# So yeah about Kassius getting into shape



## Stanford

I can't wait for the Chris Hero return tour.


----------



## Scottish-Suplex

Kassius Ohno is so fat he sits next to EVERYBODY in the locker-room.


----------



## RiverFenix

New ring gear - just put some spank around his mid-sections and he'll be fine. I might go with looser tights though. I think this is much better look and even if the flab is still there, it's behind a black top so disguised/camouflaged. 

If you look at his face, it's drawn in - especially in fan meeting shots you can find around on twitter.


----------



## Dolph'sZiggler

I don't see why WWE has such an issue with his weight. Not every wrestler needs to look like a glamour model.


----------



## december_blue

Dolph'sZiggler said:


> I don't see why WWE has such an issue with his weight. Not every wrestler needs to look like a glamour model.


He doesn't need to look like a model. They want him to tone up, he's clearly soft around the middle.


----------



## Even.Flow.NYC

If they spend this much time telling Hero to hit the weights how in the world has CM Punk not toned up even slightly? Looks like he slithered out of doing it too. Skinny-fat era is coming


----------



## Pappa Bacon

I read HHH pulled him off taping to just get in shape for a call up. I doubt that he will ne future endeavored as they seem to have plans for him. he will probably be the next heyman guy and put in a program with Punk after Lesnar and Axel. If they were going to dump him for his weight they would have done so a while ago and not bothered pulling him to hit the gym for a while. Didn't Chris talk about how he was on roids for a while? maybe it did some damage and that could be why. bottom line is Hero has so much talent and skill that it would ne in the WWE's best interest to do whatever they could do to get this guy on TV. put him in a decent program with anyone and time to work in ring he can do it all. he can have great matches with everyone as he has worked everything from Lucha, to English mat based, Puro, and US style. his ability and wrestling knowledge is valuable even as a vet tag team partner for a younger greener guy. their is to many Pro's to keeping him on the roster vs. cutting him cause he is pudgy.


----------



## JamesWSmithySmith

That tank top ain't hiding anything. He honestly looks chubbier to me, and a lot more bush-league, too. 


I really hope that he's still working on cutting and that this is just a temporary attire.


----------



## papercuts_hurt

If that's his new ring gear, my first impression is that I liked his gear better before...have to see it on TV I guess before I can really judge though.


----------



## NO!

I don't see how he looks much different than someone like Edge. This has to be the dumbest reason for not calling someone up, but whatever. Hopefully he makes it soon.


----------



## Japanese Puroresu

december_blue said:


> He doesn't need to look like a model. They want him to tone up, he's clearly soft around the middle.


Does Shinsuke Nakamura need to tone up? Does Samoa Joe need to tone up? Does the "Funkasaurus" need to tone up or Bray Wyatt?


----------



## Harbinger

I don't understand it. He's already ridiculously athletic even with all that flab. Is hitting the treadmill really that much of a problem for him? It's not like he has to lose 50 pounds. 15 and some weights and he'd be good.


----------



## Stanford

NO! said:


> I don't see how he looks much different than someone like Edge. This has to be the dumbest reason for not calling someone up, but whatever. Hopefully he makes it soon.


Edge let himself go a bit in the second half of his career, but he was jacked in the first half, and never got the point where he had to wear fat guy wrestling gear. Same goes for Punk. On top of that, Ohno's work in NXT hasn't been all that impressive anyway. 

If the story about his delayed call-up is true, I don't think it necessarily has to do with his look, but rather his work ethic and attitude.


----------



## Pappa Bacon

Stanford said:


> Edge let himself go a bit in the second half of his career, but he was jacked in the first half, and never got the point where he had to wear fat guy wrestling gear. Same goes for Punk. On top of that, Ohno's work in NXT hasn't been all that impressive anyway.
> 
> *If the story about his delayed call-up is true, I don't think it necessarily has to do with his look, but rather his work ethic and attitude.[/*QUOTE]
> 
> ding ding ding. I love Chris Hero but if the stories are true then this is the issue. If the guy isn't willing to put the time in to get in shape for a call up then why should the WWE bring him up, throw him in a program if he dosent seem to want to put in the effort to just get there. no one is going to hand him a spot on that roster and that mentality of "I'm Chris Hero" will only hurt him. Look at Punk and Bryan, neither look like greek gods but those guys did everything they could do to get in that spot. Chris won't even hit the gym and that leaves a bad impression on guys. not just management, but the guys in the back it will piss off no doubt.


----------



## december_blue

Japanese Puroresu said:


> Does Shinsuke Nakamura need to tone up? Does Samoa Joe need to tone up? Does the "Funkasaurus" need to tone up or Bray Wyatt?


I get the point you're making. They did send Bray Wyatt back down to developmental post-Nexus not only to come up with something for him to do, but to also work on his weight. The WWE clearly places a big emphasis on appearance. All reports have been that they were pretty much ready to call him up, so they must have a role in mind for him on TV. Maybe they felt that the current state of his physique didn't fit with how they were going to push him.


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## truk83

Terrible attire, and I believe Alberto Del Rio has larger love handles than Ohno, and he is currently WHC. Go back to the old attire, no one cares about your weight except crazy IWC fans.


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## Genking48

It's the fact that if they expect him to get in shape, he better get in shape, or he'll just be seen as a guy with an ego or a horrible attitude.


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## Wcthesecret

Japanese Puroresu said:


> Does Shinsuke Nakamura need to tone up? Does Samoa Joe need to tone up? Does the "Funkasaurus" need to tone up or Bray Wyatt?


:rose3 *i*** *u** you say bout swagsuke fuckyeahmura?


----------



## Interceptor88

If he was a fat guy with muscles, he would be a powerhouse or a big man like Tensai or Henry. If he was a toned up in shape guy, he would be a vicious brawler like Triple H or Sheamus. If he were a guy not very muscled and not chubby, he would be a tall but agile guy like Edge or-at a lesser extent-Christian. 

The problem is he has no muscles and he is chubby. A terrible combination when you are a wrestler. He looks as physically formidable as I. He looks terrible, just out of shape. It's not like Corey Graves or CM Punk, who are slim but look in a very good shape. It's not like Samoa Joe or Umaga, whose fatness enhances his "bulldozer" physically menacing characters. Ohno just looks like an average joe because of his physique. Or do you think that if you are tall you are automatically credible?


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## EmbassyForever

JK, he looked in pretty good shape last time I saw him, so idk what everyone are talking about.


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## Stanford

EmbassyForever said:


> JK, he looked in pretty good shape last time I saw him, so idk what everyone are talking about.












That's what everyone is talking about.


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## truk83

Stanford said:


> That's what everyone is talking about.


That's out of shape? Have you seen Alberto Del Rio's love handles, or CM Punk's? How about Chris Jericho? Perhaps even Kane? Then there is always HHH with his love handles, and stretched out tits. Have we forgotten about stars like Jake The Snake as well. I don't remember anyone bitching about his average figure. Have you seen Lesnar's chicken legs? It's why he wears his shorts. Christian looks like he is dying of starvation. Did you forget about The Miz to? Last time I checked Miz was just average looking.


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## sXeMope

Looks like something they threw together while they work on something better. I would hope that's the case anyways. He could get a generic outfit from Highspots that looks better than that. It would be incredibly hypocritical to release Ohno because of his look when they employ slobs like Brodus Clay and Bray Wyatt. He's always had an awkward skinny-chubby shape. He's said in the past he has issues with his weight. He's an amazing wrestler, and that's what should matter IMO


----------



## Scottish-Suplex

Kasius Ohno's so fat, the roster warms up by running laps round him.


----------



## Jof

truk83 said:


> That's out of shape? Have you seen Alberto Del Rio's love handles, or CM Punk's? How about Chris Jericho? Perhaps even Kane? Then there is always HHH with his love handles, and stretched out tits. Have we forgotten about stars like Jake The Snake as well. I don't remember anyone bitching about his average figure. Have you seen Lesnar's chicken legs? It's why he wears his shorts. Christian looks like he is dying of starvation. Did you forget about The Miz to? Last time I checked Miz was just average looking.


What an idiot. 

All of them are established wrestlers moron. They are not developmental rookies trying to get onto the main roster. When they were in their prime, they put in the hard work and stayed in shape. If this fatass motherfucker isn't motivated enough to get in shape when there is opportunity literally waiting at his doorstpes, how can WWE trust him to be a top star in future? Lazy fucks belong in TNA, not WWE.


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## Stanford

truk83 said:


> That's out of shape?


For a wrestler? Yes, absolutely. He's wearing fat guy ring gear.


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## Genking48

I think they just want him to get back into this shape again


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## Interceptor88

truk83 said:


> That's out of shape? Have you seen Alberto Del Rio's love handles, or CM Punk's? How about Chris Jericho? Perhaps even Kane? Then there is always HHH with his love handles, and stretched out tits. Have we forgotten about stars like Jake The Snake as well. I don't remember anyone bitching about his average figure. Have you seen Lesnar's chicken legs? It's why he wears his shorts. Christian looks like he is dying of starvation. Did you forget about The Miz to? Last time I checked Miz was just average looking.


 Sorry but, are you saying that this:


























































are the same than this?


























All the guys you said look in a good or decent shape, even if they are in their forties like Kane and Jericho. Ohno looks flabby in his gut and skinny in his built. As I said before, a terrible combination when you are supposed to be an agile but vicious and intimidating grappler.

By the way, I like Ohno's new attire. The top tank+pants or tights attire is a classic that is barely used nowadays by new wrestlers, so I'm happy to see it. Variety is the thing prowrestling needs the most!


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

The important thing is not to be in Mason Ryan condition but to have a good, unique look that people want to see. Brodus Clay is a mountain of a man, he has an excuse to be fat and his look is good. Ohno on the other hand looks like a jobber from the 80's. He looks like a younger, better looking version of Mickey Keegan and that's not acceptable for a guy who wants to be a star.

No decent promos, average matches, bad physique... If it wasn't for his encyclopedical knowledge of wrestling and his indie reputation I'm sure he'd be either a jobber or fired by now.


----------



## x78

I've been advocating Ohno wearing a shirt/singlet, but somehow that attire manages to make him look even more amateur than his previous gear. It's getting to the stage where I'm starting to think that he should just retire and become a trainer/full-time NXT talent to work with the younger guys. He hasn't got a hope in hell of reaching the main roster looking like that.


> he will probably be the next heyman guy and put in a program with Punk after Lesnar and Axel.


fpalm


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## papercuts_hurt

Tinkerbell said:


> I think they just want him to get back into this shape again


Damn its crazy how much better he looks there...if he looked like that now he'd be on the main roster. I think that was during his steroid period, but surely you don't need steroids to get more trim around the midsection?


----------



## Lilou

Anyone comparing Ohno's weight with Brodus Clay or Bray Wyatt is being ridiculous. Brodus is meant to be a "dinosaur of funk" or whatever, so he's meant to look like that, Bray Wyatt is meant to be a mental cult leader who wanders round in the woods being weird, so it isn't out of the realm of possibility that he wouldn't be chubby, Ohno is none of those things, and if WWE want him to look different, they obviously have a call up storyline/gimmick that requires that, so he can't get away with it because Brodus and Bray do.


----------



## Brodus Clay

it's a recent pic? u have more of that match op? because it could be a bad angle, I'm giving the benefit of the doubt because he looks bad, that said hes still in the point of get a decent shape relatively fast, two months hitting hard on cardio and later focus more on weight lifting would do wonders to him.


----------



## sharkboy22

I don't know how anyone can say Punk isn't in good shape. Sure he's not big and bulky put the dude has put on a lot of size since. You can really see it in his chest. 

Hero, I don't know what's his problem. Maybe it's bad genetics. He is pretty tall. It's a little harder for a guy like him to pack on size. But shit if guys like Kane and Taker could do it, what's his excuse? Speaking of Kane, here's a guy who really got back in shape within recent times. All it takes is a little effort. I can't speak for Hero, I don't know him personally and what he does on a daily basis, but it seems as if he just doesn't care about his look. 

I'm pretty much certain at this point the only reason he got signed was out of respect and maybe the 'E' sees some potential in him. Maybe the 'E' is willing to work with him but is he willing to work with them. 



Tinkerbell said:


>


Wasn't he experimenting with roids in these days? 

This isn't a bad look for him tbh. Not big, not jacked but he looks like he's in shape. 

The issue here isn't guys like Brodus Clay getting away with it, it's all about the persona being portrayed. Hero is one of them rassler guys, well look the part goddammit.


----------



## Knocks

Good lord that is some hideous ring attire.


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## RiverFenix

Why not just give Ohno the MVP ring attire - it would be perfect for him.


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## sharkboy22

Honestly though, if that's the best the guy could do on roids.....well I don't know what to say.


----------



## A$AP

HE'S FAT :steiner2


----------



## Loudness

How long has Ohno been cutting? Also I had no clue his physique was this bad, holy shit (don't watch NXT and I only know him for his ROH/indy stuff). Compared to those pics above, he looked like Dolph Ziggler in ROH lol.

Ohno needs to pick up 5x5 or Starting Strength, dude looks like a novice lifter in the pics posted ITT. CM Punk is probably 50-65% stronger than him and he's supposed to be one of the skinniest/weakest guys on the roster but at least he's big and lean enough for TV. 25% bodyfat at Ohnos weight however is terrible. Bully Ray has a similar bf%...but it works on him cause he filled up his frame with enough lean body mass to still look big instead of just fat. At 6'5" 220 lbs with the same conditioning you're basically DYEL status though.

I used to defend Ohno in other threads, but I was totally unaware of his actual current state. Looks like he not only stopped taking roids, but stopped dieting and weightlifting alltogether, he lost 10-15 lbs of muscle AND gained around 25 lbs of fat. Unacceptable for a pro wrestler.


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## The CRA1GER

He's worn stuff very similar on the indies. It wasn't good then and definitely not now in WWE.


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## swagger_ROCKS

Is it because he's a skinny fat? Can't be because of simple gut. Swagger since his return/MANIA is looking a bit of a belly as well. I guess Swagger just has more bulk than him, but geez he's 6 4 225 and can move really well. Is there a problem backstage?


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## x78

swagger_ROCKS said:


> Is it because he's a skinny fat? Can't be because of simple gut. Swagger since his return/MANIA is looking a bit of a belly as well. I guess Swagger just has more bulk than him, but geez he's 6 4 225 and can move really well. Is there a problem backstage?












You think that's comparable to Jack Swagger?


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## sabaw123

Brodus Clay said:


> it's a recent pic? u have more of that match op? because it could be a bad angle, I'm giving the benefit of the doubt because he looks bad, that said hes still in the point of get a decent shape relatively fast, two months hitting hard on cardio and later focus more on weight lifting would do wonders to him.



Saw it on Reddit


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## Arcade

x78 said:


> You think that's comparable to Jack Swagger?


Swagger's body type is pretty much the same, except that his chest is a bit more developed than Ohno's. His singlet just hides it.

It looks like Ohno was ready to be called up, until management found out he wasn't working out much. He might not be able to gain the body type back when he was on roids, but he can definitely improve his look.


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## swagger_ROCKS

x78 said:


> You think that's comparable to Jack Swagger?












I'm telling you man, Swagger used to have a GREAT shape. He's not what he used to be, but still alright. 

I'm thinking that maybe Hero needs to...bulk up and shape up maybe? Just a little.


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## sharkboy22

Are we seriously comparing Ohno to Swagger? Sure Swagger has a little belly going on but the guy has muscled packed on. Ohno just looks like a slob. No muscle mass whatsoever.

I can't believe that there's people defending this. No one is asking the guy to reach Cena levels of muscle. Shit, it's 2013. No one needs to be 250 pounds to be a draw in pro wrestling anymore. But Ohno's body is unacceptable. 

I'll say it and I'll continue to say it, they only reason this guy got signed is out of respect. He's been busting his ass on the indies for years, it's the least the WWE could have done. Maybe when he's released he'll understand the importance of dieting and exercising and most importantly, the WWE just doesn't need him. They really don't. 

In the mean time I'm awaiting the "Ohno, do you even lift bro?" memes.


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## swagger_ROCKS

sharkboy22 said:


> Are we seriously comparing Ohno to Swagger? Sure Swagger has a little belly going on but the guy has muscled packed on. Ohno just looks like a slob. No muscle mass whatsoever.
> 
> I can't believe that there's people defending this. No one is asking the guy to reach Cena levels of muscle. Shit, it's 2013. No one needs to be 250 pounds to be a draw in pro wrestling anymore. But Ohno's body is unacceptable.
> 
> I'll say it and I'll continue to say it, they only reason this guy got signed is out of respect. He's been busting his ass on the indies for years, it's the least the WWE could have done. Maybe when he's released he'll understand the importance of dieting and exercising and most importantly, the WWE just doesn't need him. They really don't.
> 
> In the mean time I'm awaiting the "Ohno, do you even lift bro?" memes.


I feel you, and understand, that's why I said



> Swagger just has more bulk than him


I just keep reading this stuff a lot, and still hope he can make the main roster one day. lol


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## sharkboy22

This pic looks like it's around 2002. 10 years later, the guy still looks the same. I knew there was a reason why I asked "Why?" when I first heard WWE signed him. Seriously, what the hell did they see in him? And don't give me the whole "cause he's a great wrestler" bullshit. It took about 5 years to finally stop all the random as fuck, phony looking, sissy looking, will-you-please-apply-some-goddamnn-pressure chain wrestling for 20 minutes (a la Mike skinny generic Quackenbush). And when he stopped that, then he started throwing elbows for another 5 years. 

Looking back on their feud, it's no surprise Punk went on to bigger and better things. You can tell Punk was willing. Also, look at Daniel Bryan. I just watched an indy match of his where he was weight 175 pounds. What is he today, 210? It seems like Ohno just has an all round shitty attitude and thinks that he can get by with his "talent"


----------



## RiverFenix

Anybody using this picture is being disingenuous. This is a pic from when he first signed with the wwe, and he was supposed to sign 6 months earlier but has high T levels in his pre-hiring health screening that red flagged him (I guess for possible steroids?), so he quit taking anything and working out completely to prove his T levels were naturally higher. He then got past the pre-screening and was signed. This pic is from a photo shoot right after he signed.


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## SAMCRO

I hope to god thats not his new attire, it just screams "i gotta wear this because i have love handles". Would he just fucking lose 15 pounds, i mean fuck its not like he's the size of Brodus Clay. Shedding 15 pounds should be easy. If he can't even lose that much fucking weight then management is gonna fire him or just not use him.


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## swagger_ROCKS

Anybody think he looks a little like Nash in that pic. lol


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## Harbinger

SAMCRO said:


> I hope to god thats not his new attire, it just screams "i gotta wear this because i have love handles". Would he just fucking lose 15 pounds, i mean fuck its not like he's the size of Brodus Clay. Shedding 15 pounds should be easy. If he can't even lose that much fucking weight then management is gonna fire him or just not use him.


That's what I'm saying. It should be a short fix to get there. I don't know about him staying there, but it really should be a relatively easy road to get the weight down initially. The muscles arent even a big deal. They can work with someone on the skinny side if they're tall, and they can work with someone on the fat side of there's muscle there too. Unfortunately he's just on the skinny side with a beer gut and love handles. It looks sloppy. I'm a huge fan of his ring work but if he can't put an hour a day on the treadmill and stop eating shit for the two months it would take, then I doubt he's motivated enough for the wwe. And it's disappointing.


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## World's Best

3VK said:


> That's what I'm saying. It should be a short fix to get there. I don't know about him staying there, but it really should be a relatively easy road to get the weight down initially. The muscles arent even a big deal. They can work with someone on the skinny side if they're tall, and they can work with someone on the fat side of there's muscle there too. Unfortunately he's just on the skinny side with a beer gut and love handles. It looks sloppy. I'm a huge fan of his ring work but if he can't put an hour a day on the treadmill and stop eating shit for the two months it would take, then I doubt he's motivated enough for the wwe. And it's disappointing.


I thought if you gained weight you got less skinny? At least, that's how it's always worked for me. I don't quite understand how he's supposedly skinny but yet they call him fat. Is it because of a beer gut?


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## SAMCRO

World's Best said:


> I thought if you gained weight you got less skinny? At least, that's how it's always worked for me. I don't quite understand how he's supposedly skinny but yet they call him fat. Is it because of a beer gut?


I think Triple H said the phrase best, its called skinny fat. Its where your body is overall skinny but you're just slightly chubby with love handles. It just makes you look sloppy and outta shape. In WWE if you're fat its gotta be massive fat or at least be enough fat to look intimidating like Umaga was. If you just got love handles and a beer belly it looks really bad.


----------



## Rick Sanchez

Even.Flow.NYC said:


> If they spend this much time telling Hero to hit the weights how in the world has CM Punk not toned up even slightly? Looks like he slithered out of doing it too. Skinny-fat era is coming


It helps to be a great wrestler and one of the greatest talkers in wrestling history.


----------



## KO Lariat

Ugh I never liked this look for ohno. I prefer the trunks


----------



## Japanese Puroresu

Love handles are the new biceps. Fuck you guys.


----------



## Emotion Blur

I like Ohno, but you really have to wonder if he gives two fucks about doing anything in WWE. He's made it to the place that about .001% of all wrestlers make it to, is asked to do the one thing that most athletes do anyways (tone up) and just doesn't? Anyone else in his position would have been hitting the weights long before anyone had to ask them to. I understand he's a naturally skinny guy and how that's sort of his thing, but no one is asking him to look like fucking Ryback by October. Unless he has some sort of ethical objection to toning up, I just don't get how you outright try to blow your opportunity like that. And even aside of all that, if you're in the wrestling industry and your higher-ups tell you to do something, it's in your best interest to just fucking do it.


----------



## Dark Church

If it's true that Triple H told him to get in better shape that is hilarious. Triple H himself went through a period of time where he had a gut for quite a while.


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## Emotion Blur

Dark Church said:


> If it's true that Triple H told him to get in better shape that is hilarious. Triple H himself went through a period of time where he had a gut for quite a while.


So I take it if you're a former drug addict you can't tell others not to do drugs? Should HHH also not be able to criticize someones match because he's had a few bad ones? It's his job to improve the product, tell others what to do, and ultimately do what's best for the company. 

And besides, Triple H's "gut" is nothing even remotely close to Ohno's gut. They're two completely different physiques.


----------



## Dark Church

Emotion Blur said:


> So I take it if you're a former drug addict you can't tell others not to do drugs? Should HHH also not be able to criticize someones match because he's had a few bad ones? It's his job to improve the product, tell others what to do, and ultimately do what's best for the company.
> 
> And besides, Triple H's "gut" is nothing even remotely close to Ohno's gut. They're two completely different physiques.


To suggest he gets in shape is one thing but pulling him off tv for it is another. There is also a huge difgerence between drug use and an out of shape wrestler. If it's not effecting his matches then it shouldn't matter. I've never known Chris Hero to ever be in great shape anyway.


----------



## MANTI TEO

Even.Flow.NYC said:


> If they spend this much time telling Hero to hit the weights how in the world has CM Punk not toned up even slightly? Looks like he slithered out of doing it too. Skinny-fat era is coming


CM Punk doesn't eat meat needs more protein in his diet and he probably doesn't have a body that can put on muscle


----------



## Lordhhhx

i dont see why he does not want to get in better Shape in fact what is bad about? they are just telling him to get in better shape and he will be in the main Roster and with all the things handed to him in the training facility leaves him no excuse but just Pure laziness on his part.

Its obvius that Trips knows that he can be a big Star and with a better look it would only do wonders for him but if he does not want to do what his boss is telling him to do wich is something that will only help him in the future and yet is not obeying. then he has nothing to do in WWE.


----------



## Oxidamus

It's so easy to stay in shape as a wrestler :lol. You don't need to take steroids to not have fat rolls. Granted Kassius/Chris has NEVER looked proper fit in his entire career, you'd expect when you've been accepted into the big leagues you'd actually try to look better.

Even Punk stated he put on like 20lbs when he heard he was accepted into the WWE.


----------



## Lordhhhx

you are right for example i go to the gym at the morning and workout for a bout an hour and half and Practice taekwondo later in the afternoon thats like 3 hours and half of exercise and i allways stay in good Shape a wretler like hero who has been wrestling for more than 10 years and still be in such a bad shape means that he barely workouts, eats well or does not take suplements to help him gain more muscle wich is what i bet that triple h seems that he lacks hell i think if he tonned up a bit he would have a fantastic look.


----------



## NO!

Wasn't William Regal fat for pretty much his entire career? He had 15 title reigns in the WWE alone. I guess there's no problem with telling a guy to work on his physique a little, but he really doesn't look THAT bad in that photo to the point where pulling him off of television is necessary. Oh well...


----------



## TempestH

Japanese Puroresu said:


> Does Shinsuke Nakamura need to tone up? Does Samoa Joe need to tone up? Does the "Funkasaurus" need to tone up or Bray Wyatt?


For those guys, being a big fatass is part of their appeal. Hero isn't THAT fat, but having that bit of pudge around his waist looks a little sloppy.



truk83 said:


> That's out of shape? Have you seen Alberto Del Rio's love handles, or CM Punk's? How about Chris Jericho? Perhaps even Kane? Then there is always HHH with his love handles, and stretched out tits. Have we forgotten about stars like Jake The Snake as well. I don't remember anyone bitching about his average figure. Have you seen Lesnar's chicken legs? It's why he wears his shorts. Christian looks like he is dying of starvation. Did you forget about The Miz to? Last time I checked Miz was just average looking.


Lesnar wears shorts because WWE's trying to capitalize on his MMA fame, otherwise he would be wearing trunks like he used to.

Miz is a little chubby, but you can tell that he's got some bulk. Miz looks like a guy who DOES hits the weights every day, but just can't stop eating cheeseburgers and ice cream.


----------



## Wcthesecret

TempestH said:


> For those guys, being a big fatass is part of their appeal. Hero isn't THAT fat, but having that bit of pudge around his waist looks a little sloppy.
> 
> 
> 
> Lesnar wears shorts because WWE's trying to capitalize on his MMA fame, otherwise he would be wearing trunks like he used to.
> 
> Miz is a little chubby, but you can tell that he's got some bulk. Miz looks like a guy who DOES hits the weights every day, but just can't stop eating cheeseburgers and ice cream.


:suzuki *i*** how the *u** dare you call swagsuke fuckyeahmura fat.


----------



## Obfuscation

It's his indie attire only the top is a tank top instead of a coverall type shirt. What's the negative about that? I always found him unusual in the traditional tights look as it is. More accustomed to this look. Again, still think it's WWE bullshit at his finest and shouldn't even be a deal worth talking about, let alone a "big" one.


----------



## TempestH

Wcthesecret said:


> :suzuki *i*** how the *u** dare you call swagsuke fuckyeahmura fat.


Ok not him, but all the others that the other guy lumped him in with for some reason.


----------



## BehindYou

NO! said:


> Wasn't William Regal fat for pretty much his entire career? He had 15 title reigns in the WWE alone. I guess there's no problem with telling a guy to work on his physique a little, but he really doesn't look THAT bad in that photo to the point where pulling him off of television is necessary. Oh well...


1)Regal had mass tough, not just a big cut with little chest/arms/back.

2)Regal was never a big debut or intended to be a key player...maybe Ohno is.


The other example someone used, the Miz......the Miz isnt in at all bad shape. His BF% is higher than other wrestlers but he still loooks big and athletic.


----------



## TD Stinger

I seriously don't get the people who are blaming WWE here. They are paying him. They want to put him on worldwide tv to represent their company. They want to make an investment in him. And he can't shed ten pounds and tone up a bit, it's his fault and his alone. It's a job. Triple H (and others) is his boss. He is the employee. Asking him drop weight and tone up is completely within their right.


----------



## Raw2003

Dolph'sZiggler said:


> I don't see why WWE has such an issue with his weight. Not every wrestler needs to look like a glamour model.


I know it isn't like CM Punk is muscle bound either.


----------



## sharkboy22

I'm tired of these Chris Hero defenders now. Seriously, some of you need glasses. CM Punk isn't a big guy but he has MUSCLE. M-U-S FUCKING C-L-E. 

Hero just looks like your average everyday slob.


----------



## CaptainObvious

Ohno is just sabotaging himself. The outfit doesn't help, but he appears to be not camera ready at all. At this point, I wouldn't be surprised at all if WWE releases him. In my opinion, there's others in NXT that are ready for a call up who are camera ready. Ohno is getting passed up.


----------



## sharkboy22

In terms of wrestling ability, it's not like they're missing out on much in Ohno tbh. it's 2013, who can't wrestle? For crying out loud, you take a look at the deathmatch wrestling scene (at one point considered to be for the unskilled) and when you see the names that have been involved in some of them, they are some of the best wrestler out there today. Heck, even Hero has done some.

The ability to wrestle isn't rare anymore. Everyone and their dog can chain wrestle and everyone and their dogs throws elbows as well. Why waste time on someone like Hero when there's Sami Callihan who hits even harder and is in shape?

Size isn't an issue in wrestling anymore. Otherwise, Generico wouldn't have been signed. But despite his small frame, he's in shape. That's the point the Chris Hero defenders are missing. The issue isn't the size of his muscles, it's the lack of.


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

Look, this is very simple. It's the WWE and Ohno doesn't have a marketable look. As far as I'm concerned he doesn't have a marketable anything right now but maybe that's only my personal opinion. He clearly isn't allowed to use his 100 moves, no top rope springboard flips, his promos are mediocre to average and his gimmick is not something WWE can push, as evidenced by Barrett's decline to jobber status.

Skinny fat or not, CM Punk has one of the best looks in wrestling right now and it's one of the reasons why even kids and teenage girls love him.

Ohno should go get some fucking decent looking ring gear, try to build his upper body and then he may have a chance at the main roster's midcard. If he doesn't he'll end up jobbing until he's released.


----------



## Mister Hands

General thoughts: can he go 30 minutes in the ring without slowing down? Then he's in shape.


----------



## birthday_massacre

sabaw123 said:


> So how long before he gets future endeavored???



who is in better shape Ohno or Ryback?

Only one of then could wrestle a 30-60 minute match without dying and that person is not Ryback.


----------



## Macker

Ohno should be released. This is his job, his dream he's getting paid to do this. I'm sure if he wanted he could ask the WWE for 1 on 1 training as well as a dietitian to get his body toned up. Hes just lazy, looks are 50% of your damn gimmick.


----------



## sharkboy22

birthday_massacre said:


> who is in better shape Ohno or Ryback?
> 
> Only one of then could wrestle a 30-60 minute match without dying and that person is not Ryback.


Yes because WWE does 60 minute matches on a weekly basis. 

This is 1970 anymore. 60 minite are special attractions rather than the norm. Also, like I previously mentioned, there's a billion other guys who could work 60 minute plus matches and have bulk. Now, tell me, what's so special about Hero now?


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

birthday_massacre said:


> who is in better shape Ohno or Ryback?
> 
> Only one of then could wrestle a 30-60 minute match without dying and that person is not Ryback.


Yeah, let's hire some marathoners and persistence hunters. 180 minute matches everyweek!

In WWE, being in shape also means looking good. WWE is able to make 4 million people watch and care about Daniel Bryan wrestling for 20 minutes because of superman looking guys like Cena and Ryback. 

There's a reason why nobody watches discus or javelin throwing, even when they're some of the world's greatest athletes.


----------



## birthday_massacre

sharkboy22 said:


> Yes because WWE does 60 minute matches on a weekly basis.
> 
> This is 1970 anymore. 60 minite are special attractions rather than the norm. Also, like I previously mentioned, there's a billion other guys who could work 60 minute plus matches and have bulk. Now, tell me, what's so special about Hero now?


You are missing the point.

The point is someone that can go 30-60 mins is in shape. Just because you dont look jacked up doesnt mean you are not in shape. People need to stop claiming he isnt in shape when he is. 

Being in shape doesnt have to do with how big you are. 


Hero is better than most of the current roster, I would him over Albert Del Rio for example any day and ADR is the WHC.

The problem with Hero is he seems bored in NXT and also does not want to see him learn the watered down WWE way of working.


----------



## birthday_massacre

Tanaka vs Awesome said:


> Yeah, let's hire some marathoners and persistence hunters. 180 minute matches everyweek!
> 
> In WWE, being in shape also means looking good. WWE is able to make 4 million people watch and care about Daniel Bryan wrestling for 20 minutes because of superman looking guys like Cena and Ryback.
> 
> There's a reason why nobody watches discus or javelin throwing, even when they're some of the world's greatest athletes.



Some of the biggest stars ever in the WWE didnt look in shape. Mic Foley, Andre the Giant, Vader, the big show and Dusty Rhodes just to name a few.

And its funny you mentioned Cean and Ryback. Those are two of the most hated wrestlers in the WWE right now (oh sure kids love Cena but not adults). 

Daniel Bryan is one of the most over wrestlers in the WWE and he does not have that superman look. Punk doesnt have the superman look either and he was champion for over 400 days.

Even look at a guy like Dean Ambrose he isnt jacked but the guy can wrestle and is in shape. He is going to be a huge star by next year.

I would take a roster full of guys like Dean Ambrose, Daniel Bryan and CM Punks over A roster full of guys like Cena and Ryback.



The superman look is 80s and is passe. The best wrestlers are the ones who are like Daniel Bryan, Punk, and Ziggler who can wrestler and sell great but dont look all roided up like Cena or Ryback.


Lets just compare the roster of the top 5 roided up looks that you love or the ones who people claim are not in great shape but are still great.

Roided Roster

Cena
Ryback
Reigns 
Jackson
Big E

Normal looking guys roster

Punk
Daniel Bryan
Ziggler And if you want to claim Ziggler looks too good for this group, replace him with Sandow).
Ambrose
Rollins


You can take all the Ryback Big E, Jackson wrestlers all you want but those guys suck.

Give me a roster full of the latter any day.


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

birthday_massacre said:


> Some of the biggest stars ever in the WWE didnt look in shape. Mic Foley, Andre the Giant, Vader, the big show and Dusty Rhodes just to name a few.
> 
> And its funny you mentioned Cean and Ryback. Those are two of the most hated wrestlers in the WWE right now (oh sure kids love Cena but not adults).
> 
> Daniel Bryan is one of the most over wrestlers in the WWE and he does not have that superman look. Punk doesnt have the superman look either and he was champion for over 400 days.
> 
> Even look at a guy like Dean Ambrose he isnt jacked but the guy can wrestle and is in shape. He is going to be a huge star by next year.
> 
> I would take a roster full of guys like Dean Ambrose, Daniel Bryan and CM Punks over A roster full of guys like Cena and Ryback.
> 
> The superman look is 80s and is passe. The best wrestlers are the ones who are like Daniel Bryan, Punk, and Ziggler who can wrestler and sell great but dont look all roided up like Cena or Ryback.


All those guys you mentioned look fantastic. Vader, Foley, Andre and the Big Show all have an extraordinary look. Ohno doesn't. Dusty was also one of the best talkers of all time, Ohno isn't.

Show me a big WWE star who doesn't have a great look. I'm not saying you have to look like Ryback, I'm saying you need to have a unique look/gimmick. Ohno currently has nothing.

If you have a roster full of great athletes with no personality you either go bankrupt or you turn into a MMA promotion.

By the way, Big E is awesome, doesn't take roids and he's also a better athlete than any of those you've mentioned.

I don't love jacked up, roided guys. I love entertaining guys.


----------



## birthday_massacre

Tanaka vs Awesome said:


> All those guys you mentioned look fantastic. Vader, Foley, Andre and the Big Show all have an extraordinary look. Ohno doesn't. Dusty was also one of the best talkers of all time, Ohno isn't.
> 
> Show me a big WWE star who doesn't have a great look. I'm not saying you have to look like Ryback, I'm saying you need to have a unique look/gimmick. Ohno currently has nothing.
> 
> If you have a roster full of great athletes with no personality you either go bankrupt or you turn into a MMA promotion.


Their bodies didnt look fantastic but their in ring work did. There is a difference people are complaining that Ohno is out of shape and that is not it. He is a great worker, he made not be great on the mic, but not everyone is. Brock Lesnar is terrible on the mic but he is great in the ring. 

And Daniel Bryan is the perfect example, he has a normal look, yet he is the most over guy in the WWE because he is great in the ring and is vastly improved on the mic.

Its not Heros fault he has a generic look in NXT its the WWE, the WWE loves to do that. Just look at how they ruined El Generico.

You are agreeing with what I am saying It does not matter if you dont have the roided up look, as long as you are good in the ring, and have personality you will be fine.

More wrestlers that have the roided up Ryback look flop than ones that look like the guys i mentioned or Ohno.


----------



## JaiGrant

I would be shocked if they released him. But let's think about this for a second. Your a wrestler who's been told to tone up. It doesn't take a couple weeks to tone up, it takes time. On top of this, the Internet knows. He's probably self conscious. While I agree, he needs to tone up if the office says so, I don't think he's in hot water.


----------



## birthday_massacre

JaiGrant said:


> I would be shocked if they released him. But let's think about this for a second. Your a wrestler who's been told to tone up. It doesn't take a couple weeks to tone up, it takes time. On top of this, the Internet knows. He's probably self conscious. While I agree, he needs to tone up if the office says so, I don't think he's in hot water.


I can see him getting released then going to TNA and becoming a star.


----------



## Wcthesecret

birthday_massacre said:


> I can see him getting released then going to TNA and becoming a star.


...if he went to tna he'd be sabotaging his career way more than just not exercising.


----------



## Outlaw91

WWE better doesn't screw him.This guy is an awesome wrestler and he deserves to be on the top.Now that Barrett is a jobber they can debut him and keep his KO finisher.


----------



## birthday_massacre

Outlaw91 said:


> WWE better doesn't screw him.This guy is an awesome wrestler and he deserves to be on the top.Now that Barrett is a jobber they can debut him and keep his KO finisher.


I agree, maybe moving him up to the main roster would motive him more. Its pretty sickening that Bo Dallas got a taste of the main roster and Ohno has not.


----------



## BehindYou

Chris hero is the least deserving of all the internet darlings.

He's adapted so poorly to the WWE style and i can't help but think thats laziness, just like his body is.


----------



## MrKennedy666

He just seems so lazy since coming to WWE


----------



## sharkboy22

I can't understand the guy at all. Isn't this his dream? Why blow it all away like that? And I know it doesn't take a few weeks to get in shape but he's been in the company for a year now. Fuck, he's been wrestling for over 10 years now. What's the excuse?

If they release him, it really won't make a difference to me. Never got the Chris Hero hype in the first place.


----------



## Scottish-Suplex

Kassius Ohno is so fat, Mark Henry pulled him on an episode of Smackdown, but they didn't air the segment as it would seem unrealisticly strong.


----------



## Obfuscation

sharkboy22 said:


> I'm tired of these Chris Hero defenders now. Seriously, some of you need glasses. CM Punk isn't a big guy but he has MUSCLE. M-U-S FUCKING C-L-E.
> 
> Hero just looks like your average everyday slob.


Pot calling the kettle black on the flip side. You seem to want to chime in on every direct aspect to bring Chris Hero down b/c you personally aren't a fan. His look shouldn't mean anything if he's still in shape. It should only matter of how he's adapted to the WWE style. And truthfully, he hasn't very well pardon the match with Regal. Some tags worked, but he was hardly the only reason for that. The only concern he should have & the company too is _"can this guy work the way we need him to work?"_


----------



## Western Illinois

Immediately thought of this when I saw the thread:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4NHxEFnqo8&t=16m50s


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

HayleySabin said:


> Pot calling the kettle black on the flip side. You seem to want to chime in on every direct aspect to bring Chris Hero down b/c you personally aren't a fan. His look shouldn't mean anything if he's still in shape. It should only matter of how he's adapted to the WWE style. And truthfully, he hasn't very well pardon the match with Regal. Some tags worked, but he was hardly the only reason for that. The only concern he should have & the company too is _"can this guy work the way we need him to work?"_


Why shouldn't his look mean anything? In the indies it may not but WWE has different goals and different audiences and a good look is absolutely necessary. If you're not marketable you won't get anywhere and Ohno currently doesn't have a single marketable quality. He doesn't act, wrestle or talk like a star and he doesn't even look like a star so why should we believe he is one?


----------



## Mister Hands

Tanaka vs Awesome said:


> Why shouldn't his look mean anything? In the indies it may not but WWE has different goals and different audiences and a good look is absolutely necessary. If you're not marketable you won't get anywhere and Ohno currently doesn't have a single marketable quality. He doesn't act, wrestle or talk like a star and he doesn't even look like a star so why should we believe he is one?


"Fairly small, outrageously bearded man vs overgrown child who sometimes thinks he's a rapper, other times a marine, other times a southern preacher."

MARKETABLE


----------



## Obfuscation

b/c caring about "looks" in wrestling is daft.


----------



## Wittie

And this is why people take steroids...

Vince still gay for meat heads as ever, I see.


----------



## Wittie

Sabin has earned it from his years of crafting, it's the next natural step for him.


----------



## Lordhhhx

they dont want him to get Ryback or cena level jacked they just want him to gain a little more muscle mass and get tonned up a bit rollins or even miz level shape would only do wonders for him


----------



## Pappa Bacon

I'm not sure how hard it is to tone up and build muscle after someone takes steroids, but if I remember correctly didn't Hero admit to taking them? If so that could be a factor. I really hope he gets his shit together because as talented as he is if the reports of work ethic are true he just doesn't deserve to be on the main roster


----------



## TD Stinger

Outlaw91 said:


> WWE better doesn't screw him.This guy is an awesome wrestler and he deserves to be on the top.Now that Barrett is a jobber they can debut him and keep his KO finisher.


Where has that great wrestler been in NXT. I've seen flashes of greatness, but most of the time just mediocrity. 



Mister Hands said:


> "Fairly small, outrageously bearded man vs overgrown child who sometimes thinks he's a rapper, other times a marine, other times a southern preacher."
> 
> MARKETABLE


Overgrown Child: Great physique

Outrageously Bearded Man: Good physique for his size and most importantly (unlike Ohno) he doesn't have fat hanging over his trunks.



HayleySabin said:


> Pot calling the kettle black on the flip side. You seem to want to chime in on every direct aspect to bring Chris Hero down b/c you personally aren't a fan. *His look shouldn't mean anything if he's still in shape. It should only matter of how he's adapted to the WWE style.* And truthfully, he hasn't very well pardon the match with Regal. Some tags worked, but he was hardly the only reason for that. *The only concern he should have & the company too is "can this guy work the way we need him to work?"*


fpalm

Yes, b/c that's all that matters in WWE. Again (and this gets lost on people) HE FUCKING WORKS FOR THEM. WWE is his boss and he is an employee. WWE wants to put him on worldwide TV and to make an investment in him and represent their company. I don't give a fuck how good he is in the ring (and for the most part, he's been mediocre in NXT), that shouldn't be the only thing that matters. They tell you to drop a few lbs. of fat and tone up, you fucking do it. If you really want to do it, you work your ass off. And that last statement is full of ignorance. There are so many things that are just important. Like actually showing some dedication and loyalty to the company that wants to put you on live tv and give you big money in the process. Or maybe actually having a somewhat presentable look for TV. I'm sorry, but he is the pure definition of skinny-fat.


----------



## Mister Hands

TD Stinger said:


> Overgrown Child: Great physique
> 
> Outrageously Bearded Man: Good physique for his size and most importantly (unlike Ohno) he doesn't have fat hanging over his trunks.


Because that's definitely the determining factor in marketability, and not just an assumption WWE have made people buy into.


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

HayleySabin said:


> b/c caring about "looks" in wrestling is daft.


fpalm

This is so ignorant I don't even know where to start. Go read this, written by someone much smarter than I could ever hope to be:

http://homes.chass.utoronto.ca/~ikalmar/illustex/Barthes-wrestling.htm

Get back to me when you're done.


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

Mister Hands said:


> Because that's definitely the determining factor in marketability, and not just an assumption WWE have made people buy into.


That's one of the main ones, if not THE main one.

When you look at a wrestler you should be able to know almost everything you need to know about him. His look is the physical representation of his character and what he stands for.


----------



## TD Stinger

Mister Hands said:


> Because that's definitely the determining factor in marketability, and not just an assumption WWE have made people buy into.


It's not everything, but it can be a big thing. And last time, having a skinny fat physique never translates into anyting. Don't mention Punk. He's not the biggest but still has more definition than Ohno and is and takes good care of his body. There is no way where you can turn his physique into a positive. It's not like he's 300 lbs. and can throw his weight around like Brodus. Size and physique aren't the the end all be all in terms of marketability, but if you have zero marketability in that category like Ohno does, it makes things so much harder than yourself. Could Ohno prove himself w/o a great physique, maybe. But this goes back to the original problem at hand, if the company you work for wants to put you on worldwide TV and they want you to shed some fat and tone up, you fucking do it.


----------



## x78

This thread has become embarrassing with people trying to defend Ohno and blame WWE. The fact is that this guy looks like a slob and on NXT has wrestled like a slob. I couldn't give less of a fuck if he's worked 60 minute matches in the past, his matches on NXT have been totally lackluster. And for a guy whose gimmick has been based around his physical/technical prowess, his appearance is no way acceptable. Suggesting that look isn't important is ridiculous, do you think The Rock would have been a huge star if he looked like Shannon Moore? Do you think Roman Reigns would even be on the main roster if he looked like Bo Dallas? People going on about Ohno having better cardio than Ryback are spectacularly missing the point.

TBH his appearance isn't even ny biggest problem with Ohno, it's been his total lack of anything interesting or exciting about his character since debuting on NXT. But his physique is also very poor, and if he's been told to improve it and not done so then he should be released. I'm guessing the majority of people defending Ohno on here are workrate marks, which is something I'll never understand.


----------



## sharkboy22

x78 said:


> This thread has become embarrassing with people trying to defend Ohno and blame WWE. The fact is that this guy looks like a slob and on NXT has wrestled like a slob. I couldn't give less of a fuck if he's worked 60 minute matches in the past, his matches on NXT have been totally lackluster. And for a guy whose gimmick has been based around his physical/technical prowess, his appearance is no way acceptable. Suggesting that look isn't important is ridiculous, do you think The Rock would have been a huge star if he looked like Shannon Moore? Do you think Roman Reigns would even be on the main roster if he looked like Bo Dallas? People going on about Ohno having better cardio than Ryback are spectacularly missing the point.
> 
> TBH his appearance isn't even ny biggest problem with Ohno, it's been his total lack of anything interesting or exciting about his character since debuting on NXT. But his physique is also very poor, and if he's been told to improve it and not done so then he should be released. I'm guessing the majority of people defending Ohno on here are workrate marks, which is something I'll never understand.


This and to add. Here's another important fact people are missing. Wrestling is a JOB. And if the higher ups are telling you to tone up in order to get a promotion (or more importantly to remain employed) you better fucking do it. 

Ohno refusing to get in shape is the equivalent of you going to work tomorrow and your boss tells you that he wants the papers on his desk by 10. He doesn't give a fuck if in your previous place of employment you delivered papers by 12. Here, he wants it by 10. 

Now, I'll give Hero the benefit of the doubt. It doesn't take 3 months to get toned up, it takes a while. But, given the fact that he's been with the company for a year now and has been wrestling for 10+ years, I'm really not sure if I should give him the benefit of the doubt. Hey, what if though, he really is working hard at it. Only time will tell.


----------



## SUPAH STRONG STYLE

To start off, I'm a huge Hero fanboy. I was really hoping to see Kassius make it in the main roster, still can't wait if it can happen. However, if everything is true, he's being a complete ass. 

Chris Hero, went through the indie circuit, gained a massive name for himself, worked on his move set, his mic skills, day in day out, constantly changing his physique at times, and he makes it to the WWE... only to drop the ball. That makes no sense. And it's rather stupid. It's sad, and stupid. I get toning up, isn't always the easiest of processess, but there's proof Hero can do it. So why refuse to do it now? 

As for people trying to make up excuses for him, stop. It's not just the physique, as others have mentioned. It's the fact he's refusing. It doesn't leave a good note to your higher ups, if you refuse while you're in the developmental phase. Think of it like this. What would Triple H think? So, if I put this guy in the main roster, ignoring his physique, if we give him a title run, will he drop it to someone without refusing? Will he go with the flow, and put someone over, even if he doesn't like it?

There's many different ways of looking at this, and no matter which way you slice it, it comes down to being Kassius's fault. I hate to say that too, because I really do like Chris Hero.


----------



## Mister Hands

x78 said:


> This thread has become embarrassing with people trying to defend Ohno and blame WWE. The fact is that this guy looks like a slob and on NXT has wrestled like a slob. I couldn't give less of a fuck if he's worked 60 minute matches in the past, his matches on NXT have been totally lackluster. And for a guy whose gimmick has been based around his physical/technical prowess, his appearance is no way acceptable. Suggesting that look isn't important is ridiculous, do you think The Rock would have been a huge star if he looked like Shannon Moore? Do you think Roman Reigns would even be on the main roster if he looked like Bo Dallas? People going on about Ohno having better cardio than Ryback are spectacularly missing the point.
> 
> TBH his appearance isn't even ny biggest problem with Ohno, it's been his total lack of anything interesting or exciting about his character since debuting on NXT. But his physique is also very poor, and if he's been told to improve it and not done so then he should be released. I'm guessing the majority of people defending Ohno on here are workrate marks, which is something I'll never understand.


Workrate mark? Probably. But on the list of things that are important in wrestling, story, workrate, and character are at the top of the list. Six-packs are not. If someone's good to go on the former three, but not the latter, and you take them off television, there's a forest I'd like you to look at once you're done staring at the trees.

I also find it weird that people are assuming he's "refusing" to tone up.


----------



## sharkboy22

Mister Hands said:


> Because that's definitely the determining factor in marketability, and not just an assumption WWE have made people buy into.
















































Yeah, an assumption only the WWE made people buy into. Only the WWE. No other company.

:cussin: work rate marks. You guys are missing the point. The issue here isn't whether or not Ohno can go 60 minutes. The issue is simply this:

Wrestling has and will always be a cosmetic business. By comestic, I do not mean that someone has to be 240 pounds of lean muscle to be considered a pro wrestler. He just needs to be considered believable. If you're 180 pounds, wrestle like it. If you're 240, wrestle like it. If your gimmick is centered around powerful strikes then no one is going to buy into your bullshit if you're a skinny fat fuck and you're facing a 220 pound man who has lean body mass. This isn't ROH. WWE fans react differently. Just because you slap the thigh when doing an elbow, doesn't mean the fans are going to go "Ohhhh". And if you're 220 pounds and stupid enough to sell an elbow for a skinny fat fuck, well the fans aren't going to buy you as a threat. So basically, you both bury yourselves. 

I don't think any WWE fan in 2013 is asking guys to be lean and ripped outta there mind. Otherwise, CM Punk wouldn't be cheered. He wouldn't be the champion for 434 days. Daniel Bryan wouldn't be arguably the #1 draw in the company. If being big and jacked really matter in 2013, then John Cena wouldn't be getting booed out the fucking building every week on RAW. 

But just because you don't have to be 240 pounds anymore, doesn't you can look like a slob and be a WWE Superstar. Sure, Brodus Clay is a fat ass but guess what? His gimmick isn't the best wrestler in the world. I don't watch MMA or boxing so I won't know, but I hardly doubt there are much skinny fat fucks walking around with much wins on their record. And yes wrestling is fake and we can suspend disbelief. But there's a difference between suspending disbelief and trying to buy into a lie. Can you suspend disbelief to the point where Hornswoggle can suplex the Great Khali?

I have a billion and one thoughts in my head and my post would be all over the place if I continue any further. The point is, if Hero wants to stay at his current body size, no problem. Just don't expect to be the guying throwing DEM ELBOWZ anymore. Or the guy who even poses a threat to anyone.


----------



## Wcthesecret

Wittie said:


> Sabin has earned it from his years of crafting, it's the next natural step for him.


YOU TAKE THAT BACK RIGHT NOW!!! HOW DARE YOU INSULT EVERY SINGLE WORLD TITLE IN THE WORLD BY SAYING THAT THAT VANILLA MIDGET IS WORLD TITLE MATERIAL!!! Yeah that's right, I said it, I called him what he is. He aint nothing but a Midcard jobber vanilla midget. He only got the title because Alex Shelley wasn't with the company anymore anyway. Undeserving little piece of **i*.


----------



## x78

Mister Hands said:


> Workrate mark? Probably. But on the list of things that are important in wrestling, story, workrate, and character are at the top of the list. Six-packs are not. If someone's good to go on the former three, but not the latter, and you take them off television, there's a forest I'd like you to look at once you're done staring at the trees.
> 
> I also find it weird that people are assuming he's "refusing" to tone up.


Storytelling is the most important aspect of wrestling, by far. And appearance is a huge part of storytelling. I couldn't give a fuck what the guys look like as long as it works for them. Ohno's look doesn't work for him, it doesn't suit the gimmick he's trying to play, it doesn't suit his ring style, it doesn't suit anything about him. It's like in movies, there's a difference between 'TV ugly' and 'ugly ugly'. Plenty of the wrestlers on the main roster have 'unconventional' looks, in fact most of the popular stars these days do. But the point is that their looks suit them, they suit who they are and the character they are portraying. Ohno doesn't look like a guy who is supposed to be out of shape, TBH he just looks like a fan. And that isn't a good thing. 

Anyway, you've mentioned storytelling and character which Ohno has also completely lacked in NXT, and even his workrate (totally fucking irrelevant to anything) has been way below the other guys on the show so I'm not sure what kind of point you're trying to make.


----------



## Deptford

Ohno looks pretty bad dont get me wrong, but that's not even the problem. I've yet to see this guy put on any sort of interesting match. Maybe I just wasn't watching the Indies in like 05 or something but I'm completely lost on why you guys think he can even wrestle an interesting match. If he could at one point, I think that time has passed.


----------



## SUPAH STRONG STYLE

Deptford said:


> Ohno looks pretty bad dont get me wrong, but that's not even the problem. I've yet to see this guy put on any sort of interesting match. Maybe I just wasn't watching the Indies in like 05 or something but I'm completely lost on why you guys think he can even wrestle an interesting match. If he could at one point, I think that time has passed.


If I could give you some advice, I'd check out his matches with Punk and D-Bry. Also one with El Generico was great. 

There's also his matches with Claudio, aka Cesaro as The Kings Of Wrestling. I would check out some of his matches. Even as a massive Hero fanboy, sometimes he can get overhyped. As of his current state, I have no idea what's going on with him now, but I'd check out some of his indie matches. He is really good.


----------



## NO!

sharkboy22 said:


> And if you're 220 pounds and stupid enough to sell an elbow for a skinny fat fuck, well the fans aren't going to buy you as a threat. So basically, you both bury yourselves.


I don't see how it's any different from Daniel Bryan making Roman Reigns tap out, CM Punk fighting Brock Lesnar while being presented as a legitimate threat to him, or Heath Slater defeating the Great Khali on Smackdown a few weeks back. When I see pictures of Ohno, sure he can work on his physique a little, but it's not the point where him knocking someone out with elbow strikes is beyond the realms of possibility. What makes these guys endearing to the audience or worth their time is all in character and the way their talent is utilized, not necessarily that their bodies look perfectly "toned down". Ridiculous...

Just because you don't have a little bit of fat on your sides doesn't make it any more believable that you can defeat someone who is ten times your size. This really comes off as nitpicking to me.

And yeah, we get it... the WWE is a business! If they want Ohno to work on his body then so be it, I agree he should do it. However, this doesn't mean that the WWE's motives must be commended. 





sharkboy22 said:


> Sure, Brodus Clay is a fat ass but guess what? His gimmick isn't the best wrestler in the world.












"I'm the best in the world at what I do".


----------



## x78

Deptford said:


> Ohno looks pretty bad dont get me wrong, but that's not even the problem. I've yet to see this guy put on any sort of interesting match. Maybe I just wasn't watching the Indies in like 05 or something but I'm completely lost on why you guys think he can even wrestle an interesting match. If he could at one point, I think that time has passed.


Some of his FCW matches were pretty good, I saw potential in the guy at that point. Since FCW became NXT though, for whatever reason he's been terrible and seems to have got much worse in every area.


----------



## Mister Hands

x78 said:


> Storytelling is the most important aspect of wrestling, by far. And appearance is a huge part of storytelling. I couldn't give a fuck what the guys look like as long as it works for them. Ohno's look doesn't work for him, it doesn't suit the gimmick he's trying to play, it doesn't suit his ring style, it doesn't suit anything about him. It's like in movies, there's a difference between 'TV ugly' and 'ugly ugly'. Plenty of the wrestlers on the main roster have 'unconventional' looks, in fact most of the popular stars these days do. But the point is that their looks suit them, they suit who they are and the character they are portraying. Ohno doesn't look like a guy who is supposed to be out of shape, TBH he just looks like a fan. And that isn't a good thing.
> 
> Anyway, you've mentioned storytelling and character which Ohno has also completely lacked in NXT, and even his workrate (totally fucking irrelevant to anything) has been way below the other guys on the show so I'm not sure what kind of point you're trying to make.


I dunno, while I agree he hasn't been a standout on NXT, I just don't think anyone was watching his match with Regal and thinking "Hmmm, this _seems_ really great, but on the other hand, this Ohno fella's a little pudgy."


----------



## x78

Mister Hands said:


> I dunno, while I agree he hasn't been a standout on NXT, I just don't think anyone was watching his match with Regal and thinking "Hmmm, this _seems_ really great, but on the other hand, this Ohno fella's a little pudgy."


Can't really comment TBH since I hated that match.


----------



## phenom64

I'm fine with him actually wanting himself to tone up, but I don't really agree with them wanting a guy to work on his physique when there are a ton of other guys on the MAIN roster who need more work than he does.


----------



## Obfuscation

Tanaka vs Awesome said:


> fpalm
> 
> This is so ignorant I don't even know where to start. Go read this, written by someone much smarter than I could ever hope to be:
> 
> http://homes.chass.utoronto.ca/~ikalmar/illustex/Barthes-wrestling.htm
> 
> Get back to me when you're done.


1984? Edited in 1995? Says it all right there. Times have changed.

I'm not Vince McMahon. Forget a "look". Give me interesting character, charisma, personality, ring work, etc. The things that make me care about professional wrestling. Unusual to me on how so many seem to care about something that isn't a concern unless to WWE management & Kassius Ohno himself. If I'm entertained, I couldn't care less about how any worker(s) looked.


----------



## TD Stinger

NO! said:


> "I'm the best in the world at what I do".


Difference is, Jericho had been on TV for years as an established main event superstar. He could afford to gain a little weight. Ohno, unfortunately, hasn't proved anything yet and doesn't get that luxury. 



HayleySabin said:


> 1984? Edited in 1995? Says it all right there. Times have changed.
> 
> I'm not Vince McMahon. Forget a "look". Give me interesting character, charisma, personality, ring work, etc. The things that make me care about professional wrestling. Unusual to me on how so many seem to care about something that isn't a concern unless to WWE management & Kassius Ohno himself. If I'm entertained, I couldn't care less about how any worker(s) looked.


I know you're not Vince McMahon. Vince McMahon is the guy whose opinion actually matters (along w/ HHH and others). According to the reports, Ohno might have been on TV by now if he had done what his employer told him to do. I don't care how good a guy is (and he hasn't proven to be that great in NXT), if he's not going to show them a sense a loyalty and dedication, it's his own damn fault. They could release him tomorrow and it wouldn't mean a thing. People would bitch here for a week but then he would be an afterthought w/ only himself to blame.


----------



## sharkboy22

NO! said:


> I don't see how it's any different from Daniel Bryan making Roman Reigns tap out, CM Punk fighting Brock Lesnar while being presented as a legitimate threat to him, or Heath Slater defeating the Great Khali on Smackdown a few weeks back. When I see pictures of Ohno, sure he can work on his physique a little, but it's not the point where him knocking someone out with elbow strikes is beyond the realms of possibility. What makes these guys endearing to the audience or worth their time is all in character and the way their talent is utilized, not necessarily that their bodies look perfectly "toned down". Ridiculous...
> 
> Just because you don't have a little bit of fat on your sides doesn't make it any more believable that you can defeat someone who is ten times your size. This really comes off as nitpicking to me.
> 
> And yeah, we get it... the WWE is a business! If they want Ohno to work on his body then so be it, I agree he should do it. However, this doesn't mean that the WWE's motives must be commended.


You workrate marks are missing the point. It's all about PSYCHOLOGY which work rate marks have no idea about because DEM KICKS BRUH. I'm not saying a 180 pound man can't beat a 220 pound man. Nor am I saying that a 220 pound can't sell for a 180 pound. But you gotta have the proper psychology. I see matches where fucking Michael Elgin is doing elbow trade off with the likes of Johnny Yuma. Which part of that makes sense? You think in Punk/Lesnar you're gonna see Punk dishing punishment from the get go? No! He's gonna fight from the bottom, look for an opening and then kick ass. 

Look, for example, at their brawl on RAW. Sure, CM Punk laid some punches in but for how long? And how much damage did it do Lesnar? Lesnar immediately found his footing and started beating the shit outta Punk. PSYCHOLOGY. 



TD Stinger said:


> Difference is, Jericho had been on TV for years as an established main event superstar. He could afford to gain a little weight. Ohno, unfortunately, hasn't proved anything yet and doesn't get that luxury.


The difference is Jericho had some fucking muscle tone. He had MASS. Sure, he was starting to get a little pudgy but look at that definition. Besides, Jericho has dropped all that fat since returning last year. 

Honestly, Hero marks need to pull their head out of their asses and stop missing the goddamn point. There's only so many times the same posters can reiterate the same point.


----------



## Interceptor88

Wow, Ohno's defenders are making some extremely lame points like comparing wrestlers that have some muscle tone or mass, or wrestlers who are slim but in shape, or wrestlers who are supposed to be immovable objects, behemoths or giants with Ohno. 

Ohno has no muscle tone or muscular mass and is flabby. And he's supposed to be a vicious but agile grappler. 

Comparing Ohno with Mark Henry, The Miz or CM Punk is extremely ridiculous.


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

HayleySabin said:


> 1984? Edited in 1995? Says it all right there. Times have changed.
> 
> I'm not Vince McMahon. Forget a "look". Give me interesting character, charisma, personality, ring work, etc. The things that make me care about professional wrestling. Unusual to me on how so many seem to care about something that isn't a concern unless to WWE management & Kassius Ohno himself. If I'm entertained, I couldn't care less about how any worker(s) looked.


As if looks don't matter to character, charisma and personality...

Looks are very much a concern in wrestling because wrestling is not a real sport. Messi can look like a midget with a weird face because he's the best player in the world. Being a good wrestler is much more than just having long matches with lots of moves. To be able to have great psychology you need a strong character and looks are an integral part of it, even more so in WWE. NXT works so well because you have plenty of different characters and not just a bunch of bland wrestlers in tights working 20 minute matches just for the hell of it.

Ohno's bad physique and overall visual presentation is a reflection of his lack of character, charisma and personality. Compare Ohno to Enzo Amore who is not a really muscular guy but has a great look to fit his character. Whose segment would you rather watch? Enzo's or Ohno putting someone in a cravate for 5 minutes while he yells "ARGHHHH" and makes a mean face?


----------



## Genking48

I don't give a shit about his work, if people like Bo Dallas can be employed then for sure Ohno can, my problem is tht back before his WWE run he looked like this:










Not fat, not big muscly guy, but he was fit, in shape no doubt about it, he looked in shape, in fact I'd argue that this is the best he's looked in his entire career, when he before (in comparison) looked like this:










Obviously he's still in shape, but he just looks so bloated, it's unbelievable, todays Kassius Ohno looks like this:










It's like he's going backwards, where before he wasn't a huge muscly guy, he was still fit, no belly at all but just a fit guy who looked so good, now it's like he's back to being that bloated pudgy guy again, I personally doesn't care if he builds muscle, no need for that, don't wanna get big and jacked, hey more power to you for making it like that, but man, at least get rid of the pudgy fat thing that's going on right now, it makes you looks lazy.


----------



## Stanford

We're all influenced by a wrestler look, whether we're conscious of it or not. The one notable thing about the "Who has the worst look in the WWE" thread was that everyone was just listing their least favorite guys. The noted Daniel Bryan haters thought he had the worst look. The vocal Cena bashers thought he had the worst look. Guys who don't like Sheamus thought he had the worst look. We're clearly influenced by look a lot more than we're willing to admit.


----------



## Wittie

Deptford said:


> Ohno looks pretty bad dont get me wrong, but that's not even the problem. I've yet to see this guy put on any sort of interesting match. Maybe I just wasn't watching the Indies in like 05 or something but I'm completely lost on why you guys think he can even wrestle an interesting match. If he could at one point, I think that time has passed.


Presumably you haven't seen his match with Regal.


----------



## Stanford

Wittie said:


> Presumably you haven't seen his match with Regal.


And that's it. That's all he's done.


----------



## NO!

sharkboy22 said:


> You workrate marks are missing the point. It's all about PSYCHOLOGY which work rate marks have no idea about because DEM KICKS BRUH. I'm not saying a 180 pound man can't beat a 220 pound man. Nor am I saying that a 220 pound can't sell for a 180 pound. But you gotta have the proper psychology. I see matches where fucking Michael Elgin is doing elbow trade off with the likes of Johnny Yuma. Which part of that makes sense? You think in Punk/Lesnar you're gonna see Punk dishing punishment from the get go? No! He's gonna fight from the bottom, look for an opening and then kick ass.
> 
> Look, for example, at their brawl on RAW. Sure, CM Punk laid some punches in but for how long? And how much damage did it do Lesnar? Lesnar immediately found his footing and started beating the shit outta Punk. PSYCHOLOGY.
> 
> 
> 
> The difference is Jericho had some fucking muscle tone. He had MASS. Sure, he was starting to get a little pudgy but look at that definition. Besides, Jericho has dropped all that fat since returning last year.
> 
> Honestly, Hero marks need to pull their head out of their asses and stop missing the goddamn point. There's only so many times the same posters can reiterate the same point.


Err, work rate and psychology aren't mutually exclusive though. That's just a bullshit stereotype. Sure CM Punk struggled in his altercations with Brock, but because his body is "perfectly toned down" doesn't really change the fact that he looks like a dwarf next to Brock either way. A couple of extra pounds changes nothing for me. The whole thing about Punk getting a few shots and then annihilated is something that can be applied to almost anyone, especially those in the 6'2-6'4 range. Even John Cena got killed by Lesnar last year, so how the hell is Punk going to manage to get a victory over him when he's not nearly as muscular? Because he's skinny? Okay... that changes everything. I guess Cody Rhodes has a legitimate chance at finding a way to beat Lesnar too, since his body is in such great shape. My main point is that taking a guy off of television because his body isn't perfectly proportioned is a bit extreme to me. I look at the picture in the OP and certainly do not see a man who is obese or anything. Ryback was being kicked around by Justin Gabriel and Chris Jericho literally weeks ago... so I'm not even sure how your outlook on this is consistent with the WWE's. I'm sure you wouldn't have to repeat yourself if your posts weren't inundated with contradictions. 










I love Punk's work, he's easily one of my favorites of all time. However, that right there is a picture of someone who has no chance in hell of defeating Brock Lesnar in a fight. You can book it however you want, it's impossible to buy into as a REAL fight. It is however tons of fun if you forget about that and take it for what it is, a professional wrestling match. 

*The Jericho picture:* So, because Jericho had a character established, that means it would be okay to throw your precious PSYCHOLOGY in the trash? Character and talent is generally valued a lot more than having a "perfect body". You think people are dissecting mass and definition when they're watching a show? It's entertainment for crying out loud. Despite what you pointed out with Jericho's body in that photo, it's the prodigious amount of fat overhanging his trunks that stands out. I still loved what he was doing though.


----------



## NO!

Stanford said:


> We're all influenced by a wrestler look, whether we're conscious of it or not. The one notable thing about the "Who has the worst look in the WWE" thread was that everyone was just listing their least favorite guys. The noted Daniel Bryan haters thought he had the worst look. The vocal Cena bashers thought he had the worst look. Guys who don't like Sheamus thought he had the worst look. We're clearly influenced by look a lot more than we're willing to admit.


It is incredibly superficial and narrow-minded for a performer's appearance to be one of the driving forces when it comes to writing them off completely. There are plenty of users on these boards who merely take shots at their least admired wrestlers any chance they get. You're never going to find one who is consensually appreciated (or consensually scoffed at for that matter), so that thread provided no revelation at all.


----------



## SUPAH STRONG STYLE

NO! said:


> Err, work rate and psychology aren't mutually exclusive though. That's just a bullshit stereotype. Sure CM Punk struggled in his altercations with Brock, but because his body is "perfectly toned down" doesn't really change the fact that he looks like a dwarf next to Brock either way. A couple of extra pounds changes nothing for me. The whole thing about Punk getting a few shots and then annihilated is something that can be applied to almost anyone, especially those in the 6'2-6'4 range. Even John Cena got killed by Lesnar last year, so how the hell is Punk going to manage to get a victory over him when he's not nearly as muscular? Because he's skinny? Okay... that changes everything. I guess Cody Rhodes has a legitimate chance at finding a way to beat Lesnar too, since his body is in such great shape. My main point is that taking a guy off of television because his body isn't perfectly proportioned is a bit extreme to me. I look at the picture in the OP and certainly do not see a man who is obese or anything. Ryback was being kicked around by Justin Gabriel and Chris Jericho literally weeks ago... so I'm not even sure how your outlook on this is consistent with the WWE's. I'm sure you wouldn't have to repeat yourself if your posts weren't inundated with contradictions.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love Punk's work, he's easily one of my favorites of all time. However, that right there is a picture of someone who has no chance in hell of defeating Brock Lesnar in a fight. You can book it however you want, it's impossible to buy into as a REAL fight. It is however tons of fun if you forget about that and take it for what it is, a professional wrestling match.
> 
> *The Jericho picture:* So, because Jericho had a character established, that means it would be okay to throw your precious PSYCHOLOGY in the trash? Character and talent is generally valued a lot more than having a "perfect body". You think people are dissecting mass and definition when they're watching a show? It's entertainment for crying out loud. Despite what you pointed out with Jericho's body in that photo, it's the prodigious amount of fat overhanging his trunks that stands out. I still loved what he was doing though.


I think they took him off TV, as more so of a lesson, as I said. As for the other superstars gaining weight, let me just try to tell you how I see it. 

When I got hired, I had to shave to come into the interview, and clean myself up to look nice and managable, and to at least prove I can shape myself up if need be. However, after the fact I got the job and I was there for a bit, the care started to be a little less if I shaved or not. I feel like that's the case here. If he would pay a bit more of his dues, than I can see him being able to get away with a bit much. However, as I said before, the guy is in the developmental stage. Making it a bit harder for me to defend Hero, even though I'd really like to. 

There's also the fact a punishment had to be in order. The guy is new to the company, and he's already refusing to do something. I'm not saying I know the story, maybe Triple H wants something extreme. However, if he's asking him to tone down just a bit, and he's refusing, there has to be some kind of punishment to maybe provoke a wake-up call. I mean, there's still more to it than him just refusing to lose the weight, as well. There's also him refusing in general. While I think at times, you should be able to disagree with your boss, or mention something that would go against his ways, that comes much later. He just came into the WWE, and he's already refusing to work on things. That's not a good note for the boss. 

Either way, being taken off TV was semi-fair. I do hope he comes back, and I do hope he gets in shape. As someone posted pictures before, he has shown he CAN do it. Getting lazy at this point in his career, would just be absurd.


----------



## x78

NO! said:


> Err, work rate and psychology aren't mutually exclusive though. That's just a bullshit stereotype. Sure CM Punk struggled in his altercations with Brock, but because his body is "perfectly toned down" doesn't really change the fact that he looks like a dwarf next to Brock either way. A couple of extra pounds changes nothing for me. The whole thing about Punk getting a few shots and then annihilated is something that can be applied to almost anyone, especially those in the 6'2-6'4 range. Even John Cena got killed by Lesnar last year, so how the hell is Punk going to manage to get a victory over him when he's not nearly as muscular? Because he's skinny? Okay... that changes everything. I guess Cody Rhodes has a legitimate chance at finding a way to beat Lesnar too, since his body is in such great shape. My main point is that taking a guy off of television because his body isn't perfectly proportioned is a bit extreme to me. I look at the picture in the OP and certainly do not see a man who is obese or anything. Ryback was being kicked around by Justin Gabriel and Chris Jericho literally weeks ago... so I'm not even sure how your outlook on this is consistent with the WWE's. I'm sure you wouldn't have to repeat yourself if your posts weren't inundated with contradictions.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love Punk's work, he's easily one of my favorites of all time. However, that right there is a picture of someone who has no chance in hell of defeating Brock Lesnar in a fight. You can book it however you want, it's impossible to buy into as a REAL fight. It is however tons of fun if you forget about that and take it for what it is, a professional wrestling match.
> 
> *The Jericho picture:* So, because Jericho had a character established, that means it would be okay to throw your precious PSYCHOLOGY in the trash? Character and talent is generally valued a lot more than having a "perfect body". You think people are dissecting mass and definition when they're watching a show? It's entertainment for crying out loud. Despite what you pointed out with Jericho's body in that photo, it's the prodigious amount of fat overhanging his trunks that stands out. I still loved what he was doing though.


You're missing the point, nobody is asking for perfect definition, we're asking for people to look the part. Punk looks the part, he looks like a guy who could be a legit fighter. Could he out-muscle Brock Lesnar? Obviously no, but the match won't be booked like that so it's irrelevant. Ohno doesn't look the part, he looks like a fat slob. He looks like a guy who is supposed to be in shape but isn't. No, it's not inconceivable that he could win some matches, but a guy looking like that shouldn't be pushed. You don't see top athletes and performers in other sports being out of shape.

Regarding that Jericho picture, it's clearly different since Jericho was already established, people knew what he could do even though he was carrying some extra weight at that point. Ohno coming up and being introduced to a wider audience looking like he does would be a disaster.


----------



## NO!

SideburnGuru said:


> I think they took him off TV, as more so of a lesson, as I said. As for the other superstars gaining weight, let me just try to tell you how I see it.
> 
> When I got hired, I had to shave to come into the interview, and clean myself up to look nice and managable, and to at least prove I can shape myself up if need be. However, after the fact I got the job and I was there for a bit, the care started to be a little less if I shaved or not. I feel like that's the case here. If he would pay a bit more of his dues, than I can see him being able to get away with a bit much. However, as I said before, the guy is in the developmental stage. Making it a bit harder for me to defend Hero, even though I'd really like to.
> 
> There's also the fact a punishment had to be in order. The guy is new to the company, and he's already refusing to do something. I'm not saying I know the story, maybe Triple H wants something extreme. However, if he's asking him to tone down just a bit, and he's refusing, there has to be some kind of punishment to maybe provoke a wake-up call. I mean, there's still more to it than him just refusing to lose the weight, as well. There's also him refusing in general. While I think at times, you should be able to disagree with your boss, or mention something that would go against his ways, that comes much later. He just came into the WWE, and he's already refusing to work on things. That's not a good note for the boss.
> 
> Either way, being taken off TV was semi-fair. I do hope he comes back, and I do hope he gets in shape. As someone posted pictures before, he has shown he CAN do it. Getting lazy at this point in his career, would just be absurd.


I can't possibly know what truly happened behind the scenes. If he is rebelling against what the company is telling him to do, then I absolutely agree that it's a bad move on his part and it would be understandable to open his eyes and send him a message. But again, I refuse to believe everything that's reported on the internet, so I'm mostly responding to Ohno being crapped on for his appearance alone. 

I'm all for him working on his physique too, but entertainment matters more to me... and his appearance does not distract me nearly as much as it seems to do with some users on here.


----------



## Mister Hands

Guys, I get that the reports said he was taken off TV for his gut, but did any report actually specify he was _refusing_ to tone up? Genuine question, because it seems like an important distinction.


----------



## NO!

x78 said:


> You're missing the point, nobody is asking for perfect definition, we're asking for people to look the part. Punk looks the part, he looks like a guy who could be a legit fighter. Could he out-muscle Brock Lesnar? Obviously no, but the match won't be booked like that so it's irrelevant. Ohno doesn't look the part, he looks like a fat slob. He looks like a guy who is supposed to be in shape but isn't. No, it's not inconceivable that he could win some matches, but a guy looking like that shouldn't be pushed. You don't see top athletes and performers in other sports being out of shape.
> 
> Regarding that Jericho picture, it's clearly different since Jericho was already established, people knew what he could do even though he was carrying some extra weight at that point. Ohno coming up and being introduced to a wider audience looking like he does would be a disaster.


I guess what I find most problematic out of this is that I can't recall the last time I've seen Chris Hero in excellent shape. Fair enough though, I see where you're coming from.


----------



## SUPAH STRONG STYLE

NO! said:


> I can't possibly know what truly happened behind the scenes. If he is rebelling against what the company is telling him to do, then I absolutely agree that it's a bad move on his part and it would be understandable to open his eyes and send him a message. But again, I refuse to believe everything that's reported on the internet, so I'm mostly responding to Ohno being crapped on for his appearance alone.
> 
> I'm all for him working on his physique too, but entertainment matters more to me... and his appearance does not distract me nearly as much as it seems to do with some users on here.


I can agree with that. I will say something that could lead me to a bit of doubt. See, it's evident, as pictures have shown Chris does work on his moves and his physique. He's put effort into his career, and it's shown over the years. Which kinda leads me to doubt someone like him, would deny something as simple as toning down a bit? He's shown to do it before, I can't see why he wouldn't do it now, out of all times. Especially since wrestling is as far as I know the main part of his life. Why not put work into it now? 

Like I said though, going off what we know from the sources, and as you said, let's think it's all true, he can't get away with just ignoring his higher ups especially since he JUST made it in. As for the body shape? I can see the arguments made by other users. He is supposed to be an athletic knock out guy. When he first came in, his promo was loving to knock people out, etc. At this point, while he can still do that, it would be a bit more helpful if he did tone down a bit. Appearance isn't the thing that matters to me, not all that much at all. It's pro-wrestling. If I could stomach seeing Rey Mysterio beat people like Khali, Taker, Big Show, and Brock Lesnar losing to guys half his size, I really don't obviously care about appearance and believing what I'm seeing. At the same time, he is a bit pudgy. If Chris would make it into the main roster, I would prefer to see him in the athletic built he did have for awhile.


----------



## Stanford

NO! said:


> It is incredibly superficial and narrow-minded for a performer's appearance to be one of the driving forces when it comes to writing them off completely.


You have provided no revelation at all.

This is television we're talking about. Of course it's superficial.


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

NO! said:


> Err, work rate and psychology aren't mutually exclusive though. That's just a bullshit stereotype. Sure CM Punk struggled in his altercations with Brock, but because his body is "perfectly toned down" doesn't really change the fact that he looks like a dwarf next to Brock either way. A couple of extra pounds changes nothing for me. The whole thing about Punk getting a few shots and then annihilated is something that can be applied to almost anyone, especially those in the 6'2-6'4 range. Even John Cena got killed by Lesnar last year, so how the hell is Punk going to manage to get a victory over him when he's not nearly as muscular? Because he's skinny? Okay... that changes everything. I guess Cody Rhodes has a legitimate chance at finding a way to beat Lesnar too, since his body is in such great shape. My main point is that taking a guy off of television because his body isn't perfectly proportioned is a bit extreme to me. I look at the picture in the OP and certainly do not see a man who is obese or anything. Ryback was being kicked around by Justin Gabriel and Chris Jericho literally weeks ago... so I'm not even sure how your outlook on this is consistent with the WWE's. I'm sure you wouldn't have to repeat yourself if your posts weren't inundated with contradictions.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love Punk's work, he's easily one of my favorites of all time. However, that right there is a picture of someone who has no chance in hell of defeating Brock Lesnar in a fight. You can book it however you want, it's impossible to buy into as a REAL fight. It is however tons of fun if you forget about that and take it for what it is, a professional wrestling match.
> 
> *The Jericho picture:* So, because Jericho had a character established, that means it would be okay to throw your precious PSYCHOLOGY in the trash? Character and talent is generally valued a lot more than having a "perfect body". You think people are dissecting mass and definition when they're watching a show? It's entertainment for crying out loud. Despite what you pointed out with Jericho's body in that photo, it's the prodigious amount of fat overhanging his trunks that stands out. I still loved what he was doing though.


Jericho's character was defined a long time ago. After all these years of people knowing him and believing in him, a six pack or a big chest does nothing for him anymore. He's in legend mode now where there's nothing that can hurt his credibility anymore. He can lose clean to Curtis Axel five times in a row but when he comes back he'll still have the loudest pop of the night. People already see him as a strong and credible wrestler so he doesn't need strong abs.


----------



## Geeee

Dark Church said:


> If it's true that Triple H told him to get in better shape that is hilarious. Triple H himself went through a period of time where he had a gut for quite a while.


You mean when he tore his groin and had to wear that protective gear under his trunks? In general, Triple H has been known for having one of the best physiques in wrestling.


----------



## Geeee

NO! said:


> Err, work rate and psychology aren't mutually exclusive though. That's just a bullshit stereotype. Sure CM Punk struggled in his altercations with Brock, but because his body is "perfectly toned down" doesn't really change the fact that he looks like a dwarf next to Brock either way. A couple of extra pounds changes nothing for me. The whole thing about Punk getting a few shots and then annihilated is something that can be applied to almost anyone, especially those in the 6'2-6'4 range. Even John Cena got killed by Lesnar last year, so how the hell is Punk going to manage to get a victory over him when he's not nearly as muscular? Because he's skinny? Okay... that changes everything. I guess Cody Rhodes has a legitimate chance at finding a way to beat Lesnar too, since his body is in such great shape. My main point is that taking a guy off of television because his body isn't perfectly proportioned is a bit extreme to me. I look at the picture in the OP and certainly do not see a man who is obese or anything. Ryback was being kicked around by Justin Gabriel and Chris Jericho literally weeks ago... so I'm not even sure how your outlook on this is consistent with the WWE's. I'm sure you wouldn't have to repeat yourself if your posts weren't inundated with contradictions.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love Punk's work, he's easily one of my favorites of all time. However, that right there is a picture of someone who has no chance in hell of defeating Brock Lesnar in a fight. You can book it however you want, it's impossible to buy into as a REAL fight. It is however tons of fun if you forget about that and take it for what it is, a professional wrestling match.
> 
> *The Jericho picture:* So, because Jericho had a character established, that means it would be okay to throw your precious PSYCHOLOGY in the trash? Character and talent is generally valued a lot more than having a "perfect body". You think people are dissecting mass and definition when they're watching a show? It's entertainment for crying out loud. Despite what you pointed out with Jericho's body in that photo, it's the prodigious amount of fat overhanging his trunks that stands out. I still loved what he was doing though.


As food for thought, this guy beat Lesnar's ass in a real fight:


----------



## Eddie Ray

Geeee said:


> As food for thought, this guy beat Lesnar's ass in a real fight:


he needs a bigger pair of shorts...just sayin...


----------



## BehindYou

Cain is a legit 240lbs still though...

Punk is what, 190?


----------



## Prayer Police

Should have just put him in Shield and throw a bulky vest on him


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

What does MMA have to do with anything? WWE is the place where Rey Mysterio can make Big Show flip by using only his legs and where a throat thrust is only dangerous if the guy's wearing a cobra sock puppet.

The purpose of size is to impress the audience and make them like the wrestler and continue to want to watch the show. It has nothing to do with the legitimacy or credibility of the match. WWE has its own set of rules.


----------



## Asenath

Stanford said:


> And that's it. That's all he's done.


Nope. His FCW mini feud with Richie Steamboat was exceptionally entertaining.


----------



## jarrelka

Even.Flow.NYC said:


> If they spend this much time telling Hero to hit the weights how in the world has CM Punk not toned up even slightly? Looks like he slithered out of doing it too. Skinny-fat era is coming


Skinny-fat era Gaga i lold more then I should of. In all seriousness though Punk can do whatever he wants they won't fire him he,s to valuable and he wouldn't even care since he,s retireing soon anyways with a lot of money too.


----------



## Deebow

The thing about Ohno is that despite his height, he has never had a big wrestlers body. So he is in the odd position of being a big guy, but not having the ability to look like a big wrestler. 

When he had his best physique a couple years back, rumor was that he was experimenting with TRT. So in actuality, he has never really had a great physique. He's been a fat kid all of his life. The fact of the matter is that the shape his is now is still better than he looked about 6-7 years ago. 

I think what would help Ohno the most right now would be to find attire that is flattering to his physique. Funny enough I think wearing something like the Shield wears would help him out a lot. Lol.


----------



## truk83

For the 1000th time, Ohno isn't being held back off of the main roster due to his weight. That is not the case at all. It's his attitude, and it has nothing to do with his weight. Once again, one of his earlier promos in FCW Ohno points out that he wouldn't be there long. This rubbed a ton of folks the wrong way, and made others in the FCW/NXT locker room feeling offended. This apparently isn't the only issue with his attitude either. I hear he speaks his mind, and has a tendency to mouth off a bit. I don't know how much of that is true, but his promo happened, and he received some heat for that. If he cut a promo that offended people, then I'm sure his attitude, or his mouth may be landing him in trouble.

Look at Leo Kruger. He has a great physique, and he has been in developmental for how long? He even has a character to go along with his looks. His promo work is ok. Bottom line is that he isn't talented. Kruger is a throwback, and would not last long on the main roster. Leo won't be on the main roster for the time being, and it has nothing to do with his weight, or physique because that's well beyond average. Kruger just sucks, plain, and simple. Ohno is one of the best wrestlers in the world. The fact that some of you can't comprehend this is astonishing to me. He walked into the big time thinking he was going to be one of the stars. Ohno's experience fooled him into thinking he would make it to the main roster right away, and that wasn't the case. That's all this is.


----------



## CactusJamie

truk83 said:


> For the 1000th time, Ohno isn't being held back off of the main roster due to his weight. That is not the case at all. It's his attitude, and it has nothing to do with his weight. Once again, one of his earlier promos in FCW Ohno points out that he wouldn't be there long. This rubbed a ton of folks the wrong way, and made others in the FCW/NXT locker room feeling offended. This apparently isn't the only issue with his attitude either. I hear he speaks his mind, and has a tendency to mouth off a bit. I don't know how much of that is true, but his promo happened, and he received some heat for that. If he cut a promo that offended people, then I'm sure his attitude, or his mouth may be landing him in trouble.
> 
> Look at Leo Kruger. He has a great physique, and he has been in developmental for how long? He even has a character to go along with his looks. His promo work is ok. Bottom line is that he isn't talented. Kruger is a throwback, and would not last long on the main roster. Leo won't be on the main roster for the time being, and it has nothing to do with his weight, or physique because that's well beyond average. Kruger just sucks, plain, and simple. Ohno is one of the best wrestlers in the world. The fact that some of you can't comprehend this is astonishing to me. He walked into the big time thinking he was going to be one of the stars. Ohno's experience fooled him into thinking he would make it to the main roster right away, and that wasn't the case. That's all this is.



I do believe you are right. Good points all around. But the McMahon's have a reputation for being horny for big muscles, and if they are going to make a guy like Rey Mysterio beef up (a guy who's performances were hindered by that extra mass), then they are definitely going to want Ohno to do the same. But, yeah, he doesn't get to decide when he is done with NXT, unless he quits the company that is. And being cocky in the dressing room is not going to be put up with in the current WWE.


----------



## x78

Kruger gets better reactions on NXT than Ohno ever has. 

If Ohno really was one of the best wrestlers in the world, he wouldn't be in the position he is now.


----------



## RiverFenix

Yeah his weight/shape isn't an issue - but they have him wrestling in a shirt now...

His attitude is the issue - so they take him off nxt television for over two months...


----------



## Amber B

...He looks exactly the same. 
The funny thing is that he hasn't gained that much weight and even at his "fittest" he still had the pouch. That's a hereditary issue.

If his weight/look was a problem then boy will we see these "reports" and "scoops" about Callihan in the future. That bastard's weight fluctuates like crazy.


----------



## RiverFenix

It will be up to Callihan. He's getting paid more than he made on the indies to basically work out and train full time. If you can't be in peak shape in developmental, how in the hell can the wwe brass expect you to keep in shape on the road?


----------



## Gretchen

I like Hero/Ohno, but I have this feeling that in the case that he gets called up he's going to end up like Cesaro. Even though I'd say he's more charismatic than Cesaro, I just can't see him getting far in the WWE.


----------



## Jerichoholic274

Rhodes_For_WHC said:


> I like Hero/Ohno, but I have this feeling that in the case that he gets called up he's going to end up like Cesaro. Even though I'd say he's more charismatic than Cesaro, I just can't see him getting far in the WWE.


I disagree. I think he can go really far, but I know WWE can fuck him up awfully. They need to give him his superstar ko kid gimmick again, and put him with a hype man(This is why Heyman should take him). Sure, he can talk like no other, but with a guy like heyman, he can REALLY get over.


----------



## Gretchen

Jerichoholic274 said:


> I disagree. I think he can go really far, but I know WWE can fuck him up awfully. They need to give him his superstar ko kid gimmick again, and put him with a hype man(This is why Heyman should take him). Sure, he can talk like no other, but with a guy like heyman, he can REALLY get over.


Not saying he couldn't get far because he don't got it, just saying I don't realistically see him going far in the WWE, for some reason. I just can't see it happening with Ohno at this point of his career, and just in general. Now him replacing Axel would be great, but it just doesn't seem like he could get big in the WWE.


----------



## x78

Jerichoholic274 said:


> I disagree. I think he can go really far, but I know WWE can fuck him up awfully. They need to give him his superstar ko kid gimmick again, and put him with a hype man(This is why Heyman should take him). Sure, he can talk like no other, but with a guy like heyman, he can REALLY get over.


Posts like this make me question whether I'm watching the same guy as everyone else. We're talking about Kassius Ohno right?


----------



## ROGERTHAT21

MANTI TEO said:


> CM Punk doesn't eat meat needs more protein in his diet and he probably doesn't have a body that can put on muscle


*Bullshit. Anyone can put on muscle if they try.*


birthday_massacre said:


> who is in better shape Ohno or Ryback?
> 
> *Only one of then could wrestle a 30-60 minute match without dying and that person is not Ryback.*


*Who cares? The WWE aren't going to put people in positions where they're not going to excel, so they'd never put Ryback in a 60 minute match. *



birthday_massacre said:


> Some of the biggest stars ever in the WWE didnt look in shape. Mic Foley, Andre the Giant, Vader, the big show and Dusty Rhodes just to name a few.
> 
> And its funny you mentioned Cean and Ryback. Those are two of the most hated wrestlers in the WWE right now (oh sure kids love Cena but not adults).
> 
> Daniel Bryan is one of the most over wrestlers in the WWE and he does not have that superman look. Punk doesnt have the superman look either and he was champion for over 400 days.
> 
> Even look at a guy like Dean Ambrose he isnt jacked but the guy can wrestle and is in shape. He is going to be a huge star by next year.
> 
> I would take a roster full of guys like Dean Ambrose, Daniel Bryan and CM Punks over A roster full of guys like Cena and Ryback.
> 
> 
> 
> The superman look is 80s and is passe. The best wrestlers are the ones who are like Daniel Bryan, Punk, and Ziggler who can wrestler and sell great but dont look all roided up like Cena or Ryback.
> 
> 
> Lets just compare the roster of the top 5 roided up looks that you love or the ones who people claim are not in great shape but are still great.
> 
> Roided Roster
> 
> Cena
> Ryback
> Reigns
> Jackson
> Big E
> 
> Normal looking guys roster
> 
> Punk
> Daniel Bryan
> Ziggler And if you want to claim Ziggler looks too good for this group, replace him with Sandow).
> Ambrose
> Rollins
> 
> 
> You can take all the Ryback Big E, Jackson wrestlers all you want but those guys suck.
> 
> Give me a roster full of the latter any day.


*Dean Ambrose and Seth Rollins are in great shape. Don't belive me? Go into the Shield Discussion Thread and check out some pics.

I'd take someone like Cena over everyone that you just mentioned, everyday of the week. He's extremely marketable.*



birthday_massacre said:


> Their bodies didnt look fantastic but their in ring work did. There is a difference people are complaining that Ohno is out of shape and that is not it. He is a great worker, he made not be great on the mic, but not everyone is. Brock Lesnar is terrible on the mic but he is great in the ring.
> 
> And Daniel Bryan is the perfect example, he has a normal look, yet he is the most over guy in the WWE because he is great in the ring and is vastly improved on the mic.
> 
> Its not Heros fault he has a generic look in NXT its the WWE, the WWE loves to do that. Just look at how they ruined El Generico.
> 
> You are agreeing with what I am saying It does not matter if you dont have the roided up look, as long as you are good in the ring, and have personality you will be fine.
> 
> More wrestlers that have the roided up Ryback look flop than ones that look like the guys i mentioned or Ohno.


*Lesnar is great in the ring, has the 'it' factor, and has a GREAT LOK. Bryan's look is anything but normal, the guy stands out like a sore thumb.*



birthday_massacre said:


> I agree, maybe moving him up to the main roster would motive him more. Its pretty sickening that Bo Dallas got a taste of the main roster and Ohno has not.


 *I'm not going to promote someone hoping that they'll do better when they suck now. That's silly, and you know it.*



Stanford said:


> You have provided no revelation at all.
> 
> This is television we're talking about. Of course it's superficial.


:clap



Geeee said:


> As food for thought, this guy beat Lesnar's ass in a real fight:


*Yeah, that's a real competition. His look doesn't matter as much as it does if he was in the WWE.*



BehindYou said:


> Cain is a legit 240lbs still though...
> 
> Punk is what, 190?


*I think Punk is 210 pounds.
*


----------



## Annihilus

the reality people dont want to admit is in order for him to get a WWE physique he has to get on steroids, he simply doesnt have the genetics or the natural testosterone levels to build the jacked physique that they expect. 

Did you guys forget he was on steroids when WWE originally tried to sign him in 2011 and they had to rescind the contract until he could pass a wellness test? thats why he was in better shape at the time, without roids he looks more like a regular guy. By the way do the math you marks: without roids a LOT of the WWE roster would look more like regular guys.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Ohno looks like Jesus. That's a good enough look for me.


----------



## NO!

Stanford said:


> You have provided no revelation at all.
> 
> This is television we're talking about. Of course it's superficial.



Ah, so it's the norm for people to act like shallow cunts because it's television. What I'm doing is questioning what's "normal", because it seems pretty fucked up to me.


----------



## Mon Joxley

NO! said:


> Ah, so it's the norm for people to act like shallow cunts because it's television. What I'm doing is questioning what's "normal", because it seems pretty fucked up to me.


People aren't acting shallow, they've just accepted what WWE expects of his wrestlers. Bitching and crying about how unfair it isn't really making any valid point.


----------



## NO!

T Man said:


> People aren't acting shallow, they've just accepted what WWE expects of his wrestlers. Bitching and crying about how unfair it isn't really making any valid point.


Not only does that have very little to do with what I'm talking about, but I am not "bitching and crying".


----------



## jarrelka

Honestly Ohno is so overrated in here. Sure he deserves alot of respect for doing it what 14 years? But he,s overrated. He reminds me of Regal. That ring general vet but lacks in the other areas to make it. Plus his ringwork isnt exactly fast and highflying like jeff hardy or fastpased techinical like Angle. He works a really slowpaced technical style that doesnt get over with WWE fans. Honestly he needs to be a trainer or something plus age is catching up on,him. Even if he made it to the mainroster next year he will be 34 and have 6 years or something.


----------



## Duke Silver

jarrelka said:


> He reminds me of Regal. That ring general vet but lacks in the other areas to make it.


I'm sorry, what?

What exactly does Regal "lack"?

Honestly.


----------



## december_blue

NO! said:


> Ah, so it's the norm for people to act like shallow cunts because it's television. What I'm doing is questioning what's "normal", because it seems pretty fucked up to me.


Who's acting like a shallow cunt? Television, and entertainment as a whole, has always been a largely cosmetic business.


----------



## jarrelka

Duke Silver said:


> I'm sorry, what?
> 
> What exactly does Regal "lack"?
> 
> Honestly.


I meant as far as ringskills. Both are vets with extremly good workrate but as far as the other elements such as intensity in the ring/storytelling/psychology/whatever. They just arent exciting in the ring. Regal is a great talker but he messed up with drugs when he finally got rewarded a push.


----------



## NO!

december_blue said:


> Who's acting like a shallow cunt? Television, and entertainment as a whole, has always been a largely cosmetic business.



The WWE can do whatever it wants, and I've accepted it as a reality that they think this way. On the other hand, I'm not sure why I must accept it as something that should be eulogized just because that's how it is on mainstream TV and entertainment. I don't complain about it, I merely have a hard time understanding this compliant go-with-the-flow approach to the whole thing. At the end of the day, I just see these guys and women (especially the women) being exploited by this "cosmetic business". They seem to be judged more, if not entirely because of what they look like over everything else, and that answers your question. 

People think he needs to tone down a bit, that's cool. I think a fan supporting the act of taking him off of television and demoting him because he has a little bit of weight is a bit drastic, but that's just me. Maybe there's something more to it that we don't know about, as I've said previously, but yeah.


----------



## SUPAH STRONG STYLE

NO! said:


> The WWE can do whatever it wants, and I've accepted it as a reality that they think this way. On the other hand, I'm not sure why I must accept it as something that should be eulogized just because that's how it is on mainstream TV and entertainment. I don't complain about it, I merely have a hard time understanding this compliant go-with-the-flow approach to the whole thing. At the end of the day, I just see these guys and women (especially the women) being exploited by this "cosmetic business". They seem to be judged more, if not entirely because of what they look like over everything else, and that answers your question.
> 
> People think he needs to tone down a bit, that's cool. I think a fan supporting the act of taking him off of television and demoting him because he has a little bit of weight is a bit drastic, but that's just me. Maybe there's something more to it that we don't know about, as I've said previously, but yeah.


Like I said before. I'm a huge Chris Hero mark. Probably, if nto second, my all time favorite superstar to watch. Some people disagree with that. I could go onto a long summary of why I find the guy to be one of the best, but it'd be irrelevant to the subject at hand. I would message someone why though, if anyone's curious. 


Anyway, like I said. As for the issue with him being taken off tv, it's most likely because he seemed to refuse to. Like I said, I don't know the story. No one truly does, but we have a general idea of what's going on. The weight is the issue because, as I said, he's the new guy on the block. They have a story for him, HHH said "Get in shape", he set up some trainers for him, Chris Hero refused, now there's the punishment for doing so. And I'd hate to say that, because even in his current weight, he could still probably pull off some good moves. Fact remains though, he still denied to do what his boss said to do. Whether I find it righteous or not, he was going to get punished for it. 

However, if I did have to think anything was fishy, I would still think it makes no sense for someone who made such work out steps before, like Hero to not train for the biggest moments of his life when getting into the WWE. Does seem a bit weird he'd refuse to do somethng that simple, but still.


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

Why isn't Superman a skinny dude wearing jean shorts? He's got super strength and can fly. Why does he have to be super good looking and muscular too?


----------



## NO!

Tanaka vs Awesome said:


> Why isn't Superman a skinny dude wearing jean shorts? He's got super strength and can fly. Why does he have to be super good looking and muscular too?


Kevin Nash is that you? Not everyone who is/has been successful in the WWE is super muscular (I thought we've already gone through this?), nor do they have looks that the media usually tries to condition you to strive towards. Superman is obviously a highly acclaimed superhero because of those abs br0. Right? Not quite. It's his character and his story that makes him who he is. He might have muscles, but you don't see him flexing in front of cameras and oiling up his body. The attention is NEVER on that. It's all in his motives, his charm, and doing what he believes is best for humanity. I don't really give two shits about Superman or most of the movies, but that much is still true. If you want to bring movies into the discussion then I'll bring up the popularity of Kick Ass as a good example, where you have a little girl beating the shit out of numerous grown adults at one time. As if having extra weight would make it any more absurd than it already is. That's the point though, it has very little to do with what her body looks like. You wouldn't be hard-pressed to find people who want a character they can be invested in, and someone who essentially entertains them. Not everyone is going to pettily scoff because "omg look at those love handles!". 

As far as I see, it only becomes an issue when it affects performance. If this is the issue people have with him, then it goes way beyond what he looks like. Watching his matches on NXT, I don't see him struggling in regards to physical exertion at all. He's moving around the same way that he always has. Any problem people might have with him would have to be associated with a struggle to adapt or merely unrealistic expectations from particular matches. 

I mean, I just don't get it when people say it's impossible to buy into his knockout gimmick. In a form of entertainment where a 5'6 individual makes giants fly around the ring with his legs, a flabby guy wins 16 world titles (the most in history), and just about everyone manages to keep the great khali down for 3 seconds with very little offense... a guy who is 6'4 can't knock someone out with hard elbow strikes because he's SLIGHTLY drooping? If delivered with tenacity and finesse, which Ohno has, a hard elbow strike would undoubtedly knock you out. 

Also, this idea that fans can't admire someone if they aren't in "perfect" shape is INSANELY outdated. And as I've already mentioned, it wouldn't make a difference to me if it wasn't, because I can still think for myself.


----------



## Genking48

NO! said:


> The WWE can do whatever it wants, and I've accepted it as a reality that they think this way. On the other hand, I'm not sure why I must accept it as something that should be eulogized just because that's how it is on mainstream TV and entertainment. I don't complain about it, I merely have a hard time understanding this compliant go-with-the-flow approach to the whole thing. At the end of the day, I just see these guys and women (especially the women) being exploited by this "cosmetic business". They seem to be judged more, if not entirely because of what they look like over everything else, and that answers your question.
> 
> People think he needs to tone down a bit, that's cool. I think a fan supporting the act of taking him off of television and demoting him *because he has a little bit of weight *is a bit drastic, but that's just me. Maybe there's something more to it that we don't know about, as I've said previously, but yeah.


Honestly, I don't think that the problem is that he's put on weight, the problem that comes (at least how I see it) is that WWE (may) tells him "Hey Chris, you've been putting on a bit of weight and it's starting to be noticable, and we really feel like you need to look in shape, so we're gonna have to ask you to lose some of that weight."

Time then pass, they open a performance center with a gym and everything, more time pass and Hero still hasn't done anything to lose that weight they suggested that he should try and lose, that's where I see a problem arising, and that's where I'm starting to think like "Hmmm, doesn't really seem like Hero has been trying to do what his employer tells him to do, maybe he's not really motivated to be there at all. Why should he take up space when there is surely people that would give everything to get into WWE and actually lose weight if they were suggested that it would be preferred by the management?" 

At least that's how I see it, if any of this is in fact true at all, if they told him that his weight is gonna be a problem he should listen to them and try to lose that weight. Fucking show that you're willing to do something to keep your job man, hell the place where you work have a fucking gym, it's not like you have to spend an hour of your life getting to the gym, you probably only need to walk for like, 2 minutes to get there, and then you can get to work and solve whatever weight problem you might or might not have.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Guys stop talking about Ohno. Some idiot just said that William Regal lacks in storytelling/psychology/intensity.


----------



## NO!

@Tinkerbell, I agree that it would be a mistake for him to not take that into consideration and show how bad he wants to get to the roster. Doing whatever is necessary and showing the dedication is vital, so I'm not disputing that. I just don't know how true those rumors are. 

As for Regal, I think he's one of the most underrated performers in the history of the company. A master in the ring, a master outside of it, and even a damn good commentator. He had so much depth as an on-screen character, and could play both heel and babyface exceptionally well to go along with his extraordinary talent as a wrestler.


----------



## Asenath

funnyfaces1 said:


> Guys stop talking about Ohno. *Some idiot just said that William Regal lacks in storytelling/psychology/intensity.*












Get me my belt.


----------



## Wcthesecret

Asenath said:


> Get me my belt.


Will you take this sodering iron instead?


----------



## Asenath

All body snark aside, one of the trainers posted video of him in the gym. His moves are looking pretty smooth here.

I don't know how to embed an Instagram. http://instagram.com/p/dF_5KSveji/


----------



## Snapdragon

Asenath said:


> All body snark aside, one of the trainers posted video of him in the gym. His moves are looking pretty smooth here.
> 
> I don't know how to embed an Instagram. http://instagram.com/p/dF_5KSveji/


Because he is a fantastic worker

Unfortunately WWE will never realize that


----------



## truk83

People tend to forget how agile he is at his height. Most people his size aren't typically that agile. He is smooth, and fast at the same time. Very hard to do when you are tall, and a bit lanky. When you look at him you don't expect such athleticism. One of the best in the world right now.


----------



## Snapdragon

truk83 said:


> People tend to forget how agile he is at his height. Most people his size aren't typically that agile. He is smooth, and fast at the same time. Very hard to do when you are tall, and a bit lanky. When you look at him you don't expect such athleticism. One of the best in the world right now.


Pretty much what you get when you've trained in Lucha Libre for years and have trained in Europe and the NOAH dojo.


----------



## prodandimitrow

Snapdragon said:


> Because he is a fantastic worker
> 
> Unfortunately WWE will never realize that


Being a fantastic worker alone doesnt draw money , drawing people draws money,selling merch draws money and selling PPV draws money.
You have the same case on the main roster now with Cesaro , he is great in the ring,fantastic worker, but it simply isnt enough for you to be successful in WWE.


----------



## Asenath

prodandimitrow said:


> Being a fantastic worker alone doesnt draw money , drawing people draws money,selling merch draws money and selling PPV draws money.
> You have the same case on the main roster now with Cesaro , he is great in the ring,fantastic worker, but it simply isnt enough for you to be successful in WWE.


Chris Hero drew everywhere in the world. I don't see why the WWE audience is so much different that they wouldn't learn to appreciate what people who follow the indies have known for years.


----------



## NO!

prodandimitrow said:


> Being a fantastic worker alone doesnt draw money , drawing people draws money,selling merch draws money and selling PPV draws money.
> You have the same case on the main roster now with Cesaro , he is great in the ring,fantastic worker, but it simply isnt enough for you to be successful in WWE.



Cesaro has the ability to do all of those things, he's just being used terribly. He's in a tag team that doesn't suit him, and it doesn't help that they lose most of the time. He would be huge if they just let him fulfill his potential. I think a face turn would probably help him, but even then I doubt they'd give him a serious push.

Both guys are actually a lot better on the microphone than Alberto Del Rio... the guy who has won 4 world titles, won Royal Rumble, and won Money in the Bank.


----------



## prodandimitrow

Asenath said:


> Chris Hero drew everywhere in the world. I don't see why the WWE audience is so much different that they wouldn't learn to appreciate what people who follow the indies have known for years.


Because the fanbase is different . A big part of the WWE audience are kids , they cant really appriciate if a guy can work 10 hour match(if something kids have a short attention time-span so long match is a no - no) or his technical abilties , however is much easier for them to appriciate eye candy type of wrestlers.


----------



## Mr. I

prodandimitrow said:


> Because the fanbase is different . A big part of the WWE audience are kids , they cant really appriciate if a guy can work 10 hour match(if something kids have a short attention time-span so long match is a no - no) or his technical abilties , however is much easier for them to appriciate eye candy type of wrestlers.


To be quite fair, KO is a good speaker, he's a good looking guy, the long hair and beard looks unique in the WWE, and he's tall and imposing. The ONLY thing off about him is his lack of toning, if he were to get more ripped, he'd have an excellent look.

There's no real reason beyond that lack of toning that he wouldn't do well.



funnyfaces1 said:


> Guys stop talking about Ohno. Some idiot just said that William Regal lacks in storytelling/psychology/intensity.


----------



## truk83

prodandimitrow said:


> Because the fanbase is different . A big part of the WWE audience are kids , they cant really appriciate if a guy can work 10 hour match(if something kids have a short attention time-span so long match is a no - no) or his technical abilties , however is much easier for them to appriciate eye candy type of wrestlers.


Are you aware that his name is no longer Chris Hero? His name is Kassius Ohno. The last name alone is catchy, and kids will likely chant that last name with no problem. Not to mention the name abbreviated is KO. I think that alone is marketable. Ohno has always been creative in terms of his look as well. I have said this once, and I will say it again. Kassius is on the same level that Bryan, and Punk were on before making it to the WWE main roster. Everyone bashed both Punk, and Bryan claiming that they won't make it, and here we are now. Kassius is bigger, and just as charismatic as either of those two men. Ohno is going to be a main event level talent.


----------



## Trifektah

I think people aren't giving children enough credit when it comes to appreciating a good worker. When I was 5 or 6 years old in the late 80's my favorite wrestlers were Curt Hennig, Macho Man, Bret Hart and The Brainbusters and The Rockers specifically because I enjoyed all of their matches so much.


----------



## Asenath

OMG, yes. I rode for the Harts in all combinations all through my childhood.


----------



## Lordhhhx

the problem is not that he is not talented he Obviusly is wich is why Tripleh told Him that they got plans for him on the main Roster and is why he wants him in good shape.

WWE is not at fault they are giving him the chance to be big but Hero is not doing anything or making the effort in exchange and disobeying his Boss.

he has the boss will not Reward him for being a Disobedient employer.


----------



## truk83

Lordhhhx said:


> the problem is not that he is not talented he Obviusly is wich is why Tripleh told Him that they got plans for him on the main Roster and is why he wants him in good shape.
> 
> WWE is not at fault they are giving him the chance to be big but Hero is not doing anything or making the effort in exchange and disobeying his Boss.
> 
> he has the boss will not Reward him for being a Disobedient employer.


Dude, it's politics. Explain to me again how Bray Wyatt got on the main roster? Have you watched a Bray Wyatt match? Ohno pissed the wrong folks off his first promo in the company down in FCW, here is the link...


----------



## truk83

As you can see in his first 5 seconds of speaking he has already offended everyone in the locker of FCW, and likely others. Lol. He says he won't be there long. Even I am a fan, but that was a dick move on his part to say. Such a level of disrespect that I am sure he wasn't quite aware of, or he wanted to be a bad boy. I dunno. Either way I think this could be the cause of his main roster problems.


----------



## The Ultimate Puke

Let me help you out there truk...


----------



## truk83

Bloodbath said:


> Let me help you out there truk...


Completely out of it, sorry, and thanks. I fixed it.


----------



## sabaw123

truk83 said:


> Dude, it's politics. Explain to me again how Bray Wyatt got on the main roster? Have you watched a Bray Wyatt match? Ohno pissed the wrong folks off his first promo in the company down in FCW, here is the link...


Bray Wyatt is actually entertaining in NXT whereas Ohno is just plain boring if it wasn't for William Regal his entire NXT stint would be forgettable.


----------



## Mon Joxley

sabaw123 said:


> Bray Wyatt is actually entertaining in NXT whereas Ohno is just plain boring if it wasn't for William Regal his entire NXT stint would be forgettable.


I grew tired of Bray Wyatt's schtick before he even debuted on Raw. Like most over-the-top movie-inspired gimmicks, I get over them rather quickly.


----------



## truk83

sabaw123 said:


> Bray Wyatt is actually entertaining in NXT whereas Ohno is just plain boring if it wasn't for William Regal his entire NXT stint would be forgettable.


The vignettes are over now, and so what's that interesting about Wyatt now? His ring work is horrible, and has been for some time now. Ohno's character is fine, and that debut promo wasn't that bad either. Kassius isn't a gimmick whereas Bray is a gimmick/character. Kassius would certainly come in as a face, and go over. It's hard to debut in the WWE as a face, and go that's why most debut as heels Fandango, Shield, Sandow, Wyatt Family etc. Ohno could easily come in talking shit as a face, or heel. Either way he could sell it. He is a personality of nicknames, not a gimmick. It's similar to Edge. 

When you think about Edge, or RVD they were nickname based personalities. Mr Monday Night, The Rated "R" Superstar, or someone like HBK with Mr.WM, or The Show Stopper. These aren't flat out gimmicks, but mere extensions of their own personalities. Bray Wyatt is a far exaggeration of some freak of nature that lives in the Swamps. This is the Mankind, Kane, or Waylon Mercy kind of character. Ohno has to learn to respect the business which he clearly didn't do in his debut promo. No one was really expecting that. He needs to suck it up, and smile. Get on the main roster, and let it all out.

Give him a new theme, and have him come out with an entourage like they do in boxing. I would even go as far as to affiliate him with Mike Tyson. Have Tyson hype him up, or come out during Ohno's WWE debut. Kassius would come out with Mike Tyson in his corner for one night. One night thing makes his debut memorable, and helps put him over with fans as a face, hopefully. Fans typically Mike Tyson. Have his first bout vs Jinder Mahal, and knocking him out as soon as the bell rings, and thus ask for just one more match since the first match was so short. In comes Drew, he gets knocked out cold, and finally Ohno says that's not enough. In comes Slater, who then is knocked out cold. Ohno wins the 3 matches in the fastest time ever recorded in the WWE. This should be his music as well...


----------



## papercuts_hurt

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BS3CMxzIIAA-Abq.jpg:large

KO just tweeted this pic of him and Knuckles Madsen...still sporting the gut sadly but is it just me or does his upper body look more muscular? I just fuckin want him back on NXT


----------



## Paul Rudd

IDK, if he was standing up straight it might look ok. When u sit down it pushes your stomach out; it doesn't look too big regardless.


----------



## Mon Joxley

Looks fine to me in that picture. Can't really call that a "gut". Bit of puppy fat and like it's been said, he's half sitting down there. His upper body looks good.


----------



## tylermoxreigns

His upper body is looking good.

Sometimes I can't help but look at his guy and think that a little bit of it "gut" is actually skin due to the amount of weight that he had lost beforehand (I could be totally wrong though). Sure, some of it is extra fat but I just really wanna see him back on TV. Ohno can work a ring, it's a waste.


----------



## Crozer

WHERE'S HIS FUCKING BEARD?


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

truk83 said:


> The vignettes are over now, and so what's that interesting about Wyatt now? His ring work is horrible, and has been for some time now. Ohno's character is fine, and that debut promo wasn't that bad either. Kassius isn't a gimmick whereas Bray is a gimmick/character. Kassius would certainly come in as a face, and go over. It's hard to debut in the WWE as a face, and go that's why most debut as heels Fandango, Shield, Sandow, Wyatt Family etc. Ohno could easily come in talking shit as a face, or heel. Either way he could sell it. He is a personality of nicknames, not a gimmick. It's similar to Edge.
> 
> When you think about Edge, or RVD they were nickname based personalities. Mr Monday Night, The Rated "R" Superstar, or someone like HBK with Mr.WM, or The Show Stopper. These aren't flat out gimmicks, but mere extensions of their own personalities. Bray Wyatt is a far exaggeration of some freak of nature that lives in the Swamps. This is the Mankind, Kane, or Waylon Mercy kind of character. Ohno has to learn to respect the business which he clearly didn't do in his debut promo. No one was really expecting that. He needs to suck it up, and smile. Get on the main roster, and let it all out.
> 
> Give him a new theme, and have him come out with an entourage like they do in boxing. I would even go as far as to affiliate him with Mike Tyson. Have Tyson hype him up, or come out during Ohno's WWE debut. Kassius would come out with Mike Tyson in his corner for one night. One night thing makes his debut memorable, and helps put him over with fans as a face, hopefully. Fans typically Mike Tyson. Have his first bout vs Jinder Mahal, and knocking him out as soon as the bell rings, and thus ask for just one more match since the first match was so short. In comes Drew, he gets knocked out cold, and finally Ohno says that's not enough. In comes Slater, who then is knocked out cold. Ohno wins the 3 matches in the fastest time ever recorded in the WWE. This should be his music as well...


Wyatt's ring work is horrible? :lmao fucking bandwagoners...

Vince McMahon hates paying the rights fees for music so Ohno won't get any famous songs. Nobody does. Punk got it because he negotiated a million dollar contract and that was one of the perks.

th KO gimmick is really lame and nobody cares about it. Barrett is evidence of that. ohno needs a over the top gimmick if he wants to be relevant


----------



## Paul Rudd

Crozer said:


> WHERE'S HIS FUCKING BEARD?


Holy shit, I didn't even notice it was gone.:lol Maybe this is him attempting to improve his image.


----------



## Mon Joxley

Tanaka vs Awesome said:


> Vince McMahon hates paying the rights fees for music so Ohno won't get any famous songs. Nobody does. Punk got it because he negotiated a million dollar contract and that was one of the perks.


No, Punk got it because WWE had already purchased the rights to use "Cult of Personality" when they used it for Stone Cold Steve Austin's Hall of Fame video package in 2009, or something like that. It was used on WWE television before Punk started using it.



Crozer said:


> WHERE'S HIS FUCKING BEARD?


I thought he got rid of it during the feud with Regal?


----------



## Asenath

papercuts_hurt said:


> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BS3CMxzIIAA-Abq.jpg:large
> 
> KO just tweeted this pic of him and Knuckles Madsen...still sporting the gut sadly but is it just me or does his upper body look more muscular? I just fuckin want him back on NXT


9/10, would smash. (Point deducted for missing hipster beard.)


----------



## truk83

Tanaka vs Awesome said:


> Wyatt's ring work is horrible? :lmao fucking bandwagoners...
> 
> Vince McMahon hates paying the rights fees for music so Ohno won't get any famous songs. Nobody does. Punk got it because he negotiated a million dollar contract and that was one of the perks.
> 
> th KO gimmick is really lame and nobody cares about it. Barrett is evidence of that. ohno needs a over the top gimmick if he wants to be relevant


Look take nothing away from Wyatt's character. I like how he plays the role. Wyatt can work in the ring like a Bam Bam Bigelow, or Terry Gordy. You can act like he can work well in the ring all you'd like, but you're wrong. It's the reason he was sent back to NXT to develop after the old NXT show.

The "KO" gimmick is not for Wade Barrett. The same way I could say that the Bray Wyatt character could not be played as well by someone like Curtis Axel. You catch my drift? Kassius Ohno can play the "KO" gimmick because that's been his character his whole career. I don't feel like that character just started in NXT. You can think that all you'd like, but once again I think you are wrong.

At the same time I also think that the "KO" gimmick is limited, and Ohno should add another dimension to his character. How about "Wrestling genius"? He would know all matches the WWE ever had, all title reigns, length of reigns, who won what title where, and when etc. He would incorporate this personality into all of his feuds where he would break down his opponents whole WWE career.

Obviously, when he is going to a title he would cut promos on the best, and longest title reigns for that specific title. For example tag team titles. If he were to pair up with someone, and go for the tag team titles he would talk about Demolition's longest tag team title reign in the history of the WWE being broken by he, and his partner. He could cut a promo, and tell someone when was the last time they won a title, or a had a title shot, and loss. He would humiliate his opponents because he would know more about their career than them, or at least call them out on things they may like to forget about.

Ohno needs a new finisher, and I feel like depth to character, and new finishing move are far more necessary right now than losing his belly fat. I'm not worried about his beard because they are easy to grow. With the amount of limited moves in the WWE I can understand why coming up with a finisher is so tough for these guys. However, I think his Dr.Teeth move is a solid finisher. Here is a video of moves that I think more than half he can certainly do right now in the WWE.


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

T Man said:


> No, Punk got it because WWE had already purchased the rights to use "Cult of Personality" when they used it for Stone Cold Steve Austin's Hall of Fame video package in 2009, or something like that. It was used on WWE television before Punk started using it.


:lmao that's not how that stuff works, trust me. you don't buy the usage rights like you buy a bottle of coke and it belongs to you forever. one thing is to use it for a one time ocasion, another is to use it every single week. its not even comparable financially.



truk83 said:


> Look take nothing away from Wyatt's character. I like how he plays the role. Wyatt can work in the ring like a Bam Bam Bigelow, or Terry Gordy. You can act like he can work well in the ring all you'd like, but you're wrong. It's the reason he was sent back to NXT to develop after the old NXT show.
> 
> The "KO" gimmick is not for Wade Barrett. The same way I could say that the Bray Wyatt character could not be played as well by someone like Curtis Axel. You catch my drift? Kassius Ohno can play the "KO" gimmick because that's been his character his whole career. I don't feel like that character just started in NXT. You can think that all you'd like, but once again I think you are wrong.
> 
> At the same time I also think that the "KO" gimmick is limited, and Ohno should add another dimension to his character. How about "Wrestling genius"? He would know all matches the WWE ever had, all title reigns, length of reigns, who won what title where, and when etc. He would incorporate this personality into all of his feuds where he would break down his opponents whole WWE career.
> 
> Obviously, when he is going to a title he would cut promos on the best, and longest title reigns for that specific title. For example tag team titles. If he were to pair up with someone, and go for the tag team titles he would talk about Demolition's longest tag team title reign in the history of the WWE being broken by he, and his partner. He could cut a promo, and tell someone when was the last time they won a title, or a had a title shot, and loss. He would humiliate his opponents because he would know more about their career than them, or at least call them out on things they may like to forget about.
> 
> Ohno needs a new finisher, and I feel like depth to character, and new finishing move are far more necessary right now than losing his belly fat. I'm not worried about his beard because they are easy to grow. With the amount of limited moves in the WWE I can understand why coming up with a finisher is so tough for these guys. However, I think his Dr.Teeth move is a solid finisher. Here is a video of moves that I think more than half he can certainly do right now in the WWE.


So you say his ring work is horrible and then you compare it to Bam Bam Bigelow and Terry Gordy, two of the greatest big men of all time? fpalm

wrestling genius gimmick is so geeky and boring. how are we supposed to get behind a guy whose appeal is great knowledge of history? does that make a fascinating character? no.


----------



## truk83

Tanaka vs Awesome said:


> :lmao that's not how that stuff works, trust me. you don't buy the usage rights like you buy a bottle of coke and it belongs to you forever. one thing is to use it for a one time ocasion, another is to use it every single week. its not even comparable financially.
> 
> 
> 
> So you say his ring work is horrible and then you compare it to Bam Bam Bigelow and Terry Gordy, two of the greatest big men of all time? fpalm
> 
> wrestling genius gimmick is so geeky and boring. how are we supposed to get behind a guy whose appeal is great knowledge of history? does that make a fascinating character? no.



You may think that Terry Gordy, and Bigelow are the greatest big men of all time, but I certainly don't think so. That's a matter of opinion.

Geeky, and boring? It's all about delivery. You can't criticize something you haven't seen. You've never seen Ohno play this role. In fact no one has. The character is one that has a high level of respect for this business, and is pissed that it's turning into "entertainment". His grudge is against the norm, and his honor is restored by the past.


----------



## x78

An anti-entertainment gimmick seems about right for Ohno based on his NXT work so far.


----------



## Asenath

x78 said:


> An anti-entertainment gimmick seems about right for Ohno based on his NXT work so far.


----------



## truk83

As for a finisher I think I have changed my mind to number 15, the "Pass Elbow". He does that so well, and it's certainly believable as a finisher. That could easily knock a man out.


----------



## papercuts_hurt

I like the wrestling genius idea, it could dovetail nicely with the "serious wrestler/KO artist" gimmick in that because he's so obsessed with competition, he obsessively watches tape like an NFL coach, breaking everyone down, and thus leading him to know everything everyone's done.

I think the KO gimmick can definitely work either way, and regardless he's just such a good wrestler he will succeed. I think Cesaro's level now would be good for him, guy they turn to for good matches all through the mid card. I would equate his ring ability with Cesaro's, Cesaro obviously can do incredible feats of strength but Ohno is more athletic (I fuckin love that dropkick through the ropes thing where he lands on his feet).

Thus my main concern for him is getting into whatever Vince/HHH/whoever deems appropriate WWE shape. There are any number of ways he can succeed when he comes up, and I do think they'll push him decently at first when he does make it, but he's been off NXT TV for like 3 months. I hope now with the new performance center and all he's working hard getting buff and soon he'll be back....

Also in response to the poster directly above, I love the pass elbow it's probably my favorite rolling elbow variation. He has in fact used it as a finish many times in FCW/NXT, but sadly the elbows were dropped from his repertoire around the beginning of the year after Barrett started establishing the (vastly inferior) bullhammer. I think they're different enough to coexist though. Esp with all KO's variants. Without the elbow his rolling arsenal was reduced to the discus knee (cool idea but harder to read) and once even that rolling headbutt (remember that guys??).


----------



## Jerichoholic274

papercuts_hurt said:


> I like the wrestling genius idea, it could dovetail nicely with the "serious wrestler/KO artist" gimmick in that because he's so obsessed with competition, he obsessively watches tape like an NFL coach, breaking everyone down, and thus leading him to know everything everyone's done.
> 
> I think the KO gimmick can definitely work either way, and regardless he's just such a good wrestler he will succeed. I think Cesaro's level now would be good for him, guy they turn to for good matches all through the mid card. I would equate his ring ability with Cesaro's, Cesaro obviously can do incredible feats of strength but Ohno is more athletic *(I fuckin love that dropkick through the ropes thing where he lands on his feet).*
> 
> Thus my main concern for him is getting into whatever Vince/HHH/whoever deems appropriate WWE shape. There are any number of ways he can succeed when he comes up, and I do think they'll push him decently at first when he does make it, but he's been off NXT TV for like 3 months. I hope now with the new performance center and all he's working hard getting buff and soon he'll be back....
> 
> Also in response to the poster directly above, I love the pass elbow it's probably my favorite rolling elbow variation. He has in fact used it as a finish many times in FCW/NXT, but sadly the elbows were dropped from his repertoire around the beginning of the year after Barrett started establishing the (vastly inferior) bullhammer. I think they're different enough to coexist though. Esp with all KO's variants. Without the elbow his rolling arsenal was reduced to the discus knee (cool idea but harder to read) and once even that rolling headbutt (remember that guys??).


That is a sweet move. I was watching an Ohno/Cesaro match from FCW where Ohno does his no hand moonault back into the ring when Cesaro ducks out of the ring, and then he hit that dropkick without stalling.

Regardless of how he looks, Ohno is incredibly agile for someone who's 6'4.

And I also think that Barett's 'ko' gimmick didn't work because when Barett came back, he was the exact same guy with a different finisher. They didn't even try to make him seem more violent or that he'd grown as a competitor.


----------



## RiverFenix

A pic found on twitter from last nights house show - 










I hate the ring gear, but he does look to be slimming down, or they've stitched spanx into his gear. I still think he needs the MVP style ring gear - it would be perfect for him.


----------



## THANOS

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> A pic found on twitter from last nights house show -
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hate the ring gear, but he does look to be slimming down, or they've stitched spanx into his gear. I still think he needs the MVP style ring gear - it would be perfect for him.


Well, if they didn't stick in spanx like you mentioned, it definitely looks like he's lost the love handles, and he only needs to put on muscle now which is good. I, to, hate that ring attire, because he looks too much like a scrawny Kevin Nash which is absolutely NOT the look he should be going for. He should wear Boxer shorts or MMA type gear with his gimmick.


----------



## normal situation

Good to see that Ohno is slimming down, at least. The outfit, as people have already said, looks bad. If they're gonna have him wear a shirt like that for now, I feel like it'd be better if he just wore his regular wrestling gear with it, kinda like this.


----------



## Wcthesecret

normal situation said:


> Good to see that Ohno is slimming down, at least. The outfit, as people have already said, looks bad. If they're gonna have him wear a shirt like that for now, I feel like it'd be better if he just wore his regular wrestling gear with it, kinda like this.


...why is he wearing a tank top?


----------



## Asenath

Because tummy pudge.


----------



## RiverFenix

In that Hero vs Colt pic, Kassius would be better off wearing the Cabana gear. I still think the MVP style garb would be the best for him.


----------



## Asenath

How is it possible for someone to be as beefy as Colt Cabana and have that pancake-y of an ass?

(I actually like trunks and tank top.)


----------



## Mon Joxley

Tanaka vs Awesome said:


> :lmao that's not how that stuff works, trust me. you don't buy the usage rights like you buy a bottle of coke and it belongs to you forever. one thing is to use it for a one time ocasion, another is to use it every single week. its not even comparable financially.


No need to laugh at me. 

Ok they may not have still had the rights, but I imagine it would have been easier for them to obtain it. Also, it's Living Color. If Punk had have asked for Metallica, creative probably would have laughed at him and gave him a Killswitch Engage CD.


----------



## Punkhead

Fuck WWE. They take away Chris hero from us and do nothing with him. In result, we lose Chris Hero and get nothing for it.


----------



## Tanaka vs Awesome

TomasThunder619 said:


> Fuck WWE. They take away Chris hero from us and do nothing with him. In result, we lose Chris Hero and get nothing for it.


why don't you blame chris hero for that? WWE didn't seem to have a problem with generico, castagnoli, PAC...


----------



## Lazyking

It's Hero's own fault if he doesn't want to work for a spot. He's no spring chicken anymore but that's no excuse for slacking off. WWE didn't just sign him for no reason.. I hope he gets back in shape.


----------



## BehindYou

And patience is a virtue. And there are rumors another Heyman guy is going to debut soon.

We know that KO is doing alot of strength stuff, he may well be preparing for TV.

Personally, I think a "heyman guy" is being wasted on the KO we have seen in NXT and if things were different... would of been a perfect debut for Cesaro.


----------



## THANOS

He posted this pic on twitter a couple days ago.










He looks like he's been working on his upper body for sure from that pic, as his chest looks a bit bigger and more defined. From that pic he at least looks Punk's size now, which is pretty good given that he's like 1/2 a foot taller than Punk at 6'6.


----------



## BornBad

Not bad. I bet he's on better shape than me and 85% of the forum


----------



## Brodus Clay

normal situation said:


>


This as to be one of the worst ring gears I ever saw.


----------



## THANOS

4hisdamnself said:


> Not bad. I bet he's on better shape than me and 85% of the forum


Yeah from that pic, it looks like he's in the best shape of his career, build wise anyway as he's always been well conditioned and athletic, and I think after another month or so of heavy lifting and good eating, he'll be Drew McIntyre size and will be fully ready for a call-up.


----------



## Brodus Clay

THANOS said:


> He posted this pic on twitter a couple days ago.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He looks like he's been working on his upper body for sure from that pic, as his chest looks a bit bigger and more defined. From that pic he at least looks Punk's size now, which is pretty good given that he's like 1/2 a foot taller than Punk at 6'6.


Shaved the beard?, well he looks like DDP right there!


----------



## Harbinger

The beard 

He's always been in ridiculously athletic. It's crazy how many 60 min+ matches this guys had. Conditioning and cardio has never been the issue. From that aspect he's been in better shape than most of the roster. It's always just been appearance. You'd think someone that athletic would tone up quickly, and it's looking good. Hope he keeps up on it. He's at the now or never age and he's almost blown it. As a huge fan I know I've soured on him based on what seems like laziness, so I really hope he can make the final push.


----------



## hidden202

birthday_massacre said:


> Some of the biggest stars ever in the WWE didnt look in shape. Mic Foley, Andre the Giant, Vader, the big show and Dusty Rhodes just to name a few.
> 
> And its funny you mentioned Cean and Ryback. Those are two of the most hated wrestlers in the WWE right now (oh sure kids love Cena but not adults).
> 
> Daniel Bryan is one of the most over wrestlers in the WWE and he does not have that superman look. Punk doesnt have the superman look either and he was champion for over 400 days.
> 
> Even look at a guy like Dean Ambrose he isnt jacked but the guy can wrestle and is in shape. He is going to be a huge star by next year.
> 
> I would take a roster full of guys like Dean Ambrose, Daniel Bryan and CM Punks over A roster full of guys like Cena and Ryback.
> 
> 
> 
> The superman look is 80s and is passe. The best wrestlers are the ones who are like Daniel Bryan, Punk, and Ziggler who can wrestler and sell great but dont look all roided up like Cena or Ryback.
> 
> 
> Lets just compare the roster of the top 5 roided up looks that you love or the ones who people claim are not in great shape but are still great.
> 
> Roided Roster
> 
> Cena
> Ryback
> Reigns
> Jackson
> Big E
> 
> Normal looking guys roster
> 
> Punk
> Daniel Bryan
> Ziggler And if you want to claim Ziggler looks too good for this group, replace him with Sandow).
> Ambrose
> Rollins
> 
> 
> You can take all the Ryback Big E, Jackson wrestlers all you want but those guys suck.
> 
> Give me a roster full of the latter any day.


I was reading through this topic and I saw this.


Prove that Big E Langston is on steroids, please.


----------



## Mon Joxley

And how the hell is Roman Reigns on steroids? Unless Luther Reigns is still employed..


----------



## Darkest Lariat

I don't understand HHH's logic here. I don't ever remember Flair being a chiseled beast and he's a 21 time world champion.


----------



## THANOS

DragonSleeper said:


> I don't understand HHH's logic here. I don't ever remember Flair being a chiseled beast and he's a 21 time world champion.


He was no :HHH2 but he was definitely built in his prime.


----------



## Darkest Lariat

Alright, bad example. I'm used to 90's WCW Flair. We didn't get NWA up here when I was a kid. But you get what I mean. There have been plenty of top guys who weren't gorillas.


----------



## Harbinger

Flair still looked good in 00. That was the beginning of his flabfest. All before he looked good, while not jacked. 

To be fair, I don't think image is the real issue. I think they'd like a good image, but the real issue is that he didnt follow through when they asked him to do something. It comes off as lazy, arrogant, and unreliable. I totally understand why they haven't pushed him. Like i said, I really hope he can turn around. He's a top talent.


----------



## Darkest Lariat

3VK said:


> Flair still looked good in 00. That was the beginning of his flabfest. All before he looked good, while not jacked.
> 
> To be fair, I don't think image is the real issue. I think they'd like a good image, but the real issue is that he didnt follow through when they asked him to do something. It comes off as lazy, arrogant, and unreliable. I totally understand why they haven't pushed him. Like i said, I really hope he can turn around. He's a top talent.


The guy came up in the indies with Punk who's now been the longest reigning champion. This is probably his way of protesting without saying anything. And I don't blame him. The guy should've been on WWE tv a long time ago.


----------



## Harbinger

DragonSleeper said:


> The guy came up in the indies with Punk who's now been the longest reigning champion. This is probably his way of protesting without saying anything. And I don't blame him. The guy should've been on WWE tv a long time ago.


Talent-wise, yes. Unfortunately you need more than talent to succeed in the WWE. If it were really a "silent protest", which I doubt, that's absolutely childish and I wouldn't push or promote him if I ran a company either. Again, it comes down to motivation and not listening to management. I think he just had the mindset that he knows best for himself because he did do everything on his own up until WWE. But I doubt he was pulling hissy fits. Again, I hope he figures it out because he's awesome. 

As for the Punk comparison, he also broke in with Colt Cabana. Make that comparison too. Some guys just make it, and some guys don't. Talent should, but doesn't, play a huge part. It's just how things are. Punk made the most of every leg up he got. He's one of the biggest wrestling stars in the world now. I'm sure there's some professional jealousy, but to go as far as making silent protests...doubtful.


----------



## truk83

3VK said:


> Talent-wise, yes. Unfortunately you need more than talent to succeed in the WWE. If it were really a "silent protest", which I doubt, that's absolutely childish and I wouldn't push or promote him if I ran a company either. Again, it comes down to motivation and not listening to management. I think he just had the mindset that he knows best for himself because he did do everything on his own up until WWE. But I doubt he was pulling hissy fits. Again, I hope he figures it out because he's awesome.
> 
> As for the Punk comparison, he also broke in with Colt Cabana. Make that comparison too. Some guys just make it, and some guys don't. Talent should, but doesn't, play a huge part. It's just how things are. Punk made the most of every leg up he got. He's one of the biggest wrestling stars in the world now. I'm sure there's some professional jealousy, but to go as far as making silent protests...doubtful.


From what I understand if it weren't for Heyman, and more importantly HBK CM Punk wouldn't have been pushed when he was, and called up to the main roster, and at that time ECW. Had those two men not spoken up for this man I'm not sure he is where he is right now in terms of stardom based on angles, and WWE title reign.


----------



## Harbinger

truk83 said:


> From what I understand if it weren't for Heyman, and more importantly HBK CM Punk wouldn't have been pushed when he was, and called up to the main roster, and at that time ECW. Had those two men not spoken up for this man I'm not sure he is where he is right now in terms of stardom based on angles, and WWE title reign.


Exactly! I mean Punk happens to be one of the most talented guys in the business, but his breakthrough is largely based on the right pull backstage and the extreme (no pun intended) amount of work ethic he showed in FCW and subsequently in ECW


----------



## Mon Joxley

3VK said:


> Exactly! I mean Punk happens to be one of the most talented guys in the business, but his breakthrough is largely based on the right pull backstage and the extreme (no pun intended) amount of work ethic he showed in FCW and subsequently in ECW


*OVW. FCW wasn't around then. But I agree wholeheartedly, as big of a fan of Punk's as I am, he was pretty much at the right place at the right time. Especially considering he got to keep his name as well.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

> - We’ve noted how Kassius Ohno has had heat in WWE developmental and was pulled from NXT TV tapings because officials wanted him to improve his physique. Ohno has been putting over other talents at recent NXT live events and has now been removed from the NXT TV intro.


Source: Wrestling Observer Newsletter

This was probably already noticeable, but hope he can bounce back.


----------



## Jof

Harbinger said:


> Flair still looked good in 00. That was the beginning of his flabfest. All before he looked good, while not jacked.
> 
> To be fair, I don't think image is the real issue. I think they'd like a good image, but the real issue is that he didnt follow through when they asked him to do something. It comes off as lazy, arrogant, and unreliable. I totally understand why they haven't pushed him. Like i said, I really hope he can turn around. He's a top talent.


This.


----------



## Stanford

Bloody hell, they _really_ don't like the guy.


----------



## Jof

Has anyone ever confirmed that HBK story regarding punk? I mean Dave lagana was the only one who said that and he's huge huge shawn Michaels mark. He even went as far to advertise Shawn's twitter account, when he made a new one, in his tweets requesting his followers to follow Shawn. Punk himself doesn't seem to be all that attached to Michaels as he is with lot others, heck I don't think he even gives a shit about HBK. 

Heyman obviously had a huge role in Punk's success today. I'm just skeptical on the hbk story. The cream always rises to the top anyways, I believe Punk would still be big star today even if the story is true.


----------



## Wcthesecret

Jof said:


> Has anyone ever confirmed that HBK story regarding punk? I mean Dave lagana was the only one who said that and he's huge huge shawn Michaels mark. He even went as far to advertise Shawn's twitter account, when he made a new one, in his tweets requesting his followers to follow Shawn. Punk himself doesn't seem to be all that attached to Michaels as he with lot others, heck I don't think he even gives a shit about HBK.
> 
> Heyman obviously had a huge role in Punk's success today. I'm just skeptical on the hbk story. The cream always rises to the top anyways, I believe Punk would still be big star today even if the story is true.


...dude...what the fuck are you talking about?


----------



## Jof

I just wanna know if the HBK story about helping out Punk is true or not?


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

I also must say, I really didn't like that recent pic posted with him in his new gear and the dude in the head lock. He has some weird fake looking face...like he's not himself. Technically it's just a pic, but that's the vibe I get.


----------



## doctor doom

Arn Anderson was a lot "fatter" than others, that didn't make him any less of a wrestler


----------



## Jof

Different era dude.


----------



## BehindYou

Arn Anderson is a top 25 talent in pro-wrestling history IMO.

Lookwise he looked like he could hurt you and that was really what his gimmick was. Sure, he wasn't ripped but he was as thick as they came with a big back, shoulders, chest and arms....


Its not remotely comparable, before you even factor what the standard of the times was.


----------



## Stanford

doctor doom said:


> Arn Anderson was a lot "fatter" than others, that didn't make him any less of a wrestler


If KO had AA's body, he'd be on the main roster already.


----------



## Lazyking

Ohno is not 5'10.. he's 6'4 and needs to be in a Shape where his gut isn't hanging out. I don't know why he can't look like he did just a few years ago. Just pure laziness to me.


----------



## mblonde09

I really don't see what the problem is, and to take him off TV because he hasn't improved his physique, is just downright petty, as far as I'm concerned. It's not a big deal, really... especially when you look at the awful physique's of legit fighters like Josh Barnett, Ben Rothwell and Roy Nelson.



Lazyking said:


> Ohno is not 5'10.. he's 6'4 and needs to be in a Shape where his gut isn't hanging out. I don't know why he can't look like he did just a few years ago. Just pure laziness to me.


From what I can see, he's always had some kind of gut/belly. Some people just have a certain body-type - and his, is obviously long and lean. Also, wasn't he on steroids at some point?


----------



## Lazyking

mblonde09 said:


> I really don't see what the problem is, and to take him off TV because he hasn't improved his physique, is just downright petty, as far as I'm concerned. It's not a big deal, really... especially when you look at the awful physique's of legit fighters like Josh Barnett, Ben Rothwell and Roy Nelson.


Pro Wrestling is an image biz. Not as much as it was before.. but I don't think they're asking for too much.. obviously when they signed him, the weight was not an issue. He was on tv.. then it got worse. If your employer asks you to do something, you do it.

I don't think they're asking for him to look like Cena..


----------



## varney

mblonde09 said:


> I really don't see what the problem is, and to take him off TV because he hasn't improved his physique, is just downright petty, as far as I'm concerned. It's not a big deal, really... especially when you look at the awful physique's of legit fighters like Josh Barnett, Ben Rothwell and Roy Nelson.
> 
> 
> From what I can see, he's always had some kind of gut/belly. Some people just have a certain body-type - and his, is obviously long and lean. Also, wasn't he on steroids at some point?



No he failed a steroids test but it was later revealed his body naturally creates above average levels of testosterone which why his test was red flagged. His above average levels might have something to do with his body not losing weight as fast as others can.


----------



## Waffelz

Bray Wyatt, Tensai, Brodus Clay ect. are all fat lumps.


----------



## RiverFenix

He's been out of the NXT opening for 4-5 weeks now - that's not new or an escalation of his punishment situation.


----------



## BehindYou

mblonde09 said:


> I really don't see what the problem is, and to take him off TV because he hasn't improved his physique, is just downright petty, as far as I'm concerned. It's not a big deal, really... especially when you look at the awful physique's of legit fighters like Josh Barnett, Ben Rothwell and Roy Nelson.
> 
> 
> From what I can see, he's always had some kind of gut/belly. Some people just have a certain body-type - and his, is obviously long and lean. Also, wasn't he on steroids at some point?


Isnt the reason that legit fighters can have bad physiques is that their well....legit fighter? No fighter would ever be held back by appearance because its not part of their industry....there industry is about winning matches.

A huge aspect of wrestling is appearances. 

I can see the long part of his body.... where's the lean? Chest i guess:|


----------



## SUPAH STRONG STYLE

Would it be okay to question Bray Wyatt then? I get he's supposed to be a bigger guy, but come on. 

Guy looks like some trailer trash I could find in the shitty end of PA. He doesn't relatively look like a threat. Just a guy who would chase you out with a shotgun if you were dating his daughter. 

Honestly, that's at least how I said it. I mentioned it before though, I get why they took him off TV initally. But Jesus, STILL keeping him off? There have been others in worse of shape.


----------



## Stanford

Waffelz said:


> Bray Wyatt, Tensai, Brodus Clay ect. are all fat lumps.


What's your point?


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

mblonde09 said:


> I really don't see what the problem is, and to take him off TV because he hasn't improved his physique, is just downright petty, as far as I'm concerned. It's not a big deal, really... especially when you look at the awful physique's of legit fighters like Josh Barnett, Ben Rothwell and Roy Nelson.
> 
> 
> From what I can see, he's always had some kind of gut/belly. Some people just have a certain body-type - and his, is obviously long and lean. Also, wasn't he on steroids at some point?


I think he might have had some strong attitude towards WWE wanting him to at least put some effort in to shaping up, which then lead to the heat, and only continued to build up from there.


----------



## BehindYou

SideburnGuru said:


> Would it be okay to question Bray Wyatt then? I get he's supposed to be a bigger guy, but come on.
> 
> Guy looks like some trailer trash I could find in the shitty end of PA. He doesn't relatively look like a threat. Just a guy who would chase you out with a shotgun if you were dating his daughter.
> 
> Honestly, that's at least how I said it. I mentioned it before though, I get why they took him off TV initally. But Jesus, STILL keeping him off? There have been others in worse of shape.


 Pretty sure Bray Wyatt's character is based on him being backwater hick trailer trash............


----------



## mblonde09

Bo Dallas is not in such great shape, has moobs and yet they still keep his ugly arse on TV.


----------



## Waffelz

Stanford said:


> What's your point?


They all get TV time, and they aren't half as talented as Hero.


----------



## RiverFenix

Waffelz said:


> Bray Wyatt, Tensai, Brodus Clay ect. are all fat lumps.


Brodus was fired once from developmental back in the Deep South days, lost 100lbs and was rehired. Bray Wyatt was dropped from wwe programming as a member of Nexus because he was letting himself go - back down to developmental to shed weight. Kassius is likely singled out now because he just looks sloppy - he's almost be better off gaining 50-60 lbs and be a fatter guy than being a skinny fat type with muffin tops and gut hanging over your trunks. It was like he's too lazy to commit to eating cleaner and putting in the work to drop the 20lbs. He might have a bad body type and was a former fatty, but it just means he has to work harder and eat cleaner - sucks to have bad genetics in this area, but then again he's 6'4", so he has advantages as well for being a pro wrestler over guys that are 5'8". It's about maximizing what you got and Ohno wasn't doing that.


----------



## THANOS

Waffelz said:


> They all get TV time, and they aren't half as talented as Hero.


Overall no, but Bray Wyatt, to single him out, is much more in tune with his character and promo work, than Hero has shown in his time with WWE, and I'm a huge Hero fan. I don't know what's with that guy, but he's much more capable than the in-ring/promo work he's shown us thus far down there, and it's dumbfounding to watch.


----------



## Emotion Blur

LOL @ people thinking that Clay, Tensai, Wyatt, etc. can be lumped into the argument against KO. If KO wants to gain 120+ pounds and base his entire image around being a "larger than life" character then you can start bringing up those other guys. But KO's entire gimmick is just knocking people out and as long as he intends to look like an athlete then he needs to look like the athlete WWE wants him to be. WWE is terribly image conscience and in many respects, your look outweighs your ability to wrestle or talk (and it's been that way since WWE has been around). WWE did not hire him solely for his ring skills, they hired him because they believe that he has a marketable look (or can get into marketable look shape, otherwise what use is he?)--if KO suddenly starts looking pudgey (relative to how he used to/should look), then his image is becoming less marketable which is a big deal to a corporation. Clay, Tensai, Wyatt, etc. were all hired because they are "big men" and WWE had the gimmicks to suit them--you can sell these guys as being "large." If any of those guys started veering towards too skinny/too big, then WWE would raise issue with them as well. KO needs to be sold as a regular-sized athlete who can legitimately compete with other superstars--if he comes out looking lanky and out of shape, it destroys his credibility, and therefore destroys his marketability. It would be the same argument if Ohno was looking a little too skinny. WWE is not claiming that there's no room for pudgey/fat/overweight/ugly guys, but there's no room for a pudgey/fat/overweight/ugly Kassius Ohno.


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7

Jof said:


> Has anyone ever confirmed that HBK story regarding punk? I mean Dave lagana was the only one who said that and he's huge huge shawn Michaels mark. He even went as far to advertise Shawn's twitter account, when he made a new one, in his tweets requesting his followers to follow Shawn. Punk himself doesn't seem to be all that attached to Michaels as he is with lot others, heck I don't think he even gives a shit about HBK.
> 
> Heyman obviously had a huge role in Punk's success today. I'm just skeptical on the hbk story. The cream always rises to the top anyways, I believe Punk would still be big star today even if the story is true.


I think Punk might have hinted about it in an interview. I could be wrong.


----------



## Wcthesecret

JoseDRiveraTCR7 said:


> I think Punk might have hinted about it in an interview. I could be wrong.


...what does that have to do with kassius Ohno?


----------



## Stanford

Waffelz said:


> They all get TV time, and they aren't half as talented as Hero.


Completely different body types and working styles. No comparison to be made.


----------



## JoseBxNYC

He should have gotten in shape by now. This guy is a joke. You can get results as soon as 6 weeks.


----------



## NO!

Based on that recent picture I saw from his twitter, he looks fine to me.


----------



## mblonde09

This just smacks of 'pick on the indy guy', to me.



JoseBxNYC said:


> He should have gotten in shape by now. This guy is a joke. *You can get results as soon as 6 weeks.*


Well thank you, Jennifer Nicole Lee.


----------



## x78

mblonde09 said:


> This just smacks of 'pick on the indy guy', to me.


No, it smacks of a guy who looked a complete mess and whose work was completely substandard being taken off TV and given time to get his act together.


----------



## Muerte al fascismo

If they're not going to call up Hero, can they just release him out his contract, rather then be the victim of the WWE environment. Hero could be doing so much more.


----------



## TankOfRate

It might just be the ring gear, but he looks awful in the recent live event pictures. Like haggard, potential methhead kind of bad. He looks a lot worse slimmed down like he is now than he did with his love handles before they took him off TV. He needs to join The Shield and Crossfit it the fuck up.


----------



## BornBad




----------



## Stanford

Looks better in that pic.


----------



## THANOS

4hisdamnself said:


>


I hate the attire, but I suppose he's just wearing it until he's in shape, or at least I hope that's the case. He's looking quite ripped in that pic in the arms and chest, and his mid section looks way slimmed down compared to how it used to be.


----------



## x78

Yeah, he does look somewhat better there. The attire is still very amateur-looking but it's at least better than what he had before and gives him a chance of getting over. I'd like to see him trade the long pants for Lesnar-style shorts.


----------



## THANOS

x78 said:


> Yeah, he does look somewhat better there. The attire is still very amateur-looking but it's at least better than what he had before and gives him a chance of getting over. *I'd like to see him trade the long pants for Lesnar-style shorts.*


That's a great idea! Keep the top until his build is amazing, and add some boxing shorts, and his look will completely fit his gimmick!


----------



## Smitson

x78 said:


> No, it smacks of a guy who looked a complete mess and whose work was completely substandard being taken off TV and given time to get his act together.


How anyone can play that card with the current push Daniel Bryan is getting is beyond me.


----------



## Lazyking

Smitson said:


> How anyone can play that card with the current push Daniel Bryan is getting is beyond me.


Bryan is well established in the WWE and over. He can look the way he does (which isn't awful ) work his ass off and be fine. Ohno isn't afforded the same luxury. Letting himself go, not working hard shows WWE he doesn't deserve the opportunity.


----------



## Harbinger

THANOS said:


> I hate the attire, but I suppose he's just wearing it until he's in shape, or at least I hope that's the case. He's looking quite ripped in that pic in the arms and chest, and his mid section looks way slimmed down compared to how it used to be.


That doesn't bother me. The tights and sleeveless at least go together. Much better than the sleeveless and short trunks. That was just fucking weird. 

Remember guys, it's only been a month or so. He's looking much better from what I've seen so I really hope he's going to get passed this speed bump and onto some TV time.


----------



## E N F O R C E R

Doesn't help with Barrett stealing his gimmick. Hope the guy gets a call up.


----------



## Stanford

E N F O R C E R said:


> Doesn't help with Barrett stealing his gimmick. Hope the guy gets a call up.


Barrett has a gimmick?


----------



## vincent k. mcmahon

Muerte al fascismo said:


> If they're not going to call up Hero, can they just release him out his contract, rather then be the victim of the WWE environment. Hero could be doing so much more.


lol wut?

hero wants to succeed in the wwe because hero wants to make money


----------



## Ham and Egger

This guy looks like a jobber in his attire. There's no hope for him.


----------



## Screwball

Stanford said:


> Barrett has a gimmick?


#badnewsbarrett


----------



## WutChagoNAdoBrothA

can't believe Hero is fucking around like this

works his whole life for this and then ....mehh ill let myself go


----------



## THANOS

> At tonight's WWE NXT tapings from Full Sail University, Kassius Ohno made his in-ring return after being absent for the past few sets of tapings. According to correspondents, *Ohno looked to be "better than ever."*
> 
> As noted earlier, Kassius Ohno had heat in WWE developmental and was pulled from NXT TV tapings because officials wanted him to work on his physique. Ohno was also removed from the NXT TV intro.
> 
> Source: lordsofpain.net


Interesting.

He does seem to look a bit better in the chest.


----------



## Harbinger

Mid section looks way better. Really really hope he's turned it around. Not enough CRAVATE in WWE.


----------



## THANOS

Harbinger said:


> Mid section looks way better. Really really hope he's turned it around. Not enough CRAVATE in WWE.


Agreed and I'm glad he's not wearing those long tights and singlet.


----------



## RiverFenix

He should use this ring gear - 









Or even the sleevless version -


----------



## Mon Joxley

Pretty sure the horrible singlet was just to get people talking/fool internet fans.


----------



## LIL' WINNING FOOT

Nice to see Ohno looking way better. People need to understand that pro wrestling, especially now, is a cosmetics business as much as it is as an athletic one. Personally, I started out at 290 pounds when I first began training and my look was TERRIBLE. Horrible cardio, unappealing look, etc. Lost about 45-50 pounds and my build looks way toned, better, cardio improved, healthier. That's what the business expects from you. They want to see if you have the hard work ethic to look a certain way to them, not so much as looking the part.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

He looks better for sure.


----------



## McNugget

Dude looks much better. I think the main thing to note is that he's put on a lot of muscle, not necessarily trimmed up the fat. But the muscle really helps to disguise the fat, which is why guys like Punk, James Storm, and even HHH at times could get away with a bit of a jiggle.


----------



## Asenath

THANOS said:


> Agreed and I'm glad he's not wearing those long tights and singlet.


You are not kidding. Those seemed to make him look paradoxically chubbier.


----------



## BornBad




----------



## Mr. I

Apparently the NXT crowd is incapable of taking a clear photo of him standing there.


----------



## THANOS

4hisdamnself said:


>


Well from that picture it's obvious that he's done some serious weight lifting. He looks quite ripped.



Ithil said:


> Apparently the NXT crowd is incapable of taking a clear photo of him standing there.


This is true, but that picture does show that a lot of progress has been made.


----------



## RiverFenix

Ithil said:


> Apparently the NXT crowd is incapable of taking a clear photo of him standing there.


----------



## Wcthesecret

DetroitRiverPhx said:


>


Oh sure they might be able to do a side photo but they aren't even to pull off a full frontal.


----------



## Harbinger

Anybody know which week his return will air? I don't read spoilers so idk


----------



## BornBad

Harbinger said:


> Anybody know which week his return will air? I don't read spoilers so idk


October 9


----------



## Harbinger

Thanks, I'm looking forward to it!


----------



## Interceptor88

Well, he has improved, which is a good thing.


----------



## Shepard

DetroitRiverPhx said:


>



He certainly looks a lot better there. He's up against a solid opponent too. Lets see if he can deliver the goods in the ring now/keep up his shape consistently too.


----------



## THANOS

Shepard said:


> He certainly looks a lot better there. He's up against a solid opponent too. Lets see if he can deliver the goods in the ring now/keep up his shape consistently too.


He actually has some tone now which should only help his boxing gimmick look more legit, since most boxers, bar Butterbean, look to be chiseled and in great athletic shape. I hope he structures his moveset to predominantly use only his most athletic and unique looking moves as well. Hopefully he's allowed to use the Rolling Elbow as his finish once again as well.


----------



## Shepard

Barrett still has his elbow right? Can't see Ohno being given the rolling elbow if thats the case. Which if he's good enough shouldn't be a hindrance to him. It hasn't affected other talents who've switched up a few moves. I'd be happy if he just focused more on his cravates or whatever. Or threw Cyclone kill in there.


----------



## Harbinger

Ohno's done so many awesome and unique moves over the years I can't see him having a trouble finding a good finisher. Like I've said, he's a ridiculous athlete/competitor for someone so flabby.


----------



## THANOS

Shepard said:


> Barrett still has his elbow right? Can't see Ohno being given the rolling elbow if thats the case. Which if he's good enough shouldn't be a hindrance to him. It hasn't affected other talents who've switched up a few moves. I'd be happy if he just focused more on his cravates or whatever. Or threw Cyclone kill in there.


The big issue with this is his entire gimmick is supposed to be a knockout artist, with his initals even being K.O. to really drive home that point. Using a finisher that doesn't look like a knockout type move would really diminsh that entire concept. I think the Rolling Elbow is much different in look and impact than the Bull Hammer so I think both of them using elbow variations shouldn't be too much of a problem. I like the Cyclone Kill but I don't think they'll allow him to use that since it is even more similar to the Brogue Kick than his elbow is to Barrett's. I seem to be correct about that, since the last time he was on NXT he was winning matches with a Cyclone Kill "knee" instead of "Yakuza kick".


----------



## Harbinger

They might have Barrett change things up. It's not like they give a shit about him anyway. Unfortunate, but undeniable.


----------



## Nostalgia

This guy is going to be 34 in a few months. It's now or never with him.



Shepard said:


> Barrett still has his elbow right? Can't see Ohno being given the rolling elbow if thats the case. Which if he's good enough shouldn't be a hindrance to him. It hasn't affected other talents who've switched up a few moves. I'd be happy if he just focused more on his cravates or whatever. Or threw Cyclone kill in there.


Yes, but Barrett hasn't used it in a while because... you know... he never wins matches. 

Ohno's variation looks better imo.


----------



## Genking48

Didn't he use the elbow since he first got to WWE, even when Barrett had it? I don't remember him having had other finishers than the elbow since coming.


----------



## Nostalgia

Tinkerbell said:


> Didn't he use the elbow since he first got to WWE, even when Barrett had it? I don't remember him having had other finishers than the elbow since coming.


Pretty sure he was using it before Barrett down in developmental, that's why some people were complaining when Barrett was given that move (I recall a lot of ranting from THANOS over it ).


----------



## Daiko

That Ohno :mark:
That yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah :mark:

This match should have meant that Wyatt was coming home, but I don't see no Wyatt :kolo2


----------



## papercuts_hurt

RE: Ohno's finisher, he used the KO til Barrett started using the Bullhammer at the end of last year, then stopped - so I guess they did deem it too similar, even though I think both could fly because they look pretty different, and cause Barrett never wins haha. After he stopped using the elbow, he started using a modified cyclone kill with a knee instead of a boot, but IIRC never pinned anyone with it, but instead used it to set up the Kassius Clutch which is like an inverted cravat submission. It's a cool move and the rolling knee is cool too but the elbow is just aces and I hope he can use it again...


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Daiko said:


> That Ohno :mark:
> That *yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah* :mark:
> 
> This match should have meant that Wyatt was coming home, but I don't see no Wyatt :kolo2


That's one of the most hilarious things in WWE atm. :lol Luke may grow on me.


----------



## Harbinger

First feud should be Ohno vs Rusev? Money.


----------



## Cotmas

The time he has spent out of the ring has certainly been used well in terms of how he looks so hopefully he can at the very least maintain this shape if so all he needs to do is produce the goods in the ring and he will be fine.


----------



## JoseBxNYC

Ohno is losing weight little by little


----------



## Amber B

Ohno's body will always look like a melted candle so WWE will just have to deal with it or stop wasting his time and let him know.
You can eat clean, go to the gym 7 days a week but sometimes, certain genetics will always win.


----------



## Stanford

Seems to me that if he built up his chest and arms, the belly fat would be completely unimportant.


----------



## truk83

Amazing, still talking about belly fat. :clap


----------



## Stanford

truk83 said:


> Amazing, still talking about belly fat. :clap


Is this something I'm guilty of often? I'm not really sure what this comment is supposed to mean.


----------



## JoseBxNYC

The belly fat will melt down. Is more about diet than anything. I follow a good diet while on cuts and do very little ab work and the fat just melts eventually. 80% Diet/Rest 20% Training


----------



## RiverFenix

Why not try liposuction on the muffin tops?


----------



## THANOS

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Why not try liposuction on the muffin tops?


If he keeps doing what he's doing, I have no reason to believe he'll need do. He's been off tv for maybe a couple months and has seemingly shed all of the belly fat, has toned up his chest, and is primed to start adding muscle and defining his abs. I still think wwith the right amount of work he can strive to achieve a body similar to Drew McIntyre's back when he was the "Chosen One".


----------



## Harbinger

He wears his tights kinda low he should just pull them up and tuck in the flab like ADR does. That guys all flab but his tights come up to his belly button so you can't really tell.


----------



## THANOS

Harbinger said:


> He wears his tights kinda low he should just pull them up and tuck in the flab like ADR does. That guys all flab but his tights come up to his belly button so you can't really tell.


That's a good point but he might not need to. At the pace he's going at the fitness centre, he'll be in elite shape by the end of the year.


----------



## #dealwithit

He's looking better. Hopefully he keeps up the hard work, and he'll be on the full roster in no time.



> Ohno's body will always look like a melted candle so WWE will just have to deal with it or stop wasting his time and let him know.
> You can eat clean, go to the gym 7 days a week but sometimes, certain genetics will always win.


I get what you're saying in that he's wide in the hip, so he'll never look like an John Morrison, but I think if he does work hard on his appearance he could look more athletic.


----------



## Harbinger

Amber B said:


> Ohno's body will always look like a melted candle so WWE will just have to deal with it or stop wasting his time and let him know.
> You can eat clean, go to the gym 7 days a week but sometimes, certain genetics will always win.


Again, I don't think the look was really the issue. I think the problem was that he was told to do something and didn't do it for the longest time. Like I said, if I ran a business and my employee wasn't doing what they were supposed to, I'd be pissed too.


----------



## truk83

Harbinger said:


> Again, I don't think the look was really the issue. I think the problem was that he was told to do something and didn't do it for the longest time. Like I said, if I ran a business and my employee wasn't doing what they were supposed to, I'd be pissed too.


This. :clap


----------



## BornBad

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Why not try liposuction on the muffin tops?


Back in the days Ohno used to be 350 lbs, why a lipôsuction ? you just can fuck with genetics


And Edge had a fat belly the last few years too, nobody really gave a shit


----------



## Crozer

he just lost in a match against Sawyer Fulton, this was his 3rd time losing to Sawyer.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Harbinger said:


> Again, I don't think the look was really the issue. I think the problem was that he was told to do something and didn't do it for the longest time. Like I said, if I ran a business and my employee wasn't doing what they were supposed to, I'd be pissed too.


Most likely. I've been saying this as well. WWE probably has a routine that he just isn't doing which lead to some heat backstage. His look really can't be that big of a deal.


----------



## RiverFenix

^Was it a "battle of the shittiest ring gear" match?


----------



## Crozer

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> ^Was it a "battle of the shittiest ring gear" match?


Uhh no. It was a battle of the shittiest ring gear on a pole match :russo


----------



## RodnyElectro

I was there... the match was not bad not good but the gear was horrible especially Ohno!


----------



## THANOS

RodnyElectro said:


> I was there... the match was not bad not good but the gear was horrible especially Ohno!


I haven't seen a recent pic of him without his jacket on yet, do his arms look bigger and/or ripped? Or is he still really gangly?


----------



## Ham and Egger

Dude is done, WWE should release this guy already.


----------



## Mr. I

Ham and Egger said:


> Dude is done, WWE should release this guy already.


They should release a world class talent who is improving his physique because....?


----------



## Ham and Egger

This guy hasn't proved shit since working in developmental. His in ring work and promos hasn't set the world on fire down in Florida. I'd be surprised if he even makes it to the main roster and if he does he should be a tag team guy at best.


----------



## E N F O R C E R

Really doesn't help when Barrett steals your gimmick...


----------



## lee20794

Ham and Egger said:


> This guy hasn't proved shit since working in developmental. His in ring work and promos hasn't set the world on fire down in Florida. I'd be surprised if he even makes it to the main roster and if he does he should be a tag team guy at best.


Spot on. Everyone keeps saying how great he is, but he hasn't proved anything in developmental that makes you say he should be in the main roster.


----------



## TheGreatBanana

Kassius is *so overrated*. I don't see what is so special about him. When people rave about Ambrose, you notice why. Same with Rollins. Same with Cesaro. Same with Zayn. Same with Wyatt. I can see why they are special. 

I have watched a lot of Ohno material and he is just another dude. His not special at all. Even guys like Woods and Amore have impressed me more.


----------



## THANOS

TheGreatBanana said:


> Kassius is *so overrated*. I don't see what is so special about him. When people rave about Ambrose, you notice why. Same with Rollins. Same with Cesaro. Same with Zayn. Same with Wyatt. I can see why they are special.
> 
> I have watched a lot of Ohno material and he is just another dude. His not special at all. Even guys like Woods and Amore have impressed me more.


When you say you've watched a lot of Ohno material, do you only mean NXT/FCW? Or ROH, CZW, IWA as well? Because the latter options are why so many people hyped Ohno and also why so many people are upset with his developmental work because of the drastic difference in quality.


----------



## moazzam23

Looking forward to Ohno vs Harper in a few weeks. Hopefully Ohno turns it around with his weight problems.


----------



## truk83

lee20794 said:


> Spot on. Everyone keeps saying how great he is, but he hasn't proved anything in developmental that makes you say he should be in the main roster.


Not a single person on the main roster that was from NXT as we know it now has done anything when they were in NXT. Big E Langston didn't t do anything other than win a title that no one gives two shits about. The same can be said for The Shield, Wyatt, and Fandango. These stars did nothing in NXT that was special, and those that know about it are a minority. The Wyatt Family made their name on the main roster not in NXT. The Shield weren't doing anything special when they weren't even The Shield, and in NXT. Rollins was in developmental for two years going back to FCW days. 

Reigns was a hardly of significance. Ambrose had one strong feud with Regal, and some classic matches with Rollins, but no one cares about those now because it was FCW. People hardly pay attention to NXT now. Who cared about FCW? Ohno would make his mark on the main roster, and would entertain the fans. His ring work alone sets him apart from 90% of the main roster. He is one of the best in the world, and that's not an Ohno mark, it's the truth. He has already had classic matches with Punk, and Bryan. Do you know who those two men are? Have you heard what they have said about their friend?


----------



## Mister Hands

truk83 said:


> The Wyatt Family made their name on the main roster not in NXT.


Eh, calling bullshit on that.


----------



## stonefort

NXT matters for 2 reasons:
1) To impress WWE HQ that you are good enough and reliable enough for the main roster.
2) To impress hard-core wrestling nerds and build up some buzz around your name.

#1 is a approximately 1000x more important than #2.


----------



## LIL' WINNING FOOT

I will say 2014 is now or never for Ohno. Either let him finally make his debut and just fucking pair him Cesaro as it should have been in the first place or let him go and not let him rot in developmental so he can go back to the Indys for a final strong run before he calls it quits.

I will say FCW/NXT Hero has been very lackluster in every aspect, which is a shame since I KNOW he can do way better than that.


----------



## THANOS

stonefort said:


> NXT matters for 2 reasons:
> 1) To impress WWE HQ that you are good enough and reliable enough for the main roster.
> 2) To impress hard-core wrestling nerds and build up some buzz around your name.
> 
> #1 is a approximately 1000x more important than #2.


And #1, from all the reports we've read, seems to apply to Ohno. They are very high on his performances down there from everything we've heard, but just want him to get in better shape before he's called up!


----------



## x78

THANOS said:


> And #1, from all the reports we've read, seems to apply to Ohno. They are very high on his performances down there from everything we've heard, but just want him to get in better shape before he's called up!


I know you keep saying this, it's great that you have faith in your guy and I saw the dirtsheet that reported this too, but if really they were high on his performance I doubt he would be taken off TV for months and I doubt he would be repeatedly jobbed out at NXT live events to complete rookies. You've said yourself that he has been poor on NXT, virtually everyone that isn't a complete mark admits that his performance hasn't been up to scratch, he hasn't worked any main roster house shows and was taken off TV without explanation when he was due a tag-team title opportunity. I really have to question the validity of that dirtsheet report that claims they're high on his work.


----------



## THANOS

x78 said:


> I know you keep saying this, it's great that you have faith in your guy and I saw the dirtsheet that reported this too, but if really they were high on his performance I doubt he would be taken off TV for months and I doubt he would be repeatedly jobbed out at NXT live events to complete rookies. You've said yourself that he has been poor on NXT, virtually everyone that isn't a complete mark admits that his performance hasn't been up to scratch, he hasn't worked any main roster house shows and was taken off TV without explanation when he was due a tag-team title opportunity. I really have to question the validity of that dirtsheet report.


You do need to keep in mind that Ambrose was kept off NXT entirely to prepare for his debut, by hitting the weights and waiting for his storyline to fall in place. The same could be happening with Ohno currently. I know it didn't happen with Wyatt, Rollins, Reigns or Cesaro, as they were all wrestling still on FCW/NXT when they were promoted, but the situation did exist with Ambrose. I think with the comments we've heard from Regal and the like, I believe there is at least some truth to the rumors of management being high on Ohno, but I do think they want him to improve in certain aspects before his call-up, and his physique is one of those things. Luckily, it seems he's well on his way to doing just that.


----------



## LIL' WINNING FOOT

It's simple, really, why he has been kept off so long. He hasn't met the hype that has surrounded him upon coming in. Not to say it's not deserved but Ohno would be Barrett if he had been brought up last year. He doesn't stand out as Ohno yet STILL. That and refusing to do what your employers tell you to do probably doesn't help matters either.


----------



## x78

THANOS said:


> You do need to keep in mind that Ambrose was kept off NXT entirely to prepare for his debut, by hitting the weights and waiting for his storyline to fall in place. The same could be happening with Ohno currently. I know it didn't happen with Wyatt, Rollins, Reigns or Cesaro, as they were all wrestling still on FCW/NXT when they were promoted, but the situation did exist with Ambrose. I think with the comments we've heard from Regal and the like, I believe there is at least some truth to the rumors of management being high on Ohno, but I do think they want him to improve in certain aspects before his call-up, and his physique is one of those things. Luckily, it seems he's well on his way to doing just that.


Ambrose didn't debut on NXT because he was supposed to have already been called up to the main roster with Foley after WM28. It wasn't anything to do with his physique, they were waiting for an opportunity to debut him after the Foley angle fell through. I don't blame them for not wanting to waste time debuting a character like Ambrose on NXT when he was imminently due for a main roster call-up, it would have been completely pointless. Ambrose was also working main roster house shows during the time he was off TV. IMO that's a big difference from Ohno who was prominently featured, earned a tag-team title match and was then pulled from TV, and is now jobbing to Sawyer Fulton at NXT house shows.


----------



## lee20794

truk83 said:


> Not a single person on the main roster that was from NXT as we know it now has done anything when they were in NXT. Big E Langston didn't t do anything other than win a title that no one gives two shits about. The same can be said for The Shield, Wyatt, and Fandango. These stars did nothing in NXT that was special, and those that know about it are a minority. The Wyatt Family made their name on the main roster not in NXT. The Shield weren't doing anything special when they weren't even The Shield, and in NXT. Rollins was in developmental for two years going back to FCW days.
> 
> Reigns was a hardly of significance. Ambrose had one strong feud with Regal, and some classic matches with Rollins, but no one cares about those now because it was FCW. People hardly pay attention to NXT now. Who cared about FCW? Ohno would make his mark on the main roster, and would entertain the fans. His ring work alone sets him apart from 90% of the main roster. He is one of the best in the world, and that's not an Ohno mark, it's the truth. He has already had classic matches with Punk, and Bryan. Do you know who those two men are? Have you heard what they have said about their friend?


Just seen this post. 

Yeah we get it, Ohno has produced some great stuff a while back, but that shouldn't mean that he should get a pass straight to the main roster based on that. It's about making the most of the opportunity's given to you in the present. And apart from a good match against Regal months ago in NXT, I really can't remember anything noteworthy that he has shown. Surely if he is one of the best in the world, you should be asking yourself why hasn't he been standing out when he has the chance? 

It's true that some people get up to the main roster without standing out. But some of the names you've mentioned have made more of an impact than Ohno. Big E for example, stands out a lot more than Ohno because he connects really well with the audience. Wyatt as well. Ohno has always just been meh.

btw you're really underrating Wyatt's contribution in NXT imo.


----------



## THANOS

Well it really does seem like his gym work is starting to pay dividends.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

I hope he doesn't break under whatever pressure he might be under. I think WWE might still see potential in him, or he would have been gone long time ago. He probably still has a strong chance, but just a little heat on his back.


----------



## Asenath

His face looks terrible. Jesus. Leaned up, he looks a good 10 years older.


----------



## truk83

lee20794 said:


> Just seen this post.
> 
> Yeah we get it, Ohno has produced some great stuff a while back, but that shouldn't mean that he should get a pass straight to the main roster based on that. It's about making the most of the opportunity's given to you in the present. And apart from a good match against Regal months ago in NXT, I really can't remember anything noteworthy that he has shown. Surely if he is one of the best in the world, you should be asking yourself why hasn't he been standing out when he has the chance?
> 
> It's true that some people get up to the main roster without standing out. But some of the names you've mentioned have made more of an impact than Ohno. Big E for example, stands out a lot more than Ohno because he connects really well with the audience. Wyatt as well. Ohno has always just been meh.
> 
> btw you're really underrating Wyatt's contribution in NXT imo.


Kruger has been on developmental for how long? People have been saying HHH was really into this guy, and Leo hasn't seen a main roster spot in ever. Look at Kruger's physique. You can't tell me he is in bad shape. Guy looks like a million bucks for his age. Bo Dallas, Bray Wyatt, all members of The Shield, Fandango, etc were all in developmental much longer than Ohno. Guys like Cesaro are the exception, the rare exception. 

For all those out there using Cesaro as an example, you're just fooling yourselves. Cesaro was called up so quickly likely as a move to humble Ohno, and not to mention because Antonio is one of the best in ring workers on the planet. Ohno's first promo ever for the WWE was his debut promo in FCW. One of the things that rubbed many the wrong way was Kassius claiming in this promo that he wouldn't be around for long. That wasn't what people wanted to hear, and apparently it was thought to be very offensive. He debuted in March. It's been roughly 18 months.






Don't get me wrong Ohno is plenty to blame in this situation. Kassius did nothing to help his cause. You obviously haven't watched his matches in NXT, or FCW. No, they aren't all 5 star matches, but remember he was working with some of the most "green" talent that was on the roster(s). Other than that I challenge anyone to show me matches with Ohno that are any less entertaining than any of the folks on from NXT/FCW on the main roster now. It's a damn shame he had to shave his beard because of Bryan, and The Wyatt Family owning creative beard rights (lol).

Ohno is going to debut, and it's likely going to mean something. The WWE has nothing for him now, and there is no point trying to debut him in the midst of these main angles right now. He is, and will be a main player in the WWE I never doubt that. However, he has to pay his dues, and be ready for his call up. He has good word for his matches, and his work according to these dirt sheets. It seems to me that just getting into shape was secondary, but likely important to him. If Kassius was truly in a position that he didn't feel comfortable in, or didn't want to take part in he would do what any normal person would, and that's leave the company to go back to what he was doing previously. Obviously, the WWE hasn't fired him either. What does that tell you?


----------



## IWCMember

Scottish-Suplex said:


> Kassius Ohno is so fat he sits next to EVERYBODY in the locker-room.


I laughed


----------



## lee20794

truk83 said:


> Kruger has been on developmental for how long? People have been saying HHH was really into this guy, and Leo hasn't seen a main roster spot in ever. Look at Kruger's physique. You can't tell me he is in bad shape. Guy looks like a million bucks for his age. Bo Dallas, Bray Wyatt, all members of The Shield, Fandango, etc were all in developmental much longer than Ohno. Guys like Cesaro are the exception, the rare exception.


Erm what are you getting at? That some have been in development longer than Ohno, therefore there's a chance of Ohno being called up? I know this.



truk83 said:


> Don't get me wrong Ohno is plenty to blame in this situation. Kassius did nothing to help his cause. You obviously haven't watched his matches in NXT, or FCW. No, they aren't all 5 star matches, but remember he was working with some of the most "green" talent that was on the roster(s).


I actually don't know how you've come to that conclusion. Maybe it's because I said he hasn't done anything noteworthy? I stand by that. When I say noteworthy which I think has caused you saying this, I mean standing out, showing _personality _in and out of the ring. [/QUOTE]



truk83 said:


> If Kassius was truly in a position that he didn't feel comfortable in, or didn't want to take part in he would do what any normal person would, and that's leave the company to go back to what he was doing previously. Obviously, the WWE hasn't fired him either. What does that tell you?


You seem to be under the illusion that I don't think he has a chance for some reason; he has one. Of course he does, even though it would surprise me. But, if the WWE is high on him, why are they jobbing him out on house shows (what I've read) That and if you take his age into account as well; it doesn't bode well, does it. I still state that he hasn't done anything that makes me think he should be on the main roster.


----------



## RiverFenix

Why does he wear that shitty gear at house shows, but wore something much better looking for the television taping?

Is it because he can dehydrate/cut weight for the tapings to look lean and ripped but that's not something you can do daily when on the road - and especially when trying to bulk up?


----------



## x78

DetroitRiverPhx said:


> Why does he wear that shitty gear at house shows, but wore something much better looking for the television taping?
> 
> Is it because he can dehydrate/cut weight for the tapings to look lean and ripped but that's not something you can do daily when on the road - and especially when trying to bulk up?


They aren't on the road daily, NXT house shows only happen once/twice a week, usually at the same venues and they're at the Performance Center the rest of the time.


----------



## Harbinger

Thanks for the pic Thanos. His chest already went from straight flab to looking a ton better than Kofi Kingston's in the matter of a month :lmao


----------



## THANOS

Harbinger said:


> Thanks for the pic Thanos. His chest already went from straight flab to looking a ton better than Kofi Kingston's in the matter of a month :lmao


:lol No problem man! I feel bad for Kofi sometimes, it's like he had pec removal surgery or something, because his chest is so damn deflated, you could probably set up a small net and play table tennis on top of it.


----------



## Harbinger

THANOS said:


> :lol No problem man! I feel bad for Kofi sometimes, it's like he had pec removal surgery or something, because his chest is so damn deflated, you could probably set up a small net and play table tennis on top of it.


I always just assumed he doesn't know you have to different exercises to workout different parts of the chest lol. The too half is really developed but it looks like he's just ignored the middle and bottom parts :lol

Maybe he's trying to avoid being to bulky. His style isn't made for that kind of thing. Unlike Ohno, who's entire move set can be helped by a solid frame.


----------



## Barty

THANOS said:


> :lol No problem man! I feel bad for Kofi sometimes, it's like he had pec removal surgery or something, because his chest is so damn deflated, you could probably set up a small net and play table tennis on top of it.





Harbinger said:


> I always just assumed he doesn't know you have to different exercises to workout different parts of the chest lol. The too half is really developed but it looks like he's just ignored the middle and bottom parts :lol
> 
> Maybe he's trying to avoid being to bulky. His style isn't made for that kind of thing. Unlike Ohno, who's entire move set can be helped by a solid frame.


Doesn't Kofi have Poland Anomaly? Pretty sure it's been discussed on this very forum countless times.


----------



## CM BORK

This guy is done, unfortunately. He's jobbing to no name rookies on NXT house shows. Can't even get on TV. 

Chris Hero doesn't deserve this.


----------



## BornBad

D+/C-


----------



## Screwball

Nice subliminal advertising there, WWE.


----------



## Crozer

No actually, Ohno wears random shirts all the time. One time he wore Fighting Spirit and the other he wore the Real Man's Man shirt. 

Props to Ohno to support Kendrick tho.


----------



## TheWFEffect

Cool kassius is going to be the Daniel Bryan of nxt and instead of the shield the wyatt family will be used to hold him down god I hope they go through with it.


----------



## NO!

It was great to see him on NXT again, but I'm not sure where they're going with this D+ thing. I think it has more to do with adding to the corporation story line than anything to do with pushing Ohno. Hopefully it's a little bit of both.


----------



## x78

NO! said:


> It was great to see him on NXT again, but I'm not sure where they're going with this D+ thing. I think it has more to do with adding to the corporation story line than anything to do with pushing Ohno. Hopefully it's a little bit of both.


Probably just something to try and get the fans invested in him and make the most of his previous lackluster run. Really smart booking IMO, since I'm now curious and interested to see Ohno for the first time since FCW ended.


----------



## Mon Joxley

Harbinger said:


> I always just assumed he doesn't know you have to different exercises to workout different parts of the chest lol. The too half is really developed but it looks like he's just ignored the middle and bottom parts :lol


There's no such thing as middle pectorals, it's all one muscle for the most part. Almost all exercises that work the chest works the entire pectoral (push-ups for example). People just have different bone structures, he could have hollow bird chest or something.


----------



## Mr. I

NO! said:


> It was great to see him on NXT again, but I'm not sure where they're going with this D+ thing. I think it has more to do with adding to the corporation story line than anything to do with pushing Ohno. Hopefully it's a little bit of both.


It looks like a slow burn story to me. Sami Zayn is the star right now, and NXT has a very slow and deliberate pace for its stories. Basically after Sami wins the title and is on the cusp of coming to the main roster, I can see them pushing Kassius as the top face (with a indie guy vs the corporation story parallel down on NXT).


----------



## Harbinger

T Man said:


> There's no such thing as middle pectorals, it's all one muscle for the most part. Almost all exercises that work the chest works the entire pectoral (push-ups for example). People just have different bone structures, he could have hollow bird chest or something.


You can target different parts of the chest with different exercises. For example, a wide grip bench press will give different results than a standard bench press. Benching on an incline drastically changes which part of the chest you use. Same with different push up types. It's all one muscle but you can target different parts of it because it's so huge. You may be using your chest but you can break it down.


----------



## pesfacemaker

on the New episode of JBL and Cole Show, it seems like Kassius Ohno on the Gym working out... You can see him at 4:52


----------



## Eulonzo

That backstage segment with Maddox was bad.


----------



## papercuts_hurt

NO! said:


> It was great to see him on NXT again, but I'm not sure where they're going with this D+ thing. I think it has more to do with adding to the corporation story line than anything to do with pushing Ohno. Hopefully it's a little bit of both.


Here's my theory on how this storyline will go. WWE likes doing story lines that are based on real stuff now, right? They know what all the rumors are and what we know (or think we know), and they're playing off that, like the Daniel Bryan storyline. I think this is similar. What is known about Ohno? That he was a world-renowned indy wrestler, that all his former peers are big stars in WWE, that he thinks he's every bit as good as them, but that he's in the doghouse. Management isn't big on him, and so he's been marginalized. That's our jumping off point for the story. So now Ohno goes on a rampage to get the attention he thinks he deserves. It is connected thematically with the Bryan storyline but I don't know if it will actually tie in - I think it's just a way to give Ohno some purpose and direction based off of "real life" events.


----------



## Mon Joxley

Harbinger said:


> You can target different parts of the chest with different exercises. For example, a wide grip bench press will give different results than a standard bench press. Benching on an incline drastically changes which part of the chest you use. Same with different push up types. It's all one muscle but you can target different parts of it because it's so huge. You may be using your chest but you can break it down.


You can target the top and bottom parts of it with some exercises, but all the tissue around the sternum which Kofi seems to be missing can't be fixed with exercises, much less one as restricting as bench press. Someone mentioned Poland Anomaly, if it's been discussed before already then there's the answer.


----------



## jarrelka

Ohnos only 33? I checked it up on Wikipedia and was expecting atleast 35 since he,s wrestled since like forever. Not really Old if you think about it. He has a good 7-10 years in him and thats more then the average wrestler spends in the WWE anyways. I hope he gets to debut in a Good storyline once this Corporation thing is over with and gets a good solid midcard push from the getgo.


----------



## Revil Fox

papercuts_hurt said:


> Here's my theory on how this storyline will go. WWE likes doing story lines that are based on real stuff now, right? They know what all the rumors are and what we know (or think we know), and they're playing off that, like the Daniel Bryan storyline. I think this is similar. What is known about Ohno? That he was a world-renowned indy wrestler, that all his former peers are big stars in WWE, that he thinks he's every bit as good as them, but that he's in the doghouse. Management isn't big on him, and so he's been marginalized. That's our jumping off point for the story. So now Ohno goes on a rampage to get the attention he thinks he deserves. It is connected thematically with the Bryan storyline but I don't know if it will actually tie in - I think it's just a way to give Ohno some purpose and direction based off of "real life" events.


I like this.


----------



## Harbinger

T Man said:


> You can target the top and bottom parts of it with some exercises, but all the tissue around the sternum which Kofi seems to be missing can't be fixed with exercises, much less one as restricting as bench press. Someone mentioned Poland Anomaly, if it's been discussed before already then there's the answer.


There's no source for him having Poland Anomaly. Somebody just made a guess. I'm fairly positive there's no record of him ever saying that. They were just basing that on a thread from here. Besides, Poland anomaly affects one side of the chest not the center. More likely just genetics.


----------



## truk83

papercuts_hurt said:


> Here's my theory on how this storyline will go. WWE likes doing story lines that are based on real stuff now, right? They know what all the rumors are and what we know (or think we know), and they're playing off that, like the Daniel Bryan storyline. I think this is similar. What is known about Ohno? That he was a world-renowned indy wrestler, that all his former peers are big stars in WWE, that he thinks he's every bit as good as them, but that he's in the doghouse. Management isn't big on him, and so he's been marginalized. That's our jumping off point for the story. So now Ohno goes on a rampage to get the attention he thinks he deserves. It is connected thematically with the Bryan storyline but I don't know if it will actually tie in - I think it's just a way to give Ohno some purpose and direction based off of "real life" events.


Yes.:mark:


----------



## joeysnotright

4hisdamnself said:


> D+/C-


I like his shirt.


----------



## barnesk9

http://www.tout.com/m/kiez4s

Looks like Ohno is in great shape and is on his way back


----------



## Asenath

barnesk9 said:


> http://www.tout.com/m/kiez4s
> 
> Looks like Ohno is in great shape and is on his way back


----------



## truk83

It's obvious he was working out the whole time, and him jobbing in NXT means nothing. If fans are on your side while jobbing at live NXT events, that means you're over. He'll get over with the majority of casual WWE fans in no time. His mic skills as a face aren't "Cena'ish", by no means is Ohno cookie cutter on the mic. That alone will get fans from various ages to cheer for him. His character isn't edgy in a profane, or derogatory way. However, at the same time it's not a face character just for kids. He falls into that "cool" zone like Punk, and Bryan. Not some smiling prick like Ryder, Sheamus, or Cena.


----------



## papercuts_hurt

Seeing him in action tonight for the first time in a while, he definitely looked great physique wise. Especially when they showed the clip of him from 4 months ago, there's a very noticeable difference. He was more muscular than CM Punk so I would think they should be OK with him now as long as he keeps it up. He worked hard now give the man a push!!!


----------



## McNugget

Dude looked MUCH better this time around. He's bulked up a lot, and I'd say he has almost the perfect build for his frame now. If he can trim up the flab around his midriff, he'll be golden, but even then it's a huge step up.


----------



## THANOS

McNugget said:


> Dude looked MUCH better this time around. He's bulked up a lot, and I'd say he has almost the perfect build for his frame now. If he can trim up the flab around his midriff, he'll be golden, but even then it's a huge step up.


Look at that Tout he sent out days ago, the dude is even BIGGER and more toned now than he was when Wednesday's show was taped. It's crazy to think how only a few months of hard work can make such a difference for the dudes body.


----------



## TedTedTed

I honestly don't see what is so bad about his shape.


----------



## McNugget

TedTedTed said:


> I honestly don't see what is so bad about his shape.


Most sane people don't, but WWE's crazy stance on physique is well documented. CM Punk talked about it on Colt Cabana's podcast, how they made him always feel gross whenever he eats pizza and like he constantly needs to work out.

With any luck, he can get back on track and show the world what he's capable of. Even if it was only a few minutes long, he moved VERY impressively in his match with Harper.


----------



## Snapdragon

It's kind of funny when you look at wrestlers in the past, nobody worked out. All the wrestlers didn't have six packs, they looked like rugged men who just came off a day of hard labor and were ready to fight. Harley Race didn't go to the gym at all (according to Hillbilly Jim). They still managed to go 60 minutes time after time with no problem.


----------



## TL Hopper

I'm surprised WWE doesn't make a big deal about Corey Graves. He must weigh 160lbs with no definition whatsoever


----------



## truk83

I want the beard back, and I want him to wear the camouflage ring attire. Get him on the main roster already.


----------



## THANOS

TL Hopper said:


> I'm surprised WWE doesn't make a big deal about Corey Graves. He must weigh 160lbs with no definition whatsoever


This is a good point. If they are so consider with Ohno they should definitely be all over Graves.



truk83 said:


> I want the beard back, and I want him to wear the camouflage ring attire. Get him on the main roster already.


I'd hate that personally. Ohno should be more of a cocky pretty boy knock out artist like Muhammad Ali was. That was his gimmick in ROH, and, imo, the best Ohno has ever looked as a complete package.

This is the Ohno I want to see, but maybe with boxing/MMA shorts to really drive home the gimmick


----------



## sizor

Snapdragon said:


> It's kind of funny when you look at wrestlers in the past, nobody worked out. All the wrestlers didn't have six packs, they looked like rugged men who just came off a day of hard labor and were ready to fight. Harley Race didn't go to the gym at all (according to Hillbilly Jim). They still managed to go 60 minutes time after time with no problem.


true!
Jake the snake lo0oked like my drank father


----------



## E N F O R C E R

Poor Ohno, first Barrett steals his gimmick now he's getting jobbed out for no fucking good reason. Look at big daddy V for Christ sakes! Body definition shouldn't define what happens in your career, fan reaction should.


----------



## Asenath

At this point, I'm thinking it's not so much about his body, per se. It's about taking him down a notch and reminding him that this isn't the indies and even top stars from there start at the bottom. That is the WWE way, you know.


----------



## El Dandy

Yeah I agree. I don't think it's the fact that Hero doesn't have an Adonis body holding him back... it's that he originally didn't take the critique from his bosses seriously when it was given to him months ago.

If he would have been a gym rat for like 6 week initially, he would be up on the main roster by now.

He could show up being chiseled tomorrow, but unless his attitude changes he won't get out of the minor leagues. How he goes about proving an attitude change is a different story. That will just take time.


----------



## MachoMadness1988

I haven't read through this whole thread but Flair said in his prime Dusty Rhodes had as good of stamina as anyone he got in the ring with.


----------



## THANOS

MachoMadness1988 said:


> I haven't read through this whole thread but Flair said in his prime Dusty Rhodes had as good of stamina as anyone he got in the ring with.


Yep and Ohno is fit to wrestle marathon 2 hour matches if ever tasked to do so. When you compound that ability with his natural athleticism, which is a million times higher than one would think based on his look, you get a seriously talented individual.


----------



## MachoMadness1988

Yeah it makes no sense to me that Herohno isn't on the main roster yet.


----------



## truk83

THANOS said:


> This is a good point. If they are so consider with Ohno they should definitely be all over Graves.
> 
> 
> 
> I'd hate that personally. Ohno should be more of a cocky pretty boy knock out artist like Muhammad Ali was. That was his gimmick in ROH, and, imo, the best Ohno has ever looked as a complete package.
> 
> This is the Ohno I want to see, but maybe with boxing/MMA shorts to really drive home the gimmick


Personally, I think this old NXT photo of him is awesome. I don't know what's wrong with this look here. Perfect in my opinion.


----------



## THANOS

truk83 said:


> Personally, I think this old NXT photo of him is awesome. I don't know what's wrong with this look here. Perfect in my opinion.


Yes but here he looked like a weathered old time wrestler/boxer, which I really don't think fits his personality. The cocky, catch-phrase laden, KO artist fit him like a glove. Check out these promos below for how I'd personally like to see Ohno be on WWE TV.


----------



## BehindYou

MachoMadness1988 said:


> I haven't read through this whole thread but Flair said in his prime Dusty Rhodes had as good of stamina as anyone he got in the ring with.


 Than you should read the thread....

The main thing people have been talking about is how an unwillingness to cooperate has been bad for him, much more so than his actual "look" itself.


----------



## EdgeheadStingerfan

Who cares about the guys current conditioning... he doesn't look disgusting. I mean c'mon, look at Punk, DB, ADR and other guys. Stop nitpicking WWE and bring this guy up already. 

#DAMNIBeenMuthFknREADY!


----------



## SAMCRO

Wth hell are they doing with this guy? He comes back 2 weeks ago after being gone for months, they give him a match for the next week, ok here we are next week and he just lost. Wth? are they punishing him for not getting into better shape? I mean damn look at ADR he's got the same body type as Ohno practically and he's never told to get in shape.


----------



## Muerte al fascismo

Hero is getting a raw deal. He's a Grade A talent, the only explanation I can think of is he's angered some serious player behind the scenes. Politics are for sure at play here. It annoys me when promotions do this and waste a talents best years. So ass-backward thinking.


----------



## BehindYou

> I mean damn look at ADR he's got the same body type as Ohno practically and he's never told to get in shape.


Del Rio looks fantastic next to Ohno. Far more mass and leaner.



> why are they punishing him for not getting into better shape?


Because they asked him to and he didn't for a long time.



> Hero is getting a raw deal. He's a Grade A talent, the only explanation I can think of is he's angered some serious player behind the scenes. Politics are for sure at play here. It annoys me when promotions do this and waste a talents best years. So ass-backward thinking.


 #1 He hasn't done anything in developmental to suggest he's a grade A talent.
#2 Angering people backstage and politics arent the same thing. It's not a question of people not liking him, it's a question of him not doing what's required of him. That *should *piss a boss off, such is life.


----------



## Asenath

SAMCRO said:


> I mean damn look at ADR he's got the same body type as Ohno practically and he's never told to get in shape.


As far as we have heard down the gossip line, ADR has done everything the company has asked of him.


----------



## Mr. I

SAMCRO said:


> Wth hell are they doing with this guy? He comes back 2 weeks ago after being gone for months, they give him a match for the next week, ok here we are next week and he just lost. Wth? are they punishing him for not getting into better shape? I mean damn look at ADR he's got the same body type as Ohno practically and he's never told to get in shape.


My guess is they're starting a slow burn story that will put him at the front of NXT down the line (after Sami Zayn has had his reign), all while he continues to improve his physique. They seemed to set it up with the promo with Maddox.


----------



## Muerte al fascismo

BehindYou said:


> Del Rio looks fantastic next to Ohno. Far more mass and leaner.
> 
> 
> Because they asked him to and he didn't for a long time.
> 
> 
> #1 He hasn't done anything in developmental to suggest he's a grade A talent.
> #2 Angering people backstage and politics arent the same thing. It's not a question of people not liking him, it's a question of him not doing what's required of him. That *should *piss a boss off, such is life.


Listen to the leaked NXT promos. That alone proves how far above the others he is. They've wasted a top indy talent, by putting him in development, doing absolutely nothing. There's never ever been anything wrong with Hero's look. Punk looks like a drug addict and he's the No2 star. Bryan look is abysmal, yet he's the main babyface right now.

He shouldn't have to change what brought him to the dance. Do something with him, or release him and let him tear it up somewhere else. The guy's a long-time vet, this is clearly just certain people fucking with him. If I was in Hero's position, I'd be just as frustrated, when you know you're better then the majority of talents on the main roster, let alone in developmental.


----------



## x78

^ If he was a better talent than the majority of the main roster then he wouldn't have totally flopped on NXT.


----------



## #dealwithit

Why do people keep saying Del Rio is in bad shape? That is blatantly untrue.


----------



## Muerte al fascismo

x78 said:


> ^ If he was a better talent than the majority of the main roster then he wouldn't have totally flopped on NXT.


It's called setting someone up for failure. A veteran like him, shouldn't even be on NXT. It's a waste of a developmental spot. Right now it's a waste of everyone's time.


----------



## x78

Muerte al fascismo said:


> It's called setting someone up for failure. A veteran like him, shouldn't even be on NXT. It's a waste of a developmental spot. Right now it's a waste of everyone's time.


He shouldn't be on NXT despite the fact that he was unable to get over on NXT, was out of shape and totally lackluster in every way?

If Ohno was better than the NXT talents then he would stand out on the show and he didn't at all, in fact he was one of the worst talents before he was taken off TV. Hopefully he'll do better this time but to suggest that he should get a free pass to the main roster without proving himself in developmental is ridiculous, look what happened with Sin Cara. And TBH I think if Ohno had been put straight on the main roster, he would have been a laughing stock and it would have ruined his career.


----------



## Muerte al fascismo

x78 said:


> He shouldn't be on NXT despite the fact that he was unable to get over on NXT, was out of shape and totally lackluster in every way?
> 
> If Ohno was better than the NXT talents then he would stand out on the show and he didn't at all, in fact he was one of the worst talents before he was taken off TV. Hopefully he'll do better this time but to suggest that he should get a free pass to the main roster without proving himself in developmental is ridiculous, look what happened with Sin Cara. And TBH I think if Ohno had been put straight on the main roster, he would have been a laughing stock and it would have ruined his career.


Sin Cara worked in Mexico with primarily Luchadors. Hero has worked several styles. The comparison is dumb. 

Like I've said before, the leaked promo alone prove how above Hero is over the NXT roster. Even in his training videos you can see how much more fluid in the ring he is. He's been given little to work with to get over. 

You can't make money if you don't get fair exposure. He's not a kid; he knows what he's doing in there. They signed him based off his value in the indies. To let him rot, where he's essentially learning nothing on NXT is stupidity of the highest level.

A developmental system is not for someone like Ohno. Use him or release him. Going back in time, it would be like taking a prime Y2J or Benoit, then saying to them, you've traveled the world, worked multiple styles, got a cult fanbase, but we want you to go to OVW to hone your craft. It's a waste of time, that ruins any buzz they may of had when signing. Don't insult vets and waste their time.


----------



## x78

Muerte al fascismo said:


> Sin Cara worked in Mexico with primarily Luchadors. Hero has worked several styles. The comparison is dumb.
> 
> Like I've said before, the leaked promo alone prove how above Hero is over the NXT roster. Even in his training videos you can see how much more fluid in the ring he is. He's been given little to work with to get over.
> 
> You can't make money if you don't get fair exposure. He's not a kid; he knows what he's doing in there. They signed him based off his value in the indies. To let him rot, where he's essentially learning nothing on NXT is stupidity of the highest level.
> 
> A developmental system is not for someone like Ohno. Use him or release him. Going back in time, it would be like taking a prime Y2J or Benoit, then saying to them, you've traveled the world, worked multiple styles, got a cult fanbase, but we want you to go to OVW to hone your craft. It's a waste of time, that ruins any buzz they may of had when signing. Don't insult vets and waste their time.


If he isn't good enough to be on the main roster, he shouldn't be there. Your argument is invalidated by the fact that Ohno wasn't even good enough to be on NXT TV and had to be taken off for 5 months. I don't think his leaked promos were particularly good, certainly not above the rest of the roster like you're claiming. So far I haven't seen anything from Ohno that justifies him being given a free pass to the main roster ahead of any of the established indy stars they sign. In fact Sami Zayn has been head and shoulders above Ohno in every department.


----------



## Muerte al fascismo

x78 said:


> If he isn't good enough to be on the main roster, he shouldn't be there. Your argument is invalidated by the fact that Ohno wasn't even good enough to be on NXT TV and had to be taken off for 5 months. I don't think his leaked promos were particularly good, certainly not above the rest of the roster like you're claiming. So far I haven't seen anything from Ohno that justifies him being given a free pass to the main roster ahead of any of the established indy stars they sign. In fact Sami Zayn has been head and shoulders above Ohno in every department.


The leaked promo is 101 on how to sell yourself as a legit threat. The others might have had more flamboyance or more content, but Hero's delivery is what you want in an Upper-Card wrestler. Notice the applause after one of his promo's.

Neither should be in developmental. Developmental is for kids that need molding or teaching. Certainly not longer then 2/3 months while they get their timing down.


----------



## Death132

Lets just end this particular discussion and say Muerte is completely right in every way and x78 is wrong.


----------



## x78

Death132 said:


> Lets just end this particular discussion and say Muerte is completely right in every way and x78 is wrong.


----------



## Shepard

> Lets just end this particular discussion and say Muerte is completely right in every way and x78 is wrong.


Except he isn't. If Ohno is so much above everyone how come his only good singles matches came against Regal who's one of the best ever and hardly has a bad match and Cesaro who he's tagged with for YEARS. Beyond that his entire time in developmental has been lacklustre and poor and there's plenty of talents above him. If you're put in developmental simply put in the work to show you're above it. You might even come out of it a lot better (Ambrose, Rollins for example. Ohno has clearly shown a struggle in adapting to the WWE style. Probably b/c he's used to his matches being a longer time on the indies. Even the Regal match was given quite a lot of time for NXT programming and he showed a flash of what he can possibly do there). People like Cesaro and Zayn turned up to developmental and worked their ass off from day 1 and put on really good matches. I doubt Zayn will be there long at all, just like Cesaro was. Although I'd mark if he kept coming down for matches like Antonio has because it'd certainly help the greener talent down there.

Nice contribution btw. Next time maybe add some thoughts beyond simply agreeing with someone.


----------



## x78

Shepard said:


> Except he isn't. If Ohno is so much above everyone how come his only good singles matches came against Regal who's one of the best ever and hardly has a bad match and Cesaro who he's tagged with for YEARS. Beyond that his entire time in developmental has been lacklustre and poor and there's plenty of talents above him. If you're put in developmental simply put in the work to show you're above it. You might even come out of it a lot better (Ambrose, Rollins for example. Ohno has clearly shown a struggle in adapting to the WWE style. Probably b/c he's used to his matches being a longer time on the indies. Even the Regal match was given quite a lot of time for NXT programming and he showed a flash of what he can possibly do there). People like Cesaro and Zayn turned up to developmental and worked their ass off from day 1 and put on really good matches. I doubt Zayn will be there long at all, just like Cesaro was. Although I'd mark if he kept coming down for matches like Antonio has because it'd certainly help the greener talent down there.
> 
> Nice contribution btw. Next time maybe add some thoughts beyond simply agreeing with someone.


Exactly this. Plenty of better talents than Ohno have spent time in developmental and improved because of it. If Ohno was as deserving as people on here think then he would have come in and stood out from day one like Ambrose, Cesaro, Zayn etc all did. As it is, Ohno was out of shape, struggled to adapt to the WWE style, struggled in promos and struggled to develop a clear character that connected with the NXT fans. I want to see him do well, but people dickriding him and suggesting that he should be pushed way ahead of everyone else and fast-tracked to the main roster on reputation alone and despite his obvious flaws is just stupid. The fact is that Ohno stank the place up on NXT and struggled to get a reaction with a crowd that gives virtually everyone a reaction. I dread to think what would have happened if he'd been put straight on the main roster like people are suggesting.

For the guy earlier, developmental is not a wrestling school, it's a place to allow talent to improve in every area and become as good as possible before being introduced to the main roster. Ohno does seem to have improved his physique, and hopefully has come back with a better attitude and can start to show whatever it is that has earned him so many fans on here. But IMO he still needs a lot more time in developmental before he's even close to being ready for the main roster.


----------



## Paul Rudd

I have to agree with the posters above me. I loved Chris Hero on the indies but Kassius Ohno has been a flop. I just get the impression that up until recently he wasn't trying at all and not only would that have hindered his performances it also would pissed people off backstage. 

I hate to complain about appearance since two of my favourites are Bryan and Punk but Ohno's physique up until recently was embarrassing. I know genetics can be a bitch but he has proven recently that he can tighten his shit up, so to go over a year looking like he did was just lazy, stupid and pathetic.

I hope he is finally on the right track, because I love his gimmick and he really is very talented. I heard his match at the latest NXT tapings was match of the night, so it seems like this could be the start of something.


----------



## SAMCRO

Le Nature Garçon said:


> Why do people keep saying Del Rio is in bad shape? That is blatantly untrue.


Just looks at these pictures, he's clearly got love handles and he's got a bit of a belly thats why he wears his trunks pulled so far up. And half the time it looks as if he's sucking his stomach in so he doesn't look as flabby.


----------



## NO!

Shepard said:


> Except he isn't. If Ohno is so much above everyone how come his only good singles matches came against Regal who's one of the best ever and hardly has a bad match


I'm not here to take sides or anything, but maybe it's because nearly all of his matches on NXT have been 3-4 minutes? And even then, some of them were at least watchable. He had better matches in FCW because he actually had time. I'm not so sure why we're even having this conversation anymore after his recent match with Harper. He looked a lot better physically and did fine in the ring for the short amount of time that they gave him.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

SAMCRO said:


> Just looks at these pictures, he's clearly got love handles and he's got a bit of a belly thats why he wears his trunks pulled so far up. And half the time it looks as if he's sucking his stomach in so he doesn't look as flabby.












These are probably looks that WWE can take more seriously than Hero. Like what's been already said, if this is much of a problem to Hero, than it's going to be harder for him to cope once he hits the main roster and has a tighter schedule like Rio and the other main roster guys have.


----------



## McNugget

The issue with his look wasn't ever the extra weight; it was that he had no muscle underneath that weight, which made him look terrible. Del Rio and Bryan both have a lot of muscle underneath their flab, which makes all the difference in the world. Just look at guys like James Storm or even HHH at times in his career.

Hero didn't need to completely trim up, but he needed to do some service to his frame and bulk up and look like more of a threat. He's on the right path now.


----------



## BehindYou

And for the 100th time, it wasn't all about the look. It seems to have been about his unwillingness to cooperate which is a far bigger issue.

And the idea that Ohno should have gone straight to WWE main programming is ridiculous.


To compare his fanbase to Benoit or especially Jericho's is insanity. Benoit had been on a major wrestling show for 5 years, Jericho for 3 (with much of that as a title holder). Even with a similar build up, there's no way that Hero could ever hope to come close to Jericho's debut pop.
None of the Indy royalty of the last decade had big enough fanbases for that to get them over, Punk and Bryan have had to fight for that so to think Hero has already made it makes little sense.

In the indies, Hero was a big fish in a small pond. He stood out because of his size and stiffness, one of which isn't a big deal in WWE, the other not encouraged. 

I don't feel hero has anything that separates him from the crowd in developmental or the main roster, other than a smark fanbase. In terms of top indie guys, he's probably the most overrated.


----------



## Shepard

NO! said:


> I'm not here to take sides or anything, but maybe it's because nearly all of his matches on NXT have been 3-4 minutes? And even then, some of them were at least watchable. He had better matches in FCW because he actually had time. I'm not so sure why we're even having this conversation anymore after his recent match with Harper. He looked a lot better physically and did fine in the ring for the short amount of time that they gave him.


Timing shouldn't matter. Cesaro got over because he was king of the squashes and making the most of what he was given. If you're good enough you can do that. Ohno has an explosive enough moveset, even on NXT to try and get the most of those matches. It's what he'd get if he was called up too and you'd assume he'd need to prove himself in that timeframe before they even consider giving him more time.

The Harper match was fine but Harpers also a really good worker (and another example of an indy guy coming in and owning from day 1. even when he had to carry Rowan at the start). If Ohno can push on from it and be consistent then great.


----------



## Starbuck

Muerte al fascismo said:


> It's called setting someone up for failure. A veteran like him, shouldn't even be on NXT. It's a waste of a developmental spot. Right now it's a waste of everyone's time.


If Ohno has the same attitude as you then it shouldn't be a surprise to anyone why he's still down there. What you do in the indies means jack shit to WWE. They call you up, you're in their house and you have to impress them all over again. Turning up with an attitude like that, like you're above everybody and deserve to be on the main roster right away isn't going to do you any favours at all. Perhaps it has taken Ohno a lot longer than most to figure that out. They aren't going to give you anything if you don't show willingness to meet them half way. Your boss tells you to hit the weights then you hit the weights. You don't start pointing the finger at everybody else and making excuses. Besides, outside the Regal stuff, based on his tenure in NXT Ohno doesn't deserve shit. He absolutely should be down there if this is what he's suggesting he's going to produce on Raw or Smackdown. Why the hell would they call him up? He hasn't given them a reason to. If you want to start the blame game that's fine but it cuts both ways.


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## E N F O R C E R

It makes me laugh how the WWE hates signing indie wrestlers but they're always the ones which are the most over at the moment (Bryan, Punk, Cesaro, Zayn). I'm sure that Ohno will be added to that list in no time. I love the guy, he's very very talented and isn't a douche bag 'take your vitamins and listen to your mother' type of baby face. Body type should NEVER be a depiction of talent, look at Foley for christ sakes. I understand it was different for him, but Ohno shouldn't be judged so much for something like that. It will be a crying shame if he doesn't eventually get called up to the main roster.


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## Raw2003

E N F O R C E R said:


> It makes me laugh how the WWE hates signing indie wrestlers but they're always the ones which are the most over at the moment (Bryan, Punk, Cesaro, Zayn). I'm sure that Ohno will be added to that list in no time. I love the guy, he's very very talented and isn't a douche bag 'take your vitamins and listen to your mother' type of baby face. Body type should NEVER be a depiction of talent, look at Foley for christ sakes. I understand it was different for him, but Ohno shouldn't be judged so much for something like that. It will be a crying shame if he doesn't eventually get called up to the main roster.


I agree they don't all have to be generic look at punk he ain't got a six pack & he's doing fine.


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## BehindYou

What makes you think that WWE hates signing indie guys...? They have been signing plenty over the last 5 years. Your talking out of your ass.
And your missing the whole point again! It's about attitude, not appearance.


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## x78

E N F O R C E R said:


> It makes me laugh how the WWE hates signing indie wrestlers but they're always the ones which are the most over at the moment (Bryan, Punk, Cesaro, Zayn). I'm sure that Ohno will be added to that list in no time. I love the guy, he's very very talented and isn't a douche bag 'take your vitamins and listen to your mother' type of baby face. Body type should NEVER be a depiction of talent, look at Foley for christ sakes. I understand it was different for him, but Ohno shouldn't be judged so much for something like that. It will be a crying shame if he doesn't eventually get called up to the main roster.


I've seen so many posts from you talking absolute bullshit, the vast majority of the current NXT roster came from the indies, in fact I think there are only 2 or 3 guys who didn't.


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## E N F O R C E R

x78 said:


> I've seen so many posts from you talking absolute bullshit, the vast majority of the current NXT roster came from the indies, in fact I think there are only 2 or 3 guys who didn't.












And just taking a quick look from your recent posts it seems you're an insecure, passive aggressive human being who's sense of superiority is really odd. Don't worry, you'll find someone to love you for who you truly are soon 

:jose


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## Death132

BehindYou said:


> In the indies, Hero was a big fish in a small pond. He stood out because of his size and stiffness, one of which isn't a big deal in WWE, the other not encouraged.


Hero stood out in the indies for his technical prowess and athletic ability along with the stiffness. But if you think his size and stiffness were the only things I guess you watched very few of his work.

He is one of the most talented overall guys out there...


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## swagger_ROCKS

E N F O R C E R said:


> It makes me laugh how the WWE hates signing indie wrestlers but they're always the ones which are the most over at the moment (Bryan, Punk, Cesaro, Zayn). I'm sure that Ohno will be added to that list in no time. I love the guy, he's very very talented and isn't a douche bag 'take your vitamins and listen to your mother' type of baby face. Body type should NEVER be a depiction of talent, look at Foley for christ sakes. I understand it was different for him, but Ohno shouldn't be judged so much for something like that. It will be a crying shame if he doesn't eventually get called up to the main roster.


They are kinda the ones that have a lot of potential, but they don't usually start off very over. Cesaro as much as people like to imagine it, wasn't over at first and was getting good reactions for the impressive spots he did in the ring, same with DB. But when WWE finally decides to give these individuals the ball, they h usually deliver.

OhNo would most likely be in the same boat, if they crowd can buy into him standing out from everybody else.


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## Mr. I

x78 said:


> I've seen so many posts from you talking absolute bullshit, the vast majority of the current NXT roster came from the indies, in fact I think there are only 2 or 3 guys who didn't.


"Only 2 or 3"? You are definitely mistaken.


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## x78

Ithil said:


> "Only 2 or 3"? You are definitely mistaken.


Of the active NXT roster, Mojo was signed from football, Bo got a developmental contract straight away because his father works for the company and I'm not sure of the backgrounds of Enzo or Big Cass, but other than that literally all of the featured talent came from the indies. Even in the Divas division, Summer Rae is the only one that didn't come from the indies. Obviously there are people still in training who are yet to debut that come from other backgrounds but still, to suggest that they 'hate signing people from the indies' is just stupid.


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## Snapdragon

Enzo and Cass are from the indies

Lana and Alexa Bliss are models/cheerleaders I think


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## Mon Joxley

It's no different than guys learning their craft in the territories. Hulk Hogan didn't get plucked from some bodybuilding contest or a football field and put through some development program, nor did Steve Austin. Hell even John Cena dabbled a bit in the indies before being picked up by WWE.


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## Mr. I

x78 said:


> Of the active NXT roster, Mojo was signed from football, Bo got a developmental contract straight away because his father works for the company and I'm not sure of the backgrounds of Enzo or Big Cass, but other than that literally all of the featured talent came from the indies. Even in the Divas division, Summer Rae is the only one that didn't come from the indies. Obviously there are people still in training who are yet to debut that come from other backgrounds but still, to suggest that they 'hate signing people from the indies' is just stupid.


If we're talking only people who have appeared on TV and not in a jobber capacity, where most of them are not from the indies, then Summer Rae, Charlotte, Kendall Skye are not from the indies, Mojo, Enzo, Big Cass, Bo aren't, and Tyler Breeze and Alexander Rusev were hired right out of wrestling school. That's more than 2-3 on TV.

If we count people simply on the roster, many are not from wrestling originally, especially among the women.


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## Genking48

Ithil said:


> If we're talking only people who have appeared on TV and not in a jobber capacity, where most of them are not from the indies, then Summer Rae, Charlotte, Kendall Skye are not from the indies, Mojo, Enzo, Big Cass, Bo aren't, and *Tyler Breeze and Alexander Rusev were hired right out of wrestling school*. That's more than 2-3 on TV.
> 
> If we count people simply on the roster, many are not from wrestling originally, especially among the women.












Tyler Breeze competed on the indies from 2007-2010 and Alexander Rusev from 2008-2011 so I dunno where you get that idea that they were hired out of wrestling school when they have spent some years wrestling before WWE contacted them


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## Snapdragon

Ithil said:


> If we're talking only people who have appeared on TV and not in a jobber capacity, where most of them are not from the indies, then Summer Rae, Charlotte, Kendall Skye are not from the indies, Mojo, Enzo, Big Cass, Bo aren't, and Tyler Breeze and Alexander Rusev were hired right out of wrestling school. That's more than 2-3 on TV.
> 
> If we count people simply on the roster, many are not from wrestling originally, especially among the women.


Big Cass and ENzo are from the indies dude.


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## NO!

Snapdragon said:


> Big Cass and ENzo are from the indies dude.


Are you sure? I thought Enzo was a football player before getting signed.


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## RobVanDingus

NO! said:


> Are you sure? I thought Enzo was a football player before getting signed.


Yeah, he played football at the D-III level. This article says HHH spotted him at a gym in his hometown

http://www.northjersey.com/sports/2...ck_football_player_Eric_Arndt.html?c=y&page=2


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## swagger_ROCKS

Snapdragon said:


> Big Cass and ENzo are from the indies dude.


Would be nice to provide some proof as well, other than just saying they did. Not trying to say you're wrong or anything, but for the sake of discussion.


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## Snapdragon

swagger_ROCKS said:


> Would be nice to provide some proof as well, other than just saying they did. Not trying to say you're wrong or anything, but for the sake of discussion.


Enzo has old videos on youtube from when he was Eric Anthony on the indies http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBhSfJm7ya8

Big Cass was trained by Johnny Rodz a few years back, while I can't find any record I'm sure he's had a least a few indy matches before getting signed, It's not uncommon for a wrestlers first matches to be unrecorded or unknown, I can't imagine him training with Johnny Rodz and then immediately being signed without having a match first. His indy name was apparently Big Bill.

http://www.cagematch.net/?id=2&nr=11618


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## swagger_ROCKS

Snapdragon said:


> Enzo has old videos on youtube from when he was Eric Anthony on the indies http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBhSfJm7ya8
> 
> Big Cass was trained by Johnny Rodz a few years back, while I can't find any record I'm sure he's had a least a few indy matches before getting signed, It's not uncommon for a wrestlers first matches to be unrecorded or unknown, I can't imagine him training with Johnny Rodz and then immediately being signed without having a match first. His indy name was apparently Big Bill.
> 
> http://www.cagematch.net/?id=2&nr=11618


Ah, and wow at that vid. Seemed a bit bigger, and it seems he was always an ace talker. (Y)


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## Harbinger

swagger_ROCKS said:


> Ah, and wow at that vid. Seemed a bit bigger, and it seems he was always an ace talker. (Y)


The thing about his size is that he's always been standing next to mountains of men since he debuted. First he was in a program with Mason Ryan. While Ryan isn't extraordinarily tall be any means, he looks like the incredible Hulk's bastard child and out weighs Enzo by about 100 lbs. Now he's facing Rusev and Dawson. Again Rusev is about the same height but has at least 60 lbs on him and is well above average in the weight dept. Dawson isn't really big, but he ain't no slouch either. He's got about 40 lbs on Enzo. 

Plus he always has Big Cass on his side who's a 7 footer.

He's not a really big guy but it's not like he's really small either. He's actually only a hair smaller than Punk and he's got about 3+ inches on Bryan. He just really suffers from the Dwarfing effect as a result of the company he keeps. In this day and age he's not going to be written off due to his size. Right now his gimmick is sort of a small snake who talks a big game and takes a beating well because he's tough. But if he wants to move away from that he's really only 10 lbs away from looking like a credible threat. 



RobVanDingus said:


> Yeah, he played football at the D-III level. This article says HHH spotted him at a gym in his hometown
> 
> http://www.northjersey.com/sports/2...ck_football_player_Eric_Arndt.html?c=y&page=2


Awesome article! I can't believe he was a linebacker :lmao


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## Pappa Bacon

At what point if you're Ohno do you asked to be released? He is 33/34 years old and if he left could probably be right in the mix in TNA or go back to ROH maybe even NJPW. I get that a lot of his friends are there but he's only making what 25k a year and could probably make more in any of those places with ROH he could make the difference up with Indy dates. 


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## Waffelz

Who are his friends?


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## RDEvans

Waffelz said:


> Who are his friends?


Sara Del Ray, Antonio Cesaro, CM Punk


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## swagger_ROCKS

Cesaro? Doubt they'll speak up for him unless he was being legitimately held back for no reason.


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## RiverFenix

Snapdragon said:


> Enzo has old videos on youtube from when he was Eric Anthony on the indies http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBhSfJm7ya8


Great vid. Enzo definitely has the gift of gab, and he looked a lot more muscled up in some of those clips - given his physique now, I have my doubts that he was all natural if you catch my drift. He's still very limited in the ring, he sells okay but his offense is really lacking and unimaginative. I guess at worst he could be a manager/mouthpiece upon call-up.


----------



## Pappa Bacon

RDEvans said:


> Sara Del Ray, Antonio Cesaro, CM Punk


Daniel Bryan, Sami Zayne, not sure but possible Evan Bourne, Seth Rollins, Dean Ambrose.

I don't think he being held back I just don't think it's clicking. Some guys just don't mesh well and that's really what I think it is.

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----------



## Shepard

I think he'd actually fit in real well over at New Japan atm. Their style seems more geared towards him if it doesn't end up working for him in the E.


----------



## Crozer

Am I the only one who thought of Kassius when Zeb said "I would like to introduce my friend" .


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## Wcthesecret

Crozer said:


> Am I the only one who thought of Kassius when Zeb said "I would like to introduce my friend" .


Yes, yes you were.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Crozer said:


> Am I the only one who thought of Kassius when Zeb said "I would like to introduce my friend" .


A debut actually came to my mind when he said it, but no specific name came to mind tbh.


----------



## Dante Cross

So I guess he's in shape now..


----------



## BehindYou

Dante Cross said:


> So I guess he's in shape now..


Would seem so... lets hope ge shows us something which lives up to his hype.


----------



## THANOS

Well his upper body is definitely looking bulky, or at least getting there, but he's really having trouble trimming up those love handles. He needs to target them much better.


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## x78

THANOS said:


> Well his upper body is definitely looking bulky, or at least getting there, but he's really having trouble trimming up those love handles. He needs to target them much better.


You can't target specific areas to lose fat, stomach is likely to be the last area to go. TBH I'm happy enough with how Ohno looks now, if he can be entertaining then I don't see any reason not to call him up to the main roster.


----------



## Shepard

Spoiler: most recent tapings



well he's worked the most out of everyone on the latest set of tapings so it should be a decent chance to see how he's coming along. it's only the one picture after all


----------



## THANOS

x78 said:


> You can't target specific areas to lose fat, stomach is likely to be the last area to go. TBH I'm happy enough with how Ohno looks now, if he can be entertaining then I don't see any reason not to call him up to the main roster.


Side curls can target those areas very well. His cardio is amazing and as top notch as can be, but I just want the guy to have the best chance of success possible in Vince's company, given his age, which could be held against him in this era, if WWE think he'll retire in his early 40s.


----------



## McNugget

He just needs to fix his attire and he'd probably be fine. Maybe he should look into a padded singlet/tights look like Sting. He'd actually be great in the Shield's attire, but he came a little late to get in on that gimmick. Dark colors that cover his thighs/midriff would really benefit him.


----------

