I'll admit I'm a jizzed mark for, but it had me on the edge of my seat w/so much stuff (Rollins' dickhead taunt antics, awesome isolation, TAKER, BRYAN, etc.). Eddie/Rey Cage is imo what GAB is for most, as in THE overlooked gem between dem two. 

And you should def. check out these. McIntyre/Masters not many know but it rules.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

ATF said:


> Well there are more ****1/4 matches than over that and some **** stuff *combined*. I think I'm too fucking generous tbph.


Hahaha. I was gonna say the same thing. Probably like 4-5 better Shield tags (at least for me) out there from this year. Love the inclusion of Miz vs. Morrison FCA though. That's a favorite of mine.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

The SD 6- Man Main Event from Friday was awesome one of the best TV matches of the year, ****1/4, it definetely deserves at leat a nomination at MOTY


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*King of the Ring 2002*

Well I gotta watch the main event for this show at some point. Might as well be now. 


*Chris Jericho Vs Rob Van Dam - King of the Ring Semi-Final Match*

They do some basic fancy looking counters and shit to start with, ending with both of them going for a dropkick at the same time. But they make it good afterwards when RVD does his "R! V! D!" thing to show that HE is actually the better man, and Jericho slaps him in the face. Which leads to RVD KICKING JERICHO IN THE FACE with a somewhat EPIC kick tbh. Looked like the toe of RVD's boot jabbed Jericho in the eye lol.

From that point, RVD is in firm control, using his unique offence to take Jericho to the limit and beyond. He sets up for a 5 star frog splash... and Jericho pushes the ref into the ropes, crotching Van Dam on the turnbuckle!!!

BREAKDOWN~! And RVD kicks out. Guess it's no longer his finisher lol, because the commentators don't even MENTION the move, and the fans don't react :lmao.

:lmao at Jericho as he chokes RVD with wrist tape. The ref tells him off and Jericho just screams back "BUT I'M THE KING OF THE WORLD!" at him :lmao.

Jericho smashes himself into the ring post and RVD begins his comeback and URGH he starts it with those elbows. Those god awful elbows. Oh god there is a HHH Vs RVD match on PPV in 02, isn't there? SHITTY ELBOWS VS SHITTY PUNCHES await me .

:mark: Jericho avoids a leg sweep and counters with a sweeet Enzeguri to the head :mark:.

GERMAN SUPLEX~! RVD fold up and STAYS LIKE THAT until Jericho makes a cover and he kicks out!

Pace picks up now and they both go for high impact/signature moves and they do give us a pretty cool finishing stretch tbh. 

LIONSAULT~! MISSES!!!

5 STAR FROG SPLASH~! MISSES!!!

LIONSAULT~! KICK OUT!!!

Jericho tries for something on the ropes, gets crotched and hit with a 5 Star Frog Splash and RVD advances to the finals!

This was pretty good . Finishing stretch was tons of fun, and Jericho's control segment was good too. Jericho then attacks RVD after the match.

*Rating: ***3/4*
*CAL SCALE - 4*


*Test Vs Brock Lesnar - King of the Ring Semi-Final Match*

Yey Lesnar has his good music now.

Cool to see Lesnar against a big powerful opponent. Test can throw out some power stuff but more importantly Lesnar can throw out bigger and better power stuff which makes him look so much more impressive.

:mark: Test kicks out at one point and Lesnar can't believe it so he just SMASHES his forearm into Test's face and goes for another pin. Lesnar is awesome.

Heyman nearly has a heart attack any time TEST hits something successfully :lmao.

HOLY SHIT, the Big Boot near fall is :mark:. Looks great and Heyman probably died for a few seconds thinking it was over then and there. He recovers enough to distract Test, F-5 from Lesnar and this is done.

Fun stuff!

*Rating: **1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 1*


*Jamie Noble Vs The Hurricane - WWE Cruiserweight Championship Match*

Man, I forgot how much FUN Noble and Nidia's characters were lol.

Pretty well built up feud for this (ahhh, CW feuds, another reason to miss the brand split  ), so there is some HATE~! here to play off .

Helms is on a roll to start with, rocking Noble with some big shots and nearly lands a CHOKESLAM too. Then Nidia tries to grab his feet coming off the ropes, but she MISSES :lmao and because it's the spot, Helms looks back and chases after her anyway, allowing Noble to KILL Helms with a legit KILLER clothesline that made me :mark:.

:lmao at Lawler trying to get JR to fantasise about Nidia :lmao.

Thing get a little dull with Noble applying a sleeper hold, which sucks . Then Hurricane makes his comeback but it falls a little flat tbh. The crowd just aren't into the match at all, making the near falls just DIE because nobody cares .

HUGE neckbreaker from the top rope are least gets a reaction. Looked great. But unfortunately that can't make up for the fact this match has been fairly dull for the most part. Which is a shame. It started off good, then died. Fans only hot hot for the neckbreaker and then the CHOKESLAM that followed, and then the match ends with Noble getting the win.

*Rating: ***
*CAL SCALE - 0.5*


*Eddie Guerrero Vs Ric Flair*

Eddie is just :lmao early on in this match. He's moving about all over the place, using his speed and quickness to out manoeuvre Flair, mocking him the entire time because Flair is old and slow and he's young and fast.

I do hate that the commentators are REALLY putting Eddie down. They talk about how Flair is a master inside the ring and has probably forgotten more about wrestling than Eddie knows and all that shit... and I'm sat thinking to myself "Eddie has been in the business for what, 14/15 years at this point? And is a second generation star who grew up in and around the business and learnt a TON from his dad and brothers. Why the fuck are you treating him like some rookie?".

Flair comes back with a LOW BLOW, showing that he's still the dirtiest player in the game, and Eddie shows that he is FAR from a rookie by going to the outside to recover and prevent Flair from building any kind of momentum. I'm all for putting FLAIR over, but at the expense of Eddie? Feck off.

Guerrero continues to mock Flair, this time by using Flair's own gameplan on him, targeting the legs and locking in a Figure Four!!!

A missed FROG SPLASH allows Flair to get back into it, and he shows Eddie how the Figure Four is really done! Benoit shows up and stands on the outside as we watch Flair fumble about on the mat trying desperately to do a bunch of quick pins but is too slow and too old to really execute them properly and it's hilarious yet sad at the same time :lmao .

Eddie distracts the referee, and Benoit drags Flair to the outside and applies the Crossface! Referee doesn't see him doing it but sends Benoit to the back anyway.

While the referee is busy with Benoit, Bubba Ray shows up! Bubba Bomb! Flair crawls into the ring, goes for a pin and gets the win!

Well this match was disappointing . Started off fun, but then it just becomes generic. Eddie attacks the legs. Flair makes a comeback. Interference. Finish.

*Rating: ***
*CAL SCALE - 0.5*


*Molly Holly Vs Trish Stratus - WWE Women's Championship Match*

No thanks.

*Rating: NO*
*CAL SCALE - -1*


*Kurt Angle Vs Hulk Hogan*

:lmao at the wig Angle is wearing.

Oh god this one starts off with a test of strength. The memory of HHH/Hogan is flooding my mind. GET IT AWAY!!!

:lmao at Hogan swinging his arm around to build up to a big punch... then when he comes time to punch, he stops spinning and throws the punch the OPPOSITE WAY HE WAS SPINNING. Come on Hogan, a guy your age can't afford to waste energy like that!

Gotta give it to Hogan here though, he does take a lot of offence from Angle, which includes a bunch of suplexes lol. Taking all those back bumps can't be good for the guy!!! 

SLEEPER HOLD. Likely quite literally used as a rest hold here so Hogan can keep on going for the remainder of the match .

ANGLE SLAM~! HOGAN KICKS OUT~!

HULK UP~!

Hogan takes the wig off, but eh, seeing Angle bald for the last 11 years takes away any kind of impact it has lol . Angle is so disgusted that he decides to leave, but comes back when he sees Hogan wearing the wig :lmao.

CHAIR TO ANGLE'S FACE... DONE BY HIMSELF~! BIG BOOT~! LEGDROP... COUNTERED INTO AN ANKLE LOCK~!

Hogan taps out. 

Match is fine. Nothing special, but I wouldn't call it bad or anything. Hogan being limited probably works in the match's favour tbh because it prevents Angle from going all out with MOVES~! .

*Rating: **1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 1*


BOOKER T AND GOLDUST. Goldust is pretending to be The Rock :lmao. The real Rock shows up and ruins everything. GoldRock > Real Rock. Goldust rubbing his nipples while Rock is talking is :lmao. Booker trying not to laugh is :lmao. Goldust rules.


*Brock Lesnar Vs Rob Van Dam - King of the Ring Finals Match*

RVD fights Lesnar HEAD ON from the get go, and Lesnar eats some fucking epic kicks to the face.

POWERBOMB. Welp, RVD is doomed lol.

Lesnar's power here is just :mark:. Completely MAULS RVD. Can't wait to see their lengthier Vengeance match soon.

BEAR HUG~! Lesnar makes it look INCREDIBLE. Heyman on the outside screaming "SQUEEZE!!!" adds a whole lot to it too. Lesnar is one of the few people who can BEAR HUG someone and not make me wanna shoot myself. A rare quality in a wrestler lol.

Damn, Lesnar catches a kick from RVD and just THROWS him up into the air and onto his shoulders. Incredible RAW POWER.

RVD starts to rock Lesnar, and to keep Lesnar motivated we hear Heyman constantly screaming "TITLE SHOT!!!" to remind Lesnar of the importance of this one. 5 STAR FROG SPLASH~! Heyman drops RVD neck first across the ropes, and RVD falls back into the cover! Lesnar kicks out, catches RVD from the ropes and levels him with an F-5.

ALL HAIL KING LESNAR!!!

Tremendously fun match. Short but good. Lesnar looks incredible, RVD gets some decent offence in and almost beats THE BEAST, which helps set up their rematch perfectly. :mark:

*Rating: ****
*CAL SCALE - 2*


HHH backstage runs into THE NWO. They all HUG and shit. NWO tell Triple H to do the CLIQUE hand signal if he needs any help. I need help with this next match, can I get the NWO to review it for me instead? PLEASE? 


*The Undertaker Vs Triple H - WWE Undisputed Championship Match*

NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO. DO NOT WANT.

But it's a main event, it's a WWE title match, and it has THE UNDERTAKER in it. So I gotta watch it . BRB need beer.

:lmao at HHH getting his win back over Hogan to become #1 contender for this match. CAN'T HAVE SOMEONE BEAT HIM WITHOUT HIM BEATING THEM BACK!!!

Heyman being on commentary to scout Lesnar's potential SS opponent might hopefully help me get through this one. HOPEFULLY. I'm scared .

OH GOD 27 MINUTES LEFT ON THE EVENT. I don't think I have enough alcohol to get me through this.

Arrghhh, awful HHH punches right from the get go. Undertaker hates them too so he just fucking HEADBUTTS HHH. And not in the "put my hand on HHH's head and headbutt my hand in a way that looks like I headbutted his head" but a "fuck this shit. HEADBUTT UNPROTECTED". Maybe he was hoping it would knock either or both of them loopy so they could get through the match not really knowing what the fuck was going on. I know I could do with something like that.

Ahhh, Undertaker is in control for the moment. GOAT PUNCHES. But so far this appears to be like their Insurrextion match, with HHH refusing to give Undertaker anything for too long. GOTTA GET DEM SHITTY PUNCHES IN.

FFS HHH, LET UNDERTAKER HAVE A FECKING CONTROL SEGMENT. Do you not understand basic wrestling 101? HEEL BUILDS HEAT, BABYFACE MAKES COMEBACK. It's the most basic of things, yet it fucking WORKS. Why should anyone care about you getting offence in if you do it every 30 bloody seconds for a 25 minute match? I gotta say though, I do :lmao at certain parts of this because UNDERTAKER seems to be shooting on HHH a few times, using some "old school" kinda moves that hurt like hell for real, such as rubbing his forearm into the face etc. I swear he's pissed off with this match as much as we are, so he's getting his shots in when he can .

Crowd has been AWFUL for this PPV btw. I don't blame them for this match, but fuck, they've just not given a shit about anything or anyone for the most part. A hot crowd MIGHT have made this a little easier. MAYBE. We'll never know though lol. 

Still 15 minutes left :|. This seems to be lasting FOREVER. BRB need more beer.

:lmao WORST REF BUMP EVER. 'Taker sets HHH up for a catapult thingy into the corner. The referee is stood to the side, seeing what's coming. THEN HE RANDOMLY MOVES INTO THE CORNER TO GET SQUASHED BY HHH :lmao.

The Rock shows up and Heyman runs away. Now we have to listen to HIM while watching this crap? Urgh.

:mark: Undertaker kicks Rock in the face. BECAUSE HE CAN. Best part of the match so far. :lmao then Rock tries to get revenge and ends up decking HHH in the head with a chair then gets mauled by Undertaker. 

LAST RIDE~!

Another referee shows up, only gets a 2 count, so Undertaker punches him in the face.

ROCK BOTTOM~! Fuck you, Rock. Stop getting in 'Taker's business. You had no reason to show up half way into the match on commentary. And you certainly had no business hitting a Rock Bottom. This is like No Way Out all over again. Match happened there because Rock put his nose in Undertaker's business when he shouldn't have. Motherfucker.

PEDIGREE~!

ROLL UP~! Undertaker wins!!!

My god. This is awful. Awful. AWFUL. And it just seems to last FOREVER too. 25 minutes? More like a fucking day. At least Undertaker wins in this one. Still, it might actually be worse than their Insurrextion match.

*Rating: DUD*
*CAL SCALE - 0*



*Overall CAL SCALE - 8*​


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Glad to see that I'm not the only one who hates the HHH/Taker match from KOTR


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Punk/lesnar *****
Punk/taker ****1/4

I think I may go off stars again 


@ I agree with Corey there are a couple I disagree with and there probably will be some more, but HELL of a effort and time spent doing this type of lsit, would probably take me over 5 yrs to do this not even joking

Examples of disagreement : if that is the Hart.bros NHB raw is WAY to low, same with that evolution tag, and # 43,45 , 49 are WAY too high, that FCA is pretty overrated tbhayley


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Srdjan99 said:


> Glad to see that I'm not the only one who hates the HHH/Taker match from KOTR


I'm pretty sure everyone hates that match :lol.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> Punk/lesnar *****
> Punk/taker ****1/4
> 
> I think I may go off stars again
> ...



I'm gonna say first that I'm excited to see the rest of your project ATF, I love lists in general and I especially liked the PPV Main Events one you did in the previous thread (if you have a link to to it I'd be very happy, I tried looking for it once to read through it again and couldn't find it)

I like that Miz/Morrison match, a fair amount actually as I think it's probably his best match along with the Danielson US title match. But I much, much prefer Hart Bros NHB to that. Eh, that's why it's all opinion I guess.

For the record, if you don't have Eddie/Rey SD 6/23/05 in your top 5 I'm going to be incredibly disappointed. That's the only TV match I think is worthy of "the full 5" (I know I'm biased, feck off) so I'd be interested in seeing what you have higher. The only ones I can see being above it for some people are Owen/Davey Raw 1997, Angle/Taker SD 03', Benoit/Austin SD, Jericho/Benoit vs Austin/Trips, and MAYBE for some Cena/Punk Feb. 2013. 

Damn, you got me wanting to do a 50 favorite TV match project now


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

ATF said:


> ATF's Top 50 WWF/E TV Matches Ever
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You put different McIntyre/Masters in w/ the photo and in the spoiler tag.  And put Miz/Morrison at 49 w/ the picture and Rock/Mankind at 49 w/ the spoiler tag. WHICH ONE IS IT!?

Listing top TV matches of shows that only really have names is something I can almost say I've literally never thought about so I have fairrrrly little idea if something on my list would be higher or lower than where someone else puts it, but I will chimez in with what I might do with these matches anyway. I wouldn't have Miz/Morrison anywhere near list. It's good, but the first kind of bored me and felt like generic WWE 'this is sports entertainment' stuff. Wouldn't have Trip/Jericho there either or even close to it. Have you seen the 6/12/00 Raw match b/w the two? Thought that was way better than 4/17. I keep wanting to love that Rey/Eddie cage but I just never do. IDK, there's always next watch since it's been a while. Michaels/Jannetty is good but I think Michaels arguably had better TV matches with Jannetty's New Rockers partner Cassidy (Al Snow), Helmlsey, Owen, Kid and none of those would make my top 50 WWE TV (the Owen match has the best shot of all of them - it's goddamn good). I'm pretty sure I'd have Doink/Jannetty a lot higher unless that's not their best match. They had two, yeah? Which was 23 falls? I think I'd place McIntyre/Masters somewhere, 5/12/11 was probably their best to me. Rey/Noble is the birth child of me and an Asian woman named Lucy so I'd have to have that somewhere higher than bottom ten. Edge/Benoit and the Raw tag are pretty great and somewhere in the 40s seems plausible. I think I still have that episode of Raw recorded on Australia's TiVo-equivalent with the Shield tag on it......call me stupid but I didn't think I'd go this long without seeing it.

I thought you were doing top WWE matches ever period (I somehow misread it every single time you brought it up), but this is cooler. Don't know what to expect with this kind of thing. Sort of. there are matches I can pretty safely bet everybody will have on the list like Austin/Benoit or Rey/Eddie, but with PPV matches out of the picture it gives room for hundreds of other matches that's anyone's guess. Will you have Punk/Henry there? IDK. Will you have the 2/7/00 tag on there? IDK. Will you have Finlay/Hardy on there? IDK. Will you have Steiners/Quebecers on there? IDK. Will you have a Kevin Thorn match on there? Probably not.

---------------------------------

at the risk of death threats I have not seen Punk/Taker, Lesnar/Punk, or Bryan/Cena yet. 

Come. At. Me.




Srdjan99 said:


> Glad to see that I'm not the only one who hates the HHH/Taker match from KOTR


Have you found someone that likes it? :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

If there is enough interest, i _may_ upload Shawn Michaels vs Venom - Texas Alliance Wrestling (2000).


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

VENOM. That reminds me, I have like, a tag match with him & someone Vs The Hardy Boys still to watch. Been meaning to see it for about a decade.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


> You put different McIntyre/Masters in w/ the photo and in the spoiler tag.  And put Miz/Morrison at 49 w/ the picture and Rock/Mankind at 49 w/ the spoiler tag. WHICH ONE IS IT!?
> 
> Listing top TV matches of shows that only really have names is something I can almost say I've literally never thought about so I have fairrrrly little idea if something on my list would be higher or lower than where someone else puts it, but I will chimez in with what I might do with these matches anyway. I wouldn't have Miz/Morrison anywhere near list. It's good, but the first kind of bored me and felt like generic WWE 'this is sports entertainment' stuff. Wouldn't have Trip/Jericho there either or even close to it. Have you seen the 6/12/00 Raw match b/w the two? Thought that was way better than 4/17. I keep wanting to love that Rey/Eddie cage but I just never do. IDK, there's always next watch since it's been a while. Michaels/Jannetty is good but I think Michaels arguably had better TV matches with Jannetty's New Rockers partner Cassidy (Al Snow), Helmlsey, Owen, Kid and none of those would make my top 50 WWE TV (the Owen match has the best shot of all of them - it's goddamn good). I'm pretty sure I'd have Doink/Jannetty a lot higher unless that's not their best match. They had two, yeah? Which was 23 falls? I think I'd place McIntyre/Masters somewhere, 5/12/11 was probably their best to me. Rey/Noble is the birth child of me and an Asian woman named Lucy so I'd have to have that somewhere higher than bottom ten. Edge/Benoit and the Raw tag are pretty great and somewhere in the 40s seems plausible. I think I still have that episode of Raw recorded on Australia's TiVo-equivalent with the Shield tag on it......call me stupid but I didn't think I'd go this long without seeing it.
> 
> ...



You seem to generally prefer nice stiff work, believability, moves/holds with purpose, and classic baby face/heel matchups I think, atleast that's how I saw it when you post your favorite WCW match lists and your match reviews. That said, I think you'd really enjoy Punk/Lesnar from Summerslam. It's your basic Monster heel vs underdog baby face (ala Vader vs Sting/Steamboat) and those two really beat the shit out of each other. There is a healthy dose of Heyman shens, though in my opinion it fits the story since Punks beef was really with Heyman, not Lesnar. At any rate, I think I deserves all the 5-Star praise it gets, it's a classic NWA-esque wrestling match blended with a bit of WWE show biz entertainment style.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Watching Wrestlemania 18, 5 matches in and the CAL scale is 8.5, still got SIX more matches, I woudn't trust the CAL scale on this one.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Eddie vs. Malenko @ Hostile City Showdown 1995. Is it any good? It sounds rather appealing, but I don't want to waste half an hour if it's dull as fuck. Opinions?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

The Sandrone said:


> Oh, I loved those two matches, especially Bryan/Cena. Love a lot of Tv matches this year as well that I wouldn't put in the same league as those two. I'd rate them:
> 
> 1) Punk/Brock- ****3/4
> 2) Taker/Punk- ****3/4
> ...


Ah, gotcha. (Y)

And I REALLY want to see that Evolution tag from 04 on ATF's list.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

FLUX said:


> Eddie vs. Malenko @ Hostile City Showdown 1995. Is it any good? It sounds rather appealing, but I don't want to waste half an hour if it's dull as fuck. Opinions?



Nah I really don't like it, their 2/3 Falls from their final ECW event is MUCH MUCH better.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Clint Eastwood said:


> If there is enough interest, i _may_ upload Shawn Michaels vs Venom - Texas Alliance Wrestling (2000).


lol there is a ton of interest for this match. Main reason is because its rare. Even if you dont have a mass ton of folks on WF clamoring for it, there are fans all across the globe searching for it. Trust, its in high demand.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I'd like to see that.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I thought more people have seen it  Been tracking it down for ages myself and noticed a contact of mine had it on a TWA disc. I don't want to hoard it as you know from my uploads, i'm not like that, just a tad reluctant to release it for the masses atm. 

Dunno.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Quick Question: is SVS 2002 a one match show? All I have seen from it is the ME, how is the res?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

SVS 02, assuming it holds up, is a super all round show. Next on my list, to clear the awful KOTR main event out of my head lol .

Noble/Kidman is good. Trish Vs Victoria is good (so don't skip it!). 6 man tables match is fun. Triple threat tag is :mark:, so I hope I don't hate it this time around lol. Show/Lesnar is :mark: for such a short match. And the main event is :mark: too.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

SVS 02 is awesome from what I remember.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Alright thanks guys, really looking forward to it. Will start it either tonight or tomorrow! 

Hogan vs Rock starting now on WM 18! Hope it holds up!


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Apart from the crowd, i can't really stand Rock/Hogan


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*** for Rock/Hogan. It's fine, but nothing amazing or anything. Taker/Flair blows it out of the water as far as a big epic match goes lol.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I liked Taker/Flair, probably the best match on the show as far as pure wrestling goes, but for the STARZ, Hogan/Rock wins by a hair.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Honestly, Taker bias and all aside, I cannot see how Hogan/Rock beats Undertaker/Flair in ANY WAY POSSIBLE outside of the crowd. And the crowd don't mean that much to me anyway .


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

The commentary for Taker/ Flair was hilarious. King always sticking up for Taker had me rolling.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Honestly, Taker bias and all aside, I cannot see how Hogan/Rock beats Undertaker/Flair in ANY WAY POSSIBLE outside of the crowd. And the crowd don't mean that much to me anyway .


Well, I like an awesome crowd, but Flair/taker was still fun, I'd put Hogan/Rock slightly as MOTN though...


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

WM 18 was a weird event for me, match quality was nothing special and Hogan/ Rock not closing the show was beyond laughable.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

On the main event now, not expecting much, an I have really hated this show outside of two matches TBH.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

I'd like to see tht HBK match but who the heck is Venom?


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Oh god watching HHH/Jericho hurt me because I like both. Their match was nothing good at all. 

**1/2


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

sharkboy22 said:


> I'd like to see tht HBK match but who the heck is Venom?


Joey Abs.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

As far as match quality goes, no mania touches 24 for me  

JBL/ Finley ***1/2
MITB ****
Batista/ Umaga **3/4
Kane/ Chavo DUD
Cena/ Orton/ HHH ***3/4
HBK/ Flair ****
Mayweather/ Show entertaining at least! 
Taker/Edge ****1/2


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

What's the deal on Lesnar vs Taker Biker Chain Match No Mercy 2003? Why haven't I heard anyone talk about this? This event happened right after I stopped watching wrestling for a while, and in the years since some how I've never heard of this. Obviously I know all about the 2 matches they had a year earlier, but this one is never brought up here.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah1993 said:


> Joey Abs.


Seriously? I've been sitting on a tag match involving Venom for all these years, being pestered to watch it when ever anyone remembers about it... and it's a fucking JOEY ABS match?













WHY HAVE I NOT WATCHED IT YET?!?!?!


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Cactus Jack said:


> What's the deal on Lesnar vs Taker Biker Chain Match No Mercy 2003? Why haven't I heard anyone talk about this? This event happened right after I stopped watching wrestling for a while, and in the years since some how I've never heard of this. Obviously I know all about the 2 matches they had a year earlier, but this one is never brought up here.


I have NM03 on DVD for Angle vs. Cena (and Vince vs. Steph obviously :vince3), but I never liked the Biker Chain match. Find it kinda boring TBH.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Cactus Jack said:


> What's the deal on Lesnar vs Taker Biker Chain Match No Mercy 2003? Why haven't I heard anyone talk about this? This event happened right after I stopped watching wrestling for a while, and in the years since some how I've never heard of this. Obviously I know all about the 2 matches they had a year earlier, but this one is never brought up here.


It gets VERY mixed reviews. Seems people either like it (oh hi ) or HATE it (fuck you all).


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> What's the deal on Lesnar vs Taker Biker Chain Match No Mercy 2003? Why haven't I heard anyone talk about this? This event happened right after I stopped watching wrestling for a while, and in the years since some how I've never heard of this. Obviously I know all about the 2 matches they had a year earlier, but this one is never brought up here.


Generally mixed opinions, but mainly the 'boring' term gets thrown about. Have to say, i remember fuck all about the match 

I still hold their Unforgiven match in high regard despite the finish, and obviously the HIAC match speaks for itself.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I'm usually never a fan of WWE continuing a feud after the wrestlers have already had the "perfect match". However, Undertaker seems to be the exception to the rule, as he had a perfect match with HBK in 1997, then ANOTHER perfect match in 2009, and finally a THIRD perfect match in 2010. I think Lesnar and Taker had the perfect match at NM02'.

I'm 10 minutes in and it's pretty effing sweet so far. :lmao at Taker doing a Magistral cradle to Brock during his control segment to show him exactly who rules all aspects of wrestling


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Well, I definitely wouldn't say it was bad. Not even close. I think what caused it to be boring at times was how back and forth it was. No guy every really built up steam, so there could be no emotional comebacks. No heat was ever built. It was like a Triple H match in that regard. However, I don't want to diss it too much, it was quite good at parts. Plus I think I'm physically incapable of disliking a match that has both Taker AND Brock. Those are 2 of my top 5 in ring favorites.

I think ***1/4 sounds about right. Like I said, what kept this match from being special, aside from the shens with the FBI and the lights, was that this was wayyyy too back and forth. Nobody ever got a chance to build some real heat. As opposed to the perfection that is their Cell match, where LOADS of HEAT got built, not to mention two GOAT worthy control segments, both by Brock and Taker. Plus, this was supposed to be a chain match, why the fuck was the chain only used once and it was the finish? Stupid.

What I liked was all the good strikes thrown by both men, and how physical and real it felt at times. It kept me relatively entertained, and nothing about it stood out as particularly heinous (aside from neither guy using the chain until the finish)

So yea, I'm sure Triple H loved this match


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

*Chris Benoit vs Kevin Sullivan- WCW Great American Bash 1996​*




What an unbelievable match this is. A stiff, chaotic brawl of a match which takes place all throughout the arena, even brawling all the way into a bathroom. Dusty Rhodes' commentary during the brawl inside the bathroom is fucking hysterical, especially when he points out that there is a woman in the men's bathroom. "She just stopped off! She got to get some relief here bebeh!" What the fuck does that even mean? :lmao Sullivan hits Benoit with a bag full of toilet paper in it which leads to more awesome one-liners from Dusty on commentary, "He hit him with some toilet paper! Man, what a fight this is!" Benoit and Sullivan bring the fight back into the arena. Benoit brings a table inside the ring and Jimmy Hart encourages Sullivan to go after Benoit. Benoit places the table half-way onto the ropes. Benoit Irish whips Sullivan toward the table but Sullivan reverses it which causes Benoit to fall onto the table. Sullivan runs to Benoit but misses and hits leaning the table. This leads to Benoit setting up a cool spot with Benoit placing the table on top of the turnbuckle giving Sullivan a Superplex off of the table to pick up the win. Terrific match. I didn't like Sullivan's selling in certain parts during the match but it didn't hinder the match at all. 

Rating: ★★★★1/2


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

That's one Benoit match I'll never understand the love for. Aside from the crazy Dusty commentary, I've always considered it extremely mediocre at best.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Callamus said:


> SVS 02, assuming it holds up, is a super all round show. Next on my list, to clear the awful KOTR main event out of my head lol .
> 
> Noble/Kidman is good. Trish Vs Victoria is good (so don't skip it!). 6 man tables match is fun. Triple threat tag is :mark:, so I hope I don't hate it this time around lol. Show/Lesnar is :mark: for such a short match. And the main event is :mark: too.


You forgot the epic debut...

GIMME THE FUCKIN' MIC! :steiner2


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Couldn't get into that Benoit/Sullivan mat when I watched it a while back. 

Cool write-up though.

SS'02 is good. MSG when Steiner's music hits :mark: Show/Lesnar is good, main event is really good. Heyman being DA GAWD :mark:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*WrestleMania 18 review​*

*Match #1: RVD vs William Regal* 

:mark:, I hope this is fun, real clash of styles here with the spotfest RVD and the mat oriented Regal. This was a fun little match, and a great choice as an opener IMO. It had your normal spots coming from RVD but provided some awesome facial expressions from Regal, which make the match. I had a lot of fun with this match and It went a perfect amount of time at about 10 minutes, which was really all the match needed to be good. This also got the crowd real hot, as van dam was OVER as a face and Regal was getting some mad heat. *** 

*CAL SCALE: 2 *

*Match #2: Christian vs DDP*

I hate that 2002 christian theme, so crappy. DDP is out and this must be his only PPV match of 2002 cept maybe the rumble? Anyways I expect decent things from these two. This wasn’t anything special TBH, felt more like a filler than anything else. The action in the ring was decent at best and event though I do love both guys I feel that they didn’t get the time they needed so I walked away with an emphatic MEH. *

*CAL SCALE: 0*

*Match # 3: Goldust vs Maven *

GOLDIE!!!!!! Wow this is like the definition of filler here, and a huge waste of Goldust. This was filler and It wasn’t anything really, just to kill some time. Match is OK and stuff but only goes like less than 5 minutes I think. Now that I think of it, wasn’t Maven just handed the title cause the undertaker shit on him at the rumble? Spike ends up winning because of the 24/7 shit and I’m confused as shit. * 

CAL SCALE: 0

*Match # 4: Kurt Angle vs Kane *

This should be great. Angle cuts a great promo on how Canadians have terrible Olympic gold medal winners, which is too true :lol. Kane comes out to a surprisingly loud pop, and his entrance looks great inside the huge Toronto Skydome. This was a pretty decent match, not as good as the Regal/RVD opener but very close. Problem with this match is that it was just too damn short! This seems to be a pattern as we are an hour into the show with already 4 matches. Anyways solid effort from both men but IMO this is a step down from these guys WM 17 matches, but then again, this was placed lower on the card. **3/4
CAL SCALE: 1 

*Match # 5: The Undertaker vs Ric Flair*

YES! I’ve been meaning to get to this match and it’s the one match I’m most looking forward to on this show, mainly because I have NEVER seen it . This might be the Only Flair 2002 match I’ve looked forward to all year. Takers entrance with the pyro is :marK:, love that theme so much! I can see why some people would hate Flair’s selling, but I fucking love it! Another reason Flair is the legit GOAT IMO, regardless of his lousy 2002 match. Anyways this match is pretty good, doubt it will be MOTN due to ROCK VS HOGAN! OK yeah this match is great and at this point was a top 3 streak match, it has since fallen down the ladder but its still solid. ****

*CAL SCALE: 5*

*Match #6: Edge vs Booker T *

I honestly went in expecting nothing, but for a 6 minute match this wasn’t too bad, not the best short match ever, but I actually was entertained during a Booker T match, pretty sure 2002 was Booker’s best year ever TBH, well at least in the WWE. Yep this was shockingly fun and is up there with the best filler matches in mania history TBH, if that means one lick of shit . **1/2 
CAL SCALE: 1

*Match # 7: Stone Cold Steve Austin vs Scott Hall *

OH NO GUYS! ITS DA NWO! Expecting pure shit here TBH as SCSA had no motivation around this time and really was complete shit, so he decided to quit and be a dick. Honestly this is nothing special AT ALL, it not bad per say, but felt like a regular TV match TBH, nothing much more to say about it besides the fact that hall sold the stunner like a FUCKING BOSS. **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5 *

*Match #8: Billy and Chuck vs the APA vs the Dudley boyz vs the hardy boyz*

:mark:, finally a match that has some substance to it besides a standard singles match, this is legit the only match on the card that’s not a regular one on one match, so let’s hope it’s good! I am a fan of 3 out of the 4 teams in this and Billy and chuck are decent so I expect a fun match here. Yeah I wasn’t too fond of this, felt like filler, but the filler was nearly 15 minutes long. I thought I remember people telling me this match was great, guess not. Skip this and the rest of the show so far besides the opener and Flair/taker. ** 

*CAL SCALE: 0.5 *

*Match # 9: Hulk Hogan vs The Rock *

About time we get to this, because basically the rest of this show has been total filler so far except flair/taker. This is the only rewatch for me on this show, and I loved it the last time, so looking forward to this one for sure. The crowd reaction is amazing in this! Best crowd ever? Maybe, the crowd just goes completely insane for everything these men do, cheering the hell outta the heel Hogan and booing the shit out of the babyface Rock, no atmosphere compares to this really except for true classics like Punk/Cena MITB and Hogan/warrior. Strange thing is that I’m not a HUGE fan of either guy but I do like this match, mostly for the crowd though :lol. Yeah this is loads of fun, MOTN for sure. ****

*CAL SCALE: 5* 

*Match # 10: Jazz vs Trish Stratus vs Lita 
*

Fuck, so much filler! Fuck this then. NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1 *

*Match # 11: Chris Jericho vs HHH *

Jesus Christ, 11 matches? That’s like some kind of 80’s WrestleMania where there was only 2 or 3 good matches, which means this one would be the third, I doubt it though. OK, I honestly think this match gets WAY too much crap. Sure its not that good, but is it DUD worthy? No way IMO, this is a solid match that just ended up in the wrong spot on the card at the wrong event. I think that if this went before Rock/Hogan it would be better received, but besides that it isn’t too bad. Overall a subpar mania mostly because of the bad booking and a ton of fillers. **3/4 

*CAL SCALE: 1*

*TOTAL CAL SCALE: 15*

*CURRENT 2002 PPV MOTY: Brock Lesnar vs the undertaker HIAC(no mercy) *

*CURRENT 2002 PPV RANKINGS 

1: rebellion (20)
2: The Royal rumble (18)
3: No mercy (15.5)
4: Vengeance ( (15.5)
5: Armageddon (15.5)
6: WrestleMania X8(15)
7: Unforgiven (15) 
8: No way out (12)
9: Backlash (11.5)
10: Judgment day(11) 
11: King of the ring(10.5)
12: Insurrection (1)*​* 
*


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

ATF said:


> ATF's Top 50 WWF/E TV Matches Ever


Good start so far. Benoit/Edge making it was great! 

Also smart to use prowrestling wikia since I've absolutely loaded that place up with awesome PICZ! 

PS if you wanna make it look good, when you post pics from wwe.com that have the black border thing around them, remove the "styles/photo_large/public/" part of the link to get the proper cut version of it.



Callamus said:


> *The Undertaker Vs Triple H - WWE Undisputed Championship Match*
> 
> NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO. DO NOT WANT.
> 
> ...


:lmao @ this whole write-up. Also I've been laughing non-stop at that Wade Barrett video. "THE BARRETT BARRAGE IS TAKING OVER!" "He always says it and then loses" :lol



Callamus said:


> That's one Benoit match I'll never understand the love for. Aside from the crazy Dusty commentary, I've always considered it extremely mediocre at best.


It's kinda fun because it's different. DUSTY, fighting in the bathroom and the fact that it seems to consist of nothing but punches plus the superplex finish makes it fun enough for me.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I just watched that benoit/sullivan match, nice brawl the bathroom portion was ***** :lmao big DUST " There is a lady in the mens bathroom" Why the fuck that woman walk in ?


----------



## GOON (Jan 23, 2010)

I just watched the first two matches from No Mercy 2003. It's already nearly better (on the CAL SCALE) than the show I previously watched, the 2003 Royal Rumble.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> I just watched that benoit/sullivan match, nice brawl the bathroom portion was ***** :lmao big DUST " There is a lady in the mens bathroom" Why the fuck that woman walk in ?



Why? Shit, if I saw Lita and Trish brawling through the hallway and into the women's bathroom, curiosity would overtake me and I would HAVE to follow them in, you know? I mean shit, if you're that lady and you're about to buy some popcorn or something and all the sudden you see a pissed off Wolverine battling the Butcher in the halls wouldn't you follow?

Still, I really dig that match. It's the only all out brawl I can think of from Benoits career, and like everything else that man ever did, he didn't half ass it. No, those punches were STIFF, and I'm sure the backstage stuff had a lot to do with it. I don't know if I would go as high as 4 1/2 for it, but **** seems fair from my point. If you look at it as a fight instead of a wrestling match, maybe you can get into it a bit more.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Why? Shit, if I saw Lita and Trish brawling through the hallway and into the women's bathroom, curiosity would overtake me and I would HAVE to follow them in, you know? I mean shit, if you're that lady and you're about to buy some popcorn or something and all the sudden you see a pissed off Wolverine battling the Butcher in the halls wouldn't you follow?
> 
> Still, I really dig that match. It's the only all out brawl I can think of from Benoits career, and like everything else that man ever did, he didn't half ass it. No, those punches were STIFF, and I'm sure the backstage stuff had a lot to do with it. I don't know if I would go as high as 4 1/2 for it, but **** seems fair from my point. If you look at it as a fight instead of a wrestling match, maybe you can get into it a bit more.


True

Somehow, after that match it lead me to this






wrestling GOD


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Who'll be here for RAW tonight? Hoping for a good show!


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Before everyone sets their Match of the Year lists, I STRONGLY urge you to go back and watch Punk vs Cena from Raw 2/25/13. I'm not sure how many of you have a saved unedited copy like I do, and I just decided to watch it for the first time since about March or so. My lord. It's even better than I remembered. The crowd, the atmosphere those two created, the call back spots they incorporated while simultaneously throwing curve balls our way made for a just EPIC match. I think this is their second best match, behind only MitB, and really, it's not far behind MitB AT ALL. I've seen some people say it's even better, and I can understand where they are coming from. It's damn near perfect. The pile driver was even more epic than I remembered (WWE's current PG direction has a lot of downside, but I can't complain when blood and piledrivers have become huge events again). Cena digging deep and busting out the Hurricanrana was super cool. Like I said, watch it again when you get the chance. It just leapfrogged Punk/Taker as my number 2 MotY. I never thought I'd say that, being the undying Taker mark that I am.

MotY list so far:

1. Punk vs Lesnar SS *****
2. Punk vs Cena Raw ****3/4
3. Punk vs Taker WM ****1/2
4. Bryan vs Cena SS ****1/4
5. Cesaro vs Zayn 2/3 Falls ****1/4
6. Ziggler vs ADR PB ****1/4
7. Shield vs Rhodes Bros BG ****
8. Shield vs Rhodes Bros Raw ****
9. Bryan vs Rollins Raw ****
10. Bryan vs Cesaro Raw ****

On a side note, PUNK VS HARPER ON RAW!!!! I'm in fucking heaven.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Benoit managed to have a classic with Kevin Sullivan. Man was in a league of his very own.

EDIT: LUKE MUTHATRUCKIN' HARPER. Good match that made him look very good. WOW that pop for the eventual Punk/Bryan team-up was tremendous.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

HOLY SHIT SD ME REMATCH!


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Benoit managed to have a classic with Kevin Sullivan. Man was in a league of his very own.
> 
> EDIT: LUKE MUTHATRUCKIN' HARPER. Good match that made him look very good. WOW that pop for the eventual Punk/Bryan team-up was tremendous.



Truth. Benoit is the best ever in the ring and I don't see how it's really disputable. It's just my opinion, but still.

So psyched for the Smackdown rematch, this should be fantastic. I had the SD match at ***3/4. Let's see if they can top it.


Wows, Ryback vs Khali. Time for a smoke break. Who the fuck came up with this piece of shit match? Way to kill the momentum built from that Punk/Bryan meeting


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Just thought of a match that would blow my mind

Reigns vs Harper :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Benoit vs Sullivan matches are the tops. BRAWLS~!


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

ADR has a huge bruise on his upper thigh from smacking his leg so much when delivering those "vicious" kicks :lmao

God Kofi Kingston just cannot fucking wrestle. He doesn't comprehend even the most basic things. He has the weakest offense I've ever seen, and all of his shit is just so contrived and corny. And my god, those blue and yellow tights he is wearing, they say "SKILLZ" on them. Oh yeah Kofi, you got SKILLZ alright. That's right, tap you corny bitch.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Why do they always give ADR shit to work with ?

Punk/Harper was pretty good, hoping Zig Zag is chosen to carry Orton to something decent but it will probaly be the miz because of sd and hoping the 6 man is anywhere close to sd's


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> Why do they always give ADR shit to work with ?
> 
> Punk/Harper was pretty good, hoping Zig Zag is chosen to carry Orton to something decent but it will probaly be the miz because of sd and hoping the 6 man is anywhere close to sd's



If it matters, I voted for Ziggles. If it's a legit vote, Ziggler will win in a landslide. Watch.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Zig Zag will definitely win the voting and do the job.

BENOIT is definitely the GOAT worker. I can never get bored watching him in the ring. The man is a cheater because he possessed a talent that I don't think any other human being does.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Miz is def winning here, gotta advance da storyline!


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Zig Zag will definitely win the voting and do the job.
> 
> BENOIT is definitely the GOAT worker. I can never get bored watching him in the ring. The man is a cheater because he possessed a talent that I don't think any other human being does.


Ziggler is the best wrestler by a country mile out of the choices, and jobbing to the WWE champ is a massive upgrade over being buried off TV for weeks at a time like he currently has been. He will easily give Randy the best match out of all of them. Here's hoping Randy is motivated and really gets some good heat on Ziggler with a vicious beat down so we can see one of those epic come backs before he slips on the proverbial banana peel.

God, that fuckin pink is STILL THERE. FUCK OFF WITH THE PINK WWE, NO ONE OTHER THAN HAYLEY LIKES IT AND IT MAKES ALL YOUR WRESTLERS LOOK LIKE COMPLETE TOOL BAGS. JUST STOP ALREADY. A PINK RING ROPE IS BAD ENOUGH, BUT I COULD TOLERATE THAT IF YOU DIDNT HAVE ALL THE WRESTLERS IN FUCKING PASTEL PINK SHIRTS TOO. UGHHJH.

sorry for the caps, the situation called for it.


Edit- Randy Orton wit dat Rick Rude promo, I LOVE IT :lmao this is great.

Edit- The vote was rigged. No one would vote for fuckin Big E. Dude sucks. Sorry. It's true.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Well, better than Miz


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

wow had to sit through that weak diatribe to hear a rigged poll's results


THREE AINT ENOUGH MAN I NEED FIVE !!!


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I don't think that poll combined to 100% :lol

All the momentum from that awesome beginning is dying off.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I don't think that poll combined to 100% :lol
> 
> All the momentum from that awesome beginning is dying off.



That poll was so obviously rigged, there is no way Big E would win that vote. It just wouldn't happen, WWE force feeding us dat Big E. I wish they would just let guys sit at the bottom of the card for a few years before pushing them, otherwise it just seems like we are being told what to like.. When that's the case, I choose to tell WWE to fuck off, and turn off Raw so their ratings will suck whenever said guy is on the screen. I'm a one man protest, but fuck it, it's all I can do about it and it makes me feel better


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I HAVE to keep RAW on, cant miss the 6 man tag! 

I am watching Sullivan/Benoit though, fucking awesome


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Edit- The vote was rigged. No one would vote for fuckin Big E. Dude sucks. Sorry. It's true.


I actually did. No one in their right mind would pick The Miz and a match with Ziggler happened just a week or two ago plus I had never seen Orton vs Big E yet.

The match delivered just fine for TV quality. Orton selling Big E's offense and that awesome pre-match promo. :lol


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

HEY! its Tyson Kidd! And he won! 

Watching taker matches during RAW to continue the project, Post #3 should be up by the end of RAW

EDIT: tag up next! :mark:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

ATF said:


> According to a spoiler read of mine, this week's SD ME is one of the best Tag matches in recent history. :mark:
> 
> 
> 
> ...





Nostalgia said:


> Eh, I don't care for that match. :side: *It's a match that will probably be repeated on the next RAW anyway*, because WWE repeating matches on RAW from Smackdown seems to be common thing these days because WWE thinks no one watches Smackdown, which I can't blame them seeing as nothing happens on Smackdown usually.


LOL, fucking called it. 

Why even bother with Smackdown.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Maybe they'll be different :lol. 

Everyone who likes Taker and Tajiri watch their match from 12/21/01 SD. Its only a 9 min video, but what a 9 minute match it was :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Wow, the 6 man tag was fucking awesome. Even better than the SD one. ★★★★.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Its Amazing to see the progression of tag team wrestling in only one year. **** from me


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

As soon as they got rid of Teddy Long, tag teams have become a part of the show that people actually want to see. That match was very fun and one of Cena's better FIP segments in his career, which I always felt was a weak point of his.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Wasn't home for Punk and Bryan or the six man tag, but I got to see that train wreck of a final segment and :kane in a suit. Life is great :cornette


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Terrible ending and the Kane character is completely gone 

*Undertaker project post #3*

*Match # 1: Kurt Angle vs the Undertaker (NWO 2006)*

FINALLY…I can watch this! I know it is one of Angles better matches but I have just never gotten around to it for some reason. Really looking forward to this and I know its not going to disappoint. Now, this match was VERY good, but I can’t say its better than the SD 2006 match I had in my last post. However, they are equal In my mind because I cannot honestly say that I prefer one over the other, as both are 2006 MOTYC, but If it was a life or death situation, I’d go with this match, but just by a hair. I do think it might be a little overrated by many as I don’t think it’s a top 10 match in WWE history but its still awesome! **** ½* 

*Match #2: John Cena vs the Undertaker (SD 6/24/04)* 

I’ll most likely check out there Vengeance 2003 match soon, but I thought I’d check this out too. I didn’t even know they had a SD match that goes this long (YT video shows it’s over 20 min), and thought that all they had was that 11 min match on RAW in 06(need to see that) and obviously the Vengeance 03 match. Not sure how well known this match is, but its VERY good, especially for a TV match. I honestly wasn’t expecting much from this but here we got a very solid and lengthy SD ME that made me honestly very excited for the possibility of a Taker/cena match at wrestlemania this year, because no doubt it would be excellent. I recommend this match for sure. ***3/4 

*Match #3: Undertaker vs Tajiri (SD 12/27/01)*

I am a HUGE Tajiri mark, like he might be up there with Rey as my favorite WWE cruiserweight ever. Also like his work in ECW too, really need to see more of it TBH. This video is only 9 minutes long but this is a must see for me, as I am a bug mark of both. God, what a match this was. This did not feel too short AT ALL, in a good way. This was SO DAMN FUN! It was no DQ and had some great hardcore moments coupled with some classic Tajiri cruiserweight spots. High recommendation to anyone looking to see something that is short but packs a punch, and any fellow Tajiri marks of course! ***1/2 

*Match # 4: The Undertaker, John Cena, and DX vs CM Punk and Legacy(SD 10/02/09)*

:mark:, I remember someone talking about this a little while ago and praising the fuck outta it. I honestly think that this could be AMAZING. I legit like everyone inside the match, awesome shit. Yes this was as fun as it looked, just great stuff here all around. This isn’t the best wrestled match per say( its till good though) but the FUN factor and entertainment value is top notch. I’m sure most of you have seen this, but if you haven’t, check it out! The finishing sequence is :mark: to the extreme too. ***1/2 ​
Doubt I'll get another post up tomorrow, but expect a SVS 02 review and MAYBE a SS 02 one as well


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Raw tonight:

Punk/Harper- ***
Orton/Big E- **
Sandow/Cesaro/Swagger vs. Cena/Rhodes/Goldust- ****

Yeah, had to go **** on the 6-man tag. Tops their SD match imo. Last few minutes were epic. Definitely among the top tag matches of the year and might make my top 10 of the year when it's all said and done. Sandow/Cena have had quite a week together (along with Rhodes Bros. and Real Americans)... great match on Raw last week, great 6-man tag on Smackdown and then what they pulled off tonight. These two could pull off a hell of a match at Survivor Series, but unfortunately we'll probably get another boring Cena/Del Rio match.

Actually, after placing it on my list, it doesn't make the top 10 of the year.  Fuck, what a year we've had for DEM MATCHES!


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Citizen Kane and Mark Henry need to have a Men's Warehouse match. This might become my favorite incarnation of Kane.

Punk/Harper: ***
6 Man Tag: ***1/2-***3/4

So excited for this Punk/Bryan coalition :mark:. Their backstage promos tonight we're really cool.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Avoiding details on RAW that are probably being discussed in here atm. _(scrolled past, yada yada)_ Here to ask if there was any match to look out for tonight. If not, I may skip and just wait till tomorrow or if to even bother watching.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

6 man tag is about it...

Don't let the people fool you with rating Punk/Harper ***, it was like...** at best. Punk looked super lazy and the booking was truly stupid, I thought.

But I know that people don't often agree with me, so do as you will.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Rhodes Brothers and Cena VS Real Americans and Sandow was pretty good. The rest was sub-par.

I'd 6-Man Tag Match a ****. Pretty good sequence at the end. Quite a few good elements to this match, from Cesaro, Rhodes, Goldust, and Zeb on commentary.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Rematch on RAW? Sold. Yay.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Goldust is GOATing week after week :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Punk vs Harper happens tonight, holy FUCK.

Just saw this post too:



Cactus Jack said:


> ADR has a huge bruise on his upper thigh from smacking his leg so much when delivering those "vicious" kicks :lmao
> 
> God Kofi Kingston just cannot fucking wrestle. He doesn't comprehend even the most basic things. He has the weakest offense I've ever seen, and all of his shit is just so contrived and corny. And my god, those blue and yellow tights he is wearing, they say "SKILLZ" on them. Oh yeah Kofi, you got SKILLZ alright. That's right, tap you corny bitch.


The most truthful post I've ever read. It's word for word my exact opinion. I now love you.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

The Primer said:


> Punk vs Harper happens tonight, holy FUCK.


I'd suggest skipping everything other than the Usos' entrance and post-match dance routine. :troll 

When I say US, Y'ALL SAY O! US! O! US! O! WAAHHH-HOOO! USOS BABY!!!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Random jobber filler match b/c the company loves their even steven booking, despite those goons having nothing to do with their careers now. 8*D

Drew McIntyre jobbing kills me, but it's still a humorous sight.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

If you haven't already seen, I'd reccomend Punk vs Harper and the 6 man tag from last night. Punk/Harper wasn't as good as it could have been, but for how it was booked it definitely got the job done. Plus seeing Punk eat one of those nasty Harper boots was just terrific. He sold it like a champ.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah 6 man tag and opening segments where I was really paying attention :lol

So glad I have off today, starting SVS 02 now, MAYBE will get SS done too


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Bryan vs. Harper on Smackdown.

:lenny


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

Harper vs Bryan sounds better than actual sex.

Naw. But close.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'd say you were right on the money with the first comment.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Fuck it, my YT account is already verified but i still can't upload 15min+ videos, maybe as i have one strike against my account or something


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I'd give you a sub for that upload 


SVS 2002 is currently blowing WM 18 out of the fucking water, so much fun


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Bubz said:


> Harper vs Bryan >actual sex..


Fixed 

Can't wait to see that one.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Survivor Series 2002 is a blast of a PPV. Watched it a ton. Has massive replay value.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> I'd give you a sub for that upload


Thanks mate, ill let you know. Im going to try to work around it.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Holy shit that Show/Bork match was awesome! 

Tag match starting now, looks to be sick!


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Survivor Series 2002 review 

MSG camera and crowd :mark:​*
*Match #1: Spike, bubba Dudley and Jeff Hardy vs 3 minute warning and rico 6 man elimination tables match* 

:mark:, I don’t care if 3 minute warning isn’t that great, it’s the Dudley boyz and tables! 3 minute warning are these two fat guys that look like they’ve been hanging out at too many NYC pizza resturants, because they are HUGE. This match is still plenty of fun. Real long too at over 15 minutes. Obviously this isn’t the best pure wrestling match you will see but I had a TON of fun with it, great choice for it to be in the opener. Crowd marks like FUCK when D-von comes out and goes to the aid of his brothers, awesome moment. So a Dudley boyz reunion and people being put through tables, hot opener. ***1/2

*CAL SCALE: 3*

*Match# 2: Jamie Noble vs Billy Kidman* 

:mark:, would prefer Mysterio and Tajiri be in this too but its cool, this should be awesome! I LOVE CRUISERWEIGHTS! Noble and Kidman I think had a match somewhere, forget where TBH, I think it was No mercy. Anyways this should be loads of fun, even if it’s somewhat short. Man, what a match this was, it starts out slow for the first few minutes but the last 3-4 minutes were :mark:, really fun stuff by both guys, but Kidman is easily the MVP of this match. ***1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 3 *

*Match #3: Victoria vs Trish Stratus hardcore match *

According to CAL I should NOT skip this, considering I already made the mistake of skipping Booker/show, I’ll listen to him here. Interesting thing is that there is legit video package to showcase this feud, so I’m excited for this TBH. Pretty good match, clearly the best divas match I have seen since I saw Mickie/Trish WM 22 in August. Pretty much an awesome brawl throughout but its divas so its even more awesome, nice use of the weapons and I like Victoria’s psychopath character, it fits her. Anyways another solid match here and the first divas match of 2002 I have watched, and only one I will. **3/4

*CAL SCALE: 1*

*Match # 4: The Big Show vs Brock Lesnar*

WTF! According to Wikipedia this match is less than 5 minutes! This better be awesome, and I have a good feeling the length will NOT be a problem! What a fucking BEAUTIFUL match, this might be the best under 5 minute match I have EVER seen. This was so good from beginning to end, and my favorite part was Heyman screwing brock out of the title and aligning himself with show, IMO one of my favorite Big show matches, and the crowd was awesome during this as well. Check this out if you haven’t seen it. It may be short, but it packs a punch! ***3/4

*CAL SCALE: 4*

*Match # 5: Edge and Rey Mysterio vs Kurt Angle and Chris Benoit vs Los Gurreros*

YES! This shall be AWESOME! I think I am a mark of everyone in this but Chavo TBH, and he can be decent some times, specially when he is tagging with his uncle! This match was GREAT IMO, however, it is not as good as it could have been. I thought this match was WAY too long for some reason, IDK why. It was good, but I really thought if it didn’t drag on and you cut like 5 minutes we could have a ****+ classic on our hands. Another issue of mine is that it did not feel very climatic during the final stretch, and the crowd wasn’t really into it. I liked it though! ***3/4 

*CAL SCALE: 4*

*Match # 6: Kane vs RVD vs HHH vs HBK vs Chris Jericho vs Booker T EC match* 

I love this match, even though in my mind its not the best EC match out there (NYR 2005!). The thing I love about this was that it gave a lot of midcard talent a chance to shine in a ME match of a huge PPV. RVD, Booker T, and Kane had never really been considered Main Event talent, and this really helped their credibility. At The beginning of this when it was just RVD and HHH dragged a little, but it really wasn’t too bad, when Jericho got in, things started to get good. Jericho is working together with HHH which really doesn’t make a lick of fuckin sense but whatever. RVD and Booker T are the first to get out and by the time HBK gets out there its just Kane, Jericho, HHH, and him. When HBK gets in this thing goes from fun to AWESOME. Jericho eliminates Kane and its down to Jericho, HHH, and HBK. HBK eliminates Jericho to an awesome pop and we are down to HBK vs HHH, the rematch from SS 2002. In the end HBK becomes the new WHC and it would ne his final world title reign. Such a great match, I think it was better at the time because it was new and fresh, but its still fun nearly 11 years later. ****1/2

*CAL SCALE: 7*

*TOTAL CAL SCALE: 22*

*CURRENT 2002 PPV MOTY: Brock Lesnar vs the Undertaker HIAC (no mercy) 
*
*2002 PPV RANKINGS

1: Survivor series(22) 
2: rebellion (20)
3: The Royal rumble (18)
4: No mercy (15.5)
5: Vengeance ( (15.5)
6: Armageddon (15.5)
7: WrestleMania X8(15)
8: Unforgiven (15) 
9: No way out (12)
10: Backlash (11.5)
11: Judgment day(11) 
12: King of the ring(10.5)
13: Insurrection (1) ​*


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Brock doing the belly to belly overhead on Show is so :mark: And Heyman's facial expressions after Brock realized that Paul had screwed him :lol

The overall chamber match isn't my favorite, but that finishing sequence is still so awesome to me. Shawn coming out of the second pedigree attempt and hitting the superkick for the win. And JR's commentary. Makes me :mark: for days.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

After watching Raw:

Ryback :lol

6-Man Tag :mark: Loved it

Kane in a suit


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

YES! Heyman is great in that :lmao

Starting SS 2002 soon! the end to the 2002 project!


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Citizen Kane, eh? Never saw that one coming. I thought he would be returning to feud with the Wyatts but not only has he turned heel, he now wears a suit which is unlike the Kane character. Think it's safe to say the Kane character is offically dead now. Not saying that as a bad thing because his character has lasted for 15 years.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I just can't deal with Orton/Show again. Headlining a PPV is something else. Ammo for guys like Hogan to say "I can make a difference, brother"

But i suppose it's all filler atm, eh.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I have faith in Orton/show, I feel Big Show is more motivated than he has been in years


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Yeah, he seems in better shape and all that, just Big Show in 2013/14 for me is just...bleh.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Oh his charchter is fucking terrible, thats not what I meant. We just really haven't seen any of him in the ring since his return, and I need to rewatch his match vs Orton at ER this year to see if its any good, dont remember anything about it except that their was a PUNT


----------



## RKO1988 (Jul 25, 2008)

Anyone know if HHH's DVD did bad in sales?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Survivor Series main event seems like filler. :kobe

So much for it being a Big 4 PPV. Now it's pretty much the big 2, with the Rumble just below it, and Survivor Series is lower than Money in the Bank or Extreme Rules. 

Skimming through Raw right now. Punk/Bryan teaming up is pretty cool. What I saw of Punk/Harper was good, I thought. 

Ryback :lmao "You want some cake, too?" That match though :lol 

Tyson Kidd on Raw? :mark: Hope Rock took notes on how to do the Sharpshooter. Hope Tyson gets on TV more and isn't just used to hype Total Divas. 

Renee Young :lenny Love Sandow on the mic. Zeb and Sandow on the mic at the same time. :mark:
"Raylene" :lmao Swagger's special ass though :lmao "We the People" still over 

Breast Cancer promo. WWE trying to make hating Cena being like hating cancer victims. Good work, guys. I'll watch the match later. But Zeb being the GOAT on commentary. Oh fuck, Cena dick sucking on commentary. Moving on, except I saw the finish. FINAL CUT :mark: Cena being with those guys hurts it for me. 

Axel? Still no fucks to give. "I HAVE ARRIVED!!!" :lmao :lmao This retard

So Ziggler pins Axel clean, with Axel facing Langston for the title on Main Event? Way to build your champion for a defense. Or is that ME match not a title match? Whatever, still don't care.

Eva Marie looking to master the rollup. That's all I saw of the Diva match.

The last segment was all I saw last night. I still can't with Big Show. Steph still gets me though. "The face of the WWE? Have you looked in the mirror lately?" Commercial break during the Shield's entrance :lol

I still can't with Kane in the suit :lmao I am all for a Show beatdown. This group though does look pretty staunch. Trips, Steph, Shield, Kane, Orton. I'm down. No more Big show plz.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah that ending segment was garbage

Starting SS 02 now!


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Yeah that ending segment was garbage
> 
> Starting SS 02 now!



WM19>SS02'>ER12' are my 3 selections for the GOAT PPV events. SummerSlam 02' is just stacked to the gills with quality.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I own 2 out of the three PPVS you listed too! Gotta own SS 02 someday


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

As long as Big Show doesn't beat Orton for the belt, I'll be happy.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

CM Punk Vs John Cena (Summerslam 2011)~ ***** 1/4*

Great, GREAT fucking match. It's a completely different bout than MITB yet it's FANTASTIC in it's own way and that takes alot out of two workers to go out and create like that on two separate occasions. Loved the ribwork by Punk and the last G2S was fucking awesome and followed up on the work done during the match, the ending was shit and was never mentioned again naturally, but the match itself was something else. You get your typical awesome smattering of near falls with an underlying story of two guys from completely different backgrounds trying to be the best. It starts off slow so it's easy to get disengaged if you have no interest in one of the two guys I guess, but this match is so fucking good and one of the best in Summerslam history.

Watching the three Punk-Jericho matches that matter to me (Wrestlemania, Extreme Rules, RAW 2013) because I know Payback isn't good already. Wrestlemania first, this is a potential top five Punk match so I'm pretty pumped.

ON A SIDE NOTE THOUGH; can you imagine hypothetically if they went with this whole "Authority" storyline in 2011 with Punk and Cena instead of Bryan and Cena? Have Punk go over Cena again and have SOMEBODY THAT ISN'T FUCKING DEL RIO cash in to kick off that with a heel Trips involved and no Big Show and all of that jazz. We should have gotten Punk Vs HHH at Wrestlemania XXVIII but I'm not disappointed with the matches we got, I was just disappointed that a logical long term feud and match between Punk and HHH is probably never going to happen because WWE seemingly plans their Mania matches like a YEAR in advance (Cena-Miz, Cena-Rock, & Cena-Rock II all allegedly being scheduled before Wrestlemania XXVI even happened, with the HHH-Taker matches being planned then as well) and they never let a main event feud ORGANICALLY happen.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

4 matches into SS 2002 and the cal scale is already up to 11, considering we have 3 AMAZING matches coming up, this might break 25 on the scale


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I see you took my advice and watched the divas match at SVS 02. EXCELLENT DECISION. Which is why everyone should listen to CAL in the first place. CALL KNOWS ALL. Gonna stick the DVD in right now and watch the event myself. Can't believe it took me until about a month ago to finally buy the sodding DVD lol. Still, I got it for cheaper than what even SV were selling it for back in the day :lmao.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

yep, pretty fun match. 

RVD/Benoit is on :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao I honestly thought Raw ended after the 6 man and took it off and by accident put it back on for the last segment, I liked it, for the first time the "Corporation" seems like a threat, suit Kane was :lmao


I was going to rewatch all the Punk/y2j (minus payback) also


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Kane looked AWESOME in a suit. AWESOME. Now I kinda want Undertaker to do the same :lmao. CORPORATE BROTHERS OF DESTRUCTION~!


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> :lmao I honestly thought Raw ended after the 6 man and took it off and by accident put it back on for the last segment, I liked it, for the first time the "Corporation" seems like a threat, suit Kane was :lmao
> 
> 
> I was going to rewatch all the Punk/y2j (minus payback) also



I'm guessing that's the purpose Daniel Bryan served, he got built up and pushed so everyone could get behind him, so when he eventually fell to the Authority it would give them even more credibility.

I'm just hoping against hope all of this isn't leading to Cena eventually swooping in and rescuing everyone. I know that's probably what ends up happening but a guy can hope can't he? 

Speaking of, how dope would a Cena, Bryan, Punk vs Wyatt's and Sandow Tag be? They could add some players to each side and make it a big Survivor Series tag, or just use it to main event a Raw or something. I think it could be pretty damn cool to see the 3 top faces on the same team.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Okay, I still have 3 matches left on SS 02 and the CAL scale is already a whopping 17!


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Punk/Harper- **1/2
Orton/Langston- ***1/4
6 Man Match- ***1/2


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

:mark: SVS 2002 is holding up TREMENDOUSLY well so far. Up to the triple threat tag match. Always been a favourite of mine. If this ends up like the NM 02 tag then I'm gonna go postal or something. I WANT TO LOVE IT STILL, DAMMIT!!! Eddie being involved should help though .


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Soo weird having a purple bar now, I feel elite 


Need something, probaly watch punk/y2j mania or something


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Summerslam 2002 review​*
*GOAT SUMMERSLAM! :mark: *​
*Match #1: Kurt Angle vs Rey Mysterio *

I haven’t seen this in FOREVER! This is Mysterio’s debut match in the WWE, and I remember it being a ton of fun, great choice to put this as the opener. This is a GREAT match, especially since these guys were only given like 10 minutes. Can you imagine these guys in a 20-30 min match? I would mark so hard, REY NEEDS TO COME BACK! Wait, did they have a match on SD or another show? A quick search tells me that they were in a triple threat with Benoit about a month after this, and then the triple threat at Mania that is GREAT. This might be a top 10 mysterio WWE match IMO, its not as good as his work with Eddie in 2005 but its close. Another great thing is that Mysterio gets a small pop when he enters but within minutes the ENTIRE crowd is behind him, which is great stuff. Only bad thing about this match is the length and the fact that Mysterio didn’t go over. But otherwise, this is a classic. ****
*CAL SCALE: 5*

*Match #2: Ric Flair vs Chris Jericho*

Guys, you aren’t gonna be happy about this, but I’m skipping it, I’ve seen it and it sucks. NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1*

*Match #3: Eddie Gurrero vs Edge*

I remember loving this match, and the match at Unforgiven was fun too. Apparently these two had an AWESOME match on SD a little after this. I always loved Edge’s entrance around this time with the fog and stuff, always energized the crowd a little bit. This is a fun match, wouldn’t say it’s as great as the opener but that means nothing, as it is still a fun match. I think the Unforgiven match is about equel to this match, need to check out the SD no DQ match too, as it is probably the best of the trilogy. Also nice to see Edge go over against one of the all time greats. ***

*CAL SCALE: 2*

*Match #4: The unamericans( Lance Storm and Christian) vs Booker T and Goldust *

:mark:, finally some more BOOKDUST. I remember loving this match because all 4 guys can WORK like shit, cept maybe Booker, but he works like a boss when he is with Goldie . It’s amazing how much heat the unamericans had on them, and their in the perfect setting too, NYC. Yep this match was just as great as I remembered, classic heel tag work coupled with the phenomenal Bookdust babyface work makes this one of my favorite matches from both of these teams. I think the crowd expected filler here and we’re surprised when they got a sick match that got both teams over. ***1/2

*CAL SCALE: 3*

*Match #5: Chris Benoit vs RVD*

I remember loving this match and thinking it was RVD’s best performance in his WWE tenure, lets hope it holds up. My god, this match is a blessing to all wrestling fans, what an amazing performance by both men. I am not a HUGE RVD fan but I can safely say that this is his best performance in his tenure with WWE. This is a classic back and forth match and these two just had some of the best chemistry I have every seen, GOD BLESS BENOIT AND RVD. If you’re on the fence about seeing it, WATCH IT! Its now a top 25 match for Benoit and the best RVD match period, although I heard his bout with taker is good as well. ****1/2

*CAL SCALE: 7 *

*Match #6: The Undertaker vs Test *

This got a video package? I find it peculiar they did an anti-american gimmick literally a year after the 9/11 attacks, think they would get some criticism over that. Oh well, it was a fun gimmick anyway, and it makes sense to put him against the AMERICAN BAD ASS! Okay, I honestly forgot this was on the card and had already written a little bit for HBK/HHH and my body was ready for that, but this shouldn’t be too bad. This match was decent, but nothing more. Its kind of forgettable unfortunately and was more like a TV match. However, Undertaker won! USA USA! **3/4

*CAL SCALE: 1 *

*Match #7: Shawn Michaels vs Triple H unsanctioned street fight*

Here we go, the first match between these two and easily the best, also HBK’s first match back in the WWE in nearly 5 years, and it’s great to see him back against his best friend. I honestly haven’t seen this in forever but I remember liking it! After one of my favorite video packages EVER in WWE history, HBK enters to a HUGE pop. My favorite part of this match is that it isn’t really that boring. Sure, its not the best worked match in WWE history but its still a load of fun. I’m pretty sure that if this wasn’t no DQ, it would be terrible, just like their other matches except EC . JR is beautiful during this match too, which might make this match just that more special. Awesome match, and one of my favorite HHH matches. ****1/2

*CAL SCALE: 7*

*Absolutely horrendous segment with the Fink

*Match # 8: Brock Lesnar vs The Rock*

Alright, here it is, the final match of my 2002 reviews. Thank you to everyone who read them and fuck you to everyone who didn’t . The crowd does not seem as dead as they did in events in shows where the co-ME is :mark:, I think this deserved the ME spot, and it eCrded up being the Rocks last SS match ever. The crowd seemed to know Rocky was going Hollywood full time soon and was shitting all over him and cheering for the future of the company, except he left 2 years later :lol. Yeah another phenomenal match here, and I’m pretty sure this is for sure the GOAT SS, and there really is NO competition, although 2011 and 2013 were both excellent as well! Ending was awesome and the crowd popped like a boss for that BORK win! ****

*CAL SCALE: 5 *

*TOTAL CAL SCALE: 29* 

*FINAL 2002 PPV MOTY: Brock Lesnar vs The Undertaker HIAC(no mercy) *

*FINAL 2002 PPV RANKINGS 
1: Summerslam(29)
2: Survivor series(22) 
3: rebellion (20)
4: The Royal rumble (18)
5: No mercy (15.5)
6: Vengeance ( (15.5)
7: Armageddon (15.5)
8: WrestleMania X8(15)
9: Unforgiven (15) 
10: No way out (12)
11: Backlash (11.5)
12: Judgment day(11) 
13: King of the ring(10.5)
14: Insurrection (1)​*
Hope you guys enjoyed the project


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Kane in a suit? So Kane's copying Abyss instead of the other way around now?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Good stuff, but I *think* you meant to say that it was Rey's debut *PPV* match in WWE, right? 

Also, Rey and Angle had a bunch of matches on SD. Pretty sure they had one before SS too (or maybe just after).

I can't wait to get to that show. Saving it for LAST. I already know I'm gonna be lower on the HHH/HBK match and RVD/Benoit (though not by much there, as I do love it), but everything else will be roughly the same. Having it at 29 overall would put it SECOND behind WM 19 as the GOAT PPV, but of course our CAL SCALE rankings are different .


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Nice review there Smitty  Angle/Rey is all sorts of fucking awesome, as is RVD/Benoit. I agree on Flair/Y2J, not alot of good (if any) about that match. Always great seeing Taker but sucks he got stuck with Test.

Still the GOAT SS.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Thanks guys! I think I'll throw in my WM 29 DVD right now and see how it compares on the CAL scale to SS 02. 

Looking forward to your thoughts on SVS 02, the tag wasn't as good as I hoped, but it was still quite fun


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'm half way into the tag and I'm fairly certain I'll be rating it higher than you .


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

From the Bryan and Vinny review of Souled out 1997 (atrocious PPV, I don't recommend watching it). Fast forward and pause at 24:08. GIMMICK INFRINGEMENT!


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Wait, does anyone else like Jericho/Flair from SS '02? Cause I recall liking it.

The sleeper hit that night for me though was Taker/Test. Oh and I still mark like a 6 year old John Cena fangirl whenever I see DAT RIGHT DERE DOUBLE KIP UP in Brock/Rock. Also, the duelling "Rocky/Brocky" chants has got to be the Greatest chant-duel ever.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> I'm half way into the tag and I'm fairly certain I'll be rating it higher than you .


Hmm yeah I figured..

Since I'm watching like the best PPV events today, think I'll attempt to find a stinker to review tomorrow, how does Summerslam 07 sound? I own it on DVD for some reason...


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> If you haven't already seen, I'd reccomend Punk vs Harper and the 6 man tag from last night. Punk/Harper wasn't as good as it could have been, but for how it was booked it definitely got the job done. Plus seeing Punk eat one of those nasty Harper boots was just terrific. He sold it like a champ.


What job did it get done? Making the Wyatts look like oafs who couldn't defeat 2 guys (1 who was injured, the other who was worn out after a match)? Making Harper into some putz who can kick the crap out of someone and then lose via roll up and look dumb? The booking was horrid. They needlessly beat Harper, one of your big monsters, totally clean in a way that made him look incompetent and bumbling in a throw away match designed to try and build a co main event to entice you to buy a PPV. They failed, nice job WWE. You showed that the monster can be defeated, and in a lame manner, on free TV. Their reputation is damaged now. Having the babyfaces ultimately triumph and showing the monster(s) can be defeated should be the payoff on PPV, not Raw. It was idiotic.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Punk is the second biggest star in the company. He's still riding the wave of momentum that comes with a 430 day title reign as well as three huge programmes with The Rock, The Undertaker and Brock Lesnar. He's labelled the best in the frickin' world. Losing to the best in the world does no harm to Harper whatsoever, it's not as if Harper didn't look strong as fuck and i'ts not as if Punk picked him up and GTS'ed him - It was a roll up. And if the faces are only supposed to get payback at the Pay Per View, whats the point in watching the TV show when you know that the faces are just going to get beaten down? It's finding the right balance between keeping it fresh and exciting as well as selling the pay per view.

In this case, I think one of the biggest attractions of this match/feud is simply seeing two of the biggest stars team up despite having previous issues: Can they work together? It's more than just wins and losses and protecting your monsters. Also, how will Wyatt get revenge for A) Punk defeating Harper and B) Bryan making the save. If anything, this Punk victory over Luke could end up making The Wyatt Family look even more beastly.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Oh man I forgot how long the first EC match is. Not sure I feel like watching it tonight. Not right now, anyway .


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

FLUX said:


> Punk is the second biggest star in the company. He's still riding the wave of momentum that comes with a 430 day title reign as well as three huge programmes with The Rock, The Undertaker and Brock Lesnar. He's labelled the best in the frickin' world. Losing to the best in the world does no harm to Harper whatsoever, it's not as if Harper didn't look strong as fuck and i'ts not as if Punk picked him up and GTS'ed him - It was a roll up. And if the faces are only supposed to get payback at the Pay Per View, whats the point in watching the TV show when you know that the faces are just going to get beaten down? It's finding the right balance between keeping it fresh and exciting as well as selling the pay per view.
> 
> In this case, I think one of the biggest attractions of this match/feud is simply seeing two of the biggest stars team up despite having previous issues: Can they work together? It's more than just wins and losses and protecting your monsters. Also, how will Wyatt get revenge for A) Punk defeating Harper and B) Bryan making the save. If anything, this Punk victory over Luke could end up making The Wyatt Family look even more beastly.


I respectfully disagree. I think it would have been way better if it had played out something like this:

Rowan interferes and they beat down Punk and leave him laying. Then on Smackdown they do the same thing to Bryan. Next Monday (the 11th), maybe make it a show long story of Punk searching for them. He gets there and is in pissed off mode, and has a pipe or some weapon and he's going hunting, but can't find them. So then at 9:30, he passes a dressing room with Daniel Bryan on the door. Punk kind of looks away, contemplating. I think that'd be a great tease. Then at like...I dunno, top of the 10pm hour, Punk goes out and calls the Wyatts out. They surround the ring, get on the apron, and Bryan runs out with a weapon and hits Rowan on the apron, while Punk and Harper brawl. There's a big fight, the babyfaces clear the ring, Bray is left untouched, since he's the ultimate goal (and should be defeated on the PPV). Punk and Bryan cut a promo that they realized that alone, the Wyatts could pick them off, but united, they can defeat these monster heels. They challenge them to a match at SVS. Bray does his mysterious riddle type promo and the match is on.

Then on the November 18th Raw, both teams are involved in separate tag matches to get them warmed up. Bryan and Punk get a reasonable challenge in a team like the Real Americans. During the match, when the babyfaces are making their comeback, the lights go out and the Wyatts appear on the entrance ramp. The distraction allows Swagger or Cesaro to hit their finisher and get the win. Bray just laughs maniacally while Rowan and Harper run down to the ring and leave Bryan and Punk laying.

Later in the show, the Wyatts face a relative jobber team like the PTP or someone. Wyatts just murder these guys and pin them, but Bryan and Punk run in through the crowd while the Wyatts celebrate and attack, driving them off (once again, Bray isn't touched). That's the go home show, since the PPV is the 24th.

This is IMO WAY more effective. Real Americans get a big rub, the Wyatts look strong, Punk and Bryan look like they're actually wronged babyfaces who want revenge, there's a logical connection why they'd team up, the Real Americans win can be spun off into a potential feud in the future (Punk vs Cesaro, for example, would have amazing potential and its fresh), and most importantly, both teams look strong enough to the point that the babyfaces still seem to be in a perilous situation, and the Wyatts look like the big bruisers they are, but the PPV promises to actually answer some questions. Can the smaller babyfaces overcome these seemingly more dominant heels? And then during the actual match, show some dissension between Bryan and Punk. Have Bryan accidentally knock Punk off the apron when trying to kick Harper and later on when Bryan is pinned, make Punk seem almost contemplating whether he wants to break it up, but eventually does. Sew the seeds now and tease this match for down the line.

Instead, Harper gets beaten and he looks like a bumbling oaf, the babyfaces are just...a team and the monster heels don't seem like monster heels. Plus, the babyfaces stood tall after their first real encounter with the heels and soundly beat them back. That's the conclusion to the feud and they gave it away for free in a nothing match...why? Its dumb and could have been so much better.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

KO Bossy does have a point. Wyatts are likely to win the potential tag match at SS but it's weird how the new wrestlers lose in TV matches (One of the Wyatt's defeat against Usos in what was a random match) for the first time instead of PPV matches which makes the whole thing look bigger and special. They've lost 3 matches now. It's similar to the Shield. They were attacking almost every big name (Rock, Cena, Undertaker, Kane, Ric Flair, Sheamus, Orton and many more) and then they started to lose in random TV matches to teams like the Usos. I believe they lost twice in June. They were always going to lose but it's odd that their unbeaten record was hyped up strongly and then it goes away in TV matches followed by more losses on the way.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

It was a MASSIVE faux pas putting Harper vs. Punk on first without any pre-match promo or anything. Utterly baffling. Punk and Bray should've traded off promos and have the match later on.

However, I'm not against the finish of the match as much as KO Bossy, as we don't have any indication that Punk and Bryan _want_ to team up just yet. Plus, Bray still had that big ol' smile on his face - the upcoming Smackdown should put The Wyatts in a more favourable position.

SHOULD.

Then again, they'll probably have Bryan beat Harper clean once more and do the EXACT same thing, but just switching round Punk and Bryan's roles.

In fact, I'm absolutely certain that will happen. I just hope I'm wrong.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

I think the WWE doesn't believe fans think into it as much as we do online.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Lord Shite said:


> It was a MASSIVE faux pas putting Harper vs. Punk on first without any pre-match promo or anything. Utterly baffling. Punk and Bray should've traded off promos and have the match later on.
> 
> However, I'm not against the finish of the match as much as KO Bossy, as we don't have any indication that Punk and Bryan _want_ to team up just yet. Plus, Bray still had that big ol' smile on his face - the upcoming Smackdown should put The Wyatts in a more favourable position.
> 
> ...


Agreed. That was pretty stupid. Punk is attacked by the Wyatt Family the previous week, and next week he just goes out to have an ordinary Raw match with one of the members. A promo by Punk going in to the match, or maybe by Wyatt would have actually added to the storyline, unlike a random match without any promos, whick makes Punk look like he doesn't care too much about what happened.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

RichardHagen said:


> I think the WWE doesn't believe fans think into it as much as we do online.


That must be why their shows have been utterly terrible for the most part for the last...well, ever since I started watching again in early 2012 anyway.

Besides, there's not much thinking to be done - it's just common sense most of the time. Their writers are paid to do the thinking, but they couldn't find their arseholes with both hands.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

KO Bossy said:


> What job did it get done? Making the Wyatts look like oafs who couldn't defeat 2 guys (1 who was injured, the other who was worn out after a match)? Making Harper into some putz who can kick the crap out of someone and then lose via roll up and look dumb? The booking was horrid. They needlessly beat Harper, one of your big monsters, totally clean in a way that made him look incompetent and bumbling in a throw away match designed to try and build a co main event to entice you to buy a PPV. They failed, nice job WWE. You showed that the monster can be defeated, and in a lame manner, on free TV. Their reputation is damaged now. Having the babyfaces ultimately triumph and showing the monster(s) can be defeated should be the payoff on PPV, not Raw. It was idiotic.


The job it got done? Being a good match? Isn't that the primary goal of every match? Read what I said the booking was stupid but if that's how they wanted it booked, with the Wyatt's coming out looking stupid and Punk/Bryan coming out looking strong, then they accomplished their goal. The Wyatt's have been undefeated for a while, and just like the Shied, they had to lose eventually tbh. If they had to lose in a way that makes them look bad, better have it be against 2 of the top 3 stars in the company instead of the Usos or something.


Again, just to clarify, I'm not defending the WWEs booking, not even close. Just saying it was an entertaining match worth the watch. I love Luke Harper (couldn't care less about Rowan to be frank) so it sucked seeing that shit booking, but if he had to lose better it be to CM Punk off a roll up over getting beat by The Miz with his whack ass finisher, you know?


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

Well, they lost to The Usos a couple of weeks ago. :lol


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

I think the difference is that Shield were already beating established teams before finally losing. Wyatt Family were just winning squash matches against jobbers for the most part. So far, they haven't beaten no one credible (apart from Kane).


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Lord Shite said:


> It was a MASSIVE faux pas putting Harper vs. Punk on first without any pre-match promo or anything. Utterly baffling. Punk and Bray should've traded off promos and have the match later on.
> 
> However, I'm not against the finish of the match as much as KO Bossy, as we don't have any indication that Punk and Bryan _want_ to team up just yet. Plus, Bray still had that big ol' smile on his face - the upcoming Smackdown should put The Wyatts in a more favourable position.
> 
> ...


Its not like I go out of my way to dislike what goes on. If its something where the positives outweigh the negatives, I'll acknowledge it. However, I read, I write and I watch movies. In other words, I know the elements of a logical and effective story. Virtually nothing the WWE does these days follows such logic. I mean, I guess the match quality is better in terms of consistency, but that largely doesn't sell shows. Yeah, I know people in this thread like reviewing matches and that's cool, but storylines are of great importance, especially in WWE where the entertainment aspect is so heavily emphasized. What I see now is so...amateur. Seriously, writing a clear, concise and logical story is not that hard. And it needn't be complicated, either. That situation I proposed before-not difficult at all to understand, yet I think it'd be way more effective. The writing now is just...I have no idea what runs through those people's heads. In a world as rich as ours in terms of creativity, THIS is the best they can do? 

I shudder every time we have a match announced for PPV like Van Dam vs Del Rio and in the build up they have the challenger pin the champion cleanly in a non title match. And that's not the only time. Christian pinned ADR in the Summerslam build, Truth pinned Axel in the Battleground build, etc. Its totally idiotic. 

I shake my head when feuds are constantly ruined or derailed because the writers start off well and after the first act haven't got a fucking clue how to continue the story. Look at the two hottest feuds in the summer. First, Punk vs Heyman was scalding hot and the build up to the match was Brock was great. Then Brock leaves and the feud must continue, so they bring in...Axel to feud with Punk. Oh and surprise-Punk beats Axel cleanly in every encounter and constantly makes him look stupid to the point that nobody would pay money to see it (yet we were expected to). So all of those weeks of babyface dominance leads to...the heel triumphing at the PPV? How does that work? And Bryan...he beats Cena clean, goes on to feud with the pseudo-Corporation...then beats Orton in their first PPV encounter totally clean. Feud is over, now. But instead they pull this idiotic swerve out of their asses so the story can weakly limp along so they can get 2 more buyrates out of it and in the process make it about 10000 times less effective. And let's not forget about the Big Show bullshit. 

:HHH2: "You have to do what we say Big Show." 

:show : "Why?"

:HHH : "Because you're broke!"

:show : "Oh OK."

Totally out of nowhere, no hinting or build, Big Show is just randomly broke. Please accept this major story flaw so we can get on with milking you fans for all you're worth.

I groan every time we have a PPV and then the next night on Raw, its filled with nothing but rematches of the previous night. People paid 55 bucks to watch this and now you're invalidating their purchase. Great going. Christ, look at the Raw following Battleground. Did you miss Ziggler vs Sandow? That's OK, here it is again. Cesaro's swing to Khali was amazing, but if you didn't feel like paying to see it, enjoy it for free. Punk and Ryback fought, and so did Axel and Truth. Save your money, you can watch it all on repeat. What sort of morons would indicate that its not worth buying their own product?

Bottom line-I get so fed up with how incompetent and lazy this company is. Its really bad when the moments that are actually good surprise you because they're so rare.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> The job it got done? Being a good match? Isn't that the primary goal of every match? Read what I said the booking was stupid but if that's how they wanted it booked, with the Wyatt's coming out looking stupid and Punk/Bryan coming out looking strong, then they accomplished their goal. The Wyatt's have been undefeated for a while, and just like the Shied, they had to lose eventually tbh. If they had to lose in a way that makes them look bad, better have it be against 2 of the top 3 stars in the company instead of the Usos or something.
> 
> 
> Again, just to clarify, I'm not defending the WWEs booking, not even close. Just saying it was an entertaining match worth the watch. I love Luke Harper (couldn't care less about Rowan to be frank) so it sucked seeing that shit booking, but if he had to lose better it be to CM Punk off a roll up over getting beat by The Miz with his whack ass finisher, you know?


It thought it was an average match in almost every sense of the word. Not awful, not great...just kinda there.

Apologies if I misread your post, I thought you were praising the booking for some reason. I don't see how anyone can, really...


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Decided to not watch WM 19 tonight, but instead work on another Undertaker project post! 

Anyone know any hidden taker gems that are fun?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Lord Shite said:


> Well, they lost to The Usos a couple of weeks ago. :lol


Shit you are right about that, that slipped my mind for some reason.

For the most part, I agree entirely with what KO Bossy said about the utter shit that is the WWE creative writing these days. Sometimes, I wonder if I still watch today's product just because of nostalgia, because I've watched wrestling my whole life. I could just as easily not watch any Raw or Smackdown or PPV's, then wait until it comes out that a match like Brock/Punk or Taker/Punk happened and watch it after the fact. I'd say 90% of the wrestling I watch happened before 2008. 

The only solution I've found is to not let myself get invested in any story lines anymore because I know I'll just be disappointed in the end. I just appreciate the good matches some guys are having and don't focus on the shit stories that I'm being force fed on a weekly basis. It's really really sad that this is what it's come to in the WWE. A decade ago we were getting awesome feuds like Taker/Lesnar, Angle/Lesnar, Eddie/Rey, JBL/Guerrero, Flair/Trips, etc. Now we have Big Show is broke and Kane in a fucking suit. Jesus.

Like I said I try to keep my bitterness to myself for the most part because I'm sure there are plenty people out there perfectly content with the current direction of the WWE. If they'd just throw me a bone by taking Kofi Kingston, The Great Khali, and Santino Marella off TV I'd be pretty happy :lmao


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> Thanks, Nostalgia! I'm gonna go ahead and get it, and I'm saving your post, so I remember which matches stood out.
> 
> To you have a link to your old reviews? I'm not gonna read them first, though, because I generally don't like to be spoiled. I'd like to have them so I can go back and read them after I watch.
> 
> ...


Quoting this again because I've finally found my old reviews now and I've put them into one big post and PM'ed them you if that's ok (thought that would be easier for you).


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

KO Bossy said:


> I groan every time we have a PPV and then the next night on Raw, its filled with nothing but rematches of the previous night. People paid 55 bucks to watch this and now you're invalidating their purchase. Great going. Christ, look at the Raw following Battleground. Did you miss Ziggler vs Sandow? That's OK, here it is again. Cesaro's swing to Khali was amazing, but if you didn't feel like paying to see it, enjoy it for free. Punk and Ryback fought, and so did Axel and Truth. Save your money, you can watch it all on repeat. What sort of morons would indicate that its not worth buying their own product?


Agreed. It seems to me like very lazing booking, as they have no ideas for matches on Raw. 

It also irks me when they have a match coming up at a PPV, and the two people in the match have actual singles matches or modified yet basically singles matches against each other. For instance, when Christian was up against Del Rio at SummerSlam, and they had a random no stipulation match on SD a week or two before that.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Souled Out 1997 was a bad PPV, but it did have the moment that made DDP into a star. Guerrero/Syxx was a bad match, but the ending was hilarious and classic Eddie :eddie. Somehow there were even worse WCW PPVs than that one.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Shit you are right about that, that slipped my mind for some reason.
> 
> For the most part, I agree entirely with what KO Bossy said about the utter shit that is the WWE creative writing these days. Sometimes, I wonder if I still watch today's product just because of nostalgia, because I've watched wrestling my whole life. I could just as easily not watch any Raw or Smackdown or PPV's, then wait until it comes out that a match like Brock/Punk or Taker/Punk happened and watch it after the fact. I'd say 90% of the wrestling I watch happened before 2008.
> 
> ...


OK Kane in the suit was pretty hilarious, but agreed with Big Show being broke. Lazy writing at its finest.

What I'm particularly baffled by is how once upon a time, this company actually had a clue. Things made sense and were so well done that a storyline flaw like "why didn't Vince simply fire Austin?" could be overlooked because of how amazing everything else was. And then just out of the blue, they stopped having a clue. It was pretty abrupt, too. It was like...one year, they had a clue, the next they didn't. I think it happened in the late 2000s, like around 09-10.

And the truly mystifying part-quality has hit basement levels, and yet business is actually great...now THAT defies logic. I mean, it took WCW 2 years from being on top of the wrestling world to being completely out of business. So how is WWE not only still alive, but thriving when their quality has spiraled into oblivion? Were this 2000, this failure known as the Best for Business storyline would have crippled this company. Imagine the Rock being shoved down the card to compete against Right to Censor while...well, isn't this amusing. You could STILL have made it Big Show vs Hunter back then as well. That would have been shat on to such an insane degree. My point is that I don't understand why people still watch WWE when the quality is deplorable and embarrassing. I mean, there ARE alternatives out there and the past has shown that when quality sucks enough, they'll abandon you (like WCW). I guess for some WWE is all that's left, but at what point will the fans say "you know what? I love wrestling, and WWE is the biggest company available, but even still, I can't watch this. It's become way too terrible."


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

smitty915 said:


> Decided to not watch WM 19 tonight, but instead work on another Undertaker project post!
> 
> Anyone know any hidden taker gems that are fun?


http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x9enwn_undertaker-vs-mark-henry_sport
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xed5zt_smackdown-5-28-10-the-undertaker-vs_sport

Hidden gems? Maybe not, but they're matches that people don't talk enough about. Or like as much as they should if they've seen them.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x9enwn_undertaker-vs-mark-henry_sport
> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xed5zt_smackdown-5-28-10-the-undertaker-vs_sport
> 
> Hidden gems? Maybe not, but they're matches that people don't talk enough about. Or like as much as they should if they've seen them.


Will definetly check out the Henry match, I reviewed that Mysterio match in my last post, wasn't a fan 



Spoiler: taker vs Rey



Match #3: Rey Mysterio vs the Undertaker ( SD 2010)
To finish out the trilogy of the Taker/Rey matches is the fatal four qualifying match that would be Takers return match but I think it was the only one before he left again. IMO this was the weakest of the three despite #2 being VERY short. At least that one had some fun SPOTZ and was quicker paced. I don’t know if it was just me but it felt like they were just going through the motions and it was kind of clear that taker was still kind of hurt, it wasn’t too bad though. ** ½*


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Some other Taker gems:

vs. Finlay: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x46vqu_smackdown-09-03-2007-finlay-vs-unde_sport
vs. Festus: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTzLoEw62FA
vs. Vader: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xdaekg_in-your-house-16-the-undertaker-vs_sport
vs. JBL: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xachir_sd-28-07-05-undertaker-vs-jbl_sport
vs. Rock: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fANmqVzbf1k


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

He didnt like that taker/rey match Yeah

taker gems ? 10/10 sd w/punk and sd 09 /punk and 09 w/ jeff hardy


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Taker vs Finlay before WM23 is absolutely awesome.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Taker vs Finlay before WM23 is absolutely awesome.


Seconded. Match is fabulous.

Here is one, not really a hidden gem tho:

Taker/Kane vs Finay/King Bookah Smackdown


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

I'm in the process of downloading every royal rumble (the actual rumble I believe) from 1988-2008. Will I enjoy this (ive watched most of them at least once).


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Thanks guys, wont be able to get all of those on this post but I saved the links and dates to a word document


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

John Cena these last few weeks showing everybody why he's the man in this fucking business with the Sandow, Del Rio, & 6 mans all being fucking excellent stuff. THE LEGEND GROWS.

CM Punk Vs Chris Jericho (Wrestlemania XXVIII)~ ***** 1/2*
CM Punk Vs Chris Jericho (RAW 2/4/13) ~ *****
CM Punk Vs Jeff Hardy (Summerslam 2009) ~ **** 3/4*

Punk Vs Jericho from Mania rules the fucking planet still, with Jericho heeling it up better than ever and Punk displaying one hell of a babyface performance. The exchanges between the two were fucking fantastic and Jericho's verbal assaults on Punk throughout the match were tremendous in garnering heat and suspense especially considering the stipulation. It's the best match on that show by a fair margin and for good reason. Will definitely make the top 100.

Punk Vs Jericho 4/2/13 is pretty damn good. Starts off with a slow build and we get into some work by Punk and some great taunting to the fans. Really pulls out just an overall great little heel performance here, was really impressed with what they gave me there. Doubt it'll be good enough to make the top 100 though. We'll see.

Punk Vs Hardy was an awesome-o spotfest in which Jeff Hardy nearly kills himself, selling me on the match immediately because I wanted to see what that crazy fucker would do. Punk is just a douchebag heel in this match, which Jeff feeding off the energy of the fans to give himself adrenaline. Just a really fucking fun match with a big time feel to it that you just love to see in a bout. Will definitely be on the list.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

My Top 5 Taker Matches(Combination of matches I saw live and watched on YouTube):

Taker VS HBK WM 25
Taker VS Shawn First Ever HIAC Match 1997
Taker VS Punk WM 29
Taker VS Angle No Way Out '06
Taker VS HBK WM 26


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Their are so many taker matches that are just so good, dont know f this should morph into a top 100 taker matches list, that would take forever to get all the matches watched, I guess I'm up for it..


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Souled Out 1997 was a bad PPV, but it did have the moment that made DDP into a star. Guerrero/Syxx was a bad match, but the ending was hilarious and classic Eddie :eddie. Somehow there were even worse WCW PPVs than that one.


Road Wild '97 gives it a run for it's money in the same year. Vicious & Delicious vs Harlem Heat where the heels were working like they cared, meanwhile Harlem Heat couldn't care less + the fact of how V&D were working like babyfaces meanwhile Heat were working like heels _(and won by cheating much to the displeasure of the very, very white audience in the South)_ And that was just the opener. :lmao


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> John Cena these last few weeks showing everybody why he's the man in this fucking business with the Sandow, Del Rio, & 6 mans all being fucking excellent stuff. THE LEGEND GROWS.
> 
> CM Punk Vs Chris Jericho (Wrestlemania XXVIII)~ ***** 1/2*
> CM Punk Vs Chris Jericho (RAW 2/4/13) ~ *****
> ...


Honestly, I'm probably one of the few people who thinks Jericho and Punk kind of lack chemistry. Take them separately and they're fantastic workers. But put them together and...I dunno, I always expected so much more. Like...MOTY stuff. And whenever I'd watch them, it just felt so...what's the best way to put it...uninspired? Especially during the Payback match, but also at the WM28 match, I kept glancing at the clock and saying to myself "why is this still going?" I found them very hard to get into. Not really a big fan, I think they work way better with other people.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Oh and by the way, I find it kind of enjoyable reviewing matches. I especially get a kick out of the bad PPVs. Would anyone be interested in reading a review of a bad PPV? Or do you want a good PPV? In either case, any suggestions? I find that most of the time I end up just watching certain matches and really have never watched many full shows in my life. Am I missing out?


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

KO Bossy said:


> Honestly, I'm probably one of the few people who thinks Jericho and Punk kind of lack chemistry. Take them separately and they're fantastic workers. But put them together and...I dunno, I always expected so much more. Like...MOTY stuff. And whenever I'd watch them, it just felt so...what's the best way to put it...uninspired? Especially during the Payback match, but also at the WM28 match, I kept glancing at the clock and saying to myself "why is this still going?" I found them very hard to get into. Not really a big fan, I think they work way better with other people.


Yeah. I remember the Payback match just felt so slow. There was little flow to the match, and there were not very many good, suspenseful moments in the match, it was just Punk and Jericho's signature moves over a long span of time, with a few basic reversals here and there, at least for the second half of the match. Nothing special and nothing to get you on the edge of your seat.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

Yeah I'm not a huge fan of Jericho and Punk together with the exception of their Mania match. I really thought their street fight in Chicago would have been better and their Payback match was pretty forgettable. 

Honestly though their Mania match more than makes up for it. It's a pretty amazing match and one of the few that I liked more when I watched it on DVD than when I saw it live. I think I rated ****1/4 or ****1/2. Man, WM 28 really could have been amazing if Sheamus and Bryan had an actual match, even if it had only been the 8 minutes that Brodus Clay got to dance.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

KO Bossy said:


> Oh and by the way, I find it kind of enjoyable reviewing matches. I especially get a kick out of the bad PPVs. Would anyone be interested in reading a review of a bad PPV? Or do you want a good PPV? In either case, any suggestions? I find that most of the time I end up just watching certain matches and really have never watched many full shows in my life. Am I missing out?


BAD: KOTR 1995, WM 2, Insurrection 2002 

GOOD: WM 19, SS 02, ER 2012, Royak Rumble 2001

This Taker/Vader match is about to start :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Which Taker vs Vader? Rumble or Canadian Stampede? Either way: :mark:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Canadian stampede :mark:

I'll get to the rumble match too though


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:hb

VADER _(Underfuckintaker too, obviously)_

I should watch it atm too. b/c the last Vader match I watched was that insane stinker vs Kane from Over the Edge '98.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Speaking of Rumble, finally watched the Sid/HBK main event match. Crowd was hot for the hometown hero but I find it pretty dull, specially Sid's control segments were fast forward material. Two stars here.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I don't mind it, but it is a far cry from their wicked good Survivor Series match.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

need to watch aleast one taker/vader


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Undertaker project post #4

Match #1: Undertaker vs Edge (Judgment day 2008)*

Didn’t enjoy this match too much, thought it was quite dull TBH. All I have seen from these two was the mania match and TLC. TLC was average (I know most hate it) and mania was great, but this felt like an extended RAW or SD match, and when taker is involved, that does not happen often. My big problem with this match is that it had no, climatic feel at all, and honestly felt like they were just going through the motions. This sucks because I usually like their matches, but no wonder no one talks about this. The finish didn’t help at all too, considering that it’s a huge title match, and then it ends by count out and then the title stays vacant, felt legit like battleground . *3/4 

*Match #2: The Undertaker vs Kane(NOC 2010)*

Apparently this match is pretty fun, but I did not like the buried alive match these two had and considering nobody liked the HIAC match I do not plan on watching it :lmao. Apparently these two had a VERY good match on SD and their WM 98 match is regarded as good too, so both of those I will get too as well. After like 10 minutes of entrances we are ready to go! This match was loads of fun, these two clicked this night even though usually they cannot seem to get it going. I haven’t seen the WM 14 match. Solid recommendation and I suggest picking up this whole show as it’s a great PPV. ***3/4 

*Match #3: Festus vs The Undertaker (SD April 2008)*

Apparently this is another GREAT sub-10 minute match by taker. We all know that Festus/Luke Gallows could work like a pro, but I haven’t seen a TON of his stuff to really assert that. Festus is a beast right from the start of this but taker just hits him with a big boot :lmao. One thing I notice is the fact that Festus’s punches are STIFF, they look real as shit, I’ve never been in the ring ever and I can tell. This is a really good match, its good for the time it got, and I need to see more FESTUS now as he is a really good in the ring, pfft, and I thought he was just a comedy character that got morphed into Punk’s buddy. ***1/2 

*Match # 4: Vader vs the Undertaker( IYH 16: Canadian Stampede)*

:mark:, two of the best brawlers in the industry’s history squaring off here. I’m expecting a stiff straight up FIGHT that will be AMAZING. Paul Bearer(RIP) is in Vader’s corner, and of course that of course is some great comedic relief, top 10 manager of all time IMO. This match is AMAZING, just an all-out FIGHT coupled with some great near falls near the end of the match make this one of my favorite taker matches of the 90s. For sure check this out if you’re in the mood for some good classic undertaker and Vader. While you’re at it, check this whole show out, one of the better PPVS of all time. **** ​


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Personally I'd go nearly **** for that JD 08 match. Helps if you watch WM - BL - JD in order though. Match and story progression between them is IMMENSE.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah I haven't seen BL yet, I have seen WM though. ****1/2 for that! 

Checking out Christian/regal BP 09 because Cal was pimping the shit out of it when he was doing ECW 09


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Kane/Taker at WM 14 :mark 

It cracks my top 5 Taker streak matches at #5. Beyond underrated. Kanes best match just Edging out Kane/Beniot from bad blood 04.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

xdoomsayerx said:


> Kane/Taker at WM 14 :mark
> 
> It cracks my top 5 Taker streak matches at #5. Beyond underrated. Kanes best match just Edging out Kane/Beniot from bad blood 04.


Think I'll start post #5 with it after this Regal/Christian


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Think I'll start post #5 with it after this Regal/Christian



Watch the Breaking Point match, absolutely fantastic, my pick for the best ECW match ever. Cal prefers the ECW TV one from England, but they are both :clap


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Undertaker vs Edge from Backlash '08 isn't essential viewing, imo, smitty. Watch if curious, but only except a good Undertaker performance. Edge was awful during it. They really only had two matches I liked overall - from both efforts - WrestleMania & SummerSlam. Don't remember anything about Judgment Day. That's reserved.

KANE vs Undertaker @ both WM 14 & NOC 2010 :mark:

+ KANE vs Benoit matches in general. :lenny


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

OMFG at this taker entrance at WM 14 :mark:


Christian vs William Regal BP: **** 

IDK about best ECW match, probably give it to one of the Swagger/Christian matches TBH


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Christian vs Swagger match on TV in February. (Y)


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

why does everyone not mention flair/show when dicussing the best ecw matches ? This vader/taker rr 97 match is :lenny want to watch hbk/sid from the same show


Should I change me name to skins or slic ric ? got to decide


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

Flair/Show is pretty fucking awesome.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

redskins25 said:


> why does everyone not mention flair/show when dicussing the best ecw matches ? This vader/taker rr 97 match is :lenny want to watch hbk/sid from the same show
> 
> 
> Should I change me name to skins or slic ric ? got to decide


It gets brought up a good bit, but lost in the shuffle as some tend to gravitate towards the later years of ECW putting out constant strong performances.

SKINS in all caps is legit. 



Saint Dick said:


> Flair/Show is pretty fucking awesome.


100x ^ this.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

Agreed w/SKINS in all caps. Bossy.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

SKINS in all caps.

Good to see smitty took my recs. I too only liked two Taker/Edge matches, which were the two in the big PPVs. Backlash certainly consisted of a horrible Edge performance, Judgment Day was nothing special whatsoever, and ONS might be the worst TLC match I've seen. Honestly, while I would definitely consider it a very good feud, I'm not very big on it at all. In real-time, it did drag on for way too long. The Smackdown roster was very shallow at the time, so it wasn't too surprising. Gonna go check out Undertaker/Kane from NOC. Hated it on first watch, but my attitude towards brawls have changed. Glad to see Taker/Festus and Taker/Vader getting love.

Sid/HBK from RR 97 was not good. SvS 96 match was super fun and had the GOAT bump.

:lmao at Road Wild 97. I remember the Horsemen/Malenko & Jarrett tag being even worse than the opener. By golly, Jeff Jarrett sucked. I kinda liked Savage/Show on last watch, all thanks to THE BIG GUY :show. Main event was terrible, as expected.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

skins in caps it is


hbk/sid rr 97 isnt any good ? bummer, how about cena/wade tlc ? seems like it gets mixed reviews up here


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I see the Lenny smiley is catching on everywhere. :lenny

Not gonna lie, my mind hasn't been on wrestling at all the past couple days since Marshall Mathers LP 2 leaked. What an album. bama4



smitty915 said:


> Decided to not watch WM 19 tonight, but instead work on another Undertaker project post!
> 
> Anyone know any hidden taker gems that are fun?


Ayyy. 1/31/92 against Bret Hart in MSG. Gem city baby.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Saint Dick said:


> Agreed w/SKINS in all caps. Bossy.


Pardon?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Gonna upload unk6 vs. :cena4 from RAW this year in HD on Dailymotion tonight or tomorrow in case anyone's interested


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Damn, I would give MMLP2 only a ***3/4*. Just felt too forced and did not hold up to all the awesome albums from this year. Artpop leaked too, but that probably warrants a *NO* on the CAL scale.

Not necessarily an Undertaker sleeper, but the 2005 Smackdown 6-Man Match that he is a part of does not get talked about enough. ******, and the final time that I marked out for face Batista.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Damn, I would give MMLP2 only a ***3/4*. Just felt too forced and did not hold up to all the awesome albums from this year. Artpop leaked too, but that probably warrants a *NO* on the CAL scale.


BRO. I could see someone not liking it, but I stick it at a rock solid *** 3/4. Not on the level of the first two LPs or Recovery, but it's a fine follow up. Enjoy the classic rock rehashes and samples and all the callbacks to MMLP. MATTHEW! Oh and that Headlights track. Almost brings tears to my eyes. :banderas


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> SKINS in all caps.
> 
> Good to see smitty took my recs. I too only liked two Taker/Edge matches, which were the two in the big PPVs. Backlash certainly consisted of a horrible Edge performance, Judgment Day was nothing special whatsoever, and ONS might be the worst TLC match I've seen. Honestly, while I would definitely consider it a very good feud, I'm not very big on it at all. In real-time, it did drag on for way too long. The Smackdown roster was very shallow at the time, so it wasn't too surprising. Gonna go check out Undertaker/Kane from NOC. Hated it on first watch, but my attitude towards brawls have changed. Glad to see Taker/Festus and Taker/Vader getting love.
> 
> ...


Agreed. The start of the feud between Taker & Edge was fine. Was their money match with their tiny roster and the next logical step to produce at WM. Following you had the good aftermath with Taker working his ass off in April, then following that is when it got stupid. At that point right now on my Smackdown 2008 project. Vacancy was just as awful as it was back when it aired. Makes zero sense. Didn't help anything & it dragged out a feud with no reason to be going for months longer. It's not like it gave Edge any sort of dominance either. He was dethroned by Punk about a month after besting Undertaker & Batista _(who owned him following NOC)_ Bizarre scene of booking there. Especially when the transition was Vickie bringing back Taker to destroy Edge, only for that to backfire on Vickie (in kayfabe, of course.) which was a blah way to get the great Taker vs Show feud running. Jesus. A lot of dumb plot holes just to have two amazing big men have a series of terrific matches. Vickie at the time hating Edge but being ultra heel towards everyone else left fans not knowing which way to react. Awful.

:lmao Horsemen tag was the dirt worst. You know what came before that? Konnan being so bad he makes a match vs Mysterio a DUD. Swear the only real silver lining for me was Jericho vs DAS having a solid match. Flair vs Syxx is uninspired, DDP vs Hennig is bleh, & Giant vs Savage had it's moments, but never formed to be much for me. I could try that one again. I recall something really stupid playing a part in the finish, however. Don't get me started on the final two matches of the show. Status quo from the start reared it's ugly head. WCW was on a PPV hot streak before that show happened too. Slamboree, GAB, & BASH AT THE BEACH were all quality events.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> BRO. I could see someone not liking it, but I stick it at a rock solid *** 3/4. Not on the level of the first two LPs or Recovery, but it's a fine follow up. Enjoy the classic rock rehashes and samples and all the callbacks to MMLP. MATTHEW! Oh and that Headlights track. Almost brings tears to my eyes. :banderas


***3/4 for MMLP2 sounds about right to me. Haven't listened that much though.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Speaking of Rumble, finally watched the Sid/HBK main event match. Crowd was hot for the hometown hero but I find it pretty dull, specially Sid's control segments were fast forward material. Two stars here.





redskins25 said:


> skins in caps it is
> 
> 
> hbk/sid rr 97 isnt any good ? bummer, how about cena/wade tlc ? seems like it gets mixed reviews up here


Yeah, it underwhelmed. I remember Shawn saying that he was disappointed in how that match went.

And you seem like a lower case kind of guy, btw, 'skins.  



Nostalgia said:


> Quoting this again because I've finally found my old reviews now and I've put them into one big post and PM'ed them you if that's ok (thought that would be easier for you).


Of course that's ok. Thanks, again!


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

It pisses me off how disrespected and unappreciated Big Show is around here. Not in this thread of course but the website in general.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I was a huge fan of Big Show's 2006 MONSTER HEEL run with the ECW belt, thought he was performing better than ever when it comes to 2006 in general, especially when it comes to stuff with Triple H. People should watch his Flair match OBVIOUSLY, but then you have stuff like his championship rematch against Lashley in December, his last match of this run where he just carries the whole damn thing.

He pulls out great performances ever year, with memorable stuff against Henry, Sheamus, etc over the last few years. Thought his work was underrated for a really, really long fucking time and felt he was a good worker as soon as he hit the industry due to his superior athleticism and power ALA Brock having a natural charisma in his work, but to a lesser extent.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

It's a shame he's been a victim of piss poor booking throughout his career. Still a legend, but he should be an even bigger one.

Still an amazing career though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Big Show is one of the best. I know a lot of folk who feel he's just about the best thing to come into wrestling. Marvel by his talents that come along with being a modern day giant. He'll always have a fan in me.

RAW this week giving me Punk vs Harper & that six man tag was more than enough to make up for the rest of the filler junk. First twenty minutes of RAW were WOW though. Weird how patchy WWE is with their booking these days. You get a scenario that's so good for one segment, then the next few look as if the company has no clue in what they're doing. Redundancies aside, I wished their consistency would float around to everyone on the roster. Not just a select few.

btw, what's the deal with the Main Event & Smackdown tapings this week? Looks as if plans went down a different path & some talent wasn't around. _(only my speculation)_ Few guys pulling double duty is unusual for both shows.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

redskins25 said:


> need to watch aleast one taker/vader


Vader vs the Undertaker( IYH 16: Canadian Stampede)in my sig


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Just watching some random Nitro/WCW B and C Show matches and do you really want to know who's underrated? Like... Underrated as in I've never seen him talked about even in this thread: Ernest fucking Miller. The guy was charismatic as shit and could work. What went wrong?

Please tell me someone else appreciates the greatness that is The Cat?

*Edit:* @skins, shortening your name and putting it in all caps is what the cool folk do. DO IT.

:hb


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

PGSucks said:


> Gonna upload unk6 vs. :cena4 from RAW this year in HD on Dailymotion tonight or tomorrow in case anyone's interested


Well you COULD... or so save time you couldn't . I already did .

John Cena vs. CM Punk_ Raw, Feb. 25, 2013 (Full-Length Match

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k6qIm66LHeDRvu4xq1B (Private)


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Add me to the list of people thoroughly disappointed with Marshall Mathers LP II. It has absolutely nothing in common with its namesake album, the beat selection was atrocious, and not one single Dr. Dre beat in sight. How can you call an album Marshall Mathers LP 2 and not have Dre produce the whole thing? It's inane. I consider Eminem and Biggie the two best ever on the mic, so I was almost despondent upon listening to it, I was expecting a certified classic. It just seems like he's trying way too hard and isn't going for that emotion he used to have. He's just trying to cram as many rhyming multisyllabic words in a sentence he can possibly fit. This is not to say its a BAD album, it's just amazingly mediocre so it's amazingly disappointing. **3/4

Vader vs Taker IYH: Canadien Stampede :mark: 2 of my top 10 favorites ever in a classic match. Love it

After rewatching Cena/Punk Raw for the first time since March 2 days ago, I was so blown away it leapfrogged Taker/Punk and is now #2 on my MotY list. Phenomenal match, their second best ever, and damn close to being as good as MitB ****3/4


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I really don't know what to make of MMLP2. I haven't seen an album with so many varying opinions in a long time. I enjoyed Relapse and to a lesser extent, Recovery, so I'll give it a chance now it's on spotify. I like MMLP but I'm not dumb enough to come in expecting something of that caliber.

To stay on topic: lolBigShow. Something about him always cracks me up, he's extremely talented but his booking is often such a momentum killer for others that he becomes an easy target. For quite a while I didn't wanna hate him but last year when he derailed Cody's momentum as IC champion, I pretty much crossed over the border and had a laugh about a house show crowd chanting "You can't wrestle" to him even though it's obviously not true. And lol @ his rematch with Lashley on ECW. Lashley botched the powerslam on first try and had to redo it. No wonder he changed to a simple powerslam from that awesome inverted version of the Dominator. No way would he have been able to hit Show with _that_ move.


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

Show and Kane are two guys who would be seen as mythical had they been around the 70's or 80's, extremely poorly used the pair of them and because of that are so underrated. 

the fact is WWE aren't going to replace those guys, dying breed and all that. 

Regarding MMLPII, I decided to check it out based on the name-sake, but the reality is he really should have stopped after Encore (which wasn't the best either but certainly better than the shit hes brought out since) Its OK but it gets dragged down because of the name of the album, it just works against him really, Bad Guy and Evil Twin are both brilliant though.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I don't know what this MMLPII is, but is doesn't like sound wrestler so GTFO with any discussion on it please.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*Survivor Series 2002*

The debut of the ELIMINATION CHAMBER~!


*Bubba Ray & Spike Dudley & Jeff Hardy Vs 3 Minute Warning & Rico - Elimination Tables Match*

I like elimination tables matches. In this case it means we are guaranteed at least 5 people going through tables :mark:.

:lmao Bubba throws Spike at 3 Minute Warning, who catch him... AND THEN STAND THERE WHILE BUBBA GETS ON HIS HAND AND KNEES TO SET UP A LAUNCHING PAD FOR JEFF TO LEAP OVER THE ROPES ONTO THEM. HUR DUR WE 3 MINUTE WARNING WE SMRT.

Holy moley, Hurricanrana from SPIKE to JAMAL.

ROSEY HEAD FIRST THROUGH A TABLE. And all it does is FUCK HIM OFF lol. He wasn't eliminated either, he drove himself through.

:lmao Rosey didn't catch Jeff coming off the ropes, so Jeff just DIES and gets a big splash for his trouble .

:mark: Spike's table bump is :mark:.

:mark: Rosey goes for a moonsault, Bubba crotches him on the ropes and he BOUNCES OFF HIS COCK and does a split legged moonsault to himself :lmao. That was fucking tremendous lol.

A tag tables match at MSG? Well gee, this sounds familiar! And to help us remember, they go over to the tunnel opposite the entrance way behind the ring to do a table spot their :mark:. Bubba desperately fighting against 2 men to get them out of the way so he can save Jeff is pretty awesome. Rosey on the table, Jeff on top of the tunnel, SWANTON BOMB~! Ahhh, RR 2000 memories .

Ha, Jeff lands a great whisper in the wind on Jamal. For some reason, even with Jamal as UMAGA, Jeff always landed that move the best on him lol. Bigger target maybe?

:lmao another RR 00 memory is attempted, but Jeff slips off the barricade while trying to run it, and he just flops head first through a standing table :lmao.

HOLY FUCK JAMAL SPLASHES JEFF THROUGH A TABLE FROM THE TOP ROPE TO THE OUTSIDE. DAYUM!!!

TOP TOPE POWERBOMB THROUGH A TABLE~! Jamal is DONE.

Rico and Bubba are the last 2. Rosey comes back even though he's been eliminated, and Jamal recovers and gets back in too! Now it's 3 on 1! So who gonna save Bubba? Spike? Jeff?

D-VON DUDLEY!!! THE REVEREND HAS REFORMED AND REJOINED WITH BUBBA!!! 3-D! Rico through a table!!! Bubba wins! Bubba wins!!!

Well this is still an absolute TON of fun. One or two silly moments (and the RICO botch which is conveniently edited from the DVD release lol), but overall just a good elimination tables tag match. Probably the second best tables match.

*Rating: ***1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 3*


*Jamie Noble Vs Billy Kidman - WWE Cruiserweight Championship Match*

Kidman seems to have Noble's number lately, beating him a few times in a row in tags and non title matches. So Kidman goes for a bunch of quick pins right off the bat, hoping to catch the champ off guard and capitalise on the momentum he's built over the last few weeks.

:mark: Noble hits a PERFECT suicide dive to Kidman. Looks like they headbutted each other too lol.

:mark: at... THAT MOVE that Kidman hits. It's like a mix between the F-U and GTS, with the back of the neck smashing down onto his knee. Noble is rocked, and Kidman feels it and goes for a SSP, but Nidia on the outside sees it coming and moves her MAN out of the ring.

:lmao at Tazz trying to sing. He did better in Willy Wonka tbh.

Kidman gets a TON of offense in this match, really playing up on the whole "has Noble's number" story, but Nidia on the outside continues to make a difference and saving her MAN on a number of occasions, almost evening the odds so to speak with Kidman being on such a roll.

SWEET JEBUS at that DDT from Noble. Could have EASILY been the finish right there.

Nidia again tries to prevent a SSP, but this time Kidman sees her coming and kicks her to the floor! SSP lands, and we got a NEW CW champ!

This was good. Kidman getting as much shit in as he did makes perfect sense for the story of the match based on the build up (see HHH, this is an example of it DONE RIGHT), and I liked how Nidia was used on the outside too.

*Rating: ***1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 3*


BANGLE BACKSTAGE SEGMENT. Tag team partners don't shake hands. Tag team partners GOTTA HUG!!! :lmao No wonder Benoit did what he did, he got fucking traumatised by Angle here!

:lmao at Victoria going crazy backstage.


*Trish Stratus Vs Victoria - Hardcore Rules WWE Women's Championship Match*

First weapon brought out is a broom by Victoria. WOMEN KNOWS HER PLACE!!! 

Oooohhhh damn, Trish gets thrown face first into a trash can that is tied to one of the corner posts. Looked NASTY. I wanna get NASTY with Trish. Fairly certain I've said something like that before. Maybe not with Trish though :lmao.

Trish gets her own back by smashing Victoria's face into a trash can... then places it over her face and kicks it. Which like, DOES NOTHING TO VICTORIA :lmao.

IRONING BOARD! :lmao at these weapons. Men have a hardcore match and we get KENDO STICKS AND STEEL CHAIRS. Women have one and it's BROOM STICKS AND IRONING BOARDS :lmao.

Oh wait, A KENDO STICK! Too late I'm afraid. This match is decimating to women already .

VICTORIA IS BLEEDING~! So Trish decides to make it worse by smashing her face some more with trash can lids! Yey!

POWERBOMB TO TRISH~!

CHICK KICK~! Trish kinda misses and just gets Victoria's hands lol, so they re-do the spot . BOTCHED STRATUSFACTION~! Trish is botching left and right here lol. SHE NEEDS PUNISHING~!

Fire extinguisher sprayed in Trish's face followed by a SUPLEX and Victoria wins!

A couple of dodgy spots but overall a fun women's FIGHT with lots of weapon usage .

*Rating: **3/4*
*CAL SCALE - 1*


*Brock Lesnar Vs The Big Show - WWE Championship Match*

:mark:.

Big Show in a WWE title match at SVS? This sounds familiar... oh yeah, I just watched RAW this week and Show gets a WWE title match against Orton at SVS. In 2013 :lmao.

Show is disgruntled at how he's been treated for the last couple of years and determined to prove he's still GOT IT. Lesnar is new, young and THE NEXT BIG THING and wants to prove that he can go up against anyone and beat them. What results is too incredibly motivated BEASTS beating the shit out of each other :mark:.

BACK SUPLEX to Big Show! Didn't get him up too high though, but still impressive! Not as impressive however as the GERMAN SUPLEX, and good god it looks like Show landed on LESNAR'S HEAD. HEAD? OVERHEAD BELLY TO BELLY SUPLEX!!! TO THE FUCKING BIG SHOW!!! :mark: Now THAT is amazingly fucking IMPRESSIVE.

Ref takes a great bump when Lesnar just RUNS HIM THE FUCK OVER. Heyman throws in a chair, Lesnar decks Show and hits the F-5!!! New ref comes down, 1...2.. HEYMAN PULLS THE REFEREE OUT!!! Yep, time for the annual Survivor Series SCREWJOB!!!

:lmao at the look on Heyman's face when Lesnar realises what happened and chases after him.

CHOKESLAM ON THE STEEL CHAIR. 1...2...3 and we got us a NEW Champion! The Big Show becomes the FIRST PERSON to pin Lesnar on TV!!!

:mark: for a 5 minute match or whatever, this was :mark:. Love it.

*Rating: ***1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 2*


*Edge & Rey Mysterio Vs Chris Benoit & Kurt Angle Vs Los Guerreros - WWE Tag Team Championship Elimination Match*

REDGE VS BANGLE VS EDDIE & THAT OTHER GUY!!!

:lmao I love how Eddie and Chavo are trying to start shit in the beginning, pushing everyone around... then both going on the apron to leave the other 2 teams to go at it. Eddie :mark:.

Edge & Rey dominate early on, getting the better of even Angle and Benoit, so Angle decides to tag in CHAVO! Take THAT, Chavo. Time for you to get a beating! 

Eddie and Rey :mark:.

Rey continues to dominate this match to Eddie tags Angle back in! LOL

Holy absolutely SHIT at Rey being thrown in the air by Angle, and Rey trying to land on the ropes and SLIPPING, landing HARD on his head. Ouch!!! Luckily he seems ok for the most part though, but that slip allows Angle and Benoit to gain control of this match!

Love Angle's use of the clotheslines to cut off Rey a couple of times. Looks NASTY every time. Angle falls to the mat when he does it to make it look more vicious and Rey bumps like fuck off it. Bangle working over Rey is :mark:. Match is more "grounded" at this point than their NM match. not in the sense that they roll around on the mat and shit, but they slow things down and don't go nuts with MOVES~!

Rey's actual comeback that allowed him to make a tag to Edge is :mark:. A GREAT counter sequence between him and Angle. Then we have Angle trying to tag one of the Guerrero's since he's closest to them, and they jump off the apron and leave him to suffer!!! Los Guerrero's are working SMART in this one.

SPEAR countered by Angle into a drop toe hold, and lands where Benoit is who applies the Crossface, allowing Angle to lock in the Ankle Lock!!! Rey makes the save and begins to dive around on everyone because he's Rey fucking Mysterio and he can do anything he wants!!!

SUNSET FLIP COMBINED WITH A GERMAN SUPLEX~! That was TOOOOOOOOOO SWEEEEEEEEEEEEEET!!!

:lmao Eddie and Chavo with the LIE, CHEAT AND STEAL antics to cause Benoit and Angle to have problems leading to their elimination is :mark:. Sucks that they get eliminated first, but again shows how SMART Los Guerreros have been in this match so far!

Love the first part of this match. We get a good control segment from BANGLE over Rey, a sweet comeback and then a great finishing stretch that DID feature some finishers, but NOBODY kicked out of anything or escaped submission holds as they were always broken up, keeping the actual moves CREDIBLE still (hey, remember when Angle had credible finishers? ME EITHER 8*D ).

Angle is FUCKED that he and Benoit are eliminated first, and beats the shit out of Edge and Rey before leaving, giving Los Guerreros ANOTHER advantage in this match, to go with the fact that they spent most of the first part of this one on the apron!

Things slow down again as Los Guerreros work over Edge, hoping to get the win asap as he was attacked by Angle. Ok workover segment before Rey gets a hot tag, and having rested on the outside he comes in with a BANG and the pace picks up again :mark:.

Ref is trying to get Edge out of the ring, Rey goes for the WEST COAST POP and Chavo decks him with the tag belts! LASO FROM EL PASO :mark:. LOS GUERREROS WIN!!! EDDIE IS TAG CHAMPS!!!

:mark: oh SVS tag match, how I love you <3. You didn't suck on this watch . This is tremendous fun and a super worked elimination tag match .

*Rating: ****1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 6*


Chris Nowinski and Matt Hardy show up and insult the crowd. HOLLA, IF YA HEAR ME!!! SCOTT FUCKING STEINER!!! HE'S BACK!!! REACTION IS INSANE. HE KILLS THEM BOTH. :mark:


*Triple H Vs Shawn Michaels Vs Chris Jericho Vs Booker T Vs RVD Vs Kane - World Heavyweight Championship Elimination Chamber Match*

The first ever EC match! I love how this SVS kept with tradition with elimination matches, but put a twist on them. 6 man elimination tag tables match, triple threat elimination tag, and now the ELIMINATION Chamber!

HHH and RVD start this thing, with everyone else chilling in their pods. We get to see the uniqueness of the CHAMBER early on, with RVD back dropping HHH over the ropes right onto the steel floor, which is of course level with the ring. He then starts using the ropes to bounce HHH into the steel chain walls of the chamber too. I'm a big fan of the chamber design. I like how they can use the ropes like that, and I love the steel floor being level with the ring too. They can still go outside like in HIAC but it makes it a little different.

And the PODS can also come into play too, with RVD climbing Jericho's pod to try and jump off, but Jericho reaches up and holds onto RVD's leg to stop him!!!

HHH is getting MURDERED by RVD in the first 5 minutes. Bleeding and everything. And he fucking deserves it. FUCK YOU AND YOUR SHITTY 2002.

The first 5 minutes are up, and to NOBODY'S SURPRISE, Jericho is out first! Why nobody's surprise? Because they made it fucking obvious every damn time for like, the first million of these matches. It all depends on their entrances into the match. HBK came out first and was put in a pod first, so he comes out LAST. Jericho was the last person to go into a pod before HHH and RVD started the match, so he came out FIRST. And this would go on for a LONG time in these matches. Yet they kept acting like it was random :lmao.

SPIDER-MAN~!

HHH and Jericho are both HEELS, so despite everything they went through earlier in the year (WM, HIAC...), they work together against RVD because... STUFF!!!

Nice beatdown on RVD, before he makes a cool comeback only to be cut off with a SICK DDT. Oh great, Booker T is in the match. Business is about to go under. I mean... pick up...

SPINAROONIE. Because even in a match this deadly there is ALWAYS time for that. Booker T takes care of the heels, RVD gets back up and then of course the BABYFACES fight each other. Which makes them look fucking stupid compared to the heels. WORK TOGETHER YOU DUMB CUNTS.

RVD goes to the top of a pod again, this time an empty one... and hits a FIVE STAR FROG SPLASH onto the game! Which in actual fact crushes part of HHH's throat when his leg lands across it :lmao. Actual splash looked terrible too. HHH was far too close and RVD could barely move around from that height when he had to come down straight away.

BOOKER T PINS RVD~!

HHH GETS HIS FOOT ON THE ROPES~!

Time for KANE to come out and play! At least when Kane attacks Booker T you can understand it because he's a MONSTER that pretty much hates anyone lol.

JERICHO THROUGH A POD~! Ahhh, I remember when that spot was new and fresh and cool. Will likely only be good again if ROMAN REIGNS gets to SPEAR someone through it. And not the Goldberg spear when he hit the spear, smashed into the pod, didn't break it and had to force Jericho (I think it was him again?) through it :lmao.

:lmao Jericho sells the POD spot by getting up about 20 seconds later, hitting a Lionsault on Booker and pinning him! I'm not complaining though. Booker T is gone :mark:.

HBK!!! WHAT THE FUCK IS HE WEARING AND WHO THE FUCK CUT HIS HAIR?!?! :lmao

KANE gets on a roll, chokeslamming everyone!!! Yet doesn't eliminate a single person :lmao.

Tombstone attempt countered into a SUPERKICK~! Followed by a PEDIGREE~! Followed by a LIONSAULT~! And Kane is eliminated!!!

So far the match has been REALLY good, but urgh, the HHH/Jericho Vs HBK part now is DULL. It goes on forever and neither HHH or Jericho can make their beatdown that interesting.

Finally after a looooong (feel like FOREVER) handicap situation, Jericho and HHH fall apart and try to kill each other.

WALLS OF JERICHO~! SUPERKICK~! JERICHO IS ELIMINATED~!

Now we are down to HHH and HBK. Urgh . HBK THROUGH A POD~!

SUPERKICK~! BLOCKED~! PEDIGREE~! KICKOUT!!!! KICKOUT!!!! KICKOUT!!!

PEDIGREE~! COUNTERED~! SUPERKICK!!! SUPERKICK!!! NEW WORLD HEAVYWEIGHT CHAMPION!!! SHAWN MICHAELS IS THE WORLD HEAVYWEIGHT CHAMPION!!!

:mark: so aside from the DULL portion towards the end with HHH, Jericho and HBK, this is still great. Still consider the 05 match to be BETTER, but this is still currently #2, though one day I would like to watch all of them and rank them for the first time ever lol.

*Rating: *****
*CAL SCALE - 5*



*Overall CAL SCALE - 20*​


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

Alim said:


> It pisses me off how disrespected and unappreciated Big Show is around here. Not in this thread of course but the website in general.


I totally understand why everyone hates him. I know he is a good wrestler but I really don't want to see him on my TV. I have tickets for Survivor Series and I want to sell them and the main reason for wanting to sell them is that he's in he main event. 

I don't care that he had a great match with Sheamus almost a year ago or that he had a series of above average matches with Mark Henry. I don't want to watch him wrestle or see him on TV. I'm almost to the point of changing the channel when I see him.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

TaylorFitz said:


> I totally understand why everyone hates him. I know he is a good wrestler but I really don't want to see him on my TV. I have tickets for Survivor Series and I want to sell them and the main reason for wanting to sell them is that he's in he main event.
> 
> I don't care that he had a great match with Sheamus almost a year ago or that he had a series of above average matches with Mark Henry. I don't want to watch him wrestle or see him on TV. I'm almost to the point of changing the channel when I see him.



:lmao tell us how you really feel.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Me does NOT want Orton/Show. At fucking all.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Continuing the taker project :mark:, having a blast with it 

Might watch a random PPV after this


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

How many PPVs can boast like Survivor Series 2002 in saying it has ZERO bad matches?

I guess some could argue XIX.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

PGSucks said:


> Gonna upload unk6 vs. :cena4 from RAW this year in HD on Dailymotion tonight or tomorrow in case anyone's interested


Fucking awesome match that was. I don't think many will disagree that Cena and Punk just have great chemistry. They've had quite a few matches, and I've really liked just about each of them. 

The Raw one, their match at MITB, and their match at NOC are my favorites.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

haribo said:


> How many PPVs can boast like Survivor Series 2002 in saying it has ZERO bad matches?
> 
> I guess some could argue XIX.




02 was an amazing year for ppvs and wwe in general. Some could argue WM was one of the worst ppvs of the year :lmao 

No way out 
Royal rumble 
Summerslam (GOAT SS) 
Survivor Series 

All :mark


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Nah 19 wasn't perfect, not a fan of the divas match there, but maybe RR 01, but I haven't seen the divas match there so IDK

And yeah 2002 was a great year to review all PPVS from, I highly recommend that as a project in the future


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

What did No Way Out 2002 have that was good?


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> What did No Way Out 2002 have that was good?




The GOAT stable returning of course was enough for me


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

And I mis read harible my bad. I thought you meant 18. 

As far as a card not having a bad match, it's easily Summerslam 02 for me. 

Angle/Mysterio ****
Jericho/Flair **3/4
RVD/Beniot ****1/4
Edge/Eddie ***3/4
Booker T/Gdust vs Christian/Storm ***
Test/Taker **3/4
HBK/ HHH ****1/2
Brock/Rock ****


Nothing touches this for me as far as match quality goes..... NOTHING.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

OK, I'm almost done my first PPV review project. Gonna post it here shortly. Its long, I won't lie, but its thorough. Hopefully you'll give it a read.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Undertaker project post #5 *​
*Match #1: Kane vs the Undertaker ( WM 14)
*
I was just a kid living about 10 miles outside of Boston at the time of this show, wish I was older than like 2 or 3 at the time . Now I live in a city with no wrestling fans, go figure :lol. Pete Rose is out and heels it up talking about the curse of the bambino which was alive and well at the time (2004!), funny stuff. He then gets Tombstoned which calls for a BIG pop for the Boston crowd. This is in my mind the best taker/Kane match I’ve seen, and its different from the NOC match in a good way because both men could definitely do more in the ring, as they were both basically in the prime of their careers. Anyways, FUN match, is definitely worth a watch for everyone, don’t be put off by the fact that they have had bad matches since this. ****

*Match#2: The Undertaker and Team Hell no vs the Shield( RAW 4-22-13)
*
I haven’t seen this since it originally aired, so I’m pretty excited to watch it again. Wasn’t this in London? Because the crowd is MAD here, so over that the shield actually gets met with boos, don’t see that too often. I honestly miss when the shield were the next big thing and every match they had was met with suspicion as to whether their streak might end, I personally thought it was going to end and taker was gonna win via tombstone. Yes another fun match here, crowd is hot for this and all 6 guys are mad over. Taker doesn’t do much unfortunately but when he is in it is :mark: worthy. Most of you have seen this but Its still fun on the rewatch. ***3/4 

*Match #3: RVD vs the Undertaker (Vengeance 2001)*

This is another match I’ve wanted to see, but it always seemed to get lost in the shuffle for me. I remember people saying this match was awesome, so because of those assertions, I’m expecting a fun match. Man, this match is fucking brutal, just an all out hardcore war from both men. This is a real hardcore title bout, unlike some of the shitty fights we had in the future and past where there was no weapon use, I’m looking at Steven Richards vs Booker T . This was definitely a fun match worth seeing, and the Undertaker is inching closer and closer to my #2 all-time wrestler list. Let’s see if he can beat out Bret Hart for #2, because no one’s beating Ric Flair. ***3/4 

*Match #4: The Rock vs The undertaker (RAW 10/5/98) 
*
I’d be lying if I said that I didn’t go into this match with low exectations, even though it was recommended to me. I just don’t like a ton of the rocks matches, but for some reason I have faith here. This was decent, but nothing more than that TBH. It was an above average match for TV but I still enjoyed it. If this had been a little longer it might have gotten a little boring but it was good for 10- 15 min. I still walked away saying “meh”, and nothing more. ***1/4 

I need some suggestions for a PPV to review, thinking some RA era, it would need to be on YT or DM however


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

ATF said:


> Me does NOT want Orton/Show. At fucking all.


I agree to an extent, but the only positive I have is that if they're not gonna give us a Corporation vs. Team Bryan elimination match, this is probably the next best choice storyline wise. I think just about everyone was tired of Orton vs. Bryan in singles matches and at least this is something fresh. I believe their match earlier this year at Extreme Rules was their first ever PPV meeting (not that it was anything special), so I won't jump to hasty conclusions yet.

I do however think this will be the best case for Orton FINALLY realizing he's heel and wrestling that way. He brought out portions of it in the HIAC match but he really needs to turn it up a notch here if anyone's gonna care about him. If not, Triple H is just gonna overshadow him forever in this storyline.

I have a strange curiosity for the match tbh. I think it could be fun and enjoyable if booked the right way. Having Big Show fend off the Shield and/or Kane until getting caught with an RKO could be a good chaotic finish.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Don't get the hate for Show/Orton match-ups at all. I'm excited about SVS.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Don't get the hate for Show/Orton match-ups at all. I'm excited about SVS.



It honestly isn't a main event worthy match for one of your considered "big 4" ppvs. Or is survivor series even a big 4 anymore? I don't hate it, but I feel they should have done HHH/Show here. They're dragging out the show storyline too long imo. Throw Orton in a classic 5 on 5 survivor series match with with Wyatts against Punk, Bryan and 3 others.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

I’m going to try and do a series of reviews of random PPVs I’ve never seen. I just think of something off the top of my head, pick a year and month and do a review of a PPV that happened. I got much amusement out of picking something this way as I ended up with something relatively forgotten that I am totally unfamiliar with.

Prepare to be sports entertained by…


*Bash at the Beach 1995*

Taking place from Huntington Beach, California (home of Tito Ortiz), we have Bash at the Beach (from now on, I’m shortening it to BaTB). This was the only time WCW did the event literally on a beach, with the whole event being outdoors. Looked pretty good. The audience was quite large, but there didn’t appear to be any seats, so I’m wondering if this was done Road Wild style where they just let people in and made no money on a live gate. The event was brought to us by Slim Jim, which gave us a classic Randy Savage promo where he shilled Slim Jims. I can’t complain, most of the time product pushing is retarded but Savage made this work, god bless him.

Heenan and Schiavone are our commentators. Brain claims Vader is going to end Hulkamania. But that’s later on.


Match 1: Meng vs Sting (c) for the US title

They air a video package on Meng before the match. I’ve always been a Meng fan. He just looked like a guy you really didn’t want to meet in a dark alley, and that aura he had helped him a lot. The package had a classic feel to it. The voice over referred to Meng as a “One Man Shield of Steel.” It also indicates that he was brought up to protect the Emperors of the Far East, which I was unaware of. He is also a master of 9 martial arts, apparently. The announcer then reveals that the fight will continue until the breathing stops when he’s involved. So in other words, Meng would be a good candidate for Thunderdome. 

They then shoot to the back where Mean Gene is interviewing Sting. At this point you could hear that the echo of voices over the loud speaker, which means that every promo was being broadcast to the audience as well. The echo was annoying, I have to say, but I tried to ignore it. Stinger puts Meng over as a bad ass, and then goes to say Meng knows 7 different forms of martial arts. I guess nobody showed Sting the video package. But that’s OK, because Sting himself knows 7 different forms of crazy and he’s got home field advantage. Pretty good promo by Sting, hyped the match pretty well and he seemed genuinely enthused and pumped to be taking on Meng.

Onto the match itself. Meng comes down to the ring with Col. Parker. Schiavone indicates that Sting and Meng fought at Great American Bash for the vacant US title. Sting won and this is his first defense. Good home crowd reaction for Sting. Schiavone claims there are hundreds of thousands of people in attendance on the beach, which I called bullshit on (turns out, according to Wikipedia, there was about 9,500 in attendance, so not even a tenth of that). Michael Buffer was doing ring intros, which was nice. He really brings that extra special something, so I approved. Randy Anderson was the ref.

The match starts with Schiavone getting in his obligatory plug that WCW is #1. Starts really slow with Sting and Meng trading blows and then backing off. Meng gets the advantage by choking Sting in the corner, which are identified by Schiavone as nerve holds. Sting bounces back with a clothesline, but it fails to knock Meng over and instead causes him to roar like a maniac, pushing that he’s this monster. I thought Sting’s facials did a good job selling that he was worried about just how tough Meng was. Anyway, Meng goes for a splash off the second rope and misses. Sting teases the Scorpion Deathlock, and actually locks it in, but let’s go when Col. Parker gets on the apron. Meng no sells and kicks Sting in the back as he’s telling Parker to get lost. Meng goes to give Sting a suplex from the apron into the ring and almost kills Sting by dropping him on his head. 

Meng starts applying rest holds, including an abdominal stretch. Meng goes for a sunset flip but Sting gives him a Senton. Meng powers back and locks in a modified Boston Crab, which Brain refers to as “just a crab”, since it was different. Meng then just suddenly let’s go and plays to the crowd which I was puzzled by, since the match clearly wasn’t over. Sting makes his comeback with 3 clotheslines, a Hurricanrana and a cross body off the second rope. Sting then goes for a Stinger Splash but Meng gets his legs up really high and nails Sting right in the chest in mid air, which I thought looked good. 

Then the finish…this finish…Meng whips Sting into the ropes and tries to give him a side kick. Sting ducks and hits a school boy, which looked terrible. Meng kicks out at 2 and a half but the ref counts 3 anyway and the match is over. Really ugly looking finish. While I love Meng, he’s the type of guy who benefits a lot from plunder, I find. Sting is a good worker and he tried, but this match was pretty dull. Having to work with Meng really slowed the pace down and the finish looked dreadful. After the match, Meng attacks Sting and Road Warrior Hawk makes the save, helping Sting to the back. Then in typical WCW fashion, they replay the finish just in case you didn’t see how bad it was, except this time they played it from a different angle, which made it look even crappier, somehow.

Overall rating: *1/2

We go to the back and Mean Gene is with Jimmy Hart…and Renegade, and I got excited. Whenever we get to see Renegade wrestle, I put aside all distractions and give it my undivided attention. Hart claims when you pick up any wrestling magazine in the country, they’re all talking about the Renegade taking on Mr. Wonderful, which sounds suspicious. Renegade cut an incoherent promo, doing his best Warrior impression…its really sad that they not only ripped off the Warrior character in the first place, but that they got this guy to play him. This was the best they could do? I have a hard time believing that. 


Match 2: Mr. Wonderful Paul Orndorff vs Renegade (c) for the TV title

Orndorff looked disgustingly ripped. The announcers state that Orndorff won the Slim Jim Challenge on WCW Saturday Night to get this title shot. They also state that Orndorff was expecting to fight Arn Anderson, the former TV champion, for the title but Renegade scored a big upset by beating Arn at Great American Bash. Yes, you heard that right-they had Arn Anderson job to this fucking guy AND drop a title to him. Heenan also notes that Renegade also managed to beat Stunning Steve Austin…quite the push this guy was getting. Renegade’s physique was also extremely chiseled. It would seem that certain substances were quite available in the locker room.

Renegade’s offense looked abysmal. He clotheslined Orndorff over the top rope. The thing is that because they were on the beach and thus on flat ground, they had to elevate the ring on a platform so the audience could see. This clothesline knocked Orndorff over the top and he fell off the platform onto his head, which looked like it hurt a lot. Granted it was only like a two foot drop but any time the terms ‘drop’ and ‘head’ are used in close proximity, its never a good thing. 

2 minutes in, Renegade is already going for a rest hold in the form of a head lock. Wonderful sends Renegade into the ropes and Renegade…attempts a shoulder block but instead just shoves him. Renegade then hits an absolutely terrible looking dropkick, and Schiavone acknowledges that “he tried a dropkick, but only managed to kick him in the gut.” Orndorff then gets the heat by tossing sand in Renegade’s eyes. 

Even Renegade’s selling was hideous. Orndorff hits him with a clothesline and Renegade just kind of lies down. The crowd was dead except for a small section of fans chanting for Orndorff (the heel). Orndorff tries to go for a piledriver but Renegade counters with a back body drop, followed up by 2 more bad looking dropkicks. I swear, they looked like Renegade just jumped up, threw his legs out in the direction of his opponent and hoped to god they hit. Awful. ZERO heat for Renegade’s big comeback. 

Orndorff tries for a vertical suplex. Renegade counters, hits a back suplex and pins Orndorff cleanly, and totally out of the blue. A few fans boo, most don’t care. Orndorff argues that his arm was up, both Schiavone and Heenan are confused. Two matches, two bad finishes. Afterwards, Orndorff attacks Renegade from behind and the fans CHEER. Let me reiterate-Orndorff is the heel, folks. And he’s getting babyface reactions. Then Orndorff teases the piledriver and the fans gets a pop, and an even louder one once he actually hits it. Orndorff starts arguing with the ref again and Renegade sits up like Undertaker, no selling the piledriver, and gets on the top rope and hits an atrocious looking…I want to say cross body but that involves you turning perpendicular to your opponent. Renegade just dived and collided with Orndorff, and it looked like his elbow smacked Orndorff in the temple, which had to have hurt. Meantime, the fans are booing at this BABYFACE comeback. Orndorff figures “fuck this, I have my pride” and rolls out of the ring and poses, causing the fans to cheer again. Nobody gave two shits about Renegade. Then they replay the finish from another angle, and it turns out Orndorff got his right arm up, but Nick Patrick was at a bad angle and didn’t see when counting the 3. So now in the first two matches, we’ve not only had 2 terrible finishes, but we’ve also had 2 instant replays from different angles that made those finishes look even worse. And on top of that, the HEEL got screwed by the referee in this one…This match is quite possibly one of the worst matches I’ve ever seen, but my god was it funny. Its worth checking out for the hilarity, but not if you want a decent match.

Overall rating: -*1/2

We get a video showing Kevin Sullivan talking about ending Hulkamania and starting the Dungeon of Doom (oh boy!). Sullivan asks his father, The Master (Curtis Iaukea) for a warrior to help him end Hulkamania. Iaukea obliges and presents him with…KAMALA, the Ugandan giant. The video was totally campy and hokey, and yet entertaining.

Mean Gene interviews Hacksaw Jim Duggan for his upcoming match. It was basically like any Duggan promo he usually cuts. He waved his 2x4 around, said NO MORE MR. NICE GUY, said, HOOOO…yeah. I thought it was OK, and the level of passion guys put into their promos back then is something to be admired. Today is a far cry from that. However cheesy they might be, I still enjoy these older promos because of the over dramatization and theatrics. They stick with me far more than some meaningless promo by someone like Fandango where he says nothing in a forgettable tone. I would at least remember this promo from Duggan. 

It was at this point that I’d realized that every time they mentioned the name of the PPV, they called it Slim Jim’s Bash at the Beach. I was starting to get annoyed by it.


Match 3: Kamala vs Jim Duggan

The commentators kept stopping in the middle of their commentary whenever the camera panned to a woman in a bikini in the crowd…I guess to indicate that they were distracted by tits. I wouldn’t be so disturbed by this if Schiavone wasn’t just a generally creepy guy and Heenan wasn’t in his 50s (meantime the girls looked like they were about 30 odd years younger).

Heenan says during Duggan’s entrance “well don’t get into that ring to anticipate wrestling, you get in that ring to fight.” Kind of subtly hinting that this match is going to suck. A ton of stalling at the beginning. We see the most basic of offense from both men, with nothing but chops, kicks and punches, all of which looked like they winded Kamala. Not even 2 minutes in, Kamala gets Duggan in a bear hug which looked bad and felt like it lasted 45 minutes. Duggan bites Kamala in the corner and both guys are falling onto each other. They looked totally gassed. Duggan then scoop slams Kamala for, I swear to god, the only actual wrestling move of the match. Then Sullivan gets on the apron and Duggan tries to grab him while the ref gets in between them.

Now, let me just explain something. What is the purpose of a run in? To help out your friend who is in trouble. However, its against the rules, so you obviously want to do it in a way that the ref won’t be alerted to you being there. Otherwise, it’s a DQ and your friend loses. Sounds simple. With that said, we get a run in from another Dungeon of Doom member, Zodiac (Ed Leslie). With the ref trying to untangle Duggan and Sullivan, Zodiac hops in the ring, carrying…something…and like the master of stealth that he is, decides to LET OUT A YELL as he whacks Duggan in the back of the head. Lesson learned-want to help out your buddy, but not let the referee know you’re there? MAKE UNNECESSARY NOISE! I’m sure that’ll help the ref NOT figure out something is going on behind him. Idiot.

Anyway, Duggan takes the pin while selling the attack. The replay shows Zodiac had hit Duggan with Kamala’s mask, so that was the mysterious object. Then Schiavone and Heenan bicker over giving cues to talk to one another. This match was short, but it was shitty and boring.

Overall Rating: -*

They air a video plugging a PPV WCW and NJPW had called Collision in Korea, where Ric Flair took on Antonio Inoki. I was confused because they said the event had already happened, and it was available on video cassette, but Schiavone said it was their next PPV. Turns out it happened in April but was being put on PPV in August (even though it was available on video and the results were out already, I’m sure. But I digress). Schiavone claims 300,000 fans showed up, which…actually was true. I’m so used to hyperbole in pro wrestling but upon double checking the facts, Collision in Korea drew 340,000 people and still holds the record for largest attendance at a wrestling event. So Schiavone actually under stated the real number, which you almost never hear in wrestling.

Then Heenan claimed if anyone could get the US and Korea to get along, it was WCW, and that he should go over and negotiate. Ah, right back to the usual pro wrestling exaggeration I’m used to.

We go to the back. Mean Gene is with Macho Man, which made me mark because that meant we’d be getting a Macho Man promo. They talked about Savage’s upcoming Lifeguard match later that night with Flair. No idea what a Lifeguard match is, but Savage’s promo was excellent, naturally, and made me want to see it, regardless. He said he didn’t care who, what or what type of animal the lifeguards are, but that its all about emotion, family and survival. He finishes by saying “the Macho Man is lookin’ at ya, zeroin’ in on ya and I’m gonna get ya, YEAH!” Just a terrific promo all around.

Next we get a video package promoting Diamond Dallas Page vs Dave Sullivan. Apparently DDP was holding arm wrestling contests, where whoever beat Page would get a date with the Diamond Doll (Kimberly). Dave Sullivan ended up challenging him but come match day, DDP was hurt and couldn’t arm wrestle. Then DDP won 13 million dollars and started blowing all of his money. Meantime, Sullivan was injured by Ric Flair and Kimberly gave him a get well gift-Ralph the Rabbit. Sullivan then started training hard and sending Kimberly gifts of his own. DDP got rattled by this and challenged anyone to stop him. Well, Sullivan was healed and they had an arm wrestling contest…Sullivan won by upset. DDP blamed Kimberly. So the day of the big date arrived. Halfway through the meal, a guy in a bunny suit showed up at their table and gave Sullivan a note. Kimberly read it and sat back aghast. The note said “Roses are red, violets are blue. Diamond Dallas says enjoy the rabbit stew.” Sullivan freaks out and starts screaming “RALPH!” So we’re led to believe that DDP served them Sullivan’s pet rabbit…which actually means that, surprisingly, Bossman chopping up Pepper and serving him to Al Snow in 1999 was NOT an original angle. Interesting.


Match 4: DDP (with Kimberly and Max Muscle) vs Dave Sullivan

Max Muscle was looking pretty ridiculous, in terms of physique. A little kid dressed in Hogan colors delivers some flowers to Kimberly. DDP gets pissed and waves them in her face, generally being a jerk. I had to hand it to DDP, he was playing a great heel and the seeds had already been sewn for the eventual split between him and Kimberly. 

Sullivan enters the ring, attacks DDP from behind while he’s yelling at Kimberly and shoves the roses into his mouth, which got a pop. The first few minutes are Sullivan kicking Page’s ass, but his infatuation with Kimberly is too much and when he leans over to talk to her, DDP capitalizes to gain the advantage. Sullivan eventually makes a comeback with a clothesline and goes for his inverted bear hug, but Max Muscle gets on the apron. Sullivan punches him off but the distraction is enough, as Page hits the Diamond Cutter and gets the win. Afterward, DDP grabs Kimberly and hauls her off, telling her not to talk to Sullivan. Nothing special, they only went about 4 minutes but it was still the best thing on the show up until this point.

Overall rating: **1/4

Once again, we go to the back. Mean Gene is with the Nasty Boys. Pretty content-less promo that just involved them shouting, but saying nothing of real value, I felt. Wasn’t that great. We then get a video promoting the triple threat tag match between the Nasty Boys, the Blue Bloods and Harlem Heat. They show Regal getting his mouth shoved into Brian Knobbs’s armpit, which made me queasy. Then Mean Gene is back with Harlem Heat and Sister Sherri, this time. Sherri cuts a promo calling the Nasty Boys the “Nasty Girls”. Promo was pretty good. Booker was next and said, and I quote, “its on like a steaming pot of neck bones cooking for about 3 days, man.” The way he started the sentence in a much gruffer voice and then tapered off toward the end, combined with how he avoided eye contact with the camera after he was done indicated to me that he was clearly embarrassed and knew what he said made absolutely no sense.

They then show a vignette with the Blue Bloods. Regal and Eaton are in suits, with Regal talking about how the Queen told them to find out what the town is all about, and that he’d heard it was the most dreadful, disgusting town in America. He also says that they need to find Sir Lawrence Olivier’s stone on the Walk of Fame and stop Americans from trampling over it. He then conveys his disgust that they couldn’t be provided with a Rolls Royce and instead were given one of these “American Limou-sines” and calls it a gaudy white thing. Then they’re at the corner of Sunset Blvd. and Courtney so Regal could show Eaton Grant’s tomb. So Regal unveils it. Eaton is confused, expecting that it was General Grant’s tomb. Regal clarifies and says “no, HUGH Grant, the dirty, filthy philanderer. This is where he got caught with that filthy, disgusting lady. And to think he was on our Oxford rugby team. Absolutely shameful.” Eaton then expresses interest in hiring a hooker and Regal ushers him away to avoid embarrassment. Next, they’re outside the Viper Room where River Phoenix overdosed. Regal claims he’s spent many nights tossing and turning about that. He shudders and they leave. Next, they’re outside Nicole Simpson’s house and Regal is disgusted with how people are driving by gawking like it’s a circus show and that it shows Americans don’t know how to behave themselves. Then they’re outside a strip club. Regal looks inside and asks “is that a whip?” Finally they get to Lawrence Olivier’s stone and Regal is appalled that its in this “decadent and debaucherous, filthy and disgusting town,” and that only an American would put it here. Then a random guy tries to walk over it and Regal shoves the guy out of the way. Lastly, they’re at Reggie’s pub. Regal is ranting about how awful Hollywood is and suggests they drink some ale, play some darts and try to forget about the whole affair.

I can’t express in words just how amazing Regal was in these videos. You absolutely must check them out. This and the Macho Man promo are the clear standouts so far.


Match 5: the Blue Bloods (Lord Steven Regal and Earl Robert Eaton) vs Harlem Heat (Booker T and Stevie Ray) (c) vs the Nasty Boys (Bryan Knobbs and Jerry Saggs) for the Tag titles

Regal and Eaton were awesome during their entrance, being British snobs. The Nasty Boys are introduced as being “as nasty as they want to be.” The announcers are really pushing how novel this match is since the champions can lose the titles and not even be pinned. They then show a pale nerdy white guy with a Zubaz hat and glasses grooving to Harlem Heat’s music, which I was amused by. They do a 3 way coin toss and the Blue Bloods are on the outside first, with the Nasty Boys and Harlem Heat starting (oh joy). Schiavone claimed this is a historic day for WCW. I disagreed. He then once more plugs WCW as the #1 wrestling organization in the world. Then all participants just start brawling, rendering the coin toss irrelevant. Heenan and Schiavone have no clue who’s legal. We get to see Regal given the “pit stop” as Knobbs shoved Regal’s mouth into Sagg’s armpit. Second time I’ve seen this on this show so far, and I felt nauseated both times. Heenan says the Nasty Boys are great to have at picnics because they keep the flies off the food. They then give the pit stop to Eaton. Three times, three feelings of sickness. Booker shockingly did a full 360 bump off a Knobbs clothesline, which Schiavone clarifies was an armpit clothesline…I have no idea why the Nasty Boys’ armpits were receiving so much attention. 

It became apparent that the only reason for Heenan being at ring side at all in this match was to crack jokes, specifically about the Nasty Boys being gross. The Blue Bloods gets the heat on Booker, but Knobbs tags in. Soon after Regal tags back in. Regal was so great in this match, he back hands Booker in the corner and just trash talks him. Awesome. Then after delivering a series of European Uppercuts, he goes over to tag in Saggs, but instead of tagging him, uses one finger to tap Saggs’ hand and recoils in disgust, showing that he wanted as little of him to be in contact with Saggs as possible because he was so vile. 

Heenan has no idea what’s going on and says so. I noticed that whenever Regal gets into the ring or walks around, he has one arm behind his back to indicate he’s upper class. Regal gets tagged back in, pounds on Booker a bit, then slaps Knobbs’ hand to tag him in and immediately wipes his hand off from any Nasty Boy filth. Again, Regal was just stellar with his in ring mannerisms. Heenan claims if the Blue Bloods win, the Queen will throw them a huge celebration. 

Regal locks in what would eventually become the Regal Stretch, but Saggs breaks it up. Regal goes for a sunset flip but Knobbs sits on him, allowing him to get a tag in to Saggs. Everyone just starts brawling. Eaton and Stevie get knocked outside. Knobbs back body drops Regal, and then Saggs back body drops Booker ONTO Regal. Knobbs splashes both and then Saggs sits on both, particularly Booker’s head and gets the pin. However, as it turns out, since Booker was on top of Regal first, the ref counted Booker pinning Regal, and not Saggs pinning both, so Harlem Heat retain. Dumb finish that was unnecessarily complicated, which even Heenan acknowledges. There was little storytelling or pacing, it was mainly just brawling and punching and the only real wrestling came from the Blue Bloods, and unfortunately there was very little.

Overall rating: *1/2 (all of which are for Regal’s work, without him the match is a DUD)

Mean Gene interviews Harlem Heat right after. They basically just say they’ll defend the titles against anybody. 

Next up, Schiavone explains that the Lifeguard match is basically a Lumberjack match, but since its on the beach, they’re calling it something else. Mean Gene next interviews Ric Flair. He says that Elizabeth left Savage because she had to get with the Nature Boy, just like all the Baywatch girls broke down and did the same thing. Gene asks if Liz went to Space Mountain and Flair grins and says “YOU KNOW SHE DID, BABY!” Then he says last night on national TV, he brought out all the women he’s fucked (aka the Space Mountainettes) to point out to Savage that he has 3 things to remember-1) he swept Elizabeth off her feet in her finest hour, 2) he jack-slapped Savage’s father because he got in his way and 3) there’s only 1 limousine ridin’, jet flyin’, kiss stealin’, wheelin’, dealin’ son of a gun that’s kissed ALL the girls and made them cry. And tonight, he’s gonna drive the fans wild one more time. Unsurprisingly, it was a terrific promo by Ric Flair.

Then some Baywatch babes in swimsuits are brought out to ringside and Heenan is basically foaming at the mouth. This was to cross promote an episode of Baywatch WCW was guest starring in (specifically, Flair, Vader, Hogan and Savage). 


Match 6: Ric Flair vs Randy Savage in a Lifeguard match

Flair comes out and is wearing the most insane looking pink robe. Savage hugs his dad, Angelo, on his way down to the ring. He also has a bunch of Slim Jims in his pocket and when in the ring, he starts tossing them out to the crowd. They show a few of the Lifeguards, who include the Nasty Boys, Harlem Heat, DDP, Dave Sullivan, Jim Duggan, Johnny B. Badd, Dirty Dick Slater, Bunkhouse Buck and…Arn Anderson. Schiavone again says that WCW is where the big boys play. Savage starts out by just waylaying Flair with punches. He mounts the turnbuckle to continue punching Flair but Ric counters with an atomic drop. Flair tries to suplex Savage into the ring from the apron but Macho Man counters and suplexes Ric outside in probably the safest I’ve ever seen that spot delivered. Now WCW had this rule at the time thanks to Bill Watts that you couldn’t go over the top rope. Heenan identifies this. Schiavone says it wasn’t a deliberate toss over the top rope. Heenan asks him if it wasn’t, then what it was, but naturally, the match continues. 

Flair gets Savage in a sleeper, but Savage counters by running into the corner and ducking so Flair’s head smacks into the turnbuckle. This leads to a Flair flop, which I always love seeing. But Flair counters again and tosses Savage over the top rope. I dunno if it was just the camera angle but Savage looked like he missed the padded platform on the outside and landed straight on the ground (the fact that you heard an audible thud lends credence to my theory). It looked quite painful. 

Flair goes for a double axe handle onto Savage, who is leaning on the ropes at this point, but misses and smacks his jaw, which he starts selling. But it was apparently a trick as when Savage applies his own Sleeper, Flair picks him up and drops him on his leg to soften him up for the Figure 4. Flair continues working on the leg. Heenan says that Savage and his dad can now share a cane, since they both have bad legs. Flair puts the Figure 4 on, but Savage eventually reverses it. Savage then hits a back body drop and double axe handle off the top rope, but Arn Anderson gets on the apron. Brian Knobbs also gets on the apron to tell the ref about Anderson, but this distracts the ref. Arn tries to help Flair but Savage decks him. However, Flair then gets in a thumb to the eye. He runs at Savage but Savage back body drops him over the top rope. While the ref is busy instructing the Lifeguards to get Flair back in the ring, Arn again interferes and hits a DDT on Savage, but he kicks out when Flair attempts a pin. Flair goes to the top rope but takes his bump down from Savage. Savage then hits a double axe handle, a scoop slam and finally hits his elbow drop for the victory. The babyfaces come in to celebrate and the Nasty Boys grab Flair by his ankles and try to pull him into the center of the ring while Flair desperately hangs onto the bottom rope, but he escapes. Not quite the level of their WM8 match, but above average. And when compared to anything else on this card, it may as well be Misawa vs Kobashi.

Overall rating: ***

We get a video for Vader’s Roadkill Tour, which shows Vader kicking ass in all sorts of different cities. Then Mean Gene is with Vader, who is just going crazy, asking what time it is. He says he grew up surviving on the mean streets of inner city LA and is going to kick Hogan’s ass back to Hollywood. He finishes by saying the Roadkill Tour is at an end and he’s gonna show Hogan what Vader time is all about. He also said “brother” quite a bit in this promo, maybe trying to imitate the Hulkster? Heenan asks if they have any chalk so they can draw an outline around Hogan’s body when Vader murders him. Then he and Schiavone bicker.

We get another plug for Collision in Korea. Then Mean Gene interviews Jimmy Hart, Hogan and their special guest, Dennis Rodman, all decked out in red and yellow. Man, was Rodman involved in a ton of stuff with WCW. Hogan says he and Rod the Bod (yeah, he called him that) were riding Harleys up the Pacific Coast Highway looking for someone’s ass to kick. Then Rodman reaches over and wipes Hogan’s mouth for some inexplicable reason. Hogan looks at him and tells him “take it easy, big man!” It looked really fucking weird. Then Hogan says he’s gonna toss Vader into the ocean where sharks will eat him. He reveals he enlisted the help of Rod the Bod to be the ‘big brother’ on the outside to prevent anyone from getting in the cage to interfere (oh yeah, this is a cage match). Rodman says something incoherent about Vader, and Hulk translates that if anyone tries to get in, Rod the Bod is gonna give them a ‘floory doory’ on the side of the cage (not making this up). Sorry, but I just can’t buy Rodman as a face.


Match 7: Hulk Hogan (c) with Dennis Rodman and Jimmy Hart vs Vader for the WCW title in a steel cage match

Hogan comes out with the Baywatch babes again. Instead of going in the door like Vader, he climbs up the cage and over to get into the ring. This cage was SIGNIFICANTLY smaller than any cage used today. It looked like…8 feet tall, tops, whereas now they use 15. Hogan is about 6’7 and this cage seemed about a foot taller than him when he was up against it. 

Hogan attacks Vader right away and starts strangling him with his shirt. Hogan runs Vader’s head into his weird get up thing that he wore to the ring (it looks sort of like Darth Vader’s mask welded onto a set of the Road Warriors’ shoulder pads). Then Hogan puts it on and starts taunting Vader. He gives Vader some headbutts and Vader starts selling. Vader gets the heat back, though, with an Irish whip reversal and 2 Vader Bombs. Vader just starts dominating with a suplex and running Hogan’s head into the cage. Hogan tries picking Vader up but can’t, to which Heenan says if you want to pick Vader up, you’ll have to call AAA. 

Then in a spot I’m always confused by, Vader gets to the top rope and can easily exit over the cage, but instead attempts a Senton onto Hogan, but misses. Hogan starts making a comeback, but is stopped when he tries to pick up Vader and Vader falls over onto him into a pin that Hogan kicks out of. Vader puts Hogan in a sleeper but Hogan starts making another comeback. He finally slams Vader, but hurts his back. Vader hits a splash off the second rope but Hogan kicks out and starts Hulking up. He hits a big boot but Vader doesn’t go down. He tries again but hits this terrible looking big boot that manages to hit Vader in the gut instead of the head, but Vader goes down this time. 

Zodiac and Taskmaster run down to try and get in the cage, but Rodman runs Zodiac’s head into the cage (which I approve of, since I hate Ed Leslie) and runs them off with a chair. Hogan hits a leg drop, plays to the crowd for a bit, hits another leg drop…and plays to the crowd some more, before trying to climb out of the cage. Vader pulls him back in, but Hogan punches him a few times and he falls in between the cage and ropes, before finally hitting the mat. Hogan climbs out and wins. Not a very good match. Yeah, Hogan sucks and did virtually nothing. I felt bad for Vader because with the right guy he can actually go, but Hogan opposite him, this match was slow and boring. 

Overall rating: *1/2


Afterwards, Flair runs in and berates Vader for losing. The commentators think they’re off the air, and Schiavone is congratulating Brain on a good cast. Then he starts mentioning “oh yeah, Flair’s in the ring. Wonder what he’s doing?” Then he realizes they’re still on the air and starts apologizing. Horrible. Vader gets pissed and grabs Flair, but Arn attacks Vader from behind and both escape, while Ric taunts Vader. Heenan doesn’t care and encourages Schiavone to leave already. Vader challenges Flair and Arn to a match, and then leaves.

In all, not a good PPV. This was a dark period for wrestling in general. There were tons of lame finishes, the action was overall really boring and nothing felt hot. There were some cool parts, but more because they appeal to the educated fans. I never need to see this PPV again and it certainly is NOT a classic. It was actually very forgettable and a lot of it wasn’t very well done.

PPV rating: 1/10



Yikes...yeah, sorry for the length. I got pretty into it.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Nice review man, but curious why you made several posts instead of one big one? 

Gonna review an absolutely horrid PPV, guess I'll do a universally hated one in the RR 2013!


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> Nice review man, but curious why you made several posts instead of one big one?
> 
> Gonna review an absolutely horrid PPV, guess I'll do a universally hated one in the RR 2013!


I figured that it might make it easier to read, since it was so long. Plus, one single post would take up so much damn room. This way, someone can read a bit, maybe go to the bathroom, then come back and start at the next post.

If its easier to read all in one post, I'll do it that way from now on. Just trying to make things easier.

The 2013 Rumble isn't really that bad...2012 was way worse, I thought. The lack of star power in that Rumble is shocking.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Also can someone show me that Cal scale again? Maybe I can give the final rating for Bash at the Beach 1995 using that.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I personally thought the 2012 rumble was worse, but the event as a whole was worse in 2013

Well, you can always use a spoiler tag my friend 



Spoiler: cal scale



NO = -1
DUD-* = 0
*1/4-** = 0.5
**1/4-**3/4 = 1
***-***1/4 = 2
***1/2 = 3
***3/4 = 4
**** = 5
****1/4 = 6
****1/2 = 7
****3/4 = 8
***** = 9


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

We've had millions of RR13 reviews. Someone needs to do one of Halloween Havoc 92. Or Uncensored 95.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> We've had millions of RR13 reviews. Someone needs to do one of Halloween Havoc 92. Or Uncensored 95.


HEY BUDDY I'VE ALREADY STARTED IT 

This review shall be different, more of a comedy review than anything :lol.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

RR13 > 12 easily.

Rock/Punk >>>> Punk/Ziggler (Rock's victory alone makes it better, match isn't as horrible as most say either imo)
WHC matches were equal
Rumble match this year >>>> RR 12


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Just listen to Review a Wai of Uncensored 1995, they do a phenomenal job already. I'm specifically looking for PPVs that they haven't done, and BaTB 95 was one of them. But they've done Fall Brawl, Halloween Havoc and War Games all from that year, so I may have to go back further or ahead further for the next review.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

RR 13 is a whole 1.5 points ahead of RR 12 on the CAL SCALE. RR 13 is only a 3.5 though :lmao. And it's still only the 5th worst RR event :lmao.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

So on the Cal scale, BaTB 1995 got a 2.5...:lol


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Could be worse . I have these under 2.5:

WrestleMania 2 - 0.5
Insurrextion 2002 - 1
WrestleMania IV - 1
WrestleMania XV - 2
2006 Royal Rumble - 2
2012 Royal Rumble - 2
WrestleMania V - 2

And 2010 RR at 2.5 . And this is just from me reviewing WM and RR, then 00 and 01 PPV's + half of 2002 .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I'll have to do RR 12 tomorrow to compare


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Callamus said:


> Could be worse . I have these under 2.5:
> 
> WrestleMania 2 - 0.5
> Insurrextion 2002 - 1
> ...


WM15 got a 2? I don't think I'd rate it THAT low...some of the matches were at least decent. I mean, the HIAC couldn't have brought the PPV down THAT much, could it?

I really urge everyone to watch Renegade vs Orndorff, its so hilariously bad.

Oh and I assume you combined all my posts into that one giant one. Thanks. :


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

WM 15 was all round pretty fucking garbage lol.



Spoiler: WM 15



WrestleMania XV

THE RAGIN' CLIMAX! Wait... WHAT?

The intro video with Classy Freddie Blassie is pretty sweet. Guy has an awesome voice over voice. They should have taken samples of shit of his voice so they could use it for the rest of time.

Match 1 - Al Snow Vs Hardcore Holly Vs Billy Gunn - Hardcore title match! Wasn't too long ago that Road Dogg was the hardcore champ, and Billy Gunn was seemingly in the IC title scene. WM comes around... and Billy Gunn is the hardcore champ, and Road Dogg isn't just in the IC title scene, he is the IC champion! Fuck knows how or why things got switched around so drastically lol. But I always liked Road Dogg more so was cool to see him with a bigger title. So this match... just 3 guys hitting each other with weapons, basically. Not as chaotic or as fun as the likes of the Chicago Street Fight or Dumpster Match from the previous 2 WM shows, but still fun to watch. Clothesline... HELLO CHAIR! Lol, great commentary Cole! Snow goes through a table, then gets a Fameasser on a chair, but Holly hits Gunn with a chair then covers Snow to become the new Hardcore champion. Highlight of his career. *.

Match 2 - Owen Hart & Jeff Jarrett Vs D-Lo Brown & Test - Tag titles on the match, and D-Lo and Test won a battle royal earlier in the night to get the title shot. The last 2 guys in the match got to team together, even though they aren't normally a team. They were fighting each other while 2 others in the match eliminated each other, so they didn't know they won and just kept fighting until they got attacked from the tag champs. So they aren't a normal team and they don't exactly get along. If this were 2013 they'd win the tag belts. Hey, D-Lo may very well win a title in TNA now he's been revealed as the VP of Aces & Eights LOL. Well this was a nothing match. Filled with nothing. Owen and Jeff retain when D-Lo is left alone as Test... goes outside to shout at women. DUD.

Match 3 - Butterbean Vs Bart Gunn - Boxing match. Yeah... Brawl for All tournament in 1998 happened. Winner was supposed to get some money, and then a title match with Austin as the reward. They wanted Dr Death to win, but Bart knocked him out and went on to win the whole thing. His reward? Not a title shot against Austin or any kind of push... but a boxing match against a professional boxer. Who knocks him THE FUCK OUT. Nice one. DUD.

Match 4 - The Big Show Vs Mankind - The winner of this gets to referee the WWF Title match between Austin and Rock in the main event. Show wants to win for the Corporation so they can ensure Rock retains the title. Mankind wants to win because he wants to be involved in the main event of WrestleMania. This one isn't very long, but it's a decent-ish fight. Show falling back with Mankind on his back looked painful as fuck and was really put over as a big spot, even though it's a simple enough spot and nothing compared to what he's done in the past lol. Then again watching the replay... I think Show did in fact land with ALL of his weight on poor Foley! Show uses a chair on Foley and... nothing happens. No DQ or anything. Chokeslam onto 2 chairs set up and... DQ. Cool spot except Foley barely touched either chair... and that's the move that wins him the mach via DQ... not getting blasted in the back with a chair. Stupid. Show turns face and knocks out Vince after he slaps him for losing. *.

Match 5 - Road Dogg Vs Ken Shamrock Vs Val Venis Vs Goldust - Four Corners IC title match! Basically, 2 guys in the ring, 2 on the apron. They can be tagged in. Elimination style. Some good action in this one. Val is a great wrestler, somewhat underrated. Road Dogg isn't the best wrestler but is so fucking over it doesn't matter. Goldust is finally back ad Goldust and not the Artist formally known as Goldust and seems to be in better shape than the previous year too. And Shamrock is solid. All of them combined with some fun sequences and a hot crowd make for what I'm predicting will end up being one of the better matches on this show. Ryan Shamrock is at ringside too. She's currently with Goldust. Did a film with Val. And they were originally gonna do an incest angle with Ken. Yeah. What is it with WWE and incest angles? Sick fucks. Shamrock and Val end up getting counted out when they brawl on the outside (Ken is pissed that Val fucked his sister... he was probably jealous LOL), so we are left with Goldust and Road Dogg. In the end, Ryan accidentally grabs Goldust's foot, and Road Dogg... I wanna say rolls up Goldust... but it was the worst roll up ever. Worse than Rock's rollup from... whatever match it was from. Yeah I liked this. Wasn't great, but solid. **.

Match 6 - Triple H Vs Kane - Pete Rose dressed as a chicken attacks Kane LOL. REVENGE FOR LAST YEAR! Except he gets Tombstoned again. I sooo wish this was a tradition every year and not just 3 years lol. HHH takes the fight to Kane, and Kane takes a nice bump into the steel steps. Nice to see a HHH WM match where he isn't controlling things and making me bored out of my mind. Kane might not be the greatest in ring performer ever but I like his work and he's far more interesting on offence than HHH is at this time. KANE DIVES OVER THE ROPES! Chyna (the reason this match is taking place) shows up to help Kane (she turned heel). Steel steps are thrown into the ring, Kane tries to use them, but they end up leading to his downfall. For about 30 seconds. Best thing HHH does in this match is take a back body drop off the steel steps on the floor. Massive chokeslam to HHH, then Chyna brings in a chair claiming to want to hit HHH. Nah, she hits Kane. So Chyna left HHH to join the Corporation and Kane. And then at the end of this match... turns on Kane and joins HHH. DX get back together. Then later in the night both HHH and Chyna turn on DX and join the Corporation. Yeah, Russo was an awesome writer! Urgh. Match is solid. Whole storyline behind it is dumb as fuck though. No surprise of course. Russo was all about SWERVES and shit rather than logical angles. **.

Match 7 - Sable Vs Tori - NO.

Match 8 - Shane McMahon Vs X-Pac - European title is on the line. Shane is the champ! How did he win it? Chyna helped him. Which makes her face turn earlier stupid. And that face turn is then made stupid when she turns heel again with HHH at the end of this one. Urgh. There is a reason I hate WWF in 1999. This event is a great example. Shit matches for the most part and dumb swerves and angles. Anyway, the match. X-Pac is fucking pissed that some rich kid basically stole his title, and is now hiding behind a bunch of Corporate goons to try and keep the belt. Mean Street Posse are sat at ringside, Test is in his corner, and Patterson & Briscoe attacked X-Pac on the way to the ring. Shane is a cocky little prick and he's awesome. Test does his job well on the outside, especially love the attack on X-Pac that sends him crotch first into the ringpost, then X-Pac just falls back to the mat almost like the ringpost gave him a powerbomb lol. Remember when there were like, 6 members of the Posse? Me either, but there were loads of them here lol. Only two survived, then they found someone else lol. Match is very, very well worked, allowing Shane to control the match in believable ways while showcasing his athleticism too. X-Pac is great at fighting the odds, constantly coming back against the young non wrestler and eliminating any outside threats allowing him to really go to school on Shane. In the end, X-Pac looks to have his title won... and then the shit with HHH and Chyna happens and Shane retains. Aside from the retarded booking of HHH and Chyna, this is a good match, especially for a non wrestler. **1/2.

Match 9 - The Undertaker Vs The Big Bossman - The Undertaker’s character had changed quite since the year before. He was now a demonic leader of The Ministry of Darkness stable, along with Paul Bearer who had joined forces once again with ‘Taker. We soon discovered that the Ministry’s plan wasn’t just about beating the hell out of everyone; it was about taking over the WWF! This naturally led to a feud between the Ministry and the Corporation, ran by the McMahons. Since Boss Man was the “enforcer” of the Corporation, he was sent to take care of The Undertaker at WrestleMania, in the first and only Hell in a Cell match to date at this event! There really isn’t much to say about this one. It’s a basic brawl which for some reason takes place inside the Hell in a Cell. The feud didn’t need this match to be a HIAC match, and it showed. It could have easily been a No DQ match, and they could have had the exact same match, just using the guard rail to throw each other into as opposed to the cell wall. The only real “brutality” in this match is when Boss Man handcuffs ‘Taker to the cell and hits him repeatedly with his night stick. Undertaker gets busted open a little bit (and we can clearly see when he cuts himself lol), and the handcuffs break when he falls down. They spend the next few minutes, which feels a hell of a lot longer, just slugging it out with each other until ‘Taker hits a Tombstone and wins. THANK GOD. After the match is over, Boss Man gets hung from the HIAC as it is raised up. That is the only memorable moment from this match lol. This is bad. Even as a huge Undertaker fan, I don’t get much enjoyment out of this. It goes on longer than it needs to, and is filled with virtually nothing that you would remember afterwards. Like I said, the most memorable moment happens AFTER the match. I’m also pretty sure that the fans were booing during the match, seemingly because it was still going on, as they were booing BOTH men . Without a doubt the worst Undertaker WrestleMania match ever. DUD.

JR returns to commentate the main event! Vince comes out too, says he's the referee now since Mankind is in the hospital and Show was arrested for punching him. SHAWN MICHAELS!!! HBK!!! He informs Vince that only the Commissioner can name the referee for a WM main event. What a random rule LOL.

Match 10 - The Rock Vs Steve Austin - The first of their WM trilogy... and their worst WM match together haha. But is it actually bad? I never thought so, so I'm just expecting it to hold up nicely as a good match but nothing more. First like, 10 minutes of this are spent outside the ring with both of them just beating the shit out of each other. Was it even a No DQ/No Countout match? Had a look and yes, it was No DQ. Doesn't say shit about no countout though lol. Ah well. AE brawls were pretty tiresome by this point, but at least the main event matches with it were able to do them that little bit better. Austin and Rock beat the shit out of each other, and I always have fun watching Rock get mauled! Then the moment they get back into the ring... Rock Bottom out of nowhere and we get the first kickout. Then Austin decks the ref with a chair. By accident of course lol. Austin sells the Rock Bottom pretty much for the time he was on the mat getting pinned. So a 2 count. Takes a steel chair to keep him down for a little bit. Shades of Austin in their WM 17 match with Rock beating Austin down with the chair. Obviously means nothing now, but is gonna be a nice callback spot at WM 17 should I remember lol. Austin continues to not sell shit when he is nearly beat with a sleeper, but after his arm goes down twice, he pretty much IMMEDIATELY gets back up and starts trading punches with Rock like nothing happened. I hate those sleeper spots as it is, but this might be the worst ever. There isn't even any real struggle for him to stand up and escape the hold. He just stands up and throws punches. More finisher kick outs, another ref gets taken out, so McMahon shows up to help Rock. Then Foley shows up to take out McMahon and be the normal referee. More finishers, then a final Stunner to keep Rock down and Austin wins the WWF Title. Huh. I remember this being better. Finishing stretch is actually pretty bad tbh. **1/4.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I should review a 1999 PPV to see what it'd get on the CAL SCALE

This show has been bad but entertaining to make fun of :lmao


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

My ratings would be a bit different, but would be pretty close. That women's match definitely deserved minus stars, though, so I agree on that.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Butterbean has more than one 'wrestling' match? :$. Thought IYH: DX was the last time we saw him. and that was against Marc Mero . And so far, the 1998 PPVs haven't been that bad. Royal Rumble was a pretty decent PPV with a very good casket match and the Rock/Shamrock match was decent. Wrestlemania was pretty much the same. Taker/Kane had their best match together with a great story, Owen/HHH was a solid European title match and Rock/Shamrock had a brilliant ending with the referee reversing the decision again. Actual match wasn't as good as their previous match but it was fine for it what was. Wouldn't say it was boring or bad.

Agree on the 2013 RR being better than the 2012 event. Rock's win, although not a very good match, was enough for me to like the event. The hilarious overreaction when he won it makes it sweeter.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Man, this is gonna be one long review. I'm only 1/3 of the way through the Rumble and this is already 1,000 words


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Pretty bad show overall, might watch RR 2012 soon. 



Spoiler:  RR 13 shitfest



*The Royal Rumble 2013 review ​**I don’t know why I hate myself...​*
*Match #1: The Big Show vs Alberto Del Rio 
*
Sigh, I hated this match on the last watch, gonna be fucking terrible. I haven’t seen their SD match where he wins the title but I hear that one is decent, unlike this fuckfest. We start out with Big shows entrance and no one gives a fuck. Next is a backstage segment, what a great way to start one of your biggest shows! ADR and Ricardo run into the hitman backstage, who I guess is here to watch the show, or maybe laugh about how he’s glad he was in his prime 20 years ago . Of course here there is nothing but silence when Del Rio makes his entrance. The man may be a very good worker, but I swear Lance Storm had better charisma than him :lmao. Now that I think of it, Big Show has barely any charisma too, THIS IS A CLASH OF NO ONE GIVES A FUCK! 

Okay, onto this match I don’t want to see at all. This starts out slow as fuck can be, and that is in terms of Big show matches, which means it must be VERY bad, and man it is. These guys seem to think that they are still in rehearsal or some shit like that, because they sure are taking their fucking time moving around, when Big Show walks around the ring he legit looks like the Undertaker is making his way to the ring before a match, man the analogies are just coming out like crazy here :lmao. I honestly forgot to mention that this is a LMS match, mainly because it looks like Scott Armstrong isn’t too bothered to count, until Big show pulls a chokeslam through the set of the show, which admittedly was kind of cool, although he took like 5 minutes to pull off the stunt . 

Anyways this match does heat up somewhat towards the end but it still is the slowest match I think I have ever seen, no joke. This match starts to get a LITTLE better when Ricardo gets some duck tape. I actually didn’t remember much about that, but ADR is a face? That’s some shitty tactics to get over as a face. Terrible match with one of the WOAT endings, fucking shit. ¼* 

*CAL SCALE: 0 *

After a Slim Jim ad, we get a ZIGGLER promo, he talks title unification, I agree. We then get a series of promos talking about the rumble, Barrett talks about how the IC title is now credible because of him :lmao

*Match # 2: Team Hell no vs Team Rhodes Scholars* 

I’ve just now noticed that Rhodes used to squat when he came out of Gorilla, why? I’m a Cody mark, but that honestly looks a little creepy TBH :lol. I legit miss the pornstache, but I’m so glad Cody is getting a push. I remember liking this match, and I doubt I will be disappointed. After the first match its refreshing to see people actually running inside the ring instead of just walking like Show and ADR were doing. Instead of talking about the match, they decide to talk about anger management, but does anyone care? NOPE


Weird to see DB in such a small role on a show considering hes main evented the last 5 PPVS the WWE has put on, BUT VINCE AINT LIKE DA MIDGETS . This isn’t too bad TBH, it might even end up being MOTN if the Rumble doesn’t hold up like I think it will, but I’ve found that rumble to be entertaining the two times I have watched it. I’m sure at this point this was considered a GREAT tag match because it was good that the title was being defended on PPV. Now of course we have a tag division which rivals 2002 as the GOAT tag division in WWE history. Yeah this was OK, it did feel a little anticlimactic, and was obviously a step down from that awesome TLC match with the shield the month before. **3/4 

*CAL SCALE: 1 *

*Match #3: DA ROYAL RUMBLE MATCH *

Here we go! I usually like rumbles and this one was no difference last time I watched it. We get the typical stats video package coupled by a hilarious team hell no segment. We then get an ad that shows that tomorrow RAW is in Las Vegas for RAW Roulette! Too bad no one will be watching after this trainwreck of a show! We get one last video showing what the WWE has done over the weekend to promote the RR PPV, such as Brodus Clay visiting an elementary school to promote literacy. If I was 8, I’d be scared as fuck if that guy came in to my classroom! Justin Roberts than announces the rules and Ziggie makes out with AJ on the stage as he comes out as #1. 

He tells the guy at #2 to just get his arse out here already, the crowd expects some midcarder or jobber, but that’s not what we got. All of a sudden JERICHOS MUSIC HITS! The crowd goes BONKERS and deservedly so, this was a legit mark out moment, as no one really expected this. RHODES is out at #3 and this could be an amazing triple threat match, I could watch these three go all day. Out at #4 is Kofi and the fun is already over, I hate you Kofi, ya dickface. The crowd is still hot for the Jericho return and keeps chanting Y2J, well until Santino comes out and no one gives a fuck, thank god he is legit buried by being the first to get eliminated. 

WE’RE A THREE MAN BAND! Mcintyre is out at #6 but the last three entrants in this match have all been terrible. Out at #7 is Titus O neil and this is quickly becoming a jobberfest. Jericho eliminates Mcintyre to a BIG pop as I think Jericho was definitely the favorite to win it here. GOLDUST is out at #8 and the whole place marks like a 10 year old kid. Some awesome interactions between Cody and Goldie are awesome! Then JBL mentions BOOKDUST, and actually calls them that :mark:. Otunga is out at #9 and he is definitely a filler entrant. Well maybe not as Heath Slater is out at #10. 

SHEAMUS is out at #11 and finally someone the crowd cares about, well, at least a little. He somehow eliminates the man beast Titus O neil and then David Otunga, which seems more realistic . The Fat fuck Tensai is out at #12 and he would soon be a joke with Brodus Clay :lol. No one cares about him and things soon return to normal. Out at #13 is BRODUS CLAY! Remember when this guy was ADR’s bodyguard? That was better than this schtick for sure. Goldie is soon eliminated by his own bro but he did well for a return appearance. Rey Mysterio is out at #14 and I legit forgot he was in this, I assumed he was injured before this I guess. #15 consists of Darren Young, I honestly am done with people who aren’t gonna win. Meanwhile, Brodus Clay and Tensai are eliminated. 

Meanwhile kofi pulls off his yearly stunt that doesn’t beat his awesome handstand from the year before or Morrison’s sick clinging onto the wall from 2011. As he gets a chair and drags it, Kofi and young are eliminated as Bo Dallas was in at #16 to no applause at all. THE GODFATHER is in at #17 to a fun pop but gets eliminated by Ziggler immediately, but it was a fun nostalgic moment. At #18 is Barrett and GOD is his music TERRIBLE. I don’t mind it now but this was like some kind of terrible TNA theme. At #19 THE CHAMP IS HERE! He actually gets quite the pop, which is suprising. He gets the shit beat out of him but manages to eliminate Slater and Rhodes, GOTTA GET DAT BURYING IN! Damien Sandow is out at #20, this is his first rumble match. 

Rey is eliminated soon after by Barrett, surprised he is still here TBH. Bryan is out at #21 to a loud pop, in hilnot comparable to this summer though. At #22 is CESARO, this is also his first rumble, not a big applause, but I would mark for him . At #23 is Khali and its honestly the exact opposite of Cesaro. How is this idiot still employed? The answer is the same as the question how many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsie pop? DA WORLD MAY NEVER KNOW. At #24 is KANE, but not corporate kane! GOOD KANE! Zack Ryder is out to the ring at #25 as Khali gets eliminated. Team Hell no eliminate each other in hilarious fashion. 

The Viper is out at #26 to a decent pop, but this was back when he was a boring face, now he’s a boring heel :lmao. Jinder Mahal is out at #27 and surprised they gave him such a late number. Cesaro is eliminated by Cena and I cry a little because Cesaro is KING. Out at 28 and 29 is Miz and Sin cara, two guys no one gives a hairy fuck about. Its Kind of fun to see Barrett get eliminated by Dallas, who soon gets eliminated by Barrett. It eventually comes down to only three guys, Ryback(who entered at #30), Cena, and Sheamus. Cena Eventually wins to a big pop and now Cena is a multi time rumble winner. 

Solid rumble, but nothing overly spectacular. ***1/4 

*CAL SCALE: 2*

*Match #5: CM Punk vs the Rock *

Yay, here we go, not looking forward to this whatsoever, I might not even write too much about it because I’m so disgusted watching it. Only good thing about this might be HEYMAN and the fact the crowd is split. This match is so bad, the worst thing I heard was a you still got it chant. THAT IS SOME BULL, he has nothing, didn’t have much to begin with anyway . This match is terrible but the ending is really the only good part about it. Yes, I like the ending, I thought the Shield interference was absolutely beautiful. Cole and JBK also conceived it brilliantly. I know most despise it, but I even liked the restart of the match by Vince, it got the job he sent out to do, which was to get the crowd going wild, same with the rocks part. The match itself sucked unfortunately, and I was left with little to write about considering their was nothing funny about how bad it was, unlike the opener. Skip this show except the rumble and I guess the tag. * 

*CAL SCALE: 0* 

*TOTAL CAL SCALE: 3 *


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Luke Harper working four matches in one week for WWE = :lenny

Match vs Punk was soooo good.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

One wrestler and I will watch five random matches and talk about them. First to answer. 

GOGOGOGOGOGOGO


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The Great Khali

:troll


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

:lol


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah1993 said:


> One wrestler and I will watch five random matches and talk about them. First to answer.
> 
> GOGOGOGOGOGOGO


Kofi Kingston.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

smitty915 said:


> The Great Khali
> 
> :troll


I hate your guts. But I'll do it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Watch Khali & Porter vs Kane & Batista from early 2008 please.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Interested to see if you can find 5 good Khali matches :lmao

I almost put Hornswoggle instead


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I can count more Khali matches I like than Kofi Kingston.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Isn't his match vs haitch at SS 08 regarded as decent?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's worked well. See no reason to hate it at all. And I'm usually against most crummy stuff Triple H has to offer. Felt like a fun match built up in the 80's with this beast going up against the babyface champion. Always liked it. Which baffles me continuously, but I'm not complaining.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Pretty damn good matches against Taker, Cena, & HHH for sure. PUNJABI PRISON with Batista at no mercy 2007 is great as well :mark:.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

The Primer said:


> Watch Khali & Porter vs Kane & Batista from early 2008 please.


Will save that for later since it seems longer than ten minutes, but I will watch.



smitty915 said:


> Interested to see if you can find 5 good Khali matches :lmao


Probably won't, but honestly I've meaning to re-watch Khali/Cena and Khali/Trip for a while and this kind of gives me an excuse to watch them.



The Primer said:


> I can count more Khali matches I like than Kofi Kingston.


:lmao :mark: :woolcock


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

Summerslam with Triple H is decent I think. 

Khali/Batista Punjabi Prison is also the most unbelievable match ever because on paper it should be total shit but it's actually good. 

Khali and Taker had a decent match too, LMS maybe? 

I don't have much after that. I think he wrestled Flair on Smackdown once and I liked that and there has to be something passable with Kane or Finlay. 


I would have gone Disco Inferno if I had the choice but to each their own I guess.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I didn't so much mind Khali as the monster in 2007-8. I really can't imagine that WWE would lose viewers from India if they cut him. Such a waste of roster space.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> Will save that for later since it seems longer than ten minutes, but I will watch.
> 
> 
> :lmao :mark: :woolcock


Goes 13 iirc.

+


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

There's also an HBK/Khali match on Raw from May 2007 that may be worth a watch for Khali's more "quality" work.

The triple threat with Rey and Batista was alright too.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

SHEAMUS and Daniel Bryan also had good matches with Khali. I'm sure all the Mark Henry/Khali squashes were fun too. I think I remember liking a match he had with Finlay too. And for reasons that even I don't know, I kinda liked a match he had with Ryback earlier this year. :ryback

EDIT: This Kane/Batista vs. Khali/MVP match is actually pretty good. I also forgot that I liked Batista/Khali/Kane and Cena/Umaga/Khali. Can't forget about the Cesaro matches. Punk also had a hilarious segment/match with Khali in 2009.

KHALI!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah that Ryback match vs Khali earlier this year actually was enjoyable. It was...odd. But welcomed.

vs Big Show from Backlash '08 is a good match. Always put support there. Also liked Orton vs Khali in 2011. Guy isn't pretty, but he's had a decent selection of matches that's worked or actually been good. All you can ask for with a monster who's nearly been immobile his whole career.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I usually agree with most of what you say Cody (besides the USOs ) but I cant get behind Khail, but its really not his fault, the guy honestly cannot move fluidly 


Havent been in a wrestling mood, last wrestling I saw was raw


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> EDIT: This Kane/Batista vs. Khali/MVP match is actually pretty good. I also forgot that I liked Batista/Khali/Kane and Cena/Umaga/Khali. Can't forget about the Cesaro matches. Punk also had a hilarious segment/match with Khali in 2009.
> 
> KHALI!


YES.

Finally, someone saw it.



redskins25 said:


> I usually agree with most of what you say Cody (besides the USOs ) but I cant get behind Khail, but its really not his fault, the guy honestly cannot move fluidly
> 
> 
> Havent been in a wrestling mood, last wrestling I saw was raw


Maybe you'll like that Shawn Michaels match vs him that was plugged. Shawn works magic for ya, of course. :hayley1


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> YES.
> 
> Finally, someone saw it.
> 
> ...


:jericho This I watch now


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

On youtube, so you're good to go. (Y)


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

So is it pretty much almost a done deal we aren't getting Cena/ Taker at mania 30?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Sure.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Just watched this for the AE project now that RR 97 is done with.






lol @ Lawler. :lawler


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Did you watch the whole RAW? Show has a tremendous Owen/Smith vs Furnas/LaFon match on it.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Skipped it (save for the finish) for now because I just wanted to get through quickly, but since you're plugging it, I'll watch it tomorrow.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's even better than their PPV match from Final Four. Def worth the watch.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I second the recommendation for that tag match. Furnas and Lafon performed so many subtle motions and gestures in that match that I feel like it was one of my favorite face tag team performances in the WWE.

This however is disgusting:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Wait, WWE made that as a way to slam them despite all that was shown was their good in ring game? The hell is that crap.

Cobra Clutch suplex to win the match was stellar.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

How can you call a team boring when they took part in a match that had one of the most loud and involved crowds ever?

Austin/Undertaker match that C2D posted was pretty good. Now that makes SIX Austin/Taker matches that I like. And yet I still think they have poor chemistry.

FL 99: *****1/4*
JD 01: ******
SS 98: *****
RAW 99: ****1/4*
SD 01: ****1/2*
RAW 97: *****

Wait I forgot IYH: CDIH. That makes it seven. ******


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Do you have any of their matches below three stars? Dunno how that's poor chemistry. 


I'm not even going to bother commenting on WWE's dumbassery with wrestlers like Furnas and Kroffat. Push Kofi Kingston again and keep Josh Mathews hired, you cunts. Drop dead.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Over the Edge and Backlash are very bad. Buried Alive was terrible. They had another match in 2002 that I don't recall liking. All of their 1996 matches sucked.And I don't recall them ever doing anything impressive in a multi man match situation.

Undertaker/Shamrock is good. Curse that crowd.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Watch John Cena rap at the royal rumble 04 and look at josh Matthews and you'll never see him the same

Hbk/khail was :Lenny pretty sure Khails 2nd best match after the sd taker match. Need to watch that cena one


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

which Michaels/Khali did you watch? I just watched one and didn't like it at all. Do they only have one match?


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

An entire night where everyone talks about The Great Khali on here? DA FUCK? :lmao

Haven't been in much of a WWE mood lately, but watched a couple matches for the Del Rio project tonight. Not getting into much detail, but the RAW match against Punk from 9/26/2011 is pretty average all around, then Punk wins with a high kick completely out of nowhere. So that only gets ** 1/2.

The 12 man tag on RAW from the night after HIAC 2011 is all kinds of awesome. Not even gonna try and type out all the participants but it's wonderfully worked match that's a lot of fun in the end. Only weird moment comes when Bourne leaves the ring too early and Cody Rhodes is left with nothing to do.  I'd go as high as *** 3/4 for it.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Del Rio project? My god, why would you ever burden yourself with something like that WILLINGLY?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Over the Edge and Backlash are very bad. Buried Alive was terrible. They had another match in 2002 that I don't recall liking. All of their 1996 matches sucked.And I don't recall them ever doing anything impressive in a multi man match situation.
> 
> Undertaker/Shamrock is good. Curse that crowd.


Undertaker vs Austin kind of split the difference overall. Yet, I'm still on the side where I think they don't have swell chemistry. The ones that were good, weren't even AS good as they probably could have been. Sans Fully Loaded '99 & Judgment Day '01.

I have to give Undertaker vs Shamrock another chance. I was bleh on it, but that could be thanks to me letting the dead crowd get all over it + not expecting it to be worked so ground, MMA based. Although it makes sense if you know Taker's interest with it. A match like that in the Attitude Era was destined to be crapped on.



Jack Evans 187 said:


> The 12 man tag on RAW from the night after HIAC 2011 is all kinds of awesome. Not even gonna try and type out all the participants but it's wonderfully worked match that's a lot of fun in the end. Only weird moment comes when Bourne leaves the ring too early and Cody Rhodes is left with nothing to do.  I'd go as high as *** 3/4 for it.


Match is SOOOO rad. One of the best from 2011 hands down.


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

did anyone answer my question regarding the rumble matches?

if so maybe you will now. 8*D


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

What was the question, Kenny?


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

I've downloaded all rumble matches from 1988-2008 (the actual rumble). I haven't watched all of them before, but most of them. Do you think it was worth it? I'm looking forward to seeing Austin GOAT :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah, sure. If you like the Rumble match then you should have a grand time watching all of 'em.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Is Cena & Codust/Sandow & Real Americans II better than the 1st?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Hmm. Depends. They're both close, but it could be more if your a fan of Cena being the babyface taking the beating & giving Goldust the hot tag, or vice versa from Smackdown with Cena receiving the hot tag. I'd say the RAW match had the hotter finish _(maybe b/c it's fresher..)_ - the strides shown in the final sequence was great. Cesaro took so much to stay down. Moonsault, crossbody, & shove into the Final Cut. Seamless.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I'll admit I wasn't much into the SD Tag, so far I'm digging the Raw one better.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Both earn my love & attention. But I can see why the RAW one would garner some stronger preference from folk. Being live also doesn't hurt, compared to being on a canned show.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Holy fuck dat ending :mark:

Yeah, much prefer this to SD. And btw, Punk/Harper was a sweet lil' match. Hope Bryan/Harper delievers.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Loved Punk vs Harper a lot. Awesome to know there is good chemistry and they can have a match even better than what was given down the line. Harper vs Danielson should be well worth a watch. Only fear is I hope it doesn't get cut too short being on Smackdown. A la the original Danielson vs Reigns match.

Don't forget there is Harper vs Ohno II on NXT this week too. :mark:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Tbf not since 2002 have we had a year with so much Tag Team match *badassery.*

Such a shame that they've ruined the SVS card, though. Orton/Show don't have chemistry at all and I kinda don't want Cena/ADR II either. And Punk & Bryan/Wyatts isn't going to be a SVS Tag either, but a 3-on-2 Handicap instead.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm wanting the Handicap over some worthless Elimination match with goons who don't need to be there.

Cena vs Del Rio II has me plenty excited.

True, not sure I'm into Show vs Orton on paper b/c their chemistry isn't there. But I'm not against the current angle so I'll remain hopeful. However, Orton has no chemistry with Danielson and look how that turned out. Orton on TV is working with the heel turn for the most part, but PPV hasn't. That'll probably continue.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Actually I miswrote, it's only going to be Punk & Bryan/Harper & Rowan.

Cena/ADR II may be a good match but it hurts my heart. Why? Two words: *Damien Sandow*. Hope it's made a 3-way.

Oh, and apparently, it's going to be Codust/Real Americans/Shield/Usos for the Tag titles.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Oh god why at the tag titles? This show is gonna be 2002 level with no Elimination match at this rate.

Sandow will be fine. Folks are overreacting. Del Rio gets his rematch, loses, Cena moves on. Sandow is still plenty in the mix. Fact he's good enough to be mentioned "in the mix" alone, is a positive sign.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

The 4-way tag will be elimination at least, surely?



The Primer said:


> Oh god why at the tag titles? This show is gonna be 2002 level with no Elimination match at this rate.


I think having the first ever Elimination Chamber more than made up for that.

Can't believe 2 months ago I was gearing up for two massive elimination matches in Team Heyman vs Team Punk and Team Corporate vs Team Bryan :lol


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Been some sort of cock up in the Upload thread, so ive had to just repost the DL links  Im having issues editing the first post so if you see no new links in there, just check the relevent sections, thanks


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

haribo said:


> I think having the first ever Elimination Chamber more than made up for that.


+ two other elimination tag team matches of a different variety. 2013 might not have anything of the elimination persuasion. That'll be hilarious.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Been some sort of cock up in the Upload thread, so ive had to just repost the DL links  Im having issues editing the first post so if you see no new links in there, just check the relevent sections, thanks


Im hoping an admin can use the cache to try and revert my post back to yesterday, but in the meantime, i have posted just the DL links of the matches that were deleted from the post.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Thinking thinking that Rebellion 2002 is next on my 02 PPV ramble watch list for today. EDDIE & the other guy Vs BANGLE best hold up :mark:.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

CHAVO


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

THE OTHER GUY.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I've used that to describe a chump or two, myself. :show


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I don't quite understand the hate for the upcoming SVS main event. Everyone is bitching about Big Show being in it. RANDY FUCKING ORTON is the problem for me. Show at least can still deliver in the ring for the most part, Orton has been stinking up the place for years now outside of Christian and SHIELD matches. And Orton is the heel in this one. He's gonna fucking have a control segment over BIG SHOW? The fucks he gonna do? Oh god I think the return of the sleeper is on it's way.


----------



## TheGreatestMan (Jan 3, 2012)

Random matches

CM Punk vs. Taker Wrestlemania 29 - ****1/4
Cody and goldust vs. The Shield Battleground - ****1/4
Brock Lesnar vs. CM Punk Summerslam 13 - *****
Daniel Bryan vs. John Cena Summerslam 13 - ****3/4
New years revolution 2005 chamber - ****3/4 (GOAT CHAMBER)


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> which Michaels/Khali did you watch? I just watched one and didn't like it at all. Do they only have one match?


Sorry man, I passed out before I say this

It think it was a 2007 raw no dq #1 contenders match, I overrearcted a but, the first half was pretty good but the second half lost a bit of steam, still good


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Oh you know this place. Apparently people have to say Big Show sucks & is boring without any real reason following their opinion. Big Show is great & actually super over in his current position, but of course HE'S the drawback atm. I have more faith in Orton these days than I did a few months ago - b/c working heel is just a more natural fit for him it seems - but my point about the match was made ^. When Orton doesn't have chemistry with someone, that usually sticks.


----------



## TheGreatestMan (Jan 3, 2012)

top 5 matches of 2013 thus far guys? My list from the top of my head:

1) Brock vs. Punk SS 13 - *****
2) Cena vs. Bryan SS 13 - ****3/4
3) Cena vs. Punk Raw - ****1/2
4) Taker vs. Punk WM 29 - ****1/2
5) Sheield vs. Cody and Goldust battleground - ****1/4-1/2


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Just watched that Los Guerreros vs Bangle Tag from Rebellion 2002 not too long ago actually, held up very well, I think I gave it ****. I prefer it to the much more heralded Bangle vs Edge/Mysterio NM02' tag, has a lot better structure and purpose over just MOVEZ.

You really can't go wrong with Eddie and The Wolverine in a match together, no matter how much Chavo is involved


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I was on such a low from the crummy Benoit & other guy tags from 2002 that I passed on that match. May decide to give it a whirl with how it's being put over. Although, when has that ever swayed me? Idk. Might watch if I'm bored.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Callamus said:


> I don't quite understand the hate for the upcoming SVS main event.












:mark:

Have Orton/Show ever had a 1v1 PPV match? I don't remember one but I fade in and out with my wrestling interest.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> I was on such a low from the crummy Benoit & other guy tags from 2002 that I passed on that match. May decide to give it a whirl with how it's being put over. Although, when has that ever swayed me? Idk. Might watch if I'm bored.



I'd be interested to see your opinion. Like I said, it's more of a classic tag match in my view.

I watched Vader/Owen from ONS 1997 last night. Now that is one hell of a match, one of the best matches Vader had during his WWF run. Reccomend it to everyone. Can't remember if Owen was heel at this time or not, I'm tempted to think he was, but he worked this match as a pure underneath baby face and really took a pounding from Vader. Loved how they worked the Hogan/Andre-esque body slam spots in (Owen repeatedly trying to slam Vader, failing while the announcers question why he would ever try such a preposterous act, only for him to fire it up in the end and get Vader up). Anyway, I love matches like this that tell such a classic easy to relate under dog story. ****


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

:lmao how did Orton FORGET TO DROP for his own finisher? :lmao


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

@haribo, they wrestled an Extreme Rules match at Extreme Rules (see what I did there?) this year. And, bar the match at Main Event last year which was watchable, they've done absolutely no worth it in the ring together. And now I have to get them in the Main Event of Survivor fucking Series. I'm a fan of Show, I dig Orton, but they don't have any chemistry together. It should've been HHH/Show instead. *BOTTOM LINE* :side:

And the rest of the card isn't looking too impressive either. Shame, the potential was immense.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

ATF said:


> @haribo, they wrestled an Extreme Rules match at Extreme Rules (see what I did there?) this year. And, bar the match at Main Event last year which was watchable, they've done absolutely no worth it in the ring together. And now I have to get them in the Main Event of Survivor fucking Series. I'm a fan of Show, I dig Orton, but they don't have any chemistry together. It should've been HHH/Show instead. *BOTTOM LINE* :side:
> 
> And the rest of the card isn't looking too impressive either. Shame, the potential was immense.



My guess would be they are building Show/Trips for Royal Rumble. I have this odd feeling that Show might go over Orton, become WWE Champ, drop the title to Haitch at the Rumble, and have Trips face either Cena or if we are really really lucky (and we never are) Bryan at Mania. I'm probably wrong but that's just a guess.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Orton/Show from ER was worse than Punk/Rock from RR, and that's saying something


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I hope too we get HHH/Bryan at Mania. Atm the long planned Punk/Bryan is out of question, might as well throw the 2nd best option in there.

And Orton/Show ER was bleh, but Punk/Rock was WAY worse imo.

Just out of curiosity, do people prefer the HBK/Angle WM or Vengeance match? (That's another critically acclaimed series that's gone under hate around here :cool2)


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Angle/HBK at WM gets so many mixed reviews, I recently rewatched it a couple of months ago and it still held up for me as MOTN right behind MITB and Orton/Taker . Gotta rewatch vengeance though. 

Angle/Shawn WM ****1/4 MOTN


I shall rematch vengeance today. Hell I'll rewatch that whole awesome ppv! :mark


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Kurt Angle vs HBK from Mania was a masterpiece for me ****3/4. Michaels and Angle tored the house down for 30 minutes on the grandest stage of them all, i really loved their match

The Vengeance one gets ****, very good bout, but can't top the mania one


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

ATF said:


> I hope too we get HHH/Bryan at Mania. Atm the long planned Punk/Bryan is out of question, might as well throw the 2nd best option in there.
> 
> And Orton/Show ER was bleh, but Punk/Rock was WAY worse imo.
> 
> Just out of curiosity, do people prefer the HBK/Angle WM or Vengeance match? (That's another critically acclaimed series that's gone under hate around here :cool2)



I actually haven't seen the Vengeance match all the way through, I tried watching it a few months ago and my stream kept messing up and I couldn't get it to work. If anyone has a link I'd love to give it a watch.

I know I'll probably be in the minority here, but I really dig the match they had at Mania. There were definitely some things I would change about it if I was the one designing the match (finish woulda been the Angle slam off the top) but all in all it was a damn good match to me. It's overrated by a lot of people who claim it's a "perfect" match, but that doesn't detract from the cool story it told (if completely recycled from other Angle matches) and the drama felt real to me. Plus it's Bobby Heenans favorite match ever, that has to count for something! ****1/2 from me. 

Like I said I'd really like to see the Vengeance match, Skins was saying it was far better than Mania.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

I can't see why people hate their WM one


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Personally both Shawn/Kurt matches are indeed excellent, I have Vengeance at ****1/2 and WM at ****1/4. Didn't like the Iron Man match on Raw Homecoming though.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

KO Bossy said:


> Del Rio project? My god, why would you ever burden yourself with something like that WILLINGLY?


Hahaha. Del Rio's one of my favorites. Fantastic worker despite all the negativity he gets for being bland or void of any character. I've watched just about every worthwhile match he's been in thus far from August 2010-September 2011.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I too even love their WM match still. Held up exceptionally well when I watched it again earlier in the year. Has some flaws, yes, but only ones that prevent it from being a GOATC (at WM, at least). Otherwise it's still an incredible match,


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> I too even love their WM match still. Held up exceptionally well when I watched it again earlier in the year. Has some flaws, yes, but only ones that prevent it from being a GOATC (at WM, at least). Otherwise it's still an incredible match,



I feel the same way, have you seen the Vengeance match?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I always considered the Vengeance match to be better, but I haven't seen it in years. Wondering how much I'll like it now considering my views on their WM match went up on last watch. Vengeance was excellent minus the utterly retarded finish :lmao.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Hahaha. Del Rio's one of my favorites. Fantastic worker despite all the negativity he gets for being bland or void of any character. I've watched just about every worthwhile match he's been in thus far from August 2010-September 2011.


I wouldn't describe Del Rio as a fantastic worker. He's good and very consistent in the ring, and has good matches, but how many _great_ memorable matches has he had? Not many. Del Rio's best match that comes to mind is his match with Christian at Extreme Rules 2011, and that was much more because of Christian and the great story behind the match than Del Rio.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Anyone that uses my Upload thread, order now restored


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I feel it's not cool around here if you like a Kurt Angle match that isn't against The Undertaker or Rey Mysterio. 



Nostalgia said:


> I wouldn't describe Del Rio as a fantastic worker. He's good and very consistent in the ring, and has good matches, but how many _great_ memorable matches has he had? Not many. Del Rio's best match that comes to mind is his match with Christian at Extreme Rules 2011, and that was much more because of Christian and the great story behind the match than Del Rio.


Well I'll admit he had some struggles throughout his first big push, but he came along extremely well in the past year and figured out how to work a match to a tee. You're a big Ziggler & Christian fan, yeah? Those two have to be his best opponents and when it's all said and done I'll have a major list of all his best matches in the company. So far at the top we have RAW matches against John Morrison, the Mania match against Edge, SD match against Bryan, a couple SD matches against Mysterio, and of course the Ladder match with Christian. I'm not sure how many matches he'll end up having in **** range or higher, but I know he'll be consistent in the *** 1/2+ column. He's never really given quality opponents on a weekly basis anymore though.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> I feel it's not cool around here if you like a Kurt Angle match that isn't against The Undertaker or Rey Mysterio.


Austin too .


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Well I'll admit he had some struggles throughout his first big push, but he came along extremely well in the past year and figured out how to work a match to a tee. You're a big Ziggler & Christian fan, yeah? Those two have to be his best opponents and when it's all said and done I'll have a major list of all his best matches in the company. So far at the top we have RAW matches against John Morrison, the Mania match against Edge, SD match against Bryan, a couple SD matches against Mysterio, and of course the Ladder match with Christian. I'm not sure how many matches he'll end up having in **** range or higher, but I know he'll be consistent in the *** 1/2+ column. He's never really given quality opponents on a weekly basis anymore though.


Yep I'm a big Ziggler and Christian fan. Ziggler being my favorite in the company for the past few years, and Christian being my all time favorite.  And I would agree that they're Del Rio's best opponents. Del Rio/Christian Extreme Rules 2011, and Del Rio/Ziggler Payback I would describe as truly great memorable matches, but the rest of their of matches are good, but not great imo. I didn't think much of Christian/Del Rio from Summerslam, good match yes, but it didn't amaze me or nothing, and knowing Christian was 100% losing didn't help. Del Rio's a good TV worker when he's not squashing guys like Kofi and Zack Ryder, which he's often booked to these days, but like a lot of people here I just find it hard to care for a Del Rio match because the guy is so boring from a character standpoint and the crowd seem to agree from his complete lack of reaction whenever he makes his entrance and during his matches.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Callamus said:


> :lmao how did Orton FORGET TO DROP for his own finisher? :lmao


Pretty sure it's Big Show who screwed up. He was supposed to counter by pushing Orton away. One thing you can rely on with Orton is that he doesn't execute his finisher needlessly on TV matches, specially when it ends in a DQ or something like that. Hell, in all the Bryan PPV matches, he never used the move mainly because he never won decisively.



Jack Evans 187 said:


> I feel it's not cool around here if you like a Kurt Angle match that isn't against The Undertaker or Rey Mysterio.


Benoit matches still rule! Fuck the haters.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Yeah, that was Big Show's fault. I remember pretty much everyone blaming Big Show on the forum at the time that it happened and someone even made a Big Show hate thread about it. I know it's the cool thing to do in this thread to hate on Orton and praise Big Show, but that was Big Show's fault imo.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Callamus said:


> Austin too .


Liking the DVD/BD Collection  Should make a compilation video of Cena's 'comeback' wins with the Superman soundtrack


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I'm gonna' watch a few more episodes of Californication and then I'm going to YEAH1993 somebody. I don't know who, though. If I had to choose now I'd say BLITZKRIEG or LA PARKA or SUPER CALO. Really digging 98-01 WCW undercard cats, at the minute.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

I don't think I'll ever like Del Rio. His massive overpush and his consistency in remaining in the world title picture certainly hasn't helped his career or character get over. He may be a great worker but if your character is boring and doesn't get people invested in storylines then it's hardly going to put him over. I know this thread loves ring work (which is fine) but I like a perfect mixture of entertaining storylines and wrestling. Del Rio doesn't get me invested in any of his storylines.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Benoit matches still rule! Fuck the haters.


Yea, I'm one of the few that agrees with that sentiment in here. Although, seeing as how respected those matches are by guys like Flair, HBK, Eddie, Stone Cold, etc (I've heard all those guys speak very highly of them in interviews) I don't think I'm crazy or anything for liking them. They are probably the most controversial matches in WWE history as far as difference of opinion goes.

Zeppers- just watched Taker/Vader IYH:CS :mark: :mark: what a fucking war that was, and amazingly they stayed between the ropes almost the entire time, and it still came off as a freaking fight. And that ending :mark: Vader requiring a top rope chokeslam, a regular chokeslam, AND a Tombstone to stay down. ****


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah I doubt I'll ever jump on the Del Rio bandwagon either. Didn't think much to him when he first came to WWE and everyone was drooling over him, and over the years I've only cared about a handful of his matches, mostly just with Christian and then the PB match with Ziggler. His character might as well be nonexistent because it's just "I'M MEXICAN AND GRINGOS HATE ME BUT MEXICANS LOVE ME BECAUSE I'M MEXICAN" which isn't much of a character at all .


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Is this on the Vengeance 2005 DVD:

Triple H and Batista backstage after Vengeance 2005:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Aye, that's an extra from the Vengeance 05 DVD.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Oliver-94 said:


> I don't think I'll ever like Del Rio. His massive overpush and his consistency in remaining in the world title picture certainly hasn't helped his career or character get over. He may be a great worker but if your character is boring and doesn't get people invested in storylines then it's hardly going to put him over. I know this thread loves ring work (which is fine) but I like a perfect mixture of entertaining storylines and wrestling. Del Rio doesn't get me invested in any of his storylines.


Very much agree. This is the workrate thread so there's going to be some Del Rio praise here, but you only have to look at the rest of the forum to see how much hate Del Rio gets here and some of it's justified. The guy has been ridiculously overpushed and shoved our throats since day one and yet the fans just don't care. Sheamus is another guy who's been overpushed these last few years but he at least connects with the audience better than Del Rio, is a good worker and has more to offer from a character standpoint than Del Rio, but I don't care much for Sheamus either.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Is this on the Vengeance 2005 DVD:
> 
> Triple H and Batista backstage after Vengeance 2005:



Hey Zep, do you happen to know a place that has HBK/Angle from Vengeance 05'? The link I found on YouTube didn't work, and I've been trying to watch that match for months.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Oh, thanks Cal  I have the DVD but missed the extra lol 

EDIT - Jack - Ill try and upload it tomorrow for ya


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Hey Zep, do you happen to know a place that has HBK/Angle from Vengeance 05'? The link I found on YouTube didn't work, and I've been trying to watch that match for months.


http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x10kpph_wwe-vengeance-2005-shawn-michaels-vs-kurt-angle_sport

If you still want it uploading, lemme know.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Oh, thanks Cal  I have the DVD but missed the extra lol
> 
> EDIT - Jack - Ill try and upload it tomorrow for ya



Gosh you're just best 

Would you prefer to be called Clint, Clint Eastwood, Man with no name, Harry Callahan, or Dirty Harry?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Del Rio is fantastic, I know he doesn't have a gimmick but who really cares as long as he entertains you in the ring.

I would say his gimmick is to just be a smug, suave, rich a-hole which works for me


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Nostalgia said:


> Very much agree. This is the workrate thread so there's going to be some Del Rio praise here, but you only have to look at the rest of the forum to see how much hate Del Rio gets here and some of it's justified. The guy has been ridiculously overpushed and shoved our throats since day one and yet the fans just don't care. Sheamus is another guy who's been overpushed these last few years but he at least connects with the audience better than Del Rio, is a good worker and has more to offer from a character standpoint than Del Rio, but I don't care much for Sheamus either.


 Agree. Only differences are that Sheamus did challenge for the US title at one stage in his career whereas Del Rio still hasn't challenged for any. A nice run with the IC title wouldn't hurt him at all. And how many non-title feuds has Del Rio been involved in? I can only think of the Rey Mysterio feud. Sheamus has feuded with Shield and Henry this year. Both feuds not involving any world title. 

in-ring wrestling is Bryan's strongest point but at least he is very over with the crowd.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

remember not liking Michaels/Angle mania, senseless mat-wrestling iirc


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Vengeance 2005 was such a good PPV. One of the best ones I own. Christian/Cena/Jericho was ****3/4* Angle/HBK was *****1/4* and Batista/HHH is probably a five star match for me.



Oliver-94 said:


> Agree. Only differences are that Sheamus did challenge for the US title at one stage in his career whereas Del Rio still hasn't challenged for any. A nice run with the IC title wouldn't hurt him at all. And how many non-title feuds has Del Rio been involved in? I can only think of the Rey Mysterio feud. Sheamus has feuded with Shield and Henry this year. Both feuds not involving any world title.
> 
> in-ring wrestling is Bryan's strongest point but at least he is very over with the crowd.


Yep. Both should of had midcard runs to establish themselves and build them up for the main-event, instead of shoving them in the main-event before they were over or really ready. Sheamus won the US Title after he won the WWE Title twice. And Sheamus when he was WWE Champion sucked and he wasn't ready for that position yet, and it wasn't until 2012 that he actually became a good worker.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

William Murderface said:


> Del Rio is fantastic, I know he doesn't have a gimmick but who really cares as long as he entertains you in the ring.
> 
> I would say his gimmick is to just be a smug, suave, rich a-hole which works for me



I always saw Del Rio as a Mexican Randy Orton. There are a lot of similarities if you look into it, it's just Randy has been around a lot longer. Plus Randy had excellent runs in 2004-2005 and 2009 that overshadow anything Del Rio has done. But otherwise both guys are very similar.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I don't understand the hate for HBK/Angle WM I personally think it is fantastic.



> I always saw Del Rio as a Mexican Randy Orton. There are a lot of similarities if you look into it, it's just Randy has been around a lot longer. Plus Randy had excellent runs in 2004-2005 and 2009 that overshadow anything Del Rio has done. But otherwise both guys are very similar.


Do you think this because he had Orton's pyro? :side:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The point of the mat wrestling Skins was the same run back story that's been told before: Angle trying desperately to prove he's better than HBK, HBK turning Angles aggressiveness around and using it to out wrestle Angle at every turn, causing Kurt to get increasingly frustrated. Finally Kurt gets fed up with HBK constantly out smarting him on the mat, blows his stack, the straps come down, and he starts suplexing/angle slamming/ankle locking etc. Until he is able to wear HBK down to the point he either taps or gets pinned. Angles inhuman conditioning and superior technique wins out in the end.

That's the basic story of a lot of Angle matches, but I tell you I don't think it's ever been done better than in that WM match. Match just had a great feel to it when I watched it last, it's hard to describe.

To each his own though sir


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Gosh you're just best
> 
> Would you prefer to be called Clint, Clint Eastwood, Man with no name, Harry Callahan, or Dirty Harry?


http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x10kpph_wwe-vengeance-2005-shawn-michaels-vs-kurt-angle_sport

If you still want it uploading, lemme know.

Any homage to Clint is nice


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

ATF said:


> @haribo, they wrestled an Extreme Rules match at Extreme Rules (see what I did there?) this year.


Fuck me. I saw that one too. Completely forgot about the Orton/Sheamus/Show feud that didn't really get going. fpalm


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Is this on the Vengeance 2005 DVD:
> 
> Triple H and Batista backstage after Vengeance 2005:


AMAZING.

Vengeance 2005 is my all time favorite show and my all time favorite PPV DVD (shout out to Wrestlemanias 22 & 21) and its segments like this that's why. The standing ovation HHH got after his MOTY with Batista was superb, as well as the Christian/Tomko/Jericho Vs Hogan/Cena/HBK tag. Beastly stuff and a show that everybody should own.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x10kpph_wwe-vengeance-2005-shawn-michaels-vs-kurt-angle_sport
> 
> If you still want it uploading, lemme know.
> 
> Any homage to Clint is nice



That link should work fine thank your sir.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> AMAZING.
> Christian/Tomko/Jericho Vs Hogan/Cena/HBK tag. Beastly stuff and a show that everybody should own.


Fuck sake, i really need to check the extra's out lol 



Cactus Jack said:


> That link should work fine thank your sir.


NP


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

Saw HBK/Angle at a UK House show in 05' and they tore the house down, remember it being worked very similar to the Mania match except HBK went over. 

Del Rio is good 'mechanically' but doesn't have an ounce of personality in anything he does, I mean RAW this week just became a piss-taking session with the commentary with ******'s and Perro's being fitted into every sentence :lol

Also just seen Rock/Hogan again, if anyone doesn't love this match doesn't get what there professional wrestling is, its literally the ultimate example.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Rock/Hogan is a breathtaking match that I adore. The Hulk Up is one of the only moments in wrestling that legit gives me goosebumps every time I see it. I honestly think Hogan should have ended his career there, obviously I understand the guy needs to make money but from a creative standpoint this would have been amazing.

Same way with how Rock should have went out at XXVIII, because Cena got his victory in a shitty match :lol.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Rock/Hogan is a breathtaking match that I adore. The Hulk Up is one of the only moments in wrestling that legit gives me goosebumps every time I see it. I honestly think Hogan should have ended his career there, obviously I understand the guy needs to make money but from a creative standpoint this would have been amazing.
> 
> Same way with how Rock should have went out at XXVIII, because Cena got his victory in a shitty match :lol.



That's a good topic, what matches or moments still give you goosebumps every single time you see them?

For me, my favorites are:

1. When Eddie is completely covered in blood during his JD 2004 match with JBL, and JBL is punching Eddie and Eddie starts no selling then does his little strut/shoulder shimmy shake around the ring before unloading on JBL. Gets me every single time.

2. When HBK kicks out of that tombstone at WM 25 and Taker makes that amazing expression that some how conveys "oh my god how did he do that" and "oh shit I might be screwed here" at the same time while still keeping Taker badass. Just a great great moment.

3. When Foley is laying in the corner after being thrown off the top and threw of the top of the Cell vs Taker, and it looks like he starts smiling (he's actually trying to show the camera his tongue sliding through his busted lip) with a look that says "I'm not effing dead yet"


----------



## Wilberforce (Feb 14, 2013)

YoungGun_UK said:


> Saw HBK/Angle at a UK House show in 05' and they tore the house down, remember it being worked very similar to the Mania match except HBK went over.
> 
> Del Rio is good 'mechanically' but doesn't have an ounce of personality in anything he does, I mean RAW this week just became a piss-taking session with the commentary with ******'s and Perro's being fitted into every sentence :lol
> 
> Also just seen Rock/Hogan again, if anyone doesn't love this match doesn't get what there professional wrestling is, its literally the ultimate example.


I love that Rock/Hogan match but come on now. To say that anyone that doesn't love it doesn't "get" pro wrestling is pretty ridiculous. I thought this thread was above that sort of "you don't agree with me so you just don't understand it" type of talk.

Anyway, on the topic of the HBK/Angle matches. I personally really like their Mania match. I know some people don't like that Shawn out wrestles Kurt but it didn't bother me at all, in fact, I thought it was a good way of him "getting into his head". I understand that obviously in a real wrestling match Kurt could easily defeat Shawn, but this is pro wrestling so I can happily suspend my belief with that. The only thing that really bothered me was the finish. I get that they were trying to build the suspense of whether Shawn is going to tap or not but come on. It seems like he's in it for fucking eternity.

As far as their Vengeance match goes, I haven't watched it in a while so it merits a rewatch. I do actually remember liking it about the same amount as their Mania match though. Again though, what a ridiculously fucktarded finish. What the fuck exactly is Kurt attempting to do? He doesn't even try and actually perform a move. He literally just jumps into the kick face first.

Anyway I just did my back in at work and I've got some time on my hands so I'll get on some wrasslin. Either today or tomorrow I'll probably watch No Mercy 05 as I have it on DVD and find it to be highly underrated. What are people's thoughts on this?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

*Part 2 *is coming. 8*D


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Eddie pinning Brock and the celebration afterwards always gets me feeling WARM AND FUZZY. Such a feel good moment.

The END OF AN ERA stuff is incredible too.


----------



## Wilberforce (Feb 14, 2013)

As far as feel good moments go. My most recent one was Bryan winning the title at Summerslam and no, I'm not joking. I know he got "screwed" and it was obvious what was going to happen. The fact is though, I got to see Bryan fucking Danielson pin John Cena CLEAN for the WWE championship at Summerslam. No motherfucker can take that away from me and it was glorious.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit countering a Pedigree into the Crippler Crossface always gives me goosebumps. I can picture smarks all around the world watching as their hearts sink when it looks like HHH is going over again... only for Benoit to lock in the Crossface and everyone's hearts starts beating fast in excitement that the underdog and internet favorite has finally achieved his goal.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Feel good moments? The ending of the 1st Chamber match.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Moments that give me goosebumps?

- HHH Entrances at Wrestlemania (21,22,27)
- Hogan Hulk Up Wrestlemania 18
- Pipe Bomb
- MITB 2011 Punk Entrance
- Benoit WM XX
- Eddie Vs BROCK
- Rey Winning the Rumble

& other stuff, that's just off the top of my head.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Feel good moments? Goosebump moments?

Orton beating Benoit clean at Summerslam. That GOAT entrance music, the complete shock of him winning. Wonderful. Also Undertaker kicking out of the tombstone from Hunter at Mania 27. That's the greatest nearfall in Streak history. Incredible.



Callamus said:


> Austin too .


Not sure how I forgot him too. 



Nostalgia said:


> Yep I'm a big Ziggler and Christian fan. Ziggler being my favorite in the company for the past few years, and Christian being my all time favorite.  And I would agree that they're Del Rio's best opponents. Del Rio/Christian Extreme Rules 2011, and Del Rio/Ziggler Payback I would describe as truly great memorable matches, but the rest of their of matches are good, but not great imo. I didn't think much of Christian/Del Rio from Summerslam, good match yes, but it didn't amaze me or nothing, and knowing Christian was 100% losing didn't help. Del Rio's a good TV worker when he's not squashing guys like Kofi and Zack Ryder, which he's often booked to these days, but like a lot of people here I just find it hard to care for a Del Rio match because the guy is so boring from a character standpoint and the crowd seem to agree from his complete lack of reaction whenever he makes his entrance and during his matches.


Completely understandable. I'm not one to get too far into character when someone is at least putting on good-great matches on a regular basis, but I know this is how many people feel. That's the major difference I see between "bland" guys like Del Rio and Axel. Del Rio has put on several quality performances and matches, while Axel has not. Axel is completely void of character and has very little in-ring talent, while Del Rio has quite a bit of the latter. He's shown signs of life when it comes to playing to the crowd as well. The chest slapping and posing these days, winking in his early months, the arrogance he's shown over the years, it's better than just grinding your teeth and yelling like some other folks like to do.



Callamus said:


> Yeah I doubt I'll ever jump on the Del Rio bandwagon either. Didn't think much to him when he first came to WWE and everyone was drooling over him, and over the years I've only cared about a handful of his matches, mostly just with Christian and then the PB match with Ziggler. His character might as well be nonexistent because it's just "I'M MEXICAN AND GRINGOS HATE ME BUT MEXICANS LOVE ME BECAUSE I'M MEXICAN" which isn't much of a character at all .


Did people really drool over him in the beginning though? I don't really remember that going on. I mean, he was a fresh face that was thrust right into the main scene but I don't recall seeing _that_ many fans of him at first. I know people were really pissed when he got involved in the Cena/Punk storyline in 2011 as well.



William Murderface said:


> Del Rio is fantastic, I know he doesn't have a gimmick but who really cares as long as he entertains you in the ring.
> 
> I would say his gimmick is to just be a smug, suave, rich a-hole which works for me


:dance 



Oliver-94 said:


> Agree. Only differences are that Sheamus did challenge for the US title at one stage in his career whereas Del Rio still hasn't challenged for any. A nice run with the IC title wouldn't hurt him at all. *And how many non-title feuds has Del Rio been involved in?* I can only think of the Rey Mysterio feud. Sheamus has feuded with Shield and Henry this year. Both feuds not involving any world title.
> 
> in-ring wrestling is Bryan's strongest point but at least he is very over with the crowd.


Truly not very many at all and I think that's been one of the biggest problems people have with him. The only noteworthy things he's been involved in that weren't Title matches were his early feud with Mysterio, the "feud" with Orton in the fall of 2012 and... well that's about it really. He was in that short lived Laurinaitis team with a couple other heels but that didn't go anywhere. Besides that he's pretty much always been involved in some form of World Title or WWE Title picture, especially this year where he's held the World Title ultimately the entire year since Ziggler got injured during his reign. OH and that Big Show injury thing in the Summer of 2011, but I'd like to forget about that.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

*ATF's Top 50 WWF/E TV Matches Ever

Just like in Part 1, matches are linked within titles

Part 1: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/25969889-post2202.html

PART 2

Honorable Mentions Part 2:
Triple H vs. TAKA Michinoku, Raw 4/10/2000
Kurt Angle & Chris Benoit vs. Edge & Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 11/7/2002
The Usos & Trent Barreta vs. Tyson Kidd, Heath Slater & Justin Gabriel, Superstars 6/30/2011

#40: Chris Benoit vs. Triple H, Raw 7/26/2004









#39: Shawn Michaels vs. Chris Benoit, Raw 2/16/2004









#38: John Morrison vs. CM Punk, ECW 9/4/2007









#37: Finlay vs. Matt Hardy, Smackdown 6/22/2007









#36: DX & The Radicalz vs. The Rock, Cactus Jack, Rikishi & Too Cool, Raw 2/7/2000









(****1/4)
#35: Rey Mysterio vs. John Morrison, Smackdown 9/4/2009









#34: The Shield vs. Team Hell No, Raw 5/27/2013









#33: Owen Hart & The British Bulldog vs. Steve Austin & Shawn Michaels, Raw 5/26/1997









#32: Shawn Michaels vs. Shelton Benjamin, Raw 5/2/2005









#31: Eddie Guerrero vs. Kurt Angle, Smackdown 9/2/2004






*



Spoiler: list



(****)
#50: Drew McIntyre vs. Chris Masters, Superstars 5/12/2011
#49: The Miz vs. John Morrison, Raw 1/3/2011
#48: Edge vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 6/8/2007
#47: Chris Benoit, Shawn Michaels, Mick Foley & Shelton Benjamin vs. Evolution, Raw 4/12/2004
#46: Triple H vs. Chris Jericho, Raw 4/17/2000
#45: Team Hell No & The Undertaker vs. The Shield, Raw 4/22/2013
#44: Rey Mysterio vs. Jamie Noble, Velocity 5/1/2004
#43: Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 9/9/2005
#42: Shawn Michaels vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 7/1/1996
#41: Doink The Clown vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 6/21/1993
#40: Chris Benoit vs. Triple H, Raw 7/26/2004
#39: Shawn Michaels vs. Chris Benoit, Raw 2/16/2004
#38: John Morrison vs. CM Punk, ECW 9/4/2007
#37: Finlay vs. Matt Hardy, Smackdown 6/22/2007
#36: DX & The Radicalz vs. The Rock, Cactus Jack, Rikishi & Too Cool, Raw 2/7/2000
(****1/4)
#35: Rey Mysterio vs. John Morrison, Smackdown 9/4/2009
#34: The Shield vs. Team Hell No, Raw 5/27/2013
#33: Owen Hart & The British Bulldog vs. Steve Austin & Shawn Michaels, Raw 5/26/1997
#32: Shawn Michaels vs. Shelton Benjamin, Raw 5/2/2005
#31: Eddie Guerrero vs. Kurt Angle, Smackdown 9/2/2004


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

# 38 has always been a match I thought was a lot of fun, but pretty overrated. It's an awesome finishing stretch but there's not too much to sink your teeth into. *** 1/2 for me on the last watch, probably *** 3/4 tops.

# 34 is a wonderful tag match, but man I thought that finish was flat as hell. I think I stuck it at *** 3/4 on the live watch.

Besides that, great looks on HBK/Shelton and Mysterio/Morrison. Both **** for me. Shame all those Benoit matches will never see dvd though...


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Ah, those were two obvious ones that I forgot:

Benoit reversing the pedigree, clamping down on the Crippler Crossface, and making Triple fucking H tap, clean, right in the middle of the ring, for the World title, at Wrestlemania. That isn't just a feel good moment, that was downright SHOCKING. As a result, WM XX will always have a spot in my heart for how awesome it was to see that. I honestly thought never in a million years the WWE would have the balls to put their two major titles on Eddie and Benoit. Amazing.

Eddie hitting that frog splash on Lesnar and getting the 1-2-3 at NWO after an all time classic match and celebrating with his family in the crowd is probably the ultimate Warm and Fuzzy moment. WWE never tried to hide that Eddie had his demons, and to see a guy who lost it all come back better than ever, work his ass off, and finally climb the mountain by taking out "The Next Big Thing" Brock Lesnar in front of a 75% Latino audience was fabulous. Seeing him dance on the announce table with the belt in one hand and the Mexican flag in the other was totally refreshing: a guy that absolutely deserved to be champ got his shot and knocked it out of the park. I've always respected Lesnar for giving Eddie such a great match that night and working as hard as he did. Reading his book, you know he was pissed at Vince at the time and was none to too happy about having to drop the title, but he respected Eddie so he did his best.

Another good one is Ric Flair vs HHH on Raw for the World Title in 2003 in front of his Greenville fans. That whole match gives me goosebumps, but especially when he gets Hunter in the Figure 4 and you really believe he might win the title again. Great great moment.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Nice work again. (Y)

HHH/Benoit, HBK/Benoit, Texas tag, Finlay/Matt, Morrison/Rey and Shelton/HBK are all quality.



> Shame all those Benoit matches will never see dvd though...


I wouldn't be so sure. You never know what the future holds.

EDIT: Think I found a suitable pic for the Eddie/Kurt match.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> I wouldn't be so sure. You never know what the future holds.


Well, I'd be beyond shocked if so. At least the big 8 or 10 man tag matches have a shot since they'd outshadow Benoit's presence, but singles matches seem like such a long shot.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Technically the pic w/Eddie's "relaxing" moment *was* from that match


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah, but Kurt is missing so it looks like you're trying to erase him. 



Jack Evans 187 said:


> Well, I'd be beyond shocked if so. At least the big 8 or 10 man tag matches have a shot since they'd outshadow Benoit's presence, but singles matches seem like such a long shot.


Atm they seem unlikely but I can see a change in about 10 years. I'd accept it even with edited commentary since with the use of various video editing programs, you can dub the original audio over the edited one.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

The Texas tag being that low upsets me. Everything I love about professional wrestling wrapped in to fifteen minutes of brilliance.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Cactus Jack said:


> Eddie hitting that frog splash on Lesnar and getting the 1-2-3 at NWO after an all time classic match and celebrating with his family in the crowd is probably the ultimate Warm and Fuzzy moment. WWE never tried to hide that Eddie had his demons, and to see a guy who lost it all come back better than ever, work his ass off, and finally climb the mountain by taking out "The Next Big Thing" Brock Lesnar in front of a 75% Latino audience was fabulous. Seeing him dance on the announce table with the belt in one hand and the Mexican flag in the other was totally refreshing: a guy that absolutely deserved to be champ got his shot and knocked it out of the park. I've always respected Lesnar for giving Eddie such a great match that night and working as hard as he did. Reading his book, you know he was pissed at Vince at the time and was none to too happy about having to drop the title, but he respected Eddie so he did his best.


YES. I was still really young when this happened, but fuck, between that, Punk winning at MITB 2011, and Bryan winning at SummerSlam this year, I don't think I've ever marked that hard. I loved Eddie so much that I still marked when he beat Angle at WM the next month  

As for the Angle vs. Eddie match on ATF's list, was that the 2/3 Falls? I'd like to see a good match with those two because I consider the WMXX and SS04 matches massive disappointments considering the guys involved. I've only seen the 2/3 Falls (although I don't remember much) and their match in 2005 for the #1 Contender's tournament after WM21 (I think).


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

PGSucks said:


> As for the Angle vs. Eddie match on ATF's list, was that the 2/3 Falls? I'd like to see a good match with those two because I consider the WMXX and SS04 matches massive disappointments considering the guys involved. *I've only seen the 2/3 Falls (although I don't remember much) and their match in 2005 for the #1 Contender's tournament after WM21 (I think)*.


Those are their only two matches that are really worth seeing. Specially the 2005 one. They also have a lumberjack match the week after 2/3 falls but that one ends early after Big Show returns and chokeslams the fuck out of the whole roster.

I _do_ need to rewatch WM, though. Haven't seen that one since early 2012.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Just started watching WMXX & the Cena pop when he wins is so loud, it kind of gave me goosebumps.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

One goosebump moment for me is an odd one. 

Takers return at SS 09 :mark: 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Choke2Death said:


> Those are their only two matches that are really worth seeing. Specially the 2005 one. They also have a lumberjack match the week after 2/3 falls but that one ends early after Big Show returns and chokeslams the fuck out of the whole roster.
> 
> I _do_ need to rewatch WM, though. Haven't seen that one since early 2012.


Ah, that's what I'd thought. It sucks that they didn't seem to click very well.

I left my WM21 DVD back in Vegas, but I'll probably bring it up here soon. I love that show's undercard :mark:

EDIT: Skimming through this week's RAW and :lmao at Orton's promo. I actually hope he cuts more promos like this going forward.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Going back to the topic of moments that gave me goosebumps/feel good... I'd have to think about it but the one that stands out for me is Taker's entrance at Mania this year. I can't say it enough, Thr entrance is the GOAT for me and being there live for it... it was just something else.

Plus it was cold out and the continuous flames from Taker's entrance really warmed up the stadium. DAT TAKER LUVS US FANS!


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I thought you were gonna say Sandow wining MITB or him losing to Cena :side:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I get goosebumps every time THE MIZ gets buried.

Wait... that's not a goosebump 8*D.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

Taker returning at Judgement Day 2000 = Gave me goosebumps on my goosebumps


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Those are their only two matches that are really worth seeing. Specially the 2005 one. They also have a lumberjack match the week after 2/3 falls but that one ends early after Big Show returns and chokeslams the fuck out of the whole roster.
> 
> I _do_ need to rewatch WM, though. Haven't seen that one since early 2012.



That lumberjack match is too tough for me to watch. Eddie was just completely broken down by that point and his nerves were shot. You can actually see him scream "don't touch me!" To Kurt when Angle tries to pick him up. It's incredibly sad. If Eddie had just taken some time off and gone to a doctor to have himself checked out, he would still be with us. He just really believed at the time that working out even harder and praying was gonna fix his broken body. God that whole deal just really really sucks. The two greatest workers I've ever seen in the ring are Eddie and Benoit, and both guys bodies completely broke down. I guess there is a lesson in that. What made them so great, their intensity and "stiffness" mixed with the unfiltered aggression in match after match night after night is just too hard on a human body. You fill that same body up with steroids, testosterone, and hgh, and you're gonna have problems. Again, it's just sad. 

Damnit, we were talking about goosebumps/great moments, not the depressing stuff!

How about Taker doing that suicide dive in WM25 and almost breaking his friggin neck? Now THAT was a :mark: moment.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

biggest goosebump moment of this year, :lenny, when his theme started :homer

Cole and CO actually played the moment up very well for their standards


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> biggest goosebump moment of this year, :lenny, when his theme started :homer




:mark::mark::mark::mark:


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Gosh you're just best
> 
> Would you prefer to be called Clint, Clint Eastwood, *Man with no name*, Harry Callahan, or Dirty Harry?












?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Isn't that the Man With No Talent? 8*D


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> That lumberjack match is too tough for me to watch. Eddie was just completely broken down by that point and his nerves were shot. You can actually see him scream "don't touch me!" To Kurt when Angle tries to pick him up. It's incredibly sad. If Eddie had just taken some time off and gone to a doctor to have himself checked out, he would still be with us. *He just really believed at the time that working out even harder and praying was gonna fix his broken body*. God that whole deal just really really sucks. The two greatest workers I've ever seen in the ring are Eddie and Benoit, and both guys bodies completely broke down. I guess there is a lesson in that. What made them so great, their intensity and "stiffness" mixed with the unfiltered aggression in match after match night after night is just too hard on a human body. You fill that same body up with steroids, testosterone, and hgh, and you're gonna have problems. Again, it's just sad.


I have to stop you right there. Eddie asked for time off several times in 2004-2005 but never got the chance because WWE valued him too much.

Jericho says in his book that backstage at SummerSlam, Eddie said he wishes he would get the same opportunity to take a break from wrestling. Bob Holly brings it up even more in his book and notes that Eddie asked for a break a few times but couldn't because WWE needed him.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Watching that Dolph video just made me sad


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> I have to stop you right there. Eddie asked for time off several times in 2004-2005 but never got the chance because WWE valued him too much.
> 
> Jericho says in his book that backstage at SummerSlam, Eddie said he wishes he would get the same opportunity to take a break from wrestling. Bob Holly brings it up even more in his book and notes that Eddie asked for a break a few times but couldn't because WWE needed him.



You are probably right, I just heard that in a Benoit (I think?)interview, he didn't actually allude to Eddie refusing to take off, Eddie probably did request it. But he did say that Eddie believed working out/praying was gonna fix his body. And if Eddie had gone to a doctor and gotten a full work up the enlarged heart would have been discovered. They find it in draft prospects at the NFL combine all the time.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

makes me sad too 

So sad, you can honestly see the joy in his face when he won it to.............he getting da shovel hard at the moment

About ATF list, good list, since I proclaimed #33 the GOAT tag I think I'd have it higher up. I never got into that hbk/shelton match either


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

William Murderface said:


> Watching that Dolph video just made me sad


Yeah, I can understand that. Ziggler got one of the biggest pops in recent memory when he cashed in MITB and that was a great start to his title reign... and then everything went downhill when Swagger gave him a concussion.. Then at Payback after his great match with Del Rio and the perfectly executed double turn it looked like there was some hope with Ziggler again with the fresh face turn, but he hasn't really gone anywhere with it. He was starting to get over and his work as a face was good, but then WWE buried him and it's destroyed his momentum. When you compare his position in the company when he cashed in to his position in the company now where he's not on PPV cards and not even on TV sometimes and he's losing a ton - it's real sad how much he's fallen.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> You are probably right, I just heard that in a Benoit (I think?)interview, he didn't actually allude to Eddie refusing to take off, Eddie probably did request it. But he did say that Eddie believed working out/praying was gonna fix his body. And if Eddie had gone to a doctor and gotten a full work up the enlarged heart would have been discovered. They find it in draft prospects at the NFL combine all the time.


Benoit himself had an enlarged heart. According to his sister-in-law in the interview she did on the 6th anniversary, he would've died within 10 months even without the tragedy. It's so sad to think about because I watched his Off the Record interview from 2004 before Backlash and both him and Eddie are on top of the world. Benoit talks about how wrestlers who blame the industry for their drug addictions are full of it as well as the media blaming wrestling for the shit that happens. He basically said it's your choice and you do it to yourself. Sucks that he went down the same path. 

Oh well, at least their great work will always be there to appreciate.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> Benoit himself had an enlarged heart. According to his sister-in-law in the interview she did on the 6th anniversary, he would've died within 10 months even without the tragedy. It's so sad to think about because I watched his Off the Record interview from 2004 before Backlash and both him and Eddie are on top of the world. Benoit talks about how wrestlers who blame the industry for their drug addictions are full of it as well as the media blaming wrestling for the shit that happens. He basically said it's your choice and you do it to yourself. Sucks that he went down the same path.
> 
> Oh well, at least their great work will always be there to appreciate.


Haven't seen that interview before. Have you got a link to it?

Eddie and Benoit's deaths lead to the wellness policy happening. If that didn't happen, we'd probably have wrestlers today over-abusing steroids and other drugs and leading to early deaths. Eddie and Benoit did steroids to get huge muscle wise to make up for their lack of height, because the mentality back then seemed to be the bigger you were the more chance you had to get pushed. Both Eddie and Benoit were huge before their deaths, far too big then they should of been, and their bodies couldn't handle that plus all the other drugs and bumps in the ring. I'm glad we have the wellness policy today.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

It's just a shame that the wellness policy is really only around BECAUSE the likes of Eddie and Benoit died .


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

ATF said:


> *ATF's Top 50 WWF/E TV Matches Ever
> 
> 
> 
> ...


*

worthless comments againexclamationpointexclamationpoint:

I'd have Finlay/Hardy way higher, unsurprisingly. Maybe top ten. I ranked it as my #5 SmackDown match however long ago and it still would be, and IDK how many non-SmackDown matches would best it. Raw 2000 tag is probably where I'd put it.....maybe higher. Maybe way higher? Again, this is a list which is hard to comment on without having my own list (but I'm still commenting b/c because). I could ahve the tag there, I could have it twenty spots higher. Rey/Morrison I like but I'm not sure I'd have in the top 50 at all. Probably ten Rey matches from SmackDown or SuperStars in 2010 alone I prefer. Punk/Morrison is kind of 'just OK' to me until the really good finish run. Michaels/Benjamin I don't get. Really average. Wouldn't list Benoit/Michaels, but I reckon I would list their match in May b/c I thought it was way better and bordering on excellent. Raw 97 tag I think I'd have higher, but you could list things later on that'd make me go 'wait I don't prefer it to that'. Like if you were listing best SummerSlam matches I could think about matches that only happen at SummerSlam and feel confident about where something might be. This is more broad and I have to remember 'shit, that happened there....' I don't remember any Eddie/Angle that didn't happen on PPV. the one you listed and the one from TV in 05 (2/3 falls?) I think I like, but I just don't remember. I think I would honestly consider listing Angle v. Marty Jannetty in 05 as far as Angle on TV goes. Genuine. Love it, honestly think it smokes all of the Angle/Michaels it was building up to. People should talk more about that match. Can't think of a non-Rey/Taker/Austin Angle match on TV I like more. Or hell, maybe on PPV too.​*


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Nostalgia said:


> Haven't seen that interview before. Have you got a link to it?


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

*Cody Rhodes and Goldust vs. The Shield (Seth Rollins and Roman Reigns) - WWE Battleground 2013: ***1/2*

Finally got around to watching this match and it is damn good. The stipulation of the match is that if Cody and Goldust wins the match, they're back in the WWE. The match starts out with The Rhodes family getting the advantage early on but The Shield comes back to control. As Rollins was working on Cody, Cody hits a big moonsault to give Goldust the hot tag. Goldust gets a flurry going on from his trademark punch on his knees to a crossbody top rope, but the momentum stops when Reigns ducks Golduts running crossbody and gets the momentum back. There was great teasing on Goldust trying to get the tag to Cody and The Shield stopping in his tracks and Goldust sold the beating really well. Cody eventually gets tagged in and goes HAM on everybody. Dusty stops Ambrose from interfering and while that was going on, Rollins tries to go for the schoolboy but Cody kicks out, and gives out his best Cross Rhodes for the win. The crowd was hot for this match and the ending was really satisfying. Really good match.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Finlay/Hardy from Smackdown would be in my top 20 for best TV matches, but again I have to give you props for even attempting a top 50 TV matches list. There has just been so much quality stuff since 1993 it is difficult to remember it all. And I'm sure I've probably only seen half of what is out there.

I'm curious to see where my pick for best TV match ever (Eddie/Rey SD) ends up, along with my second favorite Stone Cold/Benoit.

Also, I hope you didn't forget the Finlay/Kane Belfast Brawl. That is one fantastic match. Or Finlay/Benoit SD for that matter. See what I mean? There is just a TON of great TV matches.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


>


Just finished watching this. Good interview, Benoit comes across as real genuine. You can tell he's not really the interview sort, was a little awkward at the start, but it got a better as it went on. Benoit being a quite guy and not the sort to do politics I can believe. Interesting comments on some wrestlers. As for the drug addiction comments, I think he was just speaking good of the company. With him being the World Champion at the time he was representing the company and he wasn't going to speak out too much on the drug side of things, wrestlers may not of been forced to do them, but I think many of them, particularly smaller guys like Eddie and Benoit were pressured into getting bigger through steroids because that's what WWE wanted at the time.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

StraightEdgeJesus said:


> *Cody Rhodes and Goldust vs. The Shield (Seth Rollins and Roman Reigns) - WWE Battleground 2013: ***1/2*
> 
> Finally got around to watching this match and it is damn good. The stipulation of the match is that if Cody and Goldust wins the match, they're back in the WWE. The match starts out with The Rhodes family getting the advantage early on but The Shield comes back to control. As Rollins was working on Cody, Cody hits a big moonsault to give Goldust the hot tag. Goldust gets a flurry going on from his trademark punch on his knees to a crossbody top rope, but the momentum stops when Reigns ducks Golduts running crossbody and gets the momentum back. There was great teasing on Goldust trying to get the tag to Cody and The Shield stopping in his tracks and Goldust sold the beating really well. Cody eventually gets tagged in and goes HAM on everybody. Dusty stops Ambrose from interfering and while that was going on, Rollins tries to go for the schoolboy but Cody kicks out, and gives out his best Cross Rhodes for the win. The crowd was hot for this match and the ending was really satisfying. Really good match.


This. The match really was very good in just about all respects. I'd give it a ****.

What made it stand out was the shitty rest of the PPV.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

I gave it ****1/2* and I'm glad someone gave it the same rating. It's a good match, but it's gets overrated on here. The crowd being really into it and the fact it was the only good match on the card made it stand out a lot more than it should of done and I think because of that people tend to overrate it.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Dailymotion's telling me my video is too big, when it fits the requirements for size. :side:

And now that I finished an exam that'd been eating me alive all week, it's time to blow off some steam!

By watching wrestling! :delrio


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Nostalgia said:


> Just finished watching this. Good interview, Benoit comes across as real genuine. You can tell he's not really the interview sort, was a little awkward at the start, but it got a better as it went on. Benoit being a quite guy and not the sort to do politics I can believe. Interesting comments on some wrestlers. As for the drug addiction comments, I think he was just speaking good of the company. With him being the World Champion at the time he was representing the company and he wasn't going to speak out too much on the drug side of things, wrestlers may not of been forced to do them, but I think many of them, particularly smaller guys like Eddie and Benoit were pressured into getting bigger through steroids because that's what WWE wanted at the time.


Yeah, I have no doubts that WWE likely pressured the smaller wrestlers to take steroids and other stuff to get bigger. They were obviously forced to create the wellness policy because of Eddie but it was still a joke according to a few with insider info, hence Benoit passing the latest test he did before dying. Obviously, the tragedy forced them to take it more seriously. It's just sad that two of the greatest paid the price for this.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

Nostalgia said:


> Yeah, I can understand that. Ziggler got one of the biggest pops in recent memory when he cashed in MITB and that was a great start to his title reign... and then everything went downhill when Swagger gave him a concussion.. Then at Payback after his great match with Del Rio and the perfectly executed double turn it looked like there was some hope with Ziggler again with the fresh face turn, but he hasn't really gone anywhere with it. He was starting to get over and his work as a face was good, but then WWE buried him and it's destroyed his momentum. When you compare his position in the company when he cashed in to his position in the company now where he's not on PPV cards and not even on TV sometimes and he's losing a ton - it's real sad how much he's fallen.


I think that's my favorite live moment ever. 



Cactus Jack said:


> Ah, those were two obvious ones that I forgot:
> 
> Benoit reversing the pedigree, clamping down on the Crippler Crossface, and making Triple fucking H tap, clean, right in the middle of the ring, for the World title, at Wrestlemania. That isn't just a feel good moment, that was downright SHOCKING. As a result, WM XX will always have a spot in my heart for how awesome it was to see that. I honestly thought never in a million years the WWE would have the balls to put their two major titles on Eddie and Benoit. Amazing.
> 
> ...


Honestly moments like this make me wish that WWE would have just pulled the trigger and let him get the win. I like those moments where someone _almost_ overcomes all the odds and gets the improbable win but I'm always left thinking that it would have been better if the underdog won. Yeah that was a special night but it would have been so much better had he got the win. I get protecting the champion but honestly who cares? It's not real and they're supposed to create big moments and I get annoyed when they almost did. Actually I could almost make the same argument for Hogan/Rock. Just give the fans their big moment.



Wilberforce said:


> I love that Rock/Hogan match but come on now. To say that anyone that doesn't love it doesn't "get" pro wrestling is pretty ridiculous. I thought this thread was above that sort of "you don't agree with me so you just don't understand it" type of talk.


For the most part it is but I totally agree with the statement. I'm not sure how you could make a reasonable argument and say that it wasn't a special match. Hogan, the guy that built the company, was gone for years and finally was back home in the WWF. But he was a bad guy. Then on the biggest show of the year we got to see Hulk Hogan and not Hollywood Hulk Hogan. Him Hulking up was an amazing moment because it meant so much more than just seeing him Hulk up. 

I honestly think I could write pages upon pages explaining why him Hulking up at Mania is so significant. I don't want to but I think I could.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

PGSucks said:


> Dailymotion's telling me my video is too big, when it fits the requirements for size. :side:
> 
> And now that I finished an exam that'd been eating me alive all week, it's time to blow off some steam!
> 
> By watching wrestling! :delrio


Are you gonna watch some Del Rio!? :adr


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

LOL nah, I decided to watch some EDDIE because I was reading his autobiography earlier today. Just watched HH97 against Rey because that's one of my favorite matches ever. Might pop in my SummerSlam 2002 DVD to watch his match against Edge, but that would require me getting out of bed. :side:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Battleground tag isn't overrated. :ti

It was a match built up on definitive top quality work, booking, & storytelling. Everything you look for with pro wrestling.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Yea I would agree. That match felt like it was drug kicking and screaming out of 1986 NWA mid-Atlantic wrestling. It's not often you get to see 4 top notch guys go into a match that's booked to perfection, a storyline that resonates leading into it, and flawless execution of tag team wrestling. We even got a mark out moment with Dusty delivering the bionic elbow. I try not to make blanket statements because everyone has their own preferences and feelings, but I just don't understand how you can be a wrestling fan and not get goosebumps watching Dusty come alive when his family is challenged and nail Ambrose with that elbow. One of my favorite moments this entire year. 

I'm a total mark for tag-team wrestling anyway, so seeing that match really really got me pumped. And no it wasn't just because the rest of the card stunk, I didn't watch Battleground live, I watched that tag the day after just by itself. I've really really enjoyed this years ring work, even if the story lines have either been botched or stunk for the most part. And the number 1 reason I've liked so much about this year has been the return of fabulous tag teams having phenomenal matches.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah, I didn't think the theory of it being on a bad PPV + having the crowd going nuts was the only reason many thought it was great. The match itself earned that praise from folks all on its own. Which is why fans ended up caring for it. They made you. Scenario was booked well & the work put forth made it culminate into one of the better, memorable moments of 2013.

WWE in 2013 is super sick with tag team excellence. For me that has gone a long way in putting the year on a certain level. I'm willing to ignore the bland & bad aspects WWE has done in exchange for being glad of all the quality matches they've given.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Yeah, I didn't think the theory of it being on a bad PPV + having the crowd going nuts was the only reason many thought it was great. The match itself earned that praise from folks all on its own. Which is why fans ended up caring for it. They made you. Scenario was booked well & the work put forth made it culminate into one of the better, memorable moments of 2013.
> 
> WWE in 2013 is super sick with tag team excellence. For me that has gone a long way in putting the year on a certain level. I'm willing to ignore the bland & bad aspects WWE has done in exchange for being glad of all the quality matches they've given.



Hayley- did you ever watch that Benoit vs MENG Take Over 1997 match Yeah1993 pimped in the other thread?? I just finished it and......GOOD LORD :mark: :mark:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

I've seen a few people throw MOTY and *****1/2* ratings and stuff for that match, and for me that's overrating it just a tad. It was a good match, I remember me and my brother watching live and getting really into it and the story (which was surprising at the time because I hadn't really cared for the story up until that point) but matches like Punk/Taker, Punk/Brock, Ziggler/Del Rio were better this year.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Love that "Good Lord" is being used all praise :flair3

Whats this Angle/Janetty Yeah speaks of ?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> Hayley- did you ever watch that Benoit vs MENG Take Over 1997 match Yeah1993 pimped in the other thread?? I just finished it and......GOOD LORD :mark: :mark:


Shoot. Forgot to get on that. I'll do it right now.



redskins25 said:


> Love that "Good Lord" is being used all praise :flair3
> 
> Whats this Angle/Janetty Yeah speaks of ?


Haven't seen it from the original air date, but it's a really good match from Smackdown in 2005 leading up to the Angle vs Michaels match at WM 21. I hope that holds up. Would be crushed to know it sucks b/c Angle is shitty.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> Love that "Good Lord" is being used all praise :flair3
> 
> Whats this Angle/Janetty Yeah speaks of ?



Glad you picked up on that, I've noticed since I listened to that Naitch Stone Cold podcast I've been using that phrase a lot. Ric Flair has the best laugh ever, it cracks me up just listening to him laugh.


You haven't seen Angle/Janetty? Seriously? Oh my goodness it's FABULOUS. It was during the build for WM21, Angle was trying to prove he can do everything better than HBK, so he brought Jannetty out and proceeded to tear the fucking house down with him. That match was so good it led to Janetty getting a full time contract offer from WWE, but of course, Marty was still Marty, so he fucked it up :lmao

But yea, you definitely need to check it out. It was on Smackdown leading up to WM21, can't remember the exact date.

GOOD LORD.

Edit- Hayley, you're gonna love it. It's exactly what you'd expect it to be. Remember sometime whenever you're bored to check out that Los Guerreros/Bangle Rebellion tag, I promise you won't be disappointed


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Haven't seen it from the original air date, but it's a really good match from Smackdown in 2005 leading up to the Angle vs Michaels match at WM 21. I hope that holds up. Would be crushed to know it sucks b/c Angle is shitty.





Cactus Jack said:


> Glad you picked up on that, I've noticed since I listened to that Naitch Stone Cold podcast I've been using that phrase a lot. Ric Flair has the best laugh ever, it cracks me up just listening to him laugh.
> 
> 
> You haven't seen Angle/Janetty? Seriously? Oh my goodness it's FABULOUS. It was during the build for WM21, Angle was trying to prove he can do everything better than HBK, so he brought Jannetty out and proceeded to tear the fucking house down with him. That match was so good it led to Janetty getting a full time contract offer from WWE, but of course, Marty was still Marty, so he fucked it up :lmao
> ...


Yea Ive incorporated it into my irl vocabulary, we talking it in chat earlier, I had to watch the 2k14 panel again :lmao holds up, Sono pm-ed my his wife swap with Piper

Gonna give this angle/janetty a watch right now, will let you know


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Started this discussion at work, What has been MOTY since you've started watching? 

96: HBK/Mandkind IYH 
97: Austin/Bret WM 
98: Kane/Taker WM 
99: Foley/Rock I quit RR
00: HHH/Foley RR 
01: Dudleys/Hardy/E&C TLC WM 
02: HHH/HBK SS
03: Angle/Lesnar SS 
04: HBK/HHH/Beniot WM
05: Batista/HHH HIAC 
06: Taker/Angle NWO
07: Cena/HBK WM
08: Edge/Taker WM 
09: HBK/Taker WM 
10: HBK/Taker WM
11: Orton/Christian SS or HHH/Taker WM
12: Punk/Jericho WM
13: Punk/Lesnar SS 

Was close of putting Austin/Rock ahead of TLC at WM 17, but couldn't. Fuck I think that TLC match was 5 stars. Pure magic. 

HBK: Involved in 6
Taker involved in 5
HHH Involved in 5 
Foley, Lesnar & Punk involved in 2. 

What y'all got!?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I've heard a lot about Benoit/Meng matches here so I decided to check one out and went with the death match from Slamboree. Enjoyable match, specially Benoit's performance. The second rope German was :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Slamboree match is a top five in 1997 on the whole. Benoit was great, but Meng's beast like presence was >.

Match in Germany was sick. THE MOST BRUTAL SHOULDER BREAKER KNOWN TO MAN. MENG.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

xdoomsayerx said:


> =
> 01: Dudleys/Hardy/E&C TLC WM


No love for benoit/jericho ladder? that is my MOTY by a long shot, although I haven't seen Angle/Austin, think I'll watch that very soon though


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> No love for benoit/jericho ladder? that is my MOTY by a long shot, although I haven't seen Angle/Austin, think I'll watch that very soon though




Well 01 featured some epic matches. You had 

TLC 
Jericho/Beniot (I definitely don't hate)
Austin/Rock 
Angle/Austin 
Austin/Trips 3 stages of hell 

I just can't stop loving that TLC at WM. Everything was perfect IMO. Also Jericho/Beniot ladder is the GOAT ladder match, so I definitely don't hate it


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

xdoomsayerx said:


> Started this discussion at work, What has been MOTY since you've started watching?
> 
> 96: HBK/Mandkind IYH
> 97: Austin/Bret WM
> ...




1993: Bret vs Perfect KotR 
1994: Bret vs Owen WM 10
1995: Bret vs Bulldog IYH: SB
1996: Mankind vs HBK IYH: MG
1997: Bret vs Stone Cold WM 13
1998: Dude Love vs Stone Cold IYH: OTE
1999: Mankind vs The Rock I Quit Royal Rumble
2000: Cactus Jack vs Triple H Street Fight Royal Rumble
2001: Angle vs Austin SS
2002: Brock vs Undertaker HiaC No Mercy
2003: Undertaker vs Angle Smackdown
2004: Eddie vs JBL Judgement Day
2005: Eddie vs Rey Smackdown 6/23/05
2006: Undertaker vs Kurt Angle NWO
2007: Batista vs Undertaker WM 23
2008: Undertaker vs Edge HiaC SS
2009: HBK vs Undertaker WM 25
2010: HBK vs Undertaker WM 26
2011: CM Punk vs John Cena MitB 
2012: CM Punk vs Daniel Bryan OTL (tie) The Shield vs Hell No/Ryback TLC
2013: CM Punk vs Brock Lesnar SS


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Alright, watching Angle/austin SS right now, honestly going in expecting a classic


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Alright, watching Angle/austin SS right now, honestly going in expecting a classic



You wont be disappointed, its Austin's best match ever in my opinion. Superior to every Rock match, only ones that come close are the Bemoit match from Smackdown and the Dude Love match from Over the Edge


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

xdoomsayerx said:


> Well 01 featured some epic matches. You had
> 
> TLC
> Jericho/Beniot (I definitely don't hate)
> ...


Yeah I do love the TLC, ****1/2 from me. but the ladder match is ***** IMO, loving Austin/Angle so far. 

Think I'll review EC 2013 tomorrow


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> You wont be disappointed, its Austin's best match ever in my opinion. Superior to every Rock match, only ones that come close are the Benoit match from Smackdown and the Dude Love match from Over the Edge


What about Bret from WM13?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

b/c I'm lazy I'll just start at '96 like how the poster who asked the question did:_ (and assuming it is only WWF/WWE related)_

96: Undertaker vs Mankind - King of the Ring
97: Undertaker vs Mankind - Revenge of the Taker
98: Austin vs Dude Love - Over The Edge
99: Undertaker vs Austin - Fully Loaded
00: Cactus Jack vs Triple H - Royal Rumble + Edge & Christian vs Hardys vs Dudleys - SummerSlam
01: Austin vs Angle - SummerSlam 
02: Undertaker vs Lesnar - No Mercy
03: Undertaker vs Angle - Smackdown 9/??
04: Eddie vs JBL - Judgment Day
05: Eddie vs Mysterio - Smackdown 6/23
06: Anything with Finlay
07: Cena vs Umaga - Royal Rumble + Undertaker vs Batista - WrestleMania 23
08: Undertaker vs Big Show - No Mercy
09: Undertaker vs Michaels - WrestleMania 25
10: Sheamus vs Morrison - TLC
11: Cena vs Punk - Money in the Bank
12: Cena vs Lesnar - Extreme Rules
13: Punk vs Lesnar - SummerSlam

That's about right. Love all the constants popping up: Taker, Foley, Cena, Punk, Lesnar, Eddie, Austin. No wonder they're my favorites. Angle makes two appearances. When that guy was great, he was GREAT. Shame it wasn't enough. At least he gave me some stuff to be gaga over. I may have underrated a lot of Christian matches for this list. At least he made it in some capacity. Christian vs Swagger is SOOOO close behind Undertaker vs Michaels. But honestly, my reaction during Undertaker's WM match is so out of this world that I have to continue to put it over. 2002 was almost a hard selection to pick, despite the perfection that is Hell in a Cell. My top ten for that year is unfuckwithable. So many outstanding matches.

I want Yeah1993 to post his. b/c I know I probably should have given some love to more TV matches. I'm 99% positive that's where a few of his picks will be. _('97, 2008, & 2010 at least iirc)_


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

****3/4 for Angle/austin SS, fucking awesome. Checking out ambrose/rollins from FCW now, earlier someone said this was fun


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Taker/Mankind in 97 is better than HBK/Taker from Badd Blood for you? I've never seen the Revenge of the Taker match, but maybe I should. 

And you've got Sheamus/Morrison better than HBK/Taker? I remember that match happening, but probably worth a rewatch.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Why the fuck not

94 hbk/razor wm 10
95 bret/diesel svs 95 / hbk/jarrett iyh
96 hbk/mankind iyh
97 hbk/taker HIAC
98 foley/austin over the edge
99 N/A
00 hhh/foley rumble
01 ausitn/angle ss 01
02 N/A
03 N/A
04 eddie/jbl JD 04
05 hhh/batista HIAC
06 benoit/orton sd NHB ; orton/rey sd
07 hbk/cena mania
08 hbk/flair mania
09 hbk/taker mania
10 hbk/taker mania
11 cena/punk mitb
12 cena/lesnar er
13 punk/lesnar ss 13

I want to see Yeah list as well, I love pimping TV matches so there are some I'm probaly missing

leaning toward lesnar/benoit sd or taker/angle for 2003


PPL BETTER SEE THIS


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Haven't seen a lot from some years but I'll try too:

1996: Bret vs Austin - Survivor Series
1997: Bret vs Austin - WM or Undertaker vs HBK - Bad Blood
1998: Austin vs Dude Love - OTE
1999: Rock vs Mankind - RR
2000: Rock vs Benoit - FL
2001: Austin vs Rock - WM
2002: Taker vs Brock - NM
2003: Angle vs Brock - SS (Benoit vs Brock is up there and Benoit vs Angle from RR needs a rewatch)
2004: Benoit vs HBK vs HHH - WM
2005: Batista vs HHH - Vengeance
2006: Taker vs Angle - NWO
2007: Cena vs Umaga - RR
2008: HBK vs Jericho - NM
2009: HBK vs Taker - WM
2010: HBK vs Taker - WM
2011: Orton vs Christian - Over the Limit
2012: Brock vs Cena - ER
2013: Brock vs Punk - SS

BROCK is simply unstoppable. Adding the Eddie match and he's got a MOTYC for every year he's been in WWE.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

96: mankind vs taker KOTR
97: taker vs HBK HIAC
98: Austin/dude OTE
99: Rock/mankind LMS
00: HHH/foley RR
01: Benoit/jericho RR
02: Lesnar vs taker HIAC
03: the rock vs austin 
04: three way tie: HBK/HHH/benoit, Orton/Foley, and JBL/Eddie JD
05: Batista/HHH HIAC
06: Angle/taker SD 2/???
07: Batista/taker WM 23 
08: HBK/flair 
09: HBK/taker
10: HBK/taker
11: Punk/cena MITB
12: Cena/Lesnar 
13: Punk/Lesnar


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> ****3/4 for Angle/austin SS, fucking awesome. Checking out ambrose/rollins from FCW now, earlier someone said this was fun


Austin vs Angle is Kurt's best match by a million miles, imo. Stellar, stellar, stellar.

Watch all three Ambrose vs Rollins matches in a row. It makes the impact of growth among the trilogy that much better. I did it and it was so worth it. Third match is arguably ******* worthy.



HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Taker/Mankind in 97 is better than HBK/Taker from Badd Blood for you? I've never seen the Revenge of the Taker match, but maybe I should.
> 
> And you've got Sheamus/Morrison better than HBK/Taker? I remember that match happening, but probably worth a rewatch.


I love the HIAC, but personally I've always been more drawn to the Taker vs Foley match. You got to check it out. It's very, very fabulous.

That one was easy. Taker vs Shawn @ WM for the second time is good, but I've never found it to be GREAT. I'd have a good bit of matches over Taker vs Shawn in 2010, tbhayley.

-------------

Finally rewatched Flair vs Angle from 2005. It holds up. Flair carries Angle to a wonderful match. Not to say Angle was bad in it, he wasn't, but this was a total Flair show. Unreal performance. I'm talking probably best of the year. And that can include his work vs Triple H in the cage. Which he was a total boss in too. Flair went ultra dirty here & GOOD LORD did it ever get a rise out of me.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

No idea which one is on TBH, 30 minute Iron man match from 9/18/11? pretty fucking awesome :mark:


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Haven't seen a lot from some years but I'll try too:
> 
> 1996: Bret vs Austin - Survivor Series
> 1997: Bret vs Austin - WM or Undertaker vs HBK - Bad Blood
> ...




That Orton/Christian series :Mark

I still love their SS match the most, but OTL was great in its own regard as well. 

1st WHC on SD; ***3/4
OTL: ****1/4
MITB: ***1/2
SS: ****1/2
SD cage: ***3/4


I don't remember their capital punishment match. Is it worth a watch? Pretty sure it is.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I should have added Rock vs Benoit from Fully Loaded, but thought a three way tie was tacky. Doesn't really matter, it'll be a top three match for me in 2000, regardless. Don't remember that tag team match from Texas as well as I should.

Orton vs Christian matches aren't any good outside of Over The Limit. First on Smackdown still sucks. Remember watching it and thinking it was the flattest match ever despite all this weird praise.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

CP is definitely worth a watch. It's the weakest of the series but it's still good. Works an even slower pace but has a nice little story going with the concussion thing.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

How can you guys be watching wrestling when the SKINS are playing? Puttin up 24 points in the first half! Griffin's on fire! Morris is tearin it up! :lol

To be on topic, yes Orton/Christian from Capitol Punishment is worth a watch. *** 1/2 for me.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

xdoomsayerx said:


> Started this discussion at work, What has been MOTY since you've started watching?
> 
> 96: HBK/Mandkind IYH
> 97: Austin/Bret WM
> ...


Is this WWE exclusive or can anything be included?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> -------------
> 
> Finally rewatched Flair vs Angle from 2005. It holds up. Flair carries Angle to a wonderful match. Not to say Angle was bad in it, he wasn't, but this was a total Flair show. Unreal performance. I'm talking probably best of the year. And that can include his work vs Triple H in the cage. Which he was a total boss in too. Flair went ultra dirty here & *GOOD LORD *did it ever get a rise out of me.


This whole post and the bolded part put a huge smile on my face , I want to watch the angle/janetty but I have so much work to do, will do it tomorrow

I also just wanted to know Cody since you apart of that group, just out of curious what do you guys not see in michaels/taker II thats in I ? the moment not big enough ? Just curious


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

What a match this was, only bad thing is Naomi's ring announcing, ****


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

KO Bossy said:


> Is this WWE exclusive or can anything be included?




Anything of course. I'm just a wwe guy.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

SKINS. It isn't hard to mutlitask, my man. @corey...:hayley3

I just want to watch a ton of 2005 WWE now. Year was so good. At least I bought into a lot they produced. RAW, for example, was on fire with their TV product.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I have no clue why my name hasnt changed yet


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

MOTY since I started watching wrestling (1998):

98: Undertaker vs. Kane Wrestlemania 14

99: Undertaker vs. Austin Fully Loaded

(Note: For 1998 and 1999, I really only remember/have watched a couple hands full of matches, so my choices are very limited due to that)

00: Foley vs. Triple H Royal Rumble

01: Austin vs. Angle Summerslam 

02: Undertaker vs. Brock Lesnar No Mercy 

03: Chris Benoit vs. Angle Royal Rumble

04: Eddie Guerrero vs. JBL Judgement Day

05: Batista vs. Triple H Vengeance

06: Undertaker vs. Angle No Way Out

07: Undertaker vs. Batista Wrestlemania 23

08: Undertaker vs. Edge Summerslam

09: Undertaker vs. HBK Wrestlemania 25

10: Undertaker vs. HBK Wrestlemania 26

11: CM Punk vs. John Cena Money in the Bank

12: CM Punk vs. Daniel Bryan Over the Limit

13: CM Punk vs. Brock Lesnar Summerslam


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I like to have absolutely nothing else going on while I'm watching wrestling. I don't even like it when my cat's in my room, somehow distracts me.  That's why I normally watch everything at night when's everyone's asleep and nothing's going on.

Big game for the Skins in prime time, gotta watch with close eyes as they try and make a run to win the division again. :mark:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Big game for the Skins in prime time, gotta watch with close eyes as they try and make a run to win the division again. :mark:


B4 RG3 hurts his knee 

So many skins fans where I live, you guys get so excited when you win a game against a garbage team :lmao


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> B4 RG3 hurts his knee
> 
> So many skins fans where I live, you guys get so excited when you win a game against a garbage team
> :lmao


:lmao I dont live anywhere near washington and I'm a fan


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

redskins25 said:


> This whole post and the bolded part put a huge smile on my face , I want to watch the angle/janetty but I have so much work to do, will do it tomorrow
> 
> I also just wanted to know Cody since you apart of that group, just out of curious what do you guys not see in michaels/taker II thats in I ? the moment not big enough ? Just curious


It had a lot to do with not being able to match the quality of the first for one. You know how it goes with sequels a lot of the time - hard to recreate the magic. With the looming stip of it either being "Undertaker's Streak ending or Michaels' career being over" it did give it good drama. However, you can only do so many of the similar spots again. Which I felt was good, but nothing to make me think it went near the same level as before or exceeded. Did love the tombstone on the floor spot. And the moonsault through the table. Finish was good - put over Shawn's way of making it similar to how he finished off Flair a few years prior. Plus the jumping tombstone. Idc if it is common in Japanese juniors matches. UNDERTAKER DID IT. WHICH MADE IT RADICAL. I'll still say it's very good & a match I can always enjoy watching. I'm just not completely sold on it being MOTY personally. Felt Christian alone had a barrage of matches that trumped it in the overall category. Same with Mysterio & Punker too. Mysterio vs Swagger from MITB holds higher preference for me, for example. It's probably top twenty for me. I can give it that.



Jack Evans 187 said:


> I like to have absolutely nothing else going on while I'm watching wrestling. I don't even like it when my cat's in my room, somehow distracts me.  That's why I normally watch everything at night when's everyone's asleep and nothing's going on.
> 
> Big game for the Skins in prime time, gotta watch with close eyes as they try and make a run to win the division again. :mark:


Wrestling usually earns my focus if it's something I want to watch, so with the game on minimal volume in the background I can focus on what match or matches I'm wanting to check out.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> B4 RG3 hurts his knee
> 
> So many skins fans where I live, you guys get so excited when you win a game against a garbage team :lmao


You watch your mouth! :lol Honestly I hear that all the time, but I'm just a passionate fan. We went through years of mediocrity and it's just nice to have some notable players and wins now.

Heyyy wrestling. Uh... my MOTY list probably wouldn't look like anyone else's. 2008 and 2002 in particular. HBK vs. HHH Street Fight and HBK vs. Jericho at Judgment Day.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Someone already had that _*AWFUL*_ Trips vs Michaels match in for their 2002 pick.

:curry2


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Someone already had that _*AWFUL*_ Trips vs Michaels match in for their 2002 pick.
> 
> :curry2


unk4


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> You watch your mouth! :lol Honestly I hear that all the time, but I'm just a passionate fan. We went through years of mediocrity and it's just nice to have some notable players and wins now.
> 
> Heyyy wrestling. Uh... my MOTY list probably wouldn't look like anyone else's. 2008 and 2002 in particular. HBK vs. HHH Street Fight and HBK vs. Jericho at Judgment Day.


Didn't you say you lived in Winchester? I rode by signs for Winchester coming back from DC this weekend. 

Anyways, giving the MOTY list a try. I started watching in December 1998, so I'll start with 1999.

1999 - Hardy's/Edge and Christian No Mercy
2000 - Trips/Cactus Royal Rumble
2001 - Trips/Austin NWO
2002 - Brock/Taker NM 
2003 - Rock/Austin WM 19 or Angle/Lesnar Summerslam or Trips/HBK Raw
2004 - Trips/HBK/Benoit WM 20
2005 - Trips/Batista Vengeance 2005
2006 - Orton/Mysterio (Smackdown) or Taker/Angle NWO
2007 - Orton/Trips (NM) ??
2008 - HBK/Jericho Judgment Day or No Mercy
2009 - HBK/Taker WM 25
2010 - HBK/Taker
2011 - Punk/Cena
2012 - Trips/Taker WM 28 or Punk/Bryan OTL
2013 - Punk/Lesnar

So, this is more about my personal favorites, especially since there are a number of matches that I haven't even seen. Rock/Austin at Mania 19 is such a beautiful story with Rock's best performance (in my opinion), and it's Austin's last match, so it's emotional. 

2007 I'm not well versed in, but I love Trips/Orton from No Mercy, so that's at least a place holder, but it could be in contention for other folks' MOTY. 

I remember watching the tag ladder match from No Mercy 1999 and just being in love with it, so I'm sticking with that for 99. Just amazing.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Tag Team Ladder match in 1999 is probably my #2 from that year. Good pick (Y)

I'm one of the few guys that would put Undertaker & Show vs Kane & X-Pac in their best of '99. I swear that was close to #1. It's not a good year for WWF in terms of the "work". Not much to select.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Yeah I live just outside of Winchester. Cool to hear. (Y)

Love for the HBK/Jericho Judgment Day match. :mark:


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Yeah, not many great or really good matches to choose from in 1999. Austin/Rock at Backlash is great fun, and I've not seen the I Quit match from the Rumble in some time.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

1996: Bret Vs Austin - Survivor Series
1997: The Undertaker Vs HBK - Bad Blood
1998: The Undertaker Vs Mankind - King of the Ring
1999: Austin Vs The Undertaker - Fully Loaded
2000: HHH Vs Jericho - FL
2001: Benoit Vs Austin - SD
2002: Taker vs Brock - NM
2003: Benoit Vs Brock - SD
2004: Eddie Vs JBL - JD
2005: Batista vs HHH - Vengeance
2006: Mysterio Vs Orton - SD
2007: Cena vs HBK - WM
2008: Cena vs Jericho - SS
2009: HBK vs Taker - WM
2010: HBK vs Taker - WM
2011: Cena Vs Punk - MITB
2012: Brock vs Cena - ER
2013: Brock vs Punk - SS

Watched all the Punk Vs Bryan matches today as well :mark:.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Austin vs Rock from Backlash is the other that would probably round out my top five in 1999. That's a terrific match. Second favorite behind WM 19.

Someone hook me up with Brock vs Benoit from 2003. Remember ZERO about it. Leaves me sad.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> You watch your mouth! :lol Honestly I hear that all the time, but I'm just a passionate fan. We went through years of mediocrity and it's just nice to have some notable players and wins now.
> 
> Heyyy wrestling. Uh... my MOTY list probably wouldn't look like anyone else's. 2008 and 2002 in particular. HBK vs. HHH Street Fight and HBK vs. Jericho at Judgment Day.


What's wrong with the Street Fight and the Judgment Day match? I thought they were good, especially the Street Fight.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

KO Bossy said:


> What's wrong with the Street Fight and the Judgment Day match? I thought they were good, especially the Street Fight.


No, those WOULD be my MOTYs for both. So I certainly like them.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

The Street Fight is one of Trips/Shawn's two great matches. Trips' being da GOAT heel, and Shawn selling his back injury just does it for me. 

Also, JR's commentary of course. The finish :mark: when Shawn counters the Pedigree and JR: "Michaels, with the rollup! Can it be? YES!!" :mark: :mark:

As great as that is, Brock/Taker is on a whole other level. At the end of that, I nearly passed out from exhaustion.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Pick a random Tajiri match from 2002. It'll be better than the Street Fight from SummerSlam.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I stand by my claim that the 5/96 match is hbk/trips best


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Pick a random Tajiri match from 2002. It'll be better than the Street Fight from SummerSlam.




Troll much? fpalm


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

xdoomsayerx said:


> Troll much? fpalm


No, he's serious.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Decided to rewatch this since it's been a while. Great match as expected and their chemistry is always on. Just love how stiff and hard hitting their battles are. Judgment Day and 24/11/06 are both superior imo but this one is certainly great. ★★★★.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

We don't troll up here


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

I turned down FREE tickets to Judgment Day 2008. I'm a terrible person.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Vintage doomsayer not being to cope with other's opinions differing from his own.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Give him a break, neither he (or anybody) can deal with opinions as "unique" as the ones from here :lol


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

IDK about 2002, but I think every Rey/Tajiri from 03/04 might be better than Michaels/Trip. And I still kinda like Michaels/Trip.


EDIT - 'watch the Rey/Tajiris', is what I'm getting at.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Austin vs Rock from Backlash is the other that would probably round out my top five in 1999. That's a terrific match. Second favorite behind WM 19.
> 
> Someone hook me up with Brock vs Benoit from 2003. Remember ZERO about it. Leaves me sad.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Tajiri 2002? Look no further than vs Kidman from backlash, fun stuff. 

Street fight is fun, but not MOTY


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Don't forget NM Tajiri Vs Noble :mark:.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

That's another fun match 

How's rebellion 02 goin? 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

It hasn't started yet :lmao. I was GONNA watch it... then I decided to DEFEND THE STREAK on 2K14 instead. Got to about 36 on my first try. Not bad for someone as inept as me with the reversal system. :lmao Orton was the easiest to beat. He entered the ring, I shot him into the ropes, catch Tombstone and he got KO'd :lmao.

Downloading a pack of Marty Jannetty from his 05-whenever WWE decided it wasn't worth bringing him back again run from XWT. Aside from the Angle match he also had a match with Chris Masters :mark:. Also a Kennedy match from 07 that I don't remember and a Miz match from 09?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Well the triple threat vs mysterio and noble is another fun Tajiri match. 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> IDK about 2002, but I think every Rey/Tajiri from 03/04 might be better than Michaels/Trip. And I still kinda like Michaels/Trip.
> 
> 
> EDIT - 'watch the Rey/Tajiris', is what I'm getting at.


MENG VS BENOIT FROM GERMANY AHHHHH

I watched it btw



Clint Eastwood said:


>


Right on, my man.

:mark:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Lesnar/Benoit, some epic shit right there. These two deserved a 30 min PPV Main Event. Hell, Lesnar/ANYONE is PPV worthy. His only bad stuff (vs. Holly and vs. Goldberg) was because he just didn't gave a shit to make it good. I bet that, had Lesnar/Goldberg actually happened, it could've potentially been an insane, insane brawl and MOTYC because BORK is that good.

And speaking of Lesnar/Benoit, we speaking of TV. TV? *PART 3 OF MY TOP 50 TV MATCHES! Coming later today...*


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Brock vs Benoit was so good that even the smarks from back then couldn't whine about Benoit getting buried or looking bad.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

That A-Train segment prior to the match is one of my favorites. And then Brock had an amazing match with Rey later...


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

The fact that the Benoit match only JUST makes it in to my top 10 BORK matches truly is a testament to how fucking god he is. The guy was active for what? Two years? And has had five matches on top of that, and he has such a vast collection of CLASSICS is unbelievable.

Top 5/10/Whatever Bork matches, guys? 

Edit: I meant to put "how fucking good he is" but I mis spelt it. Turns out the typo is a closer description for Brock than my originally planned sentence.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Top 10 BROCK matches.

1a. Eddie (No Way Out)
1b. Undertaker (No Mercy 02)
3. Angle (SummerSlam)
4. Cena (Extreme Rules)
5. Benoit (Smackdown)
6. Angle (Ironman)
7. Punk (SummerSlam)
8. Rock (SummerSlam)
9. Mysterio (Smackdown)
10. Big Show (Judgment Day)

I probably forgot something.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Top 10 Lesnar? More like Top 10 Fuck My Life This Is Hard.

Gonna give it a try:
1. vs Cena, Extreme Rules 2012
2. vs Eddie, No Way Out 2004
3. vs Taker, No Mercy 2002
4. vs Punk, SummerSlam 2013
5. vs Angle, SummerSlam 2003
6. vs Angle, Smackdown 9/18/2003
7. vs Rock, SummerSlam 2002
8. vs Benoit, Smackdown 12/4/2003
9. vs Rey, Smackdown 12/11/2003
10. vs Angle vs Show, Vengeance 2003

BAJEEZUS. :brock


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Top 10 BROCK matches.
> 
> 1a. Eddie (No Way Out)
> 1b. Undertaker (No Mercy 02)
> ...



I meant to say Austin/Angle Summerslam is Angles best match earlier, not Austin. Obviously the Bret match is Austin's best, it's my pick for the greatest match there has ever been.

My top Brock matches (Brock is in my top 5 favorite guys ever, along with Eddie, Benoit, Undertaker, and Foley)

1. Vs Punk SummerSlam *****
2. Vs Undertaker NM ****3/4
3. Vs Eddie NWO ****3/4
4. Vs Cena ER ****3/4
5. Vs Angle SummerSlam ****1/2
6. Vs Angle IronMan ****1/2
7. Vs Benoit SmackDown ****1/4
8. Vs Big Show Stretcher match ****1/4
9. Vs The Rock SummerSlam ****1/4
10. Vs Mysterio SmackDown ****1/4


Translation- Brock is a fucking GOD in the ring. Can you imagine what his list of best matches would look like if he was wrestling a normal schedule from 2002-2013? His name would be given serious consideration as the GOAT.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

1. vs. Cena @ Extreme Rules 2012
2. vs. Eddie @ No Way Out 2004
3. vs. The Undertaker @ No Mercy 2002
4. vs. CM Punk @ Summerslam 2013
5. vs. Kurt Angle Ironamn
6. vs. The Big Show @ Judgement Day 2003
7. vs. Angle @ Summerslam 2003
8. vs. The Rock @ Summerslam 2002
9. vs. Chris Benoit Smackdown
10. vs. Angle vs. Big Show @ Vengeance 2003

HMs: vs. Taker Biker Chain, vs. Angle WM, vs. RVD Vengeance 2002, vs. Show SVS 2002, vs. Rey SD

BORK's average Summerslam rating: **** 1/2

:ass


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Harper vs Bryan from SD was pretty short but still really good. This Punk/Bryan alliance is :mark:


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Top 10 BORK matches:

(****3/4)
1) vs. Taker NM 02
2) vs. Punk SS 13
(****1/2)
3) vs. Angle SD 03 Ironman
(****1/4)
4) vs. Eddie Guerrero NWO 04
5) vs. Cena ER 12
6) vs. Angle SS 03
(****)
7) vs. Rock SS 02
8) vs. Angle WM19
9) vs. Big Show JD 03
(***3/4)
10) vs. Benoit SD 03

Think I'm lower on the Benoit match than anybody.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I really need to get my Brock project back on track, think im onto the start of '03 atm, and really looking forward to Summerslam with Angle, cant remember a thing from it


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Top Brock matches ?

1) punk ss 13
2) cena er
3) Eddie nwo 04
4) Benoit sd 03
5. Idk maybe one of angle matches


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)




----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Translation- Brock is a fucking GOD in the ring. Can you imagine what his list of best matches would look like if he was wrestling a normal schedule from 2002-2013? His name would be given serious consideration as the GOAT.


Yep, he's so amazingly talented. Kind of like a bigger version of Benoit. Can't talk but is too damn good to be ignored. And of course, he didn't have the obstacles smaller wrestlers like Benoit had to overcome. Instead he was pushed off the bat and deservedly so.

Most of those matches only get better with each watch, specially the Benoit match. Was reluctant on even giving it 4 stars at first but after a few more watches, I'm now 4 and a half for it.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Ironically, one of Lesnar's more critically loved matches outside of here, the Angle WM 19 match, is the one nobody in this place gives a shit about (Oh Kurt, oh Kurt :kurt) 

It's a pretty good match, though the botched ending brings it down quite a notch and the too fucking stacked of a card that it had to follow overshadowed it badly imo.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The WM match gets overrated simply because it's Wrestlemania which automatically gives it much more of the spotlight compared to any other PPV or TV match. I once read the list of some idiot who criticized their ironman match because it was "taped" and their work was "nothing compared to Wrestlemania". LOL.

It's the same reason why people who know no better jizz over Eddie vs Rey at WM and fail to realize the superior matches they've had _outside_ of the big stage.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I dig Angle/Lesnar WM19, it's a pretty damn good match. I just think Brock has had 10-15 matches I prefer to it. Not taking anything away from the WM match, SummerSlam and IronMan were far, FAR, superior in my opinion.

I think Brock is the most naturally gifted worker that wrestling has ever seen. I'm not saying he didn't work hard, because I doubt many people worked harder at their craft than Lesnar. I just mean Brock seemed to just "get" professional wrestling faster than anyone else I've seen. I mean he has that Hell in a Cell match with Taker that is one of the best matches ever, and he hasn't even been in the business a year yet. Brock wasn't afraid to sell and give the baby faces a good come back, but he also held nothing back in his control segments and got some of the best heat a heel has ever gotten. He did things for a purpose in the ring. Most guys, especially huge monsters like Lesnar, are scared to sell too much early on because they think it makes them look weak or whatever. Lesnar could sell his ass off and still come out looking strong. That's why the night after WM28 when I heard his music hit, it was one of my favorite moments ever. 

Plus, and it needs to be said, to get the complete Lesnar experience, Paul Heyman needs to be at ringside. Heyman at ringside with Lesnar in between the ropes, that's a tough combination to beat.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

*ATF's Top 50 WWE/F TV Matches Ever

In case you wanna watch some of these matches, just click the fucking title for a linked video, OK? OKAY MOTHERFUCKER?!

Thank you. 

Part 1: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/25969889-post2202.html
Part 2: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/26103353-post2582.html


PART 3

Honorable Mentions Part 3:
Bret Hart vs. Mankind, Shotgun Saturday Night 1/25/1997
Trish Stratus vs. Lita, Raw 12/4/2004
Chris Benoit vs. Finlay, Smackdown 11/24/2006

#30: Chris Benoit vs. Shawn Michaels, Raw 5/3/2004









#29: Chris Benoit vs. William Regal, Velocity 10/1/2005









#28: Shawn Michaels & Diesel vs. Razor Ramon & The 123-Kid, Action Zone 10/30/1994









#27: Antonio Cesaro vs. Sami Zayn, NXT 8/21/2013









#26: Brock Lesnar vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 12/11/2003









#25: Kane vs. Vitamin C vs. Jeff Hardy & Rob Van Dam vs. Bubba Ray Dudley & Spike Dudley, Raw 10/7/2002









#24: Kurt Angle vs. The Undertaker, Smackdown 3/3/2006









#23: The Shield vs. The Rhodes Brothers, Raw 10/14/2013









#22: The Shield vs. Team Hell No & Kofi Kingston, Raw 5/20/2013









#21: Randy Orton vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 1/27/2006






*​


Spoiler: list



(****)
#50: Drew McIntyre vs. Chris Masters, Superstars 5/12/2011
#49: The Miz vs. John Morrison, Raw 1/3/2011
#48: Edge vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 6/8/2007
#47: Chris Benoit, Shawn Michaels, Mick Foley & Shelton Benjamin vs. Evolution, Raw 4/12/2004
#46: Triple H vs. Chris Jericho, Raw 4/17/2000
#45: Team Hell No & The Undertaker vs. The Shield, Raw 4/22/2013
#44: Rey Mysterio vs. Jamie Noble, Velocity 5/1/2004
#43: Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 9/9/2005
#42: Shawn Michaels vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 7/1/1996
#41: Doink The Clown vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 6/21/1993
#40: Chris Benoit vs. Triple H, Raw 7/26/2004
#39: Shawn Michaels vs. Chris Benoit, Raw 2/16/2004
#38: John Morrison vs. CM Punk, ECW 9/4/2007
#37: Finlay vs. Matt Hardy, Smackdown 6/22/2007
#36: DX & The Radicalz vs. The Rock, Cactus Jack, Rikishi & Too Cool, Raw 2/7/2000
(****1/4)
#35: Rey Mysterio vs. John Morrison, Smackdown 9/4/2009
#34: The Shield vs. Team Hell No, Raw 5/27/2013
#33: Owen Hart & The British Bulldog vs. Steve Austin & Shawn Michaels, Raw 5/26/1997
#32: Shawn Michaels vs. Shelton Benjamin, Raw 5/2/2005
#31: Eddie Guerrero vs. Kurt Angle, Smackdown 9/2/2004
#30: Chris Benoit vs. Shawn Michaels, Raw 5/3/2004
#29: Chris Benoit vs. William Regal, Velocity 10/2/2005
#28: Shawn Michaels & Diesel vs. Razor Ramon & The 123-Kid, Action Zone 10/30/1994
#27: Antonio Cesaro vs. Sami Zayn, NXT 8/21/2013
#26: Brock Lesnar vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 12/11/2003
#25: Kane vs. Vitamin C vs. Jeff Hardy & Rob Van Dam vs. Bubba Ray Dudley & Spike Dudley, Raw 10/7/2002
#24: Kurt Angle vs. The Undertaker, Smackdown 3/3/2006
#23: The Shield vs. The Rhodes Brothers, Raw 10/14/2013
#22: The Shield vs. Team Hell No & Kofi Kingston, Raw 5/20/2013
#21: Randy Orton vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 1/27/2006


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

It looks to me like Benoit is gonna be the MVP of this list.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> It looks to me like Benoit is gonna be the MVP of this list.




In my opinion, I don't see how you can make a list of best Tv matches and NOT have Benoit as the MVP. He was the work horse, busting his ass every week and giving everyone their best matches ever. I think it's time for me to have a Benoit-binge. I haven't had one in about 2 weeks, nothing better than spending an entire day watching Benoit.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Comments on the list #3

#21 was my MOTY of 06 iirc

Action Zone tag :lenny

#30 might be my TVMOTY of 04 not sure....wait not but close


Are you watching all these currently or just going off the top of your head ?


Edit: and I think #23 >>>>> #22 I know Cody and some up here loved that though so idk


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

It looks? He IS.

And May is the Month Of The List apparently. So if you look for a good TV match month, May is for you.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Tajiri 2002? Look no further than vs Kidman from backlash, fun stuff.
> 
> Street fight is fun, but not MOTY
> 
> ...


There's another awesome encounter between Tajiri and Billy Kidman that most seem to forget about:





(Skip to the 1:41 mark)

:mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit ruling the list once again simply because he's the best! Really happy about #21 being ranked that high. I don't know if even I would have gone that high with it.

Also what's with the pic for #26? Think you got the wrong match there.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

TLC IV is about 100 spots too high for my liking.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yeah, I definitely did :lol

Cal, personally TLC IV is the 2nd most underrated TLC, behind III. You had KANE, diversity, one or two mad spotz, and imo one of the best performances of KANE. *KANE.*

EDIT: skins, I did rewatch pretty much many if not all of these in these past few weeks


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

ATF said:


> Yeah, I definitely did :lol
> 
> Cal, personally TLC IV is the 2nd most underrated TLC, behind III. You had KANE, diversity, one or two mad spotz, and imo one of the best performances of KANE. *KANE.*


This is what you were looking for. 

Still haven't seen TLC 4 yet. Heard some good things about it. Excited for the rest of the list.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

On that department, I hope that my (epic) list gave some of y'all the opportunity to watch some pretty good stuff you hadn't seen before. 

Get ready, because we're reaching closer to the end...

Oh, and might as well just give the honors that most of y'all have predicted - Chris Benoit IS the MVP of this list. Congrats Chr-oops, forgot. WWE doesn't know what a Chris Benoit is.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

That Angle/Jannetty match ruled the world :mark: soo good, marty was always a good worker so its not a surprise

Currently watching angle/lesnar iron man for the first time and listening to Gaga (Y)


Why hasnt my name changed DAMMIT


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

No conversations about it, had BROCK never went to UFC he'd be the GOAT and there's not a doubt in my mind.

I'll take what we got though, BROCK had 8 years to build up his aura and look what it built to? Arguably the greatest match ever, a trio of polarizing but CLASSIC bouts against HHH, & another MOTY against Punk. If I had to take one guy to give me a good match with ANYBODY throughout history, like if I needed somebody to carry an opponent for one match, this era's BROCK is up there with 1989 Flair.

YES.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> No conversations about it, had BROCK never went to UFC he'd be the GOAT and there's not a doubt in my mind.
> 
> I'll take what we got though, BROCK had 8 years to build up his aura and look what it built to? Arguably the greatest match ever, a trio of polarizing and mediocre bouts against HHH, & another MOTY against Punk. If I had to take one guy to give me a good match with ANYBODY throughout history, like if I needed somebody to carry an opponent for one match, this era's BROCK is up there with 1989 Flair.
> 
> YES.


Fixed.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> That Angle/Jannetty match ruled the world :mark: soo good, marty was always a good worker so its not a surprise
> 
> Currently watching angle/lesnar iron man for the first time and listening to Gaga (Y)
> 
> ...



You have said before you have trouble with the long matches, so I'm interested to see your thoughts on this one. In my opinion, it's probably the easiest 60 minute match to watch, even more so than the Flair/Steamboat classics and the 1992 Royal Rumble. Those two guys conditioning is just INSANE. Plus I love how Brock works that match as the heel, he makes you really get behind Angle which isn't always the easiest thing to do.

I consider Steamboat/Rude the best Ironman match, but out of the 60 minute IronMan matches, Lesnar/Angle definitely takes the cake. Badass.

Corporate KoK- I would agree with that sentiment. As far as guys I would pick to have a phenomenal match with anybody, Brock, 89' Flair, 96' HBK, and 04' Benoit would be the top choices, and Brock would deserve some serious consideration as the best. Not really a big fan of the HHH matches, but that was 95% Hunter. Brock is the man.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

BROCK is the fuckin' man for sure.

The guys I'd put up there with Brock & Flair in their primes are PART TIME UNDERTAKER, HBK 1997, & umm...... Probably a few more like Benoit, Eddie, & Rey at times.

For the record though? In terms of consistency, longevity, and mass amount of quantity mixed with quality, I think The Undertaker might be easily the greatest in WWE history. 23 years in the company & probably more classics than anybody. At the same time though, how many Undertaker matches are there where you're sitting there saying "Man, Taker really sucked in that one"? I don't know very many TBH. The classics to SHIT ratio for Taker is pretty fucking amazing after 23 years.

That ratio for Brock though is something else; the guy's had like 3 or 4 bad matches in his life and even that may be stretching it, longevity is nonexistent though.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I'd put BENOIT above them all. He delivered 99.9% of the time and could carry mediocre workers to something acceptable. Specially if you include his entire career rather than just WWE.

EDIT: Just went and gave Orton vs Punk from the week before MITB a watch and it's nowhere near as dull as I recalled it being. Some nice action that goes back and forth and counters and all that. At times it feels like going through the motions but it does deliver just fine for a TV match. No doubt they are capable of more so perhaps we'll see a title feud in the near future. ★★¾ for this.

Gonna check out HIAC between Orton/Bryan and Orton/Goldust again for a refresher too.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Top ten for Lesnar;

v. Cena ER12
v. Benoit 12/4/03
v. Taker No Mercy 02
v. Rey 12/11/03
v. Guerrero NWO04
v. the Rock slam02
v. the Big Show JD03
maybe the Angle iron man?

Can't really come up with ten. Not watched the Punk match.

I love Brock but I sure as hell don't think he has some sort of all time classic list of matches. And I sure as fuck don't think he's next to Ric motherfucking Flair. When doing the top 2000s thing that I scumbaggedly chickened out on, I had twenty WWE matches on it and none of them were from Lesnar (if the Cena match was eligible it would have made it). He has excellent matches and was really good really early, but in the few years he got I don't see an all timer. Is he a top 75 US guy?


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

Go to 1:115:18.

This is still one of his best uppercuts. :mark: So over-looked.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Yeah1993 said:


> Top ten for Lesnar;
> 
> v. Cena ER12
> v. Benoit 12/4/03
> ...


No love for vs. Angle at SummerSlam? I personally think that's one of the best matches for either of them.

Oh, and the Punk match would definitely be up there too if you'd watched it. unk6


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

WM 30 card as it looks according to sheetz atm:



Spoiler: WM 30



Cena or Punk/Orton
Taker/Brock
Trips/Bryan
Cody/Goldust
Goldberg or Show/Ryback
Shield/Wyatts



Looks sorta good to me. I guess.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

ATF said:


> WM 30 card as it looks according to sheetz atm:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Didn't the sheetz say that...



Spoiler: SPOILER!



Bryan isn't gonna be anywhere near HHH for WM?



Nevertheless, I'm just hoping that the RTWM is unpredictable. Or good. Or both. :side:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Iirc I remember that...


Spoiler: lolsheetz



Bryan isn't gonna be anywhere near HHH *until* WM season, then he would finally get Pedigreed get revenge


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

PGSucks said:


> No love for vs. Angle at SummerSlam? I personally think that's one of the best matches for either of them.


Never really *really* got into it, but it's one of those 'been so long I barely remember it' matches.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Do we have a WM discussion thread? Yes? THEN FUCKING USE IT. I don't want ANY WM or RR spoilers, so fuck off.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Starting EC 2013, havent seen anything from this show for some reason.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Huh, there's a reason why I used the fucking spoiler tags, wasn't there? You only saw them if you want :side:

Plus, it's more "safe" to post in this zone. Because with one drop of opinion they might be all over me out there


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

It is pretty scary out there


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Some matches from a pack taht I have downloaded from XWT earlier today:

Undertaker/Jeff Hardy July 2002- **, the ending was nice, but the rest of the match was slow and really boring. I actually remembered it being better
Triple H/The Rock- First Ever Smackdown- ***1/2, great match from those two here, PPV quality. Trips and Rocky really had an awesome chemistry
Ted Dibiase/Savage- WM 4 ***- nice match, considering the fact that I don't like Dibiase's in-ring work. Anyway, the crowd went nuts after Savange won the title, great atmosphere.
HArdy/HHH/Edge Armageddon 2008- ***3/4- an excellent match and one of the few in which I rooted for Jeff. It was his time here and the arena exploded after he won.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

All it takes is someone to put the spoiler tags in wrong or some other moron to quote it wrong or reply without spoilers and then I'll RAGE BAN YOU ALL. So yeah, stick the WM talk to the WM thread. Go socialise with the rest of the forum. I BET THEY BE LOVELY PEOPLE 8*D.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Does anyone else HATE the show/ADR matches. Havent seen the SD one but the two PPV matches are terrible IMO


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I do I do! Their SD LMS was terrible too. The PPV matches were unlaughably bad.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah just finished watching the EC match and was so bored throughout. RR might be the worst WHC match of 2013


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Is the EC match the one with the BUCKET botch, or was that from the RR? :lmao


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I donno, was not exactly paying precise attention to it 

RR had the duct tape ending :lmao


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Callamus said:


> All it takes is someone to put the spoiler tags in wrong or some other moron to quote it wrong or reply without spoilers and then I'll RAGE BAN YOU ALL. So yeah, stick the WM talk to the WM thread. Go socialise with the rest of the forum. I BET THEY BE LOVELY PEOPLE 8*D.


Yeah, they're a real group of Nobel prize winners...

I just got bitched at because someone asked who the top 5 wrestlers are right now and I gave a response that was apparently unacceptable. They basically told me "WELL ITS A WWE FORUM, SO WWE ONLY COUNTS!"



Callamus said:


> I do I do! Their SD LMS was terrible too. The PPV matches were unlaughably bad.







Hope you enjoy.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Callamus said:


> Is the EC match the one with the BUCKET botch, or was that from the RR? :lmao


It was EC. Watch the above video for reference (and hilarity).


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Only good thing to come from their matches :lmao.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

You know, despite how much humanity sickens me most of the time, I'll give credit where it's due-sometimes, people come up with some pretty damn amazing things. That video is one of them.

Here's another:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Callamus said:


> Do we have a WM discussion thread? Yes? THEN FUCKING USE IT. I don't want ANY WM or RR spoilers, so fuck off.


^^^^^^^^

Moops, watch Punk vs Brock already AHHHH


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Who else HATED Brock/Angle at WM? just gave it a rewatch and it doesn't compare to their SS and ironman match. 
WM 19 = ***
SS = ****1/2
Ironman = ****1/4


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Oh yeah that :lmao

writin up another post for the taker project, I have a list on my computer for matches I need to watch, so fire the suggestions out! here's what I have done so far. 



Spoiler: matches seen



Kane vs the Undertaker (WM 14)
The Undertaker and Team Hell no vs the Shield( RAW 4-22-13)
RVD vs the Undertaker (Vengeance 2001)
The Rock vs The undertaker (RAW 10/5/98)
Undertaker vs Edge (Judgment day 2008)
: The Undertaker vs Kane(NOC 2010)
Festus vs The Undertaker (SD April 2008)
Vader vs the Undertaker( IYH 16: Canadian Stampede)
Kurt Angle vs the Undertaker (NWO 2006)
John Cena vs the Undertaker (SD 6/24/04)
Undertaker vs Tajiri (SD 12/27/01)
The Undertaker, John Cena, and DX vs CM Punk and Legacy(SD 10/02/09)
: Kurt Angle vs the Undertaker (SD 3/03/06)
Rey Mysterio vs the Undertaker (SD 2003)
Rey/taker(SD 10)
Rey/taker( RR 10)
Punk/taker( HIAC 09)
HBK/taker( Bad blood 97)
Undertaker and Kane vs Stone Cold Steve Austin and HHH( BL 01) 
JBL/taker( SD 3/20/09)


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Brock vs Angle from WM is a big pile of...ok. Don't hate it, but don't find it particularly special either. It's a decent way to end a perfect WrestleMania. Cracks me up how nobody likes to mention how it has a totally fucked up finish too.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I still like Angle/Lesnar WM a lot, but it's the weakest of their main trilogy:



Spoiler: WM 19 match



Kurt Angle Vs Brock Lesnar - The match that almost never happened. Angle's neck was fucked going into WM, and nobody was sure if the match could happen. Remember the match on SD where they did the Eric Angle switch? Originally they were going to put the title on Lesnar there (fuck knows who would have been his WM opponent). But Angle agreed to wrestle at WM and then go for neck surgery, and thus this match was still able to take place. I was hyped as fuck for this one back in the day. Haven't seen it in a while either so I'm looking forward to it again. Their SummerSlam match is a ***** match imo, and their Iron Man is probably the best Iron Man match ever (Rude/Steamboat comes close). These two had great chemistry all stemming from their competitive nature due to their amateur wrestling backgrounds. Basic mat stuff in the beginning as both men use their amateur backgrounds to try and gain control and prove who the better WRESTLER is. Ends up being a stalemate so out come the GERMAN'S and Lesnar takes them better than guys half his size. Fucking LOVE the one into the turnbuckle; works perfectly with Lesnar having injured ribs, giving Angle something to focus on. Lesnar is still a fucking BEAST though and keeps fighting back and using his power when he can, but Angle continues to try and wear down his young challenger using those injured ribs to his advantage. Angle tries everything he can to keep Lesnar down, including the deadly Ankle Lock, but nothing is going to derail the next big thing tonight. F-5! Angle kicks out, so Lesnar hits another... but doesn't go for a cover. Instead Lesnar tries for a WM moment... SHOOTING STAR PRESS! And he lands on his head. OUCH. Great visual, and a crazy moment that will forever be remembered at WM... but damn, in the words of Tazz "HOW IS LESNAR NOT DEAD?". Lesnar managed to get another F-5 in, and he becomes the new WWE champion! Thought this was mostly really fucking good, but the finish falls flat (on its head...) after the botched SSP unfortunately. Doesn't affect my opinion on the match too much, but enough to lower my old rating just a little bit. Still, a great main event for WM. ****.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

I'm still waiting for Brock to do another SSP 




ATF said:


> Huh, there's a reason why I used the fucking spoiler tags, wasn't there? You only saw them if you want :side:


I hope Cal uses the mobile app to access this thread.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Jokes on you, my mobile is a pile of shite without internet capabilities!!!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cal can only afford Cal like quality service.


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

Callamus said:


> Do we have a WM discussion thread? Yes? THEN FUCKING USE IT. I don't want ANY WM or RR spoilers, so fuck off.





Callamus said:


> All it takes is someone to put the spoiler tags in wrong or some other moron to quote it wrong or reply without spoilers and then I'll RAGE BAN YOU ALL. So yeah, stick the WM talk to the WM thread. Go socialise with the rest of the forum. I BET THEY BE LOVELY PEOPLE 8*D.


CAL FUCKING SHIT UP! That's the way we like it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

BUBZ, did you see all of Harper's WOTY week yet?


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Brock/Angle SS is so great, watched it the other day definitely around **** 1/2


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Going back to a topic from yesterday, what about the Summerslam '02 Street Fight do people not like?


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Watched Dude Love vs Austin from Unforgiven 1998. Great match that I'd rate ***1/2. Structured well with Austin dominating Foley at the start, who sells and bumps the attacks brilliantly as usual. The story throughout the match was Vince trying to screw Austin in a similar fashion that Bret got screwed and must say, it was told very well. Lawler's commentary when Vince first tells the time keeper to ring the bell when Austin is locked in an abdominal stretch and then quickly changes his mind when Austin reverses. Lawler says "see he never wanted to screw Austin, he just told the timekeeper to stop". I wasn't a fan of the ending with Austin counting the victory himself and then getting DQ'ed later for hitting Vince with a chair. The DQ part is okay but Austin suddenly becoming a referee was weird but not bad.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Austin/Foley UF 98 is one of my favorite "feud-advancer" matches ever. Such a fun brawl that led to an even greater match.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Going to watch the Over the Edge match when I get to it. First time as well


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Does it piss anyone else off when Curtis Axel does Mr. Perfect spots? Watching him do the hold the ropes, get his leg kicked out and do a flip spot in particular. I just feel like he needs to do his own stuff, create his own "legacy". You don't see Randy out there wrestling like Cowboy Bob, or The Rock doing Rocky Johnson call back spots. When Axel does that stuff, it just forces a comparison with Curt Hennig, and as a result he will look worse than he already does. It has to be difficult having a father who is one of the most revered workers AND best characters WWE has come up with. He doesn't need to make it even harder on himself by constantly forcing the Curt comparisons by using his old signature spots.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

It pisses me off that Axel is in the same profession as his father. Guy needs to GTFO and do something he might be good at. Take Miz and Kingston with him too. Could be a real life 3MB. Even if they end up being the worst band in history they'd be more successful than wrestlers.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Ah, the Austin/Dude series. 2 of the best brawlers ever...brawling. What's not to love? The whole thing was great, from the building off of the first match by making Vince and the stooges the officials at OTE, to Taker interfering to plant the seeds for their epic feud culminating at Summerslam.

Man, I miss those stories. They flowed so well. Not like the dog shit we get today.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Callamus said:


> It pisses me off that Axel is in the same profession as his father. Guy needs to GTFO and do something he might be good at. Take Miz and Kingston with him too. Could be a real life 3MB. Even if they end up being the worst band in history they'd be more successful than wrestlers.


Add Wade Barrett and make it 4MB.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Does it piss anyone else off when Curtis Axel does Mr. Perfect spots? Watching him do the hold the ropes, get his leg kicked out and do a flip spot in particular. I just feel like he needs to do his own stuff, create his own "legacy". You don't see Randy out there wrestling like Cowboy Bob, or The Rock doing Rocky Johnson call back spots. When Axel does that stuff, it just forces a comparison with Curt Hennig, and as a result he will look worse than he already does. It has to be difficult having a father who is one of the most revered workers AND best characters WWE has come up with. He doesn't need to make it even harder on himself by constantly forcing the Curt comparisons by using his old signature spots.


Well...Orton DID get paired with Cowboy Bob. And Rock DID have the phase where he was drawing from the spirit of his ancestors (I think High Chief Peter Maivia). 

The whole point of Axel at this point is that they had no idea what to do with him so they literally stole everything from his relatives, mashed it together and there he is. I have no doubt that the Fed tells him to go out there and do his dad's spots. After all, he's being pushed as the Mr. Perfect of this generation (sadly). But he'll fail because he's nothing like Curt.

I have to question why some people get so offended by stuff like this. So Axel is compared to his dad and Ziggler is compared to HBK. I have to draw the line somewhere when it comes to complaining and this is it for me. There are for more heinous things afoot in the WWE these days for me to be bothered by stolen characters or mannerisms.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Choke2Death said:


> Add Wade Barrett and make it 4MB.


Pfft, Barrett doesn't deserve to be bunched with the other 3. He'd be better suited to alcoholism and dying in a ditch somewhere 8*D.

Wait... were we talking about Wade or Andy? 8*D


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

You're right, he's much better than those three. 8*D


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

It's probably sad that I think the Miz is the best of those four people listed. At their best, anyway.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Just got back and had some password probelms, I want to watch the angle/lesnar iron man tonite

COdy is that flair/angle sd or raw from 2005


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's Miz or Wade for me. Probably Wade b/c those matches vs Sheamus is all I need.

RAW 6/27/05, skins.

btw, make your new name Four Horseskins. GET IT?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah1993 said:


> It's probably sad that I think the Miz is the best of those four people listed. At their best, anyway.


lol, you might be right. Because at least he's got some personality.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Does anyone else HATE the show/ADR matches. Havent seen the SD one but the two PPV matches are terrible IMO


Nah I love their sd LMS from jan


Edit: :lmao dude I'm letting evo and the higher ups deal with it, not saying a word :lmao you saw the FORESKINS


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm sure you'll be fine. There just was the unfortunate fact that someone else had SKINS prior. Can't believe someone does, tbhayley.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

KO Bossy said:


> I have to question why some people get so offended by stuff like this. So Axel is compared to his dad and Ziggler is compared to HBK. I have to draw the line somewhere when it comes to complaining and this is it for me. There are for more heinous things afoot in the WWE these days for me to be bothered by stolen characters or mannerisms.


So because there are worse things in the WWE than Axel using his dad's spots, I'm not allowed to be bothered by it? That's some interesting logic. I suppose I shouldn't worry about our governments over spending because people are starving in Africa, right?

Anyway, Axel, Kofi Kingston, Miz, Barrett, R-Truth, Jinder Mahal, and Khali can ALL fuck off. Seriously. I can't believe WWE rolled Khali out for a singles match against ADR tonight. The dude cannot fucking move. He makes 1990 Andre the Giant look downright nimble.

This Cena/Ryback match is actually pretty damn good. Just goes to show all the idiots out there that John Cena, when motivated, can have a good match with anyone. He doesn't always need a good opponent, he's straight carrying Ryback right now and doing a helluva job.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^ is it, :lmao Ryback had Cena in a head lock for legit 15 mins


On second thought, I will be watching brock/taker HIAC for the first time in a min


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I think it was actually pretty good, I turned it on at 9:42pm EST (was watching my Wizards beat the Nets in overtime) and from there on it was pretty damn good. Not sure how much I missed in the beginning...Cena was getting out of a headlock when I first turned it on.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'll be checking out Smackdown either tonight or tomorrow. Basically tuning in for Harper vs Danielson only, but if Cena vs Ryback is good then cool beans.

Skins, you're going to watch what is *_arguably*_ the best HIAC match around.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

And by arguably he means a dead mouse can argue that it ISN'T the best HIAC match because Undertaker Vs HBK happened .


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> I'll be checking out Smackdown either tonight or tomorrow. Basically tuning in for Harper vs Danielson only, but if Cena vs Ryback is good then cool beans.
> 
> Skins, you're going to watch what is *_arguably*_ the best HIAC match around.


I think you should watch Ryback/Cena as well, I thought it was pretty damn good, atleast for the last 15 or so minutes that I saw.

I have a hard time saying Lesnar/Taker is better than the original Hell in a Cell match at Bad Blood, but I think part of that is I watched it live as a kid and remember how awe inspiring and breathtaking it was to witness that. It just seemed like one "oh my effing god" moment after another. I'd just never seen anything like that before, watching Undertaker just DESTROY that little shit HBK made me :mark: for 30+ minutes straight.

That said, a reasonable case can be made that Lesnar/Taker No Mercy is every bit as good. It was just about the perfect match. I cannot find a flaw in it and I've seen it probably 5-6 times. And you have the added Heyman factor, Paul was just GOATing it up on the outside for the duration of that one.

So yea, I think both matches are pretty swell


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I did just go the full ***** for Lesnar/Taker, but honestly I STILL don't think it touches the original HIAC. Nothing does. My ***** matches have a hierarchy, and the HIAC sits atop the mountain with every other match struggling to even see it through the clouds.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I know I prefer Taker vs Brock a ton over Taker vs Michaels. But the case presented for Taker vs Michaels is obvious. It is a perfect match. That just tells you how much regard I hold the '02 match in.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

The Primer said:


> I know I prefer Taker vs Brock a ton over Taker vs Michaels. But the case presented for Taker vs Michaels is obvious. It is a perfect match. That just tells you how much regard I hold the '02 match in.


So you're saying... Taker/Brock... is more perfect than perfect? :axel


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> So because there are worse things in the WWE than Axel using his dad's spots, I'm not allowed to be bothered by it? That's some interesting logic. I suppose I shouldn't worry about our governments over spending because people are starving in Africa, right?
> 
> Anyway, Axel, Kofi Kingston, Miz, Barrett, R-Truth, Jinder Mahal, and Khali can ALL fuck off. Seriously. I can't believe WWE rolled Khali out for a singles match against ADR tonight. The dude cannot fucking move. He makes 1990 Andre the Giant look downright nimble.
> 
> This Cena/Ryback match is actually pretty damn good. Just goes to show all the idiots out there that John Cena, when motivated, can have a good match with anyone. He doesn't always need a good opponent, he's straight carrying Ryback right now and doing a helluva job.


No, you can be bothered by it, but you aren't the first person I've seen bring up that argument and I've never understood the hate for Axel. I don't love him, but I don't detest him. He's just kind of there, taking up space. I just feel that there's already so much to dislike in WWE right now that hating Axel is wasteful. Don't sweat the small stuff.

I'd also like to add that Ryback can fuck off, as well. I find him so unbelievably boring to watch in ring. The HIAC and Battleground matches against Punk were god damn terrible, and his match with Henry from WM is a contender for worst match of the year, IMO. His pace is so bloody slow.

As for Taker/Lesnar...its good, but obviously not the GOAT Cell match. Its above average as a match, I think. Like **** range.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Sounds like I may have to check out Smackdown this week. Haven't really watched any of Harper's work but based on a few gifs, he seems like a capable big man and there's no one better than Bryan to show that against.

And Ryback/Cena being good sounds interesting too. Might make up for the lack of Orton this week that killed my interests initially.



Cactus Jack said:


> So because there are worse things in the WWE than Axel using his dad's spots, I'm not allowed to be bothered by it? That's some interesting logic. I suppose I shouldn't worry about our governments over spending because people are starving in Africa, right?


:ti


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Skins, you're going to watch what is *_arguably*_ the best HIAC match around.


:hbk1 :taker

Got side tracted by somebody, brock/taker is being started RIGHT now, will be back with my thoughts


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

I would put HBK/Taker HIAC above Brock/Taker. I slightly preferred their Unforgiven match to the one at No Mercy. I have them at the same rating though.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

JUST THOUGHT I'D INTERJECT to deliver a short but sweet review of one of the best 'hardcore' matches I have seen...I first saw this match when it first aired in 1997 but...fuck me this was FUN...

*BLACKJACK BRADSHAW* vs. *ROAD DOGG JESSE JAMES* and *BADD ASS BILLY GUNN* in a BUNKHOUSE BRAWL

Before the match: Bradshaw's partner Blackjack Windham was attacked by some 'unknown' vagrants in the locker room - thus rendering this match a handicap match.

The soon to be called New Age Outlaws enter the ring (pre-music) with plunder (trash cans, shovels, signs etc) with Road Dogg doing his excellent mic work. Bear in mind this is before the 'LADIES AND GENTLEMEN BOYS AND GIRLS...' shtick they'd forever use. They were JUST starting out.

Blackjack Bradshaw comes out without his partner, and immediately throws powder into the eyes of Billy Gunn. Th crowd at this point don't know what to expect as Bradshaw is pretty much a jobber, but fuck me...he goes in HARD on Road Dogg and Billy. By hard I mean FUCK ME SIDEWAYS hard. He basically throws Dogg and Billy around like trash. Trash can shots to the head. Bradshaw even picks up the fucking timekeepers table and wallops it over Road Dogg's head.

'Bradshaw...has just gone crazy!' shouts JR, as BJ Bradshaw frantically searches for weapons, until he settles for a chair and then fucking SMASHES it over Road Dogg's head. Honestly, when I saw this at the time, I thought Bradshaw was gonna kill these guys. Billy Gunn then catches Bradshaw with a swinging DDT off the second rope onto a steel chair and both guys pin Bradshaw for the win.
WINNERS: Road Dogg and Billy Gunn

Match lasted about four minutes but FUCK ME this was amazing. The best sub-five minute hardcore match I've ever seen. Bradshaw just basically kicked ass, and this was when he was a JOBBER.

This was on the 10th November 1997 episode of Raw, it's well worth a watch.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Since this seemed to be the cool thing to do tonight, I rewatched Taker/Brock HIAC, since its been a few years since I last saw it. I was right. **** range. Upon this rewatch, I gave it ****1/2. Very good match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

That match rings a bell with me lol. Definitely seen it, but it's been a while. Any time BRADSHAW gets in a hardcore environment its always :mark:. The VADER match is epic too.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

Callamus said:


> That match rings a bell with me lol. Definitely seen it, but it's been a while. Any time BRADSHAW gets in a hardcore environment its always :mark:. The VADER match is epic too.


I was a bit generous with the time - it lasted literally two minutes! haha

Fuck me though...it was brilliant. 

For those looking for some modern day comparison...just imagine a jobber like Tensai going HARD on Ambrose and Rollins. Completely unexpected and brutal.

HERE IT IS...AT 58:00...


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> Does anyone else HATE the show/ADR matches. Havent seen the SD one but the two PPV matches are terrible IMO


Nope. Enjoyed the Smackdown LMS and their EC match. Haven't seen the rest yet.



KO Bossy said:


> Going back to a topic from yesterday, what about the Summerslam '02 Street Fight do people not like?


No one responded to this.  Love the match personally. Watched it earlier this year and was blown away by how amazing I thought it was.



Cactus Jack said:


> Does it piss anyone else off when Curtis Axel does Mr. Perfect spots? Watching him do the hold the ropes, get his leg kicked out and do a flip spot in particular. I just feel like he needs to do his own stuff, create his own "legacy". You don't see Randy out there wrestling like Cowboy Bob, or The Rock doing Rocky Johnson call back spots. When Axel does that stuff, it just forces a comparison with Curt Hennig, and as a result he will look worse than he already does. It has to be difficult having a father who is one of the most revered workers AND best characters WWE has come up with. He doesn't need to make it even harder on himself by constantly forcing the Curt comparisons by using his old signature spots.


Yes to all of this. It's the only thing he's good for, being like his father. The rolling neck snap, Perfect Plex, and the leg spot are like almost his entire offense.  And one of this isn't even an offensive move!


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

Curtis Axel fucking sucks regardless. Everything about the guy is goofy, from his 'I'VE ARRIVED!' nipple opening pose to his charismatic-as-fog persona. Yeah he's a decent ring worker blah blah fucking blah, but he couldn't light a match if he was made of fire.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Undertaker vs. Brock Lesnar HIAC

Ok I just finished it, awesome awesome match, the praise is well deserved. What stood out to me was the middle portion was soo solid, sometimes matches starts at a 100mph and die off abit before picking back up, not this one which was good. :lmao did taker forget he had a broken right hand ? That stuff doesn't bother me but I could see it being looked down upon. Its surreal to see Brock LESNAR get his ass kicked in the first couple of mins of this which you dont see often. Why did Heyman have to blade himself ? the bump he took didnt even look that serious and his face looked painted towards the end, which was kinda cool, a bloody Heyman ? Yea this was also very brutal which makes me fpalm even more at HIAC nowadays even though I know the whole PG thing. It didnt drag at all for me which was a big plus

Ive gone off stars for a bit but this would be in the ****1/2 range

Although it was great, still this hbk/taker is the best HIAC to date. I'd probaly have this 2nd little bit ahead of trips/batista


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Completely forgot about an essay that I have due in less than three hours. Essay being due on a Friday night = :taker for me

Ah well. I'm gonna watch something to relieve some stress once I'm done with this :side: Maybe some more Eddie, since I read a bit more of his book today. :mark: :eddie


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Sandrone said:


> So you're saying... Taker/Brock... is more perfect than perfect? :axel


The match has ARRIVED. It's so perfect that it's perfect. We all need to take a second to comprehend this.



redskins25 said:


> Undertaker vs. Brock Lesnar HIAC
> 
> Ok I just finished it, awesome awesome match, the praise is well deserved. What stood out to me was the middle portion was soo solid, sometimes matches starts at a 100mph and die off abit before picking back up, not this one which was good. :lmao did taker forget he had a broken right hand ? That stuff doesn't bother me but I could see it being looked down upon. Its surreal to see Brock LESNAR get his ass kicked in the first couple of mins of this which you dont see often. Why did Heyman have to blade himself ? the bump he took didnt even look that serious and his face looked painted towards the end, which was kinda cool, a bloody Heyman ? Yea this was also very brutal which makes me fpalm even more at HIAC nowadays even though I know the whole PG thing. It didnt drag at all for me which was a big plus
> 
> ...


:hb :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Went through the MITB anthology DVD to see the talking parts and extras and noticed that they have replaced "Fuck you Cena" with "ECW" chants for the One Night Stand match, lol.

Also now I get what people say about Miz being punchable and unlikable and all of that. His arrogance when talking about winning the briefcase and title just makes you wanna punch him right in the face. :lol I guess that's why he's a horrible babyface.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Bingo. He's 100% heel. We don't want this dude with obnoxious charisma in our face trying to get a high five. We want him in our face trying to scam on your broad, talk about main eventing WM once & only once to the point where he plunk down cash or pirate their programming to see him get his ass kicked.

2010 Miz was a career high for the dude. Not just from the kayfabe successes. He actually was good in his role/position. Then again, as I've said often enough, I've never really "hated" Miz until these days.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I remember the forum's consensus opinion being pretty high on Miz when I first joined until about...mid 2011. He had his haters, which included me  :durant3


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

They need to keep Axel away from anyone interesting. He just sucks the life out of the crowd.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

What are the general feelings regarding the Angle/Eddie/Benoit/Edge 4-Way?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Good match with a finish that's a bit too overblown, but doesn't exactly ruin it. Wouldn't mind refreshing myself on it. Thanks Armageddon 2002 DVD.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

'Kay then. It looks like there's only one major match I totally forgot about on my TV list, that should've been on Part 3: Cena/Rey. Oh well.

I decided to rewatch the official highlight video of WM 21, and man, gives me chills. *DAT UNDERCARD.*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I dig it for the awesome tune they chose as that year's WM theme song.

Cena vs Mysterio, though. You mean the 2011 match? If so - how?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yes, the 2011 one. Idk how, I just did. Guess Masters/McIntyre will have to be bumped off in order for it to go in.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

NOOOOOOOOOO


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Have you even been following the countdown btw? :side:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I glanced a touch at the last one. Saw a lot of Benoit & Shield. Looks about right.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

In case you wanna check the other ones out:

Part 1: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/25969889-post2202.html
Part 2: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/26103353-post2582.html


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Man, Benoit vs Edge a month before Benoit's end is a total blur to me. Would need to check out that Eddie vs Angle match too. WM 20 was solid for me at the most & SummerSlam is garbage. I'd dig seeing them have a match that was actually good. Oh wait, that's their 2/3 falls match iirc. Hmmmm.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

2/3 falls with Eddie is probably the closest thing to 'smart' that Angle has wrestled that wasn't vs Taker, Lesnar, Mysterio or Austin.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Finnaly got around to see all the matches of one of my fav. pairings of all time: Jericho/Malenko:

Nitro 2 September 1996- ***1/4, Jericho's high-flying stuff was amazing here
Nitro 7 April 1997- ***1/4, this must be my favourite short match of all time, 3 minutes of non-stop action. Dean's evil work was great here
Thunder 19 February 1998- **3/4, not their best match together, but still a good contest. Jericho getting the clean win was a nice touch
Uncensored 1998 - ***3/4, this was amazing, the ending was brilliant with that Jericho counter. 
Slamboree 1998 - ****, the match was not better than ***1/2, but the story was fantastic, with Dean trying to make Jericho est his words, having the fans support him. Great, great match
Great American Bash 1998- ***, the ending was stupid, which really hurted the match for me


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

So anybody seen The Shield live? I just have to say these guys epitomise BADASS and COOL and EPIC and all that amazing stuff. Even at a shitty house show their entrance is GOAT. It was The Shield vs. Goldust/Cody/Big E and it was MOTN. Really fun stuff and I'll tell you, Big E came off looking very impressive in this thing. Big E and Reigns squaring off was :mark:. I'm not quite ready for the Shield to split just yet but when they do it should be awesome. Hopefully somebody will put a Shield pack up on xwt towards the end of the year and I can binge over Xmas break. Right after I watch Ziggler/ADR for skins of course .


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Got to see SHIELD live twice. The RAW after Royal Rumble in Vegas (also BORK'S return :mark and SummerSlam this year. 

Their entrance is awesome live, but I wasn't near them either time unk3. Vegas show I was in nosebleeds and SummerSlam I was seated center.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

A whole bunch of security people came to stand by close to where I was sitting and I was thinking they were going to come out there. Then they moved them way over to the other side of the arena and that's where they came fuckers. It's still an awesome entrance with the spotlight and everybody looking to see where they're going to come from. Hopefully I get to see it at Mania next year.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

They will probably have split up by the time I make it to another live event .


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

I liked Shield's WM 29 entrance above any other.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Given that the WWE is focusing on making the Wyatts the new top stable of the company, I don't think they will split up the Shield until a match with them happens, and including a possible face turn with that. Only then I guess they will have the break up.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Primer said:


> Bingo. He's 100% heel. We don't want this dude with obnoxious charisma in our face trying to get a high five. We want him in our face trying to scam on your broad, talk about main eventing WM once & only once to the point where he plunk down cash or pirate their programming to see him get his ass kicked.
> 
> 2010 Miz was a career high for the dude. Not just from the kayfabe successes. He actually was good in his role/position. Then again, as I've said often enough, I've never really "hated" Miz until these days.


Yep, he's absolutely annoying when bragging about his accomplishments just like a heel. Can't believe I actually thought at one point he would be a good face and a good replacement for Cena. But then again, I was no different than the stupid smarks who always set themselves up for disappointments.



The Primer said:


> I dig it for the awesome tune they chose as that year's WM theme song.







Brings back some memories. Wasn't watching wrestling then but I recognized it because I've heard it elsewhere. Funny how both WM21 and WM22 themes are called "Big Time".


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Miz's character isn't meant to be your friend, or that guy who you go "Man, I'd really like to have a beer with him." He's that guy who's supposed to brag about his hot fiancee, his movies and those random TMZ red carpet appearances. He thrives in that primma donna heel role. It's kind of like how people hate Ryan Seacrest because he has that punchable face mixed in with that douchelike aura.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Miz should turn heel again. It's safe to say his face run has been a failure because it's been almost a year (believe he turned face just after Survivor Series last year) so we can't keep saying 'he needs more time as a face'. A 2009/10 heel Miz would certainly be needed for todays mid card though. It's a shame he has dropped since main eventing WM 27 because his 2009 - 10 push one of the best in the 'PG' Era as far as booking goes.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

rjsbx1 said:


> Miz's character isn't meant to be your friend, or that guy who you go "Man, I'd really like to have a beer with him." He's that guy who's supposed to brag about his hot fiancee, his movies and those random TMZ red carpet appearances. He thrives in that primma donna heel role. It's kind of like how people hate Ryan Seacrest because he has that punchable face mixed in with that douchelike aura.



Good lord, you NAILED it. The Miz is WWE's Ryan Seacrest. That's a perfect comparison.

The problem with Miz for me, not only is he the worst baby face I've ever come across, but when he's a heel, which he should always be tbh, he doesn't come off as threatening enough. I think it's his ring work, but I just cannot take the guy serious as a legit threat. He works so loosey goosey and none of his moves look like they hurt a lick. The best I can see for him is a lower mid card heel, a guy who beats up on jobbers but then gets crushed by the upper mid card faces while the entire crowd rejoices in Miz getting beat down. That's not a bad spot, you earn 6 figures a year to get your ass kicked. It's just how ridiculous the knowledge is that this guy main evented a WrestleMania against one of the biggest names in the sports history. Unthinkable.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Cal's rant on the MizTV is great. "It's not even the best talk show in WWE today...and it's the only one" :lmao


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

All this talk of The Jiz makes me wanna go shoot myself in the face with a loaded shotgun. BRBLOLJKI'LLBEDEAD.

Might start Rebellion 2002 finally .


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

AND won that match, something HHH and HBK failed to do.

I admit, he was actually good in the midcard in 2010. His ring work has never been that good but as a character and on the mic, he was on point that year. Just an extremely unlikable heel who is somehow an underdog that proves his doubters wrong.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Callamus said:


> All this talk of The Jiz makes me wanna go shoot myself in the face with a loaded shotgun. BRBLOLJKI'LLBEDEAD.
> 
> Might start Rebellion 2002 finally .


Brock/Heyman vs Edge is a match i like.  Can't remember fuck all else


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I was never a fan of the Edge Vs Heyman/BAAAARRRRRRROOOOOOCK LEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSNAAAAAAR match. Can't wait to see EDDIE & the other guy Vs BANGLE again though. Just gotta sit through a fucking BOOKER T match to start with. HE'S A FUCKING RAW GUY ON A SD PPV. The fuck?


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Srdjan99 said:


> Finnaly got around to see all the matches of one of my fav. pairings of all time: Jericho/Malenko:
> 
> Nitro 2 September 1996- ***1/4, Jericho's high-flying stuff was amazing here
> Nitro 7 April 1997- ***1/4, this must be my favourite short match of all time, 3 minutes of non-stop action. Dean's evil work was great here
> ...


Please tell me you watched the Cruiserweight Battle Royal before the match?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> I was never a fan of the Edge Vs Heyman/BAAAARRRRRRROOOOOOCK LEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSNAAAAAAR match. Can't wait to see EDDIE & the other guy Vs BANGLE again though. Just gotta sit through a fucking BOOKER T match to start with. HE'S A FUCKING RAW GUY ON A SD PPV. The fuck?




I just watched that Guerreros/Bangle tag yesterday. Outside like 2 minutes of mayhem in the end, I loved it just as much as I did on the original watch. I like how the beginning you get just back and forth action and you think "oh shit, it's just gonna be one of these tags" but then they settle down in the midway point and we get a damn good FIP segment. Great tag, I like it more than the more heralded NM 02' Bangle tag.

Ps. God bless you for coming up with "Bangle", what a fun word to say. Bangle.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

The Booker T Vs Matt Hardy match is MEH, thought Hardy always worked better as a face for sure.

That show as a whole though? Not good at all.

THE UNDERTAKER GETS REPLACED BY EDGE. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO .


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Don't forget REDGE too. BANGLE VS REDGE is the NM match .

Rebellion 02 is SUCKING HARD so far. 4 matches in and it's -1 on the CAL SCALE.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Booker T vs. Matt Hardy was bad? I remember it being surprisingly good. If you really want a bad match from those two, go to 2006.

EDIT: MENG/BENOIT series:

Slamboree: ******
Germany: ****3/4*
GAB: *****

Very good series of matches where two guys essentially made a story out of nothing. 

First match featured an incredible babyface performance from Benoit where everything (including Woman) added to his showing of resilience. I loved how he was asking for more brutality from Meng, which is actually something that I see Meng doing a lot in his matches. Physical bout as expected. Ending was really cool and reminded me of one of my favorite match endings (Henry/Mysterio).

Germany match was probably the most well-paced out of the three. Lots of new stuff here with the same story as their first match, but with more Jimmy Hart interactions. There also seems to be a bigger emphasis on Benoit's quickness advantage, especially when he is on defense. Lots of cool spots here, such as Meng going to the top rope and missing the splash, only for Benoit to go to the top rope for his headbutt. Doesn't have the amazing Benoit babyface performance of the first match, but Benoit still did well and the ending was nice. Very fun match.

GAB match was good, but I do remember it being better. The match kinda started dragging towards the middle, but I liked how these two did not just mindlessly resort to weapons even though the stipulation kinda called for it. Instead, they played with the stuff from the prior PPV match. It was kinda cool to see Meng going from no-selling Benoit's offense to gradually showing more pain as the match went on. I would say that in this match, the size difference is what is played off more than in any of the others. I didn't have too big of a problem with the ending, but it was VERY similar to Michaels/Angle from WM 21.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

EVERYTHING has been bad so far. And honestly I'm not expecting a classic from the KISS MY ARSE match that I'm watching now :|.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I knew Rebellion 2002 was shit when I bought the DVD in 2004 at the age of 11 .

Only thing good about the whole thing is BROCK because it's been so long since I've seen the tag. It has Benoit & Eddie I know but it also has Angle & Chavo which kinda sketches me out. OH & BROCK telling Heyman that if he costs Brock the title that Brock will "BUST YOU IN HALF" :lol :lol.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> EVERYTHING has been bad so far. And honestly I'm not expecting a classic from the KISS MY ARSE match that I'm watching now :|.




Huh. Can't believe you don't like Bangle/Guerreros, I really dug it yesterday. 

Random question- what's the Swagger/Christian match that everyone goes gaga for? Is it Backlash?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Feb 24th 2009 is the GOAT Swagger Vs Christian match .

And when I wrote that about Rebellion, I hadn't got to BANGLE/EDDIE & the other guy match. Seen it now, about to watch the main event.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Feb 24th 2009 is the GOAT Swagger Vs Christian match .
> 
> And when I wrote that about Rebellion, I hadn't got to BANGLE/EDDIE & the other guy match. Seen it now, about to watch the main event.




Ahh, thanks, cheers mate. (My brother in law is from Manchester, I'm hip to the euro lingo  )

Gonna try and find that match Christian/Swagger match, I'm currently watching Punk/Hardy The Bash at the recommendation of funnyfaces.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Ahh, thanks, cheers mate. (My brother in law is from Manchester, I'm hip to the euro lingo  )
> 
> Gonna try and find that match Christian/Swagger match, I'm currently watching Punk/Hardy The Bash at the recommendation of funnyfaces.


http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x8jbvs_jack-swagger-vs-christian-ecw-title_sport


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x8jbvs_jack-swagger-vs-christian-ecw-title_sport



I swear Zep, you're the greatest. Anytime I need something boom you're there with a good link. Thank you again sir. Will watch it right now.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Going to watch MITB 2011 between Punk & Cena now instead of saving it for last.

I'm going to need a joint after this one, Shit's getting intense.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Going to watch MITB 2011 between Punk & Cena now instead of saving it for last.
> 
> I'm going to need a joint after this one, Shit's getting intense.


A match i've only seen once  Think i need a rewatch as i can't remember what all the fuss is about (apart from the story of course).


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*Rebellion 2002*

Fuck me Michael Cole on commentary sounds like he's on something. HI HI HI HI HI I'M MICHAEL COLE AND WOW WOW WOW LOOK HOW BIG MY HAND IS RIGHT HERE AT REBELLION IN MANCHESTER ENGLAND OMG OMG OMG THIS IS AWESOME!!!!

Stephanie McFapfap kicks off the show :mark:. She announces Undertaker won't be here tonight. WHAT A FUCKING BITCH. I'd still do her though. FAP.


*Booker T Vs Matt Hardy*

Oh wow, this looks horrible on paper lol. I like Matt, and he had a GREAT run from like, 02 to 09, but fuck, Booker T drags shit down so much. Also, this is a SD PPV... and Booker T is on Raw. THE FUCK BITCHES?

MATT LOVES ENGLISH MUFFINS. You know, I don't even know what an English Muffin is, nor have I had one (would be weirder if I'd had one and still didn't know what it was, right?).

Brilliant TAZZ commentary: "SMACKDOWN: WE DON'T CHEAT AROUND HERE. SOMETIMES."

BAAAARGH BUHHHHHH BURRGAAAGHHHHHH!!! Those are all noises you can hear from Booker T during a comeback.

Tazz: "THAT WAS A CRUMPET AWAY FROM A VICTORY FOR THE BOOK MAN" WHAT ARE YOU EVEN SAYING YOU DAFT MIDGET?

What a great match. What an incredible match to kick start this PPV. Oh wow what an incredible match right here in Manchester. These are all things Michael Cole and Tazz say about this match that are 100% bullshit.

This whole match is a giant ball of fuck all.

*Rating: 1/4**
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*John Cena & Dawn Marie Vs Billy Kidman & Torrie Wilson*

Just no. 2002 Cena = LOL. Divas = LOL.

*Rating: NO*
*CAL SCALE - -1*


*Funaki Vs Crash Holly*

Crash mocks Funaki. And gets kicked in the face. Ha.

Match is about as basic as you get, just a filler match between 2 Jobber Cruiserweights. Best part was Crash mocking Funaki at the start, and a KILLER cut off clothesline later on.

*Rating: 1/4**
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*Tajiri Vs Rey Mysterio Vs Jamie Noble - WWE Cruiserweight Championship Elimination Match*

:mark: fuck me sideways this looks INCREDIBLE on paper. Elimination style is :mark: too as it guarantees us a great one on one match regardless of who might get eliminated first!!! Hopefully this match will make up for the shite fest the show has been so far.

:lmao at Cole making a jab at Tazz being ORANGE.

Fun stuff to start, making good use of the fact there are 3 of them in the match. More unique tripley threat spots, usually featuring 2 guys trying a move and the third guy sort of getting in the way of it and getting knocked down almost by accident lol. Nice change from your typical triple threat spots.

TAJIRI KICKS~!

TIGER BOMB~! Tajiri is... eliminated? Already? 

Well, at least we are left with REY VS NOBLE, and :mark: at that. 

Noble focuses on the arm of Rey, busting out some sweet shit to target it.

Urgh, Tazz is trying to be "English" which is apparently what all colour commentators must attempt when over in the UK. FUCKING STOP IT YOU ORANGE MIDGET.

Unfortunately the arm stuff gets a little dull, with too much time just sitting in holds rather than making shit interesting .

:lmao I just found THE single greatest sign ever. For real. I mean the single greatest absolute GOAT sign anyone has EVER brought to a show. "KANE RAPED ULRIKA" :lmao UK people will laugh, everyone else will remain clueless as to who Ulrika is .

Rey makes a comeback and hits a bunch of big, high impact moves, but Noble either kicks out or is saved by Nidia.

TIGER BOMB~!

KICK OUT!!!

Noble wins with a counter to a roll up, and apparently Nidia helps him but the camera angle we saw doesn't show that :lmao.

So this was HIGHLY disappointing. I mean MAJORLY fucking disappointing. Tajiri was gone way too quickly, and the arm stuff on Rey was mostly dull, and the finish fell FLAT AS FUCK too .

*Rating: **
*CAL SCALE - 0*


:lmao at Benoit and Angle acting like kids backstage as they try to work out who is TEAM CAPTAIN. Also, HOW HILARIOUS A BAD TEETH JOKE IN ENGLAND. I love how they always come up with new, innovative jokes to mock us 8*D.


*The Big Valbowski & Chuck Palumbo Vs Ron Simmons & D-Von*

Chuck and Val as a team? Val going by THE BIG VALBOWSKI? The fuck is this craziness?

Farooq and D-Von together? I know they were stuck together in the tag title tournament... but they stayed a team afterwards? And Farooq is now just going by RON SIMMONS. Because. Stuff. This entire match is INSANE. Makes my head hurt.

So this is a bit of a mess of a match. Some ok stuff when it comes to RON beating someone up, but other than that it just doesn't work for me. Man, this PPV is sucking HARD HARD HARD right now.

*Rating: 1/4**
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*Albert Vs Rikisi - Kiss My Arse Match*

Albert hasn't quite changed his name to A-TRAIN yet. But he's dressing like A-Train.

:lmao at Albert's promo before the match.

Tazz: "ALBERT DOESN'T SHAVE HIS ASS?" Oh I'm sorry Tazz, I didn't realise that this wasn't normal. Best get my shaver out...

:lmao god this is fun. Finally, something worth seeing on this show. :lmao at Rikishi bending over as Albert runs at him, causing the big guy to back the FUCK OUT OF THE RING.

:lmao at Albert being heckled by fans, so he tells them to shut up and rubs his chest seductively :lmao.

HEADBUTT TO ALBERT~!

ALBERT IS UNPHASED~!

HEADBUTT TO RIKISHI~!

RIKISHI GOES DOWN~!

ALBERT GIVES BETTER HEAD THAT RIKISHI~!

Wait, what?

Tazz is fucking OBSESSED with Albert's hairy ass. OBSESSED.

:lmao at Tazz making what he THINKS are seal noises. Ends up sounding like a retard took over commentary.

BYCICLE KICK~!

SUPERKICK TO ALBERT~!

BONZAIIIII!!! Albert loses, and now he must KISS RIKISHI'S ASS. Which is shaved. Because that's normal apparently.

Albert tries to run, gets told he will get suspended if he doesn't. He gets back in the ring, attacks Rikishi, tries to give HIM a stinkface which backfires and he ends up with a face full of ASS.

This was fun lol.

*Rating: ***
*CAL SCALE - 0.5*


Afterwards Tazz and Cole and Tony Chimmel dance with Rikishi.


*Chris Benoit & Kurt Angle Vs Los Guerreros - WWE Tag Team Championship Match*

BANGLE VS EDDIE & the other guy!!!

:lmao at the video package pretty much being the No Mercy tag match video package... minus anything to do with REDGE.

Crowd LOVE both Angle and Benoit, and BOOOO the shit out of Chavo when he tags in to start things off :lmao.

Despite the fact LOS GUERRERO'S are the opponents here, it's the one up-man-ship feud between Benoit and Angle that seems to be the focus early on, and the crowd being split on the two followed by actually chanting "WE WANT ANGLE" when Benoit tags in plays a BIG part in the match in the early going. It's all fun 

:lmao Eddie and Chavo are just MEAT for Angle and Benoit to fuck about with to try and prove who the better man is. Angle hits a German? Benoit charges into the ring and hits one two. Can't decide which was better? STEREO GERMANS~!

Angle and Benoit basically competing against each other pisses LOS GUERREROS off, forcing them to become more vicious and actually gain control of the match with Benoit playing FIP.

GORY SPECIAL~! That'll show them for looking past LOS GUERREROS!

Benoit gets worked over a little longer, but eh, nothing setting the world on fire here, but at least it doesn't suck or anything lol .

HOT TAG TO ANGLE and the fans go crazy. Fucking Manchester... people. I'm sure they have some shitty name like Manchestians or something retarded like that but I don't know or care. YOU SUCKS. Stop cheering Angle over Benoit you tits.

Finishing stretch starts off good from the hot tag, with Angle going all crazy, then it slows down and kinda kills the momentum they were building, before going back to CRAZYVILLE for the finish... but even the finish ends up being a bit awkward lol.

Overall this is still a fun and solid match, but eh, I'm just not loving it like I used to .

*Rating: ****
*CAL SCALE - 2*


*Brock Lesnar & Paul Heyman Vs Edge - WWE Championship Handicap Match*

BOTH MEN IN TIPPY TOP SHAPE~! Tazz has a wonderfully shit way with words...

Lesnar shows off his POWER early on, then Edge resorts to his quickness to frustrate THE CHAMP, and it works for a little while until it just makes him MAD. And you wouldn't want to see Lesnar MAD. Well actually you would because he's awesome. KILL THE EDGE!!!

Does anyone do a better BACK BREAKER than Lesnar? Especially when he does them in triplicate :mark:. 

Lesnar on offence is just tremendous. Everything looks awesome and nasty and PAINFUL, especially the unique submission hold he does which is like a modified Boston Crab, but BROCKAFIED. And anything BROCKAFIED is PAINFUL and AWESOME.

Could have done with fewer rest hold in this one though. Lesnar sits in a couple of holds, and yeah they look NASTY because of how powerful he is, but even then I can only watch for so long before my mind wanders.

Poor Heyman. Edge ASSAULTS HIM twice for NO REASON at all. First he Spears him off the apron, then when Heyman finally recovers about 10 minutes later, he gives him a baseball slide and sends him crashing into the announce table. And BOTH TIMES Edge does something to Heyman, he takes his eye off Lesnar, allowing Lesnar to fucking KILL HIM the moment he turns around. DUH ME EDGE AND ME STOOPID. 

Oh look, Edge going after Heyman a THIRD TIME. What the fuck? Edge can pin Heyman without Heyman tagging in? THE FUCK IS THIS SHIT?

Michael Cole: "DROPKICK! WE ARE GONNA CROWN A NEW CHAMPION!!!!" :lmao sure Cole, Lesnar survived HELL IN A CELL WITH UNDERTAKER, but a fucking DROPKICK FROM EDGE is gonna end his title reign. Ya dumb bastard.

Nice counter from an F-5 into the Edgecution!

SPEAR! Lesnar kicks out!

CHAIR TO THE GUT~! F-5~! Lesnar retains the belt.

Match is ok. Nothing special. Lesnar rules, but the match is dragged down by a couple of rest holds that last far too long. Fun finishing stretch.

*Rating: **1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 1*



*Overall CAL SCALE - 2.5*​


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Glad that you hated the Hardy/Booker match as much as me, good stuff.

Edge is good in the beginning of the BROCK match as he actually knows how to use his quickness _*EDGE* 8*D 8*D_ ...... To try and defeat the monster, which is contradictory to the rest of the match which Edge decides to work as if he's going one on one with any regular guy. He doesn't sell the MONSTER that is Brock Lesnar very well, didn't put over his presence like Taker did, lie Hogan did, HELL... Even ROCK did a magnificent job at putting over Lesnar's persona.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Hard to believe that Smitty loved the PPV and gave it a 20 on the CAL SCALE lol. For me its the second worst PPV of the year, only just above Insurrextion :lmao.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I don't care if Shitty loved the PPV, the show fucking sucked :lol.

Anyways, 20 minutes into Punk-Cena and I'm all :mark::mark::mark::mark:.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*I liked that Edge/Lesnar and Heyman match but then again I am a shameless Edge mark. BTW: (count in me that group who googled Ulrika...still don't get it.)

That PPV does blow though...which is funny considering how Smackdown was LIGHTYEARS ahead of Raw is HHH 2002 at that time. *


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

EVAN WITH NO REGARD FOR HUMAN LIFE! Doing his best :HHH2 impression on smitty. Somebody please stop the damn match!

What PPVs are left in KillaCal's 2002 project? I was so disappointed that he didn't shit on Undertaker/Rock, but the Jericho/HHH HIAC rant was so worth it.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I have:

Vengeance
SummerSlam
Unforgiven
Armageddon

and then GLOBAL WARNING TOUR left to do. Might go for Unforgiven next, so I at least know I'm in for a :mark: Main Event before going to Amrageddon and that shit fest .


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I wonder if I should post *Part4OMGZ* tonight :hmm:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> EVAN WITH NO REGARD FOR HUMAN LIFE! Doing his best :HHH2 impression on smitty. Somebody please stop the damn match!
> 
> What PPVs are left in KillaCal's 2002 project? I was so disappointed that he didn't shit on Undertaker/Rock, but the Jericho/HHH HIAC rant was so worth it.



Just finished the Punk/Hardy match from the Bash you were pimping. Top notch stuff, I liked it a lot more than their NoC match.

Punk-Hardy Series:

1. Smackdown Cage Match ****1/2
2. Summerslam TLC Match ****1/4
3. The Bash ****
4. Night of Champions ***1/2

Am I missing any?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Just finished the Punk/Hardy match from the Bash you were pimping. Top notch stuff, I liked it a lot more than their NoC match.
> 
> Punk-Hardy Series:
> 
> ...


Glad to see you enjoyed the match. Now for the rest of the regulars in this thread to join suit if they haven't already. They had one other match on Smackdown where Matt Hardy was the special enforcer, but it wasn't anything special. I would say the final step would be to watch the best promo of 2009.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Post p4 now



Cactus Jack said:


> Just finished the Punk/Hardy match from the Bash you were pimping. Top notch stuff, I liked it a lot more than their NoC match.
> 
> Punk-Hardy Series:
> 
> ...


I forgot to post, I watched the Bash 09 match last week, pretty good shaky finish though, these guys have great chemistry. I would actually say their most famous tlc match is the weakest of their series tbhayley, not saying its bad


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> EVAN WITH NO REGARD FOR HUMAN LIFE! Doing his best :HHH2 impression on smitty. Somebody please stop the damn match!


BURIED.

Punk Vs Hardy?

Bash ~ **** 1/2*
NOC ~ **** 1/4*
Summerslam ~ **** 3/4*
Cage ~ ******

unk6


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

I love me some punk/hardy outside of NOC. Thier cage match is ridiculously underrated IMO. 

Cage: ****1/4 :mark
TLC: ****
Bash: ***3/4
NOC: ***


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Quite a RARE match people (a simple thanks would be nice )

Shawn Michaels vs Venom - Texas Wrestling Academy (2000)

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k2PDhaGG3tUhpu4T6YU

**This is my upload originally, but big thanks to Cal (Callamus) for the use of his DM account as i can't post it on YT**

I may post a DL link in my thread at some point...


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*RJSBX1 Hate-Watches: Heroes of Wrestling *










I had to do it sometime…I couldn’t just avoid it. If you’re going to watch shit…well you might as well find the crème de la shit. I present to you my friends: *HEROES OF WRESTLING 1999. *

THIS VIDEO PACKAGE looks like it was filmed with a CD Player. :lmao :lmao The pyro is akin to kids throwing up sparklers in the air…my body is ready. 

ZEB’s on commentary… the fuck is he wearing?! The play by play is some goof who’s not Gordon Solie (and thank god he didn’t spend his last days…commentating this abortion.) :lmao :lmao Zeb completely steps in front of this Rosenbloom guy. Zeb tells us to order the PPV (then looks ashamed) and Rosenbloom channels his inner Michael Cole and INSTRUCTS us how to order a PPV in 1999. :lmao for fucks sake.

Breaking News (according to the stiff): King Kong Bundy is with Michael St. Who Give a Fuck.

Oh my McDonald’s is Yokozuna fat as fuck. ¾’s of the camera is Yokozuna---no seriously…he’s that fat. They argue for a bit and kind of brawl…but it’s basically a like two blimps clogging up the air traffic. 
:lmao THIS SCRAWNY GUY manages to hold back KKB. The fuck. 

ANOTHER fucking video package….why? The voiceover guy: “This pay per view may be the most powerful storm the Gulf Coast has ever seen. “ That joke writes itself. :lmao

So the pay per view is dedicated to Gorilla Monsoon…and you know the sentiment is nice but…um…Gorilla was probably rolling over in his grave at this travesty of wrestling.

*Samoan Swat Team vs. Marty Jannetty and Tommy Rogers*

I know it’s 1999 but who the fuck wants to see this?

So Rikishi is the original Swat Team member but he actually had shit to do with WWF at this point so we get Samu as a replacement. Some little assclown in suspenders comes out with a towel for NOOO reason with the Samoan Swat Team….and HOLY YOKOZUNA is Tama is obese as a motherfucker. This show is being brought to you by Wilford Brimley. (too soon?) 

The manager starts talking for…you guessed it…no reason. :lmao :lmao Helen Keller could cut a better promo than this doofus. He mentions a 12-pack of liquid courage which no doubt Jake Roberts probably already drank. …holy fuck he’s still talking…

The play by play goof is legit talking ALL over the promo :lmao :lmao. 

Oh My Larry Hoover…Jannetty looks like shit to which Colter says “years and years of experience in the ring” Yeah okay, Dutch. 
15 minutes and no action yet...:lmao aaaaand Rosenblum (who’s a worse Mike Adamle) says Tommy Rogers tag team partner was “Jackie Fulton.” :lmao so we see that research wasn’t done tonight. 

Dutch thinks Marty Jannetty should be wrestling in WCW or WWF right now. :lmao :lmao. Dutch was also paid 40$ to say that by Jannetty. 

Not Gordon Solie Guy: “This is Marty Jannetty…he’s turned on the guys in the crowd”: lmao what.
Dutch channels his inner Zeb in ’99 and torches not Gordon Solie on first amendment rights. :lmao WHAT IS THIS. Finally some action…like finally. 

Hey we get an actual wrestling move from Marty! It’s an armdrag which is called a THROW by Randy (Michael Cole would be proud) . Tama, a savage mind you, offers a handshake. THAT MAKES NO SENSE.

DROPKICK= LEG KICK. Oh, Not Gordon Solie you so funny. This whole match is Marty Jannetty flailing his arms in the air and blowing spots. :lmao :lmao The best wrestler in the match Tommy Rogers has been in the match yet…it’s been 10 minutes.

After a LOL-worthy chairshot from one of the SST: “That is unethical” – Not Gordon Soli. Well no shit…they are heels. :lmao

I’m trying this whole capitalizing random words to keep myself interested here. PLANCHA. JANNETTY. WHYISTHISONPPV ROGERS IS IN…only to get Samoan Dropped and pinned. :lmao :lmao. ARGH. 

*DUD - Did you read the review? Did this sound entertaining match wise? The best worker ate the pin and got in…zero offense. Like why?*

*George "the Animal" Steele vs. Greg Valentine*

George is with SHERRI. I love me some Sherri. Hammer: “Sherri I’m going to walk out with you baby…whether you like it or not” That sounds a little rapey, Hammer. :lmao 

The no music entrance thing makes this EVEN more awkward. The good thing is they both look the exact same 20 years ago…but HOLY WHAT HAPPENED TO HER...Sherri looks like she got she got hit with the whole ugly tree. 

Anyway, Sherri is Steele’s boyfriend and he’s facing off against Hammer who’s the “beauty” in this match SO GUESS WHO’S TURNING HEEL. Valentine is walking around ringside and he’s accused of stalking Sherri Martel by Not Gordon Solie…even though he’s NOWHERE near her. :lmao. 

George wants to eat the turnbuckle. Classic. Not Gordon Solie, however who clearly never watched wrestling before, doesn’t understand why. 

NOT ONE OFFENSE MOVE YET. George removes his shirt…(why.)…Hammer attacks him and SO DOES Sherri…which throws out the whole SUBTLE HEEL TURN. Steele is sitting in the corner with a shirt half on and half off while Valentine beats on him. He gets it off but doesn’t know Sherri beat on him. :lmao 

Dutch: “Woman can be evil like that…you wouldn’t know that though.” OH HA HA HA. That’s so funny…ugh.

Steele grabs a chair and hits Hammer hands it to Sherri. OH BY THE WAY this isn’t a NO-DQ match. SO RING THE FUCK BELL, REF. 

Sherri (who technically…already made her heel turn already) blasts Steel with the chair. And the announcers. Both Not Gordon Solie and Dutch are SHOCKED. :lmao :lmao. Dutch is SO shocked he’s going to talk to Sherri about it. :lmao 

Oh, so Valentine gets the pinfall after the not called DQ shot. Steele starts throwing a tantrum. BREAKUPS SUCK.

*-**: Oh my stars and stripes was that a piece of shit. I wish someone would’ve taken a Steele Hammer and hit me in the face with it. Get it? *

*
2 Cold Scropio vs. Julio Fantastico*
WHO-lio Fantastico? The fuck is that? Wikipedia’s….OH it’s Julio Dinero. (who?) By the way, these two have music and Valentine and Steele didn’t. Go figure. 

OKAY. 2CS comes out with a replica WCW title belt and none of the announcers feels that’s important information to talk about. :lmao WHY DO I BOTHER. 

Lou Albano is here. Holy fuck does he save this match…barely. He can call the fucking moves AND tell a decent story unlike Not Gordon Solie and Dutch. 

Albano about Not Gordon Solie: “He’s a nice guy but he looks like he’s got the brain of a dehydrated baby if they put him in a pigeon pack and had him fly backward” :lmao :lmao :lmao 

So this is spotfest...except they blew all the spots. :lmao Who-lio can’t skin the fucking cat…so they re-do it and it looks even worse. Scorpio holding the ropes and pulling back for something but we go to a shot of Dinero and just see him being crashed on. :lmao 

Apprently this was the match that got him a ECW contract. :lmao :lmao 

BRAWL in the crowd...but it’s TOO GODDAMN DARK to see anything. 

Before a pinfall attempt: Dutch : “This will be a two count.” Two count called….really Zeb? Albano is still giving Not Gordon Solie shit for being a complete dumbass. :lmao

Decent. Well for this match anyway…finishing sequence. Scorpio wins with the Houston hangover.

**1/2 – MOTN. I mean that’s not saying much. BUT….well…they tried to not make me want to pull my hair out. *

LOU is the new commissioner…for…(sing along if you know the words)…NO REASON. He makes an acceptance speech which only we (the PPV viewing audience) can hear but the fans can’t so it’s REALLY awkward. :lmao :lmao 

*Bushwackers vs. Nikolai Volkoff and Shieky Baby *

AWWWW SHIIIIIT. SHEIKY BABY. :mark: :mark: 

A USA chant break out BUT the Bushwackers are from New Zealand. :lmao :lmao

The heels have some goof named Nikita Brezhnikov in their corner, WORST Russian accent and wears what looks like a Cossack uniform and waves a USSR flag. Wrestling misinterpreting history since the dawn of time. 

SHEIKYYYYY BABY is TALKING AND TALKING AND TALKING. :mark:. Does it makes sense? No. Is it better than anything else so far? Uh…yeah? 

I’d rather watch the Bushwackers vs. Steve Urkel and Carl Winslow from that Family Matter episode. At least, that had a fucking point. 

OKAY. So you know how Cole and JBL bicker and that gets annoying after two minutes. Not Gordon Solie and Dutch DO THIS THE WHOLE SHOW. Shut the fuck up. So this is flat out awful. AWFUL KICKS. AWFUL PUNCHES. AWFUL LIGHTING (WHY IS IT SO DAMN DARK?!) 

At one point, Sheik slaps on the Camel Clutch that Luke…or Butch…or one of those fuckers stays in for 15 seconds like it’s a resthold. THIS PPV: SHITTING ON YOUR CHILDHOOD MEMORIES. :lmao :lmao

The finish.I actually don’t know what happened…OH. Luke wins..by using a foreign object (UNETHICAL) but he’s a face so who gives a fuck.

*-**********: Count those stars. That how awful it was. I would call this a Roe v. Wade because…well you know…*

So Tully Blanchard is backstage and Stan Lane jumps him and throws him in the trunk of the limo (if you got here by limo…you shouldn’t be at this damn show) and doesn’t actually close the trunk :lmao :lmao

BUT TULLY CUTS A PROMO = :mark:. It’s a good promo, dammit. Tully actually makes me want to see the match…don’t you dare disappoint me. :lmao

*Stan Lane vs. Tully Blanchard*

They both actually look pretty good considered they weren’t signed to a major fed for like 2-3 years. Lane does a Mr. Kennedy and does his own intro. :lmao :lmao. Didn’t know Lane worked for ESPN at this time. The more you know! 

Dutch call the ring a crib...like a baby’s crib. :lmao SHUT UP.

y the way: Tully Blanchard, who more or less tried to murder both Dusty Rhodes and Magnum TA is a HERO of wrestling. :lmao :lmao Belly to Belly Suplex…and….no…a double pin….but Tully gets a shoulder barely and he wins.

**- Well. It didn’t TOTALLY suck but it still sucked. *

*One Man Gang vs. Abby the Butcher*

FUCK. I tried to avoid having to watch Abby matches because…he’s a cunt. Poor Gang can’t even get into the fucking ring. :lmao :lmao it’s reminiscent to when Vader fell on his ass in 2005. 

HARDCORE RULZ. And of course…Abby’s bleeding. BIG FUCKING SHOCK. OMG is carrying the match so that has to tell you something :lmao 

:lmao :lmao Abby decided to just blade RIGHT in front of the camera. FORK SHOTS GALORE and OMG is busted open…and probably has some form of Hep. FUCK YOU ABBY.

OH the match ends in a No-Contest. :lmao :lmao….

*-***3/4: Yet again, did you read the review? Did that sound good?*

*CowBob Orton vs. Jimmy “I Really Should Be Arrested” Snuka.*

This match ..I shit you not is over a POKER GAME. :lmao :lmao :lmao. Cowbob was cheating so Snuka is going to make him pay. SNUKA IS A HOOKER KILLER…but he’s a hero of wrestling more importantly. :lmao

Albano is managing Snuka…which doesn’t seem to be conflict of interest despite that he’s the Commissioner? Am I the only paying attention?! 

:lmao :lmao Not Gordon Solie says Cowbob is from Kansas City Kansas…which we all know is WRONG. :lmao 

Decent Crossbody from Hooker Killer. That’s as far as the compliments are going. MAT SEQUENCE which the crowd hates…these fuckers…:lmao

So remember that Commissioner Job Lou won? He’s stepping down after this match :lmao :lmao Who can fill those big shoes? 

WAY TOO LONG ARMBAR FROM COWBOB---which just confuses Not Gordon Solie :lmao 

After what seems to be forever Snuka wins with the the….CROSSBODY….not the Splash. Not the strangle and dump the body move…nope the crossbody.

*DUD- 11 minutes TOO LONG. *

*HERE WE GO: The INFAMOUS JAKE ROBERTS INTERVIEW.*

Jake is PLAAAAAAAASTERED. I mean there’s White Girl Wasted and then there’s HEROES OF WRESTLING WASTED. I don’t have to recap because you’ve all seen it but the interviewer’s discomfort is :lmao :lmao

*Jake Roberts vs. Jim Niedhart*

HOO BOY. 
Let’s just take a moment to feel bad for one person in this match: Jim Neidhart. You see Jim to my knowledge still had shit in the tank, he was 44 and I think he had some last run stints in WCW and WWF. 
Now. Jim probably showed up thinking OKAY: X amount of dollars to get hit with the DDT and leave. Sounds cool, eh? 
I imagine he thought Jake would be SOBER. 

Not Gordon Solie says Jake is being accompanied by his 12-foot python Damien…who’s definitely dead by this time

:lmao :lmao I know it’s mean to laugh at this but JAKES BOOTS ARENT EVEN LACED. Think about that for a second. 

Anvil is doing everything right…trying to stall with the ref about the Snake…which some might say is Morse Code for “get this lush out of here.” 

IMAGINE *PAYING* FOR THIS. :lmao :lmao. I just YouTube'd the shit, and I want a refund. 

Jake channels his inner Val Venis and hits on some not so pleasant gals in the front. BEER GOGGLES. :lmao. They don't seems to mind though.

The snake is out of the bag, so Jake, having no clue what country he’s in at this point, takes it out and puts part of it between his legs and, you guessed it, JERKS IT OFF. :lmao :lmao

Both announcers talk about Jake’s IC title reign…which was on the same PPV that Hogan faced Flair in MSG at Wrestlemania for the World Title AND Austin and Rock and Triple H had that Triple Threat. AKA IT NEVER HAPPENED. :lmao

This is just painful. Anvil tries to do basic thing but Jake is so GONE. SOMEHOW JAKE IS OUT OF HIS SOCKS….and Not Gordon Solie says this is mind games…:lmao :lmao

KKB comes out and breaks up the DDT for….you guessed it again….NOOOOO REASON. So they beat down on Jake until ¾ of the screen is eclipsed by Yokozuna. :argh:

NO WAIT. The “former Yokozuna”…thanks Not Gordon Solie. I would call this is a run-in but it’s more of a Plod-In. Poor Yoko is too big to do anything…and Jake’s in fucking La-La Land, and KKB is KKB and POOR POOR Jim Neidhart 

Then YOKO and Jake beat up this poor manager and…imagine being this poor stiff and having a 800 pound man and drunk beating on you…in a clearly unscheduled part of the show. :lmao

YOKO then tells Jake to give him the DDT but Jake probably thinks that means Don’t Drink Tequila. SO Yoko has to Samoan Drop him and…well THAT’S ALL FOLKS.

No scheduled main event which was KKB vs. Yoko (THANK GOD). The only saving grace, I suppose. 

*:lmao. That’s the rating. I mean, what can you say? Somewhere along the line…Bundy won the match….despite it being…AW WHO GIVES A FUCK. :lmao*

*:faint:/100* ​


----------



## mk92071 (Aug 17, 2011)

Anyone happen to have a list of ***+ TV matches from the year 2008? I'd be very grateful. Trying to make my way through the year 2008.


----------



## Brogue_Kick (Sep 11, 2011)

mk92071 said:


> Anyone happen to have a list of ***+ TV matches from the year 2008? I'd be very grateful. Trying to make my way through the year 2008.


- Matt Hardy vs Finlay vs John Morrison vs The Miz (ECW, 22/7)*
- Jeff Hardy vs Umaga - Steel Cage Match (RAW, 7/1)*
- Rey Mysterio vs Evan Bourne (RAW, 27/10)
- Undertaker vs Jeff Hardy - Extreme Rules Match (SD!, 14/11)
- Matt Hardy vs Finlay (ECW, 11/11)
- Jeff Hardy vs HBK (RAW, 11/2)
- Chris Jericho vs HBK - Last Man Standing (RAW, 19/11)
- CM Punk vs Chris Jericho & JBL (RAW, 4/8)
- CM Punk vs Chris Jericho (RAW, 22/12)
- John Morrison & The Miz vs Cryme Tyme (RAW, 22/9)
- Triple H vs Undertaker (SD!, 24/10)
- CM Punk vs Chavo Guerrero (ECW, 4/3)

My favourite from this list is Jeff Hardy vs Umaga, incredible match and great chemistry between both competitors


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I've been watching a lot of Eddie matches lately, and does anyone have some matches in his first WWF run that are worth watching? I honestly don't remember a lot of them, and I'm in the mood since I'm at the point in his book where he talks about going up to WWF.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^ sorry bud not a Guerrero aficionado 

Damn this place goes quiet some days

Want some ppv/match to watch ?


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

You guys impress me with how quickly you're able to churn out reviews, even for shitshow PPV's that you'd rather not watch. :lol

Will have a Shawn Michaels review soon...ish. :avit:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^^^ :mark: :mark: looking forward to seeing this


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Honestly, there isn't much to see for Eddie's first run in WWF 00-mid 01. He was fucked up most of the time and just wasn't "on" a lot of the time. Some fun TV matches here and there, both singes (some stuff with Jericho, Val Venis) and tags (with Chyna, believe it or not, and the radicals too), but nothing I'd say go out of your way to watch. Thankfully his return in 2002 he was :mark: again and had a tremendous 3 year run.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Eddie Guerrero and Chyna :ti "Mamacita"


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*whistles awkwardly over Cal's score :lmao 

To earn some respect back, somebody give me a random show to write about, if I can find it I'll watch it. I dont care how shitty


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Callamus said:


> Honestly, there isn't much to see for Eddie's first run in WWF 00-mid 01. He was fucked up most of the time and just wasn't "on" a lot of the time. Some fun TV matches here and there, both singes (some stuff with Jericho, Val Venis) and tags (with Chyna, believe it or not, and the radicals too), but nothing I'd say go out of your way to watch. Thankfully his return in 2002 he was :mark: again and had a tremendous 3 year run.


Eddie's first run was, IMO, far more about fleshing out his character than churning out good matches. I thought that the Latino Heat character really helped establish Eddie as a multi-faceted performer. I mean, who doesn't remember the segment where he went to the Playboy Mansion to break in and get Chyna's pictures back And remember when he fought Rikishi and pretended he was sick, so Chyna fought him instead? This was the era of actor Eddie. And despite the quality of matches being underwhelming, for Eddie at least, he was still quite entertaining. Its just that it was in a more theatrical way as opposed to in ring.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

smitty915 said:


> *whistles awkwardly over Cal's score :lmao


Oh hey there .

Top 10 WORST PPV's I've rated with THE CAL SCALE.

WrestleMania 2 - 0.5
Insurrextion 2002 - 1
WrestleMania IV - 1
WrestleMania XV - 2
2006 Royal Rumble - 2
2012 Royal Rumble - 2
WrestleMania V - 2
Rebellion 2002 - 2.5
2010 Royal Rumble - 2.5
1999 Royal Rumble - 3.5

We've had some GOD AWFUL WrestleMania and Royal Rumble shows :lmao.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

That shows how great of an overall performer Eddie was. He could play comedic roles (AE all the way to early 2004) and he could play the sociopathic character (in 2005) all to perfection. Great variety.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Oh hey there .
> 
> Top 10 WORST PPV's I've rated with THE CAL SCALE.
> 
> ...


I must of had an off day because usually our scores match up close to each other, give or take a few points. 

Still waiting for the PPV suggestion guys


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

waiting for one also


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

WM 2, obviously 8*D.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> WM 2, obviously 8*D.


Oh no, I own that one.. 

I'LL DO IT!

Skins: How does SVS 04 sound, its FUN FUN


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

*Top 100 Matches in WWE History*

Let me first give a disclaimer. I'm am 100% certain I have left out numerous important matches. I was just bored today and did this from memory. I have seen all these matches multiple times, but when it comes to the order of the last 50 or so matches, it gets a bit shaky. Also, it should go without saying, this is just my opinion, I'm only posting this because I'm bored and thought this might create some interesting discussions. And I will probably disagree with this list in 3 days anyhow. Last thing: I tried to avoid throwing tags in there as much as possible, because I just have such a hard time comparing singles matches against tag matches. I'm a huge fan of tags, so I'd probably overrate all the tag matches anyhow.

*5-Star Matches*

1.Bret Hart vs Steve Austin WrestleMania 13
2. Shawn Michaels vs The Undertaker Hell in a Cell Badd Blood 1997
3. Shawn Michaels vs The Undertaker WrestleMania 25
4. Eddie Guerrero vs JBL Judgement Day 2004
5. Bret Hart vs Owen Hart WrestleMania 10
6. Steve Austin vs Kurt Angle Summerslam 2001
7. Shawn Michaels vs Mankind Mindgames 1996
8. Shawn Michaels vs Chris Benoit vs HHH WrestleMania 20
9. Cactus Jack vs HHH Street Fight Royal Rumble 2000
10. Canadian Stampede 10 Man Tag
11. Eddie Guerrero vs Rey Mysterio Smackdown 6/23/05
12. Randy Savage vs The Ultimate Warrior WrestleMania 7
13. Cactus Jack vs Randy Orton Backlash 2004
14. CM Punk vs John Cena Money in the Bank 2011
15. CM Punk vs Brock Lesnar Summerslam 2013
16. Bret Hart vs Mr. Perfect King of the Ring 1993
17. Dude Love vs Steve Austin Over the Edge 1998
18. Chris Benoit vs Chris Jericho Ladder Match Royal Rumble 2001
19. The Undertaker vs Kurt Angle No Way Out 2006
20. Bret Hart vs Mr. Perfect Summerslam 1991
21. The Undertaker vs Shawn Michaels WrestleMania 26

* 4-3/4 Star Matches *

22. Brock Lesnar vs The Undertaker Hell in a Cell No Mercy 2002
23. Chris Benoit vs Steve Austin Smackdown 2001
24. Brock Lesnar vs John Cena Extreme Rules 2012
25. CM Punk vs Daniel Bryan Over the Limit 2012
26. Bret Hart vs Steve Austin Survivor Series 1996
27. Batista vs HHH Hell in a Cell Vengeance 2005
28. The Undertaker vs Kurt Angle Smackdown 2003
29. Ric Flair vs HHH Steel Cage Taboo Tuesday
30. Owen Hart vs Davey Boy European Championship Raw
31. The Shield vs Hell No/Ryback TLC 2012
32. Shawn Michaels vs Razor Ramon Ladder Match Summerslam 1995
33. Chris Benoit/Chris Jericho vs Two Man Power Trip Raw
34. Bret Hart vs Diesel Survivor Series 1995
35. Chris Jericho vs HHH Last Man Standing Fully Loaded 2000
36. 1992 Royal Rumble Match
37. CM Punk vs John Cena Raw Feb. 2013

* 4-1/2 Star Matches *

38. Brock Lesnar vs Kurt Angle Summerslam 2003
39. Brock Lesnar vs Eddie Guerrero No Way Out 2004
40. Ric Flair vs Randy Savage WrestleMania 8
41. Mankind vs The Undertaker Revenge of the Taker
42. Chris Benoit vs Brock Lesnar Smackdown 2003
43. Shawn Michaels vs Vader Summerslam 1996
44. Brock Lesnar vs Kurt Angle IronMan Match Smackdown 2003
45. Kurt Angle vs Rey Mysterio Summerslam 2002
46. Eddie Guerrero vs JBL Bull Rope Match Great American Bash 2004
47. Chris Benoit vs The Rock Fully Loaded 2000
48. Shawn Michaels vs Kurt Angle WrestleMania 21
49. Chris Benoit vs Finlay Judgement Day 2006
50. Steve Austin vs The Rock WrestleMania 17
51. CM Punk vs The Undertaker WrestleMania 29
52. Eddie Guerrero vs Chris Benoit Vengeance 2003
53. Bret Hart vs Bam Bam Bigelow King of the Ring 1993
54. Eddie Guerrero vs Rob Van Dam Ladder Match Raw 
55. Mankind vs The Undertaker Hell in a Cell King of the Ring 1998
56. Cactus Jack vs HHH Hell in a Cell No Way Out 2000
57. Daniel Bryan vs John Cena Summerslam 2013
58. 2005 Elimination Chamber Match New Years Revolution
59. Vader vs Bret vs Steve Austin vs The Undertaker IYH: Final Four
60. Eddie Guerrero vs Edge No DQ Match Smackdown 2002
61. Chris Benoit vs William Regal No Mercy 2006
62. Kurt Angle vs Shawn Michaels Vengeance 2005
63. Batista vs The Undertaker Wrestlemania 23
64. Eddie Guerrero vs Rey Mysterio Judgement Day 2005
65. Chris Benoit vs Eddie Guerrero Armageddon 2002
66. Christian vs William Regal Breaking Point 2009
67. Bret Hart vs Owen Hart White Plains NY Action Zone
68. Chris Benoit vs Shawn Michaels vs HHH Backlash 2004
69. Ric Flair vs Mr. Perfect Loser Leaves Town Raw 1993
70. Finlay vs Kane Belfast Brawl Smackdown 2007
71. Sheamus vs John Morrison Ladder Match TLC 2010
72. Shawn Michaels vs Chris Jericho WrestleMania 19
73. Bret Hart vs Owen Hart Steel Cage Summerslam 1994
74. Mankind vs The Undertaker King of the Ring 1996
75. Owen Hart/British Bulldog vs Shawn Michaels/Steve Austin Raw 1997
76. Finlay vs Matt Hardy Smackdown
77. Chris Benoit vs William Regal Velocity
78. Chris Jericho vs CM Punk WrestleMania 28
79. Daniel Bryan vs Sheamus 2/3 Falls Extreme Rules 2012
80. CM Punk vs John Cena Night of Champions 2012
81. The Undertaker vs HHH WrestleMania 17
82. Christian vs Jack Swagger ECW 2/24/09
83. Steve Austin vs The Rock WrestleMania 19
84. HHH vs Steve Austin 3 Stages of Hell No Way Out 2001
85. Bret Hart vs Hakushi IYH
86. Shawn Michaels vs Jeff Jarrett IYH
87. Brock Lesnar vs Big Show Stretcher Match Survivor Series
88. Matt Hardy vs Edge Cage Match Unforgiven 2005
89. CM Punk vs Jeff Hardy Cage Match Smackdown 2009
90. The Undertaker vs Batista Cyber Sunday 2007
91. Edge/Christian vs Benoit/Jericho vs The Hardys vs The Dudley's TLC: III Smackdown 2001
92. Chris Jericho vs Rey Mysterio The Bash 2009
93. The Rock vs HHH Backlash 2000
94. Randy Orton vs Christian Over The Limit 2011
95. Bret Hart vs 1-2-3 Kid Raw 1994
96. The Hardys vs The Dudley's vs Edge/Christian TLC Summerslam 2000
97. Kurt Angle vs Chris Benoit Royal Rumble 2003
98. The Rock vs Mankind I Quit Royal Rumble 1999
99. Rey Mysterio vs John Cena Raw 2011
100. Kane vs The Undertaker WrestleMania 14
​


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Summerslam 1992, 'skins.

Cactus Jack, you generally seem to have good taste. Nice to see some of the matches that you rated five stars. :nod:


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> Oh no, I own that one..
> 
> I'LL DO IT!
> 
> Skins: How does SVS 04 sound, its FUN FUN


I don't think you're about that life, smitty. WrestleMania 2 is pretty damn boring...not even fun to hate-watch.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Just so you guys know, this WM 2 review shall be a piece by piece review, I simply cannot be patient enough to sit through three hours of crap. So I'll watch Muraco/Orndorff then do something else


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Random PPV ideas for people who have none:

Cyber Sunday 2006
IYH: Rage in the Cage
Judgment Day 2003
ONS 2008 
Starrcade 1986
Halloween Havoc 1992
Guilty as Charged 2000
Against All Odds 2006
Hard Justice 2009


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

@ Cactus DAT MIND GAMES MATCH. What a classic, yet not many people seem to remember it. Absolutely one of Foley's matches, and one that surprisingly didn't require him to nearly kill himself, which was great. This is prime example #1 against the theory that Foley was only a spot monkey.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Okayy Muraco/wonderful is over, next WM 2 match will be watched tomorrow, Macho/Steele sounds fun on paper but I doubt its any good TBH 

Time for another taker post!


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Kurt Angle is involved in 9 of the best 100 WWE matches in history according to Cactus Jack. Surprised to see that considering this thread's opinion on Kurt. The Benoit vs Angle match at the Rumble making the list surprises me the most.  :kurt


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Oliver-94 said:


> Kurt Angle is involved in 9 of the best 100 WWE matches in history according to Cactus Jack. Surprised to see that considering this thread's opinion on Kurt. The Benoit vs Angle match at the Rumble making the list surprises me the most.  :kurt



I know a lot of people will disagree with me, but when Kurt was on, he was one of the best in the world. That Royal Rumble match gets a lot of hate, and I can understand it for the most part. It's just my preference, it's an action packed back and forth match with enough drama to keep me thoroughly entertained. I don't think slotting it as #97 is indefensible or anything,

Outside of that match, Angle had some downright classics with Lesnar, Taker, Austin, and Shawn Michaels. Those matches make up the other spots, and I think most people in here appreciate them to different degrees.

I think Undertaker and Benoit were my MVP's, I have them the most love. Both have over 10 matches on my list.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Oliver-94 said:


> Kurt Angle is involved in 9 of the best 100 WWE matches in history according to Cactus Jack. Surprised to see that considering this thread's opinion on Kurt. The Benoit vs Angle match at the Rumble making the list surprises me the most.  :kurt


You know, for a thread the encourages differing opinions, there seems to be a lot of wrestlers that are hated...


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Nice list CJ. Some great picks there and no brainers for the most part. Who makes the most appearances? I counted 14 for Benoit and 13 for HBK.

EDIT: Counted 15 for MEAN MARK. :taker


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

And Bret Hart has 13 on Cactus Jack's list.

GOAT's gonna GOAT.










ETA: Ahhh, C2D had to fuck it up.  :lol


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Nice list CJ. Some great picks there and no brainers for the most part. Who makes the most appearances? I counted 14 for Benoit and 13 for HBK.



Yea Benoit is the MVP I guess, HBK, Bret Hart, and Undertaker made over 10 appearances each, and Eddie was up there too. I don't think that list is overly biased or anything, I'd say 80% of that list is no brainers and the rest are ones I just personally really enjoy,

Edit- Hahahha I guess Taker wins. He's still undefeated. THE STREAK LIVES!

Wanna know the most impressive thing about that list? I typed it up on a iPad fucking mini. That's SKILLZ yo.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Thoughts on Show/taker Punjabi prison? I'm watching it now but if this is building to a DUD then I dont need to watch it TBH

Another question: Thoughts on London/Kiddman NM 04? sounds fun..


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Oh no, I own that one..
> 
> I'LL DO IT!
> 
> Skins: How does SVS 04 sound, its FUN FUN





LilOlMe said:


> Summerslam 1992, 'skins.
> 
> Cactus Jack, you generally seem to have good taste. Nice to see some of the matches that you rated five stars. :nod:


nah lol I hate that bret/davey, I cant, whats on svs 04, I dont remember hearing anything good ? I'm thinking its gonna be Backlash 09


Good Lord cjack you have alot of 5* matches :lmao, good list it also shows me there are SOO many matches Ive never seen.

I also love that :hbk1 is featured very heavily, oo yea interesting you liked hbk/razor II over I


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> nah lol I hate that bret/davey, I cant, whats on svs 04, I dont remember hearing anything good ? I'm thinking its gonna be Backlash 09
> 
> 
> Good Lord cjack you have alot of 5* matches :lmao, good list it also shows me there are SOO many matches Ive never seen.



20 5-Star matches isn't that much :side:


Everyone rates differently, I say a match is a "5-star match" when I deem it perfect, meaning I wouldn't change a single thing about it. Maybe I'm just less picky then all of you


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Another question: Thoughts on London/Kiddman NM 04? sounds fun..


 I like that match, enjoyed the story of Kidman going after Paul London's injured ribs and whether he would execute the SSP or not.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Nah I didnt mean that in a condescending way, just interesting

I think I only have like 9 i think


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> nah lol I hate that bret/davey, I cant, whats on svs 04, I dont remember hearing anything good ? I'm thinking its gonna be Backlash 09
> Ive never seen.


 SVS 04 is loads of fun. BL 09 is good too though 



Spoiler:  SVS 04 review



Survivor series 2004 review 

Match # 1: Rey Mysterio vs Billy Kidman vs Chavo Gurrero vs Spike Dudley(c) - fatal four way match for the cruiserweight title

Really fun match, tons of cool spots, a really good choice for the opener as it was not too long at only 10 minutes and it was fast paced and got the crowd hot for the rest of the show. I prefer this match to the cruiserweight open done at WrestleMania XX this year as all guys got a good amount of work in, and all are talented, though Rey and Chavo are really the only ones that would go anywhere. Decent match, but obviously not legendary by any means. *** ½* 

CAL SCALE: 3

Match # 2: Shelton Benjamin(c) vs Christian- singles match for the IC title

Everyone was telling me this was match of the night; it sure looks that way so far energetic match that combines the freak athlete in Shelton Benjamin with the charismatic nature of Christian. Great match, Tomko played a huge part by interfering while the ref looked away, hitting Benjamin with the IC belt. It’s now obvious to me that Christian plays a much better Heel than a face, he’s much too bland ATM. WWE needs Shelton back, as he’s so good in the ring. ****1/4* 

CAL SCALE: 6

Match # 3: Kurt Angle, Mark Jindrak, Luther Reigns, and Carlito vs Eddie Gurrero, Big show, John Cena, 
and RVD- traditional survivor series matchup

I am a huge fan of these types of matches, but I have no idea who Mark Jindrak or Luther Reigns is, but I’m a big fan of everyone else in the match. The match doesn’t officially start until after John Cena runs after Carlito until Carlito apparently steals a car, and apparently Carlitos such a loser he’s out already :lol. Match officially starts with Angle and the two people I don’t know against Cena’s stacked team. Angle’s team dominates the first few minutes, but nobody is eliminated yet. The match is pretty slow for a while as Angle’s team mows over Eddie. Finally RVD gets the tag and the pace is quickened. But a few minutes later RVD is eliminated. Minutes later Jindrak is eliminated, and its 3 on 2 now. Big show eliminates Reigns and its 3 on 1 now. RVD comes back out and distracts Angle while big show attacks hi, Cena then gives him the FU followed by an Eddie frog splash, big show comes in and Pins Angle. 
A pretty bad match, the whole thing with Carlito was stupid and Angles team was shit compared to Cena’s. It’s also relatively short at around 10-15 minutes; these matches should be at least 20 IMO. *

CAL SCALE: 0

Match # 4: Heidenrich vs the Undertaker- singles match

Heidenrech’s gimmick seems a little stale, but he has Paul Heyman se he must be okay. I have honestly never seen one of his matches so I go into it with it only knowing the in ring abilities of the Undertaker. This was a decent match, which surprised me, it wasn’t MOTN by any means but I thought it did its job as a filler match. Heidenrech never really did much in the WWE as he would be released in 2006, but I think if his gimmick wasn’t so dumb he could’ve been a decent midcarder. ** ½

CAL SCALE: 1

Match # 5: Lita vs Trish Stratus- singles match for the womens title

Ends in two minutes :lol- DUD

CAL SCALE: 0 

Match # 6: Booker T vs JBL- singles match for the WWE title

Love JBL but hate Booker. I expected great things from this match, at least *** ½*. Things start out much faster than your average match; it’s really good in the opening minutes. Orlando Jordan’s at ringside which sucks, but JBL and Booker both are crazy charismatic. The match slows down a little bit but booker T does a pretty cool suplex off the top rope. The crowd’s crazy behind Booker T, as JBL is an awesome heel, and Booker’s a good babyface too. Orlando interferes so much that the ref looks more stupid than usual. Then he gets knocked out, so Orlando clearly attacks Booker and grabs a chair. Then Josh Mathews attacks Orlando Jordan and I’m just done. JBL hits the clothesline and wins this silly match. Pretty bad, but it certainly could have been better, obviously JBL wins as he drops the title to Cena at WM 21 but Orlando Jordan and JOSH MATHEWS ruined it. *

CAL SCALE: 0

Match # 7: Randy Orton, Chris Jericho, Chris Benoit, and Maven vs HHH, Edge, Batista, and Snitsky

traditional SS match for control of the Raw for one month. 
Looks to be an awesome match, Snitsky took out Maven earlier so I guess he’s out already? Anyway two STACKED teams, and miss the SS style match in the ME, made it feel really special. Kind of wish Ric Flair was in this match instead of SNITSKY, whose okay I guess, but Flair would have been better. Benoit was the first one eliminated, which did NOT make me happy, I mean, its Benoit! Flair is comically ejected minutes later for interfering, which was funny. Batista is the first one off HHH’s team and I’m in shock of how Snitsky is still in. Then MAVEN comes down to the ring with no pop AT ALL, like Curtis Axel level of non-pop :lol. Snitsky gets disqualified and this match gets better, crowd seems happy. HHH then eliminates Maven. We’re down to 2 on 2, Orton and Jericho vs HHH and Edge. Jericho then gets Speared by Edge and its 2 on 1. The ref seems to just say “screw it “because there’s so much illegal action that it’s funny. Orton RKO’s Edge and we’re down to Orton and HHH. They battle for a few more minutes till a Pedigree turned RKO sends HHH packing and Orton picks up an awesome win. 
Just an awesome match, in my top 5 of SS style matches and this one had the advantage of having an awesome storyline behind it. Orton went over and got the clean win. Wish Benoit would have stayed in a little longer but besides that just an epic match. MOTN and **** ½*, just a hair better than Christian/Shelton. 

CAL SCALE: 7


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> Nah I didnt mean that in a condescending way, just interesting
> 
> I think I only have like 9 i think



I think if you include WCW, some stuff from Japan, and late NWA matches, I have like 30 matches total I gave 5-stars, I'm not sure if that's on the high end or low end for what people normally have.

Have you seen all the matches I gave 5-stars on that list?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

That reminds me - I need to watch the SVS tag from 2004 for the Trips project. And apparently Christian/Shelton from that show as well.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

KO Bossy said:


> Eddie's first run was, IMO, far more about fleshing out his character than churning out good matches. I thought that the Latino Heat character really helped establish Eddie as a multi-faceted performer. I mean, who doesn't remember the segment where he went to the Playboy Mansion to break in and get Chyna's pictures back And remember when he fought Rikishi and pretended he was sick, so Chyna fought him instead? This was the era of actor Eddie. And despite the quality of matches being underwhelming, for Eddie at least, he was still quite entertaining. Its just that it was in a more theatrical way as opposed to in ring.


Absolutely. I thought he was HILARIOUS when I watched back in 2000, even though I was too young to get the veiled sexual references with Chyna :eddie

I guess I shouldn't get too selfish considering Eddie's work after overcoming his personal problems and recommitting himself to getting in shape in wrestling was :mark: x 1,000. Speaking of that, after I play some WWE 2K14 (I totally caved and bought it), I'm gonna continue my WEEKEND OF EDDIE.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

No matter how many times I see it, I will never get tired of the Piper/Goldust Backlot Brawl. I think it legitimately deserves to be in my top 10...if I ever decide to do one.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

PGSucks said:


> Absolutely. I thought he was HILARIOUS when I watched back in 2000, even though I was too young to get the veiled sexual references with Chyna :eddie
> 
> I guess I shouldn't get too selfish considering Eddie's work after overcoming his personal problems and recommitting himself to getting in shape in wrestling was :mark: x 1,000. Speaking of that, after I play some WWE 2K14 (I totally caved and bought it), I'm gonna continue my WEEKEND OF EDDIE.




The weekend of Eddie, that sounds like a FABULOUS way to spend the weekend. Eddie will always be my favorite grappler of all time, from 2002-2005 that man could do no wrong. None. You hear me? Nothing. What?

Edit- fuck, Piper/Goldust backlot brawl, that DEFINITELY should have made my top 100. Fuck. See what I mean? That's why I hate lists, I already hate myself for not including that classic.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Edit- fuck, Piper/Goldust backlot brawl, that DEFINITELY should have made my top 100. Fuck. See what I mean? That's why I hate lists, I already hate myself for not including that classic.



Sorry 'bout that. :$


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Cactus Jack said:


> The weekend of Eddie, that sounds like a FABULOUS way to spend the weekend. Eddie will always be my favorite grappler of all time, from 2002-2005 that man could do no wrong. None. You hear me? Nothing. What?
> 
> Edit- fuck, Piper/Goldust backlot brawl, that DEFINITELY should have made my top 100. Fuck. See what I mean? That's why I hate lists, I already hate myself for not including that classic.


It's been a lot of fun watching this many EDDIE matches. He's either my second or third favorite of all time (my rankings move around quite a bit), but I never really appreciated him until lately.

I'm about to head out for a bit, but once I get back I'm gonna watch Eddie vs. JBL from JD04 for the first time since it aired. I've seen a ton of praise for it ITT, so I'm excited :mark:


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

PGSucks said:


> Absolutely. I thought he was HILARIOUS when I watched back in 2000, even though I was too young to get the veiled sexual references with Chyna :eddie
> 
> I guess I shouldn't get too selfish considering Eddie's work after overcoming his personal problems and recommitting himself to getting in shape in wrestling was :mark: x 1,000. Speaking of that, after I play some WWE 2K14 (I totally caved and bought it), I'm gonna continue my WEEKEND OF EDDIE.


Well, after his car accident, he ended up coming back WAY too early, so its unsurprising that he was in such rough shape.

If you're looking for some of the lesser known Eddie matches from his pre-WWE work, I can give some suggestions of things I enjoyed.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> I think if you include WCW, some stuff from Japan, and late NWA matches, I have like 30 matches total I gave 5-stars, I'm not sure if that's on the high end or low end for what people normally have.
> 
> Have you seen all the matches I gave 5-stars on that list?


If they're matches that you enjoy the most, why should it matter how many you gave 5 stars? All that's important is that you have a guideline for what you'd call a 5 star match. For me, it doesn't even have to be a 100% flawless, perfect match. Everyone is different. If you enjoy that many pro wrestling matches that much, that's great. It means you're a fan with great memories.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Decided that all these taker matches I am watching will eventually lead up to a top 50 taker match list. Its gonna be tough, but I think I can get it done


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Curious to see what matches will be on said list...


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Well, I will be making posts of about 4-5 matches that are just matches I'm watching. 50 of them will make the list


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Undertaker project post #6*​
*Match #1: The undertaker vs JBL (SD 3/20/09)*

This match was recommended to me, but during JBL’s 08-09 run wasn’t he in very poor health? Especially considered he retired like a month after this. But this is taker so anything can happen! This is a pretty fun match, it is mostly a brawl style which should be expected, but also has some technical wrestling in it. Not a ton of it, but for a JBL/taker match, it was surprising TBH. This was quick but plenty of fun as it was one of JBL’s last SD matches, which is cool I guess. ***1/4 

*Match #2: Undertaker vs The Big Show- Punjabi prison match( GAB 2006)*

What the fuck is a Punjabi prison? This match was supposed to involve Khali, looks like we dodged one hell of a bullet there . Now, this..Prison? What is it? It’s like two steel cages made out of bamboo or something? Why they just didn’t go with a steel cage is beyond me. But whatever, maybe this is fun and I’m just ignorant. This match was pretty fun, not great but I had a good time watching it. Might be one of the most strange stips in modern day WWE, as there is no pins but it’s like some sort of puzzle almost as you have to break out of the cage, twice. This had a bad ending as it was what the stip called for but it was decent at best. Doubt it will make my top 50 though  ***

*Match #3: Randy Orton vs the Undertaker HIAC (Armageddon 2005)
*
So this concluded the near year long feud between these two, and I will most likely get to all of the Orton/taker matches as they are all GREAT. This one however, might be the longest, maybe even the best. This is a very long match at over 35 minutes but HIAC matches are not really meant to be short and are better when they are long and violent, and this match is certainly both of those. I love this match as it is just the definition of fun. This is legit 35 minutes of pure violence, and it is a top 10 HIAC match IMO. So yeah this was the end to the epic Orton/taker feud and I’m pretty sure that they never had another match together after this, well at least on PPV, am I wrong? Anyways pretty sure that this will make the top 50 list easily! ****1/4 

*Match #4: The Undertaker vs Mankind (KOTR 96) *

This was a lot of fun TBH. Obviously not as great as there HIAC match but its still damn entertaining. Mick Foley is so good and even early in his WWF career he was putting on awesome matches. Last time I watched this I rated it a lot lower than I did here, it was very solid this time, and it went up a whole lot since the last watch which was only like a month ago, and I’m glad I liked it here considering the rest of this PPV bar HBK/Bulldog was absolutely garbage, check this out guys, solid stuff. **** 

*Match #5: MVP vs Big Daddy V vs the Great Khali vs Finlay vs the Undertaker vs Batista( SD EC no way out 2008)*

:lol at Big Daddy V and Khali in this shit, expecting complete garbage at any moment that’s not taker/Batista. This is actually a pretty fun match, after the fuckfest that Big Daddy V and Khali are involved in( thank god their eliminated early) Finlay, MVP, taker, and Batista put on a sick match. Finlay is the MVP of this match IMO, he pulls off a really fun brawl. It comes down to Batista and taker, a rematch from WrestleMania 23. Anyways, they have a really good fight for like 10-11 minutes and taker wins. Pretty sure this was his only win inside the chamber too! *** ¾* 

*Match #6: Brock Lesnar vs the Undertaker HIAC( No mercy 2002) *

:mark:, This should beat the last match by a hair, as on the last watch I remember it being one of the best HIAC matches ever, so high expectations for this rewatch. Is the Cell roof really low or is it just me? Anyways the match starts out and I am legit getting weak at Heyman screaming NOOOO, for like 5 minutes :lmao. Goddamn this is good, I think it beats out the tag match, as this seems so much better on the rewatch. I don’t remember this much blood in this match but it doesn’t take the fact away that this is my second favorite HIAC match EVER after the original one. **** ¾*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm probably the only guy alive who prefers the Smackdown/ECW Chamber to the RAW one in 2008. Finlay was the MAN in it :mark:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yes, you probably are - despite being a good one, and the opinion factor, I think it's hard to prefer that to one of the most dynamic, well booked and senseful EC matches ever in Raw 2008. But well, *opinionz are bitchez.* 8*D


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Well booked? Jeff Hardy didn't win. 8*D

Honestly, the only thing about the match I REALLY like is Umaga. He makes it good for me. Dig Jeff kicking out of the first pedigree too. Don't like the rapid eliminations. Rarely ever do in matches with the stip.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

For any HBK fans that missed it:

Quite a RARE match people (a simple thanks would be nice )

Shawn Michaels vs Venom - Texas Wrestling Academy (2000)

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k2PDhaGG3tUhpu4T6YU

**This is my upload originally, but big thanks to Cal (Callamus) for the use of his DM account as i can't post it on YT**

I may post a DL link in my thread at some point...


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Well booked? Jeff Hardy didn't win. 8*D
> 
> Honestly, the only thing about the match I REALLY like is Umaga. He makes it good for me. Dig Jeff kicking out of the first pedigree too. Don't like the rapid eliminations. Rarely ever do in matches with the stip.


Considering Jeff was suspended due to Wellness Policy strike by WM 24 time, take HHH's win as a blessing in disguise. 8*D

Oh and *Part 4 coming today.* :clap


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

b/c it gave CM Punk the win at WrestleMania instead. :mark:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

In the 2nd or 3rd best MITB ever. Off the 4th or 5th best WM ever. :mark:


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

*Team Hell No & Randy Orton vs. The Shield, Smackdown 14/6/13 - ***3/4 *

This match = :mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Matt Hardy vs. MVP (GAB 07) -****1/2.*. Very fun match, Hardy was over as fuck and MVP played the asshole heel very well. Solid in ring stuff, as MH's best work in ring is as a babyface. Finish was awkward because they could've just ended with the player's Boot because the Overdrive/Playmaker is still THE shittiest move. :lmao


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Random wrestling visual - Ric Flair on Lizard Lick Towing


----------



## Certified G (Feb 1, 2011)

Just saw some previews for the History of WWE dvd, looks pretty damn awesome. Saw alot of new backstage footage which I always find very interesting.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> That reminds me - I need to watch the SVS tag from 2004 for the Trips project. And apparently Christian/Shelton from that show as well.


Christian/Shelton was a quality match that doesn't get much attention. 

It's also this match where Christian debuts his new theme by waterproof blonde which would become his best theme song ever.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Corre said:


> Just saw some previews for the History of WWE dvd, looks pretty damn awesome. Saw alot of new backstage footage which I always find very interesting.


The doc could be decent (but it was supposed to be 3 hours, it's now 2), but the match listing is complete shit IMO. :no:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Watching some more taker matches right now, this guy is insane, every match I watch ends up being solid as fuck. This top 50 list is going to be hard as fuck to put together! 

Quick question: Most underrated mania ever?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Some one pm me or tell me the Cal scale just finished BL 09


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

redskins25 said:


> Some one pm me or tell me the Cal scale just finished BL 09


http://www.wrestlingforum.com/26073657-post2440.html

Should sticky this shit lol.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> Some one pm me or tell me the Cal scale just finished BL 09


I sent it to you

But that link that zep did is good too


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

*Backlash 2009 ​**Christian vs. Jack Swagger ECW Title*
- Ok this was a pretty good match. These two have great chemistry so I wasn't surprised by it. Their styles clash so beautifully, its really amazing, I really want to go watch that 2/09 ecw match again as we speak. Great opener, they used all the time they got well. I'm really starting to like swagger alot, I didn't watch back then but although he looks and sounds like a complete idiot, the man can wrestle and Christian 2009 is self explanatory.
****3/4*
*
Chris Jericho vs. Ricky Steamboat*
- :mark: I cannot decide if this and the ecw match was MOTN but its close. How old is Steamboat in this ? Who fucking cares the guy can still work, you look at him, flair, lawler and some of these other guys and you say in this sport you never lose your working ability if your that good I guess. Great match, loved all the old steamboat call-backs, the arm drags and everything. Good Heel performance by Y2J as well. This was steamboat last match so a bit sad, but he went out with a bang.
****3/4*
*
Kane vs. Cm Punk*
- Never heard of this match before, I guess they were just keeping Punk afloat until he cash-ins on hardy a couple months later. Its a filler MITB feud I guess, lets see how this was. Ok match, nothing special, pacing was a bit off but these guys are good so they made it work. I miss when Punk would just kick the shit out a fuckers all day long. Shocked Kane won.
****
**
Hardy vs. Hardy "I Quit"*
- Fat hardy vs. Jeff, ok match started off well, but finished pretty flat. I liked the leg work by Matt on jeff, but then for some reason this match just dies. :lmao at Matt talking to Jeff on the later and he still jumps on him. Jeff would go on to have the feud of the summer with Punk soo it worked out well for him. After looking at Matt, was tempted to go to the gym, geez :lmao
****
*
Legacy vs. HHH/Batista/Shane Mcmahon WWE title*
-Here is the blow off of that OMGZ feud they had and that classic they had at mania 25 :hhh2. Its starts off with hhh and orton beating the shit out of each other even before the match starts and Orton running away for like 20 mins for some reason. Well tbhayley that may have been the best part of the match. It felt like a old school hot tag, pacing was very good, ted and cody held their own very well mixing it up with Big Dave and Shane. Batista and Ted go to the outside and look who is back ? Randyyy, and pretty much kills the pace and momentum. I really dont think he knows how much he does this, he literally destroys the nice pace they had, oo well. After some sneaky heel attacks on the side, Cody using a chair and other stuff, we finish up with Orton and HHH in the ring. HHH throws some nice looking punches making "Doohah Doohah" sounds. Batista/Cody distract HHH on the outside and Orton hits a RKO, TWO COUNT ! Randy hears voices and hits him with the dangerous punt, Orton WINS ! HHH is in the ring unconscious and has to be tended to in the ring. Where did they go with this Feud ? Ohh yea it turned into Orton/Cena and DX/Legacy 
****1/2-3/4*
*
Santino/khail/beth/rosa stuff/match*
-Didnt watch, only postive was Rosa was looking smoking hot FAP FAP FAP rton2, after hearing the stories of her with Michaels Hayes, and the reason she still has a job............... she seems like my type of girl
*DUD*
*
John Cena vs. Edge WHC*
- Ok here we go, cena/edge OMG dat rivalry. TBHayley, I remember loving the feud in 06, back when I was a chain gang solder, had cena on the ipod shuffle and hated edge/lita. I saw this in the beginning of the summer and thought it was good, lets see how it holds up shall we? It didnt at all, had some nice parts but WAY to spotty. Geez Edge ruined this match soo much. Made this a water-down uninspiring spot fest. I'm giving Cena a pass back his :mark: track record in LMS matches, and that the good parts of this match came from him on offense, but he could save this. Its only like Edge was on the fly thinking during this match " What cool spot can I do". Just not good, but a :lmao and :mark: ending by Show putting cena in the light/whatever that was to set up their JD match.
*

*CAL SCALE 13.5​*
Enjoyed the PPV, I give the man under the ***1/2


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Maybe that LMS match needs a rewatch soon, gave it **** on the last watch :lmao

But Swagger/ Christian from that show is :lenny


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

It was soo spotty and contrived, it almost seemed like Edge would go spot and wait, spot and wait and soo on, I know that is the gimmick but geez


SO was Y2J/steamboat :lenny


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yes I think I gave Steamboat/Jericho like ***1/2 or ***3/4 

The tag is meh IMO, and the only good thing about the I quit is 

"mommy and Daddy woudn't want this jeff" :lmao


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*Oh, skins I'm so disappointed you didn't like that LMS. Although, Edge was kind of like "big spot...wait...big spot...wait" the whole match but whatever. Of course their best match is the TLC.

But those first two matches though :mark:*


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I used to like the LMS, hated it on a rewatch though. Swagger/Christian is :mark: but still nowhere near their 2/24 match. Steamer/Jericho is really good too, wouldn't go as high but it's still :mark:. Steamboat at WM, the big 8 or 10 man tag the night after and then BL with Jericho is one hell of a short return run :mark:. Tag match for the WWE title is pretty swank too, but haven't seen it in years. Got the PPV on DVD and I've yet to take off the wrapping :lmao.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^ pretty much echo all of this, I really enjoyed steamboat and enjoy his work in general so that why its that high. I'll need to check those other matches out

I just checked my old notebook, had cena/edge at ****1/2 previously :lmao


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Undertaker project post #7*​
Match #1: Shawn Michaels and John Cena vs the Undertaker and Batista ( No way out 2007)

Man, I have no idea why I haven’t seen this yet, because apparently it is a lot of fun! This is one hell of a match IMO, just old school tag wrestling at its finest, except its in 2007. All 4 of these guys can work, and Taker and HBK are both in my top 5 all time. Best thing about this match is that it never seemed to get that boring, even during the middle parts of the match I never found myself looking away from the TV for an extended period of time, which is something many matches can do TBH. Anyways the finishing stretch in this match was AWESOME. Tista turning on taker to cost his team the match was pretty sick and clearly enhanced the feud to make it personal. Would have preferred some more HBK/taker interactions but we got some which is great. Check this out if you’re in the mood for some old school tag wrestling but want to see some modern guys slug it out. ****1/2

Match #2: Batista vs the Undertaker- steel cage( SD 5/11/07)

HOLY SHITE, I didn’t even know that these two had a steel cage match, this should be AWESOME. I will certainly get to ALL of the Tista/Taker matches but I guess this will be a good one to kick it off, because all I have seen from that feud is the mania match, and I love that! This match was a WAR, and it was VERY good IMO. A bloodbath here that was worthy of the stipulation of a steel cage! They used the cage to there advantage a lot which really made this match enjoyable IMO. In the end of the match both Batista and taker were climbing down the cage at the same time, and after some replay watches by the refs( SWAGGER/ADR ER!) it was determined a draw, to the crowds disdain. THEN, MARK HENRY just beats taker to a pulp, and I assumed that was the end of the SD episode. BUT WAIT ITS EDGE! He’s cashing in MITB! WE HAVE A NEW WHC! What an ending I forgot about, which was AWESOME. The match itself was :mark: though. ****

Match #3: The Undertaker vs CM Punk vs John Morrison vs Chris Jericho vs Rey Mysterio vs Rtruth- Elimination Chamber match( EC 2010)

R-Truth in a big match? Eh, he jobs to Punk early :lol. This was a little slow but everyone but Truth is FUN in the ring. A big complaint is that no more than 3 guys we’re in the ring at a time, which makes the action a little limited compared to other EC matches. However, onc taker gets in with Morrison and Jericho, it gets awesome. Did Morrison and taker ever have a singles match? That could be real fun. The crowd is fucking dead, and kind of taking the mood out of this match, which sucks. Morrison eats a chokeslam and we’re down to Jericho and taker. Undertaker has the match one but HBK IS HERRE! SWEET CHIN MUSIC! ITS OVER! JERICHO WINS! Awesome ending! ****

Match # 4: The Undertaker vs The Big Show vs Vladimir Kozlov vs HHH vs Edge vs Jeff Hardy- EC match ( No way out 2009)

Edge and Jeff Hardy start and shocking to me Edge is pinned by Hardy even though he is champion, I didn’t know that was possible :lol. Anyways, that was an interesting way to start the match. Although this looked really good on paper it was actually pretty boring until taker came in, problem is he came in last :lol. The finish was FUN with HHH and Taker having some good near falls, possibly one of the best EC finishes ever, it was just so damn good! This match is worth a watch for the finish alone. *** ¼*

Match #5: Match # 6: Bret Hart vs the Undertaker( One Night only 1997)

This is the second time I have seen this, and I remember really liking it the first time around, so let’s see if it holds up on the rewatch. I still like this match a ton, I haven’t seen any of their matches but I’ve heard that this is the best one. Just a great back and forth match between 2 of the all time greats, this was also one of the last PPV matches involving Bret as he would leave for WCW soon. Check this out though! ****


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

*ATF's Top 50 WWE/F TV Matches Ever

I hope I don't need to talk about DEM FUCKIN' VIDEO LINKS ON THE TITL-you know what? FUCK THE LINKS, YOU SEARCH FOR THE MATCHES YOURSELF YOU LAZY FUCK.

Thank you for your attention. 

Part 1: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/25969889-post2202.html
Part 2: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/26103353-post2582.html
Part 3: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/26136937-post2712.html*

_Before PARTFOURZOMFGYESYESYES starts, there has been a small misunderstanding, in that I forgot about one major match. So, *Drew McIntyre vs. Chris Masters from Superstars 5/12/2011* will be bumped off the list, and in its place, replacing TLC IV at number #25:_

*#25: Rey Mysterio vs. John Cena, Raw 7/25/2011







*

With that out of the way...

*PART 4

Honorable Mentions Part 4:
The Rock vs. Mankind, Heat 1/31/1999
Eddie Guerrero vs. Edge vs. Kurt Angle vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 12/5/2002
Matt Hardy vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 6/5/2003

#20: Hunter Hearst Helmsley vs. Cactus Jack, Raw 9/22/1997









#19: Rey Mysterio vs. Randy Orton, Smackdown 4/7/2006









#18: Mick Foley vs. Terry Funk, Raw 5/4/1998









#17: CM Punk vs. Jeff Hardy, Smackdown 8/28/2009









#16: Ric Flair vs. Mr. Perfect, Raw 1/21/1993´









#15: Brock Lesnar vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 12/4/2003









#14: Bret Hart vs. The 123-Kid, Raw 7/11/1994









(****1/2)
#13: Chris Jericho & Chris Benoit vs. Edge & Christian vs. The Hardys vs. The Dudley Boyz, Smackdown 5/24/2001









#12: Randy Orton vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 1/13/2006









#11: The Undertaker vs. Jeff Hardy, Raw 7/1/2002









So I reached #11, typically you'd think is over. BUT DO YOU ACTUALLY DO THINK PART 4 IS OVER? WRONG!!! Since I want to make the PART 5 as epic as possible, I'll just leave the Top 5 for that, and let's countdown the 1st half of the Top 10 for now:

#10: John Cena vs. CM Punk, Raw 2/25/2013









#9: Shawn Michaels vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 5/17/1993









#8: John Cena vs. Shawn Michaels, Raw 4/23/2007









#7: Owen Hart vs. The British Bulldog, Raw 3/3/1997









#6: Jack Swagger vs. Christian, ECW 2/24/2009









The Top 5 coming soon...*​


Spoiler: list



(****)
#50: The Miz vs. John Morrison, Raw 1/3/2011
#49: Edge vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 6/8/2007
#48: Chris Benoit, Shawn Michaels, Mick Foley & Shelton Benjamin vs. Evolution, Raw 4/12/2004
#47: Triple H vs. Chris Jericho, Raw 4/17/2000
#46: Team Hell No & The Undertaker vs. The Shield, Raw 4/22/2013
#45: Rey Mysterio vs. Jamie Noble, Velocity 5/1/2004
#44: Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 9/9/2005
#43: Shawn Michaels vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 7/1/1996
#42: Doink The Clown vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 6/21/1993
#41: Chris Benoit vs. Triple H, Raw 7/26/2004
#40: Shawn Michaels vs. Chris Benoit, Raw 2/16/2004
#39: John Morrison vs. CM Punk, ECW 9/4/2007
#38: Finlay vs. Matt Hardy, Smackdown 6/22/2007
#37: DX & The Radicalz vs. The Rock, Cactus Jack, Rikishi & Too Cool, Raw 2/7/2000
(****1/4)
#36: Rey Mysterio vs. John Morrison, Smackdown 9/4/2009
#35: The Shield vs. Team Hell No, Raw 5/27/2013
#34: Owen Hart & The British Bulldog vs. Steve Austin & Shawn Michaels, Raw 5/26/1997
#33: Shawn Michaels vs. Shelton Benjamin, Raw 5/2/2005
#32: Eddie Guerrero vs. Kurt Angle, Smackdown 9/2/2004
#31: Chris Benoit vs. Shawn Michaels, Raw 5/3/2004
#30: Chris Benoit vs. William Regal, Velocity 10/2/2005
#29: Shawn Michaels & Diesel vs. Razor Ramon & The 123-Kid, Action Zone 10/30/1994
#28: Antonio Cesaro vs. Sami Zayn, NXT 8/21/2013
#27: Brock Lesnar vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 12/11/2003
#26: Kane vs. Vitamin C vs. Jeff Hardy & Rob Van Dam vs. Bubba Ray Dudley & Spike Dudley, Raw 10/7/2002
#25: Rey Mysterio vs. John Cena, Raw 7/25/2011
#24: Kurt Angle vs. The Undertaker, Smackdown 3/3/2006
#23: The Shield vs. The Rhodes Brothers, Raw 10/14/2013
#22: The Shield vs. Team Hell No & Kofi Kingston, Raw 5/20/2013
#21: Randy Orton vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 1/27/2006
#20: Hunter Hearst Helmsley vs. Cactus Jack, Raw 9/22/1997
#19: Rey Mysterio vs. Randy Orton, Smackdown 4/7/2006
#18: Mick Foley vs. Terry Funk, Raw 5/4/1998
#17: CM Punk vs. Jeff Hardy, Smackdown 8/28/2009
#16: Ric Flair vs. Mr. Perfect, Raw 1/21/1993
#15: Brock Lesnar vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 12/4/2003
#14: Bret Hart vs. The 123-Kid, Raw 7/11/1994
(****1/2)
#13: Chris Jericho & Chris Benoit vs. Edge & Christian vs. The Hardys vs. The Dudley Boyz, Smackdown 5/24/2001
#12: Randy Orton vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 1/13/2006
#11: The Undertaker vs. Jeff Hardy, Raw 7/1/2002
#10: John Cena vs. CM Punk, Raw 2/25/2013
#9: Shawn Michaels vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 5/17/1993
#8: John Cena vs. Shawn Michaels, Raw 4/23/2007
#7: Owen Hart vs. The British Bulldog, Raw 3/3/1997
#6: Jack Swagger vs. Christian, ECW 2/24/2009


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Swagger/Christian is too low. GTFO.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Once again, great job ATF! Can't wait for top 5, specially for the GOAT Raw and SD matches. (involving none other than the GOAT wrestler)

:mark: for 19, 15, 13, 12 and 11. Genuinely didn't expect 12 to make it after the NHB already appeared.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I'm so excited, you haven't listed Eddie/Rey 6/23 yet, so that means it's in your top 5, which means this list is legit.

Swagger/Christian at 6 overall? Hmmm, I just watched that yesterday, and while it was absolutely fantastic an should definitely be in the top 15, I don't think it would make 6 overall on my list. Owen/Davey would be like 2 or 3 on my list, behind only Eddie/Rey and MAYBE Punk/Cena 2/2013. I really really dig that Punk/Cena match from this year, it's damn near perfection. I'd also have Cactus Jacks debut in MSG against Hunter in my top 10, that whole match is just one giant mark out moment for me.

Props man, good list

Ps ATF I got bored yesterday and decided to copy you and made a Top 100 WWE matches list, it's a few pages back, did you see it?


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

Am I alone in not liking Foley/Funk? I must have missed something with it because from my memory it's just Foley and Funk hitting each other with a bunch of stuff. 

I also think I'm not a huge fan of Cactus Jack vs. Triple H from MSG because I've seen it a million times. Super Brawl VI matches and Coliseum Home Video matches excluded, that might be the match I've seen more than any other.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

GREAT list. Just went back and checked the rest of the matches. Shelton/HBK :mark: Cactus/Hunter :mark: Cesaro/Zayn :mark: 

Did I miss the Power Trips/Benoit and Jericho tag from 2001? Or is it coming? Or will I just have to wait and see? DAMMIT


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

TaylorFitz said:


> Am I alone in not liking Foley/Funk? I must have missed something with it because from my memory it's just Foley and Funk hitting each other with a bunch of stuff.


Honestly, that's like, the major appeal of it for me :lmao. FUNK AND FOLEY HITTING EACH OTHER WITH STUFF~! :mark:


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

*WWE Championship ~ John Cena(c) Vs CM Punk (Money in the Bank 2011)*










So YO I gotta talk about CM Punk Vs John Cena from Money in the Bank 2011 and all of the hype surrounding it. This match has already reached legendary status and it's only two years old, that's pretty astounding when you stop to think about it. This match is the ideal example of a perfect storyline with all of the perfect character dynamics involved between Punk/Cena/Vince & THE PEOPLE, with one of the most brilliant payoffs when it comes to the actual match ever. So, I love how we go from a slow build to Punk trying to slap on an anaconda vice and go home ASAP. Of course this doesn't work, which leads me to say something really important; Cena is a fucking lunatic in this match. He plays the "Rocky Balboa in Russia" role really well but ultimately sticks to his morals which leads to his downfall at the hands of the hungrier CM Punk. It's a story of one man's uprising from the bottom to the top and destroying the establishment with a GREAT MAN trying to protect what he loves but understanding at the same time the magnitude of the situation; he's been here before with the likes of RVD & Edge in these hostile environments, he's the veteran of this shit.

Punk on the other hand, plays his hand perhaps better than ever. The look of pure HUNGER in his eyes during this match is unreal, it's almost like KNEW this was going to define his career at the end of the day, so he went and balled out BIG TIME, with some of the best offensive structure I've ever seen from him with some really quick flurries of strikes and holds, the right idea when you're matching up with a titan like John Cena. The whole screwjob callback ending thingy is all about Cena though, and it's what at the end of the day separates this from the rest of the pack in 2011 to be the match of the year and one of the greatest matches ever STILL. It's the kind of match that in 10 years will be in that top 4 conversation with Bret-Austin & HBK-Taker, it'll be remembered more fondly than Cena-Lesnar even though I don't think it's as good. The passion put into this match from both Punk and Cena shows me that these are two men that consistently bring the best out of each other, with this being their ultimate masterpiece that most will remember the two for.

What a match. What a fucking payoff. This is wrestling.

*******​


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Decided I'm gonna review WM 24, this is a top 5 mania IMO


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Awesome list, ATF!

Also, I've got WM 24 as the greatest Mania of all time.


TLC 2012:

Rhodes Scholars vs Always Injured Guys - ***1/4
Cesaro vs Truth - **3/4
Barrett vs Kofi - **1/2
Shield vs Hell No/Ryback - ****1/2
Eve vs Naomi - 1/2* (goddamn eve is hot though)
Show vs Sheamus - ***
Miz/Del Rio/Brawler vs 3MB - * (fun though)
Ziggler vs Cena - ***1/2


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> *WWE Championship ~ John Cena(c) Vs CM Punk (Money in the Bank 2011)*
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Wanna know a cool fun fact about that match? Punk called that entire thing on the fly in the ring. They didn't even discuss what they were gonna do before going out, Cena just looked at Punk and said "it's you're night what do you wanna do?" And Punk replied "I got nothing right now, it's just gonna have to be out there, I'll call it". And that's how it went down, and I think that's what really made that match magical: everything they did just felt real and organic. No pre-fab bullshit as Stone Cold would say.

I saw this fact in an interview with Punk, he was talking about how Michael Hayes was pissed off at him because he didn't give him any spots to look for with the cameras. Usually the producer knows 5-10 different spots to look for so he can make sure his cameras are there to catch it, but that didn't happen for this one.

Obviously I think the world of this match, I put it in my top 15 for WWE History on that list of 100 greatest matches I posted yesterday. I slotted the Punk/Brock right below it, for the exact reason you said. I think the Punk/Brock match is actually slightly better, but the storyline and flawless execution plus the importance of it made me bump it one spot ahead.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Austin/Benoit
Canadians/2MPT
TLC III
Eddie/Rey

CHRIS BENOIT. (I have no idea what the other one out of the five will be, probably some HBK match )

Wrestlemania XXIV is one of like five or 6 Manias that are fighting for that distant number two behind Wrestlemania XIX. It's funny because I don't like Brock/Angle nearly half as much as I used to, yet I still consider it to be perhaps the GOAT WWE PPV.

OH MAN. speaking of PROJECTZ and shit, these Punk watchings have been completely awesome. I was going to do a big HHH project that would of taken me an extra few months probably but I'll hand the ball off to *HunterHearstHelmsley* and watch him take it in for a touchdown instead.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Austin/Benoit
> Canadians/2MPT
> TLC III
> Eddie/Rey
> ...


BENOIT. on my 100 greatest matches list, Benoit had 14 appearances and Undertaker had 15. The GOATS.

I consider Summerslam 2002 the best PPV ever, and I am not even that high on the Street Fight. WrestleMania 19 is a close, close, second. Extreme Rules 2012 is third and WrestleMania 17 is fourth. After that it might be Summerslam 2001 or something, I'd have to look into it.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Benoit/Orton SD Jan 06 was fuckin gold. Not sure I saw it before so thanks ATF


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Amazing that Benoit and Orton had TWO ****1/4+ matches in Jan 06 on SD.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> OH MAN. speaking of PROJECTZ and shit, these Punk watchings have been completely awesome. I was going to do a big HHH project that would of taken me an extra few months probably but I'll hand the ball off to *HunterHearstHelmsley* and watch him take it in for a touchdown instead.


I actually did a tally of what I've watched so far, and I've got 80 of the top 100, I think. Got a bunch of TV matches to watch now, including a bunch of tag matches. 

Might have the list posted by Christmas, but we'll see.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Oh damn, didn't notice that other one was in January too


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Orton in 2006 with Rey & Benoit. OOMPH ~*~!

So I'm not going to talk about it or anything in depth because I'm a lazy motherfucker who just wrote a review for Punk-Cena, but I have the entire Punk-Bryan series from WWE watched & ranked. I'll always see it as an insane chemistry that can produce no bad matches, but not on the level of say... Punk-Cena or HHH-Foley in terms of overall quality. I think they've only really had one CLASSIC match together too, so that kind of hurts them, but everytime they step in the ring together it's nothing less than GREAT.

CM GOAT VS DANIEL BRYAN SERIES ~!

RAW 1/30/12 ~ **** 1/2*
SD 2/21/12 ~ **** 3/4*
RAW 2/27/12 ~ **** 1/4*
OTL 2012 ~ ***** 1/4*
RAW 5/28/2012 ~ **** 1/4*
MITB 2012 ~ **** 1/2*

So yeah that's a REALLY FUCKING GOOD string of matches right there, all of them could find their way on my Top 100 CM Punk matches list, with OTL being a slam dunk for a top tier spot as it fucking rules the earth. It's neither man's best from that year as Sheamus-Bryan(ER) & Punk-Jericho(WM) are both better slightly, but yeah it's still awesome.

& IWW/HHH, that's fucking sick man. I watched all of HHH's 2004-2006 run and a whole bunch of other stuff, but I'm so insane about these things and there was just such a sheer amount of volume that I had to watch that I just had to delay it. With Punk I know a few things about his run in the WWE; most of the good stuff is from 2009-present so I can watch that in almost chronological order and get a huge chunk of the list, and that I can skip alot of 2006-2008 and be a little picky because he was still adjusting then.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Pretty sure that the GOAT PPV is WM XIX, SS 02 is shortly behind. But WM 24 is crazy how much of a complete card it was! 

This JBL/Finlay match is FUCKING FUN!


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I was considering doing a top 100 CM Punk project, but I thought that this thread experienced too much Punk, especially from me. Little did I know that you can never get too much Punk. Will this list include non-WWE matches as well, Evan? If it does, Punk/Homicide FCA MUST be on it. GOAT fun match. Maybe I'll make a makeshift one some day.

There was another Benoit/Orton match around that time that was also very good. I think it was match #6 in the series. And then Benoit went on to have great matches with Finlay and Regal. BENOIT!

unk2 :bryan series:

ROH Reborn: ****1/2*
IWA: MS: ****3/4*
FIP: ****3/4*
FIP 2/3 Falls: ******
RAW 1/30/12: ******
SD 2/21/12: ******
RAW 2/27/12: ***2/3*
OTL 2012: *****3/4*
RAW 5/28/2012: ****3/4*
MITB 2012: *****1/4*

GOATS GONNA GOAT unk7 :dazzler


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Match #6 was iirc 1/13, aka my Top 50's #12.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Good man for adding hbk/janetty 5/17 on their, you know the deal


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

2 matches in and WM 24 is already 8 on the cal scale, Love that MITB match TBH.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

:hbk1 vs. :flair3 deserves two :lenny :lenny


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Punk vs Danielson Reborn match in ROH is bad. 

it does have that eerie YES/NO chant in it _(can't remember which one, if not both)_ Talk about weird...


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

redskins25 said:


> :hbk1 vs. :flair3 deserves two :lenny :lenny


On the last watch I gave it *****, I honestly can't remember if the triple threat was good TBH


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

redskins25 said:


> John Cena vs. Edge WHC[/B]
> - Ok here we go, cena/edge OMG dat rivalry. TBHayley, I remember loving the feud in 06, back when I was a chain gang solder, had cena on the ipod shuffle and hated edge/lita. I saw this in the beginning of the summer and thought it was good, lets see how it holds up shall we? It didnt at all, had some nice parts but WAY to spotty. Geez Edge ruined this match soo much. Made this a water-down uninspiring spot fest. I'm giving Cena a pass back his :mark: track record in LMS matches, and that the good parts of this match came from him on offense, but he could save this. Its only like Edge was on the fly thinking during this match " What cool spot can I do". Just not good, but a :lmao and :mark: ending by Show putting cena in the light/whatever that was to set up their JD match.
> *


:hb

Hate that match too. It's awful, to the max.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> :hb
> 
> Hate that match too. It's awful, to the max.


I use to think it was really good to for some reason ?

I'm starting to love your boy swagger, man is really good in the ring


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I originally did too. Not sure why, but it is what it is. I Quit on that show is utter shit too. Rest of the event is really :lenny Christian/Swagger & the Six man are great matches.

Swagger :mark: 

Most underrated guy on the roster today. If not Del Rio. But his fans that actually are around treat him like God, so Swagger probably still wins.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

yea the hardy match was disappointing, Matt's leg work on Jeff early on was the only high point


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Flair vs HBK is about to start on this show! 

MY BODY IS READY!


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Great ready for the GREATNESS

you better watch that "old yeller" promo too


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Of course I did  HBK is making his entrance right now.

So what's everyones thoughts on the WWE title match from this show?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Hardys chemistry as opponents was always hit or miss. Only matches I really had any fun with between the two was WM & the Stretcher match following WM. Latter being easily the best effort vs each other.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

**** for the WWE Championship Match, I thought it was good, not great. Some minor things about it bugged me but I liked the finish though.*


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Hmmm, rainy outside. Guess I'll just sit inside and watch wrestling...

I know, its a terrible life I live.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Its Sunny as hell here and I'm watching wrestling :lmao


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I liked the dual story in the Reborn match where Punk had to concern himself with both Bryan and Steamboat. I also loved Bryan's work on the ribs and how an abdominal stretch of all things was the determinant. Maybe I should rewatch it.

WWE triple threat championship match at Mania 24 was very fun. I know C2D is the biggest fan of it, but I loved almost as much. Stay away from the NOC 2009 rematch. Horrid.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Think I will watch WM 20 tonight after WM 24, thats a LONG one but man is it fun

HBK/Flair just ended, top 15 match in WWE history IMO. Some will think My rating is too high, but IDGAF


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

DOnt be ashamed my friend, dont be :hbk3 :flair


I think I wrote one of my better reviews on that match, a masterpiece


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Holy shit, Cena gets a jobber entrance for this match :lmao


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> WWE triple threat championship match at Mania 24 was very fun. I know C2D is the biggest fan of it, but I loved almost as much. Stay away from the NOC 2009 rematch. Horrid.


Yep. I love that WM24 triple threat. Crowd is alive for it and there's some nice back and forth using the triple threat formula. Their NOC rematch is shit, though. About as generic a triple threat can get and generally dull. Only memorable part of it is this:

:rko2


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

WM 24

Finlay/JBL - ***1/2
MITB IV - ****1/4
Batista/Umaga - *1/2 ()
Kane/Chavo - N/A
Flair/HBK - *****
Divas tag - DUD
Cena/Orton/Trips - ***3/4
Show/Mayweather - ***1/2
Edge/Taker - ****1/4

GOAT show.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

WrestleMania 24 - 18

Finlay Vs John Bradshaw Layfield - *** - 2
John Morrison Vs Shelton Benjamin Vs CM Punk Vs Mr Kennedy Vs MVP Vs Carlito Vs Chris Jericho - ***1/4 - 2
Batista Vs Umaga - 1/2* - 0
Chavo Guerrero Jr Vs Kane - * - 0
Shawn Michaels Vs Ric Flair - ***1/2 - 3
Ashley & Maria Vs Melina & Beth Phoenix - NO - -1
Randy Orton Vs John Cena Vs Triple H - ***1/4 - 2
The Big Show Vs Floyd Mayweather - ***1/2 - 3
The Undertaker Vs Edge - ****1/2 - 7

6th Best WM.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

WM 24 - the single most spot-on on everything WM ever. Except Batista/Umaga.

Cody, I hope you didn't miss *Part 4* :side:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Me and you are gonna disagree a lot on Flair/HBK Cal :lol

Me and Brye's ratings are very similar


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Fit/JBL and Show/Maywether are probably my two favourite matches on the show, but I don't really want to watch it again to find out for sure.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I just think people judge Flair/HBK in different ways. I need to rewatch it myself, have only seen it once i think


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I view hbk/flair as wrestling masterpiece, an almost motion picture story being told. Is the 35 + year magnificence career of Ric Flair going too end ? Does he still have it ? Is he still the nature boy, can he still compete at the highest level and show against Mister Wrestlemania ? On the hbk side of things, will he really end his childhood heroes career. I mentioned early to smitty the "Old Yeller Promo" just touching stuff and then the "I love you" after the match hbk kissing flair and sprinting to the back soo Flair can be the SOLE light of attention, with his whole family in the front row. :mark: magnificence match, one of those you should to casuals to show them the true beauty of Pro-Wrestling

:lmao havent watching that much in soo long and still wrote that review lol, favorite match of all time


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Flair already found out he couldn't compete at the highest level and show with Mr WrestleMania back in 2002 .


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

WM24:

Finlay/JBL - ***3/4
MITB IV - ****
Batista/Umaga - **
Kane/Chavo - N/A
Flair/HBK - ***3/4
Divas tag - DUD
Cena/Orton/Trips - ***1/2
Show/Mayweather - ***
Edge/Taker - ****1/4

Amazing show. 3rd GOAT Mania for me. My personal favorite main event of all time as well.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Flair already found out he couldn't compete at the highest level and show with Mr WrestleMania back in 2002 .


Truth. I will never refer to HBK as Mr. WrestleMania. We all know the REAL Mr. WrestleMania. The guy who was in a whopping 15 of the best WWE matches I've ever witnessed, the guy who is the sole reason Mania still feels like a big deal every year. 

That's right, the MIZ :vince5


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Btw, I hope I'm not the only one who thinks that Orton/Benoit Best of 7 > No Holds Barred. That match was Naturaland, everything felt smooth but natural and senseful. And yes, I liked the finish. NHB was amazing too, though I personally did find that trash can shot on Benoit a little unsettling.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

ATF said:


> Btw, I hope I'm not the only one who thinks that Orton/Benoit Best of 7 > No Holds Barred. That match was Naturaland, everything felt smooth but natural and senseful. And yes, I liked the finish. NHB was amazing too, though I personally did find that trash can shot on Benoit a little unsettling.


I love them all. SummerSlam aside, I can't decide which one I like the most between NHB, #7 and Raw 04. Fitting that my two favorite wrestlers have such perfect chemistry. If only Orton had just half that chemistry with Bryan today.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

ATF said:


> Btw, I hope I'm not the only one who thinks that Orton/Benoit Best of 7 > No Holds Barred. That match was Naturaland, everything felt smooth but natural and senseful. And yes, I liked the finish. NHB was amazing too, though I personally did find that trash can shot on Benoit a little unsettling.



It's funny you should mention that, I hadn't seen those matches in ages, so when I saw them pop up on your list I decided to give them a watch again. Just finished the Best of 7 series, man that match is still absolutely terrific, ****1/4 from me. Just started the NHB. Let's see how that one holds up.

For the record, I know what you mean about that unsettling feeling. I have a hard time watching Benoit take shots to the head knowing what they eventually led to. Same thing with the ending to Rocky/Mankind I Quit at the Royal Rumble. Seeing Rock tee off on the BACK of Foley's head like that (shots to the back are wayyyy more dangerous than shots to the face/front) makes me very squeamish. I'm glad guys have smartened up to it. I still think they should try to make weaker chairs and allow the occasional shot to the head as long as guys get their hands up. I don't see how that would be a bad thing as long as it was tested and safe. Same thing with blading. But oh look I've gone off topic 

Edit- c2d I was just thinking that EXACT thing while watching this NHB match. Why doesn't Orton have that same chemistry with Bryan? Watch those Benoit matches and tell me Orton doesn't look like he is working his fucking ass off just trying to keep up with Benoit. There is absolutely ZERO carrying done by either guy in the Orton/Benoit matches, both guys just go full bore and beat the shit out of each other. Why doesn't Orton work like that with Bryan? Do you have any theories other than just a complete lack of chemistry?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Main event time, I remember loving Taker/edge, it'll most likely make my top 50 taker matches list with ease if it indeed holds up.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Edit- c2d I was just thinking that EXACT thing while watching this NHB match. Why doesn't Orton have that same chemistry with Bryan? Watch those Benoit matches and tell me Orton doesn't look like he is working his fucking ass off just trying to keep up with Benoit. There is absolutely ZERO carrying done by either guy in the Orton/Benoit matches, both guys just go full bore and beat the shit out of each other. Why doesn't Orton work like that with Bryan? Do you have any theories other than just a complete lack of chemistry?


Yep. Benoit is that much better than Bryan. 

For a more serious answer, I think Orton has slowed down his wrestling way too much now which makes the matches a bit boring and Bryan has to face limitations which causes him to mostly stick to the same ol' kicks. I'm sure if Orton expanded his moveset and Bryan got to hit some suplexes, the matches would've been much better. I know moves don't make a match but without them, the Bryan/Orton matches have felt like a bunch of nothingness. I'm an Orton fan like everyone knows but WHY THE FUCK DOES HE HAVE TO MOVE AT A SNAIL'S PACE? ARGH!


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I <3 the Jan 13 Benoit/Orton match. Second best SD match of 2006 (probably 2nd best WWE match overall for 2006 lol). NHB makes top 10 for SD that year too.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Wrestlemania 24 review*

*Match #1: JBL vs Finlay- Belfast brawl *

:mark:, two of the best brawlers in WWE history, and IDGAF that it had that TERRIBLE storyline. I guess the storyline was that hornswoggle was not the son of Finlay,( which is what I and everyone else thought) but the son of Vince McMahon. So JBL decides to be the douchebag and beat the midget up, so I’m kind of rooting for JBL just because Hornswoggle deserved that. Now, my question is, why does everyone care about Hornswoggle so much? The guy legit does NOTHING with this company, besides tarnishing the cruiserweight title by being the last person to hold it. He needed to be released at this point and still does. Well at least here he actually looked like a leprechaun, now he looks like some midget guido from long island who thinks its still cool to put grease in your hair and slick it back. He does all this by hanging around a 7 foot Indian guy who cannot speak English, WHAT THE FUCK WWE..

Anyways, Onto the match! This is called a Belfast brawl and it certainly lived up to its name, because this was a fucking war. The entire match was centered around the two just beating the fucking pulp out of each other. They used everything from cookie sheets to trash cans to chairs, and the shots they took were STIFF as fuck, these two sure can brawl. Luckily Hornswoggle didn’t get TOO involved with this match as he was kind’ve just used for JBL to throw things at during the match :lol. Check this out guys, its loads of fun. ***1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 3 *

LOLWTF is Kim Kardashian doing here :lmao 

*Match #2: John Morrison vs Carlito vs Chris Jericho vs MVP vs CM Punk vs Mr. Kennedy vs Shelton Benjamin *

God I love MITB matches, and this one is a personal favorite of mine, mainly because of all da SPOTZ and the fact that it really put Punk in the ME scene for the first time. What a match this is. All these guys except Carlito and Kennedy can work like bitches. Best spot of the match is EASILY when Shelton falls off the top of the ladder that is sitting at ringside. Carlito and Kennedy looked so scared, like they just stabbed someone, bitches we’re scared as crap that they broke his back or something. Anyways this whole thing is just awesome, probably a top 5 MITB match for me, nothing will beat the original, but this might be a close second TBH. Another awesome point is when MVP is just about to win and Matt Hardy, the guy MVP injured 5 months earlier( Kayfabe, returns and costs him the match. So Punk wins and it propels him to the ME scene, except his first title run was overshadowed a ton by the HBK/Jericho feud TBH. ***3/4

*CAL SCALE: 4*

*Match # 3: Batista vs Umaga* 

Well this sucked, I was expecting these two to go all at it with both of them being monsters in the ring, but it was the complete opposite and I was honestly bored the entire time I was watching it. Both guys did not seem to give a shit and were probably butthurt because they were both in semi main events last year at mania. So skip this, it REALLY killed the heat this show had. * 

*CAL SCALE: 0*

*Match #4: Kane vs Chavo Gurrero *

LOLWTF, this ended in 10 seconds :lmao DUD 

*CAL SCALE: 0*

*Match #5: Ric Flair vs Shawn Michaels *

This is a top 20 match in WWE history IMO, as it is storytelling and emotion at its absolute finest. Its Ric Flair, the uncontested best wrestler in pro wrestling history, and the man that is tied with #3 of my all time list( with taker). The only ones better than him is the man he is wrestling here and Bret Hart. A great video package that somehow goe ts through Ric Flair’s amazing career n only 3 minutes. This really should have been the main event but Its not too big of a deal, at least the triple threat didn’t, Edge/taker was a fine choice IMO. REALLY pumped for this match TBH, THIS IS WRESTLING . Flair’s music and his entrance as a whole is so emotional, JR is great here too. 

The beginning to this is slow, but you can already see the immense story telling unfold. I love the part where Ric Flair yells “old yeller huh?” and then Shawn slaps him, we’re 4 minutes in and I’m already completely invested into the match. That spot where HBK goes through the announce table is so :mark:, I love this match so much! 

Anyways, what a match, what story telling. The wrestling is good, not GREAT but it’s the story telling and the emotion that puts this over the edge. I just love the whole story where Flair is on his last legs and is telling HBK to end it, but Shawn just doesn’t want to, priceless. Watch this now, anywhere you are, watch it, watch the GOAT end his career end in style( forget TNA ). *****

*CAL SCALE: 9 *

*Match #6: Playboy Bunny match *

If I want to see hot chicks I have the internet, THIS AINT WRASSLIN! NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1 *

*Match#7: John Cena vs Randy Orton vs HHH
*
Good thing this wasn’t the ME, because this just doesn’t feel too special, especially after the wrestling clinic we saw in my 2008 MOTY. Okay, I honestly DIED when I realized that Cena got a jobbers entrance, that’s rich :lmao. Anyways this match was okay, nothing special but it was fun. Surprised they went with a triple threat as the whole feud should have been about Orton and cena, but Haitch gotta get in dat title match! This felt like a good match if it was on a c-PPV, but it just didn’t feel like a WWE title match at wrestlemania. I did like how Orton went over, and the ending was well executed. ***1/4

*CAL SCALE: 2 
*
*Match # 8: The Big Show vs Floyd Mayweather *

This sure seems similar to Tyson and Austin, cept all Tyson did was be a special referee. I’m actually expecting this to be a lot of fun, because I do like Boxing and UFC a little. Yeah this was OK, it was almost pretty bad TBH. I was kind of bored for the most part. Not much to say about this because it was pretty boring and didn’t really live up to the hype. It was better than 90% of celebrity matches though, if that means anything. **1/4

*CAL SCALE: 1*

*Match #9: Edge vs the Undertaker *

I think I’ll just copy this review and put it on the next taker project post as I don’t need to write about the same exact match two days in a row. I remember loving this match the last time I watched it, and its always good to see the deadman Main event the show he is undefeated at! Another GREAT entrance by taker, and its up there with WM 14 as his best, love the guys with the torches and all the fire. This is a very fun match, but the beginning does seem to turn off a lot of people. The beginning is slow, yet it does a better job of telling the storyline than the end of the match. The final 10-15 minutes of this is :mark:, I love it. The ending with Edge tapping out is awesome too. Love this match and a very underrated streak match IMO. Check this out guys! ****1/4 

*CAL SCALE: 6 *

*TOTAL CAL SCALE: 24 *​


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

BOOOOO at rating HBK/Flair ***** then shitting over Mayweather/Show. BOOOOOO.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Yep. Benoit is that much better than Bryan.
> 
> For a more serious answer, I think Orton has slowed down his wrestling way too much now which makes the matches a bit boring and Bryan has to face limitations which causes him to mostly stick to the same ol' kicks. I'm sure if Orton expanded his moveset and Bryan got to hit some suplexes, the matches would've been much better. I know moves don't make a match but without them, the Bryan/Orton matches have felt like a bunch of nothingness. I'm an Orton fan like everyone knows but WHY THE FUCK DOES HE HAVE TO MOVE AT A SNAIL'S PACE? ARGH!



I think you are probably right. Guys like Rey and Eddie have talked in interviews about how they had to learn to slow down in the ring when they got to the WWE to make sure their matches were sensible and told a coherent story. I think Orton has just taken it to another level and has slowed down too much, to the point that his matches can at times be akin to watching paint dry.

I don't dislike Orton, but I'm not like a super fan of his either so I haven't seen a TON of his matches. Today I watched those two Benoit Smackdown matches and the Rey WHC Smackdown match, all are from 2006. It's literally striking to see the difference in his work today compared to back then. He goes toe to toe with two of the greatest workers ever in those 3 matches and doesn't miss a beat. I don't think it's crazy to say in 2006 he was one of the top 10 best wrestlers in the entire world. I just don't understand what happened, why he has it in his head that he needs to work the way he does now. He's not always bad either, that Christian series in 2011 was great stuff, Over the Limit especially is a MOTYC for me for that year. The counters those two used were beautiful, it was almost like watching a ballet at some points.

Think I'm gonna watch Taker/Batista vs HBK/Cena No Way Out 2007 now. For the life of me I cannot remember a single thing about this match, other than I remember digging it when I watched it the first time.

Edit- ATF- after finishing both, I have to give the SLIGHTEST of edges to the Best of 7 Orton/Benoit match. I think both are worth ****1/4 tho.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

that NWO 07 tag is GOLD, gave it like ****1/4 when I watched it this morning


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Cactus Jack said:


> Edit- c2d I was just thinking that EXACT thing while watching this NHB match. Why doesn't Orton have that same chemistry with Bryan? Watch those Benoit matches and tell me Orton doesn't look like he is working his fucking ass off just trying to keep up with Benoit. There is absolutely ZERO carrying done by either guy in the Orton/Benoit matches, both guys just go full bore and beat the shit out of each other. Why doesn't Orton work like that with Bryan? Do you have any theories other than just a complete lack of chemistry?


I think it's mainly because Orton wasn't a useless sack a shit in 2006.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^^ pretty much

I'll take the NHB and raw 04 match, you guys can have the rest, not saying their bad or anything

Happy someone here loves hbk/flair as much as me, its not 5* but its high up there


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> I think you are probably right. Guys like Rey and Eddie have talked in interviews about how they had to learn to slow down in the ring when they got to the WWE to make sure their matches were sensible and told a coherent story. I think Orton has just taken it to another level and has slowed down too much, to the point that his matches can at times be akin to watching paint dry.
> 
> I don't dislike Orton, but I'm not like a super fan of his either so I haven't seen a TON of his matches. Today I watched those two Benoit Smackdown matches and the Rey WHC Smackdown match, all are from 2006. It's literally striking to see the difference in his work today compared to back then. He goes toe to toe with two of the greatest workers ever in those 3 matches and doesn't miss a beat. I don't think it's crazy to say in 2006 he was one of the top 10 best wrestlers in the entire world. I just don't understand what happened, why he has it in his head that he needs to work the way he does now. He's not always bad either, that Christian series in 2011 was great stuff, Over the Limit especially is a MOTYC for me for that year. The counters those two used were beautiful, it was almost like watching a ballet at some points.


Yeah, back in 2004-2006 he was so great to watch in the ring. He worked smart and told a story without having to pace it slower than Undertaker's entrance. Blows my mind that some idiots have the nerve to say he was a mediocre/bad wrestler then and has _improved_ since the 2010 face turn. He might have improved on some stuff since becoming The Viper but in terms of entertainment, his matches can be a chore to watch due to how fucking slow he works at the worst of times.

It's a shame that he's working like that now with the heel turn because in 2011 it looked like he was getting in the groove again and working a better pace like seen in the Christian matches.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So I got two options for tonight. Should I review 

WM XIX? or..

WM XX? 

I'll review the one the first person who comments picks.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Just did some GOAT yard work. Have a pile of leaves that go for days. Glad yard trash pickup is tomorrow.

Anyways, need to go back to that MITB anthology to see some briefcase matches, especially the WM 24 match, as well as a bunch of others. Flair/Michaels at *****? Interesting.

And, review XIX, Smitty. AWESOME show. I like Brock/Angle more than others.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> So I got two options for tonight. Should I review
> 
> WM XIX? or..
> 
> ...


XX because XIX is too overdone and BENOIT.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

My Benoit-loving friend has a point. XIX is reviewed a lot, so do XX.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Callamus said:


> John Morrison Vs Shelton Benjamin Vs CM Punk Vs Mr Kennedy Vs MVP Vs Carlito Vs Chris Jericho - ***1/4 - 2


omg thank you. I still don't get why everyone is so up in arms about this MITB. Always found it to be in the middle ground of all the MITB matches WWE has produced.



ATF said:


> WM 24 - the single most spot-on on everything WM ever. Except Batista/Umaga.
> 
> Cody, I hope you didn't miss *Part 4* :side:


I missed part IV 8*D



Yeah1993 said:


> Fit/JBL and Show/Maywether are probably my two favourite matches on the show, but I don't really want to watch it again to find out for sure.


(Y)


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*I always said if you took the workrate of Flair/HBK's Bad Blood match and combined it with the storytelling and emotion of the Wrestlemania 24 match---you'd have one of the greatest matches of all time. *


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Alright XX it is, starting...now


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I love MITB IV for the spots in it. Thought it was pretty creative and I thought everyone meshed together real well.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

nah flair/hbk I is pretty flat, it was great the mania match was totally different. Ive never seen mayweather/show is it that good >


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm a mark for the LADDERSAULT. That's about it. Rest was fine; personally don't find it "great". Only fun. Hardy's run in was cool too b/c MVP got owned, like he should.

Disliked the ladder breaking spot showing up again. Thought it was tacky. Should have left that to be a one time only moment for the insane Jeff/Edge spot at 23.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Hmm, I did like the WM 24 match, laddersault is :mark: 

Top 5 MITB matches? 

1: WM 21



2: MITB 2011 SD 
3: WM 23 
4: MITB 2013 SD
5: WM 24


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

1) WrestleMania 21
2) Money in the Bank 2010 - WWE Championship
3) Money in the Bank 2011 - World Championship
4) Money in the Bank 2010 - World Championship
5) WrestleMania 22

This year's World Championship match could be at number five. Would want to see it again to lock that down for sure. I'm the biggest advocate of the WM 22 one, I know.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

SKINS25 said:


> nah flair/hbk I is pretty flat, it was great the mania match was totally different. Ive never seen mayweather/show is it that good >


Mayweather/Show is a five star celebrity attraction match

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'd refer to it as an example as to why Big Show is fecking great, instead, but hey, semantics. Match rocks.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The Primer said:


> 1) WrestleMania 21
> 2) Money in the Bank 2010 - WWE Championship
> 3) Money in the Bank 2011 - World Championship
> 4) Money in the Bank 2010 - World Championship
> ...


Completely forgot about how good that MITB 2010 RAW match was, pencil that in for #4 and kick WM 24 off the list

Show/Cena was a really fun opener for this!


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

watching it now


btw you like SKINS25 or skins25 ?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

DAT NAME CHANGE

At least it's similar and your sig stayed the same. I'm trying to think of what to do for Christmas time. Maybe HunterHearstSanta or something.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> Completely forgot about how good that MITB 2010 RAW match was, pencil that in for #4 and kick WM 24 off the list
> 
> Show/Cena was a really fun opener for this!


Yep; I love the hell out of it. Both from MITB 2010 are :mark:

(Y) 

I swear most Cena vs Show matches out there are good. Feels rarer when they have a match I'm not into.



SKINS25 said:


> watching it now
> 
> 
> btw you like SKINS25 or skins25 ?


Caps, mate.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Cena and Show have some good matches that are super underrated (WM XX, JD 09, RAW 09), but they have some downright terrible ones too (NWO 12, ER 09). And then there's the overrated SD 09 match...


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I forgot how much pointless filler is on this show...FUCKKKK

I remember Christian/Y2J being fun though


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That's their best match. Not gonna side with you there.

Never hated the Submission match either. It's slow, but always thought it was fine. Steel cage is ok. Have a hard time trying to care for it. It's their weakest high profile match for me. Don't forget about their fun Pick Your Poison match from RAW in 2006.

Also, forgot to chime in on how Cena vs Ryback from Smackdown was quite good. Blows away their mediocre efforts on PPV. It comes down to how I really don't like a lot of gimmick matches WWE churns out. Ruins or waters down a good portion of matches. Also on the topic of Smackdown, Harper vs Danielson was obviously good. Went how I figured; short & def something they'll give us again in the future.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I don't know if it's quite unanimous, but geeze, I don't see many people that don't think WM 21 has the best MitB match. That ones about as good as it gets, from the quality of the performers to the structure of it to Shelton being a complete lunatic and Jericho/Benoit serving as the glue guys that keep everything running smoothly, that match was a site to see.

I might be in the minority, but I dig the one at WM 25 as well, mostly because of FINLAY. He owned in that one, and Kofi's hijinx were kept to a minimum, the few wild things he did enhanced the match I thought rather than detract from it like 99% of things involving Kofi. 

And as was said earlier by Hayley, the Rising Stars match from this year deserves top marks, Cody Rhodes absolutely stole the show, but Cesaro and Swagger definitely chipped in with a fantastic effort. Even though it was totally goofy, I really dug that spot with Cesaro on Swaggers shoulders. Made me laugh in a good way. The best way.

Edit- glad you enjoyed the Cena/Ryback match Hayley, even if Mr. Skins disagrees :side: I thought it positively blew away their Payback match.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The original MITB match is PERFECT, ****3/4 IMO

Thinking about buying the 2005 PPV collector's set, if I do. a 2005 PPV project is inevitable


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yep, the original MITB is the most ideal. It's basically flawless.

Cena vs Ryback was significantly better than Payback. Three stages of hell was a really flat match. Didn't feel like anything. Whereas the bout on Smackdown had substance to it. Ryback had another good performance (he had a good showing in squashing Kofi on Main Event last week) & Cena's string of consistency rolls on. All good in my book. I'd like to see some more interactions from them come RAW. Maybe a Del Rio & Ryback one night team vs Cena and someone else. Would be fun. Randomly pick Ziggler as Cena's partner. That'll work.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Just watched Show/Sheamus HIAC. The first 10 or so minutes are kind of "meh" to me. Maybe that's due to what they were doing with it. They were building up Sheamus' comeback. He was getting dominated by Big Show, and every single time he started to come back, he got in more shots than the previous time. Hitting White Noise is still a cool site, and the match has a couple of awesome near-falls. The first being the KO Punch, which prior to this match had never been kicked out of. Then the brogue kick... I remember thinking for sure it was over. Nobody kicked out of the brogue kick since Sheamus turned face from my recollection... except Bryan at ER, but that was after a pretty big delay if I remember correctly. Again, awesome kick out. Then the end, with Sheamus going for the brogue kick but getting caught with the KO Punch OUT OF NOWHERE was great. Crowd really got into those last 5-10 minutes. I don't feel Sheamus plays the best face in peril, or Show is the most innovative dominating monster heel, but in the end it all works out and they put together quite a match. A notch down from what I remember, but still one hell of a match and definitely worth a watch. ***1/2

On the topic of MITB's, MITB I is the best imo, with this year's WHC MITB being second. Yeah... I said it, come at me bros. 

How about everyone's worst MITB? For me the first one that pops into my mind is the WWE Title MITB this year. Such a shitfest outside of the Punk/Bryan staredown and then Heyman's betrayal of Punk. 

Gonna watch Taker/Show NM 08 now.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> . I'd like to see some more interactions from them come RAW. Maybe a Del Rio & Ryback one night team vs Cena and someone else. Would be fun. Randomly pick Ziggler as Cena's partner. That'll work.


Count me in. Especially anything involving bringing Poor Ziggler (that's his full name from now on. After all that man has had to endure, Poor Ziggler is the only fitting name left) into any sort of spot light. It could do wonders to restore his image just having him next to a name like Cena, even in a nothing tag match on Smackdown.

My guess is that Cena just truly loves being in the ring so much, that those few months away were killing him so when he came back he did the old anti-Orton, working harder than necessary to pull off a good/great match each time he sets foot in the squared circle (always liked that term).

Edit- really, really REALLY dug Show/Sheamus HiaC. That's one of my top 5 favorite matches for both guys. They totally just duked it out and it made for a truly memorable "big man style" match. I think I gave it ****1/4 on last watch.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Cactus Jack said:


> Edit- really, really REALLY dug Show/Sheamus HiaC. That's one of my top 5 favorite matches for both guys. They totally just duked it out and it made for a truly memorable "big man style" match. I think I gave it ****1/4 on last watch.


It's in my top 5 Sheamus matches and top 10 Big Show matches (although I'd only have 3 one-on-one matches above it for each of them).

Just watched Taker/Show NM08. Damn, that match was a lot quicker than I remember... only goes about 10 minutes. They pack a lot of punch in it though. The two just slug it out, and the ending is still one that makes me think "Holy Shit, Taker just got knocked out! Damn!" It doesn't beat their CS match, but it's still very much worth a watch. ***3/4


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*As far as worst MITB ladder match: Wrestlemania 26. Although, this year's All-Star one just was kind of lackluster and disappointing. 

Wrestlemania 26's MITB: Felt way to clogged with the amount of guys, and just nothing too "interesting" and then there's Swagger taking 30 minutes to unhook the damn briefcase. :lmao*


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Sandrone said:


> It's in my top 5 Sheamus matches and top 10 Big Show matches (although I'd only have 3 one-on-one matches above it for each of them).
> 
> Just watched Taker/Show NM08. Damn, that match was a lot quicker than I remember... only goes about 10 minutes. They pack a lot of punch in it though. The two just slug it out, and the ending is still one that makes me think "Holy Shit, Taker just got knocked out! Damn!" It doesn't beat their CS match, but it's still very much worth a watch. ***3/4



You're on a roll, that's another of my favorite Show matches, along with the phenomenal one they had at Cyber Sunday. Both are among my favorites for Big Show singles matches, and along with the stretcher match vs Brock round out my favorite Big Show matches.


Speaking of, what's everyone's opinion as to the best Show/Henry match? I haven't seen those in a while.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

rjsbx1 said:


> Although, this year's All-Star one just was kind of lackluster and disappointing.


Meltzer gave it ****1/2...don't know what match he was watching...:side:

And for a comparison, he gave Brock/Punk the same rating. So in his eyes, they're equally good, which I find pretty laughable.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Meltzer thinks Rock/Punk I is a near classic. Dude lost his marbles long ago.

I don't think any MITB match was bad. Heck, I thought the WWE title one this year was good. SHEAMUS was beasting like crazy and the ending was :mark:. Plus RVD was one of my favorites as a kid. It was pretty disappointing though. SHEAMUS! It's a shameful thing that he had to sacrifice his body in order to carry that match.

Henry/Big Show Vengeance 11 is their best match. My goodness that match made me learn to love big man slugfests.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I really liked the sd mitb match this year, would be near the top for me

show/henry ven 11 is :lenny


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Cactus Jack said:


> You're on a roll, that's another of my favorite Show matches, along with the phenomenal one they had at Cyber Sunday. Both are among my favorites for Big Show singles matches, and along with the stretcher match vs Brock round out my favorite Big Show matches.


Well, since you mentioned em', those are the three Big Show one-on-one matches I have above the Sheamus match (with the Cyber Sunday Taker LMS match being Big Show's best match ever). 

Henry/Show Vengeance would be their best match. Think that's the majority's opinion as well.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Meltzer thinks Rock/Punk I is a near classic. Dude lost his marbles long ago.
> 
> I don't think any MITB match was bad. Heck, I thought the WWE title one this year was good. SHEAMUS was beasting like crazy and the ending was :mark:. Plus RVD was one of my favorites as a kid. It was pretty disappointing though. SHEAMUS! It's a shameful thing that he had to sacrifice his body in order to carry that match.
> 
> Henry/Big Show Vengeance 11 is their best match. My goodness that match made me learn to love big man slugfests.


Well he gave Rock/Punk ****, so that means its a good match, but not classic. I have a hard time giving it even ****, I found it really slow and boring. And I hate the finish. Starrcade 1997 all over again.

Its funny because I read somewhere on this site that apparently some people backstage were annoyed at Sheamus because he contributed virtually nothing to preparing the MiTB match and only focused on his own spots.

At this point, I'm over MiTB. Once you live through an era where they did the most insane shit in ladder matches, the stuff today feels so much less effective and relatively unimportant.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Don't be afraid to let out your disdain for Punk/Rock. The rest of us here realize their matches suck too, including Punk/Rock fans. Great pieces of comedy though.

Paramore fan wasn't lying. Luke Harper was a king this week. The Punk match on RAW (*****), the Bryan match on Smackdown (****1/4*), and the Ohno match on NXT (****3/4*). And I still need to watch the Main Event bout with PTP. HARPER!


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I am a little upset about the fact that now two years in a row someone has lost the briefcase, the briefcase may start to lose its credibility


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

the bryan match was better than the Punk raw match this week ?


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

I heard Meltzer only gave Rock/Punk I **** because of the crowd (yet he gives a match like Hogan/Rock only 3 stars) and of the finish.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> I am a little upset about the fact that now two years in a row someone has lost the briefcase, the briefcase may start to lose its credibility



I actually think it's better this way, leads to more unpredictability. Before, the guy might as well have been winning the title when he won the briefcase. Now, they are making it so that it's more up in the air.

My biggest issue is this: when they book a guy to win a MitB match, usually he is the guy that shines the least in the match, see Sandow, Damien. Then, after he wins, they book the guy like shit so when the guy DOES cash it, it tarnishes the belt if he wins. It's mind boggling at times. I'm sure if you go watch all the MitB matches, you will see the winner is the guy that shines the least in the match, and the guy usually gets booked like crap until he wins. Edge is the only half exception I think, he did shine the least in that original MitB match, but they did book him fairly well afterwards.

I'd like someone to point out a case of where this isn't true, I'm stumped right now I've been trying to think of a MitB winner who was the highlight of the match then booked well until he win the championship.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Rock/Punk I: **3/4

Nothing special. The crowd was into it but it felt like nothing special happened in the match besides The Shield and the Dusty finish. Plus it ended Punk's 434 day reign just so Cena could get his win back from The Rock at WM


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

StraightEdgeJesus said:


> Rock/Punk I: **3/4
> 
> Nothing special. The crowd was into it but it felt like nothing special happened in the match besides The Shield and the Dusty finish. Plus it ended Punk's 434 day reign just so Cena could get his win back from the Rock at WM



Don't forget that we also got that PHENOMENAL Cena/Punk match on Raw just so John boy could get the last laugh/win in the Punk/Cena feud. I'm not complaining because that match was absolutely amazing, but still. You can't deny the only purpose was to make John seem like the eventual winner of the Punk/Cena feud. Oh well.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Cactus Jack said:


> I actually think it's better this way, leads to more unpredictability. Before, the guy might as well have been winning the title when he won the briefcase. Now, they are making it so that it's more up in the air.
> 
> My biggest issue is this: when they book a guy to win a MitB match, usually he is the guy that shines the least in the match, see Sandow, Damien. Then, after he wins, they book the guy like shit so when the guy DOES cash it, it tarnishes the belt if he wins. It's mind boggling at times. I'm sure if you go watch all the MitB matches, you will see the winner is the guy that shines the least in the match, and the guy usually gets booked like crap until he wins. Edge is the only half exception I think, he did shine the least in that original MitB match, but they did book him fairly well afterwards.
> 
> I'd like someone to point out a case of where this isn't true, I'm stumped right now I've been trying to think of a MitB winner who was the highlight of the match then booked well until he win the championship.


Kane was pretty dominant in his MITB match, and then won the title at that show..so he was booked well.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Kane was pretty dominant in his MITB match, and then won the title at that show..so he was booked well.



Point taken. Forgot about the Big Red Monster. I guess that proves the exception to every rule. Can you think of any others though?


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Don't forget that we also got that PHENOMENAL Cena/Punk match on Raw just so John boy could get the last laugh/win in the Punk/Cena feud. I'm not complaining because that match was absolutely amazing, but still. You can't deny the only purpose was to make John seem like the eventual winner of the Punk/Cena feud. Oh well.


Cena just has to beat EVERYBODY on the roster, doesn't he? :cena3

Anyway, I still think that Cena should've won at Wrestlemania 28. It was the Past vs. the Present and the Present should've won like Hogan/Rock. A year in the making (not a lot of build up though) and Cena could solidify his status as one of the greats by beating Rock in his hometown but nope, they had to extend the feud for another year and add the title to the mix. It should've been Punk in the main event as champion God dammit! 

Oh well, at least Punk/Undertaker was awesome.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Oliver-94 said:


> I heard Meltzer only gave Rock/Punk I **** because of the crowd (yet he gives a match like Hogan/Rock only 3 stars) and of the finish.


Wait, he gave the match a higher rating because he LIKED the finish? The finish was horrendous, how is that possible?

Anyway, Punk/Rock series is bleh. Neither match was good, after 5 minutes my attention starting wandering. I thought they just didn't gel at all. In retrospect, it reminds me of Punk/Ryback, which I thought was god awful as well.

As for MiTB booking...the concept really just needs to die. Its overplayed at this point, I'm getting tired of the whole cashing in concept as well. There are only 2 possible outcomes stuck on repeat-face challenges ahead of time, heel cashes in after a beating. On top of that, they're just giving away too many titles opportunities, which I think devalues how precious a shot is. 2 MiTBs, 1-2 ECs, Rumble, and that's in addition to any others you might get in the year. AND there's 2 top titles. Way too much.

Plus, they've forgotten how to book MiTB winners competently in the past several years.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Cactus Jack said:


> Point taken. Forgot about the Big Red Monster. I guess that proves the exception to every rule. Can you think of any others though?


I forget everything about 

ADR's MITB match
WM 22 RVD

I know both we're booked well after, Forget about their involvement


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

I think the redemption storyline was a nice idea to the Rock/Cena feud but the execution was very poor. We are supposed to believe that Cena had his worst year yet he beat Lesnar, was the man who made John Laurinitis lose his job, won the MITB and got title shots and then won the superstar of the year. Rematches are not a bad idea at Wrestlemania because it's not like Rock vs Cena was the first Mania feud to have a rematch. If anything, the rematch made Cena look even stronger because it's better than winning the first match with the Rock and then losing the second. Never a good idea to send a Mania crowd home unhappy and booing the face of the company. Especially the Miami crowd who attended just to see Rock wrestle and win his first match.

Just my two cents


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Oliver-94 said:


> I think the redemption storyline was a nice idea to the Rock/Cena feud but the execution was very poor. We are supposed to believe that Cena had his worst year yet he beat Lesnar, was the man who made John Laurinitis lose his job, won the MITB and got title shots and then won the superstar of the year. Rematches are not a bad idea at Wrestlemania because it's not like Rock vs Cena was the first Mania feud to have a rematch. If anything, the rematch made Cena look even stronger because it's better than winning the first match with the Rock and then losing the second. Never a good idea to send a Mania crowd home unhappy and booing the face of the company. Especially the Miami crowd who attended just to see Rock wrestle and win his first match.
> 
> Just my two cents


Good points, but I would rather see the WM 28 match be like Hogan/Rock. Plus, it would be funny to see how the people at Miami react to The Rock losing. They would throw debris into the ring as if it was the NWO lol

Overall the feud meant nothing to me, which is a shame because it could've been much more awesome, but I thought the build up was poor.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

KO Bossy said:


> Wait, he gave the match a higher rating because he LIKED the finish? The finish was horrendous, how is that possible?
> 
> Anyway, Punk/Rock series is bleh. Neither match was good, after 5 minutes my attention starting wandering. I thought they just didn't gel at all. In retrospect, it reminds me of Punk/Ryback, which I thought was god awful as well.
> 
> ...


 I think a 2000 - 2003 Rock would have done better against the current Punk. Rock was the reason why those matches sucked which I understand considering his age, long hiatus from wrestling and he has gone bigger than before. 

I concur on the MITB booking. It's weird how they can all sit in a meeting and agree to book a wrestler to lose before his MITB win, during his MITB run and then make them irrelavent after they win (or lose in Sandow's case but that remains to be seen). Swagger, Ziggler and Bryan were all victims of this. Bryan, at least, was kept relevant after winning the world title though.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

StraightEdgeJesus said:


> Good points, but I would rather see the WM 28 match be like Hogan/Rock. Plus, it would be funny to see how the people at Miami react to The Rock losing. They would throw debris into the ring as if it was the NWO lol
> 
> Overall the feud meant nothing to me, which is a shame because it could've been much more awesome, but I thought the build up was poor.


 The Miami crowd, along with the ECW crowd in 2006, are the only crowds (from what I've seen) that I believe would riot after seeing their preferred wrestler lose :lol


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Oliver-94 said:


> The Miami crowd, along with the ECW crowd in 2006, are the only crowds (from what I've seen) that I believe would riot after seeing their preferred wrestler lose :lol


Maybe the Chicago crowd at MITB 2011 would as well, but the ECW crowd would've went completely apeshit if Cena won. They gave him shit all night :lmao


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I think that like half of the ECW crowds not only would of rioted but did :lmao

EDIT: WM XX is sucking hard on the cal scale, 7 matches in and the score is 7 :lmao


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

smitty915 said:


> I think that like half of the ECW crowds not only would of rioted but did :lmao
> 
> EDIT: WM XX is sucking hard on the cal scale, 7 matches in and the score is 7 :lmao


And all 7 points are from Lesnar/Goldberg.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Definitely :lol

Guys, I just bought the 2005 PPV set, a 2005 project will happen when it gets here( hopefully next weekend)

I've been wanting to do this for a while


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> Definitely :lol
> 
> Guys, I just bought the 2005 PPV set, a 2005 project will happen when it gets here( hopefully next weekend)
> 
> I've been wanting to do this for a while


What is this 'bought' concept? I'm unfamiliar with it.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

KO Bossy said:


> What is this 'bought' concept? I'm unfamiliar with it.


:lmao, 2005 is my favorite year ever besides like 2001 in the WWE, saw the set for only $40 on amazon and went with it 

On the main event of WM XX, show has been meh so far but this will bring the score up considerably


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I don't think I will ever understand why people love 2005 so much. Maybe for TNA and ROH which were both in their primes, but the WWE was a cesspool of horrible babyfaces, PPVs with one good match and six awful ones, overrated feuds, and piss poor television. 2005 really was the year where the WWE went from being superb to going through a downward spiral that lasted for a very long time.

Rock/HHH I Quit: ****1/4*. Still holds up. Probably one of my favorite face HHH performances.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

WWE in 2005 was so fucking awesome, it's just a fun ride to go through the entire year. Super Cena started becoming a bit annoying towards the end but he was great from post-WM21 until around SummerSlam time. Luckily he redeemed himself as an entertainer in 2006 when he had a great year in that regard with his mic work.

My only issue is some of the terrible booking for a few of the valuable guys on the roster. Shelton started the year off great then they just started jobbing him out uncontrollably and Benoit had barely any direction whatsoever after getting his last ever World Title shot at NYR. But the Orton/Taker and Batista/HHH feuds were :mark: so it's all good. Eddie's death is obviously another negative but it didn't happen until the very end and he shined throughout so it doesn't take _that_ much away.

2005 is WWE's last GREAT year. 2006, 2008 and 2013 all would fall in the 'good' category but the other years have been average, subpar or downright awful.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*WrestleMania 20 review

Where it all begins….again*

*Match #1: John Cena vs the Big Show- US title match *

I’ve always liked this match, no idea what others opinion on it is, but I’ve always found it to be a good opener. Cena was way over at the time and the MSG crowd is hot for him, Big Show also as some heat too. Yeah this is a really fun match, and a very good decision to book this as the opener, as it got the crowd hot for the rest of the matches. Show was a very good debut feud for Cena going against the veteran Big Show. Crowd pops like shit for both FU’s on Show and Mr.Cena AKA the current face of the company wins his first title. ***1/2

*CAL SCALE: 3*

*Match #2: La Resistance vs The Dudley Boyz vs RVD and Booker T vs Garrison Cade and Mark Jindrak *

I love tag wrestling, but this was boring as shit. Why two of these teams needed to be on the card is beyond me. The match should of just been RVD and Booker vs the Dudley Boyz, case closed. Nope instead we got two crappy teams that couldn’t work for shit meshing with two credible teams. This was pointless filler and I’m sure we shall be seeing a lot of these types of matches. * 

*CAL SCALE: 0* 

*Match #3: Christian vs Chris Jericho *

I remember liking this match last time I watched it, let’s hope it holds up on the rewatch. Yeah this match was pretty fucking great. Some good mat wrestling here, a good break from the first two matches that didn’t really have any. It wasn’t completely mat based however, some good brawling moments too and a lot of good near falls make this match a ton of fun. The ending is :mark: too as Trish turns heel in a great moment. A fun storyline coupled with a great match, check this out! ***3/4

*CAL SCALE: 4* 

*Match #4: The Rock N Sock Connection vs Evolution *

The Rock cuts what might be his best promo ever, I love it. This match was always just “there” in my mind, it was fun but not as good as it could be. This match just did not hold up too well. This honestly felt a lot like A RAW match for some reason. Thank god Foley would go out and have one of the best matches of his career against Orton at Backlash or this would have left a bad taste in my mouth. I know some speak highly of it but it just didn’t do it for me. **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5*

*Match #5: Sable & Torrie Wilson vs. Miss Jackie & Stacy Kiebler*

NO

*CAL SCALE: -1*

*Match #6: Chavo Guerrero vs. Nunzio vs. Jamie Noble vs. Tajiri vs. Akio vs. Funaki vs. Shannon Moore vs. Ultimo Dragon vs. Billy Kidman vs. Rey Mysterio*

I know most shit on this match like crazy, but I remember liking this match a lot, mainly because of all the cool cruiserweight spots. Best part of the match might be Ultimo Dragon’s hilarious slip on the ramp, love that shit :lmao. This wasn’t as fun as I remember it, but it was still fun as shit. They did a MUCH better Cruiserweight open at NOW 06 where it wasn’t a gauntlet match but where everyone fought each other at once, much more fun IMO. This is still decent however, but fucking Chavo did NOT need to win this shit. **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5 *

*Match #7: Goldberg vs Brock Lesnar *

We all know the story here, these guys could have had a MOTY type match, but because they were both leaving, none of them gave a shit. SCSA and the crowd were the only things that made this not a complete DUD TBH, its still ridiculously infamous. * 

*CAL SCALE: 0*

*Match #8: he World’s Greatest Tag Team vs. The APA vs. The Basham Brothers vs. Rikishi & Scotty 2 Hotty
*
Not expecting much here, I remember both of these tag matches sucking hard, this one might be a little bit better though. Another Meh match here, and this continues the streak of matches me and no one else seem to give a shit about. None of these teams are really that credible and this seemed to be filler and it was pretty boring. I’d put it above the earlier tag by a hair but make no mistake about it, it is still pretty fucking disappointing. Don’t watch this unless your in the mood for some APA, bad APA too. *

*CAL SCALE: 0*
*
Match #9: Molly Holly vs Victoria *

Hair vs Hair match? GAYYY. NO

*CAL SCALE: -1*

*Match #10: Kurt Angle vs Eddie Guerrero *

Finally, after a ton of crap we get something that should be :mark: to the max! I do remember loving this match a ton, and it being fun as shit. This match was plenty of fun, clearly not as good as his war with JBL a few months later but not many matches are. I like Angle than most on these boards and I really liked this match too. It is a little slow so I can sure see why it would turn some off but it is a very good mix of mat wrestling from Angle and some awesome cruiserweight shit from Guerrero. This really made the show a lot more bearable and it was pretty fucking awesome to see Guerrero retain his title at the granddaddy of dem all. ****

*CAL SCALE: 5 *

*Match #11: Kane vs The Undertaker *

This was always an underwhelming match IMO, mainly because they got less than 10 minutes, which is pretty disappointing considering this feud was pretty fucking great and DAT DEADMAN return. Sure the ABA was cool, but it had nothing on the original deadman gimmick. When he returned as the deadman I know everyone marked out like a little kid. The match however, was pretty bad unfortunately. This really had absolutely nothing on their original clash at WM 98, as that might be a top 50 taker match. This was more about the deadman’s return and the rest was really just filler. **1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 1 *

*Match #12: Chris Benoit vs HBK vs triple H *

Wanna hear something shocking? I haven’t seen this yet! I have no idea why, but I just never watched it. So now its time, and expectations are extremely high going in. I both Benoit and HBk are like, the best wrestlers EVER. Haitch is cool too ., not as good as the other two but still good. What a fucking match this is, I just witnessed 30 minutes of flat out gold. I don’t know what it takes to make this match perfect, but this sure is fucking close to perfect. These three produced what would be the best triple threat in WWE history, possibly of all time. The whole story of the underdog Benoit going against two guys who each have held multiple world titles was awesome, and clearly the in-ring work was some of the best ever. The emotional ending with Eddie is just the icing on the cake. It is obviously tragic as fuck now with both of these guys gone forever, but it will be a memory that will forever remain in our heart. RIP Eddie and Benoit  ****3/4 

CAL SCALE: 8

TOTAL CAL SCALE: 20​


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Benoit/HHH/HBK is my pick for second greatest match of all-time. Backlash 2004 match deserves more love. Near perfect match there as well and second greatest WHC match ever. BENOIT (again).

Mankind/Kane 1/11/99: ***3/4*. Main event title match on RAW. Short but fun, even if Mankind looked weak. I was honestly shocked at how dead the crowd was for this main event though. Like wow, I would compare it to some of the most dead main events of today. That is until Austin came in and GOATed on everyone, including Mankind. My goodness what a pop for him.

Mankind/Bossman 1/18/99: ***3/4*. Holy crap this was physical. Foley takes one of the worst bumps I've ever seen him take when Bossman hits a backdrop onto a chair outside on him. The thud was disgusting. These guys fight all over the place. 8 minutes of fun.

Road Dogg & Al Snow vs. Acolytes 2/4/99: *****. An example of how good the hardcore division can be. Al Snow is a goon and Bradshaw has short hair here. I've never seen a shelf used as a weapon. I swear, everything is used here as a weapon. These chairshots are brutal! :lol at the ending. I remember being scared of it as a kid, but I couldn't help but laugh now.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I don't understand how you can say NO to a match, not watch it, then subtract points for a match in which you did not watch. Cal Scale seems a little flawed to me!

Handicap Tag at Mania XX was a lot of fun imo. *** - *** 1/2 range.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I don't think I will ever understand why people love 2005 so much. Maybe for TNA and ROH which were both in their primes, but the WWE was a cesspool of horrible babyfaces, PPVs with one good match and six awful ones, overrated feuds, and piss poor television. 2005 really was the year where the WWE went from being superb to going through a downward spiral that lasted for a very long time.


I have a very different memory of 2005 with WWE. I love the year. Recall RAW being some of the most exciting TV I could watch each and every week. Smackdown got more fun as the year rolled on too. MEXICOOLS. Only drawbacks I can think of was the lack of use with Christian & having to see Batista be a top guy when he was crap. Hassan was overrated, but at least he was gone in a flash. Well, losing Eddie was the definitive drawback. But that's in regards to life more than booking. 

2005 for all others years ruled too. ROH, TNA, & CZW :mark: Oh, and PWG was fun, obviously. BOLA + All Star Weekend debuted and Steen rose to power in his long standing war with Super Dragon. Culminating in what might still be the best match PWG has to off - their Guerilla Warfare match.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> :lmao, 2005 is my favorite year ever besides like 2001 in the WWE, saw the set for only $40 on amazon and went with it
> 
> On the main event of WM XX, show has been meh so far but this will bring the score up considerably


Hey, if it makes you happy, I say enjoy your $40 purchase.

And yes, the Benoit/Hunter/HBK main event is excellent. One of the few matches I've rated 5 stars. Love it.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Hey, its 15 PPVS cheaper than the price of one shitty 2013 PPV


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The deal you found was a total steal.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

ALL HAIL AMAZON! 

Watching Cena/angle at NM 03, I've heard this is FUN


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

I wish there were more deals on all ppvs from a year


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

SaviorBeeRad™ said:


> I wish there were more deals on all ppvs from a year


That was the only year I could find on amazon, on Ebay's UK site there is some as a lot of the PPV box sets were UK exclusive I think


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> Hey, its 15 PPVS cheaper than the price of one shitty 2013 PPV


That's a point I certainly can't argue.

I remember even thinking 30 bucks for a PPV back in the day was expensive. Now...I don't care if its a 3 hour diva orgy, I'm not spending almost $60. 

I'm actually kind of surprised that cable providers haven't tried working with WWE to put together a package where you can get all PPVs in a year for a reduced cost rather than spending full price to order individually. At least that'd spare some of the pain.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> ALL HAIL AMAZON!
> 
> Watching Cena/angle at NM 03, I've heard this is FUN


Match is awesome, tbhayley. Cena vs Angle had better chemistry in 2002 & 2003 than they did in any other year later.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Well, if the WWE network Vince pipe dream comes to fruition we could see that happen. I usually order the big 4 PPVS, but there is no way I am ordering SVS, SO SHITTY


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

SMITTY DON'T LIKE SHITTY.

but, who does unless you're drunk, amirite lads? 8*D


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Hmm, not drunk, so Big Show vs Randy Orton must actually be shitty! 

I would only reconsider ordering at this point of Lesnar or Taker was thrown into a match, which isn't happening so...not ordering! 

****1/4 for Angle/cena, some fun shit!


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

smitty915 said:


> That was the only year I could find on amazon, on Ebay's UK site there is some as a lot of the PPV box sets were UK exclusive I think


Yeah, I got the 2005 set for my birthday like right when it came out but they never really did much after that that would be considered a good deal


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's weird how I should hate the Show vs Orton match being signed, but I don't b/c the angle isn't "god awful" in my eyes. It's one of the only things I can tolerate among WWE atm. b/c I like the collective efforts of Show gunning after The Authority. They finally look like a faction. Kane joining in a suit seemed to tie it all together. Shame the booking was ass from the start to kill it for many fans. Also shame about Danielson being out of the mix atm, but he'll bounce back. Not to mention he's currently involved in the program that has my interest the most; so no harm, no foul.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

DB might win the rumble, its either him or Punk . Would love to see Rhodes or a returning Jericho win too.

Someone throw a random match at me to watch


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I wish others weren't so impatient in regards to Bryan. It's so annoying to see all the whiners talking about how he's being depushed and never getting a shot, only fueled by the stupid dirtsheets reports saying he's blamed for SummerSlam flopping. It's not like he can face Orton on 8 or so PPVs all the way until WM and they can't drag the angle out this far.

Either way, I'm looking forward to Orton vs Show. Don't recall them having a proper one-on-one match with Orton being the heel.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Just ordered WM 23, 25, 27, and Batista's DVD for around 10 bucks on dat GoHastings


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I wouldn't want anymore Orton vs Danielson matches, so I'm fine with the way things are going atm. Danielson owned Shawn Michaels following HIAC. He's good. The role right now is fresh & a sign of how he's actually established as a big cheese with the company right now. His star power mixed with Punk's is the driving force, along with building up some more heels.

Random match for ya, smitty: Ric Flair vs Kurt Angle from RAW in 2005. Flair is the god damn greatest in it.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

10 bucks all together? If so Holy shit what a steal.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

smitty915 said:


> 10 bucks all together? If so Holy shit what a steal.


I should've included it's used  16 bucks with a tna dvd and shipping but yeah.. GoHastings has 35% off used dvds today and tomorrow.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

WM 23 is good and 25 has its moments hbk2 :taker). Good buy.

I too am not really that bothered by SvS and the current authority storyline, although the potential 5-on-5 match we could have gotten (HHH/Orton/Shield vs. Show/Bryan/Rhodes/Goldust/Insertnamehere) would be so much better. People are being rather impatient when it comes to Bryan. He's going to get his big victory; this isn't 2011 where Punk's rise came out of nowhere. Big Show is nothing more than filler, and frankly I too don't have a big problem with Orton/Show. Orton needs to rack up some more victories or else he will be a bigger placeholder WWE champion than he was in 2010. Besides, Punk and Bryan teaming up is :mark:.

smitty, go watch Mysterio/Hardy

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2r0pc_rey-mysterio-vs-matt-hardy_news

Can you believe this main evented Smackdown?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Oh yeah. Mysterio was always a hot ticket. But it still had a mega impact letting the Cruiserweight Championship take the spotlight. Smart move; look at how glorious the match was.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Watching Eddie v RVD ladder match on Raw. Love this match.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Angle/Flair match was loads of fun, think I'll go watch Mysterio vs Hardy now!


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Hey you're back!

That ladder match was another case of a midcard title main eventing a show and leading to an awesome match. Love it when that happens. Good thing it happened this year with the tag title.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Not big on the Eddie vs Van Dam ladder match. Tag Championship from RAW this year, on the other hand - boss.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

*Rey Mysterio vs Chris Benoit vs Kurt Angle (Smackdown 25/9/2002)*

Perfect way to kill 10 minutes. Just non-stop, fast paced action that's vintage Kurt for the most part. Starts off with Rey being seen as the third wheel for the other two but then he refuses to stay down until he eventually wins the match with a roll-up. Some great nearfalls and that legdrop on Benoit looked deadly. Loved the Benoit/Angle portion of it as usual and Rey only added to it with his awesome offense. Nothing out of the ordinary but a fun TV match. Not as good as the triple threat Benoit and Angle have with Undertaker from the month before but still solid. ★★★¼


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Remember parts of that. Fact it was a short burst means I was more into it than 99% of all other Benoit vs Angle matches in their career. It was a decent excuse to go balls to the wall; tossing in Mysterio helped out.

Guess Angle is my hot ticket for discussion tonight. Who knew. I was sick to death of that moron on Impact this week.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Cal Scale seems a little flawed to me


What else did you expect from CAL ?

PUNK MATCH TO WATCH. THROW IT AT ME.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> What else did you expect from CAL ?
> 
> PUNK MATCH TO WATCH. THROW IT AT ME.


Punk vs. Orton at Extreme Rules.

I like it more than most big Orton fans, apparently. To me it's their best match-up.


WWE shop is selling a DVD set of all of the 2011 PPVs for $80 (if using the discount code). Worth it? Yay or nay?


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

American Dream: Dusty Rhodes Story or Jeff Hardy My life my rules guise?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Choke2Death said:


> I wish others weren't so impatient in regards to Bryan. It's so annoying to see all the whiners talking about how he's being depushed and never getting a shot, only fueled by the stupid dirtsheets reports saying he's blamed for SummerSlam flopping. It's not like he can face Orton on 8 or so PPVs all the way until WM and they can't drag the angle out this far.


I'm a huge Bryan fan and I completely agree. I don't like to hate on the guy because everyone else does, but markedfordeath is unbelievably impatient about Bryan's situation and will bring him into any and all discussions. I mean, come on man. unk2

Since tomorrow's a holiday (in the U.S. at least), I don't have classes and I can finally watch all of RAW live. :delrio


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

PGSucks said:


> Since tomorrow's a holiday (in the U.S. at least), I don't have classes and I can finally watch all of RAW live taped. :delrio


Ha . Show is recorded in the UK hours before it airs so it won't be live 8*D.

And the CAL SCALE isn't flawed you numpty! If a match is SO BAD you can't even bring yourself around to watching it, then it DESERVES minus points!


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yeah but that only applies to either previous watch memories or on-paper looks 

Imo if anything, a DUD should give -1 points too


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Having not watched SD in a long time  I didn't realise Ryback using Goldberg's Spear/Jackhammer moves against Cena, just fuck off Ryback.

Sorry to any marks of his lol but it does piss me off if im honest, are they doing it as they think they can get Goldberg for Mania to face Ryback, or getting Cena used to so he can kick out of them if/when he'll face Goldberg.

Vince listen please, Ryback is NOT Goldberg. Repeat that many times.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Random ratings 

Goldberg/DDP HH 98: ****1/4
Eddie/rey SD 2005: ****1/2
Rey/Jericho bash 2009: ****1/4


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

How dare people dismiss the CAL SCALE.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Having not watched SD in a long time  I didn't realise Ryback using Goldberg's Spear/Jackhammer moves against Cena, just fuck off Ryback.
> 
> Sorry to any marks of his lol but it does piss me off if im honest, are they doing it as they think they can get Goldberg for Mania to face Ryback, or getting Cena used to so he can kick out of them if/when he'll face Goldberg.
> 
> Vince listen please, Ryback is NOT Goldberg. Repeat that many times.


Tell that to the people chanting Goldberg's name. Doubt it would come to this if it wasn't for the chants. At this point, they're just chanting it for no reason since Goldberg and Ryback no longer have that one thing in common - W/L record. Goldberg is the guy who _always_ won and Ryback is the guy who always loses.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Yeah, that's a good point. The more they chant, the more the E will play on it and try and maximise its appeal. Sad but true, and is the sole reason we keep hearing they want Goldberg back, just for Ryback.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

SaviorBeeRad™ said:


> Just ordered WM 23, 25, 27, and Batista's DVD for around 10 bucks on dat GoHastings


Wonderful deal, but I've ordered from GoHastings before and hopefully your boxes aren't in shitty shape like mine were. Some of the discs wouldn't even stay in the cases and there was so much wear and tear on the corners. But good luck! 



LilOlMe said:


> Punk vs. Orton at Extreme Rules.
> 
> I like it more than most big Orton fans, apparently. To me it's their best match-up.
> 
> ...


Do you have any shows already from 2011? If not then I'd say it's a good deal. 13 PPVs at $80 averages out to just over $6 per show, so it doesn't get much better than that. Extreme Rules, Money in the Bank, Summerslam, and Mania 27 make it worth it. Plenty of other good shows as well throughout the year.



SaviorBeeRad™ said:


> American Dream: Dusty Rhodes Story or Jeff Hardy My life my rules guise?


Hardy, unless you somehow like that awfully slow & boring match style that the WWF worked in the late 70s and early 80s. 



Callamus said:


> Ha . Show is recorded in the UK hours before it airs so it won't be live 8*D.
> 
> And the CAL SCALE isn't flawed you numpty! If a match is SO BAD you can't even bring yourself around to watching it, then it DESERVES minus points!


That doesn't even make sense! :lol You have no way of knowing that it's SO BAD unless you watch it. 

NO should equal 0 and DUD should equal -1. Then it would make sense.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Random ratings
> 
> Goldberg/DDP HH 98: ****1/4
> Eddie/rey SD 2005: ****1/2
> Rey/Jericho bash 2009: ****1/4



I like you, so I'm gonna ignore the fact that you just gave Goldberg/DDP almost the same rating at Eddie/Rey SD 6/23/05. I really dig that Goldberg/DDP match, it's probably Goldbergs best match, and was one of my favorite matches as a kid. But Eddie/Rey SD is in my top 5 for personal favorites


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I agree that DUD should take away from the overall number. Thinking about using the CAL scale from now on when I review a PPV. Actually thinking about watching a PPV just to try it.



Clint Eastwood said:


> Yeah, that's a good point. The more they chant, the more the E will play on it and try and maximise its appeal. Sad but true, and is the sole reason we keep hearing they want Goldberg back, just for Ryback.


If Goldberg would return, I think he would be used for more than just one match. No reason to not do Berg vs Cena for example. They can also do the Orton vs Goldberg rematch from a decade ago.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

If the APPEAL of a match is SO BAD I can't bring myself to watch it then it DESERVES minus 1. If I can at least WATCH a match and it sucks then a DUD and 0 points is all it needs. DON'T FUCK WITH THE CAL SCALE.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> If the APPEAL of a match is SO BAD I can't bring myself to watch it then it DESERVES minus 1. If I can at least WATCH a match and it sucks then a DUD and 0 points is all it needs. DON'T FUCK WITH THE CAL SCALE.



What about if you watch a match, and it's so unbelievably heinous it makes you wonder why you bother watching wrestling, THEN can it count as a negative towards the Cal scale?

I'm pretty sure Hogan vs Warrior Halloween Havoc 1998 would qualify as just such a match. That match made me want to use sulfuric acid as eye drops. Just deplorable.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

If a match is THAT bad then the CAL SCALE is the least of my worries .


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

CAL SCALE is irrelevant. It was created by a ginger. Ginger's are evil. Minus 5 stars tbh.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

STARBUCK burying Cal :mark::mark::mark:.

Watching all of Punk's 2010 in chronological order at the moment even if it takes me a few days. Match with Henry was good to kick off the year and the four way tag w/ Hart Dynasty, Khali/Hardy, & Cryme Tyme was K. CM PUNK VS HHH UP NEXT THOUGH GOOD LORD.

The awesome Mysterio matches happen in 2010 too .


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

This guy on Ebay has a ton of WWE DVD's for super cheap at Buy It Now.

http://www.ebay.com/usr/gohastings


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Watching SummerSlam 2007 to use the CAL SCALE for the first time properly.



Starbuck said:


> CAL SCALE is irrelevant. It was created by a ginger. Ginger's are evil. Minus 5 stars tbh.


Unless they are Sheamus or Gingertaker.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Enjoy Finlay Vs Kane & little else .

Main event is okay I guess though.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Starbuck said:


> CAL SCALE is irrelevant. It was created by a ginger. Ginger's are evil. Minus 5 stars tbh.


I'd be upset by this post, but I have no soul so such things don't affect me. Plus you're a HHH fan and as such your opinion is irrelevant 8*D.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Wasn't the biggest fan of Mysterio/Orton from SD 2006 after WM. Too many rest-holds and too much control segments from Orton. 

But, Goldust and Booker vs Un-Americans from SS 2002 was really great. Goldust is one of the GOATs Tag Team wrestler. Honestly. He's so damn good at being FIP.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Callamus said:


> I'd be upset by this post, but I have no soul so such things don't affect me. Plus you're a HHH fan and as such your opinion is irrelevant 8*D.


GAME's opinion is the only one that matters. This extends to his fans. HHH fans > Taker fans. Back me up KOK. 

:trips2


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

HHHATERS GONNA HHHATE.

Just like GAME runs your favorite wrestling organization, GAME MARKS run the forum.

:HHH2


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

THE GAME :HHH


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Shovel

:side:


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Hall of Fame Human Being :HHH2


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

What's the best match between Cena/Orton then?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

NWO 08 was really good from what I can remember.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

HHH MARKS UNITE.

NWO 2008 & Breaking Point are the only ones worth watching by the way .


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> HHH MARKS UNITE.
> 
> NWO 2008 & Breaking Point are the only ones worth watching by the way .


And SummerSlam 2007 and Bragging Rights.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

So after watching Td last night, I went and checked out the Natayla/Brie match, its actually pretty good. I need to watch its undercard again but I think 13 edges out 02 for GOAT summerslam and I remember some of you lads were discussing GOAT ppvs yesterday and not one mention of ss 13, IMO its a top 10 maybe 10-5 ppv in WWE history and best ppv of pg era


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Nah, SS 2002 was better overall, but still SS 2013 was off the charts. My star ratings for the show 

Pre-Show - **1/2
Bray/Kane - **
Rhodes/Sandow - **3/4
Christian/Del Rio - ****
Lesnar/Punk - *****
Mixed Tag - **1/2
Cena/Bryan - ****1/2

What a show :mark: I loved Punk/Lesnar so much live. Don't know if it was discussed here, but Summerslam 2011 is pretty bad ass too with awesome double main event.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

SS 13 doesn't hold a candle to 2002. 13 had two great main events and a solid WHC match but everything else can go (except cash-in!). SS 02 was non-stop greatness from beginning to end. Main events are slightly inferior but Benoit/RVD and Angle/Rey alone are better than the 13 undercard combined.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

SS13 top 5-10 PPV all time? Sure, it was a really good event (and I was there live so that enhances my enjoyment some), but I don't think it's GOAT level good. MITB 11 was better, as was ER 2012. That's 2 just in the past 2 years. 

Bray/Kane was a DUD.
Rhodes/Cody was fine for what is was. Your standard TV match.
Divas - piss break
Mixed tag - Standard TV match.
Christian/ADR - Very good.
Lesnar/Punk - MOTY
Bryan/Cena - not far behind Lesnar/Punk

This was essentially a 2-match show, with the 2 matches being extremely good. Christian/ADR was a nice bonus. Everything else = meh/awful.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

Well I have noticed some talk about he Cal Scale and I don't think it's the best way to decide the quality of a show. Mostly because,to me at least, it seems to undervalue good but not great matches. 

Looking at the WM 20 review a few pages back I don't think the scale fairly weighs a match like Christian/Jericho.

Also it gives an advantage to longer shows because they can have more matches. Like let's take a 3 hour show. It opens with a 20 minute match that gets a ***3/4 (which is a 4). So with 2 hour and 4 minutes to go the score is a 4. 
Now look at a 4 hour Mania. Let's say it opens with 4 **1/2 matches. With 2 hours and 40 minutes to go the score is a 4. 

If the next 2 hours and 40 minutes are identical the shows would get the same score but I would say that the show with 1 ***3/4 match instead of 4 **1/2 matches is a lot better.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> What else did you expect from CAL ?
> 
> PUNK MATCH TO WATCH. THROW IT AT ME.


Watch something with MENG instead.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Nah you guys are underrating it a tad, in a couple of years we all will be looking back completely :mark: at it

-A ***** match IMO
-a ****1/4+ classic wwe title main event and a BADASS cash-in ending
-A awesome whc title match, that I think is the best match those two have put together
-a good divas match
-Cody/Sandow was pretty good, and one of Sandow's best in WWE
- kane/wyatt was more of a Spectacle and got the job done
- Hot hot crowd
- When was the last time WWE booking bulit to a ppv this well ? mitb 11 ? ss 11 ? mania 28 ?

I'd take punk/lesnar;cena/bryan over brock/rock and hhh/hbk 10/10x a week


I'd put it over er 12 and probably tied or a hair better than mitb 11


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

^it's awesome how much I agree with that analysis on SummerSlam '13.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

****1/2
***3/4
***1/2
rest was kinda skippable

And that's SS '13.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

2-match show with 1 more very good match imo.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I still can't believe you don't get blown away by Del Rio vs Christian, Cal. Match is barely under Punk vs Brock as MOTN for me. I'm talking a total hair. It does things to me.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

14 year old girls do things to you, doesn't mean the rest of us should feel the same 8*D.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Did KillaCal even finish college? Why would we use the algorithm of a man like that? 

Queen Starbuck with DAT BURIAL.

SS13 is king, but there are two PPVs that are easily better than it in the past couple years. ER12 and MITB11 will be on everybody's top ten years from now.

Gonna go watch some more 1999 to torture myself. :vince


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Punk/Lesnar > HHH/HBK 
Brock/Rock > Bryan/Cena (I'm probably one of the biggest advocates of Bork/Rock and I didn't think Bryan/Cena was OMGZAWESUMGR8 like most)
Christian/Del Rio = Benoit/RVD
UnAmericans/BookDust + Rey/Angle > Everything else at Summerslam 2013

Add Taker/Test, Edge/Eddie and Jericho/Flair which do no harm whatsoever, and I think I'd happily take Summerslam 2002 over 2013.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> ^it's awesome how much I agree with that analysis on SummerSlam '13.


:cheer:cheer


Nah Cal, Christian/ADR is incredible, the match structure is :lenny, just builds and builds and builds and then a 100mph finish 


What was mitb 11 besides punk/cena, sd mitb and the lava crowd ?

And er 12 as well, besides cena/lesnar; show/rhodes ; ziggler/brodus ?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Well, dammit Cal. 8*D

yeah, MITB 2011 is overrated as ass, tbhayley. Half the show is good and half the show is bleh.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Bryan vs Cena was awesome the first time I watched it live, mainly because of the drama, I originally rated it ****1/2, didn't like it as much on the rewatch and it went down to ****. Its good, but not really MOTY. 

Punk/Brock has stayed at ****3/4 the three times I have seen it, its VERY close to ***** too. It is MOTY by a country mile though, only competition is ADR/ Ziggles, also at ****3/4

Haven't seen christian/ADR since it aired, think I rated it like ***3/4-****

The rest of the show =


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Totally agree on MITB 2011 being overrated. Probably the most overrated PPV of all time. One great main event (and it's not even _that_ great, certainly not 5 star if you ask me), a solid Christian/Orton match that is still one of their weaker matches and two good ladder matches. Show/Henry was decent but overall, I don't think it's top 10 all-time worthy.

Extreme Rules 12 on the other hand, deserves the hype. Excellent main event and WHC match plus a good opener. Have to rewatch Punk/Jericho but I'm sure that it will never be _bad_ at least.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I did indeed finish College, whoever asked. I left 2 years into University though. About to go SELF EMPLOYED soon . Hoping to launch an online SHOP 2morrow. The first of at least 4, this one being mainly for my brother's stuff, then the others will be our own clothing brands. Suck it, bitches 8*D.

And now for something FINLAY~!

Belfast Bruiser vs. Brad Armstrong (WCWSN 2/17/96) 

Sucks major balls that Finlay has been fired from WWE. Sure, he hasn’t been an active wrestler in quite some time, but a guy like Finlay is most certainly gotta be an asset backstage. Hopefully he’ll be back in a few months when the bullshit dies down. Until then... might as well watch some of his stuff for the poll .

I *think* this is his debut match in WCW, after jumping Regal a few weeks earlier which brought him into WCW. Good decision to put him in with an Armstrong I guess, since the ones in WCW (aka not Road Dogg lol) are all very solid in the ring and can help make Finlay look as good as possible for his debut. Kinda like how sticking him with Matt Hardy in 2006 when he debuted in WWE; Hardy was a great worker back then too.

Some nice back and forth action, was kinda expecting more of a squash to put over Finlay, but ah well. He still looked good, and the finish was a DQ when the Blue Bloods showed up and... got their arses handed to them as Regal looked on terrified .

Rating: **



Belfast Bruiser vs. Brad Armstrong (Nitro 2/19/96) 

Rematch, this time possibly without interference.

Finlay ends up looking WAY better here, and we get a better match too. More intense, and a lot more offense from the Bruiser too. Plus, some of those awesome “little things” that most guys don’t even attempt to do. One of my favourites in this match is when Armstrong backs Finlay into a corner, and Finlay starts to act like he’s going to go after a leg... and then blasts Brad in the face with a fucking elbow. And then once he has control of the match again... goes after the leg!

We get a clean finish here too, which is nice.

Really good match, lots of action and plenty of awesome Finlay. Won’t vote for it, but it’s probably worth a watch anyway.

Rating: ***1/4



Belfast Bruiser vs. Steven Regal (Uncensored 3/24/96) 



Regal comes out with his most awesome theme ever (which I am now using in my videos lol). Just thought I’d mention it lol.

“One’s a Lord and the other’s a bruiser, and the bruiser is bruising on the Lord!”

Classic Dusty commentary.

I’m trying to think of a word to describe this match. Just one word. Ummm... oh yeah:

STIFF~!

We all know what these guys are capable of, both in general and against each other, so even if you haven’t seen this match, you can kinda know what to expect. And it’s just as awesome as you would expect.

Nice of them to show the Spanish commentary team randomly during the match. So... why are they relegated to the back of the area and not next to the proper commentary team? WCW IS RACISTS~!

I mentioned the awesome little things that Finlay does in that last match with Armstrong, but Regal ain’t no slouch in that department either. Arguing with the ref all the while leaning on Finlay’s throat with his leg was awesome. You probably need to see it to understand what I mean though lol.

“IRELAND! IRELAND! IRELAND! What is that, 5 miles from London?”

More funny shit from Dusty... especially considering he just randomly starts shouting “IRELAND” for no real reason.

Regal gets busted open, but damn WCW 96 wouldn’t let us see it from up close, so the rest of the match is shown from further back lol. Fuck me though on HOW he got busted open. Finlay punched the SHIT out of Regal twice, and I think it was the second punch that did it. Either way, the punches are about as real, stiff and awesome as you could EVER hope to see in a wrestling match. I had to go back and watch those shots a couple more times.

After nearly 20 minutes of fan-fucking-tastic shit, we get a damn DQ ending when the rest of the Blue Bloods show up. Disappointed with the finish, but it doesn’t take ANYTHING away from the rest of the match. This is going on my list, and atm I’m considering a top 10 spot for it too.

Rating: ****1/4



Belfast Bruiser vs. Steven Regal (WCWSN 4/13/96)

Rematch :mark:

Damn, almost some payback for Regal with the very first move, as he just kicks Finlay straight in the fucking head. Didn’t bust Finlay open though; like that punch did to Regal in the previous match.

Regal is fucking intent on destroying Finlay’s face in the early going with more kicks and plenty of palm thrusts to the nose. Everything looks brutal and therefore awesome .

Dammit, more interference from the Blue Bloods...

Before that though, the match still gets some decent time for TV, and we get some more of that great, great action that we saw at the PPV. Not as good as the PPV match though, but for what it was it was still really good. And stuff. 

Rating: ***



Belfast Bruiser vs. Steven Regal (WCWSN 4/27/96)

MOAR rematch? :mark:

Dusty when Regal dropped Finlay’s crotch onto his knee: “He got him right in the billy willy!”

:lmao

We get some more great stuff... but it ends in DQ before it develops into something really awesome. Thankfully it’s not a “Blue Bloods interference” DQ, but a “Finlay wants to kill Regal” DQ, so it’s a little better . Just more build to the parking lot brawl match that I’ve already seen, talked about and stuck on my list lol.

Rating: **1/2


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

SKINS25 said:


> :cheer:cheer
> 
> 
> Nah Cal, Christian/ADR is incredible, the match structure is :lenny, just builds and builds and builds and then a 100mph finish
> ...


Byan vs. Fella, Kane vs. Orton, Jericho vs. Punk

FUCK. I need to rewatch Kane/Orton, can remember it being quality.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Forgot show/henry, but still its a tad overrated besides the opener and main event. Good lord I dont remember anything from that Orton/Christian match besides Orton spazzing out :lmao


Edit: Ok forgot bryan/fella, but punk/y2j was kinda flat and WAYY too long and I watched orton/kane recently, prefer their mania match


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

SKINS25 said:


> :cheer:cheer
> 
> 
> Nah Cal, Christian/ADR is incredible, the match structure is :lenny, just builds and builds and builds and then a 100mph finish
> ...


Sheamus/Bryan


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

MITB 2011's good side: Punk vs Cena, World Championship Ladder match, SHOW VS HENRY. Rest can eat a dick.

SummerSlam 2002 is still basically the best around. Not saying I'll take 2013 over it, I just love 2013 on the whole too. Only match on that show I felt was below any quality was the intergender tag. Which was mediocre filler. At least the Ring of Fire had an element of something you won't see on TV. I know, I know, not the best wrestling match. Fuck it. At least there was something to separate it from the pack.

Extreme Rules 2012 is fabulous forever too. But what I don't get is how that gets love, but SummerSlam 2013 doesn't when they're formatted exactly the same. Oh well.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

MITB 2011:

Opener is :mark: and is like #2 all time MITB matches, like ****1/4 there

Cant remember a damn thing about Show/Henry or the RAW MITB 

Orton/Christian was ok, like ***1/2 

Punk/Cena was :mark:, best match of the PG era- *****

ER 2012

I just watched this last night and it was as good as ever 

Kane/Orton was FUN, like ***3/4 there 

Show/Rhodes and Ziggler/Brodus were Meh- ** for both

Bryan/Sheamus is better than ever- at least ****1/2 

Punk/Jericho was better than I remember- ****

Cena/Brock is ***** and IDGAF what you people think ​


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Not saying SS13 isn't awesome, because it is (especially since I was with you and your bro to witness it LIVE :mark. The three standout matches are awesome. I just didn't dig the undercard as much as you did.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Rhodes vs Sandow was high spirited and I dug that. I know you didn't have any interest going in, however. You leaving the moment the Divas match was about to happen was priceless. :lol


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I had to pee and get a drink. 

Rhodes/Sandow was fine, but nothing I couldn't see on Raw (wasn't there a rematch the following night?).


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> MITB 2011's good side: Punk vs Cena, World Championship Ladder match, SHOW VS HENRY. Rest can eat a dick.
> 
> SummerSlam 2002 is still basically the best around. Not saying I'll take 2013 over it, I just love 2013 on the whole too. Only match on that show I felt was below any quality was the intergender tag. Which was mediocre filler. At least the Ring of Fire had an element of something you won't see on TV. I know, I know, not the best wrestling match. Fuck it. At least there was something to separate it from the pack.
> *
> Extreme Rules 2012 is fabulous forever too. But what I don't get is how that gets love, but SummerSlam 2013 doesn't when they're formatted exactly the same. Oh well.*


Agreed, and I dont understand the bolded part as well

:lmao as soon as the divas theme hit, I'd probably would have done the same


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Christian/Del Rio from this years Summerslam wasn't anything special at all, they've had much better matches together. Brock/Punk was a truly great match and MOTY, but it wasn't a ******* match imo. And Bryan/Cena I'd struggle to put over 4 stars, it was good, not great, kind of dragged in parts and the finish was really surprising and truly a significant moment with Bryan beating Cena clean and winning the WWE Title, a moment that all the Bryan fans love, but lets not overrate the match just because of that ending. Had Cena won, that match wouldn't of got nearly the praise.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> I had to pee and get a drink.
> 
> Rhodes/Sandow was fine, but nothing I couldn't see on Raw (wasn't there a rematch the following night?).


Believe there was, haha. I just had to see Rhodes live. 



SKINS25 said:


> Agreed, and I dont understand the bolded part as well
> 
> :lmao as soon as the divas theme hit, I'd probably would have done the same


Lucky me the match was actually surprisingly solid, imo. Plus, I wasn't going anywhere once I knew the Bellas were showing up. Legit standing o. Only guy in the whole arena to care to do so. 8*D


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

If I were to rank the three shows we're talking about, I'd go ER 2012 > SSlam 2013 > MITB 2011.

I've never understood why people claim MITB '11 to be an amazing show or one of the all time greats. I've never been one to rate Cena/Punk at 5* but then again I haven't seen it in a long ass time (**** 1/4 - **** 1/2 for me atm). The SD MITB is **** and the RAW one is *** 1/4, then we have Orton/Christian being pretty good but probably the "worst" of their PPV series. Great angle though. Don't get me wrong, it's a great show no doubt, but it's not a GOAT.

Extreme Rules 2012 however is absolutely fucking fantastic and one of the greatest shows I've ever seen. Punk/Jericho, Sheamus/Bryan, and Cena/Lesnar are all ****+ for me, then you add in Orton/Kane at *** 1/4 and you've got yourself one hell of a show. The best part was that the "filler" was hella entertaining as well. Rhodes/Show & Ziggler/Clay were both really fun. 

Summerslam '13 is just a notch below ER 2012 simply because it didn't have a 4th match the caliber or Orton/Kane and because the "filler" wasn't as good or as entertaining. There was nothing actively bad on the card (at least not from what I recall watching live) and the whole thing was pretty wonderful. Although FUCK that cash-in. :lol

Summerslam 2002 probably tops them all though. There's just SO much variety and quality.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nostalgia said:


> Christian/Del Rio from this years Summerslam wasn't anything special at all, they've had much better matches together. Brock/Punk was a truly great match and MOTY, but it wasn't a ******* match imo. And Bryan/Cena I'd struggle to put over 4 stars, it was good, not great, kind of dragged in parts and the finish was really surprising and truly a significant moment with Bryan beating Cena clean and winning the WWE Title, a moment that all the Bryan fans love, but lets not overrate the match just because of that ending. Had Cena won, that match wouldn't of got nearly the praise.


That's three huge no's from me on all this. Point about Cena winning is ludicrous. Don't let your opinion on Bryan force you into generalizations. Some people didn't only just love the match b/c Danielson won clean...


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Case in point: I still like HHH/Cena from WM22 despite that awful, awful ending. :side:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

HA.

But, yeah, exactly what I'm driving at.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Extreme Rules 2012 is fabulous forever too. But what I don't get is how that gets love, but SummerSlam 2013 doesn't when they're formatted exactly the same. Oh well.


YES. This sentence is so true. Two extremely similar shows.



Nostalgia said:


> Christian/Del Rio from this years Summerslam wasn't anything special at all, they've had much better matches together. Brock/Punk was a truly great match and MOTY, but it wasn't a ******* match imo. And Bryan/Cena I'd struggle to put over 4 stars, it was good, not great, kind of dragged in parts and the finish was really surprising and truly a significant moment with Bryan beating Cena clean and winning the WWE Title, a moment that all the Bryan fans love, but lets not overrate the match just because of that ending. Had Cena won, that match wouldn't of got nearly the praise.


As far as the first sentence goes, I'll be the judge of that within the next few months.  Del Rio project of course. I will say nothing they did in 2011 tops it. We'll see how 2012 & 13 goes, but I think it's doubtful. Disagree on the last point heavily. The match was pretty fantastic throughout imo and if Cena won that wouldn't have changed a thing they did for the previous 20 minutes.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Got the sudden urge to watch all these shows now. Not like that's a bad thing.

also, Cal, FINLAY. I READ IT BTW.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Primer said:


> That's three huge no's from me on all this. Point about Cena winning is ludicrous. Don't let your opinion on Bryan force you into generalizations. *Some people didn't only just love the match b/c Danielson won clean...*


You clearly don't know the deep gates of the internet my friend. The small percentage of people who did like Cena/Bryan as a whole (mostly people from the WF + two or three YT geeks) don't make a 1/3 of those that cocksuck it just because of Bryan's victory. Otherwise i.e. you'd think they would at least *try* to show just at least a tiny bit of unanimous respect to Cena the night after SS if they did enjoy the whole thing.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I really want to watch the ss 02 undercard and ss 13 again

@ Nostalgia I disagree with you bro on all three of your points. I think the cena/bryan was pretty good w/o the ending


^^^ ??


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

ATF said:


> You clearly don't know the deep gates of the internet my friend. The small percentage of people who did like Cena/Bryan as a whole (mostly people from the WF + two or three YT geeks) don't make a 1/3 of those that cocksuck it just because of Bryan's victory. Otherwise i.e. you'd think they would at least *try* to show just at least a tiny bit of unanimous respect to Cena the night after SS if they did enjoy the whole thing.


Those geeks don't matter.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

They dont tbhayley

Off the top my head

ADR/Christian series

ss 13>>>cage>>>ex 11>>> their sd match b4 ss 13


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Their match following WM 27 is really good too. I swear I think the ladder match is my least favorite that they've produced. Stupid WWE gimmicks.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yea some of these gimmicks are really watering down these match tbh, I still like the chamber but I prefer normal stip to most if not all of these gimmick nowadays

Yea I watched their ladder match about a month ago, its solid but nothing more


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

You're wrong there. The IWC, no matter what you think, is quite the force. A headstrong one, too. You don't try in telling them stuff like "Meng >>>>> Kofi Kingston", "Angle/Benoit was fun but garbage", "The Rock sucks", etc. like you commonly hear in these servers. They'll eat your penis with their Godly keyboard warrior powers of *ranting* on you.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I gave the Christian/ADR Cage match and a couple other TV matches from 2011 *** and their Ladder match sits at *** 3/4 right now, so nothing has came close.  I have all their TV matches on my computer though. Looks like two in 2012 and three in 2013. I'll be shocked if anything tops their Summerslam match. As of right now:

SSlam '13 > Ladder Match >> Cage MAtch & SD after Mania 27

EDIT: And btw Cody and others, the one on Sd after Mania 27 was a #1 Contender's match.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Think I'll review SS 2013 right now, its still on my DVR from when I ordered it


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Something about the Christian vs Del Rio ladder match was missing an element to make it special for me. Outside of the moment when Christian won, of course. The work between the two in the ring is so strong, that once they put a ladder in the middle, it took away from what made their matches so appealing to me in the first place: the wrestling. _"There's a ladder, so that means it has to be used as a weapon."_ No. It doesn't. It could, but it doesn't have to be made to create spots at every whim. Not saying this match was the biggest offender of that _(no, look to Sabin vs Hardy from this week for that fact - ugh awful)_ but I felt disinterested when that took precedence over any other normal structure.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Ok I remember now, I reviewed ex 11 a month ago

Yea I remember writing this match REALLY didnt need a ladder and that was the worst thing about it. Its strong but yea cant explain it


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I couldn't care less about what the YTers and people of that ilk think. They are the primary reason I never joined a forum until now, it was only when I discovered this thread that I signed up. It's like this is the last bastion of sanity for wrestling on the internet. Most times atleast 

Summerslam 2002 will always be my favorite show, and I hold Summerslam 2001 in very high regard as well. Those are the only two years I think are on par/above this years event. I'm a huge fan of Christian/ADR, adore Bryan/Cena, and think Punk/Lesnar is absolutely perfect. Rhodes/Sandow was pretty decent and the Ring of Fire match was a great spectacle. So yea, lot to like there. I might be so bold as to say the Summerslam match with Christian is ADR's second best match, behind only his classic with Ziggler at PB.

As for ER 2012, I think Bryan/Sheamus 2/3 Falls is a top 5 match for 2012, absolutely tremendous and booked perfectly after Bryan's ridiculously dumb loss at WM 28. And Cena/Lesnar speaks for itself, one of the most unique matches in WWE history. Punk/Jericho Chicago Street Fight was kinda disappointing to me. It just seemed to drag and featured some dumb moments. Not even comparable with their WM 28 match, but still good I suppose. The Orton/Kane match was solid if unspectacular.

Anyone got any recommendations for something to watch?


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

ATF said:


> You're wrong there. The IWC, no matter what you think, is quite the force. A headstrong one, too. You don't try in telling them stuff like "Meng >>>>> Kofi Kingston", "Angle/Benoit was fun but garbage", "The Rock sucks", etc. like you commonly hear in these servers. They'll eat your penis with their Godly keyboard warrior powers of *ranting* on you.


Angle/Benoit ain't fun and the Rock isn't garbage, though.

Meng's obv better than Kofi Kingston.

Idiots on the web aren't the ranters. They're the ones that dismiss opinions without hearing thoughts. If I tell someone I think Sgt Slaughter v. the Iron Sheik is several universes ahead of Benoit/Angle and he says it isn't, and then doesn't respond when I've asked him if he even watched the match (this has happened before) or I say Cena's a better worker than Jericho and I get written off without any chance to say why, then he's pretty close to the worst of the worst on the web. I'm not going pretend to consider everyone's opinions equally, but no matter how ludicrously outrageous the opinion is, I'd like to read why they think that. I ain't gonna rub them off completely and it's kind of cool to see a reason why they think what they think. I think Davey Richards is completely terrible but I would honestly want to hear why people think he's really good. Sad thing is they almost never state their opinion. 

Obviously there are exceptions, like when someone says they can't watch 80s wrestling because it's all headlocks and whatever. Because it objectively isn't all headlocks and I'm not going to bother trying to get someone to like what I like. Unless it's la Parka, but everyone likes la Parka anyway.

tph I have no idea what any of these posts were about or for what reason I even wrote this. 80% is probably bullshit and I've possibly ignored thousands of posts on why Edge is not shitty. Keep Calm and Like Goldberg or your opinion sucks.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Bobby Eaton matches. This can include squashes from the Crockett days and ones where he soon became the jobber in the latter years of WCW. Anything with Bobby Eaton is up for grabs in this recommendation.

FOR EVERYONE ELSE TOO.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I think everyone is atleast watching something from all theser shows we are talking about, so go ahead and join

Beautiful Bobby :lmao


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

@Cactus Jack

WATCH SOME BLITZKRIEG.

Infact, that goes for everybody.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Cactus Jack said:


> Anyone got any recommendations for something to watch?


Bobby Eaton.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah1993 said:


> Angle/Benoit ain't fun and the Rock isn't garbage, though.
> 
> Meng's obv better than Kofi Kingston.
> 
> ...


Other than what you said about Benoit/Angle and Edge, excellent post. (specially the part about THE ROCK) (Y)

It's funny how incapable idiots outside of this place are when it comes to arguing. You put some effort to support your opinion and instead they respond with a generic "No, you're wrong and I'm right" sentence or name calling.

I do like it on the rare occasion when YEAH goes all out in another thread and whoever argues is at a loss for words.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Did someone mention Goldberg vs DDP (HH '98)? :mark:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I've seen about a hundred Midnight Express matches, and loved almost all of them. For some reason I've never seen many Bobby singles matches, I'll need to look for some good ones. I know he had a TV match with Austin, I'm sure he had a Steamboat match or two. Prolly a few with Flair I'd imagine.


----------



## hanshanshans911 (Mar 17, 2009)

Do you guys recommend the Best of Raw & Smackdown 2012 set?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

hanshanshans911 said:


> Do you guys recommend the Best of Raw & Smackdown 2012 set?



To be honest, not really. I have Best of 2011 AND best of 2012, and the Best of 2011 is FAR superior I think. I mean there is still some quality in 2012, but if I had to choose, 2011 would definitely win.

That said this is just my opinion, check the match listing and if there are guys on there you really like then go for it, it's not BAD or anything. Just not up to par with 2011.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

It's got good stuff on it. Do you have Netflix? If so, it's there.


----------



## hanshanshans911 (Mar 17, 2009)

Cactus Jack said:


> To be honest, not really. I have Best of 2011 AND best of 2012, and the Best of 2011 is FAR superior I think. I mean there is still some quality in 2012, but if I had to choose, 2011 would definitely win.
> 
> That said this is just my opinion, check the match listing and if there are guys on there you really like then go for it, it's not BAD or anything. Just not up to par with 2011.


Thanks, got the 11 one. Don't really know about the match listing, some stuff looks good on paper but can't really remember most of it (except Punk/Henry and maybe 1 or 2 others). 
Btw really can't want to see the listing for the 2013 set :mark:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

They'll probably blow what could be one of the best sets ever with nonesense like Haitch vs Axel 

Doing another Undertaker post right now I think...hope RAW is good tonight!


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^ dude you watch more wrestling than me in 1 day than I do in probably a week or two, bless you with your tolerance

Was suppose to watch all these things after the debate this afternoon but, not in the mood


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> ^^ dude you watch more wrestling than me in 1 day than I do in probably a week or two, bless you with your tolerance
> 
> Was suppose to watch all these things after the debate this afternoon but, not in the mood


I watched a few matches this morning and then have been writing a paper the rest of the day. Not gonna be watching shit tomorrow as I have a big test Wednesday


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Looks like Cena's streak of good matches ends tonight. RAW doesn't look that great, but the main event looks spectacular.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I'm so fucking tempted to look at those spoilers so I can just record and do something else 

Fuck it I'm reading them


----------



## OML (Feb 14, 2009)

Without spoiling raw can someone just say if storylines get progressed or is it just a match show that doesn't further anything. Like anything big with the authority?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

If the main event of RAW suggests anything, we may have a reason to buy SvS now.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Thoughts on Batista/taker backlash? I'm watching the CS and HIAC matches in addition to the mania match but if it has no chance of making it into my top 50 list I won't bother


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Thoughts on Batista/taker backlash? I'm watching the CS and HIAC matches in addition to the mania match but if it has no chance of making it into my top 50 list I won't bother



It's decent, not terrible or anything but not up to snuff with the other 3 you listed, wouldn't make my top 50 Taker matches, that's for sure.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Alright, guess I'll skip it then. Watching CS match now, HIAC after this!


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I enjoyed every Batista/Taker match tbh. IIRC the Backlash match was very good. In fact, Backlash 07 in general was good (Y).


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Alright, guess I'll skip it then. Watching CS match now, HIAC after this!



If I were you, I'd come back to it later, because that entire Taker/Tista feud is just :mark: :mark: to me.

Not a bad match in site. You just asked if Backlash would be in the top 50 and I said no.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

It's the LMS match, right? That match is great.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Lady Killer said:


> It's the LMS match, right? That match is great.



Oh that's right fuck. Ignore everything I said and definitely watch it, Last Man Standing is TOPS. I have it on the Deadliest matches set.

I was thinking of Taker/Edge backlash for some reason.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Ok, I mean, I've seen their SD cage and mania, plus the NWO tag, but besides that its just LMS, CS, and the HIAC match correct?

Turning on the LMS match now


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Think so, smitty.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Well, they have the TLC 09 match that is shitty as fuck 

OH! And the Armageddon 07 triple threat with Edge! Will watch that as I've heard its good


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Yea I think that's it, I would ask resident Taker expert Cal just to make sure though.

Can't wait to see what you think of the finish, I won't spoil it for you but it definitely made me stand up and go "MOTHER OF GOD" the first time I saw it :mark:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Well, they have the TLC 09 match that is shitty as fuck
> 
> OH! And the Armageddon 07 triple threat with Edge! Will watch that as I've heard its good



Thats a good one too, definitely worth the watch. It's on the History of the WHC set I have, so if you search for that set you should be able to find it fairly easily.

You could also throw in the Smackdown EC match from NWO in 2008, as that was essentially a Taker vs Batista match with others thrown in. That is if you're trying to be overly thorough


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

SD EC from NWO 08 is pretty great if only for the Taker/Batista bits.

Forgot about Armageddon 07 triple threat. Good from what I remember.

No clue about the TLC 09 match.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I reviewed that in my last post 



Spoiler: NWO 2008 EC



MVP vs Big Daddy V vs the Great Khali vs Finlay vs the Undertaker vs Batista( SD EC no way out 2008)

:lol at Big Daddy V and Khali in this shit, expecting complete garbage at any moment that’s not taker/Batista. This is actually a pretty fun match, after the fuckfest that Big Daddy V and Khali are involved in( thank god their eliminated early) Finlay, MVP, taker, and Batista put on a sick match. Finlay is the MVP of this match IMO, he pulls off a really fun brawl. It comes down to Batista and taker, a rematch from Wrestlemania 23. Anyways, they have a really good fight for like 10-11 minutes and taker wins, FUN MATCH! I think I have It over Summerslam 2003 by a hair. ***3/4


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

(Y) Was there live for that. A really solid event overall imo.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> I reviewed that in my last post
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Nice man. 

Btw- you got lucky dude. I went on Amazon and looked for that 2005 PPV set you said you got for $40, and they said there was only 4 copies left and it was $55 . I still bought it though, I adore 2005 and can't wait to do a Cal style 2005 PPV review for the entire year. I say Cal style only meaning I will use his scale and attempt to review the matches in the same rambling style he does, not saying that mine will be nearly as entertaining or funny to read


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Finlay was the GOAT in that match! 

Yeah it looks like we'll be doing 05 rambles simultaneously, I bet your rambles will put mine to shame :lmao


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I'll need to watch both chambers again. I recall both being awesome. Is the Raw one where UMAGA (RIP ) went fucking postal on everyone? DOUBLE SAMOAN DROP~!


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

UNDERTAKER/Batista. Aside from their PPV matches in 07 and the SD cage, you have the already mentioned Armageddon triple threat with Edge that is super mega awesome, 2 SD matches in 08, both are good TV matches, and some tags in 07 (from Feb to April) with them teaming up together which are certainly worth a watch. TLC CHAIRS match between them should be left for dead. It's horrible with a retarded finish. Undertaker was injured going into it, Batista was terrible, and the CHAIRS gimmick was fucking bollacks. Don't bother with it.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Lady Killer said:


> I'll need to watch both chambers again. I recall both being awesome. Is the Raw one where UMAGA (RIP ) went fucking postal on everyone? DOUBLE SAMOAN DROP~!



That's the one. HBK either does the worst blade job ever or gets busted open legit, because he bleeds all over the place after no apparent cause. Jeff Hardy almost steals it at the end, Jericho does a damn good job keeping everything focused (that seems like Jericho's niche, the glue guy in big MitB, Royal Rumble, or EC style matches) and Umage just destroys everything in site. It's my 3 rd fave chamber match behind 2005 and 2002. Only qualm is I wish JBL was around for longer so I could see him destroy more people with that wicked clothesline of his. I will never ever grow tired of watching JBL decapitate fools with that clothesline. Shit is stout.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Chairs matches are notoriously pretty bad. What was the finish of their chairs match?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I too remember the finish being shitty

Don't think I'll watch RAW tonight, just check out what gets good reviews tomorrow


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> I too remember the finish being shitty
> 
> Don't think I'll watch RAW tonight, just check out what gets good reviews tomorrow



Sadly, ever since they botched the hell out of the authority angle with Bryan after Summerslam and simultaneously killed the Punk/Heyman feud by inserting Axel and Ryback, I've been doing what you just said more and more. The booking is just so mind bogglingly stupid at times and listening to Cole and JBL bicker and argue instead of calling the match is so grating that I can't take it at times. It's really sad. I still love pro graps and always will, I just hope they find their way out of this current funk.

That's not to say I never watch it live, I watched it last week and I generally have Smackdown on in the background when I'm pre gaming with my friends or kicking it with the girl.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Eh they'll pull through, SVS just isn't a big deal anymore I guess. So I'l get to the other Tista/taker matches in my next post I guess. 

Undertaker project post #8

*Match #1: CM Punk vs the Undertaker (WM 29)*

I have only seen this once, and it was fun as shit so I’m hoping it holds up on the rematch! This match did in fact hold up, which was awesome, as I hate when I go back and rewatch a match and it’s a resounding MEH (Bryan/Cena!). I think this might in fact make the top 5 list of streak matches, only better ones I can think of is Both HBK matches and the trips WM 17 match, and of course the Tista match. It’s amazing to me that taker can only have one match a year and he constantly delivers. This match had so much drama and maybe it was a little predictable but nobody in that crowd gave a shit. My favorite part was the GTS into the pile driver, and that bossy kickout. So taker wins and the streak stays alive. Beautiful match and #3 on my MOTY list behind Punk/BORK and Ziggler/ADR! ****1/2 

*Match #2: Batista vs the Undertaker ( WM 23)*

What a great match this is, IMO this where the streak became legit. Batista had this obsession with ending it, and the fact that he needed to retain the WHC. I shall be watching the LMS match soon as well as the HIAC match so stay tuned to see what my thoughts are on those. This did start out a little slow, but it got VERY good toward the last 10-15 minutes. This is what wrestling is about, its about the drama coupled with athleticism. Possibly one of the greatest Batista matches ever, its only competition really is the HIAC match with Trips. See this now guys! ****1/2 

*Match #3: HHH vs The undertaker( WM 28)* 

This is what might be the most overrated streak match ever. Don’t get me wrong, its solid, but I’ve seen 5* thrown at it which is ridiculous. The big problem with this match is the fact that it was WAY too fucking long, it was nearly 45 minutes not including the 20 minute entrances. The other issues we’re the cell and how it just wasn’t utilized and the fact that HBK made the match feel overbooked and overdone. Otherwise, it worked out just fine, but its not really in the upper echelon of streak matches IMO. ***3/4 

*Match #4: Batista vs the Undertaker- LMS match( BL 2007)*

OK, hoping this lives up to the amazing reviews I have heard! I’m usually not a fan of LMS match because they seem to be a little anticlimactic, but this is apparently the TOPS. What a match, I wouldn’t say that this is better than their mania match but damn is it entertaining. These two made one of the most boring stips and made it fucking awesome. The finish was something else man, they fucking dived into like the sound booth and it fucking exploded! What a fucking ending!! Check this out guys! ****1/4 ​


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Lady Killer said:


> Chairs matches are notoriously pretty bad. What was the finish of their chairs match?





Spoiler: urgh



Batista uses the chair to low blow Undertaker, pin him and win the WHC. Teddy "Tag Team Match" Long comes out and reverses the decision, claiming that while the match allows CHAIRS to be used, it doesn't allow them to be used like that (WHAT THE FUCK). Then Undertaker comes back and wins.



Urgh.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Spoiler: urgh
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Wow that's fucking terrible.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Damn, that's awful!

For Raw, I'm just gonna watch the Orton stuff since they come on early and leave anything else for tomorrow.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

I know this may be an unpopular opinion in this thread, but I wanted to just go back to what people were saying earlier about match outcomes. Specifically, that they shouldn't effect people's perceptions about a match. In other words, a match still deserves a good rating if the match itself is good, even if the ending wasn't the best.

I strongly disagree. The entire point of the match is to build the rising action which eventually culminates in the finish. If the finish is done poorly, I don't see how you can call a match a real success since the main point of it ended up being unsatisfactory, and therefore, a failure. Yes, the build up takes up the bulk of the match and is important, but the ending is the payoff. If the payoff sucks, then ultimately the worth of the match is hurt.

Here's an example that isn't Brock/Cena. Look at the ER2013 match between Del Rio and Swagger. The match itself was alright...like, **1/2 around. The ending made that a resounding ZERO. Why? Because it was overbooked and totally illogical. Instant replay? The referee running out from the back to inform the actual match referee that Swagger cheated? What the hell is that? It was completely idiotic. Never before in pro wrestling has something like that ever existed, and they pull it out for this single, nothing match, and what happened after? Heels have cheated since then. Was there any instant replay? Of course not. They put in this baffling ending to write themselves out of a corner in one match, and then expect us to forget that precedent has ever been set. Its lazy, made no sense and totally brought down an otherwise decent match. I don't care if the rest of the match was a bit above average, the ending ruined it, and the ending is what the most important part is.

If you want another example, imagine if Taker/HBK HIAC ended not with a Kane debut, but Taker slips, hits his head on a chair and gets knocked out while Shawn cover him. Do you think that match would be nearly as loved? Doubtful, it certainly wouldn't get a ***** rating. The ending would probably bring it down to **** alone.

So to those who say "so what if the ending wasn't that great, everything before that was awesome, so the match deserve a good rating", I say the ending is the last impression a fan is left with, and if that isn't good, it puts a big damper on the match as a whole. And yes, an ending SHOULD negatively effect a match's rating.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I think the issue isn't the ending, but rather the decision of the match which shouldn't matter. Anyone that thinks that a bad ending doesn't affect a match is just stupid. However, the decision should be separate from the action in the match.

I have a feeling that there was another match that had an "instant replay" ending. I know it exists somewhere in the awful history of this industry.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Nah the Swagger/ADR match was terrible anyways 

DO YOU WANNA QUIT? HE DOES NOT WANT TO QUIT LADIES AND GENTLEMEN


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Well...I hate to dig up an old grave, but again, look at Brock/Cena. Yeah, the match itself was pretty good. Think I gave it ****, probably requires a rewatch. But I still hate the match because of who won. Yes, I know I'm not the biggest Cena fan, but I can look past that. What pissed me off was not Cena winning-it was Brock losing. He absolutely should NOT have lost his first match back. The idea that he did is so mind boggling that I can't wrap my head around it. All it did was harm Brock's mystique and appeal, to the point where the Summerslam 2012 build with Hunter felt so bland and empty. In that case, who won DID matter. Not hating on Cena but the fact that they figured that booking decision was sound made me lose so, SO much faith in this company. And this was in April 2012 when I still cared.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> Nah the Swagger/ADR match was terrible anyways
> 
> DO YOU WANNA QUIT? HE DOES NOT WANT TO QUIT LADIES AND GENTLEMEN


Oh god, that was something else I hated about the match. Like, one clothesline and the ref is sticking the mic in the guy's face. Not a good I Quit match, considering the legacy. In fact, right down with Cena/Miz for being some of the worst. 

Oh, there's another match where the ending made an average match into a steaming pile of shit.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Brock/Cena is a ***** classic. Its gotten that rating the 5 times I've seen it, the last time being a few hours ago. I hate the outcome but LOVE the match


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

See, I can't give it *****. I hated the ending that much. Even aside from Brock losing, it was the fact that it was a LOT like the ending of the Miz match. Miz and Riley destroy Cena, then Cena pops up, gets an STF and Miz quits. Terrible. Well in Brock/Cena, Brock annihilated Cena for 20 minutes, then Cena won with 2 moves. Now, obviously Cena/Brock was better in terms of ring work, but the finish made Miz/Cena panned. Brock/Cena was almost the same thing, why does it get a pass? Both feature Cena winning in some ridiculous fashion after a lengthy beat down that makes his opponent look like a chump. To me, BOTH are bad. I can't in all good conscience rate Cena/Brock highly because of that. Some will no doubt disagree, but that's how I look at things.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Well I dont see how if any other superstar pulls a couple moves to win he gets a pass

Cena gets way too much flack for something a lot of people do


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm probably the only one here that actually agrees with KO Bossy. I think Lesnar/Cena is an amazing match, but that ending was very anti-climatic and weak. Cut a potential 5-star match to *****1/2*. I'd say that I have a pretty good tolerance for weird match endings; heck, I liked the universally panned Michaels/Mankind ending. I just don't understand the people that say that the ending to Lesnar/Cena was good.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

I agree. I just think its more prominent in Cena's case because he's the top guy. But even still, winning in 2 moves after 20 minutes of getting killed...and those 2 moves were like...the ONLY offense he got in the match. If its a fairly even match and a guy hits his finisher and wins, there's a big difference in that scenario than getting in 2 moves in the entire thing.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I didn't say it was good, I dislike it actually. But the whole match is so much fun that its 5* despite the ending.

KO: GREAT example to what I said before is Sheamus/DB 2/3 falls from that show. Sheamus was just declared unconscious after getting the fuck beaten out of him for 20 minutes. Then he hits a Brouge kick to win. 

NEVER hear anyone talk about that ending


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

I think ending obviously does play a part in the match rating. I've seen so many people review matches who then admit the ending was the only negative in the match. Like for example, Cena/Umaga. I haven't seen the match but I've seen people admit the ending was disappointment but it was still a great match in the end. Also, Austin/Rock II sometimes gets criticised for the ending and booking (people think it's stupid for Austin to turn heel and join his rival). Match preferences isn't bad at all either. We all know want our favourites to win and it's just another way which fans get more invested into the product. I wouldn't have a go at no one who didn't like the match's ending due to the outcome of the match. I've seen people in this thread who admit Cena/Rock I was better than the second match but then go on to say that Cena/Rock II had a better winner so therefore it doesn't make the match totally bad as there was a correct winner. Or something along those lines.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cena vs Brock is perfection.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I hated the ending but eventually, I got over it since Cena is not even the only guy who has beat Brock at this point. They've killed his "legitimate" aura but he's recovered since then to an extent. Now if he had lost to Punk... that would've murdered any credibility he had left and would have really brought that match down for me. Ending still affects the Cena match as it leaves me ¼ from giving it the full five.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Also MORTIS & WRATH is now the discussion. Don't be a slave to current WWE trends. Make this thread better by not talking about the same ol crap over and over.

gogogogo


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Just watched Goldust and Yoshi vs Baretta and Caylen Croft- ECW Feb 2010

FUN FUN FUN


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> I hated the ending but eventually, I got over it since Cena is not even the only guy who has beat Brock at this point. They've killed his "legitimate" aura but he's recovered since then to an extent. Now if he had lost to Punk... that would've murdered any credibility he had left and would have really brought that match down for me. Ending still affects the Cena match as it leaves me ¼ from giving it the full five.


 I feel the same way. I will never like the ending to that match but I will admit Lesnar losing to HHH has softened the blow ironically. His defeat this year pretty much confirmed that Lesnar doesn't care about wins and losses so if he is happy with that then fair enough. It's the same way with Y2J really. He is happy enough to job consistently when it comes to PPV matches. As a fan, it would have been awesome if Lesnar was still undefeated and faced Undertaker at WM 30 with both streaks on the line.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I'm probably the only one here that actually agrees with KO Bossy. I think Lesnar/Cena is an amazing match, but that ending was very anti-climatic and weak. Cut a potential 5-star match to *****1/2*. I'd say that I have a pretty good tolerance for weird match endings; heck, I liked the universally panned Michaels/Mankind ending. I just don't understand the people that say that the ending to Lesnar/Cena was good.


I thought Michaels/Mankind (I assume we're talking about Mind Games) was a fucking amazing match. But due to the ending, I couldn't give it *****. At least there both guys looked great, and it was a terrific example of why Foley is actually an awesome in ring worker and NOT just a glorified spot monkey. However, almost 30 minutes for a DQ finish does sort of suck. I think I ended up giving it ****3/4. I will say that in that case, it made a bit more sense since Taker/Mankind were still feuding and this set up the Buried Alive match the next month. 

Another match that I gave a great rating to that had a similar lame DQ finish is Angle/Austin at Summerslam 2001. Again, amazing match, but the finish where Austin was DQ'd for assaulting too many referees...yeah, not great. They really wanted to put off Angle's title win until Unforgiven when they were in his hometown. 

But in either case, despite a lame finish, both matches showcased that the participants were equal in terms of skill. In Brock/Cena, Brock losing in 2 moves made him look like such a chump, I thought. Big bad monster heel who in the end can't get the job done. Him losing is bad enough, but at least if the match showed they were on the same level, I could forgive it a bit since Cena was a tough fight. With how it played out, Cena looked like Superman, while Brock became just another monthly opponent.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

MORTIS & WRATH.

or is that too much to understand? The ECW tag is acceptable too. GOLDUST.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Lots of people complained about the 2/3 Falls ending.

MORTIS. The man of 1005 moves. I think he's a candidate for most underrated wrestler of all-time. I need some more Wrath in my life. Give me ten good matches of his to watch.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Mortis and Wrath vs. Flair/henning :lenny iirc


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> I didn't say it was good, I dislike it actually. But the whole match is so much fun that its 5* despite the ending.
> 
> KO: GREAT example to what I said before is Sheamus/DB 2/3 falls from that show. Sheamus was just declared unconscious after getting the fuck beaten out of him for 20 minutes. Then he hits a Brouge kick to win.
> 
> NEVER hear anyone talk about that ending


Oh yeah, you're right...I only vaguely remember that, since I've only seen the PPV when it aired, and that was a year and a half ago, but I do remember feeling the finish to Sheamus/Bryan was underwhelming. That's probably why.

But yeah, that's equally stupid and needs to be exposed for the load of crap it is.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Really? Never have heard any TBH :lmao

I guess I'll watch this mortis and wrath, whoever they are :lol


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

IIRC, Wrath had a match with Meng on some WCW PPV that was way better than it had any right to be.


EDIT-It was at Halloween Havoc 1998.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I'm watching Flair/perfect Loser leaves town instead, havent seen this before for some reason


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Lots of people complained about the 2/3 Falls ending.
> 
> MORTIS. The man of 1005 moves. I think he's a candidate for most underrated wrestler of all-time. I need some more Wrath in my life. Give me ten good matches of his to watch.


Kanyon/Mortis ruled. Innovator of Offense wasn't just a catchy title. He lived it. Better yet, he had a terrific 1997 while under the mask. That was such a bad ass run with Wrath. WCW's undercard was chalk full of gems. It's kind of outrageous.

Wrath?

anything with MENG
vs Goldberg (I think..?)
vs Bam Bam Bigelow
vs Barbarian
vs Mike Enos
vs Barry Horowitz
vs BOBBY EATON
vs Saturn
vs Kevin Nash
vs El Dandy

All those should suffice. Not counting any tag work he had with Mortis or Brian Adams, of course. Did you see the Kronik match vs Palumbo & O'Haire on Nitro in 2001? That's a really good match, tbhayley. A lot of Wrath matches were squashes/showcase bouts on TV, but he demolished folks in awesome fashion.




SKINS25 said:


> Mortis and Wrath vs. Flair/henning :lenny iirc


YES



smitty915 said:


> Really? Never have heard any TBH :lmao
> 
> I guess I'll watch this mortis and wrath, whoever they are :lol


Watch their matches from Bash at the Beach '97 & Fall Brawl '97 immediately. Two amazing tags.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm going to watch and review all of those Wrath matches. I actually take recommendations to heart, unlike some folks around here :side:. You know who you are.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

got any links?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I'm going to watch and review all of those Wrath matches. I actually take recommendations to heart, unlike some folks around here :side:. You know who you are.


(Y)

Watch some more if it tickles your fancy. The Enos matches, for example, have more than one. The second match is a lot longer than the first.



smitty915 said:


> got any links?


Mortis & Wrath vs Glacier & Ernest Miller - Bash at the Beach 1997

Can't find the PPV match for Fall Brawl online anywhere. You want their Nitro match still? It's quite good despite being the shorter version of the excellence seen on PPV. It's Mortis & Wrath vs Meng & Barbarian, btw.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

What a horrible way to end Cena's streak of good matches.

I second the recommendation for those PPV tag matches involving Mortis and Wrath. Definition of gems.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

*SummerSlam 2007:*

Kane vs Finlay - ★★★¼ - *2*
Umaga vs Mr. Kennedy vs Carlito - ★★ - *0.5*
Rey Mysterio vs Chavo Guerrero - ★★¼ - *1*
Divas Battle Royal - *SUBZERO* - *-1*
John Morrison vs CM Punk - *★¾* - *0.5*
Triple H vs King Booker - *★* - *0*
Batista vs The Great Khali - *½★* - *0*
John Cena vs Randy Orton - *★★★¾* - *4*

*CAL SCALE: 7*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Shame the Fall Brawl '97 match is nowhere on a streaming site. If you have an XWT account, get the WCW 1997 PPV pack immediately. If only for that match alone. Whole show is really good, btw.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> I'm so fucking tempted to look at those spoilers so I can just record and do something else
> 
> Fuck it I'm reading them


There's no such thing as RAW spoiler.s It's live. 



smitty915 said:


> I didn't say it was good, I dislike it actually. But the whole match is so much fun that its 5* despite the ending.
> 
> KO: GREAT example to what I said before is Sheamus/DB 2/3 falls from that show. Sheamus was just declared unconscious after getting the fuck beaten out of him for 20 minutes. Then he hits a Brouge kick to win.
> 
> NEVER hear anyone talk about that ending


But that's not what happened. Sheamus was unconscious and then they wrestled like another 5 minutes in the 3rd fall until he hits a brogue kick for the win. I think what you're talking about is when Bryan charges him as the 3rd fall starts and Sheamus just throws his boot up in desperation to defend himself, which still didn't end the match. Played into the story very nicely though.



funnyfaces1 said:


> I'm going to watch and review all of those Wrath matches. I actually take recommendations to heart, unlike some folks around here :side:. You know who you are.


I hope this isn't directed towards me. :argh: Cause I haven't gotten to that Punk/Del Rio match yet. Going in chronological order!


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Sheamus' brogue kick in the beginning of the third fall was superb. Greatly added to the match.

We are all in agreement that a 6-on-6 Survivor Series match between Punk/Bryan/Usos/Rhodes/Goldust vs. Wyatts/Shield is a potential classic that deserves to main event, right? Because that ending to RAW was incredible. Hopefully the two title feuds will step back to allow the real stars to shine.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I hope the potential 6-on-6 tag closes Survivor Series because I'm a mark for SS Elimination matches and I'm not exactly jazzed for either of the title matches. Wonder what Real Americans will do now, because I'm assuming they'll get a title match against the Rhodes at TLC.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Is this SSeries Eliination match legit? If so then :damn


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Pretty sorry show on the whole, but that Shield/Wyatt interaction was HOT, and the potential of that six on six is :mark:


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Wyatts/Shield needs to happen before The Shield completely implode. In fact, that's what should lead to it... or it should be what's the cause of the Wyatt's win. 

The 6-on-6 SVS match would be an epic main event. Of course we're probably going to get one of the title matches closing the show, but if there was ever a time for one of the titles to not close the show, it's Survivor Series.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Usos tagging along while being worthless in the middle of that sea of worthwhile talent is exactly how I feel about WWE atm. For every good thing, something obnoxiously bad has to follow it. Face team needs their jobbers, of course.

These UK trips always suck so hard.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

WHY ARE THE USOS IN THAT FUCKING MATCH.

It could have been SO perfect, but NOPE. Now it's just really fucking excellent instead .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Usos tagging along while being worthless in the middle of that sea of worthwhile talent is exactly how I feel about WWE atm. For every good thing, something obnoxiously bad has to follow it. *Face team needs their jobbers, of course.*
> 
> These UK trips always suck so hard.


^^^That's why.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

loved the ending and main event in all, but why the usos, why couldnt zig zag be apart of it ? Instead of a useless IC match


----------



## Billion Dollar Man (Feb 8, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Sheamus' brogue kick in the beginning of the third fall was superb. Greatly added to the match.
> 
> We are all in agreement that a 6-on-6 Survivor Series match between Punk/Bryan/Usos/Rhodes/Goldust vs. Wyatts/Shield is a potential classic that deserves to main event, right? Because that ending to RAW was incredible. Hopefully the two title feuds will step back to allow *the real stars to shine*.


:lol:lol


----------



## Billion Dollar Man (Feb 8, 2013)

PGSucks said:


> I hope the potential 6-on-6 tag closes Survivor Series because I'm a mark for SS Elimination matches and I'm not exactly jazzed for either of the title matches. Wonder what Real Americans will do now, because I'm assuming they'll get a title match against the Rhodes at TLC.


They just lost a 2 on 1 handicap match against Cena, how anyone would buy them being threats to G & C is beyond me.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Lets go back to Wrath & Mortis now.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Billion Dollar Man said:


> :lol:lol


You again? What are you doing here?

Punk/Bryan vs. Shield was also a good match. Very fun. Can't wait to see more tag matches between them and more Punk/Shield interactions.

:lmao at how quickly Wrath/Goldberg ends.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Ignore away, FF...

Yeah, I checked it out and the Goldberg match was only about twenty seconds. Could have thought it went a bit longer...shit.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man (Feb 8, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> *You again? What are you doing here?*
> 
> Punk/Bryan vs. Shield was also a good match. Very fun. Can't wait to see more tag matches between them and more Punk/Shield interactions.
> 
> :lmao at how quickly Wrath/Goldberg ends.


What I always do, look at people opinions on matches ( identify the highest rated)I might have not seen and watch if I respect the person's opinion enough to do so.

Happen to see you and your 'mark-ish' post and had a nice laugh because of it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Punk, Danielson, both Rhodes, Shield, Cesaro, Swagger & lately Harper specifically have all had a stand out 2013. Nothing "markish" about noting where the quality has been in regards to wanting the potential PPV match to deliver.

but that's too much to ask for when talking about a lot of indie geeks & vanilla midgets, huh? I sure hope TV ratings become the next big wave in this thread. Along with more Triple H lists & Randy Orton topics.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

*WRATH*

vs Bam Bam Bigelow (1/4/99):

:lol this was on the Fingerpoke of Doom show. What the hell? Wrath can speak? That voice! THERMO-NUCLEAR-MELTDOWN! YES! Wrath is running at BBB, but he can't get him down. Love that spot. These guys just clubber each other inside and outside the ring. No stalling. WOW at that Wrath chop. This match is ouch and fun. Those are the two words to describe it. Ouch and fun.

vs Barbarian (8/4/97):

LOL at the way Barbarian runs to the corner. Wrath to the top rope! What a suplex by Barbarian. Damn, Barbarian is so grimy. DAT CHOKE! I love when Barbarian does those rapid corner strikes. I also love it when he misses that big boot. Now Barbarian going to the top rope. ROCK BOTTOM!

vs Mike Enos: 

I hope Enos does his powerbomb/shoulderbreaker thing here. Damn those knees from Wrath. LOL at Heenan talking about how awful family is. Enos wiping that sweat towards Wrath's direction. Now some pushing. LMAO at Wrath being in Mortal Kombat. Dude wasn't even on WCW/nWo Revenge without Gameshark. Oh no, Enos fell to the outside. WTF! WRATH WITH THAT APRON FLIP! I'm sold. Wrath is king. Thank you Paramore fan. Now Wrath nearly goes coast to coast on the top rope clothesline. Now Enos is GOATing with that flex and taunt. Working on that back. CALLBACK SPOT with the drop toe hold by Wrath. ROCK BOTTOM! MELTDOWN! And that fun match is over.

vs Barry Horowitz:

All I could find is that awesome Action Bronson song. ACTION BRONSON! Now there's a talent.

More to come later.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

DEATH PENALTY. TUMBLEWEED SENTON. KICKS.

WRATH.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man (Feb 8, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Punk, Danielson, both Rhodes, Shield, Cesaro, Swagger & lately Harper specifically have all had a stand out 2013. Nothing "markish" about noting where the quality has been in regards to wanting the potential PPV match to deliver.
> 
> but that's too much to ask for when talking about a lot of indie geeks & vanilla midgets, huh? I sure hope TV ratings become the next big wave in this thread. Along with more Triple H lists & Randy Orton topics.


Besides Punk, I like all the people in the final segment. But to say they are the real stars doesn't sound kinda 'mark-ish' to you? Also sounds pretty disrespectful.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Billion Dollar Man said:


> Besides Punk, I like all the people in the final segment. But to say they are the real stars doesn't sound kinda 'mark-ish' to you? Also sounds pretty disrespectful.


Or that it was just a witty comment that shouldn't be taken that seriously?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

*WRATH PT 2*

vs. MAGNUM TOKYO:

Holy crap that clothesline! That jumping shoulder! I want Roman Reigns to start doing it. And this is over quickly. Perfect squash. On the level of Mark Henry/Vader.

vs. Kevin Nash

BROGUE KICK! Wrath is manhandling Kevin Nash and I love it. DROPKICK! Nash doesn't fuck things up. Oh man I thought he got him with that top rope clothesline. LOLNASHWINS. Fun though. Well there goes Wrath's undefeated streak. Is Goldberg next?

vs. Meng

My copy of Halloween Havoc 98 doesn't have this match. Instead, it has TWO Disco Inferno matches.

Can't find the rest of the matches unk3


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nash had to prove he's the real streak killer. Poor, poor WRATH falling victim to that booking.

Your copy doesn't have WRATH vs MENG? K, go find whoever sold you it and beat em to a pulp. I wonder if your copy also cut Saturn vs Lodi or Finlay vs DAS too.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

On the Undertaker/Batista chairs match..when Batista 'won' I ended up skipping past the next 5 minutes and didn't even realise what had happened. It was only when I looked at some discussion of Undertaker still being champion did I have to go back and look. Same happened with the Royal Rumble this year; Punk won, I skipped a few minutes and all of a sudden Rock's celebrating with the title :lol






PGSucks said:


> Wonder what Real Americans will do now, because I'm assuming they'll get a title match against the Rhodes at TLC.


If you have 12 men in one match, there's a lot of open space with the rest of the card. Could just have them stay in the public eye by beating Prime Time Players. Or lose another handicap match..


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I would buy TLC for this match

Usos vs coldust vs RA vs shield in a TLC match :mark: 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

haribo said:


> On the Undertaker/Batista chairs match..when Batista 'won' I ended up skipping past the next 5 minutes and didn't even realise what had happened. It was only when I looked at some discussion of Undertaker still being champion did I have to go back and look. Same happened with the Royal Rumble this year; Punk won, I skipped a few minutes and all of a sudden Rock's celebrating with the title :lol
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I absolutely hate when a match gets restarted. It's one thing that gets me annoyed every single time I see it happen. We see unclean finishes all the time and there seems to be no rhyme or reason why certain matches get restarted and others don't.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> I would buy TLC for this match
> 
> Usos vs coldust vs RA vs shield in a TLC match :mark:
> 
> ...


I think it should just be Shield vs Rhodes Bros vs Real Americans in the TLC match then have the Usos do something else, preferably out of site. It could be a throwback to the old Hardys vs Edge/Christian vs Dudley's TLC matches that put tag team wrestling back on the map in the beginning of the new millennium. Those 3 teams are easily the best full time groups in the WWE right now, I say give them their spot to shine.


Can't wait to get home today, my 2005 PPV set is due to be delivered any minute now. I'm thinking about starting at the Rumble and just working my way through the whole year.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Via wrestlingdvdnews.com:

_We can now confirm that the Shawn Michaels’ WrestleMania Matches DVD first *announced* last month will be titled “*Shawn Michaels: Mr. WrestleMania*“._

_This will be the first major WWE DVD and Blu-ray to hit stores next year, following The Best of Raw & Smackdown 2013. The release date will be February 11th, 2014._

*For 30 Years, WWE and its Superstars have created a pantheon of iconic WrestleMania moments that are immortalized forever in history- but only one man can lay claim to the nickname “Mr. WrestleMania”, Shawn Michaels. 
*

*Whether giving Undertaker all he could handle in a quest to break the streak, revolutionizing the business in a Ladder Match with Razor Ramon, or descending from the rafters for an exhausting 60-minute Iron Man Match with Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels always accomplished his one goal at WrestleMania. That goal was to steal the show. 



**Now, fans can own all 17 of his iconic WrestleMania matches. See all the jaw-dropping action from The Showstopper on WWE’s grandest stage.*


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

So the Benoit triple threat will still be available without being cut short into highlights or simply left off? Edited or not, a one-fall, regular Benoit match appearing on DVD is :mark: worthy. It will also be comical to see how they will edit out some of it, sadly JR's epic commentary at the end will most definitely be cut.

Makes me wonder why they couldn't have featured SummerSlam 04 in the Orton DVD since it's pretty much required viewing for any Orton fan. Maybe they have finally grown a set in the past two years?


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Wrestlemania X-Seven on DVD was just delivered to my house and I'm stuck at work till 3.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I'm telling you man. WM XX triple threat will not be on that set. Willing to bet almost anything.

Oh wait, it's says all 17 matches. Fuck, they're gonna edit the shit outta that match. Not even worth it, really. 

Also, since we're two weeks from Survivor Series, I'm watching past events, starting with 2001 in a little bit.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Fuck, all 17 HBK Mania matches? :mark:


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Not sure how many folks care about this, but the Wrestlemania 23 Limited Tin Edition just randomly came in stock on WWE Shop for $16.99. I guess it's more newsworthy since they're selling a ppv that features Benoit in it now.

http://shop.wwe.com/WrestleMania-23...tart=1&cgid=shop-wwe-products-dvdandmedia-dvd


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

***1/2 for Cena/Cesaro from last night
*** for the Main Event


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I'm a fan of seeing Cena take the VERY European Uppercut. :mark:

Main event was OK. Nothing special really, aside from the awesomeness that was the aftermath.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Cactus your 2005 PPV set is here? Do you have a prime account or something? Because mine won't be here till like Thursday 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Cactus your 2005 PPV set is here? Do you have a prime account or something? Because mine won't be here till like Thursday
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App



Yep, I have a Prime account. Have had it for years and never been charged a dime for it, really odd.

Although I'm pissed because the package got delayed in Arizona so it doesn't look like it will be here till 8pm EST, so I'm not gonna have time to watch a full PPV with work tomorrow


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Better than half the stuff on Raw last night  Think they had a 'fight' during the Ryback match too.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Via wrestlingdvdnews.com:
> 
> _We can now confirm that the Shawn Michaels’ WrestleMania Matches DVD first *announced* last month will be titled “*Shawn Michaels: Mr. WrestleMania*“._
> 
> ...


:mark: and :lenny even though Ive seen most of these more than 4x each


I'd love to see the triple threat on blu-ray/HD


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

*ATF's Top 50 WWE/F TV Matches Ever

IT'S HERE! PART 5! In Jim Johnston's words: THE END IS HEEERREEE!!!!

Part 1: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/25969889-post2202.html
Part 2: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/26103353-post2582.html
Part 3: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/26136937-post2712.html
Part 4: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/26208953-post2934.html

PART 5
THE TOP 5
(See what I did here?)*

*Honorable Mentions Part 5:
Randy Savage vs. Bret Hart, Saturday Night's Main Event 11/28/1987
Edge vs. Kurt Angle, Smackdown 5/30/2002
The Undertaker vs. Kane, Smackdown 4/1/2008

#5: The Two Man Powertrip vs. Chris Jericho & Chris Benoit, Raw 5/21/2001*














The GOAT WWE tag imo. Incredible heel & underdog work from both respective parties. The crowd going berzerk for that hot tag is an unmistakable moment. Shame that this classic will forever be overshadowed by HHH's injury and Benoit's... situation.

*#4: Kurt Angle vs. Brock Lesnar, Smackdown 9/18/2003*














No surprised this was this good. Brock is one of those that could "tame" Angle in the ring, and considering the abnormal cardio these two have, this Iron Man match is the bar to beat for matches of its kind imo.

*(****3/4)
#3: Kurt Angle vs. The Undertaker, Smackdown 9/4/2003*














I was shocked at the fact that this, being 10 minutes shorter and with a hotter crowd, was every bit as good, if not better than No Way Out '06. If only the finish wasn't stupid.

*#2: Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 6/23/2005*














If the crowd weren't badly quiet, this would've gotten ***** from me (yes, that does bother me that much). I dare you to find better character work, pace and storytelling in a single WWE TV match ever.

*And #1...*






*Donald Trump vs. Rosie O'Donnell, Raw 1/8/2007*














Classic. Pure classic. Everything, from the innovation of bad cosplayers wrestling, to the... moves applied, to the end, it was unbelievable (literally). :mark:

*THE END*​


Spoiler: list



(****)
#50: The Miz vs. John Morrison, Raw 1/3/2011
#49: Edge vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 6/8/2007
#48: Chris Benoit, Shawn Michaels, Mick Foley & Shelton Benjamin vs. Evolution, Raw 4/12/2004
#47: Triple H vs. Chris Jericho, Raw 4/17/2000
#46: Team Hell No & The Undertaker vs. The Shield, Raw 4/22/2013
#45: Rey Mysterio vs. Jamie Noble, Velocity 5/1/2004
#44: Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 9/9/2005
#43: Shawn Michaels vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 7/1/1996
#42: Doink The Clown vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 6/21/1993
#41: Chris Benoit vs. Triple H, Raw 7/26/2004
#40: Shawn Michaels vs. Chris Benoit, Raw 2/16/2004
#39: John Morrison vs. CM Punk, ECW 9/4/2007
#38: Finlay vs. Matt Hardy, Smackdown 6/22/2007
#37: DX & The Radicalz vs. The Rock, Cactus Jack, Rikishi & Too Cool, Raw 2/7/2000
(****1/4)
#36: Rey Mysterio vs. John Morrison, Smackdown 9/4/2009
#35: The Shield vs. Team Hell No, Raw 5/27/2013
#34: Owen Hart & The British Bulldog vs. Steve Austin & Shawn Michaels, Raw 5/26/1997
#33: Shawn Michaels vs. Shelton Benjamin, Raw 5/2/2005
#32: Eddie Guerrero vs. Kurt Angle, Smackdown 9/2/2004
#31: Chris Benoit vs. Shawn Michaels, Raw 5/3/2004
#30: Chris Benoit vs. William Regal, Velocity 10/2/2005
#29: Shawn Michaels & Diesel vs. Razor Ramon & The 123-Kid, Action Zone 10/30/1994
#28: Antonio Cesaro vs. Sami Zayn, NXT 8/21/2013
#27: Brock Lesnar vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 12/11/2003
#26: Kane vs. Vitamin C vs. Jeff Hardy & Rob Van Dam vs. Bubba Ray Dudley & Spike Dudley, Raw 10/7/2002
#25: Rey Mysterio vs. John Cena, Raw 7/25/2011
#24: Kurt Angle vs. The Undertaker, Smackdown 3/3/2006
#23: The Shield vs. The Rhodes Brothers, Raw 10/14/2013
#22: The Shield vs. Team Hell No & Kofi Kingston, Raw 5/20/2013
#21: Randy Orton vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 1/27/2006
#20: Hunter Hearst Helmsley vs. Cactus Jack, Raw 9/22/1997
#19: Rey Mysterio vs. Randy Orton, Smackdown 4/7/2006
#18: Mick Foley vs. Terry Funk, Raw 5/4/1998
#17: CM Punk vs. Jeff Hardy, Smackdown 8/28/2009
#16: Ric Flair vs. Mr. Perfect, Raw 1/21/1993
#15: Brock Lesnar vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 12/4/2003
#14: Bret Hart vs. The 123-Kid, Raw 7/11/1994
(****1/2)
#13: Chris Jericho & Chris Benoit vs. Edge & Christian vs. The Hardys vs. The Dudley Boyz, Smackdown 5/24/2001
#12: Randy Orton vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 1/13/2006
#11: The Undertaker vs. Jeff Hardy, Raw 7/1/2002
#10: John Cena vs. CM Punk, Raw 2/25/2013
#9: Shawn Michaels vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 5/17/1993
#8: John Cena vs. Shawn Michaels, Raw 4/23/2007
#7: Owen Hart vs. The British Bulldog, Raw 3/3/1997
#6: Jack Swagger vs. Christian, ECW 2/24/2009
#5: The Two Man Powertrip vs. Chris Jericho & Chris Benoit, Raw 5/21/2001
#4: Kurt Angle vs. Brock Lesnar, Smackdown 9/18/2003
(****3/4)
#3: Kurt Angle vs. The Undertaker, Smackdown 9/4/2003
#2: Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 6/23/2005
#1: Donald Trump vs. Rosie O'Donnell, Raw 1/8/2007





















*The real #1...*






*Steve Austin vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 5/31/2001*














Well, what a match. It may have been more flawed than Eddie/Rey, but fuck it, no TV match ever grabbed my emotion and had me on the edge of my seat as much as this. If there's one Chris Benoit match that is likely to never even be remembered of that shouldn't - discounting the 3-Ways w/Hunter and Shawn of course - it's this. Imo, the sure-fire GOAT WWE/F TV match ever.


THE REAL END​


Spoiler: list



(****)
#50: The Miz vs. John Morrison, Raw 1/3/2011
#49: Edge vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 6/8/2007
#48: Chris Benoit, Shawn Michaels, Mick Foley & Shelton Benjamin vs. Evolution, Raw 4/12/2004
#47: Triple H vs. Chris Jericho, Raw 4/17/2000
#46: Team Hell No & The Undertaker vs. The Shield, Raw 4/22/2013
#45: Rey Mysterio vs. Jamie Noble, Velocity 5/1/2004
#44: Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 9/9/2005
#43: Shawn Michaels vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 7/1/1996
#42: Doink The Clown vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 6/21/1993
#41: Chris Benoit vs. Triple H, Raw 7/26/2004
#40: Shawn Michaels vs. Chris Benoit, Raw 2/16/2004
#39: John Morrison vs. CM Punk, ECW 9/4/2007
#38: Finlay vs. Matt Hardy, Smackdown 6/22/2007
#37: DX & The Radicalz vs. The Rock, Cactus Jack, Rikishi & Too Cool, Raw 2/7/2000
(****1/4)
#36: Rey Mysterio vs. John Morrison, Smackdown 9/4/2009
#35: The Shield vs. Team Hell No, Raw 5/27/2013
#34: Owen Hart & The British Bulldog vs. Steve Austin & Shawn Michaels, Raw 5/26/1997
#33: Shawn Michaels vs. Shelton Benjamin, Raw 5/2/2005
#32: Eddie Guerrero vs. Kurt Angle, Smackdown 9/2/2004
#31: Chris Benoit vs. Shawn Michaels, Raw 5/3/2004
#30: Chris Benoit vs. William Regal, Velocity 10/2/2005
#29: Shawn Michaels & Diesel vs. Razor Ramon & The 123-Kid, Action Zone 10/30/1994
#28: Antonio Cesaro vs. Sami Zayn, NXT 8/21/2013
#27: Brock Lesnar vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 12/11/2003
#26: Kane vs. Vitamin C vs. Jeff Hardy & Rob Van Dam vs. Bubba Ray Dudley & Spike Dudley, Raw 10/7/2002
#25: Rey Mysterio vs. John Cena, Raw 7/25/2011
#24: Kurt Angle vs. The Undertaker, Smackdown 3/3/2006
#23: The Shield vs. The Rhodes Brothers, Raw 10/14/2013
#22: The Shield vs. Team Hell No & Kofi Kingston, Raw 5/20/2013
#21: Randy Orton vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 1/27/2006
#20: Hunter Hearst Helmsley vs. Cactus Jack, Raw 9/22/1997
#19: Rey Mysterio vs. Randy Orton, Smackdown 4/7/2006
#18: Mick Foley vs. Terry Funk, Raw 5/4/1998
#17: CM Punk vs. Jeff Hardy, Smackdown 8/28/2009
#16: Ric Flair vs. Mr. Perfect, Raw 1/21/1993
#15: Brock Lesnar vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 12/4/2003
#14: Bret Hart vs. The 123-Kid, Raw 7/11/1994
(****1/2)
#13: Chris Jericho & Chris Benoit vs. Edge & Christian vs. The Hardys vs. The Dudley Boyz, Smackdown 5/24/2001
#12: Randy Orton vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 1/13/2006
#11: The Undertaker vs. Jeff Hardy, Raw 7/1/2002
#10: John Cena vs. CM Punk, Raw 2/25/2013
#9: Shawn Michaels vs. Marty Jannetty, Raw 5/17/1993
#8: John Cena vs. Shawn Michaels, Raw 4/23/2007
#7: Owen Hart vs. The British Bulldog, Raw 3/3/1997
#6: Jack Swagger vs. Christian, ECW 2/24/2009
#5: The Two Man Powertrip vs. Chris Jericho & Chris Benoit, Raw 5/21/2001
#4: Kurt Angle vs. Brock Lesnar, Smackdown 9/18/2003
(****3/4)
#3: Kurt Angle vs. The Undertaker, Smackdown 9/4/2003
#2: Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio, Smackdown 6/23/2005
#1: Steve Austin vs. Chris Benoit, Smackdown 5/31/2001


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I burst out laughing when I saw your fake #1 :lmao

Yeah I'm thinking of watching taboo Tuesday first. Flair/hhh cage! :mark:


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Rosie/Donald is OVERLOOKED on this forum. But that Iron Match and the Benoit/Austin is where it's at :mark:.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Fantastic work ATF, I can't even hate on you not putting Eddie/Rey at number 1 because I love that Benoit/Stone Cold match so much. I wish so badly I could have it in High Def. I'd absolutely kill to have a Top 50 Benoit matches set put on Blu Ray. Oh well.

Again, great work sir, I agree with most of it actually, especially the top 5.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Look at Smackdown dominating the top 4. (Y)


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I guess if I had to do my own top 10 it would look like this:

1. Eddie/Rey SD 6/23
2. Benoit/Austin SD
3. Angle/Taker SD 2003
4. Owen/Bulldog Raw
5. Punk/Cena Raw 2013
6. Benoit/Jericho vs Two Man Power Trip Raw
7. Lesnar/Benoit SD
8. Lesnar/Angle Ironman SD
9. Swagger/Christian Feb. 2009
10. Flair/Perfect Loser Leaves Town


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

There IS, however, one glaring omission from your list, *ATF*. That being:

John Cena vs. Shawn Michaels (_RAW 1/12/2009_)

**** 1/4 for myself. Wonderful character work from Shawn and a really great slow-build type of match. Felt like a big time main event.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

ANGLE with two of the top five TV matches of all time. :usangle

Apparently Bryan and Punk vs. Harper and Rowan was announced on WWE.com. If it isn't expanded to the 6 on 6 we saw at the end of RAW last night, I'm gonna...I'm gonna complain on this forum. :HHH


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

You sure have alot of Angle matches for a guy that "hates" him :hbk2


Kinda confused, why are their HM for each one ? Does that mean this batch of HM could have been in the top 5 ?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Top 50 Benoit matches.


Nice little topic there. Unless there already is one


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

SKINS25 said:


> Kinda confused, where are their HM for each one ? Does that mean this batch of HM could have been in the top 5 ?


I think he just split all of the Honorable Mentions into 5 parts so that there wouldn't be a giant list in the first post


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Every time I see a LIST, I wanna make a LIST. But then I remember I have too much shit to do. No time for LIST making right now. The only LIST I'll be doing is the Best of 2013 LIST at the end of the year including every match except Zigs/Rio. 

Nice work, ATF.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

FUCK. Thanks JE187 about that Cena/Shawn match, would fall about #24 or sorts. I actually forgot Raw 2009 had good stuff :lol

When did I say I "hate" him? I don't. But only when he has the aid of a Taker/Lesnar/Austin/Mysterio. 

The HM's were all 'collectibles' of sorts


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

You forgot Cena/ADR Miracle on 34th Street Fight. GOAT Raw match tbh.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Great list ATF. And great to see Austin/Benoit claim its rightful spot at #1. Would have the Power Trip/Benoit & Jericho tag a bit higher, though. The one match I couldn't call for some reason is #3. Knew the other 4 would be there but forgot all about this one. Plus points for not including Punk/Cena in the top 5.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Starbuck said:


> Every time I see a LIST, I wanna make a LIST. But then I remember I have too much shit to do. No time for LIST making right now. The only LIST I'll be doing is the Best of 2013 LIST at the end of the year including every match except Zigs/Rio.
> 
> Nice work, ATF.


Yea you just worry about :ziggler3 :delrio


I'd personally have hbk/scsa vs. owen/davey as GOAT tag


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

ATF said:


> FUCK. Thanks JE187 about that Cena/Shawn match, would fall about #24 or sorts. I actually forgot Raw 2009 had good stuff :lol
> 
> When did I say I "hate" him? I don't. But only when he has the aid of a Taker/Lesnar/Austin/Mysterio.
> 
> The HM's were all 'collectibles' of sorts


Don't forget HBK, Mr. michaels got 2 damn good and reasonably sensible matches out of Mr. Gold Medals.


What's everyone's picks for the 5 best or so Cody Rhodes matches? Love watching that guy work, he had a fabulous series with Mysterio including that excellent Smackdown match.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

rey mania 27
rey 4/11
rhodes/shield BG
rhodes/shield raw

either fca w/ orton sd or cena/rhodust vs. real americans/sandow sd

He has many gems, but these stick out


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

ATF said:


> FUCK. Thanks JE187 about that Cena/Shawn match, would fall about #24 or sorts. I actually forgot Raw 2009 had good stuff :lol
> 
> When did I say I "hate" him? I don't. But only when he has the aid of a Taker/Lesnar/Austin/Mysterio.
> 
> The HM's were all 'collectibles' of sorts


Points for me!  I constantly plug a few matches for 2009 RAW to remind people it wasn't _that_ bad (this one + HHH/Orton LMS among a few others) on top of the fact that the Best of RAW '09 is actually pretty good.



Cactus Jack said:


> Don't forget HBK, Mr. michaels got 2 damn good and reasonably sensible matches out of Mr. Gold Medals.
> 
> 
> What's everyone's picks for the 5 best or so Cody Rhodes matches? Love watching that guy work, he had a fabulous series with Mysterio including that excellent Smackdown match.


Excluding several TV matches that I'm sure I've missed, singles matches only would probably look like this:

vs. Randy Orton Street Fight (Smackdown 2011)
vs. Rey Mysterio (Mania 27) & vs. Rey Mysterio Falls Count Anywhere (Extreme Rules 2011)

The NWO 2012 match against Christian will probably fall somewhere in there, but I haven't seen that one yet. Recall a match against Sheamus on Smackdown as well. Now if we're talking tags too then the list would get a bit complicated. Legacy tags on top of Rhodes Bros tags vs. Shield.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

You don't want to start the HBK/Angle discussion again.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

So looking at the list of the top TV matches I realize I haven't seen the top 4 matches from that list. I really should do something about that.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Cody's best matches: Immediately think of Legacy/DX at Summerslam, Legacy/Tripmahontista at Backlash, then the Orton Street Fight, the Battleground tag, the WM 27 match with Rey. The six man tag last week on Raw.

Sooooo, just finished Survivor Series 2001. I'll post the write-up on here in a bit, after I go rake more leaves. Spoiler: 10 man main event is awesome.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

TaylorFitz said:


> So looking at the list of the top TV matches I realize I haven't seen the top 4 matches from that list. I really should do something about that.


You're not alone, my friend. I haven't seen the vast majority of matches on the list.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The DX/legacy rematch from BP was fun too IIRC


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

No, Breaking Point and HIAC are pretty sorry. Same story for both matches. Shawn gets isolated and killed. HIAC is only different because after Shawn gets killed, Trips breaks back in to the cell and they throw Ted out, isolating and killing Cody.

I'll clear that up: I thought Legacy did well, but doing the same story twice, only with a cell the second time didn't do it for me. Also making Shawn look so weak, two on one notwithstanding.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Nah, the Breaking Point match is incredibly fun (****). Legacy looked strong. Summerslam match is wonderful as well (*** 3/4). Yet to see their HIAC match but I have a feeling I'll enjoy it.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Once Cody continues his singles career , I expect good quality shit. 

Also when Sheamus returns I'd love to see him start a feud with Punk maybe after WM. They still haven't had a feud and I'd love to see them have a good series of matches.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Sooooo, just finished Survivor Series 2001. I'll post the write-up on here in a bit, after I go rake more leaves. Spoiler: 10 man main event is awesome.







Still as awesome as ever :mark:


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

I really liked the Legacy/DX HIAC match. I mean it was a little much with Triple H trying to break into the cell but it allowed us to get an awesome segment where Michaels was playing the face in peril and Triple H essentially played the role of someone that was looking for a hot tag. It also plays into the "Divide and Conquer" strategy that Legacy used at Breaking Point. 

Don't remember a thing about the match they had at Summerslam.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

My favorite Cody matches: His Mania Mysterio match, the Street Fight with Orton, BG tag against the Shield, DX Summerslam 09 and this four way he had with Barrett/RKO/Bryan.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So its confirmed that the 6V6 isnt happening. LOL, might not even watch this shitty PPV :lmao


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

TLC seems our best hope of a decent end of 2013. *Shudders*.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

The Shield vs. The Wyatt Family in a TLC Match? :mark:

Not going to happen, but I think it would be awesome.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I fear for how dreadful the RTWM may be this year 

TLC hopefully will be goo though


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Yeah this news means I'm not ordering survivor series. Fuckin stupid. Survivor Series has been beyond awful the past few years


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

As long as The Shield are in another TLC this year, I'll be purchasing. I'm guessing Show/Orton and Cena/ADR will likely continue onto that PPV, though.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Jushin Liger & Bill Kazmaier Vs Mike Graham & DDP - Starrcade 29/12/1991

Why am I watching this? Just because I'm a fan of strongman and I wanna see how Bill does . Only seen him compete in a battle royal before lol. LMAO at him not even realising he got tagged in at first. Good start... .

Bill kinda just stands around and lets people run into him, but then he surprises me by skinning the cat, throwing a pretty decent clothesline, hitting a sweet looking gut wrench suplex and even flies off the ropes for a splash which misses and allows DDP to take control.

With Bill doing a half decent job all things considered... Big Show Vs Brian Shaw* at WM please! (and for... probably everyone else, Brian Shaw* is the current World's Strongest Man)

Boo, Liger gets tagged in . Yey, he isn't in for long. MOAR BILL!

LMAO at hearing DDP very, very clearly telling Bill "reverse, clothesline". And Bill reverses Page and hits a clothesline! What are the odds of that??!?!

Liger and Graham try to have a ZOMG WRASSLIN MATCH and the fans don't give a flying fuck. Bill comes in, Graham tags Page in. DDP hits an elbow on Bill who was coming off the ropes, and Page is the one who gets hurt the most lol. Then Bill tags out. He tagged in, took an elbow to the chest which hurt his opponent more... then tagged out :lmao.

They keep going back to Liger/Graham and the fans don't care about it again until Liger kicks the fuck out of Graham and then flies over the ropes onto him. Totally just realised this is the lethal lottery and the winning team go into battle bowl... which is the battle royal I saw Bill compete in. Ruined the end of the match for myself .

Speaking of, the end comes when Bill launches Liger onto DDP for the 3 count.

Not making my list lol (I'm not THAT crazy), but I really enjoyed it for the most part. Mainly the parts that didn't include Mike Graham. BILL was probably the best guy in the match lol. Totally surprised me with the fact he could actually do... something lol. Kazmaier > Henry as far as strongmen wrestlers? Nah . Still... I wouldn't mind seeing Show Vs Shaw*... probably would be better than anything WWE would plan for a Celeb Vs a Wrestler these days. Plus Shaw could probably press slam Big Show. Would be a cool WM moment.

Rating: ***

*Big Z took the title from Shaw the following year. This is an old review. Posting it to break up the usual shit of Orton/HHH/Lists talk we seem to get 99% of the time.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

OMG, I just mentioned Jesse Ventura in my political science essay...

This is amazing


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> You're not alone, my friend. I haven't seen the vast majority of matches on the list.


Pshh. Most of the matches mentioned in this THREAD I've never seen. Then again, that's probably because I stopped watching from mid 2005-mid 2011. I always hear stuff like "such and such match was SUBLIME, you absolutely must watch it" and meantime, I never even knew it took place.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Mr T Vs Kevin Sullivan - Starrcade 27/12/1994

I'm downloading a bunch of PPV's from 94 and 95, and I'm checking the quality when they finish and I just happened upon this match and it looked hilariously bad, so fuck it, I'm watching it :lmao.

Mr T hits a hip toss, so already he's on par with Cena according to the majority of the IWC. Follows up with some punches to the gut that he must have learned during Rocky III or something. Already he looks fucking knackered, which is ok because Santa is here! Ummm... yeah, for some reason Santa shows up to hand out t-shirts to the audience, while Mr T gets thrown out of the ring. Also, Mr T is wearing a referee shirt. Why? I dunno.

On the outside he takes a beating, and Heenan and Schiavone sound like they are having a blast mocking Mr T as he lands on a camera man and it looks like he's trying to pin him, then the camera man, being a professional and all, keeps shooting while the camera is between Kevin's legs and we get a wonderful view of Mr T from Kevin Sullivan's ball sacks. All the while Heenan and Schiavone are still having a laugh .

Mr T is pretty much done... until Santa hits Kevin Sullivan with Jimmy Hart's megaphone and Mr T wins. Who was Santa? Dave Sullivan; Kevin's retarded brother or something lol.

Terrible pile of shit, but hilarious at the same time. So, top 20 on Craig's list? 

Rating: DUD


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Thanks Cal. I'd finally forgotten that that wretched Mr. T/Sullivan match existed, and now you've reminded me about it.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I know people aren't happy that the 12 man tag isn't happening, but GUYS. They're giving us Punk & Bryan vs. Rowan & Harper on PPV. That match could and should be totally legit. Certainly will add to the list of great tag matches we've had this year. Still potential for some kind of big tag match since Shield/Usos/Rhodes Bros/Real Americans still aren't booked yet. Can't forget about Miz, Axel, Ziggler, and Big E either.



KO Bossy said:


> Pshh. Most of the matches mentioned in this THREAD I've never seen. Then again, that's probably because I stopped watching from mid 2005-mid 2011. I always hear stuff like "such and such match was SUBLIME, you absolutely must watch it" and meantime, I never even knew it took place.


Time to do some catchin up!


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

It should just be a handicap match because Rowan can fuck off


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Can't forget about Miz, Axel, Ziggler, and Big E either.


Even though I'd like to. :hb


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

TLK's not a Ziggler fan? :$


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

*Big Show vs. Ric Flair - Extreme Rules Match - ECW 7/11/06*

_I've never seen this match before and I hear great things about it all the time so I'm going to suck it up and see what it holds. This is a lot of fun. The opening minutes are basically just Show absolutely dominating Flair and the crowd is just so hot simply because it's Ric Fucking Flair in EC fucking W. Flair's comeback is great - It isn't just any low blow, they're the most blatant low blows in pro wrestling history by the dirtiest player in the game: It just makes so much sense. What Joey Styles says is great, also - "Let me repeat that for the historical significance - RIC FLAIR IS USING A BARBED WIRE BASEBALL BAT!" :lmao After several hot minutes of Flair going to town, the finish kind of comes out of nowhere and kinda' takes the wind out of your sails, but whatever. FUN._


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> TLK's not a Ziggler fan? :$


Nah, I still am, but WWE is doing a great job of making me care less and less about him with every passing week.

I'd mostly like to forget about his current burial, if anything.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

*Survivor Series 2001*

*Christian vs Al Snow - European Championship*

Apparently this match came about when Christian talked shit to Al Snow on Heat. Either way, fun opening match. Christian plays the dirty heel very well, and Al Snow works a pretty nice match, though he's not THAT over with the crowd. Aside: Snow's "Head" theme was more enjoyable to listen. Just for the play on words. ***3/4*

*William Regal vs Tajiri*

Short match, but Regal's stiff strikes versus Tajiri's GOAT kicks is so :mark: Tajiri's superkick :mark: Regal wins with the double underhook powerbomb. *****

*Edge vs Test - Title Unification*

Match comes about when Test interferes in Edge's hardcore title match, after which Edge beats Angle for the US title. This will unify the US and IC titles. Really awesome match, with Test doing well to show off his skill in the ring, and show that he could work a really good match, especially as a heel. Finishing sequence is cool with Edge kicking out of the spear and pump handle slam, then Test kicking out of the spear, then Edge countering the powerbomb attempt into the head scissors, THEN Test going for seemingly a Full Nelson slam which Edge counters in a rollup for the win. ****1/2*

*Hardys vs Dudleys - Steel Cage Match for Tag Title Unification*

So, things start off with normal tag rules with one on one in the ring, and their partners on the apron, which changes to tornado rules about midway through. Kind of weird since there is no DQ inside the cage, why no just do the tornado tag rules the whole time. Eh, minor quibble. Another quibble I have: Dudleys ask Stacy to bring in the table with both Hardy's down, Stacy opens the cage door to hand in the table, but why not just climb out since both Hardy's are down? Matt Hardy gets out of the cage, leaving Jeff inside to try to escape on his own. Jeff has the chance to escape but instead chooses to go for the Swanton with Devon on the table. He misses, giving Bubba the chance to cover him for the win. That kind of works for me, since the Hardy's are known for the high risk offense, and this time the risk didn't pay off. Good match overall. ****1/4*

*Immunity Battle Royal*

Winner is immune from being fired. Shawn Stasiak eliminated first. Poor guy got thrown around a ton during 2001. :lmao Test wins. More Test :mark: 

*Trish vs Jackie vs Lita vs Ivory vs Mighty Molly vs Jazz
Six Pack Challenge for the Women's Championship*

Mighty Molly :lol
Jazz's theme :lol

This is actually a pretty cool match. Lita and Jackie team up a little bit (a la Matt and Jeff), Jazz looks like a good powerhouse for a bit, Lita does her solo thing. Good finish with Trish sending Jazz out, and hits the Stratusfaction on Ivory for the win. ****

Vince is backstage hyping up his WWF team. Awesome speech. When he's naming off those guys that came before. Buddy Rogers - Dr. Jack Graham - Gorilla Monsoon - (he turns to Rock and goes The High Chief: PETER MAIVIA :mark: Also, Rock doesn't stop jumping around for the whole speech. :lol

*The Rock and The Undertaker and Kane and Chris Jericho and Big Show
vs
Stone Cold and Kurt Angle and Shane McMahon and Booker T and Rob Van Dam*

Austin and Rock start things off, trading shots. Austin hits the Thesz press, followed by his elbow. Rock follows with his own Thesz press and elbow, showing Austin and the Alliance his middle finger of fellowship. Rock goes for the pin, which Shane breaks up - something he did a ton of early on in this match. Jericho tags in, then RVD tags in. The two trade counters until Jericho gains control following a spinning heel kick. Shane breaks up the Walls of Jericho, giving Booker T the opportunity to tag in, at which point Kane tags in. Then Angle tags in. The two pretty much exchange moves and Shane continues to make his presence felt by breaking up more pin attempts. 

Kane tags in Taker; Angle tags in Booker. Taker works over Booker's left arm, displaying his strength advantage. Shane breaks up yet another pin attempt. Booker tags in Austin, with Austin taking control over Taker. Austin makes a quick tag to Angle. Angle gets a nearfall, and the two trade shots as Taker gets back to his feet. Taker hits a DDT, and looks to tag in Show for the first time. Show gets in chops and takes down Angle, but turns his attention to RVD, allowing Angle to recover and hit Show with the Angle Slam. Booker tags in and hits the scissor kick, which he follows up with the Spin-a-roonie. Shane wants his moment and tags in and hits the top rope elbow, pinning Show for the elimination. 

After eliminating Show, Shane does his shuffle like only Shane can do, and Rock checks in. Rock takes down Shane and tags in Kane, who hits a Chokeslam and tags in Taker, who hits a Tombstone. Jericho then tags in and hits the Lionsault, eliminating Shane. Angle then checks in and goes at it with Jericho. Jericho looks for a pin following an inverted backbreaker, which Austin breaks up. With Jericho reeling, Booker and RVD each tag in, working over Jericho. Kane then tags in, facing off against RVD. RVD hits the standing heel kick, followed up by the Five Star Frog Splash. RVD then pins Kane off the missile drop kick. 

Taker checks in, setting up Austin, RVD, Angle, and Booker each in a corner, and hits his running clothesline on each, cleaning house. He then hits the Last Ride on Angle, and catches Booker T, who comes in with a steel chair, with a big boot. This gives Austin the opportunity to hit Taker with the Stunner, and Angle covers him for the pin. We're now down to Rock and Jericho against Austin/Angle/Booker/RVD. Booker hits the heel kick, and Rock hits the DDT, but Angle breaks up the pin attempt. Booker hits a knee to the gut, but Rock catches him coming back in and hits the Samoan drop, but Austin breaks up this pin attempt. Rock then rolls up Booker for the elimination. RVD checks in and takes advantage of Rock, who is still reeling. Rock hits a powerbomb-like move on RVD for a close nearfall. Jericho tags in and hits a strong flurry of moves on RVD, putting him in control. Jericho hits the bulldog, misses the Lionsault but lands on his feet. RVD however lands a nasty heel kick, and goes for a moonsault, which he gets most of, but Jericho gets a knee up and catches Van Dam in the lower abdomen, allowing Jericho to hit a face first maneuver (Russian leg sweep but forward?), eliminating RVD. Now down to 2 on 2.

Angle takes control of Jericho, while Austin and Rock brawl to the outside, with Austin getting the best of that encounter, catapulting Rock into the ring post. Angle gets Jericho in the chinlock, and Jericho looks to fight out, but Angle stays in control. Austin tags in, and works Jericho into the corner and hits a superplex. The two fight for position, and Austin hits a back body drop. Angle tags back in and continues to wear out Y2J. Angle looks for a German suplex, but Jericho looks to roll him up but ends up locking in the ankle lock, which Angle fights out of. Austin then tags in and looks to hit his mid-rope elbow, but decides against it, not wanting to take any unnecessary risks. Angle tags back in, and continues to go after Jericho. Austin is right back in, into the chin lock. Jericho fights up and out, and the two trade shots. They go off the ropes and each hit a clothesline. Jericho makes the hot tag to the Rock, and Austin tags in Angle. Rock takes control, and off the single leg takeover, locks in the sharpshooter, forcing Angle to tap out. Jericho and Austin are back in. Jericho looks for the Walls of Jericho, but Austin fights out. Austin then looks to lock in his own Walls, but Y2J fights out. Jericho then looks for the Lionsault, but Austin gets both legs up, blocking it. Austin then sends Jericho to the top rope, but Jericho fights him off, and hits a missile drop kick, leading to a nearfall. Jericho then looks for a rollup off the Irish whip, but Austin counters into his own rollup, eliminating Jericho, and we're down to Austin vs Rock.

Big back and forth between the two, with both guys locking in the sharpshooter. Austin avoids being run into Hebner, and hits Rock with a low blow which Hebner's view obstructed. Rock however comes back and hits the Stunner. Nick Patrick however runs in and pulls Hebner out, keeping him from counting the fall. Austin then hits Rock with the Rock Bottom, which Rock kicks out off. Austin then takes out Patrick, the Alliance referee. Austin then gets Hebner back into the ring, but Rock shoves Austin into him. Austin THEN hits the Stunner on the Rock, but there is no conscious referee. Angles runs back down and hits Austin with the title belt, turning on the Alliance, and allowing Rock to hit the Rock Bottom on Austin for the 1-2-3, ending the Alliance and giving the WWF the victory. Awesome fucking match. *****1/2*​


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Ah ok. Perfectly understandable then.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Why does KillaCal hate Liger, Muta, and Chono? If I didn't know about his love for Tajiri and Henry, I would think he's a full blown racist.

A few months ago, I asked for opinions on the DX/Legacy match at BP. Everyone except for Yeah1993 said it was awesome, with Yeah saying that it was awful. When I finally watched it, I thought it was downright horrible and somehow hated it even more than Yeah. I cannot say a single good thing about that poor excuse of a match. And then DX ends up having two more poor excuses of matches that year, both of which main evented.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I hate Liger and Chono?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

hmm, I haven't seen BP in a while, will try to give it a rewatch soon.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I really don't understand why the DX matches main evented in 2009 over the World Title matches at all. Even in 2006-07 when they had that awesome Rated RKO feud, they didn't actually main event.

lol @ Cal being a full blown racist.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

You don't? You realize who is in DX, right? Same reason Cena main events over world title matches.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Well, at least the SVS triple threat with Cena was fun IIRC


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah, I'm not racist. I hate more white people than black people 8*D.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Yeah, not a fan of two of the three DX/Legacy matches. Thoughtaroonies even though I've probably re-posted them five times by now:



Spoiler: thoughtaroonies



SUMMERSLAM
I liked the first ten minutes of this a ton (the match- DX's entrance was kinda really lame and if that was on while I was having dinner with my family I would have to explain I don't enjoy it). HHH just spends some time punching and kneeing both Legacy dudes in the face and his stuff looked good. Then Rhodes gets near Michaels and it's obvious as hell he's going to slap him in the face. Obviousness kind of bothers some people, but it doesn't bother me, I was looking forward to it and if he DIDN'T happen to slap him in the face I would have said a mighty "what the fuck!?" What was really great about the slap was the crowd were chanting 'HBK' and Michaels were looking at them meaning he didn't see Cody's hand plummet toward his beard. Obviously he wants t be tagged in now, and after some dilly-dally wrestling Cody just slaps in the face AGAIN. Michaels says "fuck you" and tackles him to the ground, but Rhodes saids "no, fuck YOU" and reverses it right away and punches at his face. Best two minutes of Cody Rhodes ever. Both Legacy members work over Michaels really well and I don't remember this team looking this good. I was actually disappointed when Michaels got the tags because I wanted the Legacy's stuff to go longer. HHH's house o' fire sort of thing was all right, but it was great when Cody kicked Trip in the back while on apron like 'ah fuck you', but then HHH says 'no fuck YOU' and pulls him in the ring. The finishing parts were kinda cool with HHH getting in a sort-of-cheap-shot Pedigree and people bumping everywhere, but it didn't feel like the sort of end I wanted I liked the match overall. The end was fine (Cody sold the superkick pretty bad though), but through it I was like "IDK what I wanted near the end but it wasn't this." You understanding me? If not then I'll say fuck you worse than Cody Rhodes did. . It feels like these two teams had a really good ten minute TV match in them that I hope actually happened. Even then, as of now this is either my favourite or second favourite Michaels/HHH tag. IDK if that's saying a WHOLE lot because I think most of their matches were either average or kinda shitty or really shitty, but I liked this. 

BREAKING POINT
So I just gone done saying these teams wrestled a good, normal match, and here we are with Submissions Count Anywhere. I don't remember seeing too many Submissions Count Anywhere matches, so I wasn't sure what to totally expect. I saw visions of four goofballs putting on shitty crossfaces on the streets in front of confused locals. And a moose (they were in Canada). What this was OK, but I'm not much a fan of the WWE-style All Over the Arena brawl even when they're done pretty well (and this one was done kinda averagely). The opening was kind of weird with Michaels looking at HHH and DiBiase instead of looking at Rhodes kick him in the leg. If he doesn't see it he won't sell it. Both DX guys work both Legacy guys' legs and I liked DiBiase stumbling toward HHH and almost falling over when punching him the head. The Boston Crab/Camel Clutch through the chair spot was really cool. They wind up in the concession area where they have a bunch of random chanting weirdos yelling 'YOU SCREWED BRET' at Michaels, and this was just after they worked over both Rhodes' and DiBiase's legs. Then they put on figure-fours. HUH? You're in Montreal surrounded by beer-guzzling bitter Bret Hart fans- USE THE SHARPSHOOTER. Speaking of submission moves - I wish neither member of DX ever used the crossface. I'm not particularly offended by it or anything; they just suck ass at putting it on. Back near the ring sometime later Rhodes has this reverse Gory Guerrero whatever thingy it is on Michaels and HHH seemingly breaks it up by jumping off of the apron and not even touching him. I'm imagining Steph telling Cody before the match- "Whenever you put that Reverse Gory Guerrero Whatever Thingy It Is on Shawn- you will break it up when Hunter jumps to the floor." To which Cody replies with "YES EMPRESS!" and a salute. I don't remember much of the last moments where the Legacy were working Michaels over solo. Well I kinda do but I don't really think it's really worth mentioning. IDK. Needed a moose. If this had Shawn Michaels putting on a sharpshooter in front of a moose it would have been ****1/2.

HELL IN A CELL
I loved the idea of this. Unfortunately it wasn't executed very well and just wasn't much fun to watch. Rhodes and DiBiase attack DX before the match even starts and they brawl all around the outside. Said brawling just wasn't that good. They get to the ramp entrance place and HHH takes Rhodes' god-awful finisher (seriously the fuck is that thing?) on the entrance way. This way they lock the door and keep Shawn in the ring and can just beat on him and win handily. It was just kind of boring and I thought the visual of HHH lying there was funny. Shawn's semi-comebacks were kind of fun, I liked when he just channelled his inner Sabu and chucked the chair directly at Cody's face. Rhodes also took a hell of a bump into the cell when Michaels used DiBiase as a weapon. One MILLION minutes after lying dead from The Shitty Thing That Is Cody Rhodes' Finisher, HHH is flopping and bouncing like a mental patient on stilts down the ramp-way. And I thought him just lying there was funny. Then he can't open the lock and DiBiase yells like an idiot "you like that donchta?" "you're HELPESS TRIPLE HHHHHH". That was also kind of funny, like when the Miz tries to act serious. Actually Shawn's acting in some of this was abysmal, like I don't remember anything short of his awful Southern Belle performance at this year's WrestleMania being worse. He was shaking a wobbling like an old man, and he was better at shaking and wobbling like an old man in 1996 when he wasn't actually an old man. So HHH leaves to what I'm hoping is him running down the ramp yelling like a barbarian to try to break the door down with his shoulder, but instead what I get after a millionerererer more minutes than him lying there was some bolt cutters. He cuts the door he hits people DiBiase locked out DX win match over GOODBYE. Bleh.




Chono kinda blows, btw. Not all the time, but kind he kinda blows.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I can't even think of a Chono match I've seen. I have seen some, but buggered if I remember or care.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Time to do some catchin up!


I don't want to have to sift throughout all the crap...just give me the highlights from those years (in terms of matches) and I can watch the crap later (or in some cases not at all). Somebody assemble me a top 20 matches of mid-2005 to mid-2011 (right up until MiTB, I saw that).


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

ANGLE VS TAKER BOSSY: The SD match in 2006 and the NWO 06 match

AND BOTH HBK/Michaels matches from 2009 and 2010

AND the tista/taker feud!


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

KO Bossy said:


> I don't want to have to sift throughout all the crap...just give me the highlights from those years (in terms of matches) and I can watch the crap later (or in some cases not at all). Somebody assemble me a top 20 matches of mid-2005 to mid-2011 (right up until MiTB, I saw that).


A while back you said that you haven't seen Benoit vs Finlay from Judgment Day 2006. GET TO IT ASAP!


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Wait, I should clarify. There ARE some matches I've seen in that period. I have seen Taker/Angle NWO, both Shawn/Taker WM matches, Taker/Trips WM27. Uhhhh...what else...Edge/Cena Unforgiven 2006...I think that might be it...

I know a few obvious ones:

1. Taker/Angle Smackdown
2. Umaga/Cena Rumble
3. HBK/Jericho Ladder
4. Eddie/Rey Smackdown
5. Cena/HBK Raw
6. Cena/HBK WM...23?
7. HBK/Angle WM 21 (which is weird, I was still watching somewhat at that time and have no recollection of this match)
8. Jericho/Rey...which is the good one?
9. Edge/Taker WM
10. Edge/Taker Summerslam
11. Benoit/Finlay Judgment Day


Open for suggestions on the rest.



Choke2Death said:


> A while back you said that you haven't seen Benoit vs Finlay from Judgment Day 2006. GET TO IT ASAP!


Thanks, I'll add it to the list.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

No real thought put in at all:

Benoit vs. Orton - SD Jan 2006 (there's a NHB match and another one, they're both fantastic)
Orton vs. Rey - NWO 06
Angle vs. Taker - NWO 08
Orton vs. Rey - SD after WM 22
Benoit vs. Finlay - Judgement Day 2006
Benoit vs. Regal - No Mercy 2006

Cena vs. Umaga - Royal Rumble 07
Cena vs. HBK - WM 23
All Batista vs. Taker matches
Cena vs. HBK - Raw 2007

Taker vs. Edge - WM 24
Flair vs. HBK - WM 24
Cena vs. Jericho - Survivor Series 2008

Christian vs. Swagger - ECW 2/24
HBK vs. Taker - WM 25
Rey vs. Jericho - Judgement Day or GAB, one is a lot beeter than the other I just can't remember. watch them both, I guess
Rey vs. Morrison - Smackdown IC title
Punk vs. Hardy - Summerslam TLC and SD Steel Cage

HBK vs. Taker - WM 26
Any Punk vs. Rey match

I'm missing a lot, I tried to narrow it down to the "classics" even if I don't think a lot of them are. I wasn't watching during 2008-2010 so I apologise for those years lacking. In fact, the majority of these matches aren't even my cup of tea or I find them overrated, but they're generally the matches people will pimp the fuck out of. 

Also: watch any Chris Masters Superstars match in 2010.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I did a top 50 matches for 2006 when I finished that year a few months ago so the list could be of use to you.

Here's the link

Also did one for 2005 but it's rather outdated but I'll link it if I find it.

EDIT: Here go the 2005 list


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Just got in, gotta love the NY weather up here, its a whopping 35 degrees, thank God for my pea coat

Punk/bryan vs. harper/rowan gonna rock, svs doesnt seem that bad too me; adr/cena, INDY starz/wyatts, orton/show for show and we may get a svs tag


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

My Survivor Series writeup getting :buried :kenny


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I read it Hunter 

Almost done with this Political science paper, gotta love that feeling of accomplishment! 

Oh wait....I have an exam tomorrow too


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

SVS this year is looking super suckish. WWE Title match? Fuck that. World Title match? Fuck that. Punk and Bryan vs. The Wyatts (not even all three, just the two underlings).... FUCK THAT! 

If they made the SVS elimination match a 6-on-6 or add Sandow to the World Title match (or better yet, take Del Rio out of it and just have Sandow replace him), I'd probably end up getting the PPV, but right now it's not looking good to me. Especially the WWE Title match.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

*Shawn Michaels - From the Vault (2003) DVD Review*










*Disc 1*:

Match #1 - *Midnight Rockers vs. Playboy Buddy Rose & Doug Somers - September 2, 1986 [AWA Tag Team Championship Match]*































*Shawn's Commentary*: Before the match begins, Shawn explains some of what was going on during the time of that match. He said that the AWA had just gotten a television deal with ESPN, so this was huge, because the entire United States got a chance to see you.

He said that Buddy Rose was the general of the entire series of matches between the two tag teams. He said that the two teams worked against each other for about two years straight.

They show an old clip of Michaels cutting a promo on the other two guys, and his voice sounds soooo different from how it sounded in the WWE. Weird.

Back to Michaels' current comments. He states that by the time that they got to this particular match, people were just chomping at the bit for the Rockers to beat these two guys, but they just couldn't do it.

He said that for this match to develop into a bloodbath was very rare for the AWA at that time. He said that this match got a lot of attention and notice for the Rockers within the wrestling business.



*My match comments:* Great babyface in peril performance by Shawn here. I've never used that term before, but it is so fitting here. He really makes you feel tremendous sympathy, and I love how he repeatedly seems disoriented and punches at the air. Likewise with Jannetty, but Michaels is in trouble for much longer.

The commentating team does a great job of making this all seem like a huge deal as well.

What Rose and Somers do is pretty basic, so the actual wrestling isn't all that riveting, but Michaels' performance makes up for it. What I loved the most about it was that it seemed authentic. Not much overacting, and not much intentional drawing attention to oneself. Just _being_. This was one of Michaels' better matches from an actual performance standpoint, I thought.

**** 3/4.*



*Extras:* There are three extras that go along with this match.


First Extra - The aftermath of this match, which includes Greg Gagne being interviewed right after the match. He does a great job of selling the severity of the injuries, in a very believable way. He says that Marty Jannetty is yelling that they broke his ribs, and that the doctor is awaiting Marty backstage.

He says that he knew that it would come to this...the matches they've had around the country all culminated in this. He says that Rose and Somers will pay for this. "I don't know the extent of the injuries, I'm not a doctor. All I know is that Jannetty was yelling that they broke his ribs, and he can hardly breathe." He goes on to say that what happened here tonight was something like he's never seen before. "These two kids have devoted their whole lives to the sport of wrestling..."

I really like the realistic style of the AWA from what I've seen.


Second Extra - A promo that Michaels cut backstage in the AWA -- I assume about this match -- but I CAN'T FUCKING HEAR IT ALL. I turned my volume way up, but you still can barely hear anything. How can they put that on DVD like that?! :lol Shawn has on some pretty nifty sunglasses, at least.


Third Extra - The Barbershop segment from the WWE, where Shawn turns on Marty. Shawn had star quality even then. I remember how shocked I was by this as a little kid, lol. Marty looks totally lit, which I _didn't_ notice as a kid.




Match #2 - *Shawn Michaels vs. Razor Ramon - Wrestlemania X [Intercontinental Championship Match]*














*Shawn's Commentary*: Says that the most gratifying thing about things like the Ladder match, is being the first guy to be involved in those matches. "To be the guy who gets labeled as 'the innovator.' There can only be one first, there can only be one blueprint...in that respect, it's always going to stand by itself." Somewhere a certain Canadian is pissed right now.

Shawn says that to him, it showed a lot of trust from a company standpoint in him, to be able to deliver something like that. That's something he takes a lot of enjoyment in.


*My match comments*: This was just such a well-structured match. It moved, it breathed, the spots were perfectly chosen and perfectly timed so that they'd stand out on their own without too much going on that would take away from those moments. I just felt that the exact, right, amount of thought went into this match, so that it wasn't overproduced, yet still stood out like hell.

I'm not even sure how long this match was, but it flew right by. It just felt breezy.

Loved the spit flying out of Shawn's mouth, and loved how quickly Shawn goes over the top rope when someone clotheslines him. It's like lightening. He's always good for those two things. Also loved him mimicking Razor's little move when Razor is about to put a match away.

LOL at all off the camera flash bulbs going off, when Michaels' pants get pulled down. :lol

And look at Hebner getting in on the post-match celebration.

This holds up incredibly well. In fact, I was shocked by how well it held up. I was all set for it to go way down in my estimation, but it was actually even better than I remembered it.

Yes, I'm giving it the full monty.

*******



*Extras:* Two extras, one of which is a promo that Michaels cut in the middle of the ring about this match at that time. He climbs to the top of a ladder and gives an arrogant promo.

The second extra is a promo package about the match. It explains the backstory of it all, and includes clips of everything leading up to the match, along with a narration.




*Match #3 - Shawn Michaels vs. Bret Hart - Wrestlemania XII [Iron Man Match for the WWF Championship]*





















*Shawn's Commentary*: Says that he doesn't think that he could have done that match with anyone other than Bret Hart. He says that that's the only way he would have agreed to do a match that would go an hour. He knew that he and Bret could do two hours if they needed to. In that respect, that was the one thing that was comforting about doing the match. That was the one thing that wasn't a question mark about the match...he knew that Bret could do it, would be into it, would train and prepare just as hard as Shawn did, etc.

It's funny, even when both Shawn and Bret strongly disliked each other, they both spoke highly about each other in this regard (Bret made similiar comments about Shawn in the Iron Man match, even though he hated him at the time).

Shawn goes on to say that everything that went into that match was real. The storyline, the preparation, the emotion before it, during it, and after it...he says that that was as real as this business will ever be for him.


*My match comments*: Viewing the match in this context makes it more exciting for me. Takes me back to how it was when the match initially went down.

I've posted my thoughts on this elsewhere on this board before, so I'm not going to repeat myself, but this was some of the best actual wrasslin' from Michaels ever seen before. The two moved as one, and had great chemistry in this regard, I thought. Lots of nice counter moves and clinics in chain wrestling. Though slow in the beginning, it did build up, to the point where the crowd was in a frenzy toward the end of the thing. 

There were also some well-timed spots that showed off both Michaels' athletic skills, and Bret's technical acumen. Also, I liked the bit of drama on the outside.

One glaring detraction is Bret essentially no-selling the shoulder work later on, which is ultra-surprising, since he's usually the master at selling...even selling throughout several matches (see KOTR '93). I think that this is due to the shoddy planning of having the shoulder work be in the first half. Kind of hard to pull off all of the stuff they were doing in the second half with a "bum" arm, so they should have thought that through a little bit more.

Still, lots stuff for to enjoy from a pure wrasslin' perspective, and I thought that there was a sufficient amount of drama. On this now third viewing, I stand by my opinion that this is a great match, no matter how unpopular that may be.

I do think that enjoying it when it happened live has a lot to do with it, as almost everyone who saw it then ranks it incredibly highly, and it seems as though those who didn't, rank it quite poorly. It is interesting how strongly opinions diverge on this.

***** 1/4.*


*Extras*: The first extra is Piper announcing that it will be an Iron Man match. You can tell that Bret and Shawn are both genuinely amused by Piper in general. Also interesting how you can tell the difference in their personalities, even in how the express that amusement. Bret with a quick smirk, not demonstrative whatsoever. Shawn far more outgoing, patting the back of Piper, clapping, etc. 

Extras two and three are the training videos for this match, and then a promo package for this match.

Extra number four is my favorite one. It's of Bret & Shawn winning match of the year at the Slammys for this. This was presented in early 1997, shortly after Shawn lost his smile. So the two hated each other at this point, and you could tell that everyone knew it. JR's like "this is going to be interesting..." and Shawn smiles like "here we go" when they win. It was just amusing to me to see the dynamics between the two of them. Bret doesn't even try to hide his disdain for Shawn, and Shawn deliberately tries to needle Bret, knowing that Bret genuinely hates him. :lol It's so funny watching this stuff in retrospect.


Will review disc 2 soon, which includes these matches as well as extras:

Match #1 - Shawn Michaels vs. Diesel - In Your House: Good Friends, Better Enemies [WWF Championship Match]
Match #2 - Shawn Michaels vs. Mankind - In Your House: Mind Games [WWF Championship Match]
Match #3 - Shawn Michaels vs. Undertaker - In Your House: Badd Blood [Hell in a Cell]
Match #4 - Shawn Michaels vs. Triple H - Summerslam 2002 [Non-Sanctioned Match]


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

A Michaels review :cheer:cheer, I'm all ears

Yes someone else loves the hbk/razor wm 10 as much as me, full ***** as well to me, your thoughts were well explained, very well structured match, and I was shocked it held up on last watch for me as well, I love the aura and it being the first major ladder, and HBK coming out party of a match sort to speak

I wont judge you on the iron man as you have voiced before you loved it and its your opinion is the only one that matters for yourself although mines is pretty good , will just say I gave it a dud :lol


Disc two :lenny, all those matches are :mark:, very good DVD, I loved those hbk/razor promos


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> A Michaels review :cheer:cheer, I'm all ears
> 
> Yes someone else loves the hbk/razor wm 10 as much as me, full ***** as well to me, your thoughts were well explained, very well structured match, and I was shocked it held up on last watch for me as well, I love the aura and it being the first major ladder, and HBK coming out party of a match sort to speak
> 
> ...


Yeah, I knew you loved it, and I was all set to say that you're cray cray for still ranking it five stars. :lol But it is!

As for disc two, disc one took me, like, a week to do, so I'm sure it will be just as long for disc two as well. :lol I'm slow as hell.

I don't have much memory of the first three matches, so I'm excited, and I've never seen the fourth one.

I know that this is sacrilegious, but a few months ago, I tried to re-watch the HIAC match vs. Taker, and got bored about 15 minutes in and stopped. I know that I was tired, so that has something to do with it, and I know that things tend to build up in the second half. So I'm hoping that meant nothing, since everyone tends to swear by that match. bama4


As for the Iron Man match, I forgot to say that it was fun spotting when the two were deliberately trying to be violent with each other. Bret said that they started shooting on each other for real in that match, because he felt that Shawn was deliberately "potatoing" him, so he returned fire. I never noticed that initially, but now I couldn't help but notice. There was one point where Bret seriously just straight up kicks Shawn in the face. :lmao




Choke2Death said:


> HIAC with [Orton vs.] Taker appears in Deadliest Matches which is a great Taker DVD worth owning for the matches.


I wish I saw this ahead of time! I ordered the "Best HIAC Matches" DVD for that Orton/Taker match. Do you know if that DVD is any good?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> Yeah, I knew you loved it, and I was all set to say that you're cray cray for still ranking it five stars. :lol But it is!
> 
> As for disc two, disc one took me, like, a week to do, so I'm sure it will be just as long for disc two as well. :lol I'm slow as hell.
> 
> ...


You'll love all them, #2 and #3 are universally loved and get ***** many of times, #1 is very good also and gets overlooked because most find Big Sexy's ring work to be poor which isnt really, I like the big guys so yea. I need to rewatch hbk/diesel myself but I have the others

hbk/mankind ****1/2
hbk/taker ***** ( GOAT match candidate)
hbk/hhh - my rating changes every time I watch, goes up and down so idk ( their raw 96 match is theri best IMO)

You want to know something ? It took me a few times as well to see the greatness of hbk/taker but when I did :mark:


Geez it will take you that long ? Some guys in here bang out ppv/match in a span of 1-2 hours


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

*Chris Benoit vs. Big Show - WWE Smackdown 5/8/2003: ****

It's 10 days before Big Show's Stretcher match with Brock Lesnar at Judgment, so Big Show sends a message by appearing with a stretcher with not only Chris Benoit's name, but Lesnar's as well. Benoit shows he's not intimidated by Big Show by getting in his face and going on a quick offensive flurry but Show stops him on his tracks with a big sidewalk slam. The Big Man vs. Little Man dynamic works well in this match as Benoit trying to use his speed but Big Show uses his power to stop him. Show demonstrates his power advantage well from delivering hard Irish whips, hard slams, to stepping on him, showing good heel work as well. Benoit does a great job at selling Show's attacks, leading up to his comeback. Benoit comes back after countering the bear hug by biting him and goes on another offensive flurry which leads to an awesome diving headbutt as Show was standing. Benoit then counters the chokeslam into the Crossface, but A-Train (who accompanied Big Show) tried to stop it by entering with the stretcher, but Benoit baseball slides as A-Train was holding the stretcher. Benoit goes for the Crossface again, but Show counters it into a chokeslam and gets a victory. It's a short, but good match.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Benoit/Big Show is very good. Glad it got a good review.

Do people here still dislike Bret/Shawn SvS 92? I try to dislike it, but nothing about it bores me. Maybe it's because I love both wrestlers and this was their first big match together, but I can't really find much to criticize. Shawn had a good showing and Bret was Bret. Fine with me.

Looking forward to more reviews, LilOlMe.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

I thought it was a really good match. Shawn plays the heel really well and Bret is great as usual. I'd give it ***3/4


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

SVS 92 Bret/Shawn is like a shorter version of their Iron Man... and somehow manages to SUCK EVEN MORE. Which is insane because the Iron Man was about 50 minutes too long. Surely cutting the match in half would have made it suck less, right? FUCKING WRONG MOTHERFUCKERS.

Bret Vs Shawn, be it singles or tag was always god awful. They might have the worst chemistry ever. Even HHH/HBK and Cena/Orton had one or two matches worst sitting through. Bret/Shawn sucked every single time.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

I'm probably one of the few who didn't think the Razor/Shawn ladder match was that amazing. I don't think it holds up at all, really.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Bret vs Shawn matches = thumbs down smiley.

Only match I don't mind is their ladder match. Rest suck.

----------

Didn't comment on it yet, but overall I didn't mind RAW. Had more fun watching it taped than I have live in a good number of weeks. Handicap matches all played off well. Show killing Orton in that insane looking bump + Shield vs Wyatts goodness were the definitive highlights. Outside of Del Rio squashing a chump, of course. :mark:


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Bret vs Shawn matches = thumbs down smiley.
> 
> Only match I don't mind is their ladder match. Rest suck.
> 
> ...


Said it perfectly :lenny


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's almost like we formed that opinion at the same time. :hmm:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Are you guys like brothers ?


nah only bret/hbk match that is good is svs 97


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Don't like the '97 match. Boring brawl.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Great stuff, LilOlMe. Looking forward to hearing what you have to say about the Summerslam '02 Street Fight. Such a love/hate match in this thread, but I LOVE it more than anyone else. 



funnyfaces1 said:


> Benoit/Big Show is very good. Glad it got a good review.
> 
> Do people here still dislike Bret/Shawn SvS 92? I try to dislike it, but nothing about it bores me. Maybe it's because I love both wrestlers and this was their first big match together, but I can't really find much to criticize. Shawn had a good showing and Bret was Bret. Fine with me.
> 
> Looking forward to more reviews, LilOlMe.


Not a fan of their SvS '92 match. I liked that they tried to have Shawn look like a real threat as he was in control for most of the match, but all he did was rest holds, then he loses in a matter of seconds. Pretty standard affair between the two if I'm being honest. ** 1/2 I believe I gave it. That whole show actually REALLY sucks, even the Flair/Ramon vs. Savage/Perfect tag is disappointing. Best things on it are the opener and Tatanka/Martel. 8*D OH and Yoko squashes Virgil!


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Great stuff, LilOlMe. Looking forward to hearing what you have to say about the Summerslam '02 Street Fight. Such a love/hate match in this thread, *but I LOVE it more than anyone else.*


No you don't.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> No you don't.


Well I have it at *****, which clearly leads you to think that I'd regard it as one of the greatest matches of all time. Are we on the same level here, BRO? 

I'm referring to folks in this thread of course.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

You have that at *****? I have it at ****1/2, but I'm super in love with it. I feel like Shawn and Hunter both GOAT it up big time in that match.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

I fuckin love HBK/ HHH from SS 02 as well. I'll never understand the hate for that match. At all. Amazing storytelling and emotion. Jrs call when HBK pins HHH for the victory was epic. 

****1/2


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> You have that at *****? I have it at ****1/2, but I'm super in love with it. I feel like Shawn and Hunter both GOAT it up big time in that match.





xdoomsayerx said:


> I fuckin love HBK/ HHH from SS 02 as well. I'll never understand the hate for that match. At all. Amazing storytelling and emotion. Jrs call when HBK pins HHH for the victory was epic.
> 
> ****1/2


Told ya. 

Yeah I think the whole thing's a masterpiece. I've heard complaints about no selling, anticipating when weapons or spots are coming, slow and boring, blah blah blah. Don't believe any of it. Hunter is the ULTIMATE heel (even after the match) by attacking and destroying Shawn's repaired back, then HBK feeds off the crowd and adrenaline for just ONE MORE MATCH to put on the performance of a lifetime. The finish is absolutely brilliant as well. Always loved the Sweet Chin into the chair too. God what a match...


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

HBK/HHH is a ****1/2 masterpiece, but 5*, NO FUCKIN WAY! 

Watching Benoit/Austin for the first time


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Remember when Mortis & Wrath were on topic in this thread yesterday? Lets go back there again, guys.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I watched the match you show me from them, fun stuff...


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> HBK/HHH is a ****1/2 masterpiece, but 5*, NO FUCKIN WAY!
> 
> Watching Benoit/Austin for the first time


How can you call something a masterpiece but NO FUCKIN WAY it's 5*? Come on man! Not like you're far off. 

------------

Mortis & Wrath! They had a fun tag match at BATB '97... and that's all I got.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

This is open to all other members of the WCW midcard in 1997 & 1998. 

GLACIER had a period where he actually wasn't nearly as bad as originally perceived by the masses.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> How can you call something a masterpiece but NO FUCKIN WAY it's 5*? Come on man! Not like you're far off.
> 
> ------------
> 
> Mortis & Wrath! They had a fun tag match at BATB '97... and that's all I got.


I mean, its good, really good. but It just for some reason didn't feel like its a 5* match. Okay, I can see someone having it at that score, but it just isn't even the GOAT HBK or HHH match, well, for them together it is.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> I mean, its good, really good. but It just for some reason didn't feel like its a 5* match. Okay, I can see someone having it at that score, but it just isn't even the GOAT HBK or HHH match, *well, for them together it is.*


Not that that's saying much.  I still haven't seen their RAW '03 match yet, but I own it. Doubtful that it could top Summerslam though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

You know who are awesome? The Nasty Boys.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

JUVENTUD GUERRERA

What an underrated cruiserweight.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Well, if the mania triple threat counts, then that is the GOAT HHH/HBK match

I still haven't seen their HIAC match, sounds dreadful TBH


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> Well, if the mania triple threat counts, then that is the GOAT HHH/HBK match
> 
> I still haven't seen their HIAC match, sounds dreadful TBH


Don't waste your time. It's 45 minutes of your life you'll never get back.

Well, it's not _that_ bad, but it's not very good either. ** 1/2 I believe I gave it. The last like 10 minutes are both of them laying on the mat, trying to force us to feel like it's a classic. It wasn't very enjoyable.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I'll get to it one day, some rave over it like no tomorrow though for some reason


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

JUICE.

who underrates him? He's the man. I'd wager to say Kidman is a ton more underrated, unfortunately.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Yeah, don't watch HIAC. I used to like it, but I threw it on a few weeks ago, and couldn't get ten minutes in without turning it off. The fact that silly WWE.com pushes it as a top 8 cell match is just fpalm

Guys, whats a good Survivor Series event to watch? I was thinking about 2003 for tomorrow mainly for DAT HBK performance, but it's also got Hunter/Goldberg which is vomit-inducing.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Yeah HBK/HHH HIAC is terrible...... their LMS match sucked too. 3 stages of hell isn't bad. 

SS: ****1/2
LMS: **
HIAC: **1/4
3 stages of hell: ***1/2
Raw 03: ***3/4


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

2002 is the GOAT SVS my friend 

2004 and 2007 are fun too


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Go with 2003 and just don't watch Goldberg vs Triple H. Although, I like to watch it b/c it's so bad it humors me. + GOLDBERG tearing through Evolution is awesome.

Fun show on the over-under for my two cents. Big advocate of the RAW elimination match. All of it felt big. Not just the moments with Michaels. It's best not making every topic about those two dudes. Undertaker squashes Vince and it's amazing. There's something worth talking about.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Well I have it at *****, which clearly leads you to think that I'd regard it as one of the greatest matches of all time. Are we on the same level here, BRO?
> 
> I'm referring to folks in this thread of course.


Actually, I have Hunter/Shawn Unsanctioned Match at Summerslam 2002 at ***** as well.

Just rewatched it last week, in fact, to reconfirm the rating. Sure enough, it held up. It doesn't really matter to me if it had little to no actual in ring work, the story itself was phenomenal, I thought. That's the entire point of wrestling-telling a story with actions. If you get there with incredible technicality or brute violence, either way, I'm happy. Even on the rewatch, I felt so invested. There was that extra layer of emotion that sadly is absent in just about all matches today, what with them playing up HBK's back and it being his first match in over 4 years, and whether or not he actually still had it in him to win. Hunter is so good at playing a bastard heel, which they really played up when he kept whipping Shawn or giving him multiple back breakers. But in the end, he underestimated how much HBK had left in the tank and Shawn rolled him up. So of course, being the prick he is, Hunter tries to cripple him after. I dunno if it was possible, but when it as all said and done, it felt like both had somehow become even BETTER at their respective roles. Shawn was this old, broken down man who had defied the odds, and Hunter was this jealous jerk who let his ego get the better of him by taking things too lightly, and after the match took things from professional envy to attempted murder. 

I fail to see why some people aren't able to get into such an emotional story, but I guess that's their loss. Yeah, too much plunder in matches can bring things down like in the hardcore division in 1999-2002. However, that's because cookie sheet shots to the head replaced any sort of storytelling or psychology. It was just senseless violence. That stuff CAN work if it serves a purpose, and this match is a great example of that (so is the 1999 Rumble I Quit match).


Anyway, I just finished watching Taker/Angle from Smackdown. Really good match, but it lost points for a lame finish. Seriously, couldn't we have just ended it cleanly and THEN have Henry beat Taker down? Ending 20+ minutes with a shitty DQ is so dumb.


----------



## SonoShion (Feb 14, 2012)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Yeah, don't watch HIAC. I used to like it, but I threw it on a few weeks ago, and couldn't get ten minutes in without turning it off. The fact that silly WWE.com pushes it as a top 8 cell match is just fpalm
> 
> Guys, whats a good Survivor Series event to watch? I was thinking about 2003 for tomorrow mainly for DAT HBK performance, but it's also got Hunter/Goldberg which is vomit-inducing.


2001 and 2002 all day long.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Might try to get in both 2003 and 2004. Think I need to watch the Evolution tag at SS 04 for da project anyway.

And Sono, I reviewed 2001 today, and posted the LONG ASS write up a few pages back. ZERO FEEDBACK.


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

The main event of SvS 01 was one of the first matches I went ahead and watched, so much fun even to this day. For some reason it made me a Jericho fan.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Survivor Series 2004 is rad. Smackdown elimination falls a bit flat b/c it's basically a babyface squash, but that's better b/c the heels suck. Love Christian vs Shelton & the RAW elimination matches. Great stuff.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

That match is :mark:

Csnt wait for the 2005 set to come Thursday I'm going out of town Saturday, but I should be able to get one review in Thursday and 1 or 2 on Friday


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

If you're looking for the best Survivor Series PPVs...depends, are you looking for a great event? Or just great Survivor Series style elimination matches. If its for the latter, 2003 rocks. If its for the former...can't go wrong with 2002. 1996 is also solid. Sid/Shawn is probably their best work together, and of course, Austin/Bret. The Survivor Series matches themselves are decent, too.


----------



## SonoShion (Feb 14, 2012)

Oh, let me check it out H.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Whats Sono doing up here ?

checking out bryan/harper and ryback/cena from last weeks smackdown


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The Primer said:


> JUICE.
> 
> who underrates him? He's the man. I'd wager to say Kidman is a ton more underrated, unfortunately.


Fuck if I know, I just never hear anyone mention him when WCW Cruiserweights are brought up. It's always Mysterio, Ultimo, Malenko, Jericho, Eddie, etc. Not that they don't deserve to be. 



HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Yeah, don't watch HIAC. I used to like it, but I threw it on a few weeks ago, and couldn't get ten minutes in without turning it off. The fact that silly WWE.com pushes it as a top 8 cell match is just fpalm
> 
> Guys, whats a good Survivor Series event to watch? I was thinking about 2003 for tomorrow mainly for DAT HBK performance, but it's also got Hunter/Goldberg which is vomit-inducing.


2007 brah. A double main event loaded with backstory and a Rated R return to boot. I'm sure there's a thing or two on the undercard that will be worth your time too.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Somebody go review SvS 95. It's really good. Opener is the most underrated match in SvS history, Joshi tag is fun, Goldust/Bigelow is good, Michaels/Yokozuna is another very good tag, and Bret/Diesel is an all-time classic.

JUVI AND KIDMAN. I went through their entire series last year, and it was really cool how in their matches, you could see a gradual shift in the alignment of the two without an actual turn happening until the very end. The matches had the same moves for the most part, but the timing of the moves and the mannerisms and gestures those two added in those matches make them great.

LIZMARK JR! Does he have anything good?


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Oh I love me some Juvi/Kidman WW3 '98. So glad that made the Wrestling's Highest Flyers set.

I think the only Lizmark Jr. match I've ever seen was the 6-man he was involved in at BATB '97. As a kid that match fucking BLEW MY MIND. These days, it's still pretty damn cool.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Good suggestions guys. Going with 2003 and hopefully 2004 tomorrow. Then 2007 and 1995 or 96 on Friday or Saturday. Need to work 2005 in just to see Trips/Flair and the Raw/Smackdown match.


----------



## SonoShion (Feb 14, 2012)

It won't do any harm to discuss WWE Wrestling once in a while Naitch. Finished RAW 2004 and starting to rewatch Smackdown midway 2002 when Lesnar takes over, started off with the July25 GOAT episode.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Good suggestions guys. Going with 2003 and hopefully 2004 tomorrow. Then 2007 and 1995 or 96 on Friday or Saturday. Need to work 2005 in just to see Trips/Flair and the Raw/Smackdown match.


trips/flair :mark:



SonoShion said:


> It won't do any harm to discuss WWE Wrestling once in a while Naitch. Finished RAW 2004 and starting to rewatch Smackdown midway 2002 when Lesnar takes over, started off with the July25 GOAT episode.


Good stuff boss, would like to hear about raw 2004, especially your kind words for evolution flair3) and those tv matches


bryan/harper was very good, better than punk raw

cena/ryback was also very good, started off a bit slow but picked up well


----------



## SonoShion (Feb 14, 2012)

I posted a little write up of the first half of 2004 in here a couple months back but I can't be arsed to look for it now. I might do another one for the complete year in the next couple days.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Lizmark Jr. is a really forgettable lucha cat from the WCW talent pool, tbhayley.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Oh my goodness, I was listening to A Tribe Called Quest while studying for an exam, and then suddenly a horrible Lady Gaga ad on Spotify ruined the vibe. :HHH unk6 :henry1

Survivor Series 2011 is also worth a watch. I know some people here consider it overrated, but that PPV will always have my heart. The last time that SvS felt like a big four. Two historic events on one PPV. :lenny

NORMAN SMILEY!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That show felt big? TLC 2011 felt like it had stronger build than that show did.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Who are you to doubt the GOAT? :rock

NORMAN SMILEY! His hardcore title run was hilarious. Smiley/Knobs rules. Norman is an example of what happens when you allow a jobber to have free reign and build a character with that opportunity.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Smiley's best match in that hardcore title sprint was the classic everyone jumps to vs Funk @ Spring Stampede '00.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Most underrated performer ever, anyone?

All this Norman Smiley talk got me thinking about it.

I'll have to think about my choice, but Smiley would definitely be a candidate. He only got over with the screaming gimmick, but was actually a hell of a wrestler.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I think Doink The Clown (Matt Borne) will be always be my go-to pick for that, simply because of the credit he doesn't get because of being associated with the gimmick. A few of us in here know and understand his greatness as an in-ring performer and character portrayer as a heel in the early to mid 90s, but the general audience obviously doesn't see that.

I've always enjoyed Fatu (Rikishi) in the '90s before he started shaking his ass and wearing thongs. Such a great bumper and one of those tough Samoan workers.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Yeah, a lot of good workers often get saddled with comedy gimmicks...what a shame. Heel Doink was pretty awesome.

I think ultimately I'll have to go with my man La Parka. Most WCW casual fans will say "wasn't he that guy in the skull suit who played air guitar with a chair?" He was a fucking great worker.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

By the way, which is the best Jericho/Rey match? Is that Bash 2009 or something else?

Also, is Jericho/Michaels Unforgiven 2008 worth a watch?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

La Parka and Doink rule. Mortis/Kanyon is my pick for most underrated.

Bash 09 is their best match, but if you have the time, go chronologically through their entire 09 series. It makes the Bash match that much better. Smackdown 2009 :lenny. Until Undertaker ruined everything.

I really like the Unforgiven 2008 match, but Jericho/HBK is my favorite feud of all-time so I am very biased. Other folks here think it's the weakest of their PPV matches and pretty dull.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

OK, what matches are involved in said 2009 Rey/Jericho series? I only know of the Bash match.

Just watched the Jericho/HBK ladder match from No Mercy. I'm rewatching Benoit/Jericho from the 2001 Rumble right now just to make sure, but the No Mercy ladder match might be the best ladder match I've ever seen (solely ladder, not counting TLC). For a 1v1 ladder match, that has to be the HBK/Taker HIAC of ladder matches. I thought their creative use of the ladder made it the ladder itself a star in the match. Almost everything they did revolved around it, which made it FEEL like a ladder match. One gripe I have about such stipulations today is that its a match that HAPPENS to feature said stipulation. Like Bryan vs Orton was just a regular no DQ match that had a HIAC around it. It wasn't a true HIAC like Taker/HBK. The No Mercy ladder match was fantastic for that very reason. Plus, Jericho's fall from the ladder onto the floor right on his legs looked ungodly painful. There are way too many cool ladder spots to go through, but the video package at the beginning made me really want to see the match. The match itself, I thought, had some great drama and very solid work. However, it never felt like a spot fest or anything. Every use of the ladder made sense, in context to what was going on, whether it be Jericho kicking the side into Shawn's face after the Figure 4 or Shawn flat out chucking the ladder straight down at Jericho on the outside. Great stuff, I gave it a full *****. Enjoyed it WAY more than the Razor/Shawn ladder match.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

KO their 09 bash match was epic. If it wasn't for HBK/Taker, Jericho/Mysterio bash 09 would be MOTY for me .


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Thanks doom. I'll give it a watch, though if someone could let me know the order their series goes in, I'd appreciate it.

Upon rewatch of Benoit/Jericho Rumble ladder match, I've concluded that the HBK/Jericho ladder match is the best ladder match I've ever seen. I just didn't feel as into Benoit/Jericho to the same degree I did HBK/Jericho. Benoit/Jericho is still very good, though.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The No Mercy Ladder match is pretty bossy, yes (see what I did there?), but I think their match at Judgment Day '08 is even better. I'm in the minority in that opinion, but I have them at **** 1/2 and **** 1/4. JD is such a wonderful piece of storytelling, character work, and mindfucking psychology.

The Rey/Jericho '09 series consists of Judgment Day, Extreme Rules (No Holds Barred), and The Bash (Mask vs. Title). The Bash is often heralded as the best encounter, but it's oddly the one I've yet to see. Judgment Day is a fun *** 1/2 while Extreme Rules has a ridiculously great finishing stretch that pulls it up to ****. Oh the many things you can do with a steel chair.  Unsure if hey had any TV matches, who knows.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I remember then having a good match on the commercial free RAW and one or two good SD matches.

JD 08 match is boss.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

What was up with the crowd on RAW for the main event? They were either popping huge or dead silent for both the match and the Wyatts vs. Shield tease. It was weird hearing nothing and then hearing the entire arena going crazy. Maybe it's just me :side:


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

Jericho vs Rey from The Bash of 09 is a cure for insomnia. Don't hate me cause I'm different. :rko2


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

Here's a review for St. Valentine's Day Massacre that I wrote a month or so ago. 



Spoiler: WWF St. Valentine's Day Massacre 1999 review



*WWF St. Valentine’s Day Massacre 1999 review​*
*Match 1: Goldust vs. Bluedust 1/4*
Bluedust, also known as Blue Meanie has been causing trouble for Goldust in some weird ways. Early on, Bluedust wastes time by walking away from the ring. Bluedust wastes more time while holding Goldust’s leg. Goldust gives Meanie a wedgie with his all too revealing attire and then spanks him. He hits his finisher and that’s it after like 2 minutes. Then he sets Meanie up in the corner and kicks him in the nuts. Terrible. All of it. What a crappy opener. It was played mostly for laughs I guess.

*Match 2: Hardcore Championship : Al Snow vs. Bob Holly ***
The title is vacant because Road Dogg got injured. For context, on the previous Raw, Snow had a hardcore match with himself and then fellow JOB Squad member, Bob Holly came out to answer his challenge. They start to brawl straight away and head outside, Holly smashes what are apparently floor tiles over Snow’s head. They brawl on the road and areas surrounding the arena. They come across more items like fencing and barb wire and wheelbarrows and head down to a river bank. They both end up in the river briefly. Holly almost takes out the cameraman as a stick is bounced off Snow’s back. Holly wraps Snow up in some chain link fencing and pins him to become Hardcore champion. Alright. That was a total clusterfuck of a match. Even by hardcore standards, that was pretty out there. It was entertaining though. Holly gets a nice reaction as he heads back to the ring for his title belt too. 

*Match 3: Big Boss Man vs. Mideon 1/2*
Early on Boss Man grabs a steel chair and misses the shot on Mideon and Mideon starts biting Boss Man’s hands. They fight in the ring for a while and this is not good. The crowd starts chanting ‘boring’. Boss Man locks in a full nelson that Mideon counters into a suplex. There’s a double clothesline and they fight back to their feet and Boss man hits his Boss Man Slam finisher for the win. Well that sucked. The ministry comes out followed by The Undertaker who watches as they dismantle Boss Man. Viscera hits a couple of splashes and they drag Boss Man away. That was the most interesting part of all of this. Though knowing that it leads to that Wrestlemania HIAC match, it’s really not that interesting after all.

*Match 4: Tag Team Championship: Mark Henry & D-Lo Brown vs. Owen Hart & Jeff Jarrett *1/2*
D-lo and Henry now have Ivory to counter Debra’s distractions and such at ring side. Henry’s in control for a while and then Jarrett and Owen take over, keeping D-Lo in their corner. They hold D-Lo down for a while until finally as Owen is punching him in the corner, he comes out with a big powerbomb. Both get a tag and Henry comes in to take care of business but runs into a turnbuckle. D-Lo comes back with dropkicks and he goes up for the Lo-down when Debra distracts him and the ref. Owen hits Henry in the back of the knee with a guitar, Jarrett locks in the figure-four and Henry taps. This was an okay match, pretty slow though and the crowd didn’t really get into it very much either. After the match Ivory rips at Debra’s jacket. The men pull them apart. The crowd enjoyed that.

*Match 5: Intercontinental Championship: Val Venis vs. Ken Shamrock *1/2*
Billy Gunn is the special guest ref. Val enters with Shamrock’s sister. They each swap control back and forth for about 5 minutes and Gunn is quite slow to get into counting positions and then complains about his shoulder. Val works Shamrock’s back for a couple of minutes. Pretty dull so far. Val applies a headlock and yells at Billy Gunn to ask him. Gunn replies with ‘Ask what?!’. This is kinda weird because Val Venis is pretty much the face here as far as I can remember (I took a couple of weeks break from watching 1999 WWF so my memory of recent events might be hazy) yet he has been in control of pretty much the whole match. As a result of that I think, the crowd just isn’t into this. Gunn makes very slow counts and Shamrock is getting pissed off. Things are picking up now as a few more pins are poorly counted by Gunn. They are trading moves and pins and Shamrock is firing up and he locks in the ankle lock. Ryan Shamrock helps Val get to the ropes. Ken gets upset with her and she slaps him. Gunn tries to break things up and Ken pushes him. Gunn doesn’t like that so he hits him and throws him into the ring and very quickly counts a roll up and Venis is the new IC champion. The last few minutes of that were entertaining, but the rest of the match was pretty slow and there was a lot of time wasting. Could have been a lot better for the time they got. A lot better. At least Billy Gunn is over.

*Match 6: Triple H & X-Pac vs. Chyna & Kane ***1/4*
Each person is being tagged in including Chyna who is getting some offense in on X-Pac and Triple H. Meanwhile, Shane is being super annoying on commentary, at one point X-Pac bowls him over though. Kane and Chyna take turns wearing X-Pac down as Shane eggs them on. Chyna has a chin lock and the crowd is starting to get really into it as he makes it out and tags in Triple H and he and Chyna really start taking it to each other. Kane starts beating him up on the outside though and X-Pac hits a bronco buster on Chyna. Shane runs in and attacks X-Pac who chases him away. Triple H has Chyna set up for a pedigree but Kane comes in and chokeslams Triple H. He drags Chyna over to cover him for the win. That was actually a really fun match and the crowd finally had something to really get into. They were pretty hot for all of this and it was good. Very interesting to see Chyna in the match and really holding her own against the guys too.

*Match 7: WWF Championship: Last Man Standing: Mankind (c) vs. The Rock ****1/2*
The Rock attacked Mankind earlier on Heat and injured Mankind’s knee. Things start out innocently enough in the ring until Mankind brings the title belt into play. They start brawling up the entrance way and Mankind piledrives The Rock through a table. They head back to the ring and Mankind goes for a People’s Elbow! But The Rock rolls out of the way. The Rock starts talking trash on commentary and Mankind hits the elbow from the apron on Rock who is draped on the edge of the table and then brings some steps into the ring. The Rock kicks them into his face though and takes control of the match again taking a chair to Mankind’s knee. Mankind moves out of the way of a chair swing to the head, the chair bounces of the rope and back into The Rock’s face. That was hilarious. Mankind hits a swinging neckbreaker on the outside. They’re both pretty beat up now. They’re on the announce table, Mankind going for a piledriver and The Rock backdrops him off and Mankind lands extremely awkwardly and painfully. Jesus Christ. The Rock drops the stairs on him from the ring. Then he hits a People’s Elbow (or Corporate Elbow) and The Rock starts singing the Heartbreak/Smackdown hotel song. Mankind gets the Mandible claw on and the ref gets knocked out of the ring. Mankind tries to force the refs count but it doesn’t work, The Rock hits a low blow and a DDT. The Rock misses wildly with a chair and Mankind plants him on it with a DDT. The Rock barely makes it. Mankind has Socko and locks in the Mandible claw but The Rock turns it into a Rock Bottom. They both get up, grab chairs and hit eachother in the head simultaneously. Neither of them make the 10-count. It’s a draw. 

The crowd isn’t happy. EMTs are out with stretchers and neck braces. They get wheeled out into ambulances. I enjoyed that match a lot, I think it’s great. The finish is a tad funky but I’m okay with it. It was a great war throughout with both men giving everything and in the end they technically couldn’t beat each other. It wasn’t a match filled with memorable big spots. It was just an excellent story being told.

*Match 8: Steel Cage: Stone Cold Steve Austin vs. Mr. McMahon ***1/2*
Vince takes his time getting into the cage, continuously making him wait. So Austin chases him but McMahon runs in and blocks Austin’s entrance. Austin tries climbing but Vince still blocks him and Austin falls off hurting his knee. But he’s faking it and McMahon has come out of the cage and is finally getting beat up by Austin. The match hasn’t started yet though. They brawl into the crowd and back out to ringside. Vince tries climbing into the cage to get away from Austin but he won’t let him. They both climb the cage on the announce table side. Austin bounces McMahon’s head off the cage and Vince goes flying back through the table, his back landing right on the edge. Sick spot (I remember them talking about this on the old McMahon DVD) because of the way he lands. He could have legitimately broken something there. They want to end it but Austin is having none of it. He goes after McMahon and throws him into the side of the cage off the stretcher. He puts him into the cage and finally, after about 15 minutes the match is starting. Austin takes him out with some elbows and goes to leave the cage but McMahon flips him off, so Austin goes back in to beat him down some more. Vince manages to kick Austin below the belt and starts climbing out but Austin throws him back in. McMahon gets thrown against the side of the cage and is bleeding. McMahon gives him the double fingers. Austin toys with him some more and then nails McMahon with a stunner. Suddenly Paul Wight enters through the ring floor, he throws Stone Cold at the side of the cage but the cage wall swings open and Austin drops down and wins the title shot at Wrestlemania. Doesn’t seem like the most successful debut for the Big Show. All of that was pretty entertaining. The match itself in the cage was not particularly good though. Just an extended squash match really. But the whole thing together is pretty good and serves as the payoff that everybody wanted to see. Austin finally got to beat the shit out of McMahon. Good stuff.

Overall, I will say this is decent PPV. Unfortunately it’s severely hurt by the first hour and a half of the show being terrible and dragging on and on. There was nothing good there aside from the hardcore match. Only the final 3 matches were actually worth watching. In saying that, the second half of the show is actually quite fun and moves along at a great pace. It’s a shame that a great main event level of the card is hurt so much by the undercard just being so boring. I’ll give it a *6/10*, a decent PPV.


I've been pretty busy lately and never bothered to post this. I also have slowed down a lot on my '90s Raw viewing schedule. I'm up to the final Raw prior to Wrestlemania 15 and watching it now. Just saw the Austin beer bath segment. It's nice to finally see all these classic moments you see in highlight reels all the time in their original context. Pretty entertaining. Anyway, I will most likely be watching WM at some point this weekend.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> I wish I saw this ahead of time! I ordered the "Best HIAC Matches" DVD for that Orton/Taker match. Do you know if that DVD is any good?


If you like the HIAC gimmick, then definitely.



SonoShion said:


> I posted a little write up of the first half of 2004 in here a couple months back but I can't be arsed to look for it now. I might do another one for the complete year in the next couple days.


RAW 2004 - THE GOAT!



funnyfaces1 said:


> Oh my goodness, I was listening to A Tribe Called Quest while studying for an exam, and then suddenly a horrible Lady Gaga ad on Spotify ruined the vibe. :HHH unk6 :henry1


lol, I press space twice quickly during commercial so it plays in silence.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

My go to guys for most underrated workers (by the general public, not in here) are Tajiri and Kidman. Both guys are just absolutely phenomenal workers who don't receive near the recognition by most wrestling fans. There seriously isn't a time I'm not game for a Tajiri match, I could watch him unleash those stiff kicks on dudes heads all freaking day. GOOD LORD.

I think the way guys get underrated is, they have a body of really really good and great matches a mile long, but they never have those 2-3 matches that are really really well known and that keeps most people from recognizing them. If you are consistently putting out matches week in and week out that get between *** and ***3/4 but never have that ****1/2 match, people end up sleeping on you it seems. I think that's the case with Tajiri and Kidman, along with the fact they were just tossed in with the Cruiserweight pile and not given a lot of higher profile feuds.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

On the discussion on the lst page about underrated workers: I couldn't possibly name a definitive _most_ underrated but fuck me sideways, I could give a list of 50+ workers that need more love and recognition. BLITZKRIEG. TAKA. ERNEST MILLER. GUIDO. SUPER CRAZY. KNOX. KID KASH. NOBLE. 

I'd actually love to find a logical and thorough way/process of finding underrated workers.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Oh my goodness, I was listening to A Tribe Called Quest while studying for an exam, and then suddenly a horrible Lady Gaga ad on Spotify ruined the vibe. :HHH unk6 :henry1
> 
> Survivor Series 2011 is also worth a watch. I know some people here consider it overrated, but that PPV will always have my heart. The last time that SvS felt like a big four. Two historic events on one PPV. :lenny
> 
> NORMAN SMILEY!


Agreed.

Dont really see SS 11 as overrated either. It gets shitted on to getting so-so praise to some folks like me and you saying it was good. The build wasn't all that great but the actual event was indeed the last good SS we've had so far. I dont care what anyone says Rocks return, good SS Tag, Hot Crowd, start of Punks reign with a good bout with Alberto, and if nothing else FINK beign on the show makes it >>>>>. Come on now. The show was fun. And yes it felt big, despite the shit build. Especially on this forum. People were hyped that night.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

FLUX said:


> On the discussion on the lst page about underrated workers: I couldn't possibly name a definitive _most_ underrated but fuck me sideways, I could give a list of 100+ workers that need more love and recognition. BLITZKRIEG. TAKA. ERNEST MILLER. GUIDO. SUPER CRAZY. KNOX. KID KASH. NOBLE.
> 
> I'd actually love to find a logical and thorough way/process of finding underrated workers.


If someone could send me a load of BLITZKRIEG on disc ill be a happy man 



LilOlMe said:


> I wish I saw this ahead of time! I ordered the "Best HIAC Matches" DVD for that Orton/Taker match. Do you know if that DVD is any good?


One of the GOAT DVD's............but that match is slightly edited in regards to when Taker is choking Orton, there is a different camera angle (far away), so maybe get the Armageddon 2005 DVD too to see it how it was live


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Clint Eastwood said:


> One of the GOAT DVD's............but that match is slightly edited in regards to when Taker is choking Orton, there is a different camera angle (far away), so maybe get the Armageddon 2005 DVD too to see it how it was live


Damn, I forgot WWE and their stupid choking censorship since the Benoit tragedy. (I really need to change my name since it coincides with this shit too much )

What surprises me is that now I think about it, Orton used some wire to choke HHH out in their last man standing match which took place a few months after.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> My go to guys for most underrated workers (by the general public, not in here) are Tajiri and Kidman. Both guys are just absolutely phenomenal workers who don't receive near the recognition by most wrestling fans. There seriously isn't a time I'm not game for a Tajiri match, I could watch him unleash those stiff kicks on dudes heads all freaking day. GOOD LORD.
> 
> I think the way guys get underrated is, they have a body of really really good and great matches a mile long, but they never have those 2-3 matches that are really really well known and that keeps most people from recognizing them. If you are consistently putting out matches week in and week out that get between *** and ***3/4 but never have that ****1/2 match, people end up sleeping on you it seems. I think that's the case with Tajiri and Kidman, along with the fact they were just tossed in with the Cruiserweight pile and not given a lot of higher profile feuds.


That entire last paragraph reminds me a lot of a certain someone... :adr



FLUX said:


> On the discussion on the lst page about underrated workers: I couldn't possibly name a definitive _most_ underrated but fuck me sideways, I could give a list of 50+ workers that need more love and recognition. BLITZKRIEG. TAKA. ERNEST MILLER. GUIDO. SUPER CRAZY. KNOX. KID KASH. NOBLE.
> 
> I'd actually love to find a logical and thorough way/process of finding underrated workers.


JESUS CHRIST James Gibson. How did I forget that guy? Yeah that's definitely my number 1. An excellent all-around workers and seller, but to truly see it you're gonna have to go deeper than his WWE work.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Damn, I forgot WWE and their stupid choking censorship since the Benoit tragedy. (I really need to change my name since it coincides with this shit too much )
> 
> What surprises me is that now I think about it, Orton used some wire to choke HHH out in their last man standing match which took place a few months after.


Thinking about it, it was on Taker's Tombstone DVD set where I saw it edited  So im not 100% sure on the one on the HIAC set...


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Today marks the 8th anniversary of Eddie Guerrero's death, so for anyone who's gonna ask what they should watch today, just pop in some Latino Heat. Celebrate the life of a legend. :eddie


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Y'all watch Eddie/Rey 6/23/05 all day in honor of *Latino Heat.*


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> That entire last paragraph reminds me a lot of a certain someone... :adr
> 
> 
> JESUS CHRIST James Gibson. How did I forget that guy? Yeah that's definitely my number 1. An excellent all-around workers and seller, but to truly see it you're gonna have to go deeper than his WWE work.



I wrote that entire paragraph with ADR, Sheamus, and Cody Rhodes in mind, so that would make sense:side:

I think ADR had an amazing match with Ziggler at Payback, but it's a damn shame it's not seen as a classic by people outside of this thread. Maybe if he does it with Cena at a Big 4 PPV like Survivor Series he will get the proper recognition,


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Been meaning to watch WM20 with Eddie and Kurt for a while, might as well do it today since it's the anniversary.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Been meaning to watch WM20 with Eddie and Kurt for a while, might as well do it today since it's the anniversary.




That ones okay, not as good as it should have been. The 2/3 Falls in 2004 and the #1 Contenders match in 2005, both on Smackdown, are where it's at for Angle/Eddie matches. Don't bother with the Lumberjack match unless you feel like being heartbroken and saddened.

I do dig the whole boot gimmick Eddie did at WM 20. Fit perfectly with his character.

For the Eddie/Angle series:

WM 20: ***1/2
SS: **1/4
2/3 Falls: ****1/4
#1 Cont.: ****1/4
Lumberjack: *1/2


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I've already seen them all but it's been so long with WM20 that I need a refresher.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Wm 20 match is fun... 



Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I wish someone could make a set of all Eddie Guerrerp stuff from 2003-2005. It would be really cool to watch him morph from sneaky little shit heel to underdog baby face. Then from beloved underdog baby face into the sadistic, callous, narcissistic, malevolent heel he became in the Rey feud. His heel turn in 2005 was a work of freaking performance art that kids in acting school would envy. He changes all his mannerisms and his ring work to fit that character PERFECTLY. One of the best and possibly my personal favorite (after late 80's Rick Rude) heel characters WWE has ever had.

My set of 2005 PPV's should be in today, adding in the Viva La Raza set and the biggest little man set, I now own the entire Eddie/Rey 2005 feud on DVD :mark:


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Just watched Mysterio vs. Taker from SD 4/4/03 and I think I can safely say it's better than any of their late 09/early 2010 clashes. Unbelievably fun five minute sprint. Theres just a feeling in the air for an upset, Rey throws absolute heymakers knowing that he can't piss around, and Taker is just Taker. Extremely rough Last Ride for Rey as well, looks nasty. Awesome stuff.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

After ATF's countdown there's no way I couldn't give the Mysterio/Guerrero feud a whirl, especially seeing I haven't seen it in full since it aired:

*1)* Eddie Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio Smackdown 23/06/05
*2)* Eddie Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio Summerslam 2005
*3)* Eddie Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio Smackdown 09/09/2005
*4)* Eddie Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio Judgment Day 2005
*5)* Eddie Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio Wrestlemania 21
*6)* Eddie Guererro Vs Rey Mysterio Great American Bash 2005



~ WM is messy at times but it's easily chalked to the kayfabe reality of unco-operative wrestling (same goes for a couple spots in the Summerslam match). I quite enjoyed this, surprisingly, considering I've seen others be quite low on this.

~ The chairshot that ended the Judgment Day match was fucking nasty

~The criticisms for GAB is certainly evident, and I can see people disliking the storyline continuity, but it's still relatively good and the best thing on that card by a margin, from what I recall. 

~The backbody drop botch that goes nasty in the ladder match is such a great and fitting moment to the storyline of just how sacrificial Rey would be to ensure Dominic wouldn't go to Eddie. Of course the ending is now infamous for Eddie's tirade on Vickie blowing her cue but I think the improvised change added to the match in that it allowed Rey one more shot at outdoing Eddie before he needed the aid of someone else.

~ It's almost fitting that the two Smackdown matches were so well put together. Weekly shows that "shouldn't matter", relatively speaking in the greater scheme, were the batting grounds for Eddie and Rey to continually knock the ball out the park. Week in and week out, even not against each other, these guys just could not do any wrong.



Rey's enjoyed a hell of a career, if I'm honest. Even at this point he's had (at least, considering I haven't dipped too far into either guys' Mexican material) a decade of being great. When you factor in the subsequent years (and allow for injury) the total comes to 16 years of consistent goodness. Of course it's reaching to say Eddie would hold the same continuity, but I don't think it's reaching beyond much stretch of the truth. Those are very long "peaks" for any wrestler and something that should catalyse discussion for just how great these two are as workers. I've got the money for the Goodhelmet Eddie comp kept aside (and I'm just waiting to officially be finished with my degree to order) so it's time I note just how consistent Eddie's been, but Rey on Smackdown has been a fierce force of nature to be reckoned with. I haven't watched nearly enough wrestling to argue contendership for greatest ever but there's easily space there for argument over what I've seen for a placing in the top pool. 

Regardless, there's not a guy in the 2000s I _enjoy_ more than Eddie and there aren't many in the entire sport I'd have above him (save one or two). His work in 2005 was pretty much perfect.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

There are a few people who might wet themselves when they see what match will be taking place on NXT next week.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> There are a few people who might wet themselves when they see what match will be taking place on NXT next week.





Spoiler: NXT



As in *NEVILLE/ZAYN?* :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Didnt get to comment a few pgs ago


You know Michaels/Jericho Ladder is one of the few Michaels big-time matches Ive never gushed over. Its ok but I never saw the ****1/4+( I think someone in here gave it *****, FF I think ?) it gets or it being most fans MOTY when matches like hbk/flair, taker/edge and a few TV matches are vastly superior. The match structure is a bit odd as well, :lmao why in a hate-fueled ladder match is there chain-wrestling for the first 10-15 mins ? and then Y2J takes some stupid bumb ( Didnt he almost break his leg/arm ?) in one fall ?. And also I understand he didnt want a title run because he wanted to shed the "Asshole" rep, but that match is one of the few times HBK 00 should have won.

I have never seen benoit/y2j so I will reserve my judgement, but I prob will still think hbk/razor is the GOAT ladder match to date


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

ATF said:


> Spoiler: NXT
> 
> 
> 
> As in *NEVILLE/ZAYN?* :mark:


Well, there's that. But I was referring to:



Spoiler: EVEN BETTER



Regal/Cesaro



edit Jericho outperformed Michaels pretty badly in that match imo. I still enjoy it, but also am a bit confused why the match begins the way it did. I enjoyed their Unsanctioned match way more.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

KO Bossy said:


> OK, what matches are involved in said 2009 Rey/Jericho series? I only know of the Bash match.


Judgment Day - *** 3/4
Extreme Rules (No Holds Barred) - **** 1/4
The Bash (Mask vs Title) - **** 1/2

I loved the series. There was probably a Smackdown match or two in there as well. Definitely tag matches anyway.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Rey/Jericho :mark:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Rey/Jericho 2009 feud was the wrestling Invader Zim for me - I was heartbroken when it was done.

INVADER ZIM :mark:


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

JESUS CHRIST at both of those NXT matches. Wow...

--------------------

Just made an order from Highspots and got Rebellion 2001, No Mercy 2006, and Cyber Sunday 2007 all for around $20. Everyone should take advantage of this sale, as they have a bunch of 2005-2007 PPVs marked down for clearance (assuming that you're here in the US):










www.highspots.com


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

I know that HBK/Razor kind of set the standard for ladder matches, and as such will always be significant, but looking back...the stuff they're doing just feels so elementary and watching it now, I never get that feeling of investment where I'm at the edge of my seat, wondering who will win. I think at the time, it probably felt incredible, but the times have changed and to me it doesn't really hold up that well.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah, when watching that match you just need to keep it in its context. At the time, it was pretty groundbreaking. Sure, it doesn't have all the high spots that today's ladder matches have, as they're constantly trying to revolutionize it and come up with new ways to entertain without recycling the same old spots. Keeping that in mind, it's a really awesome match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I prefer the house show match prior to WM that's available online (I uploaded it once upon a time so it should be around somewhere lol) to the actual WM match. Only thing it was missing was the splash I think, and eh, it's just not that impressive anymore any way . 

Also still prefer their SS 95 ladder rematch too.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I think I'm in a very small group of people that I think Sheamus/Jomo is the greatest singles ladder match. Nicely done leg work from Sheamus which Jomo not only sells magnificently but also incorporates into his offense and defense. Extremely well worked and needs more recognition when taking about the best ladder matches.

I miss John Morrison so much


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

You're not the only one who misses Morrison. :sad:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I miss parts of Morrison. Mainly the Melina part. Only the Melina part. I miss Melina.

Morrison/Sheamus ladder is :mark: though. A top... 3 singles Ladder/TLC match ever though.

OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG I just read the NXT match spoiler for next week :mark:. I CAN FAP TO THAT.

Well since my hosting is currently being a bitch and all my sites are down and I can't work on anything (like setting up a fecking shop), I think I might continue with some 2002 PPV rambles.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I think if there's one person in the whole world of wrestling that I want to return to the WWE, it's him. So many unbelievable matches could be had.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah, both of those NXT matches should be great.

edit Isn't he supposed to come back at some point? I thought he was just taking a break?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

FLUX said:


> I think I'm in a very small group of people that I think Sheamus/Jomo is the greatest singles ladder match. Nicely done leg work from Sheamus which Jomo not only sells magnificently but also incorporates into his offense and defense. Extremely well worked and needs more recognition when taking about the best ladder matches.
> 
> I miss John Morrison so much




My top Singles Ladder matches:

1. Benoit vs Jericho RR 2001
2. HBK vs Razor Summerslam (a good bit better than the WM match IMHO)
3. Eddie vs RVD Raw
4. Sheamus vs JoMo.
5. Taker/Hardy Raw

I badly badly miss JoMo too. He is infinitely more entertaining than hacks like Axel, Big E Langston, Miz, Kofi, etc.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Callamus said:


> I prefer the house show match prior to WM that's available online (I uploaded it once upon a time so it should be around somewhere lol)


Found also in my sig


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

By the way, how GNARLY are those leg submissions Sheamus puts on JoMo using that Ladder in their TLC match? Holy hell that shit was sweet. Morrison so selling throughout that entire match is perfection. You swear his leg is about to freaking fall off by the end of the match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

If only Morrison wrestled like that ALL of the time .

I LOVED the MNM team too. They were fucking SUPER back in 05-06. Melina on the outside was great too, actually ADDED to the match, and more than just SEX APPEAL. They were a great modern 3 person team that gets overlooked because their run wasn't that long and people seem to forget a lot of the SD side of things during the brand split . Shame they broke up mid-06, but they did get back together again at the end for that epic ladder match and then some Hardy Boys matches :mark:. Wish they had kept going and THEY were the major team instead of Morrison and Jiz.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Working on my coursework right now but I think I'll cap off the night by watching some Eddie, possibly Eddie/Bork and all its glory. 

RIP


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Eddie/JBL is a match i may watch if i have time, havn't seen it in.............years


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Eons ago, I had Jericho/Michaels NM at 5 stars, but that has changed. I still love it to death and it's still my favorite feud, but there are some logical fallacies in that ladder match.

Lost in the sea of Rey/Eddie match reviews is the January 2005 match they had. Hideously underrated. Their 2004 match is very good too. Everything they do is good, even if I didn't like the ladder or WM match.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

I bought the Eddie set in the January sales way back earlier this year and still haven't got around to watching it. Maybe one day. For tonight I'll settle for just one match though, I don't have time to watch more than that.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

See I have problems with the "outdated ness " of hbk/razor, holds up extremely well, and the oldness, blueprint match of ladders is what sticks out for me


hbk/razor have sensational chemistry , their TV matches are :mark:

Playing GTA atm, but I just downloaded flair/savage from Zep, bless you for including that flair/perfect promo


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> See I have problems with the "outdated ness " of hbk/razor, holds up extremely well, and the oldness, blueprint match of ladders is what sticks out for me
> 
> 
> hbk/razor have sensational chemistry , their TV matches are :mark:
> ...



Flair vs Savage from Mania 8? If so :mark: :mark:


That match doesn't often get brought up in the "Great Flair matches" discussion, and I think that's an absolute crime. It's tremendous. It's his best WWE match along with that cage match against Hunter. Savage was a brilliant baby face.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Cesaro/Regal upcoming match is gonna rock.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Any UK'ers want the John Morrison DVD for under £3:

www.zavvi.com/dvd/john-morrison-rock-star/10166559.html


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

WrestlingforEverII said:


> Cesaro/Regal upcoming match is gonna rock.


Spoilers pls.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> My go to guys for most underrated workers (by the general public, not in here) are Tajiri and Kidman. Both guys are just absolutely phenomenal workers who don't receive near the recognition by most wrestling fans. There seriously isn't a time I'm not game for a Tajiri match, I could watch him unleash those stiff kicks on dudes heads all freaking day. GOOD LORD.
> 
> I think the way guys get underrated is, they have a body of really really good and great matches a mile long, but they never have those 2-3 matches that are really really well known and that keeps most people from recognizing them. If you are consistently putting out matches week in and week out that get between *** and ***3/4 but never have that ****1/2 match, people end up sleeping on you it seems. *I think that's the case with Tajiri and Kidman, along with the fact they were just tossed in with the Cruiserweight pile and not given a lot of higher profile feuds.*


Agree with all of this, the bolded especially. The great thing about these two though is that they were able to work with the time they were given which is something Tajiri did more so. Case in point, this match:





Tajiri kicking the shit out of Kidman's left arm and great arm-work all-around throughout only under 6 minutes. Doesn't get any better than that. 



Twisted14 said:


> Here's a review for St. Valentine's Day Massacre that I wrote a month or so ago.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Great write-up. I enjoyed the St. Valentines Day Massacre PPV. I agree with the undercard being weak but Rock/Mankind along with Austin/McMahon made up for it. HHH/Pac vs Chyna/Kane was also fun and I enjoyed the Hardcore brawl between Al Snow and Hardcore Holly way more than I should have.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

To those of you who bought the Ladder I DVD, did it come with an insert saying what matches are on the DVD? 'Cause I bought it from WWE Shop, and there's a folder for the insert, yet no insert!!! So I have to put the DVDs in to know what matches are on which DVD.

Ditto for the John Cena Experience DVD. I know you guys said that that DVD is booty, but there were a couple of matches on there that I wanted, and it was really cheap, so....

Have any of you guys gotten something from WWE Shop and there was no insert and no match listing, even if there was a folder part?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> To those of you who bought the Ladder I DVD, did it come with an insert saying what matches are on the DVD? 'Cause I bought it from WWE Shop, and there's a folder for the insert, yet no insert!!! So I have to put the DVDs in to know what matches are on which DVD.
> 
> Ditto for the John Cena Experience DVD. I know you guys said that that DVD is booty, but there were a couple of matches on there that I wanted, and it was really cheap, so....
> 
> Have any of you guys gotten something from WWE Shop and there was no insert and no match listing, even if there was a folder part?


Yeah its the same for everybody, alot of DVD sets don't come with the inserts, its a real pain in the ass. Thanks WWE. :cussin:


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Thanks for answering. Do they not come with them, even when there's a folder pocket part for them?

It's weird because every WWE DVD I've ordered from amazon.com comes with them, or comes with the matches printed right on the box. I'm curious if those same DVDS I got from WWE Shop would have the same problem from amazon. 




KO Bossy said:


> I know that HBK/Razor kind of set the standard for ladder matches, and as such will always be significant, but looking back...the stuff they're doing just feels so elementary and watching it now, I never get that feeling of investment where I'm at the edge of my seat, wondering who will win. I think at the time, it probably felt incredible, but the times have changed and to me it doesn't really hold up that well.


Normally I'd agree with this, but I just re-watched Razor/HBK from SS '95, and was surprised by how much I thought it was a lesser match than WM (when I was a kid, I thought the opposite was true, though I loved them both). It evolved much more in that time and they did more stuff in that second match, but I think that's part of the reason why I thought WM was better. The second one felt too calculated, like "we're gonna try to get all of this in there." Almost like a bullet point list like ok "Shawn's knee", "both scrambling at the same time", "high flying moves", etc. It just felt inorganic to me.

At the same time it was really fun, so I'd still rate it around ****, but the first one seemed much more natural to me.

I probably would enjoy a calculated attempt much more if I hadn't had seen those two do that WM match first. I'm sure if two other wrestlers followed that same format and had that exact same SS match, I'd probably rate it much higher.


Good post:


The Lady Killer said:


> Yeah, when watching that match you just need to keep it in its context. At the time, it was pretty groundbreaking. Sure, it doesn't have all the high spots that today's ladder matches have, as they're constantly trying to revolutionize it and come up with new ways to entertain without recycling the same old spots. Keeping that in mind, it's a really awesome match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I still don't understand why they stopped making them. Makes no fucking sense to not include what's on the fecking discs lol. Sucks when there isn't one, and I hate the ones with the match listings on the back of the cover so you either have to take the cover out of the case or remove the discs and look under the case. Fucking plebs.


----------



## MrJohnSherry (Jan 3, 2012)

I bought the Blu-Ray version of the MITB anthology and it comes with an insert, as well as it being printed on the back on the cover. I have noticed, how they cut out Benoits entrance and all the commentary mentioning his name in the first match. Sounds very strange.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

LilOlMe said:


> Normally I'd agree with this, but I just re-watched Razor/HBK from SS '95, and was surprised by how much I thought it was a lesser match than WM (when I was a kid, I thought the opposite was true, though I loved them both). It evolved much more in that time and they did more stuff in that second match, but I think that's part of the reason why I thought WM was better. The second one felt too calculated, like "we're gonna try to get all of this in there." Almost like a bullet point list like ok "Shawn's knee", "both scrambling at the same time", "high flying moves", etc. It just felt inorganic to me.
> 
> At the same time it was really fun, so I'd still rate it around ****, but the first one seemed much more natural to me.
> 
> I probably would enjoy a calculated attempt much more if I hadn't had seen those two do that WM match first. I'm sure if two other wrestlers followed that same format and had that exact same SS match, I'd probably rate it much higher.


Isn't that agreeing with me?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

It is now time for another taker post...

2005 ppv rambles start tomorrow :mark:


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

The Lady Killer said:


> Isn't that agreeing with me?


lol, yes, I meant to quote KO Bossy. I just edited it.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Just got my 2005 PPV set in the mail! Gonna attempt to start at New Years Revolution and watch all the way through Armageddon these next few weeks, and post a review for each show. 

Without further ado:

*New Year's Revolution 2005*​
We are hear live in my townhouse with a 4-pack of red bull cranberry, a giant bag of sour patch kids, and my Boxer pup Maclin. Let's kick things off.


Christan and Tomko vs William Regal and Eugene for the Tag Team Titles

-Great opener. Anything involving Christian and Regal can simply not be anything less than stellar. Those two start it off with some quick and crisp mat work before Eugene gets tagged in. Nice short little FIP segment with Eugene before we get a semi-hot tag with Regal. After some nice stiff kicks from the European Mauler Tomko/Christian use some nice sneaky heel tactics to gain the upper hand and proceed to lay a good beat down on Regal. Very solid FIP segment with Regal, including my spot of the match where Christian legit kicks Regal right in the face and breaks his nose :mark: Best part? REGAL DOESNT EVEN FUCKING FLINCH. REGAL IS GOD. Anyways Eugene finally tags in, Hulks up (he's impersonating Hogan for this match) and hits the roll up after injuring his leg for the 1-2-3. I think Eugene might have actually hurt his knee too. Not positive. Either way, fantastic opening bout. 

***1/2

Next up we have a Divas title match 

BUT ITS TRISH STRATUS VS LITA!! The 2 greatest female wrestlers of the modern era squaring off, I'll actually watch this. Plus Lita is, as Cal would say, pretty effin FAP FAP.:mark:

Lita vs Trish Stratus for the WWE Women's Title

-The prestige. The honor. The tradition. The Women's Title! Anyone else with me that they should drop the whole "Divas" monicker and go back to the old strap and Women's belt? I certainly wouldn't mind it, but first they need to find more chicks like Lita and Trish who actually care about having a decent match. AJ and Kaitlyn are the only ladies these days who seem to give a fuck.

Match starts with some nice generic women's brawling. Lita hurts her knee going for the Thesz press onto Trish from the apron. I think Lita hits the ropes harder than some of the guys on the current roster. IM LOOKING AT YOU DEAN AMBROSE. YOU SISSY. Trish keeps working the leg with some respectable selling by Lita. Oh. It's over. Trish rolls Lita up and hits a quick pin. Disappointing.:cuss:

*1/4

Shelton Benjamin vs Maven for the Intercontinental Championship

-Full disclosure, I actually kinda sorta maybe like Shelton. Dude usually was pretty damn entertaining in the ring. Maven, however, can eat a giant bowl of dicks. Fuck Maven.

Wow. Maven cuts the "basic heel 101 promo in a foreign country: make fun of their native language". The crowd was hot so it disguises the fact that his promo was basic and dumb. Thank fucking god Shelton hits him the roll up and ends the match before it even begins. Lots of quick roll ups to end matches so far.

Thank god that's over.

Oh wait it's not, yay, more Shelton and Maven. Oh it's not, Shelton hit the TBone and and wins, again. Some how. That defies logic, why would the match restart? Dumb dumb dumb

DUD

Muhammed Hassan vs Jerry Lawler

-Lawler in his prime is one of the best to ever do it. He throws some of the best punches I've ever seen. That said, Lawler is not in his prime and Hassan is not a good enough worker to carry him to a good match. Having no one on commentary definitely detracted from this as well, as JR accompanied Lawler to ringside. Not much happens. Hassan gives Lawler 4-5 scoop slams in a row, Lawler bails out then comes back in and clothes lines Hassan, then we get rest holds! Lots and lots of rest holds! Imagine all the rest holds from the Wm12 IronMan combined thrown into a 10 minute match that is 8 minutes too long. This sucks. The less said the better. I would love to know what WWE was thinking when they booked this pile of crap. Lawlers punches even look shit. Hassan wins with a finishing move that looks identical to Bray Wyatt's except standing instead of kneeling.

DUD


Kane vs Snitsky

-Ear Hebner in da house! Guess he hadn't been fired yet for stealing WWE Merch and selling it. This match does nothing for me to be perfectly honest. I like Kane a good deal but Snitsky is just the drizzling Shitskies. Maybe they can surprise me. Nice back drop by Kane to the cold hard concrete. Weak looking bow and arrow around the ring post by Shitsky. I'm having a hard time not hitting fast forward. Not that what they are doing is particularly heinous or awful, it's just BORING. And right on cue we have a bear hug by Shitsky. The only human ever capable of keeping me interested in a match with a bear hug is Brock Lesnar. I'm not exactly sure why, but it's probably just how impressive it is to see a man his size straight RAG DOLL opponents, no matter their size. We get a nice little sit up spot suquence where Shitsky repeatedly kicks Kane in the head while Kane keeps sitting up. Then Kane just goes HAM on Shitsky with rights and lefts getting a nice little pop from the crowd. Kane hits the tombstone for the 1-2-3.

This wasn't as bad as my review would have you believe, I just couldn't get into this one for some reason. Mostly because I just wanted it to be over so I could get to the MAIN EVENT.

**

Chris Benoit vs Chris Jericho vs Edge vs Triple H vs Randy Orton vs Batista Elimination Chamber Match

-This is my favorite Chamber match and the only chamber match to make my top 100 WWE matches list. You have my pick as the greatest worker to ever lace up a pair of boots, Chris Benoit. You have the ultimate big match glue guy and a damn good worker and character in his own right, Chris Jericho. We got a kayfave "great" heel at the top of his "game" Triple H. We got the new kid on the block Edge. Plus we have Batista and Randy Orton and the whole Evolution angle devolving as the background story. That is the makings of GREATNESS.

Oh, and the Heartbreak Kid Shawn Michaels is the guest referee :mark:

Benoit and Jericho start out. Always loved the chemistry these two had in the ring. All their matches were excellent, yes Cal even their 2/3 Falls match at Summerslam 

Some solid chain wrestling to start followed by Benoit delivering some of the LOUDEST chops I've ever heard on Jericho. I'm surprised he didn't bust his chest open. I remember in Jericho's book he said the first time he got chopped by Benoit in a match in Japan it was like being doused in a bucket of ice water :lmao

Simply put, Jericho vs Benoit is the best opening 5 minutes in Chamber match history. Usually guys are just stalling and waiting for the first guy to come in, but these guys go full bore and knock the shit out of each other. I approve. They had the makings of a 4+ star match there if it was a straight singles contest.

The Game is the first one to have his door opened. He goes to work on Benoit first, but he's not biased, he's got cans of ass whooping for any customer buying. This is when Jericho was still working nice and stiff and it's nice to see him unload on Triple H's head, pulling no punches. Even though I own the Satans Prison set and have seen every chamber match, I still cringe whenever I see a guy take a high back drop onto that steel outside the ring. That shit has got to SMART.

Benoits busted open by the evil Haitch. One thing I've never understood is how guys in chamber matches will be trying to hit their finisher and another dude breaks it up. Wouldn't that be beneficial to you? Almost every match has multiple cases of this occurring and it makes less and less sense each time I see it. I'll ignore it for the rest of the review but just thought it deserved mentioning.

Edge checks in next. In 2005 Edge was still a great worker and had not let himself to physically. He comes in hard and fast and cleans house. Edge does possibly my least favorite move ever, the slingshot (or catapult for you limeies) to Jericho into the steel and that busts Jericho open. That move is seriously such bullshit and I wish it would be banned forever. No surprise that it's one of the Rocks favorite moves to do and you rarely if ever see guys like Benoit, Eddie, Regal, or Finlay doing it. It's bullshit. I can't say this enough, THE SLINGSHOT IS BULLSHIT. Haitch is bleeding from his immense nose, not sure the cause so it must be hard way.

Orton checks in and immediately goes after The Game-uh. The Game-uh feeds Ortons and bumps around for a while taking a good amount of punishment in the process. But there is one pissed odd Rabid Wolverine he forgot about who locks in the CROSSFACE. The Game-uh starts taunting Orton in the hold, and this fucking Wolverine doesn't like it one bit! SHARPSHOOTER ON THE GAME. RKO TO BENOIT. EDGE GOES FOR THE SPEAR AND HITS MICHAELS! SPEAR TO ORTON! SWEET CHIN MUSIC TO EDGE! LIONSAULT TO EDGE!

EDGE IS ELIMINATED :mark::mark::mark:

That my friends is how you book a fucking chamber match. That was fucking AWESOME. BAH GAWD, WHAT IS BENOIT DOING??! HEADBUTT FROM THE TOP OF THE CHAMBER! The Game gets locked into the Walls AND the Crossface the same time! WILL HE TAP??!!

BATISTA WITH THE SAVE! THE BEAST HAS BEEN UNLEASHED :mark::mark:

Seriously, from this point on this match is just one :mark: moment after another. I love everything about it. Damn near perfection. The Carnage! Jericho gives Hunter a nasty bulldog into the steel and now the GAME is busted wide open. He shows Jericho and Benoit how you fucking blade. None of this pussy paper cut shit were the blood dries in 30 seconds, Hunter hits a fucking GUSHER.

Batista gives Jericho a SPINEBUSTER on top of a fallen Benoit, then eliminates That Rabid Wolverine

BATISTA BOMB TO JERICHO! JERICHO IS ELIMINATED!

We are down to Orton, Haitch, and Batista. We are DEVOLVING. JR informs us that Hunters soul just got slammed into the steel. Ouch. I think. Ortons busted open to! Ahh, the days when 4 out of 6 guys in a chamber match could bleed. I don't care if it makes me a sick weirdo, I think if done in moderation in the proper matches/situations, blood absolutely adds to matches. There is blood in PG movies, I don't get why WWE gets held to a different standard.

RKO TO BATISTA! We are down to just Orton and The Game-uh.

PEDIGREE TO ORTON! HHH WINS THE TITLE!

Obviously I think the world of this match. Still holds up as the greatest chamber match ever

****1/2

This event pretty much blew outside of the opener and main event. Not sure what it would rate on the Cal scale but I can't imagine it being more than 10 or so.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Chamber match speaks for itself, dont know much about the show as a whole



Cactus Jack said:


> Flair vs Savage from Mania 8? If so :mark: :mark:
> That match doesn't often get brought up in the "Great Flair matches" discussion, and I think that's an absolute crime. It's tremendous. It's his best WWE match along with that cage match against Hunter. Savage was a brilliant baby face.


Half way through this and its holding up, Cannot give it the "best flair wwe match" which may be a testament to him

cage hhh
lms hhh
mania hbk
raw perfect

off the top Ive my head are all better


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> Chamber match speaks for itself, dont know much about the show as a whole
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Nah, not in my humblest of opinions. I'll give you the cage match, that's one of my favorite matches period. But I prefer the Savage match to the others you listed. Flair has about 10-15 matches in the WWE that are just a pure joy for me to watch. It's when the real Naitch comes out to play and teach these young kids how to grapple


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah I haven't seen either Flair/HHH matches, so I think Taboo Tuesday will be the first show I watch if indeed the set gets here tomorrow


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Nice review of NYR 05, Cactus Jack. That chamber match was the most brutal of the bunch and exactly what a chamber match should be. Can't say the same about the rest of the show though, which is a recurring theme of 2005. I even hated the opener. Damn that Tomko! Can't wait for RR 05 review. I thought it was a highly overrated PPV, but maybe another watch is needed.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Surivor Series 2003 as a whole - decent show. Opening tag is pretty fun. Brock tapping is kind of strange. The finish foreshadowed the opening of WM XX. You can usually plan on a couple of quick, early eliminations and Bradshaw and A-Train are the cases here. You could tell they were getting ready to push Cena a bit more with the exposure he was getting, and by him getting the winning pinfall here. Benoit doing the "Be a man!" handshake and the end (Y).

Women's title match, Lita vs Molly, was fine. Molly did well working over Lita's surgically repaired neck. Finish was also good - Lita misses her Lita-sault, but Molly hits her Molly-Go-Round lol), but Lita kicks out. A frustrated Molly then exposes the middle turnbuckle, Lita tries to surprise her with a rollup, then Molly drop toe holds Lita into the exposed turnbuckle, getting the win and retaining the title.

I wasn't really keen on Shane/Kane, but I understand the match. The two guys hate for each other really came through here. Bell rings and Shane immediately just lunges himself at Kane, sending them both over the top rope. They brawl along the outside, with each guy getting control for a bit, but Shane gets in a shot with the TV monitor, setting Kane up on the announce table for his elbow drop, which he hits. Kane sets right up, and Shane gets him to follow him through the crowd and into the back. Shane then, after being ahead of Kane, sneaks up behind and attacks him with the Kendo Stick of Doom. He then calls for another ambulance, which he uses to run over Kane, who is a security booth. Shane attempts to get Kane into the ambulance but Kane fights him off and they two brawl back to the arena, and Kane is in full control, throwing Shane off the original ambulance. One of the most brutal moments in the match is Shane opening the back door of the ambulance into Kane's face. Just OUCH. Shane hits his coast to coast of the top of the ambulance. He attempts to get Kane again into the ambulance and nearly gets the second door closed, but Kane blocks the door and pulls Shane in. He then throws Shane out and throws him off the ambulance a ton, hits the Tombstone on the concrete and throws Shane into the ambulance, winning the match. Probably one of the better ambulance matches. ***1/4

Basham Brothers vs Los Guerreros for the Tag Titles is nothing special, for me. Eddie and Chavo are both pretty good, but I can't take the Bashams seriously in their dominatrix gear, and Shaniqua, who is bigger than both Eddie and Chavo :jay. Honestly couldn't wait for this to be over so they'd be off my screen.

Team Austin vs Team Bischoff is pretty great, I think. Put the pencil down for this one and sat back and enjoyed it. This also means that I'm not writing much about it. Orton was doing well I think during this time as the Legend Killer. Really enjoyed him. HBK against Christian, Jericho and Orton is :mark: His first superkick :mark: JR calling it :mark: Finish worked for me. Set up HBK/Batista for Armageddon. 

Taker/Vince is whatever, really. It wasn't so much about the match, which is just Taker beating Vince's ass, but the finish, which sets up Taker returning at WM XX. Vince is wearing that crimson mask about 60 seconds into the match, and does a pretty great job selling Taker's beatdown. Taker introduces the McMahon family jewels to two ringposts, tries to break Vince's ankle, after which he carries Vince to the burial site, where Vince manages to gain control briefly, but Taker ultimately gets him in the grave. Taker goes up to the payloader and a flame comes out of the door, and Kane comes out. He buries Taker alive, giving Vince the win and setting up the return of the Deadman at Mania.

I still can't with Trips/Goldberg. Goldberg was still recovering from the cracked ankle he suffered weeks earlier, so they went with that story. Fine. Goldberg takes out all of Evolution, and at the end he decides he doesn't need the sledgehammer, and spears Trips, hits the sledgehammer and retains the World Title. 

Some of this is a chore to sit through, but I actually liked Taker/Vince and Austin/Bischoff is really great. No star ratings here, because half the card isn't about wrestling, but stories.


----------



## Nuski (Apr 5, 2010)

Reading back, i'm glad i'm not the only that is missing Morrison. He was so entertaining in the ring :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I honestly cannot remember a Morrison match that was bad. He always did something that I liked. Sorta like Ziggler. Those two probably only had two or three matches that I dislike. Why did people dislike Morrison anyways? My dream scenario back in 2009 was for Punk to feud with and retain his title against Undertaker, Batista, and Rey Mysterio, only to put John Morrison over in a ladder match at TLC. I would be so on board with Morrison as champ.

SGT SLOBBER :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

In the mood to watch some 1997 promos. :lmao at the post-SvS promo between DX and Shamrock. :lol at jerky HBK foreshadowing his match with Vince at Mania and Shamrock insulting Chyna. Shamrock was pretty awesome when he lost his mind. Far cry from his promo before Mania where JR introduces him to the crowd. Shamrock and Bret were both terrible in it. Thank you Austin for saving things.

LOL at HBK calling the folks in WCW "fossils" and doing the Flair strut. And they're bullying Michael Cole. LOL at the "Hunter, who wears the pants in your family" sign unk3. This segment is a solid *****1/4*


----------



## Dark Church (Jan 17, 2005)

Due to what today is I threw in the Eddie set. Haven't watched it a while anyway.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Is Judgement Day 2009 any good?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Nice review Hunter, I really dig the Bischoff vs Austin SVS tag, loads and loads of fun.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Snitsky getting called Shitsky made me laugh but also made me shed a little tear 

Fantastic review though, Cactus Jack. Definitely my favourite chamber match, I'm glad you enjoyed it as much as I do/did. I need to rewatch it though. Also, reading HHH's review - also a fantastic one - of SVS 03 made me realise I've never watched the PPV as a whole and the only match I have seen from the event is Shane/Kane. I think the Bischoff/Austin 5v5 is on tap for tonight, then.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

FLUX said:


> Snitsky getting called Shitsky made me laugh but also made me shed a little tear
> 
> Fantastic review though, Cactus Jack. Definitely my favourite chamber match, I'm glad you enjoyed it as much as I do/did. I need to rewatch it though. Also, reading HHH's review - also a fantastic one - of SVS 03 made me realise I've never watched the PPV as a whole and the only match I have seen from the event is Shane/Kane. I think the UNDERTAKER VS MR. MCMAHON is on tap for tonight, then.


FIXED.

I actually fucking love that match and I can not understand why everybody else seems to hate it. It's Vince getting destroyed by the Undertaker, how can you not eat that awesomeness up? Vince's bladejob is fucking INSANE too, one of the more underrated big time bouts out there for sure.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

Vince's blade job was stupid. Undertaker twats him with a punch in the first ten seconds and then all of a sudden Vince is gushing claret all over the fucking shop. 

Was a fun match though, even if the sight of all that blood getting mixed with all the dirt was rather disconcerting.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Vince is goofy as fuck . Maybe that's why I enjoy his matches so fucking much, especially the ballin' Wrestlemania XXII match against the MASTER of goofy overacting; Shawn Michaels.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Why did people dislike Morrison anyways?


He was pretty bad on the mic. But I wouldn't say he was any worse than say, Mysterio or Jeff Hardy.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Vince is goofy as fuck . Maybe that's why I enjoy his matches so fucking much, especially the ballin' Wrestlemania XXII match against the MASTER of goofy overacting; Shawn Michaels.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

That fucking face. CLASSIC.

MATCH WITH HOGAN AT WRESTLEMANIA XIX :mark:. One of the more legit fun matches I've ever seen on a big show, the leg drop off of the ladder was quite insane, the ultimate example of how a match is BOOKED determining how great it is, they did a fantastic job of hiding both Hogan & Vince's limitations. It's not even close to being the best match on the show, but it's better than say.... Kurt Vs Brock.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> That fucking face. CLASSIC.
> 
> MATCH WITH HOGAN AT WRESTLEMANIA XIX :mark:. One of the more legit fun matches I've ever seen on a big show, the leg drop off of the ladder was quite insane, the ultimate example of how a match is BOOKED determining how great it is, they did a fantastic job of hiding both Hogan & Vince's limitations. It's not even close to being the best match on the show, but it's better than say.... Kurt Vs Brock.


Yeah it was pretty fucking entertaining. Not forgetting that awkward Piper run-in towards the end, with the robe. Then he attacks Hogan even though the crowd were utterly confused. :lol

'C'MON JUUUNIOOORRR!'


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Hogan/Vince is pure shite and the one blip on the otherwise GOAT PPV.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

It was such a cool moment with Piper. I don't care if it made fucking ZERO sense in the grand scheme of things and it was random as balls considering these men haven't interacted in over 15 years, but the HOGAN VS PIPER FEUD IS RESURRECTED 20 YEARS LATER HOLY SHIT.

Just a feel good match. Love Hogan's entrance where he grabs the sign from the audience and rips it up. FUCK IT being the seemingly main focus on a show with so much awesomeness though, despite how fun it is.

WRESTLEMANIA XIX OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD

Rey Mysterio Vs Matt Hardy ~ *****
The Undertaker Vs Big Show/A-Train ~ *** 3/4*
Trish Stratus Vs Jazz Vs Victoria ~ *** 1/4*
Team Angle Vs Los Guerreros Vs Chris Benoit/Rhyno ~ **** 1/4*
Shawn Michaels Vs Chris Jericho ~ ******
Triple H Vs Booker T ~ **** 3/4*
Hulk Hogan Vs Vince McMahon ~ **** 1/4*
The Rock Vs Steve Austin ~ ***** 1/2*
Brock Lesnar Vs Kurt Angle ~ *** 3/4*

Maybe not the GOAT PPV anymore in my eyes, but one of the fucking BEST.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Nice review of NYR 05, Cactus Jack. That chamber match was the most brutal of the bunch and exactly what a chamber match should be. Can't say the same about the rest of the show though, which is a recurring theme of 2005. I even hated the opener. Damn that Tomko! Can't wait for RR 05 review. I thought it was a highly overrated PPV, but maybe another watch is needed.


You need to give 2005 on a whole another watch. Unless you'll go in with the same bias intending to thrash it like you always do. It boggles my mind how anyone can seriously say 2012 was better than 2005, specially TV stuff. Even for a Punk fan, there was absolutely nothing else on the show to enjoy except him.



Corporate KingOfKings said:


> That fucking face. CLASSIC.
> 
> MATCH WITH HOGAN AT WRESTLEMANIA XIX :mark:. One of the more legit fun matches I've ever seen on a big show, the leg drop off of the ladder was quite insane, the ultimate example of how a match is BOOKED determining how great it is, they did a fantastic job of hiding both Hogan & Vince's limitations. It's not even close to being the best match on the show, but it's better than say.... Kurt Vs Brock.


Surprisingly good match. The electric crowd helped but I was surprised that Vince destroyed Hogan for so long without it being horrible.


----------



## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

*Anthony Marconi vs Carl Elias - New York City October 1952*
_This is one of my favorite rasslin matches ever. Straight up. Picture quality is pretty amazing considering the year and it's also a single shot handheld camera. Goes 35 minutes but it drags less than a 10 minute match featuring 90% of wrestlers in 2013. Such effortless transitions between hold segments. And yes a hold always gets it's own segment in 1952. There's a abdominal stretch segment that lasts 5 minutes but is so awesome for the 5 minutes it goes. Elias works heel and proper wrenches that motherfucker in on top of using every heel shtick you've ever seen during an abdominal stretch spot. Apart from the horrible ref kicks the heels arm off the ropes spot. Pretty sure Elias would have pulled a gun on the ref if he did that here. Elias is awesome as the scumbag heel who's convinced that he's really a good guy deep down. Marconi is a proper rough (aesthetically) babyface but it really works in the context of the match because it gets really violent once Elias' workover transitions out into the comeback and then into an all out brawl. It's the 50's so you get an odd finish and the babyface reigning supreme but I wouldn't have had it any other way. Turns into a bloodbath at the end with Marconi running wild and getting his revenge on Elias who finally gets his dues and bleeds like a pig. I don't like throwing stars out these days but ****3/4 sounds right. That's 4.75 fyi. Out of 5. It's pretty cool as well because Elias and Marconi went to become one of the biggest heel teams of the late 50's and I've seen a couple of their tags towards the end of their respective runs which are really good in a non-hardcore but pure violence context. Had this on disc so no idea if it's online. Might upload it one day. Perhaps. _


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Yeah I fucking love Punk in 2012 but to compare it to perhaps the GOAT year in 2005 is fucking asinine. 

I need to read more into it, but I think from a pure MATCHES standpoint that this year has been the best week to week since maybe... TWO THOUSAND AND FUCKING FIVE. The PPVS this year have been LOL worthy though, let me break it down

Royal Rumble - One of the worst shows ever. Four matches & only the rumble is above ** 1/2* .
Elimination Chamber - AWESOME Shield tag, decent Chamber, decent Cesaro showcase, MEH main event.... Overall unsatisfying
Wrestlemania - Great Undercard, terrible main event with a fantastic result. Not a COMPLETE show.
Extreme Rules - HORRENDOUS undercard, fantastic main event.
Payback - Mixed bag. Aj/Kaitlyn, Alberto/Dolph, & SHIELD = YES. Everything else = FUCK NO.
Money in the Bank - Great SD MITB, exceptional WWE title match, great WHC bout, shit main event.
Summerslam - PUNK VS BROCK w/ Del Rio/Christian & Bryan/Cena being nice complimentary pieces. Other four matches suck.
Night of Champions - The best match on this is what? ***** maybe ?
Battleground - Better than NOC because of the tag; other than that it's the same thing really.
Hell in a Cell - CENA. SHIELD. That is all. MEH otherwise.

I don't think there's been a truly FANTASTIC show this year though, which is weird. Battleground, NOC, Extreme Rules, & HIAC are all shitty shows while Royal Rumble is ALL TIME BAD. Payback & Elimination Chamber are below average, MITB was a little above average as was Summerslam & Mania for me, but there hasn't been a GREAT SHOW. There's been fantastic matches on these shows, but a majority of WWE's PPV matches this year have been underwhelming.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Brock Lesnar Vs Kurt Angle ~ *** 3/4*


Blimey bud  Lowest i think i have seen it. I admit i was underwhelmed by it on last watch (i do need to rewatch the SS and SD matches), but i admit it could have been better, but with Kurt's injury (was Brock carrying an injury too?), it could have been worse i suppose.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Holy shit :mark:. I honestly didn't think anyone else knew of the GREATNESS of Carl Elias. Probably my favourite wrestler nobody (including me, because who the fuck would I talk to about him?) ever talks about. Oh and his dad was pretty sweet too. Think he was nicknamed "The Blade" too. Shame there is almost nothing out there of him. He and Carl teamed up when Carl first got in the business but then DADDY BLADE turned on him, turning Carl babyface while he got his revenge, then Carl revealed that he was still a CUNT (and an AWESOME one at that) and went back to being heel.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

MITB 2013 main event was fucking awesome. I don't know what everyone hates about it. When I think about it, MITB and SummerSlam have been the only real good shows this year. NoC was absolute nothingness from beginning to end and Battleground had two solid matches. (tag and main event)


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

Rank and compare these three Wrestlemania "Wrestling Clinics" in your opinion

Savage V Steamboat, Bret V Owen, and HBK V Y2J.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

It's a decent contest and definitely not bad at all, I just expected more from the WRESTLEMANIA MAIN EVENT .

That first statement is actually pretty funny, considering how there's very few Wrestlemania main events that I consider to be all time classics and more seem to fall in that two to three star "good but not great" category. I'm going to take a moment to reflect as I'm writing this to see where it would place out of the 29 Mania main events...

FIFTEEN. So it's middle of the pack actually. Hilarious :lol.

& Bret Vs Owen >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Savage/Steamboat>>Jericho/HBK.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

WM main events seem to be so hit and miss. Going back to say, 1998, only because that's the year I started watching:

*1998* HBK/Austin Meh match, HBK's injury taken into account.
*1999* Austin/Rock Meh match, decent brawl
*2000* Trips/Rock/Show/Foley Shouldn't have been four guys, but not a terrible match.
*2001* Rock/Austin :mark:
*2002* Trips/Jericho Decent match, crowd was exhausted from Hogan/Rock.
*2003* Brock/Angle I enjoyed this actually
*2004* Trips/HBK/Benoit :mark: for days
*2005* Trips/Batista Average match
*2006* Trips/Cena I enjoyed this a lot, some don't
*2007* HBK/Cena Great match
*2008* Edge/Taker Great match
*2009* Trips/Orton UGH (Not only was the crowd dead but the booking sucked ass)
*2010* HBK/Taker :mark:
*2011* Cena/Miz UGH
*2012* Rock/Cena Decent
*2013* Rock/Cena UGH


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I'd actually only have 5 Wrestlemania Main Events at *****+*. DELIVERING ON THE GRANDEST STAGE OF THEM ALL :lol:lol.

1. The Undertaker Vs Shawn Michaels (Wrestlemania XXVI) ~ *******
2. John Cena Vs Shawn Michaels (Wrestlemania XXIII) ~ ***** 3/4*
3. Triple H Vs Chris Benoit Vs Shawn Michaels (Wrestlemania XX)~ ***** 3/4*
4. Triple H Vs John Cena (Wrestlemania XXII) ~ ***** 1/4*
5. Steve Austin Vs The Rock (Wrestlemania X-7) ~ ******

& one of those is probably completely just my opinion (HHH-Cena) so yeah .


----------



## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

*Lesnar/Angle at Mania isn't very good and I'd quite happily call it ** if it meant I got an award. Also, HBK/Y2J at Mania isn't a clinic of any sorts. The other 2 are tops though. People also forgetting that Mania main events aren't really there to be all time great wrestling matches. 

Gonna try and dig out more 50's grainy footage I have and review some more Carl Elias matches tomorrow. *


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Lesnar/Angle WM19 is the worst in their trilogy, but it's still a great match. The match is certainly better than any from the last trilogy Lesnar was a part of. :HHH

WM Main Events:

29: Shit
28: Great
27: Shit
26: Classic
25: Shit
24: Awesome
23: Great
22: Decent
21: Shit
20: Awesome
19: Great
18: Mediocre
17: Classic
16: Good
15: Okay
14: Good
13: Shit
12: Good 
6: Great
5: Awesome

Fuck the rest.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Seabs said:


> *Gonna try and dig out more 50's grainy footage I have and review some more Carl Elias matches tomorrow. *


:mark:

Have you got the Elias & Marconi Vs The Yogorovs match? Tis sweeeeet as fuck, and man oh man old man Yogorov gets TAKEN OUT at the end of it. Fairly sure it was his retirement match and he really fucking put over Elias and Marconi with it.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Great WM main events going back to 96 or so only are the following:

Rock/Austin 17
Benoit/HHH/HBK 20
Cena/HBK 23 (bordering on good)
Edge/Taker 24
Taker/HBK 26

And Cena/Rock I is very good imo.


----------



## GOD OF CUNT (Jan 9, 2008)

Seabs said:


> *Anthony Marconi vs Carl Elias - New York City October 1952*
> _This is one of my favorite rasslin matches ever. Straight up. Picture quality is pretty amazing considering the year and it's also a single shot handheld camera. Goes 35 minutes but it drags less than a 10 minute match featuring 90% of wrestlers in 2013. Such effortless transitions between hold segments. And yes a hold always gets it's own segment in 1952. There's a abdominal stretch segment that lasts 5 minutes but is so awesome for the 5 minutes it goes. Elias works heel and proper wrenches that motherfucker in on top of using every heel shtick you've ever seen during an abdominal stretch spot. Apart from the horrible ref kicks the heels arm off the ropes spot. Pretty sure Elias would have pulled a gun on the ref if he did that here. Elias is awesome as the scumbag heel who's convinced that he's really a good guy deep down. Marconi is a proper rough (aesthetically) babyface but it really works in the context of the match because it gets really violent once Elias' workover transitions out into the comeback and then into an all out brawl. It's the 50's so you get an odd finish and the babyface reigning supreme but I wouldn't have had it any other way. Turns into a bloodbath at the end with Marconi running wild and getting his revenge on Elias who finally gets his dues and bleeds like a pig. I don't like throwing stars out these days but ****3/4 sounds right. That's 4.75 fyi. Out of 5. It's pretty cool as well because Elias and Marconi went to become one of the biggest heel teams of the late 50's and I've seen a couple of their tags towards the end of their respective runs which are really good in a non-hardcore but pure violence context. Had this on disc so no idea if it's online. Might upload it one day. Perhaps. _


Great write-up. I've only seen bits and pieces of Elias, and unfortunately none of it was in a full match, but he's a guy I really want to see more of. Think the footage I saw was from an earlier period than this as well. I should try and get a hold of some stuff from around the period that match there.

-Andreas


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Cena/Rock is very good, it's actually quite excellent for what it is really. Clash of the titans done correctly, you can say it's too long or something like that but the point that the match was trying to make was done excellently; these are two of the all time greatest stars of their generation (well Austin>Rock while both were active competitors in terms of popularity but I'm not even fucking touching that discussion for the life of me) and they're locking up in the main event of the most bought show ever.

Alot of the sequences are :mark: too, it's just I wish Cena had to win so we didn't need a rematch.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Jesus, you guys are getting into '50s wrestling now? I couldn't even keep up when you were discussing lucha/Puro/random WCW midcarders/whatever the fuck.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I googled both of those guys and couldn't find anything. Except on this forum. In this thread.


----------



## GOD OF CUNT (Jan 9, 2008)

The Lady Killer said:


> Jesus, you guys are getting into '50s wrestling now? I couldn't even keep up when you were discussing lucha/Puro/random WCW midcarders/whatever the fuck.


I was one of the pioneers of talking about all that shit ITT way back in the '08. Seabs took it to a whole 'nother level, though.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Rock paying tribute to his Rocky Maivia days in the end of the match is brilliantly done too. High cross body turns into an AA then we get a dramatic nearfall (easily beats any of the nearfalls that happened in the rematch).


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

GOD of CUNT said:


> I was one of the pioneers of talking about all that shit ITT way back in the '08. Seabs took it to a whole 'nother level, though.


Well fair play to you, sir. I should've known it was you who started such a revolution.


----------



## GOD OF CUNT (Jan 9, 2008)

^^You should be watching more Sangre Chicana and less of this Helmsley horse shit, tbf. 



HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> I googled both of those guys and couldn't find anything. Except on this forum. In this thread.


There's def footage of them out there. I had some on a comp a ways back. This was what I wrote about another match on it (C&P from a pre-70s wrestling forum):



> Watched the Golden Moose Cholak v Larry Sheen match from the 50s (took place in Chicago) that's on Schneider Comp #23 the other night. I didn't really know what to expect, but it was fucking awesome. If Cholak was always this good (and I see no reason to think he was carried in this match, even though Sheen rocked as well) then we need more Golden Moose Cholak footage right the fuck now. He's like a 1950s Terry Gordy only a bit bigger and chunkier, and he fucking ruled it. Ragdolled Sheen around, bumped like a trooper (almost Jerry Blackwell-esque, since we're namedropping awesome fatties), threw great punches, threw fucking AMAZING headbutts, and maybe best of all wears headgear. Well the headbutts were best of all, but the headgear was badass as well. And he'd use it in nefarious ways (sneaky headbutts to Sheen's cheekbone with the big plastic ear covers), which also ruled. Sheen was pretty much perfect as your scrappy underdog, bleeding and throwing fucking GREAT punches and doing amazing KO sells. At one point Cholak has him in a grounded headscissors, so Sheen ties his shoelaces together. When they get back up to a standing base Cholak is all slippin' and slidin' around while Sheen tees off on him. Crazy spot where the ref' backs Cholak out of the corner and gives him a talking to for continuing to beat on Sheen, so Sheen comes up behind the ref', uses his shoulders as a fucking vault, and propels himself up the air so he can dropkick Cholak square in the face over the referee's head. Looked incredible, and I don't think I've ever seen it done before. Honestly, forget "novelty" or "good for its time;" this was a genuinely tremendous match.


So the footage is out there.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> Cena/Rock is very good, it's actually quite excellent for what it is really. Clash of the titans done correctly, you can say it's too long or something like that but the point that the match was trying to make was done excellently; these are two of the all time greatest stars of their generation (well Austin>Rock while both were active competitors in terms of popularity but I'm not even fucking touching that discussion for the life of me) and they're locking up in the main event of the most bought show ever.
> 
> Alot of the sequences are :mark: too, it's just I wish Cena had to win so we didn't need a rematch.


I disagree on the last part. Rock winning gave us that amazing pop in the end and had the show ending on a good note unless you're a hardcore Rock hater. The rematch was definitely not needed but I feel it helped make the first one that much better. It truly felt big time, I had goosebumps the moment they had that stare down in their wrestling attires as they're about to lock-up. I had counted the days from when they announced it after WM27 and when it was finally there, I couldn't contain myself with all the excitement.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

The main event of MITB this year was one I thought sucked initially but ended up really enjoying on a rewatch. Have you seen it more than once, *Evan*?

Why does everyone forget about Hogan vs. Warrior being one of the great Mania main events? Such an all time classic.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Well that does it. Putting on Rock/Cena I since I haven't seen it since it aired.

Also, I hate Warrior like C2D hates Punk, except 100 million times more, so he gets no love from me.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Rock did need the win there. It was in his hometown, and it set up the rematch for Cena to go over and take the title. Regardless of how people feel about match quality (I thought they were both pretty good matches), they did the best they could with the storyline given Rock's limited schedule.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Rock/Cena I was actually pretty good and >>>>> than Rock/Cena II. The first one started off extremely well but started to drag with the submissions and went too long but there was plenty of good stuff there. *** 1/4 for that vs. * 1/2 for the 2nd encounter finisher-fest. Most of that rating just comes from Cena heeling it up.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Rock's win felt bigger than Cena's win IMO. Rock became the first name to beat Austin, Hogan and Cena at Wrestlemania. Cena had too many big moments that his win this year didn't feel special and it's no surprise it ended with boos. Of course Cena needed a win over a megastar but I always feel Rock's win was the main highlight of the feud.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Well that does it. Putting on Rock/Cena I since I haven't seen it since it aired.
> 
> Also, I hate Warrior like C2D hates Punk, except 100 million times more, so he gets no love from me.


I don't really hate Punk when you think about it. Always give him credit when there's a good match like the one with BROCK or Taker this year. I just can't stand most of his fans (who I refuse to ever be associated with on the same side) and he comes across as an unlikable douchebag to me, similar to how people view The Miz. Therefore I can't be a fan and always root against him. In both kayfabe and card placement.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Annoys me that they didn't add a third man to the rematch. Cena could still have pinned Rock but adding Punk (who fully deserved to be in that match) or even Lesnar would've made it a much more interesting spectacle. Every man and his dog knew Cena was winning at 29 and you'd be hard pressed to find anyone who was begging for the match. I know triple threats aren't for everyone but it's the direction I would've wanted.



Choke2Death said:


> MITB 2013 main event was fucking awesome. I don't know what everyone hates about it.


Maybe they're not Orton marks? :lol

I remember being disappointed by it. Expected great things but they never really came.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I kinda get the same feeling in regards to Punk. I can't really get behind him as a babyface because he just comes off as such a smug douchebag. I find him far more enjoyable as a heel.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

haribo said:


> Maybe they're not Orton marks? :lol
> 
> I remember being disappointed by it. Expected great things but they never really came.


Don't have to be an Orton mark to enjoy it, though. 

There were plenty of cool moments from RVD showing that he still has it, Sheamus bumping around and that awesome punch through the ladder to Christian. Plus there were other nice spots like Orton RKOing RVD off the ladder and T-Bone Suplexing Punk to the ladder as well as Punk bleeding hard after Heyman hit him with the ladder. That's just off the top of my head.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Sheamus' punch through the ladder was the best part of the match. I popped IRL.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Don't worry C2D, I'm no longer an Orton mark and I enjoyed MITB this year. Great show and a very good main event.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I thought both MITB matches were pretty fun this year.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

***1/4 for both MITB matches this year. Found them both enjoyable, not much else. SHEAMUS was the KING in the Raw one though. Absolutely ruled it.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I miss Sheamus.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Me too . Hope he's back around the RR so he can do something awesome at WM. Fuck knows where he'll fit in though.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I've just noticed: Sheamus + Ladders = :mark: :mark: :mark:

Who'd have thought that big, ginger piece of rasslin' goodness would work wonders with something as extreme and uncharacteristic (for him) as ladders.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

*John Cena vs The Rock*
Wrestlemania 28

Atmosphere for this was pretty cool. Miami was super hot and did great for this match. I of course skipped the musical performances because I can't abide MGK. (Calling Cena the biggest underdog of all time fpalm) Commentators did well to call into question Rock's potential lack of cardio, and say that while he's in fantastic physical condition, getting in ring shape is very difficult. They also push the "is Cena taking Rock lightly" story early on. Cena gets the better of the first collar/elbow tie-up, then Rock takes the next one. Rock does the same cradle he opened with at Survivor Series and the announcers jizz themselves again. Cena gains the upper hand and goes after the midsection, locking in the bearhug. Cena takes Rock to the outside and drops his ribs over the barricade and announce table. Belly to belly suplex for a near fall back in the ring. Rock looks to fight back, and Cena catches him coming in and locks in another bearhug. Rock again fights out after a bit and hits a DDT, giving him time to recover. Rock is the first to his feet, but Cena backs him into the corner. Rock though fights back, hitting his flying clothesline and spinebuster, and looks for the People's Elbow. Cena pulls him down and looks for the STF, but Rock blocks it. Cena does hit his flying shoulder blocks, and the Five Knuckle Shuffle. Cena measures Rock, with a cocky smirk on his face. Cena gets Rock up for the Attitude Adjustment, but Rock fights out, comes back in and the two hit a double clothesline. Both men down. Both men get back to their feet, and they trade right hands. Rock gets the upper hand but takes too long to mock Cena, and Cena ducks the big shot, and scores with an AA, but only gets a 2 count. Rock then hits a Rock Bottom from out of nowhere for a 2 count. Both men fight to gain control, as Cena hits a sidewalk slam out of the corner. Cena then goes to the top, clearly looking for his leg drop. Rock takes FOREVER to get into position, so Cena stands on the top rope for like, 15 seconds like an idiot. Oh yeah, two count for the leg drop. 
Cena looks for another AA, which Rock fights out of, and locks in the Sharpshooter. I'm not much for submissions coming out of nowhere with no build, so this doesn't do much for me. Cena does well to sell it, however. Rock stays in control and takes Cena to the outside, throws him into the steps, bounces his head off the steps. Rock looks to bring back in, but Cena scores a sunset flip over the top rope and locks in the STF, then Rock goes to sleep for about a minute. Ref drops Rock's hand for a 2 and a half count and Rock wakes up and fights to the rope. Cena gives Rock too much time to recover and then walks into a Samoan drop, giving Rock more time to recover. They're back up and they trade right hands and counter each others finishers, but Rock hits the spinebuster and follows it up with the People's Elbow for a 2 count. Cena looks to get Rock to the top turnbuckle, but Rock pushes him down. Rock scores with the cross body, but Cena rolls through and hits the AA for a close 2 count. Cena is now visibly frustrated and is unsure of what else he can do. He's up and thinks about his "You Can't See Me" taunt, but rethinks and throws his armband into the crowd and mocks Rock's People's Elbow taunt. He comes off the ropes and Rock catches him coming back in and scores with the Rock Bottom for the 1-2-3. 

I like the match. It kind of bothers me that after the first 10 minutes Rock didn't sell his beaten midsection and the commentators didn't acknowledge it and Cena didn't attack them anymore. Of course at the same time, and I didn't want to sit through 15 minutes of bearhugs and other holds, so I won't complain much about that. Rock's cross body is so :mark: I don't think that many people figured that Rock would win and it's still a pretty awesome moment when he catches Cena with the Rock Bottom and Miami pops hard for that 3 count. ****3/4*​


----------



## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

_*People pop during matches in a life other than the real one? What's the alternative to popping in real life?*_


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

I'm watching Unforgiven 1999 now, and I just gotta say that Moolah & Mae Young run-in was one of the greatest things, ever. DOUBLE CLOTHESLINE!!!! :lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The love for Sheamus in the thread is another of the million things that are 360's from outsiders' opinions :lmao


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

***1/2 for Graves/Neville from NXT. 2/3 Falls Match. Neville is just awesome, he wa great here once again, seriously hope he gets called up soon to the main roster. Also Kidd/Gabriel from Main-Event was a nice and entertaining *** bout. That Zig-Zag from the top rope :mark:


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Neville/Graves was boring as hell, I thought. The leg work was unspectacular, Neville's offense was so and so barring the Corkscrew SSP and the finish really took the wind out of my sails. Whatever, different strokes.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

WHC MITB>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>WWE Title MItB this year. It's really a shame because I was so psyched about the WWE Title MITB, but outside of a couple of moments, it came off extremely flat for me. I really wanted to like the match as well. 

This year, every main event outside of Bryan/Cena either underperformed or sucked. Then again, most of the PPVs have sucked.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Just rewatched a couple of matches.

Taker vs BROCK - No Mercy 02 (★★★★¾ - Simply awesome brawl and holy fuck @ that Taker blade job)
Taker vs Randy/Bob Orton - No Mercy 05 (★★★★ - Enjoy this one so much every time. Love how they work around the handicap casket stipulation and pretty cool ending)

Also rewatched Eddie vs Angle from WM20 yesterday. Pretty solid and not as boring as I recalled it being. ★★★¼-½ is where it'd fit.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

ATF said:


> The love for Sheamus in the thread is another of the million things that are 360's from outsiders' opinions :lmao


Uh 360 is a full circle...which means our opinions would be the same as other people's. I think you mean 180.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

*Whatever.* I think y'all got what I said :side:


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

To be honest I think Sheamus (the WRASSLER) gets praise. Not enough, but he isn't universally hated in that department.

I can see why people dislike his character though.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The wrestler does get praise, but the everything else is as hated as Cena's gimmick.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

He gets the Cena "I'm annoyed with you but you're pretty damn good" treatment, just not as severely as Cena.

edit FUCK


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

DAMN IT! My 2005 PPV set isn't here! Checked amazon and its still in California, expected to arrive MONDAY


----------



## WOOLCOCK (Jun 24, 2011)

GOD of CUNT said:


> ^^You should be watching more Sangre Chicana and less of this Helmsley horse shit, tbf.


fwiw I had him watch Chicana/Perro 2/28/86 and if my memory is correct he enjoyed it a fair deal. NOTE TO SEABS - LUCHA IS AN ACCESSIBLE FORM OF WRESTLING YA DAFTY.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

KO Bossy said:


> Uh 360 is a full circle...which means our opinions would be the same as other people's. I think you mean 180.





ATF said:


> *Whatever.* I think y'all got what I said :side:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> It was such a cool moment with Piper. I don't care if it made fucking ZERO sense in the grand scheme of things and it was random as balls considering these men haven't interacted in over 15 years, but the HOGAN VS PIPER FEUD IS RESURRECTED 20 YEARS LATER HOLY SHIT.
> 
> Just a feel good match. Love Hogan's entrance where he grabs the sign from the audience and rips it up. FUCK IT being the seemingly main focus on a show with so much awesomeness though, despite how fun it is.
> 
> ...


I haven't watched anything from WrestleMania 19 in a while, but I know Brock/Angle was much better than Booker/HHH. Definitely would swap those ratings around imo.



Choke2Death said:


> Also rewatched Eddie vs Angle from WM20 yesterday. Pretty solid and not as boring as I recalled it being. ★★★¼-½ is where it'd fit.


That's probably where I would rate it. Though I prefer three matches from that PPV over it (Christian/Jericho, Rock and Sock vs Evolution, World Title triple threat).


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

WOOLCOCK said:


> fwiw I had him watch Chicana/Perro 2/28/86 and if my memory is correct he enjoyed it a fair deal. NOTE TO SEABS - LUCHA IS AN ACCESSIBLE FORM OF WRESTLING YA DAFTY.


Seabs also didn't like Ishikawa/Ikeda or Ishikawa/Greco. What a scumbag. Both of those smoke the 50s match. They let people like him admin forums? I'm never watching you-know-what, Seabridge.

Also WOOLCOCK you have one *HELL* of an avatar right now. Currently my favourite behind the dinosaur eating breakfast.


----------



## WOOLCOCK (Jun 24, 2011)

Yeah1993 said:


> Seabs also didn't like Ishikawa/Ikeda or Ishikawa/Greco. What a scumbag. Both of those smoke the 50s match. They let people like him admin forums? I'm never watching you-know-what, Seabridge.
> 
> Also WOOLCOCK you have one *HELL* of an avatar right now. Currently my favourite behind the dinosaur eating breakfast.


He likes Volk Han right? My heart cannot take the inevitable pain if he were to confess to being apathetic to 'ol Han. He at least worships Fujiwara though (he does right, I didn't imagine that?!?), so there's a semblance of taste littered in that asbo riddled mind of his.

Thanking you very much for that. There's no shame in placing second to a dinosaur eating breakfast, it's the stuff of low budget graphic design dreams.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

WOOLCOCK said:


> He likes Volk Han right? My heart cannot take the inevitable pain if he were to confess to being apathetic to 'ol Han. He at least worships Fujiwara though (he does right, I didn't imagine that?!?), so there's a semblance of taste littered in that asbo riddled mind of his.
> 
> Thanking you very much for that. There's no shame in placing second to a dinosaur eating breakfast, it's the stuff of low budget graphic design dreams.



I second Yeah, that avatar is positively tremendous. Well done sir :clap

Watching Eddie vs Ohtani from Starrcade while taking a break from my Royal Rumble 2005 rambling. I'm not gonna lie, that even is hard to sit through. If I remember correctly, Cal said he actually LIKED the Taker vs Heidenreich Casket Match.:side:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Just finished watching the Real Americans vs Cena match from RAW. Good stuff. The UK crowd really added to match and they were really behind Cesaro, while booing Cena, and not really giving a shit about Swagger. Cesaro was the star in the match as usual, I mark whenever he hits that sick uppercut and I'm not even a Cesaro fan. But it's one of the best moves in the WWE today - and it's moves like that and his big swing that have been getting Cesaro over, and they should probably turn him face soon. When you're getting over because of your great wrestling ability you should be a face imo. Zeb Colter's pre-match promo was also great as usual, the guy's entertaining as hell and I think he's good enough to be a manager for a main-event star, both him and Cesaro and too good to stuck with Jack Swagger.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

WOOLCOCK said:


> He likes Volk Han right? My heart cannot take the inevitable pain if he were to confess to being apathetic to 'ol Han. He at least worships Fujiwara though (he does right, I didn't imagine that?!?), so there's a semblance of taste littered in that asbo riddled mind of his.
> 
> Thanking you very much for that. There's no shame in placing second to a dinosaur eating breakfast, it's the stuff of low budget graphic design dreams.


No idea whether he likes Han or Fujiwara stuff. Probably not because he's a dead-to-me scumbag. He didn't even like Atlantis/Villano very much. Who in the blue fuck doesn't like Atlantis/Villano very much? I gave that to people who didn't (and STILL don't) give a flying crap about lucha and they adored it and thought it was classic-level. The man must be stopped.


----------



## WOOLCOCK (Jun 24, 2011)

Yeah1993 said:


> No idea whether he likes Han or Fujiwara stuff. Probably not because he's a dead-to-me scumbag. He didn't even like Atlantis/Villano very much. Who in the blue fuck doesn't like Atlantis/Villano very much? I gave that to people who didn't (and STILL don't) give a flying crap about lucha and they adored it and thought it was classic-level. The man must be stopped.


I thought he liked Atlantis/Villano a fair degree, oh Seabs you plonker. Luckily he adores Cicloncito Ramirez/Damiancito El Guerrero 1/7/97 otherwise there'd be no coming back for him, plus he's a Tenryu advocate and that's the quickest way to my heart without putting on a sheep costume.

Just remember, for all Seabs' crimes when it comes to crapping on our beloved matches, Mike is even worse :argh:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Oh man that RAW ending was sweet. And yes I've only just finished watching RAW now. :side: ''This is awesome'' chants for The Wyatt Family and The Shield fighting, only a great crowd like a UK Crowd would do that. Heard there's been talk of doing a big 6 person team tag at Survivor Series involving The Wyatt's, The Shield, Punk and Bryan, Rhodes Brothers and The Usos, would be great, shame it's not confirmed yet and instead we've got a underwhelming Punk/Bryan vs Harper/Rowan match confirmed. But there's still a week until Survivor Series so I hope they'll change things. Everything on the Survivor Series card so far I don't care about all it looks like a RAW episode. GTFO if they expect people to pay for that.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Good Lord this place has been quiet the past couple of days, guess you know who draws here :HHH2

Anyways checked out both mitb this year. Both are good/very good with WHC being far superior, I think the reason wwe mitb gets hate is the meat/middle portion of the match is kind life-less but the end/beginning are pretty well down. FELLA !


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Sheamus! I can't believe I miss him. I just want him to be a workhorse and nothing else. Let him in the main event only to job to the real stars.

WOOLCOCK is here. Maybe now we can talk about how great Sawyer/Duggan is and agree that Nikita Koloff is among the most underrated babyfaces of all-time. I would also love some 80s Terry Funk recommendations please. Preferrably none of the famous matches.

EDIT: Really happy to see more people warm up to the WWE MITB match. It's not bad; just not the classic that we were promised. The dull parts controlled by Christian and some of the sloppy stuff from RVD were probably the only negatives of the match (unless if you loathe Orton). We also didn't get enough Punk or Bryan, but what we did get was awesome. Ending was :mark: and very successful. SHEAMUS was also killing it.

Gabriel/Kidd: ****1/4*

HOLY CRAP Graves/Neville is really good. No flaw whatsoever. Both guys structured a very good story. Fun first fall that was short and to the point, a second fall that created a long-term weakness to the face that the heel takes control of, and a suspenseful third fall with great long-term selling from Neville and some of Regal's best commentary. ****3/4 - *****


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Sheamus! I can't believe I miss him. I just want him to be a workhorse and nothing else. Let him in the main event only to job to the real stars.


Agree with this. They want to put him in 10-15 minute matches each week, I'm all for that. They want to put him in WWE/World Title storylines and have him take up more time than necessary? Fuck that shit. Sheamus being a jobber to the stars/up and coming mid-card heels would be awesome in my book.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

I need your opinions, especially because you guys know way more about PPV matches than I do.

I ordered the 2011 PPV package for $80. I've now realized that I have many of the big matches already on various DVDs.

If I sent them back, that'll mean I'm out $20 for shipping (for both ways total). So basically, I want to know, are there enough notable, good, matches in 2011 to make it worth the $60, since I already have these matches on other DVDs?:

Christian vs. ADR Ladder Match
Edge vs ADR at WM 27
Orton vs. Christian at Capitol Punishment
Orton vs. Punk at WM 27
Cena vs. Punk at MITB
Cena vs. Miz at WM 27
Cena & Rock vs. Miz and R Truth at SvS '11 
Mysterio vs. Cody Rhodes at WM 27
Elimination Chamber 2011 match
Cena vs. Miz vs. Morrison - Extreme Rules '11 [Cage Match]

Not saying that all of those matches are good, btw. Just that I have them.


Wish I was paying closer attention to what was already on other DVDs.

The ones that I know that I'm interested in that I don't already have, are Orton vs. Christian at OTL & Summerslam, Orton vs. Henry at NOC, HHH vs. Taker at WM 27 (I know opinions are split on this).

What else is there that is considered good, that aren't already listed?


----------



## WOOLCOCK (Jun 24, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> WOOLCOCK is here. Maybe now we can talk about how great Sawyer/Duggan is and agree that Nikita Koloff is among the most underrated babyfaces of all-time. I would also love some 80s Terry Funk recommendations please. Preferrably none of the famous matches.


Sawyer/Duggan (11/11/85) gets better with every viewing imo, a truly classic war and something that exemplifies the talent of both men which is criminally overlooked by the vast majority who only know of Duggan as the lumbering oaf and know nothing of Sawyer.

Funk recommendations eh? The Lawler matches are obvious gems as are the Flair matches. I guess I can only encourage you to watch the Funk/Hansen wars from All Japan if you haven't done so already. 4/14/83 is their best singles match by a strong distance imo and is a truely incredible match and the Funks/Hansen & Brody 8/31/83 tag is one of the most emotionally intense matches I've seen as it's billed as Terry's retirement match. Stick around for the post match promo where Terry addresses the native Japan audience because it's quite shocking to see how reveared he is for a gaijin.

If you haven't seen the Funks/Shiek & Abdullah the Butcher series spanning '77 and '79 in All Japan then absolutely get on those too. I think there's four matches in total, either on youtube or ditch's site. Terry puts in some of the most captivating babyface performances I've seen, Dory is perfectly suited to a more mechanical yet still violent individual and Shiek and Abby despite being limited as workers are perfectly capable of thriving in the animalistic and violent atmosphere that engulfs this series. I think I had the RWTL '79 match as the best of the bunch by the end of watching all the matches, and I think each match essentially surpassed the prior in terms of overall quality.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> What else is there that is considered good, that aren't already listed?


Excluding Orton matches (which you're familiar with I'd assume), these are good matches not listed there imo.

MITB matches (SD and Raw)
Sheamus/Henry & Barrett/Bryan - SummerSlam
Cena/Del Rio/Punk - HIAC
Cena/Del Rio & Henry/Show - Vengeance
Henry/Show - Survivor Series
Punk/Mike/Del Rio - TLC

I'd have to say that's way too overpriced and other than the matches you already mentioned (specially Orton/Christian OTL/SS), nothing is really worth that much.

------------------------

EDIT: Benoit WILL appear in the Mr. Wrestlemania DVD. :mark:

http://www.wrestlingdvdnews.com/details-wwe-shawn-michaels-mr-wrestlemania-dvd/54328/



> We can now confirm that the Shawn Michaels’ WrestleMania Matches DVD first announced last month will be titled “Shawn Michaels: Mr. WrestleMania“.
> 
> This will be the first major WWE DVD and Blu-ray to hit stores next year, following The Best of Raw & Smackdown 2013. The release date will be February 11th, 2014.
> 
> ...


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

*Eddie vs. BORK, NWO - ****3/4*

Amazing match. That is all.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

WM XX triple threat is 30 minutes plus? Prepare for 20 minutes of silence of commentary, with the most awkward ending of a match you've ever seen. Seriously. We might not even recognize the match with the amount of editing they'll likely do.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I don't understand? I just skimmed through the last few posts and saw that Benoit is on the new Mr WM DVD that's coming out. Undertaker already has his STREAK set out AND he didn't face Benoit at WM... so the fuck is going on?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

inb4 Taker Or Shawn For Mr. WM Round #53428796552167.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> WM XX triple threat is 30 minutes plus? Prepare for 20 minutes of silence of commentary, with the most awkward ending of a match you've ever seen. Seriously. We might not even recognize the match with the amount of editing they'll likely do.


I doubt the editing will be as bad this time around. Benoit is too big a part for them to simply mute every piece of commentary referring to him or change camera angles. Maybe they'll provide alternative commentary from Shawn?

I'm really starting to think that WWE is trying to sneak Benoit back into history. He's been in THREE DVDs from this year alone, which is probably the same amount he appeared in prior. And if WM20 triple threat appears, I don't think anything is out of the ordinary for him anymore.



Callamus said:


> I don't understand? I just skimmed through the last few posts and saw that Benoit is on the new Mr WM DVD that's coming out. Undertaker already has his STREAK set out AND he didn't face Benoit at WM... so the fuck is going on?


Maybe WWE has a hidden Benoit/Taker match at WM that we never saw? Maybe Taker returned for one night at WM2000 and faced Benoit in a dark match we've never seen? :mark:

Fuck WWE for not having this match. Saw the four way with Rock and Kane a few hours ago and it was awesome stuff. Should have ended when Benoit hit Taker & Kane with a chair and put Rock in the Crossface, though.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

LilOlMe said:


> I need your opinions, especially because you guys know way more about PPV matches than I do.
> 
> I ordered the 2011 PPV package for $80. I've now realized that I have many of the big matches already on various DVDs.
> 
> ...


I don't think it's "bad" enough to go through the hassle of returning it at this point. I'd just keep it and enjoy what you haven't seen, cause there's still plenty of good stuff on there.

Edge vs. Ziggler at the Rumble and the Rumble match itself
ADR vs. Kofi at Elimination Chamber (minority opinion, but still)
The RAW Chamber wasn't anything special imo but you may enjoy it, who knows
Taker vs. HHH at Mania obviously as you said
Rey vs. Cody at Extreme Rules
Punk vs. Rey at Capitol Punishment
Obvious Orton vs. Christian feud
Definitely the SD MITB Ladder Match, RAW one's pretty good as well
Bryan vs. Barrett & Punk vs. Cena from Summerslam
Punk vs. HHH at NOC and Del Rio vs. Cena
All of Vengeance and Hell in a Cell (some good stuff split between both of these)
Then you have Punk vs. Del Rio from SvS (which I've yet to see thus far) along with all of TLC

What they hey, just keep it and enjoy!


----------



## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

*I watched Atlantis/Villano twice and yeah I don't think it's even very good. Lucha isn't my thing but there's enough lucha that I like that I'm open to giving certain guys a chance. Like anything Santo, Dandy, Casas I'm open to watching for sure. It's more the style and the culture I don't dig than the actual wrestlers. 

Fujiwara's good although I haven't seen much of his peak work. I watched him wrestle YOSHIHIKO though and that was great. There's also a 95% chance that I've never seen a Volk Han match too. I'm so getting locked out of that place when they see my list. *


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I've already seen your list Seabs and I kinda hate parts of you. But your loves for CARL ELIAS and others from the GOAT NY 50's scene makes up for it.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

A couple of random match ratings for y'all:

Tiger Mask vs. Dynamite Kid (NJPW 1982-WWWF Jr. Heavyweight Title) *- *****
Kurt Angle vs. Yuji Nagata (2008-Wrestle Kingdom II) *- ***3/4*
Daniel Bryan and Gail Kim vs. Tyson Kidd and Melina (Superstars 2011)*- ****
Chris Benoit vs. Stevie Richards (2005 Sunday Night Heat)*- ****


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Unsure how anyone can not like Atlantis vs. Villano III. I watched it when it was probably like the 10th Lucha match I've ever seen and still thought it was downright incredible. I think you should give it a 3rd try, Seabs. 

Oh and I love that Angle/Nagata match. Seen it twice, **** 1/4 each time. Wonderful pacing.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

As were posting thoughts of matches from puro and the like.

Kenta Kobashi vs Jun Akiyama from NOAH in 2004 might be the most epic thing ever.


----------



## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

*It's a great version of that type of match. That type match isn't really my thing anymore but that was one of the stronger all out NOAH epics imo.*










*The notes on the door crack me up.*


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Reading some of the Wrestlemania reviews from a few pages back. 

I can easily say that if Wrestlemania XIX were anywhere but Seattle, it would be no questions asked, the Greatest Of All Time. Think if that Wrestlemania was in Chicago, or New York. 

Seattle blew it.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Honestly the crowd at XIX has never bothered me. Still think it's one of the GOAT Manias, but there are some other events I need to watch to make a good comparison.

Cynical Miracle, every time you post something, I can't help but sit and laugh at the GIF for like, a minute. Well done.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Gif of the year, TCM. :clap

Goldust should be in MvC 4 after that.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Wrestlemania 27: Why It Was Garb​
Before I get into anything, saying that Wrestlemania 27 is the worst ever is not accurate, as different strokes for different folks. I alone can not speak of any Wrestlemania before 15. As I have not seen any of them previous to that. From 15 on, 27 is definitely a contender for the worst out of that group. In my opinion, it is the worst out of that group. 

*World Heavyweight Championship Match* 

Looking over the Wrestlemania card, it makes sense on why this match opened the show. all though at the time, we would have never guessed that this match was going to open the show. At the time, it was a nice surprise and we were all delighted and it got everyone pumped up for Wrestlemania. I'm going to assume they opened the show with this to ease the blow of the next couple shitty matches. 

As soon as the match was over, people were still getting settled into being at fucking Wrestlemania and with the WHC "supposedly" being one of the top two titles, I know that if I was looking forward to the match, I would feel like there wasn't really anything left to look forward to on the show. 

*Backstage Shit*

The backstage segments were pushed so hard it made it blaintly obvious the WWE wanted to show off the fact that they were able to grab Snoop Dogg for the event. This is upseting because a match like Bryan/Sheamus was bumped off of the main show all together, I am assuming to make room for the backstage segments at Wrestlemania.

*Jerry Lawler/Michael Cole* 

Michael Cole did a hell of a job as portraying a heel character, as weeks leading up to Wrestlemania there were many times I muted my television. I genuinely hatd him.With Cole capitalizing on a transcendent heel persona, history and logic dictates that all those heelish actions would be paid off with a comprehensive beat down at the hands of Jerry Lawler at WrestleMania 27. 

As opposed to booking an actual squash of a match which would show Jerry Lawler completely destroy Michael Cole, as most expected, WWE allowed Michael Cole to get a fair amount of offense into their Mania match.

All of the factors, such as Cole being a non-athlete in real life, the crowd chanting "boring" at argueably one of the most built up storylines on the card.

This program was a complete and utter waste of Stone Cold Steve Austin and JR returning for commentary. 
I don't even want to get into the fuckery of the finish.


*Corre Vs. Big Show, Kofi Kingston, Kane, and Santino Marella*

Grab some popcorn and beverage before CM Punk/Orton. The fact that this match was on the card is just the face palm of all face palms. 


*Orton/Punk*

The Punk-Orton feud has received a long time build and was one of the more stabilized matches on the card. This match that was filled with positioning, was killed by the amount of submission holds and lack-luster star power (at the time)

I had high hopes for Punk/Orton given the talent of both performers. However, like WrestleMania 27, this match fell below expectations. 

*Cena/Miz*

Like many matches, the actual match never lives up to the hype. But this match took it one step further. This match didn't even live up to the promotional video shown before it. 

As big of a Miz fan as I am. I would expect him to hold the title maybe in the fall. Maybe during B PPV's in between Wrestlemania and Summerslam. Never would I myself put The Miz in the main event of Wrestlemania. To each their own.

The Miz and John Cena put on a C- match that was clunnky and unorganized with no real emotion that usually arises during a Wrestlemania main event.

*The Rock*

The Rock opening and closing the show really does not need any sort of explanation. A part timer comes in and they act like he is the God of all God and was the complete center of the build to the show, made the DVD cover, headlined the next nights Raw. He decided the finish of the match, they even gave him a special introduction that was played before the main video package to start the show.

Vince, stop riding Dwaynes Cock, please.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

It was bad. Well decent. Not worst of all time. Felt like a glorifred RAW. Had some cool moments though. I might put it ahead of 29 tbh.

Still dont know why folks have always ben so pissy over Rock being the host that night and having so much focus. It SHOULD have been expected. Apart from you not liking the content I guess but still, people should have expected Rock being a major focus from the moment he returned.

One of WWE's biggest stars came back after 7 years to host the companies biggest event. Damn right, the E was going to give him alot of exposure like that. As a host it was only right for him to have an introduction, segments through the night and a opening promo to hype up the crowd. He did what a host was supposed to do. I guess because it was a first time thing, people reacted that way towards it. 

If it was Austin, it would have been the same thing. But I feel that for some reason via double standards, folks wouldn't have a problem with him doing all that host stuff.

With that said, I still think it was unnecessary for a Mania host. As well as the ending that night being terribly done. Would have been better suited for Rock to have hosted RAW as it was supposed to be in 2010.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

RichardHagen said:


> Reading some of the Wrestlemania reviews from a few pages back.
> 
> I can easily say that if Wrestlemania XIX were anywhere but Seattle, it would be no questions asked, the Greatest Of All Time. Think if that Wrestlemania was in Chicago, or New York.
> 
> Seattle blew it.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*RichardHagen, I think you have to account for the fact that Safeco Field is an open-air venue so that can effect the crowd noise and whatnot, also imagine if the crowd knew beforehand that WM XIX would be Austin's final match...they would've probably been WAY more invested in the Rocky-Austin match. 

I felt they were a good crowd, all things considered. *


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

JR marking out during that match is just :mark:

Amazing.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*You know what I loved about the Rocky-Austin matches: That JR was always his usual Austin homer self and King was always pro-Rock. The commentary dynamic made their interactions that much better.*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Love the way Austin sells the Rock Bottom's in it. Makes it appear to be the most painful experience anyone could ever feel. Austin went out with a bang, possibly better than anyone else. Match is a total force.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I don't think Austin had to work too hard to sell given how much pain he was probably already in. But yeah, after every Rock Bottom, Austin would reach for the back of his head in a way that no one ever does after the Rock Bottom.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Potentially. But I'm certain a good portion of it was Austin's top notch work to make Rock look like a million bucks on his way out.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

*Re: Official DVD/Match/Show DiscussioMichaen Thread*

*Random Raw Review/Recap: February 16th 2004 *

The night started with the announcement of Shawn Michaels vs Chris Benoit and The World Tag Team Titles were going to be on the line with Evolution (Ric Flair & Batista) vs Rob Van Dam and Booker T

The opening segment had Triple H out questiong who he was going to face at Wrestlemania XX for the title. Since Shawn had signed the contract, but Chris Benoit had jumped ship to Raw to face Triple H for the title, Benoit still had a match for the title guaranteed.
The segment then picked up with the Arrival of Eric Bishoff trying to calm Triple H down. Chris Benoit came and attacked The Game causing Evolution to make the save.​
The whole segment was just awesome and watching it makes me really miss this time in WWE. To have this much action so early in the show is just awesome. I like the whole "friends come in to make the save" angle and it's always worked well with Evolution.

*Booker T/ Rob Van Dam vs Evolution (Batista & Ric Flair)(C) is next for the Titles.*

I really hate Booker T's theme during this time. It so childish. What I don't like about this match already is how Van Dam and Booker T are so careful with Ric Flair in the ring. I don't like how it's noticeable. They are just fine with Batista but Ric Flair is like a shield of glass in the ring. I feel as if you can't hang to a certain level, you shouldn't be able to hang at all. Rob Van Dam and Booker are such botchers? I never noticed how careful Booker is with everything he does and it really kills the momentum of the match. I've witnessed two (EDIT three) botches by Booker and one by Van Dam in this match so far.​Mick Foley runs out, causes the distraction on the outside for Batista and the referee, Van Dam(non legal) hits Flair with the 5-Star Frog Splash, Booker T covers for the victory. 

Very slow match with a lot of botches and slow, careful moves. The ending was good because of Mick Foley running out. Without that, the match would have been a DUD. With that, I'll give the match a one star for the good ending and New World Tag Team Champions on the Road To Wrestlemania XX

*NEW World Tag Team Champions: Booker T & Rob Van Dam
Match Rating: **​
*Backstage/Video Promos *
We get a video package from the previous nights PPV, Smackdown's No Way Out. They show how Bill Goldberg sat front row, then caused Brock Lesnar to lose the WWE Title to Eddie (RIP)

Stone Cold Steve Austin & Eric Bishoff watch the very tail end of the video package from backstage. Austin claims he's upset over Goldbergs actions. Austin is also upset because Smackdown's main event for Wrestlemania is set, but Raw's isn't. Austin says if Eric Bishoff doesn't have an answer by the end of the night, he is going to drag his ass to the ring and stomp a mudhole in his ass and walk him dry.

Eric runs into Randy Orton who wants to fight Mick Foley later. Eric gives him his wish by says the match is not sanctioned. :mark:

Chris Jericho and Christian Backstage talking about Trish Stratus and Jerichos Injury and other things. Jesus. We have had a half hour of programming, excluding commercials, and only have had 1 match. I feel like this Raw has more backstage shit than some of the programming today has. Maybe I'm wrong. I really liked the way the whole "Best friend turn against Best Friend" angle worked with Jericho/Christian. On this particular Raw, Jericho is going to give Trish flowers and tell her how he really feels about her. 
Can we have another match now?

*Chris Jericho vs Kane *
I miss the days like this where obviously smaller guys worked the bottom half of the bigger man's body to start the match. Made it seem more real. Jericho is going downtown to chinatown on Kane's legs to start the match. Jericho going for a really early Walls Of Jericho proves the reality that if this were a true sport, the smaller man would want to put the bigger man away early in the match so the big man wouldn't get in any offense. I really like that Jericho does things like this. The story is told much more smoothly. Kane & Jericho are already much faster paced than the tag team match that opened the show. Kane is really aggressive. This is when his mask was off and it's just really good TV.​
Kane wrapped Jerichos legs around the ring post and did some damage to his legs. Shortly after the referee stopped the match to aid Jericho. Dumb no-finish. I'll give the short match a *1/4 only because Jericho and Kane are both good at selling in my opinion and Jericho is always great in the ring. 

*No Finish -- Match Rating(for what it was): *1/4*​
Kane cuts a promo about his match at Wrestlemania XX with The Undertaker. The lights dim purple after Kane leaves the ring and The Undertakers returns promo airs on the titantron with Kane looking on from the Ramp.

Back from Commercial, we have The Intercontinental Randy Orton in the ring who is talking about how the previous week Mick Foley wanted a match with Randy Orton at Wrestlemania XX. He is hating on Mick Foley, saying he is a has been, and is fat & ugly. Randy says that if Foley wants a match then to come and get it. Foley makes his way to the ring. Foley and Orton battle for a while.

Okay segment, nothing spectacular and absolutely not better than the opening segment of the show. Evolution comes for the save and beats down Foley. Little progress with the feud between the two, besides Evolution being involved in beating down Foley. Foley is taken out on a stretcher. 

*Backstage/Video Promos*
Shawn Michaels is backstage preparing for his match with Chris Benoit. Chris Benoit approaches him and said that tonight he was going to show Shawn the same respect that Shawn has shown him in recent weeks. 

Stacy Keibler mark and another Diva (cannot think of her name) backstage talking to Eric Bishoff about how they should have been on the cover of Playboy as opposed to Torrie & Sable. Eric tells them to go give Hugh Heffner a call. The Divas leave and Stone Cold approaches Eric wanting an answer for the main event of Wrestlemania XX. After Eric tells him he does not have a solution, Steve begins to talk about the Monday Night Wars. Eric tells Steve that in a real fist fight Eric would destroy Vince easily with no problem. The camera expands and Vince is standing right behind Eric. Vince announces that next week on Raw, Vince is going to kick Eric's ass in the ring.


*Trish Stratus & Victoria vs. Molly Holly & Jazz*

Jesus lord is Trish ever hot. I miss her so much. Typical divas action except for in Tag Team format. Nothing to really see here besides Trish and Victoria. These are actually all really talented wrestlers. It's tough because if this talent was in todays product, instead of the Eye Candy era of the WWE, we would have a hell of a divas division. Victoria is very impressive in the ring.​
Victoria hits her finisher on Molly Holly to win the match.

*Winner: Trish Stratus and Victoria
Match Rating: Divas match/5*​
After the match, fucking Test comes out and starts to attack Trish Stratus causing Christian to come down and make the save. This is to add to the feud of Jericho/Christian heading into Wrestlemania XX

*Backstage/Video Promos*
Trish approaches Christian backstage and thanks him for the help and the save from Test. Trish says she is going to see Jericho in the hospital from the attack from Kane eariler in the night. Christian starts to heart throb her and suggests they just ride there together. Christian goes into the locker room and comes back out with the flowers that Jericho was going to give Trish after his match with Kane from earlier in the night. That fucker. 

Video recap of the progess of the feud between Shawn/Benoit/Triple H so far.

*Shawn Michaels vs Chris Benoit*

I am expecting a no-finish, only because that seems to happen with big matches like this, but I guess we will see. Hopefully we get a good match out of it, none the less.

Shawn Michaels and Chris Benoit stare down in the ring, Michaels starts a unison audience clap for some fucking reason. Man, is Benoit ever technical. Very good match so far. Both guys go for finishers early on the in the match. It's amazing that this caliper of a match was a weekly thing during this time in WWE. Shawn Michaels is just so good in the ring. With this mix of high flying moves, and quick feet. Chris Benoit had a hard time with his magnificent ground game. We see a mix of submissions holds while Jerry and King (GOAT) talk about the injuries both men have suffered through the years. I do not like how exhausted they seem so early in the match. It really slows the momentum of everything. Michaels goes for his Elbow Drop from the top rope only for Chris to move out of the way and Michaels "crashed and burned" (Thanks JR) Michaels reverses all of Benoits German Suplexes about halfway through the match. Michaels, all though late in the match, kicked out of a couple of Benoits covers at the count of 1. The snap suplexes really slow Michaels as I'd imagine. We are reminded form Jr of Eric's promise to Steve Austin that he would have an answer regarding the main even of Wrestlemania XX by the end of the night. Still to come. Michaels and Benoit exchanging Flair chops to the chest. Chris Benoit bear hugs and various submission holds really add to the suspension of the match. The crowd is more sided with HBK than Benoit, but at this time in history, I do not blame them. As Benoit is the obvious underdog between the three men. Michaels is starting to use his ground game more and more, rather than his natural high flying attributes. Michaels is pulling out submission holds of his own with a sleeper hold smack dap in the middle of the ring. A close falls count by the referee, at the count of 8, Shawn covers Benoit for the long 2 count. Exchanging blows back and forth, Michaels and Benoit find themselves both down in the center of the ring for yet another referee count. Michaels is to his feet first to set up for the Sweet Chin Music in which Benoit reverses and hits the three German Suplexes.​
Triple H appears on the stage and distracts Benoit. This set up Shawn to hit the Sweet Chin Music and take the victory. 

*Winner: Shawn Michaels
Match Rating: **3/4*​
Triple H makes his way into the ring and assists Shawn to his feet only to hit him with the Pedigree. This now leaves Triple H standing tall with Shawn and Benoit down in the ring. 

Triple H makes his way back up the ramp when Stone Cold Steve Austin's music hit and he comes down on his four wheeler and rounds the ring, grabbing a microphone. He rounds back up the ramp and parks next to the confused Triple H. Stone Cold announces that because Eric is too scared to face Triple H face to face, that at Wrestlemania it will be a Triple Threat Match for the World Heavy Weight Championship.

*Wrestlemania XX
World Heavyweight Championship
Shawn Michaels vs Christ Benoit vs Triple H(C)*

Let me know if you guys want me to do more of these. This was fun.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I would definitely say that Edge/Del Rio and Orton/Punk are nowhere close to being reasons why Mania 27 was garb. WHC match was super fun and while it was surprising to be an opener, kicked the show off with a bang. Orton/Punk was a very good midcard match and I can't see how the submissions hurt anything. Nothing wrong with a quality match with story and psychology/good selling.

The rest of the reasons I can agree on (mostly). Rock hosting was fine because it was star power and a major comeback, but Cena/Miz, Lawler/Cole, and that random Corre match sucked ass.

Still though, I'd say the show was definitely better than Mania 15 and _maybe _even 16, 18, and 25. I'd have to watch them all repeatedly to get an idea.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

*Shawn Michaels vs Rey Mysterio Series*​* Raw is Eddie 11/14/05*
-ok this was Eddie's tribute show, and they were commemorating his death by having some cross brand matches. It was a sad day for all of ys, so hopefully this will cheers us up a bit. Shawn wearing a armband that reads "EG" along with Eddie's shirt to the ring. Rey decked out in charger gear or I think ? Anyways, about the match, it was decent from a standpoint of the two hall of famers going head to head for the first time, but you can tell their mind wasnt in it. HBK honestly seems like he wasn't there, just walking through most of it. It seemed like they never kicked it into 2nd gear, which is a testament to both guys because they still got a good match out of it

* smackdown 1/29/10 *
- fast-forward five or so years, and these two have their 2nd match together (crazy how separated these guys were, tells you how strong the brand splits were back then), this time hbk is apart of DX again and Rey is challenging Taker for the whc at the rumble. This match was much better and I really enjoyed it. I like the story being told, just to future hall of famers putting on a show together. Had a nice call back of svs 05 and the raw shelton match when hbk SCM Rey as jumped off the ropes. Nice selling of the leg by Shawn. Its interesting to me how much Rey changed his move set/style since 05, He really does re-invent himself after injuries in-ring and still is :mark:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I'd put 25 over 27 just because of Taker/Shawn tbh.

Plus, MITB, Steamboat, Hardy spotfest and Edge/Cena/Show were entertaining as well. And Trips/Orton was the far lesser of two evils between it and Miz/Cena.


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## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

ATF said:


> I'd put 25 over 27 just because of Taker/Shawn tbh.
> 
> Plus, MITB, Steamboat, Hardy spotfest and Edge/Cena/Show were entertaining as well. And Trips/Orton was the far lesser of two evils between it and Miz/Cena.


LOOK, I said _maybe_, ok?  All viable arguments either way.

------------

Shawn/Rey in 2010 was great. I didn't like it much at all when I first saw it, but on the rewatch it was a wonderful slow-paced match with a badass ending.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Ok, ok, no need to feel trolled :evil:


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

*Bret Hart (c) vs. Shawn Michaels - WWF Championship match - WWF Survivor Series 1997: **3/4*

Everyone knows this match for the infamous Montreal Screwjob but not a lot of people talk about the match itself. Before the match, Shawn Michaels makes one of his best entrances heeling it up by getting the Canadian flag and putting it under his crotch, wiping his nose with it, and even humping it, showing how much he respects Canada. Bret Hart comes out to a loud ovation, being treated like a God like he's always been in Canada. The crowd was great as they were obviously Pro-Hart and Anti-HBK and it adds a lot to this match. Before the match would start, Shawn attacks Bret, going on a quick flurry, but Bret bounces back with punches and clotheslines Shawn out of the ring. The brawl would escalate outside of the ring and would even go to the crowd. Bret was in control for most of the brawl. The brawl consisted of punches, kicks, choking, and low blows which shows how personal this rivalry has become. Even the refs got caught in the crossfire, showing that no one could contain them from beating the absolute pulp out of each other. The match finally makes it to the ring and starts with Bret in control, but Shawn would bounce back. Shawn demonstrates good heel work by taunting the crowd, choking Bret with the Quebec flag, and I believe Shawn spat on one of the crowd members. Bret bounces back with a comeback and works on Shawn's leg by repeatedly punching it, doing elbows, and used both variations of the Figure-Four on the ring post and the normal one. Bret was in control until Shawn got the advantage by having Bret inadvertently hitting Earl Hebner and Shawn would rake his eyes. Shawn sets up the Sharpshooter, and you know the rest. Even though the brawl before the match was fun to watch and added a lot of emotion to the rivalry, I felt that nothing truly special happened in the match itself except of the infamous ending. It sort of felt like "That was it?", and I felt that hurt the match a bit. Overall fun brawl before the match, but not that special in the match itself.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

I don't think Wrestlemania 27 is that bad at all. I would even say it's a really good show. Now I love the Undertaker/Triple H match so that really contributes to my high opinion. 

Cody/Rey, Punk/Orton, Edge/Del Rio were all somewhere between ***-***3/4. It has its flaws as there was a lot of bad stuff too and time was used really poorly. The 8-Man and the Mixed Tag got almost no time while a Rock promo and Lawler/Cole got way too much time. The main event also wasn't amazing (I wouldn't say terrible but it just seemed like a solid main event you would see on Raw). 

So while there are certainly flaws there are still 3 really good matches and a classic Undertaker/Triple H match which made it an enjoyable watch. 

I paid to fly down to Atlanta to see it and I still think it was money was well spent. Mostly for Undertaker/Triple H. Man I love that match and I can't believe how badly I was fooled. I really thought we were seeing the same type of ending that we saw in Flair/Shawn and than Undertaker/Shawn. It was set up perfectly as the final executive blow for Undertaker and then he kicks out. It also helps that I did not see Undertaker locking in Hell's Gate at all so the ending shocked me a second time in like 5 minutes.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

I think that the Bret/Shawn match is best enjoyed by fans of theirs. The first time I watched it I was underwhelmed (and I don't generally prefer brawls over wrasslin' anyway). Watching it again, though, I liked it a lot. Mainly because the atmosphere was so damn crazy, and I felt that both men played their roles perfectly. Maybe it's because they weren't really roles. :lol I'll watch other brawls and wonder why people are so into them, and it usually is because I'm not as into those wrestlers (that Benoit/Sullivan WCW brawl is a perfect example). I think that if you enjoy the dynamic of certain wrestlers, you'll enjoy their matches more.

Everything from the intense entrances to Shawn heeling it the hell up adds to it. I think it's the whole aura of the match that I enjoy more than anything. I do understand the other side, though, because like I said, I was underwhelmed by the match at first.





Choke2Death said:


> Excluding Orton matches (which you're familiar with I'd assume), these are good matches not listed there imo.
> 
> MITB matches (SD and Raw)
> Sheamus/Henry & Barrett/Bryan - SummerSlam
> ...





Jack Evans 187 said:


> I don't think it's "bad" enough to go through the hassle of returning it at this point. I'd just keep it and enjoy what you haven't seen, cause there's still plenty of good stuff on there.
> 
> Edge vs. Ziggler at the Rumble and the Rumble match itself
> ADR vs. Kofi at Elimination Chamber (minority opinion, but still)
> ...


Thank you guys so much for answering. As for the first post, yeah, it was kind of an impulsive buy, because it was on sale, and I didn't think I'd ever get it for that cheap again.

It's good to have a list of some of these recommended matches handy, and yeah, I think I'll keep the set. Mainly because like you said, Jack Evans 187, the hassle of shipping things back is a pain. A lot of the stuff you listed sounds interesting, so I'm getting more excited now.

Re: HHH/Taker at WM27, is that one considered better than their other match? Which one was the rematch (I'm talking of their two in a row, not their earlier match)? 


As for Benoit, I read that some people assumed that the audio going out during the Orton/Benoit SS '04 match was due to what Benoit did. Actually, that was a problem when that DVD was first released (long before Benoit killed his family). Apparently it was a technical difficulty, and a lot of people complained. They actually re-released it with the audio in tact (though they did change the artwork of the DVD). It's a pain, though, because that first one is still in circulation, so you never know if you'll get the right one.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

The Cole/Lawler business took up over 30 minutes at WRESTLEMANIA. But Sheamus and Bryan getting dropped to the preshow, which turned into a battle royal. fpalm

And they still dragged the feud on after that.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> I think that the Bret/Shawn match is best enjoyed by fans of theirs. The first time I watched it I was underwhelmed (and I don't generally prefer brawls over wrasslin' anyway). Watching it again, though, I liked it a lot. Mainly because the atmosphere was so damn crazy, and I felt that both men played their roles perfectly. Maybe it's because they weren't really roles. :lol I'll watch other brawls and wonder why people are so into them, and it usually is because I'm not as into those wrestlers (that Benoit/Sullivan WCW brawl is a perfect example). I think that if you enjoy the dynamic of certain wrestlers, you'll enjoy their matches more.
> 
> Everything from the intense entrances to Shawn heeling it the hell up adds to it. I think it's the whole aura of the match that I enjoy more than anything. I do understand the other side, though, because like I said, I was underwhelmed by the match at first.


I'm a big fan of both Bret and Shawn, which in turn made it the biggest reason why I thought the match was underwhelming. Even though I agree both of them played their parts really well, I felt the match could've been a lot more better if it had more time, but alas, the ending happened and it quickly overshadowed the match itself. As I said before, the brawl was great and added a lot to the match, I just felt that the match could've been better. Maybe my opinion will change on a rewatch.



HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> The Cole/Lawler business took up over 30 minutes at WRESTLEMANIA. But Sheamus and Bryan getting dropped to the preshow, which turned into a battle royal. fpalm
> 
> And they still dragged the feud on after that.


It sucks that Sheamus/Bryan didn't have a proper match at both Wrestlemania 27 and 28. I think that if those two went 15-20 minutes, they could've easily stolen the show.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> As for Benoit, I read that some people assumed that the audio going out during the Orton/Benoit SS '04 match was due to what Benoit did. Actually, that was a problem when that DVD was first released (long before Benoit killed his family). Apparently it was a technical difficulty, and a lot of people complained. They actually re-released it with the audio in tact (though they did change the artwork of the DVD). It's a pain, though, because that first one is still in circulation, so you never know if you'll get the right one.


What audio? I know Orton's entrance introduction is botched because the mic cuts out and Lawler makes a comment about it ("Even Howard Finkel is choked up"). On another note, it surprises me that the match had no video package building up to it. For such a historic match, it's funny how Taker chokeslammed JBL through the limo then they just cut to Lawler & JR talking about a Halloween atmosphere before Evolution's music hit.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

^People have written that the audio cuts out entirely during the Orton/Benoit SS match. Some people thought it was due to the murders, but it was a problem even before that happened.

Here's an example from 2004:


> Summerslam DVD Problem - Torch subscriber Mat La Vore writes: Transworld
> Entertainment (the company that owns FYE) sent a letter out today that said:
> "Due to legal issues we cannot sell Summerslam 2004. Please insure that this
> product is not placed out on your sales floor. This is only for the DVD, the
> ...





> Here are the catalog numbers for both 2004 releases of SummerSlam 2004:
> 
> WWE56084 – SummerSlam 2004 (Re-Issue)
> WWE56072 – SummerSlam 2004 (Original Release)
> ...





> Pretty much. Look for WWE56084, not WWE56072. I have the re-issue and the Anthology versions and there was no audio/video issues on both discs.
> 
> The only song that was dubbed over on the Anthology release was 'Sumertime Blues' by Rush.


So people have to look for that re-issue, but that first one is still being sold. I see on recent reviews of Summerslam 2004 on Amazon, people are still saying that they're getting the messed up ones, while others are saying that the one they got has no problem.

In short, at least it's not a case of the WWE being ridiculous and just totally editing out all of that audio. 






StraightEdgeJesus said:


> I'm a big fan of both Bret and Shawn, which in turn made it the biggest reason why I thought the match was underwhelming. Even though I agree both of them played their parts really well, I felt the match could've been a lot more better if it had more time, but alas, the ending happened and it quickly overshadowed the match itself. As I said before, the brawl was great and added a lot to the match, I just felt that the match could've been better. Maybe my opinion will change on a rewatch.


No, I agree with you, it could have used more actual wrestling. I think that Bret said that they only got to do about 30% of what they planned, due to the screwjob ending.




On another topic, since this seems to come up a lot here...I have no horse in this race, because I'd have to see more to form an opinion on this, but I found this interesting. In an article Meltzer wrote about Sting, Meltzer pointed this out as an aside:


> If wrestlers considered Sting a great worker, he'd be in [the Hall of Fame]. While that's not entirely what got Benoit in or Jericho in, *their peers did vote for them in strong numbers. Angle even more. I can't tell you how many guys, I mean guys who have worked on top with everyone, including if I name names, Austin, Rock, Benoit, Guerrero, Jarrett and even Flair who have told me that in their opinion, Kurt is either the best (three of the above said absolute best) or one of the best they were ever in the ring with. That's why he got in. You could argue they are wrong, but it is their opinion and those names have been in with an awful lot of great wrestlers.*


So opinions range from "Angle totally sucks and is a sack of shit" here to actual wrestlers saying that he's the best that they've ever been in the ring with.

Hmmm, looks like this is one guy I'm going to have to watch more of...


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

> While that's not entirely what got Benoit in or Jericho in, their peers did vote for them in strong numbers.


So what else was it? They weren't HOF-level stars. Well Jericho was inducted in 2010, which by that point he had two Observer WOTY whatevers to fall back on and a handful and promo awards and whatnot, but Benoit? He was inducted in 2003, before his biggest push. If ring work wasn't what got Benoit *entirely* in, then what else helped? You could maybe argue influence but even then he was massively influenced by someone else (who was in the first class in 96)................and the influence is that of ring work......


Getting in a HOF for ring work alone is.....IDK. I guess it relys on big names and guys with already great work reps to think you're great. What if neither Eddie, Benoit, Flair, Taker, the Rock, or Austin thought Angle was any good, but Funaki, Val Venis, D'Lo Brown, all of the Mean Street Posse, Al Snow, and fifty other not big names thought he was the greatest of all time?


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

LilOlMe said:


> Re: HHH/Taker at WM27, is that one considered better than their other match? Which one was the rematch (I'm talking of their two in a row, not their earlier match)?


I think it all comes down to opinion. I _think_ for the most part, people rate their End of an Era HIAC match higher and hold it in higher regard because of its meaning, but I personally have both in the *** 3/4 - **** range. The 27 match is just so difficult to rate because it doesn't even feel like a wrestling match, it's more of a dramatic 25 minute scene from a movie. It has its flaws but it's just... epic. haha. I like the HIAC match but I'd rather watch Mania 27. Mania 28 goes 30 minutes and the finishers just keep happening and happening and happening. I really don't wanna spark anymore conversation on these two matches though because it ALWAYS comes up in here. 

Then you have guys like Cal who just love the shit out of both of them and put them at like **** 3/4 each.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Who got you to rewatch bret/shawn svs 97 liOLme ? :hbk2

btw I didnt see your post on 2011, yea there are other good match besides the ones you own so I'd get it


@Corey yea same I didnt think it was all that, but I liked it alot on this watch for the same reasons


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

The problem I have with WrestleMania 27 is the only two things that event had going for it are Taker/HHH and Rock and both were just stories being furthered for what was to come next year, a WrestleMania should never be 'building' something else but be the conclusion.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Apparently some cat on youtube has posted a solid number of full WCW PPVs from 1998. Unsure how long they'll remain, but this might need to be taken advantage of by some folk. I only have a handful downloaded myself so this has gotten me quite excited. Think I'm gonna start out with Jericho's cruiserweight Battle Royal from Slamboree just for the classic promo + eruption when Malenko unmaskes. WCW's talent pool in '98, man. Talk about favorites.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Could you give me a ppv to watch, this place is a wasteland nowadays


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Money in the Bank 2010.
Fall Brawl 1994.
Road Wild 1998.

Three shows right out of the clear blue sky of my mind.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

YoungGun_UK said:


> The problem I have with WrestleMania 27 is the only two things that event had going for it are Taker/HHH and Rock and both were just stories being furthered for what was to come next year, a WrestleMania should never be 'building' something else but be the conclusion.


Obviously the Rock's involvement was all about building for next year but I can't say the same for Undertaker/Triple H. Yeah they had a rematch but their match told a complete story. Triple H and Undertaker threw everything they had at each other. Triple H clearly came out on top of the fight but he wasn't able to get the job done. This really establishes that there is some type of mystique around Undertaker at Wrestlemania. He wasn't able to walk away but he lost the match anyway. The false finish with the Tombstone created the illusion that the Undertaker was human. Triple H appeared to be putting the final nail in the coffin with the tombstone. when Undertaker kicked out of that it put some cracks into the idea that he was no longer this larger than life figure. But you were still left thinking, "He can't stand up, how can he win?" And then he fucking wins. The match was all about showing that no matter what you do to the Undertaker you just can't put that final nail in the coffin and beat him. 

I think that's a complete story. You didn't need anything else to say that the story was over. The Undertaker isn't human and it doesn't matter what you do to him because at Wrestlemania he just won't lose. The End. 

Of course we got a rematch but that was something different I feel like. That match also told an amazing story. Look at them like movies. Trips/Undertaker isn't like Star Wars where you need to see Return of the Jedi to finish the story that was started in Empire Strikes back. They're more like "Taken" and "Taken 2" because you don't need the second one to finish the story told in the first one.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Go watch Souled Out 98. And then go watch Spring Stampede 99.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Everyone always talks about the Cage match from Taboo Tuesday 2005, and rightfully so as it's positively fabulous. However, while watching random matches from my 2005 PPV set, I popped in the Triple threat match for the WWE title from that same event, and man, this was freaking awesome. It's HBK vs Cena vs Angle. Might be favorite non-WM20 Triple threat now. I highly recommend it to all, they don't go with the normal 3 way formula, all 3 guys are pretty much active throughout the entire match. 

**** from me.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I need more WCW events on DVD. All would be the more apt word I'm looking for, but I'm being partially realistic.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Go watch Souled Out 98. And then go watch Spring Stampede 99.


Kidman/Mysterio and Benoit and Malenko vs. Raven and Saturn are both pretty great matches from Spring Stampede 1999 from what I remember.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Kidman vs Mysterio isn't thanks to injuries & poor timing, but the tag is fabulous & one of the most underrated within WCW.

Juvi vs Blitzkreig is the powerhouse Cruiserweight match on that show.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

Not that big on the Kidman/Mysterio match from Spring Stampede 99 either. The move-trading stuff was fun I guess but wore off real quick and I was bored with it after a while, as was the crowd. The injuries as noted hurt the match as well. 

By the way, I was more impressed by how solid Konnan vs Disco Inferno was, even for Konnan's standards. It's nothing special but better than I recall it being.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Watching HBK/Taker WM25 for the first time in years and I'm only about 2 minutes into the match and it's already GOAT. Entrances + Shawn's feigning knee injury to catch Taker off guard = :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Konnan vs Disco was poor, but not being the biggest pile of wank is basically the positive that comes along with it. I'll credit Disco there, b/c he did a better job with Konnan than say more praiseworthy workers like Mysterio or Jericho did. Less or two _(three?)_ evils or not, it's a compliment.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Everyone always talks about the Cage match from Taboo Tuesday 2005, and rightfully so as it's positively fabulous. However, while watching random matches from my 2005 PPV set, I popped in the Triple threat match for the WWE title from that same event, and man, this was freaking awesome. It's HBK vs Cena vs Angle. Might be favorite non-WM20 Triple threat now. I highly recommend it to all, they don't go with the normal 3 way formula, all 3 guys are pretty much active throughout the entire match.
> 
> **** from me.


I've seen many people show their love for it (including in this thread), but I just couldn't get into it. Don't get me wrong, if someone coerced me, I would call it a good match, but I think for me, it was a case of considering a match good yet not liking it at all. Angle in 2005 was pretty bad since that was the peak of his "Angle-isms" phase in WWE, and this was no exception at times. I don't remember Cena doing anything good besides hold on to his ankle after the match. And I am not the biggest fan of Michaels/Angle interactions after someone (I think Yeah1993) somehow ruined them for me. Bah, maybe I'm just being too harsh, like I am with the rest of 2005. Nice review though, fellow Big Pun fan.

EDIT: Rewatched it, and definitely liked it a lot more than before. First half of the match was very fun. Love the way they pulled off the 2-on-1 assault on Cena. And then I stopped caring about it. Angle puts Michaels in a very long resthold and does DAT TOP ROPE ANGLESLAM after stalling. Cena's comeback probably should have came during the pinfall attempt after the top rope Angleslam, but it did add some more energy into the match. LOL at Angle's belly to belly on Michaels :angle. Then we had that horrible ankle lock spot that went on too long and had an obvious Michaels elbow breakup. Overall a nice fun spotfest that added to that otherwise lackluster PPV (remember that Austin was supposed to appear in this :austin).


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Am I crazy, or was the uber cliche formula of this a total put off? Even with someone very likable in the babyface role like Rollins _(and god damn I've never been anti-anything with him)_ this still comes across as idk, eeckh, overall. Never been a large fan of booking in this capacity either. It's that forced type of storytelling where it doesn't feel natural. Strictly formulaic. Of course, the real dilemma here is that the match was worked well by both men. Sandow the jerk opportunist & Rollins the determined babyface who sold the bum knee in real swell fashion. But the over-under of those components are put on the backburner b/c I'm too busy sitting there void of interest at what will happen next, thanks to it being mapped out in such obvious fashion. Frustrating, these matches are. A nice out for booking both parties strong back in the territory days, but in the modern age it's so diluted beyond repair.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Am I crazy, or was the uber cliche formula of this a total put off? Even with someone very likable in the babyface role like Rollins _(and god damn I've never been anti-anything with him)_ this still comes across as idk, eeckh, overall. Never been a large fan of booking in this capacity either. It's that forced type of storytelling where it doesn't feel natural. Strictly formulaic. Of course, the real dilemma here is that the match was worked well by both men. Sandow the jerk opportunist & Rollins the determined babyface who sold the bum knee in real swell fashion. But the over-under of those components are put on the backburner b/c I'm too busy sitting there void of interest at what will happen next, thanks to it being mapped out in such obvious fashion. Frustrating, these matches are. A nice out for booking both parties strong back in the territory days, but in the modern age it's so diluted beyond repair.


Can definitely see what you're saying. I liked that match you posted, but everything did feel obvious and a bit too structured. I know I'll get tons of heat for this (especially from :woolcock), but I felt the EXACT same way about that heavily acclaimed Windham/Murdoch match in Philadelphia. The formula was very similar to this one and it possessed two top tier workers - what could go wrong? Well, Windham's FIP segment went on too long, almost to the point where I wanted them to just move on already. Murdoch didn't do anything wrong in his control segment - he just didn't do anything out of the ordinary. And then we got our prototypical roll-up surprise finish. Once again, nothing the two wrestlers did was theoretically wrong at all, but in execution, I just wasn't able to "feel" for anything.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The "feel" of it all is lacking. When that's up & vanished, there is next to no reason to care. Sure, the wrestling is fine, but there has to be more to it than that. Discussion such as this is a good tangent towards the topic - not that I'm suggesting it - as why some folk feel a lad such as Lance Storm or hell, partially obscure plug, Chad Collyer are boring wrestlers. No natural flow behind their structured, aesthetically pleasing work, if you will.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

HBK's kickout of the Tombstone after skinning the cat + Taker's face afterward = greatest nearfall ever.

JR: "I JUST HAD AN OUT OF BODY EXPERIENCE~!" :lmao


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I'm pretty partial, but I really like Angle vs. Michaels vs. Cena. 

2005 Angle was definitely the peak of Angle's...Angle-ness though. It's okay because he's my favorite  :kurt


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> HBK's kickout of the Tombstone after skinning the cat + Taker's face afterward = greatest nearfall ever.
> 
> JR: "I JUST HAD AN OUT OF BODY EXPERIENCE~!" :lmao


That line.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Forgot how badly botched that around-the-horn DDT counter was but FUCK IT


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I remember the 2-3 page intense discussion on that DDT being the potential breaking point for some putting that match at the _"full five stars"_. Match fried the brains of all wrestling fans.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> The "feel" of it all is lacking. When that's up & vanished, there is next to no reason to care. Sure, the wrestling is fine, but there has to be more to it than that. Discussion such as this is a good tangent towards the topic - not that I'm suggesting it - as why some folk feel a lad such as Lance Storm or hell, partially obscure plug, Chad Collyer are boring wrestlers. No natural flow behind their structured, aesthetically pleasing work, if you will.


I've heard the same thing being said about my boy Dean Malenko as well. I can definitely see why people have an issue with the way he wrestles as a heel as his control segments make little to sense at times. But as a face, he sometimes gets criticized for being too "plain" with what he does, but I've seen more successful things from him than unsuccessful. For a guy with no mic skills and emotion, he was great at getting the crowd into his side. Just check out that Bret/Malenko match on Nitro. The way he sold that leg should be taught at every wrestling institution.

What would any of you recommend from Storm besides his matches with Edge, HHH, and Bryan? I faintly remember liking a match between him and Crowbar of all people :argh:


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Shawn Michaels vs. The Undertaker = GOAT WM Match


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

The Primer said:


> I remember the 2-3 page intense discussion on that DDT being the potential breaking point for some putting that match at the _"full five stars"_. Match fried the brains of all wrestling fans.


I mean, yeah, would've been nice if they had hit it cleanly, but it didn't ruin anything imo.


----------



## DDMac (Feb 20, 2005)

Looked like a pretty good move before the replay.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah, the replay really exposed it. Surprised JR didn't cover it up by saying Michaels didn't get all of it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I've heard the same thing being said about my boy Dean Malenko as well. I can definitely see why people have an issue with the way he wrestles as a heel as his control segments make little to sense at times. But as a face, he sometimes gets criticized for being too "plain" with what he does, but I've seen more successful things from him than unsuccessful. For a guy with no mic skills and emotion, he was great at getting the crowd into his side. Just check out that Bret/Malenko match on Nitro. The way he sold that leg should be taught at every wrestling institution.
> 
> What would any of you recommend from Storm besides his matches with Edge, HHH, and Bryan? I faintly remember liking a match between him and Crowbar of all people :argh:


Yeah, Dean has been put under that banner a ton of times too. However, I'm a bit more on your side given the context of how the fans blew up for him. He was severely over in 1997, 1998, & 1999 before the company regulated him back to a heel crony behind Shane Douglas. Jericho was a standout heel in their program, but Malenko simply being Malenko - aka ICEMAN - and erupting in anger towards Jericho allowed him to blow up to an even larger degree. You'd swear the guy was gonna go places with how over he became. Gave him an "in" to the Four Horsemen after all. Then that ended up being the slow downfall come the next year. Why?

I recall liking a match vs Justin Credible a good bit. Might have been Storm's final ECW match, but it was def right before he departed for WCW. So it was obviously on a PPV in 2000, just drawing a blank & not bothering to remember. Same goes for trying to point out more to name as worth seeing. b/c I'm sure I might be able to name more singles matches.



The Lady Killer said:


> I mean, yeah, would've been nice if they had hit it cleanly, but it didn't ruin anything imo.


Same. Thought the nit-picking there was quite absurd.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Is the Cena and Taker vs. JeriShow vs. DX match from RAW in 09 any good? I just saw that WWE uploaded it on YouTube and I'm willing to give it a look based on the star power and the CROWD.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's a sprint that wouldn't hurt to be checked out. Worth it b/c of the Undertaker & Cena union, tbhayley.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Yeah that 3-way tag takes place in MSG so the crowd is electric and the match is pretty fun. Interactions from pretty much everyone bring back memories of old feuds. Make sure you check out the postmatch happenings too.

I've only seen one of their bouts but don't most people like the Lance Storm vs. Mike Bennett series in ROH? I've only seen the Showdown in the Sun match and thought it was pretty good, albeit unspectacular. Know they had rematches on TV and at Border Wars I believe.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Also gonna co-sign Three Way Tag at MSG. One of the few highlights of RAW that year.

Del Rio vs. CM Punk at SvS 2011 still holds up very well. So many good things about this match that add to a great whole. One of the hotter crowds for a title match in recent history. Good ol' grappling to start that sets the tone of the match with Punk getting the advantage for the most part while Del Rio is still having a hard time adjusting to the big environment. We don't usually see Punk work on the arm in order to set up the Anaconda Vice, but we do here which is a nice touch. 

ADR finally gets the advantage after some help from Ricardo, which leads to a SICK spot where ADR blindsides Punk with a through-the-second-rope dropkick to the outside. Now for some ADR limbwork, which is always a pleasure, especially when you have the second best limb seller in the WWE doing his thing (first being Christian of course). Del Rio always adds those little details in his offense that make it that much better, such as locking the arm in his pinfall attempts and holding the submission for as long as possible when his opponent is holding on to the ropes. The holds also don't last very long, which lends itself to a very good pace. On top of that, Punk gets some nicely timed comeback attempts, which also lead to great momentum-stopping moments by Del Rio. Also worth noting that Del Rio's through-the-rope to the outside miss spot is always brutal to watch. I also really liked Punk's big boot on Rio. Never seen him hit it like that. Punk too pays attention to the details as always when he sells that arm, such as when he holds his arm after every bit of offense, using the uninjured arm in his kickouts, and using the right arm to attempt to pick up Del Rio. Integrating limbwork into your offense as well as your defense is what separates the good sellers from the great ones.

We talk a lot about how Del Rio can't seem to show charisma in the ring, but I liked how he gradually showed more and more frustration as the match went on. His facial expressions after pinfall attempts tell a story of their own. When the match goes to that crescendo, we get some nice nearfalls, including an elbow drop where the crowd popped like crazy. I also loved Punk's corner stomping taunt here. Wish he used it more often (also note how his hurt limb is dangling while the other arm is grabbing on to the rope). The armbar attempt (with ADR screaming DESTINY!) to roundhouse kick miss to armbar sequence was really smooth too. ADR's primal screaming along with Punk grabbing on to Del Rio's boots and kneepads to alleviate the pain while using his legs to touch the rope was also really cool. LOL at Del Rio pulling Punk's trunks down too far. I remember that rollup was a very convincing nearfall when I watched it live, and judging by the crowd reaction, they were worried too. Match ends with a roundhouse kick from Punk which leads to an ADR kickout, and then Punk catches an unsuspecting Del Rio in the vice. Last thing to note is the struggle that Del Rio shows when he's in the vice by grabbing on to Punk's face and trying to knee Punk in the head, while Punk shakes his head around to get rid of ADR's hand. Punk's heartfelt celebration with the title perfectly closes the first chapter to his reign as well as this great Survivor Series match. ******

Gonna go watch some more Survivor Series title match goodies. Cena/Jericho maybe? Bret/Diesel? Batista/Booker :side:


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

RAW Best of '09 is really good... 

Still need to see Punk vs. Del Rio for the first time. I say you watch Orton/Michaels from '07 and Cena/HHH/HBK from '09 too. Both doozies.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

CENA VS JERICHO. Can't get much better than that.

Still find Punk vs Del Rio from SSeries to be very mediocre. Their TV outings were much more favorable for me.

Random Survivor Series match pick(s): Joshi Elimination + talented jobbers tag from '95, Tajiri vs Regal from '01, & Headshrinkers vs High Energy + Yokozuna vs Virgil from '92.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

***1/4 for Wyatt Family vs Usos from last night's Smackdown, a nice long and fast-paced match

Anyway, rewatched Survivour Series 2004:

Cruiserweight Fatal 4 Way- ***
Christian/Benjamin- ***1/2
Team Angle/ Team Guerrero- ***
Heinderich/undertaker- DUD
Trish/lita- *
Team HHH/Team Orton- ***1/2


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Joshi+Opener Tag at SvS 95 are so good. Why are we the only ones that ever talk about them? BARRY HOROWITZ! HEEL 1-2-3 KID! MARTY JANNETTY!

Haven't seen either Orton/Michaels or Cena/Jericho in a year. Sid/HBK also needs a watch. Backlund/Hart too. I remember actually disliking that match the one time I watched it. Too many damn restholds for me, and Owen was the only guy that entertained me. That means I have to rewatch it. I do recall liking their Superstars match. LOL at that wasted Mania match. WWE cannot do an I Quit match correctly. Except in the Attitude Era for whatever reason.

BACKLUND!


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

The 3 way tag at MSG from 09 was way too much fun. All the callbacks to previous feuds made me :mark:. Oh, and Cena vs. Undertaker BETTER happen. :side:

I liked Survivor Series 04. I thought the RAW SS tag was really good (although I've only seen it once), Christian vs. Shelton was good, and the opener was fun. Team Angle vs. Team Guerrero is shit though. Angle's team was :lmao

Oh! And while looking at the Survivor Series 04 match card, I remembered Carlito's bodyguard Jesús and that terrible stabbing storyline with Cena :lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Don't forget about Rad Radford aka LOUIE SPICOLI. As to why? b/c apparently undercard workers will forever be unappreciated among most. I'll never know why.

I'd skip on Backlund vs Hart, but that's just me. Haven't seen it in a good while, but my memory on it is quite sustained. Nothing more except for 30+ minute match that hardly exceeded past rest holds. Unsure if it is any different than the crummy Hart vs Michaels Iron Man, tbhayley.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Cody did you know that that dude who hangs out with Hunico is MENG'S SON!?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Of course. It's both hilarious & sad _(if he's got the potential)_

This is awesome too b/c I'm watching a MENG match as I type this.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Yeah1993, is Meng vs. Jobber Edge in WCW your favorite Edge match of all-time?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Meng vs Barbarian holds up. Knew it would b/c it's a sub-five minute match where they just clobber each other. Pre-dated JOY~! comment.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Now go watch Barbarian vs. Jim Duggan and marvel at the post-match craziness. Meng's greatest moment. Resembled what a bar fight involving Meng would have looked like. Not only can I not believe that the Faces of Fear were never tag champs, but more importantly, I cannot believe I wasn't a fan of Meng in my prior life.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Fuck YES.

Duggan making the save made me hope there was a MENG & Duggan vs Barbarian & Morrus tag, but the singles will suffice.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> ^People have written that the audio cuts out entirely during the Orton/Benoit SS match. Some people thought it was due to the murders, but it was a problem even before that happened.
> 
> Here's an example from 2004:
> 
> ...


Thanks for that info RE: Summerslam 2004 DVD, checked mine and its got WWE1085 , so I assume I have the reissue.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Yeah1993, is Meng vs. Jobber Edge in WCW your favorite Edge match of all-time?


Just watched one...wasn't too good.  Edge looks to be almost horrible as a guy being squashed. I don't like his selling to begin with, but when trying to get a guy over who's bigger than him (but not as tall) he looked useless. I won't expect a guy to go through hell pin-balling himself over the ring, but, FFS, do SOMETHING. His attempts at offense were piles of nothing other than the clothesline that Meng didn't budge on which was cool (he no-sold pretty much everything but that was the only note-worthy thing). Meng's stuff didn't even have the same energy to it. I've watched a ton of Meng, Yokozuna and Goldberg matches in 2013 and this was one of the worst squash matches I can remember seeing the whole year. Didn't even have that 'Meng v. Anyone' novelty going for it. Seabs should check it out though so he can give it a higher star rating than Atlantis/Villano and Ishikawa/Greco b/c SCUUUUUUMBAG. Now I might need to watch Yoko v. Virgil again to get the taste of 1996 Edge out of my mouth. 



Everyone's seen Meng v. the Giant, right? AKA the match with THE SMARTEST FINISH OF ALL FUCKING TIME!?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Was he rocking the Sexton Hardcastle moniker? Lets hope so.

Meng vs Giant aka the greatest match that isn't Goldberg vs La Parka? Pfft, I eat my cereal to it every day.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

"Damon Striker".


I just had to watch Meng/Giant again. Almost had to stop my gum from falling out of my mouth like seven times in that two minutes. That was fist-fighting up there with any fist-fighting in prograparoonies history. Good Lord the BEEF. When Wight hits those multiple palms in the turnbuckle I just lost it. Meng does his deathgrip pose and I lose it some more. Then that finish. Oh holy sweet Asian women that finish. Goddamn match is even better than I remembered. GOATC.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm prepared to make a potential awful moniker out of the fun of reading your review:

BEEF of BEEFs was that match. 

Yeah, all I got. BEEF was almost all this post said.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I think Andy had a blogpost he called "Beef 'n' BEEF", and I thought that would be an incredible name for a steakhouse/rib joint where the manliest of manly wrestling matches are played on a TV while you shred meat with your fangs like an epileptic rottweiler.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The only kind of place I could see Cal attend.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

BEEF. 

Someone link me to Beef n BEEF match please.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

It's MENG. It's THE GIANT. It's BEEF MEETS BEEF.

Fucking hell Giant tries to DECAPITATE Meng with a chop out of the corner. And Meng just comes back for more because he doesn't give a fuck. Neither can know the other down so they just keep fucking hitting each other. And then THAT FINISH. Holy fuckity fuck was that awesome. :mark: how can anyone be vegetarian or vegan? I know I can't because I LOVE BEEF and this is super fucking tasty.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Watched that MSG RAW Main Event posted on the WWE YT channel, ***1/4 good match between legends. Short, 9 minutes I think, but great. The interactions between Shawn and Taker, HHH and Taker and the Tombstone were awesome

Also


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Batista vs Eddie Guerrero World Heavyweight Championship No Mercy 2005

Hadn't seen this in a while so I decided to check it out. IIRC this is Eddies last PPV match, and he really does an incredible job with the character work. This is after his feud with Rey where he was one of the greatest heels I've ever seen. Now, he's the "new and improved" Eddie Guerrero and he claims to have changed his ways. Obviously Batista is skeptical that such a transformation has taken place. For the most part this match is worked as a baby face vs baby face encounter, but several times Eddie has to fight the temptation to lie, cheat, and steal, which I absolutely love. The first time happens about 5 minutes into the match, when Batista gets the advantage on Eddie and starts pounding away, so Eddie bails out of the ring and grabs a chair. He eventually decides against using it. Then later on when Eddie has Batista down, he goes to the turnbuckle and grabs the tag string, with the intent on choking Batista. He decides against that as well. Finally the ref gets knocked down and Eddie gives that amazing asshole smirk that he does and goes and grabs a chair. He brings it into the ring and starts to hit Batista before stopping mid swing and tossing the chair out. The performance by Eddie was what made this match go, the ring work was solid (like every Eddie match, duh) but the story of whether Eddie had really changed or not is what sucks you in. The ending is, Batista gets mad that Eddie had a chair in the ring, even tho he didn't get hit with it, hits the spinebuster then Batista bombs Eddie for the 1-2-3. ****3/4*


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I love the story of that match, it's similar to Bret/Piper but Eddie puts more into it, however I've never been THAT much of a fan of the match just because the ring work leaves a lot to be desired imo. Batista was still green as shit and wouldn't put on good performances on any kind of consistent basis until 07 when his feud with Undertaker helped him out tremendously. HHH got the HIAC match out of him but honestly that was about it for Batista until 07. Not even Eddie could do too much with him, so while the story was great it wasn't backed up with anything else, unlike Bret/Piper which was pretty good on both counts (ring and story).


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> I love the story of that match, it's similar to Bret/Piper but Eddie puts more into it, however I've never been THAT much of a fan of the match just because the ring work leaves a lot to be desired imo. Batista was still green as shit and wouldn't put on good performances on any kind of consistent basis until 07 when his feud with Undertaker helped him out tremendously. HHH got the HIAC match out of him but honestly that was about it for Batista until 07. Not even Eddie could do too much with him, so while the story was great it wasn't backed up with anything else, unlike Bret/Piper which was pretty good on both counts (ring and story).



I pretty much agree with everything you said. The ring work wasn't spectacular or anything to write home about. It was just good enough that it didn't detract from the story being told, and the story and character performance by Eddie is what I really loved about it.

Batista was just so stiff and rigid in the ring during his first few years. He could hardly do much without seeming like an uncoordinated oof in the ring. That Hell in a Cell match was so good because it was designed to hide all of Batista's limitations in the ring (and believe me, he had ALOT of them at that point) and really accentuated the few good things he could do in the ring (raw power, intensity, telling a story with his expressions). Until Batista got under the tutelage of the Deadman, he didn't do much at all in the ring.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

No Mercy 2005 is such a great PPV. Four very good matches on the show.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

So guys I was at FYE yesterday and came across the whole set of 2005 PPVS for only $48.99. I was completely sold. 2005 is a solid year for ppvs and I only have Summerslam from that year. Seems like they just wanted to get rid of it. 

Deal!


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Thread in the General WWE section where everyone thinks Trips should face Austin or Rock at Mania. :kenny

Getting into Surivor Series 2004 now.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I wish I had the money to get the 05 boxset. Even if I found it cheap I couldn't afford it. Then again I already own half the PPV's (NYR, RR, WM, JD, Vengeance, SVS) so I could probably just get the rest individually for cheap over a period of time. Buy one a month or something lol.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

xdoomsayerx said:


> So guys I was at FYE yesterday and came across the whole set of 2005 PPVS for only $48.99. I was completely sold. 2005 is a solid year for ppvs and I only have Summerslam from that year. Seems like they just wanted to get rid of it.
> 
> Deal!



That's why I've been talking about all these 05' matches, I got the box set myself off of Amazon for $51 shipped. 2005 is just a great year all around, it's definitely worth the buy. I'm searching EVERYWHERE for a 2004 boxset though, that's my favorite year, Eddie and Benoit on top, how can you beat that?

2005 on PPV is great though, you got:

Orton vs Taker series (WM, SS, NM, Armageddon)
HBK vs Angle (WM, Vengeance)
Eddie vs Rey (WM, JD, GAB, SS)
Flair vs HHH (TT, SVS)
HHH vs Batista (WM, BL, Vengeance)

Plus Benoit carrying random jobbers to the matches of their career for the US title, and his EXCELLENT LMS match with Edge at Backlash. The best Chamber match ever, the best MitB match ever.....just a lot to like about the year as a whole.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Batista/Eddie has to be one of the biggest carry jobs of all time. Batista literally did not add a single thing to that match. Eddie was just so on point that he made everything work. I'm convinced that if Hornswoggle was his opponent that night, he would have churned out a great match. What else did No Mercy have besides that and the casket match?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Batista/Eddie has to be one of the biggest carry jobs of all time. Batista literally did not add a single thing to that match. Eddie was just so on point that he made everything work. I'm convinced that if Hornswoggle was his opponent that night, he would have churned out a great match. What else did No Mercy have besides that and the casket match?



It had the Benoit/Booker/Christian/Jordan 4-way, Mysterio vs JBL, LOD vs MNM, Nunzio vs Juvy, Holly vs Kennedy, and Lashley vs Simon Dean (who?)

You are right about it being a carry job, Eddie literally did everything in that match, all Batista had to do was shake the ropes, hit a spine buster, act betrayed when Eddie had the chair, and hit the Batista bomb to go home. That's it.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cant find both those svs 95 tags 

I have alot of work to do, and its my friends b-day so we are taking him out, gonna watch some svs matches inbetween, want to get a list of some sort but idk think I will have the time


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Simon Dean = Nova = man of 1006 moves. Guy killed it in ECW, much to KillaCal's chagrin.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Simon Dean = Nova = man of 1006 moves. Guy killed it in ECW, much to KillaCal's chagrin.




I wonder if Cal is ever gonna figure out the source of the KillaCal name. Maneuverings nuthin new to me. Gemstones Flintstones you could say im friends with Fred.


I'll have to look up that Nova guy, never actually heard of him. Got a match in particular that stands out?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Ha, actually just came to ask why I'm called that. So tell me and stuff, otherwise I'll stop caring anyway.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> It had the Benoit/Booker/Christian/Jordan 4-way, Mysterio vs JBL, LOD vs MNM, Nunzio vs Juvy, Holly vs Kennedy, and Lashley vs Simon Dean (who?)
> 
> You are right about it being a carry job, Eddie literally did everything in that match, all Batista had to do was shake the ropes, hit a spine buster, act betrayed when Eddie had the chair, and hit the Batista bomb to go home. That's it.


Are you just gonna forget about the MOTN like that? :side:

EDIT: Actually nvm, forgot that funnyfaces mentioned it at the end of his post.

Batista/Eddie, Orton/Taker, JBL/Rey and Fatal Four Way = AWESOME!


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8RB1UV8m6b4

There is an actual song too but I can't find it.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I figured KillaCal would be a spin off of Killa Cam. :lol

Could also be taken from "Killa Cali".


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Without watching that video oor clicking that link

KillaCal is a knock off of the rapper known as Camron, his nickname is KillaCam, so FF placed it on you just switched out the Cam for Cal


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well now I'm disappointed. I thought the name might be a reference to something cool. Instead it's to some shitty rapper.

Hmmm... that's a bit redundant, isn't it? Just saying rapper would have been enough, because they are all a pile of fucking shite.

NM 05, I don't recall anything being good bar the casket match. Eddie/Batista is ok at best tbh. Don't really remember Rey/JBL but it sounds good on paper. 4 way is trash.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Don't forget that Cam'ron, KillaCam, is one of the coolest funniest guys ever. So it's a compliment to be called KillaCal, because everyone loves DIPSET.

I mean, anyone that can make a song called "Suck it or not" is pretty darn cool in my book.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

KillaCal showing exactly why gingers have no soul. 8*D



Cactus Jack said:


> Don't forget that Cam'ron, KillaCam, is one of the coolest funniest guys ever. So it's a compliment to be called KillaCal, because everyone loves DIPSET.
> 
> I mean, anyone that can make a song called "Suck it or not" is pretty darn cool in my book.


And who doesn't wanna keep a shotgun like Elmer Fudd?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)




----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Clicking that video just made me realize that commenting on youtube being harder now is a good thing.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The wrestlers of Team Skins of A True Friend (me and Skins25) on the History Draft are so fucking :mark:.

Arn Anderson, DDP, Volk Han, Windham, Blanchard, Magnum, Eddie Guerrero, Rey, Tajiri, Hennig, Goldust, AJ Styles, JoMo, Pillman, Psychosis, ... and Goldberg. 8*D


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

SVS 2011 is so much fun. DAT CROWD. The Main Event was really good. Rocky was smooth as everything here. 

Ziggler/Morrision - ***1/2
Post match: *****
Eve/Beth - ** (extra * for the finish)
SVS Elimination - **3/4
Henry/Show - ***
Punk/ADR - ***1/2
Main Event - ***1/4

Next, MITB 2011 :mark: Haven't seen it since it aired.


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

Ahh Survivor Series 11,

the most blah main event.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Hmm...I do remember JBL/Rey from NM 05 being good. Oh dear, I'm starting to warm up to 2005. Time to wash it away by watching a non-Eddie/HHH Batista match :batista2

Cam'ron's verse on the Get Em Daddy Remix is GOAT. Wrestling references to start with, and then those initials rapping at the very end was sick. Also had the best punchline I've ever heard ("They mad my car's like an elephant, the trunk in the front) :lmao

Some of my favorite Nova matches include his match with BelvisSome of my favorite Nova matches include matches with Bilvis, Matt Hardy in 2003, Cena in OVW, Chris Chetti, Eddie Guerrero (good luck finding this), 6-Man WWA cruiserweight battle, and a 4-Way Light Heavyweight match in JAPW. The draw of Nova was that he always showed us some new crazy move in every match.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Hmm...I do remember JBL/Rey from NM 05 being good. Oh dear, I'm starting to warm up to 2005. Time to wash it away by watching a non-Eddie/HHH Batista match :batista2


Yes, watch this to realize that 2005 rules!


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

*Survivor Series 2004*

Mysterio vs Kidman vs Chavo vs Spike Dudley - Cruiserweight Title **1/2
Christian vs Shelton Benjamin - Intercontinental Title ****
Angle/Luther Reigns/Jindrak/Carlito vs Show/Cena/RVD/Eddie ***
Undertaker vs Heidenreich ***1/2
Trish vs Lita N/A
JBL vs Booker T **
Trips/Batista/Edge/Snitsky vs Orton/Jericho/Benoit/Maven ***1/2

Shelton/Christian is easily match of the night here. Christian does a great job heeling it up, and Shelton's athleticism is really something to behold. Decided to go ahead and pop for the full ****, which may be a bit high, but this is really a fun watch.

Opener is fine, but would have like to have seen more Kidman offense. He and Chavo had a feud going, so the finish with Kidman costing Chavo worked. Spike Dudley though :lol

Heidenreich/Taker is interesting. Don't think it's a great match, but though Heidenreich did fairly well, and they gave the match a good bit of time. 

Wasn't really feeling the Lita losing her baby story. Lita being Trish's ass though :mark:

JBL/Booker :lmao :lmao Josh Matthews doing a run-in :lmao :lmao

Main event is fine. Don't really feel Orton as a face, but those last two RKOs :mark: Love how every time Naitch gets thrown out of a match the first thing he does is take off his jacket :lmao Then he throws it at the fan who always wears the gas attendant shirt and red ball cap :lmao


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Wasn't really feeling the Lita losing her baby story. *Lita being Trish's ass though* :mark:


That sounds very kinky.

SVS 04 is a pretty fun show throughout. Enjoyed all the main matches, including JBL/Booker.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


> So what else was it? They weren't HOF-level stars. Well Jericho was inducted in 2010, which by that point he had two Observer WOTY whatevers to fall back on and a handful and promo awards and whatnot, but Benoit? He was inducted in 2003, before his biggest push. If ring work wasn't what got Benoit *entirely* in, then what else helped? You could maybe argue influence but even then he was massively influenced by someone else (who was in the first class in 96)................and the influence is that of ring work......
> 
> 
> Getting in a HOF for ring work alone is.....IDK. I guess it relys on big names and guys with already great work reps to think you're great. What if neither Eddie, Benoit, Flair, Taker, the Rock, or Austin thought Angle was any good, but Funaki, Val Venis, D'Lo Brown, all of the Mean Street Posse, Al Snow, and fifty other not big names thought he was the greatest of all time?


Good question. In Jericho's case, maybe wrestlers respect him as an all-arounder. In Benoit's case it's almost certainly for wrestling ability, but maybe Meltzer is talking about things that are related to wrestling ability, but not just that specifically. Like being able to excel across multiple organizations, and being a small guy, etc.

I'm not sure the more respected wrestlers' votes are weighted more. Or maybe he only even gets votes from respected wrestlers. I'm not sure.




Jack Evans 187 said:


> I think it all comes down to opinion. I _think_ for the most part, people rate their End of an Era HIAC match higher and hold it in higher regard because of its meaning, but I personally have both in the *** 3/4 - **** range. The 27 match is just so difficult to rate because it doesn't even feel like a wrestling match, it's more of a dramatic 25 minute scene from a movie. It has its flaws but it's just... epic. haha. I like the HIAC match but I'd rather watch Mania 27. Mania 28 goes 30 minutes and the finishers just keep happening and happening and happening. I really don't wanna spark anymore conversation on these two matches though because it ALWAYS comes up in here.
> 
> Then you have guys like Cal who just love the shit out of both of them and put them at like **** 3/4 each.


Thanks. I'll be the determining factor. :hayden3

Your posts are always helpful, by the way. Just wanted to let you know that, since I can't rep you again.




SKINS25 said:


> Who got you to rewatch bret/shawn svs 97 liOLme ? :hbk2
> 
> btw I didnt see your post on 2011, yea there are other good match besides the ones you own so I'd get it


I dunno, some random Dolph Ziggler fan. :jericho2

And thanks. (Y)




Clint Eastwood said:


> Thanks for that info RE: Summerslam 2004 DVD, checked mine and its got WWE1085 , so I assume I have the reissue.


I'm jelly. I have the distinct feeling that I'm gonna end up receiving the messed up one.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

Nova was the go-to guy in terms of making wrestlers look good, especially in OVW. I enjoyed his time there. Too bad he has a bad reputation there for being a stooge. :lol















I need to watch more of his ECW work though. I only caught a few of his stuff as Super Nova.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

It used to be an IWC meme that Nova created every move in existence. Then :jericho stole that meme from him. I would also recommend bWo tag matches, but Blue Meanie kinda ruins them by being stupid. Stevie Richards though :lenny. Another underrated worker. Except in WWF No Mercy.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

I always miss the coolest conversations in here. That Killa Cam beat is one of my all time favorites. Yellow diamonds in my ear, call em lemonheads.



xdoomsayerx said:


> So guys I was at FYE yesterday and came across the whole set of 2005 PPVS for only $48.99. I was completely sold. 2005 is a solid year for ppvs and I only have Summerslam from that year. Seems like they just wanted to get rid of it.
> 
> Deal!


What a bargain! Why can;t I come across these things? Not that I'd buy it, I have like half the shows already anyway. 



LilOlMe said:


> Your posts are always helpful, by the way. Just wanted to let you know that, since I can't rep you again.


:banderas

Still waiting on that Disc 2 review from HBK's From the Vault.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> I always miss the coolest conversations in here. That Killa Cam beat is one of my all time favorites. Yellow diamonds in my ear, call em lemonheads.
> 
> 
> What a bargain! Why can;t I come across these things? Not that I'd buy it, I have like half the shows already anyway.
> ...




Lemonhead, end up dead, ice like Winnipeg; gemstones, Flintstones, you could say I'm friends with Fred:side:

I don't have time to watch a whole show right now, but does anyone have any good gems from 2005 that were on PPV? Anything that's not the main event will do. 

One that I dug was the Eugene/Regal vs Christian/Tomko tag at NYR. That was actually really really fun.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> I don't have time to watch a whole show right now, but does anyone have any good gems from 2005 that were on PPV? Anything that's not the main event will do.


Matt Hardy vs Edge from Unforgiven is must-watch. If not that (since it's well known), you can go for Benoit vs Jordan from The Bash. It's the only decent one-on-one Jordan match I can think of other than the one with Orton in early 2006. Jericho vs Shelton from Backlash is excellent too. Kane vs Edge from Vengeance is pretty enjoyable like the whole PPV.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

LilOlMe said:


> Good question. In Jericho's case, maybe wrestlers respect him as an all-arounder. In Benoit's case it's almost certainly for wrestling ability, but maybe Meltzer is talking about things that are related to wrestling ability, but not just that specifically. Like being able to excel across multiple organizations, and being a small guy, etc.
> 
> I'm not sure the more respected wrestlers' votes are weighted more. Or maybe he only even gets votes from respected wrestlers. I'm not sure.


I'd be surprised if any wrestler who turns in a ballot wasn't of some significance, but the backstage rep/other wrestlers' opinions means a lot to whoever's voting. Can't all be voters who were there at the time or experiencing each HOFC, or your Gotchs and Londos' would never get in. Same way it can't be all active wrestlers voting for guys like Angle in 2003. If the voters who were formerly wrestlers hear that everyone say Angle is the best guy they've ever worked with, that rep will get him a spot on the ballot (and in the HOF, in some cases LIKE Angle). Which is fairly understandable.

I have absolutely NO clue which former wrestlers might be on the Voting Bunch O' Dudes. Guessing Erik Watts is one of them, though.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Matt Hardy vs Edge from Unforgiven is must-watch. If not that (since it's well known), you can go for Benoit vs Jordan from The Bash. It's the only decent one-on-one Jordan match I can think of other than the one with Orton in early 2006. Jericho vs Shelton from Backlash is excellent too. Kane vs Edge from Vengeance is pretty enjoyable like the whole PPV.



Yea, the only matches I can actually say I'm a big fan of from Edge are his series with Hardy in 2005 and his matches with the Undertaker in 2008 (well, the WM and SS matches to be exact). So I've seen that Unforgiven match several times, it's tremendous. I don't outright dislike Edge, I actually get a kick out of his Rated R Superstar character, I just think his ring work in general leaves a lot to be desired most times. He's lazy.

I've seen the Benoit/Jordan matches as well, I'll have to check the Jericho/Shelton match out right now then. I usually enjoy Shelton in the ring, I think he's a solid mid card worker. Thanks for the tip.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Survivor Series 2010:

Daniel Bryan vs Ted DiBiase Jr - ***1/2
John Morrison vs Sheamus - ***1/2
Dolph Ziggler vs Kaval - ***1/4
Team Mysterio vs Team Del Rio - ***1/4
Natalya vs Laycool - 1/2*
Kane vs Edge - *
Nexus vs Santino/Kozlov - *
Wade Barrett vs Randy Orton - *1/4

Awesome start to the show but the entire 2nd half is dreadful.

Survivor Series 2011:

Dolph Ziggler vs John Morrison - ***1/2
Beth Phoenix vs Eve Torres - **
Team Barrett vs Team Orton - ***
Big Show vs Mark Henry - **1/2
CM Punk vs Alberto Del Rio - ***3/4
Rock & Cena vs Awesome Truth - *

Decent show with a few good matches but overall not great.

Survivor Series 2012:

Team Brodus Clay vs Team Tensai - ***1/2
Eve Torres vs Kaitlyn - **1/4
Antonio Cesaro vs R-Truth - **
Sheamus vs Big Show - ***1/2
Team Ziggler vs Team Foley - **
CM Punk vs Ryback vs John Cena - ***1/4

Another meh show. Opener and Show/Sheamus were pretty good, didn't really love anything else. Main event was solid though, Shield's debut was great.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Batista/Eddie has to be one of the biggest carry jobs of all time. Batista literally did not add a single thing to that match. Eddie was just so on point that he made everything work. I'm convinced that if Hornswoggle was his opponent that night, he would have churned out a great match. What else did No Mercy have besides that and the casket match?


I thought Eddie was awesome in it, but Batista being total dead weight kind of always turned me off to really digging the match. I've only seen it twice & haven't watched since 2010 so - NATURALLY - I should watch it again. Get some Eddie swag rolling.

No Mercy had that awesome underrated four way with Benoit vs Christian vs Booker vs Jordan & I always liked Juvi vs Nunzio. Never did like the Casket match. Only flaw about the Taker vs Orton feud.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

Man, that Edge vs Kane match was so bad. Thank god that they didn't have a rematch at TLC 2010 and WWE went with a Fatal Four Way TLC match instead.

Their Last Man standing match on Smackdown that year however is good.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Dislike their last man standing match a great deal too. Original airing I thought it was a total blast. The rewatch not long ago debunked that swiftly. Those two lost their neat chemistry from 2005, that's for sure.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

who did edge have chemistry with besides matt hardy ?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Undertaker, Orton in 2004, Benoit and Cena just to name a few.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Kane. The first time around. 
Shawn Michaels.
Undertaker & Angle can count here b/c for the matches I actually like vs them, I think they're really good.
RVD.
Jeff Hardy.
Chris Benoit.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

SKINS25 said:


> who did edge have chemistry with besides matt hardy ?


:angle

I think he's a good wrestler throughout most of his career, but for the life of me I cannot think of a match where he did well against a poor worker. Maybe Batista in 2007, but that was one match that will probably go down on rewatch.

I can't wait for the eventual ONS 2005 review. DAT AWESOME/TANAKA pairing.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Undertaker, Orton in 2004, Benoit and Cena just to name a few.


I'll give you taker, never seen any of the benoit stuff, which orton match was good ? I remember hearing there is a overrated one and a good one, and the cena matches are hit and miss tbhayley


Edit: remember liking the hbk 05 match, never seen the 02 angle matches


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Edge became shit at the end, but fuck it. I know I dig a good bit of his career so that's enough for me. Not like I see anyone ever overrate him to try and tell me my opinion on that topic is "off". Oh wait, only with xdoomsayerx. But that just ends up being funny.

Masato Tanaka, you say? I'm shocked by how I'm about the only fan of that guy here. In regards to his WHOLE career. He's still awesome these days.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Just got SS 12 and WM 23 in the mail today not sure which to watch first.


----------



## Leon Knuckles (Sep 2, 2013)

ric flair dvd documentary is good stuff.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

WrestleMania for Undertaker, man.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> I'll give you taker, never seen any of the benoit stuff, which orton match was good ? I remember hearing there is a overrated one and a good one, and the cena matches are hit and miss tbhayley
> 
> 
> Edit: remember liking the hbk 05 match, never seen the 02 angle matches



Definitely check out the Edge vs Benoit Last Man Standing match at Backlash 2005. So friggin awesome. The finish is amazing. It's up there with Batista/Taker and Foley/Rocky as my second favorite LMS match behind only the Jericho/Trips classic. Benoit is such a bad ass in that match. Love it love it love it.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

SKINS25 said:


> I'll give you taker, never seen any of the benoit stuff, *which orton match was good* ? I remember hearing there is a overrated one and a good one, and the cena matches are hit and miss tbhayley


Raw 10/5/04
Vengeance
Raw 18/7/04
Raw 13/12/04
Raw 30/4/07

Take your pick.

Over the Limit was shit but I think they have another match the week before MITB 10 that was not bad.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Masato Tanaka can almost do no wrong. The wrong that he did do was that terrible match with Hayabusa in FMW unk3

But if I can be serious for a moment. Tanaka is a very special talent. He can wrestle many different styles and can dish out as well as take a lot of punishment. Does his reputation of being part of "garbage wrestler promotions" hurt him? And is it cool to dislike the Tanaka/Awesome series? Sure their matches were largely the same, but each and every one of them were exciting. MIKE AWESOME!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I think what I've noticed about the Tanaka gripes have been is how he always tends to incorporate his hardcore spots into matches that don't always have to call for it + some selling aspects. Like in some wars he didn't sell as long or well that he should have off something that appears brutal. All I know is the guy is still killing it for me. Started the year off with a fun war vs Ishii, had some real quality tags along the way, another super fun match vs Honma _(sprint variation)_ & two MOTN's for my money on iPPV vs Naito. I don't mind a wallop of a signapore cane or a table spot in one of his matches if it doesn't take away. Usually seems to come off fine given the context of how some others in Japan work.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

As far the Edge discussion goes, 2001-03 was Edge's height as an in-ring performer. He was a solid-in ring worker, if not unspectacular...although I agree with Primer that towards the end it seemed like he was just going through the motions.

I love me some Tanaka. His matches with Nagata and Kanemoto are some good ones, and I'm a fan of the Awesome series as they worked very well together and their ONS '05 match was MOTN. His 2008 stuff in Japan really made me a fan.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Edge's 2005 was probably his best year for me considering he had the stuff vs Michaels, MITB, vs Benoit, vs Kane, & the brilliant scenario with Hardy for a good portion of the Summer into the Fall. Just a sign of how highly I think of RAW circa 2005, tbf. Not to mention it was the year where he actually felt like a definitive heel. Not some cliched watered down guy like how he was once he got to Smackdown.

Tanaka vs Nagata 10/13/08? b/c that one ruled.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

The Primer said:


> Tanaka vs Nagata 10/13/08? b/c that one ruled.


*Yessir! I haven't seen it in awhile though, definitely need to add to that to re-watch list. *


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Gonna try and search for it right now. Doesn't look promising, unfortunately. :hayley2


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Funny. I was just looking up some Yuji Nagata right now. Can never go wrong with him either. Even in WCW.

2006 is Edge's best year for me, and he was one of only three guys worth a damn that year (the other two being Finlay and Benoit). Now 2006 is a year that I doubt that I will ever like. Man that Edge/Cena feud sucked, but Edge did his best in carrying Cena to something enjoyable. What a year he had. Flair TLC, Foley WM, 6-Man ONS match, RVD in Vengeance, Cena in SS (but not Cage match or Unforgiven), triple threat with Cena and Edge, Backlash triple threat, tag matches with Orton, Big Show, and Jeff Hardy. My goodness what a year.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

2006 was a weird year RAW was dominated by Edge-Cena fued (which I loved) and then there was DX (and well that got old) fast but Smackdown was enjoyable...although the King Booker as World Champion was...eh. 

Edge did have a good 2006 year, and he excels best in hardcore/stipulation matches which made the Edge-Cena matches work. Excluding Foley, Edge and Flair were probably tops in stipulation matches that year when you consider Flair had three goodies that year with the TLC match, the hardcore match with Show, the I Quit with Foley.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cena/Edge feud in 2006 was excellent. They had such chemistry in their segments. Specially love the post-Unforgiven segment when Edge gets his hometown crowd to boo him in 30 seconds.

2006 is the last year for Cena as a character that I really like. He's been better this year than he has in a long time but he's still corny as fuck when he's not wrestling.

2006 as a whole was slightly down from 2005 in quality but still the last really good year WWE has had. 2008 and 2013 have both been solid but that's about as good as it has gotten.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nagata is an underrated cat. Another one I'll always be real big on. Glad he got to catalog a decent bit of matches in America via WCW.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Cena/Edge feud in 2006 was excellent. They had such chemistry in their segments. Specially love the post-Unforgiven segment when Edge gets his hometown crowd to boo him in 30 seconds.
> 
> 2006 is the last year for Cena as a character that I really like. He's been better this year than he has in a long time but he's still corny as fuck when he's not wrestling.
> 
> 2006 as a whole was slightly down from 2005 in quality but still the last really good year WWE has had. 2008 and 2013 have both been solid but that's about as good as it has gotten.



Totally agree with the Cena as a character thing. I got a chance to see why he is the way he is though. My 9 year old cousin just got into wrestling this past year, and he is OBSESSED with Cena. He thinks he's a super hero. He likes most of the good guys including Daniel Bryan as well, but Cena to him is like Michael Jordan was to me at that age, a god. Seeing this made it finally dawn on me for good: we are never seeing a Cena heel turn or even a return to the more aggressive "Doctor of Thuganomics" Cena. It would kill all of the WWE fans under the age of 12. If Cena turned bad, it would literally crush my little cousins soul. He wouldn't understand why his hero was cheating to win and attacking guys back stage. Watching all this great 2005 stuff has made me realize I just have to face it: WWE is no longer made for people my age, I just will have to cherry pick the good stuff that happens in the ring (and believe me there is still a ton of good happenings in the squared circle) and stop being bothered by the incoherent story lines or the omnipresence of "Super Cena". Bitching gets me nowhere and as long as there is good matches I will watch WWE. 

Oh well, atleast we still have guys like Henry, Ziggler, Bryan, Cesaro, the Shield, Rhodes Bros, the occasional Lesnar match, Taker at WM, Punk in big matches, Sheamus, and a few others knocking it out of the park in the ring to keep me thoroughly entertained.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> Raw 10/5/04
> Vengeance
> Raw 18/7/04
> Raw 13/12/04
> ...


Goddamn I loved the bolded one. That whole little four way feud in '07 led to three awesome matches in the Backlash main event, HBK/Cena in London and then that one.



The Primer said:


> Dislike their last man standing match a great deal too. Original airing I thought it was a total blast. The rewatch not long ago debunked that swiftly. Those two lost their neat chemistry from 2005, that's for sure.





SLIM SHADY LP™ said:


> Man, that Edge vs Kane match was so bad. Thank god that they didn't have a rematch at TLC 2010 and WWE went with a Fatal Four Way TLC match instead.
> 
> Their Last Man standing match on Smackdown that year however is good.


I remember the LMS but I don't really recall if I liked it. However I believe that was from the same show as Show/Ziggler/Rhodes/McIntyre which is ridiculously fun. 

The Edge/Kane SS match is such a chore to sit through though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Show vs Dolph vs Rhodes vs McIntyre was AWESOME. Real fun gem on 2010. Good plug. (Y)

Topic of Cena is easy for me to talk about: the things he says doesn't bother me in the slightest. Fans in the crowd react, so it's gonna continue. Oh well. He's the big star. I understand it & fully support it, honestly.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

I'm pretty neutral about Cena (I've actually grown to appreciate him more). I think he represents the company well, he's pretty passionate about the business and the company he works for. I also like how he has become a good, if not great "big match" performer lately, I don't know when it started but I really look forward to seeing his PPV matches. I just wish he'd take better care of himself.

ANYWAY. For some reason, I tend to avoid the late 2010 World Title stuff...those with Kane-Taker and Kane-Edge matches were pretty damn brutal and plodding to sit through. Which is a shame, because I thought Kane's title reign could've been a lot better, if they didn't do that whole "Taker is a Veggie" shit.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Kane made me actually like the feud vs Undertaker b/c his promos were so great. _(although he's always been a boss on the mic)_ And pardon the HIAC farce, the matches were real good slugfests too. Three wins over Undertaker on PPV. That was a long time coming for Kane. It wasn't until the crap with Edge started that I was losing interest in the scenario. Still glad it went down. When he cashed in on Mysterio I was left with a big grin on my face.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I'm away from home ATM, but it looks like my 2005 PPV reviews will start Monday!

Thoughts on which event to kick it off with?


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

While being patient will play it best, I say do the order chronologically. Begin with NYR and work all the way down to Armageddon.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I agree. That way you get to see the GOAT chamber match first.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I actually believe I own the '05 box set that had the plastic spinner belt thing on it. Pretty solid set of shows.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Bingo.

Opening tag is solid & I've always liked Kane vs Snitsky despite the sloppy side of it. So there's possibly three matches for you to look out for. At least should like the the tag match. Chamber is more than worth it. Crowd is hot for everyone and it's the coolest.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Then you get the Rumble, which has one of the greatest no sells of all time in Vince and his torn quad. He may have actually torn them both. Don't remember. Guy collapsed, and didn't even show pain.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:lmao

Funniest bit ever. And it wasn't scripted. That's how the best things always come by.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

'05 Rumble also had that Guerrero/Flair/Evolution backstage bit. :lmao

And the drunk JBL talking to Teddy Long bit. :lmao

I'm GONNA BEAT BIG SHOW LIKE HE'S GONNA EAT A PIZZA


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Don't forget about the second Heidenreich & Snitsky backstage segment. :littlefinger


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

C'mon man. Cut that MMA shit out.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Eddie and Flair interacting :lmao :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

yea get that mma stuff out of here FF, this is the wwe man

orton/edge 4/07 was pretty good, I liked it, hear from the commentary there was another cena/hbk that night as well ?


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

SKINS25 said:


> yea get that mma stuff out of here FF, this is the wwe man
> 
> orton/edge 4/07 was pretty good, I liked it, hear from the commentary there was another cena/hbk that night as well ?


I believe that was the night that Khali ended up taking out Orton, Edge & HBK backstage and then Cena in the ring which caused HBK/Cena to not happen.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It doesn't happen b/c of Khali iirc. That could be a bit off, but Cena vs Shawn IV doesn't happen until 2008.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

The Primer said:


> Show vs Dolph vs Rhodes vs McIntyre was AWESOME. Real fun gem on 2010. Good plug. (Y)


Might be the best fourway ever other than Final Four.


EDIT - The night Cena/Michaels III was meant to take place was indeed when Khali took out all of Cena's Backlash opponents (or at least HBK, IDR the rest). Pretty sure that lead to the Khali/Michaels match that I still have a write up of on my other comp that I never posted.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Complimented, seeing how nothing will topple Final Four.

I figured it was. Judgment Day was right around the corner, so they had to cram as much junk on night as possible. Remember when Orton seemed like he would go face following his potential trouble with WWE after smashing up the hotel room + losing to Edge post-Backlash? Then he upped and demolished Michaels leading to the debut of the punt & kind of cementing the precursor towards The Viper gimmick a year later. I tells ya, didn't see that coming back in 2007. Random, but thought I'd bring it up. God forbid me doing so with Orton though. At least it's fresh to discuss.

also this was WCW's problem in a nutshell in their later Monday Night Wars era years:






that was built up better than legit 99% of what occupied their PPVs in 2000. And a good portion of what ended 1999. Why couldn't they do this when it meant actual GOOD business? Dammit WCW. Over a decade later you still ruffle my feathers with your stupidity & I wished you weren't dead. _(of course fuck AOL/Time Warner merger too, yada yada)_


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Watched these 2 again and yeah, they're both definitely 2 of my favourite matches ever. 

*Eddie/Brock, NWO - ****3/4
Trips/Batista, HIAC - ****3/4*

:mark:


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Then you get the Rumble, which has one of the greatest no sells of all time in Vince and his torn quad. He may have actually torn them both. Don't remember. Guy collapsed, and didn't even show pain.


I think he tore one on the way into the ring, then tore the other as he was going to the back as he refused assistance :lol


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

RR 05 is overall a pretty sweeeet show. Rumble is good, not the greatest or anything (above average or so), Orton/HHH is like, :mark: and while not their BEST match (NM 07 LMS), probably my favourite from them. Casket match is better than it has any right to be considering HEIDENRAPE, but hey, they had a fucking great match at SVS 04 (did I see someone rate this as a DUD the other day? :lmao) and while the casket ain't as good, it's still a fucking good match on it's own. Triple threat for the WWE title is an underrated and overlooked triple threat. Edge/HBK is a good opener too, starting off Edge's pretty great 05 run. 4th best RR event imo.

I still need to finish 2002 PPV's off. I should do that or something.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

My Royal Rumble 2005 ratings:

Edge/HBK- ***1/2
Taker/Heinderich- *
Angle/Show/JBL- ***
HHH/Orton- **1/2
Rumble match- ****1/4


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

RR 05 Ramblings:



Spoiler: TL;DR



2005 Royal Rumble

Match 1 - Edge Vs Shawn Michaels - Nice story behind this match. Edge returned in 04, was getting booed despite being a babyface and whatnot. He slowly starts to get pissed off by it, then the shit hits the fan at Taboo Tuesday when fans voted for HBK over him to face HHH for the WHC. Then at NYR inside the elimination chamber, HBK was the referee and superkicked Edge (after Edge attacked him I think) and counted the 3 to eliminate him. So Edge feels that the fans turned on him AND HBK screwed him out of the title twice, so he wants revenge. After all the build it's a shame this one was never really viewed as a BIG match, though it probably should have been. Being at the RR doesn't help either as I never really see it as being the PPV for big grudge matches, or at least I haven't since something like 2002 onwards. Edge does a pretty great job controlling the match. He's got the crazy edge to him, but not the "spasm in the corner" kind of crazy he would get to that was terrible. I like how he uses HBK's hair to counter a HBK comeback, then just because he's a bit of a prick, he uses the hair about 4 times in a row to aid him in hitting moves though he didn't need to. Then he mocks HBK's pose. Shawn's comeback is... pretty poor tbh. But Edge puts a stop to it with a SPEAR on the floor. Follows it up with a SPEAR in the ring... and HBK kicks out lol. Edge's gets a little more crazy and tries for a high risk move, a superplex, but HBK knocks him off the ropes, lands the elbow, then begins to set up Sweet Chin Music! COUNTER INTO THE ELECTRIC CHAIR. EDUCATION! I miss that submission hold. Remember in like 02-03 and a bunch of guys on SD started using new submission holds? Edge with the Education, Brock with the BROCK LOCK and Eddie with the Lasso from El Paso? Those were awesome. Plus you already had Benoit with the Crossface and Angle with the Ankle Lock. Basically any of the top or high mid card guys had multiple ways to win and it really helped get over the awesome "competition" period on SD at the time. Edge wins using the ropes for leverage. Good match. ***1/4.

Bischoff and Long backstage with a tumbler so wrestlers can draw their own numbers. Flair and Guerrero draw their numbers. Flair is dancing for job at his, Eddie looks horrified. So he steals Flairs! He shows his number off, and they are baffled as to why he is so excited! GUERRERO STOLE MY NUMBER!

Heidenreich backstage talking about how he hates caskets. Gene Snitsky shows up. He doesn't like caskets either. But they like each other.

Match 2 - The Undertaker Vs Heidenreich - Casket match time! Heidenreich has screwed Undertaker out of the title on a couple of occasions, and they had a legit GREAT match at Survivor Series where Undertaker put over Heidenreich in a huge way. Now it's time to settle their feud in Undertaker's signature match. Well one of them anyway. Heidenreich isn't afraid of Undertaker, but he IS afraid of caskets (as is all of Undertaker's opponents lol). Undertaker uses basic holds like an arm bar and a headlock, and he keeps edging Heidenreich over to the casket just to mess with his mind. Awesome stuff. Credit to Heidenreich too for playing his part really well. Heidenreich throws some pretty good punches, similar style to Undertaker. He pummels Undertaker in the corner then talks shit to him, then tries to throw another punch, but Undertaker catches the arm and counters with a TRIANGLE CHOKE. Fuck yeah, awesome shit. Heidenreich is fading... and Snitsky shows up! Double team time. They begin to drag Undertaker to the casket, the referees open it up... and it's KANE! KANE IS IN THE CASKET! He's feuding with Snitsky so it makes sense... though he and Undertaker never exactly made up lol. Kane and Snitsky take their fight to the crowd and then backstage, leaving Undertaker to continue this match one on one. I remember the rumours of a tag match at WM to end these two feuds. Thankfully we didn't get it. Not that I necessarily think it would have sucked, but because we got the incredible Undertaker/Orton match and Kane did one hell of a job in the Money in the Bank Ladder Match. LMAO at the spot where Heidenreich runs the casket into The Undertaker. Undertaker is pretty much UNDER THE RING and the casket just bounces off the ring apron. LMAO at Undertaker trying to punch Heidenreich in the fact while he's in the casket. Ends up decking the middle rope the first time. HOLY SHIT, apron legdrop to Heidenreich, with Heidenreich's head trapped in the casket! Just like Survivor Series, Heidenreich takes all of this punishment and STILL comes back. Whips Undertaker into the turnbuckle and the sound its makes made me think they broke part of the ring lol. Man, Heidenreich looked REALLY GOOD in these matches with 'Taker. Sure, he's in there with one of THE best ever, but he did his part for sure and he did it real well. Shame Heidenreich never went anywhere after this, and looked terrible with everything he did. Undertaker of course wins. Great match, surprised even me because I never thought this was particularly good. ***1/2.

Backstage again, and Teddy is trying to get Eddie to give back Flair's number. Evolution show up to get it back. Eddie reluctantly gives it back... but turns out he still has his wallet too lol. TENSION between HHH and Batista. This feud was really fucking well done.

Christian getting ready to pick his number. He's trying to get Bischoff to reveal some people's numbers. Teddy Long gets back and Christian mentions how he just signed a petition to get him kicked off Raw! Cena shows up for his number. The beginning to their feud that would kinda happen after WM but not quite because they threw Jericho into it and made it all about those two. CHRISTIAN RAPS. 

Match 3 - JBL Vs Kurt Angle Vs The Big Show - Triple threat match for the WWE title! JBL and Angle selling injures from their LMS match on SD just 3 days ago. I should look that match up, don't remember anything about it. Show and JBL start the match, and with JBL hurt Big Show can dominate him, all the while Angle who is also hurt stands on the outside and watches on before making his move to prevent a possible pin. Fun "Big Show Vs The World" stuff early on as he's the freshest man, making him the biggest threat for the title. Show attempts to Chokeslam JBL from the steel steps through the announce table, but Angle hits a low blow, then nails the giant with a monitor and Show falls back through the table himself! Now Angle and JBL can fight one on one and continue their match from SD and not have to worry about the 7ft monster for the time being. Show eventually gets back into this thing and he's PISSED. Guy looks unstoppable, until Angle clips his knee while JBL lands a Clothesline from Hell! Even then he's back up to his feet moments later, only to get Angle Slammed. BIG SHOW DRIVING BRADSHAW THROUGH THE BARRICADE! JBL is pretty much dead. Show just has to finish off Angle and he'll be the NEW champion! THE CABINET show up to check on JBL, while Angle's boys show up to take out Big Show. While all this is going on, JBL lands a Clothesline from Hell on Angle and survives with his WWE Title! This is a TON of fun. Always loved it. Nothing has changed. One of the great triple threat matches. ***3/4. 

Carlito wants Batista to sign the petition to get rid of Teddy Long. He isn't going to sign it, so Carlito teases spitting in his face. Batista threatens him and he swallows for a change haha. Batista continues to pick his number, while Bischoff and Teddy argue about shit. Bischoff bans Evolution from ringside for the WHC match so the Raw title match isn't a mess of interference like SD's!

Match 4 - Triple H Vs Randy Orton - WHC match. Urgh, not looking forward to this. HHH and Orton just have dreadful chemistry bad like, 2 matches. RKO COUNTERED. HHH counters it by sending him over the ropes. Orton thanks his lucky stars that his shoulder didn't crumble. Trips goes after the shoulder following that move, by driving Orton into the steel steps. Then in the ring he goes after the knee. Odd that he switches up like that, but Orton apparently hurt the knee on Raw and has it taped up so HHH is just being the "cerebral assassin" and targeting the injured body part. LOL sign guy didn't think this match was worth seeing, so he went for beer. So far I've been pleasantly surprised with this one. HHH has been good working over the legs, and Orton sold well and made a sweet comeback at one point with some great punches in the corner. His selling is dodgy though as he seems to mostly ignore his bad knee during said comeback. Orton gets his lip busted open from a sweeeeeet high knee. HHH keeps avoiding the RKO. Some more great punches form Orton. HHH sells them awesomely. HHH blocks a DDT and Orton goes CRASHING to the mat, and thus begins the "out of it" part of the match for Orton, and THIS is how I remember the match. Didn't think there was so much stuff BEFORE it lol. Which makes me wonder how long is left and if it's going to reaaaallly drag on. Time for THE GAME to slowly work over the head of his former Evolution team mate. The ref is down so HHH slowly goes for the sledgehammer, but gets sent face first into the ring post instead. Ha. Trips tries to use it again but notices the ref is stirring so he gets rid of it just in case. PEDIGREE instead. Orton is done. Huh, this match was... VERY DIFFERENT to how I remembered it. Did they have a Raw match like a week or two after this? If so maybe I remembered that match. Anywho, I thought this was great. Second best match these two ever had, not that that's saying much lol. ***3/4.

Kurt Angle steals Nunzio's number for the RR. Why didn't Nunzio go tell Teddy Long about it? Speaking of, Long and Bischoff talking backstage again, this time about how good the Raw title match was. Long agrees and says it gave him a great idea. JBL and the Cabinet bust into the room celebrating, and Long informs him that at No Way Out, he'll be defending the title against Big Show in the first ever BARBED WIRE STEEL CAGE MATCH! WHAT'S HE GONNA DO? EAT ME? I'M A WRESTLING GOD. I'M A GOD. I'M A WRESTLING GOD. 

Match 5 - 30 Man Royal Rumble Match - #1 is Eddie Guerrero, the man who last year won Smackdown's RR match to determine the #1 contender for NWO against Lesnar, where he WON the title! #2 is... Christ Benoit who won the RR last year from the #1 position and went on to WM to WIN the WHC! DANIEL PUDER. Tough Enough winner. He didn't even live up to the likes of MAVEN. He basically gets set up by being in the ring against veterans who take RESPECT OF THE BUSINESS very seriously, and he gets knife edged chopped to SHIT from Benoit, Guerrero and then Hardcore Holly lol. Man, if only TAZZ could have been part of this match too lol. Eddie and Benoit work together to eliminate a few people, but at the same time try to take cheap shots with each other in an attempt to eliminate the other as well lol. DAT TILTAWHIRL BACKBREAKER ON REY BY EDDIE. Lol, Tazz thinks Booker T and HHH main evented WM last year. He's already forgetting BENOIT. TAZZ SEES THE FUTURE! Bischoff and Long show up at ringside to cheer their guys on. Nice stuff all night between the two, putting over the brand extension and competition between the two, without getting into petty insults and shit. 4 Raw guys and 4 SD guys end up in the ring at the same time and they do the old Brand Split battle which is a cool moment. Then Muhammad Hassan comes out and both sides join forces to beat the crap out of him and eliminate him. HATERS. LOL SCOTTY 2 HOTTY continues his RR curse as he gets attacked by Hassan on his way to the ring. Ring starts to fill up with a bunch of nobodies. Eddie gets eliminated. Then HBK comes in and get rid of some of the trash. LMAO at Edge chasing after Rey, and Rey keeps escaping by rolling away or crawling through his legs. Edge gives up. ANGLE! SUPERKICK! NO MORE ANGLE! More jobbers enter. Angle returns and eliminates HBK then processed to beat him up. Beginning of their great feud leading into WM. LONDON AND SNITSKY. GOAT ELIMINATION? Good GOD at the pop for Batista. Batista and Cena the final 2. 1994 RR flashbacks. Vince tears both quads just to tell them to restart the match. BATISTA wins. Good Rumble, and like most things on this show, better than I remembered. ***3/4.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Royal Rumble is just another example of how consistent 2005 was. The Rumble itself is not near the best but it's pretty fun and has some great moments. Always lol @ Edge eliminating Eddie to a chorus of boos and then mocking Eddie's little "dance" after it. :lol

Also what MMA shit took place when I was away? Seems like some post(s) has been deleted.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

UFC 167 was last night, someone posted some stars for it, I deleted it because this ain't a fucking MMA thread.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Did anybody else love Bashams/Eddie & Rey from NWO '05?


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

ATF said:


> Did anybody else love Bashams/Eddie & Rey from NWO '05?


:hb

One of the most underrated matches of the year, IMO

Edit: is XWT being a bitch for anybody else? Or just me?


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

The 2005 Rumble match is one my favorites. Many good/funny moments in that one, from the veterans in Eddie, Benoit and Hardcore Holly destroying the rookie Daniel Puder in hilarious fashion, everyone ganging up and eliminating Muhammad Hassan, Snitsky's epic elimination on Paul London, great showings from the rising stars of Edge, Mysterio, Cena and Batista - and a good finish. 






As for the rest of the card, there's two good matches in Edge/HBK and JBL/Angle/Show, Triple H/Orton was decent, and I can't remember a thing about Taker/Heidenreich so I can't comment on that. Good show all round.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

That 2005 Rumble match is one of my favorites as well: I always :lmao at Benoit, Guerrero and Holly kicking the shit out of Puder and then JR going off on Simon Dean, the London elimination. 

I'm fan of that Bashams/Rey-Eddie match and the Barbwire Steel Cage Match from that NWO show. Too bad that shitty Taker-Luther Reigns match is on that card. :lmao


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Cena/Angle from that show was good too. Even if NM '03 was much superior imo.

2005 as a whole was a great year for PPV's. The Big 4 were all awesome for one, one of the GOAT B-shows in Vengeance, and a bunch of other very good shows (Judgment Day, Unforgiven and No Mercy in e.g.).


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

rjsbx1 said:


> Too bad that shitty Taker-Luther Reigns match is on that card. :lmao


Another bad hand Taker was dealt, even in 2005 :cuss:


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

John Cena vs Kurt Angle from No Way Out 2005 is an awesome match, ***3/4 I think it's my fav. Cena/Angle one. JBL/Show was an okay match from the same PPV, **1/2, but the barbed wire gimmick was kinda stupid


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*Oh, yeah no doubt. Reigns was fucking awful...and Taker couldn't get shit out of him (even though he pulled decent stuff out of Heidenrich)*






*BEST LUTHER REIGNS MOMENT EVER. :lmao at how Taz just shrugs him off and continues eating.*


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Luther Reigns was like an awful, talentless Lesnar knock-off. I always confuse the two when looking at pictures from Reigns.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

Even Eddie Guerrero couldn't get anything out of Luther Reigns in their matches in 2004 and Eddie was on fire that year. Luther Reigns was unbelievably terrible. 



Srdjan99 said:


> John Cena vs Kurt Angle from No Way Out 2005 is an awesome match, ***3/4 I think it's my fav. Cena/Angle one. JBL/Show was an okay match from the same PPV, **1/2, *but the barbed wire gimmick was kinda stupid*


Yeah but it kinda made sense since JBL always found a way to retain his WWE title through shenanigans. I also quite liked the ending of the Barbed Wire Steel Cage match with JBL finding yet another way to retain his WWE title.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Callamus said:


> It's MENG. It's THE GIANT. It's BEEF MEETS BEEF.
> 
> Fucking hell Giant tries to DECAPITATE Meng with a chop out of the corner. And Meng just comes back for more because he doesn't give a fuck. Neither can know the other down so they just keep fucking hitting each other. And then THAT FINISH. Holy fuckity fuck was that awesome. :mark: how can anyone be vegetarian or vegan? I know I can't because I LOVE BEEF and this is super fucking tasty.



Holy shit, I watched that multiple times and got amped up with each viewing.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

2005 Rumble is how a Rumble should be structured. Lots of good moments in that match that lead to a cool finish. I still don't see how the initial ending was a botch though. Not a fan at all of NWO 2005. I honestly did not like anything on the card except for JBL's trolling. Cena/Angle just felt so "empty" for me. CorporateKingofKings had a review of the match earlier this year that explained my sentiments.

*Survivor Series 1998: The Rock vs. Mankind*

I've always felt that this match and PPV as a whole was good yet pretty overrated by the Attitude Era marks here, and I certainly was not a fan of this match. Well it was worth giving this match a rewatch because I might have missed something. From the looks of it after a rewatch, I definitely did.

The initial third of the match was very boring and consisted mainly of restholds, but I can't blame either Rock or Foley for it because they were in a tournament. The match finally became interesting when they took the action to the outside. Not only was Foley's chairshot a nice jolt to the match, Rock's chair to the steps were also pretty cool even if they did not damage Foley at all. After another resthold in the middle of the ring, we get this incredible crescendo of action that took the dead crowd out of their seats. Foley's apron elbow drop, the scuffle on the table, Foley falling through the table, etc. Great way of filling up time and making the match fun. I'll always give Rock credit for how well he sells sleeper holds and does the "hand-drop" tease better than anyone. Very convincing of him. Rock finally hits the Rock Bottom, but Foley kicks out, which leads to the iconic finish that shot both guys to superstardom. That's one thing that can't be criticized about this match; they pulled off the screwjob perfectly as well as the double turn. The match itself was fun after ten minutes, but the moment really made an above average main event to a very good one for me. ****1/4-***1/2*

I did think it was funny how Austin came out at the end and attacked both Rock and Mankind. My first impression was how this forum would have gone crazy over Austin supposedly "burying" the new champion and the guy that got screwed over and would have called out "SuperAustin" :lol. It did sorta feel like an ending to RAW and I would have much rather preferred it if the ending to the PPV was Rock holding the title to a chorus of boos, but I was still satisfied. The RAW after the PPV was actually my first ever episode of RAW that I watched, and I've been hooked since (at least until 2006-mid 2011 where I took a much needed hiatus).


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

rjsbx1 said:


> *Oh, yeah no doubt. Reigns was fucking awful...and Taker couldn't get shit out of him (even though he pulled decent stuff out of Heidenrich)*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Joy :ass


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)




----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

ATF said:


> Did anybody else love Bashams/Eddie & Rey from NWO '05?


Match is awful.

As is Triple H vs Orton from Rumble.

Lets talk about matches from 2005 that matter - like the ultra entertaining JBL vs Show vs Angle or JBL vs Show barbed wire cage.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

Speaking of Reigns and Heinreich (sp?) there can't be anyone that has been given more terrible wrestlers to work with than the Undertaker right? 



WWF Backlash 2001 


Sunday Night Heat

_Light Heavyweight Championship Match:_
*Jerry Lynn vs. Crash Holly(c)*

So this was abou 4 minutes long and not very memorable. It started out really good as Jerry Lynn showed off what he could do for about a minute. Than Crash took control and really slowed things down. The ending also had me pretty confused as Lynn worked the match like he was a face as Crash was in control for most of the match and then Lynn cheats to win. This would have been a lot better if they had just worked at the pace they set for first minute. Crash's control segment took up too much of the 4 minutes and we didn't get any type if finsihing stretch.
**1/2*


*Molly Holly vs. Lita*

They did what the last match didn't. They had three minutes and they just decided to do as much as possible in that time. It started off fun but quickly became sloppy. There were 2 spots from the top rope and they booked look really awkward aside from that this was fun for what it was.
** *​

Backlash

*The Dudley Boyz vs. The X-Factor*

I thought this was a lot of fun. There was a pretty lengthy control segment from The X-Factor but I thought that they did a good job of keeping their control segment interesting. X-pac had some nice looking offense with his kicks and we also got some good power moves for Albert. Biggest complaint is that the match ended right after we got the hot tag. Still I enjoyed the opening segment an the control segment was good. Not a great match by any means but a pretty good opener. 
***1/2* 


_Hardcore Championship Match:_
*Rhyno vs. Raven(c)* 

They beat the total shit out of each other. That's really all there is to say about this. Some of the Hardcore matches that the WWF had at this time came across as kind of goofy but not this one. They just beat the shit out each other with a bunch of weapons and it was a blast to watch. This also has the best use of a shopping cart as a weapon that I can remember. 
***3/4* 


_Dutchess of Queensberry Rules:_
*William Regal w/The Dutchess of Queensberry vs. Chris Jericho*

I found this to be highly amusing and actually a good match. Basically Regal was able to make the rules up as it went along and the Dutchess would make up a rule whenever Regal was in danger of losing the match. Aside from these antics there was a pretty solid match that took place. Regal really heeled it up and the crowd loved it. They appeared to be enraged every time he waved at them. Jericho's comebacks were also good because he was able to essentially win the match twice before the match was restarted. While I normally hate restarts these were hilarious and made the match better because there were a few control segments and comebacks mixed into a short period of time. I'm sure these two would be able to have a better match under different circumstances but for an amusing mid card match this was really solid. 
*****


_30 Minute Ultimate Submission Match:_
*Chris Benoit vs. Kurt Angle*

So we saw five minutes of straight technical wrestling before they set up the story of the match. At first they were just trade holds in the ring but then they got outside the ring and Benoit locked in the Crossface and made Angle tap (but it didn't count outside the ring). Angle made an almost immediate transformation because his arm was hurt and you could tell that he was embarrassed by what happened. From that point on he was willing to use dirty tactics and cheat to win. 

Due to Angle's dirty tactis Benoit was behind 3-1 in the first 12 minutes of the match. Once Angle got the lead you could see how he deliberetly tried to slow the match down and take the action outside the ring where Benoit couldn't score a submission. Benoit working from behind was fantastic and it just meshed so well with Angle. Each guy wrestled exactly as they should have given the situation. I loved how Benoit was persistent in locking in whatever move he could and Angle's stalling tactics and overall defensive mindset was great. 

I loved the story they told with Benoit falling behind early on and spending the rest of the match trying to catch up. I do have to admit where I felt Angle's control segments were a little slow. Other than that this was as smartly worked as a match can be. I also loved that they were able to use the unique stipulation to their advantage. I felt that each guy acted differently because of the rules of the match. Benoit would never normally tap out early in a match but it made a ton of sense in the context of this match. It shouldn't be a surprise that this was great.
*****1/2*


_Last Man Standing Match:_
*Shane McMahon vs. The Big Show*

I'm a huge fan of this match. Yeah the big spot at the end is really cool but I really do enjoy the rest of the match. You have Shane McMahon, a non wrestler, trying to survive against the Big Show. And he pulls if off because he's smarter than the Big Show. From the very start of the match we see that Shane is going to throw everything he has at Big Show and do whatever he can possibly do to win. In fact Shane actually had the match won before Vince interfered. I wasn't a fan of the Big Show control segment between Vince getting involved and Test getting involved. Show had the match won at numerous times and he picked up Shane a few times to continue hurting him. It made sense in the context of the match bcause Vince wanted Shane hurt, not just defeated. Still it isn't that interesting when Big Show hits a couple of moves and we have to wait around while the ref counts. At least Shane sold some of the moves well. 

Test's involvement evens the playing field and the match ends soon after that. Now I realize the ending is more of a stunt than a wrestling move but damn is it impressive to see how hig Shane jumps Also it's hilarious that crossed himself first before he jumped. I'll always be a fan of this. The match is just a ton of fun and Shane really deserves a lot of credit for it. I might even say that he was better than the Big Show here. 
****1/4 *


_European Championship Match:_
*Matt Hardy(c) vs. Christian vs. Eddie Guerrero*

This looks like it's going to be incredible but it really isn't anything that great. There were some really nice encounters and tey really never slowed down. You got all sorts of interference that made for a an exciting conclusion too. Also there was just a hilarious botch from Jeff Hardy when he ran and tried to hit a Swanton Bomb and missed completely. I think it was about 10 minutes and they did a bunch of stuff. Not much to complain about and there isn't much to praise. 
***1/4* 


_All Titles on the Line:_
*Intercontinental Champion Triple H w/Stephanie McMahon and WWF Champion "Stone Cold" Steve Austin vs. WWF Tag Team Champions Kane and The Undertaker* 

There really is a lot going on here. Kane comes out with one arm taped up and that led to Austin and Triple H only wanting to get in the ring with an injured Kane. This also made Undertaker hesitant to rely on Kane because he knew he wasn't 100%. You also had Austin working as a pure heel which at the time was still a novelty. It was strange seeing Austin play the classic heel and to see the guy was the biggest badass in wrestling run from the Undertaker.

The Undertaker and Kane's relationship was really interesting here as Undertaker just didn't want him in the ring at all. The obvious reason is that Kane is hurt but there was also part of me that was thinking that both Kane and Undertaker can't win a title. It was the weirdest hot tag I can remember when Undertaker was in trouble and he when he made it to his corner he didn't go for the tag and Kane had to tag him from behind to get into the match. Unfortunatley Kane had a bad arm and he quickly ended up in a bad position. 

Now I'm not Kane's biggest fan by any means but he was amazing in his face in peril segment. I would even go as far to say that he gave the best performance in this match and it's one of Kane's better efforts that I can remember. I loved seeing Kane still throwing bombs at Austin and Triple H to try to make the hot tag. It was just a great babyface performance and there were times when it really seemed like he was going to actually pull off the win without needing to tag in Undertaker. 

This might also be the only match ever where we actually didn't get a hot tag. The ref missed it and Undertaker gave no shits any proceded to kill everyone. I loved how angry everyone was when he had the match won and Hebner wouldn't make the count because Undertaker wasn't legal and Austin wasn't legal. The ending wasn't amazing as it was riddled with interference but it worked since seeing Kane almost pull of the immpossible victory was still pretty fantastic. 

In summary, KANE. Such a unique tag match. Undertaker and Kane made 3 tags the entire match while Austin and Triple H worked like they had been a team for years. Stephanie took an awesome bump and this just had a big fight feel. Also KANE
*****1/2*​

This in an amazing show. Two matches that I would hesitate to call classics and not a bad match on the card. My biggest complaint with the DVD is that the matches from Heat weren't very good...


Whoever posted a review of this show a few weeks back I want to thank because I wouldn't have watched this again if it wasn't for that review.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

That would have been me most likely .

Speaking of... still not got back to the 2002 ones :lmao.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Undertaker was always given the next "big" dude, in regards to size, to work vs. Sometimes it worked & sometimes it didn't. When it works, it proves worthwhile as a mentality to book. Gave Koslov some good matches. So, the man knows how to try and get the best out of everyone most of the time.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Undertaker/Heinderich matches are a pain to watch, seen 2 of them this weekend and I feel tortured


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The one thing you can say about 'Taker and his matches with all those terrible big guys; 99.9% of the time he gave them their career matches. Which ain't saying much for some of them, but is impressive as hell in other cases.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Srdjan99 said:


> Undertaker/Heinderich matches are a pain to watch, seen 2 of them this weekend and I feel tortured


They're better than most Kurt Angle matches.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Only one of those matches is better than most Angle matches. Man that SvS caught me so off guard. Almost as shocking as when I kinda liked Miz/Axel and even a couple Ziggler/Kofi matches.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Which elimination match?

And I liked Axel vs Miz too. T'was shocking to compute. Even though I don't hate either guy. Still expected generic tripe.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Taker and Heidenreich had surprisingly good chemistry considering how shit 'reich was.


----------



## WOOLCOCK (Jun 24, 2011)

Seabs said:


> *I watched Atlantis/Villano twice and yeah I don't think it's even very good. Lucha isn't my thing but there's enough lucha that I like that I'm open to giving certain guys a chance. Like anything Santo, Dandy, Casas I'm open to watching for sure. It's more the style and the culture I don't dig than the actual wrestlers.
> 
> Fujiwara's good although I haven't seen much of his peak work. I watched him wrestle YOSHIHIKO though and that was great. There's also a 95% chance that I've never seen a Volk Han match too. I'm so getting locked out of that place when they see my list. *


I think you'd love Sangre Chicana too. His best matches are pretty much the Mexican version of Lawler/Dundee. I'm talking amazing punches, great selling, theatrical yet engaging bumping when working underneath etc. I'd be really amped to hear your thoughts on Chicana/MS-1 '83 and Chicana/Perro 2/28/86 because they're right out of the Memphis layout and I'm convinced you'd dig it. Would also be excited to hear your thoughts on Dandy/Llanes '94 - pure matwork but not your standard Lucha holds and more closer to rugged grappling.



The Primer said:


> Same. Thought the nit-picking there was quite absurd.


Some bloke once went from 'this match is one of the best of the year' to calling it bad because of a contrived superplex onto group of wrestlers spot. Wrestling fans, they're a bloody daft bunch. 

Tbh botches only become an issue when it's someone like Sabu who insists on completing a spot even if he fucks it up on more than one occasion. A bad botch will always be immediately off putting, but typically as long as the wrestlers adjust and continue without being affected by it then I'm never fussy in having that affect my overall mood on the match: they're only human and mistakes are to be expected given the difficulty in some exchanges.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

The Primer said:


> Match is awful.
> 
> As is Triple H vs Orton from Rumble.
> 
> Lets talk about matches from 2005 that matter - like the ultra entertaining JBL vs Show vs Angle or JBL vs Show barbed wire cage.


*
2005 is always one of my favorite years in terms of programs and in-ring stuff.

2005 Velocity when they aired it on the website always had some good matches: That CW battle royal, Kazarian-London, Akio-London series, the always mentioned Regal-Benoit matches. *


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

WOOLCOCK said:


> I think you'd love Sangre Chicana too. His best matches are pretty much the Mexican version of Lawler/Dundee. I'm talking amazing punches, great selling, theatrical yet engaging bumping when working underneath etc. I'd be really amped to hear your thoughts on Chicana/MS-1 '83 and Chicana/Perro 2/28/86 because they're right out of the Memphis layout and I'm convinced you'd dig it. Would also be excited to hear your thoughts on Dandy/Llanes '94 - pure matwork but not your standard Lucha holds and more closer to rugged grappling.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh yeah. Seen that crap before. Loads of nonsense.

Certainly. Sabu mention is basically the pinnacle to get your point across. I immediately jump to his Ladder match vs RVD where he tried spots over after they flubbed and it looked much worse thanks to the obvious "exposing" nature of trying to recreate the intended notion. 



rjsbx1 said:


> *
> 2005 is always one of my favorite years in terms of programs and in-ring stuff.
> 
> 2005 Velocity when they aired it on the website always had some good matches: That CW battle royal, Kazarian-London, Akio-London series, the always mentioned Regal-Benoit matches. *


Velocity was such a boss of a B-show. Regulating cruiserweights to it basically made it fact.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

There are times where I like the idea of redoing a spot, though. Not a Sabu-type of spot but like Matt Hardy botching a Twist of Fate and instead of going for the pin, getting his opponent up and hit another one that connects perfectly.


----------



## WOOLCOCK (Jun 24, 2011)

Agreed. It's always struck me as lazy and counter productive to try and blatantly repeat a blown spot as if the crowd won't pick up on it. Fair enough if you ad lib for a few minutes and then try it later in the match, but to stubbornly insist on completing the spot (all the more frustrating given the complex shit Sabu would often attempt with little room for error) has always been a primary weakness of Sabu and something I'm surprised is prevalent in the mindsets of a few wrestlers.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Just downloaded Velocity 2003. Hoping for some GEMS and shit. Had some DANIEL BRYAN matches in there too, including one against Cena lol.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Callamus said:


> Just downloaded Velocity 2003. Hoping for some GEMS and shit. Had some DANIEL BRYAN matches in there too, including one against Cena lol.


*There's a Bryan-Noble match that is all types of awesome. DAT VELOCITY :mark:

Too bad, you have to listen to fucking Ernest Miller babble on commentary.*


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Did Sabu ever have a non-2 Cold Scorpio match that was good?


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Yeah. Sabu is far from bad on usual and really enjoyable at his best despite some of his rep (and at his worst he can suuuuuuck). The rehashing spot thing is atrocious, though.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Did Sabu ever have a non-2 Cold Scorpio match that was good?


*I liked his match with Candido at November to Rememeber...although a lot of that was Candido's doing. *


----------



## WOOLCOCK (Jun 24, 2011)

The main problem with Sabu's spot rehashing is the fact the spots he often attempts are quite complex (e.g the springboard off the chair > onto top rope > dive to opponent on the floor spots) and given how little room for error there is in spots of that nature, added to Sabu often struggling to achieve the fine balance needed to execute the spot, it could get very ugly because he could fail three times in some cases and the atmosphere just becomes very unsettling in terms of the crowd's reaction.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Ok, I'm off watching some rank videos w/some contra opinions, and makes me ask, what are y'all Top 5 Manias?

Mine are:

1 - 17
2 - 19
3 - 24
4 - 7
5 - 21


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Top 5 Manias:
1 *XIX*
2 *X-Seven*
3 *X*
4 *III*
5 *21*

Honorable mention: *22* and *24*.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

5. WrestleMania 21 - 19
4. WrestleMania 25 - 20
3. WrestleMania 22 - 20.5
2. WrestleMania X7 - 23
1. WrestleMania XIX - 29.5


----------



## GOD OF CUNT (Jan 9, 2008)

That Backlash main event is fucking crap and anybody who says otherwise sucks green donkey anus.

EDIT: alright I didn't realise that match was talked about a page back. I thought it was the most recent page. Either way it's still rubbish.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

GOD of CUNT said:


> That Backlash main event is fucking crap and anybody who says otherwise sucks green donkey anus.


Go home Andy, you're drunk.


----------



## WOOLCOCK (Jun 24, 2011)

GOD of CUNT said:


> That Backlash main event is fucking crap and anybody who says otherwise sucks green donkey anus.


Our resident Stoke friend had it 268 spots ahead of Villano III/Atlantis btw.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

17, 19, 20, 21, 24 would be my top 5 Manias.


----------



## GOD OF CUNT (Jan 9, 2008)

Callamus said:


> Go home Andy, you're drunk.


YOU'RE fucking drunk and also gay and shit for liking that match.



WOOLCOCK said:


> Our resident Stoke friend had it 268 spots ahead of Villano III/Atlantis btw.


He should go back to watching shit from the 50s.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

GOD of CUNT said:


> YOU'RE fucking drunk and also gay and shit for liking that match.


NO YOU.


----------



## GOD OF CUNT (Jan 9, 2008)

I'm tempted to kill you off.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Your ratings would plummet. Everyone only reads your crap to see what the mighty CALLAMUS is getting up to!


----------



## WOOLCOCK (Jun 24, 2011)

Everytime I picture the hypothetical demise of Callamus I just think of the clumsy waiter from The Simpsons episode where Mayor Quimby's son is on trial and Bart can exonerate him by testifying as a witness.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

All this time bickering could have been time spent watching Roman Reigns.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I need a good show to watch.

First respectable person to reply gets a review.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Don't know If I'm respectable but...

Backlash 2004?


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> I need a good show to watch.
> 
> First respectable person to reply gets a review.


ECW Anarchy Rulz 2000. :banderas

Edit: Meant to say Anarchy Rulz 1999.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I know I am not respected, but IYH: Canadian Stampede should be watched just so one more person can love Undertaker/Vader. Seriously, that match is more than just "good".


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

I think I will check out IYH: Canadian Stampede and Mind Games at another time along with the HHH/Rock iron man match.

Watched a match between Shawn Micheals and 123 Kid. ***3/4 first watch, I might go into detail another time. While I was watching though, I thought that Kid would do good in the RA era if he stayed around for that time. I was thinking he would do great in a ladder match. I also thought he would do good wrestling someone like Eddie Guerrero. Well it turns out he did both at once at WCW Souled Out 1997. Great match between the two.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> I need a good show to watch.
> 
> First respectable person to reply gets a review.


Wrestle War 1992.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Thanks for the suggestions boys but I decided to get back the good ol nostalgiac feelings starting with the very first PPV I watched in full; Summerslam 2004. Might start watching and reviewing PPVs chronologically at this point and checking out of the current product for a little bit, remembering why I love wrestling in the first place by watching the shows I love .

TEDDY LONG'S FIRST SHOW AS GM OF SMACKDOWN. JESUS HE'S BEEN AROUND FOREVER :lol.

Three matches in and nothing good, can't believe this is the show that got me hooked on wrestling in the first place. Writing down a ton of notes & I'm like 13 joints in today, this should be quite the piece.

DIVA DODGEBALL. What creativity .


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Summerslam 2004 is pretty much a one match show, though I do recall Taker/JBL and the opener being decent


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I have yet to see HHH/eugene since that Show aired. I need a link please.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

After do so a bit earlier tonight, gonna hit up more Undertaker in the Attitude Era. All b/c it hit me on a whim while marking the holy high hell out for his theme circa 1998/pre-Ministry. Gonna start right now by reliving the bout vs Shamrock.


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

This thread needs more drunken posts tbh. Would make it far more entertaining.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I should go get my bottom of rum and make this an event.

To start though, here's a random opinion: Undertaker vs Giant Gonzales is a better WM match than Triple H vs Randy Orton.


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

That is a good opinion. I support it.

That Orton Trips match is unbearable, tbh. Not saying Taker/Gonzales is good or anything, but I'd much rather watch it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I had some fun with Taker vs Gonzales the last time I watched. Wasn't good, as said, but you know, not really as bad as the theory perceived. Taker makes it work.

I'm a deplorable fiend for originally thinking this was bad: Undertaker vs Shamrock from Backlash '99 is actually quite awesome. Structure is more free range & open type of deal - b/c it's the Attitude Era & structure was a lost art then - but for the way they wanted to work the match, it proved to be a solid fitting backdrop. Fans hated it b/c there wasn't enough punching. I know Taker's punching rules, but it's still lol worthy of a reaction. Shamrock looked real good in this. Counters were slick as fuck, like they should be. Man knows his MMA, he should make it look legit. Some of Taker's reversals were on par with him. You knew he was into the sport all the way back in '99 by this indication to work a semi-shoot style. Grounded & rugged. Good shit. JR going ballistic for the counters ups this. Commentary made the style of the match feel important too. Obviously that's a quality that demands a plug. Unlike the pleb fans who weren't sure what they were seeing.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Did the Punk vs. Bryan match at MITB 2012 have a screwy ending? Did AJ involve herself a lot in a ridiculous way during the match?

Don't ruin a lot specifically, please, but just let me know if it was a decent match in a semi believable "cleanish" way, or was it just ridiculous as far as shenanigans go, from AJ or anyone else.

Also, how was that PPV as a whole? I see that Meltzer gave three matches *** 3/4 and over.



ETA: How is Umaga vs. Cena at New Years Revolution 2007? I know their RR match is better, but how is that one?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

No & no. Shenanigans weren't afoot. Only a fantastic match was. I'm one of the few who prefer the MITB match over OTL.

Sheamus vs Del Rio, Punk vs Danielson, & Five Way MITB all range under real good, fantastic, & fun, respectively. Ryback squash was effective too. Unfortunately it fell under filler as a decent chunk of the event happened to. World Championship MITB was mediocre, bordering on bad for a large majority, but the end result was a satisfying moment. It's not the strongest show around, but there's been worse. At least has a top flight match on it & two which follow it nicely.

Cena vs Umaga from NYR is great. Underrated thanks to the lost in shuffle praise of their last man standing match, but it's def worth the watch. Umaga is a force in it. Finish is perfectly logical, but you know people. Cena wins on a roll up and the world explodes with fury.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Thanks for all of that. Glad to hear that the Punk/Bryan match was normal. I loved their OTL match, so I'm excited about their MITB match.

And yeah, all of those you listed were ones that Meltzer rated well, as well as the other MITB match.

One more question - how was the Jeff Hardy vs. John Morrison cage match at New Years Revolution 2007?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Fit the mold of most Hardy vs Nitro/Morrison matches - high spirited and swell. Their chemistry was strong. Darn good opener, imo. Probably their best match stemming from their 2006 - early 2007 IC championship feud.


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

im enjoying these rumble matches


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Fit the mold of most Hardy vs Nitro/Morrison matches - high spirited and swell. Their chemistry was strong. Darn good opener, imo. Probably their best match stemming from their 2006 - early 2007 IC championship feud.


Helpful as always, thank you!


About Edge...:


SKINS25 said:


> I'll give you taker, never seen any of the benoit stuff, which orton match was good ? I remember hearing there is a overrated one and a good one, and the cena matches are hit and miss tbhayley
> 
> 
> Edit: remember liking the hbk 05 match, never seen the 02 angle matches





Choke2Death said:


> Raw 10/5/04
> Vengeance
> *Raw 18/7/04*
> Raw 13/12/04
> ...


Re-watched the Orton/Edge RAW match from July 18, 2004, because it was on one of Edge's DVDs, and it was great. Forgot how good that match was, actually. 

Liked both guys going for some of the same stuff, and the match moved pretty quickly.


ETA: smitty, did you watch Hogan/Warrior yet?


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

LilOlMe said:


> Did the Punk vs. Bryan match at MITB 2012 have a screwy ending? Did AJ involve herself a lot in a ridiculous way during the match?
> 
> Don't ruin a lot specifically, please, but just let me know if it was a decent match in a semi believable "cleanish" way, or was it just ridiculous as far as shenanigans go, from AJ or anyone else.
> 
> ...


Cena/Umage for NYR is the perfect set up to their Last Man Standing match. I found the LMS match much more enjoyable after I saw this match.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Because I'm putting off Hate-Watching until the weekends, random match rating time:

*Undertaker-Mr. Kennedy series:*

No Mercy- ***1/2*
Survivor Series- ****
Armageddon- ****


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

rjsbx1 said:


> Because I'm putting off Hate-Watching until the weekends, random match rating time:
> 
> *Undertaker-Mr. Kennedy series:*
> 
> ...


Thank you. I watched that series a few months ago andi was ashamed by all the matches. If it wasn't for Kurt Angle carrying Undertaker, his 2006 would be a waste :side:


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*The post-match beatdown from Taker to Kennedy after the SVS match was pretty :mark: but other than that I felt pretty meh about the matches. *


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Thank you. I watched that series a few months ago andi was ashamed by all the matches. If it wasn't for Kurt Angle carrying Undertaker, his 2006 would be a waste :side:


Hey, he gave Khali the best match of his career!



rjsbx1 said:


> *The post-match beatdown from Taker to Kennedy after the SVS match was pretty :mark: but other than that I felt pretty meh about the matches. *


That chair shot was fucking deadly. Kennedy got MURDERED.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Undertaker Vs Mr Kennedy - Nürnberg, Germany 08/11/2006 - ****1/4 - 6
The Undertaker Vs Mr Kennedy - No Mercy October 8th 2006 - ****1/4 - 6
The Undertaker Vs Mr Kennedy - Armageddon December 17th 2006 - ***1/2 - 3
The Undertaker Vs Mr Kennedy - Survivor Series November 26th 2006 - ***1/2 - 3


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I'm surprised you havn't said anything about 'Angle carrying Taker' comment Cal.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I try not to feed trolls 8*D.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

unk2


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

*Summerslam 2005 Match Ratings*

Chris Benoit vs Orlando Jordan -- *1/4*

Matt Hardy vs Edge W/ Lita -- **1/4*

Eddie Gurerro vs Rey Mysterio -- ****

Eugene vs Kurt Angle -- **1/4*

The Undertaker vs Randy Orton -- ***3/4*

Chris Jericho vs John Cena -- **1/4*

JBL vs Batista -- ****

HBK vs Hulk Hogan -- ***1/2*


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Damn, some low ratings for certain matches there. Mainly Eddie/Rey (which is good but not great, definitely way more than **), and Orton/Undertaker which is around ****1/4 for me on last watch and probably better than their WM match.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

RichardHagen said:


> *Summerslam 2005 Match Ratings*
> 
> Chris Benoit vs Orlando Jordan -- *1/4*
> 
> ...




Pretty harsh on Jericho/Cena. 

Awesome match. ***3/4


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

RichardHagen said:


> *Summerslam 2005 Match Ratings*
> 
> Chris Benoit vs Orlando Jordan -- *1/4*
> 
> ...


You sure you watched the right event?  Some low ratings there...


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Talk about some strict ratings... For me:

John Cena vs. Chris Jericho - *** 1/2 (hella fun sprint)
Undertaker vs. Rando Orton - **** (better than their Wrestlemania match imo)
Shawn Michaels vs. Hulk Hogan - *** 3/4 (AWESOME)


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

:lmao the WM XX match ain't gonna be on the HBK WM DVD http://www.wrestlingdvdnews.com/wwe-clarifies-inclusion-of-chris-benoit-dvd/54614/ :lmao.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

First time I've ever really critiqued a show like that. I'll loosen up. I was being very harsh, for sure. 

Eddie and Rey botched a few times in key spots of the match. Rey was also very slow in stopping Eddie from retrieving the briefcase at some points as well. Making it very awkward and hard to watch for me. Also when Vickie missed her que and Eddie flipped shit, that also ruined it for me. 

I can't really get into anything Cena does. Jericho is great, no doubt about it, but Cena is just so unorthodox in the ring, and Jericho is so good, it's a weird combination for me. 

HBK over selling the ending ruined the magic of the match.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Its ok, if that's what you thought, that's what you thought.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Callamus said:


> :lmao the WM XX match ain't gonna be on the HBK WM DVD http://www.wrestlingdvdnews.com/wwe-clarifies-inclusion-of-chris-benoit-dvd/54614/ :lmao.


lol, that's some serious bullshit. Specially since they suggest ALL 17 will be included.

Sadly iww/HHH was right on this one. :sad:


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Not surprised that the WM XX match won't be on the set. Probably for the best actually, because they would have edited the shit out of it.

Regarding Summerslam 2005, some super low ratings for sure. I actually liked Hogan/Michaels a lot. And Cena/Jericho was pretty nice also. HATE Rey/Eddie though. Probably one of their worst matches.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

I'm getting Wrestlemania 25 & 26 in the mail this Wednesday. I have never watched either of the events. I want to do a detailed review of them both.

Which one should I start with?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

25 since you'll want to watch HBK/Taker I before HBK/Taker II.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

RichardHagen said:


> First time I've ever really critiqued a show like that. I'll loosen up. I was being very harsh, for sure.
> 
> Eddie and Rey botched a few times in key spots of the match. Rey was also very slow in stopping Eddie from retrieving the briefcase at some points as well. Making it very awkward and hard to watch for me. Also when Vickie missed her que and Eddie flipped shit, that also ruined it for me.
> 
> ...



Yea man to each their own, I personally really dug Summerslam 2005, thought it was more than solid throughout.

Eddie/Rey Ladder match ****
-some would probably say this is overrating a match that has as many botches (2-3 big ones that I noticed) as this one. And that's fine, but having amazing drama and sublime character performances will always trump a few badly timed botches. Plus, aside from Eddie flipping out, I feel like they continued smoothly after the botches and it didn't really detract from the match. If this match had gone off without a hitch, no botches, exactly as it was structured, it would probably be my second or third favorite ladder match ever. As it was, I still consider it pretty grand and a helluva match. It is just masterful story telling from my favorite wrestler ever and my favorite baby face worker ever. Hard to top that for me

Cena/Jericho WWE Title ****
-I have fluctuated on ratings for this match every time I've seen it. I've had it as high as ****1/2 and as low as ***. I just watched this 3 days ago when watching this entire event, and I think I've finally settled on this being a great match but not an all timer or anything. Jericho is just a total machine in this, he works and bumps his ass off and as a result he gives Cena his best non-gimmick match to that point (aka the Judgement Day match with JBL is his best match to that point IMO). I love the structure, I love how these two guys styles meshed, and I love the crowd just saying fuck it half way through and deciding they love and respect Jericho too much to boo him. Great way for Jericho to end his first run, he had a rematch the following night on Raw that was almost as good. I know I'm gonna get heat for this, but I now prefer this one to their much more heralded SVS WHC during Jericho's second run. A lot of that has to do with the fact that I prefer Jericho as a worker from 1996-2005 as opposed to 2007-2013. He just seemed a lot stiffer with his punches and smoother with his counters back then. Again just my preference. 

HBK/Hogan Icon vs Legend Match ****
- pretty simple. I fucking love watching Hulk Hogan in the ring. I'm sorry, call it a guilty pleasure or whatever but Hogan is just such a master of crowd psychology, I will never grow tired of watching that man do his thing. His "thing" is accomplished with a punch, a boot, a leg, and whole heaping buckets of charisma, but god damn he knows his limits better than anyone and always stays true to who he is. I don't excuse him for how lazy he got in the ring during a lot of his later WCW days, but the 80's Hulk and the 2002-2005 Hulk will always entertain the hell out of me in the ring. I haven't even mentioned HBK, who takes the phrase "bumping like a madman" to a whole new extreme in an attempt to get back at Hogan for refusing to job. I don't care, none of HBKs childish actions took me out of the match, and for the first 2/3's or so of it Shawn was doing a swell job of hiding Hogans many deficiencies in the ring. When Hogan began hulking up with his face covered in blood at the end and no selling Shawn's offense, I was a little kid again. That's why I think so highly of this match.

So, yea, I dug Summerslam 2005.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

SummerSlam 2005 is an awesome show. Love the Cena/Jericho and Orton/Taker matches most of all. HBK/Hogan is lots of fun and Eddie/Rey is very good. Nothing is bad on that card.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I was going to say Benoit/Jordan is bad, but it's actually kind of amusing.

Forgot to mention Orton/Taker. Top 2-3 feud in 2005, and unlike Batista/Trips, they didn't have a bad match.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit/Jordan is awesome. It's not meant to be rated as a regular match but as a funny little squash "match". They righted their wrong from The Bash when Benoit jobbed almost completely clean to Jordan by having him get back in the strongest way possible with a tap out victory when the crowd is hyped and match is about to start.

It's funny how getting buried by Benoit is Jordan's career highlight. :lol


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

HBK over selling was amazing. The big fuck you to Hogan, because he refused to job.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Benoit/Jordan is awesome. It's not meant to be rated as a regular match but as a funny little squash "match". They righted their wrong from The Bash when Benoit jobbed almost completely clean to Jordan by having him get back in the strongest way possible with a tap out victory when the crowd is hyped and match is about to start.
> 
> It's funny how getting buried by Benoit is Jordan's career highlight. :lol


And facing the Ultimate Warrior


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Is it fair to say that I'm planning out a Top 50 WM matches ever before 30? 8*D


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

xdoomsayerx said:


> HBK over selling was amazing. The big fuck you to Hogan, because he refused to job.


imo


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Survivour Series 2007:

Punk vs Miz vs Morrison- **1/2
Divas Elimination. Match- *1/2
Cade&Murdoch vs Holly&Cody- **
Team HHH vs Team Umaga- ***1/2
HBK vs Randy Orton- ***3/4
Batista vs Undertaker- ****1/4


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)




----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Orton/HBK deserves much, much more than ***3/4 imo.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


>


Lmao. This is exactly what I was referring too.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Amazing how he does all those turns and manages to land almost perfectly. :lmao


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Going to go watch hbk/orton along with angle/taker matches from 06


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Amazing how he does all those turns and manages to land almost perfectly. :lmao


and Hogan doesn't even see it 'till HBK falls to the mat


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

I'm watching CM Punk / John Cena from February 25th 2013 Raw right now.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

RichardHagen said:


> I'm watching CM Punk / John Cena from February 25th 2013 Raw right now.



That's #2 behind only Punk/Lesnar as my MotY, absolutely tremendous. Their second best match behind MitB and one of the best TV matches ever. I know a lot of people will disagree with me but whatever, I love that match.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

WWE World Championship Match
*John Bradshaw Layfield Vs Eddie Guerrero (WWE Judgment Day 2004)*
_Fresh after the epic bloodbath of hatred that was Chicana/MS-1 I had to continue my fix of brawling, violent Mexicans and the picture of a bloodied Eddie was first that came to mind.

Eddie's control at the start of the match was so well constructed on a micro and macro level in that Eddie was monumental in his facial expressions and body language as he throws some great punches right into JBL's face. Wording off and mocking JBL in Spanish was a nice nuance to JBL refusing to address the Latino-majority crowd in their own language in his pre-match promo and just drove home the fact that the Pro-American, racist heel was being manhandled by a Mexican "lowlife". Though, to his credit, JBL can express hatred just as well, too, and his great right-hooks come as a plus to the animosity between these two men.

The pacing of both men was spot-on, as well. They transition from Eddie's utter control over JBL to Eddie's underdog role logically (as to avoid either moment seeming forced) and at just the right moment to swing the crowd from "perro" chants toward JBL, laughing at what seemed like his fast-approaching loss, to pleading for Eddie to make his comeback. Even the ref bump, which is too often a badly contrived spot in wrestling, came organically. It was hilarious as fuck to witness the powerbomb on Eddie to wake the unconscious referee up, suddenly, too.

The match-ending and post-match segment may even be better than the match, itself. Watching a bloodied Eddie throw cathartic punch after punch, with some of the finest selling of a man dizzied due to bloodloss, and then deliver a complete decimation of Bradshaw felt like a completely fitting vengeance for not only the hell JBL had exacted upon Eddie's family but the insults that the latino community had to endure due to JBL's commentary. The quality nor the hatred was as strong as the Chicana/MS-1 epic but that cannot be a slight on the goodness that was delivered here as I cannot quite think of many matches that could come close to that level. It may be Bradshaw's nickname, but I'll be damned if Eddie Guerrero wasn't channeling his inner wrestling god here as he absolutely ruled._


WWE World Championship Match
*Brock Lesnar Vs Eddie Guerrero (WWE No Way Out 2004)*
_There's always some telenovela-type drama going on with Eddie. Whether he's stealing the son off his now ex-best friend, witnessing his mother almost die of a heartache or being looked down upon because of his drug abuse (though the latter is true), the timespan of 2004-2005 was filled with potentially cringeworthy storylines that ended up working thanks, in part, to Eddie's intensity and belief in them.

As much as this is an Eddie showcase, the match comes across as a good argument for just how good Brock could be so early into his career. Of course his size counts for some, but he brings an unmistakable aura to what he does that just sells himself as the beast that he's billed as. Additionally, his selling is wholly more than servicable and, while it's not as great as his doing in the HHH cage match from this year, the backrack on a hobbling injured leg was a great sight to see.

Much like the Judgment Day match, this also transitions beautifully between control-spots while still maintaining a narrative that is succint with the underdog story you'd hope in an Eddie Vs frightening monster title fight. A narrative that becomes even more embellished by the parallels to Eddie's own life story brought forward in never giving up the fight against the demons plaguing his life.

"Just die, Eddie, just... die...". Powerful._​


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I can't understand why anybody defends Michaels' horrendously bad overselling in that match. "Hogan didn't want to lose the match!!!" Yeah, so it's OK for Shawn to ruin the dream match for thousands of people watching. All right.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

RichardHagen said:


> I'm watching CM Punk / John Cena from February 25th 2013 Raw right now.


The most overrated match of the year. :Bischoff


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah1993 said:


> I can't understand why anybody defends Michaels' horrendously bad overselling in that match. "Hogan didn't want to lose the match!!!" Yeah, so it's OK for Shawn to ruin the dream match for thousands of people watching. All right.


Yeah, but it's HBK, so it's all cool. I mean, it's not like HE would ever refuse to do a job, right?




Guys?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> I can't understand why anybody defends Michaels' horrendously bad overselling in that match. "Hogan didn't want to lose the match!!!" Yeah, so it's OK for Shawn to ruin the dream match for thousands of people watching. All right.


Because it's hilarious? I don't condone the "FUCK YOU" sentiment of it if that's indeed why he did it, but imo it makes the match that much more entertaining.

Did it actually ruin the match for people/casuals?


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Yeah1993 said:


> I can't understand why anybody defends Michaels' horrendously bad overselling in that match. "Hogan didn't want to lose the match!!!" Yeah, so it's OK for Shawn to ruin the dream match for thousands of people watching. All right.


*This.

It's not like Shawn has never played politics either. All he had to was make Hogan's offense look presentable and put the guy on top. Be a company guy and swallow the bitter pill instead of acting like a pinball on crack and basically sticking it to the guy.

I will say one thing though, HBK was killer in the promos leading up to the match. *


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

The Lady Killer said:


> Because it's hilarious? I don't condone the "FUCK YOU" sentiment of it if that's indeed why he did it, but imo it makes the match that much more entertaining.
> 
> Did it actually ruin the match for people/casuals?


I guess whether you find it entertaining or not depends on...IDK your 'you'-ness (SOMEONE WORD THIS FOR ME), but I think it's stupid. The match probably would have sucked anyway b/c Hogan was old as ass and Michaels couldn't have a good match with Rey Mysterio in 2005, but at the very least he wouldn't have tried to make it suck and look like he was shouting 'WRESTLING IS FAKE!' from a building rooftop. I'm not defending Hogan because who knows what the hell went on in the back, but being unprofessional backstage is a lot better than being unprofessional on live TV (is pay per view 'TV'? You watch it on you TV, yeah? Fookit, that will stay).


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I see your point, but most people are already aware that wrestling is fake, and I highly doubt that for those who didn't, Shawn's "performance" in that match is what gave it away. Does it make it right? Probably not.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

:lmao


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah, that was pretty great. Promo the night after Summerslam was gold too.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

I'm a Punk fan, but it's segments like this that justify my saying that his face run in 2011 was mediocre at best:







This segment, to me is, at some points cringe-worthy. The awkward introduction, the random overzealous statements... only selected parts of what Punk said were fine. 

It's made worse buy the repetition of meaningless phrases like, "This is crazy, Philadelphia!"


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Chismo said:


> The most overrated match of the year. :Bischoff


I thought that was Bryan/Cena?


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

brother brother BROTHER BROTHER BROTHER BROTHER



























































*BROTHER*

:hbk


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Rhodes_For_WHC said:


> I'm a Punk fan, but it's segments like this that justify my saying that his face run in 2011 was mediocre at best:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah, I can't really rally behind face Punk, either. He basically acts like everything he claims to hate in his "pipebombs."


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

"CAUSE YOU KNOW MEAN GENE, BROTHER!"
"Larry.... it's Larry King"
"Whatever Larry... I'M SELLING TICKETS BROTHER!"

:lmao


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Starbuck said:


> brother brother BROTHER BROTHER BROTHER BROTHER
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Stop making jokes and go watch ziggler/adr :ziggler3

Need a ppv/match to watch

tried watch taker/angle 3/06 but didnt like it 



Pretty such HHH/Lesnar CAGE is most overrated

:lmao I love after hbk watches his montage, his reaction


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

It's hilarious when wrestlers make fun of Hogan. Rock, HBK and I remember Charlie Haas doing it in 2008. :lmao


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

HHH/Lesnar is great.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Lady Killer said:


> HHH/Lesnar is great.


Yeah, their SS match is indeed great .

Rest are a pile of puke, especially the cage which was legit awful.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

^ GTFO


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

SKINS25 said:


> Stop making jokes and go watch ziggler/adr :ziggler3
> 
> Need a ppv/match to watch
> 
> ...


You know, if I procrastinate from doing what I need to do hard enough, I just might end up watching that thing tonight. Anything to NOT write this fucking thing.

Don't worry TLK. Cally's just mad Taker doesn't have the balls to get in the ring with Lesnar and DA GAME did it 3 times. 

:trips2


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Pfft, you'll never watch Ziggler/Del Rio. You ain't got the BALLS to watch it...

oh wait 8*D.


YOU GTFO TLK.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

SKINS, go watch some 1998 Jericho. Especially the promos. Have to say that he somehow put 1997 Shawn to shame, and that is nearly impossible to do.

Or you can watch some Roman Reigns. You can never go wrong with some Roman Reigns. :reigns


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

WE MADE THE SAME JOKE.......... :side:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Starbuck said:


> WE MADE THE SAME JOKE.......... :side:


Yeah, but you edited yours in after your initial post. I SAW IT. So ha.

And Undertaker has faced Lesnar 3 times in singles matches alone. A bunch more in tags and handicaps. So ha 8*D.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

The Lady Killer said:


> Yeah, I can't really rally behind face Punk, either. He basically acts like everything he claims to hate in his "pipebombs."


Agreed. However, recent face Punk, though still far worse and less entertaining than heel Punk, hasn't been as bad. Moreover because he was Kayfabe "angry" throughout most of his face run, so far. Even so, his promos were boring and repetitious after the first two or three, and were nothing noteworthy or worth checking out.

Heel Punk is just so much better than face Punk. Punk was great during his SES days, and during his most recent heel run. Nexus days were decent, too. Everything else was mediocre, at best.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Callamus said:


> Yeah, but you edited yours in after your initial post. I SAW IT. So ha.
> 
> And Undertaker has faced Lesnar 3 times in singles matches alone. A bunch more in tags and handicaps. So ha 8*D.


So you saw it and then decided to make the same joke as me? Weak, Cally. Very weak. 

Didn't Lesnar make Taker his bitch inside the cell? HA. Then again, didn't Taker make Trips his bitch inside the cell? HA...wait...


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> SKINS, go watch some 1998 Jericho. Especially the promos. *Have to say that he somehow put 1997 Shawn to shame*, and that is nearly impossible to do.


:jt lets  calm down buddy, but I'll give him a watch


I dont usually plug wwe YT stuff, but if you guys have check out some of the JBL & Cole Show episodes, it might be better 90 % of raw most of the times. especially tonite :ti


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

No ya half-wit, I saw your post BEFORE you edited anything in. So looks to me more like you saw my post and edited in your shitty version of my joke. Which doesn't work as well because I HAVE BALLS.

It's a SOUL I don't have.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Callamus said:


> Yeah, their SS match is indeed great .
> 
> Rest are a pile of puke, especially the cage which was legit awful.


Thought it was just me, I got angry when watching the cage match, I just can't watch it again. SS though is very good, love that big match feel, I've grown to like it as when I saw it the first time I wasn't sure. Mania one needs a rewatch but it draaaaaaged way too much IMO, felt like 45mins whereas Taker/Punk felt like 5mins...


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Callamus said:


> No ya half-wit, I saw your post BEFORE you edited anything in. So looks to me more like you saw my post and edited in your shitty version of my joke. Which doesn't work as well because I HAVE BALLS.
> 
> It's a SOUL I don't have.


You're bragging about these ginger balls of yours like you just got them or something.

GINGER BALLS + GINGER SOUL + GINGER TAKER = GINGER CALLY 

It all makes sense now.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'm not even sure what we are arguing about now. Gonna just call you a cunt and move on 8*D.

Also watch Ziggler/Del Rio or something.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

:lol

Agreed. I need to go do what I actually should be doing instead of wasting time arguing with gingers and talking about Zigs and Rio of all people.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

You two should settle your differences in the same room watching Gingertaker vs HHH from King of the Ring 2002 in a "Who can stay awake until the end?" contest. It's your two favorites going at it. The winner's favorite will be officially superior.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I only recently sat through and reviewed both of their 02 matches a couple of weeks ago. I FUCKING WIN.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Yeah, but it's HBK, so it's all cool. I mean, it's not like HE would ever refuse to do a job, right?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Funny you should say that. The only reason we got what I believe is the greatest match in WWE history, Austin vs Bret at WM 13, is because Shawn refused to job to Bret. Just think, if Shawn wasn't a drugged out, insecure, sissy political backstabber, we would have been deprived of that masterpiece, and had it replaced with IRONMAN 2: The Cure for Insomnia Strike Back!

So yea, I'm happy Shawn was a little bitch back then. Gave us one of the greatest matches ever.

On the subject or HBK/Hogan, my opinion is:

1. Shawn was WAYYYY out of line doing what he did it was childish and highly unprofessional and there isn't an excuse in the world for it.
2. What he did do did not "ruin" the match for me by any stretch of the imagination
3. I actually found the big boot bump to be downright hysterical
4. Shawn's stupidity kept that match from being a masterpiece, instead we got a highly entertaining but totally forgettable match. I dig it still, but it should have been SO much more.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The most recent Total Divas episode is hilarious. Consists entirely of one of the Usos farting on the Funkadactyls and Eva Marie forgetting Jinder Mahal's name :lmao






And to think that there are people out there who say that :HHH > :jericho


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Starbuck said:


> brother brother BROTHER BROTHER BROTHER BROTHER
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Speaking of Jericho, just posted this in the Raw thread:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

If you wanna see some good Jericho, check out his Fall Brawl 1996 match against Benoit. Absolutely great.

I enjoy Jericho's heel character from 2008-on, but for me I much prefer him from 1996-2005 in the ring. His best character was the heel 1998 cry baby Jericho (I remember absolutely loathing him as a kid).

For me, Jericho is both overrated and underrated. He's overrated by those who think he is one of the greatest ever, which in my opinion is surely not the case. But he's underrated because some people seem to think he's outright garbage both on the mic and in the ring, and I think that's even more incorrect. If Jericho is in your upper mid card making all the up and coming faces look like a million bucks before they hit the world title seen, you're in great shape. But if you are relying on him to carry the company, eh, not so much.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I can only think of two other guys that were better all around talents than Jericho, and both of them are your two favorites.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

2005 set STILL isn't here. I officially HATE the USPS..


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Jericho is easily one of the greatest ever. No harm in saying so. Dude's great.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

I agree with both of you, funnyfaces1 and Cactus Jack. Jericho is great all-around, he's great in the ring, on the mic, is very charismatic...

I've liked him both as face and as heel. Going back, and watching a lot of his work, I must say, my favorite work of his includes his time in WCW, his work from about 2001-1004, and his work in 2008, with Shawn Michaels.

All are above great. Though, I could see why he's not considered to be a GOAT. I'm guessing he just lacks presence, and "the look" to be top guy.


----------



## SnakePlissken (Nov 18, 2013)

Do people really buy wrestling DVDs? It's just so easy finding matches on youtube. I can't picture paying $20 for a DVD.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Jericho is easily a top ten "total package" talent. Always delivers good matches and IS one of the GOAT on the Mic.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> The most recent Total Divas episode is hilarious. Consists entirely of one of the Usos farting on the Funkadactyls and Eva Marie forgetting Jinder Mahal's name :lmao
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks so much for posting this. Watched the match, which I like, but now I'm heading to some Jericho/Malenko matches. :mark: 

Also, Jinder and Drew :burieding Eva last night :lmao But Heath try use it as a teaching moment. :lmao


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Who thinks Jericho is garbage?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Is that a new trend on this site? Bagging on Jericho?


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Agree on Jericho. One of the most few talents that can play both face and heel well, and adapt to different characters. His 2002-05 stuff was more of an arrogant Y2J with some comedy parts here and there but the 2008 - 2010 Y2J was just awesome. He really made me hate him during that feud with HBK and that's something a great heel would do :lol. A total package. Although I must say I hate his role right now. I know he wants to put over talents but when you lose to Fandango, Heath Slater and Curtis Axel then it becomes too much. He also lost to Ryback in a match that meant nothing for Ryback's momentum when looking back at it now.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Was actually enjoying his 2013 stuff alot besides that flubber at payback


What Y2J 1998 matches are you telling me to check out ?


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

SnakePlissken said:


> Do people really buy wrestling DVDs? It's just so easy finding matches on youtube. I can't picture paying $20 for a DVD.


I used to feel the same way, but DVDs are easier for having everything in one place, plus I'm interested in the documentary portions of many of them.

Also, I'm finding that I'm enjoying matches a whole hellavu lot more when I watch them on tv, as opposed to on my computer. Not sure why that is, but that's the case. Maybe because when I'm on my computer, I'm more tempted to do other stuff, any time there's a lull in the action. That's harder to do when watching on tv. I end up appreciating matches more as a whole when watching on tv, 'cause I'm less distracted.

I know others are probably smart enough to have figured out how to transfer stuff from places like Youtube on to their tvs, but I'm not that bright nor that dedicated. 

Oh, and pretty much every DVD I get is on sale, or is way cheap on amazon. You'd be surprised how cheap they are, if you catch them at the right time. It's actually been rare for me to spend $20 on a dvd. Most of them I've gotten for around $8, and the old PPVs are usually only $5.


'skins, I got your PM and will respond later. (Y)


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Jericho is great. He was never one of my top favorites, but you can always rely on Jericho for a good match/storyline. Also one of the few wrestlers that made a good face and heel. I loved the Jericho/Christian/Trish program in 2004.



SnakePlissken said:


> Do people really buy wrestling DVDs? It's just so easy finding matches on youtube. I can't picture paying $20 for a DVD.


Not anymore, but I used to because having a collection is nice. And most of the DVD's I bought where dirt cheap on Ebay. But even now if I want to watch a match I'll check YouTube first because it's easier than setting up my DVD player.  I'm lazy like that.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Nostalgia said:


> Jericho is great. He was never one of my top favorites, but you can always rely on Jericho for a good match/storyline. Also one of the few wrestlers that made a good face and heel. I loved the Jericho/Christian/Trish program in 2004.


*They had three awesome matches together in 2004. The Steel Cage match they had :mark:, one of my personal favorites. Then there's the very good Wrestlemania XX and Ladder Match (from name of the PPV is escaping me.) *


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

*Chris Jericho vs Dean Malenko - Nitro - July 27, 1998*

This is Malenko's last chance at the Cruiserweight title. Good bit of back and forth in the early going, which Jericho catching Malenko with a dropkick he even enters the ring. Back to the ring, and Jericho goes to the top, however Malenko catches Jericho with a dropkick on his way down. On the top turnbuckle, Jericho is looking for perhaps a hurricanrana from the top, but back flips off. Malenko gets the sunset flip, but Jericho rolls through, and looks for the Walls of Jericho, which he doesn't get all of, and the commentators acknowledge this, saying it was more of a Boston crab. Back from commercial, and Jericho is in control, until Malenko hits a heel kick of the Irish whip. The two continue to trade control and Malenko hits a release German suplex, followed by a running lariot. Malenko looks for another suplex, which Jericho counters in an inverted suplex and follows up with the Lionsault for a nearfall. Each guy looks for a suplex with the other countering time after time. Jericho looks for the double underhook, but Malenko counters into a potential backslide, which Jericho also fights out of. Malenko then hits the double underhook powerbomb. He then locks in the Texas Cloverleaf, but Jericho is too close to the ropes, and gets a break. Power slam from Malenko, and he goes to the top. Jerich hits the ropes and Malenko is straddling the top turnbuckle. Jericho looking for superplex, but Malenko counters into a DDT, getting a close nearfall. Jericho rolls out and and pulls out the brass knuckles, which the referee apparently doesn't see. Malenko stomps Jericho down in the corner, and pushes the referee away a couple times. Malenko attends to the ref for a second and turns around just in time to dodge a right hand, instead hitting a suplex. He then picks up the knucs and hits Jericho. Ref sees the knucs on his hand, and gives Jericho the DQ win. Kind of fun match. ***3/4*

*Chris Jericho vs Dean Malenko - WCW Uncensored 1998
*
Jericho is fucking awesome in this match. Early on he's going full steam with his cry baby gimmick. Malenko locks in a hold and he's crying to the referee :lol. He also has a great control segment, and Malenko does well as the face in peril. Dean trying to make a comeback after Jericho chops him in the corner is pretty riling. Jericho though goes right back into control. Dean hits a belly to back suplex for a two count, and Jericho is right back to his feet. Jericho looks for a belly to back suplex from the top, but Dean turns in for the cross body. Another two count. Jericho looks for the Liontamer, and Malenko fights it off, getting his behind Jericho's calves, then turning over and crawling to the ropes. They go back to the rop and Jericho looks for the Super-Frankensteiner but Malenko hits the Gutbuster from the top :mark: Jericho ends up locking in the Liontamer, Malenko gets to the ropes, but Jericho pulls him back to the middle of the ring, and sets down on one knee, not letting Malenko even attempt to crawl. Pretty sweet match. Jericho in 1998 was pretty damn fun, and pretty easy to hate. MAN OF 1004 HOLDS ****3/4*

Commentators playing up that Dean has never shown emotion, but he's distraught now. Mean Gene's interview after the match with Malenko. :lmao Keeps rubbing salt in the wound. "You are a bonified loser!" :lmao And Dean just leaves, visibly distraught with himself.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


> Who thinks Jericho is garbage?



Garbage was probably too strong a word, but I see people bag on him and call him overrated quite a bit unfortunately. Whatever, people are entitled to their opinions even if I find them silly.

Think I'll watch that classic Jericho/Ultimo Dragon match from 1996 that put him on that map. That one never gets old, I love Dragon and those nasty stiff kicks. Anyone know if Dragon ever had any matches of note with Tajiri either stateside or in Japan? I could imagine them just spending oodles of time attempting to decapitate each other with beautiful round house kicks.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

SummerSlam 2005 talk and not one person put over Hardy vs Edge being fanfuckingtastic.

Booourns.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

I have a lot of respect for Jericho for the fact that he has put up with so much shit in his career. The guy is a legend and has had a marvelous career, but it could have been even better.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*I loved the Edge/Hardy "fight" (albeit because I'm a unabashed Edge mark) but I thought it was the perfect way to kick-start the feud that led to an even better Cage match at Unforgiven.

I don't think enough gets said about how professional those two (I guess, three counting Tits McGee) were able to put the obvious tension and shit aside and work well and safely with each other. *


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Shouldn't you be busy watching some more Ministry Taker?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

The Primer said:


> SummerSlam 2005 talk and not one person put over Hardy vs Edge being fanfuckingtastic.
> 
> Booourns.


Clearly they were waiting for you. :hb


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

rjsbx1 said:


> *They had three awesome matches together in 2004. The Steel Cage match they had :mark:, one of my personal favorites. Then there's the very good Wrestlemania XX and Ladder Match (from name of the PPV is escaping me.) *


Their steel cage was awesome. One of the best TV matches of the year and it's probably my favorite from their series. With it being a TV match it's kind of rare though but I'd recommend anyone to watch it, lucky I have it on my greatest steel cage matches DVD. 

Ladder match was Unforgiven 2004 btw. (Y)


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

rjsbx1 said:


> *I loved the Edge/Hardy "fight" (albeit because I'm a unabashed Edge mark) but I thought it was the perfect way to kick-start the feud that led to an even better Cage match at Unforgiven.
> 
> I don't think enough gets said about how professional those two (I guess, three counting Tits McGee) were able to put the obvious tension and shit aside and work well and safely with each other. *


The exposure behind the angle was more of a positive than wanting to hate the ex-friend for their transgression. They were no doubt wise enough to the fact. Beat the holy hell out of each other to an extent in the ring & grow more in their singles careers via it. It was a plan that gave nothing but positives.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Shouldn't you be busy watching some more Ministry Taker?


Aye. Quick music break intermission. Then back on.

Plus I continue to get derailed b/c I'm forced to watched this numerous times. COKED out Undertaker > Shawn. It's official.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> SummerSlam 2005 talk and not one person put over Hardy vs Edge being fanfuckingtastic.
> 
> Booourns.



I put it over in the full review I wrote. I will be posting it along with the other 2005 shows I did soon. While I think the Vengeance Cage and Raw Street Fight were superior (duh, those are probably the 2 best matches of either guys career, especially the cage) I still really dug the HATE and intensity of Summerslam. The ending didn't bother me as much as I've seen others complain, it was necessary to continue the story and keep Hardy and Edge both credible for future matches. One of my favorite 5 minute "matches" ever. And I use the word matches in the loosest sense of the word, because honestly that was just a fight. Those punches by Hardy and kicks by Edge :mark:

Also, GOOD LORD, Lita always looks smoking and is in my opinion he hottest wrestler ever, but she looks maybe as hot as I've ever seen in that Summerslam match. Again, GOOD LORD.:flair3


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cage is their top prize, but for as much as I love the street fight, I wouldn't have SummerSlam far from it. Possibly over. Duration played stronger into the angle than if they were to try and kill each other for 20+ minutes every single time. First match they wanted blood. They got it. Well, Edge did in the literal sense. Hardy's punches looked good & I'm pretty sure those were the best Edge ever threw. He supplied the goods when it came to the kicks to the head following the post shot. Magical stuff. So magical to see two guys who legit hated each other at the time want to pulverize the other. This is why I watch.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

nah edge/hardy ss 05 is tops, great little brawl :lenny for that naitch reference


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Cage is their top prize, but for as much as I love the street fight, I wouldn't have SummerSlam far from it. Possibly over. Duration played stronger into the angle than if they were to try and kill each other for 20+ minutes every single time. First match they wanted blood. They got it. Well, Edge did in the literal sense. Hardy's punches looked good & I'm pretty sure those were the best Edge ever threw. He supplied the goods when it came to the kicks to the head following the post shot. Magical stuff. So magical to see two guys who legit hated each other at the time want to pulverize the other. This is why I watch.


What about the Ladder match? I own that on DVD and it's the only one I haven't seen recently (watched all the others for my 2005 project). You know what, I don't remember shit from that one but the finish, I think that deserves a rewatch. I'm sure it can't be bad if it's a Ladder match involving Edge and a Hardy.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*I love the finish of their Loser Leaves Raw match with Lita tying and basically latching onto Hardy in the ropes while he had to watch his rival grab his ticket to the main event and in the process, banish him from the flagship show.

JR sold it well by saying at the end of the match "This just isn't fair." which summed up the whole real-life situation and feud perfectly if you were Matt Hardy.*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's quite good. Out of the four matches they had I'd rank it last, but the consistency in quality there propels it to still be capable of being put over. Spots outside of climbing the ladder seems more fitting than usual b/c the hate was in full force. Opposed to be being stupid "it's a ladder match, I'm gonna do these spots just b/c".


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Edge/Hardy feud:

Cage > Summerslam > Street Fight > Ladder

And Lita was hot as fuck when she was with Edge. :yum:


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

4 matches ? sslam, cage match, ladder match and...

Don't think there was a time when I liked Michaels more then during his feud with Hogan, at that point I was so sick of face Michaels i welcomed the heel turn with open arms.
His parody of Hogan is one of my favorite segments and I was so anti-Hogan going into sslam, i was reacting to Hogan's offense on Michaels like i was his manager.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

rjsbx1 said:


> *I love the finish of their Loser Leaves Raw match with Lita tying and basically latching onto Hardy in the ropes while he had to watch his rival grab his ticket to the main event and in the process, banish him from the flagship show.
> 
> JR sold it well by saying at the end of the match "This just isn't fair." which summed up the whole real-life situation and feud perfectly if you were Matt Hardy.*



Tell me about it. Edge in 2005 is one or the last universally hated heels in wrestling. Randy got close in 2009 and so did Punk with the SES, but those guys still had plenty of dudes cheering them and appreciating the awesomeness of their heel work. Edge is different, unless you don't have a soul (I'm looking at you, Cal ) how could you not be 100% behind Hardy and 100000% against Edge? I mean the dude is supposed to be your best friend, yet he steals your girlfriend/future wife while you are out with an injury, continues fucking her when you come back, then you end up losing your dream job because the company you work for thinks higher of that piece of shit than you. That is the absolute definition of unfair. Not only that, but the only way you can get your job back is to have to protect this guy from injury in the ring and sit and watch him emasculate you every night while your girl escorts him to the ring and they make out every chance they get.

Ugh, as you can see it makes me mad just thinking about it. Hayley said it, that's why I watch wrestling. For those times when you get those transcendent feuds/matches that just suck you right in and keep you on the edge of your seat.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

HEAT

Hardy & Edge duking it out on Byte This for more fuel to the fire. WWE was all over this. I loved how they just decided to say fuck it & expose the situation to the world considering a lot already knew about it.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*That feud is just beautiful from the top to bottom. Everyone played their role brilliantly. Edge, the douchebag ex-friend. Lita, the coy and vindictive Jezebel. Hardy, the sympathetic babyface.

The best part of the feud is there was no happy ending (just like in real-life). Hardy got shipped to Smackdown and Edge became WWE Champion shortly after. Life just ain't fair, yo. *


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Truly not fair b/c Matt Hardy never got the championship rub from the scenario. :hayley2


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao at that Undertaker promo. I remember watching it as a seven year older when it first aired thinking that Undertaker lost his marbles. Couldn't find that segment for years until last year when someone uploaded it on to Dailymotion. Undertaker's story, Big Show's ability to keep a straight face, and Jericho going toe to toe with The Undertaker and making him look so foolish that he had to be admonished. Love it.

Randy Orton cut a good promo, guys. And for some reason, what should be the SvS main event is main eventing RAW.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

bme said:


> 4 matches ? sslam, cage match, ladder match and...


Their street fight from RAW:






Good match like their other matches, but this match is most well known for the epic ending when Matt Hardy delivers a Side Effect off the stage to Edge threw a table which causes the match to end as a no-contest. Edge talks about how this spot really worried him and he thought he had broke his neck again, and who could blame him, he lands horribly at 15:40 in the above video.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Cactus Jack said:


> Garbage was probably too strong a word, but I see people bag on him and call him overrated quite a bit unfortunately.


Oh, OK, in that case that would be me.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Big E the new IC Champion. Good decision. Although Cody probably hates it. 

This should of happened at Survivor Series though.


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

Nostalgia said:


> Their street fight from RAW:
> 
> 
> Good match like their other matches, but this match is most well known for the epic ending when Matt Hardy delivers a Side Effect off the stage to Edge threw a table which causes the match to end as a no-contest. Edge talks about how this spot really worried him and he thought he had broke his neck again, and who could blame him, he lands horribly at 15:40 in the above video.


I remember the side effect off the stage, it did look serious cause they showed Edge's face and he was tearing up.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:lmao


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Laughing because I thought it was a good decision? :side: Hey, I'm not a fan of either guy but I'll take him over Axel and so would 90% of this forum probably.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Surely some Tito Santana will heal the wounds of Big E winning the title, Paramore fan. Of course I don't really have a problem with Big E winning, but I have an affinity for black people.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*I mean...he can't be worse than Ezekiel Jackson, right?

Although they butchered his theme. Makes me sad.*


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

He's already better than Big Zeke (although that doesn't say much). Better in the ring and he actually some has charisma and personality, unlike Jackson.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm gonna have to rewatch that, but Big Show/Ryback was really fun. Good ol' Big Show. Unappreciated for his greatness :show


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*He has this weird likeability, and I honestly hope he goes far and I hope they utilizes the 5-count gimmick he had in NXT.

...by the way has Zeke even healed from that 3 year injury?*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nostalgia said:


> Laughing because I thought it was a good decision? :side: Hey, I'm not a fan of either guy but I'll take him over Axel and *so would 90% of this forum probably*.


I was gonna ignore this b/c that's not why I'm laughing, but the last line is just horrendous.

If someone doesn't know why I'm laughing, I feel for you.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Eh, well Axel seems to get a ton of hate on this forum while Big E most people are indifferent to or like, sure some don't like him, but the only person I've seen who REALLY dislikes him is you. While I see MANY people who don't like Axel. And I'm talking about the WWE section in general, not this thread, I know some people only really post here and don't bother with the rest of the WWE threads (and I don't blame you) but you only have to take a look at some of the threads on this forum to see the general consensus on Axel on here.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's not the preference, it's the use of a general statement as if I should care of acknowledge what "more" folk have an opinion on that makes it sound so bad. It isn't a positive scenario simply b/c more folks would prefer it than who was holding the strap before. All of this really stems from me thinking WWE's booking staff don't know what they're doing. In this situation, the Intercontinential Championship being passed off willy nilly on occasions which don't matter.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Agreed on that last line. This match should of been built up and then happened at Survivor Series. As then the title change would of meant a lot more than having it happen on a random RAW episode. But I can why WWE do it, they want people to tune in and they'll throw a title change or a big moment on RAW occasionally in the hope they will.

The pop when Big E won was good, but that would of been much better on PPV..


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I think skipping on Survivor Series was fine if it would have had a branch of a program there. Say both guys being part of an elimination match. Have a match lined up for TLC, tables or something if gimmick was added, Axel could slip away in credible fashion, Langston continues to gun & wins the strap at either Rumble or pre-Rumble on RAW in a match that was more of a "long time coming" opposed as out of the blue and abrupt like we got. Building it to be some form of a program. Apparently the company doesn't like doing such a thing anymore. Hate this short-term booking crap. It's funny how this is actually 100% like the Ezekial Jackson scenario. WWE's booking doesn't learn from past mistakes.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

The Primer said:


> I think skipping on Survivor Series was fine if it would have had a branch of a program there. Say both guys being part of an elimination match. Have a match lined up for TLC, tables or something if gimmick was added, Axel could slip away in credible fashion, Langston continues to gun & wins the strap at either Rumble or pre-Rumble on RAW in a match that was more of a "long time coming" opposed as out of the blue and abrupt like we got. Building it to be some form of a program. Apparently the company doesn't like doing such a thing anymore. Hate this short-term booking crap. It's funny how this is actually 100% like the Ezekial Jackson scenario. WWE's booking doesn't learn from past mistakes.


Yeah, that's a good idea. It's sad that we don't have one big team match at Survivor Series to look forward to this year, Survivor Series as a PPV is meaning less and less each year. It certainly doesn't feel like one of the ''big 4'' anymore. 

It's how the midcard titles have been booked for years, sadly. The current US Champion Dean Ambrose is totally forgettable and I can't remember the last time he defended the belt. I like the Ambrose, but he's a horrible US Champion because WWE have booked him in the top angle for the past few months and because of that Ambrose is not getting proper midcard feuds, and instead he's just getting filler match defenses, and the belt has become so irrelevant it's not even funny.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

ziggler/sandow was fun, did well with what they were given, I Marked/JIZZED when ziggler flair strut :lenny thought I was in heaven for a split second


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

I agree, that past few IC (or both midcard) title wins have little to no reason or story behind them which in turn hurts prestige and the guy holding the belt. 

Whether I agreed with it or not, the last "meaningful" IC title win was when Big Show won it from Cody at Mania...Show stated a reason why he wanted it (to capture something he never held, and by as doing so he would fulfill that an elusive Wrestlemania moment). It just seemed like "oh, there's a reason behind this title match) instead of a randomly thrown together title change. If that makes sense.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

WWE only put it on Dean b/c he's a personality that was & grew to get a lot of exposure. They had no plans for the championship, so that was their out. You can tell the company was only fixated on making the tag team scene mean more than all other aspects within the company. Rollins & Reigns were more than over placeholders, like how Ambrose has been booked to be, & it grew to other challengers in a nice rotating pool. Look at the matches vs Rhodes Dynasty and it says it all. Even without LONG standing build - but strong build, mind you - they made something special occur. If that focus was shifted towards all championship aspects in the company, oof. Things would be popping.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Paramore fan, how many Kofi Kingstons would you push off a cliff before you do the same to MVP?

EDIT: LMFAO, this is how they debut Xavier Woods?

EDIT #2: Xavier Woods just made an R-Truth match enjoyable. He's already on my good side.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

What do I get in place for the tossing off the cliff? Transference needs to be had. Prime Time Players in a stronger role? Ziggler not jobbing? DREW MCINTYRE BACK IN A DECENT NON-COMIC JOBBER POSITION?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

How about Bobby Eaton finding the fountain of youth and showing everyone in wrestling today how it's done? Of course, the thrill of tossing Kofi off a cliff should be enough :lol.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

SOLD.

I want Eaton vs Finlay for WM 30. Scratch want. Make it a need.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Apparently they had a match together. Now to search for it. Chances are probably decent considering that there's a guy uploading rare Saturday Night matches on Youtube. I've been able to catch up on my mid-90s Regal thanks to him. Mid-90s Regal; the best Regal :regal

My wish is for Mark Henry to somehow become immortal. Let him be WHC for twenty years.

EDIT: Make that twenty-thousand years.


----------



## DFUSCMAN (Mar 13, 2010)

This main event should be amazing

:mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

At least there is this.


----------



## Corey (Aug 11, 2006)

Wait, Big E won the IC Title? What happened to the apparent Axel vs. Ziggler feud that was going on?  Poor Ziggles.

Consequences Creed debuted? Nice!

Who's gonna be the 5th guy on Team Rhodes & Usos? Ziggler? Langston? The Rock? Mark Henry? Christian?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

There was no Axel vs Ziggler feud. Dolph won a random match on RAW, he got his championship shot last week & lost. End of it. You know that's how WWE books their stuff within the midcard.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Pacing in this match is off to me


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Jack Evans 187 said:


> Wait, Big E won the IC Title? What happened to the apparent Axel vs. Ziggler feud that was going on?  Poor Ziggles.
> 
> Consequences Creed debuted? Nice!
> 
> Who's gonna be the 5th guy on Team Rhodes & Usos? Ziggler? Langston? The Rock? Mark Henry? Christian?


There was no feud. Ziggler got a win over Axel, Ziggler got a title shot from it and lost the match.

And I've only just seen about that team match being added.. shame it was another last minute decision with no real build, and it's not The Shield + The Wyatts vs Punk/Bryan/Rhodes Brothers/Uso's like most people wanted for Survivor Series, instead we're getting that match on RAW now. fpalm


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

My goodness that main event was awesome. ****3/4*. Gotta go search up all the goodies that occurred during the two commercial breaks.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Saw most of the main event. Dat finishing sequence :mark: Dat return :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm glad Punk & Daneislon vs Wyatt's is getting their match on PPV alone. They don't need anyone else cashing in on the pull they're trying to establish from the two big babyfaces & their effect on solidifying all three of the Wyatt's. Would be a waste to build up their grudge, only to be shoved in with a lot of other folk. Plus, it's awesome to see a straight up tag team grudge match on another PPV. Before this year, you never would have gotten those. Or on the rare occasion if you did, they were filler incarnate. This year has given us various Shield six mans & vs Rhodes Dynasty and now an upcoming big time clash between the two new studs on the block & a union which is getting their proper push into the limelight.

Now WWE could have stuck the rest of the guys in their own elimination match. That is one scenario I don't quite follow.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

Fantastic main event match tonight. The last three minutes of main event was insane, followed with an awesome post-match ending. Awesome job from all involved. ★★★3/4 

PUNK :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

ahh main event was meh, pacing was a tad off just fluctuated too much, crazy finish seemed like a rip off of that rhodes/cena vs/ sandow/real americans raw match a couple weeks ago


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Give it a rewatch and marvel at the greatness of Cody's and Bryan's FIP performances. Gives me flashbacks of classic WCW 1992 tags. :lenny. And then the GOAT getting a masterful pop for a masterful finish. :mark:


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Raw

Sandow/Ziggler- **3/4 (Match was so much better than it had any right being. However, fuck Sandow losing... hell, he didn't even really lose, NEITHER OF HIS SHOULDERS WERE ON THE MAT)
Main Event- ***1/2 (Great match, but far from the best tag match of the year. I think it would've been better though in an elimination tag match at SVS... still can't believe WWE gave it away on free TV. Oh well, my gain, their loss, so it's all good).


----------



## blink_41sum_182 (Apr 9, 2011)

Main was epic tonight. Definitely *** 3/4+. Will have to rewatch later.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

About to watch Eddie Guerrero vs. JBL from Judgement Day 2004. :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

You know RAW was utter shit when the thing that I got the most excitement from was Miz reverting back to being a heel. 

Main event wasn't special. Not at all.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Bah, what a buzzkill. Now review the tag team buried alive match.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That can be arranged.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'll go watch ten Arn Anderson matches in the meantime.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Or ten Arn Anderson promos.






(IF NECESSARY)


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

The Lady Killer said:


> Yeah, I can't really rally behind face Punk, either. He basically acts like everything he claims to hate in his "pipebombs."


And that right there, sir, THAT is Vince's victory. I was saying the same thing in 2011, just few weeks after the "pipebomb", that Punk bending over like that was just another item in Vince's room full of trophies.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

The Primer said:


> I'm glad Punk & Daneislon vs Wyatt's is getting their match on PPV alone. They don't need anyone else cashing in on the pull they're trying to establish from the two big babyfaces & their effect on solidifying all three of the Wyatt's. Would be a waste to build up their grudge, only to be shoved in with a lot of other folk. Plus, it's awesome to see a straight up tag team grudge match on another PPV. Before this year, you never would have gotten those. Or on the rare occasion if you did, they were filler incarnate. This year has given us various Shield six mans & vs Rhodes Dynasty and now an upcoming big time clash between the two new studs on the block & a union which is getting their proper push into the limelight.
> 
> Now WWE could have stuck the rest of the guys in their own elimination match. That is one scenario I don't quite follow.


Punk and Bryan vs Harper and Rowan gets no buys from me. Now there's a match that much more suited to your average RAW episode instead of a PPV. It just doesn't feel big or special enough. And I have a hard time picturing Harper and Rowan winning, especially since they lost to THE USOS of all teams, but with inference from Bray Wyatt I could maybe see them steal a victory, maybe.. The match we got in the RAW main event should of been the match at Survivor Series imo, that match is a much bigger deal and after the great confrontation between The Shield and The Wyatt's last week I thought they would go in that direction. But I guess WWE want to keep the interaction between The Shield and The Wyatt's minimal atm until the Road to WrestleMania time so they can start building properly to The Shield vs The Wyatt's at Mania.



The Sandrone said:


> Raw
> 
> Sandow/Ziggler- **3/4 (Match was so much better than it had any right being. *However, fuck Sandow losing..* hell, he didn't even really lose, NEITHER OF HIS SHOULDERS WERE ON THE MAT)


Don't you say this every week? 

And I'm sick of these Ziggler/Sandow matches. As a big fan of both guys it sucks to see them wrestling pointless matches against each other with no real feud behind it. Both Ziggler and Sandow should have good relevant positions on TV, both should have a match at Survivor Series, but they don't... Hopefully Sandow will get inserted back into the World Title picture after Cena's finished with Del Rio at Survivor Series.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That's why WWE's booking staff are idiots. They have the Usos win a throwaway match on Smackdown/ with Miz interference/ to make it show fans as if they had a chance to win the triple threat from HIAC. Waste of a loss to the Wyatt's when following the PPV the company would push them. But all that aside _(and b/c that's why they beat the Usos clean on Smackdown to negate it + continue to put all three over strong leading into the show)_, the mentality you have is part of the problem with how the booking could be so crummy. Why have that thought in the first place? Every match you see can happen on a PPV or TV. So why should this get snubbed when the company is ACTUALLY trying to make it feel important & worth seeing? These are all the points I & other people make coming to light. No reason to be contradictory. That simply feeds the margin of unpleasant shitheads that grow jaded with the sport. For all the wrong reasons, mind you. This is different compared to the status quo. Which is why it's fun. 

WWE being bland with having matches on PPV only for championships with no reason but so can fall off for a long time. Have matches that mean something with a program forever 100x >. This match is damn near surpassing both major championships in terms of exposure & hype to boot.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Well the match looks like something you would typically see on free TV, whereas an Intercontinental Title match (regardless of WWE's total lack of booking proper midcard title feuds) is something I'd typically expect to see on PPV. Sure Punk and Bryan vs The Wyatt's has got some build, and that's a good thing to try to make this match seem more important than some average match, but I'm just not really invested in it. If they did the 6 on 6 match I would liked that a lot more because more of the wrestlers I like would of been involved, so I would be more invested in it, and it would be a bigger match and a bigger deal with many different teams in it + I've always liked the big team elimination matches at Survivor Series.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm convinced this is the greatest segment in professional wrestling history. At least tied with Regal transforming Eaton into a Blue Blood.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

12 man tag was just okay. Finishing sequence however was :mark:. Looking forward to both tag matches on Sunday.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

All I want is for the Elimination match to come down to Cesaro and Rey. I have tickets for the show and that match would make my dream card (obviously a younger Rey but it still makes it). I don't think anyone is better working against smaller guys than Cesaro. He can take all of there offense and he probably do a lot of what they do as well. I believe before he was signed he wrestled Hero and they were able to go int full lucha mode against each other. Just let it come down to him and Rey, that's all I want from Survior Series.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> I'm convinced this is the greatest segment in professional wrestling history. At least tied with Regal transforming Eaton into a Blue Blood.


I was absolutely gutted when I watched this episode of Raw when it aired and Sky Sports decided not to show this segment. Well, I can pretty much see why...


Undertaker slitting his wrist
Dennis Knight drinking his blood
Undertaker carving the symbol into his chest
Lightning striking the symbol from above
Mideon floating in mid air
Loud chants of 'BULLSHIT!'

BEST. FOR. BUSINESS. 

:russo


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Went to follow Kevin Nash on Twitter and I got the following message: "You have been blocked from following this account at the request of the user."

I DIDN'T WANT TO FOLLOW YOUR BROKEN QUADS ANYWAY


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Srdjan99 said:


> Went to follow Kevin Nash on Twitter and I got the following message: "You have been blocked from following this account at the request of the user."
> 
> I DIDN'T WANT TO FOLLOW YOUR BROKEN QUADS ANYWAY


*Notice the adjective "follow", Kevin Nash ain't on Twitter to be followed. 

On a side note, I used to be spooked the fuck out during those sacrifice segments. I remember the Ryan Shamrock one. Ministry Taker was the man.*


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

What?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Nash probably charges to be 'followed' too. Wonder how much he asked for to do the UK NWO tour. :side:


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Or ten Arn Anderson promos.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Knew that would be Cali's video just by the title :lmao


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

:lmao just watched that Undertaker promo when Jericho interrupts and gets eaten alive. Never seen the bit BEFORE Jericho interrupted. Can't believe what I've been missing. Oh man, if only Undertaker didn't get injured a couple of months later! Think of the GOAT promos we could have gotten? I'm 100% serious too btw. WE NEED MORE OF THAT UNDERTAKER.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

That sacrifice was pretty awesome. Shame that The Ministry was really just Undertaker and his group of jobbers constantly getting humiliated by Austin and gang. Lou Thesz certainly did not picture this when he was selling out arenas in St. Louis in the 50s.






For the two minutes that this went on, I was entertained. :lol at Undertaker using ether and a baseball bat.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

That sacrifice segment :mark:

EXCEPT COLE TALKING THE WHOLE FUCKING TIME. Then Taker's music hits (dat pop as a heel), and Cole's still like "WHO'S THAT?" 

Some things never change.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

What do you guys think about ECW One Night Stand 2006?

I've watched it twice before, and I find it to be a solid PPV. I liked RVD VS Cena for the match itself, and the rest for the crowd. Just because the crowd was so unusually rowdy, what I'm guessing would otherwise be an average PPV becomes something completely different, a PPV that stands out, and is easily identifiable.

I know some of you probably didn't like the crowd, but I viewed it as noticeably _different_, and in a very entertaining way.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I really liked it.

Angle/Orton, Sabu/Rey, RVD/Cena and the brutal tag match were all really fun imo.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

We are of a very small breed. ONS is generally seen as being overrated here and the main event is considered to be a largely awful match. I for one think it is easily the best PPV of 2006 and certainly the best crowd in WWE history.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

ONS 06 is terrible outside of THAT TAG.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

The Lady Killer said:


> I really liked it.
> 
> Angle/Orton, Sabu/Rey, RVD/Cena and the brutal tag match were all really fun imo.





funnyfaces1 said:


> We are of a very small breed. ONS is generally seen as being overrated here and the main event is considered to be a largely awful match. I for one think it is easily the best PPV of 2006 and certainly the best crowd in WWE history.



I agree. The crowd's antics with Cena's shirt were priceless, as were some of the chants throughout the show.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> We are of a very small breed. ONS is generally seen as being overrated here and the main event is considered to be a largely awful match. I for one think it is easily the best PPV of 2006 and certainly the best crowd in WWE history.


Disagree on that one. No Way Out, Judgment Day and No Mercy were all better. (notice a trend there) Also possibly Backlash and WM22.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Skimming this Best of MSG collection. Backlund vs Ken Patera is pretty cool. Matt Striker doing alternate commentary by himself over Harley Race/Backlund is :lmao. Sounds kind of awkward, as it's just him spitting stats out. It's actually really bad because the alternate commentary drowns out the crowd, which is probably pretty hot. Harley Race knee :mark: Shades of the great Triple H :hhh2


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Disagree on that one. *No Way Out, Judgment Day and No Mercy* were all better. (notice a trend there) Also possibly Backlash and WM22.


These three all from 06 deserve so much :clap. Unforgiven was excellent too imo.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Bret/Perfect from Summerslam *****

Amazing match. Terrific heel/babyface work from these guys, and the icing was the commentary team of Monsoon, Heenan, and Piper. Heenan "He hit a man with glasses" :lmao


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Bret/Perfect from Summerslam *****
> 
> Amazing match. Terrific heel/babyface work from these guys, and the icing was the commentary team of Monsoon, Heenan, and Piper. Heenan "He hit a man with glasses" :lmao


(Y) Made all the better by the apparant state of Hennigs' back.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

*Eddie Guerrero vs JBL Judgement Day 2004*

I'm disappointed at the DQ finish, as I would have liked to seen Eddie just not let JBL get the victory no matter what he did. It would have been nice to see Eddie just keep fighting and fighting and fighting with so many near finishes. With JBL ultimately getting the victory. 

Seemed sort of an anticlimax with the DQ finish. 

Other than that. :clap Holy shit. What a fantastic performance by both guys. It was non-stop, action. No momentum killers. Everything was just spot on great. JBL shows just as much aggression toward Eddie as Eddie showed to him. Eddie following JBL out of the ring when JBL would try to get away is just great detail. I hate it when the heel goes out of the ring and the babyface allows him to take their time. Especially at the start of the match. Eddie and JBL told the exact story they were trying to tell in that match. 

The DQ finish felt like we were being built up to this awesome ending, and it never came.

****1/4


----------



## NO! (Dec 19, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Disagree on that one. *No Way Out, Judgment Day and No Mercy* were all better. (notice a trend there) Also possibly Backlash and WM22.


Past the first two matches, Judgment Day 06 is one of the worst pay per views I've seen. No Way Out is the only one on that list that comes close to ONS, imo. I'm not a huge fan of 2006 though.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Ryback/Show from RAW was good. Even really good. Ryback has been on a roll lately with good matches. Hopefully this trend continues.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

NO! said:


> Past the first two matches, Judgment Day 06 is one of the worst pay per views I've seen. No Way Out is the only one on that list that comes close to ONS, imo. I'm not a huge fan of 2006 though.


Disagree. Henry/Angle was way better than expected, Rey/JBL was good and Booker/Lashley was one of their better matches together with a hot crowd. I don't remember Helms/Crazy too well but I think it was an enjoyable vintage cruiserweight match too. Even Jillian/Melina was not the disaster it could've been and Taker sold the shit out of Khali's crappy offense in his best attempt to get a tolerable match out of the giant shit.

Benoit/Finlay alone is better than anything from ONS, though.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> Disagree. Henry/Angle was way better than expected, Rey/JBL was good and Booker/Lashley was one of their better matches together with a hot crowd. I don't remember Helms/Crazy too well but I think it was an enjoyable vintage cruiserweight match too. Even Jillian/Melina was not the disaster it could've been and Taker sold the shit out of Khali's crappy offense in his best attempt to get a tolerable match out of the giant shit.
> 
> Benoit/Finlay alone is better than anything from ONS, though.


*Don't forget Londrick vs. MNM which was a quality tag match (I have it at *** 1/2), C2D. *


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

It was the opener which NO! already referred to.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

2006 was like a mini-Attitude Era type year. DX return, hardcore matches, WWECW at it's peak, live sex celebrations, and a bunch of other chaotic stuff to make for crash TV. I really enjoyed it.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Just picked up The Best PPV Matches of 2009-2010 DVD at FYE for 3 dollars.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

I feel the year 2008 was solid, the best part about it by far the GOAT Jericho-HBK feud. :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

2008 was a good year. There was a point where all three shows were giving us quality television at the same time. Gotta love the star power on RAW in 2008. Jericho, Cena, Batista, Michaels, Mysterio, Punk, JBL, Kane, Orton, and Umaga. Also had the greatest feud in the history of wrestling. Smackdown was kinda dull at times and Undertaker/Edge was not as good as people think it is, but HHH/Hardy was a very well-done long running battle. Loved Jeff's rise to the top even if I'm not a big fan of him.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

I watched The Rock vs. Punk at Royal Rumble 2013. Why are people saying it's horrible? I thought it was entertaining, and it moved much quicker than I expected. I expected for it to be really slow moving or something, with the way people were complaining.

I certainly don't agree with Meltzer's four stars for it, but it was enjoyable enough, IMO.


On a side-note, I'd like to add something to what I said earlier about the Summerslam 2004 DVD:


Spoiler: spoiler



Here's an example from 2004:


> Summerslam DVD Problem - Torch subscriber Mat La Vore writes: Transworld
> Entertainment (the company that owns FYE) sent a letter out today that said:
> "Due to legal issues we cannot sell Summerslam 2004. Please insure that this
> product is not placed out on your sales floor. This is only for the DVD, the
> ...





> Here are the catalog numbers for both 2004 releases of SummerSlam 2004:
> 
> WWE56084 – SummerSlam 2004 (Re-Issue)
> WWE56072 – SummerSlam 2004 (Original Release)
> ...





> Pretty much. Look for WWE56084, not WWE56072. I have the re-issue and the Anthology versions and there was no audio/video issues on both discs.
> 
> The only song that was dubbed over on the Anthology release was 'Sumertime Blues' by Rush.


So people have to look for that re-issue, but that first one is still being sold. I see on recent reviews of Summerslam 2004 on Amazon, people are still saying that they're getting the messed up ones, while others are saying that the one they got has no problem.

In short, at least it's not a case of the WWE being ridiculous and just totally editing out all of that audio.



I actually got the WWE56072 one, and almost didn't even bother to open it. Glad I did, because the audio is fine for me on the Benoit/Orton match. It doesn't cut out at all. Just wanted to note that, in case people get the one with that serial number, and just automatically assume that it's gonna be f'ed up. That's not the case. I guess only certain copies with that serial number were messed up.


I did LOL at them COMPLETELY removing Orton vs. Benoit on the match listing on the back. Couldn't they have at least said "Orton for the title" match or something? No one would even know that match is on there, if they didn't research first. It's absurd. Every other match is listed there.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

SD 08 had Undertaker/Big Show :mark:. Puts it above Raw for that alone . Undertaker/Edge feud was dull but produced great matches outside of TLC.

Edit: My SS 04 is WWE1085. UK version obviously. Did we have 2 versions with one potentially having audio problems?


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Edit: My SS 04 is WWE1085. UK version obviously. Did we have 2 versions with one potentially having audio problems?


Yeah, yours should be good. That's the re-issue. The WWE56072 was the original, and apparently the audio cut out entirely for, like, 13 minutes in the Benoit/Orton match on that one. I had assumed that that was the case for all copies with that serial number, but apparently not. Thankfully.

How was Matt Hardy vs. Kane from that event? Don't spoil anything, please, but just tell me if it's worth a watch.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Can't even remember that match lol. My SS 04 DVD is still in the wrapping .


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> I did LOL at them COMPLETELY removing Orton vs. Benoit on the match listing on the back. Couldn't they have at least said "Orton for the title" match or something? No one would even know that match is on there, if they didn't research first. It's absurd. Every other match is listed there.


Hey, be glad the match was there at least - unedited too! Just to be sure, is it the anthology version that has removed it from the match listing?



LilOlMe said:


> How was Matt Hardy vs. Kane from that event? Don't spoil anything, please, but just tell me if it's worth a watch.


I enjoy that event overall but nothing other than the main event and maybe HHH/Eugene is really must watch. Taker/JBL is solid too but the crowd shits on the match big time.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Matt Hardy v. anyone is pretty much always worth a watch.

EDIT - I have the SummerSlam anthology and all Benoit matches are included.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

:lmao at this thread saying Eddie/Rey WM 21 is one of the best matches ever


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Better than the Angle/Shane street fight getting four star+ ratings.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Better than Atlantis/Villano III or Regal/Windham.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

I just checked my Summerslam 2004 and I have WWE56084

There must be another release of this as there is also a DVD cover floating around that doesn't have Benoit on the cover.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Better than Atlantis/Villano III or Regal/Windham.



You think Jericho/HBK is the best feud ever? Really? That's kinda surprising but to each his own, what is it in particular that draws you too it? 

My favorite feud of all time is Mankind/Undertaker, with Eddie/Rey, Eddie/JBL, and Midnight Express/Rock n Roll Express following closely after.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


> Matt Hardy v. anyone is pretty much always worth a watch.
> 
> EDIT - I have the SummerSlam anthology and all Benoit matches are included.


Thanks for answering!



RichardHagen said:


> I just checked my Summerslam 2004 and I have WWE56084
> 
> There must be another release of this as there is also a DVD cover floating around that doesn't have Benoit on the cover.


I have the serial number that corresponds with the original release (WWE56072), but somehow they did change the artwork on that one. No biggie, as all they did was flip the insert around. The huge Benoit/Orton pic is still there, you just have to open the DVD to see it.




Choke2Death said:


> Hey, be glad the match was there at least - unedited too! Just to be sure, is it the anthology version that has removed it from the match listing?
> 
> 
> 
> I enjoy that event overall but nothing other than the main event and maybe HHH/Eugene is really must watch. Taker/JBL is solid too but the crowd shits on the match big time.


For me, I just bought the Summerslam 2004 by itself for $6, and the Benoit/Orton listing was removed. Everything is there and normal when you play the DVD, though, and like I said, Benoit's picture is there on the inside...they just reversed the insert.

Thanks for answering. LOL, that crowd was weird. They're a Canadian crowd, but popped big for Orton.

Do you know if the Benoit/Orton No Holds Barred 2006 Smackdown match is available anywhere on DVD?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^ where the 2nd hbk review ? 

think I'll watch orton/benoit ss 04

Edit: I dont think its available


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> For me, I just bought the Summerslam 2004 by itself for $6, and the Benoit/Orton listing was removed. Everything is there and normal when you play the DVD, though, and like I said, Benoit's picture is there on the inside...they just reversed the insert.


Which picture is it? Is it the promotional pic or some digital image from the match itself?



> Thanks for answering. LOL, that crowd was weird. They're a Canadian crowd, but popped big for Orton.
> 
> Do you know if the Benoit/Orton No Holds Barred 2006 Smackdown match is available anywhere on DVD?


Yeah, they were pretty strange. I do like how they were for the main event, though. Like a Japanese crowd that concentrates on the match and applauds every great move they make.

Sadly, the NHB is not on any DVDs that I'm aware of.

Since we're on the subject of Benoit vs Orton, thought I'd show you this. A few weeks back you asked about what Orton said to Benoit after RKOing him in their Best of 7 match that ended by DQ. The video you watched I assume is the low quality one available on youtube. I uploaded the full show a week ago and it's in better quality. You seem to be good at it, so you can check it out here to see if you can make out what Orton said:






Match is around 50 minute mark I think.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Everything about Michaels/Jericho clicked. I loved the initial story of how Jericho wanted to be like Shawn Michaels. That side-by-side picture of Rockers Michaels and a young Jericho was really cool. We've heard more people compare a wrestler to Shawn Michaels than anyone else I can think of, but Jericho fit that comparison better than the rest. Outside of Ric Flair, nobody could pull off brash and arrogance with that level of charisma like Shawn and Chris could. Shawn's 1997 and Jericho's 1998 speak for themselves. Jericho's obsession over surpassing his hero was such a well-done storyline that gave us a classic at Wrestlemania and an incredible match on RAW later that year.

What really pushed the feud to GOAT level for me was the 2008 portion. At the time, Jericho's face comeback run was kinda dry and did not give us anything memorable, but the feud with Shawn reinvented Jericho into the best in the business. Their promos together (which they wrote and structured all by themselves) were all really good (Highlight Reel heel turn, Summerslam, Unforgiven contract signing, Shawn Michaels ladder promo). The story of Jericho being angry and jealous at how Shawn was able to get away with all these awful things while Jericho gets vilified for doing the right thing made so much sense. The jealousy was a great way to connect the 2003 feud with the 2004 feud. You could really feel the tension between the two every time they were in each other's presence. All the little things they added to the feud (Lance Cade, Shawn's eye, Unforgiven scramble) helped too. And let's not forget about all the great matches they ad in 2008. I know this explanation is very simple and such, but I would love for someone to find one segment between the two that wasn't spectacular.

Those other feuds you named were all very good, but I never felt that Undertaker/Mankind had the personal aspect that makes a feud truly special. Foley/Rock and Foley/HHH had it, but Foley/Taker didn't. Eddie/Rey is another great rivalry, but the 2005 story between the two kept getting worse and worse to the point where it nearly ruined the entire feud. On top of that, I don't think Rey Mysterio's face performance was as good as Shawn's. Eddie made that feud amazing and his 2005 character work should be taught to every wrestler that ever wants to make it in the business, but I thought Jericho in 2008 was on that same top level as Eddie. Eddie/JBL is another great feud, but it was too short and as much as I love the Judgment Day match, I liked the WM XIX and No Mercy 08 matches better.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> ^^ where the 2nd hbk review ?
> 
> think I'll watch orton/benoit ss 04
> 
> Edit: I dont think its available


I'm getting to it. :hmm: I did respond to you, btw.

Did you ever see it before?

Here it is. Seems to be working for me:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwKlgAtF44k




Choke2Death said:


> Which picture is it? Is it the promotional pic or some digital image from the match itself?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It's the promotional one that was initially used. This one:










Good point about it being like a Japanese crowd. I agree with that.

I remember that vaguely, but don't remember the details behind it. I'm checking it out now, and I'll see if I can tell. (Y)


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The beauty of Orton/Benoit was the feeling that every move mattered in some way. We didn't get our flashy moves or really many moves for that matter, but every move looked like it hurt. That crowd that was in total awe the entire time. It truly is amazing how these two never failed. Then again, it's Benoit. Not only was Benoit probably Orton's best opponent in the ring, but I may even say that Benoit had better chemistry with Orton than with most others in his illustrious career. Certainly more so than the likes of Eddie, Angle, and HHH among others.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Just entered February in Raw 1997, now it's 2 hours long and I'm almost at Final Four. :mark: Heard so much about the fatal four way so it should be great. lol @ Bret's "I've been screwed by Stone Cold Steve Austin" promo, his delivery in that makes me laugh.

I really wanna just get to 98/99, though. Mainly to see THE ROCK because his character from those years really seems to perfect entertainment on a mic.



funnyfaces1 said:


> The beauty of Orton/Benoit was the feeling that every move mattered in some way. We didn't get our flashy moves or really many moves for that matter, but every move looked like it hurt. That crowd that was in total awe the entire time. It truly is amazing how these two never failed. Then again, it's Benoit. Not only was Benoit probably Orton's best opponent in the ring, but I may even say that Benoit had better chemistry with Orton than with most others in his illustrious career. Certainly more so than the likes of Eddie, Angle, and HHH among others.


Yes indeed. Benoit vs Orton was never anything less than great. Only match of theirs that wasn't at least very good is their 6/1/06 match but it was because the match ended too early. Every other match was amazing and they were all worked in different ways. At SummerSlam, it was their high stakes match where they worked it smartly. Raw rematch was Benoit destroying Orton in hopes of getting his title back and Orton trying to prove he's no fluke. Their 2005 matches were both their "go-to" style of hitting moves in a back and forth contest while the last Best of 7 match was purely mat-wrestling and the NHB was more physical than the rest.

And in WWE at least, who did Benoit have chemistry with on the same level as Orton? Him and Rock always worked great, him and Jericho could be great or average and same with HHH.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

There is the one that has the Summerslam Logo on the top half of the case where Orton/Benoit is on the original release, and on the bottom half they have JBL/Taker. I'm on my phone and do not know how to upload pictures, but it came with the tagged classics version of the DVD.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> The beauty of Orton/Benoit was the feeling that every move mattered in some way. We didn't get our flashy moves or really many moves for that matter, but every move looked like it hurt. That crowd that was in total awe the entire time. It truly is amazing how these two never failed. Then again, it's Benoit. Not only was Benoit probably Orton's best opponent in the ring, but I may even say that Benoit had better chemistry with Orton than with most others in his illustrious career. Certainly more so than the likes of Eddie, Angle, and HHH among others.


Great post.



Choke2Death said:


> Just entered February in Raw 1997, now it's 2 hours long and I'm almost at Final Four. :mark: Heard so much about the fatal four way so it should be great. lol @ Bret's "I've been screwed by Stone Cold Steve Austin" promo, his delivery in that makes me laugh.
> 
> I really wanna just get to 98/99, though. Mainly to see THE ROCK because his character from those years really seems to perfect entertainment on a mic.
> NHB was more physical than the rest.


February 3, 1997, correct? I swear that's Edge in the audience toward the left in the front row during that promo. Did you notice? I just looked it up, and that RAW was held in Toronto. It's totally him!!!

Don't you go skippin' Canadian Stampede now, you hear?!




RichardHagen said:


> There is the one that has the Summerslam Logo on the top half of the case where Orton/Benoit is on the original release, and on the bottom half they have JBL/Taker. I'm on my phone and do not know how to upload pictures, but it came with the tagged classics version of the DVD.


Yes, that's exactly what's on the cover of mine (but mine was just Summerslam by itself), however on the inside, it's the initial Taker/JBL and Benoit/Orton pic that I posted above.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> I'm getting to it. :hmm: I did respond to you, btw.
> 
> Did you ever see it before?
> 
> ...


Yea I saw it, those top 5 were off the top of my head, I remember liking that HHH/orton raw match, there is a good hbk/y2j from the same raw as well

Thanks for the link, after GTA I'll watch it


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

*Backlash 2009


Christian vs Jack Swagger *

*

*
Edge Vs John Cena
Last Man Standing*

**1/4


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

*Survivor Series 2005*

Booker T vs Chris Benoit - 1st match in Best of 7 for the US Title - ***1/4*
Melina vs Trish Stratus - Women's Title - ***1/4*
Triple H vs Ric Flair - Last Man Standing - *****1/2*
Kurt Angle vs John Cena - WWE Title - *****
Teddy Long vs Eric Bischoff fpalm 
Team Raw vs Team Smackdown - ****1/2*

I thought the opener was pretty sorry. Never really much cared for Booker T as a heel, and Sharmell has Vickie heat for me. Story was also pretty stupid. Match on Smackdown finished with both guys shoulder's counted down so they decided that a best of FUCKING SEVEN MATCHES was the bets way to find out who the undisputed US champ was. One match couldn't have done the trick?

Melina and Trish started out really poorly and Melina screams way too much, but it actually picked and the last couple minutes were pretty fun. Enjoyed this more than the opener.

Trips/Flair is :mark: all day long. Flair attacking the Helmsley family jewels :lol Trips using the SCREWDRIVER :mark: Flair biting :lol Trips in Last Man Standing matches as a face or heel is pretty awesome, though as a heel he's much better.

Angle/Cena just didn't work for me. I don't like the idea of Angle needing help to win, heel or not. Angle kills all the refs. Cena wins.

Teddy vs Bischoff happened. fpalm

Main event is fine. The thing that really killed was all five of the commentators just bickering the WHOLE FUCKING TIME, including during the entrances. They didn't need five, but Styles, Coach, King, Cole, and Tazz all were involved, and they just argued and argued and argued. It took away a lot from the match, as there were times I nearly turned it off, but powered through.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

RichardHagen said:


> *Backlash 2009
> 
> 
> Christian vs Jack Swagger *
> ...


WHAT? Swagger/Christian is fucking amazing, **** for me. the ME is about that score though. What didn't you like about Swagger/Christian?


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

RichardHagen said:


> *Backlash 2009
> 
> 
> Christian vs Jack Swagger *
> ...


One star? What didn't you like about it? I thought it was a really good match, told a good story with Christian's experience and Swagger's youth and power, and was arguably match of the night.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

RichardHagen said:


> *Backlash 2009
> 
> 
> Christian vs Jack Swagger *
> ...


:kobe5



HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> *Survivor Series 2005*
> 
> Booker T vs Chris Benoit - 1st match in Best of 7 for the US Title - ***1/4*
> Melina vs Trish Stratus - Women's Title - ***1/4*
> ...


We have the same ratings for flair/hhh and team raw vs sd, the LMS is magiacally, truly is I have it a notch over the CAGE


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Since we're on the subject of Benoit vs Orton, thought I'd show you this. A few weeks back you asked about what Orton said to Benoit after RKOing him in their Best of 7 match that ended by DQ. The video you watched I assume is the low quality one available on youtube. I uploaded the full show a week ago and it's in better quality. You seem to be good at it, so you can check it out here to see if you can make out what Orton said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Just watched. Great match still. Unfortunately I still can't make out what Orton is saying. Oh well. Just trash talking, I assume, but I think that the first time I saw it, I assumed he was saying something more real for some reason. Don't know why. Maybe because it seemed in such a low voice.

LOL, Booker T is so over the top.

And lol at Cole.
Cole: "Benoit just *pause* rolled Orton over."
Other guy & Booker T at the same time: "It's called a hammerlock."
Cole: "Thanks."


Did you ever see Orton doing Booker T's dance, by the way? lol:


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

What time in the video is the RKO? I'm curious now. :side:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Yeah1993, did you ever review those Khali matches?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

It's around 57:45.



LilOlMe said:


> Just watched. Great match still. Unfortunately I still can't make out what Orton is saying. Oh well. Just trash talking, I assume, but I think that the first time I saw it, I assumed he was saying something more real for some reason. Don't know why. Maybe because it seemed in such a low voice.
> 
> LOL, Booker T is so over the top.
> 
> ...


Haha yeah, Booker on commentary is gold. Even his wife is hilarious when asking Michael Cole how he got this job. :lol

And yeah, I've seen the spinaroonie video before.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Yeah1993, did you ever review those Khali matches?


Watched/wrote about two matches.



Choke2Death said:


> It's around 57:45.


Didn't get even a single word. :mark:


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

WWE should do more of these film cut shots for matches. 

Just got through watching CM Punk vs Randy Orton at Mania 27 & Rock/Cena I in the film cut versions. Pretty awesome.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Lord Shite said:


> I was absolutely gutted when I watched this episode of Raw when it aired and Sky Sports decided not to show this segment. Well, I can pretty much see why...
> 
> 
> Undertaker slitting his wrist
> ...


I never say it, but I'm willing to bend the knee for this one time only: God bless America for airing it.



Callamus said:


> :lmao just watched that Undertaker promo when Jericho interrupts and gets eaten alive. Never seen the bit BEFORE Jericho interrupted. Can't believe what I've been missing. Oh man, if only Undertaker didn't get injured a couple of months later! Think of the GOAT promos we could have gotten? I'm 100% serious too btw. WE NEED MORE OF THAT UNDERTAKER.


I wished I had a time machine only to solve this problem. MORE.



funnyfaces1 said:


> That sacrifice was pretty awesome. Shame that The Ministry was really just Undertaker and his group of jobbers constantly getting humiliated by Austin and gang. Lou Thesz certainly did not picture this when he was selling out arenas in St. Louis in the 50s.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ministry was mostly just to feed Undertaker as being the biggest bad ass around. So, with the crew not being the BIGGEST force in wrestling, I'm fine with. Acolytes turned out well. It was only really Viscera & Mideon who were the real jobbers.

Big Show in 1999 was the most fluctuating worker ever seen. Was heel & face - TWICE - before the year had finished.



The Lady Killer said:


> Knew that would be Cali's video just by the title :lmao


I was hoping someone would catch on to the fact, lolz.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Watching the *"The Triumph and Tragedy of World Class Championship Wrestling"* DVD, and man is it depressing. 

I'm on the part where they talk about all of the suicides in the Von Erich family. The living brother reminisces about how they used to sign autographs using the turnbuckle as support, and then they would write little messages to each other like "Hi, Chris!", "Hi Kerry!" on the turnbuckles for each other to find. He starts choking up and says he didn't want to even look at turnbuckles anymore after the brothers started dying one by one.

I find it really disgusting that the impending jail time seemed to be a driving factor in why Kerry Von Erich committed suicide. It's just another example of why the so-called "war on drugs" is so counter-intuitive. That jail-time hanging over his head, seemed to depress him just as much as the actual drugs ever could. 

I remember watching a documentary about a city in Europe, which legalized heroin usage (they had had a huge problem with that in that particular city), and also offered doctors distributing it inside their offices. They found that when this happened, the fallout from heroin usage lessened so much more. Basically, the chaos of jail & arrest records destabilizes people and families just as much, if not more, than the actual drugs do. I feel like Kerry is a perfect example of why punishing people for what they do to themselves is so stupid.


The DVD also contains some matches, so I watched:

*Kerry Von Erich vs. Ric Flair - Steel Cage Match, Star Wars of Wrestling, December 25, 1982*. 












A lot of people consider this a classic, and I pretty much agree, as it had high drama, a good crowd, and it kept my attention the whole time. I thought that Flair was pretty great here. He actually came off as sympathetic to me.

This review is great, and I agree with it:



Spoiler: spoiler



Caught somewhere between the seemingly-straightforward focus of early bouts and the non-stop spectacle of today’s WWE, this Christmas day title match for the World Heavyweight Championship from WCCW Star Wars in 1982 has just about everything for the casual and seasoned wrestling viewer alike: big-name fan-favorite competitors, a quick pace despite being a reasonably long match, a smattering of skillfully executed moves and holds, and the set-up for a major ongoing soap-operaesque rivalry. Oh, and don’t forget blood. Ric Flair sure knows how to bleed.

And it’s Flair who will be the real revelation for uninitiated viewers. Following Flair through the crowd into the ring with a minimum of showboating gives the lead-in to the event an oddly intimate feel—Flair doesn’t need to sell himself as a heel at this point, and his quiet poise beneath the crowd heat generates a brewing intensity and a kind of weird sympathy when this initial dignity finally collapses into trademark cartoonish agony beneath the beating that’s waiting for him at the hands of Kerry Von Erich (much to the delight of the screaming teenage girls in the audience).

In fact, it’s this odd duality in Flair that’s perhaps seen him become one of the most revered and longest-running wrestlers in the business.



I also thought that Kerry was fantastic. Those who only know him from the later years of his career would be surprised by his athleticism back then. He really had it all, and I wonder how different things would have been, if he had left his father for Vince's bright lights earlier. The crowd was in orgasmic raptures over him.

The ending took away from it a little for me, as I found it confusing as hell as first. They should have drawn that moment out more, to add more drama to it. The announcers didn't even technically say what the call was. 

**** 1/4.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Always thought that match was dull, but had a great story play out. Ending is good, but about 20 minutes of being bored prior kills any love I could share for it.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I still can't find a video of that match. I saw a couple of their other matches though. The one they had in Hawaii was good, and the 2/3 falls match warrants Lenny smileys from all of us. Their match in Japan sucked. I liked WCCW and I had tons of fun going through their best matches last summer. I do have to say though that the real talent in the family was in Kevin. He reminded me a lot of Matt Hardy for some reason. Matt Hardy on his best days of course.


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

Okay. MOAR wrestling + a site to get it from. 8*D


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Always thought that match was dull, but had a great story play out. Ending is good, but about 20 minutes of being bored prior kills any love I could share for it.


I can see that. It definitely wouldn't be one of my "OmgFAVES!", but I found it sufficiently entertaining enough to capture and keep my attention and to like. I think that it's mainly down to character work. I agree, there wasn't a ton of action (though I still think that it was faster moving than many matches I've seen from that era...I never felt it dragged at any point. and I was kind of dreading watching it, btw, lol. Wasn't in the mood to be bored, so I was pleasantly surprised). I just really liked Flair in this role -- and I'm not a big Flair fan -- and I thought that Kerry was great as the spirited, hometown, matinee idol.

The ending still bothers me. I felt that Flair looked more "out of it" and worn down than Kerry did. I think maybe it had something to do with the camera angles, though. We never did get a close up of Kerry. I still think that the call was made entirely too fast, and the commentators dropped the ball in creating drama in that moment. 

It bugs me when just small changes in execution could make an entire difference in how something is received. Well, obviously it's probably just me.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Hawaii match is usually their go-to match from most, myself included. The others, eh. Kevin & his no shoes was always fun. The high flyer of the bunch. Not a surprise he held strong appeal with me.

Kenny, I think streaming sites might be your best bet these days. Unless XWT isn't being awful for you.


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

is xwt back? :mark:


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

oh yes it is. :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Shooooot, are accounts open still?


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

Yes. Well I just signed up.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

If anybody ever watched Survivor Series 1988 in its entirety, I commend you. I was shocked at how good this show was on rewatch.


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

I might download Summerslam 1996 as I don't think I've watched it before.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Worth it for the double main event alone.

Survivor Series 1998 is quite shitty. All those damn tournament matches.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

ATF said:


> If anybody ever watched Survivor Series 1988 in its entirety, I commend you. I was shocked at how good this show was on rewatch.


The elimination match alone is :mark:



Florent Sinama Pongolle said:


> Yes. Well I just signed up.


Thanks for your goal against Olympiakos


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Survivor Series 1998 sucks after two watches. Only the main event holds up. Man, all four of the big PPVs that year are candidates for most overrated shows in WWE history.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I thought he said 1998, not 1988. :ti


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> Thanks for answering!
> 
> 
> I have the serial number that corresponds with the original release (WWE56072), but somehow they did change the artwork on that one. No biggie, as all they did was flip the insert around. The huge Benoit/Orton pic is still there, you just have to open the DVD to see it.
> ...


Check my sig if you need that match


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Forgot to say this earlier in regards to the first Undertaker vs Big Show match:

ETHER SOAKED SLEEPERHOLD

Undertaker being better than everyone else by this large of a margin in 1999 is beyond unfair. It's criminal.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I hardly remember anything from the 'Ministry era'  Even though i watched most of it, some of the AE is a blur for me.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Biggest highlight of the Attitude Era was Undertaker & the Ministry. No way I could forget all the goodies that came with it.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

There was a whole Ministry Era set on Youtube, but I think it got took down. Wouldn't mind that, from the incarnation until Taker left.

We may need a thread in the Classic section for this


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

i was thinking of getting this 

Matches List: 

The Royal Rumble Match - Royal Rumble 2003.avi 

Team Austin vs Team Bischoff (Survivor Series 2003 Five-on-five Survivor Series elimination match).avi 

Kevin Nash,Shawn Michaels,Booker T vs Triple H,Ric Flair,Chris Jericho - World Heavyweight Championship - Backlash 2003.avi 

Triple H vs Goldberg vs Shawn Michaels vs Randy Orton vs Kevin Nash vs Chris Jericho - World Heavyweight Championship - Elimination Chamber - Summerslam 2003.avi 

Scott Steiner vs Triple H - World Heavyweight Championship - Royal Rumble 2003.avi 

The Rock vs Steve Austin (WrestleMania XIX 2003).avi 

Brock Lesnar vs. Kurt Angle - WWE Championship - Wrestlemania 19.avi 

Triple H vs. Goldberg vs. Kane - World Heavyweight Championship - Armageddon 2003.avi 

Rob Van Dam vs. Randy Orton - WWE Intercontintal Championship - Special Referee Mick Foley - Armageddon 2003.avi 

Kurt Angle vs Brock Lesnar - WWE Championship - Summerslam 2003.avi 

Brock Lesnar vs. The Undertaker - Biker Chain Match - WWE Championship - No Mercy 2003.avi 

Hulk Hogan vs. Vince Mcmahon - Street Fight - Wrestlemania 19.avi 

Shawn Michaels vs Chris Jericho (WrestleMania XIX 2003).avi 

Brock Lesnar vs John Cena - WWE Championship - Backlash 2003.avi 

Kurt Angle vs Chris Benoit (Royal Rumble 2003 WWE Championship).avi 

Triple H vs Kevin Nash - Hell In A Cell - World Heavyweight Championship - Special Guest Referee Mick Foley - Bad Blood 2003.avi 

The Undertaker vs Big Show - No Way Out 2003.avi 

The Rock vs. Hulk Hogan - No Way Out 2003.avi 

Goldberg vs. Triple H - World Heavyweight Championship - Unforgiven 2003.avi 

Brock Lesnar vs Kurt Angle vs Big Show (Vengeance 2003 No Disqualification Triple Threat match, WWE Championship).avi 

John Cena vs Kurt Angle (No Mercy 2003).avi 

John Cena vs. The Undertaker - Vengeance 2003.avi 

Eddie Guerrero vs. Chris Benoit - United States Championship - Vengeance 2003.avi 

Triple H vs. Booker T - World Heavyweight Championship - Wrestlemania 19.avi 

Batista vs. Shawn Michaels - Armageddon 2003.avi 

Goldberg vs The Rock (Backlash 2003).avi 

Randy Orton vs. Shawn Michaels - Unforgiven 2003.avi 

Triple H vs. Scott Steiner - World Heavyweight Championship - No Way Out 2003.avi 

Christian vs. Rob Van Dam vs. Chris Jericho - WWE Intercontinental Championship - Unforgiven 2003.avi 

Brock Lesnar & Chris Benoit vs Team Angle (Kurt Angle, Shelton Benjamin & Charlie Haas) - 3 on 2 Handicap Match - No Way Out 2003.avi 

Kane vs Shane McMahon (Unforgiven 2003 Last Man Standing match).avi 

Team Angle vs. Team Lesnar - Survivor Series Elimination Match - Survivor Series 2003.avi 

Shawn Michaels vs. Ric Flair - Bad Blood 2003.avi 

Brock Lesnar vs The Big Show (Judgment Day 2003 Stretcher match, WWE Championship).avi 

Rey Mysterio & Billy Kidman vs. Shelton Benjamin & Charlie Haas - WWE Tag Team Championships - Vengeance 2003.avi 

Triple H vs. Kevin Nash - Street Fight - World Heavyweight Championship - Insurrextion 2003.avi 

Triple H vs Kevin Nash - World Heavyweight Championship - Judgment Day 2003.avi 

Goldberg vs. Chris Jericho - Bad Blood 2003.avi 

Eddie Guerrero & Tajiri vs. Team Angle - Ladder Match - WWE Tag Team Championships - Judgment Day 2003.avi 

Goldberg vs. Triple H - World Heavyweight Championship - Survivor Series 2003.avi 

Trish Stratus & Lita vs Chris Jericho & Christian - The Battle Of The Sexes - Armageddon 2003.avi 

The Undertaker vs. Big Show & A-Train - Handicap 2 - 1 Match - Wrestlemania 19.avi 

Jeff Hardy vs Chris Jericho (No Way Out 2003).avi 

Rob Van Dam vs Kane - No Holds Barred - Summerslam 2003.avi 

William Regal & Lance Storm vs Kane & Rob Van Dam - World Tag Team Championship - No Way Out 2003.avi 

Kane vs. Shane Mcmahon - Ambulance Match - Survivor Series 2003.avi 

Christian vs. Booker T - WWE Intercontinental Championship - Insurrextion 2003.avi 

The Undertaker vs. Vince Mcmahon - Buried Alive Match - Survivor Series 2003.avi 

Eddie Guerrero vs Big Show - United States Championship - No Mercy 2003.avi 

Mark Henry vs Booker T - Armageddon 2003.avi 

Billy Kidman vs Matt Hardy - Cruiserweight Championship - No Way Out 2003.avi 

Rey Mysterio vs Tajiri - Cruiserweight Championship - No Mercy 2003.avi 

Chris Benoit vs Eddie Guerrero vs Rhino vs Tajiri - WWE United States Championship - Summerslam 2003.avi 

A-Train vs Chris Benoit - No Mercy 2003.avi 

Test vs. Scott Steiner - Unforgiven 2003.avi 

Lance Storm & William Regal vs The Dudley Boyz - World Tag Team Championship - Royal Rumble 2003.avi 

Test vs. Scott Steiner - Special Referee Val Venis - Insurrextion 2003.avi 

Brock Lesnar vs Big Show - Winner Enters The Rumble - Royal Rumble 2003.avi 

Test vs. Scott Steiner - Bad Blood 2003.avi


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

RichardHagen said:


> *Backlash 2009
> 
> 
> Christian vs Jack Swagger *
> ...





smitty915 said:


> WHAT? Swagger/Christian is fucking amazing, **** for me. the ME is about that score though. What didn't you like about Swagger/Christian?





StraightEdgeJesus said:


> One star? What didn't you like about it? I thought it was a really good match, told a good story with Christian's experience and Swagger's youth and power, and was arguably match of the night.





SKINS25 said:


> :kobe5



Wow. I'm really sorry guys. I posted that rating when I was like half asleep trying to stay up to watch the match. I woke up with that on my phone and just clicked post and went to sleep. Let me re watch Christian/Swagger again tonight and i'll rate it again. My bad!

I did watch Edge/Cena *before* Swagger/Christian. That rating I stick with. 

:draper2 :draper2


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Out of curiosity, what matches DO you like, Hagen? Just trying to figure you out lol.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Richard Hagen, what did you think of Punk/Cena?


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*Jeez. Am I the only person who likes that Cena-Edge LMS match? :side:

Yeah, I'm also curious on your tastes, RichardHagen. What are some of your favorites?*


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Out of curiosity, what matches DO you like, Hagen? Just trying to figure you out lol.


Off of the top of my head, the matches which are my all time favorites are as follows

Rock vs Austin - Wrestlmania X-Seven
Rock vs Austin - Wrestlemania XIX
Brock Lesnar vs Kurt Angle - Wrestlamania XIX
Brock Lesnar vs Eddie Guerrero - No Way Out 2004 
Chris Benoit vs Triple H vs Shawn Michaels - Wrestlemania XX
Shawn Michaels vs Triple H Summerslam 2002
Brock Lesnar vs Kurt Angle - Iron Man Match - Smackdown 9/18/2003 
Eddie Guerrero vs JBL - Judgement Day 2004
Chris Benoit vs Chris Jericho - Ladder Match - Royal Rumble 2001 
The Rock vs Triple H - Iron Man Match - Judgement Day 2000
TLC II - Wrestlemania X-Seven
Randy Orton vs Mick Foley - Harcore Match - Backlash 2004
Kurt Angle vs The Undertaker - No Way Out 2006
Randy Orton vs The Undertaker Wrestlemania 21


Now. I haven't ever watched Wrestlemania 25 or 26. But those are coming my way either today or tomorrow. I am expecting Taker/Shawn to be added to this list as well.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

That list was just PPV's really. I have a hard time remembering matches from TV shows. I'll start to do research and make an official Top 50 matches from me in the future. Those above are in no particular order.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

If Taker/Shawn isn't added too then I'll be upset. :side:


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Richard Hagen, what did you think of Punk/Cena?


Forgot all about their MITB match. Add Cena/Punk MITB 2011 to that list.



Clint Eastwood said:


> If Taker/Shawn isn't added too then I'll be upset. :side:


Don't worry. As highly praised as that match is, it should be.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well I'm just more confused now after seeing that list . For the most part you have good taste... then for some reason you shit on some rather superb matches . STOP HAVING OPINIONS!!!


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Lmao.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

I'd say keep the controversial ratings coming, it creates discussion and it pisses off Cal.  Aren't you one of the biggest fans of that Christian/Swagger match from Backlash Cal?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

To be fair almost everything pisses me off in some way. 

Uhhh... I dunno, am I? I know I'm the biggest fan of their Feb 24th ECW match, not sure where I stand compared to other people on Backlash.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Man, looking over Chris Benoits reign as champion in 2004, they were really pushing him. He went over Shawn and HHH *twice*, then lost to 24 year old Randy Orton? It's like they lost all faith in him in the months leading to Summerslam.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Had a little Benoit fix last night

Benoit/Orton summerslam 04 ****1/4
-I really liked this one, loved their NHB and raw 04 so I wasn't shocked. Love the arm work, the finish was kinda weak for tht match though, they just had a gritty, grind it out battle for 20+ mind and then Orton hits the quickest weakest Rko out of no where, had to rewind to see it, great match

Benoit/hhh gold rush raw ***3/4

I also watched a show/Kane that all they did was chain wrestle :ti was good though


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

I remember back in 2004, I had a buddy of mine who was so sure that Shawn was going to join Evolution and screw Benoit out of the title at Wrestlemania and just lay down for Triple H to retain the title.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Callamus said:


> To be fair almost everything pisses me off in some way.
> 
> Uhhh... I dunno, am I? I know I'm the biggest fan of their Feb 24th ECW match, not sure where I stand compared to other people on Backlash.


Oh yeah that's the match, but I always hear big praise from you when it comes to Christian/Swagger matches so you're probably a big fan of their backlash match too. 

Got any more videos coming? I was bored and actually sat through both parts of your DVD/Bluray collection videos. :lol


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*I really liked the Kane/Benoit Bad Blood match. Great David vs. Goliath match up and the finish didn't make Psycho Kane look weak losing to dude who wrestled two matches that night.*


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Nostalgia said:


> Oh yeah that's the match, but I always hear big praise from you when it comes to Christian/Swagger matches so you're probably a big fan of their backlash match too.
> 
> Got any more videos coming? I was bored and actually sat through both parts of your DVD/Bluray collection videos. :lol


New video went online last night, part of my weekly series. Not done any youtube ones since the DVD/Bluray collection one though, not sure what to do next .


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

WWE 2K14 Review? I still haven't got the game yet, not sure I will tbh.

OR top 5 reasons why you hate The Rock. Come on, that video has to be done. :lmao


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I was 100000% sure going into WM 20 that Benoit wasn't going to win. To be fair, I'd kinda checked out of The product for the most part that year (I know, dumb ass me) so it's not like I had an objective opinion. I was caught in that dumb phase as a 16-17 year old where you think it's cooler to do copious amounts of hard drugs with your friends instead of following my life long passion of wrestling. I only watched WM 20 because I realized my all time favorite had the WWE title and one of my other favorites had a shot at winning the WHC.

Now, I've gone back and rewatched almost all of 2004, especially the months leading up to Mania so I can kinda see that Benoit had a better shot than I originally thought. Still though, I'd say if you were to break the odds down at the time, Trips had a 75% chance of winning, Shawn had a 15% chance, and Benoit was around 10%. Once Eddie defeated Angle I was SO sure Trips was gonna retain so the titles would be balanced with a Face and Heel. Seeing Benojt force Triple H of all people to tap clean was one of the top 5 most shocking things I've ever witnessed in wrestling. No matter what happened in his career afterwards, the ending to WM 20 is tied with the ending NWO 2004 and the ending to Raw in 1999 when Foley won the title as the best feel good moments WWE has ever given us.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I have some great ideas for your show's Christmas special CAL!

- Triple H tribute video
- Five reasons The Undertaker isn't that great
- Top 378 Triple H matches in WWE history (all over four stars, of course)
- Tribute to the GOAT cell match; Undertaker Vs Bossman 
- a look ahead to HHH (now in power) rewriting history and proclaiming his rightful spot as the undisputed GOAT.

I'm dying in anticipation :mark:.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

As for some more serious video suggestions, how about reviews of old PPV's (I know you do that on here but it could be even more funny in a video) or videos on thoughts for upcoming PPV's. Those are common things other wrestling fans do on YouTube.



RichardHagen said:


> Man, looking over Chris Benoits reign as champion in 2004, they were really pushing him. He went over Shawn and HHH *twice*, then lost to 24 year old Randy Orton? It's like they lost all faith in him in the months leading to Summerslam.


They put the title on Orton as a way to get the title back on Triple H, because after all the times Triple H lost to Benoit they couldn't do that match up again. I also heard they wanted to make Orton the youngest World Champion, because their previous youngest WWE Champion Brock Lesnar left the company and they weren't happy about that.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well it would be ironic for me to do a bunch of shitty videos as a christmas special considering I hate christmas 8*D.

I WILL be doing a WWE 2K14 review at some point... but not for a while. I've been working on something for a LONG time now (maybe only like, 8 hours of work into it over the last 2 years, so a LONG TIME but not much work actually put into it yet ) that I would have to finish and get done before I got to WWE 2K14.

I will likely have some WWE 2K14 video online soon though. Got a TON of gameplay footage recorded. Currently working on a non wrestling video atm though.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Nostalgia said:


> They put the title on Orton as a way to get the title back on Triple H, because after all the times Triple H lost to Benoit they couldn't do that match up again. I also heard they wanted to make Orton the youngest World Champion, because their previous youngest WWE Champion Brock Lesnar left the company and they weren't happy about that.



I think, and this is just from various interviews I've seen, that Benojt dropping the title to Orton was less about them not being satisfied with Benoit and more about them being all in on Orton. Since pretty much day 1 with Orton Vince had his eye on him and really thought he was the future of the company. Trips even says as much in the Batista documentary. Hunter says that everyone was Gaga over Orton but that he personally thought Batista was way more ready to carry the company and that's why he put him over as strong as he did in 2005. Since 2000 when Trips ascended to the top, I can almost guarantee Trips has never lost 3 times clean to the same opponent on consecutive PPV's, he would have never done it if he didn't like Dave as much as he did. And this goes back to Orton, he was just too young and immature at the time, Dave was already older by the time he joined WWE so he was a lot more secure with himself I guess.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Nostalgia said:


> They put the title on Orton as a way to get the title back on Triple H, because after all the times Triple H lost to Benoit they couldn't do that match up again. I also heard they wanted to make Orton the youngest World Champion, because their previous youngest WWE Champion Brock Lesnar left the company and they weren't happy about that.


Right. It just seems like they lost total faith in Benoit being this powerful underdog force, imo.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> I think, and this is just from various interviews I've seen, that Benojt dropping the title to Orton was less about them not being satisfied with Benoit and more about them being all in on Orton. Since pretty much day 1 with Orton Vince had his eye on him and really thought he was the future of the company. Trips even says as much in the Batista documentary. Hunter says that everyone was Gaga over Orton but that he personally thought Batista was way more ready to carry the company and that's why he put him over as strong as he did in 2005. Since 2000 when Trips ascended to the top, I can almost guarantee Trips has never lost 3 times clean to the same opponent on consecutive PPV's, he would have never done it if he didn't like Dave as much as he did. And this goes back to Orton, he was just too young and immature at the time, Dave was already older by the time he joined WWE so he was a lot more secure with himself I guess.


Yeah, they were clearly really high on Orton but when he couldn't handle his position as World Champion at the time because of the immaturity and backstage stuff they decided to put the title straight back on Triple H. Batista was older but a lot more green at the time he won the World Title than Orton, which is funny.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

TBF unless Benoit defended the belt against HHH he was always pushed aside in favour of HHH VS HBK FEUD OF THE DECADE stuff. Same shit happens these days with Cena. Someone else could be champ but the shows are still usually build around Cena. Back then HHH was THE GUY and whoever was champ didn't matter unless he was involved.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*Basically, half (if not most) of Benoit's title defenses had Triple H involved in some way. 

The title reign was enjoyable, it just didn't seem all that important considering RAW was still the Triple H show. *


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit is the most underutilized guy from talent-to-booking ratio in WWE history. For someone who should have main evented all the time, he got his little "thank you" reign and was stuck in midcard hell as the guy who even jobbers have a bigger chance of getting a World Title shot than him.

With that said, I give them credit for REALLY pushing him when he was champion. Even with HHH/HBK's shitty cell match and Eugene taking the main focus, he was always booked dominantly since making Brock tap out at Survivor Series. Won Royal Rumble at #1, made all of Evolution tap out, made HBK tap out, made Kane tap out, beat HHH in an ironman match and then ended it on a proper note by putting Orton over instead of the inevitable HHH loss everyone got at the time.

It's tragic to compare his booking in 2004 to three years later, though. In 2007, he tapped out to Cena like a jobber, got pinned by THE fucking MIZ, lost to MVP two falls in a row and was always jobbing clean. If there was any justice, the ECW draft would've seen him get proper strong booking again since he faced MVP about ten times and never once made him submit.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

RichardHagen said:


> Right. It just seems like they lost total faith in Benoit being this powerful underdog force, imo.


I don't think it was that really, Benoit's title reign was a ''thank you'' reign from the company for all the years in the business and his dedication, but he was never going to have some really long reign (I was surprised he held the title as long as he did) and he was never going to remain in the World Title picture. His reign was similar to Eddie Guerrero's. Really talented guys, but ultimately career midcarders who got their reign at the top near the end of their careers.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*I always wondered how different things would've been if the Triple H drafted to Smackdown thing actually stuck. 

There probably wouldn't have been a JBL Championship Reign or JBL in general (since Smackdown would've had THE top heel in the company to replace Brock), we would've gotten a good Trips-Eddie feud and the whole Eugene thing might have never happened either, but the title picture on RAW would've been drastically different. We could've gotten a Benoit-HBK Backlash re-match in Canada (where HBK could've been a heel and etc.) 

It's one of those fun "what-if" scenarios to think about. *


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Benoit is the most underutilized guy from talent-to-booking ratio in WWE history. For someone who should have main evented all the time, he got his little "thank you" reign and was stuck in midcard hell as the guy who even jobbers have a bigger chance of getting a World Title shot than him.
> 
> With that said, I give them credit for REALLY pushing him when he was champion. Even with HHH/HBK's shitty cell match and Eugene taking the main focus, he was always booked dominantly since making Brock tap out at Survivor Series. Won Royal Rumble at #1, made all of Evolution tap out, made HBK tap out, made Kane tap out, beat HHH in an ironman match and then ended it on a proper note by putting Orton over instead of the inevitable HHH loss everyone got at the time.
> 
> It's tragic to compare his booking in 2004 to three years later, though. In 2007, he tapped out to Cena like a jobber, got pinned by THE fucking MIZ, lost to MVP two falls in a row and was always jobbing clean. If there was any justice, the ECW draft would've seen him get proper strong booking again since he faced MVP about ten times and never once made him submit.



I can agree with that, the problem is Benoit wasn't "made" by Vince, and if you look back into the history of time, the WWE has NEVER had a guy who made his name elsewhere be "THE GUY" for any stretch of time. Even with Flair in 1992, Hogan was still front and center. It's the same thing today, same thing back in the early 00's, it'll always be that way I'm sure.

I personally think The Undertaker has a good claim to being very underutilized. They used him a lot of times against guys like Kennedy, Heidenreich, Khali, Gonzalez, etc who had no business being in the ring with him. You could make the argument that since 2003 when Stone Cold and the Rock left, Taker has been the most over guy in all of the WWE. Yet he has a fraction of a fraction of the time guys like Triple H, Cena, Orton, Etc. Holding the belt or being the focal point of the show.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Corporate KingOfKings said:


> I have some great ideas for your show's Christmas special CAL!
> 
> - Triple H tribute video
> - Five reasons The Undertaker isn't that great
> ...


I will be upset if at least one of these doesn't happen.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Underutilized? The fucking Undertaker from the moment he returned as the deadman, that ridiculous match with the Dudley's, then feuds with more pointless 'big men'. Yeah he had the odd windfall like against Angle, luckily 2007 came and it started to pick up.

Full respect to him for putting up with shit 10 after having to deal with Gonzales etc.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

rjsbx1 said:


> *I always wondered how different things would've been if the Triple H drafted to Smackdown thing actually stuck.
> 
> There probably wouldn't have been a JBL Championship Reign or JBL in general (since Smackdown would've had THE top heel in the company to replace Brock), we would've gotten a good Trips-Eddie feud and the whole Eugene thing might have never happened either, but the title picture on RAW would've been drastically different. We could've gotten a Benoit-HBK Backlash re-match in Canada (where HBK could've been a heel and etc.)
> 
> It's one of those fun "what-if" scenarios to think about. *


Benoit would have probably faced Jericho for the title at some point and maybe Christian would have gotten a mini-push. It's weird that Jericho and Benoit never clashed at the time because Jericho cut a promo during the summer where he said he wants a title shot but he just never got it until the elimination chamber where he was only in to fill up a place.



Cactus Jack said:


> I can agree with that, the problem is Benoit wasn't "made" by Vince, and if you look back into the history of time, the WWE has NEVER had a guy who made his name elsewhere be "THE GUY" for any stretch of time. Even with Flair in 1992, Hogan was still front and center. It's the same thing today, same thing back in the early 00's, it'll always be that way I'm sure.
> 
> I personally think The Undertaker has a good claim to being very underutilized. They used him a lot of times against guys like Kennedy, Heidenreich, Khali, Gonzalez, etc who had no business being in the ring with him. You could make the argument that since 2003 when Stone Cold and the Rock left, Taker has been the most over guy in all of the WWE. Yet he has a fraction of a fraction of the time guys like Triple H, Cena, Orton, Etc. Holding the belt or being the focal point of the show.


Good point about Benoit coming up elsewhere but it's not really about being "THE GUY". I mean more as a supporting act who is always in the main event where he could've feuded with the likes of Cena, Edge, Taker and Batista for the title and getting another run or two here and there.

Undertaker was definitely wasted for several years but at least, they _did_ start using him properly again after 2007 when he was finally being used as a main event guy in the title picture. He won the title, like, 5 times, didn't he? Same thing with Jericho, he was wasted with no direction after jobbing to HHH in 2002 for the rest of his first run with one final main event shot in the Cena feud. But then he came back, reinvented himself and became used as more than just a midcarder. I mean, yeah, he's been turned into a jobber since 2010 or so but it's probably his own request to job because he wants to show how selfless he is.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Just received NWO 05 in the post. A DAY LATE. Fucking Amazon Prime. Can't even get shit to me on time. MY POST SUCKS (no blank discs yet either... I'm gonna stab someone).

Anyway, this is the first in my WWE PPV 05 collection. Just ordered... the rest that I needed . All around £2.50 each from an Amazon seller. Banging. Was gonna pick up some 04 PPV's too... but fuck me, looking at £10+ for most of those! I got WM 17 original DVD cheaper!

So yeah, once everything actually shows up I'll have the 05 PPV collection in full :mark:.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

What an underrated promo.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Mine might get here today, It's been over a week since it was ordered...


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Just received NWO 05 in the post. A DAY LATE. Fucking Amazon Prime. Can't even get shit to me on time. MY POST SUCKS (no blank discs yet either... I'm gonna stab someone).
> 
> Anyway, this is the first in my WWE PPV 05 collection. Just ordered... the rest that I needed . All around £2.50 each from an Amazon seller. Banging. Was gonna pick up some 04 PPV's too... but fuck me, looking at £10+ for most of those! I got WM 17 original DVD cheaper!
> 
> So yeah, once everything actually shows up I'll have the 05 PPV collection in full :mark:.


I love Amazon prime. The store FYE here in the states has WWE DVD's for cheap like Amazon sellers usually do. I can pick up most PPV's for under 6 bucks. But for some reason they overprice Wrestlemanias. 

I have been lucky with ebay when it comes to PPV's as well. Found Wrestlemania 25 and 26, both 3 disc sets, for 9 bucks shipped.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Most underutilized for me is Christian. A guy who was very good in the ring (not as good as Benoit, but still very good) and very good the mic (unlike Benoit) but yet has always been booked badly. In 2005 when he was at he's hottest, they didn't push him, in 2009 when he returned to the company after 4 years he was regulated to ECW and Todd Grisham gave him the awful ''_It's Christian_'' return. And he only ever won the World Title because of Edge's career ending, and he had two of worst booked World Title reigns in history where he never had one successful title defense and always looked weak and a fluke Champion. Benoit at least got a few good months as Champion and he looked credible throughout it, Christian didn't even get that. 



Callamus said:


> Just received NWO 05 in the post. A DAY LATE. Fucking Amazon Prime. Can't even get shit to me on time. MY POST SUCKS (no blank discs yet either... I'm gonna stab someone).
> 
> Anyway, this is the first in my WWE PPV 05 collection. Just ordered... the rest that I needed . All around £2.50 each from an Amazon seller. Banging. Was gonna pick up some 04 PPV's too... but fuck me, looking at £10+ for most of those! I got WM 17 original DVD cheaper!
> 
> So yeah, once everything actually shows up I'll have the 05 PPV collection in full :mark:.


Review of Big Show/JBL barbed wire steel cage match plz.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Christian's problem was that he didn't fuck about with someone else's girlfriend. Because that is the ONLY thing Edge had over Christian imo. Christian is better in ring, better on the mic, a MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH better babyface and better heel too. Christian deserved Edge's run far more than Edge ever did.

Drew McIntyre is currently positioning himself as one of the most underutalised guys on the roster. And that makes me eternally sad .


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Christian is better in-ring than Edge but I disagree on the mic. While Christian is great at his best, Edge is extremely underrated on the stick I think. The passion and his fluent talking abilities often go unnoticed by most. He could and still can work the mic with the best of them, that's not to put Christian down in any way, I just think Edge is top 10-15.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I liked Edge on the mic for the most part, but eh, like his ring work and shit, around 06 I just stopped caring about anything he did.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Edge has a better look and more star presence than Christian. Christian's better in the ring and a better babyface for sure. Not sure on best heel or best on the mic, both were very great. The problem is since returning in 2009 Christian never gets any time to show off his great mic skills anymore, in 2004/2005 he was gold on the stick.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Christian>Edge in-ring and as a babyface. Edge>Christian at everything else. Christian deserved a much stronger push/run, but not instead of Edge.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Watched Summerslam 2002 over the weekend and forgot to post my ratings. 

*Summerslam 2002*​
Rey Mysterio vs Kurt Angle
****1/2*
Ric Flair vs Chris Jericho 
*1/2*
Edge vs Eddie Guerrero 
****1/4*
The Un-Americans (Lance Storm and Christian) vs. Booker T and Goldust 
***1/4*
Chris Benoit vs. Rob Van Dam 
****7/8* (can't justify a 4, sorry)
The Undertaker vs Test 
***1/2*
Shawn Michaels vs Triple H (one of my all time favorite, top 5.)
******* :clap
The Rock vs Brock Lesnar 
******

This has to be one of the most stacked PPV's of all time, if not the most stacked. Such great action all around. It's a shame that Jericho/Flair did not deliver, but I guess there always has to be a downside. 

Hopefully these ratings fit with you guys more than my Summerslam 2005 one.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit/RVD gets near 4 at least, so it's all good. (Y)


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

You just made a powerful enemy (me) and friend (Seabs) all at the same time with that post Hagen.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

RichardHagen said:


> Watched Summerslam 2002 over the weekend and forgot to post my ratings.
> 
> *Summerslam 2002*​
> Rey Mysterio vs Kurt Angle
> ...



Haha you did go higher but in my opinion you both over and underrated the matches. Summerslam 2002 is one of my favorite PPV's ever.

Angle vs Rey ****1/2 (second best opening match ever behind only Bret/Owen)
Flair vs Jericho **
Edge vs Eddie ***1/4
Un-Americans vs BookDust **** (one of my personal fave tag matches)
Benoit vs Van Dam ****
Taker vs Test **3/4
HBK vs Triple H ***3/4
Rock vs Lesnar ****1/4

Scratch that, Summerslam 2002 gets my vote as best PPV ever. Summerslam 2001, 2005, 2013, and WrestleMania 19 and 17, and 21 would come in some order afterwards.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

You sure you like wrestling Hagen


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Lmao are you guys being sarcastic. do you hate me now  cal. why do you hate me


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Ooooo just noticed the 50 years of WWE thingy has been uploaded as a Bluray rip already. Caught me off guard as lately releases have been slow as shit, especially BRR. In fact I still don't think the Mid-South set was ever uploaded as a BRR. Fuck DVD rip, I like my better quality and BR extras!


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Alright. Give me another chance. Someone name a PPV who everyone has a pretty much the same views on, let me watch it and rate them, and if they I fuck up, I will retire from this thread early on in my career.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

RichardHagen said:


> Alright. Give me another chance. Someone name a PPV who everyone has a pretty much the same views on, let me watch it and rate them, and if they I fuck up, I will retire from this thread early on in my career.



Lol dude you aren't fucking up everyone has their own opinion. If you think something is shit, then by all means express it. Just make sure you do it in a way that isn't trolling and has a good opinion to back it up.

Also, maybe if you wrote a few sentences or a paragraph about your thoughts on each match instead of just throwing out stars you can help us understand your opinion.

Try Extreme Rules 2012. Fantastic event.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Just watched the beginning of FL 2000 before I'm off to school.. Pretty good and I got a good reward after school


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

SaviorBeeRad™ said:


> Just watched the beginning of FL 2000 before I'm off to school.. Pretty good and I got a good reward after school



Possibly one of the best Attitude Era PPVs. Benoit/Rocky is a ****1/2 classic and Jericho/Trips gets ****1/2 from me as well, love them both to death. Backlash from the same year is also superb if I recall correctly.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

FL 00 is :mark:. 2nd best PPV of 00 and currently 5th best PPV ever based on what I've been watching for my RAMBLINGS. Which I'm sure I'll get back to. One day. Soon. Honest.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

The Sandrone said:


> Christian deserved a much stronger push/run, but not instead of Edge.


Definitely. Both are great. 

And the gif you have in your sig RichardHagen is hilarious. The Ric Flair strut and the Jeff Jarrett guitar shot from Ziggler. :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^^ it was jarrett sturt not naitch's, somebody told me that, Hagen you took my future sig , no worries as ABH has created me a :mark: one

:edit shit how do I insert a gif ?


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

I've heard that too on his DVD I think, but it's most associated with Flair so...


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

I'm not sure if this belongs in this thread, but I just saw KC's Timeline History of WWE 1977 with Graham. It was two hours of Sean Oliver geeking out and Graham burying Backlund.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Superstar was just jealous that Backlund got a near 6 year reign and he got pushed aside lol.


----------



## Cactus (Jul 28, 2011)

Watched Raw for the first time in a while. Really good episode actually. 

- Orton looked like a total boss destroying Maddox. The man's presence is off-the-charts.

- Show/Ryback was decent when watched at 1.5x speed. It was better than it had any right to be. 

- I was looking forward to that gimmick match Sandow and Ziggler after seeing the GIF of the guitar shot somewhere around here. The match reminded me off an Attitude Era Hardcore match. It goes on for a bit too long, it's rough around the edges and it's fundamentally flawed, but it's still a whole lot of fun. 

- The main event was awesome and I won't go too into detail as everything has already been said about it. The finisher-fest at the end of the match was mark-out worthy and it couldn't off been any better. Everything flowed perfectly and didn't look a tad awkward. **** match.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Just watched Raw - I thought the main event was really boring up until the last two minutes. Granted, the last two minutes were great but 15 minutes of complete and utter staleness beforehand render the great two minutes pointless.

edit: lol @ mine and Cactus' contrasting opinions.


----------



## Cactus (Jul 28, 2011)

lol exactly the same time too

I can see what you mean about it taking a while to get going, but it didn't effect my enjoyment personally.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

RichardHagen said:


> Alright. Give me another chance. Someone name a PPV who everyone has a pretty much the same views on, let me watch it and rate them, and if they I fuck up, I will retire from this thread early on in my career.


The thread would start to be a mindless circle jerk if everyone simply agreed with each other (wait, start?iper)

There's nothing at all wrong with a differing opinion - it's just your rating/appreciation of a match. If you can justify your views then that's all that matters. I remember one of my first posts in this thread was arguing with Callamus (merely using an example here, not picking on ya) over what I felt was him overrating 'Taker/Lesnar and the use of a broken hand by 'Taker being moronic. I might not necessarily agree with his counterpoints, but by stating why he enjoyed the match I could appreciate where he was coming from. Same goes for HayleySabin/Primer. He and I differ excessively on certain points/wrestlers, but I still appreciate his tastes. He has his likes/expectations in wrestling and I have mine. Shouldn't negate our abilities to discuss wrestling or maintain civility.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I agree w/Rah, obviously.

Rate a match however you'd like. Clearly there are like 5 different ways to rate a match in this thread, and not everyone is going to like/dislike the same stuff. Don't review PPVs for others' approval - do it to ignite discussion.


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

Was Raw good last night? I saw half hour somewhere in the middle of the show and got bored so I went to sleep.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

*Extreme Rules 2012​*
*Kane vs Randy Orton – Falls Count Anywhere*

Kane very aggressive, Match is outside of the ring from the get-go. Near finishes are presented early outside of the ring. Kane very aggressive and is the first one to introduce weapons into the match. The match going into the crowd tells the good story of falls count anywhere, Randy showing no mercy with knees to the head of Kane. Randy is very good at showing emotion and telling the story in whatever match he is in. I like matches like this in where they go into the crowd and don’t come right back to the ring. A fair amount of this match is fought on the outside and I admire that. Only because we see matches in the ring 52 weeks of the year. Let this one Sunday (extreme rules) be something different. With them going backstage is the same deal. Lets us see the backstage area, which is intriguing to some fans. LOL at Zach Ryder attacking Kane. Kane being slow is kind of affecting the momentum of the match. Orton swinging a steel chair at Kane is very entertaining. I don’t like WWE’s recent way of zooming in the camera to make the chair shots seem more aggressive than they are, gives me motion sickness. I am very happy with the fact that there hasn’t been a near finish on the inside of the ring at all during this match yet. That tells the story of falls count anywhere very well. Kane going for the tombstone but not successfully hitting it is kind of disappointing. Randy Orton countering the tombstone into the finishing RKO was epic. 

*
Winner: Randy Orton
Rating: ****1/2*


*Brodus Clay vs Dolph Ziggler*

The Chicago crowd is strongly being Dolph Ziggler. Jack Swagger assisting on the outside of the ring is just overdone to me. It’s a momentum killer when the referee is at an 8 count and he “barely makes it in” Vickie and Swagger on the outside is just annoying. I hate heel valets. I don’t like matches like this where it’s “that fat guy” versus a smaller more athletic dude. It’s like Ziggler is so limited in his offense and defense against someone of Brodus Clays size. Him not being able to suplex Brodus just made Ziggler look weak and that shit doesn’t make a good match, imo. Brodus Clay getting the victory is meh to me. Ziggler is wonderful at selling and like I said, not a fan of a “fat” guy against an athletic guy like Ziggler. Not saying clay isn’t athletic, just using it as a point of reference. 

*Winner: Brodus Clay
*3/4*


* Big Show vs. Cody Rhodes – Intercontinental Championship Table Match*

This match is different to me when it comes to size comparison. Big Show looks bigger than he does fat. And we all know that Big Show is semi-entertaining in this match. I don’t remember much from their Wrestlemania match, so I am looking forward to this. It seems pretty obvious before the match like “how in the hell is Cody Rhodes going to get Big Show through a table?” Maybe that’s the magic of it. What a terrible finish. Big Show put this foot through the table on accident so that justifies a rightful title win? *fat noise* 1/2 I was expecting much more from Cody Rhodes in this match. I was really hoping for a great come from behind underdog win.

*Winner: Cody Rhodes
Rating: *1/2*


*Daniel Bryan vs Sheamus – World Heavyweight Championship – Two out of Three falls*

The power of Sheamus versus the wrestler Daniel Bryan, before we get into this, anything Sheamus does is bore fucking city to me. I can’t stand him in the ring and I can’t put my tongue on it. Some people may not like the first fall by DQ but to me it made Daniel Bryan look liked a crazed madmen who just wanted to get some leverage on Sheamus in the early going of this 2 out of 3 falls match. Lose the battle to win the war type deal for Daniel Bryan. They tried to make this seem like such a grueling match by bringing in the ring doctor. I don’t like it when 2 out of 3 falls match defies all sorts of WWE logic when a regular World Heavyweight Championship match will run 25 minutes, but we are supposed to believe that Daniel Bryan and Sheamus, two of the high horse WWE up and comers at the time, complete 3 falls during the same amount of time? Two non-clean finishes, the DQ and the “pass out” made this not all that it could have been. I really hoped for Bryan to regain the title but since Sheamus is so far up Vince’s and Triple H’s ass, it’s really rough for me because I am the farthest thing from a fan of him. It was a good match, and Sheamus is a work horse. I just... I really have no clue. Without trying to be bias, and taking in count that two of the falls were DQ and “pass out” and along with the fact of what I stated about a 25 minute match, I’ll give this match the rating below.

*Winner: Sheamus
***3/4*


*Handicap Match with Ryback – DUD*

That shitty ass promo the two nobodies did before the match was annoying. At the time, the match was great because of how mysterious Ryback was. But knowing Ryback went to shit, kind of all around dud.
Squash shit for Ryback when they were building him up as this unstoppable force. See how far that got him. Love Face Ryback though! FEED ME MORE!

*Winner: Ryback
Rating: DUD*


*Chicago Street Fight – Chris Jericho vs CM Punk – WWE Championship*

I hope to god this match delivers. Jericho plays an amazing character. CM Punk plays a great face with this match being in Chicago and everybody hating Chris Jericho as much as they do in this storyline. CM Punk is telling a great story off of the bat with his aggressiveness toward Jericho. I hope this match stays out of the ring as much as Kane/Orton did earlier on in the night. A street fight should be one of the most aggressive matches they have. CM Punk and Jericho both coming dressed in Jeans tells a good story, but only if utilize it outside of the ring or with enough foreign objects. Jericho running outside the ring, forcing Punk to chase him, then running back into the ring hoping to lead Punk into a trap is great, made Jericho look like a total idiot in front of this Chicago crowd, great storytelling. Jericho hiding behind the referee is also very good character portraying on his part as well. There is a good weapon to outside of the ring to inside of the ring ratio as of right now. They are being very balanced and both guys are showing off their skills well. Not as much outside action as I’d personally like to see in a “street fight” but acceptable. Seeing CM Punks “mom” at ringside makes me wonder if that is actually his mom, since that story came out earlier this year about him not having a relationship with her at all. Hence the restraining order that Punk took against her. Jericho attempting to hit Punks sister was fucking gold. Jericho is so good at what he does. Punk then loses his fucking mind. Awesome. This is great. Punk attempting the pile driver made my heart stop; I would have marked all over the place. This match is bringing out the “Holy shit, CM Punk has to destroy this douchebag” feeling inside. They both did a great job of storytelling
(As some of you may notice, I concentrate a lot on how I rate matches by the story that’s being told during the match. This is very important to me.)
Punk botched the springboard from the rope but Jericho covered it up nicely by getting on the attack with the kendo stick quickly. Jericho screaming about Punks sister is gold, Only fueling the fire within Punk. Jericho has completely killed the hometown advantage for Punk by being in control in this portion of the match. Jericho poured “beer” all over Punk, but that totally looked like a can of A&W root beer. Lol. Punk getting momentum back is starting that “come on punk you can do this don’t let this asshole get away with this” feeling inside. 
LMAO just noticing the “OH MAH GOODNESS” sign in the crowd. Hilarious.
A couple of obvious spots calling made me feel stupid for being this emotionally involved in this match. Lol. The referee not getting Jericho to break the hold after Punk reached the rope was a “holy shit I forgot this was a street fight” moment. I marked for the fire extinguisher. The elbow from the tope rope through the announce table made up for this match mostly staying in the ring. Oh mah goodness! That was fantastic. Michael Cole kept saying “EBLOW THROUGH DA GUT! EBLOW THROUGH DA GUT! ” Hilarious. COVER HIS ASS! The exchange of finishers in the ring was great, Especially the coder breaker against the steel chair. GTS for the victory!

I had my mind made up that I was not going to give this match a 5 star rating because there wasn’t as much action outside of the ring that I, personally, would have liked for a street fight, but the appearance from the GOAT fire extinguisher, and the Spanish announce table taking a fall. I now confidently give that match 5 stars. EMOTIONAL ROLLER COASTER. Great match!!! I am a huge fan of this rivalry and the story behind it. Jericho and Punk told the story perfectly. I don’t think they could have done anything better.

*Winner: CM Punk
Rating: ******


I am about to leave and will do Brock Lesnar vs John Cena tonight! Great PPV!


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

Kane V Orton is a ****1/2 all time classic?

Fair enough.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

^^ ****1/2 for Kane/Orton and ***** for Jericho/Punk? You really overrate this 2. I have the Orton/Kane match at ***1/2 and Jericho/Punk at ****1/4. Oh and ****1/2 for Sheamus/Bryan, awesome match.

Anyway, Survivour Series 2009:

Team Miz vs Team Morrison- ***1/4
Rey Mysterio vs Batista- ***- great storytelling here
Team Orton vs Team Kingston- ***3/4
Taker vs Jericho vs Show- **3/4
Team Mickie vs Team McCool-*
John Cena vs HHH vs HBK- ***3/4


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I love the opener but I would definitely switch the rating for that one with the rating for Sheamus/Bryan.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Sheamus/Bryan ****1/2
Punk/Jericho ***3/4 - ****
Kane/Orton ***1/2
Lesnar/Cena *****

From memory.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

I think you guys are underrating Orton/Kane and Jericho/Punk


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Sheamus/Bryan ****1/4
Punk/Jericho ***1/2
Kane/Orton **
Lesnar/Cena ****3/4


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Be your self Kid, no need to have the same ratings as most of us, you think orton/kane er is a *****1/2 classic go right ahead :draper2


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> Sheamus/Bryan ****1/2
> Punk/Jericho ***3/4 - ****
> Kane/Orton ***1/2
> Lesnar/Cena *****
> ...


Same here  Although id maybe put Y2J/Punk at ****1/4, although the whole event deserves a rewatch.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

According to Amazon my set should be here today! Final Call, Yay or nay on rambles in chronological order?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I should rewatch extreme rules 12 again as well soon, had cena/lesnar clocked in a *****, forgot fella/dbryan and I thought punk/y2j was ok, but it just dragged way to much

Currently amidst a Benoit fix so I hope on that as the night grows old


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Kind of hated Punk/Jericho. Went so long and dragged so far and used so many weapons I don't give an ass about. Won't ever watch the match again unless I do a WWE in 2012 list. Kane/Orton I didn't really like either. Not big on sports entertain-y arena brawling, especially when it's done my two wrestlers who have such a mediocre and sports entertain-y way of working.


They're better than the Angle/Shane McMahon street fight that often gets ****1/2+ which is my least favourite match ever, though, so the high ratings can't bother me. (NO I'M NOT PLANNING TO TALK ABOUT THE MATCH AGAIN - I'M JUST SAYING I'M USED TO PEOPLE LIKING WHAT I MIGHT CONSIDER THE WORST OF THE WORST AND VICE VERSA AND AM NOT GOING TO HAVE A PROBLEM WITH IT)


Same opinions are pretty boring. When same opinions show up in here it results in a six page talk about HHH four times a week. Used to be once weekly but then he became a heel again and injected himself into the latest hot angle (shock). (NO I'M NOT PLANNING TO TALK ABOUT HHH AGAIN - I'M JUST SAYING HE SHOULD PROBABLY GO AWAY AT THIS POINT B/C I MIGHT HAVE A PROBLEM WITH HIM)


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

YES! The 2005 PPV set is here! NYR is starting now!


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Extreme Rules 2012 Ratings:

Kane-Orton ***1/2*
Clay-Ziggler **1/2*
Rhodes-Show *** *(Although, Booker and Lawler saying how Show's foot going THROUGH a table doesn't count was :lmao :lmao)
Sheamus-Bryan- ******
Ryback Squash- *N/A*
Punk-Jericho- *****
Cena-Brock ******


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Extreme Rules 2012. <3 <3 <3 

Seriously April 2012 was so bad ass for WWE PPVS. Two awesome back to back events in Mania 28 andER 2012.

Oh and BORK. 

Can't go wrong with that.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

I'm sticking with it. I think Kane/Orton is from Extreme Rules is way underrated and overlooked. I mean, this was my first time watching the event and I may have got caught up in the action, but thinking it over again, I'm sticking to it. It was a great match. 

Same with Punk/Jericho. I felt the match was fantastic. The story telling was so good.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

rjsbx1 said:


> Extreme Rules 2012 Ratings:
> 
> Kane-Orton ***1/2*
> Clay-Ziggler **1/2*
> ...


Make Sheamus/Bryan ***1/2 and that's about how I saw this PPV. Really overrated, I find.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Extreme Rules 2012 is near perfection.

Orton/Kane: ***3/4
Bryan/Sheamus: ****1/2
Punk/Jericho: ****1/2
Cena/Lesnar: ****1/2

Honestly, all three big matches on this PPV felt bigger than a lot of Wrestlemania main events. Glad to see the opener getting love too.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Extreme Rules 2012 is near perfection.
> 
> Orton/Kane: ***3/4
> Bryan/Sheamus: ****1/2
> ...


Remove one and a quarter from Punk/Jericho and add a quarter to Cena/BROCK and that's how I'd rate the "big four".


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Just got done watching the History of WWE documentary. When we found out it was only 2 hours instead of 3, I know I was a little disappointed as where many others, but honestly I don't think it really NEEDED to be any longer. For starters it feels like I've been watching it for 3 hours lol (in a good way), but I can't pin point anything they really skipped... except for the "Ruthless Aggression" era as they kinda go "oh hey we did a brand split, and then we went PG!" . And even then it's not like they could have talked about it much anyway. They bring up Cena and Batista, who were the 2 main stars for that time, and this was a history of the WWE as a company not just "LETS GO INTO TEH DETALZ OF AVERI EIRA", so I was cool with it. Far, far better than the recent disappointment we got with that HHH DVD. Shame the match listing for this blows too, otherwise it really would be a must own set. Ah well. In a bunch of years I'll get the Bluray if it's ever cheap . Which reminds me, need to do my weekly "FUCK YOU FREMANTLE" rant. Cunts that they are!!!


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

ER 2012:

Kane/Orton: ***1/4
Sheamus/Bryan: ****1/4
Jericho/Punk: ****1/4
Lesnar/Cena: ***3/4


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> ER 2012:
> 
> Kane/Orton: ***1/4
> Sheamus/Bryan: ****1/4
> ...


 

Did you forget a star? Thought that one was almost unanimous.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

The Lady Killer said:


> Did you forget a star? Thought that one was almost unanimous.


I thought Cena/Lesnar was only above average, personally. I've never seen the appeal of it. The ending is its own separate debacle. 

The entire PPV is overrated, honestly. All time classic my ass.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

KO Bossy said:


> I thought Cena/Lesnar was only above average, personally. I've never seen the appeal of it. The ending is its own separate debacle.
> 
> The entire PPV is overrated, honestly. All time classic my ass.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Care to shed some light on Cena/Lesnar? I'm actually curious as to why those who felt it was only average feel that way. I don't necessarily agree with the finish, either, but it wasn't enough to ruin the match for me.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

5*'s if not for the outcome so just a lowly *****3/4* from me. One of the most unique matches to take place in a WWE ring. It didn't even feel like a wrestling match tbh. I guess it must be time for the weekly Cena/Lesnar discussion.

:brock


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Lol, just realised I didn't order ECW ONS 05 earlier when I bought all the remaining 05 PPV's I needed. Added it to my Amazon Wishlist instead since Christmas is coming up . CBA paying for it myself since it's like triple the price of any other 05 PPV I bought today (used... new is stupidly high priced!), and considering the show sucks balls I don't wanna fork out too much for it .


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cena vs BORK is a thing of beauty but it's been said enough times by now.

I really wanna rewatch Orton vs Benoit rematch on Raw but I'd rather save it until CAL can come through with the better quality version that he claims to have, any updates from KillaCal? 

Until then, I'm just gonna check out some other stuff like this Rock/Benoit match before SummerSlam 2002 and Eddie/Rey from June just for a refresher.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

I bought WrestleMania 29 DVD today just for the hell of it, mostly for the Hall of Fame + Taker/Punk match.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

I wish I could watch a match. Just taking a quick break from this stupid coursework. I can't wait until Friday when I can hand it in and be done with it...before I move on to the next one .


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Got my Raw 04 discs out now!!! I'll get started on Orton/Benoit tonight and get the rest done 2morrow .


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> Care to shed some light on Cena/Lesnar? I'm actually curious as to why those who felt it was only average feel that way. I don't necessarily agree with the finish, either, but it wasn't enough to ruin the match for me.


I think it's because Lesnar was literally destroying him and then Cena suddenly "came back" and won.

I disagree with those people, though.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

smitty915 said:


>


Sorry 



The Lady Killer said:


> Care to shed some light on Cena/Lesnar? I'm actually curious as to why those who felt it was only average feel that way. I don't necessarily agree with the finish, either, but it wasn't enough to ruin the match for me.


I fully recognize that why people like the match is due to the MMA influence and the legitimacy that comes with it (like Cena being busted open hard way on purpose). For me, that's just not my cup of tea. I generally don't like matches that are basically fake UFC. Its the same reason I wasn't a big fan of the Lion's Den matches they tried in 1998 and 1999. I think there's really only a couple matches ever where I did enjoy it. Like Nakamura vs Sakuraba from Wrestlekingdom 7. That was a wicked match. Why? Because it took place between actual MMA fighters who had the ability to combine pro wrestling in with a real MMA match.

Brock/Cena was a legit MMA fighter against a WWE pro wrestler (aka not a real fighter). The entire match was just Cena getting beaten up. Then Cena hits a chain shot and AA on steps to win.

I'm not even going to bring up the idiocy that Brock lost his first match to begin with. Let's just take this as a match itself.

Basically, Cena was getting squashed all match. He barely had any offense. I get that the story was supposed to be this legit UFC machine was steamrolling through him, but I didn't see a need for it to go 20+ minutes to tell that story. If they really wanted to get Brock over, they'd have had him murder Cena in like...5 minutes.

Second, for a supposedly legit match, there was a lot of WWE style plunder...combine that with Brock mounting Cena and doing all these MMA holds and whatnot, and it kind of looked silly. There are steps and chains and shit, but Brock is trying to get top position? Why? It struck me as sort of lame. Imagine if in a match being billed like this taking place in UFC, and suddenly Cain Velasquez runs out of his corner with a Kendo stick and starts wailing on Junior Dos Santos. Then he stops pounding him into submission with a WEAPON, does a take down and attempts a rear naked choke. 

Then there's the whole booking of the match. To me, it was no better than Miz/Cena I Quit, which is panned universally by this forum. The formula is the same-heel beats down on Cena for 20 minutes, Cena pops up, hits a move or two and wins out of nowhere. Its ridiculous and bad booking. I'd be more forgiving if Cena had been booked a bit more strongly like Punk, who got in way more offense, but winning like he did makes Cena look fucking indestructible and Brock look like an incompetent oaf who take hardly any punishment yet still lost.

Anyway, I rate a match based mostly on how invested and interested I am in what's going on. I just wasn't with Brock/Cena. Others may have been, I'm glad they were and that they enjoyed it. For me, it didn't strike me as being nearly as epic as others claimed. Then again, neither did MiTB 2011. Like others, I knows what I likes and won't ditch that to conform to popular opinion. Some critics gave Punk/Jericho from Payback 4.5 stars, and I was bored beyond belief during that match. Its all about what you like.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Lol, just realised I didn't order ECW ONS 05 earlier when I bought all the remaining 05 PPV's I needed. Added it to my Amazon Wishlist instead since Christmas is coming up . CBA paying for it myself since it's like triple the price of any other 05 PPV I bought today (used... new is stupidly high priced!), and considering the show sucks balls I don't wanna fork out too much for it .


Surprised you didn't buy the whole set, could have saved a lot 

Like halfway through the main event of NYR, might not finish till Friday


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I already owned half the 05 PPV's so buying the whole set was pointless... plus it isn't ANYWHERE near as cheap over here. I had a quick look and the cheapest I could see for it used was £99. I spent about £15 including p&p (all used from sellers bar NWO which was free delivery with amazon prime), so yeah, much better to buy them separate .


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Eulonzo said:


> I think it's because Lesnar was literally destroying him and then Cena suddenly "came back" and won.
> 
> I disagree with those people, though.


Cena didn't really have a standard Cena "comeback," though. He basically caught Lesnar going to the well one too many times and got lucky by clocking him with the chain then the FU on the steps. Cena basically hit TWO moves all match, that just so happened to be timed perfectly. Do I agree with Cena winning? Not at all. However, it was very much the opposite of the standard "Cena wins lol" fare to which we've grown accustomed.



KO Bossy said:


> I fully recognize that why people like the match is due to the MMA influence and the legitimacy that comes with it (like Cena being busted open hard way on purpose). For me, that's just not my cup of tea. I generally don't like matches that are basically fake UFC. Its the same reason I wasn't a big fan of the Lion's Den matches they tried in 1998 and 1999. I think there's really only a couple matches ever where I did enjoy it. Like Nakamura vs Sakuraba from Wrestlekingdom 7. That was a wicked match. Why? Because it took place between actual MMA fighters who had the ability to combine pro wrestling in with a real MMA match.
> 
> Brock/Cena was a legit MMA fighter against a WWE pro wrestler (aka not a real fighter). The entire match was just Cena getting beaten up. Then Cena hits a chain shot and AA on steps to win.
> 
> ...


That's exactly what I was looking for. Regardless of whether or not I agree, that's what I like to see people provide when they comment on a match. I don't agree with the finish, either, though I see it as more of Lesnar getting "stunned" than actually losing. It was dumb as shit for him to lose his first match back, however.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

They booked themselves into a corner with Lesnar to begin with anyway, thanks to that GOD AWFUL contract negotiation segment. Lesnar demanding a shit ton of stuff including RENAMING THE SHOW practically confirmed that he wasn't going to win. Had they not done that bullshit, they like, could have actually HAD LESNAR WIN which would have been better.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Callamus said:


> Got my Raw 04 discs out now!!! I'll get started on Orton/Benoit tonight and get the rest done 2morrow .


You remember all the requests, right? I think they are up on the last page of the previous thread.

Edit: Here they are if you need to remember them.



Spoiler: .



Orton vs RVD - 12/1
Benoit vs Flair - 9/2
Benoit vs HBK - 16/2
Evolution vs Foley, Benoit, Shelton & HBK - 12/4
Benoit vs HBK - 3/5
Orton vs Edge - 10/5
Benoit & Edge vs Orton & Batista - 17/5
Benoit & Edge vs La Resistance - 31/5
Orton vs HBK - 7/6
Benoit, Jericho & Edge vs Evolution - 14/6 & 2/8
Benoit vs Kane - 28/6
Orton vs Benoit - 16/8
Benoit vs HHH vs Edge - 29/11


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Callamus said:


> They booked themselves into a corner with Lesnar to begin with anyway, thanks to that GOD AWFUL contract negotiation segment. Lesnar demanding a shit ton of stuff including RENAMING THE SHOW practically confirmed that he wasn't going to win. Had they not done that bullshit, they like, could have actually HAD LESNAR WIN which would have been better.


Lucky for them Lesnar doesn't give a fuck and just wants the MONAAYYYYYYYY :vince


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I saved em all in a text document when you first asked lol. Uploading Orton Vs Benoit!


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> I already owned half the 05 PPV's so buying the whole set was pointless... plus it isn't ANYWHERE near as cheap over here. I had a quick look and the cheapest I could see for it used was £99. I spent about £15 including p&p (all used from sellers bar NWO which was free delivery with amazon prime), so yeah, much better to buy them separate .


Oh, I thought you said earlier you only owned NWO :lol

DAMN! 99 euros? I know Euros is more than $ so, I must of gotten an absolute steal!


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Callamus said:


> I saved em all in a text document when you first asked lol. Uploading Orton Vs Benoit!


Alright, cool!

-------------------

Just finished watching this Rock/Benoit match from 15/8/02 on Smackdown. Fun TV quality match and very exciting. Only negative is Rock withstands the Crossface so long and then completely no sells it by reversing Benoit's irish whip into a Rock Bottom. Brock's reaction on the outside when Rock is in the hold is hilarious, lol. ★★★½.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

smitty915 said:


> Oh, I thought you said earlier you only owned NWO :lol
> 
> DAMN! 99 euros? I know Euros is more than $ so, I must of gotten an absolute steal!


Euros? Ain't none of that shitty currency here boy! POUNDS STERLING all the way. Works out at around $160. USED.

Edit: I do own NWO. Came today. I was just throwing the price of that in with what I ordered today to finish off my 05 collection lol.


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

did anyone respond to what i posted yesterday? would love thoughts on 03 stuff as i dont remember it too well.


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

Matches List: 

The Royal Rumble Match - Royal Rumble 2003.avi 

Team Austin vs Team Bischoff (Survivor Series 2003 Five-on-five Survivor Series elimination match).avi 

Kevin Nash,Shawn Michaels,Booker T vs Triple H,Ric Flair,Chris Jericho - World Heavyweight Championship - Backlash 2003.avi 

Triple H vs Goldberg vs Shawn Michaels vs Randy Orton vs Kevin Nash vs Chris Jericho - World Heavyweight Championship - Elimination Chamber - Summerslam 2003.avi 

Scott Steiner vs Triple H - World Heavyweight Championship - Royal Rumble 2003.avi 

The Rock vs Steve Austin (WrestleMania XIX 2003).avi 

Brock Lesnar vs. Kurt Angle - WWE Championship - Wrestlemania 19.avi 

Triple H vs. Goldberg vs. Kane - World Heavyweight Championship - Armageddon 2003.avi 

Rob Van Dam vs. Randy Orton - WWE Intercontintal Championship - Special Referee Mick Foley - Armageddon 2003.avi 

Kurt Angle vs Brock Lesnar - WWE Championship - Summerslam 2003.avi 

Brock Lesnar vs. The Undertaker - Biker Chain Match - WWE Championship - No Mercy 2003.avi 

Hulk Hogan vs. Vince Mcmahon - Street Fight - Wrestlemania 19.avi 

Shawn Michaels vs Chris Jericho (WrestleMania XIX 2003).avi 

Brock Lesnar vs John Cena - WWE Championship - Backlash 2003.avi 

Kurt Angle vs Chris Benoit (Royal Rumble 2003 WWE Championship).avi 

Triple H vs Kevin Nash - Hell In A Cell - World Heavyweight Championship - Special Guest Referee Mick Foley - Bad Blood 2003.avi 

The Undertaker vs Big Show - No Way Out 2003.avi 

The Rock vs. Hulk Hogan - No Way Out 2003.avi 

Goldberg vs. Triple H - World Heavyweight Championship - Unforgiven 2003.avi 

Brock Lesnar vs Kurt Angle vs Big Show (Vengeance 2003 No Disqualification Triple Threat match, WWE Championship).avi 

John Cena vs Kurt Angle (No Mercy 2003).avi 

John Cena vs. The Undertaker - Vengeance 2003.avi 

Eddie Guerrero vs. Chris Benoit - United States Championship - Vengeance 2003.avi 

Triple H vs. Booker T - World Heavyweight Championship - Wrestlemania 19.avi 

Batista vs. Shawn Michaels - Armageddon 2003.avi 

Goldberg vs The Rock (Backlash 2003).avi 

Randy Orton vs. Shawn Michaels - Unforgiven 2003.avi 

Triple H vs. Scott Steiner - World Heavyweight Championship - No Way Out 2003.avi 

Christian vs. Rob Van Dam vs. Chris Jericho - WWE Intercontinental Championship - Unforgiven 2003.avi 

Brock Lesnar & Chris Benoit vs Team Angle (Kurt Angle, Shelton Benjamin & Charlie Haas) - 3 on 2 Handicap Match - No Way Out 2003.avi 

Kane vs Shane McMahon (Unforgiven 2003 Last Man Standing match).avi 

Team Angle vs. Team Lesnar - Survivor Series Elimination Match - Survivor Series 2003.avi 

Shawn Michaels vs. Ric Flair - Bad Blood 2003.avi 

Brock Lesnar vs The Big Show (Judgment Day 2003 Stretcher match, WWE Championship).avi 

Rey Mysterio & Billy Kidman vs. Shelton Benjamin & Charlie Haas - WWE Tag Team Championships - Vengeance 2003.avi 

Triple H vs. Kevin Nash - Street Fight - World Heavyweight Championship - Insurrextion 2003.avi 

Triple H vs Kevin Nash - World Heavyweight Championship - Judgment Day 2003.avi 

Goldberg vs. Chris Jericho - Bad Blood 2003.avi 

Eddie Guerrero & Tajiri vs. Team Angle - Ladder Match - WWE Tag Team Championships - Judgment Day 2003.avi 

Goldberg vs. Triple H - World Heavyweight Championship - Survivor Series 2003.avi 

Trish Stratus & Lita vs Chris Jericho & Christian - The Battle Of The Sexes - Armageddon 2003.avi 

The Undertaker vs. Big Show & A-Train - Handicap 2 - 1 Match - Wrestlemania 19.avi 

Jeff Hardy vs Chris Jericho (No Way Out 2003).avi 

Rob Van Dam vs Kane - No Holds Barred - Summerslam 2003.avi 

William Regal & Lance Storm vs Kane & Rob Van Dam - World Tag Team Championship - No Way Out 2003.avi 

Kane vs. Shane Mcmahon - Ambulance Match - Survivor Series 2003.avi 

Christian vs. Booker T - WWE Intercontinental Championship - Insurrextion 2003.avi 

The Undertaker vs. Vince Mcmahon - Buried Alive Match - Survivor Series 2003.avi 

Eddie Guerrero vs Big Show - United States Championship - No Mercy 2003.avi 

Mark Henry vs Booker T - Armageddon 2003.avi 

Billy Kidman vs Matt Hardy - Cruiserweight Championship - No Way Out 2003.avi 

Rey Mysterio vs Tajiri - Cruiserweight Championship - No Mercy 2003.avi 

Chris Benoit vs Eddie Guerrero vs Rhino vs Tajiri - WWE United States Championship - Summerslam 2003.avi 

A-Train vs Chris Benoit - No Mercy 2003.avi 

Test vs. Scott Steiner - Unforgiven 2003.avi 

Lance Storm & William Regal vs The Dudley Boyz - World Tag Team Championship - Royal Rumble 2003.avi 

Test vs. Scott Steiner - Special Referee Val Venis - Insurrextion 2003.avi 

Brock Lesnar vs Big Show - Winner Enters The Rumble - Royal Rumble 2003.avi 

Test vs. Scott Steiner - Bad Blood 2003.avi


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Florent Sinama Pongolle said:


> did anyone respond to what i posted yesterday? would love thoughts on 03 stuff as i dont remember it too well.


2003 is pretty fun stuff, including a decent amount of the PPV stuff which is what I assume you're talking about.

And one of my greatest memories of the past involves SINAMA PONGOLLE which zep81/Clint Eastwood referred to earlier today.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

AVOID THE STEINER/HHH match! WOAT match!!


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Callamus said:


> They booked themselves into a corner with Lesnar to begin with anyway, thanks to that GOD AWFUL contract negotiation segment. Lesnar demanding a shit ton of stuff including RENAMING THE SHOW practically confirmed that he wasn't going to win. Had they not done that bullshit, they like, could have actually HAD LESNAR WIN which would have been better.


This is a GIGANTIC problem with WWE in this era. Lesnar can't lose because it'd make him look weak and they're paying him a ton of money. They need to preserve his mystique and a loss kills it. On the other hand, Cena lost at WM to Rock, and they want to give him a big rehab win. So...you have two guys who can't afford a loss. WHY ARE THEY FIGHTING, THEN? You put them in a situation where there has to be a loser when neither can afford to lose...and its in a no DQ match where you can't do a dirty, bullshit finish. Brilliant. The match shouldn't have taken place to begin with.

Same with Punk/Ryback HIAC. Punk has to keep the title to lose it to Rock, so he has to win. Ryback is probably the most over guy on the roster at the time and has a ton of momentum with his winning streak, and being the one Cena endorsed in his place. Again, neither can afford to lose. So they get booked to wrestle in a Cell where there HAS to be a winner since you can't do a dusty finish. 

Simple solution-if neither guy can afford to lose, don't book them to fight. Common fucking sense.

So now look at where we are. Brock is 3-2 since returning and his appeal for the casuals has been hurt to the point where Summerslam this year actually UNDERPERFORMED with him on the card (in terms of buys). So did WM29. They've hurt his drawing ability by putting a brick wall in front of his momentum and irreparably damaging his mystique. And Ryback...Ryback is a total nothing at this point, losing to R-Truth in a random Raw match 2 weeks ago and having zero direction.

And this could all have been easily avoided.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Callamus said:


> Christian's problem was that he didn't fuck about with someone else's girlfriend. Because that is the ONLY thing Edge had over Christian imo. Christian is better in ring, better on the mic, a MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH better babyface and better heel too. Christian deserved Edge's run far more than Edge ever did.
> 
> Drew McIntyre is currently positioning himself as one of the most underutalised guys on the roster. And that makes me eternally sad .




but also  at the last sentence.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Florent Sinama Pongolle said:


> Matches List:
> 
> The Royal Rumble Match - Royal Rumble 2003.avi
> 
> ...


These are the matches I can vouch for. It's worth watching anything Rock did because HOLLYWOOD Rock > most of what ever else was going on at the time. Brock is of course terrific. 

I didn't see Rey/Tajiri but left it because on paper of course it sounds fun. 

Don't bother with most of Triple H's stuff in 2003. HIAC with Nash is better than it should have been, but the rest of those matches and the Goldberg and Steiner matches are horrendous. Steiner matches are good for the lolz but that's it. WM match with Booker is good bar the finish.

Angle/Benoit seems to have garnered a ton of hate around here but I like it. Form your own opinion of that one.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

KO Bossy said:


> This is a GIGANTIC problem with WWE in this era. Lesnar can't lose because it'd make him look weak and they're paying him a ton of money. They need to preserve his mystique and a loss kills it. On the other hand, Cena lost at WM to Rock, and they want to give him a big rehab win. So...you have two guys who can't afford a loss. WHY ARE THEY FIGHTING, THEN? You put them in a situation where there has to be a loser when neither can afford to lose...and its in a no DQ match where you can't do a dirty, bullshit finish. Brilliant. The match shouldn't have taken place to begin with.
> 
> Same with Punk/Ryback HIAC. Punk has to keep the title to lose it to Rock, so he has to win. Ryback is probably the most over guy on the roster at the time and has a ton of momentum with his winning streak, and being the one Cena endorsed in his place. Again, neither can afford to lose. So they get booked to wrestle in a Cell where there HAS to be a winner since you can't do a dusty finish.
> 
> ...


The thing is, Cena could've afforded the loss to Lesnar. After a loss to Rock, they were playing up the fact that he couldn't win the "big one" (which is ludicrous given his history), and that could've sent him into a tailspin building up to his eventual rematch and victory over Rock for the title. Given Cena's post-match promo after Lesnar destoryed him, he should've fucked off for a while. Could've been a great story, imo, and likely would've lessened some of the heat Cena has with fans.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Primer said:


> but also  at the last sentence.


Thoughts on the new IC champ btw?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Hurricane owning Hollywood Rock was my favorite part of that run. Pardon the classic vs Austin at WM 19.

That gimmick was horseshit. Backlash '03 promo is an example of a bad coked out wrestler.


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

BIG E


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Hollywood Rock is absolutely awesome. His promos were non-stop comedy. The satellite one with Hogan, their final face to face confrontation ("You called The Rock a ROCKAJABRONI?") and the Rock Concerts, specially the one in Atlanta before Backlash. Gillberg showing up was :lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Callamus said:


> Thoughts on the new IC champ btw?


I knew it was coming, so I honestly don't care. Much like most junk within WWE these days.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Not gonna lie that I'd rather have Big E than Axel as a midcard title holder.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Big E is just a black Curtis Axel. Holding the IC title and me not giving a fuck or paying any kind of attention .

Disappointed Cody didn't rant about it .


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

Big E > Axel


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'd rather it be on someone who doesn't suck. That's my answer.

Cal I didn't rant b/c there is no reason to. It's all irrelevant and he's not Kofi Kingston - despite being a shithead too - so yeah.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

It appears he's a bit too jaded to even rant.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*#MOREBIGEBEATDOWNS

I like Langston, I think he has "it". Whatever the hell "it" is. If they give him some stories/meaningful feuds behind his title defenses and don't Ezekiel Jackson his title reign, I'll think he'll be just fine. 

PS: That remix of his theme is fucking horrendous. *


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Old theme was GOAT. Shouldn't have fucked with it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

He has everything except talent to talk on a mic or work a match or be interesting. :hayden3

Ok, Cal. If this shit topic keeps up I'll be forced to unleash. This junk stops now.

HEY GUYS, HOW ABOUT ANTONIO CESARO, HUH?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

CESARO


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Ezekiel Jackson still works there :ti

Cesaro needs to break off from Real Americans. Swagger's okay and all, and Zeb's a great talker, but Cesaro needs to be on his own tearing it up with Punk/Bryan/Cena/whoever else on PPV for a belt.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

CESARO~!

I played him in a HIAC match against HHH on WWE 2K14 and I put HHH through the cell with a catapult European Uppercut. Not quite sure how that works but it was :mark:. Got the footage saved too .

Hopefully Cesaro gets a chance to really SHINE at Survivor Series. Have him eliminate a bunch of guys. Uppercut them to hell and shit.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Looks like they're trying to showcase him a bit more lately which is (Y). Not sure why they haven't let him do the helicopter swing, though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Feed him the Usos easily. All they're good for. Taking out one of the Rhodes would be brilliant too. Then give us those Cesaro vs Mysterio interactions. I'm dying for the pop up to happen there. :mark:


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

The Lady Killer said:


> The thing is, Cena could've afforded the loss to Lesnar. After a loss to Rock, they were playing up the fact that he couldn't win the "big one" (which is ludicrous given his history), and that could've sent him into a tailspin building up to his eventual rematch and victory over Rock for the title. Given Cena's post-match promo after Lesnar destoryed him, he should've fucked off for a while. Could've been a great story, imo, and likely would've lessened some of the heat Cena has with fans.


Oh I totally know that Cena could afford to lose. I'm speaking in a WWE mindset, where for them, he had to win to get his credibility back. Either way, if he couldn't afford to lose, he shouldn't fight Lesnar. If he can, he should have lost. In either situation, Lesnar losing was fucked up.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*I would :mark: so hard just to see Cesaro swing Rey about a billion times.

#MOREBIGSWINGS*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Shoooot. Didn't even think of a swing on Mysterio. That too please.

or SPEAR on Mysterio. Good lord the options here are stellar.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Cesaro should get a chance to swing EVERYONE on the face team at SS. Wish we could have seen Cena take it a few weeks ago but whatever.


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

Cesaro is a fucking beast.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Super euro uppercut to Rey = FUCK


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Chris Benoit Vs Randy Orton - WHC Match - Raw August 16th 2004

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k23LarpwQG5mvT4W6i4 (Private)


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Callamus said:


> Chris Benoit Vs Randy Orton - WHC Match - Raw August 16th 2004
> 
> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k23LarpwQG5mvT4W6i4 (Private)


Thanks! :hb

With KillaCal, I don't have to wish for WWE to release any of Benoit's TV stuff on DVD.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Lady Killer said:


> Super euro uppercut to Rey = FUCK


That's what I'm talking about. The could reenact that FABULOUS ending to the Zayn 2/3 Falls match while throwing some Rey magic in there. Imagine the VE uppercut counters Rey could come up with :mark:

Wish to god we could have gotten 02-05 Rey in the ring with 2013 Cesaro. I might pass out.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

*Royal Rumble 2003*​
*Big Show vs Brock Lesnar – Winner Advances To The Royal Rumble Match*

Both of these guys are really giants and it must be something to see these two go out at it live in person. Brock Lesnar really shows that just because he is big does not mean that he is slow. They really booked Big Show like this big mammoth of a guy who it was a miracle that anybody could lift him. The story seemed to be that Lesnar was the GOAT because he was lifting Big Show. Brock Lesnar must have been told to make Big Show look powerful, I mean, of course he did, because Lesnar sells like a horse in this match. I feel that anybody that faced the Big Show during 2002, 2003, were straight underdogs. No matter how talented guys were. Brock Lesnar is obviously more talented in the ring than Big Show, but during their matches, Lesnar always seemed like the obvious underdog. Paul Heyman is awful annoying whenever he works as a heel. 
Brock Lesnar hits the F-5 for the victory. 
Short for a match between these two, good but not all if could have been. But I guess we supposed to believe that one of these men are going on to the Royal Rumble match and will have to face 29 other superstars.. Well the winner is entering 30..so fuck off Michael Cole.

*Winner: Brock Lesnar
Match Rating: **1/2*


*World Tag Team Championship
Dudley Boys vs. William Regal & Lance Storm*

The Dudleys smash mouth style and Regal and Storms straight wrestling attack mix well in this match. Dvon and Bubba seem to try to keep Regal and Storm off of the ground attack by throwing them into corners and attacking them at every direction. I’ve never been a fan of the cheap heat that some of these non-American teams have just because they carry around foreign flags. It’s like the WWE is knows how fucking “’merican” we are and used it against us. Just the fact that they are foreign, we are supposed to not like them doesn’t make a whole lot of sense, but what does actually make sense in the WWE.
“Chief of Staff Morley” attempting to cause the distraction for Regal/Storm to get the titles, but it backfires and the Dudleys hit the 3-D for the victory.
Great Tag Match with little of a story with an okay ending.

*Winner: The Dudleys
Match Rating : **1/2*


*Dawn Marie vs Torrie Wilson
Torrie Wilson is fucking hot/5*


*Triple H vs Scott Steiner – World Heavyweight Championship*

Wow. I forgot how terrible Scott Steiner is in the ring. He seems like a robot. Just because this is Steiner and Triple H we are supposed to like this match? The story seems like we are supposed to actually believe Scott has a chance of taking that title away from Triple H. Everything Steiner does look fake. It seems like he is very careful in everything he does. I mean, seriously this is embarrassing. Does Vince think just because Scott is big, that he is good in the ring? I hate that fucking mindset they seem to have with Big Guys, Hence Goldberg. They tried to spice up the match by going to the outside and doing a few steel posts spots, and the steel steps. Not working. The robot-ness of Steiner and the terrible “I don’t give a fuck” attitude of Triple H, this match is just a dud. Scott is so lazy in the ring. It reminds me of how The Rock was at WM29. I mean, even them going out of the ring, Triple H getting busted open, I don’t think anything can change my mind about this match at this point. They are trying too hard to have great spots in a very lazy match. Earl Hebner turning on Triple H and saying that he wasn’t going to DQ Triple H was actually a decent spot. Sad it was wasted on Steiner. 
The ending was sort of a cluster fuck with Triple H getting the win by DQ anyway. 
Stil a Triple H match and I was still entertained by Steiner being terrible and the cluster fuck finish.

*Winner: Triple H
Match Rating: *1/4 (I guess…idk. Terrible.)*

*Kurt Angle vs Chris Benoit – WWE Championship*

Team Angle being ejected from Ringside evens everything out. Even though I still see a fuckery finish, this is good for the story telling of the match. There isn’t that much a build to this match, but I am hoping that because these two are GOAT we get an amazing match. Good counters and reversals from Chris Benoit throughout the early going of the match. Both men have similar style throughout the match. The ground game by both of these men is fantastic. The reversals and the counters really make this match just an emotional roller coaster. The first half is very good but only very good. They kind of go through their move sets trading ground impact moves and then tease a couple false finishes with pinfall reversals. . The match really picks up at Benoit's comeback and re-energizes a crowd that Scott Steiner had absolutely killed. . Outstanding finishing sequence and a great match, best of the night. 

_I had more to about how bad Scott Steiner/Triple H than I did about any other match on the card. Benoit/Angle is best match on this card. The match between them Wrestlemania X-Seven was better than this, but this match saved the show besides of the Royal Rumble Match. _ 

*Winner: Kurt Angle
Rating: ****1/4*

*Royal Rumble Match*

The first half or 2/3 of the match is great with Jericho carrying the talent through transitions and doing the majority of good spots. Plus, being the veteran is always an easy gimmick for the Royal Rumble Match when done right. Jericho and friends created an fast pace for the first 15-20 minutes with hardly any "you stand on the ropes and I'll pretend to pick up your leg" fuckery. Dreamer comes in and things get enjoyable hardcore for a few minutes and it becomes apparent that Jericho is the story of the match if he wasn't already. Things hit a wall here as too many guys that get in the ring and kills the momentum and Jericho unexpectedly gets tossed by the midcard talent Test. The ending programs are pretty good as Team Angle is apparent along with Brock, Taker, Kane & Batista. 

*Winner: Brock Lesnar 
Rating: *****


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Hell yes. Haven't seen the Orton vs Benoit rematch since the air date.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Those orton/benoit are :lenny only one I havent seen is best of 7


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

SKINS25 said:


> Those orton/benoit are :lenny only one I havent seen is best of 7


If nobody else can swoop in with a link, I can arrange to have that uploaded 2morrow too .


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> That's what I'm talking about. The could reenact that FABULOUS ending to the Zayn 2/3 Falls match while throwing some Rey magic in there. Imagine the VE uppercut counters Rey could come up with :mark:
> 
> Wish to god we could have gotten 02-05 Rey in the ring with 2013 Cesaro. I might pass out.


Imo2. I hope Rey isn't too fucked up to produce some more magic before he retires.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I got SummerSlam 2004 to watch via DVD. But I need to watch all the rest in chronological order. Remember those two killing it in every match. SummerSlam match is the only vivid bout & that's fecking wonderful.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Speaking of CESARO...



Spoiler: NXT match



When is the Regal match airing? This week? If so... uhh... when does NXT air


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Callamus said:


> If nobody else can swoop in with a link, I can arrange to have that uploaded 2morrow too .


Its all up to you bud, all their matches besides raw 04 are pretty YT accessible, some of those on C2d list caught my eye if you upload them ( naitch vs. benoit :mark


Edit: I watched ss 04 last night, blew my mind


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Callamus said:


> If nobody else can swoop in with a link, I can arrange to have that uploaded 2morrow too .


Which one? Do you have 13/1 and 27/1 in better quality than the full SDs that's floating around online? I've posted the ones I have on my computer up on youtube so you can see for yourself if you own it in better quality. 13/1 and 27/1.

30/12/05 is already up in great quality (from Sky Sports as usual). Have that full SD and was my most recent upload to youtube before getting a strike for another Raw show.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Hasn't even been taped yet, iirc.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*I still haven't seen either Cesaro/Zayn match, but (not surprisingly) I hear absolutely wonderful things about both matches. I need to find some time to watch it. *


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Choke2Death said:


> Which one? Do you have 13/1 and 27/1 in better quality than the full SDs that's floating around online? I've posted the ones I have on my computer up on youtube so you can see for yourself if you own it in better quality. 13/1 and 27/1.
> 
> 30/12/05 is already up in great quality. Have that full SD and was my most recent upload to youtube before getting a strike for another Raw show.


That saves me uploading them. I only have download versions of SD 06 rather than straight to DVD versions, so the TY vids will be from the same rips I have.

Not taped yet, you say? Bah. Stupid NXT and it's crazy scheduled. I never know what's aired, when something is airing or if anything has even been taped lol.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

rjsbx1 said:


> *I still haven't seen either Cesaro/Zayn match, but (not surprisingly) I hear absolutely wonderful things about both matches. I need to find some time to watch it. *


Watch em, asap when you can. But make sure you find the proper copy of Zayn vs Cesaro 2/3 falls. There is one that cuts out the entire second fall and obviously kills the match to a strong degree.



Callamus said:


> Not taped yet, you say? Bah. Stupid NXT and it's crazy scheduled. I never know what's aired, when something is airing or if anything has even been taped lol.


Ohno still has a few more matches to air b/c of their taping schedule. That vintage WCW Saturday Night type mold. :ti


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Full Cesaro/Zayn 2/3 falls match:

Sami.Zayn.vs.Antonio.Cesaro.2.Out.Of.3.Falls.Match.720p.(from 2013-08-21.NXT)

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k5d7Frtu679mEs4LWFA (Private)

:lmao Ohno has matches still to air? Guy disappears from TV for like a year, then when he comes back and tapes some matches he gets fired... having matches air while he's gone? :lmao


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Its also on Hulu for free IIRC


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Makes his abrupt release all the more...weird. WWE never cuts dudes like this anymore. It's almost surreal with how much someone didn't like him.

Damn. Entrances for Benoit vs Orton gave me goosebumps. Reminds me of why I was such a mega Orton fan here. Dude was elite. Benoit is a given. :mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^ yea watching summerslam 04 brought me back to my orton-lovin days as well, I think I did the pose too :lmao

Legend...................Killer rton2


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Callamus said:


> Full Cesaro/Zayn 2/3 falls match:
> 
> Sami.Zayn.vs.Antonio.Cesaro.2.Out.Of.3.Falls.Match.720p.(from 2013-08-21.NXT)
> 
> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k5d7Frtu679mEs4LWFA (Private)


You are a saint, Cal. Hopefully, I'll get a chance to watch it tomorrow :mark:.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit/Orton finished downloading. :mark:

Orton's last ever entrance with Line in the Sand. Now it's time to turn on media player classic and stretch it out so the black sides get covered with the video itself.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

While I had it on my PC...

Chris Benoit Vs Randy Orton - WHC Match - Raw August 16th 2004

Lawler: "Benoit gets a re-match here in Canada? Let's face it, BENOIT IT FROM CANADA!" :lmao

Benoit is just :mark: in this. He's fucking TORTURING Orton while trying to win back the title. No fucking about here. He's out for VENGEANCE. Benoit spent 15 years, went an hour in the RR and beat HBK and HHH in a 3 way at WRESTLEMANIA to finally win the WHC (Sid match clearly forgotten for storyline reasons lol). Then he went through hell to hold onto it. Defended it in the same kind of match he won it in. Had to defend against the monster KANE after already wrestling a match earlier in the night. Against HHH who had EVOLUTION watching his back. Against HHH again in a gruelling 60 minute iron man match. And then this young punk comes along and takes it from him? In CANADA? Benoit is not taking this lying down!!!

Everything just looks BRUTAL. Orton's selling is wonderful. He looks OUT OF IT from taking CHOPS TO THE CHEST. And Benoit chops him so damn hard you could fucking believe it. Oh and man oh man, that spot with the steel steps and Orton's knee sounded SICK.

:mark: Orton hitting the knee drop and acting like his leg just broke was amazing. Benoit was DOMINATING this match, but the moment Orton saw a chance to change the tide, he went with it and being young and inexperienced he just went for what he knows, which was a knee drop, and it probably did more damage to him.

But then Orton starts to get back into the match fully, and targets the NECK of Benoit for obvious reasons. Works a BEAUTIFUL headlock. BEAUTIFUL. Furthest thing from being a rest hold, which makes a nice change from the usual headlock.

One thing I love about these 2 in the ring is how SNUG they work. It's not quite STIFF like Benoit/Regal/Finlay would be, but it's way above what just about everyone else is doing, and as such every, and I legitimately mean EVERY move looks good and looks like it did damage. Those CHOPS I mentioned earlier looked vicious. Suplexes look devastating. A HEADLOCK looks like a major submission hold. And Orton lands a fucking SWEET neckbreaker at one point too that made me :mark:.

Finish is good too, starting with all the Crossface spots, and then Evolution running interference to help Orton retain.

AND THEN THE TURN. Wonderfully done, followed up on like shit .

Great match still. Holds up magnificently. ***3/4 probably, maybe ****.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I don't need to write up a review seeing how Cal just did one. :hayley1

but that was totally fabulous. I will have to chime in on how I did love Orton's selling of his knee after it was destroyed on the steel steps. Also glad the post-match beatdown was added. I was mad at the sight of it back when I was only 13, but excited b/c it meant Orton would go babyface. Thus making my love come full circle. _(I liked his babyface run here)_ :mark:


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Has anyone else looked at the line up so far for Wrestle Kingdom 8? Okada vs Naito, Nakamura vs Tanahashi, Devitt vs Ibushi and a 4 way tag match between the Bucks, Hooligans, Time Splitters and Suzukigun. I am...floored. That has PPV of the DECADE written all over it. And that's only 4 MATCHES. There's still the rest of the PPV.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

When Okada/Nakamura happens, we all shall use our Lenny smileys.

Did somebody mention WCW Saturday Night? That means some William Regal!


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> When Okada/Nakamura happens, we all shall use our Lenny smileys.


Well, they technically have fought before. I know they fought in the G1 Climax 2012. Absolutely excellent match.

However, the idea that Nakamura leads CHAOS but is only the Intercontinental champion, while Okada is only a member and the IWGP champion makes me think at some point they're going to do a power struggle (interesting, that was the name of the last NJPW PPV) story where Okada challenges for leadership. I would :mark: so hard for that.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Fuck off with New Japan spoilers & upcoming cards in here.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

So I'm now finished with the Benoit/Orton match. Not much to say since CAL already covered everything. It was much more enjoyable to watch it in good quality, though. Other than the little advert dubbing over the commentary in the beginning but that's no big deal. Orton's selling is so awesome here, never paid attention to the knee drop being his first move when taking control before.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I was so inspired by that match, now I'm watching RAW following it on 8/23. Mostly for Regal vs Flair, but the fallout of Orton from Evolution excites me too. I didn't even know Rock randomly shows up on this night, lolz.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah, Rock's last appearance on WWE TV until his return in 2011. Unless you count the two satellite appearances before WM23 and the Smackdown 10th anniversary.

Also is Benoit even on that 23/8 show? I know he doesn't have a match on the card and I don't remember him being part of any segments. Just know that he was relegated to Heat where he beat Tomko. The week after is :mark: with Orton debuting Burn in My Light and attacking Evolution with the sledgehammer. Just thinking about it makes me wanna watch Raw 2004 all over again.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao I thought I was watching the same match as you guys, watch the Best of 7, half way though, yea gonna need some more benoit and LK orton rec after this, I know this is right up your alley C2d


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Think this is a Benoit free RAW pardon mentions on commentary & only shown via the highlight video from the rematch with Orton.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

It's sad how quickly they tossed him aside. He was booked strong all year and then he losses the title and not 8 days after fails to get some TV time. At least they brought him back into the Evolution feud going into Survivor Series.



SKINS25 said:


> :lmao I thought I was watching the same match as you guys, watch the Best of 7, half way though, yea gonna need some more benoit and LK orton rec after this, I know this is right up your alley C2d


Well, duh. It's my two favorite wrestlers facing off and it certainly helps that their chemistry is perfect.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Gave him the career high, only to have him recede down the card following. At first it was acceptable _(feuding with Evolution was still a prized role & had an upper card program with Edge)_ but once he went to Smackdown he was always held in high regard, but never quite booked in that way. Main event scene wasn't ever about him. Not sure why. Mysterio rising was smart. Eddie still being there was clearly the right move. Batista taking up time was balls, but it proved to be smart in marketing b/c he ended up being big. Taker, JBL, & Orton were all around too. So yeah, it was loaded. But why couldn't Benoit fit in there? It was like being in WCW all over again, only with a more sustained role: that of upper midcarder who never got to advance. Suppose it could have been worse. He could have been in Christian's position.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Christian is better in-ring than Edge but I disagree on the mic. While Christian is great at his best, *Edge is extremely underrated on the stick I think. The passion and his fluent talking abilities often go unnoticed by most. He could and still can work the mic with the best of them,* that's not to put Christian down in any way, I just think Edge is top 10-15.


Agreed, although I'm late.

The way he sounded when he got intense and started sounding aggresive & angry on the mic. :mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Eulonzo said:


> Agreed, although I'm late.
> 
> The way he sounded when he got intense and started sounding aggresive & angry on the mic. :mark: :mark: :mark:


http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xihcya_edge-and-lita-on-the-matt-hardy-feud-raw-8-8-2005_sport

*Still one of my favorite Edge promos. Completely shits on Hardy's promo the week before. :mark:*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

C2D Benoit did show up on this RAW. He comes out to stop Batista during the fun Regal vs Flair match. Ok, I should have remembered that for Unforgiven. :hmm:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Was Unforgiven the PPV with that horrible Steven Richards/Tyson Tomko match? And why don't we ever talk about Richards in this thread?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Why? b/c that match happened. 

Nah, idk. b/c his work isn't bad but not too noteworthy? He was a boss leading Right to Censor, of course.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Probably gonna start going through the 2005 year as well.. finished downloading the weeklies from XWT


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I need to slam through the goodies on TV from 2005 myself. These 2004 RAWs are making me want to brush through that whole year again first. Even though I did so just at the start of 2013. I have no objections in watching the top PPVs matches over. Benoit & Regal vs Flair & Batista is calling my name a ton, atm.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:sad: Jerry Lynn vs. RVD at Hardcore Heaven 1999 did not hold up at all. I can't believe I once loved this mess.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

I have never before seen someone's forehead get busted open from taking a back bump through a table, but by god, tonight I actually did. Defies logic, but there it is before my eyes. The incredible part is that it happened HARD WAY. Truth is really stranger than fiction.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I still like the RVD vs Lynn matches, but oh yeah, not nearly the "masterpieces" of high energy wrestling I once considered them to be.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

I got this RVD DVD for dirt cheap, and two of the matches on there are:

Rob Van Dam vs. Jerry Lynn at ECW Living Dangerously 3.21.99
Rob Van Dam vs. Jerry Lynn at ECW Guilty As Charged 1.7.01


Do you guys think that those two matches are better? Just from a quick cursory glance at amazon reviews of those matches, people say that those are some of the best ones on the DVD. 

I see a bunch of people throwing 10/10 at that first match.



ETA:



Clint Eastwood said:


> Check my sig if you need that match


You are awesome! Reps have to be spread around again, but I really appreciate it!



SKINS25 said:


> I also watched a show/Kane that all they did was chain wrestle :ti was good though


:lmao this made me burst out laughing.




Starbuck said:


> [Cena/Lesnar] didn't even feel like a wrestling match tbh.


That's what I liked about it. (Y) I do agree with others that the ending could have been executed better, though.


ETAA: Thanks, ThePrimer.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Living Dangerously match is the better. It was first so it had the benefit on not having to run through a few recycled spots. Living Dangerously is basically their best match overall.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Considering people's opinions here, do y'all prefer Taker/Sheamus or Taker/Brock?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

You probably saw my post. Answer here is: idc. I'll go apeshit at both options.

btw, what should I watch to go through the night: the rest of NJPW King of Pro Wrestling 2013 _(only finished pre-show & opener)_ or more Fall/Winter RAW circa 2004?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Taker/Brock for me. 

What am I saying, I fucking want Taker/Cena, but Brock is a worthy second choice


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I think I'd go with Sheamus if I have to pick only one. We've already seen Brock/Taker before and while I'd fully support it happening again, I really want Sheamus/Taker before Taker retires.



The Primer said:


> C2D Benoit did show up on this RAW. He comes out to stop Batista during the fun Regal vs Flair match. Ok, I should have remembered that for Unforgiven. :hmm:


Figured that would be it if he made an appearance.


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

Taker/Lesnar. 

Sheamus would be a huge step down for 'The Streak' WORKRATE AINT ALL BROTHER unk2 :hogan2


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Sami Zayn vs. "Everyone Loves Antonio Cesaro 2/3 Falls- *****3/4*

What an awesome match. It was even worth sitting through Alex Riley calling Zayn and Cesaro the same size. :lmao. Idiot. There was great deal of logic used in the falls and stories were told within each fall as well as an overall story to the match. The action was awesome from two great in-ring guys. ZAYN'S Tornado DDT after diving through the ring ropes :mark: AND THAT COUNTER + UPPERCUT AT THE END :mark: It's been a while since I had so much fun watching a match. That was an awesome match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Some more Raw 04 matches:

Chris Benoit Vs Shawn Michaels - Raw February 16th 2004

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/kuirLH6QHGxxiV4WfsF (Private)

Randy Orton Vs RVD - Raw January 12th 2004

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k5U6cCtecMLXdW4WeA5 (Private)

Triple H Vs Edge Vs Chris Benoit - Raw November 29th 2004

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k5cOPWGFf4CIQv4WdQg (Private)

Unfortunately some of my discs are buggered. They play fine but won't let me rip anything from them, so i can't do these:

Benoit vs Flair - 9/2
Evolution vs Foley, Benoit, Shelton & HBK - 12/4
Orton vs Edge - 10/5

Although I am 100% certain the Evolution tag is on the top 100 WWF/E matches comp I did so I'll be able to get it from there .


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Well, that sucks about the other two. But still :mark: for the rest!

DLing Orton/RVD now.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

BL and GAB 05 just showed up. Might stick in GAB and watch Eddie/Rey for the hell of it.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> BL and GAB 05 just showed up. Might stick in GAB and watch Eddie/Rey for the hell of it.



Do itttt, some classic Eddie heel work there, and that match gets my vote for the best mic work Michael Cole has ever done. Cole was spectacular in all the Eddie/Rey matches actually, but the level of disgust he shows for Eddie in that GAB makes me :mark: Tazz is great too. Especially when Eddie is using Domenick as a shield and forces Rey to get on his knees and beg :lmao


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

rjsbx1 said:


> Sami Zayn vs. "Everyone Loves Antonio Cesaro 2/3 Falls- *****3/4*
> 
> What an awesome match. It was even worth sitting through Alex Riley calling Zayn and Cesaro the same size. :lmao. Idiot. There was great deal of logic used in the falls and stories were told within each fall as well as an overall story to the match. The action was awesome from two great in-ring guys. ZAYN'S Tornado DDT after diving through the ring ropes :mark: AND THAT COUNTER + UPPERCUT AT THE END :mark: It's been a while since I had so much fun watching a match. That was an awesome match.


I really need to see this match. They've encountered each other a few times before they were signed and there matches were spectacular. There is a match from PWG between the two that you should check out if you love this one so much. I mean even if you aren't an indy wrestling, it's the same guy having another awesome match. I want to say it was at Kurt Ruselmania.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

TaylorFitz said:


> I really need to see this match. They've encountered each other a few times before they were signed and there matches were spectacular. There is a match from PWG between the two that you should check out if you love this one so much. I mean even if you aren't an indy wrestling, it's the same guy having another awesome match. I want to say it was at Kurt Ruselmania.



I can't say enough good things about that match or encourage you any more strongly to watch. It's been talked about at length in this thread many times already, so I won't go into excessive detail about why its so great, but that match is damn close to being perfect. The only match I feel comfortable saying is better from this year is Punk/Lesnar, and the tap between them is insignificant. Zayn puts on the baby face performance of a lifetime, and the 3rd and final fall is 5 minutes or so of some of the best wrestling I've ever witnessed. The finish, the first time I saw it, made me jump up in JR mode and say "GOOD GOD ALMIGHTY".

So yea, I think you should take the 12-14 minutes or so and watch it. It's fabulous. I can't wait for Vince to find a "spot" for Zayn and give him the call up already, I'd sacrifice a baby seal to see a 6 man tag of Rhodes Bros/Zayn vs The Shield.

Wow, it just made me unbelievably sad that I will never get to hear JR call a Zayn match vs a big heel, where he gives him the Jeff Hardy treatment "go on kid, climb that ladder, make yourself a STAR"


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Callamus said:


> Unfortunately some of my discs are buggered. They play fine but won't let me rip anything from them, so i can't do these:
> 
> Benoit vs Flair - 9/2
> Evolution vs Foley, Benoit, Shelton & HBK - 12/4
> ...


 I was looking forward to the naitch/benoit and evolution tag, no worries thanks for the upload


Forgot to write my thoughts on benoit/orton 1/13/06 (best of 7), again another fabolus match by these two ( I'm sorry Christian, I'm officially naming Benoit his best opponent) I liked the back story within the match, Orton is trying to out-wrestle Benoit, which is close to impossible but he damn well does well in the process. I heard someone say it and I 100% agree, these matches are soo brutal, gritty and just straight to the bone WRASSLIN. :lmao @ Booker T selling the foot injury, he literally runs back to the ring, and then try to hobble like he didn't just see that ( See what I did there :vince3). I forgot what Randy got return or was promised for by Booker to compete in this match

Its funny because I just made a top 5 Randy Orton matches off the top of my head for someone a few days ago, and I'm 90% its unvalid


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

You can still watch Flair vs Benoit here. Quality may not be as good as CAL's version but it's still watchable.

EDIT: Fuck, this site I download DM/YT vids from is sooooo slow. It's been nearly an hour and RVD/Orton is only at 85%. My internet connection is pretty good so I know it's not where the fault lies.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Just rewatched Summerslam 2004, only for the Benoit/Orton match,tbh:

Dudleys/Msterio&Kidman&London- **1/2
Hardy/Kane- **1/2
Booker/Cena- **
Edge/Jericho/Batista- ***
Eddie/Angle- ***1/2
HHH/Eugene- *
Taker/JBL- DUD
Orton/Benoit- ****, stll the best RKO outta nowhere


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Was Taker/JBL really a DUD?


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

TaylorFitz said:


> I really need to see this match. They've encountered each other a few times before they were signed and there matches were spectacular. There is a match from PWG between the two that you should check out if you love this one so much. I mean even if you aren't an indy wrestling, it's the same guy having another awesome match. I want to say it was at Kurt Ruselmania.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

I really hate that match, it was only a long JBL clusterfuck.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

So Eddie/Rey GAB still RULES THE PLANET. Just sheer... I don't think a word exists to describe how good this is. Eddie man. Eddie. FUCKING EDDIE. He's just... godly. GODLY. EDDIE GODRERRO. Has anyone, at any time in any promotion in any match ever had a performance BETTER than this? Eddie is one of my all time favourites, has been ever since I saw a random Nitro match of his on TV in 1997... and yet even *I* wanted to see him get beat in this match. He plays his character to absolute perfection. Such a fucking DICK. And oh man, say what you want about Dominic being brought unto this whole angle, but fuck me Eddie used that part of the story in such a way I can't hate on it in the slightest. Without the Dominic part of the angle, who knows what this match would have ended up being. Making Rey act friendly towards him in front of his son, shaking hands and hugging before the match is just such a DICK thing to do and it's wonderful. Using Dominic to set a trap for Rey so he can attack him from behind, which causes Tazz and Cole to fucking LOSE IT on commentary. Could you imagine them trying to do that today? Cole would be telling use to express our opinions on the situation on the App while JBL would be agreeing with Eddie for doing it because it's SMART or something and Lawler would be making some inappropriate joke. Finish is perfect too with Eddie just crushing Rey, mauling him and clearly having the victory that he has been desperate for since WM... yet he gets cocky and spends too much time playing to Dominic, allowing Rey to sneak a win. THIS is wrestling. THIS is art. THIS is fucking amazing.

Oh and don't forget Eddie SELLING HIS TESTICLES. :lmao at him just reaching down and grabbing them while the commentators just sit there in awkward silence trying to come up with an explaination :lmao.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> So Eddie/Rey GAB still RULES THE PLANET. Just sheer... I don't think a word exists to describe how good this is. Eddie man. Eddie. FUCKING EDDIE. He's just... godly. GODLY. EDDIE GODRERRO. Has anyone, at any time in any promotion in any match ever had a performance BETTER than this? Eddie is one of my all time favourites, has been ever since I saw a random Nitro match of his on TV in 1997... and yet even *I* wanted to see him get beat in this match. He plays his character to absolute perfection. Such a fucking DICK. And oh man, say what you want about Dominic being brought unto this whole angle, but fuck me Eddie used that part of the story in such a way I can't hate on it in the slightest. Without the Dominic part of the angle, who knows what this match would have ended up being. Making Rey act friendly towards him in front of his son, shaking hands and hugging before the match is just such a DICK thing to do and it's wonderful. Using Dominic to set a trap for Rey so he can attack him from behind, which causes Tazz and Cole to fucking LOSE IT on commentary. Could you imagine them trying to do that today? Cole would be telling use to express our opinions on the situation on the App while JBL would be agreeing with Eddie for doing it because it's SMART or something and Lawler would be making some inappropriate joke. Finish is perfect too with Eddie just crushing Rey, mauling him and clearly having the victory that he has been desperate for since WM... yet he gets cocky and spends too much time playing to Dominic, allowing Rey to sneak a win. THIS is wrestling. THIS is art. THIS is fucking amazing.
> 
> Oh and don't forget Eddie SELLING HIS TESTICLES. :lmao at him just reaching down and grabbing them while the commentators just sit there in awkward silence trying to come up with an explaination :lmao.



You are so hot right now. That whole paragraph was one of my favorite things I've ever read from you, probably because I agree with it 1,000,000%. It's matches like that one in particular that cemented Eddie's status as my favorite wrestler ever. I really became a fan of Eddie's when he formed the LWO in WCW, but he didn't become one of my favorites ever until 2003ish. He is just a master. There is no other word to describe it. A genius savant. And Cole and Tazz played their roles perfectly on commentary, I wish they were allowed to call matches like that now.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

rjsbx1 said:


> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xihcya_edge-and-lita-on-the-matt-hardy-feud-raw-8-8-2005_sport
> 
> *Still one of my favorite Edge promos. Completely shits on Hardy's promo the week before. :mark:*


Wow, I've never seen that. What a promo. :mark: One of my favorite promos of his now as well. The passion and emotion in that promo made it even better, not to mention a lot of what he said is true. Matt was in the Cruiserweight title scene while Edge was having great matches with arguably the GOATs (Kurt Angle, Chris Benoit, Eddie Guerrero, Triple H, Shawn Michaels).

Have you ever seen the one he did on The Highlight Reel before WM 21? I thought that one was pretty good as well.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLK7adLajJk

Go to 2:28.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Any other golides from GAB 05? I might need to buy it.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

RichardHagen said:


> Any other golides from GAB 05? I might need to buy it.



Unfortunately no, it was pretty much a 1 match show, but what a match it was.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

RichardHagen said:


> Any other golides from GAB 05? I might need to buy it.


Nothing really worth watching. It's probably the worst PPV from 2005. Only watch Eddie/Mysterio and Benoit/Jordan, the rest can be skipped. SPECIALLY that horrendous main event.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah total 1 match show... but holy fuck at how disturbing the aftermath of the Undertaker/Hassan match is lol! Blood EVERYWHERE from the back of his head after being given a Last Ride through the fucking stage lol.

Taker/JBL from SS is so far from a DUD it ain't even funny. Wouldn't put that much distance between it and Orton/Benoit. Shame the crowd were a bunch of ignorant cunts during it all.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Well, that sucks about the other two. But still :mark: for the rest!
> 
> DLing Orton/RVD now.


Thanks, good match, just chopping the shit out each other :mark: , :lmao :lmao the black guys in the NFL jersey in front when there were to the side chopping each other, best fans


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

I think I'm gonna go pick up The History Of The WWE DVD tonight. I had it in my hand at K-Mart on Tuesday and decided against it. I'm a little erie about it only being 2 hours though. Seems like a gip. But the content listing looks promising. I wish I had a blu-ray player. The extras on the blu-ray look :mark:


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

bFuuuck looking over the Blu Ray extras makes me want to go buy a Blu Ray player. It looks so good.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

Finally watched this. Pretty good match! I loved the sequence at the end where Benoit countered the top-rope clothesline that Kane does. :mark: Kane looked like a monster here. The "sit-up's" were awesome.

The ending could've been better but I guess they did the roll-up so that way Benoit still retained but Kane still looked like a monster so they didn't have to make him tap lol.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit made Kane tap out two weeks after anyways, lol.

Just watched that Edge promo on Matt Hardy and holy fuck is it awesome! Exactly what I'm talking about when it comes to Edge using a mic. He's just so great at it.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

That promo after the match, though.. :no: That really reminded me how bad Benoit was at times on the mic.

"Chris Benoit is 4 REAL!" how many times did he say that? :lmao


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> Benoit made Kane tap out two weeks after anyways, lol.
> 
> Just watched that Edge promo on Matt Hardy and holy fuck is it awesome! Exactly what I'm talking about when it comes to Edge using a mic. He's just so great at it.


*:mark: I know, right? The best part about it was everything he said was complete truth. "You're only here because your girlfriend fell in love with a main eventer." :lmao :lmao

There's another segment/interview before Hardy's return where Grisham asks Edge about a match with Kane and he just GOES OFF on MH for the whole Byte This thing. I have to re-find the video though.*


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Finished rewatching that Orton/RVD from January 2004. It's even better this time. So many awesome nearfalls and RVD guides Orton through it pretty well after he got knocked out from the steel step bump. Loved seeing Orton channel Eddie Guerrero with the playing possum thing. :lol



rjsbx1 said:


> *
> There's another segment/interview before Hardy's return where Grisham asks Edge about a match with Kane and he just GOES OFF on MH for the whole Byte This thing. I have to re-find the video though.*


I think I know which one you're talking about. Damn is he awesome here.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

rjsbx1 said:


> *:mark: I know, right? The best part about it was everything he said was complete truth. "You're only here because your girlfriend fell in love with a main eventer." :lmao :lmao
> 
> There's another segment/interview before Hardy's return where Grisham asks Edge about a match with Kane and he just GOES OFF on MH for the whole Byte This thing. I have to re-find the video though.*


Please re-find it. :mark:

Edit: Nvm.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

Again, another pretty good match. I thought the suplexes/back suplexes were a bit repetitive at times but I don't mind it, it added to the competitive-ness of the match. All of them were good.

JeriGOAT, doe.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Hate that triple threat match from WM 2000 lol.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> I think I know which one you're talking about. Damn is he awesome here.


*YES. :agree:*

* "a bunch of little geeks behind a keyboard who've never had a relationship commenting on what we're doing with our lives." :lmao :lmao. Grisham's fucking face is priceless after Edge finishes his rant.*


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

CAL, what do you think of the Orton/RVD match? I've never seen you speak on it (or most others here, period).


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> I think I know which one you're talking about. Damn is he awesome here.


GAH-DAMN. :mark: It got pretty intense in the end.

I always loved how he went from calm to pissed in some of his promos.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Don't remember much about it at all. Haven't seen it in YEARS AND YEARS lol.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Callamus said:


> Don't remember much about it at all. Haven't seen it in YEARS AND YEARS lol.


Well then, MAKE IT A PRIORITY! 

I'd probably put it in top 10 RVD singles matches in WWE. Only other matches off the top of my head I'd put above it are Eddie (Backlash & ladder), Benoit (SS and _maybe_ Raw 02), Orton (Armageddon), Taker (Vengeance) and maybe Edge (Vengeance).

_(haven't watched Taker/JBL from 28/7/05 in about a year, so this will be next on my list now.)_


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Saying it's a top 10 RVD match doesn't make me wanna rush out and see it . It's like saying a Khali match is a top 10 Khali match so go watch it now!!!


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I know you hate RVD, but surely there are at least 10 matches of his you like?  Comparing him to Khali is a bit extreme (no pun intended), don't ya think?


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*Boo! RVD. Booooo. But as far as favorite singles match: Ladder match with Christian on 2003 RAW. 


BTW: RIP Mad Dog Vachon.  *


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

> It looks like WWE have a new World Championship Wrestling themed DVD in the works!
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...tiveASIN=B00GSTHC1M&linkCode=as2&tag=wdn0d-20
> 
> ...


-- Wrestling DVD News


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Can't wait to see how they fuck up another WCW release!!!


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*One disc dedicated to our favorite horseman: Mongo! 

ALL THE MONGO MATCHES. :mark:*


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Willing to take a couple of match requests if i have them


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Well, I don't suppose you nor anyone else has the 20/01/1987 Windham/Flair TV match? I've been looking for it everywhere and I honestly don't feel like downloading the entire Ultimate Ric Flair Collection DVD for a single match.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Rah said:


> Well, I don't suppose you nor anyone else has the 20/01/1987 Windham/Flair TV match? I've been looking for it everywhere and I honestly don't feel like downloading the entire Ultimate Ric Flair Collection DVD for a single match.[/QUOTE}
> 
> i'll sort it out later  and upload tomorrow.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Just finished watching the 14/02/86 match, between them, and I'm utterly shocked at how spectacular it is. Some really good stuff early on into Windham's career down in Florida but this? Holy hell it's just so, so great. Kinda trying to do Windham's career/Windham project but the pack I got off PWT is rather hit or miss (zero Flair matches nor the War Games outings) so this may be harder than I thought.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I have that BOTB II match at the full ***** and imo the second greatest match to ever happen.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Willing to take a couple of match requests if i have them



Vader vs Sting SuperBrawl 3? The Strap Match?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

NP, just realised the Ultimate Ric Flair set is 10 years old and remains one of the GOAT DVD sets. 

Sure Cactus, I'll upload that tomorrow too


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


> NP, just realised the Ultimate Ric Flair set is 10 years old and remains one of the GOAT DVD sets.
> 
> Sure Cactus, I'll upload that tomorrow too



Excellent thank you sir.


Yes that Flair set owns, it has the following:

Flair vs Windham
Flair vs Steamboat New Orleans (one of the top 5 matches ever)
Flair vs Steamboat WrestleWar (one of the top 15 matches ever)
Flair vs Funk I Quit (one of the top 10 matches ever)
1992 Royal Rumble Match (greatest Rumble ever)
Flair vs Sting Clash 1994
Flair vs Triple H Greenville Raw 

Plus a TON of Flairs GOAT level promos. I think that set gets played more than any set I have other than Viva La Raza Legacy of Eddie.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Is it wrong that I just practiced my Ziggler ass shake for about 7 minutes? :ziggler3

About to watch SummerSlam 2000 because I got it in my anthology but I haven't watched it since getting the set


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Its wrong that you told us about it yeah


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Just wanted you to get a mental image :vince5

Considering skipping to the GOAT triple threat :troll :kurt :trips2 :rock


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

PGSucks said:


> Is it wrong that I just practiced my Ziggler ass shake for about 7 minutes? :ziggler3
> 
> About to watch SummerSlam 2000 because I got it in my anthology but I haven't watched it since getting the set


*DAT TLC I and DAT Jericho/Benoit :mark: :mark:*


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Speaking of Triple Threats, I saw some people put Taker/Rock/Angle over Benoit/HBK/HHH II (not I, but still). Imo while it is phenomenal, doesn't quite reach that level.


----------



## thevaliumkid (Jan 9, 2012)

Sorry in advance if this is the wrong thread, but im halfway through watching the new history of dvd, and i haver to say im disappointed, it feels like they did a great job of building up the early years, but the attitude era onwards seems really brief, anyone agree?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I had the V02 match over WM XX for a long time.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

So, watching 1998 RAW episodes and Kai En Tai are getting consistent air time and Val Venis also made his debut in the 5/18/98 RAW episode. When's the infamous 'Choppy choppy your pee pee' segment :vince


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

So I finished the History of WWE documentary now. Sucks that the RA era was pretty much skipped over other than them going over Cena, Batista, Orton and Edge's first title wins. If you look closely, Benoit's hair makes an appearance as will the blue lights for his entrance. :lol


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

BENOIT'S HAIR :mark: :mark:

That vs. Punk's diet soda = GOAT WM Main Event ever.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*Benoit's hair?! + the light from his entrance?!

:vince2 giving the fans what the want. If we're lucky, next time we'll get a 1 second glance over shot of his forehead. :mark:*


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

*Chris Jericho (c) vs. John Cena - World Heavyweight Championship - WWE Survivor Series 2008: *****

It's John Cena's return match after his neck injury at Summerslam and he's doing it in his hometown of Boston. The story of the match is whether or not Cena's neck was going to be a factor and it was done well starting when Jericho hit a shoulder block on Cena and Cena landed on his head and went out to regroup. Another story being told was whether or not Cena had ring rust due to his injury. That was done well with Cena going up to do his top rope leg drop but went against it, showing indifference. Jericho does a great job in his role by being the aggressive heel, continuously working on Cena's neck from kicks, strikes, throwing him to the steel steps, twisting his neck, and full nelsons. Whenever Cena tries to muster up some offense, Jericho quickly stops him. Cena comes back and it turns into a good ol' back in forth match until Jericho applies the Liontamer, working on Cena's neck hard. The match escalates to the top rope with Cena doing his patented top rope leg drop, showing he has regained his confidence. That was stopped with a Jericho clothesline and he gets cocky by yelling at Cena to get up so he could punish him more. That gets the best of Jericho when Cena counters into the STFU. Jericho tries to counter and goes for the small package but Cena uses his power to pick him up and deliver the FU for the victory. Overall, great match with great storytelling.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

They should have a 30-Man Royal Rumble with:

Chris Benoit's hair, Edge's theme song, CM Punk's diet soda, Daniel Bryan's beard, Rey Mysterio's Batman suit, Jeff Hardy's facepaint, Hulk Hogan's headband, RVD's MITB briefcase, Stacy Keibler's lingerie, The Original Sheik's fireball, Mr. Perfect's towel, Jake Roberts' Damien the python, Koko B. Ware's bird, GOD's light, Katie Vick, Kane's mask, Michael Cole's ring attire, YOSHIHIKO, Andre The Giant's ghost, The Little Boogeyman and 10 different John Cena attires.

NOW THAT'S WHAT I CALL A MATCH. :vince


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

rjsbx1 said:


> *Benoit's hair?! + the light from his entrance?!
> 
> :vince2 giving the fans what the want. If we're lucky, next time we'll get a 1 second glance over shot of his forehead. :mark:*



I just picked up the Blu Ray of the History of the WWE for $22 from Best buy (I had a gift card) so I'm kinda stoked for this. The match selection positively blows, but it'll be nice to have Punk/Cena raw on blu Ray I guess. If you think about it, Benoit WAS the Ruthless Aggression era. Angle, Eddie, and Brock were definitely part of it, but he embodied it. They couldn't cover it in detail without talking about him, so maybe it's better they glossed over it. It's still my favorite era from a ring work stand point, although the grittiness and "real ness" of the 80s for lack of a better word is what I think wrestling should be about.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit's hair should become the next internet meme.



rjsbx1 said:


> *Benoit's hair?! + the light from his entrance?!
> 
> :vince2 giving the fans what the want. If we're lucky, next time we'll get a 1 second glance over shot of his forehead. :mark:*


Until we finally see the full body. :mark:

But I forgot to mention he's also briefly seen as part of the Raw roster from the 2004 draft episode standing next to HBK with the World Title in the far left corner.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

ATF said:


> They should have a 30-Man Royal Rumble with:
> 
> Chris Benoit's hair, Edge's theme song, CM Punk's diet soda, Daniel Bryan's beard, Rey Mysterio's Batman suit, Jeff Hardy's facepaint, Hulk Hogan's headband, RVD's MITB briefcase, Stacy Keibler's lingerie, The Original Sheik's fireball, Mr. Perfect's towel, Jake Roberts' Damien the python, Koko B. Ware's bird, GOD's light, Katie Vick, Kane's mask, Michael Cole's ring attire, YOSHIHIKO, Andre The Giant's ghost, The Little Boogeyman and 10 different John Cena attires.
> 
> NOW THAT'S WHAT I CALL A MATCH. :vince


*Add Eugene's nametag, Taker's Phantom of the Opera Mask and Otunga's GOAT coffee mug.

5 STAR CLASSIC RIGHT DERE.*


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

@rjsbx1, I would but the 30 spots are already in. Unless some of the 10 Cena attires would go down at 2 and let go of the spotlight 8*D 

This is what the next big WWE meme should read:

_Chris Benoit's hair shows up in History of WWE DVD

That's more epic than him (NOT) being in HBK's WM DVD_

Vince, can we just admit that including him in your DVD's and stuff is NOT glorifying him at all?


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I'm free for the rest of the night and I need something/somebody to watch. Any suggestions? The more obscure the event or less talked about the worker, the better, maybe. I don't know. I just don't exactly want "Wrestlemania 19, Chris Benoit, Extreme Rules 2012, Daniel Bryan" because I've seen all that there is to see in terms of the must see shows/superstars. In other words: UNDERRATED WORKERS/SHOWS FOR ME TO WATCH?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Have you seen SURVIVOR SERIES 1988? If not, you haven't seen ALL of the true great shows dude.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Vengeance 2002 is a very fun show. I liked the opener more than most, The cruiserweight match and Booker/Show are decent as well as the Hogan/edge vs Christian/Storm. But Brock/RVD and the ME triple threat are :mark:

NYR 05 review should be up tonight, expect a RR 05 review tomorrow!


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*New Year’s Revolution 2005 review​*

Alright, here we go, let’s kick this project off with a bang! Apparently this show is in Puerto Rico? Wow that’s pretty cool, have they done a PPV there since? Doubt it, should be a fun crowd though. 

Match #1: Christian and Tyson Tomko vs William Regal and Eugene

Christian has that bossy entrance music going, love that stuff. I don’t think I have ever seen a Eugene match TBH, but this should be pretty fun, I’m a fan of Christian and Regal, and don’t remember enough about Tomko and Eugene in ring wise to accurately judge their skills. This Worked perfectly fine as an opener, and was quite fun TBH. I was pleasantly surprised at the moments where Tomko and Eugene we’re fighting, Eugene is an awesome comedy character and I liked Tomko as a powerhouse bodyguard for Christian. Really good mat wrestling from Christian and Regal and awesome brawling from Tomko and Eugene gets the crowd hot for the PPV, check this out. ***

CAL SCALE: 2

Match #2: Lita vs Trish Stratus

It might be bearable, but I’m not in the mood. NO 

CAL SCALE: -1

Match #3: Shelton Benjamin vs Maven 

 for Shelton Benjamin,  for Maven. This has the possibility of being a fun match still. Maven cuts a fun promo before the match but it goes WAY too long unfortunately, but it sure as hell got him some heat. I get ready for some bad wrestling but a rollup wins the match within seconds. Then some more promos by Maven but he begs for the match to restart, it apparently does. One more move and then the match is done. A little overbooked, but it was quite comical. *1/4 
CAL SCALE: 0.5

Match #4: Muhammad Hassan vs Jerry Lawler

When I reviewed KOTR 96 earlier this year, I noted that the king was WAY too old to be wrestling. Now, 9 fucking years later, HES STILL WRESTLING. Not expecting much at all here, mainly because of king and the fact I haven’t seen a lot. First thing, did the commentary need to be removed because of JR at ringside? I hate watching shit without commentary, at least put coach or Grisham there, it makes the match feel boring because it wasn’t very good at all. This was fucking terrible TBH, terrible terrible match. DUD

CAL SCALE: 0

Match # 5: Kane vs Snitsky

Expecting a solid brawl here! Hopefully it’s short so we can get to dat MAIN EVENT! This was a fine match, clearly not the most technical match ever but it worked fine as a filler match. It was a good brawl and although the lita pregnancy storyline was god awful it didn’t really make the match any shorter. This was fine though, nothing special at all however. I would check it out only if you were watching this whole show, as it is certainly watchable. **1/4

CAL SCALE: 1

Match #6: Edge vs Chris Benoit vs Chris Jericho vs Triple H vs Batista vs Randy Orton

I’ve seen this once before, and it’s the GOAT EC match IMO, I remember it being so fucking awesome. It also seems to get overlooked a little bit because most people think the original is the GOAT EC match, because of the HBK win I guess. Speaking of HBK, he is the special referee here, would have been better with him in it, but everyone was necessary in this match, and it did help him advance his feud with Edge. Benoit and Jericho start, which is awesome because its BENOIT and Jericho. This is like, the best opening segment of an EC match ever, its usually VERY Dull, but I enjoyed it a lot, as they let everything out! 

Haitch is in next, which is a fun thing, because he seems to be on tonight, and he has a VERY good track record in EC matches, as he hasn’t had a terrible performance in one IIRC. Some awesome brawling continues until Edge. Orton is out at 5 but right before Jericho took one STIFF pedigree, some bossy selling with some blood. Orton obviously goes to haitch first and I love how multiple feuds are injected into this plus the brewing of a Batista/haitch feud, great booking. Benoit takes a fucking awesome RKO, legit crippler crossface into the RKO! Edge then spears HBK but he comes back with a sweet chin music! Edge is out! After that Benoit goes up to the top of the pod, then hits a headbutt! What a match! Moments later Jericho has haitch in the walls but Tista Is released! The animal is out! 

Batista literally destroys everyone but haitch, even the cameraman! Soon after Tista powerbombs Benoit WITH Jericho, and now Benoit its out. They are really booking batista strong here, and you could tell that he was gonna be a future star! Moments later is a Batista Bomb on Jericho and its down to Tista, Haitch, and Orton, and this is legit BETTER on the rewatch. Batista and Trips legit start beating down on Orton, and it looks over. BUT WAIT! RKO! Batista’s eliminated and its down to Orton and Trips. The ending came with a pedigree on Orton after a beatdown attempt by evolution. Trips is still the WHC! 

Kind of an anti-climatic ending, which is unfortunate because the rest of the match is the exact opposite, the ending is the only reason this isn’t getting the full 5, but its still a MOTYC and easily the GOAT chamber match! ****1/2 

CAL SCALE: 7
*
FINAL CAL SCALE: 9.5 *

Complete one match show, the opener is alright but the ME is absolutely steller, a must see 

*CURRENT 2005 MOTY: Edge vs Chris Benoit vs Chris Jericho vs Triple H vs Batista vs Randy Orton( NYR)*

*CURRENT 2005 PPV Rankings

1: New Years Revolution(9.5)*​


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

FLUX said:


> I'm free for the rest of the night and I need something/somebody to watch. Any suggestions? The more obscure the event or less talked about the worker, the better, maybe. I don't know. I just don't exactly want "Wrestlemania 19, Chris Benoit, Extreme Rules 2012, Daniel Bryan" because I've seen all that there is to see in terms of the must see shows/superstars. In other words: UNDERRATED WORKERS/SHOWS FOR ME TO WATCH?


I recommend watching Andre the Giant vs Stan Hansen from NJPW 5/18/79. It's brutal as fuck and I love the story of the match with Hansen trying to take Andre down with stiff offense but Andre overpowering him being the giant that he is.

As a matter of fact, watch anything involving Stan Hansen, most specifically in AJPW.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

FLUX said:


> I'm free for the rest of the night and I need something/somebody to watch. Any suggestions? The more obscure the event or less talked about the worker, the better, maybe. I don't know. I just don't exactly want "Wrestlemania 19, Chris Benoit, Extreme Rules 2012, Daniel Bryan" because I've seen all that there is to see in terms of the must see shows/superstars. In other words: UNDERRATED WORKERS/SHOWS FOR ME TO WATCH?


I'll say it again. Wrestle War 1992. Why? Because Arn, Austin, Rude, Steamboat, Windham, Fujinami, Pillman, Badd and Raven before he was Raven.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

rjsbx1 said:


> *Benoit's hair?! + the light from his entrance?!
> 
> :vince2 giving the fans what the want. If we're lucky, next time we'll get a 1 second glance over shot of his forehead. :mark:*





SLIM SHADY LP™ said:


> I recommend watching Andre the Giant vs Stan Hansen from NJPW 5/18/79. It's brutal as fuck and I love the story of the match with Hansen trying to take Andre down with stiff offense but Andre overpowering him being the giant that he is.
> 
> As a matter of fact, watch anything involving Stan Hansen, most specifically in AJPW.



This man knows what he's talking about. Stan Hansen is a complete BOSS. I was ignorant to this mans great work up until a year ago, and I hate myself most days for it. He has some AMAZING tags with Bruiser Brody. Check the ones vs Race and Slater and the Funks. Hansen was like a more bad ass cowboy version of Sheamus with JBL's mean streak, only meaner. If that makes any sense at all.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

NYR 05 Chamber ****3/4


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Callamus said:


> Some more Raw 04 matches:
> 
> Chris Benoit Vs Shawn Michaels - Raw February 16th 2004
> 
> ...


:mark:

Wished I could see the other Benoit vs Flair match. It may be on youtube in less than omg quality. Watched their match from 8/30 yesterday and clearly it was fun for the allotted time.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Good work smitty. That chamber match is one of those matches I can watch over and over. At the end when Orton hits the RKO on Batista, and Trips makes like he's going to make the save, but changes his mind, keeping the world title out of Big Dave's hands, keeping it for himself. Love it. 

I know you're only through the first show, but that match will likely end up in your top 3-4 PPV matches from that year. 

Don't know if you've seen Trips/Batista HIAC from that year, but it's terrific. Another top 3 match from that year, and a top 3 cell match for me. 

I'm planning to rewatch a bunch of matches to form a best of 2013 at the end of the year, and I need a little help remembering what to watch. Here's what I've got off the top of my head:

Punk/Cena Raw 2/25
Punk/Jericho Raw (didn't this happen? Forgot the date)
Punk/Taker WM 29
Brock/Hunter WM 29
Brock/Hunter Extreme Rules
Shield/Super Friends Elimination Chamber
Shield/Orton-Sheamus-Show WM 29
Shield/Hell No and Taker Raw London
Shield/Hell No and Kofi Raw 
Cesaro/Zayn NXT
Shield/CodyDust Battleground
Bryan/Cesaro Raw Gauntlet Match
Punk/Lesnar Summerslam
Bryan/Cena Summerslam
Christian/Del Rio
Jericho/RVD Raw (post MITB or the following week)

Don't if I left out any important Shield matches or whatever.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I actually haven't seen the Trips/Batista HIAC match, REALLY looking forward to it


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's kind of amazing how great it is. Batista wasn't any good & Triple H is, yeah. Out of nowhere the match clicked on all cylinders. Not only to be good, but more than such. It's still one of the most well received HIAC matches around.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah, their WM and BL matches are nothing special right? I havent seen those either. 

BTW- is JBL/Cena WM as bad as some say


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Mania and Backlash matches are both forgettable, unfortunately. Actually both world title matches at Mania 21 weren't much to see, in my opinon.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah, I've never liked their WM & Backlash matches. Severely mediocre at best.

Cena vs JBL is as bad as most say. Literal DUD. Watching it live it was hard to even process Cena had "made it" b/c the match & finish were so flat.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

I love the slow turn of Batista, great foreshadowing and exactly how it should have been done in my book


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The best part of that EC match is that it combines two feuds and the bossy foreshadowing with Batista

Batista was a beast in that match :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

It's strange how one half of Mania 21 is rather underwhelming if not poor but the show still delivers as a pretty fun PPV. That's the power of the first MITB. :mark: (wont give it _all_ the credit, but it's MOTN unless Kurt/Shawn holds up on rewatch)



SaviorBeeRad™ said:


> I love the slow turn of Batista, great foreshadowing and exactly how it should have been done in my book


Yeah, it was done properly and they didn't fuck it up like the rushed Orton turn.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Theres also the GOAT sumo match right!?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Batista's face turn was so good that he lived off the momentum of that longer than anyone ever had from a turn. Man did they do a great job with that or what? I used to really like the Backlash HHH/Batista match, but after I noticed Batista's blatant no-sell in my most recent watch, I could not take the match seriously. And then Cena/JBL from Judgment Day did not hold up as a classic for me. I just can't stand the first half of it. Ah dammit, it's happening again. I'm looking at 2005 positively now. I guess I'll admit that it was a good year and better than 2012, but I can't say that it was better than 2000-2004, and I still prefer 2008, 2011, and 2013.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

When Batista did the thumbs down :mark:

I've seen the Batista/HHH WM match and I thought it was good. I have not seen the Backlash and HIAC match though. I heard the HIAC was awesome so I may check it out in the near future.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Whats the good shit in 2008? Don't remember much besides HBK/Jericho?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

2008 also had Undertaker/Edge (which also kinda sucked but gave us two classics), Undertaker/Big Show, HHH/Hardy, Mark Henry as ECW Champion, Cena/Jericho, Cena/Batista, Michaels/Batista, Flair/Michaels, the best part of the Age of Orton, CM Punk winning the WHC (despite having an awful reign), lots of good PPVs, THE BRIAN KENDRICK, and Jeff Hardy winning the WWE championship for the first time ever.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

The Brian Kendrick was WWE Champion at one point. NEVER FORGET.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Just watched Benoit vs Angle from WM for the first time in over 2 years. Held up fine but is nothing extraordinary or any of that. Nice mat wrestling that gets more physical and suplex heavy as it goes on before the inevitable submission counters. ★★★½-¾.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Batista's face turn was so good that he lived off the momentum of that longer than anyone ever had from a turn. Man did they do a great job with that or what? I used to really like the Backlash HHH/Batista match, but after I noticed Batista's blatant no-sell in my most recent watch, I could not take the match seriously. And then Cena/JBL from Judgment Day did not hold up as a classic for me. I just can't stand the first half of it. Ah dammit, it's happening again. I'm looking at 2005 positively now. I guess I'll admit that it was a good year and better than 2012, but I can't say that it was better than 2000-2004, and I still prefer 2008, 2011, and 2013.


Why so much hate for 2005? None of it makes any sense unless it was a shitty year for you personally!

And it's hardly a bad thing to not be as good as 2000-2004.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

THE BRIAN KENDRICK? lol I gotta admit I marked for Hardy winning the title I should download some 2008 PPVs soon


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> Why so much hate for 2005? None of it makes any sense unless it was a shitty year for you personally!
> 
> And it's hardly a bad thing to not be as good as 2000-2004.


2005's a damn good year. The Undertaker/Randy Orton feud, The Rise of Batista and Cena, and some damn good matches made it great imo.

The only thing that made 2005 bad was Eddie's passing


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Why so much hate for 2005? None of it makes any sense unless it was a shitty year for you personally!
> 
> And it's hardly a bad thing to not be as good as 2000-2004.


Honestly, the hate is starting to decrease the more I think about all the good feuds from that year. I just did not like the title scene from that year, especially during Cena's and Batista's reigns of doom. It was also the first year that I ever watched wrestling where I only liked a couple of faces. I also don't like a lot of the PPVs that others here like, such as Royal Rumble and No Mercy. A lot of my favorites at the time were also demoted (Benoit), left (Jericho, Christian, Hassan), regressed (Angle), or worse (Eddie). Finally, I didn't enjoy the television shows as a whole. I know I am being very unfair about that year, but it just wasn't fun, especially since Ring of Honor was putting on the greatest wrestling shows ever during that same period.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Oh yeah, 2008 WWE title scramble match was pretty fun. Kendrick being champ for a minute :lol


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

It's definitely not a perfect year and the World Title scene was complete bullshit (JBL feud sucked and went on for an eternity) but overall, there's enough great feuds and matches to make it one of the last great years for the company. You should probably rewatch the whole thing to get rid of the bad memories considering how much worse you've seen it get in some of the past years.

It sucks that Benoit was not a politician, though. His contract was gonna end right after Eddie's death but he agreed to stay when they had him do the "Best of Seven" with Booker. Like, he agreed to stay for _this_ shit? He should've demanded another run with the World Title and no doubt they would've accepted since he was a valuable veteran. Fuck WWE and their stupid "push" involving the US Title.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Benoit should've had another world title reign.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

StraightEdgeJesus said:


> 2005's a damn good year. The Undertaker/Randy Orton feud, The Rise of Batista and Cena, and some damn good matches made it great imo.
> 
> The only thing that made 2005 bad was Eddie's passing



True, but Eddie had his greatest feud ever from a ring work and character work stand point with Rey before going out. I like to consider from WrestleMania 21 to that final cage match in September Eddies Magnum Opus to us wrestling fans.

I think it's funny 2005 has been a constant source of conversation in this thread the past 2 weeks, I just got the entire year on PPV in a set, Smitty did as well, and I guess Cal completed his collection. It's the last year I would term all around GREAT for WWE. We still had plenty of solid to very good years, but 2005 was the last year I liked almost everything about.

Cena vs JBL Judgement Day really held up on my most recent rewatch. I enjoyed just about everything from it, I wish they had that match at WrestleMania. With as poor as Cena was in the ring at that point, he needed to have an all out war with JBL to make it a great match. I think in the area of ****-****1/4 seems fair. I think it was Cena's best match until he squared off with Umaga at the Royal Rumble.

Anyone gonna watch SVS live? I wanna see Punk/Bryan vs The Wyatt's and the Rhodes Tag. But really couldn't care less for Cena/ADR and Show/Orton, which is sad.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

StraightEdgeJesus said:


> Benoit should've had another world title reign.


Even more than that, but yeah, it sucks that he was demoted permanently.



Cactus Jack said:


> Anyone gonna watch SVS live? I wanna see Punk/Bryan vs The Wyatt's and the Rhodes Tag. But really couldn't care less for Cena/ADR and Show/Orton, which is sad.


I'm actually gonna watch solely for Orton/Show. It's funny how I realize Orton is far from his best atm and still find myself excited about everything involving him. The Rhodes tag will be interesting and Cena/ADR may be alright. Couldn't care less for the Punk/Bryan match on the other hand.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> True, but Eddie had his greatest feud ever from a ring work and character work stand point with Rey before going out. I like to consider from WrestleMania 21 to that final cage match in September Eddies Magnum Opus to us wrestling fans.


That Eddie heel turn was awesome. That brainbuster to Mysterio on the steel steps was gruesome. I liked that the feud started out as Eddie being this demented soul possibly having enough of Mysterio getting the best of him in prior months, but it went to shit when they involved Rey's son. The matches were great though, I need to watch those again.

In fact, I need to watch some 2005 again. Possibly the fondest memories I had of being a wrestling fan was at that year.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

I agree, Eddie was so awesome in 2005


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I am confident that years from now, 2011 and 2013 will be remembered very fondly. Granted, the first half of 2011 was terrible, but nobody really talks about it unless if they are coerced about Wrestlemania. There's just too much love from the general populace for Henry and Punk for it to be looked upon poorly, and people tend to only remember the good and forget the past. 2013 will be remembered for being a candidate for best in-ring year in company history, and it has had its fair share of great feuds.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

To me, 2011 was a good year mainly for The Summer of Punk

2013 is great in-ring wise. The Shield, Daniel Bryan, Antonio Cesaro, and Sami Zayn made every match they're in the match of the night.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I think people have mentioned that the proposed plan for WM 21 was Brock/Trips, which is interesting because Brock left a year prior. Would they have seriously had that planned out a year ahead, with the two nowhere near each other in late 2003-early 2004? I guess they would have flipped Brock back face again. Face Brock vs Heel Trips in 2005 would have been so terrific.

I still think that Cena would have risen to where he is even if Brock had stayed. Brock could never do the things that Cena does with all appearances. Brock's disdain for travel aside, he just doesn't come off as the people person that WWE needs in their top face.

So many what ifs.

Also, yeah, early 2011 pretty much blows, but Christian/Orton had great matches between post-Extreme Rules and Summerslam, then Punk was doing his thing in the MITB build, and so on. Trips should have turned heel then, but I won't get into that now.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I already look at 2011 fondly (personal reasons as well got back into grapplin that year) from mitb-on was :mark:

-Punk :mark: ( as soon as that static hit :mark:, the original BITW shirt :mark
-henry hall of pain
- christian/orton
-punk/cena
-ziggler was the young heel obnoxious show-off
-masked Cody

and much more


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Brock vs Trips back then would've definitely been :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I find 2011 overrated outside of HALL OF PAIN and the Christian/Orton series. I enjoyed Summer of Punk at the time but when I rewatched some of it with the smark cap removed, it was pretty overhyped stuff and blown out of proportion just because it was so unlike anything else we had seen in quite a while. In fact, I'd take R-Truth's heel promos from the months preceding it because they were entertaining beyond an internet darling whining. Oh and ROCK's return will always be legendary, I was still new into wrestling at the time and read up on Rock's wikipedia and saw that he had not appeared in years. But somehow, I had this gut feeling that he will return soon and a week later, I came home to watch Raw and there he was hosting WM. I got chills from that pop and the promo.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I'll never forget thinking "Oh, guest host of Mania? Fuck that." Then Rock's music hit and he cuts that promo, which fucking loved at the time. It's still good, but that was a crazy night. Then Taker and Trips returned the next week. :mark:


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Oh shit how could I forget about the Orton/Christian matches. Those were amazing to watch even though the feud was one-sided as hell.

My Orton/Christian rankings:

1. Over the Limit: ****1/2
2. Summerslam - No Holds Barred: ****1/4
3. Smackdown 5/6/11: ***3/4
4. Steel Cage match: ***3/4
5. Money in the Bank: ***1/4
6. Capital Punishment: ***


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Orton/Christian made sure Capitol Punishment wasn't the worst PPV of all time.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

That first pop for Rocky was nuts


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Orton/Christian made sure Capitol Punishment wasn't the worst PPV of all time.


That and Punk vs. Mysterio. That match was match of the night.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Good call. Most of that show I've blocked from my mind.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> I'll never forget thinking "Oh, guest host of Mania? Fuck that." Then Rock's music hit and he cuts that promo, which fucking loved at the time. It's still good, but that was a crazy night. Then Taker and Trips returned the next week. :mark:


The big pop that you guys are talking about...was that him returning at Wrestlemania, or was it that taped promo he did on RAW about Cena ("I'm not a rapper, and _clearly_ neither are you...)?


ETA: Thanks, C2D. Yeah, that was a huge pop. Who was that lady at the beginning of that clip?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> The big pop that you guys are talking about...was that him returning at Wrestlemania, or was it that taped promo he did on RAW about Cena ("I'm not a rapper, and _clearly_] neither are you...)?


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

FLUX said:


> I'm free for the rest of the night and I need something/somebody to watch. Any suggestions? The more obscure the event or less talked about the worker, the better, maybe. I don't know. I just don't exactly want "Wrestlemania 19, Chris Benoit, Extreme Rules 2012, Daniel Bryan" because I've seen all that there is to see in terms of the must see shows/superstars. In other words: UNDERRATED WORKERS/SHOWS FOR ME TO WATCH?


I don't have any underrated shows or workers for you to watch but definitely an underrated match.

Johnny Nitro vs. Shelton Benjamin vs. Carlito from Vengeance 2006. I'd say it's a pretty good match. All three of them shined in their own way, well, mostly Shelton & Carlito.

Although Melina's screaming in the match is annoying, as usual in all of Nitro's matches back then. :side: I'm not proud to say that I've experienced that screeching live.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

FLUX said:


> I'm free for the rest of the night and I need something/somebody to watch. Any suggestions? The more obscure the event or less talked about the worker, the better, maybe. I don't know. I just don't exactly want "Wrestlemania 19, Chris Benoit, Extreme Rules 2012, Daniel Bryan" because I've seen all that there is to see in terms of the must see shows/superstars. In other words: UNDERRATED WORKERS/SHOWS FOR ME TO WATCH?


I have no idea if you're still free but watch some Mike Enos.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Batista's face turn was so good that he lived off the momentum of that longer than anyone ever had from a turn. Man did they do a great job with that or what? I used to really like the Backlash HHH/Batista match, but after I noticed Batista's blatant no-sell in my most recent watch, I could not take the match seriously. And then Cena/JBL from Judgment Day did not hold up as a classic for me. I just can't stand the first half of it. Ah dammit, it's happening again. I'm looking at 2005 positively now. I guess I'll admit that it was a good year and better than 2012, but I can't say that it was better than 2000-2004, and I still prefer 2008, 2011, and 2013.


Batista was so bad, but apparently they were adamant on pushing him so out of the blue he was throttled to the top despite no significant improvement in his game. That didn't even come till he worked vs Undertaker. And still to this day, that fact blows our minds. There was a reason that match was put in the middle of the card. More than b/c Vince had his battle of the billionaires thingy to be closer at the end. b/c the faith in Batista was a little iffy for "quality" terms. Which sucks thanks to the moment it had with Undertaker finally winning a major strap after a long period without it. WM 24 they tried to make up for it. Didn't feel the same since it was obvious as holy hell he'd defeat Edge. Most didn't even expect that match to end the show, tbf. I went off into a few other tangents there...point being, Batista sucks & his push wasn't an aspect of 2005 I actually cared for. Probably the only glaring aspect on the year for me considering the rest clicked.

Def prefer it over 2008, 2011, & 2013. Wrestling back then was entertaining to me. A lot in those three years listed haven't done much for me pardon a few characters/workers. Although I've warmed up a bit more on 2008, actually, thanks to going back and reliving the goods on TV. Guess I'll nix that out for a fair chance.


----------



## The Streak (Apr 5, 2009)

History of WWE was the standard WWE wank-fest I was expecting. Not that good in other words.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Rah said:


> Well, I don't suppose you nor anyone else has the 20/01/1987 Windham/Flair TV match? I've been looking for it everywhere and I honestly don't feel like downloading the entire Ultimate Ric Flair Collection DVD for a single match.


*Ric Flair vs Barry Windham - 20.01.1987 - NWA World Wide Wrestling
*
NWA World Championship Match

'From the Official Ultimate Ric Flair Collection DVD Set'

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/nwa-w...dham-20-01-1987-nwa-world-wide-wrestling.html



Cactus Jack said:


> Vader vs Sting SuperBrawl 3? The Strap Match?


*Sting vs Vader - WCW Superbrawl III*

'Strap Match'

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/nwa-wcw-media/1031993-sting-vs-vader-wcw-superbrawl-iii.html


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Watching SD right now, Real Americans vs Rhodes Bros is really good. Finish kinda came out nowhere but still lots of good stuff.

6 man was really fun. Rey did his thing and Reigns killed the Usos at the end.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

WHITE CASTLE OF FEAR


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


> *Ric Flair vs Barry Windham - 20.01.1987 - NWA World Wide Wrestling
> *
> NWA World Championship Match
> 
> ...



You're a gentleman and a scholar, thank you. I have all the other BIG Sting vs Vader Matches on DVD except for that one, I've been wanting to rewatch it forever.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yay. On a whim I wanted to see if Mark Henry vs Viscera from No Way Out 2000 brought the BEEF in good quality & it did. Henry bumps around like a champ, Vis kicks Henry in the face like a fucking prick, & there were body slams + Mae Young comedy to boot.

:lenny


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So when I get home I'll watch RR 2005 and review. MAYBE NWO too 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Did ya knew that El Torito wrestled before? He had a couple of matches, one at IYH Ground Zero, that is. That was one of the best comedy matches I've seen btw


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

El Torito from 1997 is a different worker. Current El Torito is Mascarita Dorada.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Which is why I edited. :side:

Anyways, as part of an ongoing thing for me, I watched GZ, and Max/Torito was quite fun.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The one from Badd Blood isn't as good, but the hilarity from King freaking out that people so small can wrestle is priceless. Trios from Rumble '98 was always one of my favorite matches as a kid purely thanks to the comedy King brought. _(also b/c Minis own)_


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

After watching IYH Judgment Day, I cannot believe I was apathetic to the existance of Mankind/Shamrock. Best Shamrock singles match ever by far imo. Mick fucking Foley is a *GOD.* Goldust/Venis, X-Pac/D'Lo and Christian/TAKA only add to one of the most shockingly decent PPV's I've ever watched.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Better than Shamrock/VADER?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yes, better than even Vader/Shamrock. Not joking. At least imo.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I have to witness this.

Shamrock vs Undertaker owns a lot too.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I *think* I remember the match...



Spoiler: did it end like this?



Mankind putting the Mandible Claw on himself while Shamrock has him in the Ankle Lock so when he lost it would be to HIS MOVE and not Shamrock? 



Either way, I don't remember it being on the level of the VADER match, but I could probably FAP to that match .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Remember zilch from Judgment Day. Blank event from 1998. 

Breakdown is vivid. Cage match, in regards, and all.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yes, exactly that match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Triple threat cage is a ton of fun. Shamrock might not have been dishing out classics night after night but I enjoyed a great deal of his matches that I've seen (mainly PPV ones).


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> I *think* I remember the match...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That's the one I've seen and it's absolutely awesome. I'm not certain it's better than the Vader match but it's on par. Believe it's on the IYH set actually. They had 4 Foley matches on the IYH set, which was :yum:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'll definitely give it a watch at some point soon. Maybe tonight. *goes link hunting*.

Tried watching Shamrock/Undertaker the other night, and even I was struggling to get through it. I like MMA, I like Shamrock, I slightly enjoy that Undertaker dude... but yeah, wasn't clicking for me. Shockingly DEAD crowd didn't help either lol. I don't blame them for not giving a fuck tbh. Hardly anything happened for the first 10 minutes that I saw other than some punches at the start and then Shamrock repeatedly going for the knee lock .


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I can't remember anything from Judgement 1998 other than Christian/TAKA, which I thought was great. TAKA needs so much more loving, the guy was fun as hell.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I've tried to forget most of 98 (and 99 lol) PPV's . Other than a handful of matches everything was just wank.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

taka/hhh raw :lenny

Only one GOD in the sport of Professional Wrestling as far as I'm concerned :flair3


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

For those wondering, I do respect the fuck out of Vader/Shamrock. It was the precursor to stuff like Cena/Lesnar, and quite the beautiful fight. But Mankind/Shamrock in pure psychology terms edges out many, many good stuff easily. The action was awesome, stiff and senseful, the role-play was very good, the Chicago crowd the same, the booking was excellent, the ending was absolutely fap-worthy. Just :clap stuff.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

You guys know about this?



Spoiler: New DVD



- According to Amazon and WrestlingDVDNews.com, a new eight-hour DVD set on WCW pay-per-view matches will be released in March 2014. More details should be released soon.
Read more at http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news...sing-over-tna-last-night/#53CbpFobz8trHE6q.99


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> You guys know about this?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


There isn't much known. Article on sites haven't given much information besides the release date being in March 2014, and it will be based around WCW's PPV's.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Just about to watch Mankind/Shamrock. :lmao at Mankind's promo before the match. Greatness.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well, the promo before the match was the best part . Whole thing was kinda dull tbh. Liked the finish still.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Breakdown cage is so much fun. That match was The Rock show. Crowd worshipped him. Shane that the other triple threat on that card was an embarrassment to wrestling.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

We should have a Shamrock talk in this thread now like it usually happens with HHH. His best match is the Naoki Sano classic from 1991 and it smokes every HHH match that could ever possibly happen. I really liked those lion's dens, too. I got amped as FUCK when I found out Ken had a lion's den with Vince only to find out it never really happens. That is just bullshit.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> We should have a Shamrock talk in this thread now like it usually happens with HHH. His best match is the Naoki Sano classic from 1991 and it smokes every HHH match that could ever possibly happen. I really liked those lion's dens, too. I got amped as FUCK when I found out Ken had a lion's den with Vince only to find out it never really happens. That is just bullshit.


I was actually reading about that Shamrock/Sano match the other day as I've only ever seen Shamrock in WWF  I'll have to give it a spin when I can.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

watching RR 05, expect a review tonight 

thoughts on this show?


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> watching RR 05, expect a review tonight
> 
> thoughts on this show?


*One of my favorite Rumble matches in general (just on sheer entertainment and DAT FINAL FOUR :mark) . A fun WWE Championship match. Quality HBK/Edge match and SNITSKY and HEIDENREICH SEGMENT :mark: . 

What's not to love? (well besides Orton-Hunter)*


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

That was the last Royal Rumble that I ordered to watch. This segment was GOLD.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah that segment was :mark:

On the casket match, sounds fucking terrible


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

First person to name me a match, I'll review


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Yeah that segment was :mark:
> 
> On the casket match, sounds fucking terrible


UNDERRATED.

There was a Shamrock/Henry match or two that I REALLY fucking dug earlier this year from RAW in 1998. I wish I had the date written down somewhere but I don't, meaning that I have to go find it again all by my lonesome .

IYH Degeneration X Vs HBK is pretty good too, never cared for Shamrock's work with Rock at all though of course .


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

SKINS25 said:


> First person to name me a match, I'll review


Edge, Mick Foley and Lita vs. Tommy Dreamer, Terry Funk and Beulah - ONS 2006

I'm just glossing over my top 10 2006 matches and this is up next, so I thought I'd throw it at you.

Edit: I might do the same later, see if I get treated as nicely as I've treated you.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> First person to name me a match, I'll review


NYR 2006 EC match, I want everyone else to share the terribleness of that mess 

Casket match was decent, nothing too special, but not as bad as I thought it would be


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Casket Match > Edge/HBK from the same night.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Agreed.

HBK/Edge isn't anything good or special at all, overhyped and overrated as anything.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

FLUX said:


> Edge, Mick Foley and Lita vs. Tommy Dreamer, Terry Funk and Beulah - ONS 2006
> 
> I'm just glossing over my top 10 2006 matches and this is up next, so I thought I'd throw it at you.
> 
> Edit: I might do the same later, see if I get treated as nicely as I've treated you.


Checking it out now, and after watching some matches this week, my MOTY of 06 would be between both orton/benoit sd



smitty915 said:


> NYR 2006 EC match, I want everyone else to share the terribleness of that mess
> 
> Casket match was decent, nothing too special, but not as bad as I thought it would be


:jt


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

SKINS25 said:


> Checking it out now, and after watching some matches this week, my MOTY of 06 would be between both orton/benoit sd
> 
> 
> :jt


As it stands, my top 3 for 2006 are:

1. The Undertaker vs. Kurt Angle - No Way Out 2006
2. Rey Mysterio vs. Randy Orton - Smackdown 7/4/06
3. Edge, Mick Foley and Lita vs. Tommy Dreamer, Terry Funk and Beulah McGillicutty - ECW One Night Stand 2006


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

My top 5 matches for 2006 would be:

Taker vs Angle - No Way Out
Benoit vs Orton - SD 27/1
Mysterio vs Orton - SD 7/4
Benoit vs Orton - SD 13/1
Benoit vs Finlay - Judgment Day


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

It was an awesome cash in but the match itself is terrible imo skins 

WWE title triple threat was awesome, not looking forward to Orton/HHH at all though TBH


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Orton/HHH RR 05 is their second best match. And one of only 3 good matches they had . ***3/4 for it.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Orton/HHH from the Rumble is one of their best matches (well, one of their three great matches together ) together, HHH's offense coupled with Orton's great selling of the concussion that is just as good as Ziggler from Payback this year (well, actually better since Orton's injury in this match looked and was played out as being legit as fuck).

I'd probably give it **** 1/4* from a stars standpoint, to be honest. The Rumble match from that year is one of my favorites though, keep both of your eyes on that one at all times because it's awesome.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Which is the third one, Cal? I know NM is first.

I'd consider their two LMS matches (non-ONS) to be their best followed by RR then there are some others in the 3 star area like Unforgiven, steel cage, London street fight, Raw 05 and first NM match. But sadly, the biggest match out of them all sucked the most.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> It was an awesome cash in but the match itself is terrible imo skins


I made the face to agree, with you didnt know if I wanted to re watch that

I guess 2006 was the actual age of rton2

1)benoit sd 1/27
2)benoit sd 1/13
3)rey sd 4/06

and the last to are escaping my mind, not really AS high as most on the angle/taker from 06


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Raw LMS is the third good HHH/Orton match. ***3/4 for that too, but I ain't not seens it in years so fook knows.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Oh I thought that was a disagreeing face, whatever. Dont watch that actually, its terrible and it sounds like you know it. 

So I have new hope for haitch/Orton now guys, it just started


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*PFTT. Edge/HBK > HHH/Orton. 

As for top 5 of '06:
1.Kurt Angle vs. Undertaker – 02.19.06
2.Chris Benoit vs. Randy Orton - NHB- 1.27.06
3. WWE Tag Team Championship Four-Way Ladder Match- 12.17.06
4. Edge vs. John Cena- TLC- 09.17.06
5. Chris Benoit vs. Finlay - 05.21.06 

HM: Rey Mysterio vs. Randy Orton 7.4.06 and Ric Flair vs. Edge- TLC- 1.16.06
*


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Top 5 for 06:

The Undertaker Vs Kurt Angle - World Heavyweight Title - No Way Out February 19th 2006 - ****3/4 - 8
Chris Benoit Vs Randy Orton - Smackdown January 13th 2006 - ****1/2 - 7
The Undertaker Vs Kurt Angle - World Heavyweight Title - Smackdown March 3rd 2006 - ****1/4 - 6
Finlay Vs Chris Benoit - Judgment Day May 21st 2006 - ****1/4 - 6
Finlay Vs Chris Benoit - Smackdown November 24th 2006 - ****1/4 - 6

Not done with Raw yet but I honestly doubt anything will break the top 5.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

1. Benoit v. Finlay JD
2. Rey v. Orton 4/7
3. Benoit v. Finlay 5/5
4. Benoit v. Regal NM
5. Benoit v. Finlay 11/24 or Taker v. Angle NWO


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

My top 5 2006 would be Taker/Angle NWO at number 1, and then numbers 2-5 being (not necessarily in this order): Taker/Angle SD, Edge/Foley WM, Benoit/Finlay JD, and then maybe the 6-man ONS Tag.

And on RR05-

Edge/HBK- ***
Taker/Heidenreich- **
Orton/HHH- **3/4-***
RR- ****


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

What about jbl/show/angle? That was fun..


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Just home from work, and watching wrestling tonight. Starting with the History of WWE doc, might watch some matches from it also. Still need to watch the rest of the matches from Thy Kingdom Come, probably starting with the Iron Man.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Top 5 for 2006

1. Angle vs Taker NWO *****
2. Benoit vs Finlay Judgement Day ****1/2
3. Foley/Edge/Lita vs Dreamer/Funk/Beulah ****1/2
4. Benoit vs Finlay Smackdown 5/5/06 ****1/4
5. Benoit vs Regal No Mercy ****1/4 (those headbutts :mark: )

Honorable Mention: Orton/Rey Smackdown, Edge/Foley WM 22, both Orton/Benoit matches)


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

had my ONS 6 man tag review saved but cant find it


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Top Ten From 2006:

Undertaker/Angle NWO
Benoit/Finlay JD
Undertaker/Angle 3/3
ONS 6-Man Tag
Benoit/Orton 1/13
Benoit/Finlay 5/21
Flair/Edge TLC
Edge/Cena/HHH BL
Benoit/Finlay 11/24
Mysterio/Orton NWO 06

No I did not forget the other Mysterio/Orton match. Heck, I have three other matches besides the one listed over that one.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit vs Regal is amazing. The headbutts are just insane, specially Benoit's diving headbutt onto Regal's head. He busted himself open with that one. 

And despite that, I still couldn't find a spot for it in my top 5. The top matches for 2006 are REALLY great. And I don't think even 2004 was as heavily dominated by Benoit as the 06 top matches are.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Royal Rumble 2005 review 

One of the few rumble shows I have not seen, so really looking forward to this. 

Match #1: Shawn Michaels vs Edg*e

Its kind of strange booking to start off the night with a match that has all the right to be higher up on the card. Looking forward to this, because it should be an energetic opener! This was a fun opener, and it set the show off on the right foot, because it got the crowd hot and gave the fans a fun match, which is exactly what the opener should do. Its funny how Edge is legit hated on in this match from the moment it starts, he was a heel, but he wasn’t the top heel and he got a ton of heat from the crowd, especially when he cheated to win. Anyways I had no idea this existed TBH and its cool that I found a fun gem, check this out. ***

*CAL SCALE: 2

Match #2: Heidenreich vs the Undertaker( Casket match)*

FUCK, not looking forward to this at all, as I have heard it sucks dick. Their SVS 04 match isn’t too bad, but I’d rather a worthy match get more time TBH. The casket entrance is pretty fucking awesome, witht the druids dragging the casket into the ring, even if it does take a little too long. I also think that reich’s entrance music is a lot better than him as a wrestler, as it has a nice beat to it. I’ve always thought this guy was one of the biggest flops in history, they push this guy a ton, but he just SUCKED, even fuckin Heyman couldn’t help. The match starts out with some brawling that isn’t BAD, just very boring. All of a sudden fucking Snitsky is here and taker is probably fucking thinking “why the fuck am I doing this?” WAIT! Kane is in the casket! Snitsky is feuding is Kane, that was pretty cool, but I honestly doubt it will save this train wreck. Only other cool thing about this is some cool spots, the rest is meh. Not as bad as it sounds, but nothing good. **1/2

*CAL SCALE: 1*

*Match #3: JBL vs the big show vs Kurt Angle*

Expecting a very fun match here, as everyone seems to love it, it certainly looks like a ton of fun on paper. I do like all guys to an extent, even if they all seem to be very inconsistent, especially JBL and show. What a fun match this was, these three just put an all out war on, this had some fun hardcore spots and was just an entertaining match all the way through, and I never felt bored. I sometimes have attention problems with matches, but I was in full on this one. The finish was cool too, as JBL was getting MAD over as a heel because he just kept cheating to win all of his matches, it was just a great match from beginning to end. ***3/4

*CAL SCALE: 4
*
One of the GOAT ads with Eugene portraying Forrest Gump :lmao


*Match #4: Randy Orton vs HHH
*
Pretty awesome promo for this showing how Orton won the title back at Summerslam but in the end haitch got the best of him/buried him. This was a lot better than I expected TBH. I honestly expected shit, but it was a lot of fun. I thought this would be a match where It was boring throughout the match except for the last 5 minutes. This match was in fact the exact opposite, as it was a thouroughly entertaining match for the most part. I thought that the decision to have it be a no DQ match was a good one, as it helped the match out a ton, because its not like these two can really work a technical match at all. In the end this was pretty good, nothing spectacular, but certainly good. I would have to give the WWE title match from this show the edge as I found it to be slightly better. ***1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 3 *

*Match #5: The Royal Rumble match*

This sure seems like a predictable rumble, even though I know who is going to win, it seems obvious to me that tista’s winning. Whatever, EDDIE is out first! The true god of wrestling, fuck JBL . I love rumbles, and apparently this is an awesome one! BENOIT IS OUT SECOND! I’m marking out! These are both some AMAZING people to start the rumble. Pretty sure this was the last official good match between these two, as their ONS match is garbage IIRC. Some awesome mat wrestling starts us off. I’m not a huge fan of mat work, but when these two do it, It isn’t boring whatsoever. Out at #3 is…Daniel Puder? Who the fuck is this guy? Apparently he was on tough enough, and a quick google search tells me he was sent back to OVW soon after and was released in September, haha, FLOP! Benoit and Eddie don’t give a shit and they ignore him for a little bit. Oh shit he’s cutting a promo! Yeah yeah your gonna win, like that would make one fucking lick of sense ya fuckin MMA alum and Lesnar wannabe . Well he gets buried and Benoit and Eddie beat him down, hilarious! Hardcore Holly is out at #4 and I guarantee you that this will be shit, just like holly! It now turns into a 3 on one beatdown of Puder and this is pretty pathetic, this is how you book your developmental stars? Anyway Puder is eliminated as the HURRICANE is here at #5

Hurricane and holly are both eliminated fairly quickly, and now its just Benoit and Eddie, as it should be. Out at #6 is Kenzo Suzuki, I have definitely heard the name before but don’t remember anything about him. Pretty much just standard brawling until Edge is out at #7. Another portion of standard brawling again unit MYSTERIO is out at #8 to a huge pop! Some awesome high flying moves from Mysterio and I’m happy that I’m getting the first taste of rey in what might be his best WWE year ever. Mysterio eliminates Suzuki as Shelton Benjamin is out at #9! I love Benjamin and he is such a fun worker to watch in the ring! Some awesome brawling between Mysterio and Benjamin as Booker T comes out at #10 to my immense disdain

CAN YOU DIG IT! SUCKA! Booker sorry to break it to you, but YOU are the sucker, meaning you suck. at #11 is….Y2J! This would be his final rumble for a long time which sucks, wish he stuck around the whole time instead of being a rock star, but its whatever. Out at #12 is Luther Reigns. He looks like a non-blonde moose from the Archie comics, meaning he looks like an absolute idiot. Looks like we have a cool SD vs RAW fight although I have no idea why this means jack shit as its not a battle for brand supremacy but WHATEVER. Oh man at #13 is Muhammad Hassan and his terrible terrorist gimmick. Well EVERYONE beats the shit out of him and he’s out quickly, PUSHING THEM FUTURE STARS! Out at #14 is Orlando Jordan and sorry I puked in my mouth, because this guy is a pile of shit, legit the RA error of Virgil, a bodyguard who sucks ass. Out at #15 is Scotty 2 hotty, this guy was still employed? I hate this guy so much! 

Muhammad Hassan attacks Scotty and I say thanks to racist gimmicks because I don’t need to see him do the fucking worm. At #16 is Charlie Haas, who I only remember from those fun team angle matches in 2003, but I remember him being good. All of a sudden Reigns and Jordon as well as Booker are eliminated, and I legit nearly cried of happiness of how nice that 30 second span that was. Rene Dupree is out at #17 and its whatever to me as I remember him sucking. The ring is starting to fill up nicely, I like a crowded ring in a rumble, as the action goes by faster. A cool spot sees Benjamin eliminated by Edge, he had a good run in there and it was quite fun. Simon Dean is out at #18 and he was always a fun comedy character but man their putting in all the jobbers at once are they? Eddie is eliminated next which is sad because he is a beast , at least Benoit is still in. HBK is out at #19 which is awesome and he might clear the ring like someone usually does around the #20 mark. HBK eliminates Simon Dean as Angle is in at #20

Angle starts slamming the shit out of everyone until SWEET CHIN MUSIC! HBK has gotten Angle! This must set up there match at mania. At #21 is….the coach? Oh great this guy, he’s actually good on sportscenter these days, but I wasn’t a fan of his WWE run. He somehow doesn’t get out as Mark Jindrak comes in, and wait! Angle gets HBK! He attacks him! So this certainly sets up there Mania match, which ended up getting awesome reviews, and before you ask no I have not seen it..yet! Viscera is in at #23, with some sort of punk rock gimmick? Weird, but not as bad as the big daddy V shit. At #24 is Paul London, and it seems like we’re just treading water until someone like Cena or Tista comes in. Jericho eliminates London quickly as CENA comes in at #25 to a giant pop!

Man he was fucking over! He gets Viscera of course and this might be the first sign of supercena. Snitsky is in at #26 to get the crowd to die down I assume. He eliminates London with a HUGE clothesline, that looked fucking legit TBH. Kane is in at #27 to continue his feud with him. Kane gets Jindrak and wait, coach is here still? Legit forgot haha. Out at #28 is TISTA! Huge pop as he had just begun his face turn it seemed like, which is awesome. He eliminates Jericho as Christian is out at #29, which means Flair must be out at #30. Cena FU’s Kane out of the ring to a sick pop. After Flair comes out and Eliminates coach we get some cool teamwork between Evolution. Christian is eliminated by tista as benoit gets hit with a Batista bomb and Benoit is gone. Edge gets Flair and we’re down to the final four. Its Rey, Cena, Edge, and Batista, a fun final 4. Edge gets Mysterio next and its down to the final three. A double FU gets Edge and Its Cena and Batista. Here’s where it got unpredictable I guess, because both we’re being pushed to the moon. Both men go over the top rope and it legit looked like an accident, but the way the ref handled it makes me think that it was scripted. Wait, Vince is here! This is where he tears his quads right? :lmao. They restart the match and batista wins! Awesome Rumble, one of my favorites! ****1/2

*CAL SCALE: 7*

*TOTAL CAL SCALE: 17*

*CURRENT 2005 MOTY: Edge vs Batisa vs Orton vs HHH vs Chris Jericho vs Chris Benoit(NYR)*
'
*Current 2005 PPV rankings
1:Royal Rumble(17)
2: New Years Revolution(9.5)
*​


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Am I missing something? Since Choke2Death recommended Finlay/Benoit JD I watched it and didn't think it was anything special...


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Vince tore BOTH quads, and he no sold the shit out of it. I'm looking forward to watching Trips/Orton from that show. 

History of WWE doc is okay, I guess. I enjoyed the beginning of it, but most of the steroid stuff-present we've pretty much already heard. Nothing new really.

Starting Rock/Trips Iron Man match, and just finished the Helmsley/Dude Love from One Night Only 1997, which was kind of cool.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

KO Bossy said:


> Am I missing something? Since Choke2Death recommended Finlay/Benoit JD I watched it and didn't think it was anything special...



I don't know if you are "missing" anything, it might just not be your style of match or whatever.

For me personally, that's a match I watch every few months consistently, a personal favorite. That match is the definition of what I think wrestling should be. It's so damn gritty, intense, nasty, well paced, perfectly executed, and damn near flawless in every way. It's an overused phrase, but there is just ZERO wasted motion with those two. Every move is done with the intent to maim, the work is just so snug and the counters so crisp and intense. It made my list for the top 100 WWE matches ever and even cracked the top 50. 

Listening to Tazz on commentary for it was great too, he always called Finlay's and Benoit's matches so well and does such a good job putting over how bad ass those two are in the ring.

I like Benoit vs Regal at No Mercy 06' for much the same reasons. I mean Jesus, Benoit might have fractured Regal's skull delivering those viscous, nasty head butts. It sounded like an egg being dropped on concrete. I think that No Mercy match is almost up there with the masterpiece they had at the Pillman Tribute Show in 2000.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Smitty, thoughts on the backstage segments of RR '05? I've never really thought about this but I think it has the best backstage antics of any show, ever. Between the Angle/Nunzio segment, the JBL post match celebration, Cena/Christian confrontation, Eddie/Flair confrontation and the Eddie/Evolution segment.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Brye said:


> Smitty, thoughts on the backstage segments of RR '05? I've never really thought about this but I think it has the best backstage antics of any show, ever. Between the Angle/Nunzio segment, the JBL post match celebration, Cena/Christian confrontation, Eddie/Flair confrontation and the Eddie/Evolution segment.


They were all fucking amazing


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> They were all fucking amazing


Agreed, those segments were done perfectly. Might be the best segments on any PPV show ever. The Eddie ones especially. Stealing Flairs number :lmao


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Eddie lying, cheating & stealing never was anything less than awesome.

Kinda sleepy now but managed to rewatch these two:

Matt Hardy vs Edge (Unforgiven) - ★★★★½
Benoit vs Shawn Michaels vs HHH (Backlash) - ★★★★¾


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> Benoit vs Shawn Michaels vs HHH (Backlash) - ★★★★¾


:mark: Don't think this match gets as much praise as it deserves. Atmosphere was even a bit better than Mania since they were in Canada and crapped on HBK. One of the few instances (I think) when the Mania and Backlash matches were that amazing.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

I'm in the minority in that that Backlash three-way match didn't blow me away. Great crowd, but other than that, there was nothing for me to really sink my teeth into. Just felt like a typical good match to me.

Will have to watch WM to compare.

Did that Rock/Hunter Iron Man match include a lot of outside interferences? I don't remember much about that match. Don't ruin the result, just let me know that, please. I find all of that McMahon involvement in the Rock/Austin matches annoying in retrospect. I know that that's what helped the storyline, but sometimes I'd like to just see some normal shit. I think that's one of the things that works in favor of WM19.


ETA: Thanks, HunterHearstHelmsley!


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I won't ruin anything, except to say that Trips tells the regime to go to the back before the match, that he wants to do this himself. Watch that match again. Pretty terrific, and the hour flew by for me. ****1/4


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

FBI/Tajiri & Crazy from ONS is super FUN IMO.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

ECW One Night Stand 2005 was just a fun night overall. Tanaka vs. Awesome :mark:


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I'm referring to 06 but I agree 05 was fun too.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Oh yeah, sorry for the misunderstanding lol

ONS 06 was great as well. Edge and Foley vs. Dreamer and Funk was brutal and the crowd was red hot for Cena vs. RVD. I think no crowd has ever shitted on Cena to the extent that the ECW fans gave him.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Triple H vs Jeff Hardy Smackdown 11/21/2008 ****1/2*
Triple H vs Shelton Benjamin 3/29/2004 ****3/4*
Triple H vs Shelton Benjamin 4/5/2004 ***3/4*

Hardy/Hunter is pretty fun, from the go-home Smackdown to Survivor Series. These two usually mesh pretty well together, and this encounter was no different. 

Hunter/Shelton on 3/29 :mark: This match is beautiful. Hunter is heeling it up big time early, and Shelton does a terrific job at getting the upper hand, showing the big bad heel that he shouldn't be taken lightly. Naitch comes down to the ring, but so does Benoit, to make even things up. Naitch still manages to get a shot in, and Benoit walks him down. This distracts Hunter, allowing Shelton to hit a splash in the corner and get a rollup victory. JR marks out like crazy for this, and the crowd was pretty hot for Shelton. 

Naitch comes down and cuts a promo saying that Bischoff said that anyone who gets involved that's not on official business is done. Therefore, Naitch announces himself as the guest ring announcer, then Batista as the guest time keeper, and Orton as the guest trainer. :lmao Orton comes out with the stool, water bottle and spit bucket. :lol Shelton gets several nearfalls early, out-quicking the Game, but Trips gains control with the double A spinebuster. Evolution makes their presence known, obviously. Shelton wins by countout after catapulting Trips into the ring post. JR being awesome as usual. "Triple H just his ass beat two weeks in a row by Shelton Benjamin." :lol Not as much to see this time around, but Trips/Shelton together in the ring is still pretty fun.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I marked so hard when Shelton rolled up and beat HHH in their first match. HHH worked me like a dumbass mark when I was younger. :trips2

Currently downloading the History of the WWE (or w.e the name is) set. The matches are included, so I guess I'll watch them even though all of you guys have said the listing is shit


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

From last night SD:

Rhodes Brothers vs Real Americans- ***1/4
Shield vs Usos/Rey Mysterio- **3/4
Daniel Bryan vs Luke Harper- ***


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> FBI/Tajiri & Crazy from ONS is super FUN IMO.


Thank you. Nobody every talks about that match. It's better than so much on that entire PPV.

For those who haven't watched or were wondering, yeah, Rhodes Dynasty vs Real Americans was awesome. Let us not try and be too surprised now...


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Fahk my slow internet. My History of WWE torrent's at 6% and I've been downloading for a few hours already. :side:

Fell asleep at some point during SD after the Shield vs. Usos and Rey tag. Opener was good (obviously with the teams involved), and Rey looked good in limited action. Looking forward to the 5-on-5 tomorrow :mark:


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Cody really needs to get some pointers from his brother on how to deliver a FIP sequence. I like the guy but he wrestles it like he's in a vacuum and the section comes off flat because of it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Mysterio's hot tag was basically all the match had to offer. Was worth it. Mysterio and the Shield interactions are something I can't wait to see more of.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

That and REY VS. CESARO. :woolcock :cesaro


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Rah said:


> Cody really needs to get some pointers from his brother on how to deliver a FIP sequence. I like the guy but he wrestles it like he's in a vacuum and the section comes off flat because of it.


Haven't felt the few times he's worked FIP sequences to be as flat as you personally feel, but I do think he's a much stronger hand as a hot tag. He's got that aspect of his game nailed down.



PGSucks said:


> That and REY VS. CESARO. :woolcock :cesaro


A given. :mark:


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

PGSucks said:


> Fahk my slow internet. My History of WWE torrent's at 6% and I've been downloading for a few hours already. :side:


It's up for stream on Putlocker/Dailymotion if you want to catch it now, so long.



The Primer said:


> Haven't felt the few times he's worked FIP sequences to be as flat as you personally feel, but I do think he's a much stronger hand as a hot tag. He's got that aspect of his game nailed down.


I think because of how Goldust is so good at building to that (little mannerisms to spark the crowd that Cody doesn't do). It's like chalk and cheese - but that's true with almost anyone next to Goldust, I suppose. Guy is young and has potential so tagging with his brother is the best thing he could do to round himself out. Still liked the match, though, and that Cesaro Swing was great.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I wouldn't mind seeing Rey work as a part of a team for a while (as long as it's not with Sin Cara) just for the hot tags, similar to what Kurt Angle should have done in TNA last year with his team with AJ. Yeah, it'll mean we don't get the juicy goodness that is FIP Rey Mysterio, but if last night is anything to go by, he can work a hot tag with the best of them - Especially if you've got lunatics like Rollins around who'll nearly break their neck selling his offense. If it means keeping Rey around for a bit longer, then I'm all for it, before he puts someone over and rides in to the sunset.

The day Rey Mysterio retires will be a very, very sad day.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Couldn't find my reiview, so I rewrote it


*Foley/Edge/Lita vs. Funk/Dreamer/Beulah ONS 06*​
- Ok so I checked this out after FLUX pointed it out to me.Not really a big ECW guy (pre 09 stuff) as I'm a old school wrasslin guy but this got the job done. It was a fun mosh pit of extreme weapons all happening at once. To quote Naitch, "Foley was rolling around on barb wire" Funk was bleeding, lita and Edge were being Cunts, oh yea btw this may be a unpopular opinion, but am I the only one who never found Lita attractive of FAP worthy ? I mean the tits were :lenny but thats about it.Anyways back to the match, I loved, it was 100mph the whole time and :lmao at once edge/dreamer get done chain wrestling/feeling each other out and tagged funk/foley in and the crowd goes wild and foley looks pumped and like he is about to fuck shit up, Foley walks to edge/lita and says " I dont want to do this anymore, this was a bad idea". It was a good match, got my fill of EXTREME, forgot how much of a cunt 06 edge was. I guess him and Lita were swingers after what he was trying to do to Beulah and the way he pinned him :hbk2

***1/2+


----------



## 5*RVD (Aug 14, 2006)

Just rewatched Wrestlemania 21. Damn, what a good show with quality matches. I always thought the world title matches were not as good as the rest of the card, though. But still matches like the MITB ladder match, Mysterio vs. Guerrero, Angle vs. HBK, Taker vs. Orton, and even Hogan's appearance make this show really great for me.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

DAT TERRY FUNK BABYFACE PERFORMANCE. That's all else that needs to be said about that match. What a great PPV in a sea of mediocrity. Except for Judgment Day. That can stay. Bless that Finlay.

Three good matches on Smackdown. Hopefully Rey stays long enough to have the same career resurgence that other veterans this year have had, such as Kane, RVD, and Goldust.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

WM 21 is half and half. Half a fucking classic, epic, all time GOAT show, and half a pile of shit that doesn't deserve to be on a TNA event.

Taker/Orton
HBK/Angle
MITB

They make it GOAT worthy. And then we end up with

JBL/Cena
Eddie/Rey
SUMO
Trish/Hemme

That add some TURD to the whole thing. And then Batista/HHH in the middle with a match that ain't anything special but at least doesn't make me wanna shoot someone.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Reference to Judgment Day '06 :mark:

MNM/Mexicools, Benoit/Finlay and Rey/JBL were badassness.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

ATF said:


> Reference to Judgment Day '06 :mark:
> 
> MNM/Mexicools, Benoit/Finlay and Rey/JBL were badassness.


Don't you mean MNM/Londrick? unk3

Edit: Gonna' do what SKINS did yesterday - First person to name me a match I'll watch and review.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Evan Bourne vs. Matt Hardy Cyber Sunday 08


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

If you want to watch and review another one, I'd like to reccomend the Vader vs Sting Strap match that Zep (Clint Eastwood) uploaded for me yesterday. Absolutely :mark: :mark: the entire match. Just brutal.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

FLUX said:


> The day Rey Mysterio retires will be a very, very sad day.




I think what makes it much more depressing is that he's the last of that "Big Three" with Eddie & Benoit, two of the other greatest workers ever who happened to pass away WAY before their time. Now as the second greatest in-ring performer ever, Rey seems to be on a journey that would culminate in a retirement match over the next year or two. I'm DREAMING that this journey is a big time one with matches against the likes of Punk/HHH/Cena/Shield/ETC, the standout match that MUST happen being Rey Vs HHH of course.

HONESTLY though? I'm just hoping we get Mysterio Vs Rollins.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> If you want to watch and review another one, I'd like to reccomend the Vader vs Sting Strap match that Zep (Clint Eastwood) uploaded for me yesterday. Absolutely :mark: :mark: the entire match. Just brutal.


Yep  Everyone grab this to appreciate the magic. Sting/Vader feud is soooo :mark: worthy its unreal.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Did you guys see Rey limping on his way to the ring when he returned? Then it was reported he was limping on his way back up the ramp. I too, would love to see Rey have one last run, but I think his knees are shutting down. 

Mysterio vs Rollins, GOOD LORD. Shield vs Punk/Bryan/Rey :mark: :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I don't know if Rey really has that much left in the tank to have a full final run. For the last two years, his returns have lasted about two weeks before he had to take time off to heal knee injuries. His knees are probably more damaged than Benoit's brain was.

Also a match with Punk would be a waste for him, the two have already wrestled enough times and had good enough matches. If he only has a few left in him, it should be spent with opponents he's never properly faced before. I would like a Cena match for the WHC on PPV, HHH match would be great but far fetched at this point and Cesaro would be a no-brainer. Also I don't know if he's faced Sheamus before but it could be great.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

A couple of big PPV matches for Rey would be great, and a final, proper big send off match when he decides to call it a day.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Rey Vs Reigns please.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Damn, you guys just made me realise that Rey Mysterio is the last true cruiserweight still active. Mysterio vs Cesaro, Mysterio vs any member of the Shield and Mysterio vs Bryan are all potential TV dream matches


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Well, it's been a long ass while since I came on. And with that being said, i have no idea what I want to say. But I have to say something. Ummmmm, Real Americans vs Rhodes Brothers was fun?


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I won't be watching Survivor Series due because BRADY is on at the same time and I can't miss that.

However, I doubt I would even be watching it anyways; Orton Vs Big Show is an actual WWE Championship storyline in 2013 (We go from Punk to Rock to Cena to Bryan all the way to Orton Vs Big Show)? Cena Vs Del Rio AGAIN? Punk in a basic tag? Langston Vs Axel? Total Divas elimination match? Why would ANYBODY pay to see this show? The only good thing on it looks to be the SHIELD TAG and even that has a shit lining in the sense that the Uso's are involved .

I didn't think that WWE could put together a less inspiring card than HIAC, Battleground, & NOC but they did. I'll give it a download and a watch w/o spoilers of course early on Monday or late night Sunday, but they aren't getting my money for this one, no fucking way.

Still though, I might flip over to my stream just to watch PUNK.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

*Matt Hardy vs. Evan Bourne - Cyber Sunday 2008*

_Okay I've seen this match before, but I can't remember a damn thing about it. The thing that I don't like about this match is that it's just move, counter, move, move, counter. There's no story told or any development. I feel if you had the exact same match, but had Hardy as a heel and have him perform the same moves, Bourne the same moves, but Matt just adds dickish little things, it would be so much better. Dickish little things such as trash talking Bourne, laughing at him following his mistakes etc. Yeah, the moves are performed flawlessly and Evan Bourne bumps like an absolute lunatic (shock, I know), but there's no substance. If you're going to have Matt Hardy as a face, he needs to be the one playing the FIP. If he's not playing the FIP, he's got to be a dickish heel that thinks he's god's gift. In this match, he was neither. I loved the transition spot where Bourne tries the Asai Moonsault and Hardy pushes his legs and Evan just dies on the apron, I've never seen that before. Other than expertly performed moves, this match wasn't anything special at all. Tis' a shame._

Rating: ** 3/4 - I don't regret watching it, but I can't imagine being in any rush to watch it again any time soon.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

For shame. Thanks for trying. I for one thought there was substance to this match, with that substance being the veteran champion fighting the young gun. I loved Evan Bourne's hunger that he showed in this match, especially when he did the backslide pin. Oh well, once again thanks for the chance. Now go watch the superior Sting/Vader match.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Survivor Series had good potential, but its another glaring fuck up by WWE. Are they scared of something, or are they really incompetent oafs?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

It would be awesome if Big Show vs Orton became a sleeper and delivered despite everyone's low expectations similar to Sheamus/Show last year. Granted, I'll probably get a bunch of "Sheamus is much better than today's Orton" but that just contributes to the feeling if it delivers.

Just watched this 2-on-3 tag match from Smackdown before Royal Rumble 2004. Benoit & Cena vs Brock, Morgan & Rhyno. Some good tag work by the heels, specially BROCK and both Benoit & Cena were good FIPs. Sucks that Brock left halfway through it so it became a regular tag.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Finally got to watch Taker/Trips from WM 28. **3/4

Liked their 27 match waaay more.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

> Austin ruled out wrestling at WrestleMania 30 in an interview with Wade Keller yesterday. He said he'd need a 3 month window to get ready and he says he's got to much on to even think about it. I think its fair to say he's never wrestling again. He even says he doesn't see himself wrestling ever again. He's seems genuine as well. He reiterated what he's said for years. He doesn't want to be less than what he was and that it took him long enough to get the business out of his system that he doesn't have the itch anymore. He even said "if I got the itch I'd scratch it, but I dont think thats coming any time soon".


A post from another forum, havn't seen the interview myself though.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Never saw Austin coming back anyway. Doesn't need to at all.

Its for the best. Especially seeing how fans wanted to react towards Rock, its best he just keep doing his thing outside the business.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Good. If he would agree to return, we'd probably have Austin versus HHH like we've never seen that before and he should not lower himself to wrestling Punk ever.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*RJSBX1 Hate Watch Series: New Blood Rising 2000*
"A Very Special Vince Russo Done Lost His Damn Mind Show." 











So the main event is Booker T vs. Jeff “I’m Not A Main Eventer Anywhere Else” Jarrett. Oh and Judy Bagwell on a Forklift…

Our commentary team is Tony “Hyperbole” Schiavone, Scott “Not Important Enough for a Nickname” and…GODDAMMIT. Mark Madden… Would you enjoy PPV with these three idiots?!

*Ladder Match: Jung Dragons vs. 3 Count*

:lmao :lmao Tank Abbott dancing with 3 Count. The last PPV is saw him in he was about to kill some guy with a switchblade. Ah, good times…gooood times. 

Some future WWE’ers here…Noble, Shannon Moore, DAT Gregory Helms, Jimmy Yang. Some other people you don’t give a shit about like Evan Kagarias. 

:lmao :lmao so this match is for…a recording contract?! 

So SPOTS. SPOTS. SPOTS. They aren’t even discreet about it. SPOTZZZZZZ.

:mark: DOUBLE SPRINGBOARD DOOMSDAY DEVICES! That was pretty awesome. 

So Noble grabs the gold record…but now he needs to get the contract. Noble could’ve just grabbed both at the same damn time though. 

I’d love to hear the explanation to a record company that they lost their contract in a professional wrestling ladder match. I SHOULD’VE BEEN ON CREATIVE IN WCW 2000. Double dropkick and Noble loses the contract and Tank catches it. At least he can do something decent. 

Madden: “TANK HAS THE RECORD. TANK HAS THE RECORD.” Where the hell’s my volume off button….:side:

Oh damn, Noble nails Shannon Moore with a sick looking sitout powerbomb from the ladder 

FUCKERY ALERT: Yang (I think…) and Shannon both climb the ladder, and Tank Abbott pushes them both off…AND THEN TELLS Kagarias to climb the ladder. :lmao

Hudson: “Why did Tank push Shannon off?” 
Tony: “I have no idea.” :lmao :lmao For once I agree with Schivaone.

Kagarias grabs the record contract…and I guess they win. Who knows? Who gives fuck? MAKES NO SENSE.

****-It was actually a fun match, but it just made little to no sense, and they were more concerned about putting Abbott over who fucking reeeeeked. *

*Muta vs. Ernest Miller*

Yeah because this is worth paying to see. 

Muta is about as deserving of the title Great as Khali. TRANSLATES TO MUTA AIN’T SHIT, DAWG. Muta was one of those guys that came back every now and then and we were supposed to be impressed for no apparent reason. He never had a storyline of note other than he’s Great Muta so you should like him.

There’s a sign that say “YO MUTA YO MAMA” :lmao :lmao :lmao. That might be the best thing on this show.

FUCK. The Cat has a mic. “You the Great Muta…I’mma whoop yo’ Great Ass.” :lmao. WHAT. :lmao Miller’s punches couldn’t even dent a cake. 

Scott Hudson drops the term “legit heat”…and he has managed to take the Most Annoying Announcer Award of the night from Madden. 

Schiavone: “Wrestling. That’s what the second W in WCW stands for.” As, Ernest the Cat Miller is in the ring. I’m not even going to touch that. 

There’s WAY TOO MUCH leg work for this shitty match. :lmao :lmao

HERE COMES…some Nitro Girl, I can’t be bothered to remember. Oh it’s Tygress. Thanks, Tony. Muta mists Miller and the referee is trying to wipe the mist off his face…cause you know…refs can do that. Tygress leaps on the top rope and hits Muta with a chair and :lmao :lmao the WEAKEST chairshot ever. Muta flops like Manu Ginolibili. AND MUTA KICKS OUT…end this match already.

OH. ALL THAT LEG WORK MEANS JACKSHIT BECAUSE CAT DOESN’T SELL SHIT. He hits some shitty kick and wins. :lmao :lmao Cat looks SO out of shape.

*DUD- I have no clue why WCW was so eager to push Cat. I have no idea why the only person in the match who looked good was Tygress. I have no idea why Muta is still called Great. I do know that this match sucked. *

*Judy Bagwell on a M’F Forklift: Buff Bagwell vs. Positively Kanyon *

Schiavone: “The next match is Judy Bagwell on a pole…in fact…the match is Judy Bagwell on a pole.” :lmao SO SHITTY HE HAD TO SAY IT TWICE.

There’s Kanyon = Ratings sign in attendance. Obviously, Kanyon's boyfriend or something. :lmao :lmao :lmao I’m sorry but when they first bring her out on the forklift....the commentators can’t even rationalize this idiocy. 

Kanyon’s driving it and had a Workman’s hat on and then JUST rips into Canada because HEEL. The fans chant USA in Canada. I guess WCW managed to lower the collective intelligence of a crowd that fast. :lmao

Buff is obviously not happy about his Judy being on that forklift and we have a Pier 54 brawl up in here. Kanyon is pretty much carrying this abortion. 

Madden is just all over DDP. Does he owe Madden money or something? Did DDP Yoga not accept his fat ass? FIND OUT NEXT TIME ON NITRO. 

Kanyon works the neck for that Kanyon cutter which is…well…smart. BUT WHO CARES. JUDY BAGWELL IS SCREECHING THE WHOLE MATCH.

Toward the end, Kanyn hits a Kanyon Cutter and DDP’s music HITS and OUT COMES…..David Arquette. :lmao :lmao :lmao No. Allow me to rephrase that. Former WCW Champion David Arquette. My apologies. 

Madden: “ITS FORMER WORLD CHAMPION DAVID ARQUETTE.” In case you forgot he ever won a world title, Mark Madden is going to yell it about 6 times.

He comes and is helping Kanyon…BUT HE ALREADY HAD BUFF BEAT. :argh. However, Buff is able to ward the attack off and hit a Double Blockbuster. So…wait. Kanyon lost without really any miscue or botched interference. He lost because Arquette is fuck up?! Welcome to Courtney Cox’s world. Kanyon lays Arquette out after and gets cheered…because we all hate David Arquette. 

Madden: “David Arquette’s one of the all-time greats.” 

*DUD- I mean. The action was good but it really made no fucking sense…and LOLDAVIDARQUETTE. At least, Judy was saved off that forklift. *

Apparently, Goldberg was in a motorcycle accident and can’t make the show. LOLSWERVEALERT. 

*WCW Tag Team Titles: Misfits in Action vs. Mark Jindrak/Sean O’Haire vs. Perfect Event vs. Kronik*

Now. I have honestly no clue what the fuck is going on but the Flithy Animals are in referee shirts. ALL OF THEM. Schiavone: “I’ve never heard of four special referees.” Oh no… 

Konnan’s on commentary too….WHY DID I DO TO YOU, WCW 2000? Honestly, Konnan’s one of those guys people put on a pedestal but LOL he only had consistently good matches with like two people. 

Future Hall of Famer Rey Rey and Juvi are the tag titles. Bill DeMott and Lash LeRoux come out with water gun and I find nothing Hugh Morrus about this.
Jindrak and O’Hair are next. Okay, O’Haire was a guy who I felt was royally shafted. Comes to the WWE, has the awesome Devil Advocate gimmick and then WWE just pulled the rung under him and made him Piper’s bitch. Dude was actually pretty decent. 

Konnan: “Look at these guys, they got no charisma. They like wonderbread.” :lmao :lmao Hello Mr. Kettle, it’s your friend, The Pot. I know we haven’t seen each other in a while. 
Funny thing is, Konnan recently said the same thing to Curtis Axel…:lmao :lmao Palumbo and Stasiak are next…but when has anyone given a fuck about either guy. 

CROWD: “ECW” “ECW” “ECW” :lmao :lmao. They should just chant Fire Russo! Or Where’s My Refund.

There are too many people in this goddamn ring. Muta and Vampiro comes down because there just isn’t enough fucking people in the ring. :lmao :lmao

Literally nothing interesting in here, just 10 or so guys jammed into one big space…kinda of like (insert slutty diva’s you know what.) Kronik wins. Because the people who booked this shit was smoking some serious chronic :lmao 
Oh…just to add the fuckery. Chavo counted the pinfall. 

*DUD- A tourney has 16 people not ONE MATCH. Kronik wins?! Why did Chavo count the pinfall? WHY AM I STILL WATCHING THIS!?*

:mark: :mark: PAMELA PAULSHOCK. Oh my.

*Strap Match: Shane Dogulas vs. Billy Kidman*

:mark: Torrie. :mark: 

Torrie is out with Franchise (pfft….:lmao :lmao) so LOLSWERVE incoming. BTW. Shane has problems rising the flag…if you know what I mean. His soldiers aren’t at full attention. His Big Dick Johnson isn’t getting any pops. YOU GET THE DEAL.

If you don't, Mark Madden is making penis jokes the whole time just so you can understand the situation. Scott Hudson, please hand over that “Annoying Announcer” award back to its rightful owner. Thank you. 

Neither guy is in wrestling gear and why should they be?! Schiavone: “This really isn’t a wrestling match.” :lmao. And this really isn’t a wrestling company, Tony. 
BTW, if you can’t get it up for In Her Prime Torrie…then what kind of man are you Franchise. :lmao :lmao

STRAP MATCH and….ARMWORK. No STRAP. JUST ARM WORK. More pointless non-strap activity. This goes on fore three to four minutes. 

Oh, Torrie hits Franchise in the head with a show and everyone but the three morons ringside knew that was coming. Kidman hits the Unprettier and wins. There’s something positive about WCW in 2000; no one was watching so no permanent damage was done to anyone involved. 

*½ *- Anything with Torrie will get a bump in the ratings. Too bad, the same was said about WCW ratings. *

Bookah T is here and Jeff “the Face of WCW 2000” jumps Booker and injures him. I wish someone would injure me and take me away from this show too. 

*Major Gunns vs. Miss Hancock*
:mark: :mark: STACY. :mark :mark Major Gunns: FAPFEST.

Oh, fine. I’ll watch the stupid freaking match. There’s a mud pit in the arena so someone’s DEFINITELY going in the mud pit. Some pretty :lmao-worthy punching and kicking and the crowd really couldn’t give two shits. This match is basically WCW is Upskirts because that’s all you’re going to see with this pervert cameraman. (not complaining but…I mean…whatever.) 

Clothes are ripped off and then MUD. Can’t see anything because MUD. 

:lmao :lmao :lmao Stacy is holding her stomach and she gets pinned. Oh. WCW is Miscarriage. He comes an even bigger miscarriage, David Flair and he checks on his fiancée…who’s acting is just…Oscar worthy. :lmao

*DUD- Yeah the girls were hot. The ending makes this all the stupider, and we’ll get to that in a bit. *

Tony Schiavone (in his best JR Over the Edge voice) assures us that this was not a part of the show and this was completely real. :lmao :lmao. 

*The Kiss Demon vs. Sting*

Play by Play: Brawl. Brawl. Stinger Splash. Death Drop. Victory. Best one minute of this entire show. :lmao 

So Vampiro and Muta come out (AGAIN?!)…fuck. They try to hang Sting...because if you didn’t pop for the miscarriages and sexual impotency…you’ll love watching some get hung. 
KRONIK…(really?) makes the save. If I was Sting, I’d rather be hung. Kronik clears them out aaand…Sting just leave without saying thank you. :lmao :lmao 

*N/A OH. Kronik (who won the belts tonight) challenge Muta and Vampiro. So…new champions right?*

*United State Title: Mike Awesome vs. Lance Storm *
Speaking of hanging, Mike Awesome is out next. (yeah, I realized that’s a grim segue.) :side:

Let’s see here. This is in Canada so Storm is the hero. He’s the US, Hardcore and Cruiserweight Champion at this point but would give away two of them soon. Now the cool entrance is about the end of the cool aspects of this match. The US Title is the Canadian Title, the Hardcore Title is the Saskatchewan Hardcore International Title (Get It?) and the 100kg and Under Title. 

I always thought Storm’s charisma was/is overlooked. I think he nailed the purposely dry and boring gimmick to a tee…but it just went over a lot of wrestling fans' heads. :lmao He was definitely one of the lone bright spots of late WCW. 
Awesome has this That’s 70 Guy gimmick…then he was Fat Chick Thriller (big women need loving too.). So yeah. :lmao :lmao

Storm says he had a special guest referee and the crowd is CHANTING BRET...so naturally we get…The Mountie…or the Rougeau who played the Mountie. :lmao :lmao TROLLED. Crowd still loves Storm though. 

Uh. So. Rougeau is the outside referee and there are two titles held up. Don’t worry, Tony won’t bother to tell us which titles are up for grabs… as it’s not mentioned.

SOME hardcore table action going which prompts this exchange on commentary. 

Madden: “This isn’t wrestling!” 
Schiavone: Of course, it’s not!” :lmao :lmao. I like to think they were talking about the company…rather than the match. 

:mark: Awesome with a (no pun intended) Awesome Lyger Bomb which just destroys Lance. The pinfall is a little fucked up…but then again so is this company. :lmao

LOL CANDIAN RULES. To quote Big E’s theme song: “Three ain’t enough, you need FIVE.” Dragon Sleeper and Storm taps out…oop. NO SUBMISSIONS RULE. :lmao Awesome pins Storms for a five count…but nope… Storm has a ten count to get up after the original five count. So the US Champion has now lost three times in about ten minutes perfectly clean and they’ve killed one of a hot crowd . :lmao 

VINTAGE RUSSO BOOKING. 

Rogeau pops Awesome in the jaw and out comes Bret. You know the guy the fans wanted in the first fucking place. :lmao So they had backstage, one of the most popular Canadian sport figures ever…and instead of having him out there from the beginning…they put the Mountie out there for the bulk of time?! That’s like asking for John Elway and getting…the third string undrafted quarterback to start 3/4's of the game. 

The Canadians all hug. This is reeeeealllly stupid. 

*DUD- What was that shit all aboot? *

*WCW Tag Team Title: Kronik vs. Muta and Vampiro*

Schiavone “This match was not originally supposed to happen…but here we are.” 

KICKS. KICKS. KICKS. That’s the match. 8 fucking minutes of kicks, Vampiro getting cheered. And a DEAD CROWD. So, referee gets misted…how much mist is Muta going to waste tonight?! 

:lmao Muta kinda gets hit with a double team and the run-in is…

The Harris Brothers. I give up. They beat the shit out of Clark…or Adams…the announcers neglect to tell me. Moonsault and NEW NEW Tag Team Champions. 

*DUD- It was a refreshing match, they at least had a solid 8 shitty minutes of wrestling before they pulled the grand ol’ shit ending. *

*Goldberg vs. Nash vs. Steiner *

FUN FACT: These three guys who were on the 2003 Triple H Reign of Terror list.

So, no Goldberg. Hudson is using more internet terms, so if him and Madden can just place both hands on the side of the “Most Annoying Announcer Award” that’d be cool. 
Some pretty pedestrian Nash-Steiner stuff so you know it’s not bad…but it’s not good either. 

Hudson: “Starrcade 98. Nash gets on the booking committee two weeks before the show. He goes over.” Just take the fucking trophy, Scott. 
Steiner (after a two count) : “YOU SUCK.” :lmao :lmao :lmao. GOAT Goldberg’s back. I should say that with more zeal. GOLDBERG BACK! Woo, lawdy. 

Nash sets Goldberg for the powerbomb, he shoves him off, Nash calls him a motherfucker, Goldberg walks out, Russo meets Goldberg in the aisle: 

Goldberg asks “what the fuck are you going to do about it”. 
Answer: Russo-ify this motherfucker.” 

And the Russo magic begins. :lmao Schiavone: “Well these two might need to improvise.”
Yes, Tony Schiavone has just admitted on international TV that every single match that he has hyped over the years as being this big showdown has had a planned ending that everyone in the match knew about beforehand. :lmao :lmao

I won’t go into how Russo tried to kill and strangle Kayfabe, or why any of this is beyond stupid instead I’ll skip to the ending: Midijah…or as Scotty would say MAH-DEE-GUH comes down and low blows Nash…Nash hits DDT. Something else happens before I hear: 

Schiavone: “Remember folks, this is all being improvised.” Yeah, I’m done with this match now. 

*DUD- Let’s be like two awkward high school students who just had 12 seconds of unsatisfying sex and just not talk about it.* 

*WCW World Title Match: Jeff Jarrett vs. Booker T*

Madden: “Booker T needs to take a walk down Slap Nuts Boulevard.” Not even going to touch that one. WWF should sue…nevermind they’ll own them in like a year. 
Hudson: “Jarrett’s been WCW World Champion three… (pause) four times…excuse me.” :lmao :lmao

Booker’s selling the knee and Tony with the obligatory Booker should try to end this one early. WELL. DUH. 

Oh, this match is real. Not like that SCRIPTED match before…this is the real deal Holyfield. Is the illusion still there?! 

This match actually has a decent amount of psychology and some decent action…I’m just burned the fuck out from the other 4 (pause)...5 shit matches…excuse me.

Crowd’s dead just like me…and Booker suddenly decided to stop selling the leg after he hits a Spinebuster…which should set up the People’s Elbo-..wrong company. EL KABONG to the knee. :lmao :lmao crowd doesn’t really know how to respond to that…so they don’t. Booker and Jarrett are just…doing a whole lot of something. 

Double J hits the ref and REF BUMP # 2. I missed ref bump # 1…as I tried to look anywhere else but the monitor at this point. SOME Hardcore action…if you can even call it that…REF BUMP # 3. :lmao this is just…yeah. 
Booker hits what’s SUPPOSED to be a swinging neckbreaker on the chair but it’s more like a Twist of Fate. :lmao :lmao . Booker’s knee is all healed…and Rock Bottom/Book End This PPV and he wins…and the crowd is pretty…over this right now. 

They throw garbage in the ring…I’m throwing garbage at the computer screen…at least we agree on something, WCW 2000 “fans”. 

***- Compared to everything else it was…iight. Yet, too overbooked and messy and no one cared.*

7/100- No bueno. The opener was decent, but not must watch. Kill this with fire. This is what happens when you have someone who has a lot of ideas…but no filter. Watch this, and you’ll never wonder why fans sometimes chant FIRE RUSSO. Clap clap clap. [/B]​


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

"This is all being improvised." :lmao :lmao Said that shit twice :lmao

After this Duke/Wake game, I'm jumping on Trips/Orton from Unforgiven 2004/Rumble 2005. Then dat YARD WORK. :mark:


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Clint Eastwood said:


> A post from another forum, havn't seen the interview myself though.


 Hope he doesn't wrestle again. You should always have your fans asking for more and if he does return then it could hurt his legacy. The same way Rock has hurt his in-ring legacy when he returned.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao How did I forget that Goldberg refusing to follow the script and the Judy Bagwell on a pole match happened in the same event? What's next on the horizon for rjsbx1?


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

HOLY FUCK. Okay, everybody stop what you're doing and go and watch Mysterio vs. Super Calo from Fall Brawl 1996. :mark: How has this match escaped me for so long?


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> :lmao How did I forget that Goldberg refusing to follow the script and the Judy Bagwell on a pole match happened in the same event? What's next on the horizon for rjsbx1?


*I think most people would like to forget those two travesties happened on the same show, funnyfaces. :lmao

I don't think I have anything lined up for now. Any suggestions? *


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

FLUX said:


> HOLY FUCK. Okay, everybody stop what you're doing and go and watch Mysterio vs. Super Calo from Fall Brawl 1996. :mark: How has this match escaped me for so long?


You just now saw it!? :faint:


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

William Murderface said:


> You just now saw it!? :faint:


:angel


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

FLUX said:


> :angel



Ya seriously man that match absolutely rules on so many levels, how did you miss that one? It's on Rey's Biggest Little Man set, for anyone else that wants to look for it. I have no idea what a Calo is, let alone a SUPER Calo, and is have no clue why that guys ring gear was so damn goofy, but he and Rey absolutely tore it up in that match. I guess he was modeled after a popular Mexican rap group or something. I'm not sure if he had some other good matches in WCW or not.

I'm assuming you've seen the Rey/Blitzkrieg Nitro Match from 1999 as well? More top notch stuff from my pick for the best baby face only worker of all time (sorry Ricky Steamboat)


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

> In 1992 Antonio Peña founded Asistencia Asesoría y Administración (AAA), with the express intention to feature young, high flying wrestlers. Peña signed Carcía to a contract and then together they created the ring character García would be best known under – Super Caló, named after the Mexican Rock band Caló. The character wore a very flashing silver mask with markings that looked like sunglasses and a back turned cap, giving Super Caló a Rapper character.


From Wiki.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


> From Wiki.



Ah thanks man. You're a Lucha fan, did Super Calo have any other matches of note while in WCW?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Starting NWO 05 right now, not really looking forward to this show TBH


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

*Eddie Guerrero (c) vs. Rey Mysterio - WWE Championship - WWE Smackdown 3/18/2004: *****

Rey gets a chance at the WWE Championship after defeating Shelton Benjamin and Big Show in a gauntlet match right before facing Eddie. The match starts out with the both of them feeling each other out but Eddie gets the advantage by working on Rey's shoulder, which was worked on during the gauntlet. Eddie makes great work on the shoulder until Rey goes on a little bit of a comeback doing his quick moves and delivering a beautiful springboard moonsault to the outside. The comeback was subdued with Eddie doing a superplex and continuing to work on the shoulder. Eddie does a lot of work on the shoulder through unique moves such as doing a hammerlock while carrying Rey and arching Rey's back. Rey tries to go on another comeback but Eddie stops him and works on the arm once more. Rey finally goes on a comeback and escalates to some very exciting back and forth action from reversals to diving moves to quick pins. Eddie does his "Three Amigos" and goes for the Frog Splash but misses, giving Rey a chance to do the 619. Rey hits it, goes for the springboard leg drop but misses. Eddie does a quick Oklahoma roll on Rey's injured shoulder and gets the victory, which is a nice touch of psychology. Just a great and exciting match from two awesome workers.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Cactus Jack said:


> Ya seriously man that match absolutely rules on so many levels, how did you miss that one? It's on Rey's Biggest Little Man set, for anyone else that wants to look for it. I have no idea what a Calo is, let alone a SUPER Calo, and is have no clue why that guys ring gear was so damn goofy, but he and Rey absolutely tore it up in that match. I guess he was modeled after a popular Mexican rap group or something. I'm not sure if he had some other good matches in WCW or not.
> 
> I'm assuming you've seen the Rey/Blitzkrieg Nitro Match from 1999 as well? More top notch stuff from my pick for the best baby face only worker of all time (sorry Ricky Steamboat)


Yeah I've seen Rey/Blitzkrieg, another fantastic Rey affair. To be expected tbh, when you put a top ten - possibly top five - performer of all time in Rey Mysterio in the ring with someone who very rarely, if ever, dissappointed in the ring and one of the most underrated/less talked about cats of all time in Blitzkrieg. Youtubing Blitzkrieg matches and just watching them is one of the most easiest and fun ways to pass time, highly recommended to anybody.

I feel stupid for not having seen Rey/Calo before, but I'm sure everybody has those matches which everybody has seen but you haven't. I'm going to make an effort to make sure I don't have any of those matches left, as there's a fair few. Need to make a list of them, tbh.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

smitty915 said:


> Starting NWO 05 right now, not really looking forward to this show TBH


Pretty meh but not too bad


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

FLUX said:


> Yeah I've seen Rey/Blitzkrieg, another fantastic Rey affair. To be expected tbh, when you put a top ten - possibly top five - performer of all time in Rey Mysterio in the ring with someone who very rarely, if ever, dissappointed in the ring and one of the most underrated/less talked about cats of all time in Blitzkrieg. Youtubing Blitzkrieg matches and just watching them is one of the most easiest and fun ways to pass time, highly recommended to anybody.
> 
> I feel stupid for not having seen Rey/Calo before, but I'm sure everybody has those matches which everybody has seen but you haven't. I'm going to make an effort to make sure I don't have any of those matches left, as there's a fair few. Need to make a list of them, tbh.



For me, the one I never saw that everyone else saw is Eddie/JBL Judgement Day. I know, blasphemy coming from a huge Eddie mark, but the first time I tried watching it I couldn't get through the blood (I had a bad accident with a circular saw a few years ago so it made me nervous as fuck knowing Eddie almost bled to death) and never bothered trying to watch it again until joining this forum. Now I've probably watched it 6-7 times the past few months and it's one of my 5 favorite matches ever. 

The current match I've never seen that everyone else has? HHH/HBK Hell in a Cell. Although I suppose that's a good thing seeing the reviews. It gets


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I think the next one that's on tap for tomorrow is Bret vs. Benoit from the Owen tribute show. I've heard it being called the best Nitro match ever, so I guess it's pretty shocking that I haven't seen it. Bret just doesn't interest me as a performer. Infact, a lot of the matches I haven't seen that I should have include Bret. He just doesn't do a great deal for me as a performer. I've seen SVS 96, Mania 13, WM 10 w/ Owen, the Ironman side, Raw vs. 123 Kid and I recall a match with Diesel but I was drunk and can't remember a great deal of it (SVS 95, possibly?) Also seen the Canadian Stampede tag. Other than that, I've seen very, very little from Bret. Yeah, it's a hell of a collection with all of the matches being great (bar Mania 12), but his name doesn't excite me as much as it does most other people around here.

So yeah, will report back with my thoughts on Bret/Benoit tomorrow, after I've caught some Z's.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I honestly did not like a single thing from NWO 05 except for the ending of the main event. Just the ending. What a horrible show.

Can't go wrong with any Calo multi-man tags. His match with Mysterio is his best in WCW, but that's no shame considering how great it was.

There's a documentary sort of thing regarding Kevin Sullivan up on Youtube. Was he any good in his early days? His gimmick looks so awesome, but he's one of the worst wrestlers ever. The GAB match with Benoit is hard proof as to why I think Benoit is the second greatest wrestler of all-time, and maybe even the best ever depending on the day of the week.

EDIT: Bret/Benoit is GOAT, but I'm not sure if you would like it that much since you're not the biggest Bret fan. Paramore fan thinks it's awful, but everyone else here loves it.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Bret/Benoit (Owen tribute) is an excellent match. I watched their WCW Title match (forgot PPV name but Benoit wears blue tights with Canada leaf on the back) the other day and I thought this was the match of theirs that got criticized. It was rather underwhelming because it never quite took off and the NWO interference took away from it. lol'd @ somebody throwing trash into the ring when Bret won but the trash ended up landing on Benoit's back.



Cactus Jack said:


> For me, the one I never saw that everyone else saw is Eddie/JBL Judgement Day. I know, blasphemy coming from a huge Eddie mark, but the first time I tried watching it I couldn't get through the blood (*I had a bad accident with a circular saw a few years ago so it made me nervous as fuck knowing Eddie almost bled to death*) and never bothered trying to watch it again until joining this forum. Now I've probably watched it 6-7 times the past few months and it's one of my 5 favorite matches ever.
> 
> The current match I've never seen that everyone else has? HHH/HBK Hell in a Cell. Although I suppose that's a good thing seeing the reviews. It gets


This makes me think, is it bad that I am completely insensitive when it comes to blood?

And yeah, I'd say it's a good thing you haven't seen that cell match. It's worth a watch if you ever feel sleepy and can't quite fall asleep.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> The current match I've never seen that everyone else has? HHH/HBK Hell in a Cell. Although I suppose that's a good thing seeing the reviews. It gets


Stay as far away from that match as you can. I used to like it, but something happened and the last time I put it in about a month ago, I couldn't get past the first 10 minutes. 

Hey C2D, I watched Trips/Orton from Unforgiven 2004 and Royal Rumble 2005, and what a difference. The Unforgiven match just felt so flat the whole time. Didn't help that the crowd gave no fucks, but Orton and Hunter just didn't feel like they clicked. Then the Rumble match happened, and what a change. For starters, the action started right away. The beginning of the Unforgiven match took forever to start because the two guys were trying to feel each other out and Orton was showing he wasn't scared of the big bad Game. Orton spit on him, then Trips lets it register, then more feeling out. Also the crowd at the Rumble was far better. Of course the matches pretty much end the same way, and that kind of takes the wind of it's sails, especially the RR match because that was going pretty well. 

Did you feel the same way about those two matches?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I have Unforgiven at ★★★¼ and Rumble at ★★★½. Agree that the former was kind of slow and took a while to start. Some of the action was good but the dead crowd and long amount of time took away from it. Rumble was also slow but the methodical work felt like it had more of a purpose then the concussion thing happens with Orton's excellent selling and there are less shenanigans here as HHH pretty much wins clean, mercifully ending the feud since all it was doing was just bury Orton more and more.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Yeah, I put Unforgiven at **3/4, which is low, but I just couldn't get into that at all. Like you, I have the RR match at ***1/2. Unforgiven won't make the Top 100 Trips list, but the RR match most certainly will.

At least Orton recovered quickly with that Taker program. Being a face at that time just didn't work for him, and he showed just how natural he was as a heel when the Taker program started before Mania.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Hey zeb if you can see this right now do you by any chance have Michaels/Cena raw ?


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Cactus Jack said:


> Ah thanks man. You're a Lucha fan, did Super Calo have any other matches of note while in WCW?


Calo isn't a guy I've gone out of my way to look at, so I'm pretty useless here. Will one day. These two WCW trios are balls fun, though:

Calo/Juvi/Ciclope v. Konan/Parka/Vilano IV @ SuperBrawl 97
Calo/Juvi/Garza v. Parka/Damian/Ciclope 5/26/97

La Parka's 1997 is overlooked as fuck.



FLUX said:


> I'm sure everybody has those matches which everybody has seen but you haven't. I'm going to make an effort to make sure I don't have any of those matches left, as there's a fair few. Need to make a list of them, tbh.


I've tried this. It's impossible. In fact I think I made a list and only watched two matches from it within six months.

Hart/Benoit is good. Kinda 'just' good, though. No fucking way it's the best Nitro match, tbhimofwiwsexysex. Some think it's classic, though (I used to), so you might agree them. Who knows until you watch it really. Beauty of the graps and all that.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Bret/Benoit (Owen tribute) is an excellent match. I watched their WCW Title match (forgot PPV name but Benoit wears blue tights with Canada leaf on the back) the other day and I thought this was the match of theirs that got criticized. It was rather underwhelming because it never quite took off and the NWO interference took away from it. lol'd @ somebody throwing trash into the ring when Bret won but the trash ended up landing on Benoit's back.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Agree with you on the tribute match. Really classy and old school, I dig it. Not anywhere close to being the best Nitro match, I think Benoit/Eddie from 1995 takes that cake. But still very good. I think ***3/4 is fair.

I don't know if it's BAD that blood doesn't bother you. Blood doesn't REALLY bother me, I just happened to know before watching that match that Eddie almost died on the way to the hospital afterwards, and I myself lost 1/3 of my blood after severing an artery with a saw and I know how scary that is, when you can't stop bleeding. So it's not so much the blood that got me in that match, it's knowing the aftermath. Like I said though, I can watch it now without any problems, I'm far enough removed from that accident that I don't get that sick to my stomach feeling, I just enjoy it for the all time great face performance Eddie puts in, along with that sublime story telling.

What DOES really bother me and I cannot tolerate at all is that Ultra Violent Wrestling crap that CZW does along with some other indie promotions. Don't get me wrong, I dig some hardcore stuff, Foley's hardcore matches in the WWE are some of my favorite things ever, but I cannot abide watching a dude get dollar bills get stapled to his tongue, get thrown on beds of syringes, get driven into piles of light bulbs, etc. That shit legitimately makes me want to puke. Watching Foley throw Orton onto the thumbtacks=awesome. Watching Dean Ambrose get skil sawed in the forehead (I don't care that it was fake, it looks 100% real) seriously makes me lament the state of humanity. I can watch Saw and Hostel and because of how silly the whole premise of those movies are, but when I know one man is actually slamming another on a bed of syringes, well that's way too far and way too much. I don't know if I'm in the minority or majority on this view point, because those matches have to have fans or else they wouldn't keep holding them.

Edit- Thanks Yeah I'm gonna have to look at those.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

If an ultraviolent match is well worked then it's well-worked (aka seemingly what most of what the Necro Butcher does), but yeah, hard to watch a match with syringes being stabbed through cheeks and find it not way way way way over the top and/or completely fucking stupid. I just don't get why that has to happen.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So, going into Cena vs Angle NWO 05 is at -0.5 on the cal scale :lmao

Luckily the double main event should be decent


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

True, I like me some violent matches but when it's meaningless "look how tough we are" shit with them hitting each other with over the top objects in attempt to outdo each other, yeah, it's too much.

As for the blood thing, I've never really had anything other than small cuts but it's just that everyone I've known has freaked out over bleeding so I kind of feel strange that I'm insensitive to it. Like, if I was a wrestler, I would probably do some bladejobs similar to the ones in HHH/HBK bloodbaths.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*No Way Out 2005 review

Match #1: The Bashams vs Rey Mysterio and Eddie Gurrero *

:mark:, this was obviously led to the amazing Eddie vs rey feud, but this should be fun. Honestly forget everything about the bashams. My guess is that they are nothing special but their opponents are good enough that they could be carried to a good match. Thought this was pretty disappointing TBH. It wasn’t bad to a certain extent, but I was bored for the majority of the match. The last few minutes were pretty fun, and honestly the only reason this match isn’t a flat out DUD, because the ending is pretty fun. Eddie and Rey do work well together as a team but the Bashams were not the best team to face, as they seemed to do basically nothing for me in the ring, not much charisma either. I’m sure these two had some fun TV matches but this one just wasn’t that fun. Again, the ending more or less gave the match some life especially knowing where these two went during their later feud. **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5* 

*apparently these rookie divas shit will take place between matches, I am fast forwarding 

Match #2: Booker T vs Heidenreich

I still like this guy’s entrance music, its kind of catchy haha. Not looking forward to this AT ALL. I honestly hate both guys with a passion, so this is like hell on earth for me. Pretty sure the only reason I’m not slapping a NO on this is because I’m guessing it will be kept short. Wow this was worse than I expected, literally a 6 minute fuckfest that nearly put me to sleep better than HBK/HHH HIAC. The DQ ending was terrible too. If your going to give fans a match that might not meet standards, at least book it so the ending is climatic. A chair shot and then complaining by heidenreich makes this match absolutely horrendous. DUD

*CAL SCALE: 0

Match #3: Funaki vs Chavo Guerrero vs Shannon Moore vs Spike Dudley vs Paul London vs Akio 
*
This is a cruiserweight open, where its basically a gauntlet match. I wish they did all 6 guys in at once but its whatever. I love cruiserweights and I expect a decent match here. I honestly thought this was complete shit, and that’s coming from a big fan of cruiserweight matches. It was basically a handful of bland matches that had little cruiserweight spots, Chavo also won, which kind of sucks. This PPV and this match both suck, and this PPV is nearing WOAT talk. *


*CAL SCALE: 0*

*Match #4: Luther Reigns vs the Undertaker
*
Apparently this match is REALLY bad, no thanks! NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1*

Match #5: Kurt Angle vs John Cena

Pretty sick video package to go along with this feud. Shows the whole no 1 contenders tourney and the path to this finals. These two always seem to produce, however all I have seen from these two is there 03 work, which is widely regarded as their best matches. Still hoping for a fun match, certainly better than the rest of this shitty PPV has been! Pretty decent match here, and most certainly is MOTN so farm but I do have high hopes for the JBL/show match. This started out a little slow like most Angle matches do, with a lot of mat work. But about 7 minutes in it really started to pick up. The last 10 minutes of the match were really good, nothing outstanding, but I had fun with it. It went a good length and I enjoyed myself. The only part I was bored with was the beginning of the match, and that was just because of extensive mat work. ***1/4 

*CAL SCALE: 2*

*Match #6: JBL vs Big Show (Barbed Wire steel cage match)
*
I’m actually really looking forward to this, mainly because I have heard some RAVE about how fun this is, but some seem to think its shit. Based on what types of matches I seem to traditionally enjoy I have a feeling that I will enjoy this match. Pretty cool match here, but is suffered because like the majority of the matches from this show, it felt VERY flat. The crowd is absolutely DEAD the entire show, and this makes the match feel boring. If the match had a hot crowd it might have been a lot more entertaining. However, those complaints aside, this was still a fun brawl that was plenty of fun, and the stipulation itself was pretty fun. The ending of the match and show was pretty fucking great, apart from the crowd of course that made it feel like shit. This was MOTN, but this show was complete shit TBH. ***1/2

*CAL SCALE: 3 

TOTAL CAL SCALE: 4.5* 

*CURRENT 2005 MOTY: Edge vs Batisa vs Orton vs HHH vs Chris Jericho vs Chris Benoit*

*Current 2005 PPV rankings

1: Royal Rumble (17)
2: New Year’s Revolution (9.5)
3: No Way Out (4.5) 
*​


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

FLUX said:


> HOLY FUCK. Okay, everybody stop what you're doing and go and watch Mysterio vs. Super Calo from Fall Brawl 1996. :mark: How has this match escaped me for so long?


Feel like I've been putting this over for a very long time and nobody believed me that it was the greatest thing since sliced bread got nutella put on it. :hmm:

Also, Norman Smiley is fantastic. That stems from some other topic, but it's said.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

A lot has been said about Mysterio's 2002-2010 run, specifically 2002, 2006, and 2010, but for me, 1996 is clearly Rey's best year. No better worker in the western hemisphere that year than him besides maybe Michaels. You can extend it to the east and Rey might still be ahead of the competition. REY!

NORMAN SMILEY VS MENG VS BARBARIAN. Tell me you watched that.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I'm not really as hot on Rey's 96 as others. I might have Michaels above him that year and there're like 25 wrestlers I could say might have had a better 96 than Shawn. I prefer Rey's 04, 05, 06, 09 and 2010 (at least) over his 96.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Yeah1993, would you agree with me that Vince McMahon is a lot more fun to watch in the ring than HHH and Angle?


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Maybe on average because he's had like 10 matches.  But nah that's probably not fair to the other two. Punk v. Vince from last year was probably better than any HHH match since like Mania 27, though (and I haven't watched that since the day after so I'm not positive I'd still like it). Punk v. HHH probably would be better without the second-half horseshit. Angle I haven't really payed attention to in TNA, but I hear there's an awesome Jarrett match in early 09. Punk v. Vince is obviously better than Angle/Kennedy and Angle/Hardy both from 2010, though.

Vince is way more to watch than Kurt or Trip at their worst, if that means anything. It probably doesn't mean anything b/c those two at their worst are 'Worst in the World' level. Hell, nearing to 'Some of the Worst of All Time' level.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

SKINS25 said:


> Hey zeb if you can see this right now do you by any chance have Michaels/Cena raw ?


You talking to me or Mr.Coulter 

Think its on the HBK DVD (the match from London, yeah) I'll sort it out later.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Talking about HBK and Angle  Vengeance or Mania?

Mania for me.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Got to see HBK/Angle at Vengeance LIVE from fabulous Las Vegas. :usangle The super contrived finish ruins the match a bit for me though.

I still like the Angle vs. HBK series, with Mania being my favorite.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Shawn/Angle Vengeance is my favorite, it just feels senseful, gritty and well paced. Finish aside that is. WM 21 is amazing too imo, it tells a very good story, though the MAD number of spots and the finish's execution hurt it. Didn't like the Iron Man or 2006 matches.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm sure I've seen Smiley vs MENG vs Barbarian down the line. Certainly not recently.

Jheri, watch La Parka vs Disco Inferno from SuperBrawl '98. Basically the kind of match that shows why La Parka is epic. It's a war & he's a total stud during. Could have taken the chair bump better, but ehhhh. No biggie.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Normal Smiley Vs Meng Vs The Barbarian? Sounds very familiar, so I have likely seen it... but fuck it, I'll watch it now .






:lmao Meng and Barb just start going at it, with Norman trying to sneak up from behind with weapons which don't seem to have much effect and results him him taking a beating before Meng and Barb decide to go back to beating each other . Meng sells FUCK ALL. And tbh it's 100% believable lol. Until he gets hit in the balls, then he sells that . I like how Meng see's Norman's protective mask as a challenge almost. "Oh, this cunt is wearing a protective mask? I'll punch him in the face and see how much protection it offers" *punches him in the face* "LOLProtective mask my arse". He ends up with no protective clothing and gets double teamed, so badly that the referee calls for a stretcher :lmao. He ends up at the top of the ramp, then decides to come back. He gets in the ring and... Meng and Barb are out cold, fuck knows from what because we didn't see it :lmao. He covers Barb and retains his title . FUN FUN FUN CRAZY KINDA SHITTY FUN FUN FUN.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I was gonna make a semi-long review on SuperBrawl 1998 _(or the half of Souled Out '99 I watched and talk about midcard goodies)_ but I have to bring this to light b/c I was never sure until now.

Guerrero vs Angle from WM 20 is awful. Perhaps not SummerSlam '04 awful, but it's not far off. Only positive take aways were:

Eddie have a few brief moments of being superior during the pointless opening "feeling out" process which was only done to kill five minutes b/c there was no format to the match whatsoever. Angle's mat wrestling for no real reason but fuck all sucked, but Eddie managed to have some intricaies chucked in which shout off the top of a mountain _"I'M WAY BETTER THAN YOU, KURT, BUT I'LL ONLY SHOW YOU UP IN A SUBTLE WAY B/C THIS SUCKS."_ Why all caps? That originally started shorter. I don't even know why there was a feeling out process to begin with. Build showed Angle was furious at Eddie for portraying a champion in a negative light. So he beat the shit out of him weeks in a row. Match happens and he wants to WRESTLE him? Asinine. Strike one. Stupid Angle and his need to show off his mat wrestling grappling in so many matches that don't call for it. We get it, you're good on the ground in amateur style. Sadly, pardon the nuggets of something good it wasn't as if Eddie made this much better. Although the positives all came from him. btw Tazz creaming himself during this shit was the dirt worst. He's better off commentating Divas matches. That's a callback to prior on this event. Just saying.

The finish. Holds up always. That's a given. Now it's stupid to have the ankle all of a sudden be the only focus considering there was a tiny section of the match where Angle was attempting to pick apart Eddie's mid-section/ribs, but what the hell does that matter? It all comes back to the ankle anyways. Eddie's new way of cheating to win a match owned. Wished the build towards it would have mattered, although I'm not gonna cut this down. Awesome. Again, Eddie being the catalyst via his character. Go figure.

Ok, maybe there isn't much there like I kind of said. Lame duck of a match. Basically proves to me why I feel the way I do about Kurt Angle on the majority. Even when he targeted a body part & the work was sensible, the delivering just wasn't all that interesting. There's got to be magic in the air for that dude to really be on or something. I'll always have vs Austin @ SummerSlam 2001 to worship. Among others, but yada yada, that's his best match. I should make a list of matches with him that I actually don't dislike. It'll be really good when they're all weeded out, tbhayley.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yey. Eddie/Angle WM XX is shitty. Not SS shitty but still shitty. We don't always agree on stuff (BECAUSE YOU FUCKING SUCK) but when we do, WE FUCKING DO. <3 you slightly.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I don't see you talking about Norman/Meng/Barbarian.

Where do the Angle/Joe and Angle/Styles matches fall in to this? I thought they were mostly dumb.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Callamus said:


> Yey. Eddie/Angle WM XX is shitty. Not SS shitty but still shitty. We don't always agree on stuff (BECAUSE YOU FUCKING SUCK) but when we do, WE FUCKING DO. <3 you slightly.


:woolcock



funnyfaces1 said:


> I don't see you talking about Norman/Meng/Barbarian.
> 
> Where do the Angle/Joe and Angle/Styles matches fall in to this? I thought they were mostly dumb.


I'm still debating if I want to power nap it seeing how I'm gonna be up for football in a few hours. Dunno if I can afford seven minutes for that match. I DUNNO.

Basically all of those fun under this junk too. Angle vs Joe I & Angle vs Styles I are the only matches I liked out of them all. The latter hasn't been given a third view in a decent amount of time, so maybe that sucks now too. Pretty certain the former holds up as I did watch it not too long ago and really dug it. Being a hot as hell sprint was 100000x the correct move. Tbhayley, fuck 99% of Angle in TNA. It's a steaming pile of Randy Orton gifts in duffle bags.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Angle/Lesnar and Angle/Taker stuff are obligatory good calls out of his book. Right? *Right?!*

Also, some of the stuff vs Cena, HBK, Rey and Edge.

Explain me again why is his name mentioned at least once in every 10 pages? :side:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

vs Undertaker ~ Smackdown 2003
vs Brock Lesnar ~ SummerSlam 2003
vs Rey Mysterio ~ SummerSlam 2002
vs John Cena ~ No Mercy 2003

All locks. I'm almost certain the Vengeance match vs Michaels & Judgment Day '02 & Steel Cage match vs Edge will hold up. _(I remember them all really well, but I'd rather watch again just to be 100% sure. That's me.)_ Don't really dislike the Backlash match vs Edge, but I don't think it's anything close to special. Too movez-y. And not in the good way that I give the pass vs Benoit in the Steel Cage towards. That's mindless nonsensical fun.

also every other Angle vs Cena match pardon that one are really crummy. NWO '05 probably being their worst.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

There's also Angle/HHH from the '01 RR, Angle/Benoit from WM 17 (huge fan of JD '01 too personally) and some other TV stuff. Can't recall anything else atm.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Angle vs Trips sucks & Angle vs Benoit from Judgment Day :ti


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

ATF said:


> Explain me again why is his name mentioned at least once in every 10 pages? :side:


Look in the mirror :hbk2

Dont forgot Angle/Janetty sd 05


Finishing Michaels/Cena raw atm


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Thank you. Someone else realizes how terrible Angle/Cena NWO 05 is. Both guys were probably at their worst that year.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

ATF said:


> Explain me again why is his name mentioned at least once in every 10 pages? :side:


That's actually the point of all this crap, tbf.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Thank you. Someone else realizes how terrible Angle/Cena NWO 05 is. Both guys were probably at their worst that year.


Total garbage match.

Angle vs Flair makes me list. It's mostly a Flair show, which is why it was great. Still counts. Angle wasn't obnoxious in it. He just played a good foil for Flair to work his ultra dirty shenanigans off of.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Last time I watched HBK/Cena (Raw '07) I thought it was really good, but not really the near 5 star match some people rate it as imo 

Much prefer their Mania match tbh.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Can we please segway into some WCW midcard action? The world is begging for Raven/Benoit talk. That Nitro match is dope.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Don't steal my gimmick.

but yeah their matches are rad. Got Uncensored 1998 lined up next and basically the only match worth seeing on that whole event was the wild three way with DDP, Benoit, & Raven. Pretty certain it holds up well too. DDP vs Benoit from SuperBrawl was gritty as a motherbitch. Finish was uber :mark: too.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

DDP Vs Raven Vs Chris Benoit - Uncensored 15/03/1998

What’s with Benoit’s music? Sound like some remix of the original 2 Cool theme lol, which is about as far from Benoit as you can get .

This one is fun as fuck, and pretty great too. Love the triple tie up at the start, and then how they beat the shit out of each other keeping it 3 guys almost all of the time for the first half of the match before Benoit and Raven decide it’s in their best interests to take out Page, which they do by launching him through part of the set.

Loved Benoit actually brining out a kitchen sink too. Had to be done really lol.

Page returning from being put threw the set is done really well, with him crawling to the ring and barely getting any offence, just saving the match for himself and hitting the odd move when he gets chance. No superman comeback, just realistic selling for what happened to him.

The stop sign spot was great too. Some guy in the audience (I’m gonna guess he was a plant  ) had a big sign saying “use my sign”, so Raven did, and he ripped off the paper to unveil a metal stop sign lol.

Finish with Page coming out of nowhere to hit a Diamond Cutter from the second rope through a table was cool, and again, was just Page hitting one move when he had the chance because he was still so hurt.

In terms of match structure, this is probably one of the better triple threats, as they don’t do the old “2 in, 1 out” crap over and over, they stick to 3 guys all the time until 2 of them team up to take the other out and increase their chances of winning. And when the 3rd guy comes back, he sticks to selling his injuries instead of doing a superman comeback. Just really liked this entire match, but I’m not sure I’ll vote for it. I’m considering it atm though.

Rating: ***3/4


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I think I'm lonely in the world when it comes to Angle/Benoit JD. It's probably because I feel that was the closest thing to 'good storytelling' one of their matches ever.

Oh, the 2 out of 3 falls match w/Eddie was good too. And WM 18 vs Kane I'm a fan too. Wow, I like much more Kurt Angle matches than I thought. Maybe Skins25 is right - secretely he's my all time favorite :kurt _(He's one of my gf's favorites, unfortunely :side_

Anybody ever watched the Benoit/Mysterio 1-on-1 match from 02?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Expecting the three way to remain along those lines. Again, another match that's relatively vivid in my head. Going with the flow and let it be watched again as I check out the entire PPV.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit/Mysterio is a solid match but what could've been if they had gotten to have a lengthy 20 minute match (a la Rey/Orton after WM) in 2006.

Even as a fan of the Angle/Benoit match-ups, I'm not a big fan of JD either. Specially that ladder fall. Watched their Royal Rumble rematch from Smackdown (which is the last time they ever wrestled one on one) a few days ago and it was pretty good.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Upped this for anyone:

*The Rock vs 'Hollywood Hulk Hogan - Wrestlemania 18*

Tagged Classic Version - Unedited/Unblurred:

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-m...ulk-hogan-wrestlemania-18-a.html#post26718449

I know it's on the new History Of WWE DVD, but i assume Hogans' music is edited


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Hogan entered to the nWo theme in that match. _(iirc)_ Voodoo Child didn't return till the Red & Yellow.

Still got edited on various DVDs. Which baffles all of mankind.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Forgot lol


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Still good to hear the nWo theme over some generic version of it that made some sets.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Speaking of music edits, I always found those to be a pain through the years on various WWE DVDs. I understand it but just always irked me.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Started rambling on WM 21 last night, fell asleep after the MITB match so starting to watch Orton/Taker now, for some reason the only time I have seen this show, I stopped right before HBK/Angle and never got back to it, so hopefully it will live up to the hype!


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

WrestlingforEverII said:


> Speaking of music edits, I always found those to be a pain through the years on various WWE DVDs. I understand it but just always irked me.


IIRC, they went over the top with it in 2003 for the PPV DVDs.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Booker T, RVD, Kane, Dudleys, Flair, Sean O'Haire. Probably some others around too. It's awful.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^^ :lol I should Ive posted it today but its fine, I was wondering if you had cena/hbk raw 07


Anyways just finished *Michaels/Cena * *Raw 07*, first time I watched it in full, split my viewing, watched the first 25 mins last night and then the last about 20 this morning. It was a good match, seen some full 5's thrown at it, I like the stories being told in it; HBK being scared of the STF and Cena could pull it out at any time, the clash between power/chain wrestling/technical wrestler etc. The chain wrestling was decent in the beginning but not SO spectacular so I as scared this match was alittle more on the "overrated" side, but it held up well.

I will say the thing that stuck out to me besides all the good parts of the match was the pacing. The pacing /fluidity of the match is incredible, just slow and steady and never a down part which is awesome for the length of the match. Cena did a nice job selling the beating by Michaels,overpowering hbk,and showing off his strength. This match is the closest Ive seen of COKEZ Out Michaels during his 00s run. He even looks similar to his late 90s self in this instead of the bearded middle age guy he looked like for the last couple of years of his career. Last 5 mins dragged a bit, but all in all a good match, thought HBK should have won this though, in his 00s this is one of the few times I thought he deserved a little reign
*
MOTYC ****-1/4 range*​


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Quick Question: Is JD 05 good outside of the final 2 matches? Because looking at the card MNM vs Haas and Holly and London vs Chavo sound fun..


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Both of those matches wipe the floor with Cena vs JBL.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Funny enough Skins, i dug my DVD out just as you posted that you were watching it lol :O


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Funny enough Skins, i dug my DVD out just as you posted that you were watching it lol :O


:lol

I agree with you I prefer the mania match to it, I dont see the ***** either, that it was good and pacing was excellent, just it started to drag the last 5-7 mins


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Primer said:


> Booker T, RVD, Kane, Dudleys, Flair, Sean O'Haire. Probably some others around too. It's awful.


Damn, I completely forgot about Booker. That replacement was one of the most awful themes I've heard. Almost on par with the terrible Booker/RVD mash-up as a tag team.

First ones came to mind was Kevin Nash and also Benoit's theme being changed to his WWF one for Judgment Day.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Actually don't remember a show with Nash's being changed. Maybe at Judgment Day too? Would be odd. It's 100% a WWE creation.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Judgment Day 2005 was not too bad. Pretty cool to see a PPV built around Cena for the first time ever. Eddie was a king in his match as usual and Cena/JBL goes down on rewatches, but it's good. I honestly didn't like anything else on that show though. Maybe Chavo/London was good, but it had 2005 Chavo in it.

I thought Benoit/Angle on Smackdown in 2003 was good. Worked differently from their notorious matches and felt like a good old fashioned bloodsport fight.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Geez, Orton/Taker went WAY up on the rewatch, what a fucking match


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Taker/Orton was 1/3 of the *epic* portion of Mania 21, w/MITB and Shawn/Angle being the rest.

What are the general thoughts on Shawn/Kennedy @ Armageddon '07?


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

ATF said:


> Taker/Orton was 1/3 of the *epic* portion of Mania 21, w/MITB and Shawn/Angle being the rest.
> 
> What are the general thoughts on Shawn/Kennedy @ Armageddon '07?


*I have it as a ****, definitely Kennedy's best singles match ever and HBK was just plain ol' HBK. Good psychology but minor pacing issues. The crowd is pretty shitty (LOLPITTSBURGH) during it but don't let that affect how good the action is.*


----------



## El Dylan (Jun 28, 2011)

Some matches i watched today :

Mr. Perfect vs Ric Flair (Loser leaves town) : ****1/4

Randy Savage vs Ric Flair (Wrestlemania 8) : ****

Shawn Michaels vs Marty Jannety (Raw 07/19/93) : ***1/2

Chris Benoit/Kurt Angle vs Edge/Rey Mysterio (No Mercy 2002) : ****1/2


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

El Dylan said:


> Chris Benoit/Kurt Angle vs Edge/Rey Mysterio : ****1/2


*:mark: The No Mercy one or the 2/3 Falls match? They are both great.*


----------



## El Dylan (Jun 28, 2011)

rjsbx1 said:


> *:mark: The No Mercy one or the 2/3 Falls match? They are both great.*


No Mercy, awesome match indeed.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

The Mysterio vs Psychosis match from Monday Nitro 1/6/97 is a solid gem. Standard stuff and nothing we haven't seen before between the two but still so much fun with Rey flying around the ring at every second to put Psychosis down for the count. ★★★1/2 

Speaking of that episode of Nitro, Regal manages to get something good out of Jim Duggan, in 1997. That's quite impressive.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So just finished the Angle/Michaels match on WM 21. Didn't seem to live up to the hype but it was still pretty great, but no way in hell is it 5*. 

So on the pipers pit segment, not looking forward to the rest of this show


----------



## El Dylan (Jun 28, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> So just finished the Angle/Michaels match on WM 21. Didn't seem to live up to the hype but it was still pretty great, but no way in hell is it 5*.


One of my favorite matches ever.

****3/4

I've never given 5 stars to a match to this day but i still have a tons of classics to catch up.

These are the matches i gave ****3/4

HBK vs Taker HIAC 1997
HBK vs Taker WM 26
HBK vs Angle WM 21
HBK vs Jericho Ladder match No Mercy 2008
Cena vs Punk MITB 2011


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

You've never given a match 5 stars? Then how do you know what a 5* match is :lol

I have like 10 5* matches and 25 ****3/4 matches


----------



## El Dylan (Jun 28, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> You've never given a match 5 stars? Then how do you know what a 5* match is :lol


:aries2

I never said that i knew what a 5* match was.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

El Dylan said:


> :aries2
> 
> I never said that i knew what a 5* match was.


I think I just phrased the question wrong, I've just never met someone who doesn't have at least ONE 5* match


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Wonder where does the 12-Man Should've Been SVS Tag fall amongst the best of 2013. Fuck, the storytelling was even more beautiful on this 2nd view. **** imo.


----------



## El Dylan (Jun 28, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> I think I just phrased the question wrong, I've just never met someone who doesn't have at least ONE 5* match


I understand that it could sound weird but as i said i have a tons of classics to watch.

I've been following wrestling since 2008 which is very recent.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Dude I understand, I've only been watching about a year, I've been trying to catch up to everyone else :lmao

JBL/Cena is about to start


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I think its time for me to watch NAITCH/perfect again, just check if Zep had it :lmao


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Havnt upped that one lol


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Stuff I've missed out this week:

Show/Ryback: *** (God bless that Paul Wight)
Ziggler/Sandow: **1/2
Rhodes Bros/Real Americans: ***1/4
Shield/Usos & Rey: ***
Bryan/Harper: **3/4

Bottom line: the Tag Team division rules the world right now.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Hart Foundation vs The Rockers - Saturday Night's Main Event (1990)*

Loved the match. Seeing two of my big favourites (Bret/Michaels) going at it with their respective teams before their singles prime was great. I found the match to be an enjoyable back and forth, coupled with a nice pacing. I didn't really find anything dull about the match.

Minor gripes consists of a DQ ending with Demoltion getting involved and the Vinny Mac dominated edited commentary with only one line from Ventura. Other than that, loved the match. *8.5-9/10*


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Rewatched Survivour Series 2012 today, just because  :

3MB/Ryder&Marella- *
Team Clay/Team Tensai- **1/2- fast paced match, decent contest
Kaitlyn/Eve- DUD- KAitlyn was really horrible here
Cesaro/Truth- *1/2 
Sheamus/Show- **1/2- awful, compared to their HiaC one. Very slow paced and a bad ending
Team Ziggler/Team Foley- ***- the match was alright, but no story,psychology, nothing than the nice action from the ring. Absolutely no emotion here
Punk/Ryback/Cena- ***1/2- MOTN easily, and it should get ***** only for the Shield's debut :mark:. Good match, but it couldn't save the show


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Wrestlemania 21 review

Lillian kicks off the PPV with a fantastic rendition of America the beautiful, USA! 
*
*Match #1: Eddie Gurrero vs Rey Mysterio* 

I haven’t seen this match in a long time, but I remember it not being anything special, and since people seem to agree that this match is garbage, hopefully I disagree with them and find a way to enjoy this. Pretty Meh match TBH. It wasn’t that it was boring but more that it just felt like they were going through the motions and that hitting a few high flying spots would cause this match to be great, and this wasn’t the case. A big issue for me was how annoying it was to see Rey fumbling with his mask the whole time. Quit giving a shit about the mask and focus on the match, as it never looked like it was coming off but he messed with it after every move. Many will think the score is too high but it is a disappointing match, not necessarily a bad one. **1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 1

Match #2: Chris Jericho vs Christian vs Edge vs Shelton Benjamin vs Chris Benoit vs Kane *

I love this match, I think this will be the third time I will watch this match, but it gets better every time I swear. It is unanimously praised that it is the best MITB match by a country mile, with good reason. For one, the match was revolutionary. The WWE has not had a better gimmick match debut since this, and I would be surprised if a superior gimmick match ever arose again. So, somehow this match has gotten even better for me, this was just beautiful. The crowd was somewhat into rey/eddie but this got them mad HOT. Crowd is eatin this shit up all day, and with good reason because I was amazed at what I was seeing, and it was a second rewatch! If your new to wrestling or haven’t seen this, WATCH it! ****1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 7*

THAT HOGAN RETURN :mark: 

*
Match #3: Randy Orton vs the Undertaker* 

I remember liking this match the last time I watched it, so I expect a good match here, and it seems to get rave reviews from everyone. Anyways so I’m really looking forward to this because it will hopefully hold up, and I’d be shocked if it didn’t TBH. Another bossy taker mania entrance, coupled with that AMZING old Orton music make me pretty pumped for this match. Holy shit, this was a fucking masterpiece, I had it at ***3/4 on the last watch, and it blew that rating out of the fucking water. I haven’t been more invested in a match this entire project, and it is my new MOTY for 2005 so far, which means for me it is slightly better than the elimination chamber match from NYR. I know some might think that this rating is a little too high, but I’m sorry, I loved every minute of this thing, from the reversed RKO’s to Bob Orton to that final piledriver, I was fully invested in a classic. ****1/2
CAL SCALE: 7


*Match #4: Christy Hemme vs Trish Stratus 
*
So two classics in a row and now a divas match? Nah, I want Angle/HBK! NO 
*
CAL SCALE: -1 *

Match #5: Shawn Michaels vs Kurt Angle 

I’m really looking forward to this match, because for some reason, I haven’t seen this before. This PPV has been absolutely amazing so far, and I’m expecting this to be the last good match of the night unfortunately. Really cool video package before this one, but almost all WWE video packages are amazing so it should be the norm for me by now. The interesting thing about this match for me was that I found the first 10 minutes of it pretty fucking terrible. I like Angle’s WWE work, but he never has a great start to his match. The majority of the match however was pretty fun, and the crowd was into it a ton which made it really fun. Being a fan of HBK I can easily say this is not even his best mania match, woudn’t put it in the top 3 TBH, but I still enjoyed it, despite it being ridiculously overrated. ****

*CAL SCALE: 5 
*
*Match #6: Big Show vs Akebo *

This is disgusting. NO

*CAL SCALE: -1*

*Match #7: JBL vs John Cena *

Well, not looking forward to this match at all whatsoever, because apparently it is one of the worst WWE title matches in history, and I have seen a lot of DUD ratings for this match, so going in expecting a shitfest. This match starts out with some generic brawling, and that’s how it remains for the majority of the match. A boring chant starts about halfway through the match, and JBL and Cena think nothing of it and continue their mundane offense. The finish came with a random FU out of nowhere. Big pop for the new champ, but this was pretty bad. ½* 

*CAL SCALE: 0

Match #8: Batista vs triple H* 

Here we go, time for the main event of wrestlemania. I know that many think this match was a disappointment, but I hope its not too bad. It cant be worse than the last match right? Well, I certainly hope not :lol. The build for this match is one of my favorites, the face turn of tista was one of the best ever. That contract signing segment was so badass. Wasn’t a huge fan of this. My main gripe is that this match basically had no energy at all. It was like tista and haitch were just going through the motions as if this was some irrelevant RAW match, not the main event of wrestlemania. Crowd was only hyped for the very end which was pretty good, also cool to see batista win the title, even if he was somewhat green at the time. This is still an amazing show. If the two main events delivered, this could have been better than WM 19.This match seems similar to the WM 18 and 25 main events, a triple H match that didn’t deliver. **1/2

*CAL SCALE: 1 

TOTAL CAL SCALE: 19*

*CURRENT 2005 MOTY: Randy Orton vs The Undertaker( WM)*

*
Current 2005 PPV rankings

1: Wrestlemania 21( 19)
2: Royal Rumble (17)
3: New Year’s Revolution (9.5)
4: No Way Out (4.5)
*​


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

My WM 21 ratings:

Rey/Eddie- **3/4
MITB Match- ****1/4
Taker/Orton- ***1/2
Hemme/Stratus- DUD
HBK/Angle- ****1/2
Cena/JBL- *
Batista/HHH- **1/2

^^imo, that rating for Taker/Orton is way too big, Randall never looked like a threat, only the RKO made him look good


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

WrestleMania 21 - 19

Eddie Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio - * - 0
Chris Jericho Vs Christian Vs Chris Benoit Vs Kane Vs Shelton Benjamin Vs Edge - ****1/2 - 7
The Undertaker Vs Randy Orton - ****1/4 - 6
Trish Stratus Vs Christy Hemme - NO - -1
Shawn Michaels Vs Kurt Angle - ****1/2 - 7
The Big Show Vs Akebono - NO - -1
John Bradshaw Layfield Vs John Cena - DUD - 0
Triple H Vs Batista - **1/2 - 1


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Just rewatched Austin & HHH vs Benoit & Jericho since I downloaded zep's upload over in the multimedia section. Good quality making it enjoyable and the match just never ceases to be anything less than amazing. The heel control segment was great, Benoit as FIP was great and the finishing sequence is one of the best ever. ★★★★¾



Srdjan99 said:


> ^^imo, that rating for Taker/Orton is way too big, Randall never looked like a threat, only the RKO made him look good


What? If you ask most people, they'll say it was the last time they thought the streak was over.

WM21 ratings:

Eddie vs Mysterio - ★★★
MITB - ★★★★½
Orton vs Undertaker - ★★★★¼
Trish vs Hemme - ½★ (Trish getting the "lowblow" like she has balls makes this slightly better )
HBK vs Angle - ★★★★¼
Sumo match - 0
Cena vs JBL - ★★
Batista vs HHH - ★★½


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> WrestleMania 21 - 19
> 
> Eddie Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio - * - 0
> Chris Jericho Vs Christian Vs Chris Benoit Vs Kane Vs Shelton Benjamin Vs Edge - ****1/2 - 7
> ...


God I liked Orton/Taker more than you? Maybe I rated it a little too high

Well, we ended up with the same CAL scale scores


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Match #2: Chris Jericho vs Christian vs Edge vs Shelton Benjamin vs Chris Benoit vs Kane [/B]
> 
> I love this match, I think this will be the third time I will watch this match, but it gets better every time I swear. *It is unanimously praised that it is the best MITB match by a country mile,* with good reason. For one, the match was revolutionary. The WWE has not had a better gimmick match debut since this, and I would be surprised if a superior gimmick match ever arose again. So, somehow this match has gotten even better for me, this was just beautiful. The crowd was somewhat into rey/eddie but this got them mad HOT. Crowd is eatin this shit up all day, and with good reason because I was amazed at what I was seeing, and it was a second rewatch! If your new to wrestling or haven’t seen this, WATCH it! ****1/2


unk2 not me, I think sd 09, 11 and MAYBE 13 are better, needs a re-watch, good review


Rewatched flair/perfect holds up, not going to write a review because my last got BURIED hard


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Choke2Death said:


> What? If you ask most people, they'll say it was the last time they thought the streak was over.


I'd say Orton and Batista were the last times I ever thought the Streak had a legit chance of ending. Both happened to be GREAT matches too. :rko2 :batista2


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I watched Bret vs. Benoit from the Owen tribute show, like I said I would. It was good, but not great. I liked how they transitioned from respectful, chain wrestling in to hard hitting exchanges, showing that even though the match is to pay respects to Owen, they still have pride and still want to be the better man. The action was good throughout and the backwork was decent from Bret. I'm glad I've seen it and it's a good match, but it's definitely not the classic that some make it out to be. *** 1/2 - 3/4. Really good commentary from Heenan, Tony and Tenay, also.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I legit forgot that SVS is tonight :lmao


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Razor Ramon & 1-2-3 Kid vs The Smoking Gunns - WWF Superstars (11/11/95*)

Decent TV tag. I fucking love the Kid's kicks and he had some beautiful spin heel kicks. Razor was Razor (that's all I want), and the Gunns surprisingly good. Both teams pulled their weight, but I liked that the Gunn brothers looked very dominant when they picked apart the Kid.

Downside - DQ ending. The Bad Guy ignores the ref and brawls with Billy.* 7.5/10*


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

1-2-3 Kid was the man in 94-95. You could always can on him to put on a good gem. Same with Razor (until he got incredibly lazy).


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> I legit forgot that SVS is tonight :lmao


Me too, i thought it was next week 

I dunno if im even going to watch it at all at any point, nothing interests me exept _maybe_ The Sheild.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

SLIM SHADY LP™;26728649 said:


> 1-2-3 Kid was the man in 94-95. You could always can on him to put on a good gem. Same with Razor (until he got incredibly lazy).



:agree: on the Kid. Sparked my love for underdogs.

Ew, when did Razor get lazy? I think I don't ever want to see that.


Edit: Nevermind, WCW.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Speaking of TV tags, Razor and Kid... everyone who hasn't seen it should check out the Action Zone tag between HBK & Diesel Vs Razor & 123 Kid. Was the first AZ show I believe. One of the GOAT tag matches, in WWE anyway. Can't think of many I'd put ahead of it off the top of my head.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^^ It was a great tag, action zone has some gems


Cant wait for the divas tag tonight, my girls Eva Marie and Summer Rae are going to steal it just like I know they can


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Callamus said:


> Speaking of TV tags, Razor and Kid... everyone who hasn't seen it should check out the Action Zone tag between HBK & Diesel Vs Razor & 123 Kid. Was the first AZ show I believe. One of the GOAT tag matches, in WWE anyway. Can't think of many I'd put ahead of it off the top of my head.


DL from my sig NOW :yum: Really great tag like Cal said.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

I should check out that Action Zone tag after Diesel/Jarrett. No idea what I'm getting into, but my bias for that time period will probably blind me from whatever flaws that match might have.


----------



## Simpsons Modern Life (May 3, 2013)

What do you guys think about this release, which is coming out in the UK soon (and I guess worldwide also), do you think this is a decent DVD to have in your collection?










*Content*

*Disc One*

A Revolutionary Concept

WrestleMania 21, April 3, 2005 - 1st Ever Money in the Bank Ladder Match

Chris Jericho vs. Chris Benoit vs. Shelton Benjamin vs. Edge vs. Christian vs. Kane

WrestleMania 22, April 2, 2006 - Money in the Bank Ladder Match

Ric Flair vs. Rob Van Dam vs. Shelton Benjamin vs. Matt Hardy vs. Finlay vs. Bobby Lashley

Ladder to Success

WrestleMania 23, April 1, 2007 - Money in the Bank Ladder Match

Jeff Hardy vs. King Booker vs. Finlay vs. CM Punk vs. Mr. Kennedy vs. Matt Hardy vs. Randy Orton vs. Edge

Ultimate Opportunist

WrestleMania XXIV, March 30, 2008 - Money in the Bank Ladder Match

Chris Jericho vs. Shelton Benjamin vs. John Morrison vs. Carlito vs. CM Punk vs. MVP vs. Mr. Kennedy

Avoiding Obstacles

WrestleMania 25, April 5, 2009 - Money in the Bank Ladder Match

CM Punk vs. Kofi Kingston vs. MVP vs. Finlay vs. Christian vs. Kane vs. Shelton Benjamin vs. Mark Henry


*Disc Two*

New Stars on the Horizon

WrestleMania 26, March 28, 2010 - Money in the Bank Ladder Match

Kane vs. Christian vs. Kofi Kingston vs. MVP vs. Matt Hardy vs. Shelton Benjamin vs. Evan Bourne vs. Drew McIntyre vs. Jack Swagger vs. Dolph Ziggler

Inaugural Event

Money in the Bank, July 18, 2010 - SmackDown Money in the Bank Ladder Match

Big Show vs. Kane vs. Kofi Kingston vs. Christian vs. Matt Hardy vs. Drew McIntyre vs. Dolph Ziggler vs. Cody Rhodes

Money in the Bank, July 18, 2010 - Raw Money in the Bank Ladder Match

Randy Orton vs. John Morrison vs. Evan Bourne vs. Mark Henry vs. Edge vs. Chris Jericho vs. The Miz vs. Ted DiBiase

Era of Awesome

Money in the Bank, July 17, 2011 - SmackDown Money in the Bank Ladder Match

Kane vs. Sin Cara vs. Daniel Bryan vs. Sheamus vs. Wade Barrett vs. Cody Rhodes vs. Justin Gabriel vs. Heath Slater


*Disc Three*

Caution in the Wind

Money in the Bank, July 17, 2011 - Raw Money in the Bank Ladder Match 

Rey Mysterio vs. Kofi Kingston vs. Alex Riley vs. Evan Bourne vs. Alberto Del Rio vs. The Miz vs. R-Truth vs. Jack Swagger

Money in the Bank, July 15, 2012 - Money in the Bank Ladder Match for a World Heavyweight Championship Contract

Christian vs. Sin Cara vs. Santino Marella vs. Tyson Kidd vs. Cody Rhodes vs. Dolph Ziggler vs. Tensai vs. Damien Sandow

Long Awaited Return

Money in the Bank, July 15, 2012 - Money in the Bank Ladder Match for a WWE Championship Contract

John Cena vs. Kane vs. Big Show vs. Chris Jericho vs. The Miz

Money in the Bank, July 14, 2013 - Money in the Bank Ladder Match for a World Heavyweight Championship Contract

Cody Rhodes vs. Dean Ambrose vs. Wade Barrett vs. Damien Sandow vs. Jack Swagger vs. Antonio Cesaro vs. Fandango

Money in the Bank, July 14, 2013 - Money in the Bank Ladder Match for a WWE Championship Contract

CM Punk vs. Sheamus vs. Daniel Bryan vs. Randy Orton vs. Christian vs. Rob Van Dam​


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Survivor Series looks interesting. If there wasn't such a big football game on I'd probably be more into it. Will tune in for the elimination match and Punk/Bryan vs Wyatt Family though.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I would personally just buy all the shows from which the matches are from, and the WM 21 match is ridiculously edited


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

SpookshowTony said:


> I should check out that Action Zone tag after Diesel/Jarrett. No idea what I'm getting into, but my bias for that time period will probably blind me from whatever flaws that match might have.


Diesel/Jarrett? Is that from the first part of 95, leading up to WM? If so... at least you have the awesome AZ tag to look forward to afterwards .


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I own just about every MITB on DVD other than the '12 ones. So that DVD means nothing to me. :side:


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Callamus said:


> Diesel/Jarrett? Is that from the first part of 95, leading up to WM? If so... at least you have the awesome AZ tag to look forward to afterwards .



Yep. 


*"Double J" Jeff Jarrett w/The Roadie vs Diesel for the WWF Championship - Monday Night Raw (2/20/95)*

I thought it was okay. MVP of the match was Earl Hebner, pulling JJ off Diesel by his hair and kicking Roadie in the gut. :lmao
Despite being for the title, it didn't feel like a special match including the fact that you had a title match on free TV. 

General feeling - It delivered an okay/average match with two (three if you include Roadie) guys who went out and did what they could for a okay/average title match. *5.5-6/10*


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Lemme ask outta curiosity: how many of you would go bonkers if Eddie Guerrero and Curt Hennig went 1-on-1 for over 20 minutes?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Curt Hennig started sucking when Eddie Guerrero became known in the wrestling world. If they were both in their peak, it would be great. But if you were to pick a common year, you're gonna get disappointment.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Both at their peak, I mean.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Wouldn't be my first pick for a "dream" Eddie match, but 97 or 05 Eddie Vs... 89ish Mr Perfect could have been sweet. Perfect would need to be the babyface though.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Putting on BL 09 now, doubt I'll get the review up today though, I guess I'll watch SVS.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

ATF said:


> Lemme ask outta curiosity: how many of you would go bonkers if Eddie Guerrero and Curt Hennig went 1-on-1 for over 20 minutes?


It certainly wouldn't poll good in a history draft :side:.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

SKINS25 said:


> ^^^ It was a great tag, action zone has some gems
> 
> 
> Cant wait for the divas tag tonight, my girls Eva Marie and Summer Rae are going to steal it just like I know they can


:lol

That match will likely be a disaster, but it'll be good to see Eva Marie. :yum:



OldSchoolsCool said:


> What do you guys think about this release, which is coming out in the UK soon (and I guess worldwide also), do you think this is a decent DVD to have in your collection?​




I own quite a few of those matches on that DVD already, plus most of recent MITB matches of the last few years haven't been that good, so it's not something I'll be getting.​


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

why did you tell them ATF :lmao, the card I made you is GOAT

Edit: This fucking guy's ^^^ sig and avi :ti


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Dammit Evan, you just come in with a complete repackaging and I'm like "who the fuck is this guy?". Didn't pay attention to the username at first so I went to your profile and recognized you. :lol


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

:lol :lol :lol

I NEVER just change one thing, every three months I just don't post for one or two days so I can grab a new sig, avy, & username and then I just pop back in like "HEY!".

Anyways, I'm gonna be busy watching BRADY tonight so I'll have Survivor Series on stream in the background paying attention every now and then, hell I'll probably catch a match or two in full at halftime, let's just hope it's actually something worth watching and not Langston-Axel or some shit.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Evan Stays Trippy. Just had to get GAME in there somewhere didn't you, eh?

:HHH2


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Evan Stays Trippy said:


> :lol :lol :lol
> 
> I NEVER just change one thing, every three months I just don't post for one or two days so I can grab a new sig, avy, & username and then I just pop back in like "HEY!".
> 
> Anyways, I'm gonna be busy watching BRADY tonight so I'll have Survivor Series on stream in the background paying attention every now and then, hell I'll probably catch a match or two in full at halftime, let's just hope it's actually something worth watching and not Langston-Axel or some shit.



I remember when Promethazine w/ Codeine got popular in my area while I was in high school and I got the chopped and screwed version of Da Unbreakables and thought it was like the greatest thing ever. "Putcha dick in her mouth, give me head til I'm dead dick dick in her mouth give me head til I'm dead". Wait, what were we talking about :side:

If Hennig was baby face and Eddie was heel I'd be ALL about that match. Eddie is best as a face when he's up against bigger opponents. It's too bad that Hennig was way past his prime when he was in WCW. Like Cal said though, there are a few dream matches for Eddie I'd have above it (mainly vs Taker or vs Vader).


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Shawn Michaels & Diesel (c) vs Razor Ramon & 1-2-3 Kid for the WWF Tag Team Championship - Action Zone (10/30/94)*

The only thing I have to say is...


Spoiler



:mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark:/10 and mullets


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The talk of chopped & screwed inspired me to play some Geto Boys songs in C&S. I can picture myself in a nice, breezy afternoon in a balcony getting high to this shit. :lol

Back to the topic: 

Survivor Series is in an hour and I'll watch it mainly for Orton vs Show. But I also have some homework that needs to be finished but at this point, I guess it's best to save it for tomorrow and just watch some wrestling to finish the day off.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Adam Bomb vs Irwin R. Schyster - Monday Night Raw (11/28/94)*

Eh. They slugged it out for like a few seconds, which was nice, but that really should have been the whole match. Pretty cool moment when Bomb launched himself into the ring from the apron. Other than that, I found myself distracted since the match was so...eh. *3.5-4/10*


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*Yeah, between Manning/Brady 14, a shitload of case briefs for homework and of course, Total Divas. 

I don't think I'll even be able to watch a match in full which is shame cause I'm looking forward to SVS elimination match, Show-Orton and Bryan-Harper *.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I'm glad I'm not the only one being overloaded with HW this weekend. :side:

Anyways, moderately excited for Survivor Series because it's still a Big 4 PPV. Meh.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I liked Ryback vs Big Show more than the 12 man tag from this week's RAW. Seriously. I went over my thoughts on the tag in detail in the MOTYC thread, and while I had fun watching it, two times over it still doesn't feel like _that_ monumental a match & one I expected to be much better. Whereas I wasn't sure if Show vs Ryback would be a good smash 'em up affair. After the second viewing, that one was honestly a lot of fun. Ryback looked good in defeat against the number one contender. Which prompts the question of why they're booking him so unusually. One week he looks like a stud. The next like a chump. I feel like I'm saying this too much about WWE's booking. Sorry. Gonna stop now. Should learn that this is the status quo. I'll just note on how awful Ziggler vs Sandow shitty gimmick match was and move on.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Steiners vs. Money Inc Cage match on RAW is really fun. Ending is one of the best things I've seen in a cage tag match. If you guys want a fun sleeper gem, go watch this match.

EVAN has the greatest avatar/sig combination of all-time. No use trying to beat him. I didn't even know he liked rap music ac :kanye :drake1 :ti :ass :jay :busta


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I know this isn't an indy thread but I watches this earlier and my mind exploded, no idea for star ratings though, certainly above 4 stars though


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Can't see the link, lad. What's the match?

Steiners vs Money Inc sounds like a hoot. Money Inc. vs Nasty Boys from some Coliseum Video show in late '92 _(I think...)_ is quite rad as well. Unsure if that's online. Got that on a random DVD.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Ric Flair & Arn Anderson vs Flyin' Brian Pillman & "Beautiful" Bobby Eaton - WCW Main Event (9/6/91)*

That was a great match. Other than the story of Arn/Eaton over the TV Title from Superbrawl'91 (great match as well), I didn't know the whole story for everyone. I can push that aside due to how much hate the two teams had for each other. The Enforcer was pretty brutal with his legwork segment on Brian. Kind of pissed I can't come up with more to say since I really enjoyed it, but that's that. *8.5-9/10*


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Fixed his post so the video shows up. People and their inability to use youtube tags... .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Can't see the link, lad. What's the match?
> 
> Steiners vs Money Inc sounds like a hoot. Money Inc. vs Nasty Boys from some Coliseum Video show in late '92 _(I think...)_ is quite rad as well. Unsure if that's online. Got that on a random DVD.


Can you see it now? Its working for me, if not its the youngbucks vs forever hooligans NJPW 11/6/13

That was the first ever NJPW match I've seen and it was AMAZING

EDIT: thanks cal


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Steiners vs. anybody is a hoot. Except I wasn't that big of a fan of their match against Sasaki and Hase. Ended way too abruptly and nothing special occurred. Overrated to damn hell.

But Steiners vs. Luger/Sting, Doom, Nasty Boys, Hart Brothers, Midnight Express, LOD, Fujinami/Iuzuka, etc. :lenny


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> Can you see it now? Its working for me, if not its the youngbucks vs forever hooligans NJPW 11/6/13
> 
> That was the first ever NJPW match I've seen and it was AMAZING
> 
> EDIT: thanks cal


Brilliant. That's the standard in quality when it comes to both the Young Bucks & New Japan. Pursuing the rest of the NJPW calendar this year will give you tons more amazing bouts.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Steiners vs. anybody is a hoot. Except I wasn't that big of a fan of their match against Sasaki and Hase. Ended way too abruptly and nothing special occurred. Overrated to damn hell.
> 
> But Steiners vs. Luger/Sting, Doom, Nasty Boys, Hart Brothers, Midnight Express, LOD, Fujinami/Iuzuka, etc. :lenny


Not to mention a few of their matches vs The Outsiders were pretty fun. Oh and they were like the only team to ever get a good match out of Harlem Heat. Big props to those two rough & tumble brothers for their contributions.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah I need to start following New Japan 

Wow, SVS in..10 minutes? Don't think I've been less hyped for a PPV in a while


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

smitty915 said:


> I know this isn't an indy thread but I watches this earlier and my mind exploded, no idea for star ratings though, certainly above 4 stars though


That isn't an indy match, to be fair. 



SpookshowTony said:


> *Ric Flair & Arn Anderson vs Flyin' Brian Pillman & "Beautiful" Bobby Eaton - WCW Main Event (9/6/91)*
> 
> That was a great match. Other than the story of Arn/Eaton over the TV Title from Superbrawl'91 (great match as well), I didn't know the whole story for everyone. I can push that aside due to how much hate the two teams had for each other. The Enforcer was pretty brutal with his legwork segment on Brian. Kind of pissed I can't come up with more to say since I really enjoyed it, but that's that. *8.5-9/10*


Goddang, I don't remember this one. Either I watched it among a heap of better matches or just never watched. I would have HAD to during the WCW list, though, right? Pillman was the best wrestler in the US in 1991.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Speaking of the Steiners, I'm currently watching Halloween Havoc '90 where they're facing the Nasty Boys. You also have JR and Paul E. on commentary. It feels cliche to say this but...*my body is ready.*


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

That's not the only good match Harlem Heat had. They had a great match with Public Enemy of all people. And that match is the only one in history where all the competitors were carried by a commentator. Bless you, Dusty :lol

Oh, can't forget about this gem:






unk2

EDIT: :lmao at Kofi Kingston. Did he just turn?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Steiner is comedy, I really need become more familiar with his work other than the goofy 2003 run.



funnyfaces1 said:


> EVAN has the greatest avatar/sig combination of all-time. No use trying to beat him. I didn't even know he liked rap music


Took you long enough! That makes how many of us in this thread?

To answer your rep since I need to spread, I am drug/alcohol free but I am defo not "straight edge" since that's a culture afaik and it would be completely cheap to call myself one just because of this little coincidence. Also aren't they punk rock fans? Yeah, definitely not suited for me. Not to mention, even though I wouldn't wanna be addicted to it, I wouldn't be completely objected to hitting a blunt once in a while.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

The Primer said:


> I liked Ryback vs Big Show more than the 12 man tag from this week's RAW. Seriously. I went over my thoughts on the tag in detail in the MOTYC thread, and while I had fun watching it, two times over it still doesn't feel like _that_ monumental a match & one I expected to be much better. Whereas I wasn't sure if Show vs Ryback would be a good smash 'em up affair. After the second viewing, that one was honestly a lot of fun. Ryback looked good in defeat against the number one contender. Which prompts the question of why they're booking him so unusually. One week he looks like a stud. The next like a chump. I feel like I'm saying this too much about WWE's booking. Sorry. Gonna stop now. Should learn that this is the status quo. I'll just note on how awful Ziggler vs Sandow shitty gimmick match was and move on.


Watched that match back and it was decent big man contest. Ryback's shellshock on the Big Show was really impressive, I honestly didn't think he could do that. Crowd got excited for it and there was some who probably thought it was over then because no one seems to kick out of the shellshock.. but Big Show did. :side: And then Big Show finishes him off 30 seconds later with a KO punch that Ryback sells rather funny lol.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> Goddang, I don't remember this one. Either I watched it among a heap of better matches or just never watched. I would have HAD to during the WCW list, though, right? Pillman was the best wrestler in the US in 1991.



I personally would say check it out to see if you did watch it.

I've only seen a few of Pillman's matches, but he was damn talented and it's a shame about the injuries and what later happened.



Edit: C2D, you should give his "sweet do' days" a watch since he was fucking talented. Never liked his Big Poppa Pump character though.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

UGH I have so many things to say and I need to stay on topic. 

- Stay Trippy is the funnest rap album of 2013
- Is ANYBODY actually ordering Survivor Series :lol.
- Of the 20-25 regulars in here, I'd guess that 6 or 7 are hip-hop fans .
- Straight Edge is different than being just drug and alcohol free, it's some Punk Rock shit that I don't necessarily care for (BECAUSE I STAY TRIPPY).


Punk Rock Shit?

PUNK VS ROCK FROM THE RUMBLE IS SHIT.

THREAD SAVED.

unk6


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm begging for a :henry1 appearance tonight. Surely his presence will shoot buyrates up to numbers never seen before.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Evan Stays Trippy said:


> UGH I have so many things to say and I need to stay on topic.
> 
> - Stay Trippy is the funnest rap album of 2013
> - Is ANYBODY actually ordering Survivor Series :lol.
> ...



*Nah. It's all about DAT :brady2 vs. eyton tonight.

Also, I like hip hop but then again I'm kind of eclectic when it comes to music. (I'm all about that jazz/smooth jazz, doe. :side *


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

the tag match is the opener :mark:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Evan Stays Trippy said:


> UGH I have so many things to say and I need to stay on topic.
> 
> - Stay Trippy is the funnest rap album of 2013
> - Is ANYBODY actually ordering Survivor Series :lol.
> ...



1. Stay Trippy is one of the funniest rap albums PERIOD. 

2. Holy fucking shit Cal and Zep were right, Diesel/HBK vs Razor/Kid Action Zone is one of the greatest tag matches I've ever seen. It's brilliant. I'm almost speechless right now, I don't know how I went this long never seeing it. I remember on the Stone Cold podcast Kid said that either that match or his Raw match with Bret is the best thing he's ever done in the ring, and I think that's probably accurate. I would say this is even better than that Raw match though, its a top 5 WWE tag ever in my book. For any other idiots like me that haven't seen this yet, go to Zep's (Clint Eastwood) sig and watch it IMMEDIATELY. Do not pass go and all that jazz.

3. One of my FAVORITE Steiner's tags ever is Steiner's vs Vader/Bam Bam from NJPW. Absolutely phenomenal. I believe that's in Zep's sig as well, get on it if you haven't.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Steiner Bros. (c) vs The Nasty Boys for the NWA United States Tag team Championship - Halloween Havoc (10/27/90)*

This is hands down one of the best tag matches I've seen. That's all I can really say. If anyone's interested, check it out. If you like it, that's awesome. If there's things you don't like that affect your viewing, fine by me. 

I'm dying to give it a full 10/10, but that's the high I still have. I'll give it another view later in the week (hopefully) so I can be fair about the rating. As of right now, I'm going with a *9.5/10*.


For anyone that's interested.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

ROMAN REIGNS! Allah have mercy, he had one of the greatest Survivor Series performances of all-time. :reigns ******


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

REIGNS :lenny

Just put the fucking belt on him now. Guys a star.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Awesome match!! Probably in the **** range for that, possibly the best match since SS TBH


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Reigns is a GOD. I'm worried that they are gonna turn him face and he's just gonna get lost in the shuffle. There is a log jam of Cena/Bryan/Punk at the top of the baby face chain. Right now the only heel that can legitimately main event a PPV is Orton. ADR isn't there, Mark Henry is injured. It is WIDE OPEN for Reigns to become an EVIL MONSTER and have some memorable feuds with Bryan, Cena, and Punker. I wish they'd keep The Shield together for another 6 months though, I'm worried they are gonna bust them up too soon and we will be wishing they stayed together a bit longer to keep delivering these phenomenal tags.

Rollins should be a face, he just gets so much sympathy with the way he bumps, even if he is great at being a sneaky little shit it'll be hard to keep the crowd from getting behind him with the way he treats his body like it's someone else's.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Reigns was a beast in that match. I still need to see more from him though before I become a mark. The guy has all the intangibles but until I see him in a full match, or see him cut a promo with him doing most of the work, I can't say I see him as being ready for the World Title. He's definitely proven to be capable in small amounts but a full match remains to be seen. I wasn't totally digging him on his own and was actually getting a bit bored until he speared the shit out of Goldust and then Mysterio. I mean, as I said, he was a beast, but mainly for the moments as opposed to the in-ring work itself.

The 5-on-5 from tonight gets ***3/4 from me. Great match as a whole.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The way they booked that match makes me think that Reigns is gonna get a Lesnar-esque push, woudn't shock me if he wins the rumble TBH


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Fuck, I wanted to check out Tatanka (Buffalo!) vs Owen KOTR '94 and I hear one of the commentators ask "How much does Tatanka weigh?" It hits me, "oh no, it can't be this PPV". It fucking is. Art Donovon on commentary. Damn. I could mute the match, but nah./flustered rant/not that serious/thingy-mabob.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Aww yeah (N):henry1 is here!


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

This was definitely better than their WM match.

Marked for BIG MIZARK! :mark:


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Thought Sheamus would be returning but glad to see Henry back. Ryback loses another match but that's to be expected.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:henry1 is back and already GOATing. A crossbody like none other!

:lol at John Cena vs. Alberto Del Rio not main eventing. Absolutely shocking.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Disco Inferno vs Alex Wright (c) for the WCW Television Title - WCW Monday Nitro (9/22/97)*

Fun match. Great pop when Disco won and kind of taken aback by how aggressive both guys (mostly Wright) became. *7/10*


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Holy fuck Reigns is awesome. Shield as a whole are still awesome, tbh.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Cena/adr kinda sucked dick TBH


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

I wonder who will be Cena's opponent for TLC?

... aw who am I kidding? It's gonna be/involve Del Rio. 

Edit: Punk/Bryan vs. Harper/Rowan- ****... AWESOME FUCKING MATCH!


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Erick Rowan somehow kept up with the other three great competitors to make this match great. Kinda disappointed that we didn't get any Wyatt tomfoolery, but that was a great match. This is the beauty of having wrestlers that can play both FIP and the hot tag. ******

EDIT: LMAO at this crowd. Can we please just give Daniel Bryan or CM Punk the title so that they can give us a 434 day reign?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Ok some thoughts

1) Juicy J is a cunt/ sucks
2) the 5v5 ec tag was meh and boring but DEM Spears
3) Eva stole the show YUM is my 4th fav in the company right now
4) cena/adr was :lenny
5) punk/bryan vs. wyatts was :lenny too
6) :ti IC match
7) Total Divas is awesome right now
8) Pats are getting blown out
9) I missed Walking Dead

I'm about to hit the showers, tell me how orton/show was


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Ratingz so far- have gone up and down on matches

opener: ***1/2 
IC title match: DUD
LOLDIVAS
Cena/ADR: **3/4( prefer HIAC TBH)
Brunk vs Wyatts: ****

Pretty decent PPV so far TBH


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

So many good tag matches this year.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I feel like I'm watching Steiner/Trips in the main event here.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Well, that was a legit DUD 

WOAT SVS ME?


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Team Shield vs Team Rhodes - ***3/4
Punk/Bryan vs Wyatt Family - ***3/4
Del Rio vs Cena - **3/4
Orton vs Show - -***


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Miz/Kingston: ***
5-on-5 Tag: ******
Langston/Axel: **1/2*
Divas Tag: ***
Cena/ADR: *****
Wyatt Family/Punk-Bryan: ******
Show/Orton: ***

Holy crap how can a PPV with two awesome matches be so weak? Orton/Big Show is not a DUD for me because of Orton's punt and him kissing his bicep, but wow that match made ALL of The Rock's matches this year look like Misawa/Kawada. :lmao at how dead the crowd was at that ending too.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

If Cena/Orton is the WM main event this year I'll gladly save $60 and tell WWE to fuck itself.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Brye said:


> If Cena/Orton is the WM main event this year I'll gladly save $60 and tell WWE to fuck itself.




I'll be selling my WM ticket if it's the main event. 

But I honestly think it's gonna happen at the royal rumble.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The punt was cool I guess but the main event was legit 10 minutes long

This company..


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> The punt was cool I guess but the main event was legit 10 minutes long
> 
> This company..


I'm fine with it being 10 minutes. 20 minutes and it might have gone the full minus 5.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

That Orton/Show match... damn... fuck... what did I just watch? That was all sorts of awful. It was boring, botcherific, and had almost no heat to it. I'm gonna give that a DUD. Worst main event of 2013 by far. Makes the WWE Title MITB ladder match look great.

Orton/Show was only 10 minutes? Felt like 20+... ugh.

As far as Cena/Orton goes, I think them teasing it this early means we'll be seeing it sooner than Mania. I'm thinking Royal Rumble. And I don't think it's 100% set it will be a title unification match. Cena could lose the World Title at TLC, and then challenge Orton for the WWE Title at RR, and then fight whoever wins the Rumble at Mania.

Or hell, maybe they were just teasing not necessarily Cena vs. Orton, but just a title unification itself.

Either way, I'm looking forward to Raw tomorrow night to see where they go with it as we'll probably have a much better idea then. Plus I'm going to Raw, so I'm looking more forward to it than normal. :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Cena/Orton WM main event seems more likely now. :mark:

Sucks that the main event was underwhelming tonight. Way too short, never really got a chance to build up towards a finish and it was overly slow. Still lol'd @ Orton doing that bicep pose and the punt at the end was awesome.

Also lol @ all the butthurt over Cena/Orton happening. I hope now ya know how it felt to put up with Punk's criminal title reign.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Honestly It makes the Rock/punk rumble match look good considering at least that had some excitement :lmao

Brunk tag shouldve Main evented


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

:cena4 :rko2

Sup?


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

I think people are overrating the 5 on 5 and Punk/Bryan vs Harper and Rowan tbh. Not to mention, people are overreacting to Show/Orton. The "Boring" chant from the crowd during the sleeper hold was unwarranted. Has wrestling really reached the point now where the measuring stick for a "great worker" is the ability to go 120mph and not do sleeperholds? Will there ever be a time when fans will stop dubbing every hold as a "rest hold"?

Anyway, my thoughts (for the matches I cared about):

5 on 5 ***1/2
Punk/Bryan vs Rowan/Harper ***3/4
Big Show vs Randy Orton **3/4, maybe even ***.

I thought Show vs Orton displayed good psychology. Don't get all the hate for it. Also, I missed Cena/ADR so I'll have to catch it tomorrow.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

Orton/Show never stood a chance of being good.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Has it occurred to anyone that there could be a possible title unification match?


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

sharkboy22 said:


> Has it occurred to anyone that there could be a possible title unification match?


Indeed. 

I'm excited because after one of them wins, we'll get to see a new champion, eventually. That's as wishful as my thinking can get about the main event scene right now.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Meh, I enjoyed Orton/Show for what it was.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Strange show. 

Opener - ***3/4
Divas tag - **********
lolRyback
IC title match - muted this and watched football
Cena/Del Rio - **3/4
Punk/Bryan vs Harper/Rowan - ***3/4
Orton/Show - **1/4

Liked the opener a ton. Eliminations felt strange with Ambrose going out first, and the Shield being down 5-2. Cesaro looked really good as always. DEM SWINGS. Reigns just bossed all over the place. :mark: 

Divas tag was funny. For a bit there it was just a bunch of finishers. When Jojo came in and Tamina just toyed with her I was sure Jojo would roll her up and eliminate her, and was almost right. Glad that Nattie got the win for her team. Thought for sure it would be a Bella. Match wasn't the worst ever.

Cena/Rio nearly put me to sleep during the first part, but it got better. Still nothing but average.

Punk/Bryan vs Wyatts was really good. Will most certainly watch it again for my Top matches of 2013.

Show/Orton wasn't the worst ever, but it was a terribly poor main event for Survivor Series. Orton botching the ring escape :lmao

That ending was stupid. That's how you end RAW, not a PPV. Authority should have stopped Cena from getting in the ring and let their champ celebrate. This pretty much ensures that we'll get Cena/Orton in a unification match, but I'd like it to be a the Rumble, then the winner (Cena) defends against Punk or Bryan at Mania. I don't even know, honestly. 

Weak show, but had two really nice matches on it.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Death of the Heavyweight title would kinda suck.. still think it looks better than the WWE title


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

My stream was by far at its worst for Cena vs. Del Rio and Bryan/Punk vs. The Wyatts, so those will get re-watches sometime this week. 

When Cena came out with The Authority, my brain started to dream of a Cena heel turn :cena5


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Brye said:


> Indeed.
> 
> I'm excited because after one of them wins, we'll get to see a new champion, eventually. That's as wishful as my thinking can get about the main event scene right now.


What if......Cena wins, becomes the new face of the company and aligns himself with Triple H? DAT HEEL TURN!

Seriously though, tonight would have been an epic night for a Cena heel turn. Cena comes out, poses for the kiddies then bam! Hits Orton with the AA, leaves the ring and shakes hand with Lucifer himself.

But fuck, none of that shit ain't ever happening.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

sharkboy22 said:


> What if......Cena wins, becomes the new face of the company and aligns himself with Triple H? DAT HEEL TURN!
> 
> Seriously though, tonight would have been an epic night for a Cena heel turn. Cena comes out, poses for the kiddies then bam! Hits Orton with the AA, leaves the ring and shakes hand with Lucifer himself.
> 
> But fuck, none of that shit ain't ever happening.


That would actually save all of this for me. I'd be so into that. But I'm so sure it never happens. :/


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Face Orton though? No thanks. Cena needs to turn on Bryan, maybe Punk. That would be a ways down the road, obviously.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Geez this Broncos vs Pats game just got good

GO PATS!


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

:brady

They aren't going to wait until Wrestlemania to do Orton/Cena, that ending pretty much locks up Cena/HHH main eventing Wrestlemania XXX :mark:.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

People are forgetting there's still a royal rumble match where the winner gets a title shot at WM. 

John Cena Vs Randy Orton title unification should main event the Royal Rumble.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

*My Survivor Series ratings:*

5 on 5 tag match - No rating due to my stream fucking up and missing nearly all of it :side: - I caught the finish though and good to see Reigns come out on top.

Langston vs Axel - **1/2*

Divas Elimination match - *DUD*. The eliminations every 10 seconds was just awful to sit through. 

Ryback vs Henry - **3/4*

Cena vs ADR - *****. Started off kind of boring and I was almost dozing off when ADR was just doing his standard arm work on Cena, but the match picked up and got more interesting and I liked some of the counter sequences in this one. Finish wasn't anything special, and kind of expected in a Cena match, one superman AA out of nowhere and it's over.. can't really complain considering how often we see it. A criticism I have with this match though, is Cena with a arm that had been worked on most of the match, easily escapes Del Rio's cross armbreaker and genuinely made his finisher look like nothing, while nothing stops Cena's AA... 

Punk and Bryan vs Harper and Rowan - ****1/2*. Real good tag team bout, that surpassed my expectations for it. Erick Rowan I thought really showed his stuff here, by not only keeping up in top quality tag match with great workers despite how green he still is, but he also gave us some good power displays with him using his huge size difference over Punk and Bryan to manhandle them in some fun spots. While the attention's nearly always on Luke Harper in matches and rightfully so, I thought Rowan brought some attention to himself with his performance in this match and you've got give credit where credit is due. Hot crowd for this helped, Punk and Bryan played good babyfaces in peril, the only problem I had with this was the wrong team won - and this takes away some of the rating for me. The Wyatts REALLY needed to win this. You had Punk and Bryan beating Harper on random RAW and Smackdown episodes, and the Wyatts still lose at the PPV? They're trying to push The Wyatts, well, if they wanted to do that effectively then they should of had The Wyatts win here to give them a credible victory that would of helped elevate them further + it keeps the feud going - and Punk and Bryan could of got their win back at TLC or something, but no, Punk and Bryan just had to win... This honestly was probably going to be a ****3/4* match for me, possibly even higher, but because of the outcome it's only a ****1/2* match for me - but still a quality match. 

Orton vs Big Show - *** So dull, fully deserved the brief ''boring'' chants it got, poorly booked finish. Why couldn't they have had Orton go over clean? They want him to prove he's the face of the company, and after he couldn't even beat Daniel Bryan clean he should be trying to prove he's better, but no, Triple H involvement again overshadowing Orton once again. I guess they want to go for a Triple H/Big Show match now, while Orton feuds with someone else (Henry? there was a rumor about a feud with Henry). The tease of Cena and Orton at Mania is so ugh.. I don't care. If they're going to keep Orton champ until Mania then should better start booking him better.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Orton/Cena has no business main eventing in 2013. It sucked balls in 2009, and it's gonna suck big, fat, hairy ass balls in 2013/14


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

xdoomsayerx said:


> People are forgetting there's still a royal rumble match where the winner gets a title shot at WM.
> 
> John Cena Vs Randy Orton title unification should main event the Royal Rumble.


Cena wins the unification match at RR, then Orton enters the Rumble and wins, setting up the match. :mark: It also solves the Rumble winner plothole.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Cena wins the unification match at RR, then Orton enters the Rumble and wins, setting up the match. :mark: It also solves the Rumble winner plothole.


That won't happen. HHH would enter the RR and end up winning. Or punk or Bryan. 

Plus Cena/Orton would probably close the show.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

Haven't been watching wrestling at all recently and the end of that PPV did not make me want to start back. Cena/Orton does nothing for me.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Evan Stays Trippy said:


> :brady
> 
> They aren't going to wait until Wrestlemania to do Orton/Cena, that ending pretty much locks up Cena/HHH main eventing Wrestlemania XXX :mark:.




I'd take Cena/Orton main eventing WM30 for the Undisputed Title>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Cena/HHH WM30 for the Undisputed Title. 

If Orton/Cena needs to happen at Mania, the main matches I'd want to see is:

Taker/Lesnar
Orton/Cena for the Undisputed Title
Bryan/HHH
Punk/Hogan (Yeah, I'd take it since there wouldn't be any room for Punk anywhere else, and it puts him in somewhat of a big match where he can get a fairly big win)

If Cena/HHH needs to end up happening:

Taker/Lesnar
Cena/HHH for the Undisputed Title
Punk/Orton 

I think I'd the the Orton/Cena card, even not counting Punk/Hogan.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

You think Punk would go over Hogan? :ti

No way Hogan jobs. 

Not even trying to predict Mania anymore. Just waiting to see what happens.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Mania is so hard to poo predict. I think that's a good thing though. ,

With it being the 30th, there will definitely be star power there. Hogan and Goldberg are almost locks IMO . To go along with Lesnar, Cena, Taker, HHH, Orton, Bryan, and Punk. That's pretty good company. Although I still wanna see Austin and Rock too. 

Question is does Hogan actually wrestle? He's only 64 :lmao 

I also find that "Austin is asking for too much money" report to be complete bullshit as well.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> You think Punk would go over Hogan? :ti
> 
> No way Hogan jobs.
> 
> Not even trying to predict Mania anymore. Just waiting to see what happens.


I don't think it's as unbelievable as it'd seem. The ball isn't in Hogan's court like it was 7+ years ago. If there's any truth to the report that Hogan wants Punk, and if WWE were to give him Punk, he'd more than likely have to job.

That being said, that was more of just something big to throw Punk into and not necessarily what I think would actually happen (the rest of the card I put up I do, though). Hogan if he appears will probably do something with The Real Americans, if not a match, just a "clearing the ring" type deal if I were to make a predicted more with my head than my heart. Punk's place at Mania on that card is unpredictable. It wouldn't be a big match if not Hogan. Maybe the feud with The Wyatts continues into Mania and Punk vs. Bray Wyatt finally happens there? That's the best I could think of.

WWE is doing a great job of making Mania unpredictable, so kudos to them for that. It feels like my predicted card for it changes a fair bit every month.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Not even trying to predict Mania anymore. Just waiting to see what happens.


Same here. What I would've predicted in August is so different from what I would predict now, so I'm just gonna enjoy the ride.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Punk needs to be in a marquee match, and that Wyatt feud needs to end by TLC. I don't get Bray not wrestling though, unless he's still nicked up. 

Apparently Vince came out after Survivor Series went off the air and the McMahons/Hunter held each other back from fighting Cena. :lol

http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news...er-survivor-series-went-off-the-air-hhh-cena/


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Jesus, I forgot Hogan is probably coming back. Fuck Mania this year. LIVE FROM THE AARP CENTER.


----------



## reDREDD (Oct 12, 2008)

yes but hogan = buyrates

therefore he is objectively a great wrestler and should main event every ppv until ever


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Hogan/Andre > HBK/Cena because buyrates.


----------



## reDREDD (Oct 12, 2008)

buyrates > life

if you disgaree youre wrong a loser and virgin lol go away


someone dig up andre's corpse for a hogan vs andre rematch and drew dem epic buyrates again :mark:


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

HHH main eventing WrestleMania in 2014 would be


It's such a stupid idea that I have no idea to finish that sentence. His ego isn't THAT big, right? He wouldn't shove himself into the MAIN EVENT, would he? I fully expect him to be on the card and I can't really say that annoys me, but the main event? There's no way. He wouldn't. I'm worried.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Maintain your sanity by watching some Tatsumi Fujinami, Yeah.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I can't maintain something I don't have.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

SVS 2013:

Opener - ***3/4 (REIGNS)
Big E/Axel - *3/4
Divas - :lmao
Ryback/Henry - *3/4 (still, HENRY!)
Cena/Del Rio - **3/4 (1st half was dull, 2st felt like the exact same match as HIAC with the same spots, still wasn't that bad)
Bryan and Punk/Rowen and Harper - ***3/4 (Great tag team wrestling, crowd was hot and everyone looked really good)
Show/Orton - **1/2

Decent show I guess, wish the undercard was better but RAW should be good with Reigns' push, Cena/Orton and I'm looking forward to see what's next for Henry, Big E and the tag team divison.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Well Survivor Series happened and I don't have the slightest clue what went down. Vince appeared and then Cena wanted to fight Vince, Hunter and Kane and Orton was there and Show was probably still lying on the outside somewhere and what a clusterfuck. 

I am pretty excited for Raw later on though so I guess there's that. 

Will be checking out REIGNS as soon as I get the chance. The guy is just a star waiting to happen tbh. Can't wait to watch his rise to the top. 

:reigns


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Legit had no idea there was an 'E pay-per-view last night. Looking at the results, I might check the Punk/Bryan tag and Elimination Match with The Shield and Rey Mysterio.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Random shit I wrote while watching the show this morning:

SPEAR! SPEAR! SPEAR! SPEAR! Roman Reigns fucking killed it. Marked out like FUCK for the last Spear to Rey to WIN THE MATCH. WWE are really getting behind the guy :mark:. 

Match itself was ok, started off really strong but I felt it got a little dull when Rollins and Reigns were left against all 5 babyfaces and were getting beat down. Once they got back into the match and started eliminating bitches things picked up again, and yeah, finish was :mark:. Also, did my ears deceive me or did the fans POP LIKE FUCK when Reigns hit the Spear and won? 

:lmao Big E Vs Curtis Axel. Like I'm gonna even attempt to watch that.

GOAT inspirational speech by AJ. :lmao I don't even know the names of everyone on AJ's team. Seriously, who is the other blond? One is Summer Dancer Chick or whatever her full name is... and the other is... ummmm... forget it.

:lmao I know even less people on the other diva team :lmao.

Dammit, why does AJ never win? Tis bullshit.

CHARLES ROBINSON~!

:lmao at Bret Hart being on the Survivor Series panel. Nothing like sticking it to the guy .

RYBACK OPEN CHALLENGE. Ok, I challenge Ryback to fuck off.

MARK FUCKING HENRY :mark:. I'M MARKING OUT FOR MARK HENRY. MARK MARK MARK MARK MARK MARK :mark: :mark:.

BILL KAZMAIER MENTION~!

Lol, Henry with a JYD headbutt.

OH SHIT FLYING BEAR BY HENRY. Henry wins :mark:.

Cena wins lol.

Skipped through the Punk/Bryan tag. Just wasn't feeling it. Was it good? Worth a watch?

:lmao at the advert for Christmas Bounty staring THE MIZ. At first I thought it was some advert for a really, really shitty new sitcom or something. Turns out it's an advert for a really, really shitty Miz film :lmao. Looks terrible. TERRIBLE. :lmao

Totally skipped Orton/Show to the finish lol. Oh look HHH and Stephanie and Kane show up to distract Show. :lmao at the punt. Hilariously bad. Missed completely :lmao. Awful finish .

Urgh, Cena and Orton staredown. We had BETTER not get a match at WM between the two. Title unification or otherwise. NO. BAD WWE. STOP IT. NOBODY GIVES A FUCK. WM XXX should have a BIG main event. Not a shitty main event between two people who have wrestled a ton of times already and absolutely sucked every fucking time apart from ONE match. FUCK YOU.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Wait, Cal which one is that good Cena/Orton match? Imo, their best matches are BP and NWO. With NWO>BP.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

NWO 08. Breaking Point has some good stuff to it but I'm not overly fond of that "style" (aka one guy beats the shit out of another, then the guy makes one small comeback and wins). Lesnar/Cena is probably the only time it was done right that I can think of. NWO is super though :mark:.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Well we agree on that lol. NWO is that match I show to the Cena and Orton detractors. Surprisingly, the two worst workers in the company managed to pull off a match like that. Surprisingly.

It's such a shame none of their '09 had that magic to it. I would say though, that NWO match isn't for everyone. It's an acquired taste for sure.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

From last night's SS:

Kofi/Miz- ***1/4
6 Man Elimination Tag- ***1/2
Axel/Langston- **
Team AJ/Total Divas- DUD
Henry/Ryback- *
Cena/ADR- **3/4
Wyatts/Punk&Bryan- ***3/4
Orton/Show- DUDddddd


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

sharkboy22 said:


> Well we agree on that lol. NWO is that match I show to the Cena and Orton detractors. Surprisingly, *the two worst workers in the company* managed to pull off a match like that. Surprisingly.
> 
> It's such a shame none of their '09 had that magic to it. I would say though, that NWO match isn't for everyone. It's an acquired taste for sure.


Cena and Orton, the two worst workers in the company?


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*I still love (for the all the wrong reasons) that Cena-Orton match where Orton smacks the shit out of Chioda. :lmao :lmao.

But yeah, Cena and Orton just never seem to have that "classic" that WWE can boast about or make people want to invest/see another match between those two. Hopefully, they can figure it out when they eventually square off.*


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

5v5 - *** 1/2
Divas - 1/4*
GOATs/Wyatts - *** 1/4


That's all I watched. Yeah, I watched the divas for the hilarity of people being eliminated by shoves and dropkicks. And for the commentary not being aware of Nikki Bella making a tag rather than being eliminated.


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

Finished Show/Orton, was a chore to sit through, i was on my phone for most of it.

DUD.

Two in a row with PPV main events. Nice one.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I swear some people were defending the main event at SS and saying it'll be alright lol. Seemed pretty obvious IMO how it would have turned out, doubt I'll even bother watching SS exept the Shield involvment.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

They aren't holding onto Cena Vs Orton for five months, it`s pretty much a lock that Orton's gonna be unifying the titles at some point before Wrestlemania leading to a Cena/HHH match for company control, Punk/Orton for the title with Bryan MAYBE involved, & lastly Brock/Taker.

Fuck that main event though, checked it out this morning and MY GOD .


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I keep hearing bits and shit about WM XXX in this thread (any direct spoilers and someone dies/gets banned)... and wow, if any of this shit comes true them I am NOT looking forward to WM. A world of potential with some of the current roster + part timers and they still can't put together a decent "supercard" for the 30th WM lol. PROVE ME WRONG WWE!

About to start a 2002 PPV Ramble. FOR REALSIES THIS TIME. About time I got back on it. Had a bunch of other shit to sort out over the last few weeks and my head has been fucked a little. Now I'm doing better for the most part so I might as well dive in again. Vengeance 2002 here we go!


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Always like this match:

*Brock Lesnar vs Hulk Hogan - WWE Smackdown 08.08.2002 *

Unedited - Includes Hogans''Voodoo Child' theme 

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-m...-wwe-smackdown-08-08-2002-a.html#post26779097


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Huge fan of Lesnar/Hogan:

Brock Lesnar Vs Hulk Hogan - SD 08/08/2002

Great match, and a ton of fun for sure. Crowd are insane for Hogan. Love how they built up Hogan as being almost the ultimate challenge for Lesnar at this point in his career. Heyman on the outside yelling to Brock "He's different! He's Hulk Hogan, he's DIFFERENT!" while Lesnar is playing with Hulk like he did with everyone else at the time, being too inexperienced to truly understand who he's in the ring with. Hogan did his usual schtick; no selling stuff but not anything major that pissed you off, just in the way that is part of his gimmick. He even has Brock reeling and even begging him off, the first time we'd seen this kind of thing from Lesnar. And then Bock got it. He understood who he was in the ring with. It started with the ledgrop, and once Brock kicked out, he evolved. He went after Hulk like a man possessed. No more messing about. F-5. Busted Hogan wide open. And then locked in the bear hug and beat Hogan in perhaps THE most decisive way that Hogan has ever been beaten in. Perfect build up match to SS imo. Heyman was proclaiming Lesnar to be the next big thing. He was young, athletic, powerful. He had EVERYTHING but experience, but week after week we'd see him get better and better, and in this match its like he went from a rookie to a veteran; that's how much he learnt. He wasn't in the ring with your average guy. No more Hardy Boys (just popular team at the time). No Rikishi. No Booker T. No RVD. He was in the ring with one of THE stars. One of THE legends. He went into the match inexperienced. He made mistakes. Then he LEARNT. He adapted. He evolved. He grew. And he took OUT Hulk Hogan, and was finally ready for The Rock and the WWE Title at SummerSlam. Great stuff here, telling a pretty magnificent story imo. And Hogan taking a fucking POWERBOMB (albeit out of the corner, but all that did was allow Hogan to not have to try and flip himself up onto Brock's shoulders lol)? Awesome lol.

***3/4


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Also the aftermath, the wiping of the blood and the spit on Hogan.

Love Brock


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

FLUX said:


> Cena and Orton, the two worst workers in the company?


Lolz, I remember him saying that Cena is one of the bests in the world, repeatedly, and now he's the worst in the company. Vintage bipolar sharkboy. Thanks for quoting him, otherwise I would never check that post because of ignore list.

:ti


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

It's still too early to guess what will happen for WM30. I just hope they do go through with Cena/Orton for the titles in the main event. Have been looking forward to seeing Orton close another WM plus it'll be worth it just for the reaction of the bitter, butthurt Punk marks who were adamant about their guy having surpassed Orton so far that he's closer to Hogan and Rock's level.

Survivor Series ratingz:
5 on 5 elimination - ★★★½ (REIGNS!)
Big E vs Axel - N/A
Divas shit - NO!
Mizark vs Ryback - ★★¼
Cena vs Del Rio - ★★¾
Punk/Bryan vs Wyatts - NO!
Orton vs Big Show - ★★

And speaking of BROCK vs Hogan, that backstage segment before the match when Hogan manipulates Brock into putting the title on the line is hilarious.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Cena/Orton series 

SS 07: ****
NWO 08: ***3/4
I quit: ***1/4
Iron man: *1/2 awful 
HIAC: **3/4
SS 09: **3/4


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

I completely do not understand WWE's logic.

They depushed Bryan for not drawing yet give us this. Their reasoning for Bryan's "failures" seemingly fails to understand the contingent factors that went into those buyrates - Cena was no longer on TV and Bryan had yet to be fully tested/cemented as the guy. Throwing him with Orton (who is a proven no draw/anti-draw) is another quandary, especially when Orton gets none of the blame. Now, when they seem so hypersensitive to rating-fluctuations, they push Cena/Orton as a programme. The fact that Cena, their biggest star, came out to ZERO crowd reaction (not even from smarks booing him) in his home town and that the stand-off between himself and Orton had fans literally leaving should be damning. But no, they'll find another excuse for that, obviously.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Rah said:


> I completely do not understand WWE's logic.
> 
> They depushed Bryan for not drawing yet give us this. Their reasoning for Bryan's "failures" seemingly fails to understand the contingent factors that went into those buyrates - Cena was no longer on TV and Bryan had yet to be fully tested/cemented as the guy. Throwing him with Orton (who is a proven no draw/anti-draw) is another quandary, especially when Orton gets none of the blame. Now, when they seem so hypersensitive to rating-fluctuations, they push Cena/Orton as a programme. The fact that Cena, their biggest star, came out to ZERO crowd reaction (not even from smarks booing him) in his home town and that the stand-off between himself and Orton had fans literally leaving should be damning. But no, they'll find another excuse for that, obviously.


I don't know about Orton being a no draw/anti draw guy, I've never seen any facts to prove such a statement, nor do I particularly care about what kind of buy rate a guy produces. Because I don't think wrestlers necessarily "draw" anymore, I think story lines and feuds draw. You put Randy Orton in a really compelling feud with Big Show that causes fans to connect and relate to the characters, and I guaruntee they could sell a lot of PPV's. Instead we get Big Show earning a title match by threatening a lawsuit. Really. When did wwe decide that lawsuits draw money? Ask Christian how well it works to have lawyers be the basis of a feud.

That said, I agree with you that it's completely ridiculous for WWE to put the blame on shitty buy rates for recent PPV's on Bryan. He was given AWFUL booking, and there was ZERO support for the rest of the card to make people interested in buying the PPV. Night of Champions and Battleground are two of the worst PPV cards I've ever seen. Not to mention, the biggest factor in people wanting to pay for a PPV is for the heel to get so much heat that people were dying to see him get his cummuppence. That didn't happen, Orton was booked as badly as Bryan was, and most if not all of the heat was directed at Hunter/Stephanie. That's a recipe for a whole lot of Don't Give a Shit from the fans, and that's what WWE got.

In summation, WWE has continued to prove they have no coherent plan for feuds, they book shit by the seat of their pants and it's showing. They are becoming WCW v2.0. I can't imagine Vince sitting down in April or May and saying "Here is my main event for Surivor Series, our second longest running PPV behind Mania: Orton vs Big Show, Big Show is going to threaten a lawsuit against us and we will have no choice but to grant him his wish. That's GENUIS. WE ARE GOING TO MAKE SO MUCH EFFING MONEY OMG. THE FANS WILL LOVE IT!" :vince3


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Cactus Jack said:


> I don't know about Orton being a no draw/anti draw guy, I've never seen any facts to prove such a statement, nor do I particularly care about what kind of buy rate a guy produces. Because I don't think wrestlers necessarily "draw" anymore, I think story lines and feuds draw. You put Randy Orton in a really compelling feud with Big Show that causes fans to connect and relate to the characters, and I guaruntee they could sell a lot of PPV's. Instead we get Big Show earning a title match by threatening a lawsuit. Really. When did wwe decide that lawsuits draw money? Ask Christian how well it works to have lawyers be the basis of a feud.
> 
> That said, I agree with you that it's completely ridiculous for WWE to put the blame on shitty buy rates for recent PPV's on Bryan. He was given AWFUL booking, *and there was ZERO support for the rest of the card* to make people interested in buying the PPV. Night of Champions and Battleground are two of the worst PPV cards I've ever seen. Not to mention, the biggest factor in people wanting to pay for a PPV is for the heel to get so much heat that people were dying to see him get his cummuppence. That didn't happen, Orton was booked as badly as Bryan was, and most if not all of the heat was directed at Hunter/Stephanie. That's a recipe for a whole lot of Don't Give a Shit from the fans, and that's what WWE got.
> 
> In summation, WWE has continued to prove they have no coherent plan for feuds, they book shit by the seat of their pants and it's showing. They are becoming WCW v2.0. I can't imagine Vince sitting down in April or May and saying "Here is my main event for Surivor Series, our second longest running PPV behind Mania: Orton vs Big Show, Big Show is going to threaten a lawsuit against us and we will have no choice but to grant him his wish. That's GENUIS. WE ARE GOING TO MAKE SO MUCH EFFING MONEY OMG. THE FANS WILL LOVE IT!" :vince3


The bolded sentence is basically what I've always said/thought.

Any normal person will not spend $60 (is it that much? I'm British ) for a show that only has one match that they care about. If a PPV is 3 hours long, the main event takes up 30 minutes if you include entrances and video packages etc. Why would you pay that much for 1/6th of the show? Bryan vs. Orton could have been the best booked feud in the world, but people will not pay that much for one match and one outcome.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Bryan wasn't given awful booking. Get real. Beating Cena and Orton clean, beating up The Shield every week, isn't awful booking.


----------



## Cactus (Jul 28, 2011)

Survivor Series was ....alright. Didn't feel like a big show, but rather an okay filler PPV. 

- The 5 vs 5 tag match that opened the show was as fun as expected. I felt the pace of the match suffered when Cesaro got eliminated, but Reign's awesome performance more than made up for any inconsistencies that had happened before had. I expect big things for Reigns in the next year or so.

- I caught the last minute of Big E/Axel and it looked like the exact same match we got on Raw 6 days ago. It boggles my mind why they made Axel drop the title then rather than now.

- The Diva's match was fun mainly because of the stipulation. There was eliminations all over the place and this kept me entertained for the duration of the match.

- As big as a Henry Mark I am, Henry/Ryback never seem to click together. Serviceable match and nothing more. 

- While Cena/Del Rio was better than last month's title match, this never really kicked into second gear. It's like they were aiming to wrestle a four-star epic and a lot of what they were going for fell flat. Both guys are good workers but never seem to deliver great matches together.

- The main thing about the Punk & Bryan vs The Wyatt Family I noticed was how much better Harper is than Rowan. Pretty good match. Tied MOTN with the opener.

- Wasn't paying full attention to the main, but it looked like an average match that went on for the right time.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Harper is better than Rowan, but I thought Rowan held his own out there and I wouldn't say he's downright terrible. He can work a tag team match well enough with good workers so he's not completely helpless out there.

But Harper... damn, it's great to see a big man like him who can work as well as he does. I'm definitely a fan. :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

What did most of you guys see in the 5v5 elimination tag ? It started of decent with rhodes/ambrose, gradually got better with the REAL Americans and then just fell flat after they were both eliminated ? The spears were nice but the match itself was very underwhelming. I usually dont agree with Cody about the USOs but I didnt think they should of been in that postion, and was happy Reigns eliminated both, they are kinda over exposed nowadays tbhayley


Secondly, I would love a Orton mark, huge fan or someone very invested in the angle and him to answer this for me, why is he still wrestling slow and methodical ? He is really not that character anymore, from the segments we see of him nowadays, he is always "JACKED UP" :lol, so he should speed it up in ring. Now PUTTING ALL THE BLAME on him for last night at all, just wondering


Edit: Rowan held his own very well, but Harper :lenny love that gator(alligator ?) roll


----------



## Cactus (Jul 28, 2011)

SKINS25 said:


> What did most of you guys see in the 5v5 elimination tag ? It started of decent with rhodes/ambrose, gradually got better with the REAL Americans and then just fell flat after they were both eliminated ? The spears were nice but the match itself was very underwhelming. I usually dont agree with Cody about the USOs but I didnt think they should of been in that postion, and was happy Reigns eliminated both, they are kinda over exposed nowadays tbhayley


I thought the 5 vs 5 had all of the magic of all the previous Goldust/Rhodes tag team matches as of late. Really good hot tag build-up, always gets a great response from the crowd and it's just a whole lot of fun. I'd agree with you that the match loses a few points once Cesaro gets eliminated but I think that Reigns awesome little performance in the finishing stretch helps make up for the dull middle portion of the match.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The opener was very good, ***1/2 to ***3/4, Reigns was Godly, but that's all I've watched. Was Yes In The World/Wyatts good?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

SKINS25 said:


> Secondly, I would love a Orton mark, huge fan or someone very invested in the angle and him to answer this for me, why is he still wrestling slow and methodical ? He is really not that character anymore, from the segments we see of him nowadays, he is always "JACKED UP" :lol, so he should speed it up in ring. Now PUTTING ALL THE BLAME on him for last night at all, just wondering


I actually agree with you. The viper stuff is all in the past and he has no reason to work so slow to portray an angry character. DAMMIT RANDY, STOP MOVING AT A SNAIL'S PACE!


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I thought it was just me lol, the main reason i just cant watch Orton matches, not even against Bryan tbh


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> *I actually agree with you*. The viper stuff is all in the past and he has no reason to work so slow to portray an angry character. DAMMIT RANDY, STOP MOVING AT A SNAIL'S PACE!


:hb :hb, just a observation I made, his character seems always amped up, and frustrated with the corp, the viper/slow style should be put to bed

@Cactus I guess, the middle portion was just to dull for me tbh, its not even funny how downhill it went once Cesaro left, I think some got eliminated to early and some out stayed their welcome. The shield parts besides Reign going crazy was pretty repetitive 

Hopefully we get a Rey vs. reign/rollins tonight :lenny


----------



## reDREDD (Oct 12, 2008)

orton really needs to get back to 2006 not shit style


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I would even take "Age of Orton" Randy from late 2007-2008 pre-injury.

That's the problem with him, he has this horrible taste and thinks he's better now with a shaved head and this super slow style and hates his old theme which was awesome. When thinking about it, I guess I can't blame him since the old Orton was a drug addict with a bad attitude and he'd rather forget about that.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Choke2Death said:


> I would even take "Age of Orton" Randy from late 2007-2008 pre-injury.
> 
> That's the problem with him, he has this horrible taste and thinks he's better now with a shaved head and this super slow style and hates his old theme which was awesome. When thinking about it, *I guess I can't blame him since the old Orton was a drug addict with a bad attitude and he'd rather forget about that.*


That's actually an interesting point that I've never thought of before.

I really wish I could just bring out the 12-year old-me and mark for Orton like crazy again. Back in 2004-2005 I was as big of a mark for him as I am for Punk now believe it or not (just as excited for Taker/Orton WM21 back then as I was for Taker/Punk this year as well). The guy just makes it impossible for me to mark for him like that. I mean, I still do like him and when he was facing Show, when he faces Cena, you can bet your ass I'll be pulling for Orton. But damn, the guy falling as far as he did on my list of favorites... even guys like Punk and Sandow, who I mark for immensely, could fall at some point. Hell, with Punk it was starting to happen towards the tail-end of his face run in 2012. For Sandow... I don't know. If they strip him completely of his gimmick, it's possible a year down the line I won't be as big on him as I am now.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I think actually or have hear its more of a injury whats to play it safe mentality as opposed to the wanting to forget his past. Not saying that isnt a part of it, look at hbk although for different reasons


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Only Orton match I've been bothered to watch recently was the first PPV one against Bryan for the title. Then when that sucked I just gave up on Orton completely. He doesn't have ANYTHING to make me want to watch him. He's downright TERRIBLE right now, regardless of who he faces. He's having horrible feuds and horrible matches and I just don't give a fuck about him in the slightest. I'd sooner watch Big E Vs Curtis Axel Vs The Miz Vs Kofi Kingston.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> I would even take "Age of Orton" Randy from late 2007-2008 pre-injury.
> 
> That's the problem with him, he has this horrible taste and thinks he's better now with a shaved head and this super slow style and hates his old theme which was awesome. When thinking about it, I guess I can't blame him since the old Orton was a drug addict with a bad attitude and he'd rather forget about that.



I guess I can understand that when you put it that way. I'm a recovering addict too (been clean for 3 years) and I still get that nauseating feeling when I think back to some of the stuff that went on in my life. Maybe Orton is just so set on being a completely different dude than he was that he has lost what made him such a special "sure fire hall of Famer" talent back then. Orton back in 2004-2005 was one of the few guys that both Smarks could appreciate for his ring work and heel character, and WWE loved because he has the "look" and is marketable. He just seems to have completely lost his way, watching all these 2005 PPVs from the set I got recently the difference in his matches is just jarring. He was so versatile back then, he could work a ground it out mat wrestling match, he could base well for a guy like Mysterio, he could be a total chicken shit against Taker, he could go toe to toe HBK, he had it all. I don't get it, I just don't.

Nostalgia- I would disagree STRONGLY with your statement that Bryan has been booked well since Summerslam. Winning over Cena clean was the pinnacle of his push, things have just gone down hill since. I'm not saying he's been booked weak necessarily, he's more been booked in a way that makes all the fans lose interest and kill his steam. First, he just gets run down all the time by the Authority talking about how weak and stupid he looks and that he's no WWE champion. Is that supposed to make us get behind him? When Vince did similar stuff to Stone Cold, Austin ALWAYS got the upper hand eventually, via a stunner, a beer truck, a can of whoop ass, whatever. Bryan just has to sit and take the abuse and never get his revenge. He got screwed out of the title at NOC with absolutely ZERO explanation as to what the back story was. He has a heel as his opponent who has the heat of the artic tundra. I could go one, but I don't think many people will disagree with me when I say they WWE mishandled Bryan's push about as bad as you can without having him job to Hornswoggle.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

So SS went like Cena came out to no reaction, had a stare down with Orton that nobody gave a fuck about and a tumbleweed was seen rolling across the arena, and they completley missed Vince fucking McMahon coming out to confront the two baffoons.

:lmao

The words arse and elbow spring to mind.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> I guess I can understand that when you put it that way. I'm a recovering addict too (been clean for 3 years) and I still get that nauseating feeling when I think back to some of the stuff that went on in my life. Maybe Orton is just so set on being a completely different dude than he was that he has lost what made him such a special "sure fire hall of Famer" talent back then. Orton back in 2004-2005 was one of the few guys that both Smarks could appreciate for his ring work and heel character, and WWE loved because he has the "look" and is marketable. He just seems to have completely lost his way, watching all these 2005 PPVs from the set I got recently the difference in his matches is just jarring. He was so versatile back then, he could work a ground it out mat wrestling match, he could base well for a guy like Mysterio, he could be a total chicken shit against Taker, he could go toe to toe HBK, he had it all. I don't get it, I just don't.


We still have gotten a glimpse of the old Orton a few times. Most recently, his promos have improved for the first time in like 5 years and I actually find myself looking forward to hear him talk. Likewise, we were shades of old Orton in 2011 when his matches were worked way better than the slow mo shit he usually does now.

Sadly, he's so set in his "new" ways so he'll stick to it as long as it works with the audience and management.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*Vengeance 2002*

One of the earliest wrestling DVD's I bought! And I got it in HMV in Glasgow lol. Crazy what random shite I can remember!


*Bubba Ray & Spike Dudley Vs Chris Benoit & Eddie Guerrero - Tag Team Tables Match*

Benoit's first PPV match in 13 months!

Benoit and Eddie look great early on. Spike does a short FIP and then gets a "hot" tag in on Bubba, who doesn't even get a single bit of offence in for a while! Always like when they deviate from the typical match structure without fucking shit up. Works even better here because of the fact it's Benoit's first PPV match in 13 months. Make him look STRONG in his return.

GERMAN SUPLEX TO BUBBA. Bubba takes it like a MAN.

You know that spot where someone places a guy neck first on a ring rope, then stands on their back, using all of their weight to choke their opponent? Well... that happens when Benoit does it to Bubba... and EDDIE STOMPS HIS HEAD REPEATEDLY TOO. Awesome variation on a classic move :mark:.

Man, Bubba gets absolutely CRUSHED in this match. He is the main FIP it seems and he takes one hell of a beating. Benoit is looking incredible in his PPV match return. Spike does ok coming in every now and then to try and help out, though I do find it funny that he's essentially the hot tag guy in the match .

TABLES~! I like how they take a while to bring them out, just as Benoit and Eddie believe that have finally done enough to wear down their opponents. They fail on a couple of occasions of course, because that wouldn't be very suspenseful for a match lol.

ALL OUT BRAWL~! All 4 guys are just trying to do anything to gain control of the match now that the tables are out and set up, meaning one small mistake could cost either team the match.

BUBBA THROUGH A TABLE!!! But he put himself through it so... does that mean he's lost for his team? Nah, that would be stupid (and awesome. "ladies and gentlemen, Bubba Ray has put himself through a table, therefore your winners, Chris Benoit and Eddie Guerrero!").

:lmao at Spike seemingly getting lost in the match. He sends both Eddie and Benoit to the outside... then just starts pacing up and down, looking around wondering "the fuck am I doing?". 

DUDLEY DOG! EDDIE THROUGH A TABLE!!! THIS IS AN ELIMINATION MATCH AND I TOTALLY FORGOT!!! LOL!!!

PRESS SLAM OVER THE ROPES THROUGH A TABLE!!! Awesome spot to eliminate Spike. BENOIT RULES~!

BUBBA BOMB~! BENOIT THROUGH A TABLE~! I GUESS BUBBA RULES INSTEAD BECAUSE HE JUST WON THE MATCH FOR HIS TIME!!!

Good match. Good tag action before they even attempt to bring in the tables, and from there we get some good brawling and table spots! Definitely one of the best tables matches ever, though that isn't saying much haha.

*Rating: ***1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 3*


Eric Bischoff backstage with HHH trying to convince him to sign with RAW. But HHH is having a meeting with STEPHANIE FAP FAP.


*Jamie Noble Vs Billy Kidman - WWE Cruiserweight Championship Match*

Kidman has Noble's number going into this match, havign already pinned him in a non title match and getting a big win over TAJIRI on SD last week too. All that momentum follows through into this match as Billy rocks the CW champion early on!!!

Nidia, who has helped Noble many times in the past, including KOTR where Noble won the CW title, gets involved and gets THROWN into Kidman lol, distracting him for a moment allowing the champ to target his arm.

Ya know, I'm starting to like Noble less and less the more I see his WWE work. His matches seem to just be "opponent gets the better of him early on, Nidia distracts, Noble goes for the arm. Finish". And yeah, plenty of guys work a similar match style for all their matches, but eh, Noble working the arm doesn't seem to be that engaging a lot of the time, nor does it really pay off. He doesn't have an arm submission hold, his finish is a POWERBOMB, and Nidia more often than not helps him win.

Some flashy shit at the end, then a powerbomb from Noble and he gets the win. Standard shit.

*Rating: ***
*CAL SCALE - 0.5*


Kurt Angle. He doesn't deal in IFS. He deals in WHENS.

PAUL HEYMAN AND BROCK LESNAR. This isn't the Summer of Brock, IT'S ALL YEAR ANGLE.


*William Regal Vs Jeff Hardy - WWE European Championship Match*

So Jeff is the European Champ. Regal cried after losing it :lmao. Not sure if it was about losing the belt, or more about losing it to JEFF HARDY lol.

BRUNI~! I have no idea what that is, means or is about, but Cole and Tazz bang on about it at the start of this match lol.

Regal SLAPS Jeff early in the match and Jeff just crumbles up like he got knocked out lol.

Stiff offence by Regal, flippy shitty offence by Hardy.

HALF NELSON SUPLEX :mark:.

Quick roll up and Hardy retains the title out of nowhere. Regal cries again.

Meh. Decent in parts (REGAL).

*Rating: ***
*CAL SCALE - 0.5*


Flair and Hogan congratulate Hardy on his epic EUROPEAN TITLE match win. LOL.

Flair & Hogan taking the piss out of the fact they are both old. Awesome :lmao.


*Chris Jericho Vs John Cena*

Cena pre-gimmick of any kind. LOL.

Boring stuff. Then this happens:










Then they pick up the pace for about 1 minute with a big move or two. Lionsault. Jericho doesn't cover. Cena goes all early Superman (soo... SmallVille Cena?) and gets the win still. Poor Jericho. Can't beat 2002 Cena. LOL.

*Rating: **
*CAL SCALE - 0*


Bischoff and Coach are outside of STEPHANIE'S office waiting for HHH to come out. STEPH'S attorny shows up with some papers for them to sign. Bischoff ain't happy.

Tazz and Cole getting REPLACED by Lawler and JR.


*Brock Lesnar Vs Rob Van Dam - Intercontinental Championship Match*

Last month at the KOTR, these two met in the finals, and thanks to Heyman, Lesnar picked up the win. RVD is out for VENGEANCE. AT VENGEANCE. GET IT? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Lesnar is all "lol I'm awesome" at the start of this match, then RVD is all "amma kick you in the face a bunch of times" and does and Lesnar is all "wai you kick me in the face you bitch?" and Heyman is all "stick to the plan you moron" and Lesnar is all "MURDER RVD" and does. POWERSLAM ON THE FLOOR looks and sounds epic.

:lmao RVD goes for a leg sweep... and I can't tell if Lesnar sells it terribly OR if he BOTCHES JUMPING OVER IT :lmao.

Lesnar continues to murder RVD in epic ways, while RVD gets some nice shots in here and there. I swear his kicks always looked better against Lesnar. Probably because Lesnar just let him kick him in the face for real lol.

"SQUEEZE HIM BROCK, SQUEEZE HIM! SQUEEEEEEEEEEZE!!!"

Finishing stretch is :mark:. RVD takes it right to Lesnar, goes for a frog splash, only for Lesnar to grab him off the ropes! F-5... NO!!! Countered into a DDT! 5* Frog Splash! 1..2..HEYMAN PULLS OUT THE REFEREE~! DQ loss for Lesnar!

Big brawl after the match which is pretty awesome too. Lesnar gets the last laugh. Did these two have another match after this on Raw? 

Awesome stuff. LESNAR.

*Rating: ***3/4*
*CAL SCALE - 4*


STEPHANIE comes out of her office. Bischoff asks if HHH signed. She says yes. He goes insane. HHH comes out. Bischoff goes off on one. Turns out it was DIVORCE PAPERS that he signed. LOLOLOL.


*The Big Show Vs Booker T - No DQ & No Countouts Match*

Show being all giant-y and throwing Booker around = :mark:.

KNOCKOUT PUNCH TO THE STEEL CHAIR~!

What the fuck just happened? I... what? The fuck? Show smashed Booker T into the ring post... then ran at Booker to crush him between his own body and the ring post... and BOOKER T DIDN'T MOVE. What? That's like, the most obvious spot ever in a match. Nobody EVER hits that. The guy ALWAYS moves.

Ok, things are back to normal, the Spanish Announce Table gets broken . With a pretty cool AXE KICK. And good god Big Show is back up! Big Show is still going! How is Booker gonna stop this GIANT?

LOW BLOW. AXE KICK. HOUSTON HANGOVER!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!

Booker T wins!

Super fun match, and probably my favourite BOOKER T match. Not quite his best, but definitely one of the funnest. Me likely long time.

*Rating: ***1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 2*


TORRIE WILSON AND DAWN MARIE FAP FAP FAP. They argue over pointless shit. JR says they don't have time for them and they move on :lmao.

TIME TO PLAY THE GAME. OF CONTRACT NEGOTIATION. Stephanie and Bischoff are both wanting to sign HHH to their show. HHH decides to go with STEPHANIE because he's the hottest or something. HBK shows up. Convinces HHH to come to Raw. Always liked this segment tbh. I'm not overly high on IN RING SEGMENTS taking place on a PPV, but this felt big and important and was GOOD, so I'm fine with it tbh.

Booker T being interviewed backstage, but more importantly... GOLDUST IS WITH HIM. GOLDUST. WOOO. Crazy to think that GOLDUST is still going strong 11 years later and outperforming 99% of the entire roster.


*Edge & Hulk Hogan Vs Lance Storm & Christian - WWE Tag Team Championship Match*

So this is a match. With tags. A tag match, if you will. They do stuff. I don't care. New tag champs. Whatever.

"THEY'RE GONNA RUB IT IN OUR FACES AND SHOVE IT DOWN OUR THROATS EVERY CHANCE THEY GET"

*Rating: **
*CAL SCALE - 0*


STEPHANIE FAP FAP claims she's gonna rip the HEART out of Raw. I can't remember exactly who that ended up being. Lesnar after SS? Undertaker after SS? Eddie & Benoit before SS?


*The Undertaker Vs The Rock Vs Kurt Angle - WWE Undisputed Championship Match*

:mark:. Loved this since it happened. Bought this DVD for this match alone. Had it at ***** and the GOAT triple threat for a LONG time. Don't hold it in such high regard any more but it's still a favourite of mine.

Kinda wish this had just been Angle Vs Undertaker. Build up with their tie on SD leading to a PPV match would have been :mark:. Rock just ruined the whole thing lol. He tries to screw Undertaker out of the title for NO REASON at KOTR and ends up getting a title match. Fuck you, Rock.

Undertaker and Rock have a staredown to start things off, and poor Kurt feels left out. So he gets their attention. And they maul him :lmao.

Undertaker is :mark:. He has Rock in the corner getting ready to beat the fuck out of him, and the fans start chanting for Rock. Undertaker looks on with sheer DISTAIN, then decides to really fucking DECK Rock with a MASSIVE punch and I :mark: the entire time.

CHOKESLAM~! BY THE ROCK! ON UNDERTAKER!!!

ANKLE LOCK~! BY THE ROCK! ON KURT ANGLE!!!

ROCK BOTTOM~! BY KURT ANGLE! ON THE ROCK!!!

ANGLE SLAM~! BY THE UNDERTAKER! ON KURT ANGLE!!!

:mark: Man that whole sequence is such fun. Everyone using everyone else's finisher. The ultimate sign of disrespect, and if they could have WON with someone else's move it would have been something to brag about until the end of time.

:lmao at Lawler MARKING OUT like a bitch because Rock spat HIS water into Undertaker's face. 

Undertaker continues to rule this whole thing. Beats the fuck out of Angle, and beats the fuck out of Rock for spitting water in his face too. NOBODY GONNA STOP THE CHAMP!

ANGLE IS BLEEDING. FROM PUNCHES TO THE HEAD BY UNDERTAKER :mark:.

APRON LEG DROP~!

Holy FUCK at that Old School. Instead of smashing down on Angle's arm... he fucking PUNCHES HIM IN THE FACE. OFF THE TOP ROPE. EPIC.

Undertaker :mark:. He really is on top of his game here. Angle tries to deck him with a chair, but he sees him coming and blasts him in the face with a punch! He is on a roll, and it takes a LOW BLOW by The Rock (what a standup guy!) behind the referee's back and a chair shot to the head by Angle to take him down.

ANGLE SLAM TO ROCK~!

LAST RIDE TO ROCK~!

ANKLE LOCK TO UNDERTAKER~!

UNDERTAKER ESCAPES~!

LAST RIDE~! NO! COUNTERED INTO THE TRIANGLE CHOKE JUST LIKE SMACKDOWN!!! Callback spot :mark:.

This time Undertaker counters it with a powerbomb, but Angle holds on and Undertaker is fading fast!!!

CHOKESLAM TO ANGLE~! Undertaker is looking like the baddest motherfucker on the PLANET in this. ROCK BOTTOM! UNDERTAKER KICKS OUT!!!!!!!

ROCK BOTTOM TO ANGLE~! UNDERTAKER CAN'T GET THERE IN TIME. ROCK WINS THE TITLE. BOOOOOOO!

:mark: This still holds up as a super fucking fun match. 3 guys just beating the absolute FUCK out of each other. A lot of times this style of match just doesn't work, but for whatever reason, everything clicks here and it's :mark:.

Undertaker was just SPECTACULAR in this match btw. MVP of the match and THEN SOME. Just incredible tbh. It's like he KNEW his last few PPV matches were god awful (Hogan, HHH x 2), and wanted to show everyone that he's still the fucking MAN. And he did. He is STILL THE FUCKING MAN. 

*Rating: *****
*CAL SCALE - 5*



*Overall CAL SCALE - 15*​


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Not sure if Brock/RVD had a Raw match afterwards, but they did have one before Vengeance on 06/24/2002.

Love that Vengeance match though.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

RVD/BROCK is such an awesome match, just non-stop fun. The triple threat main event is the best of its kind after the two Benoit classics with HHH/HBK. And that opener with Benoit and Eddie can never be anything less than good considering the talent involved. lol @ Cena/Jericho, though. Even back then Jericho was damn near a jobber. I need to speed up my 1997 watching so I can get to the early 2000s already! As well as 98 and 99 when I can reminisce the good days of Austin and Rock entertaining like no other weekly.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Nostalgia- I would disagree STRONGLY with your statement that Bryan has been booked well since Summerslam. Winning over Cena clean was the pinnacle of his push, things have just gone down hill since. I'm not saying he's been booked weak necessarily, he's more been booked in a way that makes all the fans lose interest and kill his steam. First, he just gets run down all the time by the Authority talking about how weak and stupid he looks and that he's no WWE champion. Is that supposed to make us get behind him? When Vince did similar stuff to Stone Cold, Austin ALWAYS got the upper hand eventually, via a stunner, a beer truck, a can of whoop ass, whatever. Bryan just has to sit and take the abuse and never get his revenge. He got screwed out of the title at NOC with absolutely ZERO explanation as to what the back story was. He has a heel as his opponent who has the heat of the artic tundra. I could go one, but I don't think many people will disagree with me when I say they WWE mishandled Bryan's push about as bad as you can without having him job to Hornswoggle.


Nah I think he knows that so as I, I think he is (me also) coming from the standpoint, he is being booked like a cena/hhh as opposed to another certain superstar that should remain nameless :ziggler3 so bryan-marks shouldnt get their panties in a bunch and act like he getting buried because its FAR from true


----------



## Cleavage (Apr 19, 2005)

Judgement Day 2003 is such a terrible show.

John Cena & The F.B.I. vs. Chris Benoit, Spanky & Rhino **
La Résistance vs. Scott Steiner & Test *3/4
Team Angle vs. Eddie Guerrero & Tajiri (WWE Tag Team Championship/Ladder Match) ***1/4 - ***1/2
Battle Royal (Intercontinental Championship) **3/4
Mr. America vs. Roddy Piper DUD!
Triple H vs. Kevin Nash (World Heavyweight Championship) *
Jazz vs. Trish Stratus vs. Jacqueline vs. Victoria (Women’s Championship) *1/2
Brock Lesnar vs. Big Show (WWE Championship/Stretcher Match) ***1/2



Spoiler: Good Stuff



*Ladder Match For The WWE Tag Team Championships: Team Angle vs. Eddie Guerrero & Tajiri *
The Team of Eddie and Tajiri, MARK! I also just realized whoever put this matches in order is a FUCKIN’ RETARD! This is the 3rd tag match in a row and it’s a gimmick match. SERIOUSLY! The match starts out with Tajiri going to the ring to face Haas and Eddie takes on Benjamin in the aisle way. Shelton whips Eddie into the ladder, which is in the aisle way as Tajiri takes out Hass in the ring with a spinning wheel kick. He goes for the Pearl Harbor Kick on Hass, but Benjamin comes in and they put the boots to him before nailing a double team back elbow. Eddie gets into the ring and Shelton presses him onto Haas’ knee in a double team gut buster. Team Angle go underneath the ring to retrieve another ladder for some reason and Tajiri attempts a pescado onto Haas. But he doesn’t get high enough in the air and Tajiri gets caught on the ropes and the move is blown badly :lmao Eddie tries one of his own onto Benjamin and overshoots him. Shelton doesn’t sell it, Team Angle get the ladder into the ring and set it up to head for the Tag Titles, but Tajiri sneaks in and hits a handspring back elbow into the ladder to knock the ladder and them down. Eddie comes into the ring and sets up the ladder into Haas’ crotch and he and Tajiri baseball slide into it, AWESOME! Eddie and Tajiri put another ladder into the ring and place Haas onto it, sandwiching him in between two of them. Guerrero hits his slingshot senton onto the ladders, squashing Haas and causing some back pain for himself as well. Tajiri starts to climb the ladder, but Shelton pulls him off of it and Tajiri’s jaw smacks one of the steps hard way. Shelton starts climbing the ladder, but doesn’t get far before Eddie dropkicks him off. Eddie places the ladder in the corner and goes to whip Shelton into it, but Benjamin powerslams him onto it. Haas then places Tajiri on one of the ladders, holding it horizontally while Shelton climbs the other jumping off onto Tajiri’s back in a modification of Team Angle’s leap frog backbreaker double team moves. Shelton starts to climb, but Eddie gets up and knocks the ladder over, sending Haas to the floor. Eddie takes a ladder and rams it into Shelton’s midsection and then wedges it in between the top and middle turnbuckles. He goes to whip Shelton into it, but for the second time in a row, Shelton reverses it and Eddie’s back goes crashing into the ladder. In another poorly executed spot, Tajiri kicks that ladder like a see saw to send it flying into Shelton’s face, so Tajiri does it again without much power and then Shelton has to sell the weak shot. Haas gets back into the ring and Tajiri nails him with a roundhouse kick and Shelton gets one as well. Tajiri takes the ladder from the corner and uses it to ram into the midsection of both Team Angle members. Tajiri baseball slides the ladder into both men, which barely hits Shelton. Tajiri turns his attention to Haas and puts the Tarantula on him, but Shelton nails him with the ladder as he’s performing the move. Back in the ring now, as Team Angle are beating on Eddie. Haas goes to set up the ladder, but Eddie is able to monkey flip Shelton out of the corner and into the ladder, knocking them both down. Eddie suplexes Shelton to the outside and tosses Haas out as well before setting up the ladder for himself. He starts to climb it, but Team Angle all already back in the ring. He’s able to fight them off and being climbing, but Haas is on the other side of the ladder and Shelton is underneath him. Eddie shoves Shelton down and Frogsplashes him off of the ladder. Haas starts climbing up the ladder now and Eddie begins to climb the other side, brawling at the top. He nails Haas and hits the SUNSET FLIP POWERBOMB! Off the ladder! And now Eddie starts to climb the ladder again, but Shelton is in and has a hold of his legs. But Tajiri gets into the ring and climbs the other side MIST! To Shelton’s face and that allows Eddie to pull down the titles for the win. If it wasn’t for a few awkward moments I would have had this a lot higher, but it’s still a really enjoyable match. ***1/4 - ***1/2

*Stretcher Match For The WWE Championship: Brock Lesnar vs. The Big Show*
There are a few stretchers at ringside and the way to win the match is you have to place your opponent on a stretcher and rolled past a yellow line at the top of the ramp. There are no count outs and no DQ’s as well. Show comes to the ring with the same stretcher board he’s been using in recent weeks with Mysterio’s, Benoit’s and Lesnar’s name on it. Show charges at Lesnar with the board, but Lesnar ducks and unleashes a flurry of kicks and punches onto Show before nailing him with a few board shots to the back, including one to the head that knocks Show over the top rope. He nails him with it a few more times, but Show comes back with a boot to the midsection and a headbutt that Lesnar sells PHENOMENALLY! Show sets the board up near the ring post and goes to ram Lesnar into it, but Brock slips out and shoves Show into the post himself. Lesnar rams the stretcher into Show’s face, he goes to do it a 2nd time but Show is able to come back with a clubbing blow and a press slam onto the stretcher. Show takes the board and just nails Brock on the back with it before throwing Brock back into the ring where Lesnar is able to get the advantage with shoulder tackles. Lesnar tries to whip Show out of the corner, but Show grabs him and hits a MASSIVE Chokeslam. Show heads to ringside to get a stretcher board and puts it into the ring to put Brock on. He places Brock on the board and Show drops a big leg on him. Show places Brock on a stretcher and begins wheeling him towards the yellow line, but Brock kicks Show and tries to sit up, but Show clotheslines Brock off of the stretcher and he takes a hard fall onto the floor! Show once again kills Brock with the stretcher board before heading back to the ring with him. Lesnar tries to fight back and heads up the ramp, but decides to kills him some more with the stretcher board several times and uses some electrical cable to choke out Show as well. Brock then places Show on a stretcher and tries to wheel him past the yellow line, but Show holds onto the cable and gets pulled off of the stretcher. They begin brawling up the ramp again and Lesnar FUCKIN’ BODY SLAMS Show onto stretcher, but Show falls off of it. Lesnar simply can’t keep him on the stretcher no matter what he tries. He rams the stretcher into Show’s body, but it turns into a tug of war that Lesnar uses when Show rams it into Brock’s ribs. Show positions a stretcher in the aisle way and rams Lesnar into the steel post before getting another stretcher board from under the ring. Lesnar gets into the ring as Show gets on the apron and Lesnar charges at Show knocking him off of the apron onto the stretcher that Show placed at ringside but falling off because the stretcher is just too small. Lesnar leaves and heads to the back, pointing to his head. All of a sudden, Rey Mysterio’s music hits and Rey from behind and attacks Show with a 619 to the midsection! Rey’s offense is short lived though as Show clotheslines the hell out of him and signals for the Chokeslam. But Brock BUSTS through the stage with a forklift and the crowd erupts. He drives it to the ring and the distraction allows Rey to get on Show with a sleeper as Lesnar gets on the forklift. Show tosses Rey off but Lesnar gives into the ring with a flying cross body off the forklift :mark: He charges at Show with shoulder tackles in the corner then a Suplex to the Big Show, Brock then decides to hit him with a F5 before placing him on the stretcher board, then on the forklift and drives him past the yellow line to retain the title. FUCKIN’ AWESOME MATCH! Both men bumped like crazy for one another, and I loved the story with Show being too big to fit on the normal stretcher so we finally see the smarts of BROCK! To bring out the forklift. The forklift was also what Show, Train and FBI used to lock Brock in a room back on SD so that was a nice call back to use against Show. ***1/2



Everything else can suck a dick.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Heheh, than Nash/Trips match was an abomination.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> Nah I think he knows that so as I, I think he is (me also) coming from the standpoint, he is being booked like a cena/hhh as opposed to another certain superstar that should remain nameless :ziggler3 so bryan-marks shouldnt get their panties in a bunch and act like he getting buried because its FAR from true



Oh in no way would I say he is getting buried, that's just nonsense. He's twice as big now as he was at the same point last year. Bryan will be just fine, cream always rises to the top and talent will shine through. I just think WWE really mishandled his big push, much the same way they mishandled Punks. It's unfortunate, but it's not something he won't overcome.

Ziggler on the other hand I legit worry about at times. He's one of my favorites, but Jesus, he's really gonna put to test the theory that talent will always shine through. I wonder if he's some how pissed odd everyone backstage and that's why he's getting the shovel treatment. If WWE was really all about the fans, they wouldn't punish guys by taking them off TV and or jobbing them out. It's self defeating, arrogant, and foolish in the long run.

Great review Cal. Btw, just FYI, Jericho was booked to go over Cena at Vengeance but went to Vince and insisted on putting Cena over because he really liked him and thought he was a potential star. If Jericho faced Mick Foley in a match this year, I think it might go on for all eternity, as both guys just would refuse to win and would try to put each other over again and again


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

What do y'all think of Owen/123 from KOTR 1994?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

"No psychology. No real storytelling. Just 2 guys throwing out spectacular moves for under 4 minutes. Shit load of fun to watch, but that's all really."

From my last review of it . They had a better match on Raw.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

That's *exactly* what I thought.  There was a small glimpse of a story though - Owen's baseball slides at the start, they were a sign of Owen trying to end Waltman as quickly as possible.


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

Survivor Series - Best to Worst

Wyatt's/Punk,Bryan ***1/2
Team Rhodes/Team Shield ***
Axel/Langston **
Orton/Show ** 
Cena/ADR *
Henry/Ryback *
Divas match *

Saw people complaining about the length of the main event, that was honestly the best match they could've had.
Orton & Cena are so similar it's scary, 99% of the time they're a chore to watch and the other 1% they put out some quality stuff.


----------



## Cactus (Jul 28, 2011)

I'm a big fan of that match. Owen's counter German and Powerbomb were absolute cracking spots. Makes you wonder why X-Pac was so disliked. In those four minutes, you're on the edge of your seat hoping that the Kid will beat Owen and you're crushed when he doesn't. That's what makes any match for me. They actually made me care who wins.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

*The Undertaker vs The Rock - King Of The Ring 1999*

'WWF Championship Match'

Tagged Classic Version - Unedited/Unblurred:

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-m...er-vs-rock-king-ring-1999-a.html#post26787585

DAT Ministry Taker


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

The Sandrone said:


> Harper is better than Rowan, but I thought Rowan held his own out there and I wouldn't say he's downright terrible. He can work a tag team match well enough with good workers so he's not completely helpless out there.
> 
> But Harper... damn, it's great to see a big man like him who can work as well as he does. I'm definitely a fan. :mark:


Agreed. I made a point about Rowan actually looked decent for once in last night's match in my review of the show. But Harper's much better though, and his discus clothesline finisher he does is one of my favorites in the WWE right now, and I like especially how JBL marks for it. Because he would know what a good clothesline is. (Y) 



Cactus Jack said:


> Nostalgia- I would disagree STRONGLY with your statement that Bryan has been booked well since Summerslam. Winning over Cena clean was the pinnacle of his push, things have just gone down hill since. I'm not saying he's been booked weak necessarily, he's more been booked in a way that makes all the fans lose interest and kill his steam. First, he just gets run down all the time by the Authority talking about how weak and stupid he looks and that he's no WWE champion. Is that supposed to make us get behind him? When Vince did similar stuff to Stone Cold, Austin ALWAYS got the upper hand eventually, via a stunner, a beer truck, a can of whoop ass, whatever. Bryan just has to sit and take the abuse and never get his revenge. He got screwed out of the title at NOC with absolutely ZERO explanation as to what the back story was. He has a heel as his opponent who has the heat of the artic tundra. I could go one, but I don't think many people will disagree with me when I say they WWE mishandled Bryan's push about as bad as you can without having him job to Hornswoggle.


I didn't say he's been booked well, did I? I was just disagreeing with your silly statement that Bryan has received AWFUL booking, when in reality he's received a mixed bag. He got a clean win over Cena, and a clean over Orton. In addition Orton never could beat Bryan for the title without help. And Bryan was beating The Shield most weeks as well. So in matches Bryan was receiving good, protective booking. The bad booking comes from WWE not following up with their chance to create a new star and after those big wins Bryan got he's now back in the midcard for the time being, BUT this could just be temporary and we'll what happens come Road to WrestleMania time. The authority constantly running down Bryan about how Bryan wasn't main event material and is a B+ player I thought was a good storyline because I agreed with it, to me Bryan isn't main event material and from a appearance standpoint he looks like a joke who I find very hard to take seriously, but regardless of my views they've done similar storylines to this before, and it makes the fans want to get behind the underdog and see him finally triumph over it, and that's what happened when Bryan beat Orton at Night of Champions... but the problem is they then stripped him of the title and didn't follow up with it. 

But I think it's silly though to say Bryan's getting awful booking when there's wrestlers like Ziggler and Sandow who are getting booked far worse. Look at Ziggler's fall from being World Champion earlier in the year to not even making the card for the Survivor Series PPV, while Bryan is at least still in relevant matches with build, and his matches are getting the biggest investment from the crowd, but just because he's in the midcard now (and maybe only temporarily) people are going to cry about it and say he's getting booked awful? Please..


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

After seeing Cleavage's star ratings of JD 03, I must rewatch Lesnar/Show because I remember absolutely adoring it on the last watch, which was about a year and a half ago. Would probably have it as a top ten Brock match, as well, so I'm interested to see if it still holds up.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

*Full Content for WWE Best Pay-Per-View Matches 2013 DVD*

http://www.wrestlingdvdnews.com/full-content-for-wwe-best-pay-per-view-matches-2013-dvd/55009/

DISC 1

An Historic Year

WWE Best PPV Matches 2013 Match Listing
WWE Championship Match
CM Punk vs. The Rock
Royal Rumble • January 27, 2013

Six Man Tag Team Match
John Cena, Ryback & Sheamus vs. The Shield (Dean Ambrose, Roman Reigns & Seth Rollins)
Elimination Chamber • February 17, 2013

Straight Edge vs. The Streak

Undertaker vs. CM Punk
WrestleMania • April 7, 2013

WWE Championship Match
The Rock vs. John Cena
WrestleMania • April 7, 2013


DISC 2



RKO vs. WMD

Extreme Rules Match
Randy Orton vs. Big Show
Extreme Rules • May 19, 2013

Steel Cage Match
Triple H vs. Brock Lesnar
Extreme Rules • May 19, 2013

A Perfect Payback

Triple Threat Intercontinental Championship Match
Wade Barrett vs. The Miz vs. Curtis Axel
Payback • June 16, 2013

WWE Divas Championship Match
Kaitlyn vs. AJ Lee
Payback • June 16, 2013

World Heavyweight Championship Match
Dolph Ziggler vs. Alberto Del Rio
Payback • June 16, 2013

Climbing the Ladder of Success

World Heavyweight Championship Money in the Bank Ladder Match
Cody Rhodes vs. Dean Ambrose vs. Wade Barrett vs. Jack Swagger vs. Antonio Cesaro vs. Fandango vs. Damien Sandow
Money in the Bank • July 14, 2013


DISC 3



The Best vs. The Beast

No Disqualification Match
CM Punk vs. Brock Lesnar
SummerSlam • August 18, 2013

WWE Championship Match
John Cena vs. Daniel Bryan
Special Guest Referee: Triple H
SummerSlam • August 18, 2013

The Drive to be Champion

World Heavyweight Championship Match
Alberto Del Rio vs. Rob Van Dam
Night of Champions • September 15, 2013

Fatal 4-Way Match for WWE Divas Championship
AJ Lee vs. Natalya vs. Naomi vs. Brie Bella
Night of Champions • September 15, 2013

The Shield (Seth Rollins & Roman Reigns) vs. Cody Rhodes & Goldust
Battleground • October 6, 2013

World Heavyweight Championship Match
Alberto Del Rio vs. John Cena
Hell in a Cell • October 27, 2013

Hell in a Cell Match for WWE Championship
Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan
Special Guest Referee: Shawn Michaels
Hell in a Cell • October 27, 2013

Nothing Short of Incredible


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Shield/Superfriends, Punk/Taker, Dolph/Del Rio, Punk/Lesnar, Bryan/Cena and Rhodes/Shield on one DVD?

:moyes1


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

8 good-awesome matches Vs 9 shitty matches that don't deserve to be on anything called the "best" of .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Great review cal, pretty sure I had that at 15.5, so not too far off

Like the Match content for that DVD, outside of the Rock matches we all knew would be on there. Will pick it up!


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Surely disc 1 should be "_A_ Historic Year"?

Rock/Cena, Orton/Show, I-C triple threat, Diva Fatal-4-Way, Cena/Del Rio, HIAC :banderas


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Callamus said:


> 8 good-awesome matches Vs 9 shitty matches that don't deserve to be on anything called the "best" of .


I think Rock vs Punk definitely deserves to be part of a "Best of Comedy" set.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Its more sad than funny though . And not sad in a "cry your eyes out way" either lol.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Anything worth watching from last night?


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Rock Vs Punk on a "Best of" set?

I have no witty response. That's just stupid .


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm hard from that match listing, sub out the fatal 4 divas with brie/nattie summerslam and its perfection :ziggler3


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Evan, surely you were excited for the return of Juicy J last night.

Judgment Day 2003 sucked. Thank goodness for :brock to make it somewhat redeemable. He also made Extreme Rules this year not the worst PPV of the year too. Bless you Brock, we need you!


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

The Lady Killer said:


> Anything worth watching from last night?


Opening 5 on 5 for a really great performance (won't spoil who it is ) and Bryan/Punk vs. Wyatts.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Clint Eastwood said:


> *Full Content for WWE Best Pay-Per-View Matches 2013 DVD*
> 
> Fatal 4-Way Match for WWE Divas Championship
> AJ Lee vs. Natalya vs. Naomi vs. Brie Bella
> Night of Champions • September 15, 2013


:ti

Matches like Rock/Punk and Rock/Cena were awful, but they were at least big matches so you kind of expect them to be on a DVD, but a random four way divas match on a *Best* PPV matches of the year set? :lmao


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I counted 9 matches that I'll actually end up watching, so I guess I'll pick the set up from Walmart when it comes out.

:banderas at the Divas 4 way being on there.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

They always throw in a couple divas matches just for the hell of it. 

good that Kaitlyn/AJ is on it though


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

The Lady Killer said:


> Anything worth watching from last night?


Nothing great. Punk/Bryan vs Wyatt's was fine and so was the opener. Neither are anything close to being great though although one had great booking, the other not so much.

Watch anything else from the show if you have fucking insomnia because god knows it will cure it.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

6 matches on that set I want to own. It just might save me from buying Mania 29 and Summerslam 13 too from the looks of it :lol. I'm pleasantly surprised by that and the fact that it has Shield/Super Friends on there >>>>>>>>>


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Huh. Kind of figured that Rock/Cena would be on the Best of 2013 set, but as big a Punk fan that I am, I can't buy Rock/Punk being on it. Oh well. Punk's on there multiple times, which is cool for. Wish that Christian/Del Rio could have been on it, but either they didn't think it was good enough, or that Summerslam having two matches on the set was enough. Random four way Divas match on it :lmao

Question: What do people think of Triple H/Jericho at WM 18 and Triple H/Rock from Smackdown 8/26/1999? Trips/Rock is for the title and is the match where HBK kicks Rock as he's going for the People's Elbow, letting Trips retain. I like the match, but it doesn't feel like a very big match, and there's not much too it. It's currently near the bottom of the Trips Top 100.

Trips/Jericho from Mania I thought was fine, but suffered due to the crowd being burned out from Rock/Hogan. Have it currently at ***1/2.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

HHH/Jericho is terrible. 

Chris Jericho Vs Triple H - Wanna talk about shit builds for matches at this event? Look no further than this. HHH Vs Stephanie is pretty much the build up. Jericho is Stephanie's bitch, cleaning up dog shit and whatnot. But Jericho is the champion so he has to be the one to wrestling HHH lol. Instead of leaving Stephanie out of it (though her tits do fall out of her top later in this match...) and having HHH Vs Jericho for the title, building on the fact HHH injured his quad in that tag match involving Jericho, and Jericho still locked in the Walls after he tore it and whatnot... they do the whole Stephanie Vs HHH with them breaking up bullshit. Urgh. At least during the match they use the story of the leg injury and shit, with Jericho going after the leg. It's smart and shit, but fuck is it DULL. When it comes to HHH Vs Jericho, HHH should always be the heel and Jericho the face. Really doesn't work the other way around imo. PEDIGREE TO STEPH. And her tits can't stay in her top too well. LOL. Pedigree to Jericho, new champ. Yawn. **.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I agree completely that the build was stupid, and Jericho was really the third wheel, and that these two do their best work when Trips is the heel, though Jericho is a great heel in his own right.

I may put this on the rewatch list (along with a number of others since I've been doing this project since at June). Expecting some ratings to change.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

PPV Matches of 2013 looks pretty solid. Bryan/Cena & Shields/Rhodes Bros alone is awesome, let alone a pretty good set around it.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I did a write-up of the chamber matches from the Satan's Prison set earlier this year or late last year, don't remember. Either way, it's in the old thread, and I can't be bothered to find it.

*Triple H vs Undertaker vs Jeff Hardy vs Edge vs Big Show vs Vladimr Kovlov (Smackdown Chamber) NWO 2009*

Edge and Hardy start things off and after a bit of back and forth, Edge looks for the spear but Hardy counters into the small package and eliminates Edge early. If you've seen the rest of the show, you know what happens. Kovlov and Show get in, and the match just lags for like, 10-12 minutes. Man, I hated Kozlov. Trips gets in and things get better, but things don't really heat up until Taker gets in. He hits the last ride on Kozlov for the elimination. Later, Hardy climbs the chamber to the top of a pod, leading Show to climb up the top turnbuckle, attacking Hardy. Taker follows Show up and hits the superplex, which Hardy follows up with a Swanton, leading to Trips taking advantage and pinning Show, eliminating him. Taker eliminates Jeff Hardy, catching him and hitting the Tombstone. Taker and Trips have a sick back and forth, with each guy kicking out of the other's finishers. Trips gets Taker in the corner and Taker attempts a Last Ride out of the corner, which Trips jumps out of, and hits Taker with a second Pedigree, getting the win, with JR proclaiming, "Thirteen times, THE GAME!" Like I said, first half of this match sucks, but picks up and turns into a sweet fucking match. ****3/4*


----------



## reDREDD (Oct 12, 2008)

im not gonna lie, this has been a phenomenal year for tag team matches

really reminded how that brand of wrestling can be even better than singles when done right


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Just a shame that I can't see the tag division staying this good for much longer. Rumours of Cody and Goldust eventually feuding, Shield breaking up and Real Americans going their own way. Leaves us with bugger all .


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

We still have the USOS. I actually like them, honestly. But I wish to fuck that Cole and JBL would quit using their catchphrase. fpalm

Wyatts could very well get into a tag title feud when they finish with Punk/Bryan.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

FLUX said:


> Cena and Orton, the two worst workers in the company?





Chismo said:


> Lolz, I remember him saying that Cena is one of the bests in the world, repeatedly, and now he's the worst in the company. Vintage bipolar sharkboy. Thanks for quoting him, otherwise I would never check that post because of ignore list.
> 
> :ti


fpalm

It was a failed attempt at sarcasm. There's a reason why I put surprisingly twice. Meh, should have used quotation marks when I said "Worst workers". Oh well.

Oh wait, I just realized he can't see this post cause I'm on his ignore list. Damn.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Wait, Orton and Big Show had a match at Extreme Rules?

Bte, everyone seems to be talking about Roman Reign's performance last night. Imo, it was mostly due to booking. Cody Rhodes and whichever Uso it was really stood out last night to me. I'm not hearing anyone talk about whichever Uso it was' rage attack. Guy went HAM. 

Don't get me wring Reigns looked legit but Rhodes and that Uso deserve a shout out.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Nostalgia said:


> Agreed. I made a point about Rowan actually looked decent for once in last night's match in my review of the show. But Harper's much better though, and his discus clothesline finisher he does is one of my favorites in the WWE right now, and I like especially how JBL marks for it. Because he would know what a good clothesline is. (Y)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


*


That's some seriously flawed logic my man. So just because Sandow and Ziggler are getting worse booking than Bryan, I'm not allowed to say Bryan has been booked awfully? By that logic just because people are starving in Africa I shouldn't complain about our government overspending money and creating a massive deficit? So I guess I should never complain about ANYTHING WWE does because there are more serious pressing issues?

Look, I'm a fan of all those guys, I even like Ziggler MORE than Bryan, but that doesn't mean Bryan's booking isn't a problem. You keep saying Bryan beat Orton clean....when did that happen again? NoC the ref fast counted and the title was held in abeyance, Battleground Big Show came in and cleared house, HiaC Randy Orton won...did I miss a match? I'm not being an asshole I'm genuinely wondering if I missed a match somewhere. I think Ortons booking was just as bad if not worse than Bryan's, and Ziggler and Sandows has been even worse. WWE doesn't even bother to give us a good reason to hate Orton, we are just supposed to because they tell us to, he cracks jokes on the crowd occasionally, oh and he rightfully cashed in his MitB contract at the most opportune time. How is that a heel? Furthermore, how is Bryan supposed to get some steam going up against a guy that has no heat and more apathy than anything else? Aside from The Shield, The Rhodes Bros, and the build to Punk vs Lesnar at SS, I think WWE booking has been at an all time low this year. Thank god we had guys putting on AMAZING matches almost weekly to keep this year fun and entertaining. Oh, and the whole build for Bryan vs Cena at Summerslam was wholly underwhelming. It was based on Cena picking Bryan to be his contender because he thought he deserved it, a sure fire way to draw money if I ever heard it. There was no heat or real rivalry between the two, the worst it got was Bryan saying Cena was just an entertainer but he was a WRESTLER. CAN YOU SEE DOLLAR SIGNS WITH A FEUD BUILT ON THAT OR WHAT???

I actually agree 1000% with you about Bryan's appearance btw. I find it ridiculous and distracting actually. I think he looked MUCH better around Extreme Rules 2012 time, when he just had the full beard that was trimmed nice and neat and short hair. His body looked a lot more ripped and athletic back then too. I know some people will say his look is his gimmick, but I think that's stupid. Bryan would be just as popular with shorter hair and a trimmed beard. Bryan's gimmick is that he has no gimmick, he's just himself.*


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Thank god this title unification is happening at TLC, in a TLC match where these two can hide their weaknesses

if this is as good as NWO 08 :mark:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Thank god this title unification is happening at TLC, in a TLC match where these two can hide their weaknesses
> 
> if this is as good as NWO 08 :mark:



I missed the beginning of Raw (but caught that good Rhodes/Shield Tag). What's the deal with the title unification match? A TLC match between Orton and a fresh off injury Cena? Wow.

Btw *** for the tag. Definitely good. And REIGNS


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I missed it to, but I read a live summary on bleacher report that it was announced in tonights opening segment

:lmao at this segment


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Shield/Mysterio-Cody-Goldust: ****1/4*
Titus O'Neill's impersonation: *****1/2*

Let's hope that Houston humiliates the potential trash that Orton/Cena TLC become. Not a fan of Cena or Orton in these kind of gimmick matches. Cena/Edge TLC was awful and the Ziggler match was a mess.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Shield/Mysterio-Cody-Goldust: ****1/4*
> Titus O'Neill's impersonation: *****1/2*
> 
> Let's hope that Houston humiliates the potential trash that Orton/Cena TLC become. Not a fan of Cena or Orton in these kind of gimmick matches. Cena/Edge TLC was awful and the Ziggler match was a mess.



You didn't like Cena/Dolph Ladder match? Man, I actually really dug it and it's not just because I'm a Ziggler fan. I think I gave it ***3/4 on last watch. The AJ shens did detract a bit in the end, but not enough to keep me from loving it.


I'm a life long Giants fan, and this segment is making me :lmao. So stupid and ridiculous.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Contemplating not watching wwe anymore the Miz TV segment, dead serious


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> Contemplating not watching wwe anymore the Miz TV segment, dead serious




I feel ya. Some of the dumbest shit ever.

On another note, god it's good to see Henry back. I seriously love that man. I don't care if he's in a tag with 3 other scrubs, Henry is the truth.

Also awesome to see that Mysterio hot tag. I :mark: hard for both of those guys


I actually hope they put Langston with Henry for a bit. It'll allow Henry to dust off the ring rust, and maybe he can impart some knowledge on Langston and keep him from being a complete disaster as a wrestler. Plus they have the power lifting background, so it's not like WWE is just throwing two big scary black guys together. The team makes sense on paper outside of race and size.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I don't know about you guys but that segment made me laugh. I don't try to take everything so seriously so it was some comedy, specially thanks to Titus.

And :mark: for Orton/Cena in a TLC. Never seen the former in one of those or any non-MITB matches that involves ladders.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Gonna go blast some Juicy J while this sham of a rematch is going on. Why does the WWE expect us to want to watch this 7-on-7 trash again? I guess so that we can catch up on our Three 6 Mafia.

I didn't really like how sloppy and stop-starty Ziggler/Cena was. A lot of the middle portion just felt so empty and lifeless, and Cena did not really do much that I liked. I still give it a favorable rating (***), but it gets worse and worse upon rewatches. I'll gladly eat my shoes if it turns out that I love Orton/Cena.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> I don't know about you guys but that segment made me laugh. I don't try to take everything so seriously so it was some comedy, specially thanks to Titus.
> 
> And :mark: for Orton/Cena in a TLC. Never seen the former in one of those or any non-MITB matches that involves ladders.



I think I'd almost prefer them to have a hardcore match or street fight or something, but maybe they can make it work. I don't like being one of those negative people who hates on everything before he sees it. Cena has been pretty great all year in the ring, maybe he can get Orton to snap out of this funk and go ape on him. Cena is probably winning though.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Gonna go blast some Juicy J while this sham of a rematch is going on. Why does the WWE expect us to want to watch this 7-on-7 trash again? I guess so that we can catch up on our Three 6 Mafia.









Cactus Jack said:


> I think I'd almost prefer them to have a hardcore match or street fight or something, but maybe they can make it work. I don't like being one of those negative people who hates on everything before he sees it. Cena has been pretty great all year in the ring, maybe he can get Orton to snap out of this funk and go ape on him. Cena is probably winning though.


I think Orton will have no choice but to switch it up a bit in a match that has a stipulation which forces them to work a different style. Him and Cena have had no problem with varying how their matches go in the past so I'm hopeful.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

That divas match was awesome, loved every minute of it Eva rton2 on her way to the top


:ti at Strong Island being a choice, its a inside joke between Nj/NYers


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> That divas match was awesome, loved every minute of it Eva rton2 on her way to the top
> 
> 
> :ti at Strong Island being a choice, its a inside joke between Nj/NYers



I'm just happy Dolph is back on TV, and even happier Sandow is getting a match + mic time.


----------



## birthday_massacre (Jan 30, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Just a shame that I can't see the tag division staying this good for much longer. Rumours of Cody and Goldust eventually feuding, Shield breaking up and Real Americans going their own way. Leaves us with bugger all .


yeah its pretty sad when the WWE builds up their tag team division to a point where its good then they break up all their best teams.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

birthday_massacre said:


> yeah its pretty sad when the WWE builds up their tag team division to a point where its good then they break up all their best teams.




That mean....*gasp*... WWE might have to actually work and build up some new talent to take their spots! The horror! 

Just kidding, I know what you mean, it's not like another Cesaro, Reigns, Rollins, Goldust, or Cody is walking thoughts the door. I'm just gonna enjoy it while it lasts.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I would love to see more of these fun hardcore matches in the midcard, but I only wish that it was anyone but these two doing it. Let Fandango or JTG do it; not Sandow or Ziggler.

:lmao at this terrible Miz movie clip.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> :lmao at this terrible Miz movie clip.


*They should've just re-enacted that Christmas Carol skit they did in 2011 and just make it a full-length WWE Studios Christmas film. Get Michael Cole and Alex Riley (LOL like he's got something better to do.) 

I'd watch the hell out of that movie. :mark:*


----------



## reDREDD (Oct 12, 2008)

TLC with a title unifying TLC match between Cena and Orton?

yes please


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Wyatts vs. GOATs: *****

The Wyatts, The Shield, The GOATs, and The Brhodes are carrying this show on their backsides. Everyone in the locker room except for Mark Henry and Dolph Ziggler should take notes.

EDIT: I knew I forgot someone :cesaro


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Absolute total silence at the end of raw tonight. And to think Cena/Orton may happen at mania? Ha! Get the fuck out of here.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

Cena/Orton is pretty much confirmed to not happen at Wrestlemania now. Thank god they saved that shitshow for TLC and probably the Rumble.

They won't have their title match at Wrestlemania be a rematch from just a few months back. The title match at WM is going to be Cena/Punk, Orton/Punk, or a three way.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Cena/Orton is pretty much confirmed to not happen at Wrestlemania now. Thank god they saved that shitshow for TLC and probably the Rumble.
> 
> They won't have their title match at Wrestlemania be a rematch from just a few months back. The title match at WM is going to be Cena/Punk, Orton/Punk, or a three way.




God lets hope. If I was booking mania I'd do: 

Cena/Hogan (would have great atmosphere and the match would suck ) 

Punk/Orton for the title 

Taker/Lesnar 

Bryan/HHH 

Would be an awesome 4 massive main event show. Throw in Goldust/Cody and shield/wyatts? :mark


Edit: yes the Hogan/Cena would suck, but it doesn't have to be a good match to succeed. Hell you can't get much worse from cena/rock last year. Right?! I'm also not a fan of HHH/Cena either. Would feel like a flat main event for the 30th anniversary of the superbowl of wrestling.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I'm pretty sure Cena couldn't carry Hogan to a decent match in 2013, but I honestly wouldn't hate it IF it happened. It'd be an interesting atmosphere to say the very least.


----------



## shadow_rider456 (Apr 2, 2012)

Does anyone know what kind of reaction Eva Marie was getting? When she got tagged in the match and also backstage. As soon as she got on screen the crowd reacted in a very....mixed way. Did anyone catch that?


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

xdoomsayerx said:


> Edit: yes the Hogan/Cena would suck, but it doesn't have to be a good match to succeed. Hell you can't get much worse from cena/rock last year. Right?!


or Cena/Miz or Orton/HHH.
NO we don't need yet another terrible main event at WM.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


>


:mark: :mark: :mark:

PLUS, CENA VS ORTON AT WRESTLEMANIA ISN'T GOING TO HAPPEN AT MANIA   .

HAPPY DAYS.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Some random Survivor Series thoughts:


*Cena vs. Del Rio:*


I'm starting to see more why so many dislike Cena and/or Cena matches. I still like him, as I find myself almost always looking forward to him on shows. However, I'm starting to feel the same way as many about his matches.

Del Rio's one of my favorite workers in the company, but I found myself completely uninterested in this match, because I knew exactly how it would end, and about five minutes in, I knew everything that would happen throughout the match. Maybe it's because lately I've been finding myself watching some old Cena matches on some of his DVDs, and it's all the same template. It really is frustrating, and it makes me not want to watch the matches anymore.

I also saw some stuff from his heel days, and I felt far more invested and interested in those matches, mainly because they weren't worked the same way, and therefore were less predictable.

**Although on a side-note, can I just mention how tired I am of ref bumps? This goes for all matches. I swear one day I watched four matches, and all four matches had a ref going down. It's such a tired, old, crutch, and a complete lack of creativity.***

Anyway, they really need to fucking book these Cena matches better. I can't even imagine if I had been watching it for eight years. Yes, other faces have been booked the same way, and a)that's why I hated those faces (such as Hogan), because it's boring. And b)Some of the other faces who always won, at least created some suspense in their matches. There was more back and forth, more excitement in general, etc. I also think that if a match is gonna be finished in one shot like that after a beat down, it should at least be something powerful looking. Also, Cena really needs to fucking sell the aftermath of matches better.

Maybe I'm especially irritable because I actually order PPVs, and I got suckered into thinking that Henry/Cena and Del Rio/Cena would be special.

Now that I think about it, the Sandow match was really the only match of Cena's I liked a ton this year since around June. Weird, because that too was sort of typical of his matches, but it felt electric, and I thought that Cena sold particularly well in that match.

It's frustrating because I like him for other reasons, and he has a strong presence and is a really hard worker. The latter being a reason why I think it's a shame the WWE relies on this sort of lazy booking. The most frustrating thing to me is that it's something so easily fixable, yet they don't do it. Stop booking his matches the same way!


*Opening SvS match:*

Best match of the night by far. I wasn't as into the similiar Raw tag matches as everyone else, but I felt that this match delivered. I didn't feel that it dragged at all, and I felt that each of the Shield members were entertaining.


*Divas SvS match:*

I mean, it's ridiculous that each of them were eliminated after, like, five seconds, but it was pretty obvious that they weren't gonna give them THAT much time. So if you go into it knowing that's gonna happen, I actually found it pretty enjoyable for what it was. I dunno. Maybe because everything else was pretty shitty, this put a smile on my face.


*Axel vs. Big E:*

Whatever. 


*Punk & Bryan vs. Wyatts:*

I was bored to tears by this for more than half of it, but then it got good once Bryan was powerbombed off of the top rope.


I feel like I'm forgetting a match, but whatever, that's probably an indication of my thoughts on said match.


*Orton vs. Big Show:*
LOL, this match was only 10 minutes, and it was even less than that when you consider the fact that Orton was running out of the ring so much at the beginning. 

Such a complete dropping of the ball. I'm actually a fan of their Extreme Rules match from this year, and both seemed much more lively that time around. It almost feels like all the thought was given to the aftermath, and NONE to the booking of the match. I do not understand the disparity between what Orton is churning out on tv matches as opposed to PPV ones (I really think he's been great on tv from the summer on, churning out good matches with Cody, Goldust, Del Rio, Christian, etc. I even fucking liked a couple with the Miz). Then on PPV even his personality is dialed way back. He did work the crowd a little now, but there was nothing of note between he and Big Show.

Hell, even his tv segments with Big Show were so much better than this. When Show would appear in matches and Orton would verbally berate him without the mic, he looked so energized and fired up. I actually thought they had a nice chemistry, just due to that alone. Maybe it's because they're booking Orton as a cowardly heel who needs a lot of help, but it's 100% the wrong approach, and it's the wrong approach for Orton to take in the match. Fucking fight like you mean it.

I do agree with the comment posted earlier on that anyone chanting "boring" during a sleeper hold on a 350 pounder is retarded. I'd hate to see them watch matches from the 80s.

Still, though, the match was completely uninspired, and worst of all, the aftermath made Orton look like a bitch yet again, which is stupid, if they're trying to sell him as a force to go against Cena. Why close with wanting to project them as both standing powerful against each other, when Orton couldn't even beat the Big Show without help right before?

Ugh. It's like this company is completely incapable of booking smartly anymore, but it's also by design, because they _want_ the whole Authority thing to be the biggest deal, even if that means shitting on their last four PPV matches, and two of their bigger stars. Just stupid.


Shit PPV, and it's sad that I'm a sucker for that Cena/Orton TLC match, even though I know it will be a lot of fuckery. The WWE hasn't given me any faith at all lately, yet I'm in the camp that really liked most of the previous Cena/Orton matches together. Shrug. I do think they have good chemistry, and they're definitely the opponents I'd want for each of them now, so I think that I'll enjoy it. It's definitely one of the few things I'm actually kind of excited about in the WWE now, though I feel the ending with bring me not great pleasure.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

So they're not actually unifying the titles at TLC? The winner (if there is one, I'm willing to bet the ending will be both climb the ladder and grab a belt each, probably swapping belts in the process :side becomes both champions, at least tats the impression I got last night when Orton held both titles and Cole said he can become WWE Champion AND World Heavyweight Champion.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Yeah I can't see any 'unification' happening, the winner will just hold both belts.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Skipped RAW last night, and I just now come on here and find there's a Orton/Cena TLC match for both titles at the TLC PPV? Now that has actually got me a tad interested. Don't give a fuck about a Orton/Cena feud, but I'm a sucker for TLC matches and both titles on the line sounds good. The standard Orton/Cena matches have been so overdone, but a TLC match between the two mixes things up and I like it.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well thank fuck they are doing Orton/Cena on a B PPV rather than something significant. Get it out of the way now before they potentially kill WM for me. Let them be shite on a PPV nobody gives a fuck about.

Commentary for the 6 man tag last night was awesome. "If at first you don't succeed SPEAR!!!" :lmao Reigns is killing it still. Wondering where this Wyatt/Shield Vs Punk & Bryan is going.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Callamus said:


> Well thank fuck they are doing Orton/Cena on a B PPV rather than something significant. Get it out of the way now before they potentially kill WM for me. Let them be shite on a PPV nobody gives a fuck about


Cal, they're going to end the PPV in a screwy finish with titles reversed. I highly doubt it ends so abruptly.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Yeah, this'll drag onto at least the Rumble and im not ruling out the possibility of it at Mania too.

AAAARRRRGGGGHHHH!!!!!!!


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Rah said:


> Cal, they're going to end the PPV in a screwy finish with titles reversed. I highly doubt it ends so abruptly.


DON'T RUIN THIS FOR ME DAMMIT. IT ENDS AT TLC DAMMIT. STOP IT. NO. WM WILL BE GOOD AND NOT FEATURE THE DULLEST MAIN EVENT COMBINATION EVER. FUCK OFF. I HATE YOU. AND YOU TOO. I HATE YOU ALL. EVERY LAST ONE OF YOU. AND FUCK THE POLL AS WELL. GOD DAMMIT. FUCKING TOP 100 CAN FUCK OFF AND SUCK A COCK. CUNTS. ARRGH.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

At WrestleMania! The return of the two-fall triple threat! Orton as World Heavyweight Champ, Cena as WWE Champ, Punk as Rumble winner. :argh:


If they did swap titles at TLC, does that give them an extra reign each? :lmao


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Callamus said:


> DON'T RUIN THIS FOR ME DAMMIT. IT ENDS AT TLC DAMMIT. STOP IT. NO. WM WILL BE GOOD AND NOT FEATURE THE DULLEST MAIN EVENT COMBINATION EVER. FUCK OFF. I HATE YOU. AND YOU TOO. I HATE YOU ALL. EVERY LAST ONE OF YOU. AND FUCK THE POLL AS WELL. GOD DAMMIT. FUCKING TOP 100 CAN FUCK OFF AND SUCK A COCK. CUNTS. ARRGH.


Haha. They have basically hyped it as a unification match without once outright mentioning that it is. Of course it goes hokey.

This is going to be the most unlikely outcome but one I would love. While Orton/Cena continue their irrelevant feud with shaky finishes at TLC and Rumble forcing the main event at Wrestlemania to be them, the Rumble winner (seemingly overshadowed by Cena/Orton) forcefully interjects himself into that match creating a triple threat and wins the big match. I'd also love for it to be Daniel Bryan - as it fits the bill a lot more than Punk.

Yeah, I'm basically hoping for a modified Wrestlemania 20 HBK/HHH/Benoit build-up an exact decade later. A man can dream...


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

They'll probably just both grab their own belts.

As we near towards Wrestlemania, the more I start to think about the Wrestlemania card and what it's possibly going to be. I mean, Taker/Brock is seemingly a lock at this point with no reason to think that it won't happen, leaving HHH/Cena/Punk/Orton/Bryan/Sheamus as your other top six guys heading into the event. Here's an idea though; if you want to make people believe that the streak could end, do REIGNS VS UNDERTAKER at XXX after giving REIGNS a superpush.

He doesn't even need to take the streak, but since Reigns has INSANE potential it's believeable.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Actually I wouldn't be objected to Bryan being inserted into the feud and winning. His marks in here may have soured me on him a bit with how annoying they can get but he's a good talent who deserves the push. If he'd make Cena tap, that would be even better but we all know Cena will never give up.

My favorite card would be this:

Cena/Taker
Orton/Brock
HHH/Bryan (WWE Title)

I'm not even _that_ badly excited about Orton/Cena happening at WM as much as it is for the potential of seeing Orton in the main event and a prominent WM match, which he hasn't really had since closing it nearly five years ago.


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah TLC screams of FUCKERY with them going out of there way to not say its a unification but both titles are 'potentially' open for one guy to get, expect both guys to take down a championship and continuing it on at the Rumble and heading to WrestleMania with + Punk being added to the mix.

Or it could get really bad with Triple H costing Cena leading to HHH/Cena and Orton/RR Winner at Mania, im hoping Cena either at TLC or Rumble just outright wins and holds both heading into WrestleMania 

WWE TITLE
Cena/Punk
Bryan/HHH
Lesnar/Taker


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*You guys are clearly leaving out someone, I mean what's the Wrestlemania plans for that up-and-comer :hogan? 

Anyway, I don't even bother trying to figure out possible Wrestemania scenarios until after the Rumble. *


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

HHH in dat main event somehow. Eh, eh?


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Clint Eastwood said:


> HHH in dat main event somehow. Eh, eh?


*Triple H shoves both guys off the ladder, grabs both belts, claims himself the Greatest Undisputed Champion of All Time (really sticking it to Jericho, just for fun.) and main events Mania XXX *

:hhh2


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

They're gonna do another "double winner" scenario at the rumble with Punk & Bryan, I bet.

Orton (c) Vs Punk Vs Bryan
Cena Vs HHH
Brock Vs Taker

If somebody put a gun to my head, that would probably be my prediction. I mean, I think it's obvious that eventually Punk turns on Bryan and sets up a feud between the two, probably with Orton involved as the champion. THAT, or it's Punk Vs Bryan in a mid card match that even I won't care about because I'd be too insulted. Cena-HHH & Taker-Brock are locks though, I feel like Starbuck did last year trying to explain to everybody that even though they won't like it, HHH-Cena is as obvious as Rock-Cena II. I'd be down, fuck it. Rematch of one of my favorite matches ever? YEAH.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Mania card is too unpredictable right now. Taker/Lesnar seems like the only sure thing. However, playing with the idea of Bryan/Cena/Orton WWE/World Title Main Event, this is the card I'd want:

Taker/Lesnar
Bryan/Cena/Orton Undisputed Title
Punk/HHH (control of the company with Punk representing Vince)
Shield/Wyatt Family

With this card, every big star is utilized in a big match. You have the 6-man Shield bs Wyatt Family match we crave for. Punk ends up being Vince's hand-picked rep to fight HHH for control of the company. Truthfully, the match would be the most unpredictable match on the card. Punk would need the win and should win, but this could also be the way for HHH to officially take the company and not have a happy ending. Bryan/HHH would obviously lead to a Bryan win, but Punk/HHH could really go either way. TBH, the more I think about it, the more I'd think this would lead go a HHH win and Vince finally retiring forever as an on-screen character... fitting it would be at WM30. But damn, Punk needs a big win over a big star, and he's already lost to HHH. Like I said, the unpredictability is what would really draw me to the match.

Then you have Taker/Lesnar, which Lesnar has no shot of winning, but it should be an awesome match. And the Main Event, having Bryan win in the main event and getting both belts in one would be perfect.

Of course, the problem with that card is Bryan/HHH NEEDS to happen after all the shit's that been said about Bryan and HHH's jab about facing him during the HIAC contract signing. And with that and the fact they're doing Cena/Orton at TLC, the Mania card will probably be completely different from above.

As I've said, it there's one thing WWE has done right, it's make the Mania card very unpredictable outside of Taker/Lesnar (and even then, there hasn't been any hint at that).


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

WM right now is looking all BLARGH even if no matches can really be confirmed as locks and shit outside of maybe Undertaker's match. Cena, Orton and HHH being involved in any way in big matches just kills it. None of them have anything interesting to offer any more. HHH has been dead in the water for years now outside of a very, very small handful of matches. Orton can't go any more it seems. And neither can Cena... though he seems to have more of a chance than Orton given the right opponent. Not sure Orton has any right opponents any more. So those guys in any combination against ANYONE just doesn't interest me at all. Sad time for wrestling when they have 2 major titles and the scenes for both belts are pure shit given the fact that the guys likely to be holding them don't have chemistry with 99% of the roster.

Watching Unforgiven 02 atm. HHH Vs RVD just about to start. HHH has been murdering main events since way back when :lmao. Shoot me now please. Then revive me when Lesnar/Undertaker happens. Shame HLA got ruined. Fucking Rikishi in drag. BULLSHIT. I want my money back. Even though I haven't paid for this event. Ever. Was free on Sky Sports back in the day. Now I'm watching a download of it. SHUT UP AND GIVE ME MONEY. FUCKING JAWBREAKER CAN GO TO HELL. CUNT. RUINING THE TOP 100 LIST. BASTARD FACE. GOD DAMMIT ALL TO HELL.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

What should happen with Orton is that since he's a legend now, the Legend Killer should be reborn and kill Viper Orton so we get 2004 Orton as his replacement. Everybody would win. rton2

He can take a break for a few months, grow his hair back and when he's back, he shows up backstage as the old Orton and punts a mannequin of his current self to reestablish himself in a new character.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

All I got from that post is that Orton should kill himself so he fucks off for good 8*D.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> What should happen with Orton is that since he's a legend now, the Legend Killer should be reborn and kill Viper Orton so we get 2004 Orton as his replacement. Everybody would win. rton2
> 
> He can take a break for a few months, grow his hair back and when he's back, he shows up backstage as the old Orton and punts a mannequin of his current self to reestablish himself in a new character.


*Does that mean he's going shit in the Divas' bags again? Cause if it does, just imagine that Total Divas episode. :mark: :mark: *


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

rjsbx1 said:


> *Does that mean he's going shit in the Divas' bags again? Cause if it does, just imagine that Total Divas episode. :mark: :mark: *


Ha, they can do that with Brie Bella (since Orton was just feuding with Bryan and constantly teasing her). She finishes a match then goes back to her lockerroom only to find out her bag has been filled with shit.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

REIGNS.

That's all I need to say.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

I don't care who wins the Unification match at TLC as long as a future superstar will win it at WM, just like Jericho in 2001


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

:lol if they actually did that.

*Choke2Death*, I have a question for you; would you rather Benoit come back from the dead and wrestle more match, but it HAS to be against Punk and he HAS to put Punk over in spectacular fashion... Or would you rather Benoit not come back at all?

unk6


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's not said to be a unification match, btw.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

It seems logical to be an unification match


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

The Primer said:


> REIGNS.
> 
> That's all I need to say.


imo


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> imo


My reaction was priceless, apparently. _(lets admit QUITE giddy, to say the least.)_


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I can't imagine how delighted you were to see Reigns and Cesaro manhandle the Usos.

:lol the Orton marks are making bigger fools of themselves right now than the Punk marks.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Wasn't too nutty considering they weren't a threat to the quality. Knew that's all the Usos were going to be stuck in that match for. To be bounced around & elimination fodder. I wouldn't mind 'em, if they actually knew how to work matches. Punches & superkicks can only go so far. The tag team equivalent of Kofi Kingston.

but who cares about that - BLACK OUT & SPEAR ftw.

Oh man. Let me not forget about Goldust busting out a yoshi-tonic. Brilliant.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

LilOlMe said:


> *Orton vs. Big Show:*
> 
> I do agree with the comment posted earlier on that anyone chanting "boring" during a sleeper hold on a 350 pounder is retarded. I'd hate to see them watch matches from the 80s.


You see, the difference is, in the 80s the simple holds such as sleeper were a synonym for power struggle on the mat. Transitions were hard fought and hard earned, and those guys were making the absolute most out of simple offense. And today? Basic pro-wrestling holds, such as sleeper, are taken for granted, and it's easy to recognize, by both smarks and casuals.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

LEAKEE.

I mean....


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

LEAKEE REIGNS.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

They are teasing all this shit so more fans will buy the PPV, I can't see any unification happening at a B(C)-level PPV, they will just swap the belts IMO.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

LEAKEE THE ROMAN REIGNS.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Leakee... that's one of the most comical names I've heard.



Evan Stays Trippy said:


> *Choke2Death*, I have a question for you; would you rather Benoit come back from the dead and wrestle more match, but it HAS to be against Punk and he HAS to put Punk over in spectacular fashion... Or would you rather Benoit not come back at all?
> 
> unk6


Is it just one match or will he return at least as a part-timer?

If the former, he can stay chilling with Eddie. If he'll return for more than that, then HELL YEAH. He's jobbed to THE MIZ when he was at his most unbearable and Sean O'Haire only for it to result in nothing. Jobbing with him is not important, it's the match quality!

Alternatively, I would accept the Punk job if he came back for not one, but _two_ matches. The other being Undertaker at WM! I would also accept that one match if it brought him back to WWE's history.



funnyfaces1 said:


> :lol the Orton marks are making bigger fools of themselves right now than the Punk marks.


Are they complaining about booking while he's getting pushed? If yes, it's on par, if not, then not even close.

With that said, the Raw section is unbearable right now. I might just stick to this thread for at least a while and occasionally post in threads about the past.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm expecting the win by whomever on PPV, then the next night either Cena or Orton regain their championship that they lost.

Just you wait.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

The Primer said:


> I'm expecting the win by whomever on PPV, then the next night either Cena or Orton regain their championship that they lost.
> 
> Just you wait.


*I was just thinking that. 

I don't see why ever one thinks it's going to be a unification match. They haven't mentioned it once, it's just two titles on the line. Plus, there's really no benefit in unifying the titles. *


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I think unifying should be done. No reason to have two championships when one is efficiently cast aside for the other. They're not at the level where the World Championship was almost held in the same regard as the WWE. No more brands & the rosters are together. Better to make it all about one major championship from here on out. Doing so will force importance on either the United States, Intercontinental, or both again. Raise those up to be the "next big goal" below the WWE Championship. Quite ideal.

None of this will occur, however. I'm quite certain of such. That and according to fact, the match isn't a unification.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Leakee... that's one of the most comical names I've heard.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



To be honest, I would take Eddie or Benoit coming back from the dead for 1 match, any match, even if it's jobbing to The Miz, just to see them again.

I'd like to see Reigns end the streak at WM 31. Then again, I'm one of those people who thinks the Undertaker should put over a young deserving talent so he can live off it for the rest of his career. Similar to the way Jericho lived off defeating Rock and Austin in 1 night, and Orton lived off that spectacular hardcore match with Foley. For a man as respected as the Undertaker is, it doesn't seem right for him to not go out like a total pro. As long as he is 10000% certain it's his last match, he should go out laying down, like all the other greats did. Austin, Foley, Flair, The Rock, HHH, oh, wait


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Am I the only one who actually wants to see 



Spoiler: WM rumor



Hogan vs Cena @ Mania?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Undertaker should never lose at WrestleMania.

Worst booking decision to be ever thought of. Fuck every other talent in the world. They can go away and never come close to approaching such a feat. This includes if Sami Zayn was even a possible candidate in ol hypothetical land.

NO.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Undertaker should never lose at WrestleMania.


Unless he wants to imo


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

The Primer said:


> I think unifying should be done. No reason to have two championships when one is efficiently cast aside for the other. They're not at the level where the World Championship was almost held in the same regard as the WWE. No more brands & the rosters are together. Better to make it all about one major championship from here on out. Doing so will force importance on either the United States, Intercontinental, or both again. Raise those up to be the "next big goal" below the WWE Championship. Quite ideal.
> 
> None of this will occur, however. I'm quite certain of such. That and according to fact, the match isn't a unification.


Well that makes sense, in theory of course. 

There's a lot to wonder about with unification for me: Would that just create a huge logjam of people for the WWE Title and create a huge mess (considering they wouldn't even bother to involve the top guys/usual WHC contenders in the midcard title hunt.) Would they actually build the WWE Title programs on Smackdown (you know because there would be no more WHC to center Smackdown around.) and if not, LOL why even have a second show. Then the whole midcard title scenario, that's just a whole another discussion we shouldn't enter into again...:side:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Completely agree with Taker retiring undefeated. Young stars can get a rub just by taking him to the limit only to come up short.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

All good things come to a end in wwe, Taker WILL lose his last match.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> Unless he wants to imo


I'd be frustrated as a selfish fan, but couldn't hold it against him if he elects to go down this path.



rjsbx1 said:


> Well that makes sense, in theory of course.
> 
> There's a lot to wonder about with unification for me: Would that just create a huge logjam of people for the WWE Title and create a huge mess (considering they wouldn't even bother to involve the top guys/usual WHC contenders in the midcard title hunt.) Would they actually build the WWE Title programs on Smackdown (you know because there would be no more WHC to center Smackdown around.) and if not, LOL why even have a second show. Then the whole midcard title scenario, that's just a whole another discussion we shouldn't enter into again...:side:


WWE Championship picture would simply remain as important as it is today. If that means a few top stars have to suffice with not main eventing for some events, then so be it. No different than how it was in the "glory years" pre-World Championship. I think it'll be a shot of life for WWE to use some big names without the championship always in the picture. Give the show more depth & give the championship picture some more depth itself. Obviously if that's the only championship then some build will occur on Smackdown. Nothing too major, but enough to push it a tad. Smackdown is at the point of where it is WCW Saturday Night in the Nitro era. Everything is saved for Monday, although some noticeable means can be done on the next tier show.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

It's not for certain that the titles will be unified @ TLC though. There will be some bullshit where they are both up on the ladder and they either retain their own belts or take the other belt (and likely pad their title reign stats). I'm totally pro-unification, though. If they have a rematch to unify @ Royal Rumble, that's fine, as long as it happens before Mania. Don't want to see that match @ the 30th anniversary of WM.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The real problem is IF the company decides to unify at Mania. Then how does that work for the Rumble match itself? Becomes null & void this year. Unless this Ladder match is their out to solve that problem. Orton wins, Cena wins Rumble again (<3 him, but lmao), & then the match at WM happens. 

Of course the clincher there is the championships would probably officially be slated as one by WM night or a bit before that. Random factual keys along the way in this hypothetical, yada yada. Spitballing.

Still weird how Orton is in this mix despite being booked like a 3rd rate star. Honestly, weird. I don't trust Triple H.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Orton/Cena is NOT happening at WM. I don't think people realize how much shit it would actually get during the match tbh. 

You'd be hearing every negative chant imaginable if this is truly the focal point of WM 

"Daniel Bryan"

"Cm Punk"

"Boring"

"We don't want this"

"This is bullshit"

I honestly don't think Vince is this dumb, or is he? I'm attending Mania this year and if I have to endure this main event, my voice will be gone for weeks.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

If there's BS finish at TLC w/no decisive winner, rematch @ Rumble with a unified champ. RR winner challenges unified champ. Not sure wtf they'd do with Elimination Chamber, though, unless champ puts title on line inside chamber w/RR winner waiting for the winner of that (or blows his Mania title shot @ EC) and EC winner challenges unified champ @ WM.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Yeah but, WWE have been feeding us shit the majority don't want for ages now...


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:lmao

all these scenarios are so convoluted thanks to those stupid gimmick PPVs that make the mold for building towards WM so cookie cutter. No point in trying to guess this junk.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Just prepare yourself for the worst, glass half empty and all that. It'll just all turn to shit anyways.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah, gimmick PPVs really make every year feel the exact same.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Just saw someone mention Orton wins titles at TLC and Cena wins the 2014 royal rumble 

:lmao :lmao :lmao 


Oh dear god if that happened.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Kills the fun when you know you're getting a Hell in a Cell or Elimination Chamber match every year. The spontaneity of those matches being announced was part of the entertainment.

You mean someone said the exact same scenario I just did on this page?



> The real problem is IF the company decides to unify at Mania. Then how does that work for the Rumble match itself? Becomes null & void this year. Unless this Ladder match is their out to solve that problem. Orton wins, Cena wins Rumble again (<3 him, but lmao), & then the match at WM happens.


I win the outlandish WWE thought processes.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah, now when a HIAC match is announced it's like, "well duh, that's the next PPV." There are obvious exceptions like HHH/Taker @ Mania, but it's just not really fun anymore.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The names too. Ugh. So ghastly.

_"Welcome to Hell in a Cell PPV."_

C'mon, guys. It doesn't even sound like a coherent sentence.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

August through December usually sucks anyway so :hb


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I actually used to like this time of the year the most. Fall - Winter was always a fun stretch to try new things with the gap following SummerSlam heading into Rumble. Survivor Series always felt like the "big four" show to allow some flexibility on.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

The Primer said:


> The names too. Ugh. So ghastly.
> 
> _"Welcome to Hell in a Cell PPV."_
> 
> C'mon, guys. It doesn't even sound like a coherent sentence.


*Or "Welcome to WWE Fatal-Four-Way". :lmao*


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

The Primer said:


> I actually used to like this time of the year the most. Fall - Winter was always a fun stretch to try new things with the gap following SummerSlam heading into Rumble. Survivor Series always felt like the "big four" show to allow some flexibility on.


I used to like the entire year tbf.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

rjsbx1 said:


> *Or "Welcome to WWE Fatal-Four-Way". :lmao*


Sweet jesus...



The Lady Killer said:


> I used to like the entire year tbf.


I remember those days.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

When did WWE cease to be fun all year around anyways? These past few years the post-SummerSlam period has been pretty bad for the most part.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Gimmick PPVs are a good starting point for some of the blame game. At first they were fun and new, and I typically enjoy Extreme Rules, MITB and TLC, but there's really no mystery, as every calendar year is basically wash, rinse, repeat with (sometimes) new feuds.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

Has there ever been a good HiaC PPV?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

2010 is good. Main event sucks, but truthfully, that's the only drawback to the event. I like 2011's too.

2009 & 2012 gave me matches I really dug a ton, at least. Morrison/Ziggler, JeriShow vs Mysterio/Batista, Cesaro vs Gabriel, & Show vs Sheamus.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

What's even worse is that WWE has STARTED feuds at HIAC, like Show/Sheamus (though that wasn't a HIAC match) and Punk/Ryback last year. 2009 kind of worked with Orton/Cena, though the match was trash. Punk/Taker didn't really work because it was the second match they had on PPV. 2010 we had Sheamus/Orton, which was okay, but it wasn't a hate filled feud like Kane/Taker (which was still a dud of a match). Bryan/Orton was decent at best in the cell this year, but feud had become more about Bryan/Authority than Bryan/Orton, which is the fault of the booking. 

I can't for the life of me figure out why WWE would take a gimmick like HIAC that is supposed to end a feud, and throw it in a random place, usually with only three weeks build.

HIAC is really the only current gimmick PPV that bothers me. Fatal Four Way was stupid but that's gone. MITB and Extreme Rules are fine. TLC I'm really indifferent on.



> Has there ever been a good HiaC PPV?


Happen to have my legal pad with HIAC reviews on it right here. Cody's right about 2009 and 2012. 2009 had THREE FUCKING CELL MATCHES. 

2010 has the most consistent match quality with Bryan/Miz/Morrison, the aforementioned Orton/Sheamus, Barrett/Cena, Swagger/Edge, which I though was okay. Main event fpalm

2011 has was sporadic in match quality, with like every other match being good. That main event is my favorite cell match since 2008, behind only Trips/Taker.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*I like Elimination Chamber and MITB being gimmick PPVs, there's still that air of unpredictability and it doesn't devalue the gimmick match itself. *


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

HIAC is a joke now. Even when they book the feud right and lead up to a HIAC months in advance, the match typically sucks because there's only so much you can do inside the Cell that you haven't seen before - especially now that they never leave the Cell and there isn't much brutality.


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

Elimination Chamber needs to go and possibly be made a Survivor Series tradition for the WWE Championship, Extreme Rules and Money in the Bank can both stay but other than that they can all fuck off

Hell in a Cell, TLC type matches need to be used more often when the situations present themselves with feuds.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

HIAC 2009 was one of the flatest shows I've ever seen. Despite JeriShow/Mystista's badassness, the rest was all just there. Morrison/Ziggler for one did nothing for me tbh. The Main Event had good psychology but unlike the Submissions Count Anywhere match, the chaos aspect of it didn't click with me.

Thoughts on the upcoming Cena/Orton TLC match?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

It'll be worked incredibly safe imo. Orton is injury prone and they can't afford to lose Cena again. Will likely have another convoluted ending, as the last 5 PPVs or so have had.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Undertaker should never lose at WrestleMania.
> 
> Worst booking decision to be ever thought of. Fuck every other talent in the world. They can go away and never come close to approaching such a feat. This includes if Sami Zayn was even a possible candidate in ol hypothetical land.
> 
> NO.



YES.

I'd much rather see him go out that way than waste the opportunity of a lifetime to make a wrestler for life. What is the point of retiring undefeated? Just so they can say every year after Taker retires "....and of course no one will ever match the legendary Undertaker's 23-0 streak at WrestleMania". That seems pointless, as long as it's the right guy who could absolutely use the rub and become a mega-star, I have no problem with him laying down for his last match. I'm a huge huge fan of Taker, but I'd rather he did the unselfish thing rather than keep the ultimate kayfabe achievment. It's not like anyone will ever match his Streak anyways, no one else is going 23-0, so him having a final record of 22-1 wouldn't really change anything. Nineteen or so guys have had to put their shoulders to the mat to make Undertakers streak, it just seems wrong for him not to return the massive favor that was done to him early on. Sure, in recent history just being in a Mania match with Taker would make a guy, but that wasn't really the case until 2005 or so. Before that, guys were just doing the honors because that's what they were told to do. Taker should honor all those guys jobbing to him by doing the ultimate job in his last match. 

That's the way I see it anyways, I'd love to hear an honest well thought out opinion on the advantages of keeping the Streak in tact in Taker's last match other than "Taker is just the best and should never ever lose at WrestleMania". Saying that Taker losing in his last match at WrestleMania is "the worst booking decision ever" is pure nonsense. It's his last match, it's not going to affect business in a negative way BECAUSE HES NEVER WRESTLING AGAIN. And if it's a truly deserving guy like Bryan or Reigns in a few years, well, it might just IMPROVE business and therefore be a good booking decision.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Nah Taker should NEVER lose a wrestlemania fuck all the "that my main flaw with taker match, we know the win" bulls**, retire him 25-0 or 30-0 but NOBODY ever should beat him


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> Nah Taker should NEVER lose a wrestlemania fuck all the "that my main flaw with taker match, we know the win" bulls**, retire him 25-0 or 30-0 but NOBODY ever should beat him



Why? What purpose does that serve? I don't get it, I'm as big a Taker fan as anyone and I just don't understand why people think he shouldn't lose his last match. It would be such a wasted opportunity to make a deserving guy for life. After all the dudes that laid down to make Takers streak, it's the right thing to do. There is no bigger achievement in wrestling than ending the streak. It's the Mount Everest of kayfabe achievements.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I think I read that Taker would have ended the streak some time ago, but Vince didn't want to do it. Seems to me that Taker is fine with laying down, but it's in Vince's hands. I'd really like to see Taker work a program with someone that would run through 2 or 3 PPVs, but I really liked that the Shield got to be the ones that put him out at the end of this past run. Would be awesome if Taker worked the Rumble match and got to decisively end that feud by eliminating one or two of the Shield guys.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Why? What purpose does that serve? I don't get it, I'm as big a Taker fan as anyone and I just don't understand why people think he shouldn't lose his last match. It* would be such a wasted opportunity to make a deserving guy for life*. After all the dudes that laid down to make Takers streak, it's the right thing to do. There is no bigger achievement in wrestling than ending the streak. It's the Mount Everest of kayfabe achievements.


Its arguably the greatest record/accomplishment in wwe history, all sports need those UNTOUCHABLE accomplishments IMO 

@ the bolded part,But you cannot assume that cjack, you dont know for sure they will be made. It will be a waste because what if the superstar turns out to be a bust, you will tarnish the best accomplish in your sport's history because a flash in the pan superstar ended it and never lived up There is absolutely nobody on this roster (raw,sd,nxt,roh,tna whole world) I see that should end it, reigns at his peak will only eclipse to a Batista type figure and even that is not high enough so some can fuck of with that.

Only person I see semi as a threat is Cena and that would be horrible decision to make him win, you think the boos are bad now ? 

This is all coming NOT from a mark, another thing is,what happens when the superstar who ends it that you say, if he never lives up to it how is it going to look for on hhh,hbk,edge,orton etc all these HOF


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

I don't want Taker's streak to end, but I wouldn't be against if the right guy breaks it (someone who's not already a major player, but also not someone who would potentially squander/waste the opportunity due to not being talented enough or not caring for the business enough). The issue of course is in that last part... I don't know who'd have that kind of devotion, so I can't really name anyone.


----------



## Cleavage (Apr 19, 2005)

*WWE Raw 05/19/2003 - WWE World Heavyweight Championship: Ric Flair vs. Triple H*
Flair getting hyped during Flairs entrance :mark: JR this is like Mickey Mantle getting one more shot, at Yankee Stadiums but Lawler says Mantle's dead, and JR responding with "WELL RIC FLAIR'S NOT DEAD!" So JR comes back with well Mantle's legacy isn’t dead and neither is Rick Flair’s legacy. FUCKIN’ AWESOME! During Triple H’s entrance he can’t even spit the water correctly as he goes right to holding the ribs. Hunter tells Flair to lay down, and Flair says okay then sticks out his hand. But Flair pulls it away and slicks back the hair OH SHIT! Hard lockup to start and Hunter backs in the corner for the clean break, but Flair WOOOOOO’s as Hunter comes back to him but Flair pokes him the eyes. Chops in the corner but Flair goes to whip him but Hunter counters it with a back elbow knocking Flair down. Hunter picks him up and tries a suplex but he can’t the ribs are too banged up. This allows Flair to comeback with a thunderous chop and now Hunter takes that hard whip to the outside but this time he goes crashing into the barricades ribs first. Flair follows him out and suplexes him on the floor, more chops and before rolling him back in. Another suplex but this time it’s a delayed one. But Flair takes too long on the cover and gets a two, chops but Hunter again reverses a whip into the Double A Spinebuster, but this time Hunter is too hurt to make the cover. Hunter now punches him in the corner and now boots, as Flair is down Hunter begins to choke him but Flair gets out and chops him. Both men begin to trade shots for a while as we see Flair take the “Flair corner bump” but he runs across the apron and actually connects with the double axe-handle off the top. OH SHIT! I think Flair is like 2-10,002 doing that move. Flair celebrates and now begins to punch away at Hunter before knocking him down with a Chop, he picks him up and now he delivers the chop block. FIGURE FOUR IS APPLIED! Hunter fights out, as both men get back to their feet but Flair backs him into he corner but Hunter connects with a right hand knocking Flair down. Hunter is still limping so Flair chops him some more but this time Hunter puts a stop to that by whipping him into the ropes and applying the sleeper but he doesn’t fully have it locked in so Flair backs him up in the corner but the ref is their too, knocking him down. Facebuster by Hunter now who goes out of the ring and picks up the World Heavyweight Championship, he misses Flair with is and Flair pokes him in the eyes again. Low Blow now and he picks up the world title and nails Hunter in the head with it. OH SHIT! He wakes the ref up and Nick Patrick counts 2, the crowd pop was EPIC! Flair goes for the figure four again but Hunter kicks him off sending Flair mid-section first into the buckle. Hunter sets up the pedigree but gets backdropped out of it, kick to the mid-section and Flair goes for a pedigree of his own but Hunter backdrops him out of it. He hits pedigree of his own for the win. Post-Match: Nash quickly walks to the ring, Hunter then collapse on the ramp and Austin comes out and announces it Triple H vs. Kevin Nash @ Badd Blood, in Houston Texas…. HELL IN A CELL! As for the match it’s not 2005 good but given they had six minutes it was a ton of fun. ***


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

There's no fucking way WWE will capitalize on someone ending the streak. They can't even capitalize on someone beating John Cena clean in the middle of the ring. They change their mind too much, and are - to put it nicely - utter fucking dickheads. 

Plus the wrestler will get so much backlash that it could not possibly do him any good. I am all for Taker putting someone over major when he retires. Just shouldn't be at Mania.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> There's no fucking way WWE will capitalize on someone ending the streak. They can't even capitalize on someone beating John Cena clean in the middle of the ring. They change their mind too much, and are - to put it nicely - utter fucking dickheads.
> 
> Plus the wrestler will get so much backlash that it could not possibly do him any good. I am all for Taker putting someone over major when he retires. Just shouldn't be at Mania.


This is all I was trying to say in that paragraph I wrote


btw I love that flair/hhh clevage, I'd rate it a bit higher around **** mark


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

You can't trust WWE with ANYTHING. Nothing minor, nothing major. Its obvious even to a non wrestling fan they havn't got a clue.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

I remember there were rumours that Ted Dibiase JR was meant to face and even beat Taker at Wrestlemania...

http://www.wrestlenewz.com/wwe-news/update-on-ted-dibiase-ending-the-undertakers-undefeated-streak/


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Oliver-94 said:


> I remember there were rumours that Ted Dibiase JR was meant to face and even beat Taker at Wrestlemania...
> 
> http://www.wrestlenewz.com/wwe-news/update-on-ted-dibiase-ending-the-undertakers-undefeated-streak/


Sums up dirtsheets :lol


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Sums up dirtsheets :lol


 Definitely. :lol


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


> There's no fucking way WWE will capitalize on someone ending the streak. They can't even capitalize on someone beating John Cena clean in the middle of the ring. They change their mind too much, and are - to put it nicely - utter fucking dickheads.
> 
> Plus the wrestler will get so much backlash that it could not possibly do him any good. I am all for Taker putting someone over major when he retires. Just shouldn't be at Mania.



Unfortunately I think you are completely right. I was more speaking as to a hypothetical situation, if the perfect guy came along at the perfect time when Taker was gonna retire for good, then I can see it making sense. But the way WWE is booked/run right now, I wouldn't trust them to run a Dairy Queen let alone handle something as delicate as ending the streak + the ensuing 1-2 year push to solidify the guy.

Thanks for depressing me even more. I'm gonna go back to watching stuff from 2004-2005 and forget I brought up the topic.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Not even Hogan at his very peak was big enough to justifiably break the streak. Let Undertaker retire with the greatest accomplishment ever in wrestling. Nobody deserves it more.

Cactus Jack, go watch Eddie/Big Show from Smackdown in 2004. Eddie puts on another clinic with some of the most unique offense I have ever seen.

And then go watch the two Eddie Guerrero/CM Punk interactions:

http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/pwynxICKSkE/
http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/DhMcPWKYu3U/


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Just finished WM 25, outside of HBK/Taker this was such a flat show. 

Ratings 

MITB: ***1/4 (one of the worst)
Jericho/piper/snuka/steamboat: **1/2
JBL/Mysterio: ***
Hardy/Hardy: ***1/2
HBK/Taker *****
Edge/Cena/Show: **3/4
HHH/Orton: **

Such a flat ending. Was there a more silence ending to WM than this one? I highly doubt it.

Edit: JBL/Mysterio Dud. Work with me I'm doing this from my phone lol


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

JBL/Mysterio a *****? :ti


----------



## Cleavage (Apr 19, 2005)

You want Eddie GODNESS! Go watch Eddie/Tajiri vs. Team Angle - Smackdown 05/22/2003, I just finished watching it myself review coming soon.

BONUS! Benoit/Matt from the same SD.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

^this is true, any team angle match is amazing and this seems to be the best one, their ladder match is fun too IIRC. 

Not really in the mood to watch wrestling, which is strange, but BL 05 review should be up tomorrow!


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Hollywood Hulk Hogan vs The Warrior - Halloween Havoc (10/25/98) The Devil's Blackened Anus/10*

Skimmed through this nightmare to freshen/rot my mind and come up with a "perfect" rating.

*Sheamus vs Wade Barrett - Monday Night Raw (10/8/12) 8.5/10*

Despite the the ending, this has become a favourite of mine. I believe they had other matches (not sure), but a match like this could become a strength for Barrett...if the 'E could come up with anything remotely decent for the man./mini rant
I guess JR would call this a "slobberknocker".

*Taka Michinoku vs The Great Sasuke - In Your House 17: Canadian Stampede (7/6/97) 10/10*

I legitimately think this is in my top ten matches ever. Still need to come up with one. :vince7


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Not even Hogan at his very peak was big enough to justifiably break the streak. Let Undertaker retire with the greatest accomplishment ever in wrestling. Nobody deserves it more.
> 
> Cactus Jack, go watch Eddie/Big Show from Smackdown in 2004. Eddie puts on another clinic with some of the most unique offense I have ever seen.
> 
> ...




That's a mighty big statement, Hogan at his peak not being big enough to beat the Streak.


The Eddie/Show match you're talking about, that's the one where Eddie hides the wrench in his boot right? One of the finest baby face performances you are likely to see, Eddie is just the best. There are not words to describe how much I enjoy watching that man wrestle. Face or Heel, no one is better.


Cleavage- that Eddie/Tajiri match is completely off the hook. I love the tags Eddie had with Tajiri while Chavo was on the shelf. They kicked all sorts of ass. Love the Pacers too, George is looking like a MVP candidate, Hibbert looks like the Incredible Hulk, and David West is one BAD man. Plus Lance Stephenson's ball handling and general hoops IQ somehow have gotten twice as good as last year. Indiana might win it all this year.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

So apparently HHH/RVD UF 02 have me a headache and I've been dead to the world for a few hours tonight . Decided to get back to watching the event, expecting to jump right in to Undertaker Vs Lesnar... and then a video package for Benoit Vs Angle came on. Forgot this match happened :lmao. Might leave it until 2morrow now .


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Chris Jericho (c) vs Raven for the WCW Television Title - Halloween Havoc (10/25/98) 9/10*

Crowd was fiery hot for this opener. Raven entered the ring declaring that when he arrived to the arena, he was told he would have an unsanctioned match which pissed him off. Jericho entered the ring and began mocking him, causing Raven to rush the ring and get stomped all to hell by Jericho. What was surprising about the match was Raven and Jericho viciously going back and forth. I love Jericho and he deserves praise for giving it all, but Raven deserved alot more praise.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> So apparently HHH/RVD UF 02 have me a headache and I've been dead to the world for a few hours tonight . Decided to get back to watching the event, expecting to jump right in to Undertaker Vs Lesnar... and then a video package for Benoit Vs Angle came on. Forgot this match happened :lmao. Might leave it until 2morrow now .



You were really big on the 30 Minute Ultimate Submission match, right? I think you'll dig the Unforgiven match then, it's around 18 minutes and I think it's pretty bad ass actually.


----------



## bigbuxxx (May 28, 2011)

Their best match.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Jericho/Raven from Halloween Havoc is another match that should be required viewing. So much fun. Was Jericho still a heel at the time?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Cactus Jack said:


> You were really big on the 30 Minute Ultimate Submission match, right? I think you'll dig the Unforgiven match then, it's around 18 minutes and I think it's pretty bad ass actually.


I think it's a few minutes shorter than that (assuming we're talking about Angle vs. Benoit). I like it, but I feel it's the type of match that those that aren't very big on Angle wouldn't enjoy.


----------



## pr0ba (Apr 2, 2008)

Is anyone here have FremantleMedia edition of WrestleMania 28?

If do, can someone take some picture of inside the dvd box and sent me here or on private massage? 

Thanks!


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Chris Jericho Vs Raven – Halloween Havoc 25/10/1998

Got excited and thought this was BENOIT Vs Raven. Stupid Jericho.

Raven has been on a losing streak, and refuses to take part in this match that he isn’t prepared for. Jericho gets on the mic and talks shit about Raven, who eventually runs into the ring to start the match, only to get caught by Jericho as he enters the ring lol.

On the outside, Raven gains control using the environment to his advantage. Jericho takes a pretty sick bump face first into the guardrail coming off the apron too. Looks like he legit went face first without getting his hands up in time lol.

Match is very much back and forth, but not in the “your turn my turn” kinda way, just in a way where neither man can control the other for too long, despite both men taking some pretty big bumps on the outside, and in the ring with the exposed ring post too.

Fan response is weird too, as I could have sworn both men were supposed to be heels around this time, but once Jericho got on the mic at the start he was getting babyface reactions, and once Raven started making comebacks in the match he was getting babyface reactions, and when Raven tapped out there was a HUGE reaction for Jericho winning lol.

Fun stuff for under 10 minutes, some cool back and forth action and the crowd were hot for the whole thing. Nothing much else to say really.

Rating: **1/4


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Apparently we got ourselves another great tag match on Smackdown.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Just saw the spoilers and it sounds pretty solid. (Y)


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Just realized that TLC is right before my finals start. :jose

I'll probably download it the weekend after it happens because I'll be busy studying during the week. I'll stay away from the results depending on how interesting the card is to me at that point  :cena4 :rko2


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

haribo said:


> At WrestleMania! The return of the two-fall triple threat! Orton as World Heavyweight Champ, Cena as WWE Champ, Punk as Rumble winner. :argh:
> 
> 
> If they did swap titles at TLC, does that give them an extra reign each? :lmao


I've got to read the last seven pages, so hopefully I'm not repeating someone...but weeks and weeks ago, one of the wrestling journalists made a great point. They said that the Smackdown TV contract is up in 2015, which means that 2014 will be the year of negotiations. Therefore, they think that the WWE wants to do everything they can to get the Smackdown ratings as high as possible, to go into negotiations in a stronger position.

When I think of that, I think that they're gonna want to keep Cena on Smackdown. Therefore, I don't expect he and Orton to switch titles.

Either they both will keep their same titles, Cena will win them both, or Orton may win them both off of some fuckery, but Cena will get them (or at least the Smackdown one) right back.

I think it might be the former option, though.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Just heard Ziggler/Del Rio put on a clinic and had a MOTY quality bout on main event for tomorrow. I'll have to check that out. 

They really do have some awesome chemistry.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Somebody should seriously do a project involving Del Rio and Ziggler. Their chemistry is one for the ages. Easily Del Rio's best opponent and Ziggler's second best (behind Bryan).

Reading more into the Smackdown main event and it seriously sounds like one of those special fun moments that we all will love. My goodness, are we all in agreement that The Shield this year had the best year in WWE history for a tag team besides The Rockers in 89?


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

The Shield have probably had the most enjoyable year of a group that I've ever witnessed. They could already make a 3 DVD set on those guys. And I'd buy the shit out of said set.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Were you the one that said that they had an amazing house show match earlier this year?


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

As much as I dislike Del Rio, I will admit his series with Ziggler was great. The Shield has to be the best stable of this era, its not even close. I would buy a dvd of theirs as well


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Were you the one that said that they had an amazing house show match earlier this year?


Yeah, went to a show in March and they did the Shield vs Cena/Sheamus/Ryback match and just absolutely killed it. Great stuff.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

I'll be a sad man when they break up. 

Best shield match? Either TLC vs Bryan/Kane/ Ryback or EC vs Sheamus/Cena/Ryback for me.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Their debut match at TLC, or the tag against HellNo and Kofi.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

TLC is the best Shield match, no doubt about it. 

I started watching TLC 2011 like a month ago. Trying to finally finish it tonight. Just watched Henry/Show chairs match. Fun.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Chairs matches fpalm Even more so when Batista hit Taker with a low blow in 2009 and won only for Teddy Long to come out and say you couldn't do that and restarted the match fpalm

They're even worse now since usually the only things chairs are used for are shots to the gut or back. Not saying I'm clamoring for unprotected chair shots, but people rarely get creative.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I love the TLC PPV, but chairs matches have to be the worst stipulation ever. Amazing how Sheamus and Big Show ended up having a good one.

Shield vs. Jericho/Ryback/Sheamus: ****3/4*
Underappreciated match of theirs. DAT ROLLINS!

Did HHH and Christian ever have a match?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Power Trip teamed with Edge and Christian to face the BOD and Hardys on the RAW before Backlash 2001. Pretty sure Hunter and Christian never faced each other, even in a tag match.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Yeah, wow, very little interaction.

http://www.profightdb.com/wrestler_search/christian-277.html?opp=193


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Holy cow. Think I need to check out that August 12, 2002 8 man tag. Christian/Storm/Test/Hunter vs Booker/Rock/Taker/Goldust. Somehow that got by me when I checked Profight last time.

Okay, so only part II of this match is available. Anyone have a link to this show or match? Would be appreciated.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xl...er-rock-vs-un-americans-hhh-raw-8-12-02_sport

Super fun. Ending was crazy hectic. God damn I love crazy tag matches, except when they're made by Teddy Long for some unknown reason. Is it a coincidence that tag team wrestling got better once he got banished?


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

at long last:

*TLC 2011*

Dolph Ziggler v Zach Ryder
Gotta start by saying this crowd is absolutely MOLTEN and they LOVE Ryder. Really good opener here. Good action, tons of nearfalls, nice pace to it. Just an easy match to watch and enjoy enhanced by the super hot crowd. Both guys were on top of their game; on point with their offense and bumping that extra bit harder to make everything better. Good stuff. That's how you want to kick off a PPV.

Cody attacked Booker backstage. I'm extremely grateful that Booker's wrestling and not commentating on this show.

Air Boom v Epico & Primo
Another good match. Maybe Kofi should be a tag team guy. Less time for him to be awful. He actually had a pretty good hot tag here. Bourne gave us a strong FIP display and the heels were fine controlling him. No complaints from me.

Randy Orton v Wade Barrett
Really, REALLY liked this. The last show I watched (NOC '11) started with three forgettable matches, this one has started with three goodies. And the last three Orton matches I've watched (this, NOC v Henry and No Mercy LMS v HHH) have been quality and he was very good in all of them. Get back to that level and stop being shitty please. Back to the match itself, this is how tables matches should be. Focus on the tables with good, smart teases. Don't think anything here was overly contrived. That barrage of knees + big boot by Barrett while Orton was caught up in the ropes above a table on the outside was great. Also thought Orton's clothesline, clothesline, powerslam, DDT comeback which sometimes sucks didn't suck at all and came off much more natural than usual. Sweet finish too. Best tables match ever? Top 5 match for Barrett? Not sure but it just overtook Ziggler/Ryder as MOTN.

Beth Phoenix v Kelly Kelly
Not bad. Kelly Kelly overdid it with the screaming but otherwise this was decent by divas standard. Nice callback to the finish of their NoC match.

Cody jumped Booker again. I guess that match isn't happening? Can't say I'm upset about that.

Kevin Nash v Triple H
I certainly wouldn't call this a good match but I'm not gonna call it bad either and that in itself makes it better than it should've been. Nash seriously stunk it up at times, for instance when he struggled to fall through the ropes early in the match and when he botched the Pedigree near the end. Not sure what was really supposed to happen with the announce table backdrop spot but that didn't look good either. Those shitty moments aside this was totally watchable. Trips tried hard and managed to put together something mildly substantial. Always thought H was an underrated bumper and his signature corner flip w/ladder looked great here. Figure four in the ladder was a cool highlight to some decent leg work, and although my interest waned at one point I didn't think they overstayed their welcome. Clique sign -> SUCK IT --> sledgehammer KO blow was an appropriate finish. Potential disaster averted, largely thanks to a good effort from HHH and constant crowd involvement.

Punk did a promo backstage. John Lauranaitis came in and said "I'll be the bigger man. After all, I am taller than you." Yep.

Jack Swagger v Sheamus
Decent match. Felt more like an unimportant showcase for Sheamus than anything else though. I liked the start with Sheamus shaking off Swagger's punches and then clobbering him. Also thought Swagger's leg work at the end was good but I've never understood how attacking someone's knee could be a sensible setup for an ANKLE lock. I guess I could convince myself that it torques the knee as well but if I want to hurt a guy's ankle that's what I'm gonna attack. Can't remember much else.

Mark Henry v Big Show
I would totally watch this again. It's short and to the point, Mark Henry is in it (YOU CRAZY. YOU OUT OF YO MIND :mark, and Big Show is awesome selling his hand. Out of nowhere KO punch ftw works for me too. 

Oh so Cody/Booker is happening after all. Fuck it, I don't feel like watching that. Skipped.

CM Punk v Alberto Del Rio v The Miz
A three way TLC match generally isn't my cup of tea but this was really good. They had a nice dynamic going with this trio. Started off 2v1 in favor of the heels, which I'll take any day over the one guy disappears from the action so the two other guys can go at it before one of those guys disappears to be replaced by the other guy type triple threats WWE likes to do. It boiled down to that in the end anyways but I dug Miz and Del Rio working together briefly even though they didn't trust each other, only to turn on each other much sooner than I expected. Loved Punk's delayed fall through the table after a thunderous Del Rio kick. Looked like he was legit out and had no idea where he was falling or if he was falling or what planet he was on, and the camera angle did a good job of hiding the table until right before impact. Holy fuck @ Rodriguez taking a crazy bump. That looked life threatening. Del Rio was aggressive and looked like a real threat to Punk's title, Miz worked hard and didn't look out of place, and Punk turned in a high quality effort. The handcuff shenanigans were something that I might not usually enjoy but I thought it did a nice job of enhancing the babyface overcoming the odds story. Very good match. Best on the show.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Many thanks for the link. That one led me to this: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xt4tay_hhh-vs-the-rock-raw-8-19-2002_sport

Not much to say about the match except that it gave us this awesome pre-match promo with Rock, and the REALLY awesome superkick from Shawn that Brock oversells the shit out of.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Chairs matches fpalm Even more so when Batista hit Taker with a low blow in 2009 and won only for Teddy Long to come out and say you couldn't do that and restarted the match fpalm
> 
> They're even worse now since usually the only things chairs are used for are shots to the gut or back. Not saying I'm clamoring for unprotected chair shots, but people rarely get creative.


I don't understand the logic behind completely banning chairshots to the head. Well I guess it makes sense for safety reasons, but why ban them completely? If you can protect yourself and partially block the shot with your arm like any other move, it should be fine. But nooooooooooo


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

It's all Benoit's fault.

HHH clocking Taker in the head at 27 is all the greater because of it though.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

That chairshot didn't even look legit. Taker fell down way to quickly and HHH had no force behind it. It was basically Taker walking into the chair.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

idk what you're talking about


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Hooray for more people loving TLC. Let's hope that this year's show is even half as good as that one. Surprised you didn't talk about the cash in.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I haven't read the SD spoilers (been staying away from them lately), but I hope that Bryan and Punk remain working together by TLC, although I'm not sure how they'd weave The Shield into that program. Ah well, I guess my question should be at least partially resolved on SD.

Haven't watched much wrestling this week because I've had to write an essay on Wagner for my music appreciation class. Resisting the urge to reference Daniel Bryan in this essay...maybe. :bryan3


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Hooray for more people loving TLC. Let's hope that this year's show is even half as good as that one. Surprised you didn't talk about the cash in.


Such a fun show. Not a bad match on the card.

Cash ins have lost their swag to me and Bryan's was totally forgettable on a re-watch. He didn't even have to hit a move, he pinned a face, it just didn't feel special watching it now knowing how much more of a star he is today.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Saint Dick said:


> Cash ins have lost their swag to me and Bryan's was totally forgettable on a re-watch. He didn't even have to hit a move, he pinned a face, it just didn't feel special watching it now knowing how much more of a star he is today.


Does that really matter? 

All I saw was Bryan Fucking Danielson as a World Champion & I still do :mark: when I watch it.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Just got SS, UF, NM, TT and Armageddon 05 in the post! I *think* that's me with the entire 05 PPV collection now minus ECW ONS.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

ONS is probably higher on the Cal Scale than all of those other shows combined. Surely you at least liked Tanaka/Awesome.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I don't recall liking anything from ONS 05. Pile of wank tbh. At least 06 has that epic tag with FOLEY AND FUNK.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

If TLC lives up to its incredible small legacy of ending up the year in a bang (and that Main Event is a bang ending on paper) than I might just consider it the real 4th biggest event of the year.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'm not high on the TLC PPV at all. MAYBE had 1 good match per year and that's it.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

To each his own. I even didn't dislike 2009 tbh.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> ONS is probably higher on the Cal Scale than all of those other shows combined. Surely you at least liked Tanaka/Awesome.


Once again, you and your hyperbole hate for 2005! SummerSlam that year was definitely better than ONS. ONS is fun to watch but other than the match you mentioned, nothing else is memorable except the promos (Heyman shooting, Bischoff getting murdered, RVD's promo and the WWE invaders) and I don't think promos increase a show's CAL SCALE score.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Every 05 show I got today would easily blow ONS 05 out of the water with the CAL SCALE thanks to just ONE MATCH on each event. 

SS - Undertaker/Orton
UF - Edge/Hardy
NM - Undertaker/Orton
TT - HHH/Flair
Armageddon - Undertaker/Orton

And then there is the rest of the shows which no doubt will add some points here and there too lol.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Dude Summerslam 2005 is one of the top 5 Summerslams ever, no way is ONS even close to that. Orton/Taker, Michaels/Hogan, Eddie/Rey, Hardy/Edge, Benoit squashing someone....come on. I can't even pimp the Eddie/Benoit match from ONS and believe me I wish I could....it's just not that good...easily their worst match probably ***1/4 is fair and no more. Tanaka/Awesome was great but that's pretty much it if I recall.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Cal, do you mind editing out the picture in this person's post? It's making that page kind of unreadable:
http://www.wrestlingforum.com/gener...ry-according-dave-meltzer-9.html#post26880041

Thank you. 

ETA: Thanks so much, Cal!


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Can someone nominate some wrestlecrap? Like, the worst match you've ever seen - preferably with booking fuckery and pointless wrestling/no-selling.


edit: don't mind the promotion.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Not WWE, but Kurt Angle v. Jeff Hardy @ No Surrender 2010 springs to mind instantly.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

For pointless booking, there was a mention of TLC 09 with Batista and Taker. Lowblow with a chair is not allowed. :lol



Cactus Jack said:


> Dude Summerslam 2005 is one of the top 5 Summerslams ever, no way is ONS even close to that. Orton/Taker, Michaels/Hogan, Eddie/Rey, Hardy/Edge, Benoit squashing someone....come on. I can't even pimp the Eddie/Benoit match from ONS and believe me I wish I could....it's just not that good...easily their worst match probably ***1/4 is fair and no more. Tanaka/Awesome was great but that's pretty much it if I recall.


I don't think even I would go that high for Eddie/Benoit. It's such a disappointing and boring match, unlike what they usually did. Even they weren't happy with it as there was some "backstage heat" between them after the match.

And you didn't even mention Cena/Jericho for SS 05, another great match on that wonderful show.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> For pointless booking, there was a mention of TLC 09 with Batista and Taker. Lowblow with a chair is not allowed. :lol
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Fuck I knew I was forgetting one, I'm in the minority, but I think that Cena vs Jericho SS 2005 match is the best of the bunch. The one the following night on Raw was good, as was Survivor Series, but that Summerslam match is just amazing. Love how Jericho loses all his heel heat mid way through the match and the fans just decide they can't boo him over Cena because of how much respect they had for him. I'd put that match up as one of Jericho's best performances ever, he carries Cena totally and makes it a GREAT match.

Yea, I can see people giving Eddie/Benoit ONS a lower rating and I'm sure it would be completely justified. I'm just so biased when it comes to those two I find it hard to give anything they did lower than ***. But yea, not very much to say about that one other than it was very disappointing. Any idea what the heat between the two was over? Other than it not being up to their standards...


Rah- I've said it many times before the worst match I've ever seen is Hogan vs Warrior Halloween Havoc 1998. I'd love to see you or rjsbx1 write a review of that one.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cleavage said:


> You want Eddie GODNESS! Go watch Eddie/Tajiri vs. Team Angle - Smackdown 05/22/2003, I just finished watching it myself review coming soon.


Is that on YT?


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Is that on YT?







@ 6:50


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Is that on YT?



You've done me so many solids Zep here you go: 

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=u4tzb0XSR-Q

Feel like experiencing some Eddie greatness myself, GAB Bullrope match with JBL up next :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Fuck I knew I was forgetting one, I'm in the minority, but I think that Cena vs Jericho SS 2005 match is the best of the bunch. The one the following night on Raw was good, as was Survivor Series, but that Summerslam match is just amazing. Love how Jericho loses all his heel heat mid way through the match and the fans just decide they can't boo him over Cena because of how much respect they had for him. I'd put that match up as one of Jericho's best performances ever, he carries Cena totally and makes it a GREAT match.


Yeah, Jericho's performance on that one was great and he really made that match what it is. And the crowd is ELECTRIC when they do the split chants, the whole arena is chanting and unlike the future days, you can still notice some male Cena fans chanting for him.



> Yea, I can see people giving Eddie/Benoit ONS a lower rating and I'm sure it would be completely justified. I'm just so biased when it comes to those two I find it hard to give anything they did lower than ***. But yea, not very much to say about that one other than it was very disappointing. Any idea what the heat between the two was over? Other than it not being up to their standards...


I think it was just the disappointment with the match. Probably why they had another match a few weeks later on Smackdown to make up for it.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> You've done me so many solids Zep here you go:
> 
> http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=u4tzb0XSR-Q
> 
> Feel like experiencing some Eddie greatness myself, GAB Bullrope match with JBL up next :mark:





FLUX said:


> @ 6:50


Thanks guys


----------



## Cleavage (Apr 19, 2005)

Apparently they have a rematch the next week and it's better than that, I can't wait to watch it tonight :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Willing to take a match request if i have it


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

ATF said:


> If TLC lives up to its incredible small legacy of ending up the year in a bang (and that Main Event is a bang ending on paper) than I might just consider it the real 4th biggest event of the year.


I just don't see Orton/Cena being anything special. Then again it's John Cena in a big main event so it has a chance.

Are they ever gonna do HHH/Show?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I request Kerry von Erich vs. Ric Flair in a cage. If not that, then the Ghetto Street Fight between JYD and Butch Reed.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

"Ghetto Street Fight between JYD and Butch Reed" just sounds racist . Who booked it; Bill Watts? 8*D


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*Unforgiven 2002*

The first PPV with both brand titles on the line!!!


*The Un-Americans Vs Booker T, Goldust, Bubba Ray Dudley & Kane*

The Un-Americans, huh? Wonder who came up with that name; The Un-Creative Team?

OMG THAT'S NOT KANE THAT'S SOMEONE ELSE HE LOOKS DIFFERENT SO IT'S OBVIOUSLY SOMEONE ELSE WEARING THE MASK ZOMG~!

Anyone else remember how some people were absolutely ADAMANT about the fact that this wasn't REALLY Kane? :lmao

:mark: Goldust starting things off with Christian. I know Survivor Series ended up being one of the top PPV's of the year and a tremendous PPV in general regardless of the year, I'm surprised they didn't go with a big elimination match like this with the Un-Americans Vs a group of Pro-USA guys or something. Plenty of talent on the Un-American side of things, then you could have had Goldust (And Booker, I suppose, though he was in the EC that night), and uhhh... huh, everyone I can think of was already part of something at SVS lol. Well rebook the card!!! Something like this should have happened lol .

Early part of the match is the USA guys dominating and all taking turns at getting them some of these bastards who tell the truth and don't think USA is a GOAT as USA thinks it is (  ). Everyone except KANE because they saving that big gun for when it's truly NESSECCARY. NESESSARY. NESSECCESSARRRY. THAT WORD.

Bubba and Booker decide to get tables out, which fucks them over as they decide to get a table from under the ring ON THE UN-AMERICANS SIDE OF THE RING and they get jumped. OH THE SHOCK. Morons lol.

Booker T plays FIP while a bunch of superior talent work him over. Poor Booker, he's like, the worst guy in this match bar Test. MAYBE. Luckily he isn't SUCKA(ING) so it's all good.

HOT TAG TO KANE and he comes in like a house on fire. Which probably motivates him in a different way to everyone else.

WILD 8 MAN BRAWL~!

Good GOD Test absolutely fucking POWERS Kane up for a Pumphandle. I swear Kane wasn't being co-operative there either lol. PURE POWER. Booker officially moves to the bottom of the workers in this match .

DOUBLE TEAM TO KANE. SUPERKICK~! KANE SURVIVES!!!

Everyone comes in the ring and gets them some of someone before being taken out by someone else coming in. You know the deal, but hey, it's a ton of fun especially for a finishing stretch of a big match like this.

KANE comes back and starts mauling everyone. CHOKESLAM TO STORM~! 3 count.

Fun way to start the show!

*Rating: ****
*CAL SCALE - 2*


*Chris Jericho Vs Ric Flair - WWE Intercontinental Championship Match*

Huh, Jericho is IC champ? I... don't remember him winning the belt around this time lol.

In fact I don't remember this match happening at all. I know they faced at SummerSlam... but a rematch? With Jericho as IC champ somehow? WHEN DID ALL THIS SHIT HAPPEN? 

SLAPS TO THE FACE~!

This is all about FLAIR proving to himself that he can still go and can still have one last run. Jericho gives him a TON in this match. Flair is all over him and looks great despite his age.

Flair targets the leg a little, then Jericho gets a second wind, knocks Flair down and goes for the Lionsault! Flair moves, Jericho lands on his feet but quickly crumples down to the mat holding his knee!!! He's obviously hurt 8*D.

Flair gives him some space, then when he turns his back, Jericho locks in the Walls and makes Flair TAP. LOL.

Fun enough for the time it got and the match they worked. Flair looked great, then Jericho OUT-DIRTIED THE DIRTIEST PLAYER IN THE GAME and got the win.

*Rating: ***
*CAL SCALE - 0.5*


:lmao Shaq is in attendance with his son, and when the camera gets on them, his own son BLASTS HIM IN THE FACE with a right hook :lmao.


*Eddie Guerrero Vs Edge*

Hmmmm.... not sure what to expect from this match. I was never super high on their matches back in 2002, and Edge's stuff really doesn't hold up well from this time period at all. Add to that the fact I don't think much to their No DQ SD match either which is pretty much considered the crown jewel match of this feud... I can't say I'm expecting much at all from this match.

Eddie shows us his VETERAN INSTINCTS at the start of this one, getting out of the ring straight away as Edge comes in fired up. He sneaks around behind Edge for a roll up, and when Edge kicks out he runs back outside and does the chase thing before getting back in the ring and jumping on Edge as he comes in the ring. Basic stuff yeah, but it's always nice when there seems to be SOME reason behind it .

TORNADO DDT. EDGE IS DOWN! Eddie knows it, and you can see that he realises Edge is hurt and he just ATTACKS like a vicious animal :mark:.

I'm going to tell you something that you have never heard. That has never been written. That nobody would EVER expect me to ever say, write or imply. EDDIE FUCKING RULES . Eddie on offence is awesome here. He starts being violent, just jumping on Edge when he realises he's hurting. Then he starts to get cocky, playing to the crowd and taking his time (and the crowd btw are LOVING Eddie for the most part). Edge then manages to get a shot in, and Eddie sells it like a knockout shot. So when he gets back up again he reverts back to being violent and vicious in order to keep Edge down again.

Edge is hurting, and apparently also recently suffered a concussion which makes some of Eddie's offence even better lol. So when Edge sees an opportunity, he doesn't waste time, going either for a quick rollup or for one big move that might get him the win.

SPEAR! EDDIE MOVES! EDGE STOPS HIMSELF! DDT! 3! NO? EDDIE GOT HIS FOOT ON THE ROPE! MATCH CONTINUES!

EXPOSED TURNBUCKLE~! EDDIE GOES BACK FIRST INTO IT~! EDGE ATTEMPTS A SUPERPLEX... EDDIE SMASHES HIS HEAD INTO THE TURNBUCKLE WHILE THEY ARE STOOD ON THE ROPES~! SUNSET FLIP POWERBOMB~!

EDDIE WINS! EDDIE WINS!!! :mark:

Well this was WAY better than I was expecting. WAY BETTER. Eddie was clearly the driving force in making it as good as it was, but Edge played his role in this thing as well as you could expect too.

*Rating: ***1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 3*


HHH decided to visit RVD in the Raw locker room. He addresses Flair and how he's no longer what he used to be. HEEL TURN? Nah, that'll never happen...


*Billy & Chuck Vs 3 Minute Warning - If Billy & Chuck win, Bischoff must kiss Stephanie's ass. If 3 Minute Warning win, Stephanie must perform HLA*

HLA! HLA! HLA! HLA! HOT LESBIAN ACTION~!

How could ANYONE be rooting for the "babyfaces" Billy & Chuck in this situation lol?

Man, I still remember the wedding segment from SD. Bischoff revealing himself as the minister was pretty awesome. Totally didn't see it coming. Stephanie tried something similar too but was more in the background to hide than in plain sight without being seen lol.

Billy & Chuck pretty much just get squashed. YES! HLA! STEPHANIE!!! FAP FAP FAP!!! But we gotta wait for it .

*Rating: DUD*
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*Triple H Vs Rob Van Dam - World Heavyweight Championship Match*

The first WHC match in WWE history! Excluding WWF, of course . Anyway. HHH gets the title handed to him, then proceeds to BERRY people while defending it or something. You know, because RVD was WHC material...

MAN, HHH CAN REALLY SPIT WATER! He can also... lift weights . And ruin main event scenes for basically a decade! Woo!!!

About 5 minutes into the match, RVD grabs a bottle of water and does HHH's water spit. I think I could probably skip the rest of the match knowing that THAT was the best part .

LOL RVD DIES. Leaps over the ropes and splats on the floor as HHH moves. Can we end this thing on a countout please? PLEASE? No? FUCK YOU.

"I THINK EARL HEBNER COUNTS VERY WELL". I'm sure if his maths teacher is still alive he'd be proud.

*HHH applies a sleeper*

Lawler: "NOBODY HAS USED THIS MOVE IN YEARS. ITS A CLASSIC!!!"

:lmao

HHH bores the shit out of me in control. Then RVD comes back and at least TRIES to make it interesting again by quite literally kicking the fuck out of HHH.

REF BUMP~! Frog Splash. No ref. Shock and horror.

Fuck me at the set up to the low blow on RVD. Dumbest shit ever.

Sledgehammer comes out to play. Flair shows up. Nails RVD with the hammer. HHH wins. Urgh.

*Rating: **
*CAL SCALE - 0*


D-Lo Brown and Billy Kidman are... backstage talking. Some old man from... the Young and the Restless or something? I dunno. I don't know why this is a thing. I just don't get it.


*Trish Stratus Vs Molly Holly - WWE Women's Championship Match*

Ha.

*Rating: NO*
*CAL SCALE - -1*


*Chris Benoit Vs Kurt Angle*

Oh christ I forgot this was on the show lol. I used to like this... then again I used to think their RR 03 match was ***** and their Raw cage match was good. So fuck knows how I'll end up feeling about this. That being said I used to love their Backlash 01 match... and I STILL fucking love it. Hopefully this falls into that category. Better do. Sick of watching shitty matches! Need the taste of HHH/RVD out of my mouth.

So the first 5 minutes maybe, are utterly pointless. They just exchange hugs and shit while moaning and groaning like weirdos .

Cole "Benoit's got like 0% body fat"

Tazz "I used to have that!"

Cole "When? When you were 2?"

:lmao

Commentators talk about how great the CONDITIONING~! of both these guys is... yet they are both utterly fucked and are doing the old "both guys down while the ref does a 10 count" thing after... almost nothing lol. They did the hug exchanges at the start... then Angle gets a couple of moves in, Benoit makes a little comeback and... that's them knackered apparently lol.

Well, time for FINISHERS~! Because... I dunno, they've hugged for a while, then pretended to be knackered for a while so we gotta do a finishing stretch. Benoit cheats to win.

I don't... I'm not... what? I can't point to this match and say "it's fucking terrible"... because... I don't really have ANY opinion on it. It's just there. Nothing offensive, nothing to make me hate wrestling... but nothing for me to like. A whole bunch of stuff and that's it.

*Rating: **
*CAL SCALE - 0*


HLA TIME! But they crap all over it. They tease us with hot HLA. Then Rikishi comes out in drag. Bischoff seems to be the only person to not know its him. Ends up taking a stink face. Bah.


*Brock Lesnar Vs The Undertaker - WWE Championship Match*

:mark:

:mark:

Ummm...

:mark:.

This is the IYH: Ground Zero match to Lesnar & Undertaker's HIAC match. Like HBK/Undertaker GZ, this is a match that is simply used to BUILD to another match. And not in the shitty way like we've seen in the past (and future, since this is from 2002 lol). Instead they give us a great match but it ends in a way that makes us NEED a rematch, and a rematch inside some cage or cell to keep them from fucking shit up and giving us a non finish again. On last watch, this match did it just as wonderfully as HBK/Undertaker. Hope it holds up at the very least :mark:.

Starts off :mark:. Lesnar is the young champion about to face his BIGGEST test yet, and he walks right up to Undertaker and looks him in the eye, so Undertaker just pushes him away like he's fucking nothing. MIND GAMES played by both guys :mark:.

I love how Heyman sees that Lesnar is getting in trouble, so he sacrifices himself, taking a HUGE boot to the face, to allow Lesnar to capitalise on a distracted Dead Man. And man oh man, Lesnar just fucking SPEARING the shit out of Undertaker into the corner is a great way to capitalise on such a situation lol.

:mark: Undertaker's awesome strikes are awesome. Lesnar had been working over the BODY of Undertaker, so Undertaker fires back with some BRUTAL body shots that fuck Lesnar up.

More Heyman distraction and BAM~! WWE title to the face of the Dead Man and the Dead Man is busted open!!!

BRAWLING~! Undertaker is just killing it with his punches. Lesnar wants to nail him in the head with the title? Undertaker is gonna retaliate with massive punches right in the FACE.

Ref Bump! MATT HARDY! BAH GAWD MATT HARDY IS HERE~! He gets killed .

Poor ref keeps getting knocked down and shit lol. His own fault, he shouldn't be in the ring while these 2 MONSTERS are going at it. Kinda like how the army stand around getting mauled while Godzilla and King Kong battle or something. GET THE FUCK OUT OF THERE YOU DUMB FUCK. 

Lesnar and Taker are just trying to KILL each other. Lesnar is trying to hang with 'Taker to show that while he's young and fairly inexperienced, he's still a top player, while Undertaker is trying to hang with Lesnar and prove that despite getting older, he's still the big dog that runs the yard. And as a result, like I already said, we end up with both of them just trying to KILL each other. :mark:

LESNAR IS BLEEDING~! And Undertaker is making sure to go after it. Lesnar has never been CUT in a match before, so it's cool to see how he reacts to it, and well, that's pretty much how we get to the finish of the match. The BEAST has been hurt and now he's pissed. They just battle in the corner and the dumb arse ref keeps getting involved, and ends up just throwing the match out. Fans ain't happy, and yeah, you can't blame them. Nobody likes a non finish, especially for a main event, but they followed up on it like fucking BOSSES with the HIAC match, PLUS they keep on fighting after the bell rings, ending with Undertaker lobbing Lesnar through the Unforgiven stage!!!

:mark: Still love this one. A wonderful build to HIAC, AND a pretty fucking sweet match to boot.

*Rating: ****1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 6*



*Overall CAL SCALE - 10.5*​


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Unforgiven 2002 Ratings:

8-Man Tag:- ***1/2
Jericho/Flair- **
Eddie/Edge- ***3/4
3MW-Billy/Chuck: *
HHH-RVD *3/4
Molly-Trish *
Benoit-Angle ***
Brock-Taker ** (Brock bumping like a madman made the match)

BUT GOAT theme song. Adrenaline by Gavin Rossdale :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I really like Brock/Taker, think i had it near **** last time


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I request Kerry von Erich vs. Ric Flair in a cage. If not that, then the Ghetto Street Fight between JYD and Butch Reed.


Ill see what i can do 

Sorry for the double post, damn phone lol


----------



## Cleavage (Apr 19, 2005)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Willing to take a match request if i have it


http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1...003-team-angle-vs-tajiri-eddie-guerrero_sport


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Cleavage said:


> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1...003-team-angle-vs-tajiri-eddie-guerrero_sport


DAT GOAT PRE-MATCH PROMO!


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Haven't seen Survivor Series yet, haven't seen Raw yet, I know what happens and holy fuck is this place kind of unbearable right now. Good thing I haven't been here for the majority of the crying. If everybody is so bitchy now I sure can't wait to see what things are going to be like in 2 months time when we:

A) Have an Undisputed Champion
B) Have a Royal Rumble Winner
C) Have a Streak Contender
D) Have a Battle For Control of the WWE 

And all roles are most likely filled by guys a lot of people _don't _want to see. Good times ahead.

:trips2 :cena4 :vince5


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Oh dear, Starbuck is here and ready to bury some fools. Little does she know that her favorites are getting buried by DEM ROGUE CHANTS! Then again, HHH just brought the shovel out in his recent online promo about CM Punk. WHO'S BURYING WHO? :aries2


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

thoughts on ONS 05: I just watched this show a few months ago and it was amazing IMO, but SS blows it out of the water, I love Tanaka/awesome, the three way dance is a great gem, the opener is fine, and I do like the main event, Eddie/Benoit is garbage and so is Mysterio/Psycosis IIRC, can anyone back me up on that?

Me and cal disagree on everything about UF 02 besides Eddie/Edge and the opener :lmao


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Ultimately VINCE buries all when he collects the money from DEM ROGUE CHANTERS for attending the show and then continues to push the exact opposite of what they want because ROGUE CHANTS don't = PPV BUYS

:vince$

I don't even know what the hell happened though lol. Bryan chants in matches I assume?


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

HHH/RVD blows. That's probably the beginning of HHH wanting to recreate his own little watered down poor man's Four Horsemen and tenth rate Ric Flair impression. I remember during the RVD match he 'begged off' like Flair. Only unlike Flair who usually did it with Stings and Windhams - HHH was clearly the bigger and bulkier guy in the match. I think Benoit/Angle is a Benoit/Angle still like, but I haven't seen it since I watched the RR03 match and despised the finish run of it. I want to watch all of the Eddie/Edges again, but a problem with that is I have to watch Edge multiple times. He wasn't bad in 2002, at least. I wouldn't be shocked if I still liked those Edge/Angle matches, truth be told. Taker/Lesnar I thought was OK, but I'm not sure if I even finished watching it the last time I tried. Thought it was kind of dull.

Favourite parts of the show are probably Goldust and the kid practicing his Shaq Fu.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

"Daniel Bryan" and "Boring" chants during that disgrace of a main event at SvS. And then after the match, Cena comes out for whatever reason to a chorus of silence and faces off against Randy Orton. :vince3 made an appearance after the show for some fun. And then on RAW, Randy Orton was doing a promo with HHH and Stephanie, but their entire promo was no-sold by DEM ROGUE DANIEL BRYAN chants. Cena comes out once again to deafening silence and does his usual GOATing by trolling the crowd :cena3. In the horrible tag main event, all the crowd did was chant "Daniel Bryan/CM Punk" while Orton, Big Show, Del Rio, and Cena attempted to do something that somewhat resembled wrestling.

Meanwhile, :wyatt unk :bryan2 :reigns :ambrose :rollins :cesaro :cody2 Goldust and Harper are getting thunderous ovations from the crowd and giving us a reason to watch this sham of a program.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

I believe half of that ^^^^^. 

:lol


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Have you seen Roman Reigns put on a masterful performance at SvS yet?


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

I have not. I have assignments coming out my ears right now. No time for wrasslin. I'll definitely get on it in about 2 weeks when I'm finally free. I'll also finally watch Rio/Zigs so SKINS will stfu .


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

3 more 2002 events to go! Might as well get a start on Armageddon 02 now. Not looking forward to certain parts of it .


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Starbuck said:


> I have not. I have assignments coming out my ears right now. No time for wrasslin. I'll definitely get on it in about 2 weeks when I'm finally free.* I'll also finally watch Rio/Zigs so SKINS will stfu *.


Good girl, supposedly they have a match tonight that is pretty good ? I may take upon that ziggler/adr project after I'm done with job


#NW cena/orton nwo 08 for the first time and get me ready for tlc


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Ziggler/Del Rio tonight is supposed to be great... I may give it watch. I don't expect it touch their PB match, but hopefully it's better than all their other matches.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> 3 more 2002 events to go! Might as well get a start on Armageddon 02 now. Not looking forward to certain parts of it .


its actually an amazing show apart from the ME, Angle/Show, the opening tag, and EDDIE/BENOIT are all :mark: 



Spoiler: Armageddon 02 review



Armageddon 2002 review 
Match # 1: Booker T and Goldust vs. Lance Storm and William Regal vs. The Dudley Boyz vs. Chris Jericho and Christian
Oh this should be sick! These tag matches have all been :mark: so far. Best year for tag wrestling on PPV? Probably. No idea why they don’t just have 4 people in the ring instead of people fucking taggingin their opponents, never got that shit. This match is all sorts of fun, such an awesome pace and I think I am legit a fan of everyone in this but Booker T, and his weaknesses are never evident when GOLDUST is with him. This is an Elimination match apparently and it comes down to Jericho and Christian vs Bookdust. Really solid opener here, with a lot of cool spots combined with good wrestling. The final two teams are the MVP’s here as they go 2 on 2 for the majority of the match and the end has a lot of good near falls. Crowd is crazy behind Bookdust here and all 4 guys are at their very best. Awesome match, and 2002 tag wrestling keeps getting better. Match surprisingly goes a long time at over 20 minutes but it doesn’t feel too long, also nice to see Bookdust FINALLY get the tag titles. ****
CAL SCALE: 5
Match # 2: Edge vs A-train
What a fuckfest this shit will be. Edge went from being the co main event of PPVS to fucking fighting A-train in a filler match in like 2 months. This might be the shittiest match yet this year if it wasn’t for Hogan. Such a slow match and it just didn’t work. Albert was so much better when he was T&A with Test in 2000 because it hid hi weaknesses. The guy just cant work a very good match and this is a perfect example of that. DUD
CAL SCALE: 0 
Match # 3: Eddie Gurrero vs Chris Benoit
I just watched their ECW one night stand match last night, lets see how those two compare. I doubt these two have EVER had a bad match, two of the best workers in WWE history, sad as fuck their gone . This is pretty fucking great- better than that opening tag IMO. I nearly broke my computer when I realized the fans we’re chanting BORING and HBK chants, those fucking cunts. Once again this is gonna be MOTN easily, some good shit here. They start out with some really fun mat work and transition to a good brawl flawlessly. Really solid nearfalls and a dramatic ending make this a shoe in for MOTN, and pretty sure this beats out that rebellion tag for my current MOTY. **** ½* 
CAL SCALE: 7 
Match # 4: Batista vs Kane
GREEN BATISTA? NO FUCKIN THANKS!! NO 
CAL SCALE: -1
Match # 5: divas shit
DIVAS? NOT HAPPENING! NO 
CAL SCALE: -1
Match # 6: Kurt Angle vs Big Show 
Fuck this should be at the very least good. Really fucking good match, like maybe even better than Eddie/Benoit, alright not that good but still really fun. Crowd was super into this and so was I. I wish it was a lttle longer but its NBD, because they do a great job packing in some awesome moves with some fun classic wrasslin too. It WAS going great until fucking a-train decided he wanted to fuck up more than one match tonight and nearly cost Angle the match, fucking cunt. But wait! ITS BRAAACK LESSNAR! He F-5’s Show and this extremely fun match is over. **** 
CAL SCALE: 5
Match # 7: HHH vs HBK 3SOH
The only good thing about this match might be that the “stages “are actually really solid. First fall is street fight, second is a steel cage match, and a third is a ladder match. Better than the payback shit. I really want to like this match so much, just because I love HBK and Haitch can be great at times. Only match I have seen from these two is the Summerslam match, but it was a long time ago so who knows what I thought about. Alright, lets get into this 45 minute clusterfuck. 
First Fall 
This will be the most basic of the falls I guess, considering its just a no DQ match, so will this be the best fall? Most likely yes. Really low expectations going into this siply because everyone loves to shit over this . This wasn’t too bad TBH, but I hope this isn’t a flat out DUD. First fall was actually mildly entertaining, it wasn’t a classic or even really good by any means but I didn’t really have a tough time getting through it TBH, which came as a relatively large surprise considering that I went in thinking this was gonna be hell on earth. ** ¾* 
Second fall
I think Haitch one the first fall, don’t know for sure because I wasn’t really paying attention to the final moments of the match TBH. So this fall will be contested inside of a steel cage. Since HHH likes to be a jerk he throws all of the weapons from the first fall inside the ring, making this a carbon copy of the forst fall only with a cage. I guess you can always call on hunter to suck the creativity out of a match :lol. This wasn’t as good as the first fall even though HBK winning is cooler. HBK jumping off the top of the cage is :mark: and is the only reason this fall is not a flat out DUD. But besides the HBK spot, it sucks. * 
Third fall
There is only 8 minutes left in this video by the time this fall, a ladder match, starts, so this is bound to be shitty. LOLWTF is this 5 minute ladder match, porbably the shortest and shittiest ever TBH. Fuck this fall and this match. DUD 
Overall this is terrible, street fight is decent, but the rest is stupid rushed. * ¼* 
CAL SCALE: 0.5



On the main event of BL 05 ATM, their are two amazing matches on this show, hopefully the ME is a little better than the mania ME.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

3 Stages Of Hell is quite shit IMO. Random just doesn't cover half of that shit.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Backlash 2005 review 

Match# 1: Chris Jericho vs Shelton Benjamin
*
:mark: :mark: This shit is gonna be good! I am a huge mark for both guys and I haven’t seen any of their matches, but they sound REALLY good on paper. Wow, this was a lot of fun, and a really good opener. I must check out these two TT match because if its anything like this match, it’s great. Part of why this project has been so fun is because of Shelton being IC champ, so he’s on basically every RAW PPV . Hopefully his IC title reign continues because I forget when exactly he dropped it. These two worked really well together and I will check out their other matches soon, because this was awesome. ****1/4

*CAL SCALE: 6
Match #2: The Heartthrobs vs William Regal and Tajiri vs Simon Dean and Maven vs La resistance 
*
WHAT! Regal and Tajiri tagged together? I had no idea! But wait? Who the fuck are the heartthrobs? They will most likely suck. I must find more from Tegal, as they might have some amazing gems. Well that ended really quickly, wait this is a turmoil match? Okay whatever, Simon Dean and Maven AKA what might be the WOAT tag team come on down. Please tell me Tegal wins this, because I want a regular match at the next PPV. Thank god regal and Tajiri win again! La resistance come down and this is obviously jobber central here. NO! Regal and Tajiri lost! WTF and now Rosey and Hurricane are down, and I want to punch something! So in the end Rosey and Hurricane win the tag titles, and I think I’m gonna be sick, silly but entertaining match. **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5

Match #3: Edge vs Chris Benoit( LMS match)*

About time we get a one on one Benoit match! Sure he’s been in 2 classics so far but I like some singles Benoit too! I haven’t seen this match and I’m really looking forward to it! Almost immediately the crowd starts to chant you screwed matt, which reminds me that they have a feud in the fall, really looking forward to that steel cage match :mark:. Well this was pretty fucking awesome, and for an edge match too. This shows that Benoit can work with just about anyone and have an awesome match. This fits Edge’s style of course because it was a LMS match that involved a lot of hardcore elements, which is where Edge seems to fit best. Benoit is also good in hardcore matches, even though he is more of a technical wrestler. Coming from someone who thinks Edge is meh, this is good, so for you edge marks, you’ll LOVE this. ***3/4

*CAL SCALE: 4 

Match #4: Kane vs Viscera*

Legit reason I’m not putting a NO on this is because of LITA, who will start managing Edge soon in one of the GOAT pairings. The match itself will probably suck dick, but its whatever. Why does Viscera look like a punk rocker? This is 2005 vis not 1985 :lol. Also, why are you wearing a leather jacket during a wrestling match? That sounds like it would be uncomfortable. Crowd is shitting ALL over this, which is pretty funny. Wait a minute? Trish is managing Vis? GOD DAMMIT, why do the ugly people get hot chicks? Jeez this is bad, would legit prefer if this was Lita vs Trish, because at least then it wouldn’t be disgusting. I also cannot tell who is face and who is heel, as both seem like dicks TBH. Best moment of the match is where Lita hits Trish with a crutch, rest is shit. 

DUD 

CAL SCALE: 0
*
Match #5: Muhammad Hassan and Davairi vs Shawn Michaels and Hulk Hogan
*
For some reason I thought this would be the main event, just because it was like HOGANZ LAST MATCH RITE?? Well, it wasn’t his last match and their were many more disappointing matches to follow, but hopefully this will be solid, even if Hassan and the manager aren’t exactly “top completion”. This was actually pretty fun TBH, wish they went up against a team they didn’t have to carry but they did fine. The beginning and end to this match were really good TBH, but their was a long middle portion that bored the crap out of me. End was fun and crowd of course was hyped for Hogan’s win, but I am glad he came back for SS as this didn’t feel too special. **1/2

*CAL SCALE: 1 

Match #6: Batista vs Triple H *

Not looking forward to this match at all TBH. Apparently this is worse than WM 21, and that was a pretty terrible match, really just want to get to their HIAC match! Too bad I have two shows that should be awesome in JD and ONS. Wow, I shockingly liked this, its no classic for sure, but it was good, and a TON better than their mania match. This match had a lot more flow to it, and it was obvious that there chemistry was vastly improved. This might be a good hidden gem of 2005, as I remember some shitting on it. Well, if you like the mania match even a little you’ll like this. Ending was also pretty bossy. It did have some pacing issues, but I liked it, and now I’m PUMPED for the HIAC match. ***

*CAL SCALE: 2 

FINAL CAL SCALE: 13.5

CURRENT PPV MOTY: Randy Orton vs The Undertaker( WM)

Current 2005 PPV rankings
1: Wrestlemania 21( 19)
2: Royal Rumble (17)
3: Backlash(13.5)
4: New Year’s Revolution (9.5)
5: No Way Out (4.5)
*​


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I have that LMS match at ****1/4. Absolutely brilliant. The finish is one of the greatest of all LMS matches. Edge being so pissed he can't keep that rabid wolverine down that he pulls out a god damned brick and clocks the Crippler with it. :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Ziggler/Del Rio Main Event: ****3/4*


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Ziggler vs. Del Rio from Main Event tonight was really good. :mark: for some of the Payback/MITB callback spots.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Dolph/ADR was decent, started off very well but got pretty spotty for the last 10 mins, These two still gave us the 2nd MOTY at payback, may do a project of their series just need to find their smackdown matches

wanted to drop this in here






:mark: at the fact that he truly thinks he is the best in company and should be the face of it. You know what ........ I believe it. It also hilarious that all my favorites are intertwined somehow :flair3 :hbk1 :ziggler2


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

starting JD 05 soon, after this its just ONS and then we're on the possible PPV of the year with vengeance


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> starting JD 05 soon, after this its just ONS and then we're on the possible PPV of the year with vengeance



As amazing as Vengeance is, it gets solid competition from Summerslam, Summerslam might even be better all around but Vengeance has the best 2 matches (HiaC and Angle/HBK). I'm interested to see what you think of the total WAR that is Cena/JBL I Quit at Judgement Day. It's one of my favorite Cena matches ever and also one of JBL's best.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

yeah Summerslam 05 is possibly the second or third best SS ever, only match I can't remember is Tista/JBL, how was that?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

It was decent, way better than the disaster that was TGAB.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

smitty915 said:


> yeah Summerslam 05 is possibly the second or third best SS ever, only match I can't remember is Tista/JBL, how was that?


I liked SSlam 05, but I'd still put 2001, 2002, and 2013 above it pretty easily. Maybe I'm just biased because my boy Angle was in a throwaway match :angle2


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

^^ I thought I was the only one who liked Angle in this thread lol  Well his WWF/E stuff anyways...


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I'm probably the biggest Angle mark remaining who posts in this thread  :kurt

I'm with you on the WWE part too. I remember streaming his 30 minute "classic" with Jeff Hardy a few years back and I wanted to cry.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Kane vs Viscera from Backlash 2005 is awesome.

Unloading more WCW 1998 goodies. Finished Uncensored '98 tonight & slammed through most of the 3/16/98 edition of Nitro following. The Nitro is SO much better overall than the PPV. It's typical WCW, tbf. PPV was crummy on the whole & def the worst of the three given so far. Booker vs Eddie was good, Jericho vs Malenko was solid & nothing more, Luger vs Steiner was a nice short smash em up match with a lol weak finish _(unfortunately)_, and the Page vs Raven vs Benoit match was still wild & a lot of fun. Nabbing MOTN as I knew it would. Rest doesn't deserved to be mentioned. Pieces of trash. All of it. I'm gonna do a top ten of my favorites from all the '98 PPVs. I'll post my list tomorrow probably.

btw, this Nitro had some rocking bouts like Finlay vs Dragon, Scott Steiner vs Ray Traylor, Raven vs Benoit, & a Scott Norton squash which only cements how radical that guy is. Still got Jericho vs Juvi & apparently a Page + Booker T championship defense left. :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I request Kerry von Erich vs. Ric Flair in a cage.


*Ric Flair vs Kerry Von Erich - NWA 25.12.1982*

'Cage match for the NWA World Title'

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/nwa-w...-von-erich-nwa-25-12-1982-a.html#post26907849


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

b/c I saw someone mention they have next to no faith for the TLC main event to deliver; here is my two cents on that:

Cena in Ladder matches usually sucks hard pardon the fun MITB from 2012 _(it was more than him vs someone else...)_ so I'm not hopeful at all. Gimmicks in WWE ruin everything 9/10.

Also, Del Rio vs Ziggler from Main Event was nothing special. Match was fine, but far too much of a carbon copy out of all of their other matches this year to make it noteworthy. Victim by proxy. Better off watching their PPV matches and maybe one of their other sprints from Smackdown _(the first one - iirc - where Del Rio was babyface)_ and loving those as they nailed the originality aspect.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Can someone please explain the CAL scale to me? Is it an actual thing, or is it just what someone called Cal came up with to rate matches?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The latter. 

:lol

He'll explain it.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cal should just put all the info in the first post lol.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

I kind of guessed the latter, but then yeah, just thought it might be an acronym.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cal, edit the OP. You're over with your system.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> yeah Summerslam 05 is possibly the second or third best SS ever, only match I can't remember is Tista/JBL, how was that?


Not horrible or anything, way better than their previous encounters. I think I gave it like **1/2-**3/4 in my review.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

NotoriousTCG said:


> I kind of guessed the latter, but then yeah, just thought it might be an acronym.


THE CAL SCALE:

NO = -1 (for when a match is so terrible on paper I can't even bring myself to watch it. So usually diva matches and anything involving Kofi Kingston 8*D)
DUD-* = 0
*1/4-** = 0.5
**1/4-**3/4 = 1
***-***1/4 = 2
***1/2 = 3
***3/4 = 4
**** = 5
****1/4 = 6
****1/2 = 7
****3/4 = 8
***** = 9

Simple enough, I just give points based on what rating I give a match. Not perfect, just something random I came up with one day. No idea why .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cal according to your scale I'd probably have WCW Uncensored 1998 at a whopping Cal Score of 6.5. Now I don't mess around with star ratings anymore, but hey, I always wanted to try your thingy out & can wing an opinion on that crap. There's a first time for everything. Fun? Perhaps a little bit.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well isn't that... something .

Watched the first SURVIVOR SERIES earlier. Nothing particularly good, but the entire event was pretty fun. Editing is INSANE though for the tagged classic release, in the sense that it's the VHS release on DVD and they edited the VHS. We get edited entrances with some nonce dubbing the announcing over them lol... and they even edited parts of the matches! Seems just a couple of times with REST HOLDS so it's not exactly a bad thing, but I was a little disappointed with it lol.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Oh, it's a scene.

I've seen a copy like that before. It's a bummer. idc if the portions cut weren't the most exciting, if I'm getting a DVD of a show, it better be in full.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Watching GLOBAL WARNING TOUR 2002 atm. My copy of Armageddon sucked balls so I'm having to get a new one. While I find a good quality version and download it, this Aussie PPV will do. Commentary is probably the worst ever :lmao.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

You mean no more HLA on DVD? That's probably for the best.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

What?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

You certainly don't remember Armageddon 2002 very well, then.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I don't. Haven't seen the event since it aired probably lol. The main event always prevented me from even thinking about buying it on DVD .

HLA you say. Hmmm...

DAWN MARIE AND TORRIE?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Bingo.

Think Unforgiven only, you know, SHIT GOES DOWN. No Steph though. We all weep.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Speaking of Dawn Marie, she was at the first SVS. In the big women's match. She looked about 50 back then. Must have had some major work done 8*D.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Hell of a job by the doc who made her reduce 30 years to revive her career with a job in ECW & return to WWE. Completely devoid of any wrestling talent she may have had in 1987.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well you can either look pretty or know how to wrestle. Can't have both, or at least you couldn't back then. Science has improved since, but it's a little expensive so not many female wrestlers can afford both.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Aja Kong says to hell with looking pretty. And bless her soul for such a decision.

Don't know the theory behind Tamina & Aksana. That's simply fucked.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Having finally watched Raw, that STF on Del Rio :lol

I know we should be used to it by now but.


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Just watched Taker/Shawn from Wrestlemania 26. 

I hope Michaels doesn't come out of retirement. That was a perfect way to end his in ring career.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Watching JD 05 right now, pretty fun PPV so far and the double ME is :mark: 

Surprisingly, Nunzio vs Akio from the pre show is fun and its only like...4 minutes?


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

smitty915 said:


> Watching JD 05 right now, pretty fun PPV so far and the double ME is :mark:
> 
> Surprisingly, Nunzio vs Akio from the pre show is fun and its only like...4 minutes?


Surprisingly? People should know that both Guido and Yang are solid guys. Those two on a pre show >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Miz vs. Kofi


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Not heading out to stuff my face for a couple of hours, been watching 2002 stuff the past couple of days, could I get some recs, 2001 would be good to, none of the MAJOR stuff (hhh/hbk, brock/taker HIAC, no mercy tag etc) but some gems ?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

well I meant for the time it was given, I know both are fun workers 

REY/EDDIE STARTING NOW!! :mark:

BTW- Happy Thanksgiving to all us Americans out there!

EDIT: SKINS, watch Tajiri/Kidman Backlash! Such a fun match!


----------



## TheGreatestMan (Jan 3, 2012)

Random Ratings:

Cena vs. Rock WM 28 - ***3/4
Cena vs. Rock WM 29 - *
CM Punk vs. Daniel Bryan OTL - ****3/4
CM Punk vs. Daniel Bryan MITB - ****3/4 (Underrated match imo)


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Fuck me the commentary for GWT 02 is just... the worst thing ever. I've had to take a break because it was killing me. KILLING ME. Heel Cole wasn't nearly this bad. Heel Cole, modern day Lawler, ROH Gabe, WCW Madden and current TNA Tazz combined couldn't be this shit.

Might throw in SVS 88 and watch the epic billion man tag team match. The 87 one got tons of time but wasn't really that great, but the 88 one is :mark: Well, it was the last time I saw it. Always wish I watched it for the WWF/E Poll (FUCKING POLLS. FUCK YOU. FUCK YOUR TOP 100 SHIT. FUCK YOU JAWBREAKER. I'LL KILL YOU ALL) because it probably would have made top 50 on my list. I'll also never forgive myself for FORGETTING to put Eddie/Rey GAB on my list. I watched it for the poll. I loved it like crazy. And... I didn't include it. WHAT? I'm a cunt. Not as much of a cunt as JAWCUNTER though.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Fuck me the commentary for GWT 02 is just... the worst thing ever. I've had to take a break because it was killing me. KILLING ME. Heel Cole wasn't nearly this bad. Heel Cole, modern day Lawler, ROH Gabe, WCW Madden and current TNA Tazz combined couldn't be this shit.
> 
> Might throw in SVS 88 and watch the epic billion man tag team match. The 87 one got tons of time but wasn't really that great, but the 88 one is :mark: Well, it was the last time I saw it. Always wish I watched it for the WWF/E Poll (FUCKING POLLS. FUCK YOU. FUCK YOUR TOP 100 SHIT. FUCK YOU JAWBREAKER. I'LL KILL YOU ALL) because it probably would have made top 50 on my list. I'll also never forgive myself for FORGETTING to put Eddie/Rey GAB on my list. I watched it for the poll. I loved it like crazy. And... I didn't include it. WHAT? I'm a cunt. Not as much of a cunt as JAWCUNTER though.



Cal have you seen the movie "Bronson" starring Tom Hardy, about the famous inmate Charlie Bronson? Ever since I saw that a few weeks ago, whenever you start ranting and cursing, I can't help but picture you as that guy screaming at your computer screen and calling everyone "FUCKING CUNTS" in a kicking Cockney accent. Anyways, completely off topic, but if you have seen it I thought you might get a laugh out of that.

Speaking of bad asses, I just watched the Benoit/JBL cage match from Smackdown in 2006. Friggin brilliant. Love it. That match gets slept on when people discuss the great Smackdown cage matches.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Ha, funny you mentioned that Eddie/JBL cage match. It just dropped on the COUNTDOWN for the 00's Poll.

And I've not seen that film so it's totally lost on me lol.


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

With Cena/Orton taking up the TLC spot at the next ppv looks like we wont be getting the TLC tag team match.  Hopefully we'll at least get a ladder match. The should really do away with the TLC ppv, just like HIAC it forces a gimmick into a match.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Ha, funny you mentioned that Eddie/JBL cage match. It just dropped on the COUNTDOWN for the 00's Poll.
> 
> And I've not seen that film so it's totally lost on me lol.



Oh man, having watched most of your videos and read your reviews, I think you would be all about that movie. It's just one pissed off, jacked up bald guy with an impeccable mustache screaming and cursing at people and beating the absolute shit out of every prison guard ever. Highly entertaining.


I actually said the Benoit/JBL Cage match, but the Eddie/JBL one is even better. Even the ending with Angle screwing Eddie wasn't that bad. Those two had such awesome chemistry in the ring, JD, GAB, and that cage were all classics IMHO.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I just saw JBL AND CAGE and my brain filled in the gaps that weren't there .

The Benoit cage match is pretty darn good though.

*JBL Vs Chris Benoit - US Title - Steel Cage - Smackdown April 14th 2006*

A WM rematch! Liked their match at WM, thought it was a hell of a lot better than it should have been given the fact JBL was involved.

Long comes out before it starts and announces that it will be a CAGE match! Been wanting to see this since Andy mentioned it and got me to upload it (and he still hasn't watched it, the cunt!).

Didn't think this "feud" was ready for a cage match just yet, but WWE was about to start using the cage as often as a singles match (after they had kinda cooled down with them since the Attitude Era where we would have one every couple of weeks  ), so I guess it doesn't matter too much. Benoit takes it to JBL straight away, and Bradshaw has to brawl his way back into control, and once he takes down Benoit, he quickly tries to climb out. Benoit drags him off, and tries to climb out himself, which honestly doesn't bother me too much since I didn't think their were in a heated feud. Benoit pretty much wants to beat JBL to win the US title, not necessarily maim him... but if he has to do that to win, then he'll do that.

We get a couple of medium sized cage spots, with a back suplex from the top rope (in the middle of the ropes, not the corner), and Benoit launched off the top rope when they were battling in the corner to escape.

Plenty of stiff shots from both guys too a you would expect. They don't like each other so they do want to inflict damage, but overall I believe I am right in saying that both men simply want to win rather than destroy each other; destroying each other just helps with the winning lol.

Off topic here... never been a fan of Jillian in terms of looks... but those tits and THAT top... yum.

Both men end up exhausted, and JBL takes full advantage of this by locking in a sleeper hold, hoping that Benoit is already worn down enough for this hold to be used as a viable finisher for the first time in years. Surprise surprise though, its not over with a sleeper, instead it begins the Benoit comeback.

All through the match, any of the big spots (aka from the top rope) have been taken by Benoit, so when he finally gets to make his big comeback at the end, he makes damn sure JBL takes a bump too, and he busts out a top rope German Suplex! Looked AWESOME considering a guy the size of JBL took it.

Finish is pretty great, with Benoit crawling out of the cage and Jillian trying to ram the door into his head. The ref stops her, and while she gets rid of him, JBL shoves Benoit of of the way and is about to leave... but Jillian slams the door into HIS face! Ha! Crossface is locked in, and JBL taps out! Only Jillian makes up for what she just did by distracting the ref inside the ring when she tried to climb in.

JBL reverses the Crossface into a pin like at WM, but Benoit kicks out this time. They then fight to get out of the door, but a low blow puts Benoit down and JBL picks up the win.

Really enjoyed this match, maybe not enough to add it to my final list, but will be put into consideration. I liked how they worked with the cage stip, given where their feud was. It wasn't a blood and hate filled feud, though both guys don't like each other at all, its about the title (for this match, anyway. Benoit wants revenge for WM by winning back the belt). So they don't work this cage match like they want to kill each other, they try to win. And like I mentioned, trying to destroy each other helps them on their way to winning. So considering all of that, I thought they worked this cage match better than most people have in the last 5 or so years (HHH/Flair is the only one I can think of that was worked better).

*Rating: ***1/2*


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

You thought JBL/Benoit topped Eddie/JBL? For the reason you listed in your review, I prefer the Eddie match slightly. There was just more hate and more of a rivalry between Eddie and JBL by the time they had gotten to the cage. If you look of the definition of a WAR in the wrestling dictionary, I'm pretty sure the Eddie/JBL matches at Judgement Day and Great American Bash would be right near the top of the list. Those two not only knocked each other senseless, they attempted to MAIM with the vicious chair shots they both delivered. So by the time they get into the cage, JBL is just totally done with fighting Latino Heat, he wants no part of facing Guerrero again, let alone in a cage. And I think the tell a great story along the way. It's not quite in the ****-***** range of their other two bouts, but ***3/4 seems fair all things considered. Good way to end that feud and continue the disappointing Eddie/Angle feud.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I don't think I'd seen the Eddie/JBL cage match (since it aired, anyway) when I watched the Benoit/JBL cage, and honestly I can't remember the Eddie/JBL cage . So fuck knows which I like more. Tried looking up anything I might have written about it but couldn't find shit lol.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I like the Benoit match more. It's just that I prefer his intense, balls to the wall approach but the Eddie match probably had a better story to it.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

http://tinyurl.com/l269muq

*Judgment day 2005 review

Match #1: MNM vs Hardcore Holly and Charlie Haas
*
MNM! :mark:, too bad Holly is here, and I don’t remember Haas outside of his team angle work, which was pretty fucking awesome so I have faith here. Wow, MNM shocks me again with their ability to put on a FUN match, and execute an awesome heel stable character. Melina is a great manger and finds some cool ways to get some heat. The match itself is really fun and it is pretty short at around 8 minutes and the end has some fun near falls and more heel distractions to get MNM over, it was working as these guys were BOOED, awesome match! ***1/4

*CAL SCALE: 2
*
Match #2: Carlito vs the Big Show

Ughh, this sounds terrible. Has Carlito ever had a good match? If so, I would be happy if one of you chaps could direct me to said match! The sad part about this is that Carlito’s bodyguard is Matt Morgan, lets get his ass in here! Carlito is terrible, and thank god the guy never won a major title or anything close to that, because they guy sucked on the mic and in the ring, so honestly expecting a DUD here. Well, this was short, which is good, as big show and long matches aren’t good. Match wasn’t legendary bad, but there was nothing positive to take out of it except for Morgan being bossy, rest doesn’t matter. ½* 

*CAL SCALE: 0

Match #3: Chavo Gurrero vs Paul London*

So a 5-7 minute promo for Angle/booker just played, and the match isn’t now? Weird, especially since I had already written like 50 words about how gross the promo was . Anyways this should be fun, because my friend said this match is one of his favorites, so I have faith in him, even if Chavo is terrible. Wow, this was a ton of fun, not a classic as my friend said, but I still thoroughly enjoyed it. London carried Chavo to a good match here, and might be my favorite Chavo match, though his series vs rey was good too. So yeah, check this out, fun cruiserweight stuff. ***1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 3 

Match #4: Kurt Angle vs Booker T*

Eww, that entire pre match promo was all about saying Angle was gonna fuck Sharmell, that was a little awkward, and disgusting. This match will probably blow too, because booker T is like the WOAT. Wait, the match isn’t now? What in the fuck? OKAY? They played a 10 minute promo for another match to start :lmao, okay, I’m gonna go watch London/Chavo. Well, that match was a lot better than this will most likely be, so hopefully it’s kept short. God, cant believe that the WWE had the balls to do a storyline about Angle wanting tor rape sharmell. Well, this was just meh all around, nothing good or bad at all. For a booker T match its pretty good which we all know isn’t saying much, it got WAY too much time IMO, should have been a lot shorter TBH. **1/2

*CAL SCALE: 1

Match #5: Heidenreich vs Orlando Jordan*

This honestly sounds puke inducing, I’ll pass. NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1

Match #6: Rey Mysterio vs Eddie Guerrero *

So, the event has been loads of fun so far, except a few hiccups, but this and Cena/JBL should be :mark:, this match is more likely to be the better of the two, but they will be so much different in terms of style of wrestling that both should keep me entertained. Wow, this was my first viewing of this match and I am in shock of how awesome this was. I have seen their famous SD match from a few months from this time, but this was different, a lot more brawling than their SD match, which is fine with me, as it was an amazing match. I have heard this match being praised a countless amount of times and I had no idea about the finish, and it didn’t bother me at all because it forwarded the storyline, and it made sense as an opening match for the feud. Anyways awesome match all around, and loads better than their mania match. ****1/4

*CAL SCALE: 6

Match #7: JBL vs John Cena (I quit match)
*
Expecting a real war, I have seen the picture with Cena after the match, so I already know that this is going to be real bloody. I am a huge fan of hardcore matches and I like some I quit matches, with the last decent one being the Cena/Orton one, but this is probably the last GREAT one. So early on in this match it is a basic match, but it really starts to evolve into a hardcore type match quickly, and then the blood comes, and in bunches mind you. Man, this was like an ECW match, judging by the brutality and the uniqueness of weapons that was used in this match, from everything from your basic chair to a television set, it was pure madness. Honestly that might have been one of the more brutal matches in WWE history, and it sure as hell made up for their terrible mania match, as this was just pure unadulterated FUN. One of my favorite JBL matches, and probably in the top 10 or 15 for Cena matches. ****1/4

*CAL SCALE: 6

FINAL CAL SCALE: 17 

CURRENT 2005 PPV MOTY: Randy Orton vs the Undertaker( WM 21)

Current 2005 PPV rankings

1: Wrestlemania 21( 19)
2: Royal Rumble (17)
3: Judgment day(17) 
4: Backlash(13.5)
5: New Year’s Revolution (9.5)
6: No Way Out (4.5)*​


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

EDIT: Sorry had to fix double post


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

If I do tend to dislike Kurt Angle in the ring, I do think his mic skills and charisma are very good. And he to me turned the beastiality sex thingy with Booker/Sharmell from horrible to just hilarious :lol


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Angle's comedy segments were GOAT. Join me in Olympic heroes for abstinence! The best sex is no sex! :kurt


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Nice review of JD, smitty. I'll go rewatch the cruiserweight match, but everything else is fresh in my mind and I doubt anything will change regarding them. Eddie/Rey was my MOTN. Vengeance is a beauty, even if I'm not a big fan of the WWE Triple Threat and my opinion on Angle/HBK has dropped (yet still high).

WCW 1998! I'm so glad that Paramore fan likes Benoit/Raven from 3/16/98. Excellent match that shows Benoit losing his cool which was a cool story. That entire Nitro kicked ass. Jericho/Juventud, Steiner/Traylor, DDP/Reese, Nagata/Miller, Finlay/Dragon. Damn! And then the week after, we get Sting/DDP and Eddie/Hayashi.

Top 20 WCW 1998 PPV matches:



Spoiler: BrianAdams



DDP/Raven/Benoit UNCENSORED *****1/2*
Battle Royal/Jericho/Malenko SLAMBOREE *****1/2*
DDP/Goldberg HALLOWEEN HAVOC *****1/4*
DDP/Benoit SUPERBRAWL *****1/4*
Benoit/Raven SOULED OUT *****1/4*
Juventud/Kidman WWIII *****1/4*
Raven/Saturn FALL BRAWL ******
8-Man Lucha Tag SOULED OUT ******
Jericho/Juventud SUPERBRAWL ******
Bret/Flair SOULED OUT ******
Raven/DDP SPRING STAMPEDE ******
Finlay/Benoit SLAMBOREE ******
Jericho/Raven HALLOWEEN HAVOC ******
Juventud/Mysterio/Kidman STARRCADE ******
Jericho/Juventud ROAD WILD ****3/4*
Juventud/Kidman BASH AT THE BEACH ****3/4*
Booker/Benoit GREAT AMERICAN BASH ****3/4*
Eddie/Dragon SLAMBOREE ****1/2*
Jericho/Malenko UNCENSORED ****1/2*
Kidman/Eddie STARRCADE ****1/2*



DAT BENOIT/DDP/BOOKER/EDDIE/KIDMAN/JUVENTUD/RAVEN/JERICHO


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Kurt is a hypocrite! All those segments against sex while he was giving anal to Karen!


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Karen :homer I remember thinking she was so hot when watching Unforgiven 01.

Oh yeah, and the match was great too...:side:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

For one, :kurt's best in-ring year (if he has one) was easily 2001 imo. The Austin feud (DAT SS MATCH) + some other gems.

And in the talk of SummerSlam, 2002, 2013, 2001, 2011 and 1991 are my top 5 ones ever.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Nice review of JD, smitty. I'll go rewatch the cruiserweight match, but everything else is fresh in my mind and I doubt anything will change regarding them. Eddie/Rey was my MOTN. Vengeance is a beauty, even if I'm not a big fan of the WWE Triple Threat and my opinion on Angle/HBK has dropped (yet still high).
> 
> WCW 1998! I'm so glad that Paramore fan likes Benoit/Raven from 3/16/98. Excellent match that shows Benoit losing his cool which was a cool story. That entire Nitro kicked ass. Jericho/Juventud, Steiner/Traylor, DDP/Reese, Nagata/Miller, Finlay/Dragon. Damn! And then the week after, we get Sting/DDP and Eddie/Hayashi.
> 
> ...



Nice list man, I think I'd have Benoit/Finlay right near or at the top, but out of the 11 or so of those matches that I have seen, I agree with most of your ratings, except I wouldn't put Goldberg/DDP that high. That match was absolutely epic at the time, and it think it's Goldbergs best match probably, but I'll take Benoit/Finlay beating the shit out of each other for 14 minutes or so over it. Need to rewatch that Uncensored triple threat though.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'll admit that my personal markdom for DDP influenced my vote. But Benoit/Finlay is flawless. Except that it ends.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Did someone mention Goldie/DDP :mark:


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

SKINS25 said:


> Not heading out to stuff my face for a couple of hours, been watching 2002 stuff the past couple of days, could I get some recs, 2001 would be good to, none of the MAJOR stuff (hhh/hbk, brock/taker HIAC, no mercy tag etc) but some gems ?


Everything with Goldust or Tajiri. And HHH v. Lance Storm. No I am not kidding.


A WCW 1998 list shouldn't be complete without the incredibly sexy Eddie/Jericho v. Malenko/Chavo tag. Fuck all of you who think Chavo is terrible, btw.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Fuck you for not thinking Chavo Jr is terrible.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Well he ISN'T.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

YOU TAKE THAT BACK!


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Here we go again...

For the record, Chavo is fine in tag teams, if you're telling me Chavo detracted from Los Guerreros, you're crazy. Chavo was fine. Although he did some how manage to have a BAD singles match with Eddie in his prime at the Royal Rumble. I don't even know how you can possibly have a flat out BAD match with 2002-2005 Eddie Guerrero, it shouldn't be possible. But aside from that dubious distinction, Chavo was above serviceable in his team with Eddie, he had a few good matches with Rey, and also some good ones with Matt Hardy if I recall. Anyways, that's my opinion on the matter.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Chavo is not terrible, he's decent with the ability to have a good match against the right opponent and definitely being a good tag worker with Eddie.

Still I've lost respect because of how much he's been leeching off Eddie's name when he couldn't make it on his own and CAL shitting on him never ceases to make me laugh. :lol


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I sense a Top 5 Reasons I Hate Chavo Guerrero Jr video in the future .


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Chavo's real talent came from Bam Neely.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Callamus said:


> I sense a Top 5 Reasons I Hate Chavo Guerrero Jr video in the future .



That'd actually be really cool since pretty much nobody actually says why he's terrible.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

BAM NEELY. Now there was a guy who could have been big. Should have teamed him up with LUTHER REIGNS. Tag division would never have died.


----------



## Jbardo (Aug 29, 2010)

Anyone know if a HBK/Jericho or Rey v Eddie match/feud DVD comp exists?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Jbardo said:


> Anyone know if a HBK/Jericho or Rey v Eddie match/feud DVD comp exists?


A custom HBK/Jericho one does, yeah.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Man, I officially feel bad for everyone who doesn't celebrate thanksgiving right now 
,
Going to a party tonight but my ECW ONS review should be up tonight anyway, Vengeance and MAYBE GAB tomorrow if I can make it through


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I don't, because in Portugal we think Thanksgiving is for LOLAMERICANZ and others maybe 

Why in the name of God did somebody have to talk about Royal Rumble '04's undercard? *pukes* Though I didn't HATE HHH/Shawn like others (despite it having as much substance as Transformers Revenge Of The Fallen), nor did I dislike Rey/Noble for being 3 minutes, that undercard was a fucking DISGRACE for the upcoming incredible masterpiece that was that year's RR match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

RR 04 undercard is LOLSHITE. At least we got the epic rumble match :mark:.

With 3 shows left (well, 2 and a half), it's extremely clear to me who the PPV Wrestler of the Year is for 2002. Guy is fucking DOMINATING the top 10 list. Puts HHH's 00 to shame. All the while still having 2 of the WORST matches of the year on PPV. With HHH :lmao.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

RR 04 has a shit undercard but a perfect Rumble match. Since the latter is about half of the show, that saves it from being an all-time worst PPV.



Callamus said:


> With 3 shows left (well, 2 and a half), it's extremely clear to me who the PPV Wrestler of the Year is for 2002. Guy is fucking DOMINATING the top 10 list. Puts HHH's 00 to shame. All the while still having 2 of the WORST matches of the year on PPV. With HHH :lmao.


:taker

I don't know which two matches that is, but he also has a classic with HHH at King of the Ring. 8*D


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Besides the two Hiccups with HHH at Insurrection and KOTR, he had what might be his best year overall 

BTW- for any sports fans out there, watch the OJ simpson 30 for 30 doc on netflix, truly mind blowing


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

HHH is in 4 of the worst PPV matches of the year. SO FAR :lmao. Including non DUD matches, he's yet to be involved in anything good bar the EC (which honestly wasn't a big HHH effort) and the RR (he did ok but wasn't THE driving force of the match).


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

RR04 was the first Rumble I watched on PPV, so it'll always be one of my favorites (the match that is, because the rest of the event sucked). Freaked out when Benoit eliminated Big Show because I was in elementary school and kayfabe still existed to me. :mark: :krispinwah


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

If it wasn't for the hugeness of Benoit winning the 04 RR, I'd have been happy with Show winning and challenging Eddie, then Benoit still somehow ending up in the triple threat for the WHC (a surprise appearance in a RAW Rumble, since a SD one wouldn't be needed for Eddie to win and get a title shot against Lesnar... Eddie could have gotten the title shot some other way. IDK. Shut up). Anyway. Eddie Vs Show would have likely been :mark: compared to what Eddie Vs Angle ended up being. ESPECIALLY considering the match we actually got between the two just after WM on SD.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Nice review of JD, smitty. I'll go rewatch the cruiserweight match, but everything else is fresh in my mind and I doubt anything will change regarding them. Eddie/Rey was my MOTN. Vengeance is a beauty, even if I'm not a big fan of the WWE Triple Threat and my opinion on Angle/HBK has dropped (yet still high).
> 
> WCW 1998! I'm so glad that Paramore fan likes Benoit/Raven from 3/16/98. Excellent match that shows Benoit losing his cool which was a cool story. That entire Nitro kicked ass. Jericho/Juventud, Steiner/Traylor, DDP/Reese, Nagata/Miller, Finlay/Dragon. Damn! And then the week after, we get Sting/DDP and Eddie/Hayashi.
> 
> ...


Benoit's spots with the chair in that match = good lord. Great stuff.

Damn. You like Jericho vs Malenko enough to put that in top 10? I have a lot from Souled Out & Superbrawl over it. Not counting Eddie vs Booker from Uncensored itself over it too. Match was solid, but nothing more for me. Pacing was slow, but not for any real coherent reason. Dean's storyline was more fixated at start, lost in the match, then brought up again post-match. If it remained for more of the bout, it probably would have been better. Didn't help with some of the spots not exactly being pretty. But in that noticeable fashion to where it didn't help things.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

So, how was that ADR/Ziggler match everyone was raving about the other day?


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Finally got around to watching this weeks RAW and god it's awful. I think should permanently stop watching RAW live and just catch the repeat on Thursdays. 

On this RAW we got WWE continuing to bury Ziggler and Sandow by having them wrestle yet another pointless comedy match. The zero reaction both got in their entrances makes me sad, Ziggler was getting nicely over at the start of the year after his fresh face turn before WWE destroyed his momentum. We got pointless rematches from Survivor Series (why do WWE do this btw?) including WWE doing the awful divas elimination tag again (oh well at least I liked how Eva survived and got nice heat when she came in the ring ). The Punk/Bryan segment in the ring with Renee Young sucked, with Punk pandering with Bryan's stupid Yes chants. Your former WWE Champion who beat Cena clean this year still proving how one dimensional and boring he is on the mic by chanting YES non stop and not much else. No substance, but this isn't really a dig on Bryan but rather the shitty booking. WWE are obsessed with catchphrases and they'll milk them like crazy, but damn I think everyone would like to see Bryan talk a bit more and show a bit more of his promo ability - then just being a catchphrase machine. And then we have Punk/Bryan vs The Wyatts, which is pretty much just another rematch from the Survivor Series just with Bray Wyatt in the match as well... skip.. and then you have The Wyatts kidnap Bryan afterwards which is a good direction. It could lead to Bryan coming back as more serious - and getting rid of the awful look he's got currently and drop the stupid comedy chants. Or it could lead to Bryan turning heel and joining The Wyatt family which would be hilarious just to see + plus he has the look for it. Either way if it keeps Bryan off TV for a few weeks then that's good at least. Oh and the main event for this weeks RAW? Awful. That's when on put RAW on mute, as if I give a fuck for Cena and Big Show vs Orton and Del Rio. :ti


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Eddie Guerrero and Chris Jericho are the greatest tag team of all-time.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Callamus said:


> THE CAL SCALE:
> 
> NO = -1 (for when a match is so terrible on paper I can't even bring myself to watch it. So usually diva matches and anything involving Kofi Kingston 8*D)
> DUD-* = 0
> ...


Gotcha, crazy enough that makes a hell of a lot sense. Might even use it when I eventually get around to doing some reviews, thinking a random collection of 2004 matches including the Eddie/JBL cage and 4 way from Armageddon. Any other gems from mid to late 2004 you guys rate highly


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Benoit's spots with the chair in that match = good lord. Great stuff.
> 
> Damn. You like Jericho vs Malenko enough to put that in top 10? I have a lot from Souled Out & Superbrawl over it. Not counting Eddie vs Booker from Uncensored itself over it too. Match was solid, but nothing more for me. Pacing was slow, but not for any real coherent reason. Dean's storyline was more fixated at start, lost in the match, then brought up again post-match. If it remained for more of the bout, it probably would have been better. Didn't help with some of the spots not exactly being pretty. But in that noticeable fashion to where it didn't help things.


If you're referring to the Slamboree match, then I disagree with you entirely, and I'm sure you will disagree too . If you're referring to the Uncensored match (which you probably are), I actually felt the way you did with their Great American Bash match. I liked Jericho's offense more than most in the Uncensored match and I really felt bad for Malenko in the end. Match got me really invested. Their Great American Bash match though was just stupid. I understand that Malenko's strength in kayfabe and out is his matwork, but after all that Jericho put him through, why are you not showing any aggression and instead resorting to restholds? Poorly worked. I was considering putting Goldberg/Saturn in there somewhere too. I also never saw Meng/Barbarian 

Gonna keep going through 1998 Nitro and post as many gems as possible. DAT PIPER PROMO dat piper match :sad:

EDIT: LMFAO at Piper shooting on Brutus Beefcake and talking about how terrible he is. Finlay/Saturn, Jericho's 1004 holds promo, and Kidman/Inferno from 3/30/98 are worth watching.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> If you're referring to the Slamboree match, then I disagree with you entirely, and I'm sure you will disagree too . If you're referring to the Uncensored match (which you probably are), I actually felt the way you did with their Great American Bash match. I liked Jericho's offense more than most in the Uncensored match and I really felt bad for Malenko in the end. Match got me really invested. Their Great American Bash match though was just stupid. I understand that Malenko's strength in kayfabe and out is his matwork, but after all that Jericho put him through, why are you not showing any aggression and instead resorting to restholds? Poorly worked. I was considering putting Goldberg/Saturn in there somewhere too. I also never saw Meng/Barbarian
> 
> Gonna keep going through 1998 Nitro and post as many gems as possible. DAT PIPER PROMO dat piper match :sad:
> 
> EDIT: LMFAO at Piper shooting on Brutus Beefcake and talking about how terrible he is. Finlay/Saturn, Jericho's 1004 holds promo, and Kidman/Inferno from 3/30/98 are worth watching.




Just about anything Jericho did on the mic in 1998 is worth the watch, the holds promo was priceless though. "my holds! Give me back my holds! My holds!" :lmao

The Conspiracy Victim bit after the Cruiserweight battle Royal was excellent too.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Shiet, you guys have me wanting to watching some dubbyacdubbya


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

two matches into ONS 05, completely forgot how AWESOME that three way dance was, pure awesomeness!


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Jericho's "parasitic tapeworm' stoic stuff in 2008/2009 can go fuck itself compared the gold that was his heel run in 1998. Pretending to embrace fan support and then shredding their signs, smiling and thanking people while they boo him, taking his championship on dates, refusing to take the belt off of his waist before a match and then instantly regretting it after being drop-kicked in the gut, pronouncing interviewers names wrong, wearing his hair like an idiot just to get heat. The man had one of the most fun heel characters probably ever.

------

Yay2010!

Rey Mysterio v. CM Punk (Extreme Rules 4/29/10)
Yeah this doesn’t really go up or down. I watched it initially when talking about the whole show and said I’d leave a proper write-up for another time because I thought I just missed the match, but no, I just don’t think it’s THAT good. Some expectations will kill you. First five minutes are kind of standard. They do some stuff and it looks OK but I’m not going to boringly list everything they did and tell you how it affected each wrestler. There was a cool thing where Punk slid Rey out of the ring and Rey rolled out of it, though. And then after Punk had him damaged a little more he tried it again with actual success. I don’t understand the kick from Bald SES Woman, though. Usually the heel will distract the ref so that the Sherri can choke the throat, you know - something illegal. Wouldn’t a kick from CM Punk do A LOT more damage than a kick from Bald SES Woman? She didn’t kick him in the nuts or in the neck or anything…it was a legal kick that happened to be from someone not in the match. I guess Punk’s just a dick and might want others to do his work for him, but….no fuck it, I don’t buy that. Rey kind of oversold the kick, too. Pretty much flipped 180 sideways. Punk immediately proves me right by going outside and giving Rey a totally badass kick that made a badass thud and Rey sold perfectly. The next few minutes after that are great, actually. Rey fighting out of the triangle choke thing by punching Punk’s leg repeatedly until they both standing so Rey could kick at them was really cool. THEN he kicks Punk directly in the head and flops on top of him for a pin because he can’t stand up any more. Gallows gets a cheapshot in that is this massively cool uppercut fist and I cannot complain about it one bit. Not only did Punk NOT distract the ref intentionally, but I will genuinely think that Punk’s clubs to the back are nowhere near as harmful as a Luke Gallows upperfuckingpunchthing. This had it’s bad stuff like a few mistimed and sloppy reversals and armdrags (the 619 rana was screwed up), the Joey Matthews interference essentially seeming like nothing and nowhere near the ‘assault’ Michael Cole said was, but it also has it’s good like Punk’s cut-offs with big kicks and clothesline, the baseball slide when Punk reacts to SES getting kicked out, the elbows before the Gory Stretch. Et cetera. I’m adding this because it’s better than some of the stuff I already have at the bottom (including their match at Mania), but it’s honestly kind of disappointing and no way in hell it stays in the top 25. ADDING.

Current list:



Spoiler: WHATTUP?



1.	Rey Mysterio v. CM Punk (SmackDown 2/12/10)
2.	John Cena v. Batista (Extreme Rules 4/25/10)
3.	Christian v. Drew McIntyre (SmackDown 7/16/10)
4.	Christian v. Ezekiel Jackson (Royal Rumble 1/31/10)
5.	Christian/Kane v. William Regal/Ezekiel Jackson (ECW 1/26/10)
6.	Shawn Michaels v. The Undertaker (WrestleMania 3/28/10)
7.	William Regal v. Evan Bourne (SuperStars 3/4/10)
8.	Rey Mysterio v. CM Punk (Extreme Rules 4/29/10)
9.	The Undertaker v. Rey Mysterio (Royal Rumble 1/31/10)
10.	Drew McIntyre v. Kaval (SmackDown 9/10/10)
11.	Rey Mysterio v. CM Punk (WrestleMania 3/28/10)
12.	d
13.	d
14.	d
15.	d
16.	d
17.	d
18.	d
19.	d
20.	d
21.	d
22.	d
23.	d
24.	d
25.	d

Other contenders:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> Everything with Goldust or Tajiri. And *HHH v. Lance Storm.* No I am not kidding.


Thanks and no I know your not I love that match as well, just finished it, still great


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> Thanks and no I know your not I love that match as well, just finished it, still great


WHAT ABOUT THE TAJIRI/KIDMAN MATCH I SAID 

Watch it now!


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^sorry mate didnt even see that will check out now


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

You should watch this too. http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xl...er-rock-vs-un-americans-hhh-raw-8-12-02_sport

And Rey/Chavo from the Unforgiven 2002 Heat; I've thought for years it was better than any match on the actual PPV, and even if I'm not sure I'd still think it's better than Taker/Lesnar I will say that it is to annoy Callumforication should he read this.


EDIT - Ooh that might not actually be the eight man I had in mind. The one I remember had Benoit and Guerrero in it. Um....yeah, IDK.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> ^^sorry mate didnt even see that will check out now


Its the BL 02 match, but their might be a fun TV match too


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> If you're referring to the Slamboree match, then I disagree with you entirely, and I'm sure you will disagree too . If you're referring to the Uncensored match (which you probably are), I actually felt the way you did with their Great American Bash match. I liked Jericho's offense more than most in the Uncensored match and I really felt bad for Malenko in the end. Match got me really invested. Their Great American Bash match though was just stupid. I understand that Malenko's strength in kayfabe and out is his matwork, but after all that Jericho put him through, why are you not showing any aggression and instead resorting to restholds? Poorly worked. I was considering putting Goldberg/Saturn in there somewhere too. I also never saw Meng/Barbarian
> 
> Gonna keep going through 1998 Nitro and post as many gems as possible. DAT PIPER PROMO dat piper match :sad:
> 
> EDIT: LMFAO at Piper shooting on Brutus Beefcake and talking about how terrible he is. Finlay/Saturn, Jericho's 1004 holds promo, and Kidman/Inferno from 3/30/98 are worth watching.


I'm talking about Uncensored. Should have specified better if I didn't considering they did work vs each other three times on PPV in 1998. Their Slamboree sprint is def their best work. Dean unmasks, crowd is flipping out, Jericho is being radical, & it's magic.

Meng vs Barbarian is exactly what you'd expect it to be. Check it out soon.

I finished that Nitro right now, tbhayley. How fun. Finlay vs Saturn owned, then Kidman vs Disco overtook it as MOTN after that one was over. I'm pro-Disco. Dude is underrated. He's a good hand. Piper's promo buying Leslie was gold. He said all the things I kept saying only I couldn't believe he actually said it on the air. _(actually, I kind of can...)_

No love for Booker vs Benoit II? Or how about Goldberg vs Traylor in that epic bout. That one left me with goosebumps. Who show was pretty great, yet again. Outside of vs Mysterio from SuperBrawl '97, this show had Prince Iaukea look the best he ever did vs Glacier. There's something. Hope the match vs Jericho on PPV actually works.

EL DANDY STRIKES. Final plug.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

When I made that post, I did not finish the episode. Those matches you named ruled. Especially Benoit/Booker. Booker was never really that good of a wrestler, but I liked him as a television champion. Short matches where he was allowed to show off his in-ring charisma while in his athletic peak. Hooray! EL DANDY too. And that Chicago crowd. Next week's episode was good. Finished that today as well. Opening 6-Man Tag is a must watch, Jericho/Juventud is MOTN, DDP carries Bagwell, Chavo and Ultimo have a good match, Kidman/Lane and Disco/Booker are fun, and the main event of Sting and Nash was not horrible. Make sure to take a dump during Darsow/Luger. I'm gonna go start from the beginning of 98.

WCW 96-98! What a time. With all due respect to the nWo, the midcard was what made it so good. Kinda like today at this very moment. Horrible main event storyline that keeps getting worse, but at least 20 midcarders today for me are a must watch. 2013 WWE UPPER MIDCARD!


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

funnyfaces1 said:


> WCW 96-98! What a time. With all due respect to the nWo, the midcard was what made it so good. Kinda like today at this very moment. *Horrible main event storyline that keeps getting worse*, but at least 20 midcarders today for me are a must watch. 2013 WWE UPPER MIDCARD!


You mean you didn't like the HUGE double team tag team main event?! :vince7


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> When I made that post, I did not finish the episode. Those matches you named ruled. Especially Benoit/Booker. Booker was never really that good of a wrestler, but I liked him as a television champion. Short matches where he was allowed to show off his in-ring charisma while in his athletic peak. Hooray! EL DANDY too. And that Chicago crowd. Next week's episode was good. Finished that today as well. Opening 6-Man Tag is a must watch, Jericho/Juventud is MOTN, DDP carries Bagwell, Chavo and Ultimo have a good match, Kidman/Lane and Disco/Booker are fun, and the main event of Sting and Nash was not horrible. Make sure to take a dump during Darsow/Luger. I'm gonna go start from the beginning of 98.
> 
> WCW 96-98! What a time. With all due respect to the nWo, the midcard was what made it so good. Kinda like today at this very moment. Horrible main event storyline that keeps getting worse, but at least 20 midcarders today for me are a must watch. 2013 WWE UPPER MIDCARD!


I think Booker was a solid wrestler. Perhaps not one who should be working long, but def when in a capacity that is right for him, he thrived. Thus being Television Champion. He's brought so much life to this strap in the Nitro era. Booker vs Disco was another example of this. Good stuff.

Opening six man was a blast. I knew it would be. Toyko Magnum, SUWA, & the lad who would eventually be known as CIMA. Hard to believe I saw some of those guys (not Magnum b/c he stuck around) before I started to follow Puro. Always fun. La Parka, Psychosis, & El Dandy on a team :mark:

Got a GOLDBERG squash up next. Oh my yes. Thinking I might do the next Nitro tonight & some of Spring Stampede before I go to bed. It's too much fun. I have to go back and watch a few Nitro's building towards Uncensored as I didn't find the links to all these shows until last night. Can cram those another day.

nWo was fun, but of course it soon ran its course. And the matches were never worth it. That was the real turn off in comparison to the rest of the roster. That & anything involving Konnan. Fuck that moron. Worst member of the WCW roster ever. I'm talking Ron Reis is better. Kind of just b/c. Konnan made me not care for a Norman Smiley match right now. I hate him more than ever. WWE these days is following that formula. For a company once known for powerhouse main events & bad midcard, it's now switched. Only, as you stated, it's mostly the upper midcard that is delivering the good. With a general/lower midcard that is easily the weakest point of the company these days. Most of the main eventers can still do good. It's just the booking among it is crap. Dilutes any good.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*ECW one night stand 2005 review 

Match #1: Lance Storm vs Chris Jericho *

Wow, this was a ton of fun. I remember liking this over the past 2 times I watched it but when I watched it without a laptop in front of me and focused solely on the match, it was clear it was a fantastic match. Most of you guys know by now that I’m not a big fan of mat work, but this was good mat work, mixed in with some fun high flying stuff too. This was fast paced mat work, meaning that their moves we’re technical, but I didn’t see 2 minute long headlocks, which is VERY good, as that is like the definition of a boring match. This ended up being Lance Storm’s last WWE match (he still works the indie circuit), and although he had ZERO charisma, he was a fantastic worker in ECW and I liked his tagging with Christian and WWE, pretty underrated guy TBH. Jericho is also obviously amazing in this, as he is in most of his matches. Ending of this is pretty :mark: too, with the kendo stick to the face of Jericho by Storm’s friends, also the only true hardcore element of this match, which makes the ending unique and fun, great opener. ***1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 2 

Match #2: Little Guido vs Tajiri vs Super Crazy 
*
Holy shit this was fantastic, just pure FUN, like one of the more fun matches of the year. Yeah, it was completely spot oriented, but the spots kept coming, it was basically one large spot after another. Obviously all these guys can work, with Tajiri leading the pack as one of the GOAT Japanese wrestlers to compete in the WWE, but just one look at my avi tells you I am a total marl for him, but TBH, everyone should be, the guy is amazing. Obviously the best spot is the backflip from the balcony onto the other two guys, I honestly thought that was just so damn good, and gutsy as shit of course. Now, the other spots mainly consisted of backflips in the ring but IDGAF as they were all awesome, just like this match. The way they eliminated little guido was so bad ass with Mikey Whipwreck, so fucking amazing. The three backflips to end the match was awesome, so was the brief “you fucked up”chant by the crowd, so happy this DVD is unedited. So check this out bitches! ***3/4 

*CAL SCALE: 4

Match #3: Psycosis vs Rey Mysterio
*
This match has always been a little shitty to me, and it holds up as such. Its pretty obvious that Psycosis was trying way to hard to do some cool spots because they were just shitting all over him, even Styles and Foley were mentioning it. Fans we’re being fucking hilarious here BTW, “put the mask on”, basically saying he’s ugly, which I do agree with, the mask fits him better. Yeah so this match blew and the fans shat all over it. It was an example of a bad spotfest, unlike the match before this which was a good one, pretty simple. Yeah so don’t see this, it was 7 minutes of MEH, and that’s all I can really say about it because it just was…there. *1/4

*CAL SCALE: 0.5

Match #4: Sabu vs Rhyno 
*
Well this was a fun sprint of a match. Not as good as the first two matches of the night so far but pretty good still, but nothing too amazing. It was of course kept short, as it was an impromptu match that wasn’t on the card to begin with. So this started after RVD’s awesome promo, probs his best one ever. But anyways this was awesome, as Rhyno carried Sabu to a good match. Basically a hardcore match with an amazing spot through the table to finish the match, nice pop for the Sabu wins too. But this is a fun match that isn’t anything TOO special, but still fun as shit, check it out if your into ECW. **3/4

*CAL SCALE: 1

Match #5: Chris Benoit vs Eddie Gurrero
*
This match depresses me, mainly because IIRC It was the last time these two ever faced each other, the other part is because this match sucks so much. The crowd was lukewarm throughout the match and the match bored the shit out of me for the most part, it was just so boring. The beginning sequence was terrible, the cowd booed the sleeper hold but they kept it in for a LONG time, so shitty. Then we get some boring moves from these two that puts their other matches to SHAME, legit depressing because these two have put on classics, but just didn’t get it done tonight. Oh well, at least a bad Benoit/Eddie match is still a lot better than Show/Orton . **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5

Match #6: Masato Tanaka vs Mike Awesome
*
Jesus Christ! What did I just watch? That was so fucking awesome! Literally just 15 minutes of an all out WAR, super fun match that is certain to be the MOTN from this show as it is just so much fun. The amount of awesome bombs that Tanaka took is crazy, the guy is super underrated IMO, he is a great competitor. Did he ever have a match with Tajiri? If so, I’m watching that soon, would expect a great match between these two. So many sick table spots and awesome bomb spots to count. This is hardcore wrestling at its finest ladies and gentlemen, so awesome! ****

*CAL SCALE: 5 

Match #7: The Dudleyz vs Tommy Dreamer and the sandman
*
I know most people find this match to be bad, but this was fucking awesome! No idea if I could even call it a match, as the 4 people in it basically just fought themselves occasionaly but like 6 other people were involved, which is badass, because it made the match that much more enjoyable. Yeah this was basically just 16 minutes of fun chaos, with weapons ranging from cookie sheets to cheese graters being involved. The catfight between Beulah and Francine was fun, and the amazing ending with the fiery table was awesome! Of course, the best part might be the Austin appearance! Sporting a…XFL jersey? Anyway, amazing ending to an awesome show. ***1/2

*CAL SCALE: 3

FINAL CAL SCALE: `16 

CURRENT 2005 PPV MOTY: Randy Orton vs the Undertaker( WM 21) 

Current 2005 PPV rankings

1: Wrestlemania 21( 19)
2: Royal Rumble (17)
3: Judgment day(17) 
4: ECW ONS(16) 
5: Backlash(13.5)
6: New Year’s Revolution (9.5)
7: No Way Out (4.5)
*​


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Did you by any chance catch Zayn/Neville from NXT? It's been a long time since I caught up with the show, but I loved that match. Of course, how can you not love a match involving either of those two? But wow, that match gave us everything you could want in a face-face encounter.

Dancing Fools were a really cool tag team. Those guys were just made for each other. With all due respect to Colin Cassidy, I'm getting those same vibes for both Enzo Amore and Tyler Breeze. And then the WWE had Venis and Godfather, but Godfather sucked so meh. If Venis actually cared about the business instead of leftist politics, he would have been special.

4/13/98 Nitro was not as good as the past two weeks. Finlay/Steiner was so disappointing. Dragon/Lane went on too long, Buff Bagwell, Konnan, and Johnny Grunge are wrestling so you know when to take your smoke break, Calo/Jericho rules, Hammer/Saturn was ok but Hammer is horsecrap, you will love the Goldberg squash, Curt Hennig sucks as usual and manages to have a bad match with Yuji Nagata, La Parka and DDP are auto-wins, and the main event sucked. Spring Stampede had one of the few Goldberg matches that I actually liked as well as the awesome Raven/DDP fight and a decent Chavo/Dragon match with Eddie GOATing on the outside. La Parka/Psychosis somehow sucked because all the spots looked terrible and Booker/Benoit wasn't as good as their prior matches. 

I don't have too big of a problem with the lower midcard, although it could be better especially with the match quality. Tyson Kidd and Justin Gabriel rule, Prime Time Players have an excess of charisma, Santino can be fun, Tensai is a lord, 3MB are hilarious even if Drew is withering away, and Fandango and Los Matadores are not terrible. They just aren't Psychosis or La Parka. But who is? So many people try to be La Parka, but they all fail.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Dont really feel like starting Vengeance 05 ATM, but anyone have a quick recommendation for a match?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Zayn/Neville from this week's NXT. FUN


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

People always talk about HHH/Foley Royal Rumble but never their HIAC match. It's not a perfect match like the Street Fight, but still awesome and highly entertaining. Top 5 HIAC match for sure.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

think I'll watch it! 

BTW- why is my ECW ONS review getting :buried :lmao


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Please watch all of the Mike Awesome and Masato Tanaka matches that you can. You will love it. I think I have every match from ONS at least at **3/4. We are also two of the only guys here that liked the main event.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Please watch all of the Mike Awesome and Masato Tanaka matches that you can. You will love it. I think I have every match from ONS at least at **3/4. We are also two of the only guys here that liked the main event.


Dont know whats not to like if your an ECW fan


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> think I'll watch it!
> 
> BTW- why is my ECW ONS review getting :buried :lmao


It was only 25 minutes since you posted it lol 



Alim said:


> People always talk about HHH/Foley Royal Rumble but never their HIAC match. It's not a perfect match like the Street Fight, but still awesome and highly entertaining. Top 5 HIAC match for sure.


Thankyou, i love the HIAC match, made all the better when you know that the 'fall through the cell/ring' wasn't planned


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Talking about 1998 WCW PPV's and Jericho:






Makes it funnier if you have seen Spinal Tap :lol


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Did you by any chance catch Zayn/Neville from NXT? It's been a long time since I caught up with the show, but I loved that match. Of course, how can you not love a match involving either of those two? But wow, that match gave us everything you could want in a face-face encounter.
> 
> Dancing Fools were a really cool tag team. Those guys were just made for each other. With all due respect to Colin Cassidy, I'm getting those same vibes for both Enzo Amore and Tyler Breeze. And then the WWE had Venis and Godfather, but Godfather sucked so meh. If Venis actually cared about the business instead of leftist politics, he would have been special.
> 
> ...


Some XWT mishaps have put me on a brief delay for NXT this week. I'll try and get it now. I'm already expecting to get the world with Zayn vs Neville in a WWE ring.

Finlay vs Steiner not being special sounds heartbreaking. At least I have another Jericho vs Calo match to watch. That makes up for it. lol, why was Curt Hennig so bad in WCW? Then again, why was Bret Hart in most of his outings? Odd how that company brought out the best and worst in certain folk. Seriously seen better matches from Hall & Nash _(aka two notorious for their laziness in WCW)_ in that company than Hennig & Hart. From what I recall, Spring Stampede was fun. DDP vs Raven was far and away MOTN, but we'll see this time around. I thought La Parka vs Psychosis sucked way back when. After hearing someone else say it does really, really blows. I was hoping my naivety was going to show back on the last time I watched and realized that it actually is good.

Santino is tripe. Los Matadores are awful b/c their gimmick has made the Colons SO watered down. Rest I like. Well, not Jinder. He's awful. K, now the rest I like. Really, really like in some cases. Drew, Tensai, PTPs, International Airstrike. Slater is so good in his role. Don't know why he gets some strong hate him places. For what WWE has him do, he's tailor made to perform it well. Every company needs their fall guys. I only personally don't "get" why WWE doesn't at least let 3MB win a tad bit more. Two wins a year is all they can manage it seems. And that's in singles, tags, trios, everything. Throwing them a bone to make 'em remain some credibility along with the shenanigans of the gimmick wouldn't hurt. Or let Jinder be the full blown loser, while the point made sticks with the other two. I'm done talking about it. b/c next I'll just leap into how Drew shouldn't be there to begin with and filling the void with Curt Hawkins would be better.

Still think part of the middle/lower division is pretty bad. Santino, Matadores, Kofi, JTG, Mahal, Hunico _(Camacho unless I know he's kind of good_), Sin Cara, Langston, Usos, Truth, Khali, Tatsu, Otunga _(wrestling wise, he's a great character tho)_, Miz sucks now, Ezekial Jackson b/c he's still technically on the roster. All those guys I can do with out ever seeing again. That's about 18 dudes. Maybe not most of the roster, but it's still a good chunk that's poor.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Mahal had a period on NXT last year where he was actually ok. And Rollins/Mahal was* awesome* btw.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Constant garbage. Pardon the one match. But Tyler Black carrying some scrub who's had one match that isn't a pile of shit in his entire career hardly surprises me. Nor does it show any worth of the heel in question. It was a massive carry-job, as expected.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Mahawful was shite on NXT. Just as he is shite everywhere else. Of all the talent they had in NXT at the time, they still somehow managed to put Rollins against Jinder? Urgh.

Finishing GLOBAL WARNING TOUR 2002 now. Up to the main event. LESNAR VS ROCK VS HHH. Haven't seen this in forever, not expecting a classic but I also don't remember if it's garbage or not :lmao.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Rollins vs McIntyre happened. But wasn't the finals. Instead Mahal was used as some sort of big deal there for a spell.

I don't even.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I remember the tournament, I was hoping MAYBE they'd give McIntyre a bit of a push down there since they were doing sod all with him on the main shows... but nope. They tried to push Mahawful.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

WWE knew putting him in the ring with Rollins would probably give him a career match. Everybody needs their one. :ti


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*Global Warning Tour 2002*

WWE invades the land down under. You better run, you better take cover.

Show kicks off with STEPHANIE FAP FAP MCMAHON. Also, I'm fairly certain commentary is dubbed over this whole thing lol. Damn, they ain't been here for 18 years?


*Rikishi Vs Rico - Kiss My Ass Match*

Seriously... we had TWO Kiss My Ass matches on "PPV" in 02? LOL.

Dear god Cole actually asked Tazz to explain the rules of a KISS MY ASS match. Because it wasn't clear, obviously. But now the orange midget explained it I totally understand!!!

Rico looks pretty good on offence for the whole minute or so he gets. Then he misses a HUGE and awesome looking moonsault and walks into a Samoan Drop. 1 2 3 and this is done. Time for Rico to get a face of ass.

*Rating: 1/4**
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*Jamie Noble Vs The Hurricane - WWE Cruiserweight Championship Match*

Before we get the match, we get some footage of Noble and Nidia learning to surf. Noble does NOT look comfortable :lmao. He actually does a good job though lol! And Nidia looks good in a wetsuit .

Noble in glasses is odd too. Doesn't fit with his TRAILER PARK TRASH gimmick. In fact this whole video package doesn't fit. Why do this with the HEELS? Surly it would have been better with Hurricane doing it? IN HIS COSTUME? I'd have fucking paid to see that lol.

Hurricane steamrolls over Noble to begin with, until Nidia shoves her tongue down his throat giving Noble time to recover lol. Lucky bastard!!! 

Tazz "COLE I HEARD YA NIPPLES ARE PIERCED!"

Cole is baffled by Australian Football. He can't work out how anyone scores. Kinda like his sex life 8*D.

Tazz "EVERY TIME I SEE A SMALL PACKAGE I THINK OF YOU, COLE!" :lmao

:lmao Cole "I don't know if they play cricket over here..." :lmao. 

:lmao Tazz has to ask if they speak English in Australia. Fuck me, I thought the commentary was terrible at the UK shows... but they REALLY went out of their way to be the worst here.

Standard match stuff for the most part until they go into a finishing stretch and we get some nice near falls and even finisher kick outs.

TOP ROPE SWINGING NECKBREAKER~!

Nidia plays her role well as usual throughout this whole thing, constantly being a difference maker, and contributes to the finish too. She's usually the best part of the match lol. Hot too .

*Rating: ***
*CAL SCALE - 0.5*


:lmao an Australian calls Angle a bugger.


*Lance Storm & Christian Vs Billy Kidman & Rey Mysterio - World Tag Team Championship Match*

Someone shoot Tazz and Cole please.

Someone please shoot Tazz and Cole.

PLEASE SOMEONE SHOOT TAZZ AND COLE.

:lmao Rey flies around dominating everyone, then Christian pushes him off the top rope to the floor... and Rey just splats in front of some fat guy sat in a chair in the corner :lmao. I'm assuming he's security but I just don't know. He doesn't look seems to care anyway :lmao.

Well fuck, this looked awesomely brutal:










Rey is FIP, so this is pretty good as you would expect, but holy shit the commentary. It's fucking terrible. And was recorded AFTER the show. So they had the chance to edit shit and re-do shit... and they thought THIS was the best way to go about it? Really? Arrghh!!!

Hot tag to Kidman and we get a cool finishing stretch. Kidman is on fire, Christian is trying to cheat, Storm is superkicking, and Rey is fucking REY MYSTERIO.

SHOOTING STAR PRESS!!!! 1...2... NEW CHAMPIONS NO! Christian pulls out the referee, Storm levels Kidman with the tag belt and retain the tag titles.

Good match, but hard to concentrate on it all because Tazz and Cole go to levels of awfulness I didn't think even they could go to.

*Rating: ****
*CAL SCALE - 2*


Edge, Kidman and Torrie are... being morons while shopping. I swear it's like they didn't know what Australia was until they got there. Hmmm... American's (and Canadians lol) being clueless about other countries. Sounds outlandish, I know :side:.


*Chris Jericho Vs Edge*

Cole talking about Edge "IS ANYONE HOTTER THAN THIS GUY?".

BRB, gonna go shoot Tazz and Cole.

:lmao "YOU'RE A WANKER" chants directed to Jericho.

Man, between entrances, Jericho cutting a promo and then STALLING, this takes about 10 fucking minutes to start. I got so fed up the first time around I stopped watching for A DAY lol. Back to it now I guess!

Oh sweet jesus the commentary. I forgot. A day away makes the commentary seem even worse. HOW DOES THAT WORK? They talk about strip clubs and taxis. DURING A FUCKING WRESTLING MATCH.

Michael Cole: "SPEAKING OF BIG STIFF CLOTHESLINES, STACY AND TORRIE IN A BRA AND PANTIES MATCH UP NEXT!!!" :lmao WHAT THE FUCK?!?!? :lmao

Michael Cole AGAIN: "WE'VE GOT SOME WANKER FROM AUSTRALIA HELPING OUT AT RINGSIDE" :lmao I don't think he understands what wanker is :lmao.

Oh yeah there is a match going on too. Jericho heels it up, cheating when he can, cutting Edge off nicely a few times and being pretty BOSS tbh. Edge is fine, couple of nice hope spots which are usually quick pin attempts or a high impact move to try and win asap.

REF BUMP~!

Jericho grabs a chair, Edge SPEARS him, ref is still dead, I LOL. :lmao at Edge's attempt to wake the ref up. *kicks ref while he's down* NOPE, HE'S NOT GETTING UP.

ANOTHER SPEAR. Ref is awake now. JERICHO KICKS OUT!

CHAIR~! LIONSAULT~! KICK OUT~!

Jericho goes face first into the exposed turnbuckle that he apparently exposed earlier. I haven't been paying as much attention to the actual match thanks to the awful commentary. Jericho still kicks out.

Then Jericho loses to a roll up. LOL.

Match was solid stuff, but by god, everything on this show is getting ruined by the commentary.

*Rating: ****
*CAL SCALE - 2*


*Stacy Keibler Vs Torrie Wilson - Bra and Panties Match*

Val Venis is the guest ring announcer for this.

Tazz: "IT'S BETTER TO BE COCKY THAN TO SMELL COCKY" :lmao

:lmao the announcing from Val pretty much solidifies this as a FAP MATCH. Literally.

FAP FAP.

NIDIA SHOWS UP TOO!

*Rating: DUD*
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*The Rock Vs Triple H Vs Brock Lesnar - WWE Undisputed Championship Match*

It would take TEN YEARS for HHH and Lesnar to be involved in another match together. And it was great. Then they fucked it up by having 2 fucking shitty rematches.

Rock and HHH double team Lesnar and take him out of the ring, then HHH is all like "lol i dunt leik yu rick" and clotheslines the champion.

:lmao Lesnar gets brought back into the ring by being thrown over the ropes, then he kinda flops around before seemingly randomly falling back in the corner :lmao. THE FUCK WAS THAT?

:lmao Heyman attacks Rock from behind and CELEBRATES like he just won the WWE title himself. Then Rock turns around and he shats himself :lmao.

HHH VS LESNAR! Lesnar kills him :mark:.

HHH is pretty smart in this match, constantly standing back and letting Brock and Rock fight each other at every chance he gets, then he strolls in and attacks someone from behind in hopes of sneaking a win. Lesnar takes exception to this and smashes his skull into the ring post and HHH IS BLEEDING!!!

Bunch of finisher teases, but everyone counters everyone's finisher.

SHARPSHOOTER-ISH~!

PEDIGREE~!

F-5 TO HHH!!!

PEOPLE'S ELBOW~!

BROCK KICKS OUT!!!

HEYMAN IS LOVING IT!!!

F-5 TO THE ROCK!!! LESNAR GONNA BECOME CHAMP!!! 1...2... AND THAT SHITTY HHH FELLA BREAKS UP THE COUNT.

PEDIGREE TO LESNAR~!

LESNAR KICKS OUT!!! FUCK ME!!! NOTHING STOPPING THE NEXT BIG THING!!!

ROCK BOTTOM TO HHH. ROCK WINS. BOOOO .

Good match, I liked it . Whole finishing stretch was cool and Lesnar was made to look like a fucking BEAST kicking out of two finishers with no rests between pins or anything like that. HHH played his role well as the cerebral assassin, waiting for the right moment to get involved and shit, and Rock was Rock.

*Rating: ***1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 2*


*Overall CAL SCALE - 6.5*​


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Rock/Brock at SS was actually MOTN imo.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

by some angry RED guy said:


> It would take TEN YEARS for HHH and Lesnar to be involved in another match together. And it was great. Then they fucked it up by having 2 fucking shitty rematches.


8*D


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Primer said:


> 8*D


True though.

Well, apart from that house show match they had in '02?


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Just watched Ziggler/Del Rio from main event on my DVR. ..... Awesome stuff. Not as good as payback, but still really good. Wrong person won though  I can't believe just a year ago ziggler was main eventing TLC. Wonder where he'll be a year from now? 

***3/4 for Ziggler/Del Rio ME.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nah, if we're playing that game.

SummerSlam match was something I didn't care much for. Mostly b/c Brock winning is the only reason I can put up with it. Steel Cage match was tremendous on the other hand. If only b/c of Brock _(and Heyman)_. It all remains.

WM has only been one viewing but I really, really liked it the night it happened. That's a good memory. Pardon the shit ending.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Brock/Trips Summerslam match was pretty good, but Brock just seemed really really rigid in that match, like he wasn't having fun almost. It was the same in all the Brock/Trips matches. Compare how Brock was in the ring at Summerslam vs Punk to the Trips match. Brock looked like he was just having a blast destroying Punk, and as the viewer you can't help but enjoy yourself. I dunno maybe I'm just imagining things, but Brock wasn't the true Beast Incarnate in any of the Trips matches, only with Cena and Punk.

Brock vs Triple H Series:

Summerslam: ***3/4
WrestleMania: ***
Extreme Rules: ***1/4

Just my opinion, but all those matches are far below the standards of what I've come to expect from Lesnar in a big match. Sadly they are perfectly inline with what I've come to expect from Hunter for a long time now.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Guys go check out Scott Steiner vs Ray Traylor from Nitro 3/16/98. Ray Traylor, yet another guy > Triple H.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

I think I am the only one who really enjoyed the Hunter/Lesnar feud,

Summerslam- ***- this was really boring for a Lesnar match, he didn't look like a beast at all
Wrestlemania- ***3/4, started slow, but the last minutes were really great
Extreme Rules- ***1/2, Brock's selling of the injury made the match


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

NOOOOOOO hhh/lesnar talk pls


naitch/y2j ss 02 is soo fun


Dolph/ADR wasnt that good tbh


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah, it's def fun. Flair does his thing & gets the W. Liked seeing that when it aired.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

For all the NXT lovers, Zayn vs Neville from this week's episode is an indy masterpiece, ***3/4.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

SKINS25 said:


> naitch/y2j ss 02 is soo fun


I thought it was pretty shit personally


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Srdjan99 said:


> For all the NXT lovers, Zayn vs Neville from this week's episode is an indy masterpiece, ***3/4.


I'm expecting it to suck now with that phrasing.

Term like that is what makes AR Fox or Michael Elgin matches "passable" by word.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2qbhg_scott-steiner-vs-ray-traylor_sport?search_algo=2

:mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Best. Clothesline spot. Ever.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Starting Vengeance 05 now because I'm bored, doubt it will get posted until tonight


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Zayn/Neville was **1/4-1/2 imo, it was a very MOVEZ~ match that lacked substance if you can even think it would have it, but they still didn't just no-sold stuff in indy fashion so it was passable fun overall.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I know this is probably a dumb question, because if these two have had a classic together it would have been talked about by now, but did Mysterio ever get a 1 on 1 match with 10+ minutes of time against Benoit? You'd think with all the time the spent together between WCW and WWE, it would have happened at some point...


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> I know this is probably a dumb question, because if these two have had a classic together it would have been talked about by now, but did Mysterio ever get a 1 on 1 match with 10+ minutes of time against Benoit? You'd think with all the time the spent together between WCW and WWE, it would have happened at some point...











Probably the closest, dunno of any others


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

ATF said:


> Zayn/Neville was **1/4-1/2 imo, it was a very MOVEZ~ match that lacked substance if you can even think it would have it, but they still didn't just no-sold stuff in indy fashion so it was passable fun overall.



I don't agree man, I just watched it, I think it was pretty bad ass tbh. There were a few spots were it did get a bit MOVEZ-ey, but I didn't see any blatant no selling and Zayns selling for some of Nevilles high spots was on point. That back handspring power bomb counter was absolutely nasty. I think they killed it, pretty damn good match. Those two are never gonna have a Finlay/Regal type match with zero wasted motion and every move aiming to maim, for their respective styles, I think they worked a reasonably sensible match that was both FUN and entertaining. ***3/4

I will say having Bo fucking Dallas on commentary definitely took away from it. God I fucking hate listening to that guy talk, he's beyond obnoxious and he sounds like a 3rd grader. I can't tell if he's working me or if he's just a damn good heel. 

Edit- thanks Zep. I still have no clue why those two never got to work a program together. I feel like we have been robbed as wrestling fans that that match never got made.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Bo Dallas is the second ever post-modern heel, who was heavily influenced by the one and only :cena5

Zayn/Neville is exactly what it should have been. Two of the best high flyers in the company in a back-and-forth close competition for the #1 contendership. It's absolutely ridiculous to expect a match between these two that wouldn't have DEM SPOTZ, but every spot was worked in seamlessly and we didn't get those awkward pauses that come in Davey Richards/Eddie Edwards nonsense matches. Every nearfall was convincing, which to me is equivalent to the no wasted motion style of the Finlays and Regals of the world.

Traylor/Steiner is too fun. I never even knew someone fell into the pool until then.

Guys go watch Smackdown. Everything except for Orton's promo and 3MB/Los Matadores was on point, and those two things were not bad. Titus/Cesaro was hilarious. Mark Henry squashes Curtis Axel with fury and prejudice. Brodus/Woods is actually a good lower midcard feud that makes sense and may actually build up to something.

And then that main event. :lenny :homer. One of the best main event segments I have ever seen in Smackdown history. 40+ minutes of greatness that kept getting better and better and better with a hot crowd to boot. The opening promos and the match itself. God damn! I don't want to spoil anything, but that entire segment is a perfect example of how much we take the upper midcard today for granted. *****1/4*


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> And then that main event. :lenny :homer. One of the best main event segments I have ever seen in Smackdown history. 40+ minutes of greatness that kept getting better and better and better with a hot crowd to boot. The opening promos and the match itself. God damn! I don't want to spoil anything, but that entire segment is a perfect example of how much we take the upper midcard today for granted. *****1/4*


I hardly ever watch SD, but this has me intruiged so i think ill record it tonight. It better be good


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Watched Orton's promo and turned it off afterwards. rton2

Forgot to write this here but I watched HBK/HHH from SummerSlam again the other day and while I don't agree with the negative opinions here, it went down big time and is _far_ from a 5 star or even 4 and a half match. I'd go ★★★¾ for it. Good back work by HHH with a good story backing it then HBK's comeback felt like a long squash where he completely stopped selling the back work done on him before.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The entire show was just pure fun. Something that you would love if you were still a young mark, which is never a bad thing. Thanks for the upload btw.

MORE 1998 WCW!


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

For some reason, I feel like rewatching both HBK/HHH and that Backlash '01 Ultimate Submission. I remember loving the 1st 10 minutes then hating the rest so idk.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Watched Orton's promo and turned it off afterwards. rton2
> 
> Forgot to write this here but I watched HBK/HHH from SummerSlam again the other day and while I don't agree with the negative opinions here, it went down big time and is _far_ from a 5 star or even 4 and a half match. I'd go ★★★¾ for it. Good back work by HHH with a good story backing it then HBK's comeback felt like a long squash where he completely stopped selling the back work done on him before.



That's exactly what I have it at. Don't understand how people either think it's god awful or a GOAT contender. It was just really good to me, not great. The back work was excellent by Trips, I'll give him props when it's due.

Does anyone else have a fall back match that they watch whenever they are bored and can't find anything new to watch? For me, Benoit/Finlay JD06' is that match. I've probably watched it 20+ times and it just never, ever, gets old. Props to WWE for giving those two 20+ minutes on PPV to put on on an all time classic. Those two are made for each other in the ring, I think Finlay might have even been Benoit's best opponent in the ring.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Most Benoit matches are vintage "fall back" stuff for me. I don't know what to watch, so I just rewatch one of his classics and end up satisfied with the time spent. The match with Brock and Austin on Smackdown specially come to mind. Not too long but damn are they awesome from the first second until the very end.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

http://www.wrestlingdvdnews.com/is-the-wwe-raw-20th-anniversary-dvd-unedited/55220/



> As you’ve heard a number of times now, it’s being marketed as “uncut and uncensored”. While that is true in regards to WWE now being able to freely release the old shows with the “WWF” logo and those references, there are however some edits we’ve spotted.
> 
> So far we’ve noted a few changes of music in wrestler entrance themes and edits to sponsors also. Promotion of live events upcoming at the time of broadcast and their ticket information shown on screen is now covered up (as in the screenshot below).
> 
> As reported earlier, Chris Benoit features in one of the episodes chosen for the set. We can confirm that there are edits to this 2001 episode, which was to be expected. Benoit’s entrance was removed and possibly parts of the commentary pertaining to him are cut too.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

WWE again luring people into believing it's unedited. Stuff like tickets, commercials and even entrance music being changed is understandable. So is removing some commentary about Benoit but cutting his entrance and completely removing the segment with Angle is a joke and false advertising. Fuck WWE.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

> Michael Cole AGAIN: "WE'VE GOT SOME WANKER FROM AUSTRALIA HELPING OUT AT RINGSIDE"


:lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Watched Orton's promo and turned it off afterwards. rton2
> 
> Forgot to write this here but I watched HBK/HHH from SummerSlam again the other day and while I don't agree with the negative opinions here, it went down big time and is _far_ from a 5 star or even 4 and a half match. I'd go ★★★¾ for it. Good back work by HHH with a good story backing it then HBK's comeback felt like a long squash where he completely stopped selling the back work done on him before.


Basically these are my thoughts on the match. EXACT too.

Haven't been watching much wrestling lately because I've been too busy writing lyrics for this demo I'm trying to do + it's almost finals time for this semester, but I think I'll be able to dive into some good shit come Christmas time, I still have to catch up on my DVDs too which means buying shows like NOC, BG, SS, etc which is pretty gross .


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Watched Orton's promo and turned it off afterwards. rton2


Where about in the show is that? I miss the Orton thread. 

Also, could you put what the main event of Smackdown is (in spoilers I guess, since others don't want to know)? Don't post the result, though.


Watched the WM 20 three-way between Benoit, HHH, and Shawn the other day. Loved it. Deserving of the full five stars. Don't have much else to say beyond that.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

It's in the beginning. Don't know about anything else on the show because I've forgotten all about the spoilers and am too lazy to go check them out. But I think it's a six man tag or something.

Don't really follow the shows as much except the stuff with Cena and Orton as well as the occasional tag match involving Rhodes Brothers or The Shield that comes my way when watching Raw. The fucks in the Raw section have kind of sucked out the enjoyment from most stuff.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> It's in the beginning. Don't know about anything else on the show because I've forgotten all about the spoilers and am too lazy to go check them out. But I think it's a six man tag or something.
> 
> Don't really follow the shows as much except the stuff with Cena and Orton as well as the occasional tag match involving Rhodes Brothers or The Shield that comes my way when watching Raw. The fucks in the Raw section have kind of sucked out the enjoyment from most stuff.


Yeah, just don't read it. In any area of life, I find that I enjoy things more when I'm not so bogged down in other peoples' negative opinions. Especially when they're excessive, or the same shit all the time. It's almost like it's their goal sometimes to make everyone else negative too. Not talking about just on this board, but just in life in general. I enjoy things more when I'm not surrounding myself in other peoples' negative opinions on things.



funnyfaces1, you said something positive about a random Shawn/Bret match before. Was it the one in Ontario that's on Shawn's "My Journey" DVD? I feel like it was. If so, I agree with you. I liked it. Perfect length. I also liked his match against Sid on RAW on Sept 1995 that's on that same DVD. Shawn's selling was perfect there, and again, it was the perfect length of time.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Wont be home for sd tonight, so I'll miss out on the segment you guys are marking for, and tbhayley if it doesnt involve :cesaro or :ziggler2 I really dont care, kinda tired of seeing the usos/shield/rhodes.bro match every week


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

Got done watching WCW Nitro 1/20/97, which is the go-home show to NWO Souled Out 97. Cool segment with Randy Savage holding the show hostage and sitting down on a chair in the middle of the ring until Sting arrives, two solid matches in Ultimo Dragon and Dean Malenko along with Booker T and Scott Hall, and GOAT commentating from the nWo (mostly from Bischoff and Nash). Oh, and Benoit and Sullivan brawling. :mark:

Gonna go ahead and re-watch the Nitro 1/13/97 episode just to watch DDP's classic swerve on the nWo again.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> It's in the beginning. Don't know about anything else on the show because I've forgotten all about the spoilers and am too lazy to go check them out. But I think it's a six man tag or something.
> 
> Don't really follow the shows as much except the stuff with Cena and Orton as well as the occasional tag match involving Rhodes Brothers or The Shield that comes my way when watching Raw. The fucks in the Raw section have kind of sucked out the enjoyment from most stuff.


I've found Raw is 10x more entertaining when I'm not in the discussion thread for it.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I find Raw is 10x more entertaining when I skip 99% of the show . And completely avoid 99% of any wrestling related thread outside of this one.


----------



## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

*Carl Elias vs Patrick Simmons - New York City Death Match - New York City November 1961*
_So work prevented me going on a Carl Elias binge sadly but I snuck time in for this one and I'm so glad that I did. This is the culmination of a pretty epic war given how the commentator built this up. Commentary on a match this old was a neat bonus too. Audio quality is eh but from what I gathered Simmons was one of New York's top heels throughout the 50's along with Elias and this feud started up shortly after Elias' face turn. Elias is so easy to get behind and his punches look incredible. Most of the Elias stuff I've seen was him working heel and from what I gather that's how he worked the majority of his career. He's babyface here though but he's still kept the heel shtick only this time with the reverse effect. It's also a fucking death match and no referee even in the 60's is gonna DQ you for eye rakes and chokes. Crowd reaction when Elias gets his first eye rake in to signal the start of his comeback was WOAH. Simmons is really old school stiff and probably a mare to work with because his punches don't look worked one bit. Sweet spot where Simmons slams Elias on the concrete outside and it's treated like death. Obviously with a ten count in a Death Match it's easier to sell something big too. What i really liked that irks me in old Death Matches is that they don't give up falls before the ten count any easier than you'd expect them to in a one fall match which makes the stip really feel like an extension of a normal match because normal rules just won't cut for where these two guys are at. Elias busting out a blatant choke as a nod to his past heel days and the crowd just losing it when they realise he's got Simmons out with it was amazing. Too good for star ratings. _


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

"Dirty" Pat Simmons :mark:. Fairly sure he was known for just POTATO'ING guys in the ring with his punches lol. Actually don't think I've seen that match btw, though I HAVE seen a Death Match between them. Probably from another town as they did the rounds with the match, having a blowoff in every town and shit. One I saw had Marconi interfere and choke out Simmons while Elias was hurting. Was pretty :mark:.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Main event of Smackdown tonight is ridiculously fun. (Y)


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

That doesn't have the thirty second rest period rubbish, does it? When did that become a thing? 80s?


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

So like WCW 92 is supposed to be the best right? What exactly should I download on XWT to get the good shit? The PPVs?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

SaviorBeeRad™ said:


> So like WCW 92 is supposed to be the best right? What exactly should I download on XWT to get the good shit? The PPVs?



In 1992 Anything involving Rick Rude (he was a GOD that year), the Vader/Sting matches, the WarGames match for sure, anything involving Arn Anderson. Also check Dustin and Barry Windham. Steamboat had some good ones obviously, WCW had a great in ring product in 1992.

Edit- can we please just come to a general consensus in this thread that Dustin/Goldust>>>Triple H in every way, shape, form, and fashion? God it's been great getting to see Goldust back in the WWE, but watching his early WCW stuff just really drives the point home of how good that guy is. He needs to be put in the HoF sooner rather than later.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

JoJo's babyface performance at Survivor Series was better than any of Triple H's babyface performances since his match against The Great friggin Khali. Surely Goldust is superior in every way. He's in that special Finlay/Regal class of wrestlers that just "get it".

Smackdown main event still holds up. Sleeper hit of the year.

Go download the WCW Saturday Night pack if there is any for 1992. All the PPVs from 1992 are good too except for the hilariously awful Halloween Havoc. Man what an awesome year.

I honestly do not remember talking about that Shawn/Bret match, LilOlMe, or any Shawn/Bret matches for that matter. Usually I have a good memory of these things too. It might have been the SvS 92 match that I love even though everyone here doesn't. I've tried my best to dislike it, but I just don't see it. Same goes with their ladder match. Like that too. And the screwjob. Love that.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

whats with the thread being so dead today? 

Starting the ME of Vengeance 05 now, super pumped for it :mark:


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Thanksgiving hangover?  Enjoy that HIAC


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Vengeance 2005 review

Man, I’m pumped for this show, haven’t seen anything from it shockingly

Match #1: Carlito vs Shelton Benjamin*

Going in to this match I had my doubts that Shelton could carry a mundane performer like Carlito, but by god he somehow did it. This was a fun opener and though I thought the beginning stretch lagged a bit, it was fine, and I had fun with this match. The ending stretch was pretty fun, and makes this match a ton better. Lots of good near falls and for some strange reason Carlito retains the IC title, fuck the result but I recommend this match because it’s a good Carlito match, and those are very hard to find. Also, watch every match of Benjamin’s career, because he is AMAZING! Go Shelton! ***

*CAL SCALE: 2 

Match #2: Christy Hemme vs Victoria 
*
NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1

Match 3: Kane vs Edge
*
A surprisingly good match here, I went in expecting shit and I was pleasantly surprised with how fun this was. This was a lot better paced than I expected, as I thought it would be like Kane vs Vis from BL, a match that nearly put me to sleep. The best part was the crowd though, chanting “he’s a man whore” and “we want Matt” was awesome, and I cannot wait for their unforgiven match, should be epic! The pairing of Lita and Edge has always been regarded by me as one of the best parts of both of their careers, they just worked so well together as heels. So yeah, this was pretty fun, check it out, doubt you will be disappointed if you don’t expect a masterpiece. ***

*CAL SCALE: 2

Match #4: Kurt Angle vs Shawn Michaels*

First off, I just want to remind everyone that I rated these guys wreslemania match 4 stars, a lot less than most. I did think this was better than their mania match, but not by much. It’s still a fucking amazing match, is it 5 stars? No, but very few matches are. Now, my main gripe with this is that I thought it was a little too long, it felt like it dragged on and that maybe if they cut it down about 5 minutes it would have been a better match. Also thought that there was a small part in the middle that got a little dull, but then again, if they cut 5 minutes all would be well. Funniest part of the match by far is when Shawn hurts his leg and some guy screams: SHAKE IT OFF SHAWN! WHAT’RE YOU OLD? Really funny considering that guy prolly ways like 400 LBS. Anyways, this was great, it topped their mania match by a small bit. ****1/4

*CAL SCALE: 6 

Match #5: John Cena vs Christian vs Chris Jericho 
*
Funny that two of these guys would be gone in 6 months :lol. This was a pretty fun match actually, was expecting a good show and that’s what I got, a solid match. Great babyface work by Cena and some great heel work by both Jericho and Christian, but would I expect nothing less. This seems to be one of those triple threats that seem to get forgotten and lost in the shuffle, maybe because of how good the main event is for this show. The finish was pretty fucking great as well, Cena did like an F-5 motion which had Jericho’s legs hit Christian right in the head. After that Cena hit the FU on Y2J and the match was over, awesome stuff right here, check it out. ***3/4 

*CAL SCALE: 4 

Match #6: Batista vs Triple H
*
Wow, I have no idea what I just witnessed, but man, I am in shock of how…amazing that was. A top 25 match in WWE history IMO, and if this isn’t my MOTY, I have no idea what will be. Everything about this match was simply breathtaking, pardon coach being on commentary . So yeah I kind of marked a little bit when I saw the steel chair wrapped in barbed wire( ECW!) and I loved how much they utilized it in the match, as it made the match seem so much more brutal. Batista was awesome here, so was trips, but I loved Batista, this is a top 5 match for him easily, actually its #2 ATM, right under vs taker at WM 23. The ending to this match was so fucking amazing. When I saw the sledgehammer I assumed trips was gonna bang tista in, but he was THIS close to being able to hit him, but he was too much. Simply amazing match, top 5 or 10 match from Trips and easily #2 from Batista, A MUST SEE! ****3/4 

*CAL SCALE: 8 

FINAL CAL SCALE: 21 

CURRENT 2005 MOTY: Batista vs Triple H( Vengeance)

Current 2005 PPV rankings

1: Vengeance( 21)
2: Wrestlemania 21( 19)
3: Royal Rumble (17)
4: Judgment day(17) 
5: ECW ONS(16) 
6: Backlash(13.5)
7: New Year’s Revolution (9.5)
8: No Way Out (4.5)
*​


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Damn 18 points in 3 matches


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Well, Vengeance's triple ME is pretty boss. They really stacked everything into what's usually a B PPV. Ah well, still saw it LIIIVE. :delrio


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

4/20/98 Nitro: aka the reason why WWF started to win the war at that time.

Wasting Goldberg vs Raven on FREE TV. (and Hogan vs Savage for the championship, but that's only significant b/c of the Hart heel turn + championship change) Goldberg's match was so huge, and they knew it, so they kept shilling it on the PPV the night before and the entire first hour of Nitro. It was beyond obnoxious. Then bordered moronic when it was the biggest moment of the year. Bar none. I'll always love you WCW, but good lord guys. Use your brains.

Spring Stampede was also a fun show. Not PPV of the year. SuperBrawl still has that covered overall b/c it had more stronger bouts, but only match at Spring Stampede that proved to be an eyesore was the lol Hennig vs Smith match. Those two should have just retired. Probably still be alive. Idk. Didn't do their legacy any favors. Glacier > them when it comes to their WCW work. Anyways, rest was either acceptable, fun, or flat out good. MOTN still holding up as DDP vs Raven _(which is now number one on my top ten list for PPV matches atm)_ Goldberg vs Saturn ruled & Parka vs Psychosis was real "spot" heavy, but much better this go around. I like it. Yay. Sucks the crowd crapped on it for some reason.

People still need to watch La Parka vs Disco Inferno from SuperBrawl 1998. It's almost the best match I've seen from 1998 in general. DDP vs Raven is only a hair above it.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Dammit Smitty you make me wanna watch Vengeance 05 now  but I'm only at Backlash 04 and I don't wanna go out of order.

Booker/Saturn was pretty :mark:


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Am I the only one here who rates Cena vs Bryan ahead of Punk vs Brock?


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

NotoriousTCG said:


> Am I the only one here who rates Cena vs Bryan ahead of Punk vs Brock?


Nope.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Booker vs Saturn was awesome. That's high billing for me on the list. I should post it. Tomorrow.

I feel like I'm underselling the good matches from Souled Out. Namely Benoit/Raven, Lucha tag, & Nash/Giant.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

NotoriousTCG said:


> Am I the only one here who rates Cena vs Bryan ahead of Punk vs Brock?


I still rate Punk vs Brock higher, but i do really like Cena/Bryan, but that match needs a rewatch (recently bought the Summerslam DVD in a sale )


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Love Cena vs Danielson. That being said, I think I'm at the point of loving Del Rio vs Christian more. Punk vs Brock being the obvious tops.

I hold all three "big" matches in *really* high regard.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

So I ordered my first WWE DVD from FREMANTLECUNTS yesterday. Around 4pm. And it came today. I fucking ordered something through Amazon Prime yesterday BEFORE I ordered the DVD and I still have to wait while Monday for it lol, because they could only dispatch it today. So I'm impressed with their delivery, certainly on par with SV. Shame it took OVER A YEAR for them to have something appropriately priced for me to consider ordering from them lol. Shame there were no blurays on sale, but then again they considered £13 a sale price for a DVD lol. Fuck knows what the Bluray versions would have been .

Anywho, DVD I got was the Live in the UK April 2013. Has that awesome Undertaker/Bryan/Kane Vs THE SHIELD match :mark:.


----------



## El Dylan (Jun 28, 2011)

Some classic matches i saw yesterday and today :

Steve Austin vs Chris Benoit (Smackdown 2001) ****1/2

Triple H vs Chris Jericho (Last Man Standing - Fully Loaded 2000) ****1/2

Razor Ramon vs Shawn Michaels (Ladder Match - Wrestlemania 10) ****3/4

Ric Flair vs Vader (Starrcade 1993) ****1/4

Ric Flair vs Terry Funk (I Quit Match 1989) ****1/2

Rey Mysterio Jr. vs. Eddy Guerrero (Mask vs. Title - Halloween Havoc 1997) ****1/2 

Kurt Angle vs Chris Benoit (Royal Rumble 2003) ****1/2

Bret Hart vs Owen Hart (Wrestlemania 10) ****3/4

Bret Hart vs The British Bulldog (Summerslam 1992) ****1/2

Sting/Nikita Koloff/Ricky Steamboat/Barry Windham/Dustin Rhodes vs. Rick Rude/Steve Austin/Arn Anderson/Bobby Eaton/Larry Zbyszko (War Games 1992) ****1/2


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Callamus said:


> So I ordered my first WWE DVD from FREMANTLECUNTS yesterday. Around 4pm. And it came today. I fucking ordered something through Amazon Prime yesterday BEFORE I ordered the DVD and I still have to wait while Monday for it lol, because they could only dispatch it today. So I'm impressed with their delivery, certainly on par with SV. Shame it took OVER A YEAR for them to have something appropriately priced for me to consider ordering from them lol. Shame there were no blurays on sale, but then again they considered £13 a sale price for a DVD lol. Fuck knows what the Bluray versions would have been .
> 
> Anywho, DVD I got was the Live in the UK April 2013. Has that awesome Undertaker/Bryan/Kane Vs THE SHIELD match :mark:.


Yeah, i saw the 'sale' yesterday and was half thinking about ordering Wrestlemania 29, but decided to wait longer for a price drop, plus i'm nearly skint lol 

Agre on delivery, i have had a couple of things from FM and they matched SV in that regard.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

NORMAN SMILEY. 

Felt like getting that out. Also feel like getting out how there hasn't been a single good match from Konnan in all of 1998, so far. Gonna see if one will pop up. That's now a side-project in the middle of this project. Konnan only basically had one in 1997. w/Hugh Morrus vs Steiners from Slamboree, iirc. This guy is seriously probably the worst dude ever. Which covers some really bad ground. Did he remotely try once in his career? I'm not sure. El Gigante, Nailz, Virgil, are better than him. Virgil one is a tough statement for me to make, but I think I may be correct via one of those random Dibiase matches being tolerable.

Yeah1993 can vouch for this.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

So Undertaker/Bryan/Kane Vs THE SHIELD still fucking rules all kinds of worlds. Undertaker is all :mark: the entire time, just constantly wanting to beat the fuck out of those 3 young cunts who are trying to take HIS YARD away. Rollins taunting him in the middle of the match and Undertaker giving him the cut throat sign and going ballistic on the apron is still :mark:. Kane is bossy, sticking to hitting those tremendous uppercuts, and Bryan is superb as the FIP, having some awesome hope spots giving SHIELD some great cut off spots too. Hot tag to Undertaker is :mark:. SPEAR BY REIGNS TO THE FUCKING DEAD MAN :mark:. KICKOUT :mark:. Bryan getting on a roll at the end only to be stopped by non legal SHIELD members causing Undertaker to just fucking charge at them is :mark:. SHIELD picking up the win still is :mark:. Shame they didn't quite make a big a deal as they could have with Shield's first loss. Should have been on PPV rather than TV. Anyway, HUGE win for them hear. THEY BEAT A TEAM WITH UNDERTAKER ON IT. One of my favourite Shield matches, and fuck they've had so many awesome ones that's a HUGE compliment. One of the best too imo. Top 5 easily... possibly the 3rd best behind TLC and EC.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

gonna attempt to get through the GAB 05 show in one sitting today, not gonna be easy, but I want to get to SUMMERSLAM tonight 

But YAY for Eddie/Rey being on that show


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

For your greater good, just watch Eddie/Rey off GAB and skip straight away to SummerSlam. The latter, with stuff like Taker/Orton II, Edge/Matt, Eddie/Rey, Cena/Jericho and HBK/Hogan is very good and fun, one of the most fun SS's ever (falls just short to 1991 as my fifth favorite SS ever). GAB is a complete one-match show, with the rest stinking. Batista/JBL is possibly the worst WWE PPV Main Event ever, probably third only to WM 9 and the SummerSlam 2011 MITB cash-in.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I mean, I'll be able to get through it, it just will not be easy haha

but I'm super pumped for SUMMERSLAM :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Watching Armageddon 02 now. This version is muuuch better quality than the crap I downloaded before .

Opening match is :mark:. :lmao at the botch pin though :lmao. That was insane.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Am I the only one who thinks that the WM 28 undercard isn't as bad as some make it out to be? I mean yeah Bryan/Sheamus was an absolute disgrace but it didn't ruin the whole show for sure. Orton/Kane for one was solid, I enjoyed Cody/Show too and that is underrated imo, and I (can't believe I'm going to say this but I am) must be mad because I enjoyed the Divas match too. Massive props to Maria Menounos for actually trying it out despite broken ribs.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

WM 28 is a 2 match card. HIAC + WWE Title Match. Kane/Orton is the next good match at ***, but that's a big step down from ****1/2 and ****3/4 for Punk/Jericho and Undertaker/HHH.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yet those two ****+ matches should put WM 28 in a higher bow over countless other shows


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Paramore fan, I just finished watching February of 98 which featured the first appearances of MENG and Barbarian. Holy Kamala, their match against each other was good. I just wish I can find their PPV match. Some other gems from that time include every Jericho match, Regal/Booker, Rick Martel's theme song, every Raven match, and Kidman. Love that midcard.

And Eddie/Jericho vs. Benoit/Malenko as well as Malenko/Chavo are classic level great. Anybody that doesn't see those matches are not Eddie/Jericho/Benoit/Malenko fans. Lol Chavo fans. Flair and Hart kick ass too. But Hennig sucks. He manages to have a not so good match with Bobby Eaton. I'm sure Konnan had a good match with DDP. Who doesn't (besides :taker)?

I love Wrestlemania 28


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I enjoy Rock/Cena from that show, its a ***1/2 match for me, Kane/Orton is 4th at around ***

Punk/Jericho is MOTN though: ****1/2, HIAC is ****


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Eddie Vs Benoit time :mark:.

Am I the only one who thinks Raven is shitty?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Paramore fan, I just finished watching February of 98 which featured the first appearances of MENG and Barbarian. Holy Kamala, their match against each other was good. I just wish I can find their PPV match.


Road Wild 1998? I may just have that....


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

ATF, you count cash ins as the main event of a show?

The worst PPV main event I've ever seen... There's a tough question if there ever was one. The most painful one to sit through would be the Rumble in 2013, but if we're talking about a legit list of DUDS that main evented a PPV? Let me use my head on this one to find the dirt worst....

CM Punk Vs The Rock ~ Royal Rumble 2013
John Cena Vs The Miz ~ Over the Limit 2011
Randy Orton Vs Wade Barrett ~ Survivor Series 2010
The Undertaker Vs Kane ~ Hell in a Cell 2010

... EH I'm too lazy to list another 10-20. Let's just say that Cena-Miz is the worst .

Think I'm gonna watch some SHIELD. I think it's pretty crazy how they've received almost "instant classic" status in the sense that The Shield is a rare combination of talent with supreme booking that we're sure to look at as a bright light in the company for years to come. We know it's greatness that we're watching when we see the trio perform, we know it's magic, and we're acknowledging this while SHIELD is still active. That's pretty fucking legendary if you ask me, I can't wait to see how Ambrose, Rollins, & Reigns contribute in the future as all three should be WWE Champions some day, each offering something different.

I think Reigns is the guy though, I think he'll be the guy in the same sense that we thought Orton was the next guy in 2004 only for it to ultimately be Batista to be placed next to the likes of Cena in the main event picture. If I could choose one young guy to take over as the face after Cena left it'd be Reigns, no doubt. Personally, I think he gets the WWE title in 2015 and honestly, he fucking deserves a great push. Have him get like 9 or 10 eliminations this year in the rumble, do Shield/Wyatts at Mania, have SHIELD go their separate ways during 2014 at some point, then have Reigns win the Rumble to face BROCK at Wrestlemania XXXI in a co main event with Cena/Taker.

All I know is SHIELD. REIGNS. ROLLINS. AMBROSE.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yes I do. To me, Main Event = Last match. I don't care what y'all say :side:.

Batista/JBL imo was a hell of a lot worse than even crap like Punk/Rock and Cena/Miz.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

pretty sure JBL/tista is getting a NO on the cal scale, just don't have the patience when SS is waiting for me 

So that means that this review is gonna be a tad short, the summerslam one should be good though


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Punk/Rock is the worst combination of shitty match + shitty booking = SHIT.

Batista/JBL is boring as balls at some points but it never really does reach OH MY FUCKING GOD KILL ME levels like Rock/Punk does. The only way ANYBODY can enjoy Punk/Rock is if they're a Rock mark or a Punk hater, plain and simple.

NOBODY enjoys Cena/Miz though. Fuck that shit. Utter disgrace to John Cena's ability as a performer.

NEVER GIVE THE MAIN EVENT OF A PPV A NO RATING. You have to watch that shit man .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Evan Stays Trippy said:


> Punk/Rock is the worst combination of shitty match + shitty booking = SHIT.
> 
> Batista/JBL is boring as balls at some points but it never really does reach OH MY FUCKING GOD KILL ME levels like Rock/Punk does. The only way ANYBODY can enjoy Punk/Rock is if they're a Rock mark or a Punk hater, plain and simple.
> 
> ...


Alright I'll watch it, gonna be hate infused however


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Both of Mark Henry's main events were worse than the matches you guys named :sad:

Zep, I'm referring the Halloween Havoc 98 match. And this is the fourth time that I watched the Smackdown Thanksgiving Tag Team match. DAT SHIELD/PUNK/MYSTERIO/WYATTS/USOS/RHODES/GOLDUST.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Well here's the thing: Cena/Miz's booking is worse than dogshit but watching Cena go all Man Of Steel and annihilate Miz and Riley in 5 minutes despite a 20 minute murderbeat was funnier than Spanish Buzz Lightyear - and that's saying GOD like. At least there's fun to be had with that DUD.

And with the Punk/Rock DUD, there's fun too - the initial brawling moments are pretty cool tbh. Though they got badly negated by the rest of the match though.

There's absolutely NOTHING resembling of fun about Batista/JBL though. And the whole match is shitty, sloppy and dull as well. And the ending sucked. So yeah, there ya go.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Henry/Angle & Henry/Taker are bad but not Cena/Miz bad. I'd at least give the former two SOMETHING :lol.

Henry delivered in the biggest match of his life though at MITB 2013, that's all that matters. & he was given probably the last important WHC reign that I can remember. Henry got his moment in the sun at the end of the day and continues to be respected as a major player in the company. I'm sure he'll be involved in something substantial as long as he's around. The Fake retirement speech is arguably the segment of the year in a year where the company focused more on the quality of their TV product compared to their PPV output, what a compliment.

Rock/Punk is fun in a "TEAR YOUR OWN EYES OUT" way. 

OH WAIT. THAT MEANS IT ISN'T FUCKING FUN IN THE SLIGHTEST .


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Zep, I'm referring the Halloween Havoc 98 match.


 Oh, didn't realise they had a match at that PPV.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The fake retirement segment was awesome, but the first Punk/Heyman/Lesnar promo ("CM Punk, you CANNOT beat BRRROCK LESSSNAARRR!!!") was better imo.

But yeah, despite its flaws, WWE TV 2013 has been where it's at. Countless good segments and matches on TV this year. And imo this year's Summer > 2011's. Yeah, I'm going there.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Rock/Punk matches>>>Brock/HHH's 2013 matches.

Come at me, bro.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Is Benoit/OJ match from GAB his best match ever?

I know thats not saying much, but I thought it was pretty good.

I'm talking aboout Orlandos best match, not Benoit BTW


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah, Benoit has OJ's best match with him because who else would? Only other enjoyable Jordan matches I've seen are probably against Benoit (SQUASH!) and the one match he had with Orton in early 2006. Orton was on a roll that month, working with Benoit for a month with the Jordan match squeezed into the middle of it and with the momentum from wrestling the GOAT, he carried OJ.



Evan Stays Trippy said:


> Punk/Rock is the worst combination of shitty match + shitty booking = SHIT.
> 
> Batista/JBL is boring as balls at some points but it never really does reach OH MY FUCKING GOD KILL ME levels like Rock/Punk does. *The only way ANYBODY can enjoy Punk/Rock is if they're a Rock mark or a Punk hater, plain and simple.*
> 
> ...


Which is STILL way better than a boring match that just puts you to sleep. I don't think even Batista and JBL's biggest blind marks (do they exist?) would be able to enjoy that awful match. At least even if you're a hardcore Punk mark who hates The Rock, you can at least laugh at some of the stuff that takes place there.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Talk of worst main events and nobody brings up Undertaker/HHH x2?


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Okay so now the argument is SHITTY SHIT > DULL SHIT .

Benoit/Jordan is decent, making it Jordan's best match ever by a million years that I can remember. 

Dude is straight up worthless.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Agree with C2D. Punk/Rock is awful, but the comedy that it provides is off the charts. Surely it's better than Batista/JBL and all of the HHH/HBK main event matches.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

SHITTY SHIT > DULL SHIT by far. Rock/Punk is not even close to the bottom of main events, I don't care what anyone says. There are sooooo many flat out dull main events in WWE history that are far worse than that. Like ff1 says, I'd take it over the HBK/HHH cell match too. Not sure about 3SOH since that one has similar fuckeries making it entertaining. But Bad Blood definitely.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I don't know about you guys, but I'd rather watch Punk/Rock and Cena/Miz over the HBK/Hart Ironman match. Atleast those matches don't take away 65 minutes of your life and leave you bleary, confused, and angry about wasting so many precious minutes of you're life on boring rest holds and passionless wrestling. God that match still makes me angry. What a waste of a great build and and two GOAT-level performers in their prime in a main event of WrestleMania.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

OJ/Benoit from SS is obviously his best match, da hell you guys thinking?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

How about Orlando/Warrior:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*The Great American Bash 2005 review 

Match#1: MNM vs Heidenreich and the road warrior Animal*

Wow, what a team this is :lol. Wait? Is reich face now? If so, that’s a terrible idea. Well this wasn’t too bad. It of course isn’t the finest wrestling you’ll see, but it wasn’t too bad. It’s cool that after Hawk died Animal decided to have one more farewell run in honor of his friend hawk. I think I need to see more classic LOD matches, because they are super fun IIRC. Was shocked to see the NEW LOD win TBH, thought that MNM had a long run with the titles, but whatever, they were FUN as fuck anyways. So yeah, this was meh, more of a tribute match than anything else. **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5

Match #2: Booker T vs Christian *

Jeez, this got WAY too much time. This was a filler match that somehow went over 10 minutes. Another Meh match that got REALLY dull at times and was decent at others, but the match never went over the MEH feeling that I got from the first match as well. Crowd really didn’t give a shit too, weren’t heckling it but they we’re pretty quiet, and Buffalo usually has a decent crowd. So yeah this went 12 minutes, that’s probably only a little less than how much Eddie/Rey will get. So timing issues really became the issue here, as Christian and Booker looked like they had nothing left to do. But anyways nothing too bad, better than the opener I guess. **1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 1*

*Match #3: Orlando Jordan vs Chris Benoit *

90% of the time an Orlando Jordan match will come on I’ll just throw a NO on it, but come on, I can’t put do that for a Benoit match! This actually wasn’t too bad at all, and its probably the greatest Orlando match ever, even though that’s not saying too much. This was a complete carryjob however, because it further proves that Benoit is the GOAT. This got 15 minutes, and that was pretty cool considering on paper it didn’t sound like it would get too much time. I liked the ending too, thought the exposed turnbuckle spot was clever, OJ did more things right here than usual and Benoit was Benoit. ***

*CAL SCALE: 2 
*
*Match #4: The Undertaker vs Muhammad Hassan*

This would be the end of Muhammad Hassan, soon he would be completely pulled off TV by WWE because of demands by the network. The character might of taken things too far at points( 9/11 was still fresh in Americans minds) and considering he was garbage IMO, the WWE decided to take the high road and get rid of him, and I agree with that decision. As big as a taker fan as I am( #3 all time behind Flair and Hart), this sucked, a lot. Taker just couldn’t carry Hassan to a good match here. The crowd popped for the final tombstone and taker’s win, but the rest nobody gave a shit about. So yeah, Hassan sucks dick and this was the last we saw of him, sayonara! Also, this was a no 1 contenders match, when was the title match? *

*CAL SCALE: 0*

*Match #5: The Mexicools vs the BWO*

Dear god this sounds bad. NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1

Match #6: Eddie Gurrero vs Rey Mysterio *

YAY, finally a match that will bring life into this show! I honestly thought this storyline wasn’t too bad until the ladder match, which I loved, it was just unrealistic. I haven’t seen this though, but I expect some great stuff here, maybe better than their JD match. Well, this just saved this PPV from being very last on my 2005 rankings, pretty sure it will be ranked slightly higher than NWO. This match was great, but I would put it slightly under their JD match, even though it had a real finish and that match was a DQ finish. Amazing that these two have such great chemistry here, too bad their mania match was nowhere near as good, then it would be one of the GOAT manias. Yeah so this was beautiful, the heel work by Eddie looking at Dominic the entire time was out of this world. ****

*CAL SCALE: 5 

Match #7: Torrie Wilson vs Melina*

OH HELLLLL NAWW. NO 
*
CAL SCALE: -1

Match #8: JBL vs Batista 
*
Dear god I’m not looking forward to this, there was just like a 2 page discussion on how this might be the worst PPV main event of all time. On paper, this sounds terrible, mainly because tista was green at the time and JBL has always been average at best. Jesus fucking Christ that as terrible, literally one of the most dull matches I have ever seen. Literally just boring move after boring move, and that basically sums up the entire match. They tried to experiment with some things, but it ended up being really bad, and that’s an understatement. The ending was complete shit as well, a DQ ending on PPV? IN THE MAIN FUCKING EVENT OF A PPV? That’s just shitty booking. They should of out Batista with Benoit or taker, even Christian. Why put him with someone who can only work good matches if he’s being carried by a GOAT like Eddie? Urgh, apparently their Summerslam match is much better, and SHORTER. Looking forward to that show, gonna start it ASAP. But avoid this at all costs, really bad, Rock/Punk rumble > this. DUD 

*

CAL SCALE: 0 

FINAL CAL SCALE: 6.5 

CURRENT 2005 PPV MOTY: Batista vs Triple H (Vengeance) 

Current 2005 PPV rankings

1: Vengeance 
2: Wrestlemania 21( 19)
3: Royal Rumble (17)
4: Judgment day(17) 
5: ECW ONS(16) 
6: Backlash(13.5)
7: New Year’s Revolution (9.5)
8: The bash ( 6.5)
9: No way out (4.5)
*
*BTW- this DVD has Flair/Sting GAB 1990 as a DVD extra, good extra for a horrible PPV! *​


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Somehow it still beat No Way Out? I guess that's the power of Eddie, Rey and Benoit.

As for the title match involving Taker. It didn't happen. He had another #1 contender match with JBL on Smackdown the week after that and Orton interfered in the end, causing JBL to win. This restarted Taker/Orton and continued the shitty Batista/JBL feud.

Agree with Batista being given Benoit for this PPV as a "filler" opponent but somehow, they thought JBL/Batista was what fans wanted after teasing it on the road to WM. Batista/Taker was clearly saved for the big stages and luckily, it happened in 2007.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Warned ya - Batista/JBL sucked balls.

Don't worry kid, SummerSlam will kill the trauma.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

What's the Taker/Show Punjabi Prison match like?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Somehow it still beat No Way Out? I guess that's the power of Eddie, Rey and Benoit.
> 
> As for the title match involving Taker. It didn't happen. He had another #1 contender match with JBL on Smackdown the week after that and Orton interfered in the end, causing JBL to win. This restarted Taker/Orton and continued the shitty Batista/JBL feud.


Well, the taker/orton feud was GOLD, so at least that came out of it. And yeah the PPV somehow still beat NWO even with two NO's and a DUD main event, strange. 

Good thing the extras for this are AWESOME. In additon to the WCW match theirs the segment where Eddie tells rey Dominic is his son :mark:

EDIT: I actually liked that Zep, thought it was fun. Most don't though


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Muhammad Hassan is half the reason why 2005 was not bad. Certainly better than The Undertaker.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Do y'all like the ONS '07 Ladder match?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Starting Summerslam 05 right now, really pumped for this, haven't seen anything past Orton/taker, and that is really fuzzy for some reason


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Muhammad Hassan is half the reason why 2005 was not bad. Certainly better than The Undertaker.


Correction: He's one of many reasons why 2005 was awesome.

But referring to the year as "not bad" is certainly progress. 



ATF said:


> Do y'all like the ONS '07 Ladder match?


It's alright.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Hassan sucked tbh. Wasn't good in the ring and his "AMERICA SUCKS THEY DISCRIMINATING AGAINST ME WAAAAAAAA" act got old about 2 promos in.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Hassan sucked tbh. Wasn't good in the ring and his "AMERICA SUCKS THEY DISCRIMINATING AGAINST ME WAAAAAAAA" act got old about 2 promos in.


THIS, Hassan was garbage, character was a clever idea, but was the right decision to remove him from TV

That Benoit squash never gets old TBH


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I think I might go rewatch Summerslam 2005 as well. Last time I watched it, I didn't like any of the three main event matches. Orton/Taker is a classic. MOTN and top 10 match of the year. Bah, I'll go as far as to say it's a good year. I just like 2008, 2011, and 2013 better. But not 2012. And Hassan's promos did a great job in exposing the hypocrisy of the western world. It was great seeing Jim Ross look like an idiot. That character was perfect for its time, just like JBL's.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

I thought Cena/Jericho Batista/JBL NHB were a lot better than the two WM main events


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I think I might go rewatch Summerslam 2005 as well. Last time I watched it, I didn't like any of the three main event matches. Orton/Taker is a classic. MOTN and top 10 match of the year. Bah, I'll go as far as to say it's a good year. I just like 2008, 2011, and 2013 better. But not 2012. And Hassan's promos did a great job in exposing the hypocrisy of the western world. It was great seeing Jim Ross look like an idiot. That character was perfect for its time, just like JBL's.











:lmao

Every word Hassan says is true but the simple minded idiots in the audience don't have the brain to comprehend it so all they can say is "YOU ES EY" and "WHAT". lol @ Daivari going nuts and speaking in persian. "WE ARE NOT JACKASSES, YOU TWO ARE JACKASSES!" :lol


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Chris Jericho/Eddie Guerrero Tag Team:

vs. Meng/Barbarian 2/24/97: *****1/4*
vs. Benoit/Malenko 1/29/98: ******
vs. Chavo/Malenko 2/9/98: *****1/4*
vs. Benoit/Malenko 2/16/98: ******
vs. Booker/Malenko 2/26/98: ****3/4*
vs. Booker/Malenko 3/2/98: ****3/4*

Simply the greatest tag team of all-time. Why are you not watching these matches? All of them are only ten minutes, but they're the best ten minute tag matches ever.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Chris Jericho/Eddie Guerrero Tag Team:
> 
> vs. Meng/Barbarian 2/24/97: *****1/4*
> vs. Benoit/Malenko 1/29/98: ******
> ...



Seen all of those but the Booker/Malenko ones. I might have to agree, they were, as Jericho says, the Best Team that Never Was. The MENG/Barbarian match especially was tremendous, can't remember if it was you or Hayley pimping it a few weeks ago, but once I watched that I searched and found the rest. They were such a great little shit heel team. Shame they never got another to at it around 2002-2003 in WWE. Could have been even bigger/better than Los Guerreros.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Now I'm salivating at the thought of Chavo Guerrero being replaced in the Smackdown Six by Chris Jericho :homer. Christ, can things get better than perfection?


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Those tag matches sound like a helluva lot of fun.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

The Primer said:


> NORMAN SMILEY.
> 
> Felt like getting that out. Also feel like getting out how there hasn't been a single good match from Konnan in all of 1998, so far. Gonna see if one will pop up. That's now a side-project in the middle of this project. Konnan only basically had one in 1997. w/Hugh Morrus vs Steiners from Slamboree, iirc. This guy is seriously probably the worst dude ever. Which covers some really bad ground. Did he remotely try once in his career? I'm not sure. El Gigante, Nailz, Virgil, are better than him. Virgil one is a tough statement for me to make, but I think I may be correct via one of those random Dibiase matches being tolerable.
> 
> Yeah1993 can vouch for this.


I'd definitely have Virgil above him. IDK about Nailz or el Gigante but I'd have to watch more Nailz and el Gigante. Only problem is that would require watching more Nailz and el Gigante. 

Did you like the trio with Konnan in it at SuperBrawl 97? I liked that one. Konnan sucked in it duh, but he couldn't drag the other 5 or 4 guys down all at once.



Callamus said:


> Eddie Vs Benoit time :mark:.
> 
> Am I the only one who thinks Raven is shitty?


Nah, he's pretty shitty.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

This is not terrible. I think this is the best we can do with Konnan one-on-one matches.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

Everyone should check out Raven & Horace vs Perry Saturn & Kanyon from WCW Thunder 7/8/98. Fun as hell tag match with all four workers involved consisting of both teams beating the hell out of each other, Horace taking flight with a suicide dive, Perry Saturn superkicking the crap out of Raven and Horace, and a clever table spot finish. It's only under 7 minutes too and it manages to be the MOTN. The midcard steals the show yet again.

*Here's the match.*


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Quote The Raven Nevermore


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> Correction: He's one of many reasons why 2005 was awesome.
> 
> But referring to the year as "not bad" is certainly progress.


This. Hassan was great. Sure he wasn't that good in the ring, but I'd attribute that to the fact he only had 2 years of wrestling experience prior to be thrown on TV - and he was also very young, being only 23 at the time he debuted on the roster. Very few wrestlers are great in the ring at that age, and it takes years of experience to get to that level. Statements like: ''I'm glad they got rid of him'' I just don't get, he had the potential to be one of the biggest heels in recent memory. His character and promos were awesome though, and he was getting more heat than anyone else in the company at the time which was big. But because this is the workrate thread, and some posters here seem to think only having ''good matches'' matters in wrestling it's no wonder people shit on Hassan here...


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I wonder how many wrestling fans know that "Quote the Raven, Nevermore" isn't just a catch phrase Scott Levy made up, but from a classic Edgar Allen Poe poem.

To answer the "Raven is shit" sentiment, I can't say I agree. True he's never been brilliant or even all that good in the ring, but I've always been a fan of his mic work, and he has had maybe a dozen or so matches that are really pretty damn good. I would never say he achieved greatness or even "Really Goodness", but he wasn't bad at all. Plus his theme music in WWE in 2001 is one of my favorite themes ever :mark:

Speaking of 2001 Raven, that Hardcore Triple Threat at WM 17 ranks about a ZILLION on the FUN Scale :mark:

Edit- Nostalgia, I agree with your statement about Hassan. He wasn't good in the ring, at all, but he didn't have experience so it's understandable. Not everyone can be a Brock Lesnar or Kurt Angle and become great workers their first year in the business. I will say that as an American, it was kind of embarrassing that the early Hassan was considered a "heel". Later on, yes he did become a full blown heel but in the early months he was basically spouting a lot of truth to people who were still so Pro-USA/Anti-Everywhere else that it did make a bit of a joke out of country. I just wish people in other countries wouldn't look down on US fans for it, they have no idea how crazy it was here post-9/11 for the first 4-5 years. We were getting fed a lot of bullshit by our government and most people were just scared. The fear mongering press didn't help matters. Either way, I think the original Hassan character was very unique and creative on the WWE's part. I disagree with you labeling this as a "work rate thread" though. I think this is more just a "work" thread, most try to appreciate the art of what goes on in between the ropes, no matter what form it comes in. If anything, I'd dub this the "fatty" appreciation thread


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Saturn/Kanyon vs. Horace/Raven most definitely is fun. DAT DROPKICK INTO CRUCIFIX! DAT HORACE DIVE! RUSSIAN LEG SWEEP ON BARRICADE! I love how WCW ran these 100 MPH tag matches with their midcard. I love today's midcard, but if they had more of this stuff, I would love it even more. *****


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

need a ppv to watch gents hook me up,


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Fully Loaded 2000?


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Hassan was the type of heel that would speak the truth but in an aggressive manner that would usually include insulting the crowd. That made him a heel. Kind of like CM Punk in 2009 - 10 where he was telling parents the truth about alcohol and drinks but he would do it by insulting the crowd and trying to force his views on fans. Two great heels IMO that should have lasted longer than they should.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Go watch Armageddon 2008. Or Night of Champions 2010.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

SKINS: Go watch....Vengeance 05! or Vengeance 02!

*Summerslam 2005 review 

Match #1: Orlando Jordan vs Chris Benoit *

THE REMATCH! Wait? A squash? YAY!!! Orlando Jordan lost the title to one of the best ever, a true mark out moment. So this literally is just on suplex and then the crossface and then Benoit is the NEW US champion! Good start to the show to fire up the audience! This might be my favorite squash ever TBH Also Benoit’s last ever appearance on the show as he was injured in 06 and well…yeah in 2007. **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5

Matt Hardy vs Edge *

Matt Hardy actually got married about a month ago, but its hard not to feel bad for him at this point in time. I mean, HE HAD FUCKING LITA. I’d go crazy if I lost that, and I would be pissed at the guy who caused it. Now, is this the closest that WWE has gone to breaking kayfabe in a storyline? Besides maybe the screwjob, not many feuds are this personal IRL. It made both these guys have great characters. Matt was over so much as a face at this time, and was showing the most charisma he ever did. Edge and Lita were getting massive heat because of this before this storyline even started, because the incident was so public. But they sure as hell hit the nail on the head with “Can it get more personal”? JR and Coach stress how we won’t see ONE Wrestling hold in this match and Hardy slaps on a rear chinlock :lmao. The match itself is one of the most fun sub 5 minute matches you’ll ever see, it was just a WAR. Yeah this went way too short, but it was FUN. I’m super pumped for their cage match. **1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 1*

*Match #3: Rey Mysterio vs Eddie Gurrero* 

I know I rate this match a ton higher than others, mainly because IDGAF about the botches, because their not too obvious to me, and the storyline did suck balls, I will admit. But the match itself is one of the best ladder matches IMO, not a top 10 ladder match, but maybe top 15. Yes this match still holds up for me, everything about it is great. If the storyline wasn’t stupid and the botches weren’t there it’d be 5 stars IMO. I do love the way they are able to pull off the bad storyline and still give eddie a ton of heat. Ending is a great moment seeing Rey rekindle with his family, was honestly a fantastic way to end this amazing feud, par the very end being a little stupid. ***3/4

*CAL SCALE: 4

Match #4: Kurt Angle vs Eugene* 

Damn! How did Eugene get Christy Hemme!? Fuck me, shes pretty fucking hot here, IDGAF that she is like the WOAT ring announcer it TNA right now. This was another fun squash match, the sad part is it went as quickly as the Edge/Hardy match. Eugene went for a people`s elbow and Angle clotheslined him and the fans loved it. Obviously the WWE learned Eugene sucked, as Eugene has been out cheered by the HEELS in both Summerslam matches vs HHH and Angle. The peoples elbow was pretty hilarious however. He then goes for a rock bottom, this is actually pretty funny. Then a stunner, and the crowd still wants Angle to win. In the end Eugene tapped though, this was pure comedy. *1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 0.5 

Match #6: Randy Orton vs The Undertaker*

I loved their mania match more than almost anyone, I actually gave it ****1/2, that’s higher than fucking CAL gave it! So yeah, apparently nobody else rated it that high . Well this was still fucking great, just a fun 20 minute brawl that never got boring ever, such a great match. The ending was easily the best part of the match, first, Orton goes for the tombstone, but taker reverses into one of his own! then Orton hits a back breaker but only scores a nearfall. All of a sudden, some old fart comes into the ring, takers distracted, RKO! Orton wins! The man turns out to be Bob Orton, that was a fucking awesome ending! I liked the psychology in this match and great selling from both opponents, I still regard the mania match a bit higher though. ****

*CAL SCALE: 5 

Match #7: John Cena vs Chris Jericho*

I actually haven’t seen these guys matches, even the SVS 08 match that is HIGHLY regarded and is supposed to be awesome. The first half of this match was pretty boring TBH, but DAT SECOND HALF! After the first 6 or 7 minutes, it was awesome. Probably some of the loudest chants I’ve ever heard, crowd was divided so much, a lot wanted Cena to retain but I think at least half were pulling for a Jericho win. Yeah the crowd was ELECTRIC for this one, and you can almost see the fans start to turn on Cena as he started hulking up. However, the finish was amazing, a big FU, not really outta nowhere, for the win. I loved this match, MOTN so far. This was also the last PPV match for Y2J for over 2 years. **** 

*CAL SCALE: 5 

Match #8: Batista vs JBL*

God if this isn’t better than their GAB match that I watched earlier today, that was a DUD and because this is a NHB match, I expect it to be a lot better. Wow, this was actually pretty damn good, just showd you the magic of this show and how amazing it his. I love a good hardcore brawl so this was right up my alley. Quality over Quantity here as it was exciting from bell to bell and and improvement over their GAB match. Good to know that these guys took the time to try and improve their chemistry after their disgusting match, check this out. ***

*CAL SCALE: 2 

Match #9: Shawn Michaels vs Hulk Hogan *

:lenny at the thought of HBK’s heel run in 2005, even if it only lasted a month. I do know that HBK oversells like a madman in this but I haven’t seen the match itself, so I am looking forward to it. I also know that Hogan wins, hence the overselling . This was great, probably not MOTN as I’d give that to Cena/Jericho or Orton/Taker, but all of those matches are so close in terms of quality, it’s a big reason why they’re all rated similar. I wasn’t expecting this to be bloody at all so I was kind of shocked at the amount of blood there was, almost at the level of the HIAC match from Vengeance. I loved the ending, even the overselling worked, because it was hilarious. The whole match was flat out fun, it wasn’t a technical masterpiece but if this was the last Hogan match ever, it would have been one helluva fairwell. Fun match to end an absolutely AMAZING show, not a single bad match as the matches with low ratings were fun squashes. ****

*CAL SCALE: 5 

FINAL CAL SCALE: 24 

CURRENT 2005 PPV MOTY: Batista vs Triple H( Vengeance ) 

Current 2005 PPV rankings

1: Summerslam( 24) 
2: Vengeance 
3: Wrestlemania 21( 19)
4: Royal Rumble (17)
5: Judgment day(17) 
6: ECW ONS(16) 
7: Backlash(13.5)
8: New Year’s Revolution (9.5)
9: The bash ( 6.5)
10: No way out (4.5)
*​


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

My old SS 05 ratings:

Benoit/Jordan: *******
Hardy/Edge: ****1/2*
Mysterio/Guerrero: *****
Angle/Eugene: ***
Orton/Undertaker: *****1/4*
Cena/Jericho: *****
Batista/JBL: ****
Hogan/HBK: ****

Yeah...nothing like anyone else here. Cena/Jericho kinda bored me and I never thought Hogan/HBK was that entertaining. Mysterio/Guerrero also did not have that special Eddie Guerrero psychotic performance that I loved in their non-gimmick encounters. Orton/Taker though :lenny. Worth a rewatch after going through some more WCW 1998.

EDIT: Rewatching the ladder match now. Match was going pretty good until Dominick came in. :lmao at Eddie Guerrero's reaction. A lot of blown spots, but at least they looked brutal. Why is Eddie Guerrero putting his head up Rey's ass? And why is this turning into a spotfest? Michael Cole's commentary is some of the worst that I have ever heard. Eddie putting the ladder under Rey was pretty cool, but Eddie does his best Jack Swagger impression. Too many spots for their own good. Stupid Vickie Guerrero. Man this is a half great match and half stupid match. It's still good, but not as good as everyone says it is. What a horrible ending.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Fully Loaded 00 it is

@smitty planning on watching vg 05 in fully some time later, hhh/batista is my MOTY for that year as well with haitch/naitch matches a hair behind


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit vs Jordan - ★★★★★
Edge vs Matt Hardy - ★★★
Mysterio vs Eddie - ★★★¾
Angle vs Eugene - ★★½
Orton vs Undertaker - ★★★★¼
Cena vs Jericho - ★★★★
Batista vs JBL - ★★★
Hogan vs HBK - ★★★½

Awesome PPV and definitely one of my favorite SummerSlams.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Big probs to OJ giving Benoit a HUGE rub like that. Not only did he lose clean to the Crossface AND drop the US title to him, he also let it happen in mere seconds. Benoit was a rising star after that!


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Funnyfaces you cannot be serious on that Benoit/Jordan rating? In fact, all those ratings par Orton/taker and MAYBE Eddie/rey are fpalm


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> Fully Loaded 00 it is
> 
> @smitty planning on watching vg 05 in fully some time later, hhh/batista is my MOTY for that year as well with haitch/naitch matches a hair behind



You won't regret it, 2 matches I would give ****1/2+ and the rest of the card is solid as well.

Funnyfaces- I disagree that the Ladder match didn't have a psychotic Eddie performance. Eddies character work was as good in that match as the other Rey matches I thought. God Eddie was just such an amazing cunt. Eddie in 2005 is my favorite character ever. I didn't realize how many people hated the custody storyline. I thought it was a way out of the box storyline that would have been absolutely ridiculous if given to just about any other performers. But with Eddie and Rey, and their history, I thought it worked honestly. Watch that GAB match and tell me having Dominick there didn't make that match better. I certainly thought it did. I mean shit, Eddie actually used he kid as a shield in that match, and feigned like he was gonna strike him at SS. How much heat is THAT?


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> I disagree with you labeling this as a "work rate thread" though. I think this is more just a "work" thread, most try to appreciate the art of what goes on in between the ropes, no matter what form it comes in. If anything, I'd dub this the "fatty" appreciation thread


Sure. Truthfully, I'm not into the whole reviewing matches thing much (I mean I'll do it on occasion but not nearly as much as others in here) and I'd take good character/promo work over in ring work most of the time, but I personally use this thread as a general place to have discussions on wrestling with fellow like-minded good posters, because the rest of the WWE section is mostly awful filled with terrible posters. And I know others post in here for the same reason. 

You can actually have a discussion in this thread. And it is GOOD. 



smitty915 said:


> *The match itself is one of the most fun sub 5 minute matches you’ll ever see, it was just a WAR. Yeah this went way too short, but it was FUN.* I’m super pumped for their cage match. **1/2
> *CAL SCALE: 1*


That's why I would give it a higher rating than that personally. ****1/2* range for me.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Callamus said:


> Big probs to OJ giving Benoit a HUGE rub like that. Not only did he lose clean to the Crossface AND drop the US title to him, he also let it happen in mere seconds. Benoit was a rising star after that!


He deserved it after all the excessive jobs he did. A talent like him deserve better than putting over inferior talent all year.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Benoit had pretty much a career year in 05. Huge WM moment dropping the belt to JBL, a young up and coming star, then he got to feud with ORLANDO JORDAN of all people, who ended up giving Benoit the biggest rub of his career, and then oh man, BENOIT VS CHAVO. The stuff of dreams.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Nostalgia: I could see someone rating the Edge/hardy match ***1/2, think its a little too short for that much rub but it makes sense


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Callamus said:


> Benoit had pretty much a career year in 05. Huge WM moment dropping the belt to JBL, a young up and coming star, then he got to feud with ORLANDO JORDAN of all people, who ended up giving Benoit the biggest rub of his career, and then oh man, BENOIT VS CHAVO. The stuff of dreams.


Haha, what? You've got 2005 and 2006 all mixed up. 

2007 was his career year. He jobbed to Kennedy twice in a row, missed a shitload of Smackdowns, tapped out to John Cena, wrestled MVP in 90% of his appearances that year, got pinned by The Miz, was a lumberjack in his final PPV appearance and got relegated to ECW to win the prestigious ECW Championship as he decided he had enough so he took his ball and went home and we haven't seen him since.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Benoit's career year is obviously 2005, yeah. He got to wrestle the 'great under-pushed talent who should have been world champion' Muhammad Hassan. Fuck all those Finlay and Austin MOTYCs and tremendous 2004 world title run. Muhammad Hassan, man.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

I'm really shocked to see all these negative comments about Raven. Did he leave a mark on the business? No. But he was one psychologically sound wrestler. Where Raven really shined, imo, was in matches that involved multiple people. He was really good at structuring matches with lots of interferences and false finishes. And they never got tiring or overstayed their welcome. He knew how to get heat and to put a babyface over. The guy's a genius in his own little way. Anything from his feud with Dreamer in ECW is worth a watch.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


> Fuck all those Finlay and Austin MOTYCs and tremendous 2004 world title run. Muhammad Hassan, man.


Asshole. You just made me spit coffee all over my brand new pants.

Since we are on the topic of Benoit and the AMAZING push he received from 2005-2007, who would you guys say is his greatest in-ring opponent from his time in WCW/WWE? I was thinking about this the other day, he's the only GOAT contender who doesn't have that obvious #1 opponent. Eddie had Rey and Rey had Eddie. Taker had Shawn and Shawn had Taker. Bret had both Austin and Hennig. Flair had Steamboat and to a SLIGHTLY lesser extent Windham. Regal had Finlay and visa versa. Foley had Taker and to a lesser extent Hunter. You get the picture. Benoit doesn't have that obvious nemesis, the best I could come up with was Finlay or maybe Eddie. Your thoughts?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit doesn't have a #1 opponent because they all are battling for it. That's why he's the GOAT! 

Some people would say Angle but in this topic, that would not be the case. Maybe Jericho?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Benoit doesn't have a #1 opponent because they all are battling for it. That's why he's the GOAT!
> 
> Some people would say Angle but in this topic, that would not be the case. Maybe Jericho?



Ah, I guess you would be right. WM17 was okay, Backlash was a classic, JD sucked minus the first fall, Unforgiven was pretty good, and RR was great minus the finishing stretch which really did take away from a badass match, in my opinion of course. I still prefer the Finlay matches by a considerable margin though, they knocked it out of the park every time the squared off. But Angle was more of a kayfabe nemesis than Finlay, that's for sure.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Started the Best of 2013 project today. A certain Punk Match has actually gone down a little (but it's still awesome). 

Trying to make sure I get in all the necessary Shield matches. Also including the Chamber match to make sure I don't miss anything important. Barely remember that match except for HENRY.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Very good point about Benoit. He doesn't have a best opponent because all of his opponents get career matches with him. His series of matches with DDP and Malenko are great too. I faintly remember one Malenko match in 1999 that was one of Benoit's best under the radar matches.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

My take on Summerslam 2005

Benoit Vs Fuckface ~ :lol
Hardy Vs Edge ~ ******
Guerrero Vs Mysterio (Dominick on a pole) ~ *****
Angle Vs Retard ~ *1/2 **
Orton (When he was great) Vs Undertaker (He was always great) ~ **** 3/4*
Cena Vs Jericho ~ **** 3/4*
Batists Vs JBL ~ *****
Hogan Vs HBK W/o his smile ~ *****

Hardy Vs Edge MOTN and Edge's best non gimmick match in the WWE :mark: :mark:.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

WWF Judgment Day 2001


*William Regal vs. Rikishi* 

Very strange match here. All the crowd wanted was to see Regal get a stinkface. Once it happens it almost seemed kind of pointless to continue the match since the crowd already got what they wanted. The match was about 5 minutes long and it wasn't very good. Regal's control segment consisted of mostly of punches and I can't remember anything about a Rikishi's offense other than an awesome kick and a stinkface. Regal is great and everything but this wasn't great at all. This felt like something that didn't really being on PPV. 
**1/4*



_2-Out-Of-3 Falls for Angle's Medals_
*Kurt Angle vs. Chris Benoit* 

This was a month removed from the technical classic they had at Backlash and they wrestled a totally different match. In the first 2 minutes of the match we saw Angle hit his German suplexes and Benoit hit Angle with his own finisher. Benoit also scored the first fall right away so after seeing him wrestle a lengthy match from behind he jumped out to an early lead. The next fall was submissions only and it seemed like Angle was just going for finishers the entire fall. Normally that would annoy me but it made sense given the context of the match as Angle was a fall behind and desperately needed to lock in a submission. 

On a side note I loved the foreshadowing from Benoit as he locked in the Walls of Jericho during the match. 

After working an amazing Ultimate Submission match at the last PPV I was expecting more. They would just lock in different submissions in hopes of winning. I realize that's what a submission match is but it didn't seem like either guy was particularly focused in what they were going to do for a while. Benoit would try for the Crossface, lock in the Walls of Jericho, and then a Figure Four. Angle gets the submission to the surprise of nobody. 

I actually really liked the ladder match that they had. It reminded me a lot of some of the older ladder matches that have occurred in that it wasn't filled with giant, contrived spots. I always felt that they were trying to win the match and they didn't waste time setting up absurd spots. The ending was really stupid and a terrible way to end a feud but I liked the stuff that led up to it. 

Overall this was good but not great. For 28 minutes of Angle and Benoit I would have expected a lot more. Still, for a 25 minute match I was entertained for most of the match so I won't rate it too harshly.
**** *


_Hardcore Championship Match:_
*Test vs. The Big Show vs. Rhyno(c*)

This wasn't as fun as I was hoping for. They brawled backstage for a while and took out the Big Show. Test and Rhyno then fought all the way back to the ring and proceeded to hit each other with trash cans a lot. Big Show returns and they hit each other with trash cans some more. That's about the entire match. Very uninspiring hardcore match. It was really lacking the craziness and feeling that the match was out of control that other hardcore matches have. 
****


_Women's Champinship Match:_
*Lita vs. Chyna(c)*

This was a mess. Chyna and Lita were supposed to be friends going into this. At one point it appears that Chyna has the match won and she picks Lita's shoulders up. How does that make any sense. Now if you forget that they're supposed to be friends the match actually isn't too bad. Lita plays an underdog trying to take the title from the monster champion. Her offense didn't look too great at times but it was solid enough. The fact that they effectively told a story in the ring is impressive if we're going by today's Diva standards. Now back to reality, THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO BE FRIENDS. If it wasn't for that this would have been passable (barely) but when they wrestle in total contradiction with their character that doesn't make a good match.

Chyna having serious issues with her wardrobe was pretty hilarious. 
*1/2** 


_Chain Match for the Intercontinental Championship:_
*Triple H(c) w/Stephanie McMahon vs. Kane
*
Kane is a month removed from his amazing performance at Backlash and his arm is still seriously injured. Triple H naturally attacks it right away and he is able to injure it even worse before they are even chained together. Triple H then proceeds to put the chain on Kane's bad arm. Triple H was great here, I don't think a control segment focused on working the arm could be done any better. Kane's comeback was more methodical then I would have preferred but it had it's moments where he looked like a pissed off, unstoppable monster. His selling during the comeback also left a little to be desired. 

The finishing stretch was pretty great as Kane got to act like a complete badass and win despite interference from Austin. Stephanie didn't get involved in the match but just watching her at ringside added to the match. I think at one point she was crying due to the ass kicking Triple H was getting. I was also almost positive that Triple H won the match and I was wrong about that so the ending was great for me. The match certainly has its flaws (ending didn't look good and Kane stopped selling his arm at points) but there was a lot of great stuff that happened here and they fit a ton of good stuff into a short amount of time. Had they just done some little things right this could have been a classic. They didn't do the little things right though and we're left with a match that was really good but makes you wish they had done everything right because they were so close to doing something really special. 
****1/2* 


_Tag Team Turmoil:_
*The APA vs. Perry Saturn and Dean Malenko vs. The Dudley Boyz vs. X-Pac and Justin Credible w/Albert vs. The Hardy Boyz vs. Edge and Christian vs. Chris Jericho and Chris Benoit* 

I'm not really sure how to rate this as one match. What happened in the beginning had no impact on the end and the match didn't tell a single coherent story. We got a bunch of very short, but pretty good tag matches. X-Pac and Justin Credible looked pretty good as well as Benoit and Jericho. I can't say I'm a huge fan of matches like this because I would rather see one good match then a bunch of short, average ones. I wasn't bored so that's a plus I guess. Again this is tough to rate but still pretty fun, I wasn't bored. 
***1/2* 


_No Hold Barred for the WWF Championship:_
*"Stone Cold" Steve Austin(c) vs. The Undertaker*

I will say that this was better than most of the Austin/Undertaker matches that I've seen. It was very good but it wasn't great. Austin working as a heel really hurt this for me because it prevented them for going back and forth very much. Each guy ended up having lengthy periods off controlling the match and I'm not a huge fan of structuring a hardcore match like that. The first two thirds of the match was good but it never really took the match to the next level. The finishing stretch was pretty great (despite a missed chair shot that looked terrible). I was fooled on a near fall which is always a plus. Undertaker looking like he was going to overcome the odds of being in the ring with Vince, Austin, and Triple H was a nice touch. It really did look like he was going to pull it off.

The fact that they just seemed to switch controlling the match for must of the match hurt things a lot and there was some nice leg work from Austin that wasn't sold at all by the Undertaker. Despite the obvious flaws in the match I did enjoy watching it. Like Kane and Triple H earlier in the night they were really close to doing something great but they made simple mistakes. I realize Austin was playing a heel and wanted to look more cowardly but would it have killed them to let them just go crazy and have a wild brawl for a little bit? That being said it is probably their best match together (unless their First Blood match is better then I remember it being).
****1/2* ​
Pretty average overall. It was lacking a great match that all PPVs need for me to call it great.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Evan Stays Trippy said:


> Hardy Vs Edge MOTN and Edge's best non gimmick match in the WWE :mark: :mark:.


Taker/Edge mania ?

About at the midway point of FL 00, at the steel cage match to be exact, kinda gassed so I'll continue later


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

SKINS25 said:


> *kinda gassed so I'll continue later*


:rock2

Hardy/Edge is better than any Edge/Taker match IMO. The Wrestlemania match is great but it's just missing something to be out of that classic range.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I think Edge has had many better non-gimmick matches than that one with Hardy. Other than Undertaker, I also think of match with Benoit from June 2007.

Watched that tag team turmoil from Judgment Day 2001 yesterday. Pretty fun overall.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I think Benoit's best opponent is definitely Finlay (other than Muhammad Hassan - everybody's best opponent). Regal, Austin, Jushin Liger, Orton, Guerrero and 2 Cold Scorpio after that.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Hardy/Edge was great, but I'd never even consider putting it above Taker/Edge WM24 as Edge's best. Have a number of other normal singles matches of Edge above the one with Hardy.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I don't know any REALLY great Edge singles bouts where he isn't getting a ton of help from a better opponent such as ORTON in his prime, Benoit, Taker, Guerrero, Cena, Hardy, etc.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Muhammad Hassan is half the reason why 2005 was not bad. Certainly better than The Undertaker.


:skip



funnyfaces1 said:


> Paramore fan, I just finished watching February of 98 which featured the first appearances of MENG and Barbarian. Holy Kamala, their match against each other was good. I just wish I can find their PPV match. Some other gems from that time include every Jericho match, Regal/Booker, Rick Martel's theme song, every Raven match, and Kidman. Love that midcard.
> 
> And Eddie/Jericho vs. Benoit/Malenko as well as Malenko/Chavo are classic level great. Anybody that doesn't see those matches are not Eddie/Jericho/Benoit/Malenko fans. Lol Chavo fans. Flair and Hart kick ass too. But Hennig sucks. He manages to have a not so good match with Bobby Eaton. I'm sure Konnan had a good match with DDP. Who doesn't (besides :taker)?
> 
> I love Wrestlemania 28


Road Wild 1998 is on youtube. Type it in and give MENG vs Barbarian on PPV the look it deserves.

Regal vs Booker. Oh shoot. Too bad Regal got canned after the epic schooling of Benoit. WCW must have been REALLY pissed to let that not slide. It's ok. He comes back after WWF flops completely with him the first time around. WCW actually used him a lot better. You never hear that.

Today & tomorrow will probably be lacking in WCW 1998 goodness thanks to sports (although I crammed a few WWF/WWE matches today; Foley was calling) but I'm looking to try and pick up soon. Maybe something tonight after hockey. Why not. Who needs to sleep. Nitro calls my name. Have to get to Slamboree asap. Remember that show being awesome.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

what are you guys thoughts on FL 00 ?


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

HHH/Jericho is one of the best gimmick matches ever, rejoice.

The main event is great as well.

Back to Summerslam 2005, Batista-JBL is just such a fun brawl that's stiff at times and never drags due to the run time being under ten minutes. Plus like many shows in the 2004-2006 time period, it holds nostalgiac value everytime I see it and I think about watching it live and being excited to grab the DVD.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jericho vs Triple H isn't as good as most say. Jericho was great in it & I like the match, but hype is always more than what is seen.

Rock vs Benoit is fabulous. Top five Rock match in his entire career. 

Rest of the show is a total blast. Val vs Rikishi, Saturn vs Eddie, opening six person tag. So much :lenny


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

yea wanted to get the general thoughts on the under card, about to begin rikishki/venis, opening tag and snow/taz was pretty fun to me, Trish :lenny


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Tazz vs Snow is good stuff. Short & sweet.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Yea, that PPV is pretty much the Attitude Era at its finest. Too bad PPV's of that caliber were few and far between from 1998-2000. For every gem you have 3-4 turds. Oh well, that's life.

Jericho WAS phenomenal in that LMS match with Trips, that's why I think so highly of it. I consider that match the best of his career, and every single time I watch it, it holds up. His selling of the ribs was spot on, other than Rude in the Steamboat Ironman, I can't think of anyone who has ever sold a torso injury as well as Jericho does in that match. He has you wincing right along with him when he hits the Lionsault or every time Trips goes after him. I would love to see what would have happened if WWE put the title on him that night and gave him a proper push as a top face. To my recollection, he never got a serious face push, and I think it would be interesting to see where it went from there. Oh well.

For the record, I gave Jericho/Trips ****3/4 and Rocky/Benoit ****1/2. That's probably my favorite Rock match ever, right up there with his war at the Rumble with Foley and the classic at WM 19.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Watched this short Rock vs RVD match from 24/9/01 and it was good stuff!



Yeah1993 said:


> I think Benoit's best opponent is definitely Finlay (*other than Muhammad Hassan - everybody's best opponent*). Regal, Austin, Jushin Liger, Orton, Guerrero and 2 Cold Scorpio after that.


Hah, you funny motherfucker!


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I personally found FL 2000 to be a complete two match show, MAYBE a 3 match show because the opener is :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I dig Fully Loaded 2000 from top to bottom. Fun stuff. Exactly what that timeline in the Attitude Era was said to bring. Undertaker vs Angle was pretty bleh, but at least the segments throughout the night made it worthwhile.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Hmm, maybe a rewatch is in order

Just downloaded all of the HHH/Hardy matches, those are good right?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah. Hardy makes most great. Trips plays a good foil in a few of them too, tbhayley. TV matches need to be seen again, but I'm working my way to those.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

WM 29 black friday amazon deal going on 13 bucks blu ray 11 bucks dvd


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Anyone watched Smackdown? If not, you should as there's an almost hour-long presentation of Goldust wrestling. Yeah, _an hour_.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Too bad shit gets diluted and we're stuck seeing a phenomenal rematch ruined by tired booking.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Well, at least the 3-on-3 then 6-on-6 matches were good too.

Speaking of that, I need to watch Cena/ADR II, Shield/Rhodes & Rey and Best & Beard/Wyatts II. God.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

So I finished Backlash 04 & I still got the same exact opinion on every match still.

You got 4 very good matches & then you got the whatever matches  but fun regardless, I like how the Womens Title and Kane/Edge were supposed to be big though, but I have no clue what happened with those matches.

Now it's time for Judgment Day 2004 & one my favorite ME's ever :mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Can't argue with the formulas that have the main events packing a punch and the undercard not being particularly offensive. Backlash '04 accomplishes that. Although Victoria vs Lita is a DUD. Very small potatoes for the overall quality. What ends up being good more than keeps it afloat. FOLEY.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I like how we watched Foley vs Orton and then watched Foley/HHH right after haha, it felt fitting to watch those pretty much back to back.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Watched some WCW last night:

Bash at the Beach 1998:

Raven/Saturn- **1/2
Juventud/Kidman- ***1/4
Eddie/Chavo- ***1/2
Konnan/Inferno- N/A
Greene/Giant- ***
Jericho/Mysterio- *1/2
Booker/Bret Hart- DUD
Goldberg/Hennig- DUD
DDP&Malone/Hogan&Rodman- DUDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

Starrcade 1985:

Khruschev/Houston- ***
Abdullah/Fernandez- **3/4-fun brawl
Bass/Bart- *
Barbarian/Graham- DUD
Landel/Taylor- *
National tag Titles Match- **
Magnum/Blanchard- *****
Valiant&Lively/Midnight Express- **1/2
R&Roll Express/Koloffs- ***1/2
Dusty/Flair- ***3/4


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Both were basically the same match when you strip down the basis to it's core. Foley putting every one over to make 'em stars. He's so good that he can bounce back from the losses like they don't even matter & do it for more talents. Except for the hilarious _(and justified)_ observation that Carlito didn't get the W at Taboo Tuesday 2005.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Well, Cena/ADR II was the same damn thing as HIAC. Good match but loses points because of that.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah, basically. Far from bad, but not much movement on the work front. Not to mention what was given at HIAC was better.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Rhodes & Rey/Shield was quite the fun front, though quite short.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Was unfortunately short, yet quite good.

Almost made a dig at how Usos & Kofi six mans vs The Shield get ten minutes or more and aren't nearly as close to being as good as that five minute match, but I stopped myself.

:curry2


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Kofi has a better 6-man Tag with the Shield than anyone not named Ryback. I miss Team Hell No 

Oh, and Punk & Bryan/Wyatts II ruled, imo it was better than SVS which was still pretty good but a little too contrived.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Kofi did nothing in that six man tag & I was only referring to the Shield matches when it was Kofi with Usos and the samoan slugs vs Shield in general. Still, LOL @ Kofi being in the six man tag and having nothing to offer in it. That's probably why it was so amazing.

That handicap match didn't come close to trumping the PPV match. Wyatts vs Punk & Danielson from Survivor Series was great.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Can't wait for the 2013 WWE's Best Matches DVD :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Dammit, trying to win a competition on fremantle's facebook page but I can only spot 6 differences and not 7 :lmao.

https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/1426485_768336059860137_882375173_n.jpg

Little help?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

He was still in it, and him not doing a worth ain't changing it that's what the science today does 

To me it DID trump it. It was more fun, Bray Wyatt himself brought that little extra something and, with a smaller role, Rowan looked better in it than SVS too, while Punk, Bryan and Harper were their typical selves.

I can't wait to see the WWE ruin the 2013 Best Matches DVD with shit like Punk/Rock I (II wouldn't be so bad), Rock/Cena II and Cena/Ryback. Prolly Punk/Jericho PB as well (though imo that wasn't shit, lazy but not shit).


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

They already did half ruin the best PPV matches for 2013 set lol. 9 shitty matches and 8 good matches . Still hope for the Raw & SD set...


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Finish your write ups instead of worrying about Kofi Kingston ATF


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Callamus said:


> Dammit, trying to win a competition on fremantle's facebook page but I can only spot 6 differences and not 7 :lmao.
> 
> https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/1426485_768336059860137_882375173_n.jpg
> 
> Little help?


1) Colour on Bryan's spandex

2) Mismatch colour on the second/bottom Titantron of Bryan's right kickpad

3) Kane's striped colours

4) Furthest most light (4th/top corner) is missing in the second picture

5) Bryan's wrist-tape

6) The text is different in the bottom left side

7) No referee (behind Bryan) in the second picture


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Ahhh, missed the light part. Thanks lol .


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

*Sting vs Lex Luger vs Ric Flair - WCW Starrcade 1995*

'Triangle match'

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/nwa-w...-flair-wcw-starrcade-1995-a.html#post27001233

Very underrated IMO.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'm watching HHH Vs HBK Armageddon 2002 . Make the pain stop. 28 minutes left :|.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Callamus said:


> I'm watching HHH Vs HBK Armageddon 2002 . Make the pain stop. 28 minutes left :|.




It could be worse. You could be watching their HIAC match lol.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cal I'm gonna hope you liked the four way tag, Benoit vs Eddie, & Show vs Angle from that PPV.

The other matches. Oh I can't wait to see the write-up on those. Comical.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Unless I somehow like this match in any way, shape or form, I currently prefer their HIAC match .

Sorry in advance Cody. For one of those matches .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Hmm. Gonna ponder which one it is. Maybe the tag b/c of the botched elimination & how you weren't into Jericho/Christian vs Booker/Goldust from No Mercy.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I'm guessing you didn't like Show vs Angle? Because theres no way that you disliked the tag or BENOIT VS EDDIE :mark:

I loved Angle/Show. Had that and the opener listed at 4 stars and Benoit/Eddie at ****1/2


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I lied .










*Armageddon 2002*

The end is near. The 2 out of 3 falls is almost hear. God help me.


*The Dudley Boys Vs Lance Storm & William Regal Vs Booker T & Goldust Vs Chris Jericho & Christian - World Tag Team Championship Elimination Match*

Regal and Storm say they are wrestling for respect tonight. The rest are wrestling for the tag titles .

Fuck me look at all the talent in this match. And Booker T.

REGAL VS GOLDU... dammit Christian tagged himself in. CHRISTIAN VS GOLDUS... Jericho comes in seconds later. JERIC... yeah not as appealing as the other 2 combinations tbh lol. Still... GOLDUST :mark:.

YOU SON OF A BITCH I'M THE KING OF THE WORLD!!!

Ha, super awesome moment with Bubba doing his tribute to Dusty side to side with Goldust .

3-D TO CHRISTIAN~! but Regal got a blind tag! Storm hits a leg drop! Regal goes for a cover and then... :lmao WHAT WAS THAT? MEGA BOTCHED PIN :lmao.

Then Goldust pins Regal .

So now we are down to GOLDUST and the other dude Vs CHRISTIAN and Jericho.

HOLY INSERT WHATEVER DEITY YOU WORSHIP HERE AT THAT BUMP GOLDUST TAKES ON THE OUTSIDE. He takes a bump into the steel steps, but turns upside down to take it and ends up smashing his back into the steps while landing on his HEAD. Man oh man. OH FUCKING MAN. That was a godly bump.

:mark: Goldust gets a lengthy FIP segment. Christian and Jericho are great working him over. This is what their No Mercy match should have been. Amazed at how highly other people think of it. Even without the ropes breaking and fucking up the finish, it just wasn't anything special whatsoever. THIS on the other hand is :mark:. And this isn't even the entire match lol.

:mark: at Goldust preventing Christian from launching off the top rope with a title belt in his hands. Guy just fucking lobs himself into the ropes to mke Christian lose his balance :lmao. Basically hotshotted himself lol.

Fuck me some super hot near falls in this. I genuinely don't know who wins this match so I don't know the finish, so I've been getting caught up in everything lol. Booker has nearly has this thing won 3 times and fuck me I bought each time as the finish .

Fuckity fuck me I was sure the match was about to end again lol. Title shot to Booker T's face, followed by a Lionsault as Christian drags Goldust out of the ring... but Booker kicks out!

BOOKEND! 3 COUNT! NEW TAG CHAMPS!!!! GOLDUST IS WEARING GOLD AGAIN!!! :mark:

Awesome, awesome match. And that was just the Gold T Vs C2 part :mark:. Regal & Storm + Dudley Boys part at the start was a ton of fun too, shame it ended with a botchy as fuck pin, but that didn't exactly ruin much. Whole match is great but the last 2 teams going at it was amazing.

*Rating: ***3/4*
*CAL SCALE - 4*


*Edge Vs A-Train*

So Rey needed more knee surgery (shock, I know) so they had A-TRAIN take him out. Being Rey's tag partner, A-Train decides to take Edge out too. Yeah I'm not sure myself. But Edge hasn't quite been taken out so they have a match.

A 62 INCH CHEST AND A HAIRY BACK!

A-Train is powerful and tall, so Edge goes after the legs and uses his quickness to try and stay on top in this one.

A-Train gets back in control thanks to his POWER, goes for a rest hold, then the match turns into a clusterfuck of shit with Edge honestly looking terrible on offence and the commentators getting confused about Albert now being called A-Train.

Edge kicks out of like 2 of A-Train's finishers, then Train kicks out of the running hug. Then A-Train gets DQ'd when he smashes a chair on Edge's leg. Well this was weird and pointless.

*Rating: 1/2**
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*Eddie Guerrero Vs Chris Benoit*

TWO VERY GREAT FRIENDS~! :lmao

Tazz: "I've been up and down the road IN CARS with these guys" :lmao

SHADES OF BOB BACKLUND~! :mark:

Honestly, fairly standard stuff for a bulk of this match. Eddie as the heel controls, starts with some arm work then after a hope spot from Benoit, goes after the leg. All picks up with Benoit's big come back though :mark:.

GERMAN SUPLEXES~! Benoit hits about 6 in a row, but it took a bunch out of him + all the leg work, so he takes his time going to the ropes for a headbutt. Eddie starts moving, so Benoit is all "fuck this shit, MOAR GERMANS~!" and land some more German Suplexes. Eddie is all "arrrghhh stop" so he grabs the ropes to escape. So Benoit is like "Hey Eddie, remember that Nitro match we had in 95?" and Eddie is all "huh?" and Benoit is all "FUCKING POWERBOMB BITCH" but Eddie like, remembers in time what happened in 95 and manages to avoid it and decides "fuck it, GERMANS OF MY OWN" and lands some German Suplexes of his own. True story.

Benoit keeps fighting like the RABID WOLVERINE he is, until Chavo Jr decides "hey, these guys are making me look like shit, so amma interfere" and he decks Benoit with the tag title belt. BENOIT AIN'T STAYING DOWN THOUGH. Instead he's all "I SAID FUCKING POWERBOMB, BITCH!!!" and fucking MURDERS Eddie with a powerbomb :mark:.

Chavo tries to get involved again, but gets taken out because he sucks. LOLOLOL.

EDDIE FLIES!!! Back off the top rope when Benoit pushes him . HEADBUTT!!! EDDIE PLAYS POSSUM!!! LASSO FROM EL PASO!!! BENOIT COUNTERS!!! CROSSFACE!!! BUT EDDIE IS FIGHTING TO PREVENT IT FROM BEING LOCKED IN, SO BENOIT SWITCHES SIDES AND GETS EDDIE AWAY FROM THE ROPES!!! TAP OUT!!! :mark:

Great stuff. First half is standard shizzle but the second half is fucking :mark:. Evens out nicely. Still currently prefer their Vengeance 03 match though tbh.

*Rating: ***3/4*
*CAL SCALE - 4*


DAWN MARIE AND TORRIE WILSON HOT LESBIAN ACTION~! THEY ACTUALLY KISS. FULL ON. FAP FAP FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAP.


*Kane Vs Batista*

:lmao I never get tired ofthe spot Flair does when he tries to attack the babyface on the outside and is completely useless, then gets scared shitless at the fact before the babyface tries to kill him .

So Batista is green as shit here, but honestly he doesn't do half bad. His power stuff is all fine; big clotheslines and a pretty sweet spear, and he takes everything Kane had to offer perfectly well too. Nothing close to bad about this one tbh. I rather enjoyed it. :mark: at Batista catching Kane with the Spinebuster. Cool spot.

Flair continues to make his presence felt on the outside, and manages to save Batista from a likely loss after a Chokeslam. BATISTA BOMB!!! And Kane is done. Big win early on in Batista's career.

Enjoyable .

*Rating: ***
*CAL SCALE - 0.5*


:lmao Cena and B SQUARED.


*Victoria Vs Trish Stratus Vs Jacqueline - WWE Women's Championship Match*

Ha. No.

*Rating: NO*
*CAL SCALE - -1*


*The Big Show Vs Kurt Angle - WWE Championship Match*

Man this starts off super fun. Angle tries to WRESTLE Show, but he's just too fucking big. Show uses his size and power, which ends up costing him Heyman on the outside, when he accidentally dumps Angle over the ropes right onto his manager! Show is distracted allowing Angle to sneak up from behind and send Show over the ropes!!! Then Show gets back in charge with that POWER again and Angle is pretty good at being tossed around.

Cole talking about Big Show: "I CAN ALMOST PUT 3 OF MY FINGERS IN HIS RING" :lmao

:lmao at the Tornado DDT. Botched to all fuckery.

Angle starts to build some momentum, using moves he wouldn't normally attempt. MISSILE DROPKICK~! STANDING MOONSAULT... which ends up just being a kick to Show's head lol.

ANGLE SLAM~! But Show kicks out because he's a giant and normal finishers don't work on him or something .

:lmao ANKLE LOCK and Show taps out the second it's put in but nobody acknowledges it! 

Show kicks Angle off, and the ref dies in the process. HEYMAN IS UP!!! Steel chair in the ring! Fans chant for Brock.

Angle gets the chair first! Show punches the first shot away but gets smashed in the face with the second one! Show kicks out like it was fucking nothing :mark:.

Ankle Lock again! Show taps for real but... the referee is apparently dead from trying to count to 3 :lmao.

A-TRAIN!!! TRAIN WRECK TO ANGLE! OR IS THAT THE DE-RAILER? I FORGET WHICH IS WHICH. THE COOL BACKBREAKER THINGY HE DOES. THAT MOVE~!

CHOKESLAM~!

LESNAR~!

F-5~!

Angle covers... and we got ourselves a NEW WWE Champion!

So this is a ton of fun. Crazy clusterfuckery type finishing stretch but I liked it a lot. Match before that was good too. Angle desperately trying everything to keep Show down, and Show just powering him around. Good shizzle.

*Rating: ***1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 3*


*Shawn Michaels Vs Triple H - World Heavyweight Championship 2 out of 3 Falls Match - First fall is a street fight, second fall is a cage match, third fall (IF NEEDED LOL) is a ladder match*

*sigh* I guess I gotta watch this. Hated it when it happened. Hated it when I re-watched it. Honestly haven't seen it in probably 8 years. Likely only seen it twice lol. The first time was more than enough. But ever the professional (LOL) I'm gonna watch it anyway!!!

Flair gets send to the back... before the match starts. For no reason at all. Uhhhh ok. There goes the one thing I was looking forward to in this match . NOT FAIR TO FLAIR~!

:lmao Shawn pretty much has a match with a trash can for the first 5 minutes :lmao. And it's better than every other HHH/HBK match ever .

Ton of sloppy shit early on in this one. Ring rust from HBK, or just shitty HHH being shitty HHH? I know which one I'm more likely to side with lol .

HHH has his right quad all taped up. So HBK decides to go after his back instead :lmao. Sort of get why he would, because HHH wants to kill HBK's back and it's all REVENGE and shit, but come on. HIS LEG IS CLEARLY ALREADY INJURED. KILL IT!!!

:lmao then HHH starts to work on HBK's leg :lmao. YOU WANNA WORK ON MY BACK WHICH ISN'T HURT AT ALL BECAUSE YOUR BACK IS HURT AND I'LL LIKELY GO AFTER IT? WELL FUCK YOU, MY LEG IS HURT SO I'M GONNA GO AFTER YOUR LEG. LOGIC~! :lmao

HHH gets a 2x4 wrapped in barbed wire, and is about to hit HBK with it. Then he stops and stands there like a retard for about a minute, before setting it on fire instead. :lmao HBK kicks him and HHH drops the 2x4... and it lands RIGHT NEXT TO THE FANS :lmao.

HBK uses it on HHH's face!!! HHH is only bleeding though . How awesome would this match have been if HHH's FACE was on fire? HHH RIDER FTW.

HBK nips up!!! But his leg is still fucked so he hobbles back and HHH chop blocks him and lands a Pedigree, picking up the win for the first fall! Well gosh, that was like, a GOOD FINISH. If only that was the end of the match :|. Second fall time. Steel cage. Just what these guys need; a match in a confined space.

As the cage lowers, HHH throws in a bunch of weapons. :lmao even HHH knows he can't have a standard cage match with HBK and have it be good. GOTTA USE DEM WEAPONS~!

Oh hey, HBK bladed. Quite clearly . They even show it on the replay :lmao.

They both end up fighting on top of the cage, and HHH tells Flair to stack some tables because... I don't know. If HHH threw HBK off the cage through the tables then yeah, it'd fuck him up... but it would also give HBK the second fall. So uhhh... what?  

FLAIR IN THE CAGE~! FLAIR IS BLEEDING :lmao.

:lmao HHH looks to attempt a Pedigree on a steel chair, but accidentally kicks it away while trying to get his footing right .

SUPERKICK~! And Shawn... doesn't go for the cover. He wants to HURT HHH which is all well and good but come on. HBK has been fucked up during this match and honestly should have just got the win there and then rather than taking a high risk and Crossbody'ing HHH through a table from the cage. At least it paid off... but still .

Third fall time. Great, exactly what we need. Both guys have been killing each other for 20 minutes, so now they have to muster up the energy to CLIMB A LADDER. This won't be slow as shit...

What's even BETTER than them sloooowly climbing ladders? DECIDING TO NOT SELL THE LAST 20 MINUTES AND CLIMBING LADDERS LIKE IT'S FUCKING NOTHING!!! YEY!! GOAT MATCH EVER!!! 

Oh wait, after fucking off selling, they decide to start selling again and climb slowly. BEST OF BOTH WORLDS!!!

Nice superkick to HHH... then HHH comes back in, knocks HBK off the ladder and OH WOW THOSE TABLES CAME INTO PLAY I DIDN'T NOT SEE THAT COMING!

HHH wins. We don't.

This is BAD. But in a lot of ways more HILARIOUSLY bad than their HIAC match. Still, I never ever in my life want to sit through this shite again. Was about 25 minutes too long.

*Rating: **
*CAL SCALE - 0*



*Overall CAL SCALE - 10.5*​


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Well I rated everything you enjoyed a little higher, especially Eddie/Benoit

What do you have left besides Summerslam?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Nothing, just SS to go .


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

I'm watching the Triple H/Rock Iron Man match. :lmao at Shawn's shorts. He's a pisser.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Nothing, just SS to go .


Great review man. I remember when I got back into wrestling and I got the KoK set, I saw that match on there and thought it would be all :mark: because of how Trips talks about it. I didn't see it when it happened of course. So anyways, after about 15 minutes, I'm all like "so this is what I've been missing? The fuck" and yea I started fiddling with my phone and texting people instead of paying close attention to the ladder match. Just flat out rotten. That's a sure fire sign a match sucks, when I start fiddling with my phone and can't even keep my ADD mind focused on my favorite thing in the world, wrestling.

I'm pretty much in line with all your ratings except I had Eddie/Benoit higher (shocker, I know ). I too preferred their Vengeance match to it, slightly. Eddies character was just better by then. I think you should mention, if you feel the same way I do that is, that when you say "pretty typical Eddie/Benoit fair to start the match" that pretty typical for those two is still better than what 90% of wrestlers can manage on their best day. That's how I feel anyways.

Can't wait til you get to SummerSlam. God I love that opener so much, you'd be hard pressed to find a better 10 minute match anywhere, only one I'd say is flat out better is that 95' Nitro match you mentioned. That POWER BOMB from hell :mark:

P.s. I think I might have found a sweet gem. Steamboat/Windham vs Steve Austin/Cactus Jack in WCW :mark: :mark: gonna watch it now, sounds AMAZING


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Armageddon 2002's main event is great for all the wrong reasons; Flair making a cameo appearance only to don a crimson mask merely one minute later is the tops for me. It's like they choreographed the match to be one of the most over the top and hilarious matches ever. The body part targeting by both men makes absolutely NO SENSE either; both have injured body parts going into the match but neither really work on either. 

IF YOUR OPPONENT HAS A BODY PART THAT'S BANDAGED UP.... ATTACK IT.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

So SS 02 needs 21.5 points to put it on part with 2000 as far as PPV's go... and that's including Global Warning Tour as well, giving it 1 PPV advantage! Insurrextion only getting ONE on the CAL SCALE really fucks the year over lol. 2001 is untouchable at this point.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Sorry for the double post but I just thought I'd share this gem with you gents, for any that haven't seen it. Brilliance.

Stunning Steve Austin and Cactus Jack vs Barry Windham and Ricky Steamboat WCW Worldwide July 11, 1992.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RVgK9VGSsqA

Short, absolutely sweet, and to the point. Fantastic. Perfect example of how WCW's in ring product blew WWF's out of the water in the early 90's.


----------



## Marv95 (Mar 9, 2011)

Sorry but the Armageddon 3 Stages match was still much better than the Ryback/Cena one. That joke of a much can't compare.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

So last night I was fucking WRECKED and I decided to watch the "Pipebonb Part II" promo at the beginning of the year between Punk & Rock. Looking back on it from this perspective, that's a REALLY underrated segment. All of the Punk/Rock segments are really, one of my favorite feuds that never paid off in the ring, Rock is like the ONLY guy who could get me that worked up when Punk lost the title and that's..... SOMETHING. Pretty sure I also hopped on a few random Punk 2013 matches that I can't remember, OH YEAH NOW I DO;

CM Punk Vs Ryback (1/7/2013) ~ **** 1/2*
CM Punk Vs Brodus Clay (1/14/2013) ~ ** (Squash)*
CM Punk Vs The Rock (Royal Rumble) ~ *DUD*
CM Punk Vs Chris Jericho (2/3/2013) ~ **** 1/4*
CM Punk Vs The Rock (Elimination Chamber) ~ *Needs Rewatch*
CM Punk Vs John Cena (RAW 2/25/13) ~ ***** 1/4*
CM Punk Vs Kane (RAW 3/11/13) ~ *Needs Rewatch*
CM Punk Vs The Undertaker (Wrestlemania XXIX) ~ ***** 1/2*

Watch the Kane & Rock matches and then go back and check out the rest of his GOAT heel run. Enjoyed the Punk/Taker segments to a large, large extent, Punk was ballin' out in those ones. Shame he had to come back in such a shitfest of a match & then go face. At least Punk/Brock is one of the greatest matches ever and automatically makes face Punk worth it, but HEEL PUNK is on a whole different level.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Evan Stays Trippy said:


> So last night I was fucking WRECKED and I decided to watch the "Pipebonb Part II" promo at the beginning of the year between Punk & Rock. Looking back on it from this perspective, that's a REALLY underrated segment. All of the Punk/Rock segments are really, one of my favorite feuds that never paid off in the ring, Rock is like the ONLY guy who could get me that worked up when Punk lost the title and that's..... SOMETHING. Pretty sure I also hopped on a few random Punk 2013 matches that I can't remember, OH YEAH NOW I DO;
> 
> CM Punk Vs Ryback (1/7/2013) ~ **** 1/2*
> CM Punk Vs Brodus Clay (1/14/2013) ~ ** (Squash)*
> ...


I watched the Punk/Cena Raw match a few days ago, and I went all the way up to ****1/2 on it. It's behind only MitB as my favorite match they had. They just threw everything they had at each other....I don't understand why that match didn't main event WrestleMania. We could have gotten Punk/Taker this year and Taker could have faced Lesnar or The Rock at 29 or something. It's spectacular, those guys have such chemistry.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Marv95 said:


> Sorry but the Armageddon 3 Stages match was still much better than the Ryback/Cena one. That joke of a much can't compare.


Ryback/Cena>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>HBK/HHH

Both are garbage though, at least the Cena one had that bossy leap onto the lumberjacks


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I've never even seen Ryback Vs Cena. I guess I'll get to it in about 10 years when I decide to do 2013 Rambles .


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Ryback/Cena>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>HBK/HHH
> 
> Both are garbage though, at least the Cena one had that bossy leap onto the lumberjacks


Bossy? :lol I can think of more appropiate wording


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Ryback/Cena was far better than HHH/HBK. Bless Cena's soul for taking that leap of faith. The second fall was not bad either.

:lmao at that Armageddon 2002 review. KillaCal does it again.

Punk/Brodus was fun for the four minutes it got. DAT PUNK SHUCK AND JIVE. And the post match promo was quality. Make sure to rewatch Punk/Vince, Evan. That fight was one of Vince's best.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Bossy? :lol I can think of more appropiate wording


I thought it was cool, or are you just making fun of my diction? 

But I think I had Cena/Ryback at **1/2 and HBK/HHH at *1/2


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> I thought it was cool, or are you just making fun of my diction
> 
> But I think I had Cena/Ryback at **1/2 and HBK/HHH at *1/2


Na mate, i thought it was a rather retarded spot


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

2 out of 3 falls/3 stages of hell matches should just end completely. Have we ever had a really good one aside from Flair/Steamboat? Can't think of any off the top of my head lol.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Sheamus/Bryan, brother .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Callamus said:


> 2 out of 3 falls/3 stages of hell matches should just end completely. Have we ever had a really good one aside from Flair/Steamboat? Can't think of any off the top of my head lol.


are you including 2/3 falls with 3SOH? If so: BRYAN/SHEAMUS :mark:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Na mate, i thought it was a rather retarded spot



Here in the States we prefer the phrase "mentally challenged" to "retarded" Zep. It's more politically correct. I think you meant to say that spot was mentally challenged.  And it absolutely was. But yea I'd take Cena/Ryback over HHH/HBK for 3 Stages of Hell. Come to think of it, the Austin/Trips match is the only 3SOH gimmick match I enjoy. But that one is absolutely bad ass, especially that second fall :mark:

If we are just talking 2/3 Falls matches, then Bryan/Sheamus and Flair/Steamboat definitely take the cake.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Callamus said:


> 2 out of 3 falls/3 stages of hell matches should just end completely. Have we ever had a really good one aside from Flair/Steamboat? Can't think of any off the top of my head lol.


Think ill be the only fucker in this thread to say but bollocks - Trips/Austin 

Fuck the haters


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Evan Stays Trippy said:


> Sheamus/Bryan, brother .


Oh yeah . My mind is terrible when it comes to recentish stuff. Anything from the last 5 years is still kind of a blur... but shit from the 80's is clear as day :lmao.

So that's 2 .


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Think ill be the only fucker in this thread to say but bollocks - Trips/Austin
> 
> Fuck the haters



Yep, fuck the haters that match is a classic IMHO. Absolute war, 45 minutes that feels like 20 because of the pace they cut through the first 2 falls. Non stop action. Never understood the hate that one gets, I know there is some flawed logic in it but hell, the action more than makes up for it.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Callamus said:


> Oh yeah . My mind is terrible when it comes to recentish stuff. Anything from the last 5 years is still kind of a blur... but shit from the 80's is clear as day :lmao.
> 
> So that's 2 .


You mean 3? Arrrrrrrrrrrggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhh. :cuss:



Edit: Thanks Jack!!!!


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Oh yea, I got one more that Cal hates but I love:

Jericho vs Benoit from Summerslam 2000 2/3 Falls 

That match kicks ass as well, and is worked in a very sensible way.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Damn, so only 2 good 2/3 falls or 3soh matches.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Callamus said:


> Damn, so only 2 good 2/3 falls or 3soh matches.


:cuss::cuss::cuss:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

No love for any of Flair's other 2/3 Falls classics?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> No love for any of Flair's other 2/3 Falls classics?


Didn't Steamer/Flair have an earlier 2/3 Falls match too? i wanna say late 70's but it could well have been 80's


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well, onto SummerSlam 2002 2morrow :mark:. Then I need to decide if I'm gonna continue with 2003. Need to download almost the entire year since I only own 4 PPV's, and 2 are RR and WM which I've already done .

EDIT: I can't think of any other Flair 2/3 falls matches lol. Fairly certain there are a ton of tag matches in the 2/3 falls category too but buggered if I can remember any of them aside from Redge Vs Bangle which I probably won't enjoy much since I didn't like their NM match much this time around .


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

You guys are talking about 2 out of 3 falls and not mentioning the ABSOLUTE CLASSIC Kofi Kingston vs Dolph Ziggler Part 319579315797915 match from two years ago on Raw?

:ziggler1


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

lol at the 3SOH review a few pages back. Need to watch that match just to see how bad/funny it is. The part about setting up the table match in second fall sure is strange and does make the match more predictable :lol


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

My last wrestling watch. One of my favorite ever matches, certainly up there with the best of WCW, love it.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> You guys are talking about 2 out of 3 falls and not mentioning the ABSOLUTE CLASSIC Kofi Kingston vs Dolph Ziggler Part 319579315797915 match from two years ago on Raw?
> 
> :ziggler1


Bah, HHH/Orton 3SOH was better than that.

:HHH2 rton2


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

DDP Vs Sting is :mark:. Their Nitro 98 match is pretty similar and almost as good but not quite. 2 of like... 3 good Sting matches that he had after 96 (Vs REGAL) to today  (the other being against BOBBY ROOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOO OOOOOOOOODE one time).


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I also have Sting/Angle (BFG 2007) in high regard too


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Oddly enough I don't .


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> I watched the Punk/Cena Raw match a few days ago, and I went all the way up to ****1/2 on it. It's behind only MitB as my favorite match they had. They just threw everything they had at each other....I don't understand why that match didn't main event WrestleMania. We could have gotten Punk/Taker this year and Taker could have faced Lesnar or The Rock at 29 or something. It's spectacular, those guys have such chemistry.


I also just watched Punk/Cena just yesterday and went up to ****1/2 on it, with Punk/Taker dropping to ****1/4. The former is just Punk and Cena doing everything they can to get to Wrestlemania. It's not so much about bad guys or good guys, but "Whatever I have to do to get that title shot, I'll do it." Both guys told that story super well. 

Punk/Taker is still terrific, with Punk and Heyman heeling it up like only they can. Punk doing the old school once, going for it again, but Taker countering it. Then Punk doing the "Taker cover", then the throat slash. Another great moment when Taker sits up while he's in the Anaconda Vice, and the facial expressions from both him and Punk are just gold.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Ive only watched Taker/Punk once  I just wanna wait 'till i get the DVD before i watch it again...


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

I definitely need to rewatch punk/Taker as well. I refuse to pay double digits for that joke of a WM though (WORST since WM 11 IMO) . So I'm hoping to borrow it from a friend just to rewatch punk/Taker only.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

Evan Stays Trippy said:


> So last night I was fucking WRECKED and I decided to watch the "Pipebonb Part II" promo at the beginning of the year between Punk & Rock. Looking back on it from this perspective, that's a REALLY underrated segment. All of the Punk/Rock segments are really, one of my favorite feuds that never paid off in the ring, Rock is like the ONLY guy who could get me that worked up when Punk lost the title and that's..... SOMETHING.


Definitely agree here. The Rock/Punk feud, from a build up alone standpoint, was terrific. Those two were great together. Other than the obvious January 7th promo, one that really stands out to me was the one from the night after the Rumble. 

The little things they did in that promo were great, and made it seem like there was some legitimate heat between the two. That's something I know Punk strives to achieve in every big-time feud he's in. One specific part is when the Rock finishes his promo, Punk just walks off the stage, and you can see Rock mouthing "Walk away like a little punk-ass bitch." Their chemistry was awesome.

This is the promo I'm talking about. WWE shortened it unfortunately.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So, pretty sure I'm gonna do a 2004 PPV project after my 2005 project. Downloading all of the PPVS ATM but I'll see if I can get the RAW and SD shows too. 

How was that year on PPV?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

xdoomsayerx said:


> I definitely need to rewatch punk/Taker as well. * I refuse to pay double digits for that joke of a WM though (WORST since WM 11 IMO) .* So I'm hoping to borrow it from a friend just to rewatch punk/Taker only.


12
13
15
16
20 maybe

all worst than mania 29 IMO


Almost done with FL 00


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> So, pretty sure I'm gonna do a 2004 PPV project after my 2005 project. Downloading all of the PPVS ATM but I'll see if I can get the RAW and SD shows too.
> 
> How was that year on PPV?



Benoit held the WHC for around 6 months, Eddie held the WWE title for around 4. You got two GOAT Main Event contenders at WM 20 and Judgement Day, you got Foley making a comeback and delivering a 5-star caliber blood bath with Orton, plus Shelton Benjamin was on fire for a part of the year. Christian, Chris Jericho, JBL's fabulous heel run, 2004 might be the best all around year in company history.

So yea, I'd say your in good shape


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

SKINS25 said:


> 12
> 13
> 15
> 16
> ...


No way in hell is WM20 worse than WM29. You mentioned that yet forgot the shitty WM27?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Wrestlinfan35 said:


>


**insert clap smiley** Love Punk here, and indeed in the entire Punk/Rock feud.........just a shame about the matches.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Benoit carried Sting to an awesome match on Nitro in 1999 too. Most certainly worth a watch. People say that Goldberg/Sting is good too, but I hated it. Very boring.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> No way in hell is WM20 worse than WM29. You mentioned that yet forgot the shitty WM27?


Thing with 20 is outside of hbk/hhh/benoit and evolution/rock&sock ( One of this match biggest supporters) there really isnt much on it. Maybe for the lolz brock/goldberg, not that high on christian/jerchio


27 had cody/rey, the best hhh/taker (No debates pls :lol), the best orton/punk and edge/adr


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Benoit carried Sting to an awesome match on Nitro in 1999 too. Most certainly worth a watch. People say that Goldberg/Sting is good too, but I hated it. Very boring.


The Sept '98 match? Thought that was great personally, i do wish they could have got a better program together on PPV.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Clint Eastwood said:


> The Sept '98 match? Thought that was great personally, i do wish they could have got a better program together on PPV.


While going through 1998 this past weekend, I've started to warm up to some of Goldberg's squashes. He definitely does his job well. However, his PPV matches for whatever reason are so boring, and he is so bad at showing any sort of vulnerability. When Goldberg plays to his strengths and crushes people in 3 minutes or less, he's very good. But these "lengthier" matches are just too much for me. Once again though, I'm respecting him a bit more and I don't hate him anymore.

MVP of 1998 has to be Chris Jericho. Nobody was a better in-ring/mic combination ever in the history of wrestling than Jericho in 1998. :lmao at him freaking out when he thought he killed Juventud Guerrera.

EDIT: 



If you guys want some entertainment, go watch this.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

SKINS25 said:


> Thing with 20 is outside of hbk/hhh/benoit and evolution/rock&sock ( One of this match biggest supporters) there really isnt much on it. Maybe for the lolz brock/goldberg, not that high on christian/jerchio
> 
> 
> 27 had cody/rey, the best hhh/taker (No debates pls :lol), the best orton/punk and edge/adr


Wrestlemania XX had arguably the greatest triple threat match of all time with Benoit/HBK/HHH so therefore it gets a pass from me. While 27 had some solid matches with Cody/Rey, Punk/Orton, and Edge/ADR, it also had that shitstain match of Lawler/Cole, Bryan/Sheamus being bumped to the pre-show, and a really lackluster main event. I think XX and 27 are equal, but I'll give bonus points to XX for the triple threat alone.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit/HBK/HHH alone is better than all of WM29 combined, no hyperbole. I could do away with all of WM29 (even Punk/Taker), but that one match? Never!


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Rewatching the WM 21 main event. :lmao at Batista's pyro not going off so it looks like he's just gyrating randomly. Flair yelling at Chioda :lol

I get why people don't like this. It's pretty dry, but I kind of like Trips working on Dave's back, and the selling is okay. Crowd's not really feeling most of this though. Too bad, since the build to this was damn near flawless. 

Also, Raw chamber match from NWO 2008 is pretty fun. Recommend it. Same goes for NWO 2009 Smackdown chamber. Beginning of the 2009 is pretty dry, but the second half is awesome.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Just watched the recent Ziggler/ADR match. 

I'd give it ***3/4 as I felt it was a fun match with great back and forth action. Dolph and Del Rio have some great chemistry together.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

I'd fairly easily put WM20>WM29, although I'd put Taker/Punk comfortably above the Benoit/HBK/HHH (although I'm certain I'm the only one that thinks that as I think I have the lowest rating on this forum for the triple threat, and the highest rating for Taker/Punk).

But WM20 has more better matches. Both events interestingly enough feature two of the worst Brock mathes ever, if not THE worst. And while I do have Brock/HHH higher than Brock/Goldberg, the latter at least had a fun crowd during the match.

I'm not crazy about the Raw chamber from 08, but the Raw chamber from 09 is :mark: It's the second or third best chamber match ever imo


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

WrestleMania 20 is easily better than WrestleMania 29:

WrestleMania 20:

Christian/Jericho - ****
Rock and Sock/Evolution - ***3/4
Eddie/Angle - ***1/2
Benoit/HHH/HBK - *****

WrestleMania 29:

The Shield/Orton/Sheamus/Show - ***1/2
Undertaker/CM Punk - ****
Triple H/Lesnar - ***1/2
Rock/Cena - *



The Sandrone said:


> I'd fairly easily put WM20>WM29, although I'd put Taker/Punk comfortably above the Benoit/HBK/HHH (although I'm certain I'm the only one that thinks that as I think I have the lowest rating on this forum for the triple threat, and the highest rating for Taker/Punk).


Probably. Punk/Taker wasn't even that great and there's quite a few streak matches I'd put over it.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

SKINS25 said:


> 12
> 13
> 15
> 16
> ...




I disagree, nothing and I mean NOTHING memorable happened at WM 29. That's what mania is all about. Creating memorable moments that'll last forever. 

13 had Austin/Hart which was better than anything and way more memorable than all of 29. 

15 had the first every WM battle between Austin and Rock. 2 GOATS. 

16 had the epic tag team TLC match

20? Lmao no fuckin way. 20 had Christian/Jericho, the epic Undertaker returning to the deadman, The Rock and Foley reuniting, and one of the greatest matches of all time. Beniot/HHH/HBK. 

29 just felt so damn flat. Nothing came out of it that people raved about. NOTHING. 

27 > 29 btw. 

HHH/Taker 
Rhodes/Mysterio 
Orton/Punk 
Edge/Del Rio 

All solid matches ^ 29 honesty only had Punk/Taker. Hell even the shield match was disappointing IMO


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

:lmao to all that say that WM 27 is better than 29, MOTN is ***3/4 at WM 27, with the next two matches being ***1/2 and ***

29 was fine, people we're just butthurt about the main event being bad,


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Only streak match I'd put above Taker/Punk is Taker/HBK WM25. Taker/Punk has almost everything I could want in a match. Well paced action, excellent psychology, a good touch of storytelling, a very very hot, split crowd, awesome moments, and a great near-fall. Only thing it was missing IMO was a great streak-ending near-fall. It also doesn't have the star-power of the last several, but that doesn't matter much as it blows the two HHh matches out of the water, and beats out other top-notch streak matches with Edge, Batista, Orton and Kane (WM14).

WM29 as a whole was awful though. Only WM27 I'd maybe put below it. WM27's best match Taker/HHH (I have ***1/2) followed closely by Punk/Orton, Edge/Del Rio and Rey/Cody. WM29's second best match is a the Shield match (***1/4) followed by maybe ADR/Swagger (**1/2 range), but also has two awful matches in Henry/Ryback and Brock/HHH. Rock/Cena also wasn't anything good. Then again, WM27 has a worse main event and arguably the worst match of all time in Cole/Lawler. 

So overall, I'd say WM29 wins as it has a must-see match (IMO), while WM27 doesn't.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Stop talking about Wrestlemania again (except for Jericho/Christian). Talk about how fun this match is:


----------



## hag (Aug 9, 2013)

Guys go check out the Overrated/Underated Wrestlemania Matches Thread in the WWEPPV section. Some interesting opinions.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> :lmao to all that say that WM 27 is better than 29, MOTN is ***3/4 at WM 27, with the next two matches being ***1/2 and ***
> 
> 29 was fine, people we're just butthurt about the main event being bad,




It wasn't only the main event. The world title match was an absolute joke too. Swagger/Del Rio? :lmao 

Punk/Taker: ****
Swagger/Del Rio: **1/4
Henry/Ryback: *
Jericho/Fandango: **
Shield/Sheamus/Orton/Show: ***
Hell no/Ziggler/Langston: ***1/4
Rock/Cena: **

HHH/Taker: ****1/4
Punk/Orton: ***3/4
Rhodes/Mysterio: ***3/4
Del Rio/Edge: ***1/2
Cena/Miz: *

The rest is shit. Both manias weren't memorable, but match quality I'd take 27 over 29 any day of the week


----------



## Marv95 (Mar 9, 2011)

Lol at anyone saying XX is on par with 27 and worse than 29.
-Christian vs Jericho with a nice swerve
-Cena(like him or not) winning his first singles title
-Arguably the best handicapped match ever featuring the return of Rock and Sock
-The best triple threat match ever with DAT ENDING
-The return of the Phenom
-Eddie vs Kurt
-Even the crowd for Brock/Goldberg

How dare anyone compares those pieces of crap 27 and 29 to freaking Wrestlemania 20. Outside of maybe 24 there hasn't been a Wrestlemania as good as 20 since then. And don't give me the "match quality" shtick since anyone with some knowledge of pro wrestling knows it's not the _only_ thing that's important.
-


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Taker/Punk had a awful feud going into it, and I couldn't buy for one second that Punk would end the streak (unlike previous wrestlers who challenged the streak) and there wasn't any streak-ending near-fall like you mentioned (unlike previous streak matches). All these things affected the match for me and prevent it from being one of the great streak matches, and when I say great I mean *****1/4+* territory. Punk/Taker was just a ****** match for me, very good match, but not great.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Callamus said:


> 2 of like... 3 good Sting matches that he had after 96---


NO.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Benoit carried Sting---


NO.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

smitty915 said:


> :lmao to all that say that WM 27 is better than 29, MOTN is ***3/4 at WM 27, with the next two matches being ***1/2 and ***


If 27 has a ***3/4, ***1/2 and *** match then it's better than 29 :draper2


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Its called opinions people 


Not saying mania is 17,19,24 level or that mania 27 wasn't shitty and I was speaking mostly from a match quality standpoint

@Smitty you have to mention that those ratings are YOURS for 27, most probably have different ratings (not trying to start another hhh/taker, how bad was mania 27 debate)


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

haribo said:


> If 27 has a ***3/4, ***1/2 and *** match then it's better than 29 :draper2


NAH 
WM 29
Shield/ Show/Orton/Sheamus: ***3/4 
Henry/Ryback: **
Swagger/Del Rio: **1/2 
Ziggler-Langston/Hell no: ***1/4 
Jericho/Fandango: **1/2
Punk/taker: ****1/2 
Brock/trips: ***1/4
Cena/Rock: * 

WM 27
Edge/ADR: **1/2
Rhodes/Rey: ***1/2 
Punk/Orton: ***
Taker/HHH: ***3/4 
Cole/Lawler: DUD 
JOMO/Trish/snooki vs Ziggler/laycool: *
Cena/Miz: * 

Both were bad, but WM 27 is like the 4th worst mania ever behind 2,9, and 11


BTW: All in our own opinions folks, just friendly discussion


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I've softened up on WM29 after a re-watch, but it's still _such_ a flat event. Oh, and Hell No vs. Ziggy Langston should've been so much better. As in a lot more :bryan3 vs. :ziggler2


----------



## BGLWrestlingGod (Apr 25, 2007)

Watched SummerSlam 2013 on Blu-ray yesterday, and was surprised at how much more I enjoyed it. I thought it was a good event live, but I appreciated it even more the second time around.

*Kane vs. Bray Wyatt*
This is more of a segment than an actual match to get Kane off of TV. Kane pretty much whoops Wyatt's butt, the suspense is of Rowan and Harper trying to get into the ring. When they finally do, it becomes more of a handicap match, Kane almost fights them off, and then is outnumbered. Not a good match at all, but a solid segment to start the show.

*3/4

*Cody Rhodes vs. Damien Sandow*
Nice little sprint. These guys get in a lot in under 7 minutes. The action is good and there are some nice nearfalls. Five more minutes would have been nice, though.

***

*World Heavyweight Championship: ALberto Del Rio vs. Christian*
Wow do these two have great chemistry. I remember their singles matches from 2011, the ladder match, and even the cage match. Hell, the match they had on SD a week before this one was great. Their matches are just crisp, intense, realistic, and exciting. For a 12-minute match, this was a worthy junior main event.

***3/4

*Natalya vs. Brie Bella*
It was a divas match. Nothing happens. Nothing ever does. It wasn't terrible, I suppose.

*1/2

*No Disqualification Match: CM Punk vs. Brock Lesnar*
This match just gets better every time I see it. Such an amazing contrast of styles, yet such fantastic chemistry. Punk being on Lesnar like a dog, Lesnar being able to swipe him away and then just decimate him, the weapons spots, Heyman's interference, the nearfalls. If they never have another match again, then we can say their one and only encounter was indeed a masterpiece.

****1/2

*Dolph Ziggler & Kaitlyn vs. Big E Langston & AJ*
This belonged on RAW, but it was entertaining for what it was.

**

*WWE Championship: John Cena vs. Daniel Bryan*
This is a good match. I think some people are over-rating it a bit, but to each his own. I think this match is so technical at times, it's kind of hard to feel any emotions from either guy. They have some nice exchanges and it's never boring, but I think this suffers from the same problem as Cena/Punk II at SummerSlam 2011 (also with Triple H as the guest ref): just as the match is getting good, it ends. The sudden-ness of the finish made it all the more a guarantee that Orton would cash in. I give them credit, though, for really playing up DB's win after, with the cheering, the pyro, taking all the time, only for Orton to come out so late. And the way they handled the finish was perfect. The change in HHH's expression really showed it all.

****

All in all, this is probably the best SS since 2009.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

Evan Stays Trippy said:


> I don't know any REALLY great Edge singles bouts where he isn't getting a ton of help from a better opponent such as *ORTON* in his prime, Benoit, Taker, Guerrero,* Cena, Hardy*, etc.


None of those are better than Edge in the ring.At all.

Edge's top single matches on top of my mind( i'll name 2002+ since that's when i started watching) :

vs Angle ( pick any match from 2002,Backlash, JD, late SD, all of them at least ****, the backlash match should have happened at WM18 where they could have stolen the show)
vs Orton Vengeance/RAW
vs Benoit from 2005 and mid 2007
vs Eddie 2002
vs Jeff JD 09
vs Cena SummerSlam
vs Taker WM and JD(screwy finish but very good match)
vs HHH, heel vs heel in 05
vs Morrison 2009
vs Rey mid 2009
vs Christian RAW 2010


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I hate to belittle someones opinion but thinking Edge is much better than cena,hardy,orton is :ti


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

SKINS25 said:


> I hate to belittle someones opinion but thinking Edge is much better than cena,hardy,orton is :ti




What's laughable is thinking hardy and Orton are more talented than edge :lmao


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

That's actually a very good list of non-gimmick Edge singles matches. I would add the Punk Smackdown 2008 match as well. There's also an RVD match.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

xdoomsayerx said:


> What's laughable is thinking hardy and Orton are more talented than edge :lmao


unk2

Randy Orton throughout his career is more talented in every category a wrestler could have than Edge

Only thing Edge had over jeff was on the mic, and some of his face stuff is as cookie cutter as can be


Edit: @ the edge single list provide on the last pg, your missing most if not all the matches with Matt Hardy


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Edge is better on the mic than Orton but that's about it. He's maybe a better gimmick match wrestler too. But when it comes to their best matches, Orton is easily better. Many of Edge's best matches are TLC stuff that are multi-men matches.

The best non-singles matches from Orton are probably some Evolution tags, otherwise, he's always been a singles wrestler and very consistent until he started working slow.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> That's actually a very good list of non-gimmick Edge singles matches. I would add the Punk Smackdown 2008 match as well. There's also an RVD match.


I loved the RVD match,marked out when Edge did the powerbomb to the outside jumping from inside the ring



SKINS25 said:


> unk2Randy Orton throughout his career is more talented in every categorize a wrestler could posses than Edge
> 
> Only thing Edge had over jeff was on the mic, and some of his face stuff is as cookie cutter as can be
> 
> ...


I think you and I see things way too differently cause Edge easily tops Orton in wrestling skills ( almost all aspects even) and mic skills and charisma.

edit : Edge showed more skills in the ring with his series with Angle than Orton ever did. Do you realize how rare is it(in WWE) for a 6'5 man to be doing diving spining wheelkicks? diving missile dropkicks or diving crossbody's to the outside or diving spears? How many suplex variations he showed ? counters and submissions? intelligence? telling a story? how much quicker and more agile he was than Orton ever's been? Edge was a workhorse in 2002 , kinda like Morrison was in 2009


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

:lmao

I swear to God this threads favourite match is without a doubt Taker/HHH Mania 27. If not that then Taker/HHH Mania 28. Every time I go away for a couple days I come back and this is what's being discussed.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah, no Edge doesn't compare to Orton in the ring, especially in Ortons prime( ironically the beginning of his career. Can't really think of any Edge singles match that touches Orton/Foley at BL 04. 

I will give you mic skills and charisma, Edge was great at that.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Yeah, no Edge doesn't compare to Orton in the ring, especially in Ortons prime( ironically the beginning of his career. Can't really think of any Edge singles match that touches Orton/Foley at BL 04.
> 
> I will give you mic skills and charisma, Edge was great at that.




Edge/Taker at WM and HIAC is on par if not better v IMO. His hardcore match with Foley was great as well.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Yeah, no Edge doesn't compare to Orton in the ring, especially in Ortons prime( ironically the beginning of his career. Can't really think of any Edge singles match that touches Orton/Foley at BL 04.
> 
> I will give you mic skills and charisma, Edge was great at that.






xdoomsayerx said:


> Edge/Taker at WM and HIAC is on par if not better v IMO. His hardcore match with Foley was great as well.


if we're naming gimmick matches now , the best LMS match of all times vs Cena, and the ladder match vs Jeff gets a mention as well..and the one I'd easily rank above it is Edge vs Eddie NO DQ from smackdown


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Cena/Edge and Edge/Hardy were not that good. Both are perfect example of forced epics.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

etrbaby said:


> edit : *Edge showed more skills in the ring with his series with Angle than Orton ever did*. Do you realize how rare is it(in WWE) for a 6'5 man to be doing diving spining wheelkicks? diving missile dropkicks or diving crossbody's to the outside or diving spears? How many suplex variations he showed ? counters and submissions? intelligence? telling a story? how much quicker and more agile he was than Orton ever's been? Edge was a workhorse in 2002 , kinda like Morrison was in 2009


Orton's series with Benoit were better than any non-gimmick Edge matches I've seen. Don't get me wrong, the Angle matches are great, but yeah, I easily take some of Orton's series. He also had a better series with Undertaker.

If you try to talk about athleticism, it's a no contest for Orton. He has the best crossbody ever (even better than Steamboat) and one of the greatest dropkicks ever. In his rookie days, he would also do outside dives and he's even taller than Edge iirc.

As for the rest, Orton has excelled at all of them. He has never been a submission wrestler but busted out several variations of submission holds throughout his career.

Edge vs Cena is not even the best LMS match either guy have been a part of. Edge has the Benoit match and Cena has Umaga, both of which are far superior.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Edge vs Orton, their HIAC vs Undertaker & Hardcore match with Foley. Whose are better overall? :hmm:


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

Lol cant believe I used to love Cena V Edge LMS.

Its such a contrived spot fest with fuck all flow.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

haribo said:


> Edge vs Orton, their HIAC vs Undertaker & Hardcore match with Foley. Whose are better overall? :hmm:


You might think I'm biased, but I'd take Orton for both. All four are great matches and the race between the HIACs are closer. Edge/Taker HIAC is excellent but kinda feels like a spotfest at times with the use of ladders and the chokeslam through the tables. Orton/Taker, on the other hand, is like a genuine war between the two as they beat the fuck out of each other for nearly 30 minutes. The use of blood does help it, though. (Orton/Taker is a top 5 cell match to me and Edge/Taker is top 10)

For the hardcore matches, I find the Edge match to be a lite version of the Orton/Foley classic. Other than the final spot, I got the feeling of them trying to repeat the success from two years earlier to put Edge over before he would return into the main event scene.

Now I give Edge one thing, his WM match with Taker is probably better than Orton's.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> *Orton's series with Benoit were better than any non-gimmick Edge matches I've seen*. Don't get me wrong, the Angle matches are great, but yeah, I easily take some of Orton's series. *He also had a better series with Undertaker.*
> 
> If you try to talk about athleticism, it's a no contest for Orton. He has the best crossbody ever (even better than Steamboat) and one of the greatest dropkicks ever. In his rookie days, he would also do outside dives and he's even taller than Edge iirc.
> 
> ...


If you won't take my opinion, even the observer has Edge/Taker series higher, Edge/Angle similar to Benoit/Orton( with Edge and Angle pulling a ****1/2 the other was a ****1/4 at most) and no LMS was rated higher than Edge/Cena .

The best Orton/Benoit match was no holds bar IMO and I'd say it was on the same level as Angle/Edge, the rest were very good but don't touch what was done in the ring by Angle and Edge. 
I'm a complete mark for the Edge/Taker series so I won't comment on that.. and if you wana go to "who had a better series with who" , Edge had a better series an "average performer" Cena in 2006 than Orton with a more developed Cena in 09.

Also Umaga vs Cena was great, as was Edge/Benoit, I will say for what happened in the ring pretty similar level to Edge/Cena, but the fact Edge beat Cena, and ENDED the feud, the match gets a nod


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

:lmao at some one saying Edge/Cena LMS is "the best Last Man Standing match ever". What a joke, Edge's LMS match with Benoit at Backlash 2005 was far superior, and Cena's with Umaga at Royal Rumble was twice as good. I don't even know how else to respond to a statement like that, it's not even a top 10 Last Man Standing match, nor is it Top 10 in either guys respective careers. Contrived fuck fest is the best way to describe that match.

You're quoting the observer now? Meltzer thinks Punk/Rock RR and Punk/Jericho PB are both classics. Nuff said.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

etrbaby said:


> if we're naming gimmick matches now , the best LMS match of all times vs Cena,


:ti

Flair vs Triple H wants to know why it wasn't included in the fun, pretty mediocre match TBH, originally had it at **** but the rewatch brought it down to **1/2. Flair/Trips LMS is at ****1/2 and Foley/Orton is ****3/4 and is easily Ortons best match ever and if it wasn't for the HHH epics, it'd be #1 for Foley too. 

The HIAC match and the mania match vs taker are both ****1/2 IMO, probably best Edge match ever( haven't seen the cage vs hardy though). 

BTW- I'm no Orton mark, I generally think he's been shit for the most part since 07 or 08 par a few fun matches.


----------



## WrestlingOracle (Jul 6, 2013)

Watching Rebellion 2000 match between Taker and Benoit (a match which is decent but of course hampered by several factors including Undertaker getting back into but not quite in proper shape that year off injury and the fact that the match revolves soley around the knee injury instead of being a straight forward contest), Taker wins with a countered inside cradle. Has Taker in all his years won any other matches with such a move or small package or such? Can't recall any myself but in his deep catalogue I might be missing one.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Edge/Cena LMS>Edge/Benoit LMS... although Edge/Cena certainly ain't the best LMS though.

And on Edge/Orton in-ring, I'd say Edge's matches with Taker, Foley, Cena, and Batista were all better than Orton's matches with any of them. Generally, Edge has had better matches than Orton with people they both feuded with. Orton's done better than HBK and Benoit than Edge did imo, but the numbers would still favor Edge. Orton's definitely more athletic, though.

Mic wise, it's no contest. Edge blows Orton out of the water. As a heel? Edge again, but it's close. As a face? I'll give that one to Orton.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Holy shit Taker/Edge 24 is overrated as fuck. Every time I try to watch that match I fall asleep and that's not a joke. Maybe I should try watching it during the day some time. Even still, just bleh. I don't get the love.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

Cactus Jack said:


> :lmao at some one saying Edge/Cena LMS is "the best Last Man Standing match ever". What a joke, Edge's LMS match with Benoit at Backlash 2005 was far superior, and Cena's with Umaga at Royal Rumble was twice as good. I don't even know how else to respond to a statement like that, it's not even a top 10 Last Man Standing match, nor is it Top 10 in either guys respective careers. Contrived fuck fest is the best way to describe that match.
> 
> You're quoting the observer now? Meltzer thinks Punk/Rock RR and Punk/Jericho PB are both classics. Nuff said.


Cena and Edge fought for nearly 30min, the crowd was chanting "Lets go Cena.. Lets Go Edge" instead of the usual lets fo cena .. Cena sucks..
Remember Edge's promo the SD before that match, he "hated" John Cena, and it really showed, they did everything possible to just win and end the war, if it was a spot-fest IYO , it was a great spot-fest at that and justified


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----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

etrbaby said:


> Cena and Edge fought for nearly 30min, the crowd was chanting "Lets go Cena.. Lets Go Edge" instead of the usual lets fo cena .. Cena sucks..
> Remember Edge's promo the SD before that match, he "hated" John Cena, and it really showed, they did everything possible to just win and end the war, if it was a spot-fest IYO , it was a great spot-fest at that and justified
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


fpalm 

I try to respect peoples opinion, but your making it quite difficult


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

:mark: I'm feeling the CHRISTMASY SPIRIT now with my new name. FUCK EVERYONE AND FUCK CHRISTMAS! WOOO!

Might get started on SummerSlam 2002 tonight, just for the hell of it.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

My ratings for Edge + Orton against taker. 

ORTON 

WM : ***3/4 
SS: ****
HIAC: ***3/4
Casket: ***1/2

EDGE

WM : ****1/2
HIAC: ****1/2
TLC: ***1/2
BL: ***1/4

Kinda even IMO but edge gets the nod. BTW Edges 02 work is very good. Extremely underrated IMO


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Sandrone said:


> Edge/Cena LMS>Edge/Benoit LMS... although Edge/Cena certainly ain't the best LMS though.



Best Last Man Standing Matches (in my humble opinion)

1. Jericho vs Trips ****3/4
2. Flair vs Trips ****1/2
3. Foley vs The Rock ****1/2
4. Taker vs Batista ****1/2
5. Edge vs Benoit ****1/2


Right after that would be the Trips/Orton one from 2007 and Cena/Umaga Royal Rumble. Both are epic.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> fpalm
> 
> I try to respect peoples opinion, but your making it quite difficult


Aren't you people who usually care much more about the story than what really happens during a match? 
What could be a more epic story than the good guy bad guy final battle, going all in? You had great moves before the objects started coming in, then great spots and then an all out brawl .



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----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> :mark: I'm feeling the CHRISTMASY SPIRIT now with my new name. FUCK EVERYONE AND FUCK CHRISTMAS! WOOO!
> 
> Might get started on SummerSlam 2002 tonight, just for the hell of it.


HEY CAL those Freemantle fuckers are having a sale that lasts for another hour and 10 minutes if you feel like giving them any money. It's just DVD but they hinted at a blu ray sale closer to Xmas. Just thought I'd tell you that in case you didn't already know, in the spirit of Christmas Cunt and all that.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

SANTA GAME said:


> Holy shit Taker/Edge 24 is overrated as fuck. Every time I try to watch that match I fall asleep and that's not a joke. *Maybe I should try watching it during the day some time. Even still, just bleh. I don't get the love.*


Orrrrr...... :ziggler2 :delrio


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

SANTA GAME said:


> HEY CAL those Freemantle fuckers are having a sale that lasts for another hour and 10 minutes if you feel like giving them any money. It's just DVD but they hinted at a blu ray sale closer to Xmas. Just thought I'd tell you that in case you didn't already know, in the spirit of Christmas Cunt and all that.


Already bought the Live in the UK April 2013 DVD, came yesterday . Disappointed that they had no Blurays this time around, but given the "sale" prices for 3 disc DVD sets I probably wouldn't pay for a fucking Bluray still, even in the sale. I do think I need the November 2012 Live in the UK DVD still though, so I might make another order while it's still "cheap".


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Only really enjoy Edge/taker at SS and WM, found the JD and BL matches to be pretty boring TBH, but I will go as far as saying that taker is Edges best opponent. I'd also put both Orton/Taker matches at SS and WM behind Taker/edge. But i'd say Edge/Taker=Orton/taker, because I enjoy ALL of the Orton/taker matches.



etrbaby said:


> Aren't you people who usually care much more about the story than what really happens during a match?
> What could be a more epic story than the good guy bad guy final battle, going all in? You had great moves before the objects started coming in, then great spots and then an all out brawl .
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


No, this thread is for a complete package, the Cena/edge build was decent at best and was outplayed by the good Trips/Orton build.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

I thought Taker/Edge at WM XXIV was great, I gave it ****1/4. I'd even go as far as to say that it's one of the more underrated ones in terms of Streak matches.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

SKINS25 said:


> Orrrrr...... :ziggler2 :delrio


:HHH2



CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Already bought the Live in the UK April 2013 DVD, came yesterday . Disappointed that they had no Blurays this time around, but given the "sale" prices for 3 disc DVD sets I probably wouldn't pay for a fucking Bluray still, even in the sale. I do think I need the November 2012 Live in the UK DVD still though, so I might make another order while it's still "cheap".


I think they'll have a blyray sale heading into Christmas. They basically said as much on twitter so they better. I'm not buying anything from them until they do.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Damn these Christmas names. I got a rep from SANTA GAME and for a moment I was thinking ''who is that?'' then I realized it was Starbuck. And I now remember you had that name last year too. 



xdoomsayerx said:


> BTW Edges 02 work is very good. Extremely underrated IMO


This. More people need to give his 2002 stuff a watch, especially those who think Edge sucks. His tag work with Mysterio, matches with Eddie and Kurt Angle, very good and consistent that year.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

There's no un-enjoyable Taker/Orton match in their 05 series, where Taker/Edge has TLC which, while I don't think is bad, is not up to snuff with the rest of their series and not a match I'm particularly fond of watching. JD is great, though the ending sucks. BL was great as well. Their cell match is incredible though. Hasn't been a better one since (of course the next year they started the HIAC PPV crap, so nothing's ever really had a chance except Taker/HHH). And their WM match is just a flat-out awesome main event.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Nostalgia said:


> Damn these Christmas names. I got a rep from SANTA GAME and for a moment I was thinking ''who is that?'' then I realized it was Starbuck. And I now remember you had that name last year too.
> 
> 
> 
> This. More people need to give his 2002 stuff a watch, especially those who think Edge sucks. His tag work with Mysterio, matches with Eddie and Kurt Angle, very good and consistent that year.


That whole 2002 Smackdown Six! :mark:


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

CHRISTMAS names for all...well, all mods I suppose.

And I saw talk of LMS matches yet nobody said Cena/Umaga. That's bad shit because Cena/Umaga > most things tbh.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I think I'm at the point where I consider Edge below average.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

etrbaby said:


> If you won't take my opinion, even the observer has Edge/Taker series higher, Edge/Angle similar to Benoit/Orton( with Edge and Angle pulling a ****1/2 the other was a ****1/4 at most) and no LMS was rated higher than Edge/Cena .
> 
> The best Orton/Benoit match was no holds bar IMO and I'd say it was on the same level as Angle/Edge, the rest were very good but don't touch what was done in the ring by Angle and Edge.
> I'm a complete mark for the Edge/Taker series so I won't comment on that.. and if you wana go to "who had a better series with who" , Edge had a better series an "average performer" Cena in 2006 than Orton with a more developed Cena in 09.
> ...


I don't really care about the observer's opinion. I have my own and if I'm discussing it with somebody, I want _their_ reason for why it's better and not just using Meltzer as their source.

Benoit/Orton's best match is a tie between NHB and their other Smackdown match from that same month. (#7 in the Best of Seven series when Orton replaced Booker) Both were excellent and more memorable than any Angle/Edge matches I can think of. I'd say the same for SummerSlam and the Raw rematch too.

Cena/Edge in 2006 is probably better than Cena/Orton in 2009 but Edge was in his peak and Orton was regressing slowly. If we take their best matches and put them together, Orton/Cena No Way Out > any Edge/Cena match. I had the TLC rated highly before but on last rewatch, it went down quite a bit and felt contrived.

The match ending doesn't determine quality for me. Just because Edge won the blowoff after Big Show interfered, doesn't mean the match wasn't dull as fuck from what I remember. Cena/Umaga is an all out war with Cena's rib injury being a focal point and a great case of "fighting champion" while Edge/Benoit is great ring work mixed with the gimmick.



WrestlingOracle said:


> Watching Rebellion 2000 match between Taker and Benoit (a match which is decent but of course hampered by several factors including Undertaker getting back into but not quite in proper shape that year off injury and the fact that the match revolves soley around the knee injury instead of being a straight forward contest), Taker wins with a countered inside cradle. Has Taker in all his years won any other matches with such a move or small package or such? Can't recall any myself but in his deep catalogue I might be missing one.


Yeah, Benoit and Taker should have had a WM classic. If there's one thing I could change about booking decisions of the past, it would be this. Now that you mention it, I really don't recall Taker ever winning any match with a roll-up other than this. Pretty odd.



etrbaby said:


> Cena and Edge fought for nearly 30min, the crowd was chanting "Lets go Cena.. Lets Go Edge" instead of the usual lets fo cena .. Cena sucks..
> Remember Edge's promo the SD before that match, he "hated" John Cena, and it really showed, they did everything possible to just win and end the war, if it was a spot-fest IYO , it was a great spot-fest at that and justified


If a promo or build-up makes the match great, then HHH/Orton from WM25 is a classic. And dual chants for both wrestlers doesn't really mean anything. Orton also had the crowd chanting for him at HIAC 2009. Hell, even Shelton got "Let's go Shelton" chants against Cena in 2005.



> And I saw talk of LMS matches yet nobody said Cena/Umaga. That's bad shit because Cena/Umaga > most things tbh.


Erm... I specifically mentioned that it's better than Cena/Edge!


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

SANTA GAME said:


> And I saw talk of LMS matches yet nobody said Cena/Umaga. That's bad shit because Cena/Umaga > most things tbh.


Cena/Umaga is the best Last Man Standing match. It told a great story, it made Umaga look like a complete beast and Cena look like a legitimate underdog, which is something that doesn't happen as often lol.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I fucking love the Edge/Cena LMS, tbh. Have it at ****1/2 but it doesn't break my top 3 of Umaga/Cena, Jericho/Trips and Orton/Trips. Flair/Trips is up there too.

Oddly enough I didn't care for the story of Cena/Edge at all but I consider it one of the more entertaining matches I watch. That show itself is great.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

I'm gona give it another watch tomorrow 

This could be the only place where I've seen Edge/Cena not get called a classic.. It really makes me doubt if this match has been too analyzed or not even seen.. I've watched the match 3 times, talked to people that I know have seen the match, read many reviews for the backlash DVD (on amazon..ect) and almost everyone who's seen the match calls it a classic LMS match  


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----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

I remember thinking Edge/Cena LMS was really fun to watch, especially the ending with Big Show almost killing Cena with the chokeslam. That part was hilarious :lol

Anyway, I think their TLC match is way better than their LMS match.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Choke2Death said:


> Erm... I specifically mentioned that it's better than Cena/Edge!


Whoops. 

But yes, Cena/Umaga isn't talked about enough imo. I think I'd have it as the best LMS and it's one of my favourite matches ever too which doesn't hurt. *****3/*4 all the way.

Cena AA'ing Edge into the fans in their LMS is :mark: however. Great spot.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Everybody in here go check out me and ATF card in the history draft, love to have your vote, got a GOAT match going on there


I cant believe I use to love edge/cena LMS as well, watched it last month and it is horrid


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Best LMS Matches:

1) Cena/Umaga RR07 (****1/2)
2) Jericho/HHH FL00 (****1/4)
3) Taker/Show CS08 (****)
4) Edge/Cena BL 09 (****)
5) Taker/Batista BL 07 (***3/4)

Cena/Umaga wouldn't just be the best Last Man Standing match, but it's the best Cena match in my books.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

etrbaby said:


> I'm gona give it another watch tomorrow
> 
> This could be the only place where I've seen Edge/Cena not get called a classic.. It really makes me doubt if this match has been too analyzed or not even seen.. I've watched the match 3 times, talked to people that I know have seen the match, read many reviews for the backlash DVD (on amazon..ect) and almost everyone who's seen the match calls it a classic LMS match
> 
> ...


This thread has a very different perspective on what most people call good matches

All the Bret/HBK matches suck
Benoit/Angle have MEH chemistry 
Edge is overrated
Angle is overrated( for the most part)
John Cena is pretty good in the ring

Not everyone agrees, but a lot of the regulars here think this. I personally dont mind Angle but thats just me. And Edge/cena is still garbage


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

:lol. It's best you learn that in this thread pretty much everybody except Undertaker, Eddie Guerrero and Stone Cold is overrated and every match that doesn't involve one of them is overrated too lol.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

This forum (especially the "reviewers" on here) made me watch and rate PPVs etc as well. Think I'll start with 1996, I guess I'll go in chronological order. I kinda stopped watching it after the Benoit murder/suicide so when I started watching RAW/Smackdown a month ago or so, I didn't know at least 75% of the roster. 

Oh yeah, what's the CAL score?


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Holy fuck I forgot about Taker/Show.

My top 5:

Umaga/Cena - *****
Jericho/Trips - ****1/2
Orton/Trips - ****1/2
Edge/Cena - ****1/2
Show/Taker - ****1/4

LMS is probably my favorite gimmick match.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> This thread has a very different perspective on what most people call good matches
> 
> All the Bret/HBK matches suck
> Benoit/Angle have MEH chemistry
> ...


Lol good to know...
-HBK/Hart might be a bit overrated but as sure as fuck "don't suck" 
-As a team Benoit and Angle were very good, and their RR match was a epic ^^
-The only 2 wrestlers I'd rank without argument above Angle for ring skills are Liger and Benoit 
-Edge is not overrated.

Well I agree about Cena being prettr good in the ring..

And nope Edge/Cena still tore down the house  




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----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

DoubtGin said:


> This forum (especially the "reviewers" on here) made me watch and rate PPVs etc as well. Think I'll start with 1996, I guess I'll go in chronological order. I kinda stopped watching it after the Benoit murder/suicide so when I started watching RAW/Smackdown a month ago or so, I didn't know at least 75% of the roster.
> 
> Oh yeah, what's the CAL score?


Dear god we need to sticky this 



Spoiler: CAL SCALE



The Cal Scale

NO = -1
DUD-* = 0
*1/4-** = 0.5
**1/4-**3/4 = 1
***-***1/4 = 2
***1/2 = 3
***3/4 = 4
**** = 5
****1/4 = 6
****1/2 = 7
****3/4 = 8
***** = 9



just a way to rate PPVS


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

cool thanks


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

SANTA GAME said:


> :lol. It's best you learn that in this thread pretty much everybody except Undertaker, Eddie Guerrero and Stone Cold is overrated and every match that doesn't involve one of them is overrated too lol.


:hbk1 and :flair3


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

SANTA GAME said:


> :lol. It's best you learn that pretty much everybody except Undertaker, Eddie Guerrero and Stone Cold is overrated and every match that doesn't involve one of them is overrated too.


Sounds about right.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

JOLLY ST. SKINolaus said:


> :hbk1 and :flair3


I guess :flair3 but :hbk1 has his detractors for sure. Not to the extent of some others who get shit on all the time but he isn't universally loved like the other 3.

:taker :eddie :austin :flair3 :brock

^^^^ Seem to be the untouchables in here. Don't fuck with dem boys.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

We almost never talk about Austin though :lol


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Actually come to think of it, is Austin really one of the "untouchables" in this thread? Not sure as I really don't notice his name around these parts much.

Edit: Yeah, what smitty said.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit is also well liked in here. Which is refreshing for a change.  Same goes for Mysterio.

Best LMS matches:

1. Cena/Umaga
2. Jericho/HHH
3. Orton/HHH (NM)
4. Taker/Batista
5. Flair/HHH
6. Edge/Benoit
7. Orton/HHH (Raw)
8. Taker/Show
9. Cena/Batista
10. HBK/Jericho or Cena/Del Rio


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I would replace :austin with rey, love that guy and most do TBH


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

I'd add Benoit's name into the list of untouchables in this thread. Everyone praises Benoit matches and rightfully so.

Edit: C2D beat me to it.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

What, you're telling me all the Austin discussions are lost in the Orton sucks no he doesn't yes he really does what is your MOTY HHH/Taker Wrestlemania yay or nay CM PUNK let's talk about obscure match inserted here no I want to talk about Cena/Lesnar again UNDERTAKER anybody watch WCW lately I think HHH is shit hey do we like Cena again Undertaker is the real Mr Wrestlemania discussions? I never would have guessed. I don't think I've ever seen a bad word said about old Stone Cold. Maybe I should switch him for Foley then. Do we have a Foley smiley? 

:foley

Guess not...


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Untouchables of this thread:

:taker :brock :flair2














:eddie

DA GOATS!

Orton gets shitted on nowadays, but rton2 is heavily praised for the most part. I'm talking LEGEND KILLER of course!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Status quo ironies about the dip in this thread aren't funny.

Might as well talk about Fit Finlay just to compensate.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Chris Jericho Vs Dean Malenko - Uncensored 15/03/1998

Tony explains to use why Malenko is called the Iceman... because he shows no emotion and you can’t break his concentration and whatnot. Funny, I thought he was called that because he murders people and freezes them for a few years before dumping the bodies, making it impossible to get a correct time of death and making it even harder to pin the murder on him. Or maybe I’m watching way too many documentaries on this shit... .

Malenko out wrestles and out smarts Jericho in the early going, trying to prove that he is the man of 1000 holds, and Jericho can only dream of having 1004. Jericho gets really pissed off and walks out, before finally making his way back to the ring with a clearer mind and is able to take down Malenko. Despite doing a good job of taking Malenko down and getting some near falls, Jericho is too cocky and perhaps costs himself the win on a number of occasions by doing lazy pins or taunting Dean beforehand.

The so called Iceman gets in a great hope spot showing plenty of emotion, even if it was the emotion of hate. He hits a big flurry of shots and a huge back suplex, but he has taken too much of a beating to really follow up on it, and Jericho is quickly back in control. 

Some really cool counter sequences towards the end, and I think Jericho botches that springboard back elbow that he does to people on the apron... instead of just kinda jumps off the ropes and slaps Malenko lol.

It seems that Jericho spends most of the match trying to prove that he knows more moves than Malenko, but Malenko does a fantastic job of coming up with numerous counters to most of what Jericho tries to execute. Unfortunately in the end Jericho is able to lock in the Walls of Jericho/Lion Tamer and Malenko can’t get to the ropes and is forced to tap out.

Good stuff. Jericho was great as the cocky cunty little heel, while Malenko showed that he CAN have emotion, and he had great heart by not giving up until the very end, and constantly coming up with counters to show that he IS as great of a wrestler as he says he is.

Also, 2 matches I have watched from Uncensored 98, and both matches have included some of my favourites, who were nothing more than undercard guys for the NWO, getting around 15 minutes of time to give us great matches. I have some hope for the late 90’s WCW PPV undercards!

Rating: ***3/4


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

You like that match WAYYYY more than I. Sloppiness & pacing took me out of it. Still think it's solid, but nothing I'm going to put over much. I like about ten more Booker T matches than it at this point.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Are there untouchables when it comes to the current active roster?

If there is, I think it'd be Daniel Bryan, Antonio Cesaro, and Sami Zayn (he may not count since he's in NXT but fuck it he's awesome).


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I like that Uncensored match. lol'd @ the ending when Malenko sold the loss as devastating and then he got interviewed afterwards. :lol "THIS MAN HAS NEVER SHOWN ANY EMOTION BEFORE!"


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> You like that match WAYYYY more than I. Sloppiness & pacing took me out of it. Still think it's solid, but nothing I'm going to put over much. []b]I like about ten more Booker T matches than it at this point.[/b]


YOU TAKE THAT BACK!!!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'VE BEEN A BOOKER FAN FOR A LONG TIME THANKS TO HIS AWESOME TV CHAMPIONSHIP STINT. NOPE.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

pls no generalizing in here. We get more than enough of that in all the other threads. :argh:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Starting Unforgiven 05 now, doubt the review will be uo until tomorrow, anything good on there besides Edge/Hardy?


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

Who's the most hated in this thread?

Its Miz and Kurt Angle right?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I think all of the Angle vs. Cena matches from 05 were mediocre, but it's Angle so it's still worth watching  :usangle


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> Starting Unforgiven 05 now, doubt the review will be uo until tomorrow, anything good on there besides Edge/Hardy?


Masters vs Michaels.

Show vs Snitsky.

Shelton vs KERWIN.

Flair being awesome suffices for something good too. Not the match, just Flair being Flair for the over-under.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> Starting Unforgiven 05 now, doubt the review will be uo until tomorrow, anything good on there besides Edge/Hardy?


HBK/Masters is good and the main event is decent enough despite the finish.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Oh, forgot about HBK vs. Masters. Nothing like a face turn for HBK right after SummerSlam :lol


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Michaels only needed to be a heel to beef up that Hogan match, brother.

both of those matches _(vs Masters & Hogan)_ are actually really good & almost get no praise. I don't remember if Shawn throws awful punches in 'em though. Masters match is great b/c Masters dominated to avoid the fact. Masters owns.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Shouldn't matter who is liked and disliked by others in this thread, if you like someone dont let others change your opinions, that is when you become a sheep


Cody I checked out that taker/rvd vengeance match you pimp, didnt like it that much, I mean thought it was ok, not a huge fan of the "brawl all around the arena" type matches unless its bret/scsa or hbk/bret svs 97, idk rvd just doesn't do it for me, I always get this choreographed feeling watching him wrestle


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

I'm just watching In Your House 6 and oh god I know shit about that year.

Jake Roberts vs Tatanka (5:36) was quite boring, imo. A *1/2 maybe. But given that it wasn't in the actual ppv, I'm sure the rest will get better. What are the highlights? (again, I'm quite the newbie when it comes to anything besides the most-known classics and in Germany, I couldn't watch the shows most of the time and grew up with the video games). 

First real match is about to start, I love the crowd.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Michaels only needed to be a heel to beef up that Hogan match, brother.
> 
> both of those matches _(vs Masters & Hogan)_ are actually really good & almost get no praise. I don't remember if Shawn throws awful punches in 'em though. Masters match is great b/c Masters dominated to avoid the fact. Masters owns.


I thought that the feud could've worked as face vs. face. Then again, we wouldn't have gotten those AWESOME Michaels heel promos :hbk2

I like both matches too, despite Shawn's overselling in the SSlam match. DEM POLITICS. :vince3


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

the Big Show v. Snitsky is totally awesome and I am not being ironic.

Has it already been a year since I unleashed the All Japan Christmas banner onto the world? Might bring it back if I still have it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

JOLLY ST. SKINolaus said:


> Cody I checked out that taker/rvd vengeance match you pimp, didnt like it that much, I mean thought it was ok, not a huge fan of the "brawl all around the arena" type matches unless its bret/scsa or hbk/bret svs 97, idk rvd just doesn't do it for me, I always get this choreographed feeling watching him wrestle


I'd say the Survivor Series '97 match in question is a perfect example of forced or "choreographed" brawling more than Undertaker vs RVD. Which I consider to be an absolute blast.



PGSucks said:


> I thought that the feud could've worked as face vs. face. Then again, we wouldn't have gotten those AWESOME Michaels heel promos :hbk2
> 
> I like both matches too, despite Shawn's overselling in the SSlam match. DEM POLITICS. :vince3


The whole feud should have been who cuts the more insane coked out promos.



Yeah1993 said:


> the Big Show v. Snitsky is totally awesome and I am not being ironic.
> 
> Has it already been a year since I unleashed the All Japan Christmas banner onto the world? Might bring it back if I still have it.


I need Hashimoto & Tenryu showing the JOY~!


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

TENRYU~!


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

still looking for that brusier b/hanson vs. tenryu/murdoch match Naitch said was GOAT


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

If there was a 90s New Japan one of those painted thingys that'd be cool. Well, it'd have Chono and Mutoh on there so I would probably cover them with giant candy canes or snowflakes. Tenryu went everywhere in the 90s so I'd have to find a WAR one or something. Or there could be an 80s All Japan one with Jumbo and Yatsu and......Tom McGhee. Bitches love Tom McGhee.



JOLLY ST. SKINolaus said:


> still looking for that brusier b/hanson vs. tenryu/murdoch match Naitch said was GOAT


Probably no tape of it. Never heard of it, where did he mention it?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Tenryu & Dick Murdoch tag team.

oh SHIT

-------

Was Tenryu not on the AJPW poster? Can't remember.

don't be dissing Muta though. FUCK


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

So many things to say:

Austin is most certainly not an untouchable. His stretch after his neck injury as the top face is mostly criticized when it comes to match quality, and rightfully so. All the cliches people say about Cena apply more to Austin during that time. Austin's 2001 redeemed himself though. :regal is a much better choice. Who can hate him?

I really like that Show/Taker LMS is getting respect. One of Undertaker's best babyface performances. I'm not the biggest fan of the way WWE does their LMS matches, and the best example of what I'm talking about comes in the form of Cena/Edge and HHH/HBK. Two matches where guys just take turns trading spots in order to make the match feel epic, which causes everything to drag. Compare that to Jericho/HHH where we have a defined structure of an underdog face fighting against the vicious heel.

Fit Finlay! Another untouchable. Shame that he has barely appeared in my 1998 watch. I wish somebody uploaded Thunder. I'm sure he has some gems there. Until then, Paramore fan go watch some of his 1996 Saturday Night squashes. Dude POTATOES fools.

Queen Starbuck's gross generalization actually made this thread sound very diverse :lol

Unforgiven 2005 was a one match show for me with a horrible main event. That one match though was the 2005 MOTY.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

JOLLY ST. SKINolaus said:


> still looking for that brusier b/hanson vs. tenryu/murdoch match Naitch said was GOAT



That was on the podcast, right? I've also heard Terry Funk pimp a Brody/Snuka tag match that he said was absolutely phenomenal, can't remember who their opponents were.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> That was on the podcast, right? I've also heard Terry Funk pimp a Brody/Snuka tag match that he said was absolutely phenomenal, can't remember who their opponents were.


Yea on the podcast, that tag team is :lenny


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Was Tenryu not on the AJPW poster? Can't remember.


Misawa/Kobashi/Kawada/Taue/Akiyama/Baba. Would have been 'set in' 1996-ish (Akiyama being on it instead of Jumbo or Kikuchi or Fuchi means it was more than likely past 95) when Tenryu was running WAR.



Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> don't be dissing Muta though. FUCK


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Finlay's squash of that random dude Lorenzo in 1998 might be the best one of 'em all.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

FINLAY!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> Misawa/Kobashi/Kawada/Taue/Akiyama/Baba. Would have been 'set in' 1996-ish (Akiyama being on it instead of Jumbo or Kikuchi or Fuchi means it was more than likely past 95) when Tenryu was running WAR.


Hashimoto wasn't on it either? Lordy, I failed there. I deserve that. Hashimoto wasn't AJPW. What in the hell is wrong with me? Hungover.





Yeah1993 said:


>


:leslie

--------

FINLAY. vs Regal with Dusty on commentary. That's what I imagine my afterlife elyisum to be like.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Billy Kidman (c) vs Juventud Guerrera for the WCW Cruiserweight Championship - WCW Monday Nitro (11/16/98*) *8.5-9/10*


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

That Kidman/Juvi match was glorious. One of the best Nitro matches ever. Those two always tore the house down. HOOT-AND-TOOT GUERRERA!

Not sure what my afterlife elysium would be. But it must include 1997 Shawn Michaels, 1998 Chris Jericho, and any year CM Punk battling it out in promos for eternity.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> That Kidman/Juvi match was glorious. One of the best Nitro matches ever. Those two always tore the house down. HOOT-AND-TOOT GUERRERA!
> 
> Not sure what my afterlife elysium would be. But it must include 1997 Shawn Michaels, 1998 Chris Jericho, and any year CM Punk battling it out in promos for eternity.




My afterlife elysium would definitely be a never ending Heel Eddie vs Rey match with JR and Heenan on commentary while Foley rolls around on thumbtacks outside the ring and Naitch talks about all his worldly possessions to Mean Gene Okerlund.:lenny


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Afterlife elysium sounds like a pretty cool concept.

A question to *funnyfaces*: Which year would you rather find yourself in? 2005 where you get great promos by Muhammad Hassan, great feuds like Taker/Orton and Batista/HHH with great matches from Benoit, Eddie, Rey, Shelton, Jericho, HBK and etc? Or 2013 where you get bad booking, 3 painful hours of TV every week and about five members of the roster in total worth watching?


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> A question to *funnyfaces*: Which year would you rather find yourself in? 2005 where you get great promos by Muhammad Hassan, great feuds like Taker/Orton and Batista/HHH with great matches from Benoit, Eddie, Rey, Shelton, Jericho, HBK and etc? Or 2013 where you get bad booking, 3 painful hours of TV every week and about five members of the roster in total worth watching?


Add Edge/Hardy feud plus Christian's general awesomeness that year with his Captain Charisma character to the many other reasons why 2005 was great in this quest of yours to make funnyfaces like the year 2005!


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I just witnessed a good Billy Kidman promo. What is life? And now a fan is attacking Kidman :lmao

As for that question C2D, first of all, let it be known that I have finally put 2005 above both 2008 and 2012. Now it just has the second half of 2011 and 2013 to get past. Let it be known that I did not like Batista/HHH that much. Buildup to Mania was awesome, but I did not like the post-Mania stuff. Felt that it dragged too long, and I never really saw what was so likable about Batista. I also did not really like some other big feuds from that year that everyone else loves (Cena/Jericho, Cena/JBL, Eddie/Rey). I also like the weekly matches from Bryan, Punk, Shield, Rhodes, Usos, Real Americans, Orton, Del Rio, Harper, and Sheamus over the 2005 weekly output of Benoit, Eddie, Rey, Shelton, HBK, Jericho, etc. Booking in 2005 wasn't that much better than 2013. Case in point, Muhammad Hassan and Christian . 2005 PPVs >>>> 2013 PPVs. I'll give you that. 2013 television sucked less than 2005 for me though. Especially that terrible second half of 2005.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Just watched the infamous match between Goldberg and Steven Regal on WCW for the first time. :mark: :mark: :mark:

Regal was awesome.

Btw, what is the reason he is so acclaimed on here? I really like him too, but I didn't expect that nearly the whole forum would back him up.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

DoubtGin said:


> Just watched the infamous match between Goldberg and Steven Regal on WCW for the first time. :mark: :mark: :mark:
> 
> Regal was awesome.
> 
> Btw, what is the reason he is so acclaimed on here? I really like him too, but I didn't expect that nearly the whole forum would back him up.



:regal

One of the best technicians ever, coming from someone not a fan of mat work


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Nostalgia said:


> Add Edge/Hardy feud plus Christian's general awesomeness that year with his Captain Charisma character to the many other reasons why 2005 was great in this quest of yours to make funnyfaces like the year 2005!


If I named everything about that year that I liked, I'd go on all day!



funnyfaces1 said:


> As for that question C2D, first of all, let it be known that I have finally put 2005 above both 2008 and 2012. Now it just has the second half of 2011 and 2013 to get past. Let it be known that I did not like Batista/HHH that much. Buildup to Mania was awesome, but I did not like the post-Mania stuff. Felt that it dragged too long, and I never really saw what was so likable about Batista. I also did not really like some other big feuds from that year that everyone else loves (Cena/Jericho, Cena/JBL, Eddie/Rey). I also like the weekly matches from Bryan, Punk, Shield, Rhodes, Usos, Real Americans, Orton, Del Rio, Harper, and Sheamus over the 2005 weekly output of Benoit, Eddie, Rey, Shelton, HBK, Jericho, etc. Booking in 2005 wasn't that much better than 2013. Case in point, Muhammad Hassan and Christian . 2005 PPVs >>>> 2013 PPVs. I'll give you that. 2013 television sucked less than 2005 for me though. Especially that terrible second half of 2005.


2008? That's like the one year from the pack that I could understand being ranked higher. But at least we're making progress! 

And the Mania build-up is what I was talking about in regards to Batista/HHH. That's Booking 101 on how to create a star. They had Batista show more of a backbone and confront HHH in those backstage segments then teased some interaction in the chamber match followed by the excellent face turn. (Batista saying he made his choice a long time ago and doing the thumbs-up/thumbs-down thing is a mark out moment :mark

Fair enough if you like the matches now more than then but maybe if you went through some more stuff from then, I'm sure you'd change your mind. Benoit/Regal on Velocity > any TV match this year (including Cena/Punk imo)

Bad booking was definitely in existence then but at least it was a lot less than now and we didn't get stupid shit like The Miz turning heel only to turn back face a week later or The Shield being built for months and beating super-teams only to lose to a team they had already beat on the B-show with nothing being made out of it later.

And the TV stuff is your opinion but I think if you went through them again, you'd maybe change your mind. There's so much awesome shit like that Flair promo before Taboo Tuesday (that alone makes Raw in late 2005 better than "suck").


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah, the booking this year is dreadful. But the quality among the constants is more than enough to make most look back at 2013 with some high praise. It's a one note point of praise, but oh well. Can't say I walked into 2013 expecting much good when they pushed The Rock to get a WWE Championship match to start.

I see nothing with preferring this year over 2005. And I dig 2005 a lot, but the workers killing it this year are honestly 100x more appealing to me. I'd want to put them over all the time too.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The ring work this year has been pretty good and consistent, but the fact that TV is still 3 hours making most shows painful to sit through without fast forwarding the shit stuff along with some of the horrible booking decisions just takes a lot of the fun out of it. Orton's heel turn and this whole 'corporation' storyline could have been much more, instead they randomly take Bryan out of it and Orton has the same act only as a "bad guy" and HHH's puppet who acts schizophrenic by saying one minute that he needs The Shield's help and then another minute being confident in himself and complaining about any outside help. PPVs have stupid non-finishes and there's so much inconsistency.

What stood out the most was Big Show's "character". For weeks he's crying non-stop and following orders because he's "broke", then suddenly weeks later he's coming out smiling and being all "Fire me, I don't care!" making the few weeks preceding it meaningless. All of that just for a PPV title match which he loses before eventually fading into the background.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Booking after Summerslam this year has just been nonsense, don't see where 2005 booking is anywhere close to being as bad.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

SaviorBeeRad™ said:


> Booking after Summerslam this year has just been nonsense, don't see where 2005 booking is anywhere close to being as bad.


:cena2's title reign


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

funnyfaces1 said:


> :cena2's title reign


The beginning of the SuperCena era is that much of a turnoff to you?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

SuperCena in 2005 was unbelievably strong so I can see where he's coming from. But still, it made sense at least. Mainly because they were trying to create their new top face to carry the company for the next several years.

That said, his booking is understandably irritating for some. He was always put in these situations where he's supposed to be the underdog but always had the upper-hand in the end. Or if he didn't, it was due to some serious underhanded tactics. His feud with Bischoff was also really forced. Then the Angle feud turned out bad because they did everything possible under the sun to get Angle booed and it just wasn't working.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Yeah, I just see it they made a star in Cena no matter how irritating it was for some people.. but this year they did the opposite and did all they could to not create a star in D Bry


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Wwe has failed so much at making new stars over the years it's mind boggling. 

Worst booked superstars over the last few years?

Ryback (I hate him, but I'll admit his booking is awful)

Dolph Zigger (The way he's being treated now is terrible. Crazy over and he's got a little HBK in him)

Sheamus (That character ughhhh)

Damien Sandow ( he constantly gets good heat, but they do nothing with him)

Alberto Del Rio ( most over pushed superstar in the last 20 year's. He's not even a big draw in the Latino market)


----------



## BeastBoy (Oct 23, 2013)

xdoomsayerx said:


> Wwe has failed so much at making new stars over the years it's mind boggling.
> 
> Worst booked superstars over the last few years?
> 
> ...


I'm a Latino. I like Del Rio as a wrestler but Latinos do NOT relate to millionaires like him (kayfabe speaking). Look at Eddie, he went mega-over with the Hispanic community because he was a realistic character that was adored by the U.S. population of Mexican descent. That charm somehow transcended to the white and black population in the United States. WWE ruined Dos Caras for giving him that horrible gimmick from the start. Had he stuck with the mask he would've been over at Mysterio levels pre-2006.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Watching the last Raw before Final Four 97. Rocky Maivia won the IC title in pretty cool fashion by playing dead but the match was pretty boring. lol @ HBK's "I lost my smile promo" with the fangirls crying. :lol


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

xdoomsayerx said:


> Wwe has failed so much at making new stars over the years it's mind boggling.
> 
> Worst booked superstars over the last few years?
> 
> ...


I agree with everything you say except the Sheamus aspect, I think Sheamus is perfect where he is at.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Can't have babyfaces smiling making jokes, remember.

apparently it's the biggest no-no around


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Can't have babyfaces smiling making jokes, remember.
> 
> apparently it's the biggest no-no around












John Boy does not approve of this


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cena & Sheamus need to take a dip in the pool of COKE and unleash some memorable promos that way.

40 BUMS


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Slamboree 98 is sex.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That's what I remember. Only a few more weeks of Nitro to go till I'm there. :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao How am I ahead of you already after three days?

There are three matches on this card that I can confidently say I love more than anyone.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

b/c of football. and other stuff. idk. Only watched two Nitro's yesterday.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Over the Limit 5/23/10

Thought I wasn’t going to watch more 2010!? Up your arse.

Drew McIntyre v. Kofi Kingston
Man the pyro left the smokey shit all over the arena. I could barely see what was going on (not really hyperbole hyperbole). I was going to start this by saying ‘holy smokes’ but I want people reading this to enjoy it at least a little so I decided against it. Unsurprisingly most of everything good about this came from McIntyre. He had his cool offenses and cut offs like the push into the ring post, the kick to the gut during Kofi’s attempt at a Vader bomb pin roll up whatever you call that, and I really appreciated him leaning forward to make Kofi’s punches look like they’d actually hurt a crippled kitten. Took some great bumps and sells as usual, including a superb trip back-sideways after eating one of those boots while trying to do a middle rope move (I am so good with move names). There was a dropkick or something where Drew wound up under the bottom turnbuckle too. Only thing Kofi did I gave a shit about was the neat Boom leg drop while McIntyre was on the bottom rope (some how…actually I don’t even know how that worked), and I forgot that 2010 was the pinnacle of WWE commentators using those shitty terms like ‘The Controlled Frenzy of Kingston!’ If I took a drink for every time I heard someone say ‘the aggressive nature of….’ On WWE TV between 2010 and 2011, I would have drunkenly gone to wherever they were and butchered them. Finish kind of came out of nowhere in a way I’m not sure I liked. Would have been better with the Jamaican Me Lose My Mind Up In Here Kick instead of the Jamaican Roll Up Flip Pin whatever that thingy is. NOT ADDING

Ted DiBiase Jr v. R-Truth
For fuck’s sake, who’s the deserved-to-be-castrated sadistic monkey prick who thought this was a good idea? Torture. Like, Jesus you two, you aren’t trainees practicing standard wrestling moves in your fifth pro match on a random carnival show. This a pay per view for the biggest wrestling company in the world. Do something to make it look like you have graduated wrestling school. I’m far from one of those ‘thinks he has all the answers’ smarks, but I think I could seriously show up untrained to a Snake Pit Wrestling show here in Adelaide and have a more entertaining match than these two had here. Says a lot about Killings since he had at least ten years of experience at this point, too. What is wrong with you? OK, real talk – what the hell is that corkscrew thing he does? Genuine question to which I would like an answer. Is it a forearm? An elbow? A crossbody? A headbutt? Normally I’d think someone flinging themselves randomly into an opponent is chaotic and badass, but, to me, for whatever reason I don’t even understand myself, this feels like it has 75% of the showiness of a Chris Daniels Triple Flip Moonsault Package McMoonsault Powerbomb. Honestly, the hell is that thing? NOT ADDING.

Rey Mysterio v. CM Punk 
Bizarre match, almost a ‘Spectacle Match’ to me. I’m not sure I can think of a similar match that went from ‘Opening’ to ‘Incident’ and then pretty much directly to a long finish stretch. Completely worked, though. Rey is hardly a guy to call ‘under-praised’, but I kind of think he doesn’t get proper dues for his basic striking offense. Maybe that’s because not many people actually give a shit if that looks good or not, but it can be a big addition or subtraction to me. Rey’s surprisingly tight with his punches, and I find myself thinking his kicks seem stiff in every match. This had a cool opening (that barricade spot where Punk started bleeding was disgusting when you actually realised what happened), but that barber chair spot is the money. I saw Punk getting ready to throw Rey out of the ring and I blew my load when he flew into that chair. #1 reason being I forgot it was even fucking there. Kind of like a watered down moment of the Kudo/Toyoda death match where I didn’t know the barbed wire ropes were explosive and on the first “BANG” I jumped a little and my eyeballs widened more and more until they were touching by overlapping my nose. Blood stoppage was interesting as shit. Felt like it was about the struggle of Rey Mysterio getting up from that hellacious bump on the chair, and the sufficient rest he got during the blood analysis got Punk pissed off enough to go ballistic on his arse and unleash five different big moves to make up for it. Rest of the match is basically a finish run. Had too much good things to remember, and basically all of the things they did wrong at Extreme Rules they did right here. All of Rey’s luchafliprana offense and armdrags were hit and sold gorgeously (even busting out a thing or two I don’t remember seeing before), and no weird interferences. The theme of Rey continuously getting Punk on 619 position was really great; especially when he couldn’t win with it and said ‘to hell with you ROLL UP’. I absolutely fucking hated deciding where to put this. I had it in mind for #1 but just didn’t think it was as good as the SmackDown match. Then I saw my #2 was Cena v. Batista and remembered the state of awe I was in while watching that (that I didn’t *really* have while watching this). So I have this at #3 right now……honestly that feels low. I could watch everything on the list again and think this is the best of the bunch. Forget it; this is #3. What the hell is wrong with me? ADDING.

The Hart Dynasty v. Chris Jericho/The Miz
I was dreading this but it was totally OK - maybe close to ‘good’, even. There’s not a whole lot I want to mention because it wasn’t much special, but I thought it was going to be a lot more average and interest-killing than it was. Is this the point in 2010 where the Miz gets at least somewhat interesting? Because I thought he looked really good throwing clubs and kicks, and he looked to bust his arse on the bumping. Definitely the best guy in this. OK I have to mention how I kind of really don’t like people falling in the wrong direction for things. Kidd gets Jericho in the ‘you stay fucking there’ scissor kick position and dropkicked the side of his face, and Jericho falls backward. Why not turn opposite to the direction you were kicked? Minor complaint? Well it’s pretty fucking stupid when you look at it happen, but I guess I don’t HATE it. Whatever. Finish for this was real cool with the Miz’s crappy corner clothesline thing being caught with a bearhug for the Hart Attack. I’m tempted to say this is the best PPV match Jericho or the Miz have had in 2010 so far. I guess except for that Chamber Jericho was in because the Undertaker was there to save it from being worthless. NOT ADDING.

Randy Orton v. Edge
I saw Edge had a match next and got into the fetal position. Then I saw his opponent was Orton. I will make no mention of what I did. But truth be told this wasn’t particularly bad. Worst parts were Orton’s crappy selling after the front suplex on the rail, and the commentating. Is there anything worse in wrestling than when Michael Cole starts running off about shit being ‘psychologically draining’ or how Orton’s a ‘mastermind’? He was literally doing simple stomps and clubs. The fuck is so ingenious about that? Did Orton seriously injure him arm stomping on the mat for the RKO? THAT’S what they decided to go with? The match may have not have really sucked but the last couple of minutes were just…weirdly bad. NOT ADDING.

Jack Swagger v. The Big Show
You have Swagger giving up and hitting great tackles after he stops foolishly trying to grapple with the giant (which Matt Striker thought was a good idea….um, he can just punch him in the face from there, dude), so naturally this was pretty fun. Swagger goes nuts trying to keep Show down with the vader bomb and everything else he has. I kind of forgot this was the world title match half of the time so it doesn’t feel as important as it should, but whatever, it was a fine time. Finish was rough though. A belt shot DQ tends to be frowned upon to begin with, but at least the belt shot usually looks likes it’s worth disqualifying someone for. This one was weak. NOT ADDING.

Eve Torres v. Maryse 
Eve wins with a move I will call a ‘Clitoris Piledriver’. NOT ADDING.

John Cena v. Batista
I thought this was a potentially really good match ruined by a bad gimmick. I think I’m come to realise I kind of don’t like I Quit matches at all. The ‘say it’/’do you quit?’ stuff can kind of break up the action, and it feels lousy when, after going through hell, the wrestler answering says ‘no’ in what sounds lie his normal voice. On the surface this had big moments that felt big and not convoluted, a solid story to it, and perfectly serviceable moments of drama. What I’m trying to say is it wasn’t Cena or Batista’s fault that the match wasn’t terribly good. If it was another last man standing for example, I bet they would have had a match on par with the Etxreme Rules epic. As long as they left that comical car spot out. Holy shit that was terrible, and Batista looked ridiculous in that Wiggle-Mobile. This wasn’t much, but I probably liked it as much as the I Quit match Cena had with JBL in 2005. NOT ADDING.

Current list:



Spoiler: WHATTUP?



1.	Rey Mysterio v. CM Punk (SmackDown 2/12/10)
2.	John Cena v. Batista (Extreme Rules 4/25/10)
3.	Rey Mysterio v. CM Punk (Over the Limit 5/23/10)
4.	Christian v. Drew McIntyre (SmackDown 7/16/10)
5.	Christian v. Ezekiel Jackson (Royal Rumble 1/31/10)
6.	Christian/Kane v. William Regal/Ezekiel Jackson (ECW 1/26/10)
7.	Shawn Michaels v. The Undertaker (WrestleMania 3/28/10)
8.	William Regal v. Evan Bourne (SuperStars 3/4/10)
9.	Rey Mysterio v. CM Punk (Extreme Rules 4/29/10)
10.	The Undertaker v. Rey Mysterio (Royal Rumble 1/31/10)
11.	Drew McIntyre v. Kaval (SmackDown 9/10/10)
12.	Rey Mysterio v. CM Punk (WrestleMania 3/28/10)
13.	d
14.	d
15.	d
16.	d
17.	d
18.	d
19.	d
20.	d
21.	d
22.	d
23.	d
24.	d
25.	d

Other contenders:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

> If I took a drink for every time I heard someone say ‘the aggressive nature of….’ On WWE TV between 2010 and 2011, I would have drunkenly gone to wherever they were and butchered them


^^why I love you. ****. Circle jerk. The whole she-bang. It's uttered too much during 2012 & 2013, btw.

Show is pretty bad pardon Punker vs Mysterio. Show vs Swagger was fun & I like the tag. Rest, no thanks. McIntyre. :hayley2


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

http://www.wwedvd.co.uk/cyber-monday-c-262.html?osCsid=35ecb048b46449242eea01d581f0c770

So they added Blurays to this sale.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Does anybody know if the Shield TLC match from TLC is on the Best of 2012 PPV set? Nowhere seems to have the blu ray content listed for some reason.

EDIT - I'm an idiot. It's on the best of 2013 set. Duh.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

LOL @ thinking a 2012 match would be on the 2012 set instead of the 2013 set. The fuck you been smoking? 8*D


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

I got confused OK. Fuck off brick. 

Don't know whether to get the best of 2012 now. There's like 3 matches on it that I want to own. Don't really see anything else I want off there either tbh. Bleh. Shitty sale. I still refuse to pay anything more than 10 for Mania 29 so I won't be getting that for a while. Hopefully they'll have a sale after Xmas with more than 5 titles up for grabs.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man (Feb 8, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Watching the last Raw before Final Four 97. Rocky Maivia won the IC title in pretty cool fashion by playing dead but the match was pretty boring. lol @ HBK's "I lost my smile promo" with the fangirls crying. :lol


I'm a couple weeks from WM. Man, is it me or is it just like Austin is so far ahead of everyone else character and mic wise it looks ridiculous? Only person close to him is Shawn at this period IMO.

And Sid is a badass.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

SANTA GAME said:


> I got confused OK. Fuck off brick.
> 
> Don't know whether to get the best of 2012 now. There's like 3 matches on it that I want to own. Don't really see anything else I want off there either tbh. Bleh. Shitty sale. I still refuse to pay anything more than 10 for Mania 29 so I won't be getting that for a while. Hopefully they'll have a sale after Xmas with more than 5 titles up for grabs.


I want WM 29 Bluray and the best of Raw + SD 2012 Bluray... but I still refuse to pay Fremantle prices, even "sale" ones lol.


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

ive watched benoit/finlay from slamboree 1998. was good.


----------



## admiremyclone (Aug 7, 2007)

I just purchased Legends of Mid-South and Best of MSG Blu-rays in the sale from WWEDVD.CO.UK so i'm pretty excited 

Does anyone know where I can watch the recent "Off The Record" interviews with Jim Ross and Chris Jericho in full?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

4 matches in to SummerSlam 2002 and it's already exactly in the MIDDLE of 2002 PPV's on the CAL SCALE. 4 matches in and better than 7 2002 PPV's already :lmao. And it's likely to go into the top 3 after the next match alone :lmao. Tis holding up rather superbly so far :mark:.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

For those that would like it 

*Chris Benoit/Chris Jericho vs. Bubba Ray Dudley/D-Von Dudley vs. Matt Hardy/Jeff Hardy vs. Edge/Christian (TLC Match) (Smackdown 5/24/01)*

'TLC III'

Unedited/Unblurred:

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-m...iii-wwe-smackdown-5-24-01-a.html#post27035593


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Going through my monthly "Off Starz"

*Fully Loaded 00​*
*liked*
T&A vs. lita/hardyz
benoit/rock
snow/taz

*OK*
steel cage match
hhh/y2j
taker/angle

*Didnt Like*
eddie/saturn


- OK all in all good event, the 3 main events was the calling card, but the undercard was decent. I liked the opening tag, was pretty fun, Trish :lenny DAT ASS kept a smile on my face the whole time. I liked the 2 huge giants vs. the little guys, made it mesh well. 

I liked snow/taz pretty good and short, no harm done. Benoit/Rock was very good, benoit is just awesome isnt he ? Shane O mac :lmao kinda annoyed me but whatevs. Taker/Angle while I didnt think was great, was decent and wasnt that long to me. Not a fan of "brawl around the whole arena, and as I watch more and more taker matches from that era, that was a norm


Now about HHH/Y2J LMS, this is a funny match as I see alot of praise for it all the time. Well I don't think Ive ever said this before, but if it wasnt for HUNTER this match would of been so blah and I would have hopped on here and say this is by far the much OVERRATED match in HISTORY. First 10-15 is meh/was uninterested but the middle portion was done well, One of if not best HHH control segment in the middle portion, then towards the end it got spotty. So thank you hunter for make this decent


----------



## CZWRUBE (Nov 6, 2013)

admiremyclone said:


> I just purchased Legends of Mid-South and Best of MSG Blu-rays in the sale from WWEDVD.CO.UK so i'm pretty excited
> 
> Does anyone know where I can watch the recent "Off The Record" interviews with Jim Ross and Chris Jericho in full?


I need to pick up the Mid_south one, It looks pretty good.


----------



## admiremyclone (Aug 7, 2007)

CZWRUBE said:


> I need to pick up the Mid_south one, It looks pretty good.


It doesn't hurt that Jim Ross did new commentary on a bunch of matches.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Summerslam '02, that's a show I can't get enough of. One of the most entertaining cards all around.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Going through my monthly "Off Starz"
> 
> *Fully Loaded 00​*
> *liked*
> ...




It's funny how different people's opinions can be on the same match. I thought that was a career performance from Jericho, he absolutely made that contest a classic for me. Hunter was good as well, but Jericho was the star and managed to evoke all the emotion from me. His selling was just so friggin good. Oh well, sorry you didn't like it as much.

Benoit/Rock was just ridiculously good. I enjoy that match more than his famous WM 17 & 19 matches with Austin. Damn near perfect. Anyway, my matches of the year for 2000 were:

1. Foley vs Trips Street Fight Royal Rumble
2. Foley vs Trips Hell in a Cell No Way Out
3. Jericho vs Trips Last Man Standing Fully Loaded
4. Benoit vs The Rock Fully Loaded
5. The Rock vs Trips Backlash

Translation: Trips absolutely crushed it on PPV that year. I'm not a fan of his at all, but even I can't deny that fact. The match he had with Jericho on Raw in State College were Jericho initially won the title before the decision was changed is right up there with the other 5 I listed.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

My top 5 PPV matches for 2000:

Triple H Vs The Rock - ****1/2 - 7 (Backlash)
Triple H Vs Cactus Jack - ****1/2 - 7 (No Way Out)
Triple H Vs The Rock - ****1/2 - 7 (Judgment Day)
Triple H Vs Chris Jericho - ****3/4 - 8 (Fully Loaded)
Triple H Vs Cactus Jack - ****3/4 - 8 (Royal Rumble)

Meanwhile in 2002 he's in the bottom 4 PPV matches :lmao.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> Summerslam '02, that's a show I can't get enough of. One of the most entertaining cards all around.


This is how I feel when I watch SummerSlam 01 :agree:


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> My top 5 PPV matches for 2000:
> 
> Triple H Vs The Rock - ****1/2 - 7 (Backlash)
> Triple H Vs Cactus Jack - ****1/2 - 7 (No Way Out)
> ...


THE GAME


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

:berried:berried:berried:trips2:trips2:trips2

This guy is why Hero is gone Greg :cuss:


----------



## bigbuxxx (May 28, 2011)

Watched that Benoit vs Rock match a couple days ago when it was pimped. Thought it was good but nothing special. Pretty forgettable to me.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

bigbuxxx said:


> Watched that Benoit vs Rock match a couple days ago when it was pimped. Thought it was good but nothing special. Pretty forgettable to me.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

bigbuxxx said:


> Watched that Benoit vs Rock match a couple days ago when it was pimped. Thought it was good but nothing special. Pretty forgettable to me.


I watched it a few months ago and I can't remember much from it.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> :berried:berried:berried:trips2:trips2:trips2
> 
> This guy is why Hero is gone Greg :cuss:



I'm curious about that and I'd love to hear someone's, especially a Hero fans, opinion on the matter. Do you think Hero could have been successful in the WWE? I know he's a great worker I'm just wondering if anyone really thought that he would work out in the modern day WWE. I'm a guy that thinks every wrestler needs a look. Doesn't matter if he's fat, skinny, muscular, ripped, husky, whatever as long as he has a look that's unique to him. That's why Foley worked, Danielson, Punk, Stone Cold, Rocky, Taker, etc. All those guys had a unique look that made them memorable. Hero just never put his look together from what I saw in NXT. He just looked like Jesus with love handles, and I'm not sure that's a look that's bound for success.

I'm just disappointed I never got to see him on the main roster. After watching that classic with Regal from this year, I got so excited about his potential. But he seemed to just fizzle after that. I'm wondering what some people who follow Hero more closely than I did think about his potential. Did he have it and Haitch just buried him because that's what Haitch does to anyone who doesn't fit his mold? Or was he just a bad fit for the WWE, as Jim Ross said on his blog.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Cactus Jack said:


> I'm curious about that and I'd love to hear someone's, especially a Hero fans, opinion on the matter. Do you think Hero could have been successful in the WWE? I know he's a great worker I'm just wondering if anyone really thought that he would work out in the modern day WWE. I'm a guy that thinks every wrestler needs a look. Doesn't matter if he's fat, skinny, muscular, ripped, husky, whatever as long as he has a look that's unique to him. That's why Foley worked, Danielson, Punk, Stone Cold, Rocky, Taker, etc. All those guys had a unique look that made them memorable. Hero just never put his look together from what I saw in NXT. He just looked like Jesus with love handles, and I'm not sure that's a look that's bound for success.
> 
> I'm just disappointed I never got to see him on the main roster. After watching that classic with Regal from this year, I got so excited about his potential. But he seemed to just fizzle after that. I'm wondering what some people who follow Hero more closely than I did think about his potential. Did he have it and Haitch just buried him because that's what Haitch does to anyone who doesn't fit his mold? Or was he just a bad fit for the WWE, as Jim Ross said on his blog.


Well I'm gonna be blatantly honest & say yes he would be a great fit for the WWE & plus they never really gave him anything to do, he just floated around for a bit while they were pushing and using Big E & everyone but him essentially.

Hero has more talent then most the main roster has, but oh well he's back on the indies now having great matches again & as long as i get to see him wrestle I'm still a very happy Chris Hero fan.

I believe he was just buried by Triple H, but it is what it is sadly.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'll never understand this idea that Hero had a horrible look. The Jesus look is GOAT. Plus he's really good on the mic and his wrestling is worth millions of Lenny smileys. But enough of him.

Slamboree 1998:

Chris Benoit vs. Fit Finlay: ******
Lex Luger vs. Brian Adams: ***
Cruiserweight Battle Royal/Malenko vs. Jericho: *****1/2*
DDP vs. Raven: ****1/2*
Eddie Guerrero vs. Ultimo Dragon: ***3/4*
Goldberg vs. Saturn: *****
Eric Bischoff vs. Vince McMahon: *LOLWTF*
Randy Savage vs. Bret Hart: *****
Sting/Giant vs. Outsiders: ****

Man what a show.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

Cactus Jack said:


> I'm curious about that and I'd love to hear someone's, especially a Hero fans, opinion on the matter. Do you think Hero could have been successful in the WWE? I know he's a great worker I'm just wondering if anyone really thought that he would work out in the modern day WWE. I'm a guy that thinks every wrestler needs a look. Doesn't matter if he's fat, skinny, muscular, ripped, husky, whatever as long as he has a look that's unique to him. That's why Foley worked, Danielson, Punk, Stone Cold, Rocky, Taker, etc. All those guys had a unique look that made them memorable. Hero just never put his look together from what I saw in NXT. He just looked like Jesus with love handles, and I'm not sure that's a look that's bound for success.
> 
> I'm just disappointed I never got to see him on the main roster. After watching that classic with Regal from this year, I got so excited about his potential. But he seemed to just fizzle after that. I'm wondering what some people who follow Hero more closely than I did think about his potential. Did he have it and Haitch just buried him because that's what Haitch does to anyone who doesn't fit his mold? Or was he just a bad fit for the WWE, as Jim Ross said on his blog.


From what I read, he complained to a few co-workers that some were higher on the card but he was better than them and those coworkers told the managent.. That didn't go well with the management , add to that the fact they didn't have any plans for him he was let go.. 
That's the reason I heard, idk if you meant why he was not being pushed in the first place higher "than the guys he's better than"


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Unforgiven 2005 review

THE CHAMP IS HERE….BITCH! 

Match #1: Ric Flair vs Carlito *

Wow, the best ever vs someone who is complete garbage, not expect much from this because Flair was a little to old to carry someone to a good match, but maybe this will be a lot better than I expect. Interesting to see Flair open a show, he doesn’t do that much, even during his run in the 2000’s. I was shocked to find out that Flair had never been IC champ before this, thought during his 1992-1993 run he would have had that at some point, oh well, he got it here and deserved one last run with a title. Flair of course gets a huge pop because he is the best ever, and the WOO chants seem to be coming non-stop. Match does start a little slow but about 5 minutes in this starts to become a lot more fun. When Flair started taking control of the match instead of Carlito, it got good. Pretty sick spot with a drop kick by Carlito while Flair jumped off the top rope, even if it did look a little contrived. I loved the ending because every time Flair locks in that figure 4 I mark out a little inside. This was a fun opener, awesome feel good moment for Flair as he wins his final title ever. Awesome promo by him after the match too, loves the nature boy! When he brought the chicks out of the audience :lol. ***

*CAL SCALE: 2* 

*Match #2: Trish Stratus and Ashley Massaro vs Victoria and Torrie Wilson*

NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1 *

*Match #3: The Big Show vs Snitsky* 

This should be a fun big man match, where have these two been? Both of these guys haven’t been on PPV since like mania. I liked Big Shows first run with WWE, so I expect good stuff here. Snitsky has been forgotten by me ever since that terrible match with Kane at NYR, so hopefully this is a lot better. I had a ton of fun with this match, since its basically just two big men having an all-out brawl. Is this Snitsky’s best singles match? I honestly cannot think of one I would be able to put above it, guy was garbage 99% of the time. So I am glad this was kept pretty short, as any longer would have probably been too much. Funny how most of Shows best matches are relatively short. So good stuff here, nice to see Show go over after his burial to a fucking SUMO wrestler in what was the worst match yet. ***1/4

*CAL SCALE: 2

Match #4: Kerwin White vs Shelton Benjamin *

Who is this guy? OH MY GOD ITS CHAVO! What the fuck is this? Hopefully the match because its SHELTON. This is a strange gimmick, Its like a white geeky guy…except that Chavo is Hispanic, FUCK LOGIC I GUESS. Well we all know that this gimmick, he became Chavo again soon. Wow this match was pretty fun actually, wasn’t expecting much but it just shows how awesome Benjamin is. Love the fans chanting CHAVO SUCKS, and then king saying the fans are behind the times, that was pretty funny :lol. This worked perfectly fine as a filler match and I’m not a fan of Chavo most of the time, but he did well in this match, especially one SICK as fuck scissorkick, so cool Probably my least favorite of the three matches I have watched so far, but it was still relatively enjoyable. **3/4

*CAL SCALE: 1

Match 5: Matt Hardy vs Edge
*
HOLY SHIT I’M PUMPED FOR THIS!! Somehow I haven’t seen this but they had a 4 minute match at SS that was awesome, so a 20 minute steel cage match will be :mark:. wow, what a fucking match this was, I left me in awe of how incredible it was. At this point, it is #2 on my 2005 MOTY list. Rarely does a wrestling match cause me to put down whatever I’m doing and JUST watch the match, usually only stuff like Eddie/JBL and Taker/HBK can do that. Of course the story of this match was phenomenal, we all know that it might be the best storyline of 2005, but a #2 MOTY? I wasn’t expecting that AT ALL. Loved the ending so fucking much, as it fit the situation perfectly. The biggest legdrop I have EVER seen, it was so bad ass and was an awesome moment for Hardy, would say that this is his best singles match of all time, top 5 easily for edge, it was just a fucking clinic from the beginning to the end. ****1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 7
*
*Match #6: Lance Cade and Trevor Murdoch vs Hurricane and Rosey*

UGHH, is 2005 the worst year for tag matches ever? I just cannot bring myself to watch this, sorry. 

NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1 

Match #7: Chris Masters vs Shawn Michaels*

So I did go in to this expecting an incredible match, and I thought it did not live up to the hype. I thought it was pretty damn good don’t get me wrong, but was it 4 stars? No, but it was close. Liked the heel work by Masters( that pre match promo :lol), and as always HBK did great. I thought some parts in the middle neared becoming boring, but the ending was awesome, but why put HBK over? I’m pretty sure Masters needed the rub here, even if he won by cheating it would of helped him immensely. But maybe that would of made HBK look bad losing to a rookie IDK, I’m not a booker so what the fuck do I know? But yeah this was really good, borderline great, especially considering masters was so young. How did this guy become a jobber so soon? He had the look and was decent in the ring, thought he could have been a good star. ***3/4

*CAL SCALE: 4 ‘

Match #8: Kurt Angle vs John Cena *

Not expecting much here, as I’ve heard there 2005 outings pretty much all suck, though I thought their NWO match was decent(***), and I LOVE their 03 match, that one is great. Thought this was pretty shitty TBH, well at least the first 10-15 minutes of it were. The final 10 minutes were pretty good, but its hard to come back from that slow of a start. This did get way too much time, 25 minutes is way too long for this match, because its not even the first time we’ve seen it, it had happened multiple times by now. The exciting final part of this match was exciting mainly because their was a lot of cool near falls, not because the work put in by these guys was good, it wasn’t. Still, it’s hard to come back after that ATROCIUS first half, where it almost resembled the shittiness of Batista/JBL GAB. Thought the end stretch was a little too overbooked. They tried to do the Screwjob on Cena( they weren’t even I Montreal!), but with Bisch, yeah they didn’t really work too well. The end was kind of dumb too, another DQ victory? GAYYY! **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5 

FINAL CAL SCALE: 14.5 

CURRENT PPV MOTY: Batista vs Triple H( Vengeance) 

Current 2005 PPV rankings

1: Summerslam ( 24) 
2: Vengeance 
3: Wrestlemania 21( 19)
4: Royal Rumble (17)
5: Judgment day(17) 
6: ECW ONS(16) 
7: Unforgiven( 14.5)
7: Backlash(13.5)
9: New Year’s Revolution (9.5)
10: The bash ( 6.5)
11: No way out (4.5)

ALSO: I have all 2004 PPVS downloaded, and am DL all RAW and SD episodes from 2004 ATM, Considering I haven’t seen any TV stuff, Might as well watch the whole year. The only PPV I am not reviewing is WM 20, reviewed that like a few weeks ago. But the rest of the PPVS I haven’t done recently so I will be doing those 
*​


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I'll never understand this idea that Hero had a horrible look. The Jesus look is GOAT. Plus he's really good on the mic and his wrestling is worth millions of Lenny smileys. But enough of him.
> 
> Slamboree 1998:
> 
> ...



The problem is, you already have the Wyatt's and Danielson looking unkempt and shaggy, he needed to go a different direction to stand out. Just my opinion on the matter, I wish he had made the main roster and was given a shot. I've only seen 6 or 7 Hero matches, but I can already tell you I'd much rather watch him than Kofi, R Truth, Santino, or any of those other mid card bums. 

I think it's funny that management would get mad at him and Ziggler for saying they are better than guys above them on the card. Shawn Michaels got his mega push because he used to go to Vince back in the early 90's and complain about how much better he was than the guys getting pushed ahead if him, Bret did the same, Hunter did, Punk did the same, shit even Foley did the same when he was pissed about Marc fucking Mero making twice as much money as him. I would think that you'd want guys on the roster with confidence that are begging for a shot to prove their worth. But what do I know. Shame Hero got released before he even got a chance, although I think if he had worked harder on giving himself a better look he might still be with WWE. I can't imagine them cutting him so easily if he was looking chiseled and ripped.


----------



## Cleavage (Apr 19, 2005)

Does anyone have the promo between HHH/Foley before the Bad Blood 2003 show, the Raw i have cuts off as soon as Hunter makes his way to the ring  I can't find it anywhere.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Mrs Claus' Christmas Cleavage said:


> Does anyone have the promo between HHH/Foley before the Bad Blood 2003 show, the Raw i have cuts off as soon as Hunter makes his way to the ring  I can't find it anywhere.


Is this the one?


----------



## Cleavage (Apr 19, 2005)

that's the show i have


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

However, it cuts off when Foley walks down not Hunter. I do remember the old one I saw on youtube had the whole segment with Evolution beating down Foley and him still counting to three. (with JR going crazy!)

Watchwrestling only has up to 2002, otherwise that would've been a pretty good alternative. And that old site that had up to June 2003 is gone now.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Ladies and gentlemen, Damien Sandow just did a moonsault.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Eddie vs Saturn from Fully Loaded is kind of awesome. It's pretty balls to the wall, but that's what I liked about it. Plus the ending is like WOAH. Saturn actually won & got a championship. I'm pro-that. SATURN.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Ladies and gentlemen, Damien Sandow just did a moonsault.




What the fuck? Don't tell me they are turning him face? That's ridiculous, Sandow needs to be getting more vicious and aggressive in the ring, not doing fucking back flips and showing off. Please tell me it atleast made a LITTLE sense at the time? That's dissapointing, I've been yearning for him to show a mean streak so his ring work can match his wonderful character, he doesn't need to be Mr. McFlippy.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Oh it made perfect sense. At least more sense than that Wade Barrett promo :aries2

SATURN! The Booker/Martel/Saturn feud was pretty cool. And then Saturn had a good match with Goldberg. I'm also a huge proponent of his match against Jericho where the loser had to wear a dress. Oh, and Saturn/Raven. And every other Saturn match in that period except for the first Goldberg match. SATURN!


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

LADIES AND GENTLEMAN 

Oklahoma SUCKS 

:ti


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I don't know whether this is a case of Erick Rowan getting carried by better wrestlers or him genuinely improving by being around good workers a la Roman Reigns, but I was impressed by him there. That match was good.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I thought it went on a little too long, but I enjoyed it. 

Why do I always think that Bray's promos are gonna lead to some big swerve 

Would be kind of cool for Paige to debut as "sister Abigail"


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Another day, another great Shield match. It still hasn't been a year. Can anyone name a better team/trio of wrestlers than them in a one-year span? Anyone?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Best fandango match in wwe, no joke


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Nothing to even say about RAW. 

I will say this though: It would have made more sense to have had Trips turn heel on Bryan at Summerslam during the match, while Cena is down so he doesn't see it. Then Cena gets the pin, and Trips attacks Cena, allowing Orton to cash in. Cena can still leave for surgery, come back and feud with the Authority and this feud makes a bit more sense rather than just, "I think we should merge the belts."

Also would have kept the Bryan marks from getting their hopes up. It also sucks that WWE is teasing us with these Bryan/Punk vs Authority promos. I don't expect Bryan or Punk to face Trips at a big show, which is what should happen.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Did somebody say Big Show? :show


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Really liked that main event segment. The meltdowns in the Raw thread can't be graded. :jordan


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Orton's promos are getting a lot better, I'll give him that. :lmao at Cena trying to make himself into an underdog again. MVPs of the show are Titus O'Neil and :henry1


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I'd go as far as saying post-SummerSlam, Orton's promos have been way better than Punk's. I usually skip Punk segments by putting it on mute or exiting the room to do something else but the few times I've stuck around like the backstage segment with Renee tonight, I think it's for the best. That was just awful, on par with his "jokes" about John Laurinaitis two years ago.

Based on the sample we got tonight, my hopes for the Orton/Cena match delivering is going up. If they go all out like that and don't wrestle a super slow pace, it should be good.


----------



## FreakyZo (May 31, 2007)

Choke2Death said:


> I'd go as far as saying post-SummerSlam, Orton's promos have been way better than Punk's. I usually skip Punk segments by putting it on mute or exiting the room to do something else but the few times I've stuck around like the backstage segment with Renee tonight, I think it's for the best. That was just awful, on par with his "jokes" about John Laurinaitis two years ago.
> 
> Based on the sample we got tonight, my hopes for the Orton/Cena match delivering is going up. If they go all out like that and don't wrestle a super slow pace, it should be good.


Lol Orton has been looking at CM Punks old BITW heel promo tapes obviously. He's just not as convincing when he says that he the best


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Watching the first RAW of 1998, and I swear this show has more filler than today. Jeff Jarrett winning the NWA North American Heavyweight Title only to get his ass kicked by Austin. Owen Hart getting buried. The Truth Commission :lol. Marc freakin' Mero! Literally the only reason why this show is any good is because Austin stunners half the roster :austin

THE ARTIST FORMERLY KNOWN AS GOLDUST! That's it, I'm done. How much worse can it get?

Oh, it got worse. The Headbangers and Chainsaw Charlie :lol


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> I'd go as far as saying post-SummerSlam, Orton's promos have been way better than Punk's. I usually skip Punk segments by putting it on mute or exiting the room to do something else but the few times I've stuck around like the backstage segment with Renee tonight, I think it's for the best. That was just awful, on par with his "jokes" about John Laurinaitis two years ago.


Yeah, with the exception of his Brock feud, face Punk's promos are usually pretty cheesy. SOME of his shoot style promos with Trips in 2011 were okay, but he goes to another level as a heel.

The backstage segment with Renee was just silly. Pretty much no use for it. 

I'm having a difficult time getting into the Orton/Cena match(es), (because we'll probably get at least one more), since they've already had like 9 matches on PPV (including the triple threats with Trips, but not including Fatal Four ways). It's not historic like they're making it out to be. Tonight they said "Once in a lifetime". I did :lol at Steph injecting Trips into the list of guys that have held the WWE title, then the World title.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I honestly haven't been interested in Punk since 2011.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

As long as Punk is living and breathing, he will always be the best in the world unk2

:lmao Mark Henry's heel turn on the second episode of RAW in 98 was hilarious. Two episodes in and literally ever single match that year is a DUD. All of them. Literally only three guys on the roster are worth watching austin :hbk2 :rock)


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Watching the first RAW of 1998, and I swear this show has more filler than today.


Filler did *NOT* exist in the AE. :HHH

I legit fell asleep during Seahawks vs. Saints because it was a blowout and I didn't feel like watching RAW because I'd already seen Punk and Bryan's segments. I'll download for Show/Rhodes vs. Shield and to see if the contract signing was decent.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Contract signing was not bad. If you treated it as comedy, you will enjoy it. Real Americans vs. PTP is good. Shield match rules. Henry vs. Fandango is fun.

I'm gonna go make a list of all the good matches from WWE in 98. I have full confidence that The Shield has more good matches this past year than the entire WWF in 98.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Did some cunt just say that things "got worse" and used CHAINSAW FUCKING TERRY MOTHERFUCKING FUN CHARLIE as an example? Fuck you. FUCK YOU WITH A CACTUS. OR MAYBE JUST HAVE CACTUS FUCK YOU. WHERE IS THAT CUNT. CACTUS, THE FUCK YOU GO? STOP LEAVING. WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME HE WAS AROUND?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> As long as Punk is living and breathing, he will always be the best in the world unk2
> 
> :lmao Mark Henry's heel turn on the second episode of RAW in 98 was hilarious. Two episodes in and literally ever single match that year is a DUD. All of them. Literally only three guys on the roster are worth watching austin :hbk2 :rock)




Are you forgetting Missus Foley's Baby Boy???!! How dare you! He was definitely worth watching in 1998. The skits with Vince, the classic with Austin at OTE, GETTING THROWN OFF THE FUCKING CELL, the goofy cheesiness of Dude Love...I mean Foley was excellent in 1998. I still prefer the early 1996 Mankind and Cactus Jack characters to the Muppet Mankind, but he was still highly entertaining on a weekly basis.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Benoit vs Malenko 1/12/98 is radical. It's all of the good parts of their WAY too long PPV matches without all the shitty useless junk in the middle. Check it out. Can't believe this one slipped by me until last night.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

So with one month left to go in 2013, what do we have for;

- Wrestler of the Year?
- Match of the Year?
- WORST WOTY?
- WORST MOTY? 

SHIELD takes the first one for me. That's all that matters, no ONE worker deserves it over them, not Daniel Bryan, not Antonio Cesaro, not CM Punk, not ANYBODY. The SHIELD has just been.... DAMN.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Cena's winning Superstar of the Year. Won the Rumble, beat the Rock for the title, came back earlier than expected from injury, won the world title. He's winning that. You watch.

Punk not winning MOTY will be laughable, as he was in three MOTY contenders (vs Taker, vs Cena, vs Lesnar)

Don't much care about the other awards.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I don't mean the phony WWE awards that nobody cares about, I mean personally what would you have?

LEAST VALUABLE PLAYER of 2013 is an interesting discussion. I give it to the Rock, of course.

(& I don't care how popular he is, he still sucks. Just saying)


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Ah, gotcha. 

I agree, the Shield have the most consistent thing all year, not just in tag matches, but Rollins and Reigns have been very good in singles matches. 

MOTY - Punk/Lesnar
Worker(s) of the year - Shield (Honorable Mention: Cesaro and Goldust)

That's all I really care about. I also agree that Rock sucked in 2013.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Rock is definitely the most useless cunt they've had around this year. Added nothing to the shows. Took away from them, in face. Had one of the single worst title reigns ever, producing zero good matches, zero promos worth listening to, and killed 2 feuds combined with the face he was barely around even as champion. WAY TO GO ROCK~!

Continuing SummerSlam. BIG MARK VS TESTICLES.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

Punk V Taker is most likely winning MOTY is they like to give it to WM matches.

John Cena or DB to get superstar of the year award. Punk won it in 2011 so its not that big of a stretch if they gave it to DB.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I was thinking this earlier. Rock was just transitional champion AGAIN. Most of his reigns during 1999-2002, he was just holding to belt to drop it to someone else. Earlier 1999, just traded it with Foley, then got ready to drop it to Austin who was going to be the guy to carry it. Then traded it with HHH after Mania. Rock's reign was kind of in the background at Summerslam 2000 when Trips/Angle/Steph was happening. 2001 he won it at NWO only to drop it to Austin at Mania. 2002, he held it for like a month to drop it to Brock. 2013 he was only keeping it warm for Cena. I'm fully convinced that Punk/Cena would have been a GOAT match contender had it happened at Mania.



> John Cena or DB to get superstar of the year award. Punk won it in 2011 so its not that big of a stretch if they gave it to DB.


Yes, but keep in mind that in December 2011, Punk was WWE champ and relevant. They're doing their best to keep Bryan from being relevant right now.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Cynical Miracle, you sig gets me every time :lmao. Love it.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

I might never change it either.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Sig is pretty GOAT.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

If you take in to account who's been given what and their end product, then Antonio Cesaro has got to be the WOTY. He's been given very little to work with (compared to Bryan, Punk and The Shield) and has still been one of the best workers in the world. I know deciding WOTY doesn't work like that, but just thought I'd remind everybody that Bryan and The Shield have pretty much been given each other all year to work with.

But yeah, The Shield as WOTY with Bryan and Cesaro slightly behind, despite the fact that Punk has been in my three top WWE MOTYs. Incredible how that works, but it does, somehow.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*sigh* HHH Vs HBK time. At least I know its a GOOD match, just nothing amazing or anything. Better than HIAC and 3SOH anyway . Maybe I'll like it again. I used to love it.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> As long as Punk is living and breathing, he will always be the best in the world unk2
> 
> :lmao Mark Henry's heel turn on the second episode of RAW in 98 was hilarious. Two episodes in and literally ever single match that year is a DUD. All of them. Literally only three guys on the roster are worth watching austin :hbk2 :rock)


 No Kane and Undertaker?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Kane, Undertaker, and Foley haven't exactly done much yet. Not their fault; it's just that the other three are doing things. Chainsaw Charlie is a disgraceful gimmick. Surprised that Foley mentioned how much it sucked on air.

Paramore fan, if you haven't seen it yet, get ready for the episode of Nitro two weeks after Slamboree. There were at least four really good matches on that show.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*SummerSlam 2002*

And now. SummerSlam.

And that was the intro to the event? Seriously? No video package? LOL.


*Rey Mysterio Vs Kurt Angle*

:mark:

This is super fun awesome mega sweet. ALL OF THOSE THINGS.

Rey in 2002 had knees that worked so he could do ANYTHING. So he did. Some awesomely smooth high flying shit, great counters that could have easily sucked had anyone else done them because no doubt they wouldn't have been as perfectly done as Rey did em.
The German suplex counter using the ropes going into a pin attempt was :mark:.

Angle is great here too (I know!). Takes all of Rey's offense beautifully and it's kinda cool seeing him work more of a "big man vs little man" style with him as the bigger guy lol. Just lobbing Rey around and shit.

:mark: Rey diving over the ref over the ropes onto Angle.

Crowd are just on FIRE for all this too. Great to see Rey, only recently debuting with the company, taking Angle to the limit and being 100% believable to get a win despite his size and how long he's been with the company and how he was used in WCW too. 

:mark: at the finish too. Great counter by Angle. Rey taps but fuck me he basically got MADE as far as his WWE career goes in this match.

Incredible opener and all round incredible match.

*Rating: ***3/4*
*CAL SCALE - 4*


Lawler wants to welcome us to the Raw portion of Smackdown. Yup.


*Chris Jericho Vs Ric Flair*

JERICHO BEATS UP AN OLD MAN. That's essentially this match lol.

Holy fook at that spot! Jericho takes the padding off the barricade, lays Flair across it then comes crashing down on Flair from the top rope!!! Flair's selling of it afterwards is tremendous. "OH GOD!" followed by him stumbling into a camera man :lmao.

:lmao Jericho has a tougher time fighting with a turnbuckle pad than he does Flair. He ends up giving up and going after Flair with some wrist tape instead :lmao.

CHOPS~! But Jericho keeps firing back with PUNCHES TO THE FACE.

:mark: Flair hits a somewhat WONDERFUL back suplex. Who thing leading into it is tremendous too. Flair strut, then he just kinda dances around Jericho, swings his arm up and grabs him for the suplex and hits it to perfection. DEM LITTLE THINGS.

LIONSAULT~! FLAIR MOVES~! CHOPS~! WALLS OF JERICHO BY FLAIR~! BOTCHES~! FIGURE FOUR BY JERICHO~! Wait, that's not a figure four, is it? Looks totally different when Miz does it 8*D.

Flair taps! But he's in the ropes so it doesn't count! Suck it, Jericho! 

:lmao Flair chopped Jericho so hard, Charles Robinson fell down :lmao. Apparently Jericho knocked into him but you couldn't see that from the camera angle we got :lmao.

LOW BLOW~! FIGURE FOUR~! FLAIR WINS!!!! WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

Yeah this good. Fun. Awesome. OLD MAN FLAIR~!

*Rating: ****
*CAL SCALE - 2*


*Eddie Guerrero Vs Edge*

So I remember not liking these matches much in the past, but after seeing their... Unforgiven (?) match again for the first time in YEARS, I ended up loving it and now I have somewhat high hopes for this one too .

OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG PORK SIGN IN THE CROWD! :mark:

Botch in the first minute. Not a good sign :lmao. PORK, now there is a good sign! I miss PORK sign .

Eddie gets tied in the ropes and SPEAR! Edge goes for another, Eddie escapes and Edge flies out of the ring. LOL. Edge looks to be hurt, so Eddie goes right after the now seemingly injured left arm .

"GUERRERO LIKE A SHARK THAT SMELLS BLOOD IN THE WATER YUM YUM GONNA GET HIM SOME!" :lmao

Awesome move off the top rope by Eddie to smash the arm into the mat :mark:.

:mark: Eddie getting snapmared then moving like lighting to get back to Edge is :mark:. He just zooms around Edge, sweeps his leg then grabs the arm again.

Edge starts to build moment, looks to hit another SPEAR... only for Guerrero to counter with a dropkick!!!

FROG SPLASH~! NO! EDGE GOT HIS KNEES UP!

EDGECUTION~! EDDIE KICKS OUT! FUCK YES! SUCK IT EDGE!

Eddie is wonderful btw. Any time he counters an Edge comeback he is RIGHT BACK ON EDGE with such quickness. No wasting time or anything.

FROG SPLASH ON THE INJURED ARM!!! HOLY FUCK THAT WAS GOAT!!!

EDGE KICKS OUT!!!

SPEAR! And Edge wins . BOOOOO!!!

So this was good . Eddie was KING, Edge was fine. Eddie ruled.

*Rating: ****
*CAL SCALE - 2*


Christian can't wait to EXPOSE Booker T and Goldust.


*Booker T & Goldust Vs Lance Storm & Christian - World Tag Team Championship Match*

:mark: ok, this match BETTER live up to the hype. 

:mark: GOLDUST AND CHRISTIAN starting things out :mark:. Storm comes in and that's fine too... bah, Booker tagged in. FUCK OFF BOOKER.

:mark: Goldust taking a bump over the turnbuckle is :mark:. 

Goldust is superb as FIP as you would totally expect (and if you don't then what the fuck is wrong with you? Goldust > most of your favourites). Takes one hell of a beating and it's easy to get behind him as he tries to make a tag.

COME ON GOLDIE! COME ON GOLDIE! Booker T gets the hot tag, but the ref didn't see it! Fans are fucking livid lol. Awesome.

CONCHAIRTO ATTEMPT! GOLDUST DUCKS AND COMES BACK WITH A DOUBLE CLOTHESLINE! FANS POP LIKE CRAZY!!! Come on Goldust, make the tag!!! Yes!!! Shame it was to Booker T though .

Booker is at least good at coming off a hot tag and wailing on everyone. He just PLASTERS Christian on the ropes with repeated chops and slaps to the chest lol. 

DOUBLE AXE KICK~! Ref is down though. Booo.

TEST~! Big boot to Booker T, and Christian & Storm steal this one .

This rules. Fucking RULES. Goldust is such a fucking workhorse. He spends the bulk of the match in the ring and fuck he's just great. On offence, taking a beating, teasing a hot tag. :mark: Awesome stuff all round not just from him too. Hype = LIVED UP.

*Rating: ***3/4*
*CAL SCALE - 4*


Nidia is at WWE New York making out with some random dude while Noble watches :lmao.


*Chris Benoit Vs Rob Van Dam - WWE Intercontinental Championship Match*

The crowd are pretty much fucking DEAD for this one unless RVD is hitting some flippy shit lol. Which is a shame because Benoit is fucking MAULING RVD's head in pretty spectacular fashion.

So Benoit's work here is fine, great even... but at the same time I'm not caught up in the match or anything. He's just working over RVD and I'm not particularly caring. Some cool moments here and there and that's kinda it tbh.

If anything it's RVD that makes this match go from average to pretty fun at times. His crazy offence often leads to some great Benoit counters lol, and break the match up from Benoit applying holds .

Thing start to really pick up mid way though... and HOLY FUCK... TRIPLE NOTHERN LIGHTS SUPLEXES FROM BENOIT WHILE HE HAS RVD'S ARM BEHIND HIM REALLY FUCKING IT UP. Fuck triple Germans, THAT is an incredible triple suplex spot. Benoit then following it up with a Crossface is :mark:.

Finish kinda comes out of nowhere. Benoit goes for a back superplex, RVD counters with a crossbody then follows up with a 5 Star Frog Splash and it's over. Just seemed that one second Benoit is controlling and then RVD wins with his finisher but without any real comeback nor hitting it OUT OF NOWHERE lol.

Mixed feelings on this one tbh. It's good, and in parts it's great... but at times it gets a little tedious too. Goes up and down and isn't consistent. I liked it more than I disliked anything in it though. I'll settle on really good .

*Rating: ***1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 3*


*The Undertaker Vs Test*

:lmao the video package shows why the UN-AMERICANS hate America and shit... but absolutely no reason why this match is happening :lmao.

Undertaker is the AMERICAN BAS ASS so I guess that lets this "feud" write itself lol. Plus he has a Nephew I believe in the Army so he was dedicating a match to him by beating up... a Canadian. WHERE WAS HASSAN WHEN WE ACTUALLY NEEDED HIM? 

Undertaker tries to start the match in his usual way, softening up the arm, but TEST ain't having none of that shit. Big knees to Undertaker to stop those arm wrenches, so Undertaker is all "fuck it, LEAPING LARIAT" and takes Test down that way lol. 

OLD SCHOOL~! But Test again ain't having none of that shit, and shoves the referee into the ropes, crotching the DEAD MAN! Now it's time for Test to work over The Undertaker, using the steel steps to his advantage, because even a guy the size of TEST can't get on top of the Dead Man without help.

Did we ever get T&A Vs BOD? I don't think we did, did we? BOD teamed up a little in 2000 when Undertaker first returned and I'm not certain they met with T&A, then when BOD got back together again at the RR in 01, T&A had split. Bah, could have been a pretty awesome tag match tbh. T&A were awesome. One of the only "main" teams in 2000 that didn't get a tag title run lol. 2 COOL EVEN GOT A FUCKING TITLE REIGN LOL.

Undertaker fights back and manages to hit OLD SCHOOL for real this time. Time for Test to fucking PAY.

SNAKE EYES~! BIG BOOT~! TEST COUNTERS~! Bunch of other counters and then CHOKESLAM~! TEST KICKS OUT!!!

Time for Test to take his LAST RIDE, but Storm and Christian show up!!! They get the fuck beaten out of them, allowing Test to sneak in and absolutely fucking NAIL the Dead Man with a big boot! UNDERTAKER KICKS OUT!!!

Anyone else love Test's BIG BOOT? I'm a big fan of impactful strikes, be it punches of kicks anyway, so naturally I'm gonna enjoy it. But what about everyone else? I mean, a 6'6 near 300lb man charging at you full speed and smashing your face in with his boot is a SOMEWHAT credible move, right? 

STEEL CHAIR~! COUNTERED~! TOMBSTONE!!! Always loved seeing ABA Undertaker use the Tombstone. Test ain't kicking out of that in a million years.

After the match Undertaker wanders into the crowd and grabs an American Flag and parades around. Not my thing but eh, it's Undertaker so I can give it a pass .

Match is solid stuff, not great but far, far from being anything bad. Just a shame Undertaker was in basically a filler match for SummerSlam, a month after he lost the Undisputed Championship and a month before he would challenge Lesnar for the WWE title lol.

*Rating: **3/4*
*CAL SCALE - 1*


*Shawn Michaels Vs Triple H - Unsanctioned Match*

How GOAT is the FIGHT song for the video package?

I used to love this match. Really I did. Back when it happened, I was HYPED TO FUCK for it. It was SHAWN MICHAELS. RETURNING TO THE RING FOR THE FIRST TIME IN 4 YEARS. I first saw wrestling back at the end of the Golden Era, and grew up on the NEW GENERATION, which Shawn Michaels was a MAJOR part of. I was around for the inception of D-x. But I lost access to the channels with wrestling and missed everything past 98 until 2000 (gone back and caught up with everything obviously... seems I didn't miss much tbh :lmao ). So when I started watching again in 2000, I had no idea where HBK was (or Undertaker for that matter lol... and they both pretty much returned at the same PPV!!!). Took a while for me to piece everything together with the info I would catch here and there on TV. Then he came back for the NWO in 2002. And that died off quickly. Then he re-joined with HHH. And that died off pretty quickly. And then HBK said he would be ready for a match. A RETURN MATCH. AT FUCKING SUMMERSLAM. :mark:

I can still remember watching it in 2002. I adored it. It was incredible seeing HBK, my second favourite at the time (Undertaker #1, duh), FINALLY returning to the ring and putting on a fucking SHOW STEALER. But over the years I've gone way down on the match. And now I'm watching it again and after writing all of that stuff I'm kinda hyped for it one more time lol. Maybe that'll help with this re-watch .

HBK just laying across the turnbuckle like a cocky little DICK as HHH makes his INTENSE~! entrance is :mark:. He don't sweat THE GAME.

Shawn seems to catch HHH off guard at the start, like HHH wasn't expecting HBK to go that fast and that hard after all this time away from the ring. :lmao at the commentators saying how this goes WAY BEYOND a typical hardcore match... then Shawn pulls out a basic trash can lid :lmao. TRASH CAN LID = BEYOND HARDCORE!!!

Sweet Chin Music attempt is avoided, and HHH counters with a sickening BACK BREAKER, and now THE GAME begins to play with Shawn's back.

THIS IS UNSANCTIONED. THE WWE WANTS NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS MATCH~! They are just allowing it to happen on their PPV, complete with video package and entrances. And a referee in the ring to count the falls. And commentators to commentate on it. And they advertised the fuck out of it leading into the PPV. YEAH OK, NOTHING TO DO WITH IT.

DDT ON A STEEL CHAIR. How the fuck was that not the finish lol? SHAWN IS BUSTED WIDE OPEN!

Love how Earl Hebner is in this match. Screaming "NO! NOOOO!" at HHH to try and stop him from killing HBK.

Earl continues to be awesome, even backing HHH into a corner and going on a fucking TIRADE :lmao.

BACK BREAKER ON A STEEL FUCKING CHAIR. That's awesomely brutal in the circumstances. Shame it's the only thing worth watching from the last like, 5 minutes lol. I get that HHH is taking his time to really break HBK apart... but fuck this match is just TOO slow at times.

SUPERKICK~! HBK superkicks a chair right into HHH's face! His poor nose!!! 

HHH is hurting and busted open, giving Shawn a chance to make a comeback. NIP UP~! NO SELLING THE FUCKING BACK WORK~! WHAT A CUNT~!

I still have mixed feeling about that part. On the one hand... Shawn fucking NO SELLS his fucking back. Making everything in the match prior to that POINTLESS. On the other hand... :mark:. HBK nipping up and making a comeback on the EVIL HHH is still pretty :mark:.

Oh wow, I'm actually getting BORED with this match. Shawn just crossbodied HHH through a table on the floor from the ropes... and eh, I don't care. Now an Elbow Drop off the ladder. Because... Uhhh... it needed to be done from a ladder? So he's proving he's still the SHOWSTOPPER yeah? Ok. How about you FUCKING SELL YOUR BACK.

SUPERKICK~! COUNTERED INTO A PEDIGREE~! COUNTERED INTO A PIN~! HBK WINS! Finally lol.

Well unfortunately I just wasn't feeling this match. Again. Just doesn't hold up like it once did. First part is really good... and then HHH decides to slow shit down far more than he needed and the match feels far too long. Then HBK comes back and ignores his fucking BACK INJURY and that fucks me off, then it turns into meaningless spots and moves before HBK wins. So first half = good, second half = kinda crappy. Evens out to good and nothing more.

SLEDGEHAMMER TO THE BACK~!

*Rating: ****
*CAL SCALE - 2*


Before we can get to the main event, HOWARD FINKLE wants to talk! LOL. Why on EARTH were they seemingly trying to make THE FINK a heel? Or have a ring announcer as something other than a ring announcer? Oh well, TRISH FAP FAP FAP FAP FUCKING FAP WITH THAT OUTFIT comes out. LILLIAN FAP FAP GARCIA comes out and attacks Howard. Because they had some issues or something. I forget. I don't care. LOL.


*The Rock Vs Brock Lesnar - WWE Undisputed Championship Match*

Rock starts this one with those awful punches of his, but Brock is all FUCK YOU ROCK and just grabs and throws him across the ring with an impressive looking Overhead Belly to Belly suplex. HA!

:lmao HUGE ROCKY SUCKS chants :lmao. Followed up big a HUGE ROCKY chant :lmao. MAKE UP YOUR MIND PEOPLE .

Heyman :mark:. Just being a DICK on the outside, attacking Rock at every fucking chance he gets. As if being in the ring with LESNAR wasn't enough lol.

DOUBLE NIP UP SPOT :mark:.

Rock tries to clothesline Lesnar over. Doesn't work. Lesnar tells him to try again. Doesn't work. 3rd time after ducking an attempted Lesnar clothesline and LESNAR GOES DOWN. Sharpshooter attempt and YES! Heyman distracts Rock! Booo... Rock still locks it in. Fans boo. Because it's fucking shit. LEARN TO DO IT RIGHT YOU NOB. MIZ VS ROCK IN A WORST ATTEMPT AT A POPULAR SUBMISSION HOLD EVER. JOHN "STF-ISH" CENA AS GUEST REFEREE.

Rock, the big man that he is, attacks poor Heyman who is NOT a trained wrestler. What a fucking piece of shit. Lesnar makes him pay with a CHAIR SHOT to the gut though. Lesnar is a true friend .

BEAR HUG. Rock has injured ribs AND just got nailed with a chair. Lesnar put HULK HOGAN out of action with a bear hug. Rock ain't gonna stand a chance!!!

Rock makes a pretty sweet comeback, and holy fuck Lesnar is bumping around like a GOAT. Rock sends Lesnar face first into the ring post... and then decides to put Heyman through a table! THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU, ROCK? DON'T BE A BULLY, BE A STAR. Cunt. 

ROCK BOTTOM~! LESNAR KICKS OUT!!! 

BROCK BOTTOM~! ROCK KICKS OUT!!!

:mark: You know those matches where Rock goes for a People's Elbow and someone interferes, usually running Rock over? Well, LESNAR does it with a monstrous clothesline here . Fuck anyone else getting involved, BROCK is superhuman and can do it himself!!!

F-5!!! 1...2...3!!! LESNAR IS THE NEW CHAMPION!!! LESNAR IS CHAMPION, AND ROCK IS FUCKING OFF TO HOLLYWOOD! ALL IS RIGHT WITH THE WORLD!!!

:mark: Still a fucking incredible match. Awesome atmosphere, and great effort from BOTH men. Even Rock! Lesnar was fucking BOSS though.

*Rating: ****1/4*
*CAL SCALE - 6*



*Overall CAL SCALE - 24*​


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Some surprisingly low ratings there tbh Cal.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

What's "surprisingly low" other than HBK/HHH? Which shouldn't be surprising in the slightest from me .


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Why does this thread generally hate The Rock so much? 

Genuine question, because I've never seen reasoning given, unlike with someone like Angle, for example. I know people were disillusioned with his comeback, but from the tenor of comments, it seems like people aren't even fond of prime Rocky. True?


Timely review @ Cal, as I just recently watched Rock vs. Brock at SS '02. I was surprised by how much I liked it. Like, I legit had it at the **** 3/4 level from the beginning until that glorious double kip up part. It lost some steam toward the end, but I thought it was still pretty damn great. Entertaining the whole way through, and the crowd was hot.

****.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> What's "surprisingly low" other than HBK/HHH? Which shouldn't be surprising in the slightest from me .


Thought you may have gone higher on Benoit/Rob Van Dam and maybe Eddie/Edge.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I think Benoit/RVD is better than what you gave it. Otherwise, it's actually close to what I'd give it using the CAL scale. (28 for me)


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

BookDust vs. Canadians getting so much love pleases me.

The only match I'm drawing a blank on from Summerslam 2002 is Chris Jericho vs. Flair. I know I've seen it before, because I've watched the event numerous times, but I'll be damned if I can remember one thing from that match. I think I'll try and scope it out now.

Out of curiosity, where does SS 02 rank amongst the GOAT PPVs on the CAL SCALE~!, Cal?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I used to have Benoit/RVD at **** but yeah, some of it felt a little dull this time around. *** is good for Eddie/Edge from me, since I never liked it before . Tag went up an entire * from my last watch :lmao.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Also, could you please sticky the Cal Scale on the first page? I always have to go Googling to find it, and am rarely successful.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I prefer Eddie/Edge to Flair/Jericho, never really liked that match tbh, despite being a mark for both


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> Why does this thread generally hate The Rock so much?
> 
> Genuine question, because I've never seen reasoning given, unlike with someone like Angle, for example. I know people were disillusioned with his comeback, but from the tenor of comments, it seems like people aren't even fond of prime Rocky. True?
> 
> ...


This thread apparently pretty much hates Current Rock/2013 Rock whatever. 

I dont even care anymore. Its not a big deal now. He still gets praise from his previous work and his career as a whole and thats all that matters at the end of the day.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I have never liked Rock. Hated him in his prime too. His crappy, terrible catchphrase-y promos, his average ring work and at times laughable selling. Never got the appeal tbh.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

We know but you still will give credit where credit is due in some of his previous matches. Its seen in this thread plenty. 

Current Rock/2013 Rock gets no love and thats where people think the guy is hated all around and thats not really the case. 

Most people that hate/dislike his work recently still have love for what he did in his past so its not that big of a deal.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

MERRY MUTHAPHUCKKIN CHRISTMAS said:


> So with one month left to go in 2013, what do we have for;
> 
> - Wrestler of the Year?
> - Match of the Year?
> ...


*WOTY *= :ambrose :rollins :reigns
*MOTY *= unk vs. :brock
*SOTY *= :dazzler

I won't do a worst since I see no point in that.


----------



## dxbender (Jul 22, 2007)

WWE released Raw20 DVD(featuring 20 best episodes of Raw(or just best few episodes of each generation))

The thing that surprises me...It takes them 12 dvds(10 blu ray) to fit 20 episodes on......

I guess we'll NEVER have WWE releasing every episode of Raw/SD on DVD/BluRay. Just releasing an entire year worth of Raw episodes, it'd take like 25-30 DVDs/BluRay discs to do it!

Surely there is a better way to distribute episodes of WWE programs in hard copy form. WWE would make so much money off of this because you know there'll be a great number of fans who'll be willing to pay to get entire years of full WWE episodes in TV quality.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

I have a question about the Best PPV Matches of 2013 DVD.

For anyone who's gotten that type of DVD in previous years....do they include the cash-ins that happen after certain matches? It'd be ridiculous for them not to, but I could also see them being annoying and purposely not doing so, to try to increase other DVD sales. 

Basically I'm asking, do you guys think that the cash-in at SS '13 will definitely be on there since the Cena/Bryan match is there?


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Shutting down that Orton thread was best for business, Starbuck.

Speaking of Orton, I watched the mini-polarizing match that is* Orton Vs Punk from RAW earlier this year* and I thought it fell on some middle ground. Not the piece of shit that Choke2Death said it was and certainly not the great contest that Corey thought it was. There's an atmosphere for it and whatnot, but the action itself has some issues, mainly with it's pacing. Face Vs face matches shouldn't be slow, they should be action packed because they feature two guys who should be working from the bottom. Punk's strikes were tight and excellent, but I can't stand when Orton does his face flurry of shitty clotheslines and such that always takes me out of a match. Think I'll go somewhere like *** 1/4* for it because while it was ultimately good enough I guess, it certainly wasn't close to being anything special.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I rewatched that Orton/Punk match a few weeks ago, actually. Never recall describing it as a "piece of shit", just very dull. But on the rewatch it went up. Would go ★★½ for it. A solid TV match but both are capable of better.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Benoit/RVD bored the piss out of me the last time I watched it. 



LilOlMe said:


> Why does this thread generally hate The Rock so much?
> 
> Genuine question, because I've never seen reasoning given, unlike with someone like Angle, for example. I know people were disillusioned with his comeback, but from the tenor of comments, it seems like people aren't even fond of prime Rocky. True?


I don't think anybody other than Cal hated him until he started sucking and hogging up air time in 2012 (I've been on this board for five years and the most positive thing I remember Cal saying about the Rock was something like "I kinda like his WMXIX promo"). IT'S OK FOR HHH TO SUCK AND HOG UP AIR TIME, THOUGH, APPARENTLY.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Hating HHH is gonna reach the point where he starts getting underrated by everybody though I think.

Okay, so the BROCK series was like 70 percent BROCK and 30 percent HHH, but he was still really great in two of them (Summerslam & Extreme Rules), plus being equal with Taker in two great matches at consecutive Wrestlemanias and producing both times. I haven't seen a SHIT HHH performance since he went part time though, he's been great in the ring and it's worked out for the best.

I'm a mark for the guy, so him taking up airtime is :mark::mark::mark: for me :lol.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

He didn't really do much in the Lesnar matches. I guess he didn't SUCK, but I can't think of anything he really added their SummerSlam match. Extreme Rules was an abomination the moment Lesnar became the vulnerable man in the match. Yuckkk. Maybe there haven't been too many moments of suck, but I don't think he's been 'great' since.....um.............well there is the Jericho LMS. :side:


Actually come to think of it most of HHH's potentially best matches since 2010 have been ruined by booking. Punk brawl was ruined by the ending, Taker Cell was ruined by Michaels, Lesnar feud was ruined by Lesnar not being an axe murderer. It all makes SENSE NOW!


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> Extreme Rules was an abomination the moment Lesnar became the vulnerable man in the match. Yuckkk.


This. All this. My rage hasn't yet subsided lol. Yeah Brock's selling was GOAT-worthy, but fuck it, Brock is so special, he should NOT have been put in that position, and HHH trying to be his equal - fuck off.

IMO


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


> This. All this. My rage hasn't yet subsided lol. Yeah Brock's selling was GOAT-worthy, but fuck it, Brock is so special, he should NOT have been put in that position, and HHH trying to be his equal - fuck off.
> 
> IMO



Exactly my opinion on the matter. Also, I got really annoyed when Heyman took out the ref guarding the cage door, opened the cage, and Brock walked over, took the chair EVEN THOUGH HIS LEG WAS SERIOUSLY INJURED and walked back in to continue the match, Heyman was even nice enough to shut the door himself. Seriously, the fuck. You're leg is injured, why do you not just step out of the cage, win the match, then go back in and wear Hunter out with that chair. The ref was already knocked out! There is no one to stop you! God that kind of booking just shows an obvious lack of attention to detail. That used to be the WWE's calling card, how well they handled the details in things as opposed to WCW's fly by the seat of their pants approach.

Triple H hasn't interested me in the ring since 2005 and his amazing Flair matches. And even those were 75% Flair and his GOAT baby face work.

Did anyone ever bother checking out that super sweet 6-7 minute Windham/Steamboat vs Austin/Cactus tag I posted here? That's become one of my new favorite short tag matches.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well, 2002 PPV is done! Finished! Gone! And for the most part it was AWESOME.

*PPV Wrestler of the Year*

The Undertaker. Duh. The guy DOMINATED the top 10, and even while having 2 of the WORST PPV matches all year, his dominance in almost every other match more than makes up for it. 2002 Undertaker ruled. A great character, some truly great matches, and a bunch of fun TV matches too.

*PPV Match of the Year*

Brock Lesnar Vs The Undertaker Hell in a Cell - No Mercy *****. Oh yeah. Always adored this one, and ended up going the full FIVE STARS on this watch. Such an incredible match with amazing performances from both men, as well as Heyman on the outside of the cell!

*PPV of the Year*

Yeah, there really wasn't any doubt going into the year 2002 which event was gonna come out on top. SUMMERSLAM crushed everything, including Survivor Series which is a high end PPV in it's own right. I might have liked Benoit/RVD less, but I pretty much loved everything else even more. Not quite the best PPV ever, but I can't see anything else overtaking it or the other TWO events above it any time soon.

2002 Compared to 2000 and 2002:










2002 PPV Matches Ranked:



Spoiler: Matches



Edge Vs Booker T - NO - -1 (WrestleMania X8)
Trish Stratus Vs Molly Holly - NO - -1 (Unforgiven)
Victoria Vs Trish Stratus Vs Jacqueline - NO - -1 (Armageddon)
Trish Stratus Vs Stacy Keibler - NO - -1 (Judgment Day)
Molly Holly Vs Trish Stratus - NO - -1 (King of the Ring)
John Cena & Dawn Marie Vs Billy Kidman & Torrie Wilson - NO - -1 (Rebellion)
Trish Stratus & Jacqueline Vs Molly Holly & Jazz - NO - -1 (Insurrextion)
Dawn Marie Vs Torrie Wilson - NO - -1 (No Mercy)
Trish Stratus Vs Jazz - NO - -1 (Backlash)
Trish Stratus Vs Victoria - NO - -1 (No Mercy)
Billy & Chuck Vs Rikishi & Rico - NO - -1 (Judgment Day)
The Undertaker Vs Triple H - DUD - 0 (King of the Ring)
The Undertaker Vs Triple H - DUD - 0 (Insurexxtion)
Triple H Vs Hulk Hogan - DUD - 0 (Backlash)
Triple H Vs Chris Jericho - DUD - 0 (Judgment Day)
Billy & Chuck Vs 3 Minute Warning - DUD - 0 (Unforgiven)
Stacy Keibler Vs Torrie Wilson - DUD - 0 (Global Warning Tour)
Booker T Vs Matt Hardy - 1/4* - 0 (Rebellion)
Funaki Vs Crash Holly - 1/4* - 0 (Rebellion)
Rikishi Vs Rico - 1/4* - 0 (Global Warning Tour)
The Big Valbowski & Chuck Palumbo Vs Ron Simmons & D-Von - 1/4* - 0 (Rebellion)
Triple H Vs Kurt Angle - 1/4* - 0 (No Way Out)
Steven Richards Vs Booker T - 1/4* - 0 (Insurrextion)
Test & Booker T Vs Tazz & Spike Dudley - 1/2* - 0 (No Way Out)
Billy & Chuck Vs Al Snow & Maven - WWF Tag Team Championship Match - 1/2* - 0 (Backlash)
Edge Vs A-Train - 1/2* - 0 (Armageddon)
Triple H Vs Rob Van Dam - * - 0 (Unforgiven)
Shawn Michaels Vs Triple H - * - 0 (Armageddon)
Edge & Hulk Hogan Vs Lance Storm & Christian - * - 0 (Vengeance)
Chris Jericho Vs John Cena - * - 0 (Vengeance)
Steve Austin Vs Scott Hall - * - 0 (WrestleMania X8)
Scott Hall Vs Bradshaw - * - 0 (Backlash)
Eddie Guerrero Vs Rob Van Dam - * - 0 (Insurrextion)
Steve Austin Vs The Big Show - * - 0 (Insurrextion)
Chris Benoit Vs Kurt Angle - * - 0 (Unforgiven)
Tajiri Vs Rey Mysterio Vs Jamie Noble - * - 0 (Rebellion)
Goldust Vs Maven - * - 0 (WrestleMania X8)
Jazz Vs Trish Stratus Vs Lita - * - 0 (WrestleMania X8)
Spike Dudley Vs William Regal - *1/4 - 0.5 (Insurrextion)
Chris Jericho Vs Steve Austin - *1/2 - 0.5 (No Way Out)
The Hardy Boys Vs Brock Lesnar & Shawn Stasiak - *1/2 - 0.5 (Insurrextion)
Jamie Noble Vs The Hurricane - ** - 0.5 (Global Warning Tour)
Jamie Noble Vs Billy Kidman - ** - 0.5 (Vengeance)
Albert Vs Rikisi - ** - 0.5 (Rebellion)
Eddie Guerrero Vs Ric Flair - ** - 0.5 (King of the Ring)
Jamie Noble Vs The Hurricane - ** - 0.5 (King of the Ring)
Chris Jericho Vs Triple H - ** - 0.5 (WrestleMania X8)
Jazz Vs Trish Stratus - ** - 0.5 (Royal Rumble)
Chris Jericho Vs Ric Flair - ** - 0/5 (Unforgiven)
Kane Vs Batista - ** - 0.5 (Armageddon)
Chris Jericho & Christian Vs Goldust & Booker T - ** - 0.5 (No Mercy)
William Regal Vs Jeff Hardy - ** - 0.5 (Vengeance)
Hulk Hogan Vs The Undertaker - ** - 0.5 (Judgment Day)
The Hardy Boys Vs Brock Lesnar & Paul Heyman - **1/4 - 1 (Judgment Day)
Triple H Vs Kane - **1/4 - 1 (No Mercy)
Bradshaw Vs X-Pac - **1/2 - 1 (Insurrextion)
Test Vs Brock Lesnar - **1/2 - 1 (King of the Ring)
Brock Lesnar Vs Jeff Hardy - **1/2 - 1 (Backlash)
Brock Lesnar & Paul Heyman Vs Edge - **1/2 - 1 (Rebellion)
Kurt Angle Vs Hulk Hogan - **1/2 - 1 (King of the Ring)
Ric Flair Vs Rob Van Dam - **3/4 - 1 (No Mercy)
Trish Stratus Vs Victoria - **3/4 - 1 (Survivor Series)
Scotty 2 Hotty & Albert Vs Christian & Lance Storm Vs The Hardy Boys Vs The Dudley Boys Vs Billy & Chuck Vs The APA - **3/4 - 1 (No Way Out)
Kurt Angle Vs Kane - **3/4 - 1 (WrestleMania X8)
The Dudley Boys Vs Tazz & Spike - **3/4 - 1 (Royal Rumble)
The Undertaker Vs Test - **3/4 - 1 (SummerSlam)
Chris Jericho Vs Edge - *** - 2 (Global Warning Tour)
Lance Storm & Christian Vs Billy Kidman & Rey Mysterio - *** - 2 (Global Warning Tour)
Rob Van Dam Vs William Regal - *** - 2 (WrestleMania X8)
Chris Benoit & Kurt Angle Vs Los Guerreros - *** - 2 (Rebellion)
Chris Benoit & Kurt Angle Vs Rey Mysterio & Edge - *** - 2 (No Mercy)
Shawn Michaels Vs Triple H - *** - 2 (SummerSlam)
Chris Jericho Vs Ric Flair - *** - 2 (SummerSlam)
Brock Lesnar Vs Rob Van Dam - *** - 2 (King of the Ring)
Christian Vs DDP - *** - 2 (WrestleMania X8)
The Un-Americans Vs Booker T, Goldust, Bubba Ray Dudley & Kane - *** - 2 (Unforgiven)
The Dudley Boys Vs The Hardy Boys Vs APA Vs Billy & Chuck - *** - 2 (WrestleMania X8)
Eddie Guerrero Vs Edge - *** - 2 (SummerSlam)
Hulk Hogan Vs The Rock - *** - 2 (WrestleMania X8)
Kurt Angle Vs Edge - ***1/4 - 2 (Backlash)
Edge Vs Kurt Angle - ***1/4 - 2 (Judgment Day)
Ric Flair Vs Mr McMahon - ***1/4 - 2 (Royal Rumble)
The Rock Vs Triple H Vs Brock Lesnar - ***1/4 - 2 (Global Warning Tour)
Goldust Vs Rob Van Dam - ***1/4 - 2 (No Way Out)
Steve Austin Vs The Big Show & Ric Flair - ***1/4 - 2 (Judgment Day)
The Big Show Vs Booker T - ***1/4 - 2 (Vengeance)
Brock Lesnar Vs The Big Show - ***1/4 - 2 (Survivor Series)
Chris Benoit Vs Rob Van Dam - ***1/2 - 3 (SummerSlam)
Jamie Noble Vs Billy Kidman - ***1/2 - 3 (Survivor Series)
The Rock Vs Chris Jericho - ***1/2 - 3 (Royal Rumble)
Bubba Ray & Spike Dudley & Jeff Hardy Vs 3 Minute Warning & Rico - ***1/2 - 3 (Survivor Series)
The Big Show Vs Kurt Angle - ***1/2 - 3 (Armageddon)
Bubba Ray & Spike Dudley Vs Chris Benoit & Eddie Guerrero - ***1/2 - 3 (Vengeance)
Billy Kidman Vs Tajiri - ***1/2 - 3 (Backlash)
Eddie Guerrero Vs Edge - ***1/2 - 3 (Unforgiven)
Edge Vs William Regal - ***1/2 - 3 (No Way Out)
Eddie Guerrero Vs Chris Benoit - ***3/4 - 4 (Armageddon)
Rey Mysterio Vs Kurt Angle - ***3/4 - 4 (SummerSlam)
Brock Lesnar Vs Rob Van Dam - ***3/4 - 4 (Vengeance)
Chris Jericho Vs Rob Van Dam - ***3/4 - 4 (King of the Ring)
Jamie Noble Vs Tajiri - ***3/4 - 4 (No Mercy)
Eddie Guerrero Vs Rob Van Dam - ***3/4 - 4 (Judgment Day)
Booker T & Goldust Vs Lance Storm & Christian - ***3/4 - 4 (SummerSlam)
The Dudley Boys Vs Lance Storm & William Regal Vs Booker T & Goldust Vs Chris Jericho & Christian - ***3/4 - 4 (Armageddon)
William Regal Vs Edge - ***3/4 - 4 (Royal Rumble)
Rob Van Dam Vs Eddie Guerrero - **** - 5 (Backlash)
Triple H Vs Shawn Michaels Vs Chris Jericho Vs Booker T Vs RVD Vs Kane - **** - 5 (Survivor Series)
The Undertaker Vs Steve Austin - **** - 5 (Backlash)
The Undertaker Vs The Rock Vs Kurt Angle - **** - 5 (Vengeance)
The Undertaker Vs The Rock - ****1/4 - 6 (No Way Out)
Edge & Rey Mysterio Vs Chris Benoit & Kurt Angle Vs Los Guerreros - ****1/4 - 6 (Survivor Series)
Brock Lesnar Vs The Undertaker - ****1/4 - 6 (Unforgiven)
The Rock Vs Brock Lesnar - ****1/4 - 6 (SummerSlam)
The Undertaker Vs Ric Flair - ****1/4 - 6 (WrestleMania X8)
30 Man Royal Rumble Match - ****1/2 - 7 (Royal Rumble)
Brock Lesnar Vs The Undertaker - ***** - 9 (No Mercy)



PPV's Ranked on the CAL SCALE:



Spoiler: PPV's



WrestleMania 2 - 0.5
Insurrextion 2002 - 1
WrestleMania IV - 1
WrestleMania XV - 2
2006 Royal Rumble - 2
2012 Royal Rumble - 2
WrestleMania V - 2
Rebellion 2002 - 2.5
2010 Royal Rumble - 2.5
1999 Royal Rumble - 3.5
2013 Royal Rumble - 3.5
1993 Royal Rumble - 4
Armageddon 2000 - 4
WrestleMania VI - 4.5
WrestleMania 1 - 4.5
2011 Royal Rumble - 4.5
1997 Royal Rumble - 5
WrestleMania IX - 5
1988 Royal Rumble - 5.5
WrestleMania XI - 6
Survivor Series 2000 - 6
Global Warning Tour 2002 - 6.5
WrestleMania III - 6.5
Insurrextion 2001 - 6.5
WrestleMania XIV - 7
1989 Royal Rumble - 7
No Mercy 2000 - 7
Judgment Day 2002 - 7.5
WrestleMania XII - 7.5
2003 Royal Rumble - 7.5
1994 Royal Rumble - 7.5
Insurrextion 2000 - 7.5
No Way Out 2001 - 7.5
2004 Royal Rumble - 7.5
King of the Ring 2002 - 8
1990 Royal Rumble - 8
WrestleMania VIII - 8.5
2008 Royal Rumble - 9
Rebellion 2000 - 9
Rebellion 2001 - 9
1998 Royal Rumble - 9.5
WrestleMania 2000 - 10
Vengeance 2001 - 10
Unforgiven 2002 - 10.5
No Mercy 2001 - 10.5
Armageddon 2002 - 10.5
King of the Ring 2001 - 11
Invasion 2001 - 11
1991 Royal Rumble - 11.5
WrestleMania 23 - 11.5
WrestleMania X - 11.5
WrestleMania 27 - 12
Unforgiven 2001 - 12
2007 Royal Rumble - 12
No Way Out 2002 - 12.5
WrestleMania XX - 12.5
1996 Royal Rumble - 13
SummerSlam 2000 - 13
WrestleMania 29 - 13.5
WrestleMania VII - 13.5
Survivor Series 2001 - 13.5
No Way Out 2000 - 13.5
1992 Royal Rumble - 13.5
King of the Ring 2000 - 14.5
WrestleMania X8 - 14.5
WrestleMania 13 - 14.5
Unforgiven 2000 - 15
Vengeance 2002 - 15
Judgment Day 2001 - 15
2009 Royal Rumble - 15
No Mercy 2002 - 15.5
WrestleMania 26 - 15.5
1995 Royal Rumble - 15.5
Backlash 2002 - 16
WrestleMania 28 - 16
2005 Royal Rumble - 17
2000 Royal Rumble - 17
Judgement Day 2000 - 17
2002 Royal Rumble - 17.5
WrestleMania 24 - 18
No Mercy 2008 - 19
WrestleMania 21 - 19
WrestleMania 25 - 20
Suvivor Series 2002 - 20
2001 Royal Rumble - 20
WrestleMania 22 - 20.5
Backlash 2001 - 20.5
Fully Loaded 2000 - 20.5
WrestleMania X7 - 23
SummerSlam 2001 - 23
SummerSlam 2002 - 24
Backlash 2000 - 25
WrestleMania XIX - 29.5


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Just finished dbryan podcast w/ scsa good listen recommend it

Anyways in the mood for some :bryan any recs, preferably his roh/japan/ wwe gems are Ive seen most of his well know wwe stuff or Ive just rewatch some


----------



## Cleavage (Apr 19, 2005)

Fuckin' Bad Blood 2003


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Just finished dbryan podcast w/ scsa good listen recommend it
> 
> Anyways in the mood for some :bryan any recs, preferably his roh/japan/ wwe gems are Ive seen most of his well know wwe stuff or Ive just rewatch some


- Anything with Nigel McGuinness
- Matches with Tyler Black (Seth Rollins) on ROH on HDnet
- Anything 2005-2009 basically

Bryan Danielson's the fucking man


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Cal, have you seen the 8 man tag on the Raw before Summerslam 2002? Trips/Lance Storm/Test/Christian vs Taker/Goldust/Booker/Rock? Pretty fun, I thought.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I will have seen it, just not in years .


----------



## Cleavage (Apr 19, 2005)

please tell me you watched the two Eddie/Benoit vs. Rock/Eddie matches before SummerSlam 2002 Cal?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I've definitely seen them and remember at least one of them . But I haven't seen much from 2002 in terms of TV in YEARS.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So, since I'm not in the mood to really watch an 05 PPV just decided to start watching the 04 TV, I put on the first SD of the year on 1-1-04 and the first match is REY VS TAJIRI :mark: 

Really not looking forward to this month of Holly being at the top of the card though


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Rey and Tajiri have had some good matches together :mark:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Literally :lmao at how funny Teddy Long's gimmick is on this first RAW episode of 04, he just calls everyone a racist :lol


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Shield vs Rhodes Dynasty/Big Show & Danielson vs Rowan. Oh my YES. 

Every week, I swear.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

*Royal Rumble 1998*

Goldust vs. Vader: ***3/4*
Minis Match: *ARMDRAG*
Rock vs. Shamrock: *****
LOD vs. NAO: ***
Royal Rumble Match: ****1/2*
Undertaker vs. Michaels: *****1/4*

-Opener was not too bad, but it was too short to really develop into anything, especially considering the talents involved in it. The buildup to this match consisted of Goldust dressing in drag. Vader is freakishly over, but grossly misused. Fun, but nothing special.

-ARMDRAG! :jericho

-Most of the action in Rock/Shamrock was above average, but I loved the ending to it. Granted, William Regal and Bret Hart did it better, but Rock did a great job as well. A lot of what makes this match good is the little gestures and taunts that Rock does. Seriously, dude is a hoot. First good match of the entire year.

-LOD and NAO both suck, so no surprises here.

-I used to love the Rumble match, but a lot of this match felt so insignificant and dragged on quite a bit. Tyson certainly added to the fun of it though. That's exactly what this match was: FUN. Austin was steady GOATing, but man if you think this year's Rumble had an obvious winner, you would cringe at how much they made it obvious as to who was winning this.

-What else needs to be said about Michaels/Taker? Best casket match ever.

Overall a good PPV and certainly the best thing from 1998 so far. A lot of the folks outside of this blessed thread call it one of the best Royal Rumble PPVs ever, which would be going way too far as every Royal Rumble from 2000 to 2005 is honestly better than this. Worth a watch for the main event and the rise of both Rock and Austin.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Rating should have been "ARMDRAG, Sunny, & little people jokes."


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

> Goldust vs. Vader: **3/4


Goldust's entrance music makes that match GOAT worthy.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Artist Formally Known as Goldust, please. Praying for a win was awesome too. But damn. It was an iconic pop star art fiend wrestling every week during that gimmick. <3


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Since it is Christmas


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Goldust freaks me out


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Artist Formally Known as Christmas would have been a bossy name for the JOY~!


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

SaviorBeeRad™ said:


> Goldust freaks me out


But "The Deadman" doesn't?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Undertaker & Goldust. 

:mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Downloading 2003 PPV's atm so I can continue RAMBLING. Got Vengeance and No Mercy on DVD already so I can get started with them while I wait for the rest to download. And of course WM and RR are already done too. Can't wait for those RAW PPV's... :|.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Downloading 2003 PPV's atm so I can continue RAMBLING. Got Vengeance and No Mercy on DVD already so I can get started with them while I wait for the rest to download. And of course WM and RR are already done too. Can't wait for those RAW PPV's... :|.




I'm interested to read your No Mercy 03' Rambles, specifically for the Taker/Lesnar match. I know a lot of people dislike it, especially the finish, but I actually dug it. Not on par with their 2 matches in 02' of course, but still really enjoyable. How can you NOT enjoy a match with those two? It just does not compute.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I watched it about a year ago and rather enjoyed it. Below their 02 matches for sure but I don't get the hate that some cunt faced twats have for it (LOOKING AT YOU BITCH. YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE). Can't wait to relive A-Train nearly killing Benoit with a chair and a botch .


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Can't wait for all the rambles on HHH's 2003 PPV bouts.

Gonna be funny as fuck.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

HHH VS STEINER. HHH VS NASH. HHH VS GOLDBERG. THE PAIN!!!


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

WrestlingforEverII said:


> Can't wait for all the rambles on HHH's 2003 PPV bouts.
> 
> Gonna be funny as fuck.



Oh definitely. The Royal Rumble should be an instant classic. I wish someone else would watch the tremendous movie "Bronson" starring Tom Hardy about the life of Mickey Peterson, just so they can see the similarities in Cal's rants and Peterson screaming at the prison guards in that movie. I can't read Cal's rambles anymore without picturing him as a big jacked up bald guy with an immaculate mustache screaming at his computer screen about horrible matches.

Edit- here is the trailer for anyone interested in what I'm getting at http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VtkR3Oni1rY


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Already done the RR so it'll just be NWO with HHH and Steiner . http://wrestlingview.co.uk/?p=792


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Already done the RR so it'll just be NWO with HHH and Steiner . http://wrestlingview.co.uk/?p=792



Lmao I love your "play by play" for the Steiner/Trips match. I agree with you that Triple H was never the same after he came back in 2002 all bulked up. He was about two or three times as good when he was all ripped and muscular from 1999-2001. Once his abs disappeared and he got that bit of belly and his thighs got so big they touched in the middle, he just didn't bump or work the same. It's like he was caught between working as a legit big man or a Flair-esque technical heel. Maybe I'm over thinking it.

I remember precisely zippo from No Way Out 2003. I'm curious to see who is the PPV worker of the year from 2003, there are about 4-5 guys I could see deserving it.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Some highlights from No way Out 2003 was that it had an awesome crowd, return of SCSA, JR's marking out of that return lol, Hollywood Rock hilarious heel work against Hogan and the 2 on 3 Handicap match.

The other stuff ranged from ok to shit.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I didn't care for any of those things you mentioned . Rock/Hogan was horrible and nothing HOLLYWOOD Rock could change. I was never and honestly still ain't a big Steve Austin fan so his return meant fuck all to me, plus the fight with Bischoff was terrible . And I also never thought much to the handicap match either. Add Steiner/HHH and fuck me the prospect of watching this event makes me wanna do a Titus O'Neil.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I liked the handicap match


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Of course you do.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

WatchWrestling has the War Games DVD up so I decided to randomly check out the 1997 match to see what this gimmick is all about and because BENOIT is in a WWE DVD. 

Pretty good match, cool concept with the two rings and the double-cross was a surprise I didn't see coming. Also pleased that WWE did not edit out every single piece of commentary that mentions Benoit's name like they did with MITB.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Gonna pick up a whole bunch of DVDs I`ve missed this year for Christmas. Should be a fun few weeks when I go home in 10 days.

Has anybody else noticed that the tag division this year is better than it`s been in over 10 years? We actually have a whole bunch of teams (Real Americans, SHIELD, CodeDust, PTP, AxelBack, EWsos, Los Matadores, we even got Punk and Bryan teaming up for a little bit) that can face up with each other on a week to week basis, just remove Jimmy & Jey though WWE PLZ.

Thankfully since we're going to have an undisputed belt, it means that we have less CLOWNS as World Champion like Ziggler doeeeeee (I'm really starting to dislike Dolph and how his whole gimmick is basically "HEY! THIS IS ALL FAKE AND I DON'T CARE ABOUT WINNING! I JUST WANNA STEAL THE SHOW!" which pretty much removes all intensity from his matches from there on out, that's a weird reason I know, but I'll go in depth with this later once I think about it more. When I see Dolph, all I see are forced promos and forced in ring work. Okay so I'm still between the brackets, so I'm gonna shut my mouth :lol.).


----------



## Kurt 'Olympic Gold (Jul 6, 2006)

http://shop.wwe.com/WWE-RAW-20th-An...?dwvar_W06587_color=No Color&start=1&cgid=New

Does anyone know if this also will be released on Bluray and/or in Europe (DVD or Bluray)?


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Since I want to get back into WWE and stuff (post 2008), can you tell me the most memorable matches/promos/segments in the like past five years? Or is there any website where the big events are listed? 

For example, I just watched that CM Punk shoot from 2011 for the first tiem and I'm amazed the WWE let it through (given it was a worked shoot) and I'd like to know what else was huge since then.

I started watching just before Survivor Series (which was quite awful).


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Cena Vs Brock.

Just watch the entire feud that lasted a month, & the match. DO IT.

& CM Punk's heel work on the stick in 2012/2013.

& SHIELD.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

HBK VS UNDERTAKER - WM25

It's a must watch for every wrestling fan.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

DoubtGin said:


> Since I want to get back into WWE and stuff (post 2008), can you tell me the most memorable matches/promos/segments in the like past five years? Or is there any website where the big events are listed?
> 
> For example, I just watched that CM Punk shoot from 2011 for the first tiem and I'm amazed the WWE let it through (given it was a worked shoot) and I'd like to know what else was huge since then.
> 
> I started watching just before Survivor Series (which was quite awful).


Orton vs. Cena I Quit Match [Breaking Point 2009]
Orton vs. Cena Iron Man Match [Bragging Rights 2009]
Michaels vs. Undertaker WM 25
Michaels vs. Undertaker WM 26
Cena vs. CM Punk Money in the Bank 2011
Orton vs. Christian Over the Limit 2011
Cena vs. The Rock 2012 [if you want a big match feel]
Cena vs. Lesnar Extreme Rules 2012
Del Rio vs. Ziggler Payback 2013
CM Punk vs. Lesnar Summerslam 2013


Why cut it off at 2008, though? There was so much good stuff from the earlier part of the decade. 

A couple of people have made lists for the best matches of individual performers:

Top 60 Undertaker Matches
Top 100 Randy Orton Matches
Top 50 John Cena Matches [WWE list]
Top 100 John Cena Matches - [100-91 | 90-76 | 75-51 | 50-41 | 40-26 | 25-16 | 15-11 | 10-6 | 5-1]

Also, someone is doing a top Triple H matches soon.

I'm someone who just came back to wrestling this year too, so I found all of this helpful. Particularly the Orton thread, as he's the one who caught my attention the most this year. Going back and watching his old stuff, actually got me caught up on pretty much all of wrestling's major happenings and characters while I was away.

I'm sure more people will chime in.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I watched every Brock Lesnar match and most John Cena & Mark Henry matches in 2013. That's pretty fucking insane.

Punk is up next though, making my way through that pretty slow until this semester's over and I'm watching 15-25 Punk matches a DAY :mark: :mark: :mark:.


----------



## JY57 (Jul 31, 2012)

SS DVD Cover


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

DoubtGin said:


> Since I want to get back into WWE and stuff (post 2008), can you tell me the most memorable matches/promos/segments in the like past five years? Or is there any website where the big events are listed?
> 
> For example, I just watched that CM Punk shoot from 2011 for the first tiem and I'm amazed the WWE let it through (given it was a worked shoot) and I'd like to know what else was huge since then.
> 
> I started watching just before Survivor Series (which was quite awful).


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> The Artist Formally Known as Christmas would have been a bossy name for the JOY~!


If only I didn't change my name just yesterday and waited. :side:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

BAD FUCKING NEWS:

http://hotfile.com/

Hotfile has been shut down, maybe for good. So all links are pretty much dead for the matches, sorry about that but its out of my control. I can't see me uploading all these matches again but will try to continue to upload on another site, but i may just call it a day for now unless Hotfile gets back online.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Well, that sucks. Why do these federal cunts always have to take down the good sites? Hotfile and megaupload were the best of the bunch. Next they'll probably shut down mediafire. 

Oh well, in these digital days we'll always be able to retrieve uploads that are no longer working. And for wrestling, hopefully we'll have XWT for a long time to use!


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Well, that sucks. Why do these federal cunts always have to take down the good sites? Hotfile and megaupload were the best of the bunch. Next they'll probably shut down mediafire.


Yeah mate, sooo annoying. I was thinking of switching to Mediafire at some point, but think i'll take an extended break. Kinda lost the motivation now tbh.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

After HF went to shits the first time, and RS went to all hell and MU died completely I gave up too. Now I just do the odd upload to DM and keep it private (speaking of which... I have 4 Raw 04 matches on my PC to upload. Ooops ).


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Is rapidshare still around? It used to be my second option after megaupload back in the old days but I hated the long wait (it was like 90 seconds) for the download to become available followed by another long wait until you could download from them again. It was lifted last time I was there which is probably 2 or 3 years ago.

For TV matches, WWE have uploaded plenty of stuff on their channel. I think they'll take it down when they launch Network so some of us who want stuff in HQ should get to downloading them. I DLed their high quality upload of Shelton vs HBK from 2005 yesterday. If it ever gets taken down, I have it saved.  Oh and CAL, get to working!


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I *think* RS is still around, but utterly shite compared to what they were. Back in the day it was decent speeds for free users, and pretty cheap for premium users. Plus with the amount of files I had online and the downloads they were getting, I was earning enough RS Points to keep my account premium for free for AGES. I think it lasted about 2 years with me not having to pay a thing .

I completely moved away from that kind of downloading now. Usenet FTW, with torrents for stuff that I might not be able to find (mainly wrestling).

I remember trying to upload one of the 04 matches the other week and DM kept telling me that I DIDN'T OWN IT lol. Yet they would wait until I was like 90% done before they would say it. And with my shitty slow upload speed getting to 90% took like an hour .


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> After HF went to shits the first time, and RS went to all hell and MU died completely I gave up too. Now I just do the odd upload to DM and keep it private (speaking of which... I have 4 Raw 04 matches on my PC to upload. Ooops ).


Yeah Cal, ill probably do the same. Just the odd upload/request every now and again. 

Really puts you off tbh.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> After HF went to shits the first time, and RS went to all hell and *MU* died completely I gave up too. Now I just do the odd upload to DM and keep it private (speaking of which... I have 4 Raw 04 matches on my PC to upload. Ooops ).


MegaUpload


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Luke Harper's festive Lariat said:


> MegaUpload


Now that was the best IMO. Always had great DL speeds, even for free users.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I got screwed with MU. I bought a LIFETIME account and dammit I'm still alive but my account isn't!!! 

Hmmm... should I start my 03 Ramblings tonight. If so, Vengeance or No Mercy. Hmmm. Might save Vengeance for last since I know it kinda rocks already and outside of WM 19 which I've already done I can't think of a better event from 03 and I'd like to end on something good. No Mercy is pretty fucking sweet too... maybe I should just wait until the others have downloaded so I can save one of these for last and save the other for like, in between what is likely going to be some shite .


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

End of an era, HF unk3

Why am I supposed to dislike The Usos?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> End of an era, HF unk3
> 
> Why am I supposed to dislike The Usos?



Because they look like they belong on an episode of Dora the Explorer? Because they have no character and are average workers at best? Because they are essentially a tag team version of Kofi Kingston, nothing they do looks like it has any impact, and they were created solely to appeal to children under 12? I don't know. They are the definition of entertainers pretending to be wrestlers to me, not real wrestlers. There is absolutely a difference I think. I'm not shitting on anyone for liking them, I just do not see how anyone over 12 can enjoy their act. I'd love to hear their appeal explained to me. Just because they aren't horrid in the ring? Whoop de friggin do, when did that become the standard for professional wrestling? Their kicks, punches, and slams look like they might tickle a bit, but never hurt, no matter how hard they slap their thighs when delivering that awful super kick.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> Well, that sucks. Why do these federal cunts always have to take down the good sites? Hotfile and megaupload were the best of the bunch. Next they'll probably shut down mediafire.
> 
> Oh well, in these digital days we'll always be able to retrieve uploads that are no longer working. And for wrestling, hopefully we'll have XWT for a long time to use!


Fuck, Megaupload used to be fantastic. Fairly fast download times and it was pretty much the universal one on here for matches/shows.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I personally don't give a fuck about how childish or unappealing they (and their punches and kicks) are, as long as I can enjoy their work I'm good, and I find them fun to watch. Especially when they're in there with DAT SHIELD.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> Fuck, Megaupload used to be fantastic. Fairly fast download times and it was pretty much the universal one on here for matches/shows.


Megaupload was perfect. Fast downloads and easy to find stuff in it just from google searching. When I downloaded a music album, I would just search for the name with "megaupload" written in front of it and among the first results was a DL link.

Also used it frequently during the 2006 football world cup for videos. Oh, the memories. :sad:


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Usos are freaking awesome. Fuck the haters.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> I got screwed with MU. I bought a LIFETIME account and dammit I'm still alive but my account isn't!!!
> 
> Hmmm... should I start my 03 Ramblings tonight. If so, Vengeance or No Mercy. Hmmm. Might save Vengeance for last since I know it kinda rocks already and outside of WM 19 which I've already done I can't think of a better event from 03 and I'd like to end on something good. No Mercy is pretty fucking sweet too... maybe I should just wait until the others have downloaded so I can save one of these for last and save the other for like, in between what is likely going to be some shite .


2003 PPV ramblings? DEM HUNTER MATCHES :mark:


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Ever since megaupload went down I've almost completely given up on those sorts of media hosting sites. Better off uploading matches to youtube and setting the videos to 'unlisted' so they don't get taken down.


Yeah I still don't see a good reason to hate the Usos.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> Ever since megaupload went down I've almost completely given up on those sorts of media hosting sites. Better off uploading matches to youtube and setting the videos to 'unlisted' so they don't get taken down.


Yeah that would be better, if they ever remove my 'strike' so i can upload videos more than 15mins long. :frustrate


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

So just like, make a new account?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> So just like, make a new account?


Could do lol  Just gotta make another gmail account too though i guess...


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

You don't just need a gmail account/google related account . So if you have an old hotmail account or shit that should be fine. I set up YT accounts with domain name emails .


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I create youtube accounts using random ass mail names. Problem is when I am logged off and need to remember my password but can't recover it because I forgot and used a throwaway mail account.

It's also annoying that there's a limit to how many times you can use your phone numbers to get the code for access to long uploads.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> You don't just need a gmail account/google related account . So if you have an old hotmail account or shit that should be fine. I set up YT accounts with domain name emails .


Oh cool, yeah i have a Hotmail account too i could use. Tar


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

NWO 03 just finished. I looked through it to make sure the quality was good... and fuck me... I'm not looking forward to eventually watching it :lmao. But it's gonna be at least another day before I get started as I plan on fucking around with my PC 2morrow, installing a new SSD I just got along with WINDOWS 8 (with a Windows 7 "shell" so it looks and functions very much like Win 7 and I can avoid all this APPS and NO DESKTOP bullshit that Win 8 is obsessed with lol). Which will likely mean something will fuck up and not work right and it'll take me ages to fix OR I'll just end up putting Win 7 back on . Just spent the last couple of hours making sure I have installers for all my drivers + programs + steam game backups and man oh man I will need a fucking day just to install everything :lmao. Thank fuck I don't have to backup any files! 

Fremantle went from impressing me with quick deliveries to fucking me off... with deliveries :lmao. Ordered the Nov 2012 Live in the UK as I realised I needed that one too, and it was on offer like the April 2013 one that I already ordered. So I bought it on Monday morning, it got posted that afternoon... and looks like I might get it 2morrow at the earliest now! Bah. Then again it could just be the black hole that is my local postal service... which is hilarious because I'm about to go self employed and my "job" will involve me making (hopefully) lots of trips to the post office :lmao. Also I will never be selling DVD's again.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Watched the first RAW of 2011, and what an awesome episode that was. Miz vs Morrison is a great TV match. Morrison was a madman here, can't believe he ended up teaming with Snooki at WM after all the momentum he gained during that time. The main event between Sheamus, Barrett and Orton was really good as well. Nice use of the cage and good swerve at the end.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

That Bad News Barrett gimmick is on TV now :lmao


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> which is hilarious because I'm about to go self employed and my "job" will involve me making (hopefully) lots of trips to the post office :lmao.


Is that wise?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Fairly certain we plan on sending everything out recorded, so it shouldn't be too bad :side: .


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Best of luck mate. Wish i could go self-employed tbh, if i had something to do that is


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

If you think NWO 2003 was bad, take a look at NWO 98. Even the worst PPVs of this year are leagues above this trash.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> If you think NWO 2003 was bad, take a look at NWO 98. Even the worst PPVs of this year are leagues above this trash.


I quite liked the main event, even with Savio Vega


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Pretty much everything from 1998 PPV is terrible minus like, 6 matches .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

LOVE that Miz/Morrison match! probably the best miz singles match ever, gave it **** on the last watch

Morrison should of won, I'd be fine with Cena/Morrison being the ME of mania, better than Cena/miz at least


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

SURPRISE~! I'm not a fan of Miz/Morrison . WM 27 main event should have been Cena Vs KING SHEAMUS.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Even Taker/Cena was rumoured for WM27....wasn't it? And they tried to get Brock for that year too.

Oh well.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Hey, don't be slighting No Way Out 1998. The main event was great. 

And without the AE mark in me coming out, I'd still say the 1998 PPVs were better than today because a) matches mattered b) titles mattered and c) the booking was on the whole a lot less idiotic and self-damaging.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

SHEAMUS. Certainly a better option than Moz.

CAL, are you uploading those 04 vids? It's certainly better than watching NWO 03.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

But matches sucked and booking was still retired with non stop SWERVES that half the time didn't make sense .

THE SHIELD have had more good matches than 98 and 99 COMBINED (PPV and TV) in just one year.

EDIT: I have no intentions on watching NWO 03 for a few days anyway . Uploading a match from Raw 04 atm though .


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Thought they were heading towards Cena/Punk. Instead Punk attacked Orton for no real reason (oh yes.. because Orton cost him his championship THREE YEARS AGO~!) and Cena had his infamous match with Miz...


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Soooooo, in my rewatching of 2013 matches for a top 10-15 or so, I just watched the Del Rio/Ziggler matches from Payback and MITB. Payback is of course really good, and still holds up, but the MITB for me is also pretty good. Dolph's dropkicks are really nice, and I love Del Rio using the inverted suplex from the top rope. The AJ stuff at MITB didn't do it for me, but I get why they did it. There was a fan right behind her that yelled "I LOVE YOU, AJ!" :lmao :lmao He was also seen snapping a photo of her. So glad the camera caught that. :lmao It worked out well for these two that their matches were in Chicago and Philadelphia, because those crowds were really good, and they both loved Dolph, heel or face. The Payback match is so special. Dolph staying alive for so long, and getting in the Zig Zag, but not being able to make the cover. Del Rio's kick's :mark:

Payback *****1/4*
MITB ****1/2*


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

HollyJollyHelmsley said:


> That Bad News Barrett gimmick is on TV now :lmao


And I will take it! anything to have Wade back on TV, just hope it leads to something of course.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Honestly even the titles didn't feel that important outside of the WWE title. The tag division was shallow, the IC title was treated well half the time and treated like crap in the other half, and nobody gave a damn about any of the other titles.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

That's obvious, they clearly have no idea what to do with their mid card talent at all.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

*Matt Hardy (c) vs. Rey Mysterio - WWE Cruiserweight Championship - WWE Smackdown 6/5/2003: ***3/4*

Rey Mysterio goes into this match with a groin injury and he's wrestling for the title in front of his wife and kids who are in attendance. The match starts off with Rey trying to go for a quick pin, demonstrating his speed advantage against the bigger Hardy, but Matt gets in control. Rey makes a small comeback until Shannon Moore and Crash Holly (his M'Fers who are at ringside) attacked Rey as he was out of the ring and the ref kicked them out, leaving Matt alone. Matt gets in complete control when Rey tries to go for a swinging neckbreaker and Matt low blows him where the ref couldn't see it. Matt makes good work of the leg as it contributes to his groin injury and a good way to kill Rey's speed. Rey sells the injury really well as he tries to go for the 619 but his leg and his groin injury was too much and Matt took advantage of that. The match escalates to some very good back and forth action with Rey doing a spinning DDT, Matt doing a Side Effect off of the second rope, and Rey even doing the Twist of Fate. The climax of the match reaches as Rey got into the ring before the count out and Matt distracts the ref so Crash and Moore could return to attack Rey so Matt could steal the victory. Matt executes a top rope leg drop but Rey kicks out at 2. Matt gets frustrated and that turns out to be his downfall as Rey takes advantage for a quick pin and ultimately the victory. Rey then celebrates with his son which is a nce, heartwarming moment. Really good match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

:mark: love that Rey/Hardy match. Main evented SD that week too, which really put over the CW title especially for a new champ at the end of it. One of the many reasons I miss the brand split; with 2 months between PPV's they could really put over other titles by having matches main event the shows and build them up without them looking out of place. I mean, can you imagine BIG E defending the IC title in the main event of Raw? Would be viewed as a joke lol.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

I miss the Cruiserweight title.  FUCK HORNSWOGGLE


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I honestly think the WWE has enough talent ATM to bring back the brand split

They just need to make more talent credible


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> :mark: love that Rey/Hardy match. Main evented SD that week too, which really put over the CW title especially for a new champ at the end of it. One of the many reasons I miss the brand split; with 2 months between PPV's they could really put over other titles by having matches main event the shows and build them up without them looking out of place. I mean, can you imagine BIG E defending the IC title in the main event of Raw? Would be viewed as a joke lol.


All the titles had value during the brand extension when they got rid of the unnecessary extras like Hardcore and European Championship. Cruiserweight for the smaller guys on Smackdown, tag titles, midcard championships and World Titles for each brand. Even the women's championship main evented a Raw.

And yeah, nowadays if a midcard champion is put in the main event, nobody will take it seriously because of how much they've devalued everything except the main titles.

Shit, once I'm done with the Attitude Era years, I might have to go through SD 03 and Raw 04 again. So much great stuff to watch over and over.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

And the brand split can go a long way to HELP talent get credible again. Never truly understood why they got rid of it to begin with. They just seemed to say "FUCK SMACKDOWN" and focused on Raw which made SD ratings die, then they decided to include everyone on Raw anyway. The fuck? I kinda get that single brand PPV's might not have been doing so well with buyrates, and they did go back to dual branded shows again right before they shifted everyone to Raw... so they could still do that until they re-build the brands again.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Cena/Orton should have happened at WM 27 IMO. Please God let this not happen at 30


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Chris Benoit Vs Shawn Michaels - Raw May 3rd 2004

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k2ULkUkyoDP1mA50agQ (Private)


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Woooooooooooo! KingCAL strikes again! :mark:

Gonna wait for the video to fully process before downloading it.

Do you have any other years in great quality? Not that most of them need it as much as Raw 04 because for some reason, the 04 videos are always the worst quality.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Have up to April with SD 04, all of Raw 03, and that's about it really. Rest I either have as downloads, not at all, and then Raw 00 and 01 which are ok but are rather old now and have likely been re-done as far as DVD sets go with better quality.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Goldust vs Ryback tonight. I'm excited at the prospects. WWE pumping out Goldust matches left and right. :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

ehhh I'll give it a watch, havent been interested in watching two men in tights grabbing each other in a week or so


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Goldust yey. Ryback meh. Very meh. Mr Meh.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Can't wait till Moops hears about this.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Edge & Chris Benoit Vs Randy Orton & Batista - Raw May 17th 2004

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k4Hm8kdgTlqqre50aRC (Private)


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

*No Way Out 1998*

-Marc Mero & TAFKA Goldust vs. Headbangers: ***
-TAKA Michinoku vs. Pantera: ***1/2*
-Godwinns vs. Quebecers: *DUD*
-Bradshaw vs. Jeff Jarrett: ***
-NOD vs. Shamrock/Johnson/DOA: **1/2*
-Kane vs. Vader: ****
-Funk/Foley/Austin/Owen vs. DX: ***1/2*

-What have they done to Goldust here? Dude looks horrible, but he's still the best thing in this match. So boring and all the crowd cares about is Sable.

-MOTN, but very sloppy and plodding. Pantera sucks. Simple as that. The semi-racist commentary provided by the Lawlers was kinda funny in all honesty. Some cool stuff like Pantera's over the rope senton and Michinoku's back selling, but other than that, it's equivalent to the worst possible WCW Cruiserweight match.

-The only enjoyable thing in this match is Jacques Rougeau's scream before he got slammed. Horrible.

-Another boring match that also had a terrible build-up especially for a title match. Jeff Jarrett might be the worst wrestler in the business in 97-98.

-This should have been so much better, but the only two people worth a damn in this match are Shamrock and Rock, and Shamrock had an off day. Another slow, plodding, weak brawl that should have been on Shotgun Saturday.

-This match wasn't that bad, but it was worked completely wrong. Why wouldn't you let Kane/Vader be a big man slugfest? Instead it was treated as a near-comedy with tons of moments of boring action. That wrench is huge though.

-I tried my best. I really did. I tried to like this, but it's just more plodding brawling that acts as filler. It started off really fun with the faces beating the crap out of the heels, but once the action spilled over to the outside, the energy disappeared. Owen Hart looked so lost throughout all of this, and Savio Vega was a net negative. The camera also panned too often to Austin, which led to some chairshots to be missed. If it were up to me, I would send everyone here besides maybe Foley and Funk to a learning session conducted by The Shield in order to understand how to properly work a multi-man tag match that has some semblance of structure and isn't just people hitting each other with soft aluminum.

What a terrible PPV with a card that best fits a C-level television show. Funk/Foley and Pantera/Christopher from a couple weeks ago were far better than anything from here.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Goldust became a joke after Pillman's death. It made sense to turn on his wife but he became a comedy act after that by dressing as different wrestlers and then he feuded with Mero :lol. At least he got serious when he turned against Foley after Mania. I need to watch AE 1998 episodes again, sixth form work is keeping me busy at the moment so hopefully I resume watching in Christmas.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Sadly, I pretty much categorically agree with everything you said about that main event tag. It just was not that good at all. I got really excited when I saw it on the IYH set, and tried 3 different times to watch it and see the appeal. Nothing. This should NOT be possible. I'm a huge fan of big tags in the main event of B PPV's, of Mick Foley, of Terry Funk, and I like Austin well enough most times too. But that match does nothing for me, just senseless wild brawling with no real structure. Everything that was GREAT about the Final Four match with all that wicked brawling around the ring, is not existent in this one. Oh well, this is probably the only Foley main event match I'd give under *** during his WWF/E tenure, that's a damn good track record.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

It really is a shame because of all the world-class talent in that match. Three of the greatest brawlers of all-time and one of the best overall wresters in North American history on one team. What went wrong? At least now Foley is getting more television time along with Funk, even if Funk's legacy is being disgraced by this horrible gimmick. All that is interesting me now is Austin/Tyson and Kane/Undertaker, and Undertaker has barely done anything.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Taker was still selling the casket fire segment after Rumble, right?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Yeah, but prior to Royal Rumble, he didn't really do much in the build-up to the casket match.

:lol at all these dumpster spots. Shame that it led to another very bad match. I'll also add The Jackyl to the list of guys that are a net positive.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> But matches sucked and booking was still retired with non stop SWERVES that half the time didn't make sense .
> 
> THE SHIELD have had more good matches than 98 and 99 COMBINED (PPV and TV) in just one year.


Different strokes, I guess.

I thought it was a highly entertaining match. All building up to the Austin hot tag, including when the ref didn't see it and he couldn't get in. I enjoyed the brawling, as well. It seemed to elevate the feuds among all of the guys, also, I felt. Even Shawn not being there and them playing up how Shawn not showing up because he was afraid. They tried to really keep the in ring confrontation between the two until WM14, which was smart (and necessary since Shawn's back was fucked). On top of that, it was done at a time when hardcore matches weren't as prevalent. They were still somewhat novel, in the context of the time period, and didn't become overplayed until the institution of the hardcore title later in the year.

But its fine if other people like it. Guys here love the Benoit/Finlay JD06 match and I thought it was pretty average, personally. We all have your opinions.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

The first half of the NWO 98 main event was shit hot, but then it descended into ordinary tag team affair but with Funk and Foley being the faces in peril. Everybody was just waiting for Austin to get the hot tag, which made about half of the match passable. Should've just been an all out war for 20 minutes.

The actual match quality in 1998/99 WWF wasn't the best - hell sometimes it sucked and was sloppy as hell - but at least the people were interested. Not just the main eventers, but even in the midcard. NWO 98 is a poor illustration of this because the roster was still pretty thin, but once guys like Val Venis, D'Lo Brown, Edge, Gangrel, Al Snow etc. showed up, the whole gamut of characters expanded and matches actually _mattered_, rather than just have two mannequins fight each other because one guy looked at another guy the wrong way. 

I'd rather have half decent matches with incredible build and storytelling rather than **** matches that don't mean shit because they have no reason to fight.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

But what makes a match in that four-star range IS the storytelling. The subtleties and details that come with in-ring storytelling is always very interesting. A match that just has a string of well-executed maneuvers with no feeling is not a good match. Storytelling and match quality are not mutually or even partially exclusive. For me though, 2000 was really when the roster reached its peak and we had the perfect medium of wrestling and storylines. 1999 in hindsight was not very good with regards to stories. Rock/Mankind is an all-time great feud and Rock/Austin was good, but no other title feud had both a good storyline and even average matches. It also doesn't help that the only PPVs that were good in 1999 were Backlash, Summerslam, and No Mercy.

Unfortunately the RAW after NWO 98 is not very good outside of The Rock once again. I swear, this man has to be the MVP of 98 so far, and I don't know if that will change especially since he was my second favorite after going through 1998 the first time. He was also one of my first favorites when I started watching wrestling in late 98. Dude is carrying this midcard.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

True true. A good example of what I mean though is these relentless six man Shield matches against Cody/Goldust/Bryan/whoever. They get rave reviews every week, and yeah they were fun to watch the first couple of times, but now they're booked out there every damn week. Twice a week if they're on Smackdown, and it's getting kinda stale. Fair play if you're into that but I get no thrills out of these matches anymore. Not until they have an actual reason to fight anyway.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I guess the thing with "makeshift" matches is that if there isn't an existing storyline going into the match, it's the wrestlers' responsibilities to make one in the ring. That's the beauty of all these Shield matches. All three members understand the intricacies of how to play a heel in a tag team environment, and all three of them are great at interacting with the crowd, taunting other wrestlers, filling up time, and bumping like crazy in order to make the face's comeback look exciting. For me personally, I would take a great match with a horrible storyline (Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio) over a world-class storyline with a bad match (Randy Orton vs. Triple H).


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Goldust was the man with the Artist gimmick. lol @ joke :kobe


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

I meant booking wise...


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

In what capacity? Win/loss record wasn't exactly a focal point for the character at the time. He was more "show than go" under the guise.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

If you enjoy him then good but his feud with mero and sable wasnt good personally for me. I liked his feud with Vader were he was acting like a mad man who just lost his wife and some of his impersonations were hilarious. Such as the HHH one against Owen Hart. But not a big fan of his early 98 stuff.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

LMFAO at his impersonation of his father. Gotta give him that. The stuff with Mero and Sable though was really bad. And the Headbangers matches were even worse. He also doesn't get a chance to show his exquisite in-ring greatness. I've seen better matches from Kofi Kingston than from TAFKA Goldust, Mero, and the Headbangers so far. Luna Vachon is quite the woman though. Crazy how her son was in Hell's Kitchen.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Anything with Mero in WWF was generally limited to being bad or uninteresting. Which is why Sable always got the attention. You cared when you saw her. Mero was a scrub then. Unsure why they even pitted Goldust with Mero as any sort of angle. It was for two reasons: to give Goldust & Sable both random exposure. Oh the Attitude Era is chalk full of so much bad. Being on the high in 2000/2001 was lightning in a bottle.

Company really was hard to watch for a lot of that time. It isn't too much fun outside of a handful of folk. _(till named good years)_


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Have you started the Benoit/Booker Best of Seven series yet? I think I actually prefer their two other Nitro matches a month before the series over most of the matches in the Best of Seven. I'm also shocked by how over Finlay was back then. Dude got nuclear heat. That match with Enos is a sleeper gem.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

No, I'm doing the backtrack work on the Nitro's I missed for SuperBrawl & Uncensored. Been a day or two since I continued the Slamboree build. Possibly later I'll jump on those. Booker vs Benoit II was so rad. Spring Stampede was a good match, but inferior to their second I have to say. At least it was still good.

Finlay vs Enos owns. Seen it tons by lucking out in having it on a random DVD. Random WCW matches scattered about on those. Fun stuff. Lack Goldberg goodness though.

btw Raven vs Mortis & DDP vs Wrath from 1/26 are quality. Mortis does a hell of a steel step spot to Raven.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Can't wait till Moops hears about this.


Haven't been watching Goldust v. guys I like, so I won't go out of my way to watch him against Ryback. I'll probably do a best of WWE 2013 list one day so I can catch up on what I missed. Will include literally every Goldust match. No bullshit. Every single one.



funnyfaces1 said:


> -I tried my best. I really did. I tried to like this, but it's just more plodding brawling that acts as filler.


That isn't filler you FOOL. THE MATCH WAS A BRAWL. 

FOOOOOOL.

I love that match. 


Goldust/Mero feud produced some perfectly fine matches, I thought. Worst thing about it was that Goldust seemed so pathetic and sissy that it became hard for people to cheer for him during it. I dunno why people hate Marc Mero. He's probably a better worker than Kurt Angle. 


You bitches realllllly make me want to do a best of WCW 98. Stop making me want to watch more wrestling than I already have/am. I will set you all on fire.


Might start Fatal 4Way right NOW (IN A FEW MINUTES).


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I have a strange feeling that you won't like a single match on that PPV. Maybe Bourne/Y2J.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I actually liked the opener quite a hell of a lot. Wrote 505 words on it (wrote 9 words on the divas match), and most of it is positive (maybe, I do take time to shit on Kofi Kingston as per NUH DUH).


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Can't wait for you to see Goldust vs Ryback. Haven't watched myself, but it's worth it on your end.

Mero is fine. Although pardon two matches vs Austin, nothing about his WWF tenure stuck out. Liked him in WCW though. And yeah, he's better than Kurt. Most are.

If my memory is correct, McIntyre vs Kofi is one of only about three singles matches that I actually like from the chump. Others being this year vs Cesaro _(the 100% carry job one)_ & holy crap I'm drawing a blank. Ok, maybe it's only two matches. Fatal Four Way isn't a truly horrible show, it's got a mixed bag. One or possibly two really good matches, a DUD with the divas, Miz vs Truth in a laugh riot of pitiful-ness, good six person tag, fun World Championship, & a WWE Championship match that is 16 minutes of nothing.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Was Going to review all the main events of 2013 but went fuck it when I realised that Id have to review Rock/Punk x2, Rock/Cena II, Cena/Ryback 3 Stages of Hell, The two shit Bryan/Orton matches and Orton/Show. For a year of wrestling I've really enjoyed there has been some fucking horrendous main events. 

Going to review the Streak instead, even though they are matches which are duds, its Taker, so Ill watch all of them


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

So Cena is back in my good graces after watching these matches:


*John Cena vs. JBL [I Quit Match] - Judgment Day 2005* - This was fabulous. I read that someone said that this match wasn't really that good, and was just memorable because of the blood. I disagree. It had a big fight feel, and I love that Cena wasn't just getting beaten up the whole time. This is one of those times where the mic actually added to the match, rather than making it comical. I loved JBL's little personality displays, and although the ending felt a little abrupt and "LOL" at first, it made sense for JBL's character. I loved him pointing to his head, and I think it's one of the best booked Cena matches that I've seen. JBL didn't come away looking weak or like he got Supermanned. Instead, he looked like someone who realized it was smarter to live to fight another day.

I was solidly into the match the whole way through, and this was definitely one of my favorite Cena matches.

***** 1/2.*


*John Cena vs. Rob Van Dam - One Night Stand 2006* - First of all, I liked John's all black look and whole entrance here. I liked that he wasn't doing the whole doofus thing, and came in seriously and arrogantly. He played his part perfectly here. I'm really in Cena lovefest mode right now, lol.

What can I say that probably hasn't already been said, but the crowd was magnificently insane. I LOL'ed at the "asshole" chant, because that was one that I wasn't expecting from them, and probably wouldn't have happened if not for Cena's beautiful trolling. Again, he worked the crowd perfectly at that point. The match was solid, but I think that this is an example of how it's hard to really separate the crowd and atmosphere from the match quality. It can't help but contribute (or detract, in some cases).

I was a bit let down by the interference, because I was always under the impression that this was one of the few times that Cena lost cleanly. I just assumed that this would be a time where they'd have him do that, to put over Van Dam big, knowing that that would be a HUGE moment with that crowd. I feel a bit shortchanged, because I'd love to see how that crowd would have reacted to a clean win, but oh well. It's not a big deal, because I felt like the ending (especially with Heyman coming in) actually fit well with the circus-like atmosphere.

**** 3/4*, and definitely a match that everyone should see. Entertaining the whole way through, due to the crazy environment.



*John Cena vs. Umaga - New Year's Revolution 2007* - Great match. This was my first time ever seeing Umaga, and he really is impressive. LOL at him doing those flying back kicks like Owen Hart. And they looked GOOD! Cena's selling was top-notch here, as it also was in their LMS standing match. Cena, Cena, Cena. Why you no do it like this all the time?!?!

I thought that the ending was a huge relief from what I was expecting, and I wish they'd book Cena like this more often. He had to catch a lucky break, and just barely escaped, and therefore stayed true to the feeling of Cena meeting his match. I really enjoyed this.

**** 3/4*, I think. Don't really remember my exact rating, as I watched this about a week ago.



*John Cena vs. Umaga [Last Man Standing] - Royal Rumble 2007* - Terrific. Some inventive stuff, and felt like a very, very, competitive match. Again, I like that Umaga wasn't just put away right away at the end there. I wish I could remember more of my comments, because I watched this one a week ago as well, but I thought it was great, and totally deserving of the praise.

***** 1/4.* 



*John Cena vs. Chris Jericho - Summerslam 2005* - When I made my negative comments a few weeks ago about being disillusioned with the Cena matches that I had been watching, this was the one match that stood out as a positive at that time. Yeah, it had the typical Cena comeback, but it truly felt like Cena had to dig deep, and authentically made that comeback. Don't know how to explain it, but it didn't feel like one of those times where everything we just saw had all been erased. It was a spirited match up the whole time, the crowd seemed great, and both performers felt like they gave it their all.

**** 3/4 - ****.*



Some quick comments on Disc 2 of Benoit's DVD:


*Chris Benoit vs. Eddie Guerrero - Oct '95 Nitro* - Started off magnificently. I like how they did the lucha work, and then went into some stiff looking moves and throws. One move Benoit did on Eddie was so stiff that I actually sort of jumped, in a cringe type way.

**** 3/4 - *****.


*Chris Benoit vs. Kurt Angle [Steel Cage Match]* - June 2001 RAW - This was atrocious, and probably exactly what you all are talking about when you criticize Angle. To his credit, I think someone here said that Angle himself said that he hates this match.

So much nonsensical-ness, and I found Austin really distracting on the mic.

Not even gonna rate.


*Chris Benoit vs. Kurt Angle - Royal Rumble 2003* - On the other hand, this was great, and totally undeserving of the shit it receives here, IMO. I found many of the accusations about this match to be unfounded. I thought that both DID sell well, and other than a part where they dragged out the go behinds waaay too much, nothing that they did seemed unnatural or contrary to anything that would make sense in a match. It was two competitive wrestlers trying to out do each other, and both looked sufficiently tired and worn down, while trying to execute their moves. 

Also, the first time I saw this, I thought the first half was really lackluster, but I didn't feel that way this time around. In fact, it contributed to the match building up, and each man vigorously trying to put the other man out of commission toward the end.

***** 1/4 - **** 1/2.*


I maybe will comment on the rest of the matches on that disc later, but those were the main matches I had comments on.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

LilOlMe said:


> *Chris Benoit vs. Eddie Guerrero - Oct '95 Nitro* - Started off magnificently. I like how they did the lucha work, and then went into some stiff looking moves and throws. *One move Benoit did on Eddie was so stiff that I actually sort of jumped, in a cringe type way.*
> 
> **** 3/4 - *****.


:mark: POWERBOMB :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cena vs JBL I Quit is probably the match with the largest drop off from where I used to hold it. Match is so cookie cutter. Cena's blood loss is immense, but you'd swear there is a WWE gimmick match handbook after watching it.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I think I liked two Kofi/Ziggler matches. What is wrong with me?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Lilolme- I was the one that said Angle hated that match. He was on the Steve Austin show a few months back, and he said after he rewatched the match on the monitor, he was expecting Austin or Taker to come chew him out for how ridiculous it became. Oh well, as far as nonsensical fuck fests go, that is one of the more entertaining ones around.

I challenge anyone to post a video of a more devastating power bomb that the one Benoit gives Guerrero in that match. A lot of you guys have seen wayyy more Japanese wrestling than I have, so I'm guessing one is out there. But in my lifetime, I've never, ever, seen a power bomb that looked that good. Amazing. That match gets my vote as the best Nitro match ever.

Great reviews man, I pretty much agree with everything you said. You should check out the matches on the first disc of the Benoit set. The Snow match in particular was AMAZING, and what else needs to be said about the Great Sasuke match from Super J 1994? One of the finest matches I've ever seen, probably in my top 10 for best matches in wrestling history. The Liger and Black Tiger matches are spectacular as well.

I'm bored, in commemoration of him being released, I'm gonna watch Regal/Ohno NXT. That's the slept on MOTYC for me. So much goodness. Behind the Cesaro/Zayn 2/3 Falls, I don't think there has been a better NXT match. At least I can't think of any off the top of my head.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Benoit/Liger = :homer


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

*NOTORIOUSTCG's REVIEW OF THE STREAK*
PART 1

*1 – 0 
Wrestlemania VII vs. Jimmy ‘Superfly’ Snuka*

Where it all began. Did they just call him ‘The Phenom’ Superfly Jimmy Snuka? How many kids in the audience have bowl cuts? Flying Clothesline looked great as did the Tombstone but that’s about it. A squash match at Mania but what else could you do with the character? Taker no sold this match well, if that’s even possible. At least Snuka is a big name so it adds to the streak. 

*Rating: *1/4
Cal Scale: 1

2 – 0
Wrestlemania VII vs. Jake ‘The Snake’ Roberts *

How old was Jake at the time of the match, looks about 50. That is what Drugs do kids. Taker was over. Monsoon and Heenan are great on commentary, nut referee is fucking stupid, won’t count when Taker is choking Jake on the mat, but will when he chokes him standing up. No selling the DDT makes Taker look unstoppable but that Tombstone is pretty much the WOAT. Jake the Snake adds to the streak being a big name as well. 

*Rating: *1/2 
Cal Scale: 1

3 – 0
Wrestlemania IX vs. Giant Gonzales*

I won’t skip a Taker match, but if I did this would be one. Fuck Gonzales is tall and Finkus Maximus in a toga is the GOAT. That entrance though, with the vulture has to be in the top 10 GOAT entrances ever by anyone. That body suit is the WOAT wrestling attire, what the fuck is it supposed to be? How did Gonzales not get Disqualified after he low blowed Taker in front of the ref? Taker is trying real hard to make this half decent. Savage, Heenan and JR vs Lawler, Cole and JBL on commentary is like Andre the Giant vs Hornswoggle. The match actually isn’t as bad as I remember other than the ending. If it ended with a regular pin or anything other than a screwy ending it would be *1/2 match. After the match the fans chanting for Hogan, fuck. The worst selling of a clothesline ever has to go to Gonzales. Seriously I want to know if anyone can sit through and enjoy Wrestlemania 9 from start to finish. Adds nothing to the Streak and is one of two blemishes that taints it to me, the second is 10 years later. This match is still better than Rock vs Punk from the Rumble though.

*Rating 1/2*
Cal Scale: 0*

*4 – 0
Wrestlemania XI vs. King Kong Bundy*

I actually can’t remember anything about this match so it’s good to watch it again I guess. Does Bundy remind anyone else of Blastoise? How big is that Urn? It didn’t have a light in it when they first took or when the lid came off it accidently at the start or during the match but when Bearer has it, it does. Is it Bearer’s touch that makes it powerful? An interview during the match? Taker no selling the corner splash is badass I don’t care what people say. Is that the ending? A body slam followed by a clothesline? No wonder why I didn’t remember this match. The post-match celebrations is the best thing. I wasn’t expecting much but better than that. At least King Kong Bundy is a better name for the Streak than Giant Gonzales.

*Rating 3/4* 
Cal Scale: 0

5 – 0
Wrestlemania XII vs. Diesel*

If I remember correctly this is Taker’s first good match a Mania so looking forward to it. Love the complete blackout and the single purple light and smoke that follows Taker, they should use that now instead of the whole purple lighting they use. First mention of the Streak as well by Nice, as he said that Taker has never lost at Mania. Did Taker try and disqualify himself when he tried to use the chair? Might just be because of the 4 matches I have watched beforehand but I really enjoyed this match. It’s a good big man vs big man match and Undertaker’s selling is great, and is truly underrated. Only negative is that Diesel’s showboating between Jack-Knives is a little too long and over the top. Just really good match. Like I said could be because of the matches I’ve watched before but give this a solid ***1/2.

*Rating: ***1/2
Cal Scale: 3*

*Matches in order from best to worst:* (Cal Scale)
vs. Diesel @ Wrestlemania XII (3)
vs. Jake Roberts @ Wrestlemania VIII (1)
vs. Jimmy Snuka @ Wrestlemania VII (1)
vs. King King Bundy @ Wrestlemania XI (0)
vs. Giant Gonzales @ Wrestlemania IX (0)

​


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Nah, Undertaker/Diesel is legit great regardless of the shitty Streak matches before it . ***3/4 from me.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Taker/Diesel was stellar. Worked kinda similarly to the Kane/Taker matches, in that both guys were around 7 feet tall but they actually move around the ring. Diesel was a great athlete, regardless of what you think of him as a worker. Outside of the Action Zone tag, the Taker match, the Bret matches, and the HBK No DQ IYH, what other notable/great matches did Diesel have in WWE?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

"Im the shit"


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Glad I'm not the only one that enjoyed the Diesel match, one if my mates honestly doesn't rate it at all and I can't understand why.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Snake Eyes by Nash


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

watched goldust/ryback, thought it was decent, it is possible to get a good match out of the big man when he is in there with the right ppl


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Nash is great in that match.

Matter fact, the few months he had before he left in 1996 were fucking awesome. 

& by a few months, I mean three matches. They were GREAT though, who said Nash couldn't produce in the right scenario ?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nash isn't bad. Worst case scenario is he was lazy during anything post-WWF run. That and they stuck him with the wrong opponents most of the time in 1995.

btw Cactus, two part reply:

1) there might be a Kenta Kobashi powerbomb to debunk your claim. I'd have to find the specific match(es) in order to do so. Do Tiger Bomb spots off the apron count? Misawa vs Morishima would be right on up there if so. Jeeeezus. Also, look up Booker T vs Mortis from Nitro 1/19/98.

2) In regards to your rep, I like Jarrett circa 1995.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Nash isn't bad. Worst case scenario is he was lazy during anything post-WWF run. That and they stuck him with the wrong opponents most of the time in 1995.
> 
> btw Cactus, two part reply:
> 
> ...



Tiger bombs, from anywhere, count. That's one of my favorite finishers/signature moves EVER. Up there with the half Nelson suplex and the knee trembler. I'm finding those matches you mentioned now.

P.s. I finally watched that Ishii/Shibata match that everyone has raved about from this year. I know absolutely nothing about either performer, but am I correct in saying they have a history as legit shoot fighters? Because I swear the first 30 seconds or so appear to be a 100% shoot, just nasty. I really wish I knew the back story (if there is one) of those two so I could properly rate it, but for now my rating is just "other worldly". I lit a cigarette right before clicking play, and I realized about 4 minutes later I hadn't even smoked it, I just let it sit in my hand and burn all the way down because I was so riveted. That was pretty spectacular.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Misawa vs Morishima match mentioned is from 3/5/06, btw.

I know Shibata def has shoot experience. Ishii could too. A lot tend to over there, but I'm purely not 100% with my facts behind the egg-shaped wonder. He's stiff as fuck 99% of the time, that could have simply shown through. Match is everything and more once it comes to throwing bombs & letting it all hang out. Crowd was molten, every point on offense was sickening, & those two did it right. Magic. That whole show is, tbf. If you got time, check it out.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

may watch tlc 2011, but it will take me prob a week to finish

henry/show :lenny


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Found the Misawa match easy enough, but that Booker T match doesn't seem to exist, every place I search "Booker t vs Mortis" it comes up with Raven vs Mortis 

Oh well, a 20 minute Misawa match I haven't seen that apparently has Tiger Bomb death in it. That's still a good haul for today.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Found the Misawa match easy enough, but that Booker T match doesn't seem to exist, every place I search "Booker t vs Mortis" it comes up with Raven vs Mortis
> 
> Oh well, a 20 minute Misawa match I haven't seen that apparently has Tiger Bomb death in it. That's still a good haul for today.







Might be it.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Might be it.


Jesus tap dancing Christ :mark:


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

MORISHIMA MENTION. :hb

I love that fatty. Even if it's just for his ROH run, which may be one of my favourite runs of any wrestler in any promotion, ever.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> If my memory is correct, McIntyre vs Kofi is one of only about three singles matches that I actually like from the chump. Others being this year vs Cesaro _(the 100% carry job one)_ & holy crap I'm drawing a blank. Ok, maybe it's only two matches.


I remember really liking a Kofi/Swagger from 2010, am actually looking forward to watching again.



LilOlMe said:


> *Chris Benoit vs. Kurt Angle [Steel Cage Match]* - June 2001 RAW - This was atrocious, and probably exactly what you all are talking about when you criticize Angle. To his credit, I think someone here said that Angle himself said that he hates this match.
> 
> So much nonsensical-ness, and I found Austin really distracting on the mic.
> 
> Not even gonna rate.






Cactus Jack said:


> I challenge anyone to post a video of a more devastating power bomb that the one Benoit gives Guerrero in that match.


Do botched ones count? Because Sid nearly killing Brian Pillman at WarGames 91 is reallllly hard to watch sometimes. I feel like there IS a powerbomb from 90s puro I thought was too violent to even happen but I can't remember it. Maybe I'm just thinking of the Vader German or something.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Speaking of VADER and POWERBOMBS, didn't he break a jobber's back with one in WCW?

And didn't Khali end up murdering someone for real with a powerbomb? Like, the guy died from injures as a result of it? Or is that interwebs rumours?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Fuck I forgot how nasty that powerbomb was :ass


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Speaking of VADER and POWERBOMBS, didn't he break a jobber's back with one in WCW?
> 
> And didn't Khali end up murdering someone for real with a powerbomb? Like, the guy died from injures as a result of it? Or is that interwebs rumours?



Possibly. This IS Vader we are talking about. If you want to see something gruesome, he has 2 spots with none other than Cactus Jack that make me nervous just watching them. One is when he's walking down the ramp with Foley on his back, and he just kicks his legs out an falls flat on his back, damn near killing Foley. Another is when he full strength power bombed Foley onto the concrete outside the ring, because according to Bill Watts it's a great idea to take all the padding away around rings. Seriously just watch those two spots, remember that Vader was 350+ pounds and Foley was 300+ pounds. They are just gruesome, I have no idea how he didn't break his back doing them.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I remember the Cactus one on the concrete. Fuck that was sick lol. In an awesomely weird way.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> And didn't Khali end up murdering someone for real with a powerbomb? Like, the guy died from injures as a result of it? Or is that interwebs rumours?


The wrestler died in a match with khali after a flapjack or whatever, but it had more to do with a previous concussion than the move itself (which seems to have caused another concussion).



"Source of All Knowledge and Truth-Telling" Wikipedia said:


> On 28 May 2001, Brian Ong died after receiving a flapjack from Singh.[1] Ong had suffered a previous concussion during the session, but the trainers gave him a lower evaluation for not avoiding injuries and told him to continue training. This second concussion ultimately proved fatal for him. As Singh inadvertently caused his death, Ong's family brought a lawsuit against APW.[1] APW was found liable for recklessness after less than a day of deliberations, awarding the Ong family for damages of over $1.3 million
> 
> -----
> 
> In May 2001, Brian Ong was training with Dalip Singh (better known as the Great Khali) and took a flapjack from Singh. The move was botched, reportedly because Ong had grabbed Singh's shirt instead of pushing off Singh's back as he was instructed. Although he had made the mistake several times before without incident, this time Ong landed tailbone first and his head was whipped back against the mat. The resulting impact damaged his spine and brainstem. Coupled with a previous concussion, the move resulted in Ong's death a few days later.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

I'm pretty sure few young guys died under Inoki's dojo training regime back in the 70s.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

On the subject of Attitude Era 1998 that was discussed yesterday, I don't think it was BAD because January - May has been better than 1997's first five months. The Rock was much better in his role as the IC champion than he was in 1997 where he wasn't ready and they gave him the title in a match that wasn't built up well (also lost the title the same way, mind you). Heel DX HBK was better than Sid Vicious' reign in 1997 too. Tag team division was generally better too. 1997 had the Godwins, Headbangers and a few others. I think only LOD and the Hart foundation were entertaining but the rest of the division wasn't good. The feud between the New Age Outlaws and Foley/Funk made sense and I liked the way they turned heel Foley heel by basically having DX beat him up then he used the 'Austin' chants as a way to turn on the crowd. Say what you want about Russo (and I have noticed some weird swerves like turning LOD against each other and then having them reform with no reason other than 'Sunny' made the peace) but at least he kept everyone relevant. There was some background to the Mero/Goldust feud for example and the crowd were invested in the feud by chanting Sable.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

http://www.wrestlingdvdnews.com/details-on-new-wcw-ppv-matches-dvd/55606/



> A few weeks ago it was revealed that “Best of WCW PPV Matches” is the latest World Championship Wrestling themed DVD in the works for next year.
> 
> We can now confirm its go ahead and exclusively release the official synopsis. The project boats being the “first ever all-encompassing WCW pay-per-view match compilation” released by WWE and is slated to include several matches never before released on Home Video. It’s coming to both DVD and Blu-ray formats on March 11th, 2014.
> 
> ...


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

From that description the WCW PPV set already sounds bad lol. Possibility of Flair/Sting? Urgh. Eddie/Rey? Depends which match/es they put on it... but the best have already been released so REPEATS which fucking blows. NWO stuff? Urgh urgh urgh. Almost anything from the Road Wild PPV with drunk racist bikers in the crowd? URGH.

I'm pretty much guaranteeing they will fuck this release up so badly, just like every other WCW set.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> From that description the WCW PPV set already sounds bad lol. Possibility of Flair/Sting? Urgh. Eddie/Rey? Depends which match/es they put on it... but the best have already been released so REPEATS which fucking blows. NWO stuff? Urgh urgh urgh. Almost anything from the Road Wild PPV with drunk racist bikers in the crowd? URGH.
> 
> I'm pretty much guaranteeing they will fuck this release up so badly, just like every other WCW set.


They are probably gonna give us the same 1990 Sting/Flair match we already have, probably the same Edie/Rey Halloween Havoc match we already have, probably Nash/Goldberg which we already have, Sting/Hogan which sucks....man what a bummer.

I wish they would put every Sting/Vader match on that set :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I have a Vader Vs Sting comp anyway so fuck that .

So apparently wwedvdnews are announcing a DVD 2morrow, based off a poll WWE did a while back. One disc sets dedicated to the following:

Best of Shotgun Saturday Night (97 to 99)
Best of Velocity (02 to 06)
Best of Superstars (09 to '11)
Best of Saturday Morning Slam ('12 to '13)
Thanksgiving Moments
Best of Bra and Panties
Top 25 Superstar Entrances
The Christmas Collection
Music of WWE
Best of the Slammys
Best of Tribute to the Troops
Brothers of Destruction
Top Divas
Santino Comedy Hour

So ONE of those is getting released (at least, maybe more to come). COME ON SUPERSTARS SET :mark:. Though one disc isn't exactly enough, 09 probably had enough good shit to fill one disc. Should be a 3 disc set, one for each of the years that they are gonna cover in ONE disc here. Velocity set could rule too, but again too many years to cover on one disc . Better than nothing though!


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

inb4 all the virgins vote for a bra and panties set.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Apparently the Bra & Panties set won the poll that wwedvdnews did :lmao.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

:lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Stocking Filler said:


> inb4 all the virgins vote for a bra and panties set.


:lmao



Cactus Jack said:


> Found the Misawa match easy enough, but that Booker T match doesn't seem to exist, every place I search "Booker t vs Mortis" it comes up with Raven vs Mortis
> 
> Oh well, a 20 minute Misawa match I haven't seen that apparently has Tiger Bomb death in it. That's still a good haul for today.





Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Might be it.


That's the moment. btw, Cactus you had to find the full Nitro to see the match on youtube. That's how I saw it. 

Morishima vs Misawa for the GHC strap in 2008 is even better than the 2006 match, iirc.



Luke Harper's festive Lariat said:


> MORISHIMA MENTION. :hb
> 
> I love that fatty. Even if it's just for his ROH run, which may be one of my favourite runs of any wrestler in any promotion, ever.


Morishima - One of my favorites. Dude is still the highlight of NOAH these days.



Yeah1993 said:


> I remember really liking a Kofi/Swagger from 2010, am actually looking forward to watching again.


Only recall their match from Superstars and it's lame. Don't remember any of their long matches on the latter portion of Smackdown where they were stuck working vs each other weekly, but doubt I'll care for any of 'em. As much as I love Swagger, I don't see it happening. I'd watch to double check...but ughhhh. Long Kofi Kingston matches. What's the point?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

There is one ziggler/kofi match or two out of 1000 and I do mine 1000 that I actually like


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Did you also like their Superstars match? That was a good one.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Did you also like their Superstars match? That was a good one.


ehh just watched it, kofi was pretty terrible in it though

I thought this one was pretty good


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So 4 matches in and NM 05 is sucking HARD, 1 on the cal scale and the 4 way is the only match above * :lmao

Hopefully Eddie/tista ,Orton/taker, and MAYBE rey/jbl can salvage this


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> So 4 matches in and NM 05 is sucking HARD, 1 on the cal scale and the 4 way is the only match above * :lmao
> 
> Hopefully Eddie/tista ,Orton/taker, and MAYBE rey/jbl can salvage this



Orton Taker is fantastic. Eddie/Batista gets mixed reactions....I personally love it cause of EDDIE. Batista is downright lousy in that one, but Eddie's character work is so superb-he's doing this Angel/Devil on his shoulders routine where his heelish tendencies keep surfacing, but he's fighting against them and trying to be 2004 Good Guy Eddie again. Highly entertaining, even if the ring work isn't all that special...believe it's Eddie's last PPV match, figures that he goes out taking chicken shit and turning it into chicken salad, outside of Flair I can't think of a guy who did that more than Eddie.

JBL/Rey I strangely remember NOTHING about...sounds appealing on paper. Rey is ALWAYS great in the Big Heel vs Underdog baby face role, especially with a heel as nasty as JBL was. I think I'm probably the only human that would preorder a Best of JBL documentary/match set. He's one of my favorite bad guys ever. What a wonderful cunt.

Hayley-thanks for the reccomendations, I'm putting on that first Misawa match now (Y)


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Didn't like Rey/JBL, thought it went WAY too long and was really boring at parts

gonna take a break from this show, will finish it tomorrow, gonna watch the Armageddon 06 ladder match that I've wanted to see for a while


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Didn't like Rey/JBL, thought it went WAY too long and was really boring at parts
> 
> gonna take a break from this show, will finish it tomorrow, gonna watch the Armageddon 06 ladder match that I've wanted to see for a while



That match probably has the most painful spot I've ever seen. I won't ruin it for you so you don't know when it's coming, just know that one of the wrestlers face explodes. Dead serious. It's just poof, gone.

Hayley-to steal your phrase, bless you for showing me Misawa/Morishima. That was just bad ass. I got really dissapointed about 5 minutes through when Morishima power bombs Misawa and it's not that devastating at all. I was like "that it? The fuck is Hayley smoking?" Then I remembered you said it was a tiger bomb. Then about 5 minutes later Misawa hits the tiger bomb and again, not that devastating. So I was dissapointed twice. THEN, I remembered you said it was off the apron, so right on cue about 5 minutes later....Morishima dies. Well not literally, but any normal human, much less a 300 pound Japanese Terry Gordy, would die right then and there. The final 5 minutes, with that volcanic (that's hotter than molten, right?) crowd, the false finishes. Goodness me. I really wish I had some friends who were in to Japanese wrestling so they I could learn more. I only know of like 3-4 of the more famous workers (Misawa, Liger, Inoki, Baba, Jumbo, Sasuke....think that's it I'm afraid) so my knowledge is really limited. But damn. That match ruled.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

No Mercy 2005 was bad outside of the casket match and Eddie Guerrero putting on a super carryjob. I didn't like JBL/Rey that much. Way too "by-the-books" for my liking and JBL in the ring bores me even though I love his gimmick. Everything else sucked.

Cactus, what else have you seen from Morishima?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> No Mercy 2005 was bad outside of the casket match and Eddie Guerrero putting on a super carryjob. I didn't like JBL/Rey that much. Way too "by-the-books" for my liking and JBL in the ring bores me even though I love his gimmick. Everything else sucked.
> 
> Cactus, what else have you seen from Morishima?



Absolutely nothing but I'd love for that to change. His clothes lines made me feel all warm and tingly inside:agree:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

If you or anyone else here has not seen the first Morishima/Bryan match, then you're missing out. That is the closest thing you will ever see in wrestling to Lesnar/Cena, and I would go as far as to say that it surpasses Lesnar/Cena in every possible way. One of the greatest matches of the 2000s.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> If you or anyone else here has not seen the first Morishima/Bryan match, then you're missing out. That is the closest thing you will ever see in wrestling to Lesnar/Cena, and I would go as far as to say that it surpasses Lesnar/Cena in every possible way. One of the greatest matches of the 2000s.


Well, I hated Lesnar/Cena, so that's a poor selling point. And I don't like Bryan, so that's also not a good selling point.

Besides, I've already seen the best MMA/wrestling match in Nakamura vs Sakuraba from Wrestle Kingdom 7 this year. That is the closest you're probably ever going to see wrestling border actual MMA, which is what made it awesome. Lesnar/Cena saw Brock bust Cena open hard way (admirable, I admit), and then pound mercilessly on him for 20 minutes before "that finish". Never felt that into it.

My thoughts, naturally.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

I started getting into ROH right around Morshima's reign as champion. Maybe a little earlier because I do recall seeing the Danielson/McGuinness matches, especially the Unified one. 

His match vs. Danielson at Manhattan Mayhem is an absolute clinic.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Danielson vs. Morishima at Manhattan mayhem was AWESOME. Just great storytelling.

Their match at Man Up is pretty good as well with the story on Danielson's eye.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I still can't find the Man Up match anywhere. Why did Megaupload have to die? Sakuraba/Nakamura ruled too. O'Reilly and Cole did a good hybrid match too, but they basically had an amazing match on accident.

6/1/98 episode of Nitro has five good matches: Finlay/Eddy, Jericho/Juvi, Public Enemy/Raven-Saturn, Benoit/Booker, and Chavo/Wright. Add two nice squashes too involving Goldberg and DDP.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

If you watch the first Danielson/Morishima match you should do yourself a favor and watch them all. Their last match of the series is as satisfying of conclusion to a feud as you can possibly find.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Danielson/Morishima at Final Battle 2008 was great. Danielson wrapping the chain around his elbow and pounding Morishima relentlessly with it was :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> No Mercy 2005 was bad outside of the casket match and Eddie Guerrero putting on a super carryjob. I didn't like JBL/Rey that much. Way too "by-the-books" for my liking and JBL in the ring bores me even though I love his gimmick. Everything else sucked.


The fatal four way was pretty solid.

I like NM 05 because it has one classic and three solid matches. Nothing on the undercard was horrible from what I recall either. I even enjoyed Kennedy/Holly to an extent.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Welp, YouTube doesn't seem to have ANY of the Danielson/Morishima matches....the fuck man. Guess I'll have to suck it up and try to find them on daily motion on this tiny iPad screen.

I just watched the Finlay documentary...not bad. Only about 50 minutes long and it doesn't cover any particular feuds or matches, but I still found it pretty interesting. The biggest positive I got out of it is twofold: 1.) Finlay has a son who is a teenager and 2.) Finlay has a WWE ring in his basement and his been training his son every day for years :mark:

How fucking cool would that be, to have a second generation Finlay come around and start taking the piss out of everyone in the ring and just being a tough Irish bastard in general. I wish WWE would let Finlay and Regal to at it for 15-20 minutes in NXT for old time sake. How great would it be for a young Dave Finlay III to debut in NXT with a rockin mullet and mustache and just start beating the shit out of Regal and screaming about the 400 years the English people have been oppressing his countrymen :lmao


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

If Finlay still wrestles, he needs to come back to face Sheamus in a Belfast Brawl. Maybe a match for WM30. I want Sheamus in a high profile match for Mania but there doesn't seem to be a spot for him, so this would be a great alternative.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Two tough Irish bastards slugging it out in hard-hitting action at Mania? So down to watch that.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Cactus Jack said:


> I really wish I had some friends who were in to Japanese wrestling so they I could learn more. I only know of like 3-4 of the more famous workers (Misawa, Liger, Inoki, Baba, Jumbo, Sasuke....think that's it I'm afraid) so my knowledge is really limited.


You don't need friends to get sources for puro. You have NERDS LIKE US. Now watch every Tom McGhee from All Japan.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Tatsumi Fujinami! GOAT first name.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I need to check out some puro myself. Only matches from Japan I've seen are ones involving Benoit and they are a great sample.

Just watched the 10-man Texas tag and even though it's funny that the finish is botched (pretty sure Foley was legal and he broke the pin up but Benoit and ref just no sold it) yet it's non-stop awesomeness for the 13 or so many minutes it lasts. If only we had great tag action of this kind. Not traditional tags, but hyper stuff with an electric crowd and frequent back and forth action.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

Kenta Kobashi = GOAT.

Dean Ambrose just had his best match on SD with Punk. ***1/2.

His work may not be as strong Rollings. But his mannerisms, characteristics, and as I like to call it "character wrestling" is pretty sensational.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Cactus Jack said:


> The biggest positive I got out of it is twofold: 1.) Finlay has a son who is a teenager and 2.) Finlay has a WWE ring in his basement and his been training his son every day for years :mark:


:banderas


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

With Finlay's style, he could absolutely still have a 10-15 minute Belfast Brawl with Sheamus at Mania. It would probably be the best match on the card too.

Yeah- Tom McGhee? Wasn't he that huge muscular guy in the WWF in the 80's who couldn't work for shit and just had a good look? This has to be a different guy you are talking about, or he just go a million times better when he went to Japan.

Funnyfaces- I need to spread rep around, thanks for the link man.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Sheamus returns at the rumble, but as he is making his way down to the ring, Finlay attack him with his shillelagh, so that Sheamus can't compete. Next night Finlay comes out and calls Sheamus a disgrace to Ireland ect. 

This booking stuff isn't hard.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> If you or anyone else here has not seen the first Morishima/Bryan match, then you're missing out. That is the closest thing you will ever see in wrestling to Lesnar/Cena, and I would go as far as to say that it surpasses Lesnar/Cena in every possible way. One of the greatest matches of the 2000s.



I actually think that match resembled Lesnar/Punk more than Lesnar/Cena. First you had the massive size difference, like the Punk match, then you had the ridiculously hot crowd cheering for Danielson, then you had Danielson trying to pick apart Morishima early on but for Shima to finally gain the advantage by cutting off the ring and laying waste to Danielson's head with forearms and clothes lines. You had hope spots throughout including that sick dive he did over the guardrail, but Shima really controlled the pace like Lesnar. Finally you get the last gasp for Danielson with Cattle Mutilation, just like Punk with his Anaconda Vise. It doesn't work, Shima hits that filthy back drop driver/Lesnar hits the F5 on the chair, game over for the under dog baby face.


Damn that was good. Like really, really, REALLY good. They killed it. Everything I love about wrestling is in that match.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

need to watch some puro myself


But last night I watched Sheamus/tensai sd 8/12 :lenny so good


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Welp, YouTube doesn't seem to have ANY of the Danielson/Morishima matches....the fuck man. Guess I'll have to suck it up and try to find them on daily motion on this tiny iPad screen.


I did have two uploaded before the US Government intervened. :frustrate


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Damn government


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

You guys want a laugh. Look at WWE's MOTY nominations for the slammys



> * Undertaker vs. CM Punk (WrestleMania 29)
> 
> * John Cena vs. The Rock (WrestleMania 29)
> 
> ...


Rock V Cena over Punk V Cena

HHH V Lesnar over Punk V Lesnar

WWE is so fucking fuck.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Where the fuck is Punk/Brock? :lmao

Guess they really wanted to give Taker/Punk the easy win, none of the matches are in the same realm as that one (hell, the only other match on that list I'd put above 3 stars is the Shield tag). It's worthy of the award, but Punk/Brock is as well just as much, if not more-so. Second year in a row they leave out a very very very strong MOTYC. :lmao


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

Gotta have a HHH MOTYC in there


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

> Triple H vs. Brock Lesnar (Extreme Rules)


Fucking hell :lol


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

At least they picked the cage match and not WM. Still, Brock/Punk is easy MOTY imo. I guess they had to exclude it for the "one nomination per wrestler" rule they wanna use.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Yeah, looking back at it is the criteria to have no repeat superstars?


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

No Brock/Punk and no Cena/Punk, but we have Cena/Rock. Figures )


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Still, I mean, I'm certain they could come up with a better match listing than that, even if they really wanted to include Taker/Punk but didn't want a wrestler to appear twice. Could've done:

Taker/Punk WM29
Bryan/Cena SS
Ziggler/Del Rio PB

And then do the Shield/Cody+Goldust tag title match on Raw the following night instead of the BG match. I mean, Taker/Punk would still win this for me easily so it doesn't matter that much to me, but that's a much more respectable list of nominees (with the no repeats rule in mind). Then again, it's not that hard to have a much more respectable list than one that has Rock/Cena and one of the Brock/HHH matches on it.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

I find it surprising that there is not a single one DB match. He was the second worker of the year after Shield, they could have placd the Orton/Bryan HiaC match, if they really wanted to have Cena/Rock on the list


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

So, a pointless Raw coming up then? (Well, what's new)


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Raven (c) vs Kane vs Big Show for the Hardcore Championship - Wrestlemania X-Seven (4/1/01)*

I remember this being alot of fun when it first aired. :lmao at Raven breaking the florescent lighting and realizing they needed to get out. Craziness throughtout and thankfully it still holds up. *7.5/10*


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

At the end of the day, Genichiro Tenryu is Japanese GOAT. And not just Japanese, mind you. I'm very fucking sure at one point during my lifetime the day will dawn, and everyone's gonna comprehend TENRYU is the true greatest ever. It happened to me, and it will happen to everyone else. You just wait and see how far it's gonna go. He's grumpy, slightly out of shape and brings DA HEAT! To quote Ditch, _"any match where the legality of repeated punches to the face comes up is a good one, in my book"_, matches like that are Tenryu's trademark, and it really is a picture perfect description of him.



Spoiler: TENRYU

























































KO Bossy said:


> Besides, I've already seen the best MMA/wrestling match in Nakamura vs Sakuraba from Wrestle Kingdom 7 this year. *That is the closest you're probably ever going to see wrestling border actual MMA, which is what made it awesome.* Lesnar/Cena saw Brock bust Cena open hard way (admirable, I admit), and then pound mercilessly on him for 20 minutes before "that finish". Never felt that into it.
> 
> My thoughts, naturally.


That's because you're a shoot style rookie. :kobe10 It really was a great match, though. :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Give me some Tenryu to start off with ?


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Give me some Tenryu to start off with ?







His last truly great singles match.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Toshiaki Kawada Vs Gen'ichiro Tenryu (28/10/2000 AJPW)

These get a lot of praise:
Jumbo Tsuruta & Genichiro Tenryu vs. Riki Choshu Yoshiaki Yatsu (1/28/86)
Genichiro Tenryu & Toshiaki Kawada vs. Stan Hansen & Terry Gordy (12/16/88)
Jumbo Tsuruta vs. Genichiro Tenryu (6/5/89)
Jumbo Tsuruta & Yoshiaki Yatsu vs. Genichiro Tenryu & Stan Hansen (12/6/89)


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

:kobe9


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Matt Hardy vs Gregory Helms - The Great American Bash (7/23/06)*

:mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark:/10


Now checking out Tajiri/Kidman at Backlash 2002.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Chismo said:


> At the end of the day, Genichiro Tenryu is Japanese GOAT. And not just Japanese, mind you. I'm very fucking sure at one point during my lifetime the day will dawn, and everyone's gonna comprehend TENRYU is the true greatest ever. It happened to me, and it will happen to everyone else. You just wait and see how far it's gonna go. He's grumpy, slightly out of shape and brings DA HEAT! To quote Ditch, _"any match where the legality of repeated punches to the face comes up is a good one, in my book"_, matches like that are Tenryu's trademark, and it really is a picture perfect description of him.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks a lot for all the reccomendations man, I have not a damn thing to do today so it looks like I've got some great stuff to watch.

About your greatest ever comment, I came to the conclusion that FLAIR was the greatest of all time when I saw the Hunter Cage match at Taboo Tuesday. Dude was damn near 60 and having a match that probably no one else on the WWE roster was capable of having, including my beloved Benoit and Eddie.

Eddie became my favorite guy ever to watch when he turned heel in 05'. 2005 Eddie is my pick for the greatest wrestling character ever. If Eddie had lived and performed until 2009-2010, he might get more credit as the greatest of all time.

Of course, I'm only talking American wrestlers here, that's why I'm happy to watch as much stuff from Japanese guys as possible, because it's like a whole new world of goodness I know zippo about.

I think Flairs match with Barry Windham at Battle of the Belts 1986 is the second greatest match to ever happen in wrestling. For any that haven't seen it. Wow.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

I have both Flair/Barry matches at *****. :mark:


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Tajiri w/Torrie Wilson vs Billy Kidman (c) for the Cruiserweight Championship - Backlash (4/21/02)*

I don't really know what to say about the awesomeness of this match. I think I have a top ten here imho. Maybe I'm overrating it, but this is one of the best WWF/E cruiserweight matches I've seen. Tajiri was a complete boss as the asshole heel and Kidman fighting through with a highly applaudable effort. With that said, I'm making sure I keep my eyes out for matches I may have forgotten or never saw when the division was taken seriously and not when they would put ten guys out there and tell them to do flips for five minutes. As I've said, this is a potential top ten for me but with obvious future multiple viewings. For now, *9.5/10. *


For anyone interested.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I'm only ten seconds in and I'm already marking. TAJIRI


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Chismo said:


> I have both Flair/Barry matches at *****. :mark:


Both? There are four!


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Okay, yeah. That Tajiri/Kidman match was fucking great. Hadn't ever seen it before. TAJIRI was indeed boss in that.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

The Stocking Filler said:


> Okay, yeah. That Tajiri/Kidman match was fucking great. Hadn't ever seen it before. TAJIRI was indeed boss in that.



:cheer


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Whats Tajiri up to these days?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Got damn at those MOTY nominations. Punk/Taker is of course the best on that list, but part of me wants Trips/Lesnar to win just so Bret (who's presenting) has to give the award to Hunter. :lmao


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Rah said:


> Both? There are four!


If you don't know which two I'm talking about... Really.



WrestlingforEverII said:


> Whats Tajiri up to these days?


He runs his own small fed.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

HollyJollyHelmsley said:


> Got damn at those MOTY nominations. Punk/Taker is of course the best on that list, but part of me wants Trips/Lesnar to win just so Bret (who's presenting) has to give the award to Hunter. :lmao


He may 'accidentally' drop the award on Trips' foot  Or just say fuck it and clobber him with it.

One can dream.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Paul London & Brian Kendrick (c) vs The Pitbulls (Jamie Noble & Kid Kash) for the WWE Tag Team Chmapionship - The Great American Bash (7/23/06)*

Fan-fucking-tastic match. All four guys were on fire. I love Londrick, they're one of my favourite tag teams ever and they were the lunatics putting their bodies on the line along with their belts. This is the second time I've seen Noble and Kash together (don't remember the match though) and they're brutal with their offense. Fantastic match, check it out. *9-9.5/10*


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Do you have a link for that one too?


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

The Stocking Filler said:


> Do you have a link for that one too?


Footage is reversed, but that shouldn't affect your viewing.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao at that list. HHH still burying :bryan. Remember last year that Cena appeared twice in the candidacy, so that is not a valid excuse for omitting the GOATs. Shield/Rhodes is fine, but HHH/Lesnar wouldn't even make my top 50.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I care more about Rock/Cena being on there than Brock/Hunter.

They honestly should have just had a category "Best Punk Match"

vs Lesnar
vs Cena
vs Taker
vs Jericho (RAW match)


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

SpookshowTony said:


> Footage is reversed, but that shouldn't affect your viewing.






funnyfaces1 said:


> :lmao at that list. HHH still burying :bryan. Remember last year that Cena appeared twice in the candidacy, so that is not a valid excuse for omitting the GOATs. Shield/Rhodes is fine, but HHH/Lesnar wouldn't even make my top 50.


HHH/Lesnar was great.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Great doesn't cut it in 2013. Other matches were greater.

Smackdown was good this week. Went back to its old roots.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Not to resume any kind of Brock/Hunter discussion, but the cage match went down for me on last week's rewatch. Summerslam match went up, on the other hand.

Watching the Summerslam triple main event after doing yard work :mark: :mark:


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Great doesn't cut it in 2013. Other matches were greater.
> 
> Smackdown was good this week. Went back to its old roots.


I won't argue that both Bryan/Cena and Punk/Lesnar were superior. Rock/Cena being on there is more of an insult than HHH/Lesnar imo.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

The Stocking Filler said:


>


:hayden2


*Billy Kidman vs Paul London - No Mercy (10/3/04) 9/10*


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Cactus Jack said:


> Yeah- Tom McGhee? Wasn't he that huge muscular guy in the WWF in the 80's who couldn't work for shit and just had a good look? This has to be a different guy you are talking about, or he just go a million times better when he went to Japan.


Actually he may have been worse in Japan. Like, Erik Watts could laugh at how bad this guy was. Pretty sure nobody taught him what a wrestling match even is. Now watch every Tom McGhee match in All Japan.

Or at least this instant classic. Is Wrestling Observer's Worst MOTY for 1988. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4zYfaTBLk0

Turns out his name is actually Tom 'Magee'. Fuck that, I'm calling him McGhee.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Is Tom McGhee related to Tits McGhee? :lol

Sounds like something worth watching just for the comedy.

On another note; I've put this Morishima/Bryan match from "Manhattan Mayhem" on another tab, waiting to be watched. Need to watch some Danielson (as in pre-WWE) and this sounds like a good place to start.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Danielson/Morishima :mark:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The Stocking Filler said:


> Okay, yeah. That Tajiri/Kidman match was fucking great. Hadn't ever seen it before. TAJIRI was indeed boss in that.


About time somebody watches it, literally been pimping it for weeks :lol

Orton/taker about to start on NM 05 :mark:


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Dragon gets fucked up in that one. Suffers a legit detached retina.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Fights the rematch w/an EYE PATCH, no?


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Yeah1993 said:


> Or at least this instant classic. Is Wrestling Observer's Worst MOTY for 1988. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4zYfaTBLk0


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


> Actually he may have been worse in Japan. Like, Erik Watts could laugh at how bad this guy was. Pretty sure nobody taught him what a wrestling match even is. Now watch every Tom McGhee match in All Japan.
> 
> Or at least this instant classic. Is Wrestling Observer's Worst MOTY for 1988. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4zYfaTBLk0
> 
> Turns out his name is actually Tom 'Magee'. Fuck that, I'm calling him McGhee.



You're such a big help

Wow that was awful, looked like McGee was fucking naked in that Boston Crab :lmao

Apparently Bret had a great match with McGee during his WWE try out and Vince nearly jizzed himself and said "that's my next champion!" Bret's a super hero if he pulled a great match outta that guy. Lamest match ever


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I've always heard that the story goes that Vince literally just LOOKED at a picture of the guy or something and said that. 

If Magee/McGhee/McChickenNuggetsKrispyDeluxe couldn't have a decent two minute match then I have no idea how on Earth Hart would have gotten a decent match out of him that I assume was longer than two minutes. How do you not have a passable two minute match? I could have a passable two minute match right now at 8:30 in the morning with a sore neck as an untrained fool who has nothing to do with the 'biz' in any way. Probably anybody reading this could (unless Tom McPeriPeriPizzaSandwich himself is reading this). It just seems unreal.


----------



## KO Bossy (Oct 23, 2011)

Chismo said:


> At the end of the day, Genichiro Tenryu is Japanese GOAT. And not just Japanese, mind you. I'm very fucking sure at one point during my lifetime the day will dawn, and everyone's gonna comprehend TENRYU is the true greatest ever. It happened to me, and it will happen to everyone else. You just wait and see how far it's gonna go. He's grumpy, slightly out of shape and brings DA HEAT! To quote Ditch, _"any match where the legality of repeated punches to the face comes up is a good one, in my book"_, matches like that are Tenryu's trademark, and it really is a picture perfect description of him.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Nakamura/Sakuraba is the closest thing I personally have ever seen to real MMA. Its helps both are legit MMA fighters, too. It went beyond stiff work-submissions, getting top position, etc. I usually don't like what are essentially fake MMA fights, but that one was brilliant.

I've only seen one Tenryu match (vs Jumbo from 1989). It was pretty good but I've seen way better. Right now, I'm watching AJPW from the 80s and 90s. AND I have to keep up with current NJPW because its amazing. Once I'm done AJPW, then I'll start NJPW from the 80s and work my way up to the times of the Tenryu/WAR invasion and Hashimoto. Can't wait.

By the way, AJPW from the 80s and 90s=unreal. Pretty sure most know that, but in case they don't. Its hard for me to watch WWE anymore because I love the Japanese style so much and the WWE is...rarely anywhere close to how good this is. To me, the Japanese style makes so much sense. WWE feels kind of like...a bunch of moves.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*No mercy 2005 review 

The last PPV of Eddie Guerrero 

Match #1: MNM vs LOD 2k5 and Christy Hemme *

Strange how one of these teams is absolutely AMAZING and then the other one all sucks. Animal was way too old and Heidenrech sucks dick. Animal was always the lesser of the two road warriors IMO. As much as I like MNM this is pretty dull TBH. MNM would go on to have some awesome matches but the tag division was in such a sorry state in 2005 that it was basically this team against shit teams like this. Crowd chants “LOD” even though the fact that they’re saying Heidenrech is part of the LOD is a disgrace and a pile of shit. Oh yeah, did I mention that Hemme is as bad as Kelly Kelly in the ring. Somewhat luckily I guess the women don’t wrestle much at all, but what where left with really was bad. This just had ZERO energy throughout, crowd didn’t give a fuck besides the LOD chants. The divas actually out performed the men in this as Hemme wasn’t as bad as usual, which is why this wasn’t a dud. *
*
CAL SCALE: 0

Match #2: Simon Dean vs Bobby Lashley *

*I would usually say no to this, but because it’ll probably be some sort of squash. Simon brings burgers to the ring for no apparent ring, he also cuts a lackluster promo to get heat on the Houston crowd, very similar to the bad news Barrett shit. And yes this was a major squash, lasted about a minute and Dean got like ZERO offense. The no selling of the hamburger tray by Lashley was awesome. Lashley botches a move BAD and then hits some sort of slam and its over. 1/4* 
*
*CAL SCALE: 0 

Match #3: Booker T vs Orlando Jordan vs Chris Benoit vs Christian
*
:lol at that pathetic attempt to get booker over with the hometown crowd, pretty bad pop at best. Really looking forward to this because apparently its good, despite 2 guys being terrible, although the two other guys are amazing. A HUGE pop for Benoit, deservedly so of course, I mean, he is Benoit. This was decent, nothing two spectacular but certainly an improvement over the first two matches, which we’re pretty bad. Any part where Benoit and Christian were involved was solid, and I didn’t mind Booker in this. Of course Jordan still sucked as usual though. But I did thouroghly enjoy this, better than your average 4 way at least. ***1/2

*CAL SCALE: 3

Match #4: Mr. Kennedy vs Hardcore Holly*

NO, JUST FUCK NO. 

*CAL SCALE: -1*

*Match #5: JBL vs Rey Mysterio *

Expecting good things here, upset they never had that mania match that ended out being a squash. This does start out slow as fuck, JBL had Rey in a headlock for like 2 minutes, which was boring as fucking shit. After this attempt to put me to sleep, they decide to play a game of chase the immature babyface from running in and out of the ring, BORING! Really slow match expect for a few short bursts of energy, REALLY strange for a Mysterio match. So not feeling this match at all, getting pretty bored even though I love Rey. Match does start to get a little bit better for the last 5 minutes, which is good because this was bordering on DUD status for how bad that beginning stretch was. This does suffer from what the first match did, a complete lack of energy, and a crowd that doesn’t really give a shit at all. This went way too long IMO, it should have been less then 10 minutes but it ended up borderline 15 minutes. **1/4

*CAL SCALE: 1 

Match #6: Randy Orton and Bob Orton vs The Undertaker*

Pretty pumped for this, I’ve had both taker/Orton matches over 4 stars and their WrestleMania match is #3 on my MOTY for this point. I don’t expect those matches to be too great because I’m not a fan of casket matches generally, except Taker/HBK of course. Love the caskets entrance so much, that graveyard like choir is awesome. And HOLY FUCKING SHIT at that pop for taker, guy was always so over, really confused why he wasn’t champion. Taker should bring the druids back for mania 30, that was always so fucking cool. Now that I mention it, lets bring fucking Ortons music back, I love that song. Better than the I HEAR VOICES IN MY HEAD That makes me want to puke at how terrible that is. :lol at Bob wearing a dress shirt and jeans to a match too, if I was a wrestler I’d probably do that . So considering Bob’s age, I was pretty impressed with him here, he wasn’t your usual old fart. Of course his work wasn’t too great( wasn’t BAD by any means) but his heel work was :mark:. Well this was amazing as shit, just like all of their other matches. Their mania match is still the king of course but I’d put this even with Summerslam, maybe a little below it, but it was awesome still. Loved the extinguisher spot, thought that was clever of course. Check this out, awesome stuff. ****1/4 

*CAL SCALE: 6 

Match #7: Super crazy vs Juvy
*
FUCK THIS. NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1 
*
*Match #7: Eddie Gurrero vs Batista
*
It’s cool that the last PPV Eddie was on he was in the main event of a PPV and it was for a world title. I do hope that the murmurs that Eddie was supposed to win the title soon after this were true; also wish the HBK match happened . This starts out pretty slow, but its not boring per say, just pretty slow. Okay I was wrong, it becomes pretty boring after a little bit. Another VERY long headlock, maybe that is the theme of the night or some shit like that. Cannot really blame Eddie for this, tista’s working pretty shitty at this point, makes me think he was already hurt at this point, so maybe I cannot blame him as well. A lot of submission points in this match, a lot of LONG submission points, this makes the match pretty boring IMO, but at this point its already the third best match of the night. The ending stretch is actually a lot better, thank god because this one sucked early on. The Batista bomb outta nowhere finish was pretty stupid actually, but this was solid, not in the upper echelon of PPV ME’s of 2005 though. 2nd best match of the show though. ***1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 3 

FINAL CAL SCALE: 11

CURRENT PPV MOTY: Triple H vs Batista( Vengeance) 

Current 2005 PPV rankings

1: Summerslam ( 24) 
2: Vengeance 
3: Wrestlemania 21( 19)
4: Royal Rumble (17)
5: Judgment day(17) 
6: ECW ONS(16) 
7: Unforgiven( 14.5)
8: Backlash(13.5)
9: No mercy( 11) 
10: New Year’s Revolution (9.5)
11: The bash ( 6.5)
12: No way out (4.5)
*​


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Simon Dean was hilarious. One of my most favorite jobbers.

GOAT segment with Batista:


----------



## Captain Edd (Dec 14, 2011)

The Simon-System was awesome, Dean is one of my favorite Jobbers






*THE LEAN DEAN BODY CREME*


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

We need some more love for the segment with Austin :austin. Can't seem to find it though...


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Finished watching the Morishima (sp?) vs Bryan and even though it was good with Bryan's work as the underdog refusing to stay down and 'shima being the monster, I was a bit disappointed since I heard comparisons being made to Brock/Cena.

Now (sorta) watching Final Four in my 97 project. Will probably only watch IC and the main event, though. Rest doesn't interest me.



smitty915 said:


> Match #7: Super crazy vs Juvy
> [/B]
> FUCK THIS. NO


lol, why? They are not bad.



Oliver-94 said:


> We need some more love for the segment with Austin :austin. Can't seem to find it though...


http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xm...ven-and-simon-dean-segment-raw-4-4-2005_sport


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Wasn't in the mood C2D


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Chismo said:


> :kobe9


 this match looks kinda awesome on paper. I should watch it, don't think I've seen this Tenryu match yet!!!


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

....You NO'd a Juventud Guerrera v. Super Crazy match? Juvi was like the 4th best worker on that show.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

*Simon Dean's a fucking boss. My favorite moment was when dumped some weird drink on this fat lady on a RAW episode :lmao 

I could've sworn that Juvi-Super Crazy match was actually decent...although I haven't seen the show in a while.*


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Juvy or Psicosis. Who you got as the better worker?


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Definitely Psicosis. If someone picked Juvi I couldn't blame them, but I didn't think twice to choose Psic.


----------



## rjsbx1 (Jul 16, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Juvy or Psicosis. Who you got as the better worker?


*IMO Juventud was the better high flyer but Psychosis was more than just a high flyer and was very well rounded and overall a better worker.

However, Juvi was clearly leaps and bounds ahead of him in the charisma department and all that jazz.
*


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Psicosis brother


missed the first couple of mins of Punk/Ambrose but the rest of watch I saw was pretty good, need to see it in full

show/rey vs. real amercians :mark:


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Summerslam Main Events

Del Rio/Christian ****1/2*
Punk/Lesnar *****3/4*
Bryan/Cena *****1/2*

Del Rio/Christian is fine. Not as good as I remember from the night it aired. Nothing to really say other than the arm work was good. Del Rio's kicks are still :mark: But his dropping the knee pad makes no sense for a kick. 

Punk/Lesnar is so much win. Had me :mark:ing out the whole match from Brock catching Punk running in off the opening bell and taking him off his feet right to the end. Brock's teased taps continue to get me, especially when he was in the Triangle Choke. Punk's size worked to an advantage here because it made Brock throwing him around seem that much more brutal. The Heyman involvement worked completely, as Punk ultimately want too badly to get his hands on Heyman and it cost him. This was the third time I've seen this and I marked like a child the whole time.

This was only the second time I've seen Bryan/Cena, the first time the night it aired. I'm pretty sure this is one of my favorite Cena matches ever. His selling of the arm is terrific, and he really did a great job making Bryan look great. When Bryan hits the superplex, but keeps his legs locked to the ropes, then pulls himself up and fires himself up :mark Good God. The ending was of the coolest moments of the year, because the crowd, after it had been counting pins through the match, didn't count this one hardly, but when Bryan got the 3 off the running knee they just exploded. Of course the GOAT heel went back on his throne in the end. 

Bryan/Cena just jumped Punk/Cena for #2 MOTY.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

:lmao there is a thread in the general talk asking "will there ever be another Rey Mysterio?" They might as well have asked "is the Miz the greatest of all time?" Because that is the most obvious "NO!! FUCK NO!!!" answer of all time.

Outside of the Rey matches, which Psicosis matches would you guys point to as being some of his best in the US? I need to watch more of that guy.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

From tonight's Smackdown

Punk/Ambrose: ***1/2

Orton/Bryan: **3/4


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

check his nitro match out with Regal cjack , very good, and after that most crusierweights match should suffice

DOes anybody know the date of the GOOD ambrose/bryan raw match ?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Juventud is a straight up goon. Dude can play face and heel really well and at times can be one of the funniest wrestlers in existence. Really fun and easy to watch wrestler, but then again so is Psicosis. Psicosis can also be a subtle dick. Damn, I think I'm partial to Juvi here, but Psicosis is really good too.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Since TLC is coming up, I'm gonna watch all fourteen TLC matches and rank them in a list when done. Just got done with watching the first one from SummerSlam for the first time in a while and it was absolutely awesome. Groundbreaking at the time but just non-stop killer spots that keep on coming and coming and for 15 minutes, you never feel like switching focus to something else.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

First TLC is so great. Those three teams clicked so well. Have a soft spot for Shield vs Ryback/Hell No but TLC I is definitely my favorite.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

C2D, were you the one that has not seen TLC IV (the Kane one)? If not, you're gonna be in for a ride. Nothing will surpass TLC III, but man those first few ones were classics. TLC is probably my favorite stipulation ever, and all but three matches have been great. Those three being Cena/Edge, Undertaker/Edge, and DX/Jerishow. On top of that, the only one that was very bad was DX/Jericho, which further shows just how great the stipulation is.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah, haven't seen TLC IV yet. Will go through them all chronologically, so it will come soon.

Was recommended it in another thread so I watched Flair vs Perfect from the third Raw in 1993 (Loser Leaves). Pretty good stuff with Flair being an excellent heel (the constant use of ropes for leverage is something we don't see very often anymore) and Perfect as the babyface. The comeback near the end and the quick Perfect-Plex out of nowhere was great. Looking at him 20 years later, Flair really has not aged all that well. lol @ Heenan.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Skimming Smackdown. Can't be asked to watch most of these matches.

This theme song :lmao

These piped in boos for Del Rio :lmao

Teasing Shield dissention :mark:

Commentary is leagues better with Jerry Lawler not there. Except Cole and JBL both go silent for like 2 minutes during Punk/Ambrose. :lol Match is very good, and easily Ambrose's best singles match yet. He looked very strong and did a lot of things well. Good selling from Punk also. Sold that armbar like he was dying.

Really wish they'd quit using Twitter to build feuds. It's becoming a crutch for people, and they aren't being forced to cut promos. 

Not feeling AJ on commentary. Nattie pins Tamina :mark: Can't wait for Nattie to take the belt off and the marks rage. :lol

Did they cut a Zeb promo from the final edit?? The way Cole and JBL were talking it sounded like he did. DAMN IT. 

They just won't quit with Big Show. fpalm Anyways, Real Americans and Rey in the same ring :mark: Eh, nothing much to see here. I hate Big Show now, especially as a face.

Bryan/Orton is meh. Felt pretty flat. 

Nothing to see on this show besides Punk/Ambrose.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Do people not like the Taker/Edge TLC, I haven't watched it for a while but remember liking it.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Really enjoyed Punk/Ambrose from Smackdown. I'd go ***1/2 on it after one watch.

We NEED to see Rey/Cesaro happen soon. Dunno how much longer Rey is going to be wrestling for but that match would be amazing.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Eh, it felt like a match that focused more on performing one spot after another instead of possessing an actual story, which is a shame since it has a guy who may very well be the greatest storyteller of all-time. I also thought it went on for WAY too long, which is an issue with not just the entire Edge/Taker series (even though I LOVE their WM and SS match), but an issue with a lot of Edge main event matches.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Psicosis was sooo freakin' good back in the day. Amazing mask as well.

- - - - - 

Rewatched Jericho/Mysterio from The Bash. That match is aging really really well, like a fine wine. ****1/2




HollyJollyHelmsley said:


> Summerslam Main Events
> 
> Del Rio/Christian ****1/2*
> Punk/Lesnar *****3/4*
> Bryan/Cena *****1/2*


There were 3 SummerSlams this year? :vince5


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

***1/4 for Punk/Ambrose and **3/4 for Bryan/Orton


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Undertaker vs Kamala in a "Coffin Match" - Survivor Series (11/25/92)* 

Okay big man gimmick match. *6/10*


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Hey anyone a fan of Orton/RVD RAW 1/12/04? I'm watching it now for the first time


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Yeah, haven't seen TLC IV yet. Will go through them all chronologically, so it will come soon.
> 
> Was recommended it in another thread so I watched Flair vs Perfect from the third Raw in 1993 (Loser Leaves). Pretty good stuff with Flair being an excellent heel (the constant use of ropes for leverage is something we don't see very often anymore) and Perfect as the babyface. The comeback near the end and the quick Perfect-Plex out of nowhere was great. Looking at him 20 years later, Flair really has not aged all that well. lol @ Heenan.



As amazing as the work is in the ring for the Loser Leaves Raw match, Heenan fucking MADE that thing. He was just too much. Behind the Power Trip tag, that's my second favorite Raw match.

For me, TLC 3 and Ryback/Hell No vs The Shield are neck and neck as the best of the TLC matches, with Summerslam 2000 CLOSE behind. I can't remember if it's TLC 3 or 4 were Jericho bulldogs Bubba off a ladder, legit knocks him out, and Bubba still continues the match and even takes a vicious chair shot to the head in the finish. It's stuff like that that makes me understand sometimes why the WWE went crazy over protecting the wrestlers. Bubba could have suffered serious brain damage there for a free tv match. I still think having a shot to the head every once in a while when the feud calls for it, if the wrestler gets their hands up and the two guys know what they are doing would he okay. But I'd be lying if I said it didn't make me feel a little sick knowing Bubba took an unprotected shot to the head just minutes after being knocked unconscious. Apparently Bubba was asking for his mom, who had passed away 2 years ago, back stage and Jericho had the unenviable task of reminding him she was dead. That's the bad side of pro graps sometimes.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Been indulging in nitro matches since last night and dont see me stopping soon ( will probably stop in a couple hours) but anybody have good wcw PPV match recommendations ?


Edit: only seen two tlc in my life punk/hardy and last years live


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Been indulging in nitro matches since last night and dont see me stopping soon ( will probably stop in a couple hours) but anybody have good wcw PPV match recommendations ?
> 
> 
> Edit: only seen two tlc in my life punk/hardy and last years live


WATCH I, II, III, and IV NOW, literally some of the most entertaining shit ever


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> Hey anyone a fan of Orton/RVD RAW 1/12/04? I'm watching it now for the first time


I'm like its biggest fan in here or anywhere else for that matter. ★★★¾.



Cactus Jack said:


> As amazing as the work is in the ring for the Loser Leaves Raw match, Heenan fucking MADE that thing. He was just too much. Behind the Power Trip tag, that's my second favorite Raw match.
> 
> For me, TLC 3 and Ryback/Hell No vs The Shield are neck and neck as the best of the TLC matches, with Summerslam 2000 CLOSE behind. I can't remember if it's TLC 3 or 4 were Jericho bulldogs Bubba off a ladder, legit knocks him out, and Bubba still continues the match and even takes a vicious chair shot to the head in the finish. It's stuff like that that makes me understand sometimes why the WWE went crazy over protecting the wrestlers. Bubba could have suffered serious brain damage there for a free tv match. I still think having a shot to the head every once in a while when the feud calls for it, if the wrestler gets their hands up and the two guys know what they are doing would he okay. But I'd be lying if I said it didn't make me feel a little sick knowing Bubba took an unprotected shot to the head just minutes after being knocked unconscious. Apparently Bubba was asking for his mom, who had passed away 2 years ago, back stage and Jericho had the unenviable task of reminding him she was dead. That's the bad side of pro graps sometimes.


Yep, Heenan was hilarious throughout that thing.

As for Bubba, funny you mention him. Because I thought about him the most when watching the first TLC because he took two brutal chair shots to the head and moments after climbed the latter and went through four tables on the outside from there.

You're right, I don't mind blood, chair shots to the head (protected and not with full force) used once in a while if the feud calls for it, but banning them from being done regularly is definitely for the best.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I need to watch more TLC/ladder matches, time to dig out those WWE Ladder DVD's.....


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> I'm like its biggest fan in here or anywhere else for that matter. ★★★¾.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




As much as I LOVE Foley and Benoit, I always thought they were morons for never getting their hands up on chair shots. Those dudes had the most realistic move sets I've ever seen, yet when it comes time for a chair shot, they do the most unrealistic thing possible and take them clean to the head with their hands down, Just because that's what they thought the fans wanted to see. Those two are also the only wrestlers I can think of that allowed guys to hit them in the back of the head, which is just retarded. The AE really did kill the significance of chair shots for a while, so I don't mind that they took them out on recent years. It's good for business. But I DO think, when the feud calls for it, one or two shots to the head if it's seasoned vets who know what they are doing could add to it. The Lesnar/Punk feud immediately comes to mind. I'd like to see that match if it was held in 2004, when guys could get color and use chair shots more realistically. It just seems weird when Punk gets a chair with Lesnar coming at him.....and he gut shots him. Or when guys have to stay bent over so they can tee off on their backs. It just looks silly. I'd rather they don't use the chair at all in those cases. They should look into using trash cans more. When my buddies and I used to wrestle with each other as kids, we had a big metal trash can just like they have in the WWE, and we used to crack each other in the head with it all the time, you can hardly feel it because it dents so easily. Or maybe they could invest some money in chairs made of way more flimsy metal, so it's much safer and bends easier when guys get hit. Just a thought.

The lack of blood is a whole different topic that's been discussed ad nauseum already. I find it ridiculous that PG movies can have blood in them but wrestling cannot.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Agree with that. One reason why HIAC matches aren't special anymore is because of the lack of blood. I'm not saying all HIAC matches need blood but blood certainly sells how dangerous and brutal the HIAC is. I have no idea why they don't allow blood in today's WWE. Linda's campaign is over. Only other reason I can think of is that they want to protect wrestlers but I don't know.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Or when Cena said to orton on Raw "Whack a chair off your back" (Well he didn't say exactly that  but you get my point).


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I think too much blood could be bad, woudn't want wrestlers getting HIV or something like that But HIAC matches need them, you just dont need blood for EVERYTHING 

Starting TT 05 soon, looks shitty outside the double ME


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Cactus Jack said:


> As much as I LOVE Foley and Benoit, I always thought they were morons for never getting their hands up on chair shots. Those dudes had the most realistic move sets I've ever seen, yet when it comes time for a chair shot, they do the most unrealistic thing possible and take them clean to the head with their hands down, Just because that's what they thought the fans wanted to see.


While being reckless, it's definitely not unrealisitc, it's a mind game, psychological tactic to astonish opponents, in a _"motherfucker is crazy, fuck this shit, it's not worth it"_ way.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> As much as I LOVE Foley and Benoit, I always thought they were morons for never getting their hands up on chair shots. Those dudes had the most realistic move sets I've ever seen, yet when it comes time for a chair shot, they do the most unrealistic thing possible and take them clean to the head with their hands down, Just because that's what they thought the fans wanted to see. Those two are also the only wrestlers I can think of that allowed guys to hit them in the back of the head, which is just retarded. The AE really did kill the significance of chair shots for a while, so I don't mind that they took them out on recent years. It's good for business. But I DO think, when the feud calls for it, one or two shots to the head if it's seasoned vets who know what they are doing could add to it. The Lesnar/Punk feud immediately comes to mind. I'd like to see that match if it was held in 2004, when guys could get color and use chair shots more realistically. It just seems weird when Punk gets a chair with Lesnar coming at him.....and he gut shots him. Or when guys have to stay bent over so they can tee off on their backs. It just looks silly. I'd rather they don't use the chair at all in those cases. They should look into using trash cans more. When my buddies and I used to wrestle with each other as kids, we had a big metal trash can just like they have in the WWE, and we used to crack each other in the head with it all the time, you can hardly feel it because it dents so easily. Or maybe they could invest some money in chairs made of way more flimsy metal, so it's much safer and bends easier when guys get hit. Just a thought.
> 
> The lack of blood is a whole different topic that's been discussed ad nauseum already. I find it ridiculous that PG movies can have blood in them but wrestling cannot.


Tbh, if the chair is hit with full force, getting your hands up doesn't do jack. There's this tag match from late 2004 where HHH goes crazy and hits everyone with chair shots. Benoit takes one to the back of the head (then for some reason blades, lol) and Jericho as well as the ref (Jack Doan) try to protect themselves by getting their hands up but he hit them so hard that they felt the impact. (Jericho held his hand immediately after so it probably took most of the impact) And yeah, it was stupid of them to not think about their health that much, but the sacrifices are why I respect the likes of Benoit, Foley and so on. Although I don't like Foley as much after he refused to sign an autograph to this guy in his comedy show because he wore a Benoit shirt.

I think Hogan has also taken a chair shot to the back of the head in the Judgment Day match with Undertaker. Maybe that's why I can never take anything he says seriously and always look at his perspective/opinions as a joke to laugh at. :lol

Just finished TLC II. Now it's on to III and IV! :mark:


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Tbh, if the chair is hit with full force, getting your hands up doesn't do jack. There's this tag match from late 2004 where HHH goes crazy and hits everyone with chair shots. Benoit takes one to the back of the head (then for some reason blades, lol) and Jericho as well as the ref (Jack Doan) try to protect themselves by getting their hands up but he hit them so hard that they felt the impact. (Jericho held his hand immediately after so it probably took most of the impact) And yeah, it was stupid of them to not think about their health that much, but the sacrifices are why I respect the likes of Benoit, Foley and so on. Although I don't like Foley as much after he refused to sign an autograph to this guy in his comedy show because he wore a Benoit shirt.
> 
> I think Hogan has also taken a chair shot to the back of the head in the Judgment Day match with Undertaker. Maybe that's why I can never take anything he says seriously and always look at his perspective/opinions as a joke to laugh at. :lol
> 
> Just finished TLC II. Now it's on to III and IV! :mark:


I WILL FOLLOW YOU ON YOUR TLC PURSUIT ONCE AGAIN LIKE I DID LAST YEAR. YES. :mark:.

Did that Foley/Benoit shirt guy thing actually happen?

Maybe the guy was just a douche. Who knows. I don't think it's right for Foley to discriminate based on opinions of popular topics though .


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

MERRY MUTHAPHUCKKIN CHRISTMAS said:


> I WILL FOLLOW YOU ON YOUR TLC PURSUIT ONCE AGAIN LIKE I DID LAST YEAR. YES. :mark:.
> 
> Did that Foley/Benoit shirt guy thing actually happen?
> 
> Maybe the guy was just a douche. Who knows. I don't think it's right for Foley to discriminate based on opinions of popular topics though .


Yep. Don't know if it was for a photo or autograph. But it was said that he didn't wanna be associated with it. I'd hope that it was not Foley's call because I really don't wanna think of him badly in any way.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Few things:

1)Cactus Jack, yes, I do intend to watch that first disc of Benoit's DVD one of these days.

2)Just watched "That's What I Am." Cute movie, but more of a chick flick type or family movie type I think, so I dunno if others here would like it as much. There's an extra about Orton on set, which is interesting, but LOL at it being longer than him in the actual movie, lol. 

Although it's a small role, it's a pivotal one to the movie, so that's good. 

3)Funny you guys are talking about these TLC matches. I watched the first TLC match a few days ago (Summerslam 2000), and it was loads o' fun. 'skins, you should definitely watch it. Pretty much everyone was taking some crazy bumps. I lol'ed 'cause I remember someone saying that Edge always let the others do the crazy work in these matches, and it's so true. He was on the receiving end of some harsh looking shit, though. I remember him saying in an interview later on, that he wouldn't really want to do TLC matches anymore. Too tough on the body.

4)Benoit vs. Jericho ladder match at Royal Rumble 2001 was really good. Felt very cohesive, and I felt that it was perhaps the most "match-like" ladder match that I've seen so far. Don't know how to explain it, other than that the ladder felt like a natural part of the match...almost like it was normal to have a match that way. I really liked that aspect of it.

5)Could you guys please tell me what exactly TLC II, III, IV are? I never know which matches you guys are referring to, and I don't like looking them up, because results get ruined. Thanks.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Chismo said:


> While being reckless, it's definitely not unrealisitc, it's a mind game, psychological tactic to astonish opponents, in a _"motherfucker is crazy, fuck this shit, it's not worth it"_ way.



That's the psychology behind the move, yea. I just think the natural human instinct anytime someone throws or swings something at your head is to get your hands up. I bet those guys had to make a concerted effort to not flinch and protect themselves when guys gave them a shot to the head. It's the same reason I don't like when Flair or other guys started off matches by chopping guys in the chest. The match just started, you are fresh, block that shit. I can buy it when the opponent has had some damage done to him and he's "dazed" or whatever, I just don't think it makes a lot of sense when the match has just started. See Regal vs Benoit at No Mercy, Benoit tries chopping Regal to start the match and Regal just swats them away, I thought that was awesome. This is all opinion, obviously, it's just my preference that my wrestling look as real and authentic as possible, it's easier for me to suspend disbelief that way. That's why Terry Funk, Finlay, and Regal are some of the best ever in my opinion. They made it so easy to suspend your disbelief, especially Funk. He was just plain nuts.

Edit- C2D that's really dissapointing, the Foley refusing to sign an autograph thing, if it's true. I would like to believe that since Foley is under contract with the WWE that that was the reason. If you listen to the Steve Austin podcast sometime, a few different non-WWE guys have brought up Benoit in conversations about workers they respect, and Steve made an obvious effort each time to steer the conversation in a different direction. If you read Foleys book where he talks about Benoit, he doesn't call him a monster or say he was a bad guy or anything. He just says he has no idea how it was possible and it's a mystery to him.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> Few things:
> 
> 
> 4)Benoit vs. Jericho ladder match at Royal Rumble 2001 was really good. Felt very cohesive, and I felt that it was perhaps the most "match-like" ladder match that I've seen so far. Don't know how to explain it, other than that the ladder felt like a natural part of the match...almost like it was normal to have a match that way. I really liked that aspect of it.


Still the GOAT ladder match.

IMO.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

Choke2Death said:


> I'm like its biggest fan in here or anywhere else for that matter. ★★★¾.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If a chair shot to the head happens in a big match I really don't have a problem with that. Also there are different levels of getting hit in the head. Obviously don't fucking blast the guy as hard as possible unprotected. I'm honestly not sure how harmful they really are compared to other things. Obviously if you hit someone hard enough to knock them out that can obviously cause problems but when guys don't get knocked out by them I'm really not sure how many concussions people get from them. 

It's the pointless ones that just aren't called for at all. The best example I can think of is a segment from Impact where Homicide (at least I think that's who it was) blasted some English guy in the head with a chair in a random run in. There was no need for it at all.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

LilOlMe said:


> Few things:
> 
> 
> 2)Just watched "That's What I Am." Cute movie, but more of a chick flick type or family movie type I think, so I dunno if others here would like it as much. There's an extra about Orton on set, which is interesting, but LOL at it being longer than him in the actual movie, lol.
> ...


I love that movie, best WWE pictures movie IMO 

And this has all the matches http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tables,_Ladders,_and_Chairs_match#WWF.2FE


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> 5)Could you guys please tell me what exactly TLC II, III, IV are? I never know which matches you guys are referring to, and I don't like looking them up, because results get ruined. Thanks.


It's just their chronological numbers. TLC I is SummerSlam 2000, TLC II is Wrestlemania 17, TLC III is on Smackdown from May 24th, 2001. TLC IV is from the Raw Roulette in 2002 (October time I think). _(don't go to wikipedia unless you want spoilers)_



Cactus Jack said:


> Edit- C2D that's really dissapointing, the Foley refusing to sign an autograph thing, if it's true. I would like to believe that since Foley is under contract with the WWE that that was the reason. If you listen to the Steve Austin podcast sometime, a few different non-WWE guys have brought up Benoit in conversations about workers they respect, and Steve made an obvious effort each time to steer the conversation in a different direction. If you read Foleys book where he talks about Benoit, he doesn't call him a monster or say he was a bad guy or anything. He just says he has no idea how it was possible and it's a mystery to him.


Got any examples of those Austin convos? I've heard his own opinion on the matter when someone posted the question in his site and he was straight forward about it. He also talked to Angle about the cage match without going anywhere close to the tragedy.

And I hope that's the case with Foley, reading his take on it in his book, I wouldn't expect him to treat Benoit's name as taboo or something to stay away from.



Merry Fitzmas To All said:


> If a chair shot to the head happens in a big match I really don't have a problem with that. Also there are different levels of getting hit in the head. Obviously don't fucking blast the guy as hard as possible unprotected. I'm honestly not sure how harmful they really are compared to other things. Obviously if you hit someone hard enough to knock them out that can obviously cause problems but when guys don't get knocked out by them I'm really not sure how many concussions people get from them.
> 
> It's the pointless ones that just aren't called for at all. The best example I can think of is a segment from Impact where Homicide (at least I think that's who it was) blasted some English guy in the head with a chair in a random run in. There was no need for it at all.


I think unprotected chair shots to the head are pretty bad, specially with full force. I'm watching these TLC matches and I'm near the end of III at the moment. This is where I think Bubba Ray got knocked out from a ladder bulldog and even after that, he gets hit in the head with a monitor and a chair about as hard as possible. I really feel for him watching these matches because he must've got 10 concussions combined in all of them.

You're right about the pointless ones specially. Another example is Kennedy blasting Eddie with that brutal chair shot three days before Eddie died.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> I love that movie, best WWE pictures movie IMO
> 
> And this has all the matches http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tables,_Ladders,_and_Chairs_match#WWF.2FE


Thanks, but at quick glance it shows the winners in one column and the losers in another, and that's what I'm trying to avoid. 

Regarding the blood convo, I totally agree that the lack of blood detracts from HIAC matches. Some people overdo it, but I think sometimes it can really add to a match.

Since we're on the topic of blood...I watched *JBL vs. Eddie Guerrero at Judgment Day 2004* the other day, and it was glorious. Mainly for the aftermath. The match in the first half wasn't spectacular, but from the point of the gash on, it was magnificent. Perfect example of blood adding to the story and to the match, because Eddie's comeback really did feel all the more amazing, with the blood gushing out of his head. Especially when he displayed those little personality quirks while it was happening. The ending didn't bother me. Maybe because him actually winning might have felt unrealistic to me.

It also paved way for that great aftermath, so it's all good.

*****1/4 - ****1/2ish.*


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I fucking hate WWE not including match listings inlay with a lot of DVD's, i gotta google 'em and print some off at some point.....


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> It's just their chronological numbers. TLC I is SummerSlam 2000, TLC II is Wrestlemania 17, TLC III is on Smackdown from May 24th, 2001. TLC IV is from the Raw Roulette in 2002 (October time I think). _(don't go to wikipedia unless you want spoilers)_


lol, I knew it meant chronologically, but I meant when did those matches take place. Thanks for answering. You're always helpful too!




Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> I fucking hate WWE not including match listings inlay with a lot of DVD's, i gotta google 'em and print some off at some point.....


It's so annoying. I just went to Amazon.com, because usually the top reviews will contain the listing on the DVDs.

Then I just wrote them by hand on a piece of paper, and put them in the DVD case(s). 

I don't think you'll find very many inserts online, unfortunately.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Eddie Guerrero's little dance while he was bleeding like crazy in the JD 04 match is one of the best things ever in wrestling. Goosebumps galore.

Am I going crazy, or was Great Khali vs. Kane vs. Batista from Great American Bash 2007 actually a decent match? For the first and only time ever, Batista carried people to something decent.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Eddie Guerrero's little dance while he was bleeding like crazy in the JD 04 match is one of the best things ever in wrestling. Goosebumps galore.


YES!!!!!

How was Benoit vs. Kane at Bad Blood 2004?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Oops, sorry for the spoilers 

I'm still debating if JD 04 Eddie/JBL is five stars. If not it'd be the third 2004 PPV in a row with a match at least ****3/4 

Mania: Triple threat( five stars)
Orton/Foley
Eddie/JBL

Lesnar/Eddie might be ****3/4 too 

Lilolme: Thats Kane's best match ever IMO


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> 5)Could you guys please tell me what exactly TLC II, III, IV are? I never know which matches you guys are referring to, and I don't like looking them up, because results get ruined. Thanks.


SummerSlam 00: Dudley Boyz vs. Hardy Boyz vs. Edge & Christian
WrestleMania X-7: Edge & Christian vs. The Dudley Boyz vs. Hardy Boyz
5/4/01 SmackDown: Edge & Christian vs. Dudley Boyz vs. Hardy Boyz vs. Chris Jericho & Chris Benoit
10/7/02 RAW: Kane & The Hurricane vs. Rob Van Dam & Jeff Hardy vs. Bubba Ray & Spike Dudley vs. Chris Jericho & Christian


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I love Benoit/Kane from Bad Blood 2004. Felt like a "Bret Hart" type match with a simple big man vs. little man formula done effectively. They had another match on the 6/28 edition on RAW that was great too. *****1/4* for Bad Blood and ****3/4* for the RAW 2004 match.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Finished TLC III and it's on to IV. But I don't know if I should watch WWE's youtube version of it or not because they always edit something and I absolutely _hate_ it.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Am I going crazy, or was Great Khali vs. Kane vs. Batista from Great American Bash 2007 actually a decent match? For the first and only time ever, Batista carried people to something decent.


Maybe if you stopped blindly hating Batista you would realize that he has good enough in-ring ability, since 07 at least.  And I've never doubted him ever since I watched his Punjabi Prison match with Khali and actually enjoyed it.



funnyfaces1 said:


> I love Benoit/Kane from Bad Blood 2004. Felt like a "Bret Hart" type match with a simple big man vs. little man formula done effectively. They had another match on the 6/28 edition on RAW that was great too. *****1/4* for Bad Blood and ****3/4* for the RAW 2004 match.


The Raw match is pretty good, specially with how:



Spoiler: spoiler



...they had Kane actually tap out. Somehow, he's always been protected in this regard other than this once, one match with Angle in 2001 and I heard Benoit regularly made him tap when they had house show matches back then.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> YES!!!!!
> 
> How was Benoit vs. Kane at Bad Blood 2004?


Stopped doing the Michael"s Project ?


smitty915 said:


> Oops, sorry for the spoilers
> *
> I'm still debating if JD 04 Eddie/JBL is five stars*. If not it'd be the third 2004 PPV in a row with a match at least ****3/4


I along with a couple others here I think have it around there to so its not abnormal, I personally dont think the wm XX main event is, its just missing something and Im not a benoit mark so I didnt really care about the ending. Tajri/kidman bl 02 was awesome btw


As Ive been watching cruiserweight wcw stuff, I dont understand the bryan = benoit comparisons when he is pretty much the modern day Dean Malenko with a bit more psychology and athleticism. I swear at some point I think I'm watching bryan out there


----------



## JustJoel (Aug 2, 2013)

Cactus Jack said:


> Outside of the Rey matches, which Psicosis matches would you guys point to as being some of his best in the US? I need to watch more of that guy.


v. Tajiri in ECW
http://vimeo.com/17425381

Psicosis/La Parka v. Rey/Konnan
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xpmlrk_psicosis-la-parka-vs-konnan-rey-mysterio_sport

v. Ultimo @ GAB
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etTJKV0vtK0

Few others too, but those are off the top.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

There's always that Tajiri/Psicosis Texas Death Match that everyone pimps but i still havn't seen 

Watching Eddie/RVD - Raw 2002 Ladder match atm


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Taboo Tuesday 2005 review 

Match #1: Chris Masters and Edge vs Matt Hardy and Rey Mysterio* 

:mark: all the way here, this should be a lot of fun. All these guys are pretty good and although I’m not a huge fan of Edge, he has had some awesome matches this year. Wait, Edge is replaced by Snitsky? What the fuck does that accomplish? Well this has gone down the drain quick because I fucking hate Snitsky, unless he is going up against Big Show. Pretty good match, nothing spectacular here but I certainly didn’t expect a classic with Snitsky in there. Opening moments were a little slow, but it wasn’t too bad. It started getting a lot better after the first 5 minutes. These guys worked really well together which is cool considering it was their first time working together as a team for both teams IIRC. The moments not involving Snitsky were pretty awesome, and even he managed to make this pretty enjoyable. So yeah this was the first tag match I’ve enjoyed all year, really good choice to open the show with this energetic tag match. ***1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 3* 
*
Match #2: Eugene and Jimmy Snuka vs Rob Conway and Tyson Tomko 
*
Jesus Christ this sounds absolutely horrible. NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1 

Match #3: Mankind vs Carlito *

Really? Mankind’s big comeback is against fucking Carlito? That’s some bullshit; we needed Benoit/Mankind or Mankind/Cena. This is fucking horseshit. Hopefully Foley can carry him to a decent match. Well at least Foley had that absolute classic at WM 22 and ECW ONS 06, salvages this semi comeback run. I think this would have been a lot more enjoyable if it was a complete squash, but its whatever because it was decent anyways. It must have been cool to see Mick back in the ring at this time and it was a good idea to have Mick go over. So overall this was decent but nothing to special at all. Basically just a prelude to his two classics in 2006. **1/2 
*
CAL SCALE: 1

Match #4: Big Show and Kane vs Lance Cade and Trevor Murdoch 
*
Wow another tag match? Well this should be decent at best, I like all 4 guys at least. Match starts out more fun than you would think, as all 4 guys are fighting pretty stiff which fits their style, so it’s a fun match so far. So a pretty fun big man match here( I guess you could call Cade and Murdoch big men), these guys worked a lot better together than I thought they would. Whatever happened to Cade and Murdoch? They must have just faded out after this as I don’t remember them being anywhere else. Kane and Show win the tag titles, and a pretty good match. ***

*CAL SCALE: 2 

Match #5: Coach(w/ Goldust) and Vader vs Batista *

Okay, I’m gonna watch this because I LOVE Vader and Goldust, plus the fact that it should be pretty funny. So one of the choices was verbal debate :lol, would of voted for that of course, could have been fucking hilarious, same with Arm wrestling match. Of course street fight won, but IDGAF, I wanted the debate . This was nothing but a glorified squash of course, but it wasn’t too bad. For a comedy filler match, it was mildly entertaining. However, if your looking for a good match, search elsewhere of course, but its not a DUD. *

*CAL SCALE: 0

Match #6: Divas battle royal* 

YEAH not happening. NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1

Match #7: Ric Flair vs Triple H*

And this is what I was watching this show for of course, this and the triple threat match that is supposed to be awesome as well. So after nearly three years together these two together their finally gonna do battle for the IC title, inside a steel cage no less. What a fucking war this was, Flair legit got his ass completely beaten out of him for the majority of the match. This was so fucking amazing, and easily a top 10 match of the year so far. I have heard that their LMS match at the next PPV is even better. If this is true, it may be one of my favorite matches ever. These guys put on a complete fucking war and I had trouble writing and watching at the same time because it was so memorizing, not many matches can do that for sure. The blood and hatred between these two was so amazing, I don’t say this often, but that match had some amazing psychology! ****1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 7

Match #8: Kurt Angle vs John Cena vs Shawn Michaels *

I’m looking forward to this a lot, as apparently its pretty good. I like triple threats so I should be able to enjoy this match; I also like all three guys a lot (even Angle!). This match was a really good fast paced match, compared to the somewhat slower paced Trips/Flair match before it. IMO all three guys have really good chemistry with each other, all though Angle and Cena can vary greatly at times. This was just a flat out FUN match all the way through, and I had trouble not looking away from the TV it was so fun. A lot of SPOTZ make this match really fun because I admit to being a fan of spotfests but this was much more than that. It was basically a lite version of the mania 20 triple threat, and it may be number three all time in WWE behind the WM 20 match and Vengeance 2002. It is kind of short at 16 minutes, but it didn’t leave me wanting anything more. Only thing is that the Cena win leaves a bad taste in your mouth, it was time for him to drop the title here. ****1/4 

*CAL SCALE: 6 

FINAL CAL SCALE: 17

CURRENT PPV MOTY: Batista vs Triple H (Vengeance) *

*Current 2005 PPV rankings

1: Summerslam (24) 
2: Vengeance (21) 
3: WrestleMania 21(19)
4: Royal Rumble (17)
5: Taboo Tuesday (17)
6: Judgment day (17) 
7: ECW ONS (16) 
8: Unforgiven (14.5)
9: Backlash (13.5)
10: No mercy (11)
11: New Year’s Revolution (9.5)
12: The bash (6.5)
13: No way out (4.5)
*​


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Great to see that you'e consistently putting out reviews, smitty. Not a surprise, but I didn't care for TT either, but I love the cage match and I've grown to like the main event too. The two tag matches just did nothing for me, and I just don't like the premise behind Taboo Tuesday anyways. Flair with two straight great cage matches on that PPV. WOO :flair


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Fucking hell, first time in years i have watched the RVD/Eddie (Raw 2002) ladder match, but i forgot how awesome it really is, just non stop. Shame RVD fell off the ladder, but its still an awesome match IMO.

****


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The fan trying to knock Eddie off the ladder is pretty :lmao. Especially when Eddie kicks him in the fucking head :lmao.

But of course that moment is edited for any released version of it .


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

I saw you guys were talking about TLC matches? I just watched the ladder match DVD a few weeks ago actually. 

TLC 1 SS 00: ****1/4
TLC II WM 17: ****3/4 MOTY 
TLC III SD 01: ****1/4
TLC 4 Raw 02: **** 
Cena/Edge TLC: **** (IT GETS SOOOO MUCH BUT ILL ALWAYS LOVE IT)


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> The fan trying to knock Eddie off the ladder is pretty :lmao. Especially when Eddie kicks him in the fucking head :lmao.
> 
> But of course that moment is edited for any released version of it .


Yeah, i was going to say i watched the Ladder match DVD version, and of course it was edited. I was like what happened, Eddie had the ladder setup then it was like time had frozen.

Never seen the unedited version


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

14. Edge Vs Kane Vs Rey Mysterio Vs Alberto Del Rio - TLC XI TLC 2010 - **
13. Undertaker Vs Edge - TLC VII One Night Stand 2008 - **1/2
12. DX Vs JeriShow - TLC IX TLC 2009 - **1/2
11. CM Punk Vs Alberto Del Rio Vs The Miz - TLC XII TLC 2011 - **1/2
10. John Cena Vs Edge - TLC VI Unforgiven 2006 - ***
09. Bubba & Spike Vs Kane & Hurricane Vs Chris Jericho & Christian Vs Jeff Hardy & Rob Van Dam - TLC IV Raw 07/10/2002 - ***1/4
08. CM Punk Vs Jeff Hardy - TLC VIII SummerSlam 2009 - ***1/2
07. The Dudley Boys Vs The Hardy Boys Vs Edge & Christian - TLC II WrestleMania 01/04/2001 - ***1/2
06. Jerry Lawler Vs The Miz - TLC X Raw 29/11/2010 - ***1/2
05. CM Punk Vs Ryback - TLC XIV Raw 07/01/2013 - ***1/2
04. Edge Vs Ric Flair - TLC V Raw 16/01/2006 - ***3/4
03. The Shield Vs Team Hell No & Ryback - TLC XIII TLC 2012 - ****
02. The Dudley Boys Vs The Hardy Boys Vs Edge & Christian - TLC I SummerSlam 2000 - ****1/4
01. The Dudley Boys Vs The Hardy Boys Vs Edge & Christian Vs Chris Jericho & Chris Benoit - TLC III Smackdown 24/05/2001 - ****1/2

Edit: I seem to recall watching the Shield TLC match again not too long ago and liking it more so good chance it's probably actually my #2 now but I can't remember :lmao.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)




----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Finally watched the fourth TLC and BAW GOD, this was amazing. Started off a bit slow but in the end they went crazy with awesome spots one after another until Kane came back out of nowhere and retained the titles. Bubba Ray is a warrior. I was wrong as it's here he gets concussed from the ladder bulldog and still continues. I was surprised by how much he did here including a ladder superplex!

Flair/Edge is up next! Can't wait to watch Edge/Taker because it's been a long time and my tastes may have changed.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Idea for a TV Show


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Just watched SD. I actually thought Orton vs. Bryan was pretty good. Better than their PPV matches at least. Punk vs. Ambrose was okay I guess, and :mark: for Cesaro vs. Rey interactions.

Oh, and if Daniel Bryan joins the Wyatts...I will complain a lot.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Well, Flair/Edge got even better on second watch. Now it's Cena/Edge time before I'll have to close The Ladder Match to move on to the HD era TLCs. It went down last time for me but I still enjoyed it quite a lot.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> There's always that Tajiri/Psicosis Texas Death Match that everyone pimps but i still havn't seen


Psic/Tajiri isn't a death match. Might be the best ECW match ever, though.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> Psic/Tajiri isn't a death match. Might be the best ECW match ever, though.


 Got mixed up.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Yeah there're like 60,000 Tajiri/Super Crazy matches and a bunch of them are Mexican Death Matches. I thought Tajiri/Psicosis bested all of them, though, personally.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Just finished watching HBK/Vince from WrestleMania 22. FUN sums up this match completely, it's just such a enjoyable match to watch imo. JR's commentary is utterly brilliant in this with his over the top hate for Vince which puts over Vince as a truly evil son of a bitch. The elbow of the huge ladder at the end still makes me :mark: A match I can easily watch again and again:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Vince McMahon is a better wrestler than a lot of the folks he hired over the years. And then Shawn :lenny. I'm still in awe over how he carried seven men and one deity to a good match the next PPV.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Funnyfaces, what are some good WCW ppvs ?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Do you want pre-nWo stuff or during-nWo stuff?

Pre:

Spring Stampede 1994
Superbrawl II
Wrestlewar 92
Beach Blast 92
Great American Bash 92 (very tag team heavy though)
Great American Bash 89 (DAT FLAIR)
Superbrawl III

During nWo:
Spring Stampede 99
Slamboree 98
Halloween Havoc 97 :eddie
First half of Starrcade 96
Souled Out 98

Honestly WCW PPVs were not that good. You're better off watching individual matches instead.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Vince McMahon is a better wrestler than a lot of the folks he hired over the years. And then Shawn :lenny. I'm still in awe over how he carried seven men and one deity to a good match the next PPV.


Yeah, he even put in a good performance in a match with CM Punk last year...at 68 years old. There's a few Vince matches I have no problem with re-watching.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

8 TLC matches done, 6 to go. 

Hope I can run through them all before the end of the night. Finished the Punk/Hardy match and I can't help but notice how bored JR sounds announcing this. Nothing against the competitors but the contrast between JR calling some of the first TLC matches and this... it's amusing to say the least.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Do you want pre-nWo stuff or during-nWo stuff?
> 
> Pre:
> 
> ...


Thanks, was thinking nwo but I'll just watch individuals, just saw a benoit/janetty nitro match :lenny


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

SKINS, have you seen Benoit/Sullivan from GAB 96?

Punk/Hardy :mark:. I did notice the disinterest in JR's voice, especially compared to prior years. He did kinda have that tone throughout his tenure in Smackdown for whatever reason. What did you think of Edge/Cena and Edge/Taker in this rewatch, C2D?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

one where they brawl all around the arena ? Then yes, good stuff, been watching Malenko/y2j/rey the past couple days and cant get enough, and I have to say something, may be unpopular ; Y2J wcw >>>> his whole wwe run character wise


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> He did kinda have that tone throughout his tenure in Smackdown for whatever reason.


Probably because he didn't really enjoy it working with crap like Todd Grisham. He was always the best working with Lawler on RAW, he had such great chemistry with The King. Apparently he wasn't happy when WWE sent him to Smackdown.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah, Grisham is so terrible. A robot has more personality than this guy. He just doesn't have it and even when he tries to sound excited, it comes across as terrible.

As for my thoughts on Edge/Cena and Edge/Taker... I'll save it for when the list is done so I don't make it too predictable.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm of the opinion that 1998 Y2J is the greatest entertainer in the history of Thespia. He had a good match with every opponent he had in 1998 except for Konnan, and I can honestly say that Jericho contributed more to those matches than any of his opponents. Now go watch some DDP. That dude was special. He carried literally every single fossil in the main event to a good match. Hogan, Hall, Nash, Hart, Flair, Piper, Goldberg (not a fossil), Hennig, Giant (also not a fossil), etc. You name it, DDP carried it.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Saw the segment Y2J went to captial hill :lmao probably his best segment 

what some good Y2J match from that year ?


Nostalgia you took my next sig :lol


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x4z66i_nitro-98-eddie-jericho-vs-malenko-c_shortfilms



Spoiler: Youtubelinks


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Nostalgia you took my next sig :lol


:lol

Perfect sig to troll people considering how much hate Eva gets on here.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Just watched the first two TLC matches, might try to watch them all before the PPV but IDK

TLC I: ****1/2
TLC II: ****

I like TLC II a LOT, but the first half is kind of meh, the second half is :mark: of course but I'd still put it below the original, the atmosphere helps the second one a lot though.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Only two TLCs left to go. Now it's time for that Shield match. :mark:


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Trucking through some more 2013 matches for the Top 10. I actually enjoyed RVD/Del Rio from Battleground. Not making the top 10 but it was good for what it was. Rhodes/Shield from the same show is still really good. Ending is just marvelous. 

Bryan/Cesaro from the 7/22 gauntlet :mark: :mark: The ending to that. :mark: Dem uppercuts :mark: I also still liked RVD/Jericho from RAW following MITB. The former may be at the bottom of the top 10, but RVD/Jericho will likely be on the outside looking in.

Watched Cena/Sandow again and I just can't get behind it. It's super-Cena at his worst. Takes Sandow's signature and finisher, kicks out. Cena has one fucking arm, then at the end hurts his knee, and still gets the win. Remember earlier this year when Del Rio had one leg and lost the briefcase? 

Seven matches left to watch, three of them are SHIELD matches. :mark:


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Got my buddy the MITB Blu-Ray for Christmas. Watched the first 8 today with him and a couple friends.

*MITB I - ****1/2*

Great combination of wrestlers in this one. The edits on commentary for the Benoit stuff were pretty annoying but the silence when he's climbing the ladder to do the headbutt built some cool suspense. Benjamin steals the show with that insane dive out of the ring and the clothesline running up the ladder.

*MITB II - ***1/2*

Not all that much happens in this one but it's still pretty fun. Benjamin does some sick stuff once again but nothing too crazy here.

*MITB III - ***3/4*

Another pretty fun one. The Hardy/Edge spot always gets me. The Kennedy senton bomb that misses and he nails his neck off the ladder is nasty. The bump Hornswoggle takes is pretty sick too. Finlay looks fucking badass when he bleeds. Liked how just about everyone got their time to shine too.

*MITB IV - ****1/2*

Holds up as my personal favorite. Benjamin puts on another fucking show for us until he dies for our sins through the ladder. Matt Hardy's return actually felt pretty epic too, thought they booked MVP really well in this match. Some cool innovative spots with the ladders in this one, as well. LOVE the callback spot with Mr Kennedy and Punk that is the reverse order of the ending of MITB III.

*MITB V - ***3/4*

Forgot most of what happened in this one going in. The spot where Henry catches Kofi and Worlds Strongest Slams him on the ladder is awesome. Benjamin dies for our sins again jumping off the big ladder on the outside. MVP has a sick powerbomb on Benjamin when Benjamin jumps off the ladder. Another awesome callback spot where Punk is hanging upside down from the ladder like he did to Jericho last year. Christian's Killswitch to Punk off the ladder actually looked really good too.

*MITB VI - ***1/2*

Can't say I loved this one. Thought Bourne and Ziggler were entertaining in it, Christian too. Benjamin didn't wow me as much in this one. Too much going on at once. Bourne doing the one leg SSP was cool.

*SD MITB '10 - ****1/4*

Awesome dynamic in this one. Big Show dominating everyone and pulling out the big ass ladder. Kofi's leg drop through the table to Drew Mac was pretty cool. The Ziggler/Kane battle at the top of the ladder was fun as well. Cool way to take Show out, covering him in the ladders and Dolph. Kane absolutely destroyed people at the end there, forgot how dominant he was. 

*Raw MITB '10 - ****1/2*

Holy shit this went up quite a bit for me. I've seen this match a bunch of time but I really appreciated it this time. Still lots of innovative spots despite being 8 matches in. Henry was a goddamn beast again. That spot where they push the ladder that DiBiase was on out of the ring is BRUTAL. Absolutely brutal. Morrison climbing the ladder outside the ring, to the ropes and then riding the other ladder to the one in the middle was really cool too. Morrison and Bourne both going in between the rungs led to some brutal spots. 

So far my MVP of the first eight goes to Shelton Benjamin and it's not even close. Least valuable goes to Matt Hardy, who through the 5 matches he was actually in did just about nothing interesting. However his return during MITB IV was cool.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

*RANKING ALL 14 TLC MATCHES (WORST TO BEST)​*
*14. DX vs Chris Jericho & Big Show - TLC 2009










13. CM Punk vs The Miz vs Alberto Del Rio - TLC 2011










12. Edge vs Kane vs Rey Mysterio vs Alberto Del Rio - TLC 2010










11. CM Punk vs Jeff Hardy - SummerSlam 2009










10. The Miz vs Jerry Lawler - Raw, 29 November 2010










9. Edge vs Undertaker - One Night Stand 2008










8. CM Punk vs Ryback - Raw, 7 January 2013










7. Edge vs Ric Flair - Raw, 16 January 2006










6. John Cena vs Edge - Unforgiven 2006










5. Edge & Christian vs The Dudleyz vs The Hardys - Wrestlemania 17*









_(This was like a lesser version of the first TLC with many spots redone and the same teams. It starts off slow and really picks up when Rhyno shows up. What makes this standout and overrated by some is the fact it takes place at Wrestlemania and Edge gives Jeff Hardy that amazing spear off the ladder.)_

*4. Kane & Hurricane vs Christian & Chris Jericho vs Jeff Hardy & Rob Van Dam vs The Dudleyz - Raw, 7 October 2002*









_(This was a bit different with a bunch of random teams that I wouldn't have expected and a new element with monster Kane defending the titles all by himself. Starts off slow to the point it can be considered disappointing but halfway through, the pace picks up and we get loads of amazing spots as well as great back and forth action with all teams until monster Kane manages to defeat all opposition and rise above as still champion.)_

*3. The Shield vs Team Hell No & Ryback - TLC 2012*









_(This has one thing going against it and that's the lack of reason to have a TLC match since nothing is hanging above the ring. But they still made it work by giving us 20+ minutes of pure war and non-stop action. Well paced and the whole match flows beautifully with each control segment involving each team and plenty of amazing spots. Sucks to see how far Ryback has fallen since then because he was impressive here.)_

*2. Edge & Christian vs The Dudleyz vs The Hardys - SummerSlam 2000*









_(The original TLC and simply one of the best that set the bar so high for others to follow. A superior version of TLC II in short. Great non-stop action and spots for 15 minutes that you can't take your eyes off.)_

*1. Chris Benoit & Chris Jericho vs Edge & Christian vs The Hardys vs The Dudleyz - Smackdown, 24 May 2001















*
_(The very best we've got so far. Each team sacrificed their bodies to make this great and it was different to the first two with new spots being tried, a fourth team added and an underdog babyface team defending the titles.)_​


Spoiler: list with ratings



(★★¾)
14. DX vs Chris Jericho & Big Show - TLC 2009
(★★★¼)
13. CM Punk vs The Miz vs Alberto Del Rio - TLC 2011
12. Edge vs Kane vs Rey Mysterio vs Alberto Del Rio - TLC 2010
11. CM Punk vs Jeff Hardy - SummerSlam 2009
(★★★½)
10. The Miz vs Jerry Lawler - Raw, 29 November 2010
9. Edge vs Undertaker - One Night Stand 2008
(★★★¾)
8. CM Punk vs Ryback - Raw, 7 January 2013
(★★★★)
7. Edge vs Ric Flair - Raw, 16 January 2006
6. John Cena vs Edge - Unforgiven 2006
5. Edge & Christian vs The Dudleyz vs The Hardys - Wrestlemania 17
(★★★★¼)
4. Kane & Hurricane vs Christian & Chris Jericho vs Jeff Hardy & Rob Van Dam vs The Dudleyz - Raw, 7 October 2002
(★★★★½)
3. The Shield vs Team Hell No & Ryback - TLC 2012
2. Edge & Christian vs The Dudleyz vs The Hardys - SummerSlam 2000
1. Chris Benoit & Chris Jericho vs Edge & Christian vs The Hardys vs The Dudleyz - Smackdown, 24 May 2001


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

No love for Punk/Hardy?!

Great list, though.


----------



## JustJoel (Aug 2, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Do you want pre-nWo stuff or during-nWo stuff?
> 
> Pre:
> 
> ...


WW3 96 is good. Rey/Ultimo is excellent, and Psicosis/Malenko very good. Jericho has a match v. Nick Patrick that's pretty funny. Fall Brawl 96 is good too (Steiners/Harlem Heat, Eddie/Jericho) as is GAB 98 (Jericho/Malenko, Kanyon/Saturn, and Chavo/Eddie). The problem, during 96-98, was that the first half of the shows are great, but the main events _consistently_ suck ass. If you only watch the first 3-4 matches, you'll think it was a pretty good show. DDP, Booker, and Scott make it better as time goes on, but the overall booking starts getting worse evening things out


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

Taker/Edge and Cena/Edge are both REALLY bad. I watched Punk/Miz/Del Rio recently and it absolutely destroys those matches. I don't remember that 4 way from TLC '10 but looking at who's involved it just doesn't seem like something I would like unless Mysterio tore it up. 

I wish Mick Foley was in a TLC match.


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

The Shield vs Hell No & Ryback should be number 1, imo. Never have I seen such quality story representation in a match heavily based on chaotic spots and overall reckless nature.


----------



## admiremyclone (Aug 7, 2007)

Just started Best Of MSG Blu-Ray and I love the old matches they included on here. In some cases, as was typical in the 1970s in the WWF, not a lot happens in each match but dammit the crowds go bezerk at every little thing each guy does. The crowds sound so loud!

Backlund/Patera Texas Death Match is fantastic.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

After purposely avoiding it for all these years, finally watched the Taker vs Bossman HIAC. It's as horrible as I've heard it was, probably enjoyed the Giant Gonzales match more.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah the Gonzalez match is definitely slightly better . HIAC is a complete and total DUD, Gonzalez match was 3/4* for me . Undertaker seemed to at least TRY in that match.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Ive given the Gonzalez match a 3/4* and the HIAC *. That one star is purely for the undertaker's attire/appearance and what happens after the match. Its fucking horrible. Taker gets beat down 75% of the match, when really if you want him looking strong as the leader of the ministry, he should just beat the fuck out of Bossman.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

About to start SVS 05

TRIPS/FLAIR LMS :mark:

hows the rest of the card?


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

I've been hearing so much shit about that Taker/Bossman HIAC for YEARS. I gotta check it out to see how bad it is. 

Oh and smitty, the 5 on 5 is just great. Orton :mark:


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

well I dig the ending :c


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Everyone, go watch Jericho vs Juventud at SuperBrawl 1998. That is all.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Might do a 2003 PPV Ramble today. They've all downloaded so I can choose something slightly less shitty to start with . Thinking of perhaps SummerSlam, what with Undertaker/A-Train, US Title 4 way, BROCK VS ANGLE and the Elimination Chamber (FUN).


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Might do a 2003 PPV Ramble today. They've all downloaded so I can choose something slightly less shitty to start with . Thinking of perhaps SummerSlam, what with Undertaker/A-Train, US Title 4 way, BROCK VS ANGLE and the Elimination Chamber (FUN).


Some reason, always thought you hated that EC. Also, totally forgot Taker/A-Train happened lol.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> No love for Punk/Hardy?!
> 
> Great list, though.


Find it kinda boring tbh. TLC matches are all about excitement and while it has a couple of great spots as well as a great ending (with Jeff desperately trying to reclaim his title after the huge swanton), it doesn't have the atmosphere and excitement I've come to expect. Watching all the TLC matches, I think the crowd was most dead for this one and they are partly to blame for why I can't really get into it. Still decent, just not one of the best to me like it is for many others.



Saint Dick said:


> Taker/Edge and Cena/Edge are both REALLY bad. I watched Punk/Miz/Del Rio recently and it absolutely destroys those matches. I don't remember that 4 way from TLC '10 but looking at who's involved it just doesn't seem like something I would like unless Mysterio tore it up.
> 
> I wish Mick Foley was in a TLC match.


Maybe the Taker match but I don't understand the hate for Cena/Edge. It held up pretty well on this rewatch, even better than the last time and I can't hate it no matter how much shit it gets in this thread. Everything clicks there, the atmosphere is great and so are the spots. I found the triple threat pretty run of the mill stuff and hell, the most memorable thing that happened involved a guy who wasn't even in the match.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Cena/Edge was insanely terrible and dull. DEM SETUPS


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Lesnar/Angle at Summerslam is my favorite of their series, that's the match I wish they had at WM 19. Vince coming in at the end and Angle still getting Lesnar to tap was pretty :mark: Plus, it set up that awesome atmosphere at the beginning of their IronMan a few months later when the crowd was shitting all over Brock with "YOU TAPPED OUT" chants,

Cal, being a guy that loves watching dudes just kill each other with stuff punches to the face, I'm assuming you've seen Vader vs Cactus Jack from WCW Saturday Night, right? It's the one where Vader doesn't wear his gloves and just tees off on Jack's nose and eye, at one point you can even hear Jacks nose break. It's best watching it unedited, since WCW didn't allow blood at the time, Mick had to create a real version by splicing original footage with his own private tape. Micks face is just destroyed by the time the match is over.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Cal, being a guy that loves watching dudes just kill each other with stuff punches to the face, I'm assuming you've seen Vader vs Cactus Jack from WCW Saturday Night, right? It's the one where Vader doesn't wear his gloves and just tees off on Jack's nose and eye, at one point you can even hear Jacks nose break. It's best watching it unedited, since WCW didn't allow blood at the time, Mick had to create a real version by splicing original footage with his own private tape. Micks face is just destroyed by the time the match is over.


Is that on a Foley DVD then? Havn't gotten round to watching Hardcore: Hits and Misses yet


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Of course I've seen it, along with all their other WCW matches. Honestly, I'm not THAT high on that particular one, I prefer a couple of others to it. Buggered if I can remember which is which and shit though lol.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Just looked at my top 100 WCW list and this is the Cactus/Vader match I like (and the only one I voted):

Vader Vs Cactus Jack - Main Event 07/03/1993


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Is that on a Foley DVD then? Havn't gotten round to watching Hardcore: Hits and Misses yet


Yep, that's the one. It's not the best match they had, but it's solid. It's just amazing to watch to see what Mick let Vader do to him. I mean if there was 1 guy in the world I would never ever want punching me as hard as he can in the face, it's Vader, and Mick lets him do it over, and over, and over. 

So yea, not the best in the world but entertaining for the sheer brutality.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So I'm taking a break from SVS 05 but heres a review preview

Flair/Trips LMS= my new MOTY


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Flair/HHH LMS is your current 05 MOTY? How many 05 matches you watched? Just that one?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Flair/HHH LMS is your current 05 MOTY? How many 05 matches you watched? Just that one?


Orton/Taker HIAC has yet to come, maybe that'll take over. 

CAGE > LMS for Flair/HHH


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

CAGE is like, UNIVERSES'S ahead of the LMS match. Not a fan at all of the LMS. Standard match at best. Their Raw 06 match is better than it. Might even prefer their Raw 03 match to it too.

A year with as many top level matches as 05 gave us, LMS being the best honestly makes ZERO sense to me. I can't understand how or why anyone could possibly put it above ANY of the Undertaker/Orton matches, the Cage match with the same people, MITB, HBK/Angle x2, the entire RR card, SVS elimination match, Vengeance HIAC + a ton of other stuff I cba to mention lol.

Just watching Shane Vs Bischoff from SS 03 now. Not looking forward to it tbh.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

My favourite match from 2005 was Angle/HBK from WM, followed by HBK/Angle from Vengeance

I have the Flair/HHH LMS match at ****1/4, a wild brawl they really beat the shit outta each other there, better than there TT match which was a ***3/4 for me, didn't impress me so much


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> CAGE is like, UNIVERSES'S ahead of the LMS match. Not a fan at all of the LMS. Standard match at best. Their Raw 06 match is better than it. Might even prefer their Raw 03 match to it too.
> 
> A year with as many top level matches as 05 gave us, LMS being the best honestly makes ZERO sense to me. I can't understand how or why anyone could possibly put it above ANY of the Undertaker/Orton matches, the Cage match with the same people, MITB, HBK/Angle x2, the entire RR card, SVS elimination match, Vengeance HIAC + a ton of other stuff I cba to mention lol.
> 
> Just watching Shane Vs Bischoff from SS 03 now. Not looking forward to it tbh.


Yeah, I would probably put that LMS in the top 20 at best. Even TV stuff excluded, it would likely land outside the top 10 with all the great stuff 2005 offered.

And the star of that Bischoff/Shane "match" is Coach. His JR imitation had me rolling. :lmao

"THAT'S A THLOBBERKNOCKER!" :lmao


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Orton/Taker HIAC has yet to come, maybe that'll take over.
> 
> CAGE > LMS for Flair/HHH



I'd have to agree, I felt the Cage was far and away the better match of the two...LMS was still GREAT but their cage match is probably my favorite WWE Cage match of all time, more so than Bret/Owen even. Flair's baby face performance and selling in that match gave me goosebumps.

As for MotY, I'm assuming you mean PPV match of the year, because we all know what the REAL MotY for 2005 was, and it took place on Smackdown in June between two of the greatest to ever do it.. My PPV MotY would either be Batista vs Trips Hell in a Cell or the Taboo Tuesday cage. Probably Hell in a Cell though.

I need to rewatch that Orton/Taker Cell match. Last time I watched it I was in a rush because the Giants game was about to come on. I remember thinking the beginning with Taker owning Orton was just amazing, but it felt like it dragged a bit at the end. That was probably due to me being in a rush so I feel it deserves my undivided attention for the 25-30 minutes or so it takes.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

HHH/Batista HIAC from Vengeance and Edge/Hardy Cage match from Unforgiven are my top two favorite matches from 2005.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Am I the only one who thinks that the Cage match was only a very good, but not brilliant old school Ric Flair match?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Srdjan99 said:


> Am I the only one who thinks that the Cage match was only a very good, but not brilliant old school Ric Flair match?



I'm sure there are others, but I don't understand how you could think that. That cage match was Flairs best match since 1993 at Starrcade with Vader I felt. It's everything you could possibly want in a cage match: brutality, storytelling, ring work, character work, selling, Flair GOATing it up doing his Nature Boy routine...it's all there.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

2005 was the year of cage matches. Elimination Chamber, Batista/HHH, Orton/Taker, Flair/HHH and Edge/Hardy - all ★★★★½+ matches.

The HHH/Flair cage is just amazing. I usually can't really get into Flair's old school, simplistic style but that match... it's something else. Electric crowd and Flair's babyface performance. The repeated lowblows :mark:


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Well I guess I might have to rewatch that match, but it didn't impress me last time I've seen it, their LMS one seemed better to me


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

OLD MAN FLAIR IN A CAGE automatically = GOAT.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

I have Flair/HHH at *****, I might rewatch it. Strange, every time I watch the match, it's around Christmas, heh.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> 2005 was the year of cage matches. Elimination Chamber, Batista/HHH, Orton/Taker, Flair/HHH and Edge/Hardy - all ★★★★½+ matches.



Wow I never thought about that, but you're right. They were all brilliant in completely different ways too. The biggest contrast to today's style can be found in those matches. All of those feuds were white hot by the time they got to the cage/cell, and all of them ended in a bloody massacre that told a story and drew the audience in. Nowadays we get Orton/Bryan Hell in a Cell even though Orton was booked so all his heat went to the Authority and Bryan got his balls chopped off after NoC. What a great world we live in.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Got 2 more Raw 04 matches uploading atm .

And about to watch the 4 way US title match from SS 03 :mark:. TALENT~!


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Wow I never thought about that, but you're right. They were all brilliant in completely different ways too. The biggest contrast to today's style can be found in those matches. All of those feuds were white hot by the time they got to the cage/cell, and all of them ended in a bloody massacre that told a story and drew the audience in. Nowadays we get Orton/Bryan Hell in a Cell even though Orton was booked so all his heat went to the Authority and Bryan got his balls chopped off after NoC. What a great world we live in.


It's no secret that since 2008 we haven't really had it that well with WWE. There's been great stuff for every year since but drop in quality and consistency is sad.

At least we still get plenty of quality matches even to this day so there's something to redeem the awful booking.



CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Got 2 more Raw 04 matches uploading atm .
> 
> And about to watch the 4 way US title match from SS 03 :mark:. TALENT~!


:mark:

Please tell me Coach was awesome!  Strange that I haven't watched that 4 way since I watched the show in full when going through 2003 about 16 months ago. Time to get on that!


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I guess I liked LMS more than others

Cage is #3 MOTY behind hiac and the LMS 

Edge/Matt is #4


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> I guess I liked LMS more than others
> 
> Cage is #3 MOTY behind hiac and the LMS
> 
> ...



Don't feel bad, Skins prefers the LMS as well, and Ric Flair himself said the LMS was his favorite. I don't agree with that but that's why they are called opinions . 

Are you only counting PPV matches in your MotY rankings or are you doing TV stuff as well?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> I guess I liked LMS more than others
> 
> Cage is #3 MOTY behind hiac and the LMS
> 
> ...


I'm a bit late to this party, but I also have the LMS higher than the cage match, but I've got a list of things to rewatch so the cage may go on it. Just watched the LMS last month or so so it's still fresh. 

Flair's repeated attack on the jewels :lol

Also, the MsOTY for me are EC, Batista/Trips, THEN probably Trips/Flair LMS. At least on PPV. Orton/Taker HIAC is right behind those.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> I guess I liked LMS more than others
> 
> Cage is #3 MOTY behind hiac and the LMS
> 
> ...


Made me remember that epic Edge/Matt match. Must be my fav. Matt Hardy singles match ever, ****1/2, pure awesomeness


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Edge/Hardy was awesome. Think it's in my top 5 of the year. Flair/HHH is great as well and I believe it makes my top 10. Their LMS match is fine, but I wouldn't put it past ***1/2 on last watch.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Shawn Michaels Vs Randy Orton - Raw June 7th 2004

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k5N1lLOTFzK0sc51fu3 (Private)


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Shawn Michaels Vs Randy Orton - Raw June 7th 2004
> 
> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k5N1lLOTFzK0sc51fu3 (Private)


Please tell me the elimination tag is next! :mark:

Damn, Orton's Evolution entrance is just so full of class and style!


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

In to the Flair/HHH argument, I do love the LMS over the Cage match. Flair's "just won't go down" performance touched me more than his Cage match one (though that one was superb as well), and HHH convinced me he WAS the face of evil with his mannerisms more than in the Cage match too. The pacing and ending may have not been as good as the Taboo Tuesday bloodbath, but what the fuck, I loved it more myself.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Choke2Death said:


> Please tell me the elimination tag is next! :mark:


Not quite. But the next match currently uploading IS a tag match . I still need to rip that elimination tag, gotta dig out my top 100 WWF/E matches comp to get it.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Trips/Flair Cage - *****3/4* imo. Love that thing. I haven't seen the LMS in forever though. 

Here's a 2005 match nobody seems to talk about, HBK/Angle 30 min Iron Man from Raw Homecoming. Last time I saw it I thought it shat all over their Mania match tbh. But I seem to be one of the few who isn't a huge fan of the Mania match. I haven't seen the Vengeance match in forever either so I can't rate it.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Not quite. But the next match currently uploading IS a tag match . I still need to rip that elimination tag, gotta dig out my top 100 WWF/E matches comp to get it.


Wasn't that the 8 man tag before Backlash that you needed to rip from the top 100 compilation? Really sucks that you can't rip the first Edge/Orton match, though.  (I don't know how it works but can you put up the full show as an alternative? It would be worth it because there's also the cage match between Y2J/Christian iirc)



SANTA GAME said:


> Here's a 2005 match nobody seems to talk about, HBK/Angle 30 min Iron Man from Raw Homecoming. Last time I saw it I thought it shat all over their Mania match tbh. But I seem to be one of the few who isn't a huge fan of the Mania match. I haven't seen the Vengeance match in forever either so I can't rate it.


Not a big fan of that match. Thought it was only good at best.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Can anyone recommend some good Main Event matches to watch for the top 10 (might end up being 15 with all the goodies I've got)? Starting Del Rio/Ziggler from 11/27. They also had a match in February. Fuck they wrestled each other a ton.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I got confused with big tag matches lol .

And the reason I can't rip the 8 man tag is that the disc is fucked and won't let me access all the files on it to rip anything. So I can't put the entire show on because it gets to the part of the disc that is scratched and won't let me go further. All I can do it watch it, not edit or fuck about with it .


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Edge & Chris Benoit Vs La Resistance - Raw May 31st 2004

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k3od9BiromV3ae51fUb (Private)


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I may be the only one here that prefers the LMS to the cage, my love for the LMS is immense, might as well be MOTY for 05


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Don't feel bad, Skins prefers the LMS as well, and Ric Flair himself said the LMS was his favorite. I don't agree with that but that's why they are called opinions .
> 
> Are you only counting PPV matches in your MotY rankings or are you doing TV stuff as well?


I'm only doing PPV matches, I assure yo if I was doing TV than the Eddie/rey match would be VERY near the top

In other news, just rewatched the Trips/tista HIAC, its still the MOTY, changed my mind once again


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Watching King of the Ring 1996 to get everything from Attitude era on.

Marc Mero/Steve Austin and Mankind/Undertaker best matches so far.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

DoubtGin said:


> Watching King of the Ring 1996 to get everything from Attitude era on.
> 
> Marc Mero/Steve Austin and *Mankind/Undertaker* best matches so far.


Hell yeah, that's where it's at


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

SANTA GAME said:


> Trips/Flair Cage - *****3/4* imo. Love that thing. I haven't seen the LMS in forever though.
> 
> Here's a 2005 match nobody seems to talk about, HBK/Angle 30 min Iron Man from Raw Homecoming. Last time I saw it I thought it shat all over their Mania match tbh. But I seem to be one of the few who isn't a huge fan of the Mania match. I haven't seen the Vengeance match in forever either so I can't rate it.


Yea I thought this was decent too (havent seen it in forever) and shat on all their others (never seen the vengeance match)



smitty915 said:


> I'm only doing PPV matches, I assure yo if I was doing TV than the Eddie/rey match would be VERY near the top
> 
> In other news, just rewatched the Trips/tista HIAC, its still the MOTY, changed my mind once again


NOOOOOOO ! dont cave into the pressure, thinking about it I might have flair/hhh LMS as MOTY, only mathces I can think of that POSSIBLY be better it is their cage, eddie/rey sd and hhh/batista HIAC and I enjoyed the LMS the most out of all those, so I guess it makes it MOTY

Not that big on taker/orton HIAC, too long and kinda drags, liked their mania but would have it anywhere close to those other matches, need to see edge/hardy CAGE


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Edge & Chris Benoit Vs La Resistance - Raw May 31st 2004
> 
> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k3od9BiromV3ae51fUb (Private)


THE BIGGEST MOMENT OF THE RESISTANCE!

They were so fucking over in their hometown. All four are Canadians and Resistance have the crowd firmly on their side.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Yea I thought this was decent too (havent seen it in forever) and shat on all their others (never seen the vengeance match)
> 
> 
> NOOOOOOO ! dont cave into the pressure, thinking about it I might have flair/hhh LMS as MOTY, only mathces I can think of that POSSIBLY be better it is their cage, eddie/rey sd and hhh/batista HIAC and I enjoyed the LMS the most out of all those, so I guess it makes it MOTY
> ...


You haven't seen HBK/Angle at Vengeance??? I could swore you were the one telling me it was better than Mania . I reccomend it, but then again I really dug Mania too even with the closing stretch/finish. The finish to Vengeance might be even sillier but it doesn't detract from the other 20+ minutes of awesome action.

Love for Mankind/Undertaker King of the Ring 1996 :mark:

For 1996, the only 2 matches I have over it are Mind Games and Austin/Bret Survivor Series. Talk about a story, that match is purely and simply wrestling bliss for me. Made me so happy to see the chemistry those two had right off the back. Plus the finish remains one of the biggest :mark: moments for me. Never in a million years did I see that one coming. Can someone tell me who else, if anyone, has gotten Taker to pass out in a submission so he can't answer the ref?


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Can we please discuss what the hell happened to Randy Orton? In Evolution he was so damn good but now he's like ugh. He used to have so much damn charisma. Then he just turned into "My name.......is Randy Orton"

I still can't forget the day I discovered this. 






Go to 1:10.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Taker/Mankind KOTR 96 has one of the greatest match endings of all-time. NOBODY expected it, even those who watch it for the first time now. Second best non-:hbk match of 96. Because goodness gracious, HBK was GOATing all throughout that year.

The last time I watched Michaels/Angle WM XXI, I felt so disappointed . Went on for WAY too long and I don't think either guy knew what they wanted to do in that match. It's been two years though. Hopefully I'll love it again.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

sharkboy22 said:


> Can we please discuss what the hell happened to Randy Orton? In Evolution he was so damn good but now he's like ugh. He used to have so much damn charisma. Then he just turned into "My name.......is Randy Orton"


His promos are better now. Not compared to Legend Killer Orton but compared to when he was a face and did the "My name" shtick. My problem with him is how he's regressed in the ring. He just lacks that something that made him special and instead decides to work extra slow. He's still capable of delivering quality matches now and then but it's nothing compared to 2004 when he had good matches weekly.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Lately Orton has shown us more things on the mic, but either he forgot how to properly deliver lines, or the WWE is not letting him change his voice inflection. I remember one promo on Smackdown where he said this hilarious line about how he was playing possum at SvS, but the way Orton delivered it made it sound so bad. It's still way better than unnatural face Orton. I like Orton in the ring and I really enjoyed his 2011 run as a face, but for some reason his matches now just seem to drag. He's among the best at crowd interaction, so many he can do more of that. For over 10 years, I've wanted to like Orton, but there's always something stopping me.

That La Resistance/Edge-Benoit match is really good.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So, not gonna finish SVS 05 today, but if someone gives me a match, I'll review it if I can find it on YT 

IDC about what kind of match it is


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> So, not gonna finish SVS 05 today, but if someone gives me a match, I'll review it if I can find it on YT
> 
> IDC about what kind of match it is



Goldust vs Roddy Piper @ WM 12. :agree:


I found myself late Friday night/early Saturday morning listening to wrestling themes and became drunk on Honky Tonk Man's theme. Got a huge itch to watch some matches, so I found one against Bret in '89 and his Mania III match against Jake Roberts.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

SpookshowTony said:


> Goldust vs Roddy Piper @ WM 12. :agree:


Okay, haven't seen that before


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Okay, haven't seen that before



That, my friend, is one hell of a fun and wacky brawl. Your eyes might try to leave your skull at the the end though.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

sharkboy22 said:


> Can we please discuss what the hell happened to Randy Orton? In Evolution he was so damn good but now he's like ugh. He used to have so much damn charisma. Then he just turned into "My name.......is Randy Orton"


 That interview with Grisham sums up the comparisons perfectly. That promo is better than all of promos that he has cut since turning into the Viper.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Always a favorite of mine. Some people (Cal ) don't like it though.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I like it just fine lol. Didn't give it a high rating but I like it .


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Always a favorite of mine. Some people (Cal ) don't like it though.



Big Cal has sticky Undertaker memorabilia. 


That match has stayed with me ever since it's original airing, so there's that historical (atleast to me) pleasure in watching that match over and over again.




Edit: Didn't see Cal's comment. Mine still stands though. :hayden2


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Goldust vs Roddy Piper- WM 12
*
Hmm this match should be pretty interesting to say the least, no idea why the hell I haven’t seen this before. So when they mean a backlot brawl apparently they mean actually in a backlot, okay :lol. Goldie comes out of a gold car and all of a sudden their “brawling”, which basically means brawling looking like an idiot :lmao. I have no idea what the fuck I am seeing here. This may easily be the strangest match of all time, and Vince and King acting like it’s a serious match is hilarious. They say things like “Goldust is having the match of his life here” and “this my friends, is amazing”:lol. They use every strange weapon possible from a picnic bench to a hood of a car to a fire hose :lmao. I know I’m using WAY to many lol smilies but everything that happens I’m dying of laughter with. 

So they hop in the car and apparently decide to head to the arena, damn and I thought WWE now felt staged, this is like the most fake shit I have ever seen in my entire life. Goldust and some chick arrive and wait! PIPER IS ON HIS FUCKING WAY! They are in the arena! Why? That is the million dollar question! Everyone in the crowd is confused as what the fuck they are watching while Vince and King are like: “THIS RIGHT HERE IS THE MATCH OF THE CENTURY!” because they are taking it serious s fuck. Goldust decides to act all gay and make some sexual advances on Piper, all while attempting to beat the fucking shit out of him. At one point he tries to kiss him, and I honestly started falling on the floor laughing :lmao. Thank god Goldust isn’t having the gay gimmick in his current run, although it was pretty funny :lol. Piper then starts to spank Goldust…and take off his pants? What in the actual fuck am I watching? Some weird shit right here. So Piper wins in the strangest 10 minute match I have ever seen. Not sure how you rate this thing. It was no wrestling match, but it was fucking hilarious. **1/2 ​


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

HEY! My Undertaker memorabilia isn't sticky. I make sure to clean it properly after every session 8*D.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> I like it just fine lol. Didn't give it a high rating but I like it .


  Good to hear it.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> HEY! My Undertaker memorabilia isn't sticky. I make sure to clean it properly after every session 8*D.



Fuckin' hell :lmao


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

OK getting back on SVS 05 now, not looking forward to Cena/Angle AT ALL


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Goldust/Piper is campy wrestling humor done right. Strange how such a match appeared at a Wrestlemania. Man has Wrestlemania grown in stature over the years. I'm saving WM 14 for after finals week, but the buildup outside of the main event feels like a regular PPV.

Do any of you guys know anything about the Squared Circle restaurant in Chicago? Thinking of going there to catch a RAW either tomorrow or next week.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Bret "Hitman" Hart vs Honky Tonk Man w/Jimmy Hart - Madison Square Garden (1/23/89)*

Double countout kind of hurts this one, but an early indicator of what Bret's later singles career would be makes this decent. HTM's control segments felt a little draining, but I thought he was in so-so to okay territory. *7.5/10*


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Goldust/Piper is campy wrestling humor done right. Strange how such a match appeared at a Wrestlemania. Man has Wrestlemania grown in stature over the years. I'm saving WM 14 for after finals week, but the buildup outside of the main event feels like a regular PPV.
> 
> Do any of you guys know anything about the Squared Circle restaurant in Chicago? Thinking of going there to catch a RAW either tomorrow or next week.


Haven't been myself, but check out these Yelp reviews

http://www.yelp.com/biz/the-squared-circle-chicago


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Hmmm...so apparently Chris Hero/Kassius Ohno will be at the restaurant tomorrow. Sounds like a done deal to me.

I honestly cannot remember ever seeing a good Honky Tonk match besides that Bret one.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I honestly cannot remember ever seeing a good Honky Tonk match besides that Bret one.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Jake "The Snake" Roberts w/Alice Cooper vs Honky Tonk Man w/Jimmy Hart - Wrestlemania III (3/29/87)*

Lots of punches were thrown, but I enjoyed it for what it was. *8/10*


Edit: Pretty sure he pissed people off for that to happened.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Did someone say Honky Tonk man


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Where can I find a proper version of Punk/Hardy cage match? I watched it when it aired, and that's about it. Thanks in advance.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Chismo said:


> Where can I find a proper version of Punk/Hardy cage match? I watched it when it aired, and that's about it. Thanks in advance.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

could anyone provide the tlc with benoit ? :lmao I went on wwe YT channel like an idiot thinking it was there


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Good quality and taken from The Ladder Match DVD.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


>


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

When did this become the YouTube request thread? GET OFF UR ARSES AND LOOK YASELF!!!


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

I have muscle doing dirty work for me.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

so took a pause, now finishing KotR 1996, last two matches left

Jake The Roberts vs Steve Austin will most likely be shit (but that promo after :mark, so I hope Michaels vs Bulldog will do.

Brian Pillman (RIP) was pretty annoying in both promos.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Survivor series 2005 review

Match #1: Booker T vs Chris Benoit*

Looking forward to this, because Benoit is able to carry booker to good matches. This starts out slow, but its still entertaining, and far from being even relatively boring. This is the beginning of the best of 7 series that would spill into 2006 and give us those amazing Orton matches. Well this sort of blew, it felt like the whole match was just one big headlock, which is not a good thing. Sometimes they would have a suplex, but I was bored for the majority of the match outside of a few bursts of energy. It is rare that I do not like a Benoit match, but this one was a resounding MEH. I can say that I like the heel work by Booker and the cheating to win. How was the rest of the matches in this series? I’ve seen one of the Orton matches but how about the other Booker/Benoit matches? Hopefully they were better than this. **1/2 

*CAL SCALE: 1 

Match #2: Melina vs Trish 
*
As much as I like both chicks, I WANT FUCKING Flair/Trips :mark:. NO

*CAL SCALE: -1 

Match #3: Ric Flair vs Triple H*

Aww yeah, I’m fucking pumped for this! Considering some say that this is the better Flair/Trips match, it might be the MOTY for sure. Trips has actually had one hell of a year, he has the current MOTY in the HIAC match, and the #2 MOTY with his cage match. If this is as good as some say, he might have the top 3 matches of the year, which is pretty fucking impressive. So the IC title isn’t on the line because trips wants to go over, and he obviously doesn’t want the IC title, so they make it a non-title match. Flair brings a Kendo stick into the match early on, which is pretty fucking awesome, and soon they are brawling in the arena. This is getting fucking bloody already, flairs hair is already red :lol. The screwdriver as a weapon is pretty fucking nasty, didn’t really need to see that my friend. Joey Styles was AMAZING on commentary during this match, he might be my favorite commentator ever, love that guy. So, I have decided that THIS is the best LMS match ever. A top 5 triple H and Ric Flair match of all time IMO, I don’t even care that Trips went over. ****3/4 

*CAL SCALE: 8

Match #4: Kurt Angle vs John Cena *

Oh no, not looking forward to this AT ALL. Their Unforgiven match sucked hard IMO. :lol at the crowd chanting you suck dick to Angle and them having to censor it, that got fucking annoying but whatever. Why the hell is Daivairi the referee? Whatever happened to Muhammad Hassan again? Oh yeah he got taken off TV because of DA MEDIA CONTROVERSY! This match just screams MEH all the way through and the energy just wasn’t there at all. This is basically the same exact match as their Unforgiven match, maybe a LITTLE better but not by much at all. This is just CENA DEFYING THE ODDS AGAIN! **1/2

*CAL SCALE: 1

Match #5: Eric Bischoff vs Teddy Long
*
:lmao NO

*CAL SCALE: -1

Match #6: Batista, JBL, Randy Orton, Rey Mysterio and Bobby Lashley (SD) vs Shawn Michaels, Carlito, Chris Masters, Big Show, and Kane (RAW)
*
This should be pretty fun, except Tazz is already being a fucking prick with how annoying he is during this. Did anyone really care about the brand rivalry? I mean, I guess it makes a little sense but there are better rivalries than RAW vs SD. I also believe that this was the final time a SVS tag match Main evented the show. I was SHOCKED to see that Lashley was the first guy gone, I thought he was being pushed as a monster? Does it make sense for him buried? Not really. This match was awesome but GOD FUCKING DAMN Tazz was being annoying. Why the fuck was he so angry over the match? But besides that this was awesome, and although I think Flair/trips was the better match, it deserved to Main event the PPV. I love these types of matches, and the only negative I can think of would be the horrible commentary by Tazz and King that nearly destroyed the match. The RKO ending was so :mark: though. ****

DAT TAKER RETURN :mark: 

*CAL SCALE: 5

FINAL CAL SCALE: 13 

CURRENT PPV MOTY: Batista vs Triple H

Current 2005 PPV rankings

1: Summerslam (24) 
2: Vengeance (21) 
3: WrestleMania 21(19)
4: Royal Rumble (17)
5: Taboo Tuesday (17)
6: Judgment day (17) 
7: ECW ONS (16) 
8: Unforgiven (14.5)
9: Backlash (13.5)
10: Survivor Series (13)
11: No mercy (11)
12: New Year’s Revolution (9.5)
13: The bash (6.5)
14: No way out (4.5)
*​


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

DoubtGin said:


> so I hope Michaels vs Bulldog will do.


Hope? :| Its a fucking classic IMO. Love it. Bulldog power =


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Tazz during the SVS 2005 tag was annoying as fuck. He didn't shut up the whole time and came off as a butt hurt bitch, in kayfabe. I did enjoy the ending of that match, but the rest of it just didn't click for me.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*The Rockers vs The Orient Express - Wrestlemania VI (4/1/90) 7.5/10*
*The Rockers vs The Orient Express - Royal Rumble (1/19/91) 10/10*


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Hope? :| Its a fucking classic IMO. Love it. Bulldog power =


Just finished the PPV, yeah I agree, great match. MOTN, imo. Both wrestlers sold the moves so well. Did Bulldog screw up the jump or was it intentionally?

I also didn't get what Mr. Perfect was trying to do in the end. Also not too big on the post-match scenes with everyone jumping in.

"International Incident" is up next. Matchcard looks filled with huge filler to me.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

International Incident main event is :mark:. Doesn't get mentioned nearly enough.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> International Incident main event is :mark:. Doesn't get mentioned nearly enough.


Is the tag match the main event?

Oh god I still can't get over this gimmick of Billy Gunn.

Btw, in some thread (don't remember which one), someone (don't remember who) wrote something about "X-Pac heat". Was he really that hated back then? If yes, why? I


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Big Boss Man vs Nailz in a Nightstick on a Pole - Survivor Series (11/25/92) 3/10*

Best thing I got out of this match


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So, I was watching the go home episode of RAW before the RR in 2004, and I found an interesting gem

Randy Orton vs the hurricane RAW 1/19/04

http://facedl.com/fvideo.php?f=eqqxauiwwneqa&randy-orton-vs-the-hurricane-2004 (ads NSFW)

Really fun match TBH, would check it out


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Need to check that out. Don't remember it at all, I just remember Orton was in a battle royal for the #30 spot with Goldberg (duh) and a few others.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

That whole episode was fun, the battle royal was awesome and so was Goldberg vs test vs Steiner


----------



## BKKsoulcity (Apr 29, 2011)

Rewatched the triple threat match at Backlash between Benoit/HHH/HBK and completely forgot about that teased screwjob spot they did with Hebner running to the ring. I laughed for a good 5 minutes afterwards.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

I'm looking for some really good matches involving underneath fighters. Any recommendations?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Watching that La Resistance/Benoit & Edge tag that Cal uploaded earlier today and now in the middle of it. :lmao @ the commentary. Lawler asked JR if he knows who Canada's prime minister is and JR said "No, I don't". :lmao Gotta be embarrassing to randomly get this "obvious" question asked and be clueless about it, lol.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Did you watch the Orton/hurricane match? It sounds bad but its actually pretty fun


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yes, I did. A fun sub-5 minute match, loved the jump Orton did when receiving the crossbody near the end. Another solid Orton tv match pre-WM is one with Val Venis from 24/2/04.

I need to see if he has any hidden gems on Heat around that time period because his TV matches were enjoyable when he was in Evolution.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Holy shit, that Orton/Hurricane match was :mark: DAT FINISH. RKO OUTTA NOWHERE.

And just in case anyone missed it on the previous page, any good matches involving underneath babyfaces?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Sting/Vader series
Mysterio/Henry
Most Punk/Bryan matches against monsters these past couple years
Orton/Henry NoC
Malenko/Bret Nitro
Bret/Bigelow KOTR 94
Undertaker/Big Show Cyber Sunday 08
Cena/Umaga NYR 07


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

The Sting/Vader match from Slamboree 94 is real nice ****1/4. I need to rewatch my Greatest Stars of the 90s set, only 2-3 bad matches on there, but first I'll rewatch the Raw 15th anniversary set. So much goodness:lenny (Flair/Perfect, 123 Kid/Bret, HBK,Benjamin etc)


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/rants/1048601-fuck-storytelling.html

Interesting mindset. 

Anyways, Shield vs HellNo/Kofi :mark: Ambrose cuts a pretty nice promo before hand. When he lists the people the Shield have taken out. "And now the Deadman's restin in peace, you'll never see him again." :lol Ambrose proved in this promo that he is by far the superior talker, not like we didn't already know that. Really good match, but the ending is kind of meh, compared to many of their other matches. Ambrose did really well in this match, probably stood out the most to me. Reigns has improved the most probably, of the three. 

Shield vs HellNo/Taker :mark: :mark: That fucking London crowd :mark: This match starts up really nicely with a great pace. The Ambrose/Taker interactions were really fun early on. Rollins bumped around a good bit in this match. Rollins talking shit to Taker and Taker doing the throat slash and dat facial :mark: I just love this match so much more than the tag with Kofi. Granted there's more isolation in the Kofi match and a bit more dissection, but the action in this match just does it for me.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> International Incident main event is :mark:. Doesn't get mentioned nearly enough.


Didn't make the Best Of IYH Set........i don't think 

Should have done though of course.


----------



## BKKsoulcity (Apr 29, 2011)

Finished up the World Class Championship Wrestling documentary about the Von Erich's and wow that is possibly the best DVD WWE has ever released.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

*NOTORIOUSTCG's REVIEW OF THE STREAK*
PART 2

*6 – 0 
Wrestlemania XIII vs. Psycho Sid*

Shawn on commentary, why? I don’t know. A 4 man booth though. Undertaker no selling Sid’s entrance just standing there during it, was great. Reminded that Shawn was injured, as Bret Hart comes out to the ring. Geeze as much as I like Bret, Shawn and Taker this is a clusterfuck. Was Sid a face as well or did they just hate Bret that much? Undertaker’s flip over the rope landing on his feet is GOAT. The French announce table? We find out this is a no disqualification match after Sid puts Taker through a table, instead of before the match. For some reason the referee was doing a count after both men got hit my the others big boot, which I didn’t think mattered in a no DQ match, and then Sid pinned Taker after 9. If he waited one more second he would of won, so why break the count. Tope rope clothesline by Taker is pretty neat. Sid reverses the Tombstone which I something I didn’t remember, but is a good moment. Then Hart comes out and attacks Sid, like I said clusterfuck. JR can’t believe someone kicked out of a chokeslam, really? Bret interrupts again which leads to the Tombstone and Sid shitting himself. Why was the Bret interruption included? Really ruins the match for me. Taker with the belt though is awesome. Although not as good as the Diesel match it still would have been a *** to ***1/2 match, but due to the Bret interference it’s lowered. 

*Rating: **1/2
Cal Scale: 1

7 – 0
Wrestlemania XIV vs. Kane*

The GOAT entrance, lightening, fire and druids what more could you want. Love the rumbling thunder playing over his theme as well. Just perfect. The build up to this match is phenomenal, the time span and the way it played out was simply amazing, it really is the GOAT storyline, nothing compares to it. They are both in their best attires as well. Bearer at ringside shouting is great, and Taker covering up from his brother’s blows really sells them. Kane lifts Taker’s shoulders off the mat after a chokeslam, heeling it up. There are a few minor botches but these two sell them well think quickly on their feet. That dive over the ropes through the table is vicious and would have had to really hurt Taker. Taker kicks out of Kane’s tombstone and the crowd erupt. Kane sits up, but straight into the first tombstone. Kickout, then another sit up. Second tombstone, another kick out and a sit up. Top rope clothesline and then a sit up into the third and final Tombstone, as Kane kicks out a half second too late. Bearer and Kane attack Taker after the match which ends with a vicious tombstone on a chair. Taker sits up! And walks out after Kane and Bearer. I love this match and it is as good as I remember it, the rating might be high but it deserves to be, wish I watched it live at the time though, would have been awesome.

*Rating: ****1/2
Cal scale: 7

8 – 0
Wrestlemania XV vs. The Big Boss Man*

This is the only Taker match I haven’t seen and that’s because I have purposely avoided it, as I am yet to hear anything positive about it, ever. Who was supposed to be the Heel and Face in this match? Taker truly look satanic, one of his best ever looks. Did anyone really think that the Boss Man, the corporation’s hench man to beat the leader of the ministry. YOU CAN GET A FINGER CAUGHT IN THERE. No one in the crowd cares about this match, there even is a boring chant going around the arena. This is bad. Bad build up to the Tombstone. They don’t have the hanging scene on the DVD, and that’s the best thing of the whole match. Honestly would have preferred Taker just destroying Boss Man for 9 minutes instead of that 9 minutes I just watched. Atleast that would of made Taker look strong. It’s every bit as bad as what you could imagine. It's getting * star only because of Taker's look and the hanging, as well as Cole's greatest moment on commentary, otherwise would have been a complete dud 1/4*.

*Rating: * 
Cal Scale: 0

9 – 0 
Wrestlemania XVII vs. Triple H*

The live theme by Motorhead is good, but I’m personally not a big fan of the heels having the live themes, same with CM Punk this year, it’s like ‘Hey I’m a bad guy, but look, here are my friends Motorhead.’ I guess this is the first of the Taker vs. Trips trilogy, even though we aren’t supposed to remember this match. The Spanish announce table just collapses when HHH just sits on it. Taker misses the jumping elbow drop, I swear Taker’s jumping elbow drop rarely ever hits. Undertaker attacks the referee, why? Because he can. This should of just been a no DQ match, would have made more sense than the long ref bump, in fact I'll time how long the ref is down. Taker’s punches and HHH’s selling looks great when they are fighting on the structure. Giant chokeslam… except it’s onto a mattress which they don’t even try to hide, as when Taker jumps on it, he bounces. Taker with the tombstone, but the ref is still down, as we pass the 10 minute mark of his nap. The ref finally wakes up after 10:55, I kid you not 10 minutes and 55 seconds being down after a kick and an elbow drop. Taker kicks out of the sledgehammer shot and then nails the last ride for the win. Good match, I feel it’s the weakest one of the three though.

*Rating: ***3/4
Cal Scale: 4

10 – 0
Wrestlemania XVIII vs. Ric Flair*

I’m real excited to watch this again, Flair is great, might even watch his matches against HHH from 2005 that you guys have been talking about again, I remember loving them. Did Taker and Flair ever have a match when Taker was the deadman? Flair attacking Taker like a madman at the start is classic. They redo the corner spot, but cover the botch up perfectly. Flair is the GOAT at blading. Those chops by Flair, wow. Taker heeling it up by lifting Flair’s shoulders up. Taker missed the jumping elbow again, it may as well be Flair from the top rope. Lead Pipe shot by Flair, busts Taker open. Figure Four is applied with no lead up work on the leg, which is kind of annoying, considering you could have had Flair attack Taker’s legs which would have added to the story. The GOAT reversal of the Figure Four though. Taker attacks little Naitch, why? Because he can, just like last year. SPINEBUSTER BY DOUBLE A! Kickout, followed by Taker beating the shit out of AA. Flair botches the Last Ride, but like the professionals they are cover it up by hitting a Tombstone for the win. Again Little Naitch gets knocked out after the match which made me laugh. Fun match, really enjoyed it. 

*Rating: ****
Cal Scale: 5 
*
*Matches in order from Best to Worst:* (Cal Scale)
vs. Kane @ Wrestlemania XIV (7)
vs. Ric Flair @ Wrestlemania XVIII (5)
vs. Triple H @ Wrestlemania XVII (4)
vs. Diesel @ Wrestlemania XII (3)
vs. Psycho Side @ Wrestlemania XIII (1)
vs. Jake Roberts @ Wrestlemania VIII (0.5)
vs. Jimmy Snuka @ Wrestlemania VII (0.5)
vs. The Big Boss Man @ Wrestlemania XV (0)
vs. King King Bundy @ Wrestlemania XI (0)
vs. Giant Gonzales @ Wrestlemania IX (0)

​


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Always wondered about that finish, Flair 'sandbagged'?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Don't think Flair sandbagged, like with the corner spot at the start of the match he just wasn't quite ON all the time when he first got to WWE. Took him a while to get back into the swing of things it seemed lol.

And NotoriousTCG, Undertaker and Flair did indeed wrestle when Undertaker was the Dead Man, back in 1992. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TcmNTXe3HMU


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

What i thought really Cal, Flair just wasn't 100% ready and maybe a bit 'rusty'. Still really love that match, ****1/4 on my last watch


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

In Flairs book he talks about that match. He says he screwed up but that Taker was a total pro and led him through it. He said after that first turnbuckle spot missed, Taker grabbed him and whispered into his ear "ready to try it again, kid?" And Flair responded "Fuck it, let's do it". Was that Flairs first really good/great match since returning to WWE? I think it was....leave it to Mean Mark to get Naitch back into form.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Flair wasn't "in it" until Jericho reminded him of who he is. He lost so much confidence that he didn't believe they would actually have him beat Jericho by submission at SummerSlam.

Need to rewatch that Taker match from WM because it's been a long time. It's one of my first memories of wrestling ever when my uncle brought over a DVD and that match was on it (it was back in 02 so the match was new at the time).

Yesterday I also watched CAL's version of the Benoit/HBK title match on Raw and noticed one thing: the changed camera angles. When Shawn's tights come off a bit, they changed the angle to cover it up and when Benoit bleeds, they keep the camera away from showing his face until the match nears its end. Not a big deal as match itself is still a classic!


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

On Taker/Flair, off the top of my head, I'd call it Flair's best singles match from 2002-2008, period. Awesome match, loved how they covered up the hotbed last ride attempt and turned it into a tombstone. Awesome match all around and the build up was awesome as well. Video package is great.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

There are different versions of HBK/Benoit? Was it released on DVD?


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

I just thought I should let the Americans in this thread know that FYE currently has all new WWE DVDs buy one get one free. The pricing there appears to be totally random (Summerslam 2009 $25 new and Summerslam 2010 for $7) but they had a decent selection of of events from the last few years for and a few older compilations for $7. I actually found Volume 3 of the Summerslam Anthology (98-02) for $10 and the Undertaker's newest set for $10. So I got them both for $10.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Never a big fan of the Flair/Taker WM match,. Can't give it more than ***1/2, it was a fun brawl, a good old school match with the addition of blood and all that shit. Good babyface performance of Flair, he really took a beating and it was nice to see Taker as a heel at Mania. Also Anderson's interference was pretty sweet


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> There are different versions of HBK/Benoit? Was it released on DVD?


Sadly no. It's just different versions for each channel. To see the difference, here is it:

16:53 on this video for Spike TV
17:53 on here which is your video

Didn't even notice until JR was talking about Benoit bleeding and the second video barely shows anything whereas I remembered a close up on his face on previous watches.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> In Flairs book he talks about that match. He says he screwed up but that Taker was a total pro and led him through it. He said after that first turnbuckle spot missed, Taker grabbed him and whispered into his ear "ready to try it again, kid?" And Flair responded "Fuck it, let's do it". Was that Flairs first really good/great match since returning to WWE? I think it was....leave it to Mean Mark to get Naitch back into form.


Thanks for that mate, always nice to hear it from the horse's mouth 



Merry Fitzmas To All said:


> (Summerslam 2009 $25 new Volume 3 of the Summerslam Anthology (98-02) for $10


That's some confused pricing structure there


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

FYE always has no idea what they are doing :lmao

Which is funny because their branded as "the expert movie store":lol


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

http://www.wrestlingdvdnews.com/two-more-wwe-dvds-deleted-update/55929/

Just read that these two DVD's are going Out Of Print (US):

WWE: New Year’s Revolution (651191557110)
WWE: Tombstone: History Of The Undertaker (651191938872)

So you yanks get them now (although you should have them, esp Taker).


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

GOAT talk ? I'm in

Yea I liked flair/taker thought it was good, only prob was it kinda dragged toward the end , but then DOUBLE A :mark: rejuvenated the match, really like that match vs Jericho at summerslam as well


I know I'm late to the party but whatevs, so after that storytelling/angle thread in rants, I decided to go watch angle/scsa ss 01 again to even see if angle ever was a good wrestling. :banderas best choice Ive made in the past week, and a new member of my ***** club


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Oh, Angle bashing again eh? Arrrggghhh.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

If they leave Tombstone on Netflix, it's no big deal. Kind of wish they'd add more match sets to Netflix. Docs are cool, but more matches would rock.

Flair/Taker is still great for me. Double A showing up :mark:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Nice, just bought that NYR 2005 DVD 

won't be able to start Armageddon 05 till Wednesday BTW


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Choke2Death said:


> Sadly no. It's just different versions for each channel. To see the difference, here is it:
> 
> 16:53 on this video for Spike TV
> 17:53 on here which is your video
> ...


Ahhh I see. Back in 2004 Raw wasn't airing live for us yet in the UK (I don't think... when DID we start getting it live lol?), instead we got it Friday nights, so some editing likely occurred.



RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> GOAT talk ? I'm in
> 
> Yea I liked flair/taker thought it was good, only prob was it kinda dragged toward the end , but then DOUBLE A :mark: rejuvenated the match, really like that match vs Jericho at summerslam as well
> 
> ...


:mark: I added Angle/Austin to my ***** list when I watched the show recently.

As for that thread in rants, so far I've only posted pointless joke-y nonsense which doesn't really have anything to do with the actual thread. I avoid shit like that now . Hell I avoided it when the guy was in here posting about it too. I just don't have time for that crap. A few years ago... fuck me I would have torn into the moron, especially when my ANGLE HATE was super high. But now? I just don't care enough to bother .

Need to finish SummerSlam 03 off. Angle/Lesnar is next, but I got shits to do before I can get back to that. Hope it holds up on this watch, it held up awesomely last time I saw it. 

So I noticed Tombstone and NYR 05 are going OOP in the US. Both are the same over here now thanks to WWE and Fremantle. I have both so I don't care. But everyone should pick up TOMBSTONE because it's one of the best sets ever released. Up there with the Ultimate Ric Flair Collection and Biggest Little Man Rey Mysterio set.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Thanks for that mate, always nice to hear it from the horse's mouth
> 
> 
> 
> That's some confused pricing structure there





smitty915 said:


> FYE always has no idea what they are doing :lmao
> 
> Which is funny because their branded as "the expert movie store":lol


Their pricing is comically bad sometimes. I swear they just randomly assign prices to their DVDs sometimes.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Ahhh I see. Back in 2004 Raw wasn't airing live for us yet in the UK (I don't think... when DID we start getting it live lol?), instead we got it Friday nights, so some editing likely occurred.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hate to derail this thread with that stuff, but did you see my posts in there ? he started that thread mainly because of us in here :lmao

Hopefully they dont take Tombestone : Hist of Taker off of netlflix


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Finished International Incident;

Liked Mera / Austin (AGAIN) and the main event, rest was pretty dull imo.

Summerslam 1996 next.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Thoughts on the choices for episodes on the 20th anniversary DVD?


----------



## OML (Feb 14, 2009)

Yea has anyone gotten the Raw 20 dvd really wanna pick this up for christmas it looks great


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Just watched the two main matches from TLC 2012. 

Ryback/Hell no vs The Shield. ****1/4
Cena/Ziggler ***1/2

Boy, the tlc was just fantastic. Easily the best match Ryback has been apart of. Not even close. EVERYONE worked very well in the match. Definitely one of the MOTY for 2012.

Cena/Ziggler was fun. :lmao at Cena trying the hurincanrada. Another good selljob by Ziegler, with great atmosphere. Still can't believe how far Ziggler has fallen from Just a year ago. He was so fucking over smh.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Hate to derail this thread with that stuff, but did you see my posts in there ? he started that thread mainly because of us in here :lmao
> 
> Hopefully they dont take Tombestone : Hist of Taker off of netlflix



I need to find that thread, I'm curious about what everyone says of Angle.

On last watch, Austin/Angle went from just a ***** match to a top 6 match in WWE History. It is seriously the perfect match, Austin is just a complete psychopath and Angles baby face performance is one of the best I've ever seen. I think this match was both Austin and Angles career performance. Yes, WM 13 was technically a better match for Austin, but I think Austin was just BETTER from a character stand point at SS01'. Plus, who else got MAJOR goosebumps when Angle catches Austin on the outside of the ring near the barricade in the ankle lock and let's out that "WHOOOOOO" :mark: :mark: Thats one of my favorite moments in any WWE match ever.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Anyone excited for DA SLAMMYS? 

Hope I get to watch it, have a paper to write, but multitasking can solve that :lol


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> I need to find that thread, I'm curious about what everyone says of Angle.


That he's shit. :kurt



smitty915 said:


> Anyone excited for DA SLAMMYS?
> 
> Hope I get to watch it, have a paper to write, but multitasking can solve that :lol


I also have a huge paper to write, and I'm telling myself atm that I'll focus on just that, which means I'll end up watching anyways.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

sharkboy22 said:


> And just in case anyone missed it on the previous page, any good matches involving underneath babyfaces?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2WvfCLjbXY



RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> he started that thread mainly because of us in here :lmao


Yeah, that's the least surprising thing ever. I don't give a shit what you like in wrestling, just don't tell me I'm wrong and back it up with the shittiest arguments on planet earth (not to me directly but he was essentially saying the opposite of what I would have). "I think Kurt Angle is GOAT". All right, I don't but yknow...whatever. "I think Kurt Angle is GOAT because I don't care about 'psychology' or 'story' or any of that". OK, I couldn't disagree more and we have tastes in wrestling on opposite sides of the universe, but you can like what you like. "Fuck you Kurt Angle is GOAT - like him, stop caring about 'storytelling' nonsense and appreciate his moves". I don't think so. 

Most of the people I get along with online have different tastes than I do and hate things that I love and vice-versa. I can still talk to them because they either don't say random BS to prove their 'point', or aren't guys who think I should 'just sit back and enjoy it' (that one's my favourite...do they think I'm watching wrestling with pen and paper?) or 'not over-think it' or whatever else. I get along with people who hate what I love and love what I hate. Except Seabs. He may be not post random BS or say I should just sit back and enjoy or say I should stop over-thinking, but I didn't list 'putrid excuse for a creature' in the post above. MICHAELS/HELMSLEY BEING #1 TLC BEING #2 LMAOLMAOLMAO *WARNING WARNING SHITTY TASTE IN THE HOUSE*


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

SEAB'SE'S' CAN DIE IN HELL.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Eddie Gilbert :mark:
Curt Hennig before he was perfection :lenny
ROMAN REIGNS SR. :homer


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Shitty arguments are so annoying. Specially when somebody takes the time to explain their point and the comeback is a simplistic "I'm right". It's one thing to disagree, it's another to try forcing it. 1993 hates Angle/Benoit cage match and I love it, but it's alright because we both realize MUHAMMAD HASSAN is a once in a lifetime talent and stepping in the ring with him is the greatest honor for any wrestler. 

Finished watching the Flair/Taker match and it was full of lol's. I was 8 when I saw it 11 years ago and I remember finding it hard to watch because Taker absolutely murdered the bloody Flair and I felt bad for him, lol. Watching it now, it's completely different and Lawler/JR just can't stop bringing it on commentary. :lol


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Lawler's greatest moment on commentary for me will always be that time where he pretends to not know who Verne Gagne was during the second greatest triple threat match of all-time :lmao

Somebody on Youtube just uploaded a match between CHRIST BENOIT AND TERRY FUNK. :mark: Has anyone seen it before?


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Just read that thread in RANTS. lol at this gif


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah that rant was pretty :lmao

I'm happy that my initial burying of the shitty Cena/Edge LMS match might have been the birth of that


----------



## 189558 (Aug 18, 2009)

OML said:


> Yea has anyone gotten the Raw 20 dvd really wanna pick this up for christmas it looks great


I got a copy. I pre-ordered one from Amazon and received it by Friday. So far I'm liking it for the most part. The edits (which I'll explain in a second) are a bit disappointing considering the set is advertised as "Uncut & Unedited". The edits I've noticed thus far (keep in mind I've only watched up to the 2003 Raw Roulette episode) are:

-In one of the 1999 episodes a sign is blurred in the crowd. Considering it's been since the original air date that I've watched any '99 episodes (besides Raw Is Owen). I can't remember if it was blurred or not originally, but I doubt it was. So I'm counting that as an edit.

-According to WrestlingDVDNews the Mankind/Rock match on the January 4th episode where Rock chokes Mankind with a cable is cut out. Once again it's been so long since I've seen the match when it originally aired that I didn't really notice.

-According to WrestlingDVDNews again. Themes edited are Undertaker, Shane McMahon (I'll go into more detail later down for these two), the bWo, The Godwinns and Cactus Jack. Most theme edits don't really bother me and I didn't really notice them.

-Any advertisements on the episodes are blacked out with a RAW logo covering it.

-Besides being in two matches in the entire set Chris Benoit is Voldemort as usual. His entrance is cut, commentary remarks are cut (which makes Jim Ross's commentary seem awkward at times with it going in dead silence) and the Benoit/Angle skit at the beginning of the 2001 episode is cut out altogether.

-Undertaker's "Rollin" entrance theme is cut out and replaced by a generic theme, that you can barely hear over the revving of his motorcycle. You get the beginning beat and the "Dead Man Walking" intro followed by the generic theme.

-The Shane McMahon theme edit happened in either an 1998 or 1999 episode. He comes out to "Here Comes The Money". Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but I didn't think he came out to the theme until he "purchased" WCW in 2001.

-In the 1999 episode before WrestleMania. I noticed the WWF logo blurred on the right side of Mr Ass and on the interviewers shirt. When the New Age Outlaws were being interviewed before their Title vs Title match.

I've also heard that in parts the crowd is muted, but I can't vouch for that one. As I didn't really notice. So those are the edits I've noticed and credit to WrestlingDVDNews for two of the edit information. While I'd say that's a fair share of edits for the set. I'm still liking it. I like having actual DVDs in my collection over downloads. So that's a big reason I picked it up. So if the edits I listed above don't really bother you. Hit Amazon or your local retailer and getcha a copy.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2WvfCLjbXY
> 
> Yeah, that's the least surprising thing ever. I don't give a shit what you like in wrestling, just don't tell me I'm wrong and back it up with the shittiest arguments on planet earth (not to me directly but he was essentially saying the opposite of what I would have). "I think Kurt Angle is GOAT". All right, I don't but yknow...whatever. "I think Kurt Angle is GOAT because I don't care about 'psychology' or 'story' or any of that". OK, I couldn't disagree more and we have tastes in wrestling on opposite sides of the universe, but you can like what you like. "Fuck you Kurt Angle is GOAT - like him, stop caring about 'storytelling' nonsense and appreciate his moves". I don't think so.
> 
> Most of the people I get along with online have different tastes than I do and hate things that I love and vice-versa. I can still talk to them because they either don't say random BS to prove their 'point', or aren't guys who think I should 'just sit back and enjoy it' (that one's my favourite...do they think I'm watching wrestling with pen and paper?) or 'not over-think it' or whatever else. I get along with people who hate what I love and love what I hate. Except Seabs. He may be not post random BS or say I should just sit back and enjoy or say I should stop over-thinking, but I didn't list 'putrid excuse for a creature' in the post above. MICHAELS/HELMSLEY BEING #1 TLC BEING #2 LMAOLMAOLMAO *WARNING WARNING SHITTY TASTE IN THE HOUSE*


Agree, what rubbed me the wrong way was he claimed "Kurt Angle is a God fuck you" and "storytelling doesnt mean shit, so that my reasoning for me claim" and wont listen to any of hte responses (The serious ones, the gif I posted is prob the GOAT angle gif :lmao) and just countered with the shittiest arguments

I have to be honest, in a odd or maybe not odd, most of the stuff you like, I end up liking aswell


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Those commentary edits are disappointing. Especially if you're throwing an 'uncut and unedited' moniker on it.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

WWE False Advertising? I REFUSE TO BELIEVE!


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

Yeah1993 said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2WvfCLjbXY
> 
> 
> 
> ...


When I watch DVDs I usually have my media player take up 3/4 of the screen and open a note pad on the side so I can write my review while watching and during entrances and stuff. Sometimes I pause it after a match that I have a lot to say but you could say that I actually watch wrestling with a pen and paper. 


Speaking of the arguement made in rants I kind of get it. I think of matches like movies for the most part. There are action movies with no action and a bunch of shooting, killing, and explosions. I enjoy them from time to time. Same goes for total spotfests in wrestling. I can enjoy, sometimes love them. But the argument in rants is like saying "Action movies are the best because they have the most shooting, explosions, and killings." And that is something that I can't agree with at all. Sure I can sit back and enjoy a movie like "300" where they just fight the whole time and kill like a million people. But I would never say that 300 is better than a movie like Braveheart or Gladiator (famous movies with a lot of killing that come to mind). Based on the rants argument 300 is a better movie because they kill more people. Caring about the main character and even the minor ones doesn't matter because they could have been killing more people. 


Anyway here's what I've been doing for the last few hours:



Summerslam 1998

I picked up a volume of the Summerslam Anthology today and I figured I would start with the earliest event. I actually ordered this when I was a kid and still have the old VHS tape in my house somewhere. So it should be fun to give it a rewatch. 


Well right off the bat I see that they don't have the rights to "Highway to Hell" anymore as the opening shot just has some generic music. 


_European Championship:_
*Val Venis vs D-Lo Brown(c)*

D-Lo comes into the match wearing a chest protector that basically makes it impossible to hit him in the chest and did extra damage when he used for offense. They get that point across very early in the match as D-Lo uses it for a lot of his offense. Val hit the chest protector early and it hurt his arm and I was impressed to see that he avoided targeting the chest of D-Lo for the rest of the match. You could even see him make some small adjustments during the match (like going for a headbutt instead of a splash when D-Lo was one the the ground). D-Lo moved away from using his chest protector after he established what it could do which I was fine with because he stopped using his chest protector as a weapon and did more interesting things on offense instead. 

I was surprised how much time this got, over 15 minutes. The ending left a bad taste in my mouth, there was an ugly power bomb from D-Lo where he dropped Val on his head. Even with those flaws the finishing stretch was great as it had some real suspense and the chest protector was always a factor. I just wish this had a better ending. 
*****


*Kai en Tai w/Yamaguchi Son vs The Oddoties w/Luna and the ICP*

It's shocking how much more talented one team was then the other. This was a total squash as the Oddoties got in just about 100% of the offense. If it wasn't some really talented wrestlers that were getting embarrassed here I think I might find it amusing. Golga (who when I googled him turned out to be John Tenta) was the only one that let Kai en Tai get in any offense. I actually have to give him some credit as he was a lot smaller then what he used to be and he moved around the ring pretty well, much better then in some of his previous gimmicks. However the other giants didn't really let Kai en Tai get anything. WAY too long and borderline offensive for a wrestling fan that knows his stuff. The only credit this match gets is for Kai en Tai throwing themselves around like crazy and Tenta doing a solid job when he was in the ring. 
*1/2**


Also the ICP gave an incredibly shitty performance before the match. 


_Hair vs. Hair:_
*Jeff Jarrett vs. X-Pac w/Howard Finkle * 

I'm a bigger fan of Jarrett than most I believe and I'm also a pretty big fan X-Pac when he's playing a face and an underdog. The match was't anything amazing but it was very solid. Jarrett controls a good portion of the match and there some good false comebacks from from X-Pac. 
***1/2* 

*
Marc Mero and Jaqueline vs. Sable and Edge *

As far as I know Mero is only capable of having good matches with DDP. I wasn't really a fan of the match because the whole match was built around Sable getting in the ring with Mero. After watching this I just wish that they had booked them in a singles match. At least Edge had a good showing as he did some cool moves and the crowd seemed to like him. 
**3/4* 


_Lion's Den Match:_ 
*Owen Hart w/Dan Severn vs. Ken Shamrock *

I was hoping this was going to be some type of hidden gem but that wasn't the case. I really wish they had wrestled this closer to a shoot style as they had a chance for a really unique match. Instead they worked a pro style match in what was basically a round cage without ropes. This was still a pretty good match though because it had that underground fight feel to it as it was in the theater below MSG and it was just a really physical, hard hitting match. I enjoyed myself but at times I really felt that Owen was the face here. Fun but by no means great.
***3/4 *


_Falls Count Anywhere for the WWF Tag Team Championshp:_
*Mankind(c) vs. The New Age Outlaws*

Foley obviously takes a couple of brutal bumps but he gets in no offense at all. Had they made it seem like Foley had even the slightest chance of winning thi could have been something great. That didn't happen a the Outlaws were protected here from looking weak. Also how are they faces? DX was a face faction here and yet after they win Billy Gunn talks shit to Mankind after and they throw him a dumpster. Foley deserves some credit for his bumps but this was a huge let down because we didn't get that moment where the underdog looked like he was going to pull of the impossible. 
*1/2* *


_Ladder Match for the Intercontinental Championship_
*Triple H w/Chyna vs. The Rock(c) w/Mark Henry*

I'm pretty sure there are a lot of conflicting views on this match. Just looking at who's in the match should be an indication that this isn't a spotfest. There were a lot of little things that were done really well. Early on Triple H knocked the Rock off the ladder and the ladder tipped over and it landed on Triple H. It clearly wasn't intended to happen but triple H still sold it hit him. Triple H sold his leg well that the Rock spent a lot of time working over. Triple H also worked like someone that was injured. When his leg was din really bad shape and knocked the ladder over and pushed it out of the ring. When he knew he was in bad shape he shifted the match away from the ring. 

The match was structured well, worked smartly, and Triple H sold his leg very well. That being said it had it's flaws. The biggest flaw being that they overdid the fatigue too much. The belt was't that high in the air and it would take Rock about 4 minutes to climb the 4 or 5 rungs he needed to climb. Pacing issues aside I thought this was pretty fantastic. I certainly prefer a match worked like this over what a lot of modern ladder matches look like. No laying outside the ring for 10 minutes, they didn't spend all this time setting up spots, and the main concern was always getting the belt. I'm on the side of loving the match and I'm not a huge fan of their other singles matches. 
******


_WWF Championship Match:_
*"Stone Cold" Steve Austin(c) vs. The Undertaker*

It's strange how many of their matches I've watched recently. I don't understand why two guys that are great at brawling can't just go crazy and have a great slugfest. It's like every time they get in the ring together they just have to slow the pace every single time and kill the momentum that they had at the start. There was also a really awkward encounter where both guys hit the ropes and through some miscommunication both ducked at the same time and they headbutted. I have no idea how serious it was but Austin seemed out of it for a couple of minutes. 

They finally got back to doing what they should have been doing all match but by then I was already getting tired of the match. They were able to spark my interest again as you do have two badasses slugging it out in front of hot crowd. Undertaker does a crazy leg drop from the top rope to the announce table. From that point on I would call the match compelling because Austin looked like he was in a lot of trouble. If you just watch the first 30 seconds and skip until Kane shows up you have a really entertaining match. But that period in the middle really wasn't very good. However I can't give a match a bad rating when I'm invested in the last 10 minutes or so of the match. It's not a great encounter between these two amazing wrestlers but it's certainly good.
****1/4*​

This isn't the best show but I enjoyed. I practically watched it in one sitting which is impressive. I can't wait to get to the next Summerslam in the anthology.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

*Chris Benoit vs. Shawn Michaels - WWE Raw 2/16/2004: *****

The story behind this match is that the week prior, Benoit was going to sign a contract to face Hunter for the World Heavyweight Championship at Wrestlemania. Shawn interrupts, does Sweet Chin Music on Benoit, and signs his name on the contract, thus resulting in this match. The match begins with a staredown with Shawn stomping his right foot on the mat, trying to intimidate Benoit and reminding him what happen the week before. Benoit would have none of that and attacks Shawn quickly. Shawn eventually comes back and works on Benoit's neck. Momentum changes with Benoit throwing Shawn out of the ring, hurting his previously injured back. Benoit makes great work on the back from snap suplexes, back suplexes, and back breakers. Shawn makes a come back and the match escalates to great back and forth action, making it look like both men could get a victory at any moment. Benoit was going to go for his patented Diving Headbutt until Triple H shows up. Hunter distracts Benoit long enough for Shawn to deliver the Sweet Chin Music to get the victory. Stone Cold shows up and announces that the World title match at Wrestlemania was going to be a triple threat match, leading up to what I consider to be the greatest triple threat matches of all time. Overall, great match that told a good story.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Oh yeah, I didn't mean 'pen and paper' to write reviews an stuff (which I don't do but pretty much cannot blame anybody for because things can be really hard to remember). It comes off to me like whoever says the 'don't over-think' bullshit think we're 'pen and papering' to analyse every detail of a match. Like writing down some hokey geometrical 'did this make sense?' stuff of every move.

For stuff like WWE PPVs I basically write after every match. Unless there were a few matches where nothing notable happened (it's WWE PPV so it happens a few times), where I can write after like 3 matches. Sometimes my memory kicks into 11 and I can write a thing a week after I watch a match. Other times there's the three count and I sit at the computer shrugging.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Had trouble writing about the SVS tag and Cena/Angle when I reviewed SVS 05 yesterday 

Thats why that review was so short BTW :lmao


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Shitty arguments are so annoying. Specially when somebody takes the time to explain their point and the comeback is a simplistic "I'm right". It's one thing to disagree, it's another to try forcing it. 1993 hates Angle/Benoit cage match and I love it, but it's alright because we both realize MUHAMMAD HASSAN is a once in a lifetime talent and stepping in the ring with him is the greatest honor for any wrestler.
> 
> Finished watching the Flair/Taker match and it was full of lol's. I was 8 when I saw it 11 years ago and I remember finding it hard to watch because Taker absolutely murdered the bloody Flair and I felt bad for him, lol. Watching it now, it's completely different and Lawler/JR just can't stop bringing it on commentary. :lol




Good call C2D. That Taker/Flair match had hilarious moments of jr and king arguing lmao. 

Especially after the match, taker closelines the Ref and
king just goes "Daha"

Jr screams " now that is uncalled fir. ,The Undertaker should be fined and suspended for that" 

king "Oh please the match is over you can do whatever you want to"


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Got best of IC title and Jeff Hardy My life My rules great condition used from GoHastings pretty cool, gonna watch IC title sometime this week


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Heel Brodus Clay is already killing it. That squash was hilarious.

EDIT: DAT CM PUNK BABYFACE WORK. Like watching Ricky Steamboat at his absolute peak.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

GOAT raw ending :banderas

OMG I marked


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

What the fuck did we just witness? That was awesome in so many ways. :lol


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Another good Orton promo masked in that half hour of comedy :ti


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Sweet fucking Jesus I :mark:ed like a bitch at that ending. If Punk/Trips and HBK/Bryan doesn't happen then fuck off. I've predicted Shawn wouldn't wrestle but that doesn't mean I don't want him too. That superkick :mark: Dat staredown :mark: 

I'M SO HIGH RIGHT NOW :mark: :mark:


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Goddammit, it's moments like that ending segment on RAW that remind me why I fell in love with wrestling in the first place.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

This GIF's gotta be up there with Cynical Mircale's sig for GOAT GIF of 2013.

Of course, an awesome ending.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Mark Henry also did this hilarious thing where he raised his hand when Triple H was talking about all the great champions in history. There are at least five different gifs from that awesome segment.

Usos/Wyatts was also really nice. Harper's clothesline was disgusting. Heck, every match tonight was good.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> This GIF's gotta be up there with Cynical Mircale's sig for GOAT GIF of 2013.
> 
> Of course, an awesome ending.


Thank you. I'll be keeping this.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Does anyone have a gif or video of that Wyatt clothesline?

I missed it.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Yeah greatest facepalm ever lolol so much :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

lol @ that Punk gif. That's my reaction every time Stephanie tries bigging up HHH's legacy. :lol


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I gotta rewatch that segment in the am, :mark:, I almost starting crying of laughter during Ortons part "HEY MICK" :lmao

and then got pretty hype during Cenas (dat ziggler and punk mention :banderas

and then the GAWD :hbk1

and then the superkick than the punk/hhh and this and that :mark:, only way that would of been better was if NAITCH was there
********************


When Orton rages and raises his voice :banderas


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Also, when Orton goes "Where are ya, Bret?" :lmao

Punk in that GIF :lmao :lmao


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Orton 'putting down' the legends was hilarious. And what he said about Bret in general. Bret's reaction also had me rolling. :lmao Foley tried his best to keep it serious but that segment was just too much. One hour later and I still can't get over the hilarity of the whole thing. :lol


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Brets face was :lenny

I didnt see foley reaction because I was laughing so hard

legit could be 10-15 gif from that segment alone


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

:lmao



Spoiler: Don't click if you don't like dudes















Here's another goodie:


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Um...HOW ABOUT THAT MATCH OF THE YEAR?! :mark: :mark: :mark:

:cena4 vs. :rock II


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

:lmao that final segment was hilarious. CENA VS ORTON HYPE? NAH FUCK THAT. DANIEL BRYAN CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP DANIEL BRYAN CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP.

:lmao at pretty much all the Slammy winners bar Bryan. Normally I'd blame WWE but this was all down to morons with smart phones and the WWE APP.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

We also got the return of Mark Henry's salmon blazer. Damn, I should have gone and watched this RAW with Chris Hero at Victoria's restaurant. Missed out on some fun.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

I'm gonna have to watch that segment. I might even watch Orton/Bryan HiaC, but probably not.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

Cant wait to use this 











when someone says HHH is a goat


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Who do we take seriously that calls HHH the GOAT?

No Starbuck, you do not count.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Who do we take seriously that calls HHH the GOAT?
> 
> No Starbuck, you do not count.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Well, I ran into that one. Good on you Jolly ol' Holly.

Give me five matches to watch before I go to sleep.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

HollyJollyHelmsley said:


>


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

That end segment was fucking awesome, i even enjoyed Cena's speech 

So much potential from what happened, how about that end picture - Cena with the authority..........heel turn yeah?


jk.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Just woke up, and now Im gonna go watch that final segment again :mark:

It actually said off pretty meh with the orton "I really know you" yadda yadda and the cena trying to get cheap pop with bryan, and bryan getting popped hard and Haitch downing playing it, 

BUT, then when Cena went hard at Orton and then randy started going on the legends :banderas lols and :mark: nonstop

:lmao the way Rey was standing


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

That main event segment owned hard. Great on everyone's behalf.

Also Punk/Ambrose was great. ***3/4, imo.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Just watched Punk/Ambrose (missed it last night). Punk and Ambrose add another match to the long list that is the great TV matches of 2013. There's so many things I can talk about. From the consistent selling from both men to the psychological mindfuck that was Ambrose throwing Punk out on the floor right into Rollins and Reigns, this match had me hooked from the beginning. If this match had gone 10 more minutes, this would have been in the four star category for sure. I have it at a very high ***1/2.

I am disappointed by the teased Shield break up though  Oh well the silver lining, I guess, would be that we'll finally get to see Ambrose pull off his batshit crazy persona. I can see Ambrose splitting soon, but Reigns and Rollins would continue together for a while. Cause you know, Reigns still has a lot to benefit from tagging with DAT RIGHT THERE SETH ROLLINS. And, even though it's veen three years, I still can't over the fact that Tyler Black is in the WWE lol.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Damn, Punk/Ambrose was so good, Punk really played his babyface role in an excellent way there. ***1/2. Also, Bryan made Fandango look like wrestler out there, not only as a jobber and the match itself was decent.

Hunico as Sin Cara is great and his match with ADR from last night was amazing, ***1/2, i may overrate it a little , but I am really excited to see how he develops. Also that ending :mark:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Loved that final segment. Overall I thought it was a pretty good go home show for TLC and I'm a bit hyped for the PPV now - which is good considering we get TLC free in the UK as well so I can watch (and hopefully enjoy) the PPV in great quality.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Final segment did NOTHING to hype TLC for me lol. It only reminded me of how little I care about Cena and Orton and want to see guys like Bryan and Punk in big matches instead lol.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I thought the Orton/Cena exchange on the mic was pretty good, and did a commendable job of selling their TLC match, but the aftermath definitely overshadowed everything else. Amazing segment from start to finish.


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

started to watch Raw again, 

the 8 man tag's fun, loving all these tag matches WWE are giving us lately. keep it up.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I wonder how much was improvised during the final segment, with guys (mainly Cena) playing off the hot BRYAN crowd. Specifically when he got Bryan out of the crowd of guys and you could see Orton doing his absolute best to NOT laugh and smile at the whole thing .


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah, I think that short "interview" Cena had w/Bryan where he asked him his name and hometown was improvised. It was actually a pretty smart way for Cena to regain cheers and served as a segue for his "work for everything" spiel.


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

Incredible final segment for the :lmao :mark: and gifs combined. 

Cena also showed why even though he's a boring fucker, he's fucking good at his job.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

The Stocking Filler said:


> I thought the Orton/Cena exchange on the mic was pretty good, and did a commendable job of selling their TLC match, but the aftermath definitely overshadowed everything else. Amazing segment from start to finish.


Yeah. After all the possibilities that could happen after watching that final segment, what's really interesting is what will happen after TLC when we start on the road to WrestleMania. But the fact we're getting a title unification after all this time has me a bit interested for the TLC main event (and yes I know we could get some bullshit screwy finish :side even though it involves Cena and Orton who I don't care about at all.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I'm just not convinced they can put on an exciting TLC match. Cena has only been in 1 (which wasn't good), and Orton hasn't been in one at all. I doubt WWE wants to risk either of them taking big bumps that could result in injury so close to Mania. I'm guessing there will be tons of bullshit/interference, and someone like Rollins will likely eat a few tables.

That being said, next week's Raw should be great. Repercussions from last night's final segment and fallout from TLC.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> I wonder how much was improvised during the final segment, with guys (mainly Cena) playing off the hot BRYAN crowd. Specifically when he got Bryan out of the crowd of guys and you could see Orton doing his absolute best to NOT laugh and smile at the whole thing .


I definitely think Cena improvised when he started putting over Bryan and other smark favorites. From the beginning you could tell HHH and Stephanie were not happy with the crowd trying to shit on the segment (Steph rolled her eyes as soon as "Daniel Bryan" chants started). And yeah, when Cena brought Bryan to the center, you could tell that Orton was like "I see where you're going with this".

Just rewatched the segment and it was awesome work by everyone involved. And finally the rest of the Raw section has caught up instead of whining because it's cool to be automatically negative/dismissive of whatever happens due to it involving Orton and Cena.

I might set myself up for disappointment, but I hope when they talked about bringing 100% to the match, these weren't just empty kayfabe promises. I'm really excited for this. :mark:


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I was actually impressed w/Orton's promo and the way he responded to the BORING chants.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

That was Orton's best promo since like early '09, imo. I was impressed.

Working on my top 50 of 2013 list while I should be writing my finals paper. :side:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Call me a cynic, but I think Vince buzzed Cena before that spiel and had him ask Bryan the "where are you from?" Question to remind the WWE audience at home that this crowd was only going nuts for Bryan because he's a hometown guy. Just a thought. Punk rolling his eyes at Hunter being mentioned as a great champ was so fucking awesome.

C2d- completely off topic, but I think I might have been wrong about Austin actively avoiding talking about Benoit on his podcast. If you check out the Art of Wrestling podcast from a week or so ago were Colt had Austin on, Austin brings Benoit up 2 different times completely out of the blue when they are talking about unrelated stuff. The first time when Colt was talking about wrestlers who were in the best ring shape, the second when Austin said "not everyone can have a match like a New Japan Benoit vs Jushin Liger match". Made me smile, I like Austin I woulda been dissapointed if he had caved to Vince on the Benoit issue.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Yeah, I don't think they'll put on a good match either. I'm just interested in how it will end, what will the finish be? How much fuckery will there be? How they follow up on it? These things I want to know.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Agreed. I'm also a little curious as to how the two 3-on-1 matches will go.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I see Reigns and possibly even Rollins turning face on Ambrose.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Hopefully the final segment isn't just a tease and it leads to something between those involved.

Probably get fuck all though.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I dont like that there are the two handicaps, meh on them, punk/ambrose been giving us the goods tho but it seems like a clusterfuck


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I'm actually intrigued by the possibility of an HBK return match.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I only see Reigns turning face. Rollins will probably turn later separately, but now they are probably booking Reigns as the breakout star.



Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> C2d- completely off topic, but I think I might have been wrong about Austin actively avoiding talking about Benoit on his podcast. If you check out the Art of Wrestling podcast from a week or so ago were Colt had Austin on, Austin brings Benoit up 2 different times completely out of the blue when they are talking about unrelated stuff. The first time when Colt was talking about wrestlers who were in the best ring shape, the second when Austin said "not everyone can have a match like a New Japan Benoit vs Jushin Liger match". Made me smile, I like Austin I woulda been dissapointed if he had caved to Vince on the Benoit issue.


Yeah, I figured that would be the case. Just didn't make sense for him to try staying away from bringing him up when he answered somebody asking him about Benoit/HOF and when Angle was on the podcast, it was Austin who brought up the cage match between Kurt and Benoit. I think he's understanding on the issue and has no problem praising Benoit on the wrestling side of things. He once said on twitter that Benoit was one of his favorite opponents.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

That Cena 'heel turn tease' 

People still think it may happen too lol.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> That Cena 'heel turn tease'
> 
> People still think it may happen too lol.


I don't, but I still have that small bit of hope in me that they actually go through with it.

I see a "double cross" on Cena more likely based on what happened yesterday. As in HHH acting like he's helping Cena and they're about to join forces, only to push him off the ladder, help Orton become undisputed champion and the "corporation" are back together. I wouldn't be against it since I like Orton and he'll look pretty weak if he loses on Sunday. But they have a golden opportunity to pull a double turn but we all know that wont happen.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Don't care for the handicap matches and I don't understand what WWE was thinking when they made these matches, seems they've backed themselves into a corner again with their booking. Having Punk or Bryan beat 3 guys would be ridiculous, but do they want both Punk and Bryan to lose when they should look strong with Mania coming up soon? I think Punk and Bryan should of stayed a team and continued their feud with The Wyatts into the TLC PPV, but then what would The Shield do? I Guess they wanted The Shield doing some relevant and with the recent development in The Shield with the teased splitting it's important that they have a relevant match.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I'm even more surprised there hasn't been a ladder match, tables match nor a chairs match announced. Isn't there typically one of each (TLC, Ladder, Tables, Chairs) on the card?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I'm fine with no chairs match, but I hope that they just throw whoever's in the tag picture into a ladder match for the titles and I guess they can throw a random table's match in there too. Big E vs. Sandow, even though that feud's had no build? Idk 

Gonna watch the last segment of RAW again :mark:


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah, they're running out of time to announce a tag ladder match, though. Maybe on SD?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

:lmao at Booker seductively taking off his glasses right when Cena starts to say, "It's funny..."

Yeah, I don't know why WWE's waited so long to fill up the card. Nevertheless, I have moderate hopes for TLC at this point. I think Cena and Orton can put out something _decent_, but I'm not expecting much more. Hopefully the handicap matches are fun and whatever happens with the tag titles is good.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Find it interesting that there's only 5 matches announced for the main card right now.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

find interesting there aren't any other gimmick matches announced besides TLC


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Is it just me that is not totally 'feeling' the two handicap matches?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I find it interesting that none of the matches announced are actually interesting. Maybe Punk Vs THE SHIELD because THE SHIELD rule the planet. Would have preferred Bryan and Punk teaming in a 3 on 2 match against them instead.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Saw this in the Raw section:






Someone pointed out Cena's attempt at a 'kip-up' :lol (at 2:08)


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I wonder if Booker practices those at the house.

Fuckin Laurinaitis :lmao

Punk loving Steph in his underwear :lmao 

Hunter's like :HHH


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Saw this in the Raw section:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Punk + Steph =





:HHH


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Saw this in the Raw section:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


T'was me. It's pretty golden.

now rep pls~

Also rewatched Ambrose/Punk last night. Another great bout, showing the two have some real good chemistry there. Now, let's move on to Punk vs. Rollins please. :mark:

***1/2 for it.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> T'was me. It's pretty golden.
> 
> now rep pls~


Repped you already


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

SKINS your current sig is adorable. Don't change it. 



Dominick The Donkey said:


> Find it interesting that there's only 5 matches announced for the main card right now.


WWE will probably add a few pointless filler matches to the card at the last minute, they always seem to do. :side: 

I want to see a ladder match and tables match added because those matches are usually fun, fuck the chairs match though.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Agreed, no Chairs match pls.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I know no one cares but they could've easily made the IC title match a chairs match to add to the stipulations. One of the handicap matches could have been a tables match too.

Oh well, the TLC is what matters. :mark:


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Rhodes vs. Real Americans vs. Usos vs. Rybaxel in a ladder match for the tag titles and Rey vs. uh...someone would be nice. 

Saying that, WWE will probably book Miz vs. Kofi or something else shitty. :side:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

PGSucks said:


> Rhodes vs. Real Americans vs. Usos vs. Rybaxel in a ladder match for the tag titles


Or a elimination tables match. :mark:

Oh the possibilities. 

It's sad that after improving the tag division in the past few months there isn't even a tag team title match on the card for TLC yet. But just watch WWE add it at the last minute...

Oh and do I need to rant about Ziggler on the pre-show again? fpalm


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah, probably best to quell that rant.  It's pretty sad.

This is basically booked as a 1-match show. Not sure what to expect from the rest of the card (not much).


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Ziggy's probably gonna job to Fandango on the pre-show. :ziggler1

Well, I'll be watching TLC a few days after it airs because I'll be balls neck deep in studying for Finals by then. Hopefully it ends up being good enough to download. :side:


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I can see the show being entertaining, but match quality probably won't be very high. Where is the show taking place?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Stocking Filler said:


> Yeah, probably best to quell that rant.  It's pretty sad.
> 
> This is basically booked as a 1-match show. Not sure what to expect from the rest of the card (not much).


Yeah, booked as a 1-match show with the 1 match being god awful on paper :lmao.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Christmas Nostalgia said:


> SKINS your current sig is adorable. Don't change it.


:lenny



Christmas Nostalgia said:


> Oh and do I need to rant about Ziggler on the pre-show again? fpalm


Dont even get me started brother


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

BUT IT'S THE BIGGEST MATCH IN HISTORY DAMMIT :vince


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Yeah, I'm tired of ranting about it SKINS.



The Stocking Filler said:


> I can see the show being entertaining, but match quality probably won't be very high. Where is the show taking place?


Houston, Texas.



PGSucks said:


> Ziggy's probably gonna job to Fandango on the pre-show. :ziggler1


Tbh I think Ziggler will likely win because Fandango's the biggest flop of 2013 and he's jobbed to Santino recently. But you never know what WWE will do with Ziggler.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Houston isn't a notoriously good crowd, is it?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I would love for :ziggler2 to win, but I could see him jobbing out to "reestablish" Fandango or something. I never thought back in June or July that I'd be this pessimistic about Ziggler by now. :side: 


Houston, along with just about every city in Texas, isn't exactly a great crowd. Not as bad as some of the other southern crowds like Oklahoma City for instance, but they probably won't add much to the show. At least they get to witness THE BIGGEST MATCH IN WWE HISTORY :vince2


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Fun Fact : TLC 10 was in the same place, wonder how many times has that happened


I'm tired as well Nostalgia, those threads in the wwe sec dont help either


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Only way to re-establish Fandango would be to totally repackage him because he's not going anywhere with that god awful gimmick he's got now, no matter how much his theme song is over with the crowd. Summer Rae is getting more attention than Fandango these days.



RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Fun Fact : TLC 10 was in the same place, wonder how many times has that happened
> 
> 
> I'm tired as well Nostalgia, those threads in the wwe sec dont help either


I swear I see: ''what are WWE doing with Ziggler'' threads 3 times a week in the WWE section. Yeah, it's sad how much he's fallen but the topic is getting so redundant.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Stocking Filler said:


> Houston isn't a notoriously good crowd, is it?


From what I've seen, they are good. Don't know now but in the past they have been. Not a dead crowd and not too smarky either. Best of both worlds. (Y)


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I have absolute zero interest in the title match at the moment, but am absolutely stoked out of my mind at what might come down the road. I hope the match is good, and want it to be good, but I'm not looking forward to it right now. 

Seems you can't swing a dead cat without hitting a thread about the Slammy's being rigged :ti


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

Fandango sucks. Always has.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I kind of like the Fandango gimmick, they just gave it to the wrong guy. Johnny Curtis is dish water.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

I like Johnny Curtis, plays the dancing gimmick well I think. The gimmick just didn't do well after the Y2J feud.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I honestly dont think HE was ever over, just the song was incredibly catchy and caught on


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

I don't even know why that got over. It's not cool.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Only got over because of the post Mania crowd.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Saint Dick said:


> I don't even know why that got over. It's not cool.


Stupid post-Mania crowd. What I hate the most is that idiotic "dancing" that goes along with it.


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

Yeah1993 said:


> I kind of like the Fandango gimmick, they just gave it to the wrong guy. Johnny Curtis is dish water.


Kobashi looks amazing with that nose in your sig.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


> I kind of like the Fandango gimmick, they just gave it to the wrong guy. Johnny Curtis is dish water.



That's a hilarious way of putting it, but yea Curtis is a nothing wrestler. He just seems like he is going through the motions when he "wrestles". There is absolutely nothing memorable about a Fandango match. I feel like they came up with a solid heel gimmick idea, but then never expanded on it. If it was a more competent guy working as Fandango he would have taken it upon himself to add dimensions to the character. Right now it's just a dude that dances, and that's weak.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

Watching the HiaC main events now. I'm not okay with Cena doing two dropkicks in the same match. I can tolerate one but not two.


----------



## RKing85 (Mar 22, 2010)

WWE Black Friday order arrived today.

Watching Attitude Era dvd as I type this.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Why would Ziggler lose to Fandango on the pre-show? Fandango is a jobber & more irrelevant than Ziggler currently is. It's probably a lock for Ziggler to win the random match.

Not sure why people are making guesses for the tag team championship match either. It's obviously leaning towards Rhodes Dynasty vs Ryback & Axel. Without gimmicks. Usos are back to where they belong doing nothing & Real Americans are looking to keep something brewing vs Show & Mysterio just so Cesaro can have a singles match vs one of them.

Of course, all of that ^ relies on the WWE making sense. Which is hard to come by this year. So, fuck it, I guess. Also, ending to RAW was fantastic. If not for all of the "planned" reasons. It still was. Punk laughing @ 99% of the shit said = bliss. The facial expressions in that pool. My stars. I can't be the only one to notice Booker T's dramatic glasses moment.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cody :hb

Actually I didnt catch the booker thing, caught all the other dramatics :banderas


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Man, it was gold. I missed it at first until my brother showed me. Too much good stuff up in there. Camera panning on Shawn after Trips says some in the ring have been both WWE & World Champions; following with him looking directly into the camera mouthing the words "Me" with ultimate smugness.

:ti

Dude was on coke again. I'm sold.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

^^^ when he mumbled "me" as the dual champ :banderas

dude was on coke indeed, still cant get over orton/foley/bret interaction

another goodie was punk's face when Cena mention him


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Benoit's WWE debut match against HHH is good, but not as good as I used to think. Kinda disappointed.

Not sure if any of you are aware, but back in 2011 during the Tribute to the Troops taping, the WWE ran a segment between Mysterio and CM Punk where they alluded to their past feud. Not sure why it never aired, but it sounded pretty awesome.



> * Rey Mysterio appeared in a backstage segment. He told the crowd that unfortunately, he isn’t cleared to compete. The Miz and Alberto Del Rio came up to taunt Mysterio, but CM Punk showed up. The Miz and Del Rio asked Punk if he was Mysterio’s friend now, and Punk responded that he just hated Rey less than he hates them. Miz and Del Rio left, and in a nod to their previous feud, Mysterio said “Your hair grew back.” CM Punk asked how Rey’s daughter Aaliyah was doing. Punk then said to tell her he said Happy Birthday. Rey told Punk that Aaliyah still has nightmares over that. Rey was referring to a Smackdown segment in which Punk interrupted Aaliyah’s birthday celebration and sang a very disturbing rendition of Happy Birthday to her.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cena not pulling punches with the Orton taboos got another rise out of me. You question how much is said to be "edgy", although everything said is treading that line. Crowd shitting on Orton was hilarious. It's like damn, they don't give a shit about you. Only want Danielson. I bet Triple H was furious after it was over considering Danielson was more over than the entire unification angle. Kind of tells the company something.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Tbh Orton dealt with the crowd pretty well this time. They wanted to desperately shit all over him with the "Boring" chants but he just kept on going and they finally went quiet. Not really his (or Cena's) fault that the crowd are biased pricks with their only intention being shitting on the segments because they are mad about Bryan being taken out of the equation temporary.

Bret's reaction to the (funny) comments by Orton about him was one of many highlights. :lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

b/c they like someone more than Orton they're biased pricks? That's a two way street if I ever heard one.

:jordan


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I just want to see the Real Americans and Rhodes work more together, and the addition of ladders would've been nice. Ah well, Rhodes vs. Rybaxel isn't too bad.

There was just too much unintentional goodness in that segment. I lost my shit when Booker dramatically took his glasses off. Oh, and DAT POST RAW SPINAROONIE. :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Undertaker/Batista 4/18/08: ****1/2*
Undertaker/Batista 4/25/08: ****3/4*
Undertaker/Festus 4/11/08: ****3/4*
Undertaker/Kane 4/4/08: ****1/2*

DAT APRIL! Gimme some more underappreciated Undertaker television matches from that period. And don't mention his match against Finlay. I've seen it so many times.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

^Someone else saw it. YES.

Also, I've gone into loads of detail about how amazing Taker was during April of 2008. Toss in WM vs Edge + w/Kane vs Morrison & Miz. Epic. Kane & Festus matches >>> both the fun ones vs Batista though. 

watch his matches vs the monsters on Smackdown in early 2008. Henry, Big Daddy V, etc. One of the BDV matches is better than the other. I had to find out which one it is again. EDIT ~ (It's 1/25)


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Is there a link for the 08 street fight between Taker and Batista? I looked it up a while back and couldn't find it. cba to download the whole show from XWT or anywhere else, so a link to just the match would be appreciated.



Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> b/c they like someone more than Orton they're biased pricks? That's a two way street if I ever heard one.
> 
> :jordan


No, what I mean is they don't give the segments/matches any chance. They automatically dismiss everything and intend to shit on it just because they don't like the people who are involved. It's not even about Orton but the whole angle in general.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I wouldn't generalize like that. It's not so far-fetched to realize a lot of fans couldn't care less about the current major angle going on. It's Cena vs Orton. Yawn. Saw this stuff a ton before. Some folk out there might not even care about the process of unification with how the World Championship being on the backburner for so long. It's all conceivable to me.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I'm guessing there'll be Cena vs. Orton X (or is it Cena vs. Orton XI?) at the Rumble, so idk how WWE is going to sell the BIGGEST match in WWE history...again! :cena4 rton2


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Probably gonna happen THREE TIMES OVER before WM at this rate.

But it's still the biggest match ever & didn't happen in 2001. lol @ burying Jericho's win back on Smackdown last Friday.


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

I didn't care about the Cena/Orton feud back in 2007, in 2009 and nothing's changed in 2013.
the WHT isn't on par with the WWE title, so the unification to me means less former world champions walking around.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Is there a link for the 08 street fight between Taker and Batista? I looked it up a while back and couldn't find it. cba to download the whole show from XWT or anywhere else, so a link to just the match would be appreciated.
> 
> 
> 
> No, what I mean is they don't give the segments/matches any chance. They automatically dismiss everything and intend to shit on it just because they don't like the people who are involved. It's not even about Orton but the whole angle in general.


The worst part is, you can't avoid it like you can just avoid this board. It's like listening to a really annoying commentator. I hope that the crowd gives the TLC match a chance to develop, but I bet that this has become a "thing" now. Shows the stupidity too, because that actually was a really good segment, with good work done by all, but predetermined idiots were determined to be the whole show. All worked out, because it was a circus, but whatever.

It's the WWE's own fault, because they never should have fucked up Bryan's storyline to begin with. With the way that the WWE tried to marginalize and push aside Bryan, they created their own monster. This is pretty much the only way that the fans can essentially force the WWE's hand, and the fans know it. Hence where we're at.

Having said that, I'd really like to see the TLC buy numbers. I'm not usually into "drawing" stuff, especially since there are so many ways to compare things. Like, me might compare it to the other B-PPVs, others might compare it to other TLC's...do years make a difference? Different undercards make a difference, etc? I dunno, but that's why drawing arguments usually become really tedious. But if it's an obviously good number, then I will think that there might be something to the fact that these crowds & boards aren't that representative, in terms of supposed lack of interest. 



Since we're speaking of the PPV, the only two matches on the card that seem remotely interesting to me are Punk/Shield and Cena/Orton. Actually, I'm interested in where the Wyatts and Bryan go, but not in the actual match. Bray Wyatt's promos have been top fucking notch! Bryan with the Wyatts would be so damn interesting to me if done right, but I have no faith in the WWE in that regard, and it looks like that point is going to soon be moot anyway.

It'd be great to have a wrestler who wrestles a style that interests me in that group (I know Luke Harper is great, but I just can't bring myself to care about the Wyatt matches right now). Bray has so much potential when it comes to promos, that I wish that I could also be interested in them in the ring.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

bme said:


> I didn't care about the Cena/Orton feud back in 2007, in 2009 and nothing's changed in 2013.
> the WHT isn't on par with the WWE title, so the unification to me means less former world champions walking around.


How does it mean less former world champs?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Saint Dick said:


> How does it mean less former world champs?


Guys like Swagger would never win a title if there was only one instead of two.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Choke2Death said:


> No, what I mean is they don't give the segments/matches any chance. They automatically dismiss everything and intend to shit on it just because they don't like the people who are involved. It's not even about Orton but the whole angle in general.


Well to be fair it's a shitty idea within a shitty angle with a potentially shitty main event of two people who have produced some pretty shitty matches together. I am all for WWE crowds shutting the fuck up but I cannot blame them for reacting negatively to WWE's insistence of doing the same shit, especially with Randy 'Personality of a Stop Sign" Orton. I think the audience are just fed up with it and naturally they'll get vocal. Again, I can really hate these sorts of crowds, but WWE are the idiots here. Instead of thinking 'hey, they're still chanting Bryan - let's run with that again', they probably just think 'how do we shut them up?'


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Meanwhile, simple solution there would to be, you know, let Danielson get the ball and roll with it. Apparently WWE would rather create hoops to jump through, which lead nowhere, instead of cutting the BS and going for something that would actually be favorable to a large portion of their fanbase.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Guys like Swagger would never win a title if there was only one instead of two.


Obviously but he said former world champions. When the belts are unified guys like Swagger will still be former world champions.


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

What do people expect ? If fans don't like something they're not gonna just sit there and take it.

If i was at the post WM29 Raw i would've been chanting random stuff right along with the crowd as soon as the bell rang for Sheamus/Orton.



Saint Dick said:


> Obviously but he said former world champions. When the belts are unified guys like Swagger will still be former world champions.


What i meant was after TLC we wouldn't have any *more* former world champions who were more like mid-card champions.
Guys like Ziggler being former WHC sucks not because of the wrestlers but the status of the belt,
The WHC doesn't main event ppvs, they headline the #2 show in WWE and currently the company has treated the WWE title as the crown jewel.

The WWE champion is seen as the face of WWE, and ADR looks like a second rate world champion in the process.
The WWE title has been the top title for a while but they aren't even shy about showing that now.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Just re-watched the Orton/Taker match from Mania. Wow, its all kinds of good, forgot how good it was.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Here we go again.. me and my random-ass 2011 rewatching.

*Elmination Chamber 2011:
*
Alberto Del Rio vs Kofi Kingston -* ***.* While it wasn't as good as I remember, it's still a fun opener. Booker was top notch on commentary and added a lot to the match. Booker in general was brilliant in the show, he can make almost every match watchable with his hilarious commentary. God I miss him 

SD Chamber - *****1/2.* Holy shit what a match. Mcintyre was the MVP and Rey was on fire. Barrett and Kane were really good too. Loved Show's moments with Wade and Edge had a killer little match with Rey. Awesome match top to bottom. Still can't get over of how awesome Drew's entrance to the match was, thought he killed Rey when he entered :lol

Corre vs Santino and Kozlov - ***.* Decent cool-down match.

Miz vs Jerry Lawler - ****.*

RAW EC - ****1/2*. Felt like this year's RAW MITB. While it was good, still not as good as SD's match and went too long. Morrision was the clear MVP. Great tension between Orton and Punk, too bad their WM match was so average. Sheamus also had a great performance. It's just me or he has never been in a bad or even medicore gimmick match? From what I can recall, he always steals the show when it comes to gimmick match (MITB, EC, HIAC, Street Fight, 2 out of 3 Falls, Ladder.. heck, even Tables and Chairs matches!). Finish was sick and Punk's cut looked horrible. Good Chamber overall.

Very good show.


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


> Well to be fair it's a shitty idea within a shitty angle with a potentially shitty main event of two people who have produced some pretty shitty matches together. I am all for WWE crowds shutting the fuck up but I cannot blame them for reacting negatively to WWE's insistence of doing the same shit, especially with Randy 'Personality of a Stop Sign" Orton. I think the audience are just fed up with it and naturally they'll get vocal. Again, I can really hate these sorts of crowds, but WWE are the idiots here. Instead of thinking 'hey, they're still chanting Bryan - let's run with that again', they probably just think 'how do we shut them up?'


Holy shit, this post contains the utmost amount of correctness. I'm siging it, If you don't mind.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

As i own all the In Your House DVD's, thinking of putting togehter my own 'Best Of'. Came up with this:



> Bret Hart vs Hakushi - WWF: In Your House 1
> Shawn Michaels vs Jeff Jarrett - WWF: In Your House 2
> Diesel vs Sycho Sid (Lumberjack Match) - WWF In Your House 2
> Yokozuna & Owen Hart vs Lex Luger & British Bulldog - WWF: In Your House 2
> ...


Any missing?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Not sure about matches already missing, but this one NEEDS to be missing lol:

Diesel vs Sycho Sid (Lumberjack Match) - WWF In Your House 2


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Yeah a couple I wasn't sure on lol, and they had matches at IYH 1 & 2 so thought id list one, that was one of them. Another was a Taker/Goldust match as I don't really remember it.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Taker/Goldie never did anything special tbh. They never really clicked, which was a shame. Bet they could steal the fucking show any time they wanted now though lol.

Back to SS 03. EC match now!


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*SummerSlam 2003*

:lmao sign guy has a dart board sign with a picture of Vince's face in the middle .


*The Dudley Boys Vs La Resistance - World Tag Team Championship Match*

Those damn Frenchies have the WORLD tag titles, so the Dudley Boys need to bring them back to AMERICA where they belong. Apparently. LOL.

:lmao at DUPREE using a BEARHUG on BUBBA RAY. Spike Dudley might as well try the same thing on Viscera.

Wow this was uneventful as fuck. Rob Conway was dressed as a camera man and costs the Dudley Boys the match.

Terrible opener lol.

*Rating: DUD*
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*The Undertaker Vs A-Train*

UNDERTAKER~!

Sable joining A-Train for this match! HAIRY GUYS GET ALL THE PUSSY~!

Undertaker's ribs have been fucked since Vengeance against Cena, and A-Train has been attacking them for weeks on Smackdown. Undertaker being one of the GOATs knows how to wrestle a match with an injury. Love something as basic as him getting A-Train into the corner but not following up with punches, instead backing off and going on the defence just in case the big man counters and traps HIM in the corner.

OLD SCHOOL~! A-Train is down!

Shot to the ribs by A-Train, and Undertaker is fucking PISSED. He runs towards the giant hairy beast who uses the Dead Man's own momentum against him, sending him over the ropes!

Now it's time for A-Train to really target those injured ribs.

I like how the commentators tell us that Sable is "with" A-Train because A-Train is helping out Vince McMahon. So basically, Vince is pimping out Sable. LOL. No wonder Lesnar left the company!!! 8*D

BIG BACK THROW~! No Tazz, it's called a BACK SUPLEX. I thought you were the former wrestler who is there to call the moves that Cole is clueless about (so like, all of them).

PUNCHES~! Undertaker is making a comeback with some huge rights to the face of A-Train! APRON LEG DROP~!

LAST RIDE~! A-Train throws Undertaker into the referee. DE-RAILER! Undertaker kicks out!!!

UNDERTAKER KILLS THE REFEREE.

BYCYCLE KICK! UNDERTAKER IS OUT!

Referee is down so... steel chair of course! Undertaker boots it back into A-Train's face! But the ref takes his time making a pin.

TOMBSTONE~! REVERSAL~! CHOKESLAM~! 3 COUNT!!! Not often we see a Chokeslam win a match lol, even in 2003!

Undertaker has won but he ain't done! Goes for a Last Ride and Sable starts rubbing his chest. Which causes Undertaker to grab her by the throat, and hold her while STEPHANIE FAP FAP returns to get her some of Sable. Did STEPHANIE FAP FAP have a second boob job btw? Because I don't remember them being THIS BIG in 2002 lol.

Good match. Undertaker rules as always, and A-Train is mostly a very underrated big man. He works the ribs well and they have a nice finishing stretch too.

*Rating: ****
*CAL SCALE - 2*


*Shane McMahon Vs Eric Bischoff*

I don't really understand this match/feud. It was basically KANE VS SHANE and somehow Bischoff ends up... there. LOL.

So, 2 non wrestlers having... a match. This isn't even a No DQ or anything either I don't think.

:lmao it is rather amusing watching Shane maul Bischoff. THIS IS FOR NEARLY PUTTING MY DADDY OUT OF BUSINESS YOU CUNT~!

THE COACH JUST TURNED HEEL! HE JUST DECKED SHANE WITH A CHAIR! OMG!

Bischoff makes the match No DQ and Falls Count Anywhere.

:lmao THE COACH JUST TURNED HEEL.

:lmao.

Seriously, of all the people to pick to help him, Bischoff went with THE COACH? :lmao

King and JR's mic get shut off and COACH calls the match in the ring while holding Shane for Bischoff. LOL. This is TERRIBLE.

Shane makes a comeback, then being 2 on 1 gets taken down again so Austin shows up to even the odds. But Austin can't attack anyone unless physically provoked. So Shane shoves COACH into Austin. And Austin kills him.

:lmao Shane and Austin REALLY kick the shit out of the poor guy. You know how when a couple of guys stomp on someone and it looks fake as shit... well not here :lmao. It's like they WANT to hurt him for real.

Shane slaps Austin with Bischoff's hand, and Austin stuns him. BUT BISCHOFF KICKS OUT!!! Awwww what a shame, that just means Shane has to kill him some more. Elbow table spot. BISCHOFF IS DEAD. SHANE WINS.

This match is... :lmao. It's terrible but in the most hilarious way possible. THEY TURNED THE COACH HEEL :lmao. And in the end it didn't even matter :lmao. Shane still wins :lmao.

*Rating: **
*CAL SCALE - 0*


Fuck me they are hyping up WRESTLEMANIA 20 already!


*Eddie Guerrero Vs Chris Benoit Vs Rhyno Vs Tajiri - United States Championship Match*

Look at those participants. LOOK AT THAT FUCKING TALENT. FAP FAP FUCKING FAAAAAAAAAAAP.

:lmao Eddie turned on EVERYONE in this match at some point . Video showing him attacking them all on SD is GOAT. Levels his former best friend Benoit, then turns on his partner that night Rhyno, then is about to leave and figures "what the fuck" and decks his former partner Tajiri too :lmao.

But this isn't just about EDDIE VS THE WORLD, because Benoit and Rhyno have some issues too. Rhyno GORED Benoit at vengeance allowing Eddie to win the US title.

EDDIE CHANTS~! The beginning of Eddie being the most popular wrestler probably on the PLANET lol.

FUCK ME. Benoit just charges at Rhyno with a running knee and smashes it right into his ribs and keeps on going until he smashes into the corner lol. DON'T FUCK WITH BENOIT.

:mark: Benoit and Tajiri interactions. Did they have a singles match... ever? Or at least around this time period? *looks* Just 2 on Raw in 2005. DO WANT.

LASSO FROM EL PASO~! Rhyno comes in to break it up, but gets caught by Benoit and put in a Crossface! :lmao at Eddie's face as he realises that Rhyno could tap first and cost him the title!!! Awesome little sequence :mark:.

DOUBLE A SPINEBUSTER TO TAJIRI~! TAJIRI KICKS OUT~! :lmao Rhyno can be seen looking up and talking to himself. Probably saying "HOW DID THAT NOT WORK? FOR THE LOVE OF ARN HOW DID THAT NOT WORK?!?!".

GORE TO EDDIE! BUT EDDIE HAD THE US TITLE BELT WITH HIM AND IT PROTECTED THE CHAMP!!! Ha, awesome. 

Bugger me, THAT was a near fall. Headbutt to Rhyno while Tajiri is caught in a tree of woe, cover... then Tajiri manages to escape and flop over Benoit to break up the pin lol.

Rhyno is still out... FROG SPLASH~! EDDIE WINS! STILL THE CHAMP!

:mark: this rules in all kinds of ways. 4 super talented guys going at it. Exactly what you would expect.

*Rating: *****
*CAL SCALE - 5*


*Brock Lesnar Vs Kurt Angle - WWE Championship Match*

:mark:

YOU WERE SUPPOSED TO BE MY FRIEND~!

So I've had this match at ***** for a LONG time. I last watched it around 3 years ago when I was putting together my top 100 WWF/E Matches list... and boy did it ever hold up. Which honestly surprised me a little, but it's awesome when matches hold up even when I wasn't sure it would. Can it hold its place as a ***** match this time around? I fucking hope so! :mark:

Backstory for those who don't remember/didn't watch at the time. Angle lost the WWE Title to Brock at WM. Angle went away for neck surgery. He returned as a babyface and he and Lesnar had a "competitive rivarly" type friendship. Triple threat at Vengeance with Big Show for the title, and Angle won it back. Vince McMahon gets involved, turns Brock heel and Brock claims that Angle stopped being his friend when he took away HIS WWE Title. So now Lesnar wants it back. Simples.

Early going sees some AMATEUR WRASSLING, with Brock trying to show Angle up, but Angle is a fecking GOLD MEDALIST and not even Brock can hang with him. So if mat wrestling ain't gonna work, he gotta us that POWER.

But even the POWER doesn't work too well as Angle uses his speed and keeps countering THE BEAST at every oppertunity, and Lesnar is fucked! Starts throwing shit around on the outside, then grabs the WWE Title and begins to leave with it, causing Angle to chase after him!

OVERHEAD BELLY TO BELLY :mark:. And the commentators ACTUALLY CALLED THE MOVE!!! Normally they call it a "throw" or simply a "belly to belly" and both are fucking wrong and dumb. MORONS.

PRESS SLAM OVER THE ROPES TO THE FLOOR~! Angle is dead or something.

OVERHEAD BELLY TO BELLY... AND LESNAR DOESN'T FALL DOWN AFTER DOING THE SUPLEX~! HOLY FUCK THAT ALWAYS LOOKS IMPRESSIVE AS HELL. :mark:

Man oh man, Angle running FULL SPEED into Lesnar and crashing into him was awesome, and made even more awesome when Lesnar barely fucking moved!!! Love how much it takes for Angle to FINALLY knock Lesnar down, only for Brock to give him an overhead belly to belly and fuck him up again.

ANGLE SLAM~! No, Lesnar reverses! 

F-5~! No, Angle reverses!!!

ANGLE SLAM~! LESNAR KICKS OUT!!!

Well, if the Angle Slam didn't work, then you gotta go for the ANKLE LOCK~! Lesnar holds on and manages to reverse it and send Angle head first into the referee!!!

:mark: Lesnar tries to hit a SPINEBUSTER on Angle, but Angle holds on to Lesnar's waist and locks in a figure four on his NECK! Lesnar starts to fade, and once he gets on the mat, Angle switches to an Ankle Lock!!! Nice to see him going back to the hold the moment he got the chance rather than just throwing out a bunch of different submissions for the hell of it.

LESNAR TAPS~! But the referee is down! 

STEEL CHAIR TO ANGLE~! VINCE MCMAHON JUST NAILED ANGLE WITH A STEEL CHAIR~!

ONE LEGGED F-5~! Awesome.

Angle kicks out, so Vince tells Lesnar to do it again.

COUNTER INTO THE ANKLE LOCK~! LESNAR GRABS THE ROPES 3 TIMES, BUT ANGLE DRAGS HIM BACK AND APPARENTLY IT DOESN'T BREAK THE HOLD LOL.

LESNAR TAPS OUT!!! LESNAR TAPS OUT!!! ANGLE RETAINS!!!

:mark:

So this still rules... BUT I don't think it's ***** any more . A little disappointing yes, but I still think it's fucking tremendous, just not THAT tremendous lol.

*Rating: ****1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 7*


*Kane Vs Rob Van Dam - No Holds Barred*

HOUSE ARREST DOES NOT PREVENT KANE FROM COMING TO WORK~!

What?

:lmao at the video package for this match. Mostly building Shane Vs Kane. Just like Shane Vs Bischoff match earlier :lmao.

Man, how fucking DARK AND EVIL was Kane when he first unmasked? Set JR on fire, put clamps on Shane's balls and electrocuted them, and in the video package here we see him kidnap RVD, tie him up, pour gasoline over him and light a fucking match!

:lmao at some of the spots in this match. Kane doing his over the rope bump... BEFORE RVD quite gets to him with a running crossbody . And RVD setting a ladder up in the ropes, but before he can use it manages to get Kane down and goes for Rolling Thunder... but when he runs the ropes the ladder has gone :lmao. The fuck did it go? Oh, the ref moved it. Because he decided that RVD didn't want it any more... despite getting it out and not having the chance to use it yet. LOLOLOLOLOLOL.

THIS HIDEOUS, SMELLY MONSTER KANE~! You tell him, JR!!!

:lmao at RVD going for that kick off the ropes, but doing it from the second rope and barely hitting Kane because he wasn't high enough. RVD WASN'T HIGH ENOUGH FOR THE FIRST TIME IN HIS LIFE :lmao.

What? The ladder ISN'T made of chocolate? WHY AM I ONLY BEING TOLD THIS NOW, JIM? WHY?

Way to go, RVD. You just dropkicked Kane into the crowd. A PSYCHOPATHIC MONSTER WHO SETS PEOPLE ON FIRE. Right into the crowd. YOU HEARTLESS BASTARD!!!

MORE RVD STUPIDITY~! Rolling Thunder to Kane using a chair. Except the chair is on TOP of Kane so it hurts RVD too. He does that shit far too often lol.

:lmao at JR not realising that Kane MOVED from the Van Terminator attempt.

TOMBSTONE ON THE STEEL STEPS~!

Thank fuck it's done with. What a sloppy, shitty, spotty MESS.

*Rating: 1/4**
*CAL SCALE - 0*


*Triple H Vs Randy Orton Vs Goldberg Vs Shawn Michaels Vs Kevin Nash Vs Chris Jericho - World Heavyweight Championship Elimination Chamber Match*

Nash looks BADASS with his hair short and blonde/white lol. He lost a hair match to Jericho, as he needed to cut it for his upcoming part in the PUNISHER film (which is fucking awesome btw and hugely underrated. Get the extended version if you wanna check it out. Only the regular version was released outside of the US I think so I had to import it. Bluray versions anywhere are the regular version so fuck HD in this case)

Jericho and HBK to start things off!

Huge GOLDBERG chants, which confuse me because Ryback isn't in this match 8*D.

It was only 3 minutes between entrances in this one, right?

Orton is next out, and he's there to make sure HHH leaves with the belt!

:lmao Nash is next out and Orton BOTCHES GOING FACE FIRST INTO THE CHAMBER WALL :lmao. Seriously, Nash grabs his head, tries to throw him into the wall and Orton just falls down instead :lmao.

Everything before Nash came in was fine, nothing noteworthy as seen by the fact I wrote NOTHING lol, but fine nonetheless. However with BIG DADDY NASH in the match we can get someone coming in and crushing people, which is always cool to see in a match like this.

OMG NASH JUST ATTACKED SHAWN~!

SUPERKICK TO NASH~! Jericho falls into the cover and Nash is gone! LOLOLOL!!!

Next out is HHH! But before he can escape his pod, HBK superkicks him to hell! And it was pretty much just done because HHH is INJURED (tore his penis or something).

NASH gets up finally, and decides to Powerbomb everyone he sees! EVERYONE IS DOWN!

HBK tries to pin both Orton and Jericho, but they had too long to recover from the POWERBOMBS and nobody is eliminated. Gotta save some bodies for GOLDBERG after all!

Pretty fun punch spot with all 3 guys (HHH is still sleeping in his pod) just punching each other in the face in the middle of the ring.

GOLDBERG IS FREE~! EVERYONE GONNA FUCKING DIE NOW~!

Press Slam into a Spinebuster looks like it killed Orton. SPEAR just to make sure. Orton is DONE.

PRESS SLAM FROM INSIDE THE RING RIGHT INTO THE CHAIN WALL TO JERICHO~! Goldberg is mauling everyone :mark:.

SPEAR TO JERICHO THROUGH THE POD~!

That hurt Goldberg, allowing HBK to nail the elbow and the band begins to tune up and SPEAR~! JACKHAMMER~! HBK IS GONE~!

Poor Jericho, he's recovered enough from the POD SPEAR to get back in the ring, and he ends up taking another SPEAR~! JACKHAMMER~! JERICHO IS GONE~!

And then there was one. HHH is the last man standing, and Goldberg is gonna kill him :mark:.

Flair closing the pod door and holding it shut, protecting HHH is pretty sweet. Then Goldberg just fucking KICKS AND PUNCHES his way through the pod :mark:. HHH about to get raped in the pod!!!

Even HEEL LAWLER is talking about how HHH WAS a great champion, basically saying he's fucked and Goldberg is winning lol.

Goldberg sets up the SPEAR... and runs right into a fucking SLEDGEHAMMER SHOT!!! HHH pins him and retains the WHC .

Shocking finish to a SUPER FUCKING FUN match. I mean fuck me at the FUNNESS of this bad boy. Goldberg running through bitches in a confined space is just :mark:.

I do however have a problem with the finish. Goldberg was WHITE HOT at the time. HHH was INJURED. Goldberg would get the title a month later anyway. And yet they still decided to keep the belt with HHH. Didn't make that much sense to me. Surely Goldberg beating FIVE guys in the chamber would have been a better way to win the belt rather than JUST beating HHH one on one, right? Goldberg could have won here, then they could have giving HHH his rematch for the next PPV, with HHH claiming that Goldberg can't beat him one on one and without being inside the chamber or some shit, and stack the odds against the guy with EVOLUTION too and shit. Would have been fine. Instead HHH had to keep hold of the belt even though he was fucking INJURED and that kinda pisses me off tbh.

Oh well. Still uberfunawesome.

*Rating: ***1/2*
*CAL SCALE - 3*



*Overall CAL SCALE - 17*​


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I've actually got the Region 1 version of Summerslam 2003 as it was only $4 brand new lol so it was cheaper than Region 2, glad I got it now. Thanks Cal


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Splashed out and ordered the For All Mankind DVD as its currently 'reduced' on Fremantle.


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

If you notice in the Taker/A-Train match, when Undertaker knocks the ref it seems as though he 360 flips in slow motion, don't know if its just me. Also, when Taker makes his entrance to the ring, he's constantly eyeballing the ref, lol.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

That Chamber match is a lot of fun. I remember being annoyed at how quickly Nash was eliminated though. Mostly because I wanted to see him and Michaels have a lengthy interaction because of their history together and how long it had been since they were in a match against each other.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Merry Fitzmas To All said:


> That Chamber match is a lot of fun. I remember being annoyed at how quickly Nash was eliminated though. Mostly because I wanted to see him and Michaels have a lengthy interaction because of their history together and how long it had been since they were in a match against each other.


Yeah me too lol, I was actually sad to see Nash finally go.

Forgot about the HBK/Nash history when I was watching it too, didn't think about that aspect.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

That chamber match is one of the most underrated matches ever I think. 

I've heard ramblings about how it's the worst chamber next to D2D (which isn't even the worst), but I'd easily have it over NYR 2006 (Worst), D2D, SD 2008, RAW 2010, maybe BOTH in 2012, & the chamber match this year. So it's in the middle while many claim it to be near the worst.

REIGNS to get a Goldberg-like chamber performance :mark:?

REIGNS VS GOLDBERG :mark:?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

REIGNS in a Chamber match would be fucking awesome :mark:

I'm a bit ashamed to admit I've never seen SummerSlam 2003 - as in, like ANYTHING from that show. 

Chamber, Angle/BROCK and the US title 4-way sound super fun though.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

I remember that Coach heel turn very well. Just watching Shane get hit with a chair and the camera panning round expecting it to be a 6'6 newcomer or some shit, but then we see it's a goddamn backstage interview guy. Without a doubt the most bizarre heel turn I've ever seen.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Had the 2003 Chamber at *** on last watch, which was at least 4 months ago. Goldberg destroying people was pretty awesome, but that ending didn't do it for me. Naitch being Naitch though and keeping Hunter's door from opening up :lmao but Goldberg punching through the plex-i-glass :mark: JR was awesome in that match. May check it again.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

SS 03 overall quite surprised me. Didn't think it would end up with such a high CAL SCALE rating. Didn't remember much being THAT great outside of Lesnar/Angle lol.

Oh well, guess outside of Vengeance and No Mercy, it's all downhill from here . Thank fuck they didn't do a Rebellion in 03!


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Stocking Filler said:


> REIGNS in a Chamber match would be fucking awesome :mark:
> 
> I'm a bit ashamed to admit I've never seen SummerSlam 2003 - as in, like ANYTHING from that show.
> 
> Chamber, Angle/BROCK and the US title 4-way sound super fun though.


Sounds like we need a wrestling day :agree:


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Goddam it, there was a chamber match back in 2009, with Rey, Kane, Cena, Edge, Jericho and someone else, and Rey freakin' killed it, he stole the show. That hat-trick eliminating Cena and how everybody sold it via facial expressions was amazing. I think I had that match at ****1/2, but only seen it once, probably the best chamber match ever.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Rey killed it like 2 years in a row with Chamber matches. Guy was awesome in em. Wouldn't put either of them above the 05 chamber though. Pretty much untouchable, it is.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Sounds like we need a wrestling day :agree:


I'm down for that. 



Chismo said:


> Goddam it, there was a chamber match back in 2009, with Rey, Kane, Cena, Edge, Jericho and someone else, and Rey freakin' killed it, he stole the show. That hat-trick eliminating Cena and how everybody sold it via facial expressions was amazing. I think I had that match at ****1/2, but only seen it once, probably the best chamber match ever.


Hmm, I don't remember this at all. Sounds great. NYR05 is likely my favorite/best chamber. First chamber is up there as well.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

I also remember LOVING that Umaga chamber match, where he outfucked much "better wrestlers".


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Stocking Filler said:


> I'm down for that.


Anytime you wanna come down just hit us up 

I need to finish Judgment Day 04 today, been lagging.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

03 chamber is a nothing match, imotbhtbfimhoimo. Should be talking up that awesome McIntyre chamber that was brought up a few pages back. I actually thought everybody in that match had a decent role to play and did it OK. Even Kane and Barrett.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Before The Shield break up, I want to see a 3-on-3 Elimination Chamber match involving them and three other people (Cena/Punk/Bryan?). Closest thing we can get to War Games.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Honestly I've never thought about tag elimination chambers but I really want one now. Usually I don't like the gimmick because they're pretty much glorified three-ways and four-ways but that could work sooooo well.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Starting Armageddon 05 now, should be able to finish it tonight, then RR 04 review will be up once I finish one last SD!


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

Summerslam 1999

I'm a little skeptical about this show looking a the card but let's hope this delivers.


_Intercontinental and European Championship Match:_
*D'Lo Brown(c) w/Debra vs. Jeff Jarrett *

Debra was really distracting here. Any time the match would slow down there would be a chant directed at her, which put the guys in the match in a tough spot. The match was watchable but it was mostly D'Lo doing moves to get the crowd to pay attention to the match. The Mark Henry heel turn for no reason was also pretty funny. 
**3/4*


_Tag Turmoil:_
*Edge and Christian vs. Jeff and Matt Hardy w/Gangrel vs. Mideon and Viscera vs. Droz and Prine Albert vs. The APA (minus the PA) vs. Hardcore and Crash Holly*

One of the few times that Matt and Jeff wrestle as heels against Edge and Christian. They didn't get much time here but this was pretty great. Edge did really well as a hot tag and the Hardy's actually did a good job as heels. They did their normal offense as part of a control segment so that kept things interesting. The crowd really popped for the hot tag and once the pace picked up they were great. Again this match took place in 1999 and they had a spot that I was shocked by as I've never seen anything like it. The best counter ever to when Jeff does his thing where he runs across the guardrail. Tons of fun, I wish it went longer.

After the great Hardy's E&C encounter Edge and Christian proceed to wrestle as incredible underdogs and win the crowd over. They were getting some of the best pops of the night with their pinfalls and hot tags. Unfortunately Farooq and Bradshaw got the best of them and the crowd just deflated (and didn't get involved in the show again for a while). What really annoyed me is that the best didn't end with the underdogs who started things off falling to the monster team. Instead Crash and Hardcore came out and nobody gave a single fuck. 

Most of this match was really really good but the finish was terribly booked. It's probably the best tag team Turmoil match I've ever seen because they let a team win numerous falls and play underdogs which got a ton of fan support and really had me interested in the match. I just wish the booking at the end hadn't totally sucked.
****1/4* 

_Hardcore Championship Match:_
*Al Snow vs. The Big Boss Man(c)*

This was the precursor to their classic "Kennel in Hell" match as Al's dog was still alive at this time. This wasn't a particularly good match but at all but it was impressive how far away they got from the ring. Not only did they fight backstage, they left the arena, went outside, crossed the street, and went into a bar outside the arena. While that was amusing this was still a terrible match as they just walked around punching each other and occasionally used a weapon in a rather unimpressive way. 
*1/2**


_Women's Championship Match:_
*Ivory(c) vs. Torrie*

Honestly I didn't think Torrie was actually trained to wrestle. If think today's Divas are bad watch this match. 
*DUD*


_Lion's Den with Weapons Match:_
*Steve Blackman vs. Ken Shamrock*

WWE apparently didn't put a camera man on top of the cage so you have to watch this whole match through a shitty camera view outside the cage. The pacing is terrible, the weapons are pointless, the crowd doesn't care, and its boring. Want to know how Shamrock started a comeback? Blackman was kicking ass in a boring manner and he hits a DDT. Blackman delivered such a devastating DDT that it takes him forever to get up and Shamrock beats him to his feet. That's a comeback I see in $5 Wrestling. Fuck. 
*1/2**


_Love Her or Leave Her Greenich Street Fight:_
*Shane McMahon w/The Mean Street Posse vs. Test*

I was under the impression that this match was very different then what it turned out to be. It looked like Shane was going to try to win the match on his own as he fought Test straight up for a few minutes and it was a really impressive performance from Shane. But the Posse soon got involved and this went downhill for a while because Shane was again a cowardy heel and the Posse were too involved. When Shane hit his elbow drop onto the announce table things picked up and there was actually a really good face performance from Test where he tried to overcome the odds. I love a good babyface vs. the world segment so I loved the ending. Considering the collective talent of those involved this was much better then it had any right being.
***3/4* 


_WWF Tag Team Championship Match:_
*X-Pac and Kane (c) vs. The Undertaker and The Big Show w/Paul Bearer*

This isn't really X-Pac in this match. This is a 1-2-3 Kid match if I've ever seen one. Honestly it's not even worth talking about the other 3 guys in the match. It's not that they weren't good it's just that X-Pac out shined them all and gave as good an underdog performance as you are going to see. You knew he was totally out of his league but he kept fighting the whole time and made you want to root for him. I have no idea why this guy would ever be a heel. This event took place in X-Pac's home town so the crowd was really behind him. I wish he had been able to get in a little more offense or even make it feel like he had the chance to win but that wasn't really the case. When Kane was in the ring it felt like either side could win but not when X-Pac was in. But everything X-Pac did was great, I don't think he could have possibly done a better job at playing his role in this match. Had Undertaker or Big Show been willing to look a little weaker this could have been a classic. Instead it's just really good.
****1/2* 



*Billy Gunn w/A Random Fat Woman vs. The Rock*

Almost entirely forgettable. We get the classic Attitude Era brawl around the arena before some average stuff in the ring. I don't know why this is on a major PPV. I watched the match 5 minutes ago and remember nothing other then the crowd going crazy when the Rock and I also remember the Rock shoving Billy's face into the ass of the fat women he brought to the ring. 
****


_Triple Threat Match for the WWF Championship:_
*"Stone Cold" Steve Austin vs. Mankind vs. Triple H w/Chyna*
_Special Referee: Jesse Ventura _

This is a weird match. It was worked a lot like the current triple threats where one guy would be on the floor or otherwise out of the match for lengthy period of time. You also had all of the other things that always happen in triple threats, Foley and Triple H work together until one of them goes for a pin and then they start fighting each other. 

Foley is the weird part about this match. I think he only won the title because he was planning to retire and this was a "thank you" to him. That and they wanted to put the belt on Triple H without having him take it from Austin. Also it almost looked like they called the finish during the match. Shane runs into the ring and they have this arguement with Triple H and Ventura. Triple H then just walks away and chokes Foley in the corney for about a minute while Shane eats a Stunner and gets ejected. It honestly looks like Shane ran down with the finish, told HHH, who the told Foley. That would also explain why the finish was so awkward because Foley didn't really have a finisher that he beat people with via pinfall (also when you think about he really didn't win very often). 

Austin was also working injured as well so that didn't really help matters. I can't really call anything about this great other then a few big bumps from Foley. It just felt awkward most of the time. I won't call it terrible as it had a couple of great Foley bumps and it was a sort of fun brawl.
***1/4*​

This is not a good show by any means. There isn't much that's worth going out of your way to see. That and any cool moments that could have happened (like X-Pac or E&C getting great underdog wins didn't happen). This just further supports the idea that 1999 was a BAD year.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

As i own all the In Your House DVD's, thinking of putting togehter my own 'Best Of'. Came up with this:



> Bret Hart vs Hakushi - WWF: In Your House 1
> Shawn Michaels vs Jeff Jarrett - WWF: In Your House 2
> Diesel vs Sycho Sid (Lumberjack Match) - WWF In Your House 2
> Yokozuna & Owen Hart vs Lex Luger & British Bulldog - WWF: In Your House 2
> ...


Any missing? How was Diesel/Owen Hart?


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

PPV were not the WWE's strong points in '99 (or for the majority of the AE imo). The focus was on TV and tbh I struggled to get through most of the episodes of '99. God, such a terrible year is 1999. Yet somehow, it's their high rated year. Makes me wonder just how horrible WCW was that year.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Nice IYH list, although I would focus more on contraction than addition.

I cannot think of anything good in all of wrestling in 1999. Even international wrestling seemed to have taken a nosedive. What a putrid year.

OWEN HART vs. CHRIS BENOIT :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Nice IYH list, although I would focus more on contraction than addition.


Thought i covered most bases


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah, I think I stopped watching in 99. Got too ridiculous and was busy with basketball in high school. Came back late in 03 to BROCK dominating everyone.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

'03 was the year I stopped  I missed SD during its peak. The only recollection of I have of Lesnar was when he put Hogan in the bear bug. The fucked up this is, however, I didn't even know at the time that was Lesnar. I just saw some huge guy squeezing the shit outta Hogan. Gave me nightmares!


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

03 was the year I first discovered wrestling with the first match I ever saw being Brock Lesnar vs Kurt Angle ironman match from Smackdown. 

10 year anniversary now. :hb


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Chismo said:


> Goddam it, there was a chamber match back in 2009, with Rey, Kane, Cena, Edge, Jericho and someone else, and Rey freakin' killed it, he stole the show.


Was it Mike Knox? :lol

I know he was in one of the chambers that year. Somehow. Someway.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Before The Shield break up, I want to see a 3-on-3 Elimination Chamber match involving them and three other people (Cena/Punk/Bryan?). Closest thing we can get to War Games.


Honestly thought they were going to do that last year against Cena/Sheamus/Ryback. They probably considered it but couldn't work out a way to have Shield win.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

sharkboy22 said:


> PPV were not the WWE's strong points in '99 (or for the majority of the AE imo). The focus was on TV and tbh I struggled to get through most of the episodes of '99. God, such a terrible year is 1999. Yet somehow, it's their high rated year. Makes me wonder just how horrible WCW was that year.


WCW had way, way better wrestling than WWF in 1999. Wouldn't be surprised if I could find ten or fifteen WCW matches from '99 matches that beats WWF's MOTY.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Just look at Spring Stampede '99. Nit to mention some good Nitro matches like Benoit/Sting, Benoit/Bret, some more great cruiserweight matches too.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

elimination chamber match are one of the only gimmick match in wwe I actually like, I think you guys are talking about the raw 09 chamber


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The tag team division in 1999 for WCW was pretty damn good during the summer. You had Rey/Kidman, Jersey Triad, Saturn/Raven, Benoit/Malenko, and occasionally the West Texas ******** giving us good stuff. Specifically, Dean Malenko was killing it.

Spring Stampede is a beauty. Might be the most consistently good PPV franchise of WCW.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

WCW in 1999 is still pretty :mark:

Spring Stampede isn't the most consistent PPV in WCW's franchise if only thanks to how shit 1997's was. Tbf, DDP vs Savage is great, Mysterio vs Ultimo is really good, & Madusa vs Luna is solid. But that's it. Rest being some of the worst bits ever. Not Benoit vs Malenko. That one was just boring with an awful finish. The four way on that show. Jesus christ. Hard to sit through.

Now I'm wanting to think what is the best PPV franchise they had to offer. Maybe it still could be Spring Stampede. 1994 & 1999 is really all they need. However, for how good '99 is, that doesn't come close to how strong '94's is overall. _(Main event on '99 is pretty bad tbf, Disco vs Konnan, Riggs vs Whipwreck - you know, the crap)_ I am 99% confident that Uncensored is their worst string of PPVs though. It was iconic with giving us some of the most infamous wrestlecrap moments around. And then Regal vs Finlay happens in 1996. GO FIGURE.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

What would WWF 99 MOTY be then?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Hardy's vs Edge/Christian Tag Team Ladder Match at No Mercy. Or Rock/Austin at Backlash.

Also, certainly not a MOTY contender but I kind of enjoyed Vince/Hunter at Armageddon. It's fucking long, but they just kill each other, and it leads the the beginning of the greatest power couple in the history of the business.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

I'm not saying that the ladder match was bad or anything but holy shit was '99 that bad?

Btw, is that ladder match the one where the crowd is completely DEAD for the most of it? I seem to recall watching a E&C/Hardyz match from '99 and was in complete shock as to how silent the crowd was. Felt like I was watching Truth/Cena from CP.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Haven't seen much 1999 yet but from what I have, Rock/Mankind I Quit is my MOTY. I do wanna go through it, though. Not so much for the PPVs but the crash TV stuff and Rock being in his prime on the mic.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Crowd is pretty fine during the ladder match. 

Honestly haven't seen Rock/Mankind in YEARS. Might do that now. Haven't watched much wrestling the last couple days since I started 24. (Awesome show BTW.)


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

*Wrestlemania 14*

Tag Team Battle Royal - *DUD*
TAKA Michinoku vs. Mr. Aguila - ***3/4*
Owen Hart vs. HHH - ****
Goldust/Luna vs. Mero/Sable - ***
Rock vs. Ken Shamrock - ***
Mick Foley & Terry Funk vs. New Age Outlaws - ***1/2*
Undertaker vs. Kane - ****1/2*
Shawn Michaels vs. Steve Austin - *****

-LMFAO at Mark Henry staying in the battle royal five minutes after he was eliminated. That's all this trash filler opener is good for.

-Fun cruiserweight match here, but you could watch something superior to this on any Nitro. Lots of flashy moves and cool exchanges, but that's it.

-I've seen a lot of people call HHH/Owen a good match, but I just don't see it. The first half of the match was supposed to be HHH working on Owen's injured leg, but HHH's control segment was horrible. Very boring and slow. The second half of the match was even worse as they completely disregarded the legwork and Owen Hart no-sold everything and performed a heatless comeback segment. The Chyna stuff outside was also stupid. Just not a good match that went on way too long, and the ending sucked.

-I'm happy that this terrible feud is over here, but I am certainly not happy to watch this. I thought there would be some fun comedy and action here to compensate for the lack of talent in the ring. Instead I got a nothing match that wasn't fappable or entertaining. No wonder people underrated Goldust for so long; he wasn't allowed to do anything good during this time period. LMAO at Jim Ross calling Sable's kick a "martial arts kick". Yup, really boring and went on too long once again. I think people only like it because Sable did a powerbomb and a TKO.

-I liked their Royal Rumble match, but this did not have the cool ending or funny Rock gestures that the Royal Rumble match had. Instead Rock and Shamrock stunk up the place with restholds and structureless time filler wrestling. This is the most dead crowd that I have ever heard for a Rock match, and it happens to be at Mania. We randomly get to the ending sequence with no rhyme or reason. Ending of this should not belong on a PPV, much less Wrestlemania.

-Somehow I enjoyed the buildup to this match. Guess that's what happens when you have two of the greatest wrestlers ever on one team. Foley and Funk try their best to make something out of this match, but it did not evolve anywhere from garbage brawling with some funny stuff. Once again, a dead crowd for a Mania match. The dumpster-headbashing was cool and Terry Funk's mannerisms were hilarious, but there's nothing else of note.

-It's been over five years since I saw Taker/Kane, so I was excited to see this. My tastes haev changed so much since then, and unfortunately so has my opinion on this match. After the initial punches and clotheslines, the match started dragging. The rope-hung top rope clothesline and the electric chair drop was pretty cool. Other than that though, the part of the match where Kane takes over is really boring. Why do I still like this match? Well that's the beauty of The Undertaker. I love watching him fight other giants because Taker is so good at drawing sympathy from the crowd. Holy crap at that over-the-top-rope dive. The fact that Undertaker took such a huge risk to defeat Kane made him that much more awesome. He also made Kane look so powerful here. The last five minutes were when the pace quickened and things became really fun. Undertaker's quick punches and taunts are always a pleasure. And then all those convincing nearfalls from the tombstones. Only thing on this show worth a Lenny smiley. I'm really happy that this match didn't go into overbooking territory despite having such a big backstory, because the wrestling here was more to suffice. It just wasn't enough to suffice for a weak middle portion.

-It's absolutely amazing how two guys that should have been in hospitals at the moment were able to wrestle a lengthy Mania match. If you took away all the "non-wrestling" stuff from this match, you would only get a typical Attitude Era main event. But even though it was unnecessarily long, this match was still fun in many moments. All the stuff that happened outside the ring is skippable, but everything that happens in the end should be marveled at. When douchebag Shawn flicked off the crowd only for Austin to go crazy on him, I marked out. I guess that's worth another Lenny smiley. Legwork was nice but it didn't lead to much and like every match in this time period, it was eventually no-sold. Nice match, but it's more important for its historical value than for its work.

So far this is the best PPV of 1998, but it's still not that good. A lot of people talk about how great this Wrestlemania is, with some even saying that it's the first truly "great" one, but I only got a Wrestlemania vibe in this PPV for the last two matches. Every Mania from 17 to now is better.

Overall score: Two Lenny smileys :lenny :lenny


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

I think I may have seen Rock/Mankind once but it was so long ago.

Also, I've tried watching '99 RAW....TWICE! On both occasions I ended up just deleting the pack off my computer. Honestly, it's not even a good year storyline wise. The Corporation/Ministry/Corporate Ministry is all one big clusterfuck. The only thing I really enjoyed was Mankind's win. DAT POP when Austin's music hits :mark:

I dunno, I just freaking hate that year :cussin:


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> elimination chamber match are one of the only gimmick match in wwe I actually like, I think you guys are talking about the raw 09 chamber


LMS deserves love too.

Speaking of which, what's the last one of those WWE did? They should do another one soon, but please not Cena/Orton.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

LMS is hit or miss. Either they're classics, or they're forced epics. Last one was Cena/Ryback.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

funnyfaces1 said:


> LMS is hit or miss. Either they're classics, or they're forced epics. Last one was Cena/Ryback.


GOD! WHY DID YOU HAVE TO REMIND ME?

Here i was, rattling my brain trying to remember the last LMS match WWE did and you just had to remind me that Ryback/Cena existed.

Goddammit, I'm going in my bed.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

LMS is probably the one gimmick match Orton and Cena have not had. I'm sure it would have been epic if they had that at No Mercy 2007 back when Orton always delivered and Cena was more hit than miss the whole year. 

At least we got the HHH/Orton classic instead.


----------



## KingLobos (Apr 10, 2013)

About LMS, I find it funny how people rag on the Cena Ryback match, and say it's one of the worst endings of all time. 

When they ripped off the ending of the Rock Mankind LMS match from St. Valentine's Day Massacre. Which many think is actually superior to their I quit match. In any case, both Rock/ Mankind matches are good, and the Cena/Ryback one did suck, but it wasn't because of the ending, as proven by the Rock Mankind match......with the same ending.


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

Been watching Nitros/PPVs from WCW in '99 (stopped watching WCW after HH '98), I'm up to the night after Road Wild and so far its been...ok.

These are the only matches that stood out for me so far:
(There are things I've been unable to find and things I haven't seen yet)

Mysterio,Kidman/Malenko,Benoit (Nitro)
Whipwreck/Kidman (Uncensored)
Hogan,Nash,Steiner/Flair,Mongo,Benoit (Nitro)
Hak/Raven/Bigelow (Uncensored) *right now THE best match of 99 so far*
Blitzkrieg/Mysterious (Nitro)
Hogan/Flair (Super brawl)
Hogan,Sting,Goldberg/Nash,Sid,Steiner (Nitro)
Goldberg/Nash (S Stampede)
Juventud/Kidman (Nitro)
Raven,Saturn/Mysterious,Kidman/Malenko/Benoit (Slamboree)

Flair as pres of WCW was awesome, the top person I looked forward to seeing.
One thing that bugs me is a lot of partnerships aren't explained.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Mankind vs The Rock - I Quit Match - Royal Rumble 1999

Manking fucking CARRIED the build to this match. I think I get why Cal hates Rock so much. Mankind's promos and interviews all had substance, while Rock just used catchphrase after catchphrase. Amazing how different things are when you go back and watch them as an adult. Same with the pre-match interview with Rock. "Ya-da ya-da roody poo ya-da ya-da Jabroni Drive ya-da ya-da most electrifying man in sports entertainment". As much as Foley is loved, part of me wonders if he is actually underrated as a talker.

Anyways, match is fine. The ending is the best part for me, with Mick refusing to stay down, saying "You'll have to kill me". Bit much I think with your family at ringside, but whatever. This match on the whole just doesn't do it for me. Amazing though that Rock would be a face four months later.


----------



## KingLobos (Apr 10, 2013)

HollyJollyHelmsley said:


> Mankind vs The Rock - I Quit Match - Royal Rumble 1999
> 
> Manking fucking CARRIED the build to this match. I think I get why Cal hates Rock so much. Mankind's promos and interviews all had substance, while Rock just used catchphrase after catchphrase. Amazing how different things are when you go back and watch them as an adult. Same with the pre-match interview with Rock. "Ya-da ya-da roody poo ya-da ya-da Jabroni Drive ya-da ya-da most electrifying man in sports entertainment". As much as Foley is loved, part of me wonders if he is actually underrated as a talker.
> 
> Anyways, match is fine. The ending is the best part for me, with Mick refusing to stay down, saying "You'll have to kill me". Bit much I think with your family at ringside, but whatever. This match on the whole just doesn't do it for me. *Amazing though that Rock would be a face four months later.*


It is, but he really was a face in name and intentions only. He was still the same cocky arrogant character for the most part. Around the time when Austin leaves and near the beginning of 2000 is when he really starts becoming the goody two shoes face that we know today.

More surprising is how quickly HHH turned from being a fan favorite DX member to the GOAT heel.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

True. He could build a match, though. I've just been thinking about his feuds with Austin/Trips/Mankind, and DAMN. Whatever combination of those four guys just created so much gold. The quality of the Trips/Austin singles matches are up for debate, but everything is so terrific. Oh, then the build of Rock/Brock, and Rock/Hogan I and II. 

I think part of it is that the guys had much more freedom with which to work. Don't know if promos were written verbatim at all, but I imagine your top guys didn't need much help. This goes for Austin/Rock/Taker/Foley/Trips. Jericho probably also falls into that boat. 

Kind of some random thoughts, but watching the video package for Rock/Mankind made me think about BUILDS, which are so, so important.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> LMS is hit or miss. Either they're classics, or they're forced epics. Last one was Cena/Ryback.


The output is definitely in favor of hits though isn't it? I'm not sure because I tend to draw some serious blanks when it comes wrestling these days. HHH/Jericho, Cena/Umaga, HHH/Flair, HHH/Orton, Taker/Show and Cena/Batista are enough for me to be confident that it's in my top 2 WWE gimmicks. Ladder is more hit or miss imo. 



sharkboy22 said:


> GOD! WHY DID YOU HAVE TO REMIND ME?
> 
> Here i was, rattling my brain trying to remember the last LMS match WWE did and you just had to remind me that Ryback/Cena existed.
> 
> Goddammit, I'm going in my bed.


Me too. I was thinking there hasn't been one this year. Didn't see Cena/Ryback. I'm guessing I should keep it that way.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

1999 Rock was very entertaining because he was essentially a face that thought he was a heel. Arrogant Rock rules, but once the millennium changed, he became Cena Rock.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

SaviorBeeRad™ said:


> What would WWF 99 MOTY be then?


Not sure what mine'd be. Not *very* big on either Rock/Austin, the No Mercy ladder match, or any Rock/Mankind. Need to see this Taker/Shamrock one day. I guess it'd be Rock/Austin at Backlash because I do like that one.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

SaviorBeeRad™ said:


> What would WWF 99 MOTY be then?


Contenders:

Mankind vs Rock ~ Halftime Heat
Al Snow vs Bob Holly ~ St. Valentine's Day Massacre
Al Snow vs Bob Holly ~ Backlash
Mankind vs Big Show ~ Backlash
Undertaker vs Shamrock ~ Backlash
Austin vs Rock ~ Backlash
Undertaker vs Austin ~ Fully Loaded
Tag Team Turmoil ~ SummerSlam
Undertaker & Big Show vs Kane & X-Pac ~ SummerSlam
Hardys vs Edge & Christian ~ No Mercy

Don't remember Mankind vs Rock from Rumble well enough. Same goes for the tag team Buried Alive match. Not sure anything else left could qualify. Undertaker vs Austin on TV for the strap was solid. As was Mankind vs Rock in January. It's really the same few dudes who only made the most out of anything in 1999. And most were only entertaining brawls. Oh, WWF 1999...


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Contenders:
> 
> Mankind vs Rock ~ Halftime Heat
> Al Snow vs Bob Holly ~ St. Valentine's Day Massacre
> ...


You left out Bossman/Snow from SummerSlam :faint:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Also left out Snow vs Holly vs Gunn from WM too. But those may not make my top ten on the year overall. They're just a total blast to watch. Still in the upper part of goodness circa 1999. That's what matters.

Al Snow :mark:


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

That Kennel From Hell match :cornette:cornette:cornette


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

-*****

Holy crap.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

But the commentary in that match is :lenny :lenny :lenny :lenny :lenny


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Naturally.

_"We just witnessed the first - and probably last - Kennel From Hell match" (insert "!" to indicate forced excitement after a horrible match)_


----------



## Banjo (Sep 30, 2005)

Choke2Death said:


> LMS is probably the one gimmick match Orton and Cena have not had. I'm sure it would have been epic if they had that at No Mercy 2007 back when Orton always delivered and Cena was more hit than miss the whole year.


Do you think TLC 2013 will be a one and done affair? It shouldn't be.

John Cena vs. Randy Orton in a Last Man Standing match for the Unified WWE Championship is a perfect main event for the Royal Rumble!


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

Watched RAW last night. Last segment was so much fun.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Finished the TOP 100 MATCHES OF THE DECADE (2000'S) countdown this morning elsewhere, so I'll be posting the full list here at some point later today for anyone interested. Lots of people will disagree .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I think I'll check this sucker out.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Surely Melina vs. Alicia Fox will be in the top 10 of the 2000's


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

#32, pretty shocked at the placement. Felt for sure it would make top 5 8*D.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

Melina :mark:

I would so watch one of her matches with Mickie James right now.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

If Cal actually watched Divas matches, I'd expect more Alicia Fox matches to pop up on the list than Rock matches, tbhayley.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'd rather watch a Rock match than anything from Alicia Fox.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cal, I want you to meet facetious social commentary. It spices things up. For the better.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Cody, I want you to meet girls of legal age. It keeps you out of jail. For the best.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

There he is.


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

Pretty sure everyone that participated in the list knows what number 1 is. I can't see it yet because my phone is gay but I'm pretty sure. I'm happy with it if it is.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Bubz said:


> Pretty sure everyone that participated in the list knows what number 1 is. I can't see it yet because my phone is gay but I'm pretty sure. I'm happy with it if it is.


Ha. Everyone that's commented on it so far seems pretty surprised .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm just annoyed at myself for not being a part of the list. _(I know why though)_ Reading something so greatly comprehensible towards professional wrestling and I didn't have anything to do with it...that leaves me feeling like I should be dead.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Didn't know a list was being created, but I look forward to reading it.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I kinda wish I stuck with it too... but oh well. I'm just being punished for it by having the list fuck up numerous times .

I ain't got time for no best of the decade list anyway. GOTTA WATCH ME SOME WWF PPVS INSTEAD LOL. WWF/E Poll was so damn easy. I miss that. WE SHOULD RE-DO IT. 

Was thinking of doing another 2003 PPV ramble today. What's the least sucky out of:

No Way Out
Insurrextion
Backlash
Judgment Day
Bad Blood
Unforgiven
Survivor Series
Armageddon

?

Saving Vengeance and No Mercy until roughly half way through and then at the end so I can break up the shite with 2 shows I know I enjoy .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Watch NWO so you can see the terrific Undertaker vs Big Show match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I warn you though, I've never been a big fan of it.

Also... I really don't wanna watch NWO right now . My brain hurts remembering some of the matches on the show :lmao. This is a show I need to save to watch right before I watch Vengeance or No Mercy so I can recover from it quickly .


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

*NOTORIOUSTCG's REVIEW OF THE STREAK*
PART 3

*11 – 0 
Wrestlemania XIX vs. The Big Show & A-Train*

Tag match which was turned into a handicap match, thank god because when an Australian doesn’t care about Nathan Jones, who will. Still annoys me that it wasn’t a straight up singles match like the rest of the streak. Undertaker does a leap frog over A-Train which is something I’ve rarely seen. Undertaker is in real great shape here, might have to watch some more Taker matches from 2003. Taker wins after help from Nathan Jones. It’s not actually as bad as I remember, it’s a fun match.

*Rating: **1/2
Cal Scale: 1

12 – 0
Wrestlemania XX vs. Kane*

What an Entrance, GOAT return. “YOU’RE NO SON OF MINE.” Probably my favourite Taker moment, because I started watching in 2004 shortly after the Great American Bash, and instantly Taker became my favourite as this version. I don’t care about the small capacity, Wrestlemania 30 should be at the Garden. The referee being shit scared of Taker is great. That sit up. Crowd pops like crazy for the Tombstone, and that’s it. Obviously this doesn’t touch the Wrestlemania 14 match but it’s still a great moment. 

*Rating: **1/2
Cal Scale: 1

13 – 0
Wrestlemania XXI vs. Randy Orton*

Ohh Boy, am I excited to watch this again, haven’t watched it in about a year. Taker gliding to the ring is pretty awesome. Orton should have entered before Taker though, the intimidation doesn’t quite work if the person in the back isn’t watching, you know. Orton gets fucking killed by Old School as he turns the wrong way. About 10 minutes in and this is all kinds of good. Taker whips out the old Dragon Sleeper, which personally is a move I love. Is the Last Ride a botch? If it is they play it off perfectly. GOAT reversal into the RKO, honestly thought that was it when I watched it at the time. The Tombstone reversal is great as well, and that’s it folks. This is a great match, really, really good. For me off my head it’s in Orton’s top 3 matches, and one of Taker’s better ones at Mania, and best at this stage, just beating the Kane match from 14.

*Rating: ****1/2
Cal Scale: 7

14 – 0
Wrestlemania XXII vs. Mark Henry*

Just think this could have been Angle or Benoit at Mania, and would be a guaranteed ****1/2+ match. Instead we get Henry in a casket match. As I remember Henry wasn’t as badass as he is now. Henry doesn’t even have Three 6 Mafia, or maybe this is a DVD edit. Mark Henry 2013 > Mark Henry 2006. Henry no selling the steel steps to the head is pretty cool. Undertaker reaching from the casket to grab Henry’s throat looks great. Henry pins Taker, either selling the fact he’s never been in a casket match, or because he forgot. That over the top rope dive over the casket is great, then he delivers a Tombstone and rolls him into the Casket. The only wrestling moves Taker uses in this match are the Last Ride, the over the top rope dive and the Tombstone. It is what it is I guess.

*Rating: **1/4
Cal Scale: 1

15 – 0
Wrestlemania XXIII vs. Batista *

This starts the run of 6 consecutive ****+ . Teddy introduces the competitors, surprised it didn’t end up as a straight up Tag Team Match, Playas. I was never high on Batista, and other than his series against Taker and the Hell in a Cell with Triple H, I don’t care much for him. Batista is Booed in his entrance, Batista doesn’t respect the Undertaker, fuck him. That Entrance, the silhouette of Taker is GOAT. The stage looks great, one of the better Mania ones. Taker going knees first into the steps is something I really like, rather than the shoulder first. The Powerslam through the table is something that I forgot but damn it looks impressive. JBL is GOATing on commentary, wish he cared this much now. Great exchange of signature and finishing moves. How good is little Naitch handing over the title and then bolting from the ring! Taker winning the title 10 years after he won it the first time at Mania is neat, imagine if he wins the title at Wrestlemania 33 and retires 25 – 0, would be great as long as he still keeps producing MOTY candidates and wants to.

*Rating: ****1/4
Cal Scale: 6

16 – 0
Wrestlemania XXIV vs. Edge*

First of the retro outfits which is sick, wonder if he will ever go back to his original outfit, maybe for his last match. I think he raised from the floor, but all the cameraman wanted to film was smoke. This feud went for over a year, it started just after Backlash 2007 and ended at Summerslam 2008 Crowd is kind of dead, and I don’t blame them after having to endure this PPV which only average or better matches were the JBL/Finlay brawl, Flair/Michaels and this match. The crowd starts to wake up after the Over the Top Rope dive. Coach on commentary, I’d rather Mike Adamle. Taker reverses a half crab into a pin, which is a good reversal and almost un-Undertaker-like. Taker reverses Edge’s Tombstone into his own, which leads to the GOAT run to the ring, the slide and everything was perfect. The two spears leading into the Hell’s Gate is great, when I was watching this live I really thought the streak was over after the second one. Great ending to the PPV as well. Like this more than the Batista match, and about the same as the Orton match.

*Rating: ****1/2
Cal Scale: 7*

*Matches in order from Best to Worst:* (Cal Scale)
vs. Randy Orton @ Wrestlemania XXI (7)
vs. Edge @ Wrestlemania XXIV (7)
vs. Kane @ Wrestlemania XIV (7)
vs. Batista @ Wrestlemania XXIII (6)
vs. Ric Flair @ Wrestlemania XVIII (5)
vs. Triple H @ Wrestlemania XVII (4)
vs. Diesel @ Wrestlemania XII (3)
vs. Kane @ Wrestlemania XX (1)
vs. The Big Show and A-Train @ Wrestlemania XIX (1)
vs. Mark Henry @ Wrestlemania XXII (1)
vs. Psycho Sid @ Wrestlemania XIII (1)
vs. Jake Roberts @ Wrestlemania VIII (0.5)
vs. Jimmy Snuka @ Wrestlemania VII (0.5)
vs. The Big Boss Man @ Wrestlemania XV (0)
vs. King King Bundy @ Wrestlemania XI (0)
vs. Giant Gonzales @ Wrestlemania IX (0)

​


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> I warn you though, I've never been a big fan of it.
> 
> Also... I really don't wanna watch NWO right now . My brain hurts remembering some of the matches on the show :lmao. This is a show I need to save to watch right before I watch Vengeance or No Mercy so I can recover from it quickly .


:hayley2

Only matches I'd call shit on there are Steiner vs Trips & Rock vs Hogan. They're big offenders, but I find the show to be good for the majority.

Then jump on Backlash. You still have a shitty Rock match to go through either way, haha.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Damn Rock and his shitty matches!!!


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Damn Rock and his shitty matches!!!


Finally someone else who doesn't care that much about the Rock. I never watched him in his prime but re-watched some of his old matches and to me he's just meh.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm more mad that I don't think anything of his matches vs Undertaker. How does Taker not get the most out of you? Something is a miss.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I still enjoyed watching it cos hey, its Taker, but it will always piss me off how they wasted Taker at WM19. Even a straight singles with Show would have been better I suppose.

But then putting him in a tag match with someone who wasn't ready, then at the last minute finally realising that fact and making ut handicapped.

Fuck sake.


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> :hayley2
> 
> Only matches I'd call shit on there are Steiner vs Trips & Rock vs Hogan. They're big offenders, but I find the show to be good for the majority.
> 
> Then jump on Backlash. You still have a shitty Rock match to go through either way, haha.


Didn't remember seeing Rock/Goldberg originally so I watched it a month ago.
Can honestly say it was one of the most disappointing big matches i've seen.
Same thing goes for Rock/Lesnar.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The KOTR '99 & NWO '02 matches are plenty watchable, but I don't think much of 'em. Which is the downer.

I'm bigger on the Handicap match from WM 19, tbhayley. Although I believe I'm the biggest advocate of that match on this place. Feels like it.

Brock vs Rock is amazing.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I like most Rock/Undertaker matches .

Like the handicap from WM 19 too, but likely not as much as Cody.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Goldberg's debut and they make him look, IMO, weak from the offset. I know yeah he's in there with The Rock and all that, but still. 

Rock/Brock is still all kinds of good though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's real good to me. Nicely structured and all that jazz. Never saw a flaw behind it. It brought back the tombstone to WM - I loved how he won by that during a some of his ABA matches at Mania - so that's another plus.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well to be fair hitting a LAST RIDE on guys like ALBERT wouldn't be the easiest thing to do, so the TOMBSTONE was needed now and then lol.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

I don't hate the Rock/Taker matches but like Cody, surely if Taker who can drag Batista to a good match, can't make you look a million bucks then something is missing. 

Like I said the WM 19 match is fun, and if it wasn't a Mania I'd have no problem with it at all. It just leaves that sour taste in your mouth being on the Streak, like the DQ at WM 9.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Well to be fair hitting a LAST RIDE on guys like ALBERT wouldn't be the easiest thing to do, so the TOMBSTONE was needed now and then lol.


Lets not choose to look at it like that...

TOMBSTONE

-----------

Undertaker vs Gonzales can be the anomaly in regards to the finish. The streak wasn't close to being his "thing" all those years ago. So having one of the matches not be a clean victory doesn't hinder it too much for myself. Forgivable, to say the least. I'm more or less glad the match isn't too bad. I have fun with it. Fun with Giant Gonzales. Let it sink in.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

NotoriousTCG said:


> Finally someone else who doesn't care that much about the Rock. I never watched him in his prime but re-watched some of his old matches and to me he's just meh.


lol @ finally bro.

You act like its a rare thing or something. Plenty of people across this forum that doesn't like the dude.



bme said:


> Didn't remember seeing Rock/Goldberg originally so I watched it a month ago.
> Can honestly say it was one of the most disappointing big matches i've seen.
> Same thing goes for Rock/Lesnar.


Rock/Hogan & Goldberg were pretty bad. Only good thing was seeing Rock doing some funny shit in the match under his Hollywood persona. Nothing that makes the actual match better though.

However, Rock/Brock was great.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I always thought the Jericho/Rock matches, particularly the PPV trilogy & the 10/30/00 match (I THINK?) ruled.

Just a situation where the chemistry is spot on between two guys regardless of talent level. OOMPH :mark:.

EDIT: HOLD ON A MINUTE MOTHERFUCKER. ROCK VS BROCK RULES. COME @ ME BRO.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

That's a fair way to look at it, atleast Taker came out afterwards and got the better of him I guess. 

I actually wonder when the streak became a 'thing. The commentators mention it a few times early on, and the first time Taker acknowledged it was after the Flair match. But I wonder when Vince and co. Said fuck it, let's run with the Streak


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm big on all the Rock vs Jericho matches. Think they're pretty great.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Rock/Jericho had 2 really good PPV matches (No Mercy 01 and RR 02)... but their Vengeance 01 match is utter puke. I've had better matches with wrestling toys when I was a kid. RANDY SAVAGE VS UNDERTAKER NO RING MATCH was GOAT.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

WrestlingforEverII said:


> lol @ finally bro.
> 
> You act like its a rare thing or something. Plenty of people across this forum that doesn't like the dude.


I've seen a lot of people shit on his recent run and I don't blame that at all, but hardly ever see anything bad said about him from before he started making movies.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

NotoriousTCG said:


> That's a fair way to look at it, atleast Taker came out afterwards and got the better of him I guess.
> 
> I actually wonder when the streak became a 'thing. The commentators mention it a few times early on, and the first time Taker acknowledged it was after the Flair match. But I wonder when Vince and co. Said fuck it, let's run with the Streak


Honestly believe it was one of those magical things that kind of was acknowledged over night. Out of nowhere they realized Taker was undefeated at WM and rolled with it. Could always be wrong. This is purely the scenario I feel of how it went down.



CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Rock/Jericho had 2 really good PPV matches (No Mercy 01 and RR 02)... but their Vengeance 01 match is utter puke. I've had better matches with wrestling toys when I was a kid. RANDY SAVAGE VS UNDERTAKER NO RING MATCH was GOAT.


Best insult I've ever heard.


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Jericho/Rock is pretty good all around. From matches to promos. Two have had some great moments together, Ill give them that. No secret Jericho's always been big on his time with Rock.



NotoriousTCG said:


> I've seen a lot of people shit on his recent run and I don't blame that at all, but hardly ever see anything bad said about him from before he started making movies.


Hmm. Not to me. Seen him get some flack from that time period too. Hey, it happens. No one is perfect. Rock's had some shit times. They all do.

Someone should review Top 5 Shit matches from some of the all time greats. Would be great.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

JR was doing research for commentary for WM 17 and realised that Undertaker was undefeated at that event and BOOM. All went from there. JR talked about it on some sport podcast he did a couple of years ago.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Honestly believe it was one of those magical things that kind of was acknowledged over night. Out of nowhere they realized Taker was undefeated at WM and rolled with it. Could always be wrong. This is purely the scenario I feel of how it went down.


It's funny how in a world where everything is plotted out and planned, that the (arguably) biggest accomplishment in the business and the most anticipated match each year is based on something that was derived by pure luck.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Jericho considers Rock to be one of his best opponents ever and credits Rock to be one of the only guys to "carry" him to a great match during Jericho's shit run at the beginning of the company, that's pretty fucking high praise especially coming from a guy that's so respected amongst his peers like Jericho is. 

Anywhoways WWE has an INSANE deal on DVDs today. Like, I'm picking up 150 dollars worth or something because it's THAT good. Survivor Series Anthology VOL 1 for 8 bucks? THE FUCK :mark: :mark:?


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Undertaker vs Gonzales can be the anomaly in regards to the finish. The streak wasn't close to being his "thing" all those years ago. So having one of the matches not be a clean victory doesn't hinder it too much for myself. Forgivable, to say the least. I'm more or less glad the match isn't too bad. I have fun with it. Fun with Giant Gonzales. Let it sink in.


I like that match to, saw a tribute video of it years ago and for a while was searching for it online.
Don't like their last rights match though, weird.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Last Rites match? WHAT?

That sounds like something only TNA could come up with 8*D.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

What what match? Wasn't it a Rest in Peace match?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Think people forget Taker/Gonzales had a rematch at Summerslam.  Seems to slip under the radar...


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I know OF the match and nothing more. Never gone out of my way to watch it strangely enough .


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

It's a "Rest in Piece" match, yeah.

Turns out TNA ACTUALLY FUCKING DID SOMETHING CALLED A LAST RITES MATCH. WHAT?!?!?!?!?!

THAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED? & RUSSO BOOKED IT? :lol :lol :lol :lol


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> What what match? Wasn't it a Rest in Peace match?


Oops yeah it was a rest in peace match




MERRY MUTHAPHUCKKIN CHRISTMAS said:


> It's a "Rest in Piece" match, yeah.
> 
> Turns out TNA ACTUALLY FUCKING DID SOMETHING CALLED A LAST RITES MATCH. WHAT?!?!?!?!?!
> 
> THAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED? & RUSSO BOOKED IT? :lol :lol :lol :lol


Lmao was actually gonna ask you if you've seen it.
It was so bad and the fans in attendance crapped on it.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> I know OF the match and nothing more. Never gone out of my way to watch it strangely enough .


This. But something tells me Taker wins with a diving clothesline off the top rope, for some reason I can see it.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

MERRY MUTHAPHUCKKIN CHRISTMAS said:


> It's a "Rest in Piece" match, yeah.
> 
> Turns out TNA ACTUALLY FUCKING DID SOMETHING CALLED A LAST RITES MATCH. WHAT?!?!?!?!?!
> 
> THAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED? & RUSSO BOOKED IT? :lol :lol :lol :lol


Yeah, im sure Sting/Abyss had one.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Russo denies having any part in that match. Methinks he is talking bollacks .


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Rock and Jericho had impeccable chemistry, but I faintly recall them having one of the worst matches I have ever seen in television some time in 1999.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Nothing makes me laugh like the high pitched "Rest in Peace" chants in Taker's old matches.



CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> I kinda wish I stuck with it too... but oh well. I'm just being punished for it by having the list fuck up numerous times .
> 
> I ain't got time for no best of the decade list anyway. GOTTA WATCH ME SOME WWF PPVS INSTEAD LOL. WWF/E Poll was so damn easy. I miss that. WE SHOULD RE-DO IT.
> 
> ...


Backlash, Survivor Series and maybe Armageddon are the watchable events. Don't recall Unforgiven being too bad either. Bad Blood and Judgment Day (bar ladder match and main event) are crap, though.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Rock and Jericho had impeccable chemistry, but I faintly recall them having one of the worst matches I have ever seen in television some time in 1999.


LMAO, isn't that the match Jericho talks about in his book? Saying the whole thing went wrong because they went into the crowd and he threw some guy's "drink" in Rock's face. He thought it was water but it turned out to be something gross. :lol


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

ROCK/GOLDBERG IS GOOD YOU HUMAN VOMIT BAGS.



"Last Rites" sounds like it would have been a Chris Daniels match given that's his finisher and half of his gimmick of whatever. Then again this is TNA so it was probably Matt Morgan v. Gail Kim or something.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

From March 18th 2012 to November 7th 2013, a bunch of people I like more than you guys put together individual top 100 matches of the decade for 2000 to 2009. I crapped out early on and gave up because my brain decided I wasn't allowed to have fun watching wrestling for about a year, so I didn't put my own list together. Instead I just compiled everyone else's list into one definitive list, giving matches points based on their placement (101 points for #1 placement, 100 for #2 etc down to 1 point for #100). I had so many fucking problems because some cunts couldn't format their damn list right or look up correct dates combined with the fact I missed obvious shit too... but eventually the damn thing got done. Since then I've been doing a countdown, revealing so many matches per day. Today I revealed the top 5. So with that done, here is the entire list:



Spoiler: 332-101



=328	The Undertaker Vs Batista - Backlash 2007 - 04/29/07 - 1 Point
=328	Roderick Strong vs Rocky Romero - PWG All Star Weekend 5 Night 1 04/07/07 - 1 Point
=328	Rikishi & Too Cool vs. Kurt Angle, Edge & Christian (WWF Judgment Day; 05/21/00) - 1 Point
=328	Necro Butcher v Toby Klein (IWA-MS, King of the Deathmatch, 06/25/04) - 1 Point
=328	Evolution vs Chris Benoit, Chris Jericho & Edge, WWE RAW (06/14/04) - 1 Point
=326	Ultimo Dragon & Jushin Liger vs Chris Sabin & Alex Shelley - UWA – 05/25/07 - 2 Points
=326	Fuerza Guerrera, Blue Panther & El Signo v Mr. Niebla, Safari & Olimpico (CMLL, 03/30/01) - 2 Points
=324	Jerry Lawler vs. The Brian Kendrick 07/20/09 - 3 Points
=324	Daisuke Ikeda & Takeshi Ono v Manabu Suruga & Takahiro Oba (FUTEN, 04/09/09) - 3 Points
=321	William Regal vs. Tajiri 11/01/01 - 4 Points
=321	MECHA MUMMY Vs Minoru Suzuki - THE REMATCH – 05/04/09 - 4 Points
=321	John Cena vs Edge vs Rey Mysterio vs Chris Jericho vs Kane vs Mike Knox - Elimination Chamber - WWE No Way Out 02/15/09 - 4 Points
=317	MsChif vs. Amazing Kong (SHIMMER; 04/7/07) - 5 Points
=317	Mariko Yoshida vs. Megumi Fujii, ARSION (05/24/03) - 5 Points
=317	CM Punk Vs Tracy Smother vs Sabu (W/ Alfonso and The Insane Clown Posse - IWA Mid South – 09/08/01 - 5 Points
=317	Bret Kikuhart vs. Shawn Antonio Honda Michaels 07/09/09 - 5 Points
=314	Matt Sydal vs Austin Aries - IWA:MS 06/11/04 - 6 Points
=314	Kendrick/Young Bucks vs. CIMA/Motor City Machine Guns 09/04/09 - 6 Points
=314	Bryan Danielson vs. AJ Styles vs. Samoa Joe (IWA:MS; 09/18/04) - 6 Points
313	Rocky Romero vs. Alex Shelley 03/24/07 - 7 Points
=310	Spanky vs. Jack Evans 03/12/05 - 8 Points
=310	Erick Stevens vs. Roderick Strong (FIP; Redefined; 02/16/08) - 8 Points
=310	10 Man WCW Vs WWF - WWF Invasion – 07/22/01 - 8 Points
=307	Undertaker Vs Jeff Hardy - Ladder Match – Raw – 07/01/02 - 9 Points
=307	Kenta Kobashi, Tamon Honda, KENTA & Naomichi Marufuji vs Jun Akiyama, Akitoshi Saito, Yoshinobu Kanemaru & Makoto Hashi - NOAH 08/23/03 - 9 Points
=307	Doug Williams vs. Christopher Daniels 03/22/03 - 9 Points
=304	Shinya Hashimoto & Naoya Ogawa v Hiroyoshi Tenzan & Scott Norton (New Japan, 05/02/02) - 10 Points
=304	El Generico vs PAC - PWG All Star Weekend 4 Night 11/18/06 - 10 Points
=304	Bryan Danielson vs Austin Aries (ROH Take No Prisoners 03/16/08) - 10 Points
=300	London/Kendrick vs. Regal/Taylor 01/22/07 - 11 Points
=300	Koji Kanemoto v Hayato Jr. Fujita (New Japan, 12/22/09) - 11 Points
=300	Finlay vs Rey Mysterio, WWE Smackdown (09/11/07) - 11 Points
=300	Charlie Haas & Shelton Benjamin vs Rey Mysterio & Billy Kidman - WWE Vengeance 07/27/03 - 11 Points
=295	Rey Mysterio v Jamie Noble (WWE Velocity, 05/01/04) - 13 Points
=295	Nigel McGuinness vs Samoa Joe - ROH Fifth Year Festival: Liverpool 03/03/06 - 13 Points
=295	***** Navarro vs El Engendro, NWG (02/16/03) - 13 Points
=295	CM Punk vs. Brent Albright (OVW TV; 05/03/06) - 13 Points
=295	AJ Styles vs. Abyss - Six Sides Of Steel Cage Match - TNA Lockdown 04/24/05 - 13 Points
=292	Nigel McGuinness vs Jimmy Rave - Fight Without Honor - ROH Fifth Year Festival: Finale 03/04/06 - 14 Points
=292	Los Oficiales v Freelance, Rey Cometa & Pegasso Xtreme (IWRG, 10/17/08) - 14 Points
=292	Austin Aries vs. Spanky 06/04/05 - 14 Points
=290	Genichiro Tenryu & Nobukaza Hirai v Satoshi Kojima & Kaz Hayashi (All Japan, 10/06/02) - 15 Points
=290	Bryan Danielson vs. Takeshi Morishima (ROH Final Battle; 12/27/08) - 15 Points
=287	Yoshihiro Takayama v Kensuke Sasaki (NJPW 08/03/02) - 16 Points
=287	KENTA vs Yoshinobu Kanemaru - NOAH 07/18/05 - 16 Points
=287	James Gibson vs. Christopher Daniels 09/24/05 - 16 Points
=282	The 2004 Royal Rumble (WWE Royal Rumble; 01/25/04) - 17 Points
=282	Takashi Sasaki, Abdullah Kobayashi, Shadow WX & MASADA vs Yuki Miyamoto, Jun Kasai, Jaki Numazawa & Mens Teioh - BJW 01/02/07 - 17 Points
=282	Ian Rotten v Tarek The Great (IWA-MS, 10/04/02) - 17 Points
=282	Homicide vs. Samoa Joe 05/31/03 - 17 Points
=282	Brock Lesnar vs. Eddie Guerrero (WWE No Way Out; 02/15/04) - 17 Points
=279	KENTA vs Naomichi Marufuji (NOAH 10/29/06) - 18 Points
=279	James Gibson vs. Samoa Joe 06/04/05 - 18 Points
=279	Chris Herof Vs Human Tornado - Cage Match - PWG Life In Wartime - 07/06/08 - 18 Points
=276	Rey Mysterio vs. John Morrison - WWE Smackdown 09/04/09 - 19 Points
=276	Rey Mysterio vs Kurt Angle - WWE Smackdown 09/12/02 - 19 Points
=276	Mitsuharu Misawa vs Yoshihiro Takayama, NOAH (04/15/01) - 19 Points
=273	The Undertaker vs. Edge - Hell In A Cell - WWE SummerSlam 08/17/08 - 20 Points
=273	Homicide vs. Trent Acid 06/28/03 - 20 Points
=273	Finlay v Rey Mysterio (WWE Smackdown!, 03/24/06) - 20 Points
=270	Paul London vs. Low Ki vs. AJ Styles 02/08/03 - 21 Points
=270	Edge vs. The Undertaker - WWE WrestleMania XXIV 03/28/08 - 21 Points
=270	CM Punk vs James Gibson vs Samoa Joe vs Christopher Daniels (ROH Redemption 08/12/05) - 21 Points
=268	Ric Flair Vs The Undertaker- Wrestlemania 18 - 03/17/02 - 22 Points
=268	Bryan Danielson vs Tyler Black (ROH New Horizons 07/26/08) - 22 Points
=265	Kurt Angle Vs Samoa Joe – Genesis 2006 – 11/19/06 - 23 Points
=265	Kenta Kobashi & Go Shiozaki v Kensuke Sasaki & Katsuhiko Nakajima (NOAH, 11/05/05) - 23 Points
=265	John Cena vs. Umaga (WWE New Year's Revolution; 01/07/07) - 23 Points
=262	Mark Henry vs Matt Hardy, ECW (08/19/08) - 24 Points
=262	Kiyushi Tamura vs Dokonjonosuke Mishima - U-Style 04/06/03 - 24 Points
=262	Bryan Danielson vs. Jimmy Jacobs - ROH Unscripted II 12/01/07 - 24 Points
=260	Jun Akiyama & Akitoshi Saito v Takeshi Rikio & Takeshi Morishima (NOAH, 09/23/02) - 25 Points
=260	Generation Next vs. Briscoes/Rave/Walters 05/22/04 - 25 Points
=257	London/Kendrick vs. Hardys vs. Regal/Taylor vs. MNM 12/17/06 - 27 Points
=257	Kenta Kobashi & Tamon Honda vs Jun Akiyama & Akitoshi Saito (NOAH 06/06/03) - 27 Points
=257	HHH Vs Ric Flair - Survivor Series 2005 – 11/27/05 - 27 Points
256	Jay Lethal vs Samoe Joe - ROH Pure Championship - ROH Manhatten Mayhem 05/07/05 - 28 Points
=254	William Regal vs Chris Benoit, WWE Velocity (07/16/05) - 29 Points
=254	Vader v Jun Akiyama (AJPW 01/23/00) - 29 Points
=248	Tajiri v Super Crazy v Little Guido (ECW on TNN, 04/14/00) - 30 Points
=248	Paul London vs. Xavier 02/08/03 - 30 Points
=248	Kenta Kobashi vs KENTA - NOAH 03/05/06 - 30 Points
=248	CM Punk Vs Terry Funk - Glory By Honour II – 09/20/03 - 30 Points
=248	Jun Akiyama vs Masa Inoue - NOAH 04/23/06 - 31 Points
=248	Chris Benoit vs. Shawn Michaels (WWE Raw 05/03/04) - 31 Points
247	The Undertaker vs. Big Show - Last Man Standing - WWE Cyber Sunday - 10/26/08 - 32 Points
246	Low Ki vs AJ Styles - ROH A Night of Appreciation 04/27/02 - 33 Points
245	Jimmy Jacobs vs. Alex Shelley 10/16/04 - 34 Points
=243	Toshiaki Kawada vs Vader (AJPW 02/17/00) - 35 Points
=243	Mike Awesome vs. Masato Tanaka - ECW One Night Stand 06/12/05 - 35 Points
=241	The Age Of The Fall Vs The Young Bucks - PWG All Star Weekend 7 Night 2 - 08/31/08 - 36 Points
=241	Bryan Danielson vs. TJ Perkins 11/02/08 - 36 Points
=239	Triple H & Shawn Michaels vs Cody Rhodes & Ted DiBiase Jr. - Hell In A Cell - WWE Hell In A Cell 10/04/09 - 37 Points
=239	Solar, Dos Caras Jr. & Heavy Metal v ***** Navarro & Villanos IV & V (AULL, 11/02/06) - 37 Points
=236	Kurt Angle Vs Samoa Joe – Lockdown 04/13/08 - 38 Points
=236	Chris Hero vs. Eddie Kingston 12/19/09 - 38 Points
=236	Chavo Guerrero Jr. v Rey Misterio Jr. (WCW Superbrawl Revenge, 02/18/01) - 38 Points
235	Samoa Joe vs. Jay Lethal 12/05/05 - 39 Points
=232	Yuko Miyamoto & Takashi Sasaki vs Isami Kodaka & Masashi Takeda - BJW 03/26/09 - 40 Points
=232 Samoa Joe v Takeshi Morishima (ROH Fifth Year Festival: NYC, 02/16/07) - 40 Points
=232	James Gibson vs. Roderick Strong 04/02/05 - 40 Points
231	The Rock vs. Chris Benoit 07/23/00 - 42 Points
=227	The Young Bucks Vs The Motor City Machine Guns – PWG Ninety-Nine – 04/11/09 - 43 Points
=227	Steen & Generico vs. Motor City Machine Guns 08/02/08 - 43 Points
=227	Shinya Hashimoto v Masato Tanaka (Zero-One, 03/02/02) - 43 Points
=227	Kenta Kobashi vs Jun Akiyama - NOAH 07/10/04 - 43 Points
=225	Toshiaki Kawada vs. Hiroyoshi Tenzan (NJPW; 01/04/01) - 44 Points
=225	Genichiro Tenryu v Keiji Mutoh (All Japan, 04/01/02) - 44 Points
=222	KENTA & Naomichi Marufuji vs Juventud Guerrera & Ricky Marvin - NOAH 11/01/03 - 45 Points
=222	CM Punk vs. Chris Hero 05/19/01 - 45 Points
=222	American Dragon vs. Low Ki (APW; 10/27/01) - 45 Points
=220	Steve Corino Vs Terry Funk – Barbed Wire Match – MLW – 06/20/03 - 46 Points
=220	Misawa & Akiyama vs. Nagata & Hashimoto 02/03/01 - 46 Points
219	John Cena & Shawn Michaels vs. Batista & The Undertaker (WWE No Way Out; 02/18/07) - 47 Points
218	F.I.S.T. vs. The Colony 05/24/09 - 48 Points
217	Rey Mysterio v Mark Henry (WWE Smackdown!, 01/20/06) - 49 Points
216	Edge vs Mick Foley - Hardcore Match - WWE WrestleMania 22 04/02/06 - 50 Points
=214	Toshiaki Kawada & Akira Taue vs Jun Akiyama & KENTA, NOAH (10/03/09) - 52 Points
=214	Christian Cage vs. Kaz - Ladder Match - TNA Genesis 11/11/07 - 52 Points
=212	Kurt Angle vs. AJ Styles - Last Man Standing Match - TNA Hard Justice 08/10/08 - 53 Points
=212	Bryan Danielson vs. Roderick Strong 10/29/05 - 53 Points
=210	Shawn Michaels vs. Kurt Angle - WWE WrestleMania 21 04/03/05 - 54 Points
=210	Rey Mysterio & Batista v MNM (WWE Smackdown!, 12/30/05) - 54 Points
209	Mitsuharu Misawa & Kotaro Suzuki v Shinjiro Ohtani & Tatsuhito Takaiwa (NOAH, 03/05/05) - 56 Points
=207	Hiroshi Tanahashi v Yuji Nagata (New Japan, 04/13/07) - 57 Points
=207	Bryan Danielson vs. Arik Cannon 07/31/04 - 57 Points
=202	Trauma II v Zatura (IWRG, 06/18/09) - 58 Points
=202	Shinya Hashimoto & Takashi Iizuka v Naoya Ogawa & Kazunari Murakami (New Japan, 01/04/00) - 58 Points
=202	Nigel McGuinness vs El Generico - ROH Age of Insanity 08/15/08 - 58 Points
=202	Kurt Angle vs. Edge vs. Chris Benoit vs. Eddie Guerrero - 4-Way Elimination Match - WWE Smackdown 12/05/02 - 58 Points
=202	Bryan Danielson vs. Claudio Castagnoli (ROH Nothern Navigation; 07/25/08) - 58 Points
=198	Samoa Joe vs. Christopher Daniels (TNA iMPACT; 04/13/06) - 59 Points
=198	Rey Mysterio vs Kurt Angle - WWE Summerslam 08/25/02 - 59 Points
=198	Kurt Angle vs. Shane McMahon (WWF King of the Ring; 06/24/01) - 59 Points
=198	El Hijo del Santo vs. Dr. Cerebro 12/21/00 - 59 Points
=196	Kenta Kobashi vs Akitoshi Saito - NOAH 10/24/04 - 60 Points
=196	Genichiro Tenryu vs. KENTA - NOAH 10/08/05 - 60 Points
=194	The Rock vs. Steve Austin - WWE WrestleMania XIX 03/30/03 - 61 Points
=194	Jun Kasai vs. Ryuji Ito (Razor Board alpha Deathmatch) - 11/20/09 - 61 Points
193	Bryan Danielson v Low-Ki (JAPW, 06/07/02) - 62 Points
=190	Takeshi Morishima vs Claudio Castagnoli (ROH Death Before Dishonor V Night 1 08/10/07) - 63 Points
=190	Eddie Guerrero v Rey Mysterio (WWE Smackdown!, 03/18/04) - 63 Points
=190	Bryan Danielson vs. Homicide (ROH Final Battle; 12/23/06) - 63 Points
189 Yoshihiro Takayama & Takashi Sugiura vs Jun Akiyama & Takeshi Rikio (NOAH; 04/28/07) - 64 Points
=187	Edge vs. Chris Benoit - WWE Smackdown 06/07/07 - 66 Points
=187	Eddie Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio – Smackdown Cage Match – 09/09/05 - 66 Points
=185	The Undertaker vs. Kurt Angle vs. The Rock - WWE Vengeance 07/21/02 - 67 Points
=185	KENTA vs. SUWA (NOAH; 09/18/05) - 67 Points
184	John Cena v Randy Orton (WWE Summerslam, 08/26/07) - 68 Points
=182	Kenta Kobashi vs Minoru Suzuki (NOAH 08/01/05) - 70 Points
=182	Edge Vs Ric Flair - TLC Match – WWE Raw – 01/16/06 - 70 Points
=179	Matt Sydal vs. Christopher Daniels 07/28/06 - 71 Points
=179	Bryan Danielson vs Samoa Joe - PWG The Musical 04/17/04 - 71 Points
=179	Bryan Danielson vs Nigel McGuinness - ROH Rising Above 11/22/08 - 71 Points
=174	Steve Corino vs Tajiri, ECW Hardcore Heaven (05/14/00) - 72 Points
=174	Kurt Angle & Chris Benoit vs. Rey Mysterio & Edge – WWE No Mercy 10/20/02 - 72 Points
=174	JBL vs. John Cena (WWE Judgment Day; 05/22/05) - 72 Points
=174	Homicide vs. Necro Butcher 05/13/06 - 72 Points
=174	CM Punk & Ace Steel vs Austin Aries & Roderick Strong - No DQ Match - ROH Weekend of Thunder Night 2 11/06/04 - 72 Points
173	Young Bucks vs. 2 Skinny Black Guys 07/31/09 - 73 Points
=171	Mitsuharu Misawa & Jun Akiyama v Kenta Kobashi & Yoshihiro Takayama (NOAH, 12/02/07) - 74 Points
=171	AJ Styles vs. Christopher Daniels - 30 Minute Iron Man Match - TNA Against All Odds 02/13/05 - 74 Points
=167	Homicide vs. Steve Corino 11/29/03 - 75 Points
=167	Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio (WWE Judgment Day (05/22/05) - 75 Points
=167	Dave Taylor, Claudio Castagnoli and Bryan Danielson Vs Jorge Riveria, Mike Quackebush and Johnny Saint – Chikara King Of Trios- 03/28/09 - 75 Points
=167	Chris Benoit & Chris Jericho vs. Edge & Christian vs. The Dudley Boyz vs. The Hardy Boyz - TLC Match - WWF Smackdown 05/24/01 - 75 Points
166	Austin Aries vs. Bryan Danielson 08/07/04 - 76 Points
=164	Kevin Steen & El Generico vs. Jimmy Jacobs and Tyler Black (ROH Driven; 09/19/08) - 77 Points
=164	Edge vs. Chris Benoit vs. Chris Jericho vs. Shelton Benjamin vs. Christian vs. Kane - Money in the Bank Ladder Match - WWE WrestleMania 21 04/03/05 - 77 Points
=162	Jimmy Jacobs Vs Austin Aries - I Quit Match - Rising Above 08 – 11/22/08 - 78 Points
=162	El Hijo del Santo v El Hijo del Aguayo, CMLL (08/13/04) - 78 Points
161	CM Punk, Ace Steel & Jimmy Jacobs vs Austin Aries, Alex Shelley & Jack Evans - ROH Gold 10/15/04 - 78 Points
=159	Mitsuharu Misawa & Kenta Kobashi vs. Jun Akiyama & Yuji Nagata (NOAH 17/02/02) - 79 Points
=159	Bryan Danielson vs Nigel McGuinness - 2/3 Falls - ROH Epic Encounter II 08/25/06 - 79 Points
=157	Mick Foley, Edge & Lita vs Terry Funk, Tommy Dreamer & Beulah - ECW One Night Stand 06/11/06 - 81 Points
=157	John Cena vs. Randy Orton (WWE Breaking Point; 09/13/09) - 81 Points
156	The Rock v HHH (WWF Backlash, 04/30/00) - 82 Points
=152	Nigel McGuinness vs Tyler Black vs Bryan Danielson vs Claudio Castagnoli - ROH Death Before Dishonor VI 08/02/08 - 83 Points
=152	Kurt Angle vs. The Undertaker - WWE Smackdown 09/04/03 - 83 Points
=152	El Hijo Del Santo vs Dr Cerebro, IWRG (02/22/01) - 83 Points
=152	Chris Benoit v Randy Orton (WWE Smackdown!, 01/13/06) - 83 Points
=150	Homicide vs. Steve Corino 08/16/03 - 85 Points
=150	Fujita Jr. Hayato vs Yoshitune - Michinoku Pro 12/12/08 - 85 Points
=147	Paul London vs. Michael Shane 09/21/02 - 86 Points
=147	Jushin Liger & Wataru Inoue vs Yoshinobu Kanemaru & Tsuyoshi Kikuchi (NOAH; 02/17/02) - 86 Points
=147	Eddie Guerrero v JBL (WWE Smackdown!, 07/15/04) - 86 Points
=143	America's Most Wanted vs Team Canada (TNA Final Resolution; 01/16/05) - 87 Points
=143	Akira Taue v Yuji Nagata (NOAH, 06/06/03) - 87 Points
=143	Aja Kong vs KAORU - GAEA 02/13/00 - 87 Points
=143	AJ Styles vs. Petey Williams vs. Chris Sabin - Ultimate X Match - TNA Final Resolution 01/16/05 - 87 Points
142	Bryan Danielson vs. Alex Shelley 03/11/06 - 88 Points
=140	Samoa Joe vs Jay Briscoe, Steel Cage Match, ROH At Our Best (03/13/04) - 89 Points
=140	CM Punk & Ace Steel vs Dan Maff & BJ Whitmer - Chicago Street Fight (ROH Death Before Dishonor 2 Part 2 - 07/24/04) - 89 Points
=138	The Briscoes vs CM Punk & Colt Cabana - ROH Reborn: Stage 2 - 04/24/04 - 90 Points
=138	Bryan Danielson/Samoa Joe vs. Austin Aries/Jack Evans 02/19/05 - 90 Points
=135	The Briscoes vs. Kevin Steen & El Generico (ROH Man Up; 09/15/07) - 91 Points
=135	Royal Rumble Match 01 – 01/21/01 - 91 Points
=135	Nigel McGuinness vs. Kevin Steen (ROH Nothern Navigation; 07/25/08) - 91 Points
134	John Cena vs. Shawn Michaels (WWE Raw; 04/23/07) - 92 Points
=131	Tatsumi Fujinami vs Osamu Nishimura, MUGA (09/25/06) - 93 Points
=131	Jimmy Jacobs vs BJ Whitmer - I Quit Match - IWA:MS 03/01/08 - 93 Points
=131	Chris Jericho vs. Shawn Michaels 10/05/08 - 93 Points
130	Kenta Kobashi vs Akira Taue - NOAH 09/10/04 - 94 Points
129	Men's Teioh/Shinobu vs. Kengo Mashimo/Madoka 05/23/08 - 95 Points
128	Samoa Joe vs Austin Aries, ROH Final Battle (12/26/04) - 96 Points
=126	Chris Jericho vs. Rey Mysterio - Mask vs. Title - WWE The Bash 06/28/09 - 98 Points
=126	Chris Hero vs. Eddie Kingston (CZW; 04/07/07) - 98 Points
125	Kenta Kobashi v Jun Akiyama (NOAH, 12/23/00) - 99 Points
=123	Shawn Michaels, Booker T, Rob Van Dam & The Dudley Boys vs. Chris Jericho, Randy Orton, Christian, Scott Steiner & Mark Henry (WWE Survivor Series; 11/16/03) - 103 Points
=123	***** Navarro v El Dandy (IWRG, 11/08/01) - 103 Points
122	Finlay v Matt Hardy (WWE Smackdown!, 06/22/07) - 106 Points
=120	Genichiro Tenryu & Jun Akiyama v Kenta Kobashi & Akira Taue (NOAH, 09/18/05) - 107 Points
=120	Bryan Danielson & Jay Lethal v Austin Aries & Roderick Strong (ROH Tag Wars 2006, 01/27/06) - 107 Points
119	CM Punk vs. Jeff Hardy (WWE Smackdown; 08/28/09) - 109 Points
118	Bryan Danielson vs. Nigel McGuinness (ROH Weekend of Champions Night 2; 04/29/06) - 112 Points
=115	Yoshihiro Takayama v KENTA (NOAH, 06/27/04) - 113 Points
=115	The Embassy vs Generation Next - Steel Cage Warfare - ROH Steel Cage Warfare 12/03/05 - 113 Points
=115	El Hijo del Santo v La Parka (Monterrey, 12/23/01) - 113 Points
114 BJ Whitmer vs. Jimmy Jacobs (ROH Supercard of Honor II; 03/31/07) - 114 Points
=112	Toshiaki Kawada v Naoya Ogawa (Zero-One, 12/14/03) - 116 Points
=112	Batista vs. Triple H - Hell In A Cell - WWE Vengeance 06/26/05 - 116 Points
111	Kenta Kobashi vs. Kensuke Sasaki (NOAH; 07/18/05) - 117 Points
110	Shawn Michaels vs. Shelton Benjamin - WWE Raw 05/02/05 - 118 Points
109	Kurt Angle vs Christian Cage vs AJ Styles vs Samoa Joe vs Chris Harris - King Of The Mountain Match - TNA Slammiversary 06/17/07 - 119 Points
=108	James Storm vs Chris Harris – Texas Death Match - TNA Sacrifice 05/13/07 - 120 Points
=107	CM Punk vs. John Morrison (WWE Smackdown; 08/14/09) - 120 Points
106	Takeshi Morishima & Takeshi Rikio v KENTA & Naomichi Marufuji (NOAH 07/16/06) - 121 Points
=104	Ian Rotten v Chris Hero - IWA-MS 05/04/02 - 122 Points
=104	Christopher Daniels vs. AJ Styles vs. Samoa Joe – TNA Unbreakable 09/11/05 - 122 Points
=102	Yoshihiro Takayama & Kohei Sato v Takao Omori & Shinjiro Ohtani (Zero-One, 02/18/07) - 124 Points
=102	Finlay v Chris Benoit (WWE Smackdown!, 05/05/06) - 124 Points
101	American Wolves vs Bryan Danielson & Tyler Black - ROH Tag Title Classic 04/18/09 - 125 Points



Top 100:



Spoiler: 100-1



100	Yuji Nagata v Giant Bernard (New Japan, 04/30/06) - 127 Points
99	Jimmy Jacobs vs. BJ Whitmer (ROH FYF: Finale; 03/04/07) - 129 Points
=97	Mitsuharu Misawa v Yoshihiro Takayama (NOAH, 09/23/02) - 131 Points
=97	HHH Vs Ric Flair- Cage Match – Taboo Tuesday 11/01/05 - 131 Points
=95	Eddie Guerrero & Tajiri vs. Charlie Haas & Shelton Benjamin (WWE Smackdown; 05/22/03) - 133 Points
=95	AJ Styles vs Paul London - ROH Night of the Grudges 06/14/03 - 133 Points
94	The Rock vs. Hollywood Hogan (WWF Wrestlemania; 03/17/02) - 134 Points
93	Tajiri v Super Crazy (ECW on TNN, 01/21/00) - 136 Points
92	Rey Mysterio v Chavo Guerrero (WWE Great American Bash, 06/27/04) - 137 Points
91 Tajiri v Psicosis (ECW TV, 08/25/00) - 138 Points Points
90	Bryan Danielson vs. Low Ki (PWG All Star Weekend VI Night 1; 01/05/08) - 139 Points
=88	The Rock vs. Brock Lesnar – SummerSlam 08/25/02 - 140 Points
=88	Mitsuharu Misawa vs Kenta Kobashi (NOAH; 03/01/03) - 140 Points
=85	Los Villanos v Misioneros de la Muerte (IWRG, 12/11/04) - 142 Points
=85	HHH vs. Shawn Michaels (WWE Raw; 12/29/03) - 142 Points
=85	Bryan Danielson & Roderick Strong vs. The Young Bucks (PWG 05/22/09) - 142 Points
84	The Rock vs. Triple H - Iron Man Match - WWF Judgment Day 05/21/00 - 145 Points
83	Bryan Danielson vs. Chris Hero (WXW 16 Carot Gold; 03/09/08) - 146 Points
=81	Samoa Joe & Jay Lethal v Homicide & Low-Ki (ROH, Punk: The Final Chapter, 08/13/05) - 147 Points
=81	John Cena vs. Shawn Michaels (WWE Wrestlemania; 04/01/07) - 147 Points
80	Shawn Michaels vs Triple H - Unsanctioned Street Fight - WWE SummerSlam 08/25/02 - 155 Points
=78	Hardy Boys vs Dudley Boys vs Edge & Christian - TLC Match - WWE Summerslam 08/27/00 - 157 Points
=78	Genichiro Tenryu vs. Satoshi Kojima (AJPW; 07/17/02) - 157 Points
77	Kiyoshi Tamura v Hiroyuki Ito (U-Style, 08/18/04) - 158 Points
76	Yuji Nagata v Yoshihiro Takayama (New Japan, 05/02/02) - 159 Points
75	Gail Kim vs. Awesome Kong (TNA Final Resolution; 01/06/08) - 163 Points
=73	Bryan Danielson vs. Roderick Strong (ROH Vendetta; 11/05/05) - 166 Points
=73	Kenta Kobashi vs. Samoa Joe (ROH Joe vs. Kobashi; 10/01/05) - 169 Points
72	Nigel McGuinness vs. Tyler Black (ROH Take No Prisoners; 03/16/08) - 170 Points
71	Triple H vs. Randy Orton vs. Batista vs. Chris Jericho vs. Chris Benoit vs. Edge - Elimination Chamber - WWE New Year’s Revolution 01/09/05 - 172 Points
=69	Yuki Ishikawa, Alexander Otsuka & Munenori Sawa v Daisuke Ikeda, Katsumi Usuda & Super Tiger II (Battlarts, 07/26/08) - 173 Points
=69	Triple H vs Chris Jericho - Last Man Standing - WWF Fully Loaded 07/23/00 - 173 Points
68	Chris Benoit vs. Triple H vs. Shawn Michaels (03/14/04) - 174 Points
67	Bryan Danielson vs Chris Hero - PWG Guerre Sans Frontieres 09/04/09 - 175 Points
=64 Yoshihiro Takayama v Osamu Nishimura (New Japan, 08/10/02) - 177 Points
=64	Toshiaki Kawada & Nobutaka Araya vs Genichiro Tenryu & Masa Fuchi (AJPW; 06/30/01) - 177 Points
=64	Kurt Angle vs. Brock Lesnar - Iron Man Match - WWE Smackdown 09/18/03 - 177 Points
63	Bryan Danielson vs. Takeshi Morishima (ROH Glory by Honor VI Night 2; 11/03/07) - 179 Points
62	Chris Benoit vs. Chris Jericho - Ladder Match - WWF Royal Rumble 01/21/01 - 181 Points
61	Yoshihiro Takayama v Kenta Kobashi (AJPW; 05/26/00) - 183 Points
60	Blood Generation Vs. Do Fixer – ROH Supercard of Honor 03/31/06 - 186 Points
=58	Yuki Ishikawa v Carl Greco (Battlarts, 06/01/08) - 189 Points
=58	Samoa Joe vs. CM Punk (ROH World Title Classic; 06/12/04) - 189 Points
57	Cactus Jack, The Rock, Rikishi & Too Cool vs. HHH, X-Pac, Chris Benoit, Perry Saturn & Dean Malenko (WWF Raw; 02/07/00) - 193 Points
56	Chris Benoit vs. William Regal (10/08/06) - 194 Points
55	Bryan Danielson vs. Paul London (ROH Epic Encounter; 04/12/03) - 201 Points
54	Genichiro Tenryu & Nobutaka Araya v Taiyo Kea & Kiyoshi Miyamoto (All Japan, 04/27/02) - 205 Points
53	Bryan Danielson vs. Takeshi Morishima (ROH Man Up; 09/15/07) - 209 Points
=51	Toshiaki Kawada vs. Kensuke Sasaki (NJPW; 10/09/00) - 210 Points
=51	Kenta Kobashi vs Tamon Honda (NOAH; 04/13/03) - 210 Points
50	Randy Orton vs. Rey Mysterio (WWE Smackdown; 04/07/06) - 213 Points
49	Randy Orton, Ric Flair, Batista & Triple H vs. Chris Benoit, Mick Foley, Shawn Michaels & Shelton Benjamin (WWE Raw; 04/12/04) - 219 Points
48	Meiko Satomura vs Aja Kong - Sendai Pro Wrestling 07/09/06 - 220 Points
47	Kiyoshi Tamura v Tsuyoshi Kohsaka - U-Style - 02/04/04 - 221 Points
46	Edge vs. Matt Hardy - Steel Cage Match - WWE Unforgiven 09/18/05 - 232 Points
=44	Eddie Guerrero vs. Big Show (WWE Smackdown; 04/15/04) - 242 Points
=44	Brock Lesnar vs. The Undertaker - Hell In A Cell - WWE No Mercy 10/20/02 - 242 Points
43	El Hijo del Santo v Blue Panther (Monterrey, 04/09/00) - 243 Points
42	Triple X vs. America’s Most Wanted (TNA Turning Point; 12/05/04) - 258 Points
41	CM Punk vs. Samoa Joe (ROH All Star Extravagenza 3; 12/04/04) - 260 Points
40	Mitsuharu Misawa v Jun Akiyama (All Japan, 02/27/00) - 262 Points
39	Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio (WWE Great American Bash; 07/24/05) - 263 Points
38	Bryan Danielson vs. Samoa Joe (ROH Fight of the Century; 08/05/06) - 268 Points
37	Genichiro Tenryu & Jun Akiyama v Kenta Kobashi & Go Shiozaki (NOAH, 04/24/05) - 271 Points
36	Nigel McGuinness vs. Austin Aries (ROH Rising Above; 12/29/07) - 273 Points
35	Adam Pearce vs. Brent Albright (ROH Death Before Dishonor VI; 08/02/08) - 274 Points
34 Bryan Danielson vs Roderick Strong - ROH Supercard of Honor 03/31/06 - 275 Points
33 Christian vs. Jack Swagger (WWE ECW; 02/24/09) - 282 Points
32	Ric Flair vs. Shawn Michaels (WrestleMania 03/30/08) - 286 Points
31	Toshiaki Kawada vs. Shinya Hashimoto (AJPW; 02/22/04) - 296 Points
30	Samoa Joe vs. Necro Butcher (IWA:MS; 06/11/05) - 304 Points
29	Toshiaki Kawada vs Satoshi Kojima (AJPW; 02/16/05) - 308 Points
28	Atlantis vs. Villano III (CMLL; 03/17/00) - 335 Points
27	Chris Benoit vs. Finlay (WWE Judgment Day; 05/21/06) - 337 Points
26	Yuji Nagata & Takashi Iizuka vs Toshiaki Kawada & Masa Fuchi (NJPW; 12/14/00) - 341 Points
25	Daisuke Ikeda v Yuki Ishikawa (FUTEN, 04/24/05) - 344 Points
24	CM Punk vs. Austin Aries (ROH Death Before Dishonor III; 06/18/05) - 349 Points
23	Kurt Angle vs. The Undertaker - WWE No Way Out 02/19/06 - 355 Points
22	Kenta Kobashi vs. Yoshihiro Takayama (NOAH; 04/25/04) - 371 Points
21	Genichiro Tenryu & Toshiaki Kawada v Stan Hansen & Taiyo Kea (All Japan, 07/23/00) - 386 Points
20	John Cena vs. Umaga (WWE Royal Rumble; 01/28/07) - 388 Points
19	Triple H vs. Cactus Jack (WWF Royal Rumble; 01/23/00) - 392 Points
18	Shawn Michaels vs. The Undertaker (WWE Wrestlemania; 04/05/09) - 417 Points
17	Bryan Danielson v Nigel McGuinness (ROH Driven, 06/23/07) - 438 Points
16 Samoa Joe/BJ Whitmer/Adam Pearce vs. Chris Hero/Super Dragon/Necro Butcher (ROH 100th Show; 04/22/06) - 457 Points
15	The Briscoes vs. Kevin Steen & El Generico (ROH Death Before Dishonor V Night 1; 08/10/07) - 465 Points
14	Toshiaki Kawada vs. Genichiro Tenryu (AJPW; 10/28/00) - 486 Points
13	Bryan Danielson vs. Takeshi Morishima (ROH Manhattan Mayhem II; 08/25/07) - 490 Points
12	Bryan Danielson vs. KENTA (ROH Glory by Honor V Night 2; 09/16/06) - 501 Points
11	Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio (WWE Smackdown; 06/23/05) - 505 Points
10	HHH & Steve Austin vs. Chris Benoit & Chris Jericho (WWF Raw; 05/21/01) - 529 Points
9	Samoa Joe vs. CM Punk (ROH Joe vs. Punk; 10/16/04) - 535 Points
8	Steve Austin vs. The Rock (WWF Wrestlemania; 04/01/01) - 545 Points
7	Eddie Guerrero vs. JBL (WWE Judgment Day; 05/16/04) - 547 Points
6	AJ Styles vs. Samoa Joe (TNA Turning Point; 12/11/05) - 574 Points
5	Team ROH vs. Team CZW (ROH Death Before Dishonor IV; 07/15/06) - 578 Points
4	Bryan Danielson vs. Nigel McGuinness (ROH Sixth Anniversary Show; 02/23/08) - 592 Points
3	Bryan Danielson vs. Nigel McGuinness (ROH Unified; 08/12/06) - 597 Points
2	Steve Austin vs. Kurt Angle (WWF Summerslam; 08/19/01) - 666 Points
1	Chris Benoit vs. Steve Austin (WWF Smackdown; 05/31/01) - 669 Points



Some random shit you might wanna know:

332 Matches in total compared to 205 for the WWF/E Poll and 288 for the WCW Poll.

The #1 match here would have only placed #19 on the WCW Poll and #15 on the WWF/E Poll... one whole place higher than it originally got!!! (got 658 before)

Total Number of matches, highest to lowest, for random people I thought you might wanna know about:

Bryan Danielson - 37 Matches
Samoa Joe - 26 Matches
Chris Benoit - 20 Matches (one RR Match)
Kenta Kobashi - 19 Matches
Rey Mysterio - 19 Matches
Kurt Angle - 18 Matches (one RR Match)
Edge - 16 Matches
CM Punk - 16 Matches
Shawn Michaels - 15 Matches
HHH - 15 Matches
The Undertaker - 14 Matches (one RR Match)
Nigel McGuinness - 13 Matches
Eddie Guerrero - 11 Matches
KENTA - 11 Matches
AJ Styles - 11 Matches
The Rock - 11 Matches (one RR Match)
Tenryu - 10 Matches
John Cena - 10 Matches (one RR Match)
Christian - 9 Matches (one RR Match)
Misawa - 8 Matches
Randy Orton - 8 Matches (one RR Match)
Tajiri - 7 Matches (one RR Match)
Steve Austin - 7 Matches (one RR Match)
Ric Flair - 6 Matches
Finlay - 5 Matches
Brock Lesnar - 4 Matches

And number of matches per year, highest to lowest:

2005 - 49 Matches
2004 - 40 Matches
2006 - 40 Matches
2007 - 36 Matches
2008 - 35 Matches
2002 - 29 Matches
2003 - 28 Matches
2009 - 27 Matches
2000 - 26 Matches
2001 - 22 Matches


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

> 80	Shawn Michaels vs Triple H - Unsanctioned Street Fight - WWE SummerSlam 08/25/02 - 155 Points
> =78	Hardy Boys vs Dudley Boys vs Edge & Christian - TLC Match - WWE Summerslam 08/27/00 - 157 Points


look how high these are someone must have had them as their top two who the hell would have done that? what a shitty opinion lmao should be banned from the web.



I didn't hand in a list because I couldn't handle the heat, am fucking scum, am not worthy of oxygen, my name is Pineapple, etc etc.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Is this another production from the DVDVR folks? And I am shocked more than ever that Gail Kim vs. Awesome Kong is ranked that high :jericho. DAT DANIELSON :bryan3

*In Your House: Unforgiven*

Farooq, Ken Shamrock & Steve Blackman vs. NOD - ***1/2*
Triple H vs. Owen Hart - ***
Rock n' Roll Express vs. New Midnight Express - ****
Luna Vachon vs. Sable - *HAH*
New Age Outlaws vs. LOD 2000 - *DUD 2000*
Undertaker vs. Kane - *****
Steve Austin vs. Dude Love - ******

Nothing needs to be said about the undercard except that it sucks. Especially Owen vs. HHH. What a horrible match between a horrible wrestler and an all-time great.

As for the top two matches here, I was shocked at how much fun I had with the Inferno Match. Sure it was a novelty match without much great wrestling, but Undertaker flying over flame and VADER and Bearer putting themselves in the action was fun enough for me. That's what this is; fun. Main event is an Attitude Era brawl done right. Action spills to the outside, but we get more than generic punches in the crowd; instead we get Foley bumping his ass off. In fact, the best way to summarize this is that it's a Mick Foley match. Austin was fun to watch here too, but Mick made sure to make the most out of this match by taking some sick bumps and pulling off some nice shenanigans. Love the Sweet Shin Music tease.

RAW before and after WM 14 are like night and day. Matches are still awful, but as one would expect, the show is really good once Austin is champion.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Nope, list has nothing to do with DVDVR. It's a WE list. WE did WWF and WCW in the past .


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Looks like I'm bookmarking the last page so I never have to come in here and ask "WHAT SHALL I WATCH HERP DERP~!???"


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Been watching a couple elimination chamber matches these last couple of days, its definitely my favorite gimmicky gimmick match out there, NO promises but I'll try and watch as many as I can from here til ec and come up with some type of list


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Elimination Chamber is awesome. Favorite gimmick so I always enjoy the RTWM due to the Rumble, WM and in between, the EC being there.

Just watched this great Edge/Benoit vs Batista/Flair tag match which was a rematch for the World Tag Titles a week after the former won it. Not as good as their first match but still good. So many good tag matches that I really need to go through Raw 2004 again.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Just watched the Summerslam 2003 chamber again. It is fun, starting with the HBK/Jericho interaction, then Orton gets in and does his thing. 2003-2005 Orton is easily GOAT Orton. Even the the presence from his entrance is awesome. Goldberg getting in and wrecking shit is cool. I always forget just what kind of presence he had, and didn't have to make a ton of faces or scream a ton, like they made Ryback do. Triple H really shouldn't have won. He didn't even work 5 minutes hardly, and retained. They ended up going with the "If Goldberg loses at Unforgiven, he leaves Raw", and of course he ended up winning the belt there. Anyways, match stays at ***1/4, but it did jump a few spots in the top 100. 

That list that Cal posed last page is fucking wild.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

just watched I believe raw 2009 chamber :lenny all I'll say


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> ROCK/GOLDBERG IS GOOD YOU HUMAN VOMIT BAGS.
> 
> 
> 
> "Last Rites" sounds like it would have been a Chris Daniels match given that's his finisher and half of his gimmick of whatever. Then again this is TNA so it was probably Matt Morgan v. Gail Kim or something.


Nope. Not even Goldberg can make me like it.

Sting vs Abyss, btw. It's a classic. One of the TNA matches I'd watched the most.

HOLY SHIT AT A CHIKARA MATCH MAKING THE ELITE LIST. COLONY WAS IN IT TOO. _(so was Chuck Taylor)_


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Luke Harper's festive Lariat said:


> Looks like I'm bookmarking the last page so I never have to come in here and ask "WHAT SHALL I WATCH HERP DERP~!???"


Ditto. Cal thanks for posting that list you just gave me the best excuse ever to ignore human beings and watch wrestling all weekend.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Benoit vs Kane from Bad Blood '04. Whew. Still great, yay. Show isn't half bad if you nix out the boring opener & main event. Surprised how much I was into Jericho vs Tomko. Remembered that one being sloppy.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah, Bad Blood is a solid show and much better than 2003. Main event sucks but I don't recall anything else being bad. Benoit/Kane & Orton/Shelton. :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I don't mind 2003's.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

I hate when people talk about Orton's early work. I makes me cry to remember just how damn good he once was.

Anyway, on the topic of EC. I can't decide whether I liked 2005 or SD 2011 more. I think these two are definitely contenders for GOAT EC match.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Drew McIntyre :mark:


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Watching Summerslam 96 right now.

The Free For All match was shit,Hart vs Vega was ok, the tag team match is boring so far (and the rules are ridiculous, both members from a team can be in the ring at the same time and fight each other, lol what).


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's worth it for Taker vs Mankind & Vader vs Michaels.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Just downloaded a small pack off XWT - Eddie Guerrero on Nitro from October 95 - December 95

1995-10-02 Nitro - Eddie Guerrero Vs. Dean Malenko
1995-10-16 Nitro - Eddie Guerrero Vs. Chris Benoit
1995-10-23 Nitro - Dean Malenko & Chris Benoit Vs. Eddie Guerrero & Mr. J.L.
1995-10-30 Nitro - Craig Pittman Vs. Eddie Guerrero
1995-11-06 Nitro - Chris Benoit Vs. Eddie Guerrero
1995-11-13 Nitro - Johnny B. Badd Vs. Eddie Guerrero
1995-11-20 Nitro - Eddie Guerrero Vs. Brian Pillman
1995-12-18 Nitro - Eddie Guerrero Vs. Ric Flair

I've only ever seen the Flair match. I guess my night is sorted! :mark: :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

That pack looks awesome. I need one to download. What do people recommend?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Eddie vs Benoit 10/16 is gonna blow your mind.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

funnyfaces1 said:


> That pack looks awesome. I need one to download. What do people recommend?


http://www.xtremewrestlingtorrents.net/details.php?id=75303

Best pack I ever downloaded.

SO. MANY. GOODIES.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

What are people's thoughts on this weekend's PPV?

I really don't know what to make of any of the matches. They kinda booked themselves into a corner with the two handicaps. Neither guy can realistically beat three other guys (and it'd be stupid to book both big-name teams to lose to 1 guy), but can they afford to have both Punk and Bryan lose? TLC match is whatever. Not really interested in the match itself. Not even sure what else is on the card.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Get that random Bam Bam Bigelow championship pack to show Triple B some love.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

The Stocking Filler said:


> I really don't know what to make of any of the matches. They kinda booked themselves into a corner with the two handicaps. Neither guy can realistically beat three other guys (and it'd be stupid to book both big-name teams to lose to 1 guy), but can they afford to have both Punk and Bryan lose?


Mentioned this the other day.  Don't think anyone responded to it but I don't understand what WWE was thinking with these matches. I don't think the matches will be very good either. Punk and Bryan teaming up against The Wyatts or The Shield would of been much better.

As for my thoughts on the PPV, I don't have much interest in the show outside of how the main event will end. But I'll be watching TLC with a few friends so I should enjoy it a bit. (Y)


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm looking forward to both handicap matches. Especially Shield's. Their handicap matches earlier this year vs Dolph & Big Show were awesome. They are pecuilar picks for a PPV. Mostly due to there are two of 'em, opposed to only one. That's short term PPV build for ya. PPVs & championships don't mean what they used to. We all know this.

Those are the only matches on the card I care about. Oh, and the tag team championship. That won't be announced till Smackdown though. _(so you have to watch apparently 8*D)_

ugh @ no doubt having to see Miz vs idiot added to the show. Especially with Del Rio injured and the match vs Sin Cara II being scrapped. Not like I cared for that either, but Del Rio made me like it more by proxy.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Guessing they aren't announcing any other tables/chairs/ladder matches to make the main event seem even more important.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm pro that decision. Said it before, there are enough PPVs with gimmicks up and down the card. This having only one match - the namesake match too - is acceptable.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> I'm looking forward to both handicap matches. Especially Shield's. Their handicap matches earlier this year vs Dolph & Big Show were awesome.


Oh, I forgot about those matches. They were fun. (Y)



Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> ugh @ no doubt having to see Miz vs idiot added to the show.


Cody's favorite feud carrying on into another PPV. 8*D


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's one long standing epic grudge that NEEDS TO CONTINUE.

is Miz even a heel or what? :ti


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I'm even more excited for Orton/Cena after watching the video package from Main Event that shows their respective careers and accomplishments. But seeing Orton pinning Benoit really took my attention there. Marking around everywhere! :mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'll be downloading the show and skipping to the finishes of every match except possibly the SHIELD TAG which is likely the only match I'll watch in full (though I haven't seen SD yet so I don't know the full card).


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Rand Orton in 2004 makes me very :mark:

"Get a look at greatness people!" :mark: :mark:


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> is Miz even a heel or what? :ti


Depends on the day apparently.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Miz is always a heel, there is nothing likable about the guy.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

That's also an acceptable answer.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I watch Miz from 2010 & I'm just like WTF happened?

It's crazy how someone can be so high & then fall to the depths of hell out of nowhere.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

C2D marking for those Benoit appearances.



A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Rand Orton in 2004 makes me very :mark:
> 
> "Get a look at greatness people!" :mark: :mark:


This short promo video shows how great Orton used to be: 






:mark:


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Talking about Miz, his best match till now? I'd have to say that match against John Morrison for the WWE Title from early 2011 if I remember correctly


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

The Falls Count Anywhere match? That's the Morrison match that stands out. I think he and Morrison had some decent tags iirc.

in other words, MORRISON~~!


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Miz's best match is against Bryan at... NOC? Followed by TLC with Lawler on Raw and then... meh, fuck knows. I don't care. Not high on some matches like the Morrison FCA etc.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Forgot about the match against Lawler. That is pretty good actually.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

TLC match with Miz and Lawler is like a mini-version of Flair/Edge to me. Not as good, less bumps but follows a similar formula and works pretty well.



Christmas Nostalgia said:


> C2D marking for those Benoit appearances.


Well, this is the first time they've shown him on TV so clear and blatantly since the tribute show. Usually they only show Orton celebrating with the belt and nothing more, but here they even displayed the pinfall. :lol


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Hopefully Miz acts more like a heel after this Kofi 'feud'. It was alright turning him a face because his character needed a change but it's safe to say he is better suited as a heel. He just has that face that you'd love to punch and his personality just screams douchebag. As someone said in this thread before, he isn't the type of guy you would love to have a beer with, he is the type of guy who would brag about how rich he is, how he has main evented wrestlemania and has a hot girlfriend. I think a 2010 heel Miz would help the IC title gain credibility.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

We're really talking about best Miz matches? Surely isn't there something better we could talk about? :lol



Choke2Death said:


> Well, this is the first time they've shown him on TV so clear and blatantly since the tribute show. Usually they only show Orton celebrating with the belt and nothing more, but here they even displayed the pinfall. :lol


Yeah, I might have to check that out. Kind of a landmark thing if that's the first time they've show him on TV since then. I've heard they're showing him more in DVD releases lately even though they horribly edit commentary and the camera angles. :lmao


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Armageddon 05 is HORRIBLE through 3 matches, total of one on the cal scale, and a Benoit match I hated too 

And don't get me started on that Boogeyman debut


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Main Event rocks the world though .

Just had a look at the card myself, nothing sticks out as being bad on paper bar Booker/Benoit, but looking decent at least on paper doesn't always = being good for real .


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Am I the only one who enjoys the Benoit/Booker matches in late 05? 

But yeah, other than that match and the main event, I don't remember anything worthwhile on Armageddon 05.



Christmas Nostalgia said:


> Yeah, I might have to check that out. Kind of a landmark thing if that's the first time they've show him on TV since then. I've heard they're showing him more in DVD releases lately even though they horribly edit commentary and the camera angles. :lmao


DVDS are nothing new, though. They've shown him with muted commentary for years. (first one was Batista's DVD I believe) But on TV, the most we've seen are his boots in a corner when Edge's HOF video package was shown. Here they show everything but his face and he's part of the main focus.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Damn, I think I'm gonna be cut off from XWT tomorrow. I barely used my account, and I have no clue what my ratio is. How do you figure that out?

Love Benoit/Booker from Armageddon 05. I don't know what it is about it, but it kinda reminded me of Eddie/Benoit Vengeance 03. Main event kicked ass as expected. I think I liked that show. It was definitely my favorite Smackdown event in a year with one weak Smackdown event after another.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Damn, I think I'm gonna be cut off from XWT tomorrow. I barely used my account, and I have no clue what my ratio is. How do you figure that out?


Right above the check boxes for all the different sections when you click "browse", there is a bar going across the screen with all your info, and ratio is the first thing (right above the box for boxing). Al long as it's over 0.7 you are fine.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

All it says is "Inf.". Most of what I downloaded are freeleeches, so I'm not sure how that factors in to tomorrow's purge. It also says I uploaded 5 GB, but I don't recall ever doing such a thing. Thanks anyways for your assitance.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I was lucky with XWT. Registered between NOC and HIAC last year and since there was the six week gap, I was able to bring my ratio up pretty high since I went crazy with downloading 04-06 stuff and since then, my account has been living off of that. Ratio is still 2.5 which puts me in the safe zone.

ff, don't your XWT show up like this?



Spoiler: pic


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

funnyfaces1 said:


> All it says is "Inf.". Most of what I downloaded are freeleeches, so I'm not sure how that factors in to tomorrow's purge. It also says I uploaded 5 GB, but I don't recall ever doing such a thing. Thanks anyways for your assitance.


If you mainly download freeleech stuff then you are probably fine .

I'm at -8.somethingorother, had my account for YEARS, downloaded nearly 700GB and uploaded just under 600GB. 1.somethingorother on Classics, with around 500GB each way. And 1.somethingorother on PWT with around 250 each way, and everything is freeleech there and has been for AGES now after their site died for like 8 months so that's awesome .

I'd do better with XWT but half the time I just can't connect to the fecking site to upload anything (hell, I have to load up Classics and click the XWT link on there to load up the site most times lol).


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Really not sure there's a character in recent memory I hate more than Boogeyman.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

So apparently "Inf." stands for infinity :jericho unk rton2

Let the downloading commence! Off to get the Bigelow pack that Paramore fan asked me to get. What are some other good ones that you would recommend? No, I am not gonna download 2005. I'm hoping that I can find all the shows streaming, and I'll probably go through 2005 once I'm done with my four other projects (WCW 1998, WWF 1998, COTC, Danielson title reign).


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Armageddon 2005 is more good than bad. In fact, the only match I think I'm bleh on is actually Benoit vs Booker b/c I recall it dragging for twenty minutes and being a chore. Not to the extent of their dire NWO '06 match _(fuck that one)_, but pretty draining for all the wrong reasons. Rest of the show is a breeze. Then the stellar main event. Fun show with next to no expectations behind it.

BIGELOW (Y)


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

BEAST FROM THE EAST


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Bigelow had a good match with Sandman. He's very high in my book. And that match with RVD :mark:. And the Jersey Triad BATB/GAB 99 matches. And the match with Bret where the GOAT farts on him.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

GREETINGS FROM ASBURY PARK.

Bigelow vs HAK from Spring Stampede is still probably a top ten match for me from the US in 1999. It's terrific. Total war.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Well I hated Matt/JBL though, so thats why the ranking is so low 

but looking forward to the HIAC match :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I just had one of the worst days EVER, so I need something to watch


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> I just had one of the worst days EVER, so I need something to watch


Punk vs. McMahon from Raw last year. Everything to love about Sports Entertainment in one match.

:hb


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Also toss in Eddie & Tajiri vs WGTT from 2003 (doesn't matter which), Mankind vs Rock Halftime Heat, & Tyler Black vs Bryan Danielson b/c they're on streaming sites still. Also advocate Brain Damage vs Jon Moxley from CZW. It's on dailymotion.

Do a little Puro action too. Something w/Kawada. vs Mick Foley. You know Foley. It'll click.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Srdjan99 said:


> Talking about Miz, his best match till now? I'd have to say that match against John Morrison for the WWE Title from early 2011 if I remember correctly


Not his best matches, but Miz/Bryan from Fab. 14, 2011 (Rock's return show) was really good and I really enjoyed Miz/Ziggler from ME.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Miz vs Cena 5/2/11. Really good stuff. Orton vs Miz Tables match is nifty too. Love the match vs Lawler from Elimination Chamber. Think it's a lot better than the TLC.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Miz vs Cena 5/2/11. Really good stuff. Orton vs Miz Tables match is nifty too. Love the match vs Lawler from Elimination Chamber. Think it's a lot better than the TLC.


thanks for the rec you and FLUX

yea all ^^^^ these miz matches are his best just add the bryan NOC, I personally find the FCA with Morrison overrated as fuck


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Miz/Morrison from the first Raw of '11 is probably my favorite Miz match. 

Don't remember the Orton/Miz tables match but I remember their RR match felt like it was 3 hours long.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

No prob, skins.

Rumble match between Orton vs Miz does drag. 19 minutes was too much that night. WWE's own fault for only booking four matches on a card. Orton vs Miz on Smackdown post-TLC 2010 >>>>


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I think the cash in is actually the best Orton/Miz match. (from their late 10-early 11 series at least) Great babyface performance by Orton on that one.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> No prob, skins.
> 
> Rumble match between Orton vs Miz does drag. 19 minutes was too much that night. WWE's own fault for only booking four matches on a card. Orton vs Miz on Smackdown post-TLC 2010 >>>>


Don't think I've ever seen the Smackdown one. I wasn't watching SD much at that point. Will give it a look. (Y)

Edit: Agreed on the cash in match, that was solid stuff.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Good lord, I never would have thought that we would be praising Orton/Miz matches. They weren't bad though, but thankfully, they all occurred when Miz was still an asset and Orton wasn't wrestling like a drone.

:mark: I've been looking years for this classic and now I have found it!

http://www.dailymotion.com/playlist...t-muta-arn-anderson-other-1990/1#video=x2q2hk


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Smackdown match was smooth, Brye. I have fun with it.

MUTA VS ARN. LORDY LORDY


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Also toss in Eddie & Tajiri vs WGTT from 2003 (doesn't matter which), Mankind vs Rock Halftime Heat, & Tyler Black vs Bryan Danielson b/c they're on streaming sites still. Also advocate Brain Damage vs Jon Moxley from CZW. It's on dailymotion.
> 
> Do a little Puro action too. Something w/Kawada. vs Mick Foley. You know Foley. It'll click.


Did you just recommend that skins watch moxley vs brain damage TO CHEER HIMSELF UP???? That's the one where BD takes a frleaking skil saw to Ambrose head right??? You sick fuck :lmao


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Arn/Muta is a great carry job match.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Armageddon 2005 review

The end of the 05 PPV reviews! 

Match #1: JBl vs Matt Hardy *

Wow, funny how far JBL has fallen since his WWE title reign, no wonder he retired in like 6 months, but then again he was pretty old, his push just came WAY to late, and it was basically because Lesnar left, and a new face of SD was needed. But now he’s opening against Hardy instead of being in a WWE title main event match. This should be entertaining nonetheless, but Hardy seems to have been treading water since his Edge feud concluded. Good heel work by JBL to open up the match by choking Matt in the ropes, especially considering how over matt was at the time after the amazing Edge feud. Well this was pretty short, and basically only a little bit longer than a squash. Matt got like zero offense in it seems and the match went less than 5 minutes I think. I guess typical WWE logic says that lets have the old guy who can’t work anymore go over the younger guy who was starting to go over with the crowd, FUCK THAT. ¾*

*CAL SCALE: 0

Match #2: MNM vs the mexicools *

Jesus Christ Psychosis is one ugly motherfucker. I mean, he’s a pretty good wrestler, but damn he might be in contention for the ugliest of all time :lol. This should be a fun tag match though, at least some good high flying action, which is always plenty of fun. Pretty good match, certainly better than the squash of the opener, but it wasn’t anything too special. It was basically your basic tag match, with a couple of cool spots from both teams. If you’re a big fan of any of these 4 guys, then you’ll enjoy this. However, if you think their garbage, there’s nothing to see here. **1/2

*CAL SCALE: 1*
*
Match #3: Booker T vs Chris Benoit *

CAN YOU DIG IT? SUCKAA! Actually no Booker, only reason I can watch this match is because of the GOAT being in it. I wasn’t a fan of their SVS match and thought it was pretty shitty TBH, but considering they had wrested a few more matches by now I suspect that their chemistry will have improved by now. Man, I feel bad for Benoit here, working 7 fucking matches against Booker T? Well at least they would transition into some excellent Orton matches. This match was unfortunately just like their SVS match, very boring and bland. It felt like all they were doing was suplex after suplex, and the match had no energy at all, which of course is unusual for a Benoit match. This was just terrible, one of my least favorite Benoit matches, somehow worse than their SVS match. *

*CAL SCALE: 0

Match #4: Bobby Lashley vs William Regal and Paul Birchill
*
This is sad, Regal is such a better wrestler than Lashley is, but here he is jobbing to this idiot. Makes me a little nauseous TBH. Regal gets some offense in actually, which is surprising and awesome of course. But basically Lashley dominates both men 90% of the time, but it wasn’t TOO bad. *
CAL SCALE: 0
*
Match #5: Juvy vs Kid Kash *

This should be a fun CW match, probably will be MOTN so far, considering the poor matches we have had on the card so far. Not expecting anything too great here, but it should be fun. Really fun CW match here with a lot of spots, which is basically what I watch these matches for, not genuine good wrestling. This got some good time too, unlike the Booker/Benoit match it didn’t drag the fuck out, it was around 9 minutes, and I was thoroughly entertained the entire time I was watching. Check this out, because its easily the best match of the night so far through this mediocre show. ***

*CAL SCALE: 2 

Match #6: Batista and Rey Mysterio vs The Big show and Kane*

I’m actually looking forward to this for some strange reason. The prospect of Rey in their with three giants sounds :mark: for some reason. Anyways I’d rather have Batista vs Rey for the title, no need to include the tag titles and the two RAW guys. Maybe they were saving Batista/Rey for Mania for the title before Tista got injured shortly after this. Legit SILENCE for Show and Kane, guess no one cares about them, shocking how it’s still the same today . Also :lmao at the fact that Batista’s pyro legit caused the Armageddon sign to nearly fall off the scaffolding, that’s pretty funny. Well this was a LOT shorter than I thought it would go. Less than 10 minutes easily, maybe even around the 6 minute mark, it was decent for the time it got though. **1/4

*CAL SCALE: 1

Match #7: Randy Orton vs the Undertaker( HIAC)*

:mark:, remember LOVING this match, and I actually reviewed it when I was doing my Undertaker project, and taking a look at my review, I did love it. This match just feels like a big time match, and it showcases their impeccable chemistry. This starts out slow, but considering that this goes a little over 35 minutes, that should really be expected so that they don’t get too burnt out. I actually forgot just how bloody this match is, because for some reason I thought their wasn’t going to be much blood in this, but holy shit was I wrong. LOVED the RKO onto the ring ropes a lot, thought that was so :mark:, why can’t Orton do shit like that anymore? Yeah so I have no idea why the fuck people tend to dislike this match, it is to me a top 10 or 15 HIAC match, and easily the MOTN for me for this show. ****
*
CAL SCALE: 5 

TOTAL CAL SCALE: 9

FINAL PPV MOTY: Batista vs Triple H( Vengeance)*

*Final 2005 PPV rankings 

1: Summerslam (24)
2: Vengeance (21) 
3: WrestleMania 21(19)
4: Royal Rumble (17)
5: Taboo Tuesday (17)
6: Judgment day (17) 
7: ECW ONS (16) 
8: Unforgiven (14.5)
9: Backlash (13.5)
10: Survivor Series (11)
11: No mercy (11)
12: Armageddon(10)
13: New Year’s Revolution (9.5)
14: The bash (6.5)
15: No way out (4.5)*

*So that’s the 2005 reviews! Here are my top 25 PPV matches of the year 



Spoiler:  list



1: Triple H vs Batista-Vengeance: ****3/4

2: Triple H vs Ric Flair- Survivor series: ****3/4 

3: Triple H vs Ric Flair- Taboo Tuesday- ****1/2 

4: Edge vs Matt Hardy- Unforgiven ****1/2

5: Randy Orton vs The Undertaker- WM 21: ****1/2

6: Money in the bank match- WM 21: ****1/2 

7: Randy Orton vs Chris Jericho vs Chris Benoit vs Edge vs Triple H vs Batista- NYR: ****1/2

8: Randy Orton vs The Undertaker- Summerslam: ****1/4

9: The Royal Rumble match: ****1/4 

10: Shawn Michaels vs Kurt Angle- Vengeance: ****1/4 

11: Chris Jericho vs Shelton Benjamin- Backlash: ****1/4 

12: Randy Orton vs The Undertaker- No mercy: ****1/4 

13: Shawn Michaels vs John Cena vs Kurt Angle: ****1/4

14: Rey Mysterio vs Eddie Gurrero-The Bash: ****

15: Kurt Angle vs Shawn Michaels- WM 21: ****

16: JBL vs John Cena-JD: ****

17: Rey Mysterio vs Eddie Gurrero- JD: ****

18: Randy Orton vs The Undertaker- Armageddon: ****

19: John Cena vs Chris Jericho- Summerslam: ****

20: Hulk Hogan vs Shawn Michaels- Summerslam: ****

21: Mike Awesome vs Masato Tanaka- ECW ONS: ****

22: Edge vs Chris Benoit- Backlash: ****

23: Team RAW vs Team SD!- SVS-****

24: Eddie Gurrero vs Rey Mysterio-Summerslam: ***3/4

25: John Cena vs Chris Jericho vs Christian- Vengeance: ***3/4


*​


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

smitty915 said:


> *
> FINAL PPV MOTY: Batista vs the Undertaker( Vengeance)*


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


>


Oh shit haha

Fixed


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

anybody got a link to taht arn/muta :banderas

Edit: foley/kawada is the HUSTLE match Cody ?


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Took a break from January 2005 weeklies to watch SD.. hopefully something good, didn't get spoiled


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

As usual, I just watched the Orton/Cena stuff from Smackdown and skimmed through the rest. That video package is :mark: and hopefully they'll show it before the match on Sunday because that shit gets me hyped every time. (will be Benoit's first "appearance" since Vengeance 2007 )

Good promo by Cena where he kept it fully serious and Orton's apology was also well done. He's really improved his mic work since turning heel. He's been on point every time since that "Ravishing" promo before his match with Big E Langston.

And Orton/Taker HIAC is always :mark:.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The Great Muta did an excellent job carrying old man Arn to a good match. Now to watch him do the same to Dick Murdoch.

I watched everything except the Cena/Orton stuff per usual and I thought Smackdown this week was not bad.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

funnyfaces1 said:


> The Great Muta did an excellent job carrying old man Arn to a good match. Now to watch him do the same to Dick Murdoch.


Yeah Mutoh's worthless selling really pulls those matches together. 

Also Arn was 32 in 1990. OLD MAN? I think not, you willy. That's one of my favourite things about Arn, actually. He comes off like an old man even in his young years. Yoshiaki Fujiwara has that going x 1000. Looked the same in 2011 that he did 1983, because he just never looked young. 



RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Edit: foley/kawada is the HUSTLE match Cody ?


Yeah, only one. If there's another Kawada/Foley beside that one then you should alert everyone immediately.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Has anyone seen the best of IYH DVD?

Yay or nay to put on XMAS list?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The Great Muta is better than Shinya Hashimoto, Yuji Nagata, and Riki Choshu put together. Hey, why not add Tatsumi Fujinami into this too? At least Muta succeeded in the States, unlike Hashimoto/Nagata/Fujinami :side:

In all seriousness though, Muta and Arn were two of my three favorites from late 80s-early 90s WCW. Now to find Arn vs. Big Josh. I remember that match being REALLY good. It's also fun pissing off the man they call Jheri.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> Has anyone seen the best of IYH DVD?
> 
> Yay or nay to put on XMAS list?


I say yay absolutely, even with the repeats like Foley/Michaels and Bret/Davey, it's still awesome. Plus it has Jeff Jarrett best match ever, against Michaels. Also has Foley/Rock LMS and Foley/Shamrock plus a few other goodies. One of WWE better releases in a while.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Stocking Filler said:


> Forgot about the match against Lawler. That is pretty good actually.


Both of his matches with Lawler were fantastic.

I'm gonna watch the TLC match right now :mark:


----------



## admiremyclone (Aug 7, 2007)

I was thinking of popping in the new Mid-South Blu-Ray. Is it a good set? What are the best matches on this thing?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Did you just recommend that skins watch moxley vs brain damage TO CHEER HIMSELF UP???? That's the one where BD takes a frleaking skil saw to Ambrose head right??? You sick fuck :lmao


Dailymotion has both the Tournament of Death w/saw & ECW Arena matches on there. Best of both worlds. :troll


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Are there any matches from this week's TV worth watching? Only things I've watched all week are NXT and the closing segment to Raw.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

ehh punk/ambrose raw was ok, I think their sd was better though IMO. I skipped sd as well so idk


^^ lol that czw matches were the only ones I skipped last night, not my cup of tea


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Has anyone seen the best of IYH DVD?
> 
> Yay or nay to put on XMAS list?


Ive actually put together my own 'best of' as i have all the IYH's on DVD:


> *Best Of WWF In Your House - Custom Set by zep81*
> 
> _*All matches are sourced from my original Tagged Classic IYH DVD's and are uncompressed/Unedited/Unblurred*_
> 
> ...


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Just like a WWE "best of" set, you managed to throw in some real shitty matches!!!


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Just like a WWE "best of" set, you managed to throw in some real shitty matches!!!


Hey, the propaganda machine has obviously gotten to me


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

How were these two matches?:

Fatal 4 Way '10 - Sheamus vs. John Cena vs. Randy Orton vs. Edge 

Over the Limit 2012 - Fatal Four Way Match for the World Heavyweight Championship, Sheamus (Champion) vs. Alberto Del Rio vs. Randy Orton vs. Chris Jericho.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

F4W match was pretty shit, OTL was fun and decent, but nothing more (got crazy overrated when it happened I seem to recall though).


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Luke Harper's festive Lariat said:


> Are there any matches from this week's TV worth watching? Only things I've watched all week are NXT and the closing segment to Raw.


I thought that the Rhodes vs. Real Americans match from SD was solid.



LilOlMe said:


> How were these two matches?:
> 
> Fatal 4 Way '10 - Sheamus vs. John Cena vs. Randy Orton vs. Edge
> 
> Over the Limit 2012 - Fatal Four Way Match for the World Heavyweight Championship, Sheamus (Champion) vs. Alberto Del Rio vs. Randy Orton vs. Chris Jericho.


I haven't seen the first one, but the second one you listed is a pretty fun match from an underrated PPV (yeah, I said it).


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> How were these two matches?:
> 
> Fatal 4 Way '10 - Sheamus vs. John Cena vs. Randy Orton vs. Edge
> 
> Over the Limit 2012 - Fatal Four Way Match for the World Heavyweight Championship, Sheamus (Champion) vs. Alberto Del Rio vs. Randy Orton vs. Chris Jericho.


I could've sworn that you saw the second one when going through my Orton list. Anyways, that one is loads of fun. The F4W match is bad, though. Didn't like it much at all.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Yeah the OTL match is lots of fun, I think I remember rating it in the ****3/4* range. I thought every guy was good in it.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Thanks for answering, all, and I forgot to say earlier, thanks zep and funnyfaces for answering my questions a week ago.




Choke2Death said:


> I could've sworn that you saw the second one when going through my Orton list. Anyways, that one is loads of fun. The F4W match is bad, though. Didn't like it much at all.


Yep, it turns out I did see the OTL match. How did I have no memory?! This is what I said:


> > 78. Randy Orton vs Sheamus vs Chris Jericho vs Alberto del Rio – Over the Limit 2012
> 
> 
> Fun match. Really picked up as it got toward the end. That face off between Del Rio and Jericho was kind of atrocious. Seems like Del Rio has really grown in leaps in bounds, in terms of his aggressiveness and heel mannerisms nowadays.
> ...



How are these matches?:

Sheamus vs. John Cena - Tables Match for the WWE Title, TLC 2009

Sheamus vs. John Morrison - King of the Ring Final, 11/29/2012


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

> How are these matches?:
> 
> Sheamus vs. John Cena - Tables Match for the WWE Title, TLC 2009
> 
> Sheamus vs. John Morrison - King of the Ring Final, 11/29/2012


Sheamus/JOMO is fantastic, those guys had such great chemistry together.

I've always enjoyed Cena/Sheamus, it's just a straight up brawl between the 2.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Do yourself a favor and watch every single Sheamus/Morrison match. That was the first time Sheamus had a good string of matches.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

^Never saw the Goldust feud, did you?


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Do yourself a favor and watch every single Sheamus/Morrison match. That was the first time Sheamus had a good string of matches.


(Y)(Y)(Y)

Fantastic series, imo.

On the topic of Fatal Four Ways, nothing will beat the Cena/Edge/Orton/HBK match for me. Still one of my favorite matches to watch.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I liked the Goldust feud, but the matches left me desiring for more.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Someone say four way:






:mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Goldust/Sheamus matches were mostly :mark:. Glad I got to see them again for my ECW 09 project, along with their Superstars match(es) too. I never realised Sheamus didn't suck straight away. Guess it didn't help that once he won the title his first PPV match was against Orton 8*D.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Dat fatal 4 way match :banderas


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

So it just occurred to me today that I no longer have Sky. Which means I can't order Sky Box Office PPV's. Such as RR and WM. Can UK peoples order online or is it just a North Americans thing?


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

I'm sure this has been discussed in here already but two releases I'm looking forward to in 2014 are the Best WCW PPV matches and the Ultimate Warrior collection. 

SO many gems that are unreleased from the WCW vault. What do you guys wanna see on it? 

Give me shit all you want about the Warrior set but it should be entertaining at least. What matches do you think will be on it? Hopefully the Warrior/Savage rematch from Summerslam so its on blu ray. 

Thoughts?


----------



## Martyn (Feb 21, 2010)

Finally got to see Royal Rumble 2003 dvd. I found this show good with one all-time classic in Angle vs. Benoit, decent powerful opener in Show vs. Lesnar, nice tag team action, fun Triple H vs. Scott Steiner and entertaining Royal Rumble match. I know that people think that Steiner/Hunter match was a disaster, but i think that it wasnt that bad, maybe just because I'm a fan of both. Why people are comparing Benoit/Angle to Nagata/Angle match from NJPW 1/4/08 Dome show? I've seen that japanese match first and thought that they've repeated some spots from RR match, but both matches have nothing in common, imo.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Martyn said:


> Finally got to see Royal Rumble 2003 dvd. I found this show good with *one all-time classic in Angle vs. Benoit*, decent powerful opener in Show vs. Lesnar, nice tag team action, *fun Triple H vs. Scott Steiner* and entertaining Royal Rumble match.


Only one of the bolded would be agreed upon by anyone else in this thread, and it isn't the TECHNICAL MASTERPIECE.  :kurt


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Really? Because I don't agree with either .


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I find HHH vs. Steiner FUN in a disaster comedy kind of way. As in I can't watch it without laughing at least a few times. :HHH2


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Someone say four way:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



This match never gets old! Bret superplexing :vader? Fuck yes! :mark::mark::mark::mark:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

MachoMadness1988 said:


> This match never gets old! Bret superplexing :vader? Fuck yes! :mark::mark::mark::mark:


That match rules on so many levels. Yet another reason to buy the IYH set Smitty. Made the top 50 on my best WWE matches list. Best 4 way ever, makes that Backlash match Brye pimped look like child's play, and that's still a hell of a match.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I finally watched the Final Four match a week or so ago for my 1997 run and it was epic. ★★★★¼ for it. Same as the Backlash four way. I can easily think of triple threats, but I really can't think of many four ways that are of this caliber.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Speaking of which, why don't more people talk about this great match from 2005? C2D once said that he didn't like that there weren't any Benoit/Taker interactions in this match, but that's all I ever heard regarding it. I would put this match over a lot of the marveled matches from 2005.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> I finally watched the Final Four match a week or so ago for my 1997 run and it was epic. ★★★★¼ for it. Same as the Backlash four way. I can easily think of triple threats, but I really can't think of many four ways that are of this caliber.


Did you happen to check out the Talk is Jericho podcast this week? He talks to Austin again, and brings up Benoit and the GOAT Raw match, the power trip tag :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The disappointment is what caused me to not be able to enjoy that elimination match very much. Might have to rewatch it at some point but no, I wouldn't put it anywhere near most of my 2005 favorite matches. TV or PPV.



Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Did you happen to check out the Talk is Jericho podcast this week? He talks to Austin again, and brings up Benoit and the GOAT Raw match, the power trip tag :mark:


Nah, I don't follow those. But now that you mention it, I have to hunt it down. :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Not too crazy on that SD 05 match for the title that never is.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

That Smackdown was the last time I ever marked out for Batista, and the second to last time I marked out in 2005 overall (thank you Matt Hardy).


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I stopped watching wrestling for a few months around that time. Cena and Batista as champs. Spending months feuding with JBL each. NONONONONONONO. Was the Orton/Undertaker casket match and the possibility of EDDIE GUERRERO ending Batista's title reign that brought me back. Saw an ad on the Sunday evening for No Mercy and ordered it .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Starting RR 04 now 

 for everything not the rumble


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I still can't believe that 12 year old me actually liked the Holly/Lesnar feud.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

The 9 year old me didn't give a shit about that feud.

Then again, the 9 year old me enjoyed the Eddie vs. Chavo feud from that same month


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> Nah, I don't follow those. But now that you mention it, I have to hunt it down. :mark:


http://podcastone.com/Talk-Is-Jericho

Listening to it right now. Haven't gotten to the Power Trip tag yet though.

Always forget that one of the names they gave Austin before he was "Stone Cold" was Otto von Ruthless :lmao :lmao


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Finished listening half an hour ago. Normally I'd say it was a waste of nearly an hour just to get to that one minute but they have some interesting things to say elsewhere on it so it was worth it. Like when they admit that they don't like things the way they are now and preferred it back in their heydays.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

About to start the Rumble, literally ONE on the CAL scale so far :lmao


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

You didn't enjoy HHH vs. HBK in the EPIC Last Man Standing match?! Almost as EPIC as their Hell In A Cell or Three SOH. :hbk :trips


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm so scared of rewatching their Summerslam 2002 match. I have four of their matches at one star or below. FOUR! And now I'm rewatching their Tribute to the Troops match which may make it to five. And if you include the 1997 "match", then that would be SIX!


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I didn't HATE it, but it wasn't anything good 

THIS RUMBLE DOE :mark:


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

The Boot Camp match? That'll probably end up being below * too :lmao


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I still love the Summerslam match, but the HIAC is shit. LMS is nothing great, but not a dud, I don't think. The only two matches I like between Shawn/Hunter are Summerslam and December 29, 2003 Raw.

Not even bothering with the Tribute to the Troops match.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao at the disappointed face of one of the soldiers after that match. Can't disagree with him there. Their 1996 match together on RAW was pretty good.

Also rewatched HHH/Cena NoC 2008 today and it dropped like crazy. Felt like the most cookie-cutter main event match ever made. It's been over a year since I last saw it and I had no recollection of everything, but I kept rolling my eyes at every move in that match.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Royal Rumble 2004 review 

Match #1: Batista and Ric Flair vs The Dudleyz*

I remember this being fucking horrible of an opener, and its sounds like this on paper. The Dudleyz post 2001? Batista in 2004? SOUNDS FUCKING DISGUSTING. Worse things is that these guys have been facing each other on RAW like..EVERY FUCKING WEEK, so I have seen how bad this will be. Well this was extremely short, and fucking shitty as fuck, not good at all whatsoever. Their RAW matches weren’t bad, they were just boring, this is flat out SHITTY, the tables stip is shitty 99% of the time, and it has nothing at all on the :mark: tables match from the RR 2000, because that was fucking amazing. This is one of my least favorite Evolution tags and it was just….terrible. DUD 

*CAL SCALE: 0 

Match #2: Jamie Noble vs Rey Mysterio*

I remember this was decent, but just WAY too short to be able for them to be able to get anything going. Although I did Love Noble here when he was using a blind Nidia to win titles, stupid but comical. Well I said it was short I thought it was in the 5 minute range, this was WAY too short to even try to be good. It was easily less than 2-3 minutes and they just couldn’t get a good match going. There’s a difference between a fun sprint and a somewhat competitive squash, this was easily the latter. The match however was fine for the time given but not long enough at all. * 

*CAL SCALE: 0

Match #3: Eddie Gurrero vs Chavo Gurrero*

BOO Chavo! YAY for Eddie! I remember this sucking out loud, but it will probably be somewhat short so its fine by me. Funny that this is the payoff for a breakup of a tag team that was together for over 2 years. Also, why the fuck is Angle involved in this storyline? He needs to be just…away or something, in a match yes, but not in this shit. Another BORING match here, getting even more bored than the first match. Some cool spots here but most of it was boring mat work, and considering Chavo cant mat wrestle to save his life it gets bad quick. Yeah so this match is another pretty shitty match goes way too long and should have been a squash, giving the CW match way more time, fuck this shit and this show so far. *1/4 

*CAL SCALE: 0.5 

Match #4: Hardcore Holly vs Brock Lesnar *

:lmao at BOB FUCKING HOLLY in a WWE title match! Bob Holly is literally one of my least favorite wresters ever, no idea why, just cant stand watching the guy work. Only reason Im watching this is because it’s a WWE title match and I’m pretty sure its short, which is good. I love how everyone knows Holly’s losing, can you imagine him as the WWE champion? Would legit be one of the worst title reigns ever, and we thought fucking Goldberg’s reign was bad :lol. Boring chants break out almost immediately, and I seem to be able to lose my attention extremely easy because its so dull. So yeah, BORING BORING BORING is the theme of this match. Lesnar hits a F5 and this is over, also last PPV win for Lesnar till SS 2012. Shitty match all around and one of the worst feuds ever, we all know how shitty this is haha, at least they kept it short. ½*

*CAL SCALE: 0

Match #5: Triple H vs Shawn Michaels( LMS match)*

FUCK THESE TWO CUNTS, Literally dreading this match more than the Holly/Lesnar match, and I hate watching matches that I know will end in DQ, because every pinfall or “Count” in this case is irrelevant. Also only match I’ve ever seen from these two that I like is the Summerslam match, everything else can go to hell, even the Hell in a Cell match that I’ve never seen, NOT looking forward to watching that at all. I hate how they booked this feud as like: OMG DA FEUD OF THE DECADE when they already had a feud in 2002, that was enough IMO. I mean, I feel like through 2002-2004 like half of the PPVS had HBK/HHH on it, BORING! Not a fan of this match at all, I’ve seen ****1/2 thrown out for it and I jut don’t see it, not enough energy in it at all and the count out ending is shitty as fuck. Some good stuff here but mostly bad shit. **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5

Match #6: The Royal Rumble match*

YAY! About fucking time we get to the rumble, because this show has been complete shit so far. BENOIT is out first so the rumble is fucking amazing already, really looking forward to when Benoit goes on RAW, because he’s in a sea of shit on SD. I mean Lesnar and Eddie are there too, but Lesnar never wrestles and Eddie is with Chavo, so enough said :lol. Orton is out at #2 and we get a Summerslam preview! For a good…90 seconds! Mark Henry is out at #3 after a good brawl between Orton and Benoit. Why was Henry so bad? He literally sucked up until like 2011, and now he’s amazing, if only he learned how to wrestle a little earlier. TAJIRI is out at #4, this guy should have been a fucking World champion, and have the sinister minister come back to manage him. After some awesome Tajiri moments, BRADSHAW comes in, if only we knew he’d be WWE champion soon, weird that he’s like a lower midcarder here, and gets eliminated QUICK. So I then mark out when RHYNO comes in at #5 :mark:

Rhyno destroys everything for a second, which is pretty fucking amazing, but then Tajiri gets eliminated, which is sad. But then Henry is gone too! So all is well in the world again! Also cool that BENOIT eliminated him. At #6 is Matt Hardy, who is like a jobber in 2004 I think. BIG POPPA PUMP is in at #7, everyone is praying that he isn’t getting another push after those two WHC matches last year :lol. Matt Morgan is in at #8, everyone talks about this guy, but I forget who he is, pretty sure he was in TNA though, so they probably misused him or some shit like that. We get a couple BELLY TO BELLY’S from Steiner, basically his finishing move right? At #9 is HURRICANE! Wait, does anyone give a shit? No? Okay, move on then. Well, he lasts like 30 seconds after Morgan fucking tosses him out of the ring haha, awesome! At #10 is Booker T, who apparently is a favorite according to JR, :lol OKAY SURE JR

Why the fuck is Steiner in here still? Guy is literally one of the more useless pieces of shit ever TBH, well his tag work is good in WCW so he is forgiven. Oh wait Steiner Is eliminated as Kane comes in at #11, coincidence? I THINK NOT! HEY TAKER IS IN AT #12! Oh waitt no he’s not! Kane is out after the distraction and he KILLS the fuck outta Spike Dudley, pretty funny TBH :lol. So RIKiSHI is out at #13, wow I don’t give a shit about any of these people, I guess its just that point in the Rumble where all the midcarders come in. Yep it is as I don’t give a shit about Rene Dupree at #14 either, Rumble starting to get boring, as Mat Hardy and Dupree are eliminated, and its down to Kishi, Booker, Morgan Benoit, and Orton as A-train comes in at #15. 

BENOIT eliminates Matt Morgan, :mark: at how their trying to put him over, fucking amazing for sure. Rikishi and Booker are out, AWESOME for sure, just Benoit, Orton, and…A-train? Kind of random but OK. Hey Shelton Benjamin is here at #16! And A-train gets eliminated! What an amazing three guys in the rumble ATM. BUT AS I SAY THIS BENJAMIN GETS ELIMINATED! So its down to #1 and #2 after 26 minutes according to Tazz, cool I guess. At #17 is…Ernest Miller? Who is he? And why does he have Brodus Clay’s entrance music? So fucking stupid, like thank god Benoit and Orton bury them. Angle is out at 18 and I’m kind of happy he’s here, don’t mind him TOO much TBH, better than the shitty midcarders for sure. Rico is in at #19 and he seems like a Fandango copycat, so fucking dumb at this point, but this rumble is still :mark: so its okay. Luckily he gets buried by Orton, and Angle nearly gets him, thank god no though.

Test is at #21, wait no he isn’t? IT’S MICK FUCKING FOELY! HES HERE! MICK FOLEY IS HERE! ORTON AND FOLEY ARE GONE! I already knew this happened but IDGAF, its always amazing as shit. This is where the rumble gets good, although I can’t remember the numbers right, but it’s not like anyone gives a shit right? :lol At #22 is Christian, here to kill the vibe it seems. Meanwhile Foley is beating the shit out of Orton, but Orton fights back, good stuff. As Nunzio comes out at #23, Foley gives him the claw :lol, funny shit right here. Meanwhile Nunzio sits and waits outside :lmao. At #24..ITS DA BIG BAD SHOW TONIGHT! That music is so much better than..WELLLLLLLLLLL ITS THEEE BIIIG SHOOW. Shitty shit at its finest there. He beats the shit outta everyone but Jericho is out at #25! 

Jericho goes right after Angle for some reason, the tension between Christian and him is beginning, DAT MANIA BUILD. All the guys try to eliminate Big Show, but hes like: NAH FUCK ALL YOU BITCHES and stays in. Charlie Haas is in at #26, and he doesn’t do very much but take chops from Show. Chris Jericho eliminates Christian with some more MANIA BUILD. Billy Gunn at 27? Really? Fuck him and…I’M AN ASS MAN theme. Cena is in at #28 to a monster pop, guy was so over at the time, they did kind of fuck him up though, the rapping gimmick as really funny TBH, his current gimmick is stupid as shit. RVD is in at #29 and you can feel DA TENSION BUILDING! Goldberg is in at #30 as known, hope he buries some jobbers! Yep beats the shit out of everyone it seemed, a lot of people in the ring ATM, including Nunzio :lol. Berg eliminates two guys, and the its Lesnar! F5, but no elimination? OK, that’s shitty. Angle soon eliminates him, pretty good stuff, too bad they fucked up their match that could have been great . Final four is Jericho, Show, Benoit, and Angle. Jericho is out next and then its Show, Benoit, and Angle. Angle goes next and its down to Show vs Benoit. Show nearly eliminates Benoit but he counters, and then their on the ropes, SHOW GOES OVER! BENOIT WIN THE RUMBLE! 

BUT DID HE? 

Pretty awesome rumble, probably in my top 5 all time! ****1/2

*CAL SCALE: 7

FINAL CAL SCALE: 8

So a COMPLETE one match show that can barely save it  

CURRENT MOTY: The Royal Rumble match

Current 2004 PPV Rankings 

1: The Royal Rumble( 8) 
*​


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

smitty915 said:


> Also, why the fuck is Angle involved in this storyline? He needs to be just…away or something, in a match yes, but not in this shit.


Gotta build dat Mania match. :usangle


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

What a legend Benoit is. He single-handedly saved a PPV!

If I build a collection of DVDs in the future, I will get RR04 solely for him. WWE can thank the man later.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> What a legend Benoit is. He single-handedly saved a PPV!
> 
> If I build a collection of DVDs in the future, I will get RR04 solely for him. WWE can thank the man later.


Can you imagine if you inserted the 2006 or 2012 rumble into that show?

 at how bad that show would be, like WOAT level


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The 06 Rumble wasn't that bad. (dull middle portion otherwise it was good) 2012, however, would fit right in with the rest of that card.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Just watched Chris Jericho and RVD vs Evolution 3 on 2 handicap match from the night after the rumble in 04

Outstanding match, try to find it


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Benoit did not just save the Rumble, but he saved RAW in 2004 and carried 2002 on his back. Wherever Benoit goes, greatness follows. The MVP of this wrestling game, no doubt.

Going back to something I mentioned prior, but what matches for you guys are ones that you just don't ever want to rewatch so that you could maintain a high opinion of it? I feel that way for Flair/Michaels WM 24. Still have not rewatched that match since it aired. Other matches like that for me are HHH/Austin NM 99, Undertaker/HHH WM 28, Undertaker/Edge SS 08, Jericho/Austin NWO 02, and the Benoit/HHH Ironman match.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Angle vs. Benoit from RR03. I haven't watched the match in years and it used to be my favorite match, but my taste has changed a lot since then. I don't wanna hate that match, even though I kinda know it's shit now  :angle2


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Evolution tag against RVD and Jericho is decent but not really among my favorites which is not to say it's bad. Other than Rumble, the best match in January 2004 is RVD vs Orton. For an underrated Evolution tag, Batista/Flair vs RVD/Booker from the draft show is pretty solid but understandably because there's no Orton or Benoit involved in it.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Benoit did not just save the Rumble, but he saved RAW in 2004 and carried 2002 on his back. Wherever Benoit goes, greatness follows. The MVP of this wrestling game, no doubt.


To be fair, Raw had plenty of great stuff that didn't involve him that year too. But yeah, his presence always made everyone step their game up and give us something better.



> Going back to something I mentioned prior, but what matches for you guys are ones that you just don't ever want to rewatch so that you could maintain a high opinion of it? I feel that way for Flair/Michaels WM 24. Still have not rewatched that match since it aired. Other matches like that for me are HHH/Austin NM 99, Undertaker/HHH WM 28, Undertaker/Edge SS 08, Jericho/Austin NWO 02, and the Benoit/HHH Ironman match.


I don't ever feel that way. If I'm not sure about my opinion on something, I'll confront the match instead of staying away just so I can praise it. Hell, I just watched Benoit/Angle from RR to see if it held up and because I downloaded the Benoit DVD a few days ago. Still love it, specially the finishing stretch but don't know if it's quite a five star match for me anymore. Four and a half is more like it.

Same works in reverse if I dislike a match. Best example being Punk/Bryan from MITB. Thought it was awful at first but then I rewatched and while I still can't say I like it, I rate it around the average mark now. Another example is Orton/Punk before MITB this year. Thought it was boring but on rewatch it turned out a bit better and sorta enjoyable.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> ehh punk/ambrose raw was ok, I think their sd was better though IMO. I skipped sd as well so idk
> 
> 
> ^^ lol that czw matches were the only ones I skipped last night, not my cup of tea


booourns. At least that means you saw Kawada vs Foley. Foley repping MONSTER!

also: omg the 5/11/98 Nitro is SHIT. First bad edition in a long time.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I've delayed my WCW watching until after I finish my last few finals. The show has started dragging a bit. I looked at the lineup for 5/11/98 and I remember why I don't remember a thing from it. Skipped damn near everything :lol. The week after was short, fun, and to the point.

IYH: Over The Edge is almost done, and all I can say is that if you watch everything but the main event, you would get an event on the caliber of HOW.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That's a top contender for worst PPV I've ever seen. No hyperbole. Fully legit. Good lord. Yet, it has the WWF 1998 MOTY on it. Go figure.

but still, thanks to the main event some of those TNA PPVs still have it beat for potential #1.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

What are some of those awful TNA PPVs besides Against All Odds 2010? I must know what they are if I ever wanna punish myself. Hope that there's plenty of psycho Angle, Jeff Jarrett, and lazy Sting!


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> booourns. At least that means you saw Kawada vs Foley. Foley repping MONSTER!
> 
> also: omg the 5/11/98 Nitro is SHIT. First bad edition in a long time.


Yes I did :lenny yes I did


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Victory Road 2004. (Jeff Hardy is on meth here. It's hilarious.)
Victory Road 2011. (Jeff Hardy is on meth here again. And it's hilarious, but more importantly, infamous.)
Against All Odds 2005. (omg at Hardy vs Abyss - JESUS)
Destination X 2005. (Jarrett actually has a fun match on this show vs DDP, tbf)
Lockdown 2008.
Destination X 2007. (GIMMICK CITY - it's fun on a hilarity aspect + ends with a really swell Joe vs Christian match. Think OTL '98 format)
Genesis 2013. (Park vs Devon & the three way are good matches, but the rest...oh my.)
Final Resolution 2009.
Sacrifice 2011.

That's enough to get the point for now. They're some real treasures. Oof.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I faintly remember liking three matches from Final Resolution 2009 a lot (opener, Wolfe/Angle, Daniels/Styles). Everything else looks disgusting though. Against All Odds 2005 also had another decent Styles/Daniels match. Am I on meth, or was there a PPV at one point where Kurt Angle possessed and had to defend every title the company had? :kurt

The PPVs after Over The Edge look even worse. KOTR 98 was another one match show with a horrible main event, Fully Loaded did not have anything good at all, and Summerslam is so damn overrated. Can't wait to watch Rock/HHH again so that my opinion can drop like it should. My goodness, HHH is among the worst wrestlers in the company in 98, and that's saying something when you're surrounded by Kama Mustafa, the Headbangers, and the Legion of freakin' Doom.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Am I on meth, or was there a PPV at one point where Kurt Angle possessed and had to defend every title the company had? :kurt


:angle2

That sounds like the greatest thing *EVER*.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That Angle PPV was No Surrender 2007. And it was > all the shows I mentioned. Expect two of the Angle matches that night were shit. Kazarian vs Roode was so good.

Final Resolution 2009 is total crap. Dead crowd, Angle vs Wolfe is super bad, & British Invasion vs Guns is crappy too. Only match that's not a pile of wank is Daniels vs Styles. Which is solid, but suffers from heatless moments thanks to the crowd. Normally that doesn't matter too much to me _(IE Generico vs Callihan from EVOLVE in 2012)_ but it didn't do the match any favors for the two involved. 

I like Styles vs Daniels from AAO '05, but I feel it's overrated by most. Not nearly that perfect match some claim it to be. It's still good.

Almost certain nothing tops Over the Edge as the overall worst in 1998, but I could be wrong. KOTR is shitty too outside of the double main event. Well, that's probably a disservice to the Kaientai filler match & Owen vs X-Pac, but those are a bit blurry. Meanwhile the bad matches are vivid as ever. How? HHH is like a lot in 1998 - they suck. LOD though. What happened to those guys...


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Angle vs Lethal @ No Surrender 07 is :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Between that or vs Joe from Genesis 2006 have got to be the clear picks for his best matches in TNA. Considering 99% of the rest out there blows.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

You seem to have forgotten about Sting/Angle BFG 07 :usangle


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:lmao

you coy motherfucker.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> :lmao
> 
> you coy motherfucker.


:trips2


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)




----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Oh you are not upstaging me Van Der Beek :hogan2


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's done. BRICK FROG stole the show like how Goldberg does on most WCW events. _(if MENG isn't there)_


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Chris Hero could take Goldberg!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Match of the century.

and to think, maybe it could have happened on a large scale if Trips didn't use his potato headed ways to get Hero cut. 8*D


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Speaking of which, Goldberg/Glacier was pretty fun, but I've reached that point in my WCW watch where I'm getting tired of watching the same old squash.

Am I wrong for thinking Naomichi Marufuji kinda sucks?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Goldberg's presence still gives me chills. Fans erupt and it's just such a hot portion of the show. I can't say no, even if some of the matches week by week are essential of the same mold. Not all of them are though.

I like Marufuji. However, I can see the gripes some folk have with him & I have been incredibly turned off by NOAH's "long for the sake of long" forced epics that have plagued aspects of their companym, which had Marafuji be a part of on more than one occasion, Juniors or now currently in heavyweights; those matches were ugh. Honestly, KENTA is far worse imo. Went from liking him, to now loathing his work. Why that company just doesn't revert to putting everything behind Morishima is beyond me. He's still their best guy. Key word: STILL.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Being the biggest Punk worshipper around, it did kinda always annoy me when people used to refer to him as a KENTA impersonator even back in his ECW days. I like (err... liked) KENTA, but I rarely ever feel emotionally invested in his matches, especially in recent times. KENTA can execute moves to perfection, but I prefer watching Punk's sloppy moves over empty maneuvers done for no good reason. 

Of course, in a perfect world the best wrestlers combine great move placement and perfect execution (see Regal), but I would take a horribly looking move like Christian's spear that is timed perfectly over a perfectly executed one that doesn't have much thought into it. Execution was never much of a criteria of how I judge wrestlers; so long as people are safe, I'm happy.

While I still feel this way, I don't really think Ultimo Dragon should be considered elite. I can't think of too many matches that I love because of him and not the other guy. Too often I see him ruin matches by no-selling. That's not to say I don't love him, but among the WCW/NJPW juniors, he is in the middle tier.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Ultimo is massively overrated. Not bad (I've seen him be bad, though), but I've seen serious publishers (like Meltzer Jrs) say that Ultimo may have been the best wrestler of the 90s. Often a no-seller and tries to execute moves that he can't pull of without tripping over or something. Not very fond of him working over a guy, either (none of those Rey matches do much for me any more). I think he's at his best in Mexico, for whatever reason. Like, he's legitimately a better worker there and actually hits his stuff more cleanly. Best match is from there, too. I think he got almost carried in said best match, but I thought he looked good. I guess not 'carried' in a 'carried' way, but more 'carried' in a 'he was good but the other guy is an all time great who would have had a MOTYC with any average wrestler that night' kind of way. 

I almost don't like KENTA at all. Never have and probably never will. At his worst he is pure grade A dogshit, but at his best he is really, really, really good. It's just that his 'bad' is the Davey Richards-level shit that is my least favourite kind of thing you can do in wrestling (or it's a tie between that and whatever you call Chuck Taylor doing..."being a fuckhead who should have his oxygen privileges removed", maybe). Through unbiased eyes I have to give KENTA credit for this and that, but I'll never be a fan. I'll be honest - and I may get heat for this - I think Punk at his worst was just as bad. He was ripping off bad KENTA spots and executing them much worse than KENTA was. I don't get too emotionally involved in an early WWE Punk match, either. He's always been a great 'feud' wrestler (working around whatever story or whatnot is going on - the Albright strap match is excellent for an early WWE example and I haven't even watched the rest of that feud), but I really don't like early WWE Punk enough to care about anything he was doing. Even that match with Rey didn't hold with me at all. I should watch that Umaga series. That has to be at least somewhat good. 

Marufuji is arguably the worst Japanese wrestler of all time. Definitely my least favourite. I'd rather watch Kofi Kingston.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Rock/Goldberg rocked. ***3/4

- - - - -

KENTA and Marufuji were awesome as Juniors, especially when facing heavyweights, it was very easy to get behind them. Young, catlike fast, hard-hitting, high-flying, lovable. In fact, I adored KENTA as a Junior, and I adore his pre-'10 stuff (that SUWA match! :mark. Loved his style. But, as Harry Callahan once said, "a man's got to know his limitations", they got cocky and are spending the last 7 (Marufuji) and 3 (KENTA) years on trying to convince people they're heavyweights. Jushin Liger was/is bigger and better than two of them combined, but he never went looney, he was booking New Japan in 2000 and didn't bother with trying to cheat us into thinking he's a heavyweight wrestler.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Victory Road 2004. (Jeff Hardy is on meth here. It's hilarious.)
> Victory Road 2011. (Jeff Hardy is on meth here again. And it's hilarious, but more importantly, infamous.)
> Against All Odds 2005. (omg at Hardy vs Abyss - JESUS)
> Destination X 2005. (Jarrett actually has a fun match on this show vs DDP, tbf)
> ...


Sacrifice 2011 is a great shout. CHYNA. 

Best match on the card was probably Kendrick vs. Eckos, legit. 

Tommy Dreamer, Chris Harris/Braden Walker, Chyna and Karen Jarrett all on Pay Per View in 2011. 

Shit, remember when everyone thought Harris would be the most successful member of AMW? Ha. :troll

Edit: The only times I've seen Marufuji and KENTA are when they were regularly competing in ROH, although I want to say I;ve seen a KENTA/Shima match from NOAH. I much preferred Marufuji over KENTA (can remember a match between Marufuji and Generico that I dug at Motor City Madness (?) and one with Claudio at somepoint, but then again there's very few who can have matches with Generico and Claudio that I won't dig.) It's safe to say, however, that I preferred the other two regular Japanese talents in Shiozaki and Morishima over those two. 

Oh, and just to keep it somewhat relevant to WWE/WCW, I started watching that Eddie Guerrero pack I spoke of on Friday, and 10/16/95 vs. Benoit is absolutely amazing. Would probably have it over their Vengeance 03 match, but I'm not the biggest advocate of that match and find it fairly dull.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

I know it's the WWE section but since it's being discussed, I would like to know what some of you think a about Japanese wrestling. There are some matches that I like, but for the most part it's not my cup of tea. I also think how the American workers try to emulate the style (and do it so wrong and poorly) it has also turned me off. When I see no selling and a bunch of elbows, I recall matches of two guys just not knowing what the hell they're doing in front of 30 people. It automatically turns me off.

I will say though, I can watch NJPW quite easily. I don't know why, but for some reason it reminds me of a Japanese version of WWE. Sure there;s the puro elements but they also have this theatrical flare to it. AJPW and especially NOAH, I just can't get myself to watch. I remember back in 2010 watching whichever match it was Meltzer gave his 2004 MOTY. Needless to say, I hated it. I was 15 back then, didn't know much about the puro style, but the no selling put me off.

Oh well, at least it can't be worse than Lucha 8*D


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Finished Summerslam 1996 and the last two matches totally saved it.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So TLC is tonight, kind of forgot about it for a second :lol

I have a feeling that Punk/shield is gonna be GREAT


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Started IYH: Mind Games just now.

Looking at the card, it's again all about HBK/Undertaker/Mankind. Weird Steve Austin didn't get more appearances; he seemed to be getting quite the push after his KOTR win.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Well I expect some good matches from SHield/Punk and Orton/Cena. Also Wyatts/Bryan can be a nice surprise and the Tag Titles Ladder match is sure gonna be entertaining


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The tag titles match is gonna be a ladder match? :mark:

About million times more pumped


----------



## peep4life (Jun 1, 2005)

watching big show climb up a ladder is always fun. Would love to see Cesaro swing a ladder around with someone on it. I have a bad feeling about two handicap matches, feel that the best downs will get boring but if anyone can pull it off its punk and Bryan

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

It would be interesting to see how the Show/Mysterio tag would work. I'm a sucker for this big man&little guy team combinations


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Srdjan99 said:


> It would be interesting to see how the Show/Mysterio tag would work. I'm a sucker for this big man&little guy team combinations


Agreed. Same here. I think it could work well. 

Hoping Mysterishow or Real Americans win the titles. I love the Goldydust tag team but they got to break them up to build to a Mania match.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Yeah 4 way tag is only thing I'm really excited for


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Is the tag team match seriously a TLC/Ladders match?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Don't think so, doesn't say so on wwe.com or anything. Jut wishful thinking I believes.


----------



## Certified G (Feb 1, 2011)

Does anyone know when the Best of Raw 20th Anniversary set comes out in Europe? I actually wanted it for Christmas but it's not out here yet so I think I'll have to wait until early next year.

The reason I'm not importing it is because I only have a region free dvd player downstairs, and the PS3 doesn't play dvd's from other regions.. =/


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'm not even sure we are getting it, haven't heard a damn thing about it coming out over here. But I'm not too bothered tbh, a bunch of crappy shows for the most part + some repeats + EDITING despite the fact they claim it's all unedited lol.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Punk vs the Shield excites me. Like, REALLY excites me. Three of my favorites in the ring at once, and Punk can make them all look really good.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

I'll watch TLC Match for Cena's hurricanranas.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Chismo said:


> I'll watch TLC Match for Cena's hurricanranas.







:ti Awful.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

NOST your post in that AJ thread :ti 144 viewing

Yea after that GOAT championship correlation segment has worn off on me as the week has pasted, I'm actually not looking forward to tonight at all, nothing interests me. Hate fatal 4's, cena/orton ehhh and 2 handicaps ? That match type should be only used in 10 min raw/sd segments not a ppv, nonetheless with your two top workers


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I don't understand why he does that. He fucks it up, and he could break his neck if it he keeps fucking up. 

I remember people jizzing when Cena did it to Punk in the Raw 2/25 match this year.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

I don't think I came for Cena's hurricanrana. Maybe I got hard a little bit? I loved that match though. One of my favorite matches this year and the Punk piledriver.....I shot my load for that I won't lie. :mark: 

So with these handicap matches are all 3 of the Shield and Wyatt fam allowed to be in the ring at one time? 

Maybe tonight is when the Shield breaks up? Rollins takes the pin and he is seen as the "weak link" and Reigns and :ambrose turn on him? Something like that should be saved for Rumble or Mania but the same could be said for a title unification match as well. So who the hell knows.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

:lmao Looks like AJ might be dropping the belt tonight. 

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/general-wwe/1056177-aj-lee-involved-incident-tribute-troops.html


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

HollyJollyHelmsley said:


> :lmao Looks like AJ might be dropping the belt tonight.
> 
> http://www.wrestlingforum.com/general-wwe/1056177-aj-lee-involved-incident-tribute-troops.html


 Good :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Really hope Natalya wins the title tonight. She's the only diva I can call myself a fan of. Really excited for Orton/Cena :mark:



CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> I'm not even sure we are getting it, haven't heard a damn thing about it coming out over here. But I'm not too bothered tbh, a bunch of crappy shows for the most part + some repeats + EDITING despite the fact they claim it's all unedited lol.


Downloaded the disc with the Benoit match and it was fucking terrible. :lol They completely cut out the opening segment with Angle, then remove his entrance as well as the recap and silence every piece of commentary that mentions him but still refer to moves that he does. ("THE TORPEDO by Benoit") Not only that, they remove the segment where Vince fires Jarrett. UNEDITED, my ass. Hope somebody sues them for false advertising. Oh well, at least we finally get to see somebody tap out to the Crossface on a WWE DVD, that's a first.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

I'm not a fan of Natty as much I'm a fan of her tits and dat ass. :datass


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> NOST your post in that AJ thread :ti 144 viewing
> 
> Yea after that GOAT championship correlation segment has worn off on me as the week has pasted, I'm actually not looking forward to tonight at all, nothing interests me. Hate fatal 4's, cena/orton ehhh and 2 handicaps ? That match type should be only used in 10 min raw/sd segments not a ppv, nonetheless with your two top workers


Should I change my name to NOST?

And I share similar thoughts on the PPV with you, with the only thing I care about being how the unification match will end. But I will be watching TLC tonight with friends, plus I've got alcohol so I should end up enjoying the show more than expected. :lol



Choke2Death said:


> Downloaded the disc with the Benoit match and it was fucking terrible. :lol They completely cut out the opening segment with Angle, then remove his entrance as well as the recap and silence every piece of commentary that mentions him but still refer to moves that he does. ("THE TORPEDO by Benoit") Not only that, they remove the segment where Vince fires Jarrett. UNEDITED, my ass. Hope somebody sues them for false advertising. Oh well, at least we finally get to see somebody tap out to the Crossface on a WWE DVD, that's a first.


Vince firing Jarrett was hilarious :lol


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Cena huracanrana off the ladder, plz. :side:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

RKO off a ladder through a table plz.  Would mark if Orton brought back the crossbody at least this once. They promised to go all out so I hope they deliver instead of keeping it kayfabe.

_(Just watched the Homecoming DVD version. Edits on here are not that much but I noticed Benoit is removed from the intro when he holds the title, his entrance is removed as well as some commentary during Christian's entrance that talks about the No Mercy fatal four way.)_


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

RKO off a ladder through a table would kill Orton. :lol

I'm sure they'll be some funny reviews in here later for Cena/Orton.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I have a bad feeling we are getting a indecisive finish and Cena and Orton are gonna half ass it so they don't risk hurting themselves and can continue the feud. I really really hope I'm wrong, but I doubt it. It just seems like WWE is making wayyyyy too big a deal about Cena/Orton for this to be a 1 match/clean finish type deal. Orton will probably be in control 75% of the time so he can be safe and not takeany bumps. And we all now how exciting Orton control segments have Been these past few months :vince2


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I really hope it's not indecisive for the sole reason that there's been so many and the match has such big implications that people want a legit ending.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I 100% DON'T CARE who wins the titles at TLC tonight as long as we actually get ONE CHAMPION and no fucking bullshit. We do not in any way, shape or form need another cena vs orton match at any time ever. End this whole thing tonight. Move on. Never to return. PLEASE.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

They cant keep doing shit finishes...


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> Ultimo is massively overrated. Not bad (I've seen him be bad, though), but I've seen serious publishers (like Meltzer Jrs) say that Ultimo may have been the best wrestler of the 90s. Often a no-seller and tries to execute moves that he can't pull of without tripping over or something. Not very fond of him working over a guy, either (none of those Rey matches do much for me any more). I think he's at his best in Mexico, for whatever reason. Like, he's legitimately a better worker there and actually hits his stuff more cleanly. Best match is from there, too. I think he got almost carried in said best match, but I thought he looked good. I guess not 'carried' in a 'carried' way, but more 'carried' in a 'he was good but the other guy is an all time great who would have had a MOTYC with any average wrestler that night' kind of way.
> 
> I almost don't like KENTA at all. Never have and probably never will. At his worst he is pure grade A dogshit, but at his best he is really, really, really good. It's just that his 'bad' is the Davey Richards-level shit that is my least favourite kind of thing you can do in wrestling (or it's a tie between that and whatever you call Chuck Taylor doing..."being a fuckhead who should have his oxygen privileges removed", maybe). Through unbiased eyes I have to give KENTA credit for this and that, but I'll never be a fan. I'll be honest - and I may get heat for this - I think Punk at his worst was just as bad. He was ripping off bad KENTA spots and executing them much worse than KENTA was. I don't get too emotionally involved in an early WWE Punk match, either. He's always been a great 'feud' wrestler (working around whatever story or whatnot is going on - the Albright strap match is excellent for an early WWE example and I haven't even watched the rest of that feud), but I really don't like early WWE Punk enough to care about anything he was doing. Even that match with Rey didn't hold with me at all. I should watch that Umaga series. That has to be at least somewhat good.
> 
> Marufuji is arguably the worst Japanese wrestler of all time. Definitely my least favourite. I'd rather watch Kofi Kingston.


I wanted to respond towards all this, but it's that last sentence where I'm fixated on.

8*D _(it's probably b/c Kofi has only worked one match at 15 minutes, meanwhile THIRTY - SIXTY MINUTE Marufuji matches are ass. Not counting the awesome one from ROH in Japan circa 2008)_


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> I have a bad feeling we are getting a indecisive finish and Cena and Orton are gonna half ass it so they don't risk hurting themselves and can continue the feud. I really really hope I'm wrong, but I doubt it. It just seems like WWE is making wayyyyy too big a deal about Cena/Orton for this to be a 1 match/clean finish type deal. Orton will probably be in control 75% of the time so he can be safe and not takeany bumps. And we all now how exciting Orton control segments have Beebe these past few months :vince


They'll definitely be playing it extra safe. Orton is injury prone and Cena's just recently recovered from an injury and WWE can't afford two of their top stars to get injured with Mania coming up. So I don't think we're going see any good bumps, and I think we're going to get a really slow and boring TLC match. WWE probably decided to not have a ladder match on the card because they'll know it would likely overshadow the Cena/Orton TLC main event.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Expecting a decent (at best) match tonight, but a Cena hurricanrana and/or an Orton cross body would automatically make the match *** 1/2.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

What if I were to tell you that Kofi Kingston > Eddie Kingston? Apparently Eddie had a historically bad performance at Final Battle. :troll

In all seriousness, I am not crazy enough to believe something like that. I mean, I would probably prefer watching Kofi over a 20 minute Goldberg match, but that's as far as I would go.

Rick Rude vs. Ultimate Warrior SS 89: ******

I think I like this Warrior match over the Savage and the Hogan one.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> What if I were to tell you that Kofi Kingston > Eddie Kingston? Apparently Eddie had a historically bad performance at Final Battle. :troll
> 
> In all seriousness, I am not crazy enough to believe something like that. I mean, I would probably prefer watching Kofi over a 20 minute Goldberg match, but that's as far as I would go.
> 
> ...



Nawwww, that match rules but the Savage match> pretty much everything. Thanks for bringing that up though I've been meaning to watch some Rick Rude.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> 8*D _(it's probably b/c Kofi has only worked one match at 15 minutes, meanwhile THIRTY - SIXTY MINUTE Marufuji matches are ass. Not counting the awesome one from ROH in Japan circa 2008)_


More do with the fact that Marufuji actually has worse offense, is a far worse seller, and is much less likely to be carried to a watch-able match.  (though the point you made is true; Kofi isn't likely to be on screen for as long, and is in a setting where it's probably to have a good match, still........I actually think Kofi is better, tbh). 

Hate that little fucker Marufuji. Does nothing right. Might be one of the top ten wrestlers I hate watching the most. Maybe even top 5.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm still disgusted over the fact that Kofi defeated Cesaro for the title, but that Main Event rematch was an Eddie Guerrero-level carryjob. Is Eddie the gold standard of carryjobs? Dude was able to carry awful/average wrestlers to good matches (Batista, Booker T, JBL). What's even more special though is how he had those special matches with top tier talent where you could replace Eddie's opponent with anybody in the world and it would still be awesome. I know it's blasphemy to say this, but I did not care at all for Rey Mysterio in THAT Smackdown 2005 match. Heck, the same thing goes for their JD and GAB match. Eddie Guerrero carried Rey Mysterio. He also carried Chris Jericho at Fall Brawl 97. And Edge in their 2002 PPV matches. Yup, Eddie is the gold standard of carryjobs.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> What if I were to tell you that Kofi Kingston > Eddie Kingston? Apparently Eddie had a historically bad performance at Final Battle. :troll
> 
> In all seriousness, I am not crazy enough to believe something like that. I mean, I would probably prefer watching Kofi over a 20 minute Goldberg match, but that's as far as I would go.


Eddie tanking in ROH is hilarious though b/c the promotion is shit. He doesn't work well at all, yet they still use him. Only puts the company under a new light. Kevin Steen does a lot of the same too, despite putting in a bit more effort. So much of what he's done in 2013 has looked like a parody of caring. But for the sake of the facetious point, one bad Eddie performance > all the bad Kofi ones where he actually tries and does nothing in his matches but the same two shitty looking "moves".

I'd easily take a twenty minute Goldberg match. But, both are impossible b/c they've never happened. Goldberg sells better. GOLDBERG honestly sells better. And more than half of his career didn't involve selling anything. Think about that.



Yeah1993 said:


> More do with the fact that Marufuji actually has worse offense, is a far worse seller, and is much less likely to be carried to a watch-able match.  (though the point you made is true; Kofi isn't likely to be on screen for as long, and is in a setting where it's probably to have a good match, still........I actually think Kofi is better, tbh).
> 
> Hate that little fucker Marufuji. Does nothing right. Might be one of the top ten wrestlers I hate watching the most. Maybe even top 5.


All I need is the match I listed from 2008 to know I fully disagree. But, it's a scenario where your dislike on Marufuji is exactly like mine towards Kingston. This is all for fun anyways as I only brought him up to continue are typical banter, haha. 

Marufuji is like the modern day Ultimo Dragon for me. I like him; but issues with selling is there in certain matches. It's frustrating, yet I can turn a blind eye to not "hate" him.

You and I should figure out who our top ten least favorite wrestlers ever are. I mean it. Konnan should be on both of ours. Right? I know he's in mine. Locked.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

LMFAO. I FOUND IT! I dare any of you in this website to find a worse example of selling than Kofi this match.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

KOFI HAS GOT TO BE FEELING THAT RIB INJURY.

Did you see the match recently with Kofi vs Fandango on Main Event where Kofi's arm was hurt all during the match, yet when he attempted the "boom boom" hand taunt, he went through with it despite being in pain looking like the biggest idiot in the biz? It was a sight to behold.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> LMFAO. I FOUND IT! I dare any of you in this website to find a worse example of selling than Kofi this match.


 He forgot he had a bandage on


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

:lmao 

Fuck kofi


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Why would I ever punish myself by watching Kofi vs. Fandango? All that time spent with the second best long-term seller in the company, and Kofi still has not learned the basics of wrestling. It's a shame because the guy seems like a really nice person and an incredible athlete, but no sense of how to do anything. Thank goodness we have unathletic pieces of trash like Dick Murdoch who compensate for their athleticism (or lack thereof) with intelligence. I just watched him sell a shoulder better than anyone against Akira Maeda. :homer And to think this man was a Klan member...

More bad selling please! Remember how bad Austin no-sold his arm against Kane in 98?


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Hogan/Orndorff (Cage Match) ****


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Dick Murdoch was in the Klan? Why does that not surprise me at all.....fpalm

Eddie being my favorite wrestler and all, I'd love to be able to definitively say he's the king of the carry job, but itsnt that kind of Flair's deal? Granted I haven't seen a ton of examples, but apparently in the early/mid 80s Flair carried every mediocre baby face to the match of their careers. Eddie would probably be the crown prince of the carry job though, atleast for US wrestling.

I finally watched Danielson/McGuinness 2008 RoH Anniversary Match. All I can say is that it definitely lives up to the hype. I don't know about it being the 4th best match of the decade like in Cal's list, but I have a hard time finding any flaws in it. Nigel has such great heat, and I love his pacing in his control segments. It's very Lesnar-esque, he doesn't rush anything, and he's all about constantly building that heat up on Danielson. He even used cattle mutilation on Bryan which I thought was awesome. Fantastic match.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> LMFAO. I FOUND IT! I dare any of you in this website to find a worse example of selling than Kofi this match.


"This video is not available". I really wanna laugh at Kofi a little bit.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Just realized we are headed for a fifth straight lack-luster ppv by the 'E, oh well


----------



## Rickey (Apr 27, 2008)

Man this is one of the best matches I've seen. Saw it for the first time today it reminds me that the Dog Collar Match gimmick is so underused. The other one I saw was good too it happened in ROH back in 2005, CM Punk vs. Jimmy Rave.



Spoiler: stuff



Anyway, wow this match keep me entertained throughout it. Crowd is so behind Piper and I love how it starts off with them pulling each other by their neck "like 2 pitbulls" as the commentator says. Just really old school wrestling man, the majority of it is punches and using the chain to hurt each other in different ways. So much so that Piper hitting a suplex gets the crowd hype. Great match.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm not a big fan of Piper wrestling, but Valentine/Piper was so damn good. That ear :bosh. Tremendous match. Have you checked out Raven/Punk from 2003? That's another good one of that stipulation. Turned Punk into an indie star.

If you're wondering C2D, the match is between Kofi and R-Truth vs. Hawkins/Reks on 6/4/12.






Hopefully this works. Same night as :cena2 vs Michael Cole


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Just realized we are headed for a fifth straight lack-luster ppv by the 'E, oh well


I wouldn't say that's a certainty. The tag match & handicap matches _could_ be good. We could get a curve ball and have one of them as a table or ladder match. e.g. tag titles as a ladder match, Bryan vs Wyatts as table elimination. I doubt it, but you never know. None will be mind blowing, but if all 3 are above solid then we're on for an OK event. Cena/Orton..fuck knows. Maybe they'll surprise us.

Sorry.. I couldn't write that last line without laughing. :durant


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

One of the main reasons I miss 2012 is because I could go and watch RAW on YouTube the next day instead of having to torrent it...then again, my Internet was faster when I lived in Vegas. :side:

I'll probably only be home to watch the main event tonight, and I'll download the rest of the show if it's decent. Woooo FINALS! :flair


----------



## Rickey (Apr 27, 2008)

Nah, I've heard about that one and the Punk/Raven feud being great in general. The only thing I've seen from that feud is Punk's "THIS IS STRAIGHT EDGE!" promo backstage(at least I think it came from that feud.)

The Dog Collar Match gimmick is so friggin simple but it WORKS. It works so well man, imagine being changed to someone else trying to have a match its just...I can't even explain it. I think I love that match type now.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Just realized we are headed for a fifth straight lack-luster ppv by the 'E, oh well


I have faith in this PPV, I hope that the ME will be similar to their NWO match( AKA good) and I think the handicaps and the tag titles match will be good as well.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Christmas Nostalgia said:


> Vince firing Jarrett was hilarious :lol


First time I've seen this :lmao

Goonnee?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> If you're wondering C2D, the match is between Kofi and R-Truth vs. Hawkins/Reks on 6/4/12.
> 
> Hopefully this works. Same night as :cena2 vs Michael Cole


Already got that same 2 minute video working from their site. His "rib injury" doesn't even exist. :lmao That was just inexcusable if the earlier portion of the match was spent on it.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Rickey said:


> Nah, I've heard about that one and the Punk/Raven feud being great in general. The only thing I've seen from that feud is Punk's "THIS IS STRAIGHT EDGE!" promo backstage(at least I think it came from that feud.)
> 
> The Dog Collar Match gimmick is so friggin simple but it WORKS. It works so well man, imagine being changed to someone else trying to have a match its just...I can't even explain it. I think I love that match type now.


I think it all goes back to the PG rating unfortunately. Dog collar matches are brutal affairs when done properly, I don't see them giving us that sort of match in this day and age, I'm afraid. Sheamus and Henry had a strap match at ER and it was utterly disappointing, and I think a lot of that has to do with the guidelines they had going into it. 

If you want to see some more awesome matches where dudes are attached to one another, check the Vader/Sting strap, Eddie/JBL bullrope, and HHH/Kane chain matches. All are wonderful.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Ahh the Vader/Sting matches were really awesome imo. Can't remember the Kane/HHH one from which PPv?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Why would I ever punish myself by watching Kofi vs. Fandango? All that time spent with the second best long-term seller in the company, and Kofi still has not learned the basics of wrestling. It's a shame because the guy seems like a really nice person and an incredible athlete, but no sense of how to do anything. Thank goodness we have unathletic pieces of trash like Dick Murdoch who compensate for their athleticism (or lack thereof) with intelligence. I just watched him sell a shoulder better than anyone against Akira Maeda. :homer And to think this man was a Klan member...
> 
> More bad selling please! Remember how bad Austin no-sold his arm against Kane in 98?


I question why I watched. (b/c I read that Fandango won, so I could manage to tolerate it) Glad I did just so I saw that fabulous moment. His "athleticism" is kind of a fallacy too. It's probably b/c he doesn't give a damn anymore. Some of the laziest springboards - aka his offense - ever. Sabu can be pilled up and put more oomph in a springboard. These jokes are fun.

DICK. Yeah, he was a racist bastard. But dammit if he wasn't radical. You take the bad with the good. At least lets not talk about the bad in the personal side. Only what he produced in the world of wrestling. IE Benoit in 2007 never happened. Only he's an amazing wrestler.

Was it bad? KOTR or any match in general? I'd have to relive it. Don't recall Kane working on his arm on the PPV. It was more bandaged up and the rest was focused on getting Austin to bleed via his head.



Rickey said:


> Man this is one of the best matches I've seen. Saw it for the first time today it reminds me that the Dog Collar Match gimmick is so underused. The other one I saw was good too it happened in ROH back in 2005, CM Punk vs. Jimmy Rave.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


One of the best matches ever. No doubt. I'm super big on it.

Punker vs Rave is quality. Good plug. Def check out Punker vs Raven from Death Before Dishonor. Also, Raven vs Abyss from TNA No Surrender '05 is a great match too. Wild brawl.



Srdjan99 said:


> Ahh the Vader/Sting matches were really awesome imo. Can't remember the Kane/HHH one from which PPv?


Chain match from Judgment Day 2001. Good match.

----------

Danielson vs Nigel from the Anniversary show. Good grief. Match did a 180 on me when I first saw it. Danielson is Danielson. And, while always pretty great, Nigel stole the show with the heel turn. Amazing.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Dick was one of the best wrestlers in the 80s.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Nothing like a bit of DICK from the 80's. 8*D


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> You and I should figure out who our top ten least favorite wrestlers ever are. I mean it. Konnan should be on both of ours. Right? I know he's in mine. Locked.


Konnan isn't a lock for mine. I think I'd rather watch him than Marufuji. I mean yeah, Konnan is worse, I won't deny that, but 'sloppy lazy fuck' I would rather watch to 'glorified gymnast who was never taught how to sell'. Um......who would be on my ten least favourites to watch? Interesting. Davey Richards and Chuck Taylor would be for sure. Hell, Chuck Taylor is #1. Marufuji is. So that's three. I'm drawing a blank right now. Actually fuck, I think at this stage I have to add Konnan. I maintain he isn't a stone cold lock, but yeah, he's Konnan. Um, who elllllse? OH, I hate Vampiro. He has a chance. I kind of hate Yoshinobu Kanemaru as well. Falls into that Marufuji/KENTAathisworst category for me. nAHHHH WAIT MARCUS BAGWELL. Oh, well, IDK. Do I still hate him? I guess I know I still hate him, but do I hate him *that* much any more? Not sure, and IDK if I want to watch more of him to find out. Then there's Tom Zenk. Feels like I'm missing tons of 2000s indy guys. Matt Stryker and BJ Whitmer, for example. So many people I have to be forgetting. Sounds like a fun project if it didn't involve literally watching the wrestling that I despise more than anything. I'll stick to 2010 WWE. 

What a mess of a paragraph.



Piper v. Valentine is outstanding. Piper is hugely underrated and overlooked inside them ropeys. 'he wasn't a good worker' is carny 'workrate' crap. Like those people who never watch an Ian Rotten match yet say he sucked. Or people who read how ECW was all hardcore and think they've formed a proper opinion on how it never had good shit because they watched two matches.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

STEVIE RAY! That's a man that only a mother can love in the ring. How can you forget him?





So much fun. Roddy doing his thing. Unfortunately, I STILL can't find his matches with Chavo. Adonis/Piper is really fun too. I remember liking a match he had with Buddy Rose too, but anyone named Buddy probably can't have a bad match.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Though Fandango/Ziggler would be a good match. Boy I was wrong, fuck Fandango winning, what happened to Ziggler man


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

He should just leave and go to PWG at this point


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

After he won that Title after Mania, I really thought he was going to be the number 2 behind Cena. Then after the excellent double turn I thought he'd win the title back at Summerslam and be on top again. Instead he was in a mixed tag match and it's been downhill since then.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Well ladies and gentlemen, there's our MOTN.

EDIT: LMFAO at that primal scream from Natalya.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

God dammit some fucker just spoiled Cena/Orton in the TLC thread 

I hate people 

:lmao at your avi funnyfaces


----------



## DFUSCMAN (Mar 13, 2010)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Well ladies and gentlemen, there's our MOTN.


I can feel the average ppv already.

Hopefully Bryan and Harper bring the magic tonight.

Edit: Just saw funnyfaces avi :lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Punk/Shield was awesome. ***3/4-**** on first watch.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Just got in and saw Nattie/AJ. Decent match, I though. But I missed Punk/Shield. FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Why is Dolph wrestling a ballroom dancer on the pre show? The fuck! :vince7


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

LMFAO. Kofi Kingston (and the Miz) do it again. Not only did Kofi no sell his leg injury, those two had one of the worst matches of the year. Two straight DUDs in this PPV after a good tag team match.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Did anyone else think that the IC title match wasn't too bad?


----------



## Rickey (Apr 27, 2008)

Thanks for the recommendations guys. Will check them out when I can.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

The most contrived, stupidest and safely worked tlc match ever.

At least Edge V Taker had cool spots.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Ziggler/Fandango: ***
Punk/Shield: ****1/2*
AJ/Natalya: ***1/2*
Langston/Sandow: ***1/2*
4-Way Tag Team: ****1/2*
Clay/Truth: *DUD*
Miz/Kingston: *DUD*
Bryan/Wyatts: *****
Orton/Cena: ****

What a horrible PPV.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I'm just dissapointed there was no swerve 

The match was good though, ***1/2 IMO


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

What kind of a swerve were you expecting? Not being a dick just curious.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Steph looked FINE tonight. That is all.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

IDK, just SOMETHING that would make the PPV end with a bang


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Punk/Shield: ****
AJ/Natalya: **1/2
Langston/Sandow: **
4-Way Tag Team: ***1/2
Clay/Truth: Didn't watch
Miz/Kingston: Didn't watch
Bryan/Wyatts: **3/4
Orton/Cena: **1/2

Punk/Shield and four-way tag match are the best of the night by a good deal. Especially Punk/Shield.

Glad Orton won the main event, and actually kept the titles instead of them throwing it on HHH. Obviously now we'll have to deal with another boring Orton promo about being "DA FACE OF DA DUBYA DUBYA E!"... but it beats a Cena "I OVERCAME THE ODDS, CAME BACK FROM INJURY, BECAME WORLD CHAMP AND THEN THE UNDISPUTED TITLE, AND NOW I CAN CELEBRATE IT WITH U GUYZ!"


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Steph will look fine when she is 70. Give me 3 1/2 minutes. :smokey


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

★★★¼ for the main event. Solid match but too safely worked with no huge spots making it a bit underwhelming. The finish was also rather anticlimactic. The table should have been set up like normal with Cena going through it. Not as good as I hoped but far better than the disaster most of this board expected it to be. Orton winning clean was still pretty cool.

I have to laugh @ all the douchebags who went "DA CROW IZ GUNNA SHIT ON DA MACH WIF DANNY EL BRYAN CHANTZ!!!!". :flip Thankfully we had a good for a change.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I think it's funny how everyone was dreading the possibility of a non-ending or a screwjob, and now they're bitching about a semi-clean ending. 

On that note, main event wasn't too bad. Mediocre PPV, but since it's the most recent, I will call it the WOAT to fit in with the rest of this forum. :HHH


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> ★★★¼ for the main event. Solid match but too safely worked with no huge spots making it a bit underwhelming. The finish was also rather anticlimactic. The table should have been set up like normal with Cena going through it. Not as good as I hoped but far better than the disaster most of this board expected it to be. Orton winning clean was still pretty cool.
> 
> I have to laugh @ all the douchebags who went "DA CROW IZ GUNNA SHIT ON DA MACH WIF DANNY EL BRYAN CHANTZ!!!!". :flip Thankfully we had a good for a change.


I kind of agree with your assessment. Orton getting right up after going through that first table :lmao 

I just wasn't in the mood for the main event because the rest of the card had been so abysmal. I actually fell asleep and missed the ending of the Bryan match. Don't even care. 

STEPH though


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I am convinced Vince and CO hate me, so from now on I will not bring up the subject of "Dolph Ziggler" in hopes for better. Almost shed a tear tonight guys, they are probaly reading my post as we speak

Good Night


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Enjoyed tonight. Nowadays getting three matches that I'm into on a PPV, is a good thing. Thought AJ/Natalya was good, probably because I read the speculation here first. That made me more into the nearfalls than normal.

Also, lol at some marks of others claiming that Natalya isn't that good of a wrestler. This is my first time getting a really good look at her, and I think that she's rock solid. I'm so used to seeing such sloppiness in the divas division.

Thought Bryan vs. Wyatts was actually really great. I'm not usually into Wyatt matches, and Bryan doesn't really do it for me like he does it for everyone else here...so I was pleasantly surprised by how into this match I was. Bray's formula worked best here in this match moreso than in any other one that I can recall. Maybe it's because I really could imagine Bryan joining the Wyatts, so that made Bray's words seem more powerful. There's a coherence there now, and all of his mannerisms worked beautifully in this match.

Cena vs. Orton was enjoyable to me. I knew they weren't gonna do any big bumps, so I didn't feel disappointed in that regard. I liked the handcuff throwback, though the taking apart of the rope was comical (but was what I was expecting). The ending felt weird, but it added to the tension...like, waiting for someone to come out. I thought that there were several moments that felt pretty tense, and lended itself to uncertainty well, so I thought it was good in that regard. The beginning did feel "paint by numbers", though. Wish there was more character work or something.

So glad that it wasn't a screwy finish. Those screwy finishes were really driving me to reconsider ordering PPV's anymore. I think that the McMahons coming out at the end was a good enough tease for many possibilities in the future. Mainly, Orton going rogue, since he didn't seem that enamored with them.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Punk v Orton at Rumble (with Orton retaining all dirty like) and Bryan wins the Rumble and Punk wins the title at EC so we get unk and :bryan for the title at WRESTLEMANIAAAAAAAAAAAAA :vince3 voice :mark: 

I know this won't happen but it would be sweet.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)




----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Only one main event PPV match this year has been universally praised :lmao


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Only one main event PPV match this year has been universally praised :lmao


I've enjoyed Extreme Rules, MITB, SummerSlam, Battleground (except stupid finish) and TLC. To a lesser extent, Royal Rumble and HIAC too.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I enjoyed quite a lot too. RR and EC were bad matches, but hilarious nonetheless. Lesnar/HHH was good, WWE MITB was very good, Bryan/Cena is a classic, and all three Orton/Bryan matches were not bad. The only one though that isn't universally hated is Bryan/Cena. Same thing kinda happened last year too, but there are a couple more beloved matches of the bunch.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Only one main event PPV match this year has been universally praised :lmao


Probably the one I agree with. Here's how I'd rate the PPV main events:

Punk/Rock RR- ***
Punk/Rock EC- ***1/4
Rock/Cena WM- **
Brock/HHH ER- **1/2
Cena/Ryback PB- **
WWE Title MITB Ladder Match MITB- *
Bryan/Cena SS- ****1/4
Bryan/Orton NOC- **
Bryan/Orton BG- *1/2
Bryan/Orton HIAC- *3/4
Orton/Show SVS- DUD
Orton/Cena TLC- **1/2

Terrible year for PPV main events. Hell technically, the one great PPV main event wasn't even the main event due to the Bryan/Orton cash-in. You count that and the best ones are the Rock/Punk ones (which I'm sure everyone else will disagree with even then, but yeah... not a good year for main events). 

Hopefully 2014 provides much better stuff to close the shows.


----------



## TheMenace (May 26, 2013)

So now Bryan wins the Rumble and Cena wins the title match at RR setting up Cena vs Bryan at WM.

I'm thinking either that or Cena takes on Taker's WM streak.


----------



## Hennessey (Jan 1, 2012)

Awesome ppv tonight in my opinion. 

1. Shield vs CM Punk - ***1/4
2. Divas title match - **3/4
3. Big E vs Sandow (IC title match) - **1/2
4. 4 way tag title match - ****
5. Brodus vs Truth - Dud
6. Miz vs Kofi - **3/4
7 DB vs Wyatt's - ***1/2
8. Cena vs Orton (TLC) - ***1/4


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

I've been itching to check out Hogan/Andre at Mania 3. I'm just hoping I can get the big entertainment feel I got with the Hogan/Warrior WM 6 match.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Punk/Shield was solid, as was the tag match, around *** for both. Skipped everything else. Glad they actually crowned ONE champion tonight and nothing screwy like both guys grabbing a title like people have been speculating since the match was announced.

Oh and DID EVERYONE SEE AJ LEE LOSE HER TITLE AS PUNISHMENT FOR THAT THING SHE DID BACKSTAGE? LOLOLOLOL. It's almost like dirtsheets don't know stuff for real :side:.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

SpookshowTony said:


> I've been itching to check out Hogan/Andre at Mania 3. I'm just hoping I can get the big entertainment feel I got with the Hogan/Warrior WM 6 match.


Good luck with that . Hogan/Warrior had some good action to it. Hogan/Andre is awful on so many levels. The crowd is the ONLY positive.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

KillaCal, when you rewatch and rate last night's PPV, can you give Miz/Kingston a score of -2 (aka a "double NO")?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Remind me in about 4 years when I get around to watching, reviewing and rating 2013 PPV's and I will.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Good luck with that . Hogan/Warrior had some good action to it. Hogan/Andre is awful on so many levels. The crowd is the ONLY positive.



I wholeheartedly agree on the crowd. Honestly I'm not finding it godawful, it's falling more into the "meh, I saw it though" category.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

That show was a bit of an ordeal to sit through. Glad I didn't buy.

Didn't think anything on the show was more than decent. At least the finish was an actual finish.

Thought Bryan/Wyatts was interesting though.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Hulk Hogan (c) vs Andre The Giant w/Bobby "The Brain" Heenan for the WWF Championship - Wrestlemania III (3/29/87) 4/10
Hulk Hogan vs "Macho Man" Randy Savage (c) for the WWF Championship - Wrestlemania V (4/2/89) 7.5-8/10
The Nasty Boys w/Jimmy Hart vs The Hart Foundation (c) for the WWF Tag Team Championship - Wrestlemania VII (3/24/91) 8/10*


Now watching Hart/Piper at WM 8.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Didn't see the Punk/Shield match but enjoyed the Bryan/Wyatt Family one. Bray is great, just love his in ring work and the psychology behind it. *** 

If Taker was full time I'd love a Wyatt/Taker feud.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*Bret "Hitman Hart vs "Rowdy" Roddy Piper (c) for the Intercontinental Championship - Wrestlemania VIII (4/5/92) 8.5-9/10
Bret "Hitman" Hart (c) vs Razor Ramon for the WWF Championship - Royal Rumble (1/24/93) 9/10*


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:lmao

Nailed it dead on that Cena vs Orton would be DUD central. Brilliant.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Just pretty meh, loved the tag match but yeah..


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Tag match was :mark:

Main event was AWFUL though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Both Handicaps were good too. Not like I'm surprised. Wyatts vs Danielson was the better of the two, imo.

Tag titles was a lot of fun. Cross Rhodes~!


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I thought the tag match and two 3v1 were solid but nothing really wowed me. Like, yeah, it was good, but I had slightly higher expectations from those involved. Story wise, Bryan/Wyatts was great though.

Main event just didn't click with me at all.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Heel beatdown sequence in the Wyatt's match more dynamic & interesting for me. Followed by the ever awesome Danielson comeback. Blended well with the story and had a good finish for Wyatt to nab a strong victory. Booking within the Punk vs Shield match was nicely done too. Roman damn near killed himself, so it put the mistiming of the spear on Ambrose into effect quite well. Liked how Punk got a good win, while leaving the Shield looking good throughout & continuing their eventual split. The areas with those eight are always usually done so well. Same w/the folks in the tag team picture. The constants are all over WWE. In both the positives & the negatives.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I'm just sad that Fandango/Ziggler didn't do well. Like both of them and was hoping for good chemistry. It also got virtually no time though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Seems to be a running gag with Fandango. Even on Superstars. Always getting snubbed for time to showcase anything.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Anyone else get a kick out of TERRY FUNK getting a mention in the shield match with a twitter post, then King saying something about him, and the ROMAN REIGNS started selling HIS EYE :mark:.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Shield/Punk - **3/4
AJ/Natalya - nope
Langston/Sandow - nope
Tag titles - ***
Brodus/Truth - LOL no
Miz/Kofi - LOL no
Bryan/Wyatts - **3/4
Cena/Orton - *3/4

Quick viewing :vince2


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

*4 Way Tag - ***3/4 - ***** range. Need to watch again. 
*Cena/Orton - ***1/2*

The main event was fun if a bit spotty. The no selling was :lol but it seemed to me like Cena was climbing too fast which was forcing Orton to get up and run after him to comical effect. It was certainly not OMGZ THE MOST EPICZ OF EPIC CHAMPION OF CHAMPION BATTLES EVAZ but it was far from a dud too imo. If nothing else it was fun. 

The 2 handicaps were also fun all things considered and were mainly storyline advancement matches. I can live with that. 

So our next PPV is the ROYAL RUMBLE. My favourite match of the year most times or at least the most :mark:. I really hope we get some cracking interactions in this one. The stage is set with Punk/Bryan/Shield/Wyatts etc. Hopefully they're all in there mixing it up. My guess is Cena will get his rematch there too. No idea where this leaves us for Mania and I'm through guessing. We'll see where we end up in about 6 weeks time.

Decent way to end the year but yes, 2013 PPV has been horribly poor. This year has been all about TV. I wonder what 2014 is going to bring us.


----------



## bme (Sep 23, 2005)

TLC - Best to Worst

Bryan/Wyatts *** 
Fatal 4 Way **1/2 
Main Event **1/2
Punk/Shield *
IC title *
Truth/Clay *
Kofi/Miz smh
Divas lmao didn't watch

Bryan/Wyatts was good, the 4-way n Main Event were close to being good matches, and Punk/Shield, IC & Clay/Truth were decent.
I don't care about the end result of the main event last night, just bring on the Royal Rumble.

2013 main events

Punk/Rock ***1/2
Punk/Rock 2 ***
Cena/Rock 2 *** (please let Rock be done with wrestling)
Cena/Ryback **
Cena/Ryback **
MITB All Stars ****
Cena/Bryan ****
Orton/Bryan ***1/2
Orton/Bryan 2 ***
Orton/Bryan: HIAC ***1/2
Orton/Show **
Cena/Orton: TLC **1/2


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Just watched both HBK/Taker Mania matches. Probably the most enjoyable hour you can get from Wrestling.


----------



## Brogue_Kick (Sep 11, 2011)

1. The Shield vs CM Punk - ***
2. AJ Lee vs Natalya - *1/2
3. Big E vs Sandow (IC Title Match) - **1/2
4. The Rhodes vs Rybaxel vs Rey & Big Show vs The Real Americans - ****
5. Brodus Clay vs R-Truth - *1/2
6. The Miz vs Kofi - **
7. Daniel Bryan vs The Wyatt Family - ***3/4
8. Cena vs Randy Orton (TLC) - ****


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Was about to say I seem to be coming in a bit higher than most until I saw ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ that lol.


----------



## MVP_HHH_RKO (Nov 18, 2008)

erik lamela said:


> Shield/Punk - **3/4
> AJ/Natalya - nope
> Langston/Sandow - nope
> Tag titles - ***
> ...


Haha I ordered and recorded the ppv. And had the exact same opinion on the matches you skipped.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I nearly broke my forehead (if that's possible?) facepalming when I saw handcuffs. Fuck sake.

Punk/Shield - ** 3/4
AJ/Natalya - Nope
Big E/Sandow - Nope
Tag Titles - ***
Truth/Clay - NAOMI'S ASS.
Kingston/Miz - :lmao
Bryan/Wyatt - ***
Orton/Cena - DUD

3/4 of the matches I watched were at least decent. The booking in the Punk/Shield match was great, and Wyatt's beatdowns are fantastic. Tag was fun but I'm not in any rush to watch again. Main event was :lmao. Expected more from the Vinman's return, though.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

TLC last night was a great PPV, second after Summerslam this year:

Ziggler/Fandango- DUD
Punk/SHield- ***1/4
Natalya/AJ- **1/4
Big.E/Sandow- **
Tag Titles Match- ****1/4
Truth/Clay- *
Kingston/Miz- *
Bryan/Wyatts- ***3/4
Orton/Cena- ***3/4


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

I need to re-watch TLC, especially the main event. My thoughts on the main event: 

Way too spotty, not enough breathing time between spots and a lack of long term selling really hurt it. When I saw the handcuffs at first I facepalmed. I thought they were gonna pull the cliched break free from the handcuffs. Honestly, though I dug the last few minutes of it.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

On the handicap matches, I thought the first was far better. Better flow to it, great psychology by Punk to keep the Shield members in the opposite corner for as long as possible. Sick spot by Reigns with the missed spear, and eventually that spear costing their team the match when he speared Ambrose. All men delivered strong performances and we furthered the inevitable Shield split. 

Bryan/Wyatts sold the whole story a lot better than the former match did there's, but the match itself just got to be way too boring. I actually almost fell asleep during it. Match was missing something. I need to give it a re-watch as I'm having trouble remembering a lot of it due to how disinterested I got as the match kept going on. Don't see what was so good abou it tbh. It was alright and third best match of the night, but it didnt wow me in any way.

The four-way tag I definitely have to re-watch as I wasn't even paying much attention to it until the final two teams, and that sequence between them is what led to the rating I gave it. I'll give it another shot and I'll also probably re-watch Punk/Shield to see if it holds up. I am a bit surprised by the lack of love it's getting in this thread, but ah well, opinions are opinions. Maybe it helped it was the first match of the night and I was going into it expecting it to be total shit, and it wasn't. We'll see.


----------



## Loader230 (Jul 7, 2012)

Wow, people are actually calling Cena/Orton from last night a "DUD"? Really?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Doesn't sound like there's much worth checking out from last night. Not too surprised. How was the crowd?


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Cena/Orton 1/2*


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Loader230 said:


> Wow, people are actually calling Cena/Orton from last night a "DUD"? Really?


It didn't entertain me, I wasn't invested at any point of the match, I had to fight the urge to just turn it off and after I finished watching it I was left feeling annoyed with myself that I wasted twenty minutes of my life. If it doesn't entertain me in the slightest, then it's a dud, in my opinion. Obviously others share the same opinion. I'm as shocked as you probably are when I see people giving it *** 1/2 +

So yeah, really.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Stocking Filler said:


> Doesn't sound like there's much worth checking out from last night. Not too surprised. How was the crowd?


I'd say mediocre.

Finished Bad Blood 2004 last night & i still enjoy the HIAC, not sure how everyone else feels about it though.

MOTN was Beniot/Kane though tunga3


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

What did people think about the Kofi and Miz match?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

It was crap just like everything Kofi always does and what Miz has been doing lately.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> I'd say mediocre.
> 
> Finished Bad Blood 2004 last night & i still enjoy the HIAC, not sure how everyone else feels about it though.
> 
> MOTN was Beniot/Kane though tunga3


I didn't enjoy the HIAC match very much, when I've watched it. However, Benoit/Kane was indeed a good match.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I like that HIAC match. It's long, but fuck it. Benoit/Kane is great too.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Santa For WHC said:


> I didn't enjoy the HIAC match very much, when I've watched it. However, Benoit/Kane was indeed a good match.


When JR said they had been wrestling for 40 mins I didn't believe him because it didn't feel like it to me haha.

I also really enjoyed Jericho/Tomko.

Next is GAB 2004, Bull Rope Match & Cruiserweight title :mark:



> I like that HIAC match. It's long, but fuck it. Benoit/Kane is great too.


Are you saying that because Triple H is in it?


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> It was crap just like everything Kofi always does and what Miz has been doing lately.


 :lol thought so. was curious to know after watching some extraodinary Kofi no-sells last night


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Oliver-94 said:


> :lol thought so. was curious to know after watching some extraodinary Kofi no-sells last night


He actually sold the leg work last night :ey


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

I loved how Kofi was trying to act tough in the Pre-Show, when he confronted the Miz. The whole segment just came off as odd and unnatural.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Oh please. You can cut off my legs and I can still sell leg work better than Kofi.

I'm too scared to watch that main event again. It will probably go down to a DUD. John Cena is a special talent, but even Kofi can wrestle a better ladder match than him.

The best thing to come out of that pre-show was my avatar.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Santa For WHC said:


> I loved how Kofi was trying to act tough in the Pre-Show, when he confronted the Miz. The whole segment just came off as odd and unnatural.


Kofi "trying" to act tough is the most pathetic "acting" I have ever seen :lmao


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Nice to see some love for Trips/Shawn HIAC. Honestly, it doesn't even feel like it's damn near 50 minutes. Also, I liked HHH/Nash as well. So fuck all the haters.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Kofi "trying" to act tough is the most pathetic "acting" I have ever seen :lmao


"Keep talking! Keep talking, baby come on! You wanna talk? Now is a great time! Great time!"

:lmao


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Santa For WHC said:


> I loved how Kofi was trying to act tough in the Pre-Show, when he confronted the Miz. The whole segment just came off as odd and unnatural.


 I still have no idea what the story behind this 'feud' is. They're just rejecting handshakes and Miz hasn't improved as a heel.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

sharkboy22 said:


> Nice to see some love for Trips/Shawn HIAC. *Honestly, it doesn't even feel like it's damn near 50 minutes.* Also, I liked HHH/Nash as well. So fuck all the haters.


I prefer Nash/Triple H but I do enjoy both though.

I feel the exact same way about the time, I honestly think it fly's bye.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Hard to believe that at one point Miz was WWE champion for 6 months and main evented a Wrestlemania and in that very same match beat John Cena. Did WWE really think this guy was main event material?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I loved Miz in 2010 & would be thrilled if he was that entertaining again, I was very high on him but perhaps he peaked


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

I think Miz still has some potential left in him. The face turn was obviously a failed experiment but hey, we did ask for a face turn in 2012 and it happened so fair enough. All he needs now is return to the same old heel he was in 2010 and get rid of this ridiculous hairstyle that he has now. Either get the Kyle Reese look from 2012 or the faux hawk that makes him so easy to hate as a heel.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

He needs to go back to the I'm the Miz! And I'm...AWESOME gimmick

No way should he be the world champ again, but wouldn't mind him being IC champion


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

He needs to go...

And that's the end of that sentence.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Are you saying that because Triple H is in it?


That may have something to do with it. :side:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Those belts seemed to be very low for Cena/Orton.

Really enjoyed the Elimination Tag match and the Punk/Shield match. Main event was very flat for me like I knew it would be.

Thought the crowd were pretty shit all night too tbh.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> I'd say mediocre.
> 
> Finished Bad Blood 2004 last night & i still enjoy the HIAC, not sure how everyone else feels about it though.
> 
> MOTN was Beniot/Kane though tunga3


Benoit/Kane :mark:

That and Orton/Shelton rule the world. Might have to give the HIAC another chance because I LOVE 2004!


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

That HIAC sucks balls. 'blood feud ending in a cage that overshadows the world champion' wound up a bunch of horrible punches and chops for 45 minutes. I've said that the Mania three-way would have legitimately sucked if Benoit wasn't in it (making it not a three-way any more, meguess) and this (and ten of the other Michaels/HHH matches - the boot camp match being the worst) likely proves it.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Bad Blood HIAC is so shit. It makes Nash/Trips look like Brock/Taker. I still like Nash/Trips a bit, though.

Also, no Miz is the best Miz.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Original HIAC overshadowed the title, too.

Michaels/HHH are bigger draws than Benoit/Kane, so apart from the unwritten law that the title match should always close, I think it makes sense.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Without the suspense surrounding the titles on a second watch, I just about can't stand the TLC. Reminds me of my feelings on almost every Cena/Orton match. Good chance that show stays in the vault for me.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Stocking Filler said:


> Original HIAC overshadowed the title, too.
> 
> Michaels/HHH are bigger draws than Benoit/Kane, so apart from the unwritten law that the title match should always close, I think it makes sense.


It was the same with the original Bad Blood PPV, Hart had the title but didn't go on last, HBK and Taker did. I think that might be why they had the balls to do it. Benoit/Kane was actually a great match tho, along with the Finlay Smackdown match it's probably the best Kane match.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Gave some TLC matches another watch.

Punk/Shield ****1/2*
Bryan/Wyatts ****1/2*
Cena/Orton ***3/4*

I thought both handicap matches were good, with Bryan/Wyatts being a bit better. The ending of Punk/Shield made sense. Bryan's comeback was really good, and I thought Bray did fine. Bryan losing made sense, as he just couldn't overcome the 3 on 1. 

I still can't with the main event. So much no-selling, but that's partly due to Cena climbing the ladder so fast and then just playing with the belts while he waits for Orton to chase him down. The handcuffs again fpalm


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

So when is Cena winning it, Mania? :side:


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> It was the same with the original Bad Blood PPV, Hart had the title but didn't go on last, HBK and Taker did. I think that might be why they had the balls to do it. Benoit/Kane was actually a great match tho, along with the Finlay Smackdown match it's probably the best Kane match.


What do you think of Taker/Kane WM 14?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> So when is Cena winning it, Mania? :side:


PLEASE don't joke like that.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So just started watching RAW 2-2-04 and apparently there is a HBK/Orton match on this show :mark:

Thoughts on that and the Goldberg/Kane match I'm iffy on?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Don't remember Goldberg/Kane but Orton/HBK is solid. They've had better matches together on PPV but that one is one of their better TV matches (they've had quite a few to be accurate).


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Goldberg/Kane was awful. Orton/HBK was good. Underrated chemistry. I don't think Orton and HBK had a bad match.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

God bless WWE for last night's TLC Match. That's going into the vault for wrestlecrap classics that I'll love to watch one night as I get drunk. Although, I made about 50 jokes during it while sober last night. Either way - YAY @ more junk to behold.

These PPV main events this year :ti


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

There was no point in studying for the two exams I had today, considering the fact I finished both of them quicker than the HBK/HHH HIAC match took. :side:

I didn't think Orton vs. Cena was really that bad, but I was also halfway paying attention while kinda studying and definitely eating. DEM HANDCUFFS though. rton2


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

The tag match being face vs face teams kinda annoyed me when rewatching it..


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

While we're talking HBK/Orton, any thoughts on this match?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I liked it. If only for the aspect of WWE giving us matches with every team in the division instead of the cookie cutter "heel vs face" matches. Not to mention, the bout being elimination was an acceptable scenario for the booking to make it face vs face w/o any booking to determine one team to lose favor with the fans by their being a gripe among the teams. It was a safe move & I felt it worked. Wanted Real Americans to shine some more, but I can't complain with Rhodes' looking like studs again. They're running through everyone. It's a blast to watch. GOLDUST.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Mysterio and show were the heels in my mind, I was terrified they were gonna win the titles :lol

HEY! RAW starts soon! and my fucking cable box won't work!


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Okay so after months of trying to find a suitable one, I've finally found a project that I 

a) want to do 
b) feel I can stick to
and c) think might actually help me to further expand and explore my wrestling tastes/knowledge.

It's going to take a hell of a lot of time, but I'm in no rush to finish it. It's for fun, plain and simple. It's basically taking that list Cal (major props, thanks to you) posted several days ago of the best matches of this decade, and watching them (or as many as I can, a few I will struggle to get a hold of), reviewing them and re-ordering them based on my reviews and opinions. Now some reviews may be really short, some may be longer. Whatever the case, that's the project. A very fucking big one, but then again, ATF did a top 50 television matches of all time project, so... :side: I'm not going to watch them in any particular order, it just so happens that for this installment, three of the first few in the original list interest me. Also, it's not a WWE exclusive list, so there will be matches from Japan, Mexico and from TNA and the indys, but 99.99% of people in this thread are open to everything so I'm sure it'll interest some of you.

I won't be using star ratings, the matches will simply be ordered based on my opinions, what I enjoyed more and how good I felt the matches were. At the end of every installment, I'll post my list as it stands, just to keep you all up to date, if you care. I don't know how regularly installments will be posted, and the amount of matches in each post will differ. I'm just taking my time and doing whatever I feel like at that time.

For those of you that don't know what list I'm on about: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/general-wwe/1000865-official-dvd-match-show-discussion-thread-635.html

So lets get this show on the road, right?

____________________________________________________________________________________________________



Spoiler: INSTALLMENT ONE



*Batista vs. The Undertaker* || *Last Man Standing Match* || *Backlash 2007 || #328
*_In all honesty, it was big Dave that was the MVP of this match. Don't get me wrong, Taker was good but you expect that of Taker. Batista really impressed me here. His selling of his injured hamstring was great, despite being on/off, but when it was on, it was great. Even when throwing a punch, he winced and made it seem like his leg was ready to give way when he put his weight on it to do so. I also liked the gradual increase in frustraton that he showed and subsequent desperation, which was evident through his facial expressions and verbally as well. The first ten minutes were fairly annoying due to the fact that even after clotheslines and leg drops, each guy was allowing the ref to count - Reverse logic, IMO. Surely they'd know they haven't done enough and them letting the ref count just gives their opponent time to recover? Whatever, I see that a lot with LMS matches. The action it's self wasn't anything groundbreaking, and in all honesty it was rather plain. We've seen this finish dozens of times before, but it furthers the feud so it's understandable. Oh, and JBL's commentary is really fucking good in this. 100000x better than his commentary these days. Decent, but not great. Wouldn't even call it GOOD, considering it's a World Title match and it's THE FUCKING UNDERTAKER.

-------- *IF ANYBODY HAS A LINK TO NECRO BUTCHER VS. TOBY KLEIN KOTDM 2004, I WILL BE HIGHLY APPRECIATIVE *__--------

_*Rikishi and Too Cool vs. Kurt Angle, Edge and Christian || Judgement Day 2000 ||* *#238
*_First things first - I think it's safe to say they don't make entrance songs like they did back then. Fuck all of this preppy-rock shit, give me some in-house produced instrumentals like Angle's or Edge and Christian's theme. Second of all - Attitude era Angle promos > everything. Thirdly, I was caught by surprise when I saw this match on the list, even if it only has one point. Someone out there thinks its the 100th best match of the Decade. __Whatever floats your boat, I guess. Fourthly - :lmao @ the "CHYNA IS MY DAD" sign thats at ringside. ***** sign, IMO. __Finally - :lmao at Christian pronouncing Louisville "Lewisville". HEAT. Now on to the match  To put it simply: Outside of Rikishi, this sucked. And part of the only reason Rikishi somewhat saved the match was because the crowd was hot as fuck for him. Everything he did he garnered a HUGE reaction. But yeah, this was crap, IMO. NO THANKYOU.

_*Evolution vs. Chris Benoit, Chris Jericho and Edge || Raw 6/14/04 || #238* 
_Had I done this last year, I think I would have enjoyed it a lot more. It's just because we've been so exposed to unbelievably good multiman tags this year, especially 6 man tags, that I was almost subconsciously comparing this to the standard Shield 6 man. However, thats not to say that this wasn't good, because it was. Batista, despite being eliminated first, looked like a machine, whilst Flair was bumping as nuttily as Rollins and Benoit and Orton got time to shine. Edge and Jericho were just there, IMO, but they did no harm. My only qualm with this was that the pace was very... Constant? That sounds all well and good, but it wasn't constantly fast. In a multi man match, I (and maybe everyone else, I don't know) expect the heels to build heat, only for a fast paced, dynamic hot tag. You then rinse and repeat, whilst changing it up - Just like we've seen with nearly all The Shield tags, but there was very little of that in this match. Don't get me wrong, this was good... But given the talent involved and the fact that the majority of WWE multimen tags are normally good, this was slightly dissappointing._





Spoiler: MY LIST SO FAR



#1 - Batista vs. The Undertaker || Last Man Standing Match || Backlash 2007 || #328
#2 - Evolution vs. Chris Benoit, Chris Jericho and Edge || Raw 6/14/04 || #328
#3 - Rikishi and Too Cool vs. Kurt Angle, Edge and Christian || Judgement Day 2000 || #328


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

HOW ABOUT DEM SELFIES 

disgusting


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Watching Raw tonight and I don't know if I'm just not in the mood to watch wrestling or something but I just witnessed my two favorite living wrestlers in the ring together and didn't even care. :/

Hoping the Rumble can bring me some interest back.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

ROMAN REIGNS! Put this man in the hall of fame.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Luke Harper's festive Lariat said:


> -------- *IF ANYBODY HAS A LINK TO NECRO BUTCHER VS. TOBY KLEIN KOTDM 2004, I WILL BE HIGHLY APPRECIATIVE *[/I]_--------_


_

Check rep.

I actually regret giving this to you because you hated that great Judgment Day tag. Oh well, different taste (AKA YOU'RE A GODDAMN WASTE OF AIR). I do want other people's thoughts on the Necro match because I loved it and would have it top 25 if I actually finished my list (on the unfinished list I have it sits at #9), while someone else thought it was the worst match they watched for the entire duration that the list was running. And then there's Seabs who listed DX/Legacy HIAC, had SummerSlam 2000 TLC at #2 and Michaels/Helmsley SummerSlam at #1, yet said he 'couldn't justify' voting for Eddie/Rey 6/23/05. No one has ever been deader to me. Not even actual dead people. 

The guy who voted doesn't necessarily think the JD tag the objective 100th best match of the decade. Certain people have certain criteria and allow for bias or some such suchiness something. Like when the WWF/E list was done, Rock v. Hogan was in some people's top ten because they thought it captured everything that the WWE should be and was the perfect spectacle, not because it was actually one of the ten best matches the company has ever put on. I don't vote like that, but it's cool for random things to pop up.

Batista/Taker LMS is boring. The JD tag is super fun and I am currently Seabsing you._


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Spoiler: PLEASE



Paul Heyman ‏@HeymanHustle 58s
I had a fascinating conversation today w/ @BROCKLESNAR regarding the NEW @WWE World Champion @RandyOrton


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Spoiler: THANK YOU



I highly doubt anyone can have an interesting conversation about Randy Orton in this lifetime


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

FUCK, hope that's some foreshadowing


----------



## swagger_ROCKS (Jun 5, 2010)

SHIT. Did Orton talk to William Regal before this match or something? 

:banderas dude's style is straight torture tonight. :woolcock


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I would love to see how the usual folks that criticize every Bryan/Orton match to find something wrong with this one. Of course, we still haven't had the dumb ending yet, but this is a very good match.

EDIT: Eh, I liked that ending. ******


----------



## DFUSCMAN (Mar 13, 2010)

Well that was pretty fantastic

*****3/4 - ****** match right there


----------



## swagger_ROCKS (Jun 5, 2010)

That was their best match of their series imo. Orton was on fucking point in that match and the ending was classic heel shit and executed nicely. I agree with the **** stars. Great match and ending. Orton looked phenomenal 

rton2


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Bryan/Orton ****3/4* 

Pretty good night for Orton on the whole, I thought. Cut 2 good promos, and had his best match with Bryan since the heel turn. 

REALLY wish something would come of HBK showing up.


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

The match gets 4 stars from me too. It was great and the best match between Bryan and Orton yet. Fuck Cena.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS (Jun 5, 2010)

HollyJollyHelmsley said:


> Bryan/Orton ****3/4*
> 
> Pretty good night for Orton on the whole, I thought. Cut 2 good promos, and had his best match with Bryan since the heel turn.
> 
> REALLY wish something would come of HBK showing up.


It's still a bit early, they're probably still holding back until we're full well on the road to MANIA.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Why the fuck couldn't Orton/Bryan have THAT match at one of the PPVs (combined with the ending of NOC)? Damn... well, can't complain. We got the best match of there's (so far) on free TV. ***3/4 it gets from me.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Man, that match just brought me fully back into the show after being so bored. Fantastic work by both men, too bad they didn't have this quality of a match on PPV. Fully deserving a ★★★¾. No gimmicks, no shenanigans (save for ending), just two guys beating the hell out of each other.

And yeah, Randy has been really good tonight. DAT BACKSTAGE PROMO! rton2



Spoiler: oh and:



BROCK vs ORTON? :mark: MY DREAMS ARE COMING TRUE!


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Bryan/Orton ****3/4*

Ending didn't bother me. Great way to give Orton heat and not make Bryan look like a chump.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS (Jun 5, 2010)

Missed the backstage promo. May have to go back and check it out.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Anyone else notice the amount of tag matches WWE has been doing a lot lately? They're were like 3 tonight. Is it safe to say The Shield were the ones who really resurrected tag team wrestling? Ever since their arrival, WWE has just placed a huge emphasis on tag team wrestling.

Btw, I know everyone's talking about Bryan/Orton but almost every match tonight was good. There wasn't much storyline wise but the wrestling certainly delivered.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Orton promos... still not doing it for me. He's not completely 100% monotone anymore, but his two promos, including the backstage one, didn't really hold my attention. Ah well, at least he finally delivered a great match with Bryan.

I have a top 30 matches for 2013 all lined up and ready to be posted, but after tonight's Bryan/Orton match, I should probably wait until the year is over. Won't give away too much, but that match just pushed Punk/Jericho from Raw earlier this year off my list. And there's still two more SD's and two more Raw's to go, so anything could happen.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Orton was on point on the mic tonight. Haven't heard Orton cut promos like that in a long ass time. I really have no problems with Orton in his current role. Can't have a babyface champion all the time. I mean, why would a heel chase a babyface? Bryan's time will come eventually. In the meantime, I'll just be enjoying heel Orton.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS (Jun 5, 2010)

sharkboy22 said:


> Anyone else notice the amount of tag matches WWE has been doing a lot lately? They're were like 3 tonight. Is it safe to say The Shield were the ones who really resurrected tag team wrestling? Ever since their arrival, WWE has just placed a huge emphasis on tag team wrestling.
> 
> Btw, I know everyone's talking about Bryan/Orton but almost every match tonight was good. There wasn't much storyline wise but the wrestling certainly delivered.


They still have ways to go, but they're definitely trying their best, and I'm loving it. Great effort atm. And yeah, Shield matches have a huge deal to do with the quality for sure. :clap

Still see no reason why the IC champ should be in the tag division.


----------



## blink_41sum_182 (Apr 9, 2011)

Was totally not expecting that Orton/Bryan match to be that good. 

*** 3/4 for me

Best match since the street fight on Raw a few months back and better than any of their PPV matches.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I would love to see how the usual folks that criticize every Bryan/Orton match to find something wrong with this one. Of course, we still haven't had the dumb ending yet, but this is a very good match.
> 
> EDIT: Eh, I liked that ending. ******


I'll try my best. I find it hard to believe that Randy Orton had a great match in 2013.


----------



## RatedR10 (May 23, 2008)

God damn, that felt like a Raw from May-August with the match quality.

The Shield vs. CM Punk & The Usos - ***1/2
Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan - ****1/4

That Orton-Bryan match was even better than their matches in the summer, WAY better than their PPV matches and was just a notch below Punk-Cena from Raw earlier in the year. That was outstanding. I hope this sets the course for WWE having more quality TV matches like they did early in the year.

I noticed that the match quality on TV (and even PPVs) dropped off BIG TIME after Summerslam compared to before Summerslam (specifically, May-August).


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Fell asleep during MNF (and by proxy, RAW). Can't believe I missed the first really good Bryan vs. Orton match since summer. Ah well, guess I'll download it. :vince5

Oh, and I missed a SHIELD match too? Faaaack.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Orton promos... still not doing it for me. He's not completely 100% monotone anymore, but his two promos, including the backstage one, didn't really hold my attention. Ah well, at least he finally delivered a great match with Bryan.
> 
> I have a top 30 matches for 2013 all lined up and ready to be posted, but after tonight's Bryan/Orton match, I should probably wait until the year is over. Won't give away too much, but that match just pushed Punk/Jericho from Raw earlier this year off my list. And there's still two more SD's and two more Raw's to go, so anything could happen.


What was going to be a top 10 of 2013 from me has turned into a top 30. Also pleasantly surprised that a couple matches from last night and Bryan/Orton from tonight is up there. 

Posting mine near the end of the week probably. Still need to watch the RAW MITB match and Cena/Henry, as well as Shield/Super Friends from EC.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Orton/Bryan - ***3/4
Punk/Usos vs Shield - ***1/2

Both beat everything from last night's PPV, imo.

Actually enjoyed Henry/Big E vs Real Americans too.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I've started making my list of top 100 matches from this year, and by golly it sure is a beauty.

Great Muta vs. Dick Murdoch: ***1/4
CM Punk/Usos vs. The Shield: ***1/4


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I've started making my list of top 100 matches from this year, and by golly it sure is a beauty.
> 
> Great Muta vs. Dick Murdoch: ***1/4
> CM Punk/Usos vs. The Shield: ***1/4


I'm just finishing my top 100 WWE ones. 

Gotta account for tonight's matches in it though.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

One guy that seriously deserves recognition for what he did this year is Sheamus. Before he got injured, he was running Main Event. I can only think of one bad semi-lengthy match he had this year, and like 20 good-great ones. If anyone hasn't done so already, they should check out Sheamus/Barrett from Main Event this year.


----------



## RatedR10 (May 23, 2008)

All this talk of calculating the top 100 matches and I deleted all my lists. Stupid me.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Can't wait to see dem LISTZ


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

Watching TLC now. Thought the opener was really good.



funnyfaces1 said:


> One guy that seriously deserves recognition for what he did this year is Sheamus. Before he got injured, he was running Main Event. I can only think of one bad semi-lengthy match he had this year, and like 20 good-great ones. If anyone hasn't done so already, they should check out Sheamus/Barrett from Main Event this year.


Sheamus was easily a top 5 worker before he got hurt. Maybe even top 3. Any idea when he's returning? The Rumble possibly?


----------



## Dio Brando (Nov 2, 2013)

Anybody got the Raw 50th collection anniversary yet?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I actually miss Sheamus despite not being a huge fan of his last face run. 

Although I think that his absence could help freshen up his character, he would've been wonderful adding to all of the great TV matches we got after his injury unk3


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

LMFAO The Undertaker is shooting right now on the 6 1 98 episode of RAW. The real introduction of Biker Taker. The Foley/Vince promo in the opening of this show is one of Vince's best.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Six man tag was nothing to speak of tonight. Rhodes Dynasty vs Show & Mysterio was better. 

but Danielson vs Orton. YES. :mark: 

Their best match vs one another. >>>> No holds barred from RAW & all their PPVs matches. Manages to trump their recent sprint from Smackdown (aka their original best match yet) Good stuff. RAW didn't really move many angles around, but still manages to leave me liking it more than the PPV. Go figure.


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

Can anybody tell me what hinted Orton/Brock in the recent RAW? Haven't watched and specific details are hard to find.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Pipe dreams. I wouldn't look too much into it. not like we need those awful "dirt sheet" discussions in here as it is.


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Pipe dreams. I wouldn't look too much into it. not like we need those awful "dirt sheet" discussions in here as it is.


Sorry. ummmmm, what's your favorite match in the................................Punk/Cena series?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm always a sucker for their MITB 2011 match. Hasn't really been a match between the two I've disliked. Some on RAW _(mostly one, but the 2010 match where Nexus forms comes close plus another from 2011 iirc)_ didn't get too much time, but they're fine. Great chemistry among the two workers. Most underrated is probably their RAW 2011 match in Canada where Nash distracts Punk. Great match. This year's match from RAW + NOC 2012 are amazing too. Nothing can beat that MITB match though. Perfection.


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

Typical but understandable. I've always liked (loved) their RAW match from this year and think it's the superior of the bunch, sorry about the lack of justification, I'm not good or big on elaboration. I just like it best, seemed real competitive and had a high sense of zealous.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> LMFAO The Undertaker is shooting right now on the 6 1 98 episode of RAW. The real introduction of Biker Taker. The Foley/Vince promo in the opening of this show is one of Vince's best.


"I never lost my smile" 

Was a bit like a shoot promo, slightly weird seeing Taker dressed like that back then.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nothing wrong with it. I picked the most obvious match by near assumption and that's plenty feasible. Not everyone can or needs to write up a ton of words on why they love something the way they do. It's just their feelings on the matter. Cena vs Punk sure made the match this year feel big despite having the obvious outcome at the end of it. Loved the piledriver spot. Real neat touch to add something more to the match.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

BROCK Vs Orton @ Elimination Chamber in MINNESOTA?

Gets rid of the heel/heel dynamic because the crowd will be crazy for BROCK + it gives us the potential of BROCK being WWE Champion once again, if only for a month :mark:.

Makes so much sense that it won't happen.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Or BROCK in an Elimination Chamber match it's self? :ass


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Luke Harper's festive Lariat said:


> Or BROCK in an Elimination Chamber match it's self? :ass


:mark: Just imagining Brock smirking away in the chamber waiting to be unleashed.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> "I never lost my smile"
> 
> Was a bit like a shoot promo, slightly weird seeing Taker dressed like that back then.


He was only dressed like that because his bag got lost at the airport or something lol.

So Bryan/Orton was not only watchable but really good last night? Guess I'll check it out. Just watched Raw and of course I instinctively skipped the main event because LOLORTON.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

MyNameIsJonMarston said:


> Can anybody tell me what hinted Orton/Brock in the recent RAW? Haven't watched and specific details are hard to find.


Heyman tweeted that he had an interesting conversation with Brock about the new World champion (or championship).


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The "conversation" was probably something like "Hey Brock, Orton is their champion of champions. LOL. He's about as much of a threat to you as 3MB. You should totally challenge him" .


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> He was only dressed like that because his bag got lost at the airport or something lol.
> 
> So Bryan/Orton was not only watchable but really good last night? Guess I'll check it out. Just watched Raw and of course I instinctively skipped the main event because LOLORTON.


It was lengthy, but delivered. Didn't have the flat or bad tendencies which have followed Orton over the few years. Actually felt good on damn near every aspect. Finish didn't dirty the fact either. Keeps it alive if Danielson is to be the guy to dethrone Orton come WM. A fun time. Unsure if it has the Goldust match beat, but it's the only other thing this year that is close.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Bryan/Orton from last night is better than Goldust's return match. Thought Goldie worked a nice match in his return, but last night's affair just really did it for me.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

That was like, Orton's first great match in two and a half years.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

INSTALLMENT ONE

HOLY SHIT, NON-WWE ST00F~!

*The Necro Butcher vs. Toby Klein || IWA-MS King Of The Death Match 6/25/04 || #328*
_This was bat shit craziness and made very little sense, but I'll be telling the fattest and sweatiest of lies if I said I didn't enjoy the hell out of it. Both men just absolutely kill each other, and whilst they don't quite pull out the kitchen sink, they do pull out the rolling pin with thumbtacks in it and a tub of salt for the open wounds. Now I'm not an expert on Deathmatches, but I wouldn't even call this a wrestling match, it's just two guys beating the snot out of each other and one letting the other win. I loved this. So so much. Does that make me a little sick and a little morbid? Possibly. Sue me. HIGHLY RECOMMEND THIS._

*Roderick Strong vs. Rocky Romero || PWG All Star Weekend V Night 1 || #328*
_More Non-WWE stuff, how dare I? Anyway, this should be a change of pace compared to the last match. Okay - If you don't enjoy Roderick Strong in exhibition type matches, y'know the ones wheres it moves for move and there's no real story involved, then there must be something wrong with you. For a very averagely sized wrestler (at 210-220 pounds, maybe?) he is unbelievably strong (no pun intended) and in this match, he's throwing Rocky Romero around for fun, and Romero is probably only fifteen lighter than Roddy at the most. Roddy's offense is so creative and very fresh, whilst still being believable. Very very fun. I've never been a fan of Romero (although him > Ricky Reyes x10000) but he has the crowd behind him and plays a nice babyface. The two hit each other hard, and it's not too one sided but not too back and forth either. The finish fell a bit flat, IMO. They had a decent hot finishing sequence, but they just cut it short for the one big move to end it, and it kind of just killed the ending, IMO. Fun._

I guess I'll do some WWE stuff now :side:

*Jerry Lawler vs. The Brian Kendrick || RAW 7/20/09 || #324*
_Kendrick acts a dick. King plays the face legend. King puts Kendrick in his place. Don't care._

*William Regal vs. Tajiri || Smackdown! 11/01/01 || #321*
_Occasionally I see conversation about great sub five minute matches - This is one of them. It goes two minutes, and it includes KICKS, FOREARMS and GENERAL MANLINESS. It's exactly what you'd expect from Tajiri and William Regal. It won't be high on my list, in fact it will be close to the bottom, but that doesn't mean that this isn't good. Because it is. And you should watch it. Now. C'mon. It's only two minutes. Literally. Just do it._

*Paul London and Brian Kendrick vs. William Regal and Dave Taylor || Smackdown! 1/22/07 || #300*
_I dug this a lot. Was a very simple match. Faces start off extremely hot, get cut off, heels build heat by beating down one face, face makes hot tag, fresh face explodes and clean house, heels look to regain the momentum before the faces find the victory through the back door. Whilst we've seen this formula hundreds of times before, in this instance, it was done expertly. Regal and Taylor's offense was brutal and gritty, London bumped well and Kendrick's hot tag was received well by the crowd and was quick and exciting. By all means, this was a "by the book" match, but it was a very well written book._



Spoiler: MY LIST SO FAR



#1 Necro Butcher vs. Toby Klein || IWA-MS King Of The Death Match 6/25/04 || #328
#2 Roderick Strong vs. Rocky Romero || PWG All Star Weekend V Night 1 || #328
#3 Paul London and Brian Kendrick vs. William Regal and Dave Taylor || Smackdown! 1/22/07 || #300
#4 Batista vs. The Undertaker || Last Man Standing Match || Backlash 2007 || #328
#5 Evolution vs. Chris Benoit, Chris Jericho and Edge || Raw 6/14/04 || #328
#6 Rikishi and Too Cool vs. Kurt Angle, Edge and Christian || Judgement Day 2000 || #328 
#7 William Regal vs. Tajiri || Smackdown! 11/01/01 || #321
#8 Jerry Lawler vs. The Brian Kendrick || RAW 7/20/09 || #324



May watch some more later. I've got YT links for every match bar the Roddy/Romero match (which I can upload if anybody wants it) so just ask if you're too lazy to search it yourself.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Is the Necro vs Klein match on youtube? I need it if so.

Roddy vs Rocky is an all out BLITZ. Brag moment just b/c - it was intense as fuck live. Despite being a big Strong fan (does that sound weird?) I was pro Rocky in that one. I dug the finish. Flying arm bar ftw~!

Team ROH vs Brits tag isn't the one I remember too well, iirc - think mine is their first tag from late '06 - but I'm certain it kills it all the same. Those dudes being put together with a nice chunk of time to create something was merely a drop in the bucket for what 2006 on Smackdown provided. And led into 2007 with.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Also check out Regal's single matches with Londrick on SD in 06 around that time. :mark: both are great but one (I *think* the London match) rules a fucking ton.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Only the main even from Mind Games left:

*WWF World Heavyweight Championship*
Shawn Michaels (c) vs. Mankind (w/Paul Bearer)

:mark: :mark: :mark:

Dunno who wins, tbh; this should be awesome.

The rest of the ppv was pretty bad. I liked Goldust vs Undertaker, but the other matches were boring.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

REGAL.

Michaels vs Mankind is nearly perfect. And that's basically most of those New Gen PPVs in a nutshell. 1-2 matches worked and the rest of the card is a total bore.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Is the Necro vs Klein match on youtube? I need it if so.
> 
> Roddy vs Rocky is an all out BLITZ. Brag moment just b/c - it was intense as fuck live. Despite being a big Strong fan (does that sound weird?) I was pro Rocky in that one. I dug the finish. Flying arm bar ftw~!
> 
> Team ROH vs Brits tag isn't the one I remember too well, iirc - think mine is their first tag from late '06 - but I'm certain it kills it all the same. Those dudes being put together with a nice chunk of time to create something was merely a drop in the bucket for what 2006 on Smackdown provided. And led into 2007 with.


The bow and arrow round the ringpost looked fantastic. As well as when Roddy tied Rocky in the ropes, rendering him helpless and allowing Strong to boot him in the head. Innovation~!

Also, check your rep for Necro/Klein. YEAH1993 gave me the link, so it's thanks to him.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Holy fuck that kick too iirc. Unbearably sick. I should tell you to check dailymotion and watch both of the Brain Damage vs Jon Moxley matches I pitched in here a few days ago. If only for sicking fuxing punches. I advocate plenty.

:mark:

Classic moops. It had to be him; match made the list all on his accord.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Okay am I actually going to have to watch these indy matches?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Do you know Necro Butcher?

Don't answer if that's a no. Just accept it and watch. _(all of em)_


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I sure do. What I've seen of him has been rather LEGIT. Guy is a nut. I saw a match between him and Samoa Joe that was pretty brutal.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

K, then def take the time for his match. He's always legit.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Necro vs. Joe is one of my favourite matches of all time. Botched exploder off the apron onto concrete 

:wall


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> K, then def take the time for his match. He's always legit.


Rep me the link pls 

I still need to watch Bryan/Orton from last night. Great to hear it getting universal praise unlike their other matches. I'm halfway through Shield/Punk & Samoans and so far I'm not too impressed.

"WE WANT GOLDUST" chants earlier in the night = ~!


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

MysteriShow gonna get a tag title match at the RR now that they beat the champs in a non title match? That plus Orton Vs Cena Vs Bryan (seems likely given the end of the show this week) + RR match could make it a decent show this year. Assuming the Rumble doesn't blow. And Bryan can be the Benoit to Orton & Cena like Benoit was to HHH & HBK, making a triple threat between them really fucking good. Random 2 minute diva title match + another big-ish match to make up for no WHC match and we could end up with a good event. AND I WON'T BE ABLE TO WATCH IT LIVE . At least I don't think, no cunt answered my question from last time.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

If Bryan is in the title match, I wonder who the favorite would be to win the Rumble. Punk? Lesnar? A returning Sheamus?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I think if a triple threat happens, Orton retains and then Bryan enters the Rumble and wins it.

Gonna rewatch TLC (Orton/Cena that is) and yesterday's main event again. :mark:


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Watched Cena/Orton TLC again. The match flew by and I still enjoyed it second time around. I'm sticking with ****1/2.* The 4 way tag has also dipped to ****1/2* but it's still fun. So yeah, nothing monumental from this show but a decent way to round off the PPV year.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Stocking Filler said:


> Rep me the link pls
> 
> I still need to watch Bryan/Orton from last night. Great to hear it getting universal praise unlike their other matches. I'm halfway through Shield/Punk & Samoans and so far I'm not too impressed.
> 
> "WE WANT GOLDUST" chants earlier in the night = ~!


Done. 

GOLDUST


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

I think it would be awesome to do Orton/Bryan at the Rumble. But a stip is definitely needed. Maybe LMS? Cage? Goddamit, something so it doesn't look like the exact same match we've seen a dozen times this year.

Anyway, Bryan loses obviously but later comes out in the Rumble and wins the damn thing. Unfortunately, if they go that route I can see the last two men bring Bryan and Cena and WWe will fuck it up and make it a triple threat match at Mania. God, I hope that doesn't happen.

I know there's been a lot of rumours that Cena/HHH will be taking place this year but who the hell wants to see that? Well, I don't. And holy shit, I can't believe it but I'm actually speculating about Wrestlemania.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

sharkboy22 said:


> I know there's been a lot of rumours that Cena/HHH will be taking place this year but who the hell wants to see that? Well, I don't. And holy shit, I can't believe it but I'm actually speculating about Wrestlemania.


I'd like to see it if HHH wins and gets revenge for Cena ruining my life @ WM22.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

nah FUCK that

why is Triple H around?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Because he is LEGIT. :HHH


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Fuck HHH/Cena, I have no desire to see that and most people agree with me. Really hope they don't go with it because it'd be extremely pointless. DAT UNWANTED REMATCH was supposed to happen 6 (7 by WM30 time) years ago, leave that in the past and move on plz.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Stocking Filler said:


> Because he is LEGIT. :HHH


Not since he had this theme:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I see orton/bryan was really good ?

Nonce you said its just as good as the goldust and sd bryan match ?


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I just really don't want Orton in the title picture come Mania 

Because if he's the champion, and either Punk or Bryan win the Rumble like I want, we'll either get Bryan vs. Orton x10000 or Punk vs. Orton which I really do not want to see. The only way that doesn't happen is if Punk and Bryan don't win the Rumble and that will mean Cena, HHH or The Rock probably will. Unless they push someone completely out of the blue.

Orton being Champion heading in to Mania does sweet F all for me. I'd rather have the belt on HHH than Orton. But knowing my luck, they'll put the belt on Hunter with the intentions of putting Punk or Bryan over at Mania, then Vince will change it last minute so Cena wins the rumble. :side:

I see no way of me winning with Wrestlemania.

On a brighter note: I'm in such a big wrestling mood at the minute. Going to watch MOAR matches. And review MOAR. Probably won't post til' tomorrow though, maybe the day after and just have a huge post and clear a chunk of them out of the way.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I really don't want Orton involved in the title picture come Mania, either, but it's looking likely. Hopefully we get some other big matches that make up for it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> I see orton/bryan was really good ?
> 
> Nonce you said its just as good as the goldust and sd bryan match ?


Below vs Goldust, a tad above the *recent* Smackdown sprint vs Danielson.

That's his top three on the year for lack of a better way of putting it. I should rewatch it to see if it holds up.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> I see orton/bryan was really good ?
> 
> Nonce you said its just as good as the goldust and sd bryan match ?


It's better than both. Orton's best match since SummerSlam 2011 with Christian and another one of the many great Bryan matches this year.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I'll check it out


black guys/real Americans and showrey/rhodes bros looked ok


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cody blasts Big Show in the face with a punch a la Dustin. Show proceeded to block the next few following b/c he wasn't expecting it. T'was worth watching for that alone.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Paramore fan (and anyone else), tell me all the sleeper hits from NXT this year that belong on THE LIST. Something like Sheamus/Harper or Ohno/Harper.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

If someone could rep me the link to the Kline/Butcher match that would be great 

That sounds :mark:


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Check out Neville/Grey vs. Ohno/Kruger from the tag title tounament as well as the finals between Neville/Grey and The Wyatts. Both were in february, I believe.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

That Orton/Bryan match was :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Paramore fan (and anyone else), tell me all the sleeper hits from NXT this year that belong on THE LIST. Something like Sheamus/Harper or Ohno/Harper.


obiv the cesaro/zayn

check out zayn/swagger ( really recommend this one)

harper/sheamus


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

IYH: Buried Alive next, I suppose HBK got injured after Mind Games.

The main event :mark: :mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

TWO more people like Necro/Klein? Hhahahahahaha IT IS WORKINGGGG, MY EMPRESS. YOUR PLAN IS WORKING. THEY WILL SOON WORSHIP YOU AS I DO.

I don't mind people repping/PMing the link around to whoever, just don't really want it to out in the open OPEN. I assume rep is private enough. wha/ev


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> That Orton/Bryan match was :mark:


Really looking forward to checking it out when I get home. :mark:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

It was the best Orton/Bryan match I've seen. The only thing I didn't like was the ending but I understand why they did it.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> I'll check it out
> 
> 
> black guys/real Americans and showrey/rhodes bros looked ok


When you do, watch the Orton promo from right before the match first. Helps set the tone for the whole match. It starts at the 8:40 mark here, and then the Orton/Bryan match is right after that.


ETA: Also, the Orton promo at the 5:42 mark here was at the beginning of the show, and sets up the whole storyline and circumstance of the match. It explains Orton's mood and everything going into the match, which really helps make the match that much even better. Good promos from Orton both times.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Stocking Filler said:


> Really looking forward to checking it out when I get home. :mark:


You will not be disappointed 

On a different note I have really been enjoying BFG 2010 so far, I'm on Lethal Lockdown.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

BFG was the one with Young Bucks vs. MCMG and Lethal/Williams right? I remember liking those two matches a lot.

Thanks for the NXT recommendations, guys. :lol There's a good chance that no match from Extreme Rules, Royal Rumble, Night of Champions, or TLC are worth being put in the top 100. Nope, not even Lesnar/HHH. I liked that match, but even Brock can't carry :HHH2 to a good enough match.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> When you do, watch the Orton promo from right before the match first. Helps set the tone for the whole match. It starts at the 8:40 mark here, and then the Orton/Bryan match is right after that.
> 
> 
> ETA: Also, the Orton promo at the 5:42 mark here was at the beginning of the show, and sets up the whole storyline and circumstance of the match. It explains Orton's mood and everything going into the match, which really helps make the match that much even better. Good promos from Orton both times.


Will do, I caught the beginning of the show with everyone on the stage will the corp was in the ring (dat "everyone on a stage is a pussy thread" :ti

Also, as a result of a horrible stream only got to see most of orton/cena and the 4 way tag and some of all the other matches, from TLC

Thought the 4 way was good, impressed with the rybaxel's portion as well as real Americans, something happen to my stream and I didnt see the real American get eliminated but the rest of the match from there. Thought the quality to alittle dip after they left which makes that 2 straight ppvs 

Thought orton/cena was all over the place, and that the no selling by Orton as well as Cena climbing too much hurt. Crazy enough, this was NOWHERE near there worst match and actually towards the top of rankings of there match ups for me, take that for what it was worth


Btw understand Yeah's green light, could any of you pm me that link


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Just got raped by my last difficult exam. At least I can watch wrestling without feeling guilty about studying now. unk8

Still waiting for my super slow Internet to finish downloading the RAW torrent so I can watch Bryan vs. Orton. I'll probably check out the Punk/Usos vs. Shield match too.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> *BFG was the one with Young Bucks vs. MCMG and Lethal/Williams right?* I remember liking those two matches a lot.
> 
> Thanks for the NXT recommendations, guys. :lol There's a good chance that no match from Extreme Rules, Royal Rumble, Night of Champions, or TLC are worth being put in the top 100. Nope, not even Lesnar/HHH. I liked that match, but even Brock can't carry :HHH2 to a good enough match.


Yes it is :agree:

You didn't love the tag titles from TLC?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Wow, Orton v Danielson was absolutely stellar. Definitely the best they ever had. Sorta reminds me of the Eddie v Edge series were they had two somewhat disappointing ppv matches then it all came together on that tremendous smackdown match. ***3/4 for last nights Raw main event. I think that's Orton best singles match since the Christian series in 2011.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I quite liked the Eddie/Edge PPV matches, and don't particularly care for their SD match .


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Don't recall the SD match, but then again a'lot of TV matches are lost to me.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Finished rewatching the Orton/Cena and Orton/Bryan (as well as all of Orton's segments).

TLC match remains around ★★★¼ like before. Understandably worked pretty safely since WWE can't afford losing their two top stars with a slow pace that didn't ruin it like I would expect and a clever finish (despite the slight botch with Cena's landing). Nothing came across as very contrived other than Cena setting up the second table against the turnbuckle.

It is completely tamed thanks to the incredible Orton/Bryan match from last night, though. Just rewatched that and I'm upgrading it to ★★★★. Orton hasn't been this on point since the Christian matches back in 2011. Just awesome action for 20 minutes and never a dull moment throughout. Orton truly looked like a heel here with his cheap tactics and the finish was classic heel booking. lol'd @ the leg biting during the Indian Deathlock. :lol

And his promos remain as good as I went through them. Really hope this Orton continues to deliver. If the double championship has motivated him to perform at top level, then keep them on him forever! :hb Despite us continuously doubting him, Randy still has it in him to be awesome, just he continues having matches this good and preferably goes back to his younger look.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The Orton/Christian match in July on SD is really good. Definitely listworthy. So is the TLC tag match and (unfortunately) HHH/Lesnar. Man, Randy was on fire during the Summer. Those RVD matches are good too. And the Cesaro match.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> I quite liked the Eddie/Edge PPV matches, and don't particularly care for their SD match .



Well then. Exception to every rule I suppose. I really love that Smackdown match, everything seemed to click perfectly and they did a great job of incorporating the different weapons without making it seem contrived. Plus, the end with Edge hardway busting open Eddie on the top of the ladder, then Eddie getting a standing ovation as the heel makes me :mark: everytime. Their Summerslam and Unforgiven were solid ***ish bouts, I thought Smackdown got into the ****+ territory. Just my opinion.

I've been in a Christian mood lately, I rewatched the Swagger and Regal series from 2009 and the Orton 2011 series, I think I'm gonna go back to 2005 and see what I can find. Is Edge even in Christian's league as a worker? I'm really starting to think he isn't. Very hard to find flat out bad Christian matches.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Christian in 2005 was great, specially as a character. But I honestly can't remember any quality TV matches just off the top of my head with the exception of the Randy Orton match from 14/2 on Raw. But that doesn't mean he was bad, just that I need to check profightdb to give definitive recommendations.

Actually, I just remembered that awesome match he had with Benoit a week after WM21. (11 April)


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Christian in 2005 was great, specially as a character. But I honestly can't remember any quality TV matches just off the top of my head with the exception of the Randy Orton match from 14/2 on Raw. But that doesn't mean he was bad, just that I need to check profightdb to give definitive recommendations.
> 
> Actually, I just remembered that awesome match he had with Benoit a week after WM21. (11 April)



Christian vs Benoit????? Are you for real? I gotta find that pronto :mark:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

:homer at the rep William Murderface sent me. 



Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> I've been in a Christian mood lately, I rewatched the Swagger and Regal series from 2009 and the Orton 2011 series, I think I'm gonna go back to 2005 and see what I can find. Is Edge even in Christian's league as a worker? I'm really starting to think he isn't. Very hard to find flat out bad Christian matches.


Christian > Edge as a worker. And 2005 Christian is a good choice as he was so enjoyable back then with his captain charisma character, shame he wasn't booked nearly as well as he should of been then. As for 2005 Christian TV matches, I've always enjoyed this match he had with Batista:










Don't think I've heard anyone really talk about this match, but it's fun bout with Christian carrying the green Batista at the time to a decent length match. You have the hot UK crowd as well that are more in Christian's favor than Batista's which was awesome, and you have some fun shenanigans with Coach being the referee and Flair and Triple H at ringside.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

finished orton/bryan, was very good deserves all the praise, bryan working Orton leg was fantastic as well as arm work on dbryan by orton. What stood out was orton was selling very well in this, haven't seen him sell a beating this well in a very long time. Only probelm I can find was it was abit lengthy, but I didnt struggle in watching it

***3/4-**** range, and no I didn't have a problem with the ending, if I didnt I be a hypocrite, because I worship :flair3


Edit: I got it as well, muderface you devil :banderas, you see that vid of Shelly in the funny pic thread ? rton2


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

If I listing wrestlers I've watched in order of how good they were Christian would be hundreds of spots above Edge. Don't see any argument for Edge being better, like, at all. tbhayley.

I legitimately think Christian's 2009-2010 is better than Edge's entire career combined and it's not even close.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Christian vs Benoit????? Are you for real? I gotta find that pronto :mark:


YES! It's a dream match that has happened and delivered perfectly.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Re-watched Bryan/Orton from Raw last night. Enjoyed it a little bit less, but I think I'll keep at the same rating (just lower on the list of 2013 matches). Ending didn't bother me as much on the re-match, but I really hope they aren't going to do more Bryan/Orton. They might've had a great match, but that's one in what? Half a dozen at least. Orton/Cena is kind of the same. Maybe a triple threat could be interesting though... and by that I mean Bryan and Cena whoop Orton's ass in the early part of the match, wrestle for 20 minutes, and then if Orton MUST retain, have him sneak in an RKO and steal the win at the end. 

Also re-watched Punk/Ambrose from SD a couple of weeks ago... actually much like the above match, where I originally had it at a high ***3/4, it's now a lower at that rating. Maybe I'm just in the wrong mood to watch wrestling today. 

Here's my Top 30 matches of the year... if another match comes in that knocks one of them off (which would be hard to do at this point), I'll just edit it after the year ends. But meh, here I go (in spoilers because... well:



Spoiler: Top 30 WWE 2013 matches



*TOP 30 2013 WWE MATCHES*
(***1/2)
*30) Mark Henry vs. Randy Orton vs. Chris Jericho vs. Daniel Bryan vs. Kane vs. Jack Swagger - Elimination Chamber 









29) Cody Rhodes and Goldust vs. Big Show and Rey Mysterio vs. Jack Swagger and Antonio Cesaro vs. Ryback and Curtis Axel - TLC









(***3/4)

28) Daniel Bryan vs. Randy Orton - Raw 12/16









27) CM Punk vs. Dean Ambrose - Smackdown 12/6









26) Wade Barrett vs. Daniel Bryan - Smackdown 8/23









25) CM Punk vs. Chris Jericho - Payback









24) Cody Rhodes and Goldust vs. Roman Reigns and Seth Rollins vs. Jimmy Uso and Jey Uso - Hell in a Cell









23) Christian vs. Alberto Del Rio - Smackdown 8/9









22) Daniel Bryan vs. Seth Rollins - Raw 6/10









21) Roman Reigns, Dean Ambrose, Seth Rollins, Antonio Cesaro and Jack Swagger vs. Rey Mysterio, Jey Uso, Jimmy Uso, Cody Rhodes, and Goldust - Survivor Series









20) Cody Rhodes and Goldust vs. Seth Rollins and Roman Reigns - Battleground









19) CM Punk vs. Seth Rollins, Roman Reigns and Dean Ambrose - TLC









18) Damien Sandow vs. John Cena - Raw 10/28









17) Damien Sandow, Antonio Cesaro and Jack Swagger vs. John Cena, Cody Rhodes and Goldust - Smackdown 11/1









16) Dean Ambrose, Seth Rollins, and Roman Reigns vs. Chris Jericho, Ryback, and Sheamus - Raw 2/18









15) Daniel Bryan and Kane vs. Seth Rollins and Roman Reigns - Raw 5/27









(****)

14) Dolph Ziggler vs. Antonio Cesaro - Main Event 7/10









13) Dean Ambrose, Roman Reigns and Seth Rollins vs. Daniel Bryan, Kane, and Kofi Kingston - Raw 5/20









12) CM Punk and Daniel Bryan vs. Luke Harper and Eric Rowan - Survivor Series









11) Damien Sandow, Antonio Cesaro and Jack Swagger vs. John Cena, Cody Rhodes, and Goldust - Raw 11/4









10) Wade Barrett vs, Sheamus - Main Event 5/29









9) Cody Rhodes and Goldust vs. Seth Rollins and Roman Reigns - Raw 10/14









8) The Undertaker, Kane, and Daniel Bryan vs. Roman Reigns, Seth Rollins, and Dean Ambrose - Raw 4/22









7) CM Punk vs. John Cena - Raw 2/25









6) Damien Sandow vs. Cody Rhodes vs. Dean Ambrose vs. Antonio Cesaro vs. Jack Swagger vs. Wade Barrett vs. Fandango - Money in the Bank









5) Dolph Ziggler vs. Alberto Del Rio - Payback









4) Daniel Bryan vs. Antonio Cesaro - Raw 7/22









(****1/4)
3) Daniel Bryan vs. John Cena - Summerslam









(****3/4)

2) CM Punk vs. The Undertaker - Wrestlemania 29










AND NUMBER 1... LIKE IT'S ANY SURPRISE TO ANYONE...









































1) CM Punk vs. Brock Lesnar - Summerslam*







​


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Nice list, I personally wouldn't agree with most but I like how you added the pictures in. I completely forgot about making a list back in august,pretty sure I know my top 5 off the top of my head. Will be interesting see others lists, although would be shocked if someone DIDNT have punk/brock as #1


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

I only saw unk2 :brock once (live) until the other day and I think it's the best match of the year or at least 1A 1B with unk5 :cena5 on Raw for the Mania title shot. I have watched that match a lot more though. Punk's piledriver! :mark: 

I know they have had a shit ton of matches but what are your top 5 (more if you want) favorite Guerrero/Crispben Waaa matches?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> finished orton/bryan, was very good deserves all the praise, bryan working Orton leg was fantastic as well as arm work on dbryan by orton. What stood out was orton was selling very well in this, haven't seen him sell a beating this well in a very long time. Only probelm I can find was it was abit lengthy, but I didnt struggle in watching it
> 
> ***3/4-**** range, and no I didn't have a problem with the ending, if I didnt I be a hypocrite, because I worship :flair3
> 
> ...


Just watched it, it was a little uncomfortable because I felt like I was watching soft core porn with Damien Sandow :|

Who did you rep me with?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Bah gawd, Shield vs Cena/Ryback/Sheamus at Elimination Chamber is still fucking awesome. Dat spear on Sheamus :mark: Spear on Ryback :mark: REIGNS :mark: Great face in peril segment on Cena. Ambrose and Reigns especially did well on that.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

HollyJollyHelmsley said:


> Bah gawd, Shield vs Cena/Ryback/Sheamus at Elimination Chamber is still fucking awesome. Dat spear on Sheamus :mark: Spear on Ryback :mark: REIGNS :mark: Great face in peril segment on Cena. Ambrose and Reigns especially did well on that.


Agreed. I bought that DVD mostly just to have that match. It was like $5 used a few weeks ago.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Just watched it, it was a little uncomfortable because I felt like I was watching soft core porn with Damien Sandow :|
> 
> Who did you rep me with?


i actually didnt realize it was Sandow for a minute, how weird he has been santa twice, beth :deandre, and I have no clue who was the chick is, dont even know what her face looks like :hbk2, not surprised you like Ms.Marie as well as we have pretty much same taste in dames 


I will try and rewatch cena/punk raw tonite


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Finished watching IYH: Buried Alive. Like the previous PPVs, the main event was good, I also liked the Mero/Goldust match. Rest ranged from bad to decent. This is the first PPV to use the common Stone Cold theme and that's interesting to know.

Can't wait for Undetaker's return. Those are so epic every time.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> i actually didnt realize it was Sandow for a minute, how weird he has been santa twice, beth :deandre, and I have no clue who was the chick is, dont even know what her face looks like :hbk2, not surprised you like Ms.Marie as well as we have pretty much same taste in dames
> 
> 
> I will try and rewatch cena/punk raw tonite


I would have much preferred if it was was just Beth & Shelly :ass & Eva Marie is just :homer

I'm gonna watch Cena/Punk now as well, haven't watched it since I saw it on it RAW.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> I would have much preferred if it was was just Beth & Shelly :ass & Eva Marie is just :homer
> 
> I'm gonna watch Cena/Punk now as well, haven't watched it since I saw it on it RAW.


You're my new favorite person because of DAT REP PHOTO. 

Also, Zayn/Swagger ROCKS. Easily earns a spot in the top 30.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

HollyJollyHelmsley said:


> You're my new favorite person because of DAT REP PHOTO.
> 
> Also, Zayn/Swagger ROCKS. Easily earns a spot in the top 30.


I had a good feeling you would enjoy that 

I just can't wait for Zayn to get called up to the main roster :mark:


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Am I the only one not blowing my load all over the screen with Eva Marie? :aries2 

I mean she is hot I'd hit it but there are hotter divas IMHO. Also, that hair. :jay It burns my retinas. Jessica Rabbit called she wants her gimmick back. She is much hotter as a brunette.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Can't stand her. It's mainly because she comes off as the stupidest person on the earth.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Agreed. That being said I'd bang the fuck out of Kim K and she is dumb as a box of yarn. :kanye


----------



## dxbender (Jul 22, 2007)

Anyone have any youtube clips or anything of JBL saying his various catchphrases? I wanna make a video using them but I can't really find all the videos that easily.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Just watched Taker vs Angle from NWO 06. What an awesome match, those last ten minutes are simply epic with every nearfall. But I don't quite feel like it's a 5 star match anymore. 4 and ¾ like I originally had it is probably more in line. Watching this made me think since I've gone through every RA era year recently ('cept 02), I should probably try a top 100 matches from that era. Would be an amazing lot of matches to choose from and enjoy.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I've come real close to giving Angle/Taker the full five. Probably my favorite match of that year.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Just watched cena/punk raw again, and its holds up beautifully, actually went up. Its so fuck that all there matches start the SAME way but it always works. This is I think my 3rd/4th time watching it and its gone up every time. I love the big fight feel, the crowd was pretty good and cena/punk just stole it again. What is crazy is it only there 2nd best match. LOL at some guy in the front screaming "Punk ASS" like he is creative or something.

This is 3rd best match this year


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> I've come real close to giving Angle/Taker the full five. Probably my favorite match of that year.


It is easily my MOTY for 06 followed by Benoit/Orton (NHB, 13/1), Rey/Orton (SD) and Benoit/Finlay (JD).


----------



## RatedR10 (May 23, 2008)

MachoMadness1988 said:


> Am I the only one not blowing my load all over the screen with Eva Marie? :aries2
> 
> I mean she is hot I'd hit it but there are hotter divas IMHO. Also, that hair. :jay It burns my retinas. Jessica Rabbit called she wants her gimmick back. She is much hotter as a brunette.


No. I'm just waiting for her to make a fool of herself on live TV. She always looks like she's going to fall in her heels when she walks down the ramp.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Anyone else excited to see what Sheamus does whenever he returns? Everyone leaves him out of the WM equation but I think he'll be back and ready by then.

Has anyone thought about Sheamus/Taker? I know he probably wouldn't win or give you that feeling like he might, but I think the match itself would be awesome.

OR OR OR OR OR

What about Sheamus/Lesnar?!


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Going through all these Sheamus matches tonight has made me miss him. Dude was a walking 3 star match. Sheamus/Cena please.

Also went through every Ziggler/ADR match this year. Man, those two have underrated chemistry. Every single match they had was very good. All of them. Even the cash-in.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Ziggler/Del Rio stuff is great. That Payback match is just on another level though, thanks to the story. I really liked the MITB match too. Didn't see that get much love around here but I thought it was awesome.

Their TV match stuff is all pretty solid though. They managed to mix it up well too.


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

Was the Payback match the one where Del Rio targeted his head and they essentially did the face/heel role reversal thing. Because I thought that was really damn good. Didn't quite get the recognition it deserved at the time I don't think. I felt like people should have been talking about it more.

As for Sheamus, totally agree with you guys. While his character blows, he is a fantastic worker. I would love to see another match with him against Daniel Bryan. Their 2/3 Falls match was excellent and probably in the top 5 of 2012. 

I think a match against Lesnar could be pretty good. I'd be very interested in a one off between them to see how they go. A match with Taker I'm not so sure about to be honest. Part of the appeal for WM Taker matches for me is the character and story work during the build. I don't think I'd be interested in seeing that from Sheamus, despite knowing the match would surely be good.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Mysterio vs Chavo Guerrero Jr from GAB '04 is still HOLY SHIT level great.

Lets all watch and talk about this now.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Raw Ratings

Rhodes vs. MysterShow - **1/2
Fandango vs. Dolph Ziggler - **
Henry & Langston vs. Real Americans - *** 
Tons of Funk vs. RybAxel- *1/2
CM Punk & The Usos vs. The Shield - ***1/2
Divas Match - *
Daniel Bryan vs. Randy Orton - ****1/4

Pretty good show overall.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Bryan/Orton is :mark:. Gonna watch again soon and then get to work on my best of 2013 LIST THAT WILL NEVER COME TO FRUITION AND WILL NEVER INCLUDE RIO/ZIGS lol.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

About to start Survivor Series 1996 and the card looks awesome, the best 1996 had (I started at KOTR though).

From 1997 on, I will also watch the regular shows to know more about the feuds.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Just watch RAW (pulling two all-nighters in a row fucked my sleeping schedule), and Bryan vs. Orton was outstanding. I liked Punk/Usos vs. Shield too. But man, Dallas got Punk vs. Cena *AND* Bryan vs. Orton this year as their RAW main events. Lucky bastards.

Also, :lmao at Orton's backstage promo. That's the fastest I've heard him talk in 4 years. Good stuff though.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Mysterio vs Chavo Guerrero Jr from GAB '04 is still HOLY SHIT level great.
> 
> Lets all watch and talk about this now.



Really? That's on the Rey set right? I never bothered watching it because it's Chavo, and Chavo bores me outside of tagging with Eddie....you have never steered me wrong though I'll have to check it out.

For anyone that's interested, Benoit vs Jericho Fall Brawl 1996 is absolutely awesome.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Chavo/Rey is definitely Chavo's greatest match ever. It's actually good.

Rock/Austin WM 19 is superb and Rock really was the driving force of the match and helped make it as good as it was.

Miz/Lawler TLC is a super fun TV match.

Barrett/Bryan from SS '11 is far and away Barrett's best match. One of the many reasons I like that show.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Really? That's on the Rey set right? I never bothered watching it because it's Chavo, and Chavo bores me outside of tagging with Eddie....you have never steered me wrong though I'll have to check it out.
> 
> For anyone that's interested, Benoit vs Jericho Fall Brawl 1996 is absolutely awesome.


It might be on a Mysterio set. Not sure. Either way you gots to check it out. For as good as Eddie vs JBL was on that night, Chavo had a match that ended up being that much better.



CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Barrett/Bryan from SS '11 is far and away Barrett's best match. One of the many reasons I like that show.


One of the Sheamus matches from Main Event earns that honor for me. Forget which date. Both are stellar, though.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Speaking of last night's RAW (sort of), is there a reason that Punk doesn't do the bulldog after the running knee in the corner anymore? 

I might just watch some matches until I end up falling asleep again. No point in studying for my music exam since I have an A locked up :delrio


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Really? That's on the Rey set right? I never bothered watching it because it's Chavo, and Chavo bores me outside of tagging with Eddie....you have never steered me wrong though I'll have to check it out.
> 
> For anyone that's interested, Benoit vs Jericho Fall Brawl 1996 is absolutely awesome.


Chavo/Rey NWO 2004 is great too.

Finished GAB 2004 tonight & everything was mediocre or blah just like I remembered except for Chavo/Rey & Eddie/JBL

Onto Vengeance 2004 now, let's see if I still hate the IC Title match.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

MachoMadness1988 said:


> Am I the only one not blowing my load all over the screen with Eva Marie? :aries2
> 
> I mean she is hot I'd hit it but there are hotter divas IMHO. Also, that hair. :jay It burns my retinas. Jessica Rabbit called she wants her gimmick back. She is much hotter as a brunette.


Red hair >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> brunette on Eva for me. I don't really care for her as a brunette at all.



Dominick The Donkey said:


> Ziggler/Del Rio stuff is great. That Payback match is just on another level though, thanks to the story. I really liked the MITB match too. Didn't see that get much love around here but I thought it was awesome.
> 
> Their TV match stuff is all pretty solid though. They managed to mix it up well too.


This. How many posts on praising Ziggler/Del Rio from Payback is it going to take for Starbuck's lazy ass to finally get around to watching it?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I never understood the craze about Kelly and Torrie :no:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Chavo/Rey NWO 2004 is great too.
> 
> Finished GAB 2004 tonight & everything was mediocre or blah just like I remembered except for Chavo/Rey & Eddie/JBL
> 
> Onto Vengeance 2004 now, let's see if I still hate the IC Title match.


Wow, Rey selling the leg in that match was absolutely tremendous. It's amazing to me, Rey, with a freaking mask on, manages to get more sympathy with his selling, than any other wrestler I've ever seen. This match just ruled, Chavo was kind of unimpressive with his offense and bumping at times (he flat out missed on several kicks and boots) but he based well enough for an in his prime Rey Mysterio, which is no simple feat. Let's face it though, this match was almost all about Rey, Chavo could have been anyone. I appreciate the little things, like when Chavo goes to whip Rey into the ropes and Rey takes two steps and then his leg just buckles. It's a testament to Rey and his selling that Chavo, who came out to crickets, gets a full blown, Eddie-esque "CHAVO SUCKS" by the end of the match. 

This match was the perfect WWE style cruiserweight/lucha match. Is it better than the main event JBL/Eddie massacre? Eh, not even close, but that's just like my opinion and stuff  Still, very very happy I watched this **** seems about right. Thanks again Hayley.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Wow, Rey selling the leg in that match was absolutely tremendous. It's amazing to me, Rey, with a freaking mask on, manages to get more sympathy with his selling, than any other wrestler I've ever seen. This match just ruled, Chavo was kind of unimpressive with his offense and bumping at times (he flat out missed on several kicks and boots) but he based well enough for an in his prime Rey Mysterio, which is no simple feat. Let's face it though, this match was almost all about Rey, Chavo could have been anyone. I appreciate the little things, like when Chavo goes to whip Rey into the ropes and Rey takes two steps and then his leg just buckles. It's a testament to Rey and his selling that Chavo, who came out to crickets, gets a full blown, Eddie-esque "CHAVO SUCKS" by the end of the match.
> 
> This match was the perfect WWE style cruiserweight/lucha match. Is it better than the main event JBL/Eddie massacre? Eh, not even close, but that's just like my opinion and stuff  Still, very very happy I watched this **** seems about right. Thanks again Hayley.


Glad you enjoyed it, have you seen the match from NWO 04?

You didn't enjoy Eddie/JBL?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

TGAB is probably the worst 2004 PPV. Chavo/Rey is excellent as is the bullrope match but the main event made no sense and was terrible and I don't think I remember anything else on the card as it is.

I don't remember the Vengeance undercard that well either but the two main events rule! (Orton/Edge more so)



A William Murderface Christmas said:


> I never understood the craze about Kelly and Torrie :no:


I'd take them times a million, specially TORRIE, before Eva Marie who truly is someone I don't understand the appeal of AT ALL.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

What about the Undertaker Vs Dudley Boyz "Massacre" 8*D.

I need somebody to give me a big list of TV matches that I need to watch from this year as I missed ALOT, so can I get.... 50 TV matches or so?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> TGAB is probably the worst 2004 PPV. Chavo/Rey is excellent as is the bullrope match but the main event made no sense and was terrible and I don't think I remember anything else on the card as it is.
> 
> I don't remember the Vengeance undercard that well either but the two main events rule! (Orton/Edge more so)
> 
> ...


I'd say Armageddon 04 is worst then GAB 04.

I have yet to see the appeal of that Orton/Edge match.

I think Torrie is awful, but to each's own.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Glad you enjoyed it, have you seen the match from NWO 04?
> 
> You didn't enjoy Eddie/JBL?




I'm checking out NWO right now 

And no, you misunderstood, Eddie/JBL is a ***** classic in my eyes, and one of my 5 favorite matches in WWE history.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Starbuck you still haven't seen ziggler/adr :ti you PROMISED me 

yea want to s/o their mitb match as well, doesnt ever get talked about, very hard too out do payback but was very good itself


and Eva Marie actually looks much better with red hair than normal brunette believe it or not, crazy how much it works for her and I aint complaining


Pretty much have my top 10 for 2013, wont be posting 30 like other because I'm lazy


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> I'm checking out NWO right now
> 
> And no, you misunderstood, Eddie/JBL is a ***** classic in my eyes, and one of my 5 favorite matches in WWE history.


Oh ok haha, I wasn't gonna judge you or anything if you disliked it haha, I would have just been a tad bit baffled 

Do you prefer it over their Judgment Day match?


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Yeah, Armageddon 2004 is trash. Eddie & Taker in the same match and it doesn't live up to expectations due to WWE's cookie cutter multi-man formulas eliminating a great deal of character work from those who can actually go out and perform at that level. Also doesn't help that Booker was AWFUL at this point either .

Never saw much appeal in Torrie (OBVZ I'd hit it but we're comparing the BEST OF THE BEST here) but I was swooned by Mickie & Melina back in 2006. In my SMACKDOWN VS RAW Locker Room I had Mickie stuff everywhere, looking back it was pretty creepy :lol.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

MERRY MUTHAPHUCKKIN CHRISTMAS said:


> Yeah, Armageddon 2004 is trash. Eddie & Taker in the same match and it doesn't live up to expectations due to WWE's cookie cutter multi-man formulas eliminating a great deal of character work from those who can actually go out and perform at that level. Also doesn't help that Booker was AWFUL at this point either .
> 
> Never saw much appeal in Torrie (*OBVZ I'd hit it* but we're comparing the BEST OF THE BEST here) but I was swooned by Mickie & Melina back in 2006. In my SMACKDOWN VS RAW Locker Room I had Mickie stuff everywhere, looking back it was pretty creepy :lol.


We'd all hit it haha.

My girl back in the early 2000s was Victoria :banderas


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I had the biggest crush on Torrie, Trish, and Stacy as a kid...I still kinda do


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Oh ok haha, I wasn't gonna judge you or anything if you disliked it haha, I would have just been a tad bit baffled
> 
> Do you prefer it over their Judgment Day match?



Jesus I'm retarded, I was thinking of the Judgement Day match when I said it was a 5 star classic and one of the best matches ever. The bullrope match is terrific, it's just not THAT good, you know? Somewhere in the ****1/4-****1/2 seems fair. Judgement Day is about as good a wrestling match as I've seen. GAB had that same awesome intensity it just never quite got the heights of JD. I love seeing Eddie get his payback on JBL for the JD chairshot(probably the most wicked chair shot ever) at GAB, he just wears him out hahaha.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> I'd say Armageddon 04 is worst then GAB 04.
> 
> I have yet to see the appeal of that Orton/Edge match.
> 
> I think Torrie is awful, but to each's own.


Yeah, Armageddon might actually be worse. The Smackdown PPVs other than NWO were generally bad that year. JD is saved by the main event alone.

You haven't finished Vengeance yet, have you? Maybe now you'll like it more.

And Torrie is not my favorite but wow, words can't describe her hotness. I've never really had a favorite because too many to choose but Trish, Steph, Victoria, Stacy, Torrie and Mickie are on top of the list. Can't forget Lita back when she was wrestling as well as Maria.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

Slowly but surely making my way through *TLC 2013*. Thoughts so far:

Opener was really good imo. Dug how they put that together. Punk being smart and resourceful to nullify the numbers game early on was good. Then Reigns' dive over the announce table holy shit. Talk about crashing and burning. And he gets up and sells his EYE amazingly. Reigns is the fucking man. I found Punk's attack of the eye kind of hard to watch but in a 'damn that looks gruesome, this could actually be hurting him (Y)' kind of way. Reigns continued to sell it like a boss on the outside and I started to wonder if his eye might be legitimately fucked up. Naturally when the eye injury came into play in the finish I nodded my head and thought 'well done'. 

AJ/Natalya was a very decent divas match. Glad AJ kept the title. Dem shorts and some of the positions she gets into in them are quite enjoyable. She also had a really good looking barricade bump in this. Skipped Langston/Sandow because why would I want to watch that.

I don't get the praise for the 4 way tag. It was just okay with a few good moments to me. That long control segment from Swagger and Cesaro on Goldust didn't do a whole lot for me until they started knocking people off the apron to prevent the tag, then I liked it. Big Show slapping the shit out of Axel was fun. The back and forth between Cody and Rey at the end was the high point of the match. Solid match overall but I feel like it would've been for the better if they shaved a few minutes off this. Oh and Ryback is such a jobber now. Wow. I don't know if it's funny or sad that he was talking about working with Taker at Mania not long ago.

Obviously skipping Miz/Kingston and the other worthless match involving I don't remember who.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Always disliked Victoria, Jazz, Molly Holly, going into my teenage years in the RA Era.

I think Vince agrees with me on Victoria, just look at Royal Rumble 2006 the guy is backstage with Victoria, Candace Michelle, & Torrie when Vince just decides to completely lose interest and ignore everything Victoria says, and it's honestly too subtle to be intended :lol.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Jesus I'm retarded, I was thinking of the Judgement Day match when I said it was a 5 star classic and one of the best matches ever. The bullrope match is terrific, it's just not THAT good, you know? Somewhere in the ****1/4-****1/2 seems fair. Judgement Day is about as good a wrestling match as I've seen. GAB had that same awesome intensity it just never quite got the heights of JD. I love seeing Eddie get his payback on JBL for the JD chairshot(probably the most wicked chair shot ever) at GAB, he just wears him out hahaha.


Now your making sense 

That Judgment Day match is easily in my top 5 of all time, it might even be #1 just everything about that match is just :mark:

I wish we could have gotten more JBL/Eddie matches after their initial feud.



> Always disliked Victoria, Jazz, Molly Holly, going into my teenage years in the RA Era.


Victoria & Molly are FANTASTIC.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Lita, back in 2006 when she had that run with Edge, takes the cake for hottest female valet/wrestler I've ever seen. Good lord she was smokin back then. Check out the Hardy/Edge cage match, 1. Because it's awesome, 2. Because Lita looks so good it's almost not even fair.


William,- you've seen the Eddie/JBL cage on smackdown right? Pretty Damn good as well, Eddie was the perfect opponent for JBL.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

never have EVER found Lita attractive, yes tits but that it, torrie would probably be in the all-time fav 5 of hottest :banderas


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Lita, back in 2006 when she had that run with Edge, takes the cake for hottest female valet/wrestler I've ever seen. Good lord she was smokin back then. Check out the Hardy/Edge cage match, 1. Because it's awesome, 2. Because Lita looks so good it's almost not even fair.
> 
> 
> William,- you've seen the Eddie/JBL cage on smackdown right? Pretty Damon good as well, Eddie was the perfect opponent for JBL.


Of course haha, I got it on the SmackDown set and Eddie's set 

I am not looking forward to Eddie's next match on PPV with Angle at SummerSlam :argh:

But I am looking forward to watching Flair/Eugene vs La Resistance :mark:



> never have EVER found Lita attractive, yes tits but that it, torrie would probably be in the all-time fav 5 of hottest


No bueno haha


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Skins and I are so alike. :banderas

Edge/Orton from Vengeance never clicked with me and I loved both guys back then so it was a little underwhelming. Felt the match went on too long and dragged. 



MERRY MUTHAPHUCKKIN CHRISTMAS said:


> Never saw much appeal in Torrie (OBVZ I'd hit it but we're comparing the BEST OF THE BEST here) but I was swooned by Mickie & Melina back in 2006. *In my SMACKDOWN VS RAW Locker Room I had Mickie stuff everywhere, looking back it was pretty creepy :lol.*


I remember this. :lol I had Candice in the 2007 Smackdown vs RAW I think.

In 2006 WWE Lita and Candice Michelle were my girls. :cool2


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

LITA 2006. 

People seem to forget that she left WWE in the most hilarious fashion at Survivor Series.

TRISH PUTTING OVER LITA WHO PUT OVER MICKIE :mark:.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

My favorite woman are Tara, Shelly Martinez, Rosa, Beth, Summer :homer

Lita was quite amazing in 06.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Lita was at her hottest when she was a face. Think 2002-2004. Those cargopants made her so hot.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

> Christmas Nostalgia;27674169*]Skins and I are so alike.]* :banderas
> 
> Edge/Orton from Vengeance never clicked with me and I loved both guys back then so it was a little underwhelming. Felt the match went on too long and dragged.
> 
> ...


:mark: :mark:

and Candice Michelle OMG :banderas had the biggest crush


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I met Candice at a PWG show, it was the most random encounter.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Wow, Rey selling the leg in that match was absolutely tremendous. It's amazing to me, Rey, with a freaking mask on, manages to get more sympathy with his selling, than any other wrestler I've ever seen. This match just ruled, Chavo was kind of unimpressive with his offense and bumping at times (he flat out missed on several kicks and boots) but he based well enough for an in his prime Rey Mysterio, which is no simple feat. Let's face it though, this match was almost all about Rey, Chavo could have been anyone. I appreciate the little things, like when Chavo goes to whip Rey into the ropes and Rey takes two steps and then his leg just buckles. It's a testament to Rey and his selling that Chavo, who came out to crickets, gets a full blown, Eddie-esque "CHAVO SUCKS" by the end of the match.
> 
> This match was the perfect WWE style cruiserweight/lucha match. Is it better than the main event JBL/Eddie massacre? Eh, not even close, but that's just like my opinion and stuff  Still, very very happy I watched this **** seems about right. Thanks again Hayley.


Success.

Although, I still give Chavo credit during the match. When it appears he seems to shrug off the bicep damage he took, he brings it back into the fold even when demolishing Mysterio's knee. I'm a weird one, however. I liked Chavo up until about 2011.


Saint Dick said:


> Slowly but surely making my way through *TLC 2013*. Thoughts so far:
> 
> Opener was really good imo. Dug how they put that together. Punk being smart and resourceful to nullify the numbers game early on was good. Then Reigns' dive over the announce table holy shit. Talk about crashing and burning. And he gets up and sells his EYE amazingly. Reigns is the fucking man. I found Punk's attack of the eye kind of hard to watch but in a 'damn that looks gruesome, this could actually be hurting him (Y)' kind of way. Reigns continued to sell it like a boss on the outside and I started to wonder if his eye might be legitimately fucked up. Naturally when the eye injury came into play in the finish I nodded my head and thought 'well done'.
> 
> ...


tbf Clay vs Truth managed to have some substance behind it for story purposes. But just watching RAW helps that scenario out better. Divas, IC, & Miz vs Kofi were shit undercard matches. Toss in an ultra shit main event and that's the show. Ugh.

Opening handicap was good. Didn't feel it broke into "really good" territory, but managed to hit good & I loved how Reigns' nutty bump, leading to a real shiner, ended up being a strong foil for the Shield's demise. Something so good it created itself. Everyone in it was the usual goodness. It probably could have been even better, but I can't complain. Nor will I.

Wyatts vs Danielson is really good though. Do prefer it over Punker vs Shield. HARPER. MOTN for me, btw. Enjoyed the tag match too. 20 minutes of fun for this fan.

------------

Jazz is pretty crummy, tbhayley. Molly was a swell, all around solid women's worker for WWE. Kind of bland in areas, but that's b/c the company didn't let her expand much & the talent she wrestled wasn't ever good. She was a nice hand to have at the time.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Got around to watching Orton/Bryan from Raw this past Monday. Really good match, and I'll give credit where it's due. Bryan was his usual great self, really selling the shit out of his arm (some of that actually did look pretty brutal, and his blood curdling screams only enhanced this). However, Orton was awesome here. Subtle shit like "GET HIM OFF ME!" when he got to the ropes after Bryan reversed the Lou Thesz Press into a one-legged Crab. Also, "Oh, you want me to bring him in?" in response to the ref telling Orton to get Bryan back in the ring while Bryan was on the apron. So what did Orton do? He brought him back in with the draping DDT. Stuff like that was great, as was his random posing to the crowd while he was decimating Bryan's extremities. Made Bryan's comeback at the end even more awesome.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Stocking Filler said:


> Got around to watching Orton/Bryan from Raw this past Monday. Really good match, and I'll give credit where it's due. Bryan was his usual great self, really selling the shit out of his arm (some of that actually did look pretty brutal, and his blood curdling screams only enhanced this). However, Orton was awesome here. Subtle shit like "GET HIM OFF ME!" when he got to the ropes after Bryan reversed the Lou Thesz Press into a one-legged Crab. Also, "Oh, you want me to bring him in?" in response to the ref telling Orton to get Bryan back in the ring while Bryan was on the apron. So what did Orton do? He brought him back in with the draping DDT. Stuff like that was great, as was his random posing to the crowd while he was decimating Bryan's extremities. Made Bryan's comeback at the end even more awesome.


Exactly. Make no mistake about it, this was a Daniel Bryan match first and foremost. He was the featured guy and his bumping/selling is what made this go. Orton, however, was in rare form (for these days anyway) with his heelish antics. He was actually working how I've been hoping his character since Summerslam was going to work. He definitely was a major plus in the match. The finish was perfect too, obviously Orton is not gonna lose clean to Bryan the day after winning the title. So what do WWE do? They make Bryan go on one of his patented hot streaks, and right when he's about to deliver the knockout blow, Orton low blows Bryan and picks up the DQ loss. Not only did this make Bryan come off strong, it also kept the heat on Orton, without making him look overly weak. Proper booking 101, who'd a thought they were still capable of it. This match will probably end up in my top 10 for the year.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Re watched shield/rhodes bros. BG, holds up well, I'm a sucker for orignals, and this being the first of a long list of matches between these 4-5 I prefer it too most. I will say I think I liked their raw rematch more, will need too rewatch it


Edit: My theory is when ever Orton does his pose this year, he has a better match, did it in that, the goldust match and the cody match


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Orton vs Cody Rhodes - 9/2/13 - ****

Orton vs Goldust - 9/9/13 - ***1/2

AWESOME stuff. (Y)


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Brye, what did you think of the Orton/Bryan match? I don't think I've seen you post your opinion on it.

I need to rewatch that Goldust match, only saw it once live.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Loved it. Thought it looked smoother than just about every match they had in 2013. Quicker pace, better looking counters, great stuff. Didn't even dislike the ending as it sort of reminded me of Orton/Cena NWO '08. ***3/4


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Just watched Bryan/Orton. Why the fuck couldn't they have this on PPV, loved it tbh. **** at least IMO. Very enjoyable.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Orton must've been in the back watching Regal matches or some shit because some of that arm work was pretty gross.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Just watched Orton/Bryan finally. Really fucking good. Bryan was tremendous in it and Orton hasn't looked this good since... I dunno, 2007?  Anyway, awesome match. Bryan's leg work early on was awesome, Orton sold the shit out of it, and I loved him screaming and begging Bryan not to do any more. Biting Bryan's knee to escape was epicly amazing :lmao. Transition spot into Orton's control was awesome too, and I enjoyed Orton working the arm. Some nice viciousness added into the match that we don't see much at all these days which sucks more than anything ever. Finishing stretch was HOT. Finish... didn't really bother me because Orton couldn't afford to lose and Bryan needs to keep some momentum going after losing at TLC. ***3/4-**** for it, and I'd probably put it above any PPV main event this year (though only one is worth mentioning in the same sentence anyway; Bryan/Cena, and I'm not overly high on that anyway).


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Forgot about the biting of Bryan's knee :lmao That was pretty fucking great.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Nice, so even Cal is on-board for the non-stop praise of the match. Who's left from the usual Orton critics? 8*D

I'm in a bit of a 2013 mood atm and actually thinking of maybe doing a list considering that even though I don't remember a lot of the stuff that well now, I've been there and witnessed most of it.


----------



## Alim (Mar 3, 2007)

Orton/Bryan was pretty good but nothing over the top special like some people are making it out to be. However it was better than all their PPV encounters which are all DUDs as far as I'm concerned.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Some TV matches that are worth watching from this year (all of which made my top 150 list):

Sheamus vs. Wade Barrett
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x10dvsm_sheamus-vs-wade-barrett-main-event-05-29-13_sport

Sheamus vs. Alberto Del Rio
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x127m8x_sheamus-vs-alberto-del-rio-raw-07-22-13_sport

Christian vs. Daniel Bryan
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x11ug9c_christian-vs-daniel-bryan-smackdown-07-12-13_sport

Antonio Cesaro vs. Sheamus
http://vimeo.com/68494887

Wyatt Family vs. REGAL/Neville/Orton Jr.
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1...graves-william-regal-and-adrian-neville_sport

Daniel Bryan vs. Roman Reigns
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnyTubQCwvE

CM Punk vs. Fandango
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x12nhgc_cm-punk-vs-fandango_sport

DAT SHEAMUS! Where is he? And where are his smileys? One (or all of you) mod/mods isn't doing his/her job right.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Top 150? ROFL, you trying real hard to put over the PG Era years. :lol

I might do a top 20-30 matches myself. Need to go through the praised Zayn matches on NXT, though.

As for Sheamus smiley, he used to have one here but somebody removed it. (DAMN YOU, whoever you are!) Sheamus is not the only one who needs a smiley, you can add Bret, Benoit and several others to that list. Instead we're left with 10000 CM Punk smileys for every stupid face he makes.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> I never bothered watching it because it's Chavo,


UGHGHGHRHRHRHRH. 



Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Chavo was kind of unimpressive with his offense and bumping at times (he flat out missed on several kicks and boots) but he based well enough for an in his prime Rey Mysterio, which is no simple feat. Let's face it though, this match was almost all about Rey, Chavo could have been anyone.


NOOOOOOOOOO. NONONONONO. NO! BAD. NO!


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

150 might seem like a big number, but when you add NXT into the mix, it makes a difference. It's really enjoyable when you're a fan of all the heavy hitters this year. Cesaro, Sheamus, Bryan, Shield, Orton, Rhodes, Punk, Goldust, Ziggler, and Del Rio all give us good matches weekly.

SHEAMUS! Give us Sheamus/Cena, Sheamus/Orton for the title, and Sheamus/Punk on PPV next year please.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Ughh, sorry I haven't started NWO 04 yet, watched a couple of the RAWS leading up to it but this week has been busy as fuck, will hopefully start NWO 04 Saturday. I am traveling for XMAS though, going to Boston to visit family, but I hopefully will get a PPV or two done while I'm up there


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> 150 might seem like a big number, but when you add NXT into the mix, it makes a difference. It's really enjoyable when you're a fan of all the heavy hitters this year. Cesaro, Sheamus, Bryan, Shield, Orton, Rhodes, Punk, Goldust, Ziggler, and Del Rio all give us good matches weekly.
> 
> SHEAMUS! Give us Sheamus/Cena, Sheamus/Orton for the title, and Sheamus/Punk on PPV next year please.


SHEAMUS!

I hope we overdose on so much SHEAMUS goodness in 2014 that we'll beg for an early retirement.

SHEAMUS taking on Orton, Cena, Punk and Bryan are all :mark:. And most definitely BROCK.

Oh and I'm confused with you and Orton. One minute you say he's regressed and that you dislike him, then another minute you're putting him over.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I too am confused on how I feel about Orton. I WANT to like him, but there just isn't a natural connection between me and him. I can't deny that he's a great wrestler and it's amazing how quickly we forget about how many good matches he had this year (at least 30). He's an easy target to make jokes towards. But I guess that's about it; I think he's very talented in the ring, but something about him just makes me not want to be a fan of his despite all the good things he's produced in his career. For the record, I feel the same way about Cena, Rock, Angle, and KENTA.

SHEAMUS! Make sure to check out his matches against Big Show on Smackdown this year. Fun hard hitting brawls.

EDIT: Pretty good article about him here if you're interested:

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/10158206/why-randy-orton-now-champion-need

Also check out Orton/RVD/Christian from Smackdown this year. Very good match.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I honestly wouldn't mind seeing Sheamus take the WWE title for a good portion of 2014. Especially if he's heel. He got a bad rap from me in 2012 but mainly because his feud with Del Rio was so insufferable it made me forget the shit I liked about him.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Sheamus rules. Fuck the haters.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I too am confused on how I feel about Orton. I WANT to like him, but there just isn't a natural connection between me and him. I can't deny that he's a great wrestler and it's amazing how quickly we forget about how many good matches he had this year (at least 30). He's an easy target to make jokes towards. But I guess that's about it; I think he's very talented in the ring, but something about him just makes me not want to be a fan of his despite all the good things he's produced in his career. For the record, I feel the same way about Cena, Rock, Angle, and KENTA.
> 
> SHEAMUS! Make sure to check out his matches against Big Show on Smackdown this year. Fun hard hitting brawls.
> 
> ...


I guess that would be the description for me and Punk too. Although I find some of his fans so annoying that they make it hard to praise him. I can almost say the same about Bryan but he's just so naturally likable that it doesn't bother me as much.

How many matches have Show and Sheamus had this year? I remember they had one earlier this year but don't remember which episode. There were two other solid matches on that same show from what I recall. Might have been SD after WM.

Already seen that triple threat and it was very good. Man, I'm so pleased to see the difference between Orton early 2013 and now. He started off the year jobbing to Borrett completely clean, got eliminated by Ryback like a jobber at RR and was randomly placed in a match against The Shield to open WM. But since then, he's closed every PPV starting from MITB and officially closed his year on Raw with that wonderful match against Bryan. (to make up for a series of mediocre PPV matches)



Dominick The Donkey said:


> I honestly wouldn't mind seeing Sheamus take the WWE title for a good portion of 2014. Especially if he's heel. He got a bad rap from me in 2012 but mainly because his feud with Del Rio was so insufferable it made me forget the shit I liked about him.


lol, that Del Rio feud was so comically bad. No one cared but they still wanted to do it soooo badly and kept it going for 3 months. Pretty much made me lose interest in Sheamus that year even though he should've been my replacement for guys to enjoy when the overload of Punk TV time was boring me.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

I don't think we'll see Sheamus in any more horrible feuds from now on, considering he doesn't have any cars to 'borrow'.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Fuck it, stretching this list to a top 50, as I've got another 20 matches to watch with over 30 on a list, and feel like these deserve mentions at least.

Sheamus/Harper from NXT in July is pretty fun. Those guys just beating the shit out of each other. :mark:


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Sheamus rules. Fuck the haters.


I approve this message.

Sheamus for WWE World Champion in 2014 :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Sheamus should not be champion next year. We need Bryan to have a world tour with the title, and then have my boy Roman Reigns win the big one at SvS.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Would prefer Cesaro TBH :mark:


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Sheamus should not be champion next year. We need Bryan to have a world tour with the title, and then have my boy Roman Reigns win the big one at SvS.


I'll gladly accept that. Cena/Reigns could be epic. And obviously Bryan/Reigns which we've seen glimpses of. :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

One thing I'd love to happen now that we only have ONE main champion is for #1 contender matches to be presented as a BIG DEAL. Have them as semi-main events on PPV's and shit. Really put over how big the title is and how important it is to the wrestlers. Also, would be a PERFECT time to bring back the KOTR PPV, with the winner getting a title shot at SS again. WWE could really fucking run with this ONE CHAMPION thing... but I have a feeling they just won't .


----------



## Banjo (Sep 30, 2005)

I like Sheamus. He could be as good as Batista or even better. Batista benefited from having great matches with guys like Undertaker, Edge, and Shawn Michaels. Something like that Sheamus has not been allowed to do


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Finally rewatched Ziggler/Del Rio from Payback. Damn those kicks looked stiff and brutal. Awesome character work by Del Rio as he got desperate and started becoming more heelish and heelish while Ziggler turned face with a resilient performance. Excellent work by both, even AJ contributed something at ringside.

And this random thought crossed my mind: Would it be exaggerated to say that Orton/Bryan from Monday is the best TV match Orton has had since the match with Mysterio from 2006? Other than the Christian matches in 2011, I really can't think of anything he's had that was this good. _(actually just remembered the Edge match after Backlash 07, so since that much would be my answer)_



A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Sheamus for WWE World Champion in 2014 :mark:


:mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Edge/Orton might be better, but I haven't seen it in eons. To be honest, I never thought that Orton/Mysterio was this classic special match. Definitely a terrific one, but I liked their NWO match a lot more. Prefer Edge/Orton and Bryan/Orton over it too. It's not a slight at Orton either; I just didn't care for Mysterio in that match as much as everyone else.

Oh man, the 11-on-3 Handicap match this year is like a 20 minute markout moment. If we get things like this on the daily when Bryan becomes champion...:mark:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> Finally rewatched Ziggler/Del Rio from Payback. Damn those kicks looked stiff and brutal. Awesome character work by Del Rio as he got desperate and started becoming more heelish and heelish while Ziggler turned face with a resilient performance. Excellent work by both, even AJ contributed something at ringside.


This. Also I thought Ziggler's selling was brilliant in that match, made Del Rio's kicks look brutal like you mentioned and made it look like Ziggler was genuinely hurt in parts. Yep and even AJ contributed something with her sheer concern for Ziggler getting destroyed by Del Rio shown through her facial expressions and mannerisms. What do you rate it, starz wise?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Around ★★★★ sounds about right. Confident that it will be in my top 10. Another Ziggler match on my radar is the Main Event match against Cesaro. Heard good things about it but haven't seen it yet.

I'm gonna settle for a top 25. Already have everything that's got high praised along with the stuff I've rated highly lined up. I _will_ take a shortcut by just watching the best stuff because there's no way in hell I have the patience to sit through nearly hundreds of matches. Now if I was doing a list for the best Ruthless Aggression era (got a possible top 100 planned) matches THEN I'd go through it faster than you can blow up a car in GTA San Andreas using a minigun.

On another note, Sheamus is a fucking workhorse. Went to his profightdb profile and he's had over 50 matches in 2013 alone (which would be just short of 8 months for him). He's a true WARRIOR and I can't wait for his return.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Finished Survivor Series 1996

The elimination matches weren't that good, I like the one with The Rock, though. The single matches were all great, I liked the Austin/Hart match the most (it wasn't their iconic match, though, didn't know that). Didn't expect Michaels to lose.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Ziggler/Del Rio nearly got me out of my chair. Del Rio with those kicks, and Ziggler getting in a nice comeback at the end. Ziggler did get a little too excited and botched the Fameasser attempt (first or second time; pretty sure he tried it twice). Their match at MITB deserves a mention. Sure it's not the same story, but still a good match.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Don't think I've seen Ziggler/Cesaro either. 

Don't know how some people can watch so much wrestling here.  Top 150 matches? PPV reviews every day? I couldn't do that. The only match project I ever did was my Edge matches and I never finished it. :lol



Choke2Death said:


> Now if I was doing a list for the best Ruthless Aggression era (got a possible top 100 planned) matches THEN I'd go through it faster than you can blow up a car in GTA San Andreas using a minigun.


:mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

HollyJollyHelmsley said:


> Ziggler/Del Rio nearly got me out of my chair. Del Rio with those kicks, and Ziggler getting in a nice comeback at the end. Ziggler did get a little too excited and botched the Fameasser attempt (first or second time; pretty sure he tried it twice). Their match at MITB deserves a mention. Sure it's not the same story, but still a good match.


I don't know if the one I watched was edited but Ziggler only did the fame-asser once (slightly botched). But I think it added to the match, with the commentary improvising. It fit the story perfectly with Ziggler being the showoff but in a dazed state which caused him to get overexcited and fail to fully connect with the move.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Gonna need to rewatch Del rio/Ziggler PB, havent seen it since it aired, but its comfortably at my #2 MOTY behind Punk/Brock of course, not sure what rating I would give it, at least ****1/2, MAYBE ****3/4


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

PB match is awesome, around ****1/4 for it probably. Not found of their MITB match. It's like they were trying to do PB again... except Ziggler had recovered now and it was kinda stupid.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Can't remember a thing about the MITB match for some reason 

Oh yeah I had a terrible stream that night and all I truly saw was the opener, which was :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Their cash-in usurped Meng/Big Show as my favorite sub-3 minute match of all-time. They also had a very good match the night after MITB. Man that entire episode was awesome. I even kinda liked Orton/Fandango.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> I don't know if the one I watched was edited but Ziggler only did the fame-asser once (slightly botched). But I think it added to the match, with the commentary improvising. It fit the story perfectly with Ziggler being the showoff but in a dazed state which caused him to get overexcited and fail to fully connect with the move.


Fair enough.



smitty915 said:


> Gonna need to rewatch Del rio/Ziggler PB, havent seen it since it aired, but its comfortably at my #2 MOTY behind Punk/Brock of course, not sure what rating I would give it, at least ****1/2, MAYBE ****3/4


I was thinking earlier that the Brock match may be Punk's best full blown babyface performance that he's had in the company. He flys around a good bit more early on just trying to get Brock off his feet, and succeeds, and keeps going to it. Then Brock starts slinging him around (dat belly to belly overhead on the outside :mark


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

If it counts as a babyface performance (it should), Punk/Cena is his best babyface performance. He's had quite a lot of good ones over the years, but my favorite ones are from his pre-WWE days.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Their cash-in usurped Meng/Big Show as my favorite sub-3 minute match of all-time. They also had a very good match the night after MITB. Man that entire episode was awesome. I even kinda liked Orton/Fandango.


Orton that whole summer was good. The two matches with Bryan and The Shield stuff in June. Then he had good matches with Christian, Del Rio and RVD as well as that Fandango match in July. Then he turned heel and despite slipping for a short while (specially during the Big Show stuff), he ended the year on a perfect note with the Bryan match.

Just finished that Cesaro/Sheamus match you posted a few pages back. Man, that was just awesome! Two big men beating the fuck out of each other. The more Sheamus matches I watch, the more I miss him.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Christmas Nostalgia said:


> Don't think I've seen Ziggler/Cesaro either.
> 
> Don't know how some people can watch so much wrestling here.  Top 150 matches? PPV reviews every day? I couldn't do that. The only match project I ever did was my Edge matches and I never finished it. :lol
> 
> :mark:


oh NOST you have too watch ziggler/cesaro is :lenny


Def agree on the list thing, I give guys like Cal and smitty all the credit, some here have so much tolerance for wrestling, I just couldn't, 150 list funnyfaces ? geez, I have my top 10 list ready too go and thats about it


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Don't give me that much credit lol. Sometimes I can go through a ton of matches/shows/ppvs at once, but I burn out pretty quickly . Which is why I've done like 1 PPV Ramble in about 2 weeks since I finished 2002 . As for lists, always takes me AGES to do em. Like the Top 100 WWF/E and WCW ones. WE spent over a year on EACH, and it was nearly 2 years for the 00 list (that I gave up on lol). Now we are about to start an 80's list and no doubt this will take us about 2 years as well lol.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Def agree on the list thing, I give guys like Cal and smitty all the credit, some here have so much tolerance for wrestling, I just couldn't, 150 list funnyfaces ? geez, I have my top 10 list ready too go and thats about it


top 150 List? 










As for the whole list thing, I'll pump out a top 50 list for 2013 when 2004 PPV reviews are done, then doing other shit


----------



## Banjo (Sep 30, 2005)

Choke2Death said:


> Finally rewatched Ziggler/Del Rio from Payback. Damn those kicks looked stiff and brutal. Awesome character work by Del Rio as he got desperate and started becoming more heelish and heelish while Ziggler turned face with a resilient performance. Excellent work by both, even AJ contributed something at ringside.


It's a good choice for the Best PPV Matches of 2013 DVD. One of the last meaningful matches for the World Heavyweight Championship


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Cesaro/Sheamus was okay. Good stuff actually, but that finish fucking caught me off guard. Sheamus/Barrett from Main Event was fucking NICE. One of Barrett's better matches.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Choke2Death said:


> And this random thought crossed my mind: Would it be exaggerated to say that Orton/Bryan from Monday is the best TV match Orton has had since the match with Mysterio from 2006? Other than the Christian matches in 2011, I really can't think of anything he's had that was this good. _(actually just remembered the Edge match after Backlash 07, so since that much would be my answer)_


Christian/Orton SD May 2011 would be the last better Orton TV match for me. 

Outside of the Christian series, it's Orton's best match period since HBK SVS 2007.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Dont be modest Cal 

Geez for got about Cesaro/Sheamus, loved their main event, got fix up my top 10 now, but they is a couple that matches some wont expect on it


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Anyone wanna give me a random match to watch? no 04 please


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Don't give me that much credit lol. Sometimes I can go through a ton of matches/shows/ppvs at once, but I burn out pretty quickly . Which is why I've done like 1 PPV Ramble in about 2 weeks since I finished 2002 . As for lists, always takes me AGES to do em. Like the Top 100 WWF/E and WCW ones. WE spent over a year on EACH, and it was nearly 2 years for the 00 list (that I gave up on lol). Now we are about to start an 80's list and no doubt this will take us about 2 years as well lol.


Where can we see all those lists?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

If you guys are wondering how 150 is possible for me, I've been working on this list all throughout the year. Every time a good match happens, I mark it down for my own purposes. It's not as much work if you continuously do everything.

If you guys really want to see something crazy, go look at this guy:

http://s15.zetaboards.com/BigEvil/forum/3024960/


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

@ smitty ziggler/cesaro superstars, another great match that needs more lovin besides me 

Everyone watch it actually its on the bubble for my list


When are you gonna post it ?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Can anyone get me a link for that Ziggler/Cesaro match?

EDIT: NVM found it


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

SaviorBeeRad™ said:


> Where can we see all those lists?





Spoiler: WE's Top 100 WWF/E Matches



=#305: Eddie Guerrero v Jimmy Jacobs - Smackdown!, 5/14/05 (1 point)

=#305: MNM v The Hardy Boys - Royal Rumble, 1/28/07 (1 point)

=#305: HHH v Chris Benoit - No Mercy, 10/22/00 (1 point)

=#305: Chris Benoit v Booker T - Armageddon, 12/18/05 (1 point)

=#305: The Rock v Shane McMahon (Cage Match) - RAW, 5/1/00 (1 point)

=#305: Trish Stratus v Lita - RAW, 12/6/04 (1 point)

=#305: Trish Stratus v Mickie James - Wrestlemania 22, 4/2/06 (1 point)

=#298: Chris Jericho & Christian v RVD & Jeff Hardy v Spike & Bubba Ray Dudley v Kane (TLC IV) - RAW, 10/7/02 (2 points)

=#298: Evan Bourne v Chris Jericho - Fatal Four Way, 6/20/10 (2 points)

=#298: Hulk Hogan v Randy Savage (Lumberjack Match) - MSG, 2/17/86 (2 points)

=#298: Shawn Michaels v Edge (Street Fight) - RAW, 1/22/07 (2 points)

=#294: HHH v Steve Austin (No Holds Barred) - No Mercy, 10/17/99 (3 points)

=#294:Rockers v Demolition - MSG, 10/24/88 (3 points)

=#294: Steve Austin v Savio Vega (Caribbean Strap Match) - In Your House 8: Beware of Dog, 5/28/96 (3 points)

=#291: Rey Mysterio v Christian - Smackdown!, 8/4/05 (4 points)

=#291: Jake Roberts v Randy Savage - Saturday Night's Main Event, 11/29/86 (4 points)

=#289: Undertaker v Yokozuna (Casket Match) - Royal Rumble, 1/22/94 (5 points)

=#289: Undertaker v Finlay - Smackdown!, 3/9/07 (5 points)

=#289: Rey Mysterio & Billy Kidman v Charlie Hass & Shelton Benjamin - Vengeance, 7/27/03 (5 points)

=#286: Kurt Angle v Chris Benoit - Smackdown!, 2/6/03 (6 points)

=#286: Ric Flair v Mick Foley (I Quit Match) - Summerslam, 8/20/06 (6 points)

=#286: The Hardy Boys & Lita v T&A & Trish Stratus - Fully Loaded, 7/23/00 (6 points)

=#286: Batista & Rey Mysterio v MNM - Smackdown!, 12/30/05 (6 points)

=#286: Undertaker v Kennedy - No Mercy, 10/8/06 (6 points)

=#281: Shawn Michaels v Batista (Stretcher Match) - One Night Stand, 6/1/08 (7 points)

=#281: Brock Lesnar v Rey Mysterio - Smackdown!, 12/11/03 (7 points)

=#281: Randy Orton v Chris Jericho - RAW, 7/5/04 (7 points)

=#278: Eddie Guerrero v Batista - No Mercy, 10/9/05 (8 points)

=#278: Chris Benoit v Randy Orton - Summerslam 8/15/04 (8 points)

=#278: Undertaker v Big Show (Last Man Standing Match) - Cyber Sunday, 10/26/08 (8 points)

=#275: Hulk Hogan v Andre The Giant - Wrestlemania 3, 3/29/87 (9 points)

=#275: Los Guerreros v Chris Benoit & Kurt Angle v Edge & Rey Mysterio - Survivor Series, 11/17/02 (9 points)

=#275: William Regal v Brian Kendrick - Smackdown!, 11/24/06 (9 points)

=#272: London & Kendrick v William Regal & Dave Taylor - Smackdown!, 12/8/06 (10 points)

=#272: Steve Austin, Cactus Jack & Chainsaw Charlie v HHH, New Age Outlaws & Savio Vega (Unsanctioned Street Fight) - In Your House: No Way Out of Texas, 2/15/98 (10 points)

=#272: Shawn Michaels v Undertaker (Casket Match) - Royal Rumble, 1/18/98 (10 points)

=#269: John Cena v HHH v Edge - Backlash, 4/30/06 (11 points)

=#269: Chris Benoit v Kurt Angle (Ultimate Submission Match) - Backlash, 4/29/01 (11 points)

=#269: Rockers v Brainbusters - Boston Garden, 1/13/89 (11 points)

=#269: Stan Hansen v Bruno Sammartino (Cage Match) - MSG, 8/7/76 (11 points)

=#269: Undertaker & Kane v MVP & Kennedy - Smackdown!, 11/3/06 (11 points)

=#264: CM Punk v Jeff Hardy (TLC Match) - Summerslam, 8/23/09 (12 points)

=#264: Rey Mysterio v Jamie Noble - Velocity, 5/1/04 (12 points)

=#262: Bob Backlund v Larry Zbyszko - Philly Spectrum, 10/11/80 (13 points)

=#262: Undertaker v Randy & Bob Orton (Casket Match) - 10/8/06 (13 points)

=#262: Finlay v Batista v King Booker - Smackdown!, 12/1/06 (13 points)

=#259: Mankind v HHH - In Your House 16: Canadian Stampede, 7/6/97 (14 points)

=#259: Eddie Guerrero v Rey Mysterio - Great American Bash, 7/24/05 (14 points)

=#257: Edge v Chris Benoit - Smackdown!, 6/8/07 (15 points)

=#257: John Cena v Carlito v Chris Masters v Kane v Kurt Angle v Shawn Michaels (Elimination Chamber) - New Year's Revolution, 1/8/06 (15 points)

-#257: Smackdown! Royal Rumble - Smackdown!, 1/29/04 (15 points)

=#257: Rockers v Rougeau Brothers - MSG, 7/25/88 (15 points)

=#253: HHH v John Cena - Night of Champions, 6/29/08 (16 points)

=#253: T&A v The Dudleys - Backlash, 4/30/00 (16 points)

=#251: Edge v Randy Orton RAW, 4/30/07 (17 points)

=#251: Tito Santana v Greg Valentine (Cage Match) - MSG, 7/6/85 (17 points)

=#251: Marty Jannetty v Doink The Clown - RAW, 6/21/93 (17 points)

=#251: Kurt Angle v Edge (Hair vs. Hair) - Judgment Day, 5/19/02 (17 points)

=#247: Eddie Guerrero v Kurt Angle (2/3 Falls) - Smackdown!, 9/2/04 (18 points)

=#247: Eddie Guerrero & Tajiri v Charlie Hass & Shelton Benjamin - Smackdown!, 5/22/03 (18 points)

=#247: Ric Flair v Mr. Perfect (Loser Leaves Town) - RAW, 1/18/93 (18 points)

=#244: Steve Austin & HHH v Undertaker & Kane - Backlash, 4/29/01 (19 points)

=#244: Eddie Guerrero v Chris Benoit - Vengeance, 7/27/03 (19 points)

=#242: Edge & Christian v The Hardy Boys v The Dudley Boys (Triangle Ladder Match) - Wrestlemania 16, 4/2/00 (20 points)

=#242: Chris Benoit v Randy Orton (No Holds Barred Match) - Smackdown!, 1/27/06 (20 points)

=#242: Undertaker v Kane - Wrestlemania 14, 3/29/98 (20 points)

#239: Undertaker v Randy Orton - Summerslam, 8/21/05 (21 points)

=#238: Steve Austin v Kurt Angle - RAW, 1/8/01 (22 points)

=#238: Kurt Angle v Rey Mysterio - Summerslam, 8/25/02 (22 points)

=#238: Shawn Michaels v Vader - Summerslam, 8/18/96 (22 points)

=#235: The Rock v Mankind - In Your House: Rock Bottom, 12/13/98 (23 points)

=#235: Big Show v Ric Flair - ECW, 7/10/06 (23 points)

=#233: Shawn Michaels v Jeff Hardy v HHH v Umaga v JBL v Chris Jericho (Elimination Chamber) - No Way Out, 2/17/08 (24 points)

=#233: Edge v Kurt Angle - Smackdown!, 10/3/02 (24 points)

=#231: Shawn Michaels v Randy Orton - Survivor Series, 11/18/07 (25 points)

=#231: Mankind v Undertaker - Survivor Series, 11/17/96 (25 points)

=#229: The Rock v Chris Jericho - Royal Rumble, 1/20/02 (26 points)

=#229: The Rock v Chris Benoit - Fully Loaded, 7/23/00 (26 points)

=#229: The Rock v Eddie Guerrero - RAW, 7/22/02 (26 points)

=#229: Eddie Guerrero v RVD (Ladder Match) - RAW, 5/27/02 (26 points)

=#225: Chris Jericho v John Morrison v MVP v CM Punk v Carlito v Shelton Benjamin v Mr. Kennedy (Money in the Bank Ladder Match) - Wrestlemania 24, 3/30/08 (27 points)

=#225: The Rock v Mankind (Empty Arena Match) - Heat, 1/31/99 (27 points)

=#225: Rey Mysterio v Mark Henry - Smackdown!, 1/20/06 (27 points)

=#225: William Regal v Christian - ECW, 11/10/09 (27 points)

#221: Rey Mysterio v Chris Benoit - Smackdown!, 10/3/02 (29 points)

=#220: Bob Backlund v Buddy Rose - MSG, 8/30/82 (30 points)

=#220: Hart Foundation v British Bulldogs - MSG, 12/23/85 (30 points)

=#220: John Cena v Umaga - New Year's Revolution, 1/7/07 (30 points)

=#220: Ricky Steamboat v Bob Orton Jr. - Landover, MD, 7/20/85 (30 points)

=#216: Christian v Shelton Benjamin - Survivor Series, 11/14/04 (31 points)

=#216: Mr. Perfect v Doink The Clown - RAW, 5/17/93 (31 points)

=#216: Finlay v Rey Mysterio - Smackdown!, 3/24/06 (31 points)

=#216: Ricky Steamboat & Tito Santana v Greg Valentine & Brutus Beefcake - Maple Leaf Gardens, 4/21/85 (31 points)

=#212: Eddie Guerrero v RVD - Backlash, 4/21/02 (32 points)

=#212: Tito Santana v Greg Valentine - MSG, 11/20/84 (32 points)

=#212: Undertaker v Kane (Inferno Match) - Unforgiven, 4/26/98 (32 points)

=#209: Eddie Guerrero v Rey Mysterio - Smackdown!, 3/18/04 (33 points)

=#208: Undertaker v Vince McMahon (Buried Alive Match) - Survivor Series, 11/16/03 (34 points)

=#208: John Cena v Edge (TLC Match) - Unforgiven, 9/17/06 (34 points)

=#206: Steve Austin v The Rock (No Holds Barred) - Backlash, 4/25/99 (35 points)

=#206: Mick Foley v Terry Funk (Falls Count Anywhere) - RAW, 5/4/98 (35 points)

=#204: John Cena v Batista - Wrestlemania 26, 3/28/10 (38 points)

=#204: Shawn Michaels v Mankind - RAW, 8/11/97 (38 points)

=#204: Chris Benoit v Kurt Angle - Wrestlemania 17, 4/1/01 (38 points)

201: Bret Hart v Shawn Michaels - Survivor Series, 11/25/92 (39 points)

=#200: The Rock & Mankind v Undertaker & Big Show (Buried Alive Match) - Smackdown!, 9/7/99 (41 points)

=#200: Dick Murdoch & Adrian Adonis v Jack & Jerry Brisco - MSG, 12/28/84 (41 points)

=#200: Mr. Perfect v Tito Santana - Saturday Night's Main Event, 7/28/90 (41 points)

=#200: CM Punk v Jeff Hardy (Cage Match) - Smackdown!, 8/28/09 (41 points)

=#200: Chris Benoit v Kurt Angle - Unforgiven, 9/22/02 (41 points)

#195: Ricky Steamboat v Bret Hart - Boston Garden, 3/8/86 (42 points)

=#194: Randy Orton v Edge - Vengeance, 7/11/04 (43 points)

=#194: Bret Hart v Owen Hart Action Zone, 9/29/94 (43 points)

#192: Rey Mysterio v Chavo Guerrero - Great American Bash, 6/27/04 (44 points)

=#191: Undertaker v Randy Orton - Wrestlemania, 4/3/05 (45 points)

=#191: Rey Mysterio v JBL - Judgment Day, 5/21/06 (45 points)

#189: Team WWF v Team Alliance - InVasion, 7/26/01 (46 points)

=#188: Edge v Kurt Angle v Eddie Guerrero v Chris Benoit - Smackdown!, 12/5/02 (47 points)

=#188: Undertaker v Jeff Hardy (Ladder Match) - RAW, 7/1/02 (47 points)

=#186: Bob Backlund v Ken Patera - MSG, 1/21/80 (48 point)

=#186: Masato Tanaka v Mike Awesome - One Night Stand, 6/12/05 (48 points)

=#186: Rey Mysterio v Chris Jericho (No Holds Barred) - Extreme Rules, 6/9/09 (48 points)

=#183: John Cena v Randy Orton - Summerslam, 8/26/07 (50 points)

=#183: Kurt Angle v Brock Lesnar - Wrestlemania, 3/30/03 (50 points)

=#181: Shawn Michaels v Razor Ramon - RAW, 8/1/94 (51 points)

=#181: Steve Austin v Undertaker (First Blood Match) - Fully Loaded, 7/25/99 (51 points)

=#179: Randy Orton v HHH (Last Man Standing Match) - No Mercy, 10/7/07 (52 points)

=#179: Shawn Michaels v Hulk Hogan - Summerslam, 8/21/05 (52 points)

=#177: Undertaker v Edge - Judgment Day, 5/18/08 (53 points)

=#177: Big Show v Floyd Mayweather - Wrestlemania 24, 3/30/08 (53 points)

#175: Ricky Steamboat v Jake Roberts - MSG, 6/27/86 (54 points)

=#174: Randy Orton v Chris Benoit - RAW, 8/16/04 (55 points)

=#174: HHH v Ric Flair (Last Man Standing Match) - Survivor Series, 11/27/05 (55 points)

#172: Rockers v Powers of Pain - MSG, 1/15/90 (57 points)

=#171: Mr. Perfect v Doink The Clown - RAW, 5/24/93 (60 points)

=#171: HHH v John Cena - Wrestlemania 22, 4/2/06 (60 points)

#169: Steve Austin v Kurt Angle - Unforgiven, 9/23/01 (64 points)

#168: Shawn Michaels v John Cena v Edge v Randy Orton - Backlash, 4/29/07 (65 points)

#167: Barry Windham v Dick Murdoch - Philly Spectrum, 2/16/85 (66 points)

#166: Mankind v HHH (Cage Match) - Summerslam, 8/3/97 (68 points)

#165: HHH v Jeff Hardy - No Mercy, 10/5/08 (69 points)

=#164: The Rock v Mankind (I Quit Match) - Royal Rumble, 1/24/99 (70 points)

=#164: Royal Rumble Match - Royal Rumble, 1/25/09 (70 points)

=#164: Dick Murdoch v Afa - MSG, 10/22/84 (70 points)

=#164: John Cena v Kurt Angle - No Mercy, 10/19/03 (70 points)

=#160: Rey Mysterio v John Morrison - Smackdown!, 9/4/09 (71 points)

=#160: Kane v Big Show v Kofi Kingston v Drew McIntyre v Matt Hardy v Christian v Cody Rhodes v Dolph Ziggler (Money in the Bank Ladder Match) - Money In The Bank, 7/18/10 (71 points)

#158: Undertaker v Kane - Smackdown!, 4/4/08 (72 points)

#157: Owen Hart v Mankind - RAW, 1/6/97 (74 points)

#156: Eddie Guerrero v Kurt Angle - Wrestlemania, 3/14/04 (76 points)

=#155: Eddie Guerrero v Kurt Angle - Smackdown!, 4/14/05 (78 points)

=#155: Shawn Michaels v Davey Boy Smith - King of the Ring, 6/23/96 (78 points)

=#155: Tito Santana v Greg Valentine - MSG, 1/21/85 (78 points)

=#152: Shawn Michaels v Chris Benoit v HHH - Backlash, 4/18/04 (80 points)

=#152: Chris Benoit v Kane - Bad Blood, 6/13/04 (80 points)

=#150: Randy Orton, Batista & Ric Flair v Chris Benoit, Edge & Chris Jericho (Elimination Match) - RAW, 6/16/04 (81 points)

=#150: Brock Lesnar v Chris Benoit - Smackdown!, 12/4/03 (81 points)

=#148: John Cena v Edge (Last Man Standing Match) - Backlash, 4/26/09 (82 points)

=#148: Great Sasuke v TAKA Michinoku - In Your House 16: Canadian Stampede, 7/6/97 (82 points)

=#148: Rikishi & Too Cool v Edge & Christian & Kurt Angle - Judgment Day, 5/21/00 (82 points)

#145: Ric Flair v Undertaker - Wrestlemania 18, 3/17/02 (88 points)

#144: Cactus Jack v HHH (Falls Count Anywhere) - RAW, 9/22/97 (90 points)

=#143: HHH v Chris Benoit (Ironman Match) - RAW, 7/26/04 (92 points)

=#143: Mick Foley & Edge v Tommy Dreamer & Terry Funk - One Night Stand, 6/11/06 (92 points)

=#141: Eddie Guerrero v Rey Mysterio (Cage Match) - Smackdown!, 9/9/05 (94 points)

=#141: Finlay v Rey Mysterio - Smackdown!, 11/9/07 (94 points)

=#139: Kurt Angle v Shane McMahon (Street Fight) - King of the Ring, 6/24/01 (95 points)

=#139: Team WWF v Team Alliance - Survivor Series, 11/18/01 (95 points)

=#137: Undertaker v Batista - Cyber Sunday, 10/28/07 (96 points)

=#137: Chris Benoit v Finlay - Smackdown!, 11/26/06 (96 points)

=#137: John Cena v Edge v Rey Mysterio v Kane v Mike Knox v Chris Jericho (Elimination Chamber) - No Way Out, 2/15/09 (96 points)

#134: Bret Hart v Diesel - King of the Ring, 6/19/94 (99 points)

#133: Royal Rumble Match - Royal Rumble, 1/25/04 (101 points)

=#132: Steve Austin v Vince McMahon (Cage Match) - St. Valentine's Day Massacre, 2/14/99 (102 points)

=#132: Bret Hart v Undertaker - Summerslam, 8/3/97) (102 points)

#130: The Rock v Mankind - RAW, 1/4/99 (104 points)

=#129: Team Austin v Team Bischoff - Survivor Series, 11/16/03 (105 points)

=#129: Randy Orton v John Cena (I Quit Match) - Breaking Point, 9/13/09 (105 points)

=#127: Vince McMahon v Shane McMahon (Street Fight) - Wrestlemania 17, 4/1/01 (106 points)

=#127: Hardy Boys v London & Kendrick v Dave Taylor & William Regal v MNM (Ladder Match) - Armageddon, 12/17/06 (106 points)

#125: John Cena v Randy Orton - No Way Out, 2/17/08 (108 points)

#124: Rey Mysterio v Randy Orton - Smackdown!, 4/7/06 (109 points)

=#123: Shawn Michaels v Shelton Benjamin - RAW, 5/2/05 (110 points)

=#123: Undertaker v Batista (Last Man Standing Match) - Backlash, 4/29/07 (110 points)

#121: Shawn Michaels & John Cena v The Undertaker & Batista - No Way Out, 2/18/07 (111 points)

=#120: Bob Backlund v Don Muraco (Texas Death Match) - MSG, 9/21/81 (116 points)

=#120: HHH v Cactus Jack (Hell in a Cell) - No Way Out, 2/27/00 (116 points)

#118: Sgt. Slaughter v Pat Patterson (Alley Fight) - MSG, 5/4/81 (117 points)

#117: Rockers v Brainbusters - Boston Garden, 3/18/89) (118 points)

#116: Chris Benoit & Kurt Angle v Edge & Rey Mysterio (2/3 Falls Match) - Smackdown!, 11/7/02 (119 points)

=#115: Hardy Boys v Dudley Boys v Edge & Christian (TLC II) - Wrestlemania 17, 4/1/01 (121 points)

=#115: Edge & Christian v The Hardy Boys (Ladder Match) - No Mercy, 10/17/99 (121 points)

#113: Ric Flair v Edge (TLC Match) - RAW, 1/16/06 (126 points; one top ten vote)

=#112: Shawn Michaels v HHH v Chris Jericho v RVD v Kane v Booker T (Elimination Chamber) - Survivor Series, 11/17/02 (127 points)

=#112: Chris Benoit v Randy Orton - Smackdown!, 1/13/06 (127 points; one top twenty vote)

#110: Shawn Michaels v Steve Austin - King of the Ring, 6/9/97 (128 points)

#109: Bret Hart v Diesel - Survivor Series, 11/19/95 (131 points)

#108: Eddie Guerrero v Big Show - Smackdown!, 4/15/04 (132 points)

#107: Bob Backlund v Don Muraco - Philly Spectrum, 10/17/81 (134 points; one top 20 vote)

#106: Eddie Guerrero v JBL (Cage Match) - Smackdown!, 7/15/04 (138 points)

#105: Undertaker v Mankind (Buried Alive Match) - In Your house 11: Buried Alive, 10/20/96 (140 points)

#104: Shawn Michaels & Diesel v Razor Ramon & 123 Kid - Action Zone, 10/30/94 (141 points)

#103: Randy Savage v Ricky Steamboat Maple Leaf Gardens, 2/15/87 (142 points)

#102: Eddie Guerrero v Edge (No DQ Match) - Smackdown!, 9/26/02 (147 points)

#101: Randy Savage v Tito Santana (No Holds Barred) - MSG, 4/21/86 (148 points)

#100: Finlay v Chris Benoit - Smackdown!, 5/5/06 (154 points)

#99: Shawn Michaels v Chris Benoit - RAW, 5/3/04 (159 points)

#98: Eddie Guerrero v Rey Mysterio - Judgment Day, 5/22/05 (167 points)

#97: Edge v Matt Hardy (Cage Match) - Unforgiven, 9/18/05 (170 points)

#96: Rockers v Orient Express - Royal Rumble, 1/19/91 (174 points)

#95: Royal Rumble Match - Royal Rumble, 1/19/92 (178 points)

#94: Shawn Michaels, Chris Benoit, Mick Foley & Shelton Benjamin v HHH, Ric Flair, Randy Orton & Batista - RAW, 4/12/04 (179 points)

#93: Shawn Michaels & Steve Austin v Owen Hart & Davey Boy Smith - RAW, 5/26/97 (180 points; one top 20 vote)

#92: Edge v Mick Foley (Hardcore Match) - Wrestlemania 22, 4/2/06 (187 points)

#91: Edge v Undertaker (Hell in a Cell) - Summerslam, 8/17/08 (190 points; one top 20 vote)

#90: Shelton Benjamin v Chris Benoit v Chris Jericho v Kane v Christian v Edge (Money in the Bank Ladder Match) - Wrestlemania 21, 4/3/05 (194 points)

#89: Edge & Christian v The Hardy Boys v The Dudley Boys (TLC Match) - Summerslam, 8/27/00 (196 points; one top 10 vote)

#88: Shawn Michaels v Kurt Angle - Vengeance, 6/26/05 (197 points)

#87: Ric Flair v Randy Savage - Wrestlemania 8, 4/5/92 (200 points)

#86: Bret Hart v 123 Kid - RAW, 7/11/94 (201 points; one top 20 vote)

#85: The Rock v Brock Lesnar - Summerslam, 8/25/02 (204 points; one top 20 vote

#84: Undertaker v Mankind - In Your House 15: Revenge of the Taker, 4/20/97 (205 points; one top 20 vote)

#83: Shawn Michaels v Chris Jericho (Ladder Match) - No Mercy, 10/5/08 (208 points)

#82: HHH v Batista v Chris Benoit v Chris Jericho v Edge v Randy Orton (Elimination Chamber) - New Year's Revolution, 1/9/05 (212 points)

#81: Bret Hart v Roddy Piper - Wrestlemania 8, 4/5/92 (211 points)

#80: Rockers v Brainbusters - MSG, 1/23/89 (214 points; one top 20 vote)

#79: Christian v Jack Swagger - ECW, 2/24/09 (218 points; one top 20 vote)

#78: Chris Benoit v William Regal - Velocity, 7/16/05 (221 points)

#77: Bob Backlund v Ken Patera (Texas Death Match) - MSG, 5/19/80 (232 points; one top 10 vote)

#76: Undertaker v Batista - Wrestlemania, 4/1/07 (235 points)

#75: Shawn Michaels v Bret Hart (Ironman Match) - Wrestlemania 12, 3/31/96 (240 points; one top 5 vote)

#74: John Cena v Shawn Michaels - RAW, 4/23/07 (243 points)

#73: John Cena v John Bradshaw Layfield (I Quit Match) - Judgment Day, 5/22/05 (247 points)

#72: The Rock v HHH - Backlash, 4/30/00 (248 points)

#71: Shawn Michaels v HHH (Street Fight) - Summerslam, 8/25/02 (251 points; one top 5 vote)

=#70: Bret Hart v Diesel - Royal Rumble, 1/22/95 (252 points; one top 20 vote)

=#70: Shawn Michaels v HHH - RAW, 12/29/03 (252 points)

#68: Royal Rumble Match - Royal Rumble, 1/21/01 (256 points; one top 10 vote)

#67: Edge v Undertaker - Wrestlemania 24, 3/30/08 (262 points)

#66: Bob Backlund v Adrian Adonis - MSG, 1/18/82 (263 points; one top 10 vote)

=#65: The Rock v Hollywood Hogan - Wrestleania 18, 3/18/02 (267 points; one top 10 vote)

=#65: Rey Mysterio v Chris Jericho - The Bash, 6/28/09 (267 points)

#63: Bret Hart v Davey Boy Smith - Summerslam, 8/29/92 (273 points; one top 20 vote)

#62: Kurt Angle v Brock Lesnar - Summerslam, 8/24/03 (274 points)

=#61: Shawn Michaels v Diesel (No Holds Barred Match) - In Your House 7: Good Friends, Better Enemies, 4/28/96 (278 points; one top 20 vote)

=#61: Steve Austin v HHH (3 Stages of Hell) - No Way Out, 2/25/01 (278 points; one top 5 vote; one top 10 vote)

#59: Bret Hart v Undertaker - One Night Only, 9/20/97 (283 points)

#58: The Rock v Chris Jericho - No Mercy, 10/21/01 (288 points)

#57: Undertaker v Kurt Angle - Smackdown!, 9/4/03 (292 points; one #3 vote)

=#56: Undertaker v Mankind (Hell in a Cell) - King of the Ring, 6/28/98 (295 points)

=#56: Shawn Michaels v Jeff Jarrett - In Your House 2: Lumberjacks, 7/23/95 (295 points)

#54: Bret Hart v Owen Hart (Cage Match) - Summerslam, 8/29/94 (298 points; one top 20 vote)

#53: The Rock v Steve Austin - Wrestlemania 19, 3/30/03 (309 points)

#52: The Rock v Undertaker v Kurt Angle - Vengeance, 7/21/02 (312 points)

#51: Cactus Jack, The Rock, Rikishi, Brian Christopher & Scott Taylor v HHH, X-Pac, Chris Benoit, Perry Saturn & Dean Malenko - RAW, 2/7/00 (318 points; one top 20 vote)

#50: HHH v Batista (Hell in a Cell) - Vengeance, 6/26/05 (322 points)

#49: Hardy Boys v Dudley Boys v Edge & Christian v Chris Jericho & Chris Benoit (TLC III) - Smackdown!, 5/23/01 (326 points)

#48: Ric Flair v HHH (Cage Match) - Taboo Tuesday, 11/1/05 (334 points; one top 10 vote)

#47: Bret Hart v Mr. Perfect - Summerslam, 8/26/91 (351 points)

#46: Bob Backlund v Sgt. Slaughter (Cage Match) - Philly Spectrum, 3/21/81 (363 points; two top 10 votes)

#45: Kurt Angle v Brock Lesnar (Ironman Match) - Smackdown!, 9/18/03 (364 points; one top 20 vote)

#44: Bob Backlund v Sgt. Slaughter - MSG, 1/10/81 (367 points; one top 5 vote; two top 20 votes)

#43: Randy Orton v Mick Foley (Hardcore Match) - Backlash, 4/18/04 (370 points)

#42: The Rock v HHH (Ironman Match) - Judgment Day, 5/21/00 (374 points)

#41: Bret Hart, Owen Hart, Brian Pillman, Jim Neidhart & Davey Boy Smith v Steve Austin, Goldust, Ken Shamrock, Hawk & Animal - In Your House 16: Canadian Stampede, 7/6/97 (376 points; one top 20 vote)

=#40: John Cena v Shawn Michaels - Wrestlemania 23, 4/1/07 (388 points; one top 20 vote)

=#40: Chris Benoit v William Regal - No Mercy, 10/8/06 (388 points; one top 20 vote)

#38: Shawn Michaels v Ric Flair - Wrestlemania 24, 3/30/08 (415 points)

#37: Shawn Michaels v Chris Jericho - Wrestlemania 19, 3/30/03 (420 points; two top 20 votes)

#36: Shawn Michaels v Razor Ramon (Ladder Match) - Summerslam, 8/27/95 (431 points; one top 20 vote)

#35: Bret Hart v Davey Boy Smith - In Your House 5: Season's Beatings, 12/17/95 (435 points)

#34: Bret Hart v Vader v Steve Austin v Undertaker - In Your House 13: Final Four 2/16/97 (440 points; one top 5 vote)

#33: Chris Benoit v Chris Jericho (Ladder Match) 1/21/01 (474 points; one top 20 vote)

#32: Steve Austin v Dude Love - Over The Edge, 5/31/98 (480 points; one top 20 vote)

#31: HHH v Chris Jericho (Last Man Standing Match) - Fully Loaded, 7/23/00 (487 points; one top 20 vote)

#30: Chris Benoit & Kurt Angle v Edge & Rey Mysterio - No Mercy, 10/20/02 (495 points; one top 20 vote)

#29: Sgt. Slaughter v Iron Sheik (Boot Camp Match) - MSG, 6/16/84 (512 points; one #3 vote; two top 20 vote)

#28: Undertaker v Brock Lesnar (Hell in a Cell) - No Mercy, 10/20/02 (525 points; one top 10 vote; one top 20 vote)

#27: Chris Benoit v Kurt Angle - Royal Rumble, 1/19/03 (530 points; two top 10 votes)

#26: Shawn Michaels v Kurt Angle - Wrestlemania 21, 4/3/05 (534 points; three top 20 votes)

#25: John Cena v Umaga (Last Man Standing Match) - Royal Rumble, 1/28/07 (542 points; four top 20 votes)

#24: Chris Jericho & Chris Benoit v Steve Austin & HHH - RAW, 5/21/01 (547 points; one #1 vote; two top 20 votes)

#23: Owen Hart v Davey Boy Smith - RAW, 3/1/97 (590 points; one top 20 vote)

=#22: Ultimate Warrior v Randy Savage (Retirement Match) - Wrestlemania 7, 3/24/91 (594 points; two top 20 votes)

=#22: Bob Backlund v Greg Valentine - MSG, 2/19/79 (594 points; one #3 vote; one top 10 vote; two top 20 votes)

#20: Eddie Guerrero v Brock Lesnar - No Way Out, 2/15/04 (613 points; three top 20 votes)

#19: Shawn Michaels v Undertaker (Streak v Career Match) - Wrestlemania 26, 3/28/10 (621 points; two #2 votes; one top 20 vote)

#18: Eddie Guerrero v JBL - Judgment Day, 5/16/04 (635 points; one top 10 vote; one top 20 vote)

#17: The Undertaker v Kurt Angle - No Way Out, 2/19/06 (645 points; three top 20 votes)

#16: Steve Austin v Chris Benoit - Smackdown!, 5/31/01 (658 points; two top 20 votes)

#15: Shawn Michaels v Chris Benoit v HHH - Wrestlemania 20, 3/14/04 (665 points; one #3 vote; two top 10 votes; one top 20 vote)

#14: Finlay v Chris Benoit - Judgment Day, 5/21/06 (672 points; one top 10 vote; three top 20 votes)

#13: Randy Savage v Ricky Steamboat - Wrestlemania 3, 3/29/87 (690 points; two top 5 votes)

#12: Eddie Guerrero v Rey Mysterio - Smackdown!, 6/23/05 (692 points; one top 10 vote; four top 20 votes)

#11: Shawn Michaels v Razor Ramon (Ladder Match) - Wrestlemania, 3/20/94 (804 points; one top 5 vote; three top 10 votes)

#10: Bret Hart v Mr. Perfect - King of the Ring, 6/13/93 (886 points; one top 5 vote; three top 10 votes; one top 20 vote)

#9: Bret Hart v Steve Austin - Survivor Series, 11/17/96 (895 points; one top 5 vote; three top 10 votes; two top 20 votes)

#8: Shawn Michaels v Undertaker - Wrestlemania 25, 4/5/09 (920 points; one #2 vote; one #3 vote; one top 10 vote; two top 20 votes)

#7: HHH v Cactus Jack (Street Fight) - Royal Rumble, 1/23/00 (924 points; one #1 vote; one top 5 vote; one top 10 vote; four top 20 votes)

=#6: Bret Hart v Owen Hart - Wrestlemania X, 3/20/94 (1014 points; one #2 vote; four top 5 votes; one top 10 vote; two top 20 votes)

=#6: Steve Austin v Kurt Angle - Summerslam, 8/19/01 (1014 points; one # 1 vote; five top 10 votes; two top 20 votes)

#4: Steve Austin v The Rock - Wrestlemania 17, 4/1/01 (1030 points; one #1 vote; one #2 vote; two top 10 votes; three top 20 votes)

#3: Shawn Michaels v Mankind - In Your House 10: Mind Games, 9/22/96 (1096 points; one #2 vote; two #3 votes; one top 5 vote; two top 10 votes; two top 20 votes)

#2: Shawn Michaels v Undertaker (Hell in a Cell) - In Your House 18: Bad Blood, 10/5/97 (1172 points; four #1 votes; one #2 vote; one top 5 vote; one top 10 vote; one top 20 vote)

#1: Bret Hart v Steve Austin (Submission Match) - Wrestlemania 13, 3/23/97 (1198 points; one #1 vote; two # 2 votes; two #3 votes; one top 5 vote; two top 10 votes; one top 20 vote)





Spoiler: WE's Top 100 WCW Matches



=#286 Goldberg Vs Hogan - Nitro 06/07/1998 (1 point)

=#286 Chris Benoit Vs Eddie Guerrero - Nitro 20/10/1997 (1 point)

=#286 Eddie Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio - Nitro 21/12/1998 (1 point)

=#283 Dustin Rhodes Vs The Barbarian - Saturday Night 14/11/1992 (2 points)

=#283 Jim Cornette Vs Paul E Dangerously - Great American Bash 07/07/1989 (2 points)

=#283 Terry Funk Vs Norman Smiley & Ralphus - Slamboree 07/05/2000 (2 points)

=#283 Sting & Ricky Steamboat Vs Ric Flair & Stunning Steve Austin - Saturday Night 30/07/1994 (2 points)

=#283 Lord Steven Regal Vs Rey Mysterio - Nitro 10/02/1997 (2 points)

=#278 Arn Anderson & Ric Flair Vs Rock 'n Roll Express – The Main Event 18/02/1990 (3 points)

=#278 Brian Pillman Vs Norman The Lunatic - Clash Of The Champions VIII 12/09/1989 (3 points)

=#278 Hulk Hogan/Kevn Nash/Scott Steiner Vs Ric Flair/Chris Benoit/Mongo - Nitro 25/01/1999 (3 points)

=#278 Eddy Guerrero & Chris Jericho Vs Dean Malenko & Chavo Guerrero - Nitro 09/02/1998 (3 points)

=#274 Kid Romero & Elix Skipper Vs Rey Mysterio & Kidman - Greed 18/03/2001 (4 points)

=#274 Cactus Jack Vs Eddie Gilbert - 23/03/90 (4 points)

=#274 Arn Anderson & Larry Zbyszko Vs Sting & Marcus Bagwell - Pro 01/02/1992 (4 points)

=#274 Bret Hart Vs Dean Malenko - Nitro 230/11/1998 (4 points)

=#274 Steven Regal Vs Ricky Steamboat - Saturday Night 08/08/1993 (4 points)

=#274 Lord Steven Regal Vs Tony Pena - Nitro 25/11/1996 (4 points)

=#268 John Tenta Vs Big Bubba – Great American Bash 16/06/1996 (5 points)

=#268 Lord Steven Regal Vs Arn Anderson - Saturday Night 09/10/1993 (5 points)

=#266 Beef Wellington and Chris Benoit Vs Jushin Liger & Brian Pillman - Clash Of The Champions XIX 16/06/1992 (7 points)

=#266 Arn Anderson Vs Ricky Steamboat - Main Event 21/08/1994 (7 points)

=#266 Chris Benoit Vs Eddy Guerrero - Nitro 23/12/1996 (7 points)

=#266 Nikita Koloff Vs Mr. Hughes - Saturday Night 09/05/1992 (7 points)

=#266 Rick Rude & Stunning Steve Austin Vs Sting & Ricky Steamboat - Clash Of The Champions XVIII 21/01/1992 (7 points)

=#261 Arn Anderson Vs Hulk Hogan – Nitro 12/02/1996 (8 points)

=#261 Lex Luger Vs Dan Spivey - Wrestlewar 24/02/1991 (8 points)

=#261 Ricky Steamboat & Barry Windham Vs Greg Valentine & Dick Slater - Power Hour 01/08/1992 (8 points)

=#258 Mean Mark Callous Vs Lex Luger - Great American Bash 07/07/1990 (9 points)

=#258 Rick Rude/Big Van Vader/Sid Vicious Vs Sting/Davey Boy Smith/Dustin Rhodes - Clash Of The Champions XXIII 17/06/1993 (9 points)

=#255 Bull Nakano & Akira Hokuto Vs Mayumi Ozaki & Cutie Suzuki - World War 3 26/11/1995 (10 points)

=#255 Vader Vs Cactus Jack - Worldwide 30/04/1994 (10 points)

=#253 Cactus Jack Vs Van Hammer – Clash of the Champions XVIII 21/01/1992 (11 points)

=#253 Chris Benoit & Dean Malenko Vs Perry Saturn & Raven – Spring Stampede 11/04/1999 (11 points)

=#251 Chris Benoit & Dean Malenko Vs Billy Kidman & Rey Mysterio Nitro - 29/03/1999 (12 points)

=#251 Vader Vs Stan Hansen - Wrestlewar 24/02/1991 (12 points)

=#251 Ric Flair & Arn Anderson Vs Kevin Greene & Steve McMichael - Great American Bash 16/06/1996 (12 points)

=#251 Eddie Guerrero Vs Dean Malenko - Handheld Inglewood 28/06/1997 (12 points)

=#247 Arn Anderson & Larry Zbyszko Vs Barry Windham & Ron Simmons - Pro 09/11/1991 (13 points)

=#247 Cactus Jack Vs Dustin Rhodes - 06/09/1992 (13 points)

=#245 Chris Benoit Vs Booker T - Spring Stampede 19/04/1998 (14 points)

=#245 Chris Jericho Vs Dean Malenko - Slamboree 17/05/1998 (14 points)

=#245 Midnight Express Vs The Steiner Brothers – WCW 13/10/1990 (14 points)

=#245 Eddy Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio - Nitro 10/11/1997 (14 points)

=#241 Chris Jericho Vs Dean Malenko - Uncensored 15/03/1998 (15 points)

=#241 Ric Flair Vs Sting Vs DDP Vs Hulk Hogan - Spring Stampede 11/04/1999 (15 points)

=#241 Roddy Piper/Ric Flair/Kevin Greene Vs Syxx/Kevin Nash/Scott Hall – Slamboree 18/05/1997 (15 points)

=#241 Randy Savage Vs Ric Flair - Great American Bash 18/06/1995 (15 points)

=#237 Chris Benoit Vs Fit Finlay - Nitro 15/06/1998 (16 points)

=#237 Eddy Guerrero Vs Dean Malenko - Uncensored 16/03/1997 (16 points)

=#235 Big Van Vader Vs Ricky Steamboat - Saturday Night 09/10/1993 (17 points)

=#235 Juventud Guerrera/Hector Garza/Super Calo Vs La Parka/Damien/Ciclope - Nitro 26/05/1997 (17 points)

=#235 Lord Steven Regal Vs Dean Malenko - Nitro 23/12/1996 (17 points)

=#232 Lord Steven Regal Vs Larry Zbyszko – Slamboree 22/05/1994 (18 points)

=#232 Ric Flair, Arn Anderson & Barry Windham Vs Sting, Brian Pillman & El Gigante - Main Event 28/04/1990 (18 points)

=#230 The Steiner Brothers Vs Hiroshi Hase & Masahiro Chono – Clash Of The Champions XV 12/16/1991 (19 points)

=#230 Hollywood Blondes & Heavenly Bodies Vs Rock 'n Roll Express & Ricky Steamboat/Shane Douglas – Worldwide 27/02/1993 (19 points)

=#230 Rock N Roll Express Vs Heavenly Bodies - Saturday Night 06/02/1993 (19 points)

=#230 Ric Flair Vs The Giant – Nitro 25/03/1996 (19 points)

=#230 Barry Windham Vs Brian Pillman - Pro 06/04/1991 (19 points)

=#230 Juventud Guerrera Vs Rey Mysterio - Thunder 15/01/1998 (19 points)

=#224 Stan Hansen Vs Lex Luger – Starrcade 16/12/1990 (20 points)

=#224 Dustin Rhodes Vs Bobby Eaton – WCW 07/12/1991 (20 points)

=#222 The Steiner Brothers Vs Sting & Lex Luger - SuperBrawl 19/05/1991 (21 points)

=#222 Vader Vs Ricky Steamboat - Worldwide 25/04/1993 (21 points)

=#220 Sting & Ric Flair Vs Vader & Rick Rude – Clash of the Champions XXVI 27/01/1994 (22 points)

=#220 Sting Vs Ric Flair - Nitro 12/04/1999 (22 points)

=#220 Arn Anderson Vs Alex Wright - Slamboree 21/05/1995 (22 points)

#217 Bobby Eaton Vs Arn Anderson – Superbrawl 19/01/1991 (24 points)

#216 Steve Austin Vs Brian Pillman - Worldwide 04/07/1992 (27 points)

=#215 Chris Jericho Vs Juventud Guerrera – Superbrawl VIII 22/02/1998 (28 points)

=#214 Terry Gordy & Steve Williams Vs Ricky Steamboat & Nikita Koloff - Great American Bash 12/07/1992 (29 points)

=#214 Terry Funk Vs Dustin Rhodes - Uncensored 19/03/2000 (29 points)

=#214 Chris Benoit Vs Brad Armstrong - Clash of the Champions XXII 13/01/1993 (29 points)

#211 Goldberg Vs Sting - Nitro 14/09/1998 (30 points)

=#210 Diamond Dallas Page Vs Bret Hart - Nitro 26/10/1998 (31 points)

=#210 Vader Vs Cactus Jack - Halloween Havoc 24/10/1993 (31 points)

=#208 Vader Vs Cactus Jack - Main Event 07/03/1993 (32 points)

=#208 Ricky Steamboat Vs Brian Pillman - Halloween Havoc 25/10/1992 (32 points)

=#208 Rey Misterio Vs Bam Bam Bigelow - Nitro 01/03/1999 (32 points)

#205 The Steiner Brothers Vs Mr Hughes & Vader – Clash of the Champions XVIII 21/01/1992 (33 points)

=#204 The Steiner Brothers Vs Tatsumi Fujinami & Takayuki Iizuka - WrestleWar 17/05/1992 (34 points)

=#204 Rick Rude Vs Dustin Rhodes - Saturday Night 28/08/1993 (34 points)

=#204 Brian Pillman Vs Johnny B. Badd - Fall Brawl 17/09/1995 (34 points)

#201 Dick Murdoch Vs Bob Orton Jr - Clash of the Champions VI 02/04/1989 (35 points)

=#200 Chris Benoit Vs Kevin Sullivan - Bash at the Beach 13/07/1997 (36 points)

=#200 Goldberg Vs Sid Vicious – Halloween Havoc 24/10/1999 (36 points)

=#200 Arn Anderson/Rick Rude/Steve Austin Vs Barry Windham/Dustin Rhodes/Ricky Steamboat - Pro 04/04/1992 (36 points)

#197 Eddie Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio – World War 3 23/11/1997 (37 points)

=#196 Bobby Eaton Vs Ricky Steamboat - Saturday Night 14/12/1991 (38 points)

=#196 Chris Benoit Vs Chris Jericho - Nitro 30/12/1996 (38 points)

#194 Juventud Guerrera/Super Calo/Lizmark, Jr./Chavo Guerrero Vs La Parka/Psychosis/Silver King/El Dandy – Souled Out 24/01/1998 (39 points)

=#193 Chris Benoit & Dean Malenko Vs Raven & Saturn Vs The Filthy Animals - Slamboree 09/05/1999 (40 points)

=#193 Bob Orton Jr Vs Dick Murdoch - Wrestlewar 07/05/1989 (40 points)

#191 Juventud Guerrera & Rey Mysterio Vs La Parka & Psicosis - Nitro 15/12/1997 (41 points)

=#190 Steven Regal Vs Johnny B. Badd – Fall Brawl 18/09/1994 (42 points)

=#190 Charles Robinson Vs Gorgeous George - Slamboree 09/05/1999 (42 points)

=#190 Rick Rude & Steve Austin Vs Barry Windham & Dustin Rhodes - Great American Bash 12/07/1992 (42 points)

=#190 Rock n Roll Express Vs Heavenly Bodies - Superbrawl III - 12/02/1993 (42 points)

#186 Goldberg Vs Raven - Nitro 20/04/1998 (43 points)

#185 Steve Regal Vs Barry Windham – Worldwide 18/04/1993 (44 points)

#184 Ricky Steamboat Vs Cactus Jack - Worldwide 22/02/1992 (45 points)

=#183 Roddy Piper Vs Hulk Hogan - Starrcade 29/12/1996 (46 points)

=#183 Sting Vs Ric Flair - World War 3 26/11/1995 (46 points)

=#183 Ultimo Dragon Vs Dean Malenko - Clash Of The Champions XXXIV 21/01/1997 (46 points)

#180 Terry Funk Vs Norman Smiley - Spring Stampede 16/04/2000 (47 points)

#179 Sid Vicious Vs Chris Benoit - Souled Out 16/01/2000 (48 points)

=#178 Steven Regal Vs Larry Zbyszko – Clash of the Champions XXVII 23/06/1994 (49 points)

=#178 Ric Flair Vs Ricky Steamboat - Main Event 24/07/1994 (49 points)

=#176 Ric Flair Vs Sting - Clash Of The Champions XXVII 23/06/1994 (50 points)

=#176 Chris Benoit Vs Mike Enos - Souled Out 17/01/1999 (50 points)

=#174 Rey Mysterio & Kidman Vs Eddie Guerrero & Juventud Guerrera - Nitro 28/12/1998 (51 points)

=#174 Steve Austin Vs Ricky Steamboat - Saturday Night 01/08/1992 (51 points)

#172 Steven Regal Vs Arn Anderson - SuperBrawl 20/02/1994 (52 points)

=#171 Sting Vs The Giant - Great American Bash 14/06/1998 (53 points)

=#171 Barry Windham Vs Eddie Gilbert - NWA TV 14/01/1989 (53 points)

=#169 Sting Vs Meng - Bash At The Beach 16/07/1995 (54 points)

=#169 Rick Rude Vs Erik Watts - Worldwide 05/12/1992 (54 points)

=#169 Dean Malenko Vs Chris Benoit - Hog Wild 16/08/1996 (54 points)

=#166 Meng Vs Chris Benoit – Slamboree 18/05/1997 (57 points)

=#166 Rey Mysterio Vs Ultimo Dragon - Spring Stampede 06/04/1997 (57 points)

=#166 Steve Austin Vs Dustin Rhodes - Halloween Havoc 27/10/1991 (57 points)

=#163 The Road Warriors & The Midnight Express Vs The Freebirds & The Samoan Swat Team - Great American Bash 23/07/1989 (58 points)

=#163 Bull Nakano & Akira Hokuto Vs Mayumi Ozaki & Cutie Suzuki - Nitro 27/11/1995 (58 points)

=#163 Barry Windham & Dustin Rhodes Vs Steve Austin & Steve Williams - Halloween Havoc 25/10/1992 (58 points)

=#163 Sting/Brian Pillman/Dustin Rhodes Vs Rick Rude/Stunning Steve Austin/Paul Orndorff - SuperBrawl IV 20/02/1994 (58 points)

=#163 Big Van Vader Vs Davey Boy Smith - Clash of the Champions 18/08/1993 (58 points)

#158 The Fantastics Vs Edide Gilbert & Ron Simmons - Clash Of The Champions VI 07/12/1988 (59 points)

=#157 Rick Flair Vs Rick Steiner - House Show 06/01/1989 (60 points)

=#157 Hollywood Blondes Vs Arn Anderson & Ric Flair - Clash Of The Champions XXIII 16/06/1993 (60 points)

=#155 Eddie Guerrero Vs Ric Flair - Hog Wild 10/08/1996 (61 points)

=#155 Ricky Steamboat & Eddie Gilbert Vs Ric Flair & Barry Windham - NWA TV 21/01/1989 (61 points)

#153 Great Muta Vs Sting - Great American Bash 23/07/1989 (65 points)

=#152 Kwee Wee Vs Jason Jett – Greed 18/03/2001 (66 points)

=#152 Ric Flair Vs Bobby Eaton – Clash of the Champions XV 14/06/1991 (66 points)

=#152 Bobby Eaton Vs Ricky Steamboat - 04/04/1992 (66 points)

#149 Ricky Steamboat Vs Steven Regal - Saturday Night 25/09/1993 (69 points)

=#148 Rhodes & Barry Windham Vs Ricky Steamboat & Shane Douglas – Clash Of The Champions XXI 18/11/1992 (70 points)

=#148 Chris Benoit Vs Jeff Jarrett - Starrcade 19/12/1999 (70 points)

#146 Vader Vs Hulk Hogan - Superbrawl 19/02/1995 (72 points)

#145 3 Count Vs Jung Dragons Vs Jamie Knoble & Evan Karagias - Mayhem 26/11/2000 (73 points)

=#144 Vader Vs Ric Flair – Superbrawl IV 20/02/1994 (74 points)

=#144 Ric Flair Vs Brian Pillman - World Championship Wrestling 13/04/1991 (74 points)

=#142 Sting Vs Chris Benoit - Nitro 20/09/1999 (76 points)

=#142 The Steiner Brothers Vs Steve Williams & Terry Gordy - Beach Blast 20/06/1992 (76 points)

#140 Terry Funk Vs Ricky Steamboat - Clash Of The Champions VII 14/06/1989 (80 points)

#139 Ric Flair Vs Lord Steven Regal - Worldwide 01/05/1994 to 29/05/1994 (82 points)

#138 Arn Anderson & Brian Pillman Vs Ric Flair & Sting - Halloween Havoc 29/10/1995 (83 points, One top 20 vote)

#137 Ric Flair Vs Hulk Hogan - Clash Of The Champions XXVIII 28/08/1994 (84 points, One top 20 vote)

=#136 Eddy Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio - Nitro 08/09/1997 (85 points)

=#136 Terry Funk Vs Tully Blanchard - Slamboree 22/05/1994 (85 points)

#134 Ultimo Dragon Vs Rey Mysterio - World War 3 24/11/1996 (86 points)

=#133 Dean Malenko Vs Rey Mysterio - Great American Bash 16/06/1996 (88 points)

=#133 Rey Mysterio Vs Psychosis Vs Blitzkrieg Vs Juventud Guerrera - Monday Nitro 19/04/1999 (88 points)

#131 Ricky Steamboat & Shane Douglas Vs Steve Austin & Brian Pillman - Clash of the Champions XXII 13/01/1993 (90 points)

=#130 3 Count Vs Jung Dragons Vs Jamie Knoble & Evan Karagias - Starrcade 17/12/2000 (91 points)

=#130 Steve Austin Vs Ricky Steamboat - Satuday Night 18/01/1992 (91 points)

=#128 Rey Mysterio Vs Dean Malenko - Halloween Havoc 27/10/1996 (93 points, One top 20 vote)

=#128 Lord Steven Regal Vs Psicosis - Nitro 16/12/1996 (93 points)

#126 Juventud Guerrera Vs Blitzkrieg - Spring Stampede 11/04/1999 (97 points)

#125 Chris Benoit Vs Jeff Jarrett - Mayhem 21/11/1999 (99 points)

=#124 Goldberg Vs Diamond Dallas Page – Nitro 19/04/1999 (101 points)

=#124 Raven Vs Chris Benoit - Souled Out 24/01/1998 (101 points)

#122 Barry Windham Vs 2 Cold Scorpio - Clash of the Champions 16/06/1993 (102 points)

#121 Chavo Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio - SuperBrawl Revenge 18/02/2001 (104 points)

=#120 Kidman Vs Eddie Guerrero - Starrcade 27/12/1998 (105 points)

=#120 Ric Flair & Barry Windham Vs Eddie Gilbert & Lex Luger - Main Event 25/03/1989 (105 points)

#118 Arn Anderson/ Bobby Eaton/Larry Zbyszko Vs Dustin Rhodes/Barry Windham/Ron Simmons - Clash of the Champions XVIII 21/01/1992 (109 points)

#117 Ric Flair & Arn Anderson Vs Hulk Hogan & Randy Savage - Nitro 08/01/1996 (110 points)

#116 Randy Savage Vs Diamond Dallas Page - Spring Stampede 06/04/1997 (114 points)

#115 Kidman Vs Rey Mysterio - Monday Nitro 15/03/1999 (116 points)

#114 Bret Hart Vs Ric Flair - Souled Out 24/01/1998 (118 points)

=#113 Sting & The Steiner Brothers Vs Rick Rude/Arn Anderson/Bobby Eaton - Worldwide 03/10/1992 (122 points)

=#113 Stars & Stripes Vs Arn Anderson & Vader - Saturday Night 15/04/1995 (122 points)

#111 Ric Rude Vs Brian Pillman - Power Hour 15/02/1992 (123 points)

=#110 Raven Vs Chris Benoit Vs Diamond Dallas Page - Uncensored 15/03/1998 (124 points)

=#110 Randy Savage Vs Diamond Dallas Page - Halloween Havoc 26/10/1997 (124 points)

=#110 Scott Steiner Vs Goldberg - Fall Brawl 17/09/2000 (124 points)

#107 Ricky Steamboat & Shane Douglas Vs Hollywood Blondes - Worldwide 27/03/1993 (129 points)

#106 Dean Malenko Vs Eddie Guerrero - Handheld Spokane 18/09/1997 (131 points)

#105 Faces of Fear Vs Chris Jericho & Eddie Guerrero - Nitro 24/02/1997 (132 points)

#104 Eddie Guerrero Vs Shinjiro Otani - Starrcade 27/12/1995 (134 points)

#103 Lord Steven Regal Vs Ultimo Dragon - Slamboree 18/05/1997 (136 points)

#102 Dean Malenko Vs Ultimo Dragon - Starrcade 29/12/1996 (137 points)

#101 Chris Benoit Vs Eddie Guerrero - Saturday Night 18/11/1995 (142 points)

#100 Dustin Rhodes Vs Bunkhouse Buck - Slamboree 22/05/1994 (144 points)

#99 Ric Flair Vs Eddie Guerrero - Nitro 20/05/1996 (146 points)

#98 Kidman Vs Rey Mysterio Vs Juventud Guerrera - Starrcade 27/12/1998 (148 points)

=#97 Sting Vs Rick Rude - Clash Of The Champions XVII 19/11/1991 (154 points)

=#97 Arn Anderson Vs Shane Douglas - World Championship Wrestling 17/02/1990 (154 points)

=#97 Arn Anderson Vs Ricky Steamboat - Pro 21/03/1992 (154 points)

#94 Steve Williams & Terry Gordy Vs Dustin Rhodes & Barry Windham - Saturday Night 03/10/1992 (155 points)

#93 Arn Anderson Vs Great Muta - Power Hour 12/01/1990 (157 points)

#92 Chris Jeircho Vs Ultimo Dragon - Bash At The Beach 13/07/1997 (158 points, One top 20 vote)

=#91 Nasty Boys Vs Cactus Jack & Maxx Payne - SuperBrawl 20/02/1994 (161 points)

=#91 Midnight Express Vs Original Midnight Express - Starrcade 26/12/1988 (161 points)

#89 Rey Mysterio Vs Super Calo - Fall Brawl 16/06/1996 (169 points, One top 20 vote)

#88 Chris Benoit Vs 2 Cold Scorpio - Superbrawl III 21/02/1993 (173 points)

#87 Bam Bam Bigelow Vs Hak - Spring Stampede 11/04/1999 (186 points, One top 15 vote)

#86 Chris Benoit Vs Chris Jericho - Fall Brawl 15/09/1996 (192 points)

#85 Brian Pillman Vs Scotty Flamingo - Beach Blast 20/06/1992 (195 points)

#84 Lord Steven Regal Vs Fit Finlay - Nitro 29/04/1996 (197 points)

#83 Steve Austin Vs Ricky Steamboat - Bash at the Beach 17/07/1994 (200 points)

#82 Ric Flair Vs Brian Pillman - 17/02/1990 (203 points)

=#81 Wrath & Mortis v Glacier & Ernest Miller - Bash at the Beach 13/07/1997 (206 points)

=#81 Vader Vs Ricky Steamboat - Worldwide 29/05/1993 (206 points)

#79 Rey Mysterio Vs Jushin Thunder Liger - Starrcade 29/12/1996 (210 points)

=#78 Big Van Vader & Steve Austin Vs Ric Flair & Arn Anderson - Saturday Night 13/11/1993 (214, One top 15 vote)

=#78 Chris Benoit Vs Bret Hart - Nitro 04/10/1999 (214 points, One top 15 vote)

#76 Arn Anderson/Ric Flair/Lex Luger/Sting Vs Hulk Hogan/Kevin Nash/Scott Hall/Sting - Fall Brawl 15/09/1996 (216 points)

#75 Brian Pillman Vs Jushin Liger - SuperBrawl 29/02/1992 (220 points)

#74 Ric Flair & Barry Windham Vs The Midnight Express - Clash of the Champions 07/12/1988 (222 points)

#73 Lex Luger Vs Ricky Steamboat - Great American Bash 23/07/1989 (228 points)

#72 Cactus Jack Vs Paul Orndorff - Superbrawl III 12/02/1993 (232 points)

#71 Ricky Steamboat Vs Steve Austin - Clash of The Champions XXVIII 28/08/1994 (236 points, One top 20 vote)

#70 Ricky Steamboat Vs Steve Austin - Clash Of The Champions XX 02/09/1992 (246 points)

#69 Ric Flair Vs Arn Anderson - Fall Brawl 17/09/1995 (247 points, One top 15 vote)

#68 Chris Benoit Vs Diamond Dallas Page - SuperBrawl 22/02/1998 (250 points)

#67 Scott Hall & Kevin Nash Vs Randy Savage/Lex Luger/Sting - Bash At The Beach 07/07/1996 (253 points)

#66 Rick Rude Vs Dustin Rhodes - Worldwide 30/05/1992 (254 points)

#65 Rick Rude Vs Ricky Steamboat - SuperBrawl 29/02/1992 (258 points)

#64 Vader Vs Davey Boy Smith - Slamboree 23/05/1993 (272 points)

#63 Sting Vs Cactus Jack - Power Hour 16/11/1991 (273 points)

#62 Vader Vs The Boss - Spring Stampede 17/04/1994 (274 points, One top 20 vote)

#61 Cactus Jack & Kevin Sullivan Vs The Nasty Boys - Slamboree 22/05/1994 (281 points, One top 10 vote)

#60 Ric Flair Vs Sting - Great American Bash 07/07/1990 (283 points, One top 20 vote)

#59 Dustin Rhodes Vs Vader - Saturday Night 21/11/1992 (284 points)

#58 Ron Simmons Vs Vader - Main Event 02/08/1992 (286 points)

#57 Arn Anderson & Barry Windham Vs Doom - Starrcade 16/12/1990 (288 points)

#56 Vader Vs Sting - Fall Brawl 18/09/1994 (292 points)

#55 Ric Flair Vs Ricky Steamboat - Philadelphia House Show 18/03/1989 (309 points, One top 10 vote)

#54 Lord Steven Regal Vs Sting - Great American Bash 16/06/1996 (318 points, One top 20 vote)

#53 Lord Steven Regal Vs Larry Zbyszko - Saturday Night 28/05/1994 (319 points)

#52 Ric Flair Vs Hulk Hogan - Bash At The Beach 17/07/1994 (324 points, One top 20 vote)

#51 Ric Flair Vs Ricky Steamboat - Spring Stampede 17/04/1994 (337 points, One top 5 vote)

#50 The Steiner Brothers Vs The Nasty Boys - Halloween Havoc 27/10/1990 (354 points, Two top 15 votes)

#49 Arn Anderson Vs Big Josh - 02/05/1992 (365 points, One top 10 vote)

#48 Ric Flair Vs Lex Luger - WrestleWar 25/02/1990 (378 points)

#47 Dustin Rhodes/Dusty Rhodes/Nasty Boys Vs Bunkhouse Buck/Arn Anderson/Terry Funk/Colonel Parker - Fall Brawl 18/09/1994 (383 votes, One top 15 vote)

#46 Arn Anderson Vs Barry Windham - 06/06/1992 (387 points, One top 10 vote)

#45 Ricky Steamboat Vs Vader - Saturday Night 16/10/1993 (390 points, One top 5 vote)

#44 Chris Benoit Vs Eddie Guerrero - Nitro 16/10/1995 (409 points)

#43 Chris Benoit Vs Fit Finlay - Slamboree 17/05/1998 (427 points)

#42 Ric Flair Vs Ricky Steamboat - Saturday Night 14/05/1994 (429 points, One top 5 vote)

#41 Rey Mysterio Vs Psicosis - Bash At The Beach 07/07/1996 (430 points, One top 15 vote, Two top 20 votes)

#40 Ric Flair & Sting Vs Great Muta & Dick Slater - Clash Of The Champions VIII 12/09/1989 (437 points)

#39 Chris Benoit Vs Kevin Sullivan - Great American Bash 16/06/1996 (443 points, Two top 20 votes)

#38 Jake Roberts Vs Dustin Rhodes - 26/09/1992 (445 points, Two top 15 votes, One top 20 vote)

#37 Ric Flair Vs Ricky Steamboat - Landover House Show - 18/03/1989 (446 points, Two top 5 votes, Two top 15 votes)

#36 Dustin Rhodes & Barry Windham Vs Steve Austin & Larry Zbyszko - Superbrawl 29/02/1992 (449 points, One top 20 vote)

#35 Diamond Dallas Page Vs Sting - Nitro 26/04/1999 (450 points, One top 10 vote)

#34 Steve Williams & Terry Gordy Vs The Steiners - Clash Of The Champions XIX 16/06/1992 (466 points, Two top 15 votes, One top 20 vote)

#33 Sting Vs Vader - Slamboree 22/05/1994 (467 points, One top 15 vote)

#32 Cactus Jack & Maxx Payne Vs The Nasty Boys - Spring Stampede 17/04/1994 (475 points, One top 15 vote)

#31 Arn Anderson Vs Dustin Rhodes - Satuday Night 04/01/1992 (487 points, One top 20 vote)

#30 Dustin Rhodes Vs Bunkhouse Buck - Spring Stampede 17/04/1994 (501 points, One top 10 vote)

#29 Diamond Dallas Page Vs Randy Savage - Great American Bash 15/06/1997 (546 points, One top 15 vote)

#28 Steamboat/Rhodes/Koloff Vs Anderson/Zbyszko/Eaton - Saturday Night 23/05/1992 (551 points, One top 5 vote, One top 10 vote, Two top 20 votes)

#27 Ricky Steamboat Vs Lord Steven Regal - Fall Brawl 19/09/1993 (569 points, One top 5 vote)

#26 Hollywood Blondes Vs Marcus Bagwell & 2 Cold Scorpio - Worldwide 08/05/1993 (571 points, One top 15 vote)

#25 Lord Steven Regal Vs Fit Finlay - Uncensored 24/03/1996 (588 points, One top 5 vote, Two top 10 votes, One top 20 vote)

#24 Ric Flair Vs Hulk Hogan - Halloween Havoc 24/10/1994 (592 points, One top 5 vote, One top 10 vote, Two top 15 votes, One top 20 vote)

#23 Sting Vs Vader - Great American Bash 12/07/1992 (602 points, Three top 15 votes, One top 20 vote)

#22 Rock n Roll Express Vs Midnight Express - Wrestlewar 25/02/1990 (634 points, Two top 10 votes, One top 15 vote, Two top 20 votes)

#21 Eddie Guerrero Vs Chris Jericho - Fall Brawl 14/09/1997 (648 votes, One top 15 vote, Two top 20 votes)

#20 Arn Anderson/Rick Rude/Larry Zbyszko/Bobby Eaton Vs Sting/Ricky Steamboat/Dustin Rhodes/Barry Windham - Saturday Night 22/02/1992 (655 points, One top 10 vote, Two top 15 votes)

#19 Ricky Steamboat & Shane Douglas Vs Brian Pillman & Steve Austin - Starrcade 28/12/1992 (664 points, Four top 20 votes)

=#18 Sting Vs Vader - Starrcade 28/12/1992 (671 points, One top 10 vote)

=#18 Vader Vs Dustin Rhodes - Clash Of The Champions XXIX 16/11/1994 (671 points, One top 5 vote, Two top 15 votes, One top 20 vote)

#16 Ric Flair Vs Lex Luger - Starrcade 26/12/1988 (677 points, One top 10 vote, One top 15 vote, Two top 20 votes)

#15 Flair/Windham/Sid Vicious/Zbyszko Vs Sting/Pillman/The Steiners - Wrestlewar 24/02/1991 (691 points, Three top 10 votes, One top 15 vote, Two top 20 votes)

#14 Goldberg Vs Diamond Dallas Page - Halloween Havoc 24/10/1998 (725 points, Two top 10 votes, One top 20 vote)

#13 Ricky Steamboat & Dustin Rhodes Vs Arn Anderson & Larry Zbyszko - Clash Of The Champions XVII 19/11/1991 (761 points, Two top 5 votes, One top 15 vote, Two top 20 votes)

#12 Sting Vs Vader - Superbrawl III 21/02/1993 (781 points, One top 5 vote, Three top 10 votes, Two top 15 votes, One top 20 vote)

#11 Sting Vs Cactus Jack - Beach Blast 20/06/1992 (782 points, Two top 10 votes, One top 15 vote)

#10 Southern Boys Vs Midnight Express - Great American Bash 07/07/1990 (793 points, Three top 10 votes, One top 20 vote)

#9 Ric Flair Vs Terry Funk - Clash Of The Champions IX 15/11/1989 (801 points, One #1 vote, Two top 5 votes, One top 10 vote, Two top 15 votes, One top 20 vote)

#8 Ric Flair Vs Vader - Starrcade 27/12/1993 (817 points, One top 5 vote, Three top 10 votes, One top 15 votes, Three top 20 votes)

#7 Ric Flair Vs Terry Funk - Great American Bash 23/07/1989 (869 votes, Two top 5 votes, Two top 10 votes, Two top 15 votes, Two top 20 votes)

#6 Ric Flair Vs Ricky Steamboat - Wrestlewar 07/05/1989 (889 votes, One #1 vote, Three top 5 votes, One top 10 vote, One top 15 vote, One top 10 vote)

#5 Ric Flair Vs Ricky Steamboat - Chi Town Rumble 20/02/1989 (940 points, One #1 vote, Four top 5 votes, Two top 10 vote, Two top 15 vote, One top 20 vote)

#4 Sting/Koloff/Rhodes/Steamboat/Windham Vs Anderson/Eaton/Zbyszko/Austin/Rude - Wrestlewar 17/05/1992 (946 points, Four top 5 votes, Six top 10 votes)

#3 Ricky Steamboat Vs Rick Rude - Beach Blast 20/06/1992 (949 points, Two #1 votes, Four top 5 votes, One top 10 vote, Three top 15 votes)

#2 Ric Flair Vs Ricky Steamboat - Clash Of The Champions VI 02/04/1989 (951 points, Four #1 votes, Two top 5 votes, Three top 15 votes, One top 20 vote)

#1 Eddie Guerrero Vs Rey Mysterio - Halloween Havoc 26/10/1997 (965 points, One #1 vote, Five top 5 votes, Four top 10 votes)



And there is a thread in the other wrestling section with the best of the 00's list http://www.wrestlingforum.com/other-wrestling/1059465-wrestling-elites-top-328-matches-00s.html


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

I've heard rumors Sheamus will return at the Rumble. Which if true, is the perfect way to return on a big stage with a hot Rumble crowd. But I hope to god he doesn't win the thing, he can toss out the most people for all I care to establish his return but he shouldn't win it at all. 



RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> oh NOST you have too ziggler/cesaro is :lenny


Ok. I guess my reason for not watching yet would be it was on Main Event. :draper2 Ain't got time for that show.



RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Def agree on the list thing, I give guys like Cal and smitty all the credit, some here have so much tolerance for wrestling, I just couldn't, 150 list funnyfaces ? geez, I have my top 10 list ready too go and thats about it


Cal deserves credit for his hilarious PPV's reviews. :lmao


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Spoiler: WE's Top 100 WWF/E Matches
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Sweet! Bookmarked


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I forgot to put over how good Royal Rumble 1998 is.

Royal Rumble 1998 :clap


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> I forgot to put over how good Royal Rumble 1998 is.
> 
> Royal Rumble 1998 :clap


Eh, it was a good PPV, but it doesn't deserve a :clap. Rock/Shamrock gets mixed reviews, but I liked it. Goldust/Vader should have been so much better. Rumble gets mixed reviews too, but I liked it. Main event deserves a Lenny smiley.

Overall, I would put every Rumble PPV from 2000-2005 over it.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I meant it was solid compared to most of 97 & I believe it's gonna be one of the best shows of 98 as well, nothing really stupid transpired on that show.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Rock is the only thing i like from the RR tbh. His heel antics in both the shamrock and rumble matches is just awesome. The casket is also good though, with a memorable ending.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Just watched Brock/show JD 03, really fun match, love the chemistry between these guys

would Probably go ***3/4 for it


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Some TV matches that are worth watching from this year (all of which made my top 150 list):
> 
> Sheamus vs. Wade Barrett
> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x10dvsm_sheamus-vs-wade-barrett-main-event-05-29-13_sport
> ...


So much YES - minus the Punk match. Didn't think that was anything special. His matches vs Ambrose need love. Those were great.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Just rewatched Benoit vs Booker from No Way Out for the first time in over a year and wow, I can't believe it but Cody was 100% right about this. It was boring as fuck and the crowd... it felt like a damn graveyard. Booker's control segment in the first half specially made me realize just how badly I'm waiting for this shit to end. Benoit as usual did what he could to make it watchable but this time it wasn't enough. Enough for a below average rating but nowhere near the four star I had it at. Other than Booker going for the Houston Hangover and Benoit doing that excellent transition from Sharpshooter to Crossface in the end, this was highly forgettable.

Oh well, at least Orton/Mysterio and Taker/Angle still kick ass.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Who's Cody?

Smackdown looks really good.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Who's Cody?


"Paramore fan".

---------

Now I'll watch this Cena/Benoit that takes place right before the classic BROCK/Benoit match on SD to see if it still holds up.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I bet this Cody guy is a neat fella.

Benoit vs Booker. Oof. Was not prepared for that match to suck the life out of me like it did. Part of the reason why I felt that show wasn't as good as some said for so long. Undercard is entertaining & the other two main events are great, but idk, something about it didn't make it "my favorite" out of the 2006 PPVs. I'm just glad I'm in the middle of watching their WCW series atm. Although, their last match on 5/11/98 was a bit dull. Tbf, that whole Nitro was a pile of garbage outside of what Finlay, Juvi, & Kidman did.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I thought Paramore fan was a girl. Cody can be a female name, right?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I thought Paramore fan was a girl. Cody can be a female name, right?


nah only female here is that SonoSHion (Horny SnowFlakes) poster, actually a hot chick, have had phone convos with her a couple times

I have 17 matches on my top 2013 list, dont feel like cutting it down or too add 3 more to be 20 so idk


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cena vs Benoit successfully held up. Solid TV stuff and probably Cena's best match from 2003 aside from NM with Angle and one of the Taker matches. I like how they improvised when Cena botches the Crossface take down. He looks like he legit hurt his shoulder so Benoit starts working on and weakening it. The final move before Big Show randomly appeared confuses me, though. It looked like Cena wanted to flip Benoit over his head (like that move Angle does when mat wrestling) quickly and he did but then Cole went all "CENA HIT THE F-U!!!" even though it looked pretty weak. Big Show distracts him on the apron, Benoit capitalizes and makes Cena TAP in an instant! :mark:


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Booker/Benoit from NWO 06 might be worse than all 11 or 12 matches I've seen from them in WCW 1998. 



funnyfaces1 said:


> I thought Paramore fan was a girl. Cody can be a female name, right?


:mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I thought Paramore fan was a girl. Cody can be a female name, right?


Check.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

So I started Vengeance 04 I'm currently on Edge/Orton, gonna give this another to see if I somewhat enjoy the match now.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

We are all in agreement that all of Vince McMahon's PPV matches in 03 are better than all of the WHC matches that year, right? I swear, Vince is a better wrestler than half the guys he signed over the years. :vince3


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> We are all in agreement that all of Vince McMahon's PPV matches in 03 are better than all of the WHC matches that year, right? I swear, Vince is a better wrestler than half the guys he signed over the years. :vince3


Are you talking about 04?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Naw, 03. I mean c'mon. Dude carried Zack Gowen and Stephanie to good fun matches.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

That Zack Gowen match :mark:


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

God, '03 was not a good year for the WHC on PPV. Outside of Booker/Trips I'd consider the rest absolutely awful.

Trips/Steiner
Trips/Steiner
Trips/Booker
Trips/Nash
Trips/Nash
Chamber
Trips/Goldberg
Trips/Goldberg
Trips/Goldberg/Kane

Right? I loathe just about all of those. :lmao


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm watching it right now! Gowen/Steph vs. Big Show is superb. Better than anything RAW gave us that year.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I liked Triple H/Nash HIAC.

Elimination Chamber was fun but nothing special.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

vs Booker & vs Nash HIAC is all I liked out of the PPV matches. vs Flair & Michaels on TV > all the other PPV garbage.

Vince vs Steph is amazing.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I remember being so uncomfortable about 2003 Vince as a kid. Dude was fucking nuts. :lmao


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I felt uncomfortable with quite a few Vince segments over the years. Whenever he had those segments with Torrie, I'd get this funny feeling in my pants as a kid, which made me question the very meaning of life. :vince

I actually find Steph vs. Vince entertaining. It's a shame I have no idea where my No Mercy 03 DVD is, since there's that, a Biker Chain match that seems to improve (slightly) each watch, and THE GOAT making Cena tap. :usangle


----------



## JY57 (Jul 31, 2012)

Metzler's TLC Ratings:

1. Fandango vs Ziggler (*)
2. CM Punk vs The Shield (***)
3. AJ Lee vs Natalya (***)
4. Langston vs Sandow (*3/4)
5. Goldust/Cody vs Big Show/Mysterio vs Ryback/Axel vs Real Americans (***1/2)
6. R-Truth vs Brodus Clay (1/4*)
7. Kingston vs The Miz (*1/4)
8. Daniel Bryan vs The Wyatts (**3/4)
9. John Cena vs Randy Orton (***1/4)

Bonus RAW Main Event: Daniel Bryan vs Randy Orton (****)


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I'm watching it right now! Gowen/Steph vs. Big Show is superb. Better than anything RAW gave us that year.


I HAVE TO SPREAD BEFORE REPPING. F*CK.

Anywhoways, care to list off said 2013 matches from JAN-NOW that I can watch in order (TV, of course)?

I need like.... 50, & it's mainly the stuff from the summer to now that I need as I was watching consistently until after Summerslam when I started losing all interest besides whatever HHH was doing, since Punk was stuck with Axel & Ryback. 

Saw the PPVs though, garbage :lol.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

JY57 said:


> Metzler's TLC Ratings:
> 
> 1. Fandango vs Ziggler (*)
> 2. CM Punk vs The Shield (***)
> ...


Wow nice for Nattie/AJ I think it's only second divas match in history to get a ***+ rating with the other being Lita vs Trish Unforgiven 06 ( the KO's had i think around 10 ***+ , Gail/Kong series alone being like half of them) 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

You heard the story of Hero watching Cesaro/Zayn 2/3 falls with Heyman and his face for the final fall :heyman5 :lol


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

What's the consensus best Vince match? I like the HBK match well enough, but it does come off as awfully contrived/forced in the end. The match with Punk on Raw was an instant classic, I got the biggest goosebumps the last time I watched it. And finally the Hogan match, my personal favorite, if only for that AMAZING face Vince makes when he finds the lead pipe. Seriously one of my favorite moments in all wrestling is Vince wearing the crimson mask, making that amazing face, and just peeking over the edge of the mat. :mark:

That Vince/Hogan match is better than anything Kofi, Rtruth, Miz, Santino, Axel, or any of the other bum mid carders the WWE has, have ever done.

How is the Vince/Stone Cold cage match? Never bothered going back and wwatching it again, because I remember how awesome I thought it was as a kid.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I hate Hogan/Vince . Might go with the RR 02 FLAIR match for best Vince match. I love that a ton. HBK match is second, then the WM with Shane probably. Punk one deserves a mention but it wasn't enough of a "match" unfortunately .


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> I hate Hogan/Vince . Might go with the RR 02 FLAIR match for best Vince match. I love that a ton. HBK match is second, then the WM with Shane probably. Punk one deserves a mention but it wasn't enough of a "match" unfortunately .


I thought I remembered you or someone saying you hate it, what is it specifically you don't like about it? That match is just so brutal and to see 2 men around 60 years old do that to each other was a real site to see.

Forgot about that Flair match, definitely needs a rewatch. Even if I know Flair was Naitch yet.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Watching the last PPV of 1996, IYH: It's Time, now.

How's the main event? The rest of the card looks pretty unimpressive, I'm stoked for 1997 (will watch both regular shows and PPVs).

edit: I just noticed Leif Cassidy is Al Snow :lmao


----------



## KingLobos (Apr 10, 2013)

Oliver-94 said:


> Rock is the only thing i like from the RR tbh. His heel antics in both the shamrock and rumble matches is just awesome. The casket is also good though, with a memorable ending.


He does even better in next year's royal rumble :cool2


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

DoubtGin said:


> Watching the last PPV of 1996, IYH: It's Time, now.
> 
> How's the main event? The rest of the card looks pretty unimpressive, I'm stoked for 1997 (will watch both regular shows and PPVs).
> 
> edit: I just noticed Leif Cassidy is Al Snow :lmao


Main event is Sid Vs Bret, right? If so, its really fucking good. SID worked great with Shawn and Bret... shame Bret and Shawn couldn't work well together to save their lives .

Don't get too stoked for 1997... for all the great stuff it DOES have, it has some utter shite in the undercard. Every PPV is a one match show most of the time (obvious exceptions that I don't have to get into lol), with an undercard of unwatchable puke .


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> What's the consensus best Vince match? I like the HBK match well enough, but it does come off as awfully contrived/forced in the end. The match with Punk on Raw was an instant classic, I got the biggest goosebumps the last time I watched it. And finally the Hogan match, my personal favorite, if only for that AMAZING face Vince makes when he finds the lead pipe. Seriously one of my favorite moments in all wrestling is Vince wearing the crimson mask, making that amazing face, and just peeking over the edge of the mat. :mark:
> 
> That Vince/Hogan match is better than anything Kofi, Rtruth, Miz, Santino, Axel, or any of the other bum mid carders the WWE has, have ever done.
> 
> How is the Vince/Stone Cold cage match? Never bothered going back and wwatching it again, because I remember how awesome I thought it was as a kid.


I watched the Vince/Austin cage match not too long ago and I really didn't like it very much at all. The whole match is just a huge ass kicking. Also the Big Show appearing was really stupid as Austin had like 10 chances to win the match and decided not to before Big Show actually appeared. 

Vince was great as a character in it though. It took his character to a different level because he didn't play a cowardly heel too much. Him flipping Austin off as Austin was about to walk out the door was pretty awesome.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Vince/Bret from WM26 is my favourite Vince McMahon's match. I really loved how they played the story, and Bret was really phenomenal. ****1/4


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Cal, do you remember Vince/Hunter from Armageddon 1999? It's long, but it's Vince and Hunter trying to kill each other, and the ending is :mark:

Thought it was decent for what it was.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Seen yesterday the IYH match between Bret HArt and British Bulldog and I have to say that the first 8-10 minutes were really REALLY boring. They stepped up after that and delivered, but still, such a dissapointment compared to their Wembley classic. ***1/4


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Srdjan99 said:


> Vince/Bret from WM26 is my favourite Vince McMahon's match. I really loved how they played the story, and Bret was really phenomenal. ****1/4


Damn bro, we're trying to be serious here.

Vince/Austin Cage sucked. Felt like Cena/Lauranaitis. Vince/Shane might be his best match since Vince/Punk doesn't count. Was he able to carry Lashley to a good match? Vince/HHH sucked too. And that HIAC match. Hideously overrated.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

funnyface where is this 150 list man 


Mine bumped up to 25 from 10 somehow, but its not going any further, there are some UNEXPECTED matches on here, shocked there are on it either


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I think Vince/Shane is his best match or Vince/HBK.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'll give you guys my list when the new year comes. Based on the recent tapings, we have some new matches to add to our lists. I will say that there are two very controversial picks for #11 and 12 that nobody will agree on. You guys probably know what one of them are, but the other one is a match that very few people here probably saw.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I'll go for a top 25 myself. Too much to catch up on so my list will not be very accurate. Did get Ziggler/Cesaro out of the way, though. That was pretty good and is most likely in the top 20.

EDIT: Watching Raw 3/3/97 and Austin just cut this AWESOME promo from the studio. Damn is he a great talker.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Going to rewatch shield/KOFIno raw now


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

That Summer Rae sig :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Finished Zayn/Cesaro 2/3 falls. Plenty of great stuff there, definitely didn't expect a tap out from a fucking headlock so that was a nice surprise. And that suicide dive like spinning DDT. :mark:

Got about five more to go then my top 25 should be finished.



A William Murderface Christmas said:


> That Summer Rae sig :mark:


MUCH better than his previous one. (Y)


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> Finished Zayn/Cesaro 2/3 falls. Plenty of great stuff there, definitely didn't expect a tap out from a fucking headlock so that was a nice surprise. And that suicide dive like spinning DDT. :mark:
> 
> Got about five more to go then my top 25 should be finished.
> 
> ...


They are both fantastic to me.

Tom Phillips has the call of the year in that match.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Best Vince match? I love HBK/Vince more than just about anyone other than the Observer. Vince/Shane right after that. Punk/Vince brawl was AWESOME though.

Hogan/Vince - ***** for that part when Vince starts creeping up above the apron covered in blood.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> That Summer Rae sig :mark:





Choke2Death said:


> Finished Zayn/Cesaro 2/3 falls. Plenty of great stuff there, definitely didn't expect a tap out from a fucking headlock so that was a nice surprise. And that suicide dive like spinning DDT. :mark:
> 
> Got about five more to go then my top 25 should be finished.
> 
> ...


Zayn/Cesaro 2/3 is very good, I would recommend watching zayn/swagger if you havent, also very good and not talked about as much as the cesaro one


@Murderface (Y) summer is just :banderas, but eva will be showcased very soon, those 2 and renee are my girls ya know. And no the eva love isnt a gimmick, legit mark for her


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Choke2Death said:


> Finished Zayn/Cesaro 2/3 falls. Plenty of great stuff there, definitely didn't expect a tap out from a fucking headlock so that was a nice surprise. And that suicide dive like spinning DDT. :mark:


Did you see their match before the 2/3 falls one? Because the finish to it makes the headlock submission fucking tremendous :mark:.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Zayn/Cesaro 2/3 is very good, I would recommend watching zayn/swagger if you havent, also very good and not talked about as much as the cesaro one


Is that Swagger match really great or just good as in "enjoyable"? Because I'm trying to focus on the VERY best as it is.



CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Did you see their match before the 2/3 falls one? Because the finish to it makes the headlock submission fucking tremendous :mark:.


They have another one? Is it as good?

Now got done with Shield vs Super Friends from EC and another incredible match right there. Heard a lot about this Regal/Ohno match from NXT so it's next on the list. Gonna rewatch Bryan/Cesaro after it.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

They had 3 matches I think, with the 2/3 falls being the 3rd. First one is kind of a nothing match from what I remember, second is really good though, bit of a shame you didn't watch it before the 2/3 falls because like I said, the finish helps that headlock tap out look tons better.

As for the Swagger match, personally I don't get the hype. Was decent for a TV match but I don't think it comes anywhere close to the Cesaro match. Like, *** for that and then ****1/4 for the 2/3 falls.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Is that Swagger match top 25 really great or just good as in "enjoyable"? Because I'm trying to focus on the VERY best as it is.


ehhh I know kinda what you mean. i personally like it and it is in my top 15. It boils down too opinion, I know a few on here that share my opinion. I think it very good not to lengthy iirc so it wouldn't hurt. I personally have it much better than the match you are about to watch


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Fuck. Nine matches left to watch for the best of 2013. If I get to them tonight, maybe the list goes up tonight or tomorrow. If not, then Sunday night or Monday since I'm out of town this weekend. Spoiler: Bryan is all over this list.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Some other notable matches from 2013 that are worth a watch:

Team Hell No vs. The Shield
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x10c0vc#user_search=1

Daniel Bryan vs. Ryback
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x10lbva#user_search=1

Alberto Del Rio vs. Jack Swagger (yes, this was very good)
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xz6alk#user_search=1

Big Show vs. A piece of dog shit
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLNYisBoCd4

Daniel Bryan vs. Wade Barrett
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x13bc1w#user_search=1

Adrian Neville vs. Antonio Cesaro
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x12uw8w#user_search=1


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

:lmao @ Show squashing Kofi. That's not gonna be in the list, is it?


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

That Swagger/Del Rio match >>>>> their PPV ones.

Just re-watched Hell No/Kofi vs Shield. Still amazingly good.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I wrote about Show/Kofi when it happened (back when I was trying to watch EVERYTHING for the entire year and keep a list. I got to Jan 18th and gave up :lmao).

Kofi Kingston Vs The Big Show - Raw 07/01/2013 - 1/4*

Finally, a Kofi match I can look forward to. KILL HIM, SHOW!

Ha, KO punch in about 10 seconds. GOAT Kofi Match.


----------



## Jbardo (Aug 29, 2010)

Matches I currently have at ***1/2 and above for the year.

Lesner v Punk
Undertaker v Punk
Cena v Punk
Cena v Bryan
Orton v Bryan(this past raw)
Cesaro v Bryan
Rollins v Bryan
Christian v Bryan
Kofi/Kane/Bryan v The Shield
Kane/Taker/Bryan v The Shield
Ryback/Sheamus/Cena v The Shield
Goldust/Cody v Rollins/Reigns, Battleground
Cesaro v Zayn, 2/3 falls on NXT 
Orton v Goldust

Still havnt seen Ziggler v Del Rio at payback btw.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

C2D-I personally really really dug the zayn vs swagger match from NXT. It would absolutely make a top 25 for 2013 if I was making a list. Might even be top 15. It bares mentioning that I'm a huge mark for Zayn's baby face work, that dude is just AMAZING at getting sympathy. And I've always enjoyed Swaggers work for the most part. I think I gave it ***3/4 on last watch. If you have the time (it's only about 10-13 min) I'd say give it a watch. 

I'm curious how many people will have Henry/Cena Mitb on their top 25 lists. That match seems to get forgotten a bit, I personally loved it, finish aside of course.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> C2D-I personally really really dug the zayn vs swagger match from NXT. It would absolutely make a top 25 for 2013 if I was making a list. Might even be top 15. It bares mentioning that I'm a huge mark for Zayn's baby face work, that dude is just AMAZING at getting sympathy. And I've always enjoyed Swaggers work for the most part. I think I gave it ***3/4 on last watch. If you have the time (it's only about 10-13 min) I'd say give it a watch.
> 
> *I'm curious how many people will have Henry/Cena Mitb on their top 25 lists. That match seems to get forgotten a bit, I personally loved it, finish aside of course.*


:


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Cena/Henry was disappointing for me when I first watched it. Probably because I wanted Henry to win and I didn't like the whole "Cena can't lift him" angle. However I've liked it more and more since.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Zayn vs Swagger is brilliant. Easily on part w/the Cesaro matches.

oh and Orton vs Edge from Vengeance 2004 is still really, really good too. Match is all about the little things. Appreciate that. Orton's slow pacing is fine by me. It gave it something different compared to every other match you could see. Even from their other matches later on in the year too.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Zack Gowen & Stephanie McMahon vs. Big Show: ***1/4


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I was one happy youngster when Gowen got the three count that night.

Alrighty, Benoit vs Triple H time. Lets see if this is more Benoit quality than Triple H quality. I'm not too sure. Never minded the end w/Eugene so that's already working in my favor. It still could hinder things from being considered "noteworthy". That's the entertainment aspect Vince adores so much taking over..


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Benoit/HHH from Vengeance went down the last time I gave it a rewatch. Felt like it never really took off in the first half then the Eugene nonsense followed which brought it down for me. It's my least favorite of their excellent series from Benoit's run on Raw in 04-05.



Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> C2D-I personally really really dug the zayn vs swagger match from NXT. It would absolutely make a top 25 for 2013 if I was making a list. Might even be top 15. It bares mentioning that I'm a huge mark for Zayn's baby face work, that dude is just AMAZING at getting sympathy. And I've always enjoyed Swaggers work for the most part. I think I gave it ***3/4 on last watch. If you have the time (it's only about 10-13 min) I'd say give it a watch.
> 
> I'm curious how many people will have Henry/Cena Mitb on their top 25 lists. That match seems to get forgotten a bit, I personally loved it, finish aside of course.


Alright, I don't have anything to lose so I'll give it a chance.

Henry/Cena was good but I think it'll just miss making the cut.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Zack Gowen & Stephanie McMahon vs. Big Show: ***1/4


Is that the one where Angle and Brock interfere followed by Gowen getting that giant pop when he pins Show after a moonsault? Funny how about a month later Gowen would be brutalized by BORK mercilessly.

Sucks that Smackdown had to abide by the "PG rules" from 2004 onwards because they burned so many bridges with Cena's raps and how casually they used blood.


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

Speaking of Benoit/HHH, I recently found out there was another triple threat between HHH/HBK/Benoit at Backlash of the same year. Is it worth my time?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Absolutely. Not quite as good as the WMXX match IMO, but still GREAT.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I've not been able to watch the BL triple threat all the way through in YEARS. Only thing I remember is them making a tribute/teasing the fuck out of the 97 screwjob lol.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Bryan/Cesaro is over now. The uppercut battle is fucking epic. I don't care if Cesaro is "boring" on the mic, he should turn face at the end of the Real Americans stable and get a main event push next year. He deserves it.



Arm-Bar1004 said:


> Speaking of Benoit/HHH, I recently found out there was another triple threat between HHH/HBK/Benoit at Backlash of the same year. Is it worth my time?


It's nearly as good as WM20, some could argue that it's even better. Definitely worth the time.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Backlash Triple Threat is the second best WHC match ever and has Lawler's best moment in commentary.

C2D do you like Cesaro?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Benoit vs Triple H is as mediocre as holy high heavens. At least that PPV gave me Kane vs Hardy & Orton vs Edge.

List of 2004 PPV goodies: (so far)



Spoiler: what did I just say?



*Royal Rumble* - 2/6
Rey Mysterio vs Jamie Noble
Royal Rumble Match

*No Way Out* - 4/7
World's Greatest Tag Team vs APA
Rey Mysterio vs Chavo Guerrero Jr.
Big Show vs John Cena vs Kurt Angle
Brock Lesnar vs Eddie Guerrero

*WrestleMania 20* - 6/12
Big Show vs John Cena
Rob Van Dam & Booker T vs Dudley Boys vs La Resistance vs Garrison Cade & Mark Jindrak
Chris Jericho vs Christian
Rock N' Sock vs Evolution
The Undertaker vs Kane
Chris Benoit vs Shawn Michaels vs Triple H

*Backlash* - 4/8
Ric Flair vs Shelton Benjamin
Chris Jericho vs Christian & Trish Stratus
Mick Foley vs Randy Orton
Chris Benoit vs Shawn Michaels vs Triple H

*Judgment Day* - 3/8
Rob Van Dam & Rey Mysterio vs Dudley Boys
John Cena vs Rene Dupree
Eddie Guerrero vs John Bradshaw Layfield _(MOTY)_

*Bad Blood* - 4/7
Chris Jericho vs Tyson Tomko
Randy Orton vs Shelton Benjamin
Trish Stratus vs Lita vs Victoria vs Gail Kim
Chris Benoit vs Kane

*Great American Bash* - 2/8
Rey Mysterio vs Chavo Guerrero Jr.
Eddie Guerrero vs John Bradshaw Layfield

*Vengeance* - 2/7
Kane vs Matt Hardy
Randy Orton vs Edge


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Damn, soooo many medicore to shitty matches on that list dude!


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

I need to re-watch Bryan/Cesaro. I have it really high on my list, but I didn't actually watch most of the stuff on there recently (just threw them on the list from my All-time list I've been adding stuff to throughout the year). Hell, I'll give it a watch now.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Damn, soooo many medicore to shitty matches on that list dude!


Nope. Maybe the four way tag from WM, b/c it's nothing too special, but I don't mind it.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I'd add Benoit/HHH to the 2004 PPV goodies along with Eddie/Angle from WM. Some stuff I don't care for but the good stuff are there otherwise.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Backlash Triple Threat is the second best WHC match ever and has Lawler's best moment in commentary.
> 
> C2D do you like Cesaro?


It'd probably be #3 for me after WM20 triple threat and Angle/Taker from NWO. The crowd is epic for that Backlash match. Just a classic and an example of how perfectly they booked Benoit from Survivor Series all the way until the Raw when he faced HBK for the title. They gave him everything he worked for and fully deserved, such a feel good chapter in the WWE history. (making everyone tap out, double champion, won Rumble, main evented WM)

As for Cesaro, he's not a favorite of mine but that's not quite fair since he's never been given the chance with good booking to become one. But I _do_ like him, he's wonderful in the ring and his strength is unbelievable. Looking forward to a proper World Title push for him in the next year or two. Him, Rhodes and Shield are up and comers that I really look forward to seeing rise to the top. Ryback could've been something but they murdered him. The main event scene would have been so much more diverse if they could book properly for a change.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> Bryan/Cesaro is over now. The uppercut battle is fucking epic. I don't care if Cesaro is "boring" on the mic, he should turn face at the end of the Real Americans stable and get a main event push next year. He deserves it.


Ironically, I just rewatched that for the first time the other night. Very LEGIT match.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Eddie vs Angle is one of the biggest piles of crap seen in 2004. And now I'm about to see their SummerSlam match. Angle and his shitty means knows no bounds. God, he's awful.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well at least we agree on one thing from 04 Cody


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I was surprised by how much better Eddie/Angle was when I rewatched it a few weeks ago. First time I was so bored that I didn't ever wanna see it again and giving it an above average rating was out of generosity. Second watch and I actually enjoyed it. Maybe their SummerSlam match results in an opinion turn around if I rewatch it?

Make no mistakes about it, their best match is still 14/4/2005 on Smackdown.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I didn't mind the SummerSlam match at all. Great crowd, too.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

SummerSlam match is the worst of the worst. I had better wrestling matches on a beach in Greece when I was like 6 and I'd dig a square moat and smash rocks against each other because I didn't have any wrestling toys with me.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

:lmao @ Cal. I don't like Angle/Eddie PPV matches at all, and I'm a huge mark for both.

Was Bryan vs. Sheamus from July 8th RAW any good? I've only seen it once and I remember nothing other than the ending. Thought I might ask since everyone's putting together their giant lists


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> I was surprised by how much better Eddie/Angle was when I rewatched it a few weeks ago. First time I was so bored that I didn't ever wanna see it again and giving it an above average rating was out of generosity. Second watch and I actually enjoyed it. Maybe their SummerSlam match results in an opinion turn around if I rewatch it?
> 
> Make no mistakes about it, their best match is still 14/4/2005 on Smackdown.


As much as I love Eddie, I just can't enjoy the Summerslam match he had with Angle. It's just flat BAD, no other way around it. The WM match is okay, but still a massive dissapointment. I think Mania got ***1/4 from me on last watch, Summerslam struggles to get even **.

That said, good mention on the Smackdown match from 2005, I felt that one was a real gem. Booked and worked wonderfully. The 2/3 Falls match from 2004 also warrants mentioning, as that was a Damn good bout too. How much better would WM20 have been if Eddie faced Brock there and won the title instead of a month before at NWO? That could have vaulted 20 into to the top 2-3 PPv's ever conversation. Oh well. Atleast we still got that confetti ending, still my favorite moment in all of wrestling.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

2/3 falls is my fav Eddie/Angle match. First fall is the funnest thing ever.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

CAL, have you seen the 2005 match? If not, it's definitely worth it and gives the 2/3 falls a run for its money for the best Eddie/Angle match.



Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> As much as I love Eddie, I just can't enjoy the Summerslam match he had with Angle. It's just flat BAD, no other way around it. The WM match is okay, but still a massive dissapointment. I think Mania got ***1/4 from me on last watch, Summerslam struggles to get even **.
> 
> That said, good mention on the Smackdown match from 2005, I felt that one was a real gem. Booked and worked wonderfully. The 2/3 Falls match from 2004 also warrants mentioning, as that was a Damn good bout too. How much better would WM20 have been if Eddie faced Brock there and won the title instead of a month before at NWO? That could have vaulted 20 into to the top 2-3 PPv's ever conversation. Oh well. Atleast we still got that confetti ending, still my favorite moment in all of wrestling.


It would have been epic if Eddie and Chris had both won their respective titles on the same night. Would've added even more to an already epic ending. That said, I'm happy with how it turned out so the moments don't overshadow each other and highlight two different events.

Eddie vs Angle was impossible to fail on paper so it's understandable why they booked it along with the big man clash Brock/Goldberg. The former mostly gets mixed reactions with some who like it and others who were disappointed while the latter is pretty much a flat out DUD. Still, the Wolverine worked his ass off to make that event a memorable one so bless him.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Seen it, don't think it's special. Solid, so like, their second best match ever, but I much much much much much much much prefer the 2/3 falls matcharoonie.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Well at least we agree on one thing from 04 Cody


Well that list is basically filled w/all the PPV matches I don't hate or find utter crap so I'm surprised there isn't more we agree on. 8*D

Like so far SummerSlam hasn't been good, but I honestly don't mind the six man or Kane vs Hardy _(I mean it's not "good", but something about it I don't particularly hate or anything)_ so they might make my list just b/c. Maybe I should just stick w/a top ten or the matches that REALLY matter. Ha.

Oh jesus christ. Eddie vs Angle is on next. :ti

why did Angle win this match clean if the story behind it was to see if Eddie could beat him w/o cheating? Awful.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

As I'm doing my list, there is one guys name that interesting popping up : Jack Swagger


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

b/c Swagger is fantastic.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yea Swagg is the goods, also not that I'm suprised but :cena2 is on here ALOT

you can make a case Cena is the worker of the year


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> b/c Swagger is fantastic.


You speak the truth. I don't understand the hate he receives. He's not a good worker, he's a GREAT worker, his stuff looks legitimate, and if he is given an opponent that can handle their stuff he almost always delivers a good-great match. To be honest, as much as I love/enjoy the Real Americans, I can't wait to see the matches Swagger and Cesar will have if they are booked a proper break up/resulting feud. 

Does anyone know when the he'll Christian is coming back? I feel like he and Sheamus have been gone for YEARS.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Christian has the concussion + just had a kid hence all his time away, but who knows, a RR return might be on the cards for him.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> You speak the truth. I don't understand the hate he receives. He's not a good worker, he's a GREAT worker, his stuff looks legitimate, and if he is given an opponent that can handle their stuff he almost always delivers a good-great match. To be honest, as much as I love/enjoy the Real Americans, I can't wait to see the matches Swagger and Cesar will have if they are booked a proper break up/resulting feud.
> 
> Does anyone know when the he'll Christian is coming back? I feel like he and Sheamus have been gone for YEARS.


(Y)

Most of the comments on him that are negative are some of the dumbest ever uttered. It's usually about his face being comical or having a lisp. Umm.

He's also probably the guy who takes some of the hardest shots in every match. Legit every single match - long or short, big or insignificant - he always takes a gnarly shot to the face/jaw. Check it. The back elbow he took at TLC = YIKES.



CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Christian has the concussion + just had a kid hence all his time away, but who knows, a RR return might be on the cards for him.


Ahhhh. This makes some more sense.

--------

Eugene vs Trips from SummerSlam is still a fun match. The Triple H antics here are ones I don't mind. They seem to work & not be all obnoxious trying to be an 80's heel and failing like usual. Even better w/his opponent being "mentally slow" so he'll buy into the shenanigans. Punches here weren't amazing, but they fit the context. This didn't need to be a wrestling match. It needed to be more about the high impact considering the hate was pretty much the central focus. Eugene was pretty good here too. Dinsmore always had talent as far as being a solid in ring guy. The sleeperhold sequence in this was a bit pointless, but one drawback aspect coming from a Triple H match is a real positive considering the usual curve. Flair & Regal interactions, albeit brief, aided in making this enjoyable. Flair's reactions to getting ejected = massive positives every time.

Undertaker vs JBL upcoming. I remember zero about this pardon the lazy finish. I think Cal likes it. _(not shocked)_ but I wonder if that's general Undertaker bias b/c he's the best or if this is actually good. I'll know in about twenty minutes.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

It's two big TEXANS punching each other in the face a bunch of times. Tis legitimately awesome. Too bad the crowd were dumb cunts.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The crowd was hilarious for that Taker/JBL. It was the original Orton/Sheamus with the crowd paying attention to everything except the match. lol @ the random Spanish table chant and when Cole (or Tazz?) says they are trying to help Taker back into it by doing the wave.

At least they were respectable for the main event and that's all that matters!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> It's two big TEXANS punching each other in the face a bunch of times. Tis legitimately awesome. Too bad the crowd were dumb cunts.


This is accurate. Fans were shitheads. Wished Taker threw them through their cars b/c of the nonsense. Match was still good. Pacing between the two was absurd. It was 88 miles per hour for 17 minutes w/two HUGE dudes. Awesome.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

*Top 25 WWE Matches in 2013:*

(★★★¾)
25. Alberto Del Rio vs Christian - SummerSlam
24. Christian vs Randy Orton vs Rob Van Dam - Smackdown, 28 July
23. Randy Orton vs Goldust - Raw, 9 September
22. Antonio Cesaro vs Dolph Ziggler - Main Event, 10 July
21. CM Punk vs Ryback (TLC) - Raw, 7 January
20. Randy Orton vs Antonio Cesaro - Main Event, 8 May
19. Rob Van Dam vs Chris Jericho - Raw, 15 July
18. Team Hell No & Randy Orton vs The Shield - Smackdown, 14 June
17. Money in the Bank Ladder Match (WWE Championship) - MITB
16. John Cena vs Damien Sandow - Raw, 28 October
15. Team Hell No & Randy Orton vs The Shield - Raw, 3 June
14. Daniel Bryan vs Randy Orton (Street Fight) - Raw, 24 June
13. Money in the Bank Ladder Match (World Heavyweight Championship) - MITB
12. Team Hell No & Undertaker vs The Shield - Raw, 22 April
(★★★★)
11. Antonio Cesaro vs Sami Zayn (2 out of 3 falls) - NXT, 21 August
10. Daniel Bryan vs Antonio Cesaro - Raw, 22 July
9. Cody Rhodes & Goldust vs The Shield - Battleground
8. The Shield vs John Cena, Ryback & Sheamus - Elimination Chamber
7. Alberto Del Rio vs Dolph Ziggler - Payback
6. Brock Lesnar vs Triple H (Steel Cage) - Extreme Rules
5. Randy Orton vs Daniel Bryan - Raw, 16 December
4. John Cena vs CM Punk - Raw, 25 February
(★★★★¼)
3. Undertaker vs CM Punk - Wrestlemania XXVIII
2. Daniel Bryan vs John Cena - SummerSlam
(★★★★½)
1. Brock Lesnar vs CM Punk - SummerSlam​


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Eddie/Angle at SummerSlam is completely disgusting and I do not put all of the blame on Angle. Eddie's worst performance ever.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

The promo for the Summerslam match is great though. 

"... But what if I can?..."


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> Eddie/Angle at SummerSlam is completely disgusting and I do not put all of the blame on Angle. Eddie's worst performance ever.


That's what happens when you let Angle do 90% of the offense. You could tell Eddie was at a loss on what in the hell to do to counteract the nothingness Angle produced. Shit at every turn.

And after watching both I have the opinion: Benoit vs Orton post-SummerSlam '04 RAW > match @ SummerSlam '04.


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> You speak the truth. I don't understand the hate he receives. He's not a good worker, he's a GREAT worker, his stuff looks legitimate, and if he is given an opponent that can handle their stuff he almost always delivers a good-great match. To be honest, as much as I love/enjoy the Real Americans, I can't wait to see the matches Swagger and Cesar will have if they are booked a proper break up/resulting feud.
> 
> Does anyone know when the he'll Christian is coming back? I feel like he and Sheamus have been gone for YEARS.


I think the two reason are that Swagger's character has been pretty bland and stale for a long time, this is partly because of booking and partly because of his mic work, and because some people think he's unsafe. I remember him having a match with Riley where there was a botched suplex that looked like it hurt Riley and a lot of people blamed Swagger. This happened about a week after another botched moved Swagger performed that looked dangerous.



Yeah1993 said:


> Eddie/Angle at SummerSlam is completely disgusting and I do not put all of the blame on Angle. Eddie's worst performance ever.


Poor Eddie was really hurt around this time. Real shame no one thought to take action.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Mic work? Is everyone Pyro now?


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

NotoriousTCG said:


> The promo for the Summerslam match is great though.
> 
> "... But what if I can?..."


I liked that too until he cheats to win.  Ugh, horrible match. Just a horrible trainwreck of a match.



Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> And after watching both I have the opinion: Benoit vs Orton post-SummerSlam '04 RAW > match @ SummerSlam '04.


I've only watched the Raw match once but I thought it smooooked SummerSlam.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

His promo when he was WHC where he was booed like crazy was great. And I laughed so much when he sang the national anthem in Mexico.

Nice list C2D. All those matches made my list, but one of them is like 70 rankings lower. Where's the second Rhodes/Shield match?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It actually does. Not sure the theory behind why the next night the same two dudes gave a better overall match w/overall better performances, but they did. Benoit killing Orton's knee + the way he sells it is gold.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

C2D, have you watched the Rhodes/Goldust/Cena vs Sandow/Swagger/Cesaro matches from Smackdown and Raw in October? Both were really good, imo. Wasn't sure if you hadn't seen them or if they just didn't make the cut. Awesome list though.


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

funnyfaces1 said:


> His promo when he was WHC where he was booed like crazy was great. And I laughed so much when he sang the national anthem in Mexico.


I liked Swagger's WHC run, though he was booked like a bitch (like most MITB winners are). I also think he's overly criticized for his mic work/lisp, but it is what it is. Swagger was booked as a midcard jobber for a long time and that's probably how people are going to view him unless he does something huge.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

If people are that easily convinced by WWE's booking, them my pity has reached a new level.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

I'm wondering if anyone could point me in the direction of decent/great Big Boss Man matches. Doesn't matter what time period or company.


----------



## Chiller88 (May 21, 2005)

SpookshowTony said:


> I'm wondering if anyone could point me in the direction of decent/great Big Boss Man matches. Doesn't matter what time period or company.







1:39:28

It's been a few years since I've seen it, but I remember it being really good.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Kennel From Hell Match 8*D


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Re-watched TLC '11 and TLC'12. Both are entertaining PPV's, I enjoyed the crowd particularly in TLC '12.

TLC '11: Punk VS Del Rio VS Miz was a fun match, as were Cody Rhodes VS Booker T, and Dolph Ziggler VS Zack Ryder

TLC '12: Liked Rhodes Scholars VS Sin Cara and Rey, Shield VS Hell No/Ryback, and Ziggler VS Cena

Ziggler VS Cena is criticized a lot on here, but I enjoyed it, probably more due to the atmosphere than anything else.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

SpookshowTony said:


> I'm wondering if anyone could point me in the direction of decent/great Big Boss Man matches. Doesn't matter what time period or company.


Vader match Chiller posted is must-watch. Hogan cages are all good. I haven't seen them myself, but I've heard his series with the Barbarian around 1991 rock. Tenta at GAB 96 is super but the crowd couldn't give a fuck. Shitheads. And then........

https://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=1586567070087

.....this match is unreal.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Chiller88 said:


> 1:39:28
> 
> It's been a few years since I've seen it, but I remember it being really good.


I think I remember people talking about this. Thanks (Y).





A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Kennel From Hell Match 8*D


:lol
:argh: I remember seeing this multiple times. Not that I wanted to, I'd just watch the PPV over and over again.


*Edit @Yeah*: Awesomeness.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

> I remember seeing this multiple times. Not that I wanted to, I'd just watch the PPV over and over again.


I don't know how anyone can watch that match numerous times.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Big Bubba vs Alex Wright from WCW Saturday Night sometime in 1995. It's on youtube. Easy to find.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Big Bubba vs Alex Wright from WCW Saturday Night sometime in 1995. It's on youtube. Easy to find.




Bookmarked (Y)


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Oh shoot. Watch this awesome gem too:

Ray Traylor vs Scott Steiner - Nitro 3/16/98


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

When and why did people start hating Eddie/Angle WM20?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

b/c it's horseshit.


----------



## Saint Dick (Jan 21, 2006)

What's bad about it?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Saint Dick said:


> What's bad about it?


What I wrote on it a month ago:



Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Guerrero vs Angle from WM 20 is awful. Perhaps not SummerSlam '04 awful, but it's not far off. Only positive take aways were:
> 
> Eddie have a few brief moments of being superior during the pointless opening "feeling out" process which was only done to kill five minutes b/c there was no format to the match whatsoever. Angle's mat wrestling for no real reason but fuck all sucked, but Eddie managed to have some intricaies chucked in which shout off the top of a mountain _"I'M WAY BETTER THAN YOU, KURT, BUT I'LL ONLY SHOW YOU UP IN A SUBTLE WAY B/C THIS SUCKS."_ Why all caps? That originally started shorter. I don't even know why there was a feeling out process to begin with. Build showed Angle was furious at Eddie for portraying a champion in a negative light. So he beat the shit out of him weeks in a row. Match happens and he wants to WRESTLE him? Asinine. Strike one. Stupid Angle and his need to show off his mat wrestling grappling in so many matches that don't call for it. We get it, you're good on the ground in amateur style. Sadly, pardon the nuggets of something good it wasn't as if Eddie made this much better. Although the positives all came from him. btw Tazz creaming himself during this shit was the dirt worst. He's better off commentating Divas matches. That's a callback to prior on this event. Just saying.
> 
> ...


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

JoseDRiveraTCR7 said:


> I liked Swagger's WHC run, though he was booked like a bitch (like most MITB winners are). I also think he's overly criticized for his mic work/lisp, but it is what it is. Swagger was booked as a midcard jobber for a long time and that's probably how people are going to view him unless he does something huge.





JoseDRiveraTCR7 said:


> I think the two reason are that Swagger's character has been pretty bland and stale for a long time, this is partly because of booking and partly because of his mic work, and because some people think he's unsafe. I remember him having a match with Riley where there was a botched suplex that looked like it hurt Riley and a lot of people blamed Swagger. This happened about a week after another botched moved Swagger performed that looked dangerous.
> .


 well said. Right now he is where he should be but he should never become world champion. Was a big mistake handing him the title first time round and weird giving him a shot at mania considering he was a jobber beforehand. Thf, it had the potential to be a great angle but his arrest ruined it. If they stick him with zeb then thats fine.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Mic work? Is everyone Pyro now?


:lmao



funnyfaces1 said:


> Nice list C2D. All those matches made my list, but one of them is like 70 rankings lower. Where's the second Rhodes/Shield match?


Will be interesting to see which one that is. Is that the match where the Rhodes brothers won the titles? If so, I wasn't too crazy about that. Good match but BG is where it's at.



Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> It actually does. Not sure the theory behind why the next night the same two dudes gave a better overall match w/overall better performances, but they did. Benoit killing Orton's knee + the way he sells it is gold.


I think it's because they worked two totally different matches. For SummerSlam they took a slow paced mat-wrestling approach but in the rematch they went all out and Benoit just straight up destroyed Orton for a large portion of it. I rate SS higher so it depends on what you prefer. Rematch is killer, though.



Dominick The Donkey said:


> C2D, have you watched the Rhodes/Goldust/Cena vs Sandow/Swagger/Cesaro matches from Smackdown and Raw in October? Both were really good, imo. Wasn't sure if you hadn't seen them or if they just didn't make the cut. Awesome list though.


Yes, I have. Specially enjoyed the Raw match with the awesome finishing stretch. I have checked out everything that has been heavily praised (including Swagger/Zayn now) so I don't think I missed anything relevant.



A William Murderface Christmas said:


> I don't know how anyone can watch that match numerous times.


I don't think I can even watch it once.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I don't mean to alarm anyone, but I just found this on YouTube:

http://youtu.be/hoW7MaOCTEQ

***** Casas & Eddie Guerrero vs Chris Benoit & Finlay from Japan.

Holy shit I hope this is good, it sounds AMAZING.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Going to post the first part of my list later today I think


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

I gotta re-watch Eddie/Angle WM 20. I remember liking it but but it's been years and my taste in wrestling has changed drastically. 

Oh and I re-watched Lesnar/Eddie NWO a few months ago. For some reason, it just didn't hold up like it once did. Thoughts?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

*Top 25 Matches of 2013 Part 1 (#25-20)
*​Ok gonna break this into parts because gonna write abit and its will just look better

*HN: Sheamus vs Jack Swagger Main Event 7/13 

25) Goldust vs Randy Orton raw 8/13

24) Cm Punk vs Dean Ambrose sd 12/13

23) Shield vs Kofi Kingston and team hell no 5/13 raw

22) Alberto Del Rio vs Big Show sd 1/13

21) Cm Punk vs Ryback tlc raw 1/13

20) Alberto Del Rio vs John Cena HIAC​*


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I hope we get a MOTYC on Raw so it screws up your list .


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

yea I fear that abit, just looked at the calender we still have 2 raws and 2 sd, doubt anything on sd with overtake anything although this friday sd has a match that could be good but probably wont. I'll probably wait it out a little. I wont be on here that much this weekend


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Not gonna spoil who or the results, but I will say the last SD of the year will have a few good match-ups that could potentially make a list (obviously I haven't seen any of them yet, but based on the participants, they could be great). So if you haven't done a list already, I'd recommend waiting out until after seeing that show.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

sharkboy22 said:


> I gotta re-watch Eddie/Angle WM 20. I remember liking it but but it's been years and my taste in wrestling has changed drastically.
> 
> Oh and I re-watched Lesnar/Eddie NWO a few months ago. For some reason, it just didn't hold up like it once did. Thoughts?


Thoughts? You're freaking crazy 

Nah but seriously what in the world is there not to like about that match? Eddie is the perfect baby face under dog in that match, and Lesnar is probably the best pure heel worker there has ever been. Everything,ffrom the pacing, the execution, Lesnar's control segments, Eddie's comebacks, the finish, was damn near perfect. When Lesnar gets frustrated with Eddie in the end and bellows "JUST DIE EDDIE! GIVE UP LIKE YOU ALWAYS DO!" it is just a powerful, powerful, moment. Even Cole was in top form calling the match, with the classic " Eddie Guerrero has a new high in life!". I don't think it quite reached 5 star territory, but it got ****3/4 from me on last watch, and I've seen several other people rate it the same. Outside of the 2 classics with Rey from Halloween Havoc and Smackdown, and JD with JBL, think it's probably Eddie's finest match.

What about it didn't hold up for you? Just curious.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

From what I've read from the spoilers, on the last edition of Smackdown 2013 we might have another MOTY or 2 contneders


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

Who the fuck were MNM bumped off for at WM22, Boogeyman?


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

:lmao at the crazy people in the general WWE section. I keep saying I'll never post in there again but I always end up getting annoyed and doing it anyway.

This time, someone posted in the "JBL or Triple H: Who was better in 04-05?" That "Both had crappy matches and sucked in the ring but I'm gonna say Triple H cause I like him better". So I replied by listing the great matches JBL had during his run with the caveat "JBL vs Eddie at Judgment Day is a top 5 match in WWE history in my opinion, better then anything Triple H did during his reign". This guy replies that I'm an idiot for thinking that and promptly lists 10 matches he thinks are better, including the WrestleMania 12 IronMan, Rock/Hogan, and the triangle ladder from WM2000:lmao

People. I swear. Why does everyone insist on stating their opinion as indisputable fact and that anyone who disagrees is stupid? Is this a wrestling only phenomenon or does it occur on every forum?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Happens on all forums . My brother was telling me about a similar incident on a running forum he's on lol. THOSE CRAZY OPINIONATED RUNNERS!!!

I think I'm gonna watch some stuff for the top 100 matches of the 80's poll, which I fully intend on actually finishing unlike the 00's one. Might start with my BOB BACKLUND comp.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Happens on all forums . My brother was telling me about a similar incident on a running forum he's on lol. THOSE CRAZY OPINIONATED RUNNERS!!!
> 
> I think I'm gonna watch some stuff for the top 100 matches of the 80's poll, which I fully intend on actually finishing unlike the 00's one. Might start with my BOB BACKLUND comp.


Dude. A running forum? Don't get me wrong I go to the gym and try to take care of myself, but I just can't conceive of what people can discuss about running. Do people create threads like "Today I went running......it was sweet...I jogged 2 miles in 13 minutes, I give that jog ***1/2" and people reply "No way bro, you're stupid, 2 miles in 13 minutes is a **3/4 jog AT BEST". "No, your stupid, you didn't see the build to that jog, I ate 1 bowl of oatmeal and listened to Eye of the Tiger while lacing up my Nike's, plus my jog had great psychology and told a good story of a man running by himself." "Dude, that sounds like a Jog of the Year Conteder!! Im adding it to my list!":lmao

P.s. Cal, when are we getting another rant video? Kofi Kingston is so jealous of Miz and Barrett and thinks you forgot about his epic endeavours inside the squared circle.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well it's more than just running, it's Fell Running, which involves running up mountains and shit, so they have routes and mountains and all that to talk about, plus organised runs and shit, and then gear and equipment that they use. Won't be long before you'll be able to buy running gear from ME! Come January I'll be selling MMA stuff!

Another rant video? Well... probably in Jan. Right now on my board (I have a cork board with my video scheduled on it above my monitor lol) I have 8 videos that will take me to the 6th of Jan, then I'll be taking a break from my weekly show (end of the season... EPISODE 100!!!!!!!!!!), and during the break I'll be doing smaller videos (wrestling and non wrestling) and no doubt some rants will be included . But I also wanna do some positive videos too. Like, top 5 reasons TERRY FUCKING FUNK rules the planet or something. In fact, yeah, I'm doing a top 5 reasons TERRY FUCKING FUNK rules the planet in Jan .


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

All this pro-talk of Eddie/JBL from JD makes their GAB sequel look like shit. It wasn't though, probably like **** or ****1/4, gotta love that callback spot.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah their GAB is still a great fucking match, but JD is just worlds above it so it looks terrible in comparison lol.

Which is kinda like any match ever when I compare them to Undertaker Vs HBK HIAC .


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

Even Bret/Austin WM13?


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> P.s. Cal, when are we getting another rant video? Kofi Kingston is so jealous of Miz and Barrett and thinks you forgot about his epic endeavours inside the squared circle.


This. Those videos are better than videos of Cal playing Futurama, no offense Cal. :lol



CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> But I also wanna do some positive videos too. Like, top 5 reasons TERRY FUCKING FUNK rules the planet or something. In fact, yeah, I'm doing a top 5 reasons TERRY FUCKING FUNK rules the planet in Jan .


Top 5 reasons why you're such a big Taker mark?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

MyNameIsJonMarston said:


> Even Bret/Austin WM13?


Yep. All other ***** matches look like shit compared to HIAC to me lol. HIAC stands alone on top of the mountain with nothing coming close to it.

Hey! That Futurama video was just a parody of another video I saw, wasn't meant to be serious or even good. Plus I was just testing out my recording facilities since I switched to Windows 8. Been a right pain in the arse finding a program that will let me record video with SOUND lol. And in widecreen when needed . 

Top 5 reasons I'm such a mark for big mark is a video I plan on doing at some point in time, but not right now.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Everything looks like shit compared to the Taker/HBK HiaC match and Taker/HBK from WM25. I'm sure a Steamboat/Savage match can fit in there as well


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Only one of those matches fits in there, and it's the one I said .


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Of course


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Well it's more than just running, it's Fell Running, which involves running up mountains and shit, so they have routes and mountains and all that to talk about, plus organised runs and shit, and then gear and equipment that they use. Won't be long before you'll be able to buy running gear from ME! Come January I'll be selling MMA stuff!
> 
> Another rant video? Well... probably in Jan. Right now on my board (I have a cork board with my video scheduled on it above my monitor lol) I have 8 videos that will take me to the 6th of Jan, then I'll be taking a break from my weekly show (end of the season... EPISODE 100!!!!!!!!!!), and during the break I'll be doing smaller videos (wrestling and non wrestling) and no doubt some rants will be included . But I also wanna do some positive videos too. Like, top 5 reasons TERRY FUCKING FUNK rules the planet or something. In fact, yeah, I'm doing a top 5 reasons TERRY FUCKING FUNK rules the planet in Jan .


If Terry's gorgeous left hook/punch and his promos arent in the top 5 I will be one unhappy customer. Nobody throws a better punch than the Funker, nobody. Also, nobody made it easier to suspend your disbelief and suck you into a story than Terry. Que his "bastard" promo on Lawler from the 80's, or that promo he did in Florida were he poured motor oil all over himself in the shower. God love me some FUNK. 

I will now go watch his FCA match with Cactus on Raw. Or maybe his 1981 No DQ against Lawler.

If I could have any two matches in the history of wrestling on blu ray, they would be that No DQ match with Lawler and the Landover house show steamboat/flair. It sucks having to watch them in such awful quality.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Philly match > Landover match from the same night. But I'd rather have Flair/Windham BOTB II in awesome quality since its like, worlds better than either of those 2 matches.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Philly match > Landover match from the same night. But I'd rather have Flair/Windham BOTB II in awesome quality since its like, worlds better than either of those 2 matches.


The video I have of the Botb 2 match is actually pretty decent quality, especially for something shot in the 80s. I said those 2 matches because they were the best ones I can think of that have the worst quality. I cant make out the dudes expressions inthe videos I have have of those matches, but Flair/Windham s quality was fine I thought.


I agree with your sentiment about Botb2> just about everything. I've been bugging Skins for like a month now tks get off his ass and watch it, since Flair is his guy and I think this is Flair best match ever.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Probably gonna start Unforgiven 04 today that means I get to watch that opener :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Willing to take a match request if i have it. 

*I'm not 'back' to uploading per say, but one now and again*


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Willing to take a match request if i have it.
> 
> *I'm not 'back' to uploading per say, but one now and again*


Paul London vs Billy Kidman No Mercy 04.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Great match, IMO.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Paul London vs Billy Kidman No Mercy 04.


Will upload tomorrow


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Will upload tomorrow


:mark:

What show is better from 2008, Judgment Day, Cyber Sunday or Armageddon.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> I agree with your sentiment about Botb2> just about everything. I've been bugging Skins for like a month now tks get off his ass and watch it, since Flair is his guy and I think this is Flair best match ever.


I will brother I will, best naitch match ever ? high praise is an understandment


Anybody see wwe top 25 match list ? :ti bless their hearts


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> :mark:
> 
> What show is better from 2008, Judgment Day, Cyber Sunday or Armageddon.


I'd go Cyber Sunday. Show/Taker is awesome, Rey/Kane is solid, Jeff/Taker is pretty good. Forgot about Batista/Jericho, don't remember much there. Hardy/Bourne is good too, iirc.

Armageddon has Punk/Rey, Jericho/Cena and Edge/Jeff/HHH though. Plus Finlay/Henry Belfast Brawl.


----------



## Certified G (Feb 1, 2011)

Has anyone here seen the Memphis Heat documentary? I'm about 30 minutes in, very interesting so far. I've read big pieces on Memphis in the Observer but to hear these guys talk about it and to see footage is great.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Paul London vs Billy Kidman No Mercy 04.


It's on YouTube bro:






I miss Billy Kidman. :sad:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

^^ Thought it may be, saves me uploading I guess.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I liked the WWE top 25 list :side:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*looks at WWE's top 25 matches of 2013 list*

*sees Miz Vs Barrett at #25. Gives up*


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> *looks at WWE's top 25 matches of 2013 list*
> 
> *sees Miz Vs Barrett at #25. Gives up*


:lmao

Exactly what I thought. Then they had the wrong HHH/Brock match there (I know Cal hates the best one they had - ER) and if an Orton/Bryan match should've been there, it was the match they had this week.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I gave the rest of the list a look, and aside from like, 8 of the first 10 matches, it's pretty good. I'd change the order around aside from the #1 match, but overall good for wwe.com. But damn, 25-15 or so were just BAD outside of like 2 matches .


----------



## WrestlingOracle (Jul 6, 2013)

I haven't watched any PWG, but Super Dragon's moveset intrigues me and I wonder how well he works so if someone could direct give me some of the best of Super Dragon I would appreciate it.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

You might have better luck asking here http://www.wrestlingforum.com/other...cial-indy-dvd-discussion-thread-new-post.html


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> I'd go Cyber Sunday. Show/Taker is awesome, Rey/Kane is solid, Jeff/Taker is pretty good. Forgot about Batista/Jericho, don't remember much there. Hardy/Bourne is good too, iirc.
> 
> Armageddon has Punk/Rey, Jericho/Cena and Edge/Jeff/HHH though. Plus Finlay/Henry Belfast Brawl.


I would assume the best order would be Cyber Sunday, Armageddon, Judgment Day correct?


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> I would assume the best order would be Cyber Sunday, Armageddon, Judgment Day correct?


Yep. 

Wasn't all that big on JD '08 but there's a couple good matches on there.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> I don't mean to alarm anyone, but I just found this on YouTube:
> 
> http://youtu.be/hoW7MaOCTEQ
> 
> ...


All it's missing is La Parka on one side & Regal on the other.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> Yep.
> 
> Wasn't all that big on JD '08 but there's a couple good matches on there.


Makes sense why Cyber Sunday was the most expensive out of the 3


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

It amazes me that I found Backlash '09 for 60 cents. One of my favorite shows and it was ridiculously cheap.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Lets hope that's w/o any lousy shipping charges. That's how they get ya. 8*D


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> It amazes me that I found Backlash '09 for 60 cents. One of my favorite shows and it was ridiculously cheap.


I paid full price 

But I do love that show as well, 2009 was a fun year.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Only 2.00 for shipping. 

I liked '09's PPVs a lot. Loved Smackdown, ECW & Superstars too. It's just Raw that was a real weak point for me.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

RAW in 2009? 

SHEAMUS.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Well that was just the end of that year. :side:

Plus MARK CUBAN/SHEAMUS TABLEMANIA.

Also, just watched this. :lmao






Fandango's hat. :lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

idc what anyone says about Mark Cuban. That dude rules for taking not one, but two bumps when he showed up in WWE. Second being through a table. Awesome.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I find Cuban real entertaining. Honestly think he'd make an awesome manager to someone someday if he wanted to.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Boss gave me an Amazon gift card for the holiday. F yes! Picked up....

Summerslam 2001 (FINALLY have Austin/Angle on DVD! :mark 
Royal Rumble 2007 (FINALLY have Cena/Umaga on DVD! :mark: and a damn fun PPV all around)
TLC 2012....loved this PPV and just wanted a copy of it....Shield/Hell No & Ryback match is awesome as is the Cena/Dolph ladder match
Viva La Raza....which I had but my disc 2 was cracked so I wanted to rebuy it


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> All it's missing is La Parka on one side & Regal on the other.


Speaking of La Parka, our local sports radio station is always giving out free tickets to Smackdown/Raw whenever it comes to DC. I won tickets to Smackdowm next weekend by answering a question about the Real AAmericans. Anyway, they were giving more tickets away yesterday and the radio host Chad Dukes asked the question "Which wrestler was known for bringing a chair to the ring?". If I hadn't already won tickets I woulda nailed that one too, I immediately thought of you and Yeah always talking about him, otherwise I'm not sure I'd have remembered.

Did you watch that matching posted by any chance? It wasn't epic great or anything but definitely enjoyAble and worth the watch. Although it was a bit off putting seeing Eddie in trunks. Thank god he switched to tights, it's not a good look for him.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

FUCK 2010 WWE. WE HAVE THE *80s*. 

Jerry Lawler v. Bill Dundee (CWA 6/6/83)
What did I just watch? I’ve seen this more than once but I have never been so freakishly connected to it. In fact I cannot remember the last time I got this involved in a match, or the last time I thought a match was this good. It almost felt like I was watching the greatest wrestling match of all time. The opening was enough to make me a drooling fan girl. It was the greatest ‘big time fight’ boxing opening I have ever seen, and when Lawler swung that punch and Dundee flinched, fell flat on his arse and rolled out of the ring, I lost it. I had to rewind it multiple times and I swear to God it may be my new favourite wrestling match moment that has ever happened. It was the perfect opening line for this kind of loser leaves town match. The punches themselves are godly. Is there a match in history with better punches and selling of punches ever? Any fool is taught how to throw a punch in wrestling, but execution is everything, and these two don’t fuck around with selling hard punches. They don’t do the simple pissy ‘stomp and move head’, they go all out with swinging bodies and stumbling and jolting their head in the right direction of the punch. I remember multiple specific punch sells from this and I suspect I’ll remember them for a while. They’re also perfect when selling how hard the punch is. It’s like they know how much force each other will put behind the punch and sell appropriately based on that. And every punch felt big; there wasn’t a single move used to waste time, used for filler, used to set up something more elaborate– this was all important shit. Punches punches PUNCHES PUNCHES MOTHERFUCKER THE PUNCHES. Most of this is punches, but, again, execution is everything, and when you’re executing the greatest punches in any wrestling match ever then you can afford to use mostly punches. Not any two wrestlers could do this. Everything outside of punches is classic too, though. Lawler’s sell of the first shoulder block might be the best one I’ve ever seen, the missed leg drop sell might be the best I’ve ever seen, and he did ‘gets hit off of the apron and bounces off table’ better than anybody I’ve ever seen. None of this is hyperbole or exaggeration. I actually loved the referee getting involved. In a lot matches without rules they get in the way and the attention almost gets dragged towards them, but I thought the sight of Tommy Gilbert trying to tear Dundee away from the bleeding Lawler was an incredible sell of how ruthless Dundee was being; like an animal tamer stopping a lion attack. Some of the concrete spots are a little rough to think about, even if we don’t really get to see the fall. Lawler does that ‘holds onto the ropes and nearly falls backward’ spot, and actually falls. There aren’t mats here, either - it was pure concrete, so I don’t give a shit if you see it or not, just the idea of that is brutal. I’ve tried but I cannot explain this match in full detail. If I were to mention everything right with it I would have to do an honest move-by-move play-by-play. Not a single move wasted, not a single thing felt unimportant, not a single thing didn’t keep me totally gripped. Big match with a big match feel and wrestlers in the front row and fans getting unglued and just an indescribable piece of footage. I swear, this match truly feels like a surreal, unreal, all time classic. It’s basically perfect. Maybe it’s because I haven’t been watching truly amazing wrestling for a while, but I felt like if we had the full match it might be a Greatest Match of All Time contender. And it may not even be the best Jerry Lawler v. Bill Dundee match. This is the 80s.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> It amazes me that I found Backlash '09 for 60 cents. One of my favorite shows and it was ridiculously cheap.


Agreed. I picked this up for $1 a few months ago. Great PPV.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


> FUCK 2010 WWE. WE HAVE THE *80s*.
> 
> Jerry Lawler v. Bill Dundee (CWA 6/6/83)
> What did I just watch? I’ve seen this more than once but I have never been so freakishly connected to it. In fact I cannot remember the last time I got this involved in a match, or the last time I thought a match was this good. It almost felt like I was watching the greatest wrestling match of all time. The opening was enough to make me a drooling fan girl. It was the greatest ‘big time fight’ boxing opening I have ever seen, and when Lawler swung that punch and Dundee flinched, fell flat on his arse and rolled out of the ring, I lost it. I had to rewind it multiple times and I swear to God it may be my new favourite wrestling match moment that has ever happened. It was the perfect opening line for this kind of loser leaves town match. The punches themselves are godly. Is there a match in history with better punches and selling of punches ever? Any fool is taught how to throw a punch in wrestling, but execution is everything, and these two don’t fuck around with selling hard punches. They don’t do the simple pissy ‘stomp and move head’, they go all out with swinging bodies and stumbling and jolting their head in the right direction of the punch. I remember multiple specific punch sells from this and I suspect I’ll remember them for a while. They’re also perfect when selling how hard the punch is. It’s like they know how much force each other will put behind the punch and sell appropriately based on that. And every punch felt big; there wasn’t a single move used to waste time, used for filler, used to set up something more elaborate– this was all important shit. Punches punches PUNCHES PUNCHES MOTHERFUCKER THE PUNCHES. Most of this is punches, but, again, execution is everything, and when you’re executing the greatest punches in any wrestling match ever then you can afford to use mostly punches. Not any two wrestlers could do this. Everything outside of punches is classic too, though. Lawler’s sell of the first shoulder block might be the best one I’ve ever seen, the missed leg drop sell might be the best I’ve ever seen, and he did ‘gets hit off of the apron and bounces off table’ better than anybody I’ve ever seen. None of this is hyperbole or exaggeration. I actually loved the referee getting involved. In a lot matches without rules they get in the way and the attention almost gets dragged towards them, but I thought the sight of Tommy Gilbert trying to tear Dundee away from the bleeding Lawler was an incredible sell of how ruthless Dundee was being; like an animal tamer stopping a lion attack. Some of the concrete spots are a little rough to think about, even if we don’t really get to see the fall. Lawler does that ‘holds onto the ropes and nearly falls backward’ spot, and actually falls. There aren’t mats here, either - it was pure concrete, so I don’t give a shit if you see it or not, just the idea of that is brutal. I’ve tried but I cannot explain this match in full detail. If I were to mention everything right with it I would have to do an honest move-by-move play-by-play. Not a single move wasted, not a single thing felt unimportant, not a single thing didn’t keep me totally gripped. Big match with a big match feel and wrestlers in the front row and fans getting unglued and just an indescribable piece of footage. I swear, this match truly feels like a surreal, unreal, all time classic. It’s basically perfect. Maybe it’s because I haven’t been watching truly amazing wrestling for a while, but I felt like if we had the full match it might be a Greatest Match of All Time contender. And it may not even be the best Jerry Lawler v. Bill Dundee match. This is the 80s.



What a great write up. Well done sir, well done. For what its worth, I feel almost the exact same way about the No DQ match Lawler had with Funk in 1981, in that the punches were just so good, the selling sublime, the electricity and the atmosphere was just riveting. Getting that awesome "connected" feeling you were describing is easily my favorite part of pro wrestling. The last time I remember it happening was a month or 2 ago when I watched Regal vs Finlay WCW Uncensored. It makes you feel like what you're watching is the greatest thing ever.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Watching Lawler/Funk again soon. After the LLT match blowing my nipples off I am tempted to shove through all of the Lawler I planned to all today. Should really spread it out, though. OOH. I know what I'm watching next.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Is anyone else as pissed off about this Santa Mark Henry thing as I am???? Jesus fucking Christ, outside of Lesnar, Henry is BY FAR the best, most distilled, pure HEEL BAD MOTHERFUCKER in the entire WWE, and they are treating him like a big happy black Santa Claus. It's a joke. I know Henry is a face right now, which is an injustice unto itself, but come on. Can you picture Vader ever wearing a Santa costume and saying "ho ho ho"? Ughhhhh.

The thing is, I know WWE is trying to be a crossover family entertainment enterprise, but none of these skits or shorts they do are any fucking good in the first place. They aren't funny, not one single thing is amusing or mildly stimulating about them, they just suck. That Strahan skit they did a few weeks ago might be the single worst thing I've ever seen, just an epic catastrophic failure on so many levels. If they want to do variety show entertainment, they need to hire some writers who don't suck all massive kinds of suck. Fuck.

Sorry rant over.

Edit- DID ANYONE ELSE JUST SEE ROMAN REIGNS SUPER MAN PUNCH ON CENA???? :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I can most certainly picture Vader as Santa and I can't wait to see Henry dress up as Santa.

Lawler/Idol is my favorite match of Lawler's career. Lawler is a guy that I don't necessarily enjoy because I hate faces like him, but he's definitely top notch.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I can most certainly picture Vader as Santa and I can't wait to see Henry dress up as Santa.


You're the last person I'd expect to be in favor of Henry Claus.....why would you want to see that?? I don't want to see a return of Sexual Chocolate, goof ball comedy Henry, I want him to be the biggest baddest man on the block, the dude "Bent on Destruction". I just hate when WWE do things that make a mockery of the business...and make no mistake about it, taking your monster heel, your best bad guy on the entire roster, and dressing him up as a friendly jovial Santa Claus is making a mockery what wrestling is supposed to be. This just seems like a stunt so WWE can go to their board members and say "make sure you and your family tune in Monday evening for our Christmas Special!". How are we the fans supposed to take Henry serious as a heel again! He's a nice friendly guy! He dresses up like Santa Claus, kisses babies, and tries to save Christmas! I've seen Henry interviews, I know he's one of the most humble, deep thinming, friendly, decent human beings in the business. But on WWE tv they need to present him as an unconscionable monster, a destructive force of nature.

There used to be an unspoken pact between wrestling promotions and the fans. You present US a product that has the air of legit competition and that everything that happens is a shoot, and we the fans will suspend our disbelief and pay money to see your shows. WWE has been crossing this line in previous years, but 2013 was the year the line was just demolished. It's horrible. Why should I care about what happens when you are constantly reminding me everything is staged and fake?

If they wanted to do something Christmas related, they should have just had Ryback or someone disguise themselves as Santa and attack their rival backstage. That's both funny, holiday related, and it keeps the air of legitimacy.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Yeah, I knew if they turned Henry face they'd eventually do something stupid with him. Orton makes embarrassing faces and vomits worthless promos and looks stupid when trying to be intimidating and hasn't been a really good worker in half a decade and gets the mega heel push while a better guy in every single way is forced to be a smiling Santa. This is why I don't consistently watch. 

-----

Sgt Slaughter v. Pat Patterson (WWF 5/4/81)
"Alley Fight" is a great way to describe this, and rarely to those kind of gimmicky titles describe a match right. No referee, no rules, wrestling gear isn't necessary, and it's basically two men beating each other senseless in an alley with people hearing noises and wondering how big the raccoons going though the trash are. I don’t think I’ve ever wondered this, but what was the back story with all of this? I’m not positive I can remember hearing of any match these two had other than this, and there has to be a reason they’re punching each other in the face this viciously and wrapping a belt around each other’s cheeks. Patterson’s belts shots on Slaughter are obviously are great payback moment so that only furthers my wonder. I remember saying time and time again that Slaughter’s blade job was so ridiculous after the ring post bump that it goes from his head to his elbow joint in like two seconds, and that’s not a massive exaggeration at all. It drips like a faucet and constantly spills every which way. Brutal shit. Patterson going wild with the boot and Slaughter wobbling and bumping everywhere while covered in red is really what puts this match over the top as an ‘alley fight’. I never realised how many times he flew himself into the ring post. He might be the best bumper ever; even the most flimsy throws can somehow look legit when he launches himself into things. Slaughter is a guy where is best matches are just so high-end that it that doesn't matter whether you watch his in-between, you pretty much have to call him a great worker. I mean this is really excellent and may not even be a top 5 Slaughter match. Not a lock, but a good barometer for lower tier matches on the list.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Yeah1993 said:


> Yeah, I knew if they turned Henry face they'd eventually do something stupid with him. Orton makes embarrassing faces and vomits worthless promos and looks stupid when trying to be intimidating and hasn't been a really good worker in half a decade and gets the mega heel push while a better guy in every single way is forced to be a smiling Santa. This is why I don't consistently watch.
> 
> -----
> 
> ...


Preach, brother.

Love love LOVE that match. Although that last line has me curious, I've aalways thought this was Slaughters best match, atleast as far as singles contests go. Which ones would you put above it? I've seen some tremendous tags with Don Kernoodle against the Briscoes and Steamboat/Youngblood, but I can't recall any singles I enjoyed more than the alley fight with Patterson. Although there is the Boot Camp match with Sheik, hmmmm, was that one better? Haven't seen it in a while.

I bought that WWE Falls Count Anywhere set pretty much for that match alone, I'll have to dial that up tomorrow.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Honestly I'm just happy that Henry had his chance to be a monster. I know his time is waning, but it looks like he's having fun out there. And this is all non-canon, so it won't bother me, and it will only make his eventual final heel turn better. Besides, Mark Henry's comedic timing is second to :hbk2

Slaughter's trifecta in the WWE (vs. Backlund, Patterson, and Sheik) is hard to match. I used to think he was just some old garbage wrestler that gets overrated because of the period that he worked in (like Jimmy Snuka), but when I saw him essentially turn the Steamboat/Youngblood vs. Himself/Kernodle match into a classic singlehandedly, I knew this guy was superb. Felt the same way before about Stan Hansen because I thought he was just some stiff unsafe worker that worked stiff to compensate for lack of talent, but then I saw his match against Andre the Giant. Now I can not refuse a Stan Hansen match.

Yeah1993, you better be reviewing some Stan Hansen and Tatsumi Fujinami for us.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Honestly I'm just happy that Henry had his chance to be a monster. I know his time is waning, but it looks like he's having fun out there. And this is all non-canon, so it won't bother me, and it will only make his eventual final heel turn better. Besides, Mark Henry's comedic timing is second to :hbk2
> 
> Slaughter's trifecta in the WWE (vs. Backlund, Patterson, and Sheik) is hard to match. I used to think he was just some old garbage wrestler that gets overrated because of the period that he worked in (like Jimmy Snuka), but when I saw him essentially turn the Steamboat/Youngblood vs. Himself/Kernodle match into a classic singlehandedly, I knew this guy was superb. Felt the same way before about Stan Hansen because I thought he was just some stiff unsafe worker that worked stiff to compensate for lack of talent, but then I saw his match against Andre the Giant. Now I can not refuse a Stan Hansen match.
> 
> Yeah1993, you better be reviewing some Stan Hansen and Tatsumi Fujinami for us.



I thought I remember Henry saying he signed a 3 year deal this summer....I just want his last 2 1/2 years to be as memorable as possible, so he's a lock for the HoF and gets a run with the WWE title as the unstoppable force that he is. He's a guy who tries to work with the young guys and help make them better, I'm hoping that's why he's been with Langston lately, because that guy definitely needs all the help he can get. Otherwise this whole face run will be a giant waste of time.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I like Big E, but my patience is waning on him. Dude just doesn't get it in the ring.Every big man in the business needs to have a 5 hour session with Henry or Vader on how to work.

Some more gems from 2013 that may or may not make THE LIST:

Daniel Bryan vs. Sheamus
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x11qp46#user_search=1

Antonio Cesaro vs. William Regal (Fun short RAW match)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJYZQJbwa6c

Christian vs. Titus O'Neill
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x127yu3_07-22-13-christian-vs-titus-o-neill_sport

Chris Jericho vs. Rob Van Dam
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x121ebg_07-15-13-chris-jericho-vs-rob-van-dam_sport

The Shield vs. The Usos
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x11xbgf_07-14-13-the-shield-vs-the-usos-money-in-the-bank_sport

EDIT: On Smackdown, Michael Cole referenced Luke Harper's indie gimmick.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Gah, Bryan and Sheamus have such good chemistry. I watched the street fight form Raw in July of 2012 earlier in the week and it's so good. Not to mention the 2/3 falls match and I really liked the one funnyfaces listed too. I believe one of their '11 matches was good too.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Big E is everything wrong with Pro-Wresting


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Speaking of La Parka, our local sports radio station is always giving out free tickets to Smackdown/Raw whenever it comes to DC. I won tickets to Smackdowm next weekend by answering a question about the Real AAmericans. Anyway, they were giving more tickets away yesterday and the radio host Chad Dukes asked the question "Which wrestler was known for bringing a chair to the ring?". If I hadn't already won tickets I woulda nailed that one too, I immediately thought of you and Yeah always talking about him, otherwise I'm not sure I'd have remembered.
> 
> Did you watch that matching posted by any chance? It wasn't epic great or anything but definitely enjoyAble and worth the watch. Although it was a bit off putting seeing Eddie in trunks. Thank god he switched to tights, it's not a good look for him.


Damn. I would have killed to answer that. Radio station talking about La Parka & wrestling in general is sweet.

Haven't watched yet. I'll get on it tonight. Curious & already been on a mini Puro fix today as it is. I'm sure it's fine, if not being the best match we all wished it could have been.



Yeah1993 said:


> FUCK 2010 WWE. WE HAVE THE *80s*.
> 
> Jerry Lawler v. Bill Dundee (CWA 6/6/83)
> What did I just watch? I’ve seen this more than once but I have never been so freakishly connected to it. In fact I cannot remember the last time I got this involved in a match, or the last time I thought a match was this good. It almost felt like I was watching the greatest wrestling match of all time. The opening was enough to make me a drooling fan girl. It was the greatest ‘big time fight’ boxing opening I have ever seen, and when Lawler swung that punch and Dundee flinched, fell flat on his arse and rolled out of the ring, I lost it. I had to rewind it multiple times and I swear to God it may be my new favourite wrestling match moment that has ever happened. It was the perfect opening line for this kind of loser leaves town match. The punches themselves are godly. Is there a match in history with better punches and selling of punches ever? Any fool is taught how to throw a punch in wrestling, but execution is everything, and these two don’t fuck around with selling hard punches. They don’t do the simple pissy ‘stomp and move head’, they go all out with swinging bodies and stumbling and jolting their head in the right direction of the punch. I remember multiple specific punch sells from this and I suspect I’ll remember them for a while. They’re also perfect when selling how hard the punch is. It’s like they know how much force each other will put behind the punch and sell appropriately based on that. And every punch felt big; there wasn’t a single move used to waste time, used for filler, used to set up something more elaborate– this was all important shit. Punches punches PUNCHES PUNCHES MOTHERFUCKER THE PUNCHES. Most of this is punches, but, again, execution is everything, and when you’re executing the greatest punches in any wrestling match ever then you can afford to use mostly punches. Not any two wrestlers could do this. Everything outside of punches is classic too, though. Lawler’s sell of the first shoulder block might be the best one I’ve ever seen, the missed leg drop sell might be the best I’ve ever seen, and he did ‘gets hit off of the apron and bounces off table’ better than anybody I’ve ever seen. None of this is hyperbole or exaggeration. I actually loved the referee getting involved. In a lot matches without rules they get in the way and the attention almost gets dragged towards them, but I thought the sight of Tommy Gilbert trying to tear Dundee away from the bleeding Lawler was an incredible sell of how ruthless Dundee was being; like an animal tamer stopping a lion attack. Some of the concrete spots are a little rough to think about, even if we don’t really get to see the fall. Lawler does that ‘holds onto the ropes and nearly falls backward’ spot, and actually falls. There aren’t mats here, either - it was pure concrete, so I don’t give a shit if you see it or not, just the idea of that is brutal. I’ve tried but I cannot explain this match in full detail. If I were to mention everything right with it I would have to do an honest move-by-move play-by-play. Not a single move wasted, not a single thing felt unimportant, not a single thing didn’t keep me totally gripped. Big match with a big match feel and wrestlers in the front row and fans getting unglued and just an indescribable piece of footage. I swear, this match truly feels like a surreal, unreal, all time classic. It’s basically perfect. Maybe it’s because I haven’t been watching truly amazing wrestling for a while, but I felt like if we had the full match it might be a Greatest Match of All Time contender. And it may not even be the best Jerry Lawler v. Bill Dundee match. This is the 80s.


Fuck. Is this on now? I have to begin. Then again, you're the first I've seen get anything going and you were the SCUMBAG _(not my words...<3)_ who didn't even go through w/the last one. I think I'll be ok after catching the early wind. Where in the hell to start...


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Been watching a few Raw matches from 2004 today. I need to go through the whole year again because there's so much goodness.

Evolution vs Edge, Tajiri & Shelton (3/5) - ★★★¾
Orton vs Edge (10/5) - ★★★¾
Jericho vs Christian (10/5) - ★★★
Kane vs Jericho (12/7) - ★★
Orton vs Edge (19/7) - ★★★¾


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I'm skimming the June 10 RAW so I can get to Bryan/Rollins, and I forget that that same episode had the payoff to the Kaitlyn "secret admirer" storyline :lmao :lmao

AJ trolling Kaitlyn is actually pretty damn hilarious.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Forgot all about that until now. Crowd was more dead than my own reaction on it.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Preach, brother.
> 
> Love love LOVE that match. Although that last line has me curious, I've aalways thought this was Slaughters best match, atleast as far as singles contests go. Which ones would you put above it? I've seen some tremendous tags with Don Kernoodle against the Briscoes and Steamboat/Youngblood, but I can't recall any singles I enjoyed more than the alley fight with Patterson. Although there is the Boot Camp match with Sheik, hmmmm, was that one better? Haven't seen it in a while.


I'd say the Final Conflict cage, v. Backlund 1/10/81 and 3/21/81 are all better than the alley fight. And the boot camp beats them all. Slaughter's best match, and, truthfully, maybe the best WWE match of all time. 



funnyfaces1 said:


> Yeah1993, you better be reviewing some Stan Hansen and Tatsumi Fujinami for us.


It's the 80s, it'd be incomplete without them eventually. I'm really excited for the Hansen I haven't seen like the bullrope with Carlos Colon.



Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Fuck. Is this on now? I have to begin. Then again, you're the first I've seen get anything going and you were the SCUMBAG _(not my words...<3)_ who didn't even go through w/the last one. I think I'll be ok after catching the early wind. Where in the hell to start...


There's no set date yet and no pressure to start watching, I just thought it wouldn't hurt to open the topic now if people wanted to get going already (AKA me) so people agreed and Cal went through with it.

Also I probably didn't go through with the last one because the 2000s is filled with a bunch of shitty indy matches and Marufuji no selling garbage and being the worst ever. This is the motherfucking 80s. I will finish this one. 

Fuck I hate Marufuji.

-------------

Ted DiBiase v. Jim Duggan (Mid-South 3/8/85)
Mainly watched so I could have a match of theirs to dig into before the you-know-what, but I thought Duggan looked utterly outstanding here - like almost on Lawler/Dundee level for punchy brawls. His punches weren’t as good, but his bouncing around and falling into the ropes and herculean comebacks were perfect. I think this match alone cements the idea that Duggan was the most underused guy from the WWF buyout of a billion wrestlers from territories. Koko Ware was definitely a better worker, but his ‘birdman’ gimmick wasn’t stopping him as badly as Duggan’s crossed-eyed defective Eugene gimmick, and I think Duggan’s style could have made him a bigger star than Koko. He really could have been one of the best brawlers of all time; he has such a tremendous peak. If I rated wrestlers on peak v. peak alone, Duggan would rate ahead of Shawn Michaels. This match only gets around nine minutes, but it’s easily a top-tier sub-ten minute match. DiBiase has had a rep as ‘mediocre’ worker and fuck ‘opinions are opinions’ because that is flat out full on bullshit. He’s really great as the deliciously evil scumbag who treats others like shit while escaping every possible negative situation. The beginning was amazing with him asking the officials and making sure that this was No DQ before throwing salt (or some shit) in Duggan’s face. DiBiase gets 85% of the offense in the fight, and Duggan’s comebacks and semi-Hulk Ups meld perfectly in the beat-down before getting his head more bloodied. The crowd go bonkers for any indication that Duggan may get offense in; I don’t think I’ve seen a bigger pop for a kick onto someone going for a back body drop. He’s usually wobbling and flopping around trying to get himself on his feet, so it’s a miracle when he fights back. Dr. Death slipping the loaded glove on DiBiase (and slapping him in the face and ruffling his hair so he could wake up a little) so he could turn around and nail Duggan was the perfect finish. Makes all of Duggan’s comeback attempts seem almost worthless. You efforts are nothing, Hacksaw. EVIL WINS. This is just a hell of a brawl. I’m actually enjoying this 80s shit more than ever before. 

Ted DiBiase v. Jim Duggan (Mid-South 3/22/85)
How many wrestlers could make a ‘Loser Leaves Town Coal Miner’s Glove on a Pole Tuxedo Cage Match’ work? So basically they’re in a cage so no one can interfere, they’re wearing tuxedos because of a ‘Best Dressed’ Competition after Duggan won some cufflinks from being named Mid-South MVP of 84, and there’s a coal miner’s glove on a pole because DiBiase’s been ruining people with that for a while. And of course, LLT b/c LLT. So everyone knows how this goes, right? It’s one of the ultimate in payback matches. DiBiase hesitates to even get into the ring and is forced in with a ten count (I assume if he didn’t make he’d have automatically lost – it’s hard to hear what the announcer is saying with this kind of footage sometimes), because he knows he’s totally fucked if he gets in there. Nobody trusts DiBiase when actually does get into the ring, so the ref checks his tuxedo to see if he has something hidden. DiBiase thinks it’s only fair that Duggan gets checked as well, and of course that’s part of a plan to cheap-shot him from behind, but Duggan doesn’t fall for it and the match starts with the greatest ‘I caught you’ spot ever. This was a different setting to any other Duggan/DiBiase – if DiBiase was caught off of offense here he was pretty much fucked altogether because Duggan could get the glove. So because of that the cut offs are so much more dickish and sneaky. My personal favourites were the ways he’d used Duggan’s tuxedo to hook Duggan’s arm so he couldn’t throw a punch. Duggan getting the glove was of course ruined by DiBiase’s salt, but the real greatness is that DiBiase missed every single shot he threw with the glove on his hand. Duggan then figures the glove must have something hard enough to hurt the hand it’s on, so he starts ramming the gloved hand on the turnbuckle before ripping off the glove and giving the final Dragon Ball Z-like punch. Phenomenal match, duh.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Thank you zep for uploading the Dibiase/Duggan No DQ match for me. Man that entire feud was special. Made me respect Jim Duggan. Without context, that match with a million stipulations sounds awful, but the buildup made everything make so much sense. DRAGON BALL Z LIKE PUNCH :mark:. Surely Dibiase/Flair will be watched. And let's hope you find a copy of Chavo/Piper. Oh, and some 80s Owen Hart. AND Choshu/Fujiwara

Seth Rollins vs. Jinder Mahal: ******


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Rollins/Mahal?! Was than an NXT match?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> Rollins/Mahal?! Was than an NXT match?


First ever NXT Title match. Simple, yet fun match where you have a despicable heel and an easy to support babyface wrestle. The NXT Title that night felt more important than all the titles did in 2012 except for the WWE Title.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

DiBiase/Flair is more a segment than a match so I'll skip it unless I get everything out of the way early. Don't plan top watch any Owen right now, but, again, I could blow through the 'big' stuff early and squeeze in the randoms. Choshu/Fujiwara is an all time classic and might be top 25-worthy. 

Not sure what you mean by Chavo/Piper. There's this match from 76 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5kNlvb8eCk

Actually I glad you brought up because I wanted to watch Piper/Valentine before the end of the day and forgot.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> There's no set date yet and no pressure to start watching, I just thought it wouldn't hurt to open the topic now if people wanted to get going already (AKA me) so people agreed and Cal went through with it.
> 
> Also I probably didn't go through with the last one because the 2000s is filled with a bunch of shitty indy matches and Marufuji no selling garbage and being the worst ever. This is the motherfucking 80s. I will finish this one.
> 
> Fuck I hate Marufuji.


I got the details and posted in some of the threads to keep up. I might just choose to watch some random matches I dig tonight to start. Ones from DVDs that I can zip through. Probably be lazy and get the Flair vs Steamboat series out of the way since I know 2/3 falls is unfuckwithable. I like how I claim I can zip through a trilogy where the shortest match was 20+.

I wouldn't imagine anyone trying to pimp many Marufuji matches on that place, tbhayley. 8*D

Oh shit, I just realized this poll is probably the best excuse to watch the Andre vs Hansen matches in a row. As if I needed one, but shooooot.



Dominick The Donkey said:


> Rollins/Mahal?! Was than an NXT match?


It actually is really good. Black/Rollins proves his eternal worth on that night alone. <3


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Cody, why does your sig change every so often? Is that a perk of being a lifetime member, or do you manually do it? And are you still not a fan of WCCW? At the very least, you love Gordy/Khan and some of the Freebirds/Von Erichs matches please.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Signature rotation by proxy of ten dollar purchase I didn't make years ago.

That's hilarious to see someone mention my dislike of WCCW considering I just made that point elsewhere for the sake of the 80's. As for the question, eh...not much they've produced I really care to watch. I think there might have been one Freebirds vs Von Erichs match I liked. Think it was no DQ or something. Kevin Von Erich had some matches I thought were fun. Remember Gordy being forgettable in the US compared to Japan. That or my memory isn't doing him justice all over. Didn't like the Abdullah vs Brody stuff. I hate Abdullah, so that's why. Basically the gist of the company.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Well Brody sucked, to be fair, and while I really like Abby at his best he wasn't going to carry someone who sucked. So it's unsurprising none of their matches are worth a shit.

Gordy in UWF is great, have you seen any of that? I've actually never seen Gordy/Khan despite being intrigued the second I first saw Andy bring it up five years ago. FIVE. FUCKING. YEARS AGO.

I'm curious how I'll view the Flair/Kerry cage this time around. Bored me when I last watched it (late 2009, IIRC). I know their 2/3 falls from the same year is masterful, though, and then there's Hawaii from 85. Ohhw boy.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Maybe Gordy in UWF, but nothing is leaping out off the top of my head. It's only Bob Orton Jr. who's coming to mind w/my UWF memories.

Forgot about Flair vs Kerry being a part of that curve. I just place it under the Flair folder and forget about which promotion it is representing. That's def gold. The 2/3 Falls is the one that made one of Flair's sets, right? Couldn't possibly have had more than one be televised. I suppose they could. Going by my original guess that it is the same. If so, I wasn't into it on the last watch. No bother. I can always give it another shot soon. The beauty of owning it. Their cage match can go to hell. Longest 24 minutes ever.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Flair/Kerry I'm talking about is definitely on a WWE release. 8/15/82; I think the WWE release has the air date listed, which wasn't the 15th. 8/22/82, maybe. Either way, same match. Their Hawaii match is from 12/10/85 and is one of the greatest matches of all time. Feel the need to bring that up again. EVERYBODY WATCH THAT MOTHERFUCKER. 

Last couple of lines got a giggle from me, mainly because that's almost how I felt while watching the cage the last time. Or maybe mainly because you went from 'beauty' to 'this other thing can go to hell' so quickly.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That's the one. I'll be sure to watch. I'll probably just watch everything on those sets from the 80's b/c it fits the bill. Some I don't even have to watch again b/c they're seared into my brain, but it's always fun. That doesn't only include Flair. Others like Magnum vs Tully I Quit, etc.

That's how I roll. Middle ground? The hell is that? :hayley3


----------



## JY57 (Jul 31, 2012)




----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I wonder who wins that match 8*D.


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

Even has his face on the spine.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Speaking of Duggan and his punches/selling, on the awesome MidSouth set blu ray bonus features they have one of the wildest most spectacular brawls ever, Duggan vs Buzz Sawyer. Buzz Sawyer is a freaking nut, I knew nothing about him before I got this set but I'm damn sure aware of him now.

Side note on Duggan, atleast while he was in Mid South, he takes the cake for dirtiest wrestler I've ever seen. I don't mean dirty as in he cheats, I mean dirty as in his white ring gear looks brown because of all the dried blood, dirt, and sweat on it. I'm no germaphobe, but I cant hel.p. but notice how dirty he looks. I actually like it, it's the most anti WWE thing ever, and adds character to him. He's not a guy who cares how he looks, he's just here to fight.

Further side note on Duggan, Flair said in an interview that if he had to pick 4 guys to win a fight against any other hand picked group of athletes, he'd pick Duggan, Haku, Wahoo McDaniels, and Dick Slater. I'd pay $20 to watch those guys in a barroom brawl.


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

Rumble 01 is overrated, anyone agree with me? Thought the hardcore sequence was thrown in for the hell of it and uninspiring until Kane's rampage.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Cody hates it IIRC, I love that entire show besides the womens match, thought even trips/angle was decent

Gonna start NWO 04, gotta get through one more RAW and SD


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

MyNameIsJonMarston said:


> Rumble 01 is overrated, anyone agree with me? Thought the hardcore sequence was thrown in for the hell of it and uninspiring until Kane's rampage.


Nah still one of my favorites. Just fun all the way for me.

Plus the event has Benoit/Jericho :mark:


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Orton is so fake.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Nah still one of my favorites. Just fun all the way for me.
> 
> Plus the event has Benoit/Jericho :mark:


Indeed. Are you in agreement that Jericho/Wolverine is the best ladder match?? I haven't watched that one in a while, but last time I did I remember thinking it was a 5-star top 20 match in company history.

Hey Zep, do you happen to know where I can find the Slaughter vs Sheik Boot Camp match? The link I found on YouTube doesn't work with mobile devices, and while my laptop is broken I gotta use a tablet to watch everything.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Indeed. Are you in agreement that Jericho/Wolverine is the best ladder match?? I haven't watched that one in a while, but last time I did I remember thinking it was a 5-star top 20 match in company history.
> 
> Hey Zep, do you happen to know where I can find the *Slaughter vs Sheik Boot Camp match*? The link I found on YouTube doesn't work with mobile devices, and while my laptop is broken I gotta use a tablet to watch everything.


http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xz...match-6-9-84-capital-centre-landover-md_sport

Yeah mate, have always said the Benoit/Jericho ladder match is the GOAT.  Just pretty much perfect IMO.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xz...match-6-9-84-capital-centre-landover-md_sport
> 
> Yeah mate, have always said the Benoit/Jericho ladder match is the GOAT.  Just pretty much perfect IMO.



As always sir you rock thanks.

Just watched Bryan vs Punk OTL 2012. Wow. What an amazing match. It's still hard to believe those 2 main evented a ppv for the wwe title in 2012. And what's more, they fucking tore it up. I couldn't pick a moty for 2012, I had a 3 way tie with this match, Cena/Lesnar, and TLC 6 Man. I really hope, at some point, we get Danielson vs Punk at WrestleMania.

Also, I have to say it, Bryan looked 100 times better in this match than he does currently. His beard is trimmed neatly and his head is buzzed short American Dragon style. Even his muscles look bigger and badder here, I kinda wish he'd go back to this look because it's so much easier to take him seriously. Danielson could dye his hair pink Hayley Williams style and I'd still be a fan, but it is unfortunate that his current GOAT gimmick requires him to look like a hipster jack ass.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Thoughts on these two matches from RAW 2-09-04? 

RVD/Booker/Orton

Benoit/Flair 

Please tell me benoit/flair is good?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Both are pretty fun. Specially Benoit vs Naitch.



> Also, I have to say it, Bryan looked 100 times better in this match than he does currently. His beard is trimmed neatly and his head is buzzed short American Dragon style. Even his muscles look bigger and badder here, I kinda wish he'd go back to this look because it's so much easier to take him seriously. Danielson could dye his hair pink Hayley Williams style and I'd still be a fan, but it is unfortunate that his current GOAT gimmick requires him to look like a hipster jack ass.


Word. I can't stand his current "goat" look. It's so awful. Sadly they've turned it into his gimmick so we'll have to live with it for a while at least. Dunno why so many wrestlers prefer to look shitty. Orton should grow his hair and shave the beard, Bryan should trim both his hair and beard and Punk needs to get rid of that stupid haircut fast. I guess that's why it's a good thing Cena doesn't grow a beard because it could look pretty bad and he'd be obsessed with keeping it, like Orton currently is.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

I don't think Orton with a beard would be bad if he grew his hair out some more. Hate him with a bald look. I'm not against Bryan's current look... I prefer it a lot more to how he looks without facial hair at all. Not my favorite, but it works.

Punk needs to do something with his hair though. Not a fan of his current look. I don't mind the the wolverine facial hair as I liked how it looked with Punk's shorter hair when he returned. 

Cena.:. Wish he'd grow his hair out a bit. Hate the buzzcut look on him. He looked a lot better when he was growing it out a bit after his injury.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Both are pretty fun. Specially Benoit vs Naitch.
> 
> 
> 
> Word. I can't stand his current "goat" look. It's so awful. Sadly they've turned it into his gimmick so we'll have to live with it for a while at least. Dunno why so many wrestlers prefer to look shitty. Orton should grow his hair and shave the beard, Bryan should trim both his hair and beard and Punk needs to get rid of that stupid haircut fast. I guess that's why it's a good thing Cena doesn't grow a beard because it could look pretty bad and he'd be obsessed with keeping it, like Orton currently is.


Agreed on Punks hair man, it looks so stupid right now. Either buzz it or grow it out and slick it back like he used to, this in between stuff just makes him look like he rolled out of bed and walked into the ring.

I think Orton should shave his beard and head and have that 2009 look again. He looks a little too cool for school now, as a heel he needs to annoy as many people as possible, including the females, and the easiest way to do that is shave his head again.

C2D-there is an excellent article on grantland.com about your boy Orton. You should read it if you have some spare time, I always enjoy Shumacher's articles.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm gonna say something, is it just me but Randy Savage in-ring was not all that SPECTACULAR, I mean solid, but just that ? Thoughts


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> I'm gonna say something, is it just me but Randy Savage in-ring was not all that SPECTACULAR, I mean solid, but just that ? Thoughts


If you watch his matches with Flair and Warrior at WrestleMania, or his matches with DiBiase and Steamboat, you can come away thinking he was one of the all time greats. He had an outstanding match with Hart in Japan as well. He was my favorite as a little kid, so of course I'm biased. Now that I'm older, I'm still a MASSIVE mark for the macho man character, but do I think he is in the same class as a Flair, Steamboat, Bret Hart, etc as a worker? No, but he was still great imo. He always worked smart to me, he was notorious for planning every single second of all his matches before hand, so most of his matches had great pace and structure, atleast in my opinion.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> If you watch his matches with Flair and Warrior at WrestleMania, or his matches with DiBiase and Steamboat, you can come away thinking he was one of the all time greats. He had an outstanding match with Hart in Japan as well. He was my favorite as a little kid, so of course I'm biased. Now that I'm older, I'm still a MASSIVE mark for the macho man character, but do I think he is in the same class as a Flair, Steamboat, Bret Hart, etc as a worker? No, but he was still great imo. He always worked smart to me, he was notorious for planning every single second of all his matches before hand, so most of his matches had great pace and structure, atleast in my opinion.


Yea a fan of the macho man, not a mark you like yourself(that not a bad thing at all)or anything but a fan. His character is unquestioned, tbhayley top 5 on the stick for me

Let me give you a sense of where I was coming from. I was thinking of outside ihis big matches and the hart series. I was watching some wwf weeklies and some wcw weeklies and got the opinion. Not as high on the flair match as you are.

Just thought he was solid in-ring, just nowhere near the same league as the flair/hbk/austin/takers/steamboats of the world. I see alot say that though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

MyNameIsJonMarston said:


> Rumble 01 is overrated, anyone agree with me? Thought the hardcore sequence was thrown in for the hell of it and uninspiring until Kane's rampage.





smitty915 said:


> Cody hates it IIRC, I love that entire show besides the womens match, thought even trips/angle was decent


^^^^

So, yeah, it's overrated.



RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> I'm gonna say something, is it just me but Randy Savage in-ring was not all that SPECTACULAR, I mean solid, but just that ? Thoughts


You mostly going by Savage's later work? Although, even in WCW he still had some of my favorites when given the chance to unleash. All about his approach about working, for me. Goes beyond some others as far as "knowing" what to do in the ring. Compensated by showing it in terms of getting heat or getting the fans to adore him, being a nut in brawl w/some keen punches, or going out there and wanting to rasslin as good as anyone else around a la Steamboat or Flair. You know, he could basically do everything out there to make things click.



Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Speaking of Duggan and his punches/selling, on the awesome MidSouth set blu ray bonus features they have one of the wildest most spectacular brawls ever, Duggan vs Buzz Sawyer. Buzz Sawyer is a freaking nut, I knew nothing about him before I got this set but I'm damn sure aware of him now.
> 
> Side note on Duggan, atleast while he was in Mid South, he takes the cake for dirtiest wrestler I've ever seen. I don't mean dirty as in he cheats, I mean dirty as in his white ring gear looks brown because of all the dried blood, dirt, and sweat on it. I'm no germaphobe, but I cant hel.p. but notice how dirty he looks. I actually like it, it's the most anti WWE thing ever, and adds character to him. He's not a guy who cares how he looks, he's just here to fight.
> 
> Further side note on Duggan, Flair said in an interview that if he had to pick 4 guys to win a fight against any other hand picked group of athletes, he'd pick Duggan, Haku, Wahoo McDaniels, and Dick Slater. I'd pay $20 to watch those guys in a barroom brawl.


BUZZ FUCKIN SAWYER.

Duggan may honestly be the most underrated dude in the history of pro wrestling. List could be immense; I'm almost convinced it's him, tbhayley. From his Mid-South days, to WWF _(idc how he wasn't used in the biggest fashion, he was still choice)_, to even his WCW tenure. He always had something to offer. Even if his window wasn't much to give on the given night. Still can't believe that night in 2000 when he worked vs Goldberg. Match had more heart than anything that entire year and it was all thanks to Duggan. Now real life events played a part, but Duggan sold it so well for a story, that you bought into it badly. Damn, WCW really should have made this angle larger. Oh and I always say it, but Duggan is the MAN on the stick. Never gets his due for his promo work. Never.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I hate when people bring up the name Buzz Sawyer . WHERE ARE YOU DUDE?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

You know what dawned on me, atm? WWF booked Ted Dibiase vs Jim Duggan at a WM.

I'm just saying.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I was speaking mostly of his later work, probably a major reason, agreed on the he does everything well, cannot pinpoint a flaw in ring, it was just nothing jumped out at me but then again was the batch of match I watched was in his later years.

Also, bless you fr the rep, and no I'm not just :woolcock a thought of yours, my claim about Big E I believe 100% , I cant think of one good quality he has besides "bod". He is everything wrong with wwe booking

HE cant work
He cant talk
no charisma ( that twitter stuff doesnt count SEE :ryder)

Guy botched saying 20/20 :ti, and the funny thing about his build is yea he is jacked but he is a fucking midget. DOLPH FUCKING ZIGGLER towered over him when they were together and he is only 6'0 iirc

I believe the only thing good ppl can say abot Big E, atlesast he is better than Axel ? I actually like axel's stuff w/ ryback recently so maybe Paul E was overshadowing him abit? And is that a reason to like a guy, because he is better than the other guy ?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> You know what dawned on me, atm? WWF booked Ted Dibiase vs Jim Duggan at a WM.
> 
> I'm just saying.


"Match 2 - Hacksaw Jim Duggan Vs Ted DiBiase - Oh shit, MID-SOUTH time. Let me guess, it gets less than 5 minutes? Biggest Atomic Drop I think I've ever seen. Looked more like he was going for a back suplex lol. DiBiase sells it nicely by flying over the top rope. Interesting to see TED turn this into a brawl first, punching the fuck out of Hacksaw for knocking him out of the ring, but of course Duggan is the better brawler and he soon comes back with big rights of his own. Lol, this gets under 5 minutes... by about 5 seconds. But they did a nice job with the time they got. I liked it. Andre gets involved in the finish and DiBiase advances!"


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> I was speaking mostly of his later work, probably a major reason, agreed on the he does everything well, cannot pinpoint a flaw in ring, it was just nothing jumped out at me but then again was the batch of match I watched was in his later years.
> 
> Also, bless you fr the rep, and no I'm not just :woolcock a thought of yours, my claim about Big E I believe 100% , I cant think of one good quality he has besides "bod". He is everything wrong with wwe booking
> 
> ...


The 20/20 botch is the one where I basically washed my hands w/the goon. He's a WWE flavor of the week. Not worth my time. No matter how much they try and say _"hey, look at this guy w/CM Punk & John Cena. Care!"_ 

Nope.



CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> "Match 2 - Hacksaw Jim Duggan Vs Ted DiBiase - Oh shit, MID-SOUTH time. Let me guess, it gets less than 5 minutes? Biggest Atomic Drop I think I've ever seen. Looked more like he was going for a back suplex lol. DiBiase sells it nicely by flying over the top rope. Interesting to see TED turn this into a brawl first, punching the fuck out of Hacksaw for knocking him out of the ring, but of course Duggan is the better brawler and he soon comes back with big rights of his own. Lol, this gets under 5 minutes... by about 5 seconds. But they did a nice job with the time they got. I liked it. Andre gets involved in the finish and DiBiase advances!"


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Watched Extreme Rules 2012 for the first time in ages today










Still as EPIC :mark:


----------



## HiddenViolence (Jan 15, 2011)

So I watched the Bret Hart: Dungeon Collection set last week. Fabulous set and I strongly recommend it to anyone. I watched the whole thing in two days. 

However Bret Hart said in one of the interview segments that as great as Ric Flair is he lacks psychology. Personally I completely disagree with this. Flair's amazing at heel psychology and knows how to tell as story. He's very methodical in his ring work.

I am just curious to see if anybody actually agrees with Bret?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Bret is probably mad b/c he could never be an engaging heel in he ring like Flair.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Bret is probably mad b/c he could never be an engaging heel in he ring like Flair.


You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy again.


----------



## HiddenViolence (Jan 15, 2011)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Bret is probably mad b/c he could never be an engaging heel in he ring like Flair.


To be fair though I think as part of The Hart Foundation he pulled off being a heel really well.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah Bret is just jelly. I like Bret a ton, even after all these years when my tastes in wrestling have changed all over the place, but Flair is simply better.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Dont get me started with my hitman thoughts 


You know what its funny and I dont understand, ppl that hate cena but like Bret


Edit: Oh we were just talking about his heel performances vs. naitch ? flair was much better in-ring face/heel so it doesnt matter


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Just watched another fun 2004 Raw tag. Randy Orton and Batista vs Edge and Chris Jericho from 21 June. (same show with the awesome Rock/Orton segment. Enjoyable match even with Jericho taken out early with that clothesline but I couldn't help but laugh at Batista's greenness in here. Took him like 10 seconds to finish the "goes over the top rope after rope is pulled down" spot. :lol

CAL, if you read this and if it's alright: I would like to have your HQ version of the awesome Rock/Orton segment from Raw 21 June 04.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Dont get me started with my hitman thoughts
> 
> 
> You know what its funny and I dont understand, ppl that hate cena but like Bret
> ...



Obviously I don't hate Cena. I have all the respect in the world for his dedication to WWE and all the charity stuff he does. However, I'm 26 years old, so his character doesn't do anything for me. He is above average most days in the ring, and great in almost all of his "big" matches of late.

I will say that the difference between Cena and Bret is that Bret, in my opinion, was a freaking artist in the ring. His top 10 matches go neck and neck with any other wrestler ever. Cena just isn't in Bret's class as a worker. 

However, I've read Brets book, and he comes off as flat out jealous of Flair and Michaels for that matter, so no excusing him there.

To end my thought, I was a kid when Bret was in his prime, so of course his no nonsense good guy character resonated with me. If I was a kid today I'm sure Cena would be my guy too. I do have to give Bret credit for at least attempting a heelish turn in 1997, even though I thought he never quite got there. The only reason this happened though is because Vince had Austin ready to replace him as the new number 1 good guy. I've said it before and I'll say it again, a Cena heel turn is never gonna happen because WWE will never let a guy get above Cena in the good guy kid friendly area. It's not happening so it's stupid to wish for it.

I disagree with Hayley saying Bret wasn't a convincing heel in the ring, go back and watch the mid 80s Hart foundation, they, and Bret in particular, got real HEAT in the ring. Granted you cannot underestimate the Jimmy Hart effect, but still. Go watch the Boston Garden match Bret had with Steamboat. He's superb there.


Not sure I even answered your question haha.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Choke2Death said:


> Just watched another fun 2004 Raw tag. Randy Orton and Batista vs Edge and Chris Jericho from 21 June. (same show with the awesome Rock/Orton segment. Enjoyable match even with Jericho taken out early with that clothesline but I couldn't help but laugh at Batista's greenness in here. Took him like 10 seconds to finish the "goes over the top rope after rope is pulled down" spot. :lol
> 
> CAL, if you read this and if it's alright: I would like to have your HQ version of the awesome Rock/Orton segment from Raw 21 June 04.


Aye, I can get that done for ya, and the others I still need to do too . Also, I have a way to get the ones that I originally said I couldn't do! Got myself a new screen capture program, and well it's fucking ace. I've been recording videos from streaming sites that block you from downloading their stuff (even with plugins or other programs) and the quality is awesome and filesize is around that of a normal download for something of that length. So I can do the same for DVD's too!


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Aye, I can get that done for ya, and the others I still need to do too . Also, I have a way to get the ones that I originally said I couldn't do! Got myself a new screen capture program, and well it's fucking ace. I've been recording videos from streaming sites that block you from downloading their stuff (even with plugins or other programs) and the quality is awesome and filesize is around that of a normal download for something of that length. So I can do the same for DVD's too!


Great! :mark:

Go on with it, you're the king!


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Willing to take a match request if i have it


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

How are you going too upload them now ? I was thinking eddie/lesnar ? or a wargames ? forgot too save the 92 one


@cjack dont worry about it, it was more of a rhetoric question, they are soo similar


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> How are you going too upload them now ? I was thinking eddie/lesnar ? or a wargames ? forgot too save the 92 one


Ill use another upload site 

Ill re-up Wargames 1992.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Bret is the GOAT. Who else can get a match out of Diesel that is the caliber of SvS 95? Flair? Shinya Hashimoto? :ti

What made Savage so spectacular was how adaptable the guy was. There are some wrestlers who can wrestle the same style with anyone and the match will be good because of that (Mysterio, Sheamus, Flair), but Savage could wrestle different styles and make the match still look great. Dude put on some of the biggest carryjobs ever. I still cannot find a single good thing that Warrior and Hogan did in their matches with Savage. Nothing! Savage just pulls off the nutjob act so well AND he can do the resilient babyface act better than the rest too. Now I'm gonna go watch his matches with my boy Tito Santana.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Probably gonna start Unforgiven 04 today that means I get to watch that opener :mark:


Watched this again a few days ago. Highly enjoyed Benoit/Regal VS Flair/Batista, the Jericho VS Christian Ladder match, Michaels VS Kane, and liked Orton VS HHH. Jericho VS Christian was the MOTN IMO, w/ Benoit/Regal VS Flair/Batista coming somewhat close. The rest of the matches were fine, other than Tomko VS Richards. Didin't like that at all.

Jericho VS Christian, though :mark::mark::mark::mark::mark:.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Unforgiven is a pretty weak show overall. The opening tag is good and I like the main event more than most. Wasn't too fond of the ladder match and everything else is forgettable, except Tomko/Richards which is horrendously bad.

CAL - I assume your recent discovery allows you to rip from the "damaged" Raw that was 9 February 04 where the Benoit/Flair match takes place. While you're at it, I'd also appreciate the Highlight Reel before it with Benoit as the guest where Flair interrupts and the match is set-up.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

With the Christian/Jericho feud from 2004, I prefer their WrestleMania match and their RAW steel cage match over their ladder match from Unforgiven. Still enjoy their ladder match though.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> I'm gonna say something, is it just me but Randy Savage in-ring was not all that SPECTACULAR, I mean solid, but just that ? Thoughts





RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Just thought he was solid in-ring, just nowhere near the same league as the flair/hbk/austin/takers/steamboats of the world. I see alot say that though.


Nah he's amazing. Blows Michaels and Taker out of the water and I'd rank him above Austin as well. I'd give the nod to Steamboat but it's closer than one might think. Definitely don't think he's on Flair's level, but that's the A+ tier.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Christmas Nostalgia said:


> With the Christian/Jericho feud from 2004, I prefer their WrestleMania match and their RAW steel cage match over their ladder match from Unforgiven. Still enjoy their ladder match though.


I've enjoyed just about every Jericho/Christian match I've seen. Their WrestleMania match was certainly great, as was the Steel Cage match.

Great chemistry in the ring, and on the mic(promos, segments, etc)


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

It's personally one of my most favorite feuds. Really liked the love triangle storyline with Trish. (Y)


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I loved the Christian/Jericho feud but I might prefer them as the goofball tagg team better. The backstage segments were just priceless. :lmao


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Christmas Nostalgia said:


> It's personally one of my most favorite feuds. Really liked the love triangle storyline with Trish. (Y)


Definitely. I also loved their work as a tag team. Some of the mic work and in ring work in that period was absolutely great. 

In fact, I've loved the decent number of segments and promos Jericho and Christian have had. For instance, this one isn't the greatest, but I feel like it's underrated. It mostly revolves around Austin/Jericho, but Christian is also involved, and I really like the segment.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Luke Harper's festive Lariat said:


> You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy again.


tbhayley



Oddball said:


> To be fair though I think as part of The Hart Foundation he pulled off being a heel really well.


As a character he got good heat. Not hard when slamming America in front of Americans though. And he was gravely overshadowed by Brian Pillman. In the ring, nothing really changed. Other than the fact that his quality took a massive dip.



Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> I disagree with Hayley saying Bret wasn't a convincing heel in the ring, go back and watch the mid 80s Hart foundation, they, and Bret in particular, got real HEAT in the ring. Granted you cannot underestimate the Jimmy Hart effect, but still. Go watch the Boston Garden match Bret had with Steamboat. He's superb there.


At least you jump to this. A time when I'd give him some form of credit as a heel over the overrated stuff out of 1997 & laughable WCW work. This situation is no different w/me on the subject of thinking Shawn Michaels in the Rockers a million times > anything post the duo. Except there are other stretches where I still like Bret following his tag team heel work.


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

Madison Square Garden looks shit with orangish lighting, Source: Royal Rumble 2008. Madison Square Garden looks good with blueish vibrant lighting, Source: WMXX.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Christian/Jericho from WM 20 :mark:


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Christian/Jericho from WM 20 :mark:


(Y)

Always wished their ladder match turned out better though.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> (Y)
> 
> Always wished their ladder match turned out better though.


Me too, but it's still better then a lot of ladder matches out there, just a sub par match considering who was involved.

Also Summer Rae :homer :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I need to rewatch Jericho/Christian from WM20. Only seen it once and that was nearly two years ago and I didn't like it much at all.



Choke2Death said:


> CAL - I assume your recent discovery allows you to rip from the "damaged" Raw that was 9 February 04 where the Benoit/Flair match takes place. While you're at it, I'd also appreciate the Highlight Reel before it with Benoit as the guest where Flair interrupts and the match is set-up.


Just checked this and realized I screwed up. Correction on this: the segment is actually from Raw 2/2/04 and the match that is set up following it is the fun 2-3 minute Benoit/Henry match.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Ladder match has really fallen for me. It's kind of "there". Drags in a few parts too. I'll see how I feel in a few days after it's watched yet another time. Not looking forward to the shit that show provides. At least there is the booming tag & a fabulous Kane performance.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Tomko/Stevie 8*D


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Ladder match was a bit spotty, and there may have been a lack of a steady flow, but I really liked it nonetheless.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

More La Resistance crap. Oh boy.

Damn those guys for bringing down a Tajiri match.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

RAW 2004 talk. Cannot forget this moment. 

http://www.wwe.com/videos/coach-feels-the-wrath-of-tajiris-mist-raw-march-29-2004-26030021


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

First thing to come to mind w/Tajiri circa 2004.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Tajiri was great in the tag match against Evolution. Sucks they never put him in a one on one match with Orton. Their interactions in the tag were full of potential for a singles bout.

----------

Finlay vs Benoit (24/11/06) - ★★★★ (it just donned on me that Finlay has a hella basic moveset and always use restholds or strikes. Shows his talent when he has such great matches)


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

2004 Tajiri reminds me of this fun match he had with Batista on RAW: 






Fairly short but Tajiri gets in a surprisingly good amount of offense and has a good showing against Batista.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Seeing that I'd switch out your comments on Tajiri w/Batista. He was unbearable in 2004.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Seeing that I'd switch out your comments on Tajiri w/Batista. He was unbearable in 2004.


I meant he looked good against Batista, as in it wasn't the typical squash you would expect from Batista at the time and tajiri actually got some offense in and got a fun match out of Batista. I didn't mean Batista was good at the time. :lol


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Yeah Tajiri was booked quite well in 2004. Remember him beating Kane by C/O and then Edge spearing Kane afterwards. How's the Tajiri/HHH match like?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Aqib Talib :dazzler

Batista was unbearable in all but the last couple months of his career. Despite that, I'm excited for his potential return.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Well, all the advertising for his return in Vegas has apparently been pulled now. Not sure what that means, but fuck Vegas! (Even though I'm staying in Vegas right now) 

One of my friends texted me saying he wants to see Batista vs. Taker again after finding out about a potential return. I'd definitely prefer Brock vs. Taker at this point :lol


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Does Batista still have that really strange looking physique? He looked ridiculous when he was training for MMA.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Thoughts on Show/Cena ER 09?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Awful. But not as bad as NWO 2012. No justification for that trash. JD 09 was better, but still kinda boring at times.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I have so much hope for WM30 with Batista now pretty much confirmed to return. :mark: This has the potential to be the greatest Mania ever.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Batista was unbearable in all but the last couple months of his career. Despite that, I'm excited for his potential return.


I remember you gave the Batista/Orton vs Edge/Jericho tag match a very good rating not long ago. Surprised you didn't bring up Batista's hilarious botch from that match since you like to underrate him all the time. :lol


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I didn't like the Show/Cena '09 series much. That match from SD that February that Cody pimped out to me was great though.

Cena/Show feud reminds me of the Cena/JBL feud from the previous year. Awful.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Batista was unbearable in all but the last couple months of his career. Despite that, I'm excited for his potential return.


Spotlight heel Batista was the best. (Y)



Dominick The Donkey said:


> Does Batista still have that really strange looking physique? He looked ridiculous when he was training for MMA.


From the Batista thread, pics are apparently from earlier this year:


















Still looks ridiculous.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

He definitely looked grosser than that at one point though. (Y)

IT COULD BE WORSE


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cena vs Show from Judgment Day 2009 is great. Scary underrated.

Extreme Rules match is fine. Not nearly as good, iirc, but fine.

NWO 2012 match is a bit of a chore. Not sure what happened there. That night, nothing about the match clicked.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> He definitely looked grosser than that at one point though. (Y)
> 
> IT COULD BE WORSE


I was using ridiculous as a compliment though. :draper2 

I mean to look like that at 44 is pretty ridiculous. Good for him.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Christmas Nostalgia said:


> I was using ridiculous as a compliment though. :draper2
> 
> I mean to look like that at 44 is pretty ridiculous. Good for him.


Fucking hell, he's 44? Jesus. :lmao

That's actually insane shape for 44.

Hit a snag in the road in my top matches of 2013 project. So many middle of the road matches that I'm having trouble putting over each other. :argh:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> Fucking hell, he's 44? Jesus. :lmao
> 
> That's actually insane shape for 44.
> 
> Hit a snag in the road in my top matches of 2013 project. So many middle of the road matches that I'm having trouble putting over each other. :argh:


Yeah. Surprising? He's actually older than Triple H by a few months so back in Evolution when they were pushing Batista as ''the future'' while Triple H was ''the present'' - Batista was actually older than him. :lmao

What are your thoughts on a Batista return then Brye? I've never been a fan of the guy but I wouldn't mind a return. If he can still go, he could work a part timer schedule. I would like to see Brock/Batista.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Started with Royal Rumble 97.

HHH vs Goldust was pretty good, Ahmed Johnson vs Farooq not so much; I'm actually surprised Johnson gets such a good reaction from the crowd.

Good card, imo.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Christmas Nostalgia said:


> Yeah. Surprising? He's actually older than Triple H by a few months so back in Evolution when they were pushing Batista as ''the future'' while Triple H was the present Batista was older than him. :lmao
> 
> What are your thoughts on a Batista return then Brye? I've never been a fan of the guy but I wouldn't mind a return. If he can still go, he could work a part timer schedule. I would like to see Brock/Batista.


I go through times where I really like Batista and times when I couldn't stand him. Liked him in '05, '07 and '10 but didn't really care for the rest of his time. There's a lot of potential match ups that I'd like to see him in, though. So I'm pretty cool with the idea of it.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

"You're going down!" 

Bad mic skills but somehow was one of the most over guys in the 96/97 roster :argh:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> I go through times where I really like Batista and times when I couldn't stand him. Liked him in '05, '07 and '10 but didn't really care for the rest of his time. There's a lot of potential match ups that I'd like to see him in, though. So I'm pretty cool with the idea of it.


The only time I cared for him was in early 2005 when he was starting to break away from Evolution and feud with Triple H, and his 2010 heel run. But I never cared for him enough to consider myself a ''fan''. 

One of my favorite Batista moments has to be this though:






Batista's break away from evolution and feud with Triple H was just such a well done feud, and unlike most here, I wasn't underwhelmed with their WrestleMania match and I actually dig it. Probably the biggest fan of that match on here.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I like his 2010 run and I'm a evolution mark so I liked those days. I thought Batista was pretty good in the ring, started off green but by 2010 was was good/great


----------



## Raw2003 (Dec 20, 2012)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> I like his 2010 run and I'm a evolution mark so I liked those days. I thought Batista was pretty good in the ring, started off green but by 2010 was was good/great


Yeah I agree he was a really solid work when he left and was really smooth in the ring.


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Why'd they put that random six-man tag team match in the RR 97? So weird. Got like no reaction, either (I haven't finished it, though).


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

b/c WWF tried to get that LATINO market even back in 1997. Thought process is the best. _"We're in San Antonio, Texas. Lets put some Mexicans on the card."_ Result was too much.


----------



## Millsybeast (Mar 21, 2013)

Hmm, with Christmas and my Birthday coming up (Jan 2nd) I need some ideas on the WWE 'Autobiography' Videos to get. I already have CM Punk, Brock Lesnar, John Cena & Randy Orton, but was wondering if any others are worth watching? I heard Edge released one, Triple H too?


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Gotta love the WWE.

--- 

Fake Ramon/Diesel treatment in the WWF :lmao , can't believe McMahon & friends don't have to chuckle whenever they say "Big Daddy Cool".

Austin is so awesome in the Rumble :mark: :mark: (ten minutes in)

Rumble started well.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Millsybeast said:


> Hmm, with Christmas and my Birthday coming up (Jan 2nd) I need some ideas on the WWE 'Autobiography' Videos to get. I already have CM Punk, Brock Lesnar, John Cena & Randy Orton, but was wondering if any others are worth watching? I heard Edge released one, Triple H too?


You mean documentaries? 

And yes Edge's DVD is definitely worth getting if you're interested in that. One of the best wrestling documentaries I've seen.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Get Mick Foley's b/c they talk to Vader on it.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Fake Diesel :lmao

Good thing Internet wasn't popular back then otherwise Kane would have been shitted on. Can you imagine the "Isaac Yankem" or "fake Diesel" chants he would have received?


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Yeah, Foley's doc was good too. Still haven't seen Triple H's doc yet but after reading so many disappointing reviews on it I'm in no rush to do so. :lol


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The haitch doc was decent, way too much OMG TOTAL POWER COUPLEZ but the best part was when they were talking about WM 25, thought that was super interesting 

I might be picking up the Lesnar one soon, hows the doc? got it for the matches alone TBH


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Lesnar doc is nothing special. Was done back in 03 when they weren't so great at em lol.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

cant go wrong with Bret/Shawn DVD or heartbreak and triumph (ending is sooo :mark


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Get Mick Foley's b/c they talk to Vader on it.


Tell me about it. I had no clue Leon was gonna contribute to the Foley doc, and I was curious when I bought it how much of his second run in wcw was gonna be covered (since sting and Vader were his 2 big opponents). Legit got school girl giddy when I saw Vader pop up on the screen. It's no secret Vader is one of my all time favorites to watch, if I had control of WWEs DVD division the first releases I would do are a full undertaker documentary set, and a Vader documentary set. That guy was a BIG deal in the early to mid 90s, he deserves to be inducted and get his moment in the sun.

Edit- Cal, I got the new release of the Lesnar set, if you haven't already seen it, you should check the 1 minute intros Brock does for some of the matches. They are just the best. Made me love Lesnar more than I already do. That guy is just a born heel. He cant help himself. And bless him for it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

If Vader got a set, I'd worship WWE if they were able to find a way towards inserting some of his matches in Japan on there. Still not exactly sure how Benoit's set got those three New Japan matches. Or Jericho getting the WAR match vs Ultimo on his.

Of course, I can simply make orders off various websites to own these Vader matches, but you know, screw it. It'll be fantastic no matter what.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

It's time, It's time, It's time for Vader to get a DVD set!


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

*IYH: Over The Edge*

DOA vs. LOD 2000: *DUD*
Jeff Jarrett vs. Steve Blackman: *DUD*
Marc Mero vs. Sable: *DUD*
Bradshaw/TAKA vs. Kaientai: ****
The Rock vs. Faarooq: *DUD*
Kane vs. Vader: *DUD*(Worst Vader match I've ever seen)
NOD vs. DX: *DUD*
Steve Austin vs. Dude Love: *****1/2*

I'm not joking here, guys. That's how bad the undercard of this poor excuse of a show was.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

100% spot on.

IT ALL SUCKS. except for the two that avoided a DUD.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

I'm all for Batista coming back. Sure why not. But I wonder what they will do with him? :aries2 



Oddball said:


> So I watched the Bret Hart: Dungeon Collection set last week. Fabulous set and I strongly recommend it to anyone. I watched the whole thing in two days.
> 
> However Bret Hart said in one of the interview segments that as great as Ric Flair is he lacks psychology. Personally I completely disagree with this. Flair's amazing at heel psychology and knows how to tell as story. He's very methodical in his ring work.
> 
> I am just curious to see if anybody actually agrees with Bret?


Awesome set. Disagreed with his comments on :flair as well. It's no secret though that they hated each other. 

I loved their match where Bret won the title. Shame it didn't happen at a PPV though. 



Oddball said:


> To be fair though I think as part of The Hart Foundation he pulled off being a heel really well.


This. See sig. 

Bret's heel run in 1997 was entertaining as well. 



Christmas Nostalgia said:


> With the Christian/Jericho feud from 2004, I prefer their WrestleMania match and their RAW steel cage match over their ladder match from Unforgiven. Still enjoy their ladder match though.



Agreed with every word here. How HOT was Trish in 2004? Good lord. :mark: 



DoubtGin said:


> Started with Royal Rumble 97.
> 
> HHH vs Goldust was pretty good, Ahmed Johnson vs Farooq not so much; I'm actually surprised Johnson gets such a good reaction from the crowd.
> 
> Good card, imo.


Ahmed Johnson was SO over in 96/97. He was probably the second biggest face in the company behind :hbk.....I'm not counting Bret because he took like 6-7 months off around this time. 



Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Get Mick Foley's b/c they talk to Vader on it.


Great doc. The unk6 one is my fave but the Foley one is second place. 

I rewatched the Edge one this week. Loved it. What a cool dude IMHO. 



Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> If Vader got a set, I'd worship WWE if they were able to find a way towards inserting some of his matches in Japan on there. Still not exactly sure how Benoit's set got those three New Japan matches. Or Jericho getting the WAR match vs Ultimo on his.
> 
> Of course, I can simply make orders off various websites to own these Vader matches, but you know, screw it. It'll be fantastic no matter what.


This would be amazing. If they were able to get their hands on a tag match where :vader teamed with Bam Bam? Fuuuuuuck! :mark: 



funnyfaces1 said:


> *IYH: Over The Edge*
> 
> DOA vs. LOD 2000: *DUD*
> Jeff Jarrett vs. Steve Blackman: *DUD*
> ...



Terrible PPV but I loved the :austin2/Dude matches! :mark:

Kane/Vader had the potential for a great slugfest but it was not to be.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Edit- Cal, I got the new release of the Lesnar set, if you haven't already seen it, you should check the 1 minute intros Brock does for some of the matches. They are just the best. Made me love Lesnar more than I already do. That guy is just a born heel. He cant help himself. And bless him for it.


Yeah I have the new release too, but I've yet to watch any of it outside of the doc (hoping there might be SOMETHING new on it... but nope).


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Vader & Crusher Bam Bam. 

Stellar :mark:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

MachoMadness1988 said:


> Agreed with every word here. How HOT was Trish in 2004? Good lord. :mark:


Hot enough that she became my first diva crush. 



MachoMadness1988 said:


> I rewatched the Edge one this week. Loved it. What a cool dude IMHO.


(Y)

Good to see you posting more in this thread lately.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> *IYH: Over The Edge*
> 
> DOA vs. LOD 2000: *DUD*
> Jeff Jarrett vs. Steve Blackman: *DUD*
> ...


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...w-events-in-the-history-of-the-company/page/8

Check this BR out, laughable at how bad some of the shows this guy considers the best ever are :lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

> The Rock taking on Faarooq was brilliant, especially with the added bonus of it being for the Intercontinental Championship.


:hb


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

What's even scarier is that the PPV the month after is probably even worse :lmao.

EDIT: Whoops, Fully Loaded is actually the PPV after the next one. But KOTR sucked too. Take a look at the Fully Loaded 1998 card though. Next week's Smackdown has a better looking card than that trash.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I have yet to even watch my Mr. Perfect set or finish the Viva La Raza set yet


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> What's even scarier is that the PPV the month after is probably even worse :lmao.


Maybe. But probably not b/c I'm almost certain Owen vs X-Pac was pretty good. That helps w/Undertaker vs Foley being all legendary and everything. I know you don't like Austin vs Kane, but I do. So that's another plus. Don't recall the opener on KOTR being poor at all either. 

Over the Edge is gonna have the over-under on the DUD scale. I know it.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

I think Austin/Kane first blood was pretty solid. Wasn't too long either or dragged. Screwy finish, but other then that I thought it was good. Could they make it more obvious Kane was winning? Lol. 

***1/2 For Kane/Austin KOTR


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Knowing me, I'll probably like the Dungeon match over anything given on Smackdown at this rate.

oh wait, Wyatts vs Rhodes Dynasty happen. Ok, maybe it's even. Either way, I don't give a shit about either.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Since I'm STILL hungover from last night I'm gonna get a rumble ppv in tonight. 

2000 or 2001? Both were solid cards. I loved Foley/HHH street fight and hardys/dudleys table match. Although 01 has the GOAT ladder match. Didn't care for Angle/HHH though. That match is WEIRD. Both rumble matches weren't bad either although I'd probably give the nod to 01. 

Which one? Or should I just flip a coin?!


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

The Rumble match 1997 was really really good. No one seeing Austin out was lol-worthy but everything else was great. Besides the SUDDEN CAMEOS, I liked the wrestlers involved.

Now only the main event is left :mark:

Can't wait for that PPV from 98 everyone seems to hate


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:lmao 

saw junk w/Smackdown and WWE has literally made Big E. Langston into the modern Ahmad Johnson. Holy shit this dethrones Ezekial Jackson by 500 miles. WWE, why are you so blatantly comical when repeating history?


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Christmas Nostalgia said:


> Good to see you posting more in this thread lately.


Awwww look at this guy. Thanks man. 



A William Murderface Christmas said:


> I have yet to even watch my Mr. Perfect set or finish the Viva La Raza set yet


Whaaaaaaaaaaat? 

You have lots of fun ahead of you.

I just :marked: at the idea of an Eddie G/Mr. Perfect match. 



xdoomsayerx said:


> I think Austin/Kane first blood was pretty solid. Wasn't too long either or dragged. Screwy finish, but other then that I thought it was good. Could they make it more obvious Kane was winning? Lol.
> 
> ***1/2 For Kane/Austin KOTR



I'm actually watching the Kane set now. 

I really enjoyed the :austin2 :taker first blood match. As well as Kane/:austin 3 KotR. What I dont get is why Kane dropped the belt the next night. Never made sense to me.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

MachoMadness1988 said:


> Awwww look at this guy. Thanks man.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I don't either. The really dropped the ball with Kane in 98. For as intimidating as he appeared they booked him like a bitch. Didn't even make Austin bleed when he won and lost the title the next night from just one stunner. Kane could have been a bigger star in the attitude era, there's no doubt in my mind. 

But on the Bright side he lost to the GOAT Austin.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Looking back Kane during the AE was just a beast. I'm interested to hear how many people like 23 and younger were terrified of Kane as a kid. 

Agreed the booking should have been stronger with Kane. 

Just watched the Kane/HHH from Judgement Day 2001. Really enjoyed it. Steph was just :banderas


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*The Boss vs Vader w/Harley Race - WCW Spring Stampede (4/17/94)*

Cringed at every hit. I knew Vader worked a stiff style, but I'll be damned if it didn't feel like I was in the ring with him. Need to credit Boss too, for the fact he was took some brutal shots. Vadersault is still sweet. *9/10*


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> I have yet to even watch my Mr. Perfect set or finish the Viva La Raza set yet


Shame on you. Shame shame shame. The Perfect set is meh, but thank god they included the Bockwinkle bloodbath :mark: That match is just the best. Fuck. I'm watching it now screw it. 

And Viva la Raza is tied with Bret's and Rey's set as the best release wwe has ever provided us. Whenever I'm feeling bored, there are 2 matches I ALWAYS watch that never cease to make me happy. The first is Benoit/Finlay at Judgement Day, the second is Eddie's Latino Heat Parking Lot Brawl with Cena. You just can't go wrong with those two.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cjack I think I'm gonna watch that Naitch match now :lol have time


Mr.Perfect :mark:


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Christmas Nostalgia said:


> Batista's break away from evolution and feud with Triple H was just such a well done feud, and unlike most here, I wasn't underwhelmed with their WrestleMania match and I actually dig it. Probably the biggest fan of that match on here.


I just watched this the other day. Great example of why we need blading. Was bored to hell until Triple H got all bloodied. Then it all seemed urgent, and him going for the nut shots and all of that felt genuinely desperate, rather than just typical heel shit.

Yeah, blading can be wholly unnecessary (see Flair blading himself during the Edge Sex Celebration. WHY?!). But it can really add to a match, and I don't care if it's a crutch or whatever. It generally works, if thought is put into how it will add to a match, rather than just doing it.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

finished flair/windham, ehh I can understand the praise, but just a tad slow for me. Kinda reminds me of flair/sting


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...w-events-in-the-history-of-the-company/page/8
> 
> Check this BR out, laughable at how bad some of the shows this guy considers the best ever are :lmao


Amazing at how much they jizz over the Trips/Shawn HIAC match. :lmao

"WWE Championship match at Money in the Bank 2011 stole the show." It was the main event though :kobe


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

There is actually a list up on BR about the best HIAC matches and HBK/HHH is ranked #1 while classics like Batista/HHH, Orton/Taker and Brock/Taker are on the bottom half of it. :ti



LilOlMe said:


> Yeah, blading can be wholly unnecessary (see Flair blading himself during the Edge Sex Celebration. WHY?!).


I hate it when that happens in matches that don't need them. Perfect example is WM20 triple threat. Match was perfect as it was, the blade jobs of HBK and HHH were unnecessary and added nothing to it.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

#12 was otl 12 and then #11 is mitb 2011, the guy proceeds to write " this is the only other pg era ppv on the list", mania 28 is #1 :kobe, BR :ti


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Jolly Old St. Mick said:


> Shame on you. Shame shame shame. The Perfect set is meh, but thank god they included the Bockwinkle bloodbath :mark: That match is just the best. Fuck. I'm watching it now screw it.
> 
> And Viva la Raza is tied with Bret's and Rey's set as the best release wwe has ever provided us. Whenever I'm feeling bored, there are 2 matches I ALWAYS watch that never cease to make me happy. The first is Benoit/Finlay at Judgement Day, the second is Eddie's Latino Heat Parking Lot Brawl with Cena. You just can't go wrong with those two.


I haven't seen that parking lot brawl in years, perhaps I will pop in Eddie's DVD in a bit :hmm:


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

TLC IV is thought of highly in my mind, just pure carnage, I loved the non-stop influx of spots (which are fine to like when there's no real story to be told) and true emphasis on reckless nature.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Rollins/Cena is more enticing than anything on the Fully Loaded 1998 card. Unless if you're interested in The Rock and HHH wrestle a 2/3 Falls match that best resembles the WM 12 Ironman Match. I'd actually say it's worse than the Ironman match. And then a tag match that should have been on RAW as the main event. Please.

Where can I find the legendary one hour Bockwinkel/Hennig match? I haven't really seen much from Bock to be honest. I loved listening to him on the mic though. Dude was flame.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...w-events-in-the-history-of-the-company/page/8
> 
> Check this BR out, laughable at how bad some of the shows this guy considers the best ever are :lmao


:lmao

Only three Wrestlemanias made it and one was 28. :lmao:lmao:lmao

My top 25 would probably have at least 22, 24, 10, 19 and maybe 13/17/26 in it. This might be something I try to work up when I finish my big list.

Edit: Pardon me, they had 4. The epic Mania that didn't feature one singles match.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

No love for WM23? :vince7


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

PGSucks said:


> No love for WM23? :vince7


Shit, that's actually probably in the range of the 3 I listed at the end. HBK/Cena and Batista/Taker is one of my favorite main event duos they've ever done. As for the rest of the card, I liked MITB and thought Umaga/Lashley was fun for what it was.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Guys, give me a good match with terrible commentary. I want to dub a match with Paul's Boutique now that C2D has it as his avatar. Now why can't we be more like him with our music taste? I mean who listens to Paramore in 2013? :hayley2


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

People w/desires they wish to not control.

Fully Loaded 2/3 falls match is lame, but no way is it worse than sixty minutes of horseshit.


----------



## JY57 (Jul 31, 2012)

Best of RAW & Smackdown 2013 DVD Set


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Please dont fuck this up WWE 

I swear, if shit like Haitch/Axel or Cena/Ryback tables gets added I'll get mad


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> :lmao
> 
> Only three Wrestlemanias made it and one was 28. :lmao:lmao:lmao
> 
> ...


WrestleMania 13 and 17 in the same category? along with 22 being a good WrestleMania?








WUT?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

13 just for Hart/Austin I assume

22 was an awesome mania, completely underrated


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

WM 13 is hugely underrated, it's a top 10 WM for me on the CAL SCALE.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

WM13 was a decent Mania, but i wouldn't put it in top 10, Austin/Hart, the 2 tag matches and maybe HHH/Goldust which was pretty decent. Anything else sucked, especially the main event


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Main event is solid (though needed 10 minutes shaving off lol), think I gave it **3/4 which is better than most main events we get today . Austin/Bret is DUH *****, tag title match is sooo much fun and filled with TALENT (+ Davey Boy). And man oh man that CHICAGO STREET FIGHT is fucking glorious. First 3 matches on the show SUCK (4 way tag, Rock/Rikishi, Goldust/HHH) but the rest of the show is great.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

I have a big DUD for the main-event, never got into Sid/Undertaker. I consider the HHH/Goldust match a good **3/4 bout


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I don't think HHH/Goldust had a single good match back in the day. Their RR match is god awful too . In fact HHH didn't have a good WM match until like, WM 17 (maybe 16, I'm not high on it like I used to be though).


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Currently watching my way to WM 13, I like how the Hart/Austin feud is shaping up. It'll be interesting to see how they are both out of the title race.

Lawler is way more annoying then than he is now, imo.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

CHICAGO STREET FIGHT makes that WM great. Duh.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> CHICAGO STREET FIGHT makes that WM great. Duh.


Cody understands.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Tried finding my mini-review on that match. Too many pages to spool through. Bah. It's completely bonkers & utterly amazing. During a time when tag team wrestling was so shitty in WWF, that came along. <3


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

*Dangerous Alliance vs. Sting’s Squadron (Wargames 1992)*

Sting, Barry Windham, Dustin Rhodes, Ricky Steamboat & Nikita Koloff vs. Rick Rude, Arn Anderson, Larry Zbyszko, Bobby Eaton & Steve Austin (w/Paul E. Dangerously & Madusa)

(Wrestlewar 5/17/92)

PPV Version - Includes Jesse Ventura's full commentary:

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/nwa-w...-s-squadron-wargames-1992-a.html#post27803497

* By request


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

My WM 13 ramblings:



Spoiler: posted a bazillion times before



WrestleMania 13

The show is famous for one match, but how is the rest of the event? Time to find out if there is a reason nobody really talks about anything else that happens!

Match 1 - The Godwinns Vs The Headbangers Vs The New Blackjacks Vs Phil Lafon & Doug Fernas - 4 way tag match with... nothing on the line? #1 contendership? Nope. Ok then lol. Big brawl to start with, initiated by the Blackjacks (Barry Windham and Bradshaw). Bradshaw should grow back his moustache. Ummm... what? Both Headbangers end up getting tagged into the match. And they have to fight each other. What? I get the rules are that anyone can tag anyone... but surely logic would dictate that you can't have both team members in the match at the same time... what they gonna do? One pins the other, eliminating both of them from the match? LMAO, you know how I said there was nothing in it for the winning team? Well according to JR, the winning teams gets a shot at the WWF champion... Owen & Bulldog if they retain later. LOL. Dammit, the two good teams in this match (Lafon & Furnas and the Blackjacks) get eliminated together when they battle on the floor and shove the referee around. Bah. Godwinns aren't too bad though, big tough team and I recall a good Free For All match between them and the Blackjacks either the Final Four PPV prior to WM or Canadian Stampede a few months after. Either way it was a fun stiff contest. Headbangers are more high fly-y that I remember them. Moonsault attempt, splashes from the ropes, crossbodies etc. Headbangers win. Match overall was... watchable. Shame the two good teams went first. **.

Match 2 - The Sultan Vs Rocky Maivia - Rock's first WM. Against Rikishi. LOL ok. HONKY TONK MAN!!! For... some reason he's doing commentary. Guess maybe he's scouting for the next big star (which ends up being... Rock-A-Billy or Road Dogg Jessie James LOL)? Iron Sheik and BOB BACKLUND are the managers or whatever of Rikishi Sultan. TONY ATLAS. In the crowd. Arnold Skaaland. Lou Albano. Plenty of legends watching this match! LMFAO at Lawler when talking about Rock' speech at the Slammy Awards: "It was so boring even Christopher Reeves got up and walked out". And that holds true to this day when it comes to all his promos! And this match, for that matter. Boring chants and everything. Rikishi just sits in a sleeper hold. Rock pretends to fall asleep. I actually fall asleep. Best part of this match is Rikishi's awesome superkick. Guy was just fucking BORN to superkick people. Should have been his finisher. Rock hits the worst school boy I've ever seen for the win. Then gets destroyed after the match. LOL. Then Rocky Johnson shows up for the save. ROCK HAD TO BE SAVED BY AN OLD MAN. Who then gets attacked anyway. Ha. Shit match. DUD.

Match 3 - Hunter Hearst Helmsley Vs Goldust - Oh great. They sucked at the RR, so let's give them to chance to suck at WM! Yey! Well this starts off good at least. Goldust just kinda squats in the ring, which confuses HHH, allowing Goldust to attack him while he's off guard. Goldust pretty much beats the shit out of Hunter, and they do a spot where he gets tried up in the ropes, only facing the outside which I don't think I've seen, and Goldust rears back and smashes the future Game with a massive right hand. Pretty fucking sweet transition spot for HHH to get in control too. Great bump by Goldust. And now HHH sucks the life out of the match with his dull as shit offence. Like their RR match, it feels like it lasts forever. HHH wins. Urgh. *.

Match 4 - Vader & Mankind Vs Owen Hart & The British Bulldog - Tag titles on the line! Uncle Paul managing Vader and Mankind. What a mach this looks to be on paper. Never hear anything about it so I'm worried it's gonna be shit. Paul Bearer, what a manager. He died 2 days ago. RIP Bill Moody. Tag champs have been having problems since the RR when Owen "accidentally" eliminated Bulldog. Nearly cost them the titles at The Final Four PPV last month. They even had a match against each other in the finals of the European title tournament to crown the first champion (which is incredible and imo the greatest Raw match ever). Can they leave WM with the belts? Can they leave on the same page? Time to find out! Last year Vader teamed with Owen and Bulldog, this year he's fighting them! No Cornette though. Oh man, Cornette in one corner and Bearer in the other? Then the talent inside the ring? If that had happened, and happened in the 80's in JCP this probably would have been ***** lol. I'm rambling. LOL, Owen tags Bulldog into the match... while both men are in the ring. And the ref is fine with it apparently. Bulldog shows his power, suplexing Mankind then suplexing Vader! Bulldog and Vader had a pretty great match in WCW in the early 90's, definitely worth seeing. Both teams in this match are heel, and have no problems bending the rules and breaking them as much as possible. URN TO THE HEAD. Paul Bearer's reaction to it is AWESOME. Mankind and Vader are great controlling the match, essentially being the heels leaving Bulldog and Owen as the babyfaces... or at least as much as they can be. Mankind hits his signature elbow off the apron to the floor, but Vader holds Owen in the back breaker position while he does it! Wish Vader and Mankind were a team for longer, they could have been great, especially if they kept bringing up their history and always teasing them fighting each other, finally leading to some crazy match between the two. Vader Vs Mankind HIAC? Nah, first HIAC was only in October later in the year, wouldn't want them to team well past that to have one in 98. Just a cage would be fine then. Man, poor Owen really takes a fucking beating from Vader at one point. Man, just realised, only 2 people in this match (out of the 5 including Bearer) are still alive today. That fucking sucks. Owen's comeback is nice, big belly to belly to Mankind on the floor, then a devastating enziguri that takes Mankind down long enough for the tag to be made! Mandible Claw to Bulldog! Vader smashes into Owen, who in turn falls into Mankind and Bulldog who fall out to the floor, where Mankind keeps the hold applied and they both get... counted out. Damn, was hoping for an actual finish here, but ah well. One question: WHY DOES NOBODY TALK ABOUT THIS MATCH? Seriously, it's really fucking good! ***1/2.

Match 5 - Bret Hart Vs Steve Austin - It's the infamous Submission match! Ken Shamrock, at the time known for being a big MMA star, is the guest ref. This feud is awesome btw. Whole build up in 96 with Austin drawing Bret out of retirement to face him at Survivor Series, to the changing of the guard almost with the fans slowly beginning to turn on Bret and cheering more and more for Austin because he was a bad ass who took shit from nobody. And of course this match is known for really being THE match where the fans finally make Austin a babyface and turn Bret heel. This match, and the feud leading into it really was the big game changer for the WWF at the time, and it helped their ratings sky rocket and overtake WCW who were on top of the wrestling world. Didn't happen overnight of course, but this imo (not even sure if it's opinion tbh) is the reason why things starting moving up for the WWF. These two men fucking HATE each other, and you feel like the moment they start wailing away at each other the moment the match begins. Austin takes an awesome bump into the ring post too, sounds tremendous. They battle into the crowd in something we would start seeing more and more often over the next year before it became a regular occurrence for 98 and 99 and ended up being meaningless and usually pretty shitty. This feels more like an Old School brawl than the AE "forced" brawls that we got for the most part. These two have reasons to hate each other beyond one of them holding a title and the other wanting it, plus some insults thrown in there. When they get back into the ring, Bret turns it into more of a wrestling match to suit him, and he begins to target the leg, to cause Austin pain and set up the Sharpshooter as submission is the only way to win this one of course. BUT there is still all that HATE here, so just kicking the leg and putting it in leg locks isn't enough; time for a chair! Lol, Bret spills a can of coke or something onto the time keeper. Bret tries to "Pilmanize" Austin's ankle, something of a revenge spot for what Austin did to Pillman, but Austin avoids it and uses the chair on Bret's back, and now has a weak spot of his own to work over. Austin throws Bret outside right in front of his own family, just to really rub it in, so Bret makes him pay by smashing Austin's head into the guard rail that Austin just sent him into when he flew out of the ring, and the BLOOD begins to pour! This whole feud between Bret and Austin is all about how Austin is a violent unforgiving no good SOB.. and the fans are starting to LIKE it, and Bret stands for everything good and pure and can't believe that this is happening. So it's interesting to see Bret slowly begin to get more violent the longer this match goes. Went from punches to the head to smashing it against the guard rail and making Austin bleed. Kicking the legs to smashing them with a steel chair. Bret is turning into the thing he is trying to fight... but the fans are seemingly still turning on him even though now he's doing what they are cheering Austin for. Some of this stuff doesn't mean that much to THIS match, but really helps fuel the rest of the feud and the whole US Vs Canada war that we end up getting. As far as this match goes, it still gives us a great story and some awesome action. SHARPSHOOTER! The infamous finish to this infamous match; blood pours down the face of Austin, Bret has the Sharpshooter locked in tight... and then Austin passes about before he even thinks of giving up! The match ends there, but the fans love and respect the sheer toughness of the Texas Rattlesnake! Sweet jebus this match is wonderful. It truly is. Without a doubt the best WM match up to this point, and unless I love a match or two even more than before when I get to them, only ONE match can stand up to this one. *****. 

Match 6 - Faarooq, Savio vega & Crush Vs Ahmed Johnson & The Legion of Doom - Chicago Street Fight! Which... seems a little overkill after what we just saw lol. Young D-Lo in a tux! Ha, awesome. So this is... exactly as advertised: a fucking street fight. Looks and feels chaotic, just one giant brawl between the two teams. Perfect tbh. Was exactly what it should have been. Tons of fun. There is a fire extinguisher that they use a couple of times too... and fuck knows what's in it but it seems to cover the place in dust and dirt almost, and gives this match a more gritty, real street fight kinda feeling. ***.

Match 7 - Sid Vs The Undertaker - For the first time at WrestleMania, The Undertaker finally got to main event the show and wrestle for the WWF Title! It had already been nearly 6 years since the Dead Man had held the belt, but could he overcome the massive “Psycho” Sid to remain undefeated at WrestleMania AND win the belt? No real story going into this match, which is REALLY weird considering it’s the MAIN EVENT to the biggest show of the year. The entire main event/WWF Title scene was all over the place for the first couple of months in 97, starting with Sid being the champion, losing to Shawn, who had to give it up because of a knee injury. Then Austin won the RR, but cheated to do so, and his title shot was at The Final Four PPV, which saw Austin, Bret, Undertaker and Vader battle for the vacant title. Bret won, but lost the next night to Sid. Vader disappeared from the WWF Title scene for a couple of months, Bret and Austin continued their feud, which left The Undertaker to be the most logical number 1 contender. And so we ended up with this match . The Undertaker was massively over still at this time, so it made sense for him to be in the main event. As for Sid, while he is far, FAR from the best wrestler ever, his size and look was perfect for the wrestling business, and he was one of the first real tweeners in WWF, as despite being a top heel, he would still get cheers (MSG cheered him over HBK at the 1996 Survivor Series). Plus, he was obviously a pretty good draw (he always claims he is, and it’s hard to prove otherwise) since they kept putting the belt on him, and had him main event WrestleMania. Before the match can officially start, Bret Hart comes out and starts to “shoot” on HBK (who was on commentary), The Undertaker, and Sid. Sid clubs his face with a huge right hand, and Powerbombs him! Sid then tells Bret to get his “whiney ass” out of the ring, which gets Sid a huge pop. Sid wastes too much time running his mouth at Bret, which allows The Undertaker to jump the champion and the match is underway! ‘Taker dominates early on, hitting a Stinger Splash to Sid in the corner, followed by a slam, and then Old School. Sid doesn’t go down from Old School, so The Undertaker comes at Sid with another Stinger Splash, only for the monster of a champion to catch the challenger with a bear hug! Nice work from Sid, he already felt the Stinger Splash, and knew The Undertaker was going for it again, so he was able to counter it into a power move that benefits him in his quest to Powerbomb The Undertaker! As The Undertaker tries to fight out of the bear hug, Sid lets go a couple of times and just smashed his first and forearm into the back of the Dead Man! Simple stuff, but really effective back work from Sid! Sid continues with the back work as they go to the outside, which includes a huge slam onto the announce table, followed by a slam into the ring post! Back in the ring, Sid locks in a camel clutch, which again concentrates on the back area of The Undertaker. Sid may not be a great wrestler in terms of having a large move set or being able to take certain moves, but the guys knows how to work the psychology side of a match really well. The Undertaker manages to get some rest when he throws Sid out of the ring and over the guard rail. The brawl on the outside for a moment, before returning to the ring where Sid regains control of this match. A big powerslam takes down Sid one more time, and The Undertaker locks in a nerve grip, which just seems to piss off the champion more than anything lol. We then get a repeat of one of my favourite spots, which actually happened a year earlier, where both Sid and The Undertaker boot each other in the face! This is actually only the second time I have ever seen this match, so I had no idea that was going to happen, as I had forgotten pretty much the entire match . Sid has hardly taken any punishment in this match, and because of this, he is the first to his feet, and is able to continue his domination of The Undertaker. Sid even comes off the second rope numerous times, but does it once too often, allowing The Undertaker to counter, just as Sid did with the Stinger Splash at the start of this match! With Sid down, The Undertaker goes to the ropes, but unlike Sid he is successful! Tombstone attempt coming up, but Sid reverses it, and Tombstones The Undertaker! He covers, and surely has this match won, right? NO! The Undertaker’s finisher didn’t work on the Dead Man, so there is only the Powerbomb left. Bret Hart shows up now, and levels Sid with a chair! Payback for the Powerbomb earlier no doubt. Back in the ring, things look bad for Sid as he gets Chokeslammed to hell! Somehow he still manages to kick out though, and even avoids the leaping lariat of The Undertaker! Sid sets him up for the Powerbomb, but Bret shows up again to distract Sid, allowing The Undertaker to land the Tombstone and win the WWF Title! Wow, this isn’t nearly as bad as people say it is! Despite being 21 minutes, which by all rights it never should have been that long, this is actually pretty good. It didn’t feel like 21 minutes, and never really had any dull parts. Sid did lock in a few submission holds, but they all had a reason and a purpose, and added to the match IMO. Both guys came out looking strong, Sid especially, who kicked out of the Chokeslam, countered so much of The Undertaker’s offence, and dominated the majority of the match. He also only really lost thanks to Bret too. As for The Undertaker, beating Sid for the title was big enough, but he also kicked out of the Tombstone, and survived the match long beating he took from Sid. The only thing I didn’t really like about this match was Bret’s involvement. It took away from the finish IMO, and really it was all rather pointless in the end. Bret didn’t feud with either man after WrestleMania (it wasn’t until 4 or 5 months later at SumerSlam that Bret had a match with The Undertaker), and Sid left not long after this match. But anyway, despite that, I still really enjoyed this match, and thought it was way better than basically everyone else makes it out to be. **3/4.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

> Vader & Mankind Vs Owen Hart & The British Bulldog


Ill have to watch that back again, really hope i like it. It's perfect on paper lol.

Willing to take a match request if i have it.


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

I guess this is a workrate thread unk2

but WrestleMania 13 is a one match show but everything else being thrown together with no story or anticipation involved.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I think "good matches" thread would be more appropriate, actually.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

I think people in this thread pimp enough Dolph Ziggler matches to make that "good match thread" statement false 8*D.

Most of the time though? This thread is good . Pretentious as fuck at times, but good.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

MERRY MUTHAPHUCKKIN CHRISTMAS said:


> *I think people in this thread pimp enough Dolph Ziggler matches to make that "good match thread" statement* false 8*D.
> 
> Most of the time though? This thread is good . Pretentious as fuck at times, but good.


:kobe brah what I ever do


Agree on the other posts


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'd have used HHH as an example rather than Ziggler 8*D.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Or Bret Hart 

Cal I think Ive personally seen you post that wm 13 review 10x. Yes the wargames 92 was posted again. Zep, I already download and saved the hotfile matches before it when down, do they still work ?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

WM 13 seems to get brought up a lot, so I just repost the ramble to save coming up with new thoughts . Be happy I spoiler tag it too. I remember back when some giant cunt would repost his shit all the time without spoiler tags and would take up 90% of the page with his shite .


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Zep, I already download and saved the hotfile matches before it when down, do they still work ?


Not sure what you are asking here mate  Any Hotfile links no longer work, so unless you downloaded the match to your CPU 

Just been reading Cal's blog  Had to laugh at t GIF:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Not sure what you are asking here mate  Any Hotfile links no longer work, so unless you downloaded the match to your CPU


Sorry, What I was asking is I downloaded a couple of your match you upload via hotfile to my laptop months ago. Do they still work even though the website is gone ?

Edit: They work


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Sorry, What I was asking is I downloaded a couple of your match you upload via hotfile to my laptop months ago. Do they still work even though the website is gone ?
> 
> Edit: They work


Yeah course mate lol. If you already downloaded them to your CPU then they are yours


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

:lmao some funny stuff being said in here right now. Computer illiterate people do make me lol at times .

Editing my weekly show atm, the CHRISTMAS edition. Which isn't very christmasy. Just me in a santa hat and some snow effects really. Anyway, once I get this out of the way I'm digging out my BACKLUND COMP and I'm gonna watch some BOB. I can't wait to see how many matches BOB and FLAIR get in the top 100 80's matches poll. I've got a list of 16 matches so far, 9 Flair and 4 BOB, and I haven't even begun to scratch the surface of their 80's work :mark:.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Bob Backlund gave meaning to Ken Patera's life. Damn that guy was the best. Multiple classics with Ken freakin' Patera!


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao soo bad with technology, you would think I'm in my 70s


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I'm excited to watch this "bloodbath" match between Hennig & Bockwinkle that everyone seems to love.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> finished flair/windham, ehh I can understand the praise, but just a tad slow for me.


Agreed here. I see why people like it but I'm not a huge fan. I think Flair has had a lot better matches. 



RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Kinda reminds me of flair/sting


I love that match though at the original CotC. Probably because 7 year old me remembers it very well when it happened. 



funnyfaces1 said:


> Paul's Boutique


Beasties!! :mark: 



JY57 said:


> Best of RAW & Smackdown 2013 DVD Set


Sweet cover. Damn Steph mmmm. 

This SHOULD be a great set. Excited to see what matches are on it. Blu Ray too I hope. 



funnyfaces1 said:


> Bob Backlund gave meaning to Ken Patera's life. Damn that guy was the best. Multiple classics with Ken freakin' Patera!


Can we see a Backlund set from the E please? Really want Backlund/Patera Texas Death on blu ray. 



A William Murderface Christmas said:


> I'm excited to watch this "bloodbath" match between Hennig & Bockwinkle that everyone seems to love.


Amazing match.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Guys, give me a good match with terrible commentary. I want to dub a match with Paul's Boutique now that C2D has it as his avatar. Now why can't we be more like him with our music taste? I mean who listens to Paramore in 2013? :hayley2


I could probably enjoy HHH vs HBK inside HIAC with Paul's Boutique in the background.  They're both around 50 minutes so I might actually give it a try, lol.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

That is a fun idea. Take a boring, longer match and turn the sound down and put on a good album. 

My buddy and I had a you tube idea of taking matches and doing our own goofy sarcastic commentary.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I thought everyone knew that ? If you watch a match with you favorite tunes instead of commentary it becomes 10x better


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Gonna review all three discs of the best of IYH DVD I just got, this seems like an amazing set 

I'm gonna get to NWO 04 this week too


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

YoungGun_UK said:


> WrestleMania 13 and 17 in the same category? along with 22 being a good WrestleMania?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Mania 22 is my 2nd favorite, after 24. :$

I also love HBK/Vince so that might have something to do with it.

Carlito/Masters vs Kane/Show - **
MITB - ***1/2
Benoit/JBL - ***1/4
Edge/Foley - ****1/2
HBK/Vince - ****1/4
Henry/Taker - **
Mickie/Trish - ***1/4
Orton/Rey/Angle - **3/4
Trips/Cena - ***1/2

17 doesn't hold up as well for me (compared to the spectacle I considered it as a kid. Still a very good show) and I find 13 thoroughly entertaining.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

smitty915 said:


> Gonna review all three discs of the best of IYH DVD I just got, this seems like an amazing set
> 
> I'm gonna get to NWO 04 this week too


Best of IYH is a sham. A FUCKING SHAME. They call it the "best of" and miss out THE greatest match ever, never mind IYH match. Cunts. I'm gonna have to wait for Undertaker's retirement set to get it on Bluray, aren't I? 

But aside from that GIGANTIC FUCK UP the last looks great... with a couple of shitty matches thrown in because WWE don't understand the meaning of "best of" . And some are missing too.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Willing to take a match request if i have it.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

gonna watch that backlund/patera match now


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

After that watch:

Bob Backlund vs. Sgt. Slaughter - WWF - 01/10/1981
Bob Backlund vs. Sgt. Slaughter - Steel Cage – WWF - 03/21/1981
Bob Backlund vs. Adrian Adonis - WWF - MSG - 01/18/1982
Bob Backlund vs. Don Muraco - Texas Death Match - WWF - MSG - 09/21/1981

I have all of these above the Patera match. Plus the '79 hour Broadway with Valentine (but this was just from my 80's list lol).


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Wow. Not only was he able to have a good match with Patera, but he was also able to have a good one with Muraco too. And Don Muraco is incapable of doing anything good. There better be some Tito Santana.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Reigns :mark:


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> I thought everyone knew that ? If you watch a match with you favorite tunes instead of commentary it becomes 10x better


As a huge music dork it's weird I didn't put 2 and 2 together sooner. 

Also, if Renee REALLY likes the Clash? :mark: 



CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> After that watch:
> 
> Bob Backlund vs. Sgt. Slaughter - WWF - 01/10/1981
> Bob Backlund vs. Sgt. Slaughter - Steel Cage – WWF - 03/21/1981
> ...


Ok WWE.....get on a Backlund set please!


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Renee is soooo cute. Got to see her up close at SummerSlam Axxess too...:banderas 

Probably gonna watch some matches tonight after the Sunday Night game. Been watching a lot of Benoit and Eddie this weekend (rewatched their match from Super J Cup for the first time in a while :mark


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Wow. Not only was he able to have a good match with Patera, but he was also able to have a good one with Muraco too. And Don Muraco is incapable of doing anything good. There better be some Tito Santana.


Will upload _Windham/Flair 1/20/87_ this week  Think i did upload it but the link is now dead


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Reigns :mark:



I nearly shot my load when I saw that on Friday, easily the highlight of the match. Reigns is just the best man, I don't know any other way of putting it.

I do feel like Rollins is getting slept on a bit these days because Reigns has been getting so much shine, but Seth is still easily the best worker of the bunch and is just an amazing little shit heel. My dream scenario for a Shield break up involves a prolonged feud between Rollins and Reigns that culminates in a Hell in a Cell match. Can you just imagine :mark:


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Renee is totally girl next door adorable. I'm hoping to run into her when I go to Raw in a few weeks. :renee 

How about Reigns vs Rollins vs Ambrose Hell in a Cell at like Extreme Rules after Mania? :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Watching some early 90s Ted Dibiase matches. Unfortunately, I can't find a single good one. How is it possible to have a near DUD with Ricky Steamboat :aries2? The Kerry Von Erich match in London and his matches with Paul Roma and Dusty Rhodes were not very good either. In other words, I need some Ted Dibiase. And not his matches with Savage and Flair. Everyone has seen those.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Sadly I have to agree. DiBiase was awesome until about 1990ish. Maybe it was injuries? Hard to say. But yeah his Midsouth and early WWF stuff was just great. I did enjoy Money Inc as a tag team though. 

DiBiase/Steamboat should have been fantastic and DiBiase should have got a good match out of KVE.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

In fairness, KVE lost every bit of talent he had by that point. Bah, guess it's time to go through Savage's three best series of matches in the WWE. First off, Tito Santana!


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

I'd love to see a re-release of the Savage set. Like the Brock re-release. With a few more matches and HoF ceremony if/when he gets in.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I guess FYE is doing a buy one get one free on WWE DVDs. Might have to take a trip down there and finally pick up IYH/War Games.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

IYH set is just :mark:


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

MachoMadness1988 said:


> IYH set is just :mark:


It's got some real classics on it and plenty of stuff I haven't seen. CANADIAN STAMPEDE TAG MATCH IS ON IT~!


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Had they put the :hbk :taker HiaC match it might be the perfect set. It was long overdue. I wish it had the :vader/Razor Ramon match from IYH 7 because it was Razor Ramon's last match in WWF and I was there. 

What if you had to pick between Canadian Stampede 10 man tag or Bret :taker :austin3 :vader Final Four? I don't even fucking know. I probably pick the final four but that atmosphere at the 10 man tag and :austin3 's heel performance is just great.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I think I'd pick the ten man tag but those are both fantastic matches. If I had to choose one of those two or HBK/Taker HIAC I'd go HBK/Taker though. 

Never seen Razor/Vader. Liked both guys though.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Unpopular opinion time.....

I love HBK/Taker HiaC but I probably like the 10 man tag and final four better. But 1997 was just an amazing year to be a teenage wrestling fan. So much awesomeness. The Savage/DDP feud over at DubyaSeeDubya was great too. 

Vader/Razor was pretty solid but I'm sure I like it more (same with HBK/Diesel no holds barred) because I was there. 

Hoping for some amazing best of 2014 match at Raw when I go in a few weeks.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> Mania 22 is my 2nd favorite, after 24. :$
> 
> I also love HBK/Vince so that might have something to do with it.
> 
> ...


WM 22 :mark:

WM 17 is probably my favorite WM.


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> Mania 22 is my 2nd favorite, after 24. :$
> 
> I also love HBK/Vince so that might have something to do with it.
> 
> ...


don't sweat it, everyone's got there tastes,just shows WWE can never please everyone:westbrook2

however just like to point out X7 is the GREATEST OF ALL TIME:kanye2


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Currently watching Now Way Out 1998 (Y)


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*The Best of In your house DVD review 

Disc one*

*Match #1: Bret Hart vs Hakushi* 

I remember this match being amazing, as I have this on the Bret Hart set as well. IIRC this is very different than your standard Hart match, because Hakushi is kind of a high flying worker while Hart as we all know…isn’t. So looking forward to this, and it seems to me that Hakushi has WAY too many tattoos, lets hop their fake like Tensai’s. Bret cuts a strange promo where he talks about how his mother wants him to hurt Hakushi, random, but fitting I guess because its mother’s day. This was just a FUN match throughout, never boring and always exciting. I always found myself interested in this match and never really disinterested and that’s always a huge plus of course. Now I want to see more from this guy, because he is an interesting worker, but maybe Bret just carried him here. Only downside I can find is the fact that Bret acts like Cena here as Hakushi controls the match 80% of the time and Hart comes outta nowhere to win, but besides that this is awesome. ***3/4 

*Match #2: Jeff Jarrett vs Shawn Michaels*

Apparently this is the only watchable Jeff Jarret match, which makes sense considering its against HBK, guy could carry half the roster. Jeff Jarret has dat classic ******* gimmick goin here, you know what? I think we need another ******* gimmick back in the WWE, could work great, but maybe the Wyatts kind of count? Nah I doubt it. The beginning of this is weird, Jarret does a lot of gloating but Michaels eventually always gets him to start fighting again. Seems to be more of a comedic match with the goof outfits that Jarett and his manager are wearing, and HBK gets a lot more offense in, but that’s why it’s a fun match. Yeah so this was another match that was just FUN all the way through, very similar to the previous match in that it was a legend and a guy not known for GREAT matches, this was just that, a great match. ****

*Match #3: Razor Ramon vs Dean Douglas*

I have no idea who this guy is, Douglas of course, not DA BAD GUY. Oh wait this is Shane Douglas :lol I should of known that haha, well than this should be great and not the MEH I was expecting. Apprarently Shawn got beaten up by marines and this is why he’s forfeiting the title, well than fuck those guys, fake marines who don’t do shit but beat up our wrestling heroes, disgusting. But anyways this should be awesome. This match was fine, not as good as the first 2 matches on this set but certainly not bad by any stretch. I liked it, but it seemed to be missing something that would elevate it from a good match to a great one. ***1/2

*Match #4: Hunter Hearst Helmsley vs Henry O. Godwin( Hog pen match)*

What the fuck is this? They include a “Hog pen match” but exclude HBK/Taker HIAC? PATHETIC! I guess this was so they can get haitch on the DVD, but this better be short as fuck or I’m just gonna go to the next match, you know what? That sounds like a fantastic idea! NO

*Match#5: Bret Hart vs The British Bulldog 
*
Well this should be a good match, haven’t seen it in a while and cannot remember a single thing about this. I like the Summerslam match enough, probably in the ****-****1/4 range, but I’ve seen 5 stars for both this and the original match, doubt I’ll like it that much, but who knows. This was much better than their SS match IMO, this felt a lot more grittier and I liked Davey Boy as a heel in this match, especially with Cornette, one of my favorite managers ever. Davey Boy controlled the majority of this match, but that didn’t make the match any worse than it would have been if Bret would have controlled it. This did start out slow but DAMN did it pick up after like the first 10 minutes. It turned from a MEH mat wrestling match into a great bloody brawl, which was a strange but awesome transformation. So yeah this was fucking awesome, this is as underrated as their SS match is overrated, really fun stuff, check this out. ****1/2​


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Currently watching Now Way Out 1998 (Y)


This is perfect time to watch some Tatsumi Fujinami, and you choose to punish yourself by doing this.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

That Bret/Davey match at IYH is great. Really liked HBK/Jarrett as well. 

Rocking the :brock set tonight. What a beast. Kayfabe speaking the dude beat :flair :rock Hogan :taker and :angle2 in less than a year. Damn. Does anything come close to that?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> This is perfect time to watch some Tatsumi Fujinami, and you choose to punish yourself by doing this.


I have been watching all the PPV's from 97 & this just happened to be next on the list 

What's a good Fujinami match?


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=tatsumi+fujinami

There we go.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Which match is good?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm surprised you didn't ask your brother. The answer to any question like that is Vader. They had a very nice series. Of course, who else besides Kane and Hogan had a bad series against :vader? 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2HWA7MZQDU
This is good too.

That rep you gave me is GOAT.

EDIT: I found a PPV where every match is a potential DUD: Superbrawl V. I'll watch it tomorrow after work and tell you guys how bad it is. I remember the main event being the olden day equivalent of Rock/Punk RR.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I'm surprised you didn't ask your brother. The answer to any question like that is Vader. They had a very nice series. Of course, who else besides Kane and Hogan had a bad series against :vader?
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2HWA7MZQDU
> This is good too.
> ...


That butt head is sleeping 

That gif made me chuckle


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

forget about that jobber Murderface watch this


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

@ funnyfaces: I was really bored in that match, I had to power through it  but thanks for the reccomendation 

@ Skins: WCW :lenny


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

lmao my friend that works in hollywood came home today and he was telling me he ran into John Morrison. Morrison is taking acting lessons. RETURN PLZ. :side:

He met Ted Jr too who was auditioning for some small role in a movie. :lmao


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> lmao my friend that works in hollywood came home today and he was telling me he ran into John Morrison. Morrison is taking acting lessons. RETURN PLZ. :side:
> 
> He met Ted Jr too who was auditioning for some small role in a movie. :lmao


fpalm


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> fpalm


Are you facepalming at DiBiase or Morrison? :side:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Bah, it was worth a shot.

How many Flair/Windham matches were there? I've seen the BOTB one and right now I'm watching one where Dusty is on commentary, but what else is there?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Both haha, I'd rather have them both be wrestling.



> How many Flair/Windham matches were there? I've seen the BOTB one and right now I'm watching one where Dusty is on commentary, but what else is there?


On the YouTube page?


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I want Morrison back real bad. Loved Ted too. They were both real good in the ring and Morrison actually had a big following. Ted connected with fans on a smaller level real well.

I'd mark like crazy if Morrison returned though.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I think we'd all be very excited if JoMo and Ted came back, I know I'd be like this :mark:


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Acting you say?


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Oh god. :lmao


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

About to watch Christian vs. Orton from OTL 11 and I've just been thinking about how I thought Orton should've turned heel after winning the title from Christian two days after ER. I mean, he didn't do anything as a face after winning the title anyways.

Well, he put over Henry, but Christian as the face champion putting over Henry would've been so good, even if it wouldn't have been quite as impactful since Orton's the bigger star. Ah, who cares? FIP Christian vs. monster heel Henry... :mark: :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Oliver-94 said:


> Acting you say?


Where the fuck is that from? :lol Not Uwe Boll is it.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

No idea :lol


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Could be the Marine movie he's in...wait, he isn't in any other movies is he? :taker

Just finished Bryan vs. Ziggler because it was on WWE's channel . Now watching Bret vs. Owen since that made me want to watch another opener that tore the house down.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I'm surprised you didn't ask your brother. The answer to any question like that is Vader. They had a very nice series. Of course, who else besides Kane and Hogan had a bad series against :vader?
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2HWA7MZQDU
> This is good too.
> ...


*Ric Flair vs Barry Windham - 20.01.1987 - NWA World Wide Wrestling*

NWA World Championship Match

'From the Official Ultimate Ric Flair Collection DVD Set':

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/27831257-post2.html


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I'm surprised you didn't ask your brother. The answer to any question like that is Vader. They had a very nice series. Of course, who else besides Kane and Hogan had a bad series against :vader?
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2HWA7MZQDU
> This is good too.
> ...


I wasn't so sure the semi-shoot style would be his sort of "thing" tbf. Which is why I've never pitched Fujinami to him. I'm still trying to show him more Kawada first.

The opener on that Superbrawl has presented me w/the hilarity of wrestlecrap a ton of times. Paul Roma. Hey, you suck pal.

btw, unsure off the top of my head about your Vader question. I normally don't associate "Vader" & "bad" in the same grouping. So it's hard to compute. _(It really is.)_


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Speaking of Batista:






Apparantly, the office told Batista to treat the match as a squash, but he 'let' it be more of a competitive match (think its this one). First time i seen it


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

BATISTA :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

watching all these austin/steamboat matches :lenny


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Did you hit up the Flair & Austin vs Sting & Steamboat tag from WCW Saturday Night circa '94?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Did you hit up the Flair & Austin vs Sting & Steamboat tag from WCW Saturday Night circa '94?


Is that the one that involves Sherri? Or am i thinking of another one


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Did you hit up the Flair & Austin vs Sting & Steamboat tag from WCW Saturday Night circa '94?


lol I just posted it here last night for your brother to see :lenny great stuff

Yea Zep Sherri is in it, took a bump like a champ


----------



## JY57 (Jul 31, 2012)

> - WrestlingDVDNews.com reports that WWE will be releasing a "Best of RAW: Not on RAW" DVD in 2014. The set will be made up of post-RAW dark segments, skits and matches. It will be a three-disc DVD set coming out in April and a Blu-ray is also expected.


Read more at http://www.lordsofpain.net/news/wwe...Matches_and_Segments.html#wm20RQZTU1K7itDS.99


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Could be an interesting DVD, might be garbage though :lol. Wonder if they show house show matches? 

Speaking of house shows, I have tickets to one in 2 weeks, anyone wanna tell me if their fun?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Willing to take a match request if i have it.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Willing to take a match request if i have it.


I have yet to see the Chamber from NYR05 in good quality so that if you could


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

PGSucks said:


> I have yet to see the Chamber from NYR05 in good quality so that if you could


Sure. I'll up it tomorrow.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> Sure. I'll up it tomorrow.


Thanks! :dance

Gonna watch something before I get lunch with my buddies. I think I'll watch Punk vs. Hardy TLC the second time because I remember nothing about it


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> lol I just posted it here last night for your brother to see :lenny great stuff
> 
> Yea Zep Sherri is in it, took a bump like a champ


:hb

match is the tits.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Okay, top 50 matches of 2013.



> 50. The Wyatts vs William Regal, Adrian Neville, and Corey Graves, NXT, July 11
> 49. Antonio Cesaro vs Sheamus Smackdown, June 14
> 48. Elimination Chamber Match
> 47. Daniel Bryan vs Luke Harper Smackdown, November 8
> ...


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Alright C2D, you win. I marked out like fucking crazy for Batista!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> gonna watch that backlund/patera match now







Terrific.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

smitty915 said:


> Could be an interesting DVD, might be garbage though :lol. Wonder if they show house show matches?
> 
> Speaking of house shows, I have tickets to one in 2 weeks, anyone wanna tell me if their fun?


Who do you have advertised to appear? I wasn't going to buy tickets when the house show in my area was advertising Randy Orton vs. Big Show. But then they changed their advertising to say that they will have Bryan, Punk, the Shield, and the Wyatts. I'm assuming that I will get at least 2 quality matches out of them and since my ticket cost $15 I'm going. However Orton, Cena, Big Show, and Goldust and Cody are advertised for a different show on the same day. 

The matches are usually pretty basic and you won't get any title changes and the faces will almost always go over. But if someone is good enough it won't matter.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Alright C2D, you win. I marked out like fucking crazy for Batista!


Did they show a video package? And did they announce a return date? I turned it off because I already read the spoilers and don't care about anything going on. But BATISTA'S return... :mark:

I wont expect him to return as a heel but I hope he'll have something similar going on because he was awesome in his last few months before leaving.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Did they show a video package? And did they announce a return date? I turned it off because I already read the spoilers and don't care about anything going on. But BATISTA'S return... :mark:
> 
> I wont expect him to return as a heel but I hope he'll have something similar going on because he was awesome in his last few months before leaving.


Yeah, they had a pretty nice video package for his return, which will be on the go-home show of the Royal Rumble (January 20).


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Video package was pretty cool. Should be real interesting to see how they use him.

Also, this six man tag is great. (Y)


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Merry Fitzmas To All said:


> Who do you have advertised to appear? I wasn't going to buy tickets when the house show in my area was advertising Randy Orton vs. Big Show. But then they changed their advertising to say that they will have Bryan, Punk, the Shield, and the Wyatts. I'm assuming that I will get at least 2 quality matches out of them and since my ticket cost $15 I'm going. However Orton, Cena, Big Show, and Goldust and Cody are advertised for a different show on the same day.
> 
> The matches are usually pretty basic and you won't get any title changes and the faces will almost always go over. But if someone is good enough it won't matter.


I have the Punk, Bryan, Shield, Wyatts, Big E, Fandango, Miz, Mark GOAT Henry, and Damien Sandow

Not too bad, hoping for a Punk/Bryan match :mark:


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I've had a good time at all the houseshows I've gone to. Even the ones with smaller named guys have turned out fun. The wrestling is generally good and most of it is pretty light hearted.

Shield vs Sheamus/Ryback/Cena, Bryan/Christian, Henry/Hardy, Chavo/Bourne, Carlito/Benjamin/Nitro and Jericho/Ziggler are some of the better ones I've seen.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Yeah, they had a pretty nice video package for his return, which will be on the go-home show of the Royal Rumble (January 20).


Just saw it on their site. Man, I'm excited! :mark:


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Fuck, this match is awesome. The eventual Bryan/Bray match is going to be epic.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Terrific.


I watched that yesterday as well, good had some dull periods but solid nonetheless

Just got home anything special on raw


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

smitty915 said:


> I have the Punk, Bryan, Shield, Wyatts, Big E, Fandango, Miz, Mark GOAT Henry, and Damien Sandow
> 
> Not too bad, hoping for a Punk/Bryan match :mark:


I just saw a commercial during Raw that is advertising Punk vs. The Shield in a handicap match and Bryan vs. Bray Wyatt in a cage match. I feel like the 3 on 1 turns into a 6 man and Bryan/Wyatt in a cage would be fantastic.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Pretty sure the other match would be Usos/Rollins and reigns

Wyatt/Bryan cage :mark:

When's your show? Mines January 4th, I'll try to tell you about what matches happen


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

HollyJollyHelmsley said:


> Okay, top 50 matches of 2013.


nice list Haitch, have some things different but solid, didnt think much of the shield/taker hell no tag


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Christian vs Del Rio from SummerSlam is the best match that won't get proper praise.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Watched the three main events from SSlam with my friends today and I still think that Del Rio vs. Christian would've been MOTN (or close to it) for pretty much every PPV afterwards. :draper2


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I still think it was a good match, but it went down for me on last watch. Good arm work, of course, but Christian just didn't do it for me so much in that match. Probably would have been MOTN for NOC, and HIAC, but Battleground. Tag match RULES that show. I actually enjoying Del Rio/RVD from Battleground as well.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Great list HJH. (Y)

2013: Year of the six man tag. WWE kept that going tonight.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

smitty915 said:


> Pretty sure the other match would be Usos/Rollins and reigns
> 
> Wyatt/Bryan cage :mark:
> 
> When's your show? Mines January 4th, I'll try to tell you about what matches happen


Mine is January 11th so unless there is the most shocking Raw ever between them we should get similar cards.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Cody, are you still a fan of RVD/ADR from Night of Champions? I thought it's even more underappreciated than ADR/Christian.


----------



## WrestlingOracle (Jul 6, 2013)

Chris Benoit vs Brock Lesnar Smackdown title match:

As custom to the 02-03 period, another very solid match that involves the Smackdown 6.

Really quick pace throughout this bout that really mixed well with the intensity displayed by both men and the 
crispness in which they hit each other with their moves and irish whips into the steps yet despite the quick pace, this match wasn't a warpseed moveset showcase ala Kid/Owen Hart at wrestlemania. Both men's selling was on point and Lesnar's selling of Benoit's chops in particular really made such a mechanically simple strike look very devastating. (on a side note I have always felt that while people gravitate torwards the size to speed ratio of Lesnar, his freakish strength and unmatched intensity I feel that Lesnar's technical ability and selling especially is often underrated)

Back to this review, some spots that stick out to me in this match is the delayed fisherman buster Lesnar pulled early on Benoit, Lesnar hitting one of the sickest powerslams in recent history. 
As for the finish, I suppose some people could find the finish corny, but I enjoyed that Lesnar spun Benoit into the ref during an attempted sidewalk slam as opposed to the generic dime a dozen accidental shove we have seen so many times. I feel that Lesnar tapping while the ref was out protected the crossface and was yet another good piece in the 20003 and really career story of Benoit in the US as a great wrestler on the cusp of winning the big belt who has always come within inches but never grasped the belt which made his win at mania 20 that much more special when considering Benoit's journey. Benoit kicking out of the F5 When it was very well protected outside of Angle was a cool way to build suspense. Benoit passing out instead of tapping was a good booking choice in my view as well. Lesnar with some funny post match antics "making good on his pre match promise". This is a hard match to give a star rating per say but if I had to force it I think a 3 and a half or so would suffice. Just doesn't have enough for me to warrant a full four or five. Still, both men put on a good show and everything they did hit well.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Haven't been keeping up with WWE for a while. Could anyone recommend some good matches from this month?


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

StraightEdgeSanta said:


> Haven't been keeping up with WWE for a while. Could anyone recommend some good matches from this month?


Bryan/Orton on RAW last week [December 16, 2013]. Here's the link. A million times better than their PPV matches, and very clear heel/face performances. 

I like how HHH seemed to come out of character during his recent weekly interviews, to praise how good that match was ("very well deserved [at the interviewer saying that it was a MOTYC]. It was incredible.").


I also really liked Bryan vs. the Wyatt Family at TLC. I don't know if that's a popular opinion or not. More of a storytelling device than a fantastic back and forth match, but I found it riveting, and it's by far Bray Wyatt's best performance, IMO.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> Bryan/Orton on RAW last week [December 16, 2013]. Here's the link. A million times better than their PPV matches, and very clear heel/face performances.
> 
> I like how HHH seemed to come out of character during his recent weekly interviews, to praise how good that match was ("very well deserved [at the interviewer saying that it was a MOTYC]. It was incredible.").
> 
> ...


Thanks, I'm going to check that out. I remember watching their Night of Champions match and being unimpressed by it. Haven't watched their Battleground and Hell in a Cell match yet, so I may give those a watch as well. I really liked their pre-Orton heel turn series so I'm going to watch their WWE title feud.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

^You will definitely find their RAW match the best of the bunch, I'm pretty sure. Both were on fire, and there were so many subtlities you pick up, the more you watch it.


@ your rep, a lot of people liked the Shield vs. Punk handicap match at TLC. I wasn't so high on it, but since you're a Shield fan & others liked it, I'd definitely say check it out. It was another match that was more of a storytelling device/story advancer. If you watch that, then you should probably check out the Punk & Usos vs. The Shield match the next night on RAW [12/16/13] too.

Dean Ambrose & Punk had a good match on RAW or Smackdown. I don't remember which. Hopefully someone can chime in with what show that was, and what date it was.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

^ I remember watching the Ambrose/Punk match on Smackdown. It was really good, gave it ***1/2. I need to watch their Raw match though. Ambrose and Punk are :mark:

As a matter of fact, I need to keep up on a lot of matches lol


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Forgot to record Raw  Not too fussed as it was a Xmas special, but I missed the Batista video. Arrrrrrrgggggghhhhhh!!!!!


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Okay, let's make it quick: MERRY CHRISTMAS, HOLY FUCK at Batista, and my top 20 matches of the year:

20. Sheamus/Barrett, ME 5/29
19. ADR/Christian, SSlam
18. Cena, Sheamus & Ryback/Shield, EC
17. HHH/Lesnar, ER
16. Rollins/Bryan, Raw 6/10
15. WHC Contract MITB, MITB
14. Regal/Ohno, NXT 4/27
13. Bryan/Cesaro, Raw 7/22
12. Hell No & Taker/Shield, Raw 4/22
11. Orton/Bryan, Raw 12/16
10. Shield/Hell No, Raw 5/27
9. Cesaro/Zayn, NXT 8/23
8. Shield/Rhodes Bros, BG
7. Shield/Rhodes Bros, Raw 10/14
6. Shield/Hell No & Kofi, Raw 5/20
5. Ziggler/ADR, PB
4. Cena/Bryan, SSlam
3. Cena/Punk, Raw 2/25
2. Taker/Punk, WM
1. Punk/Lesnar, SSlam

PEACE.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Saw the Batista vid on YT. :mark:

I'm excited


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

PGSucks said:


> I have yet to see the Chamber from NYR05 in good quality so that if you could


*Elimination Chamber 2005 - WWE New Year Revolution 2005*

Triple H vs Batista vs Edge vs Randy Orton vs Chris Jericho vs Chris Benoit

_WWE DVD Version - Benoit commentary etc intact  Also includes full buildup video._

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-m...-new-year-revolution-2005-a.html#post27865977


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

So Batista is coming back. Yey... not really yey but whatever. The fuck he is gonna wrestle at WM? Only guy I can think of that would almost guarantee a good match from him is Undertaker. And that would be a waste of Undertaker. Not expecting shit from the guy tbh.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

http://www.wrestlingdvdnews.com/wwe-shawn-michaels-mr-wrestlemania-dvd-cover/56812/



> Now, fans can own all 17 of his iconic WrestleMania matches. See all the jaw-dropping action from The Showstopper on WWE’s grandest stage.”


Can i quote the sales of goods act to vince :side:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The fucked up the cover on that DVD set. Says Mr WrestleMania, but its a Shawn Michaels set? I R CONFUZZLED.


----------



## RKO1988 (Jul 25, 2008)

Anyone know if that 20 episode collection is any good? I know they edited out Beniwah, some offensive chants and Rocking choking Mankind with a cord but what else? And are the later episodes from the late 00s any good ones? I can't see myself paying to see any RAWs from 07-current.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Watching the ME from Final Four, atm.

Vader vs Undertaker vs Stone Cold vs Bret Hart? :mark:

hope it delivers


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Vader/Taker/Austin/BORT is excellent, excellent, excellent. A perfect Christmas gift for any wrestling fan.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Cody, are you still a fan of RVD/ADR from Night of Champions? I thought it's even more underappreciated than ADR/Christian.


Aye. But Del Rio vs Christian is a top ten match for me, probably top five so the comparisons to my point don't quite equal the same result. Do agree on Del Rio vs RVD being unappreciated too. It's good. Ignore a bland finish for all the rest. Loads better than the average, poorly paced gimmick match from Battleground.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Looking at lists, besides the obvious 9-10, my list is mostly different than all here so far


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Had no idea ADR/Christian was underappreciated around here. If it is, man people need to open their eyes. Disagree with ADR/RVD NOC being underrated though, let alone better than the surprisingly decent BG Hardcore match. It has too much "ADR being RVD's landing mat" moments for my own taste. For that kind of stuff, Jericho/RVD from Raw in July worked better. And surely not enough ADR heelish ass-kicking like in the Ziggler or Christian matches.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Jericho vs RVD was only fun thanks to nostalgia. If that match wasn't something we haven't seen since 2003, most would open their eyes to the flaws it holds.


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

Still have some Boss Man matches to watch, but I'm suddenly in a Irwin R. Schyster mood. Any matches of his worth a look?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

No one is saying it isn't flawed. Of course it is - for me, the opening moments of the match were kinda dull, and it does suffer from pacing issues, and it's also a bit too spotty. However, as you mentioned, there's the factor of NOSTALGIA~ of seeing those two perform all those MOVEZ~ at this day and age like if it perfectly were 10 years ago, which is quite impressive. And essentially, from the very moment Maddox made that match earlier the night, that's what they were going for - a nostalgic tribute to the "good ol' days". Which is odd 'cause a decade ago we had Raw 2003 AKA WWE TV at its not so finest... however we did have SD 2003 as well so there's that.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

ATF said:


> No one is saying it isn't flawed. Of course it is - for me, the opening moments of the match were kinda dull, and it does suffer from pacing issues, and it's also a bit too spotty. However, as you mentioned, there's the factor of NOSTALGIA~ of seeing those two perform all those MOVEZ~ at this day and age like if it perfectly were 10 years ago, which is quite impressive. And essentially, from the very moment Maddox made that match earlier the night, that's what they were going for - *a nostalgic tribute to the "good ol' days". Which is odd 'cause a decade ago we had Raw 2003 AKA WWE TV at its not so finest*... however we did have SD 2003 as well so there's that.


It's still the "good ol' days" and I'd give anything to have it back!


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'd rather watch WWE's Saturday show than have Raw 03 back.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Well, Raw 03 truth be told was still no worse than its PPV's. Speaking of that 2013 may have had amazing TV, but other than a select few it sucked ass for PPV.

Let's see:
SummerSlam > Money In The Bank > WrestleMania > Payback >> Elimination Chamber > TLC >>> Survivor Series > Hell In A Cell > Battleground >> Night Of Champions >>> Royal Rumble.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Tbhayley I rather have anything besides wwe 09/2012 than right now.Thinking about stopping my viewing of the current product for a few weeks, its horrid atm, and not trying to hyperbole. Raw is such a chore these days, Ive actually skipped the past 2 episodes and have no interest in catching up. Maybe RTWM will rejuvenate the product but whatever, Have no interest in watching a product that pushs Big E, current day Orton, fandango etc and also having shitty story lines


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

RAW in 2003 was less offensive on the garbage scale than Smackdown was in 2004. What a crummy one note product.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Speaking of SD 2004, I heard some people say TGAB was worse than Armageddon that year. I totally disagree.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I completely disagree too. GAB has it's pile of bantha poo doo on it, but it also has two great matches on it. Armageddon barely has one that's anything special. And the MOTN on that event is kind of a chore to sit through. GAB is less offensive at the end of the day. What can you say though, both events are bad. Basic case & point of Smackdown that year. IE look at who the good matches involved at GAB: Eddie & Mysterio. The only real constants the entire 12 month mark up.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

SD in 2004 was completely carried by Eddie and JBL. I guess you can give Mysterio credit as the undercard workhorse too. I don't know why Taker worked so little that year.

It's mindblowing to look at the complete turn around and contrast in quality between Raw and Smackdown in 2003 and 2004.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Royal Rumble '07

Hardyz/MNM - ***3/4
Lashley/Test - **1/2
Batista/Kennedy - ***
Umaga/Cena - *****
Rumble match - ****1/2

Royal Rumble '08
Flair/MVP - *3/4
JBL/Jericho - **3/4
Edge/Mysterio - ***1/2
Orton/Hardy - ****
Rumble match - ****

Royal Rumble '09
Swagger/Hardy - ***1/2
Melina/Phoenix - ***
Cena/JBL - ***1/4
Edge/Hardy - ***1/2
Rumble match - ***3/4

Really like all three of these shows but my god the '07 entire show is fantastic. (Y)


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Hardys vs MNM :mark:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

That Raw/SD twist took place the very moment Krispin Wah went to Raw - SD became Raw 03 awful, Raw became SD 03 awesome. THE KRISPIN FACTOR ZOMGUHUPGLBGBB~

RR 2007 fucking ruled. Except Lashley/Test which fucking sucked. Other than that, great show.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Hardys vs MNM :mark:


So good. I need to watch the D2D one but I haven't watched that show since it happened. :lmao


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

ATF said:


> That twist took place the very moment Krispin Wah went to Raw - SD became Raw 03 awful, Raw became SD 03 awesome. THE KRISPIN FACTOR ZOMGUHUPGLBGBB~


Well, Benoit is the GOAT. Everywhere he went, greatness followed.  And the funny thing is, it's not even a myth.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

D2D one isn't as good as the RR match. Gets a little shitty in parts tbh. Still good overall but yeah, RR is much better.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's been eons since I last saw that show in full too. Not sure why I'd want to see it again, but there are always those kinds of nights. Def do have to watch their first tag match. Remember nothing about it. Did always think Rumble was a notch above it, but both were pretty "wow" level as a series.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

http://wrestlingview.co.uk/?p=994


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

D2D 2006 isn't as Godawful as some will make you believe... well Hardys/MNM was an awesome opener, and there are two ** (at best) worthy mild matches (Mahoney/Striker and the Chamber) that sorta help not make it a true all time stinker. Still not worth your time minus the opener.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Fact they made Knox/Kelly vs Thorn/Ariel & another Daivari match on PPV a reality is why that show deserves to be shit on.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Does anyone else LOVE the trips/Sheamus match at wm 26? Just watched it for the first time and thought it was a ton of fun, prolly ****


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----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I like it, but not love it. *** from me, was solid but was definitely missing that SOMETHING to get it to anything near a **** match. Still, Sheamus did the best he could considering who he was in the ring with 8*D.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Also considering he was new to the WWE at the time, I enjoyed it a ton. I say if these two don't have a spot on the card come Mania time a rematch would be a good Midcard match. 

That Rey/punk match though :mark:


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----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

If HHH isn't putting Bryan over (or at least Punk) at Mania, then I'm not interested in him wrestling at all tbhayley. :HHH2


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Just finished watching Unforgiven 1998 and it was awful except for the inferno match & Austin/Dude.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

We can now embed Dailymotion videos!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :dance


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

smitty915 said:


> Does anyone else LOVE the trips/Sheamus match at wm 26? Just watched it for the first time and thought it was a ton of fun, prolly ****
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


Not love, but Sheamus made me really enjoy it. Which isn't what I expect when it comes to Triple H matches. Good ol Sheamus.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

My first DM Upload  We need the Micker to come back with this:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Wait, we can embed DM videos? That's awesome, had no idea!

And zep, for some reason I thought Stinger1981 is you from DM. (Sting fan + 1981 )


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Wait, we can embed DM videos? That's awesome, had no idea!
> 
> And zep, for some reason I thought Stinger1981 is you from DM. (Sting fan + 1981 )


 Na mate, although that Stinger1981 has some great vids uploaded. Just registered as zep81.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

HHH/Sheamus isn't good and Raw 03 is the worst product WWE have ever put on. 





Been here half a decade and that's the first time I've ever seen a dailymotion video embedded. Then again it took me two years to figure out multi-quoting, and only last month to figure out I could use those arrows to make my type space bigger.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> Been here half a decade and that's the first time I've ever seen a dailymotion video embedded.


To be fair to yourself, it only got added today


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

Gold Frankincense and Grrr said:


> My first DM Upload  We need the Micker to come back with this:


The entire segment is actually one of my favorite segments involving Foley.


----------



## RKO1988 (Jul 25, 2008)

RKO1988 said:


> Anyone know if that 20 episode collection is any good? I know they edited out Beniwah, some offensive chants and Rocking choking Mankind with a cord but what else? And are the later episodes from the late 00s any good ones? I can't see myself paying to see any RAWs from 07-current.


Anyone? I was also wonderinf it the Attitude Era DVD would be worth a purchase. I ask you guys since I think I'll get unbiased opinions here.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I believe I'm getting the 20 episode set tomorrow. Will let y'all know what it's like once I look into it. (Y)


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Based on what I remember of the shows, most of them are kinda crappy tbh. Plus some are even REPEATS. REPEATED FULL SHOWS. WHAT THE FUCK. Not something I'm interested in getting at all.

Attitude Era DVD... documentary is ok at best, far too short and misses sooooo much out. Matches ain't too great on it either (because, you know, Attitude Era sucked mostly lol).


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Somebody give me something to watch and try to forget my worst Christmas ever, please ._.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I'm watching malenko/Rey GAB 96 right now, a ton of fun, check it out ATF


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----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Hey y'all have a Merry Christmas tomorrow.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

So pumped for Xmas tomorrow 

Finally home in Boston today 


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----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Can't get the Nation of Domination theme out of my head :lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

b/c the Nation of Domination theme is the tops. :mark:

also, disagree w/Jheri about RAW 2003 being THAT bad. I really don't remember it being god awful other than Triple H trying to be Ric Flair. Wait. _*looks at sentence*_ Oh. Yeah, that's the clincher. Carry on.


----------



## bigbuxxx (May 28, 2011)

Finally got around to watching Rey/Eddie from 6/23/05. Been meaning to watch for months, have started and stopped it a few times due to distractions. It lived up to the hype. Fantastic match. Their performances are great.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Basically MOTY in 2005. At least in WWE. Only w/Hardy vs Edge Steel Cage on it's heels. It still holds up insanely well against the competition from elsewhere in the world of rasslin _(Japan, ROH, TNA)_ So, so amazing.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I didn't even care for Rey Mysterio in that match. It was all Eddie for me. All of it. Replace Mysterio with Konnan and that Eddie performance would still garner it high praise.

Ok maybe not Konnan. I did kinda like his match with Eddie at Uncensored 96, but a lot of that has to do with how stupid both of them looked and how funny they both were. Terrible ending.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Who? I've wiped out such a name from my memory. Makes life easier.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

If it wasn't for one of the greatest brawls ever to commence on this side of the planet Neptune, I would have forgotten about that entire event. :lmao at that Doomsday Cage Match and the Chicago Street Fight.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Please. It hurts. Giant vs Loch Ness getting less than three minute too. What in the hell?

Finlay vs Regal. Jesus. Can't believe that's from the same event. Match fills me w/so much joy. Would be my favorite from WCW if it wasn't for Midnight Express vs Southern Boys from GAB '90 hanging about. It's close.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Is $14 for SD/Raw 2011 Blu-ray good use of Christmas money?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Wyatt Family vs Daniel Bryan & The Rhodes was :mark:


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

A William Murderface Christmas said:


> Wyatt Family vs Daniel Bryan & The Rhodes was :mark:


Goldust doing the yoshi tonic :mark:

It amazes me he can do that at his age.


----------



## HiddenViolence (Jan 15, 2011)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> b/c the Nation of Domination theme is the tops. :mark:
> 
> also, disagree w/Jheri about RAW 2003 being THAT bad. I really don't remember it being god awful other than Triple H trying to be Ric Flair. Wait. _*looks at sentence*_ Oh. Yeah, that's the clincher. Carry on.


Yeah Triple H in that year had some pretty shitty feuds with the likes of Kevin Nash and Goldberg (although his feud with Booker T was fantastic). But outside of some of the title feuds I think the product was pretty good.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> Goldust doing the yoshi tonic :mark:
> 
> It amazes me he can do that at his age.


I love how he has busted out so many new moves since he has been back, It's like he got more athletic over the years


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

GOLDUST.

Is it too late to change my vote for Wrestler of the Year to him?


----------



## RKO1988 (Jul 25, 2008)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> I believe I'm getting the 20 episode set tomorrow. Will let y'all know what it's like once I look into it. (Y)


Alright, looking forward to yo review. 



CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> Based on what I remember of the shows, most of them are kinda crappy tbh. Plus some are even REPEATS. REPEATED FULL SHOWS. WHAT THE FUCK. Not something I'm interested in getting at all.
> 
> Attitude Era DVD... documentary is ok at best, far too short and misses sooooo much out. Matches ain't too great on it either (because, you know, Attitude Era sucked mostly lol).


How do you do repeated shows? Wait what? 

I saw the matches listed, they aren't too bad but they could have picked some more and some better ones. AE was all about the hype and adrenline in the matches so textbook 5 star matches not being there is fine but the lack of actual quality hardcore matches or heated rivarly or more memorable matches is a shame. At least they got some things right and added the classic Rikish/Val match that was the conclusion to their heated feud.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I mean repeated shows as in they've released them in full before.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Goldust has really surprised me this year. He's 44 and yet and he can still keep up perfectly fine in these long matches with much younger talents and bust out moves you wouldn't think a guy of that age could do. And as someone who never paid much attention to Goldust before, his work this year has impressed me. His match with Orton especially deserves praise. 



Dominick The Donkey said:


> Hey y'all have a Merry Christmas tomorrow.


As it's the 25th now I'll just echo this.  Hope everyone in here has a good Christmas, given this is one of the only good threads in this forum to discuss wresting - I appreciate this thread and the posters who make up it.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Goldust seems to clean up whenever WWE hires him. In 2009 he got into legitimately the best shape of his career and had a better physique than he did in the early 90s. And he was pretty much as good a wrestler. Fuck my asshole I love Dustin Rhodes. I will watch all of his 2013 one day. Haven't been paying the best attention to WWE ever since the power went out during SummerSlam (literally as the bell rang for Punk v. Lesnar). 

Cesaro v. Regal airs tomorrow, though, so I'll make fucking sure to watch that.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

GOLDUST. Dustin as a person seems fucking insane and not in a good way most of the time, but damn, he wrestle like a god. If there was a god of wrestling. 

So it's Christmas. Yey and stuff. Merry whatever. Bah Humbug.

Getting the Hogan DVD set (the one with a documentary... I actually already own the 4 disc unreleased set :lmao someone gave it to me as payment for 4 COPIED DISCS so I'm cool with it ) later today from my mates (part of my present from them lol). I know this because I went to their house a couple of weeks ago and they had left it out and didn't realise . They don't know I know. At least I don't think they know that I know that they might not know or know. Ya know? No.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Looking for some matches, shows and PPVs to download tomorrow from the Wrestling Multimedia section, can anyone recommend some good stuff? Doesn't matter what company or how old it is.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The entirety of the Eddie/Rey feud. Not just 2005 - ALL of it. For your sake.

Btw, does anyone have STARZ for all Goldust 2013 stuff?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Merry Christmas everyone  Thought id login before i have my dinner 

My mate bought me the History Of WWE DVD for Xmas, so i may watch Punk/Cena too later.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

£150 Amazon gift card

:datass

WRESTLING!

Merry Christmas, guys


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Got a bunch of wrestling DVDs plus about 75 bucks in visa gift cards. Will definitely be gettin some more DVDs when I get back 

Thoughts on the Steamboat set?


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----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Steamboat set is AWESOME. Good documentary (nothing standout about it, but good nonetheless), and some incredible matches. Vs Flair from '84 that has never been released which is :mark:. 2/3 falls which has been released but is their best match together so :mark:. Stuff with Savage and Roberts which is :mark:. Great tag with DUSTIN again ARN and LARRY Z. Oh and the fucking 30 minute Iron Man with RICK RUDE which is just epicly epic. Not to mention his comeback singles match with Jericho, a great match with Austin from back in the day, and a personal favourite of mine against COWBOY BOB ORTON that is tremendously fun. Oh and Vs Luger which is great too. Yeah, Steamboat set kinda fucking RULES.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

ATF said:


> The entirety of the Eddie/Rey feud. Not just 2005 - ALL of it. For your sake.


I've seen their stuff mate, might have to give it a rewatch so its on the list to download along with the rest of these goodies:

Finlay/Taker, Flair/Steamboat (WW), Rhodes/Shield, Flair/HHH x2, Flair/Funk, HBK/Mankind, Taker/Hart (1NO), Taker/Orton HIAC, Austin/Benoit, Danielson/McGuinness, Styles/Joe (TP), HHH/Foley Street Fight, Benoit/Finlay, Joe/Styles/Daniels, Okada/Tanahashi, Taker/Angle x2, Jericho/Benoit Ladder, Morrison/Mysterio and Benoit/Kane.

:mark::mark::mark::mark::mark:

Any other suggestions for matches that are this level of :mark:-ness


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Austin/Angle matches


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

The Rey/Malenko matches are all :mark: 

The GAB 96 match is my fave, but the nitro match the next night and the HH 96 match are great too. They prolly have more matches but I've just seen those, their on the Rey set for those who have that DVD


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----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Merry Christmas :mark:

Got the Raw 20th anniversary set which means PUNK/HENRY on DVD.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Got mainly money for Christmas but I won't be spending in on wrestling (well I might buy the Rumble coming up :side. But not really into collecting wrestling DVD's much anymore, and often times I can see the matches online for free anyway or just watch them on the other wrestling DVD's I have. Got to keep the money for more important things.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*No way out 2004 review

CHRISTMAS SPECIAL!*

*Match #1: The Basham Brothers and Shaniqua vs Rikishi and Scotty too Hotty *
Dear lord I'm not looking forward to this, all of these guys are fucking terrible in the ring, and I don't find kishi or Scotty comical at all. And the Bashams actually managed to have a terrible match at NWO 05 with Eddie and Rey, that means they suck A TON. I'm pretty sure these two were released soon after this, I know their in one of those bad tag matches at mania 20 but cannot remember anything beyond that from them in 2004, thank god for that. A little bit of anal humour by kishi as he apparently thinks slapping his ass is funny, yeah thats some bullshit. Why the hell is this team over so much? The match isn't as bad as I feared but Scotty is way too over with the crowd. They are in San Fran, and that place is full of hipsters AKA Scotty 2 Hotty fans, case closed. Shaniqua gets involved for no reason at all, stupid Bashams and their dumb manager. The match itself isn't that bad, I just have no interest in any of the men or women. So in the end Rikishi puts dat stinkface on Shaniqua, pretty decent match TBH, I was pretty shocked this wasn’t a DUD, considering the parties involved. But they held their own, and it was certainly watchable par the stupid Kishi’s ass thing he does all the time. **1/4

*CAL SCALE: 1

Match #2: Jamie Noble vs Nidia *

A second intergender match? Fuck this. NO 

*CAL SCALE: -1 

Match# 3: The APA vs Charlie Haas and Shelton Benjamin *

Well this should be pretty :mark:, APA is pretty fun when they want to be and Haas and Benjamin are one of my favorite tag teams ever, so expecting some good stuff here. As usual, the WGTT makes this match a lot of fun, WGTT controls the beginning portion of the match, but when the APA does get offense in, its a ton of fun. This is just the definition of a good tag match, its gritty and has excitement. Its weird that Bradshaw will be JBL soon because hes in a midcard match here, but will be WWE champion soon. So this was pretty short, but a ton of fun, check this out as I never hear it being pimped. ***1/2

*CAL SCALE: 3 

Match #4: Hardcore Holly vs Rhyno*

This comes right after the segment where Goldberg arrives and gets arrested( I think at least, didn’t really give a shit about it TBH). I think this might have been an impromptu match, but I just skipped to the part where the match starts. Not expecting much here, I like Rhyno, but Holly sucks ass, fuck him. But maybe Rhyno can carry him to a good match. Hardcore Holly starts the match in dramatic fashion with a headlock! We have never seen this! Rhyno goes nuts for a bit beating the shit outta this vanilla midget, except this isn't a vanilla midget I want to push, he sucks, I'll prolly reiterate that point a few times during this match . Yeah this is pretty boring, better than Holly's match with Lesnar but thats not saying much, I think it might get more time haha. Did Lesnar and Rhyno ever have a match? If so, MUST WATCH VERY SOON! This got way too much time, the time should of been given to the last match, no one would have shed a tear if these two got left off the card, Holly went over too. Boring match with a boring winner. *
*
CAL SCALE: 0

Match #5: Rey Mysterio vs Chavo Gurrero *

I think someone told me that this match is great, and it seems that TGAB match is a lot better, but this should still be solid. These two faced each other a ton, but the only one I’ve seen is SS 07, which wasn’t too bad. Who is this guy in Rey's corner? I should proly know who it is but whatever. Wait taker is here! haha just another tease I guess, we all know he returns at mania, to have a terrible match that no one to this day gave a shit about, at least the return was :mark:. Really hoping for a good match here, as the event has been pretty meh so far, and I cant remember if the triple threat is good because I've never seen it but It sounds decent. Chavo Sr is in his sons corner of course, and this guy was always a funny heel. Chavo Jr gets some good heat when he tries to take Rey's mask off. Why do so many people do that? Malenko did it in 96 and Jericho did it in 09, well its a good way to get heat I guess. They do a good job of alternating between mat work and high flying, and it works well in making the match entertaining. The boxer guy(I think) knocks Chavo Sr the FUCK out and gets ejected, the fans don't like it, I still DGAF. Rey does an AWESOME springboard dive while Chavo's checking on his father. This match is a ton of fun, especially considering I'm not a fan of Chavo at all. Why do they keep saying Cow Palace? I get its the venue but they NEVER talk about a venues name so much, Cole says it the whole match, fucking annoying. Still, I love this match, only thing its missing is the fact that Chavo went over and that it was missing the it factor to elevate it from good to great. Really pumped for their GAB match. I also thought they could have shaved 5 min off of this, it dragged a bit, stll an awesome match. ***3/4

*CAL SCALE: 4 

Match #6: The Big Show vs John Cena vs Kurt Angle *

Hmm this should be pretty fun, Big Show was at his best in 04-05 and I like Cena and Angle. Cena raps a little before the match, pretty funny and its weird how over this guy was. Angle nearly did the Angle slam on Show from the ropes onto the concrete below, that could have been :mark: had Cena not broken it up. Am I the only one that doesn't get the Angle hate, guy is fun to watch in the ring, he isn't a GOAT of course and he sucks now in TNA but I liked him in the WWF/WWE. I miss this Big Show, guy was a fucking monster around this time, was a lot of fun to watch. Show controls the majority of the beginning portion of this match. When Cena gets some offense in its a lot of fun, love the elbow to the head off the top rope. The FU on the Big Show was :mark:. This was a great match by Cena, he worked great with Angle in 03 and 04, and his match with Show at mania was fun as well. Yeah this match was just flat out FUN, it also set up an Eddie/Angle that a lot dislike but I enjoy. Also, this is one of the only times you’ll see Cena tap out. ****

*CAL SCALE: 5 

Match #7: Brock Lesnar vs Eddie Gurrero *

MY BODY IS FUCKING READY! I've only seen this match once, and I loved it so much. This show has been pretty good so far but this match is the one match that elevates this show to legendary PPV status. It also happens to be the only good Brock match of 2004, unless he has a great TV match on the RTWM, but I seriously doubt those odds so its this or nothing. In all honesty, THIS should have been the mania match. As good as Goldberg vs Lesnar could have been, this would have topped it. Can you imagine a mania with this match and Trips/HBK/Benoit?would have been the GOAT mania for sure. Really good brawling early on, and a fun early spot is when Eddie Jumps off the top rope and Brock Counters into something that reminds me of a Cesaro swing. Those Belly to Belly's by Brock look so painful, but maybe its just the way Eddie is selling, prolly a little of both. I'm having a little trouble continuing to write because this match is so damn entertaining. One minute Its the first suplex of the match and the next minute Its halfway through the match. What I like about this match is that its not the most brutal of matches. Its physichal of course, but theirs no chair shots or tables breaking, its just great fucking wrestling. Some say the portion of the match where they are just trading subission moves is a little dull, but I disagree, I think it just enhances the amazing story the match is telling seamlessly, being that Eddie is doing everything in his power to get the title. Brock is getting mad heat for telling Eddie to just die, what a match, crowd wants Eddie to win so bad. I love the story Cole talks about that Brock thought that this was gonna be a cake walk but it wasn't, it was AWESOME. Cole was great this whole match, one of his best called matches I think. The ending with the Goldberg interference wasn :mark: X a million. Eddie is the champion in one of the best matches ever, and the shocking thing is that it won't be MOTY, in fact, it'll be lucky if its number 2, but it'll be at leazst #3. Watch this if your a wrestling fan, its one of the best matches ever. ****3/4

*CAL SCALE: 8

FINAL CAL SCALE: 20

CURRENT MOTY: Brock Lesnar vs Eddie Gurrero( NWO) 

Current 2004 PPV rankings 
1: NWO (20)
2: Royal Rumble (8)
*​


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

How can you rank a Hardcore Holly match so poorly? Geeeeeez. :troll 

:eddie :brock was just awesome. That match never gets old. I :mark: like a motherfucker when Eddie hit that frog splash. I've been watching a lot of Eddie G lately. What a stud. 

Just watched unk :jericho from Wrestlemania 28 again. Never gets old. Just an excellent championship match. One of my favorite championship matches at Mania in years....maybe ever.

Not sure if this is true but I guess after the match unk4 ran into :rock and said "top that". I actually really enjoyed :rock and :cena3 but it was nowhere close to the WWE title match. I just loved it. A top 3 match for 2012. For me.....Right up there with :cena :brock at Extreme Rules and unk5 :bryan at OTL.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Wonder how large is the excitement around here for this week's SD, due to


Spoiler: Smackdown



Henry/Reigns and Cena/Rollins


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Dominick The Donkey said:


> Merry Christmas :mark:
> 
> Got the Raw 20th anniversary set which means PUNK/HENRY on DVD.


Is that the same match that was on the best of raw/smackdown 2011 or the other one which I believe was like 2 weeks later? Regardless both of those matches Punk/Henry had were great. Hoping they have another match again down the road. 

Awesome gift man. I got an Amazon gift card from my Aunt. I'm sure I will use it on something wrestling related DVD wise.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

MachoMadness1988 said:


> Is that the same match that was on the best of raw/smackdown 2011 or the other one which I believe was like 2 weeks later? Regardless both of those matches Punk/Henry had were great. Hoping they have another match again down the road.
> 
> Awesome gift man. I got an Amazon gift card from my Aunt. I'm sure I will use it on something wrestling related DVD wise.


It's the one from the night after Mania.  

Agreed, I love both of those matches and I'd love to see another.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

I only remember the Punk/Henry NO DQ match in England, but I enjoyed that match. That's the problem with TV matches I have a hard time remembering some of them. :side:






12:35 I thought that finish was really cool.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Christmas Nostalgia said:


> I only remember the Punk/Henry NO DQ match in England, but I enjoyed that match. That's the problem with TV matches I have a hard time remembering some of them. :side:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm the exact same way. I get fuzzy on dates and you can't just look up a random Raw in October like you can with a PPV. Unless you can and I don't know about it? I use this website sometimes to find old matches but it's not like googling No Way Out 2000 and having the card in front of you in 3 seconds. 


http://www.thehistoryofwwe.com/results.htm


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Damn this Rey set is amazing, and I only just started disc 2


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> Jesus Christ this Rey set is amazing, and I only just started disc 2
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


They all are IMO. _Biggest Little Man_ being one of, if not THE, GOAT DVD Set. :mark:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Only one I have over it is the Bret set


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> Goldust seems to clean up whenever WWE hires him. In 2009 he got into legitimately the best shape of his career and had a better physique than he did in the early 90s. And he was pretty much as good a wrestler. Fuck my asshole I love Dustin Rhodes. I will watch all of his 2013 one day. Haven't been paying the best attention to WWE ever since the power went out during SummerSlam (literally as the bell rang for Punk v. Lesnar).
> 
> Cesaro v. Regal airs tomorrow, though, so I'll make fucking sure to watch that.


+1 on the sodomy of love scale.

Cesaro vs Regal tomorrow. Merry Christmas to me. I lost my XWT account two days early. ASSHOLES. That better be put on a streaming site immediately.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> +1 on the sodomy of love scale.
> 
> *Cesaro vs Regal tomorrow*. Merry Christmas to me. I lost my XWT account two days early. ASSHOLES. That better be put on a streaming site immediately.


:mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark:


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

ATF said:


> Wonder how large is the excitement around here for this week's SD, due to
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Smackdown
> ...


My eyes just hit the floor. I watched some WWE show recently that had Brodus v. Tensai which was a cool phatties hitting each other match, with plenty of beef (before that shithead with the afro had to come in and ruin it). THIS should have that level of beef x 600.


Am I the only one that doesn't think Eddie/Lesnar is that great any more? I mentioned this in another thread but I might not have it as a top ten WWE match of 2004.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well I just blew my christmas load to those SD matches. 

I am sort of with you Jimmy. Watched Eddie/Lesnar not too long ago and wasn't feeling it. REALLY dragged on this time around.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Definitely gonna have to watch SD for DAT MATCH QUALITY.

Oh, and I don't really have a strong opinion on Big E, but I didn't think he'd be pushed this quickly, considering he hasn't cut really any promos and can't work a decent one on one match yet. Where's Chris Masters?


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

XWT are cocksuckers.

- - - - - 

Accidentaly stumbled upon the entire Eddie/Rey collection from 2005, decided to rewatch few matches. So, here we go: their WM match still sucks, and will suck forever; but wow, thank gods I rewatched the 6/21 match from SmackDown, because it looks better than ever, always thought the match was great (around ****ish), but not spectacular. Now it's spectacular, an essential WWE match from the 00s, I can't decide between Benoit/Austin and this one for the best SD contest ever. Eddie is overrated (great guy, but not GOAT, c'mon), and Rey's 619 setups are just retarded and I hate them, but I loved both guys in this match, they did no wrong (well, Rey could've sold his back for little longer, but w/e), and the structure was picture perfect. Excellent fucking match. ****3/4 And finally, the cage match was just... decent. Eddie's clean win was so appreciated, but the match structure was disconnected and pacing was odd. **3/4


----------



## bigbuxxx (May 28, 2011)

Yeah1993 said:


> Am I the only one that doesn't think Eddie/Lesnar is that great any more?


I've had it at 4 stars on my 5ish viewings of it. Just never got what was so "omg it's incredible and 5*" about it. I tried many times. Love the match though.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

As Youtube took it down and gave me a strike for it  I uploaded *CM Punk vs Eddy Guerrero (03.02.02 - IWA:MS)* on DM:


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Eddie vs. Punk :mark:

If I recall correctly, I think there was a triple threat match between Punk, Eddie, and Mysterio. Haven't seen that match in a long ass time but I remember it being good.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

StraightEdgeSanta said:


> Eddie vs. Punk :mark:
> 
> If I recall correctly, I think there was a triple threat match between Punk, Eddie, and Mysterio. Haven't seen that match in a long ass time but I remember it being good.


Yep, there is also Punk/Cabana/Eddy......i think.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm still hoping Tensai vs Clay w/SOME time behind it comes down the pike soon. Said that a bazillion times after watching Smackdown on Monday. It was still rad for the little bit it was on.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

IIRC the Punk/Eddie/Rey triple threat was good. I haven't watched it in years. 

Love that Eddie/Punk match. 

That quote Punk had on his documentary about how he thought he was good until he got in the ring with Eddie Guerrero was awesome. It's just cool to see so much respect for :eddie.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Time for Brock vs Cena. Don't even have to specific which one. You friggin know.

Merry Christmas x2.

I have to watch Eddie vs Brock again to question the judgment on it being too special or not. Memory says: yes, it's pretty great. Revision: TBD.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

It will never happen but WWE should release an indie DVD. They would have to pay a lot of smaller promotions and it probably wouldn't sell well but who knows. DVD could show an indie match or two from guys like Punk, Bryan, Cesaro, Rollins, Ambrose, etc and they talk a little about their road to the WWE. 




Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Time for Brock vs Cena. Don't even have to specific which one. You friggin know.


Love that Backlash 2003 match! :curry2


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

How is the Taker/Vader series? I think I liked Canadian Stampede but haven't watched it in a year or so.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

MyNameIsJonMarston said:


> How is the Taker/Vader series? I think I liked Canadian Stampede but haven't watched it in a year or so.


They don't have a bad match, but nothing great or memorable either, which is a shame. 93 Vader Vs 05-present Undertaker on paper could be the greatest thing ever though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Backlash '03 match is even worse after what they gave in 2012. Sheesh @ that.

Undertaker vs Vader matches are awesome. I'm pretty big on 'em.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Agreed the Backlash Brock/Cena match was not very good. 

I really enjoyed :taker :vader Canadian Stampede. That whole ppv is just :lenny


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

I thought that the Cena/Brock Backlash match was good, but their Extreme Rules match is unreal.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cena's weardown sequence after ravaging Brock really killed the match for me. Worked the bout backwards.

Canadian Stampede, oh yeah. Totally rad. I'm not very keen on WWF in 1997 for a lot of their wrestling, but that PPV was a goldmine. Would be the best in the Attitude Era until about Fully Loaded 2000. As far as any competition goes.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Backlash '03 has an excellent little gem hidden in its limb in the form of Show/Rey. That match is so overlooked it's not even funny. But the whole PPV did suck tbh.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I enjoyed Backlash 03. ROCK/Berg, Guerreros/Team Angle, Rey/Show as well as Brock/Cena (I just fast forward the two minute resthold part and match is much better that way).


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

ATF said:


> Backlash '03 has an excellent little gem hidden in its limb in the form of Show/Rey. That match is so overlooked it's not even funny. But the whole PPV did suck tbh.


Is that the one with the stretcher spot? If so that match is awesome.

I hated Backlash '03 as a whole though outside of Team Angle/Los Guerreros.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

CHRISTMAS CUNT said:


> They don't have a bad match, but nothing great or memorable either, which is a shame. 93 Vader Vs 05-present Undertaker on paper could be the greatest thing ever though.


Vader was having really swell matches in '99 and '00 too.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Chismo said:


> Vader was having really swell matches in '99 and '00 too.


Ok. Thanks for posting this?


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

:floyd2


----------



## Raging Eboue (Apr 29, 2011)

Only Taker vs Vader match I've seen was the rumble match and I thought it was pretty meh considering who's involved.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

If more people don't know how good Big Show vs Mysterio is, then that's too bad.

So, finally got around to checking out Punker vs Danielson from OTL 2012 again. I own it, but only saw it twice before this. Probably b/c it's never wow'ed me. It still doesn't. I mean, obvious it's "Good". Well wrestled, strikes were neat b/c they really laid into each other, and the rest yada yada. But I can't lose myself in it. All the work just appears pretty, yet lacks any more substance than that. I enjoy it, although can find others from 2012 I like much more. Including their MITB rematch. Which I happen to adore. I seriously think I got into the Ryback squash more after it followed Punker vs Danielson. A good way of expressing my opinion on this more is that it's the good version of that awfully boring Hart vs Benoit match from '99.

Following that I watched a nice chunk of the Clash of the Champions set and was in personal ecstasy for about however long I spent watching. It doesn't get much better than that. Midnight Express vs Rock N' Roll Express. It's all I need in my life.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Hart/Benoit is GOAT >_>. So is Benoit/Angle, Benoit/Malenko, Hart/Michaels SvS 92, and Eddie/Malenko. And in a year from now when Angle/Michaels and Angle/Undertaker get hated on here, their matches will still be great.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

@ Cody

^^ watched the steamboat/austin match on there :lenny what other match did you check out and would recommend ? Disc 3 intrigues me 


So I'm stuffed w/ food and some family just left so I'm watching hhh/brock cage and I'm really enjoying it


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

I liked Brock/Cena Backlash '03. Definitely the jewel of Cena's first DVD.

I'm halfway through Flair/HBK WM24, and it's ***** for me. Seriously. Never would have expected it, but this might be my favorite Shawn performance ever. Will see if it holds up throughout.

The pre-package really helps things out, in terms of setting the stage and making this match feel really special.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Hart/Benoit is GOAT >_>. So is Benoit/Angle, Benoit/Malenko, Hart/Michaels SvS 92, and Eddie/Malenko. And in a year from now when Angle/Michaels and Angle/Undertaker get hated on here, their matches will still be great.


Angle vs Michaels from WM has always been shit.

and god, those matches listed pardon the Undertaker one suck so much. Eddie vs Malenko from ECW :ti



RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> @ Cody
> 
> ^^ watched the steamboat/austin match on there :lenny what other match did you check out and would recommend ? Disc 3 intrigues me
> 
> ...


Watch all the Flair matches. They're gold. Flair kills it w/Luger in the United States Championship & Flair + Arn vs Hollywood Blondes is terrific. Flat finish, but that's the booking to keep it going. Only match on the entire set that's a bit of a bust is the stupid Mil Mascaras match. That's b/c he's crap. Foley's bump in it though. JEEEEEZUS. He overshadowed everything Mascaras did in the match w/that one moment alone.

Def watch Midnight Express vs Rock N'Roll Express too. Regal vs Rhodes is on there too. On paper it sounds like a match that will make my pants tight. Stopped it for now so I can't comment on it yet. SOON.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Kind of the opposite of Cody. I agree that OTL isn't a masterpiece classic, but I thought it was excellent and, on the flip-side, thoguht that MITB was a pile of nothing. Actually I thought it was a possibly great match ruined by everything other than the performances of Punk and Danielson. I think I likened it to 'a poorly written movie with two really good actors'.

Hart/Benoit is one of WCW's most overrated matches. Benoit had many better matches that year. Angle/Michaels has gotten hate long before next year (wtf), and deservedly so. They suck.

I cannot imagine why anybody wouldn't like the Angle/Takers, though. Those are pretty much all sexy. I even liked Survivor Series 2000.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I see why someone could find an aspect or two about MITB off putting, but it doesn't bother me in the slightest. All the goodness about it is heightened when I watch. And holds up a bunch of times. Watched it idk how much so far. Would honestly be my favorite WWE match of 2012 if it wasn't for Cena vs Lesnar or that TLC match which came at the end. Punker vs Henry x2 is close too. Basically top five in a nutshell. Oh SHIT @ all the Danielson, Sheamus, Big Show goodies out there too. And Punk vs Jericho from WM. Fuck. I'm all out of sorts. But yeah, I lovelovelove the MITB match over the OTL.

Taker vs Angle from Survivor Series is solid. That's about it for me. Parts of it feel like there isn't much to it. Angle was fun in it, but you could tell his connection w/Taker wasn't as strong as it would grow to be. Still stunned by how well the latter matches vs Undertaker worked out. Angle progressively got worse by his tenure in the biz, so seeing those happen and be worth talking about is a breath of fresh air.


----------



## bigbuxxx (May 28, 2011)

After watching Rey/Eddie yesterday I went in search of more of them...

Eddie vs Malenko - their first meeting in WCW 10/95 **1/2. A few botches that throw off the pacing. Hogan interrupts the match for a minute. Funnish sprint though.

Malenko vs Rey - GAB 1996. ***1/2. Absolutely love the first couple minutes and the last 3 or so minutes, it's the other 12 that kill it for me. Working the arm to kill time *yawn*. 

Are there any good cruiser tag matches from WCW?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> I'm halfway through Flair/HBK WM24, and it's ***** for me. Seriously. Never would have expected it, but this might be my favorite Shawn performance ever. Will see if it holds up throughout.
> 
> The pre-package really helps things out, in terms of setting the stage and making this match feel really special.


Favorite match of all time, dat pre package, watch the "old yeller" promo on raw :lenny



Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Watch all the Flair matches. They're gold. Flair kills it w/Luger in the United States Championship & Flair + Arn vs Hollywood Blondes is terrific. Flat finish, but that's the booking to keep it going. Only match on the entire set that's a bit of a bust is the stupid Mil Mascaras match. That's b/c he's crap. Foley's bump in it though. JEEEEEZUS. He overshadowed everything Mascaras did in the match w/that one moment alone.
> 
> Def watch Midnight Express vs Rock N'Roll Express too. Regal vs Rhodes is on there too. On paper it sounds like a match that will make my pants tight. Stopped it for now so I can't comment on it yet. SOON.


Was going too get into these :flair3 matches although I'm not high on the 1st flair/sting cotc



Yeah1993 said:


> Kind of the opposite of Cody. I agree that OTL isn't a masterpiece classic, but I thought it was excellent and, on the flip-side, thoguht that MITB was a pile of nothing. Actually I thought it was a possibly great match ruined by everything other than the performances of Punk and Danielson. I think I likened it to 'a poorly written movie with two really good actors'.


I'm kinda in the middle of both of you, as I liked both, for the longest time I had mitb>>otl but I really enjoyed otl on the last watch was about to give it MOTY for 2012 but then cena/lesnar came to mind after


Edit: May be the only here not high on the taker/angle matches, loved the sd 03 but you all can have the 06 ones, kinda like FL 00 aswell


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Almost certain Mysterio & Kidman vs Skipper & Kid Romeo from Greed kind of rules.

And there are basically every Lucha trios match from 1997 that fits the bill there. Not the ones w/Konnan though. All the others = YES.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Punk vs. Bryan at Over the Limit was great and I really liked their Money in the Bank match. I may be in the minority, but I actually enjoyed the AJ involvement. I thought it fitted well with the context of the storyline that was going on.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

MITB match is just average to me. The wrestling in it is better than OTL but all the shenanigans when the first ref bumps with AJ happens brings it down progressively as it goes on. And the finish was pretty dumb too. (Punk withstood the crossface for about 30 seconds with a kendo stick but Bryan was finished with a back suplex through a table?) I'm not too high on OTL either but at least they just go at it straight up in a wrestling match. Solid but nothing to jizz over.

Don't know about WM because it's been so long, but rewatched the Vengeance match between Angle/Shawn and it was as good as the first time bar the (again) dumb finish.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Punk/Bryan OTL is far above their MITB match for me... in fact I remember being extremely disappointed with the MITB match after what they did at OTL. Just a fantastic wrestling match that took what was no build-up whatsoever, and got the crowd really into it by just wrestling. It's a brilliant match and stands out as a classic for me, regardless of what others might say about it. I actually had it at ***** at one point, but dropped it to ****1/2 earlier this year when I went through the vast majority of the matches on my list. 

And just to be clear, MITB wasn't bad... it was good, but that's all it was imo. It just didn't capture the energy and excitement that the OTL match had. The wrestling was about on par, but too many shenanigans to hold it up. Honestly, if they had a main event match at Mania, with both of them putting in 110%, it could be the greatest Mania main event ever and top their OTL match. We may never get the chance to see it, but if WWE is smart, they'll at least give us it at Summerslam.

And for MOTY 2012, Punk/Bryan OTL wins it. Lesnar/Cena doesn't even pop into my head as potentially better... and it's an amazing match in it's own right, but there's some stuff I dislike about it that I simply can't ignore and really brings it down. There are other great matches that are up there like Bryan/Sheamus ER, Taker/HHH WM28, Punk/Henry Raw 4/2... those are high up there, but again, I wouldn't consider putting them above Punk/Bryan OTL. The only match that comes really close and at this point, I could see myself putting above Punk/Bryan is the The Shield 6-man TLC match. After Punk wasn't defending the title, I wasn't even going to order the PPV... but figured since I had ordered all of them that year to that point, it would've been a shame to leave it out. Went into the PPV expecting nothing, and came out with a classic and my favorite TLC match ever. Brilliant stuff and again, it's the only one I've considered and could see myself putting above Punk/Bryan.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

http://surl.wf/cgi-bin/protect.cgi?File=oTKWCLbrp.html

Here's this week's NXT featuring REGAL/CESARO!

Count me in on the side that believes Punk/Bryan OTL is 2012 MOTY. Can't find a single flaw in it. Only other match last year that I could say the same thing for was the 6-Man TLC.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

bigbuxxx said:


> Are there any good cruiser tag matches from WCW?


I honestly can't think of a bad one.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Regal vs Cesaro. 

sweet lady gaga yes to the maximum degree.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Favorite match of all time, dat pre package, watch the "old yeller" promo on raw :lenny


Yeah, that was part of the pre-package. Glad I watched that, because it made certain moments of the match feel more special.



What do you guys think about Cena/Angle No Mercy 2003? I've tried to watch it twice, but both times it had a problem keeping my interest. It's weird, because it didn't even strike me as a particularly slow or anything, but for some reason, it just wasn't holding my attention whatsoever.

I've seen many praise it as one of Cena's best earliest matches, and I see that Meltzer gave it **** 1/4, so maybe I should try for a third time, and stick with it this time.



OTOH, HBK/Shelton Benjamin was AMAZING. I went in without a lot of expectations, but was blown away. Best Shelton match I've seen (though it's not like I've seen a plethora), and Shawn was 100% on his game. Fabulous wrestling, perfectly timed high spots, and good storytelling/storyline going on. Loved the hell out of it, and it held up just as well on second watch.

**** 1/2.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I'm with my bro, I prefer the MITB match over the OTL match, but I really enjoy the OTL match.

That Flair/Luger match was :mark:



> What do you guys think about Cena/Angle No Mercy 2003? I've tried to watch it twice, but both times it had a problem keeping my interest. It's weird, because it didn't even strike me as a particularly slow or anything, but for some reason, it just wasn't holding my attention whatsoever.


I love this match! :lenny


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:mark: at how Regal is selling his knee. Shame that they went to commercial immediately. And it had to be that Big Show New Years commercial :bosh


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> What do you guys think about Cena/Angle No Mercy 2003? I've tried to watch it twice, but both times it had a problem keeping my interest. It's weird, because it didn't even strike me as a particularly slow or anything, but for some reason, it just wasn't holding my attention whatsoever.
> 
> I've seen many praise it as one of Cena's best earliest matches, and I see that Meltzer gave it **** 1/4, so maybe I should try for a third time, and stick with it this time.


Love it. Electric crowd with great back and forth action. Along with the Taker matches and the December Benoit match, it's among Cena's best pre-main event matches.


----------



## WrestlingOracle (Jul 6, 2013)

Just a quick match question because I can't recall an instance but can anyone remember Taker actually hitting his elbow drop that he would rarely bust out. Taker always seems to telegraph the spot for a surefire miss somewhat like Flair (though Flair DID hit top rope moves once in a blue moon). Just wondered if anyone remembers Taker hitting the elbow drop.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

...WrestleMania 17. Yeah.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

What did you think of Regal/Cesaro?


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Spoiler



The double stomp on the head was almost disgusting.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

x6ywxy
Quite possibly my favorite heel performance from Regal. He acts like a complete twat all throughout the match. His reaction to him retaining his television title makes things even better. 



LilOlMe said:


> What do you guys think about Cena/Angle No Mercy 2003? I've tried to watch it twice, but both times it had a problem keeping my interest. It's weird, because it didn't even strike me as a particularly slow or anything, but for some reason, it just wasn't holding my attention whatsoever.
> 
> I've seen many praise it as one of Cena's best earliest matches, and I see that Meltzer gave it **** 1/4, so maybe I should try for a third time, and stick with it this time.


Awesome match. Really great back and forth at the start with Angle and Cena trying to beat one another at their own game. I also love the fact that Taz put a lot of emphasis on their contrasting styles going into the match. Easily MOTN for that PPV with Tajiri/Mysterio and Eddie/Show right behind it.


----------



## Reaper (Sep 4, 2013)

NVM


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

After reading in Jericho's book (and funnyfaces' posts ) about how great he and Eddie were as a tag team, I decided I'd watch some of their matches. 

I should've known with all the talent involved, but I thought that Eddie/Jericho vs. Benoit/Malenko was a LOT of fun for such a short match. :mark:


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Just finished watching the first match from Over The Edge 1998 D.O.A. vs L.O.D. 200 :| :| :| fpalm fpalm fpalm


----------



## Reaper (Sep 4, 2013)

Thoughts on the 50 years of Wrestling DVD (documentary only):

It felt like sitting through a 2 hour recruitment DVD at a college job fair. In all honesty, I couldn't tell whether they were trying to simply hype WMXXX, build goodwill with existing fans, or just simply pat themselves on the back. Maybe all three. 

It was weird to see their refusal to acknowledge Austin as one of the most business changing top guys of the Attitude Era and also totally twisting things around to making it sound like the entire Attitude Era was ushered in by Vince's character post Montreal Screwjob. There was almost no mention of Rock spearheading Smackdown. No mention of Ric Flair at all (don't think there was even a glimpse).

I wonder if their relationship is soured at this point because I don't think that the WWE revises history on one of their biggest stars until and unless they're not kissing Vince's ass.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I liked that doc up until about the last 15 minutes, then it became like a recruitment video to me

I found the beginning portion about Bruno to be fascinating


----------



## Reaper (Sep 4, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> I liked that doc up until about the last 15 minutes, then it became like a recruitment video to me
> 
> I found the beginning portion about Bruno to be fascinating


I did too of course. WWE is by far one of the best "promotions" in the world, but since I wasn't alive during that era, I can't judge the authenticity of it. 

I hate to say this but the WWE has done very little to develop fans' trust when it comes to truth-telling.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

They should re-watch the _Rise and Fall of ECW_ and go aaahhhh that's how we/you do it.

Ill be watching the _History Of WWE DVD_ later myself


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

British Bulldog vs Owen Hart for the European Title (3/3/97) is pretty great. One of the better matches I've seen in 97 so far.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Regal Vs Cesaro on NXT... well... I went into it with a lot of hype because, you know, REGAL AND CESARO. 

*sigh*


IT TOTALLY LIVED UP TO THE HYPE . Incredible match. Regal has wrestled what, twice this year? And both have been strong MOTYC. ALL HAIL KING REGAL.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

damn I have to watch that :mark: :mark:

I have to wait till it gets uploaded, though.


----------



## Platt (Oct 20, 2004)

Such a great match :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Could anyone upload the match plz, instead of DL'ing the whole episode.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Uploading it now .


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

:mark:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Do you guys not get hulu in the UK? Because NXT is one of the shows where you dont need an account to watch


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Nope, no hulu for us. We get fuck all lol. Even our Netflix is a pile of wank.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

That sucks 

About to rewatch Lesnar/Cena, hope it holds up, had it at the full 5 last watch


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

How does Regal/Cesaro scale on the STARZ~ for those who have seen it?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'd probably go ***3/4-****. Not as good as the Hero match, but still one of the top matches this year for me.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Still love Brock/Cena, i dont even give a shit about the finish, its like Mankind/HBK, ending was shitty as fuck, but its still a ****1/4-****1/2 match. But I'm still one of the only cats here who have Cena/Brock at the full 5

Match request? Already seen Cesaro/Regal BTW- ***3/4 for that


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

x18vll1

Just says technical difficulties for me with the embed. Full link here http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x18vll1_regal-vs-cesaro-nxt-25-12-2013_sport if its the same for everyone.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yeah, it's official - whoever decided Regal should never be WWE (World Heavyweight) Champion ever is a big time idiot. Awesome stuff with him and Cesaro, ***3/4. Though still inferior to the Kassius match (have that at ****).


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Embed vid works fine for me Cal. 



#BadNewsSanta said:


> And for MOTY 2012, Punk/Bryan OTL wins it. Lesnar/Cena doesn't even pop into my head as potentially better... and it's an amazing match in it's own right, but there's some stuff I dislike about it that I simply can't ignore and really brings it down. There are other great matches that are up there like Bryan/Sheamus ER, Taker/HHH WM28, Punk/Henry Raw 4/2... those are high up there, but again, I wouldn't consider putting them above Punk/Bryan OTL. The only match that comes really close and at this point, I could see myself putting above Punk/Bryan is the The Shield 6-man TLC match. After Punk wasn't defending the title, I wasn't even going to order the PPV... but figured since I had ordered all of them that year to that point, it would've been a shame to leave it out. Went into the PPV expecting nothing, and came out with a classic and my favorite TLC match ever. Brilliant stuff and again, it's the only one I've considered and could see myself putting above Punk/Bryan.


Punk/Bryan OTL was my MOTY in 2012 for most of the year, but then right at the end of the year The 6 man Shield TLC happened and I ended up enjoying the fuck out of that match and watching it like 7-8 times, so at that point it became my new MOTY for 2012.  Cena/Lesnar would probably be my third favorite match of 2012 I think.


----------



## Reaper (Sep 4, 2013)

Fun crowd too "This is wrestling" ... Lol.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

WrestlingOracle said:


> Just a quick match question because I can't recall an instance but can anyone remember Taker actually hitting his elbow drop that he would rarely bust out. Taker always seems to telegraph the spot for a surefire miss somewhat like Flair (though Flair DID hit top rope moves once in a blue moon). Just wondered if anyone remembers Taker hitting the elbow drop.


He hit the elbow drop from the top rope against Brock Lesnar in their cell match. He moved away from the turnbuckles and stood on the ropes with help of the cell-roof, though, if that makes any difference. Otherwise, I've never seen him hit that move. Only other top rope move I've seen him do is the diving clothesline.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Punk/Bryan OTL was my MOTY for 2012, finally overtaking HHH/Undertaker after I re-watched a bunch of stuff at the end of the year to make a final decision lol. ****3/4 for it, same for HHH/Undertaker but I didn't like it quite as much on a re-watch. TLC got around **** on the first watch, but I went up to around ****1/2 on a recent re-watch. Still not enough to make it #1 but enough for top 5 (Jericho/Punk WM and Cena/Lesnar was also ****1/2 for me to place #3 and #4).


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Thanks for Cesaro/Regal, Cal (Y)


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

King Cal said:


> Punk/Bryan OTL was my MOTY for 2012, finally overtaking HHH/Undertaker after I re-watched a bunch of stuff at the end of the year to make a final decision lol. ****3/4 for it, same for HHH/Undertaker but I didn't like it quite as much on a re-watch. TLC got around **** on the first watch, but I went up to around ****1/2 on a recent re-watch. Still not enough to make it #1 but enough for top 5 (Jericho/Punk WM and Cena/Lesnar was also ****1/2 for me to place #3 and #4).


Fuck, I forgot Sheamus/Bryan. That's ****1/2 as well. TLC might only make #6 for the year lol.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Now let's see tomorrow on SD if HENRY/REIGNS will deliever. Likely not, but hopefully yes.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

anyone wanna give me a show to review? Might have to DL it but I'll get to it


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

No Mercy '06.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

ATF said:


> Now let's see tomorrow on SD if HENRY/REIGNS will deliever.


Doubt it. Reigns is still somewhat green in the ring, and Henry is usually pretty boring in the ring. The key word is "usually" because Henry has certainly had a few decent matches, IMO.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Well that's going to be a minority opinion.

Regal vs Cesaro. Knew I was smart to wait it out last night. It's a Christmas present from our very own Santa, CAL.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

RhodesForWHC said:


> Doubt it. Reigns is still somewhat green in the ring, and Henry is usually pretty boring in the ring. The key word is "usually" because Henry has certainly had a few decent matches, IMO.


Well trust me, that's not something we say often if at all around these streets.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Henry Vs Reigns excites me more than 99% of potential combinations WWE could give us.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

I'm not expecting much out of Reigns/Henry. Reigns I have yet to see anything good from on his own outside of cool spots in tag matches, and Henry... well, don't think he's as great as others say in this thread.

I actually just went into the spoiler thread to see what the matches were... and after seeing it, my expectations lowered because...



Spoiler: Smackdown



A new set of spoilers must've come up in the last few days and shows the match times. Almost all of them are under 5 minutes outside of Orton/Ziggler, which I was looking forward to but to a much lesser extent than the others, and Cena/Rollins. Sandow/Bryan and Cesaro/Cody I was really looking forward to, but they didn't get the time I was hoping they would get and thus I'm not expecting much from either match.



Still looking forward to Cena/Rollins though. Should be great. I can see Rollins meshing really well with Cena.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Actually more excited for cena/rollins tbhayley

watched brock/hhh CAGE last night ****- enjoyed it, this is my 2nd time watching, nice and stiff, loved the selling by Brock who was a babyface in this match, and heyman interactions. I was talking to Cody in the catox about this, its crazy how much more passion commentators in pretty much EVERY other country has besides the wwe us/normal broadcast. I watched it in german (better pic quality) and the guy marked the fuck out for everything, I legit though he creamed himself when Brock hit an F5 and Haitch pulled out a sledgehammer


Edit: Orton/Ziggler ? ehh could be good if Orton follows same format as that bryan raw match and tehy actually let Ziggler wrestle instead of fameasser after fameasser


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Regal vs Cesaro was masterclass.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Speaking of that, why do people hate on Orton/Ziggler NOC? That seems to be another critically well recieved match that gets hated on here. I didn't love it but I thought it wasn't terrible either (though that was at least over a year ago the last time I watched it so I don't recall it 100%).


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

ATF said:


> No Mercy '06.


 will do it, but have no idea whats on the card 

Just looked at the card, will have to DL it, which could take a while


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's worth while. Awesome show.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I marked when I watched it live, thought it was MOTN for NOC, but upon a couple rewatches it flat, no stucture, no intense no story behind. Just seemed like a throwaway sd match. Best part was Orton flipping off the crowd


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

ATF said:


> Speaking of that, why do people hate on Orton/Ziggler NOC? That seems to be another critically well recieved match that gets hated on here. I didn't love it but I thought it wasn't terrible either (though that was at least over a year ago the last time I watched it so I don't recall it 100%).


Rewatched it for my list a few months ago and I thought it's pretty average. It feels like a bunch of nothingness and other than Orton flipping the fans for being idiots, nothing is memorable about it.

I'm looking forward to their match for this week, heard Ziggler gets "You can't wrestle" chants. :lmao (it will probably be edited out)


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Rewatched it for my list a few months ago and I thought it's pretty average. It feels like a bunch of nothingness and other than Orton flipping the fans for being idiots, nothing is memorable about it.
> *
> I'm looking forward to their match for this week, heard Ziggler gets "You can't wrestle" chants. :lmao (it will probably be edited out*)


wwe fans :banderas and speaking of which these chants are so lame, just finished regal/cesaro and during it a "THIS IS WRESTLING" chant breaks out, no shit sherlock did you think its basketball ?


Zep do you have Eddie/lesnar by any chance ?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Regal's selling after taking the chop block made me crack the most joyous smile. Then idk how to describe my reaction once I saw the elevated Neutralizer _(Stretch Muffler)_ used.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Sayeth what? Ziggler got "you can't wrassle" chants? Well, those silly, silly, innocent fans are so adorable, aren't they? 8*D

Am I the only one who cringed at that double foot stomp on Regal's head?
Also, fun fact: Regal/Cesaro's "this is wrestling" chants are seen in TNA a lot times.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

A bit random lol, but i uploaded *Mickie James vs Trish Stratus - Wrestlemania 22* - The Live PPV Version (unedited with the 'grab' included that was taken out of the DVD ):


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That's Florida for ya, ATF.

Trish vs Mickie unedited? :hmm:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

It wasn't Florida, it was Corpus Christi which is Texas.



RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Zep do you have Eddie/lesnar by any chance ?


WWE have it uploaded on their youtube channel.






If they have some edits like with everything they post, then here's the original one.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

LOLFLORIDA.

Did you hear about that one where a guy was caught fapping in the DMV? Yeah, that's the world of Florida.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nope. But lets not turn this thread into the Anything section now... _(I'm not surprised to hear it, btw)_

Ha. JR was the man during that Trish vs Mickie match. _"The nutjob has won the title!"_


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yeah, but I can't help myself when it comes to LOLFLORIDA. It just has to be done. :HHH

_"Hey Mickie, I've got one word for ya: LITHIUM! Dr. Phil is looking for your number!"_

Between Trish/Mickie and Lita/Trish UF '06, don't know which may just be the GOAT Divas match.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I wouldn't go that far for either. Blayze vs Nakano from RAW in '95 >. Actually a few from 1995 I like more. If only Blayze didn't jump ship to be Madusa again or else Aja Kong would have been used more in the company. At least WCW made up for it by having Akira Hokuto be Madusa's frequent opponent.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Never seen it before, though I did watch Alunda/Bull from SSlam '95 and I liked it, but didn't love it. Is it better than SummerSlam?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Don't remember their PPV match nearly as well. Gonna watch it atm and come back w/my answer.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> Edit: Orton/Ziggler ? ehh could be good if Orton follows same format as that bryan raw match and tehy actually let Ziggler wrestle instead of fameasser after fameasser


I'll check out Orton/Ziggler, I'm a fan of their TV matches. Apparently it went 13 minutes so Ziggler probably got a decent amount of offense in which is good.

Facing Orton in a match is much better for Ziggler than trash like Fandango, or stupid comedy matches with Sandow.


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

Well like I said, here are some matches from 15th anniversary set. So far my favorite collaboration dvd they have put out.

*Ric Flair vs Mr. Perfect: Loser leaves town match.*
Now admittingly I am not a huge fan of Flair, just personal preference that's all. This match though showed how good he can be in the ring. This is Flair's heelwork at its finest. I thought these two had good chemistry with each other and I feel that this should of been the 1993 match of the year instead of HBK/Janetty. As for best Raw match of all time, I still think there are a few that edge it out. Still worth checking out but I think almost everyone has seen this already. As a side note I always thought the objects Flair hid in his boots/tights always looked weird. ****1/4.

* Shawn Michaels(c) vs Marty Janetty: Intercontinental Championship match.*
I had a bit of a hard time getting into this match but that doesn't mean it was bad and all. It was your usual Shawn Michaels match. I don't remember much from it even though I watched it recently. I prefer late 90s 00s HBK but that's just me. Still a fun match and I might have to give it a rewatch, I must of been distracted or something. Wasn't a fan of the rollup finish though. ****

*Bret Hart(c) vs 1-2-3 Kid: WWF Championship match.* 
There was a thread that recently came up that asked if midcarders should get title shots. I said yes because then you get something like this. This is by far (from what I've watched so far) the best Raw match I have ever seen. I was worried that on my second watch I would rate it lower but that didn't turn out to be the case. To start off Bret looks like a beast here. Now I wouldn't think that I would make a sentence like that but it applies for this match. Its a slow paced match in which any offense Kid delivers, Bret always manages to shut him down. Its the kind of match that hangs on every move that is made. The face comeback by Kid is really well done. Halfway through the match it needs to get restarted due to Kid's foot being on the rope on the request of Bret. They should do more face/face matches, that way we get a nice clean finish. If you enjoyed the Ziggler/ADR match from earlier this year you might enjoy this one. Would recommend. *****​


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Nostalgia said:


> I'll check out Orton/Ziggler, I'm a fan of their TV matches. Apparently it went 13 minutes so Ziggler probably got a decent amount of offense in which is good.
> 
> Facing Orton in a match is much better for Ziggler than trash like Fandango, or stupid comedy matches with Sandow.


Yea I'm all for him facing Orton, just let him regain some momentum or just let him do something semi beneficially at this point. Ive only seen 3 dolph/orton matches raw 8/11,noc, and a raw match after rumble 12. Thought the 8/11 was pretty good and remeber liking the 1/12 raw match, its the one that Barrett is watching from skybox



Edit: ^^^ Love all those matches, Bret/kidd is a GOAT TV match candidate and arguably hitman's 2nd best match IMO


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Why is Seth Rollins main eventing more than Randy Orton if he's the champion? Oh, WWE. Why kid yourselves. :ti

ATF, the SummerSlam match was solid. RAW in '95 is a lot better. Doesn't have much of the random show case submission holds in the match and flows better. PPV bout was a fun nostalgia trip. Crowd ate up Blayze's offense so much.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

'Kay then. Might have to hunt it down. Still, it has some stiff competition against those two 2006 matches. Which I came to the conclusion I love Trish/Mickie just a tad more. It had a more intriguing story and Mickie's antics were fucking amazing. Oh, and that hilarious contra crowd. If it wasn't for the botched Stratusfaction, it would've been better... which is scary considering it was near spot-on for what it was. The best WM Divas feud ever and it's not even close to being close to being close.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Trish vs Lita isn't anything special tho. I think by the fact that it wasn't awful is where it puts that glossy nostalgic feel behind it to see Trish's farewell go smoothly. I won't crap on it, but I won't put it over either. It's fine. I can watch it, but I'm not going to ever bring it up. We've all learned the curve for women's wrestling in WWF/WWE has never been anything past mediocre at the literal very best. Which is why when something good actually does come down the pike, it's accepted on such a grand scale. Although, I do feel the matches I mentioned before are quite good.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Hayley's Xmas Ecstasy said:


> Why is Seth Rollins main eventing more than Randy Orton if he's the champion? Oh, WWE. Why kid yourselves. :ti


Probably because he faced :cena5 and Rollins/Cena is a much more exciting match-up than Orton/Ziggler which we've seen a thousand times before.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I'll admit I'm biased towards it, but I love it. Despite the result being easy to predict, every bit of Lita's offense was nervewracking to watch. This WAS Trish's farewell match. Couldn't afford to lose just like that. I was like a kid in a candy store when Lita missed her Moonsault. Yes, I was that thrilled with a fucking Divas match. Plus, it was also helped by that ravaging Toronto crowd, the fact that it was the blow-off of the long-running Lita/Trish feud, a good drop of drama, and by that excellent ending. Awesome stuff imo. To each his own, but I'd be damned if I didn't love that match.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

ATF said:


> Between Trish/Mickie and Lita/Trish UF '06, don't know which may just be the GOAT Divas match.


I always loved those 2 matches, I think Mickie vs Trish had more excitement tough just a bit, for GOAT divas matches I think an argument could be made for Melina/Beth I Quit, Mickie/Melina Backlash 07, Lita/Trish RAW Main Event, Mickie/Beth RAW England 08, Melina/McCool NOC 09, and Trish/Victoria Chicago Street Fight



Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## JBLoser (Jun 12, 2005)

Anyone else get the Raw 20th Anniversary Box Set? Watching through it right now, and it's awesome.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I do get a kick out of them having a better match than Cena vs Edge from the same event.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

RUDOLPH ST. SKINolaus said:


> *Yea I'm all for him facing Orton, just let him regain some momentum or just let him do something semi beneficially at this point*. Ive only seen 3 dolph/orton matches raw 8/11,noc, and a raw match after rumble 12. Thought the 8/11 was pretty good and remeber liking the 1/12 raw match, its the one that Barrett is watching from skybox


Agreed. (Y) I hope he has a good showing in the Rumble coming up, although he probably won't. It was awesome that he lasted the longest in the last Rumble.

I remember this Orton/Ziggler match fondly:






Just for that Ziggler win. :mark: And his post-match headstand. :lol

Ziggler as the US Champion beating Randy Orton. You don't see booking like that now. Ziggler was the last good US Champion in my eyes, Ambrose hasn't done shit with the belt (and I really like the guy, but it's the truth).


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I don't think I liked anything from that event except for the crowd. Why don't we get more Canadian PPVs?

:lmao remember when everyone was raving about Paige/Emma?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Cena/Edge TLC? Again, too undeservedly hated. Is it overly contrived? Yes. Edge's crossbody off a ladder into Cena on the outside was very bleh, as was the Spear from one ladder to another. However, it did have moments where it was telling a decent story, and it had some innovative spots. Decent match as far as I'm concerned. Better than the Cena/Orton TLC, that's for sure. That one was the definition of "true spotfest".


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Paige vs Emma is horrible :lmao


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

ATF said:


> Better than the Cena/Orton TLC, that's for sure. That one was the definition of "true spotfest".


Spotfest even though the "biggest spot" was Orton safely landing on a table below him from the apron? :lol

That match wasn't great but it damn sure was no spotfest, I WISH it was.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Nostalgia said:


> Agreed. (Y) I hope he has a good showing in the Rumble coming up, although he probably won't. It was awesome that he lasted the longest in the last Rumble.
> 
> I remember this Orton/Ziggler match fondly:
> 
> ...



His post match celebrations were :lenny loved his 2011 character, and yea he was literally breathing life into that title, only to it being lower than the NXT title nowadays

Gonna rewatch this match


Edit: NOST was actually taking about this one


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Spotfest even though the "biggest spot" was Orton safely landing on a table below him from the apron? :lol
> 
> That match wasn't great but it damn sure was no spotfest, I WISH it was.


Yup. Exacly that match. :lol

"Spotfest" not in the sense of indy-like spot after another, but in the sense of constant no-sell after another, that is. Bugged the hell outta me.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

ATF said:


> 'Kay then. Might have to hunt it down. Still, it has some stiff competition against those two 2006 matches. Which I came to the conclusion I love Trish/Mickie just a tad more. It had a more intriguing story and Mickie's antics were fucking amazing. Oh, and that hilarious contra crowd. If it wasn't for the botched Stratusfaction, it would've been better... which is scary considering it was near spot-on for what it was. The best WM Divas feud ever and it's not even close to being close to being close.







Its on the Greatest Stars Of The 90's DVD Set too 

Also saw this on YT too:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Well now I _have_ to watch the one from Japan.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

ATF said:


> Speaking of that, why do people hate on Orton/Ziggler NOC? That seems to be another critically well recieved match that gets hated on here. I didn't love it but I thought it wasn't terrible either (though that was at least over a year ago the last time I watched it so I don't recall it 100%).


It's a mess. Put together about as well as a Davey Richards match. The selling isn't as shitty as a Richards match but it's a pile of moves with little rhyme of reason to them. Ziggler had that problem in 2012. He was basically trying to wrestling an 'epic' back and forth main event finish run in every stage of every match and it sucked. I didn't even like his match with Sheamus and Sheamus was probably WWE's 2012 WOTY. Punk match at the Rumble was a pile of nothing too.



ATF said:


> Am I the only one who cringed at that double foot stomp on Regal's head?
> Also, fun fact: Regal/Cesaro's "this is wrestling" chants are seen in TNA a lot times.


Yeah that stomp dropped my eyes to the floor. I loved how it was basically the beginning of Regal's actual downfall in the match, too. Like you knew it was over then and no matter what Cesaro decided on doing, he had won.

"This is wrestling" is a horrible chant. Felt right during Joe/Kobashi and no other time ever.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Just bought WrestleMania 26 on Blu Ray and Cyber Sunday 2008 :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yeah1993 said:


> It's a mess. Put together about as well as a Davey Richards match. The selling isn't as shitty as a Richards match but it's a pile of moves with little rhyme of reason to them. Ziggler had that problem in 2012. He was basically trying to wrestling an 'epic' back and forth main event finish run in every stage of every match and it sucked. I didn't even like his match with Sheamus and Sheamus was probably WWE's 2012 WOTY. Punk match at the Rumble was a pile of nothing too.


AS much as I am a Ziggler mark, I agree with this 100 % I thought the nwo sheamus match was decent but it fell under that type of "2012 ziggler match". I'm guessing he feared his postion was falling or in a decline ? IDK but I noticed that too, yea the rumble match was shit


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I also liked Ziggler's shorter TV matches against Sheamus, Punk, and Orton as opposed to his PPV bouts against them. I guess he was trying too hard to....STEAL THE SHOW. :ziggler1

Watched the Angle vs. Eddie 2/3 Falls for the first time since it aired (I think) last night and I really enjoyed it, especially since I forgot who won. I was actually kinda rooting for Eddie near the end . Damn you, Luther Reigns!


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I get annoyed when Ziggler pulls that move trade-off nonsense against guys like Fandango and Axel in generic midcard matches, but I thought it was done really well in his match against Sheamus at NWO 12. Really showed how much Ziggler wanted that title and didn't feel contrived at all. Heck, I was actually not impressed by Sheamus in that match. He was the one that did nothing well.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Meh, I've never been much of a lover of it. I mean, I was one like 1 or 2 years ago when I thought anything and everything could've possibly been 5-stars  (We've all had that stage, admit it). But the last time I watched it, I just liked it. Now I only remember Orton's barricade DDT and the flip-off. NADA else. Always have been more fond of the Champion vs. Champion match on Raw in 2011.

And since we're on the end of 2013, gotta update dat personal best of PG Era list I have going.


----------



## HJ23 (Dec 26, 2013)

I have the history of the WWE DVD, is the WarGames DVD worth purchasing?


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Ziggler got the 'You can't wrestle' chants? :lol I'm shocked since most smarky crowds tend to be on his nuts. Ah well, it took them long enough to come around but at least some folks are starting to see what I see; nothing. The guy isn't anything special at all imo. 

And yes before SKINS arrives I will watch the Payback match. I'm just waiting to get the Best of PPV 2013 set before I start into the year. I doubt it will change my opinion though. I just think he kinda sucks.

:draper2


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Ziggler had a period where he was really good. Then he went into SHOW STEALER mode and thought doing a billion moves and kickouts = good matches .


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

The best part about Ziggler is that his gimmick is all about being a show stealer yet he absolutely never steals the show. It's pretty hilarious watching him cut promos about being the best and stealing the show and yet he never does it. :lol Silly man. He needs to pick a gimmick that is actually applicable to his abilities. There's a reason nobody is buying into this current gimmick/character he's got going. He simply isn't good enough to pull it of no matter how much he thinks he is, he just isn't. Shawn Michaels he is not. Whether you agree with HBK being the legitimate 'Showstopper' or not, at least he's able to pull the character off and make the gimmick work. Ziggler? Lol no.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Bah, I'm still on Ziggler's side. He can play a babyface better than your lord Sheamus.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

I think Ziggler has only stole 4 shows maybe? 

Bragging rights 10 VS Bryan 
NWO 12 VS Sheamus 
RR 11 VS Edge
Payback 13 VS Del Rio


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

My Lord Seamus or Cal's? Either way I say you're wrong lol. Seamus/Show HIAC >>>> most things Ziggler has ever done tbh. And I don't even think he'd be so bad if he had a gimmick he could pull off. But all this show stealer nonsense just makes me lol because it's beyond forced at this point. If he ever wants to move up the card he needs to learn how to keep his mouth shut and change his character to something that he can actually play.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Bah, I'm still on Ziggler's side. He can play a babyface better than your lord Sheamus.


I'm still gonna watch the terrible 1998 ppvs haha, I haven't seen most of them before.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I'm still a Ziggler guy. He's still one of the most entertaining guys on the roster to me and I still has one of the better match catalogs. Just a shame he's rapidly falling.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Because he never has had the opportunity too steal a ppv, its always a throwawy 15 mins curtain jerking match Orton,Jericho, brodus clay etc. Once he was in ring with Del Rio you saw how that turned out... oh wait you havent because you still havent watched the payback match 

I agree Cal, that is his formula nowadays and in 2012 but I think reason being he doesn't even care anymore. Guy is buried 8 ft under the ground at this point. Have to give HHH or whoever responsibly props for this burial grade A

I disagree Starbuck, I believe in 2011 and early 2012 he played the "show-off" character extremely well with his taunts, mannerisms etc. His promo back then were pretty good, very realistic. Probelm was once he got w/ aj and dropped vickie and they mad him say "steal the show" 10x a raw and it was overkill


He does make his gimmick work when given the chance, he does have a narcissistic arrogant aura about him reminds me of :hbk2 that they believe they are soo much better than everyone


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

SANTA GAME said:


> Ziggler got the 'You can't wrestle' chants? :lol I'm shocked since most smarky crowds tend to be on his nuts. Ah well, it took them long enough to come around but at least some folks are starting to see what I see; nothing. The guy isn't anything special at all imo.


Yep, seems like even this forum has finally hopped off his nuts. He dominated the poll for "which IWC darling do you hate?". I remember a year ago, I thought I was the only one (along with that goofball with the crush on Wade "Charisma of a Wood Plank" Borrett :side who couldn't see what's so great about the guy. With only one title, luckily that means his chances of rising up decrease even more. He's been Zack Ryder'd hard.



SANTA GAME said:


> The best part about Ziggler is that his gimmick is all about being a show stealer yet he absolutely never steals the show. It's pretty hilarious watching him cut promos about being the best and stealing the show and yet he never does it. :lol Silly man. He needs to pick a gimmick that is actually applicable to his abilities. There's a reason nobody is buying into this current gimmick/character he's got going. He simply isn't good enough to pull it of no matter how much he thinks he is, he just isn't. Shawn Michaels he is not. Whether you agree with HBK being the legitimate 'Showstopper' or not, at least he's able to pull the character off and make the gimmick work. Ziggler? Lol no.


Ha, he thinks if he yells something enough times, it will catch on and people will believe it. Only a few of his delusional fans stood by the "he steals the show every night" nonsense.

I'm glad he put his foot in his mouth on that interview when he made the company look bad by complaining about Orton getting pushed. I don't think I can like Randal any more. 



funnyfaces1 said:


> Bah, I'm still on Ziggler's side. He can play a babyface better than your lord Sheamus.


Sheamus at his most unbearable character-wise still >>>>>>> Ziggler on his best day! :fella


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

The Show _Off _stuff is fine. The handstands etc. I have no problem with that and yeah, he does that part well. But the Show _STEALER _thing he's trying to play is flopping big time because he never steals the show. It's like Austin trying to be a hell raiser without raising hell or Punk being straight edge and coming out with a beer every night. There's an obvious disconnect between his performances and his character therefore it doesn't work. Meh, I just don't see anything in him and never have. He's nothing special at all to me but obviously is awesome to you and that's fine. We don't all think the same. 

In short: Ziggler sucks .


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Starbuck said:


> The Show _Off _stuff is fine. The handstands etc. I have no problem with that and yeah, he does that part well. But the Show _STEALER _thing he's trying to play is flopping big time because he never steals the show. It's like Austin trying to be a hell raiser without raising hell or Punk being straight edge and coming out with a beer every night. There's an obvious disconnect between his performances and his character therefore it doesn't work. Meh, I just don't see anything in him and never have. He's nothing special at all to me but obviously is awesome to you and that's fine. We don't all think the same. [/B]
> 
> In short: Ziggler sucks .


lol I'm not going the "Dolph Ziggler awesome too me, you all are just stupid too think differently" route you dont like him its fine, your one of the few that has specified why you think he suck as opposed to the classic "Ziggler Suck" why ? "because he not special too me" posts some other say 

Just simply disagreeing and providing my thoughts

I will also say in response to you comment about him and his gimmick not being believable, I think him losing ALL the time kinda plays a roll. Ive never seen a upper-midcard lose as much as he does, and he has the worst wins every, just roll ups


Edit: I respectfully disagree C2d with that statement, lets all not mix up sheamus the worker with the character although I dont hate his face stuff as much as most


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

lol, funnyfaces, you have balls of steel. Always been meaning to say that to you. I love how you always just stick to your "contrary to this thread's" opinions. 

_ETA:_ And yes, Dolph > Sheamus, from everything I've seen. I've watched a bunch of Sheamus' '10 stuff, and I still don't get it. He's stiff, that's great. But that's it. There's literally nothing else for me to latch on to. And stiffness is great if a guy reads tough or badass or has some kind of vibe that draws your attention. He is the exact opposite of that for me, so it makes his great, stiff, style kind of just fall by the wayside.

Nice style, but with an aura that doesn't read "threat" or "dominance" at all. Meh. And I really am trying to force myself to like him, because I know he's gonna be thrown back into the major loop of things.




ATF said:


> Speaking of that, why do people hate on Orton/Ziggler NOC? That seems to be another critically well recieved match that gets hated on here. I didn't love it but I thought it wasn't terrible either (though that was at least over a year ago the last time I watched it so I don't recall it 100%).


I have that PPV, so I'll have to watch. I saw that Meltzer gave it close to four stars, which made me interested. C2D didn't even have it in the top 100 Orton matches, though.

I like the style of both guys, so I think that I'll like it, but I'll see. I really liked one of their RAW TV matches.




Brye said:


> I'm still a Ziggler guy. He's still one of the most entertaining guys on the roster to me and I still has one of the better match catalogs. Just a shame he's rapidly falling.


Yes, he's good. One of the few things that stands out to me about current day WWE. Shame that they generally put him in a bunch of a matches that I don't care about. I think that his style could really help elevate some guys, and it sure would be more interesting than watching these "gift on a pole" type matches. Meh.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

You're taking the gimmick too literally Starbuck. The Show off is ultimately just another cocky gimmick, and cocky wrestlers always think they're much better than they actually are. So Ziggler saying ''I'm going to steal the show every night'' isn't supposed to be taken so seriously, at least that's the way I see it. The fact he's always been booked as a midcarder doesn't help the character either. HBK was obviously better than Ziggler, but HBK was also given GOD LIKE booking compared to Ziggler so he naturally pulled off the ''show stealer'' character better because he was always put in the big feuds/matches where he could always deliver, whereas Ziggler's only been in few big matches in his career and one of those was against Del Rio at Payback and he really delivered in that match with a great performance (Starbuck get around to watching it ). The majority of time though, Ziggler's booked like shit and put in matches that are effected by time constraints, silly gimmicks, bad opponents - among other things. If you expect Ziggler to steal the show when he's booked to have 4 minute matches on the pre-show of PPV's - like he's been booked as lately, then you're deluded. The ''You can't wrestle'' chants are retarded because the one thing Ziggler's best at is his wrestling ability. Even those who hate Ziggler for his mic skills or a shitty character or whatever, admit that the guy can go in the ring so those chants are just retarded imo.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Ziggler isn't the "show stealer" he tries to make himself out to be, I 100% agree on that. He has stolen shows at times, but not consistently enough where it warrants the name.

That being said, I'd still take Ziggler over most guys nowadays. Those stupid comedy matches with Sandow those couple of weeks on Raw were really fun, and for a long time he had Bryan's best match in the WWE imo (and vice versa). And heck, usually even if the match sucks, Ziggler himself is fun to watch due to his flashy nature/crazy bumping.

Ziggler's also probably the best out of the bad in terms of mic work. The guy is extremely inconsistent and a lot of the time just sucks, but unlike others who suck on the mic and can never cut a good promo (Del Rio and Sheamus are the two that come to mind), Ziggler has had a great one or two out there (one with Foley on Raw a year or two ago and then one other fairly recently impressed me). It's not saying much, but it shows me he's not completely hopeless in that regard.

He should learn to watch his mouth in interviews though. There are a lot of fans of his who are disappointed that he isn't getting pushed because he ran his mouth off. It's kinda like Punk pre-shoot. Obviously after the shoot, they weren't going to bury him if he mouthed off in interviews or said the politically incorrect thing backstage, but before that, he had lost his World Title in 2009 because of some smarmy remark about Cena to Taker (assuming it was true). Same things that happened with Punk are happening to Ziggler now and hopefully he straightens up. Someone high up in WWE clearly thinks something of Ziggler. The guy had a strong debut against Batista in 08, and has had a very slow climb up leading to the World Title earlier this year. Not to mention, he still does get wins occasionally, so he's not getting totally buried. 

Ah well. Honestly Ziggler is the least of my concerns with booking in WWE anyway. I'm still waiting for them to do something of note with Sandow after his failed cash-in... and Barrett... fuckin' Barrett needs to be given something of worth asap. I was just watching an episode of Raw from 2010 after listening to Jericho's podcast with Edge (they had talked about the Summerslam 2010 7-on-7 booking) and despite his shortcomings in the ring, it still just doesn't make any sense why they dropped him (and The Nexus) so hard. He looked so right in that role as the top heel, leading the top stable in WWE. Sure, he sucked in the ring (although most people will say he still sucks, but he sucked more back then), but considering they replaced him as the top heel with The Miz, that simply can't be it. It is WWE I suppose, so I shouldn't be surprised, but it's tough to remember a bigger fall from grace than him. Went from being the top heel in the company to now having a minute segment each week that serves no purpose to anything. 

Although I know I won't get any sympathy in this thread as a Barrett fan, so maybe I should stop now.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

A Rollins/Dolph match would be fun as hell.

Get on it, WWE.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

yea the "stealing the show" is just a gimmick or catchphrase guys remember that

^^ yea thats what I was just trying too say, he says that line because he has a "cocky narcissistic" character. Also you cant expect him to steal it vs. damien sandow on pre show, fandango, axel, Ambrose in a sub 10 mins etc. Those are all of his last like 4 months in a nut shell

Not even takign into account his years prior


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The beauty of Sheamus is how good of a workhorse he is. He's one of the best brawlers in the world and he has chemistry with everybody. He's stiff too, but I never equated stiff with "good", so I don't really care about that junk. I've also never seen him do anything that resembles good character work, which is why I want him to never win a world title ever again.

Jericho/Orton Armageddon 07 and Jeff/Orton RR 08 are both good matches.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

LilOlMe said:


> A Rollins/Dolph match would be fun as hell.
> 
> Get on it, WWE.




Rollins vs Ziggler ladder match :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

#BadNewsSanta said:


> ... and Barrett... fuckin' Barrett needs to be given something of worth asap. I was just watching an episode of Raw from 2010 after listening to Jericho's podcast with Edge (they had talked about the Summerslam 2010 7-on-7 booking) and despite his shortcomings in the ring, it still just doesn't make any sense why they dropped him (and The Nexus) so hard. He looked so right in that role as the top heel, leading the top stable in WWE. Sure, he sucked in the ring (although most people will say he still sucks, but he sucked more back then), *but considering they replaced him as the top heel with The Miz, that simply can't be it.* It is WWE I suppose, so I shouldn't be surprised, but it's tough to remember a bigger fall from grace than him. Went from being the top heel in the company to now having a minute segment each week that serves no purpose to anything.


At least Miz has charisma so in that regard, him as top heel was actually an upgrade as crazy as that sounds.  (Barrett: Bad in the ring/dull on the mic/nonexistent charisma, Miz: Bad in the ring/okay on th mic/charismatic)



funnyfaces1 said:


> Jericho/Orton Armageddon 07 and Jeff/Orton RR 08 are both good matches.


No shit.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Choke2Death said:


> At least Miz has charisma so in that regard, him as top heel was actually an upgrade as crazy as that sounds.  (Barrett: Bad in the ring/dull on the mic/nonexistent charisma, Miz: Bad in the ring/okay on th mic/charismatic)


The only thing I've ever worked out is that Miz is more media friendly than Barrett. Other than that, Barrett's a much better mic worker, has a strong presence and top heel look than The Miz. I'd also, even back then, take him above The Miz in the ring (and I'd say he's become far better than The Miz since, which isn't saying much, but still).

Ziggler/Rollins... fuck, that match needs to happen asap. :mark:


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> The beauty of Sheamus is how good of a workhorse he is. He's one of the best brawlers in the world and he has chemistry with everybody. He's stiff too, but I never equated stiff with "good", so I don't really care about that junk. I've also never seen him do anything that resembles good character work, which is why I want him to never win a world title ever again.
> 
> *Jericho/Orton Armageddon 07* and Jeff/Orton RR 08 are both good matches.


I always forget about this match. Pretty good if I recall. Shame they booked the actual return of Jericho so poorly, dragging it out like 2 months after everyone already knew.


----------



## Raw2003 (Dec 20, 2012)

My Summerslam 2000 Review: Right to Censor vs Too Cool & Rikishi, 2.5/5 average match not much to say. Road Dogg vs X-Pac, 3/5 a Decent match with some good moves and the two had great chemistry. Inter-Gender Tag Team Match for the Intercontinental Title Val Venis(c) & Trish Stratus vs Eddie Guerrero & Chyna, a Great match and was defiantly one of the top bouts of the night in my opinion 3.5/5. Hardcore Title Match Shane Mcmahon(c) vs Steve Blackman, 3/5 great match with the infamous bump of the stage that Shane took it's still as epic at 19 as it was at 6 to him fall that far down. 2 out of 3 falls Chris Jericho vs Chris Benoit, 3/5 it was a pretty good match but I'd expect them to do a lot better as it felt sloppy and unentertaining in quite a few parts but a good match overall. TLC Match for the Tag Titles Edge & Christian(c)vs Dudley Boyz vs Hardy Boyz, 4/5 as you can expect this was an epic match with many entertaining moments to enjoy. First Ever Thong Stinkface Match The Kat vs Terri, 4/5 one of the very top highlights of the entire PPV for me as you can imagine it was very hot & sexy to watch and the ending delivered. The Undertaker vs Kane, a pretty underwhelming match that didn't even officially start or have a winner for that matter so a 2.5/5 for me. WWE Championship Triple Threat, The Rock(c) vs Kurt Angle vs Triple H, 4.5/5 a Great match with some great moves and lots of high drama from beginning to end and it makes the viewer be on the edge of their seat wondering what will happen next. Overall I give the PPV a 4.5/5 it's truly one of WWE's Greatest PPV in their History.


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Being the 'Show Stealer' is his gimmick though. Being the 'Show Off' was just another cocky gimmick with the added twist of the handstands and the showing off antics in matches etc. That's a cocky character. Constantly saying you're going to steal the show though is different and is never going to work when you don't actually steal the show. Shawn Michaels is good enough to be called a Showstopper. Dolph Ziggler most certainly isn't. That's the difference, for me anyways. It's the wrong character for him to play because he isn't talented enough to pull it off. Imo of course. 

:draper2

I'm repeating myself now though so that's my last word on it lol. I will say this though, I'd rather watch a Ziggler match than a Barrett match. Now there's a guy who got horribly exposed once he was put on his own and forced to fend for himself. Boring in the ring, mostly boring on he mic, generic look, shit finisher, TERRIBLE theme music. Yeah, Ziggler > Barrett. At least Ziggler will fling himself about to entertain you. Barrett can't do shit.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

I had this big response to a bunch of things typed up but my cunt of a computer or internet made it impossible to post and I lost it. No way I'm re-posting all of it.


In short:

Fuck Ziggler
Sheamus is better
Fuck Ziggler


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

Starbuck said:


> Being the 'Show Stealer' is his gimmick though. Being the 'Show Off' was just another cocky gimmick with the added twist of the handstands and the showing off antics in matches etc. That's a cocky character. Constantly saying you're going to steal the show though is different and is never going to work when you don't actually steal the show. Shawn Michaels is good enough to be called a Showstopper. Dolph Ziggler most certainly isn't. That's the difference, for me anyways. It's the wrong character for him to play because he isn't talented enough to pull it off. Imo of course.
> 
> :draper2
> 
> I'm repeating myself now though so that's my last word on it lol. I will say this though, I'd rather watch a Ziggler match than a Barrett match. Now there's a guy who got horribly exposed once he was put on his own and forced to fend for himself. Boring in the ring, mostly boring on he mic, generic look, shit finisher, TERRIBLE theme music. Yeah, Ziggler > Barrett. At least Ziggler will fling himself about to entertain you. Barrett can't do shit.


Agreed, I think the Show Off thing works for him but Stealing the Show.. ehh, doesn't work, especially recently. Him calling himself that when he's had under-card/mid-card matches with Fandango, Damien Sandow, etc (and losing to them) proves that he is not the "Show Stealer".

Just keep the "Show Off", 'cause that works the most and makes the most sense.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

97 had some pretty good main even matches in the tv shows, finished the last RAW before Wrestlemania.

That Bret Hart rage :mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Yeah1993 said:


> In short:
> 
> Fuck Sheamus
> Ziggler is better
> Fuck Sheamus


Agreed! :clap


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

No, silly, I said Sheamus is better than Ziggler AKA THE RIGHT OPINION. Guy who actually works from underneath and creates interesting spots to get out of conundrums (I'm going to check if I have ever used that word on WF before) is clearly better than guy who has a back and forth match, works from underneath for like three moves, then works another back and forth match. Plus Sheamus finisher is a BOOT and Ziggler's some pull-down indy bullshit. What the fuck is he even doing? 

I SO WISH I HAD THAT FUCKING RESPONSE I LOST HNGNGGNGNGNNNNNN

(holy shit I almost lost this one, only difference is the other one was nine times as big)


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Sheamus > Ziggler at everything except appealing to people with bad taste. Better in ring, better on the mic, more charismatic, better look, better hair color, funnier, better everything.

1. Sheamus
50. Ziggler
500000. Miz
10000001. Barrett


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I disagree with C2D. Miz and Barrett are WAAAYYY too high .


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

King Cal said:


> I disagree with C2D. Miz and Barrett are WAAAYYY too high .


Well, Barrett has been working his way up because the winds of Barrett Barrage are changing. TIDES. 

_(your Barrett video has been making me laugh hard recently. He's just... not good.)_


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Cesaro/Regal ***3/4


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Barrett>Ziggler>>>>>Sheamus>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Miz

I actually used to like Miz... in fact now that I think about it, when/why did I start hating him? Maybe it was this thread. :lmao


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

You seem to have placed Sheamus wrongly there. He's like, tremendously good. The others really shitty, except Ziggler who is just kinda crappy.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

King Cal said:


> You seem to have placed Sheamus wrongly there. He's like, tremendously good. The others really shitty, except Ziggler who is just kinda crappy.


Nah, he's right where he belongs. A mediocre all around talent, but not completely terrible. Or by your words, "kinda crappy".


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'm still confused how he's worse than BARRETT of all people though. Calling him mediocre would be the biggest compliment he's ever likely to receive... and even then it'd be a lie to make him feel better .

Sheamus is great in the ring. NOTHING mediocre about him at all. Guy was legit one of the best in the company during 2012.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

King Cal said:


> Sheamus is great in the ring.


I'll give ya that one.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Sheamus is good at working from underneath? The reason I enjoy him in the ring is for the exact opposite reason. I think he's far better working as a dominant big guy or in a back and forth brawl. And when has Sheamus done a good promo?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> And when has Sheamus done a good promo?


Every time he's picked up a mic.

Which begs the question, when has Barrett been actually interesting to listen to on the mic? Blows my mind that the same people who say Orton is boring, uncharismatic and monotone on the mic turn around and say Barrett is a good talker. Barrett on the mic is a robot with a British accent and nothing more.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

I think Sheamus isn't too bad on the mic, but he's not great. Same for Wade Barrett.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Barrett>Ziggler>>>>>Sheamus>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Miz
> 
> I actually used to like Miz... in fact now that I think about it, when/why did I start hating him? Maybe it was this thread. :lmao


I'd switch Barrett and Sheamus myself.. none of them excite me on the mic


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Sheamus is terrible on the mic and that's my big problem with him, because that also means he can't be expected to carry a good feud/storyline. I can't get into him. Whether he's trying (and failing) to be a funny goof, or talking seriously about something, it just sounds unnatural and forced all the time.

Barrett on the mic is awesome. Very fluid, great delivery and can turn up the intensity. The issue with Orton is when he's trying to be monotone and all robotic, he tries too hard and makes it unbearable at times. Heck, the fact that it always looks like he's "trying" is a big issue in itself. Orton's done a lot better recently, but none of the good promos Orton has cut I don't think Barrett could've done and done them better. The guy knows how to cut a promo and carry a feud. It's why The Nexus angle worked as well as it did for as long as it did. The bullying of Cena in late-2010 when he joined The Nexus was gold.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Barrett in general is just awesome :mark:

Orton sucks on the mic because we know he can be charismatic as fuck but just rather then drone on about boring shit.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Sheamus is a king.

End of.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

He sure is. So was this guy:


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

Sheamus :

List (any source will do) of good/great matches from the year? Raw, SD, NXT and PPV?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

There's a pattern here.

of GLORY


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

*Randy Orton (c) vs. Daniel Bryan - WWE Championship - WWE Night of Champions 2013: ****

Decided to give this a rewatch. The match starts off with Orton and Bryan going back and forth. Orton and Bryan appeared to be equals but the momentum changes when Bryan executes two suicide dives and tries to go for the third one, but Orton counters by striking Bryan as he was going for the dive. Orton then does his DDT on the outside. DB makes it in before the 10 count and it escalates to back and forth action. There's also a ref bump that happens but the original ref gets back into the match. End of the match happens when Orton tries to go for the RKO but is countered by Bryan's backslide. Orton escapes it, gets kicked in the head, and Bryan does his running knee and gets a fast count from the ref to get the victory. Looking at the whole thing, the match is decent, but it felt really lackluster as I know the both of them could do a lot better. The fast ref count didn't help matters as it felt really anti-climatic for a match that had a decent storyline going into it.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I really hope no one still thinks The Attitude era is the glory years for the WWE, because the 98 ppvs so far have been pretty awful.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

William Murderface said:


> I really hope no one still thinks The Attitude era is the glory years for the WWE, because the 98 ppvs so far have been pretty awful.


Which one did you watch this time?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I have watched Rumble 98 to Over The Edge 98 so far.

King Of The Ring is next for me.


----------



## KingLobos (Apr 10, 2013)

1998 had major roster transition when I rewatched everything from that year about two weeks ago. Which is something I hadn't realized before.

Its like the entire midcard from early 98 is completely gone, and replaced with the new Attitude Era guys (Xpac, Venis, Gangrel, Edge) by October.

Vader, Mero, LOD and the people who would leave by the middle of the year are completely useless and boring. The new guys that come in during the year really refreshed the product and made it better IMO.

Also they did a tremendous job booking the Rock, so that was great.

I would recommend the RR-WM portion of the year and the SummerSlam- Rock Bottom portion as well. The middle of the year was just atrocious IMO. And Stone Cold was getting stale quick. When he got fired at Judgement Day the product REALLY picked up and took off.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Honestly the only thing I enjoy about 1998 WWF was The Rock and the main event scene. Even DX kinda sucked with their dated jokes.


----------



## KingLobos (Apr 10, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Honestly the only thing I enjoy about 1998 WWF was The Rock and the main event scene. Even DX kinda sucked with their dated jokes.


I did NOT like DX either.......for the majority of the year. I hate the first incarnation with Michaels and Helmsley, and I hated the heel dx from the middle of 98, including them invading WCW.

Once again, when the Corporation angle started after Survivor Series it surprised me how much every benefited including DX, who were now faces, and stopped the stupid juvenile crap and were just fighting the Corporation along with Mankind. That's when I started to like them and they were actually doing something meaningful.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I love how Over The Edge is so awful but it produced the MOTY.


----------



## JBLoser (Jun 12, 2005)

William Murderface said:


> I love how Over The Edge is so awful but it produced the MOTY.


Austin/Dude Love?


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

JBLoser said:


> Austin/Dude Love?


Yes indeed.


----------



## JBLoser (Jun 12, 2005)

Awesome match. I'm with you, by the way. 1998 was garbage. 

I'll stick to it that 2000 was the best year from top to bottom and while they started to propel themselves in 98 and 99 and gain steam, 2000 really, REALLY put them over the top in the MNW.


----------



## obby (May 19, 2009)

Ugh, just learned that Batista was coming back. Why didn't they make it SURPRISE. It would've been so fucking exciting.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

So far 98 has been awful and most of the matches have just been so lazy, plus the WWE didn't have the most talent at that time.

It was a rule that you had to throw 100 punches in every match that year.


----------



## JBLoser (Jun 12, 2005)

William Murderface said:


> So far 98 has been awful and most of the matches have just been so lazy, plus the WWE didn't have the most talent at that time.
> 
> *It was a rule that you had to throw 100 punches in every match that year.*


:lmao :lmao :lmao

So it took me 12 years to realize that if the Raw-Nitro simulcast didn't happen, the Raw go home show leading into WM X-7 would have been absolutely AWFUL.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Mark Henry is killing it in this 98 KOTR tournament. Meanwhile, X-Pac and Goldy somehow are wrestling like crap in the go home show.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Could we discuss the most overlooked/underrated stuff of THE SHIELD, please? Because I'm on a Shield mood right now.

My heart tells me to go rewatch that jizztastic 11 on 3 Handicap match.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

I think 98 has been way better than 97 so far. Not for in ring wrestling obviously but for other things. I prefer NOD vs DX instead of DOA vs Los boricus (spelling?). Also the main event and the mid card look far better IMO. Edge is still to come.


----------



## KingLobos (Apr 10, 2013)

Oliver-94 said:


> I think 98 has been way better than 97 so far. Not for in ring wrestling obviously but for other things. I prefer NOD vs DX instead of DOA vs Los boricus (spelling?). Also the main event and the mid card look far better IMO. Edge is still to come.


Late 98 is WAY better than early and middle 98. Continue on and you won't be disappointed.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

Even the R2WM in 98 was better. Kane/Taker, Rock's character, Austin and HBK were all great aspects. IIRC, 97' only had a great feud in Austin/Bret going into WM.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

I'm watching the Cesaro/Regal match and thinking how good would have a Cesaro/Benoit or Cesaro/Eddie match been.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

For the Rollins fans out there


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I need to speed up my Attitude Era watching. Still stuck at early 1997 and they just turned to Raw is War a couple of weeks before WM13. Can't wait for Malvia (that's how I read it at first) to become The Rock and rule the place with his awesome mic work.


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

okay random ppv to watch. what u think? wcw/wwf/wwe


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Just re-watched Rey/Guerrero from Halloween Havoc, fuck me it gets better every time you watch.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

King Kenny Claus said:


> okay random ppv to watch. what u think? wcw/wwf/wwe


No way out 06


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Watching WM 13 for the first time now (haven't seen any of the matches in full), anything good besides the obvious one?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Chicago Street Fight is fun.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

DoubtGin said:


> Watching WM 13 for the first time now (haven't seen any of the matches in full), anything good besides the obvious one?


Cal likes _Owen Hart & The British Bulldog vs. Mankind & Vader (w/Paul Bearer)_, but i havn't watched it myself in years


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Just watched this years and last years Post Mania RAWs back to back.

Man last years was awesome. And the better RAW for me.

Everyone went crazy for this years crowd but last years was an all around better show with a great crowd as well. 

Cant go wrong with Punk/Henry and the return of :brock (That alone jumps it up major points. ) , Rock's promo wasnt even that bad, and the Yes! chants explosions for Dbry that night. Whew!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

lolWWF1998

Lets cut the talk about this now b/c the Attitude Era praise is starting to seep in w/some posters. Help us.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao

I heard cena/rollins was pretty good, actually looking forward more to that one than henry/reigns


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Both are at an event peak for me. Rollins main eventing vs the company guy though. Wow. I'm ecstatic. Still no Rollins vs Punk yet. GAH, boo.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yea that be :lenny

Any word on ziggler/orton ?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

No idea. Only been Cena vs Rollins to really make the rounds as MOTN & a top quality match.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

Raw back in 1998 was just fantastic viewing week by week, but yeah the PPVs were total shambles. The Undertaker-Kane match from Judgement Day has to be the worst main event match I've ever seen. Man, Taker was just awful in late 1998 to September 1999.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Taker was one of the only guys I liked to watch during 1998 - 1999, tbhayley. Had some of the best matches in 1999.


----------



## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

ATF said:


> The Chicago Street Fight is fun.


If you're a fan of Colt Cabana he has an amazing cameo in that match. I think he was 16 and had floor seats and he punches Hawk during the street fight.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

So finished half of WM 13 and nothing that truly grabbed me so far. Goldust/HHH had a pretty shitty ending, but was the best match so far (still not good), the rest was unremarkable.

But Austin vs Hart is starting now :mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Having watched the 'History Of WWE DVD', it was great seeing Taker being interviewed.


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

DoubtGin said:


> So finished half of WM 13 and nothing that truly grabbed me so far. Goldust/HHH had a pretty shitty ending, but was the best match so far (still not good), the rest was unremarkable.
> 
> But Austin vs Hart is starting now :mark: :mark: :mark:


I :mark: watching this PPV a few months ago when Sheik put the camel clutch on Rocky.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I just canceled my plans for tonite for smackdown, this better be good lol


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

THE MIGHTY KRANG said:


> I :mark: watching this PPV a few months ago when Sheik put the camel clutch on Rocky.


Sheik :mark:


JR falling from his chair :lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Ok so that match was as awesome as I hoped it'd be. *****

They sure hyped Shamrock quite a bit in the end, as well.

That ovation for Austin :mark: :mark:


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

:banderas


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

SKINS25 said:


> I just canceled my plans for tonite for smackdown, this better be good lol


:lol Why? You can watch Smackdown anytime.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

RhodesForWHC said:


> :banderas


:angle2


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)




----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Nostalgia said:


> :lol Why? You can watch Smackdown anytime.


yea just realized that, have to head out in a hour, hopefully Im back by 800


----------



## SpookshowTony (Dec 9, 2012)

*The Rock vs Hollywood Hulk Hogan - Wrestlemania X8 (3/17/02) 9/10*


Edit: I know what the general consensus is on Bret/Shawn WM 12, but hopefully before the weekend is over I'm looking forward to re-watching it 17 years after the original airing.


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

Rollins/Cena on Smackdown was top notch stuff (Y)

& i'm a mark for Reigns and everything he does, his match with Henry was fun.

I'm fucking crazy but i'm kinda looking forward to Big E & Fandango on Raw


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

wow the Sycho Sid / Taker match was awful, so disappointed


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Watched Smackdown earlier today. Cena/Rollins was highly enjoyable, Reigns/Henry was too short to be anything great (but it was good) and Orton/Ziggler was fun. It even included the stuff during commercial for me where I watched it, so it was kinda strange when Cole would call a move seconds after it happened.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Is the full Bryan/Orton from Raw anywhere? Wouldn't mind seeing that again.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Is the full Bryan/Orton from Raw anywhere? Wouldn't mind seeing that again.


Watched it three times already and every time it's been awesome. I don't know if there's a version without the commercial break but here's the full show: (match starts around 106 minutes (1:46:00) with Orton's pre-match promo included)






:lmao @ "sawed off loser".


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Thanks mate


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x18nx7c_edge-vs-randy-orton-4-30-2007_creation
*Edge vs. Randy Orton (RAW 4/30/07)*

Not bad. Pretty good match, both were good but Orton delivered more, which is no surprise.

Although, truthfully, I had completely forgot about this match.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

That Edge/Orton match is awesome. My personal favorite from them.

Here are ratings from the matches I've watched so far:

Ziggler/Orton- **1/2
Sandow/Bryan- **
Henry/Reigns- *
Cena/Rollins- ***1/2

Didn't feel like sitting through Big E/Ambrose. Ziggler/Orton was a decent enough match, Sandow/Bryan had some potential but it was way too short, Henry/Reigns sucked and in this case, thankfully it was short, and Cena/Rollins was the clear MOTN, and a great one at that. Only match I forgot to watch was Cesaro/Rhodes, but I'll give that one a watch later.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Didn't thought Henry/Reigns sucked at all. For the short time given, it was a big bad slugfest exactly as it should've. Obviously it could've been a hell of a lot better, but still.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Ziggler's face performance in the Orton/Ziggler match. (Y)

Bout to watch Cena/Rollins. Never expected this match to ever happen two years ago. :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Just got back from The Squared Circle restaurant. Didn't see Victoria, but it was still a cool place with some nice memorabilia hanging around. My friend and I both really liked the food as well.

Gail Kim-Chi Burger: *****1/4*
JR's Special Burger: ****3/4*
Service: ******

They were also airing a PPV while we were there. Guess which one it was. (Hint: The main event had an awesome HIAC match).


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Bad Blood 2004? 8*D


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Holy shit @ the Rhodes moonsault off the cage. Why can't that be on TV?


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Just got back from The Squared Circle restaurant. Didn't see Victoria, but it was still a cool place with some nice memorabilia hanging around. My friend and I both really liked the food as well.
> 
> Gail Kim-Chi Burger: *****1/4*
> JR's Special Burger: ****3/4*
> ...


Summerslam '08? 

Also, Cena/Rollins, HOLY FUCK

****1/4, imo.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Hoping I'll be back home in time tonight to see Cena vs. Rollins :mark:


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Yeah, that Moonsault is absolutely great. Rhodes' Moonsault is just usually very good, best moonsault on the roster, IMO. So crisp.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Brye w/that hype. Not like I needed it for John-boy vs BLACK _(look how hip I am)_, but oh shooot.

Legit dream match right here. Can't wait. Still have at least two hours till it even airs tho.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Answer:



Spoiler: BADBLOOD04?















Unfortunately, I didn't get to see the main event, but I did catch everything from the Wrestlemania rematch and the WWE title match. Can't say I liked either match that much though.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

ATF said:


> Didn't thought Henry/Reigns sucked at all. For the short time given, it was a big bad slugfest exactly as it should've. Obviously it could've been a hell of a lot better, but still.


The last 20-30 seconds was pretty good (pretty much Reigns doing his jumping fist and then hitting the spear), but the match went way too slow for a 3 minute match (or however long it was). There was nothing to the match. A match like Henry/Reigns needs some kind of story attached to it beforehand to play out the big man power struggle. The issue of course with that is Reigns is a good deal smaller than Henry, so that wouldn't work out too well on his end. They could've played up Reign's speed and maybe make that the difference maker (and also make it a different type of match for him), but they didn't.

Again, it probably would've been better had they done some proper build up to the match and set a story beforehand, but they didn't, and I don't think they made the most out of the time they had either (and hence, why I'm glad they didn't go any longer on the night itself). So yeah, take that for what it's worth. I just don't think they meshed well at all, combined with the fact I don't think Reigns is good in the ring, it's a recipe for disaster if they go again... at least for me, anyway. 

I wish Henry would start trash talking in his matches again.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

The Primer said:


> Brye w/that hype. Not like I needed it for THE PROTOTYPE vs BLACK _(look how hip I am)_, but oh shooot.


Fixed. :cena3

Gonna watch something before I head out (I HATE GETTING READY JUST TO GO EAT). Since I watched Benoit vs. Jericho from RR01 yesterday, I guess I'll watch those two vs. the Two Man Power Trip. It's only fair.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

First time I ever saw John Cena was as PROTOTYPE in 2001. Squashed Christopher Daniels. True story.

My goal to be more hip towards rasslin continues.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Just got back from The Squared Circle restaurant. Didn't see Victoria, but it was still a cool place with some nice memorabilia hanging around. My friend and I both really liked the food as well.
> 
> Gail Kim-Chi Burger: *****1/4*
> JR's Special Burger: ****3/4*
> ...


You do know if you saw her I'd have to kill you right? :side:



> First time I ever saw John Cena was as PROTOTYPE in 2001. Squashed Christopher Daniels. True story.
> 
> My goal to be more hip towards rasslin continues.


I was there 8*D


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Just rewatched this and it's still absolutely awesome!






Since Batista is about to return, I think I'll go through some of his matches to be prepared for DA ANIMAL! :batista2


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

That's all I need to be prepared for :batista3

Ooh, now I want to watch Batista vs. Undertaker. Shit, I was supposed to YouTube Benoit and Jericho vs. HHH and Austin. Decisions..


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Been wanting to watch Taker vs Cena from 2004 for years now. Maybe tonight will finally be the night. Their stuff in 2003 is fabulous.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

PGSucks said:


> Ooh, now I want to watch Batista vs. Undertaker. S*hit, I was supposed to YouTube Benoit and Jericho vs. HHH and Austin. Decisions..*


Go for it. Here's zep's excellent version that is not too colorful:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

William Murderface said:


> You do know if you saw her I'd have to kill you right? :side:


Kill me now. I JUST found out that apparently :henry1 was at the restaurant last night. I missed my chance to meet one of my untouchables unk3.

Natalya, Aiden English, and CJ Parker were there too, but who cares about them?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Aiden English too. holy shit :mark:

You want me to tell you my two stories of being in close proximity of but missing out too? Should I be one of those to try and put the spotlight on me instead? They're almost too soul crushing to bring up.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Choke2Death said:


> Go for it. Here's zep's excellent version that is not too colorful:


Thanks! I'll definitely be watching that later tonight.

Ended up YouTubing (is that a word?) Batista vs. Undertaker at CS08. Great match, although the crowd was dead until the last few minutes and I found it funny that :batista2 went for the ten punches, even though he should know how that always ends. :side:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Triple H knows how deadly of a decision that is. Suck it, chump. :mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

just got back

ziggler/orton
rollins/cena
reigns/henry

and I think real amercians/rhodes :lenny this is better than the last 3 ppvs legit


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

PGSucks said:


> Ended up YouTubing (is that a word?) Batista vs. Undertaker at CS08. Great match, although the crowd was dead until the last few minutes and I found it funny that :batista2 went for the ten punches, even though he should know how that always ends. :side:


I hate that spot. Whenever somebody does that against Taker, it's so obvious that he'll counter it into the Last Ride. I can understand if it's somebody huge like Big Show where Taker cannot lift him traditionally so he'll need assistance, but other times it makes the opponent look dumb - specially if they stand there and pose for a minute. (Cena at Vengeance and Orton in the casket match)


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I also hate that spot. Annoys the shit out of me.

Also, didn't know you (PGSucks) wanted Undertaker/Show CS 08, I could have linked ya to my DVD rip of it lol. I bought the show on DVD a while back specifically for that match .


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

It was actually a spur of the moment decision after watching that :lol-worthy "BASKETBALLS...don't hold grudges" promo, as I'd already seen the WM and Backlash matches a ton. Thanks though 

Cody vs. Cesaro :mark:

EDIT: Not long enough :HHH


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Got no beef w/the last ride spot. Basically no different than when he does Old School to dudes. He hits him before so, but they're still able to counter unless those times he does is super fast. Yet, there are those select matches where the opponents counter. Why doesn't that happen more often? But nobody cares. So, I'm the same w/Taker powerbombing fuckers to get a near fall 9/10.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Downloading SD ATM, unfortunate that my hotel doesn't have Syfy but I wanna see Cena/Rollins :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Having PC problems myself so I won't see SD until 2morrow. Downloading a different version of Windows 7 atm while SD is behind it in the queue .


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Kill me now. I JUST found out that apparently :henry1 was at the restaurant last night. I missed my chance to meet one of my untouchables unk3.
> 
> Natalya, Aiden English, and CJ Parker were there too, but who cares about them?


I'd be stoked to meet all of them except CJ Parker obviously.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I've never been near celebs, be they wrestlers or otherwise, in a way where I could meet them or even miss meeting them. 

The restraining orders likely have something to do with that though...


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Mark Calaway feels you're creepier than DDP stalking his ex-wife, amirite?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

IF ONLY HE'D GIVE ME A CHANCE TO LOVE HIM. I COULD MAKE HIM HAPPY. YOU'LL SEE. YOU'LL ALL SEE.


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

I fucking knew it.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Don't be a slut. You got to ease into it. Which is why I'm still waiting. Generico is getting all my letters atm.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

TLC 2012 came in the mail today. Hoping for Rumble 2007 and Summerslam 2001 tomorrow. F you slow holiday shipping! 

If I ever ran into Mick Foley I'd wanna hug him. Come at me! 



DoubtGin said:


> wow the Sycho Sid / Taker match was awful, so disappointed


What were you expecting? :austin3 



RhodesForWHC said:


> Yeah, that Moonsault is absolutely great. Rhodes' Moonsault is just usually very good, best moonsault on the roster, IMO. So crisp.


Rhodes also has the best spray tan on the roster. 

I do enjoy Cody though. I'd love to see him get a big push in 2014. 



Choke2Death said:


> Go for it. Here's zep's excellent version that is not too colorful:


Wish this was on a DVD. unk3


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I slightly hugged Mick Foley. His flannel is the softest thing I've touched.

Let that sink in for a second.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

> If I ever ran into Mick Foley I'd wanna hug him. Come at me!


I met Foley, his flannel is so soft 

The guy above me copied me :side:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The Primer said:


> I slightly hugged Mick Foley. His flannel is the softest thing I've touched.
> 
> Let that sink in for a second.





William Murderface said:


> I met Foley, his flannel is so soft
> 
> The guy above me copied me :side:


Ha.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:lmao

That's the memory which stuck out the most. I DON'T LIE.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Just finished :batista3 vs :cena4 from SummerSlam. Been a while since I last watched it but it's still as fun. Plenty of atmosphere with a big time feeling and great back and forth. For two guys who supposedly "can't" wrestle (according to idiots, but still), they've had great chemistry together. This match and the LMS. :mark:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

before I forget, bought the best of SNME DVD today, thoughts on it?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

smitty915 said:


> before I forget, bought the best of SNME DVD today, thoughts on it?


FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Batista really isn't any good though.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

King Cal said:


> FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN FUN.


Awesomwe, legit haven't seen a single match on it


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

I hate all of you Foley huggers!



smitty915 said:


> before I forget, bought the best of SNME DVD today, thoughts on it?


I actually agree with Cal. Incredibly fun. One of my fave WWE sets. Dat babyface performance from Savage against Bret Hart is just swell. 

If I had to rank my top 5-10 WWE sets this probably makes the list. Brings back some great childhood memories. I was in attendance at two of the matches on the set.....Bret/DiBiase and Perfect/Tito


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Primer said:


> Batista really isn't any good though.


He's alright. When he has a bad match, that shit is unbearable but when he's on, he's shown that he can even carry The Great Khali to an enjoyable match. And _that_ takes talent!

Since I've never watched his matches with Punk, I'll prioritize them.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The match w/Punk from PPV is one of his good ones out there. It had a nice give & take behind it from both. Opposed to Batista being shitty or having to be carried.

Then there is that unusual tag that owned featuring Kane & Batista vs MVPorter & Khali in 2008. Still not sure how that was so good. Kane is the only worth the time of day and then boom. Hidden gem.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

When did Batista face Punk? I'm drawing a blank lol.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

GAB 2008 & the next night on RAW.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Primer said:


> The match w/Punk from PPV is one of his good ones out there. It had a nice give & take behind it from both. Opposed to Batista being shitty or having to be carried.
> 
> Then there is that unusual tag that owned featuring Kane & Batista vs MVPorter & Khali in 2008. Still not sure how that was so good. Kane is the only worth the time of day and then boom. Hidden gem.


:lmao @ Porter. Will give that a watch too.



King Cal said:


> When did Batista face Punk? I'm drawing a blank lol.


Great American Bash 2008 (three years after Batista had one of the worst matches in history 8*D) and on Raw the week after I think.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

I wonder if Batista will rock the power bomb as his finisher? I could be wrong but didn't they ban it?

Won't lie I saw GAB 08 used for like $4 today at the used store here and almost bought it just for the Punk/Batista match. I haven't seen it either.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Don't remember any news like that. Undertaker still uses the Last Ride when he works. Plus, Rollins has the buckle bomb & Cena has a counter thingy that morphs into a makeshift powerbomb.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

^^^^
I'm forgetting where I heard that. I LOVE the power bomb (one of my favorite finishers) so I hope I'm way off.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Ahh, 08 during Punk's title reign. I remember bugger all of that lol. Punk beat Edge on Raw by cashing in and then... got punted by Orton and had the title taken away from him. And that is all I remember :lmao.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Bigger concern is if Batista can even hit a Batista bomb. Thing has looked like a pile of crap since he got his main event push, tbhayley. Scared for a 2014 version.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

cena/rollins *** 3/4- ****
henry/reigns ***3/4

orton/ziggler was not too shabby either


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

Cena/Rollins or Bryan/Orton from the recent RAW?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

cena/rollins was on smackdown


----------



## MyNameIsJonMarston (Oct 26, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> cena/rollins was on smackdown


I know, asking which one you preferred.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

MyNameIsJonMarston said:


> I know, asking which one you preferred.


oh lol misunderstood you


ummm, they both are completely different matches, hard to compare them, I will say I enjoyed cena/rollins more if that is a better answer ?


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Cena/Rollins happened? Honestly can't decide if I'm even interested in that. Anyone have an opinion on it?


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

***3/4-**** HHH


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Cena/Rollins was fucking AWESOME. 

***3/4


----------



## WrestlingOracle (Jul 6, 2013)

On what match is better, it depends on your personal taste. If you are inclined torwards the finer points of wrestling and are a psychology stickler who appreciates the simplicity and classic appeal of the classic shortcut heel vs workhorse face than Bryan/Orton is your pick. If you are a fan who doesn't prefer a slow burned mechanical match who likes to be taken through the roller coaster of wrestling with high points and false finishes who doesn't like to watch a whole event and prefers highlights, than you would easily choose Seth/Cena. If you lie inbetween than you get the best of both worlds, but it really depends on your taste. Something to consider though is that the Rollins/Cena match was structured as a one off Rollins showcase to show fans that he is often overlooked and can in fact hang with anyone while it appears that Orton/Bryan was structured to introduce the widely predicted triple threat match at the rumble and secondly accentuate Orton's underhandedness. Also, consider that Rollins/Cena was a finished product while Orton/Bryan wasn't. Hell of a performance by Seth tonight though I will say that.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Just rewatched Ziggler/ADR for the first time since it aired, still GREAT IMO, ****1/2 and the #2 MOTY 

About to watch SD


----------



## RatedR10 (May 23, 2008)

Well...seems like I'm going to have to watch the Smackdown replay to get to see that Cena-Rollins match. Sounds awesome.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

MyNameIsJonMarston said:


> Cena/Rollins or Bryan/Orton from the recent RAW?


Orton/Bryan. I really enjoyed the former but not _that_ much.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

*Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan - WWE Championship - WWE Battleground 2013: ***1/4*

Due to questionable officiating at the Night of Champions match, the WWE Championship is vacant and Orton and Bryan are now fighting to become the new champion. The match starts out with the both of them being equal until Bryan gets a little bit of an advantage. Bryan goes on a little offensive flurry until Orton pushes Bryan onto the top rope and clothelines him from the second rope. Orton goes on the offensive until Bryan goes on a little comeback. Orton gets another momentum switch as he shows that he is the Randy Orton of old: remorseless and brutal by going on an aggressive offensive flurry from pulling Bryan onto the ring post, executing a back suplex onto the ring barrier, and shoving Bryan onto the steel steps. Orton tries to powerbomb Bryan onto the Spanish announcer's table but Bryan counters and goes an offensive flurry himself, culminating with a nice diving knee from the top rope to the outside. The match escalates into some really good back and forth offense which ends with Bryan applying the Yes Lock, looking like he's going to win. Then, Big Show shows up and pulls the ref away. Bryan confronts Big Show, gets knocked out. Scott Armstrong (the ref from the NOC match that was fired) returns and counts Orton's pin. Big Show then pulls Scott Armstrong, knocks him out, and then proceed to knock Orton out, thus ending the match in a no contest. Honestly, I thought this match was better than their NOC match and it looks like it was getting really good, but the ending yet again ruins it, being what I thought as a convoluted mess. This match could've been rated a lot higher if it wasn't for the ending imo.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Gonna catch up on some 2013 matches...haven't watched regularly since Mania at all. Anyone got some good PPV stuff for me to check out? Right now I'm checking out the double turn Ziggler vs. Del Rio, and Christian vs. ADR from Summerslam. I saw Summerslam, but didn't pay attention to that match


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Watch Rhodes Bros vs The Shield from Battleground.

Survivor Series - Elimination Match & Punk/Danielson vs Harper/Rowan
TLC - Punk vs Shield, Four Way Tag, & Danielson vs Wyatt/Harper/Rowan

Literally the same dudes worth watching. Oh, and Cena vs Henry from MITB if you missed it.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Punked Up said:


> Gonna catch up on some 2013 matches...haven't watched regularly since Mania at all. Anyone got some good PPV stuff for me to check out? Right now I'm checking out the double turn Ziggler vs. Del Rio, and Christian vs. ADR from Summerslam. I saw Summerslam, but didn't pay attention to that match


Cena vs Mark Henry MITB

Rising stars MITB

Shield vs Rhodes bros BG 

I'd say thats it for MUST SEE PPV matches excluding SS


----------



## RatedR10 (May 23, 2008)

OK, saw Cena-Rollins on Smackdown on YouTube...really good. Not quite on the Orton-Bryan level, but pretty damn close, and a very nice treat for Smackdown which hasn't seen a match like that in a while. 

John Cena vs. Seth Rollins - ***3/4


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Just got back and I have most of SD on DVR. Well, it starts with Big E sprinting to the ring 

Time to watch Orton/Ziggles, Reigns/Henry, and ROLLINS/CENA :mark:

EDIT: Ziggler's hair is tragic... :ziggler1


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

RatedR10 said:


> OK, saw Cena-Rollins on Smackdown on YouTube...really good. Not quite on the Orton-Bryan level, but pretty damn close, and a very nice treat for Smackdown which hasn't seen a match like that in a while.
> 
> John Cena vs. Seth Rollins - ***3/4


Smackdown has had a lot of great matches recently.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Punked Up said:


> Gonna catch up on some 2013 matches...haven't watched regularly since Mania at all. Anyone got some good PPV stuff for me to check out? Right now I'm checking out the double turn Ziggler vs. Del Rio, and Christian vs. ADR from Summerslam. I saw Summerslam, but didn't pay attention to that match


Ziggler/Rio from MITB is worth watching. Good bit more wrestling in that match. The two MITB matches also. That show was actually pretty good when you think about it.

If you didn't pay much attention to Summerslam, then by all means watch Punk/Lesnar and Bryan/Cena. The former has become one of my favorite matches of all time. 

The two handicap matches from TLC are enjoyable, for me. 

Looking back, TV match quality was much more consistent than PPV.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

MITB is a good show. Under the radar type good. Wouldn't mind watching the main event again though. Remember that one not being too good.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I completely forgot that Daniel Bryan even had a match tonight. :lol 

I like the MITB main event. Didn't hold up nearly as well on the second watch, but still one of the better PPV main events this year (although that isn't saying much).


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Watched Rollins/Cena again and it's still fantastic. (Y)

Wish Reigns/Henry got a little more time though. 

Also, Cena/Batista from SS '08 is about ****1/4 for me.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Hey fellas I just got back from visiting my mom in Texas, and I haven't had internet or tv the past week, what did I miss? Anything good on. Raw or crackdown? Has Cal or Yeah posted any rambles?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Regal vs Cesaro happened.

oh and apparently Cena vs Rollins + Henry vs Reigns too.

if you missed RAW: Danielson & Rhodes Bros vs Wyatt Family was excellent.

Try not to die after hearing this, lad.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Cena vs. Rollins was great. Rollins looked really good throughout, and :mark: for some of the moves Rollins pulled out. Even though I'm a big Shield mark, Rollins's single work is going to be stellar after they break up.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

He made Jinder Mahal have a borderline great match. His talents are out of this world. It's been solidified for the final time.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Regal vs Cesaro happened.
> 
> oh and apparently Cena vs Rollins + Henry vs Reigns too.
> 
> ...


Jeezus. Fucking. Christ. 

Regal. Cesaro. 

Henry. Reigns.

Holeeee shit. One of the greatest of all time facing my current fave, and the best monster heel since Leon White was putting a jockstrap on his face going against REIGNS. Oh my. I'm definitely staying up and checking all this out PRONTO. I'm assuming Regal/Cesaro was on NXT and Henry/Reigns is Raw, and Cena/Rollins is Smackdown, correct? God I've been dying to see Rollins back in a singles match since he delivered pure greatness with Danielson last summer. 

What a wonderful thing to come home too, thanks Haley.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

NXT guess is correct.

Both Henry vs Reigns & Cena vs Rollins are from tonight's Smackdown.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Excellent sir. Many thanks. Ahhh I can't believe WWE actually had the balls to give us 2 match ups like this, shame they don't seem to understand that Regal absolutely deserves to still be on Raw/Smackdown. I'd love to see the look on some rookies face if he got to raw and saw his name on the sheet against Regal in a submission match :lol

Edit- I just realized you said Danielson and Rhodes Bros vs Wyatts happened too???????!!! Wow. What a week. Was that one on Raw or Smackdown? Good lord what a week :flair3


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

RAW for the six man. It made watching that crappy night worthwhile. _(and seeing Kofi Kingston lose again _8*D)

Regal should have more use within the company on a weekly basis. Bah. We've all been down this road too many times. At least we have Goldust weekly.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> RAW for the six man. It made watching that crappy night worthwhile. _(and seeing Kofi Kingston lose again _8*D)
> 
> Regal should have more use within the company on a weekly basis. Bah. We've all been down this road too many times. At least we have Goldust weekly.


Bah, Hulu Plus doesn't have tonight's Smackdown up yet so I'll have watch those 2 matches tomorrow. I'm gonna go check the Danielson contest now.

Finished Cesar/Regal. Regal, god bless that man. He is still, at 50+ years of age, better than 99% of the guys on the main roster. And that's not a knock on them, there are some really really good wrestlers in the WWE right now, it's just Regal is in a class all his own when it comes to ring work. The style he and Finlay brought to America is without a doubt my favorite style of wrestling to watch. On top of the nastyness and stiffness you get in every Regal match, this one had some of the best selling I've seen in a match all year. You really feel Regals pain when his knee buckles, and I love that as result he couldn't use the patented knee trembler. It seems common sense enough, but so often I see guys work a limb without any sort odd purpose. It's stuff like that that adds so much legitimacy to what the performers are doing. I adored the finish as well, with Cesaro showing some humanity and not wanting to destroy someone who had earned his respect. Great storytelling, great selling, excellent mat wrestling, GREAT match. It for sure will be in my top 10 for the year, possibly as high as 6 by bumping down Ziggler/ADR PB.

Also random, but Christian/ADR Summerslam needs more love. That match wasn't good, it was GREAT. Yes it got over shadowed by the perfection that is Lesnar/Punk, utility I truly think it's every bit as good as Danielson/Cena, just without the build/hype. I can't wait til Christian comes back, there are so many new good matchups for him. I can see him absolutely killing it with Cesaro, Bryan, Punk, the Shield, etc.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Way both Regal sold the knee & Cesaro sold the arm were epic. Then the double stomp to the head. I'm slayed.

Christian vs Del Rio is the most underrated match in the whole of wrestling in 2013. Bar none. I'm set on that opinion.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

RAW main event was also good, but if you loathe Big E Langston, they stay away from it. I would also recommend Goldust/Swagger from Main Event and CESARO/ZIGGLER from Superstars this week. But DAT REIGNS/HENRY AND CENA/ROLLINS.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Forgot I need to watch Main Event still. Just for that match. No XWT account to see Cesaro vs Ziggler. Go figure. I've watched every other pile of shit, but once that returns, I miss it. It may be up on some dailymotion account soon but I'll have to keep looking.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Could someone link me to Cena/Rollins? 

BTW, started catching up a bit tonight!

Del Rio vs. Christian (SummerSlam) - ***3/4. Needed more time, but I love the way Del Rio targeted the shoulder, and the work rate here was just insane (look at me, such a mark 8*D . :clap

Henry vs. Cena (MitB) - ***1/2. The pacing was honestly pretty brutal at times, but all the stuff with the AA was actually really cool, and Henry's distraction at the end was genius (so genius that it lose him the match 8*D ) :clap:clap

Ziggler vs. Del Rio - **** Holy shit that was an awesome double turn! The crowd made this one, it was like a slow transformation where you could tell at the end they wanted to keep cheering ADR but couldn't stand what he was doing. :clap:clap:clap


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Holy shit, a lot of good matches this week. Need to watch those.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

HollyJollyHelmsley said:


> Ziggler/Rio from MITB is worth watching. Good bit more wrestling in that match. The two MITB matches also. That show was actually pretty good when you think about it.
> 
> If you didn't pay much attention to Summerslam, then by all means watch Punk/Lesnar and Bryan/Cena. The former has become one of my favorite matches of all time.
> 
> ...



I payed pretty damn good attention during Punk/Lesnar, and while the ending 10 minutes is GOAT level stuff, easily, there was too much Heyman. He seemed to interfere every single time Punk had something going, it was just too much at the end for me. ****1/2 though.

Cena vs. Bryan I need to re-watch but I remember feeling it a little less than the former, so pre-emptively you can mark me down as ****1/4 for that one. Definitely need to check it out again though.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

The Primer said:


> Way both Regal sold the knee & Cesaro sold the arm were epic. Then the double stomp to the head. I'm slayed.
> 
> Christian vs Del Rio is the most underrated match in the whole of wrestling in 2013. Bar none. I'm set on that opinion.


Ah yes, I definitely should have given Cesar the shout out for great selling too. When he gets regal down and both his arms are busted so he just guts it out, runs up, and jumps on Regals freaking head :mark: THAT was a moment.

I am 100% in your camp in regards to Christian/Del Rio. I'll admit, when I watched it live, I thought it was really really good but didn't quite reach that GREAT level. It took rewatching it a month later for it to really click for me, and now I've watched it twice the past 2 weeks alone just because it's such an enjoyable bout. I'll get some heat I think from others, but I think I might rate it as Del Rios best match. Both guys were just on their A game that night.

Edit-funnyfaces, I skipped it out of sheer principle, but how bad was the Henry as Santa Claus bit? Was it as bad as I thought? I just love Henry so much I can't bear to see him in a Santa suit, but I am curious. For people's whose sensibilities weren't offended like mine, was it funny or entertaining? Thanks for the matches recommend ations, I have given up on Big E, but I'll check it out out of morbid curiosity. Lemme guess, he was "explosive", whatever fuck that means, right?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Wow, even PTP/Rybaxel was a good match on Smackdown. One of Titus' finest performances. And Orton's promo was good too.

Another listworthy gem from this year:

x11akug_02-01-13-team-hell-no-vs-rey-mysterio-and-sin-cara_sport


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Seems like just as I take some time off WWE starts putting out one of the GOAT years in terms of match quality.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Henry vs Sandow was nothing more than a Henry squash while dressed as Santa. Not really offensive, but nothing you need to see either.

Not sure what your rep comment is driving at FF. I don't think there is a match out there I don't dig from Sheamus. He's been a favorite since I caught him on the FCW roster years ago.


----------



## WrestlingOracle (Jul 6, 2013)

All this talk of Regal and random thought: have Regal and Taker ever wrestled each other? The two have crossed paths alot because I remember some BOD/ Regal and Tajiri interraction when Regal was commisoner and I remember the cheap heat segment when Regal was denouncing Boston which was interrupted by Taker, but I can't recall the two wrestling. 
Obviously the two are in two completely different card statuses, but you would think the two would have faced if nothing else for a taker tune up match or something hence why I ask. I do opine with the Regal underutilized crowd and honestly for as lauded Regal is in the ring I think he is an underrated character portrayer as well quite honestly and a particularly underrated heel. Certainly not a GOAT heel canidate by any means but I feel the man doesn't get his due.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I wouldn't call it a carryjob, but Sheamus sacrificed himself to make the WWE Money in the Bank match really good. That's what my rep comment was getting at, but it's only expected of him to do something like that. Now let's hope he continues to dominate the midcard (and only the midcard) in 2014.

Why we never got a lengthy Regal/Taker match is beyond me. Tuneup matches I guess were not as big and great as they became later for Taker.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Sheamus was insane in that match. But, honestly, I still don't remember it being anything special. That's why I could use a rewatch. Only saw it once the night of, after all.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Christian was so bad in that match. Broke my cold heart.

Christian/Sandow from Main Event went DOWN. Like, really down. Not a very good match. Definitely not listworthy.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Benoit/Finlay from JD 06 is great. 20 minutes of two men beating the hell out of each other. What is not to like? ****1/4

Time to watch Ziggler/Del Rio at Payback for the first time :mark:


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Only thing to dislike about Benoit/Finlay was that horrible crowd.

Watched two Goldust/Michaels matches just now. Their RAW 9/6/96 match for the title is a very good RAW main event. Certainly worth a watch. Their ladder match was fun too.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

The crowd wasn't terrible, it certainly wasn't good but it's not the worst crowd I ever seen. I put it down to the crowd just 'not getting' the match.

Ziggler and Del Rio at Payback was good. They really could of made Ziggler a super over face and had him as one of the main faces of the company. Just makes me sad to see what direction he is in now.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

It's almost time to start my yearly tradition of hoping for a Kurt Angle return to the Rumble (IT'S IN PITTSBURGH COME ON). :kurt

Time to watch Benoit and Jericho vs. HHH and Austin


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Is there a match link to Cena/Rollins plz?


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Is there a match link to Cena/Rollins plz?






Match starts at about 52:20.


Benoit/Jericho vs. HHH/Austin is still great, but :lol at Hebner being so fucking useless. How did Benoit and Jericho switch being legal men (twice I might add :jericho2) near the end without tagging? Ah well.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

Great way for Cena to put over Rollins... Rollins dominates about 90% of the match, pulls off some incredible moves, counters many of Cena's signature moves, resists the stf.. And he only lost after all hell broke loose with everyone on the outside causing a bit of a distraction. Very good match, it was mostly a showcase for Seth's talent.

I think I still enjoyed Bryan/Seth more for best Seth single's match this year tough.

P.S: how fuck how stront is Mark henry how he tossed Reigns into Ambrose 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

PGSucks said:


> Match starts at about 52:20.


Thankyou 

Uploaded to my DM account:

*John Cena vs. The Undertaker (Smackdown 06.24.04)*


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

People talk about listworthy true gems of 2013, but few mention this one:


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Really hope the Bryan/Rollins match from Raw makes the best of Raw & Smackdown. Excited to see the match listing for that set. It COULD be great if the E doesn't fuck it up. 



King Cal said:


> Ahh, 08 during Punk's title reign. I remember bugger all of that lol. Punk beat Edge on Raw by cashing in and then... got punted by Orton and had the title taken away from him. And that is all I remember :lmao.


I wish we would have got a proper Punk/Edge feud. Did they ever have any matches? If so links? 



xdoomsayerx said:


> Cena/Rollins was fucking AWESOME.
> 
> ***3/4


Agreed. Loved it.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> And Orton's promo was good too.


He cracked me up when he said that line about winning the Rumble and watching WM from the skybox. :lol



funnyfaces1 said:


> Only thing to dislike about Benoit/Finlay was that horrible crowd.


Thought they were fine. They cheered the face and booed the hell. Amazing that Finlay would get "Finlay sucks" chants just by wrestling in his own unique style.



PGSucks said:


> xF4XTQJDq6M
> Match starts at about 52:20.


I like it when Orton brings back those retro trunks, always takes me back to when he was really fucking great as opposed to just good-very good. rton2



ATF said:


> People talk about listworthy true gems of 2013, but few mention this one:


One of the few enjoyable matches Useless has had.  Obviously it had to be WORKHORSE SHEAMUS getting it out of him.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Even DM took down my Punk/Eddie video  I can't fucking win.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> One of the few enjoyable matches Useless has had.  Obviously it had to be WORKHORSE SHEAMUS getting it out of him.


For the millionth time, he's NOT useless. You want useless, you look at someone like Miz. Barrett is GOOD. Fucking people :side:

Speaking of Miz, here's another well remembered gem from 2013:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Barrett isn't useless... he is just never useful or good in any way, shape or form .


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

From this week's SD:

Cody/Cesaro- *1/2- too short for me
P.T.P/Rybaxel- *- meh, Titus was fine here
Orton/Ziggler- ***1/4, good match as always from those two. Loved the poke in the eye from the end, again Rany finds the easy way out, just like Cena said.
Bryan/Sandow- **- Bryan squash, still decent enough for a 4 minute match
Henry/Reigns- DUD- this was bad. Good way to put Reigns over, but the match was bad
Cena/Rollins- ***1/2- Rollins was outstanding, and props to Cena putting Seth over.

And also: Cesaro/Regal- ****


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Srdjan99 said:


> From this week's SD:
> 
> Cody/Cesaro- *1/2- too short for me
> P.T.P/Rybaxel- *- meh, Titus was fine here
> ...


 seriously ? I thought it was pretty good, no much more you could do better in 5 mins

Michaels/Goldust raw 96 is great


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

For me it was only a short squash to make Reigns look better and it acomplished that. The match itself was bad for me


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

WWF Championship match from a house show at Madison Square Garden (8/9/96)

*Shawn Michaels vs. Goldust *


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> seriously ? I thought it was pretty good, no much more you could do better in 5 mins
> 
> Michaels/Goldust raw 96 is great


I agree, I thought Reigns vs Henry was damn good for the time it got.

Rollins vs cena though, man, that was GREAT. I'm not sure if it tops the Danielson match, but boy was it close. Those neckbreakers :mark:

About benoit vs finlay at JD....you might think I'm crazy, but I think that match is DAMN close to perfection. Like ****3/4 area, it has now taken the spot from Eddie/Rey SD as my personal favorite match to watch. It really doesn't get any better than that. I feel the same about Regal vs Benoit from No Mercy. Those matches are 1 and 2 respectively for my Match of the Year 2006. I thought the crowd was fine, Finlay being almost unknown to most fans and he still got good heat just because he's such a nasty fucker. That collar and elbow tie up to start was so bad ass.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

Rollins really is the work-horse of The Shield, he can have a good match with almost anyone.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

ATF said:


> For the millionth time, he's NOT useless. You want useless, you look at someone like Miz. Barrett is GOOD. Fucking people :side:


Even Miz has more to offer even if it's just something to laugh at. 

Barrett is just the cure for insomnia. But really, are I and Cal the only ones here who realize this?


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

Reigns/Henry was fun, it was a 5 minute slugfest, it accomplished what it set out to do, make Reigns look like a fucking beast, even more so than he has looked lately.

But i do admit i'm a mark for Reigns 

Cesaro/Regal: ****1/4 - Fucking amazing. You don't see many matches like this anymore in WWE so it was a nice treat. The selling from Regal (knee) was top notch as was Cesaro's regarding his arms. The finish stretch was so beautifully done, the look on Cesaro's face after he nailed the running stomp was storytelling at its finest in the ring. Please can we have a weekly Regal/ANYONE match in NXT? The guy makes whoever he faces look like a champion.

That handshake at the end, goosebumps.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Even Miz has more to offer even if it's just something to laugh at.
> 
> Barrett is just the cure for insomnia. But really, are I and Cal the only ones here who realize this?


This guy, only good match the fucker ever had was vs Bryan at ss 11


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

People are actually saying that Miz is better than Barret? I don't like neither of them, but the Englishman is much more talented than Mizdick in the ring


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Add that to the aforementioned Main Event match vs Sheamus (both of them actually, there are two), HIAC 2010 vs Cena, Cage match and No DQ match vs Bryan, Tables, FCA and No DQ matches vs Orton and post-WM Raw this year vs Miz (yes that was good). It's not that much few after all


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

He's had a few good matches with superior talents out of the 1000 matches he's had with each? Color me surprised! :shocked:

lol @ the Miz match post-WM. That shit was a joke that I couldn't believe was actually happening. Just because the stupid crowd was marking for their fellow countryman doesn't make it good. :lol


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Consider I'm not counting his multi-man matches, which... yeah, he also only had a few good ones too. Particularly Barrett/Miz/Axel and Barrett/Miz/Jericho. That's all I recall atm... Oh, and the Night Of Champions '10 6-Pack Challenge. WHATEVER, BARRETT IS GOOD, FUCK YOU :side:

Yes, that DOES make it good btw. I'm sure many folks here don't care about crowds in their personal ratings, but I do. That was exactly what made it good to watch


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

ATF said:


> Add that to the aforementioned Main Event match vs Sheamus (both of them actually, there are two), HIAC 2010 vs Cena, Cage match and No DQ match vs Bryan, Tables, FCA and No DQ matches vs Orton and post-WM Raw this year vs Miz (yes that was good). It's not that much few after all


:lmao I don't think ANY of those matches are good .

SS Vs Bryan is pretty much the only Barrett match I think it worth watching .

Just watching SD atm. Henry/Reigns was pretty :mark: for the time it got. Onto Cena/Rollins now. :lmao at Rollins almost forgetting to bounce back out of the corner so Cena could attempt the running bulldog .


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I still don't know how that payback match was good :lol

Well the SS 2010 main event was good too, that's it


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah SS 2010 supertag match was great... but I wouldn't attribute it to Barrett. That's like saying The Warlord didn't suck because the 1992 RR is ***** .

Cena/Rollins was good. Don't think I'm as high on it as everyone else. Around ***-***1/4 for it. Bryan/Orton was on another level as far as TV matches lately go (and Regal/Cesaro while we're at it lol).

OMG CENA HIT A SIT OUT POWERBOMB CENA VS BATISTA FOR WM XXX TEASED ZOMG~!


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Triple Threat? It was smart and well-paced for a three-way, it didn't feel like a roundtable 1 vs. 1 with the other on the outside like typical Triple Threats do, the crowd ruled and the ending was creative. Plus, Axel winning the IC Title on Father's Day was a good touch. I wonder if people only hate on that match just because of who's in there, to each his own opinion but I don't know.

Henry/Reigns for a 3 minute slugfest was quite fun and good. Don't get the hate on it.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

ATF said:


> Consider I'm not counting his multi-man matches, which... yeah, he also only had a few good ones too. Particularly Barrett/Miz/Axel and Barrett/Miz/Jericho. That's all I recall atm... *Oh, and the Night Of Champions '10 6-Pack Challenge*. WHATEVER, BARRETT IS GOOD, FUCK YOU :side:


Yeah, because of Randal and King Sheamus! BARRETT IS SHIT, BENOIT/ANGLE RULES. CRANKYVINCE. FUCK YOU.



ATF said:


> The Triple Threat? It was smart and well-paced for a three-way, it didn't feel like a roundtable 1 vs. 1 with the other on the outside like typical Triple Threats do, the crowd ruled and the ending was creative. Plus, Axel winning the IC Title on Father's Day was a good touch. I wonder if people only hate on that match just because of who's in there, to each his own opinion but I don't know.


Admittedly, that was nowhere near as horrible as it *should* have been but as funny as it sounds, I thought MIZ (yeah, lol) carried that match.

:ti


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I never said Barrett carried the 6-Pack Challenge. And the only part where Benoit/Angle rules is how fun it is... and maybe it is good if I enter in a Fast & Furious-like Hollywood flick mentality. Otherwise, it doesn't and it SUCKS. So FUCK YOU, CRANKIERVINCE. :side:

...we're talking about RR 2003, right?  Referring to other of their stuff, WM 17 is very good.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Ugh. Sometimes I feel so alone in my love for Wade. Saddens me how they let Cena drop the chairs on him. 

The cage match with Bryan and Main Event with Sheamus this year were really good. If only he hadn't gotten hurt last year, he may have been world champ by now.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Wade also had a pretty good No DQ match against Bryan on the Smackdown before Summerslam. I thought it was a fun match.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Cal, any chance you can upload Bryan/Orton plz? I don't really wanna DL the whole episode, not even off YT


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> He's had a few good matches with superior talents out of the 1000 matches he's had with each? Color me surprised! :shocked:
> 
> lol @ the Miz match post-WM. That shit was a joke that I couldn't believe was actually happening. Just because the stupid crowd was marking for their fellow countryman doesn't make it good. :lol


Am I insane or was that RAW _not_ in New Jersey?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

It was NJ. East Rutherford's Izod Center. Though technically the crowd wasn't just NJ, it was people from all over the world leftover from WrestleMania.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

:ti

b/c a large fraction were from England thus cheering for Wade as the only reason. How does one make something up _that_ comical?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I liked that Barrett match where he pinned Orton clean :rko2


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The only Orton/Barrett match I enjoyed (a nightmare I don't wanna relive) was the No DQ from February last year. 



The Primer said:


> Am I insane or was that RAW _not_ in New Jersey?


The crowd were mostly Brits.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Tables match from TLC. Rest can burn.

Topic here now is how I'm gobsmacked that Cal doesn't like Sheamus vs Barrett from Main Event. Like, wtf bro. It's clubbering for 13 minutes. YOU EAT THAT STUFF UP.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Nobody liked the Orton/Barrett Tables match?

EDIT: Cody does. Thank God I'm not alone. Btw, breaking news: apparently Matt Hardy wants to comeback to the WWE. Not sure what to think of that other than "He's nuts".


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

ATF said:


> Nobody liked the Orton/Barrett Tables match?
> 
> EDIT: Cody does. Thank God I'm not alone. Btw, breaking news: apparently Matt Hardy wants to comeback to the WWE. Not sure what to think of that other than "He's nuts".


I'd take Matt back in a heartbeat, tbh.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Matt Hardy to come back and take Adam Cole w/him.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

ADAM COLE :mark:. And then let's hope Brian Cage returns too. And then Willie Mack. Then Uhaa Nation. All those folks have the main event look and the main event talent.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Cal, any chance you can upload Bryan/Orton plz? I don't really wanna DL the whole episode, not even off YT


If I had it I would, but I don't, so sorry .



The Primer said:


> Tables match from TLC. Rest can burn.
> 
> Topic here now is how I'm gobsmacked that Cal doesn't like Sheamus vs Barrett from Main Event. Like, wtf bro. It's clubbering for 13 minutes. YOU EAT THAT STUFF UP.


TBH I probably haven't even seen it. Undertaker is legit the only guy who could face Barrett that would actually make me want to watch a Barrett match.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Does the WWE even want him back? I thought they wanted to stay as far from him as possible. And even if it would be good, at this stage I'm not even sure Matt can have the kind of matches he used to.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Primer said:


> :ti
> 
> b/c a large fraction were from England thus cheering for Wade as the only reason. How does one make something up _that_ comical?


I have absolutely no idea what you said but nonetheless, this post made me laugh. Specially that final sentence. :lol



King Cal said:


> TBH I probably haven't even seen it. Undertaker is legit the only guy who could face Barrett that would actually make me want to watch a Barrett match.


Take it from me, SHEAMUS can get good matches out of even Barrett.



ATF said:


> Does the WWE even want him back? I thought they wanted to stay as far from him as possible. And even if it would be good, at this stage I'm not even sure Matt can have the kind of matches he used to.


I heard he's cleaned himself up, so no reason he shouldn't get a chance. The reason they distanced themselves from him was because he kept on getting DUIs and looked like he had completely lost it.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

King Cal said:


> If I had it I would, but I don't, so sorry .


Damn and blast


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> ADAM COLE :mark:. And then let's hope Brian Cage returns too. And then Willie Mack. Then *Uhaa Nation*. All those folks have the main event look and the main event talent.


LOL no.

Willie Mack is a no either. But he's had his good nights.



King Cal said:


> TBH I probably haven't even seen it. Undertaker is legit the only guy who could face Barrett that would actually make me want to watch a Barrett match.


Deadman aside, I swear this is basically the match(_es - b/c they are two)_ that were made to make you actually give a shit to see Barrett. Only throwing it out there.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

*Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan - Hell in a Cell match - WWE Championship - WWE Hell in a Cell 2013: ****

Shawn Michaels is the special referee for this match. The match starts out with Bryan and Orton slugging it out and soon escalates outside of the ring. Orton uses the Cell to his advantage by throwing Bryan onto the Cell and shoves his face into it. Orton showcases his aggression by shoving Bryan into the steel steps. Bryan then goes on a little comeback of his own by doing two suicide dives to the outside, pushing Orton onto the Cell, but he is stopped when he tries to go for the third one and Orton side steps to use Bryan's own momentum to push him towards the Cell. Orton goes on the offensive but Bryan comes back and showcases an aggression of his own from ramming Orton's face onto the Cell, doing a running dropkick on Orton onto the Cell, and hits him with the steel chair. Bryan then throws a lot of chairs into the ring. Bryan tries to go for another steel chair shot but Orton stops him and gives Bryan steel chair shots of his own. Every time Orton would hit Bryan with the steel chair, he would go for the pin but Bryan would kick out, showcasing Bryan's resiliency. Orton would execute a superplex onto the pile of steel chairs, but Bryan would still kick out. Triple H comes out, telling Shawn that there was a 3 count and Shawn would argue with both Triple H and Orton. Shawn would then take a ref bump and Triple H goes in to check on him. Bryan takes the opportunity to execute his running knee on Hunter, but then takes Sweet Chin Music from Shawn which would cause Orton to pick up the victory. Overall, the match is decent and I liked how they used the Cell as a weapon, but again, it felt really lackluster imo.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Damn and blast


If you have an XWT account, you can DL it from this pack: http://xtremewrestlingtorrents.net/details.php?id=112330


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Looking upon some 2013 gems, and found one more involving *THE SHIELD*:


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

The Shield's match against Team Hell No and The Undertaker has got to be my favorite TV match of the year. Just great stuff from all guys involved.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I didn't forget about that one. You know which Shield match is the lost match? Danielson & Rhodes Dynasty vs Shield on the Smackdown following the No DQ Battleground rematch. And it's one of their finest matches too. Insane blitzkrieg.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yeah, I like that one much better than the first Rhodes & Bryan/Shield match on Raw the night after BG. Don't get me wrong, that was a good match too, but a letdown considering the talent. The rematch was far superior imo.

Rewatched the surprisingly pretty good Show/Ryback match, and it still holds up. God bless that Paul Wight.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> If you have an XWT account, you can DL it from this pack: http://xtremewrestlingtorrents.net/details.php?id=112330


Can't do torrents unfortunatly mate 

Ill see if i can be bothered to grab Raw off YT if its still up....


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Can't do torrents unfortunatly mate
> 
> Ill see if i can be bothered to grab Raw off YT if its still up....


DLed it myself. Uploading to DM right now. If you use a DM downloader, you can get it that way. Will post the link once done. Hope they don't reject it.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> DLed it myself. Uploading to DM right now. If you use a DM downloader, you can get it that way.


Very kind of you sir, thankyou :mark:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Oh, forgot about mentioning another hidden gem of the Shield: Shield/Tons Of Funk, the night we had the Wyatts debut and that excellent Bryan/Sheamus match. I legit thought at a point they were going to lose in that one. An awesome gem.


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

Got a 2013 NXT pack downloading as i type :mark:

& Smackdown, not as excited for that but still, should be fun.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

after reading the last few pgs in this thread

1) Barrett sucks

2) cena/rollins was very good, need to rewatch had it in the ***3/4-4 although it suffered abit from the commerical break

3) who the fuck is adam cole

4) that raw was in NJ

5) I LOVE sloberfest greatly but still dont have any interest in watching wade/sheamus me


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Very kind of you sir, thankyou :mark:







DM kept giving me this error so I resorted to YT. Here you go, Mr. Zeppelin! 

Tell me when you've finished downloading it so I can take it off since I don't want another account to receive a strike from those bastards. :side:

Also just found out that you can use formatting tags so that the YT vids cover the whole screen instead of the sides being black. Now I can use youtube just like windows media classic by stretching the video to full screen. :mark:


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

SKINS25 said:


> after reading the last few pgs in this thread
> 
> 1) Barrett sucks
> 
> ...


Current king of the indies, basically. Only 24 years old and only started breaking out in the past two years, really. Movie star good looks, good in the ring, charisma for days. The majority of people who follow indy wrestling, even if it's just the top indy promotions like ROH and/or PWG, know that he's 110% made for the WWE. It's just a matter of when, not if. Reason he was brought up is because the subject of Matt Hardy was brought up and he's currently involved in an angle with Hardy in ROH.

Did I mention he's also very good looking?

unk3

Edit: He's the second guy in from the left in my sig, in case you're wondering what he looks like.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

HHH vs. Taker at WM 27 is fucking amazing, and the best thing I've seen HHH do thus far.

Jack Evans 187, you are so right that it seemed like a 30 minute long movie scene. For me that's a good thing, because I love matches that have a cinematic quality to them. This was one of the best in that regard, because it wasn't showy. It all felt like one, great, artful, piece.

It's funny, because after the first 1/3rd, I was like "ugh, it really _is_ just the two of them laying around." I counted a literally eight minute segment when Triple H was just laying on the outside, with only two things happening during that eight minutes. Absurd. Then suddenly it became the best thing ever, and my favorite streak match behind WM26, of what I've seen.

The finishers didn't feel excessive at all. Triple H trying desperately to keep Taker down with three pedigrees, each growing more and more vicious (one looked like he dropped him right on his head and neck...looked magnificent), and then the chair shots, and then them both living their roles so perfectly in the aftermath of all of that...bravo. 

Can't say enough good things about this match, or about both men's performances. 

**** 1/2, and if they didn't waste so much time in the beginning it'd be in the **** 3/4 - *****. I enjoyed it in the latter range, really.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yeah, I like the HIAC better personally.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Jack Evans 187 stopped posting here unk3

What's so bad about Willie and Uhaa? We need some more black beauty in wrestling :henry1 :kobe3

*King of the Ring 1998*

Mosh/Thrasher/TAKA vs. Kaientai: ***3/4*
Ken Shamrock vs. Jeff Jarrett: ***
The Rock vs. Dan Severn: ***1/2*
Too Much vs. Al Snow/Head: ***1/2*
X-Pac vs. Owen Hart: ****
New Age Outlaws vs. New Midnight Express: *DUD*
Ken Shamrock vs. The Rock: ***1/2*
Undertaker vs. Mankind: *****1/2*
Steve Austin vs. Kane: ***1/4*

Austin/Kane the next night is a near DUD.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

Can anyone recommend me 10 matches that you guys have seen recently?

I'm bored and am in a match-watching mood for some reason.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Cena vs. Rollins - ***1/2. Awesome showcase for Rollins.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

I will never understand why Kane won the belt and dropped it the VERY NEXT NIGHT to the same guy he lost it to. I have heard :austin didn't want to job to :jpl at Summerslam 1999 which is why Foley won the title and lost it to Trips the next night but damn this made no sense to me. 

Anyone else wanna see







turn heel by Mania and win the title sometime in 2014? (Y)

I'm not as big of an indie geek as I use to be but I do like what I have seen of Adam Cole. He is pretty small which isn't a problem for me but we all know who likes the big muscley guys. :vince5 

Where is Jack Evans? Come back dude! :vince7

I really like :taker :hhh2 at Mania 27. I enjoyed 28 as well but prefer 27. The main event was God awful but WM 27 had a few good matches. Cody/Rey and Punk/Orton and Edge/ADR were good as well. If given some time I think Bryan/Sheamus could have been fun as well. 

Outside of :taker unk4 and :brock :jpl I think WM 29 was awful.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

What did you guys think of Cena vs. Triple H vs. HBK from Survivor Series 09? Gonna check it out now, I watched but I watched casually at the time.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I was drunk when I last watched the SS 09 three way and all I can remember is flipping my fucking shit at the first SCM.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Punked Up said:


> What did you guys think of Cena vs. Triple H vs. HBK from Survivor Series 09? Gonna check it out now, I watched but I watched casually at the time.


It's good, and tons of fun. I used to have it at ****1/4 but went down to about ***1/2 on last watch a while back. Still good so yeah, worth checking out for sure .


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

Finally watched Jericho/Punk from Payback. Haven't seen it since the actual PPV.

Still a really good match. That Walls of Jericho into the Anaconda Vice was fucking magical. :datass Gave me Benoit/Angle vibes for some reason.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Eulonzo said:


> Finally watched Jericho/Punk from Payback. Haven't seen it since the actual PPV.
> 
> Still a really good match. That Walls of Jericho into the Anaconda Vice was fucking magical. :datass Gave me Benoit/Angle vibes for some reason.


If you're into Jericho-Punk check out Extreme Rules 2012 again, Chicago Street Fight. ****1/2 and way better than their Wrestlemania one. :clap


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

PB match sucks arse. Also kinda reminds me of Benoit/Angle too in that sense 8*D.

WM >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ER >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PB


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

:cena :jpl :hbk2 is good. 

unk6 :jericho at Mania is one of my favorite title matches at Mania ever and their ER match is very good as well. 

I have actually not seen there Payback match yet.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

PB match is to me what Austin/Taker Backlash 02 is to Cal. I love it with all my heart, but I don't expect others to do so, and for good reason.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I did read that Punk said to Rock "Follow that" 

Of course he couldn't


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

You can watch him actually say it on his DVD, well, the Bluray. On the extras on disc 2 .


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

Yeah he did, in a joke kind of way. Its shown on Punk's dvd. Rock went up to Punk and congratulated him on his match backstage, before sharing a hug.

Edit: Cal beat me. BASTARD.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Couldn't be anything other than a joke anyway . Rock wasn't able to follow much from WM... .


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Rollins/Cena was sweet Henry/Reigns was disappointing as some people said too


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Huh. I don't remember Punk/Jericho being that good at Wrestlemania. Better watch again


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I need something to watch


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

@skins,

HEROES
OF
WRESTLING
*1999*


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

Wrestlemania match was awesome, ER was fun enough if not a little disorganised and the Payback was shit other than the 2 GTS's and DAT PUNK POP

I forgot the heat Bo Dallas got when he was a face at the start of 2013 :ti

Everyone d'load the 2013 NXT pack, there's a Superstars one too, but i seriously doubt it's worth it this year.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

SKINS25 said:


> I need something to watch


Join me on KOTR 98 8*D


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Superstars in 2013 pack? Why would anyone watch that?

Except for everyone who isn't insane as myself. It hasn't been worth it unless Cesaro or Ziggler showed up.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

ATF said:


> @skins,
> 
> HEROES
> OF
> ...





William Murderface said:


> Join me on KOTR 98 8*D


:deandre


that ziggler/cesaro superstar match from augest was great


#NW ziggler/sheamus nwo 12


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Just discovered this program that extracts specific parts from videos. Now I'm gonna upload Brock/Angle full 60 minute match (from HTCP DVD) on youtube once it's done! 



Clint Eastwood said:


> I did read that Punk said to Rock "Follow that"
> 
> Of course he couldn't


He did in an arguably better match. 

In case you missed it, I fulfilled your request at page 789. (Y)


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

funnyfaces1 said:


> What's so bad about Willie and Uhaa? We need some more black beauty in wrestling :henry1 :kobe3
> 
> *King of the Ring 1998*
> 
> ...


Nation sucks & Willie Mack isn't too special, but has his good moments. Seems like a nice guy when I briefly met him.

Not enough DUDs seen for that show, tbhayley. Al Snow's match. I love that man, but fuckin christ. Horseshit. Rock vs Severn :ti


----------



## KingLobos (Apr 10, 2013)

Rock vs Severn you actually rated higher than a dud? Nothing happened during that match. One of the worst matches of the year.

Rock vs Shamrock however I gave ***1/2. Crowd was hot, and got a lot of time to do their thing after their short matches previously. Pretty neat ending too. Big match feel, and loved the Triple H interactions when he spat in the Rock's face.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I got tired of giving out DUDs I guess. The prior PPV took them all away from me. Rock/Severn was somehow entertaining all because of The Rock. Dude was GOATing it out there. Shame that the Rock/Shamrock match became the prototype of the standard Kofi Kingston match. Al Snow & Head vs. Too Much was also too hilarious for me not to like. And then that main event...

God bless Mr. Maivia. Once again, he's carrying the DX/Nation feud.

Man what happened to Warrior/Rude at Wrestlemania V? Their two Summerslam matches were so good, but this match was a disaster. I hope their other matches aren't as bad as this.

EDIT: On second thought, I just did a quick rewatch of Severn/Rock and I don't know what I was thinking. One star.


----------



## KingLobos (Apr 10, 2013)

The best thing about Dan Severn in 98 is when he kayfabe broke his neck by Owen Hart

And his theme song is GOAT


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Rock is no different than the rest of the shit 1998 brought. He's just lucky all the punches vs Shamrock worked at Royal Rumble. He'd find greater luck when the company decides to have Mick Foley make him look worth a damn.

Foley does that a lot.

this post is about Foley btw and no one else. We're not starting this bullshit again.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Believe it or not, I was once a Rock mark back in late 98 when I first started watching. Shows how important charisma is. But since this is about Foley, let us talk about how good Cactus Jack vs. Vader in Germany is. Let's also talk about how fun Mabel/Viscera/Big Daddy V can be when he's in the right situation.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

*runs around the house chanting FOLEY! FOLEY! FOLEY! FOLEY!*

I'm sorry, what were we talking about? Oh yeah... FOLEY! FOLEY! FOLEY!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

FOLEY AKA GOD.

Dude can do wonders as a worker. On the mic, as a bumping machine to make the opponents look insanely stellar, look like the wildest man to take down everyone, & all other goodies you can think of. Bless him. Bless him so much that can't be expressed in this post alone.

Viscera is choice. I'm a fan.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

*Dolph Ziggler vs Sheamus No Way Out 12 *** 3/4*

- I really liked this one this time around.Loved the bryan/sheamus mania call back in the begin w/ ziggles and vickie. Oh look "WE WANT ZIGGLER" chants in Izod Center, the man owns that building. Anyways Sheamus carries Ziggler for the first 10 mins as ziggles was pretty bad and then ziggler turns it on himself which benefits the match greatly.I like the clash of styles here. Sheamus brawling like only he can while Ziggler puts on a great "scrappy" performance as he is always trying to get around sheamus and jump on his back to put him in a sleeper. The Brogue Kick ZIggler takes are :lenny


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

Punked Up said:


> If you're into Jericho-Punk check out Extreme Rules 2012 again, Chicago Street Fight. ****1/2 and way better than their Wrestlemania one. :clap


Considering I'm a Jericho Mark and I'm a big Punk fan, I've already seen it a lot of times. :side:

But yeah, I don't have a favorite Jericho/Punk match. Although I enjoyed their WM 28 match hell of a lot more than many other people did. Don't know why people some people dislike it.


King Cal said:


> PB match sucks arse. Also kinda reminds me of Benoit/Angle too in that sense 8*D.


:no:


SKINS25 said:


> *Dolph Ziggler vs Sheamus No Way Out 12 *** 3/4*
> 
> - I really liked this one this time around.Loved the bryan/sheamus mania call back in the begin w/ ziggles and vickie. Oh look "WE WANT ZIGGLER" chants in Izod Center, the man owns that building. Anyways Sheamus carries Ziggler for the first 10 mins as ziggles was pretty bad and then ziggler turns it on himself which benefits the match greatly.I like the clash of styles here. Sheamus brawling like only he can while Ziggler puts on a great "scrappy" performance as he is always trying to get around sheamus and jump on his back to put him in a sleeper. The Brogue Kick ZIggler takes are :lenny


Agreed. Always liked when Ziggler/Sheamus faced each other.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

I love both Punk and Jericho, but while their matches were decent, they've always fell short of my expectations. For instance, their Payback match was a bit too slow for my liking, and really lacked good, coherent psychology. Their match at ER was perhaps my favorite, and their match on Raw was fine, WM was OK, as well, but with two in ring workers who usually deliver, I'd expect much more of them. In my opinion, it may be a lack of good in ring chemistry with one another.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Jericho/Punk at PB was shit. Love the WM match, though.

And on the subject of Foley, just rewatched Orton vs RVD from Armageddon which he guest referees. Fun match even though I think I like the rematch from Raw more.


----------



## KingLobos (Apr 10, 2013)

Speaking of Punk AKA GOD.

What a guy, the true GOAT.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

KingLobos said:


> Speaking of Punk AKA GOD.
> 
> What a guy, the true GOAT.


Aren't you happy that our great city is represented by men like him and Derrick Rose?


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

RhodesForWHC said:


> I love both Punk and Jericho, but while their matches were decent, they've always fell short of my expectations. For instance, their Payback match was a bit too slow for my liking, and really lacked good, coherent psychology. Their match at ER was perhaps my favorite, and their match on Raw was fine, WM was OK, as well, but with two in ring workers who usually deliver, I'd expect much more of them. In my opinion, it may be a lack of good in ring chemistry with one another.


Kind of agree with this. I think all three matches were great, but did expect a little more from the WM and Payback ones. They were both a bit slow as well. I remember the ER match being really good however. I was satisfied with that one.

I have a WM 15 review that I wrote ages ago that I should post. Though I'm going to cut it down. I got way into the habit of recapping these matches too much. I used to just write a few sentences of thoughts about each match, I don't know why that changed.

I also watched Taker vs HBK from Mania 25 last night. I won't say much about the match because everything has been said. This was my second viewing, I saw it for the first time last year or the year before and it may have been a little over hyped for me so I didn't enjoy it as much as I could have. Much better this time around though and even though I knew what was going to happen it had my heart racing for most of the major spots and nearfalls. I guess that's a testament to how good it is.

Many people say it is THE greatest match of all time. I don't know if I could say that, but it is definitely ONE OF the greatest of all time. Mostly because I just can't compare high quality matches such as this and put one over another.

Will watch the WM 26 match soon which I still haven't seen. Actually I still haven't seen the entire event. I might do that today.


----------



## KingLobos (Apr 10, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Aren't you happy that our great city is represented by men like him and Derrick Rose?


Don't forget Obama and Oprah


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

Just watched "Dolph Ziggler vs. Kofi Kingston" from Tribute to the Troops Show.

Not too bad. You'd think it'd be a generic 5-8 minute match but it was actually pretty enjoyable. Really liked the back & forth counters + where Ziggler countered the fucking backflip in basically mid-air.. :mark: Sick. But I'm not that surprised Ziggler lost, he was basically playing the heel in the match - at least presumably, plus it didn't feel like a Face vs. Face match, it felt like Dolph was the heel lol.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

I feel like Ziggler VS Kofi match-ups are underrated, in general. Sure, the match may have been over done over the past few years, but I've always enjoyed them, the two mesh quite decently in the ring, and the sequences included are usually very "fun", if you will. Especially with Kofi's high-flying style and Ziggler's similar somewhat high-flying, but more of a hybrid style.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

KingLobos said:


> Speaking of Punk AKA GOD.
> 
> What a guy, the true GOAT.


(Y)

_"I AM THE DEVIL HIMSELF"_ - following winning the ROH Championship.



RhodesForWHC said:


> I feel like Ziggler VS Kofi match-ups are underrated, in general. Sure, the match may have been over done over the past few years, but I've always enjoyed them, the two mesh quite decently in the ring, and the sequences included are usually very "fun", if you will. Especially with Kofi's high-flying style and Ziggler's similar somewhat high-flying, but more of a hybrid style.


Is this where this thread is going? 8*D


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Even DM took down my Punk/Eddie video  I can't fucking win.


Good thing I downloaded it then :mark:


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

CM GOAT


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

The Primer said:


> (Y)
> 
> _"I AM THE DEVIL HIMSELF"_ - following winning the ROH Championship.


Ah, yes the "I AM THE DEVIL HIMSELF! And all of you stupid, mindless people fell for it!" promo. Brilliant work by Punk. I've rewatched that a few times, I consider it to be some of his top mic work. In fact, his promos in ROH were just fucking great. The promo he cut when he signed with the WWE was also very good.


----------



## HiddenViolence (Jan 15, 2011)

Anybody else think Luke Harper is really good in the ring? He's easily the best of the three of the Wyatt family members when it comes to ring performance. He has quite a deep move-set and his moves look impactful. Plus he has a good sense of storytelling when it comes to his character.


----------



## Oliver-94 (Jan 10, 2012)

RhodesForWHC said:


> Ah, yes the "I AM THE DEVIL HIMSELF! And all of you stupid, mindless people fell for it!" promo. Brilliant work by Punk. I've rewatched that a few times, I consider it to be some of his top mic work. In fact, his promos in ROH were just fucking great. The promo he cut when he signed with the WWE was also very good.


 he cut a similar promo to that last year. When he was talking the HIAC poster showing Punk as the devil. The "I am god!" Promo was better though (not the ROH promo).


----------



## KingLobos (Apr 10, 2013)

speaking of devil's and god's.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

*In Your House 23: Fully Loaded*

Val Venis vs. Jeff Jarrett: ****
D'Lo Brown vs. X-Pac: ****
Farooq/Scorpio vs. Funk/Bradshaw: *DUD*
Vader vs. Mark Henry: ***3/4*
DOA vs. LOD 2000: *DUD*
Owen Hart vs. Ken Shamrock: ***3/4*
The Rock vs. HHH: ***
Sable vs. Jacqueline: *DUD*
Mankind/Kane vs. Undertaker/Austin: ***

Find me a PPV worse than this one guys.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

Oddball said:


> Anybody else think Luke Harper is really good in the ring? He's easily the best of the three of the Wyatt family members when it comes to ring performance. He has quite a deep move-set and his moves look impactful. Plus he has a good sense of storytelling when it comes to his character.


Quite a few people here think the same, including me.

He's great.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

RhodesForWHC said:


> Ah, yes the "I AM THE DEVIL HIMSELF! And all of you stupid, mindless people fell for it!" promo. Brilliant work by Punk. I've rewatched that a few times, I consider it to be some of his top mic work. In fact, his promos in ROH were just fucking great. The promo he cut when he signed with the WWE was also very good.


He's the reason why I wanted to branch off into Indie wrestling. More than I already did, so to speak, but I saw him and fell in love. Yes, love. I'm quite passionate.

Sign of Dishonor promo where he signs the contract on the ROH World Championship is boss. Then Mick Foley shows up later that night. omg. Magic. Punk, ROH, all of it was unfuckwithable at that time.



Oddball said:


> Anybody else think Luke Harper is really good in the ring? He's easily the best of the three of the Wyatt family members when it comes to ring performance. He has quite a deep move-set and his moves look impactful. Plus he has a good sense of storytelling when it comes to his character.


He's one of my favorites in wrestling. Been that way for years now. He's a star.



funnyfaces1 said:


> *In Your House 23: Fully Loaded*
> 
> Val Venis vs. Jeff Jarrett: ****
> D'Lo Brown vs. X-Pac: ****
> ...


I'd still say Over the Edge '98 is a bigger offender despite Austin vs Dude. Too much is WAY too bad. But if you mean not in the realm of only WWF/WWE, lol. Starrcade 1999? Have you not seen TNA Sacrifice 2011 or the epic Against All Odds 2010? They win. Especially when I know I like the main event on Fully Loaded + a bikini contest entertains me more than both those PPVs combined. (that's sad too. Wrestling PPV should be > b/c of wrestling, not dames being naked in the middle of a ring) iirc I'm a fan of D-Lo vs X-Pac too. It's been a while, however.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Attitude Era :ti


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

At least it had great crowd reactions. And Ministry Undertaker.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

And Mark Henry. Henry was good even before his OVW stint. Or maybe I'm just too big of a Henry mark. But there is no such thing as that.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

BIG MIZARK


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

nah you guys can have it

NEW GEN !

new gen/nitro/wcw 92-94/ RA >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> AE


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

WCW in the late 80's - early 90's is in a class by itself, tbf.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

didnt even want to go that route tbhayley could still be going on my list of things better than AE


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Even WWE 2011?

Ok, that's not fair. Punk was around & Drew McIntyre was on Superstars.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

RA is GOAT. AE comes after that just for the crowds, ROCK and AUSTIN's awesome mic work and 2000-2001's ring work. Haven't seen WCW's best years but I assume they are somewhere around 2-4.

Watched a few random matches:

Orton vs RVD (23.9.2013) - Good while it lasted but I feel they tried too hard to bring back 'sadistic' Orton after the double countout. Way too over the top to be believable here. Prefer it when he's just being a cocky SOB like in the recent Bryan match.

Benoit vs RVD (SummerSlam) - I LOOOOOOOVE this as much as before. Just 15 or so minutes of non-stop great action.

Benoit vs Batista (23.2.2004) - Fun TV match, maybe I should add this along with the pre-match segment to my requests for CAL.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Mark Henry had more good matches in 2011 than WWF probably did in the entirety of 1999. 

I have no idea why the wrestling was so worthless at that point. Not like they had a horrible roster. I mean yeah the Headbangers and shit shouldn't have been anywhere on the card, but Austin, the Rock, Foley, Taker, Waltman, Al Snow, Bossman, the Big Show....there's enough guys there to have consistently good matches. I might have a do WWF 1999 list one day to see how little good there really was.



EDIT- 'Ruthless Aggression' is kind of starting to get massively overrated.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Dont even go there brother, I though everyone knew I view wwe 2011 w/ red roses ( that the expressions right ? whatevs)


need a good WCW match too watch, preferably post 90 not really in the most for "old school hour long flair" matches


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah1993 said:


> Mark Henry had more good matches in 2011 than WWF probably did in the entirety of 1999.
> 
> I have no idea why the wrestling was so worthless at that point. Not like they had a horrible roster. I mean yeah the Headbangers and shit shouldn't have been anywhere on the card, but Austin, the Rock, Foley, Taker, Waltman, Al Snow, Bossman, the Big Show....there's enough guys there to have consistently good matches. I might have a do WWF 1999 list one day to see how little good there really was.


You say it as if you're still trying to convince others that Mizark is good.  I think we all know that already.

EDIT: Ruthless Aggression can never be overrated until WWE gives it its due. They already started by acknowledging the name for WWE 2k14, now it's time for that DVD!



SKINS25 said:


> Dont even go there brother, I though everyone knew I view wwe 2011 w/ red roses ( that the expressions right ? whatevs)


Rose tinted glasses I think.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Choke2Death said:


> You say it as if you're still trying to convince others that Mizark is good.  I think we all know that already.


haha nah Cody said(/asked?) whether or not WWE 2011 was better than some Attitude years. He kind of answered himself, but he left out Mark Henry and I obviously find that void something that has to be filled.

Speaking of Henry, the match with Reigns was OK. Wasn't the beef match it should have been, though. I guess Reigns can't look AS beefy next to someone beefier, thus it was more about Reigns having to summoun strength or something than about a Haku/Gant club fest. I actually really want to see Reigns as a babyface in peril.


When are doing Cesaro v. Goldust? Hurry tha fuck up.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Henry too. Simply slight in my moment of covering my own tracks after asking.

Goldust vs Swagger happened. Goldust vs Cesaro has to be right around the corner. Please.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Was swagger/goldust any good ?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Still need to watch it. That's what happens when WWE puts it only on their website. I fall behind. All the blame is now on them.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

It aired on Xmas day lol who saw that ?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I believe I was watching Puro on Christmas and forgot. A tiny bit ashamed, but it's still WWE's fault.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I actually watched Brock/HHH Cage x-mas night


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That's a great match. I'm actually pro-Brock being in danger b/c he sold me on it so, so well.


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> *In Your House 23: Fully Loaded*
> 
> Val Venis vs. Jeff Jarrett: ****
> D'Lo Brown vs. X-Pac: ****
> ...


My ratings for that show were

Val Venis vs. Jeff Jarrett: *****
D'Lo Brown vs. X-Pac: **1/2*
Farooq/Scorpio vs. Funk/Bradshaw: ****
Vader vs. Mark Henry: *1/2*
DOA vs. LOD 2000: *No stars*
Owen Hart vs. Ken Shamrock: ***1/2*
The Rock vs. HHH: ***1/2*
Sable vs. Jacqueline: ****
Mankind/Kane vs. Undertaker/Austin: ****1/2*
Overall: *4/10*

Funny how we were opposite on Vader/Henry and Rock/HHH. I remember the former being garbage after the first minute. The latter match was boring to start with but got kinda fun when the interference started, and there was a hell of a lot of that.

In my opinion, Break Down later that year was a little worse. Which had a fun triple threat cage match. Also has the main event of SCSA/Taker/Kane, sounds great on paper, turned out to be dull as fuck and went 10 minutes too long. 

A lot of PPVs from 1998 sucked to be honest. 

Also are you watching the RAW episodes as well or are you just doing PPVs? There were a bunch of good RAWs that year. I've been doing a WWF attitude era run starting from 1996 for a while. I'm in 1999 now. It can be fun and there's some good stuff. Weird how the actual wrestling is mostly crap though. One of the extremely few wrestlers to provide consistent good matches worth a damn has been Mick Foley, the one who 'couldn't wrestle', amazing.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm anti-WWE cage matches. Why don't most of them make any goddamn sense? That stipulation brings the worst out of wrestlers. Gonna go wash off my memories of HHH/Lesnar with Blanchard/TA or Idol/Lawler for the millionth time. Maybe Punk/Hardy for the billionth.

I'm watching the RAWs as well. Gonna hope to go all the way through 2002 and then rewatch 2005 as a promise to C2D. I love watching tubbies fight so Henry/Vader was alright with me even if it was too short. Rock/HHH felt like a 30 minute version of Bret/HBK Ironman Match. We can all agree that LOD/DOA is a godawful feud right? RAW is kinda hit or miss. There are some episodes that are really fun and easy to watch, and then there are some that are even worse than the bad today. I can't believe how poorly DX holds up too. They are not that funny.

I remember liking that triple threat cage match from Breakdown and nothing else. Ok maybe Owen/Edge if that happened. Judgment Day was awful too. And Survivor Series. And Rock Bottom. And really everything except Summerslam, which is a candidate for most overrated PPV ever.

Fuck anyone that thinks Foley can't wrestle. Guy is a GOAT candidate.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I need to find my thoughts on Lesnar vs that other guy who did nothing steel cage match and why I loved it. Brock & Heyman made that match for me.

At least you made up w/Punk vs Hardy being listed.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Don't get me wrong. I actually liked that match, but it was entirely because of the Brocktagon and the greatest manager ever. It's just that I felt that one of the greatest selljobs I have seen in a long time was "wasted" on that.

That MonsoonClassic guy on Youtube is a saint. He just uploaded a bunch of WCW Mysterio matches from Worldwide.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

That's not too surprising to me though. They HAD to get those matches w/Triple H in. Bah. At least Brock made it end swell. We still got vs Punker not long after. I'm happy.

Radical. 99% sure I saw Liger vs Silver King from Worldwide or WCW Pro put up on youtube too. That's the tits. Why was Liger flown in only to work the D-list shows?


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> I'm anti-WWE cage matches. Why don't most of them make any goddamn sense? That stipulation brings the worst out of wrestlers. Gonna go wash off my memories of HHH/Lesnar with Blanchard/TA or Idol/Lawler for the millionth time. Maybe Punk/Hardy for the billionth.
> 
> I'm watching the RAWs as well. Gonna hope to go all the way through 2002 and then rewatch 2005 as a promise to C2D. I love watching tubbies fight so Henry/Vader was alright with me even if it was too short. Rock/HHH felt like a 30 minute version of Bret/HBK Ironman Match. We can all agree that LOD/DOA is a godawful feud right? RAW is kinda hit or miss. There are some episodes that are really fun and easy to watch, and then there are some that are even worse than the bad today. I can't believe how poorly DX holds up too. They are not that funny.
> 
> ...


The one thing I hate about cage matches is the door. I really hate that. It's just so cheap and stupid. 

I'll probably be going through until 2002 or 2003. Possibly longer, depends on how much I enjoy it. Plus I would like to see the rise of the likes of Lesnar, Eddie, Angle etc. The LOD/DOA stuff was fucking terrible. I think I mentioned it in one of my reviews where they had their last match. It was hardly even a feud, just an awful series of crappy, boring matches that lasted months if not an entire damn year. Or more. I don't know and don't care to know.

I can't say I enjoy the antics and segments involving DX all that much either. It's just a product of its time really and I can appreciate it for that. Not sure how overrated Summerslam 1998 is. People don't hype it that much do they? I have it as a good 7.5/10 show. Easily the best of that year. The ME was good, the ladder match is great, the Lion's Den match is crazy and fun, and the rest of the card is fairly decent too.

Also what I meant about Foley was how he was seen in the company, yet was one of very few wrestlers to actually have good matches. Though you probably understood that. Anyway, yes totally one of the greatest of all time. He will always be one of my favourite wrestlers in and out of the ring.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Just re-watched Taker/HHH HIAC. This is like the 5th time I've seen it, but I enjoyed it this time more than the rest. 3rd best Taker Streak match for me.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Everyone here thankfully understands that Foley is untouchable. Candidate for greatest thing this business has ever given us. The folks outside of this thread always cite Summerslam 98 as evidence as to how wrestling was leagues better back then than in any time in history. I kinda liked the main event and the Lion's Den Match. European title match wasn't bad either. Need to see if the ladder match still holds up. Based on Cal's review, it most likely won't.

Silver King vs. Liger was fine for a five minute match. Mainly a Silver King spectacle than a Liger one, but that's fine. WCW was really weird; there are times where they actually feature the Japanese talents as much as their own (Starrcade 92/95), but then over time they were nothing more than jokes. Glad I recognized the greatness of Kaz Hayashi at a young age.

Oh, and Blitzkrieg. Fuck, he's the greatest wrestler that has a super small library of matches.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

NotoriousTCG said:


> Just re-watched Taker/HHH HIAC. This is like the 5th time I've seen it, but I enjoyed it this time more than the rest. 3rd best Taker Streak match for me.


Was overbooked IMO, and Taker looked to be at his worst physically that year. He looked much better vs. Punk. ****

(just watched it today, why I'm commenting)


----------



## DFUSCMAN (Mar 13, 2010)

Was in an Elimination Chamber mood earlier today so I watched the 2011 smackdown EC.

One name, DREW FUCKING MCINTYRE.

Seriously, he is beyond fantastic, he's not in here long but he just BOSSES the match and I literally replayed him entering and wrecking shit at least 5 times.

Yeah, if you have any free time or haven't watched it in a while I'd watch it again ASAP

Also Rey is God, even in 2011 with his knees nearly destroyed he goes out there and just owns this match

Drew discussion....yes please


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Punked Up said:


> Was overbooked IMO, and Taker looked to be at his worst physically that year. He looked much better vs. Punk. ****
> 
> (just watched it today, why I'm commenting)


Following the match the year before it had to be over booked, because if they just hit each other with one finisher and that then it wouldn't make sense. It's not a great 'wrestling' match but a good 'pro-wrestling' match, had a great story and even though you knew Taker would win there were times where I thought he'd lose. 

Really I thought Taker looked in much better shape than Wrestlemania 27, honestly though Taker looked in decent shape for someone with his history.


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

Here's my Wrestlemania 15 review.


Spoiler: Wrestlemania 15 review



*WWF Wrestlemania XV review​*
*Match 1: Hardcore Championship: Al Snow vs. Hardcore Holly vs. Billy Gunn (c) *3/4*
Holly steals the win from Gunn to win the title in an okay but somewhat disappointing opener. It had a decent finish but there have been some good hardcore matches in recent months and I was expecting better from this match. Crowd was into it though so I guess it worked.

*Match 2: Tag Team Championship: D-Lo Brown & Test vs. Owen Hart & Jeff Jarrett (c) 1/2*
D-Lo and Test won a battle royale on Heat so they get a title match. I think everyone here is a heel. Before I had even seen anything worthy of writing about in this match it was over. Lasted like 3 or 4 minutes. Crappy finish with people on the outside for no reason arguing and fighting and D-Lo and Test turned on each other despite never teaming before so who cares? This will probably start a feud between D-Lo and Test but it started from absolutely nothing on the night of Wrestlemania. Everything about this including the match was super rushed.

*Match 3: Bart Gunn vs. Butterbean No rating*
I don’t really know where this came from either. Bart won the Brawl for All in mid 98 but disappeared despite being kind of over. Then he came back randomly a few weeks before this PPV and nobody cared. They mentioned in passing on another episode that he would be facing Butterbean in this brawl for all rules match. I had forgotten about it until now. Anyway. The match is underway and Butterbean knocks him down after about 20 seconds but Gunn gets up. Butterbean immediately knocks him back down again for a first round knockout. Wow. This just seems like a bad idea. I think the original Brawl for All wasn’t totally terrible and Bart Gunn got over from it, at least from what I remember. But then they put him up against Butterbean? They completely destroyed Bart Gunn and now the entire brawl for all thing has been rendered meaningless. Bart Gunn could have been something, at least a mid carder but now nothing, what a shame. 

*Match 4: Big Show vs. Mankind * 1/2*
The winner of this gets to be the referee for The Rock vs. Steve Austin. Here’s another of those matches where there is a chair shot but no dq that seemed to happen a lot this time. Later there is a second use of chairs by the Big Show and finally he is disqualified, never got that. It was an okay match, the finish just irks me is all. Post match segment is fun with Vince McMahon coming down to tell Big Show off because he needed him to keep the belt on The Rock tonight. McMahon slapped him and Big Show punched him for a huge pop.

*Match 5: Intercontinental Championship: Road Dogg (c) vs. Val Venis vs. Goldust vs. Ken Shamrock **1/2*
Wait Blue Meanie is with Goldust now? I thought they were feuding. I don’t pay the most attention to some of the stupid mid card stuff. This is a solid elimination match that also got some decent time. The finish was a bit overbooked, would have been nice to get a clean finish.

*Match 6: Kane vs. Triple H *3/4*
The match was alright, it got a little entertaining towards the end, but before that it was dull. Chyna came out during the match as she got burned by Kane accidentally on Raw. Now Chyna turns on Kane and reunites with Triple H after he dumped her a while ago. 

*Match 7: Women’s Championship: Sable (c) vs. Tori 1/4*
Sable’s kind of a heel now, even though the crowds of course still love her. Tori was a Sable fan that Sable ignored for a while and later attacked. Bad match. Real bad. Things get pretty sloppy and some lady named Nicole Bass (large, real muscular, real gross) comes out and attacks Tori letting Sable get the win. I don’t think this Nicole Bass lady actually shows up ever again but I guess we’ll see.

*Match 8: European Championship: Shane McMahon (c) vs. X-Pac ** 1/2*
Surprisingly fun little match considering Shane was wrestling, though I guess X-Pac probably took him through most of it. Don’t have much else to say about it really. 

*Match 9: The Undertaker vs. Big Bossman 1/2*
Hell in a Cell. Undertaker wanted to control the WWE and was threatening Vince and his family. Bossman attacked him once so now they have a fairly heatless HIAC match. The crowd is dead for this. They get no reaction for anything. They’re both heels here as well which I don’t think helps at all. God this match was so slow too, and the crowd sporadically boos at them. I would’ve thought it would be next to impossible to make people boo a HIAC match (with the Undertaker in it too) but here you go. I’ve seen this match before when the Undertaker’s DVD came out in like 2006. It’s much worse than what I remembered. Jesus how do you even screw this up so badly? 

And here we go, the Brood rappels down from the ceiling and tie a noose to the top of the cell and drop it through. I’ll be honest, this is really stupid, but there’s something I like about it. It’s kind of cool in a way. I think it’s Undertaker’s music actually. I really like this theme and it fits with this segment well. I wish I could explain what I like about it other than saying that it’s cool because I’d sound like a 13 year old. Though I was 13 when I first saw it in 2006 so maybe that’s it...

*Match 10: WWF title: The Rock (c) vs. Stone Cold Steve Austin *****
This match is now no disqualification as of the episode of Heat that aired before the PPV. Finally a match that got more than 10 minutes. This got the time and they were able to pull out a great match with it. The booking was a little overdone but that’s to be expected. It was still entertaining without getting stupid. The nearfalls were good and the crowd was hot for the whole thing. Great moment with Steve Austin finally winning the title again after chasing it and being screwed over for so long

Austin shares a beer with Earl Hebner after the match. When Austin is done celebrating he goes to leave but McMahon starts yelling at him, saying ‘that’s my belt!’ Austin punches him, throws him into the ring, gives him a stunner and douses him in beer. The crowd was hot for it of course.

Looking back this is just not a good show at all. Aside from the main event, which is totally worth watching, there really isn’t anything else worth watching. Perhaps Shane McMahon vs. X-Pac for being surprisingly solid is worth watching. But I wouldn’t go out of my way to see it again. And if you really want to see how to royally screw up a hot concept such as the HIAC match only 18 months after its debut, then watch Taker vs Bossman. Holly hell, what a crapfest that was. Overall, there are a few decent mid card matches, but a bunch of bad ones as well. The Main Event brings it up a bit so I’ll give it *4/10*


Or just the quick ratings:

Al Snow vs. Hardcore Holly vs. Billy Gunn: **3/4*
D-Lo Brown & Test vs. Owen Hart & Jeff Jarrett: *1/2*
Bart Gunn vs. Butterbean: *No rating*
Big Show vs. Mankind: ** 1/2*
Road Dogg vs. Val Venis vs. Goldust vs. Ken Shamrock: ***1/2*
Kane vs. Triple H: **3/4*
Sable vs. Tori: *1/4*
Shane McMahon vs. X-Pac: ***1/2*
The Undertaker vs. Big Bossman: *1/2*
The Rock vs. Stone Cold Steve Austin: ******

Overall: *4/10*


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

DFUSCMAN said:


> Was in an Elimination Chamber mood earlier today so I watched the 2011 smackdown EC.
> 
> One name, DREW FUCKING MCINTYRE.


Yeah it's mind-blowing what went through WWE's heads at that point in time. He had put on performance of the year at that point and that's when they decide to shove him off of the card. Like how he had MOTYC with Chris Masters in May and released Masters two weeks later. And HHH was still getting high profile matches near the end of that year. Some with Kevin Nash. 

Kevin. Nash.

-----

I have always hated that Rock/HHH ladder match.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Hey, at least the HHH/Nash Ladder match could've been WAY, WAY, WAY worse. Turned out not bad tbh.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

*NOTORIOUSTCG's REVIEW OF THE STREAK*
PART 4

*17 – 0
Wrestlemania XXV vs. Shawn Michaels*

At the time of watching, this was my favourite and best match I had ever seen. GOAT HBK entrance, from the heavens. Taker then rises from Hell. What a shit Mania this was, other than this match the only thing I can remember from it is the terrible main event and Cena lifting Edge and Show on his shoulders. Shawn faking a knee injury and Taker going fuck you and going to attack Shawn is great. Love how Shawn starts going for the submissions early on, makes a hell of a lot of sense and this is why these two men are so great. I’m not sure if it’s because of the roof, but the crowd is great during this match. Shawn’s splat onto the outside sounds sick, but it’s nothing compared to the Undertaker almost killing himself, fucking Sim Snuka. Even with the break mid match, the crowd is still going berserk, Taker and Shawn somehow make a few minutes of doing nothing entertaining. Last Ride is counted by Shawn, and then Taker counters the counter with one of the best Last Ride’s I’ve ever seen. That skin the cat counter into the Tombstone is GOAT, and Shawn kicking out is incredible, every man and his dog thought it was over. That Big Boot by Taker after he and Shawn do the punch/chop off is the best looking boot and selling I’ve ever seen. The crowd is almost relieved after the match, and do I blame them? It’s fucking amazing. The second best match I’ve ever seen, it has everything you want and need from a wrestling match. Just Perfect.

*Rating: *****
Cal Scale: 9

18 – 0
Wrestlemania XXVI vs. Shawn Michaels*

Streak vs. Career, the only way to follow up the match the year before was with this match. Don’t get me wrong I have nothing against Matt Striker but surely JR should be commentating this match instead of him. The Brock guy is in the crowd, about three rows back in a yellow shirt. It’s amazing how they work this match and turn real life into kayfabe with Taker’s injured left leg. Shawn kips up into a chokeslam. Tombstone on the outside leads to Taker throwing off a doctor and then Shawn kicking out. Shawn becomes the first person to counter the hells gate. Boy oh Boy what a Super Kick. Shawn miss hits the moonsult on Taker but lands on Taker’s knee which adds to the story even more, and makes it look like Shawn did it on purpose. For me Taker is the best seller in the business. ‘STAY DOWN,’ the slit throat and the slap lead to a motherfucking jumping Tombstone, and that’s Shawn’s career. The aftermath is excellent as well, and the reason why I don’t want Shawn to come out of retirement to fight Bryan at Mania. This is more like a story than anything else, as when a 24 minute match feels like its goes 5 minutes it just shows you how good it is. It’s the best match I have ever seen. I know some people don’t rate this match highly or think it’s as good as the match the year before, but to me it’s better. It’s the Greatest Of All Time versus the Second Greatest Of All Time, in the Second Greatest’s last match, in the Greatest Match of All Time. Well at least for me anyway.

*Rating: *****
Cal Scale: 9

19 – 0
Wrestlemania XXVII vs. Triple H*

I love how when the lights go out and the bell tolls everyone gets excited for the Undertaker, but it’s just Triple H and everyone is just like ohh. Triple H’s entrance is pretty sick though. Undertaker took his hat off before his coat, which was a little weird. They’ve got the ‘Cole Mine’ and the Raw General Manager’s podium at ringside, those were two greatly entertaining and well ended storylines weren’t they. Undertaker’s selling is great. Taker ends up making Triple H submit with the Hell’s Gate. Sure I can see why people don’t think this match is good. It’s not Chris Benoit vs. Kurt Angle or anything like that because that’s not what this match is about, it’s all about two men going out and hitting bombs until the other can’t take it anymore. Which is my opinion is smart, after the two Mania’s before with the Taker and Shawn matches, I think both men knew they couldn’t out wrestle that, so the story telling had to be greater. Although I don’t like that Taker was stretched out, at least he could have crawled out or something. Better than their 17 match, but not as good as their next match. 

*Rating: ****1/4
Cal Scale: 6

20 – 0 
Wrestlemania XXVIII vs. Triple H*

Undertaker comes out dressed as Shedder from the ninja turtles. I don’t understand why the cell wasn’t lowered before the wrestlers entered the ring, kind of seems weird they just stared at each other for a couple of minutes. Both men look in better shape than they did the year before. Taker’s back is bruised like anything from those chair shots. The Sweet Chin Music and Pedigree combination kick out one of the GOAT kick outs, seriously thought it was over there. That sit up, and Triple H shitting himself. Taker’s gets Haitch back for those chair shots with brutal ones of his own. Taker gives no fucks throwing the chair and sledge hammer onto the outside into the upper half of the cell. I always have liked this match, and on the re-watch I actually rate it higher than before. It may not be as good as the two HBK matches but what matches are? Fuck it I’m giving it 4 and 3/4 stars, really, really, really enjoyed the rewatch, could have even given it 5 stars.

*Rating: ****3/4
Cal Scale: 8

21 – 0
Wrestlemania XXIX vs. CM Punk*

The most shocking moment of Wrestlemania 29 was that Living Colour are black, anyway as I’ve said before, heels having their music played live is something that I’m not a huge fan of. Punk having trunks in tribute to Taker is pretty cool. That Taker entrance. Although Punk said that he’d be happy with a count out or disqualification win, other than disrespecting Taker when he made his entrance, he didn’t really play up on this. Michael Cole just called Paul Bearer Undertaker’s soul mate. The crowd go berserk for the over the top rope dive tease. That elbow drop onto the table looked like it would have killed Punk’s legs. Undertaker sit up in the anaconda vice is an awesome visual. As is the glancing GTS into the falling Tombstone. When watching it live I thought that Punk was going to win after the urn shot. And all is well as Taker goes 21 – 0 after a Tombstone. 

*Rating: ****1/2
Cal Scale: 7*


*Matches in order from Best to Worst:* (Cal Scale)
vs. Shawn Michaels @ Wrestlemania XXVI (9)
vs. Shawn Michaels @ Wrestlemania XXV (9)
vs. Triple H @ Wrestlemania XXVIII (8)
vs. CM Punk @ Wrestlemania XXIX (7)
vs. Randy Orton @ Wrestlemania XXI (7)
vs. Edge @ Wrestlemania XXIV (7)
vs. Kane @ Wrestlemania XIV (7)
vs. Triple H @ Wrestlemania XXXII (6)
vs. Batista @ Wrestlemania XXIII (6)
vs. Ric Flair @ Wrestlemania XVIII (5)
vs. Triple H @ Wrestlemania XVII (4)
vs. Diesel @ Wrestlemania XII (3)
vs. Kane @ Wrestlemania XX (1)
vs. The Big Show and A-Train @ Wrestlemania XIX (1)
vs. Mark Henry @ Wrestlemania XXII (1)
vs. Psycho Sid @ Wrestlemania XIII (1)
vs. Jake Roberts @ Wrestlemania VIII (0.5)
vs. Jimmy Snuka @ Wrestlemania VII (0.5)
vs. The Big Boss Man @ Wrestlemania XV (0)
vs. King Kong Bundy @ Wrestlemania XI (0)
vs. Giant Gonzales @ Wrestlemania IX (0)

​


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

RhodesForWHC said:


> I feel like Ziggler VS Kofi match-ups are underrated, in general. Sure, the match may have been over done over the past few years, but I've always enjoyed them, the two mesh quite decently in the ring, and the sequences included are usually very "fun", if you will. Especially with Kofi's high-flying style and Ziggler's similar somewhat high-flying, but more of a hybrid style.


I cleaned out my PMs. Was gonna tell you through reps but I still can't do that. :lol


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Taker/HHH II was no Angle/Benoit because it didn't want to suck. 8*D

Anyways, agreed 100% with all 5 of those ratings. I hope I'm not alone when I think that Taker/Trips 17 > 27, and that 28 > both. The first one may have not had the visceral battle of the iconic juggernauts feel with immense, movie-like storytelling. What it did have, however, was a different kind of the same storytelling based on all-out mayhem and chaos instead of raw viciousness. In a similar but more Attitude Era-style brawl, they had the same core as 27 - throw out every single possible bomb to the other for the better hope of him staying down for good. Which was made it the better match imo - it made it not too far of being the same thing but with a more exciting, chaotic feel. And because the Streak was still not a factor, it was more unpredictable too. The Last Ride sledgehammer spot might just be the most overlooked near-fall in Streak history. I have both at ****1/4, though.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

ATF said:


> Taker/HHH II was no Angle/Benoit because it didn't want to suck. 8*D
> 
> Anyways, agreed 100% with all 5 of those ratings. I hope I'm not alone when I think that Taker/Trips 17 > 27, and that 28 > both. The first one may have not had the visceral battle of the iconic juggernauts feel with immense, movie-like storytelling. What it did have, however, was a different kind of the same storytelling based on all-out mayhem and chaos instead of raw viciousness. In a similar but more Attitude Era-style brawl, they had the same core as 27 - throw out every single possible bomb to the other for the better hope of him staying down for good. Which was made it the better match imo - it made it not too far of being the same thing but with a more exciting, chaotic feel. I have both at ****1/4, though.


I've seen many people say they prefer 17 to 27, so you are not alone. I really enjoy their 17 match and have it at ***3/4 but it just doesn't click with me. Although for me Deadman > Biker so that might have something to do with it, as well as the close to 11 minute ref bump. Just feel it would have worked better as a no DQ match.


----------



## Eulonzo (Jun 3, 2012)

Punk/Dolph's match on RAW from 11/21/11 is pretty good.





I've seen it quite a few times.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Certainly a lot better than the overbooked shambles that was the RR 2012 match.

Speaking of Ziggler, I highly recommend y'all watch this precious gem he had this year with Ambrose:
x161ztt


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

NotoriousTCG said:


> Just re-watched Taker/HHH HIAC. This is like the 5th time I've seen it, but I enjoyed it this time more than the rest. 3rd best Taker Streak match for me.


**3/4

Ri-goddamn-diculously overrated match.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> That's a great match. I'm actually pro-Brock being in danger b/c he sold me on it so, so well.





The Primer said:


> I need to find my thoughts on Lesnar vs that other guy who did nothing steel cage match and why I loved it. Brock & Heyman made that match for me.


yea it was very good, I enjoyed it, Brock performance was off the charts, his selling was unuqe,unexpected, and :mark: worthy. The match was nice and stiff too so that always a +

Tbh I think the hhh/lesnar hate is a bit overrated these days, now EVERYONE hates them all. For me the dullness, chore to watch was always my biggest complaint. I liked their cage, mania is OK and summerslam I just too like but is too much of a chore too finish 




funnyfaces1 said:


> .
> 
> That MonsoonClassic guy on Youtube is a saint. He just uploaded a bunch of WCW Mysterio matches from Worldwide.


:mark: this channel is Godly, I was telling someone about it, I only fear is I think he is on his/her 2nd strike on YT


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Eddie Guerrero vs Ric Flair Hog Wild - *** 3/4
Just popped in the Viva La Raza DVD and this looked intriguging. Two of the greats :mark: The most important match in the career of Eddie Guerrero and there's hundreds if not thousands of ******** here to witness it. Greatness with the back and forth shoves and slaps. Eddie is the hot ball of fire while Flair is content with chillin outside with the ladies. Eddie's offense is so fun to watch here. Flair selling for Eddie's version of the Figure Four is great  Nothing better than seeing the GOATs ass too, very very necessary  And the damn diritiest player in the game prevails again! Sometimes slow and sloppy but fun throughout.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I have only seen Brock/Trips cage once, and i hated it then. Maybe as i'm a massive Brock mark, and although yes his selling was rather godlike in the match, i just couldn't stand the fact that he had to sell like that in the first place, esp in a fucking cage.

No idea if i can put myself through watching it again tbh.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Just discovered this program that extracts specific parts from videos. Now I'm gonna upload Brock/Angle full 60 minute match (from HTCP DVD) on youtube once it's done!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks again matey 

And props to upping the Brock/Angle match, was thinking of doing it myself at some point 

EDIT - Ill download it tomorrow, my internet is slow as fuck atm.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Flair/Funk GAB '89 ****


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I love Flair/Funk from GAB. Flair out of his elements putting on a great heroic performance against the greatest hardcore wrestler ever. It did bother me to see Flair win, but that doesn't take away from the match's greatness.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Clint Eastwood said:


> Thanks again matey
> 
> And props to upping the Brock/Angle match, was thinking of doing it myself at some point
> 
> EDIT - Ill download it tomorrow, my internet is slow as fuck atm.


Alright, tell me about it once it's done. I have PMs turned off so rep or this thread are the options. 

Brock/Angle is almost done, two hours remain and I've left it in the background for about 5 hours now. That's the deal with this software I used to extract it, made the one hour video near 2,5gb and that makes it useless to have once you've offloaded it into the internet.

Hopefully they don't block it because it looks great, got it in good quality with the whole hour!


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Choke2Death said:


> Alright, tell me about it once it's done. I have PMs turned off so rep or this thread are the options.
> 
> Brock/Angle is almost done, two hours remain and I've left it in the background for about 5 hours now. That's the deal with this software I used to extract it, made the one hour video near 2,5gb and that makes it useless to have once you've offloaded it into the internet.
> 
> Hopefully they don't block it because it looks great, got it in good quality with the whole hour!


I usually open the DVD up in DVDShrink, then use that to edit out the part/match i need, the use AutoGK program to convert it to avi. With that program you can determine yourself what MB you want the resulting file to be etc 

Downloaded the match now btw, my internet picked up  Thanks again.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

AutoGK sounds like something worth trying. I did some edits in Sony Vegas but for whatever reason, the audio always came out of sync.

BROCK vs ANGLE (FULL 60 MINUTES) is uploaded now, but I keep getting this "An error occurred, please try again later" message.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Video's fine for me.

My favorite Iron man match. Would consider watching it now, but Breaking Bad is taking precedence over everything else right now.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Second best Iron Man ever for me (best in WWWE), love it. So glad to have it in full on Bluray .


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Really love that the WWE YouTube channel uploads full-length matches.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yep, video works for me fine too now. DLed it from that youtube link and now I have it in good quality at only 400mb as opposed to the large 3gb that was the extraction.



StraightEdgeJesus said:


> Really love that the WWE YouTube channel uploads full-length matches.


It's been great but I hate how much they edit stuff. For instance, they posted Jeff Hardy/Undertaker ladder match but near the end, they edit out a chair shot to the head. They also never post matches with blood or if they do, it's a short snippet in black and white.

Regarding the ironman match, it's actually me who uploaded it. :lol I try to make it look "official" by using digital images as thumbnails and listing them similarly with the "FULL LENGTH MATCH" tag.


----------



## Not Lying (Sep 9, 2013)

Edge vs Chris Benoit Steel Cage match 

It was after SurvivorSeries 2004, Edge is still frustrated for not getting an opportunity to wrestle for the WHC, and Benoit was frustraded because he was supposed to wrestle HHH for the world title, so they basically took out their frustration on eachother.. It was a very intense fight, would have loved to actually go 10min longer(it was only like 10-12min) , but pretty good fight and great finish, i give it ***1/2 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

etrbaby said:


> Edge vs Chris Benoit Steel Cage match
> 
> It was after SurvivorSeries 2004, Edge is still frustrated for not getting an opportunity to wrestle for the WHC, and Benoit was frustraded because he was supposed to wrestle HHH for the world title, so they basically took out their frustration on eachother.. It was a very intense fight, would have loved to actually go 10min longer(it was only like 10-12min) , but pretty good fight and great finish, i give it ***1/2
> 
> ...


Can't remember this match at all, but it's looks like something I would enjoy. Edge's frustrated, obsessed with becoming World Champion character in late 2004 and early 2005 was great. And with Benoit you're almost guaranteed a good match.


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

New sig, playas! Dig it! 



funnyfaces1 said:


> Aren't you happy that our great city is represented by men like him and Derrick Rose?


Punk is from Chicago? I had no idea. Did you guys know he lives a straight edge lifestyle as well? :troll 




The Primer said:


> WCW in the late 80's - early 90's is in a class by itself, tbf.



As huge of a WWF fan as I was back then I can even admit the in ring product and roster depth was better in WCW at that time. 



SaviorBeeRad™;28020729 said:


> Eddie Guerrero vs Ric Flair Hog Wild - *** 3/4
> Just popped in the Viva La Raza DVD and this looked intriguging. Two of the greats :mark: The most important match in the career of Eddie Guerrero and there's hundreds if not thousands of ******** here to witness it. Greatness with the back and forth shoves and slaps. Eddie is the hot ball of fire while Flair is content with chillin outside with the ladies. Eddie's offense is so fun to watch here. Flair selling for Eddie's version of the Figure Four is great  Nothing better than seeing the GOATs ass too, very very necessary  And the damn diritiest player in the game prevails again! Sometimes slow and sloppy but fun throughout.


LOVE this match and set. One of my fave WWE sets for sure. I just watched Eddie v JBL at Judgement Day for the first time in awhile last night. Brutal carnage. 



Chismo said:


> Flair/Funk GAB '89 ****


Agreed. I might even go a little higher. I have their I Quit match at :meltzer :meltzer :meltzer :meltzer :meltzer I was a 9 year old glued to my tv as I rooted for Flair and my Dad rooted for Funk. Good times. One of my all time fav matches. 



funnyfaces1 said:


> I love Flair/Funk from GAB. Flair out of his elements putting on a great heroic performance against the greatest hardcore wrestler ever. It did bother me to see Flair win, but that doesn't take away from the match's greatness.


Agreed. Funk should have won this match with Flair regaining the title at CotC in the I quit match. Oh well. I really enjoy the Flair/Sting v Funk/Muta tag match as well from around that time in 1989. 



Choke2Death said:


> AutoGK sounds like something worth trying. I did some edits in Sony Vegas but for whatever reason, the audio always came out of sync.
> 
> BROCK vs ANGLE (FULL 60 MINUTES) is uploaded now, but I keep getting this "An error occurred, please try again later" message.


One of my favorite Iron Man matches. Terrific heel performance from :brock and face performance from :angle2 



#BadNewsSanta said:


> Video's fine for me.
> 
> My favorite Iron man match. Would consider watching it now, but Breaking Bad is taking precedence over everything else right now.


As it should. I'm only on season 3 so shhhhhhhhhh.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Choke2Death said:


> It's been great but I hate how much they edit stuff. For instance, they posted Jeff Hardy/Undertaker ladder match but near the end, they edit out a chair shot to the head. They also never post matches with blood or if they do, it's a short snippet in black and white.
> 
> Regarding the ironman match, it's actually me who uploaded it. :lol I try to make it look "official" by using digital images as thumbnails and listing them similarly with the "FULL LENGTH MATCH" tag.


Did they actually edit out the chair shot to the head? What a bunch of pussies lol

I'll edit my earlier statement: Love that WWE are uploading full-length matches, don't like the edits.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Nostalgia said:


> Can't remember this match at all, but it's looks like something I would enjoy. Edge's frustrated, obsessed with becoming World Champion character in late 2004 and early 2005 was great. And with Benoit you're almost guaranteed a good match.


Don't remember it all that well other than the finish but I do remember that I was not a huge fan of it or anything. Felt too short but it may need a rewatch.



StraightEdgeJesus said:


> Did they actually edit out the chair shot to the head? What a bunch of pussies lol
> 
> I'll edit my earlier statement: Love that WWE are uploading full-length matches, don't like the edits.


They always edit out chair shots to the head. The video freezes for a second usually, but in the match I pointed out, they completely edit out that part so Hardy goes from being held by Taker to climbing the ladder out of nowhere and JR's epic "THE KNOCKOUT SHOT!" call is taken out.


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/nxt/1070377-best-nxt-2013-part-1-a.html

I'm loving this 2013 NXT pack


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Edge/Benoit steel cage? Sounds amazing. Gotta get on that ASAP.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

So I'm pumped for Raw tomorrow night...



Spoiler: SPOILER FOR RAW TOMORROW



Big E Langston cut a promo during the Smackdown taping tonight, to air this Friday, saying Lesnar attacked Henry on Raw. So Lesnar's coming back tomorrow night and he's going head to head with Henry :mark: Hoping this isn't one of those fake spoilers.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

#BadNewsSanta said:


> So I'm pumped for Raw tomorrow night...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



:yum:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Damn, read that spoiler on mobile 

Still :mark: though 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Flair vs Funk GAB is flawless.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Gonna watch Jericho/Punk from Mania, someone gimme one more match!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Mark Henry vs Sheamus - SummerSlam 2011


----------



## DFUSCMAN (Mar 13, 2010)

The Primer said:


> Mark Henry vs Sheamus - SummerSlam 2011


:mark: times 1000 for that match

Watch it, it's literally everything sheamus and henry is supposed to be, such a fun match


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

ehh dont think that happening in regards to that spoiler

Havent watching any wrestling today, may start after this game


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

MOTN for me on a show that's pretty good all around.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Could anyone link me to Sheamus vs. Henry?


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

I'm looking forward to watching Henry vs. Sheamus, but I remember Summerslam 2011 being really fun. I might have to watch Christian vs. Orton, I remember that actually being pretty brutal :mark:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

]Quick XWT question, was just upgraded to power user, what does that mean? 

Back home, should get BL 04 done tomorrow 

EDIT: here ya go Punked up

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xzrb0e_summerslam-2011-sheamus-vs-mark-henry_sport


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Mark Henry vs Sheamus

still don't know how to embed the dailymotion videos yet - 8*D - here's the link.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Would rep but I gotta spread some more around first 8*D


----------



## Banjo (Sep 30, 2005)

StraightEdgeJesus said:


> Really love that the WWE YouTube channel uploads full-length matches.


Except... they've stopped doing it! WWE used to upload at least one match every night but they stopped cold two weeks ago!


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Henry vs. Sheamus (Summerslam 2011) - ***1/4. Nice power match and then two really cool moments with Henry jumping on Sheamus' head through the ropes, and the slam through the barricade.

Punk vs. Jericho (Mania 28) - ****1/4. This was pretty much five star quality after the first five minutes, but those SUCKED. They kept teasing disqualifications and had weak trash talk, and it felt lethargic honestly. After the superplex to the outside (underrated and awesome spot) I thought it was awesome. Could have used a little more CROWD though.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The use of the story & stip in the start was pretty much the best part of the Punk vs Jericho match.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I absolutely loved Punk/Jericho from Mania. Thought it was a really interesting touch that Big Johnny made that stipulation like minutes before the match. Made everything seem more frantic.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

The Primer said:


> The use of the story & stip in the start was pretty much the best part of the Punk vs Jericho match.


Have to disagree. The stip was thrown in right before the match and was pointless, only put in in by John L. after winning the big tag. And I always hated that build up. Should have been about who's the best in the world, not exposing Punk's family. It felt so forced in the beginning only to go away from it after five minutes too.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

What else would Johnny Ace to do a champion that he hates? Give him weeks to prepare? Give him an even playing field? Pointless is the exact opposite of what purpose it served.

Build up sucked, but it's modern day WWE. You can say that for every feud that's come down the pike for years. Their BITW promo that got a long chunk of time was more than enough needed for WM. Nothing else could be said.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Johnny did plenty right after Wrestlemania, matching up Punk with Henry three straight times. No need for it at Mania when it only mattered in the first five minutes of the match IMO. 

As far as the build there's nothing to be argued, it's a matter of personal preference, but I hated the drugs/alcohol stuff being the main focus so naturally I won't like it in the match. It was a nice touch, however, how they mixed it in with the stipulation.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

He was stacking the odds non-stop on Punk since 2011. It wasn't going to start & stop at times. Of course it would go through WM & follow post-event. That's common sense.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Punked Up said:


> I'm looking forward to watching Henry vs. Sheamus, but I remember Summerslam 2011 being really fun. I might have to watch Christian vs. Orton, I remember that actually being pretty brutal :mark:


Just watch the whole show, you won't regret it.

I might actually start Unforgiven 04 tonight or finish KOTR 98 :hmm:


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Watched the Punk/Jericho titles matches from 2012 last year, and the Mania match is still really good for me, but the Extreme Rules match went down a bit. Jericho in the Mania match :lmao That look when he yells "How's your FATHER??" :lmao

The interaction with Punk's sister at ER was predictable. Chicago though :mark:


----------



## bigbuxxx (May 28, 2011)

Watched Punk/Jericho while intoxicated to pass the time. It was a lot better than I expected. ****. The beginning was terrible but once we got past the "you father raped you" stuff it got good. Have never seen the ER match. Maybe in another year.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

RAPE 

:ti


----------



## JordanRose (Apr 12, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> HHH vs. Taker at WM 27 is fucking amazing, and the best thing I've seen HHH do thus far.
> 
> Jack Evans 187, you are so right that it seemed like a 30 minute long movie scene. For me that's a good thing, because I love matches that have a cinematic quality to them. This was one of the best in that regard, because it wasn't showy. It all felt like one, great, artful, piece.
> 
> ...


Couldn't agree more and I find it particularly weird that Bret had absolutely nothing nice to say about it, same as the following year, despite it being one of the most brilliant and beautiful stories ever told in a ring. 

I'm really surprised that Mania 26 is your favourite streak match. I'm pretty sure the general consensus is that 25 was not only the better match by far but for many the best, or one of the very best, ever. For me 26 really felt like they knew they couldn't top 25 so they weren't trying to: they just had the best match they could given the story and stipulation. Personally I was expecting much more from 26.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I'm w/Bret Hart on the match, tbhayley. It's garbage.

new subject: SHEAMUS is almost back. Rumble has to be the night.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

He's coming back as a heel iirc so I don't know what to expect. In-ring wise he's fucking Sheamus so yeah I expect very good out of him, but character-wise it also seems an upgrade from his corny bully babyface persona. Plus, his only semi-decent promos were as a heel, and watching Sheamus purposefully bully the fuck out of someone like Santino or maybe even Bryan like a proper monster heel will be glorious. Which leads to the question - is there a Batista/Sheamus possibility for Mania?


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

I remember the Punk vs. Henry matches on Raw last year were pretty solid. I particularly remember the No DQ match being fun. Anyone else? Found the match and watched it again. Still good IMO


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Both the Punk vs Henry matches were two of the best WWE pumped out last year. (Y)


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Maybe I'm delusional, but weren't there three Punk vs. Henry matches?

Already back in school starting tomorrow. This means I'm already back to watching matches instead of doing homework :side:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Second one lasted about a minute and some change. Only bring up the first post-WM & No DQ b/c they actually got to be something.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Punk/Henry stuff ruled (especially the Miami one) but y'all shouldn't forget there were two or three other good TV matches in 2012 - the first Punk/Bryan, Sheamus/Jericho and Dolph/Miz Main Event are the ones I recall atm.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

There's a lot of Sheamus matches to be listed still.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Ah, I knew it, because I remembered two awesome Punk vs. Henry matches instead of three, yet I still remembered them facing off three times. IDK if that made sense. :side:

I actually don't remember too many 2012 TV matches. :vince7


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Only recall the Jericho matches, and now just remembered the Punk Main Event match. Oh, I also liked Cody/Gabriel from Superstars, Ziggler/Swagger/Christian/Khali, Rollins/Mahal and Punk/Kane. More than I thought tbh.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

I remember like three Bryan vs. Punk TV matches, Bryan vs. Sheamus in a Street Fight, Jericho vs. Ziggler after SSlam, and a few other Jericho/Punk/Ziggler/Bryan matches. I should brush up on 2012.

Eventually.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Sheamus vs Tensai _(the smackdown one, but shorter RAW match works too)_ is a good starting point. Or one of many Cesaro showcase matches.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Ohhh, I actually remember Sheamus vs. Tensai now that you brought it up. I was blown away by how good it was. And I never need an excuse to watch :cesaro


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Oh yeah, Bryan/Sheamus Street Fight, Sheamus/Tensai and just remembered this one, Sheamus/Cesaro Champion vs. Champion. Fuck I keep remembering - now I recalled Orton/Barrett No DQ.


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

I only remember a few matches from 2012. The Punk/Henry ones and the Bryan/Sheamus street fight which was pretty damn good (and IIRC was one of the first 3 hour Raw episodes?) are actually all I can think of right now.

I just watched that Lesnar/Angle Iron Man match for the first time (also the first time I've ever seen an Iron Man match for some reason) and holy shit, that was fucking great. I can't believe it took me that long to watch it. I'm generally not good with rating random matches but that's gotta be like 5 stars. Or extremely close to it if not.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Just to raise a little discussion about the standards of "outsiders", here's a Top 15 matches of 2013 list I found while digging the net, from the honors of acclaimed YouTuber WeAreProWrestling:



> 1 - John Cena vs CM Punk, Raw 2/25 (*****)
> 2 - CM Punk vs Brock Lesnar, SummerSlam (****3/4)
> 3 - The Undertaker vs CM Punk, WrestleMania (****1/2)
> 4 - CM Punk vs Chris Jericho, Payback (****1/2)
> ...


I skipped through the TNA matches, but there were two of them on the list (Angle/Roode BFG and Gail/Taryn Ladder match). I picked the WWE stuff only, so I added his highest WWE honorable mentions instead. But can you say how much Goddamn overrated some of these, like #7, #8 and especially #10 are? It's obviously his own personal opinion, however his standards must be really low to give that high of a rating to those.


----------



## Rah (Oct 11, 2010)

Remember when I looked at you guys funny for thinking Lesnar/Punk was really good? Well, I just rewatched it (finally) and it's my hands-down MotY. 


unk8 is also in three of my top 10 matches. Pretty ironic I was championing an argument that he's quite over-rated, then, really. It's an almost pity he had those Jericho encounters and was stuck wasting his time with Axel & co. or his resume would have been rather outstanding. Still needs better diving elbows, though. :


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

About time, Rah 8*D Agreed about the Axel statement but the first Punk/Jericho this year (2/8 on Raw) was the standard of those two. PB was the one that failed to live up to hype, and even then it gets far more hate than it deserves. It was just one of those Angle'ish kinda matches where the two just did a bunch of MOVEZ~ with no structure, some sloppy ones at that, and that was slightly aided by the feelgood moment of Punk's return and the badassness of the Chicago crowd. But considering that they had next to absolutely no story avaliable given the 0 build-up the match got and with that the 0 levels of heat between the two that left them without a true reason to wrestle, that was the best way to go for them. With that said, it could've been a hell of a lot better - after all, their Raw TV match had even less circumstances and it delievered far, far more. Still, I'm more heartfelt towards the Payback match since I find its hate too harsh. It's a fun match when it picks up, after all.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

On topic of Punk. TOP 10 PUNK MATCHES (WWE only)

1. V Cena MITB *****
2. V Lesnar SS ****3/4
3. V DB OTL ****1/2
4. V Undertaker WM 29 ****1/2
5. V Cena RAW 2013 ****1/2
6. V Jericho WM 28 ****1/4
7. V Cena NOC ****1/4
8. V Cena SS ****1/4
9 V Jeff Hardy SS ****
10. V John Morrison ECW ****


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

That isn't my top 10 at all, i'd have to think about a real top 10 for Punk but to rate the matches you chose;

1. V Cena MITB *****3/4*
2. V Lesnar SS *****3/4*
3. V DB OTL *****3/4*
4. V Undertaker WM 29 *****1/2*
5. V Cena RAW 2013 ******
6. V Jericho WM 28 *****1/2*
7. V Cena NOC *****1/2* (I adore this match)
8. V Cena SS *****1/4*
9 V Jeff Hardy SS ****1/4*
10. V John Morrison ECW- Can't remember this at all.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Mysterio vs. Malenko GAB 96 is :mark:


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Punk VS Cena MITB fully deserves the five-star rating Meltzer gave it, IMO, care to explain why you're giving it a 4 3/4 stars?


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

I've got to say it's the ending for me, it detracted from the match just enough to stop it from being close to perfect as you can get. I know that's nothing to do with either Punk's or Cena's performance but it took something away, something so small but still something.

The screwjob attempt wasn't needed, ditto for Del Rio cashing in. Without it, it would probably be in my top three WWE matches. 

I do need to rewatch it though, it's been a while. I just checked my word doc


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

If he says "botches" I'll laugh.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

RhodesForWHC said:


> Punk VS Cena MITB fully deserves the five-star rating Meltzer gave it, IMO, care to explain why you're giving it a 4 3/4 stars?


I personally give it ****1/2 or ****3/4 as well, because I don't think it's a perfect match, its a very good match, but not *****.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

The match itself was fantastic, but the atmosphere to me, is what gives it a 5 star rating. The combination of the two is too strong for me to downgrade it due to any small flaws I could detect.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Starting the Flair vs. Triple H double (Cage + LMS) Should be good fun. They bury the IC title though before the match saying that Triple H couldn't care less about the title. As well as Triple H saying Flair winning the IC title was Flair settling for mediocrity.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Was Punk, Bryan & Cena/Wyatts from TttT worth it?


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

ATF said:


> Was Punk, Bryan & Cena/Wyatts from TttT worth it?


Eh not really, it was as standard a tag match you could get with the most cookie cutter finish but it's for TttT so it's not surprising. 

Although i just remembered the Punk celebration :lmao


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Flair/HHH Cage - ****1/4
Flair/HHH LMS - ****1/2

Can anyone recommend any good 'old man Flair' matches other than the above two and the HBK match.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Punk/Jericho Payback was a beautiful story that deserves to be marveled at by all you peasants. unk8. Now let's talk about something besides Punk and Sheamus. Maybe Hogan/Flair 2002. That match was better than all their previous ones combined.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Boooo LMS sucks Cage is awesome and better in every single conceivable way your opinion sucks I'm putting you on my ignore list now you retarded whore!!!



But seriously, LMS sucks and cage rules the world .


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

LMS rules more than the Cage match, screw you sir .

If we're gonna talk about Flair in 2002, we should refer Vince/Flair from RR. Badass street fight right there, Vince GOATing up with his viciousness was :mark:.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

LMS is barely decent .

Flair/Vince RR is awesome. MUCH better than Vince/Hogan. BROCK/HOGAN SD needs mentioning if we're talking about OAP's having good matches. Might actually be a top 5 Hogan match ever. Probably top 3. I can only think of *maybe* 2 better (Vs Flair in WCW... cage I think I preferred, and then Vs Warrior at WM 6).


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The Hogan cage match was a DUD. Replace it with that hilarious match against The Genius.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Amazing on how wrestling fans differ on matches


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Well some of us have RIGHT opinions and some of us *cough funnyfaces1* have WRONG opinions 8*D.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Can someone give me some good VADER matches to watch?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yes. Vs anyone from 92-94 basically . And that's just a starting point. Seriously, just go on youtube of whatever and type in Vader and watch anything and everything. Vs Sting, Vs Steamboat, Vs Cactus are all excellent places to start.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

NotoriousTCG said:


> Flair/HHH Cage - ****1/4
> Flair/HHH LMS - ****1/2
> 
> Can anyone recommend any good 'old man Flair' matches other than the above two and the HBK match.


Pretty much his entire 2005 year, He was worker of the year on raw


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Good Vader stuff? vs Foley, vs Taker, vs Flair, vs Sting, vs Shamrock, vs Michaels... essentially vs ANYONE except Batista (that Taboo Tuesday 05 puke-worthy match) and maybe Kane. Even the Heath Slater squash is worth watching.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

It's not 2005 but still, old man Flair >>>>>


----------



## Sir Digby Chicken Caesar (Nov 12, 2006)

old man Flair match?

Edge TLC, always pimp that out


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Flair/Edge TLC is :mark:

vs Orton at TT is good as well IIRC


----------



## stonecoldvshogan (Sep 29, 2013)

*in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

my choice rock vs hogan at mania 18,


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

I haven't watched as much as pretty much anyone on here 8*D so I'm still trying to watch through as many great matches as possible. But my favorite as of now is Michaels vs. Taker @ Wrestlemania 25.


----------



## 777 (Feb 24, 2011)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

Mine is HBK vs Razor @ Wrestlemania X.


----------



## Edgehead 26 (Dec 4, 2009)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*










Leave the memories alone


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

_*Behold my masterpiece...
*_


----------



## A PG Attitude (Nov 5, 2012)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

I'll go with HBK Bret Iron Man as it was my first big mark out moment as a kid and Shawn has always been my favourite.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

These are the greatest 3 matches in history. All on par for me. 

HBK vs Undertaker WM 25

Chris Beniot vs HHH vs HBK WM 20

The Undertaker vs Kurt Angle NWO 06


----------



## 3ddie93 (Aug 16, 2013)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

Zach Raider vs Khali


----------



## Natecore (Sep 16, 2013)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

Rock v Hogan WM 18. This match is grand spectacle on any level of entertainment. This is the only match I ever consider showing anyone when I'm asked why I watch wrestling. Also its Good Ole JR's finest moment as an announcer. Goosebumps just thinking about this match.

But having said that it Isn't my favorite match.


----------



## xdryza (Nov 8, 2012)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

There's really no such thing as THE greatest match of a all time because there are many that deserve that honor. I'll give a list of my favorites, though.

Steamboat vs. Savage
Hogan vs. Andre
Bret Hart Vs. British Bulldog - Summerslam
Ric Flair Vs. Randy Savage - WrestleMania
Bret Hart vs. Stone Cold - Wrestlemania
Mick Foley Vs. The Undertaker - Hell in a Cell match
Stone Cold vs The Rock - WM 17
Hulk Hogan Vs. The Rock
Shawn Michaels Vs. Triple H Vs. Chris Benoit: 
Shawn Michaels Vs. John Cena - Raw
Shawn Michael vs. Undertaker - Wrestlemania

..and one that I consider a modern classic is CM Punk vs. Cena at MITB. The atmosphere in that match was amazing. It had me at the edge of my seat.


----------



## Your_Solution (Apr 28, 2008)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

Pick any Flair/Steamboat and you'd be close


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Starbuck said:


> It's not 2005 but still, old man Flair >>>>>


GUYS LIKE YOU!

Old man Flair still had plenty to offer in his last WWE run. :flair2


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Rah said:


> Remember when I looked at you guys funny for thinking Lesnar/Punk was really good? Well, I just rewatched it (finally) and it's my hands-down MotY.
> 
> 
> unk8 is also in three of my top 10 matches. Pretty ironic I was championing an argument that he's quite over-rated, then, really. It's an almost pity he had those Jericho encounters and was stuck wasting his time with Axel & co. or his resume would have been rather outstanding. Still needs better diving elbows, though. :


Hallelujah.

Punk may have not been given the best workload for the entire year, but he's made everything that matters into something special. Still ends up being a good year for him. He's ended strong, which is something he needed. Could have only had vs Cena on RAW, vs Undertaker, & vs Brock to be worthy of high praise for the over-under. Managed to negate the few DUDs that came along the way. 8*D


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Punk was ok, but ain't got NUFFIN on this guy:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Legit made me like a Ken Anderson match this year.

Joe Park = Wrestler of the Year.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I was pretty much just waiting for someone to post something so I could find an excuse to post that pic .


----------



## JY57 (Jul 31, 2012)

http://www.lordsofpain.net/news/wwe..._Austin_Your_New_Year_s_Resolutions_More.html



> WrestlingDVDNews.com reports that WWE's RAW 20th Anniversary box set will not be released in Europe due to high production related costs. For fans in North America, the set is back-ordered on Amazon.com and Best Buy's website. It hasn't been available to order on WWE's Shop website since Cyber Monday.
> 
> - WrestlingDVDNews.com also reports that there is some sort of "limited edition" version of the WrestleMania XXX DVD and Blu-ray being planned, likely a store exclusive with one of the bonuses being a WrestleMania book.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It felt like deja vu to me, Cal. 8*D _(if you looked elsewhere that is)_


----------



## jammo2000 (Apr 1, 2011)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

ummmmmmm great post but there are too many lol depends what you class as a good match i suppose. for me there is about 10 but in my memory i have chosen five if that is ok
in random order it is

razor vs michaels not sure what one as i am sure there was two ladder matches ?

the undertaker vs yokozuna was it summerslam 96 or survivor series?
were taker was bundled into the casket by about 10 random wrestlers
the story to this match was great yokozuna sold this like a boss were he had fear for taker. not just that the ending to the match was superb.

hart vs michaels the iron man match both showed how good they are they did not get on but need to look at each other as they had great chemistry 

hart vs buckland throw in the towl match. i remember this being a great match 

the rock vs hogan what can i say icon vs icon great match

and one for the road i cant remember the match again but i can remember the rivary

hart vs hart great story telling and i remember they had a good match but cant remember if it was a great match lol. 

i have gone for the early 90s matches to the late 90s as for me the wwe was just taking off and they were good memmorys having said that for me there is a lot more that i could give a mention too


----------



## Kratosx23 (Nov 1, 2004)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

Kurt Angle vs Chris Benoit at the 2003 Royal Rumble, by miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles.

And a couple galaxies on top of all those miles.

Stone Cold vs Triple H at No Way Out 2001 is a distant second. Shawn Michaels vs Triple H vs Chris Benoit from WrestleMania XX is a distant third.


----------



## *Eternity* (Aug 11, 2010)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*



Edgehead 26 said:


> Leave the memories alone












:austin


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

HBK vs Undertaker (Bad Blood and WM25)
Austin vs Rock (WM17)
Austin vs Bret Hart (WM13)
Benoit vs HBK vs HHH (WM20)
Benoit vs Angle (Royal Rumble)
Benoit vs Jericho (Royal Rumble)


----------



## Chrome (Jan 11, 2012)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*



Tyrion Lannister said:


> Angle vs Benoit at the 2003 Royal Rumble, by miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and miles.
> 
> And a couple galaxies on top of all those miles.


Agree, such a sensational match, gonna post in-case people forgot:


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Watching Foley/Orton BL ATM

I think its safe to say BL 04 is one of the most underrated shows ever :mark:


----------



## Honey Bucket (Jul 3, 2012)

ATF said:


> Good Vader stuff? vs Foley, vs Taker, vs Flair, vs Sting, vs Shamrock, vs Michaels... essentially vs ANYONE except Batista (that Taboo Tuesday 05 puke-worthy match) and maybe Kane. Even the Heath Slater squash is worth watching.


Vader vs. Misawa (These two had a selection of blinders in 1999/2000)





Vader vs. Owen Hart from One Night Only 1997. AWESOME match. 





Vader vs. Austin vs. Taker vs. Bret. Vader gets a nasty, bloody eye. One of his best performances of ALL time. (Match build up starts around 1:10:00).


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania (Oct 16, 2012)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

NWA/WCW: Flair/Steamboat 2/3 Falls Clash of the Champions '89

WWF/E: HBK/Taker HIAC Badd Blood '97


----------



## SUPER HANS (Jun 7, 2011)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

The Undertaker V Shawn Michaels @ Wrestlemania 25.. perfection.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

HBK/Undertaker - WM25
HBK/Benoit/HHH - WM20
Punk/Cena - MITB


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Watch everything Vader had to offer minus vs Kane at Over the Edge 1998 & you'll be satisfied. Probably can skip vs Hashimoto on the first HUSTLE show in 2004, too. iirc that one was very disappointing. Sad face.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas (Sep 16, 2013)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*



xdoomsayerx said:


> These are the greatest 3 matches in history. All on par for me.
> 
> HBK vs Undertaker WM 25
> 
> ...


Can someone please tell me what's so great about Taker/Angle from NWO? I think it was a great match and all but what is so good about it that makes other people praise it so much?



Your_Solution said:


> Pick any Flair/Steamboat and you'd be close


This. This. And This.


----------



## DonkMunk316 (Aug 15, 2012)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*

Austin Rock WM17 

Ultimate match up with such a magnificent, jaw dropping finish


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

So... a thread where Angle/Benoit RR was considered the best match ever "by miles and miles and miles and miles" has been merged with this one. Is this what this once legendary place turned into? 8*D


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Re: in your opinion The single greatest match of a ll time*



TheGMofGods said:


> Can someone please tell me what's so great about Taker/Angle from NWO? I think it was a great match and all but what is so good about it that makes other people praise it so much?


Completely agree here, Angle/Taker is good of course, but a 5* match? fuck no, I'd go ****1/4 at highest


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I chose to ignore the merger and not let it spiral.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

It wasn't me. Probably that ginger mong tbh.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I think for 2014 I might actually try and keep a list of great matches and shit to rank at the end of the year. Not the same project I tried at the start of this year where I watched EVERYTHING, because fuck that. Far too much shit .


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Going to watch some Rumble matches in anticipation of the event. Which full events are worth watching the most? I'm going with 1992 probably first since I've not seen it at all and hear it's awesome.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Starbuck said:


> It wasn't me. Probably that ginger mong tbh.


Wasn't me ya cuntflap. Everyone knows I don't do shit as a mod .


----------



## RatedR10 (May 23, 2008)

King Cal said:


> I think for 2014 I might actually try and keep a list of great matches and shit to rank at the end of the year. Not the same project I tried at the start of this year where I watched EVERYTHING, because fuck that. Far too much shit .


I think I'm going to do that as well. I already do it on another board, but I think I'm going to do it here too. I had a full list of 2013 matches with ratings and all that I deleted before I got the chance to post a list here. That pissed me off.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

More Vader goodness:

Vader vs. Ken Shamrock (No Holds Barred Match/In Your House: A Cold Day In Hell/ May 11, 1997)
Vader vs. Ric Flair (WCW Championship/Starrcade 1993)
Vader vs. Sting (WCW SuperBrawl III) - The entire fucking series tbh :mark:

But yeah, there's a shitload tbh


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Oh yeah, and some his great UWFi work, like this stiff masterpiece:


----------



## WrestlingforEverII (Jan 31, 2011)

HunterHearstHelmsley said:


> Going to watch some Rumble matches in anticipation of the event. Which full events are worth watching the most? I'm going with 1992 probably first since I've not seen it at all and hear it's awesome.


Thats def a good start.

In no order I'd follow up with

2007
2004
2001
2002


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Watched Goldust vs Swagger. Was solid. Nothing more. Dunno why they didn't let Swagger dominate more to have Goldust play the role he's the best at, a face in peril. Instead it consisted of arm work that didn't go anywhere for either guy. It's still better than the average WWE TV match involving random crummy talent A vs random crummy talent B. Swagger's quick transition on the shoulder block into the Swagger Bomb Press was terrific.

I'm gonna make a list of all the WWE TV matches worth some praise in a little bit. It's actually going to be a good sized list. Good for the company this year.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

2009 is fun as well


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Just watched Cesaro vs. Regal. ***3/4 Good show, really good show. Cesaro working on Regal's knee and Regal trying to take out Cesaro's arms was great. Really good match.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> 2009 is fun as well


Yes it was, except Raw which was cringe-worthy.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Does anyone else really like the Brock/Taker (Unforgiven 2002) match, despite the finish?

Can't say i remember the Biker Chain match tbh


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

ATF said:


> Yes it was, except Raw which was cringe-worthy.


I was saying that the 09 rumble was good :lol


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

I liked their Unforgiven match, I liked it just as much as their HIAC match.

Also I watched HBK/Mankind Mind Games earlier today. Absolutely brilliant. No blood, regular match, and very little use of weapons and it still managed to be more hardcore then a bunch of hardcore matches I've seen.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Oh yeah ok, well from Raw's side, Cena/JBL was crin... well shit me, actually that was good. Me being so used their singles non-gimmick stuff was shitty never thought that match was in fact a pretty good one. Even if big reasoning for how good it was being on the hands of HBK.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Does anyone know the date for the Sami Zayn/Bo Dallas match on NXT? Haven't seen that match yet.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

NXT 10/16/13. Good match, Bo has literally the worst running hug ever as a finisher and is bland in-ring overall but when in there with a superior talent, he can pull a Miz (on that aspect of sucking but having goodies) and have good stuff.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Basically I'm trying to totally solidify my 09-13 knowledge before I move on to past eras in depth (I was never more than a casual who would tune in every now and then before that). I've seen all the classics from back a little bit, but I've yet to really watch through a lot of PPVs and stuff.

Think I'm going to work my way through the Jericho/Mysterio series for the IC title and then Mysterio/Morrison on Smackdown in 09.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Jericho/Rey was amazing, as was that Morrison/Rey match from SD. :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

2013 TV Matches lists by show:



Spoiler: RAW (110 Total)



Antonio Cesaro vs Great Khali - 1/7
CM Punk vs Ryback - Tables, Ladders, & Chairs Match - 1/7
Big Show vs Kofi Kingston - 1/7
CM Punk vs Brodus Clay - 1/14
Big Show vs Zack Ryder - 1/21
Sheamus vs Wade Barrett - 1/21
Sheamus vs Damien Sandow - Tables Match - 1/28
Antonio Cesaro vs Ryback - 2/4
Daniel Bryan vs Rey Mysterio - 2/4
CM Punk vs Chris Jericho - 2/4
Mark Henry vs Great Khali - 2/11
Daniel Bryan vs Chris Jericho - 2/11
Jack Swagger vs Zack Ryder - 2/11
Mark Henry vs Sin Cara - 2/18
Daniel Bryan vs Jack Swagger - 2/18
The Shield vs Chris Jericho, Sheamus, & Ryback - 2/18
Dolph Ziggler vs Ryback - 2/25
John Cena vs CM Punk - 2/25
Antonio Cesaro vs Ryback - 3/4
Daniel Bryan vs Dolph Ziggler - 3/11
Mark Henry vs Kofi Kingston - 3/11
CM Punk vs Kane - No DQ Match - 3/11
Cody Rhodes vs Alberto Del Rio - 3/18
Mark Henry vs The Usos - 3/25
Chris Jericho vs Antonio Cesaro - 4/1
Dolph Ziggler vs Alberto Del Rio - 4/8
Big Show vs Sheamus & Randy Orton - 4/15
The Shield vs The Undertaker, Kane, & Daniel Bryan - 4/22
Fandango vs William Regal - 4/22
Randy Orton vs Cody Rhodes - 4/29
Alberto Del Rio vs Antonio Cesaro - 4/29
The Shield vs John Cena, Kane, & Daniel Bryan - 4/29
The Shield vs John Cena, Kane, & Daniel Bryan - Elimination Match - 5/13
Sheamus vs Titus O'Neil - 5/20
The Shield vs Kane, Daniel Bryan, & Kofi Kingston - 5/20
Seth Rollins & Roman Reigns vs Kane & Daniel Bryan - 5/27
The Shield vs Kane, Daniel Bryan, & Randy Orton - 6/3
Sheamus vs Cody Rhodes - 6/3
Daniel Bryan vs Ryback - 6/3
Antonio Cesaro vs Sin Cara - 6/10
Daniel Bryan vs Seth Rollins - 6/10
Christian vs Wade Barrett - 6/17
Sheamus vs Rhodes Scholars - 6/17
Antonio Cesaro vs William Regal - 6/17
CM Punk vs Alberto Del Rio - 6/17
Sheamus & Christian vs Rhodes Scholars - 6/24
Sheamus vs Fandango - 7/1
John Cena vs Alberto Del Rio - 7/1
Daniel Bryan vs Sheamus - 7/8
Seth Rollins & Roman Reigns vs Tons of Funk - 7/8
Dolph Ziggler vs Alberto Del Rio - 7/15
Rob Van Dam vs Chris Jericho - 7/15
Sheamus vs Alberto Del Rio - 7/22
Christian vs Titus O'Neil - 7/22
Dolph Ziggler vs Darren Young - 7/22
Cody Rhodes vs Fandango - 7/22
Daniel Bryan vs Jack Swagger - 7/22
Daniel Bryan vs Antonio Cesaro - 7/22
Daniel Bryan vs Ryback - 7/22
The Shield vs Mark Henry & The Usos - 7/29
Christian vs Alberto Del Rio - 7/29
Daniel Bryan vs Kane - 7/29
John Cena vs Ryback - Tables Match - 7/29
Daniel Bryan vs Wade Barrett - 8/10
Cody Rhodes vs Damien Sandow - 8/17
The Shield vs Dolph Ziggler - 8/17
Real Americans vs Prime Time Players - 8/17
The Shield vs Big Show - 8/17
Jack Swagger vs Titus O'Neil - 8/26
Daniel Bryan vs Seth Rollins - 8/26
Randy Orton vs Cody Rhodes - 9/2
Goldust vs Randy Orton - 9/9
Daniel Bryan vs Dean Ambrose - 9/9
Dean Ambrose vs Dolph Ziggler - 9/16
Daniel Bryan vs Roman Reigns - 9/16
Luke Harper & Erick Rowan vs Prime Time Players - 9/23
The Shield vs Daniel Bryan, Rob Van Dam, Dolph Ziggler, Prime Time Players, Justin Gabriel, Zack Ryder, R-Truth, Kofi Kingston, & The Usos - Handicap Elimination Match - 9/23
Dolph Ziggler vs Damien Sandow - 10/7
The Shield vs Daniel Bryan, Goldust, & Cody Rhodes - No DQ Match - 10/7
Real Americans vs Tons of Funk - 10/14
Daniel Bryan vs Alberto Del Rio - 10/14
The Shield vs Goldust & Cody Rhodes - No DQ Match - 10/14
Daniel Bryan vs Dean Ambrose - 10/21
Real Americans vs Tons of Funk - 10/21
John Cena vs Damien Sandow - 10/28
Goldust & Cody Rhodes vs Real Americans - 10/28
CM Punk vs Luke Harper - 11/4
Ryback vs Great Khali - 11/4
John Cena, Goldust, & Cody Rhodes vs Real Americans & Damien Sandow - 11/4
Goldust & Cody Rhodes vs Randy Orton - 11/11
Curtis Axel vs Dolph Ziggler - 11/11
John Cena vs Real Americans - 11/11
The Shield vs CM Punk & Daniel Bryan - 11/11
Big Show vs Ryback - 11/18
The Shield, Bray Wyatt, Luke Harper, & Erick Rowan vs CM Punk, Daniel Bryan, Goldust, Cody Rhodes, & The Usos - 11/18
The Shield vs Goldust, Cody Rhodes, & Rey Mysterio - 11/25
CM Punk & Daniel Bryan vs Bray Wyatt, Luke Harper, & Erick Rowan - 11/25
Daniel Bryan vs Erick Rowan - 12/3
The Shield vs Goldust, Cody Rhodes, & Big Show - 12/3
Real Americans vs Prime Time Players - 12/3
Goldust, Cody Rhodes, Big Show, & Rey Mysterio vs Real Americans, Ryback, & Curtis Axel - 12/10
CM Punk vs Dean Ambrose - 12/10
Goldust & Cody Rhodes vs Big Show & Rey Mysterio - 12/17
Real Americans vs Mark Henry & Big E. Langston - 12/17
Daniel Bryan vs Randy Orton - 12/17
Curtis Axel vs Sin Cara II - 12/23
Daniel Bryan, Goldust, & Cody Rhodes vs Bray Wyatt, Luke Harper, & Erick Rowan - 12/23
The Shield vs John Cena, CM Punk, & Big E. Langston - 12/23
CM Punk vs Seth Rollins - 12/30
Daniel Bryan vs Luke Harper - 12/30





Spoiler: Smackdown (79 total)



Sheamus vs Wade Barrett - 1/25
Kane & Daniel Bryan vs Rey Mysterio & Sin Cara - 2/1
Dolph Ziggler vs Alberto Del Rio - 2/1
Big Show vs Kane - 2/8
Antonio Cesaro vs Sin Cara - 2/8
Mark Henry vs Randy Orton - 2/8
Big Show vs Chris Jericho - 2/15
Sheamus vs Damien Sandow - 2/25
Alberto Del Rio vs Wade Barrett - 2/25
Antonio Cesaro vs Mike Mizanin - Two out of Three Falls - 3/1
Sheamus vs Big Show - 3/8
Chris Jericho vs Jack Swagger - 3/15
Jack Swagger vs Alberto Del Rio - 4/19
Big Show & Mark Henry vs Sheamus & Randy Orton - 4/19
Jack Swagger vs Alberto Del Rio - No DQ - 4/26
Sheamus vs Big Show - 4/26
The Undertaker vs Dean Ambrose - 4/26
Daniel Bryan vs Ryback - 5/3
Daniel Bryan vs Dean Ambrose - 5/10
Chris Jericho vs Ryback - 5/10
Chris Jericho vs Antonio Cesaro - 5/17
Big Show, Mark Henry, & Jack Swagger vs Sheamus, Randy Orton, & Alberto Del Rio - 5/17
Daniel Bryan vs Jack Swagger - 5/24
Daniel Bryan vs Roman Reigns - 5/30
Kane vs Ryback - 6/7
Seth Rollins & Roman Reigns vs Daniel Bryan & Randy Orton - 6/7
Sheamus vs Antonio Cesaro - 6/14
The Shield vs Kane, Daniel Bryan, & Randy Orton - 6/14
Sheamus vs Cody Rhodes - 6/21
Christian vs Drew McIntyre - 6/21
Daniel Bryan vs Randy Orton - 6/21
Dolph Ziggler vs Drew McIntyre - 7/5
CM Punk vs Alberto Del Rio - 7/5
Daniel Bryan vs Christian - 7/12
Daniel Bryan vs Wade Barrett - 7/19
Christian vs Jack Swagger - 7/26
CM Punk vs Fandango - 8/2
Christian vs Rob Van Dam vs Randy Orton - 8/2
Rob Van Dam vs Randy Orton - 8/9
Christian vs Alberto Del Rio - 8/9
Christian vs Damien Sandow - 8/16
The Shield vs Big Show, Mark Henry, & Rob Van Dam - 8/16
Daniel Bryan vs Wade Barrett - No DQ - 8/16
Cody Rhodes vs Curtis Axel - 8/23
Christian vs Alberto Del Rio - 8/23
Antonio Cesaro vs Darren Young - 8/23
Daniel Bryan vs Wade Barrett - Steel Cage Match - 8/23
The Shield vs Dolph Ziggler - 8/30
Rob Van Dam vs Randy Orton - 9/6
Dolph Ziggler vs Ryback - 9/6
Daniel Bryan vs Seth Rollins - 9/6
The Shield vs Daniel Bryan & The Usos - 9/20
Real Americans vs Prime Time Players - 9/27
Alberto Del Rio vs Damien Sandow - 10/11
Goldust & Cody Rhodes vs Luke Harper & Erick Rowan - 10/11
*The Shield vs Daniel Bryan, Goldust, & Cody Rhodes - 10/18* _*Smackdown MOTY*_
The Shield & Randy Orton vs Daniel Bryan, Goldust, Cody Rhodes, & Big E. Langston - 10/25
Luke Harper & Erick Rowan vs Prime Time Players - 11/1
John Cena, Goldust, & Cody Rhodes vs Real Americans & Damien Sandow - 11/1
Daniel Bryan vs Luke Harper - 11/8
John Cena vs Ryback - 11/8
Goldust & Cody Rhodes vs Real Americans - 11/22
Daniel Bryan vs Luke Harper - 11/22
Goldust & Cody Rhodes vs Seth Rollins & Roman Reigns - 11/29
The Shield vs CM Punk, Goldust, & Cody Rhodes - 11/29
CM Punk vs Dean Ambrose - 12/6
Goldust & Cody Rhodes vs Ryback & Curtis Axel - 12/6
Real Americans vs Big Show & Rey Mysterio - 12/6
Daniel Bryan vs Randy Orton - 12/6
Goldust & Cody Rhodes vs Real Americans - 12/13
Tensai vs Brodus Clay - 12/20
Goldust & Cody Rhodes vs Luke Harper & Erick Rowan - 12/20
The Shield vs John Cena & CM Punk - 12/20
Antonio Cesaro vs Cody Rhodes - 12/27
Ryback & Curtis Axel vs Prime Time Players - 12/27
Randy Orton vs Dolph Ziggler - 12/27
Mark Henry vs Roman Reigns - 12/27
John Cena vs Seth Rollins - 12/27





Spoiler: Main Event (50 Total)



Antonio Cesaro vs Great Khali - 1/2
Sheamus vs Dolph Ziggler - 1/9
Antonio Cesaro vs Ryback - 1/23
Antonio Cesaro vs Ryback - 1/30
Tensai vs Titus O'Neil - 1/30
Dolph Ziggler vs Alberto Del Rio - 2/13
Big Show vs The Usos - 2/20
Justin Gabriel vs Titus O'Neil - 2/20
Mark Henry vs Justin Gabriel - 2/27
Antonio Cesaro vs Sin Cara - 3/6
Kane vs Antonio Cesaro - 3/27
Mike Mizanin vs Prime Time Players - 4/3
The Shield vs Tons of Funk & Kofi Kingston - 4/10
Wade Barrett vs Justin Gabriel - 4/17
Mark Henry Gauntlet - 4/24
*Antonio Cesaro vs Kofi Kingston - 5/1* _*TIE: Main Event MOTY*_
Kane vs Seth Rollins - 5/15
Wade Barrett vs Sin Cara - 5/15
Sheamus vs Wade Barrett - 5/29
Antonio Cesaro vs Justin Gabriel - 5/29
*Sheamus vs Antonio Cesaro - 6/5* _*TIE: Main Event MOTY*_
Justin Gabriel vs Curt Hawkins - 6/5
Antonio Cesaro vs Sin Cara - 6/19
Chris Jericho vs Cody Rhodes - 6/26
Antonio Cesaro vs Dolph Ziggler - 7/10
Christian vs Fandango - 7/17
Sheamus vs Jack Swagger - 7/24
Damien Sandow vs Justin Gabriel - 7/24
Mark Henry vs Drew McIntyre - 7/31
Cody Rhodes vs Alberto Del Rio - 8/14
AJ Lee vs Namoi Knight - 8/21
Cody Rhodes vs Curtis Axel - 8/28
Real Americans vs Prime Time Players - 8/28
Fandango vs Justin Gabriel - 9/4
Luke Harper & Erick Rowan vs Prime Time Players - 9/4
Dolph Ziggler vs Curtis Axel - 9/18
Curtis Axel vs Justin Gabriel - 9/25
Luke Harper & Erick Rowan vs Prime Time Players - 10/2
Real Americans vs Tons of Funk - 10/2
3MB vs Tons of Funk - 10/9
Dean Ambrose vs Dolph Ziggler - 10/16
Goldust vs Seth Rollins - 10/23
Real Americans vs Prime Time Players - 10/23
Dolph Ziggler vs Damien Sandow - 10/23
Luke Harper & Erick Rowan vs Prime Time Players - 11/6
Goldust vs Ryback - 12/4
Dolph Ziggler vs Curtis Axel - 12/11
Tons of Funk vs R-Truth & Xavier Woods - 12/11
AJ Lee vs Kaitlyn - 12/18
Goldust vs Jack Swagger - 12/25





Spoiler: Superstars (11 Total)



Tensai vs Mike Mizanin - 1/10
Justin Gabriel vs Titus O'Neil - 2/14
Antonio Cesaro vs Zack Ryder - 3/21
Ted Dibiase Jr. vs Michael McGillicutty - 5/9
Cody Rhodes vs Justin Gabriel - 5/9
Damien Sandow vs Alex Riley - 5/23
Antonio Cesaro vs Zack Ryder - 6/27
Sin Cara vs Curt Hawkins - 8/1
Dolph Ziggler & Kofi Kingston vs Prime Time Players - 8/15
Christian vs Big E. Langston - 8/22
*Antonio Cesaro vs Dolph Ziggler - 8/29* _*Superstars MOTY*_





Spoiler: NXT (93 Total)



International Airstrike vs Kassius Ohno & Leo Kruger - 1/2
Adrian Neville vs Sakamoto - 1/16
Trent Barreta vs Leo Kruger - 1/16
International Airstrike vs Antonio Cesaro & Damien Sandow - 1/16
Adrian Neville & Oliver Grey vs Heath Slater & Drew McIntyre - 1/23
Kassius Ohno & Leo Kruger vs Alex Riley & Derrick Bateman - 1/30
Adrian Neville & Oliver Grey vs Kassius Ohno & Leo Kruger - 2/6
Luke Harper & Erick Rowan vs Bo Dallas & Michael McGillicutty - 2/6
Paige vs Summer Rae - 2/13
Adrian Neville & Oliver Grey vs Luke Harper & Erick Rowan - 2/13
Xavier Woods vs El Local - 2/20
Justin Gabriel vs Leo Kruger - 2/27
Corey Graves vs Bo Dallas vs Conor O'Brien - 3/6
Kassius Ohno vs Derrick Bateman - 3/13
Summer Rae vs Emma - 3/13
Bray Wyatt vs Bo Dallas - 3/13
Justin Gabriel vs Leo Kruger - 3/20
Paige vs Bayley - 3/20
Luke Harper vs Adrian Neville - 3/30
Luke Harper & Erick Rowan vs Adrian Neville & Bo Dallas - 4/3
Paige & Sasha Banks vs Summer Rae & Audrey Marie - 4/3
William Regal vs Kassius Ohno - 4/10
Justin Gabriel vs Leo Kruger - 4/17
Emma vs Bayley - 4/17
Seth Rollins vs Corey Graves - Lumberjack Match - 4/17
Antonio Cesaro vs Adrian Neville - 4/24
AJ Lee vs Kaitlyn - 4/24
Wade Barrett vs Bo Dallas - 4/24
Paige vs Summer Rae - 5/1
Chris Jericho vs Bray Wyatt - 5/1
Paige vs Bayley - 5/8
Kassius Ohno vs Camacho - 5/8
Luke Harper & Erick Rowan vs Adrian Neville & Bo Dallas - 5/8
Natalya Neidhart vs Summer Rae - 5/15
Sami Zayn vs Curt Hawkins - 5/22
Antonio Cesaro vs Sami Zayn - 5/22
Bray Wyatt vs Corey Graves - 5/22
Luke Harper & Erick Rowan vs Travis Tyler & Sawyer Fulton - 5/29
Luke Harper & Erick Rowan vs Kassius Ohno & Corey Graves - 6/5
Antonio Cesaro vs Sami Zayn - 6/12
Big E. Langston vs Bo Dallas - 6/12
Summer Rae vs Sasha Banks - 6/19
Bray Wyatt, Luke Harper, & Erick Rowan vs Adrian Neville, Kassius Ohno, & Corey Graves - 6/19
Kassius Ohno & Corey Graves vs Scott Dawson & Garrett Dylan - 6/26
Xavier Woods vs Scott Dawson - 7/3
Bo Dallas vs Antonio Cesaro - 7/3
Summer Rae vs Emma - 7/10
Sami Zayn vs Leo Kruger - 7/10
Bray Wyatt, Luke Harper, & Erick Rowan vs William Regal, Adrian Neville, & Corey Graves - 7/10
Antonio Cesaro vs Sami Zayn vs Leo Kruger - 7/17
Luke Harper & Erick Rowan vs Adrian Neville & Corey Graves - 7/17
Sheamus vs Luke Harper - 7/24
Antonio Cesaro & Leo Kruger vs Sami Zayn & Bo Dallas - 7/31
Bo Dallas vs Leo Kruger - 8/7
Paige vs Summer Rae - 8/14
The Shield vs Adrian Neville, Corey Graves, & Xavier Woods - 8/14
AJ Lee vs Bayley - 8/21
Dolph Ziggler vs Alexander Rusev - 8/21
*Antonio Cesaro vs Sami Zayn - Two out of Three Falls - 8/21* _*NXT MOTY*_
Summer Rae vs Emma - 8/28
Scott Dawson vs Enzo Amore - 8/28
Corey Graves vs Rick Victor - 9/4
Alexander Rusev vs Mason Ryan - 9/4
Jack Swagger vs Sami Zayn - 9/4
Paige vs Sasha Banks - 9/11
Leo Kruger vs Xavier Woods - 9/11
Sami Zayn vs Curt Hawkins - 9/18
Adrian Neville, Corey Graves, Xavier Woods, & CJ Parker vs Leo Kruger, The Ascension, & Tyler Breeze - 9/18
Sasha Banks vs Bayley - 9/25
Sami Zayn vs El Local - 9/25
Luke Harper vs Kassius Ohno - 10/2
Adrian Neville & Corey Graves vs The Ascension - 10/2
Antonio Cesaro vs Leo Kruger - 10/9
Paige & Emma vs Summer Rae & Sasha Banks - 10/16
Bo Dallas vs Sami Zayn - 10/16
Sasha Banks vs Emma - 10/23
Adrian Neville vs Corey Graves - 10/23
Paige vs Summer Rae - 10/30
Luke Harper vs Kassius Ohno - 11/6
Adrian Neville vs Corey Graves - Two out of Three Falls - 11/13
Alexander Rusev vs Colin Cassady - 11/20
Kassius Ohno vs Tyler Breeze - 11/20
Sami Zayn vs Leo Kruger - 11/20
Antonio Cesaro vs Yoshi Tatsu - 11/27
Tyson Kidd vs Leo Kruger - 12/4
Bo Dallas vs Adrian Neville - 12/4
Kassius Ohno vs Alexander Rusev - 12/11
Summer Rae & Sasha Banks vs Natalya Neidhart & Bayley - 12/11
Sami Zayn vs Leo Kruger - 12/11
Antonio Cesaro & Leo Kruger vs Sami Zayn & Tyson Kidd - 12/18
Paige vs Sasha Banks - 12/18
Bo Dallas vs Adrian Neville - Lumberjack Match - 12/18
Antonio Cesaro vs William Regal - 12/25



The whole she-bang. I'll make a quick update once I see Cesaro vs Ziggler 12/25, the last Smackdown of the year _(b/c I know Cena vs Rollins deserves a plug, plus others)_ & tonight's RAW may have a gem in the bunch. No RAW MOTY listed as of it considering I got about five all on the fence and rather see if I can weed it out to only picking one. Main Event will be the only tie. The Cesaro masterclass carry job is insane for a number of reasons, but sock me sideways @ Cesaro vs Sheamus. Unbelievable.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

My list is done also, just need to add regals/cesaro and cena/rollins

Still need to watch ziggler/cesaro 12/25 and if anything on raw is good


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Punk/Rollins! :mark:


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

John Cena vs. Seth Rollins was great. ****


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

unk3 Punk and Rollins don't have chemistry. Fuck this world.

EDIT: HOLY SHIT THAT WAS AWESOME


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Punk vs. Rollins was :mark: 

Good shit by both men.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Rollins carried the shit outta that match 

But I hope thats the match at a house show I'm going to this weekend :mark:


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Punk looked really tired during that match. He had like no lift.

Still, was really fun. Two commercial breaks though?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

There's a Dailymotion page that actually uploads all the things that happen during commercials, so that you won't have to go through the hassle of using the WWE App.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

I missed Punk/Rollins? Ugh they put the best thing in the first twenty minutes why?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

you didn't miss a must see match my friend

Bryan/Harper should be good


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

King Cal said:


> Boooo LMS sucks Cage is awesome and better in every single conceivable way your opinion sucks I'm putting you on my ignore list now you retarded whore!!!
> 
> 
> 
> But seriously, LMS sucks and cage rules the world .


LMS is the shit, that sledgehammer shot to the back of his head and Triple H being the Super Heel is great


ATF said:


> LMS rules more than the Cage match, screw you sir .
> 
> If we're gonna talk about Flair in 2002, we should refer Vince/Flair from RR. Badass street fight right there, Vince GOATing up with his viciousness was :mark:.


I've never actually seen the street fight, ill have to find it.


Numberwang said:


> old man Flair match?
> 
> Edge TLC, always pimp that out


Yeah I'll have to give it a rewatch, remember it was good shit when I watched it at the time.


SKINS25 said:


> Pretty much his entire 2005 year, He was worker of the year on raw


Looking through these matches, I think it's hard to disagree.

--------------

Just watched Angle/Benoit RR 03. Its not the GOAT like some people suggest but still good shit. ****1/4


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Thoughts on Langston/Fandango from tonight? I thought it was pretty damn solid tbh.

Also, Brock/Batista for WM XXX?


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Wait when was Cena/Rollins? SD last week?


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

sharkboy22 said:


> Wait when was Cena/Rollins? SD last week?


Yep.

I also thought the Langston/Fandango match was solid as well. I thought Fandango did a good job working on the knee and I liked Langston's comeback.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Langston is really growing on me.


----------



## Guy LeDouche (Nov 24, 2012)

Bryan vs Harper has been fucking tremendous. :mark:


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Bryan vs. Harper was very good, as I'd expect for those two working a long match. DAT :bryan3 and DAT...does Harper have a smiley? 

I'll need to download RAW tomorrow for Punk vs. Rollins and the BORK segment (my USA Network feed was scrambled like hell for a good 20 minutes).


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Bryan vs. Harper was great. D-Bry proving why he's an A+ player :bryan


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

If they're going through with a Daniel Bryan heel turn... fpalm


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

I'm going to give it a chance to see how it plays out. Don't know if Bryan is fully with the Family but I guess we'll have to see next week to find out. I thought it took an interesting turn.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Cena to come and save Bryan lol.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

Okada/Tanahashi from NJPW King of Pro Wrestling. Rules the World. So good, I don't even know what to rate it yet. It with Bryan/Cena from SS are my 2 MOTYs. Ill have to re-watch both of them to choose which is better. Atleast ****3/4


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Backlash 2004 review

Match#1: Shelton Benjamin vs Ric Flair *

Holy shit this sounds amazing, I know Shelton has an amazing classic a year later at BL 05 that is so underrated it hurts. I'm a huge Shelton mark and of course Flair is fucking Ric Flair so of course your in for a treat here. Flair is such a great heel in this match so far, but Benjamin is controlling the match so far, but no qualms from this guy. I hate when people say Shelton is a spotter, this match is a testomnt against that statement. Benjamin holds his own with the GOAT in the ring in this match., and not because of whacky spots but because of fun spots, but because of GREAT wrestling. Really fun match and awesome that Shelton went over the GOAT, ***1/2

*CAL SCALE: 3

Match#2: Tajiri vs Coach*

Well, this might be bad but if anyone can get an amazing match out of a non wrestler its fucking Tajiri, did Tajiri and Shelton ever wrestle? besides those :mark: tag matches in 03 of course with Eddie and Haas, those were great, but a singles match would be amazing as well. Oh, now back to a match that is a complete waste of this amazing wrestler. Coach is actually getting some serious offense in, which is a shame because of Tajiri controlled the match than I think the match would be a lot more fun to watch, but so far this is nothing unwatchable. This match is actually pretty fucking entertaining, mainly because its fun seeing Tajiri beat the shit out of someone for a change. But of course one of my favorite wrestlers loses to a non-wrestler because of interference. Fuck you Garrison Cade. Decent match though. **1/2

*CAL SCALE: 1

Match #3: Chris Jericho vs Christian and Trish Stratus 
*
Hmm this should be pretty awesome, just because of the fact that their match at mania was :mark:. The buildup to this match was actually pretty awesome, as it started like 4 months before the match happened at mania, and that heel turn was awesome. Christian and Trish are actually really good heels in this match and suprisingly Jericho is a good babyface as hes usually a much better heel. Crowd is super hot for this match, makes sense because their in Canada, and this is 3 canadiens in a match together so their bound to be super hot for all the competitors. Crowd of course is behind Jericho, because he is the face, and for all I know this might have been his hometown, but I know its Benoit's but I doubt its his too. Love the "accidental" bump onto Trish, Jericho REALLY has the crowd behind him here, this is the hottest the crowds been all night. Christian and Jericho really have great chemistry together, and its showing here. Love the really close near falls and Christian and Trish getting frustrated. Crowd goes INSANE when Jericho hits Trish with a clothesline, so awesome. Just an insanely fun match all around, gets a decent amount of time and the crowd makes the match a lot more enjoyable. I would say that this is just as good if not better than their mania match, which I've always regarded as great, take that as you will. This is so fucking underrated, tons of fun. ***3/4

*CAL SCALE: 4	

Match #4: Victoria vs Lita*

LOLDIVAS. NO

*CAL SCALE: -1

Match #5: Mick Foley vs Randy Orton *

:mark: :mark: :mark: 

Holy mother of god I'm pumped for this, more than the ME I think, and I haven’t even seen that before. I'm pretty sure this is my favorite Orton match ever, and my second favorite Foley match EVER behind the Triple H Rumble match, which is a 5 star classic IMO. The hardcore part of this starts out immediately, as Foley brings a Bat to the ring and Orton grabs a trash can. I wasn't watching at the time, but I bet it would of been so :mark: worthy to see a GOAT like Mick back in the ring. This is such a brutal match, and that’s what I like about it. I think Foley is a very underrated worker, but its hardcore matches where he strives the most. It surprised me how bloody this was, it isn't as bad as JBL/Eddie but it’s pretty close, Orton gets the shit beaten out of him by Barbie in the beginning of this so bad it gets a little nauseating. Putting Barbie on the crotch of Orton was so :mark: too, I completely forgot how much offense Foley got in. The body slam onto the barbed wire was another :mark: moment, actually this whole match is just those moments, nothing but beauty. Another Holy shit moment of course is when Orton is dropped onto a bed of thumbtacks, legit made me queasy, really disgusting stuff there, but :mark: worthy nonetheless. But this is as close to a perfect match as you can have, prolly the #2 hardcore match ever, with Trips/Foley RR 2000 being #1. ****3/4

* CAL SCALE: 8

Match #6: La resistance vs Rosey and the Hurricane
*
NO

*CAL SCALE: -1

Match #6: Kane vs Edge *

Not expecting much here at all, they always book matches between these two and they never deliever, because they dont have the chemistry I assume. This is the big return for Edge. too bad its in a filler match 8*D. All this is is just boring and uninspired brawling, cant gvie a dogs ass about it because it doesn't even matter, even the hot Cananda crowd is quiet as fuck, which is RARE. Yeah so this match is located in SNOOZEVILLE USA, worst match that I've watched so far on this PPV, fuck this shit. 1/4*
*
CAL SCALE: 0 

Match #7: Shawn Michaels vs Triple H vs Chris Benoit 
*
:mark: have never seen this before, but I have the mania match at 5 stars so this will of course be great as well given the immense talent of HBK and Chris Benoit , oh yeah Trips is here too 8*D. HUGE hometown pop for Benoit of course, they then cut to a shot of Chris's family, not the most comforting thing to witness but I'll survive. Love the showboating by Benoit too. I have faith in this of course, and the match starts out insanely fun, mainly because of how HOT the crowd is, pretty awesome that they booked this PPV here in Canada. Really good action back in forth, pretty similar to the mania match which means while its still fucking awesome, its nothing FRESH per say, but its still a ton of fun. Do LOVE the screwjob flashback as usual as those are always hilarious. Bringing Hebner out to the ring was :lol and crowd was so upset and made the atmosphere of the match so much better. Every time Benoit goes into the crossface the arena EXPLODES, so fucking awesome. The you screwed Bret chants continue for about 10 minutes, HBK gets upset, pretty funny stuff. The dive onto the announce table by HBK was so :mark: worthy. King's pretty awesome on commentary too, I miss him as a heel, AKA when he wasn't cringe-worthy every time he openes his mouth. Really fantastic match here from start to finish, not as good as the original, but still AMAZING, Benoit retains the WHC. ****1/2

*CAL SCALE: 7

FINAL CAL SCALE: 21

CURRENT PPV MOTY: Chris Benoit vs Triple H vs Shawn Michaels( WM XX) 

CURRENT 2004 PPV RANKINGS

1: Backlash (21)
2: NWO (20)
3: Wrestlemania XX ( 20)
4: Royal Rumble (8)
*​


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

anybody have a link to ziggler/cesaro superstar 12/13 ?

putlocker aint working for me


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I'm taking tonight's show as the start of a Wyatt Family anti-hero face storyline. They're against the machine, the machine are heels and Bryan has back-up.

Either that or Bryan is setting them up.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Now that the show's been over a few hours and my fanboy rage has subsided, I'm a lot more optimistic that the Bryan/Wyatts storyline is a set-up. Or I could be wrong. :side:

Was Punk vs. Rollins good? I'm gonna watch it anyways, but I've seen mixed reviews


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

Punk/Rollins was a little sloppy to begin with but it ended up being pretty good. Langston/Fandango was surprisingly decent too.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Uploaded *Randy Savage vs Ted DiBiase (WWF Wrestlefest 1988)* to Dailymotion:


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> anybody have a link to ziggler/cesaro superstar 12/13 ?
> 
> putlocker aint working for me


k2SklFoETfFmoA56tNF?start=1
k6rTHAzpB22f6l56tNH?start=1

Spans over these two videos. Not a bad match at all. Though, did Ziggler get a jobber entrance on Superstars? Goodness gracious.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Thank Christ nobody went nuts for Punk/Rollins. I expect people to freak out and give ***** to shit that sounds as good as that just because it sounds as good as that. Match itself ended up OK but nothing too amazing. Probably a better version of Punk/Ziggler RR 2012.

Now Bryan/Harper on the other hand was fucking awesome. As was the Lesnar/Henry fight. Langston/Fandango was one of the sleeper hits of the last few months for sure too.

Can't say I'm happy for this Daniel Bray-an shit, and I'll be one pissed mammoth if they turn him heel. That being said, I'll wait to check where this goes.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

HENRY VS LESNAR :mark:. God I hope they give em a match at the RR. With only one big title match we get one less main event so that would make up for it. Had no idea Lesnar was returning so I :mark:. Then I :mark: again when HENRY fucking came out :mark:.

Punk/Rollins was good, but not great. Punk was sloppy as fuck in the first half :lmao. But they announced PUNK VS REIGNS for next week so I :mark: again.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I just hope they have Lesnar/Henry under No DQ rules and have those two go completely balls out on each other. 2014's MOTfuckingY right there :mark:


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

Punk/Rollins was alright, I really hope Punk sorts himself out for Mania season, hes sort of in limbo like "_Eh whatever_" The Bryan Gauntlet was brilliant though, needed to be that physical to tell the post match story. 

I suspect he's using the Wyatt's either to take on the Authority or to get to Bray from the 'inside'. Interesting to see WWE actually end the year on a big note. 

:mark: AT BROCK LESNAR THE WWE WORLD HEAVYWEIGHT CHAMPION :brock :heyman


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Man, I sure hope Orton retains at the Rumble but since they had him win the double championships in the first place, I guess that's what they'll go with. My dream match come true. :mark:

rton2 :brock


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

its really interesting to see were there going or trying to setup, heel vs heel? is Lesnar actually winning the championship or just a plot device to setup something else?

They've definitely learned from last year where we new the setup as early as Summerslam were all the peices were going to fit in the puzzle.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

If I were to sneak out dem starz to "the big 3" of last night:

Punk/Rollins: **3/4
Langston/Fandango: ***1/4
Bryan/Wyatts: ***1/4

The Royal Rumble looks good, with the 1st regular Orton/Cena in a dog's age, the Rumble match and apparently Lesnar/Henry. And after mauling through Henry, Choke2Death will finally get his wish of Orton/Lesnar at EC I suppose.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I wonder if Lesnar signed a new contract? Because I doubt that WWE has him fight at all the RTWM PPVS then NOT SS,as he can only do 3 shows a year, and i'd assume that SS is a show that must have Lesnar


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Hopefully the RR is great this year and hopefully HENRY VS LESNAR does get officially made for the show, because christ knows with Cena Vs Orton on the card, the PPV is gonna NEED something out balance out the pure shite.

Honestly don't see them doing Orton Vs Lesnar for the title. For starters, it'll be heel vs heel. Secondly, I and I think a LOT of people simply don't view Orton as a viable threat to Lesnar. IF they do decide on actually having Lesnar in the title match and even winning it, I think Cena will be his opponent, meaning Cena wins at the RR. However, I think they'll go a different direction and have Lesnar do something else instead.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Holy shit the undercard on JD 04 looks terrible, good thing it has that :mark: main event for me to look forward to

Thoughts on that show besides Eddie/JBL?


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I suppose the Rhodes will also be doing something, I guess against the newly formed team of Wyatt & Bryan. Wyatt & Bryan actually win the Tag Titles after some sort of screw-up, which starts the build to Cody/Dustin for Mania.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

King Cal said:


> Honestly don't see them doing Orton Vs Lesnar for the title. For starters, it'll be heel vs heel. *Secondly, I and I think a LOT of people simply don't view Orton as a viable threat to Lesnar.* IF they do decide on actually having Lesnar in the title match and even winning it, I think Cena will be his opponent, meaning Cena wins at the RR. However, I think they'll go a different direction and have Lesnar do something else instead.


IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT YOU THINK! :rock4

WWE views Orton as a top guy and he has all the accomplishments to prove it. Credibility is the very last of Orton's worries. He just came off a clean victory against Cena.


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## hardyorton (Apr 18, 2009)

Choke2Death said:


> IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT YOU THINK! :rock4
> 
> WWE views Orton as a top guy and he has all the accomplishments to prove it. Credibility is the very last of Orton's worries. He just came off a clean victory against Cena.


We are going to get Batista and Orton for the 50th million time at WM30 :rko2:batista4
Not hating on those guys but it's been seen before. Maybe Cena will get in there somewhere, either way those guys will have to have a 5 star classic to not have the fan's shit on it.

I think it be Brock and Taker and Cm Punk vs HHH in the other main events at WM 30.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yeah imo what C2D bolded is a little of what I call bullshit, Cal 8*D

Credibility as an issue for Randy fucking Orton? We don't live in 2002/3 anymore, pal. He just came off a clean victory over Cena to become the unified champion in what the WWE deemed "arguably one of their biggest matches ever". The only problem in credibility for Orton to go against Brock is physical credibility, and if they had Punk go toe-to-toe with Brock, Orton is no prob.

With all of this I'm starting to figure out the Mania card. Along the way, I see Rey/Cara and possibly AJ/Tamina start building up too. Y'all don't forget that Jericho and RVD should also be returning anytime soon.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

smitty915 said:


> Holy shit the undercard on JD 04 looks terrible, good thing it has that :mark: main event for me to look forward to
> 
> Thoughts on that show besides Eddie/JBL?


TRASH.



hardyorton said:


> We are going to get Batista and Orton for the 50th million time at WM30
> Not hating on those guys but it's been seen before. Maybe Cena will get in there somewhere, either way those guys will have to have a 5 star classic to not have the fan's shit on it.
> 
> I think it be Brock and Taker and Cm Punk vs HHH in the other main events at WM 30.


To be fair, Batista/Orton is one of those "top of the card" matches from the past few years that wasn't overdone. They only had three one on one PPV matches in 2008-09 and the feud was cut short due to Batista's injury. First match is the only time they really had a chance to put on something quality and it was decent enough. Second one had a non-finish and the last was somewhere in the middle of the card with only 10 minutes of time.

It was supposed to be the big co-headliner for WM22 with HHH/Cena as the other but Batista was once again injured. Now they might give it that big shot, seeing as both have the momentum and history.



ATF said:


> Yeah imo what C2D bolded is a little of what I call bullshit, Cal 8*D
> 
> Credibility as an issue for Randy fucking Orton? We don't live in 2002/3 anymore, pal. He just came off a clean victory over Cena to become the unified champion in what the WWE deemed "arguably one of their biggest matches ever". The only problem in credibility for Orton to go against Brock is physical credibility, and if they had Punk go toe-to-toe with Brock, Orton is no prob.


Exactly, Orton haters (sorry CAL ) are just stuck in the past with this "he's not credible" bullshit. This ain't 2012 anymore, he's been built back up (not that he needed to) and on top of that, is more "on" than he's been in years. And physically, if PUNK was sold as a threat, then pretty much anyone can be.

As for the heel/heel stuff, it's not like they've never done it before and Brock will likely be the tweenerish face by default since it's in his hometown.



> With all of this I'm starting to figure out the Mania card. Along the way, I see Rey/Cara and possibly AJ/Tamina start building up too. Y'all don't forget that Jericho and RVD should also be returning anytime soon.


With all the potential big matches, I honestly can't even figure out where Jericho or RVD would fit in.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

A big LOL if they do Orton Vs Batista and it closes. Guess wwe doesn't care if half the crowd leaves for the main event


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

They will do it. And tbh, it's still sounds much, much better than stuff like Rock/Cena II or Cena/Miz. Speaking of which, not that I wanna see him, the card is already stacked enough by the looks of it (Cena, Orton, Lesnar, HHH, Taker, Batista, Punk, Sheamus, Bryan, Rhodes, RVD, Jericho, possibly Goldberg and HBK, etc.) and nowadays he sucks, but he committed himself in this/last year's press conference for the show. Where the fuck will the Rock come into this?


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Give us a Jericho vs Sandow program please! 

And I still have no earthly idea of what there doing. Plans just keep changing more and more. Only I see set in stone is HHH vs Punk. Other then that, everything is up in the air.

EDIT: I honestly don't think we'll see Rock at WM, he fits no where unless by some miracle he agrees to wrestle. Very unlikely.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Rock would probably have the rubber match with Cena if he decided to return. 8*D But this time with no title on the line. Considering they seem to plan for Cena to take on WYATT of all people, I'm sure Rock deciding to return would push that fat fuck down the card. Or maybe they have Brock beat Orton at EC to take on Batista for WM with the title on the line and Rock faces Orton in a third generation/third generation match for the ten year anniversary of their tag match at WM20.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Where did this word "credible" come from? I never said anything like that. I said a VIABLE THREAT, in the sense that how anyone can see Orton as a threat against a BEAST like Lesnar is kinda crazy. Punk managed it, because of his offence and wrestling style. Orton doesn't come across as being THAT kind of wrestler at all, and I honestly don't see how he'd manage it against a guy like Brock. On paper a guy like Brock would MAUL someone like Orton, who aside from the match with Bryan a couple of weeks ago, wrestlers about as stiff or as vicious as a mouse. In kayfabe land, Orton has EVERY chance of beating a guy like Brock based on accomplishments and card placement, but I'm in no way talking about that.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Well, if you look at it, who is a viable threat to Lesnar anyway? Nobody is. Stop with that sensible crap, Cal. If we were going into that department, nobody should ever face Lesnar. The only one who remotely looks like a threat to him is Mark Henry and that is one big maybe. Let's just accept the fact that Orton is going to face him. Plus, it's not like it's gonna be HHH all over again... right? :HHH


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Technically few people might actually be viable threats to Lesnar, but the difference between someone like Punk and someone like Orton is that Punk was able to LOOK like he might be. The fuck is Orton gonna do to Lesnar? Stick his robot arm out and run into him like a spaz? I genuinely don't see how I could possibly suspend any kind of belief for Orton Vs Lesnar because Orton is likely incapable of LOOKING like he could be a legit threat.


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

The biggest looking actual "threat" to Lesnar is Reigns or Sheamus. No one else really comes to mind.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

King Cal said:


> Technically few people might actually be viable threats to Lesnar, but the difference between someone like Punk and someone like Orton is that Punk was able to LOOK like he might be. The fuck is Orton gonna do to Lesnar? Stick his robot arm out and run into him like a spaz? I genuinely don't see how I could possibly suspend any kind of belief for Orton Vs Lesnar because Orton is likely incapable of LOOKING like he could be a legit threat.


You did make an exception for the recent Bryan match so who said for a match with Brock, he wont follow this formula and actually work a more rough style? If he had no problems with taking a chokeslam through a table for a shitty feud with Big Show that no one cared about, I doubt he has a problem to take some bumps here in a big money dream match. Or hit an actually deadly clothesline like the one on that Bryan match after Bryan did that Fameasser-like flip which got reversed.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

ATF said:


> The Royal Rumble looks good, with the 1st regular Orton/Cena in a dog's age, the Rumble match and apparently Lesnar/Henry. And after mauling through Henry, Choke2Death will finally get his wish of Orton/Lesnar at EC I suppose.


I think they said Orton/Cena was No DQ, right?



King Cal said:


> Technically few people might actually be viable threats to Lesnar, but the difference between someone like Punk and someone like Orton is that Punk was able to LOOK like he might be. The fuck is Orton gonna do to Lesnar? Stick his robot arm out and run into him like a spaz? I genuinely don't see how I could possibly suspend any kind of belief for Orton Vs Lesnar because Orton is likely incapable of LOOKING like he could be a legit threat.


I'd buy Orton as a threat to Lesnar a million times before I'd buy Punk as a threat to Lesnar.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

The match with Bryan was like, the only time he's looked anything close to what he'd need to be against Lesnar imo, for a hell of a long time. Years and years. If anything the match would probably have to go more like the Cena match, with Orton getting mauled then somehow sneaking out a win right at the end.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I still can't get over how hilarious those PRIMAL SCREAMS were after he destroyed Henry :lmao

Skipped over most of the rest of Raw. Rollins/Punk seemed like a total carryjob. Punk was sloppy and just looks like he doesn't give a fuck. Total cruise control mode. Langston/Fandango was pretty solid, imo. Langston is improving and Fandango is talented. It's weird how he has been booked like a comedy jobber for months, only to get a good showing against a guy receiving a huge midcard push. Typical WWE booking. Lesnar mauling Henry was fantastic. Didn't see the gauntlet/ending yet.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

He sounded like a girly version of Roman Reigns :lmao.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

xdoomsayerx said:


> The biggest looking actual "threat" to Lesnar is Reigns or Sheamus. No one else really comes to mind.


Taker and his streak is the biggest threat


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

King Cal said:


> He sounded like a girly version of Roman Reigns :lmao.


Now THAT is a match I'd die to see.

BROCK VS REIGNS with REIGNS as the babyface. :mark:


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

I can't see them playing 'hot potato' with the championship, it would devalue the prestige of unifying it a month ago for it to ever go from 'Orton > Cena > Lesnar > Rumble Winner' in just a few short months. 

If John Cena was going to win it, they'd have done it at TLC, FACT IMO, as well as the worrying fact Triple H will cost Cena at the Rumble which would setup that horrible program potentially. 

So I see Orton atleast heading into the Chamber PPV as Champion and I can't see how WWE would drop that Lesnar is wanting the title, it was the main point of his segment on RAW (not the Henry stuff) so I can see him being either in that one on one match with Orton or being a participant in the Chamber match probably as the final pod (limiting his time in the ring) with Orton and 4 others (Cena, Henry ___ ____ ) 

from there it gets real messy.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

:ti This is pro-wrestling who cares about realistic "threats", Did Punk look like a threat ? No, Was the match good ? Hell yea ***** MOTY, that all I care about

Randy Orton cant have great ppv matches anymore brother, those days are over unless he changes his style. Yea he will have a good raw match here and there w/ a great wrestler w/ him but thats it. I would prefer Cena to win the belts at the rumble and lead to cena/lesnar 2 I guess at EC. Only way Orton/Brock would be good is if he is destroyed by lesnar during it

Got my top 2013 list ready to, just need to add a few, will post in breaks as I dont want it to take up the page


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I'd only want to see Cena/Lesnar II for the title if Lesnar goes over this time.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

It took Orton, like, seven times to have a great match with the best wrestler in the company.

He cant work great matches no more.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I could've supposed they wanted to build to HHH/Punk, not HHH/Cena. Given this whole Punk attacks Authority verbally, gets beaten up by the Shield and then beats them all thingy, if anything that's what this is building up to. That and imo the whole "intern investigation" thingy was just a way for Steph and Kane to hide H did in fact send AMBROZE, ROLLINZ and REIGNZ out there to attack Punk. They have no reason to attack Cena other than to protect Orton on the other hand. But this is the WWE, Creative might come up with some stupid reason though.

What I am legit worried is the whole Bryan/Wyatts situation. I just hope that Bryan gets a proper payday come WM and has a higher role on the card than just the blow-off of this feud. And by that I don't mean Bryan/HBK. HBK shouldn't be wrestling anyone period, no matter how awesome the match would be. Considering that will all the plans rumored Cena has been left wandering around with no opponent (Cena/Wyatt has been rumored but I call bs on that), maybe Cena/Bryan II?


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

King Cal said:


> Hopefully the RR is great this year and hopefully HENRY VS LESNAR does get officially made for the show, because christ knows with Cena Vs Orton on the card, the PPV is gonna NEED something out balance out the pure shite.


I don't even get the feeling that Lesnar is fighting at RR. Unless he's re-worked his contract, why are people assuming that? If he really is sticking to three matches, then it will be EC (his hometown...vs. whoever is champion), WM, and SS. They're not gonna have him waste his three matches on the first three PPVs of the year.

I got the impression they were just feeding Henry to Lesnar on RAW to give Lesnar something to do on RAW, and to make him look beastly.

However, obviously it's possible he re-worked his contract. Still not seeing why they'd waste him on a Rumble, when they already have Batista returning for that. It's a waste of paying Lesnar for an extra match, IMO.




> Honestly don't see them doing Orton Vs Lesnar for the title. For starters, it'll be heel vs heel.


EC will be in Lesnar's hometown, so he'll essentially be a face. Or a tweener. I don't think heel vs. heel stuff bothers the WWE much. Don't see why it matters, really.

Preferablly, they'll both be psycho and destructive, so that inherently has some heelish qualities to it. It obviously should be a No DQ match.




xdoomsayerx said:


> A big LOL if they do Orton Vs Batista and it closes. Guess wwe doesn't care if half the crowd leaves for the main event


Half the crowd will not leave, and everyone claiming they won't watch, will absolutely be watching. And then they'll bitch about it.


----------



## hardyorton (Apr 18, 2009)

ATF said:


> What I am legit worried is the whole Bryan/Wyatts situation. I just hope that Bryan gets a proper payday come WM and has a higher role on the card than just the blow-off of this feud. And by that I don't mean Bryan/HBK. HBK shouldn't be wrestling anyone period, no matter how awesome the match would be. Considering that will all the plans rumored Cena has been left wandering around with no opponent (Cena/Wyatt has been rumored but I call bs on that), maybe Cena/Bryan II?


I can't see Bryan going into another feud with Cena been a face. Do you think they are turning Bryan heel just so he can be feed to Cena at WM 30?

I'm a little worried Bryan won't get the match he deserves. Cena rematch wouldn't be bad but turning him heel just to do that would suck. He needs to be in one of the main events, having the best worker on the roster wrestling the opening match would be insulting.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> I'd only want to see Cena/Lesnar II for the title if Lesnar goes over this time.


This. Cena beating Brock again is a big fucking no-no.

It'll be interesting just what Brock does next year, starting with the Rumble.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

What shows/events from the WWE, this year, have you guys downloaded? 

As for me, I've downloaded the full MITB PPV in HD, the full SummerSlam PPV in HQ, the post 'Mania Raw in HQ, Ziggler's cash-in in HD, the full Cody Rhodes Randy Orton match on Raw, where Cody was "fired", and some Cody Orton match from the spring.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I don't practice illegal activity and insist on never using torrent websites!











:ti


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

:kobe


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I download every Raw and SD in HD, and then every PPV in SD. Ordered RR, WM and SS this year and still downloaded them afterwards because my mate usually stops by on Monday night with his external hard drive for a copy of the PPV .

I delete them after I've watched/used them (I use Raw and SD, and Impact too for that matter, in my videos). Only things I've kept on my PC are RR and WM which again I need for my videos. I need to buy RR and WM still for my collection, but it's impossible to get hold of them cheap nowadays in the UK . FUCK YOU FREMANTLE. Might leave this as my last post of 2013. Swearing at Fremantle and their shitty rip off prices.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I have nothing from this year. Everything I've downloaded, I've deleted shortly after. Only got stuff in my PC from 2000-2007. Nearly all the SD and Raws from 2005 until the first half of 2007. Removed the ECW shows after I finishing watching them.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

Still need to download Rhodes Family VS Shield at Battleground, and may also download Ziggler VS Del Rio at Payback and Punk VS Taker at 'Mania. May be hard to find them in HD, though. Main problem with HQ is the audio. It sounds really off in the HQ WWE events I've downloaded.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Excellent, underrated match here IMO. Ill have to check out the Fall Brawl match too


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Downloaded all PPVs this year, DVR all the weeklies


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

King Cal said:


> Honestly don't see them doing Orton Vs Lesnar for the title. For starters, it'll be heel vs heel. Secondly, I and I think a LOT of people simply don't view Orton as a viable threat to Lesnar.


It'd waste a Lesnar date as well. There were enough Lesnar v. Overrate Sack Who Should Go Away Already matches with the HHH series. He isn't around a whole lot and deserves better than shitty Orton. I can't buy Orton as a threat to Brock because while Brock comes off as someone who's legitimately as violent as he says he is, Orton comes off like a school child pretending to be a bad anime character. He's somehow even boring when flinging people into the announce table and ring post and going on a rampage. It's almost impressive.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah gets it .


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Just checking, can everyone view/watch this video:


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Watched Extreme Rules 2012, top 3 PPV in YEARS in my opinion. Rivals Money in the Bank 2011.

Kane vs. Orton - lots and lots of punches and kicks. Some cool moments, especially once they get back to ring side after the backstage brawl. Ryder :lmao **3/4

Clay vs. Ziggler - Yeah. This happened *1/4

Rhodes vs. Big Show - awful for the most part, pretty nice spot with Rhodes hitting the disaster kick. *1/2

Sheamus vs. Bryan - dark horse for MOTN. This was freaking awesome. ****1/4, could have used a little more time at the end. Bryan working the arm was amazing, Sheamus sold it well. Why couldn't they do this at Mania?

Ryback squash - DUD

Jericho vs. Punk - really fun, love how they used a lot of weapons and creatively. ****

Layla vs. Nikki Bella - *

Cena vs. Lesnar - :mark: :mark: :mark: this was so freaking sick until the end. At least Brock had the match pretty much won, but the ref was knocked out so it looked a little dirty for Cena. ****1/4

Overall: 9/10. Every big match delivered, and Kane vs. Orton was pretty solid in the undercard. Everything else was bad, but the show wasn't about those matches. THREE **** matches is pretty rare.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Anyone else have Lesnar/Cena at *****? my favorite BORK match ever 

About to review SS 2012, haven't seen anything on this show before

EDIT: Damn its not on YT, will have to DL it


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Nah, but I'm actually considering raising my rating. ****1/2 or ****3/4 might be better, I took off for what I thought was a bad ending but looking back at how Brock had him beat clean but the ref wasn't there, it's not even much of a big deal.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao at this talk about viability. Take a step back and think about what you're watching in the first place. Orton's "viability" is fine. It's just that he's a crapshoot when it comes to coming up for the occasion.

ER 2012 is excellence. Only one or two shows have had a trifecta as strong as it does.


----------



## mk92071 (Aug 17, 2011)

Does anybody else thing Cena/Bork is super overrated? I feel like I'm the only one who never came around on it.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

mk92071 said:


> Does anybody else thing Cena/Bork is super overrated? I feel like I'm the only one who never came around on it.


No


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

mk92071 said:


> Does anybody else thing Cena/Bork is super overrated? I feel like I'm the only one who never came around on it.


You're missing out on what I believe to be pretty much perfection, my friend.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

mk92071 said:


> Does anybody else thing Cena/Bork is super overrated? I feel like I'm the only one who never came around on it.


I don't think it's the ****3/4-***** match people claim, far from perfect but I wouldn't call it "super overrated".


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

*Happy two thousand and fourteen*


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

I think when I first watched Lesnar/Cena I had it at like ****1/2. I didn't mind the finish that much at all. I still thought it was one of the most surreal things I had seen, simply because I never thought a match that brutal would take place in a WWE ring in this day and age.

Though I'd love to watch it again to see if that still stands, perhaps in my memory of over a year and a half ago, the match seems more violent than it actually was.


----------



## bigbuxxx (May 28, 2011)

#BadNewsSanta said:


> I don't think it's the ****3/4-***** match people claim, far from perfect but I wouldn't call it "super overrated".


same.

i would call punk/brock super overrated.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

mk92071 said:


> Does anybody else thing Cena/Bork is super overrated? I feel like I'm the only one who never came around on it.


I'm afraid I've got some bad news!


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

I really liked Cena/Brock but I think I like Brock/Angle SS even better at least on last watch. Maybe it's just me on that one


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

Punk/Lesnar > Cena/Lesnar 

Here's what I'd give ever Lesnar match since his return 

Punk vs Lesnar = ****3/4
Cena vs Lesnar = ****1/4 
HHH vs Lesnar cage = ***3/4
HHH vs Lesnar SS = ****
HHH vs Lesnar WM = ***1/4


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Lesnar's matches since return:


vs. Cena ER 12- ****1/4
vs. HHH SS 12- ***
vs. HHH WM29- *
vs. HHH ER 13- **1/2
vs. Punk SS 13- ****3/4

Punk/Lesnar rules the earth. Fuck that HHH Mania match... fuck the whole HHH series for that matter for mucking up Lesnar's match quality and credibility. FUCK IT! FUCK IT ALL!

And HHH is probably all :HHH2


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

The Extreme Rules Cage match was poetry in motion imo. Underdog or not, Lesnar's selling was 5 fucking stars, and some other stuff like H maniacally pulling the sledgehammer off the cage and "THAT'S MY MANAGER!" = gold.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

vs Cena - ★★★★¾
vs HHH I - ★★★½
vs HHH II - ★★★¼ (rewatched it recently and it was a bit better)
vs HHH III - ★★★★
vs Punk - ★★★★½

Hopefully next thing I'll add to this list will read: vs Orton - ★★★★+ rton2


----------



## xdoomsayerx (Jun 23, 2012)

If Brock would face Sheamus or Bryan I wouldn't expect anything less then ****+. Would be epic.

I'm sure Brock vs Orton would be solid as well. As for Batista I don't know we got to see how he does in the ring this time around. He's pretty old and most likely roided up.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

vs cena *****
vs punk *****
vs HHH 1 dud
vs HHH 2 **
vs HHH 3 ****


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

Lesnar vs Cena *****1/2*
Lesnar vs HHH ****3/4*
Lesnar vs HHH 2 ***1/2*
Lesnar vs HHH 3 ****1/4*
Lesnar vs Punk *****1/2*


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Lesnar vs Cena ****1/2
Lesnar vs HHH ****1/4
Lesnar vs HHH 2 **3/4
Lesnar vs HHH 3 *
Lesnar vs Punk ****1/2


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Fuck it, I'm just gonna post all of it at the same time, hopefully it doesnt get buried



> * My top 30 matches of 2013*
> 30) Goldust vs Randy Orton raw 9/13
> 
> 29) Cm Punk vs Dean Ambrose sd 12/13
> ...


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Lesnar vs. Cena - ****1/2
Lesnar vs. HHH - ****
Lesnar vs. HHH II - ***1/2
Lesnar vs. HHH III - ***1/2
Lesnar vs. Punk - ****3/4


----------



## RatedR10 (May 23, 2008)

don't know if it was discussed here but what match did people prefer from last night's Raw between Bryan-Harper and Rollins-Punk?

I thought Punk-Rollins was sloppy early and picked up in the end, but Punk looked sluggish throughout, and I say that as a big Punk fan. Rollins did a fantastic job in there and Ambrose's interactions with Punk were awesome.

Harper has just been awesome in there with Bryan and Bryan can't seem to have a bad match with anyone.


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

Just watched Lesnar/Cena again and it still holds up, Cena bled more than I remembered too. Those first few minutes aren't easy to watch. Would say it's no lower than ****1/4 - 1/2 seems about right to me.

I hardly remember Bryan/Harper, I had some distractions while watching it yesterday. Rollins/Punk turned out to be a good match IMO. Punk looked like he was having an off night with those early spots or there were simply some communication/timing issues between the two. But the last few minutes were great. I'd love to see them have another match in the near future with some extra time, they could easily have a great match.


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

Just watched Cesaro vs. Regal from NXT and it is pretty good. I guess everybody has probably read all about it right now. But yeah, great selling by both men, quality storytelling etc. I don't care if Cesaro never makes it to holding the major World title (though hopefully one day he does) but if he could just be more prominently featured on TV with 10+ minute matches, I would be very happy.

I suppose everybody is out for new year celebrations, it's already 4pm Wednesday here. 2014 is so overrated guys. 

Seriously though, 2013 was an excellent year for quality matches. Hopefully 2014 follows on in similar fashion.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Just watched Ziggler vs. Del Rio at Payback. ****1/2 Just great storytelling. From Del Rio's shots to the head to Ziggler selling the concussion and kicks to Del Rio's display of heelish aggression to Ziggler's babyface never-say-die attitude, this was just a great match to watch with an incredibly done double turn.

Anyway. here's my top 10 favorite matches of 2013:

1. CM Punk vs. Brock Lesnar - WWE Summerslam: ****3/4
2. CM Punk vs. The Undertaker - Wrestlemania 29: ****1/2
3. Dolph Ziggler vs. Alberto Del Rio - WWE Payback: ****1/2
4. John Cena vs. CM Punk - WWE Raw 2/25/13: ****1/2
5. John Cena vs. Daniel Bryan - WWE Summerslam: ****1/4
6. Sami Zayn vs. Antonio Cesaro - WWE NXT 8/22/13: ****1/4
7. The Shield vs. Team Hell No and The Undertaker - WWE Raw 4/22/13: ****1/4
8. Alberto Del Rio vs. Christian - WWE Summerslam: ****
9. John Cena vs. Mark Henry - WWE Money in the Bank: ****
10. Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan - WWE Raw 12/16/13: ****


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Happy new year folks 

gonna watch Brock/Angle Iron man for the first time in a bit, maybe rewatch Lesnar/Rock too


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Happy new year everyone!

Brock vs. Cena - ****1/4
Brock vs. HHH I - **
Brock vs. HHH II - **1/2
Brock vs. HHH III - Didn't watch 8*D Maybe tonight?
Brock vs. Punk - ****1/2. Might be even more, but too much Heyman interference.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Happy New Year's to everyone who isn't living on the West Coast! :side:

Brock vs. Cena - **** 1/2
Brock vs. HHH I - *** 1/2
Brock vs. HHH II - ** (Only watched once and didn't like it much)
Brock vs. HHH III - Haven't watched
Brock vs. Punk - **** 1/2
Bork's screaming - ***** :brock


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Brock vs. HHH III - ****. Actually a lot of fun, they finally figured out that working at a snails pace wasn't fun and didn't create teh dramaz they were hoping for. Funny moment where Triple H has Brock in the figure four and they both start slapping at each other like little girls :lmao Also not sure why Brock hit a random F-5 three minutes in but I can't complain, was a sweet match,


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

I've been going through a list of all the career matches of the Undertaker, and at the start of 2001, I already have written down 100 matches I want to watch...


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

*BORK vs. Cena - ****3/4
BORK vs. Hunter I - ****1/2
BORK vs. Punk - ****1/2*
*BORK primal scream - ****1/2
REIGNS primal scream - ***********

I'm one of about 2 people who actually likes the Trips Summerslam match. Love it actually. I can't comment on the other 2 in the series though since I need to watch them again. I remember liking ER much better than the Mania bout. Both are on the list, I'll watch them soon. 


Arrive. BORK. MOTYC. Leave. $$$

:brock :brock :brock :brock :brock


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I'm one of the few people who enjoyed the entirety of the Hunter trilogy period :HHH2

vs Cena - *****
vs HHH I - ***3/4
vs HHH II - ***1/4
vs HHH III - ****
vs Punk - ****3/4


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

vs Cena - ****1/2 - I admit it has gone down a tad.
vs HHH I - ***3/4
vs HHH II - ***
vs HHH III - * - I just cannot deal with the apparant 'story' being told, one star for Brock and his selling., but hey i have only seen it once, live 
vs Punk - ****3/4


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

2013 PPV sucked quite a lot. Let's hope this year can produce the goods on the shows people are paying for while still maintaining the same TV quality as last. 

:cena2 vs. rton2 kicking us off. Make of that what you will lol.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Brock vs.

Cena ***3/4
Hunter I **
Hunter II **1/4
Hunter III tl;dw
Punk ***3/4


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Why so low on Cena/Punk matches? I was expecting low Trips matches since they're like marmite but most people seem to enjoy the other ones. Surprising.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

I just... don't see it. The Cena match had TWO unnecessary ref bumps that took away, and the Punk match... I don't know, I can't put my fingers on it. I guess because it was a "normal" match, not the BROCK mayhem. I enjoyed some TV matches way more.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle (Dec 10, 2006)

The HHH Brock cage match is the worst of the HHH matches.

Any mystique Brock had left was killed in that match.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

That's fair. The ending of the Cena match infuriates me but I still adore everything up to the finish. The Punk match had a little too much Heyman interference that brought it down a bit and the story was also too focused on Punk/Heyman rather than Punk/Brock but it's still fantastic. I love the story of the Trips Summerslam match and the whole accidental stumbling upon the stomach injury bit is wonderful. 

I'm with you on the TV stuff though. It definitely put PPV to shame in 2013. I'm hoping that this year we get a nice mixture of both.

Annnndddddd the first Brock/HHH discussion of 2014 in 3...2...1...


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Cynical Miracle said:


> The HHH Brock cage match is the worst of the HHH matches.
> 
> Any mystique Brock had left was killed in that match.


The way they made Brock look in that match ill never get over, yeah his selling was GOAT-worthy and all that, but the match should never have gone that way. Brock should have destroyed Triple H, esp in a fucking cage.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Bad news btw - apparently Henry is "injured", which means that the fight he had with Brock was just a way to put Brock over. In another words, there will be no Lesnar/Henry I guess 

On the plus side, we'll see Lesnar wreck havoc in the 30-Man Rumble instead :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

I do wonder what Brock will be doing at the Rumble, hopefully be a match rather than an entrant. Also, i wonder if WWE have added extra PPV dates for Brock's final year of his contract.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

ATF said:


> Bad news btw - apparently Henry is "injured", which means that the fight he had with Brock was just a way to put Brock over. In another words, there will be no Lesnar/Henry I guess
> 
> On the plus side, we'll see Lesnar wreck havoc in the 30-Man Rumble instead :mark:


Nope, he made it clear that he will not participate in the Rumble.

I think his remaining dates will probably go something like:

EC: vs Orton for the title
WM: vs Taker
SummerSlam: vs Batista
WM31: vs ROCK

If he has the Rumble in his contract, I would love it if somebody told him he has a challenge awaiting him for that show (since Henry is "injured") and when he arrives, IT'S A SHAMEFUL THING LOBSTER HEAD! hits and we get BROCK vs FELLA!


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Rewatched brock/cena before I went out last night, still holds up ***** IMO, never seen a match like it


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

This is Brock/Cena done right:






VADER :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Thanksyou Chismo. Ill have to watch that later :mark:

Oh, Sheamus/Brock - count me in!!!


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Fuck it, I'm just gonna post all of it at the same time, hopefully it doesnt get buried



> * My top 30 matches of 2013*
> 30) Goldust vs Randy Orton raw 9/13
> 
> 29) Cm Punk vs Dean Ambrose sd 12/13
> ...


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I have the same top 5 skins


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

I dig the list Skins, most of those are on mine just a different order: (you didn't like Cena/Punk Raw?)

1. CM Punk vs Brock Lesnar Summerslam *****
2. CM Punk vs The Undertaker WrestleMania ****1/2
3. Daniel Bryan vs John Cena Summerslam ****1/2
4. CM Punk vs John Cena Raw ****1/2
5. Sami Zayn vs Antonio Cesaro NXT 2/3 Falls ****1/2
6. Antonio Cesaro vs William Regal NXT ****1/4
7. Alberto Del Rio vs Christian Summerslam ****1/4
8. Dolph Ziggler vs Alberto Del Rio Payback ****1/4
9. Daniel Bryan vs Randy Orton Raw ****
10. The Shield vs Rhodes Bros Battleground ****
11. Rising Stars Money in the Bank Ladder Match ****
12. Daniel Bryan vs Seth Rollins Raw ***3/4
13. Daniel Bryan vs Antonio Cesaro Raw ***3/4
14. Antonio Cesaro vs Sheamus Main Event ***3/4
15. Seth Rollins vs John Cena Smackdown ***3/4
16. The Shield vs Rhodes Bros Raw ***3/4
17. Mark Henry vs John Cena Money in the Bank ***3/4
18. The Shield vs Super Friends Elimination Chamber ***3/4
19. Jack Swagger vs Sami Zayn NXT ***3/4
20. Sami Zayn vs Adrian Neville NXT ***3/4


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Hope they don't do Brock/Big E at Rumble..


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

smitty915 said:


> I have the same top 5 skins


:hb



Cactus Jack said:


> I dig the list Skins, most of those are on mine just a different order: (you didn't like Cena/Punk Raw?)


lol Punk/Cena raw is #3 brother, loved it


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Punk/Cena raw was number 3 on his list :lol

need to rewatch the Lesnar/Trips series later, also watched Lesnar/Angle Iron man last night for the first time, ****1/2 for me, such a good match


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

May do aswell

Never seen angle/brock, tried to but hate iron-mans with a passion


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Trust me, this ones awesome

Brock is such a :mark: heel in it

FUCK I HAVE HOMEWORK,


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I'm not much into 60-minute stuff but Bork/Angle is on a complete class of its own when it comes to Tony Stark matches _(see what I did there?)_.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> :hb
> 
> 
> lol Punk/Cena raw is #3 brother, loved it



Good lord I'm hung over :flair3

I swear to god, if they waste a Brock match on that undeserving piece of shit Langston I will flip. Henry is so much more capable and deserving than him. Langston just does not know how to fucking wrestle. He represents everything that is wrong with the current developmental system. I'd much rather see Sheamus, Ziggler, Bryan, Henry, anyone from the Shield, Cena, Punk, Orton, fuck just about ANYONE get a Brock match. If Triple H gets to have 3 subpar matches with him, I'm sure they could figure a way to have another one with Cena or Punk over giving some unprepared undeserving new guy the shot. The problem is Cena and Punk made the mistake of having perfect or near perfect matches with Lesnar the first time out, there is really no where else to go unless they do Hell in a Cell and we all know THAT ain't happening in the current WWE.

What have you all been watching lately? I've been off of pro graps for a week or so and need some new goodies to watch.

Edit-Skins, I know you're not in to really really long matches, but Lesnar/Angle IronMan stands alone among the 60 minute Ironmans. The time just flies by, Brock is such a pure heel in that match, as good as Angle is in it, Brock's antics and character just make that thing a work of art. That match represents the best of what an Ironman can be. I was actually thinking the other day, if Bryan gets a Lesnar match, I think it would be pretty damn sweet if they made it an Ironman. In the current WWE, those are the only 2 guys I can see having that sort of contest and pulling it off. Bryan is superior to Angle is just about everyday imagine able (drug and alcohol intake aside :lmao) that I could see them topping the 2003 effort.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

HAPPY NEW YEAR EVERYONE!

What better way to start the new year than reliving the previous year? I'm gonna check out all them amazing TV matches that 2013 brought us, starting with Punk/Cena. Wow, hard to believe it's almost been a year since it took place.

EDIT: Actually, I'm starting with Ziggler/Cena from 1/7/13.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Cactus Jack said:


> Good lord I'm hung over :flair3
> 
> What have you all been watching lately? I've been off of pro graps for a week or so and need some new goodies to watch.
> 
> Edit-Skins, I know you're not in to really really long matches, but Lesnar/Angle IronMan stands alone among the 60 minute Ironmans. The time just flies by, Brock is such a pure heel in that match, as good as Angle is in it, Brock's antics and character just make that thing a work of art. That match represents the best of what an Ironman can be. I was actually thinking the other day, if Bryan gets a Lesnar match, I think it would be pretty damn sweet if they made it an Ironman. In the current WWE, those are the only 2 guys I can see having that sort of contest and pulling it off. Bryan is superior to Angle is just about everyday imagine able (drug and alcohol intake aside :lmao) that I could see them topping the 2003 effort.





ATF said:


> I'm not much into 60-minute stuff but Bork/Angle is on a complete class of its own when it comes to Tony Stark matches _(see what I did there?)_.





smitty915 said:


> Trust me, this ones awesome
> 
> Brock is such a :mark: heel in it


No worries, we all had a rough night 

See my probelm isnt the match quality, I know its probably good match, my problem is I have ADD when watching wrestling and barely handle 25+ min matches unless HEAVILY invested


Watching hhh/brock mania, HHH really thinks he is similar to hbk and flair :ti


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Thought I'd do a quick top 10 for 2013! 

1: CM Punk vs Brock Lesnar(****3/4) 
2: Dolph Ziggler vs ADR(****1/2
3: John Cena vs CM Punk(****1.2)
4: Undertaker vs CM Punk(****1/2)
5: John Cena vs Daniel Bryan(****1/2)
6: Antonio Cesaro vs Sami Zayn 2/3 falls(****1/2)
7: Rhodes Bros/Shield BG(****1/4)
8: WHC MITB( ****)
9: Cena/Henry MITB (****)
10: Randy Orton/DB RAW 12/13(****) 

Decent year bama


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

SKINS25 said:


> No worries, we all had a rough night
> 
> See my probelm isnt the match quality, I know its probably good match, my problem is I have ADD when watching wrestling and barely handle 25+ min matches unless HEAVILY invested
> 
> ...



Triple H, at his absolute PEAK in 2000, isn't even close to being as good as Shawn or Flair at their absolute worst. I will never understand why Flair, Foley, Eddie and everyone sings Hunters praises as such a great worker all the time. Foley, in his book, actually made it sound like Hunter was better than he ever could be. I don't get it. Maybe since I'm not actually in the ring I am missing something. Personally, I'll take blue sweat pants Foley at his worst over Hunter at his best. Maybe I'm just biased.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

top 5 is the same (same ratings although full 5 for punk/brock and a ****1/4 for zayn/cesaro)

nice to see henry/cena get the love it deserves, #8 for me


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

See actually I dont dislike hunter nearly as much as most ( I know you hate him). I just find him for what he is billed to be a bit overrated, and find it funny if all the burial/ego stuff is true has he could think so highly of himself 

I will say his 00 year is extremely overrated and his best year(s) in ring was 04-05


sorry for DP


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I totally understand and agree with the billing of overrated he gets, but I don't hate him either tbh. I know that, when he's in his game (pun intended, yes), he can pull off quite the feats. It's not an unknown story that he was one of the very, very few guys that pulled off a not bad singles match out of Khali in example.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Which was the more better regarded Yokozuna/Taker Casket Match? Royal Rumble '94 or SvS '94?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Nobody was good in 2005. Nobody except Eddie and Benoit.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Nobody was good in 2005. Nobody except Eddie and Benoit.


Give it up, will ya.

Everyone was good in 2005 and the crazy thing is, Benoit was not even one of the top workers that year although I blame that more on his lackluster list of opponents.

Eddie, Benoit, Taker, HHH, Mysterio, Flair, Orton, Christian, Jericho, JBL, HBK, Edge and I can go on.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Nobody was good in 2005. Nobody except Eddie and Benoit.












Rey, HBK, HHH, FLAIR, Edge, Jericho, Christian, Batista, HHH, and Shelton Benjamin all were great as well


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

You all are right, Hunter not only pulled out a good Khali match, he pulled out a barbaric MASTERPIECE with Batista at Vengeance 2005, when Batista couldn't work to save his life. The only other person to pull a great match out of Dave that year was none other than Eddie, so Hunter definitely deserves props for that.

My thing is, I just hate how guys like Christian, Jericho, Eddie, Benoit, etc, guys who Hunter isn't even fit to hold their jocks when it comes to ring work, got held down just so Triple H could stay on top and put on crappy matches year after year after year. The turning point for my Hunter hate was 2006, when Edge was easily the hottest heel going, the only guy that was getting Cena cheered, and yet Edge gets dropped from the WWE title picture just so Hunter could pick up the mania check. You can't convince me that Edge holding the title from nYr06' and dropping it back to Cena at Mania wouldn't be a better program for all involved. I'm not even a big fan of Edge. Luckily forcing Edge out of the title program lit a fire in him and he ended up having probably the best match of his career with Mick at mania and then another classic at ONS.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

yea your on your own there FF


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> The turning point for my Hunter hate was 2006, when Edge was easily the hottest heel going, the only guy that was getting Cena cheered, and yet Edge gets dropped from the WWE title picture just so Hunter could pick up the mania check. You can't convince me that Edge holding the title from nYr06' and dropping it back to Cena at Mania wouldn't be a better program for all involved. I'm not even a big fan of Edge. Luckily forcing Edge out of the title program lit a fire in him and he ended up having probably the best match of his career with Mick at mania and then another classic at ONS.


Did you check out Jericho's podcast with Edge as guest? There's two of them and both are worth listening. He goes through his whole career and they get to this part specifically. Hunter seemingly didn't want Edge as a main eventer but he had the briefcase and gave the cash-in/3 week reign idea and told them he'll do as good as he can. He got fans to cheer Cena and pretty much established his main event status for post-WM. Hunter/Cena was always the plan for WM22, Edge just happened to prove himself and thankfully, he got what he deserved after Mania while Foley helped keep his momentum for WM. He said only Vince from the higher-ups really backed him and that was what mattered.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Did you check out Jericho's podcast with Edge as guest? There's two of them and both are worth listening. He goes through his whole career and they get to this part specifically. Hunter seemingly didn't want Edge as a main eventer but he had the briefcase and gave the cash-in/3 week reign idea and told them he'll do as good as he can. He got fans to cheer Cena and pretty much established his main event status for post-WM. Hunter/Cena was always the plan for WM22, Edge just happened to prove himself and thankfully, he got what he deserved after Mania while Foley helped keep his momentum for WM. He said only Vince from the higher-ups really backed him and that was what mattered.



Damn I haven't heard those yet I'll have to check them out. I loved the ones Jericho did with Austin, and even though Edge isnt one of my favorites he's always sounded really thoughtful and level headed in interviews.

My thing is though, I'm sure Hunter/Cena WAS always the plan for 22, but damn why not change things up? It's not like they couldn't go back to it at a later date, Edge was hot back then and more importantly he was new to the main even scene. Obviously he still went on to a HoF worthy career, but still, it's hard not to wonder if things would have been different for him and Jericho if Hunter wasn't always in Vince's ear about how they weren't "top guys". Plus, that WM22 match downright sucked, as overrated as most of the Cena/Edge matches are, I have a hard time believing they couldn't have topped it, easily.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

what your gonna do you know, there is always as Punk said a "glass ceiling" those the wwe are higher will go over it, and those they arent how every good they are wouldn't

Although I dont feel bad for Edge at all, for his skills and what accomplishments he got w/ them he is should kiss the ground Vince walks on.

And tbhayley I never saw Benoit as a perinatal main eventer, he had his glorious 04 run and that was it


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> Damn I haven't heard those yet I'll have to check them out. I loved the ones Jericho did with Austin, and even though Edge isnt one of my favorites he's always sounded really thoughtful and level headed in interviews.
> 
> My thing is though, I'm sure Hunter/Cena WAS always the plan for 22, but damn why not change things up? It's not like they couldn't go back to it at a later date, Edge was hot back then and more importantly he was new to the main even scene. Obviously he still went on to a HoF worthy career, but still, it's hard not to wonder if things would have been different for him and Jericho if Hunter wasn't always in Vince's ear about how they weren't "top guys". Plus, that WM22 match downright sucked, as overrated as most of the Cena/Edge matches are, I have a hard time believing they couldn't have topped it, easily.


Not really bothered by it. Hunter/Cena is a match people wanted to see back then (they had a stare down backstage around Homecoming time and it got a big pop) and as the #1 draw for the show, it did good numbers. I also enjoy the match itself, doubt Edge/Cena would have had such a great atmosphere had it happened instead. Nothing that bothers me because we got to see Edge/Cena more than enough times anyways. (hell, it happened three times in the space of two weeks BEFORE WM)

The podcast is definitely fun to listen to. Edge talks about how he wanted nothing to do with the MITB ladder match when the idea was pitched but Kane (referred to as Glenn), Jericho and Benoit convinced him to do it. Original plan was Edge, Benoit and Jericho in a random triple threat because they had nothing going on but thankfully it was changed to a historic idea involving three others with no direction. They talk about Edge's favorite moments and also go through his early years as well as briefly touching on the Smackdown Six era.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> Not really bothered by it. Hunter/Cena is a match people wanted to see back then (they had a stare down backstage around Homecoming time and it got a big pop) and as the #1 draw for the show, it did good numbers. I also enjoy the match itself, doubt Edge/Cena would have had such a great atmosphere had it happened instead. Nothing that bothers me because we got to see Edge/Cena more than enough times anyways. (hell, it happened three times in the space of two weeks BEFORE WM)
> 
> The podcast is definitely fun to listen to. Edge talks about how he wanted nothing to do with the MITB ladder match when the idea was pitched but Kane (referred to as Glenn), Jericho and Benoit convinced him to do it. Original plan was Edge, Benoit and Jericho in a random triple threat because they had nothing going on but thankfully it was changed to a historic idea involving three others with no direction. They talk about Edge's favorite moments and also go through his early years as well as briefly touching on the Smackdown Six era.


That's awesome. I remember in Jericho's second book he talked about that, how it was originally supposed to be a triple threat submission match or something, and that the Chris's thought that would be retarded since Edge didn't even have a submission. The original is by far the best, none since have touched that WM21 MitB match. Just look at the quality of performers there, Shelton was probably the weakest of the bunch yet he ended up stealing it with those two massive spots.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Listening to this podcast right now while studying, really interesting stuff


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Cactus Jack said:


> That's awesome. I remember in Jericho's second book he talked about that, how it was originally supposed to be a triple threat submission match or something, and that the Chris's thought that would be retarded since Edge didn't even have a submission. The original is by far the best, none since have touched that WM21 MitB match. Just look at the quality of performers there, Shelton was probably the weakest of the bunch yet he ended up stealing it with those two massive spots.


Yeah, a submission match and they brought it up on the podcast too. But they're way off because Edge DID use the modified Sharpshooter he called the Edgecator or something like that. Hell, he had even utilized it in some of his matches prior to WM21.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Cactus Jack said:


> Triple H, at his absolute PEAK in 2000, isn't even close to being as good as Shawn or Flair at their absolute worst.


Nahhhh, Michaels and Flair at their worst were fucking horrible. Like 'worst wrestler in the company' horrible. Trip at his worst was worse them at their worst, but at his best HHH was very good. HHH was better in 2000 than Michaels probably was the entire comeback run.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Nobody was good in 2005. Nobody except Eddie and Benoit.


Rey, Matt Hardy, MNM, Taker, Orton, Christian were all good. And Orlando muthafuckin' Jordan, duh.



Cactus Jack said:


> The turning point for my Hunter hate was 2006, when Edge was easily the hottest heel going, the only guy that was getting Cena cheered, and yet Edge gets dropped from the WWE title picture just so Hunter could pick up the mania check. You can't convince me that Edge holding the title from nYr06' and dropping it back to Cena at Mania wouldn't be a better program for all involved.


I pretty much hate seeing Edge's face at this point, but yeah, I agree, he probably should have been the Champion going into it. Then again Cena wouldn't have got anywhere near as big a rub for beating Edge than he did beating HHH clean.


----------



## sharkboy22 (Feb 13, 2010)

HHH/Edge was best for business. 

Besides, Edge got to work with Foley which was the much better move. That match solidified Edge as a main event player. Also, I could be wrong, but I think Foley has even said that it was his best Mania match.


----------



## TheLegendKiller21 (Aug 15, 2006)

I, like most of you, have been rewatching some of the best matches from 2013 and let me say that it is a travesty that Cena/Punk from Raw before Mania isn't undoubtedly MOTY. If it wasn't gonna be Punk/Lesnar, this match deserves it. It had everything and can't speak enough on the chemistry Cena and Punk seem to have with one another. Brilliant counter wrestling just based off the fact that they've wrestled in so many big matches. 

The drama is high, even though it was clear what was going to happen they still made it such an entertaining match. Heel Punk is just legendary, the countout victory spot was done so much better than his Streak Match. Punks continued countering of the five moves of doom (ducking a shoulder block, rolling the sitout slam into the Anaconda Vice, straight kick on the Five Knuckle Shuffle) made it so much more realistic. Seriously even by kayfabe standards its ridiculous when a guy throws that wild punch at Cena just so he can hit his own move.

I digress, and just when you don't know how they're going to end the match Punk pulls out the PILEDRIVER. I totally forgot about this until it happened on the rewatch and it was such a fantastic spot to see. And just to add a little more psycology to the end Cena pulls out the most sloppy hurricanrana in history which shocks and disorients Punk and boom AA, match.

*Cole:* I wonder what The Rock is thinking about this match?

Uhh probably that he will not be able to top it and stink out the joint at WM?

Oh wait, Slammys MOTY....

Bullshit


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

I absolutely adore Hunter's 99-01 run. Every word praising it is futile, we all know it. For example, Bret > > > Hunter, but I find Hunter's peak better than Bret's. But Bret was consistently great, something Hunter didn't manage to achieve. The HBK series happened, bunch of mediocrity. 2003, 2004, I'll pass. And so on... Were there any good, even great matches after the peak? Sure, he busted out a four star match every year or two (Hardy '08, two Flairs and Batista in '05, few Benoits in '04, Orton LMS in '07, Taker at WM 27), but that was just him reminding us how great he was. There was also bunch of good stuff that for some reason gets ****+ shurikens on these boards, but w/e. Overall, Triple H = good wrestler.



Cactus Jack said:


> I will never understand why Flair, Foley, Eddie and everyone sings Hunters praises as such a great worker all the time. Foley, in his book, actually made it sound like Hunter was better than he ever could be. I don't get it.


Are you seriously asking that? C'mon, eh? All those guys were/are certified ass kissers, especially Foley and Flair. I appreciate Foley's career and what he did to entertain us, but he was a bonafide idiot turned crybaby.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35 (Jan 13, 2008)

The talk of Lesnar/Punk is putting me in the mood to watch it for probably the 14th time. I have it at five stars, it'll likely hold up.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

BROCK

all I have to say considering the current topic in here isn't fun.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

I would like to have Lesnar/Punk at the full 5, but its missing something that matches like Foley/Trips and HBK/Taker have, still ****3/4 though


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Not even one day in 2014 has passed and we're already talking about Mr Helmsley. Dat GOAT topic.

:trips2


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Hey look, its Starcunt, the most hated mod as voted by WF!


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

King Cal said:


> Hey look, its Starcunt, the most hated mod as voted by WF!


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

fucking CAL


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

King Cal said:


> Hey look, its Starcunt, the most hated mod as voted by WF!


Really? 

:lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

King Cal said:


> Hey look, its Starcunt, the most hated mod as voted by WF!


:banderas


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Player 1: Cal
Player 2: Starbucks


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

I beat out Evolution by 1 vote. :lol I guess 7 people really hate me. Now I have to figure out who they are so I can bury them. Pretty sure every mod got voted for something.....except that useless mong QUEEN CAL. Isn't even relevant enough to get people to hate him. For shame.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Starbuck said:


> I beat out Evolution by 1 vote. :lol I guess 7 people really hate me. Now I have to figure out who they are so I can bury them. Pretty sure every mod got voted for something.....except that useless mong QUEEN CAL. Isn't even relevant enough to get people to hate him. For shame.


I'm betting 10 dollars on seven butthurt Punk marks. 8*D


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I voted for ya Starry .


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Choke2Death said:


> I'm betting 10 dollars on seven butthurt Punk marks. 8*D


7 people actually took the time to officially declare their hate for me. It's gotta be Punk marks :lol.

And to think, last year I was voted nicest member or something like that. 

Heel turn = success.

Cal, all these little pet names you're giving me are starting to get very concerning all things considered.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'm working on next year's new category of creepiest member 8*D.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Pretty sure the AJ marks have that title locked up Cal


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Hey, I'm an AJ mark too. I'll have to step it up a bit though...


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Starbuck gets 100 votes from me for dat HUNTER love :mark:

Cal's fine. His PPV rambles are GOAT.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Brye > KillaCal = Starbuck. Nothing against the other two. Brye is just the second best poster in this forum. :woolcock is #1.

EDIT: I just watched Mark Henry carry X-Pac and Chyna to a great three minute match. Is there anything this man can't do?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

SI is almost too intelligent for most to comprehend. There is my ass kissing for the day.

He'll thank me when we chat next time about how amazing Hashimoto vs Regal is. Or that time he finally tells me how he feels about Danielson vs Jacobs from Unscripted III.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

For the first time ever, I actually watched the entire HBK vs Bret Hart ironman match without a pause in-between! Wow, I can't believe it, but that's officially out of my "to do" list now and I'll likely never go through it again. 

Not as horrible as some make it out to be but it a giant waste of time for a huge portion. First 30 minutes has about 2-3 minutes of action and everything else is one giant resthold that never seems to end. Slowly builds up towards the last 10 minutes which was actually pretty enjoyable and understandably, the crowd came to life.

★★¼


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

One of my least favorite matches in wrestling. 

This reminds me of how I need to watch Brock vs Angle Ironman. Haven't seen it since the air date.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

The Primer said:


> Been wanting to watch Taker vs Cena from 2004 for years now. Maybe tonight will finally be the night. Their stuff in 2003 is fabulous.





funnyfaces1 said:


> Brye > KillaCal = Starbuck. Nothing against the other two. Brye is just the second best poster in this forum. :woolcock is #1.
> 
> EDIT: I just watched Mark Henry carry X-Pac and Chyna to a great three minute match. Is there anything this man can't do?





Bret/HBK is weird. When I watched it at the age of like 8 I thought it was amazing. Watched it again like 3 years ago and it just didn't do anything for me.

Lesnar/Angle on the other hand is AWESOME!


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

People would think I'm more awesome if they joined years before they did. I've practically given up on here now aside from posting my rambles .


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Primer said:


> One of my least favorite matches in wrestling.
> 
> This reminds me of how I need to watch Brock vs Angle Ironman. Haven't seen it since the air date.


ROFL @ that first part. :lol With the hype WWE gives it in their shitty list, I can fully understand that sentiment. Now I can officially join the list of people calling it overrated so it's good.

If you don't have the Here Comes the Pain DVD, I uploaded the full 60 minutes for Brock/Angle the other day. Had to reupload it because first upload got blocked. If you're gonna do it now, get on it before it gets re-blocked!






Definitely the best 60 minute ironman match in WWE. Not sure between Rock/HHH and Benoit/HHH for #2. After them is Orton/Cena then Bret/HBK a distant last place.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Wasn't there a tag team Ironman match at some point?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

On Ironman matches, Lesnar/Angle is my easy number 1, with Rock/HHH #2 pretty close (although not super close where it's a tough choice between it and Lesnar/Angle). Then there's a big gap between that and #3, which is Benoit/HHH. Then Bret/HBK would be #4 and Orton/Cena is dead last. I can never see myself sitting through those last 2 ever again, and #1 is the only one I think I could sit down and watch any day and love it, without getting even slightly bored.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

King Cal said:


> People would think I'm more awesome if they joined years before they did. I've practically given up on here now aside from posting my rambles .


All you need are the same...eight or so people.



Brye said:


> Bret/HBK is weird. When I watched it at the age of like 8 I thought it was amazing. Watched it again like 3 years ago and it just didn't do anything for me.
> 
> Lesnar/Angle on the other hand is AWESOME!





Choke2Death said:


> ROFL @ that first part. :lol With the hype WWE gives it in their shitty list, I can fully understand that sentiment. Now I can officially join the list of people calling it overrated so it's good.
> 
> If you don't have the Here Comes the Pain DVD, I uploaded the full 60 minutes for Brock/Angle the other day. Had to reupload it because first upload got blocked. If you're gonna do it now, get on it before it gets re-blocked!
> 
> ...


60 minutes and it's a chore. Oh yeah. Throw in the hype behind it - a big pile of INTENSE DISLIKE.

Strong praise all across the board. I have to make time for this. Finished up RAW so I have the whole night free. Been wanting to relive Rock vs Triple H & Benoit vs HHH ones too for so long. Very lukewarm on the latter considering it was a struggle watching the Vengeance 2004 match. Not sure I'm into 60 minutes of Triple H. Even w/Benoit being his opponent.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I do need a refresher for Rock/HHH myself. Remember enjoying it but don't recall anything at this moment other than the finish with the never ending interferences.

I like Benoit/HHH ironman much more than their Vengeance match. I still like the latter but it felt kinda dull because it was like they were both going through the motions. The ironman does follow a similar formula in a way but it is much more fun to watch and 60 minutes (50 actually due to commercials) go by fast. I have that one in good quality up on youtube as well. CAL posted it then I transferred it to YT.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Just the thought of Brock becoming WWE Champion is :mark:

But I don't know how a Orton/Brock match would work if Orton retains.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The thought of Orton/BROCK is :mark: all day long.

If Orton retains and Brock goes on to face Undertaker, I can see them randomly have Taker's gong play when Brock looks to win which distracts him long enough to lose. Don't know where to go from there but they could come up with something stupid like Taker not liking the fact Brock is spoiled and didn't earn a title shot plus the fact he walked out ten years ago or some bullshit like that. We all know only the match quality matters!



On another note, I just watched my second FLAIR / STEAMBOAT match, this one being WrestleWar. It's still not my type of wrestling match but I like how they get me into the action as it builds up. Starts off slow, almost like the Bret/HBK ironman but with more action and then really picks up halfway through. JR is so different here compared to his Attitude Era-onwards years. Almost didn't recognize him.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

I'd be all for Brock being Champion if he were to sign full time, which I doubt is happening. Just my opinion.

The thought of him as Champion though is :mark::mark::mark:.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Got to be in the right mood for the Benoit Ironman, but it'll be watched eventually.

Brock vs Cena for the Championship almost feels like a lock to me.

And Flair vs Steamboat WrestleWar is great. Although, it's my least favorite of their '89 trilogy. Not like that's a slight. Only prefer the fast paced Chi-Town Rumble & perfection 2/3 falls over the finale.


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

Brock vs. Orton would be interesting to watch, so I wouldn't mind watching it. I remember watching their match in 2002 and thought that it was fun with the time it got. Now that Orton is established, Brock vs. Orton could be good.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

If Cena wins the title at Royal Rumble that's gonna make me :lmao so hard at the booking of Orton.


----------



## Gretchen (Jun 17, 2013)

I'd be pretty annoyed if Cena faced Brock and beat him again. I guess I'd be fine w/ the match if Brock were to get his win back.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's basically like that already. 

The match that could be in place right now isn't appealing. Who would be the face? Orton? lolwhat? On so many factors. Waste of time b/c he's full blown heel again & he can't work babyface anymore. I still see this being the plant to have Cena vs Brock where Brock gets his win back. Yes, I'm sold on WWE putting the strap on him. Look at the shit last year. Anything goes w/the company come WM time. I can assume bold, nutty scenarios like this and feel 50/50 on it.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Still need to see the 2/3 falls match, that's Clash of the Champions, right?



William Murderface said:


> If Cena wins the title at Royal Rumble that's gonna make me :lmao so hard at the booking of Orton.


That would be so pointless and would kill all my enthusiasm in the product right now. But I hope they are better than that. I predict Orton to retain because all this build in the past few months would be for nothing if he lost and got dumped into a random midcard match at WM. Not to mention, when Heyman tweeted the first hint of Brock hunting gold, he specifically mentioned Orton. If they wanted to make it unpredictable, they would've had him tweet it the day before during the TLC when both Cena and Orton were fighting for the titles. Plus it would be pointless to hot potato the title again since if Cena/Brock II is the plan, they could've just had Cena unify the titles in the first place. Also Brock will be the default face at EC because it's in his hometown.

This could only go two ways. Absolutely fucking awesome (Orton retains) or dreadful (lolCenawins).


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yep, Clash of the Champions.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Cena winning wouldn't be so lame if Orton has had the title the whole time since SummerSlam, but since the title has changed hands and then became vacant it makes everything with Orton so pointless.

The whole WWE Title picture is so fucked right now it's ridiculous.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS (Jun 5, 2010)

Does anybody think that if the triple threat Ladder Match actually happened at ER in 2013, it would have been a very strong candidate for MOTY?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Yeah, the WWE Title picture is dreadful right now. You have Orton as the champion, only a bit less dull than he's been for the past 4 years, and then you have Cena, the challenger... and yeah, I ain't rooting for him over Orton. So right now my interest in the title scene is naught. I'll hope Orton retains because I like him a lot more than Cena, and if he retains there's a stronger possibility Punk wins the Rumble, but I won't cry or bitch if Cena ends up winning the title. I've grown so numb to his wins and after the Sandow match shit, I don't even think I could bring myself to care if Cena beat Punk at this point.

On the other hand, my interest in the product right now is held up by Brock just coming back, Batista coming back in a few weeks, Bryan joining the Wyatts which is a very interesting turn in the storyline (which will obviously lead to Bryan breaking off from them later on), whatever Punk is doing, and despite him doing absolutely nothing of worth for months, whatever Sandow is doing (which will probably continue to be nothing of worth, but I'll keep my fingers crossed). Not to mention with it being Mania time, Taker will be returning within the next couple of months which is always awesome. Then you have the Rumble match itself, which is reason alone to order the PPV, and with the possibility of Punk winning the Rumble, I am really looking forward to that (although since Batista's return has been announced, my money is on Batista winning, which I'm cool with if it leads to Brock/Batista for the title at Mania 30).


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

swagger_ROCKS said:


> Does anybody think that if the triple threat Ladder Match actually happened at ER in 2013, it would have been a very strong candidate for MOTY?


I wanna say yes, but I also thought Team Hell No vs The Shield on PPV would be a MOTY candidate, last year on PPV was so unpredictable.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Recently, Orton has been pretty much my only reason to watch since Bryan was put in that Wyatt storyline. I'm still not sold on it but it seems like it took an interesting turn. Orton, now BROCK and soon Batista are my reasons to continue watching until Taker is added to the list when he shows up.



William Murderface said:


> Cena winning wouldn't be so lame if Orton has had the title the whole time since SummerSlam, but since the title has changed hands and then became vacant it makes everything with Orton so pointless.
> 
> The whole WWE Title picture is so fucked right now it's ridiculous.


Yeah, the vacant angle was so dumb, should have never been done in the first place. They could've had the same non-finishes to the PPV matches WITH Orton as champion instead of breaking it in two.

Still loving the title scene right now with it being a OVW reunion of sorts should Batista join in soon.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS (Jun 5, 2010)

Yeah, Brock is making the outcome for the title match a bit more interesting. Orton has suffered from matches with good in ring quality on his part with severely anticlimactic endings. Except his match with Cody, GD, and his recent match with DB which were big matches as far as I can remember. And all were good watches imo.



> I wanna say yes, but I also thought Team Hell No vs The Shield on PPV would be a MOTY candidate, last year on PPV was so unpredictable.


Was nice, thought it deserved more time thou. Still made the best of what they go thou.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Let us not be too shocked the Hell No vs Shield match that was on par w/that quality happened on TV following the PPV. 2013 in a nutshell.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The fact that the Title isn't on Punk or Bryan or the fact they aren't even in the picture is shear stupidity.

You know once they get thrown back in the mix it will become exciting and relevant again.


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

swagger_ROCKS said:


> Does anybody think that if the triple threat Ladder Match actually happened at ER in 2013, it would have been a very strong candidate for MOTY?


Wait, which triple threat ladder match?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Ziggler vs Swagger vs Del Rio.

The match was signed before Ziggler got his concussion.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS (Jun 5, 2010)

:bryan should really be established as a WWE champ in a title reign atm, I agree. I'm guessing they didn't want to waste a strong Orton heel run and give DB a strong title chase. WWE can't drop DB, he's far too over, like disturbingly over.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I'm convinced Bryan's time will come after WM. He will definitely not get dropped. That said, I still think he should be the guy to defeat HHH at WM and not Punk. It will only be okay if HBK agrees to return for a match with Bryan.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

But they did waste an Orton heel run. He's better than what he was from late 2011 - August of 2013, but he's still a shadow of his former self. He's champion, meanwhile every other guy capable of main eventing are in a better position than him. Said it before, Seth Rollins is often in higher profile matches than Orton is.

This new Danielson angle is interesting, but a clear sign to thrust him on the backburner during the Road to WM. Which is a total farce. Looking like Danielson vs Wyatt is set for Mania, instead of Danielson getting the "big time match" either for the championship or vs Triple H.


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Ziggler vs Swagger vs Del Rio.
> 
> The match was signed before Ziggler got his concussion.


Damn I had forgotten about that, I was really bummed when it didn't happen. Could have been a good contender for MOTY, sure.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS (Jun 5, 2010)

Choke2Death said:


> I'm convinced Bryan's time will come after WM. He will definitely not get dropped. That said, I still think he should be the guy to defeat HHH at WM and not Punk. It will only be okay if HBK agrees to return for a match with Bryan.


I would be fine either way. I still lean more towards Punk thou because of 2011. And Punk hasn't even emptied half his tank of what he could dish out to HHH in a promo at this given time. But regardless of promos, I think would be at his A game in a feud with a big dog like HHH like in 2011.



> But they did waste an Orton heel run. He's better than what he was from late 2011 - August of 2013, but he's still a shadow of his former self. He's champion, meanwhile every other guy capable of main eventing are in a better position than him. Said it before, Seth Rollins is often in higher profile matches than Orton is.


Yeah, that's pretty clear with guys like Punk and DB MEing most events over him. WWE logically knows what's up.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Primer said:


> But they did waste an Orton heel run. He's better than what he was from late 2011 - August of 2013, but he's still a shadow of his former self. He's champion, meanwhile every other guy capable of main eventing are in a better position than him. Said it before, Seth Rollins is often in higher profile matches than Orton is.


I think you're exaggerating the "midcard champion" thing and am not even speaking as a fan. He's still closed every PPV ever since he reentered the main event and has been given more mic time than his entire face run combined. Even when HHH ran Raw a decade ago there would be many shows where other talent were in the main event slots so it's not a first time thing.

The Big Show feud was a complete mess that no one cared for which is why so many times you had The Shield, Bryan and others close most Raws then. Post-SummerSlam until Survivor Series, you would've been 100% right because despite being champion, Orton always had his matches in the middle of the show and Bryan/Shield closed but since Survivor Series, he's been featured more prominently consistently.



swagger_ROCKS said:


> I would be fine either way. I still lean more towards Punk thou because of 2011. And Punk hasn't even emptied half his tank of what he could dish out to HHH in a promo at this given time. But regardless of promos, I think would be at his A game in a feud with a big dog like HHH like in 2011.


The thing with Punk is, all signs point to him being done once his contract runs out. He seems to be completely out of it and other than the match with Lesnar, he hasn't done much since returning that can be above "mailing it in". So there's not much point in putting him over if the tank is almost empty. Besides, him and HHH did settle their differences in 2011 when they teamed up against Miz and R-Truth. The angle went out of control but at least there was some conclusion of sorts. Bryan, on the other hand, got screwed at HIAC and suddenly went a completely different direction. Thinking about it, I can fully understand the backlash from fans at shows who intentionally chanted for him. It's like WWE tried to Zack Ryder him by phasing him out of everyone's mind but with Bryan, there's no stoppin' him..


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Not really. Being champion should & usually is about emphasis. Orton isn't emphasized except for the phrase "face of the WWE" being blurted out by The Authority. Which is a weak cop out to make it feel as if he does matter. When in reality, he doesn't. Main eventing PPVs isn't hard when his opponents have been Cena & Danielson. When it was Big Show, it showed how that was a scenario that didn't feel like a WWE Championship program and it backfired BIG TIME. This run has mostly felt like a way to give Orton some limelight w/o really wanting to use him much. Like a way to keep him content while focusing on other aspects of the company seem to be larger in the pecking order.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS (Jun 5, 2010)

Choke2Death said:


> The thing with Punk is, all signs point to him being done once his contract runs out. He seems to be completely out of it and other than the match with Lesnar, he hasn't done much since returning that can be above "mailing it in". So there's not much point in putting him over if the tank is almost empty. Besides, him and HHH did settle their differences in 2011 when they teamed up against Miz and R-Truth. The angle went out of control but at least there was some conclusion of sorts. Bryan, on the other hand, got screwed at HIAC and suddenly went a completely different direction. Thinking about it, I can fully understand the backlash from fans at shows who intentionally chanted for him. It's like WWE tried to Zack Ryder him by phasing him out of everyone's mind but with Bryan, there's no stoppin' him..


Oh damn, it's getting to that point? I do think he's looking more and more out of it the more time goes on. I honestly wouldn't fault him for leaving if his money is right. If your body can't take it anymore, cut your losses.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Primer said:


> Not really. Being champion should & usually is about emphasis. Orton isn't emphasized except for the phrase "face of the WWE" being blurted out by The Authority. Which is a weak cop out to make it feel as if he does matter. When in reality, he doesn't. Main eventing PPVs isn't hard when his opponents have been Cena & Danielson. When it was Big Show, it showed how that was a scenario that didn't feel like a WWE Championship program and it backfired BIG TIME. This run has mostly felt like a way to give Orton some limelight w/o really wanting to use him much. Like a way to keep him content while focusing on other aspects of the company seem to be larger in the pecking order.


I guess you can look at it that way but for me, I feel they've been doing well enough with him as the handpicked champion. He may not be prominent as top heel the way he was in 2009 but save for the last two weeks which were throwaway shows, he's gotten consistent TV time. Plus he did beat Cena fair and square at TLC and they don't just give it away for people they aren't dedicating to pushing. 



swagger_ROCKS said:


> Oh damn, it's getting to that point? I do think he's looking more and more out of it the more time goes on. I honestly wouldn't fault him for leaving if his money is right. If your body can't take it anymore, cut your losses.


Yeah, he looks in worse shape than he was earlier this year, we keep hearing about him working hurt, his performances have been extra sloppy and just the other day he tweeted that he's sick of traveling which suggests this is the last we see of him as a full-timer at least. Heard his contract ends in Spring so Mania is probably the last we see of him for a while because he will likely take some time off to properly rest up. And since he isn't the partying, drinking kind, I assume he's saved up enough to live jobless for at least a few years.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Cena's so strong he can lose a ladder match after being handcuffed & still smell like a rose. That's why it was a TLC match. Orton didn't get the chance to pin him clean, so it was easy to pass on by. Hell, the company put Dolph Ziggler over Cena in a ladder match last year. The cop outs are everywhere within the company.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Good ol' Cody telling others to avoid talking about overused topics yet convening in another discussion of rton2. Why aren't you spending your time talking about Al Snow or Eddie Gilbert?

Finished my top 150 matches list of 2013 for the WWE. 150 may be a big number, but I did include NXT into the equation which inflated things quite a bit. It does help that there's so much programming today, but this year has still been impressive in terms of match quality. What's even scarier is that there are still A LOT of omissions I had to make here. As you could tell from Cody's list of worthwhile matches from this year, the list could extend even further to well above 200.

Right now I'm gonna post #150-101. If you're wondering what these matches translate to in terms of star ratings, they're in the *****-****1/4* range.



Spoiler: 150-101



150. Chris Jericho vs. Jack Swagger (3/15)
149. Sheamus vs. Damien Sandow (6/28)
148. Randy Orton/Sheamus vs. Big Show/Mark Henry (4/19)
147. Chris Jericho vs. Bray Wyatt (5/1)
146. Tyson Kidd vs. Justin Gabriel (11/13)
145. Wyatt Family vs. Ohno/Graves/Neville (6/19)
144. Daniel Bryan vs. Seth Rollins (9/6)
143. HHH vs. Brock Lesnar (Wrestlemania)
142. Antonio Cesaro vs. Sami Zayn (5/22)
141. CM Punk/Usos vs. The Shield (12/16)
140. The Shield vs. Kingston/RVD/Ziggler (9/27)
139. Kofi Kingston vs. Antonio Cesaro (9/11)
138. Dolph Ziggler vs. Dean Ambrose (10/16)
137. Dolph Ziggler vs. Alberto Del Rio (2/1)
136. The Shield vs. The Usos (10/21)
135. Daniel Bryan/Usos vs. The Shield (9/20)
134. CM Punk vs. Alberto Del Rio (7/5)
133. Christian vs. Alberto Del Rio (8/23)
132. Dolph Ziggler vs. Alberto Del Rio (4/8)
131. Daniel Bryan vs. Randy Orton (Battleground)
130. Cody Rhodes vs. Justin Gabriel (5/9)
129. The Shield vs. Cena/Bryan/Kane (5/13)
128. Team Hell No vs. Sin Cara/Rey Mysterio (2/1)
127. The Shield vs. Team Hell No (Extreme Rules)
126. Antonio Cesaro vs. Leo Kruger vs. Sami Zayn (7/18)
125. Bo Dallas vs. Sami Zayn (10/16)
124. The Rhodes Brothers vs. Wyatts (10/11)
123. Sheamus vs. Cody Rhodes (2/6)
122. Chris Jericho vs. Miz vs. Wade Barrett (3/18)
121. Dolph Ziggler vs. Chris Jericho (4/22)
120. Langston/Rhodes/Goldust/Bryan vs. Orton/Shield (10/25)
119. Dolph Ziggler vs. Alberto Del Rio (5/6)
118. Daniel Bryan vs. Luke Harper (11/8)
117. Dolph Ziggler vs. Antonio Cesaro (12/27)
116. Wyatt Family vs. Regal/Neville/Graves (7/10)
115. Daniel Bryan vs. Randy Orton (Hell in a Cell)
114. Wyatt Family vs. Daniel Bryan (TLC)
113. Sheamus vs. Antonio Cesaro (6/14)
112. The Shield vs. Randy Orton/Daniel Bryan (Payback)
111. Adrian Neville/Corey Graves vs. Wyatt Family (7/17)
110. Alberto Del Rio vs. Jack Swagger (4/26)
109. Alberto Del Rio vs. Daniel Bryan (10/14)
108. Randy Orton vs. Rob Van Dam (9/6)
107. CM Punk vs. The Shield (TLC)
106. Randy Orton vs. Rob Van Dam (8/9)
105. The Rhodes Brothers vs. The Real Americans (10/28)
104. Alberto Del Rio vs. Damien Sandow (10/11)
103. Royal Rumble Match(Royal Rumble)
102. Adrian Neville/Oliver Grey vs. Wyatt Family (2/13)
101. Rob Van Dam vs. Chris Jericho (7/15)


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It's more of a "now issue" in regards to a dire WWE Championship picture than debating the trials & tribulations of on young master Randal. I do love Al Snow. Made a point last night on how I wished he worked vs CM Punk at least once.

I should probably put that link to my matches list back in my sig. My artrave theme won't look too out of place w/it. :hayley1

As for your list, I'd easily leave off picks like Kidd vs Gabriel _(hated it)_, Danielson vs Orton Battleground & HIAC, Cesaro vs shithead Main Event rematch b/c it was a blatant weak version that had zero of the qualities which made the original carry job so utterly mind blowing, & that lame Jericho vs Barrett vs Miz match from RAW.

Punk + crummy Samoans vs The Shield was mediocre too. Only six man tags w/them that were really any good were the ones where Henry & Danielson used their work to make 'em pop. Danielson's hot tag in the one from Smackdown made sure it couldn't be snubbed. Seriously, all the Shield matches vs those goons are exactly the same every time. So boring. Zap the fun out of wrestling. That's why I dislike the poor talent that I do. Mostly for that reason all the same. Can't stand those hacks who get their butts whipped 99% of a match, hit two moves, and then win. Especially when the formula is how it ALWAYS goes down. Cena doesn't even do that nonsense that often like how so many would lead you to believe. And whenever he does, it looks GREAT. Fits within the story seamlessly. Ach. _(not the wrestler)_ There's a reason for everything.


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

So, thoughts on Bryan joining the Wyatts? :kolo1


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Primer said:


> This new Danielson angle is interesting, but a clear sign to thrust him on the backburner during the Road to WM. Which is a total farce. Looking like Danielson vs Wyatt is set for Mania, instead of Danielson getting the "big time match" either for the championship or vs Triple H.


^Right there, pal.


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

Yep sounds about right. It's a shame really. He could've got a good WRESTLING match out of HHH instead of having to rely on DEM WEAPONS or gimmick matches.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

At this point I'm not even sure what Triple H will do. I hope nothing, unless vs someone who could use the rub. b/c, fuck this guy. He doesn't even need to work. If Brock defeats Orton for the championship I can see that being a lead in for another HHH vs Orton match come WM. :lmao

I cringed as I typed that, btw.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

The Michigan State football team celebrated their Rose Bowl victory with "Yes" chants. :yes


----------



## Kenny (Aug 15, 2004)

HHH/Orton again :lmao


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

This is the state of current WWE. Brock being here might not even be enough to save us.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

There isn't a wrestler on the roster that would get me interested for a HHH match at this point. HHH v. Bryan, Henry, Cesaro, Regal, Reigns, Goldust, Harper, Mysterio, Christian....none of them would be something I would care about seeing. None of my other favourites. Nobody.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I don't give a shit about a match either. HOWEVER, I'd be willing to compromise if Danielson got the shot only "just b/c" of the meaning behind it. Ironically, I'd be 99% sure Danielson would win too. It's all about coping w/the momentum. However, again, fuck Triple H. He doesn't deserve another high profile match - or a match period - at WM. Danielson or not. 

Danielson vs Wyatt = a more appealing match for me. Despite the lowered implications in terms of pecking order. Perhaps I can cope w/that after all. I'd give a damn about the match. I wouldn't be concerned about quality as I feel Danielson can lead Bray to something special _(I like Bray's work too) _& there isn't any fear of having to stomach more nonsense from HHH as he's already doing a decent job hiding behind backstage interviews opposed to twenty minute promos these last few weeks. Maybe it can stick.

This is a god damn Bryan Danielson topic too, btw. Not my fault the scuttlebutt & heiarchy permits me to mention chumpstain mcgee up in here.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I hope I'm not the only one who finds it personally annoying when people depict him in WWE as "Bryan Danielson" - he's Daniel Bryan, fuck :side:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

From this point forward I'm going to start using El Generico & Claudio Castagnoli too.


----------



## PGSucks (Aug 16, 2010)

Nothing like being a wrestling hipster :mark:

Still haven't gotten around to watching Tyler Black vs. uhh...Chick Magnet Punk. I'll use school as an excuse even though I had New Year's off. :side:


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yeah. I enjoy myself some Nahaje Sarkodie-Mensah work too :troll


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Nobody can unless it's a limited means tag team match. Punker & that fool vs Priceless is still a nifty match. Glad it's on the Punk DVD. Recalled liking it all those years ago and it holds up.

You know what match also happened on that RAW? Mysterio vs Bourne. I HAVE to see that again.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

By "nobody" there will surely be a lot of non-WF people out there who do enjoy his work, if just because it's fun. Like that WeAreProWrestling - they give high scores to ANYTHING that's fun, just because of that. I wonder if good for them or if they miss the point of the wonders of storytelling in wrestling :hmm:

Rey/Bourne I sorta recall only by name, though I remember Cara/Bourne fondly and that delievered. One of the few good Mistico WWE singles stuff.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Well that's b/c Mistico, while a piece of shit and vastly overrated on the whole, can actually deliver if need be. He isn't incapable. He's just no good most of the time. A frustrating element. I wasn't surprised they clicked in a four minute sprint.

Two Mysterio vs Bourne matches happened, but the 2008 one is the bout where it got around eight minutes of TV time. Plenty excited to relive it. The sub-four minute rematch on a draft show - iirc - will be watched too. Always can give these the go around tomorrow.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Well I do not think of him as a total piece of shit tbh. At least back in 05/06 he was the man. Enjoyed his stuff with Ultimo Guerrero and Tiger Mask especially. Shame they wasted his potential by rushing him to the main roster.

I actually remember Kofi/Bourne better than Rey/Bourne


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Never was a fan. Felt his ego was far too high for what his talents didn't show. He's got some neat moves, but he never put them together often enough for me to like him. Have disliked him long before coming to WWE. That match vs Mephisto from New Japan in 2009. Jeeeezus. Horrendous.

I only remember the finish to the High Energy II collision. Was only a two minute match; makes sense.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Tbh Mistico made me lose hope on a fair world where deserving guys like Averno would ever get a shot at North American mainstream success, given how much of a flop he was. Now the Sin Cara character is played by Hunico, but it just doesn't feel the same. Even if Mistico sucked monkey ass, he WAS Sin Cara. Unfortunely. Now at WM 30 it's likely we'll get Rey/Cara alright, but with Hunico under the mask, not Mistico. Not exactly the big time Lucha dream match anymore.

Anywho, I have hopes for 2014 to be a better year in PPV-side for both sides of the table, especially TNA. BFG 2012 was stellar, and 2013... was awful.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

If Brock is on old skool Raw , I would love to see a confrontation between Brock and Vader :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

ATF said:


> Tbh Mistico made me lose hope on a fair world where deserving guys like Averno would ever get a shot at North American mainstream success, given how much of a flop he was. Now the Sin Cara character is played by Hunico, but it just doesn't feel the same. Even if Mistico sucked monkey ass, he WAS Sin Cara. Unfortunely. Now at WM 30 it's likely we'll get Rey/Cara alright, but with Hunico under the mask, not Mistico. Not exactly the big time Lucha dream match anymore.
> 
> Anywho, I have hopes for 2014 to be a better year in PPV-side for both sides of the table, especially TNA. BFG 2012 was stellar, and 2013... was awful.


More like Mascara Dorada, chief. I'm not bothered by it. The stars of Lucha still have their home turf and Japan to find success in.

BFG 2012 was entertaining, but not quite stellar. Aries vs Hardy was great, tbf. Others were good _(Joe/Magnus, Aces brawl, Snow/Ryan)_ & then the rest was either there _(RVD/Ion & Street Fight)_ or bad _(tag championship & Knockouts)_ Joe vs Magnus would have a rematch the next month that RAPES the BFG match too. TNA is sticking w/their minimal PPV calendar as it is. We'll only have three PPVs to worry about in 2014 and I fear all three will be utter shit like 2013.

Unsure about WWE's venture into PPVs this year. Brock already being on one early is a good sign. Mostly depending on who he works vs. Cena being my lead in pick for the good side, obviously.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

You didn't like the Street Fight? Considering the Roode/Storm feud's longevity and heat, I thought it was spot on. Btw, did you like the Kaz & Daniels/Styles & Angle stuff?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

It was mediocre at best. Their Steel Cage match was a lot better. Even that one wasn't too great either, but at least good.

Bad Influence vs Styles/Angle clicked @ Slammiversary & on Impact. No Surrender & BFG were bad. Didn't like either of those at all. Styles vs Daniels giving the excellent Last Man Standing match at Destination X is the real highlight from that feud, tbhayley. God damn what a stellar match.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Without turning this into the TNA Thread  I loved the street fight, not as good as the Sacrifice 2007 one though.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Really? I loved the fuck out of it, 2012 TNA MOTY with Roode/Aries from Destination X right behind imo. Brutality at its fiercest, and seeing Storm get a lil' redemption was awesome. The Cage match was the one I thought was only mediocre, maybe solid. Roode's asshole performance was great, granted, but... the crowd in that show was Godfuckingawful, so much that I would hate anything on that show because of them, and granted, they woke up a little bit for this one, but just a tiny bit.

But yeah, let's not turn this into DixieMania 

... let's turn this into SCARLETTBORDEAUXMANIA instead - also known as ROH. :troll Seriously, she needs to go to the WWE, bring Maria with her, have lesbian sex with Layla, and bring Matt Taven and Bennett w/Maria with them. The latter is made for the company. And give a call to Adam Cole and Roderick Strong btw.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

William Murderface said:


> I wanna say yes, but I also thought Team Hell No vs The Shield on PPV would be a MOTY candidate, last year on PPV was so unpredictable.


Hell No & Taker vs. Shield should've been on that PPV. 

Don't think the triple threat ladder match would've even been MOTN but it would've infinitely more interesting than Swagger/Del Rio II.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

We got it anyway, which is what we can't even say regarding the Triple Threat. Shame.

ADR/Swagger II was the No DQ match on SD, and the best match of their series by far. I Quit on the PPV was a fucking DUD.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

That I Quit match gave me one more reason to hate that stipulation. After rewatching and not really liking both Cena/Orton and Cena/JBL, I think I can honestly say that the I Quit match is the second worst stipulation out there.

ADR/Swagger's other match before the No DQ one on SD was even better.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Meh, don't remember it. Not sure if interested either atm.

I Quit really depends on how good the heel guy is more than anything tbh.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Don't think i've ever watched Flair/Foley yet....


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Flair/foley LMS was great, and is the only TNA match I probably ever will see

I actually was a fan of Mistco (Sin Cara) for what its worth. I enjoyed his style, and excelled at sub 8 min sd match here and there


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

SKINS25 said:


> Flair/foley LMS was great, and is the only TNA match I probably ever will


I was talking about Summerslam 2006


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Flair/Foley I Quit was pretty great and brutal iirc. Typically not a fan of I Quit matches in general, though.


----------



## Emotion Blur (May 7, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> That I Quit match gave me one more reason to hate that stipulation. After rewatching and not really liking both Cena/Orton and Cena/JBL, *I think I can honestly say that the I Quit match is the second worst stipulation out there.*
> 
> ADR/Swagger's other match before the No DQ one on SD was even better.


First?


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

CHAIRS match is the worst imo. Or Lumberjack.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

How about the dreaded scaffold match? Or the object on a pole match?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

If we just talk about currently, practically every gimmick match is terrible .


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

I've never seen a chairs match in my life :lmao What are the rules?


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

FLUX said:


> I've never seen a chairs match in my life :lmao What are the rules?


Lowblows with chairs are not allowed. 8*D


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

It's a No DQ match... where you use chairs... except for lowblows which don't cause DQ's but apparently cause restarting issues. That's it :lmao


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

It's just a match in which chairs are legal and I can't recall a good Chairs match.

"____ on a pole" matches are awful too.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Sheamus and Big Show somehow had a good chairs match.

SHEAMUS!


----------



## Emotion Blur (May 7, 2012)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Sheamus and Big Show somehow had a good chairs match.
> 
> SHEAMUS!


Quite honestly, Sheamus and Show managed to put on quite a few good matches during their feud. On paper, goofy babyface Sheamus vs "unstoppable monster run #453453" Big Show sounded atrocious, but I remember coming out of that feud with a new-found respect for Sheamus.


----------



## WrestlingOracle (Jul 6, 2013)

What a match RVD and 2 Cold Scorpio had at living dangerously 98. Never hear this one talked about much though. Some fine chain wrestling, Scorpio knowing it would take alot to put away RVD so instead of constant lateral presses like you see after almost every impact move in a typical match, Scorpio stayed plotting his next attack only covering when he really felt RVD was out. RVD made Scorpio look like a million bucks as this was one of RVD's best sell jobs in my opinion who really did look out on several occasions. The false finishes were exciting especially after the fuckery when Sabu came in. Even little subtle things like Scorpio hitting RVD's frog splash inadvertedly on the ref and then RVD Mocking Scorpio attempting a 450 afterwards was great. Good pacing in this match as well. I thought a match of the caliber deserved RVD to end the match with the five star instead of a rollup (albeit a sweet one) but a damn solid match. Yet further evidence that from a three year period from about 1997-1999, RVD in my opinion was one of the best in ring wrestlers in america. I would have to think and list out to find where exactly but certainly somewhere in the top 10.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Top 100. Maybe.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

RVD was terrible, will never understand the love for him, so choreographed seems like I'm watching dancing w/ the stars during some of his matches


----------



## WrestlingOracle (Jul 6, 2013)

Chismo said:


> Top 100. Maybe.


We are all entitled to our opinion certainly and they carry the same weight but really? Feasably I could see from an in ring standpoint Benoit certainly, Guerrero certainly , The Hitman was still excellent, Jericho was neck and neck with RVD, Malenko if you are a Malenko guy, Rey was having weekly great matches, Regal perhaps and then you have some pretty big reaches if you look for names like Triple H, DDP and Taz. You have to remember that Austin wasn't the same until 01 post neck injury, Taker had an great year in 97 but alas not very good in 98 or 99 barring One Night Only, Angle only came on the scene in 99, Owen Hart died in 98, HBK obviously with the back injury causing temporary retirement missed alot of 98 and all of 99. I'm curious who else you think belongs above RVD at this time period in the US.


----------



## jawbreaker (May 16, 2009)

guys better than RVD in WCW:

Benoit
Guerrero
Rey
Regal
DDP
Savage
Hall
Malenko
Mongo
Meng
Kanyon
Finlay
Hennig
Jericho
Alex Wright

haven't watched as much WWF recently but RVD isn't in the same stratosphere as guys like Austin, Michaels, Undertaker, Foley, Owen, etc. And I'd call it highly unlikely that guys like Goldust were worse than RVD. Fuck, even the Hardys were having better matches on the regular in OMEGA.


----------



## YoungGun_UK (Jul 26, 2011)

With Dave :batista4 imminent return was hoping for some good 'TOP 10' or 5 Batista matches lists. Post away peeps.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Best ANIMAL matches?

Hmm, off the top of my head...

NYR 05 Chamber
HIAC 2005 vs HHH
WM23 vs Taker
Backlash 07 LMS vs Taker
HBK/Cena vs Taker/Batista NWO 07
Cyber Sunday 07 vs Taker (didn't they have a cage match, too? Can't recall whether it was good. A HIAC too I think? Can't recall.)
SD Chamber from NWO 2008 - him and Taker as the last two was :mark:

Obviously forgetting some others.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Top 10 Batista singles matches:

(****1/2)
1) vs. Taker WM23
2) vs. HHH Vengeance 05
(****1/4)
3) vs. Taker CS 07
(****)
4) vs. Taker SVS 07
5) vs. Cena SS 08
(***3/4)
6) vs. Taker BL 07
7) vs. Edge NOC 08
8) vs. HBK ONS 08
(***1/2)
9) vs. Taker SD 2007 Cage
10) vs. Eddie Guerrero NM 05

There are several good multi-man matches he's been in that would go in between some of these.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Forgot about the Summerslam 08 match against Cena. That's actually one of my personal faves. Didn't he also have a few gems with Mysterio after he turned heel?


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> HBK/Cena vs Taker/Batista NWO 07


Glad someone mentioned this. I love this match. 

DAT Taker/Tista :mark:


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Taker/Batista had great chemistry. Two big guys just beating the shit out of each other.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

The Lady Killer said:


> Forgot about the Summerslam 08 match against Cena. That's actually one of my personal faves. Didn't he also have a few gems with Mysterio after he turned heel?


TBH, don't think I've ever seen them. Didn't they have a match like every week for awhile there? Remember reading spoilers and feeling like they were always having a match for a month or so... but I'm not sure.

Taker and Batista's chemistry is off the chain. It's still funny thinking back to before WM23, when everyone was expecting the match to be shit. Then Batista lights a fire under his own ass after hearing he wouldn't be main eventing, and the two just go out there and deliver. Then they do it again at Backlash, then again in the cage (with Taker injured), then again at Cyber Sunday, then again, and again, and again. They delivered in all their matches except that fuckin' Chairs match.


----------



## jawbreaker (May 16, 2009)

The 4/12/04 Evolution tag is the only Batista match I've ever thought was very good. The Summerslam 08 match is like, actively terrible. I've never thought the Undertaker matches were any good either.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I remember next to nothing about the matches except that they took place and that I thought they were good.

Waiting for Cal/Cody to come in and show off their extensive knowledge to prove I'm not insane.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

You referred a Rey/Batista pos-heel turn gem, you might be talking about either SVS '09 or their Cage match, anything else idk


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Most of the matches everyone has listed have been very good in my opinion.

I just hope Batista comes back as awesome as he was when he left.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I'm guessing he'll be face for a while, as most big stars who return typically are, but I hope he turns heel at some point during this final run.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Top 10 BIG DAVE matches: (singles/triple threats/four ways only)

vs HHH - Vengeance
vs Undertaker - Wrestlemania, Backlash, steel cage, Cyber Sunday
vs Cena - SummerSlam, Extreme Rules
vs Eddie - No Mercy
vs Orton - Raw from September 2004
vs Benoit - First Raw of 2005

Haven't seen much of his 2008 stuff including the HBK matches so they are out for now. Other than those, he has been part of many great tag matches like NWO 07 and all the Evolution stuff in 2004. Not to forget other gimmick matches like Elimination Chamber 2005.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

NYR chamber literally might be my favorite match ever.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> I'm guessing he'll be face for a while, as most big stars who return typically are, but I hope he turns heel at some point during this final run.


That's what I fear, face Batista is tired out.

Heel Batista is the only way to go (Y)


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I was actually chatting with your brother about this yesterday. He'll definitely be a face upon his return, especially if he's slated to win the Rumble and fight either Orton or Lesnar at Mania. Heel turn sometime down the line, though, plz. HEEL BATISTA = :mark:


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

If anyone wins the Rumble other the Punk I will be extremely pissed off.

Batista doesn't need to win the Rumble, multiple Royal Rumble winners irritate me.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

The Lady Killer said:


> NYR chamber literally might be my favorite match ever.


*Elimination Chamber 2005 - WWE New Year Revolution 2005*

Triple H vs Batista vs Edge vs Randy Orton vs Chris Jericho vs Chris Benoit

_WWE DVD Version - Benoit commentary etc intact  Also includes full buildup video._

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-m...mber-2005-wwe-new-year-revolution-2005-a.html


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

:mark:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

William Murderface said:


> If anyone wins the Rumble other the Punk I will be extremely pissed off.
> 
> Batista doesn't need to win the Rumble, multiple Royal Rumble winners irritate me.


This. 

I'm fine with Batista returning so along as he doesn't win the Rumble. Punk needs that win, it's one of the only things he hasn't done in his career (along with a WrestleMania main-event). Batista's already won a rumble before and got the rub from it, now Punk should.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

2005 chamber is :mark: all the way through. LOVE IT. Need to rewatch now that I think about it. Might as well DL zep's upload.



William Murderface said:


> If anyone wins the Rumble other the Punk I will be extremely pissed off.
> 
> Batista doesn't need to win the Rumble, multiple Royal Rumble winners irritate me.


I hope you will be pissed off. 

I don't like multiple winners either but other than Bryan, Batista is the only guy fit for winning.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Yeah, going to watch the chamber myself in abit.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I can watch that Chmaber match on my DVD copy


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I had the match in HD from the NYR 2005 rip that's available on the net along with every other 2005-2006 PPV but deleted them due to lack of space. Should've extracted the good matches from them for later use to trim down all the space wasted as well as getting rid of shitty matches. Will be a chore to try redownloading them all.


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

Why don't you guys just buy the DVDs?

I have pretty much every WWE show on DVD that is available to me. :dance


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

I plan to start collecting if/when I move to the States hopefully in a few years when I get a degree. For now, I'll just have to resort to the cheap way for everything.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Punk, Bryan, or Ziggler

If one of those three dont win, I'll be pissed, I know Ziggler is a long shot but would still be :mark:


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Ziggler has no chance. :sad: I'll be surprised if he lasts 5 minutes in the Rumble with how they're using him atm.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

C2D, have you a list of the best Evolution tags please?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The Lady Killer said:


> I remember next to nothing about the matches except that they took place and that I thought they were good.
> 
> Waiting for Cal/Cody to come in and show off their extensive knowledge to prove I'm not insane.


Batista vs Mysterio series did happen. And it was actually pretty nifty. Match where Mysterio beat Batista clean in very late 2009 was AWESOME, iirc.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Clint Eastwood said:


> C2D, have you a list of the best Evolution tags please?


Man, there are so many of them that I barely keep track myself. If you look through Orton and Benoit's 2004 in profightdb, you'll pretty much get everything worth watching. I'll still try to list everything I can think of.

1/3 - Orton/Batista vs Benoit/HBK
WM XX - Evolution vs Rock n Sock
24/3 - Batista/Flair vs RVD/Booker
12/4 - Evolution vs Benoit/HBK/Foley/Shelton
3/5 - Evolution (minus Flair) vs Tajiri/Edge/Shelton
17/5 - Batista/Orton vs Benoit/Edge
24/5 - Batista/Orton vs Shelton/Jericho
14/6 - Evolution (minus HHH) vs Benoit/Edge/Jericho (elimination tag and best of the bunch imo)
21/6 - Orton/Batista vs Edge/Jericho
2/8 - Evolution vs Benoit/Edge/Jericho
9/8 - Orton/HHH vs Benoit
13/9 - Flair/Batista/La Resistance vs Benoit/Regal/Tajiri/Rhyno
20/9 - Evolution vs Orton/Benoit/Shelton
11/10 - Evolution vs Benoit/Edge/HBK

There's probably some more but these were good.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Don't forget about Flair/Batista vs Benoit/Regal from Unforgiven.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Thanks guys 

Best of the bunch without Trips


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Primer said:


> Don't forget about Flair/Batista vs Benoit/Regal from Unforgiven.


Yeah, that's good too as well as the Survivor Series elimination match. Think there's a match with Maven tagging along with Orton and Jericho that might be worth looking into.

Also just discovered Orton and Jericho once tagged to take on Batista and Flair. Gonna check that out.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I love that Survivor Series elimination match. Super good stuff from everyone. Snitsky's chair shot. It still has an effect on me.

Anyone remember the Maven World Championship match following Survivor Series? I know it's vs Trips, but this may actually be a gem thanks to all the drama that surrounded it. You know, that fun kind of stuff that makes you warm and fuzzy while watching rasslin. Match felt like a nostalgia trip back to the territory days w/a young gun underdog on the hunt for gold.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm gonna be snowed in for the next day and a half

so wrasslin


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah, that Maven/HHH match was pretty fun. They really made it look like a big deal with Benoit giving Maven a pep talk before the match and all the interference only added to the excitement.

Just found that Orton/Jericho tag I was talking about, gonna see if it's any good:

xgkknz


----------



## WrestlingOracle (Jul 6, 2013)

Pretty odd to consider that Maven eliminated the Undertaker in the Royal Rumble, technically owns a victory over the Undertaker (in a hardcore title match no less), has bested Kurt Angle in tag matches on several occasions and with some help became pretty close to becomming world heavyweight champion


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Skins watch something w/Mascara Dorada. If you liked Mistico as Sin Cara, you should love this dude.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

The Primer said:


> Skins watch something w/Mascara Dorada. If you liked Mistico as Sin Cara, you should love this dude.


I will

any specifc matches of his ?


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)




----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Jut watched the ECW ONS 06 tag match, HOLY FUCKING SHIT WHAT A MATCH. Edge was just a :mark: heel in it the whole time, so was Lita too but this might have been one of Edge's best character performances in a match, so great. 

at least ****1/2 for me, might even go higher


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

I just watched that recently and Edge was pretty great in it. That's a higher rating than I'd give it, but it's a very entertaining match nonetheless. FUNK being the old crazy bastard that he is. :mark:


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Edge's pin on Beulah might be one of my favourite DICKHEAD MOVES ever. Such a cunt :lmao


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Yeah that was pretty great. Foley getting tangled in all that barbed wire must've fuckin' hurt.


----------



## Nostalgia (Dec 20, 2011)

Agreed with the above comments. Great match, that I think tends to get a little overlooked when it comes to top matches from 2006. A potential MOTY candidate from that year. 






Finally getting around to watching this weeks RAW currently. Punk's opening promo with The Shield was good stuff, more teasing with The Shield's break up, Rollins saying: ''I'm the best'' while Reigns stares at him funny. :lol Good to see Ambrose get some more live mic time. Punk/Rollins match now.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Love that ONS 06 tag. A top 5 ECW match ever, including the original ECW.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Mick Foley & Terry Funk are in it. Of course it's a top flight match.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Just watched Batista vs. Shawn Michaels from Armageddon 2003, and loved it.

This was back when you guys say that Batista was really green, but he looked beastly to me.

Good personality and character work from both Shawn & Batista (HBK was more like his whimsical, free-wheeling, self from the mid 90s), and also was just a great big man vs. small man match, I thought.

The match flew right by and I really enjoyed it. 

*** 1/2 - *** 3/4.

'skins, since you're an HBK fan, I think you'll like this. Especially with Flair at ring side, of course.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

He was insanely green. But it worked. Was his best match up until the HIAC vs Triple H, tbhayley.


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

LilOlMe said:


> Just watched Batista vs. Shawn Michaels from Armageddon 2003, and loved it.
> 
> *** 1/2 - *** 3/4.


If you wanna see more of Batista's good matches from his "green" days, I recommend this since you like Orton. Wasn't in my list but it's probably their best match together even though I had the Armageddon match there.

x2fi4n


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

I watched that lightning match Cody, good stuff :lmao completely the same style as Mistco. Like Isaid I dont have a probelm w/ him and didnt think he was that bad of the clich "botch"machine line everyone uses. Stick him in a sub 8 min match on sd weekly w/ the cesaro,rhodes,zigglers,goldsust of the world and he probably would of been good


----------



## Tony (Jan 17, 2011)

The 2 out of 3 falls match between Sami Zayn and Leo Kruger in the recent episode of NXT was really good. I'd give it between ***3/4-****. Sami Zayn pulls off another great babyface performance by selling really well and Leo Kruger was great playing up to his aggressive character. Overall, it was really good to watch.


----------



## Flux (Sep 4, 2010)

Spoiler: KRUGER VS. ZAYN COZ SOME PEOPLE HAVEN'T SEEN IT



Sami busting out the exploder in to the corner put a smile on my face for a good few minutes. It's nice to see him slowly but surely showcase his moveset and not wearing it out too quickly. Smart stuff. Proves how good he is. First the BTBomb, then the through the ropes DDT, and now the exploder. One can only hope for the BRAAAAINNNBUSTAHHHH 8*D Guessing we'll see the half and half, first.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Threw in a random disc of the Raw 20th anniversary set, figured I'd do a review.

*MONDAY NIGHT RAW - MARCH 26th 2001*

Start off with Vince shitting on (figuratively) Jeff Jarrett and WCW. Big moment for WWF, finally over taking WCW.

*Tazz (w/APA & Jacqueline) vs Val Venis (w/Right To Censor)*

Ridiculously short, brawl starts, Stevie Kick to Tazz, Tazz hits a northern lights suplex on Venis for the win. DUD

COMMISSIONER REGAL~!

Regal comes out and challenges a Holly brother. Crash and Molly come out and Regal pushes Crash out and puts Molly in the Regal Stretch. Apparently this was supposed to be a match. Crash gets in but gets put in the Regal Stretch as well. DOINK THE CLOWN MAKES THE SAVE, locks Regal in the Walls of Jericho. Turns out it's Jericho. Cool segment. Not counting it as a match.

Got Vince talking about Trish's breasts while taking some shots at Dustin Rhodes. That bastard. :side:

Backstage segments with Debra, IT'S NOT A GOOD TIME THOUGH. Then back in Vince's office another sexually charged segment with him and Trish.

Now here comes the big Vince purchasing WCW segment. You can tell Vince was enjoying the fuck out of just sticking it to WCW, can't blame him. This promo dragged quite a bit though. I'm sure it was exciting at the time but not really here. Vince threatens his son a bit, talks about his wheel chair ridden wife and then goes on listing off WCW stars, asking who the fans would want to see. They go nuts for Goldberg. Couple guys they just didn't give a fuck about. Then Shane's theme hits and he shows up LIVE IN PANAMA CITY at Nitro and announces that he's the owner of WCW. Decent segment and I understand the significance of it but it kind of dragged.

Hilarious segment backstage with Vince yelling at his lawyers on the phone. :lol:

*The Hardyz & Benoit vs Angle, Edge & Christian*

This match sounded awesome going in, and then it ended in a little over 2 minutes. ~___~ Benoit gets the win (also, commentary is so butchered on the DVD to cut out all the commentary on him) and a brawl breaks out where Rhyno spears Lita. 1/2* (This could have been awesome if it got time)

*Test vs X-Pac (w/Albert) - Eddie Guerrero as special referee*

Eddie refuses to count for Test. Test hits Eddie. X-Pac tries to cheat, fails. New ref comes in, Eddie pulls him out. Albert run in and BALDO BOMB. Eddie counts, X-Pac wins. FUCKERY. DUD.

FOLEY! Vince comes out, still fuming and says that Foley has no business being there. Cut to footage of Linda from a few months ago signing off on a bunch of stuff for Foley. Foley announces that he gets to be special ref for Vince/Shane. Vince's night gets worse and worse. Fun segment.

*Jericho vs Big Show*

Bunch of random shit happens before...YOU GUESSED IT, RUN INS! Kane goes after Big Show, but RAVEN GOES AFTER KANE. OH AND HERE'S REGAL AGAIN TO ATTACK JERICHO. Show with a chokeslam to win in you guessed it...another short ass match. DUD

Little bit more fuckery after the match.

Couple good segments with Rock and Austin backstage.

*Undertaker & Kane vs Austin & Rock*

Rock makes the hot tag to Austin and Austin and Taker go at it. Austin knocks Rock off the apron, Taker hits a chokeslam. MOTHER OF GOD ANOTHER FUCKING RUN IN, THIS TIME BY TRIPLE H. Trips hits Taker in the back with a chair, Kane pulls him out while Austin pins for the win. Main event between four of the biggest names at the time, doesn't even get five goddamn minutes. *

Taker goes after Trips while Austin decides to celebrate with a couple beers. While he's drinking, Rock gets up and hits a STUNNER on Austin to end the night. Pretty cool stuff there.

MOTN: Kane & Undertaker vs Austin & Rock - *

I completely understand why this Raw made it. It was a very significant Raw in the history of WWF/E and it was the go home Raw for one of the better Mania shows. But my god, the wrestling was just terrible. Other than a few enjoyable backstage segments, the end, the Vince promo and Jericho as DOINK, this show was just dreadful. A run in for every match and nothing even hit the five minute mark. Good lord.

Gonna watch the Raw Roulette from '03 next. Looks mildly promising.


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Best B-show PPV for 2010? Don't think I saw any all the way through


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

SaviorBeeRad™ said:


> Best B-show PPV for 2010? Don't think I saw any all the way through


Money In The Bank was pretty good. Was just looking through the cards and realized that not too many of them were well rounded. Survivor Series (I know it's technically not a B PPV) had an awesome first half but a pretty meh 2nd half.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Just rewatched Lesnar/haitch cage, wow, I fucking loved it, **** for it and a shocking one to say the least

gotta watch their others again now


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

*Summerslam 1998*

Val Venis vs. D'Lo Brown: ***1/4
Kaientai vs. The Oddities: DUD
X-Pac vs. Jeff Jarrett: ***
Sable/Edge vs. Jacqueline/Marc Mero: DUD
Owen Hart vs. Ken Shamrock: ***1/4
New Age Outlaws vs. Mankind: **3/4
The Rock vs. HHH: ***1/2
Steve Austin vs. Undertaker: ***

*In Your House: Breakdown*

Owen Hart vs. Edge: ***
Al Snow/Scorpio vs. Too Much: **1/2
Marc Mero vs. Droz: DUD
Bradshaw vs. Vader: ***
D'Lo Brown vs. Gangrel: **
The Rock vs. Ken Shamrock vs. Mankind: ***3/4
Val Venis vs. Dustin Runnels: **1/4
DX vs. Jeff Jarrett & Southern Justice: *
Undertaker vs. Kane vs. Steve Austin: DUD


----------



## MachoMadness1988 (Dec 3, 2011)

Rewatching unk2 :brock for the first time since I watched it live. So great. 

Enjoying the Best of 2013 PPV matches set. Renee Young is so adorable.


----------



## Emotion Blur (May 7, 2012)

This is going to sound random as all hell, but does anyone have any recommendations for some good Snitsky matches? I stopped watching wrestling before he even debuted (or not long after he debuted) and yet for some reason, in 2014 I'm absolutely enthralled with his character and look. Now maybe he's Khali levels of shit and never had a good match he wasn't carried to, or he did nothing but job (I honestly don't know), but to satisfy my odd curiosity, I would like to catch some of his finer wrestling moments.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

SKINS25 said:


> I watched that lightning match Cody, good stuff :lmao completely the same style as Mistco. Like Isaid I dont have a probelm w/ him and didnt think he was that bad of the clich "botch"machine line everyone uses. Stick him in a sub 8 min match on sd weekly w/ the cesaro,rhodes,zigglers,goldsust of the world and he probably would of been good


DORADA.

Cesaro carried Mistico in all of their matches. Bourne had a good one too. Umm. Singles wise I'm drawing a blank on who else. Oh, right Sheamus duh. Think the very first one vs Danielson was fine too. That's about it. Never liked the Christian vs Sin Cara match. The Drew McIntyre ones were so overblown. <3 Drew, but nah.



funnyfaces1 said:


> *In Your House: Breakdown*
> Al Snow/Scorpio vs. Too Much: **1/2


HOW?

I'm officially less of a fan of 1998 than you. Another match where I couldn't believe the crap produced and it makes me want to build a time machine to make sure WCW won the Monday Night Wars.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I liked Too Much. Something about them made me laugh. Al Snow is Al Snow. Surprisingly enough, it was Scorpio that ruined this match. Dude was a mess. But Too Much. Oh man they're a hoot when they're around Al Snow.

EDIT: Brodus Clay snapped on Main Event. Great promo.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Shitty wrestling is shitty wrestling. Fucking garbage combo they are.

Good Snitsky stuff:

vs Kane ~ Taboo Tuesday 2004
vs Kane ~ RAW January 2005
vs Big Show ~ Unforgiven 2005

Some other are out there vs John Cena, Shawn Michaels, & a slew of squashes I bet are pretty good. They're just a little fuzzy atm. I've always put him in my "guilty pleasure" pile. Big ugly guy clubberin. I find it hard for me to not enjoy him.


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

I recall Snitsky having a couple fun squash matches against Nunzio in '07.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Holy cow. Just watched Cesaro/Regal from NXT. This is something totally different from what you normally see on WWE TV (meaning Raw and Smackdown), and Regal always fucking brings it. The beginning of the match is really cool with both guys trying to strong arm the other, with Cesaro keeping hold of the wristlock even while Regal kips up twice and tries to roll through, but Cesaro's strength is just too much. (Regal's agility is pretty impressive, by the way.) Then Regal gets a similar segment, and does a modified surfboard with Cesaro's arms pulled up around his neck. Regal selling the chop block and the subsequent attacks to the knee like death :mark: What makes Regal so great also is the way he attempts to fight off Cesaro during the knee attacks. Most guys just take it and show some facial expression, but Regal is swinging and ripping at Cesaro while being worked over. Regal gets a comeback and does his thing but holy fuck at the upper cut he takes. He hits Cesaro with two uppercuts, but Cesaro comes off the ropes and follows through with a sick uppercut of his own, sending Regal to the mat hard. Cesaro does his stomp on the back of Regal's head, signaling the end for Sir William. I certainly hope I wasn't the only one who was moved by the way Cesaro showed mercy on his face for Regal, but then when he snapped and hit the Neutralizer was like :mark: The handshake at the end was cool. These two were gold together.


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Bryan vs. Punk @ Over The Limit was sweet as I expected. Never seems to hit that epic gear, but some of those submissions and counters are just so unique to modern WWE. Also, the match just has _*zero*_ fat on it. Every move advances the story, no rest holds, etc. ****1/4


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Brodus Clay cut a hell of a promo when he lost on NXT a few years ago. That quality behind him got lost on most when he was saddled w/the modern day PN News gimmick. Glad he's finally moving in the proper direction.


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

I recall him also having another good promo in 2012 during his two week feud with The Big Show. Dude can go on the mic when given the chance. In the ring he's still awful, but I'm sure a session with Mark Henry will do the trick.

Oh my goodness, a Hall Of Pain Brodus Clay run.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Yea Brodus actually has mic skills, you wouldnt ever not, I just so happen to be on wwe YT channel and saw his segment on miz tv ( I think it was on main event) and it was actually pretty good, from not knowing he made it seems like his current feud w/ woods/tensai actually means something


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

Regal vs. Cesaro was really, really sweet. Tons of emotion at the end, Regal's GOAT selling of the knee (Cesaro pretty sweet with the arms too) and the whole brute strength vs. methodical genius. Was all great. Don't even know how to rate this, I branch out so rarely from the WWE norm 8*D and this is so different from anything I've seen recently. ****+, if I had to rate it exactly ****1/2.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Brodus Clay's collision w/Tensai proves he isn't awful. As does most of his squashes. He's a fun beast. The company should haven't had in in mediocre cookie cutter tag team scenarios. Even if his partner was Tensai. The wrong move.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Tensai is one of the most underrated wrestler, looking forward to the brodus/tensai


----------



## Brye (Jan 28, 2006)

Feel like Brodus/Tensai might end up being some lame 2 minute squash in between PPV matches.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Tensai is a boss.

:mark:


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Tempted to call him sweet t from now on for lolz


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

The Primer said:


> Brodus Clay cut a hell of a promo when he lost on NXT a few years ago. That quality behind him got lost on most when he was saddled w/the modern day PN News gimmick. Glad he's finally moving in the proper direction.


I don't think he is being moved in the proper direction. All he's done is jobbed since this angle began. I think he's just going to be used to put over Xavier Woods.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The losses are building. I can't see the company giving him just as much time as the rest of the workers involved only for him to play a meaningless heel role. This feud is to turn him into a demanding heel. It may not be a ultra push, but some success should branch off from it in the form of actually being credible & under the role of a heel who's using his size to get the job done.


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

Hopefully that's true.


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

Brye said:


> Feel like Brodus/Tensai might end up being some lame 2 minute squash in between PPV matches.


It'd suck if they wound up squashes, but two minutes of phatties of clubbing each other is a plus to any PPV. Imagine if they had Tensai/Brodus and Lesnar/Henry on the same show. Much BEEF. And then Orton/Cena doesn't get to finish because they fire Orton mid-match for putting Vince and all of the other higher-ups to sleep and somehow being so boring that all of the lights and electricity shut off and WWE had to refund everyone's money who bought tickets or the show on TV. Then the electricity goes back on when Orton leaves for the airport and the light fixtures start shooting into the ground causing fires to spread and kill multiple people which results in WWE getting sued for millions and almost going bankrupt.


----------



## NotoriousTCG (Nov 28, 2013)

I hope to go through the matches in the spoiler tags below and find all of Taker's ***1/2+ matches for his whole career. There is roughly 200 matches in the list so it'll take a while.



Spoiler: Taker Matches



Million Dollar Team vs. The Dream Team – Summerslam 1990
Undertaker vs. Bret Hart – WWF MSG Shown January 31st 1992
Undertaker vs. British Bulldog – WWF MSG Shown Febuary 23rd 1992
Undertaker vs. Razor Ramon – WWF Superstars of Wrestling #312 September 1st 1992
Undertaker vs. Ric Flair – WWF MSG Show September 11th 1992
Undertaker vs. Yokozuna – WWF MSG Show November 27th 1993
Undertaker vs. Yokozuna – Royal Rumble 1994
Undertaker vs. Yokozuna – Survivor Series 1994
Undertaker vs. Bam Bam Bigelow – WWF MSG Show March 19th 1995
Undertaker, Diesel and Shawn Michaels vs. Owen Hart, Razor Ramon and The British Bulldog – Raw September 1995
Undertaker vs. Bret Hart – WWF MSG Show November 25th 1995
Undertaker vs. Bret Hart – Royal Rumble 1996
Undertaker vs. Bret Hart – Raw January 22nd 1996
Undertaker and Bret Hart vs. Diesel and Shawn Michaels – WWF MSG Shown March 17th 1996
Undertaker vs. Diesel – Wrestlemania 12
Undertaker vs. Vader – WWF Action Zone April 2nd 1996
Undertaker vs. Owen Hart – Raw April 29th 1996
Undertaker vs. Goldust –In Your House 8: Beware of Dog (1) May 26th 1996
Undertaker vs. Goldust – In Your House 8: Beware of Dog (2) May 28th 1996
Undertaker vs. Goldust – In Your House 9: International Incident
Undertaker vs. Mankind – King of the Ring 1996
Undertaker vs. Mankind – Summerslam 1996
Undertaker vs. Goldust – In Your House 10: Mind Games
Undertaker and Shawn Michaels vs. Goldust and Mankind WWF MSG Show September 29th 1996
Undertaker vs. Mankind – In Your House 11: Buried Alive 
Undertaker vs. Mankind – Survivor Series 1996
Undertaker vs. Mankind – Raw November 18th 1996
Undertaker vs. The Executioner – In Your House 12: It’s Time
Undertaker vs. Vader – Royal Rumble 1997
Undertaker vs. Steve Austin – Raw January 29th 1997
Undertaker vs. Steve Austin vs. Bret Hart vs. Vader – In Your House 13: Final Four
Undertaker vs. Mankind – In Your House 14: Revenge Of The Taker 
Undertaker vs. Steve Austin – In Your House 15: A Cold Day In Hell
Undertaker vs. Mankind – WWF MSG Show May 17th 1997
Undertaker vs. Vader – In Your House 16: Canadian Stampede
Undertaker vs. Bret Hart – Summerslam 1997
Undertaker vs. Bret Hart – WWF Friday Night’s Main Event August 23rd 1997
Undertaker vs. Shawn Michaels – In Your House 17: Grand Zero
Undertaker vs. Bret Hart – WWF One Night Only
Undertaker vs. Shawn Michaels – In Your House 18: Bad Blood
Undertaker and Steve Austin vs. Hunter Hearst Helmsley and Shawn Michaels – WWF MSG Show November 15th 1997
Undertaker vs. Shawn Michaels – Royal Rumble 1998
Undertaker vs. Kane – Wrestlemania 14
Undertaker vs. Kane – WWF Mayhem in Manchester
Undertaker vs. Kane – Unforgiven 1998
Undertaker vs. Kane – Raw June 1st 1998
Undertaker and Steve Austin vs. Kane and Mankind – WWF MSG Show June 5th 1998
Undertaker vs. Mankind – King of the Ring 1998
Undertaker and Steve Austin vs. Kane and Mankind – WWF Fully Loaded 1998
Undertaker and Steven Austin vs. Kane and Mankind vs. Billy Gunn and Road Dogg vs. D-Lo Brown and Rocky Maivia
Undertaker vs. Steve Austin Summerslam 1998
Undertaker vs. Kane vs. Steve Austin – WWF Breakdown 1998
Undertaker and Kane vs. Steve Austin and The Rock – Raw October 18th 1998
Undertaker vs. Kane – Judgment Day 1998
Undertaker vs. Kane vs. Steve Austin vs. The Rock – WWF MSG Show October 25th 1998
Undertaker vs. Kane – Survivor Series 1998
Undertaker vs. The Rock – Survivor Series 1998
Undertaker vs. Steve Austin vs. Kane vs. Mankind – Capital Carnage December 6th 1998
Undertaker vs. Steve Austin – Rock Bottom 1998
Undertaker vs. Kane – WWF MSG Show December 27th 1998
Undertaker vs. Ken Shamrock – Backlash 1999
Undertaker vs. Steve Austin vs. Triple H – No Mercy 1999
Undertaker vs. Steve Austin – Over The Edge 1999
Undertaker vs. The Rock vs. Triple H – Raw Jun 14th 1999
Undertaker vs. The Rock – King of the Ring 1999
Undertaker vs. Steve Austin – Raw June 28th 1999
Undertaker vs. Steve Austin – Fully Loaded 1999
Undertaker and The Big Show vs. Kane and X-Pac – Summerslam 1999
Undertaker and The Big Show vs. Kane and X-Pac vs. Bradshaw and Faarooq – Smackdown August 24th 1999
Undertaker and The Big Show vs. Mankind and The Rock – Raw August 30th 1999
Undertaker and The Big Show vs. Mankind and the Rock – Smackdown September 7th 1999 
Undertaker vs. Kane vs. Mankind. Vs. The Big Show vs. The Rock – Raw September 13th 1999
Undertaker vs. Kane vs. Mankind. Vs. The Big Show vs. The Rock – Smackdown September 14th 1999
Undertaker and Kane vs. Edge and Christian – Raw June 26th 2000
Undertaker and Kane vs. Kurt Angle and Triple H – Raw July 17th 2000
Undertaker and The Rock vs. Kurt Angle and Triple H – Smackdown August 8th 2000
Undertaker vs. Chris Benoit – Raw August 14th 2000
Undertaker vs. Kane – Summerslam 2000
Undertaker vs. Chris Benoit – Smackdown August 29th 2000
Undertaker vs. Kurt Angle – Smackdown September 5th 2000
Undertaker and The Rock vs. Chris Benoit and Kane – Raw September 11th 2000
Undertaker and The Rock vs. Bubba Ray Dudley and D-Von Dudley – Smackdown September 12th 2000
Undertaker vs. The Rock – Raw September 18th 2000
Undertaker and The Rock and Triple H vs. Chris Benoit and Kane and Kurt Angle – Smackdown September 19th 2000
Undertaker and The Rock and Triple H vs. Chris Benoit and Kane and Kurt Angle – WWF MSG Show September 23rd 2000
Undertaker vs. Chris Benoit vs. Kane vs. The Rock – Unforgiven 2000
Undertaker and The Rock and Triple H vs. Chris Benoit and Kane and Kurt Angle – Smackdown September 26th 2000
Undertaker vs. Chris Benoit vs. Chris Jericho vs. Kane – Smackdown November 7th 2000
Undertaker and Chris Jericho vs. Kane and Kurt Angle – Smackdown November 14th 2000
Undertaker vs. Kurt Angle – Survivor Series 2000
Undertaker vs. Edge and Christian – Raw November 20th 2000
Undertaker vs. Chris Benoit – WWF Rebellion 2000
Undertaker vs. Kurt Angle vs. The Rock vs. Steve Austin – Smackdown December 5th 
Undertaker vs. Kurt Angle vs. Rikishi vs. Steve Austin vs. The Rock vs. Triple H – Armageddon 2000
Undertaker vs. Raven – Smackdown December 12th 2000
Undertaker vs. Kane vs. Steve Austin – Smackdown December 30th 2000
Undertaker vs. Triple H – Wrestlemania 17
Undertaker and Kane vs. Edge and Christian – Smackdown April 17th 2001
Undertaker and Kane vs. Steve Austin and Triple H – Backlash 2001
Undertaker vs. Steve Austin and Triple H – WWF Insurrextion 2001
Undertaker and Kane vs. Diamond Dallas Page and Kanyon – Summerslam 2001
Undertaker vs. Booker T – No Mercy 2001
Undertaker vs. Kurt Angle and Steve Austin – Smackdown November 6th 2001
Undertaker vs. Tazz – Smackdown November 27th 2001
Undertaker vs. Rob Van Dam – Vengeance 2001
Undertaker vs. Tajiri – Smackdown December 22nd 2001
Undertaker vs. The Big Show – Smackdown January 3rd 2002
Undertaker and Chris Jericho vs. Steve Austin and the Rock – Raw February 4th 2002
Undertaker vs. The Rock – No Way Out 2002
Undertaker vs. Ric Flair – Wrestlemania 18
Undertaker vs. Steve Austin – Backlash 2002
Undertaker vs. Triple H – Insurrextion 2002
Undertaker vs. Rob Van Dam – Raw May 20th 2002
Undertaker vs. Randy Orton – Smackdown May 28th 2002
Undertaker vs. Kurt Angle – Smackdown June 18th 2002
Undertaker vs. Triple H – King Of The Ring 2002
Undertaker vs. Jeff Hardy – Raw June 24th 2002
Undertaker vs. Jeff Hardy – Raw July 1st 2002
Undertaker vs. The Rock vs. Kurt Angle – Vengeance 2002
Undertaker vs. Chris Benoit vs. Kurt Angle – Smackdown August 27th 2002
Undertaker vs. Brock Lesnar – Unforgiven 2002
Undertaker vs. Brock Lesnar – No Mercy 2002
Undertaker vs. The Big Show – No Way Out 2003
Undertaker vs. Rey Mysterio – Smackdown April 1st 2003
Undertaker vs. John Cena – Smackdown April 8th 2003
Undertaker vs. John Cena – Vengeance 2003
Undertaker vs. John Cena – Smackdown August 5th 2003
Undertaker vs. A-Train – Summerslam 2003
Undertaker vs. Brock Lesnar vs. The Big Show – Smackdown August 26th 2003
Undertaker vs. Kurt Angle – Smackdown September 2nd 2003
Undertaker vs. Brock Lesnar – WWE MSG Show September 20th 2003
Undertaker and Kurt Angle vs. Brock Lesnar and John Cena – Smackdown September 30th 2003
Undertaker vs. Brock Lesnar – No Mercy 2003
Undertaker vs. Brock Lesnar and The Big Show – Smackdown October 21st 2003
Undertaker vs. Mr. McMahon – Survivor Series 2003
Undertaker vs. Booker T – Judgement Day 2004
Undertaker vs. John Cena – Smackdown June 22nd 2004
Undertaker vs. JBL – Summerslam 2004
Undertaker vs. JBL – No Mercy 2004
Undertaker, Booker T and Eddie Guerrero vs. Basham Brothers, Orlando Jordan and JBL – Smackdown December 7th 2004
Undertaker vs. JBL vs. Booker T vs. Eddie Guerrero – Armageddon 2004
Undertaker vs. JBL and Orlando Jordan – Smackdown January 18th 2005
Undertaker vs. Heidenreich – Royal Rumble 2005
Undertaker vs. Randy Orton – Wrestlemania 21
Undertaker vs. JBL vs. Booker T vs. Muhammad Hassan vs. Christian vs. Chris Benoit – Smackdown June 27th 2005
Undertaker vs. Randy Orton – Summerslam 2005
Undertaker vs. Randy Orton and Bob Orton Jr – No Mercy 2005
Undertaker vs. Randy Orton – Armageddon 2005
Undertaker and Kurt Angle vs. Mercury, Nitro and Mark Henry – Smackdown Febuary 14th 2006
Undertaker vs. Kurt Angle – No Way Out 2006
Undertaker vs. Kurt Angle – Smackdown Febuary 27th 2006
Undertaker vs. The Big Show – ECW July 18th 2006
Undertaker vs. The Big Show – The Great American Bash 2006 
Undertaker vs. The Great Khali – Smackdown August 15th 2006
Undertaker vs. Mr. Kennedy – No Mercy 2006
Undertaker vs. Mr. Kennedy – Survivor Series 2006
Undertaker vs. Johnny Nitro – Tribute To The Troops 2006
Undertaker vs. Mr. Kennedy – Armageddon 2006
Undertaker, Shawn Michaels, Batista and John Cena vs. Edge, MVP, Mr. Kennedy and Randy Orton – Smackdown February 12th 2007
Undertaker and Batista vs. John Cena and Shawn Michaels – No Way Out 2007
Undertaker vs. Finlay – Smackdown March 6th 2007
Undertaker vs. Finlay and King Booker – Smackdown March 20th 2007
Undertaker and Batista vs. John Cena and Shawn Michaels – Raw March 26th 2007
Undertaker vs. Batista – Backlash 2007
Undertaker vs. Batista – Smackdown May 11th 2007
Undertaker vs. Mark Henry – Unforgiven 2007
Undertaker vs. Batista – Cyber Sunday 2007
Undertaker vs. Batista – Survivor Series 2007
Undertaker vs. Edge vs. Batista – Armageddon 2007
Undertaker vs. Batista vs. Big Daddy V vs. Finlay vs. MVP vs. The Great Khali – No Way Out 2008
Undertaker vs. Edge – Wrestlemania 24
Undertaker vs. Kane – Smackdown April 1st 2008
Undertaker vs. Festus – Smackdown Aprl 8th 2008
Undertaker vs. Batista – Smackdown April 22nd 2008
Undertaker vs. Edge – Backlash 2008
Undertaker vs. Edge – Judgment Day 2008
Undertaker vs. Edge – One Night Stand 2008
Undertaker vs. Edge – Summerslam 2008
Undertaker vs. The Big Show – No Mercy 2008
Undertaker vs. The Big Show – Cyber Sunday 2008
Undertaker vs. Jeff Hardy – Smackdown November 11th 2008
Undertaker vs. The Big Show – Survivor Series 2008
Undertaker vs. Shelton Benjamin – Smackdown December 30th 2008
Undertaker vs. Shelton Benjamin – Smackdown December 13th 2009
Undertaker vs. Triple H vs. Edge vs. Jeff Hardy vs. The Big Show vs. Vladimir Kozlov – No Way Out 2009
Undertaker vs. Shawn Michaels – Wrestlemania 25
Undertaker vs. Matt Hardy – Superstars April 13th 2009
Undertaker vs. Shelton Benjamin – Smackdown April 14th 2009
Undertaker, Shawn Michaels, John Cena and Triple H vs. CM Punk, Cody Rhodes, Ted DiBiase and Randy Orton – Smackdown September 29th 2009
Undertaker vs. CM Punk vs. Batista vs. Rey Mysterio – Bragging Rights 2009
Undertaker vs. Chris Jericho – Smackdown November 10th 2009 
Undertaker and John Cena vs. DX vs. Chris Jericho and The Big Show – Raw November 16th 2009
Undertaker vs. Chris Jericho vs. The Big Show – Survivor Series 2009
Undertaker vs. Batista – TLC 2009
Undertaker vs. Rey Mysterio – Smackdown December 20th 2009
Undertaker vs. Rey Mysterio – Royal Rumble 2010
Undertaker vs. Chris Jericho – Smackdown February 9th 2010
Undertaker vs. Chris Jericho vs. CM Punk vs. John Morrison vs. R-Thruth vs. Rey Mysterio – Elimination Chamber 2010
Undertaker vs. Drew McIntrye – Smackdown March 16th 2010
Undertaker vs. Shawn Michaels – Wrestlemania 26
Undertaker vs. Jack Swagger – Raw April 19th 2010
Undertaker vs. Rey Mysterio – Smackdown May 25th 2010
Undertaker vs. Kane – Bragging Rights 2010
Undertaker vs. Triple H – Wrestlemania 27
Undertaker vs. Triple H – Wrestlemania 28
Undertaker vs. CM Punk – Wrestlemania 29
Undertaker and Team Hell No vs. The Shield – Raw April 22nd 2013
Undertaker vs. Dean Ambrose – Smackdown – April 22nd 2013


----------



## William Murderface (Apr 16, 2006)

I hope Brodus goes somewhere, but you never know with this fucking company anymore sadly.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Yeah1993 said:


> It'd suck if they wound up squashes, but two minutes of phatties of clubbing each other is a plus to any PPV. Imagine if they had Tensai/Brodus and Lesnar/Henry on the same show. Much BEEF. And then Orton/Cena doesn't get to finish because they fire Orton mid-match for putting Vince and all of the other higher-ups to sleep and somehow being so boring that all of the lights and electricity shut off and WWE had to refund everyone's money who bought tickets or the show on TV. Then the electricity goes back on when Orton leaves for the airport and the light fixtures start shooting into the ground causing fires to spread and kill multiple people which results in WWE getting sued for millions and almost going bankrupt.


Part about Orton is more hilarious considering I was in the mood to watch most of Cesaro's work from 2013 & I started off w/those Orton matches early in the year and they fucking SUCK thanks to you know who. Cesaro is still Wrestler of the Year, but god damn. When Cesaro falls into formulaic, droll nonsense. Something is wrong.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

I tried to watch the Punk/Ambrose matches, but couldn't last longer than 3-4 minutes each. Punk/Rollins and Cena/Rollins better be better.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

If that's the case, then you're going to turn off Punk vs Rollins before the first commercial break.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Cena/Rollins is miles better, but Punk/Rollins is Lesnar/Goldberg compared to at least the 2nd Punk/Ambrose. No, I'm not kidding.

EDIT: How cool is it that this WWE Network thingy will air uncensored BENOIT (though it has an advisory before his shows/matches)? :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

The advisory is incredibly hilarious _(lol, what is it going to say? Try not to kill your wife & kids after watching?)_

It's still a totally awesome turn of events & a long time coming from WWE.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

WARNING: The following program contains explicit language and images of a murderer that never existed. Watch at your own risk.


----------



## DoubtGin (Nov 24, 2013)

Every Taker/Mankind match so far in 1997 was good. What a feud :mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

DoubtGin said:


> Every Taker/Mankind match so far in 1997 was good. What a feud :mark: :mark: :mark:


Every Taker/Mankind match is GREAT. Period. Probably my favorite feud ever. Those two just had the most wonderful chemistry.

Speaking of chemistry, I got bored and watched the Street Fight between Mick and Hunter at the 2000 Royal Rumble. Just as perfect as I remembered it, what a fucking war. Watching that stuff makes me awfully nostalgic, we will never ever see a match like this again in the WWE. 

Oh well, atleast we get THE WOLVERINE, unedited, on WWE network. I'm all in on this new app/network already.

If you think Michael Cole pimping the WWE app 30 times a night is bad now, just WAIT until this network hits. I wouldn't be surprised if they started putting advertising for it on mid carders trunks.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

Scott Steiner Promo - WWE Survivor Series 2002 (Unedited - Live PPV Version)

Includes Steiner's 'F-Bomb'


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

GIMME A FUCKIN' MIC!

Classic. Shame he didn't live up to the standards of awesomeness his debut raised.

Speaking of Steiner, I'm preparing a sort-of all-time WM match ranking, and after a rewatch, I *demand* all of you to go watch Steiners/Headshrinkers @ WM 9. The show may suck but boy that match is awesome.


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

ATF said:


> GIMME A FUCKIN' MIC!
> 
> Classic. Shame he didn't live up to the standards of awesomeness his debut raised.
> 
> Speaking of Steiner, I'm preparing a sort-of all-time WM match ranking, and after a rewatch, I *demand* all of you to go watch Steiners/Headshrinkers @ WM 9. The show may suck but boy that match is awesome.


Indeed it is, its get mentioned but is still underrated IMO, but please EVERYONE WATCH THIS too:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

That WM 9 tag has one of my favourite WM moments ever :mark:.


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Funny thing is I watched some of orton 2011 run.

Tbhayley I don't understand why benoit being mentioned finally is like a never-ending Battle won. I don't think most understand what bad and good PR is, Some guy in that thread compared benoit to Oj Simpson :ti


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

The Primer said:


> Part about Orton is more hilarious considering I was in the mood to watch most of Cesaro's work from 2013 & I started off w/those Orton matches early in the year and they fucking SUCK thanks to you know who. Cesaro is still Wrestler of the Year, but god damn. When Cesaro falls into formulaic, droll nonsense. Something is wrong.


I didn't like those matches they had at the start of the year. I really enjoy their match from May on Main Event, though. That one was pretty good I thought. Dunno if you hate it, but I felt it was way better than that ME match that felt like 20 minutes of nothing.



ATF said:


> EDIT: How cool is it that this WWE Network thingy will air uncensored BENOIT (though it has an advisory before his shows/matches)? :mark:


It's a celebration, brother! :hogan2

2014 already starting off the best way possible. :mark:


----------



## Brock (Feb 26, 2012)

As EC is in his home town (isn't it?), i'm surprised Brock isn't working that PPV, and is doing RR instead. Unless he wanted to space out his appearances this close to Mania.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Is it coincidence how they've announced Benoit for the WWE Network in 2014 - 10 years after the "ghost" became king of the world? 8*D


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Pretty sure it's EC he's gonna work, with it being his hometown and all. Don't think he'll be at the Rumble since it sells itself and Batista is already gonna draw some extra buys for it.

EDIT: I predicted 2014 will be great and it couldn't have started any better!  ___4 is the year of the wolverine!


----------



## Arm-Bar1004 (Mar 7, 2012)

The Steiners are in fact an awesome tag team. I still can't believe that that is the same Scott Steiner as the one that came back in 02. 

Also I really don't see Brock having the championship match any other time than EC. He can't do it at WM unless they have a triple threat and we all know he is never going to wrestle on Raw again. He could have a run in after the match at Royal Rumble but that would really suck.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

2014 does have big shoes to fill in. It has to not only improve (badly) on PPV, but to keep the streak of great TV stuff if it wants any momentum. As far as the PPV stuff, the Rumble looks semi-good - the Rumble match will hopefully be more star-studded, and since nobody is quite sure of what's going down at WM 30 yet, more unpredictable than years; Orton/Cena is an OK addition to the undercard, and we may also see Lesnar wrecking someone, Rhodes/Wyatts and AJ/Natalya or something like that. No way it will fail to improve on last year's atrocity of a show, that's certain.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Cena/Rollins is kind of awesome. Wonderful showcase for Rollins but still reeked a bit of LOLCENAWINS in the end for me. ****1/2* and I really look forward to a proper program between these guys in the future hopefully. It's not better than Bryan/Orton from Raw the week prior however. Not even close.


----------



## Srdjan99 (Apr 30, 2012)

2013 was an awesome year in terms of in-ring work, lots of MOTY contenders. Sincerely hope that 2014 can match it and maybe be even better. Oh and seriously hope for a better Mania..


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

Mania 30 needs to smoke Mania 29 because I'm going. I can't see that being a problem though since Mania 29 pretty much blew chunks.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

May have blown chunks in Mania standards, but it was still a good show imo. Henry/Ryback blew and Rock/Cena II was WTF-worthy, I'll give you that, but the rest was consistently either enjoyable or good, with one classic. Compared to stuff like WM 2 and 11, 29 is fucking SummerSlam 2002. People calling it the "warst Maniah ever ZOMG" like they did with 27 (though that one is more justified) is ridiculous.


----------



## Starbuck (Apr 11, 2008)

I prefer 27 to 29 tbh. But sometimes I feel like I'm not giving 29 a fair shot since I've only seen it once. It was a pretty terrible live viewing though from start to finish. I'm sincerely hoping that they make up for it with 30. No matter what it will likely be better to me because I'll be there and will therefore have obvious bias but still.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

Lesnar/Hunter was good. Punk/Taker was good. Everything else was pretty underwhelming/didn't get enough time imo.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

Honestly, after the Shield opener, the only thing I enjoyed was Punk/Taker. Brock was awesome in the first half of his match, but that's it. 

That said, I only liked Mysterio/Rhodes, Trips/Taker, and Punk/Orton from 27. Neither show was loaded with quality. Maybe I'll rewatch 27.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Nobody liked Hell No/Ziggler & Big E? *Criminals*.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Between 27 and 29, it's tough, but the way I look at it, nothing from Mania 27 came within the realm of awesomeness of Taker/Punk from Mania 29. That match alone keeps Mania 29 from being shit. WM27 has a few very good matches in Taker/HHH, Punk/Orton and Cody/Rey, but again, none of them come close to Taker/Punk... although they're all better than the second best match from WM29, the Shield tag match. But then the other thing to consider, is that Lawler/Cole is the worst match I've ever seen. It's awful on so many levels, and as bad as Lesnar/HHH was from Mania 29, it was nowhere near as abysmal. So overall, I'd take Mania 29>27.

Hell No vs. Ziggler and Big E was decent and what I'd put as the third best match of the night. **1/2 range... but yeah...

Also, on the topic of Cena/Rollins, awesome match, as already said. Bryan/Orton, their last Raw match, was great as well, but I think I'd take the former as the better match.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Wrestlemania XXIX was all sorts of up, with the downside being the horrendous structure of the show mixed with a horrendous main event with finisher spamming out the wazoo. Ryback/Henry is the most underrated affair of the year with Henry dishing out the pain and Ryback bumping like a madman, better performance at XXIX than Dolph Ziggler & Big E Langston anyways, PHEW was that match a bad one. 

Taker Vs Punk speaks for itself. I enjoy pure heel Vs face dynamics, so surely I enjoy that classic more than the Taker Vs HBK/HHH matches bar probably the Wrestlemania XXVI match (They're all classics in their own way). BROCK/HHH I enjoyed bundles and bundles despite being pissed at the booking when it first happened but I totally get it now; faces are supposed to get big wins at the big show, brutality in the PG era at it's finest, BROCK SCREAM. 

Then we had goodies like the Shield match that opened the show, Sheamus kicking ass in that one with Reigns and Rollins going in and making it even better? OOMPH.

Wrestlemania XXIX is a good show DAMN IT !


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I think I just watched Edge/Rio for the first time ever, which isn't surprising since I was sleeping through the first half of Mania, and turned it on right before Trips/Taker. That match is really good actually. Good stuff all around.

So many things wrong with Cole/Lawler. I was wondering if they really were doing that so Lawler could have his first ever Mania match, or if they were just trying to get Cole over as a heel. Probably mostly the latter. I guess Cole was the best choice for Lawler having his first match at Mania so they didn't have to worry about a real superstar losing to a 60 year old announcer. What should have happened was this should have been an extended squash, Swagger tries to get involved, Austin hits the Stunner, King hits some move on Cole (don't know if the Piledriver was legal then), 1-2-3, match over. Feud over. But nooooooo, they had to involve the GM, reverse the decision, and that shit continued to another PPV. 

The ONLY good thing about that match was it got JR on the PPV for the rest of the show. JR during Hunter/Taker :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

WrestleMania 27 - 12

Edge Vs Alberto Del Rio - **1/2 - 1
Cody Rhodes Vs Rey Mysterio - **** - 5
The Corre Vs The Big Show, Kane, Santino Marella & Kofi Kingston - NO - -1
CM Punk Vs Randy Orton - **1/2 - 1
Jerry Lawler Vs Michael Cole - NO - -1
The Undertaker Vs Triple H - ****3/4 - 8
John Morrison, Trish Stratus & Snookie Vs LayCool & Dolph Ziggler - NO - -1
The Miz Vs John Cena - 1/4* - 0


WrestleMania 29 - 13.5

The Shield Vs Sheamus, The Big Show & Randy Orton - ***1/2 - 3
Mark Henry Vs Ryback - *1/2 - 0.5
Team Hell No Vs Dolph Ziggler & Big E Langston - **1/2 - 1
Chris Jericho Vs Fandango - **1/2 - 1
Alberto Del Rio Vs Jack Swagger - **1/2 - 1
The Undertaker Vs CM Punk - ****1/4 - 6
Triple H Vs Brock Lesnar - **3/4 - 1
The Rock Vs John Cena - * - 0

So 29 just wins, but only because it had more stuff I was willing to actually sit through .


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Henry/Ryback started good with exactly the mirrored image of what their match should've been, the two looking beasts and bumping for each other, but then, Henry's control segment... I'm sorry but even though Henry is a fucking badass, that control segment was just dull. Dull, dull, dull. Hated it. And how is that Tag match a bad one? Super fun, got the job done in 5 minutes, crowd was fucking PUMPED, structure was perfectly fine - Bryan/Ziggler quick start w/callback to the 18 seconds spot, Langston comes in and kicks-ass in his in-ring main roster debut, hell breaks lose and Hell No win. I don't know, to each his own.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah the tag is a lot of fun given the time it got.


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

One of the Mania 29 highlights is this:





Then the match got canceled. :ti


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

Hm, I wonder how my ratings for Mania 27 and Mania 29 would place them on the Cal scale... never actually used it before. Guess it'd be a good way to start:

WrestleMania 27

Edge Vs Alberto Del Rio - ***1/4 (2)
Cody Rhodes Vs Rey Mysterio - ***1/4 (2)
The Corre Vs The Big Show, Kane, Santino Marella & Kofi Kingston - NO (-1)
CM Punk Vs Randy Orton - ***1/2 (3)
Jerry Lawler Vs Michael Cole - NO!!!! (-1)
The Undertaker Vs Triple H - ***1/2 (3)
John Morrison, Trish Stratus & Snookie Vs LayCool & Dolph Ziggler - NO (-1)
The Miz Vs John Cena - 1/2* (0)

TOTAL- 7


WrestleMania 29

The Shield Vs Sheamus, The Big Show & Randy Orton - ***1/2 (3)
Mark Henry Vs Ryback - * (0)
Team Hell No Vs Dolph Ziggler & Big E Langston - **1/2 (1)
Chris Jericho Vs Fandango - ** (0.5)
Alberto Del Rio Vs Jack Swagger - **1/4 (1)
The Undertaker Vs CM Punk - ****3/4 (8)
Triple H Vs Brock Lesnar - * (0)
The Rock Vs John Cena - ** (0.5)

Total- 14

Wow... Mania 29 smoked Mania 27 on the Cal scale. 

Made a mistake on The Shield match from Mania 29 and saying it was worse than the top 3 matches of WM27... it was only worse than the top 2.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Though here's the honest of truths - the one inbetween, 28, smokes them BOTH. If just for Taker/Trips III and Punk/Jericho. But heck, Orton/Kane and even Rock/Cena give it points too.


----------



## The Lady Killer (Oct 20, 2006)

johnnyrotten316 said:


> Ryback vs Henry was quite abysmal.


imo2. I thought it was horrible. DUD-worthy, even.


----------



## King Trips (Jan 12, 2012)

Yeah, to each his own.

Like most of Ziggler's work, it lacks true intensity due to Dolph's tendency to want to "steal the show" instead of truly getting engaged in a believable heel vs face battle. It's like everytime he talks or gets in the ring he says "HEY! THIS ISN'T REAL! I'm a HEEL you see! I'm letting you behind the scenes to see what we really do!". That isn't shades of Curt Hennig, that isn't shades of anybody really, just bullshit. Daniel Bryan was fine in the match but ultimately deserved better than to be thrown in a match with a pair of underwhelming workers like that.

Ryback/Henry featured Henry & Ryback running at one another only for Ryback to get blown over and go flying all over the place. How is that not AWESOME? I encourage you all to take a second look .

& yeah, Wrestlemania XXVII sucks besides three matches, with the only standout being HHH/Taker. Miz/Cena, Cole/Lawler, Edge/Rio, Snooki, & that fucking two minute tag all on one card? The FUCK?

WRESTLEMANIA XXVIII DOE. Punk/Jericho stealing the show while HHH/Taker & Rock/Cena give us a couple of all time spectacles. Big Show Vs Rhodes was a NICE moment while Orton/Kane surprised the shit out of me. It's the EVEN Manias that are delivering now, so I have hope for Wrestlemania XXX :mark:.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta (Sep 26, 2004)

ATF said:


> Though here's the honest of truths - the one inbetween, 28, smokes them BOTH. If just for Taker/Trips III and Punk/Jericho. But heck, Orton/Kane and even Rock/Cena give it points too.


Agreed. 

Sheamus/Bryan- DUD (0)
Kane/Orton- ***1/4 (2)
Show/Cody- ** (0.5)
Divas Tag- NO (-1)
Taker/HHH- **** (5)
Team Johnny/Team Teddy- ** (0.5)
Punk/Jericho- **** (5)
Rock/Cena- ***1/2 (3)

Total: 15

Hm... it's tied with Mania 29 on the Cal scale? Did I do something wrong? :lmao

Edit: Looked back and I put in the ** matches incorrectly. Even then, Mania 28 is only a point higher and I know my feelings are it's MUCH better than Mania 29. In fact, if I did the average for the matches, the totals would be (for the three Manias):

Mania 27- 0.875
Mania 28- 1.875
Mania 29- 1.75

...

meh, fuck that. Mania 28>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mania 29>Mania 27


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

Yeah, but true face vs. heel intensity in a random Tag Title match with next to no build-up whose only attraction was Big E's debut, featured Showstealer-era Ziggler and went 5 minutes or less than that is a bit too much to ask, right? 

I remember that initial part of Henry/Ryback - that's what stopped me from giving it a DUD. Too bad Henry's following control segment was shambles and dissapointing. Somebody should've put a laptop with the first match between him and Punk in front of him that night for he to remember what his control segments could've looked like. But again, if you liked it, it's all good in the world dude. Your opinion.

Didn't thought Edge/ADR sucked tbh. I guess some did but it was your typical everyday match for both (which means good for Del Rio). One or two points of overall long-term importance for being Edge's last match too.


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

WrestleMania 28 - 16

Daniel Bryan Vs Sheamus - DUD - 0
Kane Vs Randy Orton - *** - 2
Cody Rhodes Vs The Big Show - * - 0
Kelly Kelly & Maria Menounos Vs Beth Phoenix & Eve - NO - -1
The Undertaker Vs Triple H - ****3/4 - 8
Team Johnny: David Otunga, Dolph Ziggler, Jack Swagger, Drew McIntyre, Mark Henry & The Miz Vs Team Teddy: Santino Marella, Kofi Kongston, R-Truth, The Great Khali, Booker T & Zack Ryder – NO - -1
CM Punk Vs Chris Jericho - ****1/2 - 7
John Cena Vs The Rock - **1/4 - 1


----------



## Choke2Death (Jul 26, 2011)

Bryan vs Sheamus - ZERO - 0
Orton vs Kane - ★★★¼ - 2
Divas shit - ½★ - 0
Rhodes vs Show - ★½ - 0.5
Undertaker vs HHH - ★★★★½ - 7
Team Johnny vs Team Teddy - ★★ - 1
Punk vs Jericho - ★★★★ - 5
Rock vs Cena - ★★★★ - 5

CAL SCALE: 20.5


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Pls guys no more mania 27 vs. 29 vs. 28 discussions, its beginning to be a constant 


Im going to review the entire Randy Orton vs. Mark Henry series


----------



## SaviorBeeRad™ (Nov 29, 2008)

Stars for Morrison/Miz FCA RAW Jan 2011?


----------



## Yeah1993 (Nov 20, 2008)

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Hm... it's tied with Mania 29 on the Cal scale? Did I do something wrong? :lmao


No, the Cal scale is just MASSIVELY FLAWED.


----------



## ATF (Jan 2, 2012)

I wonder why DUD's still don't mean -1 points on the Scale nowadays :hmm:


----------



## Punked Up (Feb 12, 2012)

SaviorBeeRad™ said:


> Stars for Morrison/Miz FCA RAW Jan 2011?


Sweet match, must watch again :mark: also Morrison/Miz/Bryan triple threat submissions count anywhere from Hell in a Cell :mark:


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yeah1993 said:


> No, the Cal scale is just MASSIVELY FLAWED.


Do you expect anything different from me?

Besides, not my fault everyone else started using it. STOP USING IT. It's MY scale. Not yours. HENCE IT'S FUCKING NAME. Unless you are also called Cal. Then I guess you can use it too.

Watched Punk Vs JBL from SS 08. Wanted to watch Punk's PPV matches as WHC from that time but without resorting to youtube I could only get the JBL match lol. Was hoping for a pack or something on XWT with his entire reign but they only got that for his 2011-2013 reign. Anyway, match was good, nothing more. Around ***. :lmao at Cole trying to say that JBL was using MIND GAMES against Punk... AS HE'S PUNCHING HIM IN THE FACE. And then :lmao at the worst ever Fall Away Slam from the ropes by JBL. It's like he just fell back and THEN realised he needed to throw Punk .


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

Thoughts on the elimination chamber match from 2013 ?


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

Wrote this about it when I first saw it:

Mark Henry Vs Chris Jericho Vs Daniel Bryan Vs Kane Vs Jack Swagger Vs Randy Orton (Elimination Chamber)

:mark: This better be as awesome as I've allowed my expectations to dictate.

:lmao new music for Swagger. Sounds terrible :lmao. DUTCH. We need a debate between DUTCH and Bryan about who has the better facial hair.

:lmao when Swagger speaks, he showers us with truth. I thought it was saliva . He has a lisp.

Jericho and Bryan starting :mark:. They don't really do anything spectacular in their time alone, but its fun enough. 

Swagger time. :lmao anyone else thinks he looks like a retard when he runs? Watch him when he gets whipped into the turnbuckle by Jericho. REATRDED RUN.

KANE. Holy shit, they are actually SWERVING~! us with the entry order. Normally they go by when they come out to the ring. Kane came out first, so usually he would come out last. About time they mixed it up (probably happened last year too but I forget shit like that).

A little team work from them before Bryan turns on his partner and tries to pin him! Yes! Break them up! DOOOOOOO IIIIIIITTTT.

Orton next, which means HENRY gonna fuck shit up at the end :mark:. Really hope nobdy gets eliminated until then so Henry can crush them all.

Lol, nice job Orton. DDT KANE on the steel... doesn't even attempt to pin him. I hope Kane eliminates Orton for that .

Henry is getting inpatient. But its nearly his time. Everyone is still in the match, but all are down and hurting. SOMEBODY GONNA GET THEY ASS KICKED :mark:.

Bryan the first to go . That's disappointing tbh. BAM! Henry launches Orton through a pod . Henry catches Kane coming off the ropes. World's Strongest Slam! Kane is gone! HENRY KILLING BITCHES.

Swagger working with Jericho to try and take out Henry. Because HENRY DOESN'T LOOK LIKE THEY DO . Oh shit, double suplex to Henry. ON THE STEEL. One impressive bump for a guy that size!

I saw Jericho setting up for the Lionsault, and I also saw Henry getting to his feet. What happened is exactly what I thought would happen and hoped would happen :mark:. 

Shit. I think Henry is going . NOOOOOOOO. BULLSHIT. BUUUUUULLLSHIT. THAT WAS FUCKING BUUUUULLLSHIT. HENRY SHOULD HAVE WON DAMMIT. THIS SUCKS.

Only one guy left who should win. And it doesn't make any real sense for Jericho to win because Del Rio is a babyface and that match looks shitty on paper. I guess Ziggler could cash in before 'Mania.

Henry comes back! KILL EM ALL. KILLLLLL EMMM ALLLL! Booker T shows up. KILL BOOKER. Dammit. Well at least Henry looks like a fucking BEAST still. Just wonder what he's gonna do at WM.

So Jericho is the only real guy left who SHOULD win, but unless Ziggler cashes in, that would be stupid. Orton doesn't deserve shit atm. And Swagger... well they kinda have the story going with his new character to face Del Rio... but Swagger Vs Del Rio doesn't scream WHC match... certainly not at WRESTLEMANIA. Its more of an IC/US title match on a B PPV. Swagger is winning, isn't he?

So even with HENRY gone, they still manage to keep me interesting in the match. Great finale with all 3 men, that sequence between Jericho and Orton to eliminate Jericho was great... and then SWAGGER gets the win. At least it wasn't Orton... but Swagger? Swagger Vs Del Rio? Most likely Rock Vs Cena II? WM title matches are looking like SHIT right now.

So aside from the winner, I fucking LOVED this match. Might be my favourite. Not the BEST, but favourite. Probably up there as one of the best though. NYR 05 is definitely above it. Maybe 2 or 3 more over it, but that's about it. Great, great match.

Rating: ****

I have however re-watched it and gone down to about ***1/4 .


----------



## Skins (Jan 3, 2012)

:lmao You marked hard for that match on first watch lol, Yea I'll check it out I'm a ec gimmick mark myself


----------



## Emperor Palpatine (Aug 2, 2003)

I think I was just excited for Henry and everything else just became white noise .


----------



## H (Aug 15, 2011)

I felt the same way around Henry going down so soon. Even JERICHO lasted longer, and Jericho never wins anything. Still liked the match a bit. ***1/2 for me.


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

Choke2Death said:


> If you wanna see more of Batista's good matches from his "green" days, I recommend this since you like Orton. Wasn't in my list but it's probably their best match together even though I had the Armageddon match there.
> 
> x2fi4n


Will watch this either tonight or this weekend, and then I will post my thoughts once I do. Thanks!

Anything involving Orton on Smackdown tonight? And if so, whereabouts in the show?


----------



## funnyfaces1 (Jan 3, 2012)

Mark Henry's performance in last year's EC match is easily #1. May God strike with vengeance on whoever disagrees :henry1

Punk/JBL was fine, but there were too many dull points in that match for me. ***-***1/4 sounds about right. I liked their match on RAW a bit more. Punk/Batista though :mark:. I knew I wasn't crazy for marking out for that match when Cody also did the same. As ugly as Punk's roundhouse kick is, he hit one of the best ones I've ever seen in that match.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

funnyfaces1 said:


> Mark Henry's performance in last year's EC match is easily #1. May God strike with vengeance on whoever disagrees :henry1
> 
> Punk/JBL was fine, but there were too many dull points in that match for me. ***-***1/4 sounds about right. I liked their match on RAW a bit more. Punk/Batista though :mark:. I knew I wasn't crazy for marking out for that match when Cody also did the same. As ugly as Punk's roundhouse kick is, he hit one of the best ones I've ever seen in that match.



I want, no I NEED another Henry monster heel run. I'm all for him facing Lesnar and having a massive beef fest, but after that, Henry needs to take out Bryan or another top face and just start rolling through bitches. Henry is just too damn good to waste as a mid card face.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

random 2013 PPV review to be posted soon 

Also bought the hardcore edition of the old FOley set and WM 28 Blu ray on amazon recently, thoughts on the older Foley set?


----------



## LilOlMe (Apr 2, 2013)

smitty, did you ever end up watching the Hogan vs. Warrior match? If so, what did you think?


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

Oh yeah I watched that a while ago lilolme, ****1/4 probably


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> random 2013 PPV review to be posted soon
> 
> Also bought the hardcore edition of the old FOley set and WM 28 Blu ray on amazon recently, thoughts on the older Foley set?



That set is fabulous. Wish they would have included the better Saturday Night match with Vader, but the one on there is still solid. Make sure you check the special features on the first disc, it has the tremendous FCA match with Sting from Beach Blast. That match is legit special, just an awesome 10-12 minute fight. Also make sure you watch the awesome tag on there with Maxx Payne and the Nasty Boys. That's a wild 10 minutes.

The second disc does not have a single match that I would give anything less than ***1/2. Actually all would be ****+ but they included the Raw match with Rocky instead of the I Quit or Last Man Standing gems. Still absolutely worth the watch. That match has the single loudest pop I've ever heard, when Austin's music hits and he comes to make the save. Make sure you watch the Terry Funk match from Raw, it's Attitude Era brawling done right.

I could go on and on hahaha. For me, that Foley set you mentioned, along with Bret's, Rey's, Eddies, and Takers Tombstone set, are all 100% must owns for any serious wrestling fan. Those 5 sets are what I believe pro wrestling should be.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

decided to upgrade to premium 

Does anyone else have Foley/Trips street fight at the full 5?


----------



## Twisted14 (Jan 3, 2012)

Yeah the Foley DVD is very good, bunch of great matches on there. Plus a few matches have bonus commentary from Mick and Joey Styles I think, an awesome feature.

No idea if it has been mentioned here already, but that new DVD set that was announced featuring the best of dark matches and segments sounds amazing. Gotta give them credit for such an excellent idea for a DVD. I'm really looking forward to seeing how that turns out.


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

Choke2Death said:


> I didn't like those matches they had at the start of the year. I really enjoy their match from May on Main Event, though. That one was pretty good I thought. Dunno if you hate it, but I felt it was way better than that ME match that felt like 20 minutes of nothing.


May match is their best. Cesaro was dictating 99% of it so that helped. Still found it to be rather dull at the heart. Not awful, just decent at best.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Mark Henry's performance in last year's EC match is easily #1. May God strike with vengeance on whoever disagrees :henry1
> 
> Punk/JBL was fine, but there were too many dull points in that match for me. ***-***1/4 sounds about right. I liked their match on RAW a bit more. Punk/Batista though :mark:. I knew I wasn't crazy for marking out for that match when Cody also did the same. As ugly as Punk's roundhouse kick is, he hit one of the best ones I've ever seen in that match.


Henry was the only thing about the match I liked. Rest was beyond bleh.

Yeah, Punk vs Batista is awesome. One of my favorites featuring MR. GLASSES.


----------



## IT'S VADER TIME (Jul 14, 2013)

smitty915 said:


> decided to upgrade to premium
> 
> Does anyone else have Foley/Trips street fight at the full 5?



Indeed. When I made my top 100 WWE matches list, it fell in the top 15 in company history. Second highest Foley match behind Mindgames. Hunter was actually damn good as a heel in it as well. And the finish. Man. Pedigree right on the thumbtacks, Foley even has one sticking out of his eyebrow after the match is over :mark:


----------



## Obfuscation (Apr 15, 2006)

I love it, but Foley vs Undertaker "x" amount of times ranks higher for me.


----------



## Smitty (Aug 29, 2013)

*Money In the bank 2013 review *

*Match #1: Antonio Cesaro vs Damien Sandow vs Cody Rhodes vs Dean Ambrose vs Wade Barret vs Fandango vs Jack Swagger 
*
So we open up the PPV and Fandango and Ambrose get jobber entrances, HEYY THE REAL AMERICANS ARE HERE! Zeb cuts a :mark: promo on Philly thats probably true, love the Betsey Ross should have sewn a taco on the flag line, so funny :lmao. Cody and Sandow cut a promo, feels lackluster after Zeb's but still pretty funny nonetheless. I've seen this a few times already but I love the teamwork by the RA and the Rhodes Scholars in the beginning, GO CESARO! Swagger has really grown on me recently, learning from a great like Cesaro must be why, I mean, the guy got a GOOD match out of the fucking Miz. Why is Fandango in this BTW? Dude is nowhere near the level of EVERYONE else in the match, put like, REIGNS in there instead, then you have 3 teams and...Wade Barett :lol. Love the use of the ladders in this, they basically use it the entire match, things like Suplexes and DDT's onto the ladders are a constant presence in the match, and it makes the match much better. Wade Barret almost wins at one point, I remember watching this live I actually got worried, but Fandango pulls off an awesome move, I MISS THE SUMMER . The Dean Ambrose spot is pretty cool but why did he have to botch it? Still pretty cool I guess. Its so :mark: when the RA try to get the briefcase without the ladder, but even more :mark: worthy when Rhodes breaks them up. A this is awesome chant breaks out, and it certainly is. I love the multiple cross rhodes rhodes does, so awesome! In the end Sandow turns on his best friend, not as meaningful due to him not even getting a title out of it, but still an awesome match nonetheless. ****

*CAL SCALE: 5

Match #2: The Miz(sucks) vs Curtis Axel(also sucks) 
*
Oh dear, I cannot remember for the life of me how bad this is'. mean, its gonna be bad, but if I'm lucky it'll be like ** or something like that. Why is Wade Barret not getting a rematch? God I know I watched WWE this summer but cannot remember shit apparently, well this doesn't matter at all so whatever. Thank god Heyman isn't wasting his time with someone like Axel anymore, but he does need a new cient besides Lesnar, Sandow maybe? Axel is laugahbly bad when he yells in Miz's face "I'm the champion!"okay Curtis, whatever. I never got the Miz getting Heyman ejected, can we say WORST FACE EVER! We want Heyman chants begin, Vince is in the back laughing at his fans misory of course. God this is so bland, just boring brawling between two of the worst performers in the company, feels like it lasts a million years long too, really bad match. *

*CAL SCALE: 0

Match #3: AJ Lee vs Kaitlyn 
*
I remember this not living up to the PB match at all, but from the SD clip they played Kaitlyn is so fucking bad on the mic, worse than Axel I think. God that butterfly belt is so fucking ugly. Cole talks about how Kaitlyn has no friends, but Lawler chimes in about how hes friends with her on Facebook, of course you are king :lol. Well this was another bland match, and a big letdown to me, better than the IC title match but that is no compliment of course. I enjoyed the PB match but found this to be boring besides the awesome spear and the black widow. **

*CAL SCALE: 0.5 

Match #4: Ryback vs Chris Jericho *

This is the last PPV match to date for Y2J, sadly, its against one of the worst workers in the company, remember this being laughably bad, tempted to slap a NO on it, ah whatever I’ll watch it. CRYBACK! CRYBACK! really not looking forward to this. God this show was booked horrendously, putting three filler matches in a row, dont forget the terrible Brad Maddox segment. This gets WAY too much time, feels like 4 hours but I think it ended up being like 15 minutes in total, crowd is DEAD as shit for this and I dont blame em at all. GOLDBERG chants begin, their pretty annoying because his gimmick is NOTHING like Goldbergs :lol. So this was the fucking worst match of the night, no contest, might be my least favorite Jericho match of all time, no joke. Fuck you Ryback. DUD
*
CAL SCALE: 0 

Match #5: Dolph Ziggler vs Alberto Del Rio *

Wow huge pop for Ziggler, forgot how over he was at this time, pretty painful when you think about it because now nobody seems to give a shit about him. Of course their PB match is amazing, ****1/2 and my #2 MOTY, 1st is Punk/Lesnar so for a couple months it was in fact my MOTY. Crowd is pretty hot for this match it seems, not suprised consider was so over at this time. One thing I dont like about this match is the fact that they play up the concussion angle again. Really? I'm pretty sure that the concussion is gone 2 months after it happened. ZIggler still stole like a fucking boss though so its okay. Del Rio actually gets some solid heat in this match at some points, trust me I'm not lying rewatch the match. As good as the beginning portion of this match is good the middle portion is quite dull, pretty unfortunate but its still a good match nonetheless. I completely forgot about the ending to this match too, its so bad its not even funny. Fuck the ending, but the match was pretty solid nonetheless. ***1/2

*CAL SCALE: 3 

Match #6: Mark Henry vs John Cena 
*
Oh this match was a solid MOTYC all year long, think it ended out at #8 or some shit like that. Of course the buildup to this was :mark: with that retirement tease, such great shit. Did they ever have other matches? So pretty pumped for the rewatch here, but I wish that Henry won, because Henry as WWE champ = :mark:. Henry is pretty dominant early on in this, not too surprising I guess but weren't there some folks that said this made Henry look weak? If so, it must be for the finish alone. Henry is carrying the shit out of this too, not a BAD match by Cena, but Henry is main it fucking great. Another BIG lift for Henry by kicking out of the AA, if he just lost by pin it would have been fine, its the tapping that bothers me. However, despite these complaints, the match is holding up so well. last 5-10 mins of this are so :mark:, crowd thought there was ZERO chance that henry would win and he made them fucking believe it. Really good match but the ending made it lose at LEAST 1/4*, but besides that its a great match, brutally underrated as well. ****

*CAL SCALE: 5

Match #7: RVD vs Christian vs Sheamus vs CM Punk vs Daniel Bryan vs Randy Orton 
*
I basically haven’t seen this before, stream was fecking terrible and I just never got the time to rewatch it, but looking forward to it here. BIG pop for RVD of course, I used to be a big fan of the guy but I've gone down on my opinion of him, still think hes pretty good but not GREAT. Love the beginning of the match where they all just beat the shit out of RVD. thought it as always shitty that Kane never got replaced BTW, they just ignored that and moved on with 6, BOO! Punk and Bryan confrontation was so :mark: as well, crowd knew the hisory behind it too, which was pretty awesome. Interesting that theirs no ladders or shit early, because its so different than the opener, which was ALL ladder spots it felt like. RVD finally gets some offense in and the crowd goes insane, Philly always seems like a hot crowd it seems. RVD botches a move early too, crowd doesn't seem to notice and just get hotter for the guy it seems. This match makes me miss Sheamus, because this was his last PPV, gonna be looking for the spot where he gets injured. OH SHIT IT JUST HAPPENED, that shit looked PAINFUL! Stupid RVD hurting better wrestlers, not even 10 min into his return no less. Fella is still being so awesome in this, WHILE INJURED no less. pretty fun match so far, not getting the hate at all here, oh yeah because BOO HOO D-BRY LOST! Crowd honestly thought Bryan was gonna win but AXEL interferes? what? bah, thats so dumb. Then the Heyman interference that everyone saw coming I think, and Punks out as well. In the end Orton wins and the WWE has been going down ever since he won the title. Decent match, third best MOTN. ***3/4

*CAL SCALE:4 

TOTAL CAL SCALE: 17.5
*​[/CENTER]


----------

