# ROH's Showdown In The Sun iPPVs Discussion Thread



## Zatiel (Dec 6, 2010)

These tentative cards look weak. Once again, it feels like only two tag teams matter, so MDK, Bucks and ANX matches feel pointless. I am sick of Richards/Edwards/Strong wrestling each other. I don't see how Storm/Bennett will be special, though on a better show I'd give it the benefit of the doubt.

Here's hoping for great things to come out of the rest of the cards. Don't we know about three more singles match-ups for Night 2?


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

Zatiel said:


> These tentative cards look weak. Once again, it feels like only two tag teams matter, so MDK, *Bucks and ANX matches feel pointless*. I am sick of Richards/Edwards/Strong wrestling each other. I don't see how Storm/Bennett will be special, though on a better show I'd give it the benefit of the doubt.
> 
> Here's hoping for great things to come out of the rest of the cards. Don't we know about three more singles match-ups for Night 2?


Buck injured Titus last year, how this feel pointless?


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## B-Boy21 (Aug 22, 2010)

Two amazing looking cards so far. Really pumped up for that weekend. DGUSA and ROH having Great shows is always a good thing.


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## benturpen (Nov 8, 2011)

Friday: Steen/Generico, Saturday: Cole/O'Reilly, Elgin/DR & Edwards/Steen.


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## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Should be SOTM.


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## Ron Swanson (Sep 3, 2011)

Is ROH or DGUSA charging like 2 dollars for one of these shows? Or am I totally lost?

Friday looks good.


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## Neathe (Oct 10, 2011)

Ron Swanson said:


> Is ROH or DGUSA charging like 2 dollars for one of these shows? Or am I totally lost?
> 
> Friday looks good.


DGUSA is charging 1.99 for one of the shows, not ROH.


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## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

So Bucks/ANX are having a Street Fight one night and then a Tornado Tag match the next night? I feel like they should be reversing the order of matches they're having. Also they kind of sound like the same exact type of match. I'm sure they'll both be good but it just seems odd to do it on both nights.


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## jawbreaker (May 16, 2009)

Yeah, are they doing a street fight where you need to tag in and out? Because that would be stupid.


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

They are doing a normal Street Fight i think


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## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

The New Combination?


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## Emperor DC (Apr 3, 2006)

I'm ordering, purely for Steen goodness on both nights and LANCE FUCKING STORM.

Seriously, $20 for two shows is a fucking good deal, whatever people's hatred of ROH lately.

It still has less flaws than most companies in North American atm. Except CHIKARA.


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

I love to see a Ringmaster challenge between Adam Cole & Kyle O´Reilly


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## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

I think night 1 looks pretty good. if they are indeed having Steen/Generico aswell it's worth buying I think.


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## jawbreaker (May 16, 2009)

Manu_Styles said:


> I love to see a Ringmaster challenge between Adam Cole & Kyle O´Reilly


_why_


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

jawbreaker said:


> _why_


I like the concept of the match, i think it fit well with the ROH style, i like the first 2 falls of the match with Strong and Edwards last year and i´m curious to see how Cole & O´Reilly can work with the stipulations.


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## TelkEvolon (Jan 4, 2007)

Looking good so far, Bucks vs ANX should be good, crazy World Title match, Lance Storm's return, TMDK vs Briscoes should be awesome to see, couldn't really care about WGTT vs Briscoes.

That plus what was annouced through HDNet, sounds like some good times.


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## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

I'm ordering the Day 2, the Day 1 - no way, I'm watching DGUSA's $2 PPV with the PAC/Low Ki main event.

Good match-cards so far, btw.


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## Emperor DC (Apr 3, 2006)

JoeRulz said:


> I'm ordering the Day 2, the Day 1 - no way, I'm watching DGUSA's $2 PPV with the PAC/Low Ki main event.
> 
> Good match-cards so far, btw.


Why not order all of them considering DG:USA is only $2?

That's $22 for 3 shows.


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## Legend (Nov 3, 2006)

Looks fairly decent, especially with the matches from the spoilers added to them.

I'm the same as everyone else when it comes to having a Tornado Tag come _after_ a Street Fight. 

Eh?


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## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

DeeCee said:


> Why not order all of them considering DG:USA is only $2?
> 
> That's $22 for 3 shows.


When's the bell time for ROH's Friday show?


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## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

JoeRulz said:


> When's the bell time for ROH's Friday show?


Both shows start at 8. The DGUSA $1.99 special is just for a one-time only viewing ($14.99 for live and replay viewings) so if you're watching that then order ROH for the replay, and GoFightLive have been quick recently getting it up (don't know about 10A, I got that somewhere else.)


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## SeanWrestling (Oct 5, 2011)

Zatiel said:


> Once again, it feels like only two tag teams matter, so MDK, Bucks and ANX matches feel pointless.


I gotta disagree, the ANX/Bucks matches don't feel pointless 'cause they've been building this feud up since the Battle in the Carolinas weekend which was in December.

From what I've seen from spoilers, it looks like these cards are going to be stacked, which leads me to believe that ROH care more about these shows than they did the 10AS which is fucked up seeing as to how that weekend is going to revolve around WM.


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## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

KingCrash said:


> Both shows start at 8. The DGUSA $1.99 special is just for a one-time only viewing ($14.99 for live and replay viewings) so if you're watching that then order ROH for the replay, and GoFightLive have been quick recently getting it up (don't know about 10A, I got that somewhere else.)


:hmm: It shall be that, probably. I don't to miss DGUSA live, that's for sure.


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

https://www.rohwrestling.com/news/it-s-dual-duel-ft-lauderdale

As seen on TV, the Street Fight would go down on the 30th and while the Tornado Tag Team Match would go down on the 31st, but since that episode aired, there has been some serious controversy between the teams as to which match should take place first. ROH officials have heard valid points from all four men and have decided to settle the issue in the fairest way possible; with the flip of a coin. The decision will be made the night of the 30th as to which bout will go down which day, leaving both teams in the same position, having to prepare for either possibility.


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## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

Surely the only way to do it would be the tornado tag first, have the Bucks do something dickish at the end, and then have the street fight because ANX will be all angry and pissed and want to destroy some bitches.


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

Bubz said:


> Surely the only way to do it would be the tornado tag first, have the Bucks do something dickish at the end, and then have the street fight because ANX will be all angry and pissed and want to destroy some bitches.


+1


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## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

*The flip of a coin. Awesome.

Did someone tell them then that they booked the matches the wrong way around? I'll laugh when they still do the Street Fight first.*


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## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

Bubz said:


> Surely the only way to do it would be the tornado tag first, have the Bucks do something dickish at the end, and then have the street fight because ANX will be all angry and pissed and want to destroy some bitches.


Pretty much, though I wonder how loose they're going to be with the rules in the tornado tag and why they announced the setup on tv only to change it now.


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## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Yeah, the Tornado Match needs to go first, it's a fucking common sense, ROH. But no matter what, I expect two entertaining matches, especially in front of fresh crowds.


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## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

I definitely have a feeling these shows will be good, similar to the Centre Stage shows last year that ended up being their best shows of the year.


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## Matt_Yoda (Jun 19, 2011)

The shows are coming together quite well, Day 1 look more appealing than day 2 to me but I'll have to settle for Day 2, should be as strong as their Wrestlemania shows last year and fresh crowds are always great.


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## FourWinds (Mar 5, 2012)

Jesus I wish they showed ROH where I live.


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## SeanWrestling (Oct 5, 2011)

FourWinds said:


> Jesus I wish they showed ROH where I live.


I hope you're atleast watching the show on the website.Tell me you are.


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## maxpower2781 (Sep 23, 2004)

I have three 2nd row tickets available for ROH in Ft Lauderdale on 3/30/12 if anyone is interested.

$70 each. (They are $90 each face value)

Section 1 Row B Seats 1-3

Send me a PM if interested!

OR

http://www.stubhub.com/ring-of-hono...stling-3-30-2012-2544387/?ticket_id=441572086


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## ViolenceIsGolden (May 15, 2009)

Looks like both shows will be very good. It'd be really shocking to see Kyle O'Reilly win the ROH world title on night 2.


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## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

Updated with the Blind Destiny matchups. Clearly it'll be Elgin/Davey for the World Title and I wouldn't be shocked if they turned Lethal/Strong into a tv title match since Roddy is still owed one for the Proving Ground tie and I think they're running out of time to give him one.


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## SeanWrestling (Oct 5, 2011)

I was thinking about something, if Elgin gets a title shot as a result of the whole Blind Destiny thing, is ROH going to also count that as him getting his title shot he earned for winning SOTF or are they going to give him two title shots?What do people think?


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## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

They won't count it since it's Davey having to defend it instead of Elgin and Truth asking for their match. He'll get his shot at a house show or on tv and they'll probably use it to tease dissension between The House Of Truth.


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## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

SeanWrestling said:


> I was thinking about something, if Elgin gets a title shot as a result of the whole Blind Destiny thing, is ROH going to also count that as him getting his title shot he earned for winning SOTF or are they going to give him two title shots?What do people think?


That would not be a smart decision. If Elgin receives the title shot at ShitS, it's because he won the qualification match to enter Blind Destiny and he was the lucky to face the person who won the championship match the night before. They shouldn't take away his previous #1 contendership because of him getting lucky from Blind Destiny.


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## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Two TV Title matches, O’Reilly vs. Lethal on 3/30, Cole gets his shot on 4/7, will either former Future Shock member claim their first ROH championship? Be there live & in-person to find out!!! Tickets are available here.

Should be good, but don't like it. I wanted Cole/O'Reilly here..


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## benturpen (Nov 8, 2011)

EmbassyForever said:


> Two TV Title matches, O’Reilly vs. Lethal on 3/30, Cole gets his shot on 4/7, will either former Future Shock member claim their first ROH championship? Be there live & in-person to find out!!! Tickets are available here.
> 
> Should be good, but don't like it. I wanted Cole/O'Reilly here..


It's happening the next day.


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## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

Should be good but no way either takes the belt before Ciampa/Lethal have another match. Just please don't let it go the time limit again.


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

- An energetic high flying insectoid grappler is scheduled to compete on March 31st in Ft Lauderdale.


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## Emperor DC (Apr 3, 2006)

Fire Ant at Showdown in the Sun.

Makes sense.

Let's go CHIKARMY.


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## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

*Unless O'Reilly takes the belt there isn't really much point in that stip seeing as they're already having a match anyway. I hope one of them takes the belt off Lethal though, preferable Cole. I so don't care about anything Lethal does right now against anyone.*


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## The Streak (Apr 5, 2009)

I'm going to night one, and I think I've made a good decision looking at the cards


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## Pop Tatari (May 27, 2011)

KingCrash said:


> Should be good but no way either takes the belt before Ciampa/Lethal have another match. Just please don't let it go the time limit again.


Jay will win both matches as the way the Ciampa/lethal first match ended and with Ciampa stealing the belt there will definitely be another encounter.


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## Punkhead (Dec 29, 2011)

Are you happy with Lance Storm being back?!


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## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Young Bucks - ANX Globetrotter Promo:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=jSa4MxltT04


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## DryBones87 (Apr 1, 2010)

What if Steen makes Eddie win the triple threat so he gets a title shot the next night.


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## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Just saw the match involved Papa Briscoe. Like the reporter said, it was really fun, don't clue why it wasn't in TV.

Edit: Wrong Topic, sorry..


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## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

EmbassyForever said:


> Two TV Title matches, O’Reilly vs. Lethal on 3/30, Cole gets his shot on 4/7, will either former Future Shock member claim their first ROH championship? Be there live & in-person to find out!!! Tickets are available here.
> 
> Should be good, but don't like it. I wanted Cole/O'Reilly here..


I love Lethal, but it's someone else's time to carry that belt. Kyle to win, please, that way the Cole/O'Reilly feud can elevate both TV title and wrestlers (Cole & O'Reilly).


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

https://www.rohwrestling.com/news/chikara-represents-ft-lauderdale

Night 2
TJ Perkins vs Fire Ant


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## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Should be great.


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## Genking48 (Feb 3, 2009)

Should be a great fast paced match!


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

Perfect opener for Night 2


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## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

Like that matchup. I guess to fill out the card on Night One it'll be WGTT/Coleman & Alexander and then a 4way with Elgin/Ciampa/Cole/Fire Ant and then on Night Two it'll be a tag between Coleman & Alexander vs. Bennett & Ciampa if they stick with 8 matches per show.


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

https://www.rohwrestling.com/news/march-21st-video-wire


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## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

These cards are looking good to me. The strongest ROH cards for ages it seems.


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

My 3 main matches in both nights are: Kevin Steen vs El Generico, Adam Cole vs Kyle O´Reilly and Davey Richards vs Michael Elgin


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## ViolenceIsGolden (May 15, 2009)

Jay Lethal is walking out of Florida with the ROH world championship.


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## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

No way. Davey retains both nights and loses the belt to Steen further down the road.


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## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

ViolenceIsGolden said:


> Jay Lethal is walking out of Florida with the ROH world championship.


Not in your wildest dreams. Steen takes it on a June/July iPPV (if they have one).


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## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

The money match is Steen/Davey plus they've been building to it for awhile so Davey retains both nights and defends it vs. Steen at Best In The World 2012.

And in the newswire they're teasing both a stip for Steen/Generico for Miami and a potential Steen/Kingston match at the Unity doubleshot (Yes please.)


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## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Steen/Generico needs to be a Cage Match or GTFO.


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

If Generico doesn´t want to sign a contract maybe a "Loser Leaves Town"?


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## blink_41sum_182 (Apr 9, 2011)

Wish Steen/Generico was on night 2 so I could see it. Oh well...still should be good.


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## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

*Is their not a stip for Steen/Generico yet? Wouldn't be the worst thing for them to just work a relaxed rules match but it would be much better to give them a hardcore stip like Fight Without Honor.

No Generico on Night 2?*


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## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

Steen will definitely go over Generico. I wouldn't mind the match without a crazy stip as long as they bring HATE! But a hardcore stip would be awesome.

I'm just a little worried Steen doesn't become too dependant on wrestling hardcore matches all the time in ROH, even though the feuds he's been in do need those types of matches. I just don't want him to get that reputation as juts a hardcore guy because he's definitely better than just doing that.


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## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

As you said the feuds he's been in pretty much force him to go the hardcore route because of the hate involved. Once he beats Generico then I think he'll just do regular matches until either Corino goes for one last round with him or sometime during the Davey feud when they up the stakes. 

And I don't think Generico will be on Night 2 because they've said 8 matches per show and they already have 7 for Night 2 with four guys left without a match.


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## smitlick (Jun 9, 2006)

I'm gonna assume Steen will Injure and take Generico out of ROH. Hopefully not the case but it doesn't look good for Generico being a regular ROH guy in the future which is a massive shame.


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## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

I have a bad feeling about Generico/ROH connection. Like someone said - Loser Leaves Town is a possibility. But then again, it means Generico in DGUSA/EVOLVE, so I win anyway, lol.


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## FITZ (May 8, 2007)

All I want from ROH is for Steen to take the title and defend it against Generico one last time at Final Battle. After everything they've done for ROH this feud really needs to end with the biggest prize on the line at the biggest show of the year.


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## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

At best right now with the way it's looking all we can ask for is a Steen defense against Generico at all. My guess is it'll be Steen/Davey at Final Battle in a stip match for the title and the end of the feud. 

And one new match was announced for SITS Night One, Haas & Benjamin vs. Coleman & Alexander.


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## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

*Coleman/Alexander are really becoming Future Shock #2 but not as good as Cole or O'Reilly. They're good wrestlers but they're booked so badly that's impossible to care about them. They've never beaten anyone of worth and when you see them in a match with a team like WGTT, you don't think potential breakout match for them, you just think they're gonna lose again in a decent match. 

Looking at the cards out of 14 matches there's only 2 that I really care about and those I can live without seeing really. They're Steen vs Generico and Cole vs O'Reilly. Storm vs Bennett and the Bucks vs NAX Street Fight could both be fun too though potentially.*


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## jawbreaker (May 16, 2009)

Interested in seeing how Team MDK do, probably both of the ANX-Bucks matches, and obviously Steen and Cole's matches. One thing I will say is that they're definitely not holding anything back here. These cards are about as stacked as you could ask for.


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## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Seabs said:


> *Coleman/Alexander are really becoming Future Shock #2 but not as good as Cole or O'Reilly. They're good wrestlers but they're booked so badly that's impossible to care about them. They've never beaten anyone of worth and when you see them in a match with a team like WGTT, you don't think potential breakout match for them, you just think they're gonna lose again in a decent match.
> 
> Looking at the cards out of 14 matches there's only 2 that I really care about and those I can live without seeing really. They're Steen vs Generico and Cole vs O'Reilly. Storm vs Bennett and the Bucks vs NAX Street Fight could both be fun too though potentially.*


Actually Coleman/Alexander defeat WGTT...


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## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

*When did that happen? Clean?*


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## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Seabs said:


> *When did that happen? Clean?*


In the last epsidoe (I loved that match, BTW). And no, it wasn't a clean, Coleman I belive pinned Charlie after hard chair-shot from Jay.


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## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

*My point stands then. By the sounds of it the fact they won wasn't the main headline, it was the Briscoes/WGTT feud.*


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## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

Coleman and Alexander did win, but I still agree with Seabs' assessment. So far they've been booked as jobbers, and though they may have potential they haven't done anything to stand out. Their win feels like nothing more then a way to get them to fight WGTT at ShitS so that they can job there. They're basically O'Reilly/Cole v2.


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## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

JoseDRiveraTCR7 said:


> Coleman and Alexander did win, but I still agree with Seabs' assessment. So far they've been booked as jobbers, and though they may have potential they haven't done anything to stand out. Their win feels like nothing more then a way to get them to fight WGTT at *ShitS* so that they can job there. They're basically O'Reilly/Cole v2.


I'm not sure if this was intentional or not lol.

But yeah, I have absolutely no interest in Coleman and Alexander at all, simply because of the way they have been booked. They are good but having them job all the time won't get anyone interested. The same thing happened to FS, i really didn't care about them and now that they have started a feud i still don't care because they were booked so poorly.


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## benturpen (Nov 8, 2011)

This is where I don't understand the constant complaining about the "thin" roster ROH has at the moment. While maybe, yes, I agree, it's a bit thin and certainly weak in comparison to prior eras of ROH, you look at C&C, who now have two wins in the company(Bravados/WGTT), and TJP, who has one win in the company since his return(Mike Mondo, his first match on TV)... Those three guys are really strong talents that ROH has clearly made NO effort in elevating. They've been on 80+% of the shows since television started and have three wins combined? Let alone how they treat everyone else not DR, EE, Briscoes, WGTT and HOT. What's going to happen if ROH was to grab Johnny Gargano, or AR Fox, or Sami Callihan? Nothing. They'd get planted into the midcard and doing the same thing the rest of the roster is.


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## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

Bubz said:


> I'm not sure if this was intentional or not lol.


It was intention. I like it better than SIS or SITS.



> But yeah, I have absolutely no interest in Coleman and Alexander at all, simply because of the way they have been booked. They are good but having them job all the time won't get anyone interested. The same thing happened to FS, i really didn't care about them and now that they have started a feud i still don't care because they were booked so poorly.


The way Future Shock was booked is definitely one of the reasons I don't care for them. One minute they're jobbing, and the next they're main eventing a PPV.



benturpen said:


> This is where I don't understand the constant complaining about the "thin" roster ROH has at the moment. While maybe, yes, I agree, it's a bit thin and certainly weak in comparison to prior eras of ROH, you look at C&C, who now have two wins in the company(Bravados/WGTT), and TJP, who has one win in the company since his return(Mike Mondo, his first match on TV)... Those three guys are really strong talents that ROH has clearly made NO effort in elevating. They've been on 80+% of the shows since television started and have three wins combined? Let alone how they treat everyone else not DR, EE, Briscoes, WGTT and HOT. What's going to happen if ROH was to grab Johnny Gargano, or AR Fox, or Sami Callihan? Nothing. They'd get planted into the midcard and doing the same thing the rest of the roster is.


I do think the roster is slightly thin, but I will agree with you that the booking isn't helping.


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## ViolenceIsGolden (May 15, 2009)

Coleman and Alexander are lucky WGTT put them over in that match but if people loved the finish that's all that matters I guess.


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## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

*They'll never let TJP win a load of matches because there's no long term future with him. He's just a touring special attraction putting on good matches to make their own guys look good. Nothing wrong with that btw. It's an awesome card to have.

There's nothing wrong with Coleman/Alexander not winning much either. They're knew so fine but it's when they put them in matches on big shows with a top team like WGTT it's impossible to care about them or the match. *


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## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

That's true but even then you could have TJP and Coleman/Alexander go over the OVW jobbers and one-shot local guys so at least when they're matched up with other ROH guys there'd be a little interest (more in Coleman/Alexander's case since some ROH know how good TJP is). Plus when/if WGTT leave and ANX break up you'd at least have one tag team that could step up to the midcard without much effort while you try and find more teams. 

And at this point I've labeled Night One of ANX/Bucks the Street Fight and Night Two Tornado Tag since ROH has over the past weeks. Think you should reverse that but with WGTT/Briscoes on Night Two I guess they don't want two tag brawls.


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## maxpower2781 (Sep 23, 2004)

I still have three 2nd row tickets available for ROH in Ft Lauderdale on 3/30/12 if anyone is interested.
*$50 *each. (They are $90 each face value)
Section 1 Row B Seats 1-3

Send me a PM if interested!


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## EffectRaven (Dec 9, 2007)

KingCrash said:


> That's true but even then you could have TJP and Coleman/Alexander go over the OVW jobbers and one-shot local guys so at least when they're matched up with other ROH guys there'd be a little interest (more in Coleman/Alexander's case since some ROH know how good TJP is). Plus when/if WGTT leave and ANX break up you'd at least have one tag team that could step up to the midcard without much effort while you try and find more teams.
> 
> And at this point I've labeled Night One of ANX/Bucks the Street Fight and Night Two Tornado Tag since ROH has over the past weeks. Think you should reverse that but with WGTT/Briscoes on Night Two I guess they don't want two tag brawls.


I'm pretty certain TJP went over a couple of OVW guys, and I know for sure Coleman/Alexander beat the Bravado Brothers. Not much but they're wins


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

http://www.rohwrestling.com/connect/blogs/rd-evans/2012/mar/27/possession-nine-tenths-law

R.D. Evans letter


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## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

^^^ Hahaha, good stuff.


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

IDK what to expect in SITS with the TV Champion actually and that is a good thing, let´s see what happen there


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## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

It's a shame Adam Cole is not booked for the Day 1.


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

JoeRulz said:


> It's a shame Adam Cole is not booked for the Day 1.


He actually is: 

http://www.rohwrestling.com/live/events/2012/mar/30/showdown-sun-day-1-ft-lauderdale-fl

Scheduled to Appear:

- “Unbreakable” Michael Elgin with Truth Martini

- "The Dominant Male" Tommaso Ciampa w/ The Embassy Ltd.

- Adam Cole


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## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

http://www.rohwrestling.com/news/last-man-standing

Finally Kevin Steen vs El Generico in a Last Man Standing in SITS


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## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

Holy shit. I predict it's gonna' get crazy.


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## Phil_Mc_90 (Mar 3, 2008)

Although Steen v Generico should be a great match I still think it is too soon and should have been held off so Generico could take the world title off Steen down the line


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## Emperor DC (Apr 3, 2006)

If this ends in any other way than a symbolic chair shot to the head in similar circumstances to Final Battle 2009, Ring of Honor is crazy. Steen can then claim things have come full circle and announce his full intentions are on the ROH World Title, thus leading us to Steen's inevitable win.


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## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

Steen wins this, no doubt about it. But LMS? Hmmm, I can't even remember that steip being used in ROH...


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## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

They usually call it a Lights Out match iirc.


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## Legend (Nov 3, 2006)

Didn't Jacobs and Whitmer have one?


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## RKing85 (Mar 22, 2010)

Death Before DisHonor 5 Night 2 had Jay Briscoe and Kevin Steen in a Lights Out match.


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## geraldinhio (Feb 5, 2010)

Did Hero not have lot of lights out matches too when he first started using the Young K.O Kid gimmick?

Anyway it's a stipulation that ROH bearly do and should be a great match no doubt. I think there pulling the trigger on the Generico/Steen match too early. Does Generico not have a keyfabe broken neck? The match seemed to come out of no where either being honest. 

. It's not even gonna be the main event , will it? They could of saved it for a future IPPV to make an average show feel special. These are some of ROH's best looking cards in ages and didn't necessairly need Steen/Generico IMO.


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

I guess I'll post this here since it's the build up etc...






decent promos, nothing blow away but they did their job.


----------



## seabs (Jun 16, 2007)

*At least with that stip they can get away with doing nuttier stuff and not having to pop right back up after 2 seconds. Only problem I have with LMS matches is the down time during counts. It can work though if they don't do any ten counts until the last 5-10 minutes. It's when you have 7 counts just a few minutes that destroys the momentum of the match.*


----------



## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

At least it's not Loser Leaves Town but I do think that it'll be the last time Generico will be in ROH for awhile since Steen will probably so something heinous to him before intermission. Still weird that they could do anything to each other but the Package Piledriver is still banned.

Videowire was fine, I think almost everyone agrees with the first part of Roddy's promo and bleh at Nana's foot fetish.


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

Yeah the Nana stuff was random. I didn't even know they had the belt, what happened there?

I thought Roddy's promo was actually pretty good. 'I'm going to take the belt off someone who does this as a hobby and put it around the waist of someone who loves this sport and this company.' he came across as a face with that line though.


----------



## maxpower2781 (Sep 23, 2004)

I'm down to ONE 2nd row ticket available for ROH in Ft Lauderdale.

$50 ($90 face value)

Section 1 Row B

Send me a PM if interested!


----------



## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

BUBZ said:


> Yeah the Nana stuff was random. I didn't even know they had the belt, what happened there?
> 
> I thought Roddy's promo was actually pretty good. 'I'm going to take the belt off someone who does this as a hobby and put it around the waist of someone who loves this sport and this company.' he came across as a face with that line though.


The Embassy stole the belt from Lethal at the last ippv and are holding it hostage. I think after Lethal time-limits with O'Reilly Ciampa will be forced to give the belt back and he'll hit Lethal to continue the feud.


----------



## jawbreaker (May 16, 2009)

That was the best face promo Roddy's ever cut. Made me want to see him win when before I couldn't have cared less. Not that there's any chance he'll win, but it gives me a rooting interest nonetheless.


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

http://www.rohwrestling.com/news/march-29th-newswire

- Remember that ROH officials have said that each day of “Showdown in the Sun” will contain matches not announced in advance.


----------



## Coffey (Dec 18, 2011)

I plan on watching just to see if the crowd chants "YES! YES! YES!" in between everything again.


----------



## THECHAMPION (Dec 24, 2009)

Not the New York crowd so they probably won't be that over the top obnoxious.

New York ROH crowds are the fucking worst.


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

The YES! chant was awesome. Apart from Steen/Jacobs it was the highlight of that show lol.


----------



## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

Of course there will be YES! chants but they won't be as loud unless a match totally goes downhill like Briscoes/WGTT.


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

I read in Twitter that Eddie Kingston will defend the Grand Championship at Showdown In The Sun this isn´t offical but it would be awesome it happen!


----------



## SHIRLEY (Jun 9, 2009)

I think Kingston was hinting that he might turn up. Not defend the belt, unpromoted.


----------



## TelkEvolon (Jan 4, 2007)

Looking forward to seeing Kingston do..... Anything.


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

Yeah Kingston will be awesome.


----------



## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

I think they were talking about the NWA title which was defended tonight (Adam Cole vs. Adam Pearce, said to be good) and if they were going to do a Kingston defense they'd announce it. I also think there's going to be a NWA guy face someone on the ROH show tomorrow.


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

sound is completely out of synch for me - same with others?


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

PinkPanther21 said:


> sound is completely out of synch for me - same with others?


Yeah, same here.


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

Fixed now - and the show's starting off full speed with the Briscoes - love it!


----------



## fink (Dec 30, 2004)

Is any one getting it through Roku, it just loops the words ring of honor


----------



## fink (Dec 30, 2004)

This sucks, it wont play on roku and the audio is out of sync and constant buffering


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

fink said:


> This sucks, it wont play on roku and the audio is out of sync and constant buffering


Audio is out of sync and the video keeps stopping and going on GFL too.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Good match...


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

Yeah, GFL has a message up about that they're working on fixing it - anytime now would be nice!


----------



## fink (Dec 30, 2004)

This is why you have an interview heavy preshow to work on it b4 thew show is on


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

My stream cut out the last like two minutes of that match.

Everything looks good now though.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

its works now, Adam Pearce..


----------



## topherphillips (Mar 24, 2012)

Problems with GFL are fixed now.

and out of sync again...


----------



## fink (Dec 30, 2004)

they were good, but now its behind again


----------



## fink (Dec 30, 2004)

First match no ending, 20 mins in and audio still lags, roku at least plays now but audio is screwed on that too


----------



## fink (Dec 30, 2004)

i wish i bought dragon gate...


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Fucking bullshit.


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

This is fucking ridiculous.


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

Yeah - it's not getting any better despite GFL's message about their multiple streams - same crap for me


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

I'm done with ROH IPPV.


----------



## dk4life (Oct 3, 2008)

so its still lagging for others too, on their ste it said it was fixed, its about 20 seconds out


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

They are just morons, I wish ROH will back to PPV.....


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

If they can't solve the problems with iPPV, there's no reason to believe that they'll be able to handle the more-expensive technology of television PPV.


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

Fixed for now. Good match so far too.

Wow. Nevermind.


----------



## dk4life (Oct 3, 2008)

ahhhh the sound is pissing me off, I think its intermission they better sort that shit out before Generico/Steen


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Overall:

TMDK-Briscoes: ***1/4 (need to see this again)
Pearce-Cole: **1/2 (same)
ANX/Bucks (same)
Kyle-Lethal: ***1/4

Maybe its better, i didnt really pay attention...... Now i'm watching with music in the background.


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

Audio is even worse now lol.


----------



## topherphillips (Mar 24, 2012)

I stopped watching and asked for a refund. The audio was so far off, it made watching damn near impossible.


----------



## Coffey (Dec 18, 2011)

Tried & failed, asking for a refund. Won't be watching tomorrow. Get your shit together, ROH, fuckin' amateurs.


----------



## KYSeahawks (Nov 5, 2007)

So was ANX vs Bucks Tornado Tag or a Street Fight


----------



## The CRA1GER (Mar 14, 2011)

KYSeahawks said:


> So was ANX vs Bucks Tornado Tag or a Street Fight


Tornado today. Street Fight tomorrow.


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

Tornado tonight

Audio's so unfixable, GFL is just saying, "Oh, well - we'll have the replay up soon"


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

Absolute fucking joke. Why the fuck did I not buy Dragon Gate.


----------



## THECHAMPION (Dec 24, 2009)

The CRA1GER said:


> Tornado today. Street Fight tomorrow.


I'm surprised they didn't just always say this was the order they'd go.

It would have been really dumb if they'd done it the opposite way.

Tornado tag is a lesser stipulation than a Street Fight.


----------



## KYSeahawks (Nov 5, 2007)

Hopefully they have all this figured out by tommorrow because Im looking forward to tommorrow afternoon. Especially with the street fight is there anything I should go back and watch Lethal vs O' Reilly along with Cole vs Pearce interest me


----------



## Coffey (Dec 18, 2011)

So I guess GFL is to blame & not necessarily ROH themselves but they still need to share some of the blame.


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

I give up - I'll watch the replay - this is ridiculous!


----------



## The CRA1GER (Mar 14, 2011)

Jimmy Jacobs heel turn


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Heel Turn!! Heel Turn!! Heel Turn!!


----------



## dk4life (Oct 3, 2008)

So does anyone know when the replay will be up, I gave up just aftyer intermission


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Generico/Steen was amazing. The Main Event was great either. Haven't saw Storm/Bennett but I heard good things about this.


----------



## heyman deciple (Dec 23, 2006)

Seems like the best ROH show this year, shame about the Technical Difficulties.

This really needs to be fixed as it makes ROH and the IPPV model look bad.

This wasn't even ROH's fault. It falls on the GFL people.

For a group who produces so many IPPV's for multiple companies you would think they would have top notch quality.

DGUSA doesn't have these problems, and their IPPV provider is alot newer than GFL.

GFL may have to go.

After so many people recently bitching about the staleness of ROH's product for them to go out and hit what seems like a home run and have it ruined by production issues out of their control sucks.


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

Mike Bennett vs Lance Storm was Bennett´s carreer match hands down, what a awesome match it was. I think all the Bennett can´t wrestle, Bennett is boring should be finish after this match.


----------



## heyman deciple (Dec 23, 2006)

Manu_Styles said:


> Mike Bennett vs Lance Storm was Bennett´s carreer match hands down, what a awesome match it was. I think all the Bennett can´t wrestle, Bennett is boring should be finish after this match.


All the haters will probably say Storm carried him, giving Bennett no credit whatsoever.


----------



## EffectRaven (Dec 9, 2007)

Manu_Styles said:


> Mike Bennett vs Lance Storm was Bennett´s carreer match hands down, what a awesome match it was. I think all the Bennett can´t wrestle, Bennett is boring should be finish after this match.


Bennet has been awesome for awhile now. Hopefully this match shuts his critics up!


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

This is my review for the show:

The Briscoes vs TMDK: ***1/2
Adam Cole vs Adam Pearce: **1/2
ANX vs Young Bucks: ***1/4
WGTT vs C&C: ***
Lethal vs O´Reilly: ***1/2
Bennett vs Storm: ****
Steen vs Generico: ****3/4
Richards vs Edwards vs Strong: ****1/2


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

GFL gets 5 fails for their part of the whole thing. I can't judge anything else until I see the replay.


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

First half is already up. Second in 1 hour they said.


----------



## smitlick (Jun 9, 2006)

EmbassyForever said:


> They are just morons, I wish ROH will back to PPV.....


Yep there morons for not using a system that failed the 1st time they tried.




PinkPanther21 said:


> If they can't solve the problems with iPPV, there's no reason to believe that they'll be able to handle the more-expensive technology of television PPV.


Different people doing production. GFL.tv are to blame for the technical difficulties.



EmbassyForever said:


> Overall:
> 
> TMDK-Briscoes: ***1/4 (need to see this again)
> Pearce-Cole: **1/2 (same)
> ...


Why give ratings out if you didn't pay attention?



DMC6162 said:


> Absolute fucking joke. Why the fuck did I not buy Dragon Gate.


Because nobody cares about Dragon Gate to the point of where they pretty much gave away there iPPV and still only apparently did the numbers that ROH did for there last iPPV.



heyman deciple said:


> Seems like the best ROH show this year, shame about the Technical Difficulties.
> 
> This really needs to be fixed as it makes ROH and the IPPV model look bad.
> 
> ...


DGUSA have had much worse problems to the point of whole matches dropping out and having to offer freebies or refunds to everyone. Pretty much every week they've done iPPV theres been problems. iPPV as a whole is a flawed and very new concept with so many hurdles that haven't been looked at yet.


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

First half of the replay is up, GFL says the second half will be up in an hour.

Edit: Wow, totally missed that someone already said this.


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

And there are freezes throughout GFL's replay vid and the screen goes black for a while at the 10 minute mark - make it 6 fails for GFL for this PPV


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

It was a good show, better crowd, awful production by GFL


----------



## smitlick (Jun 9, 2006)

PinkPanther21 said:


> And there are freezes throughout GFL's replay vid and the screen goes black for a while at the 10 minute mark - make it 6 fails for GFL for this PPV


Wait a little bit. When the replay first goes up there are often slight problems with it playing through but its eventually fine.


----------



## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

smitlick said:


> DGUSA have had much worse problems to the point of whole matches dropping out and having to offer freebies or refunds to everyone. Pretty much every week they've done iPPV theres been problems. iPPV as a whole is a flawed and very new concept with so many hurdles that haven't been looked at yet.


But there are ways to test the building you're in both a couple of days before and during the pre-show. That's why sometimes you do a video-package heavy preshow to make sure everything is up and running. Plus if it is the building they're in I don't know how fast they can get things together before today's show to make sure this doesn't happen again.

About the only thing I saw complete with out any problems was Steen/Generico so at least I got to see the match I was looking forward to the most. First half was insufferable to watch with the problems, feed for me cut out for the entire Bennett/Storm match and then after Steen/Generico it started again and I gave up.


----------



## heyman deciple (Dec 23, 2006)

smitlick said:


> Yep there morons for not using a system that failed the 1st time they tried.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


My mistake, the times I have gone in on DGUSA IPPV's I haven't really had "major" problems. You are right, that IPPV is a new medium but with the amount of IPPV's GFL produces I just expect more from them. Maybe that's an unrealistic expectation.

I remember ROH being bull shit, particuarly Kevin kelly about bad tech issues on a previous IPPV and promising nothing like that will ever happen again and ROH having talks with GFL to address the problems and those problems were nowhere near as bad as tonight. Interesting to see what happens, if anything.


----------



## KingKicks (Nov 2, 2004)

Ended up going to sleep during O'Reilly/Lethal because I was knackered and the out of sync issues were pissing me off. Hopefully they will be sorted when the replay is up.

Really want to see Generico/Steen, Bennett/Storm and Davey/Eddie/Strong.


----------



## NewJack's Shank (Jan 29, 2012)

So production sucks, Dragon Gate was better this weekend IMO. Watching the reply but it sucks cause I knew who won thanks to my audio being ahead of video, Kinda sucks, Oh well be there live at Night 2 tomorrow.

wow fucking part 1 stops right between Steen/Generico, No excuse for this, CZW has had better production values. Like to watch it before I go to sleep oh well.


----------



## dk4life (Oct 3, 2008)

Is it just me or does part 2 stop right in the middle of steen/Generico?


----------



## smitlick (Jun 9, 2006)

KingCrash said:


> But there are ways to test the building you're in both a couple of days before and during the pre-show. That's why sometimes you do a video-package heavy preshow to make sure everything is up and running. Plus if it is the building they're in I don't know how fast they can get things together before today's show to make sure this doesn't happen again.
> 
> About the only thing I saw complete with out any problems was Steen/Generico so at least I got to see the match I was looking forward to the most. First half was insufferable to watch with the problems, feed for me cut out for the entire Bennett/Storm match and then after Steen/Generico it started again and I gave up.


I wasn't making any excuses for GFL. Its completely there fault and i really don't understand why ROH still use them.


----------



## TripleG (Dec 8, 2004)

I ordered the PPV last night and it was completely unwatchable due to the technical problems. I don't know whose fault it is, GFL or ROH's, but I don't really care. They really need to get a handle on these things because its getting worse. 

I'll try to watch the replay sometime next week, but I already know the results, so my intrigue has wavered.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Ok, after watching again, here's my full review:

Proving Ground Match
ROH World Tag Team Champions Jay & Mark Briscoe vs. TMDK (Mikey Nicholls & Shane Haste) - ***1/2
Really fun match, TMDK should stay.

Adam Cole vs. Adam Perace - **3/4
Good but short. Love the way they build Adam Cole, I guess he will be the next TV champ.

Dual Duel #1
The Young Bucks (Matt & Nick Jackson) vs. The All Night Express (Rhett Titus & Kenny King) - ***1/4
Great action but very short.

ROH World TV Championship Match
World TV Champion Jay Lethal defends against Kyle O'Reilly - ***1/4-***1/2

Tag Team Rematch
Wrestling's Greatest Tag Team (Charlie Haas & Shelton Benjamin) vs Caprice Coleman & Cedric Alexander - ***
Charlie is great.

The ICON vs. The PRODIGY
Lance Storm vs. "The Prodigy" Mike Bennett w/ Maria Kanellis - ***3/4
Maybe i'm too excited for this, but Storm's the man!! It was Bennett's best match, definitely.

LA REVANCHA!! – Last Man Standing Match
"Wrestling's Worst Nightmare" Kevin Steen vs. El Generico - ****3/4
MY GOD, WHAT A MATCH!

ROH World Championship Triple Threat Match
ROH World Champion Davey Richards defends against "Die Hard" Eddie Edwards and Roderick Strong w/ Truth Martini - ****1/4
The match was like for 20 minutes, which is good. Great match, great work by everybody and great action. 

Overall Rating: Best ROH show and the best show of the year by far (haven't saw DGUSA show yet). The arena looks good and crowd was also very good.


----------



## topherphillips (Mar 24, 2012)

Watching live was obviously impossible. So I watched the replay this morning, great event. Though it ends in the middle of the Last Man Standing match. So I still have not been able to watch the full event yet. Hoping they fix this before 1pm.

From what I have seen though, it's been a great night. Too bad all these tech difficulties got in the way.


----------



## Coffey (Dec 18, 2011)

EmbassyForever said:


> Overall Rating: Best ROH show and the best show of the year by far (haven't saw DGUSA show yet). The arena looks good and crowd was also very good.


Is it? Because the live show was a travesty and the feeling going away from the night sure as fuck wasn't "well, I'll just watch it tomorrow, then." I don't think the actual wrestling on the show even matters anymore. This show is going to get Ring of Honor killed in social media & the last thing that promotion needs is bad word-of-mouth. Word-of-mouth is the only damn thing that they have!

Just completely inexcusable. A high school talent show has better production. There should be people fired over this, and ties broken and I wouldn't be surprised if Ring of Honor themselves lost a ton of support from their fans because of this show. I know that I will never trust to order one of their shows again. GFL or not.


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

Everything is synced for now. Jacobs is out, imagine if I got to FUCKING SEE WHAT HAPPENED LAST NIGHT!


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

GFL seems to have matters under control after completely fucking up the broadcast last night


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

The Perkins/Fire Ant match makes me want to see Chikara - good stuff


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

Fun match between TJP and Fire Ant. Cole/O'Reilly should be good, hoping to see Cole go over.


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

Uh oh, feed out for anyone else?


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

Yep - me too - Fucking GFL


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

GFL says that power went out in the facility where the show is happening - a brownout


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

Apparently they stopped the match.


----------



## just1988 (Jun 15, 2009)

Luckily I've stayed spoiler free. I'm gunna watch them both later on this week hopefully.


----------



## geraldinhio (Feb 5, 2010)

I'm glad I didn't order now TBH . DGUSA's stream puts ROH's to shame. I'll probably wait to the DVDs.


----------



## Coffey (Dec 18, 2011)

PinkPanther21 said:


> GFL says that power went out in the facility where the show is happening - a brownout


Bryan Alvarez, live Tweeting from the show, says that the crowd is chanting "fuck the PPV." Not good!

(Yes, I realize this probably just means they want the show to continue as they're there and not worried about the at-home viewers, but it still looks bad.)


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

GFL says 4-5 more minutes - sigh


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

This is really awkward..


----------



## KYSeahawks (Nov 5, 2007)

So what have I missed had something pop up just seems like Fire Ant vs TJ Perkins and how was it


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

KYSeahawks said:


> So what have I missed had something pop up just seems like Fire Ant vs TJ Perkins and how was it


Jacobs vs Generico to open, it was alright, probably leading to more.
Ciampa vs. Cedric Alexander was pretty much a nothing match.
TJP and FIre Ant was a lot of fun. Now there is more fucking problems with the stream.


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

There was an un-announced match between Jimmy Jacobs and El Generico that was OK - the whole ending was crap, though. Then the Perkins/Fire Ant match was quite entertaining, then as soon as the Cole/O'Reilly match was going to happen, the screen went down. Now they're having an intermission.

Overall, it seems like quite a disastrous weekend for ROH - iPPV-wise, anyway.


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

It's at intermission. They really should compensate for this is some way. It's just ridiculous.


----------



## KYSeahawks (Nov 5, 2007)

Alright and there already taking intermission this is ridiculous. Had no trouble with DGUSA last night but so many with gfl. I have almost lost any interest in watching these shows due to all the mess ups.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

KYSeahawks said:


> I have almost lost any interest in watching these shows due to all the mess ups.


I Just don't care anymore..


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

Feed is back.


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

So did the Cole/O'Reilly match happen? How did it happen in a building with no electricity if there was a brown-out? Was GFL just making that crap up? I'm disgusted!


----------



## xpantherx (Jul 12, 2006)

Oh, fuck me, it cut out again!


----------



## Coffey (Dec 18, 2011)

Hypothetically speaking, if this catastrophic weekend was somehow feasibly able to put Ring of Honor out of business, I wonder how much of their roster would be able to be booked and find work elsewhere?


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

Stream is down again, hahahahahah. I'm not even mad anymore, it's such a joke I don't even care.


----------



## dk4life (Oct 3, 2008)

They are still having trouble shit GFL, I'm happy I decided to come to work instead of stay home for this, I still haven;t even seen then ending and the last match from last nigh cause they stopped the replay mid way during the last man standing, when it was going between the stages of awesome and amazing


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

I doubt that this has a possibility of putting ROH out of business. I don't think the ippv's are that significant to their survival, but they certainly better figure out other options - this is garbage!


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

I'm done, gonna try to stay spoiler free til the replay. There are no words right now.

Edit: Feeds back, probably won't last long.


----------



## KYSeahawks (Nov 5, 2007)

Stream is back and the least interesting match on the card is the 1st match I get to finally see. Miss O' Reilly and Cole along with the Street Fight but have to sit through this.


----------



## Coffey (Dec 18, 2011)

I'm really disappointed that the audio was out during that Maria/Mike make-out session. Apparently the crowd were chanting YES! YES! YES! the whole time and that sounds hilarious. Never more appropriate than at that minute. Plus, Maria getting heat for pulling her dress back down so her whole ass didn't fall out sounds funny.


----------



## C-Cool (Apr 2, 2010)

This is officially the weekend from hell for ROH.

Two of the absolute worse case production scenarios just happened for two days in a row. I feel horrible for the wrestlers, for it's not their faults.


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

Post match attack means this feud will continue, UGH, just end it already! Was a pretty good match though, still don't want to see anymore though. 

Yay, I FINALLY get to watch Steen this weekend.


----------



## Tony Tornado (Dec 19, 2011)

If the people who run ROH were smart they would blame it on Kevin Steen and his crusade to destroy the company.


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

Wow, figured it would be another draw there.


----------



## EffectRaven (Dec 9, 2007)

Based on everything I've read in this thread, it's been two good shows ruined by unfortunate circumstances. Looks like I'll be waiting for the dvds


----------



## Beatles123 (Jan 26, 2010)

recap of whats happened so far save the GFL Snafu??


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

Looked like Elgin died there, crowd is really getting behind Elgin.


----------



## Beatles123 (Jan 26, 2010)

Im not watching, aside from the issues is the PPV GOOD???


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

Yeah all the matches are good is just like last night a very good show


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

My new Match Of The Year - Davey Richards vs. Michael Elgin.


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

What a great match. Elgin is a fucking machine.


----------



## xpantherx (Jul 12, 2006)

Jesus.... Elgin vs. Richards was epic... Match of the Year so far easily.


----------



## xpantherx (Jul 12, 2006)

And the match is ruined by Richards bullshit post-match promo.


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

Bennett and Richards shut the hater up in the same weekend! Amazing Match, Michael Elgin is a fucking beast!


----------



## KYSeahawks (Nov 5, 2007)

Holy crap what a match. Elgin is defiantly a future ROH Champ. Plus he is something ROH is lacking a good big man wrestler (bar Steen).


----------



## Beatles123 (Jan 26, 2010)

So...a PPV that people wont bitch at ROH itself about?!


YES!!

YES!!

YES!


----------



## Coffey (Dec 18, 2011)

Loved the main event. Wasn't happy with the finish, mostly because Richards won, but the home stretch was a lot of fun. Not in the league of Kazuchika Okada Vs. Tetsuya Naito in my opinion but better than anything I expected from ROH lately.


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

The rest of day one is up.


----------



## topherphillips (Mar 24, 2012)

Elgin vs Richards was insane.


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

Strong vs Lethal and Richards vs Elgin were awesome matches, Richards vs Elgin worth all the fucking tech problems


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

Manu_Styles said:


> Strong vs Lethal and Richards vs Elgin were awesome matches, Richards vs Elgin worth all the fucking tech problems


It's still absolute bullshit that ROH should compensate for, even if it wasn't they're fault. But the 2nd half of the show definitely lightened my mood. The tag match, Steen/Edwards and Roddy/Lethal were all good - really good matches and the main event was incredible.


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

OK :

El Generico - Jimmy Jacobs: **1/2
Pretty dull but still good.

Cedric Alexander (w/Caprice Coleman) vs. Tommaso Ciampa (w/The Embassy) - **1/4
Good but short.

Fire Ant vs. TJ Perkins - ***
Fun match, but still, short.

The Briscoes (c) vs. Shelton Benjamin & Charlie Haas - ***1/4
Pretty good, Charlie's great.

Eddie Edwards vs. Kevin Steen - ***1/2

Jay Lethal vs. Roderick Strong - ***1/2-***3/4
Great move, glad to see Roddy as a champion.

Davey Richards vs. Michael Elgin (w/Truth Martini) - *****
Amazing.

Need to see ANX/Bucks and Kyle/Cole which both can be great.


----------



## Beatles123 (Jan 26, 2010)

to put on a show this good even WITH the tech problems deserves being praised. Seems like an epic 2 shows.


----------



## DMC6162 (Aug 27, 2011)

I'm watching the main event from day one and I'm pretty sure Kevin Kelly just said "It's a three way slugfuck..SLUGFEST it's a three way slugfest!" :lol:lol


----------



## TelkEvolon (Jan 4, 2007)

EmbassyForever said:


> Davey Richards vs. Michael Elgin (w/Truth Martini) - *****
> Amazing.


Should I take into account Elgin in your avatar?


----------



## EmbassyForever (Dec 29, 2011)

Here's some opinions from twitter and other places:

- Davey vs. Elgin was absolutely phenominal!
- Fuck a GFL refund.. I feel like I owe them another $20.. At least $20.. *****
- If guys dont give us a refund then you better give all that money to richards and eglin because that one of best matches i've seen in a long time.
- Thank you Michael Elgin, Davey Richards and the Commentary-team for that Match of the Year Candidate and Thank you Ring of Honor for those 2 great shows.
- Wow....the Davey-Elgin match was fucking incredible.
- Match of the YEAR 
- Wow...that match was incredible

Kevin Steen: Hey @ROHMichaelElgin...today you #StoleTheFuckingShow
And more..


----------



## TelkEvolon (Jan 4, 2007)

Yeah, I'm hearing that it is amazing.


----------



## NewJack's Shank (Jan 29, 2012)

I was at the event, when the feed/power went out, the official from ROH came out and they made cole and O'reilly stop wrestling...literally STOP.they then handed each one a microphone and made them "Ad Lib" while they were waiting for the feed to reestablish..it was a very embarrassing, low class, no production value event...i absolutely LOVE ROH wrestling been a fan since 05, but the company that handles there live feed/pay per views has to be the absolute worst company ever...what is it called...Go Fight Live..this is one thing you would think Sinclair Broadcasting would resolve..this is not a "new" thing that happens during their PPV's, it happens every time.


----------



## Beatles123 (Jan 26, 2010)

GFL is the problem, but ROH needs to kick them to the curb if this keeps up


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

The most substantive information that I've seen from GFL came in an e-mail response to an outraged e-mail that I sent them: "We have had tremendous challenges at this venue and we regret the problems." Was the facility that this show was at particularly archaic?


----------



## KYSeahawks (Nov 5, 2007)

For anyone interested Day 2 is up but no Cole vs O'Reilly due to the power outage.


----------



## NewJack's Shank (Jan 29, 2012)

The matches delivered but they dropped the ball big time by still keeping shitty GFL.


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

Yesterday after the show, Lance Storm said in a podcast with Bryan Alvarez that Cornette was livid about the production errors. I would have loved to see him rage about this.


----------



## NewJack's Shank (Jan 29, 2012)

JoseDRiveraTCR7 said:


> Yesterday after the show, Lance Storm said in a podcast with Bryan Alvarez that Cornette was livid about the production errors. I would have loved to see him rage about this.


"Uhh Jim the stream just cut out again"


----------



## Beatles123 (Jan 26, 2010)

Still a VERY nice PPV! Good job ROH, F you GFL.


----------



## blink_41sum_182 (Apr 9, 2011)

I have to rewatch it but live at ringside, Richards and Elgin was **** 1/4 - **** 1/2 definitely. My uncle rated it *****. 

Awesome match.


----------



## heyman deciple (Dec 23, 2006)

It's really a shame this happened.

ROH brought their A-game for both shows and delivered two high quality events that would have made both regular and first time viewers happy...

But the GFL fiasco is really bad, ROH should be celebrating they put on 2 tremendous show but instead they weekend gave them a blackeye and maybe hurt their rep and future IPPV business.

I could give them a pass for Night 1 but 2 nights in a row, that's inexcusible.

This will need to be addressed and some kind of make right needed.


----------



## smitlick (Jun 9, 2006)

Im gonna assume due to the power out, Cole vs O'Reilly is lost for good?


----------



## PinkPanther21 (May 10, 2008)

New announcement from GFL - "*We are working on the missing footage and Kyle O'Reilly vs Adam Cole which will be posted over the next couple days..", so apparently that footage is not gone for good.


----------



## Beatles123 (Jan 26, 2010)

I felt so PROUD to be a wrestling fan after the Elgin match...I'm gonna say something here, annd it may get red rep, but I believe in it...if ROH can get away from GFL's problems and continue putting on shows like this, they WILL grow into something special.

That match was a PLEASURE to watch. Elgin is a STAR in the making and I have said it since ages ago.

This entire weekend just makes me so proud to be a wrestling fan...'Mania...Dragon-gate...ROH...hell, even TNA.

This is OUR weekend, and THIS was an amazing two nights.

SCREW GFL, but...bravo, ROH...

Bravo.


----------



## Emperor DC (Apr 3, 2006)

I seriously thought Elgin had him at a couple of points.

That's when you know a match is something amazing.

It went very overboard and should have ended earlier, but at least it was not Final Battle 2011-bad.


----------



## Beatles123 (Jan 26, 2010)

I don't see it as too overkill. they ended it t the right length.

Amazing match. Nigel was having an out of body experience!!


----------



## dk4life (Oct 3, 2008)

Holy shit this weekend has been so freaking awesome!!!

Kevin Steen vs El Generico - Last man standing - Showdown in the Sun Day 1 - ****1/2
Final got to watch the whole match at work, and this was so awesome, loved the ending with Jacob's

Davey Richards vs. Eddie Edwards vs. Roderick Strong - ROH World Championship Triple Threat - Showdown in the Sun Day 1 - ****1/4
Great three way match

Davey Richards vs. Michael Elgin - ROH World Championship - Showdown in the Sun Day 2 - ****1/2 
HOLY SHIT!!!! I just became an Eglin fan, that was...speachless!


----------



## BKKsoulcity (Apr 29, 2011)

PEOPLE!! Give me some match suggestions other than Richards and Elgin which I will definitely already watch ...is Storm and bennett worth any of my time? I was always a big fan of Storm but idk if it's worth it or not


----------



## Certified G (Feb 1, 2011)

Reading these posts makes me very excited about Richards/Elgin. Definitely gonna try to download that one today, should be a good one.


----------



## dk4life (Oct 3, 2008)

BKKsoulcity said:


> PEOPLE!! Give me some match suggestions other than Richards and Elgin which I will definitely already watch ...is Storm and bennett worth any of my time? I was always a big fan of Storm but idk if it's worth it or not


Steen/Generico and the three way match was also great, Bennett/Storm was a good techincal match, and Marie's booty is worth a look also, to be honest. Edwards/Steen, Leathal/Strong and Leathal/O'Riley are also good, I would just watch both shows, they are awesome.


----------



## topherphillips (Mar 24, 2012)

Steen/Generico is definitely worth checking out.


----------



## Cactus (Jul 28, 2011)

Is there a chance some one can up Elgin/Richards? Rep and shit will be given.


----------



## RKing85 (Mar 22, 2010)

Glad I stayed away from the iPPV's. Nothing frusterates me more than shitty streams. Will be picking up both events on DVD though when they come out. Can't wait to see Richards/Elgin.


----------



## flag sabbath (Jun 28, 2011)

*Night One:*

*Briscoes vs. TDMK:* Solid opener. Dem Boys were actually more generous here than with the Bucks in NY & the Aussies did a decent job of winning over an understandably sceptical crowd. ***1/2*

*Pearce vs. Cole:* Not really sure who this benefited. Fine for what little it was. **1/2*

*ANX vs. Bucks:* As good as could be hoped given the time constraints, with plenty of Tornado-style creativity. *****

*Lethal vs. O'Reilly:* Some nice enough wrestling, but no real purpose or momentum & a step back for O'Reilly if he has regular main event aspirations. ***3/4*

*WGTT vs. C&C:* Little more than an extended squash met with wide scale indifference. **3/4*

*Storm vs. Bennett:* Storm is a class act, but this ran hot & cold with several cumbersome moments. Still unconvinced by Bennett - his charisma dries up the moment the bell rings. ***3/4*

At this point, the card felt more like an extended TV show with a bunch of short, tidy matches & one eye firmly on night two. Then came...

*Steen vs. Generico:* As brutal, epic & engaging as you'd hope for from these two. Uber-face Generico made Steen look like a monster and found sympathy & support where Corino & Jacobs had struck out. And the LMS stip put dramatic breathing spaces between all the chaos & destruction. The Jacobs swerve didn't quite make sense, but what the heck. *****1/4*

*Richards vs. Edwards vs. Strong:* Not a big fan of Richards & Edwards' nonsense (marvel as Eddie takes a back suplex on the apron then hits an Asai moonsault one minute later), but there was enough excitement punctuating the awkward silences to make this a worthwhile main. That and they only went 20mins. ****1/2*

Hats off to ROH for bringing one in under 3hrs, although ANX vs. Bucks and the TV title could have used a couple of minutes more. I'm off to watch night two...


----------



## Lex Express 12 (Dec 1, 2011)

*So......that show was........*

UN FRICKIN BELIEVABLE!

Now please understand, I have a great respect for the WWE. Matches like Steamboat Vs. Savage and Austin Vs. The Rock (W17) were awesome, but from the events I have seen live, that was the best main event I have ever seen in my life. I completely marked out when Elgin spit in Richards face. I have never seen a match like that live. The matches were phenomenal (except for a bad as ever match i have ever seen. The crowd was completely dead. Hell, at one point people started calling for Viscera and the Great Khali. Thanks alot Kyle O'Reilly and Adam Cole). The Brisco Brothers match was intense....and I was kind of sad that Jay Lethal lost the TV title, but at least it was to Roderick Strong. Maria Kanellis is amazingly gorgeous in person and as a final note......

Kevin Steen is ONE MEAN SON OF A B****!

I give Showdown in The Sun 8 1/2 stars out of 10.


----------



## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

Cactus said:


> Is there a chance some one can up Elgin/Richards? Rep and shit will be given.


http://www.wrestlingforum.com/indy-media/609355-davey-richards-vs-michael-elgin-roh-showdown-sun-night-2-a.html

Will wait until tomorrow to see if GFL redo Night Two like Night One with Cole/O'Reilly restored before watching it but it looks like a solid show. Wonder if ROH will do a make good like showing one or two of the undercard matches on tv for all the trouble during the weekend.


----------



## mk92071 (Aug 17, 2011)

I'm looking forward to watching ROH's shows, and the one show I've watched from this weekend (Open the Ultimate Gate) was awesome. Tozawa/Mochi and the main tore the house down.


----------



## jawbreaker (May 16, 2009)

Random assorted thoughts:

*The Ugly:*

- WGTT/C&C sucked just as much as I expected it to.
- Richards/Edwards/Strong was a fucking video game match. Ugh.
- Please for the love of god stop the WGTT/Briscoes feud. Match was better than Final Battle but that's like saying someone was better than Pol Pot.

*The Bad:*

- Briscoes/MDK was kinda weak. MDK looked good but the Briscoes aren't.
- Cole/Pearce was much worse than both are capable of.
- ANX/Bucks was really light. Could have used some more time. Was looking forward to the street fight still, but didn't get it.
- Lethal/O'Reilly was dull.

*The Decent:*

- Generico/Jacobs was fine. More later on Jacobs.
- Alexander/Ciampa was a fun near-squash. Alexander is a solid bumper and Ciampa's really good.
- Strong/Lethal was just barely decent, mostly for Strong winning the belt. Lethal needed to drop it and it would have been better if it was Ciampa, but Roddy is fine too I guess.

*The Good:*

- Storm/Bennett was solid. Dragged a ton at points and flag sabbath is dead on saying Bennett's charisma evaporates when the bell rings, but they did a pretty nice job, particularly with the finish.
- Edwards/Steen, and not just for Steen. Apart from a couple stupid counters (my god why do you need to do that huracanrana when you're going to take the powerbomb seconds later), he did a solid job of letting Steen get heat and while I didn't love the finish, at least there was no bullshit.
- Teasing Roddy leaving the HOT was very welcome. I don't think he needs to turn face, Edwards is filling his spot, but he looks ridiculously out of place with Truth. Fuck, so does Elgin. Bring back Raymond and Able, they actually had chemistry with Truth.

*The Excellent:*

- STEEN/GENERICO. Up to this point I was kind of annoyed by the show, Storm/Bennett was good but not enough to make me care. Then these two came out and had the best match they've had in ROH. Full of hate, not too proppy, and they worked the LMS gimmick fantastically. I'll talk more about it later because this was amazing. Exactly what I wanted it to be and then some. Generico made the fans boo Steen. I don't think anyone else could do that. Speaking of which...
- JACOBS HEEL TURN. Took a little too long, but it makes sense and he's actually a heel! As in, people boo him, and not because he sucks! Hopefully he can transfer that to Steen when he's not wrestling Generico, because Steen is just too awesome for his own good.
- Richards/Elgin. Really, really good. The finishing stretch would have been torturous if the crowd hadn't been into all of it, but they were and it was awesome. Richards did a good job of not looking unbeatable, and also of making Elgin look unbeatable. He gets a ton of shit these days and it's entirely deserved, but he was great here as the increasingly desperate champion. Elgin was good too. I wouldn't say he's entirely won me over, but this a real nice coming out party. Really good match that gave me some hope for ROH going forward, and a fantastic comeback from the abysmal night 1 main.


----------



## Beatles123 (Jan 26, 2010)

Cactus said:


> Is there a chance some one can up Elgin/Richards? Rep and shit will be given.


In the free on-demand section at Wmr-sports.net you'll find both nights of the PPV for free to watch.


----------



## flag sabbath (Jun 28, 2011)

*Night Two:*

*Generico vs. Jacobs:* A lively opener that served its purpose of re-establishing Jacobs in his most effective role. Generico desperately needs (and deserves) an ROH reboot.***3/4*

*Ciampa vs. Alexander:* A serviceable squash.**1/2*

*WGTT vs. Briscoes:* Good lord the ROH tag team scene has gotten beyond stale & judging from the post-match, this interminable feud still isn't over. Generico, Lethal, Edwards & TJP are all potential candidates to freshen up the doubles division.***1/4*

*Steen vs. Edwards:* Steen goes from strength to strength & all credit to Eddie for taking the backseat here. This was building nicely until the flat finish from outta nowhere.*****

*Lethal vs. Strong:* Horrible, horrible pre-match promos from Ciampa & Lethal sucked the life out of the place. Some decent exchanges as you'd expect, but the concluding ringpost shot & back breaker both looked really weak. ***1/4*

*Richards vs. Elgin:* Loved the early going with Elgin dominating & cutting off Davey's comebacks. Hated the subsequent tough-guy no-sell back-and-forth bs. Crowd was flat at first, but then these guys don't trade in heat. Business picked up after the dragon superplex & it turned into a fantastic match with Richards' reign seeming in real peril.*****1/4*

Technical difficulties aside, this was pretty much a two-match weekend for ROH, but those two matches were amazing, must-see MOTYCs.

I should also mention that Nigel McGuinness has quickly grown into one of the best commentators in the business. He's a tremendous storyteller (both wrestling & angle-wise) and his genuine enthusiasm stands tall in a business full of phoneys.


----------



## Cactus (Jul 28, 2011)

*Davey Richards vs Michael Elgin
ROH Showdown in the Sun Night 2; 2012/03/31*

_It has it's flaws and I think Meltzer giving it the full five stars is fucking insane, but considering this match has two guys that I don't care about at all and I ended up loving near enough every second of the match, that's got to be enough to get a nomination. They tried to play up Elgin's size and strength against the smaller size of Richards. There was sick moment whether or not Davey could hit a top rope suplex because of the sheer size of Elgin, this would of been a really cool moment if you know... DAVEY DIDN'T FUCKING RELEASE GERMAN ELGIN WITH EASE FIVE MINUTES EARLIER! Ergh. Aside from that and your typical ROH main event finishing stretch no-selling and near-falls overkill, that's all the bad stuff I can say about this match. The match was filled with emotion, mostly thanks to commentator Nigel McGuinness really getting into the match and rooting for Elgin which really set the mood for plenty of high-stake spots and awesome (and some bad) near-falls. US MOTY behind Punk/Jericho. _

_*Rating: ****1/4*_


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

Meltzer gave Elgin vs Richards 5 starts i just read?


----------



## flag sabbath (Jun 28, 2011)

Manu_Styles said:


> Meltzer gave Elgin vs Richards 5 starts i just read?


Did he give Okada vs. Naito six?


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

flag sabbath said:


> Did he give Okada vs. Naito six?


I don´t Know/Care, i read that and wanted somebody to confirm, but i give a shit about Meltzer OMG star ratings


----------



## smitlick (Jun 9, 2006)

He gave Okada/Naito ****3/4 i havent listened to the latest podcasts yet though as to what he gave Elgin/Davey but he had earlier said it was better then Okada/Naito.


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

thanks smitlick!


----------



## Ali Dia (Jun 28, 2011)

Davey/Elgin 5 stars from Meltzer? Every time Meltzer gives a match 5 I can't help but wonder how other matches didn't get 5.


----------



## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

I'm going to order the replays in few days, I'm so fucking glad I chose DGUSA over ROH. All I'm reading online is pissed off ROH fans, it's a true disaster for ROH. To fuck up like that, on that level... in 2012! And they didn't even bother to sell it, from what I'm hearing.

DGUSA's stream was smooth for me.


----------



## Emperor DC (Apr 3, 2006)

It was not ROH's fault, how many times does that point have to be made? 

Anyone who did not order missed out on a collection of good/great matches, so I pity them.


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

People before Richards/Elgin: This is ROH fault i want my money back, ....
People after Richards/Elgin: That match was awesome, Elgin is a beast, this match worth 20 dollars, ...


----------



## flag sabbath (Jun 28, 2011)

DeeCee said:


> It was not ROH's fault, how many times does that point have to be made?


That's a rather naive & ultimately irrelevant viewpoint. ROH's chosen iPPV provider dropped the ball big time & ROH's customers were left frustrated & disappointed. The promotion now has 2-3 months to win back the trust of its internet audience. They'll have to provide certain assurances for BITW & then deliver a glitch-free show.

It'll be interesting to see whether they stick with GFL for future iPPVs - I guess if they switch companies, then they can play your 'it wasn't our fault' card. And yeah, the high quality of Steen vs. Generico and Richards vs. Elgin definitely helped soften the blow from the technical hitches.


----------



## Coffey (Dec 18, 2011)

flag sabbath said:


> Did he give Okada vs. Naito six?


No shit. Sometimes I have no idea what the fuck is going through that man's head.

Okada has been incredible so far & him & Naito are my front-runners for MOTY so far. Then I come in here and see people praising Taker/HHH & I just don't get it.


----------



## Manu_Styles (Apr 13, 2011)

I think the problems in Night 1 was GFL fault, Night 2 was atmospheric troubles, nobody can´t be blame for that, shit happen

Off Topic: I actually watch Okada vs Naito and my main Puro MOTY still be Okada vs Tanahashi.


----------



## flag sabbath (Jun 28, 2011)

Ha! I just posted a ton of praise for HHH vs. Taker in the MOTYC thread, but Okada vs. Naito is still my MOTY. I watch Mania out of tradition & those guys delivered to their audience big time last night, but I'll personally take a great wrestling match over an OTT sports entertainment spectacle any day of the week.


----------



## TheAce (Jan 16, 2006)

Watched the replays and just wanna quickly say that both shows where better than any show ROH has done in a LONG time. I enjoyed these shows more than I have virtually any other ROH show in 2 years.

I'll be back with a detailed review of what I thought soon....

ALSO, GFL JUST GAVE ME A FULL REFUND...I suggest everyone complain and get yours, they pretty much ruined a great weekend for ROH...


----------



## geraldinhio (Feb 5, 2010)

Here's just some quicks thoughts about the shows.

*Night one*:

_The Briscoes vs TMDK _: Better than I expected being honest. TMDK were pretty impressive but this didn't stop it being a very average match. Will we ever see TMDK again? Why weren't they on night two? Otherwise , a decent opener.

_Adam Cole vs Adam Pierce: _ Random match , but was very average. As a lot of the undercard matches over the weekend were just very average. Atleast Cole went over.

_Jay Lethal vs Kyle O Reilly _ I liked this , a good match showcasing both men. The whole Ciampa thing was very , very stupid considering night 2.

_Lance Storm vs Mike Bennett _ Storm looks a lot older , but my God he's still great. Served it's purpose in putting Bennett over and was a very enjoyable match.

_El Generico vs Kevin Steen._ This was everything that was expected and delivered. Great match and really saved an otherwise very average show IMO. Jacobs heel is awesome and it kind of makes sense. 

_Davey Richards vs Eddie Edwards vs Roderick Strong_ This was exciting I suppose but was just a lot of flash and no substance and probably what we expected. At least it didn't go too long which made it a lot more enjoyable.

*Why wasn't Elgin wrestling on Night 1? Very stupid if you ask me. Him against Storm would of been perfect to put him over for Night 2.*


*Night 2*

_El Generico vs Jimmy Jacobs_ Would of liked if Generico sold his injury after his brutal match on night 1. Good match , nothing more , nothing less. 

_Cedric Alexander vs. Tommaso Ciampa _Really? A squash match on one of your'e biggest shows of the year that served no purpose. Ciampa's really impressive though none the less.

_Fire Ant vs. TJ Perkins _ Very fun match that ROH is lacking IMO. Just felt so different then the otherwise very average undercard matches. 

_Kyle O'Reilly vs. Adam Cole _-LOL

_Matt & Nick Jackson vs. Rhett Titus & Kenny King _-My stream went down. Don't think I seen their match on night 1 either thinking of it now.

_The Briscoes vs WGTT_- Another just very average match and was borderline bad. Does any care about this fued?

_Eddie Edwards vs. Kevin Steen _ Good match , fell flat with the random finish though.

_Jay Lethal vs Roderick Strong_ Good match from two good wrestlers but Ciampa's interaction made no sense really. Are ROH gonna do him vs Roddy? Roderick winning made no sense as ROH were building Ciampa up to win for months. Left me scratching my head , made no fucking sense.

_Davey Richards vs. Michael Elgin _All I can say is wow. Great preformance from both men and Elgin's breakout match. Everything's been allready said about this match. A must watch.

Good shows overall with Elgin/Davey , Generico vs Steen and the 3 way being the standouts. Some decent matches inbetween with some very average undercard matches were some were hard to sit through being very average and some just made no sense. ( See what I said about Ciampa.


----------



## MajinTrunks (Jun 22, 2008)

I was at Showdown in the Sun Night 1 and I've gotta say - I don't know how it came across on the stream, but live it was an extremely fun atmosphere. Easily the best wrestling show I've ever been to. I had more fun there then at Wrestlemania.


----------



## THECHAMPION (Dec 24, 2009)

R.Scorpio said:


> Davey/Elgin 5 stars from Meltzer? Every time Meltzer gives a match 5 I can't help but wonder how other matches didn't get 5.


Because despite the reverence Dave Meltzer is treated with, he's one man and judges based on his own personal opinion.


----------



## BKKsoulcity (Apr 29, 2011)

TELLY TV IS DOWN!! Can someone give me some other options where I can my get my ROH fix?


----------



## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

*ROH Showdown In The Sun Night Two - Davey Richards vs Michael Elgin*
Just goes to show how much a control segment, a HOT crowd and a good commentator add to a match, because this was fucking awesome because of those things, as well as an awesome finishing stretch. This was the best ROH match in fuck knows how long. I loved Davey starting it off fast by taking it to Elgin straight away with strikes and a dive. I loved even more the transition in to the Elgin control segment with Davey really trying to end it early by going for something crazy only for it to backfire and allow Elgin the advantage. Davey going for comebacks only to be cut off all the time by the power of Elgin was so great and really fucking fresh for a ROH main event match.

Davey did eventually get a comeback going which was the only part of the match I could have done without. They went in to the typical 'You strike me, I strike you' Davey Richards match mode for a little bit, but thankfully it didn't last long. There was also a stupid top rope Dragon Suplex spot immediately followed up by an Ankle Lock that was completely ridiculous and made no sense, admittedly the suplex itself looked fucking awesome and was the only real huge spot in the match. After that portion though it got pretty fucking amazing.

Some great near falls for Elgin that had me believing it was over even though I knew the result. I thought Davey was superb in this match for the most part, playing the champ who really wanted this thing to be over because Elgin seemed unbeatable (no pun intended). Davey's facial expression when Elgin walked through his kicks was so great. The finishing stretch was awesome as tits and I was losing my shit along with Nigel who really added something else to the match, he was absolutely godly on commentary. What a man. The submission trading was done very well, Elgin rolling through with the crossface to keep Davey away from the ropes was a great nearfall, but the spinning powerbomb was just something else. Again, Davey was great here as he legit seemed dead at points. Then we got the final stages of the match with Davey kicking the shit out of Elgin, only for Elgin to display some serious fighting spirit, and thats what it came across as. It didn't come across as just plain old no-selling, but it came off as maybe one of the best fighting spirit spots ROH has done for years. When Elgin hulked up and spit in Daveys face I marked the fuck out along with Nigel and the awesome crowd. The best ROH crowd for a match in years possibly. I have to say if the crowd wasn't that hot for the entire last half of the match it would have been nowhere near as good, but that wasn't the case and I don't care what anyone says, a hot crowd really does add a lot to a match. There are flaws here such as the pointless middle portion of about 3-5 minutes, but this is great stuff for the majority and the best match from the US this year not to mention the best ROH and Davey Richards matches for a long time. Elgin was very impressive but imo Davey made this match and thats something I didn't think I would hear myself say again.
*****1/4*


----------



## jawbreaker (May 16, 2009)

did you watch Steen/Generico from the night before? not sure if I like it better than Richards/Elgin, but yeah, those two matches were the best things ROH has done in fucking ages.


----------



## Pop Tatari (May 27, 2011)

Awesome two days thought the steen vs Generico was a MOTY candidate until i saw Richards/Elgin match which just left me speechless.


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## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

Richards v Elgin was amazingly fucking awesome. And yeah, Davey surprised me with how much I enjoyed his performance.


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## Kincaid (Mar 31, 2011)

Someone said this to me the day before the ppv: "Complaining about no selling and near falls in ROH is like bitching Rock and Cena aren't going to do enough hurracanrana's." Meaning, you gotta adjust your expectations to what you're watching. So I kept that in mind and sat down to watch the shows.

Man, that was incredible. Go Elgin.


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## JoseDRiveraTCR7 (Dec 14, 2010)

Kincaid said:


> "Complaining about no selling and near falls in ROH is like bitching Rock and Cena aren't going to do enough hurracanrana's."


That's the dumbest defense I've ever heard for shitty wrestling. One can have a great match without using hurracanranas, but selling, pacing, and psychology are vital to great matches.


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## Kincaid (Mar 31, 2011)

Sure, with the understanding that selling, pacing and psychology work differently in different companies.

edit: Which I already explained in my first post. It's about adjusting your expectations. Way to ignore that to get all snarly.


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## Last Chancery (Dec 6, 2011)

Kincaid said:


> Sure, with the understanding that selling, pacing and psychology work differently in different companies.
> 
> edit: Which I already explained in my first post. It's about adjusting your expectations. Way to ignore that to get all snarly.


Except ROH used to be all about selling, pacing and psychology, all of which now is ignored for whatever reason.


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## Bubz (Jul 19, 2007)

jawbreaker said:


> did you watch Steen/Generico from the night before? not sure if I like it better than Richards/Elgin, but yeah, those two matches were the best things ROH has done in fucking ages.


I haven't been able to get hold of it yet. I'll hopefully watch it in the next couple of days.

Also, LOL @ the thought that if you expect ROH to have no selling or psychology before you go in, it makes it completely fine. It doesn't. Theres still no selling or psychology, and you can't have a great wrestling match without really. Luckily, Elgin/Richards had way more of that than we are usually used to from ROH which is why a) most people really dug the match, and b) the crowd was so in to it. If it had just been a shitty all moves nothing else match like the FB 11 match, theres no way the crowd would have even cared about anything like they did.


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## Thumbinthebum (Feb 3, 2009)

R.Scorpio said:


> Davey/Elgin 5 stars from Meltzer? Every time Meltzer gives a match 5 I can't help but wonder how other matches didn't get 5.


Well yes because it contained everything a Meltzer 5* match should contain. You may have different criteria but his rating of Richards/Elgin is certainly consistent.


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## jawbreaker (May 16, 2009)

Kincaid said:


> Sure, with the understanding that selling, pacing and psychology work differently in different companies.
> 
> edit: Which I already explained in my first post. It's about adjusting your expectations. Way to ignore that to get all snarly.


They really don't, actually. You could make an argument for pacing, but even that would be fatally flawed because there's lots of different kinds of pacing that work well and it's more a matter of having pacing that works rather than just having "pacing".


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## Kincaid (Mar 31, 2011)

There is simply no way you can tell me that selling works the same way in Chikara as it does in WWE, for example. They both sell things in completely different ways. 

I went into that show expecting a hard hitting crazy match with a ton of cool looking moves. That's what I got. Check my post history where last month I was bitching and moaning about Davey. If you don't like the ROH format, and you keep tuning in at this point well...it's like being annoyed about coal in a coal mine.


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## jawbreaker (May 16, 2009)

no, the good wrestlers in Chikara sell the same way as the good wrestlers in WWE. have you ever watched an Eddie Kingston or Mike Quackenbush match?

the thing is, there is no "ROH format", or at least there used to not be one. there's plenty of ROH wrestlers who are excellent at pacing, selling, and psychology, like Cole and Steen. you can adjust your expectations, but that doesn't magically turn bad wrestling into good wrestling. if I watch a TNA show and enjoy it because it exceeded my expectations, that doesn't mean that TNA show was a good show, it means I enjoyed it, and that's all. you can enjoy it because you have lower expectations, and you can advise people that they could enjoy it if they lowered their expectations, which I think is what you're saying, but that doesn't mean that it is good wrestling.


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## scrilla (Jan 18, 2008)

didn't watch all of night 2. saw all of night 1 which i enjoyed for the most part. only saw Davey/Elgin from night 2. probably one of Davey's best matches, but still not a MOTY for me. still the same problems I have with his matches, but not quite as bad as usual. probably due to the crowd reaction and the fact that Elgin is actually believable as a beast. 

Elgin is great though. huge fan of the guy.


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## SHIRLEY (Jun 9, 2009)

The main problem I have with the never-ending IWC selling debate is that 99% of the selling would-be-snobs think that selling means "pretending to be hurt". It doesn't. It means getting people to buy something.


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## canmewda (Nov 25, 2006)

checking out replays tonight, i hope the Elgin match lives up to the hype, also stoked for Storm/Bennett


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## WOOLCOCK (Jun 24, 2011)

Les Kellett Lariat said:


> The main problem I have with the never-ending IWC selling debate is that 99% of the selling would-be-snobs think that selling means "pretending to be hurt". It doesn't. It means getting people to buy something.


You're right that selling goes beyond limping and hobbling to sell a limb, its about mannerisms and facial expressions. Austin's performance at Wrestlemania 17 is about as good as it gets in selling a match and the primary character, and for a more recent example Undertaker's face of shock after Michaels kicked out of the Tombstone at Wrestlemania 25 was supreme selling in conveying a sense of fear in the Deadman that maybe on this night he'd met a stronger opponent than himself.

The problem a lot of the time I find with ROH main events these days is that while the long term selling of a limb/body part leaves a lot to be desired, so does the reaction to kickouts. I mean this isn't helped when there are very few finishers in the company now that are protected to the point where a wrestler would be in disbelief that it didn't finish the match, but so much of the problems I have with Davey's selling are just as much to do with his facial expressions as they are his limb selling. I very rarely buy Davey as being shocked at a kickout or worried he may be in a fight he can't win, he seems to be almost Angle like in moving from spot to spot during a finishing run. Angle's apathy to Ankle lock escapes and Angle Slam kickouts drive me insane because you're just dying for him to show some emotion that will hook you into a match and his character, Davey's problem is he's so obsessed with his 'go go go' formula and spots that he does very little of the subtle touches in a match that I've become a bigger fan of these days. I can't remember the last time he was involved in a big match and he showed a depth in character that went beyond 'tough and intense badass', its like he doesn't think he needs to react to a kickout because he can just move into the next finisher or spot and that will hook the crowd.

I've not watched the Elgin match yet but I can't see myself loving it, even some of the more critical Davey fans on the internet have accepted this is one of his better outings, yet they point out that the finishing run killed a lot of heat in that Elgin reached a point of popularity with the crowd....and then the finish didn't come for another 10 minutes.


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## Shotakan (Oct 12, 2010)

Right, so for people who have seen the Richards/Elgen match, is it worth checking out if you think Davey Richards is over-rated and and actively terrible?


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## Beatles123 (Jan 26, 2010)

yes.


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## flag sabbath (Jun 28, 2011)

Shotakan said:


> Right, so for people who have seen the Richards/Elgen match, is it worth checking out if you think Davey Richards is over-rated and and actively terrible?


Don't worry, it still contains just enough ridiculous shit to bear out that opinion, but allow yourself to get swept along by the commentary & crowd enthusiasm and you'll be too gripped to care about how much you hate the guy. And just when you're starting to question your own judgement, Davey's nauseating post-match promo handily confirms you were right all along.


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## Shotakan (Oct 12, 2010)

I'll go check it out then; cheers.(Y)


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## scrilla (Jan 18, 2008)

Michael "Taz" Elgin makes it all bearable.


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## WOOLCOCK (Jun 24, 2011)

Watched Richards/Elgin and posted my thoughts in the 2012 MOTYC thread, some very good parts in it but as a complete match I thought the structure and pacing was extremely lacking. It dragged a lot in the opening 2/3rds and I just had a hard time getting into it. Elgin did look extremely impressive though, I could see him and Mysterio having a great match down the line with Mysterio being an expert at structuring these David v Goliath matches.

Definitely not a MOTYC though, in terms of a Big Challenger taking on a smaller Champion I thought Punk/Henry from RAW smoked it and I'll be shocked if Steen/Generico isn't the best match I see out of the 2 Showdown in the Sun shows.


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## KingCrash (Jul 6, 2007)

Joe Koff, ROH COO on the problems during Mania Weekend:



> "We are a customer of Go Fight Live. Fans paid Go Fight Live for the PPV. We felt it was Go Fight Live's responsibility to address the issue with those who purchased the PPV, and they did reach out to those fans. But the situation was beyond our control, so I don't feel like we had to address it. Had the problems occurred on our end, with something we were responsible for, I probably would have responded in a greater and quicker manner."


And GFL is promptly thrown under the bus. Probably shouldn't send out press releases that make you sound like a douche though.


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## TelkEvolon (Jan 4, 2007)

Fair.


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## Chismo (Nov 7, 2009)

LOL

I find it ridiculous when people say that Davey/Elgin was good/great because of the crowd, stating how "their stuff was bad, but the crowd made it better". For fuck's sake, if you like something, then like it. If you hate it, then hate it. Just don't be a fucking sheep and glory hunter. If I dislike a match, not even the hottest Budokan/Reseda/Toronto crowd can make it better in terms of quality. It adds something to the entertainment value, but quality? The fuck out of here. Double standards suck.

Same goes for saying "it was great, but the crowd barely care" small talk. There's a ton of matches with silent crowds I enjoyed. I like what I like, I hate what I hate, it's simple as that.


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## Thumbinthebum (Feb 3, 2009)

JoeRulz said:


> LOL
> 
> I find it ridiculous when people say that Davey/Elgin was good/great because of the crowd, stating how "their stuff was bad, but the crowd made it better". For fuck's sake, if you like something, then like it. If you hate it, then hate it. Just don't be a fucking sheep and glory hunter. If I dislike a match, not even the hottest Budokan/Reseda/Toronto crowd can make it better in terms of quality. It adds something to the entertainment value, but quality? The fuck out of here. Double standards suck.
> 
> Same goes for saying "it was great, but the crowd barely care" small talk. There's a ton of matches with silent crowds I enjoyed. I like what I like, I hate what I hate, it's simple as that.


I can't buy into that argument, crowd response is a huge part of a wrestling event and has to be taken into account; no empty-arena match will achieve all-time classic status for this reason (with the possible exception if the very first one). Look at it from the opposite point of view, plenty of matches are ruined by crowds, just look at TNA when the Crucial Crew were around. Finally it should be remembered that a good crowd is one that reacts to what they're seeing so the only bad reaction is the self marking one.


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## flag sabbath (Jun 28, 2011)

JoeRulz said:


> LOL
> 
> I find it ridiculous when people say that Davey/Elgin was good/great because of the crowd, stating how "their stuff was bad, but the crowd made it better". For fuck's sake, if you like something, then like it. If you hate it, then hate it. Just don't be a fucking sheep and glory hunter. If I dislike a match, not even the hottest Budokan/Reseda/Toronto crowd can make it better in terms of quality. It adds something to the entertainment value, but quality? The fuck out of here. Double standards suck.
> 
> Same goes for saying "it was great, but the crowd barely care" small talk. There's a ton of matches with silent crowds I enjoyed. I like what I like, I hate what I hate, it's simple as that.


Because the ghetto section of a wrestling forum is full of sheep & glory hunters. Yeesh.

The quality of Davey vs. Elgin was definitely _enhanced_ by the finishing stretch crowd reactions, in the same way that Richards' last three NY iPPV matches were hindered & exposed by audience indifference.

As several posters have mentioned, Davey vs. Elgin also benefited from being 10-15 mins shorter than those previous efforts, from Nigel's world class commentary & from Elgin's dominance in the early exchanges. These are all contributing factors to match quality - and in the context of liking or hating something, what on earth is the difference between a bout's quality & its entertainment value?

If your appreciation of a match is unwavering regardless the crowd response, then good for you. But to dismiss it as a factor in other people's enjoyment (especially when it's what every match should be designed to provoke) is oddly naive.


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