# F1 2013 thread



## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

Thank you! Saved me having to start a thread.

I'm still not sure what to expect based off pre-season testing. I'm so tempted to set my alarm to wake up for practice so that I'll have a better clue, but being up at 4am and not being able to crawl back into bed might be tough three days in a row.


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## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

I'm tipping Seb to do the business but I kind of expect a big year from Hamilton.


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## BULLY (Apr 20, 2012)

I can hear them from my apartment building. Got free tickets so going to check them out on monday. I'm hoping mark webber finishes high, but I'm tipping that vettel will come out on top. red bull are still looking good.


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

judging by practice mclaren's are nowhere. massa looks impressive.

hoping lotus can build on last season and i'm glad to see my boy sutil back.


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## WWCturbo (Jun 21, 2012)

I'm afraid RB and Vettel will dominate again (sure last year he didn't dominate in the first half of the season but the 2nd half was indeed uncompetitive). I want Alonso to win!


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Didn't see practice, then again I'd have to of streamed it. Good to see the Lotuses are keeping their pace, no surprise that McLaren have dipped off with their 'unconventional' set-up, was always going to happen. Seasonal hopes would be Rosberg getting another win, or few. And one for Massa. If he keeps up his pace, and pushes hard on Alonso, no other man deserves it.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

I'd love to see Vettel toppled but not sure he will be. Ferrari look stronger now than they did this time last year but it was the second half of the season when Vettel overtook Alonso and stormed it.

I'd rather it be Kimi who challenged him and both he & Grosjean looked quick in the second session today so maybe they're in for a strong season. Mercedes quick but unreliable it would seem. McLaren got problems too, Button not happy!


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## Curry (Jan 14, 2012)

Predicting another Alonso/Vettel battle with Alonso coming out on top this time. Hopin for Kimi though, the lotus looks faster than last year so we'll see.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

As a Macca fan, I'm none too happy with the practice results. The sole good thing about what's looking like a potentially weak car to start with is that it should be easier to gauge Perez against Button. The Mercs seem to have gotten things together (lucky for Hamilton, who I'm still cheering for on the side) and Lotus is starting strong-ish (go Kimi!).

I won't be the least bit surprised if Red Bull get the 1 -2 grid positions. Kinda hoping for Webber over Vet, just because.


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## Rising (Jul 19, 2007)

Well exited about new season Red bull look quickest , Mercedes ,Lotus Ferrari , Mcleran look to be struggling bit I am hoping It will competitive as last season atleast at the start when teams try to work out this new tires 

And I also heard it could rain in Australia so hoping for interesting race


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

I felt like I waited an eternity for this season to start. 

Last season was brilliant, I hope this season brings some intense competition, rooting for ALO, RAI and maybe HAM.

(I just hope it isn't the Red Bull show)


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

it's like 90% likely to be raining and humid for quali. possible hailstorm too.


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

What a nightmare, waking up at 5am for technical difficulties and delays  but hopefully we get a rain filled Q2 & Q3, it might be the only way to stop a red bull domination


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

kingfunkel said:


> What a nightmare, waking up at 5am for technical difficulties and delays  but hopefully we get a rain filled Q2 & Q3, it might be the only way to stop a red bull domination


Hopefully. Would love another Jenson win to add to the 3 of the last 4 victories in Melbourne. If it's wet too he'll fancy it. I'd love another Canada from 2011. That was an epic race from Mr. Button!


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## Curry (Jan 14, 2012)

Quali at Midnight and race at 6am, very little sleep shall be had tonight.


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

If it's raining you've got to think the Hulk will be in about the podium along with the Toro Rosso which looks good in rain. So it is pretty open in the rain and Red bull's to lose in the dry(going by practice.

Alonso twitter:
"Good morning! 8;45h in Melbourne. Some rain around, race should be dry, qualy not sure. Going to the circuit now. Interesting day ahead.."


@curry: yeah by Monday I'll be ruined, I'm an Aussie sleeping pattern as of Friday


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Fuck this shit, Vettel on Pole, Massa out-qualifying Alonso, not liking this start to the season at all.


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## Curry (Jan 14, 2012)

Everything looked grim after qualifying but a Kimi-Alonso 1-2 was about the best I could've hoped for, great drive for it too.


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Unfortunate ending for Sutil, was always going to end up that way. Force India will need to start identifying their weaker tyres early in race weekends and eliminate them quick in races. Its very early to pick it out, but Bianchi seems mesmerising in that Marussia. Left Chilton & Pic for dust statistically. Will need more time to say if hes a class act though.

Its good to see that the race didn't turn into a precession like it was predicted. Red Bull doesn't seem too strong on their tyres in a medium-long stint. They'll curb that quickly, mind. But both Ferrari cars seem very strong, would be fantastic for them to finally get that constructors trophy back.


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

this lotus looks good. damn good. two stopped and kimi was still pulling away at the end. tyre degradation will always be such a massive factor and if lotus have managed to harness that pace AND keep the tyres good, they'll be a force.


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## Rising (Jul 19, 2007)

Well that was a great race real happy Kimi won and it was good strategy , I though Ferrari was quickest car in the race but they were trying and cover red bull .Should be interesting season

Red bull are quick but are eating their tires real quick needs to work around it 
Lotus pretty good on its tires but qualifying and heating tires might be a problem
Ferrari looked pretty good with both drivers looking very comfortable
Mercedes well not so sure they had long run on softs but they seemed lack bit of race pace


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Great race. Kind of confirms what I've always believed which is the current 'cream of the crop' are the 2 drivers who have been such since 2005. Fernando Alonso and Kimi Raikkonen. What makes them more dangerous now is even though they may not have the one lap pace of a Sebastian Vettel or Lewis Hamilton, they know how to race, as exhibited today. Raikkonen played that Grand Prix perfectly while Alonso knew what he had to do to get past Massa, Sutil and Vettel and he did so in one strategy call. Championship looks to be interesting. Here's what I reckon the pecking order is:

*Red Bull:* Fastest over a single lap but anything longer and they're quickly drawn in. Didn't help themselves by not doing many race simulations in testing.
*Ferrari:* Pretty good in qualifying and probably the fastest overall race package.
*Lotus:* Just like last year, they're probably 3rd or 4th in terms of qualifying but in the race they're comparable with Ferrari. On pure pace they're probably a tenth or two off but they're the easiest on the tyres which will be vital at points this season.
*Mercedes:* Like Red Bull, the car is a better qualifier than racer. Qualifying-wise they can mix it up with Ferrari and maybe Red Bull depending on circumstances. However, in the race, it's clear the car is fundamentally slower than Red Bull, Ferrari and Lotus.
*McLaren:* Oh dear. Made a bold move to go revolutionary with their design, feeling they'd reached the end of the development curve with their former car (which was actually pretty handy). 5th fastest car in qualifying but at least 6th and well and truly mid-pack in the race. I'm in the minority that support the decision to make the change. Like McLaren though I expected they'd at least be closer to the front, possibly on a par with Mercedes' race pace.
*Force India:* Fairplay. The car is handy. On a par with McLaren in qualifying trim and a beast on race day. They're definitely a step ahead of the other midfield runners now and for the time being, they've surpassed McLaren overall.
*Sauber:* Tough to say. Gutierrez was ok but behind both Toro Rossos in the race, something Sauber won't want. I do however fancy Hulkenberg would have made it into the points. I'd have pegged him for 7th-9th.
*Toro Rosso:* Not too brilliant in quali but their gamble for a wide set up range has paid off in race trim. Both Ricciardo and Vergne in particular were pacey in the race, getting in amongst McLaren. What a change from last year I suppose. It must be said though that Toro Rosso have started strong before then petered out.
*Williams:* Like McLaren they seem to have gone the wrong way. I have a feeling though that Williams' woes are what McLaren feared with their 2012 design later on in the season.
*Marussia:* They've jumped Caterham and in Jules Bianchi they appear to have a very handy driver. 10th place in the Constructors' Championship is very achievable with him at the wheel.
*Caterham:* They got rid of 2 drivers who should still be on the grid, Kovalainen in particular. And..they're paying for it. They seem to have bulit a garden shed that Pic to his credit is doing a half decent job with (though I wonder whether that's due to Chilton not being all that good).


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## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

Why is Webber such a poor starter? Surely he would identify it as a major flaw in his racing and would work on improving it. Kimi was great, Alonso though may beast it this season.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

^The Iceman may have something to say about that. Kimi was Fernando's major rival back in '05, it may be that we have a similar situation here. Raikkonen looks very good.


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

The Ferraris hounding Hamilton and then hunting down Vettel was probably the greatest site ever. 

So can this Red bull not perform in turbulent air because they set up for the pole position and a clean air race?

Bianchi is gonna show Chilton up this season.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Great to see Kimi get the win. I hope he can push even further this season, Lotus too and the early signs are good!


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

kingfunkel said:


> The Ferraris hounding Hamilton and then hunting down Vettel was probably the greatest site ever.
> 
> So can this Red bull not perform in turbulent air because they set up for the pole position and a clean air race?
> 
> *Bianchi is gonna show Chilton up this season.*


Everyone and their mother knew that. Chilton hasn't really proven himself while Bianchi, although a bit too enthusiastic and crashes a fair bit, is undoubtedly fast.


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Chilton is British, so his flaws aren't going to be exposed on British TV and in the Britishmedia. For Bottas, and Williams, not a great start for them. Maldonado wasn't capable of much either before going off. I am guessing they went down the McLaren route of trying a completely new car? Or was the loss of Senna, addition of Bottas, a fair loss in cash? Can't imagine he brought in a good deal of money anyway, he got the seat based on his prior accomplishments, and pure pace.

@Kingfunkel & Red Bull, definately. Their tyres went off quickly once Vettel became stuck behind Sutil, then Alonso. You saw the pace he had at the start of the race. Just went straight off, then either settled for taking the car home, or his tyres started to grain very quickly. Webber wasn't capable of doing very much either, except overtaking Sutil, who was degrading quickly. Can't remember if he overtook Button and Perez, which wasn't much of a feat anyway.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Desecrated said:


> Chilton is British, so his flaws aren't going to be exposed on British TV and in the Britishmedia. For Bottas, and Williams, not a great start for them. Maldonado wasn't capable of much either before going off. I am guessing they went down the McLaren route of trying a completely new car? Or was the loss of Senna, addition of Bottas, a fair loss in cash? Can't imagine he brought in a good deal of money anyway, he got the seat based on his prior accomplishments, and pure pace.
> 
> @Kingfunkel & Red Bull, definately. Their tyres went off quickly once Vettel became stuck behind Sutil, then Alonso. You saw the pace he had at the start of the race. Just went straight off, then either settled for taking the car home, or his tyres started to grain very quickly. Webber wasn't capable of doing very much either, except overtaking Sutil, who was degrading quickly. Can't remember if he overtook Button and Perez, which wasn't much of a feat anyway.


On Williams, yeah I think they went the same way as McLaren. Williams do think there's a good car in there but haven't found it yet while McLaren appear to have made a couple of errors which have made the car fundamentally crap. 

Webber didn't overtake Button. In fact I don't think anyone did on the track. Both Webber and Di Resta got past as a result of pit stops. JB actually did a great job in that McLaren thinking about it. Made the car wide and only lost 3 places (to a Red Bull and 2 Force India's, all quicker cars) and he was able to keep Grosjean behind him the whole race.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

After being so excited for the season to start, I only got to watch the race this morning. Naturally, I already knew the results, which spoils it some for me, but glad I finally had the chance to see it. 

So pleased that Lotus seem to be picking up where they ended 2012 – getting stronger. Kimi's tire strategy was perfect because, unlike several of his competitors cars, his E21 really does seem able to be driven fast without destroying the rubber. In his hands, anyway. 

Sucks for Hulkenberg that his Australia bad luck has worsened at Sauber (and sucks for me since I'd picked him in a fantasy league) but hopefully that's his allotment of car troubles for the next while. Oh, and was a solid return for Sutil. Thought that deserved a mention. 

Now if McLaren will just sort out their mess of a car then I'll be really happy...


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## Lawls (Feb 24, 2007)

R.Scorpio said:


> Why is Webber such a poor starter? Surely he would identify it as a major flaw in his racing and would work on improving it. Kimi was great, Alonso though may beast it this season.


'McLaren has apologized for a software-related issue on an engine control unit it supplies to Formula One teams and which contributed to Red Bull driver Mark Webber's poor start at the Australian Grand Prix.'

Webber edged out Kimi in FP1 over in Malaysia


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Peeked at the Malaysian 2nd practice times, Bianchi above Bottas and 1.9 seconds above his teammate, 1.2 above the Caterham. Bit closer in FP1, but surreal to see gaps that big anywhere.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

^Bianchi is proving good. Interesting times. Raikkonen looks VERY good it must be said and it looks close between he, the Red Bulls and Ferrari. Grosjean doesn't look at the races, Mercedes may be challenged by Force India and McLaren, although they're still off the pace don't appear quite as awful. In fact, intermediate times pegged Button as the quickest so things may be looking up for them.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

^^

Definitely some interesting gaps opening up. 

I have time to myself today so I'm planning to watch some of the practice when it airs here in about an hour (no way I'm getting up to watch practice live during the night).


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

In the dry, I believe the qualifying would of been much more interesting. The Lotus doesn't seem great on wet tyres, neither do the Force Indias & the Mercs. And they were storming round the track until the rain came. It's unfortunate for them, and an unfortunate spectacle. It'll all be back down to tyre preservation with Vettel leading the pack, rather than pure pace, if it was Rosberg, or Raikkonen, or Hamilton, that had taken pole like their earlier pace suggested.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Desecrated said:


> In the dry, I believe the qualifying would of been much more interesting. The Lotus doesn't seem great on wet tyres, neither do the Force Indias & the Mercs. And they were storming round the track until the rain came. It's unfortunate for them, and an unfortunate spectacle. It'll all be back down to tyre preservation with Vettel leading the pack, rather than pure pace, if it was Rosberg, or Raikkonen, or Hamilton, that had taken pole like their earlier pace suggested.


It does seem that there are 5 teams close to each other, which is great, especially given that it may be 6 by Barcelona with McLaren joining the fun. They do seem to have found something which is helping them. They still have ride issues though.


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

No doubt McLaren will find something, but it won't be enough to win at least 2-3 races. May get lucky on the one. Think their fans should be worried, Button isn't going to be the driver to go out and find the missing ingredient to the car, and drive it past its capabillities.

At the start of the year, had the potential to be 8 teams all vying for podiums. But Sauber & Williams don't seem to have made progression. I do hope Hulkenberg makes good steps with them though.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

^ I disagree on Button there, purely because he already is beating that car's capabilities. It's clear McLaren aren't one of the top 5 cars but Button is mixing it up on the bottom end of the top 10 pretty much every session this season. So he's definitely doing a very good job with the shed he has. Perez isn't doing too bad either. Keeping Button honest if a few tenths off. Cars that are almost completely based around Button tend to end up being pretty good too so I wouldn't write them off. 

As for Sauber and Williams, Sauber I can't read them at the minute. It's blindingly obvious Williams have fallen right back, with Bianchi troubling Bottas. With Sauber, Hulkenberg has had such bad luck I'm not sure where the car truly is. He's the real baseline for it rather than Gutierrez. Stumbling at the start of the season isn't such a great idea though.


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

In my opinion, can't really identify if Button is finding that time, since Perez may not of found his groove. They were seperated by 0.2s in the dry, but a second in the wet. I think Button is a solid driver, but nothing groundbreaking, a team player more than a team leader. This season is his time to prove he is an exceptional driver.

Gutierrez looked good in qualy 1, never got to see his speed in the qualy 2 due to the rain. But I agree with Hulkenberg being the one to show where the car is, but judging by times, they've gone backwards. They'll be lucky to get anywhere near a nice % of the points they got last year. Very lucky.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

^Agree on Sauber. From what I see of McLaren, both Button and Perez are doing wonders in a car that just isn't all there. I still maintain it is the 6th fastest car on the grid but Button's mixing it a bit further up and now Perez seems to want to join the party but still needs to find a couple of tenths.


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

i dont rate perez. especially as a consistently solid driver who will continually score you results. seems to be in the takuma sato mould. essentially fast but won't get you the results through one thing or another.

button isn't a leader either. he isnt the kind of guy to lead a team through a difficult period. it doesnt help that mclaren have basically given them both a heap of shit with 4 wheels and a steering wheel, but ferrari gave alonso the same for the start of last season and he managed fine. mclaren seem to be a mess behind the scenes too so im not too surprised. midtable.


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## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

I'm tipping Massa to win tonight


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

Tancredi Palmeri ‏@tancredipalmeri 1m
Listen to this!!! Webber's wife to Sky Italy: "This is disgusting! We saw today who in RedBull is the real team player!"

sums it up really. that move from vettel was bloody dangerous down the straight. mark and newey quite rightly mad after the race.


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

The finish was one of the most bumming things I've seen in F1. Depressing, killed the enjoyment of a very good race up until that point. I enjoyed Vettel's challenge on Webber, but no doubt it has very bad & ugly aftertones for the team. In response to the 'team player', both men had the ego to go out and win it. Only one of them was going to get there what they wanted. It's just a pity it ended that way.


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## WWCturbo (Jun 21, 2012)

It's very hard to say who's faster than who because some teams setup their cars for a race in rain and others for a race in dry conditions. I'm pretty sure Ferrari expected heavier rain.


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## Lawls (Feb 24, 2007)

Awful display there by :vettel


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

A lot of team orders being used here. I'm adamantly against them. You earn your keep. F1 drivers are specifically designed for winning so being able to cleanly overtake is something of an essential quality. At times the teams just don't have that trust in their drivers. McLaren have done with Hamilton and Button previously and most of the time it worked out (Canada 2011 being an exception) so it's definitely possible. That being said, if your team mate is under the impression you're going to hold station, have the courtesy to say that you're ignoring the team orders before launching an attack. Webber didn't see it coming and the move turned out to be quite dangerous.

As for Mercedes, Hamilton said it best and my respect for him has increased after his comments on the podium. Whatever your opinion of Hamilton he's not the guy who asks for team orders to be implemented. Pretty disgusted with Brawn and the pit crew though. I understand bringing your cars back in one piece but at the end of the day, Hamilton was never going to lose any more positions and Rosberg was the quicker car. Nico could have driven past on the straight safely (which he did one time actually) easily so I don't understand why Mercedes would do that.

Helmut Marko's comments were interesting. We all know he isn't Webber's biggest fan and treats Seb like a son. He wasn't altogether happy with proceedings either though. He was able to get a stab at Merc though saying that they had a clear No.1 and No.2 driver. That might drive a wedge.

One standout performance was Button in the Macca. Did a phenomenal job in that car and unfortunately a pit stop error cost him 5th place at least. The way Button was setting fast lap times trying to get back into the points before retiring told me he may have had a podium shout with Lewis' fuel issues. But this was less likely. Man of the race for me.


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## Proc (Jan 4, 2011)

Could someone please explain to me what Webber meant when he told Vettel "Multi 21"?


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

it's a matter of principle. the amount of times webber has abided by team orders when he had the faster car. vettel only started catching mark after he was told to turn the engine down to save fuel and tyres and whatnot and told TWICE that vettel wouldn't attack him. vettel then pulls out a very ridiculous move and basically pisses in the face of mark and anyone who's told him the rules. it's ridiculous.

multi 21 basically means hold position. keep the status quo.


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Lawls said:


> Awful display there by :vettel


You mean lack of sportsmanship?

I agree with this being the right time for Vettel to return the favours to Webber. It was shown earlier in the race though that Vettel got frustrated early on, what he did was a natural reaction from someone who believes he is the #1 driver. It was unprofessional, but I'm sure after being sat down by the team, he'll give Webber a win back, like he did in Brazil '11.

It is also disappointing to have to discuss things like these. In the end, Vettel 'fairly' earned his victory, but due to the nature of the sport, it'll be discussed in a negative light.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Desecrated said:


> You mean lack of sportsmanship?
> 
> I agree with this being the right time for Vettel to return the favours to Webber. It was shown earlier in the race though that Vettel got frustrated early on, what he did was a natural reaction from someone who believes he is the #1 driver. It was unprofessional, but I'm sure after being sat down by the team, he'll give Webber a win back, like he did in Brazil '11.
> 
> It is also disappointing to have to discuss things like these. *In the end, Vettel 'fairly' earned his victory, but due to the nature of the sport, it'll be discussed in a negative light.*


That's the thing though, he didn't. It wasn't really a straight fight because Webber had turned the wick down so when Seb started attacking, he had basically no time to get his car battle-ready. If Vettel had said he was ignoring team orders then given Mark a fair shout and still overtook him, fair enough. But it was the fact he implemented a sneak attack that did it. This incident reeks of Imola 1982, with Villeneuve and Pironi. However, back then there was a genuine miscommunication. There wasn't any of that here. Vettel wants to win which is fine but honestly he also had a degree of pettiness by ignoring the team orders and launching that attack so quickly. It wasn't just that, it was the fact he was completely willing to risk a 1-2 finish for his own selfish purposes so early on! If I were in that situation I'd basically tell the team to get stuffed regarding holding station, but I'd make sure my team mate got a fair shout. That being said, I'd also want the 1-2 for the team, so I wouldn't be pulling any kamikaze moves like Vettel pretty much did. Webber could have shoved Seb onto the grass but his maturity shone through there imo.


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## Proc (Jan 4, 2011)

93.20 said:


> multi 21 basically means hold position. keep the status quo.


Thank you. I wasn't familiar with that expression.


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## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

I agree with the rest in that Vettel was at fault. I dont mind the ignoring of team orders. But if Webber was second going for Vettel, you know Webber would do nothing stupid in the attempt to overtake and attempt to overtake on merit, just like any other overtake, not attack it wrecklessly in the manner Vettel did. If Vettel was patient he could have potentially overtook Webber with a clean racing move, no problems. Of course this would have required the team to tell Webber that Vettel wants to go for it. But yeh Vettel just comes off as a hot head with an inflated ego, what can you do. He's the face of Red Bull.


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

i put this on another forum

it's the principle of what he's done.

he's disrespected his team-mate, the engineers and the team as a whole. they, who employ him and pay him his money, and provide him with a race drive, have told him to do one thing. webber has followed the orders. he could just as quickly have said nah **** you and put in good lap time after good lap time. but he didn't. vettel knew that webber would be following team orders, and decided to ignore his employers and attack mark with a very dangerous move.

that's what irks me. the fact he's hit a man when he's down. i don't like team orders, i didn't like what was happening to rosberg, but in the end he still did what was the right thing. vettel has disobeyed his team, and he's taken advantage of his team-mate.


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## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

^^top post


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

I think your post paints Vettel as hostile and Schumacher-esque, which I don't think he is. I know that there are more radio messages between the team & driver than what gets put on-air, but judging by his post race interviews, he didn't understand what he was being told. Which means he wasn't told enough. I agree with his overtake being ridiculous, and it doesn't help my points because it was a desperation move. I just have a very different perspective on the rest o fit.

Webber's reaction in future races will be interesting. Most likely he'll ignore any potential team orders. And if he is behind Vettel on that day, that could be very dangerous for Red Bull. Two racing drivers in the team going all the way against each other is always an excellent thing to watch, though. And with these two, they don't like each other very much.


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Another reason to dislike VET, respect to HAM and ROS for dealing with the situation in a more mature manner. 

What were Ferarri and ALO thinking? Force India were hilariously bad in the pits, I was rooting for them, tough luck to SUT and DIR.

Is it just me or anybody else enjoying the DRAMA? Since we're on a wrestling forum I kinda feel that all the drama is scripted to add a little spice to an otherwise banal sport, as of late, in the sense of heated rivalries. Wouldn't put it past Bernie to ask VET to turn heel, despite him getting a Cena reaction.


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## Cliffy (Mar 31, 2011)

Jesus, everybodies raging on webber and applauding vettel on the bbc website comments.

Total lack of understanding of the sport.


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

If I was Webber I would of rammed Vettel of the track so neither get the 25points. Red bull need to tell him he's nothing without the car, so if he's not gonna play nice go play 2nd fiddle to a decent driver.

Also well done Alonso on doing a lap, keeping a red bull at bay with a fucked front wing. Also had the wing fell off in the pitlane, he would of lost control and killed people.


So to sum up Malaysia, Vettel steals 25points and Alonso saves the lives of the pit crew. *insert Alo face*


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Cliffy Byro said:


> Jesus, everybodies raging on webber and applauding vettel on the bbc website comments.
> 
> Total lack of understanding of the sport.


You have read their comments there, right? I just went in, and I see the worst string of comments I've seen in almost any site. And most of them are trying their best to make Vettel look he is the leader of the fifth Reich. Their F1 section is ripe with some of the worst selection of posters on the entire internet.


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## Cliffy (Mar 31, 2011)

I was on there earlier and they were praising vettel for being a racer. Dunno if they've changed their minds since.


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

It's turned extremely volatile. Depressing to read. After every race, I am more and more turned away from reading the site fully. Crawling with people who believe their opinions are truth.


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

their football section is just as bad.


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Not yet as bad as goal.com. Can read some of the posts. But it's getting there.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

Double team orders race. Really, that overshadows everything else for me. I know team orders are legal, and I'm ok with that, but the way the drivers handled Brundle's questions didn't exactly do their teams any pr favours. 

Good old Webber; he's sure not one to keep the team business quiet. That was the most awkward podium interview yet, but everyone must have seen it coming. I don't blame him for being pissed. I have to think that Vettel acting out like a spoiled child, passing whenever he wants and fair warning be damned, has done as much, if not more, to sour team harmony as Webber's public dirty laundry airing. I supose it all spices up watching RedBull run off to another superseason... 

As far as Hamilton's post race; I guess it was nice of him to acknowledge his teammate but he came across too apologetic. I wasn't his decision to hold station, but considering the amount of criticism he gets it makes sense that he'd want to show he wasn't demanding #1 status. 

The race itself wasn't all that eventful. Aside from Alonso's wing failure (which could have caused a much bigger incident other than just putting him out early, so there's that to be thankful for), Button's unexpectedly strong position prior to his disaster pit stop and the Lotus sluggishness relative to last week there wasn't that much to note. Or, if there was, it faded in comparison to the obligatory post-race controversy. 

Oh well. I have Indycars in St. Petersberg to watch now. I haven't followed anything pre-season and have no clue what to expect.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Disgusted by Vettel's actions today. The amount of times Webber's protected his position in the same situation and the cunt has the nerve to do that, going against team orders & taking advantage of Webber when he'd slowed it down. Disgusted but not surprised.

Props to Rosberg too for showing Vettel up. Gutted for Di Resta, Sutil & Button too. Why Alonso didn't pit at the end of the first lap I don't know. Crazy & costly.


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## kendoo (Oct 23, 2012)

vettel acting like an ignoramous and as webber said it will go unpunished, i wonder what would happen to webber if he done the same thing


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## Rush (May 1, 2007)

Vettel is a piece of shit. End of story. If there was no team orders to basically cruise to the finish and Vettel overtook him then fair enough. You deserve that win. But when your team orders something, your teammate obeys and you decide to do the cheap ploy then lets face it, you're a dickhead.


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## Lawls (Feb 24, 2007)




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## TAR (Jan 1, 2012)

All this time I thought Webber would be better off without Red Bull, and that Vettel hogs the spotlight.. everyone at work was telling me I have no clue.

I was right about Vettel, massive cunt of a bloke.


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## Phenom (Oct 17, 2002)

I've never liked Vettel. Now I have confirmation that he is a complete cunt.


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## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

It's actually infuriating hearing people who know nothing about the sport saying Vettel was right to pass him because he was the faster car or better driver, completely clueless to the fact that Webber wouldn't have been caught if he hadn't turned the engine down.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Webber seems to be contemplating his future at the team. Now as unlikely as it seems, what do you all reckon would happen in the event Webber decides he's had enough and quits? You reckon Red Bull would give Buemi the seat? Maybe Ricciardo or Vergne? Or even Kovalainen? Heikki has been in the paddock this weekend with Caterham (likely as a push to Pic and Van der Garde to get on with it).


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

I think there's a good chance he'll leave at the end of the season but there's a long way to go and a lot of time for things to change. There's the Vettel to Ferrari for 2014 rumour and we don't know what seats may open up at other teams. If Massa's got a 1 year deal with Ferrari, there may be some truth to the possibility of Vettel going there, and if he does leave Red Bull, Webber might decide to stay and Massa could go join him. Personally I don't buy Vettel leaving Red Bull and I think they would go for one of the TR's to replace Webber if he goes.


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Vettel won't leave Red Bull while Marko is there.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

Vettel _might _move to Ferrari, Marko or no Marko. Folks said Hamilton was career McLaren and that didn't last. Where Massa is back again, and Perez (a former Ferrari backed driver) went to a different team, I could see there being a pre-contract of some sort existing that would have him alongside Alonso in 2014. 

As to Mark, every time there's a falling out, or the illusion of one, between Webber and Red Bull folks start speculating as to where he could go. It's obvious that he isn't exactly fond of Vet, but he's stayed on where he is, when other options existed, so I have to think he can't be _that_ unhappy. He is driving a top car for a winning team, which appears to be worth something to him. 

If the final breakup is imminent, I can't imagine where he'd hop off to that would be worth it, from his perspective, at this late stage in his career. Lotus (if Grosjean falters again)? Swapping with Massa (for a drive and team pecking order position pretty well the same as the one he has now, only with the possibility of better working relationship with his teammate)? To one of the mid to lower ranked teams for 2014, where he'd have to fight his way around in a slower car? I'm not sure he will even choose to stay in F1 post Red Bull.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

To be honest after today's shenanigans I don't think Ferrari would even want Vettel!. Ferrari has always said that no man is bigger than the team, so if Seb was at Ferrari and did THAT, he'd probably have a prancing horse's head on his pillow that night.

As for Mark, he may see it out but I do think that it's possible he'll go on 'gardening leave' if Vettel isn't punished in any way. Mark's a guy who speaks his mind so if nowt happens he may decide to stand by his principles. I do think it's unlikely but I couldn't rule it out.


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Vettel won't join Ferrari whilst Alonso is there. He has a clause in his contract that Ferrari can't sign Vettel while Alonso is there. Also with the signings of De la Rosa/Fishichello and being allowed to take test 1 off looks to have his feet firmly under the table. Rumours are Ferrari have bow'd to his demands and will sign an extension to keep Alonso on further than his 2016 contract and the possible signing of Flavio Briatore to Ferrari.


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## Cliffy (Mar 31, 2011)

Schumacher wasn't bigger than Ferrari ?


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Cliffy Byro said:


> Schumacher wasn't bigger than Ferrari ?


No, and proof of that is in the 1999 Malaysian GP. Schumi was coming back having broken his leg at Silverstone and been out for a while. Irvine, his team mate, was fighting for the championship. Schumi promptly put his car on pole but spent most of the race holding off Hakkinen while Irvine drove off into the sunset and letting Irvine overtake after his final stop.


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## WWCturbo (Jun 21, 2012)

Schumi was bigger than Ferrari at the prime of his career.


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## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

WWCturbo said:


> Schumi was bigger than Ferrari at the prime of his career.




Untrue, plus they functioned fine together


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Oh Vettel. Just when I thought I couldn't think less of you you selfish piece of shit.

I hope Webber fucks him up good & proper now. Red Bull at War!


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

There was action in China but so much of it was determined by tires and DRS that the race felt pointlessly chaotic to me and didn't hold my attention as much as I expected. Could just be me...maybe I'm just not as into F1 as I was a few years ago. The final 10 laps were fairly good though. I'm surprised Vettel didn't catch Hamilton (and relieved that Button at least kept the McLaren in the top 6). 

Anyway, I'm happy with who stood on the podium and where. Rosberg and Webber are having no kind of luck so far this season (and where I have Nico as a fantasy league pick I'm pretty unhappy about that). The latest I've heard is that Webber's signed a multi-year Porsche contract, so I guess there's a good chance this is his final year in F1. Not a great way to go out so far.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

The tyres are having a really negative impact, no doubt. It's more unpredictable for sure but they're not racing anywhere near enough the level they can. Webber said 80% in Malaysia. Qualifying yesterday was a joke with no one coming out for over 5 minutes.

*Edit:* And how hot's Alonso's girlfriend.:mark:


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Class drive by ALO, looked miles ahead of everybody, and his teammate who looked pretty mediocre. loved the implied threesome reference by Coulthard during commentary.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Good GP and everything but those soft tyres are ridiculous. I don't mind having tyres that make drivers think about their strategy because it's an aspect of motorsport and I'd hate to see indestructible tyres because it takes away one of the aspects of being a top racing driver. I thought Pirelli had hit the jackpot in 2011 but since then have been told to make tyres which basically manufacture results. 

Last year to me was the worst because of how many different drivers won. Even in the most competitive of sports, you'd expect a top driver to have nabbed a second win. Even Maldonado got a win because he was the only guy to perfect tyre strategy. It was too much strategy vs speed. 

This year appears to be heading in a similar direction. 3 different winners. I suppose there is a difference for the positive. It feels like less of a lottery. The same guys are appearing at the front and to be fair, in China the top 5 finishers were all of the world champions suggesting that perhaps the tyre situation isn't as bad as you'd think. After all, if your top finishers are all of the world champions, wouldn't that suggest a race result broadly based on ability rather than the car or the tyres?


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Nige™ said:


> The tyres are having a really negative impact, no doubt. It's more unpredictable for sure but they're not racing anywhere near enough the level they can. Webber said 80% in Malaysia. Qualifying yesterday was a joke with no one coming out for over 5 minutes.
> 
> *Edit:* And how hot's Alonso's girlfriend.:mark:


I think they need to change up qualifying now that they have these tyres. They shouldn't have had the soft tyres around to be honest but I think Pirelli did it because either they or the FIA messed up on the wear ratio between tyres. The softs grain too quickly and the mediums are actually pretty stubborn for mediums. Using mediums and hards could have offered a 1 stop race for someone like Button. 

On quali, it's been like that for a while tbh. Most cars are only on it right at the end. Personally I'd have the top 10 from the second round of qualifying do a one-lap shootout. A mix of this qualifying rule and the last if you will. It'll use less tyres because it's one run maximum, it forces cars to actually put in a timed lap and it'll put on a spectacle for the fans imo.

And yes, Alonso's girlfriend is VERY hot


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Jammy said:


> Class drive by ALO, looked miles ahead of everybody, and his teammate who looked pretty mediocre. loved the implied threesome reference by Coulthard during commentary.


Yeah not sure what happened with Massa tbh. He looked damn good early on, especially with that overtake on Hamilton. He and Hulkenberg too seemed to drop like a stone towards the end of the race. For Massa, he realistically should have finished behind Ricciardo! But the Toro Rosso had a couple of issues (storming drive for the Aussie has to be said). Not sure what happened. Wasn't just those 2 either. Grosjean was miles behind Kimi. Perez was miles behind Button. Rosberg too wasn't having a spectacular race before his retirement but who knows whether that was his performance or whether the car was breaking down the whole time.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Nige™ said:


> Oh Vettel. Just when I thought I couldn't think less of you you selfish piece of shit.
> 
> I hope Webber fucks him up good & proper now. Red Bull at War!


And Webber gets absolutely horrible 'luck'. You have to wonder whether Marko is sabotaging the guy 

Yeah Vettel, albeit honest of him, basically proved he's a piece of shit. Many people don't like him. A lot believed it was because of his success but I personally think the more savvy fans saw through his smoke and mirrors if you will. I was always on the fence. His petulance at times made me more weary of supporting him and his actions at Malaysia did it for me. I knew it was 100% deliberate and that 'apology' was as fake at Katie Price's tits. 

Webber isn't staying past next season and there's already reports he has agreed a deal outside of F1. I do feel bad for whoever steps into Red Bull though. Only guy who imo would be able to deal with it is Raikkonen. And tbh I wonder whether he'd actually go given the obvious favouritism at the team. And it's not even within the team, it's from the top. So even if the team think Seb's a piece of crap, they can't do a damn thing about it.

I really hope Webber becomes a thorn in Vettel's side, not even competing for the championship just making sure Vettel doesn't win. That to me would be ultimate poetic justice.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Yeah I'd love to see Webber go out of his way to fuck Vettel over. I just don't think he'd do that to the whole team, crew etc. Unlike Seb he's very honourable.


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## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

I think Webber hit Vergne thinking it was Vettel :side:


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Nige™ said:


> Yeah I'd love to see Webber go out of his way to fuck Vettel over. I just don't think he'd do that to the whole team, crew etc. Unlike Seb he's very honourable.


Webber will be mature. I think Vettel has some problems going forward though. He basically admitted he doesn't give a shit about the team. If Red Bull brought in someone like Raikkonen who doesn't play politics, doesn't bullshit and just gets on with the job at hand (not to mention being almost universally liked) then I think we could see a monumental chucking of toys out of the pram. And I would pay to see it


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Kimi is a legend. I'd be amazed though if anyone but Ricciardo replaces Webber at Red Bull from their partner team. It's been expected for a while and his performance at the weekend for Toro Rosso will reinforce that.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Nige™ said:


> Kimi is a legend. I'd be amazed though if anyone but Ricciardo replaces Webber at Red Bull from their partner team. It's been expected for a while and his performance at the weekend for Toro Rosso will reinforce that.


Well if Kimi's available I reckon Red Bull might try and snap him up. They've sponsored him before too in WRC. Ricciardo I think is the current favourite based off his performance in China but if he can't do that consistently I think Red Bull may look to steal Raikkonen from Lotus.


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Yeah I see the Anti-Vettel sentiment is alive and well everywhere, be in comment section in newspapers, to forum boards LOL.

Well I'm going against the grain, Webber hasn't been a good supporting team mate like Massa is to Alonso.
Look at last years final race, where Seb is coming through the field to retain his title, webber nearly takes him off, yes sooooo supportive!!!

It's funny I remember posting on the mclaren forum (official team member one), that Alonso's best supporting act wasn't for Massa, who did a fine job, but it was Webber.
There problem is a personality one initially, and he is very good friends with Nando, sheds some light no?

What i find so ironic, the biritish media especially were up in ARMS when german Schumacher passed Barrichelo at austria under 'team orders'.
Everyone rightly argued that is is against the spirit of racing, that even led to a rule change.
However same media are now up in arms for Vettel passing his team mate who he was faster then.
JESUS!!!!
Even Hamilton wanted Nico Rosberg to pass him, but Rosberg showed class and adhered to team orders.

I'm a Mclaren fan from the days of Senna and Prost going wheel to wheel and having a vicious battle (prost is a scumbag and a cheat and started all the bad blood AND cost Senna two titles) so that may explain my mentality to the situation.

You go hard or you go home!


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

so if rosberg showed class and followed team orders, hasn't vettel showed no class by disobeying team orders?

vettel was only faster because webber was told to turn his engine down and vettel didn't. hence, he was faster.


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## Lawls (Feb 24, 2007)

Nattie7 said:


> Yeah I see the Anti-Vettel sentiment is alive and well everywhere, be in comment section in newspapers, to forum boards LOL.
> 
> Well I'm going against the grain, Webber hasn't been a good supporting team mate like Massa is to Alonso.
> Look at last years final race, where Seb is coming through the field to retain his title, webber nearly takes him off, yes sooooo supportive!!!
> ...


This guy has no idea what is going on.

What Loud Alarm said, if Webber didn't turn down his engine he'd have won the race.


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

and by default everyone wants Nando to win the WDC this year, the same guy who bitched about hamilton being allowed to RACE him.
Felt so wronged for macca letting team mates race, he gave the info that led to them losing the constructors points.
No surprise he leaked the info at his lowest point with mclaren after it spilled over from him not feeling like the official number 1.
Yet Renault were shown to have done the same thing maclaren did, during nando's time there hmmmmmmmm.

Had his team mate deliberately crash to win a race, he was in the know, yet gets a pass, why didn't he grass on Flavio and Piquet then? Because it was benefitting him?

I see through all this bullshit

go hard, or go home!


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Loud Alarm said:


> so if rosberg showed class and followed team orders, hasn't vettel showed no class by disobeying team orders?
> 
> vettel was only faster because webber was told to turn his engine down and vettel didn't. hence, he was faster.


Yes Vettel showed little class by what he did, I never said Vettel was classy.
I used class for Rosberg because he acted in a manner, he could have disobeyed it, but didn't.
BUT lets all stop this bullshit, on one hand people complain for someone FOLLOWING team orders, then bitch when another person DOESN'T.


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

so basically you don't like alonso

gotcha.


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Loud Alarm said:


> so basically you don't like alonso
> 
> gotcha.


no, i don't like hypocrites


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Lawls said:


> This guy has no idea what is going on.
> 
> What Loud Alarm said, if Webber didn't turn down his engine he'd have won the race.


oh please, I don't know what I'm talking about?
sorry but how old are you?

firstly, I'm not a guy, secondly, I understand you have some aussie solidarity going on with the bridesmaid Webber, but no, just NO!
go look at silverstone 2011 and brazil lst year!!!
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/mo...orders-and-flying-after-Sebastian-Vettel.html

''He revealed the team had first instructed him to hold position “four or five laps” before the end. 

He said: “http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2011/07/10/webber-red-bulls-order-pass-vettel/I ignored the team and I was battling to the end.”


Please don't try and say I have no clue, debate me and show me where I am wrong, but don't try and patronise me.

Thirdly and lastly, people can't choose to criticise someone prior to follow team orders, then criticise someone for ignoring it.

that's it, done!


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

the main difference in the end is webber didn't pass vettel.


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Loud Alarm said:


> the main difference in the end is webber didn't pass vettel.


not for want of trying, he couldn't because they ran out of laps, seriously let's stop with this please!!

Also about the engine thing, why does no one mention the tyres? Vettel was on the faster tyres.
That's ignored though, just like people will ignore Webber disobeyed team orders himself.

''What makes yesterday’s situation more intriguing is that Vettel was on a different tyre strategy from Webber; having made an error by pitting too early for slicks which cost him the lead to Webber, Vettel was attempting to get the win back by running a strategy which would see him on the faster (medium) tyre in the closing stages. Webber was on the hard compound which was around 0.6s per lap slower.''

http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2013/03/analysis-why-did-vettel-ignore-team-orders-and-pass-webber/


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

and the same intention was there, that is what is hypocritical, they both chose to ignore team orders, different end result, but they both have done the SAME thing.

One is not a saint, the other is not a sinner, a racers instinct is to RACE!!!!!!!

Also people (media) can not criticise team orders as against the spirit of racing in one situation, then criticise someone for disrearding team orders to race.


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## Lawls (Feb 24, 2007)

Nattie7 said:


> oh please, I don't know what I'm talking about?
> sorry but how old are you?
> 
> firstly, I'm not a guy, secondly, I understand you have some aussie solidarity going on with the bridesmaid Webber, but no, just NO!
> ...


I still think Webber would've won the race 

And I'm 19 (almost 20) how old are you?

And sorry for calling you a 'guy' what shall I call you? :vettel


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## Muerte al fascismo (Feb 3, 2008)

I'm amazed the Bahrain GP is going ahead. Putting people in unnecessary danger and Giving legitimacy to a terrible regime.

Webber is also getting completely screwed over. Red Bull should be ashamed.


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## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

Just for the tyre argument, Vettel was on the faster tyre but it was also the tyre that lasts less, would have probably only got a handful of good laps on it is he was full pushing, meaning Webber probably ends up winning quite comfortably. Either way, I just want tonnes of races from now to the end of the year where they are right near each other just for the tension of what could happen. Would love Webber to take him out last race if the season if it means it costs Vettel the title. Big FU on the way out.


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Lawls said:


> I still think Webber would've won the race
> 
> And I'm 19 (almost 20) how old are you?
> 
> And sorry for calling you a 'guy' what shall I call you? :vettel


Well I disagree about the winning the race, once Vettel was left with no option but to use his fastest tyres in his last stop, he was in prime position to attack in the latter half of the race, or closing stages to be precise.

Webber had tyres 0.6s a lap slower, as soon as the final pits were done, Horner has said, he then called off the racing.

That to me is against the spirit of racing, Seb was faster, engine turned down on not, when you're on slower tyres, what do you think will happen?

I've already admitted Seb lacks class, I don't even like him tbh, and Webber was the lesser of two evils, up until I saw the blatant lies and hypocritical rambling by the press and sheep.

Webber and Vettel both have done the same thing to each other, so let's not white wash that fact.

By some of the posters logic in here, an attempted murderer is better than a murderer, as their victim never actualy died :lmao:lmao

As for my age, I'm old, a lot older than you chap, I was watching F1 during the golden era, I'm a massive Senna fan. That should indicate what type of mentality I come from LOL.

as for the last part, I'm not even going to entertain that with an insult, your knowledge of F1 leaves me with the desired satifaction


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## Lawls (Feb 24, 2007)

Cool.

Get off this forum and do something with your life :troll


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

I want to defend Vettel's actions, I've tried and given it lots of thought over the past 3 weeks, but it's not entirely possible other than he doesn't want to be losing points early in the season. People are using hindsight to bash Vettel, and being extremely hypocritical in the process. I can guarantee that the ones who are lamenting his actions, are probably the same ones who support what Alonso does, like Nattie says, just batting an eye away from it. Are probably the same ones who vindicated the use of team orders in other situations. If Vettel wins the championship by 1-6 points, then his victory in Malaysia is even further justified. He did what he needed to do to be World Champion.

Also got to add, dislike the sympathy that Webber is recieving from the press. Where was it for everyone else who fell foul to team orders? They were probably told by the press, and fans, to buck up and accept being #2. And, as an FYI, I do like Webber. He's a great guy, but sport is cut-throat. Vettel is also a great guy, but there is something people get for rooting against the #1 man, the champion. Weirdly, same applies to football, in the shape of Manchester United.



Lawls said:


> Cool.
> 
> Get off this forum and do something with your life :troll


Hate comments like these. It would apply to everyone, even yourself. I would just bash, but it's pointless.


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## Lawls (Feb 24, 2007)

do you not see the :troll


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Desecrated said:


> I want to defend Vettel's actions, I've tried and given it lots of thought over the past 3 weeks, but it's not entirely possible other than he doesn't want to be losing points early in the season. People are using hindsight to bash Vettel, and being extremely hypocritical in the process. I can guarantee that the ones who are lamenting his actions, are probably the same ones who support what Alonso does, like Nattie says, just batting an eye away from it. Are probably the same ones who vindicated the use of team orders in other situations. If Vettel wins the championship by 1-6 points, then his victory in Malaysia is even further justified. He did what he needed to do to be World Champion.
> 
> Also got to add, dislike the sympathy that Webber is recieving from the press. Where was it for everyone else who fell foul to team orders? They were probably told by the press, and fans, to buck up and accept being #2. And, as an FYI, I do like Webber. He's a great guy, but sport is cut-throat. Vettel is also a great guy, but there is something people get for rooting against the #1 man, the champion. Weirdly, same applies to football, in the shape of Manchester United.
> 
> ...


:clap

Very well said.

I don't like, especially being a relatively new poster and having a different opinion to nearly everyone, that I was ripe for an attack.

When I have clearly presented evidence to show the hypocritical nature of posters and press, I'm accused of being a troll.

If you disagree with my opinion, tell me why, don't say 'I have no clue', because I do, clearly more than someone who has refused to debate my points presented, the old saying 'play the ball not the (wo)man, applys here.

I guess when people are insecure in their own opinions, it leads to this.

I'm in no way a Vettel fan, I respect him as a champion, triple champion and youngest ever champion and three times winner.
But when the press and the fans go on about this, like he is the devil, completely ignoring firstly WEBBERS same actions, and secondly other drivers immoral behaviour, makes me want to point out the double standards.
I'm glad there are some articulate posters on the F1 thread, look forward to debating the many twists and turns still to come.


@R.Scorpio
So I take it when Schumacher took out Hill, Jacque Villenervue etc to win/try and win the WDC, you were not one of the fans and press who were up in arms about such dangerous and nasty tacitcs?
Deliberately taking someone out the race, imagine if it goes wrong and the other person gets injured or even killed, is a position you advocate? 

Overtaking is part and parcel of racing, driving into someone to take them out, is never acceptable.
Even as a senna fan I say this:lol


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## Bullseye (Oct 20, 2006)

The reason people are kicking up a stink is because for the last 3 seasons Webber has towed the company line and followed team orders to allow Vettel victory (races last year where Webber held up Alonso to prevent a challenge for the race win). When the shoe is on the other foot, Vettel becomes a selfish little cunt and bypasses team orders to steal the spotlight. Yes, he had faster tyres, but if Webber had not shut down his engine, following team instructions, then he goes on to win the race at full race pace.

The only fix for this issue is for the FIA to issue a mandate that makes team orders illegal and forces teams to race the entire duration of a race, to give the fan what they are paying (if in attendance) for, or what they're runing in for, and that's top line racing.


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

*" Of course I ignored the team as I want to try and get another place. Seb was doing his best and I was doing my best.''

*

that's within the 'past three seasons of Webber towing the company line.

http://edition.cnn.com/2011/SPORT/motorsport/07/11/motorsport.f1.webber.vettel/index.html


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## Rush (May 1, 2007)

sXe_Maverick said:


> The reason people are kicking up a stink is because for the last 3 seasons Webber has towed the company line and followed team orders to allow Vettel victory (races last year where Webber held up Alonso to prevent a challenge for the race win). When the shoe is on the other foot, Vettel becomes a selfish little cunt and bypasses team orders to steal the spotlight. Yes, he had faster tyres, but if Webber had not shut down his engine, following team instructions, then he goes on to win the race at full race pace.
> 
> The only fix for this issue is for the FIA to issue a mandate that makes team orders illegal and forces teams to race the entire duration of a race, to give the fan what they are paying (if in attendance) for, or what they're runing in for, and that's top line racing.


says it all really. 

If Webber didn't shut it down and go to ease it over the line like the team orders were then Vettel wouldn't have got past so easily. 

You defend Vettel's actions? How so? He went against team orders to selfishly grab extra points. If he tried to attack Webber and got past him when Webber was expecting it, and without Webber easing off his engine then fair play to him but he didn't do that. He was selfish, he went against team orders and its utterly laughble that you think its defendable.


----------



## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

What's interesting is, Seb's reaction when asked about Webbers public admission of ignoring team orders:

*Vettel added that he thought the situation had been blown wildly out of proportion.

"To me at this stage it is quite amusing," he said.

"If it was the other way around, there is no point - of course I would like to overtake Mark at that stage, so no point trying to do something stupid. I don't see why there is such a fuss."


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/sport/motorsp...odium-place-20110711-1h9co.html#ixzz2QdMZ1kVv*


----------



## Bullseye (Oct 20, 2006)

Nattie7 said:


> *" Of course I ignored the team as I want to try and get another place. Seb was doing his best and I was doing my best.''
> 
> *
> 
> ...





> "I think we were racing," said Vettel. "It was not a scheduled 'I move right, you move left, I move left, you move right, I brake here, you brake there.'
> 
> "As Mark said, he stayed flat out and tried to race me, as hard as he could, didn't find his way past. To me, at this stage, it's quite amusing."


Big difference there is that Vettel was still at race pace, and Webber was trying to race him at race pace. Vettel had not shut down the engine.


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

sXe_Maverick said:


> Big difference there is that Vettel was still at race pace, and Webber was trying to race him at race pace. Vettel had not shut down the engine.


LMFAO
the goal posts are always moved!
Team: 'hold station'

Webber: 'nah mate'

paraphrasing of course lol

Red Bull wanted them to hold station, Webber refused, look at autosport, they have better quotes and are a trust worthy source just to be more precise.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/93001

Seb was slower in the last stages of the race despite being faster throughout, he even is gracious and downplays Webber ignoring the team.
Webber tried to pass, Seb managed to hold him off.

as for what we are debating, Webber's fastest lap was the one when he was trying not get over taken/eventually passed.

When your tyres are 0.6 of a second slower, you have problems imho.

Vetell was such a classless wally for doing that, butlets not pretend Webbers the saint.

Vettel also backed himself into a corner with having a stratergy to attack in the latter half of the stages.

Trouble is people also making a point or implying Seb only wins his championships from team mates help, er hello schumacher, fernando alonson etc.

The last true teams in the fullest sense who never implemented team orders where mclaren and williams.
but even that's eroded/eroding tbh


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

also do we have a motogp thread?

and if I don't manage to respond to any more posts after 4pm, it'll be because I'm leaving work and making my way to the football or soccer some of you lot call it!


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## Lawls (Feb 24, 2007)

who do you support in the football?


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Lawls said:


> who do you support in the football?


the one that listens to their managers orders:lmao:lmao:lmao


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## Lawls (Feb 24, 2007)

Thanks for the rep!


----------



## Lawls (Feb 24, 2007)

You're the darthsimian of this thread


----------



## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

and why do you care so much?

you think I'm a troll, and now darthsimian (??)

Seeing as you have such a life, go live it.


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

@sXe, Webber has had his fair share of impeding on Vettel. I don't think Vettel looks at this as 'getting one back', but I wouldn't be surprised if it churned on his mind. It's easy for fans & press to make these assumptions after races, but when you are in the head of the moment, strategy locked in mind, and with both men doing something different, Vettel's actions can't be vilified, especially to the degree he has. In most other cases, if it was another set of team-mates, reactions would be very different. Red Bull made the situation around it much worse. They knew the strategies both men are undertaking, they should know their personalities well enough. They were telling a 3 time World Champion to sit back, and they weren't doing it with much vigor.



Lawls said:


> do you not see the :troll


The smilies on this site go over my head. Even the most basic smilies. Didn't think there was enough 'tone' to see it any other way either.


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## Lawls (Feb 24, 2007)

It's 12:30am over here.

Who is your favourite driver? What do you think of riccardo the goat


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Desecrated said:


> @sXe, Webber has had his fair share of impeding on Vettel. I don't think Vettel looks at this as 'getting one back', but I wouldn't be surprised if it churned on his mind. It's easy for fans & press to make these assumptions after races, but when you are in the head of the moment, strategy locked in mind, and with both men doing something different, Vettel's actions can't be vilified, especially to the degree he has. In most other cases, if it was another set of team-mates, reactions would be very different. Red Bull made the situation around it much worse. They knew the strategies both men are undertaking, they should know their personalities well enough. They were telling a 3 time World Champion to sit back, and they weren't doing it with much vigor.
> 
> 
> 
> The smilies on this site go over my head. Even the most basic smilies. Didn't think there was enough 'tone' to see it any other way either.


TBH Seb's justified him ignoring team orders because Webber has done the same.
Where as Seb down played it and found it amusing and stopped the press in their little tedious witch hunt.
Webber's fuelled it with his reaction, obviously I can not tell someone how to react in situation, but the press have had a frenzy!!!!!!!!!

TBH I also think Horner's too soft, hear Brawn's tone of voice to Rosberg, when Nico wanted to go passed Lewis.
contrast to Horners baby talk!


----------



## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Nattie7 said:


> Trouble is people also making a point or implying Seb only wins his championships from team mates help, er hello schumacher, fernando alonson etc.


HOW DARE YOU!!!
Well I'm gonna imply Vettel onlys wins in the best car, give Max Chilton the cars Vettel has driven and he'd win the world championship!

How about the 3 victories last season? When his team mate was in among the midcarders whilst Alonso was winning in a shit poor car in terrible conditions whilst Vettel struggled in a 11th (Malaysia).


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

kingfunkel said:


> HOW DARE YOU!!!
> Well I'm gonna imply Vettel onlys wins in the best car, give Max Chilton the cars Vettel has driven and he'd win the world championship!
> 
> How about the 3 victories last season? When his team mate was in among the midcarders whilst Alonso was winning in a shit poor car in terrible conditions whilst Vettel struggled in a 11th (Malaysia).


before I leave work for the day.

LMFAO

If you think Fernando's ever won a championship when he has had to race a team mate cleanly is a LIE.
He likes teams where there is a clear one and two.
He even had the ferrari dog Massa do a Rubens in a year he still lost the championship. :lmao:lmao:lmao

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2010/jul/26/massa-alonso-ferrari-team-orders

if all else fails he can always get a team mate to crash to ensure a victory right?

And Massa being in the midcards helps, when his rivals go in for pits and come out being the faithful lapdog, we have them work the typical Ferrari team orders magic.

Anyway GOOD DAY TOO YOU!!!!

Football is awaiting


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/motorsport/alonso-leave-mclaren


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Firstly how dare you question the ethics of Flavio Briatore, the man is a saint. Outside of his occasional trips to the casinos and such!

Secondly to call Massa a "dog" is a disgrace, he's a great racing driver and deserved to win the world championship in 2008. 

Thirdly when he was racing his Minardi on a equal playing field with his team mate, he showed him up clearly by miles. Did the same again with Trulli in his early Renault days before he became el goat!

Fourthly Alonso proved at Renault he can win WCs with his back against the wall, when Ferrari complained to the FIA and had them illegalize mass dampers. Then made them remove them after they had already said they were perfectly legal to help Schmi win a WC! 

And finally atleast Massa is professional enough to comply by those team orders! instead of being so unprofessional and selfish to ignore them then overtake his team mate!


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Ok I think someone needs to give Nattie7 his or her meds


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

F1 thread is getting lively but not sure for the right reasons.


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

kingfunkel said:


> Firstly how dare you question the ethics of Flavio Briatore, the man is a saint. Outside of his occasional trips to the casinos and such!
> 
> Secondly to call Massa a "dog" is a disgrace, he's a great racing driver and deserved to win the world championship in 2008.
> 
> ...


a known cheat is a Saint?

You obviously no nothing about F1, go get yourself clued on it.

Last year Ferrari deliberately incurred a gearbox change penalty on Massa’s car at the United States Grand Prix which had the effect of moving Alonso forward one place on the grid. At this point Massa had long been out of contention for the championship.

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2013/04/11/massa-red-bulls-team-orders-intelligent/

"The decision has been taken [to break the seal on Massa's car] to maximise the position for Fernando," said Ferrari's head of press Luca Colajanni.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/20386671

http://www.autoblog.com/2013/04/14/vettel-reserves-the-right-to-continue-disobeying-team-orders/

Webber caught flack last season after appearing to obstruct Vettel twice at the Brazilian GP as the German driver fought for a team win against Fernando Alonso.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/mo...Fernando-Alonsos-stance-over-team-orders.html


At least when I post something, I know what I am talking about and can back it up with relevant links etc.


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

and I'm off my meds for saying, Webber has disobeyed team orders, after 99% of the people on this thread were saying Seb was wrong for doing so.
Why not the same criticism for Webber?

So you want to criticise one person but not the other?
Ignoring the fact that Webber has ignored team orders, obstructed his team mate when he needed to claw his way back through the field, but hey that's RACING.
Oh but the youngest triple world champion in history is wrong, note to Webber, when you disobey team orders, make sure it counts.
Seb is so hurt about some aussie here is seeking comfort with his three WDC's!!!

And again I'm off my meds for saying Alonso has been implicated in some pretty unsavoury things.
His team cheating for him to win and/or get extra points?

Too many sheep on here.

Disprove my accusations if you can.........


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Nattie7 said:


> and I'm off my meds for saying, Webber has disobeyed team orders, after 99% of the people on this thread were saying Seb was wrong for doing so.
> Why not the same criticism for Webber?
> 
> So you want to criticise one person but not the other?
> ...


Well from what I've read nobody has any issue with Vettel choosing to disobey team orders. It's the way he chose to do it. The ambush he put on Webber was akin to kicking a man when he's down, rubbing salt in the wounds, fighting someone with one arm tied behind their back. Plain and simple, it wasn't a fair fight.

But every time Webber chose to ignore team orders, both drivers were going flat out.

There's the difference.

btw, the 'meds' thing isn't as much to do with what you're saying is how you're coming across. It's very 'rant'-like which doesn't serve to help you get your point across. But that's my interpretation of it.


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## Bullseye (Oct 20, 2006)

1andOnlyDobz! said:


> Well from what I've read nobody has any issue with Vettel choosing to disobey team orders. It's the way he chose to do it. The ambush he put on Webber was akin to kicking a man when he's down, rubbing salt in the wounds, fighting someone with one arm tied behind their back. Plain and simple, it wasn't a fair fight.
> 
> But every time Webber chose to ignore team orders, both drivers were going flat out.
> 
> ...


:clap


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

1andOnlyDobz! said:


> Well from what I've read nobody has any issue with Vettel choosing to disobey team orders. It's the way he chose to do it. The ambush he put on Webber was akin to kicking a man when he's down, rubbing salt in the wounds, fighting someone with one arm tied behind their back. Plain and simple, it wasn't a fair fight.
> 
> But every time Webber chose to ignore team orders, both drivers were going flat out.
> 
> ...


ok granted it's the way i'm saying it, not what i'm saying, interesting 

but i honestly want to know why people have stated ''WEBBER HAS TOWED THE COMPANY LINE''.

''WEBBER'S TOO MUCH OF A GOOD MAN TO DO WHAT SEB DID''.

Is disagreeing with the way he did it?

To me it shows the lack of knowledge or pure ignorance of people, when both people do the same thing, don't bitch, because the other guy did it better than you (i.e got a victory out of it).

I've backed up everything I have said.

Like I said, people on here, by using their logic an attempted murderer is better than a murderer, because the outcome was different i.e the victim not dying.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

1andOnlyDobz! said:


> Well from what I've read nobody has any issue with Vettel choosing to disobey team orders. It's the way he chose to do it. The ambush he put on Webber was akin to kicking a man when he's down, rubbing salt in the wounds, fighting someone with one arm tied behind their back. Plain and simple, it wasn't a fair fight.
> 
> But every time Webber chose to ignore team orders, both drivers were going flat out.
> 
> ...


Superbly put.

My anger with Vettel is that he did it when Webber had turned the engine down and he took advantage for his own benefit. I've got no problem with disobeying team orders if it's a fair fight. I think everyone wants to see racing, not the cruising we're getting this season because of the tyre issues.


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Nattie7 said:


> a known cheat is a Saint?
> 
> You obviously no nothing about F1, go get yourself clued on it.
> 
> ...


Lol! What is that? Thought we were arguing your opinion of Alonso not being able to win without the aid of his team mate and him always being a number 1 driver with an unaposing number 2. Now you're on about Webber disobeying team orders. 

So basically you've linked me all over the place to pretty much tell me what I already know. Thanks for confirming they sabotaged Massa's gearbox cover to get Alonso on the clean side of the track well duh! 

With red bull there isn't a number 1/2 driver so why should webber get out of the way in brazil? Plus he did actually move over to let Vettel through.

Why don't I post links, well call me lazy.

Flavio Briatore/Alonso are cheats yet you talk up Prost/Senna. After the politics of 1 and the first corner crashes etc talk about your hypocrisy! Senna purposely crashed to win the world championship, what's the difference between that and what Piquet/Briatore did? 

Take the Honda engine away what are Senna and Prost?...shit Fernando Alonsos! Fact! 
Nevermind the anti-lock brakes, traction control and active suspension of Prost's 1993 car!


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

ROS surprised us all with a blistering lap in Q3, not sure how he was 2+ tenths quicker than VET and ALO, must be the rear oriented performance of his Merc, or Tires, idk. 

Force India did really well, and have great grid position and a quick car, lol @ DIR over his radio message. Race looks really interesting with VET and ALO right on the Merc's tail, and MAS running the hard tires right behind the front row, with 2 quick Force India's on their tail. It's going to be a cracker for sure. 

Oh and I still hate Sky for ending BBC's lovely_ consistent_ coverage.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Jammy said:


> ROS surprised us all with a blistering lap in Q3, not sure how he was 2+ tenths quicker than VET and ALO, must be the rear oriented performance of his Merc, or Tires, idk.
> 
> Force India did really well, and have great grid position and a quick car, lol @ DIR over his radio message. Race looks really interesting with VET and ALO right on the Merc's tail, and MAS running the hard tires right behind the front row, with 2 quick Force India's on their tail. It's going to be a cracker for sure.
> 
> Oh and I still hate Sky for ending BBC's lovely_ consistent_ coverage.


I missed the session but know the results. What happened to Raikkonen? Did he just not have the one-lap pace? We going to see the same comeback he did last year?


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Delighted for Rosberg, needed an early pole to prove to himself & the team that he is deserving of equal upgrades and position as Hamilton. Will also prevent any media jumping on his back as the season grows old. I think the race victory belongs to Alonso though, got that extra something in the car, their tyre degred seems to be strongest, especially in the Bahrain temperatures. As for Raikkonen & Lotus, think they showed their hand in practice, while other teams were tinkering with mechanical set-up.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Delighted for Rosberg too, don't think for a minute he'll win or get on the podium either unfortunately. Disappointed Kimi only finished 9th.

Don't like people still knocking Sky. They've raised awareness of the sport and given us more insight & behind the scenes coverage then we've ever had. Get over it already!


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

1andOnlyDobz! said:


> I missed the session but know the results. What happened to Raikkonen? Did he just not have the one-lap pace? We going to see the same comeback he did last year?


Yeah, his Quali pace over a lap was quite poor, Grosjean was worse, since he didn't even make Q3 (albeit he just got 1 lap), however I have a feeling Kimi will be strong in the race, since Lotus has made it clear the Race pace is a clear priority for them.

While I'm happy for Rosberg, I feel that the tyre deg on the Merc, esp in this track wont allow them to win the race, especially with the 2 Ferrari's right behind them and VET too.

@Nige, I dont have a TV, and dont really watch anything else to waste a subscription on, iPlayer F1 was a blessing. Anyway, minor annoyances.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Raikkonen is generally stronger in the race but I'd say 9th is a bit disastrous for him, especially with Vettel and Alonso up there. I do think it'll be a case of Alonso, Vettel and Raikkonen being the top 3 though unless Massa and Webber have anything to say about it.


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Can't wait to see the fast starting prancing horses pounce, hoping ALO takes this one, I have a feeling this will be a cracker.


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Fucking bullshit result for me, same top 3 as last year. Feel for Ferrari and Di Resta who got so close to a podium.


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Result was inevitable after Alonso's DRS problem. Very unlucky for di Resta. It's frustrating to see victories in the manner Vettel got his, but manner of the circuit and tyres, he just blitzed away from everyone. Also feel sympathy for Rosberg, incredible pole, never gave up but 9th. Same could apply to Button, drove very well but finished in 10th. Strategy ruled in the desert.


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## Cliffy (Mar 31, 2011)

:vettel + Sky Coverage = :buried


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

From what I saw – I was watching while doing other things, so only caught bits here and there – the race itself was fairly exciting, even if the resulting podium wasn't any sort of surprise, ending up with he same three guys standing there as last year. Good news for Grosjean though; getting third might give him a little seat security. 

It would have been fun to have di Resta and his Force India in the top three but I was more depressed to see Nico fade after his strong qualy (mainly because I have him as a pick in a fantasy league). 

Weird problems for both Ferrari cars. 
Macca still sucks. :cussin:
Seb won. Again.

Yeah, another F1 race down and I still care less than any previous year. Strange, that.


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## Proc (Jan 4, 2011)

Anyone knows a site to watch the full race?


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

That was disappointing, I assumed the Ferrari was too quick and kind to its tire. I had this down as a alo-mas-vet/ham finish. 

Great race for Di resta, shame his tires fell off so badly during the last 10 or so laps but it was good to see Grosjean getting back up there after the critics of this season. 

Perez looked like a good racing driver(a bit crazy too) for the first time since monza apart from his occasional flashes of brilliance. 
Williams look very bad this season, especially Maldonado who truth be told should not of been there. Give me the consistent Senna rather than that erratic loon! 
Caterham's Pic updates looked impressive too but VDG needs to be dropped.
Also Sauber are really disappointing and letting the hulk down badly  but Gutierrez will not last the season, the golden boy has proven he can't handle the pressure.
What impressed me most was when the DRS on Alonso's ferrari was broke and wouldn't close how did he keep the car on the track? Surely he should of just spun it


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Reports have Webber quitting F1 at the end of the season. Not surprising. Almost entirely down to Vettel and the team's apathy in any sort of punishment towards him. Will just make Vettel look more of an arsehole, rest of the team too (especially Helmut Marko). Time for the Iceman to put Vettel in his place?


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Any Brits going to Silverstone this year?


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Another De-lamination, different team, different driver, different conditions, what's up Pirelli?


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Best get ready for Mercedes to take a detour off a cliff tomorrow. Their speed in that last sector seems unworldly though, should prevent them getting caught in the pit straight DRS. Regardless of circumstance and situation, amusing to see Button get schooled in time by his team-mate, especially one who was written off so quickly in Perez.


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Mercedes is just fucking killing it in Sector 3, but I hughly doubt they can grab the victory from the front tomorrow, hope to see some great action between AlO, VET and HAM, will be amazing if that happens. 

Hoping for an ALO win somehow


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Oh happy days, extraordinary first lap from ALO, other than that not much excitement to be honest, but F! fans have become spoilt after the epic 2012 season, not every race can be a thriller. Dreadful day for Mercedes. 

I admit the tyres are a little but of a problem, but Mercedes has other problems too, so you can't blame everything on the tyres. Too many Hamilton fans jumping on the bandwagon against Pirelli, I personally think the tyres could be better, but they HAVE to fix the delamination issues. Only a matter of time before an horrific accident.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

This season appears to be fully dependent on tyres which is never a good thing. I'm sure I won't be the only one to say 4 stops is too much in a dry race. And with the issues with failures etc. it's clear Pirelli have been asked to go further than they're capable of and it's hurting the races. I'm worried Monaco will be a farce. Likelihood has either Rosberg or Hamilton up front and 2 trains forming because the Mercs are the worst of the teams (all of them) on tyres.


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

People blaming the tyres should remember that Ferrari pushed from the word go. They weren't looking to go slow and protect the tires. They decided to pit 4 times and race all out. Red bull was caught out by Ferrari. 

Can't fucking blame Pirelli for everything. Ferrari and lotus understand the tyres.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Jammy said:


> People blaming the tyres should remember that Ferrari pushed from the word go. They weren't looking to go slow and protect the tires. They decided to pit 4 times and race all out. Red bull was caught out by Ferrari.
> 
> Can't fucking blame Pirelli for everything. Ferrari and lotus understand the tyres.


Good for them. But 4 stops in a dry race? The tyres are a problem. No denying that. More tyre failures happening too. It's clear the tyres are too big a problem and Pirelli themselves have acknowledged that.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

The tyres are a fucking joke. You just have to look at the immense degradation to see that. How you deal with it is another issue. Some teams have dealt way better than others, but don't let that hide how awful these tyres are.


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## Lawls (Feb 24, 2007)

Happy that Alonso won. Pretty much happy if anyone but Vettel wins :hb


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Nige™ said:


> The tyres are a fucking joke. You just have to look at the immense degradation to see that. How you deal with it is another issue. Some teams have dealt way better than others, but don't let that hide how awful these tyres are.


Agreed. When a guy on the front row of the grid manages to end up well out of the points, there's a problem, regardless of who it is. I'm not an advocate of having everlasting tyres because dealing with wearing tyres is a valid and valuable quality in a driver; knowing when to push 100% and when to conserve. However we're now at a point where the tyres determine the race. Qualifying means absolutely nothing. Not to mention the fact we keep getting random tyre failures like Di Resta's in Practice. It's getting to the point where the tyres may not even be safe!


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Lawls said:


> Happy that Alonso won. Pretty much happy if anyone but Vettel wins :hb


Vettel really is the most hated driver in F1 haha. He's made his bed though. Disrespected his team, his team mate, and then tried to get out of it with the most fake apology I've seen in ages, only to do a 180 and backtrack at the next race. And what he said essentially proved him a complete arsehole. Can't wait for next year. Likelihood is Raikkonen steps into the Lion's Den, and I reckon he can win. The Iceman won't take any shit and is good enough to beat Seb.

On the race, Alonso and Raikkonen AGAIN showing they're a class above everyone atm. Truly elite drivers but when elite drivers are as experienced as those 2, it's ominous. Vettel can win races with the best car, he can overtake and can do very well with a not quite so great car. But right now he doesn't seem to quite have the nous Alonso and Raikkonen have in a situation where you have to really think. You can look at Button's serge (pun intended  ) to 8th from 17th at the end of the 1st lap too. The drivers that had given best thought to their race ended up benefiting. That's a positive of degrading tyres. HOWEVER, it was too much. 4 stops!? In a dry race, that's unacceptable. Glad Pirelli are changing because it's needed.


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## Stone Cold 4life (Dec 17, 2008)

Jammy said:


> Any Brits going to Silverstone this year?


Yep I'm going. I go every year. Sitting in the luffield complex on race day this year. I normally wake up at 5:30am on the friday and saturday to ensure I get front row pit lane seats.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

This was the first race to make me complain about the Pirellis. I don't have any issue with the podium finishers – in fact, I'm quite pleased with the result – but those tires were ridiculous. I ended up watching more of the Giro live than the Spanish GP, and it's pretty rare for me to more or less give up on a race.


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## Rising (Jul 19, 2007)

Well I am fine with tires degrading fast it gives good races otherwise the races will be damn boring like the always fastest car winning but I think it has went bit to much maybe a bit less disintegrating tires with 2-3 sops would be better 

Speaking of this season Ferrari really look the quickest car out there 3 races in which they have not made mistakes they Alonso has finished 2-1-1 and so they are team to beat


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

I'm indifferent about the tires sure they go off too fast. With 4 pit stops being too much and that they aren't racing 100% of the time but I also didn't like watching Schumi/Vettel and co getting pole and leading for the full race. The tires are somewhat ruining the racing aspect but they're also bringing more excitement with the possibility anything can happen.

It looks like Ferrari are finally pointing in the right direction. Updates are working, they've resolved the wind tunnel issue, Byrne has returned, Massa on form, Pedro dela rosa working on the sims, they understand the tires and everything is falling into place. 
With everything coming together Dietrich Mateschitz coming out trying to get tyres changed is showing signs Alonso and Ferrari have got him flustered. They'll be spending so much time working out the tyres while Ferrari will be more focused on the chassis/wings/etc. had Massa not got the grind penalty for blocking Webber it would of been a Ferrari 1/2 or in red bull term Monty 34!

If Ferrari can't get help from in season testing to help them then why should the tyres change to help the red bull. If they change them that would mean Ferrari/Lotus would have to go back to the start to let Red bull catch up on the understanding of the tyres.


----------



## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Mateschitz has a point, as do Red Bull. While the tyres this year should be looked as a technological challenge, with Lotus & Ferrari mastering it, they do act like a clamp with the severity of the degration, and cuts down the sport in F1. Why not just take away how fast it degrades, and try to find another way to make it a challenging aspect for teams to try and find a way to get the maximum potential out of them? I am sure there are ways, make mediums/softs more durable under certain temperatures, while requiring the primes to perform under a higher temperature. Just spitballing here. But something around that wheelhouse, maybe with a more ruthless touch to those who can't master some of it. It would put in a lot of strategising.

Requiring a certain temperature to unlock the potential of the soft/mediums, but you can't get the temperature required to work the primes could result in great strategies. When do they use the primes. Or if a team runs on higher temperatures, they will get less pit stops in and could cut ahead of people running softs/mediums due to it. Possibillities.


----------



## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

I know what he's getting at but it's a case of learning for 2014 from '13s mistakes.

As Ferrari/Lotus have designed and made parts to help maximise the tyres without them degrading as much as red bull or the merc. So if they do change them like they've said they're think of doing, Ferrari/Lotus have spent 5 months going in the wrong direction to try and lower the degradation on the tyres just for them to be changed.

What happens if they do change the compounds slightly then merc and red bull can get them working but Ferrari and lotus can't then can they ask them to change the tires to suit their cars?

They spent winter testing and the few practice sessions trying to remedy the degradation would be wasted along with the parts made as they won't maximise the tyres like these ones which would mean the air flow, wings, chassis, engine and just about anything will need modified meaning the 4-5months of effort, research, testing, designing, planning and building will all of been pointless for them.

It's a case of Fernando Alonso and the mass damper. The Renault built the car around that, to maximise it and once the FIA banned it half way through the season the car was pretty poor. Fortunately Alonso still showed Schumi who the best driver was.

Edit: just to throw this out their, in Spain 2011 Vettel won with 4 pit stops


----------



## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

I'd say best to get more durable tyres. As much as I like Vettel not winning, there's an issue. And while I think Hamilton's race wasn't all luck but partly a qualifying setup and his serious inability to save the tyres (something Rosberg did rather effectively), 4 stops in a race is too much especially when on new tyres the guys could barely push. 

To me the FIA are trying to make racing exciting but they keep adding way too much stuff. Why not try and build F1 cars that can handle being behind another one? You wouldn't need DRS. Then with the tyres, make sure races have the 2-3 stop tendency, allowing drivers to push 100% at times and having to conserve tyres at others. I get this isn't as easy as I'm trying to make it sound  but I do think this is just getting too complex.


----------



## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

It's almost MONACO QUALIFYING time :mark:

Grosjean crashed out in FP2 and FP3, have a feeling him and Massa may not be able to take part in Quali, lets see. Hope they can fix the cars in time.


----------



## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

WET MONACO QUALIFYING :mark:


----------



## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

Not a bad quali. It's nice that Nico enjoyed his pole so much since, considering he's driving a Mercedes, he'll probably be sliding down the order all day tomorrow. Hamilton too. Or maybe I'm wrong and the team has the incredible pole-sitting car that races like a donkey all sorted, but I don't have my hopes up. Would be great if I was wrong tho. 

And where did Grosjean disappear to? I can understand why Maldonado couldn't keep up the pace on a drying track in his Williams but I really expected better from Grosjean.


----------



## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Mercedes lockout again fpalm. Should be a very fun race tomorrow. Will it be a train? or will we see 'overtaking'?


----------



## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Jammy said:


> Mercedes lockout again fpalm. Should be a very fun race tomorrow. Will it be a train? or will we see 'overtaking'?


Luckily Monaco is the best place for that, a Mercedes lockout. Means the race should be very competitive. We'll see a train but that's going to be a sight to see. Hopefully though someone decides to be brave and give overtaking a go.


----------



## Chr1st0 (Jun 18, 2011)

:lmao Martin's Grid Walk is hilarious


----------



## God™ (May 26, 2008)

Grosjean is a fucking retard.


----------



## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

Great race. Rosberg was great, Hamilton unlucky to fall 4th and Grosjean fpalm


----------



## BoJaNNNNN (Apr 2, 2012)

Anyone has a video of how Kimi got past two drivers (Gutierrez and Hulkenberg if I recall right) to end up 10th? Wasn't shown on TV.


----------



## Allur (Jan 17, 2012)

Bottas on the 3rd position? What in the heck is this?


----------



## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Good race, loved the action between ALO and HAM, great drive by ALO, DIR, JEV and of course, VET. The Red Bull is just tremendous when leading in clean air. I hated that he was never challenged, I just wish Ferrari would up their pace during Qualifying and get on the fucking front row and challenge Red Bull, Mercs.


----------



## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

http://www.montrealgazette.com/touch/story.html?id=8500899

Track marshall dies after being hit by crane during race, RIP, makes you realize how irrelevant everything is when something like this happens. First death during a race since 2001, the odds always catch up.


----------



## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Been an interesting last few weeks with the biggest anticlimax since Rikishi knocked over Stone Cold. F1 is becoming an absolute joke from breaking the rules and getting away not just scot free but better off than the teams that didn't break the rules. 

Then you have Newey breaking the rules from a technical stand point and only been told to remove it with no points reduction. It's about time they limit everything from aerodynamics/downforce/toque etc so that the best driver wins not the best car. It's more important to find the next Newey than it is to find the next Alonso.

What do you guys think about the red bull possible traction control?

http://www.worldcarfans.com/113061958990/photo-evidence-shows-apparent-red-bull-illiegal-traction

Is it an illegal traction control , engine mapping or just a bumpy road?


----------



## Rising (Jul 19, 2007)

kingfunkel said:


> Been an interesting last few weeks with the biggest anticlimax since Rikishi knocked over Stone Cold. F1 is becoming an absolute joke from breaking the rules and getting away not just scot free but better off than the teams that didn't break the rules.
> 
> Then you have Newey breaking the rules from a technical stand point and only been told to remove it with no points reduction. It's about time they limit everything from aerodynamics/downforce/toque etc so that the best driver wins not the best car. It's more important to find the next Newey than it is to find the next Alonso.
> 
> ...


What A Newey was doing was not breaking the rules he was using the loopholes it was never illegal after they found red bull have bought innovation they banned it was legal uptill then while it was banned
While what Mercedes did was going against rule of no testing


----------



## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Rising said:


> What A Newey was doing was not breaking the rules he was using the loopholes it was never illegal after they found red bull have bought innovation they banned it was legal uptill then while it was banned
> While what Mercedes did was going against rule of no testing


Wasn't last years exhaust illegal or was that just outlawed after it was on the red bull? I'm not 100% certain, I hate Newey and his loopholes.

Anyone heard the rumour that James Allison could be off to red bull with Kimi joining him as Newey and Webber leave? Apparently according to a few non credible sources Newey is going through his "I wanna try something not F1" related phrases.


----------



## Rising (Jul 19, 2007)

kingfunkel said:


> Wasn't last years exhaust illegal or was that just outlawed after it was on the red bull? I'm not 100% certain, I hate Newey and his loopholes.
> 
> Anyone heard the rumour that James Allison could be off to red bull with Kimi joining him as Newey and Webber leave? Apparently according to a few non credible sources Newey is going through his "I wanna try something not F1" related phrases.


Well what red bull did was outfox actually hot air exhaust was illegal but red bull came up with some new way which was not deemed illegal something like that


----------



## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Rising said:


> Well what red bull did was outfox actually hot air exhaust was illegal but red bull came up with some new way which was not deemed illegal something like that


Yep is was all about the fumes and air, and how they got around the rules, it was originally based around a design similar to Macca's exhaust iirc.
Then there were claims of the engine 'trick' all murky if you ask me.


----------



## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Forza Felipe!


----------



## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

F1MAN8 said:


> Forza Felipe!


I remember when he debuted with Sauber, there was this raw aggression and racers instinct, now he is a lot more polished still have that racer's instinct except against his team mate


----------



## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> I remember when he debuted with Sauber, there was this raw aggression and racers instinct, now he is a lot more polished still have that racer's instinct except against his team mate


He's had terrible luck, glock moving out of the way for Hamilton in 2008, his crash in 2009, "fernando is faster than you" in 2010, glad he's got a few podiums in the past year 

Yeah lol when he first came in he just wanted to go fast, very dangerous driver lol,


Fernando is top class


----------



## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Anybody hear the new V6 sound?

http://www.renaultsport.com/Come-on-feel-the-noise,2630.html?lang=en

youtube mirror - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MPearYsHwY


Sounds fucking awful, will reserve further judgement until i hear it on track. Depressing sound really.


----------



## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

F1MAN8 said:


> He's had terrible luck, glock moving out of the way for Hamilton in 2008, his crash in 2009, "fernando is faster than you" in 2010, glad he's got a few podiums in the past year
> 
> Yeah lol when he first came in he just wanted to go fast, very dangerous driver lol,
> 
> ...


Massa seems mentally weak to me, remember when he had his never ending crashes with Hamilton, he seemed to have been so riled up and let ham under his skin.

He was never dangerous like Sato, but he was walking a very thin line between aggressive and flat out suicidal :lol


----------



## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> Massa seems mentally weak to me, remember when he had his never ending crashes with Hamilton, he seemed to have been so riled up and let ham under his skin.
> 
> He was never dangerous like Sato, but he was walking a very thin line between aggressive and flat out suicidal :lol


If Felipe gets one more race win I can die happy lol

Sato was insane, my funniest memory of him was when he passed alonso.

Did u get my reply on the tennis forum, page 512


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

F1MAN8 said:


> If Felipe gets one more race win I can die happy lol
> 
> Sato was insane, my funniest memory of him was when he passed alonso.
> 
> Did u get my reply on the tennis forum, page 512


no I didn't see the reply, couldn't locate in on 512 either, maybe I'm having a blonde moment.

Sato was just an idiot at times, but yeah that move on nando haha!

Massa will only get one more win if Ferrari/Alonso allow him to :lol


----------



## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> no I didn't see the reply, couldn't locate in on 512 either, maybe I'm having a blonde moment.
> 
> Sato was just an idiot at times, but yeah that move on nando haha!
> 
> Massa will only get one more win if Ferrari/Alonso allow him to :lol


My mistake! You can reply to it on page 510! 

Kobayashi(racist segue) is hectic too! Remember him on his debut with Toyota, although nobody is as bad as Grosjean...

That's true, hopefully in Brasil this year! Please god lol


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Looking forward to Webber crashing into Vettel in Brazil :vettel


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## Lawls (Feb 24, 2007)

Webber retiring at the end of the season 

Hopefully he crashes into Vettel in the last race and costs him the championship :vettel


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

F1MAN8 said:


> My mistake! You can reply to it on page 510!
> 
> Kobayashi(racist segue) is hectic too! Remember him on his debut with Toyota, although nobody is as bad as Grosjean...
> 
> That's true, hopefully in Brasil this year! Please god lol


Brazilians don't seem to do well on home turf................ask Rubens!!!!


----------



## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Lawls said:


> Webber retiring at the end of the season
> 
> Hopefully he crashes into Vettel in the last race and costs him the championship :vettel


Shame but we all knew it was going to happen. Webber had enough of being screwed over by his own team, his own team mate. At least he'll get a good deal out of it though. Raikkonen probably replaces him. Interesting to see who goes to Lotus because they could be looking at getting 2 new drivers if Grosjean's inconsistency carries on.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Would love to see Kimi go to Red Bull, just to see him in the best car and how his relationship with Vettel goes. Kimi wouldn't stand for that crap.

I wouldn't rule out one of the TR guys getting the seat either.


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## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> Brazilians don't seem to do well on home turf................ask Rubens!!!!


More races than anyone else in f1, and he never won there! Born mere hours away! Poor sod, I'd love to see him back the Golden Oldie! First man to beat the stig! 

Hey! Felipe has won it twice! And would've won it in 2007 if he didn't let his team mate through to win the title!


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

F1MAN8 said:


> More races than anyone else in f1, and he never won there! Born mere hours away! Poor sod, I'd love to see him back the Golden Oldie! First man to beat the stig!
> 
> Hey! Felipe has won it twice! And would've won it in 2007 if he didn't let his team mate through to win the title!


yeah poor Rubens, him and Beco were sao Paulo lads, so must hurt even more so when he never managed to score a victory.

Yes Massa has won it, but denied a third because like a good little team mate, he moved our :lol

Still miss Senna after all these years


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Nige™ said:


> Would love to see Kimi go to Red Bull, just to see him in the best car and how his relationship with Vettel goes. Kimi wouldn't stand for that crap.
> 
> I wouldn't rule out one of the TR guys getting the seat either.


Kimi and Seb get a long well with all things considered (kimi's lack of social etiquette and Seb'as arrogance lol)
A real true like and respect there, not fake PR forced fed rubbish.
Kimi is a very classy driver and he believes in the art of racing everyone but he wont on the last season of the race, when knowing his team mate was at the back of the pack nearly crash into him so his mate that he gets on with amazingly, would win the title!


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## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> yeah poor Rubens, him and Beco were sao Paulo lads, so must hurt even more so when he never managed to score a victory.
> 
> Yes Massa has won it, but denied a third because like a good little team mate, he moved our :lol
> 
> Still miss Senna after all these years


Senna had balls of steel, sadly with his driving style and incident as such was always possible, did u see the senna film? Incredible.

Btw all I said in the tennis forum was that sharapova was 6'2 and mladenovic 6'1 :O


----------



## THEBROODRULEZ666 (Oct 5, 2010)

http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2013/6/14732.html

Paul Di Resta's car has been found to be 1.5 kilos underweight and he will therefore start at the back of the grid. Looks like it'll be the third race in a row where he'll have to claw back from the wrong end of the grid.

That promotes Daniel Ricciardo up to 5th, perfect time to put in a qualifying performance like that, I wonder if he can stay that high in the race.


----------



## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Crazy shit going down. 3 punctures in 15 laps, got to wonder if someone will take a major injury due to one later on.


----------



## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

this is bloody frightening to watch

race surely on the verge of being stopped. seems that the tyres are getting exceptionally hot and just exploding. all left rears, all around the same area of the track.

just dangerous.


----------



## Norb Jr (Jan 29, 2011)

So many tyre punctures....

But yeah if this continues, it looks like it may be stopped.


----------



## Bullseye (Oct 20, 2006)

As bad as the tyre situation was, that was a phenomenal final 10 laps. Exceptional driving from Rosberg, Webber, Alonso and Hamilton. Superb effort from Ricciardello on getting 6th, iirc it's his best finish to date. OI! OI! OI!


----------



## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

Drama filled race. Makes it a great spectacle but drivers safety should be paramount and there were iffy times to say the least. If only there was a lap or 2 left, would have loved Webber to win it. With Webber in his last few races, he should see if he can finally master the art of starting.


----------



## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Bloody Lotus costing Raikkonen second.



Bullseye said:


> Superb effort from Ricciardello on getting 6th


You wish :hayden3


----------



## Bullseye (Oct 20, 2006)

Ah he dropped to 8th. Shame.


----------



## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Yeah, not impressed with Lotus costing Kimi the chance to push & win. Pleased for Nico though, and Ricciardello?:lmao Is that some name you Aussies give Ricciardo?


----------



## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

Nige™ said:


> Yeah, not impressed with Lotus costing Kimi the chance to push & win. Pleased for Nico though, and who the hell's Ricciardello?:lmao Is that some name you Aussies give Ricciardo?


Not that I know of


----------



## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

ricciardello was a v8 supercar driver a couple of years back. he was shit

Andrew Benson ‏@andrewbensonf1 4m
Rosberg is under investigation for ignoring yellow flags. If he is found guilty, that's a race-losing penalty

oh dear.


----------



## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Yeah, rosberg just got reprimanded, nothing serious. 

Fun race, eh? I was marking out when Vettel stopped, finally he gets hit with bad luck.


----------



## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Fantastic race even with the erratic exploding tyres. Obviously they need fixing but after watching Anthony Davidson's touch tv it seems that Pirelli have modded the tyres slightly but going by today's race have went in the wrong direction.

Shame about Massa, he deserved more after his sensational start. He really needed a good performance after his recent crashes.

I've never heard a bigger pop from an F1 grandstand than when Vettel broke down  
happy days but I hope this isn't going to cover up the fact Ferrari have went backwards from being 0.3secs slower than the red bull to a full second slower than red bull. Also now seem slower than Mercedes(massively), force India and Lotus. They seem to be just ahead of the McLaren going by this weekend. 
Their updates aren't working just like they didn't last season, they blamed it on their wind tunnel but now they're renting 1 out can they use this excuse again? Hopefully the upcoming young driver tests will lead them in a positive direction again.


----------



## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

People blaming Pirelli over tyre issue, let's point the finger squarely at the FIA who demanded another rubber compound because of cost cutting.
Also riding the curbs was a big contributing factor to the left rear tyres having issues.

As for the race, was hoping Webber and Hamilton on the last lap could pass Nico and Nando respectively.
Vettel being forced out and not even through tyres issues, makes the championship a little more interesting.

I know this isn't F1 related by Rossi on Saturday was fabulous and Lorenzo a true solider, racing with a broken collar bone and getting fifth, I really hope this guy takes the championship.


----------



## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Could this kerb be the reason for the problems?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/23118588

Also Massa has suggested that a few drivers have talked about a strike over the safety of the tyres. Could we have another USA 2005 next week in Germany?


----------



## Klee (Oct 28, 2011)

I enjoyed the British GP this weekend. Hamilton still finishing 4th was a great drive.


----------



## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

F1MAN8 said:


> Senna had balls of steel, sadly with his driving style and incident as such was always possible, did u see the senna film? Incredible.
> 
> Btw all I said in the tennis forum was that sharapova was 6'2 and mladenovic 6'1 :O


Yep I've seen the film Senna, made me so emotional watching it, a true GOAT, there is no one even close to his mastery.

Hahaha oh ok, you see Maria go out and then Serena follow suit:lol


----------



## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> Yep I've seen the film Senna, made me so emotional watching it, a true GOAT, there is no one even close to his mastery.
> 
> Hahaha oh ok, you see Maria go out and then Serena follow suit:lol


I got pretty emotional too, made me hate Alain Prost even more haha. Funny how senna was so good that people consider him greater then Schumacher even though he's won 3 titles to Michales 7! 

Have you seem the trailer for that new film "rush" coming out later this year! About Lauda vs hunt!? :mark:

I marked out when lisicki won lol I am sick of serena!


----------



## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

F1MAN8 said:


> I got pretty emotional too, made me hate Alain Prost even more haha. Funny how senna was so good that people consider him greater then Schumacher even though he's won 3 titles to Michales 7!
> 
> Have you seem the trailer for that new film "rush" coming out later this year! About Lauda vs hunt!? :mark:
> 
> I marked out when lisicki won lol I am sick of serena!


I usually like Serena, but after her recent comments on a rape case, made me go right off her, so I marked out when she lost :lol

I'll check out the trailer to rush, Hunt by all accounts was awesome for his playboy don't give a fuck attitude!
champagne for breakfast :lol

As for Senna/Prost, hated balatrese (sp) more, the corrupt mafucka!
what he did to senna in the Tyrell and then in the championships, Senna may only have has 3 titles, but 2 at least denied to him where he was clearly denied through corruption and authorities dislike of him.
So many times at lotus as well he had the chance, still 3 titles and a GOAT!


----------



## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Well reading the last few posts I'm gonna get slated for this but I don't rate Senna as the goat. Yeah he was fast over qualifying but he was always average during the race and sometimes reckless. Prost was the better racer if I'm honest with his craft and intelligence. It must be hard winning with a superior engine. He did have a few spectacular races with a lesser car but that was it.

Prost was an alround better race driver. Fact Senna had nearly double the pole positions Prost had but Prost won 10 more races and 1 more world championship. Although Prost had 40+ more races.
Not Prost's fault if Senna didn't complete the track. Had it been Prost who died in that Williams, he'd be seen as the greatest racer. Sure not qualifier but qualifying is not racing.


----------



## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> I usually like Serena, but after her recent comments on a rape case, made me go right off her, so I marked out when she lost :lol
> 
> I'll check out the trailer to rush, Hunt by all accounts was awesome for his playboy don't give a fuck attitude!
> champagne for breakfast :lol
> ...


What did she say about a rape case :O? Whoa re your 3 fav lads and 3 fav girls in tennis?

Did u see the trailer yet? Looks good don't it? Nice to see the old mclarens and what not. Eddie Irvine was a subtle, wannabe James hunt haha and I'm Irish!

I wanted to punch baltarese on the TV when I re watched it haha.

Damn frenchies! Corrupt smug bastards! Schumacher up there with senna IMO, although he had the best car consistently he was still Classic, a rare breed of driver. Really polished,


----------



## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

F1MAN8 said:


> What did she say about a rape case :O? Whoa re your 3 fav lads and 3 fav girls in tennis?
> 
> Did u see the trailer yet? Looks good don't it? Nice to see the old mclarens and what not. Eddie Irvine was a subtle, wannabe James hunt haha and I'm Irish!
> 
> ...


She basically made ignorant statements and victim bashed a 15 year old who was date raped, it's in the anything section, if you want to know more.
current favs?
1) rafa
2) Tsonga
3) Ferrer

women:
1)Serena normally but :cuss:
2)Maria
3)Laura Robson

As for Senna he has proved even in a shit car he was a GOAT I challenge anyone to watch him in Toleman 1984 Monaco, (sorry called it Tyrell earlier LOL) and not say how amazing he was.

also many times in race day his car let him down, how many times in lotus did his car fail on him?

As for Balatrese wasn't he Belgium but obviously the French one, there was some corruption and favouritism going on.
Senna was directly imho conned out of two titles by him, and denied the victory in Monaco 84 because of him.

Also Schumacher's legacy let's him down, he got special FIA treatment, like PROST and his illegal traction control and cheating didn't go un-noticed with me.

I'll google the rush trailer when home, i'm at work, me and boss been watching the GZ case on live stream past couple of days :lol

Once I leave the office, no WF replies lol

So I'll let you know about it tomrrow:agree:

BTW I liked Eddie, even though he was a Ferrari driver at one point, at least he had some personality, now a days they are all corporate machines, I miss the days of the playboys, the don't give a fuck attitude of Jaques V and Montoya etc.

what are your top 3 tennis players and F1 players??


----------



## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> She basically made ignorant statements and victim bashed a 15 year old who was date raped, it's in the anything section, if you want to know more.
> current favs?
> 1) rafa
> 2) Tsonga
> ...


I'll have to check it out, her comments to sharapova bout dimitrov were unnecessary..

Men: Nadal, Del Potro and Tsonga I'd say, I was a big roddick fan :/

Women: Sharapova, Kvitova and Lisicki. Gutted kvitova is out(pun intended) 

Robson, you must be English? No?

Alonso reminds me of senna in how he was a real racer, ballsy as hell.

True,

French/Belgian, pretty much the same haha.

I don't think thats enough to say Schumacher wouldn't have win 7 titles anyways IMO,

Senna punching a young Schumacher was a low point for Ayrton, I didn't appreciate his temper,

Pirelli always in the headlines for the wrong reasons.. Pains me how massa may have won if not for the puncture, he is the best starter in the sport IMO,

I prefer Eddie Jordan haha, what a legend!

My favourites in F-p1 ATM are Massa, Alonso, Webber and also Kimi, u!


----------



## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

F1MAN8 said:


> I'll have to check it out, her comments to sharapova bout dimitrov were unnecessary..
> 
> Men: Nadal, Del Potro and Tsonga I'd say, I was a big roddick fan :/
> 
> ...


not English, british, but unlike Robson I was born in the UK :lol 

noooo way does Nando favour Senna, he is more the Prost, a thinker, yeah he can pass and be aggressive, but Senna was always flat out aggression, best form of defence is attack as they say!

No Schumacher always would have won titles, in 2000 Mika Hakkinen 3 DNF at the start cost him his triple titles in a row. But the way he won some of his titles leaves a bad taste in the mouth tbh.
Senna has that latin blood, doesn't excuse the violence but Schumacher remembering jolsting DC? after the 'brake testing' claim.

Also taking off rivals repeatedly............... 

As for Eddie, he was a character, but I didn't like how he treated Frentzen in the end, especially as HHF was Jordan's most successful driver.

as for my top 3, current:
1) kimi
2) Seb V
3) Perez 

all time
1) Senna
2) Hakkinen
3) Gilles Villerneruve - best driver never to have won a WDC, that's why I hate Ferrari, they screwed him over in 79 for Jody shitty schakcter!!!!!


----------



## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> not English, british, but unlike Robson I was born in the UK :lol
> 
> noooo way does Nando favour Senna, he is more the Prost, a thinker, yeah he can pass and be aggressive, but Senna was always flat out aggression, best form of defence is attack as they say!
> 
> ...


But alonso can make a shit car work, like senna, fernando has those senna like stints in races like at the end of the British GP.

Welsh or scottish? I hate how England treat Murray as an Englishman.....

That's true!

I suppose so, no denying Michael was still a talent. Not his fault mikayla had three DNFs and remember, he broke his leg in 99, considering how close Irvine came, schumi could've won that championship too..

I'm loving eddies work now on BBC, but yeah he clearly was closer with damon..

Vettel!! Dear god what and arrogant sod. On e he's behind the wheel he's a moany little kid. I don't like red bull at all be cause of him. What he's done to mark has been plain frustrating over th years, Vettel and Hamilton do my head in

I'll never know how jacques won the championship and not gilles(r.i.p)


----------



## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

F1MAN8 said:


> But alonso can make a shit car work, like senna, fernando has those senna like stints in races like at the end of the British GP.
> 
> Welsh or scottish? I hate how England treat Murray as an Englishman.....
> 
> ...


a shit car back then very different to a shit car today, sorry Alonso is not even close to Senna. 
Very good driver, and reads situations really well, not in style, aggression etc do I see them similar tbh.

None, British  born in London, mum's English born up north, dad is from Guyana (south America) but think west indies lol, I think a former dutch colony, but definitely a former british one.
He moved over here when 13 to uk, rest is history, so I just say i'm british :cool2

Yeah Schumacher's broken leg done at Silverstone as well, crowd cheered, very mean spirited, but Eddie Irvine never really was going to take the title from Mika that year, I'd argue Mika Sallo had more chance, I kid lol

one of my favourite moves ever was hakkinen when he passed schumi and zonta at spa all in one move, marked had as a muthafucka for that one lol!!!!

Hate Damon hill, boring racer, boring commentator, Jordan's shirt's are as colourful as he is, DC is surprisingly good on the bbc

I watch sky coverage now tbh, I like martin's grid walks and analysis.

Yep my Seb is arrogant, but he it is funny these remarks and bitterness usually come from Fernando Alonso fans and webber ones.
They completely overlook Webbers whining and bitching and hypocrisy, same with nando.
Vettel gives zero fucks, and neither do I to be honest, I like him, think he isn't as bad as the English speaking press like to make him out tbh!


----------



## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> a shit car back then very different to a shit car today, sorry Alonso is not even close to Senna.
> Very good driver, and reads situations really well, not in style, aggression etc do I see them similar tbh.
> 
> None, British  born in London, mum's English born up north, dad is from Guyana (south America) but think west indies lol, I think a former dutch colony, but definitely a former british one.
> ...


Oh right, interesting to say the least lol

My favourite ever move was Felipe massas start at Hungary 2008, incredible.

Hakkinen was so cool haha

Damon is like watching paint dry, puts you to sleep, Herbert is none better...

On bbc you have DC and EJ, hilarious chemistry, David is a pro, I liked him as a driver. Love him as a pundit. Eddie grew up where I live so I have the utmost respect for him. Proof ambition will take ya far.

Sky are watering f1 down, too much hype and fuss, not even enough focus on the racing, they care about politics only, I have the channel but watch bbc when I can.

The only thing I've ever appreciated about seb was in 2008


----------



## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Nattie7 said:


> a shit car back then very different to a shit car today, sorry Alonso is not even close to Senna.
> Very good driver, and reads situations really well, not in style, aggression etc do I see them similar tbh.


I agree Alonso is not even close to Senna! As he's so much superior than Senna was. His unfortunate death added to his legacy.
In fact Senna had an off-track moment, spin, car contact or crash in more than a quarter of his races. The guy was quick but couldn't race.

Watch back when Renault had the mass dampers taken off their car and made it so much slower than the Ferrari; yet Alonso managed to push his car further than he should of been able to and showed his class. Schumi tried several times to pass him in a superior car but couldn't get past Alonso. 
The WC was set up mid season by the FIA so Schumi could retire as world champion but Alonso said no to that idea and took on Ferrari, Schmui and the FIA.


----------



## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

F1MAN8 said:


> Oh right, interesting to say the least lol
> 
> My favourite ever move was Felipe massas start at Hungary 2008, incredible.
> 
> ...


Massa could have been so much more, instead he stays the number two, best supporting actor :lol
Waste of talent tbh

Mika was the original flying finn, a classy driver, on and off the race track. Had a great relationship with Ron Dennis, so glad he came back from nearly dying in adeliade I think it was, to go on to become double world champion.
He out qualified Senna as well, he is awesome!!!!!

Hahaha paint dry, damon hill perfect description, I don't know how this guy has any fans lol

You're right BBC's punditry is better, but I miss Jake, he is on bt sport now isn't he? but Sky have every race live and in hd/3d so I persist with them now.

Oh what part are you from then? Nice EJ is a loved by his home town.

I appreciate Seb stopping Fernando wining so he is alright in my book(Y)


----------



## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> Massa could have been so much more, instead he stays the number two, best supporting actor :lol
> Waste of talent tbh
> 
> Mika was the original flying finn, a classy driver, on and off the race track. Had a great relationship with Ron Dennis, so glad he came back from nearly dying in adeliade I think it was, to go on to become double world champion.
> ...


Yeah :/ do u think hell be at Ferrari next year? I really want him to get one more win! I could die happy then haha

Also Michael said mika is the rival he respected most, says something about hakkinen, it's funny cos he looks like kimi too haha. Deservedly a double world champion.

I only respect him for what he's done for the brdc and even in f1 for England, but he's a boring bastard hahaha

Yeah jake dc and EJ were the three musketeers haha, best trio on tv! Suzy isnt bad though but it's not the same :/

I watch sky when I have to but when bbw are showing a race I side with them. I wish sky never touched f1.

Rathfarnham in Dublin, near ranelagh where he lived, he used to always go for a drink in a pub called "the morgue" down the road, I'd love to meet him someday, real character, I've read his book twice and I'm not big on reading haha!

I'm just bored of seb, I don't like red bull because they're a franchise, not a racing brand, an energy drink!


----------



## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

Conspiracy against Webber I tell you. Poor cameraman.


----------



## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Vettelwinslol

Funny how most of the bad luck affects one of the Red Bulls, namely Mark's.


----------



## Cliffy (Mar 31, 2011)

Sport Killer :vettel


----------



## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Shame Vettel won tbh. Don't like him  Grosjean, Button both had great races. Alonso did what he could with his Ferrari. Lotus probably should have brought in Raikkonen later during the first stint. Would have in all likelihood won him the race.


----------



## tommo010 (Jul 15, 2008)

Red Bull fined 30K euros for that unsafe release that injured a camera man.

http://www1.skysports.com/formula-1...-GP-after-cameraman-injured-in-unsafe-release


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

F1MAN8 said:


> Yeah :/ do u think hell be at Ferrari next year? I really want him to get one more win! I could die happy then haha
> 
> Also Michael said mika is the rival he respected most, says something about hakkinen, it's funny cos he looks like kimi too haha. Deservedly a double world champion.
> 
> ...


Poor Massa, doesn't have much luck, it could be worse though, he could be Webber :lol


Yeah MSch gave Mika high praise, I suppose because Mika was a classy guy like I said on and off the track, he also wasn't into getting into public spats with him or calling him a dirty cheat, like people like JV were :lol

Hakkinen just did what he did best and that was FLY

Sky have made f1 like you say too watered down and fluffy, the coverage of the german gp and others all a little too showbiz.
I hate how Murdoch has a monopoly over all sports, that's hy I'm glad I have my ST at the emirates, so I'm not reliant on that scumbag for my football!!!!
Don't get me wrong I will watch other live games, but i'd rather watch MOTD for a roundup of highlights than football first.
I know FF has longer highlights but when I get to see every home game I don't need extended highlights for it.
Wish the bebb had all the F1 races still!

Ah ha near Dublin, I've been to NI but never Eire, might make a trip soon, looks a lovely place.

I understand what you mean about red bull, they lack that real racing heritage and pedigree compared to the prancing horse, macca, Williams, silver arrows etc etc

I enjoyed the race yesterday, Lotus should have brought in Kimi earlier, no doubt he would have won the race.
Props to Roman too, he has matured a lot since his days of taking every competitor off the race track LOL


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

can't stand vettel at all but to be a likely 4 time champion by the age of 26 is incredible.


----------



## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> Poor Massa, doesn't have much luck, it could be worse though, he could be Webber :lol
> 
> 
> Yeah MSch gave Mika high praise, I suppose because Mika was a classy guy like I said on and off the track, he also wasn't into getting into public spats with him or calling him a dirty cheat, like people like JV were :lol
> ...


Your such a beast poster haha

I know haha, remember when he was leading fuji 2007 and he got sick in his helmet lol?

Once again I'll never understand how jacques was WC and not Gilles! Yeah mika was a real iceman, so cool, laid back and talented, polite too.

Arsenal fan eh? Can't tell how they'll finish next year haha, yeah f1 is becoming more political since sky took over, they care more about driver contracts than driver racing ability!

I do enjoy sky's coverage of football although all the money they brought to the game killed LFC :/

You would come some time! I've been to London plenty!! I loved it haha

Roman doesn't seem to be the finishes product but has made a massive leap in form and maturity :lol


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

F1MAN8 said:


> Your such a beast poster haha
> 
> I know haha, remember when he was leading fuji 2007 and he got sick in his helmet lol?
> 
> ...


Yeah the vomit LOOOOOL

Yeah JV was lucky he had the Williams and Adrian newey to win his championship, his dad was vastly superior.
Gilles and Ronnie Peterson best drivers never to have won a WDC, such a shame!

Yep Sky and F1 is not very good but they have monopolised they now have full coverage, but people like Martin make it a little easier for me, I think he is great!


Yep Arsenal Season ticket holder, unlike some of the fronters on this forum, I actually go games and don't sit behind a keyboard talking shit like I know everything about it.
General theme I have found in this forum, over compensating for a lack of..............

I take it you're a Liverpool fan?
I think abolishing the back pass rule killed off Liverpool :lol :lol :lol

We bit, I mean bid 30m for Luis Suarez, would be awesome if he came, but it is unlikely, makes a change from everyone draining us of our star players.
United made a 26m bid for Cesc :lol like Cesc will leave to go play under Moyes, he will do to united, what souness did to Liverpool 

My prediction is Chelsea to win the league, they have their 'special' one back, he knows how to win the league, and resources to match City.


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## F1MAN8 (Jun 23, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> Yeah the vomit LOOOOOL
> 
> Yeah JV was lucky he had the Williams and Adrian newey to win his championship, his dad was vastly superior.
> Gilles and Ronnie Peterson best drivers never to have won a WDC, such a shame!
> ...



Kinda like Damon hill too, quite lucky in 96 IMO,

Fair play I respect the commitment, Liverpool have those keyboard warriors, ugh!

I am :/ :L

I hope he ruins united! It's about time!!

Suarez must stay!! If u take him I'll cry!! Cesc will stay, surely!

I agree about Chelsea


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## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

Another race weekend, another Webber problem.


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## LDM91 (Jul 26, 2013)

Yay Hamilton got pole! Not surprised by the Webber thing either. Really annoyed that I won't be able to watch it...my interest in F1 has seriously been since BBC lost half of races


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## wkdsoul (Apr 2, 2012)

LDM91 said:


> Yay Hamilton got pole! Not surprised by the Webber thing either. Really annoyed that I won't be able to watch it...my interest in F1 has seriously been since BBC lost half of races


Yeah was bad enough with ITV and adverts all the time.. but now.. 

Stream is easy enough. but meh.


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## LDM91 (Jul 26, 2013)

wkdsoul said:


> Yeah was bad enough with ITV and adverts all the time.. but now..
> 
> Stream is easy enough. but meh.


I tried watching it live with stream before but it's not the same...plus the buffering sucks lol. It's shame really 'cause when BBC had all the races I got really into it


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

At the point now where it needs to be anyone but Vettel to make the season interesting again. Really it has to Kimi or Alonso, maybe Lewis. No way Lewis will win it, have to favour Vettel but should be a good race if Lewis can get a good start. He needs to with how Mercedes have dealt with the tyres.


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## BoJaNNNNN (Apr 2, 2012)

If Lewis keeps the 1st after a few first corners, he might just win it. And, he has won it 3 times already...


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Certainly settle for that result. Probably as best as it could get. Pity Alonso could only finish 5th though. Hopefully Lotus & Mercedes can push after the summer break to make the second half slightly interesting.


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## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

Webber did well. Hamilton winning was great


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Save us James Allison!!!


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm just watching this season to LOL at Fernando


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## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Ricciardo to Red Bull next season.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Not the exciting choice but the right one. The young driver program would be pointless had they looked elsewhere.


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## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Calendar draft for next year:

16 March: Australia (Melbourne)
23 March: Malaysia (Sepang)
6 April: China (Shanghai)
13 April: Korea (Korea International Circuit)*
27 April: Bahrain (Sakhir)
11 May: Spain (Barcelona)
25 May: Monaco (Monaco)
8 June: Canada (Montreal)
22 June: Austria (Red Bull Ring)
6 July: Britain (Silverstone)
20 July: Germany (Hockenheim)
27 July: Hungary (Budapest)
24 August: Belgium (Spa-Francorchamps)
7 September: Italy (Monza)
21 September: Singapore (Marina Bay)
5 October: Japan (Suzuka)
19 October: Russia (Sochi)*
26 October: Abu Dhabi (Yas Marina)
9 November: Mexico (Mexico City)*
16 November: USA (Austin)
30 November: Brazil (Interlagos) 

I would've thought Sochi in October would have a good chance of snow, but that's just me classifying Russia late year = snow. :hmm:

Hopefully Vettel never wins in Austria.


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Riccardo to red bull was expected but I think Vergne has been massively overlooked. He's currently ahead of Riccardo this season and outscored him last season. Occasionally Riccardo looks spectacular but that's it. Wrong choice in my mind, should of been Kimi


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

I think we'd all like to see Kimi there next season but it's the right decision to go with a driver from their feeder team, otherwise it's pointless.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Vettel gets pole as expected. Hopefully Webber and Alonso can challenge. Webber in particular could do well if he gets the start right. Toro Rosso's did well, Maccas fell back there and Hamilton and the Lotus' just didn't get it right, though Lewis seemed to have been impeded by Sutil (couldn't be anyone else could it? ). But Hulkenberg, what a lap! The guy is damn good and is being wasted at Sauber, something that I'm sure a lot of people would agree with. This guy should be in a position like Grosjean's or Massa's.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Rumours Ferrari are looking at him.

This season just needs to end or Vettel to get imprisoned for something stupid to make it worthwhile.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Nige™ said:


> Rumours Ferrari are looking at him.
> 
> This season just needs to end or Vettel to get imprisoned for something stupid to make it worthwhile.


Agreed. A bit tired of Vettel running away with it. He's a sublime driver no doubt but I can't help but feel it's 50% him and 50% Newey. He tends to shine (as well as falter) when in a situation where his car isn't quite the best or it's on a level playing field (either his car or circumstances making his superior car go through more obstacles). Next year should be a sight though with the new rules and more emphasis on engines coming. It's entirely possible Vettel ends up struggling.


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Another fucking Vettelwinslol.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Too many races left too. This season's over already. No interest whatsoever in it.


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## HIGHLIGHT (Jun 10, 2007)

Even the skysports commentators where like 'Vettel is out infront, now for the race" He's getting to that Schumy in his prime days where, I couldn't care who won but not him


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Only thing to say about this race is how fucking good was Nico Hulkenberg? If you look at the race results, he was in amongst the top guys, even finishing ahead of Rosberg and directly behind Massa! Behind the top 6 there was a monumental gap back to Ricciardo who has just got a Red Bull drive for next season. Well done to him. I'd say he has really put himself in the shop window. He'll be at either Ferrari or Lotus next season imo.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

EDIT: Watched the vid totally focused and what I said was gibberish  
It was about the Ferrari situation.


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Seb must be loving it, barely 26 years of age, youngest ever driver to get a pole, win a race, win a championship and youngest ever triple world champion.
On course for four in a row, getting boo'ed for doing his job, hostile team mate off into retirement.
You know you're doing something right when you got the FIAT loving tifosi whinging and the brits boo'ing you.
They boo'ed Senna too, so Sebas take no mind kid, keep doing what you're doing!!!


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Nattie7 said:


> *keep doing what you're doing!!!*



yeah, keep killing people's interest in F1


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## BoJaNNNNN (Apr 2, 2012)

Jammy said:


> yeah, keep killing people's interest in F1


It's more of a Red Bull's and their competitors fault than his fault that the interest in F1 is getting lower. Schumacher won it five times in a row and it was still amazing to watch race after race during those years.


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## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

BoJaNNNNN said:


> Schumacher won it five times in a row and it was still amazing to watch race after race during those years.


If you insist. Very few agree there.



Kimi linked heavily with Ferrari atm. Would like to see him there again to give real competition to Alonso & Vettel. Just a shame that Ricciardo will always be playing second fiddle to Vettel no matter what; like Massa to Alonso.


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

It's just come to peoples attention Vettel is being boo'd? And they're saying it's because of the "multi 2-1" incident despite the fact he was getting bored on a lot of the podiums last year too. The 1 that stands out most was the American Grand Prix.

I can't see Kimi going to Ferrari. With that Russian kid with loads of money coming into F1 I see the Hulk in the Ferrari seat. 
I honestly don't think Kimi is as good as people make him out to be, a few string of consecutive point finishes and he's a top driver? Or was it because of the "I know what I'm doing, leave me alone" radio call?


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

or the world title he won?


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Kiz said:


> or the world title he won?


The luckiest championship win ever. He wasn't even in the running for it until Mclaren shot themselves in the foot and made a mess of it. He just lucked into it, Massa was better than him that season just Kimi was slightly more fortunate that his car was more reliable than Massa's. Without the problems at Mclaren he would of finished a distant 3rd! He only won because of the last 5 or so races when Alonso and McLaren were completely at war. Also his defence of the title was little short of pathetic, being hammered by Massa.


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

he still won it did he not?


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Jammy said:


> yeah, keep killing people's interest in F1


LMFAO 


very pathetic!!!

Don't blame the kid for doing his job, or Red Bull for doing their job better than everybody else.
Direct your criticism at the 'competitors' for being so below par.


and some posters on here have the gall to talk about LUCKY championships, considering his favourite is Fernando fucking Alonso :lol

Nando was lucky Kimi's merc engine kept breaking down that year....

I guess when kimi starts having a team mate that doesn't race him, moves over continually, even crashes his car deliberately for him to win a race, than we can talk about lucky.


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Alonso is already established as one of the all time greats, his performance in 2012 was extraordinary.


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Jammy said:


> Alonso is already established as one of the all time greats, his performance in 2012 was extraordinary.


:lol

try again

the issue being discussed was 'lucky'.

like said, not every f1 driver is lucky to have
1) a team mate deliberately crash to so you can win a race
2) a team mate who's role is never to fight you, just move out of your way etc


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## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

kingfunkel said:


> The luckiest championship win ever. He wasn't even in the running for it until Mclaren shot themselves in the foot and made a mess of it. He just lucked into it, Massa was better than him that season just Kimi was slightly more fortunate that his car was more reliable than Massa's. Without the problems at Mclaren he would of finished a distant 3rd! He only won because of the last 5 or so races when Alonso and McLaren were completely at war. Also his defence of the title was little short of pathetic, being hammered by Massa.


Winning 3 of the last 4 races is luck? Podium in 9 of the last 10? Kimi having a more reliable car than Massa, yet had more mechanical failures. Please tell us more :lmao

Kimi would've won the 2003 and 2005 seasons had his McLaren car not been so unreliable.


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

haribo said:


> Winning 3 of the last 4 races is luck? Podium in 9 of the last 10? Kimi having a more reliable car than Massa, yet had more mechanical failures. Please tell us more :lmao
> 
> Kimi would've won the 2003 and 2005 seasons had his McLaren car not been so unreliable.


of course kimi is the lucky one......nando fans :lol


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## TAR (Jan 1, 2012)

Mark Webber is the GOAT.


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## Stone Cold 4life (Dec 17, 2008)

LOL at saying Kimi isn't a good driver. Do you know F1 racing. Fucking Alonso fans, stop living in 2005/6.


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

It is funny how the Fernando fans are always so insecure about others.

This thread is a perfect example, he comes with his barbs about Senna not being a great driver, barbs about Sebas who is single handily owning FIAT and now about kimi.

The only time Nando had a team mate allowed to race him was Lewis, we all know he bitched and asked macca to impose team orders, he threatened to expose the spying documents, so Ron Dennis willingly disclosed it to Max and fired the crybaby all while debut season Lewis finished level on points with him!


----------



## Rising (Jul 19, 2007)

http://formula1.ferrari.com/news/back-kimi

Kimi returning to Ferrari confirmed next year this going to be interesting and sad to see Massa leave all though he has been not performing since 2010 he has been nice guy 

I guess this Hulk should get the Lotus seat


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

haha interesting, Kimi would never accept being a number two, so Ferrari want both drivers to compete? given their past history, seems unlikely but not impossible.

I wouldn't be too surprised if Nando departs FIAT soon...


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## Cliffy (Mar 31, 2011)

Jammy said:


> yeah, keep killing people's interest in F1


With any luck Sky might drop their coverage if Vettel keeps winning and viewing figures keep declining

:lol Raising the profile of the sport :ecclestone


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## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

Unrelated to the Kimi/Alonso debate, i swear if i see someone call Vettel "Sebas" again, I'll kill a kitten


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

Sebas wanted kimi as a team mate, instead Nando got him.

EDIT: if you want to directly call me out for using Sebas do it, don't be passive aggressive, seeing as for the last few pages only one person was using SEBAS.

feel free to air your grievances directly to me either here or in rants.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Kimi confirmed. Good to see  Noticing that kingfunkel is the one guy truly being dismissive about Raikkonen. I don't think it's a coincidence that he's a massive Alonso fan. Methinks he's worried 

On a serious note, glad to see this partnership, maybe a few years later than ideal but both are still 2 of the top 4 drivers in the sport currently (which really shows how good they both truly are) and I'd love to see how things go. Think Raikkonen could surprise a lot of people in qualifying next year. He's done a lot better this year but in a car that isn't particularly great in quali it has gone under the radar. Having said that though, Alonso is a different beast entirely to Grosjean. Ferrari in the race though will be something to behold. Kimi and Alonso are probably the 2 very best racers in F1 atm (imo ofc).


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## Nattie7 (Jan 28, 2013)

I still think Ferrari getting Kimi back, considering what happened last time around, is a clear message of intent to Fernando.


----------



## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Nattie7 said:


> I still think Ferrari getting Kimi back, considering what happened last time around, is a clear message of intent to Fernando.


Probably is. Ferrari are putting out the message that Ferrari comes first. They're in it for the Constructor's Championship rather than the Driver's Championship (though that'd be good for them too). That's where the money is. They've backed Fernando to the hilt but nothing came to fruition so now they've changed their philosophy and brought in the most consistent driver in F1 atm.


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## THEBROODRULEZ666 (Oct 5, 2010)

Not a bad qualifying session, although no surprised other than Esteban Gutierrez making it into Q3, also the first time he's outqualified teammate Nico Hulkenberg this season. Red Bull is now the only team where one driver has beaten his teammate at every qualifying session so far this season.


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## Curry (Jan 14, 2012)

Turned out to be a surprisingly good race by Singapore standards. Great drives from Kimi and Alonso, Ferrari 2014 could be tasty.

And Ted Kravitz is shit at maths. No idea why he kept going on and on about the early finish when we clearly had enough time.


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## GothicBohemian (May 26, 2012)

I love F1 - Really, I do. I’ve watched since I was a kid – but until the latter laps I was having trouble following the race without my mind wandering to other things, something that's been happening too often this season. It could just be me, maybe I’m not as into the sport as I was. I don’t know…but the closing stage was pretty decent, so I’m glad I stuck with the race to the end. I’m always happy to see Kimi finish well and Alonso did an amazing job on old tires. 

Even if Red Bull and Vettel domination is a big part of why I’m a bit bored of all of it (well, that and the suckiness of McLaren), the booing of him on the podium needs to stop.


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

didnt bother to watch, zero interest in f1 for the first time ever. it's just a procession.


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## Das Wunderberlyn (Jan 18, 2011)

Oh Man, Kimi's like CM Punk these days. Over wherever he goes. He got cheered over the winner and the runners up.

good race as well. better than Spa & Monza


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## Curry (Jan 14, 2012)

Kiz said:


> didnt bother to watch, zero interest in f1 for the first time ever. it's just a procession.


Just focus on the 21 car race, it's easy enough to forget about Vettel because he's never on screen.


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

vettelwinslol

as a wrestling fan, i completely understand a crowd's primal reaction to boo somebody, Vettel deserves it.


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## Rising (Jul 19, 2007)

Well that was entertaining race for that circuit I think best 3 drivers of the day finished in podium Romain was unlucky otherwise he would have been fighting with Alonso , Rosberg was bit Unlucky aswell and Hulk didn't deserve that penalty 

And Webber and Alonso both got reprimand Webber 10 place penalty has it is his 3rd webber for running on track without marshal permission and Alonso for stopping in dangerous postion I guess has 2 or 3 cars had to take avoiding action


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Kiz said:


> didnt bother to watch, zero interest in f1 for the first time ever. it's just a procession.


This.


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## Cliffy (Mar 31, 2011)

Jammy said:


> vettelwinslol
> 
> as a wrestling fan, i completely understand a crowd's primal reaction to boo somebody, Vettel deserves it.


alot of traditionalists (Toffs) are pissed at the booing. I like it personally. We need more heels in F1.


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## Curry (Jan 14, 2012)

Rising said:


> Well that was entertaining race for that circuit I think best 3 drivers of the day finished in podium Romain was unlucky otherwise he would have been fighting with Alonso , Rosberg was bit Unlucky aswell and Hulk didn't deserve that penalty
> 
> And Webber and Alonso both got reprimand Webber 10 place penalty has it is his 3rd webber for running on track without marshal permission and Alonso for *stopping in dangerous postion I guess has 2 or 3 cars had to take avoiding action*


Surely some of the best drivers in the world can handle a gentle turn around another car on their cooldown lap without much bother?


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## HIGHLIGHT (Jun 10, 2007)

Hulkenborg seemed pretty pissed at having to give up his place, was it with Massa?

His kimi/esk reaction was pretty funny. " You must give your postion back"

"WHY what did I do" haha


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## Cotmas (Sep 12, 2013)

hbkdxhhh said:


> Hulkenborg seemed pretty pissed at having to give up his place, was it with Massa?
> 
> His kimi/esk reaction was pretty funny. " You must give your postion back"
> 
> "WHY what did I do" haha


No it was with Sergio Perez and quite honestly I don't blame Hulkenberg one bit for his reaction personally as I felt he did nothing wrong in the incident as he was already ahead before going wide.


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## Rising (Jul 19, 2007)

I Curry I said:


> Surely some of the best drivers in the world can handle a gentle turn around another car on their cooldown lap without much bother?


Well Hamilton said it was dangerous as Alonso stopped in race track on racing line 

Alonso stopped on the racing line and people in slow down lap maybe celebrating looking at crowd etc and also there was GP2 to crash is slowdown lap so I guess FIA took into accout aswell


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Can't wait for this season to end and get on with the new 1 with the new regs. Hopefully the cars will be closer!

As for being insecure about Kimi joining Ferrari I can't tell if you're joking? Alo has never lost to a team mate ever and there's a reason behind that(no Hamilton didn't beat him, they drew) the only reason Ham/Alo drew was because of some fucking shit house and the love for his little love child who he'd been noncing since he was 11!!

As for the reprimands for a lift is a joke. If Hamilton who is meant to be 1 of the best drivers in the world can't avoid a big red wheelie bin that had just been carried around a 2hr circuit by Alonso going at 70KPH then he doesn't belong on the F1 grid. 


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## Curry (Jan 14, 2012)

It's a sign of fan's interest in F1 that I can come into this thread hours after the race finishes and still avoid spoilers.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

I was preoccupied!  Anyhow, time for the spoilers  Very entertaining race I thought. Vettel winning again is a drag (dominance is a bit boring) but the race itself behind him was very good. Raikkonen did another sterling job to get on the podium and nicking 2nd from Grosjean the way he did was the move of a wiley veteran. Grosjean did well and is clearly very good when he's on it but still needs more seasoning. Hamilton nor Alonso had good races really. Lewis did in his tyres (the team really should have brought him in though) and wasn't particularly level-headed while Alonso made errors while being held up and really should have passed Hamilton after the safety car and left the door open twice for Hamilton to get back through. Button had a very good race too after his issues, Massa and Perez too recovering to the points so they did well enough. Rosberg and Webber are VERY unlucky. And now to the man of the race. NICO FUCKING HULKENBERG. That man can drive. 5th in Monza amongst the leaders now equals his best ever result with 4th in a car that shouldn't have been anywhere near there and he coped with pressure from Alonso and Hamilton for pretty much the entire race and didn't put a peep wrong. Why he isn't already in a top team I don't know but hopefully he nabs that drive for Lotus. He deserves it. Driver of the day easily.


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## Rising (Jul 19, 2007)

It was great race to watch Nico was great and showed why he deserves a seat in top team and Vettel also did a great job didn't put a foot wrong and Kimi also did a stellar job 

Romain was good bit unlucky should have been more aware of situation , Mark and Rosberg were really unlucky in this race any one of them could have been in the podium 

Best moment though was jeep being on circuit everybody was like WTF and also Nico Rosberg loosing his wings while overtaking Hamilton if that had happened when Webber overtaking Vettel everyone would have been shouting conspiracy


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Rising said:


> It was great race to watch Nico was great and showed why he deserves a seat in top team and Vettel also did a great job didn't put a foot wrong and Kimi also did a stellar job
> 
> Romain was good bit unlucky should have been more aware of situation , Mark and Rosberg were really unlucky in this race any one of them could have been in the podium
> 
> Best moment though was jeep being on circuit everybody was like WTF and also Nico Rosberg loosing his wings while overtaking Hamilton *if that had happened when Webber overtaking Vettel everyone would have been shouting conspiracy*


Ha! Probably. But it seemed to be the fact Rosberg hit a bump on the straight from what I could see which dislodged the nose.


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## Rising (Jul 19, 2007)

there is no bump in the straight it was just accidental probably the wing touching ground made feel like a bump there was no bump if you see back again more clearly


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Well Ted Kravitz said it was a lug nut fastening the nose to the rest of the car that failed and the commentators reckoned it had to do with the sudden load change coming out of Hamilton's slipstream so maybe it was that the nose wasn't fastened properly and it just got helped off?


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## Rising (Jul 19, 2007)

1andOnlyDobz! said:


> Well Ted Kravitz said it was a lug nut fastening the nose to the rest of the car that failed and the commentators reckoned it had to do with the sudden load change coming out of Hamilton's slipstream so maybe it was that the nose wasn't fastened properly and it just got helped off?


Yep that's what most likely happened


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Looks like Vettel has it in the bag and can win the championship at the next GP if he wins and Alonso fails to get a point finish. 

I blame this all on Pirelli, could they of helped out RB anymore? "We can't show the full potential of the car because the tires fall off, we need more durable tyres" don't worry Vettel Pirelli will sharp out that right for you.

Joke of a season, it's now a joke of a sport I hope Bernie fucks off out of the sport and never returns. Hopefully in some sort of plane crash that also has Paul Hembery or whatever his name is in it too!


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## HIGHLIGHT (Jun 10, 2007)

Kimi won't be near Vettel next year I bet too.

Good to see a strong showing from Hulkenborg. WTF with that fire marshall jeep, I take it that did have clearance right?

One hell of a bumpy exit for the end of the pits. Most drivers had to correct themselves coming out the pits


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Well the FIA claimed responsibility for the jeep coming out before the safety car saying it had clearance but the safety car couldn't get out in time to stop the leaders.

EDIT: Just to add to this post (no point adding another), looking more and more like Hulkenberg will end up at Lotus. All I can say to that is GOOD! Hulkenberg should be in F1 AND in a competitive car that can compete for podiums and/or wins.


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

in desperately sad news, former reserve driver maria de villota has been found dead. she was the driver that had that awful testing crash and lost an eye i think. very sad.


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## Rising (Jul 19, 2007)

RIP maria de villota shocking and sad news heard she died from natural cause heart take that is such young age to die


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## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

He may not be winning any races but Alonso is winning at life with that girlfriend :banderas


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## HIGHLIGHT (Jun 10, 2007)

Vettel with the win again and the championship. Not that anyone cares. Surely people are frantically changing regulations next year to get someone else near the title. it just has to be damaging the sport hqving the same dull ass win all the time.


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## Jammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Congrats Vettel. 

And, fuck you.


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## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

Let's hope now that Seb is champion, Webber stops having car problems.


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## BoJaNNNNN (Apr 2, 2012)

Vettel and (more importantly) Red Bull bossed this season. Congratulations to them.

I just hope the others will step up next season and provide a bigger challenge for them because the sport could suffer from lack of interest if this continues.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

LOL. Saw Vettel's immediate reaction in the cockpit to being behind Webber. Hilarious. He was pissed off! Great lap from Webber. Makes things somewhat interesting. Hulk did a job once again. 6th place. And that guy might not got a top drive because of Crashtor Maldonado and his millions. Shame.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Saddening that I'm literally bumping the thread for this post given I did the last one but news is in.

First off, Massa & Bottas just got confirmed as Williams' line up next year leaving Maldonado and his millions to find another drive. If Lotus' deal with Quantum is done I think Hulkenberg gets the drive. If not, Maldonado gets it (I'm rooting for Hulk). 

But an even bigger development, it seems McLaren are leaning towards giving Magnussen the drive ahead of Perez. The article I read essentially said McLaren believe Perez has a general speed deficit to Button that he will not be able to get back and used Abu Dhabi as an example (Button had gained 23 seconds on Perez despite his issues at the start) and apparently their simulator findings suggest Magnussen is already faster than Perez. 

If this happens things get very interesting. Rumours I think though have Hulkenberg at Lotus, Perez at Force India and Maldonado at cash-strapped Sauber. Sutil and Gutierrez would likely end up out of F1 if this comes to fruition.


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## THEBROODRULEZ666 (Oct 5, 2010)

1andOnlyDobz! said:


> Saddening that I'm literally bumping the thread for this post given I did the last one but news is in.
> 
> First off, Massa & Bottas just got confirmed as Williams' line up next year leaving Maldonado and his millions to find another drive. If Lotus' deal with Quantum is done I think Hulkenberg gets the drive. If not, Maldonado gets it (I'm rooting for Hulk).
> 
> ...


I'm not sure if i'll really miss Sutil. He's pretty good, but can you honestly see him moving up the grid? With the limited number of seats available now, it's either move up or move aside, it's amazing he's stayed for the same team as long as he has, even with a year out.

I'm hoping Hulkenberg does get the Lotus drive, considering he's surely one of the top 6-8 drivers in the sport right now, and he's proved he deserves a top race seat.


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

THEBROODRULEZ666 said:


> I'm not sure if i'll really miss Sutil. He's pretty good, but can you honestly see him moving up the grid? With the limited number of seats available now, it's either move up or move aside, it's amazing he's stayed for the same team as long as he has, even with a year out.
> 
> I'm hoping Hulkenberg does get the Lotus drive, considering he's surely one of the top 6-8 drivers in the sport right now, and he's proved he deserves a top race seat.


Sutil is just a shithouse, f1 doesn't need a thug like him on the grid.

As for the hulk being 6-8th best driver I would love to know who you have a head of him.
Let's put them in order (my opinion)

Alo, Ham, Vet, Kimi, Hulk, Ros, Bia, Gro, Web, Mas, DIR, But, Sut, Ver, Bot, Per, Ric, Mal, Gut, VDG, Pic, Chi


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## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

^ From worst to best? Mighty Max at no.1 of course.


If Maldonado goes to Lotus they are dead to me. With Hulkenberg they'll have a good shot at remaining competitive but with Maldonado they'll sink back to Force India & Sauber levels.

Think it's harsh on Perez to replace him when the car has been utter dog shit all year and he hasn't had a remote chance of even getting a podium.


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## THEBROODRULEZ666 (Oct 5, 2010)

kingfunkel said:


> Sutil is just a shithouse, f1 doesn't need a thug like him on the grid.
> 
> As for the hulk being 6-8th best driver I would love to know who you have a head of him.
> Let's put them in order (my opinion)
> ...


I'd say

ALO
VET
HAM
RAI

ROS

Either BUT/GRO/WEB/HUL after that


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

kingfunkel said:


> Sutil is just a shithouse, f1 doesn't need a thug like him on the grid.
> 
> As for the hulk being 6-8th best driver I would love to know who you have a head of him.
> Let's put them in order (my opinion)
> ...


Yeah...Button is clearly not that low down. And it's something I can actually attest to with some fact. You rate Hamilton higher than Vettel and Webber higher than Button yet Button was a lot closer to Hamilton than Webber has been to Vettel. So how does that work?


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Wouldn't be too surprised if Marussia or Caterham (probably Caterham to replace Pic despite that 2 year deal) went all out for Maldonado. But probably Sauber yeah.


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

1andOnlyDobz! said:


> Yeah...Button is clearly not that low down. And it's something I can actually attest to with some fact. You rate Hamilton higher than Vettel and Webber higher than Button yet Button was a lot closer to Hamilton than Webber has been to Vettel. So how does that work?


Different cars and different drivers. I don't honestly believe Webber has the exact same tools as what Vettel has, I could be wrong but I doubt it.

For Button everything has to be perfect and the planet have to align for him for him to have a great race. In a poor McLaren Perez has been just about Button's equal, with Button slightly edging it. Had McLaren not had so many technical problems Hamilton would of destroyed Button and probably won the 2012 championship.


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

only just caught up with some of the news. incredibly harsh that perez is being pushed out after only a season, he and button got shocking cars and perez for much of the season was at least button's equal.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Very harsh on him, especially when you look at his replacement.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Seems harsh Perez is gone but having read the beeb article going into detail on it I can see why McLaren took the risk. It may or may not pay off for them. Perez has done enough to get an F1 seat though tbf. 

Also Kovalainen confirmed for the rest of the season at Lotus. Good for him. Got nerfed out undeservedly so this is a chance for him to show that he still has it. Good luck to him.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Don't normally comment on the practice sessions but while it's normal service with the Bull's way out front and the Mercs in 3rd and 4th, one Heikki Kovalainen managed to nab the 5th fastest time. His one-lap pace looks very comparable with Grosjean while his race pace is respectable albeit slower than Grosjean's. Still, he looks good for a guy who hasn't been in the car before this weekend. Really getting to grips quickly. Fairplay.


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

1andOnlyDobz! said:


> Don't normally comment on the practice sessions but while it's normal service with the Bull's way out front and the Mercs in 3rd and 4th, one Heikki Kovalainen managed to nab the 5th fastest time. His one-lap pace looks very comparable with Grosjean while his race pace is respectable albeit slower than Grosjean's. Still, he looks good for a guy who hasn't been in the car before this weekend. Really getting to grips quickly. Fairplay.


Kov is a top driver who deserved a seat this season no doubt but unfortunately for the likes of him we have shite drivers who don't belong in f1 but are there because of their wallet sizes. 

In other news I wish Vettel would just settle on a helmet. It's meant to be your identity but he just changes it race to race like the cunt that he is. 

SkyF1 have an interview with Robert Kubica coming up soon  wish he recovers fully but it's doubtful 


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Well Seb probably thinks of his helmet the same way Raikkonen does. It's a helmet. Doesn't matter to him, especially when half of it is full of Red Bull decal.


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## Muerte al fascismo (Feb 3, 2008)

Haven't followed F1 as much this year, but is Perez getting fired a result of Button Politicking?
From the races I saw, Perez seemed to be gaining Button's number. With another year Perez may have taken that no1 spot.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Muerte al fascismo said:


> Haven't followed F1 as much this year, but is Perez getting fired a result of Button Politicking?
> From the races I saw, Perez seemed to be gaining Button's number. With another year Perez may have taken that no1 spot.


No. Button didn't have anything to do with it. McLaren went with Magnussen because they noticed Perez had a general speed deficit to Button overall that they didn't think he'd recoup and simulator tests suggested Magnussen was already quicker than Perez. They're in a transitional period so took the risk.


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## THEBROODRULEZ666 (Oct 5, 2010)

Muerte al fascismo said:


> Haven't followed F1 as much this year, but is Perez getting fired a result of Button Politicking?


Button seems like the last driver who would politic to me.


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## Desecrated (Feb 4, 2009)

Has Lotus not retained Grosjean for next season yet? Guy is on exceptional form and considering Boullier is his manager, what is the delay? I don't think it matters who is their second driver as long as he has a competitive car.

It's a shame to also say this but I think Force India should move on from di Resta and Sutil. Not sure how their cash situation is but I think Bianchi is deserving of a shot there.


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## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Yeah, pretty sure Grosjean is signed for next season. Bianchi's also staying with Marussia.

I think it's currently:
*Red Bull* - Vettel, Ricciardo
*Mercedes* - Hamilton, Rosberg
*Ferrari* - Alonso, Raikkonen
*Lotus* - Grosjean, ?
*McLaren* - Button, Magnussen
*Force India* - ?, ?
*Sauber* - Sirotkin (I'm not sure on this?), ?
*Toro Rosso* - Vergne, Kvyat
*Williams* - Massa, Bottas
*Marussia* - Bianchi, ?
*Caterham* - ?, ?

Hulkenberg is obviously getting a drive somewhere. Then there's Gutierrez, Perez, Maldonado, Di Resta, Sutil, Pic, Kovalainen, van der Garde & the great Max Chilton fighting for the other seats with any other possible newcomers.


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## Muerte al fascismo (Feb 3, 2008)

1andOnlyDobz! said:


> No. Button didn't have anything to do with it. McLaren went with Magnussen because they noticed Perez had a general speed deficit to Button overall that they didn't think he'd recoup and simulator tests suggested Magnussen was already quicker than Perez. They're in a transitional period so took the risk.


Fair enough. Very strange move still, even for Mclaren.



THEBROODRULEZ666 said:


> Button seems like the last driver who would politic to me.


Normally I would agree, but from the races I've seen, he appeared to be very critical of Perez, both in the media and on the team-radio.

There was also the rumor that one of the reasons Hamilton left, is that he didn't feel he had the same rapport that Whitmarsh had with Button


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Muerte al fascismo said:


> Fair enough. Very strange move still, even for Mclaren.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


On Button he changed his tune once Perez got the sack, probably felt bad for him to be honest. Yeah it's a strange move but I think it's a future thing. Get Magnussen in the car now so that when Honda come a knockin' and they make that move for Alonso they'll be in a position to seriously contend for the Driver's Title in 2015. Magnussen's arrival is probably worse for Button than Perez staying actually.


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## THEBROODRULEZ666 (Oct 5, 2010)

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2013/nov/25/f1-2013-alternative-driver-rankings

British bias at its finest, who in the right mind would rank Max Chilton ahead of Fernando Alonso in this season's rankings?


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

THEBROODRULEZ666 said:


> http://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2013/nov/25/f1-2013-alternative-driver-rankings
> 
> British bias at its finest, who in the right mind would rank Max Chilton ahead of Fernando Alonso in this season's rankings?


I love The Guardian don't get me wrong but this attempt at doing "equal" rankings has failed miserably. I don't think it's British bias so much as wanting so much to prove that their format is that of equality but you have to be frank and to me Chilton has been one of if not the worst driver. Was slower than Bianchi (a rookie himself) almost the entire season and quali and was much slower than him in races from what I noticed.

I'd also rank Button ahead of Di Resta. Truth is Di Resta had a better car than Button for a lot of the season but Button's consistency pulled him clear when Paul started crashing a ton. Perez shouldn't be that low to be fair. Grosjean is too high. The guy has only come into his own in the second half of the season. First half was still quite inconsistent. Bottas doesn't belong anywhere near where he was placed. Shown flashes of brilliances but VERY sporadic. Truth be told Alonso should be towards the top too. Still finished a clear second in the championship when he probably should have been around Hamilton/Webber/Raikkonen territory.


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

Chilton did a decent job of finishing every race in his debut season in a shite car, but that's ridiculous. Alonso did very well in a very poor Ferrari. Don't get that at all!


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Nige™ said:


> Chilton did a decent job of finishing every race in his debut season in a shite car, but that's ridiculous. Alonso did very well in a very poor Ferrari. Don't get that at all!


Pretty sure it's Guardian trying to do a ranking based on a level playing field, but they cocked it up


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## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Maldonado confirmed for Lotus. Disgraceful.


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## Cotmas (Sep 12, 2013)

haribo said:


> Maldonado confirmed for Lotus. Disgraceful.


All I have to say is regrettably to that is simply another example money coming over talent. :vince$


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## Nige™ (Nov 25, 2006)

I like Di Resta but Hulkenberg & Perez for Force India could prove to be good picks. Still a shame for Di Resta though. His lack of finishes killed him.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Ok good news, bad news time. Bad news first. FIA have introduced double points for the season finale from next year. Now I can't be the only one thinking this will only likely gift someone a title they probably don't deserve. Just my take on that. Good news though is that drivers will be given a permanent number of their choice from next year so like the old days. Good times there though with iconic numbers such as the red 5 associated with Mansell and the #27 associated with Gilles Villeneuve I get the feeling originality is almost entirely out of the question  Only thing I'm not fond of is that it's permanent and that drivers get the choice. I feel like it should be the team's choice. We'll see numbers on F1 cars more like that of motorcycles imo.


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## haribo (Feb 4, 2005)

Double points for the last race is ridiculous and surely won't stand.


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## Kiz (Dec 2, 2006)

double points?

fuck off with that nonsense. f1 is about rewarding consistency, not a last chance cash in. how about doing something about bringing the competition closer, instead of less flashy gimmicks that helps no one. double points doesn't mean jack shit if the title is over and done with 4 races from the end you idiots.

no wonder my interest is waning in f1.


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## wkdsoul (Apr 2, 2012)




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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Not a fan of the idea of double points for the last race of the season! Seems too gimmicky. This is motor sport not an entertainment show. Although it'll keep teams developing to the death instead of giving up 3 quarters of the way through the season. 

I do like the fact they'll have personalised stamped numbers  not to get my hopes up but Alonso won his first karting title with the number 14 and will most likely use number 14 next season....in 2014!!!!!!! It's written in the stars

In other news this years f1 thread has got more posts than 2012 by over 100 posts. Well done guys and gals!


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

I'm not altogether happy with the fact the drivers pick the numbers and not the teams. This isn't MotoGP. I'd want to see Ferrari with the Nos. 27 and 28, Williams with the nos. 5 and 6 etc.


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

Force India have confirmed Perez to team with Hulkenberg. May be harsh for Di Resta but truthfully I'd have picked Hulk and Checo over him too. Guy will somewhat unfairly leave F1 entirely probably but the guy imo didn't exactly set the world alight in the way the beeb desperately tried to portray him as having done.


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## Deck The Halls With Funes Mori (May 13, 2012)

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/formula-1/michael-schumacher-live-updates-formula-2969745

Michael Schumacher is in a coma following a ski accident according to the Mirror. 

The below is taken from Sky.



> Schumacher's spokeswoman confirmed: "Michael fell on his head when he was on a private skiing trip in the French Alps.
> 
> "He was taken to hospital and is receiving professional medical attention. We ask for understanding that we cannot give out continuous information about his health.
> 
> "He was wearing a helmet and was not alone. No one else was involved in the fall."


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## Even Flow (Jun 10, 2005)

Read about this earlier, and now just read that he's in a critical condition. Hope he pulls through, because I was a big fan of his when he was at Ferrari.


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Well these cars look hideous ? actually vulgar! 


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## wkdsoul (Apr 2, 2012)

The new cars are fucking fugly... the hoover, the dildo, the walrus... ergh!


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

They are but honestly I'll get used to them. No point in being under an illusion that F1 cars have always been pretty. We've had a fair few ugos throughout F1 history


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## kingfunkel (Aug 17, 2011)

Ohhh looks like the Mercedes & Ferrari powered cars are better than the Renault power units  

hopefully we'll see what Vettel can actually do! Keep in mind if Damon Hill was only a slight bit better and Williams kept world champions he could of been a 3 times world champion.....also in a Newey built car 


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## 1andOnlyDobz! (Jan 3, 2011)

^In terms of reliability yeah. Mercedes (the constructor) looks a lot more reliable than everyone else atm though. Tbf I expect that gap to reduce as the teams get to know their cars better so that advantage isn't altogether likely to be maintained. I myself am very interested in the McLaren. They have this rear suspension design which is much more radical than the others' and apparently the FIA did deem it legal. What's more is this is something McLaren have been working on for a while apparently so it's possible they've stolen a march on everyone else. Always love to see innovations


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