# The Young Bucks Leave Twitter?



## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

They probably just blocked you like they do with anyone who doesn't constantly suck their dicks on Twitter.


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Good. It means they're hearing the criticisms. They very likely booked the Dark Order attack shit to close the show and couldn't take the well earned criticisms for it. I mean Brandon Cutler obviously out there under a purple mask means he's written to eventually be a big reveal is all you need to know about it.

They should give up the book, and just wrestle and stick to their BTE hijinks and hilarity. 

I bet they long for the days when they could be the no responsibility indie rebels.


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## Chan Hung (Dec 28, 2011)

They probably still come on Wrestling Forum. Just saying lol. But yeah the ending of the AEW Show was a bummer. I think had they placed this earlier in the show (Dark Order stint) it would have been a bit better, although still cringe but not as bad. It has potential, but the followers look kind of geeky. Just saying.


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## The Sheik (Jul 10, 2017)

All the wrestlers should leave Twitter.. since all they do is bitch about the "haters" and "trolls"

I don't blame them for leaving.


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

Wrestling fans are toxic and annoying. I don't blame the Bucks


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## reyfan (May 23, 2011)

People probably kept tagging them in that terrible camera angle for the ending of Dynamite so they're taking a break for a few weeks.


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

What camera angle?


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## MetalKiwi (Sep 2, 2013)

For the record, I'm a fan of the Bucks.


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## The Masked Avenger (Apr 18, 2018)

Good, Twitter is cancer.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Funniest Twitter shit was Scorpio Sky


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## Best Bout Machine (Jan 24, 2009)

Is that a big deal or something? I haven't used Twitter since 2009, so I'm pretty out of the loop.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Don’t blame em - some peace an quiet over the Christmas period


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## Braylyt (Jan 19, 2015)

Dynamite openly getting shitted on by the likes of Henry, Trish, X-Pac and Lance fucking Storm must've really struck a chord


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## TAC41 (Jun 8, 2016)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> Don’t blame em - some peace an quiet over the Christmas period


You realize you can actively ignore twitter without deleting your entire account? These snowflakes just want the attention. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

I don't think that them leaving twitter have anything to do about the bad punches of one of the creepers.

The last few weeks they interacted less and less with the fans on twitter.


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## V-Trigger (Jul 6, 2016)

rbl85 said:


> I don't think that them leaving twitter have anything to do about the bad punches of one of the creepers.
> 
> The last few weeks they interacted less and less with the fans on twitter.


It's about the constant harassment by the likes of Henry Trish and others.

Can you imagine Henry and Trish giving others shit for being terrible workers on their early days?.


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## Geeee (Aug 9, 2010)

My guess is this has something to do with Being the Elite


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## roadkill_ (Jan 28, 2010)

Good. Now, if only they'd leave AEW.


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## virus21 (Sep 22, 2009)

Can humanity leave Twitter?


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

V-Trigger said:


> It's about the constant harassment by the likes of Henry Trish and others.
> 
> Can you imagine Henry and Trish giving others shit for being terrible workers on their early days?.


Henry has been campaigning so hard to be a guest on backstage that he has turned into a joke - its sad, as I really liked the guy


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## IronMan8 (Dec 25, 2015)

After losing clean to SCU, I'd think they're selling the idea that they believe they lied to their fans about being the #1 tag team in the world and now it's tormenting them. I don't watch any of their stuff outside TV though, but it makes a lot more sense than they had a tantrum over some criticism.


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Henry was also treated well by AEW in his role as a reporter for some outlet. I wonder if he thought it would lead to the pile on it did when he re-tweeted it.


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## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Henry was also treated well by AEW in his role as a reporter for some outlet. I wonder if he thought it would lead to the pile on it did when he re-tweeted it.


Well i'm pretty sure that the people who retweeted this are now not welcome in any AEW show.


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

TAC41 said:


> You realize you can actively ignore twitter without deleting your entire account? These snowflakes just want the attention.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Deleting an attention-getting platform to get attention? LOL do these marks read before submitting their posts


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## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

Gh0stFace said:


> Deleting an attention-getting platform to get attention? LOL do these marks read before submitting their posts


Nobody said that.

Still if you have enough of twitter because some sons (or daughters) of bitches send you a lot of hate messages then why do you keep your instagram account ?


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## shandcraig (Mar 23, 2008)

The Sheik said:


> All the wrestlers should leave Twitter.. since all they do is bitch about the "haters" and "trolls"
> 
> I don't blame them for leaving.



problem is most of these guys dont know how to do social media from a business persective. You have some that are brilliant at it like Nick Aldis . The guy stays in Character for his social media yet he also responds to everyone with logic and in character responses or logic, He also still maanges to have some of his personal life in a very discrete way. You have guys breaking kayfed constantly on social media and it takes you out of the character


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## MoxleyMoxx (Sep 24, 2012)

Nick deleted his account but Matt's account seems to now be the official account of the Bucks


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Buck punch training:


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1207962353867919361


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## imthegame19 (Oct 12, 2008)

Good they are on a break for the holidays. I wouldn't want to deal with massive idiots and trolls either. This forum is bad enough with about 10 trolls. Twitter is filled with them.


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

Seeing Bucks live for the first time in ROH at Hammerstein Ballroom was actually what got me back into wrestling after WWE became unwatchable. They must've been 21-22 years old back then and when I saw that match I was like "WTF did I just see?" it was like I had an out-of-body experience it was so different and not like anything I've seen before. 

Right after that match there was Tyler Black (Seth Rollins) vs. Austin Aries doing really old school 60 minute draw. I started a "this is boring" chant because I was literally bored after 20 minutes. 

I knew Young Bucks would be huge one day and polarizing as fuck. When someone is "successful", it really brings the "haters" out of the woodwork. These are insecure individuals who want to put a spanner in the works, sprinkle salt in your game if you're making out with a chick that they could only dream of being with. 

When I see someone with talent or successful, I'm happy for them. I'm glad that they're successful. The world is a better place. It's cool to see. I'm inspired. A hater will look at my car and see not what I have, but what he hasn't got. He'll see his own fear and failure. From personal experience, he'll see me as a threat to him, sexually and egotistically. He's so insecure, if he had the world his way everyone would be riding around rusty buckets.


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1208238453894217731
AKA they book the tag division and decided to keep the titles on SCU and then booked the Dark Order attack after the tag title match with their indie buddies fka Super Smash Brothers and some jobber team fka The Beaver Boys merking all the top guys in the company and their super secret reveal of Brandon Cutler completely telegraphed to be over as a fart in church and the whole segment was a disaster and got the criticism it deserved.

They can't take the pressure of a whole company on their shoulders - they're free wheeling freelancers who could jump from company to company and show to show without long term care in the world. Get their shit in and move on to the next town sorta deal. 

I could see Bucks and Kenny giving up the book sooner than later. I think Cody likes it and will transition out of the ring sooner than many expect because of it. But Omega and Bucks seem miserable.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

I’m a fan of them, but that is sad. Just ignore the shit, or you can take the criticism and use it to take action. Pull the roster together, ask them to a man and woman if they are happy just making what they make now as sort of the red headed stepchild of the wrestling world, or if they want to take their craft seriously, learn what it takes to be a true professional wrestler, learn to do proper punches, kicks, timing, selling, etc. 

It’s up to them, but you can’t just hide from the criticism. Either stand and face it trusting your vision, or you can use it to hone your business.


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## Garty (Jul 29, 2007)

Gh0stFace said:


> Seeing Bucks live for the first time in ROH at Hammerstein Ballroom was actually what got me back into wrestling after WWE became unwatchable. They must've been 21-22 years old back then and when I saw that match I was like "WTF did I just see?" it was like I had an out-of-body experience it was so different and not like anything I've seen before.
> 
> Right after that match there was Tyler Black (Seth Rollins) vs. Austin Aries doing really old school 60 minute draw. I started a "this is boring" chant because I was literally bored after 20 minutes.
> 
> ...


Umm, who wrote this for you... and I mean that in a positive way. Considering what you've written previously...?



DetroitRiverPhx said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1208238453894217731
> AKA they book the tag division and decided to keep the titles on SCU and then booked the Dark Order attack after the tag title match with their indie buddies fka Super Smash Brothers and some jobber team fka The Beaver Boys merking all the top guys in the company and their super secret reveal of Brandon Cutler completely telegraphed to be over as a fart in church and the whole segment was a disaster and got the criticism it deserved.
> 
> They can't take the pressure of a whole company on their shoulders - they're free wheeling freelancers who could jump from company to company and show to show without long term care in the world. Get their shit in and move on to the next town sorta deal.
> ...


This insanity has got to stop! Have we all reverted back to grade school, snickering and laughing because, "ooh look, the dum wresslers dont evan now how to ponch." Seriously guys. Really? This is what you want to talk about? Has this somehow validated your "opinion" that "AEW sucks" because a few WWE guys and girls, or "journalists" have pointed out a one off-moment clip? What the hell is the end-game here? Shitting on AEW must be the new "cool thing" to do because it's all over Twitter now I guess, huh?!

Maybe it's because they don't want to read the same stupid shit, over and over, just like it is, posted here? Maybe they'd like to have Christmas "dickhead free"? Maybe they just don't want to play the game that you all want them to play? Is that it? They won't play with you? Ahh. Holy fuck! Some of you REALLY need to step away. To the haters, please go and watch WWE exclusively for a while. It's quite obvious that AEW is not for you, whereas WWE seems to be more suited to your vision of what's good.



bdon said:


> I’m a fan of them, but that is sad. Just ignore the shit, or you can take the criticism and use it to take action. Pull the roster together, ask them to a man and woman if they are happy just making what they make now as sort of the red headed stepchild of the wrestling world, or if they want to take their craft seriously, learn what it takes to be a true professional wrestler, learn to do proper punches, kicks, timing, selling, etc.
> 
> It’s up to them, but you can’t just hide from the criticism. Either stand and face it trusting your vision, or you can use it to hone your business.


See above and join the list.


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## reyfan (May 23, 2011)

As Enzo would say, the Bucks are S A W F T, SAWFT!


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

Gh0stFace said:


> hat they could only dream of being with.





Garty said:


> Umm, who wrote this for you... and I mean that in a positive way. Considering what you've written previously...?


Are you suggesting I hired a ghostwriter for some obscure wrestling forum?


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## Garty (Jul 29, 2007)

Gh0stFace said:


> Are you suggesting I hired a ghostwriter for some obscure wrestling forum?


Well, you have "Ghost" in your username, so... 

By the way, it was a sarcastic joke that obviously missed the mark.


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## RKing85 (Mar 22, 2010)

why any celebrity checks their mentions on twitter is beyond me.


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Gh0stFace said:


> Seeing Bucks live for the first time in ROH at Hammerstein Ballroom was actually what got me back into wrestling after WWE became unwatchable. They must've been 21-22 years old back then and when I saw that match I was like "WTF did I just see?" it was like I had an out-of-body experience it was so different and not like anything I've seen before.
> 
> Right after that match there was Tyler Black (Seth Rollins) vs. Austin Aries doing really old school 60 minute draw. I started a "this is boring" chant because I was literally bored after 20 minutes.
> 
> ...


Sounds like you were hating on Black and Aries


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Garty said:


> This insanity has got to stop! Have we all reverted back to grade school, snickering and laughing because, "ooh look, the dum wresslers dont evan now how to ponch." Seriously guys. Really? This is what you want to talk about? Has this somehow validated your "opinion" that "AEW sucks" because a few WWE guys and girls, or "journalists" have pointed out a one off-moment clip? What the hell is the end-game here? Shitting on AEW must be the new "cool thing" to do because it's all over Twitter now I guess, huh?!
> 
> Maybe it's because they don't want to read the same stupid shit, over and over, just like it is, posted here? Maybe they'd like to have Christmas "dickhead free"? Maybe they just don't want to play the game that you all want them to play? Is that it? They won't play with you? Ahh. Holy fuck! Some of you REALLY need to step away. To the haters, please go and watch WWE exclusively for a while. It's quite obvious that AEW is not for you, whereas WWE seems to be more suited to your vision of what's good.


Only thing is when you're someone like the Buck's who troll and take shots at others as they've notoriously done on stuff like BTE you can't run away when it's dished back at you. If the Buck's can give it then they should be able to take it. Especially considering they still get a lot of positive mentions on their Twitter


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## IronMan8 (Dec 25, 2015)

Gh0stFace said:


> When I see someone with talent or successful, I'm happy for them. I'm glad that they're successful. The world is a better place.


I’m assuming it’s a work to really encourage their own fanbase to boo them. 

As for the criticism, I’m love/hate towards their performances myself, but the hate doesn’t come from my attitude. 

For me, my hate is because I think they’re cashing in on the establishment of expectations that took decades to create - expectations that X, Y, and Z wrestling moves hurt like hell, and take a certain amount of time to recover from.

The shock, awe, and out-of-body wow factor you experienced when you first saw them only happened because they smashed your expectations that were built up from everything you’ve watched before. It’s temporarily-obtained shock value. The “Crash TV” equivalent of in-ring, I guess you could say. But how do you keep topping in-ring expectations?

After their style becomes normalised... you won’t feel that way. Is the world a better place after that? 

Maybe, maybe not - nevertheless, that’s where I’m coming from whenever I criticise their in-ring style, it’s not about my attitude towards their success. I admire them more overall than I dislike what I perceive as their no-sell shock value.



Garty said:


> Maybe it's because they don't want to read the same stupid shit, over and over, just like it is, posted here? Maybe they'd like to have Christmas "dickhead free"?


They could just... not look at their twitters.

But nah - guaranteed this is a great modern day work.

Anyone who thinks this is real is assuming some pretty negative real-life character traits in them as people. 

Gotta admire them for working everybody in 2019 to manipulate cheers and boos in their chase for the tag team titles.


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## TKO Wrestling (Jun 26, 2018)

Good maybe this will lead to Russo getting the book in AEW. Something has to happen and Russo will get those ratings way up, he always does, look at TNA with him and then since him.


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## Braylyt (Jan 19, 2015)

If they feel like deleting Twitter is better for their mental health then more power to them, but don't act like fans (and pretty much everyone in the business) were in the wrong for ridiculing that awful clip.

Even if some fans took it too far, the selective outrage is laughable. Even on this forum it's apparently perfectly acceptable to wish death upon a 70+ year old man on a daily basis, some trolls rubbing AEW's fuck ups in their faces isn't even close to being in the same ballpark.


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## bdon (Nov 12, 2019)

Garty said:


> Umm, who wrote this for you... and I mean that in a positive way. Considering what you've written previously...?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Your reading comprehension is shit.

12-13 years old, I’m assuming..?


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Leave my TV as well please.


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## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

TKO Wrestling said:


> Good maybe this will lead to Russo getting the book in AEW. Something has to happen and Russo will get those ratings way up, he always does, look at TNA with him and then since him.


Please, no Russo! He did a few things right but the so many wrongs he did to the business far outweighs the good. I tried to be objective with him and not pay attention to all the negative that Jim Cornette spews but I watched wrestling during his main times and I am disgusted with most of his work. The only good thing he did was made mid carders relevant in the companies he wrote for but that's seriously about the only positive I could find.


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

optikk sucks said:


> Leave my TV as well please.


I understand the fans that don't like spot fests, too many close counts, false finishes & trying to make every match the best match ever and whatever else they complain about. Young Bucks are operating at another frequency when it comes to wrestling and even if you hate them, deep down you would have to truly have some personal grudge against them (as Cornette has admitted to) to not respect them after all of the years of work that they put in and after they were able to successfully contribute in making this company a success. It was a huge gamble on their part. That takes A LOT OF BALLS.

But it's human nature. People subconsciously associate change with danger to their current perception because that would mean making they would need to make adjustments and look at things from different angles. For 1 hour I spend watching FOX news, I spend another watching CNN. That's besides the point. When Midnight Express first came around, old school fans hated them because they were doing too many moves that were to be done only on certain occasions.

I heard a quote recently and it couldn't be more true or relevant... "If you don't have a lot of people hating you, you're probably doing something wrong."


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## CenaBoy4Life (Jul 31, 2013)

da fuck are you rambling about. people dont like the bucks because their ugly vanilla midget spot wrestlers with no psychology. they belong in a trampoline park.


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## roadkill_ (Jan 28, 2010)

Gh0stFace said:


> I understand the fans that don't like spot fests, too many close counts, false finishes & trying to make every match the best match ever and whatever else they complain about. Young Bucks are operating at another frequency when it comes to wrestling and even if you hate them, deep down you would have to truly have some personal grudge against them (as Cornette has admitted to) to not respect them *after all of the years of work that they put in* and after they were able to successfully contribute in making this company a success. It was a huge gamble on their part. That takes A LOT OF BALLS.
> 
> But it's human nature. People subconsciously adverse change as the threat because it requires serious adjustment in thinking and perceiving things. When Midnight Express first came around, old school fans hated them because they were doing too many moves that were to be done only on certain occasions.
> 
> I heard a quote recently and it couldn't be more true or relevant... "If you don't have a lot of people hating you, you're probably doing something wrong."


There you go, you're doing it again. This is big time television and work rate doesn't mean shit, TNT's viewership doesn't care about the struggles or determination these guys have been through. WCW didn't present new wrestlers by boasting about PowerPlant work ethic, because that's boring and no-one cares. As far as the typical TNT viewer or lapsed wrestling fan is concerned, they have no idea who these two are and AEW has done nothing to make them digestible for a larger market.

Channel hoppers with a past affinity for wrestling look at these two and see a pair of generic jobbers.

Again, AEW seems to have an identity crisis. They want to become major league, but they want to book a show for marks. These are contradictory aspirations.


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Gh0stFace said:


> I understand the fans that don't like spot fests, too many close counts, false finishes & trying to make every match the best match ever and whatever else they complain about. Young Bucks are operating at another frequency when it comes to wrestling and even if you hate them, deep down you would have to truly have some personal grudge against them (as Cornette has admitted to) to not respect them after all of the years of work that they put in and after they were able to successfully contribute in making this company a success. It was a huge gamble on their part. That takes A LOT OF BALLS.
> 
> But it's human nature. People subconsciously associate change with danger to their current perception because that would mean making they would need to make adjustments and look at things from different angles. For 1 hour I spend watching FOX news, I spend another watching CNN. That's besides the point. When Midnight Express first came around, old school fans hated them because they were doing too many moves that were to be done only on certain occasions.
> 
> I heard a quote recently and it couldn't be more true or relevant... "If you don't have a lot of people hating you, you're probably doing something wrong."


What the fuck is this

I write one sentence and I get this essay ?


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

CenaBoy4Life said:


> da fuck are you rambling about. people dont like the bucks because their ugly vanilla midget spot wrestlers with no psychology. they belong in a trampoline park.


Exactly what someone named "CenaBoy4Life" would say. After growing up with 15 years of boring Cena/WWE style wrestling -- it makes perfect sense for you to catch feelings and act out like a little kid. Besides, I thought only kids were Cena fans. 

With a name like that, you expect me to take you seriously?


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

optikk sucks said:


> What the fuck is this
> 
> I write one sentence and I get this essay ?


I naturally assumed that you were a rationally-minded adult capable of talking about the current nuances in wrestling given that you've given this forum a good portion of your life with 20k+ posts and 12 years.

It's lame childish shit like this that makes me think that AEW diehards and WWE diehards are both equally retarded.


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

Wrestling fans will be wrestling fans. I rest my case.


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Gh0stFace said:


> I naturally assumed that you were a rationally-minded adult capable of talking about the current nuances in wrestling given that you've given this forum a good portion of your life with 20k+ posts and 12 years.
> 
> It's lame childish shit like this that makes me think that AEW diehards and WWE diehards are both equally retarded.


You overthought a lost where I expressed my distaste for the young bucks, taking my dislike for them and thinking it’s personal lmao.
What is wrong with you - sorry thus wasn’t very 21st century of me. If you have any sort of condition, I apologise.


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

Gh0stFace said:


> med that you were a rationally-minded adult capable of talking about the current nuances in wrestling given that you've given this for





roadkill_ said:


> There you go, you're doing it again. This is big time television and work rate doesn't mean shit, TNT's viewership doesn't care about the struggles or determination these guys have been through. WCW didn't present new wrestlers by boasting about PowerPlant work ethic, because that's boring and no-one cares. As far as the typical TNT viewer or lapsed wrestling fan is concerned, they have no idea who these two are and AEW has done nothing to make them digestible for a larger market.
> 
> Channel hoppers with a past affinity for wrestling look at these two and see a pair of generic jobbers.
> 
> Again, AEW seems to have an identity crisis. They want to become major league, but they want to book a show for marks. These are contradictory aspirations.


So you stopped reading mid-sentence when you saw that quote and couldn't bother finishing reading the sentence or you just completely missed the theme of the post? AEW has been a huge success, well exceeding projected numbers -- even causing WWE to acknowledge them and to congratulate them for their success. 

The point was Young Bucks are widely popular, especially among the younger crowd (portion of KEY DEMOS), and have contributed to AEW's success. And this is perfectly reflected in the ratings: NXT had to give away a TAKE OVER caliber show on free TV just to get ONE WIN in the key demographics which consist of the younger audience since the "war" started.

You actually think the younger generation who didn't grow up watching wrestling will be more compelled to watch the boring WWE/Cena style of wrestling as opposed to watching a Young Bucks match? WWE style is very boring and generic -- the same way 70's wrestling would look to someone who started watching in the 80's or '90s. Look at the drop in WWE's numbers in the last decade before talking about a company that hasn't even been one season in business television-wise.


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## CenaBoy4Life (Jul 31, 2013)

Gh0stFace said:


> Exactly what someone named "CenaBoy4Life" would say. After growing up with 15 years of boring Cena/WWE style wrestling -- it makes perfect sense for you to catch feelings and act out like a little kid. Besides, I thought only kids were Cena fans.
> 
> With a name like that, you expect me to take you seriously?





Gh0stFace said:


> Exactly what someone named "CenaBoy4Life" would say. After growing up with 15 years of boring Cena/WWE style wrestling -- it makes perfect sense for you to catch feelings and act out like a little kid. Besides, I thought only kids were Cena fans.
> 
> With a name like that, you expect me to take you seriously?


" Young Bucks are operating at another frequency when it comes to wrestling "

Sorry i cant take this seriously. You may need another essay to explain whatever the fuck that means.


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

This is from Forbes from back in July 2019:
"WWE officials are worried that the company may lose a number of its younger viewers to AEW when it starts weekly TV in October 2019."

From the perspective of someone from a younger generation who has a general idea that wrestling is fake is an open secret but they have to put on a show no different than a TV show, except they get no retakes, compare an episode of Dynamite to RAW/Smackdown. Dynamite is a non-stop action show where you don't even realize 2 hours had just passed by compared to RAW. 

Dynamite is edgy, it's "cool" and it has the "nobody is safe, anything can happen" vibe because they're constantly experimenting and trying new things as opposed to RAW/Smackdown where everything is very formulaic, predictable and most of the time UNWATCHABLE, even to me, as a wrestling fan.


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

CenaBoy4Life said:


> " Young Bucks are operating at another frequency when it comes to wrestling "
> 
> Sorry i cant take this seriously. You may need another essay to explain whatever the fuck that means.


I'm assuming that you're a kid since you're a Cena fan and a WWE loyalist because of 5-10 years of WWE brainwashing. What you read is called a METAPHOR... meaning Young Bucks are doing different things that would never see the light of day on RAW/Smackdown because it's for kids like you. Hence the PG-rating and the move towards being "family-oriented"


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

V-Trigger said:


> It's about the constant harassment by the likes of Henry Trish and others.


Constant? To my knowledge Trish left a head in hand emoji and that's it. Henry commented once or twice and Orton tweeted maybe a couple more times than that. Far from harassment when it comes to them.

The fans? Maybe.


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## reyfan (May 23, 2011)

Gh0stFace said:


> I'm assuming that you're a kid since you're a Cena fan and a WWE loyalist because of 5-10 years of WWE brainwashing. What you read is called a METAPHOR... meaning Young Bucks are doing different things that would never see the light of day on RAW/Smackdown because it's for kids like you. Hence the PG-rating and the move towards being "family-oriented"


I guess Young Bucks appeal to the video game generation where you can get thrown out of a helicopter and get up like nothing happened, people got annoyed with Cena would no sell also, the one thing WWE has never done and probably never will is name a wrestling move after a dirt sheet writer hoping he wont dump on them for their shitty performances.


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## CenaBoy4Life (Jul 31, 2013)

Gh0stFace said:


> I'm assuming that you're a kid since you're a Cena fan and a WWE loyalist because of 5-10 years of WWE brainwashing. What you read is called a METAPHOR... meaning Young Bucks are doing different things that would never see the light of day on RAW/Smackdown because it's for kids like you. Hence the PG-rating and the move towards being "family-oriented"


yeah what exactly are they doing differently. stop insulting and bringing up cena and explain what makes young cucks such special wrestlers. what a troll this guy is.


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

optikk sucks said:


> You overthought a lost where I expressed my distaste for the young bucks, taking my dislike for them and thinking it’s personal lmao.
> What is wrong with you - sorry thus wasn’t very 21st century of me. If you have any sort of condition, I apologise.


LOL! No need for underhanded apologies, go off on me... I wouldn't report you. I ain't no Tekashi. I personally fucking hate this 21st century politically correct culture where everyone gets offended over every little thing. I was trolling with what I said in regards to WWE & AEW diehard fans I'm a pretty diehard AEW fan myself.

I'm just genuinely perplexed that an AEW fan like yourself hates these guys that basically helped build this company into what it is today. They were pretty instrumental to the creation of AEW.

John Cena is a modern day version of Hulk Hogan. He may even have less moves. He's the personification of that style of wrestling. But that style of wrestling is outdated. Things have to change and evolve, bro. Just look at the ratings. John Cena killed off 7 million viewers starting with the "Ruthless Aggression Era" after Attitude Era had to end.

IMO what Young Bucks are trying to do is add a bit of edginess that made Attitude Era fun to watch into wrestling matches. It may not come over well to you. But watching Hulk and Cena wrestle looks 1000x more fake and lame to me.

We're on the same team, bud. Just trying to understand this cognitive dissonance.


----------



## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

reyfan said:


> I guess Young Bucks appeal to the video game generation where you can get thrown out of a helicopter and get up like nothing happened, people got annoyed with Cena would no sell also, the one thing WWE has never done and probably never will is name a wrestling move after a dirt sheet writer hoping he wont dump on them for their shitty performances.


Actually, the one thing WWE has never done and probably never will is treat it's workers or fans with respect or care.


----------



## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

CenaBoy4Life said:


> yeah what exactly are they doing differently. stop insulting and bringing up cena and explain what makes young cucks such special wrestlers. what a troll this guy is.


People claim that Young Bucks undersell and that WWE stars oversell. I agree with this to a certain extent. I'm not a fan of Triple H brawl matches and long-holds. Bret Hart was my favorite wrestler when I first started watching wrestling. 

He was able to evolve in his own way creating his own style that respected the expectations and psychology of the traditional wrestling but he took it up a notch or two... while it may look like Young Bucks take it up 9-10 notches sometimes. I love technical wrestling but I also love the X-Divison style non-stop action wrestling which Young Bucks have kind of pioneered. 

Bret Hart's matches always looked so believable to me and I believe that was one of the reasons why. He was able to hit that sweet spot like Jericho. Jericho vs. PAC & Jericho vs. Omega never felt like a WWE style match. They looked like very believable hard-hitting contests with real main event feels.


----------



## IronMan8 (Dec 25, 2015)

Braylyt said:


> If they feel like deleting Twitter is better for their mental health then more power to them, but don't act like fans (and pretty much everyone in the business) were in the wrong for ridiculing that awful clip.
> 
> Even if some fans took it too far, the selective outrage is laughable. Even on this forum it's apparently perfectly acceptable to wish death upon a 70+ year old man on a daily basis, some trolls rubbing AEW's fuck ups in their faces isn't even close to being in the same ballpark.


Nobody ever actually wishes death on a 70+ year old man though. You’re just misinterpreting the actual meaning behind the literal words you see.

90% of meaning in communication is not from words.


----------



## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

CenaBoy4Life said:


> yeah what exactly are they doing differently. stop insulting and bringing up cena and explain what makes young cucks such special wrestlers. what a troll this guy is.


What Will Osprey and Ricochet do is not that much different than Young Bucks. It's the same style of wrestling that's been knocked as "video game wrestling."

And typical critics of this type of wrestling would particularly be annoyed by this video below.. especially in that spot where Ricochet hit Ospreay with Death Valley Driver (dangerous move) on the apron (hardest part of the ring). Osprey no-sold it and immediately came back with a reverse hurricanrana.

But CM Punk still calls him the best in the world, so what do I know?


----------



## reyfan (May 23, 2011)

Gh0stFace said:


> Actually, the one thing WWE has never done and probably never will is treat it's workers or fans with respect or care.


Yeah because they keep guys with jobs after their careers end like Paige and Bryan(before he returned) or HBK on the payroll for 4 years after his back injury for lols


----------



## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

reyfan said:


> Yeah because they keep guys with jobs after their careers end like Paige and Bryan(before he returned) or HBK on the payroll for 4 years after his back injury for lols


Aw I thought the same and then reality hit me in the face when I read Ashley Massaro's affidavit shortly before she killed herself detailing how WWE treats it's employees. You can have a look here:
https://wweconcussionlawsuitnews.co...19/05/Ashley-Massaro-Affidavit-Clean-11.1.pdf


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Gh0stFace said:


> Aw I thought the same and then reality hit me in the face when I read Ashley Massaro's affidavit shortly before she killed herself detailing how WWE treats it's employees. You can have a look here:
> https://wweconcussionlawsuitnews.co...19/05/Ashley-Massaro-Affidavit-Clean-11.1.pdf


AEW hasn't been around long enough to say how they treat employees. The fact of the matter is all wrestling promotions treat their independent contractors like shit. Be it over working them, asking them to work injured, not paying them, not paying them a living wage, not offering insurance. They all do a lot of shit that wouldn't be approved of if wrestling was a business people cared about.


----------



## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

RapShepard said:


> AEW hasn't been around long enough to say how they treat employees. The fact of the matter is all wrestling promotions treat their independent contractors like shit. Be it over working them, asking them to work injured, not paying them, not paying them a living wage, not offering insurance. They all do a lot of shit that wouldn't be approved of if wrestling was a business people cared about.


According Jericho he's an employee of AEW and has health insurance; which he had neither in WWE and yet was contracted to work for them despite being contracted as an INDEPENDENT contractor yet not being allowed to work anywhere else (kind of defeats the purpose of being an independent contractor). The wrestlers who are working full-time as employees are receiving health insurance. But not the wrestlers who are also working independently (like Moxley - but obviously he is still covered for anything that happens in AEW ring).


----------



## reyfan (May 23, 2011)

Gh0stFace said:


> Aw I thought the same and then reality hit me in the face when I read Ashley Massaro's affidavit shortly before she killed herself detailing how WWE treats it's employees. You can have a look here:
> https://wweconcussionlawsuitnews.co...19/05/Ashley-Massaro-Affidavit-Clean-11.1.pdf


And how many times should WWE put someone through rehab before they realise it's a waste of money?
Then you get guys like Umaga that refuse to take their help and die a few months later.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Gh0stFace said:


> According Jericho he's an employee of AEW and has health insurance; which he had neither in WWE and yet was contracted to work for them despite being contracted as an INDEPENDENT contractor.


According to Bucks, Cody, and Tony Kahn only folks with backstage or office roles get guaranteed health insurance. A select few wrestlers get health insurance, but it's not company wide. Safe to assume it's Jericho and folk super close to the Elite 









AEW Execs Gave New Statements About Healthcare For Their Wrestlers


AEW executives Cody and Tony Khan talked about how their company plans to take care of its wrestlers.




uproxx.com













AEW President Tony Khan Addresses Talent Health Insurance


All Elite Wrestling President Tony Khan divulged information over how AEW handle health insurance for its talent during a post-AEW: Dynamite media scrum




www.sescoops.com





Notice how in the second link he never bothers to actually name those who have full coverage that just wrestle and how he goes on to double talk about how "oh well some of these people aren't full time they're part time". To justify without justifying why they don't have health care. 

For the record I don't think Kahn is some monster or anything. Just pointing to how he's not doing much different despite the credit you want to give him.


----------



## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

Still much better progress in less than 1 year than WWE had in 48 years toward the wellbeing of their "superstars"


----------



## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

Did you read the affidavit?


----------



## IronMan8 (Dec 25, 2015)

Gh0stFace said:


> Bret Hart was my favorite wrestler when I first started watching wrestling.
> 
> He was able to evolve in his own way creating his own style that respected the expectations and psychology of the traditional wrestling but he took it up a notch or two... while it may look like Young Bucks take it up 9-10 notches sometimes. I love technical wrestling but I also love the X-Divison style non-stop action wrestling which Young Bucks have kind of pioneered.
> 
> Bret Hart's matches always looked so believable to me and I believe that was one of the reasons why. He was able to hit that sweet spot like Jericho. Jericho vs. PAC & Jericho vs. Omega never felt like a WWE style match. They looked like very believable hard-hitting contests with real main event feels.


Bret Hart was my first favourite too, I’ve seen all his WWF PPV matches from 1990.

I watched a Bret Hart vs Ric Flair match last weekend, and the first 15 minutes literally consistently of twisting the arm.

Ric gave one kick to the stomach and Bret collapsed for 20 seconds.

The way Bret improved the in-ring product was to increase the drama and realism. Heaps of time was spent on emotion with facial expressions and selling. That’s how he made us care about him.

The Bucks are changing things too, but it’s not like Bret.

The Bucks have significantly reduced kayfabe psychology and significantly increased admiration for real-life traits that can only be admired if you’re not buying into the art.

By that I mean, we admire their business acumen, athleticism, creativity, etc.

But nothing they do within the framework of kayfabe is good for the business.

I’m expecting it will be harmful, because it means we might never get matches that make us care about the characters while we willingly buy into the kayfabe, like Bret Hart’s, ever again - where the pain and emotion is central to the in-ring story.

I forgot how great it was to see Ric Flair’s cockiness evaporate as he screamed like a little girl from a simple arm bar.

Bret and Ric’s match demonstrates that is wasn’t about the moves, it was about justice being served to the character.

Bucks’ matches don’t create that feeling, but they do create a feeling of shock and awe at what the real them are capable of doing in the ring.


----------



## IronMan8 (Dec 25, 2015)

Gh0stFace said:


> What Will Osprey and Ricochet do is not that much different than Young Bucks. It's the same style of wrestling that's been knocked as "video game wrestling."
> 
> And typical critics of this type of wrestling would particularly be annoyed by this video below.. especially in that spot where Ricochet hit Ospreay with Death Valley Driver (dangerous move) on the apron (hardest part of the ring). Osprey no-sold it and immediately came back with a reverse hurricanrana.
> 
> But CM Punk still calls him the best in the world, so what do I know?


I won’t make any judgments on what is good or bad.

But I think it’s accurate to describe this type of match as generating the following emotions in the crowd:


shock
awe
surprise
That’s about it. They’re standing there after the match like they’re fine, so you’re never going to feel anything more than admiration for their athleticism and perhaps creativity for thinking of some of the spots.

But if we’re supposed to admire their athleticism, then why wouldn’t we watch men’s gymnastics where the athletes can do triple flips on the floor?

If we’re supposed to admire their creativity for thinking of spots, how much more creative can they be if everyone is wrestling this style 7 hours a week, 52 weeks a year?

Most importantly, people don’t really care about your character if they’re feeling shock, surprise, etc.

People are hardwired to feel more deeply and sympathetic when someone is in pain.

People enjoy seeing justice being served.

Video game wrestling completely ignores the most powerful emotions that used to be central to wrestling.

It will only be successful if a new type of non-kayfabe wrestling becomes successful, where it does eventually become a form of gymnastics. I can’t see another logical way forward for this style long-term.

Wrestling is running away from kayfabe right now, but unless we think Olympic-standard gymnastics is the end-goal here, then they should be pivoting to present wrestling like a Hollywood movie or TV show where it’s common sense that you buy into the kayfabe.


----------



## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

> Bucks’ matches don’t create that feeling, but they do create a feeling of shock and awe at what the real them are capable of doing in the ring.


The first time I saw Young Bucks I was just blown away. They were super young. I thought the match was over in 2 minutes but it lasted about 10. This was like 2007 so they were MUCH MORE dangerous and reckless back then. I admit that it was a CRAZY SPOT after CRAZY SPOT after a CRAZY SPOT but the entire crowd was invested and every few seconds the ENTIRE crowd would be like "OHHHHHH" with every spot like someone just got shot. I never experienced that got kind of energy before. It was definitely shock and awe but also intrigue. Their timing, pace, body language, every little thing was impeccable -- I never saw such collaborative action between a tag team where they were in 100% perfect sync with each other.

I felt like the match was over in 10 seconds although it went 10 minutes because of how crazy fast action paced it was. But it was INTENSE and I felt the whole energy of the crowd reacting to every crazy spot in unison telling themselves "please don't die". There was definitely emotion, and strong emotion but I couldn't describe exactly what. But I was definitely shocked and in awe. If wrestling is also partially about "larger than life superstars", this is exactly what they were...

They still got it nowadays but I can tell they're holding back. They're not everyone's cup of tea and they poke fun at it with their "killin the business" t-shirts


----------



## Garty (Jul 29, 2007)

reyfan said:


> Yeah because they keep guys with jobs after their careers end like Paige and Bryan(before he returned) or HBK on the payroll for 4 years after his back injury for lols


Do you know why that is? One word. Lawsuits.


----------



## volde (Apr 9, 2007)

While Ospreay still is a bit too spots-heavy for my tastes I think it is unfair to show that video of him and Ricochet as some sort of an example. In last two years he has improved a lot. He has more defined character, his selling improved and his high spots now usually make more sense than just "I'll do high spot because I need to do it".


----------



## Uchiha Ghost (Nov 16, 2019)

Lol, cry me a river Young Shits.??????


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Gh0stFace said:


> Actually, the one thing WWE has never done and probably never will is treat it's workers or fans with respect or care.





Gh0stFace said:


> LOL! No need for underhanded apologies, go off on me... I wouldn't report you. I ain't no Tekashi. I personally fucking hate this 21st century politically correct culture where everyone gets offended over every little thing. I was trolling with what I said in regards to WWE & AEW diehard fans I'm a pretty diehard AEW fan myself.
> 
> I'm just genuinely perplexed that an AEW fan like yourself hates these guys that basically helped build this company into what it is today. They were pretty instrumental to the creation of AEW.
> 
> ...


i would honestly rather have Cena than the Bucks on my team.
You can call Cena talentless all you but, but the fact is he isn’t. He was a top talent and a company man- he did what the boss asked of him. Genuine perfect employee.

I find the bucks irritating. They are not natural faces.


----------



## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

Uchiha Ghost said:


> Lol, cry me a river Young Shits.??????


Can you at least be a _little_ witty and call them "Young Fucks" instead? Damn...


----------



## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

optikk sucks said:


> i would honestly rather have Cena than the Bucks on my team.
> You can call Cena talentless all you but, but the fact is he isn’t. He was a top talent and a company man- he did what the boss asked of him. Genuine perfect employee.
> 
> I find the bucks irritating. They are not natural faces.


That's the problem. He's a good employee. He's a good company man. Not the fan's man. But more than 7 million people stopped watching during his reign and fans turned on him with "Cena Sucks" chants. Most AEW fans are as crazy as ECW fans back in the day, they would riot the day Cena replaces the Bucks. 

Bucks have a connection with the crowd. I saw them at PWG show where they were being heels and doing all kinds of shit to get heat on them to the point people were cursing them out.... only to afterwards have a huge line to buy their merchandise.

They are either very smart or very dumb. I highly doubt the latter given where they are right now.


----------



## xio8ups (Nov 6, 2015)

elite marks


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Gh0stFace said:


> That's the problem. He's a good employee. He's a good company man. Not the fan's man. But more than 7 million people stopped watching during his reign and fans turned on him with "Cena Sucks" chants. Most AEW fans are as crazy as ECW fans back in the day, they would riot the day Cena replaces the Bucks.
> 
> Bucks have a connection with the crowd. I saw them at PWG show where they were being heels and doing all kinds of shit to get heat on them to the point people were cursing them out.... only to afterwards have a huge line to buy their merchandise.
> 
> They are either very smart or very dumb. I highly doubt the latter given where they are right now.


Cena moved merchandise during a time when they lost viewers. Blaming one man for the loss in viewers is dumb. They started losing viewers from 2001. Is it still Cenas fault?

And the irony of your last statement is hilarious. Was Vince dumb to push Cena?


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

RapShepard said:


> *According to Bucks, Cody, and Tony Kahn only folks with backstage or office roles get guaranteed health insurance. A select few wrestlers get health insurance, but it's not company wide. Safe to assume it's Jericho and folk super close to the Elite*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I’ve told you a couple of times over the last months about how almost 80% gets health insurance - way more than what is needed - and you keep saying this. The people who don’t get it are either 1. Those who don’t need it, like Mox or 2. Those not signed to a deal - ie> on try-out for a time or one-off appearances, like Hayter. I would also guess somebody who spends 90% of their time in another promotion like Bea would be one.

go watch the media scrum with Tony after Full Gear (not read a very badly written article about it) listen to his long podcast he did with that wrestling guy... I think Bryan Alvarez - he explains it very well (for a loooooong time)

and although I’ve said this to you multiple times - you keep making this statement. Which is just untrue.


----------



## NondescriptWWEfan (May 9, 2017)

probably a publicity stunt they'll return soon


----------



## Moonlight_drive (Oct 8, 2008)

...and now leave wrestling.


----------



## reyfan (May 23, 2011)

NondescriptWWEfan said:


> probably a publicity stunt they'll return soon


Yeah if they hadn't made the statement before hand and just disappeared it could have easily been sold as the "attack" from the dark order really fucked with them so they are on hiatus from everything.


----------



## Rozzop (Aug 26, 2019)

Gh0stFace said:


> What Will Osprey and Ricochet do is not that much different than Young Bucks. It's the same style of wrestling that's been knocked as "video game wrestling."
> 
> And typical critics of this type of wrestling would particularly be annoyed by this video below.. especially in that spot where Ricochet hit Ospreay with Death Valley Driver (dangerous move) on the apron (hardest part of the ring). Osprey no-sold it and immediately came back with a reverse hurricanrana.
> 
> But CM Punk still calls him the best in the world, so what do I know?


Thats not even wrestling. Yeah I can appreciate the athleticsm and if I was a young kid who has never seen a wrestling match before, who knows if I would like it but at the end of the day, none of the moves look like they hurt the competitior, they both dont look intimidating and it just reminds me of two guys bouncing around on a trampoline inflicting zero damage on each other until the finish.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Rozzop said:


> Thats not even wrestling. Yeah I can appreciate the athleticsm and if I was a young kid who has never seen a wrestling match before, who knows if I would like it but at the end of the day, none of the moves look like they hurt the competitior, they both dont look intimidating and it just reminds me of two guys bouncing around on a trampoline inflicting zero damage on each other until the finish.


Honestly i fucking hate this style of wrestling.


----------



## kingfrass44 (Sep 19, 2019)

Gh0stFace said:


> LOL! No need for underhanded apologies, go off on me... I wouldn't report you. I ain't no Tekashi. I personally fucking hate this 21st century politically correct culture where everyone gets offended over every little thing. I was trolling with what I said in regards to WWE & AEW diehard fans I'm a pretty diehard AEW fan myself.
> 
> I'm just genuinely perplexed that an AEW fan like yourself hates these guys that basically helped build this company into what it is today. They were pretty instrumental to the creation of AEW.
> 
> ...


Depending on your logic 
look ratings aew 
Young Bucks killer ratings Which means their style is useless


----------



## The Raw Smackdown (Jan 8, 2017)

You know . They could be just enjoying the holidays...


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

Gh0stFace said:


> Still much better progress in less than 1 year than WWE had in 48 years toward the wellbeing of their "superstars"


Based on what I mean the WWE rehab program alone is one of the most progressive things in wrestling. They've been paying for surgeries and any injury related costs. As shady as the wellness policy can be, it did help someone like MVP discover he had a heart condition. That's not even getting into personal stories of Vince helping out talent, like when he bought Austin a house and this is before Austin was his top guy.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

It's like the 'Fans' don't know the Young Bucks at ALL    


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1209153299213099011


----------



## Sir Linko (Oct 10, 2019)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> It's like the 'Fans' don't know the Young Bucks at ALL
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1209153299213099011


This makes me so happy. Mistakes happen and that was a big one, only because of the internet, but still big. One thing AEW doesnt get any credit for is either fixing criticism or at least recognizing it. This type of tweet is going to male trolls mad far more than trolls make them mad. :lmao

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


----------



## Coach (May 5, 2013)

SEETHING


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> I’ve told you a couple of times over the last months about how almost 80% gets health insurance - way more than what is needed - and you keep saying this. The people who don’t get it are either 1. Those who don’t need it, like Mox or 2. Those not signed to a deal - ie> on try-out for a time or one-off appearances, like Hayter. I would also guess somebody who spends 90% of their time in another promotion like Bea would be one.
> 
> go watch the media scrum with Tony after Full Gear (not read a very badly written article about it) listen to his long podcast he did with that wrestling guy... I think Bryan Alvarez - he explains it very well (for a loooooong time)
> 
> and although I’ve said this to you multiple times - you keep making this statement. Which is just untrue.


My point isn't untrue at all. They went from we'll offer them healthcare to we'll see, to they got it themselves. Again I have no problem with how they're handling healthcare. But pretending that their healthcare system is vastly different than the WWE's is silly. They cover you if you get injured (though it's nice they cover even if it's not on their show). 

Also we've talked about it once so cut the multiple times shit out.


----------



## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

RapShepard said:


> My point isn't untrue at all. They went from we'll offer them healthcare to we'll see, to they got it themselves. Again I have no problem with how they're handling healthcare. But pretending that their healthcare system is vastly different than the WWE's is silly. They cover you if you get injured (though it's nice they cover even if it's not on their show).
> 
> Also we've talked about it once so cut the multiple times shit out.


This is the 3rd time the topic has come up - and then also more in general

WWE covers you when you get hurt in their ring - insurance against injury it not = healthcare. its the same as 3rd party insurance when you own buildings. Maybe a little more.

AEW gives healthcare - there is a big difference. Why is it a difference? They give a lot of their people dual roles - so, they get registered as an employee - so, not just coverage for injuries in the ring

The biggest issue with WWE is not even healthcare - it is exclusivity for independent contractors - which is ducking healthcare completely

Now... to be fair, I care zero for WWEs going ons - so, it bothers me none - those 
wrestlers also get mega bucks, so they should get their own healthcare. But to say their 'systems are close to each other' .... is just untrue ?‍♂


----------



## Uchiha Ghost (Nov 16, 2019)

Gh0stFace said:


> Can you at least be a _little_ witty and call them "Young Fucks" instead? Damn...


You sound triggered. ? ?


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> This is the 3rd time the topic has come up - and then also more in general
> 
> WWE covers you when you get hurt in their ring - insurance against injury it not = healthcare. its the same as 3rd party insurance when you own buildings. Maybe a little more.
> 
> ...


I didn't say WWE gave healthcare you misread the post. I said AEW doesn't operate much different than WWE when it comes to healthcare. It's a pretty well known fact that health insurance is expensive for risky careers like wrestling. I mean it's kind of obvious that outside of saving money on bring in legitimate EVP and stuff like that, hiring wrestlers in those positions allows a loophole for them to get cheap healthcare. 

But again I don't think Tony is doing anything wrong. I just don't get why @Gh0stFace is acting as if AEW is doing something really revolutionary treatment wise when most what they're doing is pretty standard. Outside of covering talent if they get injured while wrestling for another promotion. That's a really stand up move.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RapShepard said:


> AEW doesn't operate much different than WWE when it comes to healthcare.


they sorta do tho

aew cover most of their roster. wwe do not.


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

optikk sucks said:


> they sorta do tho
> 
> aew cover most of their roster. wwe do not.


Except they don't the wrestlers that are covered have dual roles save a few. HHH also has health care, but it's because he's also a suit. If AEW were giving health care to the Sonny Kisses of the roster and such that would be vastly different. But in reality just like WWE the majority of their roster gets their own health care. Then the ones that do cover it, the majority of them have a position as a suit.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RapShepard said:


> Except they don't the wrestlers that are covered have dual roles save a few. HHH also has health care, but it's because he's also a suit. If AEW were giving health care to the Sonny Kisses of the roster and such that would be vastly different. But in reality just like WWE the majority of their roster gets their own health care. Then the ones that do cover it, the majority of them have a position as a suit.


except that AEW do cover most of their roster.

You got a copy of Sonny Kiss contract?


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

optikk sucks said:


> except that AEW do cover most of their roster.
> 
> You got a copy of Sonny Kiss contract?


It's been said multiple times that they don't. If they were legitimately covering most of the wrestlers especially the ones that don't have dual roles they'd be screaming that shit from the high heavens. Not that they're in the wrong for not covering them.


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RapShepard said:


> It's been said multiple times that they don't. If they were legitimately covering most of the wrestlers especially the ones that don't have dual roles they'd be screaming that shit from the high heavens. Not that they're in the wrong for not covering them.


let's see that sonny kiss contract bro

the amount of times that undercard jobber sonny kiss is mentioned in this sxn, you would think he's a multi-time world champion or something. lots of people seem to be a fan lmao


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

optikk sucks said:


> let's see that sonny kiss contract bro


Do you have it, because you're acting like you know Sonny Kiss contract? I'm going off Tony's own words on who has health coverage. 







Go to 8 minutes in and this is from the first Dynamite episode. Be honest with yourself why do you think he keeps stressing the "full time", "office workers", and "apart of my office". If AEW was covering the majority of the wrestlers in general regardless if they had dual roles we both know he would've just said that. 

I still don't think any thing is wrong with that. But he's clearly beating around the bush and not just saying the obvious that " no they aren't covering everybody".


----------



## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

RapShepard said:


> Do you have it, because you're acting like you know Sonny Kiss contract? I'm going off Tony's own words on who has health coverage.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


but sonny kiss is mentioned so much on wf, you'd think he would be heavily features on dynamite as one of their most prominent stars? surely he'd bag healthcare insurance from aew? who doesn't want sonny to get that treatment?


----------



## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

optikk sucks said:


> but sonny kiss is mentioned so much on wf, you'd think he would be heavily features on dynamite as one of their most prominent stars? surely he'd bag healthcare insurance from aew? who doesn't want sonny to get that treatment?


You just made my point for me :lmao.

If the only wrestlers with dual roles as executives, producers, coaches, and Jericho have health care can you really brag about offering health care? I mentioned Sonny Kiss specifically because he's pretty much bottom of the barrel in the company. If they were truly offering health care to all their wrestlers somebody as low as Kiss would have heath care. But as Tony Kahn made it clear the full time employees aka folk with official backstage jobs are the ones with health coverage.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

RapShepard said:


> Do you have it, because you're acting like you know Sonny Kiss contract? I'm going off Tony's own words on who has health coverage.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


ah - that is the clip.

what I infer from that - and I will listen to Wade's podcast again (as he says there is a list) - is that anybody with a dual role and/or exclusivity has health care / Benefits

anybody who does multiple promotions does not - and even then, he has given to some.

So, I would say if you're on their roster page, it is a good chance you have

Like Hayter is not, only doing a couple of spots, works mostly for another promotion

I think the key is here.... there is zero need to give these guys benefits / health care if they are not exclusive - then they are just independent contractors. Giving independent contractors benefits (in cases) is a stand-up thing and should be applauded. They could have not done that.

Now... this is much ado about nothing and I don't know how we got here on a YB thread - but I think we can put a pin it at 'you think it isn't the biggest deal' / 'I think it is a bigger deal' - but there is no reason to really argue about it because it depends on the individual in each case anyway


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

RapShepard said:


> You just made my point for me :lmao.
> 
> If the only wrestlers with dual roles as executives, producers, coaches, and Jericho have health care can you really brag about offering health care? I mentioned Sonny Kiss specifically because he's pretty much bottom of the barrel in the company. I*f they were truly offering health care to all their wrestlers somebody as low as Kiss would have heath care.* But as Tony Kahn made it clear the full time employees aka folk with official backstage jobs are the ones with health coverage.


.... maybe he does?


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## RapShepard (Jun 20, 2014)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> ah - that is the clip.
> 
> what I infer from that - and I will listen to Wade's podcast again (as he says there is a list) - is that anybody with a dual role and/or exclusivity has health care / Benefits
> 
> ...


I think we definitely agree it's no big deal whether they do or not. My only thing is the claim to giving health care to their wrestlers is kind of dubious when it's mostly down to them holding a position outside the ring. But yeah agree to disagree on that end.


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

RapShepard said:


> I think we definitely agree it's no big deal whether they do or not. My only thing is the claim to giving health care to their wrestlers is kind of dubious when it's mostly down to them holding a position outside the ring. But yeah agree to disagree on that end.


.... dubious is a strong word for what I perceive to be a good thing. Especially since they haven't been trumpeting it - they just answered questions when it came up

but, agree to disagree it is


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## NathanMayberry (Oct 11, 2019)

Gh0stFace said:


> Did you read the affidavit?


The one that was thrown out by the judge?


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## MoxleyMoxx (Sep 24, 2012)




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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

Twitter is a drain - they‘re bookers now - good call


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## Coach (May 5, 2013)

MoxleyMoxx said:


>


 S E E T H I N G


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## Optikk is All Elite (Sep 5, 2007)

Your best content should be on tv


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## RiverFenix (Dec 10, 2011)

Now if they only quit BTE to spend more time with their families. And gave up the book to spend more time with thier families. And gave up being EVP's to spend more time with their families. And gave up no-sell trampoline wrestling to spend more time with their families.


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## rbl85 (Nov 21, 2017)

optikk sucks said:


> Your best content should be on tv


Don't be that dense….


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## LifeInCattleClass (Dec 21, 2010)

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Now if they only quit BTE to spend more time with their families. And gave up the book to spend more time with thier families. And gave up being EVP's to spend more time with their families. And gave up no-sell trampoline wrestling to spend more time with their families.


If only some posters would spend more time with their families too


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## Chip Chipperson (Jun 29, 2019)

Gh0stFace said:


> The first time I saw Young Bucks I was just blown away. They were super young. I thought the match was over in 2 minutes but it lasted about 10. This was like 2007 so they were MUCH MORE dangerous and reckless back then. I admit that it was a CRAZY SPOT after CRAZY SPOT after a CRAZY SPOT but the entire crowd was invested and every few seconds the ENTIRE crowd would be like "OHHHHHH" with every spot like someone just got shot. I never experienced that got kind of energy before. It was definitely shock and awe but also intrigue. Their timing, pace, body language, every little thing was impeccable -- I never saw such collaborative action between a tag team where they were in 100% perfect sync with each other.
> 
> I felt like the match was over in 10 seconds although it went 10 minutes because of how crazy fast action paced it was. But it was INTENSE and I felt the whole energy of the crowd reacting to every crazy spot in unison telling themselves "please don't die". There was definitely emotion, and strong emotion but I couldn't describe exactly what. But I was definitely shocked and in awe. If wrestling is also partially about "larger than life superstars", this is exactly what they were...


Your getting shot analogy is a good one. Imagine a Young Bucks match went more like a movie and instead of starting the movie with guys getting shot they instead build an emotional connection with the audience and make ONE shot mean something.

From a wrestling perspective here is what I mean, The Bucks come out, they go for a high-flying spot but the dastardly heel moves out of the way, runs away, cuts them off etc etc. The Bucks try a couple more times throughout the matches but something always stops them. The crowd anticipate the move, The Bucks finally eventually do hit the move (Aka the shot) and it means something because:

1. The crowd are pissed at the heels for stopping the entertaining stuff.

2. The Bucks have just won the match and they like The Bucks. 

The lack of flips throughout the match don't matter because eventually they hit them and the good guys won. Heels get over as well rather than it just being spot followed by spot followed by spot followed by spot followed...by...spot...




Gh0stFace said:


> That's the problem. He's a good employee. He's a good company man. Not the fan's man. But more than 7 million people stopped watching during his reign and fans turned on him with "Cena Sucks" chants. Most AEW fans are as crazy as ECW fans back in the day, they would riot the day Cena replaces the Bucks.
> 
> Bucks have a connection with the crowd. I saw them at PWG show where they were being heels and doing all kinds of shit to get heat on them to the point people were cursing them out.... only to afterwards have a huge line to buy their merchandise.
> 
> They are either very smart or very dumb. I highly doubt the latter given where they are right now.


Wrestling fans tuned out in 2001 because WCW died and then it slowly started dropping ever since. Compare the 02 roster with 05 when Cena won the belt. Also, the brand split definitely split the audience. I remember as a kid that the other kids were fans of either RAW or Smackdown and very few actually watched both. I was a Smackdown guy and had a few friends that were but the majority were RAW fans.




Sir Linko said:


> This makes me so happy. Mistakes happen and that was a big one, only because of the internet, but still big. One thing AEW doesnt get any credit for is either fixing criticism or at least recognizing it. This type of tweet is going to male trolls mad far more than trolls make them mad. :lmao
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


How does it result in money being made? The shit punches on AEW TV makes people say "This is fake bullshit" and tune out. How does that video tweet bring them back?


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Your getting shot analogy is a good one. Imagine a Young Bucks match went more like a movie and instead of starting the movie with guys getting shot they instead build an emotional connection with the audience and make ONE shot mean something.
> 
> From a wrestling perspective here is what I mean, The Bucks come out, they go for a high-flying spot but the dastardly heel moves out of the way, runs away, cuts them off etc etc. The Bucks try a couple more times throughout the matches but something always stops them. The crowd anticipate the move, The Bucks finally eventually do hit the move (Aka the shot) and it means something because:
> 
> ...


Look I hear and understand everything that you're saying ... but when you're there live and feel that energy with the crowd it's just a completely different experience. Young Bucks have themselves said that they don't think like wrestlers because they always want to be unpredictable and innovative.. .I remember in some interview Nick said they think of it as shooting an action movie. 

Watching Young Bucks live may be like watching a Marvel movie. I HATE Marvel movies because I feel as if they lack the emotional connection ... I haven't even watched Avengers yet, but I understand why people would like it.

I don't follow Young Bucks religiously but since watching that last Being The Elite on You Tube which was very entertaining and funny I decided to go back to episode 1 & 2... and WOW. Adam Cole was there from the beginning: 

skip to 2 mins 30 seconds


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## Cult03 (Oct 31, 2016)

MoxleyMoxx said:


>


Its always everyone else's fault with these guys. Stop with the woe is me antics. Pay someone to look after your social media if you can't cop it for mistakes your company makes, just like Vince does. Trying so hard to like them but I just can't do it. They embrace the trolling when they want to and as soon as they get it back they run off. They really weren't ready for this


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## Gh0stFace (Oct 10, 2019)

Like that study said, Twitter is toxic as fuck, but never representative. I don't blame them


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## BigCy (Nov 10, 2012)

LifeInCattleClass said:


> If only some posters would spend more time with their families too


Lol. So true. That's probably most of us "regulars" though.


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## The Wood (Nov 7, 2003)

They are struggling under the pressure.


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## Sir Linko (Oct 10, 2019)

Chip Chipperson said:


> Your getting shot analogy is a good one. Imagine a Young Bucks match went more like a movie and instead of starting the movie with guys getting shot they instead build an emotional connection with the audience and make ONE shot mean something.
> 
> From a wrestling perspective here is what I mean, The Bucks come out, they go for a high-flying spot but the dastardly heel moves out of the way, runs away, cuts them off etc etc. The Bucks try a couple more times throughout the matches but something always stops them. The crowd anticipate the move, The Bucks finally eventually do hit the move (Aka the shot) and it means something because:
> 
> ...



Because most of the people that even care about that tweet are either already haters of AEW or watchers. Maybe, possibly, people already involved in wrestling. Those who see it who aren't already interested in wrestling didn't come in droves when Kofi won the Championship at Wrestlemania after his win went viral - people aren't going to write off wrestling because of one single gif :lmao

People making this a much bigger deal as it was a fuck up to the minds of everyone who love / watch wrestling. Otherwise, sadly, no one really gives a shit.

This isn't the 90's where the business would have been hugely exposed, or 80's, or 70's. Everyone knows wrestling is fake and people either like it or don't. Unless something happens really really big in the wrestling industry - then people simply don't fucking care about it outside of those that do.

Lmao same shit on RAW happened with Shane ghost punching orton and in NJPW when Jericho and Omega were playing air guitars on eachothers ears. Shit happens, bad camera angles happen, people just wanted to shit on AEW because of this when most of the people didn't even comment about the punches in the first place until people started pointing them out. Now it's a big deal? Pffft.


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## One Shed (Jan 7, 2014)

Gh0stFace said:


> Look I hear and understand everything that you're saying ... but when you're there live and feel that energy with the crowd it's just a completely different experience. Young Bucks have themselves said that they don't think like wrestlers because they always want to be unpredictable and innovative.. .I remember in some interview Nick said they think of it as shooting an action movie.
> 
> Watching Young Bucks live may be like watching a Marvel movie. I HATE Marvel movies because I feel as if they lack the emotional connection ... I haven't even watched Avengers yet, but I understand why people would like it.
> 
> ...


It is hard to take a perspective seriously that Marvel movies lack an emotional connection, but you did say you have not seen "Avengers" which I assume you mean Infinity War and Endgame. I would highly recommend you watch them. For "comic book movies" they have some of the best emotional moments I have seen in movies. I think Infinity War is one of the best movies ever made.

Young Bucks are much more like DC movies. Just a bunch of incoherent action for long swaths of time with no one bothering to come up with an interesting story. The reason Marvel movies work and DC ones do not is because you have to know your heroes can fail and often do. Superman is boring since he always wins the day. The Bucks are boring and sure, they can flip a lot and would probably do really well at gymnastics, but they have sold less than a snow store in Alaska.


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## The Raw Smackdown (Jan 8, 2017)

I swear people read what they wanna read and see what they wanna see.


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