# **All TV Ratings Talk Here**



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

New thread?

:yes :yes :yes


----------



## Starbuck

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

A new thread is best for business.


----------



## Biast

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***


----------



## Starbuck

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

9/11 jokes. That's cold.


----------



## austin316 G.O.A.T

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***


----------



## austin316 G.O.A.T

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

*Let the games begin*


----------



## Biast

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Starbuck said:


> 9/11 jokes. That's cold.


Hey, there were some positive aspects! Flight training schools for example proved that they are expensive but worth it, a lot of people actually learned how to spell “Afghanistan” correctly and the sales for U.S. flags went way up. Plus, now they have much lower electric bills for Manhattan and some great new unobstructed views of the city.



























































I'm so going to hell. :jordan2


----------



## Cliffy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Remember that one CM Punk interview that lost 200,000 viewers at the top of the hour ?

Good Times.


----------



## Biast

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Cliffy Byro said:


> Remember that one CM Punk interview that lost 200,000 viewers at the top of the hour ?
> 
> Good Times.





> - Q8: Raw fell to a 1.74 rating for Santino vs. Fandango, plus one commercial.
> 
> - Q9: Raw popped to a 2.47 rating for C.M. Punk's return, Paul Heyman promo exchange, and Ryback brawl. There was no commercial break during the segment, similar to Q1.
> 
> Punk vs. Heyman is a clearly-defined, singular feud centered on two compelling, strong characters. It drew a big audience this week. On the other hand, the Daniel Bryan & Team Babyfaces vs. the Kinda-Heel Power Couple storyline is a mess, which produced an odd 11-on-3 main event featuring interchangeable, emasculated babyfaces alongside the most-recent WWE champion, Daniel Bryan, whose character is in a delicate position right now. The result was a lukewarm reception for this week's main event.


Good times indeed!


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Cliffy Byro said:


> Remember that one CM Punk interview that lost 200,000 viewers at the top of the hour ?
> 
> Good Times.



:lol


----------



## BOOTS 2 ASSES

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

So,here it all begins once again unk :bryan2


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Boots2Asses said:


> So,here it all begins once again unk :bryan2


In before some Punk fan starts crying about Bryan's being bigger than Punk's.


----------



## Guy LeDouche

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

A brand new Ratings thread, which only means one thing:


----------



## funnyfaces1

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Those summaries and interpretations that ratings reports give are really really bad and make no sense whatsoever. How is Bryan's character in a delicate position?




Ah what the hell am I doing? :henry1 :henry1 :henry1


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Looking at the Smackdown and Raw ratings, it looks like the polloi arent enamored of The Shield being put in an underdog role against the jobber Illuminati.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



funnyfaces1 said:


> Those summaries and interpretations that ratings reports give are really really bad and make no sense whatsoever. How is Bryan's character in a delicate position?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ah what the hell am I doing? :henry1 :henry1 :henry1


 That happens in a lot of these reports, Instead of just reporting the raw numbers, whoever writes up the report adds in their own biases. They basically put a spin on it like they are some political operative.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Bryan does'nt draw.


----------



## WWE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

:HHH2


----------



## Soulrollins

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Dammit i fucking love Bryan.

But is really pathetic seeing his hardcore fans forcing themselves to believe he's a bigger draw than than everyone especially Punk, when he's not. :lol


----------



## Jof

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

:henry1 :trips2


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

This thread should be named "The Official Bash on the Vanilla Midgets Thread". unk5 :bryan


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



> C.M. Punk's return segment on the Monday, September 23 WWE Raw episode single-handedly boosted this week's Raw TV rating.
> 
> Punk's segment scored a 2.47 rating in the males 18-49 demographic. The next-highest rating was a 2.21 rating for a five-minute over-run, which contained the finish of the Team Bryan vs. Team Shield handicap elimination match.
> 
> - Punk's 2.47 rating was the highest-rated Q9 segment (top of the third hour) in one month and second-highest-rated of the last two months.
> 
> - The 2.21 over-run rating was the lowest since July 29. Last week's over-run rating was a 2.65 for the finish of Daniel Bryan vs. Roman Reigns one-on-one, plus a post-match angle involving the babyface roster "making the save" for Bryan.


Because the Bryan mark butthurt over this is just so damn funny.

That CM GOAT. unk


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

So what you are saying is 2.47 is lower than 2.65. Excellent observation.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Comparing two different weeks. :lmao

The excuses have just stooped so low, and it just keeps on getting funnier. What else ya got?


----------



## #Mark

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



> Punk vs. Heyman is a clearly-defined, singular feud centered on two compelling, strong characters. It drew a big audience this week. On the other hand, the Daniel Bryan & Team Babyfaces vs. the Kinda-Heel Power Couple storyline is a mess, which produced an odd 11-on-3 main event featuring interchangeable, emasculated babyfaces alongside the most-recent WWE champion, Daniel Bryan, whose character is in a delicate position right now. The result was a lukewarm reception for this week's main event.


Is this from the torch or the observer? Really accurate description of what's wrong with the Corporation angle.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Congrats on Punk finally beating the Corporation for the first time in months. :clap

Too bad he can't draw in a match with Brock Lesnar, proving to be the only guy who can't do that.

unk


----------



## CHIcagoMade

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

New thread means new meltdowns.

:mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



ShowStopper '97 said:


> Congrats on Punk finally beating the Corporation for the first time in months. :clap
> 
> Too bad he can't draw in a match with Brock Lesnar, proving to be the only guy who can't do that.
> 
> unk


:lol

The Corporation should be topping the night every night. You know, because it's the main program. The fact that Punk working with Axel and Ryback topped it not once but twice, is hilarious. DAT "MAJOR" PROGRAM.

And yeah, like how Wrestlemania doing less than last year falls on the hands of Brock/HHH. Oh wait, no, that wasn't the main focus. Kind of like Punk/Lesnar. Try harder pal.

Bryan, in a match with Cena and with the help of Punk/Lesnar, could only pop the lowest SS buys since '97. :lmao The poor guy's hopeless.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Wrestlinfan35 said:


> :lol
> 
> The Corporation should be topping the night every night. You know, because it's the main program. The fact that Punk working with Axel and Ryback topped it not once but twice, is hilarious. DAT "MAJOR" PROGRAM.
> 
> And yeah, like how Wrestlemania doing less than last year falls on the hands of Brock/HHH. Oh wait, no, *that wasn't the main focus. Kind of like Punk/Lesnar. Try harder pal.*
> 
> Bryan, in a match with Cena and with the help of Punk/Lesnar, could only pop the lowest SS buys since '97. :lmao The poor guy's hopeless.


DAT SELLING POINT OF SUMMERSLAM, ACCORDING TO YOU.

You know, like when Dunmer, and the rest of this thread decided to BURY the absolute shit out of you like no one else ever has here?

Yeah, DAT BURIAL.

unk :buried unk :buried unk :buried unk :buried

So, nah, you try harder.

unk


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Coming from the guy who said Bryan's the spotlight of the PPV. Oh man, looks like somebody was gotten to pretty quickly. 

:lmao


----------



## reDREDD

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

lolvanillamidgets

when will all people realise realise they are all equally inferior to Kevin nash

also why is neidhert with DX in showstoppers sig


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Ah yes, the go to phrase when your burial has been brought up.

ReDredd, a couple of weeks after the Montreal Screwjob, Niedhart was still in the WWF and they had HBK offer him to join, and he did, only to get turned at the end of Raw, and they spray-painted WCW on his back, and he went to WCW.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

If Bryan could only pop less than 300k buys for a Summerslam, with that much help, boy do I fear for that NOC number. Some of you may have to be put on suicide watch with the way you cry about Bryan's hilarious failures in here.

I'ma just get that popcorn ready.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Wrestlinfan35 said:


> If Bryan could only pop less than 300k buys for a Summerslam, with that much help, boy do I fear for that NOC number. Some of you may have to be put on suicide watch with the way you cry about Bryan's hilarious failures in here.
> 
> I'ma just get that popcorn ready.


His failures can't be that bad if they're willing to make him the main babyface without John Cena holding his hand the entire time.


----------



## KingLobos

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Triple H is single handily saving the show right now from being an absolute bomb. It's sad that somebody who has been around since the New Generation era is still the guy at the top of the food chain and the focal point of the show.


----------



## reDREDD

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

did someone say focal point?

:sturridge


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

I gotta give credit where it's due. Dat Heyman and dat cart full of ratingz coupled with Da Big Guy were able to salvage that disaster of a segment that the pandersaurus Punk presented.

If only Vince could trust Phil to helm the ship with Cena gone. Maybe we could see him starting and finishing shows. Nah. he's better suited to losing on ppvs and feuding with those on his charisma level: i.e. Axel and Ryback. Punk is content to be a minnow swimming in the shallow end and not drawing those overruns like that shark D-Bry.


----------



## joeycalz

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

CM Punk sucks. Daniel Bryan sucks. Their drawing ability in 2013 pales in comparison to some of the greatest superstars of all-time. They don't even sell merchandise, either. They are just vanilla midgets who are immensely overrated by their marks and bring absolute no positive contributions to this business.

If you guys want to talk about a REAL DRAW, talk about the greatest WWE Superstar to ever live, JOHN CENA. His accomplishments are endless. Multiple WWE Championships, 2x Royal Rumble Winner, Superstar of the Year and countless epic feuds that have drawn millions of fans AROUND THE WORLD. John Cena is solely responsible for some of the highest purchased Wrestlemanias of all-time. Facts are facts. L-O-L.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Geeks talking about who draws more out of Bryan and Punk = massive :ti


----------



## MaybeLock

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Cena needs to come back to calm down everybody in this thread :cena3


----------



## Soulrollins

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

:lol This thread is hilarious.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



ReDREDD said:


> lolvanillamidgets
> 
> when will all people realise realise they are all equally inferior to Kevin nash
> 
> also why is neidhert with DX in showstoppers sig


So true. Just look @ about :38 in






Midgets like Punk and Bryan can only dream of being the largest grossing champion of all time like Nash was.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

i'm sorry, did someone in here just say that Bryan doesn't sell merchandise? ha ha wow! now we're desperate and the overrun this week didn't gain as it usually does, but no one wants to see jobbers helping him, not that hard to figure out.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

The bottom line is Punk aint no Stone Cold.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Punk supporters just can't admit it..i dont know why.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> i'm sorry, did someone in here just say that Bryan doesn't sell merchandise? ha ha wow! now we're desperate and the overrun this week didn't gain as it usually does, but no one wants to see jobbers helping him, not that hard to figure out.


So he sold some t-shirts to some kids. Big deal. Has he ever had his name on the marquee of Madison Square Garden? No.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Has Nash ever had his likeness on the alternate cover of a video game?


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> Has Nash ever had his likeness on the alternate cover of a video game?


No but he had his likeness used for a *main* cover:


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

has he ever been on the cover of WWE magazine? I dont care what anyone says....Bryan might not draw big right now, but they're setting him up to draw giganticly the rest of his career, this is only the start.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> has he ever been on the cover of WWE magazine? I dont care what anyone says....Bryan might not draw big right now, but they're setting him up to draw giganticly the rest of his career, this is only the start.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Nash could have been on the cover of Giant Gimp Quarterly.


----------



## Biast

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Dat Nash. He has done it all. True legend! :troll


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

okay okay, so then must mean Bryan has made it big if he has done everything Nash has.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Until Bryan appears in a TMNT movie he has accomplished squat.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> okay okay, so then must mean Bryan has made it big if he has done everything Nash has.


Except he hasn't done everything Nash has. Was Bryan the star of a movie that made 160 million dollars? No, but Nash was.


----------



## Choke2Death

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Not to mention, Nash held the title for longer in one go compared to Bryan's three reigns COMBINED! :nash :troll

This new thread should be good. Always entertaining to read the meltdowns and battles between Bryan's and Punk's disciples.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

DAT SUPER SHREDDER! Kevin Nash's career SHITS on everyone.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Choke2Death said:


> Not to mention, Nash held the title for longer in one go compared to Bryan's three reigns COMBINED! :nash :troll
> 
> This new thread should be good. Always entertaining to read the meltdowns and battles between Bryan's and Punk's disciples.


And that was back when the WWE title was still seen as legit and not some prop that they on nerds like Punk or Bryan.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

i'm actually being all kiddy and sarcastic this whole time, i'm not picking a mark war, think of me as the kid saying "but but but" Hey that comparison about the movie was messed up and not fair LOL not a fair fight, Bryan doesn't want to be in movies lol


----------



## MaybeLock

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Bryan hasn't torn enough quads to be compared to a legend like Nash


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Big Sexy> Goatface> Short order cook.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Bryan doesn't want to be a big star, he just wants to be WWE champion..i think that's the difference between him and other wrestlers..he doesn't care about the money and how famous he gets, he just wants to be WWE champion to prove that he's just as good if not a little better than most...That's all he cares about, I doubt he wants to be in a movie or tv show or on the cover of a cereal box. or the face of the company, that's just what his fans want...but in reality, he'll just be champion and that's it....which is perfectly fine. Because he's made a damn good living for himself, has a great life. He doesn't need that other stuff...he's still very valuable to the WWE regardless....


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Damn, the essays seem to be accumulating faster and faster...


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Big Kev being named the new Raw GM and celebrating by dwarf tossing Bryan/Punk/Ziggler all in a row = Ratings not seen since the Vinny Ru era.


----------



## joeycalz

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

How the **** did this thread turn into a Kevin Nash thread? I swear.. This ****ing forum.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



joeycalz said:


> How the **** did this thread turn into a Kevin Nash thread? I swear.. This ****ing forum.


You can't have a thread that's basically about drawing without having it be about one of the biggest drawing wrestlers of all time, Kevin Nash.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

how jealous of the Kliqs success was Scott Hall? that dude got shafted in the championship title department.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Don't think he's jealous at all since he's had a successful career. He has a lot of regrets as far as the shit he's done but I doubt there's much jealousy in him. How can somebody be jealous when they are one of the core members of one of the biggest stables in wrestling history?


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

yeah but he was never world champion...i mean he probably could have been one of the greatest ever.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> yeah but he was never world champion...i mean he probably could have been one of the greatest ever.


And? Winning a fake title is irrelevant when considering how great someone is. Hall, Piper, Henning, Roberts, Regal, etc never won major world titles yet are highly regarded. Promos, matches, influence, etc > leather and metal. Miz is a former WWE champion yet he's much worse than any of the guys that I just mentioned.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Big Kev being named the new Raw GM and celebrating by dwarf tossing Bryan/Punk/Ziggler all in a row = Ratings not seen since the Vinny Ru era.


That would be a contender for greatest Raw segment in history.

The only thing that could possibly make it better is if they transposed onomatopoeias over the screen at the same time a la Batman 1966. You know, like BIFF, POW, SOCK! VANILLA MIDGET! TOO SMALL! CAN'T DRAW!


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

you have a point....i guess titles don't mean much...just makes promoters look silly when they don't recognize real talent..all of those guys you mentioned were Gods in the ring.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



ShowStopper '97 said:


> DAT SUPER SHREDDER! Kevin Nash's career SHITS on everyone.


Wrong one. That's just regular old Shredder, that weak pussy.










Now this...this physique will have you crushing vanilla midget turtles from sun up til sundown. Note how drinking the ooze also caused his costume to grow extra spikes. You think if Bryan or Punk drank it that their costumes would do that? I don't think so. Clearly, this is a side effect unique to Big Sexy.


----------



## Soulrollins

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

That big piece of shit of Kevin Nash was Shredder? I just realized this shit now..


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Speaking of Punk lol @ when Nash annihilated him with "Take a shower, hit the weights, get clue" and the waffle house insult.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Vanilla Midgit HBK V Larger then life Nash at WM 11

WHO WON THAT MATCH YO?

That year Nash and his tallness went on to take the business to heights never seen before.

He's a true universal sensation.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> Speaking of Punk lol @ when Nash annihilated him with "Take a shower, hit the weights, get clue" and the waffle house insult.


So you're a man that has two faces. Those are just unoriginal insults by Kev he got owned by Punk each time because he was obviously not good for business :HHH2


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Sonnen Says said:


> So you're a man that has two faces. Those are just unoriginal insults by Kev he got owned by Punk each time because he was obviously not good for business :HHH2


He didn't own him though. All Vanilla Midget Punk did was resort to quad jokes and fake vomiting.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> He didn't own him though. All Vanilla Midget Punk did was resort to quad jokes and fake vomiting.


He did many times when for example he told him if Triple H asked you to jump from a bridge would you because I think that will be good for business, the text from his sister, and the fact it's not 1994 anymore for Kev. Also when he mocked the Kliq and how he runs slowly. In the end we get that he was never good for business :HHH2


----------



## #Mark

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

I'm pretty sure this is Kevin Nash's youtube channel :lol


----------



## mblonde09

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> Speaking of Punk lol @ when Nash annihilated him with "Take a shower, hit the weights, get clue" and the waffle house insult.


After Punk had already owned Nash with the now infamous, "text from my little Sister" line:lol.



Starbuck said:


> A new thread is best for business.


A new mod would be even better.


----------



## Alo0oy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Its a shame I can't find viewership numbers where I live, the only ratings I could find were for Arab Idol & other crappy shows, how the hell does that shit get watched by 100 million viewers?

Anyway, I doubt WWE cares about viewership as much outside USA.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



mblonde09 said:


> After Punk had already owned Nash with the now infamous, "text from my little Sister" line:lol.


That must have been before Punk turned into Nash's little jobber boy. 




mblonde09 said:


> A new mod would be even better.


:lol You still mad that Starbuck stole your lunch money?


----------



## Starbuck

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



mblonde09 said:


> A new mod would be even better.


----------



## ellthom

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Can we make a Kevin Nash sub forum?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Starbuck said:


>


Aw, it's okay Starbuck. You're a good little mod. B+ all the way! But you just don't represent the WWE section's general opinion on things well enough. It's okay though. You could always become an A+ mod if you just start marking for Punk, as that's the main thing you're missing. Don't even think about, just do it!


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



The Sandrone said:


> Aw, it's okay Starbuck. You're a good little mod. B+ all the way! But you just don't represent the WWE section's general opinion on things well enough. It's okay though. You could always become an A+ mod if you just start marking for Punk, as that's the main thing you're missing. Don't even think about, just do it!


Yeah, come on in. It's nice, warm and roomy in Phil's asshole. You can have the 3rd fissure to the left, right next to Wrestlinfan35's place. :


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

just read an interview, CM Punk said he hopes that he will be remembered as the guy that set the standard for the smaller guys in today's generation.....really man? Bryan Danielson was always a better wrestler than you, only because you were a few inches taller did you get to come into the WWE before him...makes me so mad how he actually thinks he's better than Bryan.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> just read an interview, CM Punk said he hopes that he will be remembered as the guy that set the standard for the smaller guys in today's generation.....really man? Bryan Danielson was always a better wrestler than you, only because you were a few inches taller did you get to come into the WWE before him...makes me so mad how he actually thinks he's better than Bryan.


Punk's set several standards for this gen...

1. Only guy to be Nash's complete bitch at a PPV last year. Is Punk ever gonna get revenge? 
2. Only current wrestler to take over a year going over everybody and a feud with Taker and Rock to become credible main eventer. :bryan2 *=* Mr. Two Months
3. Biggest whiner of the current gen...actually complained about losing too much back in late April when his only loses for the year were to Rock and Taker. At least Ryder's bitching has/had a modicum of validity.
4. Hypocrite extraordinaire. Didn't Pipebomb Punk (Or shortly there after) goof on Cena for releasing a bunch of stupid merch especially t-shirts? Now Punk has how many generic shirts out? That bump up in the paycheck must have been quite the mind changer.


Now the war begins.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> just read an interview, CM Punk said he hopes that he will be remembered as the guy that set the standard for the smaller guys in today's generation.....really man? Bryan Danielson was always a better wrestler than you, only because you were a few inches taller did you get to come into the WWE before him...makes me so mad how he actually thinks he's better than Bryan.


You AND Punk are wrong. So what if Danielson is a better wrestler than Punk, he hasn't set a precedent for smaller guys at all. Neither has Punk. HBK and Shawn set that standard in the 90s to pave the way for Rey, Eddie and Benoit to mold it a bit finer in the mid 2000s. Punk and Bryan at this point are just the next batch of smaller guys, and if it weren't for the 5 I just mentioned, they'd be in the midcard doing nothing.

And if he's talking about just being the most well known smaller guy in this era...then, I'd say he's probably correct. Danielson hasn't been in the main event long enough to do anything of real note, while Punk has been there for 2 years and has done a fair amount. In terms of their careers right now in the WWE, Punk is ahead of Bryan. Why does it make you mad that he thinks he's better than Bryan? If you look at their career accomplishments, he is.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



KO Bossy said:


> You AND Punk are wrong. So what if Danielson is a better wrestler than Punk, he hasn't set a precedent for smaller guys at all. Neither has Punk. HBK and Shawn set that standard in the 90s to pave the way for Rey, Eddie and Benoit to mold it a bit finer in the mid 2000s. Punk and Bryan at this point are just the next batch of smaller guys, and if it weren't for the 5 I just mentioned, they'd be in the midcard doing nothing.


We don't agree much but *THIS* was beautiful (aside from listing HBK twice...I'm assuming you meant Bret).


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Well yeah anyone with a few years head start in the WWE can have a better career at this point then a guy in his first trek to the main event...that's a given! but still, he's not better than Danielson, they're about equal...that's what I have a problem with.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Punk is a reasonably good in ring worker with phenomenal mic work. Danielson can be a reasonably good mic worker with phenomenal in ring work. Both are opposite each other in that they bring to the table what the other doesn't.

Right now, by sheer virtue of the fact that Punk has done more in his WWE career than Bryan, its not wrong to say that he's kind of set the standard for the smaller guys right now. Danielson could certainly up that, however, but as of today, he hasn't because he hasn't been in the main event long enough. I don't think Punk is saying he thinks he's better than Bryan, but kind of stating that he's the current bar. And it makes sense because he's been positioned by the Fed as such.


----------



## Chrome

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> Yeah, come on in. It's nice, warm and roomy in Phil's asshole. You can have the 3rd fissure to the left, right next to Wrestlinfan35's place. :


:bryan2


----------



## JY57

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_73640.shtml#.Ukn97Rb3CL0



> WWE Smackdown on Friday, September 27 scored a 1.89 rating, down slightly from a 1.93 rating last week following Night of Champions.
> 
> Smackdown averaged 2.631 million viewers, up slightly from 2.602 million viewers last week.
> 
> On cable TV Friday night, Smackdown ranked #4 in overall viewers, #5 among males 18-34, and #2 among males 18-49. The show swung to four-week highs in m18-34 and m18-49.
> 
> One year ago, Smackdown scored a 1.83 rating. This year's key demo ratings were up two-tenths of a rating compared to the same week last year.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

dang, on both shows lately the ratings are improving from last year and Smackdown continues to remain consistent...


----------



## RKO 4life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Alright..Lets get back to how awesome Nash is ok. If we are not going to talk about Orton then lets talk second best which is Nash. Or I won't even read this shit, only reason I am posting right now is because Nash is getting the love.


----------



## roadkill_

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



KO Bossy said:


> Punk is a reasonably good in ring worker with phenomenal mic work.


His mic work is, at best, mediocre. His monologues are like sleeping pills. He stutters. He's a boring little shit.

Hell, Lance Storm was a better mic worker.


----------



## hazuki

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

If Punk's not a good mic worker - than who is in this current state of there roster? Very few guys are good mic workers in this company/main roster rn


----------



## Jof

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Heel punk on the mic is fantastic. Babyface punk is boring all around. I'd go as far as to say the only reason fans are interested in him right now is because of Paul Heyman. Remember his face work against John laurinaitis? that shit was horrible.




hazuki said:


> If Punk's not a good mic worker - than who is in this current state of there roster? Very few guys are good mic workers in this company/main roster rn


Yeah but most of them don't get promo time to show how good they are or even improve. They just have random matches everyweek. When was the last time Ziggler cut a promo?


----------



## RKO1988

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

I still think Nash set it all up where he wouldn't have to job to Punk.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Jof said:


> Heel punk on the mic is fantastic. Babyface punk is boring all around. I'd go as far as to say the only reason fans are interested in him right now is because of Paul Heyman. Remember his face work against John laurinaitis? that shit was horrible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah but most of them don't get promo time to show how good they are or even improve. They just have random matches everyweek.* When was the last time Ziggler cut a promo?*


He's one of the guys that I will never want to listen to after he opened his mouth and no he had a lot of promo time when he was hot. I only want to listen to guys that are natural talkers like Sandow, Henry, Punk, Heymen, Ambrose, Bray. I sometimes find Barrett and Rollins entertaining on the mic but other than those guys I dont think anyone can improve to be as good as the guys I mentioned.


----------



## Vin Ghostal

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



roadkill_ said:


> His mic work is, at best, mediocre. His monologues are like sleeping pills. He stutters. He's a boring little shit.
> 
> Hell, Lance Storm was a better mic worker.


This sort of hyperbole makes your argument weaker, not stronger.

Even Lance Storm wouldn't agree with you. Jesus H. Christmas.


----------



## Biast

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



roadkill_ said:


> His mic work is, at best, mediocre. His monologues are like sleeping pills. He stutters. He's a boring little shit.
> 
> Hell, Lance Storm was a better mic worker.


:lmao Not even your stupid ass can think that! That there is a beyond retarded statement. It's like saying Bryan sucks in the ring.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



roadkill_ said:


> His mic work is, at best, mediocre. His monologues are like sleeping pills. He stutters. He's a boring little shit.
> 
> Hell, Lance Storm was a better mic worker.


I agree with everything except the Lance Storm part.:lol


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

man they've us back to back shitty Raws, why are they doing this? Its all unorganized like they don't give a shit. Its like theyr'e trying to lose viewers on purpose or something. anyone agree?


----------



## JY57

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



> -- Monday's WWE Raw inched up five percent in social media activity compared to last week's episode.
> 
> Raw scored 223,059 in social activity, according to Trendrr.TV, compared to a season-low 212k last week. Raw ranked #2 on cable TV, trailing Monday Night Football.
> 
> Raw has scored below the 2013 yearly average of 282k for six consecutive weeks.


via PWTorch


----------



## mblonde09

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> man they've us back to back shitty Raws, why are they doing this? Its all unorganized like they don't give a shit. Its like theyr'e trying to lose viewers on purpose or something. anyone agree?


Why was it shitty? 'Cos Bryan was only in one crappy segment?


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

oh yeah, cuz that's the only thing that was shitty? you don't think it was bad? tell me one good thing about it, and you can't mention Punk, because that's all you ever do. Give me one thing that is good about it.


----------



## JY57

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Hour 1 - 3.605 million
Hour 2 - 3.530 million
Hour 2 - 3.616 million

Average - 3.58 million viewers 

a little better than last year which was 3.5 million viewers. but it still went down again from last week


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Hour 2 with the worst showing, the one that had the Corporation/Rhodes segment. Ain't looking too good there.

Pretty shit numbers, once again. Interested in seeing those quarter breakdowns. And mark wars~~


----------



## stonefort

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

And once again we see Boring Danial Bryan is Boring. We've seen the Yes! chants and chest kicks about 1,000x now and it's just dumb and boring now. Bland, dull, and boring.


----------



## checkcola

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Saints were putting on a show on ESPN, just saying


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Punk in more than one segment? First time viewership is higher than the year prior's counterpart? (since Summerslam at least anyway)

unk unk2 unk5


----------



## ShiftyLWO

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Hour 2 with the worst showing, the one that had the Corporation/Rhodes segment. Ain't looking too good there.
> 
> Pretty shit numbers, once again. Interested in seeing those quarter breakdowns. And mark wars~~


Nobody gives a shit about dusty rhodes cody and goldust. Night of champions will have horrible buy rates.


----------



## JY57

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

^^ wasn't 10/1/12 the day where the Cena pipe thing, Foley/Punk, and Ryback at the end staring down Punk happened?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



JY57 said:


> ^^ wasn't 10/1/12 the day where the Cena pipe thing, Foley/Punk, and Ryback at the end staring down Punk happened?


Not sure what exactly went down that night, but I'm sure Punk was the center of it as he was for all Raws around that time.

But you put Punk back in more than one segment, and he out-does the year prior! SUCK ON DAT, BRYAN MARKS! 
hopefully no one takes this seriously
DAT PUNK! unk unk unk


----------



## JY57

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Hour 2 with the worst showing, the one that had the Corporation/Rhodes segment. Ain't looking too good there.
> 
> Pretty shit numbers, once again. Interested in seeing those quarter breakdowns. And mark wars~~


or the rest of the hour sucked bad. the one with Dusty/Stephanie same 6:00 PM hour was the lowest hour of the show and their quarter gained 800,000+ viewers but the rest of the hour lost over 1,000,000 million viewers. 

Whatever plain & simple the show sucks in ratings Late September - January regardless who is main eventing anyways.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

at least it was up from the 2.54 from last year...they could pat themselves on the back with that, but at the same time, the McMahons are ruining the show


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Oof. Not very good. That's what happens when the focus isn't on Bryan. Need MORE Bryan.

:bryan :yes


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



The Sandrone said:


> Not sure what exactly went down that night, but I'm sure Punk was the center of it as he was for all Raws around that time.
> 
> But you put Punk back in more than one segment, and he out-does the year prior! SUCK ON DAT, BRYAN MARKS!
> hopefully no one takes this seriously
> DAT PUNK! unk unk unk



Punk was omnipresent on Raw last night and it fell to the fewest viewers since Dec. 31, 2012. This Raw was a lemon and Punk's gotta own it!


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

last two Raws, Bryan is only in the third hour and both of the shows have the third hour being the highest rated hour....oh and they've barely had Bryan on the show the last two weeks and the rating has fallen..WWE is messing up again!


----------



## JY57

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



The Sandrone said:


> Not sure what exactly went down that night, but I'm sure Punk was the center of it as he was for all Raws around that time.
> 
> But you put Punk back in more than one segment, and he out-does the year prior! SUCK ON DAT, BRYAN MARKS!
> hopefully no one takes this seriously
> DAT PUNK! unk unk unk


Ok I just found last year infamous 2.54 rating (I believe it was a start of all these record breaking bad ratings for non-holidays):



> As noted before, the October 1st WWE RAW did a 2.54 cable rating with 3.50 million viewers. This is the lowest rated non-holiday RAW in 15 years.
> 
> In the segment breakdown, the opening segment with CM Punk, Paul Heyman, Vickie Guerrero, Dolph Ziggler, AJ Lee, Kane and Daniel Bryan started with a 2.74 quarter rating and gained 4,000 viewers. Sin Cara and Rey Mysterio vs. Primo and Epico plus Antonio Cesaro vs. Brodus Clay lost 461,000 viewers. Zack Ryder vs. The Miz lost another 47,000 viewers and did a 2.37 quarter rating.
> 
> The debate with Big Show and Sheamus gained 421,000 viewers which is about the same as the usual 9pm growth. Tensai vs. Ryback and Eve Torres vs. Beth Phoenix lost 350,000 viewers. Santino Marella vs. Heath Slater gained 222,000 viewers. Sheamus vs. Damien Sandow lost 63,000 viewers in the 10pm timeslot.
> 
> The 10pm timeslot was scheduled to kick off with the Jim Ross Appreciation Night angle with Punk, Heyman and Ryback but they didn't really get into it until 10:15pm, which usually posts a big loss. However, instead of a big loss the JR segment gained 461,000 viewers for a show-high 2.89 quarter rating.
> 
> Kofi Kingston vs. Alberto Del Rio lost 824,000 viewers for a 2.29 quarter rating. This is the lowest quarter for a regular episode of RAW in 15 years. Basically, 21% of all viewers who saw the JR segment tuned out when that segment ended. 38% of teenage boys, 25% of Males 18-49, 28% of teenage girls and 20% of Women 18-49 tuned out at that point.
> 
> The main event with Kane and Daniel Bryan vs. CM Punk and Dolph Ziggler gained 532,000 viewers for a 2.70 overrun rating.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> last two Raws, Bryan is only in the third hour and both of the shows have the third hour being the highest rated hour....oh and they've barely had Bryan on the show the last two weeks and the rating has fallen..WWE is messing up again!


Not shooting Bryan or anyone else down, but WWE set a precedent a long time ago that the most important thing happen in the 3rd hour, so it makes sense that that hour has the most viewers.

I also wouldn't say the ratings have fallen because of no Bryan, but ever since NoC, they've fucked themselves on their biggest feuds, which has made them lose a ton of steam. If anything, I think general interest is winding down after that month or so of good stuff.


----------



## JY57

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

final rating - 2.68


----------



## funnyfaces1

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

LMFAO at Alberto Del Rio and Kofi Kingston losing over 800k viewers to a 2.29 last year.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

would you at least agree, that the way they're treating him is a turn off..regardless of if anyone likes him or not, the way they're treating him is bad.....and its turning people off. Now Triple H isn't even involved with it at all. Looks like Orton might just win the feud for no reason.


----------



## Amuroray

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

the usual suspects at work again. I predicted middle to low 2s by late sept.

Bring back cena and rock.


----------



## RatedR10

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

When fans saw Big E Langston in the opening, they probably knew what they were in for on the night...


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

i bet Orton beats Bryan, then beats him again at Hell in a Cell, then Orton faces Rhodes or Miz for the title moving forward..total waste of time.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> would you at least agree, that the way they're treating him is a turn off..regardless of if anyone likes him or not, the way they're treating him is bad.....and its turning people off. Now Triple H isn't even involved with it at all. Looks like Orton might just win the feud for no reason.


Maybe people are just tired of the story? Who says it has to do with them treating Bryan badly? He's a legit main eventer and is a big focus of the main feud, how is that treating him badly?


----------



## roadkill_

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Russo Nitro ratings. And Russo's WCW had an excuse - they had monster competition.

Extremely sad.


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Guess that means most people had something better to do than watch that horrible show. God knows I did.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Best4Bidness said:


> Punk was omnipresent on Raw last night and it fell to the fewest viewers since Dec. 31, 2012. This Raw was a lemon and Punk's gotta own it!


Yep. SinJackal and I called it in another thread last night. Punk and Cult of Personality was all over this show whether he was front and center or they were recapping what he did or trying to trick us into believing he was coming out. Punk bombed last night. Pure and simple. No Bryan, no ratings. :yes




JY57 said:


> Ok I just found last year infamous 2.54 rating (I believe it was a start of all these record breaking bad ratings for non-holidays):


Proof that Punk couldn't draw for shit last year. Granted Bryan was in there as well but he wasn't considered a legit main event player at that point. Punk fans need to thank Rock and Taker. Bryan needs to thank Vince's ego. Every time they try to bury that guy he rises like Lazarus of Bethany.




Barry Dylan said:


> Guess that means most people had something better to do than watch that horrible show. God knows I did.


Yeah you're too busy narcing to mods, and bitching about people who disagree with you.


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> Yeah you're too busy narcing to mods, and bitching about people who disagree with you.


Still crying over that rep I gave you? :lol


----------



## roadkill_

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Biast said:


> :lmao Not even your stupid ass can think that! That there is a beyond retarded statement. It's like saying Bryan sucks in the ring.


I'd be willing to bet you've never seen a single match of the man I mentioned. Fucking teenaged Punk marks who never watched a single hour of WWF programming, so they have no idea what great mic work is. 

I'd have to say that in the history of the IWC, and I've been around it since the 90's, CM Punk marks are among the dumbest. Most of them are noobs - when you got someone swearing by the mic skills of someone who can't even muster X-Pac heat, then this person is clearly aged 15-21 and never watched SCSA or The Rock weekly in their prime work a mic. 

Your skinny fat vanilla midget *sucks on the mic*. Let's go through the bacic tenants of mic work, noob:

1) When you are not getting over, like Punk, *do not exhibit signs of desperation*, such as listening real hard for a chant that's about to begin. That makes you look like a try-hard. 

2) If you keep stuttering and flunking your lines, stop. Stop rambling.

3) Do not repeat yourself every 30 seconds, know when to shutup

Punk fails at even the basics. Which is why his ratings-poison ass has torpedoed another RAW telecast. Sad and pathetic. Boring emo fan favourite. I stand by my statement, even _Lance Storm_ had more presence on the mic. "If I can be serious for a minute".

Bring that red rep 17 year old emos and 27 year old retards!


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

i'm not saying he's not getting a push, which he is...but they're choosing to not make him get pissed off over what's happened to him, and they're choosing for him not to say "you got in my girl's face, i'm going to kill you" he should be like that. He is like that in real life, he said in a radio interview one time that someone tried to hit on Brie, and he said he would break the guy's thumb if he touched her again..we need that guy!


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Barry Dylan said:


> Still crying over that rep I gave you? :lol


Yeah that is it. Why'd you change your user name Slowhand? What are you trying to hide from? Snitches are bitches. Narc.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



roadkill_ said:


> I'd be willing to bet you've never seen a single match of the man I mentioned. Fucking teenaged Punk marks who never watched a single hour of WWF programming, so they have no idea what great mic work is.
> 
> I'd have to say that in the history of the IWC, and I've been around it since the 90's, CM Punk marks are among the dumbest. Most of them are noobs - when you got someone swearing by the mic skills of someone who can't even muster X-Pac heat, then this person is clearly aged 15-21 and never watched SCSA or The Rock weekly in their prime work a mic.
> 
> Your skinny fat vanilla midget *sucks on the mic*. Let's go through the bacic tenants of mic work, noob:
> 
> 1) When you are not getting over, like Punk, *do not exhibit signs of desperation*, such as listening real hard for a chant that's about to begin. That makes you look like a try-hard.
> 
> 2) If you keep stuttering and flunking your lines, stop. Stop rambling.
> 
> 3) Do not repeat yourself every 30 seconds, know when to shutup
> 
> Punk fails at even the basics. Which is why his ratings-poison ass has torpedoed another RAW telecast. Sad and pathetic. Boring emo fan favourite. I stand by my statement, even _Lance Storm_ had more presence on the mic. "If I can be serious for a minute".
> 
> Bring that red rep 17 year old emos and 27 year old retards!



I think saying he flat out sucks is totally wrong but I don't get what is happening with him lately. Either he's lost something or his heart isn't in to this Heyman feud. "I'll rip your face off." Foley-esque cheap pops. WTF?

EDIT: Best sig pic in the world. :clap


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> Yeah that is it. Why'd you change your user name Slowhand? What are you trying to hide from? Snitches are bitches. Narc.


fpalm

I change my name every 90 days like clockwork. Duh. Like saying my last name means jack shit, we all know our former usernames are on page. So quit pretending you're smart.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Barry Dylan said:


> I change my name every 90 days like clockwork. If you actually bothered to know your shit instead of just repeating what some other troll said, you would know.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Punk gets featured more and the ratings fall. :ti


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Bryan's segments gain viewers and he sells tee shirts...awesome! all he really has to do, because with this piss poor booking, that's all he should be relied on to do....


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Bet on this. When the quarter hours come out Punk marks will claim credit for the glorious Heyman/Ryback segment. Punk made a guest appearance for just 3 minutes of that quarter. Punk is one of those remora swimming alongside DAT RATINGS SHARK,Heyman.:heyman3 

Next week, Heyman and Ryback re-enact that clay sculpting scene from Ghost.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

You know what? Fuck this thread. Enjoy your dick waving competition, guys. What a waste of time. Roadkill's clear failure to assess talent is bad enough, but now petty bickering between people over rep...pathetic.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



KO Bossy said:


> You know what? Fuck this thread. Enjoy your dick waving competition, guys. What a waste of time. Roadkill's clear failure to assess talent is bad enough, but now petty bickering between people over rep...pathetic.


Has absolutely nothing to do with rep. Again we don't need you to play daddy. This forum isn't called "Post Only What Makes KO Bossy Happy."




Best4Bidness said:


> Next week, Heyman and Ryback re-enact that clay sculpting scene from Ghost.


That would go over the heads of most of the audience. They need to re-enact a scene from Twilight. Team Heyman vs Team Axel. :lol


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

yep, maybe it went from 2.54 to 2.68 in a year because of the overrun, that didn't have Punk in it.


----------



## JY57

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> yep, maybe it went from 2.54 to 2.68 in a year because of the overrun, that didn't have Punk in it.


no, the Nielsen ratings changes every year. Like last year had more viewers for last 2 months (tip this week) but the rating this year is a litle bit higher than last year.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> That would go over the heads of most of the audience. They need to re-enact a scene from Twilight. Team Heyman vs Team Axel. :lol


Damn. I keep forgetting how much older I am than their target audience. I'm on Team Heyman,lol.


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

LoL at this rate TNA won't have to catch up to WWE to beat them. WWE will fall to their level. sad rating but for a show full of jobbers, a shit new tag team, crying big show, gay walrus and a awful corporation main storyline it's pretty good. Not like they deserved better.


----------



## rocknblues81

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



CenaBoy4Life said:


> LoL at this rate TNA won't have to catch up to WWE to beat them. WWE will fall to their level. sad rating but for a show full of jobbers, a shit new tag team, crying big show, gay walrus and a awful corporation main storyline it's pretty good. Not like they deserved better.


It's still better than watching that ****** John Cena ever week.


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Lol okay. Cenas return will bump it up to at least 3.2.


----------



## Jerichoholic4Life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Viewers have been dropping like flies since Cena left. There has only been one week when they didn’t fall and that was the night after a pay-per-view which always rises (and usually by more than the 0.09 million the night after NOC).

Last Raw with Cena did 4.30 million viewers

Week 1 without Cena: 4.19 million
Week 2: 3.94 million
Week 3: 3.92 million
Week 4: 4.01 million
Week 5: 3.74 million
Week 6: 3.58 million

They could be looking at averaging under three and a half come next month.

The Night Of Champions, Battleground and Hell In A Cell buyrates are probably going to be ugly too. It’s a rough time all round for WWE right now.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

There was also no NFL season when Cena was here. Just saying.

Keep going with Cena as the solution. See where you when he retires.

:vince5


----------



## rocknblues81

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Jerichoholic4Life said:


> Viewers have been dropping like flies since Cena left. There has only been one week when they didn’t fall and that was the night after a pay-per-view which always rises (and usually by more than the 0.09 million the night after NOC).
> 
> Last Raw with Cena did 4.30 million viewers
> 
> Week 1 without Cena: 4.19 million
> Week 2: 3.94 million
> Week 3: 3.92 million
> Week 4: 4.01 million
> Week 5: 3.74 million
> Week 6: 3.58 million
> 
> They could be looking at averaging under three and a half come next month.
> 
> The Night Of Champions, Battleground and Hell In A Cell buyrates are probably going to be ugly too. It’s a rough time all round for WWE right now.


Anyone that can enjoy watching John Cena is someone I know I would hate.

That said, PW is never going to be what it used to be. I just hope for a decent show, but I know I'm not going to get it from a ****** that can't even fall down convincingly.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Punk and Bryan can't draw simple as that.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

ha ha last year under Cena, the ratings were worse..wow! lol the ratings have been better this year against MNF without Cena.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



ShowStopper '97 said:


> There was also no NFL season when Cena was here. Just saying.


This.




rabidwolverine27 said:


> Punk and Bryan can't draw simple as that.


Well you're half right.


----------



## Jerichoholic4Life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



rocknblues81 said:


> Anyone that can enjoy watching John Cena is someone I know I would hate.


I hope you are 12 years old or younger.

If you're older than that then your mentality (not liking someone for liking something you don't) is inane and frankly worrisome.


----------



## rocknblues81

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



rabidwolverine27 said:


> Punk and Bryan can't draw simple as that.


Nobody of the guys today are Superstars IMO.


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Punk was never a draw and Bryan has been booked like shit. Soon as he got over huge they made it all about HHH as usual.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

drawing ability is different nowadays....selling tee shirts and tv ratings are all the full timers can do..they rely on part timers and guys out of retirement to get ppv buys.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



rocknblues81 said:


> Nobody of the guys today are Superstars IMO.


Yep. That is what happens when the previous gen retires, quits, or disappears before putting over the next gen. Throw in part timers coming in and clowning the full time roster and you get what we got....main eventers with little credibility.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Bryan has been the closest to be a superstar...they were never going to give Punk the ball because of his attitude...and Bryan has been the closest but they still seem to be hesitant to give him the ball fully, as like have the title more than a day.


----------



## Jerichoholic4Life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> ha ha last year under Cena, the ratings were worse..wow! lol the ratings have been better this year against MNF without Cena.


The only Raw so far this football season that had more viewers than the same week last year was this week and Cena didn't appear on that episode in 2012.

So far every Raw Cena appeared on last year has had more viewers than it's mirror show this year.


----------



## rocknblues81

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> Yep. That is what happens when the previous gen retires, quits, or disappears before putting over the next gen. Throw in part timers coming in and clowning the full time roster and you get what we got....main eventers with little credibility.


The new generation simply lacks the complete package. 

-Bryan can wrestle, but he can't talk.

-Zigger can wrestle some and he is great at taking bumps, but he acts like an arrogant teenager.

-Cena has the look, but he can't sell, gives repetitive promo's, and he has bad matches 80% of the time.

-Punk can wrestle and talk trash, but he does not have the look.

-Orton is a respectable wrestler and a good look, but he is a wooden and lifeless as a personality.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

ratings system changes every year...its about the ratings, not viewers.


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



rocknblues81 said:


> The new generation simply lacks the complete package.
> 
> -Bryan can wrestle, but he can't talk.
> 
> -Zigger can wrestle some and he is great at taking bumps, but he acts like an arrogant teenager.
> 
> -Cena has the look, but he can't sell, gives repetitive promo's, and he has bad matches 80% of the time.
> 
> -Punk can wrestle and talk trash, but he does not have the look.
> 
> -Orton is a respectable wrestler and a good look, but he is a wooden and lifeless as a personality.


Bryan can talk fine, and Ziggler has a terrible look, music, and name. He needs a remake. Most of these problems have to do with horrible booking now.


----------



## rocknblues81

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

The booking is also terrible. 

Vince seems to think you can just endlessly job guys and build them up whenever they want to and the fans will just go along with it.

What year did they start doing this?


----------



## rocknblues81

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Jerichoholic4Life said:


> I hope you are 12 years old or younger.
> 
> If you're older than that then your mentality (not liking someone for liking something you don't) is inane and frankly worrisome.


I'm not being completely serious, but I sure as hell would not watch wrestling with that person.


----------



## Jerichoholic4Life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> ratings system changes every year...its about the ratings, not viewers.


No, it's not. In 5 years time you might be able to get a 3.0 rating with only 2.5 million viewers. WWE isn't going to be happy if that's what they're drawing though. Even if the rating is roughly the same it's less viewers and less people watching your TV = less potential pay-per-view customers.

There's no way you can try and spin this into a positive. Less people are watching the television show each week and if the upcoming pay-per-views perform as poorly as projected then the final quarter of this financial year is going to be WWE's worst in a long time.


----------



## rocknblues81

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Jerichoholic4Life said:


> No, it's not. In 5 years time you might be able to get a 3.0 rating with only 2.5 million viewers. WWE isn't going to be happy if that's what they're drawing though. Even if the rating is roughly the same it's less viewers and less people watching your TV = less potential pay-per-view customers.
> 
> There's no way you can try and spin this into a positive. Less people are watching the television show each week and if the upcoming pay-per-views perform as poorly as projected then the final quarter of this financial year is going to be WWE's worst in a long time.


These cards are horrible though. How could anyone think that Night of Champions would be worth buying? The card was terrible and so is the card for Battleground. I seriously doubt that Vince and CO think that people will buy these PPV's. It's just not going to happen.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Doesn't matter, a difference of .3 or .4, or even .5. Eventually, you HAVE to start making some new stars. Being that they are on the same level as they were last year with Cena there, now is the time to bite the bullet and build for the future. The part timers and Cena aren't going to be around forever.

Freaking out about a .2-.5 difference in comparison to what it can be once the older guys step away would be ridiculous.

Man, sometimes people are so shortsighted it's not even funny.


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

I really don't know why they changed the PPV name when its going to be another throw away. What was the point.


----------



## rocknblues81

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



ShowStopper '97 said:


> Doesn't matter, a difference of .3 or .4, or even .5. Eventually, you HAVE to start making some new stars. Being that they are on the same level as they were last year with Cena there, now is the time to bite the bullet and build for the future. The part timers and Cena aren't going to be around forever.
> 
> Freaking out about a .2-.5 difference in comparison to what it can be once the older guys step away would be ridiculous.
> 
> Man, sometimes people are so shortsighted it's not even funny.


No doubt these bad ratings and poor PPV sales are going to convince Vince and CO that Cena is still the long term answer.

Things look a lot more bleak than they did 2 or 3 weeks ago.


----------



## rocknblues81

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



CenaBoy4Life said:


> I really don't know why they changed the PPV name when its going to be another throw away. What was the point.


I think the roster mailed it in on NOTC. Even Bryan and Orton failed to give a really good match. It seems like WWE is coasting until SS.


----------



## Jerichoholic4Life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



rocknblues81 said:


> These cards are horrible though. How could anyone think that Night of Champions would be worth buying? The card was terrible and so is the card for Battleground. I seriously doubt that Vince and CO think that people will buy these PPV's. It's just not going to happen.


NOC was a one match card that will live or die based on how much of a draw Orton/Bryan was. The rest of the card was trash. The same could be said for last years card though with Punk/Cena and that show drew well (up over 20,000 buys). If people are interested in the main event the show will sell regardless of the undercard. Hell In A Cell last year also proves that. Punk/Ryback was the only draw on that card and it sold well.


----------



## rocknblues81

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Jerichoholic4Life said:


> NOC was a one match card that will live or die based on how much of a draw Orton/Bryan was. The rest of the card was trash. The same could be said for last years card though with Punk/Cena and that show drew well (up over 20,000 buys). If people are interested in the main event the show will sell regardless of the undercard. Hell In A Cell last year also proves that. Punk/Ryback was the only draw on that card and it sold well.


I think that's a good point and perhaps Bryan's run will come soon it the PPV sales continue to tank.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

yeah sure blame Bryan for the ppv rates, ignore the fact that the booking has sucked...geez man! every anti bryan person blames him for everything when how is it possible that its his fault? when before night of champions they beat him down every week and made it look bleak for him and even worse because they knew he had no help and that he woudl get screwed, who would pay for that? then he gets stripped of the title, he gets screwed just like people thought...and now hes being held back again for Battleground.....and the rest of the card sucks..but yeah, its Bryan's fault they won't sell lol


----------



## Ham and Egger

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

That's a dreadful rating but it's a slow process but they need to build their guys more strongly. They're hitting the right notes in building the Rhodes', Punk, and Bryan, but their undercard needs more meaningful angle to get the TV audience to care. One man can't be blamed for everything.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> yeah sure blame Bryan for the ppv rates, ignore the fact that the booking has sucked...geez man! *every anti bryan person blames him for everything* when how is it possible that its his fault? when before night of champions they beat him down every week and made it look bleak for him and even worse because they knew he had no help and that he woudl get screwed, who would pay for that? then he gets stripped of the title, he gets screwed just like people thought...and now hes being held back again for Battleground.....and the rest of the card sucks..but yeah, its Bryan's fault they won't sell lol


Yeah, that's kinda what being anti-somebody entails.

And Bryan's booking has been just fine (in terms of his matches, he looks great). Its the creative assholes who can't write a decent story worth a fuck that are to blame. Well, that and the 11-3 handicap match. Though that wasn't Bryan's booking being bad, that was the Shield's. Regardless, its not Bryan's booking. The story itself is fizzling faster than carbon from a freshly opened Pepsi.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Bryan can't be blamed for the Raws, because his segments are gaining viewers...he is not in charge of the rest of the show..not his fault the WWE is phoning it in creative wise..wouldn't be surprised if they fired their writers and its just the three of them coming up with ideas.


----------



## Arya Dark

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

*I lost all interest in the angle once they brought Brie in. *


----------



## rocknblues81

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



KO Bossy said:


> Yeah, that's kinda what being anti-somebody entails.
> 
> And Bryan's booking has been just fine (in terms of his matches, he looks great). Its the creative assholes who can't write a decent story worth a fuck that are to blame. Well, that and the 11-3 handicap match. Though that wasn't Bryan's booking being bad, that was the Shield's. Regardless, its not Bryan's booking. The story itself is fizzling faster than carbon from a freshly opened Pepsi.


Yep. I always hated Pepsi too. :


----------



## Mqwar

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Adult 18-49 peak viewership was in the third hour. So either Heyman/Ryback stuff did really well, as the 10pm has done for a few weeks now(likely due to viewers switching channels), or the overrun hit the peak of the show. Next best number should be Corporation/Rhodes at 9PM.





Jerichoholic4Life said:


> Viewers have been dropping like flies since Cena left. There has only been one week when they didn’t fall and that was the night after a pay-per-view which always rises (and usually by more than the 0.09 million the night after NOC).
> 
> Last Raw with Cena did 4.30 million viewers
> 
> Week 1 without Cena: 4.19 million
> Week 2: 3.94 million
> Week 3: 3.92 million
> Week 4: 4.01 million
> Week 5: 3.74 million
> Week 6: 3.58 million
> 
> They could be looking at averaging under three and a half come next month.
> 
> The Night Of Champions, Battleground and Hell In A Cell buyrates are probably going to be ugly too. It’s a rough time all round for WWE right now.


Its the MNF killing them, not Cena's absense. Cena was there every week last year and it did way worse. 

As for buyrates, you gotta sacrifice a few buyrates to benefit long term with a new main event star. I'm pretty sure they get this.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Ham and Egger said:


> That's a dreadful rating but it's a slow process but they need to build their guys more strongly. They're hitting the right notes in building the Rhodes', Punk, and Bryan, but *their undercard needs more meaningful angle to get the TV audience to care*. One man can't be blamed for everything.


That's been a problem for year now. Unfortunately, if you're not a main event level guy or somehow involved in a main event level feud, they have nothing for you. Its funny, you'd think in those 3 hours they could try to scrape SOMETHING together, with the extra time and all. Hmmm, maybe they'd find more time if they cut out excessive commercials, social media updates, app instructions, recaps, blatant product shilling and trailers for WWE films or films featuring WWE stars. Just a thought.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

i can only imagine what the crowd reaction will be when Triple H and Orton open next week's Raw with Orton holding the title or worse, still nobody having the title....


----------



## Osize10

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



KO Bossy said:


> Yeah, that's kinda what being anti-somebody entails.
> 
> And Bryan's booking has been just fine (in terms of his matches, he looks great). Its the creative assholes who can't write a decent story worth a fuck that are to blame. Well, that and the 11-3 handicap match. Though that wasn't Bryan's booking being bad, that was the Shield's. Regardless, its not Bryan's booking. The story itself is fizzling faster than carbon from a freshly opened Pepsi.



oh my god. As The Rock once said to Goldust (Bossy being Rock, me being Goldust), "we ain't ever going to see eye to eye." But godamnit, everyone read this post and read it again. SPOT ON the current problems with wwe.


----------



## Mqwar

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Well to be fair, they are building up the tag team division by pushing PTP, USOS, debut of matadores etc.. that part of undercard is getting attention.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

WWE looks at the 11 on 3 gauntlet plus the beginning of one on Smackdown and all they think is damn those mid card or less jobbers made those segments underperform. This is probably why there was no mention of Bryan being the leader of the locker room. That is akin to being the captain of the Titanic.


----------



## Jerichoholic4Life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> yeah sure blame Bryan for the ppv rates, ignore the fact that the booking has sucked...geez man! every anti bryan person blames him for everything when how is it possible that its his fault? when before night of champions they beat him down every week and made it look bleak for him and even worse because they knew he had no help and that he woudl get screwed, who would pay for that? then he gets stripped of the title, he gets screwed just like people thought...and now hes being held back again for Battleground.....and the rest of the card sucks..but yeah, its Bryan's fault they won't sell lol


No one’s blaming Bryan for anything. Not yet at least. We don’t even know the numbers for NOC or Battleground yet.

They might surprise people and do well. And the funny thing is if that were to be the case the same people saying that Bryan can’t be blamed for bad buyrates would all of a sudden be giving him full credit if the shows do well. 

If you’re the featured act on a show you have to take the lions share of credit/blame if a show draws well/poorly. You can’t have it both ways and want to give credit if things go well then absolve of all blame if things don’t do well. Bryan is the featured attraction on these shows and how well they do will fall mostly on his shoulders, positively or negatively. That's just the way it is.



Mqwar said:


> Adult 18-49 peak viewership was in the third hour. So either Heyman/Ryback stuff did really well, as the 10pm has done for a few weeks now(likely due to viewers switching channels), or the overrun hit the peak of the show. Next best number should be Corporation/Rhodes at 9PM.
> 
> Its the MNF killing them, not Cena's absense. Cena was there every week last year and it did way worse.
> 
> As for buyrates, you gotta sacrifice a few buyrates to benefit long term with a new main event star. I'm pretty sure they get this.


The only week they had less viewers at the same time last year was a show that Cena wasn't on. When Cena was on the comparative shows did better than they're doing now.

They wouldn't be getting 4.0 ratings or anything with Cena but they certainly would be doing better than averaging 3 and a half million viewers on non-holiday shows. Cena fronted shows have went up against Monday Night Football dozens of times since 2005 and they've never done this bad.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

You're misunderstanding. Bryan can't be blamed if he wasn't booked like himself...Instead he has been booked like Cena with him saying corny things and being cheesy just like Cena..people grew tired of that.....if they just let him act like himself and cut a serious promo to sell the pay per view and have him be a badass aggressive guy, then they'd do well..instead, he's Cena lite...doesn't translate to good business and they'll start to notice.


----------



## Mqwar

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



> The only week they had less viewers at the same time last year was a show that Cena wasn't on. When Cena was on the comparative shows did better than they're doing now.


Ar you referring to viewership or the rating of the show? Its not the same. Cena wasn't even the peak of show in any case, so you can't credit him.



> They wouldn't be getting 4.0 ratings or anything with Cena but they certainly would be doing better than averaging 3 and a half million viewers on non-holiday shows. Cena fronted shows have went up against Monday Night Football dozens of times since 2005 and they've never done this bad.


Thats when RAW was still very strong with starpower and it was 2hr show. RAW is three hours now and roster is 80% full of unover and unestablished stars, just like it was last year and the result of it was record low ratings since 1997 around december, with Cena still part of the show.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Moral of the story, WWE fucked up to the point where everything was about Cena and he worked so damn hard he could be collecting worker's comp and suing them for overworking him. Now Bryan is the work horse, if he gets hurt you're even more fucked...and will have to insert Ziggler against Orton, and just imagine the business then.


----------



## Osize10

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> Moral of the story, WWE fucked up to the point where everything was about Cena and he worked so damn hard he could be collecting worker's comp and suing them for overworking him. Now Bryan is the work horse, if he gets hurt you're even more fucked...and will have to insert Ziggler against Orton, and just imagine the business then.


Oh God no...please no...not that


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

i can't wait until Bryan becomes champion, just imagine the matches we'll see on Raw...thats if the WWE lets him.


----------



## Vyer

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Jerichoholic4Life said:


> No one’s blaming Bryan for anything. Not yet at least. We don’t even know the numbers for NOC or Battleground yet.
> 
> They might surprise people and do well. And the funny thing is if that were to be the case the same people saying that Bryan can’t be blamed for bad buyrates would all of a sudden be giving him full credit if the shows do well.
> 
> If you’re the featured act on a show you have to take the lions share of credit/blame if a show draws well/poorly. You can’t have it both ways and want to give credit if things go well then absolve of all blame if things don’t do well. Bryan is the featured attraction on these shows and how well they do will fall mostly on his shoulders, positively or negatively. That's just the way it is.


I don't think that's really fair. I will agree that one should not get all the credit, one should not get all blame either. A wrestler can be a draw, but the show can still do poorly based upon weak angles, weak matchups, and/or a weak roster. I also want to mention people should not look for a lone scapegoat if there are other big stars and hyped match ups on the card as well. Honestly, I think wrestling isn't as popular as it once was, but I don't know.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> You're misunderstanding. Bryan can't be blamed if he wasn't booked like himself...Instead he has been booked like Cena with him saying corny things and being cheesy just like Cena..people grew tired of that.....if they just let him act like himself and cut a serious promo to sell the pay per view and have him be a badass aggressive guy, then they'd do well..instead, he's Cena lite...doesn't translate to good business and they'll start to notice.


Well, everyone is booked to be a certain way. By that logic, no one is responsible for the ratings. You could easily say Punk did badly as a draw because he was booked as a Cena style babyface in the winter and spring of 2012. Or even Cena, because that's not how John Cena actually is-that's just the character.

Though there's nothing also to say that the PPV would do well if Bryan became serious, even. However, they really haven't tried that, so its at least worth a shot. Can't say it'll succeed though, since its unproven right now.


----------



## Osize10

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

i wonder what a random 60 minute iron man match on raw between bryan and punk would do. i say try it out.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

if the American Dragon came out.everyone would mark I bet....that would be successful, but they only care about the gimmicks they create, won't let anyone have their old one.yet they mentioned it on wwe.com which is confusing.


----------



## SinJackal

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

When are the segment by segment ratings out? It's always a needle in a haystack to sift through this thread for the numbers.

I have to defend Bryan on the poor numbers this week though. He was barely featured last night. All he got was a video package (marriage to Brie) and the final segment. He was only advertised once, and just for a few seconds the segment right before his segment came up.

Can't blame him too much since he was barely featured or talked about.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

he'll be included in the overrun which is one of the highest any way..just like last week's, he was in quarter 12 and the overrun, probably was one of the highest as well..so he's alright..they put him there purposely I think because they know that spot draws.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Pass.

Bryan can put on as many 'great' matches(they're ok but not as good as marks make them out to be) as he likes but until he learns to talk on mic it'll mean nothing.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

his segments still get a lot of viewers though....regardless of if anyone likes his matches or not.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



SinJackal said:


> When are the segment by segment ratings out? It's always a needle in a haystack to sift through this thread for the numbers.
> 
> I have to defend Bryan on the poor numbers this week though. He was barely featured last night. All he got was a video package (marriage to Brie) and the final segment. He was only advertised once, and just for a few seconds the segment right before his segment came up.
> 
> Can't blame him too much since he was barely featured or talked about.


Usually tomorrow in the afternoon.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> his segments still get a lot of viewers though....regardless of if anyone likes his matches or not.


 It's not like the competition is stiff :lol

Just another mid carder who doesn't have it to cut it at the main event level.

FYI

I would prefer to have The Shield be the focal point of Raw.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> if the American Dragon came out.everyone would mark I bet....that would be successful, but they only care about the gimmicks they create, won't let anyone have their old one.yet they mentioned it on wwe.com which is confusing.


How many casuals actually know about Bryan's past, though? Why would they mark for something they've never heard of? Most probably only know of YES man Daniel Bryan, not American Dragon Bryan Danielson.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

*sigh* just your opinion and comments like that grow stale.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

oh yeah, i'm with you, I know they don't know of his past, but look at it this way..if he starts kicking Orton's ass and starts saying things like what he said to Miz on the go home Summerslam Raw..remember he told him he'd punch him in the face...? that's the Dragon right there..he needs to start doing that, that comment got a pop for him.


----------



## SinJackal

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> Usually tomorrow in the afternoon.


Thanks, I'll check back tomorrow night.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

Ah yes, there's nothing that'll endear him more to me (and maybe the fans) than threatening Miz with bodily harm. That should happen more often. Just a weekly Monday Night Raw Miz gets his ass soundly pummeled segment. Highest quarter, I'll bet you.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

ha ha nobody likes the Miz..i love it. he's the only person who is hated by everyone, even his own father doesn't give a shit if he gets his ass kicked lol


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***

To be fair, he's not the ONLY person. I don't think I've ever seen one person say something positive about Bo Dallas, either. And rightly so, he's the transgendered love child of Taylor Lautner and Tatanka.

But yes, Miz hate is a special thing. Bryan and Punk markdom may drive a wedge between those of us on this site, but Miz hate helps bring us back together. Kind of spiritual, really.


----------



## RKO 4life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

No Orton=no ratings. Need more air time


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

How can a face not get a reaction? its just very silly. You would think he would have had some left over MTV fans from when he was on Real World or whatever it was, but I guess people never really loved him on that show. Hard to take him seriously, when the only reason he was a WWE champion to begin with was because they were broadcasting Tough Enough the reality show and they needed someone to represent the company to represent reality tv. it was brilliant really. not a surprise that as soon as the show ends he loses the title.


----------



## Arya Dark

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> if the American Dragon came out.everyone would mark I bet....that would be successful, but they only care about the gimmicks they create, won't let anyone have their old one.yet they mentioned it on wwe.com which is confusing.


*No they wouldn't. No one would even know what was happening and they would just start chanting YES YES YES like sheep always do. 

There would be several people on this forum masturbating to it though, I assure you.*


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Hopefully the segments I enjoyed gained viewers, because I don't want to start having to hate them


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

KO Bossy & I are too beautiful for this shit, I _propose_ to him on bended e-knee that we join our hands and become one flesh as co-admins of wrestlingleatherdaddys.com


----------



## wb1899

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

A18-49 viewership:
8:00: 1,600,000 (+51,000)
9:00: 1,664,000 (+51,000)
10:00-11:10: 1,740,000 (-25,000)
Average: 1,668,000 (+25,667)


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



wb1899 said:


> A18-49 viewership:
> 8:00: 1,600,000 (+51,000)
> 9:00: 1,664,000 (+51,000)
> 10:00-11:10: 1,740,000 (-25,000)
> Average: 1,668,00 (+25,667)


Punk bringing in the MONSTER gains unk2


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Punk bringing in the MONSTER gains unk2


You're kidding, right?


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Bryan and Orton probably had the best gain, they're obviously saving the best shit for the build up to HIAC.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> You're kidding, right?


Typical :lmao Bryan :lmao mark :lmao why :lmao don't :lmao you :lmao just :lmao frig :lmao off, :lmao pal


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> Bryan and Orton probably had the best gain, they're obviously saving the best shit for the build up to HIAC.


I bet the Heyman/Ryback segment did the best because it was so bizarre watching it. I dont think the overrun will do that well. Just a feeling because the segment didnt electrify me. It will have a big increase in viewers from the orevious segment with Santino, though. If it doesnt, it might be time to worry.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

time to worry? what about? the booking has been bad, its the writer's fault.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

I suspect it will increase from Santino. Bryan fan's wouldnt hear the end of it if it fell. I'm not happy with Bryan's booking as of late either. He is still the most over guy in the company. Hopefully, the storyline will move in a more positive direction for Bryan at next week's Raw.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

they know they screwed up...why do you think it was just Orton/Bryan by themselves and why Brie was brought into it? they figured that they made a mistake and now they are going a different direction to see if this one works..they know who they have in Bryan, he's going to be a huge deal in the company going forward, he just needs the right angle, and they fucked up on this one, so they're trying to correct it. not making it Bryan versus the Regime anymore, they're making it personal with Orton, with a climax at HIAC probably.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Typical :lmao Bryan :lmao mark :lmao why :lmao don't :lmao you :lmao just :lmao frig :lmao off, :lmao pal


Typical Punktard, deny reality for as long as you can. Saturated Punk show pulling in that 2.68 rating. The lowest audience for a non-holiday episode of RAW since December 3, 2012. Cm Punk back to running on that Diesel power. :lol


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> Typical Punktard, deny reality for as long as you can. Saturated Punk show pulling in that 2.68 rating. The lowest audience for a non-holiday episode of RAW since December 3, 2012. Cm Punk back to running on that Diesel power. :lol


Come down to Chicago and say that to me and Phil Brooks' (we're bros for life so I can call him by his first name, u mad?) faces, we'll knock your shriveled little dick in the dirt and then go eat a delicious vegan venison stir fry after.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Come down to Chicago and say that to me and Phil Brooks' (we're bros for life so I can call him by his first name, u mad?) faces, we'll knock your shriveled little dick in the dirt and then go eat a delicious vegan venison stir fry after.



 I can't, I can't even...:lmao:lmao:lmao

Oh, you're so cool Brewster.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Silenced, just like Cash Magnet Punk silenced the critics when he defeated the nearly invincible John Cena in hand to hand combat on like 3 separate occasions.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Silenced, just like Cash Magnet Punk silenced the critics when he defeated the nearly invincible John Cena in hand to hand combat on like 3 separate occasions.


:cool2 Yeah after that last post I'd try to convince everyone I was trolling all along too.


----------



## wb1899

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Q1-3 2013 vs Q1-3 2012

*All numbers are Live+SD!*

*2013 (2012)*
Raw
A18-49
8:00: 1,796,795 (1,872,750*)
9:00: 1,939,103 (2,143,026)
10:00: 1,970,928 (2,188,769)

P2+
8:00: 4,141,051 (4,112,500*)
9:00: 4,330,872 (4,555,641)
10:00: 4,225,923 (4,522,564)

*12 Broadcasts

USA Network (Prime-Time average)
A18-49: 940,795 (972,333)
P2+: 2,629,077 (2,710,872)


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



wb1899 said:


> Q1-3 2013 vs Q1-3 2012
> 
> *All numbers are Live+SD!*
> 
> *2013 (2012)*
> Raw
> A18-49
> 8:00: 1,796,795 (1,872,750*)
> 9:00: 1,939,103 (2,143,026)
> 10:00: 1,970,928 (2,188,769)
> 
> P2+
> 8:00: 4,141,051 (4,112,500*)
> 9:00: 4,330,872 (4,555,641)
> 10:00: 4,225,923 (4,522,564)
> 
> *12 Broadcasts
> 
> USA Network (Prime-Time average)
> A18-49: 940,795 (972,333)
> P2+: 2,629,077 (2,710,872)



:faint: But Ski Em Punker always brings da ratingz. It's not fair. This is John Cena's fault. I'm not sure how just yet but when Punker fails it's always Cena's fault.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



wb1899 said:


> Q1-3 2013 vs Q1-3 2012
> 
> *All numbers are Live+SD!*
> 
> *2013 (2012)*
> Raw
> A18-49
> 8:00: 1,796,795 (1,872,750*)
> 9:00: 1,939,103 (2,143,026)
> 10:00: 1,970,928 (2,188,769)
> 
> P2+
> 8:00: 4,141,051 (4,112,500*)
> 9:00: 4,330,872 (4,555,641)
> 10:00: 4,225,923 (4,522,564)
> 
> *12 Broadcasts
> 
> USA Network (Prime-Time average)
> A18-49: 940,795 (972,333)
> P2+: 2,629,077 (2,710,872)


*"The accumulated filth of all their jobs and burying will foam up around their waists and all the WHORES and BACKSTAGE POLITICIANS will look up and shout "Save us!"......and I'll whisper "No." * - _CM Punk_


----------



## Karma101

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> :cool2 Yeah after that last post I'd try to convince everyone I was trolling all along too.


Nah he was trolling all along though.


----------



## THANOS

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> *"The accumulated filth of all their jobs and burying will foam up around their waists and all the WHORES and BACKSTAGE POLITICIANS will look up and shout "Save us!"......and I'll whisper "No." * - _CM Punk_


Rep for the Rorschach mention!


----------



## The Buryer

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



wb1899 said:


> Q1-3 2013 vs Q1-3 2012


What months are we exactly comparing here?


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

You know the fact that some Bryan marks trying to look cool by making fun of Punk ratings of last year is just I dont know embarrassing I would say. You know last year had nothing except Punk compared to this year so you Bryan should be only thankful that Bryan is in this position even tho he adds nothing. Also that idiot comparing last year December numbers when December is 3 months way, he's so confident that it will do way better numbers fpalm. Ok Bryan marks he's the next Austin he will bring the old glory days and will destroy NFL, or whatever because he's such an amazing draw . You see the buyrates confirm that also you know! 

Did you guys forget that the show did a 2.65 rating early this year! unk


----------



## Biast

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



wb1899 said:


> A18-49 viewership:
> 8:00: 1,600,000 (+51,000)
> 9:00: 1,664,000 (+51,000)
> 10:00-11:10: 1,740,000 (-25,000)
> Average: 1,668,000 (+25,667)


Punk and Bryan bringing ratings, nothing new. The Corp storyline on the other hand is beginning to bore me out.

A little bit weak this week though. Punk is playing the second stick to the Corp sotryline really good, especially after last week's huge gain. Bryan is doing good also, but with him being the focal point of WWE right now, I expected a bit more. I don't know, crowd wasn't really that into it this week either. On top of that, the Chicago Bears match was good too, which also hurt the ratings. Still pretty good show and nice gains by Punk and Bryan.

The rest of the show was kinda ''meh''. I would love to see a minute breakdown just to laugh at all the viewers the Divas match lost. Without AJ, there is no point in having Divas on the show.


----------



## shought321

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> :cool2 Yeah after that last post I'd try to convince everyone I was trolling all along too.


Yeh, except it was ABUNDANTLY clear he was trolling all along.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Guess the WWE hasn't given up on Bryan if there is talk of him winning the Rumble and main eventing Mania....


----------



## Biast

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> Guess the WWE hasn't given up on Bryan if there is talk of him winning the Rumble and *main eventing Mania*....


Not happening.


----------



## 4everEyebrowRaisin

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Ah, time for the weekly argument about ratings while WWE still continue to push the same guys because they don't really give as big a fuck as the nerds on here think they do.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

last time I checked whoever wins the Rumble as a big title match at Mania.


----------



## superuser1

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> last time I checked whoever wins the Rumble as a big title match at Mania.


But that doesnt mean it'll be in the main event


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

either way, he's look at as a main eventer now which should eliminate some of the fears some Bryan fans had of him being sent back.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Biast said:


> Not happening.


Yes, it will co-main event. Doesn't mean it will be the last match of the show but it will be billed as a main event.




superuser1 said:


> But that doesnt mean it'll be in the main event


A Main event, yes. last match, no. That will be HHH/Vince's Champ for control of company match.


----------



## Jof

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Biast said:


> Punk and Bryan bringing ratings, nothing new. The Corp storyline on the other hand is beginning to bore me out.
> 
> A little bit weak this week though. Punk is the second stick to the Corp sotryline really good, especially after last week's huge gain. Bryan is doing good also, but with him being the focal point of WWE right now, I expected a bit more. I don't know, crowd wasn't really that into it this week either. On top of that, the Chicago Bears match was good too, which also hurt the ratings. Still pretty good show and nice gains by Punk and Bryan.
> 
> The rest of the show was kinda ''meh''. I would love to see a minute breakdown just to laugh at all the viewers the Divas match lost. *Without AJ, there is no point in having Divas on the show.*


No shit. AJ lee has been overpushed for the past two years.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Sonnen Says said:


> You know the fact that some Bryan marks trying to look cool by making fun of Punk ratings of last year is just I dont know embarrassing I would say. You know last year had nothing except Punk compared to this year so you Bryan should be only thankful that Bryan is in this position even tho he adds nothing. Also that idiot comparing last year December numbers when December is 3 months way, he's so confident that it will do way better numbers fpalm. Ok Bryan marks he's the next Austin he will bring the old glory days and will destroy NFL, or whatever because he's such an amazing draw . You see the buyrates confirm that also you know!
> 
> Did you guys forget that the show did a 2.65 rating early this year! unk


Who's trying to look cool? I'm merely pointing out what so many Punk fans have tried desperately to deny time after time. Punk didn't draw for shit until he worked with Taker and Rock and became a credible superstar. All I want in bringing this up is for Punk marks to FINALLY admit to the reality of the situation. He bombed last year, and it was NOT Cena's fault, or HHH's fault...it was Phil's fault. 2 years....2 FUCKING YEARS and he still drew poorly. Bryan routinely has been beating him in the ratings (barring last weeks outlier) since becoming a main eventer at SS. That is REALITY. Admit it and we can all move on. unk3

You still haven't figured out how to read and then respond, have you Brick? No one is comparing December's ratings. Last Monday's show got the lowest ratings SINCE December. Read, then respond.

BTW those buyrates were prelims and they STILL were higher than Cena/Punk when the Summer of Failure first began. Again...simple reality.





Jof said:


> No shit. AJ lee has been overpushed for the past two years.


I know, right. Push some other women, both in story lines and in the gym. Why these women are allowed to half ass it in the ring when the guys can't is beyond me. Women and men are equal, right? Make them learn to actually wrestle and then push the talented ones just like they do with the men.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

what I can't figure out, is that since Punk gets shitty numbers, why do they keep giving him chances?


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Because he still makes money and gets the best crowd reactons. Ratings don't mean shit.


----------



## Lebyonics

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

But last year had more viewership than this year....and from what I know ratings keep changing every year


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Numbers are comparable to last year, so if Punk failed a year ago, Bryan's failing as well. Also the viewership from last yer's show of the same week happened to be a big drop from the week prior... and this show was the same. 

The reality is it's got nothing to do with Punk or Bryan, it's just the competition. Even looking at the comparison to year's prior around the same time, numbers always drop low around this time. I mean, if this big Corporation angle with HHH involved is only doing around what last year did (and on all shows bar this week's, a bit lower), then nothing in WWE's arsenal right now is going to change that.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

ratings would go up if Bryan was actually given the title like he deserves...people are getting turned off because he doesn't have it...ever since he was stripped, the ratings each week have gone down.


----------



## #Mark

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> what I can't figure out, is that since Punk gets shitty numbers, why do they keep giving him chances?


It's not like Bryan's numbers are great either.


----------



## Jof

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

I wonder how low the numbers are gonna get in December.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

either way Punk and Bryan's numbers are better than anyone elses' on the show.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

You really can't blame any wrestler in particular. It's all on WWE creative for giving the fans no reason to tune in. Outside of the Bryan getting stripped nothing important has happened post-NOC.


----------



## JY57

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

^^^ if last December was any indication pretty low (2.55, 2.7, 2.84, 2.2, & 2.31)


----------



## Jof

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

To be fair, they are really weak on babyface side with Cena, sheamus, henry out, Hunter and Orton turning heel and Show locked in with them. Thats why PPVs feel like poor fillers since summerslam. With Cena, henry and Sheamus having seperate feuds leading to any PPV would make tremendous difference in name value, if not buyrates.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

i'm pretty sure in December they just rely on their house show attendance and merch sales to get by through that month.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



The Sandrone said:


> Numbers are comparable to last year, so if Punk failed a year ago, Bryan's failing as well. Also the viewership from last yer's show of the same week happened to be a big drop from the week prior... and this show was the same.
> 
> The reality is it's got nothing to do with Punk or Bryan, it's just the competition. Even looking at the comparison to year's prior around the same time, numbers always drop low around this time. I mean, if this big Corporation angle with HHH involved is only doing around what last year did (and on all shows bar this week's, a bit lower), then nothing in WWE's arsenal right now is going to change that.


It's doing the same while only 2 months into pushing a new main eventer in Bryan (We would be around August of 2011 in Punk's push timeline wise) and WITHOUT JOHN CENA. While up against MNF and the lynchpin of the company is gone with no return in sight and ratings aren't in freefall (barring this weeks Punktastic shitfest).


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Bryan and Punks segments consistently gain big #'s, only megastars like Hogan/Austin/Rock/:russo can do the same for the whole show.


----------



## Cliffy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> You really can't blame any wrestler in particular. It's all on WWE creative for giving the fans no reason to tune in. Outside of the Bryan getting stripped nothing important has happened post-NOC.


This is spot on. 

Marks need to get a grip & focus on the real problem, Hunter, Steph & the creative team.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Bryan and Punks segments consistently gain big #'s, only megastars like *Hogan*/Austin/Rock/:russo can do the same for the whole show.


Try to tell this to Dixie Carter with a straight face. :lmao




Barry Dylan said:


> Because he still makes money and gets the best crowd reactons. Ratings don't mean shit.


Is it Snitch O'Clock already?


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Cliffy Byro said:


> This is spot on.
> 
> Marks need to get a grip & focus on the real problem, Hunter, Steph & the creative team.


Actually, a very reliable source on the creative team just informed me that it's all Daniel Bryans fault and he'll soon be getting into a fatal "accident"

Tough luck marks


----------



## Jof

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Tell that and Dixie would likely agree with you. TNA is the problem, not Hogan.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

When will the segment by segment numbers be out?


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Actually, a very reliable source on the creative team just informed me that it's all Daniel Bryans fault and he'll soon be getting into a fatal "accident"
> 
> Tough luck marks



Over hearing a conversation after being smuggled in to WWE Corporate via Punk's asshole does not a source make. BTW ,aren't you on Preperation-H duty today?


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Jof said:


> Tell that and Dixie would likely agree with you. TNA is the problem, not Hogan.


She knows. At this point she has to. She's just too chickenshit to deal with the problem. I think she feels the cancer has spread so wide that she has to just live with it for now and hope for a last minute cure. IMO of course.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> Over hearing a conversation after being smuggled in to WWE Corporate via Punk's asshole does not a source make. BTW ,aren't you on Preperation-H duty today?


 Bryan marks seem to really be intimated by Punks presence, you should realize Bryan will never be bigger than Punk. He's had his time and so far he's failed miserably.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> Try to tell this to Dixie Carter with a straight face. :lmao


*Picks up phone and time travels back to late 2009* 

"Hey Dixie, forums poster "AnthonyMichaelHall" here. Now everyone knows Hulk Hogan was the biggest draw in the business for the better part of 14 years, but he's lost quite a bit of his luster since then, and while he'll most likely pop the ratings in the short term, in the long run the effect he'll have on your business probably won't be worth his salary."

"Why yes, I'll be happy to lay more pipe than Haliburton in you"


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Amazing how Hogan's net worth is down to nothing now.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Punk Fan said:


> Bryan marks seem to really be intimated by Punks presence, you should realize Bryan will never be bigger than Punk. He's had his time and so far he's failed miserably.


Dude, I was joking/trolling with Anthony. But for the record Bryan already is bigger than Punk. Everyone knows it too. That's why Punktards are soiling themselves for Punk to take Orton or Bryan's place. Bryan gets bigger reactions and ratings most weeks and it only took 2 months to surpass Mr. 2 Years. *sniff, sniff* The smell of Punk mark desperation.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

I'd be inclined to agree, Bryan appeals more to the kids, so thats why he's already bigger than Punk....plus, Bryan follows the rules and Punk looks like he breaks them all the time and doesn't give a shit. So with that type of volatility, you can't push him to the top and have him stay there..but if you're a company guy and follow the rules in a big corporation you're given everything.


----------



## Jof

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Hogan's contract with TNA jsut expired, chances he will back in WWE for wrestlemania.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> Dude, I was joking/trolling with Anthony. *But for the record Bryan already is bigger than Punk.* Everyone knows it too. That's why Punktards are soiling themselves for Punk to take Orton or Bryan's place. Bryan gets bigger reactions and ratings most weeks and it only took 2 months to surpass Mr. 2 Years. *sniff, sniff* The smell of Punk mark desperation.


 The numbers say otherwise the only merch that actually sold was the Yes shirts the beard ones aren't half as successful. Do I even need to bring up PPV buys and ratings?


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Jof said:


> Hogan's contract with TNA jsut expired, chances he will back in WWE for wrestlemania.


Not to wrestle. The guy can barely walk. At this point going over Hogan is tantamount to a mercy killing. What would be the point of paying him that huge salary he'll demand for a big fat nothing?


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> I'd be inclined to agree, Bryan appeals more to the kids, so thats why he's already bigger than Punk....plus, Bryan follows the rules and Punk looks like he breaks them all the time and doesn't give a shit.* So with that type of volatility, you can't push him to the top and have him stay there..but if you're a company guy and follow the rules in a big corporation you're given everything.*


 Yet they did unk2

Bryan is nothing but a placeholder, this time could have been much better spent splitting up the shield and having the show focused around them but no we have the feel good story of Daniel Bland.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Punk Fan said:


> The numbers say otherwise the only merch that actually sold was the Yes shirts the beard ones aren't half as successful. Do I even need to bring up PPV buys and ratings?


Punk has a head start and way more merch so it isn't surprising he sells a lot of merch. The beard shirt was only for men. Can you really see some female (or kids for that matter) wearing a shirt about a beard?  The only PPV buys we have are prelims which currently are higher that Punk/Cena's were at the time...and ratings? Since SS and barring last week Bryan has beat Punk in the ratings every time. WTF are you talking about? You mention ratings right after a Raw saturated with Punk comes in as the lowest rated show since LAST YEAR. C'mon, son.




Punk Fan said:


> Yet they did unk2
> 
> Bryan is nothing but a placeholder, this time could have been much better spent splitting up the shield and having the show focused around them but no we have the feel good story of Daniel Bland.


The genie is out of the bottle dude. Bryan is a main eventer for life. You'll still be bitching about him a year from now when Punk has long since retired from the full time roster. I look forward to your tears. Delicious.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

shut it man! Punk had his time....geez..go away! its someone elses' turn..no matter who got this push, you'd bitch that it wasn't Punk...


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Punk Fan said:


> The numbers say otherwise the only merch that actually sold was the Yes shirts the beard ones aren't half as successful. Do I even need to bring up PPV buys and ratings?


Do I need to bring up the 2.2s and fans leaving before/during Punk's matches when he was in the main event?


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Bryan has to stay in the main event..you can't go from pinning Cena clean to pinning Orton clean, to not staying in the main event.....it makes the company look bad.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> Do I need to bring up the 2.2s and fans leaving before/during Punk's matches when he was in the main event?


 So what? I can admit Punk doesn't draw :lol

Just like Bryan and the rest of the roster.

Characters at present just blow, or are missing something. 

None of them have the attributes to keep you engaged for long, it's just that Punk to me at present is the best of a bad bunch.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> Do I need to bring up the 2.2s and fans leaving before/during Punk's matches when he was in the main event?


Why can't I rep you hourly?


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

he just said Bryan doesn't draw again...there are more Yes signs than anything of anyone else's in the arenas..they clearly come for him....I throw my hands up at this argument.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> he just said Bryan doesn't draw again...*there are more Yes signs than anything of anyone else's in the arenas..they clearly come for him*....I throw my hands up at this argument.


 Everyone has there two mins, what happens to Bryan when the Yes/No chants become redundant? Does he magically grow 4 inches and develop main event worthy mic skills?


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

we're still waiting on them to go away aren't we? by my calculations its been since before wrestlemania 28, what number is coming up?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> It's doing the same while only 2 months into pushing a new main eventer in Bryan (We would be around August of 2011 in Punk's push timeline wise) and WITHOUT JOHN CENA. While up against MNF and the lynchpin of the company is gone with no return in sight and ratings aren't in freefall (barring this weeks Punktastic shitfest).


But ratings havbeefed free falling iin line with last year's, even before this week. And last year was WITHOUt HHH AND A BIG STORYLINE. So despite Punk having more of a push by this time last year, it all evens out and th result is just about even. Call Punk's numbers a failure if you wish, but Bryan should take the same fall for the overall number if you do.

But as I said, for me, neither of them deserve the blame. The numbers are low just because of the average decline around this time of year, nothing else really.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> we're still waiting on them to go away aren't we? by my calculations its been since before wrestlemania 28, what number is coming up?


 So Bryan needs a one syllable chant to remain over? I mean c'mon even you must realize it's not good for business having a guy like Bryan beat guys like Orton for 6 months and have him be the face of the company (till Cena gets back). The chants actually really make wrestling fans look retarded tbh.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Punk Fan said:


> Everyone has there two *years*, what happens to *Punk* when the *pipebombs/breaking of the fourth wall* become redundant? Does he magically grow 4 inches and develop main event worthy *drawing* skills?


Fixed.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

It really seems Punk fans are butthurt Bryan's become a bigger deal in the past several months than Punk has in his 434 days of irrelevancy. :ti


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

dude Christ! he was over before the chants....geez, do you even watch wrestling? if they died down ever, he'd still remain over because he's exciting in general...so just stop it! in the indies, he kicked guys in the head, was the main event, didnt need a chant...he will always find a way to stay relevant.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



The Sandrone said:


> But ratings have been freefling in line with last year's, even before this week. And last year was WITHOUt HHH AND A BIG STORYLINE. So despite Punk having more of a push by this time last year, it all evens out and th result is just about even. Call Punk's numbers a failure if you wish, but Bryan should take the same fall for the overall number if you do.
> 
> But as I said, for me, neither of them deserve the blame. The numbers are low just because of the average decline around this time of year, nothing else really.


You missed my point. Bryan isn't in the same spot Punk was in last year. Bryan is in the same spot Punk was in back in August of 2011. So no I don't blame Bryan...yet. 6 months from now and you're right on and I'll agree completely.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> It really seems Punk fans are butthurt Bryan's become a bigger deal in the past several months than Punk has in his 434 days of irrelevancy. :ti


 I'd love to see 434 day long reign of Daniel Bryan just to see the reaction of some marks after it.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Punk Fan said:


> So Bryan needs a one syllable chant to remain over? I mean c'mon even you must realize it's not good for business having a guy like Bryan beat guys like Orton for 6 months and have him be the face of the company (till Cena gets back). The chants actually really make wrestling fans look retarded tbh.


What?


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

it would be the greatest 434 days ever because it'd be nothing but exciting matches, he'd be a fighting champion..Punk was dull and boring and I already forgot about his title reign because it wasn't important, it was all Cena all night long any way.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> dude Christ! he was over before the chants....geez, do you even watch wrestling? if they died down ever, *he'd still remain over because he's exciting in general*...so just stop it! in the indies, he kicked guys in the head, was the main event, didnt need a chant...he will always find a way to stay relevant.


 The guy isn't compelling sure he's great in the ring but when he has to sell a match in a promo he can't do anything. 

He doesn't have a look of a superstar and he doesn't have the mic skills of a superstar and for that reason alone Cena will remain to be the guy for the next 5-6 years at least.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Punk Fan said:


> I'd love to see 434 day long reign of Daniel Bryan just to see the reaction of some marks after it.


And that is the difference between Bryan fans and Punk fans. *Most* Bryan fans DON'T want that. Not only does a reign like that do more damage than good, it's just plain fucking selfish to everyone else on the roster.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

oh so tattoos all over your upperbody and your hair slicked back makes you a superstar now? Bryan can run circles over everyone on any roster..oh and he doesn't need to sell a match, everyone knows already how great he is, dont' believe me? look at his matches, everyone gets into it...


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> And that is the difference between Bryan fans and Punk fans. *Most* Bryan fans DON'T want that. Not only does a reign like that do more damage than good, it's just plain fucking selfish to everyone else on the roster.


 Exactly....

People bring up Punks reign and the ratings from but the truth is most people would turn off regardless of champion. With booking as it is, it would be difficult to stay relevant and fresh.


----------



## #Mark

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Punk Fan said:


> I mean c'mon even you must realize it's not good for business having a guy like Bryan beat guys like Orton for 6 months and have him be the face of the company (till Cena gets back). The chants actually really make wrestling fans look retarded tbh.


Just like it was good for business for Punk to hold the belt for 434 days.. You know, when Raw has averaging it's lowest ratings since 1996 :lmao


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Punk Fan said:


> Exactly....
> 
> People bring up Punks reign and the ratings from but the truth is most people would turn off regardless of champion because with booking as it is, it would be difficult to stay relevant and fresh.


But quite a few Punk fans want ANOTHER 434 days...at least. Explain that to me.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> You missed my point. Bryan isn't in the same spot Punk was in last year. Bryan is in the same spot Punk was in back in August of 2011. So no I don't blame Bryan...yet. 6 months from now and you're right on and I'll agree completely.


Right, I got that, but again, they're in the same position, the center of the show in the championship feud, so whether Punk was further ahead than Bryan is now or not, they are in fact in the same position for blame because of where they're positioned. Bryan is positioned far better than Punk post-NoC 2011.


----------



## Stad

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> *oh so tattoos all over your upperbody and your hair slicked back makes you a superstar now?* Bryan can run circles over everyone on any roster..oh and he doesn't need to sell a match, everyone knows already how great he is, dont' believe me? look at his matches, everyone gets into it...


What exactly does that have to do with anything? :lmao


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



#Mark said:


> Just like it was good for business for Punk to hold the belt for 434 days.. You know, when Raw has averaging it's lowest ratings since 1996 :lmao


 It was stupid but who else could have gotten the belt? There's a lack of genuine main eventers..


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

the key is fresh feuds.....how about every week they have the champion wrestle someone new....that would be epic! everyone gets a shot at the title or the champion..I like fighting champions. I hate how champions nowadays only defend the title at ppvs.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> But quite a few Punk fans want ANOTHER 434 days...at least. Explain that to me.


 Plain stupid, no one in this era is capable of holding the title for that long.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> the key is fresh feuds.....how about every week they have the champion wrestle someone new....that would be epic! everyone gets a shot at the title or the champion..I like fighting champions. I hate how champions nowadays only defend the title at ppvs.


 This.

With the rare title change to reduce predictability.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

ADR has held the world title for a long time already....so long reigns can happen regardless if a guy draws or not.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Long title reigns work if the right guy is holding the belt. I saw a legit chart that showed that Nash drew more than Hogan, Hart, Austin and Rock during his year long title reign. But then again Nash is a guy that actually looks like a champion not like a Hobbit extra or some Waffle House fry cook.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> But quite a few Punk fans want ANOTHER 434 days...at least. Explain that to me.


Well... Punk fans/marks should want a guy they're entertained by to be champion for as log as possible. Sure, that may not be the best thing for the ratings, but there's nothing odd about that.

I mean, maybe it happens and people who were fans of his get bored by it and regret wanting it again after it starts, but I know all the guys I mark for... (not just Punk) I want to see them have long, successful runs.


----------



## Stad

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> Do I need to bring up the 2.2s and *fans leaving before/during Punk's matches when he was in the main event?*


How exactly would you know this? did you attend every RAW and PPV or what?? :ti


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

i mean just imagine, Bryan wins the title, but then he faces someone like an R-Truth on Raw, or Sandow the next week, then Ziggler challenges him, then he has another classic with Cesaro the next week, all while at the same time he's having his build up for a ppv match..but yet every week he's defending the title on tv to show that he is dangerous and how hard it'll be to get the title off of him because he's beating everyone. see, that is what should be happening...instead of hot potato with the belt and year long title reigns...just change it up and make the feuds random and entertaining instead of having just one for the whole year.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



The Sandrone said:


> Right, I got that, but again, they're in the same position, the center of the show in the championship feud, so whether Punk was further ahead than Bryan is now or not, they are in fact in the same position for blame because of where they're positioned. Bryan is positioned far better than Punk post-NoC 2011.


I get what you're trying to say but I disagree. By this time last year Punk was clearly established as a legit main event player (no matter what his fans say about Cena). Bryan isn't established in casual fan's minds yet. NOC proved that. They didn't cheer for his title win until it was apparent he was gonna keep the title for the night. That matters. Even if 5% of casuals tune out because they don't think Bryan will stick around in the main event for long that makes a huge difference. In 6 months when he's been cemented at the top in even the most cynical of minds I'll agree with you....but I won't have to because I believe Bryan will be drawing. He connects with fans in a way Punk just doesn't. We'll see in a few months.


----------



## PepeSilvia

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Bryan wins the WWE title at Summerslam
> HHH takes it away
Next 4 weeks Bryan can't even get an offensive move in...gets beat down at the end of every show

Bryan wins the WWE title at NoC
> HHH takes it away (2nd time)
> Bryan doesnt even put up a fight, except to say "NO!" before he his RKO'd
> Bryan ends every show with the Yes chant....suddenly not giving a crap about the WWE title or getting back at HHH (the dude who set him up. DB beat Orton with the same move he beat Cena with. If I was Bryan Id be pissed...fast count, who cares...it was over)

Daniel Bryan was RED HOT this summer. Maybe they want to bottle it up and turn it back on for Wrestlemania. Because the way he's being booked right now is stupid and confuses everyone


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Stad said:


> How exactly would you know this? did you attend every RAW and PPV or what?? :ti


House show reports. There were quite a few last year that started quite a few fans were leaving before Punk's match even started.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Bryan will draw. he always finds a way to turn a shitty situation into magic...Losing to Sheamus in 18 seconds he turned that into Yes Mania, being paired with Kane, he turned those comedy skits to gold every week and got people interested...he can turn anything into gold..he has many years left and its just starting to get epic for him..he'll find another way to stay relevant.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



> 7)* In the main event*, Ryback defeated WWE Champion, *CM Punk* via D.Q. *I have never seen so many people leave during a WWE main event as happened here.* Whether this was a reflection on how people views Ryback, or because the kids were so young that families wanted to beat the traffic, or if it was late, who knows. But other than the 'Feed Me More' chants that people liked to do, people didn't seem as into Ryback as I've seen them get into other non-John Cena main event babyfaces over the years. Granted it's a recent mega push, and these things take time to catch on. It doesn't help that Ryback is such a limited worker though, and this really wasn't a good main event match. Punk tried his best, but there's only so much Zbyszko-like stalling he can do. Ryback no-sold a bunch of Punk offence. Punk tried to go for the GTS, but was clotheslined to the outside. Ryback charged at him, but Punk dodged him, and Ryback ran-head first into the ring steps. Ryback beat the count and joined Punk back in the ring at the count of 9. Ryback powered up and levelled Punk with clotheslines. He was going for Shellshock when Cody Rhodes & Damien Sandow hit the ring for the cheap D.Q. The heels triple-teamed Ryback and tried to use a chair on him, but Ryback broke free and made his own comeback, getting rid of Rhodes Scholars, then giving Punk Shell Shock to finish the show. Ryback's music played, and he paraded around the ring afterwards,* but over half the crowd had left* at this point, and it was kind of sad to see.


:lmao


----------



## Stad

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> :lmao


So you bring up one house show incident and somehow that makes it happen at every RAW and PPV now? :ti


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> Who's trying to look cool? I'm merely pointing out what so many Punk fans have tried desperately to deny time after time. Punk didn't draw for shit until he worked with Taker and Rock and became a credible superstar. All I want in bringing this up is for Punk marks to FINALLY admit to the reality of the situation. He bombed last year, and it was NOT Cena's fault, or HHH's fault...it was Phil's fault. 2 years....2 FUCKING YEARS and he still drew poorly. Bryan routinely has been beating him in the ratings (barring last weeks outlier) since becoming a main eventer at SS. That is REALITY. Admit it and we can all move on. unk3
> 
> You still haven't figured out how to read and then respond, have you Brick? No one is comparing December's ratings. Last Monday's show got the lowest ratings SINCE December. Read, then respond.
> 
> BTW those buyrates were prelims and they STILL were higher than Cena/Punk when the Summer of Failure first began. Again...simple reality.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know, right. Push some other women, both in story lines and in the gym. Why these women are allowed to half ass it in the ring when the guys can't is beyond me. Women and men are equal, right? Make them learn to actually wrestle and then push the talented ones just like they do with the men.


Why do you consider ratings as a success or failure of Punk? Raw was doing well until October/December. His buyrate numbers was higher than Cenas when maineventing this year, last year and the year before it if you exclude WM. The RR 13, EC 13, HIAC 12, SS 12, NOC 12, etc. have all drew good/great numbers that Bryan will never reach. Also he's a top merchandise seller with Cena. Overall ratings doesnt show his drawing power because the show is 3 hours hard to label anyone as it's someones fault. It's the WWE fault for not having enough top stars, at least now they are building Bryan but that's it for now, they are just gonna focus on him. Bryan numbers arent that impressive since he has HHH and McMahons with him while Punk has Axel and Ryback and still draws as big or even bigger. 

You seriously gonna compare SS 11 card with this year card unk, this year had a bigger card but since Bryan is the mainevent people probably didn't see him as a threat. Summer of Punk was a success, Punk T-shirt was the hottest selling shirt since Austin shirt and also the level of demand in the media was higher than any wrestler in this whole PG era shit, he had tons and tons of interviews, also as a champ he was part of the highest WM buys of all time and also the highest RR buys since 2002. Reality is Bryan will never reach Punks starpower. 

You seem to forget every time you respond to someone. You remember the guy with the signature that says 2.2 rating, he summed up Punks whole reign with it and you agreed with his signature like an idiot. You probably dont know what show was that anyway. I dont care if I didnt pay enough attention to all this numbers crap because the discussion was you guys comparing numbers anyway. Either ways this year will get similar numbers. I think JY57 said that last year viewership was higher than this year but the rating is different.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Whats up with the Shield thread? A guy/girl who seems to have the hots for them keeps posting pictures of them...

Where are the meaningful discussions?..


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

oh yeah because Bryan isn't a draw..another stupid post about it again! its neverending. how in the fuck can anyone say Bryan will never reach Punk's starpower when he already clearly has....? give me a break!


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Stad said:


> So you bring up one house show incident and somehow that makes it happen at every RAW and PPV now? :ti


Never said that it happened at every RAW and PPV. The fact that it happened quite a few times last year obviously shows what the fans think of Vanilla Midget Punk. I've never heard of it happened for any other WWE Champion.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> Never said that it happened at every RAW and PPV. The fact that it happened quite a few times last year obviously shows what the fans think of *Vanilla Midget Punk*. I've never heard of it happened for any other WWE Champion.


 What's Daniel Bryan then?...


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

stop trying to reason with them, they'll never let the Bryan hate and Punk love go.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Punk Fan said:


> What's Daniel Bryan then?...


The next wrestler turned actor like Dwayne Johnson and Hulk Hogan. Can't wait for Bryan to star in the sequel to Suburban Commando. :mark:


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> House show reports. There were quite a few last year that started quite a few fans were leaving before Punk's match even started.


And there is reports that says Punk was drawing very well without Cena. It doesn't mean anything anyway, most of Cena fans are just bunch of kids.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Sonnen Says said:


> Why do you consider ratings as a success or failure of Punk?


Probably for the same reason I consider a straight guy surrounded by hot women a ladies man. Common sense. Punk's job is to get people to watch him which in turn sells merch and ppvs which makes WWE money. That's his job. If ratings are low when he's on that means people as a whole aren't watching him. That means HE ISN'T DOING HIS FUCKING JOB CORRECTLY.



Sonnen Says said:


> You seriously gonna compare SS 11 card with this year card unk, this year had a bigger card but since Bryan is the mainevent people probably didn't see him as a threat.


Then it should have done less buys prelim wise if no one believed in Bryan as a threat. You're arguing against yourself.



Sonnen Says said:


> Summer of Punk was a success


It really wasn't. Is the Earth flat in your dimension too?



Sonnen Says said:


> Punk T-shirt was the hottest selling shirt since Austin shirt


For 3 whole months. Then Cena went back to whooping that tattooed ass.



Sonnen Says said:


> also the level of demand in the media was higher than any wrestler in this whole PG era shit he had tons and tons of interviews


Who's ass did you pull this out of? Please prove this shit.



Sonnen Says said:


> also as a champ he was part of the highest WM buys of all time and also the highest RR buys since 2002. Reality is Bryan will never reach Punks starpower.


Yeah that was all Punk. Rock had nothing to do with it. :lmao



Sonnen Says said:


> You seem to forget every time you respond to someone. You remember the guy with the signature that says 2.2 rating, he summed up Punks whole reign with it and you agreed with his signature like an idiot.


No dumb dumb, I said it was funny and the best gif in the world playing up on Punk's (really Bryan's) catchphrase. I didn't agree or disagree with what it said at all. I'm gonna keep saying this until you finally fucking learn. Read, then respond.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

every time someone says Bryan can't draw it just makes them look ridiculous.....


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> I get what you're trying to say but I disagree. By this time last year Punk was clearly established as a legit main event player (no matter what his fans say about Cena). Bryan isn't established in casual fan's minds yet. NOC proved that. They didn't cheer for his title win until it was apparent he was gonna keep the title for the night. That matters. Even if 5% of casuals tune out because they don't think Bryan will stick around in the main event for long that makes a huge difference. In 6 months when he's been cemented at the top in even the most cynical of minds I'll agree with you....but I won't have to because I believe Bryan will be drawing. He connects with fans in a way Punk just doesn't. We'll see in a few months.


Fair enough, we'll have to agree to disagree, but when do you expect to compare them? Because in 6 months we'll be deep in Mania season and there will be many months into Mania. Bythe way you're talking, we'd have to wait a year before seeing what kind of impact Bryan has, which if that's how it works for you, then cool.

Why can't Punk and Bryan marks just get along?


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

because they cant....which is sad, but we like who we like.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> oh yeah because Bryan isn't a draw..another stupid post about it again! its neverending. how in the fuck can anyone say Bryan will never reach Punk's starpower when he already clearly has....? give me a break!


When Bryan faces Taker, Rock, Lesnar, and HHH we then can talk later and even when he faces one of them the feud will no where be as good, the guy can barely talk and tell a story. Did Bryan have the hottest selling shirt since Austin shirt or did he reach Punks PPV buys no he didnt and he will never will. You think Bryan can draw 570k with someone? :lol that will never happen hell he had a strong card in SS and it didn't even open with 300k.


----------



## #Mark

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

How on earth was the Summer of Punk a success? Because he moved some merchandise? Daniel Bryan's YES shirt was one of the top selling shirts in the company when he was jobbing to Sheamus on a weekly basis. Fact is the ratings were down, Summerslam 2011 was one of the least drawing Summerslams of all time, and NOC 2011 garnered the lowest buyrate in the history of the PPV.. If embarrassing business constitutes as a success then yeah the Summer of Punk was the most successful three months in WWE history.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

okay Sonnen whatever you say....has Bryan faced those guys yet? no, so there you go, your argument is invalid.


----------



## Happenstan

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



The Sandrone said:


> Fair enough, we'll have to agree to disagree, but when do you expect to compare them? Because in 6 months we'll be deep in Mania season and there will be many months into Mania. Bythe way you're talking, we'd have to wait a year before seeing what kind of impact Bryan has, which if that's how it works for you, then cool.


That's a good point. It shouldn't be pre-RtWM but after Mania would be too long for a perfect comparison as well. Maybe compare Punk and Bryan 8 months in to their respective big pushes after mania 30 season is over. That seems fair I guess.



The Sandrone said:


> Why can't Punk and Bryan marks just get along?


Mainly because Punk fans keep trying to prop their boy up on our boy's back. Have you ever seen a multitude of one wrestler's fans demand said wrestler take over/steal some other guys big push? 1 or 2 here and there is understandable but when this Corp story started there were 3-4 threads a day demanding Punk take Bryan's place. How selfishly dickish is that?





Sonnen Says said:


> When Bryan faces Taker, Rock, Lesnar, and HHH we then can talk later and even when he faces one of them the feud will no where be as good, the guy can barely talk and tell a story. Did Bryan have the hottest selling shirt since Austin shirt or did he reach Punks PPV buys no he didnt and he will never will. You think Bryan can draw 570k with someone? :lol that will never happen hell he had a strong card in SS and it didn't even open with 300k.


Bryan still has those feuds to look forward to because unlike Can't Draw McPunk it didn't take a year and going over the entire roster to get Bryan over.


----------



## THANOS

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> The next wrestler turned actor like Dwayne Johnson and Hulk Hogan. Can't wait for Bryan to star in the sequel to Suburban Commando. :mark:


:mark: I challenge you to make the photoshop of Bryan on that poster now! :

Use these pictures as a reference.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Bryan will probably be the only top guy in the WWE that won't ever appear in a movie, not his thing, he doesn't want to do it.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> Probably for the same reason I consider a straight guy surrounded by hot women a ladies man. Common sense. Punk's job is to get people to watch him which in turn sells merch and ppvs which makes WWE money. That's his job. If ratings are low when he's on that means people as a whole aren't watching him. That means HE ISN'T DOING HIS FUCKING JOB CORRECTLY.
> 
> *Did you see the breakdown of last year? Because Punk was the only one with Cena drawing at that time. If ratings measures merch and buyrates Punk wouldn't succeed in both.*
> 
> Then it should have done less buys prelim wise if no one believed in Bryan as a threat. You're arguing against yourself.
> 
> *You just ignored what I said SS 11 card was nothing compared to SS 13 card. It should have drew higher. The prelim isnt higher than SS 11 final number which was something like 330k. Either ways the card wasnt strong as it lacked starpower compared to this year. Even if the final number is announced it will still be one of the lowest SS buys ever, so you're not making any point any way.*
> 
> It really wasn't. Is the Earth flat in your dimension too?
> 
> *Maybe if you read the rest you will know why. *
> 
> For 3 whole months. Then Cena went back to whooping that tattooed ass.
> 
> *Actually 8 months. But I like the fact you missed the part where I said the highest selling shirt since Austin. That means even higher than all Cena shirts. *
> 
> Who's ass did you pull this out of? Please prove this shit.
> 
> *This just shows that you weren't watching in 2011.*
> 
> Yeah that was all Punk. Rock had nothing to do with it. :lmao
> 
> *The fact is Punk was part of it you can never change that. Rock will not draw that number with Ryder in RR period
> *
> 
> No dumb dumb, I said it was funny and the best gif in the world playing up on Punk's (really Bryan's) catchphrase. I didn't agree or disagree with what it said at all. I'm gonna keep saying this until you finally fucking learn. Read, then respond.


In bold.


----------



## Jof

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> :lmao


When was this?


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

i think Bryan was in that wrestlemania too....whoa, guess that puts him in the drawing category, this argument is stupid.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> That's a good point. It shouldn't be pre-RtWM but after Mania would be too long for a perfect comparison as well. Maybe compare Punk and Bryan 8 months in to their respective big pushes after mania 30 season is over. That seems fair.


Even then, that wouldn't be fair to Bryan because right after Mania that year Lesnar returned. And even then, Punk wasn't really in THE main storyline at the time so if Bryan is, it's still not a fair comparison. I mean, I know how I'm comparing them and u compare them however you see fit, but by your way, it doesnt seem like it'd be fair to compare them until we see Bryan go the same period Punk was in the main storyline, with the same time of a push.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Happenstan said:


> That's a good point. It shouldn't be pre-RtWM but after Mania would be too long for a perfect comparison as well. Maybe compare Punk and Bryan 8 months in to their respective big pushes after mania 30 season is over. That seems fair I guess.
> 
> 
> 
> Mainly because Punk fans keep trying to prop their boy up on our boy's back. Have you ever seen a multitude of one wrestler's fans demand said wrestler take over/steal some other guys big push? 1 or 2 here and there is understandable but when this Corp story started there were 3-4 threads a day demanding Punk take Bryan's place. How selfishly dickish is that?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Bryan still has those feuds to look forward to because unlike Can't Draw McPunk it didn't take a year and going over the entire roster to get Bryan over.*


You're just delusional Bryan didnt draw anything higher than Punk neither in merchandise or PPV buys. You cant really call a guy that drew 570k in RR a non draw. No matter what you say you have no proof that Bryan is a bigger draw. Punk have drew higher ratings than Bryan in 2013 his feud with Taker, Cena, Brock, Rock did higher than anything Bryan did all year.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Last weeks quarter hour breakdown



> n the segment-by-segment (these are not actual numbers, but are based on certain markets, but the general picture is going to be consistent), the Alberto Del Rio vs. Kofi Kingston match lost 492,000 viewers from the opening segment. Erick Rowan & Luke Harper vs. The Prime Time Players lost 335,000 viewers and was among the lowest rated quarters of the year. The Miz TV segment with Big Show and Stephanie McMahon at 9 p.m. gained 531,000 viewers. Randy Orton vs. Rob Van Dam lost 98,000 viewers. However, the Orton post-match beatdown on Van Dam gained 157,000 viewers. Fandango vs. Santino Marella lost 354,000 viewers. The C.M. Punk/Paul Heyman/Ryback segment at 10 p.m. was a huge success, gaining 1.03 million viewers. I don’t know what was going on in football but I’m wondering if it coincided with halftime. Even so, a gain like that is incredible for 10 p.m., as it would be among the best gains of the year in that time slot. The 10-woman tag match with A.J. Lee & Tamina Snuka & Alicia Fox & Aksana & Layla vs. Natalya & The Bella Twins & Cameron & Naomi plus a Shield promo lost 1.14 million viewers. Again, that would almost seem like halftime ended and people went back would play a part in that huge of a shift. The 11-on-3 main event gained 492,000 viewers. It should be noted that viewership was larger for the intros and the Rhodes family attack than for most of the match, but it did pick back up for the overrun.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Sonnen Says said:


> You're just delusional Bryan didnt draw anything higher than Punk neither in merchandise or PPV buys. *You cant really call a guy that drew 570k in RR a non draw.* No matter what you say you have no proof that Bryan is a bigger draw. Punk have drew higher ratings than Bryan in 2013 his feud with Taker, Cena, Brock, Rock did higher than anything Bryan did all year.


:lmao:lmao

Stop. Just stop.


----------



## Jof

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Bryan single handedly improved Smackdown ratings during his first title reign, Punk never did. Therefore Bryan > Punk.

/End argument. :trips2


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

I am still failing to see how Punk's lack of drawing suddenly makes it acceptable that this Corporation story is going down faster than Sunny on a cocaine covered dick...

They blew it at NoC, and now interest in general, for everything, is going down. Who cares which of Bryan and Punk draws more viewers, the hottest storyline of the summer is fucked and the show is markedly less entertaining because they seem not to have a clue what they're doing.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

CM Draw doing a 1.03 million take that Bryan marks. Bryan could never do that in that time slot. But wow thats huge its doing better than Bryan supposed push :lol.



Jof said:


> *Henry* single handedly improved Smackdown ratings during his first title reign, Punk never did. Therefore Bryan > Punk.
> 
> /End argument. :trips2


Fixed.


----------



## #Mark

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Billion Dollar Man said:


> :lmao:lmao
> 
> Stop. Just stop.


Punk marks :lmao


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



KO Bossy said:


> going down faster than Sunny on a cocaine covered dick..


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



#Mark said:


> Punk marks :lmao





Billion Dollar Man said:


> :lmao:lmao
> 
> Stop. Just stop.


Yeah I guess Punk and his title reign had nothing to do with it because Survivor Series did such a success for Rock .


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

so you're happy and giddy about Punk getting all these viewers during Halftime of a football game, compared to Bryan gaining half of that while the game was going on? that makes Bryan look better actually. He gained a shit load DURING the game.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

That 1.03 Million gain. In a 10 PM segment. CM GOAT.

:lmao this thread, Bryan marks are just so stupid it's funny. Talking about numbers to downplay Punk, when Bryan in a main event program still can't even touch Punk. The numbers are even with last year, and they still try to say Punk's 2012 failed, yet try to make a claim that Bryan is doing a successful job. :lol The delusion is hilarious.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

what the fuck....can you not read? Punk's segment was DURING halftime..anyone can gain during that shit....Fuck I give up!


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Those excuses. I love 'em, keep it coming.

unk with those huge numbers. Making the "main event" program looking like shit, and not just quality wise.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

so gaining 500,000 viewers is shitty all of a sudden? wow! that seems like a very good gain actually...so i don't understand the point your'e trying to make...you're saying that Punk is better because his segment gained a million and because it gained more that means Punk is better? they both gained viewers, so i'm failing to see how Bryan failed here.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Nah, just compared to a 1.03 million gain, it looks shitty.

Way to be, main event angle. Way to be.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

i'm confused, a couple weeks back you were in awe of how impressive Bryan was, now you're back to bashing him...what happened?


----------



## Jof

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

To be fair, main event focus was on the shield and the jobbers, not Bryan/corporation. Punk did well in any case. 

I reckon Bryan/Corporation angle would deliver big numbers eventually when it hits the peak. Right now too many superstars are involved in this.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Sonnen Says said:


> Yeah I guess Punk and his title reign had nothing to do with it because Survivor Series did such a success for Rock .


Wasn't that the best SS Buyrate since 2008, and far greater than 2012 as well. Yeah.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

It hit it's peak it's first week. And even then, Punk out-performed the segment with Axel of all people. The angle is just going downhill.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

and its Bryan's fault its going downhill? I swear man! maybe the fact they keep fucking him over people are getting tired of...ever think maybe its the fucking writing? but no, blame the wrestler.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

No, it's not his fault. Never said it was. But, he's just not entertaining enough to keep the angle interesting, and by the looks of it, keep the viewers interested. His shtick has already gotten old, fast. This week's crowd was probably the least I've seen a crowd do the Yes thing.

To be fair, they were only loud for one man, and no surprise who it was.


----------



## Jof

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Nah it's yet to peak and there is long way to go. The corrupt referee angle who screwed Orton hasn't even been progressed yet.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

so you say its not his fault, then go and say he's not entertaining to keep the viewers interested..see, you do think its his fault...just your opinion...but seriously dude, your hate for him is the only thing getting stale here.....and you're now saying that the crowd wasn't into him? oh my god, you have jumped the shark on your love for Punk. go ahead blame Punk instead of the lame McMahons were keep fucking everything up.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Billion Dollar Man said:


> Wasn't that the best SS Buyrate since 2008, and far greater than 2012 as well. Yeah.


Meltzer said it wasn't successful by any means because it cost WWE way more than that.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Didnt we devote several pages to how that quarter did last week? We already knew the segment did well, so while the increase was great, its old news. I want to see the quarters this week when Punk tried to glom on to that amazing Heyman/Ryback segment.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

i think fans are interested in both angles, neither of them are losing viewers...you act as if Bryan is the Divas or some shit. now that's awful! seriously, this war is so stupid.


----------



## Biast

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



> In the segment-by-segment (these are not actual numbers, but are based on certain markets, but the general picture is going to be consistent), the Alberto Del Rio vs. Kofi Kingston match lost 492,000 viewers from the opening segment. Erick Rowan & Luke Harper vs. The Prime Time Players lost 335,000 viewers and was among the lowest rated quarters of the year. The Miz TV segment with Big Show and Stephanie McMahon at 9 p.m. gained 531,000 viewers. Randy Orton vs. Rob Van Dam lost 98,000 viewers. However, the Orton post-match beatdown on Van Dam gained 157,000 viewers. Fandango vs. Santino Marella lost 354,000 viewers. *The C.M. Punk/Paul Heyman/Ryback segment at 10 p.m. was a huge success, gaining 1.03 million viewers. *I don’t know what was going on in football but I’m wondering if it coincided with halftime. Even so, a gain like that is incredible for 10 p.m., as it would be among the best gains of the year in that time slot. The 10-woman tag match with A.J. Lee & Tamina Snuka & Alicia Fox & Aksana & Layla vs. Natalya & The Bella Twins & Cameron & Naomi plus a Shield promo lost 1.14 million viewers. Again, that would almost seem like halftime ended and people went back would play a part in that huge of a shift. The 11-on-3 main event gained 492,000 viewers. It should be noted that viewership was larger for the intros and the Rhodes family attack than for most of the match, but it did pick back up for the overrun.


HOLY MOTHERFUCKING BITCH! :jesse This is even more than 3 weeks ago when he gained 860k. 

Inb4 Punk and Bryan can't draw arguments and that it's all luck. :lol


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Wrestlinfan35 said:


> No, it's not his fault. Never said it was. But, he's just not entertaining enough to keep the angle interesting, and by the looks of it, keep the viewers interested. His shtick has already gotten old, fast. This week's crowd was probably the least I've seen a crowd do the Yes thing.
> 
> To be fair, they were only loud for one man, and no surprise who it was.


Randy Orton?


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

What did Bryan do on Raw? I have forgotten. All I remember is the Rhodes bit and Punks two segments.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Well, the 1.03 million gain isn't old news. Not surprised Bryan marks want to sweep it under the rug. GOAT's gonna GOAT.



> Randy Orton?


Funniest thing in this thread yet. Not sure if serious, but still very funny nonetheless.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> so you say its not his fault, then go and say he's not entertaining to keep the viewers interested..see, you do think its his fault...just your opinion...but seriously dude, your hate for him is the only thing getting stale here.....and you're now saying that the crowd wasn't into him? oh my god, you have jumped the shark on your love for Punk. go ahead blame Punk instead of the lame McMahons were keep fucking everything up.


The fact is it's the #1 feud. Bryan has HHH and McMahons and yet Punk is outshining his numbers with Axel. I dont hate Bryan by the way, am actually one of his fans but I just hate how his marks overate his ass.

@wrestlinfan35 Bryan marks are just looking for excuses now.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

i'm not sweeping it under the rug, Bryan already got one of those million gains on a Raw already, so they're about even. And don't go sweeping that one under the rug Punk marks.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Curiously, what does it mean that Punk got that many viewers? How exactly does it make him better, or you right? I really want to know how this thought process works.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

i'm trying to say that neither of them is better...they're not understanding this..i keep saying neither one of them is losing viewers and yet the Punk fans keep saying Bryan isn't as strong as Punk in viewership when they both do well weekly.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> i'm not sweeping it under the rug, Bryan already got one of those million gains on a Raw already, so they're about even. And don't go sweeping that one under the rug Punk marks.


The difference is that the gain with Bryan was in the main event, which is basically expected to do well, whereas Punk did that at the 10pm slot, which is expected to have a small gain. 1.03 million viewers is gigantic, way above expected.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Sonnen Says said:


> The fact is it's the #1 feud. Bryan has HHH and McMahons and yet Punk is outshining his numbers with Axel. I dont hate Bryan by the way, am actually one of his fans but I just hate how his marks overate his ass.
> 
> @wrestlinfan35 Bryan marks are just looking for excuses now.


Bingo.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

why can't people just admit that they're about equal? this is coming from a Bryan mark here...i'm giving Punk full credit but Bryan needs to be given credit as well and needs to stop being bashed..he's working his ass off.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



KO Bossy said:


> Curiously, what does it mean that Punk got that many viewers? How exactly does it make him better, or you right? I really want to know how this thought process works.


Nothing it's just a way for them to shut up about Punk and his drawing ability. I just think they should be happy that Bryan is maineventing but unfortunately they concern themselves with Punk for a reason.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Well, the 1.03 million gain isn't old news. Not surprised Bryan marks want to sweep it under the rug. GOAT's gonna GOAT.
> 
> 
> 
> Funniest thing in this thread yet. Not sure if serious, but still very funny nonetheless.


The funniest thing I've seen is people acting like Punk and/or Bryan is a draw. And someone being delusional enough to credit Punk for the Royal Rumble buyrate. :lmao


----------



## Jof

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



KO Bossy said:


> The difference is that the gain with Bryan was in the main event, which is basically expected to do well, whereas Punk did that at the 10pm slot, which is expected to have a small gain. 1.03 million viewers is gigantic, way above expected.


Normally yes but with MNF to compete with, that's not the case. Its not co-incidence the past few weeks 10 PM has been the show peak. Its perfect for the viewership gain from the game break. If they had Orton/bryan promo segment in that spot, it would have done just as well or even bigger.


----------



## DualShock

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> oh yeah because Bryan isn't a draw..another stupid post about it again! its neverending. how in the fuck can anyone say Bryan will never reach Punk's starpower when he already clearly has....? give me a break!


That's another example of how delusional Punk marks are. Like CM Punk set the bar high or some shit like that so it's so hard for Daniel Bryan to surpass CM Punk:ti
CM Punk hasn't even reached the starpower of Diesel in 1995



Happenstan said:


> Probably for the same reason I consider a straight guy surrounded by hot women a ladies man. Common sense. Punk's job is to get people to watch him which in turn sells merch and ppvs which makes WWE money. That's his job. If ratings are low when he's on that means people as a whole aren't watching him. That means HE ISN'T DOING HIS FUCKING JOB CORRECTLY.


Wonderful explanation. Repped:clap
But that common sense is ignored by Punk marks.
inb4 Punk marks replying "why do you care if the guy surrounded by hot women is a ladies man? Are you the shareholder of their pussies":lmao



markedfordeath said:


> every time someone says Bryan can't draw it just makes them look ridiculous.....


and everytime someone says Bryan can draw I ask him to post an evidence



Sonnen Says said:


> also as a champ he was part of the highest WM buys of all time and also the highest RR buys since 2002.












You can put the WWE belt on CM Punk, Daniel Bryan, Zack Ryder or Yoshi Tatsu and WrestleMania would still have record buys if the Rock is in main event.
That's the problem when a show has so many guys on the card, there is always someone who gives a failure credit for the success


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Jof said:


> Normally yes but with MNF to compete with, that's not the case. Its not co-incidence the past few weeks 10 PM has been the show peak. Its perfect for the viewership gain from the game break. If they had Orton/bryan promo segment in that spot, it would have done just as well or even bigger.


We didn't get those kinds of 10 PM numbers last year, or years before if I remember correctly, during half time. So I disagree there.

Edit: In fact, to compare the 10PM segment to this time last year:

9/17:



> The post-match stuff with Bryan and Kane hugging lost 169,000 viewers in the 10pm timeslot, doing a low 2.78 quarter rating.


9/24:



> David Otunga, Ricardo Rodriguez and Alberto Del Rio vs. Sin Cara, Sheamus and Rey Mysterio lost 129,000 viewers for a 2.75 quarter at 10pm.


----------



## Vyer

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Sonnen Says said:


> Nothing it's just a way for them to shut up about Punk and his drawing ability. I just think they should be happy that Bryan is maineventing but unfortunately they concern themselves with Punk for a reason.


The pendulum swings both ways.....


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Sonnen Says said:


> Nothing it's just a way for them to shut up about *Punk and his drawing ability.* I just think they should be happy that Bryan is maineventing but unfortunately they concern themselves with Punk for a reason.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

when Punk retires, i hope this nonsense goes away.


----------



## hazuki

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

CM Punk wow.


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> when Punk retires, i hope this nonsense goes away.


When Punk retires, the haters will find someone to hate.


----------



## Lebyonics

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

That gain and its not even the main storyline unk


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



DualShock said:


> That's another example of how delusional Punk marks are. Like CM Punk set the bar high or some shit like that so it's so hard for Daniel Bryan to surpass CM Punk:ti
> CM Punk hasn't even reached the starpower of Diesel in 1995
> 
> 
> Wonderful explanation. Repped:clap
> But that common sense is ignored by Punk marks.
> inb4 Punk marks replying "why do you care if the guy surrounded by hot women is a ladies man? Are you the shareholder of their pussies":lmao
> 
> 
> and everytime someone says Bryan can draw I ask him to post an evidence
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *You can put the WWE belt on CM Punk, Daniel Bryan, Zack Ryder or Yoshi Tatsu and WrestleMania would still have record buys if the Rock is in main event.*
> That's the problem when a show has so many guys on the card, there is always someone who gives a failure credit for the success


You're delusion if that's right Survivor Series will have done big but it didn't. RR have done big not just because of Rock, Punk and his reign helped and you cant deny that, the most important thing is the quality of the feud because none of the guys you mentioned will produce the same quality, and :lol Rock cant bring 570k in RR with those guys, dont be stupid. 

Stop acting like Punk cant draw high ratings because he does bring high gains and quarters. Putting the name Nash with drawing seems difficult. The fact is Punk is a top merchandide seller with Cena and his popularity is huge and he can bring PPV buys with the right guy hell he even did it with Ryback with no Cena there. If Punk was booked right he will become a big draw.



Billion Dollar Man said:


>


Yeah just ignore the facts son. Why dont you concern yourself with Orton drawing power :lmao oh wait.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Sonnen Says said:


> You're delusion if that's right Survivor Series will have done big but it didn't. RR have done big not just because of Rock, Punk and his reign helped and you cant deny that, the most important thing is the quality of the feud because none of the guys you mentioned will produce the same quality, and :lol Rock cant bring 570k in RR with those guys, dont be stupid.
> 
> Stop acting like Punk cant draw high ratings because he does bring high gains and quarters. Putting the name Nash with drawing seems difficult. The fact is Punk is a top merchandide seller with Cena and his popularity is huge *and he can bring PPV buys with the right guy* hell he even did it with Ryback with no Cena there. If Punk was booked right he will become a big draw.


Just like anybody else who is pushed into the main event. 

Besides, he only drew with Rock. He did shit business with both Cena and Lesnar.

Rock can bring buys with anyFUCKINGbody. PERIOD


----------



## DualShock

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Barry Dylan said:


> When Punk retires, the haters will find someone to hate.


Even if, it would be babyfaces like John Cena or Sheamus who are not ashamed of being cheesy because they represent the PG era unlike Punk who tries to be something that he isn't (Attitude Era star trapped in the PG roster LOL) what makes it even more awkward and Punk even more pathetic


----------



## Choke2Death

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

lol @ Punk getting credit for WM28 buyrates and getting full credit for the Royal Rumble this year. :lmao :ti

This thread never fails to deliver with the comedy.


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



DualShock said:


> Even if, it would be babyfaces like John Cena or Sheamus who are not ashamed of being cheesy because they represent the PG era unlike Punk who tries to be something that he isn't (Attitude Era star trapped in the PG roster LOL) what makes it even more awkward and Punk even more pathetic












Please continue with your fiction. Entertain me.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Choke2Death said:


> lol @ Punk getting credit for WM28 buyrates and getting full credit for the Royal Rumble this year. :lmao :ti
> 
> This thread never fails to deliver with the comedy.


Exactly. Pure unadulterated Delusion.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Where is anyone crediting Punk fully with the Rumble buyrates? That's idiotic. Sure he helped a bit, since we know if it was Rock vs Tyson Kidd or something it wouldn't have done as well, but the majority belongs to Dwayne.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Choke2Death said:


> lol @ Punk getting credit for WM28 buyrates and getting full credit for the Royal Rumble this year. :lmao :ti
> 
> This thread never fails to deliver with the comedy.


I guess you like to read from your ass.



Billion Dollar Man said:


> Just like anybody else who is pushed into the main event.
> 
> Besides, he only drew with Rock. He did shit business with both *Cena* and Lesnar.
> 
> Rock can bring buys with anyFUCKINGbody. PERIOD


MITB 11 and NOC 12 says otherwise. He didnt mainevent with Brock. Not everyone can bring 570k with the Rock stop acting like Punk didnt draw well without Cena because he did well with Ryback and almost every time he mainevents.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



KO Bossy said:


> Where is anyone crediting Punk fully with the Rumble buyrates? That's idiotic. Sure he helped a bit, since we know if it was Rock vs Tyson Kidd or something it wouldn't have done as well, but the majority belongs to Dwayne.


Yeah, this. It would be idiotic to say Punk deserves the credit for the RR buys. Just like it would be idiotic to say it was all Rock, even though a large majority obviously goes to Rock.

And not sure why people say Punk's done poor PPV business. He performed well with Miz and Del Rio of all people, out-performing a Ziggler/Cena main event on the same show a year later, and also did a very good number with Ryback for HIAC.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Choke2Death said:


> lol @ Punk getting credit for WM28 buyrates and getting full credit for the Royal Rumble this year. :lmao :ti


Anyone claiming this has to be trolling, nothing more.


----------



## DualShock

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Barry Dylan said:


> Please continue with your fiction. Entertain me.


Punk was the one who said that he was born 15 years later in the wrong era, that was shortly after reading a Bleacher Report article on Raw when he was still on his high horse thinking he was the new Stone Cold so I suggest CM Punk can continue to entertain you from now on


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Yeah, this. It would be idiotic to say Punk deserves the credit for the RR buys. Just like it would be idiotic to say it was all Rock, even though a large majority obviously goes to Rock.
> 
> And not sure why people say Punk's done poor PPV business. He performed well with Miz and Del Rio of all people, out-performing a Ziggler/Cena main event on the same show a year later, and also did a very good number with Ryback for HIAC.


Miz has always done well as far as business goes. Triple H and Nash in a ladder match was also on that card. Buyrates were also down from the previous year at TLC 2010 when Miz was champion against Orton and Cena faced Barrett.

I guess you can give him credit for Hell in a Cell, although I bought Hell In A Cell to see WWE make a new star in Ryback. But Punk played his part well as the chicken shit heel who couldn't possibly walk away from the PPV as champion against the monster Ryback in Hell In A Cell. That's one PPV where you give 50/50 credit to both participants. 

And Ryback>>>>Ziggler, so of course you can get a better Buyrate.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



DualShock said:


> Punk was the one who said that he was born 15 years later in the wrong era, that was shortly after reading a Bleacher Report article on Raw when he was still on his high horse thinking he was the new Stone Cold so I suggest CM Punk can continue to entertain you from now on


Maybe the guy has something else to offer and the PG era doesn't help. Obviously he just wants to test himself with those guys because I think he did a fantastic job with Raven in the indies.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Sonnen Says said:


> Maybe the guy has something else to offer and the PG era doesn't help. Obviously he just wants to test himself with those guys because I think he did a fantastic job with Raven in the indies.


Raven was in the hardcore division in the AE. Punk might have got there, depending on if he kept his mouth shut and didn't think he was something that he isn't. He tried any of that fake tough guy/rebel shit in the AE, not only would he have gotten his ass beat backstage multiple times; but he would've found himself out of a job.


----------



## Stad

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Billion Dollar Man said:


> Miz has always done well as far as business goes. Triple H and Nash in a ladder match was also on that card. Buyrates were also down from the previous year at TLC 2010 when Miz was champion against Orton and Cena faced Barrett.
> 
> I guess you can give him credit for Hell in a Cell, although I bought Hell In A Cell to see WWE make a new star in Ryback. But Punk played his part well as the chicken shit heel who couldn't possibly walk away from the PPV as champion against the monster Ryback in Hell In A Cell. That's one PPV where you give 50/50 credit to both participants.
> 
> *And Ryback>>>>Ziggler, so of course you can get a better Buyrate.*


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



DualShock said:


> Punk was the one who said that he was born 15 years later in the wrong era, that was shortly after reading a Bleacher Report article on Raw when he was still on his high horse thinking he was the new Stone Cold so I suggest *CM Punk can continue to entertain you from now on*












Best in the World. Entertained I will be!! :clap:clap:clap:clap:clap


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Stad said:


>


:lmao:lmao:lmao

Dat Gif. 


But Ryback is far greater than Ziggler. He's better in every conceivable way. Only argument is ring work.


----------



## DualShock

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Barry Dylan said:


> Best in the World. Entertained I will be!! :clap:clap:clap:clap:clap


Of course you will be entertained by Punk. You and the other fans responsible for the 2.2 ratings :ti


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

The haters still talk about the one 2.2 rating that they got on _Christmas Eve_? The one where the main angle was Del Rio running over Santa Clause? :lol Any excuse will work for them Punk haterz I suppose. 

Edit: And the highest rated segment of that show was a Punk/Ryback segment. :lol Over the Cena/Del Rio main event as well.



> I guess you can give him credit for Hell in a Cell, although I bought Hell In A Cell to see WWE make a new star in Ryback. But Punk played his part well as the chicken shit heel who couldn't possibly walk away from the PPV as champion against the monster Ryback in Hell In A Cell. That's one PPV where you give 50/50 credit to both participants.
> 
> And Ryback>>>>Ziggler, so of course you can get a better Buyrate.


You do have a point, I give Punk a big part of the credit because it was a program that he had to carry, where he was the star. And the show doing very well is a testament to his ability. But, they also built up Ryback perfectly at that point. Even the people on here weren't able to predict who would win between the two, because of Ryback's win streak.


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



DualShock said:


> Of course you will be entertained by Punk. You and the other fans responsible for the 2.2 ratings :ti


Yup...cuz ratings don't mean shit to me. How was that even supposed to be an insult?

:dance:dance:dance:dance


----------



## DualShock

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Wrestlinfan35 said:


> The haters still talk about the one 2.2 rating that they got on _Christmas Eve_? The one where the main angle was Del Rio running over Santa Clause? :lol Any excuse will work for them Punk haterz I suppose.


Mocks Punk haterz because of excuses
Uses Christmas Eve and the main angle as excuse unk2

Your post makes no sense (but what to expect when it comes to defending CM Punk)
First you post that it was on Christmas Eve (indicating that the show couldn't achieve a higher rating because of the holidays no matter what happened) and then you mock the main angle like it was the reason why the show had such a low rating, because of such an embarrassing segment that made the people turn off.

A Punk mark in a nutshell:
Low rating with someone else in a segment: because of a stupid angle like running over Santa
Low rating because of Punk: but, but it was Christmas Eve :ti



Barry Dylan said:


> Yup...cuz ratings don't mean shit to me. How was that even supposed to be an insult?
> 
> :dance:dance:dance:dance


Not an insult, just a reminder that he is obviously not the best in the world and not so entertaining if just a small group who made this pathetic rating.

Insult? That's the best example of a delusional Punk mark. You praise CM Punk on forums as one of the best if not the best, entertaining, try to squeeze him into discussions about wrestlers who made actually an impact and when someone proves you wrong, posts stats, facts as a reality check you think this is some kind of insult.
Why insulting him and his marks when the biggest insult was his legendary title reign


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



DualShock said:


> Mocks Punk haterz because of excuses
> Uses Christmas Eve and the main angle as excuse unk2
> 
> Your post makes no sense (but what to expect when it comes to defending CM Punk)
> First you post that it was on Christmas Eve (indicating that the show couldn't achieve a higher rating because of the holidays no matter what happened) and then you mock the main angle like it was the reason why the show had such a low rating, because of such an embarrassing segment that made the people turn off.
> 
> A Punk mark in a nutshell:
> Low rating with someone else in a segment: because of a stupid angle like running over Santa
> Low rating because of Punk: but, but it was Christmas Eve :ti
> 
> 
> 
> Not an insult, just a reminder that he is obviously not the best in the world and not so entertaining if just a small group who made this pathetic rating.
> 
> Insult? That's the best example of a delusional Punk mark. You praise CM Punk on forums as one of the best if not the best, entertaining, try to squeeze him into discussions about wrestlers who made actually an impact and when someone proves you wrong, posts stats, facts as a reality check you think this is some kind of insult.
> Why insulting him and his marks when the biggest insult was his legendary title reign


Best is subjective, not a fact. You get pissed because someone is entertained by someone you don't like? Grow up, seriously.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

So you blame Punk for that show's rating, despite it being on Christmas Eve, despite him not being the main focus of the show, and despite him having the highest rated segment?

Makes perfect sense. :lmao Why bother at this point with some of you.


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Sigh...this fucking thread.

I can't deal with some of you. Both sides are just flat out making shit up at this point, and way over exaggerating as a way of slinging mud. Aren't you people adults? Perhaps try acting like it, you'll come off so much more credible.


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



KO Bossy said:


> You know what? *Fuck this thread.* Enjoy your dick waving competition, guys. What a waste of time. Roadkill's clear failure to assess talent is bad enough, but now petty bickering between people over rep...pathetic.


Welcome back.


----------



## DualShock

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Barry Dylan said:


> Best is subjective, not a fact. You get pissed because someone is entertained by someone you don't like? Grow up, seriously.


Of course you can like who you want and of course there is not one single statistic in the world that can't allow you to like and cheer for who you want but there are lots of stats that prove that your taste and opinion simply sucks


Wrestlinfan35 said:


> So you blame Punk for that show's rating, despite it being on Christmas Eve, despite him not being the main focus of the show, and despite him having the highest rated segment?
> 
> Makes perfect sense. :lmao Why bother at this point with some of you.


Wait, what?
The CM Punk fans who are known for "why do you care about ratings? Do you own WWE? Are you working there? Are you a shareholder? Go jerk on the rating points!" are now using the ratings as argument:lmao
I posted it here months ago, if CM Punk was actually a draw the CM Punk fans would be worse than any AE mark when it comes to ratings.
Their replies when it comes to ratings just screams bitterness and they try to dismiss any valid point like numbers and stats because they know they have no arguments. But when a CM Punk segment gains 0.000005 rating points they are the first ones who will post about the ratings to praise their master.
But what about the miserable ratings for the rest of the year because except of his feuds with John Cena and The Rock he was as WWE Champion the whole year not the main focus of the show :ti


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



DualShock said:


> Of course you can like who you want and of course there is not one single statistic in the world that can't allow you to like and cheer for who you want *but there are lots of stats that prove that your taste and opinion simply sucks*


----------



## KO Bossy

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Barry Dylan said:


> Welcome back.


Apparently, I'm a glutton for punishment...


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Wow people actually using the 2.2 rating as the proof of Punks drawing power fpalm. First of all the show was disgraceful and Punk was injured at that time and wasnt really feuding with anyone it was all on Cena, if Punk is really the problem they will let him heal his injuries instead of bringing him in every week to cut a promo.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Don't even bother, it's just Punk haters' shitty ammo because they don't have much. The arguments against him for that were already defeated in December last year.

They have to go trace back to a year because you won't see them using DAT 1.03mil GAIN against him.

unk


----------



## #Mark

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

They got a 2.3 on October 1st during the Ryback/Punk feud. Seriously, Punk has only had one really successful PPV buyrate and that was at HIAC against Ryback. I guess you can consider 2012 a success but that was only up 20,000 buys from the embarrassing buyrate he and Hunter did in 2011.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



#Mark said:


> They got a 2.3 on October 1st during the Ryback/Punk feud. Seriously, Punk has only had one really successful PPV buyrate and that was at HIAC against Ryback. I guess you can consider 2012 a success but that was only up 20,000 buys from the embarrassing buyrate he and Hunter did in 2011.


unfortunately for you they didn't get 2.3 in October.


----------



## #Mark

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Sonnen Says said:


> unfortunately for you they didn't get 2.3 in October.


My bad, a 2.5.. Still the lowest in 15 years. Ironically enough, Cena wasn't on that show. Imagine if Cena was gone for more than a week during Punk's reign :lmao

http://www.enfinity1productions.com/wrestling/wwe-raw-ratings-lowest-in-15-years/
http://www.wrestlezone.com/news/261947-101-wwe-raw-draws-lowest-rating-of-2012-without-john-cena


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



#Mark said:


> My bad, a 2.5.. Still the lowest in 15 years. Ironically enough, Cena wasn't on that show. Imagine if Cena was gone for more than a week during Punk's reign :lmao
> 
> http://www.enfinity1productions.com/wrestling/wwe-raw-ratings-lowest-in-15-years/
> http://www.wrestlezone.com/news/261947-101-wwe-raw-draws-lowest-rating-of-2012-without-john-cena


So what! The show early on this year did a 2.65 rating without Punk. Imagining Cena gone! why would I do that when I know the guy is meant to be a big draw after all these accomplishments. I will just be glad to see more guys reach that level but that cannot happen in WWE anyway, they wouldn't allow anyone tbh. They're just exaggerating in 2007 and 2004 they got a 2.5 rating one in December and the other one in September.

http://www.gerweck.net/tv-ratings/2004-ratings/


----------



## Choke2Death

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

The only Raw in 2004 that got a 2 is the 20th December one (2.75) which was a "Best of" edition.

It just makes me think how far have ratings fallen. Back in 2004, Smackdown was getting 3s regularly, nowadays Raw struggles to stay in the 3-upper 2 area consistently.


----------



## LovelyElle890

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

So much salt. So much shade being thrown in this thread.


----------



## RKO 4life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



4everEyebrowRaisin said:


> Ah, time for the weekly argument about ratings while WWE still continue to push the same guys because they don't really give as big a fuck as the nerds on here think they do.


It's only a nerd fight because of the nerd fanbases of punk and bryan. When guess how 2 weeks ago got a 1,00000 gain in ratings fighting The Miz at a 9:40 time sloot. The Miz!!!!!, could you see the ratings if Rock came back to face Orton? We talkin 4.3 bow.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



#Mark said:


> My bad, a 2.5.. Still the lowest in 15 years. Ironically enough, Cena wasn't on that show. Imagine if Cena was gone for more than a week during Punk's reign :lmao
> 
> http://www.enfinity1productions.com/wrestling/wwe-raw-ratings-lowest-in-15-years/
> http://www.wrestlezone.com/news/261947-101-wwe-raw-draws-lowest-rating-of-2012-without-john-cena


More evidence that they need Cena. Honestly when it comes to Punk and Bryan, they could both walk through airports and not be noticed unless they have a gimmick shirt on and the belt and the ratings prove it.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

huh? Everyone knows who Bryan is now. He is featured on all the news outlets now. and Total Divas. he's becoming a star, that's the goal. Even my dad who doesn't like wrestling asked me about him the other day.


----------



## Ace

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



markedfordeath said:


> huh? Everyone knows who Bryan is now. He is featured on all the news outlets now. and Total Divas. he's becoming a star, that's the goal. Even my dad who doesn't like wrestling asked me about him the other day.


 What news outlets? And Total Divas, really? :lol

The only guy who has mainstream attention currently is Cena the rest are nobodies.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

I said he's getting there, its a slow goal...just like Punk is featured at baseball games and UFC fights. Cena is the only one recognizable but that's nobody's fault but the company's because they never built anyone up more than Cena this whole time.


----------



## SinJackal

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Good god, Punk marks are giving Punk the entirety of the credit for that segment's gain now? :lmao :lmao He was barely even in it.

I just watched the segment again before making this reply to be sure I was right in my recall of the segment, and Punk was barely on screen for like 1/4th of that total segment. Literally 2/3rds of his on screen time was him laying on the ground outside the ring looking like an ass clown for "hurting his knee" jumping over the barricade.

If you break it down further, Punk's attacks on Heyman and Ryback only lasted 17 seconds (about 5 of which were him attacking Axel) followed by 50 seconds of tooling around with Axel in the ring. Then the segment was over after a replay.

So literally there was a nearly 10 minute segment between Ryback and Heyman, then Punk "hurts his knee" and lays around for almost two full minutes, then barely a minute of Punk actually doing something. . .then end of segment.

Heyman "proposing to Ryback" was advertised, Punk was not. Heyman/Ryback alone was the first 3/4ths of the segment. That is what drew. There's no way in hell people didn't give a shit about that then started calling their friends to tune in to that barely one minute window Punk was even doing anything.

Punkmarks straw grasping harder than usual now. And as usual, giving zero credit to anyone else even when the other guys did most of the segment alone.

You're literally claiming that this drew:

Punk laying on the ground appearing hurt for 2 minutes, looking like a fool.

17 second attack on Heyman/Ryback

50 second attack on Curtis Axel


. . .and not Heyman's near 10 minute proposal segment with Ryback prior to that blip of a Punk appearance which consisted mostly of looking like he hurt his knee accidently and tooling around with Axel.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> More evidence that they need Cena. Honestly when it comes to Punk and Bryan, they could both walk through airports and not be noticed unless they have a gimmick shirt on and the belt and the ratings prove it.


They'd be noticed in a "Mommy, look at the funny dirty little people" way.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

don't bother, they think Bryan will be in the mid card by next year...you know, the same guy who pinned Cena clean without interference....*shakes head*


----------



## #Mark

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



RKO 4life said:


> It's only a nerd fight because of the nerd fanbases of punk and bryan. When guess how 2 weeks ago got a 1,00000 gain in ratings fighting The Miz at a 9:40 time sloot. The Miz!!!!!, could you see the ratings if Rock came back to face Orton? We talkin 4.3 bow.





> Randy Orton vs. Rob Van Dam lost 98,000 viewers.





> Christian vs. Randy Orton match lost 140,000 viewers





> The Randy Orton vs. CM Punk main event gained 48,000 viewers, which is terrible for an overrun segment


.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Has an ADR match/segment EVER gained numbers?


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

nope, neither has an RVD match recently and Orton can only gain numbers in stipulation matches.


----------



## AJ_Styles_P1

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

This has nothing to do with Punk as a talent.

Its just the product sucks as a whole right now, and they haven't built up anyone other than Cena.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

I'm curious as to why :russo marks all seem to hate Punk so much, since Vinny Ru was all about BREAKIN DA FAWTH WALL and CHARACTUHS

They really screwed up by having Bryan win the belt back at NOC, it just diluted the moment when he finally wins it for real AND it made Randy look like a bit of a bitch since he lost clean in the very first match of the goddamn feud. Now it seems like they have no idea where to go with this storyline besides trying to throw in the entire babyface roster and seeing what sticks.


----------



## RKO 4life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> I'm curious as to why :russo marks all seem to hate Punk so much, since Vinny Ru was all about BREAKIN DA FAWTH WALL and CHARACTUHS
> 
> They really screwed up by having Bryan win the belt back at NOC, it just diluted the moment when he finally wins it for real AND it made Randy look like a bit of a bitch since he lost clean in the very first match of the goddamn feud. Now it seems like they have no idea where to go with this storyline besides trying to throw in the entire babyface roster and seeing what sticks.


huh gezz maybe the reason why people hate Punk is because he sucks and puts people to sleep..No I'm not talking about the GTS.


----------



## RKO 4life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



#Mark said:


> .


Orton draws ratings. HELLO!Not worried about 3 numbers RVD?PUNK? they can't draw blame them for a bad number bud.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



RKO 4life said:


> huh gezz maybe the reason why people hate Punk is because he sucks and puts people to sleep..No I'm not talking about the GTS.


You make a compelling argument, but I wanna hear from the :russo marks themselves.


----------



## Catsaregreat

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Rytingsback


----------



## RKO 4life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> You make a compelling argument, but I wanna hear from the :russo marks themselves.


YOU HAVE DONE HEARD FROM THEM ALL IN THIS THREAD! TAKE IT FROM SOMEONE WHO KNOWS WHAT THE HELL HES TALKING ABOUT!


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



RKO 4life said:


> YOU HAVE DONE HEARD FROM THEM ALL IN THIS THREAD! TAKE IT FROM SOMEONE WHO KNOWS WHAT THE HELL HES TALKING ABOUT!


Don't take that tone with me, bud.


----------



## #Mark

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



RKO 4life said:


> Orton draws ratings. HELLO!Not worried about 3 numbers RVD?PUNK? they can't draw blame them for a bad number bud.


:lmao Orton marks


----------



## RKO 4life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



#Mark said:


> :lmao Orton marks


HAHA RG3 marks. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Can I be a nerd to?


----------



## Lockard The GOAT

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



SinJackal said:


> Good god, Punk marks are giving Punk the entirety of the credit for that segment's gain now? :lmao :lmao He was barely even in it.
> 
> I just watched the segment again before making this reply to be sure I was right in my recall of the segment, and Punk was barely on screen for like 1/4th of that total segment. Literally 2/3rds of his on screen time was him laying on the ground outside the ring looking like an ass clown for "hurting his knee" jumping over the barricade.
> 
> If you break it down further, Punk's attacks on Heyman and Ryback only lasted 17 seconds (about 5 of which were him attacking Axel) followed by 50 seconds of tooling around with Axel in the ring. Then the segment was over after a replay.
> 
> So literally there was a nearly 10 minute segment between Ryback and Heyman, then Punk "hurts his knee" and lays around for almost two full minutes, then barely a minute of Punk actually doing something. . .then end of segment.
> 
> Heyman "proposing to Ryback" was advertised, Punk was not. Heyman/Ryback alone was the first 3/4ths of the segment. That is what drew. There's no way in hell people didn't give a shit about that then started calling their friends to tune in to that barely one minute window Punk was even doing anything.
> 
> Punkmarks straw grasping harder than usual now. And as usual, giving zero credit to anyone else even when the other guys did most of the segment alone.
> 
> You're literally claiming that this drew:
> 
> Punk laying on the ground appearing hurt for 2 minutes, looking like a fool.
> 
> 17 second attack on Heyman/Ryback
> 
> 50 second attack on Curtis Axel
> 
> 
> . . .and not Heyman's near 10 minute proposal segment with Ryback prior to that blip of a Punk appearance which consisted mostly of looking like he hurt his knee accidently and tooling around with Axel.


So? Paul Heyman and Ryback are in a feud with who? CM PUNK. So when Heyman and Ryback are on-screen, then it's natural for people to think that Punk will show up on screen at any moment. So yes, Punk can be considered largely responsible for that huge gain. Especially when Punk already made it known he was gonna outsmart Heyman and had done so once already earlier in the night when his theme suddenly being played caused Curtis Axel become distracted and lose his match.


----------



## RKO 4life

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Kevin Lockard said:


> So? Paul Heyman and Ryback are in a feud with who? CM PUNK. So when Heyman and Ryback are on-screen, then it's natural for people to think that Punk will show up on screen at any moment. So yes, Punk can be considered largely responsible for that huge gain. Especially when Punk already made it known he was gonna outsmart Heyman and had done so once already earlier in the night when his theme suddenly being played caused Curtis Axel become distracted and lose his match.


:lmao Punk marks


----------



## #Mark

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



RKO 4life said:


> HAHA RG3 marks. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
> 
> Can I be a nerd to?


Don't be so down on yourself bud, if it helps you feel any better Orton isn't the biggest anti-draw on the roster. That title is reserved for Punk. Seriously though, whose bright idea was it to put Punk and Orton on during the overrun :lol


----------



## Lockard The GOAT

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



RKO 4life said:


> :lmao Punk marks


You post a smilie, yet you don't dispute/refute my post. Should tell ya something. :flip


----------



## Lebyonics

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Where are this week's breakdown ????


----------



## SinJackal

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Kevin Lockard said:


> So? Paul Heyman and Ryback are in a feud with who? CM PUNK. So when Heyman and Ryback are on-screen, then it's natural for people to think that Punk will show up on screen at any moment. So yes, Punk can be considered largely responsible for that huge gain. Especially when Punk already made it known he was gonna outsmart Heyman and had done so once already earlier in the night when his theme suddenly being played caused Curtis Axel become distracted and lose his match.


That logic doesn't work because we're talking about a single, specific segment in which CM Punk was not advertised for and was barely spoken about within it. What was advertised, was the Paul Heyman was going to "propose to Ryback". A shocking, strange, and interesting notion which people tuned in to see unfold.

I shouldn't even dignify your absurd "Punk could show up at any moment so he drew ratings for that segment!" comment with an reply since it's so bad and obviously wrong that it refutes itself. I'm going to anyway though because you truly seem to believe that. Tbh, if you were a regular poster I would be positive you were just trolling. Anywhere, here's your explanation:


The amount of times CM Punk has drawn anywhere near those kinds of viewers to ANY of his segments in the past few years (when not opposite The Rock or Brock Lesnar, megastars who inarguably do most the drawing in their segments), rests comfortably between "not very often" and "almost never". There were weekly arguments in these ratings threads about Punk's drawing power, or lackthereof.

*This means we have an established track record of knowing CM Punk is not a huge draw *no matter what he's doing unless he's going against an established much larger draw than himself (such as The Rock or Brock Lesnar, as exampled earlier). *Note: I'm not saying CM Punk isn't a draw period, I'm saying he isn't a huge draw.* Never was. He typically drew around 300k viewers even when he was WWE champion and had the main storyline every week. I looked at this thread and argued in it all the damn time last year. I remember how little he drew and how the show's ratings continued to fall the longer he held the WWE title. Almost every time he retained at a PPV, the ratings fell and didn't climb back up.

To claim the mere "threat of Punk appearing" somehow drew a million viewers is a complete joke when we already know Punk doesn't draw anywhere near those kinds of numbers even when people _know he's going to be there_ and is in a major storyline that includes the WWE title!

It's extremely obvious that Punk did not draw anywhere near even half of those viewers, much less most of them (or all, as I've yet to see credit being given to Ryback and Heyman outside of my own posts). It was Paul Heyman's proposal to Ryback that drew. Straw grasping, credit-stealing shit like this is why Punk marks have such a terrible reputation everywhere on the internet.

Point stands. Ryback and Heyman's proposal interaction is what drew. Punk at best was 20% of the pull for that segment, and I'm being extremely generous to Punk by giving him 20% of the credit.



Kevin Lockard said:


> You post a smilie, yet you don't dispute/refute my post. Should tell ya something. :flip


He didn't need to do anything but laugh because not only was your point not good, but he has no particular obligation to debate you since your post was a reply to me.

So his post doesn't "tell ya" anything.


----------



## TheWFEffect

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Punk is the face and heyman and Ryback are heels logically people will tune in too see punk but in the case of Monday I think people wanted too see what the proposal was.


----------



## Lebyonics

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



SinJackal said:


> That logic doesn't work because we're talking about a single, specific segment in which CM Punk was not advertised for and was barely spoken about within it. What was advertised, was the Paul Heyman was going to "propose to Ryback". A shocking, strange, and interesting notion which people tuned in to see unfold.
> 
> I shouldn't even dignify your absurd "Punk could show up at any moment so he drew ratings for that segment!" comment with an reply since it's so bad and obviously wrong that it refutes itself. I'm going to anyway though because you truly seem to believe that. Tbh, if you were a regular poster I would be positive you were just trolling. Anywhere, here's your explanation:
> 
> 
> The amount of times CM Punk has drawn anywhere near those kinds of viewers to ANY of his segments in the past few years (when not opposite The Rock or Brock Lesnar, megastars who inarguably do most the drawing in their segments), rests comfortably between "not very often" and "almost never". There were weekly arguments in these ratings threads about Punk's drawing power, or lackthereof.
> 
> *This means we have an established track record of knowing CM Punk is not a huge draw *no matter what he's doing unless he's going against an established much larger draw than himself (such as The Rock or Brock Lesnar, as exampled earlier). *Note: I'm not saying CM Punk isn't a draw period, I'm saying he isn't a huge draw.* Never was. He typically drew around 300k viewers even when he was WWE champion and had the main storyline every week. I looked at this thread and argued in it all the damn time last year. I remember how little he drew and how the show's ratings continued to fall the longer he held the WWE title. Almost every time he retained at a PPV, the ratings fell and didn't climb back up.
> 
> To claim the mere "threat of Punk appearing" somehow drew a million viewers is a complete joke when we already know Punk doesn't draw anywhere near those kinds of numbers even when people _know he's going to be there_ and is in a major storyline that includes the WWE title!
> 
> It's extremely obvious that Punk did not draw anywhere near even half of those viewers, much less most of them (or all, as I've yet to see credit being given to Ryback and Heyman outside of my own posts). It was Paul Heyman's proposal to Ryback that drew. Straw grasping, credit-stealing shit like this is why Punk marks have such a terrible reputation everywhere on the internet.
> 
> Point stands. Ryback and Heyman's proposal interaction is what drew. Punk at best was 20% of the pull for that segment, and I'm being extremely generous to Punk by giving him 20% of the credit.
> 
> 
> 
> He didn't need to do anything but laugh because not only was your point not good, but he has no particular obligation to debate you since your post was a reply to me.
> 
> So his post doesn't "tell ya" anything.


The million gain was for last week in Chicago where Punk was the entire focus of the segment unk2


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

damn, if Brie wins that title. wonder which direction shit gone go.


----------



## SinJackal

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Lebyonics said:


> The million gain was for last week in Chicago where Punk was the entire focus of the segment unk2


Do you seriously think a million wrestling fans tune in just to see wrestlers perform in the home towns? fpalm

The town Raw was in has nothing to do with the televised ratings, just the decibels of the pops he gets.

And no Punk wasn't anywhere remotely close to the "entire focus of the segment". The focus of the segment was Heyman making a proposal to Ryback. Punk became the focus of the segment for the 3 minutes he came out at the end of it.


----------



## Lebyonics

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



SinJackal said:


> Do you seriously think a million wrestling fans tune in just to see wrestlers perform in the home towns? fpalm
> 
> The town Raw was in has nothing to do with the televised ratings, just the decibels of the pops he gets.
> 
> And no Punk wasn't anywhere remotely close to the "entire focus of the segment". The focus of the segment was Heyman making a proposal to Ryback. Punk became the focus of the segment for the 3 minutes he came out at the end of it.


You are getting me wrong. The million gain was for the last week's segment, Heyman-Ryback's this week's breakdown is not out yet and Yes Punk was the focus of last week so he gets the entire credit for the million gain


----------



## SinJackal

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Lebyonics said:


> You are getting me wrong. The million gain was for the last week's segment, Heyman-Ryback's this week's breakdown is not out yet and Yes Punk was the focus of last week so he gets the entire credit for the million gain


Oh okay. And you mean Punk's loss to Paul Heyman the night before was the focus? Looks like the segment right before it lost nearly half a million viewers too.


----------



## D17

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

I'm genuinely amazed Punk and Bryan marks go at it. Rock and Punk, and Cena and Punk marks are understandable, but Punk/Bryan?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Wait, why are we talking about the Heyman/Ryback proposal? Is this week's breakdown out yet? Because the only one I've seen is the one from last week in Chicago, where they advertised Punk numerous times throughout the night, and where he was in the whole segment. That segment, Punk does deserve most of the credit, no question about it (of course, Heyman/Ryback deserve some as well).

This week though was the opposite of that. Whatever that segment ends up gaining/losing, it's mostly due to Heyman/Ryback, with a small portion of the credit/blame going to Punk. I think either you got confused reading the breakdown SinJackel, or I'm completely missing where the breakdown for this week is.

Edit: Nevermind, looks like that was already explained. Shows what happens when you don't go to the last page of the thread. <_<


----------



## funnyfaces1

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

:lmao at Dualshock getting crushed.


----------



## DualShock

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



funnyfaces1 said:


> :lmao at Dualshock getting crushed.


:lmao at funnyfaces1 getting crushed in another thread by me so he plays now a cheerleader for another users posting one liners



AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> I'm curious as to why :russo marks all seem to hate Punk so much, since Vinny Ru was all about BREAKIN DA FAWTH WALL and CHARACTUHS


That's the same like saying you're curious why the Rock marks hate John Cena because Cena has also his catchphrases or why many Exorcist fans hate Exorcist II


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

So many people are sour about that 1.03 MILLION GAIN~


----------



## FreakyZo

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Lol this thread is full of retards...


----------



## Londrick

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Weren't there several times where Punk got outdrawn by Divas segments last year?



RKO 4life said:


> Orton draws ratings. HELLO!Not worried about 3 numbers RVD?PUNK? they can't draw blame them for a bad number bud.


Then why did SD almost get cancelled when Orton was the central point of the show?


----------



## Rick Sanchez

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

So weird seeing the Punk haters wet their pants over a gain. It's just a number. Calm down, they're not gonna sell their stock to Punk and name the show after him. Jesus.


----------



## WWE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***

Just read back the last couple of pages.. 


Just wow
:ti


----------



## Arthurgos

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings Discussions Here***



Dunmer said:


> Weren't there several times where Punk got outdrawn by Divas segments last year?


That was this year.


----------



## Eddie Ray

sooo...punk haters are getting their panties in a twist because hes started drawing?

...this thread has officially gone crazy. his character is currently far more appealing to casuals than when he was making insider references etc. its no surprise that he is getting over more and gaining more fans.

what he was drawing is irrelevant because currently he's doing a great job.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Happy Punk was in a big segment last week. Would be nice if his marks credited Heyman as well. He wasnt window dressing in that segment.


----------



## Eddie Ray

Best4Bidness said:


> Happy Punk was in a big segment last week. Would be nice if his marks credited Heyman as well. He wasnt window dressing in that segment.


I don't think there are many Punk marks that wouldn't credit it partially to Heyman but both have amazing chemistry together.although I love Bryan and his storyline I'm finding Punks more entertaining currently.


----------



## Choke2Death

Just to be sure after skimming through the past few pages, which Punk segment in the 10PM slot gained a million? If it was the promo from Chicago then he fully deserves the credit but if it was the proposal segment, then LOL.


----------



## Londrick

If I can be serious for a minute, if Punk gets the blame for the terrible ratings during his reign why isn't Vacant getting the blame for these ratings? Just goes to show how terrible of an idea it was giving Vacant another world title reign. He's irrelevant in 2013.



Choke2Death said:


> Just to be sure after skimming through the past few pages, which Punk segment in the 10PM slot gained a million? If it was the promo from Chicago then he fully deserves the credit but if it was the proposal segment, then LOL.


It was the one from Chicago. Last RAW's breakdown hasn't been posted yet.


----------



## markedfordeath

man the WWE is fucked this Sunday...nobody is going to shell out $45-$55 to watch a title match that won't mean anything until the next pay per view or to watch him get stripped of it again and they don't want to watch Punk lose to Ryback which is what will happen because their feud just started. The writers should get fired.


----------



## MaybeLock

Someone has already said it but there is a bigger problem than a certain guy drawing or not drawing. At this point I think that it is pretty obvious that ratings remain low in a long term, and it doesn't matter who is around the main event. Obviously some happenings like Lesnar or Rock returning raise the ratings, but it´s only a short term thing and it goes back to shit. WWE has clearly lost the ability to keep people watching in the long term. Either that, or they simply don't give a fucking shit about the weekly ratings anymore and give more importance to tickets, merchandising and Road to Wrestlemania earnings.

Either way, it´s really lame to see these type of mark wars all the time, because either A) We have a bigger problem to worry about, and that is the creative department being filled with monkeys, or B) We are giving the weekly ratings a bigger importance than WWE itself does.

I mean, just take a look back at Summerslam: The Corporation angle looked like the biggest thing WWE had come up with since Summer of Punk, look at it now, it´s becoming stale fast, like it happened with Summer of Punk. And it´s not me saying it, you just have to take a look at the ratings to know that people are losing the interest on the storyline, and in the product in general.


----------



## markedfordeath

well now its just confusing.....so people are confused. that's why you need to pull out all the stops, get Vince involved and have him and HBK be on Bryan's side.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

Choke2Death said:


> Just to be sure after skimming through the past few pages, which Punk segment in the 10PM slot gained a million? If it was the promo from Chicago then he fully deserves the credit but if it was the proposal segment, then LOL.


The one in Chicago last week, gained 1.03 million. So yes, you're right, the GOAT does fully deserve the credit for that.


----------



## Alo0oy

I demand this thread be renamed "The Official Punk vs Bryan thread" :lmao


----------



## stonefort

Better enjoy Boring Daniel Bryan while you can. No doubt he'll be whisked away to Hollywood soon. Cause of all the natural charisma he has. Does anybody have more charisma than Boring Daniel Bryan?


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

stonefort said:


> Better enjoy Boring Daniel Bryan while you can. No doubt he'll be whisked away to Hollywood soon. Cause of all the natural charisma he has. Does anybody have more charisma than Boring Daniel Bryan?


Your posts are boring and inaccurate. Step your game up.


----------



## KO Bossy

markedfordeath said:


> well now its just confusing.....so people are confused. that's why you need to pull out all the stops, get Vince involved and have him and HBK be on Bryan's side.


I've said it 50 times now, Vince siding with Bryan would ruin this story. Everyone is complaining about things being booked and written badly, that'd be the icing on the shit cake.


----------



## Dash24

Eddie Ray said:


> sooo...punk haters are getting their panties in a twist because hes started drawing?
> 
> ...this thread has officially gone crazy. his character is currently far more appealing to casuals than when he was making insider references etc. its no surprise that he is getting over more and gaining more fans.
> 
> what he was drawing is irrelevant because currently he's doing a great job.


Agreed. Punk has _quietly_ been evolving substantially as a face and as a draw. 

The reason he drew so poorly last year may partially be due to WWE being WWE. The fans want to *desperately* cheer CM Punk? Lets turn him heel. Gimmick? Lets give him the generic chickenshit role, that _clearly_ draws right? While I can't personally speak for millions of people, CM Punk and The Shield are quite easily my favorites but even with those two in the same program I ended up barely tuning in for Raw (I'm pretty casual, if you want proof check my join date and total posts. Notice how the majority are since Bryan's push and Punk's return ). Punk's character was just so bad but he managed to make the best of it from the youtube clips I saw. 

Ratings from last year are irrelevant sort of like how an NBA player's three point shooting last season is irrelevant if he changes teams (or gimmicks) because there are different schemes, either little/moderate/great spacing in an offense, and teammates (I.E. Brock Lesnar). Now that he's got a great gimmick, he's running the fuck away with it and its generating more interest from casuals. This is honestly the best character I've ever seen Punk have.

Now backtracking to Lesnar, people are really looking at that Summerslam the wrong way. This board cares WAY too much for who gets the pin rather than context and judging by how Cole continuously said "Punk really won that match" and the high ratings for Punk following that match, its safe to say he got put over MASSIVELY. Imagine if John Cena was in Punk's role for that match. Would people be complaining that Cena got buried? Or would they be whining about Lesnar getting buried?

But yeah, back to my original point Punk has been tremendous of late. I really hope he can continue to be solid as a drawer as does Bryan (I wish I could give Bryan more props in this post. He deserves some with the ridiculous hate this board has given him lately) so we have two alternatives to Cena when he returns. Seriously people instead of bickering and complaining, how about relish the fact that we have two faces not named John Cena (or rather the same old crap you've been fed since 2006) drawing well during the NFL season? I mean 1,000,000 fans during a MNF game is phenomenal and no one can deny that.

Edit: wow this post was way longer than I intended.


----------



## Londrick

The quarter hours should be out by now. I'm excited to see which vanilla midget I can blame for the terrible rating.


----------



## markedfordeath

Bryan was on in the last ten minutes..so how can you blame him for a ten minute spot?


----------



## JY57

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_73700.shtml#.Uk35LBb3CL0



> Quarter-hour TV ratings for Monday's Raw capture a general lack of interest in the Daniel Bryan vs. Randy Orton feud heading into Battleground on Sunday.
> 
> The face-off between Bryan and Orton at the end of Monday's Raw scored the lowest over-run rating in the males 18-49 demographic of the past three months.
> 
> The segment scored a 2.05 m18-49 rating, compared to a 2.21 over-run last week, a 2.65 over-run the Monday after Night of Champions, and a 2.46 over-run rating leading into NOC.
> 
> - The highest-rated segment of Monday's Raw was a 2.29 rating for Paul Heyman's "proposal" to Ryback at the top of the third hour. This was down from a 2.47 rating for C.M. Punk's return segment at the top of the third hour last week.
> 
> The only other segment above a 2.0 on the night was a 2.05 rating for the Rhodes Family returning to hear a business proposal from Triple H & Stephanie McMahon at the top of the second hour.
> 
> Raw M18-49 Demo Break Down
> 
> - OVERALL SHOW: 1.87 rating / 1.178 million viewers
> 
> The entire first hour was below the show-average:
> 
> - Q1: Raw opened with a below-average 1.77 rating for C.M. Punk's show-opening promo exchange with Brad Maddox, plus one commercial. By comparison, the previous two weeks opened with 2.0+ ratings.
> 
> - Q2: Raw was about the same with a 1.75 rating for Punk vs. Big E. Langston, one commercial, and ring introductions for Fandango vs. Kofi Kingston.
> 
> - Q3: Raw inched up to a 1.79 rating for Kofi vs. Fandango, backstage segments and interviews, and two full commercial breaks.
> 
> - Q4: Raw increased to a first-hour-high 1.86 rating for Los Matadores's debut, plus one commercial.
> 
> The peak audience of the first hour was contained in Q4 - 1.467 million viewers at 8:53 p.m. for the end of Los Matadores's debut.
> 
> - Q5: Raw got its top-of-the-hour bump to a 2.05 rating for the Rhodes-McMahon Summit and one commercial.
> 
> Peak viewership was 1.610 million viewers at 9:06 p.m., which was one of the few times during the show that Raw touched 1.6 million.
> 
> - Q6: Raw fell 14 percent to a second-hour-low 1.76 rating for Curtis Axel vs. R-Truth, plus one commercial.
> 
> - Q7: Raw rebounded to a 1.92 rating for Brie Bella vs. Alicia Fox, one commercial, and Big Show flipping out backstage.
> 
> - Q8: Raw fell to a 1.80 rating for World champion Alberto Del Rio vs. Zack Ryder and two full commercial breaks.
> 
> - Q9: Raw jumped to a show-high 2.29 rating for Paul Heyman's "proposal" to Ryback and C.M. Punk's run-in. There was no commercial interruption, boosting the rating.
> 
> The segment included the show's peak audience of 1.663 million viewers twice at the end of the segment. Overall, the final five minutes of the segment averaged 1.6 million viewers.
> 
> - Q10: After the "proposal" segment, Raw fell 24 percent for the next segment, which featured two full commercial breaks and the first few minutes of The Shield vs. Dolph Ziggler & The Usos.
> 
> - Q11: Raw rebounded to a 1.87 rating for the end of Shield vs. Ziggler & Usos, Stephanie brow-beating Big Show backstage, and one commercial.
> 
> The peak audience was 1.380 million viewers for Stephanie-Show at 10:40 p.m.
> 
> - Q12: Raw fell to a show-low 1.69 rating for Santino vs. Antonio Cesaro and two full commercial breaks.
> 
> - Over-Run: Raw scored a 2.05 rating for the Bryan-Orton face-off to close Raw. The peak audience was 1.367 million viewers at 11:09 p.m. when Raw signed off.


highest segment was Ryback/Heyman/Punk and Orton/Bryan got lowest over-run in three months


----------



## markedfordeath

WWE gone and fucked up just like I said...they changed everything up and its not exciting for anyone anymore. Why do they have to mess everything up?


----------



## Biast

JY57 said:


> http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_73700.shtml#.Uk35LBb3CL0
> 
> 
> 
> highest segment was Ryback/Heyman/Punk and Orton/Bryan got lowest over-run in three months


The Corp stroyline going down... :no:


----------



## markedfordeath

yep, no one is interested anymore because instead they made it a personal relationship angle out of nowhere...so now its a love triangle instead of a regime against Bryan thing. They don't have enough time from between now and HIAC to change the feud, so what can they possibly do to get people interested again?


----------



## #Mark

Bryan's star has fell just has quick as it's risen.


----------



## markedfordeath

what? you're blaming Bryan for this shit now? really man? how is it his fault? its his fault Brie is involved and he got his ass beat?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

They took HHH out of the main angle, and look what happens. :HHH2

The Punk/Heyman/Ryback feud is still doing well at least. Opener for Punk wasn't very good, but it looks like the 10PM peaked around the time he came out, so it's all good (plus the 10PM all around did well, meaning the Heyman/Ryback "marriage" tease worked).


----------



## markedfordeath

punk was barely involved in that proposal, he should get no credit for that at all...


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

markedfordeath said:


> punk was barely involved in that proposal, he should get no credit for that at all...


Of course he should get a bit of credit, especially when it was around the end of it, when he was there, that the segment was averaging 1.6 million viewers. Obviously though Heyman/Ryback should get the vast majority of the credit, but Punk deserves his bit, which is the opposite of last week where he gets the vast majority of credit with Heyman/Ryback/the angle itself getting a fair bit.


----------



## markedfordeath

i'm pissed, can't believe WWE fucked up the main event angle so damn bad. Sabotaging the participant's success too. You get screwed over enough times people lose interest.


----------



## JY57

markedfordeath said:


> yep, no one is interested anymore because instead they made it a personal relationship angle out of nowhere...so now its a love triangle instead of a regime against Bryan thing. They don't have enough time from between now and HIAC to change the feud, so what can they possibly do to get people interested again?


umm end it at HIAC. its the only way to go ( & I am not even watching RAW or the PPVS [except SummerSlam] anyways). Involved with each other for Payback,They already had 3 matches in 1 week in June after Payback, they feuded during MITB, Orton was involved with Bryan in the SummerSlam feud with Cena, he had impromtu match with Bryan, another in NOC, another in Battleground, & another in BattleGround. People might be sick of them going at it all the time. 4 Straight PPVS ending with Orton/Bryan. And nobody got time for another match or even 5 on 5 crap at Survivor Series between the two. Enough is enough

at least it looks like its over after HIAC since Orton is supposedly to move on with another opponent for Survivor Series & TLC.


----------



## markedfordeath

good..it should end. Triple H and Bryan should feud now. That has to happen now because its fresh. Great! they'll probably not give him the championship now. what a waste of time, of course they'd find a way to fuck it up for him.


----------



## THANOS

> - Q9: Raw jumped to a show-high 2.29 rating for Paul Heyman's "proposal" to Ryback and C.M. Punk's run-in. There was no commercial interruption, boosting the rating.
> 
> *The segment included the show's peak audience of 1.663 million viewers twice at the end of the segment. Overall, the final five minutes of the segment averaged 1.6 million viewers.*


So once Punk came into the fold the segment was at it's peek. There's one to stop people from only crediting Heyman/Ryback.



> - Over-Run: Raw scored a 2.05 rating for the Bryan-Orton face-off to close Raw. The peak audience was 1.367 million viewers at 11:09 p.m. when Raw signed off.


It would be interesting to see how it was during the initial face-off before Orton took control of the contest? Either way the confusion in this storyline has deflated it completely it seems. Well done WWE Creative. :clap

Come out and take a bow.










And anyone saying it's Bryan are way off base. The guy was pulling highest rated segments out of Barrett on Smackdown and Cesaro on RAW.


----------



## markedfordeath

and apparently its all Bryan's fault...what a joke! can't wait to see what they do this Sunday now......probably screw him again, then Monday night forget he exists, then they'll realize later on it was Orton's fault for being too boring the whole time.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

THANOS said:


> So once Punk came into the fold the segment was at it's peek. *There's one to stop people from only crediting Heyman/Ryback.
> *
> 
> 
> It would be interesting to see how it was during the initial face-off before Orton took control of the contest? Either way the confusion in this storyline has deflated it completely it seems. Well done WWE Creative. :clap
> 
> Come out and take a bow.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And anyone saying it's Bryan are way off base. The guy was pulling highest rated segments out of Barrett on Smackdown and Cesaro on RAW.


Sounds like a Punk fan wrote it TBH.


----------



## superuser1

Fact of the matter is Bryan is turning into Cena 2.0 nobody wants to see that anymore


----------



## markedfordeath

*shoots head* I seriously cannot believe that Bryan is getting blamed...you haters are making your hate too obvious....just don't blame the writing, we'll blame Bryan....sounds logical, NOT!


----------



## THANOS

Billion Dollar Man said:


> Sounds like a Punk fan wrote it TBH.


Maybe so, but if those are the "actual numbers", then it's a fact that can't be denied.


----------



## markedfordeath

the fans are migrating away...I think the WWE shot themselves in the foot.


----------



## Mqwar

Other than the overrun bombing, its pretty much what I expected overall except for Punk promo opening low. Expected 2.0 rating for the opener since the ones with hunter opening did that. 10 PM continues to deliver big, well deserved tbh it was fun segment with some awesome selling from punk. 

There is no excuse for the low overrun, although the quarter before dragged them significantly down...



> - Q12: *Raw fell to a show-low 1.69 rating* for Santino vs. Antonio Cesaro and two full commercial breaks.
> 
> - Over-Run: Raw scored a 2.05 rating for the Bryan-Orton face-off to close Raw. The peak audience was 1.367 million viewers at 11:09 p.m. when Raw signed off.


Overrun did rebound but still bad. It definitely shows lack of interest considering Stephanie-Show backstage segment actually had a larger peak viewership.


----------



## markedfordeath

Vacant is such a draw.


----------



## Mqwar

They need something drastic at battleground PPV for the main event finish. Orton/Bryan is evidently losing interest. Maybe the inclusion of Bellas in this feud might spike interest? It has happened before.


----------



## krai999

soo people don't like seeing orton beat the shit out of bryan huh.


----------



## markedfordeath

this just means the feud has to end, they have to finally give Bryan the title and then things will change...Vacant isn't a draw.


----------



## Mqwar

But do you really want Bryan to win the title at a throwaway PPV like battleground though? Bad overrun one week isn't end of the world. If they panicked and put the title on Bryan now, the whole corp angle would end abruptly.


----------



## superuser1

This is back to back poor ratings for Daniel Bryan after having some strong consecutive weeks. He did poor in the babyfaces vs Shield main event last week and now this. Something is obviously wrong here.


----------



## markedfordeath

uhhh that was because he had jobbers in the match with him..that's obvious.....and if they don't give him the title soon, WWE is going to explode with no business....they need to have something big happen to make HIAC worth it.


----------



## THANOS

krai999 said:


> soo people don't like seeing orton beat the shit out of bryan huh.


We can't make that assertion just yet, although I considered it lol. We would need to see how the ratings were when Orton took control of the segment and it became clear that Bryan was getting beat down single handedly to end the show.


----------



## markedfordeath

i mean doesn't anyone question the WWE sometimes? like who in their right mind thought that last segment was a good idea? I mean seriously, is this Stephanie's fault?


----------



## THANOS

superuser1 said:


> This is back to back poor ratings for Daniel Bryan after having some strong consecutive weeks. He did poor in the babyfaces vs Shield main event last week and now this. Something is obviously wrong here.


I've said before and I'll say it again, it's not Bryan. When the guy does the highest rated segment on Smackdown, obliterating Triple H's segments earlier in the show, and working with a jobber like Barrett (no offense to Barrett) who barely ever appears on TV and when he does he loses, you pretty much have to admit that the guy draws when he's placed in a significant light. Barret had nothing to do with the corporation storyline yet Bryan drew well working with him, so it's clear that when Bryan is protected, and not likened to a pathetic "barnyard animal, troll" he does well.

There's plenty of evidence out there to prove these assertions, and I welcome any counters to it.


----------



## markedfordeath

yet they continue to beat him down...I wonder if their researchers are grad school children.


----------



## Mister Hands

superuser1 said:


> This is back to back poor ratings for Daniel Bryan after having some strong consecutive weeks. He did poor in the babyfaces vs Shield main event last week and now this. Something is obviously wrong here.


The writing's shit? This can't be new information to you


----------



## Mqwar

THANOS said:


> I've said before and I'll say it again, it's not Bryan. When the guy does the highest rated segment on Smackdown, obliterating Triple H's segments earlier in the show, and working with a jobber like Barrett (no offense to Barrett) who barely ever appears on TV and when he does he loses, you pretty much have to admit that the guy draws when he's placed in a significant light. Barret had nothing to do with the corporation storyline yet Bryan drew well working with him, so it's clear that when Bryan is protected, and not likened to a pathetic "barnyard animal, troll" he does well.
> 
> There's plenty of evidence out there to prove these assertions, and I welcome any counters to it.


Smackdown audience typically builds from opener through top of the hour to the main event. Its not the same as RAW viewership. Overall viewership of the show depends on how strong the top angle is. Once you get that viewers, you could have Orton wrestling Barrett instead of Bryan in the main event and gotten the same result, especially since the match was a random one.


----------



## krai999

You know what I find funny? People are bashing Bryan letting him take *ALL* of the blame for the segment's ratings. Yet I see no blame being placed on orton when he was the one who the wwe has been putting emphasis on about his new aggressive behavior these last few weeks. So because the rating's segment's didn't do well your gonna put all the blame on Bryan. What reason is there for orton to get a run with the wwe title for the few months what if he was the reason.


----------



## Mqwar

superuser1 said:


> This is back to back poor ratings for Daniel Bryan after having some strong consecutive weeks. He did poor in the babyfaces vs Shield main event last week and now this. Something is obviously wrong here.


Who said last week was poor? Overrun drew 2.21 rating in the adult demo, second biggest of the night. Far from poor.


----------



## markedfordeath

they actually said that this would push Vince to TV sooner than later....so they're not blaming anyone..they're just restructuring the story and moving shit up now. so now Vince will have his face turn earlier, probably this Monday.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The overrun was lower than last week, which isnt good. It did break 2.0 in the demo and increased significantly from the previous segment, so that part isnt bad. Punk's opening promo and match didnt do well and he and Big E were outdrawn by Fandango and Kofi and The Matadores. In fact, Punk's segments were below the show's average of 1.87 and weighed down the overall first hour rating. Now his appearance did help increase the Ryback/Heyman segment but w/o the minute to minute it is unclear just how much. If Punk never showed in the proposal segment it would still probably have been the highest segment. Punk should be grateful he got to glom onto the greatness of that segment because he failed to open the show well at 1.77 and actually dropped from 2.0+ the last 2 weeks.


----------



## markedfordeath

hey dude, you forgot to mention it's Bryan's fault just like everything else lol I love how the go home show to NOC was just Bryan kneeing Orton, but this go home show to Battleground included a DDT on the mat outside and an RKO onto the table....so they had to give the babyface an assaulting unmatched to the one the heel got last month...strange.


----------



## THANOS

Mqwar said:


> Smackdown audience typically builds from opener through top of the hour to the main event. Its not the same as RAW viewership. Overall viewership of the show depends on how strong the top angle is. Once you get that viewers, you could have Orton wrestling Barrett instead of Bryan in the main event and gotten the same result, especially since the match was a random one.


Maybe so but when Orton was on top on Smackdown ratings were at their lowest, so we can't be so sure of that point. Also, there's still the fact that Bryan has gained for many weeks now in non-overrun segments, like his promo last week before the main event, or in his gauntlet with Cesaro. The fact is he's done well enough since this push began back when he lost the tag titles, that it's fair to say with a strong protected push he'll draw.


----------



## markedfordeath

and they look at those, they look at the quarter numbers and see who did the best......those are the people they don't get mad at...the Divas, Sandow, RVD, ADR, those guys should be the ones punished, those segments are consistent piss breaks every week.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

To any chicken littles looking at Raw's rating and acting like the sky is falling, isnt the rating still higher than the corresponding one last year? The show is experiencing the same downward trend against football and the new fall season debuts as it did a year ago. Now, if the bottom were to fall out and Raw was significantly lower, then panic might be understandable.


----------



## superuser1

krai999 said:


> You know what I find funny? People are bashing Bryan letting him take *ALL* of the blame for the segment's ratings. Yet I see no blame being placed on orton when he was the one who the wwe has been putting emphasis on about his new aggressive behavior these last few weeks. So because the rating's segment's didn't do well your gonna put all the blame on Bryan. What reason is there for orton to get a run with the wwe title for the few months what if he was the reason.


Hmmm Bryan is the main guy right now with Cena out. I think that's crystal clear. Orton is just playing second fiddle to Bryan. Basically they needed a good heel for Bryan to go up against and that's Orton's job. Who's been main eventing Raw each night? Thats right Daniel Bryan. Im just saying not all the blame should be thrown onto Bryan but he definitely deserves some of it.


----------



## markedfordeath

yeah but with that ending to Raw, they really need Bryan to get over real soon...because its ridiculous how many obstacles they have....If he gets screwed again this Sunday, what do you do to the fanbase then?


----------



## markedfordeath

I think Bryan gets a pass for it being his first ever main event push on tv...so he's learning on the job.....I think he gets a pass...if its been 10-12 months and he's not bringing in ratings, then drop him.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

> The face-off between Bryan and Orton at the end of Monday's Raw scored the lowest over-run rating in the males 18-49 demographic of the past three months.
> 
> The segment scored a 2.05 m18-49 rating, compared to a 2.21 over-run last week, a 2.65 over-run the Monday after Night of Champions, and a 2.46 over-run rating leading into NOC.
> 
> - The highest-rated segment of Monday's Raw was a 2.29 rating for Paul Heyman's "proposal" to Ryback at the top of the third hour. This was down from a 2.47 rating for C.M. Punk's return segment at the top of the third hour last week.
> 
> The only other segment above a 2.0 on the night was a 2.05 rating for the Rhodes Family returning to hear a business proposal from Triple H & Stephanie McMahon at the top of the second hour.


:lmao

Another week, another RAW where CM GOAT outdraws the main event storyline. Orton and Bryan are just not interesting enough people/characters to keep viewers interested, which obviously shows. They're both to blame, easily. Not even the McMahon/Rhodes segment did well. So even with the McMahons on the show, looks like the only guys drawing in viewers consistently these days are Punk and Heyman. No surprise there.

unk


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

You must concede CM Goatcheese was outdrawn by Kofi, Fandango and a midget in a bull costume during his lackluster 1st quarter drawing debacle. Punk rides on Heyman's shoulders just like a new age Master Blaster.


----------



## krai999

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> :lmao
> 
> Another week, another RAW where CM GOAT outdraws the main event storyline. Orton and Bryan are just not interesting enough people/characters to keep viewers interested, which obviously shows. They're both to blame, easily. Not even the McMahon/Rhodes segment did well. So even with the McMahons on the show, looks like the only guys drawing in viewers consistently these days are Punk and Heyman. No surprise there.
> 
> unk


yeahh. Where was punk this time. I'm sorry but heyman bad that top hour


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

krai999 said:


> yeahh. Where was punk this time. I'm sorry but heyman bad that top hour


Shame that excuse won't work, seeing as how the five minutes Punk was involved in had the highest average viewership in that segment.



> Q9: Raw jumped to a show-high 2.29 rating for Paul Heyman's "proposal" to Ryback and C.M. Punk's run-in. There was no commercial interruption, boosting the rating.
> 
> *The segment included the show's peak audience of 1.663 million viewers twice at the end of the segment. Overall, the final five minutes of the segment averaged 1.6 million viewers.*


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Shame that excuse won't work, seeing as how the five minutes Punk was involved in had the highest average viewership in that segment.


Yeah, but if Punk only added a little to what was already a high segment, it is akin to sticking a rock on top of Mount Everest and taking credit for it being the tallest in the world.


----------



## Choke2Death

Bryan and Orton's segment still gained quite a bit of viewers regardless of being low in overrun numbers compared to the past. Wait, isn't that the excuse Punk marks used last year when the shows kept getting bad ratings and Punk's segments gained a bit in reliable spots so they blamed everyone except Punk? Okay, fuck it!

I blame the terrible build-up since it was, what, their first segment together since the night after Night of Champions? All the emphasis has turned into being about HHH and Big Show.


----------



## krai999

vacant=worst drawing champion ever.


----------



## #Mark

Fandango vs. Kofi outdrew Punk's opening promo :lol.


----------



## JY57

Brie Bella vs Alicia Fox >The Shield Match > Los Matadores > ADR vs Ryder > Kofi vs Fandango > Punk vs Langston >Marella vs Cesaro

for the wrestling matches in ratings.


----------



## KO Bossy

All I see in this thread is people throwing excuses at each other, claiming that when other people's favorite didn't do well, they relied on that same excuse.

I speak from personal experience when I was a lot more active in this thread about a year ago that many people did NOT give Punk credit when the show did poorly, but his segment still did well. I see to remember the phrase "he's the center of the show, if it does badly, he's to blame" being thrown around quite a bit. Well...swallow your prides and be fair. This Corporation angle has been given the most attention out of anything these days, and Bryan is one of the main focuses and is challenging for the title.

It seems that people like WrestlinFan35 are really pouring on exaggeration about Punk's recent viewership almost as a way of sticking it to the people who shat on Punk last year, but are now defending Bryan and Orton who are in the same position. These ratings are an absolute cancer because they are cheap ammunition for people to push their personal agendas. I get along fine with Choke2Death but I know full well he's never liked Punk, and that he was one of the people last year getting on him for the show doing poorly (again, despite Punk's segments often doing very well). Punk could draw 50 million people per show and it still wouldn't appease him because he personally strongly dislikes the guy. There's nothing wrong with that, but constantly using ratings as a vehicle to push why Punk is bad gets irritating. Its just a random justification, and a weak one at that.

So now the people who suffered through the constant ridicule of Punk have the ammunition THEY need to start slinging shit at Bryan marks so they can feel like the king of the mountain for a change, while now all the Bryan marks have to start their excuses like Punk last year. To them I say this-eat some humble pie and suck it up. You were more than willing to dish it out to the people who liked Punk, but now its somewhat evident that you can't take it when the guy YOU mark for is in that position. If you don't like the rules of the game, don't play. If you want to play, get ready for a situation like this. Punk has had some highly viewed segments as of late, and all I see is the regular haters trying to discredit them. "Oh the football game was at half time. Heyman was out there for most of it. The remote got stuck on USA for half the country." Blah blah blah. Is it that hard to give some credit where its due? Jesus, most of you know I'm not a fan of Bryan (probably one of the more outspoken ones on the site), but even I'll give him credit when a segment he's in does a good number. Why? Because I'm fair. If you aren't fair, you come across as a bitter, biased little mark who will go to any lengths to make shit up to suit your opinions, and if that's the case, why should anyone give a fuck what you say? I can listen to Thanos because like me, he's fair about stuff. As a result, I'll read what he says and take it into account. If its someone like Billion Dollar Man who just bitches about how bad Punk is, he posts are garbage that clutter up my page and so I ignore him.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

KOBossy, so you're defending Punk marks doing what you hate most (ruining this thread and trolling others)? 

You suggest that people should ignore people who don't like Punk because they don't like Punk and bash him. But it's okay if a Punk mark bashes Bryan every other post. Alrighty. I mean, at least try to hide your bias alittle bit.


----------



## Choke2Death

KO Bossy said:


> I get along fine with Choke2Death but I know full well he's never liked Punk, and that he was one of the people last year getting on him for the show doing poorly (again, despite Punk's segments often doing very well). Punk could draw 50 million people per show and it still wouldn't appease him because he personally strongly dislikes the guy. There's nothing wrong with that, but constantly using ratings as a vehicle to push why Punk is bad gets irritating. Its just a random justification, and a weak one at that.


Actually I did like Punk for a while in 2011. 50 million? LOL, let's not exaggerate now, okay? Just a few pages back I said he deserves credit for that promo from last week gaining a million. And I never used ratings as an excuse to justify Punk being bad. I'm just not a fan yet I've never actually denied his talents. If I ever saying something hyperbole, I'm just riling up Punk marks since they are always so extremely sensitive and fall into the trap. (Billion Dollar Man always shitting on Punk never gets old :lol)

Like you pointed out, we've gotten along fine but this paragraph I'm quoting is a load of crap.


----------



## Alo0oy

krai999 said:


> vacant=worst drawing champion ever.


The WWE App needs to be champion ASAP, Vacant is a failed project.


----------



## Londrick

Time to send Bryan back to the high school gyms and replace him with Ryback and Heyman. The Vanilla Midget Era continues to do bad.


----------



## markedfordeath

well think of it this way, at least the over run gained viewership albeit smaller than usual but it still gained just under 400,000 viewers which is weak but not the worst ever. If it lost then man oh man, but it didnt..congrats to Punk and Heyman this week! I hate Ryback so i'll ignore him he he


----------



## funnyfaces1

Bryan and Orton did not do poorly. You want to put blame on someone? Why not the World Heavyweight Champion?

EDIT: And yes, people should ignore Billion Dollar Man, because he is the most obvious troll on here now that Hawksea has disappeared.


----------



## markedfordeath

i watched a two hour Raw on Youtube last night, it was over in 90 mins..oh man those were the days...Its so hard watching three hours. and when they make Smackdown three hours, watch out!


----------



## Londrick

WWE really need to pull the plug on this vanilla midget experiment they have been doing the past several years. Bryan's flopping big and Punk may be doing good number but it's still a low rated RAW. It's like being proud of a kid getting the best grades in remedial class. WWE need to go back to pushing people based on their star potential and not cause they threaten to leave the company or they're dating the sister of the person who's dating the face of the company.


----------



## KO Bossy

ShowStopper '97 said:


> KOBossy, so you're defending Punk marks doing what you hate most (ruining this thread and trolling others)? What a shock.
> 
> Ignore Billion Dollar Man because he doesn't like Punk and bashes him. But it's okay if a Punk mark bashes Bryan every other post.
> 
> So much for being fair.


Yeah, pretty much. I don't feel the least bit sorry for them, either. I was here last year and the hate Punk was getting was insane. Now those haters will sit back and use the exact same reason that I brought up at least 3 times a week to now defend Bryan: "Punk's segment did well, why is he responsible for the entire show doing a bad rating?" You know what? I don't blame Bryan solely for these crappy ratings because that's an asinine thing to do. Sure its partly his fault, just like its partly everyone's fault. In that regard, I'll speak up on his behalf. His legion of followers, on the other hand, I absolutely will not defend. They had no trouble talking shit before, so as far as I'm concerned, they should have no trouble taking it, either. In my eyes, they've earned it.

As for Punk marks bashing Bryan marks, the opposite is true as well. I'm not going to waste my time defending every single post, I've given up. They can enjoy their mark war, I'll leave that to them. I personally don't care who they think is better, I care about who I think is better.

This entire thread has been ruined anyway. And no offense, but for every Punk mark I see (and I genuinely only see a few), I see at least 5 Bryan supporters rushing in with a shield to block blows. Markedfordeath in particular has got this thing where every comment against Bryan is taken as a personal attack, which I think is pretty ridiculous.

Were it up to me, we'd just be having an actual discussion about the ratings, but its never that. Its always "the ratings say the guy I like is more popular than the one you like, suck it." And its the never ending, constantly escalating feud. You do it, too. Hell, sometimes I do it. Its like one person makes a comment that rubs you the wrong way and your next few posts are tweaked to subtly fight back. Like when Bryan does a good Smackdown rating and one hater shits on it. I see that you'll say something like "Bryan bringing in dem ratings, da GOAT is killing it on Smackdown! And people say he can't draw :lmao." Then the haters start flocking in to top your comment, then more Bryan fans come in to defend him and eventually it become a huge argument. 

Unfortunately, you and I don't see things from the same perspective. For months I've been putting up with this pro-Bryan and anti-Punk bullshit. I've seen everything from people refusing to credit Punk even a bit with the strong Rumble drawing with Rock, or even having a great match with Taker at WM (my god, there were so many threads by haters calling it an overrated piece of crap only a week after it happened, and targeting Punk in particular). And meantime, I've been seeing so much about Bryan being this new king who will draw in the greatest numbers weekly and whatnot. Well, now its been a bit of a slide and Bryan marks are now pulling out the same excuses they'd criticize Punk for. That pisses me off, and so when there's an argument about this stuff, I don't feel bad for them. Karma is a bitch.

On the flipside, you probably don't feel bad for Punk marks when they open their mouths because of your bad experiences with them. Its all perspective. I've had extremely annoying dealings with the blindest of Bryan marks on this site and its soured my opinion on the guy so much, and on Bryan marks themselves.

For the record, I also don't advocate people targeting Bryan marks. Were it up to me, no one would target anyone. However, you reap what you sow. 



Choke2Death said:


> Actually I did like Punk for a while in 2011. 50 million? LOL, let's not exaggerate now, okay? Just a few pages back I said he deserves credit for that promo from last week gaining a million. And I never used ratings as an excuse to justify Punk being bad. I'm just not a fan yet I've never actually denied his talents. If I ever saying something hyperbole, I'm just riling up Punk marks since they are always so extremely sensitive and fall into the trap. (Billion Dollar Man always shitting on Punk never gets old :lol)
> 
> Like you pointed out, we've gotten along fine but this paragraph I'm quoting is a load of crap.


Well, that's generally not what I've read from your posts. 

I think you and I are two sides of the same coin. Both of us dislike a popular star simply because of the outlandish comments made by his fans to give him what we feel to be unwarranted praise.

And yeah, Billion Dollar Man shitting on Punk DOES get old. It wouldn't if he ever said anything other than that, but any post that comes up is something about why he's crappy for whatever reason he's pushing that day. Marks in general are way too sensitive on this site, anyway, I agree, but he's the other extreme.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

KO Bossy said:


> Yeah, pretty much. I don't feel the least bit sorry for them, either. I was here last year and the hate Punk was getting was insane. Now those haters will sit back and use the exact same reason that I brought up at least 3 times a week to now defend Bryan: "Punk's segment did well, why is he responsible for the entire show doing a bad rating?" You know what? I don't blame Bryan solely for these crappy ratings because that's an asinine thing to do. Sure its partly his fault, just like its partly everyone's fault. In that regard, I'll speak up on his behalf. His legion of followers, on the other hand, I absolutely will not defend. They had no trouble talking shit before, so as far as I'm concerned, they should have no trouble taking it, either. In my eyes, they've earned it.
> 
> As for Punk marks bashing Bryan marks, the opposite is true as well. I'm not going to waste my time defending every single post, I've given up. They can enjoy their mark war, I'll leave that to them. I personally don't care who they think is better, I care about who I think is better.
> 
> This entire thread has been ruined anyway. And no offense, but for every Punk mark I see (and I genuinely only see a few), I see at least 5 Bryan supporters rushing in with a shield to block blows. Markedfordeath in particular has got this thing where every comment against Bryan is taken as a personal attack, which I think is pretty ridiculous.
> 
> Were it up to me, we'd just be having an actual discussion about the ratings, but its never that. Its always "the ratings say the guy I like is more popular than the one you like, suck it." And its the never ending, constantly escalating feud. You do it, too. Hell, sometimes I do it. Its like one person makes a comment that rubs you the wrong way and your next few posts are tweaked to subtly fight back. Like when Bryan does a good Smackdown rating and one hater shits on it. I see that you'll say something like "Bryan bringing in dem ratings, da GOAT is killing it on Smackdown! And people say he can't draw :lmao." Then the haters start flocking in to top your comment, then more Bryan fans come in to defend him and eventually it become a huge argument.
> 
> Unfortunately, you and I don't see things from the same perspective. For months I've been putting up with this pro-Bryan and anti-Punk bullshit. I've seen everything from people refusing to credit Punk even a bit with the strong Rumble drawing with Rock, or even having a great match with Taker at WM (my god, there were so many threads by haters calling it an overrated piece of crap only a week after it happened, and targeting Punk in particular). And meantime, I've been seeing so much about Bryan being this new king who will draw in the greatest numbers weekly and whatnot. Well, now its been a bit of a slide and Bryan marks are now pulling out the same excuses they'd criticize Punk for. That pisses me off, and so when there's an argument about this stuff, I don't feel bad for them. Karma is a bitch.
> 
> 
> 
> Well, that's generally not what I've read from your posts.
> 
> I think you and I are two sides of the same coin. Both of us dislike a popular star simply because of the outlandish comments made by his fans to give him what we feel to be unwarranted praise.
> 
> And yeah, Billion Dollar Man shitting on Punk DOES get old. It wouldn't if he ever said anything other than that, but any post that comes up is something about why he's crappy for whatever reason he's pushing that day. Marks in general are way too sensitive on this site, anyway, I agree, but he's the other extreme.


I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but guess what?

*CM Punk was the WWE Champion for 434 days. Of course, he is going to get the blame or the credit for the ratings.* Bryan has had a push since SumemrSlam, and has been the WWE Champion for 1 day and 5 minutes. OF COURSE the guy with the 434 day reign is going to get more of the blame or credit (this case, the blame).

Give Bryan a 400+ day title reign, then there would be an actual comparison. Until then, there is none. Not even close. And at least Punk had Cena around in 2012 to help draw some ratings. Bryan doesn't.

And you seem to believe that only Bryan marks start these "wars."

LO-fucking-L about that.


----------



## markedfordeath

They need to test it to see how Bryan draws as champion. They really need to do that. Instead, there's a rumor that Orton moves on from the feud to face someone else, but they don't say if its for the title, and if they give up on Bryan so quickly, that would just be such a buzzkill.


----------



## Londrick

The real culprit is Vacant. Fans obviously don't care about him holding the title in 2013.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

KO Bossy said:


> All I see in this thread is people throwing excuses at each other, claiming that when other people's favorite didn't do well, they relied on that same excuse.
> 
> I speak from personal experience when I was a lot more active in this thread about a year ago that many people did NOT give Punk credit when the show did poorly, but his segment still did well. I see to remember the phrase "he's the center of the show, if it does badly, he's to blame" being thrown around quite a bit. Well...swallow your prides and be fair. This Corporation angle has been given the most attention out of anything these days, and Bryan is one of the main focuses and is challenging for the title.
> 
> It seems that people like WrestlinFan35 are really pouring on exaggeration about Punk's recent viewership almost as a way of sticking it to the people who shat on Punk last year, but are now defending Bryan and Orton who are in the same position. These ratings are an absolute cancer because they are cheap ammunition for people to push their personal agendas. I get along fine with Choke2Death but I know full well he's never liked Punk, and that he was one of the people last year getting on him for the show doing poorly (again, despite Punk's segments often doing very well). Punk could draw 50 million people per show and it still wouldn't appease him because he personally strongly dislikes the guy. There's nothing wrong with that, but constantly using ratings as a vehicle to push why Punk is bad gets irritating. Its just a random justification, and a weak one at that.
> 
> So now the people who suffered through the constant ridicule of Punk have the ammunition THEY need to start slinging shit at Bryan marks so they can feel like the king of the mountain for a change, while now all the Bryan marks have to start their excuses like Punk last year. To them I say this-eat some humble pie and suck it up. You were more than willing to dish it out to the people who liked Punk, but now its somewhat evident that you can't take it when the guy YOU mark for is in that position. If you don't like the rules of the game, don't play. If you want to play, get ready for a situation like this. Punk has had some highly viewed segments as of late, and all I see is the regular haters trying to discredit them. "Oh the football game was at half time. Heyman was out there for most of it. The remote got stuck on USA for half the country." Blah blah blah. Is it that hard to give some credit where its due? Jesus, most of you know I'm not a fan of Bryan (probably one of the more outspoken ones on the site), but even I'll give him credit when a segment he's in does a good number. Why? Because I'm fair. If you aren't fair, you come across as a bitter, biased little mark who will go to any lengths to make shit up to suit your opinions, and if that's the case, why should anyone give a fuck what you say? I can listen to Thanos because like me, he's fair about stuff. As a result, I'll read what he says and take it into account. *If its someone like Billion Dollar Man who just bitches about how bad Punk is, he posts are garbage that clutter up my page and so I ignore him.*


I have Punk marks giving me green rep agreeing with me half the time. So spare me the high and mighty bullshit. You do that exact same to Bryan, you're no different. Me and you never had problem prior to Bryan's push, now you act anti-Bryan, but super duper pro Punk. Hell, you use to give me green rep until Bryan's push. You just turned into a full fledged Punk mark.


----------



## markedfordeath

Who cares at this point..the company will sink or swim with whatever decision they make. We can't control it. If they think bringing Vince back to tv will help, then so be it. I'd like to know who the head writer is though because very shitty ideas most of the time.


----------



## RKO 4life

markedfordeath said:


> I think Bryan gets a pass for it being his first ever main event push on tv...so he's learning on the job.....I think he gets a pass...if its been 10-12 months and he's not bringing in ratings, then drop him.


The Orton/Bryan feud has more in the tank and will get higher numbers in the weeks to come. No one is blaming Bryan, it's writers/Vince people how are not giving Orton and Bryan the air time. They both need mic time as well.


----------



## markedfordeath

Yep..even on Smackdown this week I think both of them are only on at the end as well..that's just silly.


----------



## SinJackal

> - Q9: Raw jumped to a show-high 2.29 rating for Paul Heyman's "proposal" to Ryback and C.M. Punk's run-in. There was no commercial interruption, boosting the rating.
> 
> The segment included the show's peak audience of 1.663 million viewers twice at the end of the segment. Overall, the final five minutes of the segment averaged 1.6 million viewers.





THANOS said:


> So once Punk came into the fold the segment was at it's peek. There's one to stop people from only crediting Heyman/Ryback.


So it was basically huge without Punk and gained a little when Punk appeared and seemed to blow his knee out? I'll give Punk a little bit credit, but he was barely involved in it. 2/3rds of his involvement was looking like he critically botched a barricade hop and hurt his knee.

If you rewatch that segment of when Punk appears, he hurts" his knee almost immediately upon showing up then *lies on the floor for a full two minutes* selling it before attacking Punk and Heyman for barely 12 seconds, then attacking Axel for 50 seconds. Then nothing but a replay and commercial. So about one minute of Punk in action at the tail end after two minutes of Punk laying the the ground selling what looked like an embarrassing spot failure. . .after a lengthy proposal segment _which was advertised_ prior to that segment airing.

This may sound mean-spirited, but if people tuned in then "because of Punk", it was to laugh at him for seeming to critically botch the barricade hop. After all, that's 2/3rds of what his appearance consisted of; seeming like he botched and hurt himself for real.



The Sandrone said:


> Of course he should get a bit of credit, especially when it was around the end of it, when he was there, that the segment was averaging 1.6 million viewers. Obviously though Heyman/Ryback should get the vast majority of the credit, but Punk deserves his bit, which is the opposite of last week where he gets the vast majority of credit with Heyman/Ryback/the angle itself getting a fair bit.


I agree, Punk deserves a bit of credit, just not much. Let's compare and contrast:



> - Q1: Raw opened with a below-average 1.77 rating for C.M. Punk's show-opening promo





> Q9: Raw jumped to a show-high 2.29 rating for Paul Heyman's "proposal" to Ryback


That's a pretty major difference.



> The segment included the show's peak audience of 1.663 million viewers twice at the end of the segment. Overall, the final five minutes of the segment averaged 1.6 million viewers.


Now, this doesn't tell us exactly what the rating was BEFORE Punk showed up. I wish they listed that too. It'd paint a more clear picture. I would assume the Heyman/Ryback proposal did most of the heavy lifting though. At least 85-90%. Either way, this fued seems to be outdrawing most of the show now. That's a good thing I guess. Better pairing than people first gave it credit for. I know personally I didn't give two shits about Punk/Axel, now it's interesting.

The rating for this week's show really sucked overall though. Talk about horrendous. The PPV this week is probably going to bomb bigtime too. WWE needs to do something different soon. Come to think of it, this happened last year too when Cena was out for awhile.


----------



## KO Bossy

ShowStopper '97 said:


> I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but guess what?
> 
> *CM Punk was the WWE Champion for 434 days. Of course, he is going to get the blame or the credit for the ratings.* Bryan has had a push since SumemrSlam, and has been the WWE Champion for 1 day and 5 minutes. OF COURSE the guy with the 434 day reign is going to get more of the blame or credit (this case, the blame).
> 
> Give Bryan a 400+ day title reign, then there would be an actual comparison. Until then, there is none. Not even close. And at least Punk had Cena around in 2012 to help draw some ratings. Bryan doesn't.
> 
> And you seem to believe that only Bryan marks start these "wars."
> 
> LO-fucking-L about that.


Never said they were the only one who start them. 

Honestly, your post unfortunately just wreaks of justifications and double standards. It IS Punk's fault simply because he had a really long reign (despite being booked as the clear and distant #2 to Cena). However, its NOT Bryan's fault that he's been gifted this once awesome, now dwindling storyline that people on this site were raving about, and that he'd been getting the majority of the attention in this entire story, being put clearly into the #1 position while Cena is out, and having previously gone over Cena the cleanest anyone ever has. 

So...Bryan is the #1 babyface, beat the top guy and got handed the torch, has been going over everyone cleanly, and is the center of a giant story, one of the hottest in years. Why exactly is he free of guilt? Because he doesn't have a 434 day reign where he played second fiddle to someone else more important than him? All I see is one thing: both guys are in very prominent positions, getting very big pushes and being the biggest centers of attention. Ergo, either both or neither deserve blame. I hate this logic that Punk does deserve it, but Bryan doesn't. The fact of the matter is that neither are bringing in new viewers to boost up numbers. Its the same people who tune in every week. That's a failing for both of them.

Punk fans had to endure it, now Bryan fans are. People constantly made fun of Punk marks for excusing him. Well, now people are making fun of Bryan marks for doing the same thing. I have no sympathy for one side crying foul when a type of ammunition is used against them that they themselves had no problem using before. 

And saying "LO-fucking-L about that" is just another petty form of one-upmanship. Like you're saying "put that in your pipe and smoke it." Do you have this need to get the last word in or something? Does it bother you that much when people rag on Bryan? Apparently it does. Without fail, whenever someone says something bad about him, its like your first instinct is to distribute more praise to balance the scales in his favor or something. For me, it doesn't bother me a lot anymore that Punk gets so much hate, but I will absolutely say something when the hate he gets is because of something that people will defend someone else for.

Its kind of amusing, I know you've always felt like I'm this hidden Punk mark who you can't ever see sticking up for Bryan or anything. You've said it a few times. Truth is, I do enjoy Punk a lot, way more than Bryan, but I'll always be fair to both of them when I can be. Same can't be said for the marks, however. Bryan marks drive me absolutely insane and I'll freely admit it. Marks in general annoy me, but Bryan's irritate me the most by far. And contrary to popular belief, I have spoken out against ridiculous claims made by Punk fans before. However, this idea that Bryan is absolved of blame right now...doesn't fly. You can agree or disagree with me, its really not my decision. I'll continue to feel how I do, just how all of you will continue to feel how you do.


----------



## FreakyZo

If its anybody to blame its Orton....nobody has given a shit about him since 2009 and I like Orton. Smackdown 2011 is all I need to say


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

KO Bossy said:


> Ergo, either both or neither deserve blame. I hate this logic that Punk does deserve it, but Bryan doesn't. The fact of the matter is that neither are bringing in new viewers to boost up numbers. Its the same people who tune in every week. That's a failing for both of them.


THIS 110%. Great post as a whole, but this part rings true especially.


----------



## RKO 4life

Little off topic but we can see the numbers in the opening of what rating it got.. but who do you guys think will come out first and open Raw this coming week? HHH/Orton/Vince/Punk/Bryan/?


----------



## markedfordeath

Orton since he'll be the champion.


----------



## Londrick

FreakyZo said:


> If its anybody to blame its Orton....nobody has given a shit about him since 2009 and I like Orton. Smackdown 2011 is all I need to say


Good point. While the fans aren't buying midgets like Punk and Bryan, Orton has been the most pushed guy on the current roster. If he was as big of deal as his fans make him out to be this angle would be doing a lot better.


----------



## markedfordeath

its weird how live crowds go crazy for guys, yet they don't end up watching them at home.


----------



## EyeZac

It's almost as if taking the biggest draw off tv due to injury means less people are watching. Who would have thought that? Cena will get a title reign because of these ratings.


----------



## Londrick

Yeah they desperately need Cena back. Hopefully once the hobbit is done with Orton Cena will be healed and be able to get the title again. A lot of people on here may hate Cena but the low ratings w/o him prove he's best for business.


----------



## LateTrain27

I've been lurking this thread for a while. Is it just me or has this thread lately become an absolute trainwreck?


----------



## markedfordeath

everyone hates Bryan, so either way he can't win.


----------



## RKO 4life

Dunmer said:


> Good point. While the fans aren't buying midgets like Punk and Bryan, Orton has been the most pushed guy on the current roster. If he was as big of deal as his fans make him out to be this angle would be doing a lot better.


Why do you need to bash Punk/Bryan/Orton? All you do is bash the living shit outta the whole roster. Who is your fav?

Also if Orton feud with Cena/Rock/Beast/Y2J as Punk has done the last 2 years, do you really think he wouldn't post bigger numbers then Raw has seen the last 2 years? Are you a real poster? Throw Smackdown 2011 put blame on him for some unknown reason, but don't forget in 09 when he was Champ Raw posted 4.01 in 2010 3.07. Where have those numbers been since?


----------



## Londrick

RKO 4life said:


> Why do you need to bash Punk/Bryan/Orton? All you do is bash the living shit outta the whole roster. Who is your fav?
> 
> Also if Orton feud with Cena/Rock/Beast/Y2J as Punk has done the last 2 years, do you really think he wouldn't post bigger numbers then Raw has seen the last 2 years? Are you a real poster? Throw Smackdown 2011 put blame on him for some unknown reason, but don't forget in 09 when he was Champ Raw posted 4.01 in 2010 3.07. Where have those numbers been since?


No one right now, unless you include part time/injured wrestlers like Cena, Brock, Taker, etc. They are actual stars not like the regular roster which is full of midgets and drug addicts like Bryan, Punk and Orton. 

Cool he drew decent numbers feuding with the likes of HHH and Cena. What a tremendous accomplishment! Not. If Orton was such a big star he'd be able to draw on his own regardless of what angle he is in but he can't.


----------



## SinJackal

markedfordeath said:


> its weird how live crowds go crazy for guys, yet they don't end up watching them at home.


I actually noticed this too. Santino for example, gets bigtime crowd support but at home everyone's turning the channel.

Crowd support doesn't always translate to people putting the remote down. It usually does, but there are cases where it doesn't mean anything. Usually for underdog types that usually always get cheered, but people at home tend to not give a shit since it's so easy to turn to NBA or NFL.



markedfordeath said:


> everyone hates Bryan, so either way he can't win.


Most of the forum likes Bryan. Until the past few weeks it's been practically taboo to talk ill of him.

There are quite a bit of negative posts about him though, but his level of support here is still high. Truly hated wrestlers on here would be guys like John Morrison, Ryback until recently, and John Cena. Almost nobody defends them. Bryan has never been unsupported by IWC. The negative posts are just popping up more often now because he's getting a superman push.


----------



## markedfordeath

drug addicts like Bryan and Punk? they don't even drink man.


----------



## Londrick

markedfordeath said:


> drug addicts like Bryan and Punk? they don't even drink man.


That part of the post was directed at Orton who is one strike away from being in TNA.


----------



## markedfordeath

I will say this though, Bryan has the brightest long term potential, it'll just take a little longer than expected. But he gets the biggest cheers, so I guess if you're WWE you just work with it and write a good program that you don't fuck up. I think they gave in to the complaining moms and that's why the plotholes are being covered up right now. Like why was Shawn's name dropped when he hasn't shown up yet? where is the fired referee? why hasn't Triple H been talking with Bryan lately? that sort of thing, they just stopped it altogether.


----------



## RKO 4life

Dunmer said:


> No one right now, unless you include part time/injured wrestlers like Cena, Brock, Taker, etc. They are actual stars not like the regular roster which is full of midgets and drug addicts like Bryan, Punk and Orton.
> 
> Cool he drew decent numbers feuding with the likes of HHH and Cena. What a tremendous accomplishment! Not. If Orton was such a big star he'd be able to draw on his own regardless of what angle he is in but he can't.


Oh hes only been doing it for while now. Biggest number 2 weeks ago with THE MIZ of all people. Put in bad time sloots yet gets big numbers. Go by the time of the program don't go by a nerd Dave who rally doesn't have an high iq about wrestling.


----------



## Londrick

lol @ "THE MIZ of all people". You do realize that Miz as WWE champ at WM drew better than any of the of the previous ones where Orton was champ or going for the title?


----------



## SinJackal

markedfordeath said:


> I will say this though, Bryan has *the brightest * long term potential, it'll just take a little longer than expected. But he gets the biggest cheers, so I guess if you're WWE you just work with it and write a good program that you don't fuck up. I think they gave in to the complaining moms and that's why the plotholes are being covered up right now. Like why was Shawn's name dropped when he hasn't shown up yet? where is the fired referee? why hasn't Triple H been talking with Bryan lately? that sort of thing, they just stopped it altogether.


If you just said "bright", and not, "the brightest", I'd agree.

I don't agree that he has the most potential of the whole roster. Sorry, but no. Top 10, yeah. Top 5, maybe. #1? No.


----------



## Londrick

The brightest potential goes to Reigns. He's the only guy on the current roster who has a chance of reaching the likes of Cena, Austin, Rock, Hogan, etc.


----------



## THANOS

KO Bossy said:


> All I see in this thread is people throwing excuses at each other, claiming that when other people's favorite didn't do well, they relied on that same excuse.
> 
> I speak from personal experience when I was a lot more active in this thread about a year ago that many people did NOT give Punk credit when the show did poorly, but his segment still did well. I see to remember the phrase "he's the center of the show, if it does badly, he's to blame" being thrown around quite a bit. Well...swallow your prides and be fair. This Corporation angle has been given the most attention out of anything these days, and Bryan is one of the main focuses and is challenging for the title.
> 
> It seems that people like WrestlinFan35 are really pouring on exaggeration about Punk's recent viewership almost as a way of sticking it to the people who shat on Punk last year, but are now defending Bryan and Orton who are in the same position. These ratings are an absolute cancer because they are cheap ammunition for people to push their personal agendas. I get along fine with Choke2Death but I know full well he's never liked Punk, and that he was one of the people last year getting on him for the show doing poorly (again, despite Punk's segments often doing very well). Punk could draw 50 million people per show and it still wouldn't appease him because he personally strongly dislikes the guy. There's nothing wrong with that, but constantly using ratings as a vehicle to push why Punk is bad gets irritating. Its just a random justification, and a weak one at that.
> 
> So now the people who suffered through the constant ridicule of Punk have the ammunition THEY need to start slinging shit at Bryan marks so they can feel like the king of the mountain for a change, while now all the Bryan marks have to start their excuses like Punk last year. To them I say this-eat some humble pie and suck it up. You were more than willing to dish it out to the people who liked Punk, but now its somewhat evident that you can't take it when the guy YOU mark for is in that position. If you don't like the rules of the game, don't play. If you want to play, get ready for a situation like this. Punk has had some highly viewed segments as of late, and all I see is the regular haters trying to discredit them. "Oh the football game was at half time. Heyman was out there for most of it. The remote got stuck on USA for half the country." Blah blah blah. Is it that hard to give some credit where its due? Jesus, most of you know I'm not a fan of Bryan (probably one of the more outspoken ones on the site), but even I'll give him credit when a segment he's in does a good number. Why? Because I'm fair. If you aren't fair, you come across as a bitter, biased little mark who will go to any lengths to make shit up to suit your opinions, and if that's the case, why should anyone give a fuck what you say? I can listen to Thanos because like me, he's fair about stuff. As a result, I'll read what he says and take it into account. If its someone like Billion Dollar Man who just bitches about how bad Punk is, he posts are garbage that clutter up my page and so I ignore him.


I'll rep you as soon as I can my friend. What a fabulous post this is! :clap And I didn't even notice the name drop until this very second lol. You hit the nail on the head with this, and I think it is ridiculous anytime someone tries to blame an entire show on one guy, especially when the report comes out and said guy does the best on the show. I don't think anyone on either side of the mark war is going to tell you with a truthful tone that Bryan and Punk are mega draws, because that's bull, but they're are certainly draws in this era, and huge ones in comparison to the rest of the roster, so people need to quit the dumb hate, and instead focus on why comedy matches featuring Santino are still existing when they turn in ratings like this :lmao.


----------



## markedfordeath

I think Bryan might end up being the Savage to Hogan or Bob Backlund to Bruno Sammartino...know what I mean? the top guy at a time but not all the time.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

FreakyZo said:


> If its anybody to blame its Orton....nobody has given a shit about him since 2009 and I like Orton. Smackdown 2011 is all I need to say


I think SD was probably shit as a whole. It was Christian and Orton for how long? And the entire feud was one sided. It wasn't until Henry that they finally started to mix things up a bit.

Either way, Orton wasn't the man to push SD's ratings like Vince thought he would. But I think he kept enough interest on it.


----------



## RKO 4life

Dunmer said:


> lol @ "THE MIZ of all people". You do realize that Miz as WWE champ at WM drew better than any of the of the previous ones where Orton was champ or going for the title?



?


----------



## Londrick

swagger_ROCKS said:


> I think SD was probably shit as a whole. It was Christian and Orton for how long? And the entire feud was one sided. It wasn't until Henry that they finally started to mix things up a bit.
> 
> Either way, Orton wasn't the man to push SD's ratings like Vince thought he would. But I think he kept enough interest on it.


Henry is a guy you can take seriously as champ unlike Orton.


----------



## RKO 4life

Dunmer said:


> Henry is a guy you can take seriously as champ unlike Orton.


:banplz:


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

RKO 4life said:


> :banplz:


If Henry's push didn't come many years too late, probably, and I do stress "probably" so. I mean his build before winning the title was gold, his mic work is gold, and his promo before he faced Cena for the WWE title...well...gold. Henry was a hidden gem WWE failed to capitalize on long before his initial push. 

Overall, Orton just has that championship/marketable look, and skill.


----------



## Jingoro

swagger_ROCKS said:


> If Henry's push didn't come many years too late, probably, and I do stress "probably" so. I mean his build before winning the title was gold, his mic work is gold, and his promo before he faced Cena for the WWE title...well...gold. Henry was a hidden gem WWE failed to capitalize on long before his initial push.
> 
> Overall, Orton just has that championship/marketable look, and skill.


i wonder for how long was henry that good and they just didn't see it in him? his whole career could have been something entirely different than it turned out. what a waste.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Jingoro said:


> i wonder for how long was henry that good and they didn't see it in him? his whole career could have been something entirely different than it turned out.


Very true. I had not much to absolutely no interest in Henry until 2011. And he was better in the ring long ago. Now he gets injured a lot.


----------



## Starbuck

Holy shit this thread! :lol Jesus Christ lol. I'm going to edit the front page to include 'Where Objectivity Comes To Die' because apparently it doesn't exist when people click to come in here. 

I have to say that the cycle over the past 2 years is beyond hilarious. This thread was initially created because Punk marks were crying over Rock316AE's posts about him not being able to draw every week. 2 years ago Punk marks were in the position of Bryan marks right now and arguing week after week that he could draw. Now 2 years later they're doing the very thing Rock316AE did to them and it's actually fucking hilarious to watch just for the sheer irony of the situation. Then you have the Bryan marks riding high one week and low the next. The only difference is that he's getting compared to Punk, a much easier fight of course than getting compared to the biggest wrestling draw on the planet in Rocky lol. 

Why can't we all just admit these very obvious conclusions based on recent numbers:

1) Post NOC the 'Corporation' story kind of ended or has most definitely gone askew. Up until that point they had consistent high viewership, ratings and interest not to mention a defined arc with HHH/Orton vs. Bryan/Friends. Since then, Orton and Bryan have barely interacted and the McMahon's have been off doing their own thing. I've still found enjoyment in pieces of the storyline but that doesn't stop me from seeing the obvious here. I fully understand the reason for the finish at NOC and the whole title in abeyance thing but it hasn't worked and has only served to cool people down. Orton and Bryan have a match yet they sent them on 2 separate trajectories heading into Battleground. Now, Orton's one makes sense because he was going back to finding the Viper and all that but they probably should have tried to keep them together. What happened this week was a last ditch attempt to roll 3 weeks of build into 1. And while it may have been the lowest overrun in months, it didn't bomb in the context of the viewership of this particular show. 

2) Maybe just maybe it could be possible that the 2+ years they've invested into Punk is starting to show dividends and that people are interested in the Heyman storyline. Be honest. They're pulling some whacky shit in this thing and the proposal was funny this week lol. I don't get why that's so hard for some people to admit. I'm not saying that Punk is a guaranteed money maker. The Summerslam 2013 number with Lesnar is worrying. But at the very least WWE might have created a solid TV draw in Punk and know they can slot him in certain timeslots and hopefully expect him to hold steady or even pop a big number. Compare that to the last 2 years where he was losing viewers more than he was gaining them. Using this week obviously isn't the best example. The show opener with his promo and then match was the lowest opener they've had in a while. Compared to the last 2 weeks where HHH opened the show and lifted the first hour number, Punk did the opposite and dragged it down. BUT...and there is a but, the Heyman/Ryback stuff topped the show and he was involved. Last week he had a huge gain that was all him. Yes, it may have been half time in the football game but at the end of the day, over a million people turned the channel when he was on and stayed until he left. There is no refuting that.

On the whole Cena front, it makes no difference whether he's here or not tbh. At this time of the year, the trend is a downward trend until things pick up for the Rumble. It would be the same whether he was on or not with a few fluctuations here and there depending on what he was doing at the time. This is the first week viewership has taken a considerable dip since Summerslam. They were going very steady but have lost their way since Night of Champions. This will be the 4th big Orton/Bryan match this year alone. In their last one we got a screwy finish. It's obvious they will have another match in just 3 weeks time. They didn't do an effective job in the 3 weeks they had between NOC and Battleground in building their match so interest is low. They either need to have a decisive finish this Sunday and end this or if they go for another screwy finish they need to have enough gas to get them through the 3 weeks after to HIAC where they will end it there. The build to Orton/Bryan is what has let them down here and it's their own fault.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Oh man, *Rock316AE* kinda miss the saint.


----------



## Starbuck

Watching him get under the skin of practically every mark besides Rock marks was some of the funniest shit I've ever seen on the internet. :lmao That was just gold. I doubt we'll see him again until Rock comes back if he does. We need him here for Rock/Brock to tell us it's the biggest drawing match in Wrestling/MMA/Entertainment today every week. He wouldn't be wrong lol.


----------



## Cliffy

He's still on here it's just that he posts mostly in the football threads, 

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## MaybeLock

Great posts by KObossy and Starbuck. These type of fights are getting very absurd. If this shit keeps going, it´s not going to be possible to like anybody on the roster, because everybody is going to have these 2.XX ratings eventually and be blamed for them.

Orton, Cena, Punk, Bryan... The 4 WWE Champions and top guys for the last 2 years (I don't include Del Rio because he´s not in that league of overall popularity), and all of them had to deal with the bad ratings. When they were fed with a better storyline, the ratings obviously rose, but eventually they went back to the bad ratings everybody gets in this Era, where Wrestling isn´t that popular anymore and where you can easily stream the show on your PC.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Starbuck said:


> Watching him get under the skin of practically every mark besides Rock marks was some of the funniest shit I've ever seen on the internet. :lmao That was just gold. I doubt we'll see him again until Rock comes back if he does. We need him here for Rock/Brock to tell us it's the biggest drawing match in Wrestling/MMA/Entertainment today every week. He wouldn't be wrong lol.


It was truly entertaining. The best part was when some rock marks had the same avy as him. :lol


----------



## Starbuck

You know what's hilarious? ADR and his ability to legitimately be a ratings killer and nobody has anything to say about it lol. You know why? Because he has no marks and nobody cares enough to hate on him. If ADR had marks calling him the best thing since sliced bread guaranteed he'd be getting crucified every week. Fact is, the reason Punk and Bryan are getting the most hate is because their marks are doing all the bragging and over exaggerating them to holy heaven. You never see Cena or HHH getting torn to pieces in here that often because their marks aren't running around calling them the saviours of wrestling. Sure, the odd discussion breaks out every now and then and haters get their shots in but for the most part, this is actually something of a safe haven for 2 guys who unmercifully get shat on on the internet. How ironic that in contrast to that, 2 guys who can do no wrong in Punk and Bryan are the ones feeling the heat every week and the best bit about it all is that their marks are going to war AGAINST each other. :lmao Never gets old.


----------



## DOPA

Unsurprisingly, the only users making sensible posts are Starbuck and KO Bossy. I'd just like to add one more point, those saying WWE need Cena back to draw those ratings again need to pay attention to last year. He was on the show late last year except for the build to HIAC in the biggest storylines and angles and yet didn't make much of a difference at all. There is a definite trend that the football season is drawing away viewers regardless of who is on top or who is in main programs. That can only lead to one conclusion:

* A lot of the blame has to go to the creative team for not coming up with consistent quality TV programming with angles and storylines to gain interest in the product.

I'd also like to point out that as far as increase in ratings is concerned in order for WWE to increase their TV ratings back up for the long haul, it's going to require long term consistent quality TV like I said. WWE in the late 90's didn't get Attitude Era ratings in a week and that certainly wouldn't be the case even getting back up to consistent 3.5's at this time.

I've always thought it's pointless to point the blame at one wrestler anyway when at the moment it's clear that a) The brand draws more now and b) There has been consistent long term planned TV in god knows how long to really bring in viewers.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Starbuck said:


> You know what's hilarious? ADR and his ability to legitimately be a ratings killer and nobody has anything to say about it lol. You know why? Because he has no marks and nobody cares enough to hate on him. If ADR had marks calling him the best thing since sliced bread guaranteed he'd be getting crucified every week. Fact is, the reason Punk and Bryan are getting the most hate is because their marks are doing all the bragging and over exaggerating them to holy heaven. You never see Cena or HHH getting torn to pieces in here that often because their marks aren't running around calling them the saviours of wrestling. Sure, the odd discussion breaks out every now and then and haters get their shots in but for the most part, this is actually something of a safe haven for 2 guys who unmercifully get shat on on the internet. How ironic that in contrast to that, 2 guys who can do no wrong in Punk and Bryan are the ones feeling the heat every week and the best bit about it all is that their marks are going to war AGAINST each other. :lmao Never gets old.


This is why I dread the day someone like Cesaro gets the WHC belt, and may possibly not do as well as people think he might. I'm just gonna enjoy his build to getting over at least.


----------



## Starbuck

You can't fully put the blame on creative during this time of year. The obvious and recent Orton/Bryan debacle aside, from Summerslam to NOC the high points of the show were scoring consistent 3.6, 3.7, 3.5 etc on Raw for their particular segments with viewership over 5 million. You can't ask for more than that. People were interested in whatever was happening in those 15 minute slots but it wasn't enough to get them over the 3.0 mark even with such a huge storyline. It's the rest of the show letting them down and that's completely understandable. It's 3 hours long, longer than most movies, of course things are going to fluctuate. You can have the best show in the world but it's going to be a struggle for any entertainment outlet to hold consistent viewer interest for 3 hours solid. That's just a fact of life. They are never getting AE ratings back, that's another fact of life. It's just not possible. There is no wrestling boom, there is no competition, the show is 3 hours long. It's never happening again.

I don't even think ratings are that big of an issue for WWE. They give the best indication of what is drawing viewer interest but WWE is already paid upfront when it comes to ratings. The most successful thing about the AE is that the high ratings converted into high PPV buys. That doesn't happen today. WWE is unable to convert its television audience into a PPV purchasing audience. WWE gets around 4 million viewers a week yet only 170,000 people on average buy a PPV. That's more concerning but I guess it's fair when you consider the less hyped B and C PPV's they put on. But this years Summerslam is a worrying number for them. The ratings for both Punk/Lesnar and Cena/Bryan heading in were strong and indicated viewer interest in both matches. You would think that unlike NOC or Payback, people would be more likely to buy given it was Summerslam and 2 hyped matches were on the card. The buys come in and show a shocking result. Firstly that there is no correlation between ratings and PPV buys and secondly and it's essentially the same thing here, you can have big matches that you think are going to draw well and would naturally assume would draw well based on TV numbers yet when it comes to people actually having to part with their money to see the end result of what they've watched on TV, they don't. They don't want to see the end product. That's a bigger problem than dropping to 3.5 million viewers the odd time during their lowest point of the wrestling year.

@Swagger - If a tirade of Cesaro marks go around parading him to be the saviour of wrestling he'll get shat on just like Punk and Bryan are getting shat on. If they don't though, then he'll get the ADR treatment most likely. Moral of the story, don't exaggerate and avoid dat hate 8*D.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

KO Bossy said:


> Never said they were the only one who start them.
> 
> Honestly, your post unfortunately just wreaks of justifications and double standards. It IS Punk's fault simply because he had a really long reign (despite being booked as the clear and distant #2 to Cena). However, its NOT Bryan's fault that he's been gifted this once awesome, now dwindling storyline that people on this site were raving about, and that he'd been getting the majority of the attention in this entire story, being put clearly into the #1 position while Cena is out, and having previously gone over Cena the cleanest anyone ever has.
> 
> So...Bryan is the #1 babyface, beat the top guy and got handed the torch, has been going over everyone cleanly, and is the center of a giant story, one of the hottest in years. Why exactly is he free of guilt? Because he doesn't have a 434 day reign where he played second fiddle to someone else more important than him? All I see is one thing: both guys are in very prominent positions, getting very big pushes and being the biggest centers of attention. Ergo, either both or neither deserve blame. I hate this logic that Punk does deserve it, but Bryan doesn't. The fact of the matter is that neither are bringing in new viewers to boost up numbers. Its the same people who tune in every week. That's a failing for both of them.
> 
> Punk fans had to endure it, now Bryan fans are. People constantly made fun of Punk marks for excusing him. Well, now people are making fun of Bryan marks for doing the same thing. I have no sympathy for one side crying foul when a type of ammunition is used against them that they themselves had no problem using before.
> 
> And saying "LO-fucking-L about that" is just another petty form of one-upmanship. Like you're saying "put that in your pipe and smoke it." Do you have this need to get the last word in or something? Does it bother you that much when people rag on Bryan? Apparently it does. Without fail, whenever someone says something bad about him, its like your first instinct is to distribute more praise to balance the scales in his favor or something. For me, it doesn't bother me a lot anymore that Punk gets so much hate, but I will absolutely say something when the hate he gets is because of something that people will defend someone else for.
> 
> Its kind of amusing, I know you've always felt like I'm this hidden Punk mark who you can't ever see sticking up for Bryan or anything. You've said it a few times. Truth is, I do enjoy Punk a lot, way more than Bryan, but I'll always be fair to both of them when I can be. Same can't be said for the marks, however. Bryan marks drive me absolutely insane and I'll freely admit it. Marks in general annoy me, but Bryan's irritate me the most by far. And contrary to popular belief, I have spoken out against ridiculous claims made by Punk fans before. However, this idea that Bryan is absolved of blame right now...doesn't fly. You can agree or disagree with me, its really not my decision. I'll continue to feel how I do, just how all of you will continue to feel how you do.


Are you serious dude?

You come in here and every other post of yours is you playing "dad" and telling all of us that everyone here is "ruining this thread" and people should stop slinging shit at one another. On it's own, that is fine, if that's what you want to do.

However, then you come here and pretty much give Punk marks a pass for doing exactly what you bitch about every other post re: trolling and getting underneath other people's skin. You can't have it BOTH ways. You either hate what we do here, or condone BOTH parties doing it. You can't say it's okay for one set of marks to antagonize but not the other. That's like a parent allowing one of his kid's to antagonize the other, yet not allowing the other to stand up for him/herself. That's complete and total bullshit. Either condone it or don't condone it. You can't condone just a certain half of it. Especially when you come on this thread everyother day and let us know how much you don't approve of our posts.

I never absolved Bryan of ALL credit OR blame. Anytime I say something like, "BRYAN GETTING DEM RATINGS" is tongue in cheek. I thought that would be pretty obvious with the caps and the use of the word "dem," since I never type like that in any other situation. Sure, he derseves a good bit of credit sometimes, and sometimes he doesn't. Just like Punk. Just like anyother wrestler. But AGAIN, the funny part is, you get on ME for typing those silly, tongue planted firmly in cheek posts, but never get on Punk marks for doing the same. Gee, what a coincidence!

Just don't come on here trying to act like "dad," and then later on, pick one side. Either join the fray or don't. But don't try to pull this bullshit like you're better than everyone on here AND then have the NERVE to ever so subtlely join the fray. You can't have it both ways.


----------



## superuser1

FreakyZo said:


> If its anybody to blame its Orton....nobody has given a shit about him since 2009 and I like Orton. Smackdown 2011 is all I need to say


All Orton's matches since he turned heel have all gotten good numbers except for the one he had with Christian on the Raw after Summerslam. And Daniel Bryan has been doing good consistently so I'm confused on why their segment did so poorly. It doesn't make any sense.


----------



## KingLobos

I don't know why you all are arguing. Nobody in the WWE is a draw besides Undertaker, Cena, Triple H, and Brock Lesnar (Losing steam fast).

It's like you are arguing who is the worst team in baseball. It doesn't really matter what ratings Punk and Bryan pull in. They both aren't good at it, and probably never will be.


----------



## dualtamac

Do they not release the breakdowns for overall viewership, not just the 18-49 male demo??


----------



## funnyfaces1

Ah, Rock316AE. What a character. Dude was always here until Punk proved to him that he can draw, which was when his head exploded. I would have liked him more if he didn't always red rep people all the time.


----------



## Starbuck

KingLobos said:


> I don't know why you all are arguing. Nobody in the WWE is a draw besides Undertaker, Cena, Triple H, and Brock Lesnar (Losing steam fast).
> 
> It's like you are arguing who is the worst team in baseball. It doesn't really matter what ratings Punk and Bryan pull in. They both aren't good at it, and probably never will be.


But if they didn't argue I'd have nothing to :lol at when I need a break from my studies. 

You guys keep fighting the good fight! Phil Punk Brooks and Daniel Bryan Danielson are so proud of all of you.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

Rock316AE's passion to prove that Rock was a bigger draw than Austin was pretty fucking inspiring.


----------



## funnyfaces1

His Twitter account was hilarious. Ultimately though, he really was nothing more than a big bully.

:ryback


----------



## Starbuck

Truth! Guy needs to go into politics. Talk about a cult of personality...

unk


----------



## The Cynical Miracle




----------



## Biast

Anyone who thinks that Punk and/or Bryan can't draw is beyond retarded in my honest opinion. As you can see, in the past 6 months only their segments, the Cena's ones and the part timers' ones are gaining viewers. The mid card, the tag titles, the Divas, the fucking backstage segments, all of that is losing viewers, and the WWE should blame themselves along with their piss poor booking! When you book retardedly everything except the main event scene you should expect viewers and ratings only for Punk, Bryan, Cena and the guys who are feuding with them. The rest of the show is all just filler crap which is why the WWE should feel lucky to be above 2.0 ratings when 70% of their show doesn't lead to anything! Dat ''creative'' lmao) team.

Side note: Anyone that doesn't recognise that Punk has been drawing some big numbers since last December are trying way too hard to prove a point they cannot prove.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

This thread was high level when it was all about Big Nashy Kevin Sex

EDIT: Guess I can't post vids yet 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GgE2XD8w0Vc


----------



## Biast

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> This thread was high level when it was all about Big Nashy Kevin Sex
> 
> EDIT: Guess I can't post vids yet


Fixed, and you're welcome. :sandow


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Biast said:


> Fixed, and you're welcome. :sandow


ily


----------



## Londrick

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> This thread was high level when it was all about Big Nashy Kevin Sex
> 
> EDIT: Guess I can't post vids yet
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GgE2XD8w0Vc


Just like wrestling in general. The Nash Era = GOAT period of wrestling. Much better than this vanilla midget era we currently having to deal with.


----------



## JY57

Vince is desperate if rumor is he wants to return to TV next week instead of waiting for November. He did the same thing last year after the 10/1 2.54 disaster, came back the following week to TV. It worked for one day but than his consecutive appearance thereafter didn't matter anymore. So not sure what he thinks is going to change except for one week


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Dunmer said:


> Just like wrestling in general. The Nash Era = GOAT period of wrestling. Much better than this vanilla midget era we currently having to deal with.


It's ironic that they're calling this the "Reality Era" because in reality these hipster gnomes would get their lunch money taken and then be stuffed into lockers by Nash/Hall/Psycho Sid/Earthquake/The Bastion Booger


----------



## Londrick

Paul needs to get his buddy Nash on the phone and convince him to save the business again. #nashforchamp2014


----------



## stonefort

With the ratings, I'm wondering if Boring Daniel Bryan can be fixed. It's still weird to feature a guy with a gimmick of being intentionally Boring. I think Boring Daniel Bryan is a decent guy, it's not his fault he's so bland and dull.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

JY57 said:


> Vince is desperate if rumor is he wants to return to TV next week instead of waiting for November. He did the same thing last year after the 10/1 2.54 disaster, came back the following week to TV. It worked for one day but than his consecutive appearance thereafter didn't matter anymore. So not sure what he thinks is going to change except for one week


I'm genuinely puzzled by the fact that Vince HAS to realize that business was best when wrestlers were given much more leeway to develop their own characters/cut their own promos, and all of the angles were booked by 2 people at most, but for some reason he's been keeping on with this "creative committee" (aka a revolving door of hack soap opera writers) for the past 12 years...


----------



## Loudness

Dunmer said:


> Just like wrestling in general. The Nash Era = GOAT period of wrestling. Much better than this vanilla midget era we currently having to deal with.


The only chance they can make it is if Big Kev makes a star out of those manlets.






I heard every chat with Kevin Nash gives you an inch of height. 6 chats = half a foot = turns a manlet into a manmore. Imagine the heights D Bryan could reach if he had Kevin Nash as his manager...he could touch the sky.


----------



## mblonde09

Maybe, the TV audience are getting tired of seeing a grown man shouting "YES" repeatedly, like an irritating, over-excited child... because when Bryan isn't wrestling, then that's pretty much all you're going to get from him.



markedfordeath said:


> I will say this though, Bryan has the brightest long term potential, it'll just take a little longer than expected. *But he gets the biggest cheers*, so I guess if you're WWE you just work with it and write a good program that you don't fuck up. I think they gave in to the complaining moms and that's why the plotholes are being covered up right now. Like why was Shawn's name dropped when he hasn't shown up yet? where is the fired referee? why hasn't Triple H been talking with Bryan lately? that sort of thing, they just stopped it altogether.


Nope.


----------



## markedfordeath

i thought the WWE didn't care about ratings that much because the USA Network pays them no matter what...guess we know the truth.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

ShowStopper '97 said:


> Are you serious dude?
> 
> You come in here and every other post of yours is you playing "dad" and telling all of us that everyone here is "ruining this thread" and people should stop slinging shit at one another. On it's own, that is fine, if that's what you want to do.
> 
> However, then you come here and pretty much give Punk marks a pass for doing exactly what you bitch about every other post re: trolling and getting underneath other people's skin. You can't have it BOTH ways. You either hate what we do here, or condone BOTH parties doing it. You can't say it's okay for one set of marks to antagonize but not the other. That's like a parent allowing one of his kid's to antagonize the other, yet not allowing the other to stand up for him/herself. That's complete and total bullshit. Either condone it or don't condone it. You can't condone just a certain half of it. Especially when you come on this thread everyother day and let us know how much you don't approve of our posts.
> 
> I never absolved Bryan of ALL credit OR blame. Anytime I say something like, "BRYAN GETTING DEM RATINGS" is tongue in cheek. I thought that would be pretty obvious with the caps and the use of the word "dem," since I never type like that in any other situation. Sure, he derseves a good bit of credit sometimes, and sometimes he doesn't. Just like Punk. Just like anyother wrestler. But AGAIN, the funny part is, you get on ME for typing those silly, tongue planted firmly in cheek posts, but never get on Punk marks for doing the same. Gee, what a coincidence!
> 
> Just don't come on here trying to act like "dad," and then later on, pick one side. Either join the fray or don't. But don't try to pull this bullshit like you're better than everyone on here AND then have the NERVE to ever so subtlely join the fray. You can't have it both ways.


:clap:clap:clap


----------



## Osize10

Dunmer said:


> The brightest potential goes to Reigns. He's the only guy on the current roster who has a chance of reaching the likes of Cena, Austin, Rock, Hogan, etc.


Da fuq. If that ever happens, I'll finally know when to stop watching wrestling.


----------



## TheStig

I recently watched an interview with Vince from off the record that was made when they competed with wcw. He said something along the lines that wcw had better ratings but ratings wasn't everything and they did everything else besides tv ratings better. He mentioned that both merchandise and live events are important. Deciding if a wrestler can draw tv ratings is not the whole picture. Drawing is the same as making the company money so you have to look at the company as a whole and from my understanding they are making great money and probably even making more money every year with both expanding raw and making more shows.

Oh im at the ratings thread. 
Cm punk cant draw!

Edit - spelling


----------



## SpaceTraveller

Dunmer said:


> The real culprit is Vacant. Fans obviously don't care about him holding the title in 2013.


Nope, he has barely been featured on TV, he's playing second fiddle to everyone. He TBD has had more TV time than Vacant. You can't blame Vacant for crappy booking.


----------



## markedfordeath

the company is very profitable no matter what, i'm sure everyone that is in a position of importance right now is making them obscene amounts of money.


----------



## KO Bossy

ShowStopper '97 said:


> Are you serious dude?
> 
> You come in here and every other post of yours is you playing "dad" and telling all of us that everyone here is "ruining this thread" and people should stop slinging shit at one another. On it's own, that is fine, if that's what you want to do.
> 
> However, then you come here and pretty much give Punk marks a pass for doing exactly what you bitch about every other post re: trolling and getting underneath other people's skin. You can't have it BOTH ways. You either hate what we do here, or condone BOTH parties doing it. You can't say it's okay for one set of marks to antagonize but not the other. That's like a parent allowing one of his kid's to antagonize the other, yet not allowing the other to stand up for him/herself. That's complete and total bullshit. Either condone it or don't condone it. You can't condone just a certain half of it. Especially when you come on this thread everyother day and let us know how much you don't approve of our posts.
> 
> I never absolved Bryan of ALL credit OR blame. Anytime I say something like, "BRYAN GETTING DEM RATINGS" is tongue in cheek. I thought that would be pretty obvious with the caps and the use of the word "dem," since I never type like that in any other situation. Sure, he derseves a good bit of credit sometimes, and sometimes he doesn't. Just like Punk. Just like anyother wrestler. But AGAIN, the funny part is, you get on ME for typing those silly, tongue planted firmly in cheek posts, but never get on Punk marks for doing the same. Gee, what a coincidence!
> 
> Just don't come on here trying to act like "dad," and then later on, pick one side. Either join the fray or don't. But don't try to pull this bullshit like you're better than everyone on here AND then have the NERVE to ever so subtlely join the fray. You can't have it both ways.


I'm sinister. That's clearly what it is.

For the record, I already have several Punk marks on ignore so that's probably why I don't get on them-I don't see their posts period, so how can I comment?

But whatever, its passed and I'm not going to get into another fight about it.


----------



## TheStig

markedfordeath said:


> the company is very profitable no matter what, i'm sure everyone that is in a position of importance right now is making them obscene amounts of money.


Ye and if cena and punk is not the ones making them the most im not sure who is.


----------



## markedfordeath

Punk, Bryan, Orton, Cena make them tons of money.. even Ziggler does, which they don't want to admit lol


----------



## LovelyElle890

This thread is boring when only Punk and Bryan marks fight. Needs more Starbuck and Orton marks in the mix.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Starbuck graciously made her presence this morning. Even indirectly buried Punk in the WM XXX thread by inexcusably omitting Punk from her preferred Mania card. Can't wait for her to review Battleground when things go crazy in the main event.


----------



## KO Bossy

I speak on behalf of the Triple H marks when I say that its obvious the ratings spike from Summerslam to NoC was due to the Game being dat epic heel.

The GOAT Nose is a draw, plain and simple. :HHH2


----------



## Jof

Was this observer posted yet? 



> - On Monday's Raw, it was teased that Paul Heyman wanted to marry Ryback after being "saved" by the former Skip Sheffield at Night of Champions. Instead, Heyman proposed that he become the latest "Paul Heyman Guy." Vince McMahon was behind a shock tactic taking place on the program, as he made it clear to members of the writing staff that *they feature "a spectacle" to lure viewers of ESPN's Monday Night Football away during halftime.* An unnamed creative writer then pitched the idea of teasing Heyman asking Ryback his hand in marriage.


Smart move.


----------



## markedfordeath

they're lucky it worked though, because a big part of the country is still homophobic.


----------



## Jof

Homophobes probably enjoyed that segment considering it was sorta mocking it.


----------



## cl_theo

mblonde09 said:


> Maybe, the TV audience are getting tired of seeing a grown man shouting "YES" repeatedly, like an irritating, over-excited child... because when Bryan isn't wrestling, then that's pretty much all you're going to get from him.
> 
> 
> Nope.


Better than a grown man who acts like whiny teenager rebel inside and outside the ring, because he thinks he's all that. Just because the "man" acts like that,, doesn't mean his marks should too.


----------



## #Mark

Was the opening segment the lowest of the year?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

#Mark said:


> Was the opening segment the lowest of the year?


Nope. I believe it got the same as the cutting edge segment from a few weeks ago, and that one where Barrett/Bryan opened did lower.


----------



## Sonnen Says

The Sandrone said:


> Nope. I believe it got the same as the cutting edge segment from a few weeks ago, and that one where Barrett/Bryan opened did lower.


I also believe Punk did the highest opening with a 3.8 rating this year. Not sure but I highly think so.


----------



## N-destroy

Mqwar said:


> Overrun did rebound but still bad. It definitely shows lack of interest considering Stephanie-Show backstage segment actually had a larger peak viewership.


So the prospect of Show knocking out HHH had more interest than Orton/Bryan promo, is it?


----------



## Mqwar

N-destroy said:


> So the prospect of Show knocking out HHH had more interest than Orton/Bryan promo, is it?


Yes that seems to be the case. I think taking hunter out of the feud is hurting them. IMO, something happened before Night of Champions PPV, because since then everything's changed in this angle. Think about it, right after the ppv Hunter goes tweener instead of a full blown heel(heck if not for the Big show story going on you wouldn't even know HHH is a heel), Orton is out of the corporation and doing his own thing, Sheild is booked to lose against 11 guys, the title is vacated, Bryan/HHH barely interact etc.... something happened there which lead to these changes. It might be all those facebook, twitter bullying complaints or Vince changing his mind week to week... who knows? Not good though. 




Sonnen Says said:


> I also believe Punk did the highest opening with a 3.8 rating this year. Not sure but I highly think so.



The highest(since torch started tracking m18-49 demo) rated Q1 is the opening promo between Triple H, Orton and Bryan where HHH presents Orton with the cadillac. The highest rated overrun is from the same RAW with Triple H ordering the shield to attack Bryan, while holding back the roster with Show, Ziggler and Miz from helping him, that drew 2.89 rating. Highest Q9 is Punk/heyman promo exchange on RAW 19 August, which was a fall out from the angle they did with Heyman and Axel beating down punk with Kendo stick, while he lays handcuffed. 

Evidently Punk/heyman angle still seems to be performing well (although half time is a significant advantage), lot has changed in the corporation storyline. They need to get it back on track and quick.


----------



## markedfordeath

people hated HHH the night after NOC for stripping Bryan of the title...he's been focusing on the Rhodes thing. People don't want him in every goddamn segment on the TV screen, so its happening by only having him on for the Rhodes thing. After Battleground he'll probably go back to the title picture especially if Bryan wins it tomorrow night. my prediction is a Shield face turn or at least from one of their members after the Rhodes clearly win it tomorrow night.


----------



## Mqwar

What people are you exactly talking about? People in here? the forum? WWE doesn't give a shit about that.


----------



## markedfordeath

facebook complaints, the insider writers, all of that.


----------



## Mqwar

Facebook/Twitter complaints likely had a lot of impact in their decisions, because that's something WWE monitors regularly. Insider news BS are irrelevant.


----------



## validreasoning

interesting article on the top 9 shows on cable. it includes dvr playback numbers which is something you never really think about and gives us an idea of the real viewership figures

March 4, 9 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.8 million viewers 
March 4, 10 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.4 million viewers
March 4, 8 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.4 million viewers
Feb. 25, 8 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.4 million viewers
March 11, 8 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.4 million viewers
March 11, 9 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.3 million viewers
Feb. 25, 9 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.2 million viewers
Feb. 25, 10 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.2 million viewers
March 11, 10 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.1 million viewers

http://www.buzzfeed.com/kateaurthur/walking-dead-duck-dynasty-ratings


----------



## markedfordeath

yeah, those DVR numbers probably push Raw to over 3.0 every week which is awesome for them.


----------



## DesolationRow

Antonio Cesaro is the best thing since sliced bread and outdraws everyone else! He is the present and future of pro wrestling!!!1 Look at dem ratings he's drawing all on his own and look at him throw Khali around like a toy!!!!1 Come at me bros. I'm ready.


----------



## D.M.N.

validreasoning said:


> interesting article on the top 9 shows on cable. it includes dvr playback numbers which is something you never really think about and gives us an idea of the real viewership figures
> 
> March 4, 9 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.8 million viewers (5.2 million, +0.6 million)
> March 4, 10 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.4 million viewers (4.8 million, +0.6 million)
> March 4, 8 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.4 million viewers (5.0 million, +0.4 million)
> Feb. 25, 8 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.4 million viewers (4.9 million, +0.5 million)
> March 11, 8 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.4 million viewers (5.0 million, +0.4 million)
> March 11, 9 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.3 million viewers (4.9 million, +0.4 million)
> Feb. 25, 9 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.2 million viewers (4.7 million, +0.6 million)
> Feb. 25, 10 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.2 million viewers (4.6 million, +0.6 million)
> March 11, 10 p.m. episode (Live+7 rating): 5.1 million viewers (4.6 million, +0.5 million)
> 
> http://www.buzzfeed.com/kateaurthur/walking-dead-duck-dynasty-ratings


This is the first time we have ever seen Live+7 day numbers for Raw. In brackets above is the Live+SD rating to 1.d.p. and the increase too.

This is just three weeks in March. Back ten years ago, virtually everyone would watch Raw live as the technology was not available.

If Raw is increasing half a million from same day to +7 day, that is a fair big amount that is not factored in - about 10 percent of the audience.

Why no one ever reports live+7 for Raw, I don't know.

EDIT, for those three episodes in terms of ratings:

Feb 25th - 3.46 rating / 4.71 million ---> *3.9 rating / 5.3 million*
March 4th - 3.52 rating / 5.02 million --> *3.9 rating / 5.5 million*
March 11th - 3.34 rating / 4.81 million --> *3.7 rating / 5.3 million*

Yeah...


----------



## JY57

http://www.f4wonline.com/more/more-...oh-tickets-biggest-news-stories-of-september-



> --Neilsen will be debuting its new Twitter ratings for TV starting this week.


----------



## JY57

http://adf.ly/X7p5N



> The 10/4 edition of Smackdown did 2,513,000 viewers, down from last week.


down from 2,631,000 from week before. # 2 on Cable though behind the MLB Playoffs


----------



## markedfordeath

i'm sure Cena will work wonders being on Smackdown now...ugh!


----------



## Apex Predator

It's good to see Cena back.


----------



## WWE

3.0 Ratings incoming :HHH2


----------



## Ace

Cena back to save em ratings :cena2


----------



## #Mark

Punk Fan said:


> Cena back to save em ratings :cena2


Good to see Bryan lasted two months until they brought Cena back. Remember what happened the week Cena took time off during Punk's reign?
http://whatculture.com/wwe/wwe-raws-worst-rating-in-15-years-a-good-or-a-bad-thing.php
http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2012/1023/557382/ryback/

:lmao


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Yep, just like dat awesome drawing Cena title reign earlier this year.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Viewership/Rating should be up significantly if we're following the trend that the numbers are around last year's (which got a 2.8 this week... viewership I'm not sure of off the top of my head). Overrun number should be great.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

I hope Del Rio gets the biggest gain just to see Bryan and Punk marks cry.


----------



## Happenstan

rabidwolverine27 said:


> I hope Del Rio gets the biggest gain just to see Bryan and Punk marks cry.


I hope I get abducted by a group of horny hot ass women from the future after all men have died out wanting me to re-populate the planet one hottie at a time but that shit isn't happening.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Cut ADR some slack, most guys don't really start getting over until around their 7th or 8th World title reign.


----------



## JY57

> Monday's WWE Raw scored the lowest Social Media Activity of the year for a post-PPV episode.
> 
> Raw scored 256,024 in social activity, according to Trendrr.TV, which was lower than the previous post-PPV low of 267k the night after Extreme Rules in May.
> 
> In a week-to-week comparison, Raw was up 15 percent compared to last week's social media activity leading into Battleground. In a yearly comparison, Raw was down 9 percent compared to the 2013 average.
> 
> Raw ranked #3 on cable TV Monday night behind the NFL Monday Night Football game and the Braves-Dodgers MLB Playoffs game.
> 
> Post-PPV Raw Break Down
> 
> - Jan. 28 post-Rumble Raw - 389,815 social activity (+86.5 percent vs. previous week)
> 
> - Feb. 18 post-Chamber Raw - 286,986 social activity (+7.0 percent vs. previous week)
> 
> - Apr. 8 post-WM29 Raw - 518,787 social activity (+69.2 percent vs. previous week)
> 
> - May 20 post-E. Rules Raw - 267,714 social activity (+18.3 percent vs. previous week)
> 
> - June 17 post-Payback Raw - 323,847 social activity (+56.5 percent vs. previous week)
> 
> - July 15 post-MITB Raw - 355,138 social activity (+24.5 percent vs. previous week)
> 
> - Aug. 19 post-SSlam Raw - 377,874 social activity (+44.9 percent vs. previous week)
> 
> - Sept. 16 post-NOC Raw - 271,819 social activity (+9.5 percent vs. previous week)
> 
> - Oct. 7 post-BG Raw - 256,024 social activity (+14.8 percent vs. previous week)


via PWTorch


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

> Monday's WWE Raw scored the lowest Social Media Activity of the year for a post-PPV episode.


Dat Corporation angle... 

:lmao


----------



## superuser1

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Dat Corporation angle...
> 
> :lmao


Thats what they get for making Big Show out of everybody the vocal point of this storyline smh


----------



## Cliffy

This is what happens when you put anti-draws in prominent roles :HHH2 unk2


----------



## markedfordeath

Big Show sucking the life out of it...I love how they're doing what's best for business but it ends up being the opposite. Vince get the fuck in that creative room and take back control.


----------



## WWE

:bryan2 unk


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

How many times will Bryan and Punk torpedo the ratings before Vince realises he never needs to push anyone ever again while Cena still lives?


----------



## markedfordeath

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> How many times will the McMahons and Big Show torpedo the ratings before Vince realises he never needs to push anyone ever again while Cena still lives?


Fixed


----------



## mblonde09

markedfordeath said:


> *Big Show sucking the life out of it*...I love how they're doing what's best for business but it ends up being the opposite. Vince get the fuck in that creative room and take back control.


Bryan and Orton already sucked the life out of this angle weeks ago, with both their mediocrity, and inability to handle a big storyline, and carry a show. Why do you think they've bought HHH back, and they're going to bring Michaels into it? Orton and Bryan aren't getting it done on their own - proven by the rating for their "face-to-face" segment, last week.


----------



## markedfordeath

yeah and that's why they keep putting Bryan in main event matches and that he might win the title in three weeks, because they hate his guts and he can't carry a show.


----------



## Londrick

Mr. 2.2 marks talking about ratings. :ti


----------



## Stannis Baratheon.

big show is really hurting this angle imo.


----------



## superuser1

mblonde09 said:


> Bryan and Orton already sucked the life out of this angle weeks ago, with both their mediocrity, and inability to handle a big storyline, and carry a show. Why do you think they've bought HHH back, and they're going to bring Michaels into it? Orton and Bryan aren't getting it done on their own - proven by the rating for their "face-to-face" segment, last week.


Where were you when Punk was champion in 2011?


----------



## markedfordeath

Big Slow is just going to lose to Triple H any way..and having Michaels involved in this puts Bryan even more over...Michaels is the one that has been telling Vince for years to push the guy.


----------



## dan the marino

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Dat Corporation angle...
> 
> :lmao


That's what happens when you have an awful ppv with no build up and nothing much to talk about.

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Alo0oy

Cena conveniently returns after the World Series...


----------



## Happenstan

superuser1 said:


> Where were you when Punk was champion in 2011?


And 2012.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Happenstan said:


> And 2012.


The fact is the show was horrible and was filled with nobody's you cant blame Punk for that. I dont know how Punk is supposed to carry the show for 3 hours I think anyone with a brain knows it's impossible.


----------



## Happenstan

Sonnen Says said:


> The fact is the show was horrible and was filled with nobody's you cant blame Punk for that. I dont know how Punk is supposed to carry the show for 3 hours I think anyone with a brain knows it's impossible.


But Bryan's supposed to carry the show despite terrible booking and a 2 month push. Right. I swear I don't know how you Punk fans manage simple day to day activities like wiping your asses....excuse me, mouths. That's where all your shit spews from.


----------



## markedfordeath

exactly..and they blame Bryan, he's supposed to carry the whole three hours too? the booking is too confusing......its like back and forth with him....they show him strong, then weak, strong then weak, too confusing.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Happenstan said:


> But Bryan's supposed to carry the show despite terrible booking and a 2 month push. Right. I swear I don't know how you Punk fans manage simple day to day activities like wiping your asses....excuses me mouths. That's where all your shit spews from.


Last year booking was much worst. Bryan has HHH, McMahon's, Show, Orton, Punk, Cena, The Shield etc. Punk had nothing last year compared to this year. The booking is not really the problem both Bryan and Orton don't have the personality to make it interesting at least Cena brought that to Bryan but Bryan cant bring that neither does Orton.


----------



## markedfordeath

blah blah, not making sense again...you are a hypocrite, reread what you keep posting.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Sonnen Says said:


> Last year booking was much worst. Bryan has HHH, McMahon's, Show, Orton, Punk, Cena, The Shield etc. Punk had nothing last year compared to this year. The booking is not really the problem both Bryan and Orton don't have the personality to make it interesting at least Cena brought that to Bryan but Bryan cant bring that neither does Orton.


Punk has nothing even when he has something.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

To be fair, playoff baseball added with MNF has to have some effect on WWE. They are all competing for that young male demo.


----------



## markedfordeath

the Bryan hate is still astonishing to me....He fucking went up to a 7 year old cancer patient last night after Raw...he's an awesome guy....he didn't have to do that. How can someone hate that guy?


----------



## KO Bossy

markedfordeath said:


> the Bryan hate is still astonishing to me....He fucking went up to a 7 year old cancer patient last night after Raw...he's an awesome guy....he didn't have to do that. How can someone hate that guy?


I've got no problem with Bryan Danielson the person, he seems like a cool guy. I've got a lot of problems with Daniel Bryan the wrestling character. Big difference.


----------



## Sonnen Says

markedfordeath said:


> blah blah, not making sense again...you are a hypocrite, reread what you keep posting.


I dont need to reread anything. Bryan isnt supposed to carry the show because he's not that guy but some of you Bryan marks believe that he can carry the company when he doesnt have it in him. Bryan is a great wrestler but the guy has no personality or mic skills to make people interested in him neither does Orton. He can talk but not really a guy that I want to see talk.



Best4Bidness said:


> Punk has nothing even when he has something.


He has something? You call Axel and Ryback something


----------



## markedfordeath

I'm just glad Cena is out of the limelight for once. And he could actually share the spotlight instead of making it about him....lets hope this trend continues. WHC is a lowly title so hopefully he can stay on that level for now.


----------



## JY57

Hour 1 - 3.694 million
Hour 2 - 3.739 million
Hour 3 - 3.685 million

Avg - 3.706 million


----------



## Choke2Death

The Orton hour got the biggest number. :mark: rton2

(Don't remember what else was on in that hour so others can fill me in)


----------



## JY57

^ didn't watch but results say Punk/Heyman/Ryback/Axel/Truth and Kofi/Orton. I think thats it


----------



## markedfordeath

once again, the main event and the Punk segment are the only things worth watching.


----------



## KO Bossy

Choke2Death said:


> The Orton hour got the biggest number. :mark: rton2
> 
> (Don't remember what else was on in that hour so others can fill me in)


Sorry be we ALL know who the thanks for that belongs to unk2


----------



## LilOlMe

Happenstan said:


> But Bryan's supposed to carry the show despite terrible booking and a 2 month push. Right. I swear I don't know how you Punk fans manage simple day to day activities like wiping your asses....excuse me, mouths. That's where all your shit spews from.


In fairness, I remember how utterly cocky you were, talking about how Bryan will be different than Punk as far as ratings are concerned, and "just watch" and all of that.

You'd shit on Punk for being a failure, yet had no proof that Bryan would be any better.

Always thought it was kind of brazen, since we really _couldn't_ know for sure, and now what's happening with Bryan is eerily similiar to what was happening with Punk. But we're supposed to pretend that's not the case, and you're twisting in the wind with justifications. I'm not saying that there aren't justifications in Bryan's case -- there are. But there are in Punk's case as well, and it's just markdom to pretend that there isn't, or that the justifications in one case take precedence over the other.

Now they're in virtually the same type of position, so people argue over decimal points because it's all about not backing down from a previous position and fear. Has nothing to do with an honest conversation, which is more akin to what I said before:


> It just goes to show you that storylines matter, and all of the drawing arguments are so stupid.
> 
> People shat on Punk when he supposedly "didn't draw." Now look, he's involved in an interesting storyline, and it's totally engaging and drawing viewers.
> 
> Hogan's face act had gotten so stale and old that it wasn't drawing much for WCW. Then suddenly he turns heel, and is involved in a huge storyline, and they start creaming the WWF.
> 
> So what was the problem? Does it mean that Punk and Hogan were bad draws, or was it that creative was to blame? It's the latter.
> 
> Orton vs. Christian had no real selling point and was random and wasn't even announced, so it didn't do well in the ratings. Orton vs. Cody had a great selling point and was announced, and it did great. See how that works?
> 
> People will always try to use what they can for mark wars, but there's so much that goes into "drawing."


And it's all really ridiculous when you watch the reactions from week to week. Someone goes from bad draw to good draw to bad draw to good draw...it's all so absurd.


----------



## markedfordeath

yeah you're right, bad booking has nothing to do with anything......both were booked bad..i hate creative with a passion.


----------



## JY57

down from last year in viewership which was the Vince vs CM Punk show.

this year - 3.706 million with between 2.7 to 2.8 rating and last year - 4.11 million with a 2.80 rating.


----------



## markedfordeath

WWE needs to get exciting again!


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Ouch, terrible numbers. Wonder who the blame will be put on this week since Punk wasn't on the show much at all.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

unk / :vince II please. The numbers are just calling for it.

Bryan, Orton, Show and Triple H are just failing all over the place.



> Wonder who the blame will be put on this week since Punk wasn't on the show much at all.


Wouldn't make sense to blame him anyway considering he tops the night constantly without even being in the main event angle. The blame goes to DAT MAJOR CORPORATE STORYLINE~!


----------



## markedfordeath

i knew that would bring you out to troll us again! who cares about this shit, WWE is tanking itself. And its no surprise Bryan/orton has taken a back seat..its the Stephanie/Big Show show now.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Wouldn't make sense to blame him anyway considering he tops the night constantly without even being in the main event angle. The blame goes to DAT MAJOR CORPORATE STORYLINE~!


Well yeah, but people blame him anyway.


----------



## JY57

The Sandrone said:


> Ouch, terrible numbers. Wonder who the blame will be put on this week since Punk wasn't on the show much at all.


third lowest number of the year and lowest Post-PPV RAW of the year so far


----------



## markedfordeath

what corporate storyline? there's no such thing anymore. Bryan/Orton is a separate feud now....that's been obvious since last week. Its not as important as Triple H and Stephanie and Big Show....but yet Bryan gets the blame again...I give up!


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

Didn't Bryan stand tall over Triple H doing his stupid Yes taunt to close the show? Yes, he's still a part of it as is Orton. This "huge" storyline runs the entire show, and yet can't bring in any successful numbers for shit.

These guys need to step it up. unk and :heyman2 can't just carry the show on their own forever.


----------



## markedfordeath

doesn't change the fact that they put the focus square on the McMahons and Big Show.....everyone is pissed off about that...I hope the rating keeps going down, serves them right for that shitty ppv and the shitty shows they've given us..they even reduced Punk to a guy that gets talent over....Raw is a joke. Bryan and Punk should go to ROH, they'd be treated better, since they get blamed for everything...which is irritating.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

Vacant cant draw.


----------



## JY57

final rating - 2.65 (lowest of the year)


----------



## markedfordeath

sweet! take that McMahons..selfish assholes..demote anyone on the roster you want, wont' change the fact that your writing team sucks ass..hope it gets a 2.25 next week.


----------



## Sonnen Says

JY57 said:


> final rating - 2.65 (lowest of the year)


If I'm not mistaken last year it did 2.8 and also the 2.65 rating happened earlier this year.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

JY57 said:


> final rating - 2.65 (lowest of the year)


----------



## stonefort

Boring Daniel Bryan. Bringing the Dull! Bringing the Bland! Bringing the embarrassing, goofy, stupid, Yes Chants!

You can't have a comedy gimmick as the main event. It will never work.
The Yes! chants are fine for a mid-card comedy geek. Not a main eventer.


----------



## markedfordeath

its cool.....another decade of Cena at the top....no big deal. Watching him win Rumbles and Wrestlemanias all the time, that'll drive business up....fucking WWE


----------



## checkcola

The show was centered around Big Show, how many damn times did they replay the opening segment?


----------



## markedfordeath

shhh, they dont care, its automatically Bryan's fault, everything is. Apparently it is, this is how this mark wars thing works, right? which if they want to play that game, 2012 had a 2.54 ratings in late 2012, guess that was Punk's fault. *rolls eyes*


----------



## Choke2Death

lol @ Punk marks who make excuses for their guy when ratings are bad with him as centerpiece but blame the main angle now not taking into account that other than the main angle itself (and Punk/Heyman I guess), the rest of the show is no different than it was last year.



checkcola said:


> The show was centered around Big Show, how many damn times did they replay the opening segment?


Pretty much.

If anyone deserves blame from everyone in the main angle, it's Big Show by far. Lol @ blaming Orton when he only had a random match in a random spot and minor interference in the middle of the main event. And I wouldn't blame Bryan either since he only appeared in the main event with 6 or so other people.

The angle has been losing momentum and the numbers are showing it too (although with MNF and past history, they would've probably gone down anyways). And it's all because they've put more and more focus on Big Show's dilemma.


----------



## markedfordeath

yet Orton and Bryan will get demoted and Cena and whoever will get the rub, probably Triple H.


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

The main storyline is garbage and crying big show turned people away.


----------



## superuser1

Big Show should get %100 of the blame here. Everyone knew he would show up again at the end after getting fired and by the look of things they weren't interested in seeing that.


----------



## markedfordeath

they're so desperate, they change the storylines from week to week....they'll do something one Raw, then change it the next as if it never happened.


----------



## KingLobos

Awful


----------



## SarcasmoBlaster

I know people will put this at the feet of Daniel Bryan, because this thread is the worst that internet fandom has to offer, but WWE on the whole has been terrible lately. Some of it is lack of Cena, sure. One would expect a dip there. But the entire main even angle has been botched to high heaven. If you have 2 PPVs in a row where you don't give people a definitive outcome, they stop giving a shit. Shocking, I know.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

It's all Cody's fault.  Just wanted to break up the groundhog day posting of Punk vs Bryan ad nauseam.


----------



## superuser1

Not to mention people are probably tired of not getting a legit outcome out of the Daniel Bryan/Randy Orton feud. I mean what is this? The second ppv in a row where no champion has been crowned? The title should've never went vacant in the first place. It seems like both Bryan and Orton are chasing the title when it really should've been just Bryan chasing the title.


----------



## MaybeLock

Come on guys, you all knew when Henry got injured that ratings would drop. Just wait for him to come back and ratings will go through the roof. :henry1


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

WWE only had one good angle to begin with. It's not like anyone else is going to draw, as is being evidenced.


----------



## markedfordeath

well at least now they have two new people to blame the next buyrate on...


----------



## #Mark

Damn, the ratings are almost as bad as they were last year. You know there's a cause for concern when ratings dip close to the embarrassing ratings Punk was drawing during his title reign.


----------



## Choke2Death

ShowStopper '97 said:


> WWE only had one good angle to begin with. It's not like anyone else is going to draw, as is being evidenced.


What are you smoking? If CM PUNK was in Bryan's place, the ratings would have been in the 4s now! unk


----------



## markedfordeath

this is what happens when no one is champion....two more Raws until HIAC, expect the same ratings..they should just have a tournament on Raw..but nope.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Choke2Death said:


> What are you smoking? If CM PUNK was in Bryan's place, the ratings would have been in the 4s now! unk


The only "4" Punk would bring to WWE now is fore-closure.


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

They need more feuds with proper storylines and serious characters. To much of the show is joke filled with comedy jobbers.


----------



## markedfordeath

I guess they'll just wait it out until January.


----------



## KO Bossy

Choke2Death said:


> lol @ Punk marks who make excuses for their guy when ratings are bad with him as centerpiece but blame the main angle now not taking into account that other than the main angle itself (and Punk/Heyman I guess), the rest of the show is no different than it was last year.


Yeah, and how many Punk haters tried to pin it all on Punk last year instead of talking about the other high profile programs that were happening at the time like you're now doing with Bryan (trying to shift blame onto Punk and Heyman for being a big feud, but clearly not as big as the main event)? The correct answer is all of them. Nobody cut Punk any slack, and so his marks tried to. Now people don't want to cut Bryan and slack, and his marks are trying to. In both cases, people are wrong. But stop trying to make it seem like the Punk marks are so delusional or committing a crime of some sort. I vividly remember you being one of those guys who had no problem criticizing Punk for the ratings. Don't see you criticizing Bryan...Perhaps its because you hate Punk, but like Bryan?

Right now, Bryan is no better than Punk last year. Both guys are failing to bring in new viewers and get them interested into what's going on. They're not ratings killers like the divas or Del Rio, but they're not draws either. The fans who already watch tune in for their segments, but hooking in people who are already fans isn't terribly impressive. 

Anyway, I agree with the consensus who say that Big Show deserves the brunt of this blame. It was an idiotic idea for them to make him a pivotal part of this angle, and now they're reaping what they sow.


----------



## markedfordeath

don't forget Triple H, who can't make up his mind if he's good or bad.


----------



## KO Bossy

markedfordeath said:


> this is what happens when no one is champion....two more Raws until HIAC, expect the same ratings..they should just have a tournament on Raw..but nope.


Ratings for the weeks in 1998 when there was no champion:

September 28-4.0
October 5-4.55
October 12-4.8
October 19-5.0
October 26-4.5
November 2-4.8
November 9-5.0

So, yeah...this isn't what happens when there's no champion, this is what happens when writing and booking both suck.


----------



## Choke2Death

KO Bossy said:


> Yeah, and how many Punk haters tried to pin it all on Punk last year instead of talking about the other high profile programs that were happening at the time like you're now doing with Bryan (*trying to shift blame onto Punk and Heyman for being a big feud, but clearly not as big as the main event*)? The correct answer is all of them. Nobody cut Punk any slack, and so his marks tried to. Now people don't want to cut Bryan and slack, and his marks are trying to. In both cases, people are wrong. But stop trying to make it seem like the Punk marks are so delusional or committing a crime of some sort. I vividly remember you being one of those guys who had no problem criticizing Punk for the ratings. Don't see you criticizing Bryan...Perhaps its because you hate Punk, but like Bryan?


Once again, you're imagining things with the bold part since I _never_ said anything like that. Just another one of your attempts to try to make look like a troll or some other shit.

As for blaming Bryan for the ratings... I'm no mark for him so I don't care about white-knighting him. I'll say he has not become a draw or anything like that but that doesn't happen overnight AND THE FOCUS HAS SHIFTED FROM HIM. Now it's become more about Triple H and Big Show. (Bryan's push has been what, 3 months now? Punk's push had been going on for over a year when his reign was committing ratings genocide) Therefore, Bryan deserves some slack as it is _right now_ with him not being the focal point of the show. In the summer, that point could be made since he appeared numerous times every week. Now, not so much.

In Punk's case, it was all about him. I remember reading the results (since I quit watching then) and every week I would see him involved in all the special slots (opener, 9PM, backstage segments, main event). THAT'S why he got much more blame. The angles were also almost solely focused on Punk with legends coming out to put him over in promos and all of that. My problem here is not Bryan getting blamed and not Punk or whatever you're spewing. I just find it funny that the Punk marks would make excuses last year and blame everything except him for the bad numbers yet here they are, complaining about Bryan (and everyone else who is getting pushed) because ratings are falling. We no longer hear the "but the rest of the show sucks" excuses like it was the case with Punk. Let's not forget that Punk marks have been shown contradicting themselves numerous times.


----------



## markedfordeath

what exactly were they trying to accomplish with this booking? I mean who in their right mind thought any of this shit was going to work?


----------



## WWE

JY57 said:


> final rating - 2.65 (lowest of the year)


----------



## Stannis Baratheon.

not surprised its been a downward spiral since summerslam. i really liked the potential of this angle, but its getting harder and harder to support it with the big shows involvement.


----------



## markedfordeath

*sigh* guess that never gets old.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Ah yes, time for Cena to get 0.3 back. DAT THREE TENTHS OF A POINT. SUCH A HUGE DEAL FOR DA WWE.

:HHH2


----------



## KO Bossy

Choke2Death said:


> Once again, you're imagining things with the bold part since I _never_ said anything like that. Just another one of your attempts to try to make look like a troll or some other shit.
> 
> As for blaming Bryan for the ratings... I'm no mark for him so I don't care about white-knighting him. I'll say he has not become a draw or anything like that but that doesn't happen overnight AND THE FOCUS HAS SHIFTED FROM HIM. Now it's become more about Triple H and Big Show. (Bryan's push has been what, 3 months now? Punk's push had been going on for over a year when his reign was committing ratings genocide) Therefore, Bryan deserves some slack as it is _right now_ with him not being the focal point of the show. In the summer, that point could be made since he appeared numerous times every week. Now, not so much.
> 
> In Punk's case, it was all about him. I remember reading the results (since I quit watching then) and every week I would see him involved in all the special slots (opener, 9PM, backstage segments, main event). THAT'S why he got much more blame. The angles were also almost solely focused on Punk with legends coming out to put him over in promos and all of that. My problem here is not Bryan getting blamed and not Punk or whatever you're spewing. I just find it funny that the Punk marks would make excuses last year and blame everything except him for the bad numbers yet here they are, complaining about Bryan (and everyone else who is getting pushed) because ratings are falling. We no longer hear the "but the rest of the show sucks" excuses like it was the case with Punk. Let's not forget that Punk marks have been shown contradicting themselves numerous times.


Well to be fair, as others say in defense of Bryan, Punk's segments usually gained viewers and did well, ratings wise...

And yeah, we do hear the complaints that the rest of the show sucks because it does. It doesn't help that the main event is sucking as well. However, the ones saying the rest of the show sucks are Bryan defenders.

Its the same shit as last year, but a different target. Punk marks took it last year from everyone, including Bryan marks, and now Bryan marks are taking it this year from Punk marks. Cycle of life. The fact is that in both cases, they're not bringing in the new viewers, but they're not driving them away in their segments. That's what the majority of the rest of the show does. And with good reason, because it sucks.


----------



## markedfordeath

so is HBK Bryan's Nash?


----------



## Mqwar

Does anyone watch the game here? Why did they move Punk/Ryback to 9PM? And 10PM with Del Rio of all people? which almost certainly guarantees viewers loss? A18-49 viewership also peaked at 9, the pointless random tag match with R Truth couldn't have had that level of interest, surely not over the main angle involving the big show. Whats the deal there? I hope Torch reports how many viewers swtiched over from the game and at what time. They didn't last week. 

Overall though, not a good rating. But they faced heavy competition with NFL that drew a strong 11 million viewers and MLB playoffs close to 4m. Three hour show is just too long to hold viewer's interest, last year had the same problem. Cena's return isn't going help them anyways.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Choke2Death said:


> Once again, you're imagining things with the bold part since I _never_ said anything like that. Just another one of your attempts to try to make look like a troll or some other shit.
> 
> As for blaming Bryan for the ratings... I'm no mark for him so I don't care about white-knighting him. I'll say he has not become a draw or anything like that but that doesn't happen overnight AND THE FOCUS HAS SHIFTED FROM HIM. Now it's become more about Triple H and Big Show. (Bryan's push has been what, 3 months now? Punk's push had been going on for over a year when his reign was committing ratings genocide) Therefore, Bryan deserves some slack as it is _right now_ with him not being the focal point of the show. In the summer, that point could be made since he appeared numerous times every week. Now, not so much.
> 
> In Punk's case, it was all about him. I remember reading the results (since I quit watching then) and every week I would see him involved in all the special slots (opener, 9PM, backstage segments, main event). THAT'S why he got much more blame. The angles were also almost solely focused on Punk with legends coming out to put him over in promos and all of that. My problem here is not Bryan getting blamed and not Punk or whatever you're spewing. I just find it funny that the Punk marks would make excuses last year and blame everything except him for the bad numbers yet here they are, complaining about Bryan (and everyone else who is getting pushed) because ratings are falling. We no longer hear the "but the rest of the show sucks" excuses like it was the case with Punk. Let's not forget that Punk marks have been shown contradicting themselves numerous times.



Last year viewership was higher than this year by the way. You saying Punk was committing ratings genocide is just you exaggerating like always. You make it sound like Punks reign had those numbers from the start to the end of the year it only got low numbers in October/December and it wasnt like the numbers where the same every week. It was up and down because the show had nothing. Also Punk didn't mainevent every show he mainevented only in occasions while Cena was still the focus of the show with the main angles because if you really paid attention Punk was injured and was there just cutting promos. There was no serious angles compared to this year it was just Punk and then just Cena while the rest of the show was filler. The fact that you just watched the result shows how clueless you're about the show.

By the way last year it did 2.8 compared to this week. It's funny you always try to show Punks numbers and speak about Bryan and forget the fact that Orton is there in the main angle because he should be blamed as much as Bryan because he shows up more than once in the show.


----------



## LovelyElle890

I'll tell you who is to blame for the ratings. It's not Punk, Bryan, Orton, Big Show, or HHH. Only one man is capable of tanking RAW with the mere mention of his return. That's right, that man is John Cena. :cena3

Even if it's not true, I say we roll with this because watching Punk and Bryan marks go at it is boring.


----------



## markedfordeath

if the ratings stays the same for next week with John Cena returning, then there you go, nobody can save it.


----------



## Irish Jet

To be fair, they were up against GENO the GOAT.


----------



## stonefort

Maybe Boring Daniel Bryan should try being 10% less Boring.
Worth a try.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

^Yes, as opposed to all of those exciting WWE characters littered all over the roster..


----------



## JY57

markedfordeath said:


> if the ratings stays the same for next week with John Cena returning, then there you go, nobody can save it.


he most likely isn't returning until the PPV (as he said himself).


----------



## markedfordeath

I got it! Heel HBK and the Cerebral Assassin HHH feuding with Bryan would be better television..scrap the corporation BS altogether. Or have Bryan and Punk join forces..thats' what they should have done....blown opportunity.Guess there's still time for the latter post HIAC


----------



## Ace

markedfordeath said:


> I got it! Heel HBK and the Cerebral Assassin HHH feuding with Bryan would be better television..scrap the corporation BS altogether. Or have Bryan and Punk join forces..thats' what they should have done....blown opportunity.Guess there's still time for the latter post HIAC


 Not even Punk can save the mess that is the corporation angle. 

The whole angle makes no sense at all :lol

Inceptioned :trips2


----------



## markedfordeath

they really should have gone with Bryan and Punk..they still can..but I doubt they will.


----------



## Oakue

Well can you blame people for not tuning in? I think yesterday was the first time in about a month Big Show wasn't slobbering his wet whale like tears all over the place.


----------



## Choke2Death

KO Bossy said:


> Well to be fair, as others say in defense of Bryan, Punk's segments usually gained viewers and did well, ratings wise...
> 
> And yeah, we do hear the complaints that the rest of the show sucks because it does. It doesn't help that the main event is sucking as well. However, the ones saying the rest of the show sucks are Bryan defenders.
> 
> Its the same shit as last year, but a different target. Punk marks took it last year from everyone, including Bryan marks, and now Bryan marks are taking it this year from Punk marks. Cycle of life. The fact is that in both cases, they're not bringing in the new viewers, but they're not driving them away in their segments. That's what the majority of the rest of the show does. And with good reason, because it sucks.


So have most of the important segments from this year. Yet Punk marks talk about how bad the ratings are because of Bryan/Orton/whoever else.

Way to change the subject. I don't care whether the show sucks or whatever, I'm just saying it was an excuse being used by Punk marks last year, this year, they still seemingly think the show sucks (except whatever Punk does, that's the rule) but put the full blame on the main event angle.

Punk marks took it from Bryan marks last year? LOL, what a load of crap. You make Bryan marks sound like the Antichrist or something and I don't even like most of them. Last year there were hardly any Bryan marks in this thread other than a few trolls who talked about "DA GOAT BRINGING DA RATINGZ". Most of the abuse Punk marks took were actually from Rock fans and others who simply can't stand CM Punk. Just because they are feuding with Bryan marks now, doesn't mean it was the case then.


----------



## superuser1

Sonnen Says said:


> Last year viewership was higher than this year by the way. You saying Punk was committing ratings genocide is just you exaggerating like always. You make it sound like Punks reign had those numbers from the start to the end of the year it only got low numbers in October/December and it wasnt like the numbers where the same every week. It was up and down because the show had nothing. Also Punk didn't mainevent every show he mainevented only in occasions while Cena was still the focus of the show with the main angles because if you really paid attention Punk was injured and was there just cutting promos. There was no serious angles compared to this year it was just Punk and then just Cena while the rest of the show was filler. The fact that you just watched the result shows how clueless you're about the show.
> 
> *By the way last year it did 2.8 compared to this week. It's funny you always try to show Punks numbers and speak about Bryan and forget the fact that Orton is there in the main angle because he should be blamed as much as Bryan because he shows up more than once in the show.*


Well to be fair in Orton's case when was the last time he main evented Raw? And last night he popped up rkoed Bryan than disappeared in less than 10 seconds.


----------



## Londrick

If they really want to bring up the ratings they need to start pushing guys have the look, charisma and actually belong in the ring. The Indy Darling/Vanilla Midget experiment has failed. Go back to what worked with guys like Hogan, Austin, Cena, etc. Guys like Punk and Bryan are good little guys who can put on a good match but it's basically filler.


----------



## KO Bossy

Choke2Death said:


> So have most of the important segments from this year. Yet Punk marks talk about how bad the ratings are because of Bryan/Orton/whoever else.
> 
> Way to change the subject. I don't care whether the show sucks or whatever, I'm just saying it was an excuse being used by Punk marks last year, this year, they still seemingly think the show sucks (except whatever Punk does, that's the rule) but put the full blame on the main event angle.
> 
> Punk marks took it from Bryan marks last year? LOL, what a load of crap. You make Bryan marks sound like the Antichrist or something and I don't even like most of them. Last year there were hardly any Bryan marks in this thread other than a few trolls who talked about "DA GOAT BRINGING DA RATINGZ". Most of the abuse Punk marks took were actually from Rock fans and others who simply can't stand CM Punk. Just because they are feuding with Bryan marks now, doesn't mean it was the case then.


Fine, whatever you say. I honestly don't even know why I'm arguing the point, I'm not a Punk mark so it doesn't apply to me. The guys I mark for aren't even employed by the WWE...actually, they don't even wrestle anymore (oh and one is dead).


----------



## Sonnen Says

Dunmer said:


> If they really want to bring up the ratings they need to start pushing guys have the look, charisma and actually belong in the ring. The Indy Darling/Vanilla Midget experiment has failed. Go back to what worked with guys like *Hogan, Austin, Cena, etc.* Guys like Punk and Bryan are good little guys who can put on a good match but it's basically filler.


Cena doesn't belong there or even Hogan I want someone like Austin and Rock to represent me I cant stand staleness if you know what I mean. I dont think there is anything wrong with Punk he has the mic skills, ring skills, charisma, personality and the storytelling all he needs is big victories to matter because thats how Cena got there anyway. Bryan is good for what he is a Benoit booking is what he needs not this cooperate shit its for a guy who has a personality and mic skills. The closest thing to that is Punk or maybe Barrett (turns face) if he improves a little more in the ring or... I cant think of anyone tbh. I will love Sandow to change his gimmick like maybe next year, this current gimmick even tho I love it doesnt or may not work for him as a Main Eventer he's a great mic worker with tons of potential obviously so I think there will be a time where he's gonna turn to :HHH :side:


----------



## Choke2Death

KO Bossy said:


> Fine, whatever you say. I honestly don't even know why I'm arguing the point, I'm not a Punk mark so it doesn't apply to me. The guys I mark for aren't even employed by the WWE...actually, they don't even wrestle anymore (oh and one is dead).


Well, you responded to me first so you should have the answer to the question. Although you always love sticking up for Punk marks, so that might be why we're arguing.

As for being a mark, didn't you post this?



KO Bossy said:


> 1. Stone Cold Steve Austin
> 2. Rowdy Roddy Piper
> 3. Kurt Angle
> 4. The Rock
> 5. Undertaker
> 6. Triple H
> 7. Mick Foley and all his incarnations
> *8. CM Punk*
> 
> 
> Can't think of 2 more.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

Punk and Bryan can't DRAW end of thread.


----------



## WWE

Just imagine if the ratings increase back to a 3 when Cena returns.


----------



## KO Bossy

Choke2Death said:


> Well, you responded to me first so you should have the answer to the question. Although you always love sticking up for Punk marks, so that might be why we're arguing.
> 
> As for being a mark, didn't you post this?


Yeah, I'm pretty sure that was in a thread of guys I'd tune in for or that I enjoy...something along those lines. And its true. Punk got me back into wrestling in 2011 when I heard news of his pipebomb and people were saying it was must see. So in that regard, I guess he does hold a special place for me. 

However, what I say by mark tends to deviate from the usual definition. I'm a fan of Punk's, yeah. That doesn't mean him showing up on screen makes me go into ultra fan mode and enjoy what I'm seeing simply due to the fact that he's doing it. The only guys that get that kind of reaction out of me are Austin, Piper, Savage (who's dead), Dusty and Angle. With them, when they show up on my screen, I halt everything I'm doing and I become the fan I was in 1999-2000. Innocent, uninformed and easy to please. For example, seeing Dusty hit that Bionic Elbow on Sunday was the hardest I've marked in a long damn time. 

Hunter makes the list as well, but that's assuming he's a heel. I can live without face Hunter. Once upon a time, so did Rock, but that was killed off.

Anyway, yeah, I enjoy Punk's work a good amount of the time, but he doesn't make that list.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

I made a Punk marks vs Bryan marks thread in rants. So go tear each other apart and have fun.


----------



## doctor doom

I don't care about ratings, but I do hope that they continue to plummet until Daniel Bryan is gone from the main event scene.. BUT for some of you to compare numbers from the late 90's and early 2000's to today is just absurd. There isn't the fan base that there once was. Kids today DON'T WATCH WRESTLING. My generation (mid-late 20s) didn't have online video games (except 56k PC) to keep them occupied instead of watching Nitro. That was all there was to do on a Monday night after Toonami (GUNDAM POWER!). There are too many alternatives and I don't think wrestling will be popular again for a long time. You can blame the internet and technology in general.


----------



## Freakaleak

LMAO At the Punk vs. Bryan war on here. No one even cares to hate on Cena last year. If this was a few years ago and they announced his return fans on this message board would be slitting their wrists. Now the IWC has turned on each other.


----------



## Happenstan

LilOlMe said:


> In fairness, I remember how utterly cocky you were, talking about how Bryan will be different than Punk as far as ratings are concerned, and "just watch" and all of that.
> 
> You'd shit on Punk for being a failure, yet had no proof that Bryan would be any better.


Wrong-o. I said that Bryan would be in a better position than Punk is in IF he gets the same push Punk got. He's had 2 months not 2 years. He's tying Mr. 2 Years draw wise already. So wait, and "just watch."




KO Bossy said:


> Ratings for the weeks in 1998 when there was no champion:
> 
> September 28-4.0
> October 5-4.55
> October 12-4.8
> October 19-5.0
> October 26-4.5
> November 2-4.8
> November 9-5.0
> 
> So, yeah...this isn't what happens when there's no champion, this is what happens when writing and booking both suck.



Are you really quoting ratings from 15 years ago as proof of your argument? Damn son. I didn't realize you needed to win every argument THAT desperately.





Wrestlinfan35 said:


> These guys need to step it up. unk and :heyman2 can't just carry the show on their own forever.


Like how they carried the show into the ditch last week?


----------



## markedfordeath

do you still think Bryan is in a good position? I'm actually starting to get a little peeved that him and Orton are becoming forgotten about now.


----------



## Hotdiggity11

KO Bossy said:


> Ratings for the weeks in 1998 when there was no champion:
> 
> September 28-4.0
> October 5-4.55
> October 12-4.8
> October 19-5.0
> October 26-4.5
> November 2-4.8
> November 9-5.0
> 
> So, yeah...this isn't what happens when there's no champion, this is what happens when writing and booking both suck.





Because 2013 and 1998 are comparable when it comes to ratings?


----------



## Happenstan

markedfordeath said:


> do you still think Bryan is in a good position? I'm actually starting to get a little peeved that him and Orton are becoming forgotten about now.


Most likely. It took Punk 2 years to draw more than flies. Bryan ties him after 2 months. It took Austin almost a year from turning into SCSA to drawing ratings. WWE knows it takes time and that's with good story telling. This Big Slow shit is dull and HHH always going over everybody sux too. That's why Monday night happened. Bryan's not gonna be the number 1 guy, that's John SeenIt's crown, but he'll be the number 2 guy with Punk right behind him at #3. Nothing wrong with that at all. Unlike Cena and Punk, they still have a plethora of feuds to book Bryan in to once this HHH/Steph ego stroke is over.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

doctor doom said:


> I don't care about ratings, but I do hope that they continue to plummet until Daniel Bryan is gone from the main event scene.. BUT for some of you to compare numbers from the late 90's and early 2000's to today is just absurd. There isn't the fan base that there once was. Kids today DON'T WATCH WRESTLING. My generation (mid-late 20s) didn't have online video games (except 56k PC) to keep them occupied instead of watching Nitro. That was all there was to do on a Monday night after Toonami (GUNDAM POWER!). There are too many alternatives and I don't think wrestling will be popular again for a long time. You can blame the internet and technology in general.


Yeah, video games and the Internet are really KILLING the WWEs ratings, just absolutely MURDERING them, almost STRANGLING and SMOTHERING them and then COMMITTING SUICIDE right after.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

I wonder if they'll break the "lowest rating in 15 years" record this year?

I have faith.


----------



## wb1899

A18-49 viewership:
8:00: 1,638,000 (+38,000)
9:00: 1,753,000 (+89,000)
10:00-11:05: 1,715,000 (-25,000)
Average: 1,702,000 (+34,000)


----------



## Cmpunk91

Well they need to bring Punk back into an interesting storyline, and have the main focus on bryan and Orton with the title not hhh. Then maybe the ratings will grow again.


----------



## MaybeLock

Dunmer said:


> If they really want to bring up the ratings they need to start pushing guys have the look, charisma and actually belong in the ring. The Indy Darling/Vanilla Midget experiment has failed. Go back to what worked with guys like Hogan, Austin, Cena, etc. Guys like Punk and Bryan are good little guys who can put on a good match but it's basically filler.


You say that like finding a star like Austin or Hogan is easy. We´d be lucky if we ever get someone with their charisma in the main event again. As far as Punk goes, he´s good in that department, specially as heel. With Bryan I have more doubts, but well, he´s not been in the Main Event for that long, he might get better with time.

As I said, it´s not that we have too many charismatic guys in the roster waiting to take that spot, anyway.


----------



## roadkill_

MaybeLock said:


> You say that like finding a star like Austin or Hogan is easy. We´d be lucky if we ever get someone with their charisma in the main event again. *As far as Punk goes, he´s good in that department, specially as heel.* With Bryan I have more doubts, but well, he´s not been in the Main Event for that long, he might get better with time.
> 
> As I said, it´s not that we have too many charismatic guys in the roster waiting to take that spot, anyway.


Drawing dead heat is considered 'good' now? :lol


----------



## MaybeLock

roadkill_ said:


> Drawing dead heat is considered 'good' now? :lol


I was only talking about charisma and mic skills. Bryan gets tremendous reactions from the crowd and that doesn't mean that he´s in the Hogan level of charisma or something like that. When Punk was heel people simply wanted to cheer for him, like it has happened before with other heel turns like Austin, Rock or Hogan. Hell, it´s happening with HHH, he´s drawing a lot more heat than I expected, but he still has a lot of fans that like him and will cheer for him when he comes out.


----------



## validreasoning

roadkill_ said:


> Drawing dead heat is considered 'good' now? :lol


you do realise your signature is completely wrong right??

wwf raw on january 2nd 1995 drew a 2.1 rating


----------



## JY57

Sonnen Says said:


> If I'm not mistaken last year it did 2.8 and also the 2.65 rating happened earlier this year.


the other one was 2.66 on June 3 against Game 7 of the NBA Eastern Conference Finals


----------



## 4everEyebrowRaisin

At the end of the day, it's always the main event storyline that's supposed to draw the ratings. Shifting the blame onto Punk is just pointless. I wasn't aware that what's essentially a mid-card feud is supposed to be the big draw now... or are people just pulling that excuse out of their buttholes for convenience? 

The top guys aren't doing what they're supposed to. Bryan, Orton, HHH, Big Show, Steph and The Shield are the primary focus right now and the ratings are absolutely sucking.

Also, I think a lot of it has to do with the whole roster. They just don't have the starpower necessary to interest an audience and they're just boring. I'm a big CM Punk fan and even I can say he's been absolutely sucking as of late, his matches and promos have really gone down in quality. 

They need legit Superstars and good storylines.


----------



## Mqwar

> Also, I think a lot of it has to do with the whole roster. They just don't have the starpower necessary to interest an audience and they're just boring.


Agreed with this, the first part. They desperately starpower. Losing Sheamus, Henry, Cena to injury at the same time took its toll. Orton, for instance ever since turning heel hasn't faced any credible opponent other than Bryan, Orton vs Sheamus positioned on top of the hour slot is something that could draw viewers. Even if there isn't a significant bump in the ratings, the roster would atleast have some credibility.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

Happenstan said:


> Like how they carried the show into the ditch last week?


Wait, didn't they get the biggest segment of the night? :lmao It was your boy toy and Orton who gave RAW the worst overrun in two months, as well as every other main angle segment that night bombing. Thank fuck for Heyman and CM GOAT.

Saying Bryan now has tied Punk. :lol The delusion. If that were the case Bryan wouldn't be bombing in main event segments while Punk is pulling in million+ gains in a program with Axel and Ryback. No real point in arguing this, though. 

I swear not a day goes by where these Bryan marks aren't butthurt about something.


----------



## Happenstan

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Wait, didn't they get the biggest segment of the night? :lmao It was your boy toy and Orton who gave RAW the worst overrun in two months, as well as every other main angle segment that night bombing. Thank fuck for Heyman and CM GOAT.
> 
> Saying Bryan now has tied Punk. :lol The delusion. If that were the case Bryan wouldn't be bombing in main event segments while Punk is pulling in million+ gains in a program with Axel and Ryback. No real point in arguing this, though.
> 
> I swear not a day goes by where these Bryan marks aren't butthurt about something.


That was two weeks ago during MNF's half time....it was also considerable luck considering what happened a week later. Last week was the Cm Punk show and it bombed son. The ratings went down faster than you would if Phil dropped his pants in your presence.

BTW Bryan pulled in a million + gain for a segment too but keep pretending like you don't already know that.


----------



## Londrick

People arguing about who draws more between Punk and Bryan is like debating who's less retarded in a Special Ed class. 



MaybeLock said:


> You say that like finding a star like Austin or Hogan is easy. We´d be lucky if we ever get someone with their charisma in the main event again. As far as Punk goes, he´s good in that department, specially as heel. With Bryan I have more doubts, but well, he´s not been in the Main Event for that long, he might get better with time.
> 
> As I said, it´s not that we have too many charismatic guys in the roster waiting to take that spot, anyway.


It's not easy but they already have a guy on their roster who can be the top guy and draw, Roman Reigns. He may not be the next Hogan or Austin but he certainly is the next Batista.


----------



## Sonnen Says

JY57 said:


> the other one was 2.66 on June 3 against Game 7 of the NBA Eastern Conference Finals


The other one says it's 2.65 I don't know where you brought that number.

http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2013/0606/563218/63-raw-breakdown-cena-vs-axel-rematch/



Dunmer said:


> People arguing about who draws more between Punk and Bryan is like debating who's less retarded in a Special Ed class.
> 
> 
> 
> It's not easy but they already have a guy on their roster who can be the top guy and draw, Roman Reigns. He may not be the next Hogan or Austin but he certainly is the next Batista.


The guy is too green to get that spot. You argue about size shit but UFC biggest draw right now is GSP. It's all about the booking and how you develop things, WWE are just struggling to know how.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Edit.....


----------



## Londrick

Sonnen Says said:


> The other one says it's 2.65 I don't know where you brought that number.
> 
> http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2013/0606/563218/63-raw-breakdown-cena-vs-axel-rematch/
> 
> 
> 
> The guy is too green to get that spot. You argue about size shit but UFC biggest draw right now is GSP. It's all about the booking and how you develop things, WWE are just struggling to know how.


He does still need to get some exp under his belt but within a few more months he'll be ready.

Yeah cause being a draw in a legit sport is the same as being one in a fake one.


----------



## markedfordeath

maybe now that Cena is back, people will stop blaming Bryan and Punk for the poor ratings and buyrates. If Hell in a Cell bombs now, then that means that wrestling just isn't popular and now everyone will know and stop blaming everyone. If a returning HBK and a returning Cena doesn't get buyrates, then its no one's fault but the WWE for not gripping any interest. But we should applaud the guys who did their best without starpower while the big stars have been injured, they're doing their best and they worked their asses off...now that Cena is back the pressure is on him to deliver and now he can be the one to carry the company.....takes the pressure off everyone else.


----------



## WWE

markedfordeath said:


> maybe now that Cena is back, people will stop blaming Bryan and Punk for the poor ratings and buyrates. If Hell in a Cell bombs now, then that means that wrestling just isn't popular and now everyone will know and stop blaming everyone. If a returning HBK and a returning Cena doesn't get buyrates, then its no one's fault but the WWE for not gripping any interest. But we should applaud the guys who did their best without starpower while the big stars have been injured, they're doing their best and they worked their asses off...now that Cena is back the pressure is on him to deliver and now he can be the one to carry the company.....takes the pressure off everyone else.



I can bet that Cena wont even turn until Hell In a Cell

But then again, I'm sure just the mention of Cena returning might raise some viewers wanting to turn in... but if he ain't there he can't get blamed


----------



## markedfordeath

but if he is there, then that means nobody should be blamed, because no one watches wrestling anymore...they're putting all their resources into HIAC to get the fans back, and if it still has a low buyrate, then you just have to wait it out until Rumble...


----------



## validreasoning

Dunmer said:


> He does still need to get some exp under his belt but within a few more months he'll be ready.


he is still quite a bit away from being ready for a mainevent singles push (which btw is no doubt coming). if you are using the batista example he wasn't pushed into the mainevent until 3 years after his debut on the main roster



> Yeah cause being a draw in a legit sport is the same as being one in a fake one.


real or fake doesn't make much difference in the grand scheme of things. ufc and wwe are still in the business of selling ppvs and arena tickets based on characters and angles. the nick diaz/gsp feud was pure old school pro-wrestling

mayweather is the biggest heel in sports right now


----------



## markedfordeath

how could any of you expect anyone to become a star with the stupid writers that they have? they'll probably end up ruining Reigns.....who in my opinion sucks in the ring.


----------



## validreasoning

to be fair one of those stupid writers ie david kreizman was the reason for bryans push from may till summerslam

kreizman left after the ppv (he wanted to leave in june but they convinced him to stay till summerslam). everythings gone to shit since with vince booking the shows


----------



## doctor doom

If they WWE wants to really increase ratings and buyrates, they need LESS PPV's a year and LESS weekly television. They need Smackdown to move back to Thursdays when people are actually home and to do away with Main Event. Have 5 or 6 PPV's a year, the Big 4 plus Starcade in December and KOTR in June. Not everyone has the money to shell out $50 a month for a PPV.


----------



## markedfordeath

i wonder what Kreizman's ideas would have been going forward if he never left then. And this proves that Vince has no sense of what the fans want anymore.


----------



## funnyfaces1

validreasoning said:


> you do realise your signature is completely wrong right??
> 
> wwf raw on january 2nd 1995 drew a 2.1 rating


On top of that, Cena/Del Rio was the main story that night. Punk was actually the one guy on that horrid 2.2 show that had an above average gain including the high spot.

Wait what am I saying? :henry1 :rock2 :HHH2 :kobe


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

funnyfaces1 said:


> On top of that, Cena/Del Rio was the main story that night. Punk was actually the one guy on that horrid 2.2 show that had an above average gain including the high spot.


That doesn't matter, man. Tha haterz~ will believe whatever they would like to believe. Meanwhile CM GOAT's just gonna GOAT.


----------



## JY57

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_73831.shtml



> Quarter-hour TV ratings for Monday's Raw following the Battleground PPV were below-average across the board. No segment during the regular portion of the show topped the "barometer" 2.0 rating in the males 18-49 demographic that we track.
> 
> Only the over-run segment - featuring the end of Team Bryan vs. The Shield and Big Show's return to knock out Triple H - scored above a 2.0. The segment scored a 2.30 rating, which was the highest over-run rating in three weeks.
> 
> During the regular portion of Raw, the show topped out at a 1.95 rating three times:
> 
> - Q3 for Brad Maddox announcing the WWE Title situation for Hell in a Cell.
> 
> - Q5 at the top of the second hour for this week's C.M. Punk-Paul Heyman segment.
> 
> - Q9 at the top of the third hour for Alberto Del Rio's match segment with Ricardo Rodriguez.
> 
> Raw quarter-hour ratings break down M18-49 demo
> 
> Q1: Raw started slow despite being the night after a PPV. Raw scored a 1.77 rating, which was the same as last week's Q1 rating on the PPV lead-in show, for Stephanie McMahon "firing" Big Show, plus one commercial.
> 
> Q2: Raw then scored a near-show-low 1.67 rating for Dolph Ziggler vs. Damien Sandow and one mid-match commercial.
> 
> Q3: Raw jumped to a 1.95 rating for Brad Maddox's WWE Title announcement. The segment also contained a six-Divas tag match, but, looking at the minute-by-minute ratings, Maddox's announcement boosted the quarter-hour. There was also one commercial in-between segments.
> 
> The segment peaked with a first-hour-high 1.405 million viewers at 8:43 p.m. for the conclusion of Maddox's announcement setting up Booker T's campaign promo.
> 
> Q4: Raw fell back to a 1.74 rating for Los Matadores in tag action, plus two full commercial breaks.
> 
> Q5: Raw rebounded to a 1.95 rating at the top of the hour for the Punk-Heyman segment, one commercial, and the first-half of Punk & R-Truth vs. Ryback & Curtis Axel.
> 
> Q6: Raw slipped to a 1.87 rating for the end of the tag match, one commercial, and Bob Backlund's campaign promo.
> 
> The segment was boosted by the end of the tag match, which topped out at a second-hour-high 1.454 million viewers at 9:17 p.m.
> 
> Q7: Raw slipped to a 1.80 rating for the drawn-out Randy Orton vs. Kofi Kingston match, plus one mid-match commercial. This was the lowest-rated segment of the second hour, although the audience did increase by small numbers throughout the match.
> 
> Q8: Raw increased to a 1.86 rating for Shawn Michaels's unadvertised return to campaign for the special referee role at Hell in a Cell, plus two full commercial breaks dragging down the rating.
> 
> The segment peaked with 1.397 million viewers at 9:54 p.m. when HBK wrapped up prior to the second commercial.
> 
> Q9: Raw got a top-of-the-hour bump to a 1.95 rating for Del Rio vs. Ricardo Rodriguez and the announcement of John Cena returning to WWE at Hell in a Cell to face Del Rio. There was also one commercial.
> 
> Q10: Raw fell to a 1.72 rating for Fandango vs. Zack Ryder, one commercial, and Real Americans vs. Santino & Great Khali. The matches averaged nearly the exact same viewership in the low-end 1.1 million-viewer range.
> 
> Q11: Raw fell to a show-low 1.66 rating for the brief and interrupted Miz TV segment, various promotional videos, the McMahons and Brad Maddox backstage, and two full commercials, which affected the rating.
> 
> Q12: Raw rebounded to a 1.87 rating for the Bryan & Rhodes vs. Shield main event, plus one mid-match commercial.
> 
> Q13: Raw finished with a 2.30 rating for the end of the six-man tag main event, Big Show's return after being "fired," and Show KO'ing Hunter to close Raw.


only the over-run got over 2.0 (even that was meh)


----------



## markedfordeath

CM Punk is being highly misused at the moment. Goes from number 2 storyline to number 3 because of fucking Big Show..Big Show is now number one, in 2013.....we should revolt this bullshit.


----------



## markedfordeath

And Heyman/Punk and Bryan carrying another Show....


----------



## Stad

Dunmer said:


> People arguing about who draws more between Punk and Bryan is like debating who's less retarded in a Special Ed class.
> 
> 
> 
> It's not easy but they already have a guy on their roster who can be the top guy and draw, Roman Reigns. He may not be the next Hogan or Austin but he certainly is the next Batista.


Maybe they should bring Kevin Nash back.

:ti


----------



## Jof

JY57 said:


> http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_73831.shtml
> 
> 
> 
> only the over-run got over 2.0 (even that was meh)


How is that a "meh"? look at the rest of the quarters, terrible numbers. Overrun grew 24% and the only part of the show to do 2.3 rating. Nothing came close. Overrun saved the show.


----------



## markedfordeath

The Rhodes, Bryan and the Shield saving that show.....


----------



## JY57

Jof said:


> How is that a "meh"? look at the rest of the quarters, terrible numbers. Overrun grew 24% and the only part of the show to do 2.3 rating. Nothing came close. Overrun saved the show.


this time last year the overrun got a 3.46 (not sure what the over-all rating for this is since its only 18-49 demo for this; but I assume it less than 3.0 judgining by previous notes) with gaining 1.233 million viewers meanwhile everything else did bad and was against MNF too. If the angle is a supposed draw than it should do something similar.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

Fact is know one can save this show.


----------



## markedfordeath

this is what happens when they keep changing shit up every week, no continuity.


----------



## stonefort

Boring Daniel Bryan, cause Bland is the new Black.


----------



## markedfordeath

yep boring Daniel Bryan who was in the highest rated segment....yep, such a boring guy lol


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

DAT BIG SHOW, DAT PUNK, DAT MADDOX, DAT CENA ANNOUNCEMENT

That's about it for this week.


----------



## markedfordeath

yeah but he shared the spotlight with R Truth, that's the only high segment R Truth will get his whole career LOL


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

Choke2Death said:


> The Orton hour got the biggest number. :mark: rton2





> Q7: Raw slipped to a 1.80 rating for the drawn-out Randy Orton vs. Kofi Kingston match, plus one mid-match commercial. *This was the lowest-rated segment of the second hour*, although the audience did increase by small numbers throughout the match.


:lmao It's kind of funny.

Dat CM GOAT though, with the biggest segment in the second hour. Once again, saving everybody's ass.


----------



## Jof

JY57 said:


> this time last year the overrun got a 3.46 (not sure what the over-all rating for this is since its only 18-49 demo for this; but I assume it less than 3.0 judgining by previous notes) with gaining 1.233 million viewers meanwhile everything else did bad and was against MNF too. If the angle is a supposed draw than it should do something similar.


The overrun rating should be around 3.1~3.2 overall. Last year they weren't up against competition this strong with both NFL and MLB playoffs. The angle is a draw, its carrying the show every week. The roster is so fucking weak right now compared to last year, If you take the punk angle out of this, then you basically got Usos, fundango, Miz, wyatt, Kofi, Ryder etc.. borderline jobbers all of them. Without the corporation the ratings would be all time low almost everyweek and Bryan will get the blame for it.


----------



## markedfordeath

now no one can get blamed, the golden boy is back.....


----------



## WhyMe123

Only the Jabroni beater can save the raw ratingz


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Dat CM Goat starting with a 1.95 and losing viewers to a 1.87 for his tag match. Dat Bryan growing his match from a 1.87 to a 2.3, and that's with a commercial break. Bryan breaks the 2.0 barrier yet again. The only number 2 Punk is smelling this week was that crap segment he was in.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

Bryan marks would give him the credit for the overrun. :lmao

"BIG SHOW KNOCKING OUT TRIPLE H? NOPE, WAT U TALKING ABOUT?"

Meanwhile, in reality, Bryan's "main event" matched Punk's tag match with three jobbers. Once again, that CM GOAT.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

TEAM BRYAN GETTING THE ONLY SEGMENT ON THE ENTIRE SHOW OVER 2.0

NO PROBLEM, BRUVS. HE'S HERE TO HELP.

:bryan

EDIT: OH AND LET'S NOT FORGET THAT 1.8 TO 2.3 GAIN.

DANIEL GOAT BRYAN MAKING GAINZ.


----------



## Jof

Well if you're going to credit Punk for the overrun number that Vince mcmahon actually drew last year, then bryan can be credited for this overrun.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

Can't wait till it starts to get 1.0 or anything lower than 2.0


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

Jof said:


> Well if you're going to credit Punk for the overrun number that Vince mcmahon actually drew last year, then bryan can be credited for this overrun.


What fucking sense does that make? :lmao

Punk = IN THE MATCH. Also sold the match with McMahon earlier in the night, in another high quarter segment.
Bryan = Shows up in the last minute and shouts yes.

I guess we see why they brought Big Show into the main angle. Orton and Bryan just can't cut it.


----------



## markedfordeath

huh? the overrun included the ending TO THE MATCH this week.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Bryan takes the overrun and closed the show with massive cheers that dwarfed the Carny Munchkin Punk.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Jof said:


> Well if you're going to credit Punk for the overrun number that Vince mcmahon actually drew last year, then bryan can be credited for this overrun.


Oh, come on. Vince has never been much of a draw :lmao :lmao :lmao

Vince has nothing on the Shield :lmao

Someone on the show had to do over a 2.0 Might as well be the match Bryan is in.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

markedfordeath said:


> huh? the overrun included the ending TO THE MATCH this week.


Wrong. The match ended at 10:58 and Big Show made his way out at 11:00.

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/raw/9...13-where-you-will-sports-entertained-240.html

The credit for the overrun goes to Big Show and Triple H alone. Believe what you want though.



> Someone on the show had to do over a 2.0 Might as well be the match Bryan is in.


Except his match didn't get over 2.0. :lol


----------



## Jof

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> What fucking sense does that make? :lmao
> 
> Punk = IN THE MATCH.
> Bryan = Shows up in the last minute and shouts yes.


It was actually Vince Mcmahon's first match on RAW since WM 26. Punk was doing 2.7s(overall not m18-49 demo :lol) overrun ratings before Vince. Thats why Vince returned back then. 

Bryan was essential part of the overrun, same as Punk.


----------



## markedfordeath

it says in the PWtorch thing that the overrun was the ending of the match plus Big Show's involvement..its right there in front of you.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

markedfordeath said:


> it says in the PWtorch thing that the overrun was the ending of the match plus Big Show's involvement..its right there in front of you.


:lmao


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

> Bryan was essential part of the overrun, same as Punk.


No he wasn't. :lmao What show were you watching?



markedfordeath said:


> it says in the PWtorch thing that the overrun was the ending of the match plus Big Show's involvement..its right there in front of you.


And the proof of when the match ended and when Big Show came out is right in front of you. 

These have to be some of the funniest, saddest posts I've seen.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

DANIEL BRYAN STANDING TALL TO END THE SHOW. Nah, not an important part of the overrun. Not at all. Who cares who ends the show on top, right?

:lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao

DAT BUTT-SORENESS

:yes


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

ShowStopper '97 said:


> DANIEL BRYAN STANDING TALL TO END THE SHOW. Nah, not an important part of the overrun. Not at all. Who cares who ends the show on top, right?
> 
> :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao
> 
> DAT BUTT-SORENESS
> 
> :yes


:lmao

This is a joke, right?

Bryan with that knock out punch on Bryan, with Bryan standing tall! DEM RATINGS

We're truly at the point where Bryan marks are just grasping at straws, and it's the best thing ever.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

Would this thread be open if Punk and Bryan were drawing 6.0 ratings and up ?


Even tho this will never happen.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Bryan marks would give him the credit for the overrun. :lmao
> 
> "BIG SHOW KNOCKING OUT TRIPLE H? NOPE, WAT U TALKING ABOUT?"
> 
> Meanwhile, in reality, Bryan's "main event" matched Punk's tag match with three jobbers. Once again, that CM GOAT.


So Ryback and the Intercontinental champion Curtis Axel are jobbers? By your logic, Punk is a jobber too.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> :lmao
> 
> This is a joke, right?
> 
> Bryan with that knock out punch on Bryan, with Bryan standing tall! DEM RATINGS


:lmao Who cares who punched him? People want to see how the show ENDS. And it ended with Daniel Bryan standing tall. The only joke is suggesting how the show ends isn't important.


----------



## dreamchord

markedfordeath said:


> CM Punk is being highly misused at the moment. Goes from number 2 storyline to number 3 because of fucking Big Show..Big Show is now number one, in 2013.....we should revolt this bullshit.


Big Show snapping on Triple H has been the best thing in WWE in ages. About time they rolled back Punk for a while, he's been in the main event or semi-main event for over 2 years straight


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

I just want to get it straight so I know how the logic of a Bryan mark works:

So, people saw Big Show fired earlier. People DON'T tune in for the main event, but they all come tuning in to the overrun, not because of Big Show coming back with a possible altercation with Triple H. Nope, they all came back to see what Daniel Bryan was going to do. 

Did I get that right?


----------



## Londrick

ShowStopper '97 vs Wrestlinfan35 =


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Yes, beacause the viewers just KNEW for a fact that Big Show was going to come out after being fired.

:lmao

The QH before the main event fell to a show low 1.66. The main event match rebounded to a 1.87, and the viewers gained into the overrun. It's not unreasonable at all to think it helped bring in more viewers in the overrun. If Punk was in Bryan's spot, Punk marks would be giving Punk all of the credit.


----------



## SPCDRI

1.77 with M 18-49 ratings to start the show.
1.67 for Ziggler/Sandow match

:vince3 and :HHH2 are shitting bricks!


----------



## rabidwolverine27

Dunmer said:


> ShowStopper '97 vs Wrestlinfan35 =


I wish I could rep you. :lol :lol :lol


----------



## Londrick

Stad said:


> Maybe they should bring Kevin Nash back.
> 
> :ti


Good point. WWE should bring back a guy that revolutionized the industry. He's done more good for wrestling than midgets like Bryan and Punk can only dream of.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

I wish Kevin Nash could read this thread.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

You could distribute some credit Bryan and co. for the overrun if the match did enter the overrun, but it didn't. It ended before the overrun began.

It's very easy to understand that really, the only two guys who get the credit for that overrun are Big Show and Triple H. That's really all there is to it.


----------



## Choke2Death

rabidwolverine27 said:


> I wish Kevin Nash could read this thread.


Someone should tweet it to him. "Look at those indy midget lovers arguing".


----------



## ChickMagnet12

Dunmer said:


> ShowStopper '97 vs Wrestlinfan35 =


:lmao

LOL ONLY 20K VIEWS SOUTH PARK CLEARLY CANT DRAW


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> You could distribute some credit Bryan and co. for the overrun if the match did enter the overrun, but it didn't. It ended before the overrun began.
> 
> It's very easy to understand that really, the only two guys who get the credit for that overrun are Big Show and Triple H. That's really all there is to it.


If Bryan didn't end the show standing tall, (or do anything on the screen in the overrun), then I wouldn't give him any credit. BUT, HE DID, so he gets some credit, without a doubt.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> I just want to get it straight so I know how the logic of a Bryan mark works:
> 
> So, people saw Big Show fired earlier. People DON'T tune in for the main event, but they all come tuning in to the overrun, not because of Big Show coming back with a possible altercation with Triple H. Nope, they all came back to see what Daniel Bryan was going to do.
> 
> Did I get that right?


You need to get your facts straight. It will help you be a more effective troll. HHH restarted the match. It ended after 11:00pm EST. Shows music hit around 11:01. The overrun had begun and people were tuning in to see how the show closed. When the overrun started the match was still going. The Big Show angle was the main focus of the overrun. But what was that lasting image WWE wanted the viewers to take away from the show. It was that Goat Bryan standing tall celebrating with the crowd. Oh that crowd pop must have really hurt, didnt it? :bryan


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

ShowStopper '97 said:


> If Bryan didn't end the show standing tall, (or do anything on the screen in the overrun), then I wouldn't give him any credit. BUT, HE DID, so he gets some credit, without a doubt.


That is a fair point. Originally, I was arguing about the match because somebody brought up the match went from 1.85 to 2.03, which isn't true since the match's entirety was in only one segment. Because Bryan was in the segment, and he still is the center of the storyline, albeit not as much as he once was, he deserves some credit as well. You're right about that. The most out of the three? I wouldn't say that.


----------



## doctor doom

ONLY 1 MAN CAN SAVE THE WWE


----------



## dreamchord

doctor doom said:


> ONLY 1 MAN CAN SAVE THE WWE


I think you meant...


----------



## markedfordeath

that's the WWE's fault for pushing Bryan out of the spotlight though. And I hope they pay the price for that. Fans want new stars being built, not the same people over and over again.


----------



## Theproof

WWE is a sinking ship. Will WWE go out of business?


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Once again. THE MATCH WAS RESTARTED AND ENDED AFTER 11:00. This is why the Torch article stated that the match ending was part of the overrun. You dont get to change the facts to suit your argument to help alleviate youe butthurt.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

:lol if people are taking everything here seriously. It's basically a troll thread. Some posts are serious, but I think it's quite obvious some aren't. This is in re: to the last page of the thread.


----------



## Londrick

Theproof said:


> WWE is a sinking ship. Will WWE go out of business?


Only if they keep on pushing Pizza Hut delivery drivers, and extras from Lord of the Rings.


----------



## markedfordeath

I want a Bryan/Barett feud or Bryan/Reigns feud for the WWE title, that "midget" can go against any tall guy on the roster.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

Theproof said:


> WWE is a sinking ship. Will WWE go out of business?


Nope they're not TNA.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

ShowStopper '97 said:


> :lol if people are taking everything here seriously. It's basically a troll thread. Some posts are serious, but I think it's quite obvious some aren't. This is in re: to the last page of the thread.


I sometimes fear that the only people who actually know this are you, Starbuck, Sandrone and myself.

WORKIN' THE MARKS.

:vince


----------



## MaybeLock

ShowStopper '97 said:


> :lol if people are taking everything here seriously. It's basically a troll thread. Some posts are serious, but I think it's quite obvious some aren't. This is in re: to the last page of the thread.


You broke the 4th wall! :lol Wrestlinfan35 vs Showstopper '97 always looked legit to me : 

They worked us, dammit.


----------



## funnyfaces1

So why are you guys not making fun of The Miz?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> I sometimes fear that the only people who actually know this are you, Starbuck, *Sandrone* and myself.
> 
> WORKIN' THE MARKS.
> 
> :vince


I do? :rock2



MaybeLock said:


> You broke the 4th wall! :lol Wrestlinfan35 vs Showstopper '97 always looked legit to me :
> 
> They worked us, dammit.


Showstopper... he's not a fan of Punk. People who aren't fans of Punk hate Punk. People who hate Punk hate him partly because "HE BRAKES DA 4TH WALL!"

Then Showstopper goes and does it himself... fucking hypocrite.


----------



## BIGFOOT

Dunmer said:


> Only if they keep on pushing Pizza Hut delivery drivers, and extras from Lord of the Rings.


I think you have to do more than jump up and down shouting one syllable words and grow a pubic like "beard" to get a role in LOTR. :brock


----------



## funnyfaces1

LOTR drew record audience. A midcarder extra for them is bigger than Hogan or The Rock.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

The Sandrone said:


> I do? :rock2
> 
> 
> 
> Showstopper... he's not a fan of Punk. People who aren't fans of Punk hate Punk. People who hate Punk hate him partly because "HE BRAKES DA 4TH WALL!"
> 
> Then Showstopper goes and does it himself... fucking hypocrite.


I actually do like Punk, believe it or not.


----------



## JY57

> In the segment-by-segment, based on certain markets, C.M. Punk vs. Big E Langston and Kofi Kingston vs. Fandango lost 38,000 viewers. Los Matadores vs. Heath Slater & Jinder Mahal gained 134,000 viewers so all the hype there did lead to some curiosity. The Rhodes Family, HHH and Stephanie McMahon segment leading to the PPV match and The Shield beatdown on the Rhodes family gained 358,000 viewers. Curtis Axel vs. R-Truth lost 546,000 viewers. Brie Bella vs. Alicia Fox and interviews with Paul Heyman and Big Show where Show threatened Brad Maddox and HHH gained 306,000 viewers. Alberto Del Rio vs. Zack Ryder lost 230,000 viewers. The Paul Heyman proposal segment and C.M. Punk run-in did the freak show gain at 10 p.m. It was another big quarter, with a 938,000 viewer gain. I believe once again this was during halftime of the football game. There is the feeling of hotshotting at 10 p.m. because it’s usually halftime and it’s the best shot to gain viewers. The Shield vs. Dolph Ziggler & Usos which took place when the game went back lost 1,053,000 viewers. The segment where Big Show was going to be arrested and Stephanie McMahon made the save and then started insulting him gained 249,000 viewers. Santino Marella vs. Antonio Cesaro late in the show lost 345,000 viewers. The Daniel Bryan/Randy Orton brawl during the overrun gained 689,000 viewers, which is a solid overrun gain.


breakdown for last week (via WON)


----------



## Choke2Death

> Santino Marella vs. Antonio Cesaro late in the show lost 345,000 viewers. *The Daniel Bryan/Randy Orton brawl during the overrun gained 689,000 viewers, which is a solid overrun gain.*


Did somebody say it flopped? rton2 :bryan


----------



## validreasoning

doctor doom said:


> If they WWE wants to really increase ratings and buyrates, they need LESS PPV's a year and LESS weekly television. They need Smackdown to move back to Thursdays when people are actually home and to do away with Main Event. Have 5 or 6 PPV's a year, the Big 4 plus Starcade in December and KOTR in June. Not everyone has the money to shell out $50 a month for a PPV.


you do realise tna have dropped 75% of their ppvs and buyrates have fallen as have ratings since the move


----------



## WWE

Don't worry, everyone. Cena will be back to regain them ratings :cena3

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Bryan and Orton gain 689,000 even with their clusterfuck booking. Props to Heyman and Ryback and halftime for drawing that huge increase.


----------



## validreasoning

bryan is still pulling cena like numbers for his segments despite being booked like shit


----------



## funnyfaces1

LMFAO at everyone that said Orton and Bryan flopped.


----------



## Stad

Dunmer said:


> Good point. WWE should bring back a guy that revolutionized the industry. He's done more good for wrestling than midgets like Bryan and Punk can only dream of.


So we can watch him tear his quad again, :lmao.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

:damn at dat Bryan/Orton overrun. Not going to lie, didn't think it was going to do *that* well. Great job by both guys.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

> The Paul Heyman proposal segment and C.M. Punk run-in did the freak show gain at 10 p.m. It was another big quarter, with a 938,000 viewer gain.


Holy shit, another huge one for a 10 segment. Does that make both the Chicago one and this one the largest 10PM growths of the year? 

There is no stopping the GOATs Punk and Heyman.


----------



## JY57

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Holy shit, another huge one for a 10 segment. Does that make both the Chicago one and this one the largest 10PM growths of the year?
> 
> There is no stopping the GOATs Punk and Heyman.


yeah I believe. Seems all the top 7:00 gains of the year include Heyman. These 3 and the HQ one with Brock which was 900,000.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

On a serious note, as much as myself along with a lot of others don't like that they've been dragging this Punk/Heyman program this long, it has a shit ton of interest. Majority of the time, more interest than the main angle itself. Say what you will about the angle, it's working, and it's doing good business for the WWE.

Still, fucking end it at HIAC please. I know it'll be dragged on to Survivor Series, but one can dream.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

> The Paul Heyman proposal segment and C.M. Punk run-in did the freak show gain at 10 p.m. It was another big quarter, with a 938,000 viewer gain. *I believe once again this was during halftime of the football game. There is the feeling of hotshotting at 10 p.m. because it’s usually halftime and it’s the best shot to gain viewers*.


Ahhh, wasn't aware of that. Makes sense.

C.M. Punk vs. Big E Langston and Kofi Kingston vs. Fandango lost 38,000 viewers. Ouch.


----------



## markedfordeath

here's a question...why do they always put Heyman on at halftime of the game? shouldn't they give the rub to other people on the roster to gain credibility? Heyman has already proven he's a tv draw, can't it be someone else's turn?


----------



## Londrick

Why do people act like Punk or Bryan gaining numbers is some sort of accomplishment? Yeah it's such a big deal getting the highest rated segment on some of the lowest rated RAWs of all time.



Stad said:


> So we can watch him tear his quad again, :lmao.


lol @ quad jokes in 2013.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

ShowStopper '97 said:


> Ahhh, wasn't aware of that. Makes sense.


Wouldn't credit it solely to halftime since it looks like that barely effected this week's 10PM rating, and we never saw these kind of 10PM numbers this time last year. Punk/Heyman is working, and as far as TV numbers go, it's massively successful.


----------



## markedfordeath

problem is nobody is buying ppv's....everyone wants to see this shit on free tv...which should send a message to the WWE.


----------



## Londrick

markedfordeath said:


> problem is nobody is buying ppv's....everyone wants to see this shit on free tv...which should send a message to the WWE.


Judging by the vanilla midget era ratings people don't even want to see WWE for free.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

I don't think it's solely because of halftime of the football game, but I think it's certainly a significant factor.


----------



## markedfordeath

your "vanilla midget" jokes are getting old now.


----------



## LilOlMe

Jof said:


> The overrun rating should be around 3.1~3.2 overall. *Last year they weren't up against competition this strong with both NFL and MLB playoffs.* The angle is a draw, its carrying the show every week. The roster is so fucking weak right now compared to last year, If you take the punk angle out of this, then you basically got Usos, fundango, Miz, wyatt, Kofi, Ryder etc.. borderline jobbers all of them. Without the corporation the ratings would be all time low almost everyweek and Bryan will get the blame for it.


Didn't they have the NFL and MLB playoffs last year as well?


----------



## THANOS

Choke2Death said:


> Did somebody say it flopped? rton2 :bryan


So I'm guessing loads of people outside of the main 18-49 demographic tuned in then? The <18 and >49 demos must have loved that segment?


----------



## Stad

Dunmer said:


> Judging by the vanilla midget era ratings people don't even want to see WWE for free.


lol @ vanilla midget jokes in 2013.


----------



## deatawaits

Half time or not those are too big gains to ignore.It can't be the first time that a 10 pm seg was during half time.I can't remember huge gains at 10 during football season since I started following this thread in 2011.Even if half time was such a factor,people stayed throughout the two segs.(evident from pwtorch breakdown)


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

deatawaits said:


> Half time or not those are too big gains to ignore.It can't be the first time that a 10 pm seg was during half time.I can't remember huge gains at 10 during football season since I started following this thread in 2011.Even if half time was such a factor,people stayed throughout the two segs.(evident from pwtorch breakdown)


Well, of course, Vince had a mock skit of two men in a "marriage proposal" skit. That's alittle bit out of the ordinary for WWE.


----------



## deatawaits

I was talking about punk's chicago segment as well.


----------



## Londrick

Stad said:


> lol @ vanilla midget jokes in 2013.


They're still fresh considering the geeks the WWE are pushing, unk :dazzler . While Nash hasn't had a quad tear in like 10 years. Keep hating on the highest grossing champ of all time. 



markedfordeath said:


> your "vanilla midget" jokes are getting old now.


They're not jokes. Would it be better if I made 50 posts a day sucking off Bryan like you do?


----------



## markedfordeath

at least we're both consistent


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

deatawaits said:


> Half time or not those are too big gains to ignore.It can't be the first time that a 10 pm seg was during half time.I can't remember huge gains at 10 during football season since I started following this thread in 2011.Even if half time was such a factor,people stayed throughout the two segs.(evident from pwtorch breakdown)


Exactly correct.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

deatawaits said:


> I was talking about punk's chicago segment as well.


At what time?


----------



## Lebyonics

that unk7:heyman3 

Even for such staleness.....their chemistry is just blowing away everything else


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

Lebyonics said:


> that unk7:heyman3
> 
> Even for such staleness.....their chemistry is just blowing everything else


It is pretty remarkable.


----------



## markedfordeath

just imagine the numbers Bryan and Punk will get in their upcoming feud..it has to come next..they've stayed apart long enough.


----------



## deatawaits

ShowStopper '97 said:


> At what time?


My post was about both punk's 10 pm segment in chicago 2 weeks before battleground(1million gain) and this paul heyman seg. If that is what you are asking.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

deatawaits said:


> My post was about both punk's 10 pm segment in chicago 2 weeks before battleground(1million gain) and this paul heyman seg. If that is what you are asking.


Yep. That's all I wanted to know.


----------



## Death132

Dunmer said:


> They're still fresh considering the geeks the WWE are pushing, unk :dazzler . While Nash hasn't had a quad tear in like 10 years. Keep hating on the highest grossing champ of all time.
> 
> 
> 
> They're not jokes. Would it be better if I made 50 posts a day sucking off Bryan like you do?


These troll posts are getting quite old.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

Death132 said:


> These troll posts are getting quite old.


Yo, iz u mad bro?


----------



## Happenstan

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> I sometimes fear that the only people who actually know this are you, Starbuck, Sandrone and *myself*.
> 
> WORKIN' THE MARKS.
> 
> :vince


----------



## Theproof

Calling the WWE a shell of it's former self would be a complement. How this show doesn't get below 2.0 ratings after all these years of garbage is beyond me. You know things are bad when you have guys like The Rock and Brock Lensar return and things still are shitty.

What's even worse is that people praise them when they get good ratings despite the fact that their shows are still horrible. People should be hoping that the ratings go as low as possible so that this company can get it's act together. I haven't seen a full hour of Raw since 2009. I just can't make it past the first hour without falling asleep.


----------



## funnyfaces1

ShowStopper '97 said:


> Well, of course, Vince had a mock skit of two men in a "marriage proposal" skit. That's alittle bit out of the ordinary for WWE.


This is the same man that has a zombie that wears makeup as his most credible star ever and approved segments involving things like embalmings, a Rosie O'Donnell impersonator, BBQ sauce baths on commentators, and a midget that ran an entire show for over a year and a half. Nothing is out of the ordinary in the WWE.

Dunmer, you should probably take a couple days off to rest. This past month, you were mostly awesome but lately the humor is gone.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

funnyfaces1 said:


> This is the same man that has a zombie that wears makeup as his most credible star ever and approved segments involving things like embalmings, a Rosie O'Donnell impersonator, BBQ sauce baths on commentators, and a midget that ran an entire show for over a year and a half. Nothing is out of the ordinary in the WWE.
> 
> Dunmer, you should probably take a couple days off to rest. This past month, you were mostly awesome but lately the humor is gone.


It's true that all that stuff is out there. The Heyman/Ryback proposal isn't the first odd segment they've ever done over the years, you're right. But it was kind of out there.


----------



## CALΔMITY

ShowStopper '97 said:


> It's true that all that stuff is out there. The Heyman/Ryback proposal isn't the first odd segment they've ever done over the years, you're right. But it was kind of out there.


Especially considering how tame things were for a while. Well at least up until Punk bathed in Paul Bearer's ashes...:argh:


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> On a serious note, as much as myself along with a lot of others don't like that they've been dragging this Punk/Heyman program this long, it has a shit ton of interest. Majority of the time, more interest than the main angle itself. Say what you will about the angle, it's working, and it's doing good business for the WWE.
> 
> Still, fucking end it at HIAC please. I know it'll be dragged on to Survivor Series, but one can dream.


If they blew their load early, what would we have for MANIA? Punk will probably enter the main angle at some point, and when he does, and is helping DB, that crowd reaction and moment will be just as surreal as DB going over Cena clean. 

It's what made moments like Austin helping Rock and vice versa so special. They were both so over in whatever it was that they were doing, that once they interacted and helped each other, the feeling was great.

I still to this day thou, wonder why they've kept Sheamus from facing Cena for THIS LONG ever since Sheamus became really over and super credible.


----------



## markedfordeath

do you think the WWE will ever get 4.0-5.0 ratings ever again?


----------



## lil_dro

I tuned out during the 6 diva tag match after Eva Marie tagged in and slopped it up.


----------



## THANOS

markedfordeath said:


> do you think the WWE will ever get 4.0-5.0 ratings ever again?


It's doubtful because of the technological advancements that make tv watching a lot less of a priority. These being Teevo, DVR, streaming tv websites, etc.

I do think, with a lot of work, it is possible to get mid-high 3.0s again, especially when we consider how RAW 1000 did. This means that the audience is still out there to be grabbed, WWE just has to write better storylines. That's all there is to it really. Good storylines with talented individuals will draw as long as it's consistent over a long stretch. It does take awhile for word of mouth to spread, especially when we consider how long it took Austin to begin drawing (a year and a half from when his first feud with Bret Hart began).


----------



## Weltschmertz

Yo - haven't posted my predictions here for a while because I've been busy at university. Thought I'd make a quick comment though given the recent decline in the TV audience. This decline is entirely predictable - happens every year because of increased competition on TV. In fact, I made a forecast a couple of weeks ago that said we would sink closer to 3,500,000 (check past posts).


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Weltschmertz said:


> Yo - haven't posted my predictions here for a while because I've been busy at university. Thought I'd make a quick comment though given the recent decline in the TV audience. This decline is entirely predictable - happens every year because of increased competition on TV. In fact, I made a forecast a couple of weeks ago that said we would sink closer to 3,500,000 (check past posts).


Damn dude, puttin' dat university education to use for sure.


----------



## hazuki

No breakdown for last week?


----------



## mrmacman

judge judy use to get 1.5 rating during Attitude Era,now the show easily pulls 7.0 ratings


you can use growth of technology as an excuse but the fact is WWE has no talent in storylines nor in the ring. 

Wrestling is pretty much dead.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

Are we just going to ignore that a guy who has been a recent WWE champion and current PPV main eventer in Randy Orton, scored the lowest quarter rating in the entire second hour? Everybody's so focused on how Punk and Bryan are doing, but is there a bigger embarrassment as a "main eventer" on the roster than Randy Orton? 

How many years of a push and he still can't bring jack shit to the table. It's fucking hilarious.


----------



## Choke2Death

Totally random, unannounced match with Kofi Kingston in a random spot. Gee, I wonder why it didn't draw. 

Even I almost missed it because I wanted to leave the room as soon as Kofi's music hit, but then right before I could, Orton's music hit and I ended up catching it.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

You act as if this was the first time. A guy pushed for nearly a decade shouldn't be getting show-low numbers, especially in the midst of headlining PPVs. It's hilarious how poorly he does. Is there even anything at all that Orton brings to the table? Because I must be missing it.

Good thing the GOAT's tag team match saved that second hour from flopping and making it the most watched hour of the three.


----------



## markedfordeath

Vince must not care about drawing ability.


----------



## Cliffy

Pyro does the Orton hating gimmick better.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

markedfordeath said:


> Vince must not care about drawing ability.


He doesn't. DB, Punk, Orton, Del Rio have never been consistent draws. But they are still positioned where they are because WWE gives a lot less fucks about ratings then they use to.


----------



## Choke2Death

Punkfan35 said:


> You act as if this was the first time. A guy pushed for nearly a decade shouldn't be getting show-low numbers, especially in the midst of headlining PPVs. It's hilarious how poorly he does. Is there even anything at all that Orton brings to the table? Because I must be missing it.
> 
> Good thing the GOAT's tag team match saved that second hour from flopping and making it the most watched hour of the three.


Newsflash: Everyone will get bad numbers if they are booked with no direction for years.

Yeah, he's back in the title hunt but his booking otherwise hasn't changed because he barely interacts with his opponent and is doing his own thing in random spots where he wrestles some jobber. As for him bringing something to the table? Ask WWE, they clearly know better than you which is why he continues to get pushed for a decade.

I also missed Stone Cold having a tag team match in the second hour. :austin



> Pyro does the Orton hating gimmick better.


Even Coffee Boy does the Punk's personal lover gimmick better.


----------



## markedfordeath

I think if you sell shirts, that's all that matters. PPV revenue is down and ratings aren't strong around this time of year, so if you're selling shirts, then you're golden..which clearly, all three are doing.


----------



## Londrick

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Are we just going to ignore that a guy who has been a recent WWE champion and current PPV main eventer in Randy Orton, scored the lowest quarter rating in the entire second hour? Everybody's so focused on how Punk and Bryan are doing, but is there a bigger embarrassment as a "main eventer" on the roster than Randy Orton?
> 
> How many years of a push and he still can't bring jack shit to the table. It's fucking hilarious.


That's cause Orton's always been an anti-draw outside of a couple months

Here's a pic of a house show when he was the "star" of Smackdown:


----------



## LovelyElle890

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> You act as if this was the first time. A guy pushed for nearly a decade shouldn't be getting show-low numbers, especially in the midst of headlining PPVs. It's hilarious how poorly he does. Is there even anything at all that Orton brings to the table? Because I must be missing it.
> 
> Good thing *the GOAT's tag team match *saved that second hour from flopping and making it the most watched hour of the three.


Funny, I didn't see Stone Cold wrestle anybody on Monday night.


----------



## Londrick

The GOAT had a tag match at RAW? Fuck can't believe I missed Norman Smiley.


----------



## Starbuck

Del Rio though. I just legit don't get that one. No reaction, nobody cares, legitimately makes people change the channel. Just nope, nope, nope x NOPE. I'll never understand why this guy has the accolades and/or the push he has received. Boggles the mind it truly does.


----------



## markedfordeath

that's why the "best for business" angle is laughable.


----------



## Starbuck

Actually, ignore that last post. What are we fighting about now? Orton? Oh yeah, nobody is talking about Orton because none of his marks are acting like retards. That's why nobody is talking about and/or laughing at Orton.


----------



## markedfordeath

Pretty pathetic how Cena is the only draw on the full time roster so far. they need to get their act together.


----------



## Londrick

Starbuck said:


> Del Rio though. I just legit don't get that one. No reaction, nobody cares, legitimately makes people change the channel. Just nope, nope, nope x NOPE. I'll never understand why this guy has the accolades and/or the push he has received. Boggles the mind it truly does.


I don't think anyone can come up with a legit reason why Del Rio gets pushed. He's failed at drawing in the latinos and that seems like the only reason he's ever gotten pushed. IIRC, the Mexico shows where Del Rio main evented didn't do as good as they hoped.


----------



## markedfordeath

clearly being an anti draw isn't a death sentence...


----------



## Starbuck

Dunmer said:


> I don't think anyone can come up with a legit reason why Del Rio gets pushed. He's failed at drawing in the latinos and that seems like the only reason he's ever gotten pushed. IIRC, the Mexico shows where Del Rio main evented didn't do as good as they hoped.


The sad part is, Del Rio is very talented at what he does. His problem is that nobody gives a single fuck when he's doing it. He's the perfect example of being a good _wrestler _but absofuckinglutely SUCKING in every other department. Just take him away. The guy blows.


----------



## JY57

Starbuck said:


> The sad part is, Del Rio is very talented at what he does. His problem is that nobody gives a single fuck when he's doing it. He's the perfect example of being a good _wrestler _but absofuckinglutely SUCKING in every other department. Just take him away. The guy blows.












What Vince thinks about your idea.


----------



## markedfordeath

if Vince can't make money off of you, and he keeps you around, that just means that he's playing favorites. Clearly the guys on top right now are his favorites.


----------



## Starbuck

DAT VINCE NOT GIVING A FUCK

End of the day, it's his company and he's going to do whatever the hell he wants. He must have access to some info that is hidden to us. It can't be merch, it's not ratings, it's not buys, it's not live gates. I don't know what the fuck it is but it's got to be something. Either that or he literally doesn't give a fuck about the WHC and Del Rio has pictures of him and Pat Patterson.


----------



## KO Bossy

Dunmer said:


> The GOAT had a tag match at RAW? Fuck can't believe I missed Norman Smiley.


Remember his screaming gimmick? Man I miss that guy.



Starbuck said:


> Del Rio though. I just legit don't get that one. No reaction, nobody cares, legitimately makes people change the channel. Just nope, nope, nope x NOPE. I'll never understand why this guy has the accolades and/or the push he has received. Boggles the mind it truly does.


Seconded. Guy's a useless fuck.


----------



## JY57

Starbuck said:


> DAT VINCE NOT GIVING A FUCK
> 
> End of the day, it's his company and he's going to do whatever the hell he wants. He must have access to some info that is hidden to us. It can't be merch, it's not ratings, it's not buys, it's not live gates. I don't know what the fuck it is but it's got to be something. Either that or he literally doesn't give a fuck about the WHC and Del Rio has pictures of him and Pat Patterson.


well Del Rio has a Royal Rumble Win, MITB, & 2x WWE Champion to add to that 2x World HeavyWeight Champion. His boner is clearly for Del Rio.


----------



## Starbuck

But I just don't get it lol. Usually you can pick out or see at least _something _in the guys Vince is pushing hard or see why Vince might like them. Del Rio? I see nothing. He flat out sucks. It's confusing as fuck.


----------



## markedfordeath

nobody draws but Cena, so I guess the expectations are lower than they used to be.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

According to scoops, Vince also legit thinks that Del Rio is the best heel in the company.


----------



## Starbuck

That's not what he says at the dinner table

:HHH2


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Del Rio... all I can think of is he brings in the mexican/spanish/hispanic/whatever it is that Rey used to draw in for the company. Sin Cara failed and because of that, all they have is Del Rio. Vince clearly highly values that market and that's why Del Rio is pushed so hard.

Well, that's all I can gather anyway.


----------



## markedfordeath

can't they use Rosa Mendez for the latino market?


----------



## MaybeLock

Del Rio's push reason is simple: the latino community. I'm spanish and some times read latinos websites about wrestling and he's highly appreciated by them. He's nothing compared to Eddie, of course, but there is nobody except him who can play that tole, since Sin Cara was a flop and Rey is injured all the time. If you demote Del Rio from the title picture there is nothing he can do, I simply dont see him feuding without a title involved. I guess they still have hopes that he can grow as a big draw for the latinos, because as you guys say he's not that big of a draw as he might seem for the latinos. Meanwhile he's an antidraw for the rest of the world so, they better put a bigger effort in this poor copy of heel Bret Hart.


----------



## Sonnen Says

If they really want to bring the Mexican community they should look for another guy that has IT because this goof Del Rio flat out sucks. The guy is good in the ring but sucks at everything else. I dont think this guy brings any money to the company but ironically they ditch Ziggler for that reason even tho he at least gets a reaction out of the fans while the other guy cant get heat even if he stomped on a women.


----------



## KO Bossy

Starbuck said:


> But I just don't get it lol. Usually you can pick out or see at least _something _in the guys Vince is pushing hard or see why Vince might like them. Del Rio? I see nothing. He flat out sucks. It's confusing as fuck.


Perhaps Vince likes playing out his fantasy of getting rubbed down by a studly cabana boy on his private beach in the Caribbean?

"Why Juan Pedro, is that tanning lotion in your hand?"

"Veence, I tell you for the millyonth time. My name is Albearto."

"And I've told YOU for the millionth time. If you want this push to continue, around me, your name is Juan Pedro!"


----------



## Starbuck

If Vince wanted to appeal to the Latino demo all he had to do was stick Hunico in the Sin Cara outfit and they were sorted. Sin Cara's initial push was working. He was pulling good ratings back then iirc and definitely had a better shot of being a new Mysterio like figure than Del Rio by FAR.


----------



## BrosOfDestruction

markedfordeath said:


> can't they use Rosa Mendez for the latino market?


Michael Hayes, I see you.


----------



## markedfordeath

three quarters of the roster doesn't look like they can draw jack shit. Not even everyone has merchandise. So i'm surprised the people without merchandise even have jobs on the main roster.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Starbuck said:


> If Vince wanted to appeal to the Latino demo all he had to do was stick Hunico in the Sin Cara outfit and they were sorted. Sin Cara's initial push was working. He was pulling good ratings back then iirc and definitely had a better shot of being a new Mysterio like figure than Del Rio by FAR.


Try telling Vince that.

Plus they probably didn't think that Sin Cara injuries would be as frequent as they became.


----------



## Starbuck

If they just let Hunico run with the Sin Cara character he would probably be WHC by now. Seriously. There was absolutely nothing stopping HUNICO from running with the ball. Obviously Mistico has his issues and the whole thing fell flat on its face. 

Personally if I were Vince I'd be looking for a new Latino megastar along with a new Chinese megastar(s). 1+ billion people? $$$$$.


----------



## markedfordeath

or just wait for more of Rock's relatives


----------



## Starbuck

I'd find a star for every continent. 

WORLD RATINGS DOMINATION

:vince5


----------



## MaybeLock

Starbuck said:


> If they just let Hunico run with the Sin Cara character he would probably be WHC by now. Seriously. There was absolutely nothing stopping HUNICO from running with the ball. Obviously Mistico has his issues and the whole thing fell flat on its face.
> 
> Personally if I were Vince I'd be looking for a new Latino megastar along with a new Chinese megastar(s). 1+ billion people? $$$$$.


Shit, the day Vince finds a chinese star he can milk out we are going to be screwed. Cena will look like a midcarder next to the massive push he will get.


----------



## markedfordeath

how did Cena become such a big draw any way...was it that feud with JBL in 2005?


----------



## Jof

Its not all Del Rio's fault you know? His booking hasn't been all that great, even though his accomplishments would make it seem so. WWE doesn't care about the world title, Sheamus didn't do any better as champion either. Ever since the corporate storyline has been carried over to SD regularly, the title has been lowered even further. That is not Del Rio's fault, and he's been stuck with RVD for months.


----------



## markedfordeath

so, why do you think they came up with the idea of Vacant this time around? why are they still keeping it vacant, even with outcry from fans?


----------



## Londrick

It's completely Del Rio's fault. WWE have booked him strongly. He's been in top feuds, really ever loses, 3 or 4 time world champ, RR Rumble, etc and yet if he quit or got fired it wouldn't make the slightest difference. He even tried to sponging off of Bryan's overness by using the Si chants but fans still didn't care.


----------



## markedfordeath

he just has one of those faces you want to punch out.


----------



## superuser1

markedfordeath said:


> so, why do you think they came up with the idea of Vacant this time around? why are they still keeping it vacant, even with outcry from fans?


Its because they're idiots. Now I feel bad for whoever gets the belt next because the ratings are going nowhere but down from here and that's who'll get all the blame.


----------



## markedfordeath

my guess is that the Big Show gets the belt next..they're giving him a title shot in a three way feud lol ridiculous!


----------



## superuser1

markedfordeath said:


> my guess is that the Big Show gets the belt next..they're giving him a title shot in a three way feud lol ridiculous!


Im referring to HIAC


----------



## markedfordeath

they should bring back the writer who left right after Summerslam, he was in charge of things starting well, but once he left everything veered off badly.


----------



## markedfordeath

Raw after Summerslam (8/19) 3.24 rating, highest in awhile.
Raw (8/26) 3.07-stronger than usual.
Raw (9/2) 2.85-Labor Day
Raw (9/9) 2.91-staying consistent
Raw (9/16)2.96-after NOC, strong consistent rating
everything goes downhill after Bryan gets stripped and Big Show becomes the focus.
Raw (9/23)2.81
Raw (9/30)2.68
Raw (10/7)2.65- very bad, and this is probably after everyone heard about the Battleground ending.
Moral of the story is that people want to see a crowned champion and they're pissed off that the story changed randomly and got confusing on them. Hopefully they notice this and change it.


----------



## Happenstan

Starbuck said:


> But I just don't get it lol. Usually you can pick out or see at least _something _in the guys Vince is pushing hard or see why Vince might like them. Del Rio? I see nothing. He flat out sucks. It's confusing as fuck.


Really? It's obvious. Vince wants to hold on to the Latino audience he has and build it up bigger. He wants huge crowds when they hit up Mexico, and while Dorito isn't providing that now he is a stop gap until something better comes along IMO. Dorito isn't pushed to move the Latino dial, he's pushed to plug up the dam.




The Cynical Miracle said:


> According to scoops, Vince also legit thinks that Del Rio is the best heel in the company.


That's just Vince proving he's the ultimate troll.




Starbuck said:


> If Vince wanted to appeal to the Latino demo all he had to do was stick Hunico in the Sin Cara outfit and they were sorted. Sin Cara's initial push was working.


That is exactly what they should have done. Hell get Mistico a speech therapist to work with him on learning English as well. I think a lot of his botching comes from missed calls in the ring because he can't understand what's going on. If WWE is gonna invest that much money to steal him from Mexico, invest a little more teaching him English.


----------



## validreasoning

Starbuck said:


> But I just don't get it lol. Usually you can pick out or see at least _something _in the guys Vince is pushing hard or see why Vince might like them. Del Rio? I see nothing. He flat out sucks. It's confusing as fuck.


the guy is tall, good looking, very good technically, the son of dos caras and nephew of mil mascaras. vince has had a hard on for these types of guys forever. 

do you think the rock and orton are getting their initial pushes if they are 5'6 and not third generation wrestlers???


----------



## Happenstan

validreasoning said:


> the guy is tall, good looking, very good technically, the son of dos caras and nephew of mil mascaras. vince has had a hard on for these types of guys forever.
> 
> do you think the rock and orton are getting their initial pushes if they are 5'6 and not third generation wrestlers???


Orton, no. Rock...FUCK YES. That guy oozes charisma.


----------



## Choke2Death

Happenstan said:


> If WWE is gonna invest that much money to steal him from Mexico, invest a little more teaching him English.


I don't understand it. Mistico has been with WWE for over two years now and he still can't put together a sentence in English? Specially with all the time he spent on the shelf with every injury. They really should do something with him rather than job him out.



Happenstan said:


> Orton, no. Rock...FUCK YES. That guy oozes charisma.


I think even with all his charisma, Rock might not have gotten a fair chance if he was undersized. Look at Jericho, he has all the charisma in the world and for several years they never did anything with him. Both in WCW and WWE.


----------



## Happenstan

Choke2Death said:


> I think even with all his charisma, Rock might not have gotten a fair chance if he was undersized. Look at Jericho, he has all the charisma in the world and for several years they never did anything with him. Both in WCW and WWE.


Huge Jericho mark here but nobody controls the crowds like Rock did. Jericho got over but if could puppet the crowds like Rock did Jericho would be up there with Austin and Hogan as one of the all time greats IMO.


----------



## Choke2Death

Happenstan said:


> Huge Jericho mark here but nobody controls the crowds like Rock did. Jericho got over but if could puppet the crowds like Rock did Jericho would be up there with Austin and Hogan as one of the all time greats IMO.


Not doubting Rock's ability (I'm a huge mark for his old characters) but I'm saying if he didn't have the wrestling family and the look of a star, he may have never gotten the opportunity to succeed. Specially with his first character flopping.


----------



## validreasoning

Happenstan said:


> Orton, no. Rock...FUCK YES. That guy oozes charisma.


the only job rock is getting at 5'6 and no family connections in 1996 is that of a manager, charisma or no charisma


----------



## Happenstan

validreasoning said:


> the only job rock is getting at 5'6 and no family connections in 1996 is that of a manager, charisma or no charisma


We'll just have to disagree then. He was too charismatic to over look. Worst case scenario he would have went to WCW and become a star there. A 5'6 Rock would own the cruiser division on the mic. Aren't you one of the ones that says the cream always rises to the top when it comes to talent? Or am I remembering someone else? Either way Rock is the cream.

Choke2Death: He would have had a harder road no doubt but he would have broken through eventually...either in WWF, or WCW.


----------



## tonsgrams

2.65 is a horrible rating.


----------



## markedfordeath

better than a 2.2 or a 2.5 or a 2.0....


----------



## Starbuck

Rock's charisma is undeniable. You can't have a go at the guy for being 6'5 and jacked. That's not his fault. His family connections paved the way but his talent got him to the top and made him one of the biggest superstars of all time. Just because you're a 2nd or 3rd generation star doesn't mean you're a made man. Sure, you'll get more opportunities but you still have to prove your worth. Insert Curtis Axel example here.


----------



## YoungGun_UK

Yeah I think it's undeniable he wouldn't have got that break initially without his connections, and that's half the battle (I doubt Curtis Axel is unhappy with his pay packet!) but once he got in, the reason he became what he is today is down to just how talented he is. 

and that's WWE, when it comes to Hollywood, he had no connections and has managed to succeed in that form of entertainment more than probably anyone expected him too.


----------



## JY57

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...own-legend-of-korra-haven-jessie-more/208815/

Smackdown dropped to 2.435 million down from 2.513 million last week; still # 2 in cable for 18-49 age range


----------



## markedfordeath

when the stars aren't on the show, this isn't a surprise.


----------



## markedfordeath

they put Bryan on at Halftime, the 7pm hour. Guess he might get one of the highest.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The one thing he wont get is a big increase from the previous quarter. They usually will have someone like Santino on in front of a star segment because it makes the increase more impressive if it rises from a low point. His segment was after Punk's, so it could still do well, it just wont probably increase alot if it increases at all. The commercial breaks wont help it either.


----------



## Starbuck

Lots of funny quarters this week. 9pm started about 8.55 and was over by 9.05ish but Ryback was coming out by then for the BTC so it will probably hold up. 10pm was Punk/Axel but again it has the BTC stip so it should do well. Then they had Bryan/ADR right after it which should be interesting and will absolutely cause a meltdown depending on how the numbers fall lol. The main event was Rhodes/Shield so it will be interesting to see how that does. Overrun happened exactly when Rollins threw Rhodes into the barricade and it all broke down so Big Show will be part of that. I fully expect the Cena is Jesus videos to top the night TWICE. 

:cena5


----------



## rabidwolverine27

Should be a fun week lol.


----------



## JY57

ratings might look different this week. they going to start using the new Twitter Nielsen Rating System for RAW this week.


----------



## Starbuck

Twitter ratings? DAT 6.0 ERA BEGINS TODAY.

:vince3


----------



## JY57

> -- WWE Raw's social media activity fell 17 percent on Monday night compared to the post-Battleground episode last week.
> 
> Raw scored 213,028 in social activity, according to Trendrr.TV, which was nearly the lowest social score of the season. The lowest was 212k last month in-between Night of Champions and Battleground.
> 
> Raw ranked #2 on cable TV behind the MLB Playoffs game between the Dodgers and Cardinals. Meanwhile, ESPN's Monday Night Football generated very little social activity relative to the usual activity, not even scoring 100,000.


via PWTorch (even worst than last week terrible social media numbers)


----------



## Starbuck

DAT 2.0 ERA STILL UPON US

:vince6


----------



## Banjo

I haven't watched RAW live since football started, but I haven't missed an episode. Thank god for Hulu Plus. It's a great service... I can watch RAW on my phone!


----------



## validreasoning

9:00 PM .......4.146	
8:00 PM........4.114	
10:00 PM.......3.716


----------



## JY57

Hour 1 - 4.114 million
Hour 2 - 4.146 million
Hour 3 - 3.716 million

average - 3.992 million viewers


----------



## markedfordeath

viewership went up, good sign. never seen the third hour lower though.


----------



## Londrick

validreasoning said:


> 9:00 PM .......4.146
> 8:00 PM........4.114
> 10:00 PM.......*3.716*


:trips2:showcody2:reigns:ambrose


----------



## markedfordeath

guess the overrun won't be that great....guess tag matches aren't as exciting main events.


----------



## JY57

^ or Bryan/Del Rio/Orton/Bellas lost a ton of viewers


----------



## Sonnen Says

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.114 million
> Hour 2 - 4.146 million
> *Hour 3 - 3.716 million*
> 
> average - 3.992 million viewers


:lmao WTF


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Wow, first two hours did well.


----------



## markedfordeath

Bryan hasn't lost viewers in months....probably the Divas match....


----------



## Starbuck

DAT 4 MILLION VIEWERSHIP BUMP

We all know what's responsible...

:cena2


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Starbuck said:


> DAT 4 MILLION VIEWERSHIP BUMP
> 
> We all know what's responsible...
> 
> :cena2


DEM VIDEO PACKAGES!


----------



## WWE

Starbuck said:


> DAT 4 MILLION VIEWERSHIP BUMP
> 
> We all know what's responsible...
> 
> :cena2



DAMN RIGHT


:cena3

I'd lol if Cena's video package gained viewers.

If it didn't, then damn would I be embarrassed


----------



## Death132

What exactly determines the ratings for the hours? Third hour has less than the first two which makes no sense. Are those the ratings for exactly 10pm? If so then why the fuck do people judge ratings like this? 

What were the ratings for the main event?


----------



## validreasoning

The Sandrone said:


> Wow, first two hours did well.


they beat some hours during mania season


----------



## markedfordeath

pretty awesome, i'm glad to see the ratings going up, on a holiday no doubt. think it equates to a 2.86 roughly right?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

validreasoning said:


> they beat some hours during mania season


Yeah...

DAT HB SHIZZLE and CENA VIDEOS bringing in DEM RATINGZ! :hbk :cena3


----------



## Starbuck

Cycloneon said:


> DAMN RIGHT
> 
> 
> :cena3
> 
> I'd lol if Cena's video package gained viewers.
> 
> If it didn't, then damn would I be embarrassed


I'd be super embarrassed because I predicted the Cena videos would be the highest rated segments of the show 2 pages back and I couldn't live with myself if I was wrong about that. 

BUT SERIOUSLY, THE POWER OF THE KNOCKOUT PUNCH BRINGING DEM RATINGS 

:show


----------



## JY57

markedfordeath said:


> Bryan hasn't lost viewers in months....probably the Divas match....


wasn't that in hour 2?


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

That last hour is a big drop off. Ideally, you would want the show to build throughout.


----------



## validreasoning

Death132 said:


> What exactly determines the ratings for the hours?


listed are average number of viewers per hour in millions



> Third hour has less than the first two which makes no sense.


why doesn't it make it sense?? it means roughly 10% of viewers that watched first two hours didn't tune into hour 3. there has been numerous raws since moving to 3 hours where the least watched hour is the final one. most people tap out as show is too long or if nfl game is tight



> What were the ratings for the main event?


quarter hour ratings are available thursday usually


----------



## DOPA

Wow that third hour dropped considerably after holding 4 million for the first two hours. Surprised tbh.


----------



## markedfordeath

well the game came back on from halftime around 7:10, 7:15...could be a reason, who knows..but getting to four million is a huge deal.


----------



## Starbuck

8pm - HB-Shizzle and Jesus Cena package 1
9pm - HHH/Steph and start of Ryback match
10pm - Punk/Axel Jesus Cena package 2
Overrun - Shield/Rhodes & DAT KO PUNCH

There you go people. Get your guns ready.


----------



## Death132

I'll fucking die if Shield/Rhodes didn't bump things up. That is the match that made RAW and is what we need more of. If the ratings are up there then that tells WWE that is what the fans want.


----------



## Starbuck

Getting serious for a minute, that's an impressive jump considering the drought they were in for a bit there. I imagine it's a combination of people wanting to see the fallout to Show's KO punch and HHH's reaction, the announcement of Cena making a return and the inclusion of HBK in the WWE Title match. All 3 together probably produced the bump. The high number for the first hour though is telling and would indicate high interest coming off the back of last week.


----------



## markedfordeath

only 11 more weeks to play second fiddle to the NFL.


----------



## Starbuck

Fuck that shit, if it's only 11 more weeks until NFL is over then it's only 11 more weeks until the RTWM and then I can start the countdown to my trip to NOLA :mark:.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Breakdown should be very interesting. I mentioned this in the Raw thread, but we're gonna have mark wars no matter what because Punk and Bryan happened to share the 10PM quarter (Punk had like the first 5 minutes with his announcement and maybe the tail end of Punk/Axel match, Bryan entrance, commercial, and then by the time the Bryan/Del Rio match started they had about minutes of the quarter before taking up all of the following quarter). But yeah, if it does well.... well, the usual trolls suspects will be sure to praise Punk or Bryan, and if it doesn't do well, the opposite will happen.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

DAT GOAT

:hbk1


----------



## JY57

final rating - 2.88


----------



## markedfordeath

2.88 rating,fucking awesome! nice! now Raw is back!


----------



## Starbuck

The Sandrone said:


> Breakdown should be very interesting. I mentioned this in the Raw thread, but we're gonna have mark wars no matter what because Punk and Bryan happened to share the 10PM quarter (Punk had like the first 5 minutes with his announcement and maybe the tail end of Punk/Axel match, Bryan entrance, commercial, and then by the time the Bryan/Del Rio match started they had about minutes of the quarter before taking up all of the following quarter). But yeah, if it does well.... well, the usual trolls suspects will be sure to praise Punk or Bryan, and if it doesn't do well, the opposite will happen.


Really? :lol This is going to be great. I hope the Observer breakdown comes out first to build the suspense before the Torch minute by minute stuff comes out.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

I am a huge Bryan fan but I fear he and ADR laid a ratings egg. Bryan has been booked to be ineffectual and last night he came across as the third wheel in his match with Orton and HBK as ref. He should have made an appearance in the opening segment. He then looked weaker as he was blindsided by ADR and basically told off by Steph. If you book him as an impotent midget, dont be surprised when he draws a flaccid rating. Basically, you cant cut the legs off of a guy who is only 5'8" to start with.


----------



## markedfordeath

see i dont see it that way. I see them laying the foundation for the reemergence of the Bryan/McMahons feud. He got in Steph's face, and basically stood there after she told him to leave, and he stared her down like he had visions of slapping her silly. He didn't walk away with his head down. And of course he laid a ratings egg this week, the game was a great game and he wasn't the main event..I think they portrayed him well this week...the pessimism is silly. And you do know that ADR always loses viewers right? nobody gives a shit about that guy and not even Bryan can save him from that...don't fret over it..one week in months, big deal.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.114 million
> Hour 2 - 4.146 million
> Hour 3 - 3.716 million
> 
> average - 3.992 million viewers


Just for comparison, last year's numbers on the same week:

Hour 1- 4.067
Hour 2- 4.013
Hour 3- 3.886

Average- 3.988 million viewers

A tiny bit better than last year, and they're back in line with last year's after last week went way down in comparison.



> Really? This is going to be great. I hope the Observer breakdown comes out first to build the suspense before the Torch minute by minute stuff comes out.


Yep, I called in last night as Bryan was making his entrance. Shit's gonna go down this week.


----------



## Starbuck

Same thing happened at 9pm. There's going to be a huge mark war between THE AUTHORITY marks and the Ryback marks because they shared that slot.....


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Starbuck said:


> Same thing happened at 9pm. There's going to be a huge mark war between THE AUTHORITY marks and the Ryback marks because they shared that slot.....


Ryback has marks?




Edit: OH, you meant









There shouldn't be a war in that case. The Big Guy was clearly the one responsible.


----------



## WWE

2.88?

:cena3 :hbk2


----------



## markedfordeath

there won't be mark wars, Bryan and Punk probably both didn't do as good as they usually did, we should all expect that this week..


----------



## Dec_619

Please take some time to read this column posted on LordsOfPain. I found it very interesting. Credit to TheDoc who published it. Some of you may agree, some may disagree. But I damn well agree 100% with him.



> http://www.lordsofpain.net/columns/...ason_for_WWE_Ratings_Declines_Since_2006.html


----------



## Starbuck

The Sandrone said:


> Ryback has marks?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: OH, you meant
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There shouldn't be a war in that case. The Big Guy was clearly the one responsible.


The Big Guy vs. The Bad Guy?

OH ITS ON MOTHERFUCKERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ryback responsible just like he was responsible for the HIAC 2012 buys 8*D.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Starbuck said:


> The Big Guy vs. The Bad Guy?
> 
> OH ITS ON MOTHERFUCKERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> Ryback responsible just like he was responsible for the HIAC 2012 buys 8*D.


unk3


----------



## Death132

Dec_619 said:


> Please take some time to read this column posted on LordsOfPain. I found it very interesting. Credit to TheDoc who published it. Some of you may agree, some may disagree. But I damn well agree 100% with him.


Its no coincidence the product started seeing a major decline in quality throughout all those years. For as long as I live I will never stop believing that the WWE is responsible the the ratings decline. You'd have to be a mark to really think NFL is the reason and not WWEs mediocre booking and MASSIVE decline in star power.


----------



## Dec_619

> - Monday's WWE RAW scored a 2.88 cable TV rating, up from the previous week's 2.65 cable rating. This week's RAW averaged 3.992 million viewers, up 8% from last week. The episode did 4.114 million viewers the first hour, 4.146 million the second, and 3.716 million the final third hour. RAW ranked #3 in overall viewers Monday night.


Source: Lords Of Pain.


----------



## Mqwar

> WWE Raw on Monday, October 14 scored a 2.88 rating, up nine percent from last week's year-low 2.65 rating.
> 
> It was the highest-rated Raw in one month dating back to the post-Night of Champions episode.
> 
> - Raw averaged 3.992 million viewers, up eight percent from last week. The show was boosted by the first two hours, then the third hour dropped off 10 percent.
> 
> Hourly Break Down: 4.114 million first hour viewers (most in two months), 4.146 million second hour viewers (most in one month) and 3.716 million third hour viewers.
> 
> Raw's third hour performance can be blamed on a few factors, such as audience fatigue and/or the combination of a closely-contested Monday Night Football game and the MLB Playoffs. Football drew a pedestrian 12 million viewers, while this year's Playoffs continue to draw strong numbers, registering nearly five million viewers for Cardinals at Dodgers.
> 
> On cable TV Monday night, Raw ranked #3 in overall viewers behind sports, but ranked #2 in the adult male demos behind football, but ahead of baseball.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: WWE gave viewers hope and something to get excited about at the end of last week's show when Big Show KO'ed Triple H, which seems to have propelled the first two hours of the follow-up show this week. But, most of this week's Raw dragged, making it easy for Three-Hour Viewer Fatigue to kick in and for viewers to be drawn away to sports during the third hour.


Torch.

A18-49 rating and viewership was up from last week for first two hours.


----------



## dxbender

https://www.trendrr.tv/main/chart

Raw was the #2 show of all cable AND broadcast tv shows in social media activity. Beating out tv shows which had over 10M viewers.


----------



## markedfordeath

Raw had a popular week.


----------



## Dec_619

markedfordeath said:


> Raw had a popular week.


It wasn't a bad show. It deserved the better rating than last week. Hopefully it gets better and the ratings keep going up.


----------



## Londrick

Them Rhodes Bros saving the WWE. #codyforwwechampgoldustforwhc2014


----------



## markedfordeath

they needed help to win though. could have done it on their own.


----------



## Starbuck

It's going to be funny to see how both the Observer and the Torch 'spin' the numbers this week. The past few weeks the numbers enabled them to push their little THIS STORYLINE SUX THEY ARE RUINING EVERYBODY agenda. But things have gone up and the increase has more than likely come from HHH getting knocked out and his subsequent response. With Punk and Bryan also sharing 10pm DIS SHIT GUN B GUD :lol.


----------



## JY57

Starbuck said:


> It's going to be funny to see how both the Observer and the Torch 'spin' the numbers this week. The past few weeks the numbers enabled them to push their little THIS STORYLINE SUX THEY ARE RUINING EVERYBODY agenda. But things have gone up and the increase has more than likely come from HHH getting knocked out and his subsequent response. With Punk and Bryan also sharing 10pm DIS SHIT GUN B GUD :lol.


well last week they got the lowest rating of the year (post PPV show doing that ba; is terrible) and week before was the lowest go home show rating of the year (3rd overall lowest). So PWInsider, F4wOnline, & PWTorch have legit arguments.

But for a brief moment looks like they did right this week. Just have to wait if they can sustain it especially with the numerous stiff competition.


----------



## austin316 G.O.A.T

Guess this worked


----------



## Jof

JY57 said:


> well last week they got the lowest rating of the year (post PPV show doing that ba; is terrible) and week before was the lowest go home show rating of the year (3rd overall lowest). So PWInsider, F4wOnline, & PWTorch have legit arguments.


They don't. Ratings have been the same as last year more or less, obviously three hours, weak roster and competition is taking its toll as usual. Besides, the past few weeks they took corporation out of the top feud and let Orton and Bryan do their own thing instead which led to the drop. Keller has no credibility anyway, he's been burying the angle since the grantland interview. He even went as far as to claim WWE buried the babyfaces the same week usos, Ryder, PTP, Shield main evented RAW. Idiotic. 



> But for a brief moment looks like they did right this week. Just have to wait if they can sustain it especially with the numerous stiff competition.


Yup. I think they need Sheamus and Henry back desperately. The face side is terribly weak, Cena's return is just not enough. Survivor series this year likely to have a great build up all things considered, that should help them hold viewer's interest.


----------



## wb1899

Mqwar said:


> A18-49 rating and viewership was up from last week for first two hours.


Third hour also:
8:00: +204,000 viewers
9:00: +114,000 viewers
10:00-11:04: +25,000 viewers


----------



## WWE

:show = Ratings


----------



## Starbuck

JY57 said:


> well last week they got the lowest rating of the year (post PPV show doing that ba; is terrible) and week before was the lowest go home show rating of the year (3rd overall lowest). So PWInsider, F4wOnline, & PWTorch have legit arguments.
> 
> But for a brief moment looks like they did right this week. Just have to wait if they can sustain it especially with the numerous stiff competition.


Oh I know all that. There was a big dip from NOC to Battleground. I meant it more in terms of they could use the low ratings to back their cause and it will just be interesting to see what they have to say now that the numbers don't fit their agendas any more. They can hardly say 'This angle is terrible and the numbers prove it' when things have gone up.


----------



## markedfordeath

what do you mean their agenda?


----------



## #Mark

Because they point out that HHH initially wasn't doing anyone favors but himself they have an agenda.


----------



## Starbuck

Or how about they bitch, bitch, bitch no matter what was happening. 

Bryans gets a beat down = bitch
Bryan gets the upper hand = bitch
HHH involved in Orton/Bryan = bitch
HHH not involved in Orton/Bryan = bitch
Babyfaces are emasculated = bitch
Babyfaces get some retribution = bitch

I don't think anybody can say with a straight face that Wade Keller doesn't have an agenda. Ever since that Grantland interview he's been shitting his pants over every single little thing HHH has done. He attends a SD taping where Bryan didn't get an Austin/Rock level pop and uses that as the basis for his term paper on why HHH is the devil. Besides, if all of the stuff that happened in the initial stages of the story didn't happen then the things that we're seeing now wouldn't mean jack shit. Who cares if the Rhodes become tag champs if Cody didn't get fired? They happened for a reason. I expect idiocy like that from posters on a wrestling forum but when you see it coming from people who are supposed to be these expert insiders it's kind of embarrassing tbh. And their analysis from NOC to Battleground was actually pretty spot on for the most part. It's just a shame they can't keep their bias out of things, especially when they're supposed to be objective news reporters. Instead we get them pushing agendas because of their personal dislike for something. In any other medium of critiquing work, obvious bias would never be tolerated yet it's accepted in wrestling and has been for years. I'll never get that. Whether it's about somebody I mark for or not, whether it's about something I'm even knowledgeable about or not, if I'm reading a review of any show or any product and I know the writer has a clear bias against the thing they are critiquing, I tend not to take it seriously. Maybe that's just me, I don't know. At the end of the day it's just an opinion piece but when you go around acting like that opinion is a fact, we'll, that's when you start to make yourself look foolish. Unfortunately too many people fall for their bullshit. Hell, they even make money off it through their subscriptions. It's admirable to say the least.


----------



## markedfordeath

yeah all over the torch is nothing but "Bryan being buried" nonsense.....Ziggler would kill for this push lol


----------



## checkcola

The funny thing about Smackdown tapings, if Smackdown usually doesn't sell out, I'm not sure how its possible to get a Rock/Austin level pop anyway, as well as the fact is, people want to do the Yes! chant when Bryan comes out, so they may be waiting for him to start leading the chants. Just my two cents.


----------



## markedfordeath

yep, Smackdown has no reason to exist..no one is off work by 5pm on Friday any way and if they are, they're stuck in traffic, at least where i'm from...so people might record it, but it gets consistently bad ratings on a friday night because no one can watch it, even though it's the top 2 for each Friday, but still, not even people go to the tapings.


----------



## KO Bossy

Starbuck said:


> Or how about they bitch, bitch, bitch no matter what was happening.
> 
> Bryans gets a beat down = bitch
> Bryan gets the upper hand = bitch
> HHH involved in Orton/Bryan = bitch
> HHH not involved in Orton/Bryan = bitch
> Babyfaces are emasculated = bitch
> Babyfaces get some retribution = bitch
> 
> I don't think anybody can say with a straight face that Wade Keller doesn't have an agenda. Ever since that Grantland interview he's been shitting his pants over every single little thing HHH has done. He attends a SD taping where Bryan didn't get an Austin/Rock level pop and uses that as the basis for his term paper on why HHH is the devil. Besides, if all of the stuff that happened in the initial stages of the story didn't happen then the things that we're seeing now wouldn't mean jack shit. Who cares if the Rhodes become tag champs if Cody didn't get fired? They happened for a reason. I expect idiocy like that from posters on a wrestling forum but when you see it coming from people who are supposed to be these expert insiders it's kind of embarrassing tbh. And their analysis from NOC to Battleground was actually pretty spot on for the most part. It's just a shame they can't keep their bias out of things, especially when they're supposed to be objective news reporters. Instead we get them pushing agendas because of their personal dislike for something. In any other medium of critiquing work, obvious bias would never be tolerated yet it's accepted in wrestling and has been for years. I'll never get that. Whether it's about somebody I mark for or not, whether it's about something I'm even knowledgeable about or not, if I'm reading a review of any show or any product and I know the writer has a clear bias against the thing they are critiquing, I tend not to take it seriously. Maybe that's just me, I don't know. At the end of the day it's just an opinion piece but when you go around acting like that opinion is a fact, we'll, that's when you start to make yourself look foolish. Unfortunately too many people fall for their bullshit. Hell, they even make money off it through their subscriptions. It's admirable to say the least.


Keller is mad jealous because of the GOAT nose. He could only dream of having a honker that splendid. :trips


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

Just checked the RAW thread, the 10 PM segment is kind of all over the place. Punk/Axel with the announcement, went from 9:54 to _10:03_? What kind of scheduling is that? And with Bryan in it too, I won't be surprised to see the 10 segment this week under-perform. Especially compared to the last two Punk/Heyman segments that went the full quarter.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Just checked the RAW thread, the 10 PM segment is kind of all over the place. Punk/Axel with the announcement, went from 9:54 to _10:03_? What kind of scheduling is that? And with Bryan in it too, I won't be surprised to see the 10 segment this week under-perform. Especially compared to the last two Punk/Heyman segments that went the full quarter.


Yeah, they had to put Daniel "Goatface" Bryan against Alberto "No Heat" Del Rio in Punk/Heyman's quarter. No doubt that's gonna kill any gain it would've gotten. (although Del Rio did get a good load of heat on Raw this week)


----------



## Londrick

lol @ Wrestlinfan35 already blaming Bryan if that quarter does bad. I bet he's gonna be completely unbiased and give him credit if that quarter does good.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Dunmer said:


> lol @ Wrestlinfan35 already blaming Bryan if that quarter does bad. I bet he's gonna be completely unbiased and give him credit if that quarter does good.


If the quarter gains a million viewers, it would've gained 2,000,000 if it was just Punk and Heyman stuff.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

The Sandrone said:


> If the quarter gains a million viewers, it would've gained 2,000,000 if it was just Punk and Heyman stuff.


Exactly.

:vince

10:00 - 10:03 probably had the biggest three minute viewership in years. I could only imagine the drop when Bryan's music played.


----------



## mblonde09

When has Bryan ever got an Austin/Rock level pop? He can't even out-pop Punk.


----------



## Londrick

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Exactly.
> 
> :vince
> 
> 10:00 - 10:03 probably had the biggest three minute viewership in years. I could only imagine the drop when Bryan's music played.


It'll probably do better than the This is Your Life segment with Dwayne and Foley. Think it did a 8.4, so those three minutes will probably do 9.2.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Dunmer said:


> It'll probably do better than the This is Your Life segment with Dwayne and Foley. Think it did a 8.4, so those three minutes will probably do *9.2.*


Why that low? unk2


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

The Sandrone said:


> If the quarter gains a million viewers, it would've gained 2,000,000 if it was just Punk and Heyman stuff.


Exactly Punk is a huge fucking deal people, get wit it or get lost. He's the biggest draw in professional wrestling.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

mblonde09 said:


> When has Bryan ever got an Austin/Rock level pop? He can't even out-pop Punk.


Both get Godfather pops.


----------



## Londrick

Billion Dollar Man said:


> Exactly Punk is a huge fucking deal people, get wit it or get lost. He's the biggest draw in professional wrestling.


He makes Nash look like one of the lowest drawing champs of all time. That's how big of a star Punk is.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Billion Dollar Man said:


> Both get Godfather pops.


What pop does Orton get unk2. You make me laugh in a bad way.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

Sonnen Says said:


> What pop does Orton get unk2. You make me laugh in a bad way.


Who said anything about Orton? He's a nothing, a nobody, a blemish on the industries buttocks.

Now the CM "Megastar" Punk, he's the best to ever do it.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

It's so nice when everyone's honest with each other.


----------



## KO Bossy

I hope people aren't hating on Godfather, that guy was awesome. Over as hell, too. People today would be lucky to get that over.


----------



## Londrick

KO Bossy said:


> I hope people aren't hating on Godfather, that guy was awesome. Over as hell, too. People today would be lucky to get that over.


Especially certain world champions. :delrio


----------



## KingLobos

Godfather had a hell of a career. I think it's funny when people talk shit about Charles Wright or Ron Simmons thinking they were one trick ponies. When in fact they reinvented themselves so many times constantly changing with the times.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Godfather had one of the best gimmicks ever for a midcarder, but man did he suck in the ring. Not that it mattered considering his gimmicks, but his matches were almost always skippable. Godfather/Venis was a great short-lived team though.


----------



## KO Bossy

Dunmer said:


> Especially certain world champions. :delrio


Ba-zing.

Seriously, if Del Rio was 1/10th as over as GOATfather, he'd be fine. And when you think of how simple the Godfather character was, and how much thought needed to be put into it, its fucking pathetic that Del Rio still can't get over.

Look at what they tried:

-Its my destiny!
-I'm a Mexican aristocrat!
-I beat up Ricardo!
-I beat up Ziggler when he had a concussion!
-I'm a hero to the Latinos!
-I'm a savage heel who always hurts babyfaces!
-I sneak-attacked Daniel Bryan!

STILL NOT OVER.

Meantime, look what Godfather needed:

-Bring out the Hos
-Talk about lighting one up, 420 style
-Say "Pimpin' ain't easy"

And the guy was so ridiculously over that its incredible.



KingLobos said:


> Godfather had a hell of a career. I think it's funny when people talk shit about Charles Wright or Ron Simmons thinking they were one trick ponies. When in fact they reinvented themselves so many times constantly changing with the times.


Exactly. Papa Shango, Kama, Godfather, Goodfather...man, when he joined RTC, people were SO disappointed. How dare you rob us of our tits!


----------



## Londrick

Venis nearly getting his dick chopped off = :lmao


----------



## KO Bossy

Oh my bad, I forgot that the Godfather needed to say "its time, once again, for everybody to come aboard the ho train." His shtick was like...the exact same thing every time, and the fans loved it.


----------



## KO Bossy

funnyfaces1 said:


> Godfather had one of the best gimmicks ever for a midcarder, but man did he suck in the ring. Not that it mattered considering his gimmicks, but his matches were almost always skippable. Godfather/Venis was a great short-lived team though.


Yeah, but he didn't need to be good in ring. He was perfect for that first to third match in on a PPV card. He'd get awesome reactions and totally get the fans into what was going on, building up for later in the show where guys like Rock and Austin would come out. In other words, he was like an enhancement talent for the crowd. That's an important role, and he was fine with it. He did it extremely well, to the point that we're still talking about him in 2013.

Meantime, our current WHC was getting crickets in TORONTO for god's sake.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

KO Bossy said:


> Meantime, our current WHC was getting crickets in TORONTO for god's sake.


The Randy Savage lookalike in the front row was the only thing we gave a fuck about during that match, too. Dat World champ.


----------



## Londrick

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> The Randy Savage lookalike in the front row was the only thing we gave a fuck about during that match, too. Dat World champ.


A member of the audience being more over than Del Rio?


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Dunmer said:


> Venis nearly getting his dick chopped off = :lmao


This, sadly, was more entertaining than the majority of the 2012 Raws.


----------



## RKO 4life

Once again Orton carrying the show. other then that Raw was shitty.


----------



## markedfordeath

Does that Randy Savage lookalike travel to every arena and tv taping? because his chant goes off during all the boring matches. Or is Randy Savage the new "boring" chant?


----------



## Londrick

RKO 4life said:


> *Once again Orton carrying the show*. other then that Raw was shitty.


Is that why the ratings are still low? :lol


----------



## RKO 4life

Talk to smoke man in DC in 2 weeks and I'll see if he will bring in Nash for a main story.


----------



## RKO 4life

Dunmer said:


> Is that why the ratings are still low? :lol


Ratings still low because of booking and the wrestler they pushed a year ago.

Orton bumps up the ratings.


----------



## Londrick

Then why haven't the ratings been bumped with Orton getting a more prominent role?


----------



## RKO 4life

Dunmer said:


> Then why haven't the ratings been bumped with Orton getting a more prominent role?


Have you seen the drop off in ratings after he lost the belt? Can't see how you are a Nash fan. 

Nash and Orton fans fighting? Coming from the same line of blood brother, my 2 all time fav Nash and Orton. and you can't see the facts.


----------



## validreasoning

meltzers numbers from the october 7th raw



> In the segment numbers, Dolph Ziggler vs. Damien Sandow lost 204,000 viewers. Brad Maddox announcing the main event for Hell in a Cell, the Booker T interview and Natalya & Eva Marie & Jo Jo vs. Aksana & Rosa Mendes & Alicia Fox gained 571,000 viewers. It was more the PPV announcement that boosted things. Los Matadores vs. Jinder Mahal & Drew McIntyre lost 428,000 viewers. The 9 p.m. hour with the Paul Heyman with Curtis Axel & Ryback confrontation with C.M. Punk leading to Punk & R-Truth vs. Axel & Ryback gained 428,000 viewers, essentially getting back the audience that turned out for Los Matadores. The Bob Backlund interview lost 163,000 viewers. Kofi Kingston vs. Randy Orton lost 143,000 viewers. The Shawn Michaels interview gained 122,000 viewers. It was hurt badly because it wasn’t advertised in advance. Alberto Del Rio vs. Ricardo Rodriguez at 10 p.m. plus the John Cena announcement gained 183,000 viewers, which is a far cry from the near seven figures that Punk and Heyman had done in previous weeks in that same time slot. Fandango vs. Zack Ryder and Jack Swagger & Antonio Cesaro vs. Great Khali & Santino Marella lost 479,000 viewers. The Miz angle with the Wyatt Family lost 123,000 viewers. Daniel Bryan & Cody Rhodes & Goldust vs. The Shield in the main event gained 430,000 viewers. The post-match with HHH being knocked out by Big Show gained 895,000 viewers.


----------



## Happenstan

mblonde09 said:


> When has Bryan ever got an Austin/Rock level pop? He can't even out-pop Punk.


:lmao Dude Bryan out-pops Punk every week for quite a while now. You just can't get good acoustics in Phil's asshole. Stick your head out and listen next time.




Mister WrestleMania said:


> This, sadly, was more entertaining than the majority of the 2012 Raws.


"Me choppy choppy your pee pee." Greatest quote in Raw's history.




RKO 4life said:


> Have you seen the drop off in ratings after he lost the belt? Can't see how you are a Nash fan.
> 
> Nash and Orton fans fighting? Coming from the same line of blood brother, my 2 all time fav Nash and Orton. and you can't see the facts.


Dude I know you like Randy and all but last time he was WWE champ ratings got so bad they hotshotted the title to the freaking Miz. Last time he won the WHC from Christian Smackdown ratings dropped huge the night he was scheduled to win the title. Randy's a great heel but I'm just not so sure people want to tune in and watch him be a successful (storyline wise) heel. Really not sure why that is though.


----------



## Alo0oy

Happenstan said:


> :lmao Dude Bryan out-pops Punk every week for quite a while now. You just can't get good acoustics in Phil's asshole. Stick your head out and listen next time.


But that hasn't been the case the last two weeks.


----------



## austin316 G.O.A.T

RKO 4life said:


> Once again Orton carrying the show. other then that Raw was shitty.


Are you serious about Orton carrying Raw?


----------



## JY57

Main Event and Over-Run combined for extra 1,325,000 viewers is pretty good for last week.

7:00 slot not doing too well is not a surprise since HBK & Cena announcement were out of nowhere (didn't watch but they were never spoke about before the show).


----------



## Bfo4jd

JY57 said:


> Main Event and Over-Run combined for extra 1,325,000 viewers is pretty good for last week.


HOLY RATINGS BATMAN! This actually outdid last year's ME+overrun viewership gain with Vince Mcmahon which gained 1,233,000 viewers. Incredible.

That's bigger than TNA's entire weekly viewership lol.


----------



## Mr. I

RKO 4life said:


> Ratings still low because of booking and the wrestler they pushed a year ago.
> 
> Orton bumps up the ratings.


Orton is not and never has been a ratings draw. I don't care if you're a fan of him, reality is reality.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

> Daniel Bryan & Cody Rhodes & Goldust vs. The Shield in the main event gained 430,000 viewers. The post-match with HHH being knocked out by Big Show gained 895,000 viewers.


:damn

:yes


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

BM Junk and Waaaaahniel Cryan pulled in about half as many viewers as Da Big Show, how apropos.


----------



## Alo0oy

Ithil said:


> Orton is not and *never has been* a ratings draw. I don't care if you're a fan of him, reality is reality.


Not now, but he was in 09.


----------



## stonefort

Boring Daniel Bryan is like kryptonite for ratings.
Pro-tip: Boring, Dull, and Bland are not exciting.


----------



## Londrick

> In the segment numbers, Dolph Ziggler vs. Damien Sandow lost 204,000 viewers. Brad Maddox announcing the main event for Hell in a Cell, the Booker T interview and Natalya & Eva Marie & Jo Jo vs. Aksana & Rosa Mendes & Alicia Fox gained 571,000 viewers. It was more the PPV announcement that boosted things. Los Matadores vs. Jinder Mahal & Drew McIntyre lost 428,000 viewers. The 9 p.m. hour with the Paul Heyman with Curtis Axel & Ryback confrontation with *C.M. Punk* leading to Punk & R-Truth vs. Axel & Ryback* gained 428,000 viewers*, essentially getting back the audience that turned out for Los Matadores. The Bob Backlund interview lost 163,000 viewers. Kofi Kingston vs. Randy Orton lost 143,000 viewers. The Shawn Michaels interview gained 122,000 viewers. It was hurt badly because it wasn’t advertised in advance. Alberto Del Rio vs. Ricardo Rodriguez at 10 p.m. plus the John Cena announcement gained 183,000 viewers, which is a far cry from the near seven figures that Punk and Heyman had done in previous weeks in that same time slot. Fandango vs. Zack Ryder and Jack Swagger & Antonio Cesaro vs. Great Khali & Santino Marella lost 479,000 viewers. The Miz angle with the Wyatt Family lost 123,000 viewers.* Daniel Bryan* & Cody Rhodes & Goldust vs. The Shield in the main event *gained 430,000 viewers*. The post-match with HHH being knocked out by Big Show gained 895,000 viewers.


Vanilla Midgets bringing in the viewers


----------



## markedfordeath

Bryan still doing well. I'm really happy for him. Putting a Cena clip on at 7pm wasn't such a good idea afterall.


----------



## FreakyZo

That over run had nothing to do with Bryan it was all HHH and Big Show


----------



## markedfordeath

But Bryan was in it, he was the last image they showed when it faded to black. That standing over Triple H bit was the main focus of Trip's promo this week. That's why he hates the Yes.Its also why Brie got in trouble with Stephanie.


----------



## JY57

markedfordeath said:


> Bryan still doing well. I'm really happy for him. Putting a Cena clip on at 7pm wasn't such a good idea afterall.


Cena announcement and HBK came out of nowhere. People probably expected just a Del Rio match and thats that.


----------



## markedfordeath

If Bryan and Del Rio this week did awful, and if Bryan can't even get an ADR segment to gain viewership, then all hope is lost for ADR.....he never gains viewers.


----------



## JY57

^ well he does well with Cena & Punk (from what I remember). Not sure if anything else ADR has done great on, outside of minimal gains.


----------



## markedfordeath

the total number of viewers for each hour, is that each segment of the hour added up? Like only the gains added up?


----------



## Death132

Every single one of Ortons TV matches since cashing in has lost viewers.


----------



## stonefort

Notice that nobody cares about Daniel Bryan anymore?


----------



## DoubleDeckerBar

Death132 said:


> Every single one of Ortons TV matches since cashing in has lost viewers.


No they haven't.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

DoubleDeckerBar said:


> No they haven't.


The stuff with Rhodes and Goldust weren't "matches". They were career-ending events. Big difference. Orton's a no drawing vanilla tall hack.


----------



## Choke2Death

Death132 said:


> Every single one of Ortons TV matches since cashing in has lost viewers.


LOL, that's not even close to true.


----------



## superuser1

Death132 said:


> Every single one of Ortons TV matches since cashing in has lost viewers.


Nah only his match against Christian and the one against Kofi which isn't surprising both those matches didn't serve any purpose.


----------



## markedfordeath

and his match last week.


----------



## doinktheclowns

No one is a draw on the full time roster anymore like they used to excluding Cena. People shouldn't go on about ratings all of the time when they don't understand them in context and don't know what to do with the information. They should just go on entertainment value to them.

Bryan/Orton/Punk

Sometimes they do well and sometimes the do badly. Mainly because a lot of it is totally random and dependent on so many other things than whether someone is interesting.

Bryan/Orton/Punk - I like all three but non of them do too much to the ratings on a regular basis. The shows are consistently low and to an extent regardless of what they do in that 10 minute window it wont budge the dial too much.

People don't watch WWE like they used to 15 years ago but debates continue to go on and people only remember times when there is a bad drawing segment to help their argument against someone they don't like. They don't lie they just don't tell the whole truth.

Not to mention all the ways to watch wrestling that aren't counted in the ratings.


Thats my opinions on the matter anyway.

Ratings are important but not to us and the majority of us don't understand them properly anyway.


----------



## superuser1

markedfordeath said:


> and his match last week.


That was against Kofi wasnt it


----------



## TheStig

Orton lost viewers when it was a pointless match and gained when it had a storyline attached. Voices in my head say that booking might actually be a part of ratings? I think im going crazy guys. I need the breakdown right now.


----------



## superuser1

TheStig said:


> Orton lost viewers when it was a pointless match and gained when it had a storyline attached. Voices in my head say that booking might actually be a part of ratings? I think im going crazy guys. I need the breakdown right now.


Exactly. A good example of this is lets say on tv there's three NBA games Lakers Vs Heat, Grizzles Vs Hornets and Spurs Vs Pistons. Which will gain the most viewers? Lakers Vs Heat without a shadow of a doubt. Simply because of the storyline here Kobe Vs LeBron etc. Why you guys think Punk is drawing now? Simply because he's in a good storyline and not some thrown together random type stuff. People tuning in to see wether he'll get his hands on Heyman. He's drawing way more now than when he had the title which says alot.


----------



## RKO 4life

Orton carying these ratings!As the past 8 weeks. HHH/Bryan/Punk no draws. Orton/Cena/Vince/Undertaker the draws.

Guys I don't post to lie.


----------



## markedfordeath

Cena and Vince haven't been on tv in 8 weeks, so yes that is a lie! lol


----------



## RKO 4life

markedfordeath said:


> Cena and Vince haven't been on tv in 8 weeks, so yes that is a lie! lol


I mean the last 8 weeks in these threads. But Mark keep trying you'll get better.


----------



## markedfordeath

look at your post, it had an exclamation point followed by "as the past 8 weeks". Anyone would think that was all one continuation of a sentence. I was correcting you...You're welcome.


----------



## RKO 4life

markedfordeath said:


> look at your post, it had an exclamation point followed by "as the past 8 weeks". Anyone would think that was all one continuation of a sentence. I was correcting you...You're welcome.


and I said you'll get better at this. I like your passion kid. One day you'll have a take that won't suck.


----------



## Starbuck

> *Natalya & Eva Marie & Jo Jo vs. Aksana & Rosa Mendes & Alicia Fox gained 571,000 viewers*


:vince2



> *Daniel Bryan & Cody Rhodes & Goldust vs. The Shield in the main event gained 430,000 viewers. *


:dazzler



> *The post-match with HHH being knocked out by Big Show gained 895,000 viewers.*


:HHH2 :show

Cena & HBK were out of nowhere so those numbers can't be held against them. It's all Del Rio's fault okay.


----------



## Sonnen Says

RKO 4life said:


> Orton carying these ratings!As the past 8 weeks. HHH/Bryan/Punk no draws. Orton/Cena/Vince/Undertaker the draws.
> 
> Guys I don't post to lie.


What are you talking about :lmao


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

My viewing philosophy is *"If I don't wanna fuck 'em, off my TV I'll chuck 'em"* which is why I only watch for Randy and Roman Reigns.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

Still lol'ing at one half of their PPV main event and recent WWE champ, Randy Orton, getting hour-low ratings.

:lmao


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Still lol'ing at one half of their PPV main event and recent WWE champ, Randy Orton, getting hour-low ratings.
> 
> :lmao


Lolling even harder at Punk being estranged from his entire family


----------



## superuser1

Did the breakdown for Raw come out yet?


----------



## Cliffy

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Lolling even harder at Punk being estranged from his entire family


:ti classic


----------



## Choke2Death

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Lolling even harder at Punk being estranged from his entire family


:lmao


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

:lmao Sad Randall marks are just the best thing. They really have no legs to stand on, it's just so fun to watch.


----------



## Oliver-94

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Lolling even harder at Punk being estranged from his entire family


:clap:clap:clap


----------



## ROGERTHAT21

:lmao *I'm a sick bastard for laughing at that Punk post man.*


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> :lmao Sad Randall marks are just the best thing. They really have no legs to stand on, it's just so fun to watch.


I wish I could watch Phil Brooks gnaw on his lil vegan Cornish game hen all by himself on Thanksgiving


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

unk3


----------



## funnyfaces1

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Lolling even harder at Punk being estranged from his entire family


Folks, we have a new pick for best poster on this thread. Dude is gonna surpass Rock316AE.


----------



## #Mark

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Lolling even harder at Punk being estranged from his entire family


:lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Lolling even harder at Punk being estranged from his entire family


:lmao Where's JR calling a low-blow when you need him?


----------



## Alo0oy

I nominate this thread & its predecessor to the internet Hall of Fame. :lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## celticjobber

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Lolling even harder at Punk being estranged from his entire family


Basically he stopped talking to his parents because they always sided with his "loser" brother (who stole money from him) and bought the brother a car and never paid him enough attention. 

Atleast, that's what it seemed like from what Punk said on his DVD.

I'm a fan of his work as a wrestler, but that seems like a petty reason to stop talking to your family. 

That type of shit happens with alot of people, and they don't whine and cut off their family because of it.


----------



## Alo0oy

celticjobber said:


> Basically he stopped talking to his parents because they always sided with his "loser" brother (who stole money from him) and bought the brother a car and never paid him enough attention.
> 
> Atleast, that's what it seemed like from what Punk said on his DVD.
> 
> I'm a fan of his work as a wrestler, but that seems like a petty reason to stop talking to your family.
> 
> That type of shit happens with alot of people, and they don't whine and cut off their family because of it.


His mother used to blackmail him, if he didn't give her money she threatened suicide.


----------



## SpaceTraveller

I'm a huge Punk fan, however, that's only one side of the story. As a skeptic, it's very hard to substantiate those claims coming from a biased source. I'm not saying he's lying, but I can't say he's telling the truth either as there's no evidence either way.


----------



## Biast

SpaceTraveller said:


> I'm a huge Punk fan, however, that's only one side of the story. As a skeptic, it's very hard to substantiate those claims coming from a biased source. I'm not saying he's lying, but I can't say he's telling the truth either as there's no evidence either way.


It's actually true. This was posted on the forum a couple of months ago:



> CM Punk's legal wish has been granted -- a judge has issued a 2-year restraining order against the WWE superstar's estranged mother after she allegedly bombarded him with threats, TMZ has learned.
> 
> We broke the story ... Punk filed legal docs in Illinois claiming his mom threatened to commit suicide several times after he stopped giving her money to pay for her living situation. Punk also claimed his mom had threatened to expose humiliating secrets from his past.
> 
> Punk had already received a temporary restraining order against his mom -- but today, the judge decided to extend the order of protection for 2 years.
> 
> Punk had asked the court to also ban his mom from WWE wrestling events -- but it's unclear if the judge signed off on that request as well.


From www.tmz.com


----------



## Jof

Wow. What an asshole though, restraining order against his own mother even after knowing she's suicidal?


----------



## Biast

Jof said:


> Wow. What an asshole though, restraining order against his own mother even after knowing she's suicidal?


She isn't suicidal, she was just blackmailing him. In the full report it has been stated that she was blackmailing him like that for years, asking for large quantities of money every few months. In reality if she was suicidal, she would have killed herself by now. Her mental condition is just fine!

In conclusion, I would've done the same! Fuck that bitch! Furthermore, she kicked him out of the house when he was 16, so it's not like he owes her anything!


----------



## Jof

Biast said:


> *She isn't suicidal,* she was just blackmailing him. In the full report it has been stated that she was blackmailing him like that for years, asking for large quantities of money every few months. *In reality if she was suicidal, she would have killed herself by now. Her mental condition is just fine!*


You don't know that though. How can you say "her mental condition is just fine" for sure? 



> In conclusion, I would've done the same! Fuck that bitch! Furthermore, she kicked him out of the house when he was 16, so it's not like he owes her anything!


Well I wouldn't. You don't turn your back on family. Look, I'm not saying Punk didn't have his reasons to do what he did, but restraining order on your own mother who could be suicidal, just doesn't seem like the right move. Especially considering how much money punk makes every year.


----------



## Biast

Jof said:


> You don't know that though. How can you say "her mental condition is just fine" for sure?
> 
> 
> 
> Well I wouldn't. You don't turn your back on family. Look, I'm not saying Punk didn't have his reasons to do what he did, but restraining order on your own mother who could be suicidal, just doesn't seem like the right move. Especially considering how much money punk makes every year.


You should know that the judge is forced by the law to make sure Punk's mother takes the proper mental condition tests before making his dicision. And giving the fact that he conceded Punk the restraining order, his mother's mental state tests came out fine, meaning, she isn't suicidal.


----------



## MadaraDaBoss

ok so how did you get from talking about ratings to punk's mother


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Props to Daniel Bryan for not throwing his own mother under the bus. Punk isnt wearing the pink shirts this month because he hates his mom.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

RKO 4life said:


> I mean the last 8 weeks in these threads. But Mark keep trying you'll get better.


What ?


----------



## Loudness

Man what's up with the ratings these days? They're boring as hell. Whatever happened to the good old days when the top guys actually lost viewers and bombed harder than their marks after trying to immitate the yes chants pointing their fingers up during sexual intercourse in the most awkward of ways? Those were the good old days when mark wars still meant something. How the hell am I supposed to lol @ a wrestler if he's making gains in his segments?


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

Loudness said:


> Man what's up with the ratings these days? They're boring as hell. Whatever happened to the good old days when the top guys actually lost viewers and bombed harder than their marks after trying to immitate the yes chants pointing their fingers up during sexual intercourse in the most awkward of ways? Those were the good old days when mark wars still meant something. How the hell am I supposed to lol @ a wrestler if he's making gains in his segments?


Well, there's Orton. He does awful every week. There's always room to laugh at him.


----------



## LovelyElle890

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Well, there's Orton. He does awful every week. There's always room to laugh at him.


Well, nobody wants to laugh at one person all of the time. I want Bryan, Orton, and Punk on the chopping block every week. 

Also, nothing beats a Punk mark going on a tirade because facts got handed to him by Starbuck.

I blame the part-timers for making these guys interesting. Everything was fine until the part-timers stared interacting with wrestlers not named Cena. Honestly, that is when the ratings thread started going downhill. Part-timers are good for business but bad for the ratings thread.

Now we have to rely on dissing people's relationships with their parents for entertainment. It's sad.


----------



## krai999

Biast said:


> She isn't suicidal, she was just blackmailing him. In the full report it has been stated that she was blackmailing him like that for years, asking for large quantities of money every few months. In reality if she was suicidal, she would have killed herself by now. Her mental condition is just fine!
> 
> In conclusion, I would've done the same! Fuck that bitch! Furthermore, *she kicked him out of the house when he was 16,* so it's not like he owes her anything!


I don't blame him at all now


----------



## #Mark

Biast said:


> She isn't suicidal, she was just blackmailing him. In the full report it has been stated that she was blackmailing him like that for years, asking for large quantities of money every few months. In reality if she was suicidal, she would have killed herself by now. Her mental condition is just fine!
> 
> In conclusion, I would've done the same! Fuck that bitch! Furthermore, she kicked him out of the house when he was 16, so it's not like he owes her anything!


Still his mom though. There's two sides to every story, I don't get why you're taking Punk's words as gospel.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

Why is Punk's mom in the ratings thread ?


----------



## krai999

rabidwolverine27 said:


> Why is Punk's mom in the ratings thread ?


it all started with the yo mama jokes on punk


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

When are we getting Torch's breakdown? Don't tell me that all we're gonna get is The Observer's shitty version of a "breakdown."


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

I'm not really surprised Punk has alienated everyone who's ever loved him, this is a guy who knowingly allows his employers to pay him millions of dollars every year, despite the fact that he's never made them a dime.


----------



## Choke2Death

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> I'm not really surprised Punk has alienated everyone who's ever loved him, *this is a guy who knowingly allows his employers to pay him millions of dollars every year, despite the fact that he's never made them a dime.*


:ti

Can't knock that, though. He's using people before they use him.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

What's wrong with that ? He has millions so I don't think he gives a fuck who wouldn't.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

rabidwolverine27 said:


> What's wrong with that ? He has millions so I don't think he gives a fuck who wouldn't.


wut


----------



## Londrick

rabidwolverine27 said:


> Why is Punk's mom in the ratings thread ?


She's a bigger draw than her failure of a son.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

lol


----------



## THANOS

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> I'm not really surprised Punk has alienated everyone who's ever loved him, this is a guy who knowingly allows his employers to pay him millions of dollars every year, despite the fact that he's never made them a dime.





Dunmer said:


> She's a bigger draw than her failure of a son.


:lmao These are especially sound entries.


----------



## Londrick

I get having fallouts with your family but completely cutting out the person who gave birth to you is just pathetic. If it wasn't for Punk's mom there would be no CM Punk. Then again I'm not surprised considering Punk loves to hit his own fans and use homophobic slurs. Going by his DVD it seems his problems with his family is his own fault.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Punk could set up a whorehouse right next to an Army base and still go bankrupt :lmao


----------



## Choke2Death

Dunmer said:


> She's a bigger draw than her failure of a son.


The comedy in this thread never ends. :lmao


----------



## PepeSilvia

http://www.memegeneokerlund.com/media/created/y68trz.jpg


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## funnyfaces1

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Punk could set up a whorehouse right next to an Army base and still go bankrupt :lmao


:lmao


----------



## rabidwolverine27

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Punk could set up a whorehouse right next to an Army base and still go bankrupt :lmao


:lmao But what if they're all Orton clones ? Do they all run away ?


----------



## Death132

Dunmer said:


> I get having fallouts with your family but completely cutting out the person who gave birth to you is just pathetic. If it wasn't for Punk's mom there would be no CM Punk. Then again I'm not surprised considering Punk loves to hit his own fans and use homophobic slurs. Going by his DVD it seems his problems with his family is his own fault.


So because they gave birth to you you have to care about them and that automatically makes up for anything bad they've ever done. Shut up you tool

Unless you've had an abusive parent or even no the whole story with Punk and his mom, which you don't, then you have no room to say anything.


----------



## RKO 4life

Dunmer said:


> I get having fallouts with your family but completely cutting out the person who gave birth to you is just pathetic. If it wasn't for Punk's mom there would be no CM Punk. Then again I'm not surprised considering Punk loves to hit his own fans and use homophobic slurs. Going by his DVD it seems his problems with his family is his own fault.


You would think Vince would see that Punk is no draw by now, and how Tony Hawk really is in real life. Kinda makes you wonder if TNA will take over in the next few years. But damn those ratings are awful in TNA. But keep pushing guys like Bryan and Punk they should take Vince out.


----------



## markedfordeath

says the guy of the fan that loses viewers weekly.


----------



## RKO 4life

markedfordeath said:


> says the guy of the fan that loses viewers weekly.


Lot of haters for the face of the company.


----------



## #Mark

RKO 4life said:


> You would think Vince would see that Punk is no draw by now, and how Tony Hawk really is in real life. Kinda makes you wonder if TNA will take over in the next few years. But damn those ratings are awful in TNA. But keep pushing guys like Bryan and Punk they should take Vince out.


Vince has survived pushing the anti-draw himself Randy Orton so I'm assuming nothing will take him out.


----------



## RKO 4life

#Mark said:


> Vince has survived pushing the anti-draw himself Randy Orton so I'm assuming nothing will take him out.


TNA will if they got the act together. USA will drop them soon if this didn't get fix. Let Orton save it.


----------



## THANOS

RKO 4life said:


> TNA will if they got the act together. USA will drop them soon if this didn't get fix. Let Orton save it.


Orton couldn't save a kitten out of a tree, even if the tree was 1 ft. tall and the kitten was de-clawed.


----------



## markedfordeath

I know I'm going to get attacked for saying this, but Bryan is one of the best things to happen to the WWE in awhile. Whoever attacks him is an instant heel....And whoever aligns with him is an instant face. That's a very very rare talent.


----------



## DoubleDeckerBar

THANOS said:


> Orton couldn't save a kitten in a tree, even if the tree was 1 ft. tall and the kitten was de-clawed.


:lmao

Apparently I must spread rep around before giving it to THANOS again. It's a shame, if ever something deserved rep, it was that.


----------



## Happenstan

THANOS said:


> Orton couldn't save a kitten in a tree, even if the tree was 1 ft. tall and the kitten was de-clawed.


Ouch. :lmao


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

THANOS said:


> Orton couldn't save a kitten in a tree, even if the tree was 1 ft. tall and the kitten was de-clawed.


:lmao

That poor kitty.


----------



## Happenstan

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Punk could set up a whorehouse right next to an Army base and still go bankrupt :lmao


:lmao :rep


----------



## Biast

Punk gaining viewers weekly = People saying he can't draw.

Orton losing viewers almost every week = People saying he will save the company.

fpalm DAT LOGIC


----------



## Londrick

Death132 said:


> So because they gave birth to you you have to care about them and that automatically makes up for anything bad they've ever done. Shut up you tool
> 
> Unless you've had an abusive parent or even no the whole story with Punk and his mom, which you don't, then you have no room to say anything.


Was gonna report you for calling me a tool but that seems pointless now with you being humbled. :lol


----------



## Sonnen Says

THANOS said:


> Orton couldn't save a kitten in a tree, even if the tree was 1 ft. tall and the kitten was de-clawed.


Orton couldn't even draw people in to help that poor kitten.


----------



## SerapisLiber

RKO 4life said:


> Orton carying these ratings!As the past 8 weeks. HHH/Bryan/Punk no draws. Orton/Cena/Vince/Undertaker the draws.
> 
> Guys I don't post to lie.
> 
> 
> 
> Sonnen Says said:
> 
> 
> 
> What are you talking about :lmao
Click to expand...


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Punk hates his mom because SHE HAS A VAGINA!!


----------



## Starbuck

GOAT thread. Punk and Orton getting ripped into for no reason whatsoever. :lol

unk rton2


----------



## rabidwolverine27

What's the difference between Randy Orton and a Robot?


What did the art teacher say to Punk and Bryan ?


----------



## THANOS

rabidwolverine27 said:


> What's the difference between Randy Orton and a Robot?


The robot can be given a personality chip.


----------



## Choke2Death

rabidwolverine27 said:


> What did the art teacher say to Punk and Bryan ?


YOU CAN'T DRAW!

And they both got an F. :bryan2 unk3


----------



## Arya Dark

*wrong thread *


----------



## IWCMember

rabidwolverine27 said:


> What's the difference between Randy Orton and a Robot?


Randy Orton is sexy


----------



## superuser1

rabidwolverine27 said:


> What did the art teacher say to Punk and Bryan ?


Punk how were you capable of bringing in the lowest rating since 1997?


----------



## Biast

superuser1 said:


> Punk how were you capable of bringing in the lowest rating since 1997?


I love blind haters like you! Punk has been GAINING viewers for the past year while the likes of Orton are LOSING viewers on a daily basis. 

See the difference? Do you want me to draw you a picture, a diagram, a graphic, so you could understand it?

''_Ohhh, but, but... RAW scored 2.2 ratings with him as champion a year ago herp derp herp_'' Maybe, but he has been drawing every week since then.

''_He may have been drawing for the last 300 days, but he lost viewers 3 consecutive weeks one year ago, so he can't draw. Cause everybody knows 3 weeks of low ratings > an entire year of gaining ratings herp derp._''

fpalm You guys are something else!


----------



## THANOS

Biast said:


> I love blind haters like you! Punk has been GAINING viewers for the past year while the likes of Orton have been LOSING viewers on a daily basis.
> 
> See the difference?


I'd be interested in seeing if someone could make a list of all the times Punk and Orton have lost viewers since the beginning of 2013 and see who's list is longer. That would clear up a lot of confusion, or maybe even create more :HHH2.


----------



## Choke2Death

THANOS said:


> I'd be interested in seeing if someone could make a list of all the times Punk and Orton have lost viewers since the beginning of 2013 and see who's list is longer. That would clear up a lot of confusion, or maybe even create more :HHH2.


Let's see.

Orton in 2013: Spends the first half being wasted with no direction in random, pointless matches with no purpose - many of which are put in random spots and are destined to fail. Around June, finally gets some direction with the Team Hell No/Shield stuff and then starts to be put in places where you can hold him responsible for numbers. Does good gains when they put some effort into the segment/match (coronation post-SummerSlam, matches with Cody & Goldust plus go-home segment with Bryan before Battleground) and loses viewers when there's no reason to tune in (matches with Kofi & Christian)

Punk in 2013: Feuds with The Rock, Cena (temporarily), Undertaker and Brock Lesnar. 99% of the time is always placed in segments that are expected to gain (opener, 9PM, 10PM, main event) and sometimes he does good numbers (Chicago promo) while other times he flops (see the pre-NoC promo at 10PM that lost viewers)

Of course Punk is gonna have the better track record here. unk2 If he couldn't even win this one sided battle, he should be ashamed of himself.


----------



## Biast

THANOS said:


> I'd be interested in seeing if someone could make a list of all the times Punk and Orton have lost viewers since the beginning of 2013 and see who's list is longer. That would clear up a lot of confusion, or maybe even create more :HHH2.


Punk hasn't lost viewers since the begining of 2013. Ok, maybe once... But haters will be haters, nonetheless! ''OMG he lost viewers once! HE CANT DRAWZZZZ!''

Let me tell you what happens with Punk haters. The guy is sooooooo good that for them to have a legitimate argument against him, they have to go AN ENTIRE YEAR back. :lmao


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

CM GOAT's the only consistent draw they have at the moment. Dem haters can only use the excuses they had a year ago to try and sound credible, because they have nothing recent. Let 'em have their fun.

And coincidentally, it's all of the Orton marks who are trying to cover up their boytoy's failures as a draw.


----------



## Sonnen Says

If Punk became a major draw in for example 2014 they will still talk about what happened 2 years ago because that's the only argument they have against him. Yeah lets blame him for some of the low ratings that happened in October/December last year and lets label it as a symbol of Punk ratings as champ all year :lmao. Just like the idiots who bring the 2.2 rating every time there is an argument about Punk. Forgetting the real reasons why it got that rating. Many reasons for that but they dismiss everything else and blame Punk only for everything. Those kind of people make me laugh every time tho.


----------



## Londrick

TNA needs it's own ratings thread.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

What ratings ?


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> *CM GOAT's the only consistent draw they have at the moment.* Dem haters can only use the excuses they had a year ago to try and sound credible, because they have nothing recent. Let 'em have their fun.
> 
> And coincidentally, it's all of the Orton marks who are trying to cover up their boytoy's failures as a draw.


Payback 2013, Summerslam 2013. Nuff said.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Biast said:


> I love blind haters like you! Punk has been GAINING viewers for the past year while the likes of Orton are LOSING viewers on a daily basis.
> 
> See the difference?


But see here's the thing. Orton marks aren't around here overrating the crap out of him & saying he should be main eventing Mania over part timers.

That's why Punk gets shit hurled at him about ratings.

Also let me clear this up while I'm at it. No one actually cares about ratings. Just because we understand why things are the way they are doesn't mean we really care. It's an interesting little topic to discuss, nothing more.


----------



## Sonnen Says

CHIcagoMade said:


> But see here's the thing. *Orton marks aren't around here overrating the crap out of him & saying he should be main eventing Mania over part timers.*
> 
> That's why Punk gets shit hurled at him about ratings.
> 
> Also let me clear this up while I'm at it. No one actually cares about ratings. Just because we understand why things are the way they are doesn't mean we really care. It's an interesting little topic to discuss, nothing more.


Orton already mainevented WM so why will they complain! Who said he should Mainevent over part timers cant he mainevent with a part timer? Why not he deserves it.


----------



## Starbuck

I will seriously die laughing if Orton/Punk happens at Wrestlemania. I don't think this thread could take it. Personally I'm rooting for the match because the shitstorm in this thread would be unreal. Come on, Vince. BOOK IT.


----------



## Alo0oy

Starbuck said:


> I will seriously die laughing if Orton/Punk happens at Wrestlemania. I don't think this thread could take it. Personally I'm rooting for the match because the shitstorm in this thread would be unreal. Come on, Vince. BOOK IT.


I don't care about ratings, I want this match to happen because unlike the rest of the roster, they're not goofy characters that smile 80% of the time & then make poop jokes for the remaining 20%.

That feud would be edgy & a Ruthless Aggression throwback. We won't see Punk telling Orton how pretty he is or Orton telling Punk how he is all about hustle, loyalty, & respect. fpalm

From an entertainment standpoint, I don't see why would anybody that hates the current family-friendly product would hate their feud.


----------



## Starbuck

Alo0oy said:


> I don't care about ratings, I want this match to happen because unlike the rest of the roster, they're not goofy characters that smile 80% of the time & then make poop jokes for the remaining 20%.
> 
> That feud would be edgy & a Ruthless Aggression throwback. We won't see Punk telling Orton how pretty he is or Orton telling Punk how he is all about hustle, loyalty, & respect. fpalm
> 
> From an entertainment standpoint, I don't see why would anybody that hates the current family-friendly product would hate their feud.


I liked their last feud heading into Mania 27. I liked the match too. If they do it again both of them will be on much more equal footing this time not to mention the heel/face role reversal. I'm not totally opposed to the idea at all. But if it happens I'm going to :lol so hard at the bitch fits thrown every week. 

Punk/Orton and HHH/Cena. :lmao The crying would be endless over those matches.


----------



## Londrick

Starbuck said:


> I liked their last feud heading into Mania 27. I liked the match too. If they do it again both of them will be on much more equal footing this time not to mention the heel/face role reversal. I'm not totally opposed to the idea at all. But if it happens I'm going to :lol so hard at the bitch fits thrown every week.
> 
> Punk/Orton and HHH/Cena. :lmao The crying would be endless over those matches.


and Ryback vs Taker.


----------



## Alo0oy

Starbuck said:


> I liked their last feud heading into Mania 27. I liked the match too. If they do it again both of them will be on much more equal footing this time not to mention the heel/face role reversal. I'm not totally opposed to the idea at all. But if it happens I'm going to :lol so hard at the bitch fits thrown every week.
> 
> Punk/Orton and HHH/Cena. :lmao The crying would be endless over those matches.


The only people I see bitching about it would be Bryan marks if it's for the WWE title, or Orton/Punk marks if it's not. Marks for each one of those wrestlers wants them in a WWE title match, I'm in the minority though, I prefer an entertaining feud over a boring feud for the WWE title.

I could care less if my favorites are holding the WWE title, as long as they're booked in a relevant well-written feud & not in midcard hell.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

Billion Dollar Man said:


> Payback 2013, Summerslam 2013. Nuff said.


As in the PPV that had Ryback/Cena as the main focus, and the PPV that had Bryan as the main focus. lol. Oh, the desperation these days is lovely.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> As in the PPV that had Ryback/Cena as the main focus, and the PPV that had *Bryan as the main focus*. lol. Oh, the desperation these days is lovely.


Huh? I thought Brock/Punk was the "selling point" of that PPV?


----------



## Londrick

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Huh? I thought Brock/Punk was the "selling point" of that PPV?


----------



## MaybeLock

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Huh? I thought Brock/Punk was the "selling point" of that PPV?


Here we go again :lmao Somebody bring the popcorn :dance


----------



## Sonnen Says

MaybeLock said:


> Here we go again :lmao Somebody bring the popcorn :dance


I think it should end with Dunmer post that gif is hilarious.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

:clap


----------



## Cliffy

Yo Punk Marks:


----------



## Starbuck

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

8*D


----------



## Cliffy

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Sensational Thread name change :banderas


----------



## Starbuck

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*


----------



## Biast

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Thread is so booooooooooooooooooring that it needs a name change to attract posters. fpalm


----------



## Choke2Death

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

lol @ the name change.

What the overly defensive Punk marks don't get when they use the "Punk didn't main event" excuse for PPVs that flopped: He doesn't have to main event to draw people in. It's as if the match that main events suddenly cancels out every buy another highly promoted angle would have contributed so the only one responsible is the main event. You know damn well you would have been here celebrating "CM DRAW" if Payback or SummerSlam would have done well. But since they didn't, you put the blame on everyone except Punk.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

To be fair Bryan marks are just as bad. Especially when they say he's a better wrestler than Chris Benoit.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*










New thread title = GOAT.


----------



## Choke2Death

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



rabidwolverine27 said:


> To be fair Bryan marks are just as bad. Especially when they say he's a better wrestler than Chris Benoit.


Not gonna defend Bryan marks but there are a few Punk marks that are worse than any Bryan marks I've seen.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

That I agree. Mblonde09 is the first one that comes to mind.


----------



## Duberry

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Dunmer said:


> TNA needs it's own ratings thread.


The "TNA ratings and attendance thread" would be the greatest thing to happen to this forum since the Tna section was removed for a few days.


----------



## Gandhi

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

If I like somebody and 90% of the world don't give a shit about him or hate him I won't suddenly think he sucks.

That being said, I don't know why anybody on here gives a shit about ratings.


----------



## krai999

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

hey punk marks




go to 1:39
before you marks bring up bryan. I already know about his limitations more than you think


----------



## krai999

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

this thread title is a game changer


----------



## Starbuck

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



krai999 said:


> this thread title is a game changer


We're talking about Punk here. Do you mean game changer or channel changer? 

unk


----------



## Londrick

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



rabidwolverine27 said:


> That I agree. Mblonde09 is the first one that comes to mind.


lol @ when there was several pages in the old thread of people posting laughing gifs in response to him making some post defending Punk's drawing power.



SJFC said:


> The "TNA ratings and attendance thread" would be the greatest thing to happen to this forum since the Tna section was removed for a few days.


Seriously. I don't know what would be more epic, guys like mblonde09 and WF35 defending Punk or TNA marks defending current TNA's ratings.


----------



## 4everEyebrowRaisin

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

I think I'm in the wrong neighbourhood...


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Starbuck said:


> We're talking about Punk here. Do you mean game changer or *channel changer? *
> 
> unk


I though that was supposed to be Nash unk


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

The Bryan marks still sour about the Summerslam buys. :lol So the guy completely bombed the first PPV he was the main focus of, it's time to move on. Hey, maybe NOC and Battleground will do well..

Oh right, Bryan vs. Orton... 

:lmao


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

:lmao the the thread title. 

2.2 PUNK.


----------



## Cliffy

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



SJFC said:


> The "TNA ratings and attendance thread" would be the greatest thing to happen to this forum since the Tna section was removed for a few days.


Not sure why we don't have an official state of TNA business thread.

It would keep everything in 1 thread.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Cliffy Byro said:


> Not sure why we don't have an official state of TNA business thread.
> 
> It would keep everything in 1 thread.


I agree. It seems everyday there's a new thread about their ratings, business, attendance, etc. Having one official LOL TNA thread would solve the problem of having so many meaningless thread.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Mister WrestleMania said:


> :lmao the the thread title.
> 
> 2.2 PUNK.


Lol didn't HBK get a 1.8 rating as a champ?


----------



## Chismo

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

The name change, heheh.

Orton vs. Punk?

:ti




Cliffy Byro said:


> Yo Punk Marks:


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Sonnen Says said:


> Lol didn't HBK get a 1.8 rating as a champ?


Not sure. But yeah, Raw in 1996 and 2013, totally the same thing. Not to mention, HBK had alittle thing called the nWo in it's early days (1996, when it was at its best) to contend with on the other channel. What wrestling show does Raw have to contend with today?

Oh, that's right. None.

:hbk1


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

New thread title = about damn time. :lmao


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

i bet the ratings go up once there is an actual champion.


----------



## DA

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Awful


----------



## Biast

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Starbuck said:


> We're talking about Punk here. Do you mean game changer or channel changer?
> 
> unk


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Mister WrestleMania said:


> Not sure. But yeah, Raw in 1996 and 2013, totally the same thing. Not to mention, HBK had alittle thing called the nWo in it's early days (1996, when it was at its best) to contend with on the other channel. What wrestling show does Raw have to contend with today?
> 
> Oh, that's right. None.
> 
> :hbk1


That wasnt the only one, I just pointed out the lowest of his. By the way it got 2.2 because it was a Christmas show nothing more and he was injured anyway. On the other hand it's a 3 hours show hard to fill only the ones with a brain will understand plus it wasn't a 3 hours show back then. People get tired watching for 3 hours if Rock loses viewers it tells you something. The Competition will be the NFL or whatever it is called. Also the talent is not as good as it was once. Even tho there is some great talents now but unfortunately they are not pushed yet.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

the audience gets tired at the end of Raw...When i went last time, everyone around me was exhausted because during the commercial breaks there's a lot of downtime....so you're just like whatever most of the filler time.


----------



## A$AP

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

:ti


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Sonnen Says said:


> *That wasnt the only one, I just pointed out the lowest of his.* By the way it got 2.2 because it was a Christmas show nothing more and he was injured anyway. On the other hand it's a 3 hours show hard to fill only the ones with a brain will understand plus it wasn't a 3 hours show back then. People get tired watching for 3 hours if Rock loses viewers it tells you something. The Competition will be the NFL or whatever it is called. Also the talent is not as good as it was once. Even tho there is some great talents now but unfortunately they are not pushed yet.


And that still doesn't change the fact that Raw was much different back then. It also doesn't change the fact that the WWF had legit competition on the very same night, unlike today. Ratings weren't high in the mid 90s, which is why they finally went edgy. Anyone with a brain would know WCW had the nWo angle in 1996, which would be the hottest WCW would EVER be business wise. And the talent in 1996 was very thin for the WWF. They a good main event (HBK, Taker, Bret, who was out for 8 months in 1996, while HBK was champ) and a whole lot of nothing. Austin and Rock were there, but were nowhere near being what they would become in the future.


----------



## JY57

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

http://pwinsider.com/article/81051/smackdown-audience-rises.html?p=1



> The 10/18 edition of Smackdown did 2,640,000 viewers, well up from last week and is the best number in weeks.


up from 2,453,000 the week before (still # 2 in Cable behind MLB Playoffs)


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



JY57 said:


> http://pwinsider.com/article/81051/smackdown-audience-rises.html?p=1
> 
> 
> 
> up from 2,453,000 the week before (still # 2 in Cable behind MLB Playoffs)


Good Job Los Matadores. :dance :clap :cheer


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

The Bryan Smackdown Show with the ratings again LOL love it.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



JY57 said:


> http://pwinsider.com/article/81051/smackdown-audience-rises.html?p=1
> 
> 
> 
> up from 2,453,000 the week before (still # 2 in Cable behind MLB Playoffs)


You can thank 

unk

for that.

They advertised him, and it gets the best number in weeks. The GOAT just GOATing in the ratings like he does in 2013.

It must be too bad for the Punk haters. He's doing so consistently well this year, their only option is to resort to last year to try and bash him. Even still bringing up the Christmas Eve RAW that John Cena main evented. :lmao DAT DEPSERATION.


----------



## Skins

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Cliffy Byro said:


> Yo Punk Marks:


I'm a punk fan, but this is one of the greatest things ever :lmao:lmao


----------



## 4everEyebrowRaisin

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

*sticks head through door* Is it safe to be a Punk mark yet?


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

^ :lmao

That Youtube video fucking nailed it.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Punk bringing in DEM RATINGS? Well, fuck, what can we bash him on then? His family and posting Youtube videos? Sounds like a plan!

= This thread.

I miss it when the trolling in here was fun and had to do with ratings. Damnit Phil, why must you have to GOAT in the ratings now. At least there's always going to be Orton and Bryan's hilarious failures to laugh at.

:troll


----------



## THANOS

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



redskins25 said:


> I'm a punk fan, but this is one of the greatest things ever :lmao:lmao


Agreed :lmao. I could probably refute every single one of those points, or at least most of them, but it doesn't make it any less hilarious.


----------



## Sonnen Says

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



THANOS said:


> Agreed :lmao. I could probably refute every single one of those points, or at least most of them, but it doesn't make it any less hilarious.


The funny thing is he's now a Punk mark :lol


----------



## DA

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Punk haters getting trolled by the GOAT WJ :banderas






:banderas


----------



## nevereveragainu

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



Biast said:


> I'm so going to hell. :jordan2












let me get that for you


----------



## xD7oom

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

YES CM PUNK SUCKS THREAD :mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark::mark:


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

A lot more believability and oomph in the 10.5 minute video.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

no matter what anyone says, this year Bryan and Punk are bringing in the ratings, so far this year putting Cena to shame....


----------



## Duberry

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

ALRIGHTYYYYY

WJ changes his opinion like Punk changes broads. Doesn't make his vids any less brilliant though.


----------



## Choke2Death

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

WJ is so fucking hilarious. :lol


----------



## Biast

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*






:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Punk bringing in DEM RATINGS? Well, fuck, what can we bash him on then? His family and posting Youtube videos? Sounds like a plan!
> 
> = This thread.
> 
> I miss it when the trolling in here was fun and had to do with ratings. Damnit Phil, why must you have to GOAT in the ratings now. At least there's always going to be Orton and Bryan's hilarious failures to laugh at.
> 
> :troll



Summerslam says hello. So does Payback.


----------



## Bearodactyl

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

I just can't with WJ anymore..


----------



## Biast

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Billion Dollar Man said:


> Summerslam says hello. So does Payback.


Summerslam = Bryan, Punk and Cena.

Payback = Cena and Ryback.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Yeah, they say hello to Bryan, and Cena/Ryback. Nice try, but it doesn't work because you aren't really thinking but instead blindly hating.

So the only breakdown we'll get for last RAW is the Observer's? Which means they're going to group Punk and Bryan's segments together? But who are we going to blame/credit for the 10 segment? 



Biast said:


> Summerslam = Bryan and Punk.


And Lesnar, and Cena. All four deserve blame. But most of it obviously goes to Bryan because he was the most promoted and built up guy in the SS build. But we've already been through that.


----------



## DOPA

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

I love how easily Wrestlinfan35 is getting worked up by all of this :lmao. Trying so desperately to defend Punk whilst everyone else is laughing their ass off at WJ's youtube videos :lmao :lmao :lmao

Dude, chill the fuck out :lmao.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Er, what? Clearly you don't know what this thread is actually about. :lmao

And I don't have to defend Punk. Da GOAT's numbers speak for themselves.

Dat SD the highest in weeks. Sorry Orton and Bryan.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

dude just stop, all you ever want to do is blame the wrestlers for stuff, its so sad. I bet you don't even buy the ppvs, and you blame the wrestlers when you're part of the problem for not spending your money.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Weren't you the guy that told KO Bossy to kill himself or something after you got so worked up over Bryan's failure to be a draw?


----------



## Raw2003

You guys are just pathetic smarks wasting your time on a thread like this, pathetic really 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## validreasoning

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

wrestling jesus should become a comedian because some of his stuff is really great


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Daniel Bryan and Smackdown...been there, done that.

Good on WWE for letting some mid-carders get some shine on the SyFy Network. Should be right up some of their alleys.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Anyone notice how Orton has his first WWE title match in a couple years at Summerslam 2013 yet it doesn't do well? Don't think that's a coincidence.


----------



## Stad

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Mister WrestleMania said:


> And that still doesn't change the fact that Raw was much different back then. It also doesn't change the fact that the WWF had legit competition on the very same night, unlike today. Ratings weren't high in the mid 90s, which is why they finally went edgy. Anyone with a brain would know WCW had the nWo angle in 1996, which would be the hottest WCW would EVER be business wise. And the talent in 1996 was very thin for the WWF. They a good main event (HBK, Taker, Bret, who was out for 8 months in 1996, while HBK was champ) and a whole lot of nothing. Austin and Rock were there, but were nowhere near being what they would become in the future.


MAKIN UP DEM EXCUSES.

:hayden3


----------



## KingLobos

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Er, what? Clearly you don't know what this thread is actually about. :lmao
> 
> And I don't have to defend Punk. Da GOAT's numbers speak for themselves.
> 
> Dat SD the highest in weeks. Sorry Orton and Bryan.


They do speak for themselves. And they are pretty pathetic numbers. But for a midcarder (like Punk) they are impressive. I guess the bar has been lowered so much for Phillip, that you are actually celebrating Orton and Bryan's failures? LOL. Bryan ain't a draw and neither is Orton. All mediocre midcarders who are just waiting for the eventual return of John Cena. But I guess Bryan and Orton are the company that Phillip should be compared to.

Mid-Card 4 Life


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Stad said:


> MAKIN UP DEM EXCUSES.
> 
> :hayden3


Or facts. Not that you're expected to have knowledge of them. Unlike some Punk marks, I've never labeled HBK a "Ratings God!!11" :lmao


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

nobody on here buys ppvs, yet they complain.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



markedfordeath said:


> nobody on here buys ppvs, yet they complain.


I do, at least the ones with Rock/Brock. The rest are garbage.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

i buy every single one...but most of the people stream on here, yet complain about drawing ability LOL


----------



## Chismo

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Yeah, they say hello to Bryan, and Cena/Ryback. Nice try, but it doesn't work because you aren't really thinking but instead blindly hating.
> 
> So the only breakdown we'll get for last RAW is the Observer's? Which means they're going to group Punk and Bryan's segments together? But who are we going to blame/credit for the 10 segment?
> 
> 
> 
> And Lesnar, and Cena. All four deserve blame. But most of it obviously goes to Bryan because he was the most promoted and built up guy in the SS build. But we've already been through that.


----------



## THANOS

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Chismo said:


>


love that gif :lmao.


----------



## Londrick

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

I have yet to hear about fans walking out before/during Bryan matches. Can't say the same about Punk's matches.


----------



## xdoomsayerx

Dunmer said:


> I have yet to hear about fans walking out before/during Bryan matches. Can't say the same about Punk's matches.




I did for Bryans match at Payback.


----------



## Stad

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Mister WrestleMania said:


> Or facts. Not that you're expected to have knowledge of them. Unlike some Punk marks, I've never labeled HBK a "Ratings God!!11" :lmao


I don't think Punk is a ratings god, i don't give a shit about ratings. I come in this thread to laugh at all you dweebs who argue every week who is a draw and who isn't.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Stad said:


> I don't think Punk is a ratings god, i don't give a shit about ratings. I come in this thread to laugh at all you dweebs who argue every week who is a draw and who isn't.


I'm not saying you have or haven't. But for the some that do call him that.


----------



## Jof

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

I think that smackdown ratings bump likely has to do with Big show than Punk. On the smackdown episode the week before, for some reason WWE didn't progress the corporation storyline which they usually do post RAW. They did that on RAW instead.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Smackdown got 2.640 million viewers this week, the highest in over a month? CM Punk was advertised? 

Clearly Smackdown would've gotten over 3 million if Punk wasn't announced to be there.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Jof said:


> I think that smackdown ratings bump likely has to do with Big show than Punk. On the smackdown episode the week before, for some reason WWE didn't progress the corporation storyline which they usually do post RAW. They did that on RAW instead.


:ambrose2


----------



## Londrick

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Bryan's run on SD a couple years ago do better than Punk when he was feuding with Jeff Hardy and Taker.


----------



## Choke2Death

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Jof said:


> I think that smackdown ratings bump likely has to do with Big show than Punk. On the smackdown episode the week before, for some reason WWE didn't progress the corporation storyline which they usually do post RAW. They did that on RAW instead.


Or maybe because last week had ZERO star power and this week they finally brought back the usual people who are on the show? The biggest stars on the show last week were... Cody & Dustin and Del Rio.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Last week, sure. But best in weeks? Only one difference...

unk

Looks like the WWE will only bring Punk in for SD when the guys over on that show just aren't cutting it. Arrive. RATINGS. Leave.


----------



## funnyfaces1

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Punk, Bryan, and Randy steady bringing in them :henry1 numbers. But ultimately there can only be one GOAT.


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

last week on Smackdown nobody was on. Sandow was given the spotlight. so of course it was the lowest amount of viewers.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



markedfordeath said:


> nobody on here buys ppvs, yet they complain.


That's not true at all, & why complain when I can just quite simply, stop watching.

But I do agree that most people on this forum haven't put one red cent into the product. Yet they think the product should be catered to them.

It's quite hilarious.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Why are you talking about last week's Smackdown? We know it had nobody. But three of the Smackdowns prior to last week, the shows had Bryan, Orton, Triple H, and Big Show, but they all did less than this week. And all it needed was the GOAT to bring in the viewers.

unk :langston > :bryan :HHH rton2 :show


----------



## markedfordeath

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Bryan wasn't on the Smackdown two weeks ago either man, he was too busy proposing to his long time girlfriend..but nice try.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



markedfordeath said:


> Bryan wasn't on the Smackdown two weeks ago either man, he was too busy proposing to his long time girlfriend..but nice try.


C'mon son. This week's was the best since September 13th. Bryan was on the September 20th Smackdown. So he's still included.


----------



## Jof

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Sep 20, 27 and last week with punk had about the same viewership. 2.6m viewers.



Choke2Death said:


> Or maybe because last week had ZERO star power and this week they finally brought back the usual people who are on the show? The biggest stars on the show last week were... Cody & Dustin and Del Rio.


Yeah, it was probably the reason for increase.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Jof said:


> Sep 20, 27 and last week with punk had about the same viewership. 2.6m viewers.
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, it was probably the reason for increase.


Nah, this week had more viewers. 

I love how hard it is for the Punk haters to give any credit. :lmao Mad that the GOAT had to go over to their boys' show to revive the ratings a bit.


----------



## funnyfaces1

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

Let it be known that CM Punk's part of the quarter went from 8:31-8:38, and now :hbk :jpl and Stephanie are recovering the number of viewers that Punk drove away with that promo.


----------



## Kamaria

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*

I'm just going to point to my sig in response to all the bull on this thread.


----------



## RKO 4life

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



markedfordeath said:


> last week on Smackdown nobody was on. Sandow was given the spotlight. so of course it was the lowest amount of viewers.


Which is sad because Sandow should be used better then this. If they gave him anything good people would watch. The guy has lots of talent. I feel he can draw people in.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Kamaria said:


> I'm just going to point to my sig in response to all the bull on this thread.


Thanks for setting us straight bro, I think we can finally close this thread up for good now. (Y)


----------



## Karma101

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



CHIcagoMade said:


> Thanks for setting us straight bro, I think we can finally close this thread up for good now. (Y)


That sounds like wishful thinking.


----------



## Chrome

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Kamaria said:


> I'm just going to point to my sig in response to all the bull on this thread.


Wasn't that the dude who stole people's posts from other forums and posted them here as his own?


----------



## Cliffy

*Re: Official CM Punk marks getting ripped to pieces thread **All TV Ratings Talk Here*



Chrome said:


> Wasn't that the dude who stole people's posts from other forums and posted them here as his own?


Yes.


----------



## Bfo4jd

First hour was stacked, chances are viewers built from Q1 through Q4. Even if it did not, Bryan vs Ambrose match may have been the only quarter to lose viewers, rest of them should do well.


----------



## Cliffy

Also, for Dunmer:


----------



## SpaceTraveller

That's the beauty of having Austin as your all time favorite... Anyway you cut it, Austin 3:16 just whoop your ass. I'm a huge Bryan and Punk fan, but gaining numbers is not indicative of being a draw. People are just channel surfing, now Austin went from 1.9/2.0s to 4.5/6.0s, now that's a ratings draw, because he drew NEW viewers. Punk, Bryan and Even Cena are just getting the same audience to channel surf back into the product. The potential audience is still there, I mean Raw 1000 did great numbers (yes it was nostalgic). However, there's still a potential audience. 

Now if you say, well is not their fault because the booking is bad. Meaning the booking controls the ratings. Then you can't praise them either, then just say number a gain is because the booking was good... So Punk and Bryan aren't draws, the booking is the draw. 

Anyways, I'll go back to jerking off to 1984-1989 and 1998-2002 WWF and 2004-2009 ROH and KENTA Oh and Harley Race cutting borderline racist promos.


----------



## Londrick

The waffle house CM Punk pic in that vid. :ti


----------



## Bfo4jd

> The potential audience is still there, I mean Raw 1000 did great numbers (yes it was nostalgic). However, there's still a potential audience.


RAW 1000 averaged 6million, If thats the total potential audience they got, they certainly aren't going to get that number everyweek. Numbers could be a bit up, I'll agree but its not bad either imo.


----------



## Sonnen Says

I wouldn't be surprised if Dunmer made that video.


----------



## JY57

> -- Monday's WWE Raw fell to a year-low in Social Media Activity leading into the Hell in a Cell PPV.
> 
> Raw scored 168,461 in social activity, according to Trendrr.TV, down 21 percent from last week. It was easily the lowest social score of the year - the previous low was 195k in May.
> 
> Raw ranked #3 on cable TV Monday night, trailing Monday Night Football and a TLC show.


via PWTorch


----------



## Bfo4jd

Social Media activity probably peaked in the first hour and fell off greatly from there until the closing promo. Bad layout, nothing more.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

> Hour 1- 3.914
> Hour 2- 3.802
> Hour 3- 3.759


Down and down they go. A lot better than last year's numbers of the same week though, so not totally bad.


----------



## JY57

Hour 1 - 3.914 million
Hour 2 - 3.802 million
Hour 3 - 3.759 million


----------



## markedfordeath

not great, but not awful either! remains consistent each week pretty much.


----------



## validreasoning

they will take 3.8 million average NOW if you offered them the next two weeks

next week you have the world series as well as mnf head to head
in two weeks bears and packers


----------



## markedfordeath

basically they're not doing as badly as people had predicted.


----------



## superuser1

Do the segment by segment breakdown still come out? Havent seen one in weeks.


----------



## KingLobos

The fact is 3 hours is just too much damn television. The money is being made, but the product is suffering IMO. I would also make Smackdown a 1 hour show if I could.

I loved the programming when Sunday Night Heat first debut. Raw was 2 hours and Heat was on Sunday for 1 hour. That was more than enough programming.


----------



## markedfordeath

they make so much on ad revenue, they don't even need the extra hour. instead of 5 hours of wrestling per week, maybe it three, or even just four. And also keep the A show and B show house shows nightly, but also only have like 6-8 ppvs a year. Plus your merchandise sales, you won't lose money. if you have house shows daily, your live attendance will get the job done....and as long as you keep Raw and Smackdown entertaining people will keep buying tickets.


----------



## JY57

final rating - 2.71 with average 3.825 million viewers

better than last year at least which was 2.48 with average 3.55 million (looking at that breakdown damn only two segments worth a damn)


----------



## markedfordeath

do they compare the year to years? or do they not care?


----------



## LilOlMe

markedfordeath said:


> do they compare the year to years? or do they not care?


Well, it'd be stupid to, because there are outside circumstances.

Last year there was a MLB playoff game that Monday night. The deciding game in fact, to determine who goes to the World Series.


ETA: Next Monday will be game 5 of the World Series, if necessary.


----------



## JY57

markedfordeath said:


> do they compare the year to years? or do they not care?


I doubt it. last year like the poster above said had World Series Game on along with MNF and other drama shows.


----------



## wwe4universe

2.71 heading into a ppv. Not good at all. Viking vs Giants shouldnt be the excuse for poor ratings.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

wwe4universe said:


> 2.71 heading into a ppv. Not good at all. Viking vs Giants shouldnt be the excuse for poor ratings.


I watched that and the Chicago Bulls preseason game over Raw TBH. Only segment I made an effort to watch was the last one( which obviously was gonna be the contract signing).


----------



## 4everEyebrowRaisin

What do you expect with shit like this? Something has gotta change. 



















Blaming the football doesn't cut it because they never used to get beaten so badly in the ratings like they do now.


----------



## markedfordeath

it is when you have a fantasy team which tons of people do now.


----------



## WWE

Don't worry, guys.









Coming soon.
​


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Too many cartoon characters. And the biggest one is coming back soon.

:cena4


----------



## markedfordeath

with emasculated babyfaces, never ending feuds and only two segments that matter, how is this a surprise?


----------



## austin316 G.O.A.T

I think Raw would have done better if it was 2 hours instead of 3 hours.3 hours is just too much


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

You know, I can't help but feel this ratings decline is somehow all Curtis Axel's fault. Heyman should drop him immediately.


----------



## Kizzo

markedfordeath said:


> they make so much on ad revenue, they don't even need the extra hour. instead of 5 hours of wrestling per week, maybe it three, or even just four. And also keep the A show and B show house shows nightly, but also only have like 6-8 ppvs a year. Plus your merchandise sales, you won't lose money. if you have house shows daily, your live attendance will get the job done....and as long as you keep Raw and Smackdown entertaining people will keep buying tickets.



Are you crazy! This is Corporate America there is NEVER enough money!! I agree the extra hour isn't needed, but the third hour isn't going away unless they stop making money from it.


----------



## markedfordeath

they make money anyway....having live events every single day...ad revenue from Raw and Smackdown and the PPVs, the ppv buys, the merchandise sales, they make money on everything, they'll never go broke.


----------



## stonefort

Boring Daniel Bryan is a natural TV star. Face it, everybody loves Boring, Dull, and Bland things. Boring Daniel Bryan has all the Boringness anyone could every want. And catch phrases for the kids! Ratings gold, baby!


----------



## funnyfaces1

When that Bears/Packers game occurs, expect the return of the 2.2 era spearheaded by :cena3 :bryan :jpl rton2 unk3 :show


----------



## Sonnen Says

The only way ratings will get any higher is if they go back to 2 hours program.


----------



## Stannis Baratheon.

now the excuse is nba pre season? :lmao


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

GOD said:


> now the excuse is nba pre season? :lmao


ac

No, I said I watched The Bulls Preseason game over it.


----------



## wb1899

A18-49 viewership:
WWE Raw
8:00: 1,702,000 
9:00: 1,628,000 
10:00-11:10: 1,797,000

Monday Night Football - 8:28-11:51: 6,198,000
CrazySexyCool: The TLC Story - 9:00-11:30 Uhr: 3,063,000


----------



## validreasoning

wwe4universe said:


> 2.71 heading into a ppv. Not good at all. Viking vs Giants shouldnt be the excuse for poor ratings.


rating is low but that is due to a far more people per household watching the show, overall viewership is decent for 3+ hours. viewership has only dropped 11% from the pre mania raw. i bet most would have predicted a much bigger drop than that against mnf considering rock was champion then and there has been no champion for 6 weeks now

All the pre ppvs raw ratings in 2013

jan 21 (pre rumble raw)..........................3.04 rating with 4.32 million viewers
feb 11 (pre EC raw)..............................3.16 rating with 4.26 million viewers
apr 1 (pre mania raw)............................3.12 rating with 4.31 million viewers
may 13 (pre extreme rules).......................2.92 rating with 4.05 million viewers
june 10 (pre payback)............................3.04 rating with 3.99 million viewers
july 8 (pre mitb)................................3.08 rating with 4.17 million viewers
august 12 (pre summerslam).......................2.95 rating with 4.11 million viewers
sep 9 (pre noc)..................................2.91 rating with 3.89 million viewers
sep 30 (pre battleground)........................2.68 rating with 3.58 million viewers
oct 21 (pre hiac)................................2.71 rating with 3.83 million viewers


----------



## kingbucket

validreasoning said:


> rating is low but that is due to a far more people per household watching the show, overall viewership is decent for 3+ hours. viewership has only dropped 11% from the pre mania raw. i bet most would have predicted a much bigger drop than that against mnf considering rock was champion then and there has been no champion for 6 weeks now
> 
> All the pre ppvs raw ratings in 2013
> 
> jan 21 (pre rumble raw)..........................3.04 rating with 4.32 million viewers
> feb 11 (pre EC raw)..............................3.16 rating with 4.26 million viewers
> apr 1 (pre mania raw)............................3.12 rating with 4.31 million viewers
> may 13 (pre extreme rules).......................2.92 rating with 4.05 million viewers
> june 10 (pre payback)............................3.04 rating with 3.99 million viewers
> july 8 (pre mitb)................................3.08 rating with 4.17 million viewers
> august 12 (pre summerslam).......................2.95 rating with 4.11 million viewers
> sep 9 (pre noc)..................................2.91 rating with 3.89 million viewers
> sep 30 (pre battleground)........................2.68 rating with 3.58 million viewers
> oct 21 (pre hiac)................................2.71 rating with 3.83 million viewers


That pre mitb rating and viewership.. Mark "Ratings" Henry does it again! :henry1


----------



## JY57

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_74108.shtml#.UmhQgxb3C2w



> WWE Raw's overall TV rating was down six percent compared to last week, but WWE got its biggest audience of the night when it counted in the final half-hour and over-run of the show.
> 
> In the key PPV-buying demographic of males 18-49, Raw's top-rated segments of the show were in Q11 for the main event tag match, Q12 for the first-half of the WWE Title contract signing, and the over-run for the conclusion of the signing.
> 
> Raw Audience Flow m18-49 demographic
> 
> - Overall Show: 1.92 rating and 1.210 million viewers.
> 
> - Q1: Raw opened with a stronger-than-recent 1.96 rating for The Authority opening the show and Big Show interrupting via satellite before Daniel Bryan came out, plus one commercial.
> 
> Included was the first hour's peak audience of 1.481 million viewers at 8:07 p.m. before the mid-quarter commercial.
> 
> - Q2: Raw dipped to a 1.89 rating for U.S. champion Dean Ambrose vs. Daniel Bryan and one mid-match commercial.
> 
> The audience peaked for the finish of the match with 1.325 million viewers at 8:29 p.m.
> 
> - Q3: Raw fell to a near-show-low 1.76 rating for C.M. Punk's on-stage speech and Shawn Michaels backstage with Triple H and Stephanie. There were two full commercial breaks affecting the rating.
> 
> - Q4: Raw increased to a 1.80 rating for Santino Elvis vs. Heath Slater in a comedy match, plus one commercial leading to the top of the hour.
> 
> - Q5: Even with the benefit of the top-of-the-hour bump, Raw was actually down from Q4 with a 1.79 rating for Randy Orton vs. Dolph Ziggler, a John Cena hype video, and one commercial.
> 
> Within the quarter-hour, the audience was stagnant for Orton-Ziggler in the 1.2-million range, then the audience dropped to the 1.1-million range when the video package played before the commercial.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: You could draw a few conclusions here - Orton has been damaged via The Authority storyline, Ziggler has been damaged via constant losing post-World Title run, the match-up was not interesting, people don't want to see Cena in a video package, or something better was on TV at the top of the hour.
> 
> - Q6: Raw rebounded to a strong 1.95 rating for the Divas tag match of A.J. Lee & Tamina vs. the Bellas, one commercial, and Paul Heyman's backstage promo responding to C.M. Punk.
> 
> Within the quarter-hour, the Divas tag match drew the biggest audience of the second hour, averaging more than 1.3 million viewers throughout. Heyman's promo post-commercial was in the 1.2-million range.
> 
> - Q7: Raw fell back to a 1.83 rating for The Wyatts vs. Kofi Kingston & The Miz in a thrown-out-there tag match and one commercial.
> 
> - Q8: Raw fell to a show-low 1.75 rating for a segment with two full commercials and the first-half of C.M. Punk & Big E. Langston vs. Curtis Axel & Ryback.
> 
> - Q9: Raw increased to a below-average 1.90 rating for the second-half of Punk & Langston vs. Axel & Ryback, one commercial, and Real Americans vs. Tons of Funk.
> 
> Zeb Colter's post-match promo bringing out the bull whip drew the largest audience of the segment, registering 1.4 million viewers.
> 
> - Q10: Raw began a steady increase with a 1.94 rating for a segment that included two commercials. In-between commercials, there was another Cena hype video and Rhodes Bros. making their entrance.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: In this segment, people were interested in a Cena video package, as the audience increased from 1.272 million viewers at 10:21 p.m. to nearly 1.5 million viewers for the length of the video.
> 
> - Q11: Raw continued to ascend with a 1.97 rating for the first-half of The Usos vs. The Shield with Rhodes Bros. ringside, plus one commercial.
> 
> - Q12: Raw increased again to a regular-show-high 1.99 rating for the end of the tag match, post-match chaos, one commercial, and the first-half of the WWE Title contract signing featuring Daniel Bryan, Randy Orton, Shawn Michaels, Triple H, and Stephanie McMahon.
> 
> - Over-Run: Raw jumped to a 2.49 rating for the second-half of the contract signing.
> 
> The segment started with 1.501 million viewers at 11:00 p.m., peaked with 1.643 million viewers at 11:06 p.m., and signed off with 1.457 million viewers at 11:09 p.m.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: Something that has been in-play since September has been declining interest in the Punk-Heyman feud, especially when they are not sharing screen time. When it was just them and when they shared screen time, they drew the highest ratings of the show on a consistent basis. Adding Ryback and Axel to the mix in prominent roles has taken away from the simplicity of the Punk-Heyman feud, plus "time" has become a factor stretching the feud too thin while the audience waits for a pay-off.


this week quarter hour ratings for 18-49 male demo (there isn't one for last week; guess WON only for that one )


----------



## markedfordeath

Bryan and Brie bringing in that audience


----------



## Choke2Death

> - Q3: Raw fell to a near-show-low 1.76 rating for C.M. Punk's on-stage speech and Shawn Michaels backstage with Triple H and Stephanie. There were two full commercial breaks affecting the rating.
> 
> - Q8: Raw fell to a show-low 1.75 rating for a segment with two full commercials and the first-half of C.M. Punk & Big E. Langston vs. Curtis Axel & Ryback.


:ti


----------



## KingLobos

Punk doing what he does best in Q3

LOL at Q4 doing better


----------



## markedfordeath

Divas did better, at least Brie is getting noticed now.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

If I had a nickel for everytime Punk or Bryan brought in ratings. I would have zero nickels.


Now if I had a nickel for everytime Austin or Rock brought in ratings. I would be swimming in nickels.


----------



## Happenstan

KingLobos said:


> Punk doing what he does best in Q3


Bombing like Pearl Harbor? Time for Punk to have another meeting with Vince and "re-up" Vince's deal. :vince6 unk7




Mr. Ratings King of the Night *=* :bryan :yes


The Bryan iron is still hot but losing steam, strike now while you still can WWE.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

:lmao at Quarter 5 doing lower than quarter 4. Lowest 9PM in months as well.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

Happenstan said:


> Bombing like Pearl Harbor? Time for Punk to have another meeting with Vince and "re-up" Vince's deal. :vince6 unk7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. Ratings King of the Night *=* :bryan :yes


Don't know why your happy as the most watched part of the show was HHH telling the audience that Daniel Bryan isn't a star.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

No PWTorch breakdown from last week? How will we ever know who was responsible for the 10PM segment, Punk or Bryan? WHO'S TO CREDIT/AT FAULT?????? :bryan2 unk3


----------



## markedfordeath

man Orton can't catch a break from viewers can he?


----------



## rabidwolverine27

Nash should take the belt from Bryan. That would be ratings through the roof.


----------



## Happenstan

The Cynical Miracle said:


> Don't know why your happy as the most watched part of the show was HHH telling the audience that Daniel Bryan isn't a star.


Didn't say whether I was happy or not. But that segment still drew people in to watch regardless of what HHH said, now didn't it? Bryan's time is now. WWE needs to commit while they still can.


----------



## Londrick

Lowest segment of the night being Punk, and people think the main angle would do better with him in Bryan's spot. :lmao


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

> Caldwell's Analysis: You could draw a few conclusions here - Orton has been damaged via The Authority storyline, Ziggler has been damaged via constant losing post-World Title run, the match-up was not interesting, *people don't want to see Cena in a video package,* or something better was on TV at the top of the hour.


Aint that the motherfucking truth. JOHN CENA HYPE VIDEO *NOT* BRINGING IN DEM RATINGS.

:cena4


----------



## MaybeLock

Q4 getting a better rating than Q3 and Q5 is disgusting. 

Well, we better get ready for more dancing segments...


----------



## Jof

Meh... Overrun was gonna do well, we all knew that. Q5 and Q9 failing was a surprise. Q6 gain? good for the divas.


----------



## Happenstan

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Aint that the motherfucking truth. JOHN CENA HYPE VIDEO *NOT* BRINGING IN DEM RATINGS.
> 
> :cena4


That wasn't a Cena package. That was a Cena has returned to us like Jesus package. I was expecting hymns and alter boys running from Priests to appear on screen at any moment.




Jof said:


> Meh... Overrun was gonna do well, we all knew that. Q5 and Q9 failing was a surprise. Q6 gain? good for the divas.


Bryan's f*cking some ratings magic into Brie, obviously.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

Saying Bryan is a better draw than Punk is like saying poop is better than pee.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Also... 



> Q3: Raw fell to a near-show-low 1.76 rating for C.M. Punk's on-stage speech and *Shawn Michaels backstage with Triple H and Stephanie*. There were two full commercial breaks affecting the rating.


:HHH :hbk3

And...



> Q2: Raw dipped to a 1.89 rating for U.S. champion Dean Ambrose vs. Daniel Bryan and one mid-match commercial.


:bryan2


----------



## Jof

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Aint that the motherfucking truth. JOHN CENA HYPE VIDEO *NOT* BRINGING IN DEM RATINGS.
> 
> :cena4


Nah it just means Video packages aren't significant enough to switch over from the game. Who made cadwell the expert anyway? he just needs to report the numbers and shut the fuck up. We can take care of the analysis in here everyweek, right?


----------



## Happenstan

Dunmer said:


> Lowest segment of the night being Punk, and people think the main angle would do better with him in Bryan's spot. :lmao


But it's not fair. This is all John Cena's fault somehow.




rabidwolverine27 said:


> Saying Bryan is a better draw than Punk is like saying poop is better than pee.


Well one is certainly easier to clean up after than the other.


----------



## markedfordeath

Poop is better than pee, and Brie is getting that magic...hopefully the crowd really starts taking to her. I thought they would lose viewers due to Nikki wearing Cena's hat lol


----------



## Londrick

The Sandrone said:


> Also...
> 
> 
> 
> :HHH :hbk3


If they can't draw either I guess that means we know who the big draw in the main angle is. :bryan


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

The Sandrone said:


> Also...
> 
> 
> 
> :HHH :hbk3


That HBK/HHH/Stephanie segment was like what, 20 seconds? We all know who takes the major blame there:

unk7


----------



## Happenstan

Dunmer said:


> If they can't draw either I guess that means we know who the big draw in the main angle is. :bryan


:yes


Watching you troll Punk fans about Phil's latest failure or Bryan's recent triumph is always a joy to behold.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Mister WrestleMania said:


> That HBK/HHH/Stephanie segment was like what, 20 seconds? We all know who takes the major blame there:
> 
> unk7


Nah, it was a lot longer than that :HHH and :hbk3 couldn't carry the weight.



> If they can't draw either I guess that means we know who the big draw in the main angle is.


Indeed, if it wasn't for this:



> Q2: Raw dipped to a 1.89 rating for U.S. champion Dean Ambrose vs. Daniel Bryan and one mid-match commercial.


Everyone's a drawing failure. People just tune in randomly. That's the only explanation for Q4 with that Elvis-Cobra comedy shit doing so well (well, not doing "well", but gaining on the previous quarter, which in quarter 4 is doing "well").


----------



## rabidwolverine27

They need to bring in Nash. Am I the only one who thinks that ? He should take the belt of Bryan. This forum would explode.


----------



## markedfordeath

isn't it funny how they think bringing Cena back will make things better, when no one gave a shit about the video packages? isn't that a sign that he wont make things better?


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Yeah, you're right, 30 seconds.

If people had tuned into see the Punk promo, they would have seen the rest of the QH.

unk


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

Happenstan said:


> Didn't say whether I was happy or not. But that segment still drew people in to watch regardless of what HHH said, now didn't it? *Bryan's time is now. WWE needs to commit while they still can*.


You just don't understand the business. Stop living in fantasy land. WWE will never commit to DB. HHH said it himself on live tv, even if he wins the belt, he will never be the guy.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Yeah, you're right, 30 seconds.
> 
> If people had tuned into see the Punk promo, they would have seen the rest of the QH.
> 
> unk


Nah, people tuned out right after Punk's promo ended. It just wasn't long enough to keep the interest for the whole quarter (was only 4 minutes or so). HBK and HHH couldn't keep the interest after he left the screen. No one wants to watch a couple of old-timers anymore. unk2

Edit: Segment was two minutes by the way. :lmao


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> Indeed, if it wasn't for this


When does the opening of RAW ever draw big numbers since going 3 hours?


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Holy fuck I'm dying over here:



> - Q3: Raw fell to a near-show-low 1.76 rating for C.M. Punk's on-stage speech and Shawn Michaels backstage with Triple H and Stephanie. There were two full commercial breaks affecting the rating.
> 
> - Q8: Raw fell to a show-low 1.75 rating for a segment with two full commercials and the first-half of C.M. Punk & Big E. Langston vs. Curtis Axel & Ryback.


:lmao


----------



## rabidwolverine27

Why the hell would Bryan or Punk be the face of the company ? They will never be on Cena's level it's true prove me wrong.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Holy fuck I'm dying over here:
> 
> 
> 
> :lmao


DAT HBK/HHH "FIRST MEETING SINCE HHH TURNED HEEL" FAILING! :lmao



> When does the opening of RAW ever draw big numbers since going 3 hours?


Nah, he lost viewers from quarter 1. He's a drawing failure. :bryan2


----------



## Happenstan

The Cynical Miracle said:


> You just don't understand the business. Stop living in fantasy land. WWE will never commit to DB. HHH said it himself on live tv, even if he wins the belt, he will never be the guy.


HHH said this on live tv? Well then it must be true. Thank you for opening my eyes. How have we poor wretched wrestling fans survived this long without your wisdom?





rabidwolverine27 said:


> Why the hell would Bryan or Punk be the face of the company ? They will never be on Cena's level it's true prove me wrong.


No kidding. Cena will die mid-ring before there is a new face of the WWE crowned.


----------



## markedfordeath

fact is, that Bryan's matches still get people to watch...he's a wrestling machine.


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> Nah, he lost viewers from quarter 1. He's a drawing failure. :bryan2


"Don't stop believing...hold on to that feeling..."


----------



## rabidwolverine27

The next face of the company isn't even in the WWE right now. I don't know anyone in the WWE right now that could. They can't have a garden gnome or a waffle house cook as the face of the company.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

CM GOAT drawing in dem ratings for Monday Night Raw.


----------



## MaybeLock

rabidwolverine27 said:


> The next face of the company isn't even in the WWE right now.


I´m sorry to tell you that he is: 









:argh:


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

This Happenstan dude needs to go. 

Not only does he not understand the business. He's a horrifically unfunny comedian.


----------



## Happenstan

The Cynical Miracle said:


> This Happenstan dude needs to go.
> 
> Not only does he not understand the business. He's a horrifically unfunny comedian.


Geez, I didn't mean to kick THAT much sand into your vagina.


----------



## Fanboi101

LOL epic fail by Punk. He truly can't draw worth shit.

Also, these ratings suggest Heyman / NFL half-time are entirely responsible for the big gain "Punk segments" were getting a few weeks ago.


----------



## Happenstan

Fanboi101 said:


> LOL epic fail by Punk. He truly can't draw worth shit.
> 
> Also, these ratings suggest Heyman / NFL half-time are entirely responsible for the big gain "Punk segments" were getting a few weeks ago.


As if any non-Punk lover didn't call this weeks ago. Punk does his best work when he's striking up at someone not feuding downward with someone like Axel or a bitched out Ryback. Punk can't carry a feud when he is the top star in said feud.


----------



## krai999

- Q3: Raw fell to a near-show-low *1.76 rating for C.M. Punk's on-stage speech *and Shawn Michaels backstage with Triple H and Stephanie. There were two full commercial breaks affecting the rating.

- Q4: Raw increased to a *1.80 rating for Santino Elvis vs. Heath Slater in a comedy match*, plus one commercial leading to the top of the hour.

*Raw fell to a show-low 1.75 rating *for a segment with two full commercials and the first-half of* C.M. Punk *& Big E. Langston vs. Curtis Axel & Ryback.


----------



## TheStig

Fanboi101 said:


> LOL epic fail by Punk. He truly can't draw worth shit.
> 
> Also, these ratings suggest Heyman / NFL half-time are entirely responsible for the big gain "Punk segments" were getting a few weeks ago.


From what I have seen promo segments gains alot more than wrestling matches. The recent months have shown us 1 other thing, punk/heyman segment with the whole quarter(15min) gains alot and if around 5-10 min gains only little or loses. Since we dont have minute to minute breakdown there's not much to tell.


----------



## Londrick

I think the fans tuned out cause they didn't want to watch a child molester. :AJ unk


----------



## Happenstan

krai999 said:


> - Q3: Raw fell to a near-show-low *1.76 rating for C.M. Punk's on-stage speech *and Shawn Michaels backstage with Triple H and Stephanie. There were two full commercial breaks affecting the rating.
> 
> - Q4: Raw increased to a *1.80 rating for Santino Elvis vs. Heath Slater in a comedy match*, plus one commercial leading to the top of the hour.
> 
> *Raw fell to a show-low 1.75 rating *for a segment with two full commercials and the first-half of* C.M. Punk *& Big E. Langston vs. Curtis Axel & Ryback.




The jokes practically write themselves, don't they?




Dunmer said:


> I think the fans tuned out cause they didn't want to watch a child molester. :AJ unk


But Jerry Lawler's segment did ok.


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7

rabidwolverine27 said:


> They need to bring in Nash. Am I the only one who thinks that ? He should take the belt of Bryan. This forum would explode.


Nash should definitely come back and become WWE champion. I've been waiting for someone to break his record of being the lowest drawing WWE champion ever and it would be poetic if he were the one to do it.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Holy fuck I'm dying over here:
> 
> 
> 
> :lmao


Lol somebody is having fun for no reason.

You know if you read carefully it's says >

-There were *two full commercial breaks affecting the rating.*

-with *two full commercials* and the first-half of C.M. Punk & Big E. Langston vs. Curtis Axel & Ryback.

It had two full commercials. So it will be affected no matter what.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Happenstan said:


> "Don't stop believing...hold on to that feeling..."


It's alright man. The sooner you realize your hero is ratings failure, the better.



> CM GOAT drawing in dem ratings for Monday Night Raw.


About time somebody posted something truthful in here.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

The Sandrone said:


> It's alright man. The sooner you realize your hero is ratings failure, the better.
> 
> 
> 
> About time somebody posted something truthful in here.



Don't be silly did you know Bryan can walk on water and turn water into wine.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

rabidwolverine27 said:


> Don't be silly did you know Bryan can walk on water and turn water into wine.


Yeah but he can't draw ratings and that's what matters. Nothing else does.


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> It's alright man. The sooner you realize your hero is ratings failure, the better.


Actually unlike Punktards I'll have no trouble admitting it. I just think it will take longer than 3 months to find out one way or the other. Hell it took SCSA a year to start drawing after he started getting a push. If after 1 years push Bryan isn't drawing I'll be the first to admit it. But in actuality he's tying or out drawing Punk, depending upon the week, already after a 2 year mega push for Punk. You have to admit that is straight up embarrassing for Punk and his fans. Well if you're honest you would.




The Sandrone said:


> About time somebody posted something truthful in here.


Yeah. Shame Punk got his ass handed to him *mid show* by the Divas again in the ratings during both his appearances. What is that the 3rd and 4th time this year? :lmao




rabidwolverine27 said:


> Don't be silly did you know Bryan can walk on water and turn water into wine.


That's on Sundays. On Mondays and Fridays he consistently draws some of the highest ratings of the night.


----------



## stonefort

Maybe they just need even more Boring Daniel Bryan.
Enjoy Boring Daniel Bryan now, he'll probably follow Rock to Hollywood within 18 months.
Boring Daniel Bryan has the charisma of ten normal boring men.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Happenstan said:


> Actually unlike Punktards I'll have no trouble admitting it. I just think it will take longer than 3 months to find out one way or the other. Hell it took SCSA a year to start drawing after he started getting a push. If after 1 years push Bryan isn't drawing I'll be the first to admit it. But in actuality he's tying or out drawing Punk, depending upon the week, already after a 2 year mega push for Punk. You have to admit that is straight up embarrassing for Punk and his fans. Well if you're honest you would.


:lmao

Bryan's not drawing, man. You claim you'll admit it, but yet you're just making excuses. He only draws when in the main event. They should just give up on him now and try their luck with someone like :sandow ... or THAT BARRETT BARRAGE! :mark:



> Yeah. Shame Punk got his ass handed to him mid show by the Divas


So did Bryan. The dude needs to be pushed down the card. He's clearly not helping.


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> :lmao
> 
> Bryan's not drawing, man. You claim you'll admit it, but yet you're just making excuses. He only draws when in the main event. They should just give up on him now and try their luck with someone like :sandow ... or THAT BARRETT BARRAGE! :mark:


I'm giving Bryan the same time frame Austin, and Punk had. How is that an excuse? I know you're desperate to stop Punk's inevitable eclipsing but holding Bryan to a standard Punk doesn't have to match up to only proves how obvious Punk's failings truly are.




The Sandrone said:


> So did Bryan. The dude needs to be pushed down the card. He's clearly not helping.


I said mid show. I'm not including the first hour for either man. It rarely draws. This 3 hour thing has been a disaster. But if I did Punk's loss to the Divas would only grow.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Oh man, what a fantastic night.

DAT OVERRUN!

Look at the GOATS.

:bryan :hbk1 :rko2 :hhh2

They're everywhere.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Happenstan said:


> I'm giving Bryan the same time frame Austin, and Punk had. How is that an excuse? I know you're desperate to stop Punk's inevitable eclipsing but holding Bryan to a standard Punk doesn't have to match up to only proves how obvious Punk's failings truly are.


Excuses excuses. Bryan just can't draw. Cena needs to hurry back asap. Not even sure he can undo the damage Bryan's done.



Mister WrestleMania said:


> Oh man, what a fantastic night.
> 
> DAT OVERRUN!
> 
> Look at the GOATS.
> 
> :bryan :hbk1 :rko2 :hhh2
> 
> They're everywhere.





> Q2: Raw *dipped to a 1.89* rating for U.S. champion Dean Ambrose vs. *Daniel Bryan* and one mid-match commercial.





> Q3: Raw *fell to a near-show-low 1.76 rating *for C.M. Punk's on-stage speech and *Shawn Michaels backstage with Triple H* and Stephanie. There were two full commercial breaks affecting the rating.





> *Q5: Even with the benefit of the top-of-the-hour bump, Raw was actually down from Q4 with a 1.79 rating for Randy Orton vs. Dolph Ziggler*, a John Cena hype video, and one commercial.


DEM GOATS! :lmao


----------



## Sonnen Says

Happenstan said:


> Actually unlike Punktards I'll have no trouble admitting it. I just think it will take longer than 3 months to find out one way or the other. Hell it took SCSA a year to start drawing after he started getting a push. If after 1 years push Bryan isn't drawing I'll be the first to admit it. But in actuality he's tying or out drawing Punk, depending upon the week, already after a 2 year mega push for Punk. You have to admit that is straight up embarrassing for Punk and his fans. Well if you're honest you would.


Yeah because Bryan is the next SCSA :lmao. Mega push my ass. Get a clue hater, you just say that because you wanna feel good about yourself. Bryan got a bigger push than Punk. Bryan defeated most of the guys in the roster clean in less than 2 months. But still even with Punk losing record he's outdrawing his hairy ass.



Fanboi101 said:


> *LOL epic fail by Punk. He truly can't draw worth shit.*
> 
> Also, these ratings suggest Heyman / NFL half-time are entirely responsible for the big gain "Punk segments" were getting a few weeks ago.


I guess it took you so long to say it :lmao. He was drawing high numbers for a long time now stop kidding yourself.


----------



## KingLobos

CM Punk

Midcard 4 Life










Bryan better be careful. Or soon he might be joining Punk.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

KingLobos said:


> CM Punk
> 
> Midcard 4 Life
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bryan better be careful. Or soon he might be joining Punk.


Vince is already doing his power-walk to next week's Monday Night Raw to save the ratings from Bryan. Bryan will probably lose the WWE Title match at Hell in a Cell and then be demoted to a US Title feud with Ambrose. Obviously it'll draw poorly as this week's rating shows, but it's what needs to be done.


----------



## Sonnen Says

KingLobos said:


> CM Punk
> 
> Midcard 4 Life
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bryan better be careful. Or soon he might be joining Punk.


Rock should be a midcard 4 life since he lost viewers. I guess anyone who loses viewers for even just one week they should be called that.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Sonnen Says said:


> Rock should be a midcard 4 life since he lost viewers. I guess anyone who loses viewers for even just one week they should be called that.


NO! YOU'RE A PUNK MARK! YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO ADMIT WHEN PUNK DOESN'T DO WELL! SHUT UP! PUNK'S A RATINGS GOD TO U!!!!


----------



## Happenstan

Sonnen Says said:


> Yeah because Bryan is the next SCSA :lmao. Mega push my ass. Get a clue hater, you just say that because you wanna feel good about yourself. Bryan got a bigger push than Punk. Bryan defeated most of the guys in the roster clean in less than 2 months. But still even with Punk losing record he's outdrawing his hairy ass.
> 
> 
> 
> I guess it took you so long to say it :lmao. He was drawing high numbers for a long time now stop kidding yourself.



When did I say Bryan was the next SCSA? I see you still haven't mastered the concept of read first then respond. Seriously Brick, are you mentally retarded? Most would have learned this simple lesson months ago.

Main event Bryan hasn't gone over Sheamus, Del Rio, Ziggler, HHH, Lesnar, Rock, Taker, Henry, Ryback, Show, Punk...plenty of fresh feuds to carry him out for the next year at minimum.

And Bryan has been pushed harder than Mr. 434 Days? Seriously. You are mental.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

OMG, I'M WATCHING MAIN EVENT AND THAT CENA HYPE VIDEO IS PLAYING! The second one... the one that gained viewers. What an inspiration the man is. He needs to hurry back asap to save the day ratings!


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> Excuses excuses. Bryan just can't draw. Cena needs to hurry back asap. Not even sure he can undo the damage Bryan's done.


Your poor attempt at trollage will not work on me. Calling for Cena to return. There is such a thing as taking things too damned far.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Happenstan said:


> Your poor attempt at trollage will not work on me. Calling for Cena to return. There is such a thing as taking things too damned far.


It already did, my friend:



> Actually unlike Punktards I'll have no trouble admitting it. I just think it will take longer than 3 months to find out one way or the other. Hell it took SCSA a year to start drawing after he started getting a push. If after 1 years push Bryan isn't drawing I'll be the first to admit it. But in actuality he's tying or out drawing Punk, depending upon the week, already after a 2 year mega push for Punk. You have to admit that is straight up embarrassing for Punk and his fans. Well if you're honest you would.


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> It already did, my friend:


:lmao Keep hope alive Sandy. How is the above a successful troll attempt? I didn't mark out for Bryan so your attempt failed.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Happenstan said:


> :lmao Keep hope alive Sandy.


Well, I got my rise out of you, so I'm all good now and don't need hope. Surprised it took so long for you to realize I was trolling. :lmao


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> Well, I got my rise out of you, so I'm all good now and don't need hope. Surprised it took so long for you to realize I was trolling. :lmao


I knew it all along. That's why I rebutted you with simple facts and not "OMG BRYAN IS THE GREATEST EVER HATER!! YOU SUCK!!!" posts.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Happenstan said:


> I knew it all along. That's why I rebutted you with simple facts and not "OMG BRYAN IS THE GREATEST EVER HATER!! YOU SUCK!!!" posts.


:lmao the denial. The fact you just admitted you responded with "facts" and took my posts seriously says it all.


----------



## KingLobos

Sonnen Says said:


> Rock should be a midcard 4 life since he lost viewers. I guess anyone who loses viewers for even just one week they should be called that.


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> :lmao the denial. The fact you just admitted you responded with "facts" and took my posts seriously says it all.


Whatever. You and I have a very different definition of trolling but if it makes you feel good to think you got one over on me, go for it. You clearly need the boost if you're willing to go through this much trouble and explanation.


----------



## 1andOnlyDobz!

Punk haters out in full force I see. I don't tend to comment on these threads but regardless of whether or not Punk is a draw, this week's ratings aren't exactly indicative. The thing you're conveniently ignoring? The commercial breaks, where Punk was pretty much surrounded. 2 commercial breaks in the same quarter as his promo and match? No chance he'd go unaffected.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

Can you guys agree on anything ?


----------



## Happenstan

1andOnlyDobz! said:


> Punk haters out in full force I see. I don't tend to comment on these threads but regardless of whether or not Punk is a draw, this week's ratings aren't exactly indicative. The thing you're conveniently ignoring? The commercial breaks, where Punk was pretty much surrounded. 2 commercial breaks in the same quarter as his promo and match? No chance he'd go unaffected.


There was a commercial break in Bryan's match and right be-4 the contract signing too. So what?





rabidwolverine27 said:


> Can you guys agree on anything ?


Um, Chris Benoit is a crazy murderer?


----------



## Vyer

I think some people are just having fun trolling :lmao

Regarding the segments, I believe this furthers my previous point in that a lot more goes into drawing in viewers and different situations, especially the ones outside of the WWE's control, affect it. It is certainly weird looking at the break down. I also feel that everyone is doing the best they can in the segments they are in.


----------



## Jof

Sonnen Says said:


> Rock should be a midcard 4 life since he lost viewers.


:lmao :lmao


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Happenstan said:


> Whatever. You and I have a very different definition of trolling but if it makes you feel good to think you got one over on me, go for it. You clearly need the boost if you're willing to go through this much trouble and explanation.


Here, have a tissue.










Anyway, to get serious for a moment, yeah, this was a bad week for Punk, although I'm not referring to what happened with quarter 3. Punk, much like the 10PM from a few weeks ago, was on for roughly a third of that. He shouldn't be held responsible for the quarter... the quarter as a whole was cut up between commercials, that Punk promo, and then the two minute backstage stuff between HBK and HHH (which obviously I don't really blame them for). 

However the quarter 8 losing viewers, which was a Punk match that I'm pretty sure took up a majority of the quarter and then going to a show-low... that was bad. Really bad. It's Punk's first truly bad quarter in a while so it isn't indicative of Punk not being a draw or anything like that, but he had a bad week. 

The opener was actually strong and although the Bryan/Ambrose match lost from that, it was still the highest quarter 2 in awhile. The overrun though was great and the highest overrun in over a month, so Bryan overall did really well this week. 

Orton's quarter 5 though... that was really bad. How much of his match actually took up the quarter? It really was the lowest 9PM quarter in months.

Interesting that the 10PM hour kept getting higher and higher, slowly but surely, until the big overrun gain. It's a good sign that the #1 contender's match for the tag titles actually gained viewers. 

So yeah, Bryan wins the week. :bryan


----------



## Choke2Death

The Sandrone said:


> Orton's quarter 5 though... that was really bad. How much of his match actually took up the quarter? It really was the lowest 9PM quarter in months.


Match started around 8:58 and lasted 8 minutes. So around 3:06, which means more than half the quarter was the Cena video and a commercial break while the rest of the Orton/Ziggler match (including entrances and first two minutes) belonged in Q4.


----------



## MaybeLock

The Sandrone said:


> Here, have a tissue.
> 
> Anyway, to get serious for a moment, yeah, this was a bad week for Punk, although I'm not referring to what happened with quarter 3. Punk, much like the 10PM from a few weeks ago, was on for roughly a third of that. He shouldn't be held responsible for the quarter... the quarter as a whole was cut up between commercials, that Punk promo, and then the two minute backstage stuff between HBK and HHH (which obviously I don't really blame them for).
> 
> However the quarter 8 losing viewers, which was a Punk match that I'm pretty sure took up a majority of the quarter and then going to a show-low... that was bad. Really bad. It's Punk's first truly bad quarter in a while so it isn't indicative of Punk not being a draw or anything like that, but he had a bad week.
> 
> The opener was actually strong and although the Bryan/Ambrose match lost from that, it was still the highest quarter 2 in awhile. The overrun though was great and the highest overrun in over a month, so Bryan overall did really well this week.
> 
> Orton's quarter 5 though... that was really bad. How much of his match actually took up the quarter? It really was the lowest 9PM quarter in months.
> 
> Interesting that the 10PM hour kept getting higher and higher, slowly but surely, until the big overrun gain. It's a good sign that the #1 contender's match for the tag titles actually gained viewers.
> 
> So yeah, Bryan wins the week. :bryan


It was indeed an absolute forgettable week for Punk: Bad promo, bad match, bad ratings. Considering he´s been doing well ratings wise these last weeks, I don't see what changed the momentum. He really needs some fresh air right now: End this storyline, and do something else. It will be better, not only for ratings but for the quality of the product.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

KingLobos said:


> CM Punk
> 
> Midcard 4 Life
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bryan better be careful. Or soon he might be joining Punk.


A GOAT gif right there. Would've loved to seen a feud between HBK and Rock at this time period. Would've been electric.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Choke2Death said:


> Match started around 8:58 and lasted 8 minutes. So around 3:06, which means more than half the quarter was the Cena video and a commercial break while the rest of the Orton/Ziggler match (including entrances and first two minutes) belonged in Q4.


Well if that's the case, no wonder it did poorly. WWE for some reason the past couple of weeks have been splitting things between quarters and I think that's bringing the average down. It certainly has an effect on the major 4 quarters (8, 9, 10, and 11). They should at the very least make sure that only one thing/one storyline is done in those quarters for maximum benefit. It's become apparent doing things like the having a Punk/Orton promo/match for 5 minutes, going to a commercial, and then having something involving jobbers/lower card guys who aren't in a storyline is going to have a very negative effect on the number that comes up.


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> Here, have a tissue.


Save it for your leaky vag.




Choke2Death said:


> Match started around 8:58 and lasted 8 minutes. So around 3:06, which means more than half the quarter was the Cena video and a commercial break while the rest of the Orton/Ziggler match (including entrances and first two minutes) belonged in Q4.


You lost me. If he had an 8 minute match that started 2 minutes before the 9pm hour wouldn't that make 6 minutes of the segment focused on Orton? What's the 3:06 about?


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

1andOnlyDobz! said:


> Punk haters out in full force I see. I don't tend to comment on these threads but regardless of whether or not Punk is a draw, this week's ratings aren't exactly indicative. The thing you're conveniently ignoring? The commercial breaks, where Punk was pretty much surrounded. 2 commercial breaks in the same quarter as his promo and match? No chance he'd go unaffected.


What is all this Punk marks hatred of commercials? But, But I thought Punk was a *commercial* draw. Phil was outdrawn by Elvis impersonators, a bearded sock puppet and the Divas. I thought Bryan was the one losing steam. Maybe "no-steam" Punk needs to do some more shoot interviews or cuss out some fat fans to try and get back on that ratings superhighway that Bryan is paving. :bryan


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Happenstan said:


> Save it for your leaky vag.


:lmao




Happenstan said:


> You lost me. If he had an 8 minute match that started 2 minutes before the 9pm hour wouldn't that make 6 minutes of the segment focused on Orton?


Yep, that's exactly it. The match itself only took up 6 minutes of quarter 5. If there were any viewers gained by that, they probably left once the Cena video started and/or when the commercial started. And that's why it ended up going down probably.


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> :lmao
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yep, that's exactly it. The match itself only took up 6 minutes of quarter 5. If there were any viewers gained by that, they probably left once the Cena video started and/or when the commercial started. And that's why it ended up going down probably.


So what is the 3:06 thing about? That's where he lost me.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Happenstan said:


> So what is the 3:06 thing about? That's where he lost me.


Probably his own time-zone or a typo? Either way, it started and had two minutes of quarter 4, and then 6 minutes of the following.


----------



## markedfordeath

i cant wait until the official feud starts between HHH/Bryan...that'll get ratings going indeed.


----------



## Choke2Death

Happenstan said:


> So what is the 3:06 thing about? That's where he lost me.


Oh, it's different time zones. Meant to say 9:06 but said 3 because that's what the time was here.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Jof said:


> :lmao :lmao


I know it's hilarious that now anyone who loses viewers for even just once they get to called midcarders. Rock did lose viewers by the way. Those things doesnt mean shit since you will have an off week eventually. You're not gonna draw the same in every quarter especially if there is 2 full commercials. It's not an excuse it's just the truth.


----------



## Dash24

The Sandrone said:


> Here, have a tissue.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, to get serious for a moment, yeah, this was a bad week for Punk, although I'm not referring to what happened with quarter 3. Punk, much like the 10PM from a few weeks ago, was on for roughly a third of that. He shouldn't be held responsible for the quarter... the quarter as a whole was cut up between commercials, that Punk promo, and then the two minute backstage stuff between HBK and HHH (which obviously I don't really blame them for).
> 
> However the quarter 8 losing viewers, which was a Punk match that I'm pretty sure took up a majority of the quarter and then going to a show-low... that was bad. Really bad. It's Punk's first truly bad quarter in a while so it isn't indicative of Punk not being a draw or anything like that, but he had a bad week.
> 
> The opener was actually strong and although the Bryan/Ambrose match lost from that, it was still the highest quarter 2 in awhile. The overrun though was great and the highest overrun in over a month, so Bryan overall did really well this week.
> 
> Orton's quarter 5 though... that was really bad. How much of his match actually took up the quarter? It really was the lowest 9PM quarter in months.
> 
> Interesting that the 10PM hour kept getting higher and higher, slowly but surely, until the big overrun gain. It's a good sign that the #1 contender's match for the tag titles actually gained viewers.
> 
> So yeah, Bryan wins the week. :bryan


Honestly, I think its been impressive that he's been consistently drawing viewers since Summerslam where the feud started to drag on badly. There's enough evidence out there that _this year_ Punk is among the top drawers (full-time) along with Cena/Bryan, but the ratings this week might be an indication that viewers are all but done with the Punk/Heyman storyline. Hopefully WWE takes a hint and ends it this weekend. 

Regardless, why is everyone in this thread trying to take a dump on Punk? In case people didn't bother reading the article and just skimmed to see how Punk did: pretty much everyone on the roster did bad! Something clearly needs to change.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Dash24 said:


> Honestly, I think its been impressive that he's been consistently drawing viewers since Summerslam where the feud started to drag on badly. There's enough evidence out there that _this year_ Punk is among the top drawers (full-time) along with Cena/Bryan, but the ratings this week might be an indication that viewers are all but done with the Punk/Heyman. Hopefully WWE takes a hint and ends it this weekend.


Hopefully. I'm a big Punk mark, a big Heyman mark, and I even like Ryback as well. However this feud NEEDS to end. It's dragged on beyond belief and I'm surprised it's done as well as it has in the ratings for so long, even a couple of weeks beating the overrun. I don't know if it's enough to say viewers are tired of it though. It was a bad week in the midst of several good weeks. We'd need to see how it'd do over the next few weeks to see if it really has lost interest. Hopefully though, we won't have to find out and the feud ends Sunday. Heyman, Axel and Ryback move to Big E Langston, and Punk moves onto bigger and better things.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

I cant wait 'til Bryan goes over HHH cleanly so Obi Wan can hear the voices of millions of Punk fans crying out in terror, then silenced by the deafening roar of the YES! chants. The saddest Part about Punk on Raw was his desperate plea to get the crowd to chant for him by using Ryback's mannerisms. I think he got more FEED ME MORE chants than those C.ant M.ainevent Punk chants.


----------



## markedfordeath

they're moving on, its ending Sunday. Punk met with Vince this week about his new program, you know, since Punk has creative control, he gets to sit in on creative meetings with Vince.


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> Hopefully. I'm a big Punk mark, a big Heyman mark, and I even like Ryback as well. However this feud NEEDS to end. It's dragged on beyond belief and I'm surprised it's done as well as it has in the ratings for so long, even a couple of weeks beating the overrun. I don't know if it's enough to say viewers are tired of it though. It was a bad week in the midst of several good weeks. We'd need to see how it'd do over the next few weeks to see if it really has lost interest. Hopefully though, we won't have to find out and the feud ends Sunday. Heyman, Axel and Ryback move to Big E Langston, and Punk moves onto bigger and better things.


You like Ryback? We agree on something? Well I'll be damned. Ryback could be huge if they recreated Heyman/Lesnar from 10 years ago on a smaller scale with Ryback. Let him work his way through the WHC ranks for a while. If Sexual Chocolate can turn into bad ass Mark Henry after 15 years then Ryback's got plenty of time and potential ahead.

So if Punk moves on after Sunday, who does he move on to?


----------



## markedfordeath

probably Orton..that would be interesting..imagine HBK/HHH and Orton in the ring celebrating, Cult of Personality hits.....although instead it might just be Flight of the Valkyries because Bryan will get pissed off...maybe Punk saves him from a beating.


----------



## rabidwolverine27

Happenstan said:


> You like Ryback? We agree on something? Well I'll be damned. Ryback could be huge if they recreated Heyman/Lesnar from 10 years ago on a smaller scale with Ryback. Let him work his way through the WHC ranks for a while. If Sexual Chocolate can turn into bad ass Mark Henry after 15 years then Ryback's got plenty of time and potential ahead.
> 
> So if Punk moves on after Sunday, who does he move on to?


Ryback and Big E are gonna have a feud. So he could face Orton.


----------



## markedfordeath

i cant wait for a heel HBK. it could be Punk versus Orton, and Bryan versus the new DX..i mean HBK did say Suck It two weeks ago on Raw and HBK mentioned how fun HHH used to be at playing strip poker in the ring...referencing their old DX days...Bryan versus DX...ratings gold.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Punk will feud with Men on a Mission because he hates M.O.M


----------



## markedfordeath

I just cant wait until Royal Rumble season because they're halfassing the rest of 2013..they're saving the good shit for 2014..cant come fast enough.


----------



## NewJack's Shank

Best4Bidness said:


> Punk will feud with Men on a Mission because he hates M.O.M


----------



## Happenstan

rabidwolverine27 said:


> Ryback and Big E are gonna have a feud. So he could face Orton.


Yeah I know about that. Thanks again Cena. Those matches are gonna be spectacular.  So if Punk gets Orton who does Bryan get? HHH? What about Show?




Best4Bidness said:


> Punk will feud with Men on a Mission because he hates M.O.M


I know you're :rep but you got me anyway.


----------



## markedfordeath

Bryan gets the fucking Kliq and Stephanie. Nash will be at Raw, HBK is turning heel at HIAC....4 on 1 plus the Shield...its starting all over again, lets hope they get it right this time and make Bryan the hero.


----------



## Londrick

Sonnen Says said:


> Rock should be a midcard 4 life since he lost viewers. I guess anyone who loses viewers for even just one week they should be called that.


lol @ grasping for straws by bringing up the Rock. Keep running your mouth, and I'm gonna take this thread, shine it up real nice, turn it side ways, and stick it straight up your candy ass! Jabroni.


----------



## 1andOnlyDobz!

Best4Bidness said:


> What is all this Punk marks hatred of commercials? But, But I thought Punk was a *commercial* draw. Phil was outdrawn by Elvis impersonators, a bearded sock puppet and the Divas. I thought Bryan was the one losing steam. Maybe "no-steam" Punk needs to do some more shoot interviews or cuss out some fat fans to try and get back on that ratings superhighway that Bryan is paving. :bryan


All I see is a post making assumptions about me and not acknowledging any potential impact of commercials.

Stuff like this is why I shy away from the ratings thread most often. Too much arguing, too many rose-tinted views, too much bias on something with zero basis on what is entertaining to the individual. That being said, later peeps!


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Happenstan said:


> You like Ryback? We agree on something? Well I'll be damned. Ryback could be huge if they recreated Heyman/Lesnar from 10 years ago on a smaller scale with Ryback. Let him work his way through the WHC ranks for a while. If Sexual Chocolate can turn into bad ass Mark Henry after 15 years then Ryback's got plenty of time and potential ahead.
> 
> So if Punk moves on after Sunday, who does he move on to?


Hell yeah I like Ryback. I was one of the few that liked him a year ago when he was feuding with Punk and doing nothing but "Feed me More" and ass kicking. They fucked him up though by having him take the pinfall in the 6-man tag at EC this year in such clean fashion, and then the pinfall against Henry at Mania (and I love Henry, but that was the final nail in the coffin of face Ryback imo). Heyman/Ryback could work and really bring Ryback up to being a top heel... however if Heyman is going into a feud with Big E Langston after this, chances are Ryback's going to eat another feud loss. I think it's going to be awhile, if ever, before Ryback is fully going strong again.

And we agree on liking Bryan as well. 

As for what Punk moves onto... honestly he may end up taking a break and I'd be fine with that, because the only person I could see him feuding with is Orton, but that feud doesn't NEED to happen by any means. Let Punk rest up, come back, win the Rumble, face Lesnar for the title at Mania, beat him, and then drop the title to Bryan at Summerslam and I'd be happy (and Bryan would win the title at HIAC, drop the title to Lesnar at RR, and then beat HHH at Mania. Then at Mania 31 he can face Cena for the first time since Summerslam this year make Cena tap out to officially become the #1 face).


----------



## markedfordeath

Having Cena only on Smackdown until mid November will be great....but then he comes back to Raw..not so great.


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> As for what Punk moves onto... honestly he may end up taking a break and I'd be fine with that, because the only person I could see him feuding with is Orton, but that feud doesn't NEED to happen by any means. Let Punk rest up, come back, win the Rumble, face Lesnar for the title at Mania, beat him, and then drop the title to Bryan at Summerslam and I'd be happy (and Bryan would win the title at HIAC, drop the title to Lesnar at RR, and then beat HHH at Mania. Then at Mania 31 he can face Cena for the first time since Summerslam this year make Cena tap out to officially become the #1 face).


If that happens (and given how hurt punk is it probably should) then Ryback should "injure" Punk at HIAC. It would be the perfect way to put Ryback over huge, so of course that will never happen.


----------



## markedfordeath

Punk shouldnt' win the Rumble. Bryan has to, especially if he loses this Sunday, it will be perfect way to make him believable again in the eyes of the fans.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

markedfordeath said:


> Punk shouldnt' win the Rumble. Bryan has to, especially if he loses this Sunday, it will be perfect way to make him believable again in the eyes of the fans.


My idea has him winning Sunday though. And he doesn't have to win the Rumble this year. In fact, his match with HHH doesn't have to be for the title. It really doesn't matter. The only pay-off for that feud is seeing Bryan defeat HHH and shut him up once and for all. The WWE Title pay-off could be something used in a feud with Punk leading to Summerslam, and then finally for Mania 31, the feud with Cena is what would lead to him becoming the #1 guy. I'm sure Bryan has many years left and he'll win a rumble at some point. It doesn't NEED to happen at this upcoming Rumble. What NEEDS to happen is Bryan defeating HHH. Whether it's for the title or not doesn't really matter (although if it's not, they can use that in a later feud to help increase buyrates for whatever PPV the presumed pay-off would be as I mentioned above).



> If that happens (and given how hurt punk is it probably should) then Ryback should "injure" Punk at HIAC. It would be the perfect way to put Ryback over huge, so of course that will never happen.


The only problem with that is that would mean Punk/Ryback continues on when Punk returns... although maybe they could make it work. Punk returns, wins Rumble, feuds with Ryback going into EC, defeats him, and then moves onto Mania against Lesnar. I suppose the Punk/Heyman feud would have to continue anyway, so the idea of Ryback injuring Punk might not be a bad idea if Punk does need time off.


----------



## markedfordeath

Something tells me Triple H couldn't wait for Cena to get out of the way for a bit, because all of the people he signed and worked with in the past are getting some much needed attention. So he finally is able to work with the roster, Vince probably was the one wanting it to be Cena all the time. Triple H and Stephanie probably couldn't wait to make change.


----------



## KO Bossy

markedfordeath said:


> Punk shouldnt' win the Rumble. Bryan has to, especially if he loses this Sunday, it will be perfect way to make him believable again in the eyes of the fans.


Ugh...

What is it with you and the constant poor poor pitiful Bryan routine? "If Bryan wins, it'll be the perfect way to make him believable again!" The fans already believe in him plenty and he's been riding high in the main event for like...3 months now. He doesn't need a Rumble, unless you want him to become another ADR where the fans tire of him after being pushed insanely, way too quickly.

I say give it to Punk to make him relevant once more.

Or better yet, have Cena win it, have Rock win the WWF title from Triple H at Elimination Chamber and Cena can beat Rock to unify the titles at WM30. Thrice in a lifetime for the all time greatest. :cena3


----------



## funnyfaces1

markedfordeath said:


> Punk shouldnt' win the Rumble. Bryan has to, especially if he loses this Sunday, it will be perfect way to make him believable again in the eyes of the fans.


Why not have Bryan actually win the title beforehand and Punk winning the Rumble, thus setting up the GOAT Mania title match unk5 :bryan2

Lost in all of this would be Randy Orton. I'm not a big fan of the guy, but I'm worried that all of what is going on is not in his favor if they make him feud with Big Show and then kick him to the curb around Mania season. A match with either Rock or Cena at Mania would be perfect for him, with him going over of course. Of course, I doubt either match will be very good, but Punk/Bryan can make up for the worst possible card of wrestling.


----------



## markedfordeath

who would feel badly for Orton? after HIAC he'll be an 11 time champion..he's already a hall of famer, hes done it all. He should do what Cena should be doing...making careers.


----------



## Choke2Death

funnyfaces1 said:


> Lost in all of this would be Randy Orton. I'm not a big fan of the guy, but I'm worried that all of what is going on is not in his favor if they make him feud with Big Show and then kick him to the curb around Mania season. A match with either Rock or Cena at Mania would be perfect for him, with him going over of course. Of course, I doubt either match will be very good, but Punk/Bryan can make up for the worst possible card of wrestling.


One of the reports that came out a month ago said he will be in a prominent place for the Mania card next year. Fingers crossed that actually happens.

I think it's clear that Bryan will face HHH at Mania, though. I have a feeling Orton may take on Punk with the title on the line. Or my best case scenario, Orton vs Cena in a title unification match.


----------



## Londrick

I like how for WM this there are still plenty of possibility for the top matches. You really cane make any combination of Brock, Bryan, HHH, Punk, Cena and Taker for the top matches of WM 30.


----------



## Jof

I think Punk vs Orton is a lock for mania. Think about it, whats the biggest match either can have without part timers and Cena? It comes down to the same opponents. I never believed there was ever a plan for Punk vs Lesnar rematch, plus the fact that punk lost in a strong protected fashion against Lesnar, only shows its not happening. Summerslam drew a disappointing buyrate, so even if they had any plans for that match, its now gone. At this point Taker vs Lesnar is best option. Triple H and Bryan obvious. Rock has already signed multiple movie deals, he likely isn't returning. 

Unless Austin returns, Punk vs Orton is a lock imo.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Punk/Orton... eh, I dunno. It does make sense as the only combo if Taker/Brock and Bryan/HHH happens... then again, maybe they do Punk/Cena? Or... *ugh* Orton/Cena? Can't see them leaving Cena out of a top match... or maybe they will. Maybe they'll give him Sheamus for the World Title. So it would be:

Taker/Brock
Punk/Orton for the WWE Title
Bryan/HHH
Cena/Sheamus for the World Title

There certainly are seemingly endless possibilities for this Mania. TBH if we just got Taker/Cena and Punk/Bryan for the title, I'd be a veeeeeery happy camper... but HHH is definitely gonna end up fighting either Cena or Bryan, so there's no chance of that. God damn you HHH! You have to ruin the best possible card!


----------



## Londrick

I could see them going with Big E vs Orton. Rumors are that they plan on pushing him and a feud and win over Orton at WM would be great for him. Especially since the next option for Big E would be Del Rio.


----------



## KO Bossy

Dunmer said:


> I could see them going with Big E vs Orton. Rumors are that they plan on pushing him and a feud and win over Orton at WM would be great for him. Especially since the next option for *Big E would be Del Rio*.












Please god, no...


----------



## markedfordeath

is it just me or is Sheamus probably not considered a top guy anymore? It just doesn't seem like there's room for him anymore. And hopefully by WM, Cena is getting phased out, its time for a change in WWE.


----------



## #Mark

Punk drawing less viewers than the Elvis impersonators :lol


----------



## markedfordeath

when those impersonators came on I had to change the channel, that and the Cena video packages made me gag...I bet once Triple H takes over, there will be no more of that comedy crap.


----------



## Reaper

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1761998-daniel-bryan-and-randy-orton-are-badly-overxposed

This guy has some incredibly valid points about over-exposure:



> With a full two months left this year, Bryan has wrestled in 83 televised matches so far.
> 
> To put things into perspective, John Cena has competed in only 25 matches this year. CM Punk has been in 29. Sure, they have suffered injuries, but even when they were active they compete far less than Bryan does.
> 
> Or, take a heel who has wrestled all year in Antonio Cesaro. He's sitting at 64 (not counting the rarely seen Superstars and NXT appearances). A full 19 matches less than Bryan in front of a national audience. Even that feels like too much.
> 
> In fact, the only one who competes with Bryan right now for most matches is conveniently his Hell in a Cell opponent Randy Orton who is sitting at 82. To make matters even worse, their upcoming showdown will be their eighth one-on-one encounter this year.
> 
> That's probably why we've seen Bryan battle The Shield in one form or another 24 times in 2013.
> 
> At this point, Bryan and Orton are going to crack the 100 match mark for the year. To put that into perspective, Steve Austin wrestled 270 televised WWF matches in his entire career! Mick Foley had 259.
> 
> For those watching every week, they may already be getting a sense of deja vu. Every Bryan match is feeling strikingly similar. For a man who has such an incredible amount of moves under his arsenal, the WWE seems to have sadly limited him to a select few.
> 
> Every week Bryan delivers a series of kicks to the chest (and missing the final one), the backflip off the top of the turnbuckle, a couple of dropkicks in the corner, the diving headbutt, the Yes Lock and the running knee attack. Rinse and repeat. Twice every week.
> 
> The end of the brand split, and the additional hour of Raw has made this feeling of been-there-done-that inevitable. Even Los Matadores have taken on the 3MB in four of their five televised matches.
> 
> The roster just isn't big enough for six hours of prime-time TV a week. The same talent is relied upon again and again to diminishing returns.
> 
> We're back to a 2.68 rating. How much worse can it get?
> 
> WWE needs stars, it's the reason why fans go to the shows. They should be protected, and not overexposed. But right now, the company's superstars are feeling more ordinary than ever before.


----------



## Reaper

markedfordeath said:


> is it just me or is Sheamus probably not considered a top guy anymore? It just doesn't seem like there's room for him anymore. And hopefully by WM, *Cena is getting phased out, *its time for a change in WWE.


What part of 10 minutes of video packages when he's not even there made you think that ? 

A lot of fans (and myself) are thinking the if anything, WWE is teasing a title unification at WMXXX with Cena being the first.


----------



## markedfordeath

uhhh no! not happening....Cena winning again like that would turn fans off!


----------



## Reaper

markedfordeath said:


> uhhh no! not happening....Cena winning again like that would turn fans off!


*some* fans. 

He's still their most marketable guy and with him on board and in a top feud/storyline is still better than Bryan/Orton or whomever they decide to choose. Of course he needs a worthy #2 and that's honestly what I think Bryan is really being prepared for. 

Love him or hate him, people don't tune out when Cena's on-screen.


----------



## markedfordeath

dude, its time to turn Cena heel..Bryan is the ultimate babyface...you have to turn Cena heel. It just has to happen now.


----------



## Reaper

markedfordeath said:


> dude, its time to turn Cena heel..Bryan is the ultimate babyface...you have to turn Cena heel. It just has to happen now.


Why? There's nothing wrong with a babyface / babyface main event at WMXXX. IMO, splitting the crowd down the middle for two faces have been excellent draws. And they have the ultimate opportunity to repeat that with a Cena/Bryan main event for Undisputed Champion.


----------



## markedfordeath

I think they are going to turn Cena heel because read the reports, an idea was pitched to have the Bellas split up and go into each of their guy's corners. Brie would be in Bryan's and Nikki in Cena's, only Nikki would be a heel....why would Cena have a heel in his corner, unless........


----------



## Mqwar

> Raw on 10/21 did a 2.71 rating and 3.82 million viewers, the third lowest rating of the year and bottom ten in the last 15 years for non-holiday episodes.
> 
> It’s not that bad an audience figure given the New York Giants vs. Minnesota Vikings game, even though both have terrible records, did 13.24 million viewers due to the New York market. A New York market team hurts WWE more because that’s where its highest concentration of viewers are.


From Observer.


----------



## markedfordeath

Raw is going to continue to have ratings like that until most of the roster gets built up. you need to sacrifice low ratings until the characters get known by everyone. When all people know is Cena all the time, then you are in trouble once he leaves. Just give it time and if they continue to build people like they're doing, then there you go, things will get better.


----------



## Happenstan

Mqwar said:


> *Raw on 10/21 did a 2.71 rating and 3.82 million viewers, the third lowest rating of the year and bottom ten in the last 15 years for non-holiday episodes.*
> 
> It’s not that bad an audience figure given the New York Giants vs. Minnesota Vikings game, even though both have terrible records, did 13.24 million viewers due to the New York market. A New York market team hurts WWE more because that’s where its highest concentration of viewers are.
> 
> 
> 
> From Observer.
Click to expand...

Ski Em Punker bringing in those massive GOAT ratings. Right guys? Right?


----------



## wwe4universe

markedfordeath said:


> Raw is going to continue to have ratings like that until most of the roster gets built up. you need to sacrifice low ratings until the characters get known by everyone. When all people know is Cena all the time, then you are in trouble once he leaves. Just give it time and if they continue to build people like they're doing, then there you go, things will get better.


Problem is though its a business, there are stakeholders (network, advertiser, shareholders etc). Nobody gonna be patient and wait it out knowing that theres a john cena ready to return.


----------



## markedfordeath

okay then what do you do when Cena retires? you need guys that are stars on the roster, they only have Bryan (who is starting out) and Punk....that's all the known guys outside of Cena..thats the WWE's fault...so you have to sacrifice low ratings to get success....people only watch one or two segments of the show....they need to make the whole show entertaining, but the star power isn't there for the whole show...so obviously you need to change that. The share holders will understand, WWE has a long term plan. Every business goes through a lull, you have to be patient.....


----------



## THANOS

wwe4universe said:


> Problem is though its a business, there are stakeholders (network, advertiser, shareholders etc). Nobody gonna be patient and wait it out knowing that theres a john cena ready to return.


Yes but there's a lot less importance placed on tv ratings then there is on merchandise sales, buyrates, and live gates. Those are the most prominent figures that equate to a largest percentage of revenue, seeing as they get paid on a contract basis, and the ratings do not equate to revenue for WWE. It may equate to revenue for the various stations that air WWE produced shows, but not to WWE themselves. And as long as that third hour is bringing those stations a lot of money, which it is, WWE won't worry all that much about the ratings slip while they are in this transition stage of building more stars.


----------



## markedfordeath

exactly. they're building Bryan as the guy leading the charge with Rhodes, Ambrose, Big E, Rollins and all the other new up and comers for a changing of the guard. It'll take time, another boom period might come..every few years when an era is ending and another is beginning, things go through lulls, patience is the key which is what they're doing.


----------



## #Mark

Imo Cena still has another solid five years on top. The fact hat they brought him back so early is pretty telling.


----------



## markedfordeath

nonsense..they wouldnt be building all these new guys if Cena was going to be around a long time on top...his role will be reduced.


----------



## Starbuck

THANOS said:


> *Yes but there's a lot less importance placed on tv ratings then there is on merchandise sales, buyrates, and live gates. Those are the most prominent figures that equate to a largest percentage of revenue, seeing as they get paid on a contract basis, and the ratings do not equate to revenue for WWE.* It may equate to revenue for the various stations that air WWE produced shows, but not to WWE themselves. And as long as that third hour is bringing those stations a lot of money, which it is, WWE won't worry all that much about the ratings slip while they are in this transition stage of building more stars.


Nope. From their 2012 annual report:

*TV Rights Fees Net Revenues (as a % of total revenue)
2012 = 29%
2011 = 27%
2010 = 27%

PPV Net Revenues (as a % of total revenue)
2012 = 17%
2011 = 16%
2010 = 15%

Live Events Net Revenues (as a % of total revenue)
2012 = 21%
2011 = 22%
2010 = 22%

Venue Merchandise Net Revenues (as a % of total revenue)
2012 = 4%
2011 = 4%
2010 = 4%*

Merch is therefore significantly lower than the other 3.

Also, when you consider profit contribution (for 2012 only in millions):

*TV Rights = $57.3
PPV = $46
Live Events = $29.2
Venue Merchandise = $7.8*

Merchandise sits at the very bottom of the pile in terms of revenues and profit contributions to their business. If you read into the report more they actually make more from Home Video than they do from Merchandise which I find to be rather interesting. Home Video in 2012 = $33 and Merch in 2012 = $18.8. I never would have thought that. People can attend a show but not all of them are going to buy a shirt.

EDIT - I forgot to add that yes, while the actual rating per week doesn't directly produce revenue since it's already paid for upfront, if they were to dip and keep dipping, they wouldn't make as much money off the rights fees and therefore there's less revenue generated overall. So yeah, while a string of 2.5's in October aren't going to have them panicking, if that were to become a trend it most definitely would have an impact.


----------



## THANOS

Starbuck said:


> Nope. From their 2012 annual report:
> 
> *TV Rights Fees Net Revenues (as a % of total revenue)
> 2012 = 29%
> 2011 = 27%
> 2010 = 27%
> 
> PPV Net Revenues (as a % of total revenue)
> 2012 = 17%
> 2011 = 16%
> 2010 = 15%
> 
> Live Events Net Revenues (as a % of total revenue)
> 2012 = 21%
> 2011 = 22%
> 2010 = 22%
> 
> Venue Merchandise Net Revenues (as a % of total revenue)
> 2012 = 4%
> 2011 = 4%
> 2010 = 4%*
> 
> Merch is therefore significantly lower than the other 3.
> 
> Also, when you consider profit contribution (for 2012 only in millions):
> 
> *TV Rights = $57.3
> PPV = $46
> Live Events = $29.2
> Venue Merchandise = $7.8*
> 
> Merchandise sits at the very bottom of the pile in terms of revenues and profit contributions to their business. If you read into the report more they actually make more from Home Video than they do from Merchandise which I find to be rather interesting. Home Video in 2012 = $33 and Merch in 2012 = $18.8. I never would have thought that. People can attend a show but not all of them are going to buy a shirt.
> *
> EDIT - I forgot to add that yes, while the actual rating per week doesn't directly produce revenue since it's already paid for upfront, if they were to dip and keep dipping, they wouldn't make as much money off the rights fees and therefore there's less revenue generated overall. So yeah, while a string of 2.5's in October aren't going to have them panicking, if that were to become a trend it most definitely would have an impact.*


This is the point I was trying to make. That's interesting to see that merchandise is actually a lot less significant that I originally thought. Guys like Punk and Bryan have to be helping the company in other forms than just merchandise sales, or else why would they be getting the pushes they are getting?


----------



## Happenstan

Starbuck said:


> Venue Merchandise Net Revenues (as a % of total revenue)
> 2012 = 4%
> 2011 = 4%
> 2010 = 4%


Do you know if that 4% is before or after guys like Bryan/Punk/Cena get their cut? Could be less than 4% in the end.


----------



## Choke2Death

THANOS said:


> This is the point I was trying to make. That's interesting to see that merchandise is actually a lot less significant that I originally thought. *Guys like Punk and Bryan have to be helping the company in other forms than just merchandise sales, or else why would they be getting the pushes they are getting?*


Tbf, considering the thin roster, I don't think it really means much if they are getting pushed while not being much of a difference maker business wise. What else is the company gonna do? They can't keep relying on Cena and depush everybody who doesn't become a mega star overnight.


----------



## Starbuck

THANOS said:


> This is the point I was trying to make. That's interesting to see that merchandise is actually a lot less significant that I originally thought. Guys like Punk and Bryan have to be helping the company in other forms than just merchandise sales, or else why would they be getting the pushes they are getting?


It's way lower than I thought too. Just when I read your first post it made me think and I geeked out and went and looked it up. It also makes that claim about Cena producing over a million in merch a load of BS. Funny how nobody bothered to look it up at the time because all the info is right there if you go looking for it. 

As far as pushes go, they're pushing the guys they _think _can impact in the other 3 areas. That doesn't mean it's always going to happen though. They've stuck with Punk almost going on 3 years now and when you really break it down, his ability to move the needle is very minimal. Bryan's ability to do the same is still far from determined since his push has only started but I can't see this years Summerslam number being a very positive indictment for either of them. 

@Happenstan - Not a clue. They just had it listed after revenues with no mention of % cuts for individual performers. Since the wrestlers are independent contractors it really depends on how WWE goes about paying out their debts. The cut for the merch could be included in the 2012 statement in which case that would be the final number or it could roll over into the 2013 statement in which case the number would change. That info wasn't provided though so I don't know.


----------



## JustJoel

Starbuck said:


> Nope. From their 2012 annual report:
> 
> *TV Rights Fees Net Revenues (as a % of total revenue)
> 2012 = 29%
> 2011 = 27%
> 2010 = 27%
> 
> PPV Net Revenues (as a % of total revenue)
> 2012 = 17%
> 2011 = 16%
> 2010 = 15%
> 
> Live Events Net Revenues (as a % of total revenue)
> 2012 = 21%
> 2011 = 22%
> 2010 = 22%
> 
> Venue Merchandise Net Revenues (as a % of total revenue)
> 2012 = 4%
> 2011 = 4%
> 2010 = 4%*
> 
> Merch is therefore significantly lower than the other 3.
> 
> Also, when you consider profit contribution (for 2012 only in millions):
> 
> *TV Rights = $57.3
> PPV = $46
> Live Events = $29.2
> Venue Merchandise = $7.8*
> 
> Merchandise sits at the very bottom of the pile in terms of revenues and profit contributions to their business. If you read into the report more they actually make more from Home Video than they do from Merchandise which I find to be rather interesting. Home Video in 2012 = $33 and Merch in 2012 = $18.8. I never would have thought that. People can attend a show but not all of them are going to buy a shirt.
> 
> EDIT - I forgot to add that yes, while the actual rating per week doesn't directly produce revenue since it's already paid for upfront, if they were to dip and keep dipping, they wouldn't make as much money off the rights fees and therefore there's less revenue generated overall. So yeah, while a string of 2.5's in October aren't going to have them panicking, if that were to become a trend it most definitely would have an impact.


Something about the specific phrase "Venue Merchandise" stuck out to me, so I looked it up:



> Our venue merchandise business consists of the sale of various WWE-branded products *at our live events*, such as T-shirts, caps and other novelty items, which feature our Superstars and/or our logo. Nearly all of these products are designed by our in-house creative staff and manufactured by third parties.
> 
> Venue merchandise net revenues were $18.5 million, $19.1 million, $12.1 million and $14.7 million, representing 4%, 4%, 5% and 4% of total net revenues in 2008, 2007, transition 2006 and fiscal 2006, respectively.


http://www.wikinvest.com/stock/World_Wrestling_Entertainment_(WWE)/Venue_Merchandise
The link sources 10-K filings from 2006-2009 for the definition. 

The term doesn't mean all merch sales, just those at live events.


----------



## markedfordeath

if they have Bryan go over Triple H and they keep pushing him, he will make tons of money for them. having one ppv not do as well as they thought means jack shit in the grand scheme of things, because you have to keep pushing a guy and putting him in a favorable program if you want him to succeed and make money for you. IF Bryan goes over Triple H, then his stock soars and soars and soars. They also pitched an idea to have him feud with a heel Cena, his stock will soar even more. And next summer they want him to face Lesnar, there we go, soaring even higher. Plus, unlike Punk, Bryan appeals to almost every demographic, he'll become very profitable in the long run. The company has to back you fully in order to become a money maker, and putting him over Triple H is without question the thing that will get him going.


----------



## Starbuck

JustJoel said:


> Something about the specific phrase "Venue Merchandise" stuck out to me, so I looked it up:
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.wikinvest.com/stock/World_Wrestling_Entertainment_(WWE)/Venue_Merchandise
> The link sources 10-K filings from 2006-2009 for the definition.
> 
> The term doesn't mean all merch sales, just those at live events.


I know. I initially included a section entitled WWE Shop but they have that under the Digital Media segment. It talks about Digital Media but also about no. of orders processed so I got confused. Whatever it is, it only amounted to 3% so if you combine the two that's a total of 7% and still miles behind the other 3.


----------



## SerapisLiber

Reaper Jones said:


> WWE is teasing a title unification at WMXXX with Cena being *the first*.


----------



## markedfordeath

since Cena has been the only one marketed the last 10 years, you could see the problem they formed for themselves. They will have this problem for the next year until stars are built up. That's what they have to do, they did it to themselves.


----------



## Starbuck

There's also a lot of talk, in the financial reports, about their deals with the TV networks coming up for renewal and it was stated several times that they feel they have more leverage heading into those deals and are expecting to get more money as a result. When you consider that then I reckon they probably are a bit more touchy about the ratings at the minute because obviously they're going to want to keep them strong while they're doing the negotiating for better contracts.


----------



## SerapisLiber

Reaper Jones said:


> http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1761998-daniel-bryan-and-randy-orton-are-badly-overxposed
> 
> This guy has some incredibly valid points about over-exposure:


Good article. The thing is, some *slightly* newer appeal could've been added to the Bryan exposure these past three months if it had been with the him defending the fucking WWE title. At least that would have been *something* different. But nope. They'd even go so far as to have *NO* champion rather than a *new* champion.


----------



## Starbuck

Just wait, they've been saving Bryan defending the title against the Shield for Nov through Dec.

:HHH2


----------



## validreasoning

overall ratings will have very little to no overall effect on the tv deals forthcoming as we have seen with the huge deals recently signed by ufc/nhl/nascar despite all three seeing their ratings fall alot more than wwe this past 5 years

it will all be about whether or not the networks can sell the shows to advertisers, in years gone by advertisers were not interested in wwe or pro wrestling in general as they see the fan base as lower class with low disposable spending, a major reason why nobody was interested in raw when the last deal came due in 2009 despite the fact raw viewership was the highest since 2001 that year. if wwe can convince the network/advertisers they are sport and that their fans have the same buying habits as ufc fans (which in fact they do) then you will see a big increase in fees. 

right now fox are paying ufc $100m a year for approx 30 shows a year (most averaging well under 1 million viewers) while usa pay wwe about $35m a year for 52 episodes of raw which last year averaged 4.8 million viewers per episode when dvr playback was included


----------



## markedfordeath

if they want to renegotiate tv deals, get Vacant his ass off the roster, then they can market their champion on talk shows and stuff.


----------



## KO Bossy

markedfordeath said:


> if they have Bryan go over Triple H and they keep pushing him, he will make tons of money for them. having one ppv not do as well as they thought means jack shit in the grand scheme of things, because you have to keep pushing a guy and putting him in a favorable program if you want him to succeed and make money for you. IF Bryan goes over Triple H, then his stock soars and soars and soars. They also pitched an idea to have him feud with a heel Cena, his stock will soar even more. And next summer they want him to face Lesnar, there we go, soaring even higher. Plus, unlike Punk, Bryan appeals to almost every demographic, he'll become very profitable in the long run. The company has to back you fully in order to become a money maker, and putting him over Triple H is without question the thing that will get him going.


Yeah yeah, if 'ifs' and 'buts' were candies and nuts...

This is all pure speculation. They gave ADR the world and his stock is worthless.

If they want to hook in the audience of old and create some new buzz they need someone and something different to build it off of. Something we haven't seen before. Right now, the only person I could legit seeing be that top babyface is Seth Rollins. He's got the unique look, the high flying babyface move set and they can tailor a character to suit him. Then they need to change the tone of their product. Again, I'm speculating as well, but if you look at the boom periods, they all incorporated some sort of formula similar to this.


----------



## JustJoel

Starbuck said:


> I know. I initially included a section entitled WWE Shop but they have that under the Digital Media segment. It talks about Digital Media but also about no. of orders processed so I got confused. Whatever it is, it only amounted to 3% so if you combine the two that's a total of 7% and still miles behind the other 3.


And licensing for bed sheets, action figures, t-shirts sold at Target (or any other 3rd party distributor), etc?


----------



## Amuroray

Cm punk simply cant bring in viewers.

Isnt good enough


----------



## 4everEyebrowRaisin

Amuroray said:


> Cm punk simply cant bring in viewers.
> 
> Isnt good enough


Why's it solely his responsibility? Daniel Bryan, Triple H, Stephanie, The Shield and The Big Show are the main focus right now. If the main event storyline isn't bringing in big ratings then the majority of the blame falls on their shoulders. Punk should be held accountable too, every big star who's expected to capture the interest of viewers should, but not nearly to the extent as the aforementioned talent involved in the top feud.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

GOAT brought in those ratings this week.

:yes


----------



## Happenstan

4everEyebrowRaisin said:


> *Why's it solely his responsibility?* Daniel Bryan, Triple H, Stephanie, The Shield and The Big Show are the main focus right now. If the main event storyline isn't bringing in big ratings then the majority of the blame falls on their shoulders. Punk should be held accountable too, every big star who's expected to capture the interest of viewers should, but not nearly to the extent as the aforementioned talent involved in the top feud.


Oh I don't know. Maybe because until recently Punk was one of the 2 main focuses (along with Cena) of the show for the past 2 freaking years.


----------



## markedfordeath

don't worry Happenstan, they'll never understand. I still blame Vacant for everything.


----------



## Amuroray

Happenstan said:


> Oh I don't know. Maybe because until recently Punk was one of the 2 main focuses (along with Cena) of the show for the past 2 freaking years.


Punk marks simply cant blame punk for his lack of drawing power.

Its all cenas fault.


----------



## RKO 4life

Bryan and Punk can't draw shit.


----------



## markedfordeath

ha ha


----------



## Happenstan

RKO 4life said:


> Bryan and Punk can't draw shit.


I don't know about that but Punk did draw flies throughout 2012.


----------



## markedfordeath

after HIAC the ratings get good. Bryan will be feuding with Triple H until January, then he moves on to a heel Cena...cant wait.


----------



## RKO 4life

Happenstan said:


> I don't know about that but Punk did draw flies throughout 2012.


As you are a Bryan mark throwing stones are we?


----------



## markedfordeath

how in the fuck can you even have a Bryan cant draw argument, when there's Vacant as champion? come on man! your argument doesn't work..he's not champion, so how can you hold anything against him? The only reason we're holding shit against Orton is because he's an established guy that is making people turn the channel every week. Bryan isn't established yet and he's not the champion...so this is too silly.


----------



## Happenstan

RKO 4life said:


> As you are a Bryan mark throwing stones are we?


2 years....3 months. Case closed.


----------



## RKO 4life

markedfordeath said:


> how in the fuck can you even have a Bryan cant draw argument, when there's Vacant as champion? come on man! your argument doesn't work..he's not champion, so how can you hold anything against him? The only reason we're holding shit against Orton is because he's an established guy that is making people turn the channel every week. Bryan isn't established yet and he's not the champion...so this is too silly.


:argh:

wow just wow


----------



## Stad

Happenstan almost has like this strange fetish for ratings and Punk, he just can't seem to stay away it seems.

:ti


----------



## markedfordeath

just like people can't stay away from the fact that the WWE is shit right now, and they're blaming Bryan for poor ratings, even though the ratings have gone down since he got stripped of the title, coincidence? obviously people want him as champion...and are tired of seeing Triple H's ego on TV....Fact!


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

unk3 - "My family might hate me, my co-workers might think I'm a conceited jackass, and I may be heading into middle age unmarried and childless, but I still have you, my constant companion..." *rubs small, greasy dick against a zombie comic bo- SHUT UP ITS A *GRAPHIC NOVEL**


----------



## Starbuck

Ouch lol.


----------



## Waffelz

The fuck has the breakdown disappeared for?


----------



## Happenstan

Stad said:


> Happenstan almost has like this strange fetish for ratings and Punk, he just can't seem to stay away it seems.
> 
> :ti


No more than Punk fans have a strange fetish for denying reality. Facts aren't open for debate. It hurts, I know.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Daniel Bryan*begins violently shaking* Daniel Bryan*beams of sanctifying light begin liquefying my corrupt flesh*DANIEL BRYAN*I am an _ánimam_ of Transcendent Enlightenment, cleansed of all falsehood and profanity*


----------



## WWE

> - Q10: Raw began a steady increase with a 1.94 rating for a segment that included two commercials. In-between commercials, there was another Cena hype video and Rhodes Bros. making their entrance.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: In this segment, people were interested in a Cena video package, as the audience increased from 1.272 million viewers at 10:21 p.m. to nearly 1.5 million viewers for the length of the video.


:cena3


----------



## Cena rulz12345

As ALWAYS CENA DRWAS AGAIN...


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Too bad the first Cena video didn't draw.

:cena4


----------



## MaybeLock

Cena rulz12345 said:


> As ALWAYS CENA DRWAS AGAIN...


Further proof that Cena is not human. He can draw people to a show where he doesn't even appear.

All hail the new wrestling GOD! :cena


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

> - Q5: Even with the benefit of the top-of-the-hour bump, Raw was actually down from Q4 with a 1.79 rating for Randy Orton vs. Dolph Ziggler, a John Cena hype video, and one commercial.
> 
> Within the quarter-hour, the audience was stagnant for Orton-Ziggler in the 1.2-million range, then the audience dropped to the 1.1-million range when the video package played before the commercial.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: You could draw a few conclusions here - Orton has been damaged via The Authority storyline, Ziggler has been damaged via constant losing post-World Title run, the match-up was not interesting, people don't want to see Cena in a video package, or something better was on TV at the top of the hour.


:cena4 :vince2


----------



## Cena rulz12345

^ what
@maybe lockj
lol,true
the only person who can draw even when he is not on show, :cena
bryan can only dream of doing so.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Cena rulz12345 said:


> ^ what
> @maybe lockj
> lol,true
> the only person who can draw even when he is not on show, :cena
> bryan can only dream of doing so.


If that was true, both of his awful video packages would have seen an increase. Yep. Just like Cena's most recent title run. What a draw that title reign was.


----------



## GillbergReturns

markedfordeath said:


> just like people can't stay away from the fact that the WWE is shit right now, and they're blaming Bryan for poor ratings, even though the ratings have gone down since he got stripped of the title, coincidence? obviously people want him as champion...and are tired of seeing Triple H's ego on TV....Fact!


Someone needs to look up last years October ratings. 

3 words Monday Night Football. That's the difference between now and September.


----------



## #Mark

RKO 4life said:


> Bryan, Orton and Punk can't draw shit.


Fixed.


----------



## Waffelz

Mister WrestleMania said:


> If that was true, both of his awful video packages would have seen an increase. Yep. Just like Cena's most recent title run. What a draw that title reign was.


I'll hazard a guess and say they did draw, but Orton's match was done just so badly. He can't draw. Ever.


----------



## Mabus

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> unk3 - "My family might hate me, my co-workers might think I'm a conceited jackass, and I may be heading into middle age unmarried and childless, but I still have you, my constant companion..." *rubs small, greasy dick against a zombie comic bo- SHUT UP ITS A *GRAPHIC NOVEL**


LOL POST OF THE MONTH!

All Punk needs is Gawd.


----------



## Happenstan

#Mark said:


> RKO 4life said:
> 
> 
> 
> Orton and Punk can't draw shit after *YEARS OF TRYING*. Bryan's 3 months in and thus a work in progress.
> 
> 
> 
> Fixed.
Click to expand...

Really fixed.


----------



## RKO 4life

Happenstan said:


> Really fixed.


you are a piece of work 

Orton best drawer since Nash in 98. Well I have to also throw in Rock and Stone Cold


----------



## Cena rulz12345

@mr.wm
idk what num they did so i can't say it was bad or good,
but atleast he is a proven draw unlike your shizzle.


----------



## markedfordeath

those video packages for Cena were tributes. Vince might want him to continue as face of the company, but Triple H clearly does not...because he's trying real hard to push new guys now. When he's not burying them I mean.


----------



## dmccourt95

To put an end to the mark war:

Monday Night Football
There isn't that much of an interest
Its easier to watch later on than live
People are fed up with the same old shit


----------



## ChickMagnet12

dmccourt95 said:


> *To put an end to the mark war:*
> 
> Monday Night Football
> There isn't that much of an interest
> Its easier to watch later on than live
> People are fed up with the same old shit



“Only the dead have seen the end of war.” ― Plato


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Cena rulz12345 said:


> @mr.wm
> idk what num they did so i can't say it was bad or good


All you have to do is read it.


----------



## Happenstan

RKO 4life said:


> you are a piece of work
> 
> Orton best drawer since Nash in 98. Well I have to also throw in Rock and Stone Cold


The mark of a good troll is fooling people into believing you are real and serious. You're way too obvious and over the top with your comments to pull off what you are trying to pull off.




dmccourt95 said:


> To put an end to the mark war


Now why would you want to do something like that?


----------



## Alo0oy

According to Google Trends, there is STILL more interest in CM Punk than Daniel Bryan.










Bryan's popularity peaked in August & he's been in a sharp decline ever since.

CM Punk is at his lowest since May 2011, & there's still more interest in him now than when Bryan was at his peak in August.


----------



## Happenstan

Alo0oy said:


> According to Google Trends, there is STILL more interest in CM Punk than Daniel Bryan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bryan's popularity peaked in August & he's been in a sharp decline ever since.
> 
> CM Punk is at his lowest since May 2011, & there's still more interest in him now than when Bryan was at his peak in August.


Try running a search with Punk against Randy Orton and it is Orton that has drawn more interest than Punk for months now and yet of the 3 he is the one to draw the lowest ratings each week. I don't think quoting Google Trends is exactly the best argument for who is more popular.


----------



## Jof

No shit. Punk is still the bigger star and has more credibility/Starpower compared to Bryan. Bryan is just being built up, Punk has had two year long solid push starting Survivor Series 2011. 

I reckon when we get closer to wrestlemania, Bryan's interest level will hit its peak.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Google trends now being brought into this ratings thread. :lmao

GOAT Thread, no question about it.


----------



## Alo0oy

Happenstan said:


> Try running a search with Punk against Randy Orton and it is Orton that has drawn more interest than Punk for months now and yet of the 3 he is the one to draw the lowest ratings each week. I don't think quoting Google Trends is exactly the best argument for who is more popular.


Quarterly ratings are nothing more than arbitrary increases/decreases unless there is an advertized event, people don't get a popup at the bottom of the screen while watching Breaking Bad every time someone makes an appearance on Raw unadvertized.

You would be crazy to think The Divas & Santino-Elvis draw more than CM Punk, there are unexplainable increased & decreases every single week.

Google trends is more definitive than arbitrary ratings, CM Punk generating more interest than Bryan makes sense, & the sharp decline in the interest in Bryan makes sense because his pops have been decreasing for weeks now.

As for Randy Orton, have you seen how low the interest in him in 2012 & the early part of 2013? It makes sense because he was in midcard hell back then.

EDIT: I didn't mean ratings overall don't matter, because it's clear if there is a champion that draws, or a big star makes an appearance, the ratings increase, my point is that overall ratings are more accurate than arbitrary by-segment ratings.


----------



## Guy LeDouche

The Sandrone said:


> Google trends now being brought into this ratings thread. :lmao
> 
> GOAT Thread, no question about it.


:lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## Happenstan

Alo0oy said:


> Google trends is more definitive than arbitrary ratings


Hmmm, super fans who are searching and tweeting during RAW or casuals who are just sitting down with the family to watch every Monday night then forgetting all about wrestling for the rest of the week. I wonder which there are more of....


----------



## Jof

More definitive? How would you explain this though? 










So according to this, Big show almost always had more interest with fans than Punk, even when Punk was having 434 days of main event title push and even going against the likes of Rock, Lesnar, Undertaker? The trend shows big interest in may 2011 for punk but ratings in 2011 never moved and even actually down from previous year at that time. 

In any case, WWE clearly doesn't use that data to push stars, so its irrelevant.


----------



## Alo0oy

The Sandrone said:


> Google trends now being brought into this ratings thread. :lmao
> 
> GOAT Thread, no question about it.


I've been reading this thread for months, so I wanted to contribute.


----------



## Alo0oy

Happenstan said:


> Hmmm, super fans who are searching and tweeting during RAW or casuals who are just sitting down with the family to watch every Monday night then forgetting all about wrestling for the rest of the week. I wonder which there are more of....


You ignored my entire post, I said ratings matter, just not arbitrary breakdowns, people don't tune in every minute, so how many people watched during a 15 minute window is the definition of arbitrary.


----------



## Alo0oy

Jof said:


> More definitive? How would you explain this though?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So according to this, Big show almost always had more interest with fans than Punk, even when Punk was having 434 days of main event title push and even going against the likes of Rock, Lesnar, Undertaker? The trend shows big interest in may 2011 for punk but ratings in 2011 never moved and even actually down from previous year at that time.
> 
> In any case, WWE clearly doesn't use that data to push stars, so its irrelevant.


"Big Show" is a vague term, "Big Metallica Show at _____" would add to Big Show's trends.


----------



## Jof

Which is exactly why this is not reliable data.


----------



## Alo0oy

Jof said:


> Which is exactly why this is not reliable data.


"CM Punk" & "Daniel Bryan" are as specific as it gets, using "Big Show" as evidence that it's not reliable is stupid, because "Big Show" is one of the most vague "names" in WWE.


----------



## Happenstan

Alo0oy said:


> "Big Show" is a vague term, "Big Metallica Show at _____" would add to Big Show's trends.


I know nothing of google trends but if results are skewered that easily wouldn't any mention of punk music add to CM Punk's tally?


----------



## Alo0oy

Happenstan said:


> I know nothing of google trends but if results are skewered that easily wouldn't any mention of punk music add to CM Punk's tally?


It would if the search was only for "Punk", but there is a "CM" prefix before "Punk".


----------



## Ungratefulness

Looks like AJ's been more popular than Bryan for awhile


----------



## funnyfaces1

:lmao at using Google Trends. What's next? Youtube views? Silly unk marks.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Wow.
A ratings thread turned into a google trends thread.
Only smarks can do that.


----------



## Alo0oy

funnyfaces1 said:


> :lmao at using Google Trends. What's next? Youtube views? Silly unk marks.


Well, Brock Lesnar vs CM Punk has more youtube views than Daniel Bryan vs John Cena.

Facts are facts.


----------



## markedfordeath

is this really turning into another Bash Bryan thread? come on guys! it got old. As soon as he beats Triple H, he'll be the most popular once again.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

:lmao and now youtube views. This thread.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Btw bryan does'nt even draw on youtube :troll


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Cena rulz12345 said:


> Btw bryan does'nt even draw on youtube :troll


Too bad Cena's last title reign didn't draw. :cena4

Talk about a doofus.


----------



## Brye

Honest question for y'all. How much emphasis do you think the midcard has on how the TV ratings turn out? It plays a good deal in my interest for the show but do you think it requires a well rounded show (with a decent main event scene) to make a strong rating, or just a good main event scene and a lacking midcard?


----------



## Choke2Death

Twitter followers is what matters!

Randy Orton: 3,125,354 followers
CM Punk: 2,047,591 followers
Daniel Bryan: 1,105,247 followers

Guess who wins? rton2


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Brye said:


> Honest question for y'all. How much emphasis do you think the midcard has on how the TV ratings turn out? It plays a good deal in my interest for the show but do you think it requires a well rounded show (with a decent main event scene) to make a strong rating, or just a good main event scene and a lacking midcard?


I think the stronger the card and/or roster is from top to bottom, the stronger the rating and viewers will be. I liken it to a sitcom. The more viable characters on the show will help draw in more and more viewers. For instance, if there's only one or two characters on a particular show people like, the want or need to watch the show isn't as strong. If viewers have more than one or two reasons to watch, the more viewers the show will likely draw in.


----------



## Gretchen

You all forget about the Ultimate Draw:

:miz

Dem ratings.


----------



## Alo0oy

Choke2Death said:


> Twitter followers is what matters!
> 
> Randy Orton: 3,125,354 followers
> CM Punk: 2,047,591 followers
> Daniel Bryan: 1,105,247 followers
> 
> Guess who wins? rton2


Facebook likes:

Randy Orton: 3.6M
CM Punk: 2.7M
Daniel Bryan: 435K :lol

Daniel Bryan is like the bastard child of the three.


----------



## markedfordeath

Bryan has over 1.1 million twitter followers after three months, pretty damn good...just imagine how much he'll have when he has more exposure outside of wrestling as the WWE champion. You guys put him down too much, i bet if you spent a day with him you'd probably love the guy, but all you guys do is talk shit about him constantly!


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Considering the pushes over the years some of those guys have gotten, it's pretty funny Bryan is even in the same neighborhood. Just imagine if Bryan had been pushed for the last 3-7 years. :lmao


----------



## markedfordeath

exactly. if Bryan was champion for a year, i bet he'd have 3 million facebook likes too....


----------



## checkcola

Google trends, lord help us, I used to be a fan of American Idol way back when it was a bit of a cultural phenomenon and I remember one group of fans "The Claymates" who would spam polls, run searches on different search sites, the whole nine yards to make it seems as if Clay Aiken was da greatest American Idol (putting aside that the chump didn't even win his season). The Mates kind of remind me of certain wrestling fans. Just saying.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Considering the pushes over the years some of those guys have gotten, it's pretty funny Bryan is even in the same neighborhood. Just imagine if Bryan had been pushed for the last 3-7 years. :lmao


How is that the same neighborhood? Bryan needs to multiply his facebook likes by 8+ to match Orton & 6+ to match Punk.

He also needs to multiply his followers by 3 to match Orton & by 2 to match Punk.

If you want to use the "he just got his push" card, Randy Orton gained 2,177 followers over the last 24 hours while Daniel Bryan only 1,577.

Face it, Daniel Bryan won't even draw on Duck Dynasty :bryan.


----------



## Happenstan

Alo0oy said:


> How is that the same neighborhood? Bryan needs to multiply his facebook likes by 8+ to match Orton & 6+ to match Punk.
> 
> He also needs to multiply his followers by 3 to match Orton & by 2 to match Punk.
> 
> If you want to use the "he just got his push" card, Randy Orton gained 2,177 followers over the last 24 hours while Daniel Bryan only 1,577.
> 
> Face it, Daniel Bryan won't even draw on Duck Dynasty :bryan.



He's been pushed as a legit threat for 3 months (a year if we include Hell No), while Orton's on year 10(?) and Punk is on year 3 (year 5 if we include his midcard stuff like feuding with Jeff Hardy and SES as we did with Bryan and Hell No). Do the math. Bryan's achieving social media fandom at a faster rate. Plus does he even use Facebook? He rarely ever uses Twitter compared to Orton and Punk.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> How is that the same neighborhood? Bryan needs to multiply his facebook likes by 8+ to match Orton & 6+ to match Punk.
> 
> He also needs to multiply his followers by 3 to match Orton & by 2 to match Punk.
> 
> If you want to use the "he just got his push" card, Randy Orton gained 2,177 followers over the last 24 hours while Daniel Bryan only 1,577.
> 
> Face it, Daniel Bryan won't even draw on Duck Dynasty :bryan.


:lol I meant Twitter followers. 

Someone takes their Social Media _very_ seriously. Kids.

:lmao :lmao :lmao

Now, to the numbers that MATTER. CM Punk drew the two lowest QH's on Raw this past week. 

:lmao


----------



## Choke2Death

Orton has barely been on twitter all year. He tweets a couple of times a month it seems and just disappears for weeks.


----------



## markedfordeath

seriously, this argument is a complete joke right now, Alooy is obviously trolling, because his over the top Bryan hate has to be fake.


----------



## Alo0oy

Happenstan said:


> He's been pushed as a legit threat for 3 months (a year if we include Hell No), while Orton's on year 10(?) and Punk is on year 3 (year 5 if we include his midcard stuff like feuding with Jeff Hardy and SES as we did with Bryan and Hell No). Do the math. Bryan's achieving social media fandom at a faster rate. Plus does he even use Facebook? He rarely ever uses Twitter compared to Orton and Punk.


But the rate is right there in the post you quoted, Orton gained more followers than Bryan over the last 24 hours. & Daniel Bryan actually uses twitter more often than Randy Orton & CM Punk.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

fpalm


----------



## Alo0oy

markedfordeath said:


> seriously, this argument is a complete joke right now, Alooy is obviously trolling, because his over the top Bryan hate has to be fake.


I don't hate him, I've stated plenty of times that he's my third favorite wrestler.

It's just that...Facts are facts.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> I don't hate him, I've stated plenty of times that he's my third favorite wrestler.
> 
> It's just that...Facts are facts.


Here's another fact:

CM Punk drew the two lowest QH's of this past weeks Raw, in the 1.7's.

:hhh2


----------



## Happenstan

Alo0oy said:


> But the rate is right there in the post you quoted, Orton gained more followers than Bryan over the last 24 hours. & Daniel Bryan actually uses twitter more often than Randy Orton & CM Punk.


He's been around longer. Patience. Wait a year like every other top guy has got and then compare. If Bryan is failing then I'll be the first to call him out.

Since when has Bryan used twitter more than Punk or Orton? Granted I haven't been to either's twitter in an age but a year ago Bryan was rarely posting and Punk and Orton couldn't shut up.


----------



## markedfordeath

Bryan is going to end up more popular than Punk....WWE is tailored to kids, thats the demo they care about the most. And Bryan is more kid friendly than Punk. So in the long run, he's more valuable to the company. That's going to be a fact. And Punk's twitter is always mentioned as the top, Bryan doesn't use it, another shitty post from you! Bryan never uses Twitter.


----------



## Happenstan

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Alo0oy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't hate him, I've stated plenty of times that he's my third favorite wrestler.
> 
> It's just that...Facts are facts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here's another fact:
> 
> CM Punk drew the two lowest QH's of this past weeks Raw, in the 1.7's.
> 
> :hhh2
Click to expand...

Punk's getting a new theme song...


----------



## Choke2Death

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Here's another fact:
> 
> CM Punk drew the two lowest QH's of this past weeks Raw, in the 1.7's.
> 
> :hhh2


Come on now, that's cheap. Punk doing bad numbers is about as natural as breathing. Let's not act surprised when that happens.


----------



## checkcola

You're more likely to hear what Bryan is up to on the bella twins twitter than his own, actually


----------



## markedfordeath

has anyone noticed that the guys that do shitty numbers are the ones favored by Vince? He continually puts them in favorable positions on the card..why is that?


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Here's another fact:
> 
> CM Punk drew the two lowest QH's of this past weeks Raw, in the 1.7's.
> 
> :hhh2


Yeah let's compare unadvertized events to hyped up events.


----------



## Alo0oy

markedfordeath said:


> has anyone noticed that the guys that do shitty numbers are the ones favored by Vince? He continually puts them in favorable positions on the card..why is that?


Here's why: Ratings don't mean shit unless the contract with the networks is up for renewal.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Yeah let's compare unadvertized events to hyped up events.


Yeah, let's all of a sudden not use the system that WWE and the entire television world uses as a barometer of success, you know, just because.


----------



## Londrick

People are using facebook/twitter followers to gauge someone's popularity? :ti


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Yeah, let's all of a sudden not use the system that WWE and the entire television world uses as a barometer of success, you know, just because.


So why do WWE hype up events in advance if it doesn't mean more viewers will tune in?


----------



## markedfordeath

if not as many people are buying PPV's anymore and the ratings do not really matter and all that, then how are they making money every year?


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> So why do WWE hype up events in advance if it doesn't mean more viewers will tune in?


Do you even know what they use ratings for?


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Do you even know what they use ratings for?


Here's a marketing fact: Advertized event > Unadvertized event.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Here's a marketing fact: Advertized event > Unadvertized event.


Here's a fact: 

The television industry has used ratings as a barometer of success for decades now. That is not changing anytime soon. You can yell, scream, cry, send nasty emails to whomever, it's not changing.

Now DRAW DEM RATINGS OR GET OUT.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Here's a fact:
> 
> The television industry has used ratings as a barometer of success for decades now. That is not changing anytime soon. You can yell, scream, cry, send nasty emails to whomever, it's not changing.
> 
> Now DRAW DEM RATINGS OR GET OUT.


You're dodging my point.

if Brad Pitt showed up at a bookstore unannounced to sign autographs, there won't be that many people that would show up, if the bookstore advertized him however, there will be more people there.


----------



## Happenstan

Alo0oy said:


> Here's why: Ratings don't mean shit unless the contract with the networks is up for renewal.


You know that's on happening real soon, right?


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> You're dodging my point.
> 
> if Brad Pitt showed up at a bookstore unannounced to sign autographs, there won't be that many people that would show up, if the bookstore advertized him however, there will be more people there.


No shit? But this is television ratings. Two completely different things. Everything gets recorded and counts for every wrestler. That's the way it's been forever.


----------



## Alo0oy

Happenstan said:


> You know that's on happening real soon, right?


Soon as in, a year from now.

http://corporate.wwe.com/news/2009/2009_11_16_2-.jsp


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> No shit? But this is television ratings. Two completely different things. Everything gets recorded and counts for every wrestler. That's the way it's been forever.


I'm talking about advertized events within the show itself, Bryan's segments have always been advertized within the show between matches & segments, while Punk just shows up & does his thing.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> I'm talking about advertized events within the show itself, Bryan's segments have always been advertized within the show between matches & segments, while Punk just shows up & does his thing.


That's not true at all. A few weeks ago Raw was in Punk's hometown of Chicago. They ADVERTISED for that and Punk drew a rating for it. And that's just off the top of my head.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> That's not true at all. A few weeks ago Raw was in Punk's hometown of Chicago. They ADVERTISED for that and *Punk drew a rating for it*. And that's just off the top of my head.


& that's my point.

Same thing with Orton too, when he was advertized against Cody & Goldust, he drew huge numbers too.

But when they show up randomly, people that aren't watching Raw don't even know that they're there, WWE & the networks aren't stupid to judge by that, they judge by how well they do when advertized, & how well the show does when it revolves around them.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> & that's my point.
> 
> Same thing with Orton too, when he was advertized against Cody & Goldust, he drew huge numbers too.
> 
> *But when they show up randomly, people that aren't watching Raw don't even know that they're there*, WWE & the networks aren't stupid to judge by that, they judge by how well they do when advertized, & how well the show does when it revolves around them.


It's WWE. If a fan wants to catch their weekly fix of their favorite wrestler, they know to tune into Raw every week. It's a show that's on once a week.

And WWE and the networks absolutely look at the ratings on a week to week basis. It's what networks use to determine how much they are willing to spend to advertise their product on WWE TV. 

Ratings matter.

:hhh2


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> *It's WWE. If a fan wants to catch their weekly fix of their favorite wrestler, they know to tune into Raw every week. It's a show that's on once a week.*
> 
> And WWE and the networks absolutely look at the ratings on a week to week basis. It's what networks use to determine how much they are willing to spend to advertise their product on WWE TV.
> 
> Ratings matter.
> 
> :hhh2


You're just poking holes into your own argument, if everybody that wants to watch his favorite wrestler will tune in every week, doesn't that mean quarterly ratings are irrelevant? Since all of Punk/Bryan/Orton fans will tune in to that "once a week" show anyway?


----------



## Brye

Man, y'all take this ratings stuff so seriously.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> You're just poking holes into your own argument, if everybody that wants to watch his favorite wrestler will tune in every week, doesn't that mean quarterly ratings are irrelevant? Since all of Punk/Bryan/Orton fans will tune in to that "once a week" show anyway?


Not if fans either a) are turned off by that night's show and decide to channel surf, remember fans have short attention spans these days, or b) after channel surfing, found something else they'd rather watch for the next few hours.

With this awful logic, only "advertised" segments matter. No others do. Terrible argument.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Not if fans either a) are turned off by that night's show and decide to channel surf, remember fans have short attention spans these days, or b) after channel surfing, found something else they'd rather watch for the next few hours.
> 
> *With this awful logic, only "advertised" segments matter. No others do. Terrible argument.*


Have you been watching the same WWE the last few years? Advertized segments ARE the only segments that matter, except for the rare surprise appearance. Nothing big ever happens in random segments.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Have you been watching the same WWE the last few years? Advertized segments ARE the only segments that matter, except for the rare surprise appearance. * Nothing big ever happens in random segments.*


*

*

That's a whole other argument. Anyway, this is so beyond stupid.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> [/B]
> 
> That's a whole other argument. Anyway, this is so beyond stupid.


I think we've argued over this to death, so let's move on.

Punk still has double the twitter followers Bryan has. unk


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> I think we've argued over this to death, so let's move on.
> 
> Punk still has double the twitter followers Bryan has. unk


Considering the push he had, he should have 10 times the followers and much more ratings than Bryan has consistently.

Those 1.7's didn't do it this week, though. Forget Bryan, those were the two lowest rated QH's the ENTIRE show.

:lmao


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Considering the push he had, he should have 10 times the followers and much more ratings than Bryan has consistently.
> 
> Those 1.7's didn't do it this week, though. Forget Bryan, those were the two lowest rated QH's the ENTIRE show.
> 
> :lmao


Punk felt bad for Bryan, so he decided to give him some of his viewers for a change.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Punk felt bad for Bryan, so he decided to give him some of his viewers for a change.


If that's what makes you feel better, then sure.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> If that's what makes you feel better, then sure.


----------



## Alo0oy

Brye said:


> Man, y'all take this ratings stuff so seriously.


Hey, you're not supposed to break this thread's kayfabe.


----------



## WWE

Brye said:


> Man, y'all take this ratings stuff so seriously.


man shaddup John Morrison couldn't for shit Daniel Bryan rules!!!1!!!1!11!!11


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

And all of a sudden this is like the wwe.com forums. Dem kiddies.

:cena4


----------



## WWE

And we all know what happened to the WWE forum :side:


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

There's only one uh...er, "man" to blame!

:cena4


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> There's only one uh...er, "man" to blame!
> 
> :cena4


It has to be Triple H. :trips :buried


----------



## Brye

I don't like Triple H and therefore he can't draw. Fucker can't even use crayons.



I actually generally don't mind Trips.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

Brye said:


> Honest question for y'all. How much emphasis do you think the midcard has on how the TV ratings turn out? It plays a good deal in my interest for the show but do you think it requires a well rounded show (with a decent main event scene) to make a strong rating, or just a good main event scene and a lacking midcard?


A Lot. I actually found myself watching more of Raw when Orton was midcarding it up. Now I just watch the main story on DVR. And most of the time I'm hesitant to even watch any. Usually get around to watching on like Weds or Thurs if I decide to not watch it live.

As of now, I just watch Football over Raw. Even watch the NBA preseason over Raw TBH.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

Alo0oy said:


> Well, Brock Lesnar vs CM Punk has more youtube views than Daniel Bryan vs John Cena.
> 
> Facts are facts.


I'm sure it's because of Punk.:flacco2


----------



## Brye

Billion Dollar Man said:


> A Lot. I actually found myself watching more of Raw when Orton was midcarding it up. Now I just watch the main story on DVR. And most of the time I'm hesitant to even watch any. Usually get around to watching on like Weds or Thurs if I decide to not watch it live.
> 
> As of now, I just watch Football over Raw. Even watch the NBA preseason over Raw TBH.


I've found myself watching football over it as well. Generally based on the game though. I'd gladly take Raw over that Vikings/Giants game.

I definitely don't have that urge to immediately catch it when I miss a show. However I'm really enjoying the tag team stuff.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

Brye said:


> I've found myself watching football over it as well. Generally based on the game though. I'd gladly take *Raw over that Vikings/Giants game.*
> 
> I definitely don't have that urge to immediately catch it when I miss a show. However I'm really enjoying the tag team stuff.


Adrian Peterson is all I need to watch that over Raw no matter how bad the teams are.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Too bad Cena's last title reign didn't draw. :cena4
> 
> Talk about a doofus.


too bad none of hbk's reigns ever drew
:cena4
talk about a doofus.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Cena rulz12345 said:


> too bad none of hbk's reigns ever drew
> :cena4
> talk about a doofus.


I never said they did. But at least he had a good excuse as to why (the nWo at it's hottest), and he made up for it in other areas. Current day WWE has no wrestling competition. What's today's excuse?

Look at this dofus's face right here. No wonder why WWE doesn't draw today. :cena4 fpalm :lmao


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Wwe does'nt draw????????
Are you living under a rock????
And cena does'nt draw???
Do you even know that cena has headlined 4wm's that did 1million buys or do you know cena alone is responsible for 24% of their annual income.
He made them a mindblowing $105 millions in just merchandise sales and thay have laid many sponsership deals just this year.
I know you don't like cena much but get your facts straight and be ''honest'' here.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Yeah, this is the ratings thread, dude. WWE doesn't draw as much as it used to, and they have NO wrestling competition on at the same time as them, like they used to. That's what I'm getting at. I know Cena is the best full time wrestler draw that they have. Which isn't saying much.


----------



## Alo0oy

Man, using Cena as the butt of jokes in this thread is no fun.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Man, using Cena as the butt of jokes in this thread is no fun.


Cena is one of many that one can use.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Cena is one of many that one can use.


It's fun when we can make fun of the way he takes bumps or how shitty his execution in the ring is. But once we start creeping into his drawing ability, we'll get burned.

Oh well, there's always this:


----------



## Londrick

This thread is gonna be great when tonight's breakdown comes out. It's gonna be unk :bryan vs rton2


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Or maybe
:bryan unk vs :cena2 rton2


----------



## Osize10

I hope Kevin Nash shows up and gives the jackknife power bomb to Bryan. Then at SS it's team HHH vs team HBK with Nash as special guest ref, Orton vs Big Show, and LOL Cena vs ADR in a submission match.

#RTLOLZWM


----------



## Londrick

Cena rulz12345 said:


> Or maybe
> :bryan unk :randyorton vs :cena2


Actually it's gonna be Vanilla midget marks vs :cena rton2


----------



## checkcola

I'm sure Nash wishes he could text message himself back onto RAW.


----------



## Jof

Orton da champ will bring ratings. No worries.


----------



## checkcola

Jof said:


> Orton da champ will bring ratings. No worries.


He's running out of midcard babyfaces to go through on RAW.


----------



## Starbuck

*WRESTLEMANIA COMES EARLY TO THE RATINGS THREAD*

unk5 :bryan2 vs. rton2 :cena2 vs. :trips2 :hbk2

Did we ever get a breakdown for last week btw?


----------



## Londrick

I think so. IIRC Punk bombed hard, drew a 1.74 and 1.75 the lowest of the show.


----------



## JY57

> - Friday's episode of WWE SmackDown did 2,681,000 viewers, up just a bit from the previous week's 2,640,000 viewers.


 via PWInsider (1st on Cable in 18-49 Male Demo)


----------



## Starbuck

Londrick said:


> I think so. IIRC Punk bombed hard, drew a 1.74 and 1.75 the lowest of the show.


Oh yeah that's right. So we got Torch but not Observer? Seems like we got one or the other these days, never the two.


----------



## Choke2Death

Starbuck said:


> *WRESTLEMANIA COMES EARLY TO THE RATINGS THREAD*
> 
> unk5 :bryan2 vs. rton2 :cena2 vs. :trips2 :hbk2
> 
> Did we ever get a breakdown for last week btw?


Team Indy Midgets vs Team Champions vs Team DX? (thanks to the champs and DX)

BUYRATES GALORE!



Londrick said:


> I think so. IIRC Punk bombed hard, drew a 1.74 and 1.75 the lowest of the show.


Unsurprisingly, there were none of the blind Punk marks in sight this week to defend their hero's failure to deliver.


----------



## doinktheclowns

Choke2Death said:


> Team Indy Midgets vs Team Champions vs Team DX? (thanks to the champs and DX)
> 
> BUYRATES GALORE!
> 
> 
> 
> Unsurprisingly, there were none of the blind Punk marks in sight this week to defend their hero's failure to deliver.


You are relentless.


----------



## WWE

First Hour:
Cena opens show
Cena/Sandow after commercial break 
Cena/Sandow until 8:35

Langston/Ambrose first 5 minutes
Langston/Usos/Shield until 8:50 (15 minutes)


Second Hour:
HBK announcement, Kicking off 2nd hour (8:55)
HBK/Daniel Bryan at 9:00, ended around 9:05
Daniel Bryan/Wyatt Family segment at 9:10
Los Matawhatever vs 3MB from 9:14 - 9:18
AJ Lee/wHATEVer her name was/Bella Twins - around 9:20 - 9:30
Miz/Kane at 9:35 to... 9:40
Kane/Stephanie from 9:40 to like.. 9:43
PTP Merchandise Sale from 9:45 to... 9:47
CM ratings Dropping Punk from 9:48 - 9:52

Third Hour:
CM Ratings Dropping Punk/Ryback from 10:00 to 10:05
CM Ratings Dropping Punk/Wyatt's from 10:05 to 10:08
Real Americans/Rhodes Bros from 10:12 - 10:27
Alberto Dorito Segment at 10:30
Summer Rae & Fandango/Natalya & Great Khack from 10:35 to like 10:47
THE GOAT SEGMENT + Overrun - 10:52 - 11:05


Ya'll go Crazy.


----------



## RKO 4life

Orton will get the biggest numbers this week.


----------



## Mqwar

HBK/Bryan at 9 should be strongest this week.


----------



## ChickMagnet12

Londrick said:


> Actually it's gonna be Vanilla midget marks vs :cena rton2



You can't possibly mean...

unk :bryan marks are now...one?

Reminds me of this.











Soon to be attacking the Orton marks


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

^Until they're in the same segments together each week... no way Punk and Bryan marks will ever be "one". :lmao

Hopefully everyone just tuned out after what happened in Cena/Sandow. It would be great if there was a huge gain for that match, and then a huge loss that they never recover from afterwards. That would make my day.


----------



## JY57

> Monday's WWE Raw following the Hell in a Cell PPV jumped 68.5 percent in Social Media Activity compared to last week's show.
> 
> Raw scored 283,796, according to Trendrr.TV, the highest in two months dating back to the Raw after Summerslam. Raw ranked #1 on cable TV for the first time in six weeks.
> 
> Last week, Raw scored by far the lowest social score of the year, registering 168k for the PPV lead-in episode, which set up this week's Raw for a dramatic increase.


via PWTorch


----------



## wb1899

Just for Fun:
WWE Raw (10/28) Nielsen Twitter TV Ratings
Unique Audience(000): 1,486.4 
Impressions(000): 10,119.5 
Unique Authors(000): 53.9 
Tweets(000): 189.8


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

JY57 said:


> via PWTorch


DAT :sandow


----------



## Mqwar

wb1899 said:


> Just for Fun:
> WWE Raw (10/28) Nielsen Twitter TV Ratings
> Unique Audience(000): 1,486.4
> Impressions(000): 10,119.5
> Unique Authors(000): 53.9
> Tweets(000): 189.8


Wow, so this is the new Nielsen twitter TV-ratings! 










RAW makes the Top 3 too. 

This might even become the new standard for advertisers in a few years.


----------



## JasonLives

Think they should atleast be able to get over 4 million viewers this week. Or atleast 2 out of 3 hours of 4 million viewers.


----------



## WWE

> Raw scored 283,796, according to Trendrr.TV, *the highest in two months dating back to the Raw after Summerslam.* *Raw ranked #1 on cable TV for the first time in six weeks.*


I WONDER WHY :cena3


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Cycloneon said:


> I WONDER WHY :cena3


YOU'RE WELCOME! :sandow

Hour 1- 4.315
Hour 2- 4.185
Hour 3- 3.965


----------



## JY57

Hour 1 - 4.315 million
Hour 2 - 4.185 million
Hour 3 - 3.965 million


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

4.155 average. Really good. Last year's did well this week too with 4.102 million average and hours of:

Hour 1- 4.306 
Hour 2- 4.217
Hour 3- 3.783

So as usual, right in line with the year prior.


----------



## vk79

So this proves it.. WWE is not changing anything up from last night since they did pretty good in the ratings. Cena will continue to reign supreme.


----------



## Amuroray

cena just doing what he does


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Obviously it was all Sandow. The same Raw he's about to become World Champion gets the best single-hour viewership in months, and the best 8PM hour in even longer. Cena was just there.


----------



## markedfordeath

so I guess since Cena can overcome the odds injured against Sandow and he is Superman, what does that mean for Bryan who beat him clean and Cena couldn't come back in that match?


----------



## Cena rulz12345

YET AGAIN CENA DRAWS
the last time he was on tv on post ss raw it got the big score than this past raw we get the highest score for raw since last time cena was on raw. :cena4 :cena5
I wonder how long vince will be able to keep himself from inserting cena in the corp storyline
:vince2


----------



## Mqwar

Weaker competition and Post-PPV bump probably the biggest reasons, and yes Cena's return was also part of the reason. 

Don't get too excited though, the increase is a one night deal.


----------



## Londrick

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.315 million
> Hour 2 - 4.185 million
> *Hour 3 - 3.965 million*



:HHH2 :show :rko2 bringing in them numbers. :lol

Thank fully Cena's back to save the ratings from the Authority.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Londrick said:


> :HHH2 :show :rko2 bringing in them numbers. :lol
> 
> Thank fully Cena's back to save the ratings from the Authority.


That was actually last year's.


----------



## superuser1

Londrick said:


> :HHH2 :show :rko2 bringing in them numbers. :lol
> 
> Thank fully Cena's back to save the ratings from the Authority.


Thats from last year


----------



## Londrick

What are you guys talking about? :angle


----------



## WWE

JY57 said:


> *Hour 1 - 4.315 million*
> Hour 2 - 4.185 million
> Hour 3 - 3.965 million


----------



## D.M.N.

The first hour was the highest first hour rating since the night after WrestleMania 29. That's Cena for you, folks...


----------



## markedfordeath

i bet his match and the HBK/Bryan segment were the highest.


----------



## WWE

D.M.N. said:


> The first hour was the highest first hour rating since the night after WrestleMania 29. That's Cena for you, folks...


----------



## Fissiks

the ratings would have been even higher next week had Cena lost tbh.


----------



## markedfordeath

Poor Sandow! The robe is the curse...just like Rick Rude, nobody with that type of robe becomes World Champion....well other than Ric Flair, but his wasn't as impressive.


----------



## chronoxiong

Mark Henry doesn't equal ratings. It was Cena all along. That Hustle, Loyalty, and Respect. Eat that Cena haters! :cena3


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

DAT HEEL :hbk1

SHAKE HIS HAND.


----------



## markedfordeath

ha ha loved how Triple H didn't give a shit that HBK was attacked lol


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

:hbk1 did what was best for business. Don't hate.


----------



## Alo0oy

chronoxiong said:


> Mark Henry doesn't equal ratings. It was Cena all along. That Hustle, Loyalty, and Respect. Eat that Cena haters! :cena3


No one can bring dem ratings more than The World's Strongest Ratings. :henry1


----------



## JY57

final rating - 2.98


----------



## markedfordeath

damn..now that all the players are back, the lowest it got was 2.65...that still isn't that awful...so all in all, ratings stayed consistent mostly.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

2.98? HUGE!!!!

:lmao


----------



## markedfordeath

that's pretty darn good...HBK/Bryan segment and the Cena match had to be the highest...not a high overrun due to it being the lowest hour but those three are the top


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Yup, 2.98 is really good around this time nowadays. Again though, if the numbers continue following suit with last year's, this is gonna be the highest rating for the rest of the year, so expect a pretty big dip next week.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

It's certainly not good enough to proclaim anyone as some kind of a huge draw, that's for sure. They're all in the same boat.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Can't wait to see the breakdown. I think Cena/Sandow peaks the night in quarter 2 if it was as well received as the crowd made it seem. 9PM might have a shot, and the overrun... well since that's not averaged into the third hour (I think), that could be way up there. Not really sure on that. 

But the way I figure it, the show should start off strong with it being the fallout from the PPV last night and the fact it's Cena's first appearance on Raw in a couple of months. And then when Sandow comes out, attacks Cena, and then officially cashes in, more people jump onto Raw and people who were watching stay tuned. Then we see a huge drop after the match ends. It ended at 8:35 (I think), so the drop will probably happen in quarter 3.


----------



## markedfordeath

gee, wonder who's fault that is!


----------



## JY57

Mister WrestleMania said:


> It's certainly not good enough to proclaim anyone as some kind of a huge draw, that's for sure. They're all in the same boat.


fall (starting with the end of September) & winter (December) season they are lucky to even get this type of rating. they are in 2.4-2.7 range (and sometimes even below 2.4 during the holidays)


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

JY57 said:


> fall (starting with the end of September) & winter (December) season they are lucky to even get this type of rating. they are in 2.4-2.7 range (and sometimes even below 2.4 during the holidays)


I know. Pretty sad. I predicted a couple of weeks ago that Cena is good for a .2 or .3 bump. Not to toot my own horn, but I nailed it. All of these guys are in the same boat, which makes this thread all the more ironic :lol


----------



## markedfordeath

well the fact that it never fell below a 2.6, we could give credit to Orton, Punk and Bryan.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Truth be told, I'm not sure how responsible Cena actually is for the bump. If numbers were falling in line with last year's as they have been, regardless of what happened then and this year (besides a couple of weeks), then I don't think it's because of Cena we saw this bump. It was a week destined to do a lot better than others.

Now the first hour getting it's highest number since the post-WM29 show... I think that has something to do with Cena, but not just Cena himself. I think the cash-in is what ultimately made the first hour as successful as it was. Now yeah, that doesn't mean Sandow was responsible for it as it probably could've been anyone cashing in on Cena and the numbers would've been about the same, but the fact the cash-in happened, and it was a World Title match and a very important match in the WWE world because of it, it kept people tuned in for longer and got more people to tune in, which ultimately bumped up the first hour to post-Mania/pre-ER levels. 

Now of course, I'll have to wait to see the breakdown before I actually judge what was responsible. After all, the cash-in could've actually lost viewers and Cena's promo at the opening pops a huge number, and in which case the first hour would be attributed to Cena completely and nothing to the cash-in.


----------



## MaybeLock

Well, this week they got better ratings simply because they put on a better show. People were expecting to see the new champions after their wins, Bryan vs HBK reaction, CM Punk´s new feud... Then Sandow also cashes it out of nowhere. I´m sure that made a lot of people tune in. 

Just wait for the 2.60 to come back if Big Show becomes the first contender for the WWE Championship :


----------



## Mr. I

vk79 said:


> So this proves it.. WWE is not changing anything up from last night since they did pretty good in the ratings. Cena will continue to reign supreme.


Cena was only present in the first half hour of the show. In fact, most of the new angles on the show had nothing to do with him.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

D.M.N. said:


> The first hour was the highest first hour rating since the night after WrestleMania 29. That's Cena for you, folks...


AND who was in the first hour of the post WrestleMania 29 raw?
ya you guessed it :cena4 :cena3


----------



## Alo0oy

:bryan will be carried this week by HBK & The Wyatts.


----------



## TheStig

Can somebody make year for year comparison of the ratings and viewership in september to december. Would be interesting to see since cena wasn't on for long periods of that time or atleast wasn't the focus.


----------



## wb1899

TheStig said:


> Can somebody make year for year comparison of the ratings and viewership in september to december. Would be interesting to see since cena wasn't on for long periods of that time or atleast wasn't the focus.


For September and October

*Average Live+SD viewership
Hour: 2012 -- 2013
September
P2+ * 
8:00: *3,991,250* -- 3,712,800
9:00: *4,216,500* -- 3,907,200
10:00: *3,926,250* -- 3,875,000

*A18-49*
8:00: *1,753,000* -- 1,640,600
9:00: *1,914,000* -- 1,754,200
10:00: *1,870,250* -- 1,846,600

*October
P2+ * 
8:00: 3,915,600 -- *4,009,250*
9:00: 3,909,600 -- *3,968,000*
10:00: 3,727,600 -- *3,781,250*

*A18-49*
8:00: 1,719,800 -- *1,759,000*
9:00: 1,756,200 -- *1,769,250*
10:00: *1,760,400* -- 1,757,250


----------



## Jof

Seems like m18-49 demo viewership peaked in the first hour with the PPV fallout and Cena/Sandow.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> :bryan will be carried this week by HBK & The Wyatts.


Bryan doesn't need to be carried. He doesn't draw two 1.7's in the same night. unk


----------



## ShiftyLWO

HBK drawz. Also people tune in to see the results of the ppv.
next week no hbk = 2.66


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Bryan doesn't need to be carried. He doesn't draw two 1.7's in the same night. unk


That's about to change this week. :bryan


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

It will be interesting to see how Bryan does when he's not mixed up in the main storyline with the likes of HHH.


----------



## Jof

Bryan/Hbk was the actual follow-up to the PPV finish, so it should do really well.


----------



## Starbuck

Good numbers this week but that was to be expected with the PPV fallout and Cena's return. The first hour obviously benefited from the whole cash in thing. 9pm should do well with Bryan/HBK. 10pm should do well because it was a Raw Active match with a stipulation. Overrun should do well with Orton/HHH/Show. So yeah, they had a lot of hyped segments in the top slots and with higher than usual interest after the PPV, the numbers aren't surprising. It will be interesting to see the breakdown as usual (lol) and to see whether all the unanswered questions left from this week are enough to hold people's interest for next week. 

:cena5


----------



## TheStig

wb1899 said:


> For September and October
> 
> *Average Live+SD viewership
> Hour: 2012 -- 2013
> September
> P2+ *
> 8:00: *3,991,250* -- 3,712,800
> 9:00: *4,216,500* -- 3,907,200
> 10:00: *3,926,250* -- 3,875,000
> 
> *A18-49*
> 8:00: *1,753,000* -- 1,640,600
> 9:00: *1,914,000* -- 1,754,200
> 10:00: *1,870,250* -- 1,846,600
> 
> *October
> P2+ *
> 8:00: 3,915,600 -- *4,009,250*
> 9:00: 3,909,600 -- *3,968,000*
> 10:00: 3,727,600 -- *3,781,250*
> 
> *A18-49*
> 8:00: 1,719,800 -- *1,759,000*
> 9:00: 1,756,200 -- *1,769,250*
> 10:00: *1,760,400* -- 1,757,250


So september 2012 was higher than 2013 and october was little higher 2013 than 2012. The question now is what will happend in november so we can truly see how much of an impact cena really has. With this week having close to last year it's not much yet.


----------



## Starbuck

The Sandrone said:


> It will be interesting to see how Bryan does when he's not mixed up in the main storyline with the likes of HHH.


But he's with DAT MEGA DRAW CM GOAT now so he shouldn't have a problem

unk


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Starbuck said:


> But he's with DAT MEGA DRAW CM GOAT now so he shouldn't have a problem
> 
> unk


Well, yeah, if they're in the same segment, of course CM GOAT is gonna carry the ratings up and Bryan will be part of it. 

If Bryan's on his own in a segment though...


----------



## markedfordeath

too bad Heyman isn't coming back to tv anytime soon...would have loved for him to join Punk and Bryan.


----------



## Alo0oy

The Sandrone said:


> It will be interesting to see how Bryan does when he's not mixed up in the main storyline with the likes of HHH.


HBK still carried him this week.


----------



## markedfordeath

shut the fuck up! carried him this week! ugh go away! that was the most untrue comment ever....Bryan didn't talk, he made him tap, better than HBK praising himself.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

But still that ''i saved your money'' tweet was epic as hell.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> That's about to change this week. :bryan


:ambrose


----------



## BeastBoy

CM Punk is like insecticide: ratings dropped like flies. It's not _totally_ his fault, though. He should've told his fans to properly watch him on RAW and PPVs through television and not through pirated streams.


----------



## #Mark

The last hour didn't do well because no one wanted to see another Orton celebration with an obvious Big Show interference. Surprisingly, I actually enjoyed the segment.



The Sandrone said:


> It will be interesting to see how Bryan does when he's not mixed up in the main storyline with the likes of HHH.


It's not like HHH has been a draw during this angle. I don't think he's had one impressive gain.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

just for fun

he still draws :cena4 and will continue to do so :cena3 :cena5


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Yeah, that HUGE increase from 2.7 to 2.9, the night after a PPV. Impressive?

:lmao


----------



## Diezffects

#Mark said:


> The last hour didn't do well because no one wanted to see another Orton celebration with an obvious Big Show interference. Surprisingly, I actually enjoyed the segment.
> 
> 
> 
> It's not like HHH has been a draw during this angle. I don't think he's had one impressive gain.


Wait... what? huh? Triple H _is_ the entire angle, don't you realize that? He hasn't had a impressive gain? The overrun with Triple H having shield take out Daniel Bryan whilst the entire roster watches, is the highest rated to date since this story began. The first time Big Show knocked out Triple H, the overrun and main event had a collective gain of 1.34m viewers. You need to follow the weekly breakdowns.


----------



## BeastBoy

Diezffects said:


> Wait... what? huh? Triple H _is_ the entire angle, don't you realize that? He hasn't had a impressive gain? The overrun with Triple H having shield take out Daniel Bryan whilst the entire roster watches, is the highest rated to date since this story began. The first time Big Show knocked out Triple H, the overrun and main event had a collective gain of 1.34m viewers. You need to follow the weekly breakdowns.


I am the ratings and I am that damn good!


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

It will be hilarious to watch the arguments over who drew what during the upcoming segments with both Punk and Bryan. I cant wait for the Punk marks to see their leader cheerleading for Bryan, leading the crowd in YES chants, hoping for Bryan to tag him in against The Wyatts.


----------



## markedfordeath

i bet they're slowly bringing back the old weak link angry Bryan, will probably be the first to kick all members of the Wyatt's ass at one time just like he did with the Shield.


----------



## Fissiks

markedfordeath said:


> i bet they're slowly bringing back the old weak link angry Bryan, will probably be the first to kick all members of the Wyatt's ass at one time just like he did with the Shield.


doesn't make sense Punk was the weak link in the ratings


----------



## BeastBoy

Is Punk a draw?

[]YES!

[*] NO!


----------



## Sonnen Says

BeastBoy said:


> Is Punk a draw?
> 
> []YES!
> 
> [*] NO!


Why do people necessarily say this. Do you feel better after saying it? Ratings doesnt show who's a draw or who isnt unless the wrestler is losing viewers every week. Punk is a draw in merchandise and can bring solid PPV buys and can have a huge buy with the right guy (see Rock). I know a lot will discredit him somehow since it's the Rock but for the record Punk/Rock buys did higher than any other (non WM) PPV since 2005 (SS 05 Hogan) but if we dismiss SS 05 it's the highest since 2002. So it beats Rock return matches in 2002 and 2003 and again non WM.


----------



## BeastBoy

Sonnen Says said:


> Why do people necessarily say this. Do you feel better after saying it? Ratings doesnt show who's a draw or who isnt unless the wrestler is losing viewers every week. Punk is a draw in merchandise and can bring solid PPV buys and can have a huge buy with the right guy (see Rock). I know a lot will discredit him somehow since it's the Rock but for the record Punk/Rock buys did higher than any other (non WM) PPV since 2005 (SS 05 Hogan) but if we dismiss SS 05 it's the highest since 2002. So it beats Rock return matches in 2002 and 2003 and again non WM.


You in a nutshell:

*Ratings are jack-shit when involving CM Punk

*CM Punk only counts as a merch seller and not as a "performer"

*CM Punk only sold a PPV higher when he faces The Rock

Ergo, CM Punk can't draw for shit.


----------



## Sonnen Says

BeastBoy said:


> You in a nutshell:
> 
> *Ratings are jack-shit when involving CM Punk
> 
> *CM Punk only counts as a merch seller and not as a "performer"
> 
> *CM Punk only sold a PPV higher when he faces The Rock
> 
> Ergo, CM Punk can't draw for shit.


I guess you didnt like the truth. Punk/Rock as I said did higher than any other PPV buys since SS 05 and if we dismiss it, it's the highest since 2002. So that means it's higher than Rock/Goldberg, Rock/Lesnar, Austin return, etc. I believe it was higher than WM 19 I think. No, Punk did increase buys like NOC 12, HIAC 12, SS 12, and pretty much almost every PPV in 2012 did higher than the previous one/ones. Also Punk BITW shirt was the highest selling shirt since Austin shirt. Again you can dismiss that all you want but it doesnt change that it's true.

Edited: The reason I say ratings doesnt mean as much as you believe not because I like Punk it's because of something else. Like it's a 3 hours show and I dare you to find me a 3 hours show that does above 4.0 and again HBK/HHH/McMahons are here and ratings still doesnt even reach above 3.0. So I believe the only way it will get a better rating is if they go back to 2 hours.


----------



## LKRocks

I always get a kick out of seeing "SMARKS" discussing RATINGZ

Some of you must go to arenas just to se tickets being sold. "OH MAN LOOK AT DAT DRAWING"


----------



## Choke2Death

PPVs in 2003 and earlier only counted domestic numbers so it's not a fair comparison at all.


----------



## BeastBoy

Sonnen Says said:


> I guess you didnt like the truth. Punk/Rock as I said did higher than any other PPV buys since SS 05 and if we dismiss it, it's the highest since 2002. So that means it's higher than Rock/Goldberg, Rock/Lesnar, Austin return, etc. I believe it was higher than WM 19 I think. No, Punk did increase buys like NOC 12, HIAC 12, SS 12, and pretty much almost every PPV in 2012 did higher than the previous one/ones. Also Punk BITW shirt was the highest selling shirt since Austin shirt. Again you can dismiss that all you want but it doesnt change that it's true.


Punk's shirt only sold high because he was the only marketable guy other than Cena at that time. No inter-corporation competition. Austin was different, he had to compete with Rock, Undertaker, Kane, HHH, DX, etc to become WWF's #1 seller and many people at that time were so popular even mid-carders outdid Punk in merchandise. That's like saying Sonic the Hedgehog was racing against The Flash and Speedy Gonzales to reach the finish line. Punk had no Sonic or Flash or Speedy to compete with. Get the point?

As for PPVs, Punk wasn't even in the main events. It was still Cena. Proof that even without a championship the man still sells. Who did Punk face at Summerslam, Night of Champions and Survivor Series? Exactly, Punk can't sell for shit unless he's paired up with a big name, and even then it's because of the big names like Cena or Rock or even Lesnar that Punk gets a part in a PPV ratings, reception and revenue, but it's thanks to his opponents, not to himself.


----------



## markedfordeath

to be fair, Punk isn't exactly loved by mothers and fathers of small children. I mean telling off fat guys in the first row and slapping fans isn't exactly kid friendly, so you can understand why the WWE didn't make him the top top guy.


----------



## kokepepsi

BeastBoy said:


> Is Punk a draw?
> 
> []YES!
> 
> [*] NO!


look at my sig 
:woolcock


----------



## Sonnen Says

BeastBoy said:


> Punk's shirt only sold high because he was the only marketable guy other than Cena at that time. No inter-corporation competition. Austin was different, he had to compete with Rock, Undertaker, Kane, HHH, DX, etc to become WWF's #1 seller and many people at that time were so popular even mid-carders outdid Punk in merchandise. That's like saying Sonic the Hedgehog was racing against The Flash and Speedy Gonzales to reach the finish line. Punk had no Sonic or Flash or Speedy to compete with. Get the point?
> 
> As for PPVs, Punk wasn't even in the main events. It was still Cena. Proof that even without a championship the man still sells. Who did Punk face at Summerslam, Night of Champions and Survivor Series? Exactly, Punk can't sell for shit unless he's paired up with a big name, and even then it's because of the big names like Cena or Rock or even Lesnar that Punk gets a part in a PPV ratings, reception and revenue, but it's thanks to his opponents, not to himself.


You barley recognize anything I say. How many times should I say Punk shirt did the highest since *Austin shirt*? do you even understand this point. You can make excuses for it all you want. 

Funny you say that since most of who dislikes Punk said he got the biggest push and got the best storylines in 2012 not Cena. Cena wasnt doing great numbers in 2010 or 2011 as a Maineventer so how come when Punk came in it did higher than the previous ones! I don't think if Punk mainevernted in 2012 over Cena will change the buys since Cena is still in the PPV. Like HIAC 12 did higher than the previous year without Cena and without Punk TLC 12 which was headlined by Cena did lower than the previous one which was headlined by Punk. So either ways I think Punk can still pull a huge number with the right guy like Rock which I dont really need to repeat what I said about it.


----------



## validreasoning

BeastBoy said:


> *CM Punk only sold a PPV higher when he faces The Rock
> 
> Ergo, CM Punk can't draw for shit.


ppvs headlined by punk after winning wwe title at survivor series 2011

tlc 2011.....179k (98k domestic) 
_tlc 2012..175k (73k domestic)_ no punk on the card

noc 2012.....207k (112k domestic)
noc 2011.....169k (109k domestic)

hiac 2012....200k (152k domestic)
hiac 2011....182k (98k domestic)

and of course he headlined survivor series, rumble and EC. so of the 6 ppvs he headlined, 5 increased and only 1 (survivor series) decreased which to me isn't bad for a guy who can't draw..

Choke2Death, they started counting worldwide numbers before 2003. the 2002 rumble was on box office in the uk.


----------



## Choke2Death

validreasoning said:


> Choke2Death, they started counting worldwide numbers before 2003. the 2002 rumble was on box office in the uk.


Never heard that. Take WM for example. Every time I've seen the buyrate history posted, it's been noted that WM20 (2004) is the first time they counted worldwide numbers.


----------



## validreasoning

wwe reported 1.04m buys for mania 17 but the domestic total was i believe 925k


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Cena vs Sandow > Cena vs Rio. :woolcock make it happen yo :vince2 :cena3 :sandow


----------



## Sonnen Says

validreasoning said:


> wwe reported 1.04m buys for mania 17 but *the domestic total was i believe 925k*


Wrestlemania 17: 1,040,000 (950,000 domestic buys)


----------



## The Great Gatsby

BeastBoy said:


> You in a nutshell:
> 
> *Ratings are jack-shit when involving CM Punk
> 
> *CM Punk only counts as a merch seller and not as a "performer"
> 
> *CM Punk only sold a PPV higher when he faces The Rock
> 
> Ergo, CM Punk can't draw for shit.


WWE never even tried to make him a draw. They constantly presented him as an afterthought even with the title while pushing Cena as the be all end all. Fact is nobody on the roster is really a draw, not even Cena because ratings and buyrates have only fallen under his reign.



validreasoning said:


> wwe reported 1.04m buys for mania 17 but the domestic total was i believe 925k





Sonnen Says said:


> Wrestlemania 17: 1,040,000 (950,000 domestic buys)


So why was Mania x9 buyrate so shitty and was that only domestic # or worldwide?


----------



## validreasoning

the only number i have seen for mania 19 was domestic

this is a very interesting video and really highlights how much wrestling fans are in their own little bubble regarding ratings for wwe

wwe are second only to nfl of all sports on a year round basis http://web.yesnetwork.com/media/video.jsp?content_id=31193663&topic_id=&tcid=vpp_copy_31193663&v=3


----------



## markedfordeath

if ratings aren't a huge deal, then how do they know who to push? is it crowd response and merch sales mostly?


----------



## Londrick

markedfordeath said:


> if ratings aren't a huge deal, then how do they know who to push? *is it crowd response* and merch sales mostly?


Definitely. :delrio


----------



## funnyfaces1

Everyone should watch validreasoning's video he linked. Arguably the best contribution this thread has seen (besides AnthonyMichaelHall).


----------



## JY57

> In the segment-by-segment, Dean Ambrose vs. Daniel Bryan lost 139,000 viewers. The C.M. Punk interview and HHH, Shawn Michaels and Stephanie McMahon backstage lost 259,000 viewers. Heath Slater vs. Santino Marella gained 80,000 viewers. In a shocker, at 9 p.m., the Randy Orton vs. Dolph Ziggler match actually lost 21,000 viewers. They never lose viewers in that slot. However, they picked up big for the Bella Twins vs. A.J. Lee & Tamina Snuka and Paul Heyman promo with a gain of 318,000 viewers. The Miz & Kofi Kingston vs. Erick Rowan & Luke Harper lost 239,000 viewers. C.M. Punk & Big E Langston vs. Ryback & Curtis Axel at 10 p.m. gained 139,000 viewers, which is a weak gain for that time slot. A John Cena video and Alberto Del Rio interview gained 79,000 viewers. The Usos vs. Goldust & Cody Rhodes gained 58,000 viewers. And the Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan contract signing with HHH and Stephanie McMahon gained 454,000 viewers.


Last week


----------



## markedfordeath

what a horrible week, everyone lost in their segments..holy shit!


----------



## THANOS

JY57 said:


> Last week





markedfordeath said:


> what a horrible week, everyone lost in their segments..holy shit!


Yeah that's really odd? Everyone lost at some point in the night even HHH and HBK.


----------



## markedfordeath

i have a feeling this week's numbers though, some segments will have huge gains.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Horrible gains. And Ziggler lost viewers? That logic doesn't even make sense.


----------



## markedfordeath

i wonder how many viewers Orton will lose as champ.


----------



## celticjobber

markedfordeath said:


> what a horrible week, everyone lost in their segments..holy shit!


Nope, the Divas match actually gained 318,000 viewers.


----------



## JasonLives

Despite ratings being down there is a good chance WWE is gonna make a killing on their next TV deal with NBC Universals.



> Forbes SportsMoney did a piece concerning the upcoming TV licensing deal WWE will presumably sign with NBC Universal. Bob Lorenz, Chris Bevilcqua, and Micheal Ozanian speculated that WWE could receive four to six times its current $140 million per year deal when they resign and point to WWE having three times as many annual gross rating points as NASCAR which recently signed a 10 year, $4.5 billion deal with NBC.


Possibly half a billion dollars per year? Sick!


----------



## MaybeLock

In a shocker, at 9 p.m., the Randy Orton vs. Dolph Ziggler match actually lost 21,000 viewers. They never lose viewers in that slot.


That's what I call overcoming the odds. :


----------



## checkcola

AJ Lee saving the show!


----------



## JY57

not ratings but Night of Champions intially did 175,000 buys down 14,000 from last year (mentioned in another thread).


----------



## Cena rulz12345

wow what aDRAW BRYAN IS,
even being red hot in the fued he could'nt draw shit :vince2 :show


----------



## Mqwar

He did do well, last year NOC drew 189,000 buys with 102K domestic. This year 175,000 is the initial figure, it would likely beat that number by the end of the year. 

Anyways, take the discussion here to this thread -

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/general-wwe/1009377-intial-buys-night-champions.html#post25822425


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

That's much better than I thought, especially for an initial number on a B PPV. :clap


----------



## WWE

Santino/Slater = Ratings.


----------



## markedfordeath

i'm sure they're confident with Bryan.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Mister WrestleMania said:


> That's much better than I thought, especially for an initial number on a B PPV. :clap


:|:shocked::faint:


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Cena rulz12345 said:


> :|:shocked::faint:


HA-HA. Don't hate.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

iam not like you


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Damn right, you're not


----------



## JY57

:cena3 vs :henry1 > :cena4 vs unk5 (in MITB PPV buys)


----------



## Sonnen Says

Cena/Henry didn't MainEvent tho. Wasn't it the return of RVD I think that helped.


----------



## JY57

^ yeah I am sure RVD helped a lot. but I doubt the PPV would do the same kind of numbers if they did Cena vs Ryback III. 

that Mark Henry promo helped big time to sell MITB along with the 1 month announcement of RVD's return and keeping him off TV till the PPV.


----------



## YoungGun_UK

The WWE MITB match was stacked too with Bryan/Punk/Orton/RVD/Sheamus/Christian. 

Was a really good show.


----------



## markedfordeath

the last three ppvs, they're lucky they only lost two million dollars off of...with all the screw job endings, it should have been more..hope the writers understand and now can correct things.


----------



## Raw2003

markedfordeath said:


> the last three ppvs, they're lucky they only lost two million dollars off of...with all the screw job endings, it should have been more..hope the writers understand and now can correct things.


Yeah that's the problems with so many consecutive screw jobs on PPV 


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Londrick

Orton really can't draw. He lost viewers last week and NOC buys dropped.


----------



## markedfordeath

people need to stop thinking Bryan is to blame...has he gone into any PPV as the champ? yes or no? has he had a long reign to show off what he's capable of? yes or no? is he the one threatening lawsuits to Triple H and Stephanie and hacking into satellite feeds? is he the one crashing title coronations on Raw? all he does is get his ass kicked when not in matches and screwed out of the title to where it pisses fans off....so he hasn't been able to live up to his full potential because they haven't let him.


----------



## stonefort

Bryan is to blame. He's small and weak and unbelievable as a main eventer.
Casuals aren't impressed by small, weak dudes. 
And the comparisons to HBK are silly. Watch the HBK and Bryan segment from Raw. HBK towers over Bryan! Daniel Bryan isn't just short for WWE, he's short compared to normal-sized adult males.


----------



## vk79

It doesn't matter if we as fans blame Bryan or not. Vince himself sounds like he is placing a great deal of the blame on Bryan for the fact that Summerslam was a disappointment in terms of buyrates.


----------



## markedfordeath

prove it! prove that he blames Bryan.....just prove it..where does he say that he blames Bryan for the low buyrate?


----------



## checkcola

Everyone knew Summerslam was disappointing buyrate wise long before this Vince conference call and Bryan/Cena was sort of presented as some kind of strange exhibition match going in, I suppose the safer course would have been for Orton to announce his cash in for Summerslam and have Triple H turn during the match (of course, I always wondered if the release of Grand Theft Auto 5 close to Summerslam had anything to do with it... one of the biggest hyped games ever, 60 bucks for that or 55 bucks for a ppv, a game you can enjoy for months and months or a ppv that's done in 3 hrs, waiting on a great game seems the better choice). I also wonder if Triple H beating Brock at Mania killed his appeal.


----------



## markedfordeath

Bryan isn't getting the blame..after Summerslam, for the next couple months Bryan was taking Cena's place on the card.....yep, they hate him sooo much LOL


----------



## checkcola

markedfordeath said:


> Bryan isn't getting the blame..after Summerslam, for the next couple months Bryan was taking Cena's place on the card.....yep, they hate him sooo much LOL


Well, there weren't a lot of options if you look around the roster. I am a Bryan fan, mind you, but the WWE did really back themselves into a corner relying on part-timers and only Cena.


----------



## markedfordeath

exactly...and now they know the kind of work Bryan can do and that the pressure doesn't bother him and he can make any opponent look good and the crowd loves him..so he should be at Punk's level.


----------



## vk79

WWE may be very profitable but I just don't understand their vision for the future. I mean there is not a single other star on the roster equal to that of John Cena in their eyes.

They have failed at building new top stars in the past few years now and this is going to affect them.


----------



## markedfordeath

i know, it sucks but i'm just going to continue to enjoy the work of my favorite guys, i dont care if they stay at the top or not, i'll just enjoy their segments.


----------



## Ungratefulness

JY57 said:


> In the segment-by-segment, Dean Ambrose vs. Daniel Bryan lost 139,000 viewers. The C.M. Punk interview and HHH, Shawn Michaels and Stephanie McMahon backstage lost 259,000 viewers. Heath Slater vs. Santino Marella gained 80,000 viewers. In a shocker, at 9 p.m., the Randy Orton vs. Dolph Ziggler match actually lost 21,000 viewers. They never lose viewers in that slot. However, they picked up big for the Bella Twins vs. A.J. Lee & Tamina Snuka and Paul Heyman promo with a gain of 318,000 viewers. The Miz & Kofi Kingston vs. Erick Rowan & Luke Harper lost 239,000 viewers. C.M. Punk & Big E Langston vs. Ryback & Curtis Axel at 10 p.m. gained 139,000 viewers, which is a weak gain for that time slot. A John Cena video and Alberto Del Rio interview gained 79,000 viewers. The Usos vs. Goldust & Cody Rhodes gained 58,000 viewers. And the Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan contract signing with HHH and Stephanie McMahon gained 454,000 viewers.
> 
> 
> 
> Last week
Click to expand...

AJ Ratings Lee strikes again.


----------



## vanboxmeer

Ungratefulness said:


> AJ Ratings Lee strikes again.


Yes, ignore that long string of weeks where her in tag matches were losing hundreds of thousands of viewers but was ignored because it doesn't fit the political agenda to be pushed.


----------



## Sonnen Says

> In a shocker, at 9 p.m., the Randy Orton vs. Dolph Ziggler match actually lost 21,000 viewers. They never lose viewers in that slot.


:clap The supposed face of the company.


----------



## markedfordeath

i know, right? lol


----------



## Ungratefulness

vanboxmeer said:


> Yes, ignore that long string of weeks where her in tag matches were losing hundreds of thousands of viewers but was ignored because it doesn't fit the political agenda to be pushed.


Other divas are clearly holding her back, this is the kind of gigantic dip the ratings take for divas when AJ's not involved at all, and the kind of gain she gets when she gets mic time.

http://www.cagesideseats.com/wwe/20...inues-to-have-little-impact-on-wwe-television



> The Dusty Rhodes interview segment with Stephanie McMahon with The Shield and Big Show was a huge quarter, with a gain of 836,000 viewers. Naomi & Cameron & Brie Bella vs. Aksana & Alicia Fox & Layla lost 1,020,000 viewers, which again emphasizes that whatever exposure they got on E! doesn't translate into more interest in them by the Monday night fans, nor has their been any new female shift in Raw viewers from the big female numbers of Total Divas.


http://www.heartbreakers.me/index.php?topic=2612.0



> Within the quarter-hours, it's worth noting that A.J. Lee's brief "worked shoot" promo on "Total Divas" drew the most-watched minute of the show prior to the over-run segment.


----------



## Londrick

It's a shame AJ's parents won't sign her permission slip to be on Total Divas. Maybe once she graduates from high school she'll be on the show. 

What are the odds that she gets a tattoo of the date of her "pipebomb"?


----------



## e1987p

vanboxmeer said:


> Yes, ignore that long string of weeks where her in tag matches were losing hundreds of thousands of viewers but was ignored because it doesn't fit the political agenda to be pushed.



You are referring to the last 10 weeks.Where for 8 Raw the quarters with divas and aj lost viewers and for 2 Raw the quarters with divas without aj gain viewers.
:side:


----------



## KO Bossy

Londrick said:


> It's a shame AJ's parents won't sign her permission slip to be on Total Divas. Maybe once she graduates from high school she'll be on the show.
> 
> What are the odds that she gets a tattoo of the date of her "pipebomb"?


Maybe she'll get a tramp stamp of an actual pipebomb so Punk can reminisce while nailing her? 

That Punk...I'm sure he's introduced her to his "pipebomb" by now.


----------



## Alo0oy

Bryan just can't hang with the big boys rton2 unk2


----------



## kokepepsi

damn that pipebomb spike


----------



## Alo0oy

kokepepsi said:


> damn that pipebomb spike


It still pisses me off how they didn't capitalize on that, they've had a chance to make Punk into a huge star.


----------



## SpaceTraveller

Alo0oy said:


> Bryan just can't hang with the big boys rton2 unk2


None of them compare to John Cena though... So obviously Cena is better than all of them... Also the reason why Justin Bieber is better than Jimmy Hendrix and The Beatles because he trends higher than them... 

Here's a quote from Immortal Technique on how I feel about ratings and record sales:
"'cause if you go platinum, it's got nothing to do with luck
it just means that a million people are stupid as fuck" - Immortal Technique


----------



## Alo0oy

SpaceTraveller said:


> None of them compare to John Cena though... So obviously Cena is better than all of them... Also the reason why Justin Bieber is better than Jimmy Hendrix and The Beatles because he trends higher than them...
> 
> Here's a quote from Immortal Technique on how I feel about ratings and record sales:
> "'cause if you go platinum, it's got nothing to do with luck
> it just means that a million people are stupid as fuck" - Immortal Technique


First time on the ratings thread, I presume?


----------



## Mqwar

Alo0oy said:


> It still pisses me off how *they didn't capitalize on that*, they've had a chance to make Punk into a huge star.


They did. What show were you watching? You think the management out of the blue decided the put the title on Punk for 400 days? 

The Pipebomb promo made him the star he is today, make no mistake about it.


----------



## SpaceTraveller

Alo0oy said:


> First time on the ratings thread, I presume?


Yes, I should say though, that quote or that message was not made from anger or in an angry tone. It's just the quote happens to be angry from an angry rapper. My point was that talent is not correlated or congruent with ratings. 

I myself watch Punk and Bryan regardless of where they are on the card. It's a scripted show thus competition is nonexistent. Everything else is subjective and belts just mean external validation. I just like what I like independent of whether Vince, the fans or WWE like them. To further elaborate, debating who's better is a matter of preference. 

I just felt I should share that because Bryan is not trending on Google as much as Punk or Orton is nothing to do with talent. Which is how they work the matches (in my opinion, others might enjoy mic work or something else). I find Bryan is very polish with his striking and chain wrestling. I've been doing Muay Thai and BJJ on a off for many years so I have a different eye (not better or worst, just different). Punk's striking although very sloppy and rudimentary, I still think he makes it work and fits who he is. Similar to how some MMA guys are "sloppy" but still win fights. 

Besides, I like guys that are nice in person. I've heard nothing but good things about Bryan from guys that have trained at Xtreme Couture when Shawn Thompkins was still alive. Punk I have no idea as he's on the Gracie side of things and I have no connections there.


----------



## Alo0oy

SpaceTraveller said:


> Yes, I should say though, that quote or that message was not made from anger or in an angry tone. It's just the quote happens to be angry from an angry rapper. My point was that talent is not correlated or congruent with ratings.
> 
> I myself watch Punk and Bryan regardless of where they are on the card. It's a scripted show thus competition is nonexistent. Everything else is subjective and belts just mean external validation. I just like what I like independent of whether Vince, the fans or WWE like them. To further elaborate, debating who's better is a matter of preference.
> 
> I just felt I should share that because Bryan is not trending on Google as much as Punk or Orton is nothing to do with talent. Which is how they work the matches (in my opinion, others might enjoy mic work or something else). I find Bryan is very polish with his striking and chain wrestling. I've been doing Muay Thai and BJJ on a off for many years so I have a different eye (not better or worst, just different). Punk's striking although very sloppy and rudimentary, I still think he makes it work and fits who he is. Similar to how some MMA guys are "sloppy" but still win fights.
> 
> Besides, I like guys that are nice in person. I've heard nothing but good things about Bryan from guys that have trained at Xtreme Couture when Shawn Thompkins was still alive. Punk I have no idea as he's on the Gracie side of things and I have no connections there.


The ratings thread is basically a troll thread (for the most part). With that being said, most people want to see their favorites succeed in ratings/PPV buys/merchandise because Vince uses that to measure his talent, & subsequently gives them a push. If a guy doesn't draw, he won't get to have long matches, main event PPVs, or hold a world title.


----------



## SpaceTraveller

Alo0oy said:


> The ratings thread is basically a troll thread (for the most part). With that being said, most people want to see their favorites succeed in ratings/PPV buys/merchandise because Vince uses that to measure his talent, & subsequently gives them a push. If a guy doesn't draw, he won't get to have long matches, main event PPVs, or hold a world title.


I guess I got spoiled by MMA and watching wrestling online where it didn't matter where they were in the card. I guess I'm different in that even if they lose as long as they put good matches it's OK with me. I mean as long as they're Upper Midcarders they'll get enough time to wrestler. The whole Vince pushing them or giving them belts are validations by the WWE and mean very little to me personally. I could see how that could bother someone though. 


After reading some of the thread more, I won't fit in the ratings thread as I don't really hate any of the wrestlers lol


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Damn right, you're not


yes because iam honest



Sonnen Says said:


> Cena/Henry didn't MainEvent tho. Wasn't it the return of RVD I think that helped.


when was rvd EVER a DRAW? yes,his return would've helped a bit but not a big off a impact.


markedfordeath said:


> people need to stop thinking Bryan is to blame...has he gone into any PPV as the champ? yes or no? has he had a long reign to show off what he's capable of? yes or no? is he the one threatening lawsuits to Triple H and Stephanie and hacking into satellite feeds? is he the one crashing title coronations on Raw? all he does is get his ass kicked when not in matches and screwed out of the title to where it pisses fans off....so he hasn't been able to live up to his full potential because they haven't let him.


No,you're wrong bryan was the only one to blame.
not going as the champ into the ppvs was the best thing that could've happen to him.
faces are better off chasing the title because ppl are more invested in it,why do you think cena have'nt held a title for over a month since 2009(except his recent one).
and THE biggest example would be austin who set "THIS TREND",he used to win titles only to get screwed out of it the very next night because it got ppl more invested and forced to buy the next ppv as well.
so considering this bryan is the only one to blame.
AND GETTING HIS ASS KICKED REALYYYYYYYYYYYYY???
since may i've only seen him go through the shield beating them single handedly and making them tap out like bithces and "BURYING" them week after week and yet nobody EVEN COMPLAINS BECAUSE IT'S DANIEL UNTOUCHABLE FUCKING BRYAN.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

:lmao


----------



## Cena rulz12345

btw is there ANY chance WE can be FRIENDS :show :vince2


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Londrick said:


> *It's a shame AJ's parents won't sign her permission slip to be on Total Divas. Maybe once she graduates from high school she'll be on the show.
> *
> What are the odds that she gets a tattoo of the date of her "pipebomb"?


:lmao


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Punk's pipebomb would explode prematurely. He cant deliver in the sack or in the ratingz. unk3


----------



## markedfordeath

because of Punk/Bryan's new partnership, how much you want to bet that Brie AND AJ become aligned because the McMahons will bring in Punk/AJ's relationship into the storyline too.


----------



## RKO 4life

Nice ratings it's been the year of Orton/Bryan/The Shield those are the only things going.


----------



## Londrick

Has the breakdown been released? I wanna know who to make fun of.


----------



## checkcola

Londrick said:


> Has the breakdown been released? I wanna know who to make fun of.


I want to know how the "Main Event Match" did, Summer Rae vs Nattie :lmao


----------



## Waffelz

The breakdown used to come out on Thursday/Friday, didn't it? Now it seems its never here.


----------



## validreasoning

interesting piece by meltzer on ratings gains from june 2002 that someone posted over on the classics section. if we use this as a reference today then some gains are much better than many give credit for



> Meltzer has one of his infamous ratings charts in the latest Observer keeping track of how all the wrestlers have drawn since the split occured. This is not a science, which Meltzer even admits, but it's interesting nonetheless. He mentions that a +250,000 is a good number for a main eventer and +500,000 is a great number.
> 
> For the RAW side, he says that Austin and Flair are the two biggest ratings draws and clearly carrying the show. Austin's segments average an increase of 330,000 viewers from the previous segment. Flair's segments average an increase of 320,000 viewers from the previous segment.
> 
> Undertaker is third with 280,000. The NWO has been helped by being involved with lots of segments with Austin as they have high numbers as well. RVD is averaging an increase of 75,000 viewers.
> 
> For the month he was on RAW, Hulk Hogan segments increased a whopping 7,000 viewers!
> 
> The biggest channel clickers were the Hardys, Steven Richards, Jazz and Trish.
> 
> Meltzer did the ratings differently for Smackdown since I guess he doesn't get quarter hour numbers. He ranked them by how many times their segment were ranked highest or lowest in the major markets.
> 
> He says Hogan was the draw for the first couple weeks since the split but his numbers have been dropping ever since and that Chris Jericho and Triple H have been carrying the show. The Angle/Edge feud has been a disappointment because Angle's numbers are down somewhat since the split. Meltzer takes it to mean that the Edge push has not worked yet.
> 
> Vince is also a ratings disappointment as his segments with Stacy do no better than Tajiri/cruiserweight segments.


----------



## MaybeLock

validreasoning said:


> interesting piece by meltzer on ratings gains from june 2002 that someone posted over on the classics section. if we use this as a reference today then some gains are much better than many give credit for


But, but... Vanilla midgetz doesnt drawzzz!

Who are we gonna bash now? :batista3


----------



## checkcola

7000 viewer increase for a month, close personal friends of Hulk Hogan?


----------



## SerapisLiber

checkcola said:


> 7000 viewer increase for a month, close personal friends of Hulk Hogan?


They just count each one of Ed Leslie's in-ring characters individually.


----------



## Gretchen

How the fuck is this thread so long? It astonishes me how much some of you care about ratings and drawing power.

Guy 1: "Hey, did you see that sweet promo by Punk, yesterday, on Raw?"

Guy 2: "Punk isn't a draw, lolololololol!" 

fpalm


----------



## WWE

Waffelz said:


> The breakdown used to come out on Thursday/Friday, didn't it? Now it seems its never here.


Those distributors must be Cena haters that threw away the breakdown when they saw the epic increase in the opening segment :side: :cena3


----------



## Londrick

Actually they usually come out on Wednesday. 



Cycloneon said:


> Those distributors must be Cena haters that threw away the breakdown when they saw the epic increase in the opening segment :side: :cena3


Either that or Vince and HHH bribed the Nielsen to not give Dave the numbers because of how bad the Show/Orton stuff did. Can't have people knowing that D-Bry is a bigger draw than both.


----------



## RKO 4life

Londrick said:


> Actually they usually come out on Wednesday.
> 
> 
> 
> Either that or Vince and HHH bribed the Nielsen to not give Dave the numbers because of how bad the Show/Orton stuff did. Can't have people knowing that D-Bry is a bigger draw than both.


you really do think Bryan out draws Orton don't you?


----------



## Waffelz

Orton doesn't draw. Period.


----------



## Happenstan

Waffelz said:


> Orton doesn't draw. Period.


Sure he does. The last time Orton was WWE champion it drew Vince to make this decision.


----------



## markedfordeath

what were the ratings under the Miz? lol


----------



## RKO 4life

Have no idea how numbers and storylines work AT ALL.


----------



## checkcola

markedfordeath said:


> what were the ratings under the Miz? lol


I imagine a lot better as it came when Rock made his return and it was WM season.


----------



## JY57

Metzler mentioned on radio that the viewership in teenagers (below 18) were up 48 % last week for Cena's return than the previous week


----------



## Jof

Its pretty much in line with Last year's numbers. Strong interest from the PPV, added with Cena/Sandow title match opening. Also MNF had 3 million viewers lesser than last week.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

^:cena3 :show :vince2
time for cena to take down the authority :trips


----------



## Londrick

RKO 4life said:


> you really do think Bryan out draws Orton don't you?


WM with Bryan as world champ outdrew anyone where Orton was world champ. So yeah Bryan is a bigger draw than Orton.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

Londrick said:


> WM with Bryan as world champ outdrew anyone where Orton was world champ. So yeah Bryan is a bigger draw than Orton.


Londrick with those cold, hard FACTS.


----------



## Loudness

Orton really was a bad Long-Term Investment though. He just lacks the personality to get by imo, especially for a double digit World Champion. Even Bryan schools him on the mic and he's supposed to be a wrestlers wrestler. Orton is what happens when you put a vanilla midgets soul into a Maineventers Body, no wonder his ex-wife was only a 6/10 instead a 9/10 like you'd expect from a handsome, loaded guy...what I'm saying is he may be loaded but he lacks the load.


----------



## THANOS

Loudness said:


> Orton really was a bad Long-Term Investment though. He just lacks the personality to get by imo, especially for a double digit World Champion. Even Bryan schools him on the mic and he's supposed to be a wrestlers wrestler. Orton is what happens when you put a vanilla midgets soul into a Maineventers Body, no wonder his ex-wife was only a 6/10 instead a 9/10 like you'd expect from a handsome, loaded guy...what I'm saying is he may be loaded but he lacks the load.


Orton should honestly just marry one of his obsessed fangirls, as I'm sure at least one of them has got to be better looking than his ex-wife right? You're bang on with that post though. I don't mind Orton currently and used to like him as one of my favourites back in his Evolution days, but ever since his feud with HHH leading into Mania, he's been completely void of engaging mic work. I can't believe when someone has the stones to say he's more charismatic than Bryan or cuts better promos than Bryan. Orton is a charismatic dude, sure, but most of that has to do with how long he was shoved down our throats when he was young to become the big name with the casuals he is now. I remember orton coming out to either silence or tepid reactions for most of his career, until he turned face, no matter what brass rings he was given.


----------



## markedfordeath

Bryan is engaged to a hot goddess, that automatically earns him respect from the guys in the back, and the fact that he doesn't need to be good on the mic because he's a bad ass wrestler that does his talking in the ring....and he's a good PR guy for the company too when they need him to be. I don't remember seeing Orton on any talk shows or anything..he's not a very nice guy, he goes off on reporters for asking simple questions. Was he really pushed this much due to who his father was? or is that a myth?


----------



## Starbuck

Ouch at that Orton post. Lots of fatal shots being fired in here recently lol. 

rton2


----------



## markedfordeath

Cena bringing back the teenage viewers means we'll see more of him every week and he'll start to dominate Raw now too...man oh man, the WWE screwed themselves, they can't move on because the kiddies only watch Cena...this isn't good.


----------



## Loudness

THANOS said:


> Orton should honestly just marry one of his obsessed fangirls, as I'm sure at least one of them has got to be better looking than his ex-wife right? You're bang on with that post though. I don't mind Orton currently and used to like him as one of my favourites back in his Evolution days, but ever since his feud with HHH leading into Mania, he's been completely void of engaging mic work. I can't believe when someone has the stones to say he's more charismatic than Bryan or cuts better promos than Bryan. Orton is a charismatic dude, sure, but most of that has to do with how long he was shoved down our throats when he was young to become the big name with the casuals he is now. I remember orton coming out to either silence or tepid reactions for most of his career, until he turned face, no matter what brass rings he was given.


I liked him in 2009, he had a real character (sort of) back then and was pretty succesful and entertaining, after that he detoriated. He should be in his prime now so there is no excuse for him to be so mediocre on the mic, especially with like 10 years of experience under his belt.



Starbuck said:


> Ouch at that Orton post. Lots of fatal shots being fired in here recently lol.
> 
> rton2


I just want the good ole Orton back that punts heads and shits in people's bags.


----------



## Starbuck

He played the legend killer gimmick so well because it most likely wasn't a gimmick lol. By all accounts he was an entitled cocky and immature little dick back then. He has an ex-wife and a kid now. He isn't the same guy. His injuries have also greatly impacted how he goes about things in the ring. He's never been the best mic worker but unlike the legend killer gimmick, this viper character doesn't allow for him to be terribly exciting or upbeat when cutting promos. He's supposed to be slow and methodical and all the things he is. I'm not excusing him because like I said, he isn't one of the better promo guys but I don't think he's as bad as he's made out to be. He's definitely a script guy but there have been many times that he's delivered his scripted lines really really well. Orton's all about the small details imo. His mannerisms and facial expressions are second to none. It's just unfortunate that he can't carry them across to his promos too.


----------



## Loudness

I thought he carried himself better in the backstage promos with Legacy, no comparision to today where he looks like Triple Hs sidekick.

His character shouldn't really be an excuse at this point, he has tons of experience, had had WM ME matches, huge feuds for both World Titles and more. A wrestler with his accomplishments needs to be able to adopt and evolve beyond a few mannerisms, he is after all one of WWEs biggest Investments in the last decade and he's just off in that regard. Yeah, he's nowhere as bad as some other guys on the rosters but given his accolades on would expect to be one of the very best, one of the guys delivering memorable promos and he just never really does that. Like you said, he just recites scripts more or less good, depending on the material but to me, he's still far too basic.


----------



## Alo0oy

Loudness said:


> *Orton really was a bad Long-Term Investment* though. He just lacks the personality to get by imo, especially for a double digit World Champion. Even Bryan schools him on the mic and he's supposed to be a wrestlers wrestler. Orton is what happens when you put a vanilla midgets soul into a Maineventers Body, no wonder his ex-wife was only a 6/10 instead a 9/10 like you'd expect from a handsome, loaded guy...what I'm saying is he may be loaded but he lacks the load.


According to Meltzer's calculations, Orton generated more income to his promotion than even Ric Flair, so GTFO, using his 2011 numbers & ignoring everything else in his career is the definition of selective memory.

It's one thing to say he doesn't entertain you, which you are entitled to, but calling him a bad investment? fpalm


----------



## Londrick

With this reign Orton could end up being the lowest drawing WWE champ of all time. IIRC he already holds the record for being the lowest WHC of all time.


----------



## Ungratefulness

Looks like AJ has more interest now than any of the non veteran main eventers


----------



## Londrick

:cena3


----------



## JY57

Smackdown Audience Rises Again and was third most watched show on Cable:

2,730,000 million up from 2,681,000 million (which was up from 2,640,000 million the previous week)


----------



## Starbuck

:cena5


----------



## WrestlingforEverII

CENGOAT


----------



## SerapisLiber

Loudness said:


> Orton is what happens when you put a vanilla midgets soul into a Maineventers Body


So what holds back a vanilla midget is his soul?

If a Punk or an Eddie Guerrero had Orton's body, well, one could only imagine...


----------



## SerapisLiber

Londrick said:


> :cena3


Damn, sharp decline for this year. And the last report has him between bars 2 & 3, while AJ & Bryan remain between 3 & 4.


----------



## WWE

:cena3 DAH GHHHHOOOOAAAAT


----------



## krai999

Londrick said:


> :cena3


 but but but where is cm punk's pipe bomb spike
unk3


----------



## Firallon

Londrick said:


> With this reign Orton could end up being the lowest drawing WWE champ of all time. IIRC he already holds the record for being the lowest WHC of all time.


Orton's WHC reigns in 2011 were incredibly poorly booked to be fair


----------



## superuser1

Firallon said:


> Orton's WHC reigns in 2011 were incredibly poorly booked to be fair


Smackdown was already on the verge of falling apart to be fair to Orton even before he came over there. Besides Orton there wasnt anybody on that roster. You had Orton feuding with Christian and then what? Not to mention they're feud went on for to long with Orton winning each time. It was poorly booked.


----------



## RebelArch86

nvm


----------



## markedfordeath

i hope the Big Show bombs the buyrate at Survivor Series...nobody should want to watch SS now.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

JY57 said:


> Smackdown Audience Rises Again and was third most watched show on Cable:
> 
> 2,730,000 million up from 2,681,000 million (which was up from 2,640,000 million the previous week)





Starbuck said:


> :cena5


DAT GOAT DRAW CENA :cena3


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

krai999 said:


> but but but where is cm punk's pipe bomb spike
> unk3


DAT SUMMER OF PUNK BURIAL

:cena4


----------



## JY57

> -- WWE Raw fell back to the Fall Season average in social media activity on Monday night.
> 
> Rae scored 217,272 in social activity, according to Trendrr.TV, down 23 percent from 283k last week the night after Hell in a Cell.
> 
> The score knocked Raw out of the #1 spot, trailing ESPN's Monday Night Football game.


via PWTorch


----------



## Alo0oy

Watch Bryan zap the ratings as soon as he "makes the save". :bryan


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Watch Bryan zap the ratings as soon as he "makes the save". :bryan


Nah. I think that'd be reserved for the guy who drew the two 1.7's two weeks ago.

unk


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Nah. I think that'd be reserved for the guy who drew the two 1.7's two weeks ago.
> 
> unk


They haven't released last week's breakdown because a certain bearded midget drew so low that they were too embarrassed to publish it. :bryan


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> They haven't released last week's breakdown because a certain bearded midget drew so low that they were too embarrassed to publish it. :bryan


I didn't say last week. I said two weeks ago. Two different 1.7 QH's. 

The numbers don't lie.

unk


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> I didn't say last week. I said two weeks ago. Two different 1.7 QH's.
> 
> The numbers don't lie.
> 
> unk


Yeah, Bryan is such a draw that Big Show replaced him in the main storyline. :lol :lmao :bryan2 :dazzler


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Yeah, Bryan is such a draw that Big Show replaced him in the main storyline. :lol :lmao :bryan2 :dazzler


As long as he's not drawing the two worst QH's on the show, I'm happy. That's just PATHETIC.

unk


----------



## SerapisLiber

Mister WrestleMania said:


> I didn't say last week. I said two weeks ago. Two different 1.7 QH's.
> 
> The numbers don't lie.
> 
> unk


While terrible, just to be clear, those were only for the 18-49 demographic. And I forget which show it was but a segment involving Bryan also got down in the 1.7s too, like a 1.78 or so. Again, for the 18-49 demo, not overall.


----------



## Alo0oy

SerapisLiber said:


> While terrible, just to be clear, those were only for the 18-49 demographic. And I forget which show it was but a segment involving Bryan also got down in the 1.7s too, like a 1.78 or so. Again, for the 18-49 demo, not overall.












:bryan :bryan2 :dazzler


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

SerapisLiber said:


> While terrible, just to be clear, those were only for the 18-49 demographic. And I forget which show it was but a segment involving Bryan also got down in the 1.7s too, like a 1.78 or so. Again, for the 18-49 demo, not overall.


Still better than the 1.75 and 1.76 from the Punk QH's. And that's just the 18-49 demo. Not the overall rating. Who cares?


----------



## #Mark

Alo0oy said:


> Watch Bryan zap the ratings as soon as he "makes the save". :bryan


The ratings were zapped the minute people turned on their TV's to see Punk in a match.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Still better than the 1.75 and 1.76 from the Punk QH's. And that's just the 18-49 demo. Not the overall rating. Who cares?


At least when Punk drew low ratings, they didn't depush him in favor of Big Show.

Being depushed in favor of Big Show is just :lmao :lmao


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> At least when Punk drew low ratings, they didn't depush him in favor of Big Show.
> 
> Being depushed in favor of Big Show is just :lmao :lmao


Nope. Instead, during his big push, he was the second guy most of, if not the entire time, in favor of

:cena5


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Nope. Instead, during his big push, he was the second guy most of, if not the entire time, in favor of
> 
> :cena5


Beats being demoted to the midcard, Punk was at least WWE champion. Bryan was drawing so bad that they didn't even trust him to hold the championship while Cena was a world champion.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> *Beats being demoted to the midcard*, Punk was at least WWE champion. Bryan was drawing so bad that they didn't even trust him to hold the championship while Cena was a world champion.


Yeah, Punk doesn't know what it's like to be in the midcard recently. Not at all.

:lmao

Still beats having to have to your hand held while you're supposedly the "champion." Nothing more embarrassing than that. Bryan will get a normal length title reign, and he won't have to have his hand held the entire time and promise a bunch of changes that never happen. Complete fail.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Yeah, Punk doesn't know what it's like to be in the midcard recently. Not at all.
> 
> :lmao
> 
> Still beats having to have to your hand held while you're supposedly the "champion." Nothing more embarrassing than that. *Bryan will get a normal length title reign, and he won't have to have his hand held the entire time and promise a bunch of changes that never happen*. Complete fail.


You can brag about that when it happens. As of right now, he's closer to Ryback than Punk.

Yeah, Punk is in the midcard now, but every main eventer coasts in the midcard after being in the main event scene for a while with the exception of Cena.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> You can brag about that when it happens.
> 
> Yeah, Punk is in the midcard now, but every main eventer coasts in the midcard after being in the main event scene for a while with the exception of Cena.


Yep, on both statements.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Yep, on both statements.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Punk's been in the midcard for quite some time now. Alittle bit longer than your typical main eventer in the mid card. So, there is that.


----------



## Londrick

Why are people still arguing who draws more out of Bryan and Punk? Time to move on and discuss the future of the company Big Show, revitalizing the low rating and buys. Survivor Series is probably gonna do about 600k with Show main eventing it. Hoping this Kane thing works out and we get Show vs Kane for the title @ WM 30.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Punk's been in the midcard for quite some time now. Alittle bit longer than your typical main eventer in the mid card. So, there is that.


Sheamus has been in the midcard since late last year, Orton since Late 2011, & it hasn't even been 6 months since Punk was put in the midcard after his return, so I don't know what you're talking about. Cena is the only one immune to the midcard syndrome.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Sheamus has been in the midcard since late last year, Orton since Late 2011, & it hasn't even been 6 months since Punk was put in the midcard after his return, so I don't know what you're talking about. Cena is the only one immune to the midcard syndrome.


That's quite along time for a guy who was champion for 434 days and was supposedly going to usher in all of this totally awesome new change to the company. What a fall from grace.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> That's quite along time for a guy who was champion for 434 days and was supposedly going to usher in all of this totally awesome new change to the company. What a fall from grace.


I didn't even calculate it, Payback was his return match, then he was in the main event of Money in the Bank, then he had the secondary main event at Summerslam. So he hasn't truly been in the midcard until after Summerslam, that's only 2+ months.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

And what a time period it's been. And it's not over yet.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> And what a time period it's been. And it's not over yet.


That's still 433 more days as WWE champion than the Duck Dynasty midget. :bryan2

He wasn't even trusted to be overshadowed by Cena being WHC, instead, he was relegated to Smackdown. :lmao


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> That's still 433 more days as WWE champion than the Duck Dynasty midget. :bryan2
> 
> He wasn't even trusted to be overshadowed by Cena being WHC, instead, he was relegated to Smackdown. :lmao


WWE Champion...overshadowed by John Cena the entire time.

Nothing funnier and more tragic than that.

Oh wait, forgot he's been relegated to midcard duty these past few months, and is still going.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> WWE Champion...overshadowed by John Cena the entire time.
> 
> Nothing funnier and more tragic than that.
> 
> Oh wait, forgot he's been relegated to midcard duty these past few months, and is still going.


midcard WWE champion > Smackdown midcarder. :lmao :bryan


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> midcard WWE champion > Smackdown midcarder. :lmao :bryan


Smackdown midcarder? You mean the guy who beat Cena clean and was the focus of the show for the past few months?

fpalm


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Smackdown midcarder? You mean the guy who beat Cena clean and was the focus of the show for the past few months?
> 
> fpalm


Yeah, but Vince realized how much of an anti-draw he was, so he put him in a match with Luke Harper on Smackdown. :lmao


----------



## Cena rulz12345

^ iam LOVING THIS.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Yeah, but Vince realized how much of an anti-draw he was, so he put him in a match with Luke Harper on Smackdown. :lmao


Anti-draw? No. That's reserved for guys who draw not ONE, but TWO 1.7 QH's back to back.

:lmao

DEM VIEWERS piling in for Punk. :lol


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Anti-draw? No. That's reserved for guys who draw not ONE, but TWO 1.7 QH's back to back.
> 
> :lmao
> 
> DEM VIEWERS piling in for Punk. :lol


As opposed to the guy that drew the lowest Summerslam buyrate since 1997? :lmao :lmao


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> As opposed to the guy that drew the lowest Summerslam buyrate since 1997? :lmao :lmao


With the help of the one guy who can't draw in a match with BROCK Lesnar?

:lmao

Everyone draws with Brock...well, almost everyone.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> With the help of the one guy who can't draw in a match with BROCK Lesnar?
> 
> :lmao
> 
> Everyone draws with Brock...well, almost everyone.


He would if he wasn't playing second fiddle to the anti-draw bearded midget. :lmao


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> He would if he wasn't playing second fiddle to the anti-draw bearded midget. :lmao


Yeah, that makes sense. There were a few Raws there where Brock/Punk got more attention and closed Raw. There were Punk fans here who thought it would close SS given how much attention it was getting. Doesn't matter anyway.


----------



## checkcola

I'm surprised Punk/Bryan mark wars are still going on now that RAW is about the fucking Big "is this a trick" Show


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Yeah, that makes sense. There were a few Raws there where Brock/Punk got more attention and closed Raw. There were Punk fans here who thought it would close SS given how much attention it was getting. Doesn't matter anyway.


Punk has proven that he can draw & HIAC 2012 was evidence.

So Bryan shoulders the blame, & Vince agrees.


----------



## Mr. I

So the new claim is now "Bryan is bad for ratings!" even though nothing speaks to that. And of course, if you yell if confidently loud enough, you will come to believe it's actually true.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Punk has proven that he can draw & HIAC 2012 was evidence.
> 
> So Bryan shoulders the blame, & Vince agrees.


Need a ton more evidence than one PPV. And let's see if Vince agrees when Bryan is back in the main event in the not too distant future and gets his title reign.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Ithil said:


> So the new claim is now "Bryan is bad for ratings!" even though nothing speaks to that. And of course, if you yell if confidently loud enough, you will come to believe it's actually true.


Apparently, only if you're so MAD that your favorite wrestler is still stuck in the midcard. It's all Bryan's fault!


----------



## Waffelz

Hour 1: 3.91m
Hour 2: 4.2m
Hour 3: 4.05m


----------



## Alo0oy

Ithil said:


> So the new claim is now "Bryan is bad for ratings!" even though nothing speaks to that. And of course, if you yell if confidently loud enough, you will come to believe it's actually true.


His Summerslam program bombed so hard that Big Show took his place in the storyline, it's really that simple.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

ah! those punk/bryan mark wars THEY ARE ALWAYS FUN TO WATCH.


----------



## Alo0oy

Waffelz said:


> Hour 1: 3.91m
> Hour 2: 4.2m
> Hour 3: 4.05m


:show = ratings.

I think Vince is liking this, ratings are going up without Bryan. :bryan2


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Bryan has been in quite a few hours that drew over 4 million, and that was with no Cena on the show.

Ho-hum.


----------



## Alo0oy

Cena rulz12345 said:


> ah! those punk/bryan mark wars THEY ARE ALWAYS FUN TO WATCH.


At least Punk and Bryan can put two moves together without botching.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Bryan has been in quite a few hours that drew over 4 million, and that was with no Cena on the show.
> 
> Ho-hum.


& he was carried by Triple Nose and The Shield.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> & he was carried by Triple Nose and The Shield.


The Shield? I like them, but come on, now. :lol

Triple H, I agree, played a part.


----------



## MaybeLock

Not a shame being replaced by The Big GOAT. 

Seriously guys, WMXX: Cena vs Big Show, WMXXV: Cena vs Big Show vs Edge. At WM XXX it has to be Cena vs Big Show, three times in a lifetime. DAT Main event


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> The Shield? I like them, but come on, now. :lol
> 
> Triple H, I agree, *played a part.*


Just a part? He was the whole reason Bryan did good numbers, he always made an appearance, or made it look like he'll make an appearance.


----------



## Alo0oy

MaybeLock said:


> Not a shame being replaced by The Big GOAT.
> 
> Seriously guys, WMXX: Cena vs Big Show, WMXXV: Cena vs Big Show vs Edge. At WM XXX it has to be Cena vs Big Show, three times in a lifetime. DAT Main event


Thrice in a lifetime. :cena4 :show :vince2


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Just a part? He was the whole reason Bryan did good numbers, he always made an appearance, or made it look like he'll make an appearance.


And if the guy Triple H is opposing in those segments is Khali or Heath Slater, it's not the same thing.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> And if the guy Triple H is opposing in those segments is Khali or Heath Slater, it's not the same thing.


No, but if it was Big Show, it sure would.

oops. :lmao


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> No, but if it was Big Show, it sure would.
> 
> oops. :lmao


Let see Big Show hold the momentum for multiple months. Not one show.

Lets see how that Survivor Series buyrate goes. :lmao

Should be a stellar event.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Alo0oy said:


> At least Punk and Bryan can put two moves together without botching.


atleast cena did'nt drew two 1.7 two wweeks i a row. unk:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao


----------



## vanboxmeer

Daniel Bryan is the new Kofi for the CM Punk-led tag team. Getting replaced by Big Show is legitimately embarrassing no matter how you slice it or rationalize it. Now he`s losing to Luke Harper on the taped show while Punk is beating him on the live one. It`s clear Punk`s winning the Rumble while Bryan is back to getting squashed by larger men for the rest of the year.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Cena rulz12345 said:


> atleast cena did'nt drew two 1.7 two wweeks i a row. unk:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao


DAT CM GOAT IS CM DRAWING.

:lmao


----------



## checkcola

Nah, the most likely booking is Brock winning the Rumble and challenging the streak and it puts aside the issue of the title match owed, so title unification can happen (and Cena can reclaim his status as Face of the WWE). Brock needs to be pushed and the easiest way to make him a threat is if he mowed through some midcarders in the Rumble. But once he jobs to Taker at WM (two WM losses in a row on the biggest stage), its over. Brock will be a part timer who just can't get it done.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Let see Big Show hold the momentum for multiple months. Not one show.
> 
> Lets see how that Survivor Series buyrate goes. :lmao
> 
> Should be a stellar event.


I'm not thrilled about Big Show, but you can't deny that an overweight 40 year old giant is drawing just as much as the "best wrestler in the world". :lmao :lmao


----------



## Alo0oy

vanboxmeer said:


> Daniel Bryan is the new Kofi for the CM Punk-led tag team. Getting replaced by Big Show is legitimately embarrassing no matter how you slice it or rationalize it. Now he`s losing to Luke Harper on the taped show while Punk is beating him on the live one. It`s clear Punk`s winning the Rumble while Bryan is back to getting squashed by larger men for the rest of the year.


The reaction here when Bryan jobs to Harper on the midcard of the B-show. :lmao


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> I'm not thrilled about Big Show, but* you can't deny that an overweight 40 year old giant is drawing just as much as the "best wrestler in the world"*. :lmao :lmao


1) Let us see this carry for a few months.

2) I though Punk was the "BITW"?


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> 1) Let us see this carry for a few months.
> 
> 2) I though Punk was the "BITW"?


1- I'll get back to you after survivor series.

2- two completely different things.

Fact is, Bryan never drew by himself, Punk was thrown to the wolves against Ryback last year & he did well, Bryan couldn't even do it with Cena. :lmao


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I think the viewership is way up on last year's (not sure though and can't check right now).

The Big Draw has arrived! :bigshow


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> 1- I'll get back to you after survivor series.
> 
> 2- two completely different things.
> 
> Fact is, Bryan never drew by himself, Punk was thrown to the wolves against Ryback last year & he did well, Bryan couldn't even do it with Cena. :lmao


1) :lol Yeah, right. I'm sure you will.

2) No. They're really not at all. Only one guy has gone out there for the past few years and claimed to the "Best in the World."

:ti


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> 1) :lol Yeah, right. I'm sure you will.
> 
> 2) No. They're really not at all. Only one guy has gone out there for the past few years and claimed to the *"Best in the World."*
> 
> :ti


But that's not what I said.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> But that's not what I said.


"Best Wrestler in the World."

Well yeah, at least you got that right.

That's about it. Including your feminine gifs that you post.

:lmao



(Y)


----------



## #Mark

Alo0oy said:


> I'm not thrilled about Big Show, but you can't deny that an overweight 40 year old giant is drawing just as much as the "best wrestler in the world". :lmao :lmao


Show's segments are doing better than any segment Punk's been that didn't involve the Rock. Atleast Bryan's main event run saw him tapping HBK out and going over Cena clean.. All Punk's title run has to show for is him laying down for the Rock and two of the lowest rated episodes of RAW in over fifteen years.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> "Best Wrestler in the World."
> 
> Well yeah, at least you got that right.
> 
> That's about it. Including your feminine gifs that you post.
> 
> :lmao
> 
> "Not that there's anything wrong with that."
> 
> (Y)


Are you implying...


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

#Mark said:


> Show's segments are doing better than any segment Punk's been that didn't involve the Rock. Atleast Bryan's main event run saw him tapping HBK out and going over Cena clean.. All Punk's title run has to show for is him laying down for the Rock and two of the lowest rated episodes of RAW in over fifteen years.


And 14 months of quality entertainment in the WWE Title scene.


----------



## Londrick

The Sandrone said:


> I think the viewership is way up on last year's (not sure though and can't check right now).
> 
> The Big Draw has arrived! :bigshow


Vince McMahon's gonna swimming in all the money The World's Largest Drawing Athlete brings in.


----------



## Choke2Death

The Sandrone said:


> And 14 months of quality entertainment in the WWE Title scene.


If "quality entertainment" consists of changing the channel, then you're right on the money.


----------



## Alo0oy

#Mark said:


> Show's segments are doing better than any segment Punk's been that didn't involve the Rock. Atleast Bryan's main event run saw him tapping HBK out and going over Cena clean.. All Punk's title run has to show for is him laying down for the Rock and two of the lowest rated episodes of RAW in over fifteen years.


Punk at least didn't use Triple H to piggy back on the ratings.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Punk at least didn't use Triple H to piggy back on the ratings.


No. Instead, he had Cena to piggyback on for 434 days.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> No. Instead, he had Cena to piggyback on for 434 days.


Yeah, Cena bought HIAC for everyone of his acquaintances while he was rehabbing from injury.


----------



## Londrick

Hey remember when AJ was the main star of the Bryan vs Punk feud last year? Geeks get overshadow by a diva.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Yeah, Cena bought HIAC for everyone of his acquaintances while he was rehabbing from injury.


Cena was the #1 babyface in the company during Punk's title reign.


----------



## vanboxmeer

Londrick said:


> Hey remember when AJ was the main star of the Bryan vs Punk feud last year? Geeks get overshadow by a diva.


And not so surprisingly those PPV numbers WERE EVEN WORSE than this year :lmao.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Cena was the #1 babyface in the company during Punk's title reign.


He was the #1 face during everybody's title reign, not just Punk.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> He was the #1 face during everybody's title reign, not just Punk.


Sorry Charlie.

Signed,

:cena5


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Choke2Death said:


> If "quality entertainment" consists of changing the channel, then you're right on the money.


Nah, that's channel changing quality, an example of which is WWE right now.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Sorry Charlie.
> 
> Signed,
> 
> :cena5


----------



## markedfordeath

Cena didn't even help Smackdown this past Friday, had a lower rating and demos went down.


----------



## Alo0oy

markedfordeath said:


> Cena didn't even help Smackdown this past Friday, had a lower rating and demos went down.


I thought Smackdown ratings were up?


----------



## Starbuck

Waffelz said:


> Hour 1: 3.91m
> Hour 2: 4.2m
> Hour 3: 4.05m


:vince2 :show :trips2 :cena2

DA BIG SHOW = BIG RATINGZ

Vince was right to stick with the BIG GUYS in BIG ANGLES for BIG MONEY. Just wait until they put Mark Henry in this thing. It's going to break your TV it's so BIG and full of BIG RATINGS.


----------



## #Mark

Alo0oy said:


> Punk at least didn't use Triple H to piggy back on the ratings.


Well, the one week Cena took off in October did draw a 2.3 so suffice to say he was piggy backing on John boy.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

*[SUNG TO THE TUNE OF "SMOKE ON THE WATER"]

No one came out to Chicago
On the Lake Mich-i-gan shoreline
To buy tickets for the small guy
They didn't care at any time
John Cena and the Rybacks
Were pulling the best #s around
Until some moron with a lip-ring
Pipebombed the ratings straight to the ground

A jooooooooke of a draw-er
Skinny fat greasy guy

A jooooooooke of a draw-er
Skinny fat greasy guy*


----------



## Starbuck

I'm totally rooting for the underdogs this week. Come on Punk and Bryan. I know you can do the highest number of the night in your joined 2 minutes on screen together. :mark: :mark:


----------



## Jof

Umm....where are those numbers from? 

Also was the breakdown for last week's show posted yet?


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

#Mark said:


> Well, the one week Cena took off in October did draw a 2.3 so suffice to say he was piggy backing on John boy.


Ouch.

:buried


----------



## Alo0oy

Starbuck said:


> :vince2 :show :trips2 :cena2
> 
> DA BIG SHOW = BIG RATINGZ
> 
> Vince was right to stick with the BIG GUYS in BIG ANGLES for BIG MONEY. Just wait until they put Mark Henry in this thing. It's going to break your TV it's so BIG and full of BIG RATINGS.


:henry1 :show in the same angle?

I think Nielsen might go into maintenance soon.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Starbuck said:


> :vince2 :show :trips2 :cena2
> 
> DA BIG SHOW = BIG RATINGZ
> 
> Vince was right to stick with the BIG GUYS in BIG ANGLES for BIG MONEY. Just wait until they put Mark Henry in this thing. It's going to break your TV it's so BIG and full of BIG RATINGS.


If they could make X box controllers that were also somehow weights, Punk and Bryan would put the Steiners to shame.


----------



## Ungratefulness

vanboxmeer said:


> And not so surprisingly those PPV numbers WERE EVEN WORSE than this year :lmao.


How is that when No Way Out which centered around AJ and had her in the promotional picture did 12,000 more buys than Payback this year (the ppv done at the same time this year) and did 24,000 more buys than Capitol Punishment (the ppv the year before that was during the same time of year).


----------



## markedfordeath

i'm sure the main angle and the Wyatts angle were the only two that did well.


----------



## Starbuck

Jof said:


> Umm....where are those numbers from?
> 
> Also was the breakdown for last week's show posted yet?


Somebody made them up.

No.



Alo0oy said:


> :henry1 :show in the same angle?
> 
> I think Nielsen might go into maintenance soon.


They're keeping Henry off TV right now because they know it would break our TV's. WORLDS STRONGEST RATINGS.


----------



## checkcola

Starbuck said:


> Somebody made them up.



Heh. I just assumed they are real.


----------



## vanboxmeer

Starbuck said:


> I'm totally rooting for the underdogs this week. Come on Punk and Bryan. I know you can do the highest number of the night in your joined 2 minutes on screen together. :mark: :mark:


I'd assume Vince's directives to get them both out of the way on the show in one segment as his way of making sure the Ratings Poison didn't have to be in 2 segments of the show and simply contained into one neat little package.


----------



## Jof

Can't wait for Henry's return, honestly. :mark: :mark:


----------



## Alo0oy

#Mark said:


> Well, the one week Cena took off in October did draw a 2.3 so suffice to say he was piggy backing on John boy.


Maybe he did. But he wasn't so bad that he had to be replaced by Big Show. :lmao


----------



## Starbuck

I don't know if those numbers are real or not lol. I just made up that somebody made them up... 8*D.

Punk got replaced by Nash. Bryan got replaced by Big Show. What one is worse? 200 word limit. Discuss.


----------



## vanboxmeer

Ungratefulness said:


> How is that when No Way Out which centered around AJ and had her in the promotional picture did 12,000 more buys than Payback this year (the ppv done at the same time this year) and did 24,000 more buys than Capitol Punishment (the ppv the year before that was during the same time of year).


No Way Out was John Laurainitis' comeuppance PPV featuring the megadraw Big Show against the megadraw Cena. MITB was the heaviest AJ promotion and it did worse than Mark Henry and some clusterfuck MITB. Then you compare the GM AJ ratings that even had that artificial Raw 1000 numbers to leech off of that quickly died off versus Jobbin' Danny B and Triple H. And let's not even get started on Cena's worst drawing period as a main eventer in his entire career in that AJ/Cena program versus BEEG LAWSUITS.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

#Mark said:


> Well, the one week Cena took off in October did draw a 2.3 so suffice to say he was piggy backing on John boy.


Hey, that's worse than any of the Raw's from the past 2 months.

:yes

First, the two 1.7's, now this.

:lmao


----------



## Alo0oy

vanboxmeer said:


> No Way Out was John Laurainitis' comeuppance PPV featuring the megadraw Big Show against the megadraw Cena. MITB was the heaviest AJ promotion and *it did worse than Mark Henry* and some clusterfuck MITB. Then you compare the GM AJ ratings that even had that artificial Raw 1000 numbers to leech off of that quickly died off versus Jobbin' Danny B and Triple H. And let's not even get started on Cena's worst drawing period as a main eventer in his entire career in that AJ/Cena program versus BEEG LAWSUITS.


Everyone does worse than Mark Henry. :henry1


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Hey, that's worse than any of the Raw's from the past 2 months.
> 
> :yes
> 
> First, the two 1.7's, now this.
> 
> :lmao


Triple Nose wasn't there to pick him up, unlike a certain someone. :bryan2


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Triple Nose wasn't there to pick him up, unlike a certain someone. :bryan2


Just like Cena did that October for Punk, when he came back.

unk


----------



## Ungratefulness

vanboxmeer said:


> No Way Out was John Laurainitis' comeuppance PPV featuring the megadraw Big Show against the megadraw Cena. MITB was the heaviest AJ promotion and it did worse than Mark Henry and some clusterfuck MITB. Then you compare the GM AJ ratings that even had that artificial Raw 1000 numbers to leech off of that quickly died off versus Jobbin' Danny B and Triple H. And let's not even get started on Cena's worst drawing period as a main eventer in his entire career in that AJ/Cena program versus BEEG LAWSUITS.


AJ's storyline was clearly huge for No Way Out and she was the promotional poster. As for MITB, Mark Henry is a known draw and got real promo time with the biggest draw Cena, instead of Cena just being 1 of 6 contestants in a forced match. And RVD returned in an extreme match. All there is to it to the gain.any proof for those ratings thing you spout?


----------



## vanboxmeer

CM Punk is simply there to bring up the Wyatts' status, Dooker B is there to take the bumps and pinfalls. That's why on the sheets for the match cards, Punk is listed above Dooker B. He's the star of the team, Dooker is the mechanic.


----------



## #Mark

The Sandrone said:


> And 14 months of quality entertainment in the WWE Title scene.


I agree, I just don't think it makes much sense for Punk fans to throw stones at Bryan for not being able to draw when Punk hasn't been a great draw either. We need some consistency here.


----------



## vanboxmeer

Ungratefulness said:


> AJ's storyline was clearly huge for No Way Out and she was the promotional poster. As for MITB, Mark Henry is a known draw and got real promo time with the biggest draw Cena, instead of Cena just being 1 of 6 contestants in a forced match. And RVD returned in an extreme match. All there is to it to the gain.any proof for those ratings thing you spout?


Mark Henry is TV ratings meme and has never drawn a single PPV buyrate in his career. John Lauranaitis was easily the biggest entity going into the No Way Out PPV by a country mile. Simply in your AJ shrine bubble it was important because AJ is your waifu, but to both the actual company itself and more importantly VINCE, the clear cut selling program was Cena vs Lauranitis. Posters mean jack shit since R-Truth and Kofi Kingston can be on posters and not even be on the card. I'm way too lazy to dig up last year's breakdowns, but you can easily see Bryan defendants saying how the ratings were higher than last year every single week. So even as low as these ratings are, they're still higher than the Nickolodeon Teen Drama fest of 2012.


----------



## dxbender

Waffelz said:


> Hour 1: 3.91m
> *Hour 2: 4.2m*
> Hour 3: 4.05m


:langston and the WWE APP


----------



## Alo0oy

#Mark said:


> I agree, I just don't think it makes much sense for Punk fans to throw stones at Bryan for not being able to draw when Punk hasn't been a great draw either. We need some consistency here.


That would make this thread boring.

This thread isn't complete without taking shots at :bryan2.


----------



## Ungratefulness

vanboxmeer said:


> Mark Henry is TV ratings meme and has never drawn a single PPV buyrate in his career. John Lauranaitis was easily the biggest entity going into the No Way Out PPV by a country mile. Simply in your AJ shrine bubble it was important because AJ is your waifu, but to both the actual company itself and more importantly VINCE, the clear cut selling program was Cena vs Lauranitis. Posters mean jack shit since R-Truth and Kofi Kingston can be on posters and not even be on the card. I'm way too lazy to dig up last year's breakdowns, but you can easily see Bryan defendants saying how the ratings were higher than last year every single week. So even as low as these ratings are, they're still higher than the Nickolodeon Teen Drama fest of 2012.


AJ was clearly a big deal for No Way Out. Posters can mean nothing, in this case it didn't, every week you had AJ kissing Kane, Punk and Bryan. MITB gain was due to Cena vs Henry and RVD return and it wasn't even a big gain. And all I ever see in this thread is talk about how Bryan can't draw and now it's he's so bad he's being replaced by big show, so I don't believe doubt that ratings stuff you've said.


----------



## Starbuck

:lol @ the last few pages of this thread. We're going to get hit with double numbers from last week and this week and nobody will know what to argue over first.


----------



## The Great Gatsby

#Mark said:


> I agree, I just don't think it makes much sense for Punk fans to throw stones at Bryan for not being able to draw when Punk hasn't been a great draw either. We need some consistency here.


But who really draws anymore thats not a part timer? Its funny because Cena will headline every PPV of the year and the PPVs that dont draw the other guy gets the blame. If Punk or Bryan headlined every PPV with Cena under them I bet yearly PPV count would be roughly the same. Im tired of people acting like Cena is such a huge draw when hes not, hes headlined 6 out of 10 worst drawing PPV since 2000 and buyrates have only gotten worse under his reign. Im dying for someone to explain why hes such a big draw given those facts.


----------



## Alo0oy

Ungratefulness said:


> AJ was clearly a big deal for No Way Out. Posters can mean nothing, in this case it didn't, every week you had AJ kissing Kane, Punk and Bryan. MITB gain was due to Cena vs Henry and RVD return and it wasn't even a big gain. And all I ever see in this thread is talk about how Bryan can't draw and now it's he's so bad he's being replaced by big show, so I don't believe doubt that ratings stuff you've said.


AJ is not a draw.

Really, the only Divas that were draws were Trish, and maybe Lita. That's it.


----------



## Alo0oy

The Great Gatsby said:


> But who really draws anymore thats not a part timer? Its funny because Cena will headline every PPV of the year and the PPVs that dont draw the other guy gets the blame. If Punk or Bryan headlined every PPV with Cena under them I bet yearly PPV count would be roughly the same. Im tired of people acting like Cena is such a huge draw when hes not, hes headlined 6 out of 10 worst drawing PPV since 2000 and buyrates have only gotten worse under his reign. Im dying for someone to explain why hes such a big draw given those facts.


People forget that TLC did bad without Punk. & Cena was in the card.


----------



## checkcola

vanboxmeer said:


> So even as low as these ratings are, they're still higher than the Nickolodeon Teen Drama fest of 2012.


iCarly did way better numbers, actually. That show was a juggernaut.


----------



## MaybeLock

Starbuck said:


> :lol @ the last few pages of this thread. We're going to get hit with double numbers from last week and this week and nobody will know what to argue over first.


I just cant wait for this week's google trend update :mark:


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> That would make this thread boring.
> 
> This thread isn't complete without taking shots at :bryan2.


I think you mean Punk. It was great when the thread got renamed over us burying Punk.


----------



## Londrick

Starbuck said:


> :lol @ the last few pages of this thread. We're going to get hit with double numbers from last week and this week and nobody will know what to argue over first.


Hopefully the segment with Bryan and Punk clearing the ring flops hard.


----------



## Alo0oy

Starbuck said:


> I don't know if those numbers are real or not lol. I just made up that somebody made them up... 8*D.
> 
> *Punk got replaced by Nash. Bryan got replaced by Big Show. What one is worse? 200 word limit. Discuss.*


I just saw that.

I don't need 200 words, one of them came out of it with a 434 days title reign, the other one had a 21 hours & 5 minutes title reign. :lmao


----------



## vanboxmeer

Ungratefulness said:


> AJ was clearly a big deal for No Way Out. Posters can mean nothing, in this case it didn't, every week you had AJ kissing Kane, Punk and Bryan. MITB gain was due to Cena vs Henry and RVD return and it wasn't even a big gain. And all I ever see in this thread is talk about how Bryan can't draw and now it's he's so bad he's being replaced by big show, so I don't believe doubt that ratings stuff you've said.


7/9/2012 "In the segment breakdown, the opener with AJ Lee, CM Punk and Daniel lost 74,000 viewers."

10/8/2012 "A backstage segment with AJ Lee and Punk lost 254,000 viewers"
"Vince McMahon vs. CM Punk in the main event gained 1,233,000 viewers."

11/9/2012 "The 9:00 segment with Vickie Guerrero, AJ Lee, Cena and Dolph Ziggler with the kiss gained 195,000 viewers for a 2.85 quarter rating. Lowest gain of the year for the timeslot."

"The AJ Lee and Ziggler locker room segment that ended with the Cena and Ziggler brawl lost 241,000 viewers."


And many more. I'll open up the can of worms if you want more.


----------



## Alo0oy

Londrick said:


> Hopefully the segment with Bryan and Punk clearing the ring flops hard.


It will likely go like this:

Bryan makes the save: segment loses 500k viewers. :lmao

:bryan2


----------



## checkcola

Wow, that Ziggler brawl Raw was probably the best angle I remember him being involved in


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Bryan 2 WWE Title reigns
Punk 1

:yes


----------



## Londrick

Show replacement was worse. Nash vs HHH was great since it was revealed that Nash possibly raped HHH and broke his heart:


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> It will likely go like this:
> 
> Bryan makes the save: segment loses 500k viewers. :lmao
> 
> :bryan2


That's Punk's role.

Mr. 1.7

unk

Replaced by Kevin Nash.

:ti

Dat 35 year old rebel.


----------



## KO Bossy

Ungratefulness said:


> AJ was clearly a big deal for No Way Out. Posters can mean nothing, in this case it didn't, every week you had AJ kissing Kane, Punk and Bryan. MITB gain was due to Cena vs Henry and RVD return and it wasn't even a big gain. And all I ever see in this thread is talk about how Bryan can't draw and now it's he's so bad he's being replaced by big show, so I don't believe doubt that ratings stuff you've said.


Yeah and AJ's involvement is what made it suck...what's your point?

As for Bryan being unable to draw, so far we've got 2 PPV buys available where he was the main focus and in the main event-Summerslam and NoC. Both drew less (in Summerslam's case, way less) than 2012. Battleground was terrible, so I can see that also getting a poor buyrate. HIAC I can see doing a bad buyrate because of people being pissed off with how terrible Battleground was. But regardless, 2 PPVs and 2 lower buyrates. That's a pattern that doesn't bode well.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Bryan 2 WWE Title reigns
> Punk 1
> 
> :yes


I think you need to refresh your memory.

Punk has as many WWE title reigns, & three more WHC reigns, in total 6 > 3.

& did I mention 434 days > less than a day? :lmao


----------



## vanboxmeer

Guys, guys. This is like arguing Apples with Apples. They're both from the same vein; brothers from different mothers per say, criticizing one is also criticizing the other. They're both ratings and PPV bums. Though I'm sure CM Punk and his Colin Delaney-wannabe partner will do there best to not lose milions of viewers in the coming months against the hobos.


----------



## markedfordeath

wait! so Bryan gets depushed and he STILL has haters? I thought this place only hated the people that get pushed....he's been depushed so you all can stop acting like you hate him now. he's out of the way!


----------



## Waffelz

I can confirm the numbers on a few pages back are not actually real and are actually my predictions for this week. I apologise sincerely for mixing it up for some of you marks.

Though, if them numbers were true and hour two did the best, why is everyone wetting themselves over Big Show? He was in hour three and that dropped considerably from hour two.


----------



## Londrick

Colin Delaney reference. :mark:


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> I think you need to refresh your memory.
> 
> Punk has as many WWE title reigns, & three more WHC reigns, in total 6 > 3.
> 
> & did I mention 434 days > less than a day? :lmao


I would hope he would have more total reigns. He's been in the company far longer.

Duh.


----------



## Waffelz

KO Bossy said:


> Yeah and AJ's involvement is what made it suck...what's your point?
> 
> As for Bryan being unable to draw, so far we've got 2 PPV buys available where he was the main focus and in the main event-Summerslam and NoC. Both drew less (in Summerslam's case, way less) than 2012. Battleground was terrible, so I can see that also getting a poor buyrate. HIAC I can see doing a bad buyrate because of people being pissed off with how terrible Battleground was. But regardless, 2 PPVs and 2 lower buyrates. That's a pattern that doesn't bode well.


Pretty unfair comparing this Summerslam to last years with HHH versus Bork. Oh, and NOC will do better this year because they've not counted the other buys yet.


----------



## KO Bossy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Bryan 2 WWE Title reigns
> Punk 1
> 
> :yes


1 win at MiTB + 1 win at Survivor Series=1 WWE title reign?

Not hating, just pointing it out.


----------



## WWE

The numbers that wafflez posted, are those the real numbers?


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

KO Bossy said:


> 1 win at MiTB + 1 win at Survivor Series=1 WWE title reign?
> 
> Not hating, just pointing it out.


I forgot about the shorter title run, for obvious reasons.


----------



## Alo0oy

vanboxmeer said:


> Guys, guys. This is like arguing Apples with Apples. They're both from the same vein; brothers from different mothers per say, criticizing one is also criticizing the other. They're both ratings and PPV bums. Though I'm sure CM Punk and his Colin Delaney-wannabe partner will do there best to not lose milions of viewers in the coming months against the hobos.


One of them still got a better deal out of it. unk


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> One of them still got a better deal out of it. unk


Like jobbing to Paul Heyman?

:ti


----------



## KO Bossy

Waffelz said:


> Pretty unfair comparing this Summerslam to last years with HHH versus Bork. Oh, and NOC will do better this year because they've not counted the other buys yet.


All I've read is that 2013 NoC did 175k buys, while 2012 did 189k.

And why is it unfair? Hunter vs Brock was the ONLY worthwhile match on the show, and the build sucked. Summerslam was better in match quality and match build, but apparently Bryan's big build up and Punk taking on Brock wasn't that much of a draw.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

KO Bossy said:


> All I've read is that 2013 NoC did 175k buys, while 2012 did 189k.
> 
> And why is it unfair? Hunter vs Brock was the ONLY worthwhile match on the show, and the build sucked. Summerslam was better in match quality and match build, but apparently Bryan's big build up and Punk taking on Brock wasn't that much of a draw.


Those are prelim numbers for this year. The final numbers aren't in yet.


----------



## KO Bossy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> I forgot about the shorter title run, for obvious reasons.


Well the win was pretty epic. Then he got Nash'd.


----------



## JY57

Hour 1 - 4.069 million
Hour 2 - 3.951 million
Hour 3 - 3.643 million


----------



## KO Bossy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Those are prelim numbers for this year. The final numbers aren't in yet.


My mistake.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Like jobbing to Paul Heyman?
> 
> :ti


Even if they turn him into a jobber, he still got the better deal.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.069 million
> Hour 2 - 3.951 million
> Hour 3 - 3.643 million




:lmao

:lmao 

:lmao

DAT MAIN EVENT MISSING DANIEL BRYAN

:yes


----------



## Londrick

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.069 million
> Hour 2 - 3.951 million
> *Hour 3 - 3.643 million*


:ti

:show rton2 :HHH2


----------



## Alo0oy

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.069 million
> Hour 2 - 3.951 million
> Hour 3 - 3.643 million


Quick, depush Big Show.

We know who can save the ratings. :henry1


----------



## Waffelz

The vanilla midgets bringing in 4 million.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Thread got quiet as FUCK.

:lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## vanboxmeer

They need to start growing their new talent in labs with artificial insemination. Get some of that Big Show gigantism and Uncle Dwayne's star presence and make some super baby. Forget about all that ridiculous NFL style combine, it's so 1980's technology. WWE needs to be ahead of the curve.


----------



## WWE

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.069 million
> Hour 2 - 3.951 million
> Hour 3 - 3.643 million



OH FUCK 

:ti :ti :ti

*EVERYBODY RUN THE PUNK/BRYAN MARKS ARE COMING*

unk :bryan2


----------



## MaybeLock

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.069 million
> Hour 2 - 3.951 million
> *Hour 3 - 3.643 million*


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Oh man, I'm dying over here.

:lmao


----------



## vanboxmeer

Well, clearly they assumed that with Punk and Dooker B coming early in the show for only 2 minutes, that they'd be book-ended at the end of the show with the Big Show sandwiched in the middle.


----------



## markedfordeath

YES YES YES, fuck yeah, fuck you WWE! especially Vince, this is what you get...now imagine the buyrate for SS LOL Big Show's ripping off of DB and his flabby belly turned them off


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Mister WrestleMania said:


> :lmao
> 
> :lmao
> 
> :lmao
> 
> DAT MAIN EVENT MISSING DANIEL BRYAN
> 
> :yes




Quick. Get Big Flop to fire up dem YES chants!


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Apparently, the "bedroom" isn't the only place Big Show isn't "measuring up."

:show


----------



## checkcola

Well done WWE, well done indeed ...


----------



## WWE

:ti I'm sorry, I just can't right now


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

Hahaha. This authority storyline flopped so hard and fuck big show that fat pig stealing DB chants and failing in the ratings.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

EDIT: Ninja'd, but oh well, this gif is awesome.


----------



## superuser1

Man Im glad this happened. Now get Big Show the fuck outta here.


----------



## markedfordeath

People got pissed because they want Bryan in the main event....See what WWE doesn't realize is that you can free stream PPV's, this is why in 2013 they shouldn't depend on PPV revenue. why they do is beyond me..why do you guys think they do? they get so much revenue elsewhere, why do they need ppv revenue? you can get shows for free nowadays if you know where to look, and yet they still use that as an excuse to depush someone....You would think Stephanie of all people would know how things are nowadays.


----------



## checkcola

They need to get more programs going. More storylines. Triple H/Kane/Big Show 90s rehash hour is not going to cut it.


----------



## WWE

NEXT WEEK VINCE McMAHON RETURNS











*THAAAA GOOOAT*

​


----------



## Ungratefulness

vanboxmeer said:


> And many more. I'll open up the can of worms if you want more.


As if CM Punk and Bryan don't have bad segments that everyone in this thread talks about, I know I keep reading how Punk twice got the lowest QH's in the show recently and drew something lowest in 15 years. I don't know many qh's but Aj's pipe bomb was the highest rated segment of the show and recently her match was the only part of the show that gained. Pulling out random good examples and bad examples help to prove nothing of any point.


----------



## superuser1

Thing is Big Show isnt an underdog. People arent interested in seeing him overcome The Authority.


----------



## Jof

Game started at 8:30 and drew a massive 16.5 million viewers, freaking huge..possibly the biggest they have faced this year. So the peak of the show is likely at the beginning within the first half hour.

Nothing to do with storylines/angles, the competition is just too heavy this week.


----------



## superuser1

To be fair though we wont know how Big Show really did until the breakdown comes out but I havent seen one of these in weeks.


----------



## checkcola

superuser1 said:


> Thing is Big Show isnt an underdog. People arent interested in seeing him overcome The Authority.


He's a proven backstabber given all his heel/face turns. And he sounded like an idiot in that final segment. People don't back idiots nor do they back backstabbers. History does matter.


----------



## WWE

superuser1 said:


> To be fair though we wont know how Big Show really did until the breakdown comes out but I havent seen one of these in weeks.


True.


BUT FOR NOW..


:ti :ti :ti :ti :ti


----------



## MaybeLock

checkcola said:


> They need to get more programs going. More storylines. Triple H/Kane/Big Show 90s rehash hour is not going to cut it.


Dont worry, they will bring Hogan back for an 80s rehash tour :lmao:lmao

Best 4 Business :trips2


----------



## vanboxmeer

Ungratefulness said:


> As if CM Punk and Bryan don't have bad segments that everyone in this thread talks about, I know I keep reading how Punk twice got the lowest QH's in the show recently and drew something lowest in 15 years. I don't know many qh's but Aj's pipe bomb was the highest rated segment of the show and recently her match was the only part of the show that gained. Pulling out random good examples and bad examples help to prove nothing of any point.


And that pipebomb did nothing except have the following weeks with either AJ in tag matches or on commentary losing massive viewers. In fact the frequency in which she was in segments that lost viewers are far greater than the ones that you can barely even count on 1 hand. Hell, the reason they turned her heel last year was because her GM run and then storyline with Cena that was packaged with some lame Vickie feud bombed so epically that the only way to salvage Cena was to turn her heel so that he could save face for his build to Mania.


----------



## validreasoning

superuser1 said:


> To be fair though we wont know how Big Show really did until the breakdown comes out but I havent seen one of these in weeks.


the angle started early like 10.40pm or something so they were out there along time. i expect a decent over-run with the shield/orton/kane but you never know.

the game was a monster and close so you can't really go by anything this week


----------



## Londrick

Cycloneon said:


> NEXT WEEK VINCE McMAHON RETURNS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *THAAAA GOOOAT*
> 
> ​


Vince to cancel the main event, strip Orton of the title, make Henry the new champ and make Cena vs Henry unification match at Survivor Series. :mark:


----------



## checkcola

I would love it if Vince suddenly was in Big Show's corner to prop him, thus wasting the long rumored Vince's Guy match at Mania instead at a nothing ppv like Survivor Series.


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

Just wait until Vince is fully retired and retarded fucks HHH and Steph have full control. WWE will be pulling in TNA level ratings.


----------



## JY57

third hour has been lowest hour for 5 straight weeks. I wouldn't judge anything by that till a breakdown is out if there is one.

Most of the time the main event does ok/good and segments between 7:15 - 7:45 lose about 800,000 - 1,000,000 viewers.


----------



## #Mark

KO Bossy said:


> Yeah and AJ's involvement is what made it suck...what's your point?
> 
> As for Bryan being unable to draw, so far we've got 2 PPV buys available where he was the main focus and in the main event-Summerslam and NoC. Both drew less (in Summerslam's case, way less) than 2012. Battleground was terrible, so I can see that also getting a poor buyrate. HIAC I can see doing a bad buyrate because of people being pissed off with how terrible Battleground was. But regardless, 2 PPVs and 2 lower buyrates. That's a pattern that doesn't bode well.


NOC will likely do better than last years since prelim numbers are higher than last years prelim numbers. Plus, NOC 2013 did a better number than NOC 2011 (Which was headlined by HHH and Punk).


----------



## superuser1

JY57 said:


> third hour has been lowest hour for 5 straight weeks. I wouldn't judge anything by that till a breakdown is out if there is out.


Yeah exactly.


----------



## markedfordeath

my thoughts exactly, and if he keeps selling merchandise and his segments on Raw keep gaining, then why wouldnt they push him again?


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Yeah, but it's not like Hour 1 just edged Hour 3. Hour 1 had over 400,000 more viewers. Even Hour 2 had more viewers. Hour 3 bombed. Big time.


----------



## Ungratefulness

vanboxmeer said:


> And that pipebomb did nothing except have the following weeks with either AJ in tag matches or on commentary losing massive viewers. In fact the frequency in which she was in segments that lost viewers are far greater than the ones that you can barely even count on 1 hand. Hell, the reason they turned her heel last year was because her GM run and then storyline with Cena that was packaged with some lame Vickie feud bombed so epically that the only way to salvage Cena was to turn her heel so that he could save face for his build to Mania.


You're spouting nonsense with no basis because you have no argument.


----------



## checkcola

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Yeah, but it's not like Hour 1 just edged Hour 3. Hour 1 had over 400,000 more viewers. Even Hour 2 had more viewers. Hour 3 bombed. Big time.


And they kept replaying over and over, hyping and hyping this lawsuit angle throughout the entire show.


----------



## Alo0oy

Punk should just let Bryan job to The Wyatts & join the main storyline.

Big Flop flopped hard. :lmao :lmao


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

But Big Show is a draw they said. Well, not they, just one guy.

:lmao

:lmao

:lmao


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

checkcola said:


> And they kept replaying over and over, hyping and hyping this lawsuit angle throughout the entire show.


:lmao I know! That makes this fail 1000000x even funnier.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> But Big Show is a draw they said. Well, not they, just one guy.
> 
> :lmao
> 
> :lmao
> 
> :lmao


Vince must be furious right now. :lmao


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Vince must be furious right now. :lmao


Actually, weren't you here all afternoon telling us how much of a draw Big Show is and how he is right for this spot?


----------



## Choke2Death

#Mark said:


> NOC will likely do better than last years since prelim numbers are higher than last years prelim numbers. Plus, NOC 2013 did a better number than NOC 2011 (Which was headlined by HHH and Punk).


Damn. That dream match between Punk and HHH drew some great numbers, didn't it?


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Actually, weren't you here all afternoon telling us how much of a draw Big Show is and how he is right for this spot?


No, I'm saying how bad do you have to be to be replaced by THAT. :lmao


----------



## WWE

JY57 said:


> third hour has been lowest hour for 5 straight weeks.


And notice how Cena hasn't even been near the third hour?


CONNECT THE DOTS PEOPLE

:cena3


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> No, I'm saying how bad do you have to be to be replaced by THAT. :lmao


Good try.


----------



## Gretchen

Mister WrestleMania said:


> But Big Show is a draw they said. Well, not they, just one guy.
> 
> :lmao
> 
> :lmao
> 
> :lmao


:lmao That segment with Show and Orton at the end. Could the crowd give any less fucks? What clusterfuck booking, fucking WWE. Most importantly this whole Big Show going after the WWE Title thing is fucking stupid.


----------



## Alo0oy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Good try.


Bryan got depushed in favor of Big Show, & look at how bad Big Show is drawing. :lmao

Vince must really think highly of DB. :lmao


----------



## markedfordeath

so does this mean Show doesn't win the title now? At least Vince should be consistent....Maybe Show gets depushed too..wonder who gets a shot at Orton after that.


----------



## validreasoning

when this angle is over i hope to never see another evil owner/gm angle again. that and the invading faction have been done to death this past 17 years and its time for both wwe and tna to come up with something different


----------



## Alo0oy

markedfordeath said:


> so does this mean Show doesn't win the title now? At least Vince should be consistent....Maybe Show gets depushed too..wonder who gets a shot at Orton after that.


He was never going to win the title, it was a desperate move after Bryan was a "Swing & a miss".


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> Bryan got depushed in favor of Big Show, & look at how bad Big Show is drawing. :lmao
> 
> Vince must really think highly of DB. :lmao


And how much worse do you have to be when Vince could have just as easily put Punk in the Bryan/Show spot, and Vince kept him in the midcard.

:lmao
:lmao
:lmao

He must think REALLY highly of Punk. Continuing DAT Midcard Push.


----------



## superuser1

Rhodes_For_WHC said:


> :lmao That segment with Show and Orton at the end. Could the crowd give any less fucks? What clusterfuck booking, fucking WWE. Most importantly this whole Big Show going after the WWE Title thing is fucking stupid.


tbh when they went to commercial break in the middle of the segment that killed the crowd.


----------



## KO Bossy

Just saw the ratings for yesterday.

Imagine the third hour if they teased Korporate Kane making his debut? Like...5 million viewers, easily. :kane

But that number...pee-yoo. Its unfortunate that the 6 man tag, the best match on the show, was in that hour because it deserved better than that. The main event...well, it was what it was. Hunter was great as usual, just being a jerk, but Big Show was wretched, with his comedy. I'm sure the divas match didn't help things, though. 

I'd have honestly thought that Big Show's 'Sid' moment would have done better.


----------



## validreasoning

Alo0oy said:


> He was never going to win the title, it was a desperate move after Bryan was a "Swing & a miss".


they were building to show as main challenger the night after summerslam, even meltzer reported in august that show and orton was scheduled for november. there was nothing desperate about it given it was their plan for months.

why do you think big show hasn't wrestled all this time (outside that non match with bryan about a month ago)


----------



## Choke2Death

KO Bossy said:


> Just saw the ratings for yesterday.
> 
> Imagine the third hour if they teased Korporate Kane making his debut? Like...5 million viewers, easily. :kane
> 
> But that number...pee-yoo. Its unfortunate that the 6 man tag, *the best match on the show, was in that hour because it deserved better than that. * The main event...well, it was what it was. Hunter was great as usual, just being a jerk, but Big Show was wretched, with his comedy. I'm sure the divas match didn't help things, though.
> 
> I'd have honestly thought that Big Show's 'Sid' moment would have done better.


It wasn't. Cena came out around 9:40 or something and the match ended a few minutes after 10 PM. So other than the main segment, nothing worthwhile took place in hour 3.


----------



## JY57

Choke2Death said:


> It wasn't. Cena came out around 9:40 or something and the match ended a few minutes after 10 PM. So other than the main segment, nothing worthwhile took place in hour 3.


what was the full lineup on the third hour anyways?


----------



## Londrick

Cycloneon said:


> And notice how Cena hasn't even been near the third hour?
> 
> 
> CONNECT THE DOTS PEOPLE
> 
> :cena3


Cena needs to bury this angle next week. 

"The Champ is back to scratch some itches, you know drawing boring ass bitches"


----------



## Gretchen

superuser1 said:


> tbh when they went to commercial break in the middle of the segment that killed the crowd.


That's true, the crowd was somewhat interested, initially. However, at the end, the crowd went completely dead. And it's SC. This type of crow is where Show would be the most over.


----------



## checkcola

The commercial break could be the means to blame the Shield. It was their music playing. It was a cliffhanger built around them.


----------



## Starbuck

Waffelz said:


> I can confirm the numbers on a few pages back are not actually real and are actually my predictions for this week. I apologise sincerely for mixing it up for some of you marks.


:vince2



JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.069 million
> Hour 2 - 3.951 million
> Hour 3 - 3.643 million


DAT HOUR 3 LAWSUIT BOMB

:HHH

Overrun can still pop a number in line with the rest of the show based off that so DA BIG SHOW is safe for now. My prediction a few pages back was correct after all however. Punk & Bryan going to top the night :lol.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

DAT THIRD HOUR


----------



## Alo0oy

Starbuck said:


> :vince2
> 
> 
> 
> DAT HOUR 3 LAWSUIT BOMB
> 
> :HHH
> 
> Overrun can still pop a number in line with the rest of the show based off that so DA BIG SHOW is safe for now. My prediction a few pages back was correct after all however. Punk & *Bryan* going to top the night :lol.


What did Bryan do? he had like 30 seconds TV time.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Still dying over here. Love it.

:yes


----------



## Sonnen Says

The supposed face of the company probably lost viewers again.


----------



## Starbuck

Cycloneon said:


> NEXT WEEK VINCE McMAHON RETURNS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *THAAAA GOOOAT*
> 
> ​


:mark: :mark: :mark: :vince :vince2 :vince3 :vince4 :vince5 :vince6



Jof said:


> Game started at 8:30 and drew a massive 16.5 million viewers, freaking huge..possibly the biggest they have faced this year. So the peak of the show is likely at the beginning within the first half hour.
> 
> Nothing to do with storylines/angles, the competition is just too heavy this week.


So hour 3 was up against a monster game and Cena at 10pm was over before 10pm? Well that certainly explains the dip then. But it's much more fun to take the piss so...

LOL BIG SHOW DA RATINGS KILLAH NO NONSENSE PRE WRESTLEMANIA PPV FILLAH

:show



Alo0oy said:


> What did Bryan do? he had like 30 seconds TV time.


Shhh. They are the same thing.


----------



## markedfordeath

so if it was reported back in August that Big Show was supposed to be in this spot, then I guess Bryan was always supposed to be pushed back down regardless.


----------



## Alo0oy

Corporate Kane probably saved the overrun. :lmao


----------



## Londrick

Jof said:


> Game started at 8:30 and drew a massive 16.5 million viewers, freaking huge..possibly the biggest they have faced this year. So the peak of the show is likely at the beginning within the first half hour.
> 
> Nothing to do with storylines/angles, the competition is just too heavy this week.


Last week they had to deal with the World Series and Monday Night Football which totaled about 24 million viewers yet none of the hours bombed as hard as hour 3.


----------



## checkcola

Sonnen Says said:


> The supposed face of the company probably lost viewers again.


Playing your male audience as the victim of cuckolding to Orton seems foolish to me. I mean, really? That kind of shit is going to draw?


----------



## Alo0oy

Big Show has no marks.

This is boring.


----------



## JY57

Note (not rating related): supposedly the crowd wasn't even close to a sellout and people were clearling out during the main event


----------



## SerapisLiber

validreasoning said:


> they were building to show as main challenger the night after summerslam, even meltzer reported in august that show and orton was scheduled for november. there was nothing desperate about it given it was their plan for months.
> 
> why do you think big show hasn't wrestled all this time (outside that non match with bryan about a month ago)


Oh, well, shit. That actually kind of explains why Bryan & Orton was booked the way it was. Bryan was never meant to get the top spot then. At least, not for right now. Although I'm still keeping my fingers crossed that they're just waiting for RTWM to finally give him full reign.


----------



## Dec_619

> Hour 1 - 4.069 million


:yes


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

JY57 said:


> Note (not rating related): supposedly the crowd wasn't even close to a sellout and *people were clearling out during the main event*





:lmao

:vince4


----------



## checkcola

JY57 said:


> Note (not rating related): supposedly the crowd wasn't even close to a sellout and people were clearling out during the main event


:lmao Better to beat traffic than listen to Triple H ramble on and on 

(though, to be fair, the crowd was pretty good throughout the show despite those huge sections that looked blacked out)


----------



## Starbuck

Alo0oy said:


> Big Show has no marks.
> 
> This is boring.


Lies. Didn't you hear all those people chanting YES? Big Show has tons of marks. Tons of Funk are Big Show marks. Next time he gets beat down they'll save him.


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7

Vanilla giants don't draw. Nash, JBL, Show, and Kane have proven this.


----------



## Londrick

They probably wanted to get out of before HHH fired them all again.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Well one poster here would rather watch Big Show vs Orton for a year over seeing Bryan in another main event. Sounds like a Big Show mark to me.


----------



## KO Bossy

Could this be one of those rare times where after the first segment, the show was basically all downhill from there in term of viewers??


----------



## KO Bossy

Best4Bidness said:


> Well one poster here would rather watch Big Show vs Orton for a year over seeing Bryan in another main event. Sounds like a Big Show mark to me.


I still stand by that statement. Not a Big Show mark at all, its more emphasizing how much I disliked what Bryan's main event run amounted to.


----------



## markedfordeath

i should have known that when I was watching the last segment and there were a line of people walking up the stairs, I guess i should have taken that as a sign...lol but Vince knows best, right?


----------



## Mr. I

Alo0oy said:


> What did Bryan do? he had like 30 seconds TV time.


Damned if you do, damned if you don't.


----------



## Starbuck

We are forever left in the unknown sea of ratings breakdowns. We'll never know the truth. This week and last are dark days for us all. Those with the information are withholding it and taking pleasure in the slander of poor Big Show. Didn't they see the video from Raw? This guy sues people for...everything apparently. Maybe he sued Meltzer to prevent the breakdown getting released? :side:


----------



## JY57

Starbuck said:


> We are forever left in the unknown sea of ratings breakdowns. We'll never know the truth. This week and last are dark days for us all. Those with the information are withholding it and taking pleasure in the slander of poor Big Show. Didn't they see the video from Raw? This guy sues people for...everything apparently. Maybe he sued Meltzer to prevent the breakdown getting released? :side:


not sure if true but supposedly PWTorch will only do every other week from now on.


----------



## Dec_619

Cena, Punk and Bryan were finished for the night. No one wants to see Big Show in a main event angle in 2013.


----------



## Gretchen

JY57 said:


> Note (not rating related): supposedly the crowd wasn't even close to a sellout and people were clearling out during the main event


Doesn't surprise me, considering how dead the crowd was at the end.


----------



## Starbuck

JY57 said:


> not sure if true but supposedly PWTorch will only do every other week from now on.


Strange. Observer haven't been giving out the best quarter hour reports if they even do them at all recently either. At one stage they were both reporting every week. Now you're lucky to get one never mind two.

I wouldn't be surprised if the awkward as fuck commercial break led to people leaving. The promo was just reaching fever pitch and then they went to commercial. When they came back there was an obvious change in atmosphere when folks seemed pretty into it before from what I saw and heard. Meh.


----------



## #Mark

Looks like the Mini Powers alliance is off to a good start unk2 :dazzler


----------



## Choke2Death

Does that mean it's the end of the ratings thread?


----------



## chessarmy

I hope the ratings hit a 2.0, they deserve this for fucking over Daniel Bryan in favor of Big Show.

Sick and tired of Vince and his fetish for big men


----------



## JY57

> WWE Raw on Monday, November 4 scored a 2.75 rating, down eight percent from last week's season-high 2.98 rating following the Hell in a Cell PPV.
> 
> Raw fell to a ratings level in-between the Battleground and HIAC PPVs prior to last week's jump. Externally, a potential contributor was the strongest Monday Night Football game of the past month, which averaged 16.1 million viewers, up significantly from recent games in the 10-11 million viewer range.
> 
> - Raw averaged 3.887 million viewers, down six percent from last week's average of 4.155 million viewers following HIAC.
> 
> Hourly Break Down: 4.069 million first hour viewers, decline to 3.951 million second hour viewers, and a sharp eight percent decline to 3.643 million viewers.
> 
> It was the third consecutive week that Raw's audience fell from the first hour to the second hour to the third hour.
> 
> In the early stages of the Three-Hour Raw Era, Raw peaked in the second hour when the General Audience and Adult Male audience overlapped. Over the past three weeks, there has been a drop-off in either the General or Adult Male audience in the second hour before the now-customary third hour decline.


via PWTorch


----------



## superuser1

This thread serves no purpose since the breakdown doesnt come out anymore. All we can do is speculate.


----------



## KO Bossy

Oh so its MNF that made Big Show's moment in the sun fail...

Rest easy Vince.


----------



## markedfordeath

see, Cena doesn't even help all that much....when Cena was gone, Bryan helped them to a 3.07 rating the week after the Authority angle had started, back on August 26th, and now Cena and Show are around and nothing has changed....see, the fanbase is pissed off! Give Bryan the fucking title!


----------



## Sonnen Says

The only way they will get higher ratings is if they change back to 2 hours and have less commercials but this will never happen or at least not any time soon since WWE earns more money for that extra hour.


----------



## checkcola

If you saw the bits you wanted, why stick around for acts not appealing to you? 3 hrs does allow people to pick and choose. Sounds like it happened on a micro-level at RAW when people left instead of sticking around for the trainwreck mainevent.


----------



## GillbergReturns

Some of you guys. The article told you what drew people away. Monday Night Football. If they have a good game on it's going to come at Raw's expense.


----------



## checkcola

GillbergReturns said:


> Some of you guys. The article told you what drew people away. Monday Night Football. If they have a good game on it's going to come at Raw's expense.


The people leveling RAW wheren't watching football, yet they had the same reaction as viewership.


----------



## rocknblues81

Choke2Death said:


> Damn. That dream match between Punk and HHH drew some great numbers, didn't it?


I'm shocked anyone bought Night of the Champions this year. The card for that event was brutal.


----------



## GillbergReturns

checkcola said:


> The people leveling RAW wheren't watching football, yet they had the same reaction as viewership.


3rd hour typically draws the least viewers and 8pm can start off strong because the game doesn't start until 8:30.


----------



## markedfordeath

they put Punk and Bryan on at the top of the hour where they can be seen the most....weird...must be a burial for them LOL if anything I feel bad for Fandango and 3MB, nobody ever watches them.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

The first hour has been the worst in drawing most of the time. That changed this week. Just saying.


----------



## markedfordeath

thats' what I'm saying, they put CM Punk and had Bryan run in during the segment within the first half hour before football started....they want the Wyatts to get over as heels so they made sure they were on at the beginning to show them...basically means they know this feud will be high on the card, so they want it to be important....


----------



## Waffelz

No it hasn't. Stop lying.


----------



## rocknblues81

GillbergReturns said:


> Some of you guys. The article told you what drew people away. Monday Night Football. If they have a good game on it's going to come at Raw's expense.


A game with two back up QB's.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Holy crap at those real numbers! :lmao

DEM VANILLA MIDGETS BRINGING IN DEM VIEWERS!







:bryan

DEM STARS FROM THE ATTITUDE ERA AKA DA GRATEST ERA IN RASSLIN HISTORY FAILING :HHH :show :kane

As for what actually peaked the night, it's either the opener of Punk/Harper with Bryan coming in at the end, or the 6-man tag... I actually expect the 10PM to lose viewers and potentially the 6-man tag in it's odd position to pop the biggest number of the night. Hours 1 and 2 are close enough where either one could be the biggest.

Overrun could of course be good, but Quarter 12 won't be probably.

And this year's is actually quite a bit down from last year's:



> 8PM- 4.066
> 9PM- 4.279
> 10PM- 3.883


GET ONE OF DEM DRAWING MIDGETS BACK IN THE MAIN EVENT!


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

This is what happens when you put Big Show in top face spot, and Bryan and Punk in the first hour. That's the only difference from previous weeks.


----------



## markedfordeath

I told you guys that the Wyatts/Punk,Bryan feud is going to be the only one that draws interest..ffs people were leaving during the end of Raw..they never left when Bryan was the main event.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

The Sandrone said:


> Holy crap at those real numbers! :lmao
> 
> DEM VANILLA MIDGETS BRINGING IN DEM VIEWERS!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :bryan
> 
> DEM STARS FROM THE ATTITUDE ERA AKA DA GRATEST ERA IN RASSLIN HISTORY FAILING :HHH :show :kane


They should bring back Austin and Rock.


----------



## GillbergReturns

Mister WrestleMania said:


> The first hour has been the worst in drawing most of the time. That changed this week. Just saying.


It's been that way for 3 weeks in a row but yeah typically the 9 PM hour is the highest.


----------



## markedfordeath

this is why they shouldn't go by ppv numbers, clearly its in the breakdowns each week what people watch...and if they like the "vanilla midgets" the best, then they should be in the main event...Hello Vince, anyone home?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

While we'll need to wait and see how numbers play out and how the breakdown goes this week, if it ends up being Punk/Bryan pull in the most viewers each week in this storyline, a Punk vs. Bryan match may become slightly more likely for this year's Mania...

... although I do kinda hope for Bryan/HHH as Bryan beating HHH would be a much bigger deal for Bryan than Bryan beating Punk... plus they really need to do it after HHH's comments during the contract signing for Hell in a Cell. So...

Bryan vs. HHH for WM30

Punk vs. Bryan for WM31

MAKE IT HAPPEN VINCE! :mark:


----------



## Gretchen

*Vanilla Midget Who Isn't a Draw, No More!* unk5


----------



## GillbergReturns

markedfordeath said:


> this is why they shouldn't go by ppv numbers, clearly its in the breakdowns each week what people watch...and if they like the "vanilla midgets" the best, then they should be in the main event...Hello Vince, anyone home?


No, because when 2 part timers pull in great numbers (Summerslam 12) then 2 "vanilla midgets" pull in horrible numbers (Summerslam 13) despite 13's ratings being stronger you see it's a little more complicated.


----------



## WWE

Just imagine all those punk/bryan marks if the show/hhh segment actually LOSES viewers, somehow


----------



## markedfordeath

okay but by that logic, only part timers can draw ppv numbers..that's been the case for awhile, thats why so many come back and why Triple H is involved now. They aren't losing money, so they can afford to have low buyrates and low ratings until all the new guys on the roster get built up..isn't that how you run a business? you have to sink and swim first and stay afloat until everyone is built up and then you get the ultimate payoff with large numbers due to fan interest..instead of sabotaging people left and right and holding them down.....instead of panicking, think of the long term.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Cycloneon said:


> Just imagine all those punk/bryan marks if the show/hhh segment actually LOSES viewers, somehow


As a mark of both Punk and Bryan, I can speak on behalf of both groups and say WE... ARE... GOING... TO... PARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR...

... actually, we're not gonna give a fuck because all we care about are Punk and/or Bryan's segment(s). unk2 :bryan


----------



## markedfordeath

i'm leaning toward a Cena/Bryan match for Mania actually. Cena needs his win back, that'll be what the feud is based upon. of course Bryan should win that match though. This time Cena can't blame the elbow.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I must say, I'd laugh (and cry) if Punk and Bryan's segment does poorly and everything else in the quarter was what brought the viewership average for the hour up. :lol


----------



## markedfordeath

nothing will come up higher than the Punk segment, because the game started at 5:30 so the match was over by then, so the most viewers watched it.


----------



## GillbergReturns

markedfordeath said:


> okay but by that logic, only part timers can draw ppv numbers..that's been the case for awhile, thats why so many come back and why Triple H is involved now. They aren't losing money, so they can afford to have low buyrates and low ratings until all the new guys on the roster get built up..isn't that how you run a business? you have to sink and swim first and stay afloat until everyone is built up and then you get the ultimate payoff with large numbers due to fan interest..instead of sabotaging people left and right and holding them down.....instead of panicking, think of the long term.


The funny thing is you guys still don't think these indy wrestlers are being pushed despite other than Cena they're the only full time wrestlers being pushed. 

Punk's been pushed for 2 years straight, Bryan got Summerslam and more likely than not will be prominently featured in Rumble and WrestleMania. I really don't even know what you guys are complaining about. It's November WWE always has filler runs going on in this time. That's what Show HHH is.


----------



## Sonnen Says

They did a big mistake when they wasted Punk and Bryan in the first hour since that's the most excited story from last week. They could have waited for it and placed it in the 9 or 10pm where Punk/Bryan will bring dem numbers unlike someone I know who loses viewers in the 9pm when it's impossible to lose :lol.


----------



## chronoxiong

I'm glad to see the viewership drop big time in the 3rd hour. That was the best thing I was hoping for when I was watching the show. It will show the WWE that fans dont want to see Big Show in the main event and for old Attitude Era guys hogging the spotlight again. Let's keep this up WWE Universe! The WWE needs a wakeup call.


----------



## GillbergReturns

Sonnen Says said:


> They did a big mistake when they wasted Punk and Bryan in the first hour since that's the most excited story from last week. They could have waited for it and placed it in the 9 or 10pm where Punk/Bryan will bring dem numbers unlike someone I know who loses viewers in the 9pm when it's impossible to lose :lol.


I'm pretty sure Punk and Bryan were in the 9pm/ 10 pm last week and guess what hour did the best? Yeah that's right 8 PM.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

> I'm pretty sure Punk and Bryan were in the 9pm/ 10 pm last week and guess what hour did the best? Yeah that's right 8 PM.


That was because of Mr. Sandow. :sandow


----------



## The Great Gatsby

markedfordeath said:


> i'm leaning toward a Cena/Bryan match for Mania actually. Cena needs his win back, that'll be what the feud is based upon. of course Bryan should win that match though. This time Cena can't blame the elbow.


I doubt that will happen, I think they have been planning Cena/Orton for a long time for Mania. Im sure at some point WWE will have to have Cena squash Bryan for no damn reason


----------



## WWE

markedfordeath said:


> i'm leaning toward a Cena/Bryan match for Mania actually. Cena needs his win back, that'll be what the feud is based upon. of course Bryan should win that match though. This time Cena can't blame the elbow.


...He didn't even blame the elbow the first time


----------



## validreasoning

GillbergReturns said:


> Punk's been pushed for 2 years straight, Bryan got Summerslam and more likely than not will be prominently featured in Rumble and WrestleMania. I really don't even know what you guys are complaining about. It's November WWE always has filler runs going on in this time. That's what Show HHH is.


meltzer said that orton and show is the first program which will lead to show and hhh program. the whole point of this is to build up show massively for a major program at mania (he didn't name the opponent)


----------



## markedfordeath

if Heyman is the Devil for the Wyatts storyline, then that could be intriguing, then that rumor of Punk/Bryan/Heyman aligning down the road against the Authority could be awesome for Wrestlemania season. RTWM is going to be fun, but they'll probably ruin it with nothing but part timers and some BS. lets hope not! Hope Big Show is back in a tag team with Henry by January. *wait what? Big Show massively built for Mania? shit! So we have to deal with this guy for the foreseeable future? and he has a huge match at Mania? fuck this!


----------



## Sonnen Says

The Sandrone said:


> That was because of Mr. Sandow. :sandow


----------



## Happenstan

Londrick said:


> Last week they had to deal with the World Series and Monday Night Football which totaled about 24 million viewers yet none of the hours bombed as hard as hour 3.


This. Stop the football excuse. It doesn't hold up to scrutiny.


As for the ratings....you know, I feel sorry for Big Show in a way. He's really in a no win situation here. He's been around too long and jobbed too much to be taken seriously in this angle. He's already turning off viewers like me who bailed on the show for the first time in 15 years and you just know when he tries to pull that yes theft in a smark city they are gonna rain a shit storm down on the guy reserved only for John SeenIt. Incoming boos and "bullshit" chants galore. That's gonna be embarrassing. If this program with Orton is supposed to lead to a program with HHH next month...well...do YOU really think HHH will wrestle a guy who's getting these ratings and most likely little to no pop a month from now? I don't think so.


----------



## markedfordeath

seriously, Bryan didnt even give him permission to use it either..he said in an interview he hates it when people use it to get cheers..its his thing..Big Show should be ashamed. And its funny how HHH thinks Big Show is more of a star than Bryan..ha ha my oh my!


----------



## Londrick

Cycloneon said:


> ...He didn't even blame the elbow the first time


Seriously. The next RAW he straight up said Bryan was the better man and beat him fair and square.


----------



## vk79

The ratings sucked for Raw because the show sucked.

All of the storylines are watered down and WWE has killed momentum of too many superstars. 

Seriously this company has no direction right now.


----------



## Alo0oy

Londrick said:


> Seriously. The next RAW he straight up said Bryan was the better man and beat him fair and square.


It doesn't matter, he can change his mind at any moment, all they need to do is show clips of the doctors checking on him mid-match & him waving them off.


----------



## markedfordeath

how hard is it to write a productive, interesting storyline? How is it so hard? and I know Vince has to okay everything, but how can he possibly think that the ideas he okays are going to go over well with the audience? I mean does he just not pay attention? or does he not care around this time of year? what is it? four screwy finishes and having a fat 41 year old being the center, and having his son in law belittle the roster, Vince actually thought these ideas would go over well with the audience? it is just baffling. And they don't understand how the ratings are down.....?


----------



## Jingoro

last weeks raw was awesome and they followed it up with a crappy smackdown and a crappy raw this week. it's only really good when they start new fueds and have something special like a briefcase cash-in. otherwise it's back to the usual shit show starring john cena and a ton of time devoted to a guy who was at the time fired from the company.


----------



## Schrute_Farms

its late wcw quality shit. they want me to sit through 3 hours of crap to see the big show? have they lost their fucking minds?


----------



## Alo0oy

Look on the bright side, they'll bury him at Survivor Series & then kick him out of the storyline. I don't think HHH wants to face him anymore.

:HHH2 :buried :show


----------



## Happenstan

Alo0oy said:


> Look on the bright side, they'll bury him at Survivor Series & then kick him out of the storyline. I don't think HHH wants to face him anymore.
> 
> :HHH2 :buried :show


I don't think we're there yet, but we will be very soon if Big Show keeps pulling in those kinds of ratings. HHH is a remora. He only attaches himself to ratings and popularity sharks. You can't leech off a dead fish...even if it's 7 foot.


----------



## Alo0oy

Happenstan said:


> I don't think we're there yet, but we will be very soon if Big Show keeps pulling in those kinds of ratings. HHH is a remora. *He only attaches himself to ratings and popularity sharks. You can't leech off a dead fish*...even if it's 7 foot.


& I never thought I'd appreciate that more than right now, if Big Show bombs in the upcoming weeks, no way in hell is HHH facing him.


----------



## fulcizombie

markedfordeath said:


> see, Cena doesn't even help all that much....when Cena was gone, Bryan helped them to a 3.07 rating the week after the Authority angle had started, back on August 26th, and now Cena and Show are around and nothing has changed....see, the fanbase is pissed off! Give Bryan the fucking title!


Why anyone would think that cena, of all people, is a rating;s draw is beyond me . Cena' s era has led the wwe to some horrible ratings .


----------



## Choke2Death

Happenstan said:


> I don't think we're there yet, but we will be very soon if Big Show keeps pulling in those kinds of ratings. HHH is a remora. *He only attaches himself to ratings and popularity sharks. You can't leech off a dead fish...even if it's 7 foot.*


Yet he faced CM Punk and unsurprisingly, the buyrates for the PPV bombed hard. And he faced Kevin Nash (aka the lowest drawing champion until Mr. Punk took the throne) later that year, which might be down to the fact that they're buddies. He's also buddies with Big Show, so it'll be another exception this time I think.


----------



## Happenstan

Choke2Death said:


> Yet he faced CM Punk and unsurprisingly, the buyrates for the PPV bombed hard. And he faced Kevin Nash (aka the lowest drawing champion until Mr. Punk took the throne) later that year, which might be down to the fact that they're buddies. He's also buddies with Big Show, so it'll be another exception this time I think.


CM Punk: All about Punk's post "shoot" popularity. But as we've seen with Bryan, just because you are popular doesn't mean you pop huge buyrates right out of the gate.

Nash: Just a favor basically. They didn't care if they drew. They were entertaining each other. The Kliq continued...


----------



## WWE

Alo0oy said:


> It doesn't matter, he can change his mind at any moment, all they need to do is show clips of the doctors checking on him mid-match & him waving them off.


Jesus Christ, what's with you people coming up with excuses to bash Cena? 

Even when you know we're right, ya'll still say 'Oh it doesn't matter'


----------



## SerapisLiber

Choke2Death said:


> Kevin Nash (aka the lowest drawing champion until Mr. Punk took the throne)


Hardly. Nash didn't just bomb in ratings, he bombed in $$$ (which, btw, is the only reason being a draw even matters). '95 was way worse than 2012. In fact, even 2011 made less than 2012.


----------



## Londrick

Choke2Death said:


> Yet he faced CM Punk and unsurprisingly, the buyrates for the PPV bombed hard. *And he faced Kevin Nash (aka the lowest drawing champion* until Mr. Punk took the throne) later that year, which might be down to the fact that they're buddies. He's also buddies with Big Show, so it'll be another exception this time I think.


:kobe

You need to get your facts straight. 

:36


----------



## The Great Gatsby

fulcizombie said:


> Why anyone would think that cena, of all people, is a rating;s draw is beyond me . Cena' s era has led the wwe to some horrible ratings .


This, the degree to which people overrate Cena drawing power is astonishing. WWE has gotten 6/7 PPVs do less than 200k the past 3 years yet Cena is such a big draw :lmao truth is if WWE gave anyone else the Cena push business would pick up. Cena is the corporate champion so hes protected and guys are held down to make up for his lack of star power


----------



## markedfordeath

Cena/Orton for Wrestlemania 30 and Big Show/Triple H is rumored now for Wrestlemania 30 as well. Orton is scheduled to beat Big Show cleanly the next few months to establish himself as a prominent champion after several weak victories over Bryan by interference. So basically, Bryan is forgotten about and he never gets a title shot again, so I guess WWE picks what the people want instead of the people picking what they want.


----------



## SerapisLiber

Londrick said:


> :kobe
> 
> You need to get your facts straight.
> 
> :36


----------



## Waffelz

Cena never ever loses viewers, so that makes him a draw. It's not his fault people aren't interested in other people.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

KO Bossy said:


> 1 win at MiTB + 1 win at Survivor Series=1 WWE title reign?
> 
> Not hating, just pointing it out.


:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao DAT MARK HATRED



Cycloneon said:


> OH FUCK
> 
> :ti :ti :ti
> 
> *EVERYBODY RUN THE PUNK/BRYAN MARKS ARE COMING*
> 
> unk :bryan2


:lmao:lmao:lmao


MaybeLock said:


> Dont worry, they will bring Hogan back for an 80s rehash tour :lmao:lmao
> 
> Best 4 Business :trips2


:lmao:lmao:lmao


----------



## Cliffy

SerapisLiber said:


> Hardly. Nash didn't just bomb in ratings, he bombed in $$$ (which, btw, is the only reason being a draw even matters). '95 was way worse than 2012. In fact, even 2011 made less than 2012.


WWE actually lost more money in the period after Nash dropped the title.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

JY57 said:


> third hour has been lowest hour for 5 straight weeks. I wouldn't judge anything by that till a breakdown is out if there is one.
> 
> Most of the time the main event does ok/good and segments between 7:15 - 7:45 lose about 800,000 - 1,000,000 viewers.


see bryan is'nt also DAT MEGA DRAW,HE WAS ALSO GETTING LOW NUMBERS IN THE ME.:lmao:lmao



Cycloneon said:


> And notice how Cena hasn't even been near the third hour?
> 
> 
> CONNECT THE DOTS PEOPLE
> 
> :cena3


 CENA RETURNS TO SAVE DAT ME SCENE :cena3 :cena5


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

DEM VANILLA MIDGETS in the highest rated hour of RAW. :bryan & unk7 tearing up the rest of the roster.

:lmao :lmao :lmao

No one in current day WWE is a "mega draw." It's time for people to accept this.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

markedfordeath said:


> see, Cena doesn't even help all that much....when Cena was gone, Bryan helped them to a 3.07 rating the week after the Authority angle had started, back on August 26th, and now Cena and Show are around and nothing has changed....see, the fanbase is pissed off! Give Bryan the fucking title!





markedfordeath said:


> thats' what I'm saying, they put CM Punk and had Bryan run in during the segment within the first half hour before football started....they want the Wyatts to get over as heels so they made sure they were on at the beginning to show them...basically means they know this feud will be high on the card, so they want it to be important....


btw do you remember that guy named john cena who drew te HIGHEST FIRST HOUR RATINGS since post wm29 raw or was it the highest rating since post wm29 raw,just saying.......


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

They should just put Punk and Bryan in there every hour. Who needs Cena and Show? They drag Raw down these days, more than anything else.


----------



## validreasoning

Cena rulz12345 said:


> see bryan is'nt also DAT MEGA DRAW,HE WAS ALSO GETTING LOW NUMBERS IN THE ME.:lmao:lmao


meltzer in that article from june 2002 i posted said gaining 500,000 or above is great. here are all the mainevents of raw since summerslam

8/19 The big angle in the main event slot with the McMahons, Randy Orton, Daniel Bryan, the long HHH promo and The Shield all involved gained about 670,000 viewers to a 3.6

8/26 Daniel Bryan’s Gauntlet against The Shield and his being laid out gained 1,092,000 viewers to a 3.7 quarter

9/2 Big Show vs. Daniel Bryan in the main event gained 550,000 viewers to a 3.3 quarter

9/9 Daniel Bryan vs. Dean Ambrose main event gained 760,000 viewers.

9/16 Daniel Bryan vs. Roman Reigns main event gained 580,000 viewers

9/23 The 11-on-3 main event gained 492,000 viewers. 

9/30 The Daniel Bryan/Randy Orton brawl during the overrun gained 689,000 viewers

10/7 Daniel Bryan & Cody Rhodes & Goldust vs. The Shield in the main event gained 430,000 viewers.

10/14 no breakdown released

10/21 The Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan contract signing gained 454,000 viewers.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Cycloneon said:


> ...He didn't even blame the elbow the first time


yes,infact he said the elbow should'nt be used as a excuse to taint bryan's victory.
DAT MARKEDFORDEATH IS SUCH A BITCHY CENA HATER.



Cycloneon said:


> Jesus Christ, what's with you people coming up with excuses to bash Cena?
> 
> Even when you know we're right, ya'll still say 'Oh it doesn't matter'


indeed


The Great Gatsby said:


> This, the degree to which people overrate Cena drawing power is astonishing. WWE has gotten 6/7 PPVs do less than 200k the past 3 years yet Cena is such a big draw :lmao truth is if WWE gave anyone else the Cena push business would pick up. Cena is the corporate champion so hes protected and guys are held down to make up for his lack of star power


fpalm should'nt the blame go to ppv streams,ufc,shitty product etc...
btw while you bash cena for not being a draw you seem to forget he is the ONLy MAN to headline a ppv that did $1million buys 4TIMES.


----------



## Alo0oy

validreasoning said:


> meltzer in that article from june 2002 i posted said gaining 500,000 or above is great. here are all the mainevents of raw since summerslam
> 
> 8/19 The big angle in the main event slot with the McMahons, Randy Orton, Daniel Bryan, the long HHH promo and The Shield all involved gained about 670,000 viewers to a 3.6
> 
> 8/26 Daniel Bryan’s Gauntlet against The Shield and his being laid out gained 1,092,000 viewers to a 3.7 quarter
> 
> 9/2 Big Show vs. Daniel Bryan in the main event gained 550,000 viewers to a 3.3 quarter
> 
> 9/9 Daniel Bryan vs. Dean Ambrose main event gained 760,000 viewers.
> 
> 9/16 Daniel Bryan vs. Roman Reigns main event gained 580,000 viewers
> 
> 9/23 The 11-on-3 main event gained 492,000 viewers.
> 
> 9/30 The Daniel Bryan/Randy Orton brawl during the overrun gained 689,000 viewers
> 
> 10/7 Daniel Bryan & Cody Rhodes & Goldust vs. The Shield in the main event gained 430,000 viewers.
> 
> 10/14 no breakdown released
> 
> 10/21 The Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan contract signing gained 454,000 viewers.


Those gains could all be attributed to Triple H, he always teased coming out, & more often than not, he did, & the storyline itself was drawing, every time they attached something to the storyline it gained viewers (until it started becoming redundant recently).

Bryan lost viewers when he had a match with Dean Ambrose in the midcard, & that's because there's no Triple H to fall back on.

:bryan2 He can zap the ratings somewhere else in the card now. :lmao


----------



## checkcola

Yet, people in attendance were leaving when Triple H and Big Show were having their confrontation to end RAW. Triple H needs a hot act to play off of. Big Show never, ever was a hot act, even going back to the Monday Night Wars. Austin beat him right as he came into the company and that was that. Nothing has changed. He's stale, fat and portrayed as an idiot who doesn't even demand his house back (the one logical demand for him to make). Better to beat traffic than listen to that goof apparently.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

validreasoning said:


> meltzer in that article from june 2002 i posted said gaining 500,000 or above is great. here are all the mainevents of raw since summerslam
> 
> 8/19 The big angle in the main event slot with the McMahons, Randy Orton, Daniel Bryan, the long HHH promo and The Shield all involved gained about 670,000 viewers to a 3.6
> 
> 8/26 Daniel Bryan’s Gauntlet against The Shield and his being laid out gained 1,092,000 viewers to a 3.7 quarter
> 
> 9/2 Big Show vs. Daniel Bryan in the main event gained 550,000 viewers to a 3.3 quarter
> 
> 9/9 Daniel Bryan vs. Dean Ambrose main event gained 760,000 viewers.
> 
> 9/16 Daniel Bryan vs. Roman Reigns main event gained 580,000 viewers
> 
> 9/23 The 11-on-3 main event gained 492,000 viewers.
> 
> 9/30 The Daniel Bryan/Randy Orton brawl during the overrun gained 689,000 viewers
> 
> 10/7 Daniel Bryan & Cody Rhodes & Goldust vs. The Shield in the main event gained 430,000 viewers.
> 
> 10/14 no breakdown released
> 
> 10/21 The Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan contract signing gained 454,000 viewers.


/end of discussion.

:clap :clap :clap

Bryan don't do DEM 1.7's.


----------



## SerapisLiber

Cliffy Byro said:


> WWE actually lost more money in the period after Nash dropped the title.


But Choke didn't make the comparison to Bret or Shawn, he used Nash.


----------



## validreasoning

Alo0oy said:


> Those gains could all be attributed to Triple H, he always teased coming out, & more often than not, he did, & the storyline itself was drawing, every time they attached something to the storyline it gained viewers (until it started becoming redundant recently).
> 
> Bryan lost viewers when he had a match with Dean Ambrose in the midcard, & that's because there's no Triple H to fall back on.


how many times has bryan wrestled the shield in one form or another on tv this past year?? i read it was 27 times in early october so obviously its over 30 now and the segment after the opening one is 99.99% of the time loses viewers

as for giving all the credit to hhh well here are bryans numbers after his breakaway from team hell no and before any of the hhh bullshit or before cena picked him the night after mitb

june 3rd..Daniel Bryan vs. Ryback gained 463,000 viewers at 10:30 p.m., which is tremendous growth for that time slot
june 10th.. Daniel Bryan vs. Seth Rollins at 10 p.m. gained 223,000 viewers to a 3.20 quarter.
june 17th Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan gained 248,000 viewers to a 3.13 quarter at 9 p.m.
june 24th Orton vs. Bryan street fight (their 3rd tv match in a week) gained 104,000 viewers
july 1st Randy Orton vs. Kane with Daniel Bryan as ref gained 217,000 viewers 
july 8th Daniel Bryan vs. Sheamus gained 183,000 viewers at 8.15pm, nearly always a losing segment
july 15th cena picks bryan


----------



## doinktheclowns

parody


----------



## Cena rulz12345

so drawing 500,00 means you're a great draw hmm..


> 6/3 John Cena vs. Curtis Axel gained 430,000 viewers for a show-high 3.14 overrun rating.
> 
> 7/1 John Cena vs. Alberto Del Rio gained 567,000 viewers to a 3.25 overrun
> 
> 7/15 The John Cena/Mark Henry segment gained 738,000 viewers for a 3.57 rating.
> 
> 7/29 Ryback vs. John Cena in a Tables Match gained a big 769,000 viewers for a 3.29 overrun rating
> 
> 8/5 The main event with The Shield vs. Daniel Bryan, Randy Orton and John Cena gained around 700,000 viewers for a 3.4 overrun rating
> 
> 2/25 *John Cena vs. C.M. Punk gained about 1 million viewers and finished with a 3.9 overrun, considered to be a huge success*


----------



## YoungGun_UK

doinktheclowns said:


> I don't dislike Nash but he is one of the most delusional guys in wrestling and by far the biggest mark for himself. He has massive insecurities and constantly has to tell people what his achievements are. He is basically saying he drew more money to the company than Stone Cold, The Rock, Hulk Hogan etc etc Which isn't true.


:ti 

No he's right, Nash is GOAT DRAW, I don't know what makes you think different, he just said it in a video.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Cena should be able to draw consistently. He's been pushed to the moon for the past decade. Little Danny Bryan hasn't receieved even a 1/4 of that push. They are on completely different levels.


----------



## doinktheclowns

Choke2Death said:


> Yet he faced CM Punk and unsurprisingly, the buyrates for the PPV bombed hard. And he faced Kevin Nash (aka the lowest drawing champion until Mr. Punk took the throne) later that year, which might be down to the fact that they're buddies. He's also buddies with Big Show, so it'll be another exception this time I think.


Argument doesn't really hold any water because TLC of the same year that CM Punk main evented did better numbers than Night of Champions and didn't feature Cena. The problem with Night of Champions I think was the stipulation that HHH would resign as COO if he lost pretty much made the Main Event predictable.

Im not saying CM Punk is a draw when it comes to buyrates but the dial doesn't move much for anyone these days. I say the low number for Night of Champions is worse for HHH that is was for Punk.


----------



## doinktheclowns

YoungGun_UK said:


> :ti
> 
> No he's right, Nash is GOAT DRAW, I don't know what makes you think different, he just said it in a video.


Parody


----------



## vanboxmeer

doinktheclowns said:


> Parody


The graph and empirical data was right there in the video. How can you blatantly disregard factual information in green marker?


----------



## doinktheclowns

vanboxmeer said:


> The graph and empirical data was right there in the video. How can you blatantly disregard factual information in green marker?


Like I said I realise it is a parody.


----------



## THANOS

validreasoning said:


> how many times has bryan wrestled the shield in one form or another on tv this past year?? i read it was 27 times in early october so obviously its over 30 now and the segment after the opening one is 99.99% of the time loses viewers
> 
> as for giving all the credit to hhh well here are bryans numbers after his breakaway from team hell no and before any of the hhh bullshit or before cena picked him the night after mitb
> 
> june 3rd..Daniel Bryan vs. Ryback gained 463,000 viewers at 10:30 p.m., which is tremendous growth for that time slot
> june 10th.. Daniel Bryan vs. Seth Rollins at 10 p.m. gained 223,000 viewers to a 3.20 quarter.
> june 17th Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan gained 248,000 viewers to a 3.13 quarter at 9 p.m.
> june 24th Orton vs. Bryan street fight (their 3rd tv match in a week) gained 104,000 viewers
> july 1st Randy Orton vs. Kane with Daniel Bryan as ref gained 217,000 viewers
> july 8th Daniel Bryan vs. Sheamus gained 183,000 viewers at 8.15pm, nearly always a losing segment
> july 15th cena picks bryan


Perfect. I would love to see someone attribute this to HHH and Cena now. Hell, regardless of the storyline, Bryan's mainevent with Wade Barrett (continuous ratings loser) on Smackdown destroyed everything else on the show and it wasn't even close.


----------



## Bfo4jd

The third hour viewership isn't surpirsing, it was full of fillers. The Cena match ended at 10, Big show/HHH stuff started at 10:48 and look what we had in between - Dolph Ziggler Vs Axel, Recap video of Punk/Bryan against Wyatts, Renee young backstage with Bryan, The Usos vs 3mb, Backstage Vickie, Stephanie, Triple H, Backstage Renee young with Los matadores, Divas entrance, recap of Kane/Stephanie, 6-diva tag match.... even wrestling fans would have tuned out during this. Can't expect casuals to stick around. I mean Renee young got more TV time than the wrestlers involved did individually. Plus the lawsuit angles typically not being interesting ones, didn't help either. Overrun should be a decent rebound if at all, all things considered.





checkcola said:


> Yet, people in attendance were leaving when Triple H and Big Show were having their confrontation to end RAW. Triple H needs a hot act to play off of. Big Show never, ever was a hot act, even going back to the Monday Night Wars. Austin beat him right as he came into the company and that was that. Nothing has changed. He's stale, fat and portrayed as an idiot who doesn't even demand his house back (the one logical demand for him to make). Better to beat traffic than listen to that goof apparently.


What was the attendance for the show? I know it wasn't a sell-out(november and december usually aren't) but what's the official attendance number? People left? Source to this report? 'Cuz I haven't seen it anywhere. 

Anyways, Crowd itself was weak last night I thought, maybe because they had to sit through 3 hrs for continuous wrestling. If you think about it, the first two hours had no story developments, it was a bunch of recaps and video packages. Only two promos that barely even lasted 5 minutes one from Orton(which was actually pretty good) before the match and the other from Cena about Breast cancer thing. Nothing else, it was match after match after match. Big show story was the only one they even bothered to push and it started after 10. 

Last week had great crowd, people going nuts towards the end, especially when HHH took his suit off to fight Big show. I think too much wrestling killed the crowd last night. Can't blame 'em.


----------



## Choke2Death

SerapisLiber said:


>


He's always comedy posting so don't worry.



doinktheclowns said:


> Argument doesn't really hold any water because TLC of the same year that CM Punk main evented did better numbers than Night of Champions and didn't feature Cena. The problem with Night of Champions I think was the stipulation that HHH would resign as COO if he lost pretty much made the Main Event predictable.
> 
> Im not saying CM Punk is a draw when it comes to buyrates but the dial doesn't move much for anyone these days. I say the low number for Night of Champions is worse for HHH that is was for Punk.


It was bad for both. HHH's first match outside of WM since Extreme Rules 2010 and Punk was supposedly in his hottest period coming off two consecutive PPV wins over Cena.


----------



## markedfordeath

I think this Authority angle was a bad idea all around. I'm surprised they're still willing to do it. It's not growing ratings..hasn't been above a 3.0 since August 26th Raw.


----------



## hag

It makes me so happy that the last hour did pooly. Hopefully they change shit around. I didn't watch the last half of Raw because I knew it was just going to be authority bullshit.


----------



## doinktheclowns

Choke2Death said:


> He's always comedy posting so don't worry.
> 
> 
> 
> It was bad for both. HHH's first match outside of WM since Extreme Rules 2010 and Punk was supposedly in his hottest period coming off two consecutive PPV wins over Cena.


True.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

Inb4 WWE doesn't release the quarter hours. 

Dont want to expose the STAR MAKING ANGLE flopping in the ratings.


----------



## markedfordeath

that gif has gotten me all day long...the Miz is that hated..i love it.


----------



## Gretchen

Dec_619 said:


> Cena, Punk and Orton were finished for the night. No one wants to see Big Show in a main event angle in 2013.


Pretty much this.


----------



## markedfordeath

i think it has a lot to do with how they've treated Bryan to be perfectly honest...people saw change finally coming, and then the WWE didn't want to give them change, so they decided to not buy tickets to events anymore....I'm very convinced this is the truth too....they finally saw a changing of the guard and Vince decided to stick it to the fans. and look, looks like the ppv results for the foreseeable future have screwy finishes galore, especially since Big Show is facing Orton again at TLC....looks like he's screwed at SS too..just like Bryan..the WWE has their money, they dont care.


----------



## Alo0oy

Looks like interest in Punk is growing, while it's the opposite for Bryan. :troll


----------



## Londrick

Alo0oy said:


> Looks like interest in Punk is growing, while it's the opposite for Bryan. :troll


This person moved or deleted this image. Seems pretty ironic that a post about Punk flops.


----------



## Alo0oy

Londrick said:


> This person moved or deleted this image. Seems pretty ironic that a post about Punk flops.


I don't know what you're talking about, the image is right there.


----------



## Londrick

That's cause it's still in your cache:










Post flopped just like Punk's reign.


----------



## markedfordeath

ha ha he's still trolling hating on Bryan, i have him ignored so he can hate all he wants, its sad really...he's not even in the main event anymore yet he still has haters on here LOL


----------



## #Mark

Alo0oy said:


> Those gains could all be attributed to Triple H, he always teased coming out, & more often than not, he did, & the storyline itself was drawing, every time they attached something to the storyline it gained viewers (until it started becoming redundant recently).
> 
> Bryan lost viewers when he had a match with Dean Ambrose in the midcard, & that's because there's no Triple H to fall back on.
> 
> :bryan2 He can zap the ratings somewhere else in the card now. :lmao


Here's just one example of how Punk did in the overrun this summer when not paired with an established draw:

July 8th:


> The Randy Orton vs. CM Punk main event gained 48,000 viewers, which is terrible for an overrun segment,


Here's how Bryan's match did that same week:



> Daniel Bryan vs. Sheamus gained 183,000 viewers at 8.15pm, nearly always a losing segment


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

So for the record...any gains/losses posted for this past RAW yet?


----------



## Alo0oy

Londrick said:


> That's cause it's still in your cache:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Post flopped just like Punk's reign.


Okay my bad, I fixed it, I was rearranging my library & the link got screwed up.


----------



## TheStig

Where is that rock316ae or whatever his name was. This thread needs that hero once again because these months will be fun to breakdown as the low 2's rating is for sure comming back this year. Next week is taped and will probably do less than this week and it goes downhill from here.


----------



## Sonnen Says

#Mark said:


> Here's just one example of how Punk did in the overrun this summer when not paired with an established draw:
> 
> July 8th:
> 
> 
> Here's how Bryan's match did that same week:





> -The opener with Daniel Bryan and Randy Orton did a 2.82 quarter rating, which is very weak.
> 
> 
> -The Orton vs. Bryan street fight gained 104,000 viewers - one of the lowest main event gains of the whole year, finishing at a 2.92 overrun.


No surprise it's Randy Orton :


----------



## JY57

not rating but made new thread in PPV section of updated buys for two PPVs (via Dave Metzler in the new WON):

Extreme Rules - 231,000 has increased 14,000 buys to 245,000 (did better than Rock vs Punk II at EC which was 241,000 [the updated version])

Payback - 186,000 buys has increased to 198,000 buys


----------



## Londrick

Sonnen Says said:


> No surprise it's Randy Orton :



That's why he's called Ratings Killer Orton.


----------



## markedfordeath

it doesn't make sense..they want Orton as champion til Wrestlemania, yet Orton never main events Raw and always loses viewers....so what the fuck is the WWE thinking?


----------



## xdoomsayerx

You people should just ignore this week's ratings. The Bears vs Packers were on at the same time, raw obviously wasn't gonna draw shit lol.


----------



## birthday_massacre

xdoomsayerx said:


> You people should just ignore this week's ratings. The Bears vs Packers were on at the same time, raw obviously wasn't gonna draw shit lol.


Yeah because HHH, Orton and Big show were in the main event but we all know if Daniel Bryan was in the main event he would have gotten the blame.

HHH and Orton are ratings killers


----------



## Londrick

People still using the MNF excuse. :ti


----------



## JY57

no breakdown for last week (10/28) from Metzler. so the breakdown for last week (10/28) will likely stay a mystery.


----------



## Alo0oy

The show bombed, Punk saved the first hour, this isn't the first time Raw has gone against strong competition.

Big Show flopped, time to take him out of this angle.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

validreasoning absolutely :buried the Bryan haters before. I love it.

:clap


----------



## Londrick

Alo0oy said:


> The show bombed, Punk saved the first hour, this isn't the first time Raw has gone against strong competition.
> 
> Big Show flopped, time to take him out of this angle.


So has heel Orton and HHH. You can't blame Bryan anymore since he's no longer involved and this angle is no doing worse than with him involved. Time for Cena to get the WWE title back and feud with monster heel #25632.


----------



## checkcola

They're stuck with Big Show for two ppv cycles if he's also going against Triple H at TLC. 










Why the fake jungle/zoo backdrop? Very lame.


----------



## Choke2Death

birthday_massacre said:


> Yeah because HHH, Orton and Big show were in the main event but we all know if Daniel Bryan was in the main event he would have gotten the blame.
> 
> HHH and Orton are ratings killers


Orton only appeared in the overrun. If you're gonna blame him, you might as well mention The Shield too.


----------



## checkcola

Choke2Death said:


> Orton only appeared in the overrun. If you're gonna blame him, you might as well mention The Shield too.


Shield could easily be blamed as their music was playing going to commercial. Anything to protect those stale 90s stars.


----------



## Londrick

checkcola said:


> Shield could easily be blamed as their music was playing going to commercial. Anything to protect those stale 90s stars.


Pretty much. Shield to start jobbing to 3MB cause :HHH2 thinks they're to blame. Wonder who he's gonna bury when this angle continues to tank and it's just him, Steph, Show, Orton and Kane.


----------



## xdoomsayerx

Londrick said:


> People still using the MNF excuse. :ti




How is it an excuse? It was a massive game. The bears and packers are both top 5 most popular nfl teams. It was a fact wwes ratings wouldn't do to well this week. Do you even realize how big the NFL is?


----------



## Alo0oy

Londrick said:


> So has heel Orton and HHH. You can't blame Bryan anymore since he's no longer involved and this angle is no doing worse than with him involved. Time for Cena to get the WWE title back and feud with monster heel #25632.


1- Orton was not advertized to appear.
2- He only appeared in the overrun.

Nice try, though.


----------



## Londrick

xdoomsayerx said:


> How is it an excuse? It was a massive game. The bears and packers are both top 5 most popular nfl teams. It was a fact wwes ratings wouldn't do to well this week. Do you even realize how big the NFL is?


Last week RAW had to deal the World Series and Football yet no hours tanked as hard. Fan's just don't care for StepHHH Knows Best.


----------



## markedfordeath

Orton was in the second hour against Langston and that hour did worse than the first....so Orton is a ratings killer.


----------



## Londrick

Orton's been tanking the ratings for several years now. There's been numerous times he's lost more than 700k viewers not to mention SD getting record low ratings when he was the main star of the show.


----------



## markedfordeath

see, and how are we supposed to believe that they care about ratings when Orton is the champion? obviously they could care less about ratings.


----------



## THANOS

checkcola said:


> They're stuck with Big Show for two ppv cycles if he's also going against Triple H at TLC.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why the fake jungle/zoo backdrop? Very lame.


I think Big Show will be beating Orton at Survivor Series followed by retaining the title at TLC, then he'll lose it to HHH at the Rumble, and get his rematch at the Chamber, with HHH retaining. All the while Bryan will win the Rumble from the #1 seed, and go on to Mania to beat HHH for the title. Now this would require logic, so we'll see if WWE creative get the logic implant they sorely need, otherwise..


----------



## markedfordeath

i have a feeling that Reigns is winning the Rumble now, they suddenly want to fast track his face turn and apparently they're making him the next Cena, even though he sucks in the ring and can't talk..so how the fuck is he being considered over a guy who the fans organically picked? explain this shit to me!


----------



## SPCDRI

What, you don't buy Josh McCown/Seneca Wallace in two non-major market teams as a ratings wrecker?

:hayden3

Orton is ratings poison and this Triple H/Big Show angle is heinous.


----------



## Choke2Death

THANOS said:


> I think Big Show will be beating Orton at Survivor Series followed by retaining the title at TLC, then he'll lose it to HHH at the Rumble, and get his rematch at the Chamber, with HHH retaining. All the while Bryan will win the Rumble from the #1 seed, and go on to Mania to beat HHH for the title. Now this would require logic, so we'll see if WWE creative get the logic implant they sorely need, otherwise..


Hopeful THANOS strikes again!


----------



## reDREDD

The belt on Triple H?

Going into Wrestlemania?

imagine the riots :mark:


----------



## Alo0oy

Londrick said:


> Orton's been tanking the ratings for several years now. There's been numerous times he's lost more than 700k viewers not to mention SD getting record low ratings when he was the main star of the show.


Funny, when 2009 was basically Monday Night Orton, that year averaged the highest ratings of the PG era...hmmm.

As for Smackdown, he wasn't just the main star of the show, he was the ONLY star of the show, not even Cena could have saved that messy roster.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

checkcola said:


> They're stuck with Big Show for two ppv cycles if he's also going against Triple H at TLC.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why the fake jungle/zoo backdrop? Very lame.


Bray is on the poster in a surviving wilderness theme.


----------



## SPCDRI

markedfordeath said:


> Cena/Orton for Wrestlemania 30 and Big Show/Triple H is rumored now for Wrestlemania 30 as well. Orton is scheduled to beat Big Show cleanly the next few months to establish himself as a prominent champion after several weak victories over Bryan by interference. So basically, Bryan is forgotten about and he never gets a title shot again, so I guess WWE picks what the people want instead of the people picking what they want.


Multiple Show/Orton matches, culminating in Orton/Cena for about the 20th time on PPV in about 4 years. 

Big Show/Triple H partying like its 2003.

Meanwhile, all of those people could be having great matches with young talent that needs to be elevated.

Holy fuck. Words cannot express how bad those decisions are. They threw Daniel Bryan away as a made man for life off of making Triple H
or Orton tap out in order to do Orton/Cena Part 20 and Big Show/Triple H?

BREAKFAST CLUB GONNA BREAKFAST, BITCH

rton2 :cena5 :hhh2


----------



## Choke2Death

2013 - BREAKFAST CLUB STILL RULING! :mark:









:HHH2
:cena3


----------



## Londrick

Alo0oy said:


> Funny, when 2009 was basically Monday Night Orton, that year averaged the highest ratings of the PG era...hmmm.
> 
> As for Smackdown, he wasn't just the main star of the show, he was the ONLY star of the show, not even Cena could have saved that messy roster.


What does what he did 09 for a couple months have to do with him killing the ratings the past several years? Judging by his face run as champ, his recent WHC reigns, the various segments he bombed in and the current angle fans no longer care to watch him on TV or PPV.


----------



## markedfordeath

yep, can't wait until business goes down further.


----------



## Londrick

Wonder how long before there's rumors of Billy Corgan buying WWE.


----------



## Alo0oy

Londrick said:


> What does what he did 09 for a couple months have to do with him killing the ratings the past several years? Judging by his face run as champ, his recent WHC reigns, the various segments he bombed in and the current angle fans no longer care to watch him on TV or PPV.


It wasn't a few months, it was the entire year, 2009 was the only year in this era that had ratings as good as the Ruthless Aggression era.

& yes, compare his ratings during his midcard hell run to when he was a main eventer, that makes sense, even Cena will draw poor ratings if you give him the same treatment Orton had in 2012 all the way through the first half of 2013. He needs to re-establish his credibility before people buy into him again, he was jobbing to Wade Barrett & Dolph Ziggler a few months ago.


----------



## #Mark

I have a bad feeling that Show will beat Orton for the title. He seems to almost always win matches he has absolutely no business winning.

Also, Londrick has a point. If you guys are gonna claim Bryan isn't a ratings draw than there has to be consistency here, Orton needs his fair share of blame.. Personally, I think both aren't bad ratings draws by any means but if you're gonna blame one for this angle underperforming then you have to also blame the other.


----------



## Londrick

Show to knock out Orton and start his 5 year run as WWE champ. :vince


----------



## SPCDRI

Londrick said:


> Show to knock out Orton and start his 5 year run as WWE champ. :vince


BEST 4 BIZNAZZ

:vince3 :hhh2


----------



## WWE

Londrick said:


> Show to knock out Orton and start his 5 year run as WWE champ. :vince


----------



## The Great Gatsby

Cena rulz12345 said:


> fpalm should'nt the blame go to ppv streams,ufc,shitty product etc...


I did more PPV digging my friend, out of the 4 worst drawing PPVs of 2011 Cena headlined 3 of them without Punk while Punk only headlined 1 of them which was with HHH so what does WWE do in 2012? They have Cena headlined every PPV so he doesnt get overshadowed by Punk. Funny thing is when Cena was out and Punk/Ryback headlined a PPV it drew better than 6 PPVs that Cena headlined that year. Without WWE protecting Cena he wouldve been surpassed by several stars over the years :lmao



Cena rulz12345 said:


> btw while you bash cena for not being a draw you seem to forget he is the ONLy MAN to headline a ppv that did $1million buys 4TIMES.


Rock got Mania 17, 27, 28, 29 with a much shorter career not to mention the 2 Manias before he came back didnt break 1 million mark.


----------



## Schrute_Farms

Meh I hate big Show but Orton as champ is pretty freaking awful. It's a total lose lose situation for a fan of interesting, talented, entertaining wrestling but meh whatever.


----------



## Alo0oy

#Mark said:


> Also, Londrick has a point. If you guys are gonna claim Bryan isn't a ratings draw than there has to be consistency here, Orton needs his fair share of blame.. Personally, I think both aren't bad ratings draws by any means but if you're gonna blame one for this angle underperforming then you have to also blame the other.


I'm just trolling Bryan marks, they're the most insecure marks out of Punk/Orton/Bryan, so it's easy to work them over. :troll


----------



## Gretchen

Londrick said:


> Show to knock out Orton and start his 5 year run as WWE champ. :vince


*THE FUTURE!!!*

:vince5:show:hhh2


----------



## Choke2Death

Schrute_Farms said:


> Meh I hate big Show but Orton as champ is pretty freaking awful. It's a total lose lose situation for a fan of interesting, talented, entertaining wrestling but meh whatever.


I don't know, it's certainly a win-win situation for this fan of interesting, talented and entertaining wrestlers.

I doubt Show's run in the main event is gonna last more than one or two months at most anyways. He will lose at SVS then lose to HHH before becoming an irrelevant face and turning heel come WM30 like he does every year.


----------



## Jof

JY57 said:


> not rating but made new thread in PPV section of updated buys for two PPVs (via Dave Metzler in the new WON):
> 
> Extreme Rules - 231,000 has increased 14,000 buys to 245,000 (did better than Rock vs Punk II at EC which was 241,000 [the updated version])
> 
> Payback - 186,000 buys has increased to 198,000 buys


Good to know the numbers went up. Any update on wrestlemania? Last time it was reported, the figure was 1,039,000 buys. Should've increased a bit by now. Overall its basically in line with last year. In my opinion, the only event that's gonna bomb hard is Battleground because it was sandwitched between two PPVs within two weeks gap. HIAC should do well considering Shawn Michaels and Cena's return. 




xdoomsayerx said:


> How is it an excuse? It was a massive game. The bears and packers are both top 5 most popular nfl teams. It was a fact wwes ratings wouldn't do to well this week. Do you even realize how big the NFL is?


All that needs to be said.


----------



## JY57

Jof said:


> Good to know the numbers went up. Any update on wrestlemania? Last time it was reported, the figure was 1,039,000 buys. Should've increased a bit by now. Overall its basically in line with last year. In my opinion, the only event that's gonna bomb hard is Battleground because it was sandwitched between two PPVs within two weeks gap. HIAC should do well considering Shawn Michaels and Cena's return.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All that needs to be said.


Yes it's in the WWE PPV section


----------



## Happenstan

Jof said:


> Good to know the numbers went up. Any update on wrestlemania? Last time it was reported, the figure was 1,039,000 buys. Should've increased a bit by now. Overall its basically in line with last year. In my opinion, the only event that's gonna bomb hard is Battleground because it was sandwitched between two PPVs within two weeks gap. HIAC should do well considering Shawn Michaels and Cena's return.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *All that needs to be said.*


Not quite, there's a little more.



Londrick said:


> Last week RAW had to deal the World Series and Football yet no hours tanked as hard. Fan's just don't care for StepHHH Knows Best.


MNF plus World Series on Oct 28th = 24 million viewers.
MNF on Nov 4th = 16 million viewers
Authority and Big Show fans still trying to blame MNF for Nov 4th's lame ratings = Priceless


----------



## Marv95

xdoomsayerx said:


> How is it an excuse? It was a massive game. The bears and packers are both top 5 most popular nfl teams. It was a fact wwes ratings wouldn't do to well this week. Do you even realize how big the NFL is?


They were getting 3s and 4s competing with big MNF games not THAT long ago.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

markedfordeath said:


> i think it has a lot to do with how they've treated Bryan to be perfectly honest...people saw change finally coming, and then the WWE didn't want to give them change


yeah the lowest ss buyrate since 1997 was GREAT CHANGE. :troll


----------



## Cena rulz12345

markedfordeath said:


> i think it has a lot to do with how they've treated Bryan to be perfectly honest...people saw change finally coming, and then the WWE didn't want to give them change


yeah the lowest ss buyrate since 1997 was GREAT CHANGE. :troll
Rock got Mania 17, 27, 28, 29 with a much shorter career not to mention the 2 Manias before he came back didnt break 1 million mark.[/QUOTE]
did the rock had to face free ppv streams,crappy product,crapy economy,lack of me stars etc.......


----------



## WWE

Cena rulz12345 said:


> yeah the lowest ss buyrate since 1997 was GREAT CHANGE. :troll
> Rock got Mania 17, 27, 28, 29 with a much shorter career not to mention the 2 Manias before he came back didnt break 1 million mark.


did the rock had to face free ppv streams,crappy product,crapy economy,lack of me stars etc.......[/QUOTE]


Lowest buyrate since 1997? 

SS 2012 - Cena/Punk/Show
SS 2011 - Cena/Punk
SS 2010 - Nexus/Cena gang.....
SS 2009 - Cena/Orton
SS 2008 - Cena/Batista, but that wasn't main event, right?
SS 2007 - Cena/Orton
SS 2006 - Cena/Edge
SS 2005 - Cena/Jericho

:cena3


----------



## Londrick

Happenstan said:


> Not quite, there's a little more.
> 
> 
> 
> MNF plus World Series on Oct 28th = 24 million viewers.
> MNF on Nov 4th = 16 million viewers
> Authority and Big Show fans still trying to blame MNF for Nov 4th's lame ratings = Priceless


Pretty much. Might as well blame everything that's on when RAW is instead of facing the fact that this angle is flopping hard.


----------



## Jof

Happenstan said:


> Not quite, there's a little more.
> 
> 
> 
> MNF plus World Series on Oct 28th = 24 million viewers.
> MNF on Nov 4th = 16 million viewers
> Authority and Big Show fans still trying to blame MNF for Nov 4th's lame ratings = Priceless



Cable competetion usually hurts them bad. This is evident whenever MNF viewership goes up, RAW numbers fall. Last week the 10 million MNF viewership is what actually pulled RAW down from hitting that 3.0+ rating, not the world series viewership. Plus, last week was post-PPV RAW with two top title changes the previous night leading to the show, you can't compare that with this week's weak episode. You're blaming Big Show/Authority for the 2.7 rating when the main event wasn't even addressed until after 10, yes they had bunch of recaps and "exhibits" but the Show/Authortity promo segment actual push happened only a few minutes before the closing seg, when Big show demanded they meet in the ring instead of the office.

Besides, if you're going to compare with last week, then Cena/Sandow match last week opened to strong first hour viewership of 4.3 million - largest since post mania RAW with male demo peak - huge lead-in to rest of the show. This week RAW opened to a barely above 4m viewership with a 32% drop in male demo, and guess who was involved? Punk and Daniel Bryan. Last week and this week's ME+OR both were focused on Big Show/Authority/Orton angle.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

> Lowest buyrate since 1997?
> 
> SS 2012 - Cena/Punk/Show
> SS 2011 - Cena/Punk
> SS 2010 - Nexus/Cena gang.....
> SS 2009 - Cena/Orton
> SS 2008 - Cena/Batista, but that wasn't main event, right?
> SS 2007 - Cena/Orton
> SS 2006 - Cena/Edge
> SS 2005 - Cena/Jericho
> 
> :cena3


what are you trying to say???
if you're saying THOSE are the ss matches that drew the lowest buyrate since ss1997 then you're wrong.


----------



## WWE

Cena rulz12345 said:


> Lowest buyrate since 1997?
> 
> SS 2012 - Cena/Punk/Show
> SS 2011 - Cena/Punk
> SS 2010 - Nexus/Cena gang.....
> SS 2009 - Cena/Orton
> SS 2008 - Cena/Batista, but that wasn't main event, right?
> SS 2007 - Cena/Orton
> SS 2006 - Cena/Edge
> SS 2005 - Cena/Jericho
> 
> :cena3


what are you trying to say???
if you're saying THOSE are the ss matches that drew the lowest buyrate since ss1997 then you're wrong.[/QUOTE]


Actually, no.

I'm just trying to imply that Cena is the main event for Summerslam :cena3

Cenarulz, ya'll :vince2


----------



## Cena rulz12345

^ oh ok, then :vince2 :vince2 :vince2 :vince2 :vince2


----------



## JY57

not sure if there will be quarter hour rating from PWTorch (for this week), I only see they have a new TNA quarter hourly rating for last week so far


----------



## Happenstan

Jof said:


> Besides, if you're going to compare with last week, then Cena/Sandow match last week opened to strong first hour viewership of 4.3 million - largest since post mania RAW with male demo peak - huge lead-in to rest of the show. This week RAW opened to a barely above 4m viewership with a 32% drop in male demo, and guess who was involved? Punk and Daniel Bryan. Last week and this week's ME+OR both were focused on Big Show/Authority/Orton angle.


No just Punk. Bryan was out there for 90 seconds max. As for the main event angle starting after 10...after all those recaps and talk ups that should make the failure of the final hour even worse. EVERYONE knew what and more specifically who was gonna end Raw and still the thing bombed. Not good. Not good at all.


----------



## THANOS

Happenstan said:


> No just Punk. Bryan was out there for 90 seconds max. As for the main event angle starting after 10...after all those recaps and talk ups that should make the failure of the final hour even worse. EVERYONE knew what and more specifically who was gonna end Raw and still the thing bombed. Not good. Not good at all.


Oh it's good alright. If that segment bombs and Punk/Harper with Bryan's run-in ends up as the high point of the show then it will certainly put a smile on my face.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

THANOS said:


> Oh it's good alright. If that segment bombs and Punk/Harper with Bryan's run-in ends up as the high point of the show then it will certainly put a smile on my face.


Bryan's run in was the most watched part of the entire Raw show. It got 1.571million viewers


----------



## JY57

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_74413.shtml



> If you felt like Monday's WWE Raw should have ended with the six-man tag match of John Cena & Rhodes Bros. vs. Real Americans & Damien Sandow at the end of the second hour, the key audience of males 18-49 felt the same way.
> 
> The standard portion of Raw peaked with a 2.06 m18-49 rating in Q9 for the conclusion of the six-man tag match at the top of the third hour, which would have been the over-run for a two-hour Raw.
> 
> After Q9, the rating dropped off to a 1.74 rating, 1.75 rating, and 1.81 rating to conclude the third hour. Raw then hit an over-run rating of 2.23 for the conclusion of "WWE: Law & Order" starring Triple H, Big Show, and The Authority. The over-run was the highest-rated portion of the show, but was below recent over-runs in October.
> 
> Raw Break Down - m18-49 demo
> 
> - Overall Show: 1.93 rating and 1.215 million viewers.
> 
> Q1: Raw opened above-average with a 2.03 rating for C.M. Punk vs. Luke Harper and one mid-match commercial.
> 
> Q2: Raw stayed above-average with a 2.04 rating for Punk-Wyatts post-match activity, one commercial, and non-wrestling segments following up on the open.
> 
> The post-match activity peaked with 1.571 million viewers at 8:16 p.m., which was the most-watched portion of the entire show.
> 
> Q3: Raw dropped to a 1.88 rating for Ryback vs. Great Khali, one commercial, and the first-half of Alberto Del Rio vs. Kofi Kingston.
> 
> Q4: Raw was about the same with a 1.89 rating for the end of Del Rio-Kofi, one commercial, and Randy Orton introduced for a talking and match segment.
> 
> Q5: Raw got a top-of-the-hour bump to a 2.04 rating for Orton's "Ravishing Rick Rude" promo, match with Big E. Langston, and one mid-match commercial.
> 
> Q6: Raw stayed above-average with a 2.00 rating for talking segments, one commercial, and Tyson Kidd's return match teaming with Natalya against Fandango and Summer Rae.
> 
> Q7: Raw dropped off to a 1.86 rating for more video reviews of WWE: Law & Order, John Cena's in-ring promo, and one commercial.
> 
> Q8: Raw fell to a 1.78 rating for the first-half of the Cena & Rhodes vs. Real Sandows six-man tag, plus one commercial.
> 
> Q9: Raw jumped 16 percent at the top of the hour to a 2.06 rating for the end of the six-man tag, one commercial, and a few minutes of WWE: Law & Order that set up a third hour slide.
> 
> Q10: Raw fell 16 percent to a show-low 1.74 rating for Curtis Axel vs. Dolph Ziggler, one commercial, and more legal business backstage.
> 
> Q11: Raw was about the same with a 1.75 rating for The Usos vs. 3MB, one commercial, and a Divas tag match.
> 
> Q12: Raw remained well below-average with a 1.81 rating for the first-half of the Big Show-Triple H lawsuit angle and two commercial breaks, including the awkward final commercial before the top of the hour.
> 
> Over-Run: Raw finished with a 2.23 rating for an 11-minute over-run segment concluding WWE: Law & Order.
> 
> The over-run could have delivered a better rating, but WWE lost the audience as the over-run went on. The over-run peaked with 1.485 million viewers at 11:01 p.m., was at 1.414 million viewers at 11:05 p.m., dipped below the 1.4-million-mark to 1.399 million viewers at 11:09 p.m., and went off the air with 1.250 million viewers at 11:11 p.m.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Best4Bidness said:


> Bryan's run in was the most watched part of the entire Raw show. It got 1.571million viewers


Daniel Bryan bringing DAT PEAK of the show.

:yes


----------



## Choke2Death

> Q5: Raw got a top-of-the-hour bump to a 2.04 rating for Orton's "Ravishing Rick Rude" promo, match with Big E. Langston, and one mid-match commercial.


----------



## WWE

> Q8: Raw fell to a 1.78 rating for the first-half of the Cena & Rhodes vs. Real Sandows six-man tag, plus one commercial.


Cena, Goldust, Rhodes, Sandow, Cesaro, and Swagger can't draw 8*D


----------



## Happenstan

THANOS said:


> Oh it's good alright. If that segment bombs and Punk/Harper with Bryan's run-in ends up as the high point of the show then it will certainly put a smile on my face.


Start smiling.

So the highest moment of the night was Bryan saving Punk while Big Slow/HHH/Orton bled viewers. I'm positively shocked. Who could have ever thought something like this would happen? 


If the overrun was bleeding viewers that bad during week 1 of Big Slow as top face, imagine where we'll be in a month. HHH vs Show most likely just got or will soon be cancelled.


----------



## MaybeLock

Cycloneon said:


> Cena, Goldust, Rhodes, Sandow, Cesaro, and Swagger can't draw 8*D



Rise above Ratings!


----------



## Waffelz

Cycloneon said:


> Cena, Goldust, Rhodes, Sandow, Cesaro, and Swagger can't draw 8*D


The match started at a weird time. No surprise that after the first commercial it jumped to 2.06. Plus, I don't think people expected it to be then, as it was originally scheduled for the Main Event.

Anyway: Vanilla Midgets donned it.

Edit: thats the males anyway, so its always gonna favour Bryan/Punk, I think. Shame we won't get the proper breakdown to see whats what.


----------



## Starbuck

Choke2Death said:


>


:lmao 

GOAT Orton smiley right there. 

Overrun highest rated segment of the night?

:show

:lol. The 18-49's obviously weren't interested but if the Observer releases a breakdown the gain will probably be substantial considering they jumped from 1.8 to 2.2. It'll probably be like that time one of the Orton/Bryan segments didn't appear to do too well from the Torch breakdown but then ended up gaining something like 600k or whatever it was. I guess it all depends on the skew and who you want to poke fun at lol. 

All the main segments did well though outside the 18-49's tuning out at the end. I guess that means it's pick on Big Show this week. 

DAT BIG SHOW BABYFACE IN PERIL KILLING DEM 18-49's


----------



## Sonnen Says

> Q1: Raw opened above-average with a 2.03 rating for C.M. Punk vs. Luke Harper and one mid-match commercial.
> 
> Q2: Raw stayed above-average with a 2.04 rating for Punk-Wyatts post-match activity, one commercial, and non-wrestling segments following up on the open.
> 
> *The post-match activity peaked with 1.571 million viewers at 8:16 p.m., which was the most-watched portion of the entire show. *


Punk/Bryan > all


----------



## TheStig

Does overrun get lump together with third hour? This was expected from the hour breakdowns reported earlier and if authority gets bad numbers next week then I don't know who will take the blame for probably ratings below 2,5's.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

> Q12: *Raw remained well below-average with a 1.81 rating for the first-half of the Big Show-Triple H lawsuit angle* and two commercial breaks, including the awkward final commercial before the top of the hour.
> 
> Over-Run: Raw finished with a 2.23 rating for an 11-minute over-run segment concluding WWE: Law & Order.
> 
> * The over-run could have delivered a better rating, but WWE lost the audience as the over-run went on.* The over-run peaked with 1.485 million viewers at 11:01 p.m., was at 1.414 million viewers at 11:05 p.m., dipped below the 1.4-million-mark to 1.399 million viewers at 11:09 p.m., and went off the air with 1.250 million viewers at 11:11 p.m.


:lmao


----------



## Gretchen

Cycloneon said:


> Cena, Cena, Cena, Cena, Cena, and Swagger can't draw 8*D


Fixed for you. :

unk5


----------



## Starbuck

I forgot to add that my Punk/Bryan prediction was correct.

unk...

Actually wait, Punk wrestled the match but the peak was when Bryan was out there for a whole minute.

:bryan > unk2 :cena2 :sandow :show rton2 :jpl


----------



## Londrick

Team Vanilla Midget doing good. 

lol @ the overrun losing viewers as time went on.

big E in one of the highest rated segments. Dude's a star.

Seems :bryan unk2 :cena4 and :langston2 need to get top billing for WM.

Good thing Kane's a big dude otherwise he'd get punished for the overrun.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Dat Big Blow is doing the Playboy Buddy Rose blow away diet for the demo. He is shedding 18-49 males at a GOAT rate.


----------



## Starbuck

BIG E. 

I was at a show last night and there was a definite connection between he and the fans. They popped hard for everything he did. Just watch people, Big E Langston vs. Roman Reigns will main event Wrestlemania before CM Punk or Daniel Bryan. 

:vince2


----------



## Choke2Death

No fun this week since Big Show is the only one leaving us with something to laugh at.


----------



## Starbuck

When a wrestler has no marks, all the other marks gang up and pick on him, enemies unite against a common enemy and this thread fails. 

In other news, at the same show I attended last night I reckon they tested out the potential finish to Orton/Show at Survivor Series. If that does end up happening we can expect the WHC to close a PPV for the first time in 3 years. 

:cena5


----------



## markedfordeath

so is Vince still blaming Bryan for all the failures of his company? the "vanilla midgets" gain viewers weekly and have for months and he has the gall to blame the small guys for loss of revenue? Unreal! the proof is in the pudding. Now we know the buyrates for Survivor Series, if they are more than zero, people are only ordering it for the Bryan/Punk match.....


----------



## MaybeLock

Starbuck said:


> When a wrestler has no marks, all the other marks gang up and pick on him, enemies unite against a common enemy and this thread fails.
> 
> In other news, at the same show I attended last night I reckon they tested out the potential finish to Orton/Show at Survivor Series. If that does end up happening we can expect the WHC to close a PPV for the first time in 3 years.
> 
> :cena5


Good Old Big Show bringing peace to this thread


----------



## checkcola

They've lost both the casuals and smarks with this Big Show mainevent push. That's a perfect storm. The mainevent angle was poorly constructed and one of the oddest things I have seen during my years of watching RAW. Lets see how long Triple H hitches his wagon to Big Show before something changes.


----------



## Starbuck

MaybeLock said:


> Good Old Big Show bringing peace to this thread


For 4 months Punk and Bryan marks have been at each others throats in here. It's taken Big Show 2 short weeks to make them best friends. 

:show


----------



## markedfordeath

I'm guessing there aren't going to be any Punk/Bryan mark wars for several months eh? since they're working together probably until the end of the year. I'm guessing their segment on Smackdown tomorrow night will bring in the ratings too...I bet Vince is noticing but trying to ignore it.


----------



## Londrick

Starbuck said:


> BIG E.
> 
> I was at a show last night and there was a definite connection between he and the fans. They popped hard for everything he did. Just watch people, Big E Langston vs. Roman Reigns will main event Wrestlemania before CM Punk or Daniel Bryan.
> 
> :vince2


They're gonna be tagging in the pre show while the big guys main event.



Starbuck said:


> For 4 months Punk and Bryan marks have been at each others throats in here. It's taken Big Show 2 short weeks to make them best friends.
> 
> :show


If he can do that he can bring world peace. Show for Nobel Prize 2014.


----------



## Alo0oy

> Q1: Raw opened above-average with a 2.03 rating for C.M. Punk vs. Luke Harper and one mid-match commercial.
> 
> Q2: Raw stayed above-average with a 2.04 rating for Punk-Wyatts post-match activity, one commercial, and non-wrestling segments following up on the open.
> 
> The post-match activity peaked with 1.571 million viewers at 8:16 p.m., which was the most-watched portion of the entire show.


unk :bryan



> Q5: Raw got a top-of-the-hour bump to a 2.04 rating for Orton's "Ravishing Rick Rude" promo, match with Big E. Langston, and one mid-match commercial.


rton2



> Q7: Raw dropped off to a 1.86 rating for more video reviews of WWE: Law & Order, John Cena's in-ring promo, and one commercial.
> 
> Q8: Raw fell to a 1.78 rating for the first-half of the Cena & Rhodes vs. Real Sandows six-man tag, plus one commercial.














> Q12: Raw remained well below-average with a 1.81 rating for the first-half of the Big Show-Triple H lawsuit angle and two commercial breaks, including the awkward final commercial before the top of the hour.
> 
> Over-Run: Raw finished with a 2.23 rating for an 11-minute over-run segment concluding WWE: Law & Order.


----------



## Happenstan

Starbuck said:


> For 4 months Punk and Bryan marks have been at each others throats in here. It's taken Big Show 2 short weeks to make them best friends.
> 
> :show


Let's not get carried away now. Here...

So the highest rated segment was Bryan saving Punk's ass? Art really does imitate life.


Better?



Big Show blows.


----------



## markedfordeath

this proves my theory that nobody cares about PPV....the evidence is in what the audience prefers to watch weekly....obviously they preferred Bryan in the main event angle, not the Big Show...can the WWE finally see this? If they are glued to their televisions watching Bryan's segments weekly, shouldn't that tell them that people are interested in him. ?


----------



## Alo0oy

I'm surprised nobody's talking about Cena losing viewers.

DAT draw. :cena3


----------



## superuser1

Q5: Raw got a top-of-the-hour bump to a 2.04 rating for Orton's "Ravishing Rick Rude" promo, match with Big E. Langston, and one mid-match commercial.


Randall bringing in dem ratingssss...goes to show again whenever he does something interesting and is not thrown into a random pointless match he always delivers.


----------



## Starbuck

Happenstan said:


> Let's not get carried away now. Here...
> 
> So the highest rated segment was Bryan saving Punk's ass? Art really does imitate life.
> 
> Better?
> 
> Big Show blows.


Most watched minute was the Bryan run in which only lasted a minute of course. Highest rated _segment _was..........the overrun!

:show

Punk and Bryan are BFF's on TV. Now their marks gotta be BFF's in the ratings thread. That's how it works. Just watch. If their seg does well they have to credit one so are crediting the other by default. This is the beginning of the Mega Small Man Alliance Power Trip.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Punk pulling a double win with two great quarters, starting the show off well (highest opener in a month and a half) and then being part of the highest viewed segment of the night. Bryan... well, his minute on-screen was the highest of the night.

Vanilla midgets win the night! unk2 :bryan

Orton did well too. 

Overrun wasn't the worst overrun, but it was one of the weaker ones post-Summerslam. :HHH :show :korporatekane


----------



## markedfordeath

I'm pretty sure its going to be like this every single Raw too. Building up that momentum for Royal Rumble...my Royal Rumble fantasy: Punk and Bryan landing on the ground at the same time, co winners ala Bret Hart and Luger.


----------



## superuser1

markedfordeath said:


> I'm pretty sure its going to be like this every single Raw too. Building up that momentum for Royal Rumble...my Royal Rumble fantasy: Punk and Bryan landing on the ground at the same time, co winners ala Bret Hart and Luger.


They'll be the final two thats for sure.


----------



## Londrick

They'll be landing on the ground at the same time for sure but it'll be cause Show double chokeslammed them out of the ring.

:show


----------



## markedfordeath

remember that reaction Punk and Bryan got at MITB when they were in the ring together? imagine if they were the last two in the Rumble! holy shit!


----------



## THANOS

Best4Bidness said:


> Bryan's run in was the most watched part of the entire Raw show. It got 1.571million viewers


:bryan



JY57 said:


> http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_74413.shtml
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *If you felt like Monday's WWE Raw should have ended with the six-man tag match of John Cena & Rhodes Bros. vs. Real Americans & Damien Sandow at the end of the second hour, the key audience of males 18-49 felt the same way.*
> 
> The standard portion of Raw peaked with a 2.06 m18-49 rating in Q9 for the conclusion of the six-man tag match at the top of the third hour, which would have been the over-run for a two-hour Raw.
> 
> After Q9, the rating dropped off to a 1.74 rating, 1.75 rating, and 1.81 rating to conclude the third hour. Raw then hit an over-run rating of 2.23 for the conclusion of "WWE: Law & Order" starring Triple H, Big Show, and The Authority. The over-run was the highest-rated portion of the show, but was below recent over-runs in October.
> 
> Raw Break Down - m18-49 demo
> 
> - Overall Show: 1.93 rating and 1.215 million viewers.
> 
> *Q1: Raw opened above-average with a 2.03 rating for C.M. Punk vs. Luke Harper and one mid-match commercial.
> 
> Q2: Raw stayed above-average with a 2.04 rating for Punk-Wyatts post-match activity, one commercial, and non-wrestling segments following up on the open.*
> 
> unk
> 
> *The post-match activity peaked with 1.571 million viewers at 8:16 p.m., which was the most-watched portion of the entire show.*
> 
> :dazzler
> 
> *Q12: Raw remained well below-average with a 1.81 rating for the first-half of the Big Show-Triple H lawsuit angle and two commercial breaks, including the awkward final commercial before the top of the hour.
> 
> Over-Run: Raw finished with a 2.23 rating for an 11-minute over-run segment concluding WWE: Law & Order.*
Click to expand...




Mister WrestleMania said:


> Daniel Bryan bringing DAT PEAK of the show.
> 
> :yes


:bryan2


----------



## Waffelz

Alo0oy said:


> I'm surprised nobody's talking about Cena losing viewers.
> 
> DAT draw. :cena3


He didn't. And if we get a proper breakdown, I'll hedge a bet that its one of the most viewed if not the most.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Alo0oy said:


> I'm surprised nobody's talking about Cena losing viewers.
> 
> DAT draw. :cena3


lolCena.


----------



## THANOS

Waffelz said:


> He didn't. And if we get a proper breakdown, I'll hedge a bet that its one of the most viewed if not the most.


Uhhhh?



> *Q7: Raw dropped off to a 1.86 rating for* more video reviews of WWE: Law & Order, *John Cena's in-ring promo*, and one commercial.
> 
> *Q8: Raw fell to a 1.78 rating for the first-half of the Cena & Rhodes vs. Real Sandows six-man tag*, plus one commercial.


:austin3


----------



## Osize10

:vince3


----------



## markedfordeath

This goes to show you people are pissed off about the Bryan depush!! lets hear that outcry more and more each week.


----------



## Waffelz

THANOS said:


> Uhhhh?
> 
> 
> 
> :austin3


And what happened to that? It reached a 2.06 - higher than the beginning of the show. Fair enough if they lost viewers at the end of the match, but that was not the case.

By the time that match was over, they gained. It's like laughing at a team for conceding a goal, but they end up winning anyway.


----------



## Londrick

markedfordeath said:


> This goes to show you people are pissed off about the Bryan depush!! lets hear that outcry more and more each week.


You should make a petition. https://www.change.org/


----------



## SerapisLiber

Starbuck said:


> For 4 months Punk and Bryan marks have been at each others throats in here. It's taken Big Show 2 short weeks to make them best friends.
> 
> :show


LOL, I'd rep you again if I could.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

THANOS said:


> Uhhhh?
> 
> 
> 
> :austin3


:lol

Jawn Seena losing dem viewers.


----------



## markedfordeath

its astounding how many people are upset, so many writers writing articles about it and how uncool it is that he's cast aside. The fact that they pushed him aside after one pay per view disappointment, just shows that they never intended him to be at the top. Because if they truly liked him in his current role, they would have changed things around so that his booking was way better and made corrections instead of kicking him out of it altogether. So that says everything right there, that they didn't want to have him on the top so this is their excuse. Of course you can make the same argument with Punk, he's once again not moving up to the championship picture either, and they stuck him with the Wyatts too, maybe they're both being punished. no worries, its the only angle people care about now, such a fucking punishment WWE, its keeping them the most popular..I bet its the only reason why people watch Smackdown this week too.


----------



## Londrick

https://www.change.org/petitions/ww...ck-on-daniel-bryan-and-give-him-lengthy-reign

Everyone please sign this.


----------



## markedfordeath

I signed it! do you think it'll make a difference?


----------



## SerapisLiber

markedfordeath said:


> The fact that they pushed him aside after one pay per view disappointment, just shows that they never intended him to be at the top.


People here were saying that Meltzer reported before SummerSlam that Big Show and Orton was planned down that road and, well, here we are. So yes, they indeed had no intention of keeping Bryan in the main event, and this explains the booking of the Bryan-Orton feud.


----------



## Waffelz

Mister WrestleMania said:


> :lol
> 
> Jawn Seena losing dem viewers.


No. And if we get a breakdown, it will no doubt show at the end of the tag match that it drew the most viewers sadly.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Waffelz said:


> No. And if we get a breakdown, it will no doubt show at the end of the tag match that it drew the most viewers sadly.





> Q7: *Raw dropped off to a 1.86 rating* for more video reviews of WWE: Law & Order, *John Cena's in-ring promo*, and one commercial.
> 
> Q8: *Raw fell to a 1.78 rating for the first-half of the Cena *& Rhodes vs. Real Sandows six-man tag, plus one commercial.


Yes.


----------



## Waffelz

Are you dense? Or are you just 12 years old? What rating was it once the match was over? 2.06. Higher than the opening of the show.


----------



## Choke2Death

> Q9: *Raw jumped 16 percent at the top of the hour to a 2.06 rating for the end of the six-man tag*, one commercial, and a few minutes of WWE: Law & Order that set up a third hour slide.


At least be consistent.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

fpalm

Both Cena segments LOST viewers from the previous segments. The viewers didn't gain from the previous segments, or even stay the same. BOTH Cena segments LOST viewers from the previous segments.


----------



## SPCDRI

More scientific evidence that Cena is done as a draw.

NO FUCKS GIVEN.


----------



## Waffelz

What do you mean both segments lost? So Cena was just involved in half of the match, yeah? I'll answer that for you - no, he wasn't. How on earth can you list the 1.78 rating for the match, but miss out on the end figure of 2.06.

How old are you?


----------



## #Mark

Dat Mini Powers Alliance bringing in the highest viewership :bryan2 unk 



> Q12: Raw remained well below-average with a 1.81 rating for the first-half of the Big Show-Triple H lawsuit angle and two commercial breaks, including the awkward final commercial before the top of the hour. The over-run could have delivered a better rating, but WWE lost the audience as the over-run went on.


 :trips2


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Waffelz said:


> What do you mean both segments lost? So Cena was just involved in half of the match, yeah? I'll answer that for you - no, he wasn't. How on earth can you list the 1.78 rating for the match, but miss out on the end figure of 2.06.
> 
> How old are you?


I guarantee that I'm older than some Cena fanboy.

Again, for those who can't read:

Q7: Raw *dropped* off to a 1.86 rating for more video reviews of WWE: Law & Order, John Cena's in-ring promo, and one commercial.

Q8: Raw *fell* to a 1.78 rating for the first-half of the Cena & Rhodes vs. Real Sandows six-man tag, plus one commercial. 

"Dropped" and "Fell" for the two Cena segments, including his in-ring promo. You'd think a guy who has been pushed like God for almost 10 years can do alittle bit better than that. And his segments in comparison to anyother talent on the show shouldn't even be close, considering his push dwarfs anyother wrestler's push.

Cry me some more of those tears. They taste delicious.

:cena4


----------



## WWE

Londrick said:


> https://www.change.org/petitions/ww...ck-on-daniel-bryan-and-give-him-lengthy-reign
> 
> Everyone please sign this.


:ti nah


----------



## crazybeats

I know it doesn't sound nice but it's for the best guys. WWE needs to hit rock bottom before it gets better. Getting crap ratings is one way of doing it. I hope the audience keeps tuning out every week. It needs to happen in order for changes to be made.


----------



## Waffelz

I don't care if he lost viewers at the start, the main thing is they were all there at the end. I think people would have tuned out as the match was scheduled for the main event at first, so were just expecting a promo on Cancer.

I'm not a John Cena fan boy. Give me Antonio Cesaro, Cm Punk, Daniel Bryan anyday of the week before him.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Waffelz said:


> I don't care if he lost viewers at the start, the main thing is they were all there at the end. I think people would have tuned out as the match was scheduled for the main event at first, so were just expecting a promo on Cancer.
> 
> I'm not a John Cena fan boy. Give me Antonio Cesaro, Cm Punk, Daniel Bryan anyday of the week before him.


Well, alright. You don't have to care if he lost viewers at the start of the match, and his in-ring promo. But I'm sure WWE cares (not that they will do anything to the golden gir..er boy), and we care. Bravo to one of his segments getting an increase.


----------



## JY57

It will be interesting to see how the main event did in *total *viewers and what the gain was (If Metzler puts it out next week). This was the Main Event & Over-Run of last year (11/5/12) for a taped show :



> The main event with John Cena and Ryback vs. Punk and Ziggler gained 1,084,000 viewers for a 3.22 overrun – good numbers for the main event.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Man, it feels like forever ago since Punk was a heel in that tag match last year. Like, longer than a year.


----------



## Alo0oy

Time to move on to a new target. :cena4










Interest in Cena is at its lowest since February 2009 when he was playing second fiddle to Triple H & Randy Orton, face it, people don't give a shit about him anymore, especially when rton2 & :trips2 occupy the main storyline.


----------



## crazybeats

I'd say give me entertainment before wrestling anyday of the week. When you watch wrestling you are supposed to see characters and storys you care about. The reason for that is the majority of what you see would never happen in the real world. Gimmick matches, relationships, cheesy acting, over the top violence, that's pro wrestling.


The ratings show what fans have known and done for decades. The worst thing you can do on a wrestling TV show is show wrestling all the way through it. The majority of viewers watching couldn't care less about 10 minute tv matches and 15 minute main event segments. Thank God they're tuning out and ratings are so low now, of course they don't matter because WWE makes money in other ways but my God.......those ratings are nothing to brag about. If that was any other TV show it would be hanging in the balance right now. Other TV shows live and die on their ratings, they NEED to put out good TV each week. WWE is just on a free ride, the only people that watch or care about WWE are its die hard fans and any real sports fan would be watching football on a Monday and any real TV fan would be watching one of the many great TV shows on network/cable on Monday nights.


----------



## markedfordeath

it just occurred to me, that this whole Authority angle was set up for John Cena to get cheered..they went to all of this trouble to get people to cheer him. their theory is that he'll save the day and then after that nobody will boo him the rest of his career....


----------



## THANOS

Choke2Death said:


> At least be consistent.


Yes but that wasn't the highest point in the show, they already said Bryan's run-in was, clearly others need to be consistent as well :argh:.


----------



## crazybeats

Of course that is what it's for but the truth is,



fans are sick of John Cena and casual viewers? Hate on me if you will but I think if a casual viewer sees John Cena in the ring talking they would find it insulting. You couldn't believe he was angry or sad or get any feeling from him. In some ways John Cena is like a big red flag pointing out to you that wrestling is fake. If anyone proves wrestling is fake it's JOhn Cena. A non fan would laugh at it, they would ridicule you for watching it. When Triple H and Randy Orton are on screen they look the part and talk the part. Dare I say it....they're like real men. Real men that are strong and confident, very masculine. I'm trying hard to put it into words but they have a legitimacy about them, something John Cena never had. With Triple H and Randy Orton you believe they could hurt you. You want to be like them, you respect their work in the ring, how they look, you can admire them and I believe all fans are like that. I think all fans watch wrestling and wish they had bodies like that and could be confident speakers, you do it don't you? But we're all too lazy to go and do something about it. 

I think casual fans and regular fans can't relate that way to John Cena. There's just nothing threatening about him at all and he's so clean cut, the all American boy. Really he should be a Baseball coach or something lol. Wrestling? You don't believe he could ever hurt anyone or that any emotion he has is genuine, even when he's happy and smiling there's always that tone with him that it's very sly and showbiz, there's something not quite right,it's never heartfelt. It's insulting really and like I say it kind of exposes the business. It does bring down some of the other characters and storys, where they can really make you buy into it and believe. That's the magic we all want. We all want to believe again and the sad thing about it is I think WWE doesn't want that. WWE would rather you knew it was all fake and phony and it's just a TV show and we support charity and we all sing Xmas carols every year and they're killing their own credibility.


----------



## validreasoning

crazybeats said:


> *If that was any other TV show it would be hanging in the balance right now. *Other TV shows live and die on their ratings, they NEED to put out good TV each week. WWE is just on a free ride, the only people that watch or care about WWE are its die hard fans and any real sports fan would be watching football on a Monday and any real TV fan would be watching one of the many great TV shows on network/cable on Monday nights.


99.99% of shows on cable would kill for wwes numbers. there are over 20,000 shows broadcast on cable each week and raw gets into the top 10-15 most watched of the week almost every single week of the year. and this for a show thats been on the air 21 years non-stop.

thats last weeks numbers, the only thing beating them is the nfl, walking dead and the opening game of the nba season


----------



## Choke2Death

THANOS said:


> Yes but that wasn't the highest point in the show, they already said Bryan's run-in was, clearly others need to be consistent as well :argh:.


I wasn't talking about that. I was mainly focusing on the fact that viewership DID increase for the Cena match towards the end but Cena haters refuse to acknowledge it.


----------



## Happenstan

validreasoning said:


> *99.99% of shows on cable would kill for wwes numbers*. there are over 20,000 shows broadcast on cable each week and raw gets into the top 10-15 most watched of the week almost every single week of the year. and this for a show thats been on the air 21 years non-stop.
> 
> thats last weeks numbers, the only thing beating them is the nfl, walking dead and the opening game of the nba season


Not if those numbers were accompanied by WWE's weekly expenses. TV shows don't have the alternate revenue streams like merch and PPVs like WWE does.


----------



## markedfordeath

WWE will continue to force feed us guys they want us to like instead of going with the guy we pick, and then they'll wonder why they went under.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Alo0oy said:


> Time to move on to a new target. :cena4
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interest in Cena is at its lowest since February 2009 when he was playing second fiddle to Triple H & Randy Orton, face it, people don't give a shit about him anymore, especially when rton2 & :trips2 occupy the main storyline.


Losing to that garden gnome at Summerslam has damaged Cena's credibility. Aha! IT'S BRYAN'S FAULT!!! :vince5


----------



## markedfordeath

its funny how management now thinks Bryan is "too small" and "too average", yet they had him headline four straight ppvs and main event Raws as well. They could have brought in Big Show in after Battleground instead, but they surely stayed with Bryan all the way until late October. Guess for a "too average" of a guy, they sure gave him the spotlight a lot. So its just confusing. not to mention the report that came out saying they made him a star and made it look like he can be a legit threat to anyone, yet after that report now they think he's too small and too average....which one is it WWE? is he a star that is a legit threat to win against anyone, or is he too small and too average? so many reports.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

still did'nt beat cena/sandow rton2


----------



## BOOTS 2 ASSES

markedfordeath said:


> its funny how management now thinks Bryan is "too small" and "too average", yet they had him headline four straight ppvs and main event Raws as well. They could have brought in Big Show in after Battleground instead, but they surely stayed with Bryan all the way until late October. Guess for a "too average" of a guy, they sure gave him the spotlight a lot. So its just confusing. not to mention the report that came out saying they made him a star and made it look like he can be a legit threat to anyone, yet after that report now they think he's too small and too average....which one is it WWE? is he a star that is a legit threat to win against anyone, or is he too small and too average? so many reports.


Agreed.However surprisingly Vince has amazing faith in both Orton/Punk.And now I can foresee the year 2014 belonging to CM Punk after turbulent 2013.

What could be the reason according to you?


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Alo0oy said:


> Time to move on to a new target. :cena4
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interest in Cena is at its lowest since February 2009 when he was playing second fiddle to Triple H & Randy Orton, face it, people don't give a shit about him anymore, especially when rton2 & :trips2 occupy the main storyline.


but still ppl had more intrest in cena than punk or bryan.
just trend it.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Cena rulz12345 said:


> but still ppl had more intrest in cena than punk or bryan.
> just trend it.


Because he's the top guy for 9 years now and the one who went against the biggest stars in those years (Defeated them too). You make a big deal out of anything just to put Cena over anyone. You can't compare the guys/opportunities that Cena had with what Punk and Bryan had. They work hard to earn it not so much for Cena.


----------



## SerapisLiber

Why'd all the blame go to Bryan though? Orton was there through the whole ordeal, and yet he's still in the main event. If they claim people want spectacles like Big Show, then put Big Show against Bryan. It's just as unrealistic as Orton beating Big Show, so the "believability" criticism fails.


----------



## etched Chaos

Cena rulz12345 said:


> but still ppl had more intrest in cena than punk or bryan.
> just trend it.


I trended the Rock as well, guess what? Cena lost.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Sonnen Says said:


> Because he's the top guy for 9 years now and the one who went against the biggest stars in those years (Defeated them too). You make a big deal out of anything just to put Cena over anyone. You can't compare the guys/opportunities that Cena had with what Punk and Bryan had. They work hard to earn it not so much for Cena.


and You make a big deal out of anything just to bury Cena over anyone and btw if we just talk about punk2011 and db2013,he was still ahead of them despite both of them being redhot in those years.



etched Chaos said:


> I trended the Rock as well, guess what? Cena lost.


fpalm you do know that rock has millions other fans in movies as well.
so that's NOT A FAIR COMPARISON.


----------



## Choke2Death

SerapisLiber said:


> Why'd all the blame go to Bryan though? Orton was there through the whole ordeal, and yet he's still in the main event. If they claim people want spectacles like Big Show, then put Big Show against Bryan. It's just as unrealistic as Orton beating Big Show, so the "believability" criticism fails.


Orton is taller, though. Plus he's the heel and heels use more underhanded tactics than sympathetic faces.


----------



## John Cena forever

"Rock" as in rock music/rock bands or rock(stone) are counted as The Rock. Here is a more accurate chart.


----------



## John Cena forever

John Cena > everyone


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I trend more than John Cena.


----------



## etched Chaos

John Cena forever said:


> "Rock" as in rock music/rock bands or rock(stone) are counted as The Rock. Here is a more accurate chart.


Uh no they're not, I did a trend with just rock vs. John Cena and it was even more extreme than using 'The Rock'. So no, Cena does not win.


----------



## John Cena forever

For example, 

The Beatles, greatest "rock" band in "the" world gives concert in China. 

This will be counted as The Rock because both words(the and rock) are in the phrase. Absolutely nothing to do with The Rock (actor/wrestler) lol!


----------



## etched Chaos

John Cena forever said:


> For example,
> 
> The Beatles, greatest "rock" band in "the" world gives concert in China.
> 
> This will be counted as The Rock because both words(the and rock) are in the phrase. Absolutely nothing to do with The Rock (actor/wrestler) lol!


Again, this is not how it works. If rock counted under the adage 'the rock' then using rock as trend wouldn't give a result 10 times bigger than 'The Rock'.


----------



## Choke2Death

Using quotation marks while searching gives a more accurate response.


----------



## John Cena forever

LOL

Only the word "Rock" is related to millions things.

Justin Bieber and Usher "rock" during concert. Only "rock" is used.


----------



## etched Chaos

Choke2Death said:


> Using quotation marks while searching gives a more accurate response.


The Rock still wins.


----------



## John Cena forever

John Cena trended less for the past weeks because of his injury. It will go back to normal level in a few weeks.

John Cena beat Rock in late 2012 and is miles ahead of everyone else.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

John Cena forever said:


> "Rock" as in rock music/rock bands or rock(stone) are counted as The Rock. Here is a more accurate chart.





John Cena forever said:


> John Cena > everyone


:ti
john cena>EVERYONE


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Too much stupid.


----------



## Alo0oy

John Cena forever said:


> "Rock" as in rock music/rock bands or rock(stone) are counted as The Rock. Here is a more accurate chart.


Nobody uses "Dwayne Johnson" when searching for The Rock. fpalm


----------



## Fanboi101

John Cena forever said:


> For example,
> 
> The Beatles, greatest "rock" band in "the" world gives concert in China.
> 
> This will be counted as The Rock because both words(the and rock) are in the phrase. Absolutely nothing to do with The Rock (actor/wrestler) lol!



Male John Cena fans that are 16 or older remind me of the 45 year old creepy guy at a club full of college students. They don't belong and make other people uncomfortable. You're free to like whoever you want to like but at some point doesn't feel weird being the only one in the room who is not a little kid or a screaming fan girl?

John Cena is like the power rangers, Barney or the teletubbies... you might like them when you are young and easily entertained but when you get smarter, grow up, and require more than bright colours to be entertained, most people would move on.


----------



## THANOS

Fanboi101 said:


> Male John Cena fans that are 16 or older remind me of the 45 year old creepy guy at a club full of college students. They don't belong and make other people uncomfortable. You're free to like whoever you want to like but at some point doesn't feel weird being the only one in the room who is not a little kid or a screaming fan girl?
> 
> John Cena is like the power rangers, Barney or the teletubbies... you might like them when you are young and easily entertained but when you get smarter, grow up, and require more than bright colours to be entertained, most people would move on.


:clap well done! They should feel embarrassed.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

^ feel embarrassed :ti
hogan marks don't,so we don't as well.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Hogan actually had the nuts to turn heel at some point in his career and add some type of new dimension to his character.


----------



## THANOS

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Hogan actually had the nuts to turn heel at some point in his career and add some type of new dimension to his character.


This most definitely. :hogan2


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Nothing wrong with being an adult Cena fan. But being one just to try and piss people off is LOLworthy.


----------



## Alo0oy

swagger_ROCKS said:


> Nothing wrong with being an adult Cena fan. But being one just to try and piss people off is LOLworthy.


I agree, just like there's nothing wrong with being an adult Barney the dinosaur fan. :lol


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Alo0oy said:


> I agree, just like there's nothing wrong with being an adult Barney the dinosaur fan. :lol


Barney wishes he could change colours like :cena3


----------



## Alo0oy

swagger_ROCKS said:


> Barney wishes he could change colours like :cena3


But I'm pretty sure if you put him in the ring he'd botch a lot less.


----------



## Gretchen

I sometimes find myself wondering what adult Cena fans see in him, but that's their deal. If an adult likes Cena, so be it. As long as any fan on here makes logical, coherent posts, I don't really care who he/she likes.


----------



## THANOS

Alo0oy said:


> But I'm pretty sure if you put him in the ring he'd botch a lot less.


And probably sell a lot better as well :. Hell, even Barney turned heel at one point.


----------



## Alo0oy

THANOS said:


> And probably sell a lot better as well :. Hell, even Barney turned heel at one point.


Dat heel Barney. :lmao :lmao


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Rhodes_For_WHC said:


> I sometimes find myself wondering what adult Cena fans see in him, but that's their deal. If an adult likes Cena, so be it. As long as any fan on here makes logical, coherent posts, I don't really care who he/she likes.


Reminds me when I was at MANIA 29 and Cena won the ME and when we were leaving the arena some adult Cena fan was trolling everybody saying "WHAT'S WRONG GUYS? AREN'T YOU HAPPY CENA WON?". and going on and on.


----------



## Gretchen

swagger_ROCKS said:


> Reminds me when I was at MANIA 29 and Cena won the ME and when we were leaving the arena some adult Cena fan was trolling everybody saying "WHAT'S WRONG GUYS? AREN'T YOU HAPPY CENA WON?". and going on and on.


:cena5

But, yeah, he was probably just a trolling Cena mark trying to stick it to all the disappointed smarks. Must have been really annoying.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Rhodes_For_WHC said:


> :cena5
> 
> But, yeah, he was probably just a trolling Cena mark trying to stick it to all the disappointed smarks. Must have been really annoying.


Was a chuckle at first, but at some point you could see he was trying too hard. lol


----------



## etched Chaos

I always imagine that an adult Cena fan is a Justin Bieber fan too - wearing those pink sweatbands to better mingle with the Bieber fangirls at his concerts.


----------



## markedfordeath

i'm sure Bryan will still rock it in the mid card and continue to have an excellent career. He'll kick some major ass and steal the show some nights probably. At least all the pressure is off of him now. Not his fault he's short.


----------



## RandomLurker




----------



## krai999

this google trend thing is so stupid


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Opening this thread and seeing all of these graphs, I feel like I'm reading a 5th grade Math textbook or something. Jesus.


----------



## Happenstan

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Hogan actually had the nuts to turn heel at some point in his career and add some type of new dimension to his character.


Well this is a bit of revisionist history. Hogan turned because Hulkamania was causing every (then) WCW fan to puke and/or change the channel. Hogan didn't turn cause he had "nuts", he turned because he had no other option if he wanted to remain relevant.


----------



## markedfordeath

hey, I was at that Royal Rumble, where Shawn nipped up just like that gif shows..what a match!


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Happenstan said:


> Well this is a bit of revisionist history. Hogan turned because Hulkamania was causing every (then) WCW fan to puke and/or change the channel. Hogan didn't turn cause he had "nuts", he turned because he had no other option if he wanted to remain relevant.


Still took a lot of nuts to do. The guy was the biggest name in the history of the business and was still making a ton of money. Yes, he wasn't getting the same pops he was getting in his prime, but he was still a huge name. If the heel turn flopped, he would have been even worse off, then what does he do? It was no where near a guarantee that the heel turn was going to work. As a matter of fact, Hogan was very nervous about making that decision and it took a lot of convincing.


----------



## markedfordeath

I still think they're turning Cena heel in 2014.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Hogan actually had the nuts to turn heel at some point in his career and add some type of new dimension to his character.


Except turning heel wasn't Hogan's idea, it was Bischoff's. If I remember correctly, Hogan was nervous as hell about turning heel and didn't want to do it because of the negative backlash he was going to receive from the crowd that night.


----------



## Gretchen

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Opening this thread and seeing all of these graphs, I feel like I'm reading a 5th grade Math textbook or something. Jesus.


Exactly. One person posts one of these trend graphs, then 20 more people hop on, and we have one or two per each page, now.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

TheGMofGods said:


> Except turning heel wasn't Hogan's idea, it was Bischoff's. If I remember correctly, Hogan was nervous as hell about turning heel and didn't want to do it because of the negative backlash he was going to receive from the crowd that night.


I know. That's exactly what I said in my very next post. He needed to be convinced by Bischoff. He was worried. It was far from a gimme that the heel turn was going to work. Here's my post:



> Still took a lot of nuts to do. The guy was the biggest name in the history of the business and was still making a ton of money. Yes, he wasn't getting the same pops he was getting in his prime, but he was still a huge name. If the heel turn flopped, he would have been even worse off, then what does he do? It was no where near a guarantee that the heel turn was going to work. As a matter of fact, *Hogan was very nervous about making that decision and it took a lot of convincing*.


----------



## Nathan Grey

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Still took a lot of nuts to do. The guy was the biggest name in the history of the business and was still making a ton of money. Yes, he wasn't getting the same pops he was getting in his prime, but he was still a huge name. If the heel turn flopped, he would have been even worse off, then what does he do? It was no where near a guarantee that the heel turn was going to work. As a matter of fact, Hogan was very nervous about making that decision and it took a lot of convincing.


Everything about the Hogan heel turn was magical. Hall and Nash did their job...they had you believing it was gonna be the WWF vs WCW. That was the hook. That was the scheme and the deception that got it SO BIG. When Hogan turned and did probably the best promo of his LIFE and did it LIVE like that....hit all the big points and just put over the angle and how it came off so perfectly since he came from NY and the WWF in the first place..it was guaranteed money. Trash hit that ring and you KNEW it was untouchable as you watched it. 

It's true. Hogan didn't want to get on board but took a chance and it paid off. And of course you know him...you'll never hear the end of it since it was so successful. But of course he's responsible for some horrible shit too. Like the end of the Sting match at Starrcade 97, the Warrior debacle, and the fingerpoke of Doom that practically killed WCW and is why we are stuck with this abomination pretending to be a true all time great with his bright shirts and using cancer patients in promos to defend himself against criticism.


----------



## Starbuck

RandomLurker said:


>


:lmao

The fuck is happening in this thread? Punk and Bryan are boyfriends and all of a sudden nobody has anything to fight about. 

FUCK SAKE VINCE YOU RUINED OUR THREAD GOD DAMMIT

:vince5


----------



## MaybeLock

Porn is a draw. He should be WWE Champ at WM XXX


----------



## napalmdestruction

MaybeLock said:


> Porn is a draw. He should be WWE Champ at WM XXX


very fitting.


----------



## Annihilus

This thread got stupid.. lets get back to talking about ratings. The word is WWE is now going to focus on pushing bigger guys thinking they're more of an attraction, yet that segment with the Big Show at the end of Raw lost significant ratings:

_Raw viewership peaked during the first hour, drawing 4.069 million viewers. The second hour drew 3.951 million viewers, before plunging to 3.643 million in the third and final hour featuring a confrontation between the power couple and "The World's Largest Athlete._

At least 1 in 10 people watching Raw changed the channel for the Big Show/McMahons segment, thats whats best for business?


----------



## SPCDRI

Rhodes_For_WHC said:


> Exactly. One person posts one of these trend graphs, then 20 more people hop on, and we have one or two per each page, now.


TREND GRAPHS ARE A DRAW. Trend Graph should unify the belts at WM 30.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Alo0oy said:


> I agree, just like there's nothing wrong with being an adult Barney the dinosaur fan. :lol


atleast that dinosaur is a household name and lightyears ahead of your fav wrestlers.


Starbuck said:


> :lmao
> 
> The fuck is happening in this thread? Punk and Bryan are boyfriends and all of a sudden nobody has anything to fight about.
> 
> FUCK SAKE VINCE YOU RUINED OUR THREAD GOD DAMMIT
> 
> :vince5


DAMN SURE HE DID.


Happenstan said:


> Well this is a bit of revisionist history. Hogan turned because Hulkamania was causing every (then) WCW fan to puke and/or change the channel. Hogan didn't turn cause he had "nuts", he turned because he had no other option if he wanted to remain relevant.


yes and also because he was'nt drawing at all.
IF there comes a day when cena is completly "hogan'ed" then vince also would'nt have any choice but to turn cena heel.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Starbuck said:


> :lmao
> 
> The fuck is happening in this thread? Punk and Bryan are boyfriends and all of a sudden nobody has anything to fight about.


I'm surprised. I would've bet that Punk and Bryan die-hard marks would still be fighting over who's responsible for the numbers they got.

I must say, I'm impressed! 










... well, with those who would bicker about that every single week.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Even if Cena stopped "drawing," I fully believe he and/or Vince still wouldn't have the guts to turn him heel. Like Cena said, "it's not in him to be a heel." Don't shoot the messenger. He said it, not me.


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> I'm surprised. I would've bet that Punk and Bryan die-hard marks would still be fighting over who's responsible for the numbers they got.
> 
> I must say, I'm impressed!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... well, with those who would bicker about that every single week.



Just wait. This week that was easy to determine. The exact moment of Bryan coming out for the save got a bigger number than Punk's entire match did so Bryan won this week. It was easy to figure out. Wait until they are both out there for the exact same moment and length of time for the entire night and then the fighting will begin no doubt.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Happenstan said:


> Just wait. This week that was easy to determine. The exact moment of Bryan coming out for the save got a bigger number than Punk's entire match did so Bryan won this week. It was easy to figure out. Wait until they are both out there for the exact same moment and length of time for the entire night and then the fighting will begin no doubt.


Bryan's moment peaked the night, but Punk's match set the stage and started out the show high and was close enough to the peak number based on the ratings, so really, it was both of them.


----------



## Gretchen

Happenstan said:


> Just wait. This week that was easy to determine. *The exact moment of Bryan coming out for the save got a bigger number than Punk's entire match* did so Bryan won this week. It was easy to figure out. Wait until they are both out there for the exact same moment and length of time for the entire night and then the fighting will begin no doubt.


Maybe because people are more interested in post match shenanigans and run-ins than in meaningless matches?


----------



## fulcizombie

crazybeats said:


> Of course that is what it's for but the truth is,
> 
> 
> 
> fans are sick of John Cena and casual viewers? Hate on me if you will but I think if a casual viewer sees John Cena in the ring talking they would find it insulting. You couldn't believe he was angry or sad or get any feeling from him. In some ways John Cena is like a big red flag pointing out to you that wrestling is fake. If anyone proves wrestling is fake it's JOhn Cena. A non fan would laugh at it, they would ridicule you for watching it. When Triple H and Randy Orton are on screen they look the part and talk the part. Dare I say it....they're like real men. Real men that are strong and confident, very masculine. I'm trying hard to put it into words but they have a legitimacy about them, something John Cena never had. With Triple H and Randy Orton you believe they could hurt you. You want to be like them, you respect their work in the ring, how they look, you can admire them and I believe all fans are like that. I think all fans watch wrestling and wish they had bodies like that and could be confident speakers, you do it don't you? But we're all too lazy to go and do something about it.
> 
> I think casual fans and regular fans can't relate that way to John Cena. There's just nothing threatening about him at all and he's so clean cut, the all American boy. Really he should be a Baseball coach or something lol. Wrestling? You don't believe he could ever hurt anyone or that any emotion he has is genuine, even when he's happy and smiling there's always that tone with him that it's very sly and showbiz, there's something not quite right,it's never heartfelt. It's insulting really and like I say it kind of exposes the business. It does bring down some of the other characters and storys, where they can really make you buy into it and believe. That's the magic we all want. We all want to believe again and the sad thing about it is I think WWE doesn't want that. WWE would rather you knew it was all fake and phony and it's just a TV show and we support charity and we all sing Xmas carols every year and they're killing their own credibility.


Wow, what a great post :clap:clap


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

DAT :bryan moment.

DEM Vanilla Midges.


----------



## Londrick

Alo0oy said:


> But I'm pretty sure if you put him in the ring he'd botch a lot less.


Number of 5 star Cena matches: 1
Number of 5 star Orton matches: 0

:ti


----------



## etched Chaos

Londrick said:


> Number of 5 star Cena matches: 1
> Number of 5 star Orton matches: 0
> Number of 5 star Punk free Cena matches: 0
> 
> unk


Having a little fun .


----------



## Alo0oy

Londrick said:


> Number of 5 star Cena matches: 1
> Number of 5 star Orton matches: 0
> 
> :ti


Number of 5 star matches for The Rock: zero
Number of 5 star matches for Jericho: zero.
Number of 5 star matches for Kurt Angle: zero

Cena > Kurt Angle, Chris Jericho, The Rock, Randy Orton? :troll

EDIT: Meltzer rated Cena vs The Rock at WM29 3.5 stars. :lmao :lmao way to kill your credibility.


----------



## THANOS

Alo0oy said:


> Number of 5 star matches for The Rock: zero
> Number of 5 star matches for Jericho: zero.
> Number of 5 star matches for Kurt Angle: zero
> 
> Cena > Kurt Angle, Chris Jericho, The Rock, Randy Orton? :troll
> 
> EDIT: Meltzer rated Cena vs The Rock at WM29 3.5 stars. :lmao :lmao way to kill your credibility.


You could lump Bryan in there as well, since he hasn't had a 5 star match either .


----------



## Alo0oy

THANOS said:


> You could lump Bryan in there as well, since he hasn't had a 5 star match either .


Yup.

To think that Cena is in Daniel Bryan & Kurt Angle's league! :lmao :lmao

Cena fans amuse me. :lol


----------



## THANOS

Alo0oy said:


> Yup.
> 
> To think that Cena is in Daniel Bryan & Kurt Angle's league! :lmao :lmao
> 
> Cena fans amuse me. :lol


Agreed :lol. The biggest way to tell is to look at that archive that chronicles all the 4 star matches each wrestler has had in their careers. Both Bryan and Angle absolutely annihilate Cena in that regard and it isn't even close :lmao.

EDIT: Here's the site.


Bryan (26 ****+ matches)

Angle (48 ****+ matches)

Cena (22 ****+ matches)

I'm not sure if this includes everything, but Cena's total is quite interesting and much more impressive than I first thought.


----------



## Alo0oy

THANOS said:


> Agreed :lol. The biggest way to tell is to look at that archive that chronicles all the 4 star matches each wrestler has had in their careers. Both Bryan and Angle absolutely annihilate Cena in that regard and it isn't even close :lmao.


Weighted average for DB matches: 3.78
Angle: 3.57

Cena: 3.32 :lol

& even then I wouldn't put too much stock on Meltzer's opinion, since Cena has a higher average than Jericho, & to think that Cena is in Jericho's league is just fpalm


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Guys, this is the _TV_ Ratings thread, not the _star_ ratings thread. Take that shit somewhere else!


----------



## funnyfaces1

I would consider Cena to be on the same level as a wrestler as Rock and Angle. Come at me.


----------



## Alo0oy

The Sandrone said:


> Guys, this is the _TV_ Ratings thread, not the _star_ ratings thread. Take that shit somewhere else!


There's no activity this week, so might as well shit on Cena.

Dat 1.7 for Cena. :cena4


----------



## Alo0oy

funnyfaces1 said:


> I would consider Cena to be on the same level as a wrestler as Rock and *Angle*. Come at me.


----------



## THANOS

Alo0oy said:


> Weighted average for DB matches: 3.78
> Angle: 3.57
> 
> Cena: 3.32 :lol
> 
> & even then I wouldn't put too much stock on Meltzer's opinion, since Cena has a higher average than Jericho, & to think that Cena is in Jericho's league is just fpalm


Those weighted average numbers are quite interesting, and I guess that goes to show the quality you can expect the majority of time a specific wrestler steps in a ring.

Well Cena has had the opportunity of working with much better wrestlers than him most of the time, but I have to give him some credit still.


----------



## Alo0oy

THANOS said:


> Those weighted average numbers are quite interesting, and I guess that goes to show the quality you can expect the majority of time a specific wrestler steps in a ring.
> 
> Well Cena has had the opportunity of working with much better wrestlers than him most of the time, but I have to give him some credit still.


Cena's average is higher than Jericho, The Rock, Stone Cold, The Undertaker, & Triple H, & barely below Randy Orton & Chris Benoit.

Which is why I don't take a lot of what Meltzer says regarding match quality seriously.


----------



## THANOS

Alo0oy said:


> Cena's average is higher than Jericho, The Rock, Stone Cold, The Undertaker, & Triple H, & barely below Randy Orton & Chris Benoit.
> 
> Which is why I don't take a lot of what Meltzer says regarding match quality seriously.


Yeah and can see what you mean, but there are not too many ways out there to measure what constitutes a great wrestler using statistics. It would be interesting if we could find a way that can actually rate an individual wrestler with variables that can be directly assigned to their performance level.


----------



## Alo0oy

THANOS said:


> Yeah and can see what you mean, but there are not too many ways out there to measure what constitutes a great wrestler using statistics. It would be interesting if we could find a way that can actually rate an individual wrestler with variables that can be directly assigned to their performance level.


We can rate their actual ability instead of match quality.

We know that Cena is a terrible seller, sloppy in the ring, has poor grasp at ring psychology, & doesn't know a thing about chain wrestling, yet we still see a lot of great matches from him.

If you compare his ability to Jericho, Jericho has no weaknesses in the ring, he's a good seller, he's crisp, good ring psychology, great technical wrestler, & very athletic.

Cena might have had more great matches (I can only assume, via Meltzer's ratings), but most of the times its not because Cena is a better wrestler, but because he ALWAYS gets 20+ minutes on PPVs with great wrestlers, while Jericho gets short matches with less able wrestlers.


----------



## Sonnen Says

etched Chaos said:


> Having a little fun .


Actually Punk had a 5 star match with Joe.


----------



## Happenstan

The Sandrone said:


> Bryan's moment peaked the night, but Punk's match set the stage and started out the show high and was close enough to the peak number based on the ratings, so really, it was both of them.





Rhodes_For_WHC said:


> Maybe because people are more interested in post match shenanigans and run-ins than in meaningless matches?




Ok, I was wrong. Even something as straight forward as this brings excuses from Punk's fans. Just remember this you 2 when the quarter hours line up this precisely and show Punk winning the night in the future. I will. No claiming Punk carried the night then from either of you.


----------



## funnyfaces1

If you really want to watch a match devoid of any proper understanding of psychology, go watch Kurt Angle. 2001-2003 is the only time that I can consider him even close to elite in the ring, and he worked with the greatest talents in wrestling history (Austin, Undertaker, Lesnar, Benoit, Mysterio, Eddie). I don't think Angle would have been able to have great matches with the likes of Umaga and Bobby Lashley like Cena did.


----------



## etched Chaos

Sonnen Says said:


> Actually Punk had a 5 star match with Joe.


Uh, my joke went completely over your head. I referenced Cena's 5 star matches not including those against Punk... Not Punk's 5 star matches.


----------



## Alo0oy

funnyfaces1 said:


> If you really want to watch a match devoid of any proper understanding of psychology, go watch Kurt Angle. 2001-2003 is the only time that I can consider him even close to elite in the ring, and he worked with the greatest talents in wrestling history (Austin, Undertaker, Lesnar, Benoit, Mysterio, Eddie). I don't think Angle would have been able to have great matches with the likes of Umaga and Bobby Lashley like Cena did.


You cannot put "proper ring psychology" & Cena in the same sentence, because Cena is probably one of the worst main eventers when it comes to ring psychology, you see him clutching his arms one minute, & then carry someone or perform a submission with that very same arm a minute later.

We don't even have to look that far, his match with Sandow, he couldn't perform the STF on Sandow, five minutes later he put all his weight on the five knuckle shuffle...You call that good ring psychology?

EDIT: Or when he completely no sold Sandow's finisher in the tag match, I can point out Cena's flaws all day long if you want, even in his great matches, his matches are good despite his in-ring shenanigans, not because of them.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Happenstan said:


> Ok, I was wrong. Even something as straight forward as this brings excuses from Punk's fans. Just remember this you 2 when the quarter hours line up this precisely and show Punk winning the night in the future. I will. No claiming Punk carried the night then from either of you.


It would've been one thing if the Punk/Harper match started at like a 1.80 and then the rating bumped up to a 2.04 in the second quarter and it showed Bryan making the save getting the highest of the night. But from what I understand and from the looks of the breakdown, the bump due to Bryan wasn't THAT massive and the show started strong anyway. 

That being said, I won't deny that Bryan's moment got the biggest number of the night. It did, but it also helped how strong the show started. However I'm glad that happened as maybe it'll show WWE just how silly it was to take Bryan out of the main event. 

Hell, maybe they'll give this Punk and Bryan/Wyatts feud the main spotlight on next week's Raw.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Alo0oy said:


> Weighted average for DB matches: 3.78
> Angle: 3.57
> 
> Cena: 3.32 :lol
> 
> & even then I wouldn't put too much stock on Meltzer's opinion, since Cena has a higher average than Jericho, & to think that Cena is in Jericho's league is just fpalm


Tbf Meltzer rated some of Jericho matches 4.75 which is more than Cena. Cena never had a match rated above 4.5 except for one match which was MITB. Most of the matches that Meltzer rated for Cena are true.


----------



## #Mark

I agree, Cena is a better worker than Angle.. Angle is probably the most overrated worker of the past decade. Once he turned into the 'Wrestling Machine' his matches were devoid of any logic or psychology.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

funnyfaces1 said:


> If you really want to watch a match devoid of any proper understanding of psychology, go watch Kurt Angle. 2001-2003 is the only time that I can consider him even close to elite in the ring, and he worked with the greatest talents in wrestling history (Austin, Undertaker, Lesnar, Benoit, Mysterio, Eddie). I don't think Angle would have been able to have great matches with the likes of Umaga and Bobby Lashley like Cena did.


If this post isn't shit, I don't know what is.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

#Mark said:


> I agree, Cena is a better worker than Angle.. Angle is probably the most overrated worker of the past decade. Once he turned into the 'Wrestling Machine' his matches were devoid of any logic or psychology.


The problem with this is, Cena has always been lacking those things.


----------



## Choke2Death

Billion Dollar Man said:


> If this post isn't shit, I don't know what is.


Not really, he's right for the most part. Angle is extremely talented but if he leads a match, it will end up being a messy spotfest where finishers are hit for no reason at all and that's why I agree with the sentiment that Angle is overrated in the ring. He spams high impact moves and signatures too much so when they are hit you know it's not even a nearfall. For the worst of it, see his match with Jeff Hardy from No Surrender 2010.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

Choke2Death said:


> Not really, he's right for the most part. Angle is extremely talented but if he leads a match, it will end up being a messy spotfest where finishers are hit for no reason at all and that's why I agree with the sentiment that Angle is overrated in the ring. He spams high impact moves and signatures too much so when they are hit you know it's not even a nearfall. For the worst of it, see his match with Jeff Hardy from No Surrender 2010.


First couple of statements you made could also be used to describe Cena. Angle may get overrated( certainly not by me), but he's still better than Cena.


----------



## THANOS

Choke2Death said:


> Not really, he's right for the most part. Angle is extremely talented but if he leads a match, it will end up being a messy spotfest where finishers are hit for no reason at all and that's why I agree with the sentiment that Angle is overrated in the ring. He spams high impact moves and signatures too much so when they are hit you know it's not even a nearfall. For the worst of it, see his match with Jeff Hardy from No Surrender 2010.


Could not agree more. I like Angle but he doesn't create excellent stories in the ring unless he's with a superior ring general. Case in point, his matches with Nigel McGuiness (Desmond Wolfe).


----------



## Alo0oy

Choke2Death said:


> Not really, he's right for the most part. Angle is extremely talented but if he leads a match, it will end up being a messy spotfest where finishers are hit for no reason at all and that's why I agree with the sentiment that Angle is overrated in the ring. He spams high impact moves and signatures too much so when they are hit you know it's not even a nearfall. For the worst of it, see his match with Jeff Hardy from No Surrender 2010.


Despite Angle's flaws, he's still heads & shoulders above Cena in the ring, the only reason Cena has a lot of great matches is because he main evented sooo many PPVs (thus gets the longest time in the ring), Cena main evented 91 PPVs, the only wrestlers that are close are HHH with 92 & Undertaker with 86, nobody else is even close to that many main events.

What's really telling is the fact that a lot of wrestlers main evented less PPVs by a very wide margin but still have almost as many good matches as Cena (like Edge & Orton).


----------



## TheStig

Happenstan said:


> Ok, I was wrong. Even something as straight forward as this brings excuses from Punk's fans. Just remember this you 2 when the quarter hours line up this precisely and show Punk winning the night in the future. I will. No claiming Punk carried the night then from either of you.


It's actually common sense that you build it up and the idea is to get the peak at the end of the segment. To give credit to only punk or only bryan is missing the point. Without punk it wouldn't have build up to that level and this shows that fans are into this storyline. Bryan making a random apperance would not get that number and thus as logic prevails both get credit for the segment being a success.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

THANOS said:


> Could not agree more. I like Angle but he doesn't create excellent stories in the ring unless he's with a superior ring general. Case in point, his matches with Nigel McGuiness (Desmond Wolfe).


His matches against who? Google doesn't even know who he is. :troll


----------



## THANOS

Billion Dollar Man said:


> His matches against who? Google doesn't even know who he is. :troll


Touche.


----------



## markedfordeath

hey Thanos, go to the Daniel Bryan thread, the backlash has already started...all hail the fans.


----------



## Choke2Death

Alo0oy said:


> Despite Angle's flaws, he's still heads & shoulders above Cena in the ring, the only reason Cena has a lot of great matches is because he main evented sooo many PPVs (thus gets the longest time in the ring), Cena main evented 91 PPVs, the only wrestlers that are close are HHH with 92 & Undertaker with 86, nobody else is even close to that many main events.
> 
> What's really telling is the fact that a lot of wrestlers main evented less PPVs by a very wide margin but still have almost as many good matches as Cena (like Edge & Orton).


I don't see what main eventing has to do with your talent. I consider Chris Benoit the greatest wrestler of all time and he probably main evented a total amount of 10-15 PPVs combined in WCW/WWE.

And Cena getting a lot of time for his matches is hardly a negative. It just means he gets the opportunity to showcase his talent and as result, he does so. And it's not like he needs a great opponent to "carry" him since he's had excellent matches with guys like Umaga, Lashley, JBL and Batista just to name a few workers who range from decent to good. He even gave The Great Khali one of the better matches of his career. Using Edge or Orton is not exactly a good example since these are also two guys who have been featured as main event/upper midcarders for over a decade, much like Cena himself.


----------



## krai999

HEY GUYS REMEMBER THIS THREAD 2 YEARS AGO yeah good times
http://www.wrestlingforum.com/raw/543973-crowd-so-silent-during-daniel-bryan-entrance-_______.html


----------



## markedfordeath

He was pretty popular on NXT a month before that.


----------



## Alo0oy

Choke2Death said:


> I don't see what main eventing has to do with your talent. I consider Chris Benoit the greatest wrestler of all time and he probably main evented a total amount of 10-15 PPVs combined in WCW/WWE.
> 
> And Cena getting a lot of time for his matches is hardly a negative. It just means he gets the opportunity to showcase his talent and as result, he does so. And it's not like he needs a great opponent to "carry" him since he's had excellent matches with guys like Umaga, Lashley, JBL and Batista just to name a few workers who range from decent to good. He even gave The Great Khali one of the better matches of his career. Using Edge or Orton is not exactly a good example since these are also two guys who have been featured as main event/upper midcarders for over a decade, much like Cena himself.


Getting more main events means he has a higher chance of having good matches.

Let's look at all his PPV matches since 2012.

vs Kane @RR.
vs Kane @EC.
vs The Rock @WM.
*vs Brock Lesnar @ER.*
vs John Laurinaitis @OTL.
vs Big Show @NWO.
MITB match @MITB.
vs CM Punk vs Big Show @SS.
*vs CM Punk @NOC.*
vs CM Punk vs Ryback at @SvS.
*vs Dolph Ziggler @TLC.*
RR match @RR.
w/Ryback & Sheamus vs The Shield @EC.
vs The Rock @WM.
vs Ryback @ER.
vs Ryback @PB.
vs Mark Henry @MITB.
*vs Daniel Bryan @SS.*
vs Alberto Del Rio @HIAC.

Cena main evented the overwhelming majority of those PPVs, & he has the bolded matches as great matches, nobody else got this many opportunities, in fact, you're more likely to find stinkers in the above list than great matches.

Who else could have this many opportunities & pull off ONLY 4 great matches?

EDIT: In fact, CM Punk in 10 months this year had a better collection of matches than Cena had in 22 months.


----------



## Choke2Death

Not really. Punk's great matches this year have been vs Cena (Feb), Undertaker (WM) and Lesnar (SS) as well as the MITB ladder match if you count it. Everything else has been decent at best or forgettable. (4 only)

Great Cena matches in the past 2 years: vs Brock (ER), Punk (NOC), Punk (Feb, Raw) and Bryan (SS). Good matches are vs Henry (MITB), Sandow (MITB cash in last week), Rock (WM28), 6 man tag (EC). (four great, 8 in total)


----------



## Oliver-94

funnyfaces1 said:


> I would consider Cena to be on the same level as a wrestler as Rock and Angle. Come at me.


 Yup. Cena is more closer to the Rock as far as ring talent goes. Obviously Cena has had better list of matches than the Rock. 

As a draw, however, it's not even close :rock :rock4


----------



## Alo0oy

Choke2Death said:


> Not really. Punk's great matches this year have been vs Cena (Feb), Undertaker (WM) and Lesnar (SS) as well as the MITB ladder match if you count it. Everything else has been decent at best or forgettable. (4 only)
> 
> Great Cena matches in the past 2 years: vs Brock (ER), Punk (NOC), Punk (Feb, Raw) and Bryan (SS). Good matches are vs Henry (MITB), Sandow (MITB cash in last week), Rock (WM28), 6 man tag (EC). (four great, 8 in total)


You forgot Punk's match with Jericho at Payback.

My point is, while superior wrestlers like Daniel Bryan, Dolph Ziggler, & Randy Orton just off the top of my head were either in multi-men matches or 5 minute midcard matches, John Cena was main eventing every single PPV & given 20+ minutes.

If say, Dolph Ziggler was given this many PPV main events to wrestle 20+ minute matches, he would have crapped on all of Cena's collection during that time period. Cena had better matches than Dolph Ziggler during that time period, but that's only because he was given 10 times the opportunity Ziggler got.

EDIT: If we're only talking about "good" matches, Bryan & Orton this year alone shit all over Cena during the past two years, even if we only count their Raw & Smackdown matches.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Punks match with Jericho in PB was very good and their match in Raw was pretty good too. Punk/Rock was good for Rock standard nowadays since it's his best match since returning. Punk/Ryback TLC match in RAW was also good.


----------



## Alo0oy

Sonnen Says said:


> Punks match with Jericho in PB was very good and their match in Raw was pretty good too. Punk/Rock was good for Rock standard nowadays since it's his best match since returning. Punk/Ryback TLC match in RAW was also good.


Yup, The Rock's only great match since his return was his RR match with Punk.


----------



## Oliver-94

Alo0oy said:


> Yup, The Rock's only great match since his return was his RR match with Punk.


 Nah, his only great match was against Cena at WM 28. Second best is against Punk at EC (not saying much, it wasn't very good) and the other two are dissappointing.


----------



## Alo0oy

Oliver-94 said:


> Nah, his only great match was against Cena at WM 28. Second best is against Punk at EC (not saying much, it wasn't very good) and the other two are dissappointing.


To each his own I guess, his first match with Cena was alright, I wouldn't call it great, & his EC match against Punk wasn't good at all, I preferred their first match.


----------



## Choke2Death

Alo0oy said:


> You forgot Punk's match with Jericho at Payback.
> 
> My point is, while superior wrestlers like Daniel Bryan, Dolph Ziggler, & Randy Orton just off the top of my head were either in multi-men matches or 5 minute midcard matches, John Cena was main eventing every single PPV & given 20+ minutes.
> 
> If say, Dolph Ziggler was given this many PPV main events to wrestle 20+ minute matches, he would have crapped on all of Cena's collection during that time period. Cena had better matches than Dolph Ziggler during that time period, but that's only because he was given 10 times the opportunity Ziggler got.
> 
> EDIT: If we're only talking about "good" matches, Bryan & Orton this year alone shit all over Cena during the past two years, even if we only count their Raw & Smackdown matches.


I didn't. That Payback match is totally shit imo. Intentionally, I excluded Cena vs Ziggler from TLC because I don't think highly of that one either so I ain't biased. I _did_ forget the TLC with Ryback since I really liked that one.

The point I'm trying to make is Cena IS a capable wrestler. Whether others would have offered something more... I don't know. Cena gave Sandow the best match of his career and Sandow has wrestled guys like Orton, Ziggler and Sheamus just to name a few given the same amount of time (10-12 minutes) but it wasn't nearly as good. The Cena/Sandow match instantly made me a believer of Sandow's abilities in the ring when I was doubting him prior to that.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Great Punk matches this year:

vs. Ryback TLC
vs. Jericho Raw
vs. Cena Raw
vs. Taker WM29
vs. Jericho PB
vs. Brock SS

Great Cena matches the last two years:

vs. Rock WM28
vs. Brock ER
vs. Punk NOC
vs. Punk Raw
vs. Bryan SS
vs. Sandow Raw
6-man Tag on SD a week or two ago
6-man Tag on Raw this past week

As far as good matches go, for Punk, unlike most, I'd consider both Rock matches "good". The Luke Harper match this past week on Raw was also good. The second Big E Langston match was good. He also had a good one with Fandango on SD a while ago. Cena the past couple of years... the Shield 6-man tag and the Henry MITB matches I'd put as "good". I also thought the Ryback LMS match, while maybe a bit underwhelming for the match type, was still good. Outside of that... eh, not sure. Think Cena would win.

Now Bryan on the other hand? He'd easily beat out Cena in great/good matches this year vs. Cena the last two years... hell, maybe even the last 3 years. So many Shield tag goodies would probably be all I'd need to come up with it, never mind his singles work (although the last few months of PPVs have been weak for him since he's been facing Orton).


----------



## Alo0oy

Choke2Death said:


> I didn't. That Payback match is totally shit imo. Intentionally, I excluded Cena vs Ziggler from TLC because I don't think highly of that one either so I ain't biased.
> 
> The point I'm trying to make is Cena IS a capable wrestler. Whether others would have offered something more... I don't know. Cena gave Sandow the best match of his career and Sandow has wrestled guys like Orton, Ziggler and Sheamus just to name a few given the same amount of time (10-12 minutes) but it wasn't nearly as good. The Cena/Sandow match instantly made me a believer of Sandow's abilities in the ring when I was doubting him prior to that.


I never said Cena isn't capable, I'd actually say he's underrated around here. But he's not a special talent in the ring, he's good, but there are many many better wrestlers on the roster. You have Punk with his storytelling, Bryan, Ziggler, & Rollins with their athleticism, Ambrose with his ring psychology, Orton with his execution & ring psychology. Then you have also Cesaro, Christian, & Cody Rhodes.

Cena is a good wrestler, but I don't think there's even an argument to be made that he's better than any of the names I mentioned above.


----------



## Oliver-94

Alo0oy said:


> To each his own I guess, his first match with Cena was alright, I wouldn't call it great, & his EC match against Punk wasn't good at all, I preferred their first match.


 Fair enough. I like the EC match much better than the RR match. The first opening six minutes were entertaining with Punk slapping the Rock and then spitting on him as an attempt to get him DQ'ed. I thought Punk's role in this match was smart with him playing the role of a heel that would do everything to win and he played up to the stipulation very well, trying to get Rock DQ'ed and counted out. The ending is also better than their previous match. Of course, the headlocks did last long but as I said, it wasn't a very good match.


----------



## Choke2Death

Alo0oy said:


> I never said Cena isn't capable, I'd actually say he's underrated around here. But he's not a special talent in the ring, he's good, but there are many many better wrestlers on the roster. You have Punk with his storytelling, Bryan, Ziggler, & Rollins with their athleticism, Ambrose with his ring psychology, Orton with his execution & ring psychology. Then you have also Cesaro, Christian, & Cody Rhodes.
> 
> Cena is a good wrestler, but I don't think there's even an argument to be made that he's better than any of the names I mentioned above.


That's not what I've seen from you in the past. For the most part, you've come across as an almost irrational Cena hater who always nitpicks and talks about his "botches".

Anyways, I can easily make the argument. While these other guys excel in parts that Cena has a weakness (athletic abilities of Orton/Ziggler for instance), he always manages to make it work with what little he has when he's motivated to work. In big match situations he can always be counted on and at the end of the day, that's what matters the most.


----------



## BOOTS 2 ASSES

Oliver-94 said:


> Yup. Cena is more closer to the Rock as far as ring talent goes. Obviously Cena has had better list of matches than the Rock.


Nah.Cena has no finesse in the ring.He can't even perform a simple leg drop properly.Apart from this most of his moves lack smoothness.And no way he is anywhere close to Rock when it comes to story-telling and connection with the crowd.

In his favour though,he may be slightly better counter wrestler than The Rock(even that is up for debate).


But still all in all,Cena will go down as a wrestler who was just slightly below the Rock's level,whether as a mic-worker or as an in-ring performer.



> As a draw, however, it's not even close :rock :rock4


He broke Austin's all time gates record in 1999 itself-the peak of Austin Era.Since then no one is literally close:cool2


----------



## Alo0oy

Choke2Death said:


> That's not what I've seen from you in the past. For the most part, you've come across as an almost irrational Cena hater who always nitpicks and talks about his "botches".
> 
> Anyways, I can easily make the argument. While these other guys excel in parts that Cena has a weakness (athletic abilities of Orton/Ziggler for instance), he always manages to make it work with what little he has when he's motivated to work. In big match situations he can always be counted on and at the end of the day, that's what matters the most.


I admit that I'm a Cena hater, but most of my comments about Cena are just troll posts. I actually don't mind Cena in his current position, upper midcard.

It's easy to say he steps up in big matches, when the majority of his matches are "big", & its easier to remember the good ones & forget the bad ones in that case. Even in his great matches he always does something stupid to make you fpalm, like the botched finish of his match against Punk, or when he almost broke Bryan's neck at SS.


----------



## Oliver-94

Agree for the most part Boots2Asses, especially the drawing part. The RATINGS would increase if Rock returned. Bryan/Punk are no match :rock


----------



## Sonnen Says

Rock/Punk in RR is the Rocks best I think. It had better reversals, story, moves, better execution (Punks kicks were awesome), etc. I rate it like Meltzer tbh. 


By the way Punk/Jericho in PR wasn't a shitty match neither was their match in Raw. It was a very good match.


----------



## #Mark

Objectively, if you compare Cena's five best main event matches to almost anyone else's in WWE history i'm pretty sure you'd find Cena's matches better. Like it or not he's build a quality catalog of matches. I personally can't stand Cena the character, but I do think he's a great main event style worker.


----------



## BOOTS 2 ASSES

#Mark said:


> Objectively, if you compare Cena's five best main event matches to almost anyone else's in WWE history i'm pretty sure you'd find Cena's matches better. Like it or not he's build a quality catalog of matches. I personally can't stand Cena the character, but I do think he's a great main event style worker.


Give me Rock vs Austin WM17/19 over any Cena match,and I would take it anyday.


----------



## Alo0oy

#Mark said:


> Objectively, if you compare Cena's five best main event matches to almost anyone else's in WWE history i'm pretty sure you'd find Cena's matches better. Like it or not he's build a quality catalog of matches. I personally can't stand Cena the character, but I do think he's a great main event style worker.


Not really, his only historic match is the one against Punk @MITB, while HBK has three historic matches against Taker, also against Razor Ramon & Bret Hart, you have Austin vs Bret Hart, his series against The Rock, & his three stages of hell match against Triple H, those are just off the top of my head.

Hell even if I go lower, Orton vs Foley, Benoit, Taker, & his Christian series are also better than Cena's.

Punk this year alone has three legitimate MOTY contenders, & I'd say two of them (vs Taker, vs Lesnar) are better than any match in Cena's career except the one against Punk @MITB. EDIT: I'm just exaggerating here.


----------



## krai999

hope manchester continues the trend with the daniel bryan chants during the main event segments


----------



## Choke2Death

What's your definition of "historic matches"?

If it's matches that standout for their stipulation, quality, uniqueness or atmosphere then there's MITB with Punk, Lesnar at ER, HBK on Raw, Orton Ironman match and Once in a Lifetime with The Rock.


----------



## Alo0oy

Choke2Death said:


> What's your definition of "historic matches"?
> 
> If it's matches that standout for their stipulation, quality, uniqueness or atmosphere then there's MITB with Punk, Lesnar at ER, HBK on Raw, Orton Ironman match and Once in a Lifetime with The Rock.


I'm talking about the wrestling aspect of the match.

Before MITB, Cena really had no standout match in terms of wrestling.


----------



## Choke2Death

Alo0oy said:


> I'm talking about the wrestling aspect of the match.
> 
> Before MITB, Cena really had no standout match in terms of wrestling.












Even Cena haters were raving about how great this was when it was over.


----------



## Alo0oy

Choke2Death said:


> Even Cena haters were raving about how great this was when it was over.


It was a great match, more than great actually.

But does it match up with Taker vs HBK, Austin vs Bret Hart, or even his own match at MITB against Punk?

I'm talking about matches that will be remembered forever, not because of the spectacle, but because of the wrestling.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Cena/HBK is about as much wrestling as you're gonna get in a match. The match is a Cena standout for me definitely and although his MITB match was better, I could never say Cena had no standout matches before MITB 2011. All the ones C2D mentioned as well (minus the Ironman with Orton) I'd agree with as well as far as being standouts for one reason or another.


----------



## Choke2Death

Alo0oy said:


> It was a great match, more than great actually.
> 
> But does it match up with Taker vs HBK, Austin vs Bret Hart, or even his own match at MITB against Punk?
> 
> I'm talking about matches that will be remembered forever, not because of the spectacle, but because of the wrestling.


As a wrestling match, it's definitely better than MITB with Punk since it doesn't have any of the sloppiness that match suffers from.

As a wrestling match, it's also good enough to be remembered forever. It's the longest match in Raw history so it has that going for it. (61 minutes, slightly above Benoit/HHH ironman match from 2004)


----------



## Alo0oy

Choke2Death said:


> As a wrestling match, it's definitely better than MITB with Punk since it doesn't have any of the sloppiness that match suffers from.
> 
> As a wrestling match, it's also good enough to be remembered forever. It's the longest match in Raw history so it has that going for it. (61 minutes, slightly above Benoit/HHH ironman match from 2004)


Maybe I'm underrating it because it was a Raw match. I just don't feel it's as memorable as other matches.

Anyway, even with his match against HBK, there are many other wrestlers that had more standout matches, Cena definitely didn't have the most. I'd say HBK had the most.


----------



## Choke2Death

Alo0oy said:


> Maybe I'm underrating it because it was a Raw match. I just don't feel it's as memorable as other matches.
> 
> Anyway, even with his match against HBK, there are many other wrestlers that had more standout matches, Cena definitely didn't have the most. I'd say HBK had the most.


He doesn't have the most, I never said that. But he definitely has a lot of them. HBK and Benoit have the most I think, with maybe Undertaker rounding it out.


----------



## Alo0oy

Choke2Death said:


> He doesn't have the most, I never said that. But he definitely has a lot of them. HBK and Benoit have the most I think, with maybe Undertaker rounding it out.


Yeah, I was responding to #Mark, he said Cena had the most out of any WWE wrestler in history.


----------



## Schrute_Farms

I'd rather watch Austin brawl for 30 minutes than any Cena or Punk match.


----------



## WWE

Alo0oy said:


> It was a great match, more than great actually.
> 
> But does it match up with Taker vs HBK, Austin vs Bret Hart, or even his own match at MITB against Punk?
> 
> I'm talking about matches that will be remembered forever, not because of the spectacle, but because of the wrestling.


I don't think anybody remembers Punk/Cena because of the wrestling. they mainly remember it because of the atmosphere and everything else surrounding the match


----------



## Gretchen

Cycloneon said:


> I don't think anybody remembers Punk/Cena because of the wrestling. they mainly remember it because of the atmosphere and everything else surrounding the match


Yeah, sure, but don't try to downplay the match itself. It was very good, as was the atmosphere. Cena and Punk just have great in ring chemistry, as well as promo-type chemistry.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

Sonnen Says said:


> Rock/Punk in RR is the Rocks best I think. It had better reversals, story, moves, better execution (Punks kicks were awesome), etc. I rate it like Meltzer tbh.
> 
> 
> By the way Punk/Jericho in PR wasn't a shitty match neither was their match in Raw. It was a very good match.


First statement I completely agree. Don't understand the hate on Rock/Punk, both matches were above average with the RR one being 4 stars IMO.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

krai999 said:


> HEY GUYS REMEMBER THIS THREAD 2 YEARS AGO yeah good times
> http://www.wrestlingforum.com/raw/543973-crowd-so-silent-during-daniel-bryan-entrance-_______.html


:lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## Starbuck

Official TV/Star Ratings Discussion Thread eh?


----------



## markedfordeath

are you really a John Cena fan? have you noticed a lot more people are cheering for him lately? where did these people come from? they hated him before he left.


----------



## Starbuck

yes. yes. from the cenation. no.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Starbuck has been a Cena mark for as long as I can remember.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

This thread is going in all sorts of directions now :lol


----------



## markedfordeath

Man those England live event reports are so sweet to read!


----------



## JY57

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_74501.shtml



> -- E! issued a press release on Monday announcing 1.3 million viewers for the return of "Total Divas" Sunday night on E!
> 
> The premiere episode in July averaged 1.343 million viewers, placing Sunday's first episode of the second-half of Season 1 in-line with the start.
> 
> In September, the mid-season finale averaged 1.0 million viewers as part of viewership falling off for the final two episodes.
> 
> Also of note, TD's lead-in show, "Keeping up with the Kardashians," averaged 2.3 million viewers for its season finale episode on Sunday.
> 
> -- Sunday's "Total Divas" episode scored its lowest Social Media Activity score of the series.
> 
> The show did not rank in the Top 10 on cable TV Sunday night, according to Trendrr.TV, with the the #10 score being 26,513 in social activity for the Kardashians.
> 
> The lowest score from the first-half of TD's Season 1 was 37k against Summerslam, placing Sunday's episode well below the previous low.


----------



## Chrome

Billion Dollar Man said:


> :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao


My how times change. Now he gets his name chanted in matches he isn't even a part of. :bryan


----------



## JY57

Smackdown Viewers up again for the 4th straight week:

2.946 million viewers up from 2.730 million viewers last week

Also:

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_74500.shtml#.UoFV05GQdlI



> WWE Smackdown on Friday, November 8 popped to a 2.08 rating, up nearly 10 percent from last week's 1.90 rating for John Cena's return to Smackdown.
> 
> It was the highest-rated Smackdown since a 2.11 rating on March 22 before WrestleMania 29.
> 
> Smackdown averaged 2.946 million viewers, up eight percent from last week. It was also the most viewers since Mar. 22.
> 
> - On cable TV Friday night, Smackdown ranked #2 in overall viewers, #1 in the 8:00 p.m. EST timeslot, #1 in males 18-34, and #2 in males 18-49.
> 
> The biggest increase came in the m18-49 demo, which jumped three-tenths of a rating compared to last week for the highest m18-49 rating in over one year.
> 
> Smackdown also gained two-tenths in the general adults 18-49 demo, plus one-tenth in males 18-34, males 12-34, and teen males.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: The John Cena Factor. It appears the audience just needed one week to catch on to Cena being a regular part of Smackdown, as the audience popped big this week compared to declining last week for Cena's first show back on Smackdown. It will be interesting to see if this is a one-off ratings pop or a sign of things to come for the rest of the fall season.


the rating is highest (2.08) since March 22 (2.11; right before Mania)


----------



## markedfordeath

who was advertised on Smackdown? Daniel Bryan versus Luke Harper....Ratings baby! John Cena wasn't advertised because he didn't have a match until the show was airing. on Raw they advertised Harper/Bryan, and the fans tune in! Cena can't be the reason when he wasn't even advertised, of course the WWE will think Cena is the reason.


----------



## JY57

markedfordeath said:


> who was advertised on Smackdown? Daniel Bryan versus Luke Harper....Ratings baby! John Cena wasn't advertised because he didn't have a match until the show was airing. on Raw they advertised Harper/Bryan, and the fans tune in!


he was advertised by wwe.com and there spoilers out on Tuesday so everyone knows by Friday if he is there or not.


----------



## markedfordeath

yeah but he wasn't going to wrestle until the show, so he didn't have a role until the show started...Guerrero put him in a match, he didn't have a match to be advertised before. Plus on Raw only Bryan was advertised to appear against Harper so Bryan should be given credit. Not everyone looks at the spoilers. They'll see Raw and will be like, oh nice let me check out Smackdown.


----------



## Waffelz

Giving Bryan credit over Cena? Holy shit. My eyes. My fucking eyes.


----------



## markedfordeath

I'm giving him credit over Cena, but not the WWE...


----------



## Waffelz

Of course you would, and what a silly thing to do.


----------



## markedfordeath

how is it silly? i just said why he should be given credit..not a lot of people look up spoilers and WWE.com...Bryan was advertised last week on Raw that he was going to be on Smackdown..so its silly to assume that Bryan can get credit for the rating? huh?


----------



## Dec_619

Punk/Bryan in the main event this week, please bring better numbers than any other hour of the show.


----------



## markedfordeath

it did, I bet that was the highest rated segment just like last week. "vanilla midgets" can draw.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

JY57 said:


> Smackdown Viewers up again for the 4th straight week:
> 
> 2.946 million viewers up from 2.730 million viewers last week
> 
> Also:
> 
> http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_74500.shtml#.UoFV05GQdlI
> 
> 
> 
> the rating is highest (2.08) since March 22 (2.11; right before Mania)


:cena3 :cena5



Waffelz said:


> Giving Bryan credit over Cena? Holy shit. My eyes. My fucking eyes.


same here my FUCKING EYES.


----------



## Dub J

This thread should be tits next Monday.

yee-haw


----------



## GeneticJackhammer9

Waffelz said:


> Giving Bryan credit over Cena? Holy shit. My eyes. My fucking eyes.


Mr Low Buyrates carrying Cena in viewership gains....... LO fcking L

:lmao


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Mr Low Buyrates........:vince :yes:yes:yes


----------



## hag




----------



## Waffelz

Mon da vanilla midgets!!!


----------



## The Great Gatsby

Cena rulz12345 said:


> Mr Low Buyrates........:vince :yes:yes:yes


Wasnt your boy in the same main event that didnt draw what WWE expected? Again with the Cena hype I see, too bad he has a terrible hit or miss track record as a draw. :lmao


----------



## JY57

> -- Monday's WWE Raw fell 20 percent in Social Media Activity for a pre-taped international show.
> 
> Raw scored 173,282 in social activity, nearly the lowest of the second-half of 2013. Only the October 21 show scored lower - 168k.
> 
> By comparison, the November U.K. Raw last year dropped 35 percent from the previous week and scored 166k in social activity.
> 
> On cable TV, Raw ranked #2 behind "Love & Hip Hop" on VH1 and ahead of a poor Monday Night Football match-up on ESPN.


via PWTorch


----------



## markedfordeath

yikes! probably got a bad rating too.


----------



## markedfordeath

the fact that Punk/Bryan were in the main event and the overrun, means that Vince saw the quarter hours from last week and it told him that the public ONLY gives a shit about them. So they were in the most important spot again! Their match alone will sell the ppv, but Vince won't see it that way, which is nuts!


----------



## funnyfaces1

The real story is how on earth did MNF do so poorly.


----------



## Waffelz

Why do people not watch pre-taped shows?


----------



## Choke2Death

Waffelz said:


> Why do people not watch pre-taped shows?


Not very exciting when you already have access to the spoilers and can see how much is worth watching.


----------



## Chrome

funnyfaces1 said:


> The real story is how on earth did MNF do so poorly.


A mediocre 4-4 Dolphins team vs a winless Bucs team will do that.


----------



## markedfordeath

still can't believe they didn't capitalize on the excitement of Raw..guess they don't like their ppvs selling. Seriously, I've never seen the WWE do such bad business practices as long as I've been a fan. How do common sense things like this escape Creative?


----------



## JY57

Hour 1 - 3.867 million
Hour 2 - 3.834 million
Hour 3 - 3.603 million


----------



## Stad

funnyfaces1 said:


> The real story is how on earth did MNF do so poorly.


Look who was playing, lol.


----------



## markedfordeath

looks like the overrun and the opening segment will do the best again!


----------



## Starbuck

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 3.867 million
> Hour 2 - 3.834 million
> Hour 3 - 3.603 million


Before everybody shits themselves, the main event tag will still probably top the night in the overrun even though the overall hour 3 is down from the other two. Same as last week I imagine when everybody was laughing although I doubt anybody will find it very funny this week because marks.


----------



## markedfordeath

All the big stars were in hour three so I dont think any of them had a bad rating, hour three only does well every so often, not a lot. Still think the overrun was the highest. And maybe the Big Show chokeslam, although the first hour was boring.


----------



## Choke2Death

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 3.867 million
> Hour 2 - 3.834 million
> Hour 3 - 3.603 million


lol @ the indy midget hour doing lowest. Since Big Show took so much abuse last week in the same position, it's only fair to turn it around. :lol


----------



## Waffelz

I'm looking forward to the marks not lolling at the final number and being hypocrites.


----------



## markedfordeath

actually, most of the third hour number came from the "vanilla midget" main event and over run...do you really think they gained viewers on a Ryback/Truth match or a Langston/Del Rio match? come on now..obviously the bulk of the viewers came from the main event. It probably saved the third hour due to all the losses it was having in segments. The Heyman promo, main event and overrun was what saved that hour..the first part of it was cringeworthy.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Shitty numbers. So much for anyone on this roster being a mega draw, like I read all the time.


----------



## markedfordeath

what do you mean? Big guys draw, remember? thats what Vince wants us to think...and its showing in the numbers clearly, look at those 4 million viewers each week with the big guys on top lol


----------



## Alo0oy

Looks like a no fun week.


----------



## Gretchen

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Shitty numbers. So much for anyone on this roster being a mega draw, like I read all the time.


*But don't you know that :cena4 is a mega-draw? Constantly garnering good ratings?*



:troll


----------



## funnyfaces1

Everyone was an anti-draw. We need the GOAT back :henry1


----------



## #Mark

Looks like we're getting more HHH and Steph next week, yay... I'm not into conspiracy theories, but it does seem a little convenient that the one week they aren't on TV happens to be a taped show.


----------



## Starbuck

#Mark said:


> Looks like we're getting more HHH and Steph next week, yay... I'm not into conspiracy theories, but it does seem a little convenient that the on week they aren't on TV happens to be a taped show.


Hunter carefully calculated this so that he wouldn't be on TV this week so he could avoid criticism for a low rating from internet posters who already blame him for low ratings. 

:HHH2


----------



## markedfordeath

well certainly the excess of big guys aren't really helping the rating like they thought it would. All the big guys were in the overrun, so we'll see how that goes....Also, loving how Punk and Bryan are main eventing Smackdown this week too, but LOL at the fact that Axel is in the match with them lol


----------



## WWE

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 3.867 million
> Hour 2 - 3.834 million
> *Hour 3 - 3.603 million*



:ti


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

This year's numbers are way down from last year's numbers of the same week:

8PM- 4.154 million
9PM- 4.399 million
10PM- 4.027 million

Don't know if last year's was a taped show as well, but it wasn't even close this week for one reason or another. There was another week several weeks back that did a lot worse than last year's, although there was also one where this year's did a lot better than last year's.

Overrun is still probably going to do well. However Q11 (which had Heyman promo and then Punk beating him up towards the end I believe, as well as a couple of commercials) and Q12 (which had the main event itself) will probably under-perform. What was in the 10PM slot this week?


----------



## #Mark

Starbuck said:


> Hunter carefully calculated this so that he wouldn't be on TV this week so he could avoid criticism for a low rating from internet posters who already blame him for low ratings.
> 
> :HHH2


That actually wouldn't surprise me.


----------



## Choke2Death

Last year's Raw from this week was the go-home show for Survivor Series if I'm not mistaken. Couple that with the taped factor and you'll see why this year has lower numbers.

Here's last year's breakdown:



> As noted before, the November 12th WWE RAW did a 2.86 cable rating with 4.19 million viewers.
> 
> In the segment breakdown, Randy Orton and Kofi Kingston vs. Dolph Ziggler and Alberto Del Rio lost 74,000 from the opener. The angle with Vickie Guerrero, AJ Lee, John Cena and Dolph Ziggler as well as Big Show vs. William Regal gained 468,000 viewers, which is strong growth for that point in the show. Layla vs. Kaitlyn and clips to hype Jerry Lawler’s return lost 234,000 viewers.
> 
> Lawler’s return with the segment involving CM Punk, Paul Heyman and Mick Foley gained 745,000 viewers for a high 3.38 quarter hour rating. The end of the angle lost 876,000 viewers.
> 
> Sin Cara, Rey Mysterio, Tyson Kidd and Justin Gabriel vs. Titus O’Neil, Darren Young, Primo and Epico gained 233,000 viewers in the last few minutes. Tensai vs. R-Truth lost 253,000 viewers. Brad Maddox vs. Ryback gained 755,000 viewers for a 3.28 quarter rating in the 10pm timeslot. This is the best 10pm growth in a long time.
> 
> Sheamus vs. David Otunga lost 910,000 viewers, which would be among the most viewers lost in one segment all year. Kane and The Miz vs. Cody Rhodes and Damien Sandow lost 40,000 viewers. The lowest point of the whole show came at the beginning of CM Punk vs. John Cena. The first half of that match lost 313,000 viewers and did a 2.42 quarter hour rating. It picked up at 11pm for the overrun, finishing with a 2.99 quarter rating after gaining 528,000 viewers.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Good god, :ryback was drawing on levels that very few could accomplish. That was a pretty eventful RAW too.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Choke2Death said:


> Last year's Raw from this week was the go-home show for Survivor Series if I'm not mistaken. Couple that with the taped factor and you'll see why this year has lower numbers.


Oh yeah, forgot that SVS took place a week earlier last year than it is this year. Still, go-home shows aren't guaranteed to do well. Now the fallout of from the PPV is what I've seen generally do really well (although last year's fallout from SVS did under-perform).

I think the fact it was a taped show is what really drove the numbers down.

Edit: @last year's breakdown: 

DAMN! Main event did not do well. 9PM though did amazingly well though and so did the Ryback/Maddox match. Ryback was really on quite a roll. Really puts into perspective how far he's fallen.


----------



## WWE




----------



## JY57

final rating - 2.73 (down from 2.75 last week)


----------



## JY57

this was last year breakdown on 11/12 (ironically main event was Cena vs Punk and it did terrible) which had 4.19 million and 2.86 rating



> As noted before, the November 12th WWE RAW did a 2.86 cable rating with 4.19 million viewers.
> 
> In the segment breakdown, Randy Orton and Kofi Kingston vs. Dolph Ziggler and Alberto Del Rio lost 74,000 from the opener. The angle with Vickie Guerrero, AJ Lee, John Cena and Dolph Ziggler as well as Big Show vs. William Regal gained 468,000 viewers, which is strong growth for that point in the show. Layla vs. Kaitlyn and clips to hype Jerry Lawler’s return lost 234,000 viewers.
> 
> Lawler’s return with the segment involving CM Punk, Paul Heyman and Mick Foley gained 745,000 viewers for a high 3.38 quarter hour rating. The end of the angle lost 876,000 viewers.
> 
> Sin Cara, Rey Mysterio, Tyson Kidd and Justin Gabriel vs. Titus O’Neil, Darren Young, Primo and Epico gained 233,000 viewers in the last few minutes. Tensai vs. R-Truth lost 253,000 viewers. Brad Maddox vs. Ryback gained 755,000 viewers for a 3.28 quarter rating in the 10pm timeslot. This is the best 10pm growth in a long time.
> 
> Sheamus vs. David Otunga lost 910,000 viewers, which would be among the most viewers lost in one segment all year. Kane and The Miz vs. Cody Rhodes and Damien Sandow lost 40,000 viewers. The lowest point of the whole show came at the beginning of CM Punk vs. John Cena. The first half of that match lost 313,000 viewers and did a 2.42 quarter hour rating. It picked up at 11pm for the overrun, finishing with a 2.99 quarter rating after gaining 528,000 viewers.


----------



## WWE

JY57 said:


> final rating - 2.73 (down from 2.75 last week)


That's actually pretty damn good for a taped show


----------



## Dec_619

I think everyone is sick of the show by the third hour.


----------



## Eddie Ray

just something to consider, before you all start mark wars. i imagine last week was somewhat a culprit in turning away viewers from this week, considering where the storylines seemed to be heading and how disappointing it was.


----------



## Alo0oy

Eddie Ray said:


> just something to consider, before you all start mark wars. i imagine last week was somewhat a culprit in turning away viewers from this week, considering where the storylines seemed to be heading and how disappointing it was.


I'd say the culprit is the fact that nothing happened after the first half hour of the show. The entire show could have been condensed into one hour, the first half hour & the last half hour, nothing relevant happened in-between.


----------



## JY57

the PWTorch breakdown won't help (if it comes this week) because according to them the 18-49 male demo was beyond awful and the lowest in months. Males from 12-17 and older 49 did good though, here is the synopsis:



> WWE Raw on Monday, November 11 scored a 2.73 rating, down slightly from a 2.75 rating last week.
> 
> The taped episode from the U.K. narrowly avoided being the lowest-rated Raw of the past month, topping a 2.71 rating on October 21 leading into the Hell in a Cell PPV.
> 
> - Raw averaged 3.768 million viewers, down three percent from last week's show. It was the fewest viewers since October 7.
> 
> Hourly Break Down: 3.867 million first hour viewers, decline to 3.834 million second hour viewers, and six percent decline to 3.603 million third hour viewers.
> 
> Raw registered the least-watched third hour of the year. More concerning is Raw declined from the first hour to second hour to third hour for the fourth consecutive week.
> 
> - On cable TV Monday night, Raw ranked #2 behind a weak Monday Night Football game, which averaged 600,000 viewers than last week, and #2 in the key male demos behind football.
> 
> Within the Raw hourlies, the second hour scored highest among adult males and the third hour scored highest among teen males. This is reflected by the m12-17 demo increasing four-tenths of a rating compared to last week. Other than John Cena's first Raw returning from injury in October, it was the highest m12-17 rating in months.
> 
> Elsewhere, the m18-34 demo nose-dived 24 percent to the lowest m18-34 rating in months. Also, the m18-49 demo dropped two-tenths of a rating to the lowest m18-49 rating in months.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: The key male demos look pretty bad, but the overall show rating was boosted by the extremes - teen males and apparently older males outside of the 18-49 window who gravitate toward sports unless there is a weak football game on Monday nights.


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

3 hour shows are way to long. By the second hour Raw is just background noise and I'm on the pc. It's just to much filler nonsense with no reason to watch low/midcard guys.


----------



## Alo0oy

JY57 said:


> the PWTorch breakdown won't help (if it comes this week) because according to them the 18-49 male demo was beyond awful and the lowest in months. Males from 12-17 and older 49 did good though, here is the synopsis:


Ouch.

I think everybody sucks as a draw at this point.


----------



## Londrick

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 3.867 million
> Hour 2 - 3.834 million
> *Hour 3 - 3.603 million*


If only Bryan had some muscle the 3rd hour would've been higher.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

WWE needs Matt Morgan!!!!


----------



## markedfordeath

i'm sure the vanilla midgets will be blamed for this, its always their fault...


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I think we can all blame Korporate Kane.

Corporate Henry needs to happen asap to save the ratings.


----------



## superuser1

I think we should blame the Usos they had no place in the main event


----------



## markedfordeath

so since the ratings are still not that great, does Big Show get blamed? Are they going to try to push someone else in his place? Because frankly having bigger guys doesn't help much either like they thought it would have.


----------



## JY57

superuser1 said:


> I think we should blame the Usos they had no place in the main event


blamed for what? If not mistaken (from peeps show watched it) they were in the over-run and came unannounced for like 30 seconds.


----------



## Alo0oy

markedfordeath said:


> so since the ratings are still not that great, does Big Show get blamed? Are they going to try to push someone else in his place? Because frankly having bigger guys doesn't help much either like they thought it would have.


That's Vince McMahon we're talking about, he'll say first hour = most viewers = Big Show.


----------



## superuser1

JY57 said:


> blamed for what? If not mistaken (from peeps show watched it) they were in the over-run and came unannounced for like 30 seconds.


It was a joke


----------



## superuser1

Alo0oy said:


>


Lmaooooooooooooooo


----------



## DesolationRow

Alo0oy said:


> That's Vince McMahon we're talking about, he'll say first hour = most viewers = Big Show.


:lmao :lmao :lmao

That thing does not get old.


----------



## Jof

Not a good number, but I doubt WWE cares being a taped show and all. 

BTW was this the first time Punk and Bryan teamed together against the Shield? Has this match happened before?


----------



## SPCDRI

Vinny Mac orgasming over the muscle studs is still the GOAT gif. ALWAYS FUNNY.

:vince3 :vince3 :vince3 :vince3 :vince3 out of 5


----------



## funnyfaces1

Jof said:


> Not a good number, but I doubt WWE cares being a taped show and all.
> 
> BTW was this the first time Punk and Bryan teamed together against the Shield? Has this match happened before?


Yeah. This was Punk's first ever match against anyone in The Shield actually. I imagined their first encounter to be a bit more dramatic considering that Punk is one of only two major guys on the roster (HHH being the other) that didn't have a match against them. Oh well, let's hope for more interactions.


----------



## markedfordeath

yeah but are we supposed to forget about the fact that Punk hired them to begin with? that's how they made their debut.


----------



## funnyfaces1

markedfordeath said:


> yeah but are we supposed to forget about the fact that Punk hired them to begin with? that's how they made their debut.


Technically it was Heyman that hired them behind Punk's back.


----------



## Gretchen

SPCDRI said:


> Vinny Mac orgasming over the muscle studs is still the GOAT gif. ALWAYS FUNNY.
> 
> :vince3 :vince3 :vince3 :vince3 :vince3 out of 5


I love the last bit, where he sees the guy's abs, and "faints". :lol


----------



## Alo0oy

Rhodes_For_WHC said:


> I love the last bit, where he sees the guy's abs, and "faints". :lol


Yeah, I'm sure he "fainted" all over his pants. :lmao


----------



## THANOS

Alo0oy said:


> Yeah, I'm sure he "fainted" all over his pants. :lmao


He painted and fainted :lmao


----------



## Londrick

Judging by last weeks episode big guys don't draw, judging by this weeks episode vanilla midgets don't draw. WWE should go another route with superstars and only push animals. Bear vs Gorilla WM 30 Main event, imagine the buys.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Londrick said:


> Judging by last weeks episode *big guys* don't draw, judging by this weeks episode *vanilla midgets *don't draw. WWE should go another route with superstars and only push animals. Bear vs Gorilla WM 30 Main event, imagine the buys.


The bigs and littles apparently don't draw. It's time to push the medium sized guys. Everyone over 6'1" and under 6'7", come on down!

:vince5


----------



## Gretchen

Mister WrestleMania said:


> The bigs and littles apparently don't draw. It's time to push the medium sized guys. Everyone over 6'1" and under 6'7", come on down!
> 
> :vince5


*Before medium guys, we've got to go to super-small guys!

Hornswoggle, El Torito, you're up! You guys just might be the draws I've been looking for!*

:vince4


----------



## THANOS

Mister WrestleMania said:


> The bigs and littles apparently don't draw. It's time to push the medium sized guys. Everyone over 6'1" and under 6'7", come on down!
> 
> :vince5


He's ready :cesaro


----------



## Londrick

Mister WrestleMania said:


> The bigs and littles apparently don't draw. It's time to push the medium sized guys. Everyone over 6'1" and under 6'7", come on down!
> 
> :vince5


I know just the guy for the job. :hhh2

2014 will be HHH's year.


----------



## RKO 4life

I think it will help if they pushed Jack Swagger Big E and Sandow more. Stop this Bryan and Punk crap most people don't seem to care about. Stop it with the NOBODY Family shit too.

Also guys see hour 3 losses ratings almost every week and I know the over run is awful.


----------



## Londrick

Swagger and Sandow helping ratings? :ti


----------



## RKO 4life

Londrick said:


> Swagger and Sandow helping ratings? :ti


It wouldn't hurt to try would it? Once RVD comes back that can Main Event Smackdown with Sandow and you can have Swagger vs Y2J once he gets back Main Event the 10:00 slot for Raw and give Swagger the win over a Legend see if he can build off from it. They gave Jack Swagger a BIG push right before Wrestle Mania but after losing to Del Rio they stopped. Not so sure why just because of weed I guess.

Sandow should Main Event, did you see his awesome match against Cena? He made Cena fun to watch. He is the one I would be pushing hard.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Londrick said:


> Swagger and Sandow helping ratings? :ti


SD ratings dropped when Swagger was suspended then rose when he came back. I'm always thankful Swagger is a "Vince Guy".


----------



## #Mark

RKO 4life said:


> I think it will help if they pushed Jack Swagger Big E and Sandow more. Stop this Bryan and Punk crap most people don't seem to care about. Stop it with the NOBODY Family shit too.
> 
> Also guys see hour 3 losses ratings almost every week and I know the over run is awful.


An Orton fan has no right to talk about who the audience doesn't care about. Especially when an entire crowd is chanting "Orton's boring."


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Hour 1 - 3.867 million
Hour 2 - 3.834 million
*Hour 3 - 3.603 million*

:ti :ti :ti

so much for DEM MIDGETS DRAW:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao



Alo0oy said:


> I'd say the culprit is the fact that nothing happened after the first half hour of the show. The entire show could have been condensed into one hour, the first half hour & the last half hour, nothing relevant happened in-between.





markedfordeath said:


> i'm sure the vanilla midgets will be blamed for this, its always their fault...


oh! look somebody is saving his boy's ass.


----------



## RKO 4life

#Mark said:


> An Orton fan has no right to talk about who the audience doesn't care about. Especially when an entire crowd is chanting "Orton's boring."


I have no right? Bitch please. Punk and Bryan can't draw and will get called out on it. You can try and stop me, but I must say you wouldn't. Those fans across the pond are geeks ass low life people. They are from another country, so they don't matter.


----------



## THANOS

RKO 4life said:


> I have no right? Bitch please. Punk and Bryan can't draw and will get called out on it. You can try and stop me, but I must say you wouldn't. Those fans across the pond are geeks ass low life people. They are from another country, so they don't matter.


Every week you come out and say this and every week you're put in your place via the quarter hour ratings breakdown. I know it's second nature to you, but maybe just maybe there might be an easier way to get attention no?


----------



## RKO 4life

THANOS said:


> Every week you come out and say this and every week you're put in your place via the quarter hour ratings breakdown. I know it's second nature to you, but maybe just maybe there might be an easier way to get attention no?


So now I get put in my place? I would love to see the day. Orton is a way better draw then slow foot Punk and little Tommy Bryan. But I will call out facts when I see fit. Guys wanna blame Big Show for the 3rd hour last week, I'll do the same for Tony Hawk and Bryan poo this week. You are going to have to deal with it or stop posting bud. Must suck knowing Bryan will always be a nobody. Hell I don't see him in WWE much longer he is what we call a TNA midcard talent.

I know you will put me in red I get that you have nothing else to do.


----------



## RKO 4life

OH MY GOD HE'S TALKING BAD ABOUT PUNK AND BRYAN DADDY


----------



## Dub J

gonna B wed weps apwenty


----------



## ChickMagnet12

Londrick said:


> Judging by last weeks episode big guys don't draw, judging by this weeks episode vanilla midgets don't draw. WWE should go another route with superstars and only push animals. *Bear vs Gorilla WM 30 Main event*, imagine the buys.



Is it wrong that I read this as Bear Grylls?

Drinking piss would be best for business.


----------



## Soulrollins

RKO 4life said:


> So now I get put in my place? I would love to see the day. Orton is a way better draw then slow foot Punk and little Tommy Bryan. But I will call out facts when I see fit. Guys wanna blame Big Show for the 3rd hour last week, I'll do the same for Tony Hawk and Bryan poo this week. You are going to have to deal with it or stop posting bud. Must suck knowing Bryan will always be a nobody. Hell I don't see him in WWE much longer he is what we call a TNA midcard talent.
> 
> I know you will put me in red I get that you have nothing else to do.


Lol.. Orton isn't a better draw than anybody..


----------



## TheStig

Probably ryback vs r-thruth and big e vs del rio losing viwers before it increases until the end in last hour.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

RKO 4life said:


> So now I get put in my place? I would love to see the day. Orton is a way better draw then slow foot Punk and little Tommy Bryan. But I will call out facts when I see fit. *Guys wanna blame Big Show for the 3rd hour last week*, I'll do the same for Tony Hawk and Bryan poo this week. You are going to have to deal with it or stop posting bud. Must suck knowing Bryan will always be a nobody. Hell I don't see him in WWE much longer he is what we call a TNA midcard talent.
> 
> I know you will put me in red I get that you have nothing else to do.


it's the typical marks hypocricy,they all jumped on show last week but now that their midgets also did'nt draw they are blaming last week's show.
that shows you how much blinded they're by their love for punk/bryan and how much non-sense they speak.
"COME AT ME BRO" :dance:dance:dance


----------



## Choke2Death

It would be even funnier if the main event segment actually loses viewers. Maybe it would come back to Punk as last year, this week was not nice to him since his match with Cena in the main event did one of the lowest numbers in the whole show. There's your "defining feud" of this era, folks. unk2


----------



## Cliffy

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Shitty numbers. So much for anyone on this roster being a mega draw, like I read all the time.


But...but..Cena is Megastar

But Cena is fourth draw all times

But Cena is Draw....






































:ti


----------



## superuser1

Punk and Bryan marks were quick to blame Big Show last week smh the double standard here


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Cliffy Byro said:


> But...but..Cena is Megastar
> 
> But Cena is fourth draw all times
> 
> But Cena is Draw....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :ti


Cena is such a huge draw. Look at the MASSIVE ratings Raw has drawn since he's been back.

:lmao

We all know Bryan and Punk aren't draws. But the only one who truly gets called one here and SHOULD be (given his push the past decade) is Cena. And the fact that he ISN'T is all sorts of hilarious.


----------



## Eddie Ray

superuser1 said:


> Punk and Bryan marks were quick to blame Big Show last week smh the double standard here


even the live crowd walked out on big show last week. where as this week the crowd was so hot for the ending this week. saying that they are comparable is ludicrous. 

I am almost betting that the drop is down to 3 things...

1)its taped- always a drop for taped shows
2) 80% of the show was boring ass filler which fails to keep the audiences attention throughout the whole 3 hours. a show cannot be sustained on the last 20 minutes.
3) last week served as a major turn off. TBH if it wasn't for this weeks great ending I was doubting even catching SS in two weeks time. the concept of Show Vs Orton is a complete turn off. The Babyface failed to get his revenge and what he was due, i don't blame people from being less invested because of it.


----------



## Soulrollins

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Cena is such a huge draw. Look at the MASSIVE ratings Raw has drawn since he's been back.
> 
> :lmao
> 
> We all know Bryan and Punk aren't draws. But the only one who truly gets called one here and SHOULD be (given his push the past decade) is Cena. And the fact that he ISN'T is all sorts of hilarious.


Lol...The only wrestler who has been able to boost ratings in the last years is the Rock.

The others are completely shit, including Cena and his fucking over megapush.. So basically no one in the current roster can't draw, is hilarious tha people here actually cares about ratings.


----------



## Eddie Ray

well built storylines draw. if The Rock Or SCSA were booked as shitly as the last few years (one could argue the last half a decade) with stop start pushes and Vince growing ever more paranoid in his old age then they would have never got over because Vince wouldn't have sustained enough faith in them before they gained the fanbase or build to become a big draw.

you can have talent in the bucket load but if the booking isn't consistent or strong enough then its not enough. D Bry could be more of a draw now if he had sustained that momentum from SS (which was the start of his major push into the upper card- he shouldn't be required to draw yet- that takes longer than most people realise) but poor booking with promos that constantly belittled him with no pay-off at the end has hurt his brand. I hope Bryan can recover from this, hes being known for being unburiable so I just hope that rings true this time around.


----------



## JY57

http://www.lordsofpain.net/news/wwe..._History_of_WWE_Note.html#4KrKuGorO0kh4Xxz.99



> - The replay of Sunday's WWE Total Divas that aired after Monday's RAW on the USA Network drew 1.2 million viewers. The original airing on E! on Sunday night drew 1.3 million viewers.


----------



## Cliffy

Total Divas re-run outdrew impact bama4


----------



## WWE

Cliffy Byro said:


> Total Divas re-run outdrew impact bama3


----------



## markedfordeath

if they wrote better storylines EVERYBODY would be able to draw! The fact that they took a hot ending to Raw, that everybody had interest in, and would be the reason people ordered SS to begin with, and then just made it a regular tag match after all of that speaks volumes for how much the WWE actually WANTS to sabotage their own business...Stephanie and Triple H are allowing Vince to okay these ideas? he's lost it! they had a golden opportunity. They've had tons the whole year, but man oh man the WWE is losing it...enjoy that money while its coming in now guys!


----------



## Starbuck

:lmao 

Can't believe how quiet this thread is when just last week everybody was _ripping _into Big Show something ridiculous. 

:show


----------



## markedfordeath

maybe because Big Show wasn't the reason why the first hour was up! it was the first hour, the first half hour of Raw always gets better ratings because football hasn't started yet. Big Show has nothing to do with it..screw that fat ass.


----------



## WWE

markedfordeath said:


> maybe because Big Show wasn't the reason why the first hour was up! it was the first hour, the first half hour of Raw always gets better ratings because football hasn't started yet. Big Show has nothing to do with it..screw that fat ass.













Nah man those Punk/Bryan marks are hiding, kinda like those Miami Heat bandwagoners unk


----------



## markedfordeath

the main event was the only thing that brought viewers to the third hour though...you really think Del Rio/Langston and Ryback/Truth kept people interested for the last hour of Raw? I guarantee both those matches lost viewership and the main event gained it back. Truth and Del Rio are viewer losers consistently.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Starbuck said:


> :lmao
> 
> Can't believe how quiet this thread is when just last week everybody was _ripping _into Big Show something ridiculous.
> 
> :show


iwc hypocricy at it's best.



markedfordeath said:


> maybe because Big Show wasn't the reason why the first hour was up! it was the first hour, the first half hour of Raw always gets better ratings because football hasn't started yet. Big Show has nothing to do with it..screw that fat ass.


so when midgets first hour was the highest last week you bitched all over this forum that they should be in th me coz they drew and now that their last hour got bombed and show's was highest it's just that first hour is always the highest.
YOU REALLY ARE THE NEW KKF


----------



## SerapisLiber

Everyone's quiet because they're waiting for the quarter breakdowns.


----------



## markedfordeath

you're just jealous of me! that's why you always respond to me.


----------



## Choke2Death

SerapisLiber said:


> Everyone's quiet because they're waiting for the quarter breakdowns.


They were not waiting this long to blast the Big Show, though. HYPOCRISY.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

I'm right here. My whole contention the entire time has been that NO ONE on the entire full time roster is a big time draw. That includes Punk and Bryan. 

Don't see what the big deal is. No one is hiding. If people want to make a big deal about a guy who has been on the roster since 1999 and is 42 years old, and is a fat, old slob. Go ahead. Slobber all over him.

BIG SHOW DAT BIG RATINGS DRAW ACCORDING TO SOME HERE.

(Y)

:show

:lmao


----------



## Jatt Kidd

Cliffy Byro said:


> Total Divas re-run outdrew impact bama4


hahahhahahahaha 

*pause*

hahahahahahaha


----------



## SPCDRI

If vanilla midgets don't draw, what are Eric Rowan, Luke Harper, Bray Wyatt and Roman Reigns? 
There isn't a single one of those guys billed under 6'3'' 265 pounds.


----------



## Londrick

Vanilla Giants.


----------



## SerapisLiber

Londrick said:


> Vanilla Giants.


Who you callin' "vanilla"?


----------



## funnyfaces1

Mister Wrestlemania has it right. The only person in this decrepit company that can draw is busy impersonating Rick Ross.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Cliffy Byro said:


> Total Divas re-run outdrew impact bama4


:lmao

#TNAwful


----------



## Starbuck

SerapisLiber said:


> Everyone's quiet because they're waiting for the quarter breakdowns.


Everyone's quiet because it isn't so funny when it happens to one of your boys, all this despite the fact that their segment will still probably top the night. 



Mister WrestleMania said:


> I'm right here. My whole contention the entire time has been that NO ONE on the entire full time roster is a big time draw. That includes Punk and Bryan.
> 
> Don't see what the big deal is. No one is hiding. If people want to make a big deal about a guy who has been on the roster since 1999 and is 42 years old, and is a fat, old slob. Go ahead. Slobber all over him.
> 
> BIG SHOW DAT BIG RATINGS DRAW ACCORDING TO SOME HERE.
> 
> (Y)
> 
> :show
> 
> :lmao


There is no big deal. Some of us are just laughing at the blatant hypocrisy running rampant in here. You don't have to be a fan of Show, Punk or Bryan to see that.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

Mister WrestleMania said:


> I'm right here. My whole contention the entire time has been that NO ONE on the entire full time roster is a big time draw. That includes Punk and Bryan.
> 
> Don't see what the big deal is. No one is hiding. If people want to make a big deal about a guy who has been on the roster since 1999 and is 42 years old, and is a fat, old slob. Go ahead. Slobber all over him.
> 
> BIG SHOW DAT BIG RATINGS DRAW ACCORDING TO SOME HERE.
> 
> (Y)
> 
> :show
> 
> :lmao


:lmao

I've always been a supporter of Big show until last year, now the guy is just fucking irritating. He is in the main event even more than Cena now.


----------



## Starbuck

Don't worry, by the time Wrestlemania rolls along Big Show will be an afterthought and everybody will be back to complaining about Cena again...or whatever guy gets a top spot that doesn't happen to be Punk or Bryan. And so the circle continues.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

Starbuck said:


> Everyone's quiet because it isn't so funny when it happens to one of your boys, all this despite the fact that their segment will still probably top the night.
> 
> 
> 
> There is no big deal. Some of us are just laughing at the blatant hypocrisy running rampant in here. You don't have to be a fan of Show, Punk or Bryan to see that.


Def agree with this tho.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Starbuck said:


> Don't worry, by the time Wrestlemania rolls along Big Show will be an afterthought and everybody will be back to complaining about Cena again...or whatever guy gets a top spot that doesn't happen to be Punk or Bryan. And so the circle continues.


But people do complain about Punk and Bryan as well when they're on top (normally anyway).

No one escapes the wrath of the IWC!


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

Starbuck said:


> Don't worry, by the time Wrestlemania rolls along Big Show will be an afterthought and everybody will be back to complaining about Cena again...or whatever guy gets a top spot that doesn't happen to be Punk or Bryan. And so the circle continues.


I'm not complaining tho. And I don't see how anyone who is a fan of Orton, Show, Bryan, Cena, Punk could be complaining TBH. They all have their feuds going right now and are big parts of the show. The wealth is being spread equally IMO. But I guess Punk/Bryan marks want their boys to play hot potato with the WWE title until they retire.


----------



## SPCDRI

Erik Rowan
Luke Harper
Bray Wyatt
Dean Ambrose
Roman Reigns

VANILLA GIANTS

Same with Big Show. Somebody tell me what this blubbering bitch's personality is?
He's had 19 heel turns since 1999! Doesn't that tell you what a cipher he is and how devoid
of personality he is that he has had 19 heel turns since 1999? That is the only way they can make this
blubbering vanilla giant "interesting" and he's still boring as fuck.

19 HEEL TURNS in 14 YEARS!

:ti 

:hayden3

:show


----------



## Starbuck

Billion Dollar Man said:


> I'm not complaining tho. And I don't see how anyone who is a fan of Orton, Show, Bryan, Cena, Punk could be complaining TBH. They all have their feuds going right now and are big parts of the show. The wealth is being spread equally IMO. But I guess Punk/Bryan marks want their boys to play hot potato with the WWE title until they retire.


Oh I wasn't saying you were complaining, just making a general comment that all the whining about Show now is for nothing since he's going to be gone by the time Mania comes along. Then it will be back to business as usual, complaining about Cena and anybody else supposedly taking Mania spots from the likes of Punk and Bryan. There's always somebody complaining about something in this place.


----------



## Gretchen

SPCDRI said:


> 19 HEEL TURNS in 14 YEARS!


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

Starbuck said:


> Oh I wasn't saying you were complaining, just making a general comment that all the whining about Show now is for nothing since he's going to be gone by the time Mania comes along. Then it will be back to business as usual, complaining about Cena and anybody else supposedly taking Mania spots from the likes of Punk and Bryan. There's always somebody complaining about something in this place.


That's true. Most just complain for the sake of complaining.


----------



## Vyer

The Sandrone said:


> But people do complain about Punk and Bryan as well when they're on top (normally anyway).
> 
> No one escapes the wrath of the IWC!


Yeah I seen some threads saying how Punk and Bryan are too small and they don't draw. As Spider-Man would say from family guy "Everybody gets one."

I don't mind The Big Show though. He's been doing alright.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Does this thread post gains and losses anymore?


----------



## Londrick

Starbuck said:


> Oh I wasn't saying you were complaining, just making a general comment that all the whining about Show now is for nothing since he's going to be gone by the time Mania comes along. Then it will be back to business as usual, complaining about Cena and anybody else supposedly taking Mania spots from the likes of Punk and Bryan. There's always somebody complaining about something in this place.


So no Show w/ Vince vs HHH w/Steph as the main event of WM for the control of the company?










I'm no longer gonna order WM this year.



swagger_ROCKS said:


> Does this thread post gains and losses anymore?


Yeah but it's just for the 18-48 male demo now, I think.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

swagger_ROCKS said:


> Does this thread post gains and losses anymore?


Our news-postin' man/girl JY57 usually takes care of that. Ask him/her.


----------



## markedfordeath

wouldn't it be hilarious if Show won the Rumble? that up and comer gets that title shot at Mania


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Londrick said:


> So no Show w/ Vince vs HHH w/Steph as the main event of WM for the control of the company?



I would order this if Steph were locked in one of those old TNA stripper cages or a Steph on my pole match.


----------



## markedfordeath

i'm only ordering Rumble and Mania from now on...they've really dropped the ball the whole year so far.


----------



## #Mark

Why were people blaming Show anyways? HHH and Steph deserve any and all blame since this is their angle.


----------



## markedfordeath

the ratings would stay consistent no matter what the angle, the angle hasn't worked like they thought it would have.


----------



## SerapisLiber

markedfordeath said:


> wouldn't it be hilarious if Show won the Rumble? that up and comer gets that title shot at Mania


Ugh. That is the one major prize he hasn't accomplished yet. Wouldn't surprise me if some folks backstage considered giving it to him as a retirement gift.


----------



## Gretchen

SerapisLiber said:


> Ugh. That is the one major prize he hasn't accomplished yet. Wouldn't surprise me if some folks backstage considered giving it to him as a retirement gift.


*Retirement gift, you say?* :vince


----------



## Alo0oy

SerapisLiber said:


> Ugh. That is the one major prize he hasn't accomplished yet. Wouldn't surprise me if some folks backstage considered giving it to him as a retirement gift.


Big Show signed a five year contract earlier this year.


----------



## markedfordeath

he isn't going anywhere, he still has five years left, just signed a contract.


----------



## Jof

Source to that info? I thought that was mark henry...


----------



## Alo0oy

Jof said:


> Source to that info? I thought that was mark henry...


http://www.ewrestlingnews.com/news/19184/the-big-show-signs-new-five-year-wwe-deal


----------



## JY57

> For Raw on 11/4, which did a 2.75 rating and 3.89 million viewers, here is how the quarters went. The Wyatt Family beating down C.M. Punk after the Punk vs. Luke Harper match, plus the Paul Heyman audio interview gained 32,000 viewers. Ryback vs. Great Khali lost 414,000 viewers. Alberto Del Rio vs. Kofi Kingston gained 31,000 viewers. Randy Orton vs. Big E Langston at 9 p.m. gained 478,000 viewers, which is good. Fandango & Summer Rae vs. Natalya & Tyson Kidd lost 128,000 viewers. The John Cena interview talking about breast cancer awareness lost 446,000 viewers. The Cena & Goldust & Cody Rhodes vs. Antonio Cesaro & Jack Swagger & Damien Sandow match gained 638,000 viewers in the 10 p.m. time slot which is very strong. Curtis Axel vs. Dolph Ziggler lost 1,020,000 viewers. That’s where that giant third hour drop came from and may have been partially due to halftime ending of the football game. Usos vs. 3MB in a two-on-three match and The Bella Twins & Eva Marie vs. A.J. Lee & Tamina Snuka & Aksana gained 30,000 viewers. The final segment itself with the HHH/Big Show settlement plus Show vs. Orton & The Shield in the handicap match gained 861,000 viewers, which is one of the best final segment growth periods. So it wasn’t the final segment that died and killed the third hour as much as the period from 10:15 to 10:45 where viewership was low.


from 11/4 show


----------



## Cena rulz12345

> *The Wyatt Family beating down C.M. Punk after the Punk vs. Luke Harper match, plus the Paul Heyman audio interview gained 32,000 viewers
> :ti :ti :ti dat mini power alliance DRAW
> 
> The Cena & Goldust & Cody Rhodes vs. Antonio Cesaro & Jack Swagger & Damien Sandow match gained 638,000 viewers in the 10 p.m. time slot which is very strong.
> 
> The final segment itself with the HHH/Big Show settlement plus Show vs. Orton & The Shield in the handicap match gained 861,000 viewers, which is one of the best final segment growth periods. So it wasn’t the final segment that died and killed the third hour as much as the period from 10:15 to 10:45 where viewership was low.*


DAT GOAT DRAW :cena3 AND THE WORLD'S GIANT DRAW :show

AND for those that say orton does'nt draw 


> Randy Orton vs. Big E Langston at 9 p.m. gained 478,000 viewers


rton2


----------



## JY57

Maybe they should stop doing those live advertising (breast cancer or whatever) promos on TV and keep it as a dark segment during a commercial. Not even Cena can save them. I noticed tons of viewers lost when these happen regardless who it is talking.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

^yes they are for a good cause but nothing intresting for the audience to here.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

JY57 said:


> from 11/4 show


thank you. :dance Nice gain on the 6 man tag. :cena3


----------



## #Mark

Damn these are the WORST possible gains :lol . Any note on how Bryan's run in did? It was described as the highest point of the show on the Torch's report.


----------



## Alo0oy

All the big stars gained viewers, but Axel & Dolph losing 1m viewers is pretty sad.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

so i guess other than the iwc general fans ARE INTRESTED IN SHOW VS AUTHOURITY


----------



## Alo0oy

Cena rulz12345 said:


> so i guess other than the iwc general fans ARE INTRESTED IN SHOW VS AUTHOURITY


Nobody doubted that though, fans ate that storyline up according to facebook/twitter/instagram. They love Big Show for some reason.


----------



## superuser1

Those who were blaming Big Show I wonder what they have to say now lol


----------



## JY57

#Mark said:


> Damn these are the WORST possible gains :lol . Any note on how Bryan's run in did? It was described as the highest point of the show on the Torch's report.


that was only for 18-49 male demo. PWTorch ratings are for that demo of the show (even though they are definitely much more detailed and sometimes does minute to minute).


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Alo0oy said:


> All the big stars gained viewers, but Axel & Dolph losing 1m viewers is pretty sad.


not all,punk and bryan gained the same as kofi's match :ti



superuser1 said:


> Those who were blaming Big Show I wonder what they have to say now lol


lol,they are hiding in their mummy's room out of shame :lmao :lmao


----------



## MizisWWE

Alo0oy said:


> Nobody doubted that though, fans ate that storyline up according to facebook/twitter/instagram. They love Big Show for some reason.


He is a larger than life giant. Not only is he a giant, he's a freak of nature with the way he moves for his size and weight like Shaq. Top it off with he can talk and you get why he gets to be the guy vs Triple H or the attraction vs a Mayweather or Sportscenter top 10 looking at Shaq. It is not a lie that a caudal will give a dozen more fucks about guys like him than Bryan, it's why the strongman acts in the circus get looked at as much if not more than a high wire act. Vince knows this, Trips knows this, and it's always been that way dating back to Andre and Bundy.

Anyone who has ever seen. Big Show work in person or walk out at a live event knows that. His presence is something to behold because at first you say damn he's big. Then you say damn he's quick, then damn he's agile, and finally damn that has to hurt when he does something as simple as the whole tell the crowd shush and chop a guy. He has a remarkable presence that goes way beyond a simple Yes Chant that is the equivalent of a modern day what


----------



## TheGreatBanana

I wouldn't be surprised if this weeks Raw experienced the same gains like last weeks. 

It is likely that viewership dropped after 10 pm and picked up heavily during the final minutes of the show, but the gain isn't enough to help the viewership average for that hour.

Anyways people stop blaming the blame game, its *fucking immature*.


----------



## Soulrollins

Cena rulz12345 said:


> not all,punk and bryan gained the same as kofi's match :ti
> 
> 
> 
> lol,they are hiding in their mummy's room out of shame :lmao :lmao


Lol.. This guy should be retarded.


----------



## Jof

That 10:15-10:30 slot following big match/angle is usually a death zone, that's why you need to have entertaining promos there even if it's just meant for comedy with Santino/Rtruth/whatever, instead of random matches with no story. When was the last time mid card stars had over 10 min promo time on RAW excluding Miz TV and shit? WWE really need to put more focus on mid-card superstars who are good talkers on the mic. They got three hours to fill, so much more can be done instead of Random matches over and over.


----------



## Fatcat

Cena rulz12345 said:


> not all,punk and bryan gained the same as kofi's match :ti


After a segment that lost over 400,000 viewers, which means about 380,000 less people saw the Kofi match.


----------



## GeneticJackhammer9

Cena rulz12345 said:


> not all,punk and bryan gained the same as kofi's match :ti
> 
> 
> 
> lol,they are hiding in their mummy's room out of shame :lmao :lmao


And they said the "Summer of Punk" would lead to a new wrestling boom. It only lead to 2.2 ratings.

And they said Bryan would lead the company to a new era when Cena rested for a few months. It only lead to low PPV buyrates.

:ti


----------



## Fatcat

Anyway I decided to do something different. I gave the start of the show a baseline of 0 and then added and subtracted the gains of each segment to compare how they actually did to each other.

Punk vs. Luke Harper: 0
Beatdown/Heyman: +32,000
Ryback vs. Khali: -382,000
Del Rio vs. Kofi: -351,000
Orton vs. Langston: +127,000
Fandango: -1,000
Cena Interview: -447,000
6 Man Tag: +191,000
Axel vs. Ziggler: -829,000
3MB/Usos/Divas: -799,000
HHH/Big Show/Handicap Match: +62,000


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

DAT Cena promo losing 446,000 viewers.

OOHHHH WHAT A LOSS!

:ti


----------



## SerapisLiber

Alo0oy said:


> Big Show signed a five year contract earlier this year.


Oh dear god, please be trolling...


----------



## hag

So many uneducated Bryan/Punk haters in this thread. Lol.


----------



## SerapisLiber

Cena rulz12345 said:


> The Wyatt Family beating down C.M. Punk after the Punk vs. Luke Harper match, plus the Paul Heyman audio interview gained 32,000 viewers
> 
> 
> 
> dat mini power alliance DRAW
Click to expand...

Huh? Punk vs. Harper opened the show, so the post match beat down gained 32,000 *on TOP of what the match itself had*, which is whatever the opening quarter had.

What is that number, btw, and why isn't it on this breakdown?

Anyway, the attitude of your post is like you're expecting Punk to out draw *himself* within the *same* segment. Weird. 

I guess technically he kind of did, as per the wording of that breakdown, but it's most likely that the bump was the Bryan run-in and the anticipation for it.


----------



## Choke2Death

> Curtis Axel vs. Dolph Ziggler lost 1,020,000 viewers.


:ti

The lack of charisma in that ring was too much to handle.

Also lol @ DAT BIG "ANTI-DRAW" SHOW KILLING THOSE VIEWERS!!! :show


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Fatcat said:


> After a segment that lost over 400,000 viewers, which means about 380,000 less people saw the Kofi match.





> The Wyatt Family beating down C.M. Punk after the Punk vs. Luke Harper match, plus the Paul Heyman audio interview gained 32,000 viewers. Ryback vs. Great Khali lost 414,000 viewers. Alberto Del Rio vs. Kofi Kingston gained 31,000 viewers


Ryback vs. Great Khali lost 414,000 viewers and kofi's match just gained viewers which means 31.000 were intrested in his match vs del rio.



Soulrollins said:


> Lol.. This guy should be retarded.


:genius:genius:genius :clap :clap :clap
stating the facts means you are retarded wow :clap,
everyone knows who is acting like a retard here.


----------



## Vyer

Cena rulz12345 said:


> Ryback vs. Great Khali lost 414,000 viewers and kofi's match just gained viewers which means 31.000 were intrested in his match vs del rio.


I think what he was saying was that the beat down had more viewers than kofi vs del rio if you add 414,000 viewers, which was the number of viewers lost from Khali vs Ryback.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Overrun certainly looks a lot better on this breakdown as opposed to the torch one. Probably because there's no rating in the observer one anymore.

All the gains were strong though, and we know the opener started off strong, so all the main slots did well.


----------



## TheStig

The Sandrone said:


> Overrun certainly looks a lot better on this breakdown as opposed to the torch one. Probably because there's no rating in the observer one anymore.
> 
> All the gains were strong though, and we know the opener started off strong, so all the main slots did well.


Well if the stuff before loses 1 million you better gain some back. The first breakdown showed that q12 didn't change much and it was the overun that got the gain. This new one didn't break up the Q12 from the overun. 



Fatcat said:


> Anyway I decided to do something different. I gave the start of the show a baseline of 0 and then added and subtracted the gains of each segment to compare how they actually did to each other.
> 
> Punk vs. Luke Harper: 0
> Beatdown/Heyman: +32,000
> Ryback vs. Khali: -382,000
> Del Rio vs. Kofi: -351,000
> Orton vs. Langston: +127,000
> Fandango: -1,000
> Cena Interview: -447,000
> 6 Man Tag: +191,000
> Axel vs. Ziggler: -829,000
> 3MB/Usos/Divas: -799,000
> HHH/Big Show/Handicap Match: +62,000


Interesting way to look at it. Im kinda sick right now so my head is messy so I dunno if this is a legit way of looking at it but sure looks interesting.


----------



## Alo0oy

Fatcat said:


> Anyway I decided to do something different. I gave the start of the show a baseline of 0 and then added and subtracted the gains of each segment to compare how they actually did to each other.
> 
> Punk vs. Luke Harper: 0
> Beatdown/Heyman: +32,000
> Ryback vs. Khali: -382,000
> Del Rio vs. Kofi: -351,000
> Orton vs. Langston: +127,000
> Fandango: -1,000
> Cena Interview: -447,000
> 6 Man Tag: +191,000
> *Axel vs. Ziggler: -829,000*
> 3MB/Usos/Divas: -799,000
> HHH/Big Show/Handicap Match: +62,000


Axel should just drop the strap, losing that many viewers means nobody gives a fuck about you. :lmao

& dem Orton gains. rton1


----------



## Sonnen Says

GeneticJackhammer9 said:


> And they said the "Summer of Punk" would lead to a new wrestling boom. *It only lead to 2.2 ratings*.
> 
> And they said Bryan would lead the company to a new era when Cena rested for a few months. It only lead to low PPV buyrates.
> 
> :ti


Yeah in a Christmas show where it's 3 hours. Cena Mainevented and Punk still got the highest of the night. But lets dismiss all the ratings before it :lol that had decent/good/great numbers. Either ways you're just a troll.


----------



## Alo0oy

Sonnen Says said:


> Yeah in a Christmas show where it's 3 hours. Cena Mainevented and Punk still got the highest of the night. But lets dismiss all the ratings before it :lol that had decent/good/great numbers. Either ways you're just a troll.


Selective memory, every time I bring up HIAC buyrates they ignore that completely. Or how TLC did bad because Punk wasn't on the card.


----------



## GeneticJackhammer9

Sonnen Says said:


> Yeah in a Christmas show where it's 3 hours. Cena Mainevented and Punk still got the highest of the night. *But lets dismiss all the ratings before it :lol that had decent/good/great numbers*. Either ways you're just a troll.


What great numbers?.......

September 3 
2.83
September 10 
2.89
September 17 
2.86
September 24 
2.72
October 1 
2.54
October 8 
2.8
October 15 
2.81
October 22 
2.48
October 29 
2.95
November 5-9 
2.78
November 12-16 
2.86
November 19
2.73
November 26 
2.7
December 3 
2.55
December 10 
2.67
December 17 
2.87
December 24 
2.2
December 31 
2.32


:lmao

:ti


----------



## Alo0oy

GeneticJackhammer9 said:


> What great numbers?.......
> 
> September 3
> 2.83
> September 10
> 2.89
> September 17
> 2.86
> September 24
> 2.72
> October 1
> 2.54
> October 8
> 2.8
> October 15
> 2.81
> October 22
> 2.48
> October 29
> 2.95
> November 5-9
> 2.78
> November 12-16
> 2.86
> November 19
> 2.73
> November 26
> 2.7
> December 3
> 2.55
> December 10
> 2.67
> December 17
> 2.87
> December 24
> 2.2
> December 31
> 2.32
> 
> 
> :lmao
> 
> :ti


Yeah, because an abomination show like the Del Rio running over SanFoley one is suppoed to draw. If it doesn't its all Punk's fault.


----------



## Eddie Ray

GeneticJackhammer9 said:


> What great numbers?.......
> 
> September 3
> 2.83
> September 10
> 2.89
> September 17
> 2.86
> September 24
> 2.72
> October 1
> 2.54
> October 8
> 2.8
> October 15
> 2.81
> October 22
> 2.48
> October 29
> 2.95
> November 5-9
> 2.78
> November 12-16
> 2.86
> November 19
> 2.73
> November 26
> 2.7
> December 3
> 2.55
> December 10
> 2.67
> December 17
> 2.87
> December 24
> 2.2
> December 31
> 2.32
> 
> 
> :lmao
> 
> :ti


hi Hawksea...how long till you get banned again...


----------



## RebelArch86

Thing most of you guys miss, that awful rating everyone is mark warring over, was enough for the #2 spot. Tv ratings are different now. The attitude era ratings of 8m everyone gizzes over was a different time, when the #1 show could pull 85m viewers. The #1 show now pulls 15m. RAW ratings are doing better than ever. Forbes just reported on how great they were, and how WWE is making more money now than ever before.

If it's just the current stars that can't draw attitude era numbers, where were those big numbers when Rock was back? When HHH is on? When HBK was back? When DX got back together? When Lesnar was back? Where was TNA's numbers with proven draws like Hogan and Sting? Money is the bottom line, b/c all other statistics change. No one talks about Avatar only selling 60m tickets while Gone with the Wind sold 240m tickets. The story is Avatar made $1b dollars.


----------



## RebelArch86

Oh yeah: thread closed/ see Forbes business analysis.


----------



## markedfordeath

fuck! all you guys talk about is drawing ability! why do you guys care so much? its disgusting! nobody draws a good number anymore, its irrelevant. Theres always the same gains and losses every week..its not like anyone is bringing in 2-3 million new viewers in their segments and all ppvs are doing badly nowadays...so why is it a big deal? wrestling isn't popular anymore.


----------



## WWE

When was the last time RAW was averaging 3'?


----------



## Jerichoholic4Life

markedfordeath said:


> all ppvs are doing badly nowadays...so why is it a big deal? wrestling isn't popular anymore.


Royal Rumble, Elimination Chamber, Wrestlemania, Extreme Rules, Payback, Money In The Bank and Hell In A Cell (if the initial reports end up being true) all drew well this year.

Summerslam, Night Of Champions and Battleground are the only shows to do really bad.


----------



## Alo0oy

RebelArch86 said:


> Oh yeah: thread closed/ see Forbes business analysis.


Where's the fun in that?


----------



## #Mark

GeneticJackhammer9 said:


> And they said Bryan would lead the company to a new era when Cena rested for a few months. It only lead to low PPV buyrates.
> 
> :ti


What lowbuyrates are you talking about? Because if IRRC, NOC 2013's final numbers will be better than NOC 2012 and significantly better than NOC 2011.


----------



## JY57

#Mark said:


> What lowbuyrates are you talking about? Because if IRRC, NOC 2013's final numbers will be better than NOC 2012 and significantly better than NOC 2011.


2012 NOC final buys are 207,000 (initial was 189,000) so not sure about that, but it did already pass 2011 (which is sad for Punk vs Hunter)


----------



## markedfordeath

and the buy rates for Battle ground were expected to be piss poor, so I don't see the problem...Bryan did fairly well for the time Cena was out. Ratings have stayed the same since Cena got back, so I don't understand what Bryan did wrong. And Night of Champions did decent and HIAC did well, so that's actually pretty good without Cena don't you all think?


----------



## Jerichoholic4Life

markedfordeath said:


> and the buy rates for Battle ground were expected to be piss poor, so I don't see the problem...Bryan did fairly well for the time Cena was out. Ratings have stayed the same since Cena got back, so I don't understand what Bryan did wrong. And Night of Champions did decent and HIAC did well, so that's actually pretty good without Cena don't you all think?


175,000 buys (the lowest of the year at the time) is decent? I thought anything under 200-195,000 was considered poor. I remember people ripping the Payback buyrate which ended up at 198,000 buys and now all of a sudden some of those same people are trying to claim 175,000 isn’t bad.

And with Bryan/Orton drawing so badly the first two times I think it would be safe to safe that Hell In A Cell did well because of John Cena’s return, Shawn Michaels’ appearance or the Cell gimmick more than Bryan/Orton. If it was Bryan/Orton that people cared about then NOC and BG wouldn’t have done so poorly.

Please don’t try and paint me as a Bryan hater here. I’m a fan of the guy but sometimes you’ve just got to call a spade a spade. It’s patronizing to him when he headlines the two worst drawing shows of the year and you try to spin it into a positive.


----------



## markedfordeath

still don't see how its his fault...enlighten me on what the guy did wrong. They sabotaged him from the get go, even he has a problem with the booking, he was telling the fans to let the company know what their opinion is, you can tell the guy is upset as how he was portrayed, he was only doing what he was told. And if I remember correctly, there was an "Orton is boring" chant on Raw this past Monday, tells you what people think of the guy, he was in those main events too.


----------



## #Mark

Jerichoholic4Life said:


> 175,000 buys (the lowest of the year at the time) is decent? I thought anything under 200-195,000 was considered poor. I remember people ripping the Payback buyrate which ended up at 198,000 buys and now all of a sudden some of those same people are trying to claim 175,000 isn’t bad.
> 
> And with Bryan/Orton drawing so badly the first two times I think it would be safe to safe that Hell In A Cell did well because of John Cena’s return, Shawn Michaels’ appearance or the Cell gimmick more than Bryan/Orton. If it was Bryan/Orton that people cared about then NOC and BG wouldn’t have done so poorly.
> 
> Please don’t try and paint me as a Bryan hater here. I’m a fan of the guy but sometimes you’ve just got to call a spade a spade. It’s patronizing to him when he headlines the two worst drawing shows of the year and you try to spin it into a positive.


NOC is generally one of the lowest drawing PPVs though. This year's initial buys already surpassed NOC 2011 (A PPV that had HHH wrestling for the first time in almost six months, CM Punk in the midst of his Summer of Punk push, John Cena as WWE champ, and Randy Orton as World Champ) and NOC 2013's final numbers will most likely the same as last year's number. That's actually pretty remarkable considering it was a ONE match show.. Bryan/Orton was the only match with any interest whatsoever.


----------



## markedfordeath

People keep forgetting that people got refunds as well..so those buys were taken away from the event.


----------



## superuser1

markedfordeath said:


> still don't see how its his fault...enlighten me on what the guy did wrong. They sabotaged him from the get go, even he has a problem with the booking, he was telling the fans to let the company know what their opinion is, you can tell the guy is upset as how he was portrayed, he was only doing what he was told. And if I remember correctly, there was an "Orton is boring" chant on Raw this past Monday, tells you what people think of the guy, he was in those main events too.


You love blaming everyone but Bryan though. Maybe he is the reason ever thought about that? And you talking about a boring chant to a HEEL that lasted for under 30 seconds.


----------



## vanboxmeer

The fact of the matter is Orton is going to continue main-eventing PPVs as the WWE champion while Bryan is making midcard money doing odd jobs and making people look better. If Bryan was really as hot a financial commodity and worthy of "replacing" Cena, his hottest period should have yielded greater numbers in some area. In reality, he didn't sell more merch than Cena does, he didn't sell PPVs, house show numbers weren't any higher, ratings didn't go up at all. Not a single financial indicator suggested any legitimate reason for Vince's mind to keep going with a guy he never believed would be in that spot to begin with. So now he's a lameduck babyface going through the motions in the midcard until his inevitable heel turn.


----------



## Eddie Ray

vanboxmeer said:


> The fact of the matter is Orton is going to continue main-eventing PPVs as the WWE champion while Bryan is making midcard money doing odd jobs and making people look better. If Bryan was really as hot a financial commodity and worthy of "replacing" Cena, his hottest period should have yielded greater numbers in some area. In reality, he didn't sell more merch than Cena does, he didn't sell PPVs, house show numbers weren't any higher, ratings didn't go up at all. Not a single financial indicator suggested any legitimate reason for Vince's mind to keep going with a guy he never believed would be in that spot to begin with. So now he's a lameduck babyface going through the motions in the midcard until his inevitable heel turn.


it was the beginning of his upper card push. he shouldn't be drawing mega numbers for at least 6 months. he needed this time to be legitimized and separated from his tag work, or at least grow something from that organically, instead he was demeaned, belittled and always came up short. Fortunately he still remains the most over on the roster (a tie with Punk, Cena second) and now it appears that the big midcard storyline is the only thing worth watching at SS so there is a slight blessing in disguise there. He may be out of the Title picture but it appears that the title picture is the only thing suffering for it.
as for his merch, dude, he sells it by the bucket load. So he doesn't shift more merch than Cena, big whoop. its near impossible to do that right now anyway, and Cena should be selling more, hes been built up for 10 years. that sort of booking should pay dividends.


----------



## markedfordeath

why would I blame Bryan when he didn't do anything wrong..the crowd still never stopped loving the guy...its not his fault that they booked him like shit, how come none of you can see that? if anything, the reason why Summerslam got any buys at all was due to him..look at his reactions on a nightly basis, and they have the gall to blame him for anything bad happening? that's a cop out if i've ever seen one...for any of you to blame him is ridiculous too. name one thing the guy did that he wasn't told to do! he was doing what he was told and for doing his job he gets blamed...thats seriously retarded.


----------



## vanboxmeer

Eddie Ray said:


> it was the beginning of his upper card push. he shouldn't be drawing mega numbers for at least 6 months. he needed this time to be legitimized and separated from his tag work, or at least grow something from that organically, instead he was demeaned, belittled and always came up short. Fortunately he still remains the most over on the roster (a tie with Punk, Cena second) and now it appears that the big midcard storyline is the only thing worth watching at SS so there is a slight blessing in disguise there. He may be out of the Title picture but it appears that the title picture is the only thing suffering for it.
> as for his merch, dude, he sells it by the bucket load. So he doesn't shift more merch than Cena, big whoop. its near impossible to do that right now anyway, and Cena should be selling more, hes been built up for 10 years. that sort of booking should pay dividends.


When a stale Cena outsells Bryan at his hottest point, there's no point in replacing Cena for Bryan. The "standard medium" is outdrawing the prospect at his peak of momentum. That's all that matters to Vince, the bottom line. Punk has his spot because he at his peak did draw on a PPV and his shirt was greatly outpacing Cena's. You need to prove that you can draw higher than the standard level to Vince even if it's only once. That's all there is to it.


----------



## markedfordeath

the fact that nobody gives a shit about the title match should tell Vince all he needs to know..hopefully he realizes that maybe it could be Orton. you can't blame Bryan anymore when the buyrates keep going down. and since the ratings have been getting worse, you can't blame Bryan anymore, so now he looks ridiculous for picking that as the excuse when its proven that it isnt.


----------



## superuser1

markedfordeath said:


> the fact that nobody gives a shit about the title match should tell Vince all he needs to know..hopefully he realizes that maybe it could be Orton. you can't blame Bryan anymore when the buyrates keep going down. and since the ratings have been getting worse, you can't blame Bryan anymore, so now he looks ridiculous for picking that as the excuse when its proven that it isnt.


The thing is Orton has already proved himself. His shirts outsold Cena's I think back in 2009 I'm not sure the exact year it was but his merchandise was the top seller at one point. So Orton's gonna be in the main event regardless because he's a proven guy. What hurt Bryan the most is the WWE's lack of patience nowadays. Business isn't how it once was anymore. If they push you and you're not bringing in numbers they're gonna knock you right off and put someone else in your spot.


----------



## Billion Dollar Man

markedfordeath said:


> *the fact that nobody gives a shit about the title match should tell Vince all he needs to know*..hopefully he realizes that maybe it could be Orton. you can't blame Bryan anymore when the buyrates keep going down. and since the ratings have been getting worse, you can't blame Bryan anymore, so now he looks ridiculous for picking that as the excuse when its proven that it isnt.


The IWC isn't everybody.


----------



## Waffelz

800k gain from da BIG Show. He'll probably have donned this week too, the lump of shite he is.


----------



## #Mark

vanboxmeer said:


> The fact of the matter is Orton is going to continue main-eventing PPVs as the WWE champion while Bryan is making midcard money doing odd jobs and making people look better. If Bryan was really as hot a financial commodity and worthy of "replacing" Cena, his hottest period should have yielded greater numbers in some area. In reality, he didn't sell more merch than Cena does, he didn't sell PPVs, house show numbers weren't any higher, ratings didn't go up at all. Not a single financial indicator suggested any legitimate reason for Vince's mind to keep going with a guy he never believed would be in that spot to begin with. So now he's a lameduck babyface going through the motions in the midcard until his inevitable heel turn.


In what world does it make sense to accurately gauge a wrestler's long term success during the first month of their push? NO one becomes a top draw overnight. It took all of the top guys in the past (Austin, Rock, Cena.. Hell even Orton and Punk) several months and really hard pushes to become the stars that they eventually became. Bryan was never awarded that luxury. He had a begrudging push that was only served to parlay heat to HHH. In fact, He had one of the worst babyface main event pushes in WWE history. 

Here's his push timeline:

He was the fall guy for the Shield throughout the Spring well into late June, he was then taken out by Curtis Axel at MITB and didn't even get retribution, then he was pitifully chosen as Cena's opponent at Summerslam and the entire build to the program was Vince burying him, he then went over Cena only to drop the belt to Orton (Every main event face in the last decade has had that career defining first championship victory: Austin at WM 14, Rock at Backlash 2000, Benoit at WM 20, Orton at Summerslam 2004, Cena and Batista at WM21, Punk at MITB 2011. Bryan dropping the belt after winning it for the first time completely devalued what was supposed to be a career defining moment), he was then verbally buried by HHH on a weekly basis in a manner that's never been seen before on WWE TV, he was then laid out for six straight shows and failed to win the Championship at three straight PPVs until he ultimately decided to stop trying.

All things considered Bryan's run WAS a financial success. Smackdown viewership increased during the summer and fall when he was main eventing, his segments on RAW were generally always successful (especially during the Summer when he was gaining hundreds of thousands of viewers no matter what time slot he was on, in fact, his match with Rollins in August had the highest overrun since the RTWM), there wasn't a decrease in house show revenue despite the absence of the biggest star in the industry, and the one PPV buyrate that has circulated with Bryan as the main event face did a buyrate similar to last years and better than the year before. 

Now, I am in agreement that Bryan's push was never meant to make him a star. His entire main event push was a knee jerk reaction to the fact that they had NO other main event babyfaces (Cena got hurt, Sheamus was hurt, Orton kept begging to turn heel, they fucked Ryback up, Punk was in a long term program with Heyman).. They also knew that they could capitalize on his success by having him transfer his momentum to their authority angle. They only had him go over Cena in a convincing manner because the subsequent HHH and Orton heel turns would get more heat if it was done on Bryan (also because Cena was taking time off). The WWE may be inept, but do you think they really believed that belittling Bryan and booking Big Show above him would make him a star? Of course not.


----------



## vanboxmeer

#Mark said:


> In what world does it make sense to accurately gauge a wrestler's long term success during the first month of their push?


In the only world that matters. Vince McMahon's. As he would put it, he gave Bryan an "opportunity", and to him Bryan was a failure as an attraction.


----------



## vanboxmeer

The fact that the moment Vince got an inkling of how Summerslam did, he panicked. So they had to put Cena on even greater doses of TRT and revamped their own wellness policy during that time specifically to get him back ASAP without having a blatant test failure on their guy when his levels were off the chart. Vince probably found out about TRT and "doctor exemptions" in other sports late as usual when it comes to current events outside of the WWE bubble and decided to play the same loop hole to get his future prospects to come in the way he wants 'em.


----------



## markedfordeath

I love how Bryan sticks it to management though, he's like "see this crowd? they fucking love me, I don't give a shit what you think Vince" Its funny how management just ignores what is right in front of them. And I love how with him out of the main event the ratings have stayed the same LOL


----------



## vanboxmeer

markedfordeath said:


> I love how Bryan sticks it to management though, he's like "see this crowd? they fucking love me, I don't give a shit what you think Vince" Its funny how management just ignores what is right in front of them. And I love how with him out of the main event the ratings have stayed the same LOL


Big Show can say the same thing. And Hunter can say it's "heat" for himself. And Vince can say "Guy said a thousand Yes's, but couldn't draw a dime".


----------



## Alo0oy

Eddie Ray said:


> it was the beginning of his upper card push. he shouldn't be drawing mega numbers for at least 6 months. he needed this time to be legitimized and separated from his tag work, or at least grow something from that organically, instead he was demeaned, belittled and always came up short. Fortunately *he still remains the most over on the roster (a tie with Punk*, Cena second) and now it appears that the big midcard storyline is the only thing worth watching at SS so there is a slight blessing in disguise there. He may be out of the Title picture but it appears that the title picture is the only thing suffering for it.
> as for his merch, dude, he sells it by the bucket load. So he doesn't shift more merch than Cena, big whoop. its near impossible to do that right now anyway, and Cena should be selling more, hes been built up for 10 years. that sort of booking should pay dividends.


No...The last time Bryan got a pop bigger than Punk was over a month ago. He's not the most over guy on the roster anymore.


----------



## Jof

#Mark said:


> In fact, He had one of the worst babyface main event pushes in WWE history.


One of the worst babyface pushes? Really? Do you even have any idea what you're talking about?



> He was the fall guy for the Shield throughout the Spring well into late June, he was then taken out by Curtis Axel at MITB and didn't even get retribution, then he was pitifully chosen as Cena's opponent at Summerslam and the entire build to the program was Vince burying him, he then went over Cena only to drop the belt to Orton (Every main event face in the last decade has had that career defining first championship victory: Austin at WM 14, Rock at Backlash 2000, Benoit at WM 20, Orton at Summerslam 2004, Cena and Batista at WM21, Punk at MITB 2011. Bryan dropping the belt after winning it for the first time completely devalued what was supposed to be a career defining moment), he was then verbally buried by HHH on a weekly basis in a manner that's never been seen before on WWE TV, he was then laid out for six straight shows and failed to win the Championship at three straight PPVs until he ultimately decided to stop trying.


Before Summerslam he was just a mid card star, even then he was the first person to pin the Shield from what I understand. MITB with Axel was merely just a mid match spot to lead into Punk/Heyman, You're talking as if it was some top angle on RAW that was dropped, nobody even remembers that past that night. I still fail to see how Vince saying anything as a heel is turned into "buried" crap. This has been happening for years now. Hell, where were you dumb marks when the Rock did it as a babyface back in AE? This whole argument is idiotic, So Vince makes fun of his looks as a heel and he is buried? You know what, If that is infact the case with Bryan, then a guy that weak doesn't belong in the main event in the first place. .

"Every main event face has had that career defining" True, but the thing is, If it was a truly a career defining moment, it'd fucking stick with fans no matter what happens before or after. Its not something that is forced by booking, it happens naturally. Rock following his backlash win lost the title a month later, same with Punk at Summerslm '11, how long did Orton's summerslam win last? Benoit was overshadowed by Shawn Michaels, HHH and even eugene, Cena's win itself was completely overshadowed by Batista/HHH. But fans still remember those moments because they were career defining, but with Bryan that is evidently not the case. You said it yourself, Cena "pitifully" picked Bryan from the roster on a random RAW and on top of that, the guy was injured the entire time. Compare this to Punk/Cena MITB '11 momentum, buzz, the fan reaction and its not even in the ballpark. The truth is Bryan defining moment is yet to happen and I'm sure it will, if you marks just be patient with him.

As for booking post summerslam, I love how you pick just the right parts for your argument, and just ignore the rest. Bryan was laid out by the authority for the first three straight Raws, that's it. Starting the go home show of NOC, he was the one standing tall almost everyweek, whether it'd be Shield, Orton or Triple H himself. He was never made to look weak after that. He didn't lose three straight PPVs, NOC he fucking won CLEAN. Battleground had no winner, Orton was screwed as much as Bryan. Hell in a cell was the only PPV he lost and even that wasn't clean. The next night Shawn Michaels of all people, is tapping out in the middle of the ring. Pinning John Cena at summerslam, being the main event focus for three whole months, having Shawn Michaels tap out...so this is what you call "one of the worst pushes ever" huh? Just plain dumb. 




> All things considered Bryan's run WAS a financial success. Smackdown viewership increased during the summer and fall when he was main eventing, his segments on RAW were generally always successful (especially during the Summer when he was gaining hundreds of thousands of viewers no matter what time slot he was on, in fact, his match with Rollins in August had the highest overrun since the RTWM), there wasn't a decrease in house show revenue despite the absence of the biggest star in the industry, and the one PPV buyrate that has circulated with Bryan as the main event face did a buyrate similar to last years and better than the year before.


Why are we even talking Buyrates and business metrics when WWE isn't even pushing him based on numbers? You're talking about stagnant smackdown numbers when Summerslam itself drew all time low buyrate and Bryan was still main eventing three months later. If they cared as much, Bryan's push would have been dropped months ago. Fact is, they are behind him no matter what. They push him because they want to. Anyone who doesn't see this, needs to stop pretending to be smart wrestling fan, because you're nothing more than an average mark getting worked. You don't make a retired legend tap out in the middle of the ring, If the company doesn't want you to be a star.


----------



## markedfordeath

thanks Jof, your post made me feel good...Makes me think that report of them blaming him was all just bullshit, because it coincides with the storyline an awful lot!


----------



## Vyer

vanboxmeer said:


> The fact that the moment Vince got an inkling of how Summerslam did, he panicked. So they had to put Cena on even greater doses of TRT and revamped their own wellness policy during that time specifically to get him back ASAP without having a blatant test failure on their guy when his levels were off the chart. Vince probably found out about TRT and "doctor exemptions" in other sports late as usual when it comes to current events outside of the WWE bubble and decided to play the same loop hole to get his future prospects to come in the way he wants 'em.


I hope you're not serious...


----------



## Starbuck

> _The final segment itself with the HHH/Big Show settlement plus Show vs. Orton & The Shield in the handicap match *gained 861,000 viewers, which is one of the best final segment growth periods*. So it wasn’t the final segment that died and killed the third hour as much as the period from 10:15 to 10:45 where viewership was low._


:lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao

Oh Jesus that's just too damn funny. BIG SHOWS REVENGE. Gets ripped a new ass based on numbers for one demo only to come back and rip the asses of everybody who laughed at him with DAT HUGE GAIN. 

:lol Hilarious. 

:show :HHH2 rton2 :show :HHH2 rton2

It's just unfortunate that it didn't happen again this week. I'm telling you Punk/Bryan fans, you guys need to get on this so that when the same thing likely happens when the numbers come out for this week, you guys can get the last laugh.

Too fucking funny. Who needs DA GAME to come with his shovel when you're all very capable of burying yourselves.


----------



## TheStig

Starbuck said:


> :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao
> 
> Oh Jesus that's just too damn funny. BIG SHOWS REVENGE. Gets ripped a new ass based on numbers for one demo only to come back and rip the asses of everybody who laughed at him with DAT HUGE GAIN.
> 
> :lol Hilarious.
> 
> :show :HHH2 rton2 :show :HHH2 rton2
> 
> It's just unfortunate that it didn't happen again this week. I'm telling you Punk/Bryan fans, you guys need to get on this so that when the same thing likely happens when the numbers come out for this week, you guys can get the last laugh.
> 
> Too fucking funny. Who needs DA GAME to come with his shovel when you're all very capable of burying yourselves.


What happend to the old breakdown when they showed both gains and ratings, it was more informative than this one.


----------



## Starbuck

TheStig said:


> What happend to the old breakdown when they showed both gains and ratings, it was more informative than this one.


I don't know. Observer have been pretty shit lately tbh and the Torch only shows one demo. It's best when you get both because it gives the best overall picture. One without the other ends up being too vague.


----------



## hag

Some of the people giving Bryan and Punk all of the heat are fucking stupid and uneducated. Bryan has been in one of the worst programs of the main event scene in a while. It's all about how a person is built whether or not they "draw" Super fucking Cena has "drawn" crazy numbers because they book him like he is superman.

Bryan had the title taken away from him. Twice. Fans began to realize that that program was going absolute no where which is exactly what happened. HBK "screwed" Bryan out of the title, Bryan came back with a crossface the next night on Raw and the fans were just supposed to expect that be the end of the storyline. We all were saying how this was going to lead to Bryans triumphant title run and everything was going to be great. The whole thing was just anticlimax. We didn't have any answers at the end of the feud, we were left cliff hanging with Daniel Bryan and the WWE title.

CM Punk worked with the biggest pieces of shit on the roster. Nobody needs an explanation on why CM Punk had terrible numbers, because Axel and Ryback are bore-fest.

This comes without mentioning, but looking at some of the uneducated people in this thread who are blaming all of their problems on Bryan and Punk, I feel like I need to explain it. This isn't the fucking attitude Era people. NOBODY draws those numbers anymore. I feel like all of you guys are just going in circles. Nobody really "draws" by themselve anymore. It's an entire team effort. It's an entire product effort. It's *entertainment*.


----------



## Starbuck

RichardHagen said:


> I feel like all of you guys are just going in circles.


:HHH2


----------



## Cena rulz12345

markedfordeath said:


> I love how Bryan sticks it to management though, he's like "see this crowd? they fucking love me, I don't give a shit what you think Vince" Its funny how management just ignores what is right in front of them. And I love how with him out of the main event the ratings have stayed the same LOL


fpalm
did you even see raw.
the uk crowed chanted yes more loudly for big show than bryan



markedfordeath said:


> *the fact that nobody gives a shit about the title match should tell Vince all he needs to know*..hopefully he realizes that maybe it could be Orton. you can't blame Bryan anymore when the buyrates keep going down. and since the ratings have been getting worse, you can't blame Bryan anymore, so now he looks ridiculous for picking that as the excuse when its proven that it isnt.


800 ppl do care for it,while only 32000 ppl care for bryan :lmao


----------



## Londrick

Nothing impressive about that gain considering Ziggler and Axel lost a million in the same hour.



Cena rulz12345 said:


> fpalm
> did you even see raw.
> the uk crowed chanted yes more loudly for big show than bryan
> 
> 
> 800 ppl do care for it,while only 32000 ppl care for bryan :lmao


Last I checked 32000> 800. :angle


----------



## Eddie Ray

Alo0oy said:


> No...The last time Bryan got a pop bigger than Punk was over a month ago. He's not the most over guy on the roster anymore.


he often ties with Punk. its a fact. yes, his pops have dwindled SLIGHTLY but the booking has been fucking terrible so I expect a slight decline. i'm a fan of both for the record, so im not favouring one over the other and im certainly not getting involved in the mark wars bullshit.


----------



## Alo0oy

Eddie Ray said:


> he often ties with Punk. its a fact. yes, his pops have dwindled SLIGHTLY but the booking has been fucking terrible so I expect a slight decline. i'm a fan of both for the record, so im not favouring one over the other and im certainly not getting involved in the mark wars bullshit.


It hasn't been close to a tie since the Battleground go home show, Punk has been outpopping Bryan for a while now, surely there's enough video evidence to support that, you can watch if you don't believe me.

Hell, during the face off between Orton & Bryan for their second match, Orton got a bigger pop than Bryan, & he was a heel. You can look that up on youtube.

I'm not blaming you for not noticing though, since he was getting crazy pops in July, August, & early September.


----------



## vanboxmeer

The Yes Chants are now certainly more over than Daniel Bryan. He's become the costumed team mascot of the chant, but the chant has clearly been transferred as the signature warcry of the WWE Universe™ in the face of The Authority™.

Can't wait for that Roman Reigns Tribal Yes Shirt to come out.


----------



## KO Bossy

Ah yes, I see that the Bryan apologists are out in full effect. "THIS STORY IS TERRIBLE, ITS NOT HIS FAULT!" Yeah, and like 2 months ago, you were all raving about how amazing it was, and that it was the best story in years. And not a good babyface push? That is so laughable. The guy did better than win the title, he beat JOHN CENA...CLEANLY. That's like 10 titles right there. Then beat ORTON...CLEANLY...TWICE (back in the early summer and at Battleground). And he's main evented the last...4 PPVs. And almost constantly wins matches.

As I've said before, for Bryan marks, anything short of his induction into godhood will never be enough.


----------



## Rick Sanchez

Am I the only Bryan fan who hates the beard? I honestly think it makes him look silly. Either his old ROH look or the look he had back in late 2011 would be better. Besides, his fans are still gonna chant yes even without the facial hair. Not that I care, I never cared for the YES crap. Just wanna see him wrestle, which he does better than anyone at the moment.


----------



## THANOS

Barry Dylan said:


> Am I the only Bryan fan who hates the beard? I honestly think it makes him look silly. Either his old ROH look or the look he had back in late 2011 would be better. Besides, his fans are still gonna chant yes even without the facial hair. Not that I care, I never cared for the YES crap. Just wanna see him wrestle, which he does better than anyone at the moment.


I'm with you man. I'd like a shorter beard circa late 2011, and either his current hair or his lat 2011 hair and his look would be great and much more fitting of the role he's currently playing. I won't say it's more marketable because his fake beard props are selling like hotcakes at the live shows and off wwe shop, but it's definitely much more presentable imo.


----------



## markedfordeath

does anyone agree that Vince has a problem with Bryan?


----------



## Eddie Ray

markedfordeath said:


> does anyone agree that Vince has a problem with Bryan?


the problem with Vince is that he blows hot and cold depending on what mood he is in...and the booking reflects it.


----------



## krai999

Barry Dylan said:


> Am I the only Bryan fan who hates the beard? I honestly think it makes him look silly. Either his old ROH look or the look he had back in late 2011 would be better. Besides, his fans are still gonna chant yes even without the facial hair. Not that I care, I never cared for the YES crap. Just wanna see him wrestle, which he does better than anyone at the moment.


your not the only one man this look in my sig is the best imo


----------



## THANOS

krai999 said:


> your not the only one man this look in my sig is the best imo


Ah yes the Chuck Norris look will always be the best. The picture is so intimidating that it nearly KO'd me after only a glance. :


----------



## Kamaria

Debating about who draws and who doesn't is silly and there are more factors than just who's on TV at the moment that determine what segments gain or lose viewers. You have to look at the bigger picture. But if you did want to argue, I'd say that of course Bryan doesn't draw as well as WWE veterans because he isn't established enough. Rock or Austin would have never drawn a dime in 2013 if they were breaking into the business just now as Rocky Maivia or The Ringmaster.


----------



## markedfordeath

thank you! exactly my point..he's not known to casuals fully just yet, so of course he shouldn't be expected to draw..I bet after this program with the Wyatts, Bryan will be a bigger draw because he'll be a bad ass coming out of this program..Also, HUGE Daniel Bryan chant at the beginning of Smackdown tonight, and Erick Rowan is a fucking horrible wrestler....I don't think Bryan or Punk could even save him, he almost killed a Uso twice tonight.


----------



## Rick Sanchez

krai999 said:


> your not the only one man this look in my sig is the best imo


I love that look, he looks way more badass.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

Londrick said:


> Last I checked 32000> 800. :angle


oh i forgot to add 'k' so now
800k> 32000



markedfordeath said:


> does anyone agree that Vince has a problem with Bryan?


it's all about the money.
vince will give el-torito the fotc if he was out drawin cena in every fashion WHICH bryan have'nt done.


----------



## vanboxmeer

Big Show is a perfectly fine babyface replacement for Bryan anyways. It's not like the TV audience has "rebelled" against the placement of him in that spot. Or the TV crowds. Bryan's babyface headlining days are over, just let him flounder around doing odd jobs before his number gets called up again when he turns heel. That's all there is to it.


----------



## JY57

vanboxmeer said:


> Big Show is a perfectly fine babyface replacement for Bryan anyways. It's not like the TV audience has "rebelled" against the placement of him in that spot. Or the TV crowds. Bryan's babyface headlining days are over, just let him flounder around doing odd jobs before his number gets called up again when he turns heel. That's all there is to it.


Not sure turning heel is any better. Chance is he gets fed to Cena and then starts jobbing to guys like Justin Gabriel on Main Event.


----------



## vanboxmeer

JY57 said:


> Not sure turning heel is any better. Chance is he gets fed to Cena and then starts jobbing to guys like Justin Gabriel on Main Event.


It's far better getting a 2 month main event program against Cena and moving down the card, then simply moving down the card as a babyface without the 2 months of main event house show pay days as he's in the process of doing right now anyways.


----------



## shought321

It's not all bad vanboxmeer, when he turns heel he can get back together with AJ.


----------



## Johncena-hhh

3 hours for TV show

Too much

Two hours better than 3


----------



## markedfordeath

Jobbing on Main Event like Gabriel? Ha ha you guys are too much sometimes..thanks for the laugh! They'll give the guy another chance. More people watch around RTWM time. Nobody watches around this time of year, well not much any way and business is always down. Nobody would be able to salvage business right now..They put more spotlight on bigger guys and the ratings are the exact same that they were a month ago...See, nobody can help it right now. They'll give Bryan another chance, there will be more viewers and business will start to pick up and he'll be front and center. If you guys think anyone could help business right now you're insane! Because nobody has been able to and they have big guys at the forefront right now. Not even Cena is helping like they thought he would..they still haven't had 3.0's since August. Its a lost cause around this time of year, the talent is just wasting their time on autopilot until January.


----------



## vanboxmeer

It's quite hilarious when UFC has better storylines than WWE. And Uncle Dana is right up there with Paulie-chan at cutting promos.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

markedfordeath said:


> Jobbing on Main Event like Gabriel? Ha ha you guys are too much sometimes..thanks for the laugh! They'll give the guy another chance. More people watch around RTWM time. Nobody watches around this time of year, well not much any way and business is always down. Nobody would be able to salvage business right now..They put more spotlight on bigger guys and the ratings are the exact same that they were a month ago...See, nobody can help it right now. They'll give Bryan another chance, there will be more viewers and business will start to pick up and he'll be front and center. If you guys think anyone could help business right now you're insane! Because nobody has been able to and they have big guys at the forefront right now. Not even Cena is helping like they thought he would..they still haven't had 3.0's since August. Its a lost cause around this time of year, the talent is just wasting their time on autopilot until January.


You know what would suck? WWE sees all of Brie's improvement in the ring and decides to make Bryan this generation's Finlay and he becomes the head diva trainer in NXT.


----------



## Eddie Ray

Best4Bidness said:


> You know what would suck? WWE sees all of Brie's improvement in the ring and decides to make Bryan this generation's Finlay and he becomes the head diva trainer in NXT.


they don't need to, they have Sara Del Ray, who is essentially the female Daniel Bryan anyway.


----------



## Alo0oy

Best4Bidness said:


> You know what would suck? WWE sees all of Brie's improvement in the ring and decides to make Bryan this generation's Finlay and he becomes the head diva trainer in NXT.


Judging from the improved Brie Bella, Bryan sucks as a trainer.


----------



## JY57

> Last week's TV ratings pop for WWE Smackdown was short-lived.
> 
> Smackdown on Friday, November 15 scored a 1.90 rating, down nine percent from last week's season-high 2.08 rating. It was the same rating as two weeks ago on Nov. 1.
> 
> Smackdown averaged 2.684 million viewers, down nine percent compared to last week's season-high (2,946,000). Viewership was also less than two weeks ago, which averaged 2.730 million viewers.
> 
> - On cable TV Friday night, Smackdown ranked #3 in overall viewers. Also, Smackdown ranked #4 in males 18-34 and #3 in males 18-49, trailing "Gold Rush" on Discovery and NBA basketball on ESPN.
> 
> - In the week-to-week demos, Smackdown was hit hard across the board compared to last week's season-ghih episode.
> 
> Teen males 12-17 dropped three-tenths of a rating and males 12-34 dropped two-tenths of a rating to one-month lows. Also, m18-34 & m18-49 dropped two-tenths of a rating to one-month lows.


via PWTorch


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Think I've missed 2 eps of SD tbh. Needs some Sandow/Cena interaction. Not feeling the Rio/Cena.


----------



## markedfordeath

the best part about this Raw, is the fact that now they know that there is more interest in the Wyatts/Punk, Bryan match, then everything else on the card. You can tell because that's been the main event the last two weeks and has had the most focus on Raw and Smackdown. So they're using Punk and Bryan to sell another PPV. So much for the reports that they're considered midcard. Orton, Cena and Big Show are like in the first hour every week of Raw, and the other two are in the main event and get the focus...Thats the match selling Survivor Series.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

markedfordeath said:


> the best part about this Raw, is the fact that now they know that there is more interest in the Wyatts/Punk, Bryan match, then everything else on the card. You can tell because that's been the main event the last two weeks and has had the most focus on Raw and Smackdown. So they're using Punk and Bryan to sell another PPV. So much for the reports that they're considered midcard. Orton, Cena and Big Show are like in the first hour every week of Raw, and the other two are in the main event and get the focus...*Thats the match selling Survivor Series*.


Actually it seems like there is more interest in a Wyatt/Shield match than the Wyatts/Punk-Bryan match.

If that's the case will you be willing to put the blame on them if Survivor Series doesn't draw? Because using that theory Daniel Bryan vs John Cena was the match selling Summerslam and it didn't do well, yet the IWC was trying all they could to deflect blame from Daniel Bryan.


----------



## markedfordeath

whats your beef with Bryan any way? your boy Orton isn't even facing him anymore LOL


----------



## Antomine

markedfordeath said:


> whats your beef with Bryan any way? your boy Orton isn't even facing him anymore LOL


I don't think he has a beef with Bryan, I think he's just calling out your hypocrisy. If (and it appears wwe is) Bryan and Punk are being put in the main event night after night, and are the ones that are suppose to draw for Survivor Series and Survivor Series rates are shit will it be Punk and Bryan's fault?

Same question as above, except Survivor Series does amazingly well, will that be because of Punk and Bryan?

Here's a hint, the answer to both questions MUST be the same.


----------



## FITZ

Honestly I find most of the arguments in this thread to be pointless and based off very poor analysis for TV ratings. 

That being said I'm really curious to see what the live performance music performance did for the ratings. I know I changed the channel immediately and watched Monday Night Football for a little bit before tuning back in for the main event.


----------



## JY57

> -- Despite WWE Raw returning live and carrying a theme this week heading into Survivor Series, Raw remained below the 200,000 benchmark in social media activity.
> 
> Raw scored 195,965 in social activity, according to Trendrr.TV, up 13 percent from 173k for last week's taped show from the U.K. This week's 195k score represents a Top 5 lowest score of the year.
> 
> Raw ranked #2 on cable TV behind a down-to-the-wire Monday Night Football game on ESPN and stayed ahead of the typical #1 show on Monday nights, "Love & Hip Hop," on VH1.


via PWTorch


----------



## EndOfAnEra

Not bad at all.


----------



## Gretchen

Been reading through some Raw ratings thread's old posts, don't know if this one or not.

:lmao @ some of the arguments and mark wars


----------



## JY57

Total Divas Viewership Increases to 1,411,000

up from 1,300,000 from last week


----------



## validreasoning

TaylorFitz said:


> Honestly I find most of the arguments in this thread to be pointless


its also not like there is really much to talk about in general. raw is about as consistent a show right now in terms of viewership that you can find pretty much anywhere. mania season raw averages 4.3-5 million viewers. may till august raw averages 4-4.4 million viewers and football season raw averages 3.5-4 million



JY57 said:


> Total Divas Viewership Increases to 1,411,000
> 
> up from 1,300,000 from last week



no big kardashians lead in either, last time it lost that it dropped 400,000 viewers, this time it gained which bodes well for the future of that show. last week was 1.255 million so they gained quite a bit this week.


----------



## JY57

Hour 1 - 3.768 million
Hour 2 - 3.965 million
Hour 3 - 3.674 million


----------



## Alo0oy

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 3.965 million
> Hour 2 - 3.768 million
> Hour 3 - 3.674 million


When was the last time hour 3 had the most viewers? & when was the last time viewers increased throughout the show from hour 1 to 2 to 3?


----------



## JY57

Alo0oy said:


> When was the last time hour 3 had the most viewers? & when was the last time viewers increased throughout the show from hour 1 to 2 to 3?


about 8 weeks ago. its looks like something like last year the 3rd hour was the lowest for like 20 straight weeks and like 35 out of 40 weeks. Not sure if that will happen again, but it says that people probably find it too long


----------



## Choke2Death

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 3.965 million
> Hour 2 - 3.768 million
> Hour 3 - 3.674 million


THAT FIRST HOUR. rton2


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The numbers I saw had the hour 1 and 2 numbers flipped:

http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/Tvbythenumbers/~3/04qKcsiyPKQ/


----------



## Bubba Chuck

Choke2Death said:


> THAT FIRST HOUR. rton2


BEST FOR BUSINESS

:hhh2


----------



## #Mark

I hope the live performance has a massive loss.


----------



## Waffelz

John Cena bringing in the ratings.


----------



## WWE

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 3.768 million
> Hour 2 - 3.965 million
> Hour 3 - 3.674 million


And who dominated the third hour? :bryan2 unk2 
Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Vyer

Best4Bidness said:


> The numbers I saw had the hour 1 and 2 numbers flipped:
> 
> http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/Tvbythenumbers/~3/04qKcsiyPKQ/


If this is true then wonder what went on during this time. Alright numbers though.


----------



## #Mark

CYC said:


> And who dominated the third hour? :bryan2 unk2
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


Cena was on at the top of third hour too.


----------



## TheStig

Any chances of them dropping below 3 mil viewers during late december? It doesn't look far from it right now.


----------



## markedfordeath

main event and over run probably did the best...all the filler bullshit is what kills everything..WWE will never learn..they should make every feud exciting! Instead of only a couple.


----------



## JY57

final rating - 2.73 (same as last week)


----------



## JY57

> Despite returning live and to the U.S. on Monday, WWE Raw's TV rating was flat compared to last week's show.
> 
> "Raw Country" on November 18 scored a 2.73 rating, the same as last week's show and down slightly from a 2.75 rating two weeks ago.
> 
> - Raw averaged 3.802 million viewers, up slightly from an average of 3.768 million viewers last week.
> 
> Hourly Break Down: 3.768 million first hour viewers, increase to 3.965 million second hour viewers, and sharp decline of seven percent to 3.674 million third hour viewers.
> 
> Raw was opposed by a competitive Monday Night Football game, which averaged 15.7 million viewers. This was up five million viewers from last week, but about the same as two weeks ago when Raw scored a similar TV rating. The game remaining competitive to the final play likely hurt Raw's third hour viewership.
> 
> On cable TV Monday night, Raw ranked #2 in total viewers and adult male demos behind football.
> 
> -- In the week-to-week demographic ratings, Raw declined four-tenths of a rating among teen males 12-17, scoring the same rating as two weeks. But, Impact increased two-tenths of a rating in the key demos of m18-34 and m18-49.
> 
> Other than the teen male demo, all demographics were up for the themed Raw that attracted a wider audience of males and females.
> 
> The overall rating was impacted by the extremes, though - decline in the teen male audience and a likely decline in the adult male group outside of the m18-49 window that generally tunes into sports if there is a competitive game.


via PWTorch (few demo numbers discussed)


----------



## Fissiks

that concert probably killed the viewers.


----------



## Eddie Ray

who would have thought in 2013 country music doesn't draw...:side:


----------



## WWE

#Mark said:


> Cena was on at the top of third hour too.


That's why I said who dominated it  They took up (literally) half the hour and more ( I think there was an overrun, not sure though because I barely watched the main event :side


----------



## Waffelz

Forgot the concert was in hour three. Reckon Cena gained around 500k and then the concert lost at least 800-900k. Main Event should gradually gain good numbers.


----------



## markedfordeath

WWE just isn't as popular anymore. Just wait it out until January.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

2.7 :lol 

But WWE has a massive draw!

:cena4


----------



## WWE

markedfordeath said:


> WWE just isn't as popular anymore. Just wait it out until January.


I believe you're right. Too much American programs on TV (Like Dancing With The Stars & Monday Night Football) absorbs viewers. Mainly because of unpredictability of their programs


----------



## Bushmaster

They were against :cam and :brady3


----------



## WWE

Too bad Patriot's lost :jose


----------



## stonefort

Eddie Ray said:


> who would have thought in 2013 country music doesn't draw...:side:


Country music is huge in 2013. Look up some actual music industry data. Get out of your bubble.

In 2012, the last year we have full data, Country and Rock were the only two genres that actually grew in sales. Country grew 4%, Rock grew 2%. Everything else (R&B, Metal, Rap, Alternative, Latin, Dance, Classical, etc) shrank.

Of the top 10 best-selling albums in 2012, 5 were Country. Half.

Facts are crazy things.


----------



## Londrick

Not even Cena being in the same hour can help Team Vanilla Midget draw.


----------



## WWE

I'm just going to go out on a limb and say Taylor Swift is the reason why Country is so popular, right? :side:


----------



## markedfordeath

nobody is ordering survivor series now at all....This Sunday its Brady versus Manning. Big game


----------



## superuser1

markedfordeath said:


> WWE just isn't as popular anymore. Just wait it out until January.


This. And I think they're aware of it which is why things just seem all over the place right now.


----------



## wwe4universe

CYC said:


> I believe you're right. Too much American programs on TV (Like Dancing With The Stars & Monday Night Football) absorbs viewers. Mainly because of unpredictability of their programs


I hate the football excuses. MNF has been around for many decades and raw is capable to get 3.0 against them, as proven in the past. If raw sucks and consumes with fillers, guess what? im gonna change the channel to football. 

Man i just hate old cliche excuses for the poor ratings:

MNF
streaming
world series
nba
other non direct tv programs
minor national holidays
DVR

How about just admit the product sucks at this time? Raw goes country was filled with fillers and concert. It didnt focus on building up to SS. The cena vs del rio has been played out, nobody interested. Big show vs Orton? Man.


----------



## JTB33b

Country music is not to blame for the ratings. If you put the CMA awards up against Raw, The CMA awards would win in a landslide.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Yeah, I don't think Cam Newton has a great affect on Raw ratings. Brady? Yes.


----------



## markedfordeath

I seriously cannot figure out why the WWE cares about ratings and all of that right now..They're in a transitionary period. Young guys need to get built up, Cena is breaking down day by day, you can't rely on part timers forever. Why can't they just sacrifice the short term for the long gain? I don't understand why they can't just go through a down period just to build guys up and reap the rewards in the future years. Its not like they're losing money. They can afford to have a down period right now and wait til guys get super popular.


----------



## Chrome

markedfordeath said:


> I seriously cannot figure out why the WWE cares about ratings and all of that right now..They're in a transitionary period. Young guys need to get built up, Cena is breaking down day by day, you can't rely on part timers forever. Why can't they just sacrifice the short term for the long gain? I don't understand why they can't just go through a down period just to build guys up and reap the rewards in the future years. Its not like they're losing money. They can afford to have a down period right now and wait til guys get super popular.


Ratings = :vince$

I do agree with you though, they should try building new stars first and worry about guest hosts and special themed Raws later.


----------



## Stannis Baratheon.

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Yeah, I don't think Cam Newton has a great affect on Raw ratings. Brady? Yes.


disagree. cam does have an affect on the raw rating. more people america probably know who cam newton is over some line john cena or cm punk..


----------



## #Mark

Very tactical positioning of Punk and Bryan by the WWE. When Survivor Series' buyrate is a failure, despite Show/Orton or Cena/ADR main eventing, Punk and Bryan (especially Bryan) will be the scapegoats because their angle closed the show two weeks in a row.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 3.768 million
> Hour 2 - 3.965 million
> Hour 3 - 3.674 million


dat DRAW rton2



CYC said:


> And who dominated the third hour? :bryan2 unk2
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


let me guess :bryan unk



markedfordeath said:


> I seriously cannot figure out why the WWE cares about ratings and all of that right now..They're in a transitionary period. Young guys need to get built up, Cena is breaking down day by day, you can't rely on part timers forever. Why can't they just sacrifice the short term for the long gain? I don't understand why they can't just go through a down period just to build guys up and reap the rewards in the future years. Its not like they're losing money. They can afford to have a down period right now and wait til guys get super popular.


so last week your excuse was that the show was taped that's why ratings should'nt matter but now when it was live and your boys still did'nt draw you're saying rating should'nt even matter at all.
you're REALLY THE BIGGEST HYPOCRITE ON THIS FORUM.


----------



## Alo0oy

#Mark said:


> Very tactical positioning of Punk and Bryan by the WWE. When Survivor Series' buyrate is a failure, despite Show/Orton or Cena/ADR main eventing, Punk and Bryan (especially Bryan) will be the scapegoats because their angle closed the show two weeks in a row.


I doubt Vince is using entrapment to justify Bryan's depush, if he wants to depush him, he will regardless.


----------



## Starbuck

#Mark said:


> Very tactical positioning of Punk and Bryan by the WWE. When Survivor Series' buyrate is a failure, despite Show/Orton or Cena/ADR main eventing, Punk and Bryan (especially Bryan) will be the scapegoats because their angle closed the show two weeks in a row.


:lmao Appropriately named Mark, you really need to get over yourself. If Vince McMahon didn't want to push Punk or Bryan he wouldn't push them and he doesn't need to justify that decision to anybody but himself. If Vince McMahon wants to blame Punk and Bryan for poor ratings then he'll find a way to blame them regardless of what evidence is put in front of him. I actually think you truly believe he cares what you and other internet fans have to say. I'm sure Vince sits there and thinks up these elaborate ways to push but not push CM Punk and Daniel Bryan so that when the buys come out he has his reason to justify his actions to a bunch of people he'll never see and clearly doesn't give a fuck about nor has he ever given a fuck about. Get real and stop acting like such a...mark...


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

I will NEVER #RiseAboveHate when it comes to these damned dirty bearded dwarves clogging up my third hour

Fuck you Phil Brooks! Fuck you Bryan CANielson! 

Someone lock them up in a gingerbread prison and throw away the key.


----------



## Starbuck

Hour 2 was highest right? Guess who came on at 9pm?

:show


----------



## THANOS

Chrome said:


> Ratings = :vince$
> 
> I do agree with you though, they should try building new stars first and worry about guest hosts and special themed Raws later.


Yeah but they only equal money in contract years where they are trying to get a new deal, but once said deal is reached then they are usually good for a few years no matter what their ratings are. I believe next year the contract with USA is up and according to the report that came out from Forbes WWE is positioned to get a massive new deal even bigger than the one Nascar just signed.


----------



## corporation2.0

Smh at the excuses on these forums:

Main event with Authority/Show holds somewhat steady = Orton and Show can't draw. Bryan and Punk are the real draws, so push them.

Main event with Bryan/Punk bombs = It's the lead-in to the main event which hurt the ratings. Besides, ratings don't matter.

Love the hypocrisy.


----------



## SerapisLiber

Weren't we all just taught a lesson 2 weeks ago about not bitching before the breakdown after Big Show's overrun was prematurely called a flop?


----------



## TheStig

SerapisLiber said:


> Weren't we all just taught a lesson 2 weeks ago about not bitching before the breakdown after Big Show's overrun was prematurely called a flop?


Well mostly because last 2 weeks breakdowns hasn't been out.


----------



## Choke2Death

Starbuck said:


> :lmao Appropriately named Mark, you really need to get over yourself. If Vince McMahon didn't want to push Punk or Bryan he wouldn't push them and he doesn't need to justify that decision to anybody but himself. If Vince McMahon wants to blame Punk and Bryan for poor ratings then he'll find a way to blame them regardless of what evidence is put in front of him. I actually think you truly believe he cares what you and other internet fans have to say. I'm sure Vince sits there and thinks up these elaborate ways to push but not push CM Punk and Daniel Bryan so that when the buys come out he has his reason to justify his actions to a bunch of people he'll never see and clearly doesn't give a fuck about nor has he ever given a fuck about. Get real and stop acting like such a...mark...


Well said. Blaming Vince for supposedly intentionally putting Bryan and Punk in a "bad" spot in hopes of it failing is a new low for the indy midget marks who can't accept their guys are not the mega stars their fans wish they were.


----------



## Starbuck

Choke2Death said:


> Well said. Blaming Vince for supposedly intentionally putting Bryan and Punk in a "bad" spot in hopes of it failing is a new low for the indy midget marks who can't accept their guys are not the mega stars their fans wish they were.


Hey, people can blame Vince for their guys not being stars or whatever all they want. That isn't the issue. It's the fact that MARK believes Vince is coming up with ways to justify not pushing or scapegoating certain guys in order to save face with the internet. He also believes that HHH didn't appear on the taped Raw from London because he knew the rating would tank and he wanted to be exempt from getting the blame. I guess we know why WWE isn't quality entertainment from top to bottom. Clearly Vince and HHH are spending all their time reading internet message boards trying to come up with elaborate plans to justify their actions to the smarks.

unk2

And yep, this thread has been mighty quiet since BIG SHOW silenced the world with that 800k gain the other week lol. WORLDS LARGEST RATINGS.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

#Mark said:


> Very tactical positioning of Punk and Bryan by the WWE. When Survivor Series' buyrate is a failure, despite Show/Orton or Cena/ADR main eventing, Punk and Bryan (especially Bryan) will be the scapegoats because their angle closed the show two weeks in a row.


It will happen. And Survivor Series will be a huge failure. DAT 2.7 rating.

:show :cena4

DEM Modern Day MEGA DRAWS...or something.


----------



## Starbuck

Mister WrestleMania said:


> It will happen. And Survivor Series will be a huge failure. DAT 2.7 rating.
> 
> :show :cena4
> 
> DEM Modern Day MEGA DRAWS...or something.


Of course it will bomb lol but it isn't going mean much since WWE probably already knows it will bomb. If Punk and/or Bryan are written into big Mania plans then they'll be in big Mania plans regardless of how well this PPV does. The end of the year is always filler. Everybody should know that.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Starbuck said:


> Of course it will bomb lol but it isn't going mean much since WWE probably already knows it will bomb. If Punk and/or Bryan are written into big Mania plans then they'll be in big Mania plans regardless of how well this PPV does. The end of the year is always filler. Everybody should know that.


Yep. I'm not expecting much of anything from the product anymore with the creative staff. The only watchable part of this past weeks Raw was the main event. Everything else was shit, literally. My hopes for WM are also in the tank with the lack of star power that will most likely be the case. I purely just watch for the lolz now. Thank god for DVDs of the past.


----------



## Starbuck

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Yep. I'm not expecting much of anything from the product anymore with the creative staff. The only watchable part of this past weeks Raw was the main event. Everything else was shit, literally. My hopes for WM are also in the tank with the lack of star power that will most likely be the case. I purely just watch for the lolz now. Thank god for DVDs of the past.


I don't take my wrasslin as seriously as most so I'm able to find enjoyment out of a lot of the shit that happens these days. I thought Raw was pretty fun for the most part this week. It doesn't always have to be deep and serious.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Starbuck said:


> I don't take my wrasslin as seriously as most so I'm able to find enjoyment out of a lot of the shit that happens these days. I thought Raw was pretty fun for the most part this week. It doesn't always have to be deep and serious.


I'm okay with just some good 'ol entertainment, too. But Monday wasn't it for me. Outside of the main event, I barely remember anything that even happened. Very forgettable stuff from week to week.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

GOD said:


> disagree. cam does have an affect on the raw rating. more people america probably know who cam newton is over some line john cena or cm punk..


Yeah, but I don't think that means a Carolina Panther game is going to be a massive problem for other shows on at that time.


----------



## Stannis Baratheon.

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Yeah, but I don't think that means a Carolina Panther game is going to be a massive problem for other shows on at that time.


any two nfl teams can and will outdraw wwe and other shows on at that time..


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

GOD said:


> any two nfl teams can and will outdraw wwe and other shows on at that time..


Exactly. *ANY* team. Not just Cam Newton or a Cam Newton led team..


----------



## Cena rulz12345

corporation2.0 said:


> Smh at the excuses on these forums:
> 
> Main event with Authority/Show holds somewhat steady = Orton and Show can't draw. Bryan and Punk are the real draws, so push them.
> 
> Main event with Bryan/Punk bombs = It's the lead-in to the main event which hurt the ratings. Besides, ratings don't matter.
> 
> Love the hypocrisy.


markedfordeath would'nt be much happy with you.



Starbuck said:


> Hey, people can blame Vince for their guys not being stars or whatever all they want. That isn't the issue. It's the fact that MARK believes Vince is coming up with ways to justify not pushing or scapegoating certain guys in order to save face with the internet. He also believes that HHH didn't appear on the taped Raw from London because he knew the rating would tank and he wanted to be exempt from getting the blame. I guess we know why WWE isn't quality entertainment from top to bottom. Clearly Vince and HHH are spending all their time reading internet message boards trying to come up with elaborate plans to justify their actions to the smarks.
> 
> unk2
> 
> And yep, this thread has been mighty quiet since BIG SHOW silenced the world with that 800k gain the other week lol. WORLDS LARGEST RATINGS.


:show


----------



## Londrick

Starbuck said:


> And yep, this thread has been mighty quiet since BIG SHOW silenced the world with that 800k gain the other week lol. WORLDS LARGEST RATINGS.


Yeah what a huge draw gaining 800k in the same hour that lost 1 million. :ti


----------



## Starbuck

Londrick said:


> Yeah what a huge draw gaining 800k in the same hour that lost 1 million. :ti


Are you disagreeing with THE WORLDS LARGEST RATINGS? 

:show


----------



## Waffelz

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Yep. I'm not expecting much of anything from the product anymore with the creative staff. The only watchable part of this past weeks Raw was the main event. Everything else was shit, literally. My hopes for WM are also in the tank with the *lack of star power* that will most likely be the case. I purely just watch for the lolz now. Thank god for DVDs of the past.


Who actually cares? WWE need to forget about all the old-timers. Move on. I'd be delighted f there was no Rock, SCSA, Goldberg ect.

Give me Ambrose v Rollins v Reigns, Punk v Bryan and Cody Rhodes v Dustin Rhodes any day of the week.


----------



## #Mark

Starbuck said:


> :lmao Appropriately named Mark, you really need to get over yourself. If Vince McMahon didn't want to push Punk or Bryan he wouldn't push them and he doesn't need to justify that decision to anybody but himself. If Vince McMahon wants to blame Punk and Bryan for poor ratings then he'll find a way to blame them regardless of what evidence is put in front of him. I actually think you truly believe he cares what you and other internet fans have to say. I'm sure Vince sits there and thinks up these elaborate ways to push but not push CM Punk and Daniel Bryan so that when the buys come out he has his reason to justify his actions to a bunch of people he'll never see and clearly doesn't give a fuck about nor has he ever given a fuck about. Get real and stop acting like such a...mark...


:lol don't get your panties in a bunch .. What I said was in jest, but even so, after the inevitable disappointing Survivor Series' number Vince will be looking to place blame on someone and it's obviously not gonna be himself/creative, Hunter, Cena, Orton, or Show. Bryan and Punk being scapegoats for main eventing the go home show isn't out of the realm of possibilities, especially when considering that he blamed Miz for the SS 2011 buyrate.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Waffelz said:


> *Who actually cares?* WWE need to forget about all the old-timers. Move on. I'd be delighted f there was no Rock, SCSA, Goldberg ect.Give me Ambrose v Rollins v Reigns, Punk v Bryan and Cody Rhodes v Dustin Rhodes any day of the week.


Vince? WWE? The people who are trying to make money for the company, I suppose. It's neat if you or I don't care. But it's WM 30. Putting out a huge show is something they are concerned with, and should be. Those are other matches aren't big enough to headline a WM. Especially WM 30.


----------



## THANOS

#Mark said:


> :lol don't get your panties in a bunch .. What I said was in jest, but even so, after the inevitable disappointing Survivor Series' number Vince will be looking to place blame on someone and it's obviously not gonna be himself/creative, Hunter, Cena, Orton, or Show. Bryan and Punk being scapegoats for main eventing the go home show isn't out of the realm of possibilities, *especially when considering that he blamed Miz for the SS 2011 buyrate.*


That's actually a solid point. (Y)


----------



## Londrick

Starbuck said:


> Are you disagreeing with THE WORLDS LARGEST RATINGS?
> 
> :show


That smiley makes me wonder why isn't there a smiley of show crying? Would be used a lot.


----------



## markedfordeath

So once they get that new deal next year, does this mean that programming will be even worse than it is now? because its pretty bad right now, and if they get that huge deal signed, they'll probably get lazier and realize that they don't even have to try any longer and it'll start to get worse week by week when it already is now. I hope that's not the case...oh and Punk/Bryan are stars. If Vince didn't like them, then why does he want them to have big matches at WM? He wanted Bryan to face HBK for crying out loud! That still may happen, and it'll be an epic feud. And if it does, and Punk gets a title shot or whatever at Mania, then I guess Vince is high on teh both of them after all


----------



## Starbuck

#Mark said:


> :lol don't get your panties in a bunch .. What I said was in jest, but even so, after the inevitable disappointing Survivor Series' number Vince will be looking to place blame on someone and it's obviously not gonna be himself/creative, Hunter, Cena, Orton, or Show. Bryan and Punk being scapegoats for main eventing the go home show isn't out of the realm of possibilities, especially when considering that he blamed Miz for the SS 2011 buyrate.


Sure it was. Just like all those other times you spoke in jest. 

Conspiracy theories running wild. The world according to Mark. 

:hogan

Pretty sure they don't have big expectations for Survivor Series any more, especially considering they wanted to drop it a couple of years ago. If it bombs Vince is hardly going to go after Bryan and he sure as hell isn't strategically putting him in positions to fail so he can justify a de-push to you or anybody else. Lol. Summerslam was different given the hype leading in. Placing blame is understandable in that case.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Londrick said:


> That smiley makes me wonder why isn't there a smiley of show crying? Would be used a lot.


He should be crying at the absolute joke of a career that he's had. Especially the huge expectations they had for him when he signed in 1999. At the time, I also thought his career would be much better than what it turned out to be.

The man is a failure.

:show

And unlike Bryan and Punk, Vince can't blame that failure on someone for being too "small."


----------



## Choke2Death

I'm no Show fan but his career is definitely not a failure. Despite all the joke heel/face turns, he's a grand-slam champion.


----------



## Cliffy

I blame Triple H & John Cena for everything.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Choke2Death said:


> I'm no Show fan but his career is definitely not a failure. Despite all the joke heel/face turns, he's a grand-slam champion.


Vince had HUGE expectations for him in 1999, when they signed him from WCW. He was supposed to be the company's number one heel to go up against Austin. And he couldn't get over enough to be in that spot. Taker also got on him for being unmotivated, undisciplined, lazy, and fat years ago. And he never was that #1 that Vince wanted him to be. He's been a comedy figure for large parts of his career. He's a joke.


----------



## Starbuck

If Show was too small would that make him The Small Show? :side:


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Starbuck said:


> If Show was too small would that make him The Small Show? :side:


It would give Vince some ammo to get on Show, that's for sure.

:vince5


----------



## Choke2Death

Mister WrestleMania said:


> Vince had HUGE expectations for him in 1999, when they signed him from WCW. He was supposed to be the company's number one heel to go up against Austin. And he couldn't get over enough to be in that spot. *Taker also got on him for being unmotivated, undisciplined, lazy, and fat years ago.* And he never was that #1 that Vince wanted him to be. He's been a comedy figure for large parts of his career. He's a joke.


:lmao @ the bold part. I remember that interview and the way Taker worded it cracked me up. "I'm gonna blow you" :lol

He may not have become what he could've been with his talent and backing, yet most wrestlers would kill to have a career like he's had. He's set for life financially with a good enough career. Can't call that a failure.


----------



## markedfordeath

does everyone agree that if the 12 man match was on for Survivor Series instead of this past Raw, that they would have gotten more buys? instead, it seems like Vince just decided to give up and put in there meaningless uninteresting matches compared to what he could have put in there


----------



## Bushmaster

I hate that the match was on Raw. I'm going to SS and would have loved seeing that match get 30 minutes on the PPV. I understand why they did it though, they need the talent spread out to create more matches. Imagine how much worse the card would be if all that talent was in one match.


----------



## markedfordeath

but the ppv is not going to get any buys. They're fucked this Sunday. And I think its obvious Punk/Bryan aren't to blame for Summerslam, based upon crowd reactions (which casuals are apart of the live crowds) people are mainly interested in the Wyatts/Shield/Punk/Bryan program compared to the rest of the card for SS. So I hope Vince finally realizes this. I mean those guys have been the main event the last few weeks. By the end of the shows, people forget about Orton and Big Show.


----------



## SPCDRI

I'd like to say that Daniel Bryan and CM Punk were viewer draws and that Big Show didn't gain hundreds of thousands of viewers every time his dumb,
fat, slow, old ass was on t.v.

But I can't. That wouldn't be true. People like Big Show for unfathomable, godawful reasons.


----------



## markedfordeath

he actually only gained hundreds of thousands last week but it was in the hour that the segment before lost over a million..so it still suffered a net loss of 200,000 from the hour before. But that's if you want to get technical about the situation. he's not the draw, they just want Triple H to get his ass kicked which he still refuses to do. Even the week after Show hit him and knocked him out, Triple H no sold it the next week.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

so how is it show's fault that a segment in which he was'nt even on lost 1million viewers?


----------



## superuser1

According to markedfordeath anyone not named Daniel Bryan is a failure


----------



## #Mark

Cena rulz12345 said:


> so how is it show's fault that a segment in which he was'nt even on lost 1million viewers?


But it doesn't make that segment successful. He gained back viewers that left...


----------



## fulcizombie

Wwe needs a new attitude era . Just looking at how much better everything about a mid card attitude era character , Goldust , is compared to current wwe superstars speaks volumes . Bring back pg 14 , crazy characters (like the Wyatt's with more freedom) and create some fuckin exciting tv again or else we will be arguing about below 3.0 ratings and if Daniel Bryan or John cena lost or gained 100.000 viewers .


----------



## Cena rulz12345

^ fpalm i can't help but wonder that you're a 12 year old who is told AE was "cool" that's why you jumped on the "we want AE back" bandwagoon.


----------



## THANOS

Cena rulz12345 said:


> ^ fpalm i can't help but wonder that you're a 12 year old who is told AE was "cool" that's why you jumped on the "we want AE back" bandwagoon.


You shouldn't be accusing anybody about being a child to be honest. unk2


----------



## Cena rulz12345

if he was not a child he would've not complained about it bc WE'RE GETTING A PRODUCT SIMILAR TO AE RIGHT NOW.


----------



## THANOS

Cena rulz12345 said:


> if he was not a child he would've not complained about it bc WE'RE GETTING A PRODUCT SIMILAR TO AE RIGHT NOW.


Not quite. It's certainly a better and more edgier product than a few years ago, but I wouldn't liken it to the Attitude Era, at least not yet.


----------



## FITZ

stonefort said:


> Country music is huge in 2013. Look up some actual music industry data. Get out of your bubble.
> 
> In 2012, the last year we have full data, Country and Rock were the only two genres that actually grew in sales. Country grew 4%, Rock grew 2%. Everything else (R&B, Metal, Rap, Alternative, Latin, Dance, Classical, etc) shrank.
> 
> Of the top 10 best-selling albums in 2012, 5 were Country. Half.
> 
> Facts are crazy things.


Country music is popular. But that doesn't mean that the same people that like Country Music watch Monday Night Raw. I have no idea if they do. It's like if you put a really popular hardcore rapper on The View. He might be really popular overall but if he isn't popular with the audience of The View it won't be good for viewership. 

I have no idea if many wrestling fans like Country music. 



corporation2.0 said:


> Smh at the excuses on these forums:
> 
> Main event with Authority/Show holds somewhat steady = Orton and Show can't draw. Bryan and Punk are the real draws, so push them.
> 
> Main event with Bryan/Punk bombs = It's the lead-in to the main event which hurt the ratings. Besides, ratings don't matter.
> 
> Love the hypocrisy.


Well we don't actually know if the main event bombed yet. We just know that the third hour had the lowest ratings. If the segments before the main event had low viewership even a great main event (in terms of viewers) wouldn't be able to raise the hour's overall average. 

It's totally possible that the main event didn't do great, I really don't know, I just think it's too early to draw conclusions about the main event just based on the final hour's average viewership.


----------



## Cena rulz12345

THANOS said:


> Not quite. It's certainly a better and more edgier product than a few years ago, but I wouldn't liken it to the Attitude Era, at least not yet.


summerslam,noc,BG.......
the authourity beating everyone up...
and when all of this happend,the ppl who were bitching for AE to return they were bitching about how bad the product was.
when in reality they meant db should'nt lose.


----------



## Cliffy

Who gets the blame when SS does it's lowest buyrate of all time ?


----------



## Cena rulz12345

^ The miz :troll


----------



## Bushmaster

Cliffy Byro said:


> Who gets the blame when SS does it's lowest buyrate of all time ?


:bryan unk :wyatt :reigns :ambrose :rollins :swagger :cesaro


----------



## markedfordeath

Del Rio, Big Show and Orton won't get blamed..oh no! Have to keep pushing the guys that bring you no business whatsoever!


----------



## Choke2Death

Cliffy Byro said:


> Who gets the blame when SS does it's lowest buyrate of all time ?


It definitely wont be lower than last year.


----------



## JY57

Cliffy Byro said:


> Who gets the blame when SS does it's lowest buyrate of all time ?


It probably still beat last year which was worst SS in terms of buys Of all time at 209,000


----------



## MaybeLock

Cliffy Byro said:


> Who gets the blame when SS does it's lowest buyrate of all time ?


Anyone but Big Show, this thread will never mess with him and doubt about his drawing power. :show


----------



## Gretchen

THANOS said:


> You shouldn't be accusing anybody about being a child to be honest. unk2


:lmao

This post is the highlight of the last three pages of this thread, due to its factual honesty. (Y)


----------



## markedfordeath

if HIAC does bad, does that make HBK and Cena look bad?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I'm going to solve this right now:

If Battleground does badly, it's because of :vince

If Hell in a Cell does badly, it's because of :vince2

If Survivor Series does badly, it's because of :vince3


Now if Battleground does well, it's because of unk2

If Hell in a Cell does well, it's because of unk

If Survivor Series does well, it's because of unk6


----------



## markedfordeath

ha ha we only wish Vince would blame himself every now and then. Can't believe he never fires his writers....they need new ones heading into WM season. They should never have fired that head writer after Summerslam.


----------



## RKO1988

Starbuck said:


> I don't take my wrasslin as seriously as most so I'm able to find enjoyment out of a lot of the shit that happens these days. I thought Raw was pretty fun for the most part this week. It doesn't always have to be deep and serious.


Its not about being deep and serious its about being an entertaining show which wwe has a hard time consistently maintaining for years now. People want the bad guys to cut loose and act like assholes, for the divas to look like hot sluts and for the characters and storylines to at least be engaging and interesting. None of this is there so they lose their adult audience. People say catering to kids makes them more money but its hard to see that with the consent low ratings and lower PPV buyrates every year. 

Its not about wanting deep and serious storylines, just something that has some effort put into and wasn't aimed toward 5 year olds is nice enough.


----------



## Smith_Jensen

Here is an link to an article from Yahoo Finance as it relates to RAW ratings and TV ratings in general.

*"TV Is Dying, And Here Are The Stats That Prove It"*
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/tv-dying-stats-prove-151130162.html

Here are some highlights from that article:


> The TV business is having its worst year ever.
> 
> Audience ratings have collapsed: Aside from a brief respite during the Olympics, there has been only negative ratings growth on broadcast and cable TV since September 2011, according to Citi Research.
> 
> Media stock analysts Craig Moffett and Michael Nathanson recently noted, "The pay-TV industry has reported its worst 12-month stretch ever." All the major TV providers lost a collective 113,000 subscribers in Q3 2013. That doesn't sound like a huge deal — but it includes internet subscribers, too.
> 
> Broadband internet was supposed to benefit from the end of cable TV, but it hasn't.
> 
> In all, about 5 million people ended their cable and broadband subs between the beginning of 2010 and the end of this year.
> 
> Time Warner Cable, for instance, lost 306,000 TV subscribers in Q3, and 24,000 broadband web subscribers, too.
> 
> And Tom Rutledge, CEO of Charter Communications, told Wall Street analysts he was "surprised" that 1.3 million of his 5.5 million customers don't want TV — just broadband internet. "Our broadband-only growth has been greater than I thought it would be," he said.
> 
> For the first time ever, the number of cable TV subscribers at major providers is about to dip below 40 million.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So why are ratings in decline?
> 
> We're at the beginning of a major historical shift from watching TV to watching video — including TV shows and movies — on the internet or on mobile devices.
> 
> This is going to hurt cable TV providers.
> 
> Nearly 5 million cable TV subscribers have gone elsewhere in the last five years. The number of subscribers remaining could sink below 40 million later this year.
> Cable and broadband companies are increasingly unable to retain customers.
> 
> The cable and broadband subscriber business is seasonal. The net number of people leaving or adding services changes with the seasons, because people like to move house in the fall.
> 
> It used to be that up to 500,000 new subscriptions would be added across all companies in any given quarter. But now, cable and internet companies are lucky if they get any new subscribers at all. Increasingly, the industry loses subscribers rather than gaining them.
> 
> For the first time ever, less than half of subscribers at the major broadband companies now subscribe to cable TV.
> 
> What's happening is that people are giving up on cable TV as a standalone product, and the market is shifting in favor of telco companies like AT&T and Verizon who offer TV as a package with high-speed internet access, according to media equity analysts at ISI Group. (Direct Broadcast Satellite appears to be remaining steady, in part because its customers often live in more rural areas and have fewer alternatives.)
> 
> Even though cable TV has had its worst year ever, cable TV revenues are still rising because companies are charging the dwindling number of customers more in subscription fees. According to analysts Craig Moffett and Michael Nathanson, those higher prices are "part of the problem" that pushes out poor subscribers — losing the TV business even more eyeballs:
> 
> "Of course, the fact that pay-TV revenue is still rising smartly is part of the problem ... We have always argued that cord-cutting is an economic phenomenon, not a technological one. ... Pay-TV revenue growth reflects rapid pay-TV pricing growth and that is precisely the problem. Rapidly rising prices are squeezing lower-income consumers out of the ecosystem."
> 
> Time Warner Cable CEO Glenn Britt said in his last-ever conference call that the cable business has been 'in denial.'
> Britt, who is retiring because he has been diagnosed with cancer, told analysts on his Q3 2013 earnings call that he thought the cable business had spent too many years complacently dismissing the competition:
> 
> Regarding competition, well, duh, we have competition. I say that because when I first got this job 12 years ago, I think the cable industry as a whole, including our company, was in denial that we had real, viable competition. And I still hear some of my peers saying dismissive things about our competitors. And certainly, each of them has strengths and weaknesses, just as we do. However, they are around to stay, and we need to keep getting better at competing.
> People who are unplugging from both cable TV and broadband internet are likely going to free wifi.
> 
> So if fewer people are watching cable TV and fewer people are paying for Internet service, does that mean that we just don't care about watching our favorite shows anymore?
> 
> Not necessarily.
> 
> Free wifi — at work, in coffee shops, and on campuses — is making it easier for consumers to get the shows, movies and videos they want without subscribing to any kind of cable or broadband service
> 
> All of Starbucks offers free wifi, for instance.


----------



## Happenstan

^^ I believe that. When/If the entire USA gets unlimited broadband all over the country like the rest of the freaking world cable will be irrelevant. Enough caps, enough spotty service in rural areas. Time to get with the next century already.


----------



## THANOS

Happenstan said:


> ^^ I believe that. When/If the entire USA gets unlimited broadband all over the country like the rest of the freaking world cable will be irrelevant. Enough caps, enough spotty service in rural areas. Time to get with the next century already.


Yeah definitely! This is why Punk and Bryan's audience doesn't show up that much in the tv ratings measure, but I'm willing to bet they are huge draws if WWE can figure out a way to track their audience online other than, say, twitter :side:. I'm willing to bet they are in great competition with Cena's fanbase if you could include the internet someway.


----------



## Alo0oy

Happenstan said:


> ^^ I believe that. When/If the entire USA gets unlimited broadband all over the country like the rest of the freaking world cable will be irrelevant. Enough caps, enough spotty service in rural areas. Time to get with the next century already.


Wait, you mean there's a download threshold? In USA?


----------



## markedfordeath

they screwed Bryan....now Cena is Orton's next opponent and he'll end up beating Orton. I thought they were second guessing the decision to take Bryan out? so I guess that was wrong?


----------



## The Steven Seagal

markedfordeath said:


> they screwed Bryan....now Cena is Orton's next opponent and he'll end up beating Orton. I thought they were second guessing the decision to take Bryan out? so I guess that was wrong?



Yes :agree:


----------



## RKO1988

Bryan should learn to politic already. Its the only way anyone gets a good long reign in WWE after all.


----------



## P5YC40D3L1C

WWE is trying to help boost TNA's ratings.


----------



## markedfordeath

They really are..but I do love how flustered Triple H was at the beginning of Raw last night......they stuck it to him, and it felt great! Bryan was a star in that building, must be embarassing for Triple H when he said he only faces stars...to the fans in attendance he's the biggest star..what a joke this angle is.


----------



## validreasoning

big fall off in final hour again otherwise show would have done mania season numbers



8:00 PM............4318
9:00 PM............4292	
10:00 PM..........3796


----------



## markedfordeath

i thought "vanilla midgets" can't draw!! Bryan even drew in the first hour when his name was chanted non stop!!! nope, he's not a draw, fuck you Vince! ha ha they shit on the main event in the ratings too.....good!


----------



## Cliffy

Cena/Orton killing that third hour :vince$


----------



## Dec_619

validreasoning said:


> big fall off in final hour again otherwise show would have done mania season numbers
> 
> 
> 
> 8:00 PM............4318
> 9:00 PM............4292
> 10:00 PM..........3796


Source?


----------



## Happenstan

validreasoning said:


> big fall off in final hour again otherwise show would have done mania season numbers
> 
> 
> 
> 8:00 PM............4318
> 9:00 PM............4292
> 10:00 PM..........3796



:vince5 "That Cena/Orton tease at Survivor Series is already paying off." :vince$

:bryan3 unk6 "They were also in the final hour of RAW which scored the lowest ratings of the night."

:vince6 "Silence midgets. I'm watching tall bodybuilders flex."


----------



## checkcola

Dec_619 said:


> Source?


tvbythenumbers


----------



## The True Believer

Isn't it basically a fact that no matter what, the viewership always goes down in this three hour format? That's why I feel like scapegoating wrestlers for not pulling in ratings is all sorts of ridiculous.


----------



## superuser1

validreasoning said:


> big fall off in final hour again otherwise show would have done mania season numbers
> 
> 
> 
> *8:00 PM............4318*
> 9:00 PM............4292
> 10:00 PM..........3796


[email protected]/Cena bringing in those first hour ratings. Obviously the casuals were tuned in to see the fall out from the Survivor Series ending.


----------



## Dec_619

Krinkles said:


> Isn't it basically a fact that no matter what, the viewership always goes down in this three hour format? That's why I feel like scapegoating wrestlers for not pulling in ratings is all sorts of ridiculous.


Pretty much this. 

Everyone is either asleep or bored of the product by the third hour.

At least when they had the 2-hour show it was pretty full on.


----------



## Vyer

I wonder if the segments with Michael Strahan did big gains.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Guest hosts = draw.

And the return of the one and only. :henry1


----------



## SPCDRI

:adr rton2 :show :cena5 killing a segment again. Lets give them another 9 WHCs and 7 WWE belts.

:vince4


----------



## superuser1

SPCDRI said:


> :adr rton2 :show :cena5 killing a segment again. Lets give them another 9 WHCs and 7 WWE belts.
> 
> :vince4


The third hour always drops off. Look at the first hour though.


----------



## MaybeLock

Heel team vs Face team mixing rivalries not drawing in the main event? Oh no, another new concept that fails.


----------



## Stad

superuser1 said:


> *The third hour always drops off.* Look at the first hour though.


Quit lying to us, brah.


----------



## checkcola

Keep in mind what's coming next week, as high profile a NFL game you'll see all year long, [email protected]


----------



## superuser1

Stad said:


> Quit lying to us, brah.


Lollllllll


----------



## dxbender

Got message on my twitter about a survey, and in it they asked me about what shows I watched yesterday(Raw was one of the few options listed).

It seems like they're trying to find out more information regarding social media activity for big tv shows.

Since social media is gonna be counting towards ratings soon, wonder how Raw is gonna do.


----------



## Londrick

Punk and Bryan are midcarding, the golden boys are back in the main event and the numbers still suck. :ti



superuser1 said:


> [email protected]/Cena bringing in those first hour ratings. Obviously the casuals were tuned in to see the fall out from the Survivor Series ending.


Yeah that huge 9% increase from last weeks first hour. :ti


----------



## 4everEyebrowRaisin

Ah, finally! Cena and Orton are back in the main event. The ratings should improve greatly now that those midgets are in the mid-card where they belong...

Oh, they still fucking suck? Huh, who'da thunk it...


----------



## markedfordeath

the ratings for that main event, watch out, they found a winner didnt they? and Bryan/Punk were in at the end of the second hour, and spiked bigger numbers...Vince wants them buried and off tv to take out his frustrations that they're more over than the actual main event...so he had one kidnapped and will probably be gone next week too and another one beaten up badly by the Shield and will probably book that same one in a handicap match of 6 on 1 next week for further punishment lol you gotta love the WWE! either way, they're both outdrawing the main event angle, serves them right!


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

HOLY CRAP, DAT :henry1


----------



## The True Believer

markedfordeath said:


> the ratings for that main event, watch out, they found a winner didnt they? and Bryan/Punk were in at the end of the second hour, and spiked bigger numbers...Vince wants them buried and off tv to take out his frustrations that they're more over than the actual main event...so he had one kidnapped and will probably be gone next week too and another one beaten up badly by the Shield and will probably book that same one in a handicap match of 6 on 1 next week for further punishment lol you gotta love the WWE! *either way, they're both outdrawing the main event angle, serves them right!*


Don't forget,the third hour seems to always have the lowest rating no matter what.


----------



## markedfordeath

the midgets probably wont' be on TV next week, they'll be selling their injuries, and one of them will still be kidnapped..ha ha Vince is punishing Bryan clearly because the fans were chanting his name during the main event of Survivor Series...why else would they have the Wyatts kidnap him instead of Punk? think about it! Vince is trying to bury Bryan.....its obvious, this won't sit well with fans either....its funny, he really is unburyable though!


----------



## Cmpunk91

Punk and Bryan out drawing Orton and Cena. Love it


----------



## markedfordeath

did you expect anything less? how much you want to bet there is a Daniel Bryan chant at TLC too? they should just keep doing it at every ppv in which he's not in a title match to make WWE look really ridiculous.


----------



## TheWFEffect

DAT is all down to Eva draw Marie.


----------



## superuser1

Krinkles said:


> Don't forget,the third hour seems to always have the lowest rating no matter what.


Lol they're acting like they don't know that


----------



## The True Believer

superuser1 said:


> Lol they're acting like they don't know that


Ohhhhhhhh. :ryback

I knew that.


----------



## Soulrollins

And the final time of Raw actually have viewers? Who da hell watch this boring shit?


----------



## Waffelz

Who was in the first hour? I imagine there will be a loss of near 1 million for someone in thefinal hour.


----------



## Jerichoholic4Life

Cmpunk91 said:


> Punk and Bryan out drawing Orton and Cena. Love it


The quarter hours usually don't come out on Tuesday so I'm not sure where you got that from. And even if you're referring to hourly numbers it's also false because a) all four were in the third hour and b) the highest rated hour featured Orton and Cena but not Punk and Bryan.

My predictions for when the quarters do come out: The opening with Cena, Orton and The Authority is the highest rated seg of the night. Punk and Bryan's match does below average (which I'd fault the Wyatts more for) and 10-10.45pm tanks badly before the main event gains the usual viewers.


----------



## JTB33b

Cena should never be in the 3rd hour. His entire fanbase are in bed by that time.


----------



## markedfordeath

whenever Punk and Bryan were main eventing Raw you guys kept rubbing it in our faces that they can't draw because the third hour was down..well looks like the third hour is always down so stop rubbing it in our faces that they can't draw when it isn't true because nobody apparently has a good third hour. Not even the golden boys of the company...oh and Bryan was in the first hour, he was the only name they chanted, he might as well have been, they all wanted him to be!


----------



## Waffelz

You're such a little girl. Jesus.


----------



## NewJack's Shank

LMAO fucking losers and DA WATINGZZZZZZ

Orton still fucking sucks, Bryan and Punk are boring? Some retards here atleast they garner a reaction from the crowd, Main Event had a Los Matadores vs. 3mb atmosphere.


----------



## RandomLurker

superuser1 said:


> Lol they're acting like they don't know that


Yet if Bryan was in this week's third hour:



superuser1 said:


> He did poor in the babyfaces vs Shield main event last week and now this. Something is obviously wrong here.


----------



## markedfordeath

point is, it does not matter who is in the main event on Raw...thats why the money position is the beginning of the second hour or the beginning of Raw in general.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

The numbers always drop in the third hour. But the thing is, WWE had 4 million viewers through out the first two hours. All of a sudden, the third hour comes in and a large number of people tune out. A majority of those people certainly tuned out because of the third hour but a large amount of them also were most likely due to a lack of interest in the main event match, which was announced early in the show. We'll find out what the quarter ratings are but this will probably change the way WWE books Wrestlemania if this trend continues for the next few weeks.


----------



## markedfordeath

if Bryan turns heel, how much you want a bet that drives away viewers too? they'll do anything to keep Cena number one.


----------



## Waffelz

Bryan doesn't have any fans.


----------



## Cmpunk91

Waffelz said:


> Bryan doesn't have any fans.


Lol


----------



## GillbergReturns

If you're going to blame Orton/ Cena for the 3rd hour you have to credit them for the 1st hour. We all knew how Raw was going to open.

It wasn't with Punk Bryan.


----------



## checkcola

Listening to today's PWTorch Livecast, and they touch on the ratings, according to their spreedsheet, that is the biggest drop off from hour 2 to hour 3 for the entire year.


----------



## Cmpunk91

GillbergReturns said:


> If you're going to blame Orton/ Cena for the 3rd hour you have to credit them for the 1st hour. We all knew how Raw was going to open.
> 
> It wasn't with Punk Bryan.


To be honest seeing as Vince made appearance after Survivor series finished, I was thinking he would open raw tbh.


----------



## superuser1

GillbergReturns said:


> If you're going to blame Orton/ Cena for the 3rd hour you have to credit them for the 1st hour. We all knew how Raw was going to open.
> 
> It wasn't with Punk Bryan.


Exactly. They keep ignoring the first hour and keep talking about the third which over the past month has had the least amount of viewers each time.


----------



## DesolationRow

Oh my name is nothin'
My age it means less
The country I come from
Is called the Midwest
I's taught and brought up there
The laws to abide
And the land that I live in
Has God on its side.

Oh the Ratings Talk thread tells it
It tells it so well
The Punk marks charged
The Orton marks fell
The Punk marks charged
The Orton marks died
Oh, the marks were young
With God on their side.

The John Cena-Daniel Bryan War
Had its day
And the Civil War of Punk and Bryan marks, too
Was soon laid away
And the names of the heroes
I's made to memorize
With hands over their keyboards
And God on their side.

The marks of The Rock, boys
They came and went
The reason for fighting
I never did get
But I learned to accept it
Accept it with pride
For you don't count the dead
With God on your side.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Everyone go green rep DesolationRow

:lmao at Billion Dollar Man getting humbled. I'm gonna miss him.


----------



## Schrute_Farms

Nobody gives a shit about Orton at all, nobody buys a ticket or a PPV to see him do his boring, lame act. It's not entertaining, his matches never leave you feeling like you got your monies worth. A match with Orton and Del Rio and Big Show… how much would they like to pay me to sit through that crap, better be a decent amount because I have zero interest in it.


----------



## checkcola

Schrute_Farms said:


> Nobody gives a shit about Orton at all, nobody buys a ticket or a PPV to see him do his boring, lame act. It's not entertaining, his matches never leave you feeling like you got your monies worth. A match with Orton and Del Rio and Big Show… how much would they like to pay me to sit through that crap, better be a decent amount because I have zero interest in it.


They announced that match at the top of the show and signaled to people who don't enjoy those acts to just skip hour 3, which could account for the big drop off between 2 and 3.


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

All the kids went to bed at 10 and the rating dropped. Can you guys stop arguing now?


----------



## MaybeLock

It was ABOUT TIME for the Ratings thread to have an official anthem. FINALLY.


----------



## superuser1

This thread fell off ever since Punk & Bryan teamed up. Hardly anymore mark wars.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

SoupBro said:


> :bryan unk :wyatt :reigns :ambrose :rollins :swagger :cesaro


I should give you a one two slap. These dudes are the reason SD popped up last week. :side:


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

The Observer hardly posts breakdowns anymore....

There are no specific numbers to fight with anymore.....

Theres no point me even coming to this thread anymore.....


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

The Cynical Miracle said:


> The Observer hardly posts breakdowns anymore....
> 
> There are no specific numbers to fight with anymore.....
> 
> Theres no point me even coming to this thread anymore.....












I haven't seen gains and losses anymore.  :sad::sad::sad::sad::sad:


----------



## JY57

http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2013/1128/567821/wwe-stock-at-year-high/



> - Last week's episode of RAW, which airs on Fridays at 3 PM on Televisa Canal 5, garnered a 5.1 rating in Mexico. SmackDown, which airs on Fridays at 5:15 PM on Azteca 7, scored a 3.7 rating. Both shows used to draw ratings near the tens a few years ago when they aired at night, but they now both air on Friday afternoons.


interesting tidbit: ratings of RAW (last week- 11/18) and Smackdown (11/29) in Mexico


----------



## MaybeLock

JY57 said:


> http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2013/1128/567821/wwe-stock-at-year-high/
> 
> 
> 
> interesting tidbit: ratings of RAW (last week- 11/18) and Smackdown (11/29) in Mexico


It is fair to say that ADR has no problem handling all kinds of demographics. He draws equally bad with everyone :adr

Its sad we have to settle with mexican ratings


----------



## fanchking

Top Rated Monday Night Cable Shows... Taken from TvByTheNumbers.


----------



## fanchking

All around viewers rly don't matter in the end... It's that 18-49 group that rakes in the advertiser $$$.


----------



## Waffelz

This thread is pointless nowadays


----------



## krai999

ffs I wanna see the damn breakdown for the last raw. When is it gonna come?


----------



## SPCDRI

I want to see how *Alberto No Heato, The Ratings Bandito* did in his quarter hour. 

This is a guy who has a long track record of losing more than 400,000 people for his matches. 
He causes _10 percent of the audience to change the channel_ in his quarter hours.

Yet he's been pushed and presented as a mainstream and world title caliber wrestler.


----------



## funnyfaces1

End of an era guys :HHH2 unk3 :henry1


----------



## Cliffy

Maybe now the "Del Rio & Sin Cara are draws in Mexico" nonsense will stop.

Also, Raw is going to get massacred on the 9th by AMERICA'S TEAM!!! :romo


----------



## markedfordeath

thats why its the Slammy Awards.


----------



## apokalypse

Bryan and Punk on first Quarter and Final Quarter they leave it to Orton/Cena...going to be interesting


----------



## markedfordeath

they literally shit on Bryan tonight! its official, the WWE is seriously out of it! he got made fun of his whole match, and now they told us that he's joining the Wyatts.


----------



## Duberry

markedfordeath said:


> they literally shit on Bryan tonight! its official, the WWE is seriously out of it! he got made fun of his whole match, and now they told us that he's joining the Wyatts.


#cutforbryan


----------



## xdryza

markedfordeath said:


> they literally shit on Bryan tonight! its official, the WWE is seriously out of it! he got made fun of his whole match, and now they told us that he's joining the Wyatts.


You scare me, man. Seriously.


----------



## Chrome

Cliffy Byro said:


> Maybe now the "Del Rio & Sin Cara are draws in Mexico" nonsense will stop.
> 
> Also, Raw is going to get massacred on the 9th by AMERICA'S TEAM!!! :romo


Yeah, Bears/Cowboys are gonna take a royal shit on Raw's ratings next week. 

Sorry Vince. :vince7


----------



## Shenroe

markedfordeath said:


> they literally shit on Bryan tonight! its official, the WWE is seriously out of it! he got made fun of his whole match, and now they told us that he's joining the Wyatts.


No shit. Rowan is twice as big as Bryan, what did you expect fpalm


----------



## JY57

http://pwinsider.com/article/81963/smackdown-audience-drops.html?p=1



> The 11/29 edition of Smackdown did 2,641,000 viewers, way down from the 3,106,000 viewers it did the previous week.


----------



## markedfordeath

there's no saving Smackdown..all it does is go up and down, just like Raw...neither show will ever continue to grow week to week


----------



## WWE

Smackdown ratings go down? 

They must of realized Cena wasn't going to be on the show after wondering why the fuck he wasn't on SD! last week :cena2


----------



## funnyfaces1

DaT THANKSGIVING DROP!


----------



## Silent KEEL

Of course the SD ratings went down, Bryan had beem abducted and it was obvious he wouldn't make it to Smackdown!


----------



## Flawless Victory

SPCDRI said:


> I want to see how *Alberto No Heato, The Ratings Bandito* did in his quarter hour.
> 
> This is a guy who has a long track record of losing more than 400,000 people for his matches.
> He causes _10 percent of the audience to change the channel_ in his quarter hours.
> 
> Yet he's been pushed and presented as a mainstream and world title caliber wrestler.


Ok. I never post in this thread, I just read and laugh my ass off at the G.O.A.T posts that are produced in this thread but your post is a mother fucking lie. I'm not gonna say that ADR doesn't lose viewers from time to time, but that "track record of losing more than 400,000 viewers for his matches" is straight bullshit!!


----------



## Stannis Baratheon.

people have gotten smart and stopped watching the holiday episodes :lol


----------



## LKRocks

Flawless Victory said:


> Ok. I never post in this thread, I just read and laugh my ass off at the G.O.A.T posts that are produced in this thread but your post is a mother fucking lie. I'm not gonna say that ADR doesn't lose viewers from time to time, but that "track record of losing more than 400,000 viewers for his matches" is straight bullshit!!


pffft losing clean to hunico cara

:kobe9 :ti :kobe9


----------



## JY57

> After last week's series low rating, WWE's Total Divas rebounded nicely this week doing 1.443 million viewers on Sunday a 0.7 in the 18-49 demo.


viw PWInsider. 

went up big from the 920,000 viewership the previous week


----------



## wb1899

Raw:
10:00 PM: 3.447 million viewers, A18-49: 1.3
9:00 PM: 3.560 million viewers, A18-49: 1.3
8:00 PM: 3.616 million viewers, A18-49: 1.2


----------



## Happenstan

wb1899 said:


> Raw:
> 10:00 PM: 3.447 million viewers, A18-49: 1.3
> 9:00 PM: 3.560 million viewers, A18-49: 1.3
> 8:00 PM: 3.616 million viewers, A18-49: 1.2


Hemorrhaging viewers throughout the show. And they barely broke 3 and a half million (Is this the first time the first hour got the highest rating?). So John SeenIt vs Orton isn't the saving grace WWE thought it would be. Shocker. I hope to God that match ends with Jericho returning and taking both belts while claiming himself the true undisputed champ.


----------



## JY57

well it did better than last year which was:

Hour 1 - 3.58 million
Hour 2 - 3.37 million
Hour 3 - 3.36 million

with a 2.55 rating


----------



## Waffelz

Punk bringing in dem numbers in the opening segment!!!!!!!!!!1


----------



## Londrick

10 PM having the lowest viewership again. Dat GOAT match contract signing.

:vince :trips2 :cena4 rton2


----------



## Happenstan

JY57 said:


> well it did better than last year which was:
> 
> Hour 1 - 3.58 million
> Hour 2 - 3.37 million
> Hour 3 - 3.36 million
> 
> with a 2.55 rating



Well, CM Punk had been champion for the entire year at that point. People were tired as hell of seeing that.




Jesus Chris' Birthday said:


> 10 PM having the lowest viewership again. Dat GOAT match contract signing.
> 
> :vince :trips2 :cena4 rton2



This Authority storyline has really gone to shit considering what it could have been. Main event Bryan, Team Rhodes becoming huge...and now we get SeenIt and Orton pretending Jericho didn't unified the titles a decade ago.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Awful awful numbers. Better than last year's at the very least, but damn!


----------



## Johncena-hhh

awful numbers


----------



## markedfordeath

wait, isn't hour one the lowest? or am I seeing things?


----------



## wwe4universe

terrible numbers. I enjoy watching football but i dont consider myself huge fan. And even i was drawn to watch the seahawks play then to watch a 3 hour mediocre raw.

-3 hours too long to keep ppl entertained
-8/10 matches were fillers.
-only relevant matches were bryan vs a wyatt and the 6 man tag. And even 
i think those were weak matches in terms of keeping ppl staying tuned. 
To me im only interested to see the leader Bray wyatt facing D bryan. I really dont care seeing the other Wyatts ham n eggers in action. 
-6 man tag had great action but it was within the 2-3 hours mark. Thats the hour ppl just get tire from watching.
-as far as the last segment goes, i dont know cause the segment was entertaining. Guess ppl are not invested in this match up.

Raw had some good stuff a little bit here and there. But the overall show just not entertaining enough to keep ppl stay tuned and not watch MNF.


----------



## LilOlMe

markedfordeath said:


> wait, isn't hour one the lowest? or am I seeing things?


Yes, in the 18-49 year old demo, which is all advertisers care about.


----------



## markedfordeath

funny though how even Cena/Orton against each other can't save the WWE...


----------



## superuser1

These ratings are pointless with no breakdowns


----------



## JY57

> WWE Raw on Monday, December 2 scored a 2.65 rating, down three-tenths of a rating (10 percent) from a 2.93 rating last week.
> 
> It was one of the lowest ratings of the year, in-line with 2.68 and 2.65 ratings on September 30 and October 7, respectively.
> 
> Raw was hit hard in the key demos, but mostly among younger viewers. Compared to last week, Raw was down 20 percent in m18-34, 21 percent in m12-34, and 25 percent in m12-17.
> 
> - Raw averaged 3.541 million viewers, down 14 percent from last week's post-Survivor Series episode of Raw.
> 
> It was the fewest viewers of the year (fewer than the previous year-low of 3.583 million viewers in September) and slightly fewer than the New Year's Eve episode on December 31, 2012, which averaged 3.551 million viewers.
> 
> Hourly Break Down: 3.616 million first hour viewers (nearly fewest of the year), decline to 3.560 million second hour viewers (nearly fewest of the year), and decline to 3.447 million third hour viewers, which was the fewest of the year.
> 
> The third-hour decline was despite the NFL Monday Night Football game being a blow-out by this point. The football game, which matched two of the top teams in the NFL, averaged 15.5 million viewers, which is a good number, but not a blow-away number.
> 
> - On cable TV Monday night, Raw ranked #3 in overall viewers behind football and "Major Crimes" on TNT. Raw ranked #3 in m18-49 behind football and "Fast 'N Loud" on Discovery), and ranked a distant #9 in teen males.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: Raw actually declining in the third hour despite the NFL game being a blow-out should be a cause for concern. The content of that third hour showed why Raw should not be a three-hour show unless WWE has a more disciplined approach to their Monday night program. Constipation, dancing, and a main event centered on vomiting is not exactly a formula for third hour success.
> 
> Within the demographic ratings, Raw losing younger viewers should be a concern, especially when football typically draws away older Raw viewers, not younger viewers. It could be a combination of Raw not being "cool" right now, the end of Daniel Bryan's main event run, and John Cena not really being in jeopardy right now squaring off with a foe like Randy Orton who is afraid of his own shadow at this point.


via PWTorch

tied with the lowest rating of the year which was the Post - BattleGround RAW


----------



## Cliffy

:lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao 

DEM BIG DRAWS :cena :HHH2 

LOL at the declining kid audience. More kids are watching than ever they said!!! PG is attracting kids they said!!


----------



## Diezffects

Isn't it funny Punk is finally involved in the authority storyline for the first time after all these months, and the Viewership/ratings hits the year low figures. Its like the 2.2 era last year still haunting the guy. :lol 

WOW, final rating 2.65 lowest rating of the year, with year low viewership. Absolutely bombed unk


----------



## krai999

the biggest match in wwe history my ass.


----------



## Stanford

To summarize this thread; Bryan isn't a draw, Orton isn't a draw, Punk isn't a draw, Cena isn't a draw, and Triple H isn't a draw. The only wrestlers who _do_ draw are Bryan, Punk, Orton, Cena and Triple H. 

Ratings!


----------



## checkcola

They need to put the Authority Storyline out of its misery.


----------



## Loader230

Obviously viewers saw Punk open the show, didn't give a shit, tuned out and never returned until overrun, which is why 18-49 demo peaked in the third hour. 

Even though internet fans markout all the time, Punk's just not significant enough to the casual viewers. Big mistake to have him open RAW and lead from there. They should have put Cena promo or a match there, Cena vs Sandow if I recall correctly drew one of the biggest numbers this year?


----------



## funnyfaces1

Not enough :henry1 unk5


----------



## Loader230

checkcola said:


> They need to put the Authority Storyline out of its misery.


What good would that do? Authority angle isn't even top angle anymore, John Cena vs Randy Orton feud is...which is basically John Cena, as always.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

:lmao at people putting the blame on Punk.


----------



## markedfordeath

even with Cena back the ratings still are shitty..And they panicked and brought them back? for what? nothing now! When Bryan was on top at least the ratings stayed in the 2.8 range consistently. Hopefully the WWE sees the error in their ways because people are seriously disinterested now that Bryan is out...
And who will they blame now that ratings are going down? you can't blame Cena, of course, so when does Orton get the blame? Bryan is out of the top spot now and things are even worse.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

Orton and Cena bringing in the viewers. Oh wait, they're bombing pretty hard. DAT BIGGEST MATCH EVAR.



> Raw:
> 10:00 PM: 3.447 million viewers, A18-49: 1.3
> 9:00 PM: 3.560 million viewers, A18-49: 1.3
> *8:00 PM: 3.616 million viewers*, A18-49: 1.2


unk GOAT.


----------



## krai999

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> Orton and Cena bringing in the viewers. Oh wait, they're bombing pretty hard. DAT BIGGEST MATCH EVAR.
> 
> 
> 
> unk GOAT.


um
:hogan2 i think you mean punk favorite


----------



## markedfordeath

at this rate Triple H just better not wrestle..Every opponent that was supposed to wrap up the Authority angle has bombed....Big Show, Cena, those were the opponents for Triple H and now nobody is interested and his ego won't allow him to face guys that the public isn't interested in. If he's going to wrestle, he has to wrestle DB or Punk. That's what the fans want. Or don't wrestle at all.


----------



## vanboxmeer

markedfordeath said:


> at this rate Triple H just better not wrestle..Every opponent that was supposed to wrap up the Authority angle has bombed....Big Show, Cena, those were the opponents for Triple H and now nobody is interested and his ego won't allow him to face guys that the public isn't interested in. If he's going to wrestle, he has to wrestle DB or Punk. That's what the fans want. Or don't wrestle at all.


----------



## markedfordeath

its a lost cause at this point..the Corporation back in the 90's, that angle got high ratings. Its just weird how Vince can't find that magic again and how he's fucked up things so bad.


----------



## GillbergReturns

They drew better than this time last year. The sky is not falling. You're not going to draw well against 10-1 vs 9-2 football games blow out or not.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

2.65? :lmao

Well, at least it's better than last year. Because, you know, last years numbers are any sort of barometer for success :lol


----------



## Brodus Clay

Orton it's fucking useless even Cena can't make him draw.


----------



## Apex Rattlesnake

Happenstan said:


> I hope to God that match ends with Jericho returning and taking both belts while claiming himself the true undisputed champ.


Sweet Jesus if only...

:datass


----------



## Ham and Egger

The biggest match in the WWE history can't draw any ratings! :lmao


----------



## markedfordeath

is it clear now that Orton is the problem? all of his feuds since he's become champion haven't had big numbers....yet he's staying as champion..does anyone see a problem here? its like they are ignoring the obvious and putting the blame on others instead even though now they should see the truth.


----------



## GillbergReturns

markedfordeath said:


> is it clear now that Orton is the problem? all of his feuds since he's become champion haven't had big numbers....yet he's staying as champion..does anyone see a problem here? its like they are ignoring the obvious and putting the blame on others instead even though now they should see the truth.


WWE is pulling in the same ratings as last year at this time. That's not saying much but these are the #s WWE draws in Nov and Dec.


----------



## markedfordeath

if that's the case then why was DB getting blamed for the ratings being low? if this is what the ratings are supposed to be...Orton has be blamed sometime....


----------



## GillbergReturns

markedfordeath said:


> if that's the case then why was DB getting blamed for the ratings being low? if this is what the ratings are supposed to be...Orton has be blamed sometime....


He's not being blamed. He never was going to be champ at this point. We'll see what WWE has in it's plans come Mania season but it's really looking unpredictable right now.


----------



## Stannis Baratheon.

THOSE DRAWS


----------



## Waffelz

Pretty sure the contract signing started just before the overtime. The third hour had a lot of shite in it, they will have lost hundreds of thousands with Tyson.


----------



## cokecan567

Ham and Egger said:


> The biggest match in the WWE history can't draw any ratings! :lmao


indeed lmfao!

It's hilarious how they think shoving John Cena down our throats is the answer for ratings. And they blame Bryan and punk for low ratings yet WWE hyping this supposed big match between John Cena aka the guy whose been shoved down our throats for so long with the same predictable boring endings against a guy he has faced countless times in the past. 

I am glad the ratings for this RAW sucked. I hope they keep getting lower.


----------



## markedfordeath

they will get lower...the go home show is the Slammys next week....very bad sign!


----------



## superuser1

markedfordeath said:


> is it clear now that Orton is the problem? all of his feuds since he's become champion haven't had big numbers....yet he's staying as champion..does anyone see a problem here? its like they are ignoring the obvious and putting the blame on others instead even though now they should see the truth.


There's no breakdown you can't blame anybody with no proof


----------



## funnyfaces1

superuser1 said:


> There's no breakdown you can't blame anybody with no proof


That didn't stop people from blaming unk3 last year.


----------



## The True Believer

superuser1 said:


> There's no breakdown you can't blame anybody with no proof


Forget that. Third hour ALWAYS has the lowest ratings. No matter what closes the show, it will have the lowest average rating out of the three hours.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

I'm an Orton fan but even I have to admit that he's always had trouble drawing ratings and PPV numbers. It makes me wonder how he has over 3 million people following him on twitter. The next closest is CM Punk with over 2 million followers.


----------



## Duberry

The Boy Wonder said:


> I'm an Orton fan but even I have to admit that he's always had trouble drawing ratings and PPV numbers. It makes me wonder how he has over 3 million people following him on twitter. The next closest is CM Punk with over 2 million followers.


He's been exchanging nude pics for follows with vulnerable teenage girls

Dat Predator rton2


----------



## dan the marino

Kris Krinkles said:


> Forget that. Third hour ALWAYS has the lowest ratings. No matter what closes the show, it will have the lowest average rating out of the three hours.


Forgive me if this wrong but isn't this a new thing? I feel like two years ago the third hour always drew highest thanks to the overflow and the fact that it should have the main event stuff which should be drawing highest anyway.


----------



## MaybeLock

Orton should be called the Ratings Predator :ti


----------



## The True Believer

BEST FOR BUSIMAS said:


> Forgive me if this wrong but isn't this a new thing? I feel like two years ago the third hour always drew highest thanks to the overflow and the fact that it should have the main event stuff which should be drawing highest anyway.


I think it's a fairly new trend. I'm not sure if it's always been like this but it's been pretty consistent for months now.


----------



## RandomLurker

The Boy Wonder said:


> I'm an Orton fan but even I have to admit that he's always had trouble drawing ratings and PPV numbers. It makes me wonder how he has over 3 million people following him on twitter. The next closest is CM Punk with over 2 million followers.


I honestly don't see the importance of twitter followers outside the straw-grasping "well favorite wrestler has more followers than your favorite wrestler!" comment.


----------



## ddp

Kris Krinkles said:


> I think it's a fairly new trend. I'm not sure if it's always been like this but it's been pretty consistent for months now.


its the 3 hour curse.


----------



## Choke2Death

The Boy Wonder said:


> I'm an Orton fan but even I have to admit that he's always had trouble drawing ratings and PPV numbers. It makes me wonder how he has over 3 million people following him on twitter. The next closest is CM Punk with over 2 million followers.


He's no big draw, but he was on fire in 2009. Number one merchandise seller and Raw ratings were great during his feud with McMahon/HHH. At this point, he just happens to not be a very fresh main event guy, much like Cena, so without the solid drawing power, he will not cause much of a change but tbh, neither is anyone else on the roster.


----------



## SerapisLiber

BEST FOR BUSIMAS said:


> Forgive me if this wrong but isn't this a new thing? I feel like two years ago the third hour always drew highest thanks to the overflow and the fact that it should have the main event stuff which should be drawing highest anyway.


Was the show even 3 hours 2 years ago? I thought that was implemented after RAW 1000. When the show was only two hours, of course the 2nd hour could pull better.


----------



## krai999

yeah. Wasn't there a time in 2011 where we used to blame orton for low ratings after he won it from Christian and when henry won it the ratings shoot back up. Guess the raw ratings are really exposing that aren't they.


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

The Boy Wonder said:


> I'm an Orton fan but even I have to admit that he's always had trouble drawing ratings and PPV numbers. It makes me wonder how he has over 3 million people following him on twitter. The next closest is CM Punk with over 2 million followers.


Half of Beibers twitter base are fake accounts. That's like 14 million fake accounts. Twitter followers don't really mean much. Its all spam and bots just to market and advertise crap.


----------



## SerapisLiber

Diezffects said:


> Isn't it funny Punk is finally involved in the authority storyline for the first time after all these months, and the Viewership/ratings hits the year low figures. Its like the 2.2 era last year still haunting the guy. :lol
> 
> WOW, final rating 2.65 lowest rating of the year, with year low viewership. Absolutely bombed unk


Pfft, nice attempt at trying to rationalize your way out of reality, but still a fail. This was no different than blaming the low ratings on Obama. bama3


----------



## WWE

Wow. They need to go back to 2 hours. Not even cena and Orton can bring in them viewers for the third hour. 

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## markedfordeath

once again Vince, this is DB's fault how exactly? doesn't seem like he was the problem to me!


----------



## kokepepsi

Ratings will not improve until the rest of the 9 segments actually GAIN AND NOT LOSE VIEWERS!

Its like blaming rich people for the economy when they pay most of the taxes
You guys blame the top guys for the shit ratings whey they are the biggest(and only) gains in the entire 3 hours.

Expecting Cena/Orton/Bryan/Punk/HHH to gain 1million+ every week consistently to get back up to a 3.0 rating because that shitty ziggler segment lost 400k viewers is dumb


----------



## Brodus Clay

krai999 said:


> yeah. Wasn't there a time in 2011 where we used to blame orton for low ratings after he won it from Christian and when henry won it the ratings shoot back up. Guess the raw ratings are really exposing that aren't they.


Was when he earned the ''The Ratings Killer'' nickname here :lmao


----------



## markedfordeath

either way its sweet revenge. The McMahons get what they deserve! hopefully this puts their tv deal in jeopardy.


----------



## funnyfaces1

This is so dumb. I can't wait for the reaction when next week gets hideous ratings due to two of the biggest football markets facing each other.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

markedfordeath said:


> either way its sweet revenge. The McMahons get what they deserve! hopefully this puts their tv deal in jeopardy.


Wishful thinking. People are having their joy right now but let's wait and see what the TLC buyrate is.


----------



## rocknblues81

The Boy Wonder said:


> I'm an Orton fan but even I have to admit that he's always had trouble drawing ratings and PPV numbers. It makes me wonder how he has over 3 million people following him on twitter. The next closest is CM Punk with over 2 million followers.


Women.


----------



## JTB33b

The kiddies are all in bed by the 3rd hour.


----------



## LilOlMe

Have we not learned that it's a bit stupid to react until we see the breakdowns? The overrun could have done quite well, while shit like the vomiting segment and whatever else was going on, could have dragged things down a lot.

Not saying that that's what happened, because we don't know for sure, but it seems silly to react based on half-assed info.

But then this thread wouldn't really be as "fun" then, I guess, right? :woolcock


----------



## The Boy Wonder

What happened to the rating breakdowns? The last time I saw one was when AJ Lee's pipebomb lost over 500,000 viewers. We use to see the breakdowns weekly, but since the summer they vanished. Are the breakdowns not looking good for some and that's why Meltzer is holding back?


----------



## superuser1

This is like a reverse cycle. The ratings come out with no breakdown people start blaming whoever they hate the most and say push *insert their favorite wrestler here* then the thread dies out and next week its the same thing all over again.


----------



## SerapisLiber

The Boy Wonder said:


> The last time I saw one was when *the quarter hour also containing* AJ Lee's pipebomb lost over 500,000 viewers.


Fix'd


----------



## The Boy Wonder

SerapisLiber said:


> Fix'd


Her pipebomb didn't draw in viewers. Deal with it. It was yet another overrated segment.


----------



## Ungratefulness

The Boy Wonder said:


> Her pipebomb didn't draw in viewers. Deal with it. It was yet another overrated segment.


what
http://www.heartbreakers.me/index.php?topic=2612.0


> Within the quarter-hours, it's worth noting that A.J. Lee's brief "worked shoot" promo on "Total Divas" drew the most-watched minute of the show prior to the over-run segment.


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## The Boy Wonder

Ungratefulness said:


> what
> http://www.heartbreakers.me/index.php?topic=2612.0
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


Where are the exact numbers though? The report I read said over 500,000 viewers were lost for that segment.


----------



## Ungratefulness

The Boy Wonder said:


> Where are the exact numbers though? The report I read said over 500,000 viewers were lost for that segment.


Brie Bella vs Natalya which was also in that quarter hourly lost viewers, but during the pipe bomb, they gained viewers.

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## The Boy Wonder

Ungratefulness said:


> Brie Bella vs Natalya which was also in that quarter hourly lost viewers, but during the pipe bomb, they gained viewers.
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


How many viewers? I'd like to know the figures.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

Ungratefulness said:


> Brie Bella vs Natalya which was also in that quarter hourly lost viewers, but during the pipe bomb, they gained viewers.
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


I know this. I'm just messing with you guys to prove a point. Yes, the segment in which AJ gave her pipebomb lost over 500,000 viewers, but her pipebomb did very well as far as the minute-by-minute #s goes. My point is that why don't we use that same standard when judging the numbers for Orton and Cena from this past Monday? Hour 3 had a huge drop, however it's very possible that fans turned away for most of hour 3 but came back for the contract signing. Hour 3 was bad, but it's possible that the overrun or minute-by-minute numbers did very well for Orton/Cena/HHH. We have to wait and see the breakdown.


----------



## markedfordeath

not likely...people don't want that match up!


----------



## superuser1

The Boy Wonder said:


> I know this. I'm just messing with you guys to prove a point. Yes, the segment in which AJ gave her pipebomb lost over 500,000 viewers, but her pipebomb did very well as far as the minute-by-minute #s goes. My point is that why don't we use that same standard when judging the numbers for Orton and Cena from this past Monday? Hour 3 had a huge drop, however it's very possible that fans turned away for most of hour 3 but came back for the contract signing. Hour 3 was bad, but it's possible that the overrun or minute-by-minute numbers did very well for Orton/Cena/HHH. We have to wait and see the breakdown.


Agree %100


----------



## superuser1

markedfordeath said:


> not likely...people don't want that match up!


Hour 3 always had the least amount of viewers when Bryan was in the main event too. So why you're blaming Orton & Cena when there's no proof that their segment bombed?


----------



## markedfordeath

i'm blaming them because NOBODY wants to see the fucking match! you're in the minority! The ratings have sucked every week and not even special Cena can fix anything....so he's not a fucking savior!


----------



## RandomLurker

I wished people used this same staunch logic and apply it to other things that can't solely be blamed on one person. Mayhaps PPVs?


----------



## LKRocks

The Boy Wonder said:


> I know this. I'm just messing with you guys to prove a point.


HEY GUYSE LOOK AT ME I WAS VOMITING A LOAD OF BULLSHIT, AND NOW THAT SOMEONE PROVED ME WRONG I'LL JUST SAY THAT I WAS TROLLING Y'ALL


----------



## The Boy Wonder

LKRocks said:


> HEY GUYSE LOOK AT ME I WAS VOMITING A LOAD OF BULLSHIT, AND NOW THAT SOMEONE PROVED ME WRONG I'LL JUST SAY THAT I WAS TROLLING Y'ALL


Read above. I was merely trying to make people use the same logic for AJ's pipebomb numbers for the contract signing from this week. :clap


----------



## The Boy Wonder

Speaking of the breakdowns was that something that was only supplied by Wrestling Observer? If so, can anyone find out from them why they stopped producing the numbers?


----------



## checkcola

The Boy Wonder said:


> Speaking of the breakdowns was that something that was only supplied by Wrestling Observer? If so, can anyone find out from them why they stopped producing the numbers?


I would assume the numbers are inside info direct from WWE and whom ever was supplying them no longer is for fear of being found out


----------



## The Boy Wonder

checkcola said:


> I would assume the numbers are inside info direct from WWE and whom ever was supplying them no longer is for fear of being found out


That's probably want happened since the breakdowns have been missing for months now.


----------



## markedfordeath

i bet the insider was Sgt. Slaughter. out of nowhere he's grown some balls and has called out Creative's misuse of certain talents while he's still a member of their payroll.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

markedfordeath said:


> i bet the insider was Sgt. Slaughter. out of nowhere he's grown some balls and has called out Creative's misuse of certain talents while he's still a member of their payroll.


Yeah I saw that as well.


----------



## growell

There are always a few TV is good.


----------



## JY57

http://adf.ly/aWDTM



> *SMACKDO)WN AUDIENCE RISES*
> 
> By Dave Scherer on 2013-12-09 17:27:05
> 
> ﻿The 12/6 edition of Smackdown did 2,837,000 viewers, up from last week's 2,641,000 viewers


----------



## Choke2Death

rton2 main eventing brings numbers back up. Can't say I'm surprised.


----------



## markedfordeath

hey hey now, both of our boys main evented, dual credit LOL who needs Cena? Smackdown surely doesnt.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

unk2 match getting advertised=RATINGZ!


----------



## superuser1

JY57 said:


> http://adf.ly/aWDTM


Orton and Bryan bringing in them ratingssssss


----------



## funnyfaces1

:rko2 :bryan rekindling their feud and unk taking a dump = ratings


----------



## BOOTS 2 ASSES

I think some people don't understand the importance of The Shield in the ratings gain.


----------



## Londrick

My reaction if Monday Night Bryan tanks:


----------



## checkcola

Jesus Chris' Birthday said:


> My reaction if Monday Night Bryan tanks:


Ehhh... Cowboys vs Bears, think RAW will do the usual mushy ratings


----------



## Londrick

Oh yeah MNF. I'll use that as my excuse just in case tonight's episode tanks.


----------



## JY57

Tota;l Divas did 1.202 million viewers down from 1.443 million the previous week


----------



## validreasoning

8:00 PM...	4.218 million
9:00 PM...	4.177 million
10:00 PM....	4.062 million

probably won't be happy losing viewers every hour but that still a decent showing against a monster football game


----------



## Vyer

validreasoning said:


> 8:00 PM...	4.218 million
> 9:00 PM...	4.177 million
> 10:00 PM....	4.062 million
> 
> probably won't be happy losing viewers every hour but that still a decent showing against a monster football game


Looks like an increase from last week. Nice numbers.


----------



## Starbuck

Kind of pointless since we don't get breakdowns any more but I'd consider that a pretty good showing all things considered. There's nobody and everybody to blame for the final hour being the lowest since that's what we do in here now. 

ITS ALL THEIR FAULTS

:vince5


----------



## D.M.N.

validreasoning said:


> 8:00 PM...	4.218 million
> 9:00 PM...	4.177 million
> 10:00 PM....	4.062 million
> 
> probably won't be happy losing viewers every hour but that still a decent showing against a monster football game


Really good bounce back from last week though - up 600,000 viewers. Highest hour three rating since August too which bodes well for TLC.


----------



## TheStig

validreasoning said:


> 8:00 PM...	4.218 million
> 9:00 PM...	4.177 million
> 10:00 PM....	4.062 million
> 
> probably won't be happy losing viewers every hour but that still a decent showing against a monster football game


Is this more than last week? Im suprised.


----------



## markedfordeath

Guess DB can't draw ratings


----------



## Waffelz

Vanilla Midgets with dat drawing capabilities.


----------



## Happenstan

JY57 said:


> Tota;l Divas did 1.202 million viewers down from 1.443 million the previous week


Still good since the lead in was some movie.




validreasoning said:


> 8:00 PM...	4.218 million
> 9:00 PM...	4.177 million
> 10:00 PM....	4.062 million
> 
> probably won't be happy losing viewers every hour but that still a decent showing against a monster football game


The hour with :bryan match getting the highest ratings. :yes No one knew the final segment would turn into the platinum it did so I fail to see how anyone but Orton/Cena/Authority could be blamed for low ratings if the over run shit the bed given they advertised a final dual champion Orton/Cena confrontation all show long. Isn't it amazing how few fucks are given about this first time ever epic history making title unification (*cough* bullshit *cough*) match? It's like no one really cares that much at all.


----------



## MaybeLock

Waffelz said:


> Vanilla Midgets with dat drawing capabilities.


They should exchange a little of their drawing ability for some muscle mass :vince


----------



## ShiftyLWO

Bret and HBK drawing dem ratings


----------



## markedfordeath

yet another report comes out today saying Vince doesn't believe in Bryan....Dirtsheets will dirtsheet LOL how can you not believe in him at this point? fuck!


----------



## Londrick

Huge increase from last week. Monday Night Bryan seems to have been a success.


----------



## Choke2Death

Pretty good improvement over the past few weeks. It's pretty much the norm for the hours to keep decreasing. It doesn't make a difference who ends the show.


----------



## LKRocks

Vince would have to hate money to not believe in Bryan.
The guy dwarfed three of the biggest superstars of all time last night. Every arena is always filled with D-Bry merchandise in a 2006 Cena fashion. 
Even the almighty ratings have been consistently good in his segments. 

Daniel Bryan is a goddamned money printer


----------



## markedfordeath

then why do reports keep coming out like that? And why isn't he even being talked about for being in a title match at WM? I dont get it!


----------



## Eddie Ray

markedfordeath said:


> then why do reports keep coming out like that? And why isn't he even being talked about for being in a title match at WM? I dont get it!


because vince is a closet case with a muscle fetish.


----------



## superuser1

Happenstan said:


> The hour with :bryan match getting the highest ratings. :yes No one knew the final segment would turn into the platinum it did so I fail to see how anyone but Orton/Cena/Authority could be blamed for low ratings if the over run shit the bed given they advertised a final dual champion Orton/Cena confrontation all show long. Isn't it amazing how few fucks are given about this first time ever epic history making title unification (*cough* bullshit *cough*) match? It's like no one really cares that much at all.


Here we go again people making assumptions with no breakdown and no proof.


----------



## Soulrollins

The process began, but i really think they will take a long time to break up and prepare the feud between them, i even think one of them would be winning a world title soon, and the feud with the Wyatt Family is also something that can't be missing.


----------



## Happenstan

superuser1 said:


> Here we go again people making assumptions with no breakdown and no proof.


How so? I said 'if' the overrun bombed...not that it did. Read the post first, then respond.


----------



## WWE

validreasoning said:


> 8:00 PM...	4.218 million
> 9:00 PM...	4.177 million
> 10:00 PM....	4.062 million
> 
> probably won't be happy losing viewers every hour but that still a decent showing against a monster football game


Third hour goes down again.

People can't survive 3 hours :lol


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

Kids and teens go to bed usually before 10 on school nights and 3 hours is just draining to begin with. It becomes a chore to pay attention for that long.


----------



## Uerfer

LOL @ everyone in this thread trying to ignore the elephant in the room - third is the lowest rated, Barely above 4m.

Live crowd always reacting great to Bryan, but not many bother to tune in when once they get home.


----------



## THANOS

Uerfer said:


> LOL @ everyone in this thread trying to ignore the elephant in the room - third is the lowest rated, Barely above 4m.
> 
> Live crowd always reacting great to Bryan, but not many bother to tune in when once they get home.


Ummmm.. And that is related to Bryan how exactly? The "biggest match in WWE history" is between Orton and Cena with HHH all over it. Bryan was there as a set-piece, no more. The crowd made the segment about him, but the segment was entitled for Cena, Orton and HHH. Keep in mind that the overrun isn't included in here, and I'm willing to bet it ended up drawing huge once fans tuned in and saw what was going on, especially when all hell broke loose.


----------



## Reaper

It's a really simple formula they need to follow. 

Give the kiddies Spiderman ... I mean Cenaman in the first hour and the grownups Punk and Bryan in the final and the ratings will remain somewhat consistent.


----------



## markedfordeath

do you guys think the Bryan/Cena interaction was staged? When he was asking him if he worked for stuff.


----------



## Reaper

markedfordeath said:


> do you guys think the Bryan/Cena interaction was staged? When he was asking him if he worked for stuff.


They looked prepared for the eventuality of that happening, but what Cena did was improv'ed to me. It was like he probably had the idea churning in his head for a while (plus they're already close given they're dating twins). Stuff like this is sure to come up backstage. If we're discussing it on the forums, why wouldn't they be discussing it backstage and preparing for all sorts of eventualities. 

In either case, it looked both genuine as well as put both Bryan and Cena over more.


----------



## markedfordeath

i'm seriously shocked that DB didn't get beat up in his hometown..isn't that the norm? And I'm glad he acknowledged a rematch. I think everyone would love to see that match, only have it be corporate Cena.


----------



## JY57

final rating - 2.84


----------



## Waffelz

Thought it would be a lot higher.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Last year slammy awards show got 2.89 rating


----------



## wb1899

> [..]
> WWE MONDAY NIGHT RAW – the most-watched, regularly scheduled program on cable, 52 weeks a year – made USA #1 Monday nights in 2013, delivering more total viewers (4.61 million), P25-54 (2.10 million), P18-49 (2.12 million), and P18-34 (1.11 million) than any cable entertainment network on Monday in primetime. Among M18-34, RAW was the #1 show on cable Monday nights in 2013, making USA the #1 entertainment network in all of television in this demo.
> [..]
> Note: Data reflects the most up-to-date M-Su 8-11p time period data with all DVR playback information available at this time, which includes Live+7 for all possible dates, Live+3 for dates when Live+7 is not available and Live+Same for dates when Live+3 is not available.
> [..]


tvbythenumbers


----------



## stonefort

Not a surprise. Daniel Bryan is just dull.


----------



## THANOS

stonefort said:


> Not a surprise. Daniel Bryan is just dull.


You're gimmick is showing you know? You must not have even read that last post because there was nothing remotely negative about it, and certainly nothing you could negatively attribute to Bryan. If anything you are basically saying that all fans love Bryan because he's dull. Unless of course that was your point? :argh:


----------



## markedfordeath

i wonder if that reaction Monday night jump started another massive push of his....


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

stonefort said:


> Not a surprise. Daniel Bryan is just dull.


That "dull" wrestler just got the most rabid crowd response of any wrestler in how many years? Don't attribute it to being in his home state either. Bryan's reception by that audience was god tier. No one today gets a sustained reaction like that,not Punk in Chicago or Rock in Miami but Bryan just did. The only thing dull in this thread is your repetitive posting and lack of hearing.


----------



## markedfordeath

hey Best4Bidness, do you think that response changed things for his future?


----------



## WWE

JY57 said:


> final rating - 2.84


Yeah I expected it to be higher than the other weeks. Don't matter how much we complain about how rigged it is, you can't NOT watch the slammies! 

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

markedfordeath said:


> hey Best4Bidness, do you think that response changed things for his future?



I hope it does. They did book him s part of the final angle, so you would hope they realize that the fans dont want Bryan in a meaningless feud with the Wyatts. I listened to the Observer and Torch reports last night and one of them, I cant remember which, thought that the WWE has to acknowledge Bryan's support and not just ignore it. For certain, We will know after Rumble where Bryan fits into the Mania storyline.


----------



## RKO 4life

The Orton ratings maker


----------



## JY57

total divas season finale rises to 1,295,000


----------



## Happenstan

JY57 said:


> total divas season finale rises to 1,295,000


And what was the previews for this episode? Oh yeah. Bryan proposing. Dat ratings king. :bryan :yes


----------



## JY57

Hour 1 - 4.417 million
Hour 2 - 4.297 million
Hour 3 - 3.886 million


----------



## Schrute_Farms

Guess people didn't feel like sitting through all that mediocrity for an Orton match. Too bad because it was the best he's looked in years.


----------



## JasonLives

Very good first hour, not suprised after such an important PPV.
Hour 2 held up pretty good
Hour 3 did bad. Looking at the hour it was mostly wrestling. Guess it didnt held peoples attention. Despite it being very good wrestling most of it.


----------



## WWE

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.417 million
> Hour 2 - 4.297 million
> Hour 3 - 3.886 million


I guess some people didn't want to endure Orton/Bryan for 30-40 minutes.

I sure as hell didn't, I flipped to my PS3 until like 10 minutes before the 3rd hour ended :lol That's when the good shit starts


----------



## krai999

even though this was there best match people didn't give it a chance due to the fact that it was done to death


----------



## JY57

krai999 said:


> even though this was there best match people didn't give it a chance due to the fact that it was done to death


pretty much they have been wrestling or involved with each other since May (with November being only month away from each other) including two extra matches this month of December. if they seriously do this match at Mania than they really going to have to get 3 bigger matches on the card to sell the PPV especially if your main championship match has been overkill/overdone.

3rd hour most of the time does the worst anyways, too long for a lot of casuals to sit thru also.


----------



## Mr. I

Standard ratings. Nothing much to talk about, it keeps up the current trend and without quarterly's it's pretty vague thing.



Best4Bidness said:


> That "dull" wrestler just got the most rabid crowd response of any wrestler in how many years? Don't attribute it to being in his home state either. Bryan's reception by that audience was god tier. No one today gets a sustained reaction like that,not Punk in Chicago or Rock in Miami but Bryan just did. The only thing dull in this thread is your repetitive posting and lack of hearing.


Put him on ignore, he's a lazy troll.


----------



## LKRocks

Good god. The third hour just keeps getting the worst viewership every single week. Three consecutive hours of wrestling weekly is too much.


----------



## Choke2Death

Sucks about the third hour but like said, they have overdone that match so many times that it doesn't feel "must watch" anymore plus the quality of the PPV matches were lacking which didn't do it any favors.

I do think the numbers would have been better if they had kept it as a title match rather than a pointless singles match with nothing at stake. No reason why they removed the stipulation since Orton would have retained thanks to the DQ anyways.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

It didnt help hour 3 that the football game was decided in the last few seconds. Still the show is too long.


----------



## Londrick

I guess that settles it, time for another Cena reign. Seems everyone tuned in for the first hour hoping Cena would be the champ then tuned out when they saw Orton won and a vanilla midget was gonna be in the main event again.


----------



## krai999

Jesus Chris' Birthday said:


> I guess that settles it, time for another Cena reign. Seems everyone tuned in for the first hour hoping Cena would be the champ then tuned out when they saw Orton won and a vanilla midget was gonna be in the main event again.


:fpalm even when cena and orton were feuding ratings were still as hell. Even when wwe was promoting the segments of the unification match they were still of the lowest hour. Orton is a ratings killer


----------



## superuser1

Jesus Chris' Birthday said:


> I guess that settles it, time for another Cena reign. Seems everyone tuned in for the first hour hoping Cena would be the champ then tuned out when they saw Orton won and a vanilla midget was gonna be in the main event again.


So the first hour did well because they were hoping Cena would be champ? Lol you make no sense like nobody knew Orton won at TLC.


----------



## Choke2Death

He was joking. If you frequent this thread, you should have that figured out by now.

It's also pretty hard to point fingers and say so and so is killing ratings when we don't even have the proper breakdowns anymore.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

I,admittedly, almost didnt watch the Bryan/Orton match because I assumed it was going to be a one sided clean win to put a kibosh on those YES chants during Orton and Cena segments. I am glad I was wrong because that was the best WWe match in months.


----------



## WWE

It's so ironic how for the past couple of weeks, everyone trashed Orton for the third ratings drop. But now that Orton *AND* Bryan were involved in the same segments and matches. It's all like 'Oh orton and bryan were done to death'

'Oh third hour is too long for people'

8*D :HHH2 :vince4


----------



## JY57

final rating - 2.95


----------



## Waffelz

Third hour was pretty awesome too. End of the tag match, decent Diva tag match and then the Main Event. 

Orton always loses viewers. 

2.95 is pretty good.


----------



## JTB33b

All the kids are in bed by the 3rd hour.


----------



## WWE

Notice 'dem excuses when Bryan is main eventing? :HHH2


----------



## Mr. I

PSYCHO CHRISTMAS said:


> Notice 'dem excuses when Bryan is main eventing? :HHH2


We heard you the first time. Your salt is showing.


----------



## WWE

Ithil said:


> We heard you the first time. Your salt is showing.


I'm just trying to unleash the inner rage from them bryan marks.

I ain't giving up :cena3


...I also do the same thing with Rocky marks :rock


----------



## Fissiks

PSYCHO CHRISTMAS said:


> I'm just trying to unleash the inner rage from them bryan marks.
> 
> I ain't giving up :cena3
> 
> 
> ...I also do the same thing with Rocky marks :rock


";_; give me attention guys"

people try to hard to be funny on this board 

you are never going to do it better than vanboxmeer


----------



## Yes Era

Let's see....everyone realized that the main event was just another set up and buffer to get to another Cena/Orton match. And realized that from the horrible John Cena pandering bullshit to kick the show off...not to mention WAY too many Orton segments in one show...a guy that causal fans at home RUN from and can't wait to turn the channel on. Sounds about right to me.


----------



## Yes Era

PSYCHO CHRISTMAS said:


> It's so ironic how for the past couple of weeks, everyone trashed Orton for the third ratings drop. But now that Orton *AND* Bryan were involved in the same segments and matches. It's all like 'Oh orton and bryan were done to death'
> 
> 'Oh third hour is too long for people'
> 
> 8*D :HHH2 :vince4


Well Bryan isn't a proven ratings loser. He's one of the only significant winners on the ratings sheet in 2013 consistently. More than your Punks and Cenas...only Rock has blown everyone else away. I think there was big Taker numbers too. But that's it.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

Does anyone have specific numbers of Daniel Bryan from this year? I've seen some good numbers and some bad ones.


----------



## superuser1

This thread is so damn backwards. The last time the breakdown cameout was during that episode where Big Show got his job back and Reigns powerbombed him through the announcers table and you know what's funny? The third hour had the least amount of viewers and everyone clowned on Big Show calling him the ratings killer and so on then the breakdown cameout a couple days after and that segment actually turned out to have good numbers and nobody had anything to say after lol so that goes to show theres no point in calling anyone the ratings killer when theres no breakdown anymore. So this thread is basically useless.


----------



## wwe4universe

Coming off from one of "the biggest match in wwe history", raw does a 2.95 ratings with continuous decline in viewership for the whole 3 hours. Man when was the last time wwe ever obtained an above 3.0 in ratings? I wish i can be more optimistic about this but man the standard for average ratings just keep on sinking. This just proves 3 hours dont work, not with the type of mediocre product the wwe regularly displays. What good of an incredible mainevent if ppl are driven away from the boredom of the first two hours?


----------



## THANOS

The Boy Wonder said:


> Does anyone have specific numbers of Daniel Bryan from this year? I've seen some good numbers and some bad ones.


If I'm not too tired when I get home I'll see if I can dig them up for you man, but maybe someone will be kind enough to do it before me. I will say that he has been extremely consistent. He's only lost once since he broke away from Hell No as far as I can remember and it was in the second quarter, after the top of the show segment, which almost always loses viewers. Some of his high points include huge gains against Wade Barrett on Smackdown (even doing better than the authority segment earlier in that same show), against Ryback on RAW during his weak link storyline, his two gauntlet matches (which both grew as they went), and then all of his big main event matches/segments in the authority storyline (but I don't really look at those too much because they can easily be attributed by some people to others such as HHH).


----------



## #Mark

Completely unrelated, but remember when people were burying Bryan on here for not being a PPV draw?

I just saw this on another thread and it says the complete opposite:

(2012 is not included because it had a different PPV model)

2010
noc 165k
hiac 210k
bragging rights 137k

2011
noc 161k
hiac 182k
vengeance 121k

2013
noc 175k
battleground ~125k
hiac ~220k


Essentially, when comparing the PPVs by year all the Bryan/Orton main evented PPVs during the fall were better than all of the other comparable PPVs except for Bragging Rights 2010. I especially find it funny that NOC 2013 was better than the two previous ones (2010 had Taker/Kane & Orton vs. Edge vs. Y2J vs. Barrett vs. Sheamus vs. Cena and 2011 had HHH/Punk & Cena/ADR for the title).


----------



## THANOS

#Mark said:


> Completely unrelated, but remember when people were burying Bryan on here for not being a PPV draw?
> 
> I just saw this on another thread and it says the complete opposite:
> 
> (2012 is not included because it had a different PPV model)
> 
> 2010
> noc 165k
> hiac 210k
> bragging rights 137k
> 
> 2011
> noc 161k
> hiac 182k
> vengeance 121k
> 
> 2013
> noc 175k
> battleground ~125k
> hiac ~220k
> 
> 
> Essentially, when comparing the PPVs by year all the Bryan/Orton main evented PPVs during the fall were better than all of the other comparable PPVs except for Bragging Rights 2010. I especially find it funny that NOC 2013 was better than the two previous ones (2010 had Taker/Kane & Orton vs. Edge vs. Y2J vs. Barrett vs. Sheamus vs. Cena and 2011 had HHH/Punk & Cena/ADR for the title).


Wow nice find man. Repped. This is especially amazing when you consider that less people are watching the shows every year that passes by.


----------



## markedfordeath

so reading this, I take it the reports of them thinking he doesnt draw have to be BS, correct?


----------



## THANOS

markedfordeath said:


> so reading this, I take it the reports of them thinking he doesnt draw have to be BS, correct?


If it isn't than Vince McMahon has somehow transformed into a poor businessman who doesn't use historical figures when evaluating his current fiscal year. The likelihood of that being true is the same as Hornswoggle somehow growing 3 ft.


----------



## markedfordeath

the RTWM is going to be awesome. All the upcoming feuds will be great. Its boring how Orton is going to be champion for the next several months, but oh well. Wonder who will be the guy to knock him off his throne. The Authority storyline is just old now.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

The Boy Wonder said:


> Does anyone have specific numbers of Daniel Bryan from this year? I've seen some good numbers and some bad ones.


Yeah.


----------



## THANOS

markedfordeath said:


> the RTWM is going to be awesome. All the upcoming feuds will be great. Its boring how Orton is going to be champion for the next several months, but oh well. Wonder who will be the guy to knock him off his throne. The Authority storyline is just old now.


Personally, as long as Orton can keep up how he was on RAW Monday (promos/inring) than I'm fine with him going in as Champion as long as he doesn't face Cena. An Orton/Lesnar match would be fantastic.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Yeah.


...so post them. 

Nice to see the theory of Bryan not being a PPV draw pretty much being proven wrong.


----------



## markedfordeath

he's totally a ppv draw....did anyone here actually expect Battleground to get over 120,000 buys? I was thinking it wasn't even worth 12,000. I think what happened was that Bryan won SOTY and they were like, "holy shit, this guy really is popular" and now here we are with him getting the focus again for a little while. I understand Orton is the champion for storyline purposes only, but they should have really tested Bryan with the belt by now. To see what he really can bring..Maybe he could bring huge numbers if he is champion. How would they know unless they let him run with it? Also, the frustrated viewers will probably come back as well. Tons of frustrated people right now.


----------



## CM Jewels

Vince just needed a scapegoat/someone to throw under the bus. Now look.


----------



## markedfordeath

yeah, and now that same scapegoat was thrown back in, so I guess he wasn't truly the reason....hmmm


----------



## CM Jewels

Now what do Bryan haters have to say?

I'm waiting for damage control.


----------



## markedfordeath

Clearly he won't win the title anytime soon, because the storyline calls for Orton to keep it for awhile, but they are throwing Bryan back in there it looks like. My guess is he is about to beat Orton AGAIN for the title at the Rumble while Cena is out of the ring injured, and HBK comes in and superkicks him costing him another opportunity at the title, then that'll start the HBK/DB feud for Mania, and after DB beats HBK, instant over night legend, then he'll finally win the title...I mean fuck, he has to win it sometime! I understand them not giving it to him because of storyline purposes with the Authority, but after Mania, once the Authority is over and done with, they have to give the title to him.


----------



## validreasoning

this past monday



> *Male 18-49 Break Down*
> 
> 
> Q1: Raw opened with an exceedingly strong 2.41 rating for Randy Orton's coronation as WWE World Hvt. champion, John Cena's response, and the main event of Orton vs. Daniel Bryan set up.
> 
> Q2: Raw dropped 20 percent to a 1.94 rating for a segment that included two full commercial breaks and the first-half of Rhodes Bros. vs. Rey Mysterio & Big Show.
> 
> Q3: Raw rebounded to a 2.09 rating for the end of the tag match and one-and-a-half commercials.
> 
> Q4: Raw fell back to a 1.93 rating for Fandango vs. Dolph Ziggler, the first-half of Big E. Langston & Mark Henry vs. the Real Americans, and one-and-a-half commercials.
> 
> Q5: Raw got a slight top-of-the-hour bump to a 2.02 rating for the end of Langston & Henry vs. Real Americans and one commercial.
> 
> Q6: Raw slipped to a 1.98 rating for Tensai & Brodus Clay vs. Ryback & Curtis Axel and one-and-a-half commercials.
> 
> Q7: Raw rebounded to an above-average 2.07 rating for C.M. Punk's confrontation with Shawn Michaels and one-and-a-half commercials.
> 
> Q8: Raw fell to a 1.89 rating for C.M. Punk & The Usos vs. The Shield in a six-man tag match that followed the off-center Punk-HBK confrontation, plus one-and-a-half commercials.
> 
> Q9: Raw did not get a top-of-the-hour bump, scoring a 1.90 rating for the end of the six-man tag match, one commercial, and a Wyatt vignette.
> 
> Q10: Raw began its third-hour slide with a 1.79 rating for two full commercial breaks and a six-Divas tag match.
> 
> Q11: Raw bottomed out with a 1.74 rating for various video and interview segments leading to the main event, plus one commercial.
> 
> Q12: Raw rebounded to a 1.99 rating for the first-half of the Orton vs. Bryan main event, plus one mid-match commercial.
> 
> Over-run: Raw finished with a 2.32 rating for the conclusion of Orton vs. Bryan and post-match activity involving Cena.


----------



## markedfordeath

looks like all the crap in the third hour was washed away once the Main Event happened, and even after the commercial break in the main event, the interest grew, so thats a good thing. It looks like most of the viewers came for the main event at the end....even during that great football game. Looks like the beginning of the main event all the way to the overrun, 600,000 viewers or more were gained. Not bad.


----------



## Londrick

Daniel Ratings Bryan once again in the two highest rated segments. :bryan :vince7

I think the third hour wouldn't look so bad if it included the overrun.


----------



## markedfordeath

people tuned out during the divas match, But then came back in droves for the main event....very good gains during a good football game...the game was tight all the way to the end. Thats cool that even during the commercial break of the match, viewers gained.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The Bryan/Orton match had the largest increase in m18-49 from the previous segment. It increased from a 1.74 to a 1.99. The ending increased an additional .33. It did quite well against the down to the last second football game. I would like to see the actual viewer numbers and not just the male demo.


----------



## Happenstan

> Q7: Raw rebounded to an above-average 2.07 rating for C.M. Punk's confrontation with Shawn Michaels and one-and-a-half commercials.
> 
> Q8: Raw fell to a 1.89 rating for C.M. Punk & The Usos vs. The Shield in a six-man tag match that followed the off-center Punk-HBK confrontation, plus one-and-a-half commercials.


What? Ratings went down during CM Punk's promo with HBK and his match with the freaking Shield? Obviously commercials didn't help but HBK and Punk were out there. WTF? That's a little surprising IMO.


----------



## markedfordeath

its obvious now they put Bryan in the main event to pop that big rating...what fucked it up though, and what could have made it even bigger, was if they didn't have the fucking Divas match on efore it...so the main event had to pick up the slack.


----------



## Waffelz

Divas are always on before the main event or the last match for some reason.


----------



## markedfordeath

and it brings the rating down.


----------



## LKRocks

Happenstan said:


> What? Ratings went down during CM Punk's promo with HBK and his match with the freaking Shield? Obviously commercials didn't help but HBK and Punk were out there. WTF? That's a little surprising IMO.


Q6: Raw slipped to a 1.98 rating for Tensai & Brodus Clay vs. Ryback & Curtis Axel and one-and-a-half commercials.

Q7: Raw rebounded to an above-average 2.07 rating for C.M. Punk's confrontation with Shawn Michaels and one-and-a-half commercials.


The ratings only fell during the match


----------



## markedfordeath

how do they expect HBK to help pop ratings when the last few appearances for him haven't been advertised?


----------



## Happenstan

LKRocks said:


> Q6: Raw slipped to a 1.98 rating for Tensai & Brodus Clay vs. Ryback & Curtis Axel and one-and-a-half commercials.
> 
> Q7: Raw rebounded to an above-average 2.07 rating for C.M. Punk's confrontation with Shawn Michaels and one-and-a-half commercials.
> 
> 
> The ratings only fell during the match


Exactly. A CM Punk/Shield match with HBK introduction fell below Tensai & Brodus Clay vs. Ryback & Curtis Axel. Bryan's matches tend to gain ratings as they continue along. I guess I just figured the same would happen with Punk but it clearly didn't in this instance....hence my surprise.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Waffelz said:


> Divas are always on before the main event or the last match for some reason.


I think they want the segment preceding the main event to do a so so number, so the main event can show a big increase.


----------



## Schrute_Farms

Best4Bidness said:


> I think they want the segment preceding the main event to do a so so number, so the main event can show a big increase.


exactly! wow a huge bump for ________ wrestler.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Ooo, a breakdown. 

Really strong opener, to be expected with it coming off TLC and the crowning of a unified champion. 

Punk promo leading into Punk/HBK did really really well. Beating out the 9 and 10PM slots, as well as the main event before the overrun factor brought viewers back in is great. However, the match dropping the next quarter wasn't good. Only explanation I can think of is that Punk had beaten The Shield the night before on his own, so that took away the fun out of Punk with a team, beating them, and so people tuned out not expecting much from the result. At the very least, it wasn't the lowest of the night. Now the 10PM... don't know if I'd blame the match itself. Don't know how long the match went into the 10PM, but I don't think it was more than 5 minutes (I really don't remember though), and if that's the case, it has more to do with the 10PM having no central focus. 

Overrun does really well. Not much to say on that.


----------



## Choke2Death

> Q1: Raw opened with an exceedingly strong 2.41 rating for Randy Orton's coronation as WWE World Hvt. champion, John Cena's response, and the main event of Orton vs. Daniel Bryan set up.
> 
> Q12: Raw rebounded to a 1.99 rating for the first-half of the Orton vs. Bryan main event, plus one mid-match commercial.
> 
> Over-run: Raw finished with a 2.32 rating for the conclusion of Orton vs. Bryan and post-match activity involving Cena.


rton2 :bryan


----------



## markedfordeath

See, yeah sure their feud didn't bring much in the form of PPV numbers, but they can still draw viewers on a free show...Tells you all you need to know, people dont' have the money nowadays.


----------



## LKRocks

Heh. I didn't think Bryan would become a draw so quickly. Must be dat beard.


----------



## markedfordeath

Bryan's future looks seriously big time bright. He's the most important guy in the company right now and the best asset if you think about it. He is so fucking over, that they're using him to get guys over as heels and over as faces. Whoever tags with him in a tag match gets over, whoever attacks him gets heel heat. He is very important to improving other guy's characters. Very essential. Plus, the feuds in his future will be awesome and all of his matches have a hot crowd so whoever wrestles him benefits from having a big feel to the match.


----------



## #Mark

PSYCHO CHRISTMAS said:


> Notice 'dem excuses when Bryan is main eventing? :HHH2


No need for excuses. D-Bry was in the two highest rating segments of the night :bryan


----------



## Waffelz

Orton still isn't a draw.


----------



## Happenstan

#Mark said:


> No need for excuses. D-Bry was in the two highest rating segments of the night :bryan


As usual. :yes


----------



## markedfordeath

Still don't get it..did they give us that main event just to make us happy? because if he's just going to lose at the Rumble and face HBK at Mania, then what is the point of this whole Cena/Bryan nonsense right now? they keep mentioning HBK facing him, yet he's back in the title scene? so what do you think happens with him? does he ever become champion?


----------



## Happenstan

markedfordeath said:


> Still don't get it..did they give us that main event just to make us happy? because if he's just going to lose at the Rumble and face HBK at Mania, then what is the point of this whole Cena/Bryan nonsense right now? they keep mentioning HBK facing him, yet he's back in the title scene? so what do you think happens with him? does he ever become champion?


Dude, would you stop already? Your schtick isn't amusing anymore. 40 posts a day about the exact same fucking subject is old. Real old. Don't you have anything else to do in your life other than trolling a wrestling board in a futile attempt to make Bryan fans look bad? It's starting to border on the pathetic.


----------



## markedfordeath

Yeah, it really is huh? Guess i'm obsessive compulsive. Stopping!


----------



## Happenstan

markedfordeath said:


> Yeah, it really is huh? Guess i'm obsessive compulsive. Stopping!


If you are not a troll I apologize but you have got to calm the fuck down. There are plenty of threads and plenty of discussions about other wrestlers you can join in. Surely you like someone other than just Bryan and can add something of value to those conversations. 40 posts a day about the same thing is nuts, bro. Limit yourself to a few a day and join in other conversations. Like I said...if you aren't trolling us all.


----------



## markedfordeath

i'm just clearly frustrated about the treatment going on in the WWE. And the storyline direction. And how they don't take advantage of amazing momentum. But like I said, I stopped.


----------



## superuser1

[email protected] bringing in them ratings and now the haters blaming him for the third hour disappeared.


----------



## superuser1

Waffelz said:


> Orton still isn't a draw.


Randy has always drawn as a heel. Nothing new here.


----------



## Choke2Death

superuser1 said:


> Randy has always drawn as a heel. Nothing new here.


Don't feed the troll.


----------



## Alo0oy

> Q1: Raw opened with an exceedingly strong 2.41 rating for Randy Orton's coronation as WWE World Hvt. champion, John Cena's response, and the main event of Orton vs. Daniel Bryan set up.
> 
> Q7: Raw rebounded to an above-average 2.07 rating for C.M. Punk's confrontation with Shawn Michaels and one-and-a-half commercials.
> 
> Q12: Raw rebounded to a 1.99 rating for the first-half of the Orton vs. Bryan main event, plus one mid-match commercial.
> 
> Over-run: Raw finished with a 2.32 rating for the conclusion of Orton vs. Bryan and post-match activity involving Cena.


unk2 rton2


----------



## Happenstan

Alo0oy said:


> unk2 rton2


More like :bryan rton2

People tuned out during Punk's segment. He lost ratings during his match. Yes, I know commercials contributed but Punk and HBK were just out there and a small group bail? Didn't they want to see if HHH or HBK would interfere in his match? Funny how Bryan didn't have this problem when he gained ratings throughout the night while wrestling Cesaro through 2 commercials after having wrestled Swagger for 10 minutes before hand a while back. :cesaro


----------



## Alo0oy

Happenstan said:


> More like :bryan rton2
> 
> People tuned out during Punk's segment. He lost ratings during his match. Yes, I know commercials contributed but Punk and HBK were just out there and a small group bail? Didn't they want to see if HHH or HBK would interfere in his match? Funny how Bryan didn't have this problem when he gained ratings throughout the night while wrestling Cesaro through 2 commercials after having wrestled Swagger for 10 minutes before hand a while back. :cesaro


The match may have lost viewers but his promo was one of the most viewed segments of the night, & the match lost viewers because it was a rematch from the PPV, who would tune in for a rematch?

While Bryan & Orton deserve credit for the main event, Bryan doesn't deserve credit for the opening segment.

All trolling aside, all of Orton/Punk/Bryan did well.


----------



## LKRocks

It's great to see all major players doing well. We get better TV when the company doesn't have to worry about who is a draw and who isn't. 
With all 4 guys doing well, I don't think WWE will have to shoehorn John Cena int everything anymore, which is great. 
More stars = More variety = More storylines = Less filler segments with Khali dancing


----------



## markedfordeath

the fact that Bryan is being even more featured than before tells you everything..Look at the previews for Tribute to the Troops..they all end the night doing the Yes chant with all the wrestlers in the ring..Bryan is the center of attention there too. The company has wisened up.I hate how he's still being in a feud with the Wyatts wasting his time, but hey, they're trying to get the Wyatts to become the big time heel stable, so that's working.


----------



## JY57

Smackdown viewship goes up from previous week 

2.724 million (12/20) from 2.686 million (12/13)


----------



## markedfordeath

Smackdown keeps going up and down...Raw and Smackdown never ever go week to week higher than the other....it goes down, goes up, goes down, goes up. Never consistent.


----------



## JasonLives

Monday Night Raw Viewership from Monday:

Hour 1 3.893 million viewers
Hour 2 3.959 million viewers
Hour 3 3.610 million viewers

Once again the third hour took a hit. The rest I guess is decent.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

markedfordeath said:


> i'm just clearly frustrated about the treatment going on in the WWE. And the storyline direction. And how they don't take advantage of amazing momentum. But like I said, I stopped.


*Two Days Later*



markedfordeath said:


> its apparent after this past Smackdown and tonight's Raw....going forward, the WWE values Langston more than they do Bryan. Langston takes Bryan's shine away on Smackdown and they have Bryan beat down instead, and now on tonight's Raw Langston is in the main event and gets to stand tall at the end and Bryan gets his ass beat AGAIN.thats all they ever do to him is have him get his ass kicked.


Yep you've definitely stopped.


----------



## JY57

not bad for a Christmas show especially considering last year was down atrocity


----------



## Alo0oy

JY57 said:


> not bad for a Christmas show especially considering last year was down atrocity


Do you have last year's numbers?


----------



## JY57

^ keep in mind it was Christmas Eve so much much less watched than 23rd of December:

Hour one: 2.94 million viewers
Hour two: 3.27 million viewers
Hour three: 3.22 million viewers

with a 2.2 rating


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Yeah, it wasn't going to be as low as last year's. Last year's was Christmas Eve and absolutely nothing would save that. 

Decent numbers.


----------



## D.M.N.

"On NBC, WWE Tribute to the Troops scored a 0.6 adults 18-49 rating up 100 percent from a 0.3 for last year's special which aired on Saturday, December 22, 2012."

NBC	WWE Tribute to the Troops	0.6/2	2.31

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...e-tribute-to-the-troops-48-hours-rise/225337/

Nice numbers.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

DAT Bryan opening and closing the show with his theme = RATINGZ :yes


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

This year's WWE Tribute To The Troops special on NBC averaged 2.31 million viewers, up a whopping 76% from last year's show, which drew 1.31 million viewers. It was in line with the 2011 version, which garnered 2.08 million viewers on NBC. According to TV By The Numbers, the show finished second in its timeslot and scored a 0.6 rating in the 18-49 demo.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Yeah, it wasn't going to be as low as last year's. Last year's was Christmas Eve and absolutely nothing would save that.
> 
> Decent numbers.


And yet for what ever reason people continue to point that rating out when trying to say that Cm Punk was the reason for the low ratings.


----------



## Fatcat

That Christmas Eve episode was the one where Del Rio ran over Santa Claus, leading up to a "Miracle on 34th Street" match against Cena.


----------



## dxbender

Best4Bidness said:


> This year's WWE Tribute To The Troops special on NBC averaged 2.31 million viewers, up a whopping 76% from last year's show, which drew 1.31 million viewers. It was in line with the 2011 version, which garnered 2.08 million viewers on NBC. According to TV By The Numbers, the show finished second in its timeslot and scored a 0.6 rating in the 18-49 demo.


Unfortunately for WWE that when they're on a network like NBC, that's all they get. Would be nice to see WWE on NBC one day with a meaningful show. Not a pre-taped show airing on Saturday.

They should have 1 episode of Raw on NBC just to test it out and see how it does. I wouldn't mind them trying that one time. I'm sure ratings would be great for them.


----------



## JY57

Smackdown viewership up - 2,852,000


----------



## JY57

> *Update on WWE technical issues last night*
> 
> It was not just the West Coast, but the entire DirecTV feed in HD was a mess for the Brock Lesnar interivew and the following Divas match on a national basis.
> 
> It would make sense next week to replay the Lesnar segment during Raw because a significant percentage of the audience wouldn't have been able to see it very well.


via F4Wonline


----------



## Rick Sanchez

They were probably gonna do that anyways since most of the show is usually already filler.


----------



## D.M.N.

WWE Entertainment	USA	9:00 PM	4204	1.0
WWE Entertainment	USA	8:00 PM	4141	1.0
WWE Entertainment	USA	10:00 PM	4040	1.0


----------



## validreasoning

either thats a mistake on the 18-49 demo or it got killed (down some 60%) from 2 weeks ago. nothing on tv could account for such a drop. college bowl game did 7.5 million viewers on espn but only a 1.8 in the 18-49 bracket which is much lower than the nfl games were doing opposite raw.


----------



## checkcola

All three hours did 4 mil. Not bad.


----------



## JY57

Hour 1 - 4.141 million
Hour 2 - 4.204 million
Hour 3 - 4.040 million

much better than last year but last year was on New Year's Eve so thats totally understandable.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Good numbers.


----------



## the fox

i guess spoiling brock return did actually help the rating
and a lot of the top stars wasn't on the show too


----------



## Organically Over

Yea seeing as how Brock's return vid has twice as many views than Bryan's segment on youtube. I think the ratings can be chocked up to Lesnar.


----------



## Choke2Death

Fair to say Brock brought those numbers. At least for me, I wouldn't have even watched if it wasn't for knowing he'll be there. I even turned it off when the divas match started because his appearance was the true main event and I had no interest in Bryan wrestling the Wyatts for the millionth time (or the feud in general).


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Bryan brings over 4 million for the third quarter without Cena. Not bad for a guy stuck in a mid-card feud.


----------



## checkcola

Best4Bidness said:


> Bryan brings over 4 million for the third quarter without Cena. Not bad for a guy stuck in a mid-card feud.


*Brock gets credit* 

Because you know, he was on commentary doing his wild animal call during the match


----------



## THANOS

Choke2Death said:


> Fair to say Brock brought those numbers. At least for me, I wouldn't have even watched if it wasn't for knowing he'll be there. I even turned it off when the divas match started because his appearance was the true main event and I had no interest in Bryan wrestling the Wyatts for the millionth time (or the feud in general).


I don't know man, I know Brock's return probably did amazing, but Bryan's gauntlets have traditionally done very well and gained throughout. It will be interesting to see if we actually get a breakdown this week.


----------



## Choke2Death

THANOS said:


> I don't know man, I know Brock's return probably did amazing, but Bryan's gauntlets have traditionally done very well and gained throughout. It will be interesting to see if we actually get a breakdown this week.


Oh, I'm not dismissing Bryan just like that. What I think is, word about Brock's return brought more interest and Bryan managed to keep those viewers for the main event so they stayed above the 4 million mark.


----------



## validreasoning

Organically Over said:


> Yea seeing as how Brock's return vid has twice as many views than Bryan's segment on youtube. I think the ratings can be chocked up to Lesnar.


anyone watching on direct tv in hd would have missed the lesnar segment last night so were probably rewatching on youtube. watching on youtube suggests that person didn't watch on tv to begin with.



> It was not just the West Coast, but the entire DirecTV feed in HD was a mess for the Brock Lesnar interivew and the following Divas match on a national basis.
> 
> It would make sense next week to replay the Lesnar segment during Raw because a significant percentage of the audience wouldn't have been able to see it very well.


very few outside the hardcore of hardcore internet fans knew lesnar was returning last night. even on here the raw thread did a below average level of replies for a monday night. after all the show only averaged a 1.0 rating in the 18-49 demo which tells you the biggest audience segment took the night off


----------



## xD7oom

:brock = Ratings


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Umm, guys, CM Punk brought in the ratings. That's an indisputable fact.


----------



## PRL18

No Football


----------



## Londrick

People came for the Brock and stayed for the Bryan. :brock :bryan


----------



## Yes Era

THANOS said:


> I don't know man, I know Brock's return probably did amazing, but Bryan's gauntlets have traditionally done very well and gained throughout. It will be interesting to see if we actually get a breakdown this week.


LOl. Why are you even entertaining that kid? No one even knew Lesnar was gonna be there. The Bryan storyline was hyped all show long. It's not even close.


----------



## Bryan D.

:brock


----------



## funnyfaces1

:henry1 = Ratings


----------



## Bfo4jd

D.M.N. said:


> WWE Entertainment	USA	9:00 PM	4204	1.0
> WWE Entertainment	USA	8:00 PM	4141	1.0
> WWE Entertainment	USA	10:00 PM	4040	1.0


Why is the 18-49 demo rating quoted wrong? 

Hour 1 - 1.4
Hour 2 - 1.4
Hour 3 - 1.3

Up from last week. :brock obviously.


----------



## Happenstan

validreasoning said:


> anyone watching on direct tv in hd would have missed the lesnar segment last night so were probably rewatching on youtube. watching on youtube suggests that person didn't watch on tv to begin with.
> 
> 
> 
> very few outside the hardcore of hardcore internet fans knew lesnar was returning last night. even on here the raw thread did a below average level of replies for a monday night. after all the show only averaged a 1.0 rating in the 18-49 demo which tells you the biggest audience segment took the night off


This. And even if they did know Brock was returning, half of their customer base (satellite feed) was down. I seriously doubt people sat through 20 minutes of scramble vision so they could *hear* Brock's return. Most likely Bryan popped the rating here like he did with his last gauntlet match with the Real Americans and Ryback.


----------



## BOOTS 2 ASSES

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.141 million
> Hour 2 - 4.204 million
> Hour 3 - 4.040 million
> 
> much better than last year but last year was on New Year's Eve so thats totally understandable.


With over 4m viewership average for all three hours,the final ratings should be above 3.0?


----------



## WWE

Come on guys, people were obviously expecting cena
:HHH2

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Rick Sanchez

I skipped most of Raw as usual. Punk/Rollins, Bryan/Wyatts and the Brock segment were the only things I cared about.


----------



## superuser1

Boots2Asses said:


> With over 4m viewership average for all three hours,the final ratings should be above 3.0?


Nah a few weeks ago each hour hit 4 mil and the ratings was still in the 2s


----------



## Starbuck

:brock and dat GOAT rton2 video package bringing in da ratingz.


----------



## D.M.N.

*2012 ratings*
Average = 4.33 million viewers

Two Hour Era
Average = 4.55 million viewers
Hour 1 = 4.55 million viewers
Hour 2 = 4.55 million viewers

Three Hour Era
Average = 4.06 million viewers (3.98m excluding Raw 1000)
Hour 1 = 3.98 million viewers (3.92m)
Hour 2 = 4.21 million viewers (4.12m)
Hour 3 = 4.00 million viewers (3.90m)

*2013 ratings*
Average = 4.16 million viewers
Hour 1 = 4.11 million viewers
Hour 2 = 4.25 million viewers
Hour 3 = 4.11 million viewers

January to July 15th
Average = 4.33 million viewers
Hour 1 = 4.27 million viewers
Hour 2 = 4.42 million viewers
Hour 3 = 3.31 million viewers

July 22nd to December
Average = 3.95 million viewers
Hour 1 = 3.93 million viewers
Hour 2 = 4.05 million viewers
Hour 3 = 3.87 million viewers

So year-on-year, they've lost about 150,000 viewers. And for the same three hour period versus last year, they've lost about 30,000. Which, considering we have an extra hour now is very, very good.

It also shows more so how USA needs WWE and not necessarily the other way around.


----------



## rbhayek

Can I ask some of you a legitimate question? Do you honestly believe ONE man (not talking about one man in particular but let's say for example one man, John Cena or CM Punk) determines the rating a product gets? If the WWE has a quality show IMO it's going to draw regardless of who is on the card. If it doesn't then you can put Cena in the main event every night and it's still going to fail. By the "he can draw and he can't draw" logic, it would be comparable to saying that Tom Brady is the only reason the New England Patriots draw for the NFL or Peyton Manning for the Denver Broncos when it has been proven that fans like to see good teams regardless of who is playing. Likewise, if the product is good, it's going to get watched regardless of who is in the main event.


----------



## fulcizombie

rbhayek said:


> Can I ask some of you a legitimate question? Do you honestly believe ONE man (not talking about one man in particular but let's say for example one man, John Cena or CM Punk) determines the rating a product gets? If the WWE has a quality show IMO it's going to draw regardless of who is on the card. If it doesn't then you can put Cena in the main event every night and it's still going to fail. By the "he can draw and he can't draw" logic, it would be comparable to saying that Tom Brady is the only reason the New England Patriots draw for the NFL or Peyton Manning for the Denver Broncos when it has been proven that fans like to see good teams regardless of who is playing. Likewise, if the product is good, it's going to get watched regardless of who is in the main event.


I believe that huge superstars of the past are draws , regardless of the quality of the programm . Put the rock or SCSA or even Hulk Hogan in few raws and the ratings will slightly go up . Even a guy like Lesnar can help. From the current roster NOBODY is a real draw and that includes john cena (i never understood why people consider cena a draw when ratings and PPV numbers in his "era" have gone to the toilet and despite wwe putting its marketing weight 100% behind him he hasn't been able to cross to the mainstream )


----------



## SerapisLiber

Ratings aren't what wrestlers typically used to determine who draws anyway, money is. Hence the phrase "___ never drew a dime." Ratings are for free TV. Ticket sales and PPV buys and the like reflect drawing power.

They clearly are also not what TPTB use to determine a push.

They are just what we (s)marks use as ammo against each other in threads like these.


----------



## SerapisLiber

F4Wonline said:


> It would make sense next week to replay the Lesnar segment during Raw because a significant percentage of the audience wouldn't have been able to see it very well.


Well, that or just have Brock in an entirely new segment.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

SerapisLiber said:


> They are just what we (s)marks use as ammo against each other in threads like these.


Truer words have never been spoken in this thread.


----------



## validreasoning

fulcizombie said:


> From the current roster NOBODY is a real draw and that includes john cena (i never understood why people consider cena a draw when ratings and PPV numbers in his "era" have gone to the toilet and despite wwe putting its marketing weight 100% behind him he hasn't been able to cross to the mainstream )


he is considered a draw because in 2004 live attendance was around 3,500 paid and that jumped to 6,200 by 2009 with cena on top. this will be cenas 9th year on top come mania, by hogans 9th year on top wwe business was truly in the toilet and wwe were drawing just 3,000 paid in cities like chicago, detroit and boston for hogans matches.

as for ratings take cena off tv for one or three years and see the effect he would have if he returned...


----------



## SerapisLiber

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Truer words have never been spoken in this thread.


Indeed. I remember hearing X-Pac say in a shoot one time that back in '93 or '94 he marked out because one of his segments got a 3.21 which was unheard of at the time, and the boys in the back all made fun of him for giving a shit about ratings. He said for a while they called him "the 3.2-1 Kid" instead.


----------



## rbhayek

SerapisLiber said:


> Ratings aren't what wrestlers typically used to determine who draws anyway, money is. Hence the phrase "___ never drew a dime." Ratings are for free TV. Ticket sales and PPV buys and the like reflect drawing power.
> 
> They clearly are also not what TPTB use to determine a push.
> 
> They are just what we (s)marks use as ammo against each other in threads like these.


But ratings is exactly what forum members talk about when referencing drawing power. That's why I asked the question "do you really believe ONE MAN DRAWS the ratings in". Now if we were talking about merchandise sales then yes Cena does draw but so does Punk, Bryan and any other big guy who has made WWE money with merchandise. Ratings to me are a different story tho.


----------



## VGooBUG

D.M.N. said:


> *2012 ratings*
> Average = 4.33 million viewers
> 
> Two Hour Era
> Average = 4.55 million viewers
> Hour 1 = 4.55 million viewers
> Hour 2 = 4.55 million viewers
> 
> Three Hour Era
> Average = 4.06 million viewers (3.98m excluding Raw 1000)
> Hour 1 = 3.98 million viewers (3.92m)
> Hour 2 = 4.21 million viewers (4.12m)
> Hour 3 = 4.00 million viewers (3.90m)
> 
> *2013 ratings*
> Average = 4.16 million viewers
> Hour 1 = 4.11 million viewers
> Hour 2 = 4.25 million viewers
> Hour 3 = 4.11 million viewers
> 
> January to July 15th
> Average = 4.33 million viewers
> Hour 1 = 4.27 million viewers
> Hour 2 = 4.42 million viewers
> Hour 3 = 3.31 million viewers
> 
> July 22nd to December
> Average = 3.95 million viewers
> Hour 1 = 3.93 million viewers
> Hour 2 = 4.05 million viewers
> Hour 3 = 3.87 million viewers
> 
> So year-on-year, they've lost about 150,000 viewers. And for the same three hour period versus last year, they've lost about 30,000. Which, considering we have an extra hour now is very, very good.
> 
> It also shows more so how USA needs WWE and not necessarily the other way around.


losing viewership with the same format as the previous year, yep thats always good :side:


----------



## Dio Brando

How do ratings actually work do they just count the United States and who watches it on television? I say about 3 million people in the us watch on their television while like 2 million watches on streams in the us. And then we got everyone around the world who loves wrestling to death.


----------



## fulcizombie

validreasoning said:


> he is considered a draw because in 2004 live attendance was around 3,500 paid and that jumped to 6,200 by 2009 with cena on top. this will be cenas 9th year on top come mania, by hogans 9th year on top wwe business was truly in the toilet and wwe were drawing just 3,000 paid in cities like chicago, detroit and boston for hogans matches.
> 
> as for ratings take cena off tv for one or three years and see the effect he would have if he returned...


Why would I need to take cena off tv when I see the results of the cena era regarding tv ratings ? As for attendance numbers I truly believe that if wwe's programm had stayed relevant to the mainstream(no pg era, cena era) , with the social opportunities that this age presents , they would have been much higher and the same applies to ratings, ppv buyrates, merchandise sales e.t.c


----------



## validreasoning

VGooBUG said:


> losing viewership with the same format as the previous year, yep thats always good :side:


i ended up being spot on :cool2

raw averaged 2.82 from september till december with the lowest being a 2.65 on october 7. in fact they only dropped below a 2.7 three times and one of those was the taped christmas special














Shikamaru said:


> How do ratings actually work do they just count the United States and who watches it on television? I say about 3 million people in the us watch on their television while like 2 million watches on streams in the us. And then we got everyone around the world who loves wrestling to death.


its just the us. 4.2 million were watching raw live this past monday on tv, nielsen doesn't measure streams.



fulcizombie said:


> Why would I need to take cena off tv when I see the results of the cena era regarding tv ratings ? As for attendance numbers I truly believe that if wwe's programm had stayed relevant to the mainstream(no pg era, cena era) , with the social opportunities that this age presents , they would have been much higher and the same applies to ratings, ppv buyrates, merchandise sales e.t.c


wwe attendance figures dropped like a stone between 2002 and 2004 so cena era or pg era had nothing to do with it. since cena has become number one guy attendance rose steadily from 2004 and peaked in 2009.

i used the cena example because you were talking about guys that were draws and they appear on tv only a couple of times a year. cena spiked the ratings alot when he returned after just 2 months away the night after hiac so just imagine he was away a year. cena is one of the biggest draws in wrestling history but if you want to believe otherwise nothing i can do to change your mind.


----------



## D.M.N.

VGooBUG said:


> losing viewership with the same format as the previous year, yep thats always good :side:


Indeed, when DVR's are on the rise, and more people are watching via things such as the internet.....


----------



## Biast

So I guess this thread has died out, have been aways for some months. 

Ah, good times, good times indeed.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Expect horrible ratings for tonight's show. Johnny Manziel is a bigger draw than :brock


----------



## llrxyou

Every time people are very excited to see a boxing match ...:gun:


----------



## D.M.N.

Hour 1 - 4.723m (highest since March 11th)
Hour 2 - 4.427m (highest since August 19th)
Hour 3 - 4.463m (highest since April 8th)
Average = 4.538m (highest since April 8th)

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...-wwe-raw-teen-wolf-single-ladies-more/227246/


----------



## Cliffy

Bryan deserves all the credit obviously

Dat pseudo heel turn draw powah

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## validreasoning

imagine what raw would have done last night without the bcs championship game head to head (26 million viewers) and going down to the last seconds.


----------



## JY57

last year with The Rock's return was 3.14 rating with

Hour 1 - 4.29 million
Hour 2 - 4.32 million
Hour 3 - 4.65 million

so this year actually did better. Good for them.


----------



## MaybeLock

Jake Roberts bringing the snake... and the ratings :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death

D.M.N. said:


> Hour 1 - 4.723m (highest since March 11th)
> Hour 2 - 4.427m (highest since August 19th)
> Hour 3 - 4.463m (highest since April 8th)
> Average = 4.538m (highest since April 8th)
> 
> http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...-wwe-raw-teen-wolf-single-ladies-more/227246/


Good numbers.

DAT FIRST HOUR with the mini Evolution reunion! rton2 :flair2


----------



## Starbuck

D.M.N. said:


> Hour 1 - 4.723m (highest since March 11th)
> Hour 2 - 4.427m (highest since August 19th)
> Hour 3 - 4.463m (highest since April 8th)
> Average = 4.538m (highest since April 8th)
> 
> http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...-wwe-raw-teen-wolf-single-ladies-more/227246/


The fuck did that come from?

:vince2

High interest from the beginning is a great sign. OLD SCHOOL BRINGING DA RATINGZ.


----------



## Waffelz

It's a shame that we don't get breakdowns because I bet Roberts brought in a good couple hundred thousand.


----------



## D.M.N.

Waffelz said:


> It's a shame that we don't get breakdowns because I bet Roberts brought in a good couple hundred thousand.


He was on screen for the last two minutes, so I very much doubt it.


----------



## Starbuck

Waffelz said:


> It's a shame that we don't get breakdowns because I bet Roberts brought in a good couple hundred thousand.


From the looks of it :cena2 rton2 :flair2 probably did the highest of the night although I have no doubt the overrun could/did beat it. But we'll never know since Big Dave obviously lost his RATINGZ source.


----------



## Bryan D.

Those numbers man. :mark: :brock


----------



## the fox

third hour increase!
when was the last time this happened!


----------



## DesolationRow

Dave Batista already bringing da ratingz.


----------



## superuser1

The overrun probably did good people were expecting a Shield breakup or more tension between the group.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Looks like the Punk/Reigns did well as the third hour actually increased from the second hour.

Not that we'll ever actually know unless we get lucky and get a breakdown this week.


----------



## funnyfaces1

:bryan2 unk8 :brock rton2 :flair :reigns iper :rollins :ambrose

:henry1


----------



## JY57

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_75534.shtml#.UsyX_HmQflI



> "Old School" WWE Raw on Monday, January 6 scored a 3.23 rating, up nine percent from the final Raw of 2013.
> 
> It was the highest rating since the night after Summerslam in August, which scored a 3.24 rating.
> 
> - Raw averaged 4.537 million viewers, up 10 percent from the final Raw of 2013. It was the most viewers since the night after WrestleMania 29 in April, which averaged 4.612 million viewers.
> 
> Hourly Break Down: 4.723 million first hour viewers, decline to 4.427 million second hour viewers during the meat of the BCS Title game, and slight increase to 4.463 million third viewers.
> 
> The first hour was the most-watched since March 11, 2013, even more than the night after WM29. For the first time in 14 weeks, the third hour viewership increased from the second hour.
> 
> - The BCS Title game scored a 14.4 rating and averaging 25.6 million viewers on ESPN, which was up from the previous year's college football game due to the blow-out nature of the 2013 edition.
> 
> On cable TV Monday night, Raw ranked #3 behind football and "Major Crimes" on TNT, but #2 in key male demos behind football.
> 
> - Last year, the first Raw of 2013 against the BCS Title game scored a 3.14 rating and averaged 4.421 million viewers. Last year's third hour was more watched than this year's third hour due to the football game turning into a blow-out, which send viewers to Raw.


final ratin - 3.23 (highest since Post SummerSlam RAW)


----------



## xD7oom

Legends = Ratings.


----------



## Marv95

Not bad. I thought they would do a 3 even but a 3.2 is even better. Show still sucked though.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The first hour was the highest because viewers saw Bryan and thought he was the true Old School legend, Duke Droese. If the Duke of Dorchester, Pete Doherty, had shown, the ratings would have blown the roof off.


----------



## RatedR10

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Looks like the Punk/Reigns did well as the third hour actually increased from the second hour.
> 
> Not that we'll ever actually know unless we get lucky and get a breakdown this week.


I haven't paid attention to ratings for the longest time but why did breakdowns stop coming out?


----------



## NapperX

Not too excited as the ratings should have been much higher considering it was meant to be special edition of Raw. It could have been planned and written much better.


----------



## validreasoning

NapperX said:


> Not too excited as the ratings should have been much higher considering it was meant to be special edition of Raw. It could have been planned and written much better.


it went head to head with the 3rd most watched telecast in cable tv history and that game went right down to the wire.

last year had rock returning for the first time in months and a wwe title match on raw in a tlc match (last time the title was defended on raw) and the game head to head was a complete blowout at halftime and still didn't do as well as this year..


----------



## The True Believer

JY57 said:


> last year with The Rock's return was 3.14 rating with
> 
> Hour 1 - 4.29 million
> Hour 2 - 4.32 million
> Hour 3 - 4.65 million
> 
> so this year actually did better. Good for them.


The fuck? Ratings actually get better as the hour goes by?!

*0_0*


----------



## JY57

Krinkles said:


> The fuck? Ratings actually get better as the hour goes by?!
> 
> *0_0*


Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson returned to face off with Punk at the end and they had a TLC WWE Championship (CM Punk vs Ryback) match in that last hour. No surprise really.


----------



## The True Believer

funnyfaces1 said:


> :bryan2 unk8 :brock rton2 :flair :reigns iper :rollins :ambrose
> 
> :henry1


You forgot somebody.

:cena4


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

It's kinda sad a 3.2 is considered a high rating now when it was the average a few years ago. Soon a 3.0 will be high then a 2.8 etc. I really don't see this as something to celebrate and posting a punch of random peoples faces like they drew.


----------



## superuser1

CenaBoy4Life said:


> It's kinda sad a 3.2 is considered a high rating now when it was the average a few years ago. Soon a 3.0 will be high then a 2.8 etc. I really don't see this as something to celebrate and posting a punch of random peoples faces like they drew.


Well we have to come to the realization that wrestling will never be maintsream popular again. We'll probably never see the 7`s,the 6`s,the 5`s or even the 4`s for that matter. So yeah a 3.2 is something we should be proud of I guess lol.


----------



## chronoxiong

Old school gimmick show equals ratings. I'm very shocked the third hour actually went up. Good to see for once.


----------



## validreasoning

CenaBoy4Life said:


> It's kinda sad a 3.2 is considered a high rating now when it was the average a few years ago.


wwe raw ratings head to head with bcs championship game
2014........3.23
2013........3.14
2012........2.86
2011........3.07
2008........3.23
2007........3.65

2010 and 2009 went head to head with much smaller fiesta bowl


----------



## BOOTS 2 ASSES

The increase in third hour obviously means that people were excited for the Punk/Reigns main-event.Looks like the numbers are backing up WWE's trust to go with Reigns as future _numero uno_ star


----------



## krai999

if ratings were better for old school raw then it's no doubt that Bryan joining the Wyatt family didn't play a huge factor which caused people to tune in the next week


----------



## Happenstan

Boots2Asses said:


> The increase in third hour obviously means that people were excited for the Punk/Reigns main-event.Looks like the numbers are backing up WWE's trust to go with Reigns as future _numero uno_ star


It also means USA Network's satellite feed didn't go down for 20 minutes too.


----------



## Starbuck

RTWM draws.


----------



## SerapisLiber

Krinkles said:


> funnyfaces1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> :bryan2 unk8 :brock rton2 :flair :reigns iper :rollins :ambrose
> 
> :henry1
> 
> 
> 
> You forgot somebody.
Click to expand...

Fix'd.


----------



## The_Workout_Buddy

too bad I signed to this forum after the breakdowns were posted (quarters breakdowns and emotional breakdowns), looked like a lot of fun was on this thred alone.


----------



## Arrogant Mog

:flair


----------



## The Redneck

:cena5 rton2


----------



## Jof

No more breakdowns eh? It's a shame.


----------



## kiguel182

No more breakdowns? Why? Bummer.


----------



## Alo0oy

How the mighty have fallen, this used to be a GOAT thread, I miss trolling Bryan marks. :troll


----------



## JY57

> WWE Smackdown on Friday, January 10 scored a 1.96 rating, up nearly one-tenth of a rating from last week's 1.88 rating.
> 
> Smackdown featuring WWE champ Randy Orton vs. IC champion Big E. Langston averaged 2.816 million viewers, up eight percent from last week's three-month low in viewership.
> 
> - On cable TV Friday night, Smackdown ranked #2 in overall viewers, #6 in males 18-34, and #4 in males 18-49.
> 
> The key male demos were event with last week, but Smackdown drew in younger viewers to help boost the overall rating. Specifically, Smackdown scored one of its highest teen male ratings in a few months.


via PWTorch


----------



## funnyfaces1

Featuring Randy Orton vs. Big E Langston? :ti


----------



## TheStig

I havent rly payed that much attention to smackdown but what happend to cena on the show? They been getting good ratings for months now or is this usual and nobody actually pay attentions to smackdown ratings.


----------



## D.M.N.

Raw lead the night on cable: http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...ie-for-lead-single-ladies-archer-more/229062/

8pm - 4.399m
9pm - 4.598m
10pm - 4.214m
Average = 4.40m

Same week last year did 4.55m. Wouldn't be at all surprised if Orton/Kofi killed the momentum.


----------



## Happenstan

D.M.N. said:


> Raw lead the night on cable: http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...ie-for-lead-single-ladies-archer-more/229062/
> 
> 8pm - 4.399m
> 9pm - 4.598m
> 10pm - 4.214m
> Average = 4.40m
> 
> Same week last year did 4.55m. *Wouldn't be at all surprised if Orton/Kofi killed the momentum.*


Probably. There are quite a few reports from the show saying that match just killed the crowd until the ending. I didn't think it was that bad (the stuff with Cena Sr. blew chunks though) but apparently I was wrong.


----------



## checkcola

Anytime you get 4 mil for the entire show, that's a win in my book.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The show maintained a 1.6 demo for the whole 3 hours which is the most important rating.


----------



## rocknblues81

Daniel Bryan bringing' those tv ratings.


----------



## PRL18

so how many here jump off the bandwagon when they saw the ratings??


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

unk2


----------



## JY57

> WWE Raw on Monday, January 13 scored a 3.12 rating, down one-tenth of a rating from last week's 3.23 rating for "Old School" Raw.
> 
> Removing last week's show, it was the first time Raw surpassed the 3.0 mark since August before the start of the football and fall TV seasons.
> 
> - Raw averaged 4.403 million viewers, down three percent from last week's viewership for "Old School" Raw.
> 
> Hourly Break Down: 4.399 million viewers, jump to 4.598 million second hour viewers, and eight percent decline to 4.214 million third hour viewers.
> 
> The second hour was the most-watched second hour in nearly nine months dating back to April 22, 2013. Meanwhile, the third hour was down 250,000 viewers (six percent) from last week's third hour.
> 
> - On cable TV Monday night, Raw still ranked #2 despite no football competition for the first time since August. Raw trailed "Major Crimes" on TNT in overall viewers, but ranked #1 in key male demographics.
> 
> Despite the overall rating declining from last week, Raw saw a significant increase in males 18-34 and teen male viewers.
> 
> - One year ago this week, the first post-football Raw on Jan. 14, 2013 scored a 3.24 rating and the demos were up one-tenth of a rating compared to the 2014 edition.


via PWTorch (final rating - 3.12)


----------



## Stannis Baratheon.

major crimes :lol


----------



## WWE

D.M.N. said:


> Raw lead the night on cable: http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...ie-for-lead-single-ladies-archer-more/229062/
> 
> 8pm - 4.399m
> 9pm - 4.598m
> 10pm - 4.214m
> Average = 4.40m
> 
> Same week last year did 4.55m. Wouldn't be at all surprised if Orton/Kofi killed the momentum.


I wonder who was invoked in the first part of the opening, and final part of the closing.


























:HHH2


----------



## Osize10

JY57 said:


> via PWTorch (final rating - 3.12)


3.24 lolwwe


----------



## stonefort

Once again we see the disconnect between the minority of hard-cores that attend live shows and the more important TV audience. Lots of the IWC and hard-cored dig DBryan. But the truth is he's boring and lacks charisma and doesn't draw casual TV viewers.


----------



## FITZ

stonefort said:


> Once again we see the disconnect between the minority of hard-cores that attend live shows and the more important TV audience. Lots of the IWC and hard-cored dig DBryan. But the truth is he's boring and lacks charisma and doesn't draw casual TV viewers.


Do you really think it's the hardcore fans that are at the average WWE event?


----------



## #Mark

stonefort said:


> Once again we see the disconnect between the minority of hard-cores that attend live shows and the more important TV audience. Lots of the IWC and hard-cored dig DBryan. But the truth is he's boring and lacks charisma and doesn't draw casual TV viewers.


You weren't saying this two weeks ago when his 45 minute gauntlet match against the Wyatts drew the biggest number of the show. The only reason the third hour seemed low is because the second hour had it's highest number since last spring.


----------



## validreasoning

TaylorFitz said:


> Do you really think it's the hardcore fans that are at the average WWE event?


its best to just ignore him. he is a gimmick poster, 90% of his posts proclaiming daniel bryan is boring


----------



## D.M.N.

Oh, god. *THE QUARTER HOURS ARE BACK!* (big red writing to mark a momentous day in this thread's illustrious history)

Here we go: http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_75741.shtml



> WWE Raw on Monday, January 13 delivered very interesting quarter-hour TV ratings results.
> 
> There were three distinct "peak levels" in each hour of the three-hour show, including the 2014 Hall of Fame announcement. The show then re-peaked during the over-run, which featured Daniel Bryan's memorable babyface turn on the Wyatts.
> 
> All ratings references below are for the key demographic of males 18-49.
> 
> - Peak #1: 2.33 rating in Q4 (end of the first hour) for the end of Big Show vs. Jack Swagger and New Age Outlaws's ring introductions before their six-man tag match with C.M. Punk against The Shield.
> 
> The actual six-man tag then dipped to a 2.24 rating in Q5 at the top of the second hour.
> 
> - Peak #2: 2.35 rating in Q7 for the Ultimate Warrior's Hall of Fame announcement, which was helped by a pre-commercial teaser.
> 
> - Peak #3: 2.39 rating in Q9 (top of the third hour) for the end of Randy Orton vs. Kofi Kingston and post-match injury angle involving John Cena, Sr.
> 
> - Over-Run Peak: 2.40 over-run rating for the end of the steel cage main event and Daniel Bryan dumping the Wyatts.
> 
> Raw TV Ratings Break Down (m18-49 demo
> 
> Q1: Raw opened with a 1.98 rating for the opening match of Daniel Bryan & Bray Wyatt vs. The Usos, plus one commercial.
> 
> Q2: Raw slipped to a show-low 1.95 rating for John Cena vs. Damien Sandow, plus one commercial.
> 
> Q3: Raw popped to a 2.10 rating for a filler segment - two commercial breaks and backstage segments, possibly reflecting the audience being late tuning in for Cena's match.
> 
> Q4: Raw popped again to a 2.33 rating for the end of Show-Swagger, one commercial, and the Outlaws's ring introductions.
> 
> Q5: Raw dipped to a 2.24 rating for the six-man tag and one mid-match commercial.
> 
> Q6: Raw slipped to a 2.19 rating for post-match fall-out from the Outlaws dropping Punk, one commercial, A.J. Lee & Tamina vs. Cameron & Naomi in Divas tag action, and the HOF teaser.
> 
> Q7: Raw popped to a 2.35 rating for Warrior's HOF announcement, plus one commercial.
> 
> Q8: Raw dipped to a 2.26 rating for the start of Randy Orton vs. Kofi Kingston, plus one commercial.
> 
> Q9: Raw increased to a 2.39 rating for the second-half of Orton vs. Kofi, the post-match angle involving Cena, Sr., and one commercial.
> 
> Q10: Raw dropped to a 2.16 rating as audience fatigue kicked in. The segment included WWE tag champs Cody Rhodes & Goldust vs. Ryback & Curtis Axel, one commercial, and the first-half of an unhyped Rey Mysterio vs. Alberto Del Rio match.
> 
> Q11: Raw dipped again to a 2.10 rating for the end of Rey-Del Rio, one commercial, and a WWE Network video.
> 
> Q12: Raw dipped again to a 2.01 rating for video recaps, main event ring introductions, the first half of the main event, and one commercial.
> 
> Over-Run: Raw drew a 2.40 over-run rating for the end of Bryan & Bray Wyatt vs. The Usos in a cage and Bryan's post-match turn.


No minute-by-minute breakdown, but I think we'll settle for this.

The last M18-49 breakdown I can find for Raw is from September 16th, here: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/24132737-post5868.html

3... 2... 1... go!


----------



## Mr. I

> - Peak #1: 2.33 rating in Q4 (end of the first hour) for the end of Big Show vs. Jack Swagger and New Age Outlaws's ring introductions before their six-man tag match with C.M. Punk against The Shield.
> 
> The actual six-man tag then dipped to a 2.24 rating in Q5 at the top of the second hour.
> 
> - Peak #2: 2.35 rating in Q7 for the Ultimate Warrior's Hall of Fame announcement, which was helped by a pre-commercial teaser.
> 
> - Peak #3: 2.39 rating in Q9 (top of the third hour) for the end of Randy Orton vs. Kofi Kingston and post-match injury angle involving John Cena, Sr.
> 
> - Over-Run Peak: 2.40 over-run rating for the end of the steel cage main event and Daniel Bryan dumping the Wyatts.
> 
> Raw slipped to a show-low 1.95 rating for John Cena vs. Damien Sandow, plus one commercial.


The 18-49 demo ratings peaks.


----------



## DesolationRow

KORTER OUERS R BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111

CLEERLEY D-BRY IS A BIGGUR DRAAW THEN JON CENA!!!!!!!!111 NEW AGE OUTLAWZ R A BIGGUR DRAWN THEN CM JUNK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1111

JON CENAS DAD = RATINGZ

Am I doing this right? I'm out of practice. 

(Seriously, it's cool that the quarter hours are back.)


----------



## Waffelz

Cena


----------



## LilOlMe

People claimed that Kofi/Orton killed the ratings.

This entire thread is pointless, really. A lot of talking out of the ass and mark wars and that's it.


----------



## superuser1

[email protected] bringing in dem ratings when people assumed he lost viewers. Randall shutting up his haters again.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

superuser1 said:


> [email protected] bringing in dem ratings when people assumed he lost viewers. Randall shutting up his haters again.




The one thing he didnt have to shut up was the crowd because they were dead for his match.


----------



## MaybeLock

D.M.N. said:


> Oh, god. *THE QUARTER HOURS ARE BACK!* (big red writing to mark a momentous day in this thread's illustrious history)


BAH GOWD, the ratings breakdown is back! :mark:

The Road to Wrestlemania begins here, I want a fair fight guys.


----------



## Choke2Death

So it seems like only Orton and Bryan (and Ultimate Warrior) had a good week this time and even then it took some time. lol @ Cena's match gaining show-low.

Hopefully quarter-hour breakdowns are back more consistently now.


----------



## SPCDRI

Show low for Cena...

:hayden3

20 percent boost tomshow high 2.4 fot Bryan

:dazzler


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Interesting quarter numbers. Orton/Kofi doing that well is a big shock, but I wonder how much Kofi beating Orton had an impact on that? First part of the match dipped, but I think once people heard Kofi beat Orton, that's what got people to tune in for the rest of that quarter and bring the whole number up. 

Good to see the overrun doing well. I'm sure people were tuning in droves within a minute of Bryan refusing to take Sister Abigail. Mark of not only a great face, but a great heel to build up to that point. Who knows? Bryan/Wyatt could be the main event of Wrestlemania in a few years. 

Sandow/Cena doing show-low? Good, no one wants to see Sandow job to Cena again.

Show actually didn't start off that strong compared to the rest of the show, but overall all those numbers look good, even the parts that dipped. We've been getting only one/two breakdowns a month since November (at least from my count).


----------



## superuser1

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Interesting quarter numbers. Orton/Kofi doing that well is a big shock, but I wonder how much Kofi beating Orton had an impact on that? First part of the match dipped, but I think once people heard Kofi beat Orton, that's what got people to tune in for the rest of that quarter and bring the whole number up.


Orton has always drawn as a heel though but I think the viewers knew Orton was gonna go apeshit after the match was over.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

superuser1 said:


> *Orton has always drawn as a heel though* but I think the viewers knew Orton was gonna go apeshit after the match was over.


Nah, not really. Sometimes he does well, sometimes not. He's far from consistent. However, it's fair to say Kofi beating Orton, being something different from the norm, is what brought viewers in to see what had happened, and then Orton's potential antics after the match may have kept the viewers tuned in. 

It's good for both guys, although I think it was just the prospect of something different happening that brought the viewers in. Orton/Kofi had a match a few months ago that didn't do well, a match that Orton, if I'm not mistaken, won, just as you'd expect from an Orton/Kofi match. Same thing was expected of this match and then WWE goes and has Kofi beat Orton clean. Brilliant move that based on the numbers, worked out perfectly.

Not only that, but a rematch of Orton/Kofi will probably do well now for next week on Raw, even if they have Orton destroy Kofi, the fact they showed they can be a bit unpredictable will lead people to wanting to see the next match and if they'll throw Kofi another bone. It's interesting to say the least.


----------



## Choke2Death

Yeah, I have to admit that the match would have likely not moved any numbers had it not been for the shock ending. Orton has always drawn well when given something to work with. A random meaningless match where he beats Kofi (like everyone would've thought) doesn't bring interest, but the upset followed by his post-match meltdown will surely do just that as we've witnessed.


----------



## The Redneck

Hope we'll have some epic mark wars again.


----------



## Alo0oy

Time for the GOAT thread to revive, I hope this isn't a one week thing.

Dat draw, though. :cena :cena2 :cena3 :cena4


----------



## G-Rated Is Coming

Only thing that will achieve is bury Sandow further. The morons backstage will just automatically assume it's impossible for their Golden Boy to have the lowest segment, therefore the blame is on the guy he was in the ring with.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

LilOlMe said:


> People claimed that Kofi/Orton killed the ratings.
> 
> This entire thread is pointless, really. A lot of talking out of the ass and mark wars and that's it.


That's the beauty of it.


----------



## FITZ

It seems like the key demographic ratings are more consistent then the overall ratings. 

Old people change the channel a lot. I don't know how my dad does it some times, he sees at least 5 seconds of every show that's on for any given hours.


----------



## #Mark

Good week for Orton and Bryan. Cena drawing the show low is really surprising actually. I wonder if there's been a trend of him gaining less than stellar numbers lately.


----------



## Londrick

Highest rated segment of the night =









If Bryan is a B+ player what does that make the rest of the roster?


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

TaylorFitz said:


> It seems like the key demographic ratings are more consistent then the overall ratings.
> 
> Old people change the channel a lot. I don't know how my dad does it some times, he sees at least 5 seconds of every show that's on for any given hours.



This. The overall demo rating was 1.6 for the whole show. Hour two averaged 2.090 million adults 18-49, hour three had 1.985 million and hour one had 1.976 million. So the key demo was fairly stable. I got these numbers from futon critic.


----------



## superuser1

This thread fell off so bad because the guys who are suppose to draw are actually drawing well except for Cena this week lol


----------



## THANOS

Bryan's gains never cease to amaze me. The guy may be 5'8 but he pulls in viewers like he's 6'6. It's truly incredible!


----------



## D.M.N.

When people tell you that WWE has lost viewers in the past ten years... remember, they actually haven't that much.

Raw - March 24th, 2003 breakdown - *credit to BrosOfDestruction*: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/class...rs-ago-wrestling-observer-9.html#post25751681



> Raw on 3/24 ended up doing a 3.44 rating, the lowest since football season ended and on the final Raw before Wrestlemania.
> 
> Internally, people are crediting the war for the low number, but that belies the huge turn-off as the show was going on which would have nothing to do with the war. The promised Rock concert, which would have worked years ago, is not what the audience wants as a main event. *The concert with the promised Austin run in only drew a 3.56 quarter and 4.74 million viewers*, which was only an increase of 365,000 fans from the RVD/Kane vs Dudleys match, but still a poor showing.
> 
> Airing replays of SD of the Vince/Hogan angle as well as Lesnar/Angle, because a lot of markets had preempted SD because of the war coverage, was a disaster with the closing quarter doing a 2.56 rating, the lowest rated quarter for a live Raw in about 6 years.Those repeat segments made the difference between the show doing a 3.54 rating and a 3.44 rating.
> 
> There was a steady rejection throughout the show as the highest rated quarter, with a 3.85 rating and 5.29 million viewers was Steiner vs Christian which gained 244,000 viewers from the previous quarter. The angle where Morely gave himself part of the tag titles and set up the Raw match for Mania lost 472,000 viewers during a usual growth time slot. Bookdust vs Flair and HHH lost 239,000 viewers in a usual quarter that averages solid gains. The Jericho interview with HBK added 79,000 viewers as the only bright spot late in the show. A Rock interview with Bischoff lost 271,000 viewers and the RVD/Kane vs Dudleys match lost 17,000 viewers.
> 
> The big loss was the replays of the Hogan/Vince and Angle/Lesnar angles, which lost 1,217,000 viewers, or 26% of the audience.


Ratings have gone down more the viewership, remember that.


----------



## joeycalz

All this thread tells me is that Daniel Bryan needs to be in the Wrestlemania main event. Whether he faces Orton, Cena, Lesnar or Punk for the WWE Championship, it doesn't matter. Bryan has consistently been in the highest or second highest rated segment of RAW for the better part of seven, going on eight months now. That's not a fluke. He's the most universally loved guy on the roster, and he's a humble workaholic who is able to work with anybody for the benefit of us. I've wanted Punk to win the Rumble for months, but his feud with Triple H is just so natural. Bryan needs the Rumble win. They need to do it. It's not even a debate anymore.


----------



## stonefort

Of course there's a debate. Some might be in love with Daniel Bryan, but the rest of us think he's boring, bland, and dull.


----------



## Tardbasher12

stonefort said:


> Of course there's a debate. Some might be in love with Daniel Bryan, but the rest of us think he's boring, bland, and dull.


Hey look, a gimmick poster.


----------



## xdryza

stonefort said:


> Of course there's a debate. Some might be in love with Daniel Bryan, but the rest of us think he's boring, bland, and dull.


Lol at you trying to speak for people.


----------



## THANOS

stonefort said:


> Of course there's a debate. Some might be in love with Daniel Bryan, but the rest of us think he's boring, bland, and dull.


What's "the rest of us" comprised of? Maybe 5 or 6 people on this site :hayden3. It's certainly not the people tuning in to watch RAW, as Bryan gains 99% of the time, and has done tremendous in his segments and matches for the past 7 or 8 months on both RAW and Smackdown. He brings in viewers, chants, and buys (if you look at how Night of Champions and HIAC did) as if he were a 6'6 350lb muscle head.

Now please enlighten us with your rebuttal :bigphil.


----------



## Londrick

People are still replying to stonefort? :ti


----------



## Choke2Death

Londrick said:


> People are still replying to stonefort? :ti


Exactly what I thought. He will continue to post the same thing "Bryan is boring" for as long as everyone here continues to respond.


----------



## LKRocks

Guys, stop replying to stonefort. Let the mods handle him.


----------



## D.M.N.

Good news! No Raw ratings until Wednesday: http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2014/01/20/mlk-holiday-ratings-delays-3/230645/

:batista3

The feelings of many, I'm sure.


----------



## JY57

> The 1/17 edition of Smackdown did 2,916,000 viewers, up 100,000 from last week's 2,816,000 viewers.


Via PWInsider


----------



## Karma101

D.M.N. said:


> Good news! No Raw ratings until Wednesday: http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2014/01/20/mlk-holiday-ratings-delays-3/230645/
> 
> :batista3
> 
> The feelings of many, I'm sure.


----------



## FITZ

D.M.N. said:


> When people tell you that WWE has lost viewers in the past ten years... remember, they actually haven't that much.
> 
> Raw - March 24th, 2003 breakdown - *credit to BrosOfDestruction*: http://www.wrestlingforum.com/class...rs-ago-wrestling-observer-9.html#post25751681
> 
> 
> 
> Ratings have gone down more the viewership, remember that.


Thanks for posting this. I do find it pretty funny that all of this talk of the rating falling so much over the years and then you post something where the Rock and Austin in the ring together had 4.75 viewers and like 4.5 million people watched last week. Obviously the viewership percentage has gone down but there are also a lot more TV channels now then we had 10 years ago. 

Also I smirked when I realized Cena's match was the lowest rated among the key demographics (which is a fancy way of saying adults).


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

So, anyone got the numbers for this weeks Raw?


----------



## D.M.N.

Hour 1 - 5.249m (Raw 1000 had 5.439m!)
Hour 2 - 4.995m (highest since March 4th)
Hour 3 - 4.363m

Hour 1 highest since Raw 1000!!!!!

HUGE number for Hour 1, Hour 2 did well whilst Hour 3 sort of fell off a cliff lol.


----------



## JY57

Hour 1 - 5.249 million
Hour 2 - 4.995 million
Hour 3 - 4.363 million


----------



## D.M.N.

With an average of 4.869m, it was the highest rating since *March 4th, 2013* - and would have been the third highest rating of 2013.

I'm impressed that Hour 2 held up very well as well, would be intrigued to see whether the opening segment was the highest rated segment, because the hour 1 and hour 2 difference is not much, suggesting a different quarter may well be top...


----------



## Fissiks

fuck they are going to go ahead and let Batista win now...

lol at Cena and Orton


----------



## Redzero

Orton vs Kofi is a draw lol jk


----------



## TheStig

I think I fast forward the last hour in approx 3-5 mins so no wonder why it did so shitty. Now when I think about it what the fuck even happend that hour?


----------



## D.M.N.

Also, if you want to know why WWE bring people back, ratings like _that_ is why. Hogan will pop huge again, irrespective of what he has been doing the past few years. 5m+ easily I imagine.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

They used the tease of Cena for the third hour but the attraction didnt draw.


----------



## validreasoning

D.M.N. said:


> Also, if you want to know why WWE bring people back, ratings like _that_ is why. Hogan will pop huge again, irrespective of what he has been doing the past few years. 5m+ easily I imagine.


i would leave hogan till mania and just advertise the shit out of his return every week for 2 months like they did for batista


----------



## THANOS

I expected this with Big Dave's big return, but this definitely worries me heading into the Rumble.


----------



## D.M.N.

validreasoning said:


> i would leave hogan till mania and just advertise the shit out of his return every week for 2 months like they did for batista


Hogan's return will be on the night of the Network, or before. Perfect time for WWE to be popping big ratings, as this is the window for the negotiations with USA.

Same applies for Austin, and any other former stars that wish to return.

I do think the 5 million+ hour 1 shows how many lapsed fans there are, which is who they need to reach out to in the next month or so.

However, Hour 2 was also strong, which means that those who tuned in at the start of Hour 1 have been keeping an eye on the product recently (yes, that includes Bryan) and are liking what they see. I think the strong Hour 1 is Batista's return, but also the Bryan face turn at the end of last week. Whether WWE like it or not, that _is_ a factor.

Worth also noting that the ratings now are stronger than this time last year... despite last year featuring The Rock.


----------



## Choke2Death

THAT MINI EVOLUTION REUNION BRINGING THE RATINGZ!!! :bigdave :hhh2 rton2


----------



## Batista1man242

Honestly guys I got to say baristas return was amazing and did anyone notice his mess up when he went for the spine buster like I did? Don't get me wrong I know he's rusty and I know he said for once he was nervous but I got to give him credit he did good.


----------



## The Caped Crusader

Can people finally stop downplaying how big of a draw or star Batista was now? I'm genuinely not surprised that his return got such a huge bump. I'm sure many on here are thinking 'fuck why' though. Meltzer said this guy was WWE's biggest international star back in 2008 or so. The USA Network specifically wanted him on Raw. His face turn in 2005 brought a big increase in business on PPV, house shows, attendance etc. I hope people understand that when they say 'no one wants to see Batista in the main event of Wrestlemania' they're a minority. He's easily, far and away, the biggest star WWE had behind John Cena since the departure of The Rock and Stone Cold Steve Austin.

I still think the opening segment was terrible though and they booked it horribly.


----------



## D.M.N.

Hour 1 - ~3.7 rating / 5.249 million
Hour 2 - ~3.5 rating / 4.995 million
Hour 3 - ~3.1 rating / 4.363 million


----------



## ScottishJobber

The Caped Crusader said:


> Can people finally stop downplaying how big of a draw or star Batista was now? I'm genuinely not surprised that his return got such a huge bump. I'm sure many on here are thinking 'fuck why' though. Meltzer said this guy was WWE's biggest international star back in 2008 or so. The USA Network specifically wanted him on Raw. His face turn in 2005 brought a big increase in business on PPV, house shows, attendance etc. I hope people understand that when they say 'no one wants to see Batista in the main event of Wrestlemania' they're a minority. He's easily, far and away, the biggest star WWE had behind John Cena since the departure of The Rock and Stone Cold Steve Austin.
> 
> I still think the opening segment was terrible though and they booked it horribly.


Great post, and yeah he was massive overseas. Not sure why people one here are downplaying how big he was/is.

Agreed about the way it was booked, felt clumsy or something. Regardless it's great to have him back.


----------



## Starbuck

D.M.N. said:


> Hour 1 - 5.249m (Raw 1000 had 5.439m!)
> Hour 2 - 4.995m (highest since March 4th)
> Hour 3 - 4.363m
> 
> Hour 1 highest since Raw 1000!!!!!
> 
> HUGE number for Hour 1, Hour 2 did well whilst Hour 3 sort of fell off a cliff lol.


DA ANIMAL WIT DEM RATINGZ

Holy fuck that's impressive but wasn't Bryan in the first hour too? Unless we get a breakdown LET THE BATTLE COMMENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!

:batista4 :dazzler

Seriously though, that's a pretty big fucking first hour rating and if that's for the whole first hour then the actual segment probably did even better. Second hour did really well too and then the 3rd hour died. Whoops.

Hopefully the strangeness of the segment didn't ruin the magic already.


----------



## xdoomsayerx

The Caped Crusader said:


> Can people finally stop downplaying how big of a draw or star Batista was now? I'm genuinely not surprised that his return got such a huge bump. I'm sure many on here are thinking 'fuck why' though. Meltzer said this guy was WWE's biggest international star back in 2008 or so. The USA Network specifically wanted him on Raw. His face turn in 2005 brought a big increase in business on PPV, house shows, attendance etc. I hope people understand that when they say 'no one wants to see Batista in the main event of Wrestlemania' they're a minority. He's easily, far and away, the biggest star WWE had behind John Cena since the departure of The Rock and Stone Cold Steve Austin.
> 
> I still think the opening segment was terrible though and they booked it horribly.





Wwe is clearly making Batista to be a bigger star then he actually is. He won't have the same impact as Rock, Hogan, Austin, Lesnar, HBK or Undertaker would to bring the "casuals" in like they always do for WM . The guy was the face of a B level show which was considered during a shit era in wrestling. Is he a star? Yes, but he's not a massive star like they are making him out to be. It'll be really depressing to see him win something that he's already had. He's also had his WM moment, why again? It simply makes no sense and doesn't change ANYTHING. Which is what a milestone WM SHOULD be. To change something and make a big impact. 

Three things as well. 

Batista wasn't advertised to start the show and the first hour always does the best

HHH MADE Batista a star . His heel work was that damn good and anyone turning on HHH at that time would have worked. 

If Lesnar never left Batista wouldn't be shit.


----------



## checkcola

Well, I guess there's a segment of wrestling fandom just ready to be tapped into that just stays away usually (because of John Cena?). 

The hour three drop off, I can't even remember what went on in it.


----------



## Born of Osiris

The Caped Crusader said:


> Can people finally stop downplaying how big of a draw or star Batista was now? I'm genuinely not surprised that his return got such a huge bump. I'm sure many on here are thinking 'fuck why' though. Meltzer said this guy was WWE's biggest international star back in 2008 or so. The USA Network specifically wanted him on Raw. His face turn in 2005 brought a big increase in business on PPV, house shows, attendance etc. I hope people understand that when they say 'no one wants to see Batista in the main event of Wrestlemania' they're a minority. He's easily, far and away, the biggest star WWE had behind John Cena since the departure of The Rock and Stone Cold Steve Austin.
> 
> I still think the opening segment was terrible though and they booked it horribly.


We'll see just how much of a minority they are when he's getting boos to hell and back if he does indeed main event Mania :vince


----------



## Choke2Death

I don't think there can be any doubt about Batista's star power at this point. He's got the casuals on lock, even smarks are on the bandwagon before they inevitably turn on him again and he'll likely have a new audience following him with his newfound success in movies.



xdoomsayerx said:


> Wwe is clearly making Batista to be a bigger star then he actually is. He won't have the same impact as Rock, Hogan, Austin, Lesnar, HBK or Undertaker would to bring the "casuals" in like they always do for WM . The guy was the face of a B level show which was considered during a shit era in wrestling. Is he a star? Yes, but he's not a massive star like they are making him out to be. It'll be really depressing to see him win something that he's already had. He's also had his WM moment, why again? It simply makes no sense and doesn't change ANYTHING. Which is what a milestone WM SHOULD be. To change something and make a big impact.
> 
> Three things as well.
> 
> Batista wasn't advertised to start the show and the first hour always does the best
> 
> Also HHH MADE Batista. His heel work was that damn good.
> 
> If Lesnar never left Batista wouldn't be shit.


Sounds like you're just mad that he's in the spotlight. Since when did you become an advocate for Daniel Bryan anyways? For months you were non-stop complaining about him and would constantly respond to posts that suggested a Bryan/Lesnar match with a :lmao smiley or some other ridiculous shit, now you're suddenly on the bandwagon. (with the obvious "I'm not a Bryan mark" statement as cover up) What gives?


----------



## The Caped Crusader

Starbuck said:


> DA ANIMAL WIT DEM RATINGZ
> 
> Holy fuck that's impressive but wasn't Bryan in the first hour too? Unless we get a breakdown LET THE BATTLE COMMENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> :batista4 :dazzler
> 
> Seriously though, that's a pretty big fucking first hour rating and if that's for the whole first hour then the actual segment probably did even better. Second hour did really well too and then the 3rd hour died. Whoops.
> 
> Hopefully the strangeness of the segment didn't ruin the magic already.


I think the segment was pretty terrible. It didn't do a good job of building anticipation.

People tuned in, but it wasn't a good way to be left wanting more. Even if they cut a short promo, it can be done well if what leads to it is exciting. It should have been simple, Del Rio comes out, calls out Batista and says he's tired of waiting. Batista comes out, does his pyro entrance, then as soon as he gets in the ring, just spears Del Rio, spinebuster, and then Batista Bomb. Then he cuts a short promo. Could even keep it simple. Heck, this took me all of ten seconds to think of just now.

'It's been nearly four years. A lot of things have happened in the WWE. A lot of things have changed. But something remains the same. I'm the man, I'm the predator, and I'm the top of the food chain. For anyone thinking of standing in my way, think carefully, because I'm going to destroy everyone.'

Done. That wasn't even hard to think of. It's simple though, starts slow and builds to something more.

That would have been infinitely better than what was booked. There is no reason for Batista to be hugging Stephanie or teasing anything with Orton or whatever. The above is also more true to what people liked seeing from him in the first place.



xdoomsayerx said:


> Wwe is clearly making Batista to be a bigger star then he actually is. He won't have the same impact as Rock, Hogan, Austin, Lesnar, HBK or Undertaker would to bring the "casuals" in like they always do for WM . The guy was the face of a B level show which was considered during a shit era in wrestling. Is he a star? Yes, but he's not a massive star like they are making him out to be. It'll be really depressing to see him win something that he's already had. He's also had his WM moment, why again? It simply makes no sense and doesn't change ANYTHING. Which is what a milestone WM SHOULD be. To change something and make a big impact.
> 
> Three things as well.
> 
> Batista wasn't advertised to start the show and the first hour always does the best
> 
> HHH MADE Batista a star . His heel work was that damn good and anyone turning on HHH at that time would have worked.
> 
> If Lesnar never left Batista wouldn't be shit.


Perfect example of what I mean. This must all hurt you so much.


----------



## superuser1

checkcola said:


> Well, I guess there's a segment of wrestling fandom just ready to be tapped into that just stays away usually (because of John Cena?).
> 
> *The hour three drop off, I can't even remember what went on in it.*


The third hour always has a dropoff Im surprised people haven't started blaming Orton and Kofi yet like they did last week and when the breakdown came out that match actually did good numbers. I feel bad for Bryan marks though because Batista`s return having that huge of a bump almost guarantees that he'll win the Rumble.


----------



## checkcola

It was a bad segment, but I think people are more likely to remember "Batista is back" rather than "that was lame".

A lot of stuff Rock and Cena did was lame, still did big business.


----------



## The Caped Crusader

superuser1 said:


> The third hour always has a dropoff Im surprised people haven't started blaming Orton and Kofi yet like they did last week and when the breakdown came out that match actually did good numbers. I feel bad for Bryan marks though because Batista`s return having that huge of a bump almost guarantees that he'll win the Rumble.


He should win the Royal Rumble and he should face Lesnar at Wrestlemania. Then he should turn heel pretty much right after.


----------



## SnapOrTap

DBry vs. Batista. 

Come on DBry!


----------



## Starbuck

If the first hour was that high for Batista then chances are a similar amount of people saw Bryan too so Bryan marks have no reason to be mad. This is the benefit of having bigger stars around. If the people tuning in for them stick around for other guys too then it's more eyeballs for everybody. How many people who tuned in for Batista and have no idea who Daniel Bryan even is perhaps stuck around for the rest of Raw, saw his segment and thought yeah, I might give this guy a chance so they tune in for Batista next week but also wait to see Bryan too etc etc? It's not all bad news.


----------



## D.M.N.

Rough guide of who was in Q1 to Q8

Q1 - Authority/Cena; Batista return
Q2 - End of Q1 segment; Shield vs Rhodes'/Langston
Q3 - End of Q2 match; Bryan segment
Q4 - Woods/Fandango; recaps
Q5 - Punk segment; Punk vs Gunn
Q6 - End of Q5 match; Young tribute
Q7 - Mysterio vs Del Rio
Q8 - Batista part #2; start of Show/Lesnar segment

I suspect things plunged, straight after Show/Lesnar.


----------



## JY57

definitely better than last year which was Rock/Punk and Cena Rumble Final Hype go home show which was:

Hour 1 - 4.37 million
Hour 2 - 4.41 million
Hour 3 - 4.16 million

with a 3.04 rating


----------



## Starbuck

I can't see the buys for the Rumble this year beating out Rock's title match last year though. If they do then BIG DAVE >>>>>>>>>> 

:batista4


----------



## InTheAirTonight

The neckbeards are mad. :lmao I love it.

:bigdave


----------



## Cliffy

Fucking LOL at Cena

The Real Draw is back


----------



## xdoomsayerx

Choke2Death said:


> I don't think there can be any doubt about Batista's star power at this point. He's got the casuals on lock, even smarks are on the bandwagon before they inevitably turn on him again and he'll likely have a new audience following him with his newfound success in movies.
> 
> 
> 
> Sounds like you're just mad that he's in the spotlight. Since when did you become an advocate for Daniel Bryan anyways? For months you were non-stop complaining about him and would constantly respond to posts that suggested a Bryan/Lesnar match with a :lmao smiley or some other ridiculous shit, now you're suddenly on the bandwagon. (with the obvious "I'm not a Bryan mark" statement as cover up) What gives?




Because they need to simply create bigger stars. I'm NOT a Bryan fan, but I certainly do think he deserves to win the rumble. That's what the match is for, to elevate talent into big time stars. I've started why Batista shouldn't win it yet again, It simply does nothing. Batista not winning the rumble doesn't hurt him at all. I'm not on any bandwagon, as I still ultimately want Cena vs Taker headlining WM. That'll never change til it happens. Or Punk headlining a mania as well. But why Batista again? Especially at a milestone WM. He's not as big as guys like Cena, Lesnar, or Undertaker.


----------



## Starbuck

*Wrestlemania 26 Rematch
Battle for True & Undisputed Face of the Company*

:batista4 vs. :cena5

*Special Referee*: :trips2

*Time Keeper:* :rko2​


----------



## 4everEyebrowRaisin

They started hyping Cena arriving at RAW during the opening segment and yet the rating still went down after Batista fucked off. Cena/Orton is a fucking borefest that we've seen thousands of times already, enough of this shit.


----------



## superuser1

I'll be lmao when the breakdown come out and Cena`s arrival did good numbers


----------



## Born of Osiris

xdoomsayerx said:


> Because they need to simply create bigger stars. I'm NOT a Bryan fan, but I certainly do think he deserves to win the rumble. That's what the match is for, to elevate talent into big time stars. I've started why Batista shouldn't win it yet again, It simply does nothing. Batista not winning the rumble doesn't hurt him at all. I'm not on any bandwagon, as I still ultimately want Cena vs Taker headlining WM. That'll never change til it happens. Or Punk headlining a mania as well. But why Batista again? Especially at a milestone WM. He's not as big as guys like Cena, Lesnar, or Undertaker.


There is no reason no matter how much people will try to justify it.


----------



## The Caped Crusader

Starbuck said:


> I can't see the buys for the Rumble this year beating out Rock's title match last year though. If they do then BIG DAVE >>>>>>>>>>
> 
> :batista4


Something that could have helped the first hour was that Batista being back was trending worldwide on Twitter minutes after he returned. A bunch of people could have tuned in when seeing that. I think the breakdown would give more of an indication if that was the case.


----------



## Catsaregreat

Its the skinny jeans


----------



## Sonnen Says

xdoomsayerx said:


> Because they need to simply create bigger stars. I'm NOT a Bryan fan, but I certainly do think he deserves to win the rumble. That's what the match is for, to elevate talent into big time stars. I've started why Batista shouldn't win it yet again, It simply does nothing. Batista not winning the rumble doesn't hurt him at all. I'm not on any bandwagon, as I still ultimately want Cena vs Taker headlining WM. That'll never change til it happens. Or Punk headlining a mania as well. But why Batista again? Especially at a milestone WM. *He's not as big as guys like Cena, Lesnar, or Undertaker.*


Keep whining :lol:lol:lol. He just proved that he is, hour 1 did the highest since the RAW 1000 episode and you think he might not be at that level :argh:. Yeah he shouldn't win RR but if he did I wouldn't mind nor do I mind him ME but only if it's against Lesnar tho If not then Punk should win and HHH wins the titles and then we have it, the WM ME.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

> Batista's return won't draw much, mark my words.


Fuck me. Seriously. Just fuck me.


----------



## ThePandagirl20

Starbuck said:


> *Wrestlemania 26 Rematch
> Battle for True & Undisputed Face of the Company*
> 
> :batista4 vs. :cena5
> 
> *Special Referee*: :trips2
> 
> *Time Keeper:* :rko2​


:genius


----------



## MaybeLock

Lol at third hour losing so many viewers when they were hyping a Cena/Orton confrontation during the whole show. Nobody seems to care about this rivalry at this point. Also, for someone who is considered such a big draw like Cena, he isn't drawing so much, TV ratings wise.


----------



## Waffelz

"The real draw is back".

I'd bet my house if Cena was gone four years and came back he'd have brung in better numbers. Good for business, but not good for us Smarks knowing Batista is winning the RR now


----------



## Loader230

Biggest since RAW 1000. #Dealwithit. 




xdoomsayerx said:


> Because they need to simply create bigger stars. I'm NOT a Bryan fan, but I certainly do think he deserves to win the rumble. That's what the match is for, to elevate talent into big time stars. I've started why Batista shouldn't win it yet again, It simply does nothing. Batista not winning the rumble doesn't hurt him at all. I'm not on any bandwagon, as I still ultimately want Cena vs Taker headlining WM. That'll never change til it happens. Or Punk headlining a mania as well. But why Batista again? Especially at a milestone WM. *He's not as big as guys like Cena, Lesnar, or Undertaker.*


:kobe 

He's bigger than Cena right now, he was always a bigger draw than Undertaker until the the day he quit, and now yet again on his return. Lesnar is a mainstream name though, however since Batista is fresh compared to Lesnar, a case can't be made that he is bigger deal to WWE's fanbase currently.


----------



## Waffelz

Batista is not and never will be bigger than Cena. Does Batista make WWE $100m a year?


----------



## tbp82

All I want to add is for critics of Batista Men Lie Women Lie Numbers Don't #dealwithit


----------



## Loader230

Cena doesn't make $100m for WWE, where is that number coming from? Batista is bigger PPV draw since he is fresh and evidently as noted, a much bigger ratings draw.


----------



## Londrick

Not surprised. Everyone was obviously hyped after last weeks ending and wanted to see what would happen with Bryan. :bryan

1 million difference between hour 1 and 3. The BIGGET REMATCH IN WWE HISTORY is sure doing well :ti


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

It'll be interesting to see if Batista can maintain type of numbers (mid-high 4 million mark) after Mania. But damn, that's impressive as the pre-Rumble show in the past few years, even with Rock last year, doesn't come anywhere near these numbers except the third hour... which by the way, lol at that drop. Thing to remember is last time Batista was around, it was when Raw was still two hours. A lot of the people that tuned in for Batista probably didn't give enough of a shit to last past two hours, especially with them pushing Cena coming out as this big thing. 

Bryan deserves a small bit of credit for the number as well, but unless quarter hours show otherwise, it was Batista who brought in the bulk of the viewers.



> Biggest since RAW 1000. #Dealwithit.


Not quite. Post-Rumble show last year had:

Hour 1- 4.86 million
Hour 2- 5.27 million
Hour 3- 4.93 million


----------



## Loader230

The last time a report came out about Cena and $100m, Meltzer went crazy mad and debunked it completely - 



> Originally Posted by *Dave Meltzer*
> Let me know when some of the reporters using that figure use their brain and realize how completely full of shit it is.
> 
> No one person is responsible for 22% of company revenue. The very idea of it is preposterous. If Cena is moving $106 million in anything, he should be earning $40-50 million a year instead of a small fraction of that.
> 
> That's like in 1991 when some similar full of shit report talked about how WWF was a $1.7 billion dollar a year company and it got repeated everywhere when the company actually only grossed $125 million the previous year.
> 
> I know it was on our site as well.
> 
> Look at WWE revenues by category and see what Cena meant.
> 
> He means a little bit on house shows, a little bit on PPV, a little on DVDs (the majority of which he's only a part of or not even a part of at all), he means virtually nothing when it comes to the TV money which is under contract whether he's with the company or not and doesn't go up when he's there and down when he's not there.
> 
> This isn't a guy who is the difference between 250,000 buys and 800,000 buys. And while his merch moves. Total merch for last year was $45 million so even if he means 20% of that, you're still talking $8 million.
> 
> The best you're getting is Cena means maybe 5% of total revenue of $478 million or $24 million, and that's giving him the benefit of a lot of numbers that may not be warranted and giving him 20% of merch which is a shot in the dark number likely way higher than the real number.
> 
> I know it was on this site as well. I saw that figure and I just thought, common sense says it's a full of shit number and moved on. Then when everyone started going with it, I satdown and tried to figure if it was possible, and it's not.


----------



## superuser1

Loader230 said:


> Biggest since RAW 1000. #Dealwithit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :kobe
> 
> *He's bigger than Cena right now,* he was always a bigger draw than Undertaker until the the day he quit, and now yet again on his return. Lesnar is a mainstream name though, however since Batista is fresh compared to Lesnar, a case can't be made that he is bigger deal to WWE's fanbase currently.


Of course he's a bigger draw than Cena right now. He's been gone for 3 years! When you're gone from the business for that long people will miss you no matter what. Even the smarks was excited when they announced his return those same smarks who called him boring and stale when he was a full timer.


----------



## stonefort

Good for Batista. Not a shocker the people got bored so quick with Daniel Bryan.


----------



## Loader230

superuser1 said:


> Of course he's a bigger draw than Cena right now. He's been gone for 3 years! When you're gone from the business for that long people will miss you no matter what. Even the smarks was excited when they announced his return those same smarks who called him boring and stale when he was a full timer.


So you make a post pointlessly repeating what I just said? 

Smarks are irrelevant. They call Cena stale and boring everyweek, Orton, Punk too.


----------



## Alo0oy

Evolution is a mystery, it draws in all the ratings. :batista2 rton2 :trips


----------



## Loader230

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Not quite. Post-Rumble show last year had:
> 
> Hour 1- 4.86 million
> Hour 2- 5.27 million
> Hour 3- 4.93 million


I meant the first hour. Post rumble this year is going to draw just as well anyway.


----------



## Happenstan

Last week everyone was sure Orton/Kofi killed the ratings for their hour....they were wrong.
This week everyone is sure Batista's return got huge ratings...now watch Bryan's first promo in forever blow everything out of the water.

WWE Ratings 101. It's never what we think it is.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Loader230 said:


> I meant the first hour. Post rumble this year is going to draw just as well anyway.


Ah, okay then.

Yeah, post-Rumble Raw always does well and if Batista wins, I can definitely see the first hour doing similar, if not better than this week. Shame too because there's only one match that I want a Batista Rumble win to lead to, and I don't think that's what's going to happen.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

It will be interesting to see how Big Dave's numbers hold in subsequent weeks. No doubt people tuned in to see him after his long absence. After that lackluster segment I wonder if people will have had their fill of him or will they want to see more? If he keeps drawing well, they should put him in hour 3 to pull that average up.


----------



## Waffelz

Orton deserves no praise whatsoever. It was all Batista. Will be interesting to see the numbers of hour three. (which Cena wasn't in)


----------



## xdoomsayerx

Loader230 said:


> Biggest since RAW 1000. #Dealwithit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :kobe
> 
> He's bigger than Cena right now, he was always a bigger draw than Undertaker until the the day he quit, and now yet again on his return. Lesnar is a mainstream name though, however since Batista is fresh compared to Lesnar, a case can't be made that he is bigger deal to WWE's fanbase currently.




Lmao. Ok pal, Cena is way more known then Batista. If Cena was gone for 3 years and returned it would be a WHOLE LOT more of a bigger deal.


----------



## Loader230

Happenstan said:


> Last week everyone was sure Orton/Kofi killed the ratings for their hour....they were wrong.
> This week everyone is sure Batista's return got huge ratings...now watch Bryan's first promo in forever blow everything out of the water.
> 
> WWE Ratings 101. It's never what we think it is.



Nah..not this time. Whenever the increase is this big, it usually is because of a specific reason. Bryan's not drawing 5m, suddenly just like that.


----------



## Londrick

Loader230 said:


> Nah..not this time. Whenever the increase is this big, it usually is because of a specific reason. Bryan's not drawing 5m, suddenly just like that.


Yes he can



D.M.N. said:


> Rough guide of who was in Q1 to Q8
> 
> Q1 - Authority/Cena; Batista return
> Q2 - End of Q1 segment; Shield vs Rhodes'/Langston
> *Q3 - End of Q2 match; Bryan segment*
> Q4 - Woods/Fandango; recaps
> Q5 - Punk segment; Punk vs Gunn
> Q6 - End of Q5 match; Young tribute
> Q7 - Mysterio vs Del Rio
> Q8 - Batista part #2; start of Show/Lesnar segment
> 
> I suspect things plunged, straight after Show/Lesnar.


If Batista can sustain these numbers months from now it's on him. If not it's just shock factor of someone returning after 4 years and the ending of last weeks RAW.


----------



## Happenstan

Loader230 said:


> Nah..not this time. Whenever the increase is this big, it usually is because of a specific reason. Bryan's not drawing 5m, suddenly just like that.


Like Bryan having his first promo since November, maybe? That is a specific reason. Doesn't make me right but it is possible. The fact that so many here are sure it is Batista tells me it isn't. The batting average of this thread sucks ass.


----------



## JY57

> WWE Raw on Monday, January 20 scored a 3.46 rating, up 11 percent from last week's 3.12 rating.
> 
> The episode featuring Batista's TV return drew the highest overall rating since March 4, 2013. The show just edged out the post-WrestleMania episode in April 2013, which scored a 3.45 rating.
> 
> - Raw averaged 4.869 million viewers, up 11 percent from last week's average of 4.403 million viewers.
> 
> It was the most viewers for an episode of Raw since Mar. 4, 2013 (more than the post-WrestleMania episode).
> 
> Hourly Break Down: 5.249 million first hour viewers, steady at 4.995 million second hour viewers, and a 13 percent decline to 4.363 million third hour viewers.
> 
> The downside of the show is that Raw lost nearly one million viewers from the first to third hour, representing an in-show decline of 17 percent.
> 
> Looking at the first hour performance, this was the first time since Mar. 4, 2013 that any hour of Raw topped five million viewers. Also, the average of 5.249 million was the most viewers for any hour of Raw since the post-Royal Rumble episode one year ago.
> 
> - Raw was boosted in the key male demographics of males 18-34 & males 18-49, hitting the highest points since before the Fall 2013 TV season.
> 
> Raw also received a bump among younger viewers, registering the highest demo ratings since before the fall.
> 
> - On cable TV Monday night, Raw ranked #1 in all viewers and in all key male demos.


Via PWTorch. 

Final rAting - 3.46


----------



## Murph

Such a shame that the opening segment got such a big number. It was poorly executed, poorly acted, the fan reaction to Batista was lukewarm. Those extra viewers weren't hooked and won't be back regularly.


----------



## superuser1

Happenstan said:


> Last week everyone was sure Orton/Kofi killed the ratings for their hour....they were wrong.
> This week everyone is sure Batista's return got huge ratings...now watch Bryan's first promo in forever blow everything out of the water.
> 
> WWE Ratings 101. It's never what we think it is.


My thoughts exactly it's always the same old with this thread. Third hour does the lowest numbers everyone starts blaming whoever was in the main event not realizing after all this damn time that the third hour almost always has the least amount of viewers. The breakdown comes out and the main event does solid numbers they ignore it and next week it's a reverse cycle.


----------



## checkcola

That's quite an assumption. The causal fan is a mysterious factor. They value stars over storytelling. I do remember WWE's strategy with Rock. Bring him down to Cena's level to make the feud work. So, bring Batista down to Orton's level to make their feud work?

PW Torch makes note of the third hour drop off as I thought it stood out too. I wonder how Batista will do when he closes out RAW in the weeks to come.


----------



## Happenstan

Murph said:


> Such a shame that the opening segment got such a big number. It was poorly executed, poorly acted, the fan reaction to Batista was lukewarm. Those extra viewers weren't hooked and won't be back regularly.


But we still don't know that yet. Hell, Misterio/Dorito also took place in hour 1. Maybe there was an abnormal amount of Latinos watching. Yeah, I know that is far fetched but until we have the quarter hours anything is possible.




checkcola said:


> PW Torch makes note of the third hour drop off as I thought it stood out too. I wonder how Batista will do when he closes out RAW in the weeks to come.


Orton/SeenIt is just not working. It's been done to death. Bad omens for Orton/Batista IMO. We've seen that too.


----------



## checkcola

You people are grasping if you don't think Batista is the reason for the extra eye balls.


----------



## Choke2Death

Happenstan said:


> But we still don't know that yet. *Hell, Misterio/Dorito also took place in hour 1. Maybe there was an abnormal amount of Latinos watching.* Yeah, I know that is far fetched but until we have the quarter hours anything is possible.


Pretty sure that was hour 2.


----------



## Happenstan

checkcola said:


> You people are grasping if you don't think Batista is the reason for the extra eye balls.


Probably so, but every time this thread has been SO sure of something, we've been wrong. Embarrassingly so.




Choke2Death said:


> Pretty sure that was hour 2.


Maybe it was. The show was so awful it bled together for me.


----------



## Loader230

xdoomsayerx said:


> Lmao. Ok pal, Cena is way more known then Batista. If Cena was gone for 3 years and returned it would be a WHOLE LOT more of a bigger deal.


There is no way to prove these kind of speculations. Lot of it depends on how well WWE is doing at that time, If Cena was replaced by some other top star(a strong possibility given 3 years is a lot of time) and WWE product becomes "must-see" again, fans would simply move on. Cena won't be a big deal anymore. One of the reasons nostalgic returns these days draws well is because this current era sucks... atleast that's the perception of the majority. A big number of fans are willing to watch WWE only if anyone from the past returns as proven with these returns, Old school RAW, RTWM with AE stars etc. 





Happenstan said:


> Like Bryan having his first promo since November, maybe? That is a specific reason. Doesn't make me right but it is possible. The fact that so many here are sure it is Batista tells me it isn't. The batting average of this thread sucks ass.


I highly doubt it, when was the last time Bryan was responsible for such a huge increase? Think about it, the number goes up after a big star return, Batista's return was well promoted and advertised for over a month, the authority/Orton promo + return went over 21 minutes solid. You really think it was Bryan's promo? 



> If Batista can sustain these numbers months from now it's on him. If not it's just shock factor of someone returning after 4 years and the ending of last weeks RAW.



What's your point? He's a bigger and much more valuable star than Bryan regardless. He's going to part timer like the Rock anyway, he will likely bump up the rating whenever he returns like the Rock does.


----------



## Sonnen Says

checkcola said:


> You people are grasping if you don't think Batista is the reason for the extra eye balls.


Exactly. How can anyone think otherwise :lol


----------



## Happenstan

Loader230 said:


> I highly doubt it, when was the last time Bryan was responsible for such a huge increase? Think about it, the number goes up after a big star return, Batista's return was well promoted and advertised for over a month, the authority/Orton promo + return went over 21 minutes solid. You really think it was Bryan's promo?


Of course, the flip side to that is when was the last time a show ended like the week before's did with Bryan turning "face". Again, I'm not claiming Bryan is responsible just that anything is POSSIBLE until we get concrete numbers.




Sonnen Says said:


> Exactly. How can anyone think otherwise :lol


Now I'm even more convinced this thread could be wrong about Batista.


----------



## checkcola

Just be glad Bryan got to cut a meaningful promo with a lot of extra people watching. Quite a bit of the roster couldn't even make that show, not even the standard brawl they usually do to hype the Rumble.


----------



## Murph

Batista was the reason for the extra viewers in the first hour. But it was a very poorly executed segment. The crowd reaction made Batista look like the average (imo) star he is. It was not a big pop, it wasn't even the biggest pop of the fucking show. I think the IWC misunderstands the casual viewer much, much more than WWE do. That segment will have done nothing for them, guaranteed. It was boring, the acting was cringeworthy levels of bad, and Batista made no unique impression. The road to Wrestlemania will give them a few more chances to keep those people watching, this segment certainly won't have done the job.


----------



## kokepepsi

this is why I stopped coming to this thread
Most of you don't understand the ratings and need to take basic match again
a bunch of quarters, some gain others lose.

Batista may have gained alot at the start
but for the numbers to stay that high other segments either gained or lost very little.

That bryan segment and billy gunn helped


----------



## Londrick

Loader230 said:


> What's your point? He's a bigger and much more valuable star than Bryan regardless. He's going to part timer like the Rock anyway, he will likely bump up the rating whenever he returns like the Rock does.


Proof that Batista draws more than Bryan in 2014? Can't really use this weeks RAW since there's no evidence that it was cause of Batista's return or the ending to RAW last week.

Actually he's gonna be closer to a full timer doing RAWs, SDs, and house shows iirc. Which means once his return loses it's luster they'll be back to shit ratings and PPV buys.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I'm afraid I've got some bad news for everyone...

... a breakdown just came out last week. Last we heard anything of consistent breakdowns, it was that we'd get them every other week. So unless they finally got someone in the back who can give this info weekly, we'll be wondering forever who brought in the viewers.

Well, some people will. The rest of us will realize it was Batista who brought in the vast majority of those viewers, while Bryan, Punk, and Lesnar held onto most of them for the first two hours following until some massive drop in hour 3, more than likely directly after the Lesnar/Show segment.


----------



## Loader230

Happenstan said:


> Of course, the flip side to that is when was the last time a show ended like the week before's did with Bryan turning "face". Again, I'm not claiming Bryan is responsible just that anything is POSSIBLE until we get concrete numbers.


I think you're forgetting the fact, Bryan was in Q3. In this case, you're really assuming RAW opener with Authority/Batista draws a average number and Q3 with Bryan increases really big from that to bump the overall to 5.2m viewers. It doesn't seem possible, I doubt even the Rock could do that kinda increase being placed in Q3. Also, don't forget the fact Authority haven't been RAW for past three weeks, so them opening the show would have caught the attention of lot of casuals expecting a big return.


----------



## Waffelz

Batista was the reason for the numbers. Batista isn't bigger than Cena.


----------



## THANOS

Loader230 said:


> I think you're forgetting the fact, Bryan was in Q3. In this case, you're really assuming RAW opener with Authority/Batista draws a average number and Q3 with Bryan increases really big from that to bump the overall to 5.2m viewers. It doesn't seem possible, I doubt even the Rock could do that kinda increase being placed in Q3. Also, don't forget the fact Authority haven't been RAW for past three weeks, so them opening the show would have caught the attention of lot of casuals expecting a big return.


From an objective standpoint, Big Dave's return most likely did a huge gain in that first quarter with loads of people tuning in to see how he looked now, but Bryan's face turn probably would have netted a really good first quarter number the following week regardless. Bryan's segments have gained tremendously for a long time now, about 8 months, but Batista's big return in all likelihood did the biggest number.

The key is to see if this continues going forward. It'll be interesting to see if the old Batista fans stick around for segments including the likes of Bryan and Punk, and if the crowd reactions, slowly but surely, move their attention from Batista onto Bryan.


----------



## Loader230

Londrick said:


> Proof that Batista draws more than Bryan in 2014? Can't really use this weeks RAW since there's no evidence that it was cause of Batista's return or the ending to RAW last week.


The follow-up of last week was also on smackdown the same week, there was no increase there. You're really reaching with these. What has Bryan drawn exactly? Weekly rating average year-to-year is the same, unless there is a special reason like this week with Batista's return, numbers aren't up. 



> Actually he's gonna be closer to a full timer doing RAWs, SDs, and house shows iirc. Which means once his return loses it's luster they'll be back to shit ratings and PPV buys.


Until mania, past that he will be part time. Similar to the Rock, who worked every RAW through RTWM but not smackdown or house shows.


----------



## Londrick

Bringing up SD's ratings :ti

No one gives a fuck about SD anymore.

I guess you don't have any proof that Batista draws more than Bryan in 2014

It only goes through RTW depending if his broken down body can handle the WWE schedule. If it does he'll be pretty much full time.


----------



## InTheAirTonight

Neckbeards running out of excuses. :lmao

First Cena outdrawing Punk.

Now Batista outdrawing Bryan.

So much indy fail. :lmao

:ti


----------



## THANOS

InTheAirTonight said:


> Neckbeards running out of excuses. :lmao
> 
> First Cena outdrawing Punk.
> 
> *Now Batista outdrawing Bryan.
> 
> So much indy fail. :lmao*
> 
> :ti


You've already embarssed yourself countless times on here, but we haven't even seen the quarter hours yet, so the last thing you should be doing is jumping to the conclusions, or sooner or later (maybe tomorrow?) you'll look like a fool because of it.


----------



## RebelArch86

Batista might have brought 1m old viewers back while the rest of the roster has been bringing 15m weekly viewers across all WWE programming. Sounds like everyone is doing their job.


----------



## Loader230

More like the popular WWE brand bringing in consistent viewers year long, regardless of a shitty/great product. And it isn't 15m viewers lol.


----------



## The XL

Lol at anyone thinking Bryan was the reason for the spike. It was obviously Batista.


----------



## Stad

InTheAirTonight said:


> Neckbeards running out of excuses. :lmao
> 
> First Cena outdrawing Punk.
> 
> Now Batista outdrawing Bryan.
> 
> So much indy fail. :lmao
> 
> :ti


Is neckbeard suppose to be an insult or something? :deandre


----------



## Arrogant Mog

:ti


----------



## KingLobos

Who the hell is trying to convince people that Bryan is a bigger draw than Batista. LOL


----------



## TheGmGoken

WWE Raw on Monday, January 20 scored a 3.46 rating, up 11 percent from last week's 3.12 rating.

Lately I notice something. All of the GOOD raw shows get average or bad ratings. ALL of the BAD raw Shows get average or good ratings. That must suck. Now the creative think bad is good. This Raw was boring IMHO.


----------



## Ray

Seriously, don't ya'll have better things to do then argue about WWE television ratings? What's the point? Who the fuck cares if one person or another draws?


----------



## Words Of Wisdom

Welp, Batista will win the Rumble now. I like Batista but his return was lackluster. Also, I'm glad from a wrestling fan perspective and an admiration for the company that it had tons of viewers. But, after seeing those numbers it sucks to know that Bryan won't probably win the rumble or the title anytime soon.


----------



## celticjobber

Punter said:


> Seriously, don't ya'll have better things to do then argue about WWE television ratings? What's the point? Who the fuck cares if one person or another draws?


Mostly because whoever draws ratings will get the biggest push.


----------



## TheGmGoken

Punter said:


> Seriously, don't ya'll have better things to do then argue about WWE television ratings? What's the point? Who the fuck cares if one person or another draws?


Do you have nothing better to do but bitch? Bitching about bitching is just as bad. Seriously what did you expect from this website? Get a fucking brain idiot and realize your fucking surrounding on the internet. So I suggest you know your damn role and shut your damn mouth. You dig sucka? Come here bitching like you're on your period you fucking pussy ass bitch.


----------



## funnyfaces1

TheGmGoken said:


> WWE Raw on Monday, January 20 scored a 3.46 rating, up 11 percent from last week's 3.12 rating.
> 
> Lately I notice something. All of the GOOD raw shows get average or bad ratings. ALL of the BAD raw Shows get average or good ratings. That must suck. Now the creative think bad is good. This Raw was boring IMHO.


Not a surprise. Ratings and quality do not correlate. The Wire is the GOAT show and its ratings were horrible. RAW in mid-1999 got amazing ratings and everything about it sucked, including the main event.


----------



## stonefort

funnyfaces1 said:


> Not a surprise. Ratings and quality do not correlate. The Wire is the GOAT show and its ratings were horrible. RAW in mid-1999 got amazing ratings and everything about it sucked, including the main event.


Wire is hugely over-rated. It was boring and predictable.


----------



## Banjo

Daniel Bryan on his best day will never bring in the ratings or buyrates that BATISTA can. This is why Bryan will never be the face of WWE and why he will never main event WrestleMania.

Next week's RAW should involve Big Dave in the main event. Like say John Cena & Batista vs. The Shield. Batista face to face with Roman Reigns... the ratings would spike to 6.0 for those few seconds :


----------



## Alo0oy

InTheAirTonight said:


> First Cena outdrawing Punk.





> Q2: Raw slipped to a show-low 1.95 rating for John Cena vs. Damien Sandow, plus one commercial.


----------



## fulcizombie

The Caped Crusader said:


> Can people finally stop downplaying how big of a draw or star Batista was now? I'm genuinely not surprised that his return got such a huge bump. I'm sure many on here are thinking 'fuck why' though. Meltzer said this guy was WWE's biggest international star back in 2008 or so. The USA Network specifically wanted him on Raw. His face turn in 2005 brought a big increase in business on PPV, house shows, attendance etc. I hope people understand that when they say 'no one wants to see Batista in the main event of Wrestlemania' they're a minority. He's easily, far and away, the biggest star WWE had behind John Cena since the departure of The Rock and Stone Cold Steve Austin.
> 
> I still think the opening segment was terrible though and they booked it horribly.


Agreed. The main event of wrestlemania has to be Lesnar vs. Batista , anything else will be a joke (and that includes orton vs. batista).


----------



## Rick Sanchez

Any main event at XXX without Bryan and the title is a joke. And Bryan vs. Brock is the best choice, though I'm willing to watch Cena/Orton/Bryan or Cena/Bryan II if that's what it takes.


----------



## fulcizombie

A Man Named Bruce said:


> Any main event at XXX without Bryan and the title is a joke. And Bryan vs. Brock is the best choice, though I'm willing to watch Cena/Orton/Bryan or Cena/Bryan II if that's what it takes.


Daniel bryan fans have gone insane and have made this forum unreadable. Yeah let's have bryan at the main event of wrestlemania , the same DB that killed summerslam . In the 30th edition of wrestlemania and the first that will be aired in the wwe network DB doesn't have a place anywhere near the main event and i am sure wwe officials know that .


----------



## Murph

fulcizombie said:


> Agreed. The main event of wrestlemania has to be Lesnar vs. Batista , anything else will be a joke (and that includes orton vs. batista).


Wrestlemania sells itself. By ignoring Bryan and keeping him out of the Main Event, they are begging fans to shit all over the Main Event and chant Bryan's name the entire time. They can't afford for that to happen at a show as big as Wrestlemania XXX. They won't do it.


----------



## Cliffy

Waffelz said:


> Batista is not and never will be bigger than Cena. Does Batista make WWE $100m a year?


No, nor does Cena

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## validreasoning

batista was gone for 4 years and wwe hyped his return for over a month and ratings increased by 11%.

cena was gone 2 months and wwe hyped his return for about 2 weeks and ratings increased by 9% despite the fact raw went head to the head with the nfl AND the world series that night.

i can't wait for hogan to return and people here to claim he should main event wrestlemania after the first weeks raw numbers come in


----------



## MaybeLock

fulcizombie said:


> Daniel bryan fans have gone insane and have made this forum unreadable. Yeah let's have bryan at the main event of wrestlemania , the same DB that killed summerslam . In the 30th edition of wrestlemania and the first that will be aired in the wwe network DB doesn't have a place anywhere near the main event and i am sure wwe officials know that .


Better idea, let's use the Main event of Wrestlemania, to put over another part timer. Or even better, let's put John Cena over again. When was the last time we saw a new star in the spotlight of winning in the WM Main Event? It's time for someone new, and out of the new stars, Bryan is the biggest one.


----------



## HULK HOGAN GOAT

fulcizombie said:


> Daniel bryan fans have gone insane and have made this forum unreadable. Yeah let's have bryan at the main event of wrestlemania , the same DB that killed summerslam . In the 30th edition of wrestlemania and the first that will be aired in the wwe network DB doesn't have a place anywhere near the main event and i am sure wwe officials know that .


You're going crazy on just THAT?

Wait till he wins the RR AND ME WM, This forum will go apeshit and call him even greater than hogan.


----------



## validreasoning

MaybeLock said:


> Better idea, let's use the Main event of Wrestlemania, to put over another part timer. Or even better, let's put John Cena over again. When was the last time we saw a new star in the spotlight of winning in the WM Main Event? It's time for someone new, and out of the new stars, Bryan is the biggest one.


would agree on that. mania used to be the vehicle to build new stars and have the show end with someone newish on top be it bret at mania 10, shawn at 12, austin at 14, lesnar at 19, benoit at 20, cena and batista at 21. its been 9 years since they had someone new close mania and thats far too long. whats better popping a single buyrate or perhaps creating one or two new superstars for the next decade...

the summerslam stuff is just nonsense too. 99% of people didn't even think bryan and cena was maineventing that show. punk and lesnar was the main program going into summerslam and had the longest build (it started prior to payback in may with jericho forcing heyman to take a match). it was the final angle that closed the go home raw and lesnars match at extreme rules went on after cenas title match with ryback. most casuals probably just saw bryan as another notch on cenas belt like ryback and henry had been in the months previous.


----------



## krai999

validreasoning said:


> would agree on that. mania used to be the vehicle to build new stars and have the show end with someone newish on top be it bret at mania 10, shawn at 12, austin at 14, lesnar at 19, benoit at 20, cena and batista at 21. its been 9 years since they had someone new close mania and thats far too long. whats better popping a single buyrate or perhaps creating one or two new superstars for the next decade...
> 
> the summerslam stuff is just nonsense too. 99% of people didn't even think bryan and cena was maineventing that show. punk and lesnar was the main program going into summerslam and had the longest build (it started prior to payback in may with jericho forcing heyman to take a match). it was the final angle that closed the go home raw and lesnars match at extreme rules went on after cenas title match with ryback.


all that this is telling me is that pro wrestling is dead


----------



## fulcizombie

validreasoning said:


> the summerslam stuff is just nonsense too. 99% of people didn't even think bryan and cena was maineventing that show. punk and lesnar was the main program going into summerslam and had the longest build (it started prior to payback in may with jericho forcing heyman to take a match). it was the final angle that closed the go home raw and lesnars match at extreme rules went on after cenas title match with ryback. most casuals probably just saw bryan as another notch on cenas belt like ryback and henry had been in the months previous.


I said wow . So cena was champion, has been main eventing forever, even when he was not the champion , but...people didn't know cena/Bryan was the main event ?


----------



## checkcola

fulcizombie said:


> I said wow . So cena was champion, has been main eventing forever, even when he was not the champion , but...people didn't know cena/Bryan was the main event ?


There was a lot of speculation that Brock was closing based on the prior year vs Triple H


----------



## HULK HOGAN GOAT

InTheAirTonight said:


> Neckbeards running out of excuses. :lmao
> 
> First Cena outdrawing Punk.
> 
> Now Batista outdrawing Bryan.
> 
> So much indy fail. :lmao
> 
> :ti


how many -reps you got for honest that?


----------



## validreasoning

fulcizombie said:


> I said wow . So cena was champion, has been main eventing forever, even when he was not the champion , but...people didn't know cena/Bryan was the main event ?


cena was champion at extreme rules and lesnar closed that show. cena was champion at mitb and didn't close that show. cena was in title match at summerslam the year previous and lesnar closed that show


----------



## Loader230

validreasoning said:


> batista was gone for 4 years and wwe hyped his return for over a month and ratings increased by 11%.
> 
> cena was gone 2 months and wwe hyped his return for about 2 weeks and ratings increased by 9% despite the fact raw went head to the head with the nfl AND the world series that night.
> 
> i can't wait for hogan to return and people here to claim he should main event wrestlemania after the first weeks raw numbers come in


Cena's return was post-PPV show. Hell in a cell fall-out of the Kliq screwjob with Shawn as referee. Big difference.


----------



## The_Workout_Buddy

WOW people bragging as if this were Monday Night Wars numbers....


----------



## Murph

The_Workout_Buddy said:


> WOW people bragging as if this were Monday Night Wars numbers....


Most Raws in 1998 drew 5.5-6.5 million viewers. The opening of this show was not far behind that.


----------



## Waffelz

Cliffy Byro said:


> No, nor does Cena
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


Why would Cena lie?


----------



## Rick Sanchez

Murph said:


> Most Raws in 1998 drew 5.5-6.5 million viewers. The opening of this show was not far behind that.


You're talking one segment. AE at its peak drew up to about 10 million viewers in its biggest segments of all time.


----------



## Yes Era

There was definite interest in Batista returning and Bryan turning. There is no running from or denying that. Will Batista continue to bring in good numbers? I doubt. Next week is gonna get a good number too.....What is most telling is what will happen at the end of the Royal Rumble when the fans realize that Bryan got blackballed from the match so he wouldn't outpop their chosen elite yet again. On Monday Night Raw next week, the fans will be LOUD one way or another during the promo by the Rumble winner...


----------



## D.M.N.

Regarding the Bryan factor, and whether he was a factor at all, his face turn has had 636,000 views on YouTube from January 13th Raw.

As for this past Monday on YouTube on WWE's official YouTube channel:

- 620k - Batista attacks Del Rio
=> *LAST THURSDAY equivalent number - ~500k - Daniel Bryan's face turn*
- 407k - Show/Lesnar segment
- 381k - Batista return
- 223k - Cena/Orton brawl
- 169k - Punk vs Gunn
- 168k - Punk/Kane segment
- 137k - Bryan segment
- 93k - Divas match
- 89k - Shield vs Rhodes/Langston
- 79k - Wyatt vs Usos
- 74k - Rey vs Del Rio
- 54k - Woods vs Fandango

You could argue that they didn't follow up Bryan well based on the YouTube numbers, but we don't know if the concussion changed plans a bit, after all the physicality in the Usos match was not much either.

If anything, I'd say the YouTube hits show who casuals care about - for this week alone, big drop after Batista/Lesnar segments.


----------



## Masked Legend

Bryan marks actually think Bryan was the reason for these numbers :ti It was because of Batista, stop trying to delude yourselves :lmao 

Your indy midgets can't draw for shit. :batista2 DEAL WITH IT! :batista4


----------



## The Redneck

^ #dealwithit-everyobody


----------



## MaybeLock

Masked Legend said:


> Bryan marks actually think Bryan was the reason for these numbers :ti It was because of Batista, stop trying to delude yourselves :lmao
> 
> Your indy midgets can't draw for shit. :batista2 DEAL WITH IT! :batista4





> - Over-Run Peak: 2.40 over-run rating for the end of the steel cage main event and Daniel Bryan dumping the Wyatts.


Not drawing... Right... 

Obviously Batista was the reason for the ratings bump, but last week's ratings were already good, and it´s normal that people tune in to see Mr. Skinny Pants after 4 years. Let's see if he keeps up with those extraordinary numbers. For all I know, Bryan has been getting good numbers in a weekly basis, without that nostalgia/surprise factor of returning.


----------



## KingLobos

funnyfaces1 said:


> Not a surprise. Ratings and quality do not correlate. The Wire is the GOAT show and its ratings were horrible. RAW in mid-1999 got amazing ratings and everything about it sucked, including the main event.


You got it backwards.

Ratings and wrestling matches do not correlate. Bryan can have all the 5 star matches he wants. And it doesn't mean anything. Batista drawing big numbers does. Oh and the reason 1999 got so much ratings was because......look at the top guys. They can actually entertain you and put butts in the seats. That is their job afterall. Stone Cold, The Rock, Mick Foley, Vince McMahon, I'll watch anything with them on it. You can have Bryan. LOL.


----------



## Alo0oy

MaybeLock said:


> Not drawing... Right...
> 
> Obviously Batista was the reason for the ratings bump, but last week's ratings were already good, and it´s normal that people tune in to see Mr. Skinny Pants after 4 years. Let's see if he keeps up with those extraordinary numbers. For all I know, Bryan has been getting good numbers in a weekly basis, without that nostalgia/surprise factor of returning.


The overrun got as many viewers as Orton vs Kofi in the middle of the show, is that really something to brag about?


----------



## Murph

Masked Legend said:


> Bryan marks actually think Bryan was the reason for these numbers :ti It was because of Batista, stop trying to delude yourselves :lmao
> 
> Your indy midgets can't draw for shit. :batista2 DEAL WITH IT! :batista4


Watch all the Kevin Nash shoot interviews you want, try and sound like how you've heard Vince McMahon is like all you want- you're not an industry insider. Clueless.


----------



## #Mark

Alo0oy said:


> The overrun got as many viewers as Orton vs Kofi in the middle of the show, is that really something to brag about?


His segment was still the peak of a poorly rated show. Bryan facing the Wyatts in a gaunlet match and then joining them did a monster gain too.


----------



## Alo0oy

#Mark said:


> His segment was still the peak of a poorly rated show. Bryan facing the Wyatts in a gaunlet match and then joining them did a monster gain too.


It was the overrun, it's supposed to be the peak of the show, yet it almost had as many viewers as a match in the middle of the show (2.4 vs 2.39 is the same really).

I'm not shitting on Bryan, but its not something to brag about, when was the last time the overrun got as many viewers as a match in the middle of the show? I don't remember it ever happened in 2013, the overrun always had a significant amount of viewers more than any part of the show.


----------



## SerapisLiber

celticjobber said:


> Mostly because whoever draws ratings will get the biggest push.


:delrio rton2 unk8


----------



## MaybeLock

Well, half of the Kofi vs Orton match actually lost viewers, I guess what drew them back was what happened after the match. Orton vs Cena are supposed to be the the biggest angle right now, and that was an important segment of the feud. It shouldn't be surprising they get good numbers. Still, Bryan beat the main feud going on.


----------



## Choke2Death

MaybeLock said:


> *Well, half of the Kofi vs Orton match actually lost viewers*, I guess what drew them back was what happened after the match. Orton vs Cena are supposed to be the the biggest angle right now, and that was an important segment of the feud. It shouldn't be surprising they get good numbers. Still, Bryan beat the main feud going on.


It still did better numbers compared to the last actual segment which was the Punk/NAO vs Shield match-up, though. The Ultimate Warrior video had a huge increase in numbers then they went down for the first half of Kofi/Orton and the increase happened in the end.


----------



## #Mark

Alo0oy said:


> It was the overrun, it's supposed to be the peak of the show, yet it almost had as many viewers as a match in the middle of the show (2.4 vs 2.39 is the same really).
> 
> I'm not shitting on Bryan, but its not something to brag about, when was the last time the overrun got as many viewers as a match in the middle of the show? I don't remember it ever happened in 2013, the overrun always had a significant amount of viewers more than any part of the show.


I'm pretty sure it just happened this week.. The Cena/Orton segment definitely got lower than either of the Batista segments. 

Anyways, one time I know for sure is the Orton vs. Punk ME that happened over the Summer. It had the lowest overrun of the year and had a lower rating than a lot of other segments on the same show.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

#Mark said:


> I'm pretty sure it just happened this week.. The Cena/Orton segment definitely got lower than either of the Batista segments.
> 
> Anyways, one time I know for sure is the Orton vs. Punk ME that happened over the Summer. It had the lowest overrun of the year and had a lower rating than a lot of other segments on the same show.


Actually, Orton/Bryan from a couple of weeks prior had the lowest overrun, with a 2.92 rating. The Punk/Orton match you're referring to was second to that with a 3.13.


----------



## NearFall

Been super busy (exams really took most of my time since October) Can anyone really fill me in on how ratings went November-Now? (Just a quick preface/summary would be much appreciated)


----------



## #Mark

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Actually, Orton/Bryan from a couple of weeks prior had the lowest overrun, with a 2.92 rating. The Punk/Orton match you're referring to was second to that with a 3.13.


Bryan/Orton had the lower rating but it did have the higher gain.



> The Orton vs. Bryan street fight gained 104,000 viewers, one of the lowest main event gains of the year, finishing at a 2.92 overrun.





> The Randy Orton vs. CM Punk main event gained 48,000 viewers, which is terrible for an overrun segment


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

#Mark said:


> Bryan/Orton had the lower rating but it did have the higher gain.


Yeah, but it was still a lower rating at the end of the day, and the gain wasn't that much higher. What you consider worse depends on what you view as more important, the gain or the rating, but the lowest overrun was Bryan/Orton.

Edit: Also, didn't realize before, but this one was also lower than Punk/Orton (but the gain was higher):



> Ryback vs. Kane and the post-match with Daniel Bryan, John Cena and The Shield gained 163,000 viewers, weak for a main event, and did a 2.99 overrun.


----------



## Alo0oy

#Mark said:


> I'm pretty sure it just happened this week.. The Cena/Orton segment definitely got lower than either of the Batista segments.


Nobody's debating that, I'm 100% sure the show peaked during Batista's return.



> Anyways, one time I know for sure is the Orton vs. Punk ME that happened over the Summer. It had the lowest overrun of the year and had a lower rating than a lot of other segments on the same show.





#BadNewsSanta said:


> Actually, Orton/Bryan from a couple of weeks prior had the lowest overrun, with a 2.92 rating. The Punk/Orton match you're referring to was second to that with a 3.13.


My point stands, you don't brag when a pointless match in the midcard gets as many viewers as the overrun, its a respectable amount of viewers, but nothing to brag about.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

NearFall said:


> Been super busy (exams really took most of my time since October) Can anyone really fill me in on how ratings went November-Now? (Just a quick preface/summary would be much appreciated)


Off the top of my head, pretty much the same as the year prior up until the last couple Raws, a little more some weeks, a little less, and a couple of times where it was a lot less, and I think once where it was a lot more. The last couple of Raws did considerably better than their 2012 because the 2012 shows fell directly on Christmas and New Years Eve. Then for the last few weeks, I think they were the same as 2013, although this week's Raw did considerably better than the 2013 counterpart (due to Batista's return).


----------



## Your_Solution

I feel like Batista doesnt have enough marks around here. If any of the other main eventers got this kind of number there would be blood everywhere throughout the forums


----------



## RKO 4life

Waffelz said:


> Orton deserves no praise whatsoever. It was all Batista. Will be interesting to see the numbers of hour three. (which Cena wasn't in)


You are the biggest troll on here.


----------



## The_Workout_Buddy

MaybeLock said:


> Well, half of the Kofi vs Orton match actually lost viewers, I guess what drew them back was what happened after the match. *Orton vs Cena are supposed to be the the biggest angle right now*, and that was an important segment of the feud. It shouldn't be surprising they get good numbers. Still, Bryan beat the main feud going on.


Sorry but that's not truth, since TLC ppv the biggest angle has been Bryan vs Wyatt Family, the angle has plagued all WWE programing, even on the lesser shows has it's own video package, main even not only on RAW but Smackdown, its THE biggest angle right now, hey there were weeks where Orton and Cena not even had a segment dedicated to its program.


----------



## The Redneck

KingLobos said:


> You got it backwards.
> 
> Ratings and wrestling matches do not correlate. Bryan can have all the 5 star matches he wants. And it doesn't mean anything. Batista drawing big numbers does. Oh and the reason 1999 got so much ratings was because......look at the top guys. They can actually entertain you and put butts in the seats. That is their job afterall. Stone Cold, The Rock, Mick Foley, Vince McMahon, I'll watch anything with them on it. You can have Bryan. LOL.


agreed.


----------



## Waffelz

RKO 4life said:


> You are the biggest troll on here.


Are you actually suggesting that it wasn't? HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAH


----------



## The_Great_One2

'Tista bringing in the ratings. Let's see if he keeps them up.


----------



## superuser1

Lmao the mark war died quick no breakdown for last week


----------



## D.M.N.

superuser1 said:


> Lmao the mark war died quick no breakdown for last week


Breakdown's later this week due to Martin Luther King day, should be out early next week.


----------



## D.M.N.

Whilst we wait, some interesting random historical comparisons:

2000
- 03/07 - 5.25 rating / 4.10 million households
- 04/12 - 5.00 rating / 3.91 million households

2001
- 19/03 - 4.60 rating / 3.68 million households
- 26/03 - 4.70 rating / 3.75 million households
- 14/05 - 4.50 rating / 3.64 million households
- 04/06 - 4.30 rating / 3.44 million households
- 20/08 - 5.15 rating / 4.18 million households
- 03/09 - 4.60 rating / 3.86 million households
- 17/09 - 4.80 rating / 4.01 million households
- 05/11 - 3.95 rating / 3.35 million households
- 03/12 - 4.20 rating / 3.55 million households
- 10/12 - 4.65 rating / 3.93 million households

2011
- 07/03 - 3.92 rating / 3.94 million households
* USA Network available in 100,480,000 households as of July 2011

2012
- 23/07 - 3.86 rating / 3.83 million households
* the two main hours had 4 million+ households
* USA Network available in 99,301,000 households as of July 2012

2013
- 28/01 - 3.67 rating / 3.64 million households
* USA Network available in 99,301,000 households as of July 2012

2014
- 06/01 - 3.23 rating / 3.19 million households
- 13/01 - 3.11 rating / 3.07 million households
- 20/01 - 3.46 rating / 3.41 million households
* USA Network is currently available in 98,647,000 households

You could do an entire 2001 table by Googling: ``WWF Entertainment'' site:mediapost.com.

Highest rating used for 2010 through to 2013. Actual raw viewership numbers going back to the early 2000's are unavailable (only for the past 5/6 years can you find viewership numbers) but household ratings go back all the way to whenever so make for good comparisons.

If someone (wb1989?) had the USA Network/SpikeTV/TNN household totals going back 10/15 years, you could see how much the number of households watching wrestling has dropped since the Attitude Era.


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7

What happened to the quarter ratings breakdown?


----------



## JY57

Smackdown Viewership Rises for Go Home Rumble Show:

3.03 million viewers (up from 2.92 million the previous week)


----------



## kokepepsi

Not sure why I am even posting this since most of you marks don't look at numbers or understand what they mean.

But this guy dissected the Raw rating per person for the last 3 years
*PER PERSON!!!!
*http://indeedwrestling.blogspot.com/2014/01/dissecting-raw-ratings-by-person.html

By the way of interesting note
From August - October 2013
Daniel Bryan is the biggest gainer over everyone

Again I know no one is gonna check the link out except for D.M.N and the 3 other smarks in this thread
---------------
Good fuel for some mark wars though:mark:


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7

> Right now, I'll leave that as an exercise to the reader, so they can twist it to prove whatever point best fits their narrative.


lol


----------



## Bfo4jd

Jim Ross is the biggest viewership gainer of the year 2011. Go figure.


----------



## Starbuck

Some interesting and funny stuff in that link. BAH GAWD JR!! So 2011 goes JR, Cena, HHH, *THE FUCKING MIZ* and then Punk....after Miz....during Punk's hottest time???

:ti

Taker and HHH with dat End of an Era doing work in 2012 obviously. Vince at third though? I can't even remember him appearing other than that one match with Punk, right? I would have expected Cena to come after Rocky at 5 but HBK is surprising. Cena that far down is also surprising. Vickie over Cena? Vickie over Punk? Heyman over Punk? Dat 434.

:ti

ROCKY/BROCKY/CENA/HEYMAN/HHH all bringing da ratingz in 2013. No surprises there although Taker disappeared off the face of the earth. Young Randal, the face of the WWE all the way at the bottom for 2013 and 2012.

:ti

From August to October of last year D BRY and DA GAME with dem ratingz gainz. I did lol at the fact that Show, Maddox, Goldust and Stephanie are all ahead of Orton for that time period too. Heyman > Punk once again is also...

:ti

*Conclusions to draw from this inconclusive evidence.... 8*D :*

1) :cena4 and :trips2 are WWE's most consistent TV da ratingz draws for the past 3 years with :trips2 being the only man to feature in the top 5 for all 3 years. 

2) Part timers draw da ratingz :rock4 :brock

3) :heyman2 is a bigger ratingz draw than unk2

4) Everybody is a bigger ratingz draw than :rko2

5) :HHH2 is da GOAT ratingz draw


----------



## Ungratefulness

kokepepsi said:


> Not sure why I am even posting this since most of you marks don't look at numbers or understand what they mean.
> 
> But this guy dissected the Raw rating per person for the last 3 years
> *PER PERSON!!!!
> *http://indeedwrestling.blogspot.com/2014/01/dissecting-raw-ratings-by-person.html
> 
> By the way of interesting note
> From August - October 2013
> Daniel Bryan is the biggest gainer over everyone
> 
> Again I know no one is gonna check the link out except for D.M.N and the 3 other smarks in this thread
> ---------------
> Good fuel for some mark wars though:mark:


Great link. So AJ was a top viewership gainer in 2012 and now that she's only on with other divas, she's losing viewers but less so than any other diva, so it's obviously the other divas really losing them. She needs a bigger role.


----------



## Alo0oy

Starbuck said:


> Some interesting and funny stuff in that link. BAH GAWD JR!! So 2011 goes JR, Cena, HHH, *THE FUCKING MIZ* and then Punk....after Miz....during Punk's hottest time???
> 
> :ti
> 
> Taker and HHH with dat End of an Era doing work in 2012 obviously. Vince at third though? I can't even remember him appearing other than that one match with Punk, right? I would have expected Cena to come after Rocky at 5 but HBK is surprising. Cena that far down is also surprising. Vickie over Cena? Vickie over Punk? Heyman over Punk? Dat 434.
> 
> :ti
> 
> ROCKY/BROCKY/CENA/HEYMAN/HHH all bringing da ratingz in 2013. No surprises there although Taker disappeared off the face of the earth. Young Randal, the face of the WWE all the way at the bottom for 2013 and 2012.
> 
> :ti
> 
> From August to October of last year D BRY and DA GAME with dem ratingz gainz. I did lol at the fact that Show, Maddox, Goldust and Stephanie are all ahead of Orton for that time period too. Heyman > Punk once again is also...
> 
> :ti
> 
> *Conclusions to draw from this inconclusive evidence.... 8*D :*
> 
> 1) :cena4 and :trips2 are WWE's most consistent TV da ratingz draws for the past 3 years with :trips2 being the only man to feature in the top 5 for all 3 years.
> 
> 2) Part timers draw da ratingz :rock4 :brock
> 
> 3) :heyman2 is a bigger ratingz draw than unk2
> 
> 4) Everybody is a bigger ratingz draw than :rko2
> 
> 5) :HHH2 is da GOAT ratingz draw


You can't possibly take that link seriously. :lmao


----------



## Starbuck

Somebody clearly needs to better their comprehension skills.


----------



## D.M.N.

I Walk Alone! ...in sending the ratings down, that is.

8pm - 4.849m
9pm - 4.837m
10pm - 4.470m

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...ip-hop-fast-n-loud-single-ladies-more/232423/

Interestingly, the Adults 18-49 appears slightly up week-on-week, but overall down the raw total numbers.


----------



## Alo0oy

D.M.N. said:


> I Walk Alone! ...in sending the ratings down, that is.
> 
> 8pm - 4.849m
> 9pm - 4.837m
> 10pm - 4.470m
> 
> http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...ip-hop-fast-n-loud-single-ladies-more/232423/
> 
> Interestingly, the Adults 18-49 appears slightly up week-on-week, but overall down the raw total numbers.


How does that compare to last year's?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Wow, I was sure the first hour would get above 5 million (or at least one of the hours). This is a decent bit down from last year's post-Raw Rumble (and the prior year's...). Not terrible by any means, but definitely not what I thought it would be as a post-Raw Rumble. TBH, I think the 2nd hour was helped by the possibility of Brock vs. Orton for the title or Brock vs. Batista getting announced, but when Heyman said that wasn't happening, people tuned out after the Brock segment. TBH, I think they should've done the 6-man tag at the 10PM, and then in the final segment, have HHH respond to Brock/Heyman's options. Have Brock threaten to destroy cameras, the announce table, etc. and then HHH says he'll put Brock in the elimination chamber. Not sure what they do to send Raw off outside of HHH's music playing with Brock and Heyman standing in the ring, both pulling off evil smiles. 

That would've definitely helped keep the viewership up imo.

Edit: Last year's post-Rumble Raw:

Hour 1- 4.86 million
Hour 2- 5.27 million
Hour 3- 4.93 million

None of this year's hours went above last year's lowest.


----------



## Starbuck

#YESMOVEMENT IN FULL FORCE YOU SHOWED THEM GUYS YOU SHOWED THEM!!!!!!!

:yes :yes :yes :yes

:vince7 :vince7 :vince7 :vince7


----------



## TKOW

Starbuck said:


> 4) Everybody is a bigger ratingz draw than :rko2


You don't need statistics to come to that conclusion...


----------



## D.M.N.

Don't forget last year did have Rock winning the title, which was huge from a casual POV.


----------



## LKRocks

Batista wins the Rumble and the Ratings go down. Way to go.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The Batista bomb is in effect. Dave has been exposed for what he is and there is no upside to his stale, wind-sucking ass.


----------



## Dec_619

Starbuck said:


> #YESMOVEMENT IN FULL FORCE YOU SHOWED THEM GUYS YOU SHOWED THEM!!!!!!!
> 
> :yes :yes :yes :yes
> 
> :vince7 :vince7 :vince7 :vince7


:yes :yes :yes :yes :yes :yes :yes :yes

Seriously, no one gives a shit about Batista.


----------



## Waffelz

THE BOYCOTT WORKED!!!!!!


----------



## Sonnen Says

They indeed give a shit about Bryan see that final hour.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Vince needs to announce a do over and have the Rumble on Raw next week. Put Batista at #1 and let him show the fans he merits the Mania main event.


----------



## Waffelz

Main event started at 03:35 or so. I bet it gained liked Bruan's gauntlet match last summer.


----------



## #Mark

We getting quarter hours this week?


----------



## LKRocks

The breadown will likely show that the entire third hour was terrible, and then the main event was one of the best segments of the night. That seems to be the template nowadays


----------



## Bushmaster

Dec_619 said:


> :yes :yes :yes :yes :yes :yes :yes :yes
> 
> Seriously, no one gives a shit about Batista.


But i thought last week's good ratings were due to Batista


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

But...But... I heard it's in Big Dave's contract that every segment he is in draws over 5 million and that all the fans cheer him.


----------



## Sonnen Says

I think Batista/Brock/Paul/Orton segment will be the highest point of the show.


----------



## MaybeLock

If Batista keeps losing viewers, the "I walk alone" line is going to get real. :ti


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7

SoupBro said:


> But i thought last week's good ratings were due to Batista


They probably were, but he couldn't sustain interest this week.


----------



## LilOlMe

D.M.N. said:


> I Walk Alone! ...in sending the ratings down, that is.
> 
> 8pm - 4.849m
> 9pm - 4.837m
> 10pm - 4.470m
> 
> http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...ip-hop-fast-n-loud-single-ladies-more/232423/
> 
> Interestingly, the Adults 18-49 appears slightly up week-on-week, but overall down the raw total numbers.


The A18-49 demo is all that matters to advertisers, so RAW being down in total viewers doesn't really matter. Advertisers look at that particular demo. This is why shows like "Body of Proof" can get canceled, even after averaging 10 million viewers. Yet a show with much less viewership, but high in the 18-49 demo, is considered a success.


----------



## Arrogant Mog

And people say Batista draws

:ti


----------



## Biast

#SaveUsDiesel


----------



## Bryan D.

#SaveUsHenry


----------



## napalmdestruction

The first hour would have been bigger but people saw Triple H, Stephanie and Daniel Bryan in the ring at the same time and changed the channel. I know I did.


----------



## Fissiks

Arrogant Mog said:


> And people say Batista draws
> 
> :ti


it's like they never heard of a rating pop before


----------



## Bfo4jd

First hour this year drew essentially the same as last year. Second hour viewership difference clearly shows Batista is no Dwayne Johnson when it comes to being a mainstream name. 

Although in fairness to dave, last year had Cena win the Rumble and a change of title involving the Rock at the same time. That is just too big compared to this year where it was all Batista and _maybe_ Bryan.


----------



## ecabney

napalmdestruction said:


> The first hour would have been bigger but people saw Triple H, Stephanie and Daniel Bryan in the ring at the same time and changed the channel. I know I did.


So what's your excuse for Batista drawing worse numbers in the second hour then? :jordan


----------



## Your_Solution

Bfo4jd said:


> First hour this year drew essentially the same as last year. Second hour viewership difference clearly shows Batista is no Dwayne Johnson when it comes to being a mainstream name.
> 
> Although in fairness to dave, last year had Cena win the Rumble and a change of title involving the Rock at the same time. That is just too big compared to this year where it was all Batista and _maybe_ Bryan.


Yeah I think we gotta be fair to Batista and Bryan this year, the interest wasnt going to match the interest of seeing Rock as CHAMPION.

It doesnt help that we've seen the Shield vs Superfriends X, Y, and Z match like a million times.


----------



## Arrogant Mog

ecabney said:


> So what's your excuse for Batista drawing worse numbers in the second hour then? :jordan


:ti


----------



## Brye

The wrestler I didn't like apparently didn't get a good rating. Should I be bragging to enforce my views?


----------



## Arrogant Mog

Brye said:


> The wrestler I didn't like apparently didn't get a good rating. Should I be bragging to enforce my views?


This is Wrestling Forum, it's apart of the culture


----------



## Bfo4jd

Your_Solution said:


> Yeah I think we gotta be fair to Batista and Bryan this year, the interest wasnt going to match the interest of seeing Rock as CHAMPION.
> 
> It doesnt help that we've seen the Shield vs Superfriends X, Y, and Z match like a million times.


Yeah, Batista is no Rock, but then who really is? That's not a slight on Batista. Rumble PPV is still going to draw well anyway.


----------



## MaybeLock

Brye said:


> The wrestler I didn't like apparently didn't get a good rating. Should I be bragging to enforce my views?


Is there any other reason why we may dislike a wrestler? :taker


----------



## napalmdestruction

ecabney said:


> So what's your excuse for Batista drawing worse numbers in the second hour then? :jordan


Alberto del Rio vs Kofi probably lost close to 3 million viewers and hurt the average.


----------



## Brye

Arrogant Mog said:


> This is Wrestling Forum, it's apart of the culture


I've got no problem with that. Just think it's weird how some use them in arguments.


----------



## KingLobos

The Rock wins again. Even when he's not on the show. 

GOAT


----------



## ecabney

napalmdestruction said:


> Alberto del Rio vs Kofi probably lost close to 3 million viewers and hurt the average.


But Batista's such a huge draw. He's supposed to gain that 3 million back :jordan :jordan4


----------



## napalmdestruction

Brye said:


> I've got no problem with that. Just think it's weird how some use them in arguments.


How is that weird?

Purpose of real sports: winning championships
Purpose of wrestling: making money

So:

"Michael Jordan is better than Kobe! Jordan has 6 rings, Kobe only has 5!"
"Batista drew 5 million people to Raw! Daniel Bryan only drew 4!"


----------



## napalmdestruction

ecabney said:


> But Batista's such a huge draw. He's supposed to gain that 3 million back :jordan :jordan4


And he did. 

1st hour: First half of the hour - 4.700; Second Half - 4.900 Average: 4.800
2nd hour: First half of the hour - 2.500; Second Half - 7.000 Average: 4.750

I'm pretty sure this is what happened.


----------



## JY57

no shock The Rock winning the championship fallout and Brock Lesnar returning last year did better than this year.


----------



## JY57

some 2013 stats


----------



## Bfo4jd

I think Batista was on the first half of the second hour?


----------



## WWE

JY57 said:


>



:rock :cena2 :brock :HHH2


Naomi bringing dem down :ti


----------



## napalmdestruction

I think those stats prove the WWE audience is racist.


----------



## GeorgeCostanza

as if the WWE ever gave you a reason to care about anyone on that biggest loser list minus bray


----------



## Bushmaster

napalmdestruction said:


> How is that weird?
> 
> Purpose of real sports: winning championships
> Purpose of wrestling: making money
> 
> So:
> 
> "*Michael Jordan is better than Kobe! Jordan has 6 rings, Kobe only has 5!*"
> "Batista drew 5 million people to Raw! Daniel Bryan only drew 4!"


So Bill Russell is better than Jordan i guess :draper2

I agree it's weird too.


----------



## CJohn3:16

napalmdestruction said:


> And he did.
> 
> 1st hour: First half of the hour - 4.700; Second Half - 4.900 Average: 4.800
> 2nd hour: First half of the hour - 2.500; Second Half - 7.000 Average: 4.750
> 
> I'm pretty sure this is what happened.


More likely they lost 3 million when people realized Fandango was going to fight against R-Truth.


----------



## Bob the Jobber

napalmdestruction said:


> I think those stats prove the WWE audience is racist.


They've grown accustom to Vince telling them that they're inferior.


----------



## G-Rated Is Coming

JY57 said:


> some 2013 stats


Brad Maddox and Curtis Axel a bigger draw than Blandy Boreton. Suck it marks.

Someone needs to fire him for putting everyone to sleep every week with his God awful matches and promos. 10+ years of a rocket shoved up his ass and still no one cares about him.


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

hahaha wow randy orton is such a failure. all that wasted time pushing him, handing him titles and curtis freaking axel is a better draw.


----------



## Choke2Death

CenaBoy4Life said:


> hahaha wow randy orton is such a failure. all that wasted time pushing him, handing him titles and curtis freaking axel is a better draw.


To be fair, he spent 6 or so months doing nothing noteworthy which no doubt impacted the overall gain/loss numbers.


----------



## Born of Osiris

I thought Punk would be alot lower in the list. He may not be drawing like Cena and the part-timer but he isn't drawing like a jobber either. Daniel Bryan seems a little low but he just started his(what was supposed to be) big push at SummerSlam and we all knew how that turned put.

Orton has never been a huge draw but the way they booked him was just awful. Fans did not give one shit about Show and Cena. He should have at least fueded with Punk.


----------



## superuser1

CenaBoy4Life said:


> hahaha wow randy orton is such a failure. all that wasted time pushing him, handing him titles and curtis freaking axel is a better draw.


Orton was stuck in the midcard doing nothing for most of the year till he cashed in his mitb. You guys seem to forget that.


----------



## LilOlMe

Oh, so we have to respond to this like it's a serious thing. Ok. Everyone on that list was involved in the big storylines, hence the Vickie & Maddox gains. Does this really have to be explained?

Same applies to Axel, as most of his appearances during this time were either with Cena, HHH, or the Punk/Heyman storyline.

As has been noted, Orton was not involved in anything major until late August. Even, then, from what I remember, they still had him wrestling random, unannounced, matches against the likes of Christian in the middle of an hour.

I don't even care about AJ, but the fact that this list makes her look like a loser, shows you how just looking at a graphic doesn't tell a whole story. No shit she'd be one of the "biggest losers" when doing nothing in random matches and time slots (similarly to Orton for much of the year). Put her in there in the main storylines at the good time spots, and it'd be a different story. 

Or as the poster says themselves:


> This is clearly an imperfect science. It covers weeks with strong competition on television to weeks with little competition on television. It covers time-periods where you may be pushing a wrestlers as a main-event title contenders during one month and pushing them a comedy tag team goofball during a different time period.


Anything to keep up 'dem mark wars, though!

Shouldn't even be bothering to respond seriously, because I remember when everyone would shit on Punk for shit ratings when he wasn't really doing anything interesting, but then they'd look retarded when the ratings for the Heyman storyline came out. Wash, rinse, repeat.





superuser1 said:


> Orton was stuck in the midcard doing nothing for most of the year till he cashed in his mitb. You guys seem to forget that.


They don't forget, they'd just rather stick to the true spirit of this thread. You know what that is.


----------



## funnyfaces1

DAT :jpl :vince3 :cena :henry1 :heyman2 :brock and now after two years, unk4 can join the fray. Look at him carrying Smackdown to record highs. Oh man, I'm shedding a tear.

:lmao at :batista3


----------



## Your_Solution

KuroNeko said:


> I thought Punk would be alot lower in the list. He may not be drawing like Cena and the part-timer but he isn't drawing like a jobber either. Daniel Bryan seems a little low but he just started his(what was supposed to be) big push at SummerSlam and we all knew how that turned put.
> 
> Orton has never been a huge draw but the way they booked him was just awful. Fans did not give one shit about Show and Cena. He should have at least fueded with Punk.


If you look at the ratings chart for after august, Bryan actually gains the most of anybody, which makes sense given that he's often the focus of the show even after he was taken out of the title scene

As for Orton, even after he becomes champion and starts being booked in more MEs he still draws terribly. Prior to SummerSlam you could make the claim he was languishing in midcard hell and so his low gains make sense, but since being champ he's still not carrying his weight. 

In his defense, even as champ they've booked him in the middle of the show a LOT for a champion. Which would seem to indicate they dont have faith in him to close shows consistently (like when Punk was champ and they booked him below Cena). Yet they DO have enough faith in him to have him as champ going into WM! So it's quite a bizarre situation. 

It's typically harder to draw as a heel than as a face. Lesnar/Heyman is obviously an exception. I would be curious to see how Punk's numbers changed when he turned heel, and again when he turned face.


----------



## LilOlMe

Your_Solution said:


> If you look at the ratings chart for after august, Bryan actually gains the most of anybody, which makes sense given that he's often the focus of the show even after he was taken out of the title scene


Good point.




















Goldust with 'dem Shield & Orton matches gains!


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

superuser1 said:


> Orton was stuck in the midcard doing nothing for most of the year till he cashed in his mitb. You guys seem to forget that.


So? He's pushed down the fans throats as a megastar, a top guy, the face of the wwe, what a star would look like if you created one and he doesn't draw shit and never will. If he was any of that he would have done better on the charts than fucking sheamus, axel, vickie, brad, big show and kane.

Orton has to be one of the most pushed, protected and failed wrestlers ever.


----------



## Happenstan

KuroNeko said:


> I thought Punk would be alot lower in the list. He may not be drawing like Cena and the part-timer but he isn't drawing like a jobber either. *Daniel Bryan seems a little low but he just started his(what was supposed to be) big push at SummerSlam and we all knew how that turned put.*
> 
> Orton has never been a huge draw but the way they booked him was just awful. Fans did not give one shit about Show and Cena. He should have at least fueded with Punk.


Daniel Bryan is number 1 with a bullet if you just count from SS until the end of the year when he got most of his push. Hell Nov/Dec he was in a feud with the Wyatt Clan and still popped them numbers.


----------



## napalmdestruction

Happenstan said:


> Daniel Bryan is number 1 with a bullet if you just count from SS until the end of the year when he got most of his push. Hell Nov/Dec he was in a feud with the Wyatt Clan and still popped them numbers.


So what is it then? This information clearly contradicts all this burying nonsense I keep hearing about him. He's always put in the good timeslots and has been closing the show for I don't know how long.

I don't know what more could have been done. Maybe he would draw more if he had beat Cena clean. Oh wait, nevermind...


----------



## Fissiks

napalmdestruction said:


> So what is it then? This information clearly contradicts all this burying nonsense I keep hearing about him. He's always put in the good timeslots and has been closing the show for I don't know how long.
> 
> I don't know what more could have been done. Maybe he would draw more if he had beat Cena clean. Oh wait, nevermind...


he is drawing that's the point...but Vince doesn't want to give Bryan the keys to the kingdom because he doesn't fit Vince's "mold"


----------



## #Mark

napalmdestruction said:


> So what is it then? This information clearly contradicts all this burying nonsense I keep hearing about him. He's always put in the good timeslots and has been closing the show for I don't know how long.
> 
> I don't know what more could have been done. Maybe he would draw more if he had beat Cena clean. Oh wait, nevermind...


Bryan's the biggest ratings gainer since October. Try harder.


----------



## napalmdestruction

#Mark said:


> Bryan's the biggest ratings gainer since October. Try harder.


And why do you think that is? Because he's always being featured in the important segments, in those favorable timeslots. And you still keep bitching and whining that Bryan is getting buried and WWE is keeping him down.

Everyone can gain ratings in those time slots. If he had huge increases (800,000 or more) constantly then he would be a draw for sure but anyone can gain 400,000 and 500,000 in those spots. Go back and look at the numbers from the Capitol Punishment Raw shows. Even R-Truth is doing those numbers.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Bryan has since August been placed in high level matches, for the most part. Why? They saw his massive popularity and used it to try and get the Authority over, then Orton as heel, and finally The Wyatts. They did all this but never gave him the spot that fans desperately wanted him in. Good news, if Punk is really gone, Bryan will smash through that glass ceiling because WWE cant afford not to it. The Punk/Bryan mark wars are over and The Yes Movement won.


----------



## Meki

CYC said:


> :rock :cena2 :brock :HHH2
> 
> 
> Naomi bringing dem down :ti


naomi can go down on me anytime she wants :yum:


----------



## validreasoning

napalmdestruction said:


> Everyone can gain ratings in those time slots. If he had huge increases (800,000 or more) constantly then he would be a draw for sure but anyone can gain 400,000 and 500,000 in those spots. Go back and look at the numbers from the Capitol Punishment Raw shows. Even R-Truth is doing those numbers.


every over-run truth was involved in also had cena in a match situation and one had austin as a ref and another one was the night of punks pipebomb. bryans was doing cena-like over-run numbers with reigns, ambrose, orton after summerslam.


----------



## superuser1

Your_Solution said:


> \
> As for Orton, even after he becomes champion and starts being booked in more MEs he still draws terribly. Prior to SummerSlam you could make the claim he was languishing in midcard hell and so his low gains make sense, but since being champ he's still not carrying his weight.
> 
> In his defense, even as champ they've booked him in the middle of the show a LOT for a champion. Which would seem to indicate they dont have faith in him to close shows consistently (like when Punk was champ and they booked him below Cena). Yet they DO have enough faith in him to have him as champ going into WM! So it's quite a bizarre situation.


Orton has definitely drawn since becoming champion. I would go back and find the numbers but that'll be to much work. I mean he was even able to draw against Kofi. He has always been a draw when he is a heel.


----------



## superuser1

CenaBoy4Life said:


> So? He's pushed down the fans throats as a megastar, a top guy, the face of the wwe, what a star would look like if you created one and he doesn't draw shit and never will. If he was any of that he would have done better on the charts than fucking sheamus, axel, vickie, brad, big show and kane.
> 
> Orton has to be one of the most pushed, protected and failed wrestlers ever.


How the hell you're suppose to draw being in the midcard facing the likes of Ziggler every damn week in a random match? Tbh I'm even surprised he made it to the Biggest Gainers column because he did jack shit up until he cashed in and won the title.


----------



## funnyfaces1

I think people seem to forget that in the past, these huge 1 mill viewership gains that people are expecting from main eventers were a rarity even more so than now. Bryan is doing more than fine.


----------



## #Mark

napalmdestruction said:


> And why do you think that is? Because he's always being featured in the important segments, in those favorable timeslots. And you still keep bitching and whining that Bryan is getting buried and WWE is keeping him down.
> 
> Everyone can gain ratings in those time slots. If he had huge increases (800,000 or more) constantly then he would be a draw for sure but anyone can gain 400,000 and 500,000 in those spots. Go back and look at the numbers from the Capitol Punishment Raw shows. Even R-Truth is doing those numbers.


You do realize that Bryan's "push" took place during Football season with Cena on the shelf. The very fact that he was the biggest gainer says all you need to know.


----------



## D.M.N.

From PWTorch's comments section:

01/27 WWE Raw A18-49 ratings: 8:00: 2,150,000 viewers (1.69 rtg), 9:00: 2,113,000 (1.66), 10:00-11:06: 2,034,000 (1.60)


----------



## JY57

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_75981.shtml#.UulNUdHTnIU



> For the first time since 2009, the post-Royal Rumble edition of Raw declined in TV ratings and viewership compared to the Rumble lead-in.
> 
> The 2009 season featured Vince McMahon returning to TV the week before the Rumble. Five years later, Batista returned to WWE TV the week before the Rumble, impacting the post-Rumble Raw's performance.
> 
> Overall, Monday's Raw scored the lowest rating and averaged the fewest viewers for a post-Rumble Raw over the past eight years...
> 
> 1/29/07 Raw: 4.17 rating (+3.2% previous week), 5.45 million viewers (-3.1% previous week)
> 
> 1/28/08 Raw: 3.87 rating (+9.4%), 5.71 million viewers (+16.7%)
> 
> 1/26/09 Raw: 3.60 rating (-6.9%), 5.17 million viewers (-9.9%)
> 
> 2/1/10 Raw: 3.63 rating (+1.1%), 5.29 million viewers (+2.9%)
> 
> 1/31/11 Raw: 3.48 rating (+5.8%), 5.28 million viewers (+7.8%)
> 
> 1/30/12 Raw: 3.55 rating (+11.6%), 5.22 million viewers (+13.1%)
> 
> 1/28/13 Raw: 3.68 rating (+21.5%), 5.02 million viewers (+16.3%)
> 
> 1/27/14 Raw: 3.24 rating (-6.4%), 4.72 million viewers (-3.1%)
> 
> * Note: The Jan. 26, 2009 Raw followed a big Vince McMahon return angle on the Jan. 19, 2009 Raw, contributing to why the 2009 rating and viewership was down.
> 
> * Note: The Jan. 27, 2014 Raw followed a big Batista return angle on the Jan. 20, 2014 Raw, contributing to why the 2014 rating and viewership was down.


numbers of past post-rumble raws


----------



## Happenstan

JY57 said:


> http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_75981.shtml#.UulNUdHTnIU
> 
> 
> 
> numbers of past post-rumble raws


"But Tista draws 5 million viewers minimum all the time."


----------



## Banjo

Daniel Bryan got all the attention in the opening segment and was featured in the main event. That's why ratings went down. More proof why you cannot build around Bryan as a top star


----------



## D.M.N.

1/29/07 Raw: 4.17 rating (+3.2% previous week), 5.45 million viewers (-3.1% previous week)
1/28/08 Raw: 3.87 rating (+9.4%), 5.71 million viewers (+16.7%) > Cena wins Rumble
1/26/09 Raw: 3.60 rating (-6.9%), 5.17 million viewers (-9.9%) > Orton wins Rumble
2/1/10 Raw: 3.63 rating (+1.1%), 5.29 million viewers (+2.9%) > Sheamus wins Rumble
1/31/11 Raw: 3.48 rating (+5.8%), 5.28 million viewers (+7.8%) > del Rio wins Rumble
1/30/12 Raw: 3.55 rating (+11.6%), 5.22 million viewers (+13.1%) > John Laurinaitis job evaluation/Undertaker return
1/28/13 Raw: 3.68 rating (+21.5%), 5.02 million viewers (+16.3%) > Rock wins title
1/27/14 Raw: 3.24 rating (-6.4%), 4.72 million viewers (-3.1%) > Batista wins; shitstorm

Conclusion: People don't like Evolution members winning Rumble matches.


----------



## MaybeLock

Lol at Batista draws.


----------



## Oakue

It is interesting that 4 of the top 5 biggest losers are "Total Divas". I won't argue the show isn't popular, because it is, but is that popularity overrated I wonder? In other words because the E network is content with the ratings, the WWE machine then hyped it up as he biggest success ever, and the reality is, it's just an okay success. I don't know. I guess time will tell.


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

why isn't Swagger on that chart?


----------



## The Caped Crusader

MaybeLock said:


> Lol at Batista draws.


I know right. Remember those smurfs last week? They brought in over 5 million viewers. They should have them come back.


----------



## napalmdestruction

validreasoning said:


> every over-run truth was involved in also had cena in a match situation and one had austin as a ref and another one was the night of punks pipebomb. bryans was doing cena-like over-run numbers with reigns, ambrose, orton after summerslam.


How is that possible if I heard Dave Meltzer say it with my own ears that Bryan never drew ratings, his merch doesn't sell that well and his house shows also draw less than Cena's and Orton's.

If Daniel Bryan did draw big ratings he would have become full-time WWE champion and WWE wouldn't have hotshot the title unification angle with Cena.


----------



## Lazyking

When do the quarter hour ratings come out? I don't care much about ratings, just curious.


----------



## Happenstan

napalmdestruction said:


> *How is that possible if I heard Dave Meltzer say it with my own ears that Bryan never drew ratings*, his merch doesn't sell that well and his house shows also draw less than Cena's and Orton's.
> 
> If Daniel Bryan did draw big ratings he would have become full-time WWE champion and WWE wouldn't have hotshot the title unification angle with Cena.


Then get your hearing checked. Meltzer said Punk/Bryan isn't selling more tickets than the Orton/Cena house show set so there is no reason to change things up. Please post a clip of Meltzer saying Bryan doesn't get any ratings. Don't worry, I'll wait.


----------



## #Mark

napalmdestruction said:


> How is that possible if I heard Dave Meltzer say it with my own ears that Bryan never drew ratings, his merch doesn't sell that well and his house shows also draw less than Cena's and Orton's.
> 
> If Daniel Bryan did draw big ratings he would have become full-time WWE champion and WWE wouldn't have hotshot the title unification angle with Cena.


Bryan had the second highest overrun of the year (second to the Rock) in a match with Rollins. His run from August to November was a huge ratings success.. WWE just didn't want to be forced into making him a star. Plus, your whole argument is moot when Orton is the current champion and MEing Mania. Bryan has proven to be just as big or a bigger draw than him in less than six months (not a knock on RKO just the reality of the situation).


----------



## Redzero

LOL at Fucktista ratings.


----------



## The_Workout_Buddy

Meanwhile a man called Dwayne Johnson is laughin his ass off...


----------



## CJohn3:16

That hurts. Not even over 5 million people. WWE needs to get his shit together because ratings are dropping badly.


----------



## JamesK

Big Dave brings the ratings.. :lmao :lmao


----------



## validreasoning

napalmdestruction said:


> How is that possible if I heard Dave Meltzer say it with my own ears that Bryan never drew ratings, his merch doesn't sell that well and his house shows also draw less than Cena's and Orton's.


the over-run numbers meltzer himself reported at the time

august 19th The big angle in the main event slot with the McMahons, Randy Orton, Daniel Bryan, the long HHH promo and The Shield all involved gained about 670,000 viewers to a 3.6 rating

august 26th Daniel Bryan’s Gauntlet against The Shield and his being laid out gained 1,092,000 viewers to a 3.7 quarter

September 2nd Big Show vs. Daniel Bryan in the main event gained 550,000 viewers to a 3.3 quarter

September 9th Daniel Bryan vs. Dean Ambrose main event gained 760,000 viewers.

September 16th Daniel Bryan vs. Roman Reigns main event gained 580,000 viewers

Septemer 23rd The 11-on-3 main event gained 492,000 viewers. 

September 30th The Daniel Bryan/Orton brawl during the overrun gained 689,000 viewers

October 7th Bryan & Rhodes vs. The Shield in the main event gained 430,000 viewers.

October 14th N/A

October 21st The Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan contract signing gained 454,000 viewers.



The_Workout_Buddy said:


> Meanwhile a man called Dwayne Johnson is laughin his ass off...


to be fair the difference between last year and this years post rumble raws was just 300,000 viewers and thats with rock winning his first title in 11.5 years and no title change sunday night.


----------



## FITZ

napalmdestruction said:


> How is that possible if I heard Dave Meltzer say it with my own ears that Bryan never drew ratings, his merch doesn't sell that well and his house shows also draw less than Cena's and Orton's.
> 
> If Daniel Bryan did draw big ratings he would have become full-time WWE champion and WWE wouldn't have hotshot the title unification angle with Cena.


In regards to the house shows I think Bryan and Punk were working in the smaller markets. I know I had a house show with Bryan and Punk and it took place in Glens Falls, NY while Cena/Orton were in Buffalo. Buffalo probably did draw more but Buffalo is a MUCH bigger market than Glens Falls.


----------



## Londrick

I guess that confirms that last week was cause of Bryan turning on the Wyatts the week before. Batista winning the rumble killed the ratings.


----------



## JC00

The Batista marks have suddenly become real quiet


----------



## The Caped Crusader

JC00 said:


> The Batista marks have suddenly become real quiet


Quiet about what? If The Rock couldn't sustain 5+ million viewers, Batista wasn't going to. The fact that his return popped the rating is all that needed to be said for people who were claiming his return doesn't matter. It's up to WWE to handle things beyond that though and it was clear from the segment last week, they didn't know what they were doing. They haven't given his return more thought than 'I'm back, I want title, I want Wrestlemania headline'.


----------



## JC00

The Caped Crusader said:


> Quiet about what? If The Rock couldn't sustain 5+ million viewers, Batista wasn't going to. The fact that his return popped the rating is all that needed to be said for people who were claiming his return doesn't matter. It's up to WWE to handle things beyond that though and it was clear from the segment last week, they didn't know what they were doing. They haven't given his return more thought than 'I'm back, I want title, I want Wrestlemania headline'.


A Batista mark says what?


----------



## BOOTS 2 ASSES

Just one week's ratings is too early to judge someone's drawing power. Let us give some time to Batista, before writing him off.


----------



## DanM3

Lol at the ratings. Well done Batista! 

I'm sure next week ratings will go up. WWE will say its because of Batista we know it's because of cm punk


----------



## Kamaria

napalmdestruction said:


> How is that possible if I heard Dave Meltzer say it with my own ears that Bryan never drew ratings, his merch doesn't sell that well and his house shows also draw less than Cena's and Orton's.
> 
> If Daniel Bryan did draw big ratings he would have become full-time WWE champion and WWE wouldn't have hotshot the title unification angle with Cena.


If that's true the only reason he doesn't because he hasn't been pushed with the full backing of the company. Cena and Orton are more established, they're more recognizable to the average guy as top talent. Daniel Bryan IS over, but statistically he's not going to pull the same numbers as top talent until they take a chance on him.


----------



## superuser1

No ratings breakdown for this week same shit next week ratings comeout marks give their guy all the credit and then the thread dies down till the following week. It's what you call a reverse cycle.


----------



## Starbuck

superuser1 said:


> No ratings breakdown for this week same shit next week ratings comeout marks give their guy all the credit and then the thread dies down till the following week. It's what you call a reverse cycle.


Here you go:

HHH/Steph/Bryan Opener or Orton/Brock/Batista seg is likely to be the highest on the show. The third hour experienced a big dip and then rebounded for the main event, gaining steadily until they hit the overrun which had a big gain for SuperFriends/Shield.

That's likely what it was going to say lol.


----------



## Vyer

Starbuck said:


> Here you go:
> 
> HHH/Steph/Bryan Opener or Orton/Brock/Batista seg is likely to be the highest on the show. The third hour experienced a big dip and then rebounded for the main event, gaining steadily until they hit the overrun which had a big gain for *SuperFriends/*Shield.
> 
> That's likely what it was going to say lol.


Justice League. Come on Starbuck. Get with the times.


----------



## MaybeLock

With no breakdowns we can blame everyone we want for the ratings. Yay! 8*D

Oh wait, we did it anyways.


----------



## D.M.N.

In lieu of a breakdown, here are the most watched segments from last Monday's Raw on WWE's YouTube channel:

- 355k - Main Event
- 171k - Opening Segment(Daniel Bryan and The Authority)
- 148k - Main Event Set-Up
- 124k - Rhodes/New Age Outlaws
- 108k - Divas' match
- 83k - Ziggler/Miz
- 76k - Mysterio/Cara vs Real Americans
- 68k - Usos vs Ryback/Axel
- 66k - Kingston/del Rio
- 40k - Truth/Fandango
- 40k - Bad News Barrett segment

As far as I can see the Lesnar/Batista/Orton segment wasn't uploaded oddly.


----------



## JY57

> WWE Smackdown on Friday, January 31 scored a 2.18 rating, up slightly from a 2.15 rating last week and 2.11 rating the week before.
> 
> The post-Royal Rumble edition of Smackdown hit the highest point in over one year. This dates back to a 2.20 rating in January 2013. It was the second-highest rating in two years dating back to the same 2.18 rating in January 2012.
> 
> Smackdown drew an audience of 3.027 million viewers, which was nearly identical to an audience of 3.029 million viewers last week.
> 
> It was the first time that back-to-back Smackdowns topped three million viewers in two years dating back to February 2012 when The Rock's boat raised the water level.
> 
> - On cable TV Friday night, Smackdown ranked #3 in overall viewers, #7 in males 18-34, and #5 in males 18-49 on an apparently competitive night.
> 
> The week-to-week demographic ratings were nearly identical to last week. The only significant change was a one-tenth decline in the adult 18-49 demo.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: Christian's WWE TV return was the main hook for Smackdown, so that was probably a cherry on top for overall strong interest in the product right now, even if people loathe the current direction coming out of the Rumble. There's a sense of people will watch to see the product get better, especially if their favorites are featured more prominently.


via PWTorch


----------



## funnyfaces1

Christian the draw! We need a smiley of his.


----------



## D.M.N.

8pm - 4.428m
9pm - 4.221m
10pm - 3.983m

Disaster all around.

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...dies-teen-wolf-switched-at-birth-more/234317/

Otherwise known as 'how to flush 1.5 million viewers down the toilet in two weeks'.


----------



## Your_Solution

:cena5 unk


----------



## validreasoning

Very similar to the feb 11 episode last year and that show had the rock

8pm 4.350 million 
9pm 4.248 million 
10pm 4.178 million


----------



## superuser1

D.M.N. said:


> 8pm - 4.428m
> 9pm - 4.221m
> 10pm - 3.983m
> 
> Disaster all around.
> 
> http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...dies-teen-wolf-switched-at-birth-more/234317/
> 
> Otherwise known as 'how to flush 1.5 million viewers down the toilet in two weeks'.


Lol here we go no breakdown so let the SPECULATIONS BEGINNNNNN!


----------



## Happenstan

D.M.N. said:


> 8pm - 4.428m
> 9pm - 4.221m
> 10pm - 3.983m
> 
> Disaster all around.
> 
> http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...dies-teen-wolf-switched-at-birth-more/234317/
> 
> Otherwise known as 'how to flush 1.5 million viewers down the toilet in two weeks'.



No. Otherwise known as "Not a pre or post Royal Rumble Raw."




validreasoning said:


> Very similar to the feb 11 episode last year and that show had the rock
> 
> 8pm 4.350 million
> 9pm 4.248 million
> 10pm 4.178 million


"Last nights show did as well as last year WITH THE ROCK?!?! But that means we can't blame poor ratings on the absence of Ski Em Punker."


----------



## Waffelz

Batista was on the top of the third hour and there was the diva match and then the 1000th Bryan-Orton match. 

No surprise to see it fail.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Waffelz said:


> Batista was on the top of the third hour and there was the diva match and then the 1000th Bryan-Orton match.
> 
> No surprise to see it fail.


You forgot the Wyatts match also. Cena, Brock, and Punk, for whatever reason, all missed the show. There was a definite lack of star power overall.


----------



## Da MastaMind

unk5


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

lol at hour 3. Nice work Bryan and Orton. That third hour is what happens when there's no Cena and Punk.


----------



## FITZ

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> lol at hour 3. Nice work Bryan and Orton. That third hour is what happens when there's no Cena and Punk.


Isn't the third hour usually the lowest hour anyway?


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

TaylorFitz said:


> Isn't the third hour usually the lowest hour anyway?



It always is. Plus, I cant remember when Punk has appeared in hour 3, so his absence meant squat for that hour.


----------



## NastyYaffa

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> lol at hour 3. Nice work Bryan and Orton. That third hour is what happens when there's no Cena and Punk.


I am pretty sure that even if Punk would've been there, it would have not done any better. Stop being a blind mark, lolol.


----------



## superuser1

Waffelz said:


> Batista was on the top of the third hour and there was the diva match and then the 1000th Bryan-Orton match.
> 
> No surprise to see it fail.


I could almost gaurantee the Bryan/Orton match did good numbers. The third hour has always been the lowest for months now.


----------



## Happenstan

superuser1 said:


> I could almost gaurantee the Bryan/Orton match did good numbers. The third hour has always been the lowest for months now.


Yep. Fatigue sets in, plus when you cater to a kiddie audience you can't stay on past their bed time.


----------



## The_Workout_Buddy

WWE can have Stone Cold in the 1st hour, Hogan and Cena in the second hour, and The Rock returning in the third hour, still the ratings will be the same, only people who are watching the product now are the lifelong fans of the company, so the number does not abruptly increased or decreased from week to week.

WWE knows this, thats why they are moving all of it's eggs in the WWE NETWORK nest.


----------



## Fissiks

D.M.N. said:


> 8pm - 4.428m
> 9pm - 4.221m
> 10pm - 3.983m
> 
> Disaster all around.
> 
> http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...dies-teen-wolf-switched-at-birth-more/234317/
> 
> Otherwise known as 'how to flush 1.5 million viewers down the toilet in two weeks'.


wow i thought the CM Punk drama would have pop the ratings a bit more.


----------



## RatedR10

The third hour always sucks anyways in terms of numbers. Bryan said it best, people are exhausted by then after the two hours before it. 

I want to see a breakdown but it doesn't seem we'll get one.


----------



## TheStig

Ouch at the third hour going under 4 mill. Gonna be interesting to see if next weeks ratings drops further because right now they dont have a hook in to next weeks raw and besides bryan/orton thers not much going on.


----------



## Dec_619

Happenstan said:


> Yep. Fatigue sets in, plus when you cater to a kiddie audience you can't stay on past their bed time.


Pretty much this.


----------



## Arrogant Mog

Expecting good numbers :mark:


----------



## Superhippy

So they lost about 10 to 11 percent of their viewers in a week. Sounds about right to me. Between Batista's return being a mega-flop and Punks absence, the Raw is going to have some of the worst Road to Wrestlemania ratings ever. If Bryan were to get hurt they would be so fucked.


----------



## TheStig

validreasoning said:


> Very similar to the feb 11 episode last year and that show had the rock
> 
> 8pm 4.350 million
> 9pm 4.248 million
> 10pm 4.178 million


"Also, one year ago this week, Raw scored a 3.56 rating for the second Raw after the Rumble PPV." PWTORCH 
So from the looks of it it might even get worse next week.

EDIT: Might add that this week got 3.15 ratings


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

#Save.Us_Punk


----------



## JAROTO

So Bryan is going to be blamed for this?


----------



## superuser1

JAROTO said:


> So Bryan is going to be blamed for this?


You're not hip to this game? With no breakdown coming out anymore you blame who you want and give the credit to who you want.


----------



## JY57

final rating - 3.15


----------



## JY57

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_76132.shtml#.UvGKz9GPLIU



> WWE Raw on Monday, February 3 scored a 3.15 rating, down from a 3.24 rating for the post-Royal Rumble episode of Raw. Raw was also down from a 3.46 rating for Batista's return and follow-up on Daniel Bryan's face turn two weeks ago.
> 
> WWE should be building momentum coming out of the Rumble heading into WrestleMania Season, but Raw was at the level of the previous "in-between PPVs" maintenance show on January 13, which scored a 3.12 rating.
> 
> Also, one year ago this week, Raw scored a 3.56 rating for the second Raw after the Rumble PPV.
> 
> - Raw's audience was 4.210 million viewers, down ten percent from 4.718 million viewers last week. It was the fewest viewers of the year.
> 
> Hourly Break Down: 4.428 million viewers in the first hour (viewers counted as individuals who watched at least six minutes of the hour), 4.221 million second hour viewers, and a drop to 3.983 million third hour viewers.
> 
> It was the first time in 2014 that the third hour drew fewer than four million viewers.
> 
> The hourly pattern continued a six-hour viewership decline.
> 
> 1/27 Hour 1 - 4.849 million viewers
> 1/27 Hour 2 - 4.837 million viewers
> 1/27 Hour 3 - 4.470 million viewers
> 2/3 Hour 1 - 4.428 million viewers
> 2/3 Hour 2 - 4.221 million viewers
> 2/3 Hour 3 - 3.983 million viewers
> 
> - On cable TV Monday night, Raw ranked #1 in overall viewers and in the key male demos. However, the week-to-week picture was not good.
> 
> Raw was down two-tenths of a rating in adults 18-49, three-tenths in males 18-49, and two-tenths in males 12-34.
> 
> *Caldwell's Analysis:* There are any number of factors to consider when looking at this decline. One is the absence of a big name returning to the fold a la The Rock in recent years. Another is fan frustration/anger turning into tune-out. Another is the absence of top star John Cena. Another is a significant amount of casual/irregular viewers decided this was a skippable week. Another is general lack of interest in the current product right now, especially without a clear WrestleMania Match being built to outside of Randy Orton vs. Batista. Another is the show was complete maintenance bordering on three hours of filler, which assuredly hurt the third hour. Another is WWE has presented Daniel Bryan vs. Randy Orton so many times - even asking $165 + tax to see it on PPV last year - that it's not a special main event anymore. The reasons are numerous. So, it will be interesting to see if WWE comes up with a better effort next week.


----------



## Arrogant Mog

Batista v Bryan :mark:


----------



## Choke2Death

JY57 said:


> final rating - 3.15


Not horrible and certainly better than a 2 but tbf, this is the Road to WM. Still, there was nothing really to keep the viewers and it could've been worse. Wont be surprised if the main event does well just like the last time they had the match after TLC. It looked like it did weak numbers but turned out it did great and it was some jobber squash match or two preceding it that ruined the numbers.


----------



## WWE

TaylorFitz said:


> Isn't the third hour usually the lowest hour anyway?





Best4Bidness said:


> It always is. Plus, I cant remember when Punk has appeared in hour 3, so his absence meant squat for that hour.





Happenstan said:


> Yep. Fatigue sets in, plus when you cater to a kiddie audience you can't stay on past their bed time.


How come you people don't say this when Bryan isn't in the main event?


Holy shit....


----------



## Happenstan

CYC said:


> How come you people don't say this when Bryan isn't in the main event?
> 
> 
> Holy shit....


Say what? That the third hour routinely does the worst because the show is so long? I have, many times.


----------



## P.H. Hatecraft

CYC said:


> How come you people don't say this when Bryan isn't in the main event?
> 
> 
> Holy shit....


No need to because people like you usually do not raise a ruckus trying to falsely discredit Cena, Shield or Punk.


----------



## #Mark

CYC said:


> How come you people don't say this when Bryan isn't in the main event?
> 
> 
> Holy shit....


Same can be said with you and Cena's recent terrible quarter hours.


----------



## Reaper

Interesting, no mention of Punk causing a drop in ratings. I would guess that that also contributed to the drop-off. 

I agree with Bryan/Orton not pulling in ratings. That match is no longer a draw. At this point no matter how over Bryan is, the overall product is seriously suffering. My guess is that on the night of the Rumble, a lot of people just decided to tune and probably took it as a final nail in the coffin. Even I haven't been as motivated to watch the WWE since having skipped Smackdown completely (first show skipped since April 2013) as well as watched only about 40-45 minutes of Raw. 

For me, it's a matter of trust now. Thrusting Bryan back into the main event is not enough anymore because of the fact that I don't trust them to do it justice.


----------



## Bfo4jd

> Interesting, no mention of Punk causing a drop in ratings.


That's because most punk marks, including Wade keller were predicting a big increase in RAW rating due to the internet buzz following Punk's walk out. Obviously never happened, now they just keeping quiet or blaming batista which they were going to do regardless. I recall somebody's post in the Punk discussion thread about how the numbers are going to go up because of punk situation, but WWE is gonna credit Batista instead of Punk and how unfair that would be. :lol


Anyways, No big deal. Numbers are usually down at this time of year before chamber PPV. You can check it out yourselves. Last year, same time Feb 11th 2013 RAW scored a rating of 3.1 which was down from 3.56 - http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_68600.shtml#.UvIqFGKSy3Q

The year before rating fell below 3.0 -
http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_58122.shtml#.UvIqGmKSy3Q

Once chamber PPV ends and the big feuds officially begin with the return of top stars, rating would obviously rise.


----------



## Bob the Jobber

Reaper Jones said:


> Interesting, no mention of Punk causing a drop in ratings. I would guess that that also contributed to the drop-off.
> 
> I agree with Bryan/Orton not pulling in ratings. That match is no longer a draw. At this point no matter how over Bryan is, the overall product is seriously suffering. My guess is that on the night of the Rumble, a lot of people just decided to tune and probably took it as a final nail in the coffin. Even I haven't been as motivated to watch the WWE since having skipped Smackdown completely (first show skipped since April 2013) as well as watched only about 40-45 minutes of Raw.
> 
> For me, it's a matter of trust now. Thrusting Bryan back into the main event is not enough anymore because of the fact that I don't trust them to do it justice.


I doubt Punk's leaving had much impact, not because I doubt there's a ton of Punk fans but there is a lot of overlap with them being fans of other guys as well -- Bryan, Cesaro, Bray, etc. They also had more reason to tune in just to see if it was (a) a work or (b) how they handle the situation.

I agree with your last point in that a lot of Bryan fans just believe this mini-Bryan push is just lip service to quell the hijacking chants more than an actual belief in him from the backstage office. 

Also, there was absolutely zero build going into a big WM program on RAW this week. Batista/ADR? Not part of WM program. Orton/Bryan? Likely not part of WM program. No Taker. No Lesnar. SHIELD split is the only real lead up.


----------



## #Mark

I also agree that Orton/Bryan likely didn't do well. They've done that match so many times the past six months and each time ended with Bryan being screwed in some capacity. Why should anyone expect something different?


----------



## Reaper

#Mark said:


> I also agree that Orton/Bryan likely didn't do well. They've done that match so many times the past six months and each time ended with Bryan being screwed in some capacity. Why should anyone expect something different?


Exactly. WWE has lost the fan's trust. It was something that had started happening around HIAC and completely lost it at the Rumble. Doesn't mean that guys on the roster aren't draws, it just means that people have genuinely tuned out only because of their booking.


----------



## Arrogant Mog

Reaper Jones said:


> Exactly. WWE has lost the fan's trust. It was something that had started happening around HIAC and completely lost it at the Rumble. Doesn't mean that guys on the roster aren't draws, it just means that people have genuinely tuned out only because of their booking.


Don't agree with that personally, you don't know that.

I agree that they've had the same rematch's for the past few months, but I was looking forward to it regardless


----------



## WWE

#Mark said:


> Same can be said with you and Cena's recent terrible quarter hours.


Same can't be said with me because I don't normally post here anymore unk2


----------



## D.M.N.

A look at how many households have watched Raw this week historically:

04/02/02 - 3.81 million households / 4.49 rating
03/02/03 - 2.94 million households / 3.40 rating
02/02/04 - 3.24 million households / 3.70 rating
07/02/05 - 3.31 million households / 3.70 rating
06/02/06 - 4.00 million households / 4.45 rating
05/02/07 - 3.76 million households / 4.10 rating
04/02/08 - 3.45 million households / 3.59 rating
02/02/09 - 3.53 million households / 3.59 rating
08/02/10 - 3.50 million households / 3.59 rating
07/02/11 - 3.31 million households / 3.30 rating
06/02/12 - 3.27 million households / 3.25 rating
04/02/13 - 3.52 million households / 3.54 rating
03/02/14 - 3.11 million households / 3.15 rating

Historically, the lowest since 2003. Three years stand out there for this week:

- 2002 (coming off the Attitude Era)
- 2006 (Edge bringing back a lot of viewers around this time period)
- 2007 (Trump vs McMahon storyline)

Doing a lot more analysis which may result in some interesting discussion on here, and mark wars as per!


----------



## Waffelz

Why did 2003 do awful?


----------



## JY57

Waffelz said:


> Why did 2003 do awful?


all the good stuff was on Smackdown back then


----------



## The_Workout_Buddy

Waffelz said:


> Why did 2003 do awful?


Triple H's reign of terror, WCW washed up acts being the contenders, the so promoted "Next Big Thing" (aka face of the company) being on SmackDown.


----------



## Kamaria

People aren't watching because Orton in champion, IMO.


----------



## Jakall

There's nothing happening right now to watch that's why no one is watching. Its been difficult for some hardcore fans to stomach, can't expect casuals to tune in.

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

D.M.N. said:


> A look at how many households have watched Raw this week historically:
> 
> 04/02/02 - 3.81 million households / 4.49 rating
> 03/02/03 - 2.94 million households / 3.40 rating
> 02/02/04 - 3.24 million households / 3.70 rating
> 07/02/05 - 3.31 million households / 3.70 rating
> *06/02/06 - 4.00 million households / 4.45 rating*
> 05/02/07 - 3.76 million households / 4.10 rating
> 04/02/08 - 3.45 million households / 3.59 rating
> 02/02/09 - 3.53 million households / 3.59 rating
> 08/02/10 - 3.50 million households / 3.59 rating
> 07/02/11 - 3.31 million households / 3.30 rating
> 06/02/12 - 3.27 million households / 3.25 rating
> 04/02/13 - 3.52 million households / 3.54 rating
> 03/02/14 - 3.11 million households / 3.15 rating


DAT RATED R SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOPERSTAR!:edge


----------



## joeycalz

#BadNewsSanta said:


> DAT RATED R SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOPERSTAR!:edge


What's funny is in Triple H's promo three months ago, he said Jericho, Rob Van Dam and Edge didn't draw. I'm almost POSITIVE that the list given debunks all of that.


----------



## xdryza

joeycalz said:


> What's funny is in Triple H's promo three months ago, he said Jericho, Rob Van Dam and Edge didn't draw. I'm almost POSITIVE that the list given debunks all of that.


He wasn't a draw either, so his argument was invalid.


----------



## DAYM!

^ Have a look at the SS 2012 numbers and then 2013,11 SS numbers.

HHH wrestling = big numbers

HHH not wrestling = shitty numbers.


----------



## Fatcat

DAYM! said:


> ^ Have a look at the SS 2012 numbers and then 2013,11 SS numbers.
> 
> HHH wrestling = big numbers
> 
> HHH not wrestling = shitty numbers.


When Triple H was the top guy in 2003-05, the WWE was losing fans by the boatload. Attendance, TV viewership, and PPV buys all dropped off. It didn't start picking up again until Cena became the top guy in 05-06.


----------



## JY57

> Chris Harrington did a study on TV ratings by performers for the year. A few notes on this. The first is that the data used was from the Observer, which essentially means from January through August we had just about every show and the numbers were actuals. Over the next few months, we had sporadic and they were from a different source and were estimates, but it’s a different methodology and wasn’t exact. But as far as, on average, how many people are gained or lost based on this character’s segments, this is the top 20:
> 
> *1. The Rock: 335,698
> 
> 2. Brock Lesnar: 330,068
> 
> 3. John Cena: 328,401
> 
> 4. Paul Heyman: 317,531
> 
> 5. HHH: 259,420
> 
> 6. C.M. Punk: 246,534
> 
> 7. Stephanie McMahon: 242,841
> 
> 8. Vickie Guerrero: 234,359
> 
> 9. Vince McMahon: 203,475
> 
> 10. Brad Maddox: 168,819
> 
> 11. Seth Rollins: 167,388
> 
> 12. Roman Reigns: 166,202
> 
> 13. Big Show: 161,143
> 
> 14. Daniel Bryan: 155,341
> 
> 15. Dean Ambrose: 135,652
> 
> 16. Ryback: 91,294
> 
> 17. Curtis Axel: 59,699
> 
> 18. Kane: 48,198
> 
> 19. Sheamus: 40,064:
> 
> 20. Randy Orton: 36,305 *
> 
> A few notes on these numbers. There is an advantage in the sense those perceived as top draws are going to get the better segments, so it’s not perfect. Also, wrestlers are not isolated in the sense only one person is in a segment. Does Heyman, for example, benefit greatly here by the fact he worked with Lesnar and Punk all year? Of course. Rollins & Reigns were a tag team, and the only thing it showed is that Ambrose fares worse as U.S. champion than as part of the unit, hurting his average compared to the other two. I doubt anyone should be surprised by that. All the authority figures fare well because they are in the segments where they make big announcements, or are involved with top angles. Brad Maddox is not a bigger ratings draw than Daniel Bryan. Also, as part-time performers, it probably helps Rock and definitely helps Lesnar. The idea that Cena and Punk were the two most successful full-timers coincides with the idea that they were the two most pushed during that period.
> 
> For the bottom 20:
> 
> *1. Cameron: -496,714
> 
> 2. Layla: -486,500
> 
> 3. Aksana: -397,000
> 
> 4. Naomi: -389,417
> 
> 5. R-Truth: -322,143
> 
> 6. Brie Bella: -322,133
> 
> 7. Nikki Bella: -311,175
> 
> 8. Natalya: -299,300
> 
> 9. Alicia Fox: -234,875
> 
> 10. Christian: -208,000
> 
> 11. Usos: -205,417
> 
> 12. Kofi Kingston: -202,158
> 
> 13. Great Khali: -201,200
> 
> 14. Damien Sandow: -184,140
> 
> 15. Fandango: -175,640
> 
> 16. Santino Marella: -179,438
> 
> 17. Bray Wyatt: -171,225
> 
> 18. Zack Ryder: -152,643
> 
> 19. A.J. Lee: -152,838
> 
> 20. Erick Rowan: -142,250*


vi Dave Metzlr (through Chris Herington); top/bottom 20 through Jan-August 2013)

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/raw/973441-all-tv-ratings-talk-here-350.html (through November as previously posted)


----------



## Waffelz

Randy Orton - your "face" of the company. Hahahhahaha


----------



## LilOlMe

And this is why a billion dollar company doesn't rely on random internet posts with no real methodology.

But since we're going with that -- which also to their credit, they themselves stated that it was rather imperfect (read: silly), since it doesn't even take into account simpe things like competition, as far as what's on tv at a particular time (if this is the same thing that was posted earlier) -- take note that this was before Orton was in the title picture, and was doing nothing in random, nothing, time slots.

After August, he was toward the top of the gainers, as to be expected. Which makes it interesting that only the part until August was posted. 

The fact that people like Vickie and Maddox are up there, should be a pretty clear indication that it's about time slot and story lines, but we shall not let that get in the way how absolutely retarded this thread tends to be! It's tradition!

If anyone actually wants to work on real data, here's an idea. It'd be great for the lolz to see a cumulative post of all of the weeks of back-and-forth nonsense over the YEARS of these ratings threads. I'm talking about how one week someone goes from being a no draw, to people having to eat crow and stfu the next week, and vice versa. Yadda, yadda.


And btw, the most amusing/maddening part of all of these thousand and thousand pages of mark wars: No one _really_ DRAWS from this generation except for Cena and part-timers.


ETA: 
This is so stupid that it even has to even be continued to be entertained, but fine...:



LilOlMe said:


> Good point.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Goldust with 'dem Shield & Orton matches gains!


----------



## Arrogant Mog

JY57 said:


> vi Dave Metzlr (through Chris Herington); top/bottom 20 through Jan-August 2013)
> 
> http://www.wrestlingforum.com/raw/973441-all-tv-ratings-talk-here-350.html (through November as previously posted)


Good stuff


----------



## JY57

Metzler on Wrestling Observer Radio last night said (talked to WWE people and Ratings Insider) that Batista had the top rated segment this week along with the last two weeks.


----------



## superuser1

Waffelz said:


> Randy Orton - your "face" of the company. Hahahhahaha


January through August Orton was stuck in the midcard taking part in random matches.


----------



## D.M.N.

JY57 said:


> Metzler on Wrestling Observer Radio last night said (talked to WWE people and Ratings Insider) that Batista had the top rated segment this week along with the last two weeks.


Not a surprise considering his placement on the show.


----------



## Waffelz

superuser1 said:


> January through August Orton was stuck in the midcard taking part in random matches.


So was Bryan. So was Punk the second half of the year. So was The Shield...

Looked at John Cena, who apparently isn't a draw to some of you. Rock only gaining 10,000 more and he was there about ten times, same with Lesnar.


----------



## superuser1

Waffelz said:


> So was Bryan. So was Punk the second half of the year. So was The Shield...
> 
> Looked at John Cena, who apparently isn't a draw to some of you. Rock only gaining 10,000 more and he was there about ten times, same with Lesnar.


Bryan was a part of Team Hell No remember? They had a bunch of segments on Raw. CM Punk feuded with Rock and Undertaker don't forget his feud with Paul Heyman so what are you talking about? And The Shield had a strong push they hardly ever lost. While Orton wandered in the midcard doing nothing till he cashed in his MITB on Bryan.


----------



## DAYM!

@ fatcat

While I am not denying ratings and ppv buys were down when hhh was at the top BUT there was NOTHING good happening on raw back then, no big stars were there to support him and bussines was going downhill ever since vince bought wcw.

But look when he was in a fued with wrestlers of his calliber(yeah I know what are you thinking).

His numbers with rock in 2000 are amazing and the same with cena and batista as well.

And look DAT BIG DRAW with biggest gain after the special attractions :cena5 :vince2 :bigdave

9years running and still going strong #riseabovehate #riseabove heelturns.


----------



## Waffelz

Randy Orton got half a year in the Main Event, so did Punk. 

Punk was feuding with fucking Axel and Ryback until December until he moved onto The Shield.


----------



## Choke2Death

You must be really horrible at remembering things.

Orton was in the main event for FOUR months of the year. Can count it as five but he only became champion in the second half of August (can be subtracted with the ten final days of December when his screen time was about 2 minutes combined). Punk's feud with Axel/Ryback ended at Hell in a Cell (or the night after, if you will) which took place in October.


----------



## Waffelz

What happened in November? Either way, he wasn't in the Main Event. Five months, four months. He still isn't a draw. Fucking Kane, Ryback and Axel all outdrew him. Unlucky.


----------



## Redzero

LMFAO at Orton place.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

:lmao Orton.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Lol even if Orton only got in the ME 4 months ago, Axel got higher than him which is embarrassing.


----------



## InTheAirTonight

I thought the "fans" were already sick of part timers? I thought they wanted Bryan to main event Mania? Why do they want to watch The Animal instead?

:ti

Batista 3 #YESmovement 0


----------



## TheStig

Why doesnt the list include how many apperances they had? Would be a interesting thing.


----------



## El Capitan

I think those numbers would be a lot better for everyone if the show was still 2 hours long, there is far too much filler in a 3 hour show that you just start tuning at a certain point.


----------



## D.M.N.

No breakdown, so here's what people have been watching on WWE's official YouTube channel from last week's Raw:

- 429k - Batista/Del Rio segment
- 370k - Bryan vs Orton
- 249k - Marella vs Fandango (dance off)
- 216k - Rhodes Brothers vs New Age Outlaws
- 194k - Mysterio, Kingston and Langston vs The Shield
- 115k - Ryder vs O'Neil
- 114k - Sheamus vs Axel
- 107k - Ziggler, Truth and Woods vs Wyatt Family
- 94k - Christian vs Swagger
- 94k - Naomi vs Aksana
- 47k - Bad News Barrett segment


----------



## JY57

Smackdown was the most watched cable program for 18-49 adults last week.

The viewership was 3.201 million viewers (higher than last week which was 3.03 million viewers)


----------



## Starbuck

Dat Smackdown. 

Bryan, Shield, Wyatts, Orton and the general RTWM carrying the blue brand to 3 million+ viewers. Impressive.


----------



## Happenstan

D.M.N. said:


> No breakdown, so here's what people have been watching on WWE's official YouTube channel from last week's Raw:
> 
> - 429k - Batista/Del Rio segment
> - 370k - Bryan vs Orton
> - 249k - Marella vs Fandango (dance off)
> - 216k - Rhodes Brothers vs New Age Outlaws
> - 194k - Mysterio, Kingston and Langston vs The Shield
> - 115k - Ryder vs O'Neil
> - 114k - Sheamus vs Axel
> - 107k - Ziggler, Truth and Woods vs Wyatt Family
> - 94k - Christian vs Swagger
> - 94k - Naomi vs Aksana
> *- 47k - Bad News Barrett segment*


Oh, Wade. I'm afraid I got some bad news. "Best of luck in your future endeavors."


----------



## JY57

no preliminary buys numbers yet for it, but today also Bryan Alvarez says that he has been told that TLC did some good numbers.


----------



## Starbuck

JY57 said:


> no preliminary buys numbers yet for it, but today also Bryan Alvarez says that he has been told that TLC did some good numbers.


rton2 :cena4


----------



## Happenstan

JY57 said:


> no preliminary buys numbers yet for it, but today also Bryan Alvarez says that he has been told that TLC did some good numbers.


If true, then that is why WWE will never move on from Cena, Orton and the rest of the old guard. WWE fans chant for change while bending over and taking the same old **** up the ass. Then the next morning they have the audacity to wonder why this happened. Casual wrestling fans are complete f'ing morons.


----------



## xdryza

JY57 said:


> no preliminary buys numbers yet for it, but today also Bryan Alvarez says that he has been told that TLC did some good numbers.


That's because of the title unification. I doubt people paid money to watch Cena vs. Orton for the 4674287th time.


----------



## superuser1

JY57 said:


> no preliminary buys numbers yet for it, but today also Bryan Alvarez says that he has been told that TLC did some good numbers.


Hahahaha no surprise here. The IWC could hate these Orton Vs Cena matches all they want but the casuals seem to be intrigued by it.


----------



## #Mark

To be fair, they promoted that match better than any match in the last several months. The closing segment on the go home show had everyone hyped.


----------



## validreasoning

domestically tlc will do well but internationally it won't because it was free in the uk this time around whereas its usually on ppv there.


----------



## JY57

> WWE Smackdown on Friday, February 7 scored a 2.15 rating, down slightly from a 2.18 rating last week.
> 
> Smackdown continued a trend of scoring above a 2.1, though, making it four consecutive weeks for the first time in two years dating back to the same January to February 2012 stretch.
> 
> Smackdown drew an audience of 3.201 million viewers, up six percent from last week's audience of 3.027 million viewers. Despite the rating declining, the number of viewers who watched at least six minutes of the show increased nearly 200,000 viewers.
> 
> - On cable TV Friday night, Smackdown ranked #1 in overall viewers and in all key male demos.
> 
> In the week-to-week demos, Smackdown was up and down compared to last week. The high point was males 18-34, which hit by far the highest point of the year. The low point was a steep decline in the fluctuating teen male demo, which hit a four-week low.
> 
> - By comparison to Monday's WWE Raw, Smackdown came within one million viewers of reaching the flagship show.
> 
> On a week where Raw fell to a year-low of 4.210 million viewers, Smackdown increased to a two-year-high of 3.201 million viewers.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: It appears the Winter Olympics opening ceremony did not have a negative effect on Smackdown, which continued a hot streak on Friday nights. Whether it's WrestleMania Season or another reason, the show is clicking with audiences right now.


Via PWTorch (more on SD)


----------



## superuser1

Bryan and Randall carrying the blue brand


----------



## Choke2Death

JY57 said:


> no preliminary buys numbers yet for it, but today also Bryan Alvarez says that he has been told that TLC did some good numbers.


Haha, so much for the "no1 carez" bullshit we had in here. :flip


----------



## InTheAirTonight

We all knew it all along.

:ti

Daniel Bryan and CM Punk are what the VIRGINS not what the MASSES want. It's proven over and over again but these neckbeards still want to live in denial.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I don't mean to be a downer for some, but I would like to think a title unification between the two top titles in the business would do well and create the aura of a "must-see" PPV, regardless of the two participants. Nevermind the fact we haven't actually seen any numbers yet, maybe we should wait before jumping to conclusions? 

However, good looks on the Smackdown show. Highest viewership in a couple of years? That's great, especially with it beating out all The Rock appearances last year. 


Raw numbers should be through the roof this week. :henry1


----------



## Kamaria

D.M.N. said:


> No breakdown, so here's what people have been watching on WWE's official YouTube channel from last week's Raw:
> 
> - 429k - Batista/Del Rio segment
> - 370k - Bryan vs Orton


Why would you want to watch a shitty segment over a wrestling match? It's not as if Batista did anything of note.


----------



## Choke2Death

#BadNewsSanta said:


> I don't mean to be a downer for some, but I would like to think a title unification between the two top titles in the business would do well and create the aura of a "must-see" PPV, regardless of the two participants. Nevermind the fact we haven't actually seen any numbers yet, maybe we should wait before jumping to conclusions?


But remember, no one cares!

That's what everyone here suggested. The build-up is rushed, the match is old and no one is interested! Unification or not. Although I don't recall anyone actually saying it, I wouldn't be surprised if the same people in denial would also say that the future of the planet could be decided as stipulation (Orton wins, world goes extinct, Cena wins, the world is safe) and it would still flop. Hell, just a month or so ago there were some people jumping to conclusions, actually saying that TLC had a bad buyrate without ANY evidence to support it.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Choke2Death said:


> But remember, no one cares!


Oh indeed, no one cares/cared. It's a fact that "no one" equates to less than the amount of people who watch WWE.


----------



## Londrick

JY57 said:


> no preliminary buys numbers yet for it, but today also Bryan Alvarez says that he has been told that TLC did some good numbers.












Looks like Bryan will get stuck facing Bray @ WM while Cena gets entered into the title match. :bigdave :cena4 rton2 :vince$


----------



## Kamaria

TLC did good numbers because it built to and promoted a major match. You could have put anyone from the main event tier in that spot and it would have drawn huge.


----------



## Your_Solution

TLC better have done good numbers given that it featured the two guys they've pushed more than anyone over the past decade in a gimmick match for both world titles. Too bad they can't have a title unification every PPV.

That said, it's still another feather in Cena's cap. As much as I dislike him, he's proven that he makes more money than any other full-timer. I think if they gave someone else the level of booking they give him that person would see similar success, but thats not something I or anyone else can prove unfortunately.


----------



## validreasoning

8pm.... 4.499 million 
9pm.....4.336 million 
10pm....4.153 million
average = 4.33 million

this week a year ago with rock as champion raw averaged 4.26 million (off hours of 4.350 million, 4.248 million, and 4.178 million)


----------



## JAROTO

Benoit main evented WM20 and won title. Did this mean he was the one responsible for the huge buyrate? Honestly Rock's return is what helped big with the buyrates.

My point is, Cena doesn't need to be in the main event to have a big buyrate. I still think Bryan should be the one winning the title match at WM30. He may not be the face of the WWE, but they would have created a new credible top star.


----------



## Kamaria

validreasoning said:


> 8pm.... 4.499 million
> 9pm.....4.336 million
> 10pm....4.153 million
> average = 4.33 million
> 
> this week a year ago with rock as champion raw averaged 4.26 million (off hours of 4.350 million, 4.248 million, and 4.178 million)


Guess Cena isn't a draw! /s

I guess this just proves in general that the viewership seems to decline as the night goes on. 3 hour Raws absolutely drag.


----------



## Choke2Death

Third hour doing the lowest is the norm and has been for a while now. But you can't really tell anything when there isn't a breakdown.



JAROTO said:


> Benoit main evented WM20 and won title. Did this mean he was the one responsible for the huge buyrate? Honestly Rock's return is what helped big with the buyrates.


Right, so an out of nowhere return two weeks before the show involving The Rock being in a handicap tag was what gave them one million? I don't think so. Not to discredit The Rock because he was a big part of it, but WM XX was a success due to a combination of things. Smarks were excited to see Benoit in his well deserved main event spot, Undertaker was going to return as the Deadman, The Rock was there, Brock/Goldberg with Austin as referee (match sucked but build-up and star power is what this is about), the show being at MSG and being a milestone WM all together helped make it a successful show.


----------



## Starbuck

Dat Hour 1. Always the top rated hour for ages now. Dem Authority promos bringing da buyz.

:HHH2


----------



## The Boy Wonder

So this week's third hour of RAW featuring Randy Orton vs. John Cena did 4.153 million viewers while last week's third hour featuring Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan did 3.983 million viewers. 

rton2

Also, last night's RAW was going against the Olympics and still stayed over 4 million viewers.


----------



## Starbuck

^^^^^^^^^^^ Bryan marks.............GO!!!!!!!!!! 

The lack of breakdowns render this thread obsolete tbh, and with Punk gone too. I mean, his marks are the reason this thread was even created in the first place. Those days when the great Rock316AE was making so many people cry on a daily basis.

:rock4

[enter violin overture]


----------



## funnyfaces1

Rock316AE is the reason why this thread exists and why the GOAT thread existed. We need him to talk out of his ass again for our entertainment. Remember when he said that The Rock was once an elite technical wrestler? :ti


----------



## CHIcagoMade

funnyfaces1 said:


> I was one of the people The Great Rock316AE hurt.


Fixed.


----------



## superuser1

[email protected] thread being dead for this week`s ratings. If hour 3 had bombed boy I tell ya.


----------



## funnyfaces1

CHIcagoMade said:


> Fixed.


What are you talking about? I loved the guy. Every time I see him looking at a thread, I always mention it. After The-Rock-Says, I'm the biggest mark of the guy. How do I know you're not one of the guys that he ridiculed? You are a Punk mark.


----------



## InTheAirTonight

douple post


----------



## InTheAirTonight

People are already sick part timers. The crowd in the Rumble proved that. (Batista outdraws Bryan in every segment he's in)

Nobody wants to see Cena vs Orton for the trillionth time. They want the #YESmovement as the face of the company. (Buyrates suddenly improves after Bryan almost sinks it below 100k in consecutive PPVs)

People want to see Punk main event Mania as champion, not a has been part timer. (Raw ratings takes a 50% increase immediately after Punk drops it at Rumble)

:ti

Keep pouring in those hopeless excuses.


----------



## BrosOfDestruction

Choke2Death said:


> Third hour doing the lowest is the norm and has been for a while now. But you can't really tell anything when there isn't a breakdown.
> 
> 
> 
> Right, so an out of nowhere return two weeks before the show involving The Rock being in a handicap tag was what gave them one million? I don't think so. Not to discredit The Rock because he was a big part of it, but WM XX was a success due to a combination of things. Smarks were excited to see Benoit in his well deserved main event spot, Undertaker was going to return as the Deadman, The Rock was there, Brock/Goldberg with Austin as referee (match sucked but build-up and star power is what this is about), the show being at MSG and being a milestone WM all together helped make it a successful show.


WM 20 did 885K, not a mill and Rock/Foley vs Evolution was indeed the biggest drawing match on the show followed by Brock/Goldberg. Meltzer mentioned it in the Observer. Rock did make a big impact in those 2 weeks he was there as far as ratings go which indicates people were interested in seeing him and Meltzer mentioned the last RAW before MANIA was a sellout largely due to him. I agree that its not a situation where it was the clear-cut headlining match tho. There's a bunch of factors like you said. 



> Based on the latest company released estimates for the newer years and the original released estimates in most cases for the older years, here are the biggest PPV events in history:
> 
> 1,040,000 - 4/1/01 Wrestlemania 17 (Rock vs. Austin)
> 985,000 - 3/31/05 Wrestlemania 21 (HHH vs. Batista)
> 925,000 - 4/2/06 Wrestlemania 22 (Cena vs. HHH)
> *885,000 - 3/14/04 Wrestlemania 20 (HHH vs. Benoit vs. Michaels)****
> 840,000 - 3/17/02 Wrestlemania 18 (Rock vs. Hogan)****
> 824,000 - 4/2/00 Wrestlemania 16 (HHH vs. Rock vs. Foley vs. Show)
> 800,000 - 3/28/99 Wrestlemania 15 (Austin vs. Rock)
> 770,000 - 7/22/0 Invasion (Booker T & Dudley’s & DDP & Rhyno vs. Austin & Angle & Undertaker & Kane & Jericho)
> 730,000 - 3/29/98 Wrestlemania 14 (Austin vs. Michaels/Tyson ref)
> 700,000 - 8/30/98 SummerSlam (Austin vs. Undertaker)
> 675,000 - 4/30/00 Backlash (Rock vs. HHH)*
> 665,000 - 1/20/02 Royal Rumble (Rumble/Jericho vs. Rock)**
> 650,000 - 12/28/97 Starrcade '97 (Hogan vs. Sting)
> 650,000 - 4/2/89 Wrestlemania 5 (Hogan vs. Savage)
> 650,000 - 1/24/99 Royal Rumble (Rumble, Rock vs. Foley)
> 636,000 - 8/21/05 Summerslam (Hogan vs. Michaels)
> 605,000 - 9/24/00 Unforgiven (Rock vs. Benoit vs. Undertaker vs. Kane)*
> 600,000 - 7/12/98 Bash at the Beach (Hogan & Rodman vs. DDP & Malone)
> 600,000 - 8/22/99 Summerslam (Austin vs. HHH vs. Foley, Ventura referee)
> 
> *Both of these buy rates were drawn by Austin returning after a long absence and not them main event of the show. The April 30, 2000, buy rate in many ways showed the peak of the Austin drawing power, as he pulled nearly a Wrestlemania level number for a "B" PPV and he didn't even wrestle on the show. It was Austin's first televised appearance, since neck surgery which at the time threatened his career
> **The reason this was the most successful Rumble event ever, even more notable because WWE and DirecTV were at odds and DirecTV didn't air the event, was due to the incredible job of hyping the return of HHH after a long absence due to a tom quadriceps muscle
> ****Although this was the main event and stole the show from a match quality standpoint, polls before the show took place listed Rock & Foley vs. Flair & Orton & Batista as the biggest drawing match on the show, followed by Bill Goldberg vs. Brock Lesnar. Even though the main event stole the show and is the most remembered thing on the card, at the time, it was probably only the third biggest drawing match on the show.*
> ****HHH vs. Chris Jericho was put in the main event position on this show, but Hogan vs. Rock was clearly the most heavily advertised match and most responsible for the buys


----------



## Your_Solution

InTheAirTonight said:


> People are already sick part timers. The crowd in the Rumble proved that. (Batista outdraws Bryan in every segment he's in)
> 
> Nobody wants to see Cena vs Orton for the trillionth time. They want the #YESmovement as the face of the company. (Buyrates suddenly improves after Bryan almost sinks it below 100k in consecutive PPVs)
> 
> People want to see Punk main event Mania as champion, not a has been part timer. (Raw ratings takes a 50% increase immediately after Punk drops it at Rumble)
> 
> :ti
> 
> Keep pouring in those hopeless excuses.


The lowest buyrate of 2013 was 175k :argh:

Its unfortunate that Batista's segments are drawing so well. Welp, he DID tell us all to DEAL WITH IT


----------



## SerapisLiber

InTheAirTonight said:


> (Buyrates suddenly improves after Bryan almost sinks it below 100k in consecutive PPVs)


Bullshit.

"Survivor Series 2013:

The pay-per-view proved to be the worst-performing edition of Survivor Series at the box office since the event's inception in 1987; this has been attributed to a weak buildup.[4][5] It received 179,000 buys, down from 208,000 for the previous year's event; and attracted more than 100,000 fewer orders than the 2011 event, which generated 281,000 buys.[6]"

The common denominator has been Orton.


----------



## FITZ

The Boy Wonder said:


> So this week's third hour of RAW featuring Randy Orton vs. John Cena did 4.153 million viewers while last week's third hour featuring Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan did 3.983 million viewers.
> 
> rton2
> 
> Also, last night's RAW was going against the Olympics and still stayed over 4 million viewers.


So by the logic that gets used in this thread all the time does that mean Bryan is 95% of the draw that Cena is?


----------



## JY57

Your_Solution said:


> The lowest buyrate of 2013 was 175k :argh:
> 
> Its unfortunate that Batista's segments are drawing so well. Welp, he DID tell us all to DEAL WITH IT


Actually it is 122,000 (initial) ethic was Battleground


----------



## D.M.N.

3.14 rating for Monday.

A look at how many households have watched Raw this week historically:

11/02/02 - 3.74 million households / 4.42 rating
10/02/03 - ????
09/02/04 - 3.29 million households / 3.80 rating
14/02/05 - 3.47 million households / 3.90 rating
13/02/06 - Westminster Dog Show, displaced
12/02/07 - Westminster Dog Show, displaced
11/02/08 - 3.27 million households / 3.39 rating
09/02/09 - 3.36 million households / 3.42 rating
15/02/10 - 3.31 million households / 3.40 rating
14/02/11 - 3.15 million households / 3.14 rating
13/02/12 - 3.02 million households / 3.01 rating
11/02/13 - 3.13 million households / 3.15 rating
10/02/14 - 3.10 million households / 3.14 rating

Historically this week of ratings has always been poor, going back a decade Raw has never hit 3.5 million households. I guess it is because this week has been the 'lull' between the Royal Rumble and No Way Out.

So not a bad number for last night, especially when you think that there were no 'stars' on last night's show from a casual perspective. (Batista doesn't count)


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

D.M.N. said:


> 3.14 rating for Monday.
> 
> A look at how many households have watched Raw this week historically:
> 
> *14/02/05 - 3.47 million households / 3.90 rating*


Hm, what main evented that show... oh this:



> Batista vs. *Edge*
> 
> The start:
> 
> The two men lock up, Batista gets the advantage early but Edge fights back, running into Batista, but not knocking him over. Edge comes off the ropes again and runs into an elbow. Batista controls Edge until he misses a corner charge allowing Edge to throw some right hands. He goes to whip Batista but Batista does not budge and instead tosses Edge over the top rope and to the outside! Batista follows him but Edge reverses and nails Batista with the Edge-O-Matic on the outside hard mat. Edge then nails away on Batista with boots as HHH looks on.
> 
> Mid Match Notes:
> 
> Edge chops the throat and chest of Batista on the apron before coming in the ring and using the ropes to choke him. Edge throws a right hand and hits a neckbreaker, he makes a cover for a two count before placing Batista in a sideways chin and head lock. Batista tries to get to his feet and manages to but Edge clubs him in the back several times before mounting him in the corner, he gets a punch off but Batista givesa him a one handed swat off the ropes. Batista gives him a few knockdown and then catches Edge and follows up with a hard body slam. Edge gets the upper hand afterwards with right hands and he climbs the top rope. He comes flying off but Batista charges him and gives him a shoulder block in mid air. Batista throws Edge off the ropes and goes for the spinebuster but Edge evades it and nails an implant DDT. Edge calls for the spear and makes a run at Batista but runs right into a spinebuster!
> 
> The Finish:
> 
> Batista picks Edge up and drops him with the sit down powerbomb! However at this point, a limo is shown on the screen and HHH comes in and knocks referee Mike Chooda out, forcing Batista to focus on the Raw tron thing. The bell is rung.
> 
> Winner by DQ: *Edge*


:edge


----------



## Your_Solution

JY57 said:


> Actually it is 122,000 (initial) ethic was Battleground


Why would people track by initial? I did miss battleground while researching though, its the low for the year at 150k

The numbers are not pretty. But despite that, one of the guys involved in the ugly BG, HIAC, and Survivor Series numbers is getting to main event Wrestlemania.


----------



## JY57

Your_Solution said:


> Why would people track by initial? I did miss battleground while researching though, its the low for the year at 150k
> 
> The numbers are not pretty. But despite that, one of the guys involved in the ugly BG, HIAC, and Survivor Series numbers is getting to main event Wrestlemania.


Final numbers won't be out till laTer in the year so just going by what WWE reported HIAC was only one that did good out of those 3 which was 212,000 vs 122,000 & 175,000. You can say because of return of Cena, HBK, and the end of Orton/ Bryan sold that PPV. 

final numbers for MITB, SummerSlam, and NOC will be out by the end of the month. So it will be interesting to see how much the improved numbers look.


----------



## Brodus Clay

Those people that said nobody would care about ADR and Batista feuding must be in awe xD, tbh the feud it's a mid card non-cowardly heel vs monster face being booked well, the promos have been golden comedy and ADR gonna carry Batista to a decent match.


----------



## #Mark

JY57 said:


> Final numbers won't be out till laTer in the year so just going by what WWE reported HIAC was only one that did good out of those 3 which was 212,000 vs 122,000 & 175,000. You can say because of return of Cena, HBK, and the end of Orton/ Bryan sold that PPV.
> 
> final numbers for MITB, SummerSlam, and NOC will be out by the end of the month. So it will be interesting to see how much the improved numbers look.


NOC did well. Better than 2011 and 2010.


----------



## etta411

This is the year 2014 those numbers really mean shit.

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## MaybeLock

etta411 said:


> This is the year 2014 those numbers really mean shit.


This is the year of... GOOGLE TRENDS :vince5

Made a quick search to check how main event wrestlers are doing: 










Daniel Bryan still way behind of main stars, which is surprising. 
Batista losing his return spike.
CM Punk with more mainstream attention than during Summer of Punk 2011.
First time for years that a full timer ties Cena's popularity. Because of walking out on the company :ti


----------



## Stannis Baratheon.

its all about the trends on twitter


----------



## #Mark

ham619 said:


> And that tells you why wwe does'nt care about bryan and cena, batista, orton get to ME WM.
> 
> And waiting for people to no sell the google trends because db did'nt win.












No sell that.


----------



## Sonnen Says

#Mark said:


> NOC did well. Better than 2011 and 2010.


WWE in 2010 and 2011 had an extra PPV 13 instead of 12 now. So you should compare it with 2012 instead but yeah it's not good enough. By the way NOC in 10/11 got higher domestic number than 13.



#Mark said:


> No sell that.


Of course he's gonna gain the most at that time as he was the one getting pushed. But when you show the overall year he's nowhere near the top.


----------



## superuser1

#Mark said:


> No sell that.


How is Maddox so high?


----------



## #Mark

Sonnen Says said:


> WWE in 2010 and 2011 had an extra PPV 13 instead of 12 now. So you should compare it with 2012 instead but yeah it's not good enough. By the way NOC in 10/11 got higher domestic number than 13.


:lol what are you talking about? 13, 10, and 11 had the exact PPV model. NOC in september, a PPV in early October, and a PPV in late October. 2012 didn't have the PPV in early october.. It only had NOC in september and HIAC in late October. And no NOC 13's initial buys are better than 2010 and 2011's. The final buys are being reported by the end of the month. NOC 13 was going against a Mayweather fight and still drew better than 2010/2011.

Initial buys:
2010
NOC: 165,00
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_Champions_(2010)
http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2010/1027/533301/john-cena/

2011:
NOC: 169K
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_Champions_(2011)
http://www.cagesideseats.com/2011/1...ns-2011-pay-per-view-buys-estimated-at-165000

2013:
NOC 175k 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_Champions_(2013)
http://www.wrestling-news.net/buyrates-revealed-wwe-money-wwe-wwe/37193/


Sonnen Says said:


> Of course he's gonna gain the most at that time as he was the one getting pushed. But when you show the overall year he's nowhere near the top.


Orton was champion and Bryan is over six spots ahead of him and Bryan is ahead of HHH who was dominating tv during that time. Bryan was tagging with Kane for the first eight months of the year up to August. Of course he isn't gonna be high.. That's like me criticizing Punk for being low on that list when he was feuding with Axel and Ryback.


----------



## Sonnen Says

#Mark said:


> :lol what are you talking about? 13, 10, and 11 had the exact PPV model. NOC in september, a PPV in early October, and a PPV in late October. 2012 didn't have the PPV in early october.. It only had NOC in september and HIAC in late October. And no NOC 13's initial buys are better than 2010 and 2011's. The final buys are being reported by the end of the month. NOC 13 was going against a Mayweather fight and still drew better than 2010/2011.
> 
> Initial buys:
> 2010
> NOC: 165,00
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_Champions_(2010)
> http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2010/1027/533301/john-cena/
> 
> 2011:
> NOC: 169K
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_Champions_(2011)
> http://www.cagesideseats.com/2011/1...ns-2011-pay-per-view-buys-estimated-at-165000
> 
> 2013:
> NOC 175k
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_Champions_(2013)
> http://www.wrestling-news.net/buyrates-revealed-wwe-money-wwe-wwe/37193/
> 
> 
> Orton was champion and Bryan is over six spots ahead of him and Bryan is ahead of HHH who was dominating tv during that time. Bryan was tagging with Kane for the first eight months of the year up to August. Of course he isn't gonna be high.. That's like me criticizing Punk for being low on that list when he was feuding with Axel and Ryback.


You can't even count the PPVs: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_WWE_pay-per-view_events

And you don't even know what a domestic number is which is embarrassing. You don't need to show me the overall number because NOC just had higher international buys which is expected and I don't even know why are you comparing it with 2010 and 2011 when you should do so with 2012 as it's the year that had the same amount of PPVs.

Domestic numbers
NOC 2010: 99,000
NOC 2011: 109,000
NOC 2012: 102,000
NOC 2013: 92,000

Bryan had the most screen time not HHH and not even Cena/Punk and this list means nothing as it had Maddox over every top star. Orton is just Orton he doesn't draw there is a reason why SD hit an all time low ratings with him. That list though just shows who got the most spotlight at that time and again if you wanna judge your numbers than judge the overall year as it doesn't even have Bryan anywhere near the top.


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7

superuser1 said:


> How is Maddox so high?


Because he's usually involved in segments with big stars.


----------



## InTheAirTonight

Sonnen Says said:


> You can't even count the PPVs: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_WWE_pay-per-view_events
> 
> And you don't even know what a domestic number is which is embarrassing. You don't need to show me the overall number because NOC just had higher international buys which is expected and I don't even know why are you comparing it with 2010 and 2011 when you should do so with 2012 as it's the year that had the same amount of PPVs.
> 
> Domestic numbers
> NOC 2010: 99,000
> NOC 2011: 109,000
> NOC 2012: 102,000
> NOC 2013: 92,000
> 
> Bryan had the most screen time not HHH and not even Cena/Punk and this list means nothing as it had Maddox over every top star. Orton is just Orton he doesn't draw there is a reason why SD hit an all time low ratings with him. That list though just shows who got the most spotlight at that time and again if you wanna judge your numbers than judge the overall year as it doesn't even have Bryan anywhere near the top.


You're just embarrassing yourself even more.


----------



## MaybeLock

ham619 said:


> That list just no sells itself.
> 
> DB had the luxry of working with HEEL HHH AND THE AUTHORITY, thats why he is that high.
> 
> And to prove my point look at maddox's numbers.


618 850 > 569 250

How can you claim HHH is the only reason why Bryan is that high when his rating's gain number is inferior? It could be said HHH had the luxury of turning heel against DBryan. :HHH2


----------



## MaybeLock

ham619 said:


> :ti


I´m sure he would have gotten way more heat if he turned heel on Orton or Cena :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao


----------



## Sonnen Says

InTheAirTonight said:


> You're just embarrassing yourself even more.


Ironically that's what you have done since you started posting here. What's so embarrassing tho oh wait Punk drew 2.2 rating in a Christmas show, funny thing Punk was injured at that time and his segment was the only thing that gained in that show, but lets not act like Cena wasn't there, if anything he drew the 2.2 since he's the one that ME. But again I'm not delusional like you, I don't blame any wrestler for it the show was dreadful and nothing could save it.


----------



## superuser1

What the happened to this thread? Lmao hour 3 did good numbers with Cena & Orton main eventing everyone`s quiet


----------



## #Mark

Sonnen Says said:


> You can't even count the PPVs: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_WWE_pay-per-view_events
> 
> And you don't even know what a domestic number is which is embarrassing. You don't need to show me the overall number because NOC just had higher international buys which is expected and I don't even know why are you comparing it with 2010 and 2011 when you should do so with 2012 as it's the year that had the same amount of PPVs.
> 
> Domestic numbers
> NOC 2010: 99,000
> NOC 2011: 109,000
> NOC 2012: 102,000
> NOC 2013: 92,000
> 
> Bryan had the most screen time not HHH and not even Cena/Punk and this list means nothing as it had Maddox over every top star. Orton is just Orton he doesn't draw there is a reason why SD hit an all time low ratings with him. That list though just shows who got the most spotlight at that time and again if you wanna judge your numbers than judge the overall year as it doesn't even have Bryan anywhere near the top.


I'm thoroughly confused. You post a link to prove my point? 

2011:
September 18, 2011:Night of Champions	
October 2, 2011: Hell in a Cell	
October 23, 2011: Vengeance

2012:
September 16, 2012: Night of Champions
October 28, 2012: Hell in a Cell

2013:
September 15, 2013: Night of Champions	
October 6, 2013: Battleground	
October 27, 2013: Hell in a Cell

As you can see, the PPV model is similar to 2011. There were two PPVs in October as opposed to one. As for NOC 2013, the initial buys and final buys are higher, that matters just as much as the domestic. There was a huge Mayweather fight that same weekend and it still topped previous PPVs. 

:lol HHH had just as much if not more screen time than Bryan. He opened the show and closed the show more and was involved in sporadic segments with Bryan, Orton, Show, and The Rhodes. He was even in more segments per week than Bryan was. Even so, I remember someone posted a list of the top ratings performers during the summer and fall of 2011 and Punk was behind the Miz .. He had more screen time than him so explain that?



superuser1 said:


> What the happened to this thread? Lmao hour 3 did good numbers with Cena & Orton main eventing everyone`s quiet


The third hour was still the lowest but that's par for the course now. You can put Rock and Taker there and it still would be the lowest so there's no point in arguing.


----------



## The Buryer

Bryan's numbers are obviously mis-credited to him. The authority angle was the strong draw post summerslam which Bryan benefitted by being part of, he was replaceable. It could have been easily CM Punk in his place at that time. I remember fans even complaining about Punk not replacing him. Same for Orton. From what I recall, Daniel Bryan, without the top angle and as a singles star facing Randy Orton drew one of the lowest main event+ over run quarters in years.

Yeah that list is not reliable in any way, unless the person who made the list gives us all the info on how and which quarters he has credited to whom.


----------



## Starbuck

#Mark said:


> Even so, I remember someone posted a list of the top ratings performers during the summer and fall of 2011 and Punk was behind the Miz .. He had more screen time than him so explain that?


That was me. There are overalls for 2011, 2012 from the same guy who did the 2013 overall and Authority/Bryan stint. I do wonder if there was one of these done purely from the pipebomb promo to say...Summerslam or Night of Champions 2011 where Punk was similar to Bryan in that they were the focus for a couple of months if that would change anything. Punk's overall 2011 is pretty lol though all things considered but I'd bet that from June to September he'd be a lot higher. At the same time it's likely that Vince, Cena and Hunter would probably best him because they were the guys involved in the segments with Punk and their overall 2011 was miles better than Punk's. I can't find the link any more but I'm sure Cena and HHH were 1 and 2 or top 3 at least. Miz was way up there too.


----------



## The Buryer

MaybeLock said:


> I´m sure he would have gotten way more heat if he turned heel on Orton or Cena :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao


You don't get it. It's not about getting heat or pops, the presence of top heels - The Authority, as an adversary gave Bryan major credibility and importance to his character. Without that, he just becomes "a guy with Yes! chants". Its a lot similar to Rock/Cena dynamic, where the presence of the Rock, a mega-star as opponent gave John Cena a new amount of credibility and importance that he hasn't had in years. Without him, Cena is just Cena squashing heels in the main event of RAW. Yes Cena is still a top star, same way Daniel Bryan is currently, but without that credibility and purpose, fans wouldn't care as much. 

This is what lot of Bryan marks don't seem to understand, they seem to believe Bryan got over "despite WWE" which is so far from the truth. The Problem is, while WWE is always pushing Bryan, they are doing it in a half-assed manner. For some reason they are reluctant to go all the way with him but they don't want him off the spotlight either. To me, its bad business to push someone without the intention of going all the way, if you don't intend to, then don't push him at all. They could have easily buried him by putting him on superstars or whatever jobber show they got going right now, like they did with Drew mcintyre and killed his appeal with fans. But instead, they give him a solid push for months, main events on RAW, pay-per-views, clean victories over opponents, even bring back a retire legend, Shawn Michaels just for him etc... all this push and then pull him off the Rumble match. fpalm These idiots were essentially setting themselves up for that crowd reaction(poor Batista), because they let it get to that point.


----------



## #Mark

The Buryer said:


> Bryan's numbers are obviously mis-credited to him. The authority angle was the strong draw post summerslam which Bryan benefitted by being part of, he was replaceable. It could have been easily CM Punk in his place at that time. I remember fans even complaining about Punk not replacing him. Same for Orton. From what I recall, Daniel Bryan, without the top angle and as a singles star facing Randy Orton drew one of the lowest main event+ over run quarters in years.
> 
> Yeah that list is not reliable in any way, unless the person who made the list gives us all the info on how and which quarters he has credited to whom.


You mean the Orton/Bryan match from June that happened a week after Bryan took the fall against the shield on PPV and days after he lost to Damien Sandow on SD? Bryan wasn't protected then and wasn't presented as an ME act. The Bryan/Orton match that happened in December had a great overrun and I'm sure the same for the match last week. Bryan benefitted from the Authority angle obviously because it's the main angle but he truly started gaining good numbers back during the Cena angle. His matches with Cesaro and Sheamus in july, for example, gained great numbers. That said, I do agree with your overall premise though.


----------



## Happenstan

#Mark said:


> *I'm thoroughly confused.* You post a link to prove my point?


A feeling that will become quite frequent when debating Brick (Sonnen Says).


----------



## Sonnen Says

#Mark said:


> I'm thoroughly confused. You post a link to prove my point?
> 
> 2011:
> September 18, 2011:Night of Champions
> October 2, 2011: Hell in a Cell
> October 23, 2011: Vengeance
> 
> 2012:
> September 16, 2012: Night of Champions
> October 28, 2012: Hell in a Cell
> 
> 2013:
> September 15, 2013: Night of Champions
> October 6, 2013: Battleground
> October 27, 2013: Hell in a Cell
> 
> As you can see, the PPV model is similar to 2011. There were two PPVs in October as opposed to one. As for NOC 2013, the initial buys and final buys are higher, that matters just as much as the domestic. There was a huge Mayweather fight that same weekend and it still topped previous PPVs.
> 
> :lol HHH had just as much if not more screen time than Bryan. He opened the show and closed the show more and was involved in sporadic segments with Bryan, Orton, Show, and The Rhodes. He was even in more segments per week than Bryan was. Even so, I remember someone posted a list of the top ratings performers during the summer and fall of 2011 and Punk was behind the Miz .. He had more screen time than him so explain that?
> 
> 
> 
> The third hour was still the lowest but that's par for the course now. You can put Rock and Taker there and it still would be the lowest so there's no point in arguing.


I'm the one who's confused here. Do you even understand that there was a PPV canceled since 2011? If you know that then you do realize it helps the other PPVs get higher buys right. NOC came after Summerslam last year and the years before it anyway but last year it had Payback replacing two PPVs in OTL and NWO (Before that CP) and again that's before Summerslam and NOC which should help increase the PPV buys. They just made a new PPV after NOC so it will not effect it numbers and I don't see how it will and I don't know what are you trying to go with this. And even if it's the initial buys it will not increase that much and it may not even increase as the PPV sucked. If anything It shows that the PPV cancellation helped NOC get higher international buys but not Domestic that's for sure even after moving and canceling PPVs before the summer. In 2011 it had 1 extra PPV before the summer and one just like you mentioned in October which was Vengeance. That's probably why they canceled a PPV and made it 12 PPVs instead of 13 to help increase buys. Again the Domestic numbers for NOC last year wasn't higher than the previous three that's what I was talking about. 

No Bryan had more air time which includes matches, and again this is not the overall year numbers because Bryan wasn't even anywhere near the top. If the most pushed guy since SS doesn't get the most numbers in that period of time than it's embarrassing and not that it was impressive enough to put him anywhere near the top for the overall year as shown by that site. Miz had higher numbers because he was in the ME of WM with Cena and Rock which he had tons of segments with during RTWM. Also he was still feuding with Cena until OTL. But ever since I remember him losing a lot of viewers, he just couldn't keep his momentum.




Happenstan said:


> A feeling that will become quite frequent when debating Brick (Sonnen Says).


Debating with you is just hilarious, I still remember when you said Bryan will be the next Austin and that he will bring the glory days back :lmao. Keep dreaming like the dummy that you have always been.


----------



## Happenstan

Sonnen Says said:


> Debating with you is just hilarious, I still remember when you said Bryan will be the next Austin and that he will bring the glory days back :lmao. Keep dreaming like the dummy that you have always been.


Really? I said that? How about we make a little wager then. If I said that, post the proof here and I'll never say another bad thing about Punk again. I'll complement him in every post I make. However, when you can't produce that quote you have to admit your hero Punk is a loser who quit like a little bitch in every post you make from here on out. Day after day, month after month. For once in your life back up your bullshit. I'll be waiting.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Happenstan said:


> Really? I said that? How about we make a little wager then. If I said that, post the proof here and I'll never say another bad thing about Punk again. I'll complement him in every post I make. However, when you can't produce that quote you have to admit your hero Punk is a loser who quit like a little bitch in every post you make from here on out. Day after day, month after month. *For once in your life back up your bullshit. I'll be waiting.*


:lmao For once in my life and all those Meltzer sources are not good enough I need to get them from Vince to convince a Bryan mark, is that what I should do. You don't need to deny it, I remember we had an argument that's even before Bryan gets his push, you were talking trash about Punk numbers and how Bryan will do way higher if it was him and all that shit and also you said he will be like the next Austin or something like that. I don't feel like searching it's damn old from last year when I do I will show it. Also I don't care about your feelings towards Punk :lol


----------



## Happenstan

Sonnen Says said:


> :lmao For once in my life and all those Meltzer sources are not good enough I need to get them from Vince to convince a Bryan mark, is that what I should do. You don't need to deny it, I remember we had an argument that's even before Bryan gets his push, you were talking trash about Punk numbers and how Bryan will do way higher if it was him and all that shit and also you said he will be like the next Austin or something like that. I don't feel like searching it's damn old from last year when I do I will show it. Also I don't care about your feelings towards Punk :lol


Just as I thought. You lied, I called you out and now you are changing the subject. You're pathetic Brick and everyone here sees you for what you really are. Go back to your home in Punk's asshole and think up some new lies to tell.

I never said that crap. I said Bryan would surpass Punk and he quickly did. Only an idiot would think anyone will surpass 80s Hogan, Rock, or SCSA. Liars gotta lie.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Happenstan said:


> Just as I thought. You lied, I called you out and now you are changing the subject. You're pathetic Brick and everyone here sees you for what you really are. Go back to your home in Punk's asshole and think up some new lies to tell.
> 
> I never said that crap. I said Bryan would surpass Punk and he quickly did. Only an idiot would think anyone will surpass 80s Hogan, Rock, or SCSA. Liars gotta lie.


Ok go search what I said 8 months ago, go waste your time and do it. Yeah dummy keep acting like a childish poster with your dumb insults and temper issues. You know that I can't find it it's old, but I know that you said something similar that's all that matters. 

You talk about lies and yet you think Bryan surpassed Punk quickly and that never even happened, in what terms exactly? 

Deny it all you want but you made an argument once and I don't remember which thread it was, so I don't care about your BS again. It was something like Bryan will revolutionize a new era like Austin or something and *No* not that he will surpass him but that's still stupid.


----------



## Happenstan

Sonnen Says said:


> You talk about lies and yet you think Bryan surpassed Punk quickly and that never even happened, in what terms exactly?


Popularity, potential, opportunity. There's a reason why Bryan's still with the company and Punk rage quit over his Wrestlemania position. Oh that's right. It's been decreed by the army of Punktard that CM quit for us. That's Cm Punk. Ever the martyr.



Sonnen Says said:


> Deny it all you want but you made an argument once and I don't remember which thread it was, so I don't care about your BS again. It was something like Bryan will revolutionize a new era like Austin or something and *No* not that he will surpass him but that's still stupid.


Never happened....at least not in the real world. We all know how you Punktards are when it comes to reality. At best you are mixing me up with someone else or at worst you are a liar. I'll go with liar.


----------



## Brodus Clay

Sonnen Says said:


> Ok go search what I said 8 months ago, go waste your time and do it. Yeah dummy keep acting like a childish poster with your dumb insults and temper issues. *You know that I can't find it it's old*, but I know that you said something similar that's all that matters.
> 
> You talk about lies and yet you think Bryan surpassed Punk quickly and that never even happened, in what terms exactly?
> 
> Deny it all you want but you made an argument once and *I don't remember which thread it was, so I don't care about your BS again.* It was something like Bryan will revolutionize a new era like Austin or something and *No* not that he will surpass him but that's still stupid.


Dude if you don't have the links stop using that ''I don't remember but I swear it happened'' shit to back up your arguments no wonder he calls you brick -___-


----------



## Sonnen Says

Happenstan said:


> Popularity, potential, opportunity. There's a reason why Bryan's still with the company and Punk rage quit over his Wrestlemania position. Oh that's right. It's been decreed by the army of Punktard that CM quit for us. That's Cm Punk. Ever the martyr.
> 
> 
> 
> Never happened....at least not in the real world. We all know how you Punktards are when it comes to reality. At best you are mixing me up with someone else or at worst you are a liar. I'll go with liar.


Well that doesn't even make sense he still didn't surpass Punk in anything except maybe fan reactions and that isn't the case. 

Again all that matters is I know you said something similar. Plz don't talk about the real world, you exaggerate like no other in this forum toward your hero Bryan almost as much as some Bryan/Punk marks. If I could go back to your posts last year before even Bryan got pushed I will show you all the exaggeration you spew about Bryan and how he's gonna reach levels way higher than Punk and how he will revolutionize the WWE since Austin and bla bla bla. Again I don't care all that matters now is your claims is wrong. Well he didn't outdraw or even outsell Punk. So keep dreaming. You keep on making excuses saying Bryan is not pushed as much as him but the reality is Bryan is already been pushed harder since he got his win over Cena.



Brodus Clay said:


> Dude if you don't have the links stop using that ''I don't remember but I swear it happened'' shit to back up your arguments no wonder he calls you brick -___-


And what does this have to do with you. I said he said something similar. Im not obsessed about what he said 8 months ago as I cant go search for it now since I can only see what he posted recently so how am I gonna back it up. This is not the first time I show him the proof that he's wrong, I give him Meltzer sources he either ignores or still thinks it's something I made up.


----------



## Happenstan

Sonnen Says said:


> Again all that matters is I know you said something similar.


Well as long as you and you alone believe real hard....




Sonnen Says said:


> And what does this have to do with you. I said he said something similar. Im not obsessed about what he said 8 months ago as I cant go search for it now since I can only see what he posted recently so how am I gonna back it up. This is not the first time I show him the proof that he's wrong, *I give him Meltzer sources* he either ignores or still thinks it's something I made up.


:lmao That was Mark you were arguing about that with. You just can't keep your shit straight, can you?


----------



## Sonnen Says

Happenstan said:


> Well as long as you and you alone believe real hard....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *:lmao That was Mark you were arguing about that with. You just can't keep your shit straight, can you?*


Here let me quote you:
*For once in your life back up your bullshit.*

You just admit that I don't back things up it doesn't matter if it wasn't toward you but some times I do show it to you tho. You were still following the same thread.


----------



## Choke2Death

Sonnen Says said:


> And what does this have to do with you. I said he said something similar. Im not obsessed about what he said 8 months ago as I cant go search for it now since I can only see what he posted recently so how am I gonna back it up. *This is not the first time I show him the proof that he's wrong, I give him Meltzer sources he either ignores or still thinks it's something I made up*.


You show him Meltzer as source that he claimed Bryan was gonna be the next Austin? :lmao

At least that's the conclusion I can draw based on following the past page of posts.


----------



## Happenstan

Sonnen Says said:


> Here let me quote you:
> *For once in your life back up your bullshit.*
> 
> You just admit that I don't back things up it doesn't matter if it wasn't toward you but some times I do show it to you tho. You were still following the same thread.


You're right Brick...let me rephrase. For once in *our own numerous conversations together*, back up your bullshit. That better? Still waiting BTW. Back up your allegations or admit you lied.


----------



## Starbuck

Sonnen Says with dat self burial.

:ti


----------



## Sonnen Says

Choke2Death said:


> You show him Meltzer as source that he claimed Bryan was gonna be the next Austin? :lmao
> 
> At least that's the conclusion I can draw based on following the past page of posts.


That's what happens when you don't follow :lmao. Nice one tho I :lol. I was talking about the numbers and other things that I was showing by sources.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Happenstan said:


> You're right Brick...let me rephrase. For once in *our own numerous conversations together*, back up your bullshit. That better? Still waiting BTW. Back up your allegations or admit you lied.


I didn't lie, I cant back it up now since I can only see what you posted recently that's all. :lol no need to get so excited about. Even when you argue with others you forget what you post and that's fine and all:



Happenstan said:


> Continue to put words in my mouth because you ASSumed something incorrectly.





Crona said:


> You did say that though... I even put it in bold when I quoted you.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

lolsonnensays


----------



## Happenstan

Sonnen Says said:


> I didn't lie, I cant back it up now since I can only see what you posted recently that's all. :lol no need to get so excited about. Even when you argue with others you forget what you post and that's fine and all:


fpalm Did you even read the whole exchange? Whatever. As I said in that thread, Bryan has surpassed Punk. Deal with it. :batista4


----------



## Londrick

Just when I think the greatness of this thread is over, Sonnen Says vs Happenstan happens.


----------



## D.M.N.

President's Day yesterday = no Monday cable ratings today


----------



## JY57

Valentines Day Smackdown Viewrship:

2,831,000 (down from 3,203,000 from last week)

no surprise on V-Day (still not bad on that night)


----------



## Crona

Londrick said:


> Just when I think the greatness of this thread is over, *Sonnen Says vs Happenstan* happens.


Then. Now. Forever.


----------



## Waffelz

D.M.N. said:


> President's Day yesterday = no Monday cable ratings today


Why?!


----------



## Your_Solution

Londrick said:


> Just when I think the greatness of this thread is over, Sonnen Says vs Happenstan happens.


Far more entertaining than John Cena vs. Randy Orton


----------



## Bushmaster

Londrick said:


> Just when I think the greatness of this thread is over, Sonnen Says vs Happenstan happens.


2 super marks going at it with eachother :StephenA


----------



## Happenstan

SoupBro said:


> 2 super marks going at it with eachother :StephenA


I haven't been a super mark for anybody. Super hater when it comes to Punk...ok, that might be true. I'll own that but spare me this mark shit.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The first hour of Raw was dominant over every other one and the biggest part of the first hour was :bryan

WWE Entertainment USA 8:00 PM 4662 1.4
WWE Entertainment USA 9:00 PM 4296 1.3
WWE Entertainment USA 10:00 PM 4134 1.3


----------



## hazuki

:Bryan:


----------



## Jof

4.364m average, not bad. Last year the show featuring The Rock unveiling the new WWE championship drew 3.3 rating with an average of 4.66 million viewers. It was also EC PPV fall-out show.

Last year's hourly breakdown - 

Hour one: 4.82m viewers
Hour two: 4.67m viewers
Hour three: 4.49m viewers


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

I wouldnt be surprised if there was some decline in Bryan's matches since there were 3 commercial breaks. I would like to see the breakdowns just to see how well it held in spite of the commercials.


----------



## dxbender

Jof said:


> 4.364m average, not bad. Last year the show featuring The Rock unveiling the new WWE championship drew 3.3 rating with an average of 4.66 million viewers. It was also EC PPV fall-out show.
> 
> Last year's hourly breakdown -
> 
> Hour one: 4.82m viewers
> Hour two: 4.67m viewers
> Hour three: 4.49m viewers


This years show went up against the Olympics(which got over 23M viewers) among other shows also airing new episodes. But it was the #1 show on Cable TV for the night.


----------



## Londrick

That Sheamus vs Orton main event :ti


----------



## JAROTO

Bryan is drawing


----------



## xdryza

Boreton still losing viewers. lol


----------



## WWE

Londrick said:


> Just when I think the greatness of this thread is over, Sonnen Says vs Happenstan happens.


:ti



IDONTSHIV said:


> The first hour of Raw was dominant over every other one and the biggest part of the first hour was :bryan
> 
> WWE Entertainment USA 8:00 PM 4662 1.4
> WWE Entertainment USA 9:00 PM 4296 1.3
> WWE Entertainment USA 10:00 PM 4134 1.3


The first hour was dominant compared to any other hour because it was the first hour :draper2



hazuki said:


> :Bryan:


:kobe


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

CYC said:


> :ti
> 
> 
> 
> The first hour was dominant compared to any other hour because it was the first hour :draper2
> 
> 
> 
> :kobe


I dont have to be logical, it's the ratings thread.


----------



## WWE

IDONTSHIV said:


> I dont have to be logical, it's the ratings thread.



Good point. 

I need those ratings breakdowns!


----------



## validreasoning

4th highest Hour 1 since March 11 2013. More people watched Hour 1 this week than watched Hour 1 the night after Wrestlemania 29 or Summerslam 13 incredibly.


----------



## RelivingTheShadow

Why do people even attempt to argue weather or not Bryan is a TV draw? Bryan is #2 or #3 right behind Cena and MAYBE Batista, but I think Batista's drawing ability's was a one time thing since he isn't even being utilized on TV in prolonged amounts of time. Bryan CLEARLY out draws Orton and Punk. Bryan was the only guy to pull 1,000,000 viewers in a over run segment not involving Rock or Lesnar and that hasn't been done in years without Lesnar or Rock. Bryan was wrestling THE SHIELD in a Gauntlet match when he pulled that for those that are wondering.


----------



## TheStig

TakeMyGun said:


> Why do people even attempt to argue weather or not Bryan is a TV draw? Bryan is #2 or #3 right behind Cena and MAYBE Batista, but I think Batista's drawing ability's was a one time thing since he isn't even being utilized on TV in prolonged amounts of time. Bryan CLEARLY out draws Orton and Punk. Bryan was the only guy to pull 1,000,000 viewers in a over run segment not involving Rock or Lesnar and that hasn't been done in years without Lesnar or Rock. Bryan was wrestling THE SHIELD in a Gauntlet match when he pulled that for those that are wondering.


Didnt punk and heyman get 1mill in a 10pm slot? I even remember undertaker getting 1mill in non overrun segments so I dunno why overrun are so important.

I believe punk vs vince + cena vs punk amongs other overruns getting 1mill+.


----------



## Reaper

IDONTSHIV said:


> I dont have to be logical, it's the ratings thread.


Yup. This is probably one of the worst mark threads on the forum. When I first joined, I thought that ratings actually had a science behind it ... Nope. I'm going with the age old infallible technique of judging stars: Crowd reactions, merchandise sales and whether they're selling out arenas and houseshows. Maybe buyrates, but they're also almost impossible to determine who's buying for what really. That's it. 

If there was an infallible science behind ratings as opposed to "my assertion = evidence", I would certainly back it. But in the end, that's all it really boils down to.


----------



## superuser1

Reaper Jones said:


> Yup. *This is probably one of the worst mark threads on the forum.* When I first joined, I thought that ratings actually had a science behind it ... Nope. I'm going with the age old infallible technique of judging stars: Crowd reactions, merchandise sales and whether they're selling out arenas and houseshows. Maybe buyrates, but they're also almost impossible to determine who's buying for what really. That's it.
> 
> If there was an infallible science behind ratings as opposed to "my assertion = evidence", I would certainly back it. But in the end, that's all it really boils down to.


Yeah and especially now that the breakdown doesn't come out anymore this thread is pointless as can be.


----------



## D.M.N.

I'm sure you guys what facts to add to the discussion, so...



> Three Months Ended
> Broadcast
> 
> Month
> 
> Events (in chronological order) December 31,
> 2013 December 31,
> 2012
> 
> October WWE Battleground 114
> October Hell in a Cell 228 199
> November Survivor Series 177 208
> December WWE TLC 181 175
> 
> Prior events 82 70
> Total 782 652


----------



## checkcola

Hell in a Cell had the only real ppv quality card, not surprising it did well


----------



## RelivingTheShadow

TheStig said:


> Didnt punk and heyman get 1mill in a 10pm slot? I even remember undertaker getting 1mill in non overrun segments so I dunno why overrun are so important.
> 
> I believe punk vs vince + cena vs punk amongs other overruns getting 1mill+.


Punk Vs Vince did, but that was late 2012. We are talking over 1 year ago.

I believe the highest Punk/Heymen ever did was 600,000 at the 9PM Slot.


----------



## TheStig

TakeMyGun said:


> Punk Vs Vince did, but that was late 2012. We are talking over 1 year ago.
> 
> I believe the highest Punk/Heymen ever did was 600,000 at the 9PM Slot.


I believe it was the chicago show with punk,heyman and ryback at 10pm. You also had the number 1 contender for the wwe title around this time last year between cena and punk so it happends a couple of times a year in both non overrun and overruns. The rating itself is much more important factor and should be focused on rather than gains.


----------



## corporation2.0

As we all know, the ratings usually start off strongest in the first hour and decrease with each subsequent hour. It's a huge weakness of the 3-hour format.

However, from what I can tell, the summary of this thread is:

*Bryan in the opening hour, Orton in the final hour*
"Look at dem ratings! Bryan is such a huge draw! Take Orton out of the main event! He's a ratings killer!"

*Orton in the opening hour, Bryan in the final hour*
"The ratings decreased during the show because Orton killed the fans' interest in the first hour. Bryan isn't to blame because the ratings are always down in the final hour."

Love that logic. :argh:


----------



## validreasoning

corporation2.0 said:


> As we all know, the ratings usually start off strongest in the first hour and decrease with each subsequent hour. It's a huge weakness of the 3-hour format.


its only recent weeks the first hour is the strongest, for a long time it was the second hour. the fact remains that hour 1 this past monday was the 4th strongest in 11 months so this is a W in the bryan column no matter what way you look at it.


----------



## Starbuck

validreasoning said:


> its only recent weeks the first hour is the strongest, for a long time it was the second hour. the fact remains that hour 1 this past monday was the 4th strongest in 11 months so this is a W in the bryan column no matter what way you look at it.


Lies. People were clearly awaiting the usual Authority promo to start the show. 

:vince2


----------



## The True Believer

It's strange to see this thread has activity again. Last time I checked, it had dwindled down next to nothing. Part of the reason I did was because I figured that people finally realized how pointless there rating discussions. I mean, I don't want to rain on anyone's parade or anything or make them feel stupid but can someone tell me what the point of trying to gauge someone's worth to overall presence, popularity, etc. using TV ratings? I mean, with PPV buys, you have more of a leg to stand on but when it pertains to these 3 hour RAW's, 9.7x out of 10, you're going to get a downward spiral in rating numbers form hour to hour no matter what starts off the show.

If Orton starts the show, that hour get the biggest rating and if Daniel Bryan closes the show, that hour will get the lowest. 

Unless something mind blowing happens to close the show, like Austin wrestling or Hogan going one on one with The Rock for the third and final time, the third hour will always draw the lowest overall rating. And individual segments, while a better indicator, usually don't make too much of a margrin between segments unless their in different hours all together.

TLDR; what's the point? :draper2


----------



## Starbuck

Krinkles said:


> It's strange to see this thread has activity again. Last time I checked, it had dwindled down next to nothing. Part of the reason I did was because I figured that people finally realized how pointless there rating discussions. I mean, I don't want to rain on anyone's parade or anything or make them feel stupid but can someone tell me what the point of trying to gauge someone's worth to overall presence, popularity, etc. using TV ratings? I mean, with PPV buys, you have more of a leg to stand on but when it pertains to these 3 hour RAW's, 9.7x out of 10, you're going to get a downward spiral in rating numbers form hour to hour no matter what starts off the show.
> 
> If Orton starts the show, that hour get the biggest rating and if Daniel Bryan closes the show, that hour will get the lowest.
> 
> Unless something mind blowing happens to close the show, like Austin wrestling or Hogan going one on one with The Rock for the third and final time, the third hour will always draw the lowest overall rating. And individual segments, while a better indicator, usually don't make too much of a margrin between segments unless their in different hours all together.
> 
> TLDR; what's the point? :draper2


When breakdown were released you could pinpoint what exact segments were pulling numbers rather than overall hours. It therefore gave an indication of what storylines were clicking with the viewing audience and by extension, the superstars involved would get credit/flamed for a particular storyline or segment doing good or bad. All without considering external variables of course.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Londrick said:


> Just when I think the greatness of this thread is over, Sonnen Says vs Happenstan happens.


You just had to say it. Now the debate hasn't gone on for three days >_<


----------



## Starbuck

TheGMofGods said:


> You just had to say it. Now the debate hasn't gone on for three days >_<


Just wait until the final Summerslam 2013 buys come out next week. Then we'll have a mark war for the ages lol.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Starbuck said:


> Just wait until the final Summerslam 2013 buys come out next week. Then we'll have a mark war for the ages lol.


Yea...and I'll probably be a part of it :/


----------



## Starbuck

TheGMofGods said:


> Yea...and I'll probably be a part of it :/


Of course you will. Meanwhile I'll get the popcorn.


----------



## The True Believer

Starbuck said:


> Just wait until the final Summerslam 2013 buys come out next week. Then we'll have a mark war for the ages lol.


We'll have to turn off most of the site's features to avoid any crashing.


----------



## Schrute_Farms

Wow those PPV buys are absolutely disgusting, Im still shocked that many people ordered Survivor Series, Battle Ground is hilarious.


----------



## D.M.N.

Predict Raw's number, hmmm. I'm going for a 3.5/3.6 and nudging over 5 million for the three hours.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Starbuck said:


> Of course you will. Meanwhile I'll get the popcorn.


Could you get me some fruit punch while you're at it? Kay thanks.


----------



## Wrestlinfan35

lol'd hard at those PPV numbers. THE BRYAN/ORTON ERA. :lmao


----------



## Starbuck

TheGMofGods said:


> Could you get me some fruit punch while you're at it? Kay thanks.


I'll get you a Pepsi. 

unk


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Wrestlinfan35 said:


> lol'd hard at those PPV numbers. THE BRYAN/ORTON ERA. :lmao



What does it say about Punk that he couldnt main event during that era? *C*ant *M*ainevent *Punk*


----------



## validreasoning

D.M.N. said:


> Predict Raw's number, hmmm. I'm going for a 3.5/3.6 and nudging over 5 million for the three hours.


If they advertised hogans return for a month like they did Batista then who knows the numbers Raw might have done. Baffled at how wwe have handled this especially given they wanted the biggest audience possible watching this coming Monday night.


----------



## Sonnen Says

^ But they will have Hogan, Taker, Brock, Batista, etc. So expect that kind of rating.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Raw this coming week should get a very high number. Returns of Taker and Hogan, it's the start of the real build to Mania, and it has hype around the WWE Network launch. I'd say at least one of the hours get over 5 million, maybe two.


----------



## validreasoning

Sonnen Says said:


> ^ But they will have Hogan, Taker, Brock, Batista, etc. So expect that kind of rating.


nobody knows taker is there outside the hardcore iwc. lesnar and batista mean very little for ratings at this stage and again very few know lesnar will be there.

if you don't advertise well in advance the only people watching will be those that would be watching normally. the best example of this is rocks return in 2011, week before he returned raw drew a 3.3 and FELL to a 3.14 the night he came back because nobody knew he was going to be there (outside the hardcore iwc). 

hogan in 2014 doesn't have the capacity to make a difference 3, 4 or 5 weeks from now as we saw in tna. you get one major rating pop from him on the night he returns if you build to it on tv. no doubt in my mind raw would have broken 6 million for the first hour had they ran a hogan return video at the rumble and every week on raw/sd since.


----------



## D.M.N.

The WWE YouTube hits from this past Monday's Raw:

- 231k - Sheamus vs Randy Orton
- 192k - John Cena vs Cesaro
- 186k - Batista and Randy Orton segment
- 159k - The Wyatt Family and The Shield confrontation
- 141k - Mark Henry vs Roman Reigns
- 123k - Daniel Bryan vs Kane
- 95k - The Shield promo
- 89k - Jey Uso vs Billy Gunn
- 82k - Daniel Bryan vs Christian
- 79k - Sin Cara and Los Matadores vs The Wyatt Family
- 67k - Big E vs 3MB
- 60k - Elimination Chamber promo
- 57k - Santino Marella vs Fandango
- 38k - Kofi Kingston vs Jack Swagger


----------



## The_Workout_Buddy

so the more promoted segments are the more viewed, wow *DAT* revelation...

89k - Jey Uso vs Billy Gunn... those must be real WWE fans.


----------



## superuser1

D.M.N. said:


> The WWE YouTube hits from this past Monday's Raw:
> 
> *- 231k - Sheamus vs Randy Orton*
> - 192k - John Cena vs Cesaro
> *- 186k - Batista and Randy Orton segment*
> - 159k - The Wyatt Family and The Shield confrontation
> - 141k - Mark Henry vs Roman Reigns
> - 123k - Daniel Bryan vs Kane
> - 95k - The Shield promo
> - 89k - Jey Uso vs Billy Gunn
> - 82k - Daniel Bryan vs Christian
> - 79k - Sin Cara and Los Matadores vs The Wyatt Family
> - 67k - Big E vs 3MB
> - 60k - Elimination Chamber promo
> - 57k - Santino Marella vs Fandango
> - 38k - Kofi Kingston vs Jack Swagger


If youtube is the new breakdown Orton bringing in them numbers


----------



## D.M.N.

Random Raw breakdown from 2006 (my bold) : http://www.wrestlingforum.com/class...rs-ago-wrestling-observer-9.html#post25579241



> Raw on 5/15 drew a *3.90 rating* (3.77 first hour; 4.02 second hour; *4.86 million viewers* and 917,000 (3.5 rating) in Males 18-34. Top demo was against male teenagers with a 4.9.
> 
> In the segment-by-segment, the Cena & RVD vs. HHH, Benjamin & Masters match gained 610,000 viewers from start to finish. The second segment is usually a gainer from people who show up late, but this was far better than usual build. Spirit Squad’s Johnny and Nicky vs. Goldust & Snitsky lost 97,000 viewers, and that is not usually a segment that loses. I’d bet money that it wasn’t that match that lost it but the preceding “See No Evil” video piece No. 1. The Foley, Funk and Edge segment with the promo and angle gained 720,000 viewers to the show’s peak rating of a 4.55. That’s obviously great growth. Striker vs. Eugene plus “See No Evil” piece No. 2 lost 842,000 viewers, which is probably close to record levels this year. Umaga’s squash and a few interviews gained 48,000 viewers. The “See No Evil” piece No. 3 and beginning of the Michaels vs. Kenny main event lost 286,000 viewers. Since obviously, as the next quarter shows, people did not click off during the main event, that speaks volumes for how many did, but all that stuff is a necessary evil. The overrun with Michaels vs. Kenny with the sledgehammer and Vince cradling Shane ended up gaining 926,000 viewers to a 4.41 rating.
> 
> Raw on 9/11 segment notes: The parking lot beat down of DX by Show, Shane, Cade and Murdoch lost 372,000 and was the lowest rated segment of the show (3.3), but the Vince vs. Hunter match gained 869,000 for the ratings peak of 4.0, which is somewhat of a disappointing number.
> 
> Raw on 9/18 segment notes: The Orton promo and the build-up to the six-way gained 508,000 but the match itself lost 508,000. The six-man main event gained 635,000 for the ratings peak of 4.3, which beat the ratings peak of last week with the Vince vs. Hunter main event.


2002



> The RAW on 12/9 was the first one in a while to show consistent growth throughout the show. But the first hour rating was the lowest for RAW in 5 years.
> 
> The Triple H/Jeff Hardy match and Flair/Michaels interview(which was put on at the top of the first hour after some combination of Jerichristian and Bookdust had the highest rated segment of the night in that spot for the last couple weeks) only added 147,000 viewers.
> 
> Meanwhile, the wrestling main event of Jericho/Christian/Victoria v. Dudleys/Trish was the hit of the night, adding almost half a million viewers in what is usually a weak timeslot.
> 
> The Triple H/Shawn Michaels over-run only added 130,000 viewers.
> 
> RVD/Batista added 1,000 viewers. Kane v. Samoans lost 41,000 viewers. The Tough Enough tag match added 160,00 viewers.


2004



> The complete report on the 6/28 Raw show was a *3.67 rating*, with a 3.37 first hour and 3.94 second hour and *4.62 million viewers* (1.44 viewers per home)
> 
> As far as growth, Chris Jericho & Edge vs. Randy Orton & Batista gained 661,000 viewers over 17:00 which is good. Kane interview and Divas Search video lost 318,000 viewers, which is terrible for the time slot. HHH vs. William Regal with Eugene as ref gained 547,000 viewers, which is above normal for the time slot. La Resistance vs. Sgt. Slaughter & Rhyno lost 53,000 viewers, which isn't bad. Chris Benoit vs. Kane gained 390,000 viewers, peaking at 5.23 million viewers, which is about average for a main event.


----------



## superuser1

^lol we have to resort to old breakdowns to keep this thread interesting


----------



## MaybeLock

D.M.N. said:


> The WWE YouTube hits from this past Monday's Raw:
> 
> - 231k - Sheamus vs Randy Orton
> - 192k - John Cena vs Cesaro
> - 186k - Batista and Randy Orton segment
> - 159k - The Wyatt Family and The Shield confrontation
> - 141k - Mark Henry vs Roman Reigns
> - 123k - Daniel Bryan vs Kane
> - 95k - The Shield promo
> - 89k - Jey Uso vs Billy Gunn
> - 82k - Daniel Bryan vs Christian
> - 79k - Sin Cara and Los Matadores vs The Wyatt Family
> - 67k - Big E vs 3MB
> - 60k - Elimination Chamber promo
> - 57k - Santino Marella vs Fandango
> - 38k - Kofi Kingston vs Jack Swagger


This proves that Internet fans are all Batista, Orton, Sheamus and Cena fans, while Bryan is over with the casuals. 
The world is changing :argh:


----------



## #Mark

ham619 said:


> :lol at DB's drawing power, even youtube no sells it :ti and cena, batista, orton bringing in DEM NUMBERS. :bigdave rton2 :cena5


Bryan had two matches and combined their way higher than Batista's segment and Cena's match. Majority of the people already saw Bryan's match anyways, you know, because it was the fourth highest hour 1 rating since March 2013 (Higher than the post Mania Raw) :yes:


----------



## TheGreatBanana

The only reason why that Sheamus Vs Orton video got that many views is because of the melee that happened at the end. Nothing else.


----------



## superuser1

TheGreatBanana said:


> The only reason why that Sheamus Vs Orton video got that many views is because of the melee that happened at the end. Nothing else.


Nah Randy just be bringing in dem numberssssss


----------



## Waffelz

Do you think they'll get over 5.5m for any segments tonight? I'll say:

1 hour: 5.3m
2 hour: 5.1m
3 hour: 4.8m


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Can't wait for the SS buyrates, can't wait for the return of quarter hour breakdowns, can't wait for the continuing Midget Marks vs Muscle Marks saga.


----------



## MaybeLock

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Can't wait for the SS buyrates, can't wait for the return of quarter hour breakdowns, can't wait for the continuing Midget Marks vs Muscle Marks saga.


This is the WWE Network Era brother, no more breakdowns. Only google trends and video hits.

The future of the TV Ratings thread IS NOW!


----------



## JY57

> - Last night's WWE RAW ranked #4 for the night in Nielsen's new Twitter TV ratings, trailing ABC's The Bachelor, NBC's The Voice and MTV's Teen Wolf. RAW had a unique audience of 2.305 million, which represents the number of Twitter accounts that commented on the show. This was up from the previous week. RAW had total impressions of 16.028 million, which represents the number of times the show was tweeted about. This was also up from the previous week.


http://www.lordsofpain.net/news/wwe...RAW_WWE_In_Green_Bay.html#MUUlRBfWQOeYzRb6.99


----------



## JY57

*



WWE Raw Monday's top cable program with a 1.6 adults 18-49 rating, up from last week's 1.74adults 18-49 rating. Swamp People was second with a 1.0 adults 18-49 rating.

Click to expand...

*Hour 1 - 4.892 million
Hour 2 - 4.778 million
Hour 3 - 4.313 million


----------



## Vyer

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.892 million
> Hour 2 - 4.778 million
> Hour 3 - 4.313 million


Almost broke 5 million. Not bad, not bad at all.


----------



## JY57

did barely better than post Elimination Chamber Raw last year (1 - 4.82 million, 2 - 4.67 million, 3 - 4.49 million)

Average - 4.661 million (2014) vs 4.66 million (2013)


----------



## CJohn3:16

JY57 said:


> *Hour 1 - 4.892 million*
> Hour 2 - 4.778 million
> Hour 3 - 4.313 million


:vince5 :vince2 :hhh2 :hogan2 :trips2 :vince$


----------



## checkcola

Did Emma/Summer Rae then tag title match lose a lot of viewers? hmmmm


----------



## JY57

^ the 7:15 - 7:45 PM area is a death slot every week.


----------



## validreasoning

Vyer said:


> Almost broke 5 million. Not bad, not bad at all.


considering hour 1 of batistas return easily broke 5 million and hour 1 last week did more than 4.6 million, less than 4.9 million coming off a ppv and hogans return after 7 years is big disappointment

this is why you need to advertise returns on tv otherwise no new people will be watching.


----------



## Starbuck

Hogan news broke on a Friday. They had 1 PPV and basically 2 days to hype it up and the first hour pulls 4.8 million viewers. I'd consider that a huge success. Of course the EC fallout contributed but yep, Hulkamania lives. Whether or not they can sustain it will tell the tale. Orton/Batista and Taker/Brock were made official last night while Cena/Wyatt and HHH/Bryan were overtly hinted at. The fans know what to expect now. Let's see if they are interested.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Hour 2 held up nicely. Hour 3 is just reality now. Promising Lesnar, the first Reigns/wyatt singles match and Bryan for the first 7 or 8 minutes of the hour and it still was down from Hour 2. It's just how it is. Fans apparently tire before the third hour is up. Without breakdown info, all you can say is Raw did pretty well for the whole show.


----------



## JY57

final rating - 3.31


----------



## WWE

JY57 said:


> final rating - 3.31


:hogan2


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.892 million


My reaction:

http://youtu.be/Xu9JEkGSRRo?t=2m25s (2:25-2:29)


----------



## Joker King

> - Monday's WWE RAW with Hulk Hogan's return, The Undertaker's return and fallout from Elimination Chamber averaged 4,661,000 viewers, up 7% from the previous week's 4,364,000 viewers. RAW was the #1 show on cable for the night and did a 1.6 in the adults 18-49 demographic, down from last week's 1.74.
> 
> For this week's show, the first hour of RAW - which featured Hulk Hogan's return - averaged 4,892,000 viewers, the second hour averaged 4,778,000 and the final hour averaged 4,313,000 viewers, a 12% drop from the first hour.
> 
> By comparison, the January 20th episode of RAW which featured Batista's return averaged 5,249,000 viewers in the first hour. That episode averaged 4,869,000 viewers.


http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news...boost-the-raw-viewership/#qPzKw8Q7z37Gf6xT.99


:ti Pathetic rating. Hogan, Taker, Brock.... basically nobody drew. Batista was the only guy who was able to do it, but they seemed to have ruined him already.


----------



## Your_Solution

Not a great rating considering the star power they brought for the show. Hopefully now that everyone knows Hogan/Taker/Lesnar are around the ratings go up next week.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Daniel Bryan cuts 2 promos

Ratings go down despite massive star power

COINCIDENCE?


----------



## wjd1989

So basically, Hogan drew - Undertaker didm't.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

wjd1989 said:


> So basically, Hogan drew - Undertaker didm't.


Infomercialmania runnin wild trumps some old bald guy with eyeliner every time.


----------



## BRRROCK-LESNAR

The launch of the WWE Universe drew, brother :hogan2


----------



## superuser1

BRRROCK-LESNAR said:


> The launch of the WWE Universe drew, brother :hogan2


Hahahahahaha


----------



## validreasoning

for the first 8 weeks of 2013 (the rock appeared on 7 of those shows) raw averaged 4.59 million viewers 

for the first 8 weeks of 2014 raw averaged 4.51 million viewers


----------



## TheGreatBanana

Joker King said:


> http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news...boost-the-raw-viewership/#qPzKw8Q7z37Gf6xT.99
> 
> 
> :ti Pathetic rating. Hogan, Taker, Brock.... basically nobody drew. Batista was the only guy who was able to do it, but they seemed to have ruined him already.


I don't see how that is pathetic. Batista had weeks ad weeks of advertising. Hogan was advertised on short notice. 

Plus no one knew if Taker was coming back or not, sure the internet knew, but casuals did not.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Not to mention, Taker was strictly in the overrun, which doesn't seem to get counted into the third hour anyway.


----------



## Bushmaster

If the they had well over 5 million viewers in the 1st hour, would Hogan have gotten a majority of tje credit? Batista was hyped for weeks to wrestling fans but I thought the Hogan host thing was all over the news. 

Even though it was only a few days before Raw wouldn't all the Hogan attention in newspapers and on TV shows reach a wider audience than the hyping of Batista?

I'd say the numbers are disappointing because this Raw was being hyped as a special show. Usually special shows do much much better. Day after a PPV also usually does really well.
Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## D.M.N.

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Not to mention, Taker was strictly in the overrun, which doesn't seem to get counted into the third hour anyway.


Yes it does.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

D.M.N. said:


> Yes it does.


Hm, could've sworn I was told by somebody it doesn't. 

Well, whatever it is, I'm sure the overrun got a big boost. I do wonder how Wyatt/Reigns did? That's a fairly big match-up on today's roster, first time they face each other, etc. When it started, thats usually the slot that loses a lot though.


----------



## Londrick

Not surprised at the third hour considering Bray was main eventing. The whole hour probably did good until that match then it lost half a million viewers.


----------



## Waffelz

Londrick is the greatest of trolls


----------



## KingLobos

3 hours sucks.

From the 20 minute jobber match (Christian cough Sheamus cough)

To the countless commercials

They need better time management. MORE time for promos and mid card development of story lines. Not pointless 30 minute mid card matches. Save that crap for ppvs.


----------



## InTheAirTonight

The Universe tuned in for Big Dave. Nobody else.

So much for Boootista.

:ti

Already demonstrates again what we already know. It's not nobody wants to see Batista and Orton main event mania. It's just that the live crowd had been hijacked by these overweight, zit faced, curly haired, neck bearded, never got laid losers who would only mark for their fellow hobos regardless of how untalented and unfascinating they are.


----------



## D.M.N.

YouTube hits:

- 1.01m - The Undertaker returns
- 308k - Hulk Hogan returns
- 199k - Roman Reigns vs Bray Wyatt
- 158k - Batista vs Alberto del Rio
- 174k - Paul Heyman and Brock Lesnar segment
- 140k - John Cena and Wyatt Family confrontation
- 126k - Emma vs Summer Rae
- 125k - Daniel Bryan vs Kane
- 110k - The Shield and Wyatt Family backstage
- 81k - Big E vs Cesaro
- 72k - The Usos vs New Age Outlaws
- 62k - Sheamus vs Christian

Undertaker > everyone that ever existed ever :shocked:


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

InTheAirTonight said:


> Already demonstrates again what we already know. It's not nobody wants to see Batista and Orton main event mania. It's just that the live crowd had been hijacked by these overweight, zit faced, curly haired, neck bearded, never got laid losers who would only mark for their fellow hobos regardless of how untalented and unfascinating they are.


:lmao

Intheairtonight has risen up to be one of my favorite trolls on this forum (helps that his username is awesome). Watch out, Londrick!

@DMN

Yes, Undertaker>everyone that ever existed. You shouldn't need some YouTube view number to realize that.


----------



## JY57

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/wwe-p...uys-2013-mitb-summerslam-night-champions.html

posted updated buys for MITB, SSlam, & NOC


----------



## Joker King

TheGreatBanana said:


> I don't see how that is pathetic. Batista had weeks ad weeks of advertising. Hogan was advertised on short notice.


But as per wrestling marks, "Bootista" is no Hogan, is he? :tyson Hell he's not even in Cena's level according to you guys. Hogan who is a mega-star should have done well, and his return was hyped all week.



> Plus no one knew if Taker was coming back or not, sure the internet knew, but casuals did not.


Yeah, that explains the youtube views. Taker is most over with the internet fans. Brock was advertised though, crowds were even chanting for Taker before he returned, so I reckon lot of them knew, but not enough interest from them.


----------



## YoungGun_UK

Starbuck said:


> Hogan news broke on a Friday. They had 1 PPV and basically 2 days to hype it up and the first hour pulls 4.8 million viewers. I'd consider that a huge success. Of course the EC fallout contributed but yep, Hulkamania lives. Whether or not they can sustain it will tell the tale. Orton/Batista and Taker/Brock were made official last night while Cena/Wyatt and HHH/Bryan were overtly hinted at. The fans know what to expect now. Let's see if they are interested.


Think Brock/Taker will bring in people, its how they build it whether they can sustain it. The YouTube clip has already surpassed 1M views.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

D.M.N. said:


> YouTube hits:
> 
> - 1.01m - The Undertaker returns
> - 308k - Hulk Hogan returns
> - 199k - Roman Reigns vs Bray Wyatt
> - 158k - Batista vs Alberto del Rio
> - 174k - Paul Heyman and Brock Lesnar segment
> - 140k - John Cena and Wyatt Family confrontation
> *- 126k - Emma vs Summer Rae
> - 125k - Daniel Bryan vs Kane*
> - 110k - The Shield and Wyatt Family backstage
> - 81k - Big E vs Cesaro
> - 72k - The Usos vs New Age Outlaws
> - 62k - Sheamus vs Christian
> 
> Undertaker > everyone that ever existed ever :shocked:


"The most over guy since the Attitude Era" playing second fiddle to the Divas and Santino :ti :ti :ti :ti


----------



## Tardbasher12

[email protected] Batista marks trying to use YouTube to determine if a person draws viewers.


----------



## I > U

Tardbasher12 said:


> [email protected] Batista marks trying to use YouTube to determine if a person draws viewers.


Lol @ you. Tell me why Taker's segment has the most views? It's because Taker is one of the biggest draws. You can use YouTube to determine if a person draws viewers.


----------



## validreasoning

I > U said:


> Lol @ you. Tell me why Taker's segment has the most views? It's because Taker is one of the biggest draws. You can use YouTube to determine if a person draws viewers.


because maybe a large proportion of people didn't watch the 3rd hour of raw
because maybe it was the undertakers first appearance on tv in a year

batistas first appearance on tv last month has nearly 1.5 million hits on youtube...his first match on free tv in 4 years this past week has 175,000, thats some fall in a month.


----------



## robertdeniro

D.M.N. said:


> YouTube hits:
> 
> - 1.01m - The Undertaker returns
> - 308k - Hulk Hogan returns
> - 199k - Roman Reigns vs Bray Wyatt
> - 158k - Batista vs Alberto del Rio
> - 174k - Paul Heyman and Brock Lesnar segment
> - 140k - John Cena and Wyatt Family confrontation
> - 126k - Emma vs Summer Rae
> - 125k - Daniel Bryan vs Kane
> - 110k - The Shield and Wyatt Family backstage
> - 81k - Big E vs Cesaro
> - 72k - The Usos vs New Age Outlaws
> - 62k - Sheamus vs Christian
> 
> Undertaker > everyone that ever existed ever :shocked:


Taker was/is one of the biggest draws of all time,only haters deny that.


----------



## Mr.S

UT returns 1 time a year and Bryan wrestles every house show. Who wants to watch that average match with Kane?

Can't believe people are discussing something this stupid. Besides Brock is a massive draw up there with Taker. You put Bryan with Brock in a compelling segment in ME with Heyman around and man it's going to draw. UT's return is set up for a year, Hogan for half a decade.

If they still can't draw, they should be jobbing to Santino. Can't believe people are even discussing it. Could not care shit about Bryan wrestling Kane.

Besides who uses Youtube, I use Hac*********y.


----------



## Waffelz

What we should be laughing at is that Hogan didn't even get half Undertaker's views.


----------



## SerapisLiber

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> D.M.N. said:
> 
> 
> 
> YouTube hits:
> 
> - 1.01m - The Undertaker returns
> - 308k - Hulk Hogan returns
> - 199k - Roman Reigns vs Bray Wyatt
> - 158k - Batista vs Alberto del Rio
> - 174k - Paul Heyman and Brock Lesnar segment
> - 140k - John Cena and Wyatt Family confrontation
> - 126k - Emma vs Summer Rae
> - 125k - Daniel Bryan vs Kane
> - 110k - The Shield and Wyatt Family backstage
> - 81k - Big E vs Cesaro
> - 72k - The Usos vs New Age Outlaws
> - 62k - Sheamus vs Christian
> 
> Undertaker > everyone that ever existed ever :shocked:
> 
> 
> 
> "The most over guy since the Attitude Era" playing second fiddle to the Divas and Santino :ti :ti :ti :ti
Click to expand...

Which one?










*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vote_splitting*


----------



## D.M.N.

Tardbasher12 said:


> [email protected] Batista marks trying to use YouTube to determine if a person draws viewers.


Actually, if you read my posts (I suspect you don't), you'll notice that I've been doing that for many weeks since the breakdowns dried up.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I wonder, is there a way to see the number of unique viewers on each video (so people who watch the video multiple times are only accounted for once)? That would be interesting to see.


----------



## #Mark

Just checked on YT and Emma/Summer Rae has the same amount of views as Cena's promo with Wyatt now.. For whatever reason, that segment is over on YT.


----------



## Londrick

#Mark said:


> Just checked on YT and Emma/Summer Rae has the same amount of views as Cena's promo with Wyatt now.. For whatever reason, that segment is over on YT.


Probably has something to do with this:


----------



## Bfo4jd

Fighting over Youtute views? :ti Seriously, is this what this thread has come down to? 

Any increase in YT views is influenced based on share rate of a particular video, in social media. That's why pointless but funny videos like Vomiting/farting have insane amount of views. People keep sharing it, just because their friends are doing it. This, in no way, shows if a segment/match was great or who's over with the crowd.


----------



## CZWRUBE

*Re: CHECK OUT THOSE RATINGS Thread **All TV Ratings And Discussions Here***



CHIcagoMade said:


> New thread means new meltdowns.
> 
> :mark: :mark: :mark:


I like watching Meltdowns!!! (Y)


----------



## etta411

MITB - from 195,000 buys to 223,000 Buys (up from 2011 - 205,000 & 2012 - 206,000)

SummerSlam - from 296,000 Buys to 332,000 Buys (down from 392,000 in 2012 and up from 311,000 from 2011)s

NOC - from 175,000 buys to 196,000 Buys (down from 207,000 in 2012)



Good to see Bryan is a bigger draw than Vince probably thought.

Also, I would probably attribute the great MITB buyrate to RVD -- which makes it all the more baffling how he was booked


----------



## Achilles

SerapisLiber said:


> Which one?


Nice find.


----------



## TheGreatBanana

Joker King said:


> But as per wrestling marks, "Bootista" is no Hogan, is he? :tyson Hell he's not even in Cena's level according to you guys. Hogan who is a mega-star should have done well, and his return was hyped all week.


News of Hogan's return was confirmed and published on the previous Friday before Raw. Where is this week long hype you talk about?

Fact is Batista had a month long hype on *national TV*, Hogan didn't. Hogan got great media attention, but it wasn't enough to influence ratings significantly, even though he did spike viewership.


----------



## InTheAirTonight

Man, I'm just feeling sorry for these neckbeards now, lol.

Clear as day nobody else loves their malnourished idols other than them.


----------



## bigbuxxx

where do you guys find ratings by the quarter hour for raw?


----------



## Cack_Thu

What's wrong with Dave Meltzer's lazy ass?Cant he publish some quarterly breakdown by squeezing out infos from his sources anymore?


----------



## funnyfaces1

Cack_Thu said:


> What's wrong with Dave Meltzer's lazy ass?Cant he publish some quarterly breakdown by squeezing out infos from his sources anymore?


He's too busy announcing reports of the GOAT's return.


----------



## Cack_Thu

funnyfaces1 said:


> He's too busy announcing reports of the GOAT's return.


The Great One is NOT coming back anytime soon.

For someone who claims to have WWE inside contacts,he is certainly turning out to be a sore disappointment when he cant even get his hands on quarterly breakdowns.


----------



## The Caped Crusader

Cack_Thu said:


> What's wrong with Dave Meltzer's lazy ass?Cant he publish some quarterly breakdown by squeezing out infos from his sources anymore?


He said recently on his podcast or something that Batista has been in the highest rated segment each week since his return. So we know who's bringing in the viewers more than anyone else right now at least.


----------



## WWE

Wait.. I hear some of you are resorting to youtube video views to showcase you point.

:lol


----------



## Bob the Jobber

Thuganomics said:


> Wait.. I hear some of you are resorting to youtube video views to showcase you point.
> 
> :lol


Searching "WWE" and sorting by view count, the #2 video (after DC vs. Marvel WWE '12 video) with over 14 million views is...






DEM DRAWS


----------



## JY57

Smackdown Viewership Rises from 2,729,000 to 2,796,000 million


----------



## WWE

JY57 said:


> Smackdown Viewership Rises from 2,729,000 to 2,796,000 million


:bigdave


----------



## holt_hogan

Just spent a little time putting this together, it puts the topic of ratings in perspective in terms of where they were, how they are doing and where they're going. Free to save, share or comment on.










*Data:*

Year	Raw	S/D	Impact
99	5.90	4.37	
00	5.88	4.73	
01	4.64	4.03	
02	4.01	3.52	
03	3.76	3.30	
04	3.67	3.18	
05	3.81	3.04	0.79
06	3.90	2.46	0.89
07	3.61	2.64	1.04
08	3.24	2.33	1.06
09	3.57	1.94	1.14
10	3.28	1.81	1.06
11	3.21	1.95	1.17
12	3.00	1.89	1.01
13	3.01	1.92	0.99


----------



## JY57

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_76779.shtml#.UxYUW9y4mlI



> WWE Raw generated PPV-level social media interest on Monday night, according to Nielsen's Twitter TV Ratings.
> 
> Raw produced a "unique audience" of 2.286 million users tweeting about Raw, down slightly from 2.304 million last week.
> 
> However, Raw's total impressions (the number of people viewing the tweets) sky-rocketed to 22.262 million, up 26 percent from last week's previously huge audience the night after the Elimination Chamber PPV.
> 
> By comparison, the Royal Rumble's social media reach was at a similar level - 2.430 million unique users and total impressions of 27.082 million.
> 
> On Monday night, Raw ranked #4 in the unique audience category on all of TV, but nearly doubled #1-ranked The Bachelor's total impressions.


----------



## Cmpunk91

Punk don't even have to be there to make ratings go up.


----------



## Fissiks

Punk finally draws in those ratings lol


----------



## funnyfaces1

Chicago always brings big business thanks to DAT PUNK LOVE. Remember the last time RAW was there, Punk drew one of the largest gains in the 10:00 PM slot in history unk2

Holy shit. :woolcock is here.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Punk don't even need to be there to draw! unk5


----------



## superuser1

Damn Cena bringing in them ratings the guy outdraws the whole roster


----------



## D.M.N.

4.672m, 4.620m and 4.438m.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Very good numbers again.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Hours 1 & 3 did a 1.6 in the demo, while Hour 2 did a 1.5. Hour 3 did a better job of retaining viewers than recent weeks have.


----------



## Starbuck

Much more consistent than usual. Only around 300k - 200k separating each hour this week. 

bama


----------



## FITZ

The last segment usually does really well and since it was a lot longer than normal that probably helped the overall hour average stay up.


----------



## JY57

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_76785.shtml#.UxZlh9y4mlI



> WWE Raw on Monday, March 3 scored a 3.26 rating, down from a 3.31 rating last week following the Elimination Chamber PPV.
> 
> Raw averaged 4.576 million viewers, down two percent from last week's audience of 4.661 million viewers.
> 
> Hourly Break Down: 4.672 million first hour viewers, slight decline to 4.620 million second hour viewers, and a four percent decline to 4.438 million third hour viewers.
> 
> The third hour was slightly above last week's third hour. Despite the drop-off from the second hour, it was the most-watched third hour since the night after the Royal Rumble episode of Raw. That gap in time also captures the rate of drop-offs over the past month.
> 
> - The first Raw in March over the past three years has gone 3.54 rating (2013), 3.25 rating (2012), and 3.92 rating (2011). The biggest difference is the teen male rating, which was down five-tenths of a rating from last week's Raw and the 2013 Raw.
> 
> - On cable TV Monday night, Raw ranked #1 in overall viewers and key male demographics. The bright spot was males 18-34, which increased two-tenths of a rating to the highest point since January 20.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: There wasn't a strong hook for casual/irregular viewers to entice them to tune in, so WWE wasn't able to grow the audience beyond the standard level for Raw right now despite online buzz for whether C.M. Punk would return in his hometown. Plus, viewers who sampled last week's Raw setting the stage for WrestleMania saw a disjointed show that didn't create a lot of momentum heading into Mania season. WWE tried to re-start the Mania push this week, plus WWE has a Hulk Hogan teaser for next week, so that should make for an interesting rating evaluation next Monday.


final rating - 3.26


----------



## DoubtGin

Anyone who can tell me what happened at that March RAW show (with the 3.92 rating)? Seemed to have gathered quite the interest back then.


----------



## WWE

> WWE Raw on Monday, March 3 scored a 3.26 rating, down from a 3.31 rating last week following the Elimination Chamber PPV


unk :HHH2 :ti


----------



## KingLobos

No Undertaker. No ratings.


----------



## Cack_Thu

JY57 said:


> http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_76785.shtml#.UxZlh9y4mlI
> 
> 
> 
> final rating - 3.26


:lmao @ Punk's anticipated return nos.The whole show had CM Phil written all over it.Seems no fucks were given by the casuals.


----------



## MaybeLock

Cack_Thu said:


> :lmao @ Punk's anticipated return nos.The whole show had CM Phil written all over it.Seems no fucks were given by the casuals.


Considering that 3.31 is what Hogan and Undertaker returning in the same show (first show after a PPV, by the way) does, I dont see how 3.26 is bad. unk2


----------



## Cack_Thu

MaybeLock said:


> Considering that 3.31 is what Hogan and Undertaker returning in the same show (first show after a PPV, by the way) does, I dont see how 3.26 is bad. unk2


Well,a big disappointment considering CM Punk is one of the biggest if not THE biggest draw on the internet.On top of that,his marks were desperately trying to garner everybody's attention with thier #HijackRAW shit.Many were expecting Batista-level views of over 5M this week,but ah man,what a letdown.:no:


----------



## TheStig

Starbuck said:


> Much more consistent than usual. Only around 300k - 200k separating each hour this week.
> 
> bama


Isnt the overrun counted towards the third hour? Might have something to do with it. Decent rating as it wont get much higher the following weeks either and then plummit after wm to lower than 3's at this rate.


----------



## superuser1

KingLobos said:


> No Undertaker. No ratings.


Less Orton. Less ratings.


----------



## InTheAirTonight

Phil sinking ratings even when he's not around.

:ti


----------



## BlueRover

While I almost never care for ratings, it is truly remarkable to see how few people actually give the slightest damn about CM Punk. Which means the whole "Punk revolution" and all those Chicago crybabies chanting his name are exactly what we suspected all along - a small handful of irrelevant losers who the WWE are right to ignore. Why don't you try to get people to watch the show instead of making more pointless Punk avatars and signatures?


----------



## Waffelz

Not quite sure why folk are laughing at the ratings. Very strange.


----------



## BlueRover

Waffelz said:


> Not quite sure why folk are laughing at the ratings. Very strange.


According to the PUNK train, this was supposed to be one of the biggest Raws in history, with everyone and their mother tuning in. Because PUNK is a massive superstar, you know.


----------



## DingoMan

CM Punk has never drawn a dime, so I don't know why there would be any surprise at his rumoured return in his home town not drawing...


----------



## superuser1

DingoMan said:


> CM Punk has never drawn a dime, so I don't know why there would be any surprise at his rumoured return in his home town not drawing...


But CM Punk saved wrestling with his pipebomb bro


----------



## Choke2Death

So much for MEGA STAR PUNK increasing ratings when he's not there. :lmao


----------



## Nimbus

3.26 rating....this just proves that CM Punk cant draw shit.


----------



## Waffelz

Who the fuck was saying it was one of the biggest RAWs ever? Fucking mentalists.

CM Punk wasn't even there. Why the fuck are folk laughing at him? He was NEVER going to return. The rating is okay. If anything, you should laugh at Undertaker and Hogan only just about drawing more last week in a post PPV RAW.


----------



## Peter Carroll

Edge drew more and didn't have as high of demands as this clown.


----------



## #Mark

Wow, people are now blaming Punk for a show that drew a relatively good number and a show he wasn't even advertised for. I'm not a Punk fan in the slightest but even I find that absurd.


----------



## Cack_Thu

BlueRover said:


> While I almost never care for ratings, it is truly remarkable to *see how few people actually give the slightest damn *about CM Punk. Which means the whole "Punk revolution" and all those *Chicago crybabies* chanting his name are exactly what we suspected all along - a *small handful of irrelevant losers* who the *WWE are right to ignore*. Why don't you try to get people to watch the show instead of *making more pointless Punk avatars and signatures*?


:lol
This is what happens when midcarders like Punk are given the top title.
What a pity!
Majority of his fan base that comprises of nerds,dumb 30 year old geeky virgins,want him to headline Wrestlemania so that he can conveniently piggyback Batista's popularity.They should thank The Great One for rubbing shoulders with a pizza-delivery-boy lookalike mid-card act :CM Punk.They should thank the badass beast Brock Lesnar for the great job at making Punk's sloppy ass look like a credible threat.The Undertaker streak match gave Punk another opportunity at stardom and he piggyrode on Taker's back.
Cant help but laugh at the aggressive stance adopted by some of the dumb marks of course,that having a Punk Vs Bryan face-off for the title at WMXXX is a better idea and would be a better wrasslin match to have than Batista vs Orton..the aftermath of which is,Vinnie Mac filing bankruptcy.:lmaoThis week's *rating* is once again,a painful reminder to that irrelevant IWC legend named:CM Phil.CM Punk should change his name to CM Spunk and do some Brazzers shit 'cause that's his level.

yeah some more :cussin:#redrepdbadguycuzNobodyDeridezGeeky30yroldVirginzidol


----------



## Cack_Thu

Imagine the reactions of CM PUNK marks if this week's RAW drew Batista-level numbers:EDWIN2 

.Punk marks would have surely overrun this board unk2


----------



## Starbuck

Blaming Punk when he wasn't even there? Besides, they were barely down from last week and last week was a post PPV show. There isn't really anything to fight about here...unless we get some breakdowns, in which case DURR CM PUNK CNT DRAW DA MONEYZ DURR.


----------



## Fanboi101

All the hype about Punk's return to his hometown and the ratings go down fpalm

Not surprising that WWE stock hit a 15 year high now that he's gone:

http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2014/0304/571892/wwe-stock-hits-a-new-high/


----------



## FITZ

Fanboi101 said:


> All the hype about Punk's return to his hometown and the ratings go down fpalm
> 
> Not surprising that WWE stock hit a 15 year high now that he's gone:
> 
> http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2014/0304/571892/wwe-stock-hits-a-new-high/


Are you actually trying to say that CM Punk leaving has had a positive increase on WWE's stock value? Are you not aware of the WWE Network and their upcoming PPV deal?


----------



## validreasoning

Fanboi101 said:


> All the hype about Punk's return to his hometown and the ratings go down fpalm
> 
> Not surprising that WWE stock hit a 15 year high now that he's gone:
> 
> http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2014/0304/571892/wwe-stock-hits-a-new-high/


what hype?? the only hype was online and the iwc makes up a tiny % of wwes overall fanbase. wwe never advertised punk returning or made mention of him at all last 5 weeks. this is the biggest wrestling site on the web by a country mile and only 150 people here or thereabouts out of 60,000 tickets sold are going to mania this year according to the poll setup which really highlights how insignificant the iwc really is. 

lol at thinking the stock price has anything to do with product or talent.


----------



## Bob the Jobber

Rating thread logic..

The IWC is irrelevant = Not enough people
IWC-only "hype" doesn't affect ratings = Wrestler isn't a draw


----------



## Kamaria

*Show that did not have CM Punk advertised draws pretty good number that isn't even that much lower than last week*

"Punk can't draw OMG"

Is that the logic I'm seeing in this thread?


----------



## Nimbus

I dont get why CM Cant draw, hes god on the mic, and a pretty good wrestler.


----------



## superuser1

Nimbus said:


> I dont get why CM Cant draw, hes god on the mic, and a pretty good wrestler.


People just aren't interested in seeing him


----------



## #Mark

superuser1 said:


> People just aren't interested in seeing him


lol. People are more interested in seeing him than anyone on the roster not named Cena (arguably Bryan now too). This notion that Punk isn't a draw because they drew an average rating for a show he wasn't advertised for is honestly the most ridiculous thing I've ever read in this thread.


----------



## Joker King

Nimbus said:


> I dont get why CM Cant draw, hes god on the mic, and a pretty good wrestler.


:lmao :lmao Classic!


----------



## CM Punk Is A God

DingoMan said:


> CM Punk has never drawn a dime, so I don't know why there would be any surprise at his rumoured return in his home town not drawing...


Top merchandise seller in 2011... That's not drawing a dime?

Nobody has sold more merch than Cena before Punk came around.

That's just blind hate.


----------



## WWE

Nimbus said:


> I dont get why CM Cant draw, hes god on the mic, and a pretty good wrestler.


:ti


----------



## Joker King

CM Punk Is A God said:


> Nobody has sold more merch than Cena before Punk came around.


You mean like Edge, Batista, DX, Jeff hardy, Randy Orton?


----------



## Cmpunk91

If Punk was advertised the ratings would probably be near a 4. Most people knew he wasn't returning.


----------



## Peter Carroll

Please, keep defending the Internet darling that had ****1/2 matches in ROH.


----------



## Bob the Jobber

Cmpunk91 said:


> If Punk was advertised the ratings would probably be near a 4. Most people knew he wasn't returning.


No chance in hell.


----------



## Kamaria

There is no point in arguing if someone was a draw or not when they did not appear and were not advertised. The ratings were pretty good, anyway. Consistency is not a bad thing. 

I refer any further complainers to my signature.


----------



## Peter Carroll

Yes to the question in that signature.


----------



## The Caped Crusader

#Mark said:


> lol. People are more interested in seeing him than anyone on the roster not named Cena (arguably Bryan now too). This notion that Punk isn't a draw because they drew an average rating for a show he wasn't advertised for is honestly the most ridiculous thing I've ever read in this thread.


I swear this particular superstar is more interesting and a bigger draw than anyone on the roster except for John Cena because of what I say. Even though I don't really have any real evidence to prove to the contrary. On that note, I feel we should all know that The Great Khali is the second biggest draw in the WWE. My proof? It came from outer ass.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Kamaria said:


> There is no point in arguing if someone was a draw or not when they did not appear and were not advertised. The ratings were pretty good, anyway. Consistency is not a bad thing.
> 
> I refer any further complainers to my signature.


If something isn't popular, then most people don't like it. If most people don't like something, it's probably shitty.

THEREFORE 

PJ "The Punk" Brooks is arguably the worst champion in wrestling history.


----------



## #Mark

The Caped Crusader said:


> I swear this particular superstar is more interesting and a bigger draw than anyone on the roster except for John Cena because of what I say. Even though I don't really have any real evidence to prove to the contrary. On that note, I feel we should all know that The Great Khali is the second biggest draw in the WWE. My proof? It came from outer ass.


Actually, merch sales, individual ratings gains, house show ticket sales, and PPV buyrates indicate that Punk is the number two star of the company. Of course, you take issue with my post but ignore all the baseless claims in this thread blaming Punk for a show he wasn't even advertised for.

Anyways, I just remembered that discussion we had the other day, do you still think Batista/Orton is main eventing as is? Especially after this past week when both were used as fodder for Bryan/HHH :lmao .. We're two months into the build and they've had virtually no interaction together. I understand you're the president of the Batista fan club but the fact that you think Batista/Orton has any chance of main eventing is hilarious.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The Torch listed the male 18-49 demo for the quarter hours of Raw from Chicago:



> WWE NEWS: Raw quarter-hour TV ratings - details on Chicago Raw including *which segment blew everything away*
> 
> 
> Monday's WWE Raw from Chicago peaked in Q1 in the quarter-hour TV ratings, then skyrocketed at the top of the third hour for the Daniel Bryan-Triple H/Stephanie McMahon confrontation.
> 
> After the confrontation, Raw slid back to the first hour levels. This included Bryan vs. Batista in the over-run segment, which also had a rare commercial break.
> 
> Raw opened with an above-average audience in Q1 for the initial check-in on how WWE would handle C.M. Punk in Chicago. Otherwise, the rest of the show performed okay-to-average outside of the Bryan-Authority confrontation in Q9.
> 
> Raw Break Down - males 18-49 demographic
> 
> - Overall Show: 2.22 m18-49 rating / 1.4 million viewers. (Bryan-Authority scored a 2.57 rating.)
> 
> Q1: Raw opened with a 2.29 rating for Paul Heyman addressing the C.M. Punk situation in Chicago. There was no commercial.
> 
> Q2: Raw dipped to a 2.24 rating for the end of the opening segment, the first-half of the New Age Outlaws vs. The Usos for the Tag Titles, and one commercial.
> 
> Q3: Raw dropped to a 2.06 rating for the second-half of the Tag Title match, two full commercial breaks, and Big E. vs. Cesaro in a two-minute match. Within the minute-by-minute performance, the end of the Tag Title match performed well, but the two commercials had a significant tune-out factor.
> 
> Q4: Raw rebounded slightly to a 2.12 rating for the first-half of The Shield vs. The Wyatts, plus two full commercial breaks.
> 
> Q5: Raw got a top-of-the-hour bump to a 2.27 rating for the finish of the six-man tag match and one commercial. It was a solid, but not overwhelming quarter-hour rating for a re-match from the Elimination Chamber PPV.
> 
> Q6: Raw dropped to a show-low 2.05 rating for the comedown mixed tag match of Fandango & Summer Rae vs. Santino & Emma, one commercial, Stephanie McMahon's Network message, and ring introductions for Christian vs. Sheamus.
> 
> Q7: Raw increased to a 2.18 rating for Sheamus vs. Christian and one commercial.
> 
> Q8: Raw dipped to a 2.11 rating for The Bellas vs. Foxsana and two full commercial breaks.
> 
> *Q9: Raw skyrocketed to a 2.57 rating at the top of the third hour for the Bryan-Authority confrontation. There was no commercial. The peak audience was 1.751 million m18-49 viewers at 10:14 p.m. EST when the segment wrapped up after growing from 1.5 to 1.6 to 1.7 million viewers every five minutes.*
> 
> Q10: Raw dropped to a 2.26 rating for Dolph Ziggler vs. Alberto Del Rio in the comedown match, plus there were two full commercial breaks.
> 
> Q11: Raw was about the same at a 2.22 rating for Big E. vs. Jack Swagger, the Real Americans hashing things out, one commercial, and the first-half of John Cena's speech.
> 
> Q12: Raw was about the same at a 2.23 rating for the end of Cena's speech, one commercial, and main event ring introductions. Cena's speech topped out in the mid-1.5 million viewers range.
> 
> Over-Run: Raw scored a 2.27 rating for Bryan vs. Batista. Before the commercial, the match was in the mid-1.4 million viewers range. Afterward, Raw increased to the mid-to-upper 1.5 million range, peaking with 1.590 million viewers.



The match "nobody" wants to see sure brought doze ratingz!!!! :HHH2 :bryan


----------



## CrowHardy

Lol.. Punk drew more than hogan returns without even being announced.

Punk= The biggest draw of this generation.


----------



## mwk360

:cool2(Y)That DBry:cool2(Y)


----------



## Waffelz

Now people blaming Punk look slightly stupid. Ah well.

Bryan you mutha fucking don. NOW GIVE HIM THE FACKING TITLE.


----------



## validreasoning

The Caped Crusader said:


> On that note, I feel we should all know that The Great Khali is the second biggest draw in the WWE. My proof? It came from outer ass.


If khali was the number 2 draw then yes they were be clear indications

*he would be headlining houseshows...and he isn't. punk before he left was headlining his own show 3 nights a week while cena was headlining another city those same nights.
*we would be seeing a ton of khali merch sold and i don't see that, euroshop top selling list is working (unlike the us site) http://euroshop.wwe.com/b/336108903...dtextbin,subjectbin,color_map,price,size_name
*we would be seeing khalis video on top like punks was last year










can't believe people don't use common-sense on this site. if punk and bryan were not bringing in tons of money for wwe they would be where tyson kidd and justin gabriel are now..vince simply doesn't push guys that look like bryan and punk into the main-event unless they are making him money.


----------



## funnyfaces1

All of this is too funny.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

A WILD BREAKDOWN APPEARS!

That Bryan/HHH segment getting a 2.57 is the highest 10PM quarter segment of the torch breakdown, that I have. Now it is during Mania season, and I don't believe there were any for last year's Mania season, so to compare it to the next few highest might not be fair, but Punk/Heyman and Punk/Axel's brawl from the night after Summerslam and the Vickie segment with the McMahons on 7/8 are tied at the second highest, the third highest is Punk/Heyman/Lesnar promo/brawl from 7/15, and the fourth highest was for a Punk/Heyman/Ryback promo/brawl on 9/23. And the fifth highest I have is the Orton/Kofi match that Kofi won in January, at a 2.39. I'm sure I don't have all the shows though that have gotten the torch breakdown, so this might not be completely accurate.

In any event, it got much higher than the overrun, which is something that isn't seen often. Then again, the overrun was actually pretty disappointing all things considered. This reminds me of when Punk/Kane closed out a Raw this time last year, and they did a fucking commercial during the overrun. Same thing happened here where I think people just tuned out with the commercial and didn't give a fuck. Would've been interesting to compare, but there are no torch numbers for that show a year ago (at least, I'm fairly certain there aren't). 

Actually come to think of it, both overruns had Kane in them. DAT OVERRUN KILLER!


----------



## Joker King

> *he would be headlining houseshows...and he isn't. punk before he left was headlining his own show 3 nights a week while cena was headlining another city those same nights.


It was Orton's crew, he was the headliner, not punk. Although to be fair, Orton was the champ. Punk and Orton are both at the same level imo.




> Anyways, I just remembered that discussion we had the other day, do you still think Batista/Orton is main eventing as is? Especially after this past week when both were used as fodder for Bryan/HHH .. We're two months into the build and they've had virtually no interaction together. I understand you're the president of the Batista fan club but the fact that you think Batista/Orton has any chance of main eventing is hilarious.


Judging from the fact, Bryan/Triple H drew the biggest 10 PM quarter in over a year, it's clear which feud has the most interest and which match needs to main event. But WWE can't de-value the title even more than they already have. They have messed up so bad with the main program, not only has it turned into heel vs heel but fans don't even seem to care one bit. This should have been Bryan, as the Rumble winner against Triple H as the world champion, from the beginning. Lot of bad decisions from WWE in the past three months.


----------



## #Mark

Joker King said:


> It was Orton's crew, he was the headliner, not punk. Although to be fair, Orton was the champ. Punk and Orton are both at the same level imo.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Judging from the fact, Bryan/Triple H drew the biggest 10 PM quarter in over a year, it's clear which feud has the most interest and which match needs to main event. But WWE can't de-value the title even more than they already have. They have messed up so bad with the main program, not only has it turned into heel vs heel but fans don't even seem to care one bit. This should have been Bryan, as the Rumble winner against Triple H as the world champion, from the beginning. Lot of bad decisions from WWE in the past three months.


Orton was on tours with Cena while Punk was on tours with Bryan.


----------



## mwk360

Usually after posting a ratings breakdown this place explodes, now nothing lol the hype for Wrestlemania really is low.


----------



## validreasoning

Joker King said:


> It was Orton's crew, he was the headliner, not punk. Although to be fair, Orton was the champ. Punk and Orton are both at the same level imo.


ortons been on the cena tour since december, prior to that orton was working with bryan and punk was headlining another tour with heyman/ryback

*WWE @ New York City, NY - Madison Square Garden - December 26, 2013*
John Cena defeated WWE World Heavyweight Champion Randy Orton via disqualification when Orton hit a low blow; after the match, Cena hit the FU to Orton

*WWE @ Chicago, IL - AllState Arena - December 26, 2013 (10,000)*
CM Punk defeated WWE US Champion Dean Ambrose, Seth Rollins, & Roman Reigns in a handicap match by pinning Ambrose with the Go To Sleep

*WWE @ Hartford, CT - XL Center - December 27, 2013 (7,000)*
John Cena defeated WWE World Heavyweight Champion Randy Orton via disqualification

*WWE @ Indianapolis, IN - Bankers Life Fieldhouse - December 27, 2013 (5,500)*
CM Punk defeated WWE US Champion Dean Ambrose, Seth Rollins, & Roman Reigns in a handicap match

*WWE @ Newark, NJ - Prudential Center - December 28, 2013 (8,000)*
John Cena & Rey Mysterio Jr. defeated WWE World Heavyweight Champion Randy Orton & Alberto Del Rio when Cena pinned ADR with the FU

*WWE @ Detroit, MI - Joe Louis Arena - December 28, 2013 (6,500)*
CM Punk defeated WWE US Champion Dean Ambrose, Seth Rollins, & Roman Reigns in a handicap match by pinning Ambrose with the Go To Sleep

*WWE @ Hershey, PA - Giant Center - December 29, 2013 (4,900)*
John Cena defeated WWE World Heavyweight Champion Randy Orton via disqualification after Orton hit a low blow; after the bout, Cena hit the FU to Orton

*WWE @ Washington DC - Verizon Center - December 29, 2013 (9,000)*
CM Punk and the Usos defeated The Shield when Punk pins after Ambrose after hitting the GTS.

*WWE @ Richmond, VA - Coliseum - December 30, 2013 (8,000 paid; sell out)*
CM Punk defeated WWE US Champion Dean Ambrose, Roman Reigns, & Seth Rollins in a handicap match by pinning Ambrose with the Go To Sleep

*WWE @ Toronto, Ontario - Ricoh Coliseum - December 30, 2013 (7,000)*
John Cena defeated WWE World Heavyweight Champion Randy Orton via disqualification after Orton hit a low blow; after the bout, Cena hit the FU to Orton


----------



## JY57

http://wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/201...main-event-airing-on-the-network-have-on-ion/



> Last Wednesday's episode of WWE Main Event on ION, which featured Daniel Bryan facing Kane, averaged 1.487 million viewers. The show averaged 0.511 million viewers in adults 18-49, and did a 0.40 rating in that demo.
> 
> Despite the episode airing live on the WWE Network the night before, the audience was actually up from recent weeks and saw a 15% increase from last week's show, which garnered 1.289 million viewers.


rating for Main Event on ION Television on Wednesday after WWE aired it Live on Tuesday (up 15 % from last week and if not mistaken one of their higher numbers of the show)


----------



## funnyfaces1

The Usos wrestled against The Usos. No wonder it drew.


----------



## superuser1

funnyfaces1 said:


> The Usos wrestled against The Usos. No wonder it drew.


Lmaooooooooo


----------



## SerapisLiber

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> If most people don't like something, it's probably shitty.


Ah, so Justin Bieber *IS* the greatest musician. Thanks for clearing that up.


----------



## Londrick

Batista in the main event flopping hard :ti


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

SerapisLiber said:


> Ah, so Justin Bieber *IS* the greatest musician. Thanks for clearing that up.


Current GOAT? Yes.

All-time GOAT? Nope, still has a long way to go if he wants to match Garth Brooks.


----------



## #Mark

JY57 said:


> http://wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/201...main-event-airing-on-the-network-have-on-ion/
> 
> 
> 
> rating for Main Event on ION Television on Wednesday after WWE aired it Live on Tuesday (up 15 % from last week and if not mistaken one of their higher numbers of the show)


A certain someone's first appearance on Main Event in nearly a year and numbers are through the roof :yes:


----------



## TheStig

validreasoning said:


> ortons been on the cena tour since december, prior to that orton was working with bryan and punk was headlining another tour with heyman/ryback
> 
> *WWE @ New York City, NY - Madison Square Garden - December 26, 2013*
> John Cena defeated WWE World Heavyweight Champion Randy Orton via disqualification when Orton hit a low blow; after the match, Cena hit the FU to Orton
> 
> *WWE @ Chicago, IL - AllState Arena - December 26, 2013 (10,000)*
> CM Punk defeated WWE US Champion Dean Ambrose, Seth Rollins, & Roman Reigns in a handicap match by pinning Ambrose with the Go To Sleep
> 
> *WWE @ Hartford, CT - XL Center - December 27, 2013 (7,000)*
> John Cena defeated WWE World Heavyweight Champion Randy Orton via disqualification
> 
> *WWE @ Indianapolis, IN - Bankers Life Fieldhouse - December 27, 2013 (5,500)*
> CM Punk defeated WWE US Champion Dean Ambrose, Seth Rollins, & Roman Reigns in a handicap match
> 
> *WWE @ Newark, NJ - Prudential Center - December 28, 2013 (8,000)*
> John Cena & Rey Mysterio Jr. defeated WWE World Heavyweight Champion Randy Orton & Alberto Del Rio when Cena pinned ADR with the FU
> 
> *WWE @ Detroit, MI - Joe Louis Arena - December 28, 2013 (6,500)*
> CM Punk defeated WWE US Champion Dean Ambrose, Seth Rollins, & Roman Reigns in a handicap match by pinning Ambrose with the Go To Sleep
> 
> *WWE @ Hershey, PA - Giant Center - December 29, 2013 (4,900)*
> John Cena defeated WWE World Heavyweight Champion Randy Orton via disqualification after Orton hit a low blow; after the bout, Cena hit the FU to Orton
> 
> *WWE @ Washington DC - Verizon Center - December 29, 2013 (9,000)*
> CM Punk and the Usos defeated The Shield when Punk pins after Ambrose after hitting the GTS.
> 
> *WWE @ Richmond, VA - Coliseum - December 30, 2013 (8,000 paid; sell out)*
> CM Punk defeated WWE US Champion Dean Ambrose, Roman Reigns, & Seth Rollins in a handicap match by pinning Ambrose with the Go To Sleep
> 
> *WWE @ Toronto, Ontario - Ricoh Coliseum - December 30, 2013 (7,000)*
> John Cena defeated WWE World Heavyweight Champion Randy Orton via disqualification after Orton hit a low blow; after the bout, Cena hit the FU to Orton


Interesting numbers, are there any more from that period since meltzer said the cena/orton tour drew more than punk/bryan tour. Doesnt seems that big from numbers presented.


----------



## murder

This whole Cena/Orton tours drawing better than Bryan/Punk is misleading. Of course, Cena/Orton for the title drew more than Bryan and Punk vs two midcarders in random matches. Doesn't mean that Orton or even Cena would necessarily be bigger draws than Bryan and Punk.

I remember back in the AE, house shows with Austin wrestling Hunter for the title and Rock wrestling the Big Bossman in a random match. Does that mean that Hunter or Austin for that matter were bigger draws than Rocky?!


----------



## TheStig

murder said:


> This whole Cena/Orton tours drawing better than Bryan/Punk is misleading. Of course, Cena/Orton for the title drew more than Bryan and Punk vs two midcarders in random matches. Doesn't mean that Orton or even Cena would necessarily be bigger draws than Bryan and Punk.
> 
> I remember back in the AE, house shows with Austin wrestling Hunter for the title and Rock wrestling the Big Bossman in a random match. Does that mean that Hunter or Austin for that matter were bigger draws than Rocky?!


I agree. The tour probably did good and might be the reason why they want punk back as fast as possible. Doing 2 tours will always be better than 1 as theres more money. They could still split up 2 tours with cena on 1 and bryan,batista and orton in the other and still do good.


----------



## Joker King

murder said:


> I remember back in the AE, house shows with Austin wrestling Hunter for the title and Rock wrestling the Big Bossman in a random match. Does that mean that Hunter or Austin for that matter were bigger draws than Rocky?!


No it just means they had one top heel in hunter and they valued Austin more than the Rock as the top face to headline against him.


----------



## murder

Joker King said:


> No it just means they had one top heel in hunter and they valued Austin more than the Rock as the top face to headline against him.


Exactly


----------



## Starbuck

Trips/Bryan bringing DA MEGA RATINGZ for their match that _nobody _wants to see.

:trips3 :bryan


----------



## JY57

Smackdown Viewership up 3.142 million viewers from 2.796 million the previous week and was #2 on Cable


----------



## bigbuxxx

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Current GOAT? Yes.
> 
> All-time GOAT? Nope, still has a long way to go if he wants to match Garth Brooks.


Do you realize GOAT stands for "Greatest of all time"? There is no such thing as a current GOAT, just a GOAT.


----------



## checkcola

JY57 said:


> Smackdown Viewership up 3.142 million viewers from 2.796 million the previous week and was #2 on Cable


Power of Big Show?


----------



## Tyrion Hammister

my main ***** bryan drawin them ratings. cant wait for him to save this pile of shit mania.


----------



## Phantomdreamer

Tyrion Hammister said:


> my main ***** bryan drawin them ratings. cant wait for him to save this pile of shit mania.


Bryan is on Smackdown every week? Why would the rating suddenly be higher this week?


----------



## Lordhhhx

:rollins :ambrose :bryan3 :batista4 :reigns :show Bringing the Ratings

Them.Now.Forever


----------



## D.M.N.

Wouldn't be surprised to see at least one of the hours of Raw in the 3's, a lot less replies in the Raw thread than usual and Twitter activity down too according to PWTorch


----------



## JY57

Hour 1 - 4.165 million
Hour 2 - 4.676 million
Hour 3 - 4.265 million

top rated cable show for 18-49 adults


----------



## 2 Ton 21

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.165 million
> Hour 2 - 4.676 million
> Hour 3 - 4.265 million
> 
> top rated cable show for 18-49 adults


Wow the 2nd hour was way up from the 1st hour and the 3rd beat it too. Usually the 8:00 has the best number.


----------



## JY57

2 Ton 21 said:


> Wow the 9:00 hour was way up from the 8:00 and the 10:00 beat it too. Usually the 8:00 has the best number.


what was on the 2nd hour anyways?


----------



## The True Believer

JY57 said:


> what was on the 2nd hour anyways?


The Occupy RAW segment topped the second hour.

EDIT: Sorry. Meant the 3rd hour actually.


----------



## D.M.N.

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.165 million
> Hour 2 - 4.676 million
> Hour 3 - 4.265 million
> 
> top rated cable show for 18-49 adults


Unusual ratings pattern, which means that any breakdown we get later this week may be more interesting than usual.

Suspect a big gain for the Undertaker/Heyman segment.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

DAT :taker and :heyman and although not there, :brock


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

In the all important 18-49 demo. hour 1 fell from a 1.6 to a 1.3 Hour 2 went up from a 1.5 to a 1.6 and Hour 3 was 1.6 for the last 2 weeks. Hour 1 was significantly down in total viewers from last week, it dropped 507,000 viewers.


----------



## checkcola

Sheamus/Christian 14 min match and then Lana/Rusev promo was third hour filler between Bryan/Triple H stuff and the mainevent match. 

Hour 1, Hogan is no longer seen as cool in 2014?


----------



## Waffelz

Hour one was absolutely awful.


----------



## Kamaria

Wasn't OccupyRaw just before the end of hour 2?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Kamaria said:


> Wasn't OccupyRaw just before the end of hour 2?


Yeah, it started right at the end of hour 2 and went through the beginning of hour 3. From what I remember, it started a little after 9:50, a commercial took place around 9:57, we came back around 10:00 and that's when HHH and Steph made their way out, and I think it went like 10 or so minutes after that.

We just got a breakdown last week, so I doubt we're going to be lucky enough to get one this week, so we'll probably never know how well this or that did.


----------



## Tardbasher12

#OccupyRAW with the ratings.


----------



## THANOS

Kamaria said:


> Wasn't OccupyRaw just before the end of hour 2?


Yes it was, just before the beginning of hour 3 and continued into hour 3, before being followed by Sheamus/Christian (viewer genocide after doing that match so many times already) and the Lana/Rusev promo, before the main event.

It's likely that hour 2 was bookmarked by huge gaining segments with Taker/Heyman and #OccupyRAW, and hour 3 did the same only not to the extent of hour 2.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

I know some people attribute Daylight Savings Time to drops in ratings for 8:00pm shows, but others call that idea an excuse. Maybe that contributed to hour 1 dropping, maybe people were disappointed with Hogan's announcement and tuned out.


----------



## checkcola

IDONTSHIV said:


> I know some people attribute Daylight Savings Time to drops in ratings for 8:00pm shows, but others call that idea an excuse. Maybe that contributed to hour 1 dropping, maybe people were disappointed with Hogan's announcement and tuned out.


Maybe its no big deal, but when Cena entered it, I thought all the heavy hitters were going to do double duty in that Battle Royal and someone who matters would win it, but then Cena backed out. I felt like that was a bummer, but I do understand WWE wants to get as much of the roster on the ppv.


----------



## Bob the Jobber

checkcola said:


> Maybe its no big deal, but when Cena entered it, I thought all the heavy hitters were going to do double duty in that Battle Royal and someone who matters would win it, but then Cena backed out. I felt like that was a bummer,* but I do understand WWE wants to get as much of the roster on the ppv.*


Might have something to do with the PPV bonus pay and WWE Universe issue? Possibly just giving the entire roster a spot on the show to get a paycheck.


----------



## murder

Bob the Jobber said:


> Might have something to do with the PPV bonus pay and WWE Universe issue?


What PPV bonus?


----------



## Bob the Jobber

murder said:


> What PPV bonus?


Wrestlers used to get a portion of PPV profits (a small amount), IIRC. With the WWE Network cutting out a lot of the purchases, how will that extra money be determined?

WWE Universe = Hogan jab


----------



## Superhippy

Not shocked at all. That Cena segment was one of the worst segments that he has ever done. Normally he panders to the crowd, but it usually just comes off as Cena being Cena / having fun out there messing with the crowd and whatnot, but yesterday he just came off like a self-absorbed douchbag. Way more cringe worthy then the Occupy Raw segment. The part when Cena was posing with Hogan and acting like he didn't know how to do it was beyond stupid. Your John Cena. Million time world champion. Face of the WWE. And you really don't know the Hogan poses. Get the fuck out with that crap. On top of that with his verbal assaults on The Wyatts along with The Wyatts theme of taking down a false god, Wyatt is coming off as a tweener more then a heel.


----------



## RatedR10

Undertaker bringing in those numbers.


----------



## Fargerov

Oh wow, CM Punk is a huge draw. Great numbers.


----------



## JY57

3.1 rating


----------



## funnyfaces1

Rock316AE alert. Hope he sees just how valuable the GOAT is.


----------



## WWE

Kinda weird how the first hour gets the lowest viewership..

right after daylight savings time.


----------



## Uerfer

Ratings pattern has changed because of Daylight savings time. There is no reason for Hogan and Cena's first segment together in years, not perform well. Lot of viewers failed to tune in the first hour due to daylight savings, it also explains the second hour starting big. Hogan/Cena actually would have been a massive viewership gainer, if it was placed at the right spot.


----------



## wrastlinggg

since this is after the fact, could someone please point me in the direction of a link to last nights raw, missed all of it, thank you


----------



## Uerfer

wrastlinggg said:


> since this is after the fact, could someone please point me in the direction of a link to last nights raw, missed all of it, thank you


http://www.firedrive.com/file/9320757A4D605AF5
http://www.firedrive.com/file/B58AC48029BF68F2
http://www.firedrive.com/file/BDFB20BE731B4124

Three parts, click on continue file and watch/download it.


----------



## robertdeniro

#BadNewsSanta said:


> DAT :taker and :heyman and although not there, :brock


(Y)(Y)(Y)


----------



## MaybeLock

DAT first hour. Cena should change his catchphrase to: "You don't want to see me"

Also, it seems that Hogan isn't that relevant in 2014 anymore. Not a surpirse after his TNA run.


----------



## Starbuck

I love people drawing conclusions based on entire hour numbers. Didn't we learn anything from the whole Big Show fiasco last year? :lol It's the quarter hours that point the definitive finger, not the hour as a whole. Anyway, I reckon the daylight savings people are on to something. For the past I don't know how many months now the opening hour has been the highest of the night. Suddenly the clocks go back and hour 1 is the lowest of the night and hour 2 opens much higher. It isn't hard to connect the dots with that one. Either way I imagine Taker/Heyman and Occupy Raw topped the night in whatever order. Based on the huge numbers Bryan/HHH pulled last week (in the male 18-49 demo mind you), I wouldn't be surprised at all if they were the highest rated segment again with the Seamus/Christian match falling off a cliff right after up until the main event. But we won't know until a breakdown comes through and that isn't likely so DAT SPECULATION RUNNING WILD BROTHERS.


----------



## Joker King

3.09 rating. 

Despite the advertised return of Undertaker and Hogan, this was the second lowest rated Raw of the year. Daylight savings may have had a greater impact.


----------



## murder

Maybe people fnally realized that they don't miss shit in the first hour. They used to have a huge opening segment that set-up the storyline and the main event for the show. For example, on the highest rated Raw in history, when Commissioner Michaels booked the entire show in the second segment.

Nowadays, for example this Monday, we saw Cena and Hogan in a segment with the Wyatts and nothing ever came out of it and was important for the rest of the show. 

It's like if at the begining of the Dark Knight, Robin battled Two-Face and with neither of them to be seen again for the last 2 1/2 half hours in the movie. Apparently, their "TV writers" do not know how to write a TV show.


----------



## Joker King

Well for what it's worth, when the authority used to open the shows week after week from about NOC to until TLC PPV, they did book the matches, the feuds from that point on leading to the main event, usually involving Bryan and Shield though. It was the also the period where Mid carders like the USOS, Cody, Goldust, even the Sheild etc...got some direction to their characters and got over.

But yes, the era of awesome storyline progression building throughout the show are long gone.


----------



## TheStig

Starbuck said:


> I love people drawing conclusions based on entire hour numbers. Didn't we learn anything from the whole Big Show fiasco last year? :lol It's the quarter hours that point the definitive finger, not the hour as a whole. Anyway, I reckon the daylight savings people are on to something. For the past I don't know how many months now the opening hour has been the highest of the night. Suddenly the clocks go back and hour 1 is the lowest of the night and hour 2 opens much higher. It isn't hard to connect the dots with that one. Either way I imagine Taker/Heyman and Occupy Raw topped the night in whatever order. Based on the huge numbers Bryan/HHH pulled last week (in the male 18-49 demo mind you), I wouldn't be surprised at all if they were the highest rated segment again with the Seamus/Christian match falling off a cliff right after up until the main event. But we won't know until a breakdown comes through and that isn't likely so DAT SPECULATION RUNNING WILD BROTHERS.


I fail to understand how so many people would do a stupid mistake like that. How the hell do you even do a mistake like that? Are americans or american wrestling fans that stupid?

Edit: Daylightsavings shit


----------



## El Capitan

These ratings ain't gonna get any better until they go back to 2 hours. The majority of people I know just record/download RAW and watch it the next day so they can shift through the filler.


----------



## Londrick

Supposedly Bryan's segment drew the highest since last year's RTW.


----------



## THANOS

Londrick said:


> Supposedly Bryan's segment drew the highest since last year's RTW.


Really man? Where did you hear that, Meltzer's podcast?


----------



## THANOS

Londrick said:


> Supposedly Bryan's segment drew the highest since last year's RTW.


Really man? Where did you hear that, Meltzer's podcast?


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7

Probably the Newsletter or from the Torch.


----------



## The Buryer

Youtube views(So far) - 

*436,978 Views* - Authority/Bryan Occupy RAW
*228,415 Views* - Main even tag match involving Big Show
*225,282 Views* - Undertaker/Heyman Segment
*212,699 Views* - Hogan, Cena vs Eric Rowan
*110,298 Views* - Shield vs Cody and Goldust


----------



## checkcola

Londrick said:


> Supposedly Bryan's segment drew the highest since last year's RTW.


Interesting. I just assumed Paul E/Taker was the peak of the show.


----------



## The Buryer

^ It could still be, due to daylight savings change affecting the viewing pattern. I would wait till we get a source for Londrick's post before crediting anyone.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

THANOS said:


> Really man? Where did you hear that, Meltzer's podcast?


I want it to be true, I hope this is confirmed.


----------



## Happenstan

THANOS said:


> Really man? Where did you hear that, Meltzer's podcast?


Probably the Torch



> For the second consecutive week, the interaction between Daniel Bryan and Triple H/Stephanie McMahon positioned at the top of the third hour blew away the rest of Raw in the quarter-hour TV ratings.
> 
> In the key demo of males 18-49, Raw peaked between 10:02 and 10:12 p.m. EST for the meat of Bryan's "Occupy Raw" bit setting up Hunter accepting a WrestleMania match.
> 
> Numerically, the Q9 segment at the top of the third hour averaged 1.747 million m18-49 viewers and scored a 2.78 demo rating. This grew on last week's show-high Q9 performance of 1.620 million viewers and 2.57 rating.
> 
> The next closest segment this week was 1.534 million viewers in the over-run for Bryan & Big Show vs. Randy Orton & Batista.
> 
> For non-over-run segments, Q5 drew 1.494 million viewers for Paul Heyman-The Undertaker and Q7 drew 1.484 million viewers for the end of The Shield vs. Rhodes Bros.
> 
> Then, there was the first hour. The first hour was not even in the ballpark of Fall TV Season first hour, which ranged between 1.1 and 1.2 million viewers. This week's first hour did not reach 1.2 million viewers and did not reach 1.1 million viewers until Q3.
> 
> Raw Break Down - M18-49 Demo
> 
> - Overall Show: 2.19 rating and 1.373 million viewers
> 
> Q1: Raw opened with a measly 1.081 million viewers for Hulk Hogan opening the show, John Cena interaction, and Wyatt Family interruption. Either fans were mad after last week, Daylight Savings Time threw off viewers, or there were other reasons why this opening segment performed poorly.
> 
> Q2: Raw dipped to a show-low 1.021 million viewers for Cena vs. Erick Rowan, plus two commercial breaks.
> 
> Q3: Raw bumped up to 1.151 million viewers for The Authority making a speech, one commercial, and The Usos vs. Ryback & Curtis Axel.
> 
> Q4: Raw bumped up to 1.186 million viewers for Big E. vs. Jack Swagger and two full commercial breaks.
> 
> Q5: Raw got a 26 percent top-of-the-hour bump to 1.494 million viewers for The Undertaker returning and Paul Heyman confronting him, plus one commercial. The segment peaked with 1.700 and 1.701 million viewers before the commercial.
> 
> Q6: Raw dipped to 1.476 million viewers for the first-half of The Shield vs. Rhodes Bros. and one commercial.
> 
> Q7: Raw rebounded to 1.484 million viewers for the end of the tag match, one commercial, and a Divas tag match.
> 
> Q8: Raw fell to 1.434 million viewers for two commercials and the first-half of Daniel Bryan hi-jacking Raw. The segment started to build momentum at the end of the hour, peaking with 1.725 million viewers at 9:55 p.m.
> 
> *Q9: Raw skyrocketed 22 percent to 1.747 million viewers for the Bryan-Hunter/Stephanie confrontation and one commercial at the end of the segment.
> 
> Peak viewership was a ridiculously-high 1.922 million viewers at 10:10 p.m., then 1.919 million viewers at 10:11 p.m. heading to commercial. From 10:02 p.m. to 10:12 p.m. viewership was between 1.7 and 2.0 million viewers.*
> 
> Q10: Raw fell back to the pre-Q9 levels with 1.431 million viewers for the first-half of Sheamus vs. Christian and one commercial.
> 
> Q11: Raw inched up to 1.449 million viewers for the second-half of Sheamus-Christian, one commercial, and a backstage segment.
> 
> Q12: Raw dropped to 1.365 million viewers for pre-main event happenings, main event ring intros, and two full commercial breaks.
> 
> Over-run: Raw increased to 1.534 million viewers for Bryan & Show vs. Orton & Batista. The segment was up from 1.429 million viewers for last week's over-run, but last week's segment included a rare mid-overtime commercial.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: Bryan vs. Hunter is going to carry WWE to WrestleMania this year. Last year, it was the C.M. Punk-Paul Heyman interaction surrounding Punk vs. Undertaker. This year, it's the Bryan-Authority show. WWE just has to be careful with how they frame it by not going over-board on the "Hippies vs. Corporations" theme that could take viewers out of the moment of what has been an easy-to-follow "Underdog vs. Power-Hungry New Boss" feud.


----------



## Starbuck

Holy ratings. It's crazy the numbers this is pulling in and that's just the 18-49 demo. 2 million viewers in 1 demo for 1 segment alone? HHH/Bryan pulling low Smackdown viewership on their own there. Madness and yeah, it's kind of obvious what the hottest program is for Mania. I did lol at Caldwell's incorrect analysis about Punk/Taker carrying last year. No lol. Somebody needs to go back and look at the numbers but im not about to drag that up again. IIRC the Rock/Cena point-counter point segment drew a 4.1 overall last year as the highest rated RTWM 29 segment. I'd be curious to see how this did in comparison to that. If it pulled 2 million in 1 demo it's not a stretch to believe it could be in the realm of the 4's or very high 3's at least for the overall number. 

From every Daniel Bryan and Triple H interaction dating back to post Summerslam it seems like these 2 together produce top rated segments that people watch in high volumes. Just goes to show you the interest you can garner with a white hot babyface on the rise and one of the best heels ever playing the foil. I'm sure the Bryan marks will attribute this all to him and the Bryan haters will attribute it to HHH but the truth is, it's the 2 of them together that brings the magic and produces the goods. Daniel Bryan has never drawn ratings like this in his life and yes, a big part of that is because of the association with the Authority and the storyline here. At the same time, HHH wouldn't be pulling these numbers on his own right now because while he has the proven ability to move numbers, it's the combination of he and Bryan together that is making things soar. Equal credit where it's due here folks. It may not be Austin/McMahon but this thing is working big time. If this level of interest can translate to Network buys Bryan will be a made man for life.


----------



## robertdeniro

Starbuck said:


> I did lol at Caldwell's incorrect analysis about Punk/Taker carrying last year. No lol. Somebody needs to go back and look at the numbers but im not about to drag that up again. IIRC the Rock/Cena point-counter point segment drew a 4.1 overall last year as the highest rated RTWM 29 segment. I'd be curious to see how this did in comparison to that. If it pulled 2 million in 1 demo it's not a stretch to believe it could be in the realm of the 4's or very high 3's at least for the overall number.
> 
> .


Taker/Punk was carrying last year RTWM,except for the one Rock/Cena segment you mentioned, Taker/Punk was always the high point of the show.


----------



## Reaper

But but but Bryan dodn't draw :'(

Lol. 

Anyways, tbf, it's the stars, the storyline, the uniqueness of the segment, the intensity the hype around the fact that it was truly a wtf this is really happening moment that combined for that massive rating. 

I keep saying that it's everything that matters, not just a single element that can be singled out as a sole reason.


----------



## JY57

no surprise what the top two rated programs for Mania are.

Taker/Brock were highest on week one from what I heard (and # 2 last two weeks according to PWTorch quarters) and the last two weeks Bryan/Hunter are on top.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

DAT GOAT + DAT CAVEMAN = DEM A+ RATINGZ!!! :bryan :hhh2 :yes :yes :yes


----------



## The Buryer

Damn, Orton Vs Batista is a complete afterthought to all this.


----------



## checkcola

The Buryer said:


> Damn, Orton Vs Batista is a complete afterthought to all this.


They'll get to beat down Bryan in the weeks leading up to Mania, I'm sure


----------



## The Buryer

JY57 said:


> no surprise what the top two rated programs for Mania are.
> 
> Taker/Brock were highest on week one from what I heard (and # 2 last two weeks according to PWTorch quarters) and the last two weeks Bryan/Hunter are on top.


Week one? Are you referring to the Hogan return show? I think that was opening segment that was top rated, Viewership did not recover to the same level after that. Jason powell of pro-wrestling.net talked about Brock and Heyman promoted overrun not doing well, and that WWE should have advertised Taker's return in advance, like this week.


----------



## Starbuck

robertdeniro said:


> Taker/Punk was carrying last year RTWM,except for the one Rock/Cena segment you mentioned, Taker/Punk was always the high point of the show.



It wasn't. When Rock/Cena were on together they topped. For the rest of the weeks the other 2 traded back and forth. I'm really not getting into that again though. Punk marks believe his match was the top draw for Mania 29 when it was the 3rd biggest match on the card. It is what it is and nothing can be said to change their minds so its not worth the time. 




Reaper Jones said:


> But but but Bryan dodn't draw :'(
> 
> Lol.
> 
> Anyways, tbf, it's the stars, the storyline, the uniqueness of the segment, the intensity the hype around the fact that it was truly a wtf this is really happening moment that combined for that massive rating.
> 
> I keep saying that it's everything that matters, not just a single element that can be singled out as a sole reason.


Top/hot stars put in the right angle brings the best results. Always has been that way and always will be. HHH and Bryan. One without the other and it simply doesn't work. The uniqueness and strong build doesn't hurt either. Brock vs Taker sells itself.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

The Buryer said:


> Youtube views(So far) -
> 
> *436,978 Views* - Authority/Bryan Occupy RAW
> _*228,415 Views*_ - Main even tag match involving *Big Show*
> *225,282 Views* - Undertaker/Heyman Segment
> *212,699 Views* - Hogan, Cena vs Eric Rowan
> *110,298 Views* - Shield vs Cody and Goldust


Methinks the Triple Threat title match is about to get......supersized :show


----------



## funnyfaces1

:lmao at Starbuck still denying that Taker/Punk was bigger than Lesnar/HHH. Give it up, woman.

Great to see creativity getting rewarded.


----------



## Starbuck

funnyfaces1 said:


> :lmao at Starbuck still denying that Taker/Punk was bigger than Lesnar/HHH. Give it up, woman.
> 
> Great to see creativity getting rewarded.


Thanks for proving my point.

:hunter


----------



## funnyfaces1

Not before you proved mine unk


----------



## Starbuck

funnyfaces1 said:


> Not before you proved mine unk


Last year I had this discussion with 2 of the biggest Punk marks on this forum. I ain't having it again. Think what you want about dat megastar punk. Boy is getting outclassed by little Danny B. 

Best in the punk mark world

:ti


----------



## funnyfaces1

I'm actually happy that Danny B is usurping Punk. I'm not Pyro, I can think clearly.


----------



## Rick Sanchez

Starbuck said:


> Last year I had this discussion with 2 of the biggest Punk marks on this forum.


Who?


----------



## Starbuck

Other 2 are probably worse than Pyro tbh. Tyrion is a gimmick lol.

Edit - how could I forget mblonde lol? He's probably still crying into his GTS pillow.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Was Sonnen Says the other philistine?

Don't forget guys that back in 2012, :bryan2's WHC reign brought Smackdown its highest ratings since the 2008 :HHH2 era.


----------



## robertdeniro

Starbuck said:


> It wasn't. When Rock/Cena were on together they topped. For the rest of the weeks the other 2 traded back and forth. I'm really not getting into that again though. Punk marks believe his match was the top draw for Mania 29 when it was the 3rd biggest match on the card. It is what it is and nothing can be said to change their minds so its not worth the time.
> 
> .


It was.



> WWE RAW Ratings Breakdown (4/1/2013); Overrun With CM Punk & Undertaker Scores Big
> 
> Credit – Wrestling Observer As noted before, the April 22nd WWE RAW did a 3.13 cable rating with 4.40 million viewers. RAW was the highest rated cable show for the night, beating the Chicago Bulls vs. Brooklyn Nets NBA game which did a 2.38 rating with 2.99 million viewers. In the segment breakdown, the show opened with a 3.04 quarter rating for the segment with Paul Heyman and Triple H. R-Truth vs. Antonio Cesaro lost 163,000 viewers. Damien Sandow vs. Brodus Clay and a segment with Dolph Ziggler, AJ Lee, Brad Maddox and Vickie Guerrero gained 153,000 viewers. Chris Jericho vs. Ziggler gained 439,000 viewers for a 3.35 rating at the 9pm mark, which is strong growth. Tensai vs. Cody Rhodes lost 224,000 viewers. Zack Ryder vs. Big E Langston lost another 139,000 viewers. The Shield vs. Kane, Daniel Bryan and The Undertaker gained 581,000 viewers for a show-high 3.50 quarter rating at 10pm. Fandango vs. William Regal lost 949,000 viewers for a 2.83 quarter rating. More people tuned out in this segment than nearly any other in recent years. The Divas #1 contender battle royal gained 302,000 viewers. The final segment with Ryback, Mick Foley, John Cena and The Shield gained 548,000 viewers with a 3.43 rating in the overrun. These are good numbers but not great growth for the final segment.





> WWE RAW Ratings Breakdown (3/18/2013); CM Punk & Undertaker Showdown is Highest Rated Segment
> 
> Credit – Wrestling Observer
> 
> As noted before, the March 18th WWE RAW did a 3.08 cable rating with 4.25 million viewers, down 11% in viewership from recent weeks.
> 
> In the segment breakdown, John Cena vs. Darren Young and Ryback vs. David Otunga lost 36,000 viewers from the opener. Fandango and The Great Khali lost 104,000 viewers while R-Truth vs. Damien Sandow lost another 128,000. The segment with CM Punk and The Undertaker plus Kane and Daniel Bryan vs. Epico and Primo gained 111,000 viewers for a 3.27 quarter – the high point of the show.
> 
> Cody Rhodes vs. Alberto Del Rio lost 184,000 viewers while Booker T’s Hall of Fame announcement lost 124,000 viewers. Sheamus and Randy Orton vs. 3MB and the post-match segment gained 58,000 viewers for a 3.09 quarter in the 10pm timeslot. Dolph Ziggler vs. Kofi Kingston lost 302,000 viewers while the Triple Threat with Wade Barrett, The Miz and Chris Jericho lost 54,000 viewers. The final segment with Paul Heyman, Triple H and Brock Lesnar gained 494,000 viewers for a 3.19 overrun.





> Credit – Wrestling Observer
> 
> As noted before, the March 11th WWE RAW did a 3.34 cable rating with 4.79 million viewers.
> 
> In the segment breakdown, the show opened at a 3.46 quarter rating for the Paul Bearer tribute, The Undertaker and CM Punk. Big Show vs. Seth Rollins lost 9,000 viewers. Dolph Ziggler vs. Daniel Bryan gained 132,000 viewers. Fandango’s segment with Tensai and Brodus Clay lost 298,000 viewers. The New Age Outlaws vs. Cody Rhodes and Damien Sandow with Brock Lesnar’s appearance gained 326,000 viewers for a show-high 3.57 quarter rating.
> 
> Mark Henry vs. Kofi Kingston and Ryback vs. Heath Slater and the Henry-Ryback face-off lost 179,000 viewers. Antonio Cesaro vs. Alberto Del Rio lost 265,000 viewers. The video for John Cena vs. The Rock lost 10,000 viewers. Sheamus and Randy Orton vs. Rhodes and Sandow in the 10pm timeslot gained 106,000 viewers for a 3.32 quarter rating. The Highlight Reel with Chris Jericho, The Miz, Wade Barrett and Brad Maddox gained 81,000 viewers but Jericho vs. Miz lost 359,000 viewers. Jack Swagger vs. Sin Cara lost 78,000 viewers.
> 
> CM Punk vs. Kane in a No DQ main event gained 153,000 viewers for a 3.18 quarter rating, which is a very weak overrun gain.





> As noted before, the March 4th old-school edition of WWE RAW did a 3.52 cable rating with 5.01 million viewers, the second best numbers of the year. RAW was the highest rated show on cable for the night, even beating out Pawn Stars.
> 
> In the segment breakdown, the first segment, after The Undertaker opened the show, with CM Punk and Paul Heyman, Randy Orton, Sheamus and Big Show opened strong with a 3.7 quarter rating. We don’t have exact gains and losses this week but Ryback vs. Antonio Cesaro lost 427,000 viewers while Zack Ryder vs. Mark Henry gained 142,000. The Miz vs. Dolph Ziggler and segment with Ric Flair stayed even.
> 
> The high-point of the show came with The Rock and John Cena having their point & counterpoint segment, which did a 4.1 quarter rating and gained 855,000 viewers in the 9pm timeslot. Jim Duggan with the WWE Legends vs. Jack Swagger lost 712,000 viewers. Kane and Daniel Bryan vs. Darren Young and Titus O’Neil plus Tensai and Brodus Clay vs. Drew McIntyre and Heath Slater lost 142,000 viewers. Fandango’s entrance and interview lost 284,000 viewers.
> 
> Triple H’s segment gained 427,000 viewers and did a 3.6 quarter rating in the 10pm timeslot. Alberto Del Rio vs. Wade Barrett plus a promo from Swagger and Zeb Colter lost 427,000 viewers. Mae Young’s birthday segment lost 142,000 viewers and was the lowest rated part of the show. The Fatal 4 Way main event with Punk, Orton, Sheamus and Big Show gained 570,000 viewers for a 3.7 overrun.


Rock/Cena sure was the bigger match but Taker/Punk did move numbers more than Rock/Cena at the RTWM.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

robertdeniro said:


> It was.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rock/Cena sure was the bigger match but Taker/Punk did move numbers more than Rock/Cena at the RTWM.


What happens when you put the two greatest in this industry or any other industry together.


----------



## Starbuck

^^^^^^^^^ I know. Almost 4 million buys for the Rock vs Cena feud in total. GOATS. 

Forgot Sonnen too lol. I wasn't even talking about those 2 either, ha. Seriously though whatever happened to mblonde? His rage was :lol


----------



## funnyfaces1

I thought you buried/banned him. It was either you, or Shephard. Look at you. You've gotten to the point where you forget who you buried.

But back on topic. Bryan is going to get big. I've tried to get my younger brother into wrestling by showing him all the children's favorites (Hogan, Cena, Warrior, Rock, Mysterio, Austin, Taker, Bret, Jeff). Until very recently when I showed him Mick Foley, Daniel Bryan was the only wrestler that he could identify with. The Yes chant definitely helped, but the beard and little man look did just as much. Yup, Bryan has IT.


----------



## Starbuck

Contrary to popular belief I've never buried anybody.

Just wait until he wins the title and everybody starts hating on him. It's gonna be :lol. It happened with Punk last year, Edge before him and Orton before him. DAT IWC.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Don't forget the biggest example of that theorem.

:cena :cena3 :cena4 :cena2 :cena5


----------



## Starbuck

2004: JAAAAWWWWNNNNN CEEEENNNNAAAAAAAAAAA :mark:

2006: Jon Cena :mad

2008: John Cena? :side: 

2010: JOHN CENA 

2012: John > Dwayne 8*D

2014: :cena5


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Gotta hand it to the Bryan/ HHH numbers, they've been very impressive. You can't really compare them to last year's numbers since those were a completely different breakdown, but they're some of the best numbers we've seen on a torch breakdown, and the highest for the 10 Pm slot.

That being said, I wonder now that the match has been announced, if they can maintain those numbers. I think a lot of the interest was in seeing the match finally announced, but I guess we'll find out.


----------



## Londrick

Revenge of the Nerds = :vince$

CM who?


----------



## Sonnen Says

Did someone mention me I am in starbucks ordering Frappuccino :cena . Did I miss something, anyway that's a nice number for Bryan.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The final verdict on the Occupy Raw segment is in: RATINGS JACKPOT! An original compelling piece that made viewers keep watching whether they loved or hated it. Oh yeah, Great for Bryan to be the top 2 segments of Raw. The D in D-Bry must stand for Demo!!! :yes


----------



## Bob the Jobber

RAW is Bryan.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Starbuck said:


> Thanks for proving my point.
> 
> :hunter


:ti


----------



## RelivingTheShadow

Bryan Alvarez of F4W said that the Bryan/HHH segment did a 25% growth over the previous segment. So assuming that the previous segment had 4 Million Viewers(Probably had slightly more than that) the segment did a 1 MILLION Quarter hour gain. That's ridiculous.


----------



## JamesK

> For the second consecutive week, the interaction between Daniel Bryan and Triple H/Stephanie McMahon positioned at the top of the third hour blew away the rest of Raw in the quarter-hour TV ratings.
> 
> In the key demo of males 18-49, Raw peaked between 10:02 and 10:12 p.m. EST for the meat of Bryan's "Occupy Raw" bit setting up Hunter accepting a WrestleMania match.
> 
> Numerically, the Q9 segment at the top of the third hour averaged 1.747 million m18-49 viewers and scored a 2.78 demo rating. This grew on last week's show-high Q9 performance of 1.620 million viewers and 2.57 rating.
> 
> The next closest segment this week was 1.534 million viewers in the over-run for Bryan & Big Show vs. Randy Orton & Batista.
> 
> For non-over-run segments, Q5 drew 1.494 million viewers for Paul Heyman-The Undertaker and Q7 drew 1.484 million viewers for the end of The Shield vs. Rhodes Bros.
> 
> Then, there was the first hour. The first hour was not even in the ballpark of Fall TV Season first hour, which ranged between 1.1 and 1.2 million viewers. This week's first hour did not reach 1.2 million viewers and did not reach 1.1 million viewers until Q3.
> 
> Raw Break Down - M18-49 Demo
> 
> - Overall Show: 2.19 rating and 1.373 million viewers
> 
> Q1: Raw opened with a measly 1.081 million viewers for Hulk Hogan opening the show, John Cena interaction, and Wyatt Family interruption. Either fans were mad after last week, Daylight Savings Time threw off viewers, or there were other reasons why this opening segment performed poorly.
> 
> Q2: Raw dipped to a show-low 1.021 million viewers for Cena vs. Erick Rowan, plus two commercial breaks.
> 
> Q3: Raw bumped up to 1.151 million viewers for The Authority making a speech, one commercial, and The Usos vs. Ryback & Curtis Axel.
> 
> Q4: Raw bumped up to 1.186 million viewers for Big E. vs. Jack Swagger and two full commercial breaks.
> 
> Q5: Raw got a 26 percent top-of-the-hour bump to 1.494 million viewers for The Undertaker returning and Paul Heyman confronting him, plus one commercial. The segment peaked with 1.700 and 1.701 million viewers before the commercial.
> 
> Q6: Raw dipped to 1.476 million viewers for the first-half of The Shield vs. Rhodes Bros. and one commercial.
> 
> Q7: Raw rebounded to 1.484 million viewers for the end of the tag match, one commercial, and a Divas tag match.
> 
> Q8: Raw fell to 1.434 million viewers for two commercials and the first-half of Daniel Bryan hi-jacking Raw. The segment started to build momentum at the end of the hour, peaking with 1.725 million viewers at 9:55 p.m.
> 
> *Q9: Raw skyrocketed 22 percent to 1.747 million viewers for the Bryan-Hunter/Stephanie confrontation and one commercial at the end of the segment.
> 
> Peak viewership was a ridiculously-high 1.922 million viewers at 10:10 p.m., then 1.919 million viewers at 10:11 p.m. heading to commercial. From 10:02 p.m. to 10:12 p.m. viewership was between 1.7 and 2.0 million viewers.
> *
> Q10: Raw fell back to the pre-Q9 levels with 1.431 million viewers for the first-half of Sheamus vs. Christian and one commercial.
> 
> Q11: Raw inched up to 1.449 million viewers for the second-half of Sheamus-Christian, one commercial, and a backstage segment.
> 
> Q12: Raw dropped to 1.365 million viewers for pre-main event happenings, main event ring intros, and two full commercial breaks.
> 
> Over-run: Raw increased to 1.534 million viewers for Bryan & Show vs. Orton & Batista. The segment was up from 1.429 million viewers for last week's over-run, but last week's segment included a rare mid-overtime commercial.


Yeah the segment was bad and Taker/Heyman and Shield brought the numbers..Also Bryan is not a draw.


----------



## Lariatoh!

1.2 million, isn't that TNA numbers!?!!?


----------



## JamesK

Lariatoh! said:


> 1.2 million, isn't that TNA numbers!?!!?


It's only about the key demo males 18-49


----------



## NastyYaffa

:bryan & :HHH2 are killing it! :yes


----------



## D.M.N.

Looks like Bryan/HHH did ~5.3 / 5.5 million total viewers which is a fantastic number for Raw.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

D.M.N. said:


> Looks like Bryan/HHH did ~5.3 / 5.5 million total viewers which is a fantastic number for Raw.


Nice. Out of curiosity though, where'd you get that number from, and what would it equate to in ratings (about). I'd imagine in the 3.8-3.9 range, maybe even cracking 4.0. Last year, only Rock/Cena, Rock/Punk, and Lesnar's first return of the year broke that.


----------



## Waffelz

Fucking Bryan \o/

What an absolute hero. YES


----------



## D.M.N.

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Nice. Out of curiosity though, where'd you get that number from, and what would it equate to in ratings (about). I'd imagine in the 3.8-3.9 range, maybe even cracking 4.0. Last year, only Rock/Cena, Rock/Punk, and Lesnar's first return of the year broke that.


On the basis of 25% gain versus the previous quarter, and also when you consider the Males 18-49 breakdown. Suggests that overall it did at least 5 million+.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I just realized that number would be part of the third hour, and that segment would be a million viewers over the average for the third hour if that's the case.

I wonder if it's the top segment for the year, so far? Batista's return hour did an average of 5 million, so I'd imagine that return did higher, but. I can't remember if we got a breakdown for that show.

One thing's for sure I think, and that's that Bryan has proven to be the best ratings draw in the business right now. He consistently gets good-great numbers no matter who he's with, and he's beating out an Undertaker Mania feud in the ratings, which outside of Rock involvement, hasn't been done in years (last year Taker/Punk was the most consistently high, and Taker/HHH the year prior WAS the highest, consistently and height wise). So yeah, Bryan's probably WWE's biggest ratings draw since Cena at his peak, and maybe he's done better than that (I'm not sure though what kind of numbers Cena would get back then).


----------



## The Buryer

Orton's 2009 feud with HHH drew better. Last year WM 29, Rock vs Cena II was the top rated feud and carried the buyrate, and the same for WM 27. Taker/HHH carried WM 28 though atleast the RAW ratings, if not the buyrate. Bryan's doing well all things considered. Funny though, WWE probably expected batista to be that star this year but its turned out to Bryan instead.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

The Buryer said:


> Orton's 2009 feud with HHH drew better. Last year WM 29, Rock vs Cena II was the top rated feud and carried the buyrate, and the same for WM 27. Taker/HHH carried WM 28 though atleast the RAW ratings, if not the buyrate. Bryan's doing well all things considered. Funny though, WWE probably expected batista to be that star this year but its turned out to Bryan instead.


Orton/ HHH is what I go back to as the last feud that did better in the ratings than Taker's that didn't include Rock (although Taker/ HBK I still put as just as big if not a bigger reason for the buyrate, but that's a whole other debate for another thread on another day).


----------



## The Buryer

From recent wrestlemanias(the period when the streak became a really big WM deal), WM 28 was the only time the streak match was the strongest/hottest feud going in, every other time it was No.2/3 at best, including this year. As for judging Bryan though, it also need to be noted he has the full backing of the WWE, that other superstars like Punk for instance never did. I mean HHH himself turned heel for Bryan(which he never did for Punk) and at this point he sure seems to be determined, to pushing Bryan's stardom to the absolute biggest it can get, that kind of support makes a lot of difference, especially adding huge credibility to the feud and the superstar.


----------



## LKRocks

Holy shit, Daniel Bryan with that drawing power. Never expected to see him becoming so popular so fast.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

The Buryer said:


> From recent wrestlemanias(the period when the streak became a really big WM deal), WM 28 was the only time the streak match was the strongest/hottest feud going in, every other time it was No.2/3 at best, including this year. As for judging Bryan though, it also need to be noted he has the full backing of the WWE, that other superstars like Punk for instance never did. I mean HHH himself turned heel for Bryan(which he never did for Punk) and at this point he sure seems to be determined, to pushing Bryan's stardom to the absolute biggest it can get, that kind of support makes a lot of difference, especially adding huge credibility to the feud and the superstar.


I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you, all I'm saying is not including Rock, the streak has been the hottest/best drawing feud since WM26 each year, up until this year, where it's clear the Bryan's popularity has lead him to doing just that as his feud with HHH has drawn better than Taker/Brock (so far, and I don't see that changing).

As for the note on Bryan, he does have more backing than Punk did backstage, but I don't think he's been "fully" back and I always get the feeling some people are hesitant on pushing him, namely, Vince, who's the big decision maker at the end of the day. I don't doubt HHH is behind Bryan though. However even without HHH on his side, if Bryan was still as popular as he is now, it wouldn't matter because he's gotten to a level where a sizable portion of the audience won't accept him not being in the position he's in now.


----------



## checkcola

Well, Triple H was the one who convinced Vince Daniel Wyatt had to be killed.


----------



## P.H. Hatecraft

A guy who doesn't have the company's backing doesn't face the Undertaker at WM, Brock Lesnar at Summerslam, the Rock twice or holds the championship for over a year. As for HHH, are we forgetting Punk was his original opponent? He may not have turned heel for Punk, he didn't turn to put over Bryan originally either. How quickly do we forget Daniel Wyatt, which was a clear demotion. If I were a betting man, I would wager a buck on Batista ending HHH's authority (again) as the original plan.


----------



## Tyrion Hammister

nice to see bryan carrying hhh's carcass to some great ratings.


----------



## Mr.S

Starbuck said:


> Holy ratings. It's crazy the numbers this is pulling in and that's just the 18-49 demo. 2 million viewers in 1 demo for 1 segment alone? HHH/Bryan pulling low Smackdown viewership on their own there. Madness and yeah, it's kind of obvious what the hottest program is for Mania. I did lol at Caldwell's incorrect analysis about Punk/Taker carrying last year. No lol. Somebody needs to go back and look at the numbers but im not about to drag that up again. IIRC the Rock/Cena point-counter point segment drew a 4.1 overall last year as the highest rated RTWM 29 segment. I'd be curious to see how this did in comparison to that. If it pulled 2 million in 1 demo it's not a stretch to believe it could be in the realm of the 4's or very high 3's at least for the overall number.
> 
> From every Daniel Bryan and Triple H interaction dating back to post Summerslam it seems like these 2 together produce top rated segments that people watch in high volumes. Just goes to show you the interest you can garner with a white hot babyface on the rise and one of the best heels ever playing the foil. I'm sure the Bryan marks will attribute this all to him and the Bryan haters will attribute it to HHH but the truth is, it's the 2 of them together that brings the magic and produces the goods. Daniel Bryan has never drawn ratings like this in his life and yes, a big part of that is because of the association with the Authority and the storyline here. At the same time, HHH wouldn't be pulling these numbers on his own right now because while he has the proven ability to move numbers, it's the combination of he and Bryan together that is making things soar. Equal credit where it's due here folks. It may not be Austin/McMahon but this thing is working big time. If this level of interest can translate to Network buys Bryan will be a made man for life.



During his World Title Reign at SD Bryan had one of the highest draws in SD in the last 4-5 years. He drew very well. I can't imagine HHH today will draw any bit but anyways it's a combination of all, the Authority, Bryan and the storyline


----------



## Chicago Warrior

All I got to say is that WWE better give Daniel Bryan a raise and a new top star contract deal.


----------



## CrowHardy

,


----------



## Waffelz

Quote isn't working - did some guy really say Taker/HHH carried WM28's buyrate?


----------



## The Buryer

P.H. Hatecraft said:


> A guy who doesn't have the company's backing doesn't face the Undertaker at WM, Brock Lesnar at Summerslam, the Rock twice or holds the championship for over a year. As for HHH, are we forgetting Punk was his original opponent? He may not have turned heel for Punk, he didn't turn to put over Bryan originally either. How quickly do we forget Daniel Wyatt, which was a clear demotion. If I were a betting man, I would wager a buck on Batista ending HHH's authority (again) as the original plan.


Triple H brought his best fucking friend, a retire legend, veteran and one of the biggest names in the business, Shawn Michaels back exclusively for Bryan and even had him tapping out in the ring. If that doesn't tell you about HHH's support then I don't know what else would. Hell even the entire authority storyline, if you take HHH out of summerslam and the past 7 months, you'd be left with Bryan vs Orton for the WWE title over and over until Cena returns and it turns to Cena vs Orton leaving Bryan behind in the upper mid card again. At best, it would have been a three way feud and considering WWE/Vince's obsession with Cena and Orton as top stars, again it would made Bryan an afterthought. 

Even when you go back a few months to TLC PPV, you would've noticed not many folks complained about Bryan not being in the title picture with Cena/Orton, why do you think that was? It's because people knew as long HHH is still present as the top heel, Bryan doesn't need to worry about staying relevant in the main event scene. And on the contrary, when Big show vs Authority was happening, almost everyone complained. Essentially, more people complained about Bryan taken out of the Authority storyline, than being left out of the title picture for Orton/Cena. And the reason for that was because the Big Show, by positioning himself as HHH's adversary, was stealing Bryan's main event credibility. Presence of a star like Triple H as the top heel gives Bryan massive credibility and relevance. Without him, Bryan right now would have been pushed well behind Randy Orton and returning top stars John Cena, Dave Batista, Brock Lesnar and Undertaker. Don't ever underestimate the significance of the support from a guy like HHH would do for talents. If he's backing you, he will go all the way to make sure you're walking out of mania, a star.

As for Punk though, I think that had a lot to do with Punk sorta blackmailing them into putting him in the top storyline for Mania, since his contract was expiring and he wasn't willing to re-sign. Letting the contract of a top talent like Punk expire would reflect poorly on WWE, and Triple H being the head of talent relations who handles those things, I could imagine why he went with that option. Otherwise, I see no reason for Triple H to push Bryan aside for Punk, after over 6 months of solid backstory and main event push that saw Bryan get to this level of stardom in the first place.






Waffelz said:


> Quote isn't working - did some guy really say Taker/HHH carried WM28's buyrate?


I said it carried RAW ratings which is true. It was the hottest feud going in by far.


----------



## N-destroy

Damn, that peak viewership close to 2 million. AMAZING! Think this is the highest m18-49 demo viewership they have drawn in the last two years, biggest since Rock's first return to WWE in early 2011 and his interactions with Cena that year.





#BadNewsSanta said:


> Nice. Out of curiosity though, where'd you get that number from, *and what would it equate to in ratings (about).*


Hard to say without all the data, but a 3.8 rating right about equals 5 million overall viewers, 5.3~5.5m viewers would be in the range of 4.1 - 4.2 rating.


----------



## CookiePuss

Not to take away from Daniel Bryan or Triple H and Steph (who both carried the segment), if I was switching through my channels and saw a shit load of people in the ring, I'd probably stop and see what was going on too.


----------



## THANOS

cookiepuss said:


> Not to take away from Daniel Bryan or Triple H and Steph (who both carried the segment), if I was switching through my channels and saw a shit load of people in the ring, I'd probably stop and see what was going on too.


Most definitely man and I'm sure a lot of the viewers did just that, but the segment apparently did gain throughout, which suggest they held all the viewers from beginning to end of the segment (which means it drew them in for an extended period of time equating to enjoyment?). Moreover, Bryan, and HHH for that matter, have been gaining monster numbers for awhile now, and Bryan has been gaining quite well ever since mid 2013. This suggests that he has certainly become a draw, and when combined with the drawing power of HHH it equals a must watch segment for fans.

People on here may bitch about it, and scream for Bryan's head like they did with Punk, but it's certainly not translating onto tv and I don't think it ever will. Remember all the people booing Punk during his big babyface run in 2012? Yep neither do I lol. This is because the hate began and ended on the internet and was never ever heard on tv. This will be no different to Bryan's run because like CM Punk he wrestles a style that is hate-proof and his character is believable as an underdog.

Now I ran off on a tangent a bit there lol, so I apologize, but the point remains that Bryan is gaining viewers and will only increase as a draw as time goes by, all the way being universally loved and cheered in crowds, despite the quiet minority on the internet shitting on him.


----------



## Gretchen

Scrolling through several pages of this thread is the way to go if you want to lose lots of brain cells. 

"YEASHSHD!11!11!111 DA GUY I HATEZ AND STALKZ EVER DAI CM PUNK.. THE RAW IN THE CITY HES FROM DIDNT PRODUCE RATINGZ!!!!1111111 BEST DAY UV MAH LYFE!!1111111 SUK IT PHIL FANS 111!!!!1 lolollololol"

So pathetic.


----------



## THANOS

RhodesForWHC said:


> Scrolling through several pages of this thread is the way to go if you want to lose lots of brain cells.
> 
> "YEASHSHD!11!11!111 DA GUY I HATEZ AND STALKZ EVER DAI CM PUNK.. THE RAW IN THE CITY HES FROM DIDNT PRODUCE RATINGZ!!!!1111111 BEST DAY UV MAH LYFE!!1111111 SUK IT PHIL FANS 111!!!!1 lolollololol"
> 
> So pathetic.


I always find that overblown hatred of guys like him and Bryan on here hilarious, especially since it NEVER translates onto tv lol, and instead they get cheered unanimously at the expense of all their muscle-bound favourites. It's true music to my ears and soul. :


----------



## Uerfer

Considering summerslam 2013 buys, it sure "translates" to PPV business. :ti :ti


----------



## Gretchen

THANOS said:


> I always find that overblown hatred of guys like him and Bryan on here hilarious, especially since it NEVER translates onto tv lol, and instead they get cheered unanimously at the expense of all their muscle-bound favourites. It's true music to my ears and soul. :


It's ironic b/c I would have thought that Punk would be popular on an online wrestling forum, yet so many people here hate his guts. It's pathetic, they're so obsessed w/ him that some of them post more in Punk related threads than actual Punk marks.

Bryan also gets quite a bit of hate, but I have seen less of it b/c he isn't as vocal as Punk, and I guess, b/c he doesn't whine and bitch as much as Punk does. 

But yeah, these two are always over at shows, while they are hated on here by many. I've also found it funny that most of the anti-Punk posters actually seem to be from Chicago. :lmao


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The Chicago anti Punk fans probably like the White Sox whereas Phil loves the Cubs.


----------



## THANOS

Uerfer said:


> Considering summerslam 2013 buys, it sure "translates" to PPV business. :ti :ti


You need to talk to #Mark or Validreasoning, because they have posted the updated buys, and given your current opinion the update would surprise you.

Now when you consider that it was Bryan's 1st payperview he headlined ever and consider Austin bombed on payperview as a headliner for awhile before winning the title from HBK in 98, it's perfectly reasonable to consider the new update for Summerslam's buys to be a success.



RhodesForWHC said:


> It's ironic b/c I would have thought that Punk would be popular on an online wrestling forum, yet so many people here hate his guts. It's pathetic, they're so obsessed w/ him that some of them post more in Punk related threads than actual Punk marks.
> 
> Bryan also gets quite a bit of hate, but I have seen less of it b/c he isn't as vocal as Punk, and I guess, b/c he doesn't whine and bitch as much as Punk does.
> 
> But yeah, these two are always over at shows, while they are hated on here by many. I've also found it funny that most of the anti-Punk posters actually seem to be from Chicago. :lmao


Yeah it's always hilarious to see that ironic hate/love relationship with them lol. It really makes it seem that the internet hates Punk and Bryan but the casuals and WWE's core fanbase loves them. It really proves all these "Only the IWC loves them cause they don't draw" posts to be pure trash and completely unfounded hate.



IDONTSHIV said:


> The Chicago anti Punk fans probably like the White Sox whereas Phil loves the Cubs.


Yeah that could be possible lol, never underestimate the power of sports fandom.


----------



## Uerfer

> You need to talk to #Mark or Validreasoning, because they have posted the updated buys, and given your current opinion the update would surprise you.


:ti Why those two? They are some kinda buyrates experts now?

Summerslam domestic is still an all time low figure since 1997. International buys increased like they always do for most big PPVs, that is not new.



> Now when you consider that it was Bryan's 1st payperview he headlined ever and consider Austin bombed on payperview as a headliner for awhile before winning the title from HBK in 98, it's perfectly reasonable to consider the new update for Summerslam's buys to be a success.


From about Nov 1997, Austin was red hot drawing the biggest house show crowds, doubling up ratings and buyrates before they had him win the rumble and beat the champion. Bryan isn't even in the ballpark. I get that it was his first headlining PPV and all that but all time low buyrate is just unacceptable, especially considering how overhyped his fandom was at the time, actually the entire event itself was overhyped. Besides, its not like he did any better headlining with Orton after summerslam. 

Let's just hope Wrestlemania delivers big, because in a lot of ways, fans have forced WWE's hands in this. WWE were probably hoping to give Bryan his title reign on a later PPV but you guys may have made them change those plans, which is not good. This is what Bryan fans don't seem to get, Bryan may have lost his favour with the WWE because of all this. If WWE had pushed him as the champion as per the plans they had for him, he would have had their full support no matter what, whether he does well as champion or not wouldn't matter one bit. However, since they were forced into this, I believe Vince is gonna fold on his title reign at the very first sign of trouble, and bring back super Cena to the rescue as he has done in the past with many superstars. Actually when you think about it, CM Punk's entire push reflects this to perfection. "Summer of Punk" angle came out of nowhere due to the contract situation at the time. Not only did they horribly botch it, but for the most part they didn't even know how to proceed with it, and had him stripped off the title the very next PPV. But when they realized what they had done, WWE _themselves_ voluntarily put the title on him at survivor series 2011 and gave him strong backing for well over a year, even when he proved to be a poor draw as champion. IMO without WWE's favour, right now it really comes down to Bryan better fucking draw or he's done scenario. Bryan's entire appeal is being an underdog who is denied his deserved title reign, once he accomplishes that, I'm not sure how he going to keep things interesting, before his fans turn on him like they turned on Cena.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

N-destroy said:


> Hard to say without all the data, but a 3.8 rating right about equals 5 million overall viewers, 5.3~5.5m viewers would be in the range of 4.1 - 4.2 rating.


4.1-4.2 seems pretty high, even for 5.5 million.

Just did a quick calculation, to figure out the overall average amount of viewers per 1.0 rating for this episode of Raw. Got about 1.41 million. Assuming it got 5.5 million, 5.5/1.41 would be a 3.9 million. On the "low" end (5.3 million), it'd be a 3.75. Either way, very very impressive numbers, especially for the 10PM slot. Does anyone know what the average viewers for Rock/Cena's promo on Old School Raw was? (that got a 4.1)


----------



## #Mark

Uerfer said:


> Considering summerslam 2013 buys, it sure "translates" to PPV business. :ti :ti


Summerslam netted 332,000 buys. Down from last years major business (which had the benefit of a 4 month long build between HHH/Brock) but up over 22,000 buys from the Summerslam 2011 buyrate. Domestically, they both netted 296,000 buys. 

Night of Champions netted 196,000 buys on a weekend that featured a huge Floyd Mayweather fight. For some perspective, it was higher than the NOC buys in 2011 and 2010.. and was also higher than the HISTORIC UNIFICATION match at TLC and Survivor Series 2013's buyrate. It also was the first PPV out of three in six weeks since BG and HIAC were only three weeks apart. 

HIAC netted a strong 228,000 buys, the highest in the PPVs history. There were definitely other factors (Cena's return) but it was the blow off to Bryan/Orton. Cena's return can only contribute so much because the next month featured Cena's first WHC title defense and the buys were atrocious.

Survivor Series 2013 netted 177,000 buys. It was Bryan's first PPV out of the ME and produced the lowest buyrate in Survivor Series history. There was definitely intrigue in Bryan's chase for the title and this historically low buyrate proves it.

BattleGround netted a poor 114,000 buys. But it was never intended to do more because it was only three weeks after NOC and less than three weeks before HIAC. The last time WWE put a PPV in October sandwiched between two PPVs with less than three weeks of build was Vengeance 2011 which produced a 120,000 buyrate and was double main evented by HHH/Punk vs. Awesome Truth and Cena vs. Del Rio for the WWE title.

In October Bryan main evented PPVs netted a total of 342,000 buys.

Couple that with his strong ratings gains over the last several months and his merch sales and you'd be delusional to say that Bryan isn't proving that he can produce great business.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

#Mark said:


> Summerslam netted 332,000 buys. Down from last years major business (which had the benefit of a 4 month long build between HHH/Brock) but up over 22,000 buys from the Summerslam 2011 buyrate. Domestically, they both netted 296,000 buys.
> 
> Night of Champions netted 196,000 buys on a weekend that featured a huge Floyd Mayweather fight. For some perspective, it was higher than the NOC buys in 2011 and 2010.. and was also higher than the HISTORIC UNIFICATION match at TLC and Survivor Series 2013's buyrate. It also was the first PPV out of three in six weeks since BG and HIAC were only three weeks apart.
> 
> HIAC netted a strong 228,000 buys, the highest in the PPVs history. There were definitely other factors (Cena's return) but it was the blow off to Bryan/Orton. Cena's return can only contribute so much because the next month featured Cena's first WHC title defense and the buys were atrocious.
> 
> Survivor Series 2013 netted 177,000 buys. It was Bryan's first PPV out of the ME and produced the lowest buyrate in Survivor Series history. There was definitely intrigue in Bryan's chase for the title and this historically low buyrate proves it.
> 
> BattleGround netted a poor 114,000 buys. But it was never intended to do more because it was only three weeks after NOC and less than three weeks before HIAC. The last time WWE put a PPV in October sandwiched between two PPVs with less than three weeks of build was Vengeance 2011 which produced a 120,000 buyrate and was double main evented by HHH/Punk vs. Awesome Truth and Cena vs. Del Rio for the WWE title.
> 
> In October Bryan main evented PPVs netted a total of 342,000 buys.
> 
> Couple that with his strong ratings gains over the last several months and his merch sales and you'd be delusional to say that Bryan isn't proving that *he can produce great business.*


Great is a bit of an overstatement, But I agree with everything otherwise.(Y)

If he stays on this consistent push, he could eventually be able to produce great business. Right now he is showing potential.


----------



## THANOS

#Mark said:


> Summerslam netted 332,000 buys. Down from last years major business (which had the benefit of a 4 month long build between HHH/Brock) but up over 22,000 buys from the Summerslam 2011 buyrate. Domestically, they both netted 296,000 buys.
> 
> Night of Champions netted 196,000 buys on a weekend that featured a huge Floyd Mayweather fight. For some perspective, it was higher than the NOC buys in 2011 and 2010.. and was also higher than the HISTORIC UNIFICATION match at TLC and Survivor Series 2013's buyrate. It also was the first PPV out of three in six weeks since BG and HIAC were only three weeks apart.
> 
> HIAC netted a strong 228,000 buys, the highest in the PPVs history. There were definitely other factors (Cena's return) but it was the blow off to Bryan/Orton. Cena's return can only contribute so much because the next month featured Cena's first WHC title defense and the buys were atrocious.
> 
> Survivor Series 2013 netted 177,000 buys. It was Bryan's first PPV out of the ME and produced the lowest buyrate in Survivor Series history. There was definitely intrigue in Bryan's chase for the title and this historically low buyrate proves it.
> 
> BattleGround netted a poor 114,000 buys. But it was never intended to do more because it was only three weeks after NOC and less than three weeks before HIAC. The last time WWE put a PPV in October sandwiched between two PPVs with less than three weeks of build was Vengeance 2011 which produced a 120,000 buyrate and was double main evented by HHH/Punk vs. Awesome Truth and Cena vs. Del Rio for the WWE title.
> 
> In October Bryan main evented PPVs netted a total of 342,000 buys.
> 
> Couple that with his strong ratings gains over the last several months and his merch sales and you'd be delusional to say that Bryan isn't proving that he can produce great business.


Thanks man :clap. I can always count on you to provide the necessary statistics.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

THANOS said:


> Most definitely man and I'm sure a lot of the viewers did just that, but the segment apparently did gain throughout, which suggest they held all the viewers from beginning to end of the segment (which means it drew them in for an extended period of time equating to enjoyment?). Moreover, Bryan, and HHH for that matter, have been gaining monster numbers for awhile now, and Bryan has been gaining quite well ever since mid 2013. This suggests that he has certainly become a draw, and when combined with the drawing power of HHH it equals a must watch segment for fans.
> 
> People on here may bitch about it, and scream for Bryan's head like they did with Punk, but it's certainly not translating onto tv and I don't think it ever will. Remember all the people booing Punk during his big babyface run in 2012? Yep neither do I lol. This is because the hate began and ended on the internet and was never ever heard on tv. This will be no different to Bryan's run because like CM Punk he wrestles a style that is hate-proof and his character is believable as an underdog.
> 
> Now I ran off on a tangent a bit there lol, so I apologize, but the point remains that Bryan is gaining viewers and will only increase as a draw as time goes by, all the way being universally loved and cheered in crowds, despite the quiet minority on the internet shitting on him.


Punk wasn't doing the numbers Bryan is, so the comparison is moot. Bryan is over, and It's translating to the ratings. As much as I like Punk, he couldn't really draw.


----------



## THANOS

CHIcagoMade said:


> Punk wasn't doing the numbers Bryan is, so the comparison is moot. Bryan is over, and It's translating to the ratings. As much as I like Punk, he couldn't really draw.


Yes I can agree to this, but Punk did do pretty decent numbers once he turned heel, and I think that was because it was much truer to his own personality and, thus, much more believable to the viewer. The current incarnation of Bryan is completely believable and true to himself, which is why it's pulling in such good numbers, with potential to develop into great numbers.


----------



## Sonnen Says

CHIcagoMade said:


> Punk wasn't doing the numbers Bryan is, so the comparison is moot. Bryan is over, and It's translating to the ratings. As much as I like Punk, he couldn't really draw.


Wrong. Punk drew higher than him, the buyrates was never just because of him. He had Punk/Lesnar in SS 13 and the other numbers weren't really that good. Don't even start.


----------



## Chrome

IDONTSHIV said:


> The Chicago anti Punk fans probably like the White Sox whereas Phil loves the Cubs.


I don't know about that. I'm a ChiSox fan and couldn't care less that Punk roots for the Cubs, hell he could root for the Packers for all I care, he entertains me alot and that's why he's one of my favorites. I think the anti-Punk people just hate him to try and stand out more, and enjoy getting under Punk fans' skin.

Although I'm a big Punk mark, he never was a great ratings and buyrates draw. Nothing wrong with that, and he did have his moments, but so far, Bryan is proving to be a bigger draw. At this point, there's really no excuse not to give Bryan the World title at Wrestlemania and give him a sustained run with the belt.


----------



## Uerfer

#Mark said:


> Summerslam netted 332,000 buys. Down from last years major business (which had the benefit of a 4 month long build between HHH/Brock) but up over 22,000 buys from the Summerslam 2011 buyrate. Domestically, they both netted 296,000 buys.
> 
> Night of Champions netted 196,000 buys on a weekend that featured a huge Floyd Mayweather fight. For some perspective, it was higher than the NOC buys in 2011 and 2010.. and was also higher than the HISTORIC UNIFICATION match at TLC and Survivor Series 2013's buyrate. It also was the first PPV out of three in six weeks since BG and HIAC were only three weeks apart.
> 
> HIAC netted a strong 228,000 buys, the highest in the PPVs history. There were definitely other factors (Cena's return) but it was the blow off to Bryan/Orton. Cena's return can only contribute so much because the next month featured Cena's first WHC title defense and the buys were atrocious.
> 
> Survivor Series 2013 netted 177,000 buys. It was Bryan's first PPV out of the ME and produced the lowest buyrate in Survivor Series history. There was definitely intrigue in Bryan's chase for the title and this historically low buyrate proves it.
> 
> BattleGround netted a poor 114,000 buys. But it was never intended to do more because it was only three weeks after NOC and less than three weeks before HIAC. The last time WWE put a PPV in October sandwiched between two PPVs with less than three weeks of build was Vengeance 2011 which produced a 120,000 buyrate and was double main evented by HHH/Punk vs. Awesome Truth and Cena vs. Del Rio for the WWE title.


Like I said, Summerslam domestic is still an all time low figure. International buys typically goes up after a few months, that is normal. You can't credit what normally happens, to Daniel Bryan. At the end of the day, summerslam was not a success, even Vince called it "swing and a miss", we could argue all day about this pathetic buyrate but considering how hot Bryan supposedly was and all the hype for the event, it should've done major business. 

NOC drew decent all things considered, I guess. Even then domestic was lower than previous years from what I understand.

HIAC is purely Cena and Shawn's return. Bryan/Orton was the "other" factor in this, not the main factor. Without their returns, blowoff match or not, Bryan/Orton has no hope even coming closer to that figure.

Survivor series doing bad doesn't prove Bryan's significance but big show's unwantedness in the main event scene. If Bryan vs Orton drew well atleast once before I would agree with your post, but its did just as awful the previous PPVs. I guess the conclusion is Bryan > Big show, and that proves what exactly?

Battleground was a failure. Considering it would have been a failure even if brock lesnar main evented it, I don't really blame Bryan for it, but it's still a failure nonetheless. 




> Couple that with his strong ratings gains over the last several months and his merch sales and you'd be delusional to say that Bryan isn't proving that he can produce great business


Great business? More like average business. Hey, let me make it clear, I don't hate Bryan or wish to see him depushed or anything like that. But for a guy who is supposedly super hot, crowds going nuts every week, his performance in the key business metrics isn't all that "hot".


----------



## Uerfer

And its laughable to compare this PPV run to Steve Austin of all people.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Sonnen Says said:


> Wrong. Punk drew higher than him, the buyrates was never just because of him. He had Punk/Lesnar in SS 13 and the other numbers weren't really that good. Don't even start.


Don't even start what? Telling the truth? I'm a huge fan of Punk, but I can be objective as well when talking about him. Can you?


----------



## Sonnen Says

The only good buy was HIAC, mainly because of Cena and HBK return. If it was just Bryan/Orton it would have been lower than the previous year like 10 less. NOC 13 did the lowest domestic number for the PPV, for some reason it did higher internationally than 10/11. Probably because they canceled a PPV early in the year which was OTL. They had an extra PPV in 2011 which explains why some were low. And the rest were bad. How can anyone say Bryan proved to be a bigger draw. You seriously think SS 13 will do higher if it wasn't for the real ME in Punk/Lesnar. If it was just Bryan/Cena it wouldn't draw even as much as 2011. Stop this delusion. Punk outsold Cena for 8 months in 2011 and few weeks back was outselling Cena in online orders before he left. Punk is a bigger draw, nothing proves Bryan to be a bigger draw.


----------



## Vyer

I thought any buys were good, including international ones.


----------



## Uerfer

PPVs are half price outside of US, sometimes even completely free. Unless its a big event like wrestlemania, profits from international buys are not that lucrative, since WWE only get half of what is already half. Domestic buys is where their profits truly come from, with all those HD costs/subscriptions and what not.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Sonnen Says said:


> The only good buy was HIAC, mainly because of Cena and HBK return. If it was just Bryan/Orton it would have been lower than the previous year like 10 less. NOC 13 did the lowest domestic number for the PPV, for some reason it did higher internationally than 10/11. Probably because they canceled a PPV early in the year which was OTL. They had an extra PPV in 2011 which explains why some were low. And the rest were bad. How can anyone say Bryan proved to be a bigger draw. You seriously think SS 13 will do higher if it wasn't for the real ME in Punk/Lesnar. If it was just Bryan/Cena it wouldn't draw even as much as 2011. Stop this delusion. *Punk outsold Cena for 8 months in 2011* and few weeks back was outselling Cena in online orders before he left. Punk is a bigger draw, nothing proves Bryan to be a bigger draw.


Source or please stop saying this shit.

Also, stop making excuses. And outselling Cena in online orders:lmao, the fuck is that suppose to be saying?


----------



## Sonnen Says

CHIcagoMade said:


> Don't even start what? Telling the truth? I'm a huge fan of Punk, but I can be objective as well when talking about him. Can you?


What truth? just read what I said in my previous post. Some people don't even know what they are talking about. Just to add Punk did higher in 2012 than Bryan did in 2013. Lets use logic here. SS 11 was 2 rematches and Orton/Christian have been done 3 times in a PPV before it so it wasn't a strong card by any means. SS 13 had a stronger card if it didn't do higher with Brock in the PPV than it's embarrassing. So it's expected, not that it's a good number anyway.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Sonnen Says said:


> What truth? just read what I said in my previous post. Some people don't even know what they are talking about. Just to add Punk did higher in 2012 than Bryan did in 2013. Lets use logic here. SS 11 was 2 rematches and Orton/Christian have been done 3 times in a PPV before it so it wasn't a strong card by any means. SS 13 had a stronger card if it didn't do higher with Brock in the PPV than it's embarrassing. So it's expected, not that it's a good number anyway.


You're forgetting 2011 wasn't Punk's first crack at the main event.


----------



## #Mark

Uerfer said:


> Like I said, Summerslam domestic is still an all time low figure. International buys typically goes up after a few months, that is normal. You can't credit what normally happens, to Daniel Bryan. At the end of the day, summerslam was not a success, even Vince called it "swing and a miss", we could argue all day about this pathetic buyrate but considering how hot Bryan supposedly was and all the hype for the event, it should've done major business.
> 
> NOC drew decent all things considered, I guess. Even then domestic was lower than previous years from what I understand.
> 
> HIAC is purely Cena and Shawn's return. Bryan/Orton was the "other" factor in this, not the main factor. Without their returns, blowoff match or not, Bryan/Orton has no hope even coming closer to that figure.
> 
> Survivor series doing bad doesn't prove Bryan's significance but big show's unwantedness in the main event scene. If Bryan vs Orton drew well atleast once before I would agree with your post, but its did just as awful the previous PPVs. I guess the conclusion is Bryan > Big show, and that proves what exactly?
> 
> Battleground was a failure. Considering it would have been a failure even if brock lesnar main evented it, I don't really blame Bryan for it, but it's still a failure nonetheless.
> 
> 
> Great business? More like average business. Hey, let me make it clear, I don't hate Bryan or wish to see him depushed or anything like that. But for a guy who is supposedly super hot, crowds going nuts every week, his performance in the key business metrics isn't all that "hot".


Summerslam 2011 experienced a bump in numbers and SS 2013 still had 22,000 buys. 2012 was more of an anomaly since it was Brock's second match back, they had an intense four month build with Brock breaking HHH's arm, and it was HHH's return match. They aren't getting business like that again. Even the Summerslam 2010 buyrate with the Nexus program was only 18,000 more buys than Summerslam 2013. Summerslam 2013's buyrate was low comparably to 2012's but not low when comparing to previous numbers.

Why are you downplaying NOC? Domestically it was not all that low, I'm pretty sure it was still higher than 2011 and only slightly lower than 2012. Still, the PPV model was drastically different compared to last year. NOC netting higher buys than SS, TLC (the unification match), and the years prior to 2012 shows Bryan's potential. Hell, I'm sure it doesn't even account for the thousands of refunds that was reported after Bryan dropped the belt.

Just comparing the PPV model between 2013 and 2012:


2012:
September 16, 2012: NOC: 207,000 buys
October 28, 2012: HIAC: 200,000 buys

2013:
September 15, 2013: NOC: 196,000 buys
October 6, 2013: Battleground: 114,000 buys
October 27, 2013: HIAC: 228,000

2012 had the benefit of a six weeks between PPVs while 2013 only had less than three weeks between PPVs. The fact that NOC 2013 did so well with two PPVs approaching in six weeks (while 2012 only had one PPV in six weeks) says a lot.

HIAC definitely had a variety of factors but people are not paying to see HBK referee a match, they're paying to see if he would help Bryan or not. He was part of the blowoff to the Bryan/Orton match. Yeah, Cena's return was definitely a huge factor and most likely the biggest but people obviously weren't into him that much to buy the following PPV to see his first title defense.

You also have to account that Bryan was doing these numbers during the thick of Football season with Cena (the only proven draw in the company) on the shelf. Even Punk at his hottest in 2011 still had Cena co-headlining PPVs with him. Bryan was on his own so the fact that buys did well and ratings did well says that people were invested in Bryan.


----------



## funnyfaces1

When will we all realize that the brand draws more than the wrestler? Except if you're black :henry1 :rock2 :cena


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

How I'd go with Punk vs. Bryan... just to get it out of the way:

Punk's a good TV ratings draw, despite what people will say.

Bryan's a great one though and definitely a better ratings draw than Punk. He pulls in numbers a lot more consistently than Punk. He's also more over right now than Punk was ever (outside of Chicago)... which isn't a knock at Punk as Punk has been very very over, but Bryan's just in another world of overness right now. You could argue he's the most over face of the last decade. Merch wise it goes to Punk. Live event gates... I have no idea. PPV wise, I don't think either of them are the strongest at getting people to pay for PPV to see them, although under the right circumstances/feuds, both could definitely help out a buyrate. 

Take that as you will.


----------



## Sonnen Says

CHIcagoMade said:


> You're forgetting 2011 wasn't Punk's first crack at the main event.


You mean 2009 push. He got a lot more buys than Bryan in 2013 by some distance. 

ER: 213,000
NOC: 267,000
SS: 369,000
HIAC: 283,000



CHIcagoMade said:


> Source or please stop saying this shit.
> 
> Also, stop making excuses. And outselling Cena in online orders:lmao, the fuck is that suppose to be saying?


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...es-1-in-merchandise-set-to-receive-major-push

http://cmpunksource.org/?p=1234

There was another one in December or January still had Punk in top but then Cena overtook him again for several years now, but was still #2 in the company and selling a lot of merch and outsold Cena at times. Impressive and a report few weeks back stated that Punk is outselling Cena in online orders. You will understand now. 

http://www.411mania.com/wrestling/n...Sales-Update-–-Cena-and-Punk-Lead-The-Way.htm


----------



## Londrick

Who cares about these two vanilla midgets and how they're average draws? It's pointless unless once of them gets on Cena's level where he's make the company a 100 million a year.


----------



## Vyer

Uerfer said:


> PPVs are half price outside of US, sometimes even completely free. Unless its a big event like wrestlemania, profits from international buys are not that lucrative, since WWE only get half of what is already half. Domestic buys is where their profits truly come from, with all those HD costs/subscriptions and what not.


Interesting, but if that's true, I still don't quite understand why that is bad. If both have the same domestic buys but one have higher international buys, then I would consider the one with more international buys to be more successful. I believe the entire card for Summerslam '13 can be credited for that. 

The bottom line is really the total profits the ppvs make.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Sonnen Says said:


> You mean 2009 push. He got a lot more buys than Bryan in 2013 by some distance.
> 
> ER: 213,000
> NOC: 267,000
> SS: 369,000
> HIAC: 283,000
> 
> 
> 
> http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...es-1-in-merchandise-set-to-receive-major-push
> 
> http://cmpunksource.org/?p=1234
> 
> There was another one in December or January still had Punk in top but then Cena overtook him again for several years now, but was still #2 in the company and selling a lot of merch and outsold Cena at times. Impressive and a report few weeks back stated that Punk is outselling Cena in online orders. You will understand now.
> 
> http://www.411mania.com/wrestling/n...Sales-Update-–-Cena-and-Punk-Lead-The-Way.htm


But using your logic, he had a lot of help from actual draws like Orton, Cena, DX, and a red hot Hardy.

See how I can take that away from Punk, but you would want me to, so you can't take buys from Bryan, right?


----------



## Sonnen Says

CHIcagoMade said:


> But using your logic, he had a lot of help from actual draws like Orton, Cena, DX, and a red hot Hardy.
> 
> See how I can take that away from Punk, but you would want me to, so you can't take buys from Bryan, right?


Orton was never that big of a draw for PPVs. He mainevented some of the PPVs in 2009 it was lower than Punks and even Cena which is weird (for Cena). NOC had Punk in the poster and was the ME and got 267,000 higher than the previous year and was higher than Survivor Series which was headlined by Cena with HHH and HBK and even the rest of the year. Still tho, numbers are numbers since he ME and was the focus for some time in 2009. 

I don't think anyone should deny it Bryan had help in HIAC and SS to get higher numbers but then again the rest were bad even NOC since it got lower than the previous year and was lower in domestic than 10/11. Note than before NOC they canceled a PPV early in the year which was OTL I think. So that might help increase more international buys.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Sonnen Says said:


> Orton was never that big of a draw for PPVs. He mainevented some of the PPVs in 2009 it was lower than Punks and even Cena which is weird (for Cena). NOC had Punk in the poster and was the ME and got 267,000 higher than the previous year and was higher than Survivor Series which was headlined by Cena with HHH and HBK and even the rest of the year. Still tho, numbers are numbers since he ME and was the focus for some time in 2009.
> 
> I don't think anyone should deny it Bryan had help in HIAC and SS to get higher numbers but then again the rest were bad even NOC since it got lower than the previous year and was lower in domestic than 10/11. Note than before NOC they canceled a PPV early in the year which was OTL I think. So that might help increase more international buys.


You may not like Orton, but he is one of their best heel draws of the last decade.


----------



## superuser1

CHIcagoMade said:


> You may not like Orton, but he is one of their best heel draws of the last decade.


Yeah in 2009 Orton was definitely one of the biggest draws they had


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Orton was a good draw in 2009, although his drawing ability from that year is exaggerated quite a bit. He had a lot of support that helped prop up the ratings (Cena at a time when he was still drawing well, HHH, the McMahons, and as much as they both sucked from an entertainment perspective, the DX reunion and guest hosts), and a year later it showed how much that support might've helped him when those numbers weren't all that good with him as WWE Champion. Though we can't blame him for bringing numbers down without breakdowns, much like Punk, he didn't help things out, and because of that, outside of maybe the first 3 months of 2009 when that whole McMahon storyline centered around him and at that point all eyes were on him, I have my doubts he was at all responsible for the high numbers throughout the rest of the year.

Interestingly enough, Bryan right now is in a similar position Orton was those first 3 months in 09... well, not exactly the same, but in terms of fighting HHH/Stephanie and the rest of the McMahons. It'll be interesting to see how much of a draw Bryan really is once Wrestlemania is over and the whole HHH feud is over with. Right now, imo though, it looks better than Orton because Bryan was also drawing really well even when he wasn't directly feuding with The Authority in the last several months. Plus Bryan is way more over than Orton ever was, so we'll have to wait and see how this plays out.

Edit: Also what will probably help Bryan out, I do think Bryan will defeat HHH at Mania.


----------



## Sonnen Says

CHIcagoMade said:


> You may not like Orton, but he is one of their best heel draws of the last decade.


That's not really accurate. He's not a PPV draw as shown, I'm not hating just showing the numbers. In terms of ratings I don't know as I think the guest hosts, Donald Trump, DX, Triple H, The McMahons (all of them), Cena, Batista, Flair, HBK, etc. were the huge factors or the main ones, when he was the champ the ratings were lower the first time he won it. He was one of the draws but he's not gonna top the list by any means. In PPVs he's not a draw, his PPV ME were the lowest numbers of the year, no matter who he was facing he wasn't a strong PPV draw.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

> Friday's episode of WWE SmackDown was the #2 original program on cable for the night. The show averaged 2.801 million viewers, down from last week's 3.142 million viewers.


SD viewership down and no Bryan on show. Coincidence? NO BRYAN NO RATINGZ!!! :dazzler


----------



## WhyMe123

Fast forward through the undertaker segment, he will do the 5 minutes enterance and nust tell whoever that they will "rest in peace", and then leave.


----------



## superuser1

Sonnen Says said:


> That's not really accurate. He's not a PPV draw as shown, I'm not hating just showing the numbers. In terms of ratings I don't know as I think the guest hosts, Donald Trump, DX, Triple H, The McMahons (all of them), Cena, Batista, Flair, HBK, etc. were the huge factors or the main ones, when he was the champ the ratings were lower the first time he won it. He was one of the draws but he's not gonna top the list by any means. In PPVs he's not a draw, his PPV ME were the lowest numbers of the year, no matter who he was facing he wasn't a strong PPV draw.


What you mean he wasn't at the top of the list when he was the top heel on Raw in 2009? And you have facts about his PPV main events having the lowest of the year? If so post them.


----------



## e1987p

IDONTSHIV said:


> SD viewership down and no Bryan on show. Coincidence? NO BRYAN NO RATINGZ!!! :dazzler


And no Batista.


----------



## Sonnen Says

superuser1 said:


> What you mean he wasn't at the top of the list when he was the top heel on Raw in 2009? And you have facts about his PPV main events having the lowest of the year? If so post them.


He wasn't one of the top draws, he was one of the draws. Why get mad at logic, the ones I mentioned were bigger stars/names than him. As I said when he became the champ the first time the ratings went down. Do you want me to mention the names again? Because I already did. 


*Royal Rumble: 450,000 buys* (Previous year did 533,000 buys and it's the lowest number for the PPV since early 90s)
No Way Out 2009: 272,000
*Wrestlemania XXV: 960,000* (It's WM and it's lower than the previous year anyway which got 1,024,000 buys)
*Backlash: 182,000* (Third lowest of the year and lowest number for the PPV ever and the previous year did 200,000)
Judgment Day: 228,000 
Extreme Rules: 213,000
*The Bash: 178,000* (Second lowest and the lowest for the PPV ever which then got canceled just like Backlash)
Night Of Champions: 267,000
Summerslam: 369,000
*Breaking Point: 169,000* (New PPV and it got the lowest of the year which not necessarily anybody's fault but whatever still it's the lowest)
Hell In A Cell: 300,000
*Bragging Rights: 200,000* (4th lowest of the year)
Survivor Series: 225,000
TLC: 228,000

The ones in bold are him as the the champ and the ones he was the ME


----------



## Loader230

> Interestingly enough, Bryan right now is in a similar position Orton was those first 3 months in 09... well, not exactly the same, but in terms of fighting HHH/Stephanie and the rest of the McMahons. It'll be interesting to see how much of a draw Bryan really is once Wrestlemania is over and the whole HHH feud is over with. Right now, imo though, it looks better than Orton because Bryan was also drawing really well even when he wasn't directly feuding with The Authority in the last several months. Plus Bryan is way more over than Orton ever was, so we'll have to wait and see how this plays out.


I agree with this. Right now, the Authority storyline is more or less carrying him as far as ratings are concerned. It makes him seem significant and viewers pay attention when he is out there. After mania once this angle is done with, Bryan needs a strong heel and a top angle to draw big numbers consistently imo, especially cosidering he won't be the underdog anymore as he would have both the title and the spotlight, he and his fans wanted from the start.


----------



## JY57

didn't look like Total Divas Season 2 Premiere did to well (neither anything on E! for that matter) as not in top ranked 100 cable.. 

But CM Punk appearance increased Talking Dead viewership dramatically almost up to 1 million viewers (5.415 million this week which is up from 4.6 million the previous week) and was 2nd most watched cable show from 18-49 adults, behind the Walking Dead (12.856 million viewers)


----------



## Loader230

Likely a lot of wrestling fans tuned in hoping he would talk about his walkout.


----------



## The Cynical Miracle

JY57 said:


> didn't look like Total Divas Season 2 Premiere did to well (neither anything on E! for that matter) as not in top ranked 100 cable..
> 
> But CM Punk appearance increased Talking Dead viewership dramatically almost up to 1 million viewers (5.415 million this week which is up from 4.6 million the previous week) and was 2nd most watched cable show from 18-49 adults, behind the Walking Dead (12.856 million viewers)


Explains why shots were taken at Punk last night.


----------



## Waffelz

Punker


----------



## Lebyonics

Maybe thats why all those shots unk5


----------



## Starbuck

Punk drawing dat dirty dead zombie hobo demographic. Hey everyone, he just might have found his niche. 

unk


----------



## checkcola

CM Punk's revenge on WWE, burying Total Divas for a week


----------



## Happenstan

The Cynical Miracle said:


> Explains why shots were taken at Punk last night.


Unless WWE employs someone who can see the future I fail to see how the above makes any sense.


So we got quarter breakdowns for the last 2 weeks. Think we get a three-peat?


----------



## checkcola

Happenstan said:


> Unless WWE employs someone who can see the future I fail to see how the above makes any sense.


The jabs Triple H has been taking has nothing to do with Total Divas, just how he really feels


----------



## Cmpunk91

"- This past Sunday's episode of Talking Dead on AMC with CM Punk drew 5.415 million viewers." CM Phil Brooks Punk draws!


----------



## Starbuck

Well to be fair to Trips here Punk did dish out his wife's phone number to his buddies for shits and giggles. It wasn't like his comment last night wasn't provoked. 

As for getting a breakdown, I hope so. Maybe the streak will continue. I can see the overrun not being as strong as usual since it's near impossible for them to beat what they did last week. I also think there's a possibility of them losing viewers as it goes on because of the nature of the beat down etc. Who knows though when the Bryan/HHH segments have been pulling stupid numbers lately.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Wow, Punk buried total divas. He did it for his girl, obviously. unk2

Damn though, almost a million viewer increase? That's very impressive. I think it shows if he ever does come back to the WWE and they promote it correctly, it'd be a very very nice boost in numbers (well, at least for a week). Or maybe not, maybe wrestling fans who already watch WWE weekly added those extra viewers, and Punk coming back wouldn't necessarily increase anything. But it certainly makes things interesting, either way.

Three breakdowns in a row? We ain't that lucky, I'm sure... then again, maybe the torch got their source back/another source and we are going to be graced with breakdowns from here on out. Even in the overrun, I don't see Bryan/HHH doing as well as they did last week. Last week I think was the viewership peak of it all. Fans finally got what they wanted, they were building to the Bryan/HHH and/or Bryan getting added to the title match for weeks. They finally gave them it, so now things will probably go down. The numbers will still be strong, I'm sure, but yeah...

... also hope we get a breakdown next week to see how Taker/Brock's first interaction since the contract signing will be. I do think similar to the above, that was probably the peak viewership of that program, and while I expect better than what we've gotten the last couple of weeks, I'll be surprised if we see some outrageous number, even for that.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

I'm sure Punk did draw some viewers to Talking Dead, but the lionshare of the extra viewers likely tuned in because of the calamitous events of Walking Dead. The episode was tragic and people tuned in to Talking Dead for a cathartic effect.


----------



## Londrick

Phil Brooks draws, CM Punk doesn't.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

IDONTSHIV said:


> I'm sure Punk did draw some viewers to Talking Dead, but the lionshare of the extra viewers likely tuned in because of the calamitous events of Walking Dead. The episode was tragic and people tuned in to Talking Dead for a cathartic effect.


Ah, that could be it. Plus looking at viewership history, they've had some larger increases before. Still, looks like it was third highest in terms of viewership Talking Dead has gotten, which is something.



> Phil Brooks draws, CM Punk doesn't.


But of course!


----------



## Cmpunk91

Punks next return to wwe whenever it maybe is gonna be huge


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Raw down across the board this week and dropped in the demo too:

WWE Entertainment USA 9:00 PM 4174 1.4
WWE Entertainment USA 10:00 PM 4051 1.4
WWE Entertainment USA 8:00 PM 4001 1.4


----------



## Waffelz

Pretty bad numbers.


----------



## D.M.N.

Fairly low numbers, I think the lowest of the year so far. Surprising considering last week, but it wasn't a great show, overrun asides.

Also, I wouldn't be surprised if Q9 did poor with Shield and Kane.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Hour 2 dropped over 500,000 viewers from last week. Hour 2 was down just over 200,000 and hour 1 was down over 160,000. Hour 1 was up .1 in the demo while the show as a whole dropped .2 in the demo.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Yeesh, only barely broke 4 million, which during Mania season isn't too good. We'll have to wait until if a breakdown comes out to see for sure, but it looks like now that people got what they wanted in Bryan getting in the title match, along with the HHH match, that now it's just about counting down the days until Mania. Plus no Taker or Brock didn't help things out either.


----------



## THANOS

IDONTSHIV said:


> Raw down across the board this week and dropped in the demo too:
> 
> WWE Entertainment USA 9:00 PM 4174 1.4
> WWE Entertainment USA 10:00 PM 4051 1.4
> WWE Entertainment USA 8:00 PM 4001 1.4





D.M.N. said:


> Fairly low numbers, I think the lowest of the year so far. Surprising considering last week, but it wasn't a great show, overrun asides.
> 
> Also, I wouldn't be surprised if Q9 did poor with Shield and Kane.


Hmmm, the overrun isn't counted in that right? I would be interested to see what the HHH/Bryan beat-down segment pulled. What conclusions could we draw from the segment if it does well or poorly? 

If it does well do we say people were hoping Bryan would overcome, they were happy to see him get beat down, or maybe they just enjoyed the intensity of the segment?

If it does poor do we say people hated seeing Bryan get beat down, *or that they dislike the storyline?*

I think we can rule out the bold since the ratings have been great so far in this storyline, but I would be interested to see what theories people come up with when/if the breakdown comes out.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

THANOS said:


> Hmmm, the overrun isn't counted in that right? I would be interested to see what the HHH/Bryan beat-down segment pulled. What conclusions could we draw from the segment if it does well or poorly?


Actually, supposedly it is. I had brought it up a week or so ago and D.M.N (I think) said the overrun was counted in the third hour.

Even if it is, it could've still drawn massively. It's estimated the occupy segment pulled over 5.3-5.5 million viewers, based on the torch breakdown's numbers. That's over a million over the average for the hour it was in, so the same could've happened this week. Whole 3rd hour does terribly, and then it spikes right up for the overrun by some massive number to 5 million plus. 

However, the fact the overall show was down leads me to believe it didn't have some massive increase, and rather it'll be a really good number, but down significantly from the last several weeks.


----------



## Loader230

Judging from low numbers not just for one hour but all three hours in the same ballpark, barely scrapping 4m, it seems like they took a due to a specific reason, as opposed to a bad raw or weak storylines. What about the competition last night? Was anything big going on that drew unusually well?


----------



## Cmpunk91

Poor ratings, hmmm i wonder why?! Maybe because erm Geee i dunno?! Maybe because the product is awful??!


----------



## Loader230

4.075m average viewers, 6% down from last week's 4.36m average viewers. The opener and overrun should still be strong, regardless of the overall drop.


----------



## krai999

I know why ratings are low . Let's just say that me and the rest of my country wasn't able to watch raw due to some political program being in place of the normal raw schedule in our local channel.Take it for what it's worth but raw is a popular show to watch in my country of trinidad like england for tna consists of a population of 1.5 million people where instead of the usa channel they have it in the local channel instead where the local channel brought the rights to have the show broadcast at their channel. You don't have to believe me but take it for what it's worth


----------



## superuser1

The entire show was surrounded around Bryan it's his fault


----------



## DanM3

Maybe it's because there was only one good match the whole night


----------



## krai999

superuser1 said:


> The entire show was surrounded around Bryan it's his fault


if you read the previous comment our entire country wasn't able to watch raw due to the local channel it runs on had something else on. Trinidad is what england is with tna


----------



## superuser1

krai999 said:


> if you read the previous comment our entire country wasn't able to watch raw due to the local channel it runs on had something else on. Trinidad is what england is with tna


Sacarsm sacarsm I was joking


----------



## #Mark

superuser1 said:


> The entire show was surrounded around Bryan it's his fault


Actually last week was and Occupy RAW had the highest growth in ratings in over a year. This show was more about HHH than it was about Bryan anyways.. Either way, it wasn't either of their faults. I'm sure there is a specific reason why the show was really low.

Edit: NVM, just read your post :lol


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

It was a pretty HHH centered show. A lot of people probably saw HHH basically say he was going to be in the main event of Mania, and tuned out for the rest of the night in protest. :HHH


----------



## D.M.N.

krai999 said:


> I know why ratings are low . Let's just say that me and the rest of my country wasn't able to *watch raw due to some political program being in place of the normal raw schedule in our local channel.Take it for what it's worth but raw is a popular show to watch in my country of trinidad* like england for tna consists of a population of 1.5 million people where instead of the usa channel they have it in the local channel instead where the local channel brought the rights to have the show broadcast at their channel. You don't have to believe me but take it for what it's worth


You do realise the ratings posted are for the United States only?


----------



## THANOS

#BadNewsSanta said:


> It was a pretty HHH centered show. A lot of people probably saw HHH basically say he was going to be in the main event of Mania, and tuned out for the rest of the night in protest. :HHH


:lmao would be pretty funny if that was the reason.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

I dont blame Trinidad, I blame Canada.


----------



## THANOS

IDONTSHIV said:


> I dont blame Trinidad, I blame Canada.


:HHH


----------



## Waffelz

THANOS! When did you come back?!


----------



## THANOS

Waffelz said:


> THANOS! When did you come back?!


Hey man, I returned after Occupy RAW :, the stipulation more or less rendered my reasons for leaving meaningless .


----------



## Tweener ken

D.M.N. said:


> You do realise the ratings posted are for the United States only?


no, he does'nt


----------



## Loader230

> WWE Raw on Monday, March 17 scored a 2.9 rating, down from last week's 3.09 rating and down from a 3.26 rating two weeks ago.
> 
> Raw slipped below the 3.0-level for the first time since the final Raw of 2013.
> 
> - Raw averaged 4.075 million viewers, down seven percent from last week's show and down 11 percent from two weeks ago. It was the fewest viewers of the year.
> 
> Hourly Break Down: 4.001 million first hour viewers (fewest of the year), increase to 4.174 million second hour viewers (fewest of the year), and slight decline to 4.051 million third hour viewers.
> 
> The bright spot was the third hour only declining three percent from the second hour, as compared to 10 percent, 4 percent, and 9 percent the past three weeks.
> 
> WWE placed the highly-rated Daniel Bryan-Triple H feud in the final segment of the show, which appeared to help offset Raw's typical third hour slide.
> 
> - In the demographic ratings, Raw took a big hit in the key male demos of m18-34 and m18-49 to month-low levels. Raw also took a hit among general viewers, male and female.
> 
> The final hour scored the highest m18-34 rating of the night, but only slightly higher than the third hour. The reverse was true for m18-49, which scored highest in the second hour before declining in the third hour.
> 
> On cable TV Monday night, Raw still ranked #1 in overall viewers and in the male demos.
> 
> *- One year ago this week, Raw slid to a 3.09 rating after scoring a 3.35 rating the week before.*
> 
> *Caldwell's Analysis:* There are several reasons you could come up with to explain why Raw does not have WrestleMania Season momentum in the overall ratings picture. Bryan-Hunter has individual momentum, but the overall show's performance does not reflect Mania Season. Outside of what WWE is doing (or not doing), the Daylight Savings Time change appears to have hurt the last two weeks with the earlier start time. But, that's only one of several factors to consider when looking at the overall picture.


Torch.


----------



## Starbuck

Strange dip but we know nothing unless a breakdown comes. There's only 2 left at this stage and they left a big hook for next week. 

ROLL ON DAT QUARTER HOUR BREAKDOWN

:vince3


----------



## superuser1

Besides the Bryan/HHH/Orton/Batista fiasco what do they really have going on? You got Taker and Brock who's feuding but neither guy shows up then you got Cena who has completely no sold Bray Wyatt as a threat so far. But I guess I can't just assume these things without a true breakdown.


----------



## Fanboi101

How could the daylight savings time change still hurt ratings? Are people that retarded that they still don't know what time it is?


----------



## Loader230

Wade Keller on his radio show speculates St Patrick's day might have something to do with low viewership. Overall, he couldn't be sure of what was the exact reason, and notes that last year had a similar drop in viewership the exact same week. He thinks it might be a pattern that WWE needs to keep an eye out.


----------



## FITZ

Fanboi101 said:


> How could the daylight savings time change still hurt ratings? Are people that retarded that they still don't know what time it is?


I'm sure there must be a few people somewhere that are still wondering why nothing has been happening at the right time for the last 2 weeks.


----------



## Bob the Jobber

Loader230 said:


> Wade Keller on his radio show speculates St Patrick's day might have something to do with low viewership. Overall, he couldn't be sure of what was the exact reason, and notes that last year had a similar drop in viewership the exact same week. He thinks it might be a pattern that WWE needs to keep an eye out.


Would explain the heavy hit to the older male demographic, as most would have been out partying on the second biggest drinking day of the year (after New Year's).


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

> Daniel Bryan was once again in the highest-rated segment of Raw. But, not in the over-run segment taking a beating from Triple H.
> 
> Instead, the second-half of the Bryan vs. Randy Orton match drew the highest quarter-hour rating of the show in the key males 18-49 demo, topping the over-run.
> 
> The entire show was down from recent weeks to year-low levels more in-line with Raw's performance in the fall against Monday Night Football. The bright spots were Bryan vs. Orton in Q6, Paul Heyman's promo in Q7, and John Cena's promo in Q5.
> 
> 3/17 Raw Break Down - M18-49 demo rating
> 
> - Overall Show: 1.95 rating / 1.226 million viewers
> 
> Q1: Raw opened above the show average with a 2.01 rating for Triple H, Randy Orton, and Batista opening the show. Whereas, last week's first Raw after Daylight Savings Time opened with a 1.72 rating.
> 
> Q2: Raw dropped to a 1.79 rating for two commercial breaks and the first-half of The Usos vs. Real Americans.
> 
> Q3: Raw increased to a 1.92 rating for the end of the tag match, one commercial, and Kane backstage with The Shield. The backstage segment out-drew the end of the tag match.
> 
> Q4: Raw declined to a 1.86 rating for two commercials and Sheamus vs. Titus O'Neil in a buffer segment before the top of the hour. This is where the past two Raws intersected - as last week's Raw drew a 1.88 rating in Q4.
> 
> Q5: At the top of the hour, Raw got a slight bump to a 2.01 rating for John Cena responding to the Wyatts and one commercial. Whereas, last week's Q5 segment jumped to a 2.37 rating for The Undertaker.
> 
> Q6: Raw hit a show-high 2.18 rating for Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan in a No DQ match, plus one commercial. The peak of the entire show was from 9:23 to 9:30 p.m. EST for the second-half of the match. Included was show-high peak viewership of 1.523 million viewers at 9:25 p.m.
> 
> Q7: Raw declined to a 2.02 rating for a Paul Heyman promo, plus one commercial.
> 
> Q8: Raw fell to a 1.86 rating for Fandango vs. Goldust, plus one commercial. Whereas, last week's Raw scored a 2.40 rating in Q8.
> 
> Q9: Raw got a minimal bump at the top of the hour - registering a 1.98 rating for Kane calling out The Shield, one commercial, and a Divas tag match.
> 
> Q10: Raw dipped to a 1.89 rating for Divas post-match activity, one commercial, and the first-half of a big eight-man tag match.
> 
> Q11: Raw dipped again to a 1.85 rating for the second-half of the eight-man tag match, which shows audience fatigue kicking in combined with two full commercial breaks in the segment.
> 
> Q12: Raw was even at a 1.85 rating for the "main event" of Bray Wyatt vs. Kofi Kingston and one commercial leading to the top of the hour.
> 
> Over-Run: The over-run increased to a pedestrian 2.12 rating for Triple H's long segment with Daniel Bryan. Last week's over-run scored a 2.44 rating, and the Bryan-Hunter interaction scored a 2.57 rating two weeks ago and a 2.78 rating last week.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: Daniel Bryan remains the top act on the show, based on quarter-hour ratings, but for some reason the over-run segment with Bryan and Hunter did not work this week after two strong ratings.


Bryan top rated segment with Orton. Bryan/HHH second highest rating/ Hmmm...what do these two things have in common? :bryan


This Caldwell guy sounds like a tool. The overrun increased from a lackluster Kofi segment with Bray. The show as a whole was down. HHH"s beatdown was still relatively strong compared to the rest of the program.


----------



## Choke2Death

Orton vs Bryan matches done over and over and they still draw. :bryan rton2


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

As expected, good numbers for the Bryan and HHH stuff, but not great. Overrun not topping the night isn't the best sign, but one weak segment after the last several strong ones they've had is nothing to worry about. Bryan/Orton did great though for the odd quarter they were in. Surprising it still drew well after the million times they've done it in the last 6 months.

Hoping these breakdowns continue. I look forward to seeing what tops next week as we're getting both Taker and Brock for the first time since the first encounter, and Bryan/ HHH have the beatdown hook, so hopefully we can see how it all plays out.


----------



## Your_Solution

Gotta treat last raw as an anomaly. I suspect this monday ratings will be back to normal.


----------



## Starbuck

DAT D BRY 

:dazzler

I'm with the Paddy's day folks as the reason for all 3 hours being down. Top rated segment of the night was 2.18 with the next best coming in a 2.12. In comparison, last week they had 2 segments way above that which pulled the overalls up...overall 8*D. They had a hiccup this week. Next week and the week after we have everybody there and only 2 shows left. 

DA RATINGZ BATTLE CONTINUOOZ

I'm wondering when these wonderful breakdowns are going to run out and/or if big Meltz will speak to his super insider sources any time soon. Double the information, double the ammo.


----------



## THANOS

IDONTSHIV said:


> Bryan top rated segment with Orton. Bryan/HHH second highest rating/ Hmmm...what do these two things have in common? :bryan
> 
> 
> This Caldwell guy sounds like a tool. The overrun increased from a lackluster Kofi segment with Bray. The show as a whole was down. HHH"s beatdown was still relatively strong compared to the rest of the program.


Holy shit! :dazzler I don't want to jump the gun here, but Bryan has certainly developed into some kind of big draw, at least from a viewer perspective. People will watch him no matter what at this point, and actually tune out when he's getting beat down, apparently, in the Trips closing segment. I don't know how you can even make the claim that Bryan can't draw at this point. So many months of being a huge gainer when placed in a prominent spot has done well to extinguish that claim.

Having said that, I'm certainly surprised that the Trips beat down didn't do that well, I certainly enjoyed it, but I guess people really don't want to see Bryan get beat down. I don't think that one overrun where Orton beat down Bryan before one of their ppv matches did well either, correct me if I'm wrong?


----------



## Wagg

I think that in the last few weeks i didn't seen the viewership for every segment. What happened to them?


----------



## THANOS

Wagg said:


> I think that in the last few weeks i didn't seen the viewership for every segment. What happened to them?


In short, Bryan and HHH dominated.


----------



## Starbuck

The beat down was long and viewership was down across the board. Even in saying that, the overrun was only 0.06 behind the peak of the Bryan/Orton match. It's nothing to worry about although there might be some truth to people not wanting to see Bryan get beat up. Then again, previous beat downs of him have been huge gainers so who knows. Pretty much every Bryan/HHH segment dating right back to Summerslam has either topped the night or brought record numbers. This week Bryan topped the night on his own with the beat down right behind him. I don't see that as them losing any steam because they were never touching what they did last week. If they take another dip next week though maybe the novelty has worn off, you just don't know.


----------



## Bob the Jobber

With all the soccer mom rage over the HHH beatdown, how many of those do we credit for tuning out during it?


----------



## THANOS

Starbuck said:


> The beat down was long and viewership was down across the board. Even in saying that, the overrun was only 0.06 behind the peak of the Bryan/Orton match. It's nothing to worry about although there might be some truth to people not wanting to see Bryan get beat up. Then again, previous beat downs of him have been huge gainers so who knows. Pretty much every Bryan/HHH segment dating right back to Summerslam has either topped the night or brought record numbers. This week Bryan topped the night on his own with the beat down right behind him. I don't see that as them losing any steam because they were never touching what they did last week. If they take another dip next week though maybe the novelty has worn off, you just don't know.


Was the Orton beat down of Bryan a huge gainer? I seem to remember it doing poorly compared to the overall average but I could be wrong? 

Would you agree that Bryan certainly is doing pretty damn well for himself in his current position as a draw? To me, it really is incredible to watch, because I don't ever remember Punk being at this level prior to his 434 title reign. In fact, Bryan is drawing at a level right now that "could" suggest that if he wins the belts at Mania he could actually take off and bring in loads of viewers to the overall show. I know that's a big prediction, but he certainly is doing much better than I could ever imagine at drawing in viewers, especially when we consider his size and look constraints.


----------



## Starbuck

^^^^ I haven't a clue what the Orton/Bryan beat down did. I do remember that the Shield/Bryan beat downs way back in September/October did real well. 

Bryan's got to walk before he runs lol. I wouldn't get carried away. I will say this though, he's getting the biggest stage and platform to show what he can bring to the table here. For as much as I think Punk whines about not getting pushed despite everything he had, he never got this. If Bryan does indeed take down all 3 Evolution boys and gets a run with the title for a couple months heading into the rest of the year he had better make an impact or what else will there be to say really?

NO CHILDREN YOU WILL *NOT* WATCH THE PASSION OF THE BRYAN CHANGE THAT DAMN CHANNEL THAT TRIPLE H IS A DEMON

:lol


----------



## LilOlMe

> Instead, the second-half of the Bryan vs. Randy Orton match drew the highest quarter-hour rating of the show in the key males 18-49 demo, topping the over-run.


Honestly, I think Orton going full retard right before the commercial break helped things. I don't think there was a soul that tuned out after that, thus helping them retain viewership for the second half of the match. The second half of matches usually does better anyway, but the fact that this was the show high makes me think that that little bit definitely played a part.

More coked up Orton audience interactions = ratingz.


----------



## Your_Solution

LilOlMe said:


> Honestly, I think Orton going full retard right before the commercial break helped things. I don't think there was a soul that tuned out after that, thus helping them retain viewership for the second half of the match. The second half of matches usually does better anyway, but the fact that this was the show high makes me think that that little bit definitely played a part.
> 
> More coked up Orton audience interactions = ratingz.


I want Orton to just lose his mind all the time, he's much better that way


----------



## Starbuck

I seriously doubt Orton had a thing to do with it. It's all Bryan right now, there's no denying that.


----------



## THANOS

Starbuck said:


> ^^^^ I haven't a clue what the Orton/Bryan beat down did. I do remember that the Shield/Bryan beat downs way back in September/October did real well.
> 
> Bryan's got to walk before he runs lol. I wouldn't get carried away. I will say this though, he's getting the biggest stage and platform to show what he can bring to the table here. For as much as I think Punk whines about not getting pushed despite everything he had, he never got this. If Bryan does indeed take down all 3 Evolution boys and gets a run with the title for a couple months heading into the rest of the year he had better make an impact or what else will there be to say really?
> 
> NO CHILDREN YOU WILL *NOT* WATCH THE PASSION OF THE BRYAN CHANGE THAT DAMN CHANNEL THAT TRIPLE H IS A DEMON
> 
> :lol


Good points all around. Punk never did get this type of platform and positioning around his rise as Bryan has had and when he did (vs The Rock, Taker, Lesnar, etc.) he drew pretty well. You are definitely bang on with the fact that Bryan needs to make a huge overall impact if he goes over all three guys at Mania. Hopefully he's able to do it. I do think WWE needs to get Bryan out there to run the gauntlet of late night talk shows, as well as maybe the View, so he can get his face and name out there and try and spread the yes movement and use the fact that he doesn't look like a stereotypical wrestler, but is so damn likable, as his main selling point.


----------



## THANOS

Starbuck said:


> I seriously doubt Orton had a thing to do with it. It's all Bryan right now, there's no denying that.


More or less. If you substitute Bryan with almost anyone else on the active roster in that match with Orton, I doubt it does as well. At least, based on what we've seen in recent weeks and months.


----------



## Choke2Death

THANOS said:


> Was the Orton beat down of Bryan a huge gainer? I seem to remember it doing poorly compared to the overall average but I could be wrong?


Are you talking about the segment before Battleground? If so, I don't remember the exact number but I do recall it doing rather well and surprising everyone. The hour numbers came out and it looked like a disappointment but then the quarter numbers were out a week or two after and it turned out that it did a very good gain.



THANOS said:


> More or less. If you substitute Bryan with almost anyone else on the active roster in that match with Orton, I doubt it does as well. At least, based on what we've seen in recent weeks and months.


Of course, that's because there's actually a story to a Bryan/Orton match. Why exactly would anyone tune in for a pointless match Orton has with Christian, Kofi, Ziggler or whoever?

Give the audience something that has a reason to happen and they'll likely watch.


----------



## Starbuck

THANOS said:


> Good points all around. Punk never did get this type of platform and positioning around his rise as Bryan has had and when he did (vs The Rock, Taker, Lesnar, etc.) he drew pretty well. You are definitely bang on with the fact that Bryan needs to make a huge overall impact if he goes over all three guys at Mania. Hopefully he's able to do it. I do think WWE needs to get Bryan out there to run the gauntlet of late night talk shows, as well as maybe the View, so he can get his face and name out there and try and spread the yes movement and use the fact that he doesn't look like a stereotypical wrestler, but is so damn likable, as his main selling point.


What's funny is that Punk _could _have had this but he apparently didn't think it was good enough. Punk got tons of attention and positioning, he just never got it around this time of year. Bryan's getting it now and getting it in spades. 2 matches at Wrestlemania and a full blown heel HHH for the first time in what, 8 years? They may not have been in the beginning but they're all in with him now. So far he's knocking it out of the park but the real test comes when the shine of Wrestlemania is gone, all the hype dies down and he's the one responsible for carrying a feud. That's Punk's biggest flaw. He was never able to do that. All his most significant moments, promos and matches from 2011 until now have all come from working with bigger stars. When Punk was tasked with carrying a feud he couldn't do it. I'd like to see all this momentum turn into something real for Bryan. Maybe if Cena does go off to make that movie and when Brock, Taker and HHH are all gone after Wrestlemania, I hope this is all enough for Bryan to carry the show and for him to do it well because only then will he ever be in with a shot of being #1 and not #2 (to Cena) like everybody else before him.


----------



## THANOS

Choke2Death said:


> Are you talking about the segment before Battleground? If so, I don't remember the exact number but I do recall it doing rather well and surprising everyone. The hour numbers came out and it looked like a disappointment but then the quarter numbers were out a week or two after and it turned out that it did a very good gain.


Did it? That's my mistake then. I do remember an Orton/Bryan overrun segment doing poorly around that time but maybe it wasn't the brawl?



Choke2Death said:


> Of course, that's because there's actually a story to a Bryan/Orton match. Why exactly would anyone tune in for a pointless match Orton has with Christian, Kofi, Ziggler or whoever?
> 
> Give the audience something that has a reason to happen and they'll likely watch.


That's a good point, fair enough.



Starbuck said:


> What's funny is that Punk _could _have had this but he apparently didn't think it was good enough. Punk got tons of attention and positioning, he just never got it around this time of year. Bryan's getting it now and getting it in spades. 2 matches at Wrestlemania and a full blown heel HHH for the first time in what, 8 years?


You know what Starbuck, you know I've never been too kindly to Trips in the past, but what he has done to spotlight Bryan dating back to the press conference for Summerslam has been truly amazing and nowhere near the self serving image he can exude at times. If he truly does put him over at Mania for his match and for the title, I'll never say another bad thing about the dude.



Starbuck said:


> They may not have been in the beginning but they're all in with him now. So far he's knocking it out of the park but the real test comes when the shine of Wrestlemania is gone, all the hype dies down and he's the one responsible for carrying a feud. That's Punk's biggest flaw. He was never able to do that. All his most significant moments, promos and matches from 2011 until now have all come from working with bigger stars. When Punk was tasked with carrying a feud he couldn't do it. I'd like to see all this momentum turn into something real for Bryan. Maybe if Cena does go off to make that movie and when Brock, Taker and HHH are all gone after Wrestlemania, I hope this is all enough for Bryan to carry the show and for him to do it well because only then will he ever be in with a shot of being #1 and not #2 (to Cena) like everybody else before him.


:clap Well said. Bryan, to his credit, does have a small background of carrying smaller stars than him to decent ratings back during his weak link storyline when he was running gauntlets against the Shield and the Real Americans, and wrestling Wade Barrett on Smackdown, but it will be interesting to see if truly can spread the wealth to other segments in the show overall just by viewers knowing his presence is there like the big mega stars have all done.


----------



## Starbuck

If all that happens and you say another bad word about Trips you have to leave again . The guy doesn't lay down for everybody but when he does, he does it right and that's why it means so much. It's looking like we'll be adding Bryan to the Cena, Batista and Benoit list of guys who humbled the Game at Wrestlemania :lol.


----------



## Chrome

It'd be cool if Bryan can become a consistent ratings draw. Maybe we can get that :cena heel turn after all. 

I'd love to see a heel Authority Cena vs Bryan sometime in the near future.


----------



## MaybeLock

Agree. HHH might have this burying stigma associated to himself. But he's easily the top guy who has put over more guys, and in a more efficient way. Yes, he has buried some wrestlers, but hell, you have to win some times if you don't want to end up like Jericho. There is no doubt in my mind that he'll put Bryan over at WM. 

Said this, it's surprising how Bryan has become such a solid TV ratings draw. I know people here like to overreact, troll, and make jokes, but for real: Who would have bet their money on this happening back in the summer?


----------



## Superhippy

Those quarter ratings are pretty much a mirror of how this Wrestlemania season is going.

- Bryan vs. HHH stuff is no doubt Wrestlemania worthy and feels huge.

- Wyatt vs. Cena stuff is very solid and has had some good build towards Mania.

- Lesnar vs. Taker is hurting badly because Paul Heyman is trying to carry the entire fued.

- Everything else is pretty meh.


I am curious to see how they do this Battle Royale at Wrestlemania. It's one thing to have a jobber pre-show match to get a bunch of guys on the card. It's another thing to include real names like Sheamus, Del Rio, Big Show, Ziggler, Christian and Henry. I wouldn't mind if the WWE did it Royal Rumble style with 45 second intervals for when each guy comes out. Having 10 - 15 minutes straight of guys having their entrance and just heading to the ring is going to feel awkward. Basically just trotting out all the guys that had nothing to do for Mania.


----------



## Waffelz

Orton had nothing to do with it. Okay, maybe a tiny bit. Still Bryan drawing the highest rated segment whilst facing Orton for the 80th time.

Its happening lads, its fucking happening!


----------



## JamesK

The segment drew big because of Orton..

Daniel Bryan can't draw a shit and i agree with all the people that said the same all this time..

Also last week the segment had a big number because of HHH/Stephanie and the anticipation of Sandow's match..


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

JamesK said:


> The segment drew big because of Orton..
> 
> Daniel Bryan can't draw a shit and i agree with all the people that said the same all this time..
> 
> Also last week the segment had a big number because of HHH/Stephanie *and the anticipation of Sandow's match..*


I approve of this theory. (Y)


----------



## Sonnen Says

Starbuck said:


> What's funny is that Punk _could _have had this but he apparently didn't think it was good enough. Punk got tons of attention and positioning, he just never got it around this time of year. Bryan's getting it now and getting it in spades. 2 matches at Wrestlemania and a full blown heel HHH for the first time in what, 8 years? They may not have been in the beginning but they're all in with him now. So far he's knocking it out of the park but the real test comes when the shine of Wrestlemania is gone, all the hype dies down and he's the one responsible for carrying a feud. That's Punk's biggest flaw. He was never able to do that. All his most significant moments, promos and matches from 2011 until now have all come from working with bigger stars. *When Punk was tasked with carrying a feud he couldn't do it.* I'd like to see all this momentum turn into something real for Bryan. Maybe if Cena does go off to make that movie and when Brock, Taker and HHH are all gone after Wrestlemania, I hope this is all enough for Bryan to carry the show and for him to do it well because only then will he ever be in with a shot of being #1 and not #2 (to Cena) like everybody else before him.


Lets be real here when Punk was feuding with guys like Ziggler, and Bryan those guys were build horribly, they were losing left and right so it wasn't believable and I don't see how he failed in those times? what was he supposed to do exactly. Punk actually did a very good job carrying a feud with Ryback even tho he was brought up fast because of the thin roster. Bryan has rising stars in the The Shield and the wyatt family they are booked strong and they are seen as the future. So he has the bigger chance now than Punk did 2 years ago no doubt. Punk had nobody to face left that was good enough. Thing is Punk delivers big time in big matches unlike someone I know.


----------



## Londrick

I think it's safe to say that Bryan > Phil when it comes to drawing.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Sonnen Says said:


> The only good buy was HIAC, mainly because of Cena and HBK return. If it was just Bryan/Orton it would have been lower than the previous year like 10 less. NOC 13 did the lowest domestic number for the PPV, for some reason it did higher internationally than 10/11. Probably because they canceled a PPV early in the year which was OTL. They had an extra PPV in 2011 which explains why some were low. And the rest were bad. How can anyone say Bryan proved to be a bigger draw. You seriously think SS 13 will do higher if it wasn't for the real ME in Punk/Lesnar. If it was just Bryan/Cena it wouldn't draw even as much as 2011. Stop this delusion. Punk outsold Cena for 8 months in 2011 and few weeks back was outselling Cena in online orders before he left. Punk is a bigger draw, nothing proves Bryan to be a bigger draw.


Dude, you need to stop doing this to yourself. Your constant defending of Punk is just making yourself look clueless. I am by no means an expert when it comes to ratings, I know absolutely nothing at all about how it works. All I can do is look at the numbers and go from there. But from what we have seen Bryan do recently, and from what he did in 2013, I have never heard of Punk at any point producing any kind of numbers like Bryan did. I'm not saying Punk wasn't a draw, he most certainly was, and people who point to the 2.2 rating are morons, but Bryan's the bigger draw.


----------



## Choke2Death

Londrick said:


> I think it's safe to say that Bryan > Phil when it comes to drawing.


In other news, water is wet.


----------



## superuser1

I don't get why Bryan gets all the credit for pulling in the strong numbers with Orton. They both deserve the same amount of credit.


----------



## RatedR10

God damn... Daniel Bryan = best for business :bryan


----------



## JamesK

superuser1 said:


> I don't get why Bryan gets all the credit for pulling in the strong numbers with Orton. They both deserve the same amount of credit.


For sure Orton deserves credit but i think that Bryan's numbers the last months shows that people are interested at him more than Orton


----------



## guru of wrestling

About time this thread was made it was made off of my thread about "why do ratings matter to you"


----------



## Sonnen Says

TheGMofGods said:


> Dude, you need to stop doing this to yourself. Your constant defending of Punk is just making yourself look clueless. I am by no means an expert when it comes to ratings, I know absolutely nothing at all about how it works. All I can do is look at the numbers and go from there. But from what we have seen Bryan do recently, and from what he did in 2013, I have never heard of Punk at any point producing any kind of numbers like Bryan did. I'm not saying Punk wasn't a draw, he most certainly was, and people who point to the 2.2 rating are morons, but Bryan's the bigger draw.


Ehh, if you don't know anything about ratings why speak about it. I wasn't specifically talking about ratings, I was talking about the carrying of lesser star. Bryan test will be after WM. Bryan is not a bigger draw in terms of ratings, Punk have pulled more in 2013 RTWM compared to this year RTWM Bryan and he pulled million views in the 10pm a lot of times which is impressive and overall he was pulling numbers even after WM. Also in terms of buys Punk had done well in carrying lesser stars, his matches with Ziggler, Bryan, Ryback, etc. all have done well in buys even if he didn't ME some. Ever since Bryan got pushed in SS he's been constantly in the MEs with the authority and was the focus of the show most of the time unlike Punk who was midcarding with guys half his reign. The roster was thin compared to this year, it's the truth. There was no Shield (Well there was but they were still new and came by the end), Wyatts, Goldust/Cody, HHH/McMahons, etc. Fact is Punk is a bigger draw in terms of buys and merch. Bryan is having segments with HHH, McMahons ever since SS and been in the MEs and was the focus a lot of times so he was supposed to draw. Again Bryan big test is after WM.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Oh no, don't let this be a Bryan/Punk debate. Let's just agree that :vince4 is secretly dancing in the money that both of them bring for him, despite what the doubters say. It really doesn't surprise me that Bryan is doing so successfully. Besides working with Triple H, Bryan undoubtedly has "it". I don't think the WWE has had a character that can draw sympathy as well as Bryan can since Foley. Maybe Jeff Hardy, but Bryan has surpassed him by leaps and bounds. Bryan needs to be put in talk shows and big media appearances now. Every little thing matters, including Arnold Schwarzenegger "YES"ing along. I'm going through the Attitude Era, and it's amazing how even before both Austin and Rock got their big title victories, the WWE promoted both of them like crazy. That's what needs to happen with Bryan.


----------



## THANOS

funnyfaces1 said:


> Oh no, don't let this be a Bryan/Punk debate. Let's just agree that :vince4 is secretly dancing in the money that both of them bring for him, despite what the doubters say. It really doesn't surprise me that Bryan is doing so successfully. Besides working with Triple H, Bryan undoubtedly has "it". I don't think the WWE has had a character that can draw sympathy as well as Bryan can since Foley. Maybe Jeff Hardy, but Bryan has surpassed him by leaps and bounds. Bryan needs to be put in talk shows and big media appearances now. Every little thing matters, including Arnold Schwarzenegger "YES"ing along. I'm going through the Attitude Era, and it's amazing how even before both Austin and Rock got their big title victories, the WWE promoted both of them like crazy. That's what needs to happen with Bryan.


Couldn't agree more. Great post!


----------



## Tweener ken

I don't understand how people can say bryan is better draw than punk when punk did'nt have the luxry of working with the authority.

If bryan was pulling these numbers with sheamus then you can easily say bryan>punk, but right now this is not a fair comparision.


----------



## Starbuck

Sonnen Says said:


> Lets be real here when Punk was feuding with guys like Ziggler, and Bryan those guys were build horribly, they were losing left and right so it wasn't believable and I don't see how he failed in those times? what was he supposed to do exactly. Punk actually did a very good job carrying a feud with Ryback even tho he was brought up fast because of the thin roster. Bryan has rising stars in the The Shield and the wyatt family they are booked strong and they are seen as the future. So he has the bigger chance now than Punk did 2 years ago no doubt. Punk had nobody to face left that was good enough. Thing is Punk delivers big time in big matches unlike someone I know.












Please stop, Sonnen. Even Punk is starting to feel embarrassed for you.


----------



## mwk360

Is it getting desperate in here or what....

Goat face Bryan and Goat heel HHH. Mega draws!


----------



## #Mark

Tweener ken said:


> I don't understand how people can say bryan is better draw than punk when punk did'nt have the luxry of working with the authority.
> 
> If bryan was pulling these numbers with sheamus then you can easily say bryan>punk, but right now this is not a fair comparision.


So I guess we're all forgetting that Punk worked with Vince, Cena, HHH, Rock, Taker and Brock?


----------



## Starbuck

#Mark said:


> So I guess we're all forgetting that Punk worked with Vince, Cena, HHH, Rock, Taker and Brock?


Must have been forgotten about in between his ground breaking programs with Ziggler, Del Rio and Ryback where he carried them all to 5* matches and broke attendance records around the world. 

Dat Punk

unk


----------



## Cmpunk91

Punk drew 5 mill on the walking dead. Haters gon' hate


----------



## Mr.S

Sonnen Says said:


> Ehh, if you don't know anything about ratings why speak about it. I wasn't specifically talking about ratings, I was talking about the carrying of lesser star. Bryan test will be after WM. Bryan is not a bigger draw in terms of ratings, Punk have pulled more in 2013 RTWM compared to this year RTWM Bryan and he pulled million views in the 10pm a lot of times which is impressive and overall he was pulling numbers even after WM. Also in terms of buys Punk had done well in carrying lesser stars, his matches with Ziggler, Bryan, Ryback, etc. all have done well in buys even if he didn't ME some. Ever since Bryan got pushed in SS he's been constantly in the MEs with the authority and was the focus of the show most of the time unlike Punk who was midcarding with guys half his reign. The roster was thin compared to this year, it's the truth. There was no Shield (Well there was but they were still new and came by the end), Wyatts, Goldust/Cody, HHH/McMahons, etc. Fact is Punk is a bigger draw in terms of buys and merch. Bryan is having segments with HHH, McMahons ever since SS and been in the MEs and was the focus a lot of times so he was supposed to draw. Again Bryan big test is after WM.


Punk did pull in good ratings against freaking Taker using Heyman and the late Paul Bearer.

It was very good. But Punk was the worst drawing Champion in WWE/F history. His reign drew so shit that he was a mid-carder basically. Cena was above the title and that reign destroyed a lot of credibility of the title. 

Punk has not drawn anything unless in a bumper angle. He is up there with Diesel as the worst drawing champion in WWF/E history. Thus does not diminish his fantastic work though. Let us accept it and move on. Not everyone can draw


----------



## Mr.S

Why are all ratings being considered for only 18-49 male demographic? Why not the entirety? I would love to see overall ratings?


----------



## Tweener ken

@ mark

punk was a heel when facing rock, and taker so he did'nt have the extra supports from casuals that bryan has.
Also they rock, brock, taker were all part timers, they were hardly present to make the fueds intresting.

And none of them were as hated as the authourity.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Mr.S said:


> It was very good. But Punk was the worst drawing Champion in WWE/F history. His reign drew so shit that *he was a mid-carder basically*. Cena was above the title and that reign destroyed a lot of credibility of the title.


I don't mean to go off-topic, but this has honestly been one of the most annoying trends with the WWE, and it isn't exclusive to Punk. For whatever reason, the WWE doesn't want to make the title THE focus of the show, especially for the past few years. 

It started with Sheamus' sham of a reign in 2009-2010, but the most noticeable instance of this was not Punk in 2012, but Randy Orton in 2010. A lot of us Orton doubters forget this, but dude had A LOT of momentum in 2010 and was easily the most over guy on the roster. However, throughout his first face world title reign in six years, he played second fiddle to Cena/Barrett. The trend didn't stop as The Miz suffered the same fate during his run as champion. Then we went back to normal with Cena as champion and then the Punk/Cena storyline, but then Punk/HHH became the forefront story over Cena/Del Rio until Punk won the title, and we know what happened there. To make matters even crazier, even Cena during his last WWE title reign played the second fiddle game for half of his reign. Whether it was Brock/HHH, Money in the Bank, Punk/Lesnar/Heyman, or even Shield/Babyfaces, Cena didn't really feel like the focus of the show as champion. And now we have Orton, who gets less television time than Darren Young gets shower time. I just hope that this all changes with Bryan, and that the McMahons stay away from using their family garbage to overshadow his title reign just because they don't have confidence in his ability to draw.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Starbuck said:


> Please stop, Sonnen. Even Punk is starting to feel embarrassed for you.


Stop what, you have this habit with posting a gif of someone laughing :lol. Use logic just because you don't like Punk doesn't mean everyone is wrong about him. I don't see what's so funny in what I said. Punk delivers big time when it matters. 



Starbuck said:


> Must have been forgotten about in between his ground breaking programs with Ziggler, Del Rio and Ryback where he carried them all to 5* matches and broke attendance records around the world.
> 
> Dat Punk
> 
> unk


Coming from a guy who likes a guy who fails to deliver a great match with Brock :lol. Yeah those weren't 5 star matches but unlike your hero Punk actually has a 5 star match :HHH. It isn't about breaking records when it comes to guys like that, great booking is what makes a draw but since we have HHH running the show and burying talent for years expect that to be out of question. This show is centered about him, I will not be surprised if he beats Bryan in WM and put himself in the ME. 



Mr.S said:


> Punk did pull in good ratings against freaking Taker using Heyman and the late Paul Bearer.
> 
> It was very good. *But Punk was the worst drawing Champion in WWE/F history.* His reign drew so shit that he was a mid-carder basically. Cena was above the title and that reign destroyed a lot of credibility of the title.
> 
> Punk has not drawn anything unless in a bumper angle. He is up there with Diesel as the worst drawing champion in WWF/E history. Thus does not diminish his fantastic work though. Let us accept it and move on. Not everyone can draw


No, he wasn't the worse :lol. Anyway last year ratings weren't that much better they were still getting low numbers. Fact is the Roster was thin by the end of 2012 and there was no hype and no starpower. If there was this authority angle and had the current shield and Wyatts ratings will have been higher than that because the show will have a strong midcard with actual credibility and momentum. By the way Ratings were very good until September. 3 hours is just too long to judge somebody drawing power, you can gain one million viewers and the next segments can lose what you gained, that's what was happening actually. Punk was gaining viewers every week and guys like Sheamus and Orton were losing half million viewers almost every damn week. Tho I remember when Punk had a match with Sheamus it gained more than 1 million viewers in the ME. He was drawing good numbers for his segments but the rest of the show was dreadful it didn't have any top stars except for two in Cena and Punk and that gets stale and that's not enough to fill three hours. Fact is the roster draws. 

Ratings doesn't determine your success or drawing power because you're not always responsible, there is something called merch and PPV buys. Most of the PPVs did higher buys than the previous year during Punk title reign and higher than this year too. Punk merch are toe to toe with Cena for years now and sometimes he outsells him.


----------



## Starbuck

Sonnen Says said:


> *Use logic*


:rock5


----------



## SerapisLiber

Mr.S said:


> But Punk was the worst drawing Champion in WWE/F history.


Hardly. That honor still belongs to Kevin Nash. Punk merely pulled the lowest _*TELEVISION*_ rating since the 90s, and even that he only did a handful of times, so it was the exception for him not the rule. But 2012 still grossed more money than 2011, so business was actually slightly up during the year of Punk's reign.

Nash on the other hand, not only drew piss poor ratings, but drew the lowest business. The company couldn't even fill up their "home" at Madison Square Garden, hell they couldn't even get it half full, during Nash's reign.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

This Starbuck/Sonnen Says feud is too one sided.


----------



## KingLobos

If Punk isn't the lowest drawing champion who is. Answer that Sonnen.


----------



## Jammy

KingLobos said:


> If Punk isn't the lowest drawing champion who is. Answer that Sonnen.


Orton, I dont even dislike him. But he's pretty much irrelevant.


----------



## Reaper

KingLobos said:


> If Punk isn't the lowest drawing champion who is. Answer that Sonnen.


I'm not going to give this credit to anyone person because it's not the champion, or the championship that draws, but the character, personality, storyline and a bunch of things combined. 

However, if you want to know the biggest flopped reigns in my opinion in terms of capturing people's attention, then look no farther than all the guys that held the belt between early - mid 90's, and then 2005 onwards. During the mid-90's, they themselves claim that business shrank to the point of WWE almost going out of business and that's indicative of lowest drawing power. And then none of the guys post Rock/Austin grew the business, they merely helped sustain marginal profitability, when we all know that the potential to do better is there. 

You have keep in mind that by 2002, competition was completely dead and WWE became the only real option available to wrestling fans. Either fans turned away for good, or stayed for loyalty reasons *hoping* that it'll get better and/or giving the WWE continued patronage till Cena came along and helped them _sustain _the business .. but not grow it. 

Lastly, in the case of the WWE's recent champions, many of them simply sustaining the business alone is a significant achievement all things considered. I think even the WWE at this point are beyond depending on one person solely as a draw and are looking towards building a combination of stars to sustain their business. 

I think the growth potential is gone from the WWE primarily because of lack of originality ... until and unless there's a next Cena somewhere (which I don't see the WWE having at this point), the business will continue to stagnate and show marginal ups and downs.


----------



## Uerfer

Cena didn't "sustain" the business(he is just a poster-boy who's popular with kids), WWE's move back to USA network in 05 did. If anything Cena has "sustained" his own position largely thanks to WWE's success with the network and the overall monopoly in the industry. 


Anyways, did we have quarter hour breakdowns yet for this week?


----------



## THANOS

Uerfer said:


> Cena didn't "sustain" the business(he is just a poster-boy who's popular with kids), WWE's move back to USA network in 05 did. If anything Cena has "sustained" his own position largely thanks to WWE's success with the network and the overall monopoly in the industry.
> 
> 
> Anyways, did we have quarter hour breakdowns yet for this week?


Yes but not the full demo breakdown, only the 18-49 breakdown that PWTORCH does. To sum it up this week was all Bryan :bryan, as he pulled the highest rating with Orton in an odd quarter and the second highest with HHH in the overrun.



> *Daniel Bryan was once again in the highest-rated segment of Raw. But, not in the over-run segment taking a beating from Triple H.
> 
> Instead, the second-half of the Bryan vs. Randy Orton match drew the highest quarter-hour rating of the show in the key males 18-49 demo, topping the over-run.*
> 
> The entire show was down from recent weeks to year-low levels more in-line with Raw's performance in the fall against Monday Night Football. *The bright spots were Bryan vs. Orton in Q6, Paul Heyman's promo in Q7, and John Cena's promo in Q5.*
> 
> 3/17 Raw Break Down - M18-49 demo rating
> 
> - Overall Show: 1.95 rating / 1.226 million viewers
> 
> Q1: Raw opened above the show average with a 2.01 rating for Triple H, Randy Orton, and Batista opening the show. Whereas, last week's first Raw after Daylight Savings Time opened with a 1.72 rating.
> 
> Q2: Raw dropped to a 1.79 rating for two commercial breaks and the first-half of The Usos vs. Real Americans.
> 
> Q3: Raw increased to a 1.92 rating for the end of the tag match, one commercial, and Kane backstage with The Shield. The backstage segment out-drew the end of the tag match.
> 
> Q4: Raw declined to a 1.86 rating for two commercials and Sheamus vs. Titus O'Neil in a buffer segment before the top of the hour. This is where the past two Raws intersected - as last week's Raw drew a 1.88 rating in Q4.
> 
> Q5: At the top of the hour, Raw got a slight bump to a 2.01 rating for John Cena responding to the Wyatts and one commercial. Whereas, last week's Q5 segment jumped to a 2.37 rating for The Undertaker.
> *
> Q6: Raw hit a show-high 2.18 rating for Randy Orton vs. Daniel Bryan in a No DQ match, plus one commercial. The peak of the entire show was from 9:23 to 9:30 p.m. EST for the second-half of the match. Included was show-high peak viewership of 1.523 million viewers at 9:25 p.m.*
> 
> Q7: Raw declined to a 2.02 rating for a Paul Heyman promo, plus one commercial.
> 
> Q8: Raw fell to a 1.86 rating for Fandango vs. Goldust, plus one commercial. Whereas, last week's Raw scored a 2.40 rating in Q8.
> 
> Q9: Raw got a minimal bump at the top of the hour - registering a 1.98 rating for Kane calling out The Shield, one commercial, and a Divas tag match.
> 
> Q10: Raw dipped to a 1.89 rating for Divas post-match activity, one commercial, and the first-half of a big eight-man tag match.
> 
> Q11: Raw dipped again to a 1.85 rating for the second-half of the eight-man tag match, which shows audience fatigue kicking in combined with two full commercial breaks in the segment.
> 
> Q12: Raw was even at a 1.85 rating for the "main event" of Bray Wyatt vs. Kofi Kingston and one commercial leading to the top of the hour.
> 
> Over-Run: The over-run increased to a pedestrian 2.12 rating for Triple H's long segment with Daniel Bryan. Last week's over-run scored a 2.44 rating, and the Bryan-Hunter interaction scored a 2.57 rating two weeks ago and a 2.78 rating last week.
> 
> *Caldwell's Analysis: Daniel Bryan remains the top act on the show, based on quarter-hour ratings, but for some reason the over-run segment with Bryan and Hunter did not work this week after two strong ratings. *


----------



## vanboxmeer




----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Sonnen Says said:


> Ehh, if you don't know anything about ratings why speak about it. I wasn't specifically talking about ratings, I was talking about the carrying of lesser star. Bryan test will be after WM. Bryan is not a bigger draw in terms of ratings, Punk have pulled more in 2013 RTWM compared to this year RTWM Bryan and he pulled million views in the 10pm a lot of times which is impressive and overall he was pulling numbers even after WM. Also in terms of buys Punk had done well in carrying lesser stars, his matches with Ziggler, Bryan, Ryback, etc. all have done well in buys even if he didn't ME some. Ever since Bryan got pushed in SS he's been constantly in the MEs with the authority and was the focus of the show most of the time unlike Punk who was midcarding with guys half his reign. The roster was thin compared to this year, it's the truth. There was no Shield (Well there was but they were still new and came by the end), Wyatts, Goldust/Cody, HHH/McMahons, etc. Fact is Punk is a bigger draw in terms of buys and merch. Bryan is having segments with HHH, McMahons ever since SS and been in the MEs and was the focus a lot of times so he was supposed to draw. Again Bryan big test is after WM.


Dude, again, you're trying way too hard here. You're sitting here talking about Punk "carrying" lesser stars as if Punk was the main reason for the somewhat good buy rates during his time as WWE champion, and yet you're failing to take into account other factors as well. But you're constantly pointing out that Punk was in the mid card where as Bryan was in the main event and you're failing to understand why. It's because Bryan has proven himself to be a capable draw already before he was even put in the storyline against the Authority. He was the hottest thing going for the WWE, and he was proving himself to be a capable draw and he was a work horse. Punk on the other hand did not prove this. This isn't saying Punk wasn't a draw, but again, there's a reason why despite being WWE Champion, he rarely main evented PPV's. 

There is nothing, and I mean NOTHING, that proves so far that Punk was in fact a bigger draw in terms of buyrates. Nothing. And again, I am not an expert on this. But I am looking at the numbers and they are all pointing towards Bryan, a guy doing this shit with less star power on his side and is still bringing in good numbers. And btw, don't give me that you aren't talking about ratings bullshit. Just a few posts ago before that one you were talking about Punk being a bigger ratings draw than Bryan, so just stop already with your bullshit and stop trying to protect Punk already. You just make yourself look even worse every time you try.



Uerfer said:


> Cena didn't "sustain" the business(he is just a poster-boy who's popular with kids), WWE's move back to USA network in 05 did. If anything Cena has "sustained" his own position largely thanks to WWE's success with the network and the overall monopoly in the industry.
> 
> 
> Anyways, did we have quarter hour breakdowns yet for this week?


Don't talk about things you clearly don't understand.


----------



## Uerfer

THANOS said:


> Yes but not the full demo breakdown, only the 18-49 breakdown that PWTORCH does. To sum it up this week was all Bryan :bryan, as he pulled the highest rating with Orton in an odd quarter and the second highest with HHH in the overrun.


Thanks for posting. Bryan's doing incredibly well, nothing new there. Opening promo drew strong comparably to last week. Cena/Wyatt held up. As for Overrun, the overall rating is down because it went way too long from the start of the promo all the way to the end of the beating, which actually went past the RAW closing copyrights logo. Viewership would have dropped gradually from start to end, especially at the logo part since most people would have assumed that was the close. Plus it was heel beating to begin with. 




> Don't talk about things you clearly don't understand.


:kobe lol yeah right. I suppose, I should learn from you.


----------



## Bob the Jobber

vanboxmeer said:


>


Is the current Bryan push enough for you to enjoy it rather than your "sky is falling" gimmick?


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Uerfer said:


> :kobe lol yeah right. I suppose, I should learn from you.


You should learn from people who have a basic understanding of Pro Wrestling, its business and how it works. You apparently don't understand any of these things.


----------



## THANOS

Bob the Jobber said:


> Is the current Bryan push enough for you to enjoy it rather than your "sky is falling" gimmick?


Since I've been back has Boxy posted anything positive in regards to the Bryan front? I would imagine he was his usual doom and gloom while I was gone especially before WWE announced to the world during Occupy RAW that Bryan would be going over all members of Evolution and main eventing Wrestlemania lol.


----------



## P.H. Hatecraft

Yea, he stopped doing his schtick after it was obvious the WWE was actually behind Bryan.


----------



## Bob the Jobber

P.H. Hatecraft said:


> Yea, he stopped doing his schtick after it was obvious the WWE was actually behind Bryan.


He was correct more often than not, to be fair.


----------



## THANOS

P.H. Hatecraft said:


> Yea, he stopped doing his schtick after it was obvious the WWE was actually behind Bryan.


Figured as much unfortunately. I've always wondered why Pyro and him refuse to ever enjoy anything they see on WWE tv, I could only imagine the stress they must go through watching it, and definitely wouldn't want to be in the same room with them during it lol. At the end of the day it's suppose to be fun, I'm having my usual mania party this year and half the people coming don't care for wrestling in the slightest but we all get drunk, eat wings, and enjoy the spectacle regardless. It makes wrestling much more enjoyable for me anyway.



Bob the Jobber said:


> He was correct more often than not, to be fair.


Sort of I suppose. The exaggerations were so out there that it was easy for Bryan to actually overcome and surpass them. Perhaps he was only saying those things as a defense mechanism, but either way it seemed pretty damn bitter and sad for my liking. I mean he was saying the same things detractors say like, "Jobbing Danny B will never be more than a comedic midcarder, or jobber to the stars, will never hold the WWE Title, etc."


----------



## Bob the Jobber

THANOS said:


> Figured as much unfortunately. I've always wondered why Pyro and him refuse to ever enjoy anything they see on WWE tv, I could only imagine the stress they must go through watching it, and definitely wouldn't want to be in the same room with them during it lol. At the end of the day it's suppose to be fun, I'm having my usual mania party this year and half the people coming don't care for wrestling in the slightest but we all get drunk, eat wings, and enjoy the spectacle regardless. It makes wrestling much more enjoyable for me anyway.
> 
> 
> 
> Sort of I suppose. The exaggerations were so out there that it was easy for Bryan to actually overcome and surpass them. Perhaps he was only saying those things as a defense mechanism, but either way it seemed pretty damn bitter and sad for my liking. I mean he was saying the same things detractors say like, "Jobbing Danny B will never be more than a comedic midcarder, or jobber to the stars, will never hold the WWE Title, etc."


IIRC, he was a Bryan fan for a long time, but seeing him basically be siphoned for Sheamus's push, AJ's push, Punk's push, being sent to the tag division, etc all just left him not getting his hopes up. It was obvious that the WWE up until VERY recently did not take him as serious as the fans did. 

Also: KO makes Pyro look like Bob Ross.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

THANOS said:


> Figured as much unfortunately. I've always wondered why Pyro and him refuse to ever enjoy anything they see on WWE tv, I could only imagine the stress they must go through watching it, and definitely wouldn't want to be in the same room with them during it lol. At the end of the day it's suppose to be fun, *I'm having my usual mania party this year and half the people coming don't care for wrestling in the slightest but we all get drunk, eat wings, and enjoy the spectacle regardless. It makes wrestling much more enjoyable for me anyway.*
> 
> 
> 
> Sort of I suppose. The exaggerations were so out there that it was easy for Bryan to actually overcome and surpass them. Perhaps he was only saying those things as a defense mechanism, but either way it seemed pretty damn bitter and sad for my liking. I mean he was saying the same things detractors say like, "Jobbing Danny B will never be more than a comedic midcarder, or jobber to the stars, will never hold the WWE Title, etc."


Hey bro, room for one more? :cena5

btw, I'd love to sit down & watch an ep. of MNR with Pyro. 

Shit would be hilarious. :ti


----------



## THANOS

CHIcagoMade said:


> Hey bro, room for one more? :cena5
> 
> btw, I'd love to sit down & watch an ep. of MNR with Pyro.
> 
> Shit would be hilarious. :ti


Yeah man no problem but do you live in Ontario? I'm near Toronto lol. And yeah the bitterness of watching MNR with Pyro would definitely be hilarious, luckily we both could appreciate some stuff together like the Wyatts and...... well the Wyatts lol.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

THANOS said:


> Since I've been back has Boxy posted anything positive in regards to the Bryan front? I would imagine he was his usual doom and gloom while I was gone especially before WWE announced to the world during Occupy RAW that Bryan would be going over all members of Evolution and main eventing Wrestlemania lol.


Wait, who the hell is Boxy?


----------



## THANOS

TheGMofGods said:


> Wait, who the hell is Boxy?


Vanboxmeer


----------



## validreasoning

SerapisLiber said:


> Hardly. That honor still belongs to Kevin Nash. Punk merely pulled the lowest _*TELEVISION*_ rating since the 90s, and even that he only did a handful of times, so it was the exception for him not the rule. But 2012 still grossed more money than 2011, so business was actually slightly up during the year of Punk's reign.
> 
> Nash on the other hand, not only drew piss poor ratings, but drew the lowest business. The company couldn't even fill up their "home" at Madison Square Garden, hell they couldn't even get it half full, during Nash's reign.


incredible that people come on here and say punk was the worst drawing champion of all time.

just using ratings raw drew an average 3.0 in 2012 while punk was champion the whole year.
raw averaged a 3.01 with less viewers in 2013 with rock, cena and orton as champions.

ppv buys in 2012 were up from 2011 and 2010.

in terms of revenue generated 2012 was the third most successful year in wwe history (and second most successful at that point).

houseshow business 2012 was slightly ahead of 2002 and blew away 1992, 93, 95, 96, 2003, 2004 and more than doubled 1994 figures



Uerfer said:


> Cena didn't "sustain" the business(he is just a poster-boy who's popular with kids), WWE's move back to USA network in 05 did. If anything Cena has "sustained" his own position largely thanks to WWE's success with the network and the overall monopoly in the industry.


yes moving to usa is the reason house-show business and revenue dramatically improved from 2005 onwards. usa is in the same number of homes as spike so moving from one channel to the next makes little or no difference. when raw moved to spike in 2000 its numbers saw no change until austin turned heel and wwes business went into decline by mid 2001.

2005 onwards saw wwe go head to head with ufc...man i would love to see wwe today had cena not come along when he did looking at their numbers in 2003-04 without the ufc threat.


----------



## murder

validreasoning said:


> incredible that people come on here and say punk was the worst drawing champion of all time.
> 
> just using ratings raw drew an average 3.0 in 2012 while punk was champion the whole year.
> raw averaged a 3.01 with less viewers in 2013 with rock, cena and orton as champions.
> 
> ppv buys in 2012 were up from 2011 and 2010.
> 
> in terms of revenue generated 2012 was the third most successful year in wwe history (and second most successful at that point).
> 
> houseshow business 2012 was slightly ahead of 2002 and blew away 1992, 93, 95, 96, 2003, 2004 and more than doubled 1994 figures


How many PPV's did Punk headline in 2012?
How many house show did Punk wrestle on with no Cena around? 
How many Raw shows were built around Punk and not Cena, Lesnar, Rock, Triple H or Undertaker?

If you go by revenue, Orton would be the biggest draw in history because 2008 was the biggest year in that aspect. A little flawed that theory, wouldn't you agree?


----------



## Uerfer

validreasoning said:


> yes moving to usa is the reason house-show business and revenue dramatically improved from 2005 onwards. *usa is in the same number of homes as spike so moving from one channel to the next makes little or no difference.* when raw moved to spike in 2000 its numbers saw no change until austin turned heel and wwes business went into decline by mid 2001.


WOW! You can't be this fucking stupid. fpalm Its not availability, the difference maker is the popularity. I can't believe I even have to explain this to a guy quoting Meltzer all the time. RAW's numbers went down within six months of the switch to Spike and this was during the peak of attitude era. Infact, 1999 WWF viewership/rating average is higher than 2000, even though WCW was one hour show by 2000 and posed absolutely no threat. One of the biggest reasons for that drop was the move to spike.




> 2005 onwards saw wwe go head to head with ufc...man i would love to see wwe today had cena not come along when he did looking at their numbers in 2003-04 without the ufc threat.


UFC has never been big on ratings. UFC draws well only rarely if there is a big hype surrounding the event. UFC is huge on PPV buys, and WWE's biggest numbers all came from celebrities at mania not Cena, you can include the Rock to that list of celebs as well. Like I said, he's a poster boy who is super efficient merchandise draw, nothing more. He's not the one carrying WWE's ratings or PPV business, never was. WWE brand is strong established brand globally, Cena is not crucial. It's funny to see you talk about WWE facing competition and therefore Cena being essential when the reality is complete opposite, if WWE did have a solid competition that they were afraid of, a babyface who's been booed to shit every week wouldn't even last few months, let alone years as the top face of WWE. It's specifically because of lack of a proper threat that WWE is capable of keeping Cena in the exact same spot for years and years. House show business saw its peak in 2008, a year Cena missed due to injuries btw.

And Dave fucking Meltzer on the subject -



> Originally Posted by *Dave Meltzer*
> Let me know when some of the reporters using that figure use their brain and realize how completely full of shit it is.
> 
> No one person is responsible for 22% of company revenue. The very idea of it is preposterous. If Cena is moving $106 million in anything, he should be earning $40-50 million a year instead of a small fraction of that.
> 
> That's like in 1991 when some similar full of shit report talked about how WWF was a $1.7 billion dollar a year company and it got repeated everywhere when the company actually only grossed $125 million the previous year.
> 
> I know it was on our site as well.
> 
> Look at WWE revenues by category and see what Cena meant.
> 
> He means a little bit on house shows, a little bit on PPV, a little on DVDs (the majority of which he's only a part of or not even a part of at all), he means virtually nothing when it comes to the TV money which is under contract whether he's with the company or not and doesn't go up when he's there and down when he's not there.
> 
> This isn't a guy who is the difference between 250,000 buys and 800,000 buys. And while his merch moves. Total merch for last year was $45 million so even if he means 20% of that, you're still talking $8 million.
> 
> The best you're getting is Cena means maybe 5% of total revenue of $478 million or $24 million, and that's giving him the benefit of a lot of numbers that may not be warranted and giving him 20% of merch which is a shot in the dark number likely way higher than the real number.
> 
> I know it was on this site as well. I saw that figure and I just thought, common sense says it's a full of shit number and moved on. Then when everyone started going with it, I satdown and tried to figure if it was possible, and it's not.




Honestly, John Cena's just a walking, talking advertisement/propaganda machine. I mean this is a guy who says things like, 'I don't care what people think' yet he goes out of his way to pander to the crowd of every town that he's in, it's absolutely disgusting. You didn't see Stone Cold Steve Austin kissing the crowd's ass every time he went out there, or reminding people of the countless selfless deeds he does to help those in need. People just genuinely liked him. The same goes for The Rock. Cena, though, constantly tries to win the crowd over. Constantly tells us all how hard he works. Constantly berates us with his noble causes, even tries to make the crowd gain SYMPATHY for him. How long has he been trying to get over his little 'My future in WWE is in jeopardy...I might not be coming back for a loong time...' crap? which also reminded me of the night after EC 2012, the night he fought Brock Lesnar...'I'm gonna be leaving for a while, taking a short break...' then shows up the next night on RAW like nothing fucking happened. This is what Cena does. Unlike Steve Austin and The Rock who understood the crowd, who "naturally" drew cheers by letting the crowd be what they want to be, Cena uses these ridiculous manipulation tactics to try to elicit a response from the fans. Embarrassing and sad to say the least.


----------



## Fanboi101

validreasoning said:


> incredible that people come on here and say punk was the worst drawing champion of all time.
> 
> just using ratings raw drew an average 3.0 in 2012 while punk was champion the whole year.
> raw averaged a 3.01 with less viewers in 2013 with rock, cena and orton as champions.
> 
> ppv buys in 2012 were up from 2011 and 2010.
> 
> in terms of revenue generated 2012 was the third most successful year in wwe history (and second most successful at that point).
> 
> houseshow business 2012 was slightly ahead of 2002 and blew away 1992, 93, 95, 96, 2003, 2004 and more than doubled 1994 figures
> 
> 
> 
> yes moving to usa is the reason house-show business and revenue dramatically improved from 2005 onwards. usa is in the same number of homes as spike so moving from one channel to the next makes little or no difference. when raw moved to spike in 2000 its numbers saw no change until austin turned heel and wwes business went into decline by mid 2001.
> 
> 2005 onwards saw wwe go head to head with ufc...man i would love to see wwe today had cena not come along when he did looking at their numbers in 2003-04 without the ufc threat.




We are going to credit Punk's reign for the ppv buys in 2012 when most of the increase can be credited to WM28 which was all about Rock/Cena? I can't even remember who Punk wrestled at WM28...

Punk's reign was irrelevant to business, that's why he is considered such a low drawing champ. As someone else said, the show revolved around Cena (or else the Rock when he was around, cause Rock is a way bigger draw than Cena but that is a dif story)

And LOL at Cena saving the WWE from UFC... Cena and UFCs fanbases are nothing alike. IF anything, he probably drove a lot of male fans to the UFC and away from the WWE


----------



## validreasoning

Uerfer said:


> *RAW's numbers went down within six months of the switch to Spike and this was during the peak of attitude era.*


so after 6 months people stopped realizing raw was on spike...

the last month on usa raw averaged a 5.15 raing, the first month on spike raw averaged a 5.25, the month after that a 5.13.

spike had nothing to do with ratings falling after 6 months, austin turning heel did and people checked out in the droves after that.



> Infact, 1999 WWF viewership/rating average is higher than 2000, even though WCW was one hour show by 2000 and posed absolutely no threat. One of the biggest reasons for that drop was the move to spike.


difference between ratings in 1999 and 2000 was barely noticeable and spike was in more homes so viewership was actually slightly higher in 2000.




> UFC has never been big on ratings. UFC draws well only rarely if there is a big hype surrounding the event. UFC is huge on PPV buys, and WWE's biggest numbers all came from celebrities at mania not Cena, you can include the Rock to that list of celebs as well. Like I said, he's a poster boy who is super efficient merchandise draw, nothing more.


ufc were targetting wwe fans directly starting in 2005 when tuf debuted after raw. without a guy there who brought in new fans to replace those moving onto the next cool thing then wwe are in serious trouble. 

what did vince say about cena recently...c'mon dude you like to cut and paste!!




> House show business saw its peak in 2008, a year Cena missed due to injuries btw.


cena worked the majority of 2008, he missed january, september and october. 2008 wasn't the peak of the house-show business anyway..2009 was 6,226 paid vs 5,973 in 2008.


----------



## Choke2Death

The ratings for 2012 were in the 3s when Cena was the focus, but then Punk got the spotlight after SummerSlam and the dramatic decrease was incredible. 3 hours could be used as an excuse but then again, all of 2013 was 3 hours and the average for the whole year was about the same (which is a good thing because 2012 benefited heavily from being 2 hours for half of it). A large amount of the Raw's for the second half of 2013 are around 2.9 while 2012 from September onwards only reached 2.9 ONCE and went as low as 2.2 and 2.3 in the final weeks.


----------



## validreasoning

Fanboi101 said:


> We are going to credit Punk's reign for the ppv buys in 2012 when most of the increase can be credited to WM28 which was all about Rock/Cena? I can't even remember who Punk wrestled at WM28...


he wrestled jericho in second from top of the card, if you didn't know that why bother even commenting.

its ok to blame punk totally for ratings but buyrates :side:

rumble, extreme rules, over the limit, no way out, summerslam, noc, hiac were all up compared to 2011. in fact only 3 ppvs in 2012 drew less than 2011 and one of them was tlc where punk didn't compete...



> Punk's reign was irrelevant to business, *that's why he is considered such a low drawing champ.* As someone else said, the show revolved around Cena (or else the Rock when he was around, cause Rock is a way bigger draw than Cena but that is a dif story)


nobody here is saying low drawing champion, they are clearly saying *"WORST DRAWING CHAMPION OF ALL TIME"*

if you think the show revolved around cena and rock then why even bother blaming punk for anything. if he isn't put in a position to draw how can he draw?



> And LOL at Cena saving the WWE from UFC... Cena and UFCs fanbases are nothing alike. IF anything, he probably drove a lot of male fans to the UFC and away from the WWE


been addressed above.



Choke2Death said:


> The ratings for 2012 were in the 3s when Cena was the focus, but then Punk got the spotlight after SummerSlam and the dramatic decrease was incredible.


punk was a major focus of raw in june and july when raw was doing its best numbers of that year. in june it was bryan/punk/aj trilogy leading the show, then in july/august it was all focused on punks heel turn and heyman returning.

why do people keep bringing up ratings on christmas eve and new years eve as if they were normal. that christmas eve show was totally built around the cena/santa/del rio story.


----------



## murder

validreasoning said:


> the last month on usa raw averaged a 5.15 raing, the first month on spike raw averaged a 5.25, the month after that a 5.13.


Yeah when you take the two Raw shows that were preempted due to the US Open into account. In the regular time slot, Raw was averaging 6's since November 99 all the way to August 00, the month before the jump to Spike.

The move to Spike hurt the ratings, that's obvious because all of a sudden they were averaging only 5's with even more starpower. Sure, they had NFL competition, but they did 6's the year before against both, NFL and WCW, so that's not the reason.

6 months later, Raw's ratings dropped even more. That had nothing to do with Spike. That was loss of momentum, lack of competition and less starpower and just plain terrible shows. Had they been on USA, ratings would have dropped as well.


----------



## Uerfer

validreasoning said:


> so after 6 months people stopped realizing raw was on spike...
> 
> the last month on usa raw averaged a 5.15 raing, the first month on spike raw averaged a 5.25, the month after that a 5.13.
> 
> spike had nothing to do with ratings falling after 6 months, austin turning heel did and people checked out in the droves after that.
> 
> 
> 
> difference between ratings in 1999 and 2000 was barely noticeable and spike was in more homes so viewership was actually slightly higher in 2000.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ufc were targetting wwe fans directly starting in 2005 when tuf debuted after raw. without a guy there who brought in new fans to replace those moving onto the next cool thing then wwe are in serious trouble.
> 
> what did vince say about cena recently...c'mon dude you like to cut and paste!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cena worked the majority of 2008, he missed january, september and october. 2008 wasn't the peak of the house-show business anyway..2009 was 6,226 paid vs 5,973 in 2008.


I know Austin's turn hurt business in a major way but their business had already peaked before that with the USA network. The move to spike only worsened that business drop, along with WCW's death and the invasion angle botch. Dave Meltzer himself has countless times said the move leaving USA was bad one. Can't believe we're even arguing this. If Spike was so fucking popular why did TNA's attempt at Monday nights a mega fail? They brought in Hogan, Flair, hardy, nWo etc..all at the same time for the first time, and it didn't do jack for them. 

Once again, UFC was never big on ratings, it wasn't then and it isn't now. You're seriously sitting here crediting John Cena for an imaginary competition that he supposedly saved WWE from, like a clueless moron. The only significant change in UFC came in domestic PPVs where they got incredibly huge within US, Cena as top guy was nothing more than a poster-boy and WWE's PPV business suffered as accordingly. Vince got so desperate, he brought in mainstream celebrities to combat that and succeeded. Before 2011, the last time Cena was a difference maker for Mania buys was in 06 with HHH. It took Cena 5 years to be a difference maker at wrestlemania despite being the top guy the entire time, that says it all about this guy's worth. Hell even 2011/'12/'13 numbers are debatable since its the Rock who would take the most credit and he's a celebrity as well. RAW rating average 2004 was 3.6, 2005 - 3.8, 2006 -3.9, practically the same, UFC never was a competition to RAW ratings. They were a threat to WWE's PPV business and Batista deserves credit for bringing that up even before the move to USA. In anycase, Cena didn't save shit. Cena missed majority of 2008 live events due to injury, and the business was fucking up from 2007. 2009 attendance is higher because they added more live shows.


----------



## Choke2Death

validreasoning said:


> punk was a major focus of raw in june and july when raw was doing its best numbers of that year. in june it was bryan/punk/aj trilogy leading the show, then in july/august it was all focused on punks heel turn and heyman returning.


June had Vince McMahon coming back to conclude the John Laurinaitis GM story heading into No Way Out. That was the major focus. He returned in a 3 hour special and ratings increased big time after going below 3 the week before. And July had Raw 1000, which is a special that shouldn't count with the rest. The other episodes that month were no different than the consistent 3s that the earlier months had got. And none of the June/July episodes bar 1000 matched the 3.5 that was for the Raw after the Royal Rumble.

Punk became THE focus from August, specially after SummerSlam when Lesnar/HHH was done. And when that happened, ratings kept on going down. You can make all the excuses you want or bring up house show numbers and merch sales but the fact remains that with Punk as champion and the the major focus in 2012, ratings saw an immense decrease.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Choke2Death said:


> June had Vince McMahon coming back to conclude the John Laurinaitis GM story heading into No Way Out. That was the major focus. He returned in a 3 hour special and ratings increased big time after going below 3 the week before. And July had Raw 1000, which is a special that shouldn't count with the rest. The other episodes that month were no different than the consistent 3s that the earlier months had got. And none of the June/July episodes bar 1000 matched the 3.5 that was for the Raw after the Royal Rumble.
> 
> Punk became THE focus from August, specially after SummerSlam when Lesnar/HHH was done. And when that happened, ratings kept on going down. You can make all the excuses you want or bring up house show numbers and merch sales but the fact remains that with Punk as champion and *the the major focus in 2012, ratings saw an immense decrease.*


Major focus :faint: he didn't ME half his reign. Anyway ratings after the summer always gets lower just like last year. But the buys are higher last year which shows ratings didn't reflect on the buys and it was merely because 3 hours was too long for a show that had very little starpower and no major hype (after the summer).


----------



## RelivingTheShadow

CM Punk has only become a TV draw in this last year, his feuds with Rock, Undertaker and Lesnar made him go over the top. Look at the numbers he was pulling this fall, very good for top of the hour stuff. I think one time he pulled in 700,000 for a promo with CURTIS AXEL.


----------



## Choke2Death

Sonnen Says said:


> Major focus :faint: he didn't ME half his reign. Anyway ratings after the summer always gets lower just like last year. But the buys are higher last year which shows ratings didn't reflect on the buys and it was merely because 3 hours was too long for a show that had very little starpower and no major hype (after the summer).


I was clearly talking about WHEN he became the major focus, which is after Raw 1000. Yeah, ratings do decrease post-summer, but last year they didn't go down as much. Many times they were around 2.9 and the worst it got was 2.6 (if it went any lower, it was a taped show). In 2012, after September, they reached the 2.9 zone only once.


----------



## APEX

Dem ratingz.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

2012 vs. 2013 comparison?

They got on average about the same viewership each week. A couple of weeks 2012 was a lot higher, a couple of weeks 2013 was a lot higher, but as a whole they were both more or less even. Punk just happened to start getting featured as the worst time of year for ratings/viewership reared it's ugly head (at least in the last few years anyway). Punk/Cena couldn't perform a miracle with the numbers that year, Bryan and Orton couldn't pull a miracle with the numbers in 2013 (even with HHH/Steph there most weeks and the authority angle in full effect), and I doubt anyone who happens to be champion from August-end of 2014 will be able to pull a miracle with the numbers either, no matter what the feud. Monday Night Football is just too much of a beast in the ratings.


----------



## funnyfaces1

The GOAT got a match with Sheamus of all people to get a seven digit gain.


----------



## Choke2Death

funnyfaces1 said:


> The GOAT got a match with Sheamus of all people to get a seven digit gain.


Did Stone Cold face Sheamus? On Raw no less? I can't believe I missed that because it sounds like a match with lots of potential.

*googles Stone Cold vs Sheamus*


----------



## validreasoning

Uerfer said:


> Can't believe we're even arguing this. If Spike was so fucking popular why did TNA's attempt at Monday nights a mega fail? They brought in Hogan, Flair, hardy, nWo etc..all at the same time for the first time, and it didn't do jack for them.


meltzer has said that moving back usa made no difference actually.

using tna for your argument, wow. 

ufc did fine on spike..












> In anycase, Cena didn't save shit. Cena missed majority of 2008 live events due to injury, and the business was fucking up from 2007. 2009 attendance is higher because they added more live shows.


i am talking about business in general and you are only referring to raw ratings. 

average attendance is average attendance. adding more shows does not mean you get higher average attendance. 

yes cena has been the face of a billion dollar corporation for nearly a decade because he sells a bit of merch, you obviously know more about business than vince clearly.



Choke2Death said:


> You can make all the excuses you want or bring up house show numbers and merch sales but the fact remains that with Punk as champion and the the major focus in 2012, ratings saw an immense decrease.


you mean raw numbers decreased between september and december? raw averaged a 2.75 during that period last year and thats with raw falling on xmas eve, new years eve and going against the final presidential debate. in 2013 between september and december raw with hhh on tv every week averaged a 2.82


----------



## murder

validreasoning said:


> yes cena has been the face of a billion dollar corporation for nearly a decade because he sells a bit of merch, you obviously know more about business than vince clearly.


Just because Cena is their biggest draw doesn't mean he's a big draw.


----------



## Uerfer

validreasoning said:


> meltzer has said that moving back usa made no difference actually.
> 
> using tna for your argument, wow.
> 
> ufc did fine on spike..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i am talking about business in general and you are only referring to raw ratings.
> 
> average attendance is average attendance. adding more shows does not mean you get higher average attendance.
> 
> yes cena has been the face of a billion dollar corporation for nearly a decade because he sells a bit of merch, you obviously know more about business than vince clearly.



I love how you completely avoid key points in my post because you can't respond to it and simply reply with single sentences instead. Great arguments there, buddy. (Y)

Dave has countless times said WWE's move off USA during their peak was one of their worst mistakes. I can recall listening to him talk about that twice in his radio show with Bryan Alvarez last year alone. He even had one long ass article discussing WWE's history with USA network on one of his newsletter issues in 2008, it was right around the time when SD moved to My-network TV. If I find it, I can screen cap and post it later.

TNA is a valid argument, you're the one who said being on Spike/USA makes no difference because of the fact spike is available in just as many households.

As I previously noted, UFC does well rarely only when there is big hype about their event. Besides, the viewership you posted is of a wednesday episode. 

What the fuck is "talking business is general"? I was being specific about ratings and WWE's PPV business. 

He sells a lot of merch, and his superhero character which fits almost too well with WWE's marketing purposes in the mainstream media. Ofcourse I won't take away the fact his qualities of being a hard-worker, a role model to kids and more importantly, extremely reliable as top star, not a drug abuser like Orton or diva like Punk etc.. all that has made Vince Mcmahon just too damn comfortable with Cena as the face. This doesn't mean he is some super draw, because he is not. WWE brand is the actual draw, it has been that way for close to a decade now.


----------



## validreasoning

Uerfer said:


> I love how you completely avoid key points in my post because you can't respond to it and simply reply with single sentences instead. Great arguments there, buddy. (Y)


i have already provided proof that raw numbers were the same 2 months after leaving spike as they were the final month on usa so i don't see any point debating it further. if the move to spike really was the cause then numbers should have dropped straight away and they didn't.



> TNA is a valid argument, you're the one who said being on Spike/USA makes no difference because of the fact spike is available in just as many households.


tna is not a valid argument. its a completely different show. if you moved tna to usa next week its numbers would stay the same. sd is broadcast on syfy (same number of homes and same primetime average as spike) and it draws 2.5-3 times the viewership of impact. its not the network, its the show and people simply don't want to watch impact.



> As I previously noted, UFC does well rarely only when there is big hype about their event. Besides, the viewership you posted is of a wednesday episode.


ufc drew big numbers on spike and grew into a global powerhouse on that network, their business has fallen since moving to fx and now to fox sports.



> This doesn't mean he is some super draw, because he is not. WWE brand is the actual draw, it has been that way for close to a decade now.


he is one of the biggest draws in us history. cena brand houseshows outdraw any other wwe lead houseshow the same night despite the fact wwe charge more for the cena events. his longevity at this level is now reaching a level only a few others can match. last year was his 6th year to mainevent the most shows drawing 10,000+ fans, only 5 wrestlers in us history are ahead on him in that category now.


----------



## Uerfer

You seem to be posting the same thing over and over, without understanding the posts you're replying to. Forget UFC and TNA, let's just discuss John Cena. Cena is a guy on top of an already successful and established global brand, he is not the reason for that success. House show business stays the same, and even goes up sometimes when he is not there due to injuries, he was never responsible for WWE's big PPV numbers to begin with. RAW ratings have been going down year and year, with or without Cena. Meltzer's post pretty much explained everything about his real worth to WWE. Yeah he has longevity on top, that's because of the lack of competition and Vince Mcmahon's complacency with him on top. Think back to 2005, how strong they pushed his ass despite him not connecting with the fans as the face, Batista was a far bigger draw than him at that time, the PPV numbers were down when he main evented in 06. No one since has had that level of consistent commitment from Vince Mcmahon. If he was such a super draw and crucial part of WWE's success, where are those big buyrates with him as champion the first half of 2013? Where are those great ratings at that time?


----------



## Fanboi101

Uerfer said:


> You seem to be posting the same thing over and over, without understanding the posts you're replying to. Forget UFC and TNA, let's just discuss John Cena. Cena is a guy on top of an already successful and established global brand, he is not the reason for that success. House show business stays the same, and even goes up sometimes when he is not there due to injuries, he was never responsible for WWE's big PPV numbers to begin with. RAW ratings have been going down year and year, with or without Cena. Meltzer's post pretty much explained everything about his real worth to WWE. Yeah he has longevity on top, that's because of the lack of competition and Vince Mcmahon's complacency with him on top. Think back to 2005, how strong they pushed his ass despite him not connecting with the fans as the face, Batista was a far bigger draw than him at that time, the PPV numbers were down when he main evented in 06. No one since has had that level of consistent commitment from Vince Mcmahon. If he was such a super draw and crucial part of WWE's success, where are those big buyrates with him as champion the first half of 2013? Where are those great ratings at that time?


True, one day Cena won't be here and people will understand that he is just a cog in the WWE machine that can be replaced by the next superhero character to market to kids. Because Cena's been on top so long, people forget what it's like when true megastars like Hogan, Rock or Austin were the top guys, the mainstream popularity they had and how Cena just doesn't compare at all.


----------



## murder

validreasoning said:


> i have already provided proof that raw numbers were the same 2 months after leaving spike as they were the final month on usa


You didn't proof anything. You compare preempted Raws on USA to primetime Raws on Spike and then say they are the same. Do you even read or understand anybody's reply?!



Fanboi101 said:


> True, one day Cena won't be here and people will understand that he is just a cog in the WWE machine that can be replaced by the next superhero character to market to kids


And they already did that when Cena was injured in 07/08 and it's proven to be true. Hardy took his spot, challenged for the title at Rumble and clearly outdrew the previous Rumble with Cena as the champion.


----------



## validreasoning

murder said:


> Just because Cena is their biggest draw doesn't mean he's a big draw.


who is a bigger draw last 30 years? you can only name 3 names and 2 of them didn't have the longevity cena has. even hogan in his 9th year on top in wwe was not doing the numbers cena is in 2014. go back and look at the numbers hogan houseshows were drawing in 93 in strong wwe cities like boston and chicago. 



Fanboi101 said:


> True, one day Cena won't be here and people will understand that he is just a cog in the WWE machine that can be replaced by the next superhero character to market to kids. Because Cena's been on top so long, people forget what it's like when true megastars like Hogan, Rock or Austin were the top guys, the mainstream popularity they had and how Cena just doesn't compare at all.


or maybe when cena retires people will realize what an asset the guy truly is. everyone is a cog in the machine so that statement is moot. austin referred to himself as that on the mania of wrestlemania. replacing cena will be alot more difficult than you or a few others think when the time comes.



Uerfer said:


> You seem to be posting the same thing over and over, without understanding the posts you're replying to. Forget UFC and TNA, let's just discuss John Cena. Cena is a guy on top of an already successful and established global brand, he is not the reason for that success. House show business stays the same, and even goes up sometimes when he is not there due to injuries


house show business fell every year from 2000 to 2004 and then increased from 2005 onwards and reached a peak in 2009 and stayed consistent since that time. you can't ignore facts but yet you are...

guys i am out of here, believe whatever you want to believe, we will see who is right when the time comes.


----------



## Uerfer

validreasoning said:


> who is a bigger draw last 30 years? you can only name 3 names and 2 of them didn't have the longevity cena has. even hogan in his 9th year on top in wwe was not doing the numbers cena is in 2014. go back and look at the numbers hogan houseshows were drawing in 93 in strong wwe cities like boston and chicago.
> 
> 
> 
> or maybe when cena retires people will realize what an asset the guy truly is. everyone is a cog in the machine so that statement is moot. austin referred to himself as that on the mania of wrestlemania. replacing cena will be alot more difficult than you or a few others think when the time comes.
> 
> 
> 
> house show business fell every year from 2000 to 2004 and then increased from 2005 onwards and reached a peak in 2009 and stayed consistent since that time. you can't ignore facts but yet you are...
> 
> guys i am out of here, believe whatever you want to believe, we will see who is right when the time comes.



Ofcourse business fell post 2000, because it was the peak you idiot. If you compare 2005-2009 to Attitude era, the trend is still down, not up. Business did see an increase in post 05 because of USA network's popularity and once again you're crediting Cena for something he had nothing to do with. In 2005, WWE business had already turned around before they even drafted Cena's ass to RAW. When he was main eventing in 06, PPV buys were down from previous year, look it up. 

What that poster means by cog in the machine is someone who is replaceable from the start. Guys like Austin, Hogan were not mere cogs in the machine, if you take them out at their peak then WWE's entire history changes completely. Austin's humble enough to call himself that, but the success of his character was extremely crucial for WWE, he is a game changer in every sense of the word. Cena is not that guy, never was and never will be, hell he is not even a difference maker for Wrestlemanias, let alone being a game changer for the industry. He is merely a poster boy for WWE's mainstream image. 

Replacing Cena won't be easy(largely because of Vince's obsession with him on top) but wouldn't be hard either, infact I'd argue he is already being phased out in favour of Bryan in a lot of ways. At the moment, it actually feels like Bryan is the "face of WWE", atleast since summerslam he's been the top focus and now wrestlemania is built around him as well, all the while Cena is stuck in a mid card match with Wyatts. Besides, when Cena became WWE champ after two years at mania by beating the fucking ROCK clean, business didn't see any increase whatsoever, actually I think PPV buys were down when he headlined, I'd have to look up the ratings average. If he was someone who can't be replaced, his title reign after two fucking years and going over a mega star the Rock would have mattered. It didn't.


----------



## krai999

c'mon we all know arnold and hogan in the same ring is gonna draw in the highest segment in the show


----------



## THANOS

krai999 said:


> c'mon we all know arnold and hogan in the same ring is gonna draw in the highest segment in the show


Rightfully so, it was entertaining as fuck :mark:, I love Arnie. I'd expect the Lesnar/Taker mini brawl to do well also.


----------



## murder

validreasoning said:


> who is a bigger draw last 30 years? you can only name 3 names


Austin, Hogan, Rock, Warrior, Sting, Goldberg, Savage, Andre, Flair, Piper, Hart, Foley, Taker


----------



## validreasoning

Uerfer said:


> Ofcourse business fell post 2000, because it was the peak you idiot.


negged for continuously attacking the poster.

wwe business did increase in 2014, revenue increased by 5%. live event revenue was up, live attendance was up, merch revenue was up. total raw and sd ratings were up (when dvr playback is included and wwe use that stat to determine ratings). ppv was down by a $1 million but cena also missed a couple of ppvs...



murder said:


> Warrior, Sting, Goldberg, Savage, Andre, Flair, Piper, Hart, Foley, Taker


flair and andre are the only two there that you can argue. andres entire career then yes, last 30 years (so 1984 till his death) no.

* warrior drew for a short while on top, his title run was not a success.
* sting drew big one year (1997) and that year he only wrestled one match and drew 600,000 buys on ppv for a match with a year build against the biggest star of the modern era. he never drew after that. sting was always the number 2 guy in wcw, first behind flair, then behind hogan.
* goldberg had one of the biggest drawing years ever in 1998 but rarely drew after losing the streak. his 2003 run in wwe a massive flop financially. 
* savage drew very well in the late 80s but he was always regarded as a number 2 guy not a guy that could carry a company.
* piper/foley and taker were never big enough draws to carry a national company. if taker was a bigger draw than cena then why didn't vince build the company around him after austin/rock left?
* cenas numbers on top blow away bret harts


----------



## JY57

Total Divas up to 1.28 million viewers from 1.072 million last week


----------



## checkcola

JY57 said:


> Total Divas up to 1.28 million viewers from 1.072 million last week


Cena/Nikki romance bringing them viewers back!


----------



## Starbuck

Cena battle in the ratingz thread. Who woulda thunk it?

:cena5


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

checkcola said:


> Cena/Nikki romance bringing them viewers back!


Bryan's Bang Bus bringing the ratings!!!


----------



## WWE

Yeah because we all knew heading into the show that they'd showcase Bryan's bus.

:HHH2


----------



## JamesK

Thuganomics said:


> Yeah because we all knew heading into the show that they'd showcase Bryan's bus.
> 
> :HHH2


Actually the viewers did know that...


----------



## KingLobos

Speaking of ratings. Damn the GOAT's Hercules trailer is awesome.


----------



## checkcola

KingLobos said:


> Speaking of ratings. Damn the GOAT's Hercules trailer is awesome.


I didn't know Steve Austin had a Hercules trailer out. 

Oh, you mean the Goat... I didn't know Bryan had a Hercules trailer out.


----------



## Londrick

Need quarter hour ratings for Total Divas


----------



## Starbuck

Thuganomics said:


> Yeah because we all knew heading into the show that they'd showcase Bryan's bus.
> 
> :HHH2


Hold up, Bryan got a bus?

DAT D-BRY BREAKFAST CLUB 

:dazzler


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Lack of unk2 as competition this week really helped out dat Total Divas number, obviously.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

Can anyone tell me when was the last time that Monday Night RAW did a 4 rating?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

The Boy Wonder said:


> Can anyone tell me when was the last time that Monday Night RAW did a 4 rating?


I think the Donald Trump Commercial Free episode in 2009.


----------



## JY57

4.217 million
4.393 million 
4.207 million 

Up from last week


----------



## WWE

JamesK said:


> Actually the viewers did know that...


explain please



JY57 said:


> 4.217 million
> 4.393 million
> 4.207 million
> 
> Up from last week


No Daniel bryan and it goes up? :HHH2 :bigdave


----------



## #Mark

Thuganomics said:


> Yeah because we all knew heading into the show that they'd showcase Bryan's bus.
> 
> :HHH2


Uhh.. it was on the commercial for the show.


----------



## WWE

#Mark said:


> Uhh.. it was on the commercial for the show.



Then in that case I apologize, I only saw certain parts of the show because I was sick :jose


but still

Cena's bus was like a fucking house :ti


----------



## The Buryer

Strong possibility Hogan/Arnie segment was the peak.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

It does seem that last week was an outlier. Maybe it was Daylight Savings, who knows? But it does stand put like sore thumb when compared with the last few weeks.


----------



## #Mark

This week they had Arnie, Take/Brock showdown, and Hogan advertised. Plus, obvious intrigue from the closing angle last week. I don't think they even flashed the Bryan tweet until the third hour anyways.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

#Mark said:


> This week they had Arnie, Take/Brock showdown, and Hogan advertised. Plus, obvious intrigue from the closing angle last week. I don't think they even flashed the Bryan tweet until the third hour anyways.


But didn't Stephanie tell the audience in the opening segment that Bryan wouldn't be there?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Not great numbers, but at least it's up from last week and remained consistent throughout the hours. I could see Taker/Lesnar, Hogan/Arnie, or the HHH segment peaked the night.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The Boy Wonder said:


> But didn't Stephanie tell the audience in the opening segment that Bryan wouldn't be there?



Given wrestling's history, I assumed he would be there when she said that. He had done both house shows that weekend and Cole said on Smackdown that he would appear, so I assumed Steph was just being a heel at that moment.


----------



## checkcola

Last week was saint patrick's day as well


----------



## 4everEyebrowRaisin

When was the last time RAW got over 5 million+? I can't remember.


----------



## JamesK

4everEyebrowRaisin said:


> When was the last time RAW got over 5 million+? I can't remember.


Overall it has been a long time since that. In one segment 2 weeks ago with occupy Raw they got 5.3-5.5 and last year with the Rock they did 5+..


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Batista's return episode might've gotten over 5 million.

As far as individual segments, something from that show had to have gotten over 5 million viewers at least. Outside of that and the Occupy Raw segment, not sure. I think several segments last year might've gotten over 5 million, like Taker's return last year on Old School (both the opener and ending), the Rock/Cena segment from that same show, Punk/Rock from the night after the Royal Rumble 2013, Brock's return from that same night... and maybe some others I'm forgetting about.


----------



## JamesK

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Batista's return episode might've gotten over 5 million.
> 
> As far as individual segments, something from that show had to have gotten over 5 million viewers at least. Outside of that and the Occupy Raw segment, not sure. I think several segments last year might've gotten over 5 million, like Taker's return last year on Old School (both the opener and ending), the Rock/Cena segment from that same show, Punk/Rock from the night after the Royal Rumble 2013, Brock's return from that same night... and maybe some others I'm forgetting about.


Yeah Batista's comeback too i forgot that....
Also now i remembered that Raw 1000 averaged 6 million viewers...


----------



## The Boy Wonder

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Batista's return episode might've gotten over 5 million.
> 
> As far as individual segments, *something from that show had to have gotten over 5 million viewers at least.* Outside of that and the Occupy Raw segment, not sure. I think several segments last year might've gotten over 5 million, like Taker's return last year on Old School (both the opener and ending), the Rock/Cena segment from that same show, Punk/Rock from the night after the Royal Rumble 2013, Brock's return from that same night... and maybe some others I'm forgetting about.


Does anyone have the exact numbers for this segment?


----------



## Sonnen Says

This shows people aren't as interested for WM like the previous years. I mean you have Taker/Brock/Paul/Cena/Hogan/HHH/Authority/Arnold/Batista for the show and yet it only does 3.07. I'm starting to believe a lot of viewers lost interest ever since Punk left. There is no other reason why it isn't getting any higher maybe because there is no Rock for this year too.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

Sonnen Says said:


> This shows people aren't as interested for WM like the previous years. I mean you have Taker/Brock/Paul/Cena/Hogan/HHH/Authority/Arnold/Batista for the show and yet it only does 3.09. I'm starting to believe a lot of viewers lost interest ever since Punk left. There is no other reason why it isn't getting any higher maybe because there is no Rock for this year too.


Care to put any of the blame on Daniel Bryan's push? He's been the main focus of WWE since last summer.


----------



## xdoomsayerx

Sonnen Says said:


> This shows people aren't as interested for WM like the previous years. I mean you have Taker/Brock/Paul/Cena/Hogan/HHH/Authority/Arnold/Batista for the show and yet it only does 3.07. I'm starting to believe a lot of viewers lost interest ever since Punk left. There is no other reason why it isn't getting any higher maybe because there is no Rock for this year too.



Punk being there or not has nothing to do with the ratings. Last 2 year's were ONLY higher because of the rock, not fucking cm punk dude lol.


----------



## THANOS

The Boy Wonder said:


> Care to put any of the blame on Daniel Bryan's push? He's been the main focus of WWE since last summer.


Don't be silly, we've seen how his quarter hour segments have performed since months before his Summerslam program even happened, and he's been great in the ratings department. There's no one person to blame for the ratings decline. It's more to do with the fact that outside of 4 programs, the WWE have done fuck all to promote any other feuds and here we are less than two weeks before Mania fpalm. 

Any logical person wouldn't do Shield vs NAO & Kane at Wrestle-fucking-mania because it's a huge fucking waste of talent. Besides that you have a battle royal for everyone else because WWE and their writers were too lazy or indecisive to create proper feuds for all the upper midcarders. It's truly embarrassing really.. 

The least they could have done is feuds like Cody vs Goldust, heel Sheamus vs Roman Reigns, Ambrose vs Rollins for the US title, and maybe Big E vs Mark Henry for the IC title. Yeah those matches may not add a lot of buyrates but at least the viewer has a larger palette to invest it. They could have also paid Goldberg what he was asking and fed Ryback to him, since I'm sure that would add a bit more star power to the event as well.


----------



## JY57

Sonnen Says said:


> This shows people aren't as interested for WM like the previous years. I mean you have Taker/Brock/Paul/Cena/Hogan/HHH/Authority/Arnold/Batista for the show and yet it only does 3.07. I'm starting to believe a lot of viewers lost interest ever since Punk left. There is no other reason why it isn't getting any higher maybe because there is no Rock for this year too.


Dwayne is not there plain and simple.

WWE is lucky they have both PPV and Network to guarantee a good combined number (buys & subscriptions) for this PPV.


----------



## Sonnen Says

xdoomsayerx said:


> Punk being there or not has nothing to do with the ratings. Last 2 year's were ONLY higher because of the rock, not fucking cm punk dude lol.


Punk was getting the highest numbers and high profile feuds with Rock, Undertaker (Which was higher than Rock/Cena at times and mostly higher than Brock/HHH feud) and Cena (match). He was pretty much a big focus at that time. The Raw in Chicago this year was the 3rd highest (he didn't even show up was just teased) only behind Raw after RR and EC. I think if Punk was/is here rating will have increased by a good amount. Rock be added too will increase it even higher which I bet will get even more than last year easily.


----------



## #Mark

Sonnen Says said:


> This shows people aren't as interested for WM like the previous years. I mean you have Taker/Brock/Paul/Cena/Hogan/HHH/Authority/Arnold/Batista for the show and yet it only does 3.07. I'm starting to believe a lot of viewers lost interest ever since Punk left. There is no other reason why it isn't getting any higher maybe because there is no Rock for this year too.


Raw did a 3.1 on the go home before Mania 29 last year and a 3.08 on the show two weeks before Mania. The ratings always fluctuate and the only true ratings move left in the industry is off promoting Hercules. CM Punk might make a difference but it probably isn't noticeable.




The Boy Wonder said:


> Care to put any of the blame on Daniel Bryan's push? He's been the main focus of WWE since last summer.


You seem to be ignoring that Bryan has consistently topped the show whenever he has been in the spotlight, including last week in a random slotted match with Orton. Also, Bryan has only became the focus again in February. Bryan was mid-carding after November and during the entire winter while Orton and the Authority was in the ME in programs with Big Show and Cena. So your boy Orton and the Authority definitely shoulder blame too.


----------



## D.M.N.

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_77271.shtml

Bryan > all


----------



## JY57

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_77271.shtml#.UzNS5dy4klI



> WWE Raw TV quarter-hours 3/24
> 
> In Summary: A collection of segments propped up Raw throughout the show, but none of those segments skyrocketed or popped off the page like segments involving Daniel Bryan the past three weeks.
> 
> With Daniel Bryan held off this week's Raw episode, the top-rated portion of the show was the Hulk Hogan/Arnold Schwarzenegger/Joe Manganiello segment that included an interruption by The Miz.
> 
> The stretch from 9:25 p.m. to 9:32 p.m. (Q6 to Q7) drew the largest audience of the night in the males 18-49 demographic, surpassing the over-run for The Undertaker and Brock Lesnar.
> 
> However, the over-run drew a larger audience than Q6 and Q7, reflecting the Hogan segment drawing the most viewers on the night, but not to the level of carrying its two quarter-hours above the over-run.
> 
> Another top segment was Triple H's "interview" with Michael Cole at the top of the second hour, which drew the second-highest quarter-hour rating of the show, besides the over-run. But, it was below recent Raws that featured Hunter and Daniel Bryan sharing the same ring.
> 
> Interestingly, another strong segment was the Divas Title announcement for WrestleMania, which joined with Scott Hall's Hall of Fame announcement to carry Q10 to the highest-rated segment of the show, besides the over-run.
> 
> Raw Quarter-Hour Break Down - m18-49 demo
> 
> - Overall Show: 1.273 million viewers and 2.02 rating in m18-49.
> 
> - Q1: Raw opened with a 2.06 rating for Batista, Randy Orton, and Stephanie McMahon hyping WrestleMania.
> 
> - Q2: Raw quickly fell to a show-low 1.84 rating for two commercials and the first few minutes of a four-way #1 contender match to the IC Title.
> 
> - Q3: Raw increased to a 1.93 rating for the end of the match, one commercial, and Damien Sandow vs. Sin Cara.
> 
> - Q4: Raw dipped again to a 1.87 rating for two commercials and Los Matadores vs. Curtis Axel & Ryback.
> 
> - Q5: Raw bumped to a 2.11 rating at the top of the second hour for Triple H's sit-down discussion with Cole and one commercial.
> 
> - Q6: Raw held on with a 2.10 rating for Cody Rhodes vs. Fandango, one commercial, and the first-half of the Hogan/Arnold/Joe-Miz segment.
> 
> The quarter-hour ended with 1.511 million and 1.533 million viewers prior to Miz's interruption.
> 
> - Q7: Raw was steady at a 2.09 rating for the end of the Hogan-Miz segment, one commercial, and Big Show vs. Titus O'Neil.
> 
> The quarter-hour peaked with 1.546 million, 1.557 million, and a show-high 1.591 million viewers at 9:32 p.m. EST when the segment ended. From there, 500,000 viewers tuned out during the commercial.
> 
> - Q8: Raw slipped to a 2.01 rating for two commercials and the first-half of John Cena vs. Luke Harper.
> 
> - Q9: Raw rebounded to a 2.09 rating for the second-half of Cena vs. Harper, one commercial, and Divas champion A.J. Lee vs. Naomi.
> 
> The peak audience was 1.470 million viewers at 10:01 p.m. during the meat of the Cena-Harper match.
> 
> - Q10: Raw actually grew to a 2.12 rating - the highest non-over-run rating of the show - for Vickie Guerrero announcing the Divas match at WrestleMania, one commercial, and the Scott Hall/HOF announcement.
> 
> The audience peaked with 1.501 million and 1.552 million viewers at 10:16 p.m. for Vickie's announcement, then peaked again with 1.440 million viewers at 10:26 for the HOF announcement.
> 
> - Q11: Raw dropped to a 1.90 rating for two commercials and the first-half of The Shield vs. Real Americans in the default main event.
> 
> - Q12: Raw was about even with a 1.92 rating for the second-half of the main event, one commercial, and the first few minutes of the Taker-Lesnar segment.
> 
> - Over-run: Raw scored a show-high 2.26 rating for the Taker-Lesnar segment and no commercial.
> 
> The peak audience was 1.475 million viewers at 11:08 p.m. Raw then signed off with 1.469 million viewers and 1.346 million viewers.
> 
> The segment held steady around 1.4 million viewers throughout, which allowed it to surpass the Q6 and Q7 segment, but there wasn't a significant pop to surpass the Hogan/Arnold audience that stretched across Q6 and Q7.


----------



## Fissiks

hey what do you know i guess Bryan was the reason the segments with the Authority are the highest rated parts of the show afterall


----------



## Starbuck

Consistency wins the day eh? Basically a 2.1 from Trips/Cole to Hogan/Arnie to Cena/Harper to HOF/Divas right through to the main event and then jumping up to 2.2 for the overrun. No massive jumps like in previous weeks but pretty consistent all the way through. 

DAT SLOW AND STEADY WINS THE RACE


----------



## checkcola

> - Q10: Raw actually grew to a 2.12 rating - the highest non-over-run rating of the show - for Vickie Guerrero announcing the Divas match at WrestleMania, one commercial, and the Scott Hall/HOF announcement.


----------



## Starbuck

> ...and a show-high 1.591 million viewers at 9:32 p.m.





> ...show-high peak viewership of 1.523 million viewers at 9:25 p.m.


9.25pm - 9.32pm = magical ratingz minutes 2 weeks in a row 8*D


----------



## JY57

Starbuck said:


> Consistency wins the day eh? Basically a 2.1 from Trips/Cole to Hogan/Arnie to Cena/Harper to HOF/Divas right through to the main event and then jumping up to 2.2 for the overrun. No massive jumps like in previous weeks but pretty consistent all the way through.
> 
> DAT SLOW AND STEADY WINS THE RACE


too bad its only for the 18-49 male demo because there still pretty much 3.0 million unaccounted for if the average viewers for this demo was 1.273 million viewers


----------



## Starbuck

JY57 said:


> too bad its only for the 18-49 male demo because there still pretty much 3.0 million unaccounted for if the average viewers for this demo was 1.273 million viewers


Yup. Working with less than half the viewing audience obviously isn't ideal but Meltzer seems to have lost contact with his sources or something. These 18-49's are great to see and all but they don't give the full picture. Either way, I had an epiphany. Bryan/Orton last week beat everything this week except the overrun and even then it was only 0.08 away from Taker/Lesnar BUT Hogan/Arnie had higher viewership than Bryan/Orton despite having a lower rating therefore EVERYBODY DRAWS AND NOBODY DRAWS hey wait Hunter on his soapbox had a higher rating than Hogan/Arnie which beat Cena/Harper by 0.02 BUT the HOF/Divas matched the rating of the overrun last week EVERYBODY DRAWS AND NOBODY DRAWS FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT

:vince3


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

NO DAZZLING DEMOS W/O DAT BOY D-BRY!!!! :dazzler


----------



## JamesK

So the biggest draws of the show was Arnie,Joe and Hogan....

We might have found a new tag team to feud with the Shield or the Wyatts :vince


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Well, Taker/Brock ruled the overall quarter viewership, Hogan/Arnie got the peak viewership, and Vickie Guerrero buries all other segments. 

Sorry :batista2:rko2:HHH , but if you don't have Bryan, there's no point in tryin'! :bryan


----------



## RatedR10

Safe to say Bryan is over big with the 18-49 demo? Awesome. :dazzler


----------



## The Boy Wonder

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Sorry :batista2:rko2:HHH , but if you don't have Bryan, there's no point in tryin'! :bryan


But didn't RAW do a higher rating this week without Bryan then they did last week with him?

Also, if Daniel Bryan is "popping" ratings off the page why isn't RAW doing better overall ratings?


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

The Boy Wonder said:


> But didn't RAW do a higher rating this week without Bryan then they did last week with him?
> 
> Also, if Daniel Bryan is "popping" ratings off the page why isn't RAW doing better overall ratings?


I blame the WWE champion and the face of the company, Randy Orton.


----------



## #Mark

The Boy Wonder said:


> But didn't RAW do a higher rating this week without Bryan then they did last week with him?
> 
> Also, if Daniel Bryan is "popping" ratings off the page why isn't RAW overall doing better numbers? The numbers for RAW overall are at it's lowest compared to previous years.


The RAW rating was better this week for a variety of reasons that you keep ignoring: Hogan, Taker, and Brock were advertised for this show and weren't on last show.. Those three guys are bigger ratings movers than anyone on the full time roster. Couple that with the fact that there was obvious intrigue as a result of last week's closing angle and the fact that last week was St. Patty's day and you're sure to see a ratings increase. Not to mention Bryan was advertised for the show on SD, during the weekend's adverts, and was even advertised on the pre-show. 

The numbers are only marginially lower than last years which is expected. Ratings decrease every year.. The Rock (you know, a megastar in hollywood) was the world champion and the show was still pulling in similar numbers. The show two weeks before Mania pulled in a 3.08.. The show this week pulled in a 3.07. So I'm really not sure what argument you're trying to make.

Even so, Bryan's segments no matter where they are placed are consistently topping the show. Last week he topped the show in an oddly placed match against Orton. This week, no segments gained like Bryan's did and the Authority isn't even in the discussion of highest ratings gains. Bryan isn't responsible for what the segment after him or before him does. If a performer moves the ratings the most, it's up to the people who come after to maintain that. You're essentially blaming him for being the most popular act on the roster. It's quite hilarious actually.


----------



## THANOS

The Boy Wonder said:


> But didn't RAW do a higher rating this week without Bryan then they did last week with him?
> 
> Also, if Daniel Bryan is "popping" ratings off the page why isn't RAW doing better overall ratings?


No where near how Bryan featured segments have done the past 3 weeks. The overall may have been higher, simply because they expected Bryan to do some sort of a surprise run in, as usual when the heel boss mentions that said superstar won't be there. It's usually done to build anticipation in professional wrestling, but this time it turned out to be the truth. It also helped that they were teasing another Brock/Taker confrontation and the Hogan/Arnold segment which both paid off well.

Bryan simply can't elevate the entire show by himself, the whole show needs to be altered to reflect the new top star. Just like in the Attitude Era, Austin didn't start improving the overall ratings until the entire show changed to reflect the "attitude" of the man on top. HHH coined the potential new era as called "the Reality Era" live RAW, which was the first time that name had been mentioned by WWE since CM Punk teased it back in 2011. It reminded me of this:






If they do change the programming to reflect the uprising movement of the the indy star who doesn't look like the typical wrestler, and market the program and matches similar to the way UFC hype matches like big competitive bouts instead of entertainment spectacles, then and only then will you be able to point blame at Bryan for the "overall" rating. Until that time you can only criticize wrestlers for their own specific segments and not the entire show.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

THANOS said:


> Bryan simply can't elevate the entire show by himself, the whole show needs to be altered to reflect the new top star. Just like in the Attitude Era, Austin didn't start improving the overall ratings until the entire show changed to reflect the "attitude" of the man on top. HHH coined the potential new era as called "the Reality Era" live RAW, which was the first time that name had been mentioned by WWE since CM Punk teased it back in 2011. It reminded me of this:


But Bryan is so heavily featured on every RAW, sometimes getting multiple segments. If he's popping the rating it should reflect in the overall rating.


----------



## Happenstan

The Boy Wonder said:


> But Bryan is so heavily featured on every RAW, sometimes getting multiple segments. If he's popping the rating it should reflect in the overall rating.


:lmao That's quite an interesting argument. Especially since when I made a similar one about Punk I'm pretty sure you were one of the ones who called me crazy for it. How is the above argument any different from mine in my ongoing feud with Punk fans about how Punk wasn't held down/back by Cena closing shows when Punk was featured in multiple talk ups, commentator spots, promos, etc?


----------



## THANOS

The Boy Wonder said:


> But Bryan is so heavily featured on every RAW, sometimes getting multiple segments. If he's popping the rating it should reflect in the overall rating.


And every single one of those segments does great so what's your point? Like I said, he can't be tasked with raising segments he's not a part of unless the entire product evolves to match the theme or attitude of his character, just like it did for Austin. Otherwise, you can only dissect his individual segments, which he does well in and usually tops the show.


----------



## #Mark

The Boy Wonder said:


> But Bryan is so heavily featured on every RAW, sometimes getting multiple segments. If he's popping the rating it should reflect in the overall rating.


Bryan's segments are getting high ratings because people are invested in his character so because people happen to switch channels after his segments are over... That's his fault. Not the WWE for booking the stories outside the main ones poorly but the hottest guy in the company for being too popular. Bryan's segments are topping the show, everything else is stagnant. So instead of blaming the one guy who is actually moving ratings wouldn't it be wise to address the other acts not moving ratings?


----------



## Londrick

Even the Divas are outdrawing Orton and Batista. :ti


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Look at how small Bryan used to be in #Mark's sig. :ti

See what happens when you put on some muscle. :vince


----------



## JY57

Smackdown viewership up to 3.047 million from 2.597 million the previous week


----------



## checkcola

JY57 said:


> Smackdown viewership up to 3.047 million from 2.597 million the previous week


That has to be general interest in WrestleMania adding some extra eyes.


----------



## e1987p

JY57 said:


> Smackdown viewership up to 3.047 million from 2.597 million the previous week


Batista.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Total Divas delivers second highest rating. I credit the shenanigans on Bryan's B+us.

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2014/03/31/total-divas-delivers-most-watched-episode-this-season-eric-jessie-game-on-scores-big-in-its-season-2-premiere/249649/


----------



## THANOS

Tune in to RAW tonight to find if Bryan can, once again, top the night's ratings with his segment :.


----------



## JY57

Total Divas got 1.55 million viewers? Pretty impressive for that show.


----------



## SUPER HANS

JY57 said:


> Total Divas got 1.55 million viewers? Pretty impressive for that show.


GOATal Divas


----------



## checkcola

JY57 said:


> Total Divas got 1.55 million viewers? Pretty impressive for that show.


Summer Rae conflict!!!!


----------



## Reaper

The Boy Wonder said:


> But didn't RAW do a higher rating this week without Bryan then they did last week with him?
> 
> Also, if Daniel Bryan is "popping" ratings off the page why isn't RAW doing better overall ratings?


They didn't advertise that he wasn't going to be on the show. They also said the exact same thing right off the bat today that Bryan won't be on the show and guess what, he was. 

Fans have been trained to take statements like "oh x guy isn't on the show" as an obvious misdirection as opposed to a fact. 

So even though he wasn't on the show it's still "fair" to attribute some of that rating to the Bryan/HHH storyline and fans want to see its progress.

Notice how I'm not saying it's Bryan, or HHH, or Orton, or Batista, or Taker, or Arnold or Lesnar specifically, because at this point on the RTWM it would be a huge leap in logic to believe that only 1 or 2 people irrespective of their storylines are rating draws or killers. It's RTWM.


----------



## D.M.N.

WWE Entertainment	USA	8:00 PM	4231	1.4
WWE Entertainment	USA	9:00 PM	4603	1.6
WWE Entertainment	USA	10:00 PM	4338	1.6

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...k-crew-bates-motel-archer-dallas-more/249790/


----------



## JY57

About the same average as last year go home show (4.30 million this year I believe a but higher)


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Good numbers to end on. Will be interesting to see what the breakdown shows. Looks like Taker/Brock may have held up there own weight despite some apparently stiff competition. And the Bryan/HHH/Orton/Batista and Cena/Wyatts held up the rest of the show quite nicely. I expect the overrun to top the night.


----------



## THANOS

The overrun is almost always the high point of the show but I'm curious to see just how high the overrun actually is compared to the past year. If it's the highest since last year and peaks during the Bryan run-in, I think it will only add that much more to the rising drawing power of the beard. :mark: It will truly be interesting to see!


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Bryan only appeared for 4 minutes. You wonder if people anticipated him showing up, or they gave up because they were told he wasnt there,like last week. Regardless, he blew the roof off of that place.


----------



## THANOS

IDONTSHIV said:


> Bryan only appeared for 4 minutes. You wonder if people anticipated him showing up, or they gave up because they were told he wasnt there,like last week. Regardless, he blew the roof off of that place.


Yeah he wasn't there long but the Torch should at least provide us with the peak viewership during that Overrun and hopefully it's high enough to bring the total number up high enough to beat most of the past year.


----------



## JY57

Average - 4.390 million viewers

Final Rating - 3.14


----------



## Wagg

Bootista's fucked up return had bigger viewership than the go home edition of the 30th anniversary of WM. Dat ratings monster D Bryan. :ti He can move how many hands he wants in the crowd but that will not make him a draw.


----------



## #Mark

Wagg said:


> Bootista's fucked up return had bigger viewership than the go home edition of the 30th anniversary of WM. Dat ratings monster D Bryan. :ti He can move how many hands he wants in the crowd but that will not make him a draw.


:lmao

The go home show this week drew a bigger rating than the go home last year. So by your moronic logic, Bryan>Rock :yes:


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Wagg said:


> Bootista's fucked up return had bigger viewership than the go home edition of the 30th anniversary of WM. Dat ratings monster D Bryan. :ti He can move how many hands he wants in the crowd but that will not make him a draw.


Bryan has been consistently drawing higher ratings than Dave for many weeks now. Try harder.


----------



## purple_gloves

Bryan should be drawing at the moment. He's over with the crowd and he's playing the underdog role in a compelling storyline against a heel HHH. If that doesn't draw, then they're in serious trouble.

Punk drew when he was involved in compelling stories or going against big stars. The thing is, in my opinion, Bryan will end up following a similar path to Punk after this is over. He'll probably have a title run and a couple of main event feuds, then he'll get knocked back down the card and struggle to draw on his own.


----------



## THANOS

purple_gloves said:


> Bryan should be drawing at the moment. He's over with the crowd and he's playing the underdog role in a compelling storyline against a heel HHH. If that doesn't draw, then they're in serious trouble.
> 
> Punk drew when he was involved in compelling stories or going against big stars. The thing is, in my opinion, Bryan will end up following a similar path to Punk after this is over. He'll probably have a title run and a couple of main event feuds, then he'll get knocked back down the card and struggle to draw on his own.


Actually there are holes in your logic. Bryan has been drawing very well in segments dating back to his tean hell no split last year, which was a good few months before he even faced John Cena at Summerslam and won the title. He was drawing loads of viewers during matches with Wade Barrett, Jack Swagger, Cesaro, The Shield, and Ryback while in his weak link storyline. Not to mention how he was doing in his Wyatt feud. The fact is Bryan doesn't need to be in the main event storyline to draw, he simply draws now wherever he is because he elevates the storyline to main event importance like Cena currently does. 

Most logical people, privy to the information out there, will admit he far surpassed Punk as a ratings draw long ago, is currently second behind Cena in merch, headlines his own live event tour with the Big Show and no one else yet still sells it out, and has increased buyrates from previous years in the majority of Bryan headlined events. 

He's not perfect, and no one is saying he's a megadraw or anything like that, but he's certainly doing amazing so far with this push, showing no signs of slowing down, and has risen much higher than Punk ever did with less than half the push Punk received.


----------



## purple_gloves

THANOS said:


> Actually there are holes in your logic. Bryan has been drawing very well in segments dating back to his tean hell no split last year, which was a good few months before he even faced John Cena at Summerslam and won the title. He was drawing loads of viewers during matches with Wade Barrett, Jack Swagger, Cesaro, The Shield, and Ryback while in his weak link storyline. Not to mention how he was doing in his Wyatt feud. The fact is Bryan doesn't need to be in the main event storyline to draw, he simply draws now wherever he is because he elevates the storyline to main event importance like Cena currently does.
> 
> Most logical people, privy to the information out there, will admit he far surpassed Punk as a ratings draw long ago, is currently second behind Cena in merch, headlines his own live event tour with the Big Show and no one else yet still sells it out, and has increased buyrates from previous years in the majority of Bryan headlined events.
> 
> He's not perfect, and no one is saying he's a megadraw or anything like that, but he's certainly doing amazing so far with this push, showing no signs of slowing down, and has risen much higher than Punk ever did with less than half the push Punk received.


Firstly, Bryan has actually been pushed (properly pushed) more than Punk in my opinion. Punk was never booked as an underdog babyface chasing the title. That's a feud that draws 9 times out of 10. They had their chance in 2011 and didn't want to go there. Punk was either booked as a cowardly heel champ, a babyface champ playing 2nd fiddle to Cena, or feuding with the likes of ADR, Miz, Ziggler etc . A. Long title reign means nothing if he's been booked like a mid carder.

Secondly, I'm enjoying this feud so I don't really care either way.


----------



## Sonnen Says

THANOS said:


> Actually there are holes in your logic. Bryan has been drawing very well in segments dating back to his tean hell no split last year, which was a good few months before he even faced John Cena at Summerslam and won the title. He was drawing loads of viewers during matches with Wade Barrett, Jack Swagger, Cesaro, The Shield, and Ryback while in his weak link storyline. Not to mention how he was doing in his Wyatt feud. The fact is Bryan doesn't need to be in the main event storyline to draw, he simply draws now wherever he is because he elevates the storyline to main event importance like Cena currently does.
> 
> Most logical people, privy to the information out there, will admit he far surpassed Punk as a ratings draw long ago, is currently second behind Cena in merch, headlines his own live event tour with the Big Show and no one else yet still sells it out, *and has increased buyrates from previous years in the majority of Bryan headlined events. *
> 
> He's not perfect, and no one is saying he's a megadraw or anything like that, but he's certainly doing amazing so far with this push, showing no signs of slowing down, *and has risen much higher than Punk ever did with less than half the push Punk received.*


:banderas


----------



## funnyfaces1

Didn't the exact opposite happen with PPVs that Bryan main evented? I think they did better in 2010 and 2011, but not 2012.


----------



## The Buryer

For comparison, breakdown last year go home show - 



> - John Cena Promo opens to a decent 3.1
> - Randy Orton, Sheamus, and Big Show vs. 3MB lost 95,000 viewers
> - Daniel Bryan vs. Dolph Ziggler lost 43,000 more
> - Triple H/Heyman/Brock with the return of Shawn gained a big 585,000 viewers
> - Wade Barrett vs. Zack Ryder lost 485,000 viewers
> - Mark Henry vs. Santino Marella with Ryback gained 14,000 viewers.
> - Alberto Del Rio vs. Zeb Colter with Jack Swagger lost 108,000 viewers.
> - The Rock Promo on top of the third hour gained a very weak 275,000 viewers.
> - Chris Jericho vs. Antonio Cesaro with Fandango lost 168,000 viewers
> - Mania video packages lost 212,000
> - Cameron and Naomi vs. the Bella Twins gained 288,000 viewers
> - Undertaker/Heyman/Punk dumping ash gained 599,000 viewers to close out the Overrun


Essentially there was no noteworthy gains or increase last year, 10Pm was surprisingly low with the Rock, 9pm and Overrun with same amount of viewer gains, and overrun topped out the rating thanks to the Divas 280K lead-in before. 

Let's see how this year draws and if there is any huge gains.


----------



## D.M.N.

With quarter one (January to March) over, here is how the quarter rated versus previous years. The +/- is an average of the comparison between (i.e. for Q1 2007):

- the previous quarter (Q4 2006)
- one year earlier (Q1 2006)
- two years earlier (Q1 2005)

Which gives us:

2003	- 3.8 rating / 3.30 million households
2004	- 3.8 rating / 3.36 million households (-1.5%)
2005	- 3.8 rating / 3.40 million households (+4.0%)
2006	- 4.1 rating / 3.72 million households (+9.2%)
2007	- 3.9 rating / 3.62 million households (+4.4%)
2008	- 3.6 rating / 3.48 million households (-0.6%)
2009	- 3.7 rating / 3.61 million households (+7.2%)
2010	- 3.6 rating / 3.54 million households (+2.2%)
2011	- 3.5 rating / 3.47 million households (+1.5%)
2012	- 3.2 rating / 3.17 million households (-5.6%)
2013	- 3.3 rating / 3.27 million households (+7.3%)
2014	- 3.2 rating / 3.13 million households (+2.5%)

And from a percentage point of view, the most successful quarter one's were:

+9.2 - 2006
+7.3 - 2013
+7.2 - 2009
+4.4 - 2007
+4.0 - 2005
+2.5 - 2014
+2.2 - 2010
+1.5 - 2011
-0.6 - 2008
-1.5 - 2004
-5.6 - 2012

2005, 2006 and 2007 were a string of superb WrestleMania build-ups and need no explanation for their high Q1 numbers. 2013 is there simply because Q4 in 2012 was the worst quarter in the company's history in fifteen years, which meant that Q1 in 2013 gained big as a result.

2014's household numbers are the lowest for a Q1 since before the Attitude Era. Surprising on one hand, not surprising on the other with no Rock. I think we can also say that Hogan is not a draw in 2014, and WWE's tactic of advertising his return did nothing for the numbers. 2004 did not do that bad coming off the Attitude Era, 2008 sucked outright and in 2012 no one wanted to see Rock vs Cena II.

If Bryan does walk out of WrestleMania champion, the year on year comparisons will be very interesting going forward.


----------



## The Buryer

> 2013 is there simply because *Q4 in 2012 was the worst quarter in the company's history in fifteen years*, which meant that Q1 in 2013 gained big as a result.


fucking unk lol



> 2014's household numbers are the lowest for a Q1 since before the Attitude Era. Surprising on one hand, not surprising on the other with no Rock.


Not really sure if the Rock mattered all that much, considering 2012 Q1 from your data shows essentially the same rating average and lower households compared to rest of the years excluding 2014. Also the fact 2012 Q1 had RAW the usual two hours, in 2014 obviously three hour shows hurting viewing patterns. The build-up was also for the first time match between Rock vs Cena. 




> I think we can also say that Hogan is not a draw in 2014,


I don't think they were banking on Hogan to draw for wrestlemania in the first place, more like it was meant to be Batista. And Batista did draw great the first few weeks until Bryan fans killed his appeal, by booing his ass week after week and turned him into a joke. Hogan was probably there just for the Network plugs.



> If Bryan does walk out of WrestleMania champion, the year on year comparisons will be very interesting going forward.


Indeed. I hope he does well though.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

*WWE NEWS: Raw quarter-hour TV ratings - why the final Raw before WM30 was owned by Bryan-Hunter *





> *Daniel Bryan's expected WWE TV return and the Bryan vs. Triple H feud boosted Raw TV ratings on Monday heading into WrestleMania.
> 
> Bryan's attack on Hunter in the final moments of the March 31 Raw was the most-watched portion of the show in the males 18-49 demographic.
> 
> During the non-overrun portion of the show, Triple H's speech at the top of the Second Hour teasing a potential Bryan appearance was by far the highest-rated quarter-hour.
> 
> The consistently strong TV ratings for Bryan-Hunter over the past month (excluding last week where Bryan did not appear on the show) point to their feud being the strongest heading into WrestleMania.*
> 
> Raw TV Ratings Break Down (m18-49)
> 
> - Overall Show Average: 2.10 rating / 1.3 million viewers
> 
> - Q1: Raw opened with a weak 1.85 rating for the opening segment, which was Undertaker and Brock Lesnar's final exchange before WrestleMania.
> 
> Taker-Lesnar peaked with 1.288 million viewers at 8:12 p.m., below the show average.
> 
> - Q2: Raw fell to a show-low 1.66 rating for two commercials and the first-half of IC champion Big E. vs. Alberto Del Rio.
> 
> - Q3: Raw jumped to a 2.04 rating for the end of the match, one commercial, and the Wyatts delivering a message to John Cena.
> 
> The second-half with the Wyatts popped the quarter-hour rating, peaking with 1.433 million viewers at 8;41 p.m.
> 
> - Q4: Raw increased to a 2.09 rating as Raw built momentum heading to the top of the hour. The segment included Summer Rae vs. Natalya, one commercial, and the first-half of The Authority's speech.
> 
> ***
> 
> - Q5: Raw popped a 2.55 rating for the second-half of Triple H and Stephanie McMahon teasing a Bryan appearance, plus one commercial at the end of the segment.
> 
> The segment built from 1.543 million viewers at 9:00 p.m. to a peak of 1.736 million viewers at 9:07 p.m. Batista and Randy Orton interrupted, then it became apparent Bryan was not coming out, which led to the audience tapering off to 1.658 million viewers when Raw went to break at 9:11 p.m.
> 
> - Q6: Raw began a Second Hour Slide to a 2.14 rating for an eight-man tag match centered on the top WWE tag teams, plus one commercial.
> 
> - Q7: Raw slid to a 2.03 rating for the end of the tag match, one-and-a-half commercials, and Rhodes Bros. vs. Damien Sandow & Fandango.
> 
> - Q8: Raw dipped to a 2.01 rating for Bray Wyatt vs. R-Truth and one-and-a-half commercials.
> 
> ***
> 
> - Q9: Raw rebounded to a 2.17 rating at the top of the Third Hour for John Cena's post-match sneak-up on the Wyatts, one commercial, and A.J. Lee vs. Naomi.
> 
> The quarter-hour peaked with 1.554 million viewers at 10:02 p.m. for Cena sneaking up on the Wyatts.
> 
> - Q10: Raw dipped to a 2.09 rating for various videos, WM30 hype, and one commercial.
> 
> - Q11: Raw slightly increased to a 2.12 rating for Roman Reigns vs. Kane, one commercial, and the first-half of the Piper's Pit segment.
> 
> The end of Reigns-Kane and this portion of Piper's Pit were evenly matched. The match peaked with 1.499 million viewers and Pit peaked with 1.490 million viewers.
> 
> - Q12: Raw increased to a 2.21 rating for the second-half of Piper's Pit, one commercial, and the first-half of the original WrestleMania main event of Randy Orton vs. Batista.
> 
> The segment was boosted by the second-half of the Pit, which peaked with 1.619 million viewers at 10:48 p.m. By comparison, the first-half of the main event hit 1.519 million viewers at 10:59 p.m.
> 
> - Over-run: The over-run drew a show-high 2.68 rating - easily the highest over-run rating during Mania Season.
> 
> The final segment started with 1.609 million viewers at 11:00 p.m., peaked with 1.758 million viewers at 11:04 p.m. when Bryan attacked Hunter, and went off the air with 1.752 million viewers and 1.643 million viewers


Bryan and HHH knocking it out of the park. :mark::mark::mark:


----------



## Mr. I

Wagg said:


> Bootista's fucked up return had bigger viewership than the go home edition of the 30th anniversary of WM. Dat ratings monster D Bryan. :ti He can move how many hands he wants in the crowd but that will not make him a draw.


Trying too hard.


----------



## Happenstan

THANOS said:


> Actually there are holes in your logic. Bryan has been drawing very well in segments dating back to his tean hell no split last year, which was a good few months before he even faced John Cena at Summerslam and won the title. He was drawing loads of viewers during matches with Wade Barrett, Jack Swagger, Cesaro, The Shield, and Ryback while in his weak link storyline. Not to mention how he was doing in his Wyatt feud. The fact is Bryan doesn't need to be in the main event storyline to draw, he simply draws now wherever he is because he elevates the storyline to main event importance like Cena currently does.
> 
> Most logical people, privy to the information out there, will admit he far surpassed Punk as a ratings draw long ago, is currently second behind Cena in merch, headlines his own live event tour with the Big Show and no one else yet still sells it out, and has increased buyrates from previous years in the majority of Bryan headlined events.
> 
> He's not perfect, and no one is saying he's a megadraw or anything like that, but he's certainly doing amazing so far with this push, showing no signs of slowing down, and has risen much higher than Punk ever did with less than half the push Punk received.


The truth. Live it, learn it, love it but most of all you just got to accept it. 




D.M.N. said:


> 2013 is there simply because Q4 in 2012 was the worst quarter in the company's history in fifteen years, which meant that Q1 in 2013 gained big as a result.


unk unk3 But Cena held him back. :lmao





IDONTSHIV said:


> Bryan and HHH knocking it out of the park. :mark::mark::mark:


Was there ever any doubt? Bryan's been the ratings king for quite a while now.


EDIT: :damn Taker/Lesnar is bombing like Hiroshima.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

BRYAN BRINGING BROBDINGNAGIAN BONANZA!!! :bryan


DAT DRAGON DRAWING DEM DAZZLING DEMOS!!! :dazzler


----------



## LKRocks

Holy fuck Bryan/Hunter is drawing BIG. That's what happens when you have the best babyface facing the best heel. Wrestling 101.

"bu-bu-but small guys can't draw WAAAAAHHHH"


----------



## Sonnen Says

Speaking of lowest in years. The show that did 2.96 3 weeks ago was the lowest rating for RTWM in 18 years.


----------



## Happenstan

LKRocks said:


> Holy fuck Bryan/Hunter is drawing BIG. That's what happens when you have the best babyface facing the best heel. Wrestling 101.
> 
> "bu-bu-but small guys can't draw WAAAAAHHHH"


I got a feeling these ratings are gonna cause WWE to draw this HHH/Bryan story line out further. No, I don't think Bryan is losing either match at Mania but I think they will go the SCSA/Vince route and have HHH keep trying to dethrone Bryan as champion with bigger and bigger opponents and obstacles put in his way. That kind of story writes itself and clearly draws like a mother.




Sonnen Says said:


> Speaking of lowest in years. The show that did 2.96 3 weeks ago was the lowest rating for RTWM in 18 years.


Smells like...desperation.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Looks like Taker/Lesnar couldn't keep the numbers up in the face of the competition they had (read some report that's why Vince had them start the show). Still, it did pretty bad in the grand scheme of things. They completely killed the build and it looks like ratings are reflecting that.

Bryan does golden work with the numbers once again. Heck, it even states the Q5 numbers were decreasing once it looked like Bryan wasn't coming out. And that overrun is pretty fucking high, although I'd expect it to naturally be a little higher than it would be since it's the final Raw segment heading into mania. Great stuff.


----------



## NastyYaffa

Sonnen Says said:


> Speaking of lowest in years. The show that did 2.96 3 weeks ago was the lowest rating for RTWM in 18 years.


You still trying? :lmao


----------



## D.M.N.

Happenstan said:


> I got a feeling these ratings are gonna cause WWE to draw this HHH/Bryan story line out further. No, I don't think Bryan is losing either match at Mania but I think they will go the SCSA/Vince route and have HHH keep trying to dethrone Bryan as champion with bigger and bigger opponents and obstacles put in his way. That kind of story writes itself and clearly draws like a mother.


There were rumours a few weeks back that Vince is going to return to TV after 'Mania, so we'll see what happens.


----------



## #Mark

Wow, these Bryan ratings trends are crazy. Whether it's 9 pm, 10 pm, the overrun.. He's drawing the highest of the show. HHH/Bryan are carrying this Wrestlemania. I can't believe they even entertained the idea of Punk/HHH when Bryan/HHH was easily the hottest match they could do.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

#Mark said:


> Wow, these Bryan ratings trends are crazy. Whether it's 9 pm, 10 pm, the overrun.. He's drawing the highest of the show. HHH/Bryan are carrying this Wrestlemania. I can't believe they even entertained the idea of Punk/HHH when Bryan/HHH was easily the hottest match they could do.


Card should've been Orton/Punk, Trips/Bryan, Taker/Cena, Rock/Brock.

Could've been the best Wrestlemania of all time, especially considering who would've made up the under-card.

Mania will still be good( because of Trips/Bryan and Orton/Batista/Bryan/Trips angle), but it could've been so much more.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

People need to realize that WWE was never going to do Cena/Taker for a PPV they are giving away. There's no way WM 31 (or ones after that) will be included in the network package.


----------



## Happenstan

The Boy Wonder said:


> People need to realize that WWE was never going to do Cena/Taker for a PPV they are giving away. There's no way WM 31 (or ones after that) will be included in the network package.


I think this is the first time in years that Taker's match won't steal the show. I wonder if after Mania is well past if this Brock match will have some kind of effect on Taker wanting to continue at future Wrestlemanias.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Happenstan said:


> I think this is the first time in years that Taker's match won't steal the show. I wonder if after Mania is well past if this Brock match will have some kind of effect on Taker wanting to continue at future Wrestlemanias.


He hasn't 'stole' the show since WM 25. How do you steal the show when everyone already thinks your match will be the best?

Besides, I thought Rock/Cena 1 was the best match @ WM 28.


----------



## Happenstan

CHIcagoMade said:


> He hasn't 'stole' the show since WM 25. How do you steal the show when everyone already thinks your match will be the best?
> 
> Besides, I thought Rock/Cena 1 was the best match @ WM 28.


Ok, fair enough. I used the wrong phrase but you know what I mean.


----------



## Sonnen Says

NastyYaffa said:


> You still trying? :lmao


It's cool to overrate Bryan numbers. Last week did higher than the previous week without him, which shows that HHH is bringing the numbers just as much if not more. Bryan have been in the spotlight since SS with the authority he's supposed to get the highest of the show since he's part of the biggest storyline this year. What people don't seem to know is that it's the lowest ratings for RTWM in 18 years :lmao. With Punk in 2012 it was by the end which he at least had an excuse since the roster had no hype and had zero starpower outside of him and Cena who was ME over him anyway.


----------



## Born of Osiris

The Boy Wonder said:


> People need to realize that WWE was never going to do Cena/Taker for a PPV they are giving away. There's no way WM 31 (or ones after that) will be included in the network package.


The WM31 logo has the play button because it'll be on the Network. WWE isn't that stupid to completely fuck up their investment like that.


----------



## The Buryer

> The over-run drew a show-high 2.68 rating - *easily the highest over-run rating during Mania Season*


Incredible.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

KuroNeko said:


> The WM31 logo has the play button because it'll be on the Network. WWE isn't that stupid to completely fuck up their investment like that.


I really doubt it. After the 6 month commitment is over they will change the plan up.


----------



## #Mark

Sonnen Says said:


> It's cool to overrate Bryan numbers. Last week did higher than the previous week without him, which shows that HHH is bringing the numbers just as much if not more. Bryan have been in the spotlight since SS with the authority he's supposed to get the highest of the show since he's part of the biggest storyline this year. What people don't seem to know is that it's the lowest ratings for RTWM in 18 years :lmao. With Punk in 2012 it was by the end which he at least had an excuse since the roster had no hype and had zero starpower outside of him and Cena who was ME over him anyway.


*Q4 in 2012 was the worst quarter in the company's history in fifteen years*

:ti


----------



## robertdeniro

Taker/Lesnar did good during the RTWM considering they didn't have a great build up and they used it this week against HIMYM finale.

Bryan needs to win the champion,other than that they will kill his momentum.


----------



## Starbuck

DAT GOD BABYFACE BRYAN AND DAT GOD HEEL TRIPLE H CARRYING THE RTWM LIKE THE GOATS THEY ARE

:yes

Leaving everybody else in the dust.

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## tailhook

Happenstan said:


> I got a feeling these ratings are gonna cause WWE to draw this HHH/Bryan story line out further. No, I don't think Bryan is losing either match at Mania but I think they will go the SCSA/Vince route and have HHH keep trying to dethrone Bryan as champion with bigger and bigger opponents and obstacles put in his way. That kind of story writes itself and clearly draws like a mother.


There is no doubt in my mind Bryan loses the match with Hunter and gets inserted by Hogan.

You really have 1.25 matches. You have .25 of a match with Triple H screwjobing a quick win to troll the internet. That's simply to get both guys in the Main Event which immediately follows. Then, the Main Event becomes 4-way Elimination with the last man not to be pinned being the champion and after Orton and Batista are eliminated(in that order), the full actual 5star match of Bryan v Triple H for all the marbles ends the night with Bryan winning clean.

No doubt in my mind thats how it will break down. The first match is purely a setup match to finalize the main event. If they try any type of early 5star Triple H v Bryan match, it'll make the ME anticlimactic.


----------



## Sonnen Says

#Mark said:


> *Q4 in 2012 was the worst quarter in the company's history in fifteen years*
> 
> :ti


*Q1 for RTWM in 2014 is the lowest quarter in the company's history in 18 years *

:ti


Getting low numbers in RTWM is much and much worse than in a quarter that is known to be always getting the lowest of the year. Plus if the show in 2012 was a 2 hours show it would have gotten better ratings since the roster was very thin and had no hype whatsoever. I'm telling it like it is .


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Sonnen Says said:


> Speaking of lowest in years. The show that did 2.96 3 weeks ago was the lowest rating for RTWM in 18 years.


Enough already dude. Just accept the fact that Bryan is consistently drawing numbers Punk was never capable of.


----------



## LKRocks

D-Bry and Hunter carrying Wrestlemania on their back. Incredible. I never thought that Bryan would become this big of a monster draw.


----------



## #Mark

Sonnen Says said:


> *Q1 for RTWM in 2014 is the lowest quarter in the company's history in 18 years *
> 
> :ti
> 
> 
> Getting low numbers in RTWM is much and much worse than in a quarter that is known to be always getting the lowest of the year. Plus if the show in 2012 was a 2 hours show it would have gotten better ratings since the roster was very thin and had no hype whatsoever. I'm telling it like it is .


:lmao

No it isn't. It isn't even close to the lowest in 18 years, in fact it's the same as last year and Rock isn't even on TV :lol

Only one show did poor and that was because St.Patrick's day fell on a monday this year. I can't believe you're resorting to making up stuff to fit your agenda now :lmao


----------



## NastyYaffa

Sonnen Says said:


> *Q1 for RTWM in 2014 is the lowest quarter in the company's history in 18 years *
> 
> :ti
> 
> 
> Getting low numbers in RTWM is much and much worse than in a quarter that is known to be always getting the lowest of the year. Plus if the show in 2012 was a 2 hours show it would have gotten better ratings since the roster was very thin and had no hype whatsoever. I'm telling it like it is .


Lmao man, you are the greatest. :lmao:lmao:lmao


----------



## tailhook

The Boy Wonder said:


> I really doubt it. After the 6 month commitment is over they will change the plan up.


Doesn't work. In business terms, they would need to give 6 months notice to all customers that they were changing the plan up in order for them to decide whether they want to drop it or not. Otherwise they'd have a class-action lawsuit for bait and switch on their hands.

Either way, they aren't giving the pay-per-views away, they're charging $10 a month. They're looking to go from selling 200k, $50-60 tickets... to selling say 1-1.2 million $10 tickets. Anything over 1.2 million subs and they're making money. And if they even pull a third of Netflix's numbers, they'll be rolling in cash. Its simply changing up the game in order to provide a much higher ceiling for possible revenue. Pretty simple stuff.

Also, the 6-month commitment is horseshit. It charges month-to-month, simply cancel your debit card or remove it from Paypal if you want to cancel.. there is not a thing they can do about it. Any legal remedy would cost them more than simply cancelling you.


----------



## Sonnen Says

TheGMofGods said:


> Enough already dude. Just accept the fact that Bryan is consistently drawing numbers Punk was never capable of.


You again fpalm. Punk did higher in 2013 stop acting like you know the facts, I guess it's cool to be so clueless about things. 



#Mark said:


> :lmao
> 
> No it isn't. It isn't even close to the lowest in 18 years, in fact it's the same as last year and Rock isn't even on TV :lol
> 
> Only one show did poor and that was because St.Patrick's day fell on a monday this year. I can't believe you're resorting to making up stuff to fit your agenda now :lmao


Yes it is. Not just for one week for weeks. Just look for yourself http://www.gerweck.net/tv-ratings/

No matter how many times you want to believe that the gains is all on Bryan, fact is he was/is in the spotlight with the authority and WWE title scene since SS. He's part of the biggest storyline of the year, and it's not a big deal because after WM he might not have HHH or the authority to make sure he's in the spotlight, it will not be good for Bryan. 

You want to resort to 2012 numbers when you know exactly the big gap of starpower. If Bryan was in Punk shoes it will be just as low and you know that for a fact. Punk was in the wrong place at a bad time. In 2013 it had Punk, Cena, adding HHH, Bryan, Orton, Wyatts, Sheild, Authority, and a strong tag division. In 2012 it was just Punk and Cena and none of the above. If Punk had any of the above it wouldn't be as low it's a guarantee. Why is it so hard to understand. Punk got nowhere near the booking and starpower Bryan is getting now. Fact is Punk was still having the highest of the night every week in those low ratings with Cena. Others were losing millions of viewers and WWE couldn't do anything about it because they didn't have any build stars to rely on. It's their fault not Punk. TV ratings didn't reflect on the buys tho because it got higher than this year and last year, so much drawing power from Bryan I see :lol. All this ratings you guys talk about wouldn't mean shit if buys don't do well.


----------



## #Mark

2013 popped four enormous ratings but those coincided with interest in Rock's title run. Other than the four big ratings, the shows were very similar. Lots of 3.0's, 3.1's, and 3.2's. I didn't realize how big of a ratings pop Rock as champion was but that is to be expected since he single handily produced over a million buys two years in a row for Mania. But, if you compare 2014 starting from the build to the Rumble to 2012 at the same starting point 2014 averages higher ratings. That shows last year was more of an anomaly if anything.

So no, it isn't the lowest in 18 years, it's the lowest since 2012. I'm sensing a common theme here..


----------



## Sweettre15

*Source:* _PWTorch_

*Raw TV Ratings Break Down (m18-49)
*
- Overall Show Average: 2.10 rating / 1.3 million viewers

*- Q1: Raw opened with a weak 1.85 rating for the opening segment, which was Undertaker and Brock Lesnar's final exchange before WrestleMania.
*
Taker-Lesnar peaked with 1.288 million viewers at 8:12 p.m., below the show average.

*- Q2: Raw fell to a show-low 1.66 rating for two commercials and the first-half of IC champion Big E. vs. Alberto Del Rio.
*
*- Q3: Raw jumped to a 2.04 rating for the end of the match, one commercial, and the Wyatts delivering a message to John Cena.
*
The second-half with the Wyatts popped the quarter-hour rating, peaking with 1.433 million viewers at 8;41 p.m.
*
- Q4: Raw increased to a 2.09 rating as Raw built momentum heading to the top of the hour. The segment included Summer Rae vs. Natalya, one commercial, and the first-half of The Authority's speech.*

***

*- Q5: Raw popped a 2.55 rating for the second-half of Triple H and Stephanie McMahon teasing a Bryan appearance, plus one commercial at the end of the segment.
*
The segment built from 1.543 million viewers at 9:00 p.m. to a peak of 1.736 million viewers at 9:07 p.m. Batista and Randy Orton interrupted, then it became apparent Bryan was not coming out, which led to the audience tapering off to 1.658 million viewers when Raw went to break at 9:11 p.m.

*- Q6: Raw began a Second Hour Slide to a 2.14 rating for an eight-man tag match centered on the top WWE tag teams, plus one commercial.

- Q7: Raw slid to a 2.03 rating for the end of the tag match, one-and-a-half commercials, and Rhodes Bros. vs. Damien Sandow & Fandango.

- Q8: Raw dipped to a 2.01 rating for Bray Wyatt vs. R-Truth and one-and-a-half commercials.

***

- Q9: Raw rebounded to a 2.17 rating at the top of the Third Hour for John Cena's post-match sneak-up on the Wyatts, one commercial, and A.J. Lee vs. Naomi.*

The quarter-hour peaked with 1.554 million viewers at 10:02 p.m. for Cena sneaking up on the Wyatts.

*- Q10: Raw dipped to a 2.09 rating for various videos, WM30 hype, and one commercial.

- Q11: Raw slightly increased to a 2.12 rating for Roman Reigns vs. Kane, one commercial, and the first-half of the Piper's Pit segment.
*
The end of Reigns-Kane and this portion of Piper's Pit were evenly matched. The match peaked with 1.499 million viewers and Pit peaked with 1.490 million viewers.

*- Q12: Raw increased to a 2.21 rating for the second-half of Piper's Pit, one commercial, and the first-half of the original WrestleMania main event of Randy Orton vs. Batista.
*
The segment was boosted by the second-half of the Pit, which peaked with 1.619 million viewers at 10:48 p.m. By comparison, the first-half of the main event hit 1.519 million viewers at 10:59 p.m.

*- Over-run: The over-run drew a show-high 2.68 rating - easily the highest over-run rating during Mania Season.
*
The final segment started with 1.609 million viewers at 11:00 p.m., peaked with 1.758 million viewers at 11:04 p.m. when Bryan attacked Hunter, and went off the air with 1.752 million viewers and 1.643 million viewers.[/I]

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_77409.shtml


----------



## RebelArch86

Sweettre15 said:


> *Source:* _PWTorch_
> 
> *Raw TV Ratings Break Down (m18-49)
> *
> - Overall Show Average: 2.10 rating / 1.3 million viewers
> 
> *- Q1: Raw opened with a weak 1.85 rating for the opening segment, which was Undertaker and Brock Lesnar's final exchange before WrestleMania.
> *
> Taker-Lesnar peaked with 1.288 million viewers at 8:12 p.m., below the show average.
> 
> *- Q2: Raw fell to a show-low 1.66 rating for two commercials and the first-half of IC champion Big E. vs. Alberto Del Rio.
> *
> *- Q3: Raw jumped to a 2.04 rating for the end of the match, one commercial, and the Wyatts delivering a message to John Cena.
> *
> The second-half with the Wyatts popped the quarter-hour rating, peaking with 1.433 million viewers at 8;41 p.m.
> *
> - Q4: Raw increased to a 2.09 rating as Raw built momentum heading to the top of the hour. The segment included Summer Rae vs. Natalya, one commercial, and the first-half of The Authority's speech.*
> 
> ***
> 
> *- Q5: Raw popped a 2.55 rating for the second-half of Triple H and Stephanie McMahon teasing a Bryan appearance, plus one commercial at the end of the segment.
> *
> The segment built from 1.543 million viewers at 9:00 p.m. to a peak of 1.736 million viewers at 9:07 p.m. Batista and Randy Orton interrupted, then it became apparent Bryan was not coming out, which led to the audience tapering off to 1.658 million viewers when Raw went to break at 9:11 p.m.
> 
> *- Q6: Raw began a Second Hour Slide to a 2.14 rating for an eight-man tag match centered on the top WWE tag teams, plus one commercial.
> 
> - Q7: Raw slid to a 2.03 rating for the end of the tag match, one-and-a-half commercials, and Rhodes Bros. vs. Damien Sandow & Fandango.
> 
> - Q8: Raw dipped to a 2.01 rating for Bray Wyatt vs. R-Truth and one-and-a-half commercials.
> 
> ***
> 
> - Q9: Raw rebounded to a 2.17 rating at the top of the Third Hour for John Cena's post-match sneak-up on the Wyatts, one commercial, and A.J. Lee vs. Naomi.*
> 
> The quarter-hour peaked with 1.554 million viewers at 10:02 p.m. for Cena sneaking up on the Wyatts.
> 
> *- Q10: Raw dipped to a 2.09 rating for various videos, WM30 hype, and one commercial.
> 
> - Q11: Raw slightly increased to a 2.12 rating for Roman Reigns vs. Kane, one commercial, and the first-half of the Piper's Pit segment.
> *
> The end of Reigns-Kane and this portion of Piper's Pit were evenly matched. The match peaked with 1.499 million viewers and Pit peaked with 1.490 million viewers.
> 
> *- Q12: Raw increased to a 2.21 rating for the second-half of Piper's Pit, one commercial, and the first-half of the original WrestleMania main event of Randy Orton vs. Batista.
> *
> The segment was boosted by the second-half of the Pit, which peaked with 1.619 million viewers at 10:48 p.m. By comparison, the first-half of the main event hit 1.519 million viewers at 10:59 p.m.
> 
> *- Over-run: The over-run drew a show-high 2.68 rating - easily the highest over-run rating during Mania Season.
> *
> The final segment started with 1.609 million viewers at 11:00 p.m., peaked with 1.758 million viewers at 11:04 p.m. when Bryan attacked Hunter, and went off the air with 1.752 million viewers and 1.643 million viewers.[/I]
> 
> http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_77409.shtml


Damn d Bry has become the barometer reporters review the ratings around


----------



## purple_gloves

LKRocks said:


> Holy fuck Bryan/Hunter is drawing BIG. *That's what happens when you have the best babyface facing the best heel. Wrestling 101.*
> 
> "bu-bu-but small guys can't draw WAAAAAHHHH"




This is it in a nutshell. Over babyface chasing the title and feuding with one of the best heels of all time. This is how you make a star. It seems they could finally be fully behind someone. First time since Cena and it's no surprise that this feud is drawing.

Just to set the record straight for some of the "Punk can't draw" crowd, Punk was never pushed like Bryan. And before you speak too soon about Bryan's ability to draw, let's wait until later in the year when, as champ, he's feuding with the likes of ADR, Ziggler, Miz and Ryback before proclaiming that he's a bigger draw than Punk.

Another thing, which I find a bit strange, is why everyone seems to have picked a side? If you like Bryan, you bash Punk, and vice versa. Isn't it possible to like them both and just be realistic about the ratings situation? I like Bryan and hope he goes on to become a huge star, but as a rational person I can see they were clearly never fully behind Punk and dropped the ball with him time and time again. Nobody becomes a star in wwe without a green light push from Vince.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Sonnen Says said:


> You again fpalm. Punk did higher in 2013 stop acting like you know the facts, I guess it's cool to be so clueless about things.


I do know the facts here. The fact here is that you are incredibly biased when it comes to punk and you will make up any bullshit you can think of just to save face. Punk did not draw better than Bryan. The numbers punk did where the result of being a part of feuds with people who were bigger stars than him. On his own, he wasn't drawing anywhere near those numbers. And guess what? Bryan on his ownis still drawing large numbers. There's evidence in the last few pages that prove Bryan is a bigger draw than punk ever was. Stop embarrassing yourself and get over it already.


----------



## funnyfaces1

GOAT drew 1.1 million viewers in a match against Sheamus. There's proof unk


----------



## wb1899

USA IS #1 CABLE NETWORK IN Q1 FOR AN UNPRECEDENTED 9TH CONSECUTIVE YEAR

The Network Marks Its Youngest Quarter Since 2009

NEWYORK, NY - April, 2 2014 - For the 9th consecutive year, USA is the #1 cable network in first quarter among total viewers P2+ (2.38MM), with a double digit lead over the closest competitor. Fueled by a young audience for MODERN FAMILY, SUITS, WWE and the new reality series CHRISLEY KNOWS BEST, USA also tied for #1 in P18-34 delivery this quarter (522,000) and was one of only two networks to break 1 million in P18-49 (1.02MM) and P25-54 (1.05). The quarter was the network's youngest since 2009, with a median age of 47.4, and nearly five years younger than the network's median age in 1Q13.

A snapshot of the first quarter is below:
[...]
WWE MONDAY NIGHT RAW was the most watched entertainment show on cable Monday nights in 1Q14, averaging more than 4 million total viewers P2+ (4.84MM). The program was also cable's top entertainer Monday nights for male viewers in every demo (M18-49/25-54/18-34/2+). USA was the #1 network in all of television's Monday night primetime this quarter for M18-34 and outperformed every cable network in P18-49, P25-54, P18-34, and total viewers P2+.
[...]
Note: Time period data represent the most current combination of Live+7 (12/30/13-3/16/14), Live+3 (3/17-3/27/14), and Live+SD (3/28-3/30/14) unless otherwise indicated.


----------



## Sonnen Says

TheGMofGods said:


> I do know the facts here. The fact here is that you are incredibly biased when it comes to punk and *you will make up any bullshit* you can think of just to save face. Punk did not draw better than Bryan. The numbers punk did where the result of being a part of feuds with people who were bigger stars than him. On his own, he wasn't drawing anywhere near those numbers. And guess what? *Bryan on his ownis still drawing large numbers.* There's evidence in the last few pages that prove Bryan is a bigger draw than punk ever was. Stop embarrassing yourself and get over it already.


Thats BS. When was Bryan on his own. He's been feuding with the authority and been in the title picture with Cena, Orton, and constantly with HHH, the authority, Wyatts and The Shield since SS you dummy. He wasn't having matches with jobbers and low midcarders all those he was feuding with are legit main attraction of the show and just as credible (Wyatts, and Shield). He's been protected. Punk was just gaining as much with Wyatts and Shield so get a clue. So clearly you're the one who's been biased here. 

Punk on his own gained a million views with Sheamus, Axel/Ryback, ADR and segments of his own. He was drawing million views in the 10 pm back in 2013 3 or 4 weeks in a row with no Taker, Cena, Rock, etc. 



#Mark said:


> 2013 popped four enormous ratings but those coincided with interest in Rock's title run. Other than the four big ratings, the shows were very similar. Lots of 3.0's, 3.1's, and 3.2's. I didn't realize how big of a ratings pop Rock as champion was but that is to be expected since he single handily produced over a million buys two years in a row for Mania. But, if you compare 2014 starting from the build to the Rumble to 2012 at the same starting point 2014 averages higher ratings. That shows last year was more of an anomaly if anything.
> 
> * So no, it isn't the lowest in 18 years, it's the lowest since 2012. I'm sensing a common theme here..*


No 2012 was just a little bit higher than 2014. Especially after this year got 2.97 and 3.07 just few weeks back which the year prior that got 3.29 and 3.1 in comparison and yeah this year got a higher go home run show but the previous weeks got higher in 2012. Either ways it's very close but 2012 got a lil bit higher. So again it's the lowest RTWM in 18 years.


----------



## D.M.N.

wb1899 said:


> USA IS #1 CABLE NETWORK IN Q1 FOR AN UNPRECEDENTED 9TH CONSECUTIVE YEAR
> 
> The Network Marks Its Youngest Quarter Since 2009
> 
> NEWYORK, NY - April, 2 2014 - For the 9th consecutive year, USA is the #1 cable network in first quarter among total viewers P2+ (2.38MM), with a double digit lead over the closest competitor. Fueled by a young audience for MODERN FAMILY, SUITS, WWE and the new reality series CHRISLEY KNOWS BEST, USA also tied for #1 in P18-34 delivery this quarter (522,000) and was one of only two networks to break 1 million in P18-49 (1.02MM) and P25-54 (1.05). The quarter was the network's youngest since 2009, with a median age of 47.4, and nearly five years younger than the network's median age in 1Q13.
> 
> A snapshot of the first quarter is below:
> [...]
> WWE MONDAY NIGHT RAW was the most watched entertainment show on cable Monday nights in 1Q14, averaging more than 4 million total viewers P2+ (4.84MM). The program was also cable's top entertainer Monday nights for male viewers in every demo (M18-49/25-54/18-34/2+). USA was the #1 network in all of television's Monday night primetime this quarter for M18-34 and outperformed every cable network in P18-49, P25-54, P18-34, and total viewers P2+.
> [...]
> Note: Time period data represent the most current combination of Live+7 (12/30/13-3/16/14), Live+3 (3/17-3/27/14), and Live+SD (3/28-3/30/14) unless otherwise indicated.


Last year:

NEW YORK - March 19, 2013 - For the 8th consecutive year, USA is #1 cable network among total viewers (3 million) and P25-54 (1.2 million) in the first quarter, earning it the distinction as the most-watched network. Marking a victory no other cable entertainment network has achieved before, this is the 27th quarter that USA is #1 in total viewers (P2+).
[...]
· WWE MONDAY NIGHT RAW made USA the #1 cable network in its Monday 8p-11p timeslot across all key demos in 1Q13. The series saw double digit gains over its 4Q12 performance in all key demos: up 20% in P18-49 (2.3 million), 18% in P25-54 (2.3 million), 14% in P18-34 (1.2 million) and up 16% in total viewers P2+ (4.9 million) in 1Q13 versus 4Q12.
[...]
Note: Data reflects blend of Live+7 for 12/31/12-3/3/13, Live+3 for 3/4-3/13/13 and Live+SD for 3/14-3/16/13.


----------



## Happenstan

purple_gloves said:


> This is it in a nutshell. Over babyface chasing the title and feuding with one of the best heels of all time. This is how you make a star. It seems they could finally be fully behind someone. First time since Cena and it's no surprise that this feud is drawing.
> 
> Just to set the record straight for some of the "Punk can't draw" crowd, *Punk was never pushed like Bryan.* And before you speak too soon about Bryan's ability to draw, let's wait until later in the year when, as champ, he's feuding with the likes of ADR, Ziggler, Miz and Ryback before proclaiming that he's a bigger draw than Punk.
> 
> Another thing, which I find a bit strange, is why everyone seems to have picked a side? If you like Bryan, you bash Punk, and vice versa. Isn't it possible to like them both and just be realistic about the ratings situation? I like Bryan and hope he goes on to become a huge star, but as a rational person I can see they were clearly never fully behind Punk and dropped the ball with him time and time again. Nobody becomes a star in wwe without a green light push from Vince.


We'll just agree to disagree about that first bolded steaming bit o' bullshit. As for why people pick sides...Punktards. They started this childish nonsense last year when Bryan was given the Authority storyline and every Punk fan here made multiple threads (like 10 a day, no joke) about how Bryan didn't deserve his shot. They then followed that gem up with practically demanding WWE put the quitter in Bryan's place and kick Bryan to the curb. Karma is a bitch though as Punk is now gone and Bryan has surpassed him without even burning through 1/10th of potential feud opponents. You kinda get what you give in this world. Bryan achieves Punk's dream of closing a Mania while the baby runs home to "propose" to AJ....as if they will last longer than a year. Punk's cheated on past gfs. I doubt they even make it to a wedding.


----------



## Beatles123

Well, Punk WOULD have been a lot bigger than he was--which WAS still big--if WWE hadn'y fucked it all up with the Nash BS.


----------



## purple_gloves

Happenstan said:


> We'll just agree to disagree about that first bolded steaming bit o' bullshit. As for why people pick sides...Punktards. They started this childish nonsense last year when Bryan was given the Authority storyline and every Punk fan here made multiple threads (like 10 a day, no joke) about how Bryan didn't deserve his shot. They then followed that gem up with practically demanding WWE put the quitter in Bryan's place and kick Bryan to the curb. Karma is a bitch though as Punk is now gone and Bryan has surpassed him without even burning through 1/10th of potential feud opponents. You kinda get what you give in this world. Bryan achieves Punk's dream of closing a Mania while the baby runs home to "propose" to AJ....as if they will last longer than a year. Punk's cheated on past gfs. I doubt they even make it to a wedding.


I'll take 2 things from this.

1. You really can't stand CM Punk.

2. You don't know how WWE and Vince works. If you did you'd agree that Punk was never pushed like Bryan. I can't be bothered to go through everything, but think of it like this.....they have given the audience a reason to rally round Bryan, they never did with Punk.


----------



## Londrick

Yeah Bryan's the one who's got the better push. Feuding with Taker, Brock and Rock mean nothing when you're feuding with the Wyatts, and Authority. :ti


----------



## Beatles123

Honestly why does it matter, yo? They both are GOAT and deserve the same success and praise.


----------



## THANOS

Londrick said:


> Yeah Bryan's the one who's got the better push. Feuding with Taker, Brock and Rock mean nothing when you're feuding with the Wyatts, and Authority. :ti


This, and the fact that Bryan was drawing better ratings during his weak link storyline than Punk was as Champion feuding with Miz, Ziggler, and Del Rio. I would say the likes of Barrett, and the Real Americans were less established when Bryan was feuding with them than the group above that Punk was feuding with, and as champion no less.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Londrick said:


> Yeah Bryan's the one who's got the better push. Feuding with Taker, Brock and Rock mean nothing when you're feuding with the Wyatts, and Authority. :ti



THIS. Anyone who thinks Bryan was pushed better than Punk has forgotten the Authority angle was created to put heat on HHH and Orton, Bryan was replaced by Big Show and then paired with The Wyatts when they werent getting crowd reactions. They then kept him out of The Rumble. Bryan finally started getting his big push after EC, but ,until then, he was slated for an undercard Mania match. To pretend that the Authority angle was always intended to culminate with Bryan as the Mania main event is the height of revisionism.


----------



## robertdeniro

IDONTSHIV said:


> THIS. Anyone who thinks Bryan was pushed better than Punk has forgotten the Authority angle was created to put heat on HHH and Orton, Bryan was replaced by Big Show and then paired with The Wyatts when they werent getting crowd reactions. They then kept him out of The Rumble. Bryan finally started getting his big push after EC, but ,until then, he was slated for an undercard Mania match. To pretend that the Authority angle was always intended to culminate with Bryan as the Mania main event is the height of revisionism.


The crowd reaction made Bryan the star that he is today because i'm sure without the fans support he would be a mid carder now if not lower.It's a shame because that's how WWE thinks of Bryan.


----------



## purple_gloves

Londrick said:


> Yeah Bryan's the one who's got the better push. Feuding with Taker, Brock and Rock mean nothing when you're feuding with the Wyatts, and Authority. :ti



You're missing one important point. The heel/face dynamic in wrestling.

Bryan is being booked as an underdog babyface, fighting against the odds. He's currently feuding with one of the best heels of all time, in a WM program, chasing the title, and could end up wrestling twice at WM fucking 30! If that's not a reason to rally behind someone, I don't know what is. That's wrestling 101. That's the sort of push you give someone you're trying to make a star out of.

Punk went against HHH, who remained face throughout, in a cluster fuck of a feud that somehow ended with HHH/Nash in a TLC match. Against The Rock as a cowardly heel (and I'd be willing to bet he only held the title for as long to try and make Rock's title win seem more legit). Against Taker as a cowardly heel in a feud that was clearly only designed to give Taker a mania opponent. As a babyface champ he feuded with ADR, Miz and Ziggler while playing 2nd fiddle to Cena. This is not the sort of push you give someone you're trying to make a star out of. 

They've never given the audience a real reason to rally behind Punk and that's the difference. That tells me they never intended to make a star out of Punk. When you don't have Vince's backing, you don't become a star. Simple as that. 

As for Bryan drawing better than Punk against nobodies, I'm not buying that. Not yet anyway. Some of the Hell No segments lost plenty of viewers for a start. And Punk HAS pulled in good numbers against nobodies occasionally.


----------



## #Mark

Sonnen Says said:


> Thats BS. When was Bryan on his own. He's been feuding with the authority and been in the title picture with Cena, Orton, and constantly with HHH, the authority, Wyatts and The Shield since SS you dummy. He wasn't having matches with jobbers and low midcarders all those he was feuding with are legit main attraction of the show and just as credible (Wyatts, and Shield). He's been protected. Punk was just gaining as much with Wyatts and Shield so get a clue. So clearly you're the one who's been biased here.
> 
> Punk on his own gained a million views with Sheamus, Axel/Ryback, ADR and segments of his own. He was drawing million views in the 10 pm back in 2013 3 or 4 weeks in a row with no Taker, Cena, Rock, etc.
> 
> 
> 
> No 2012 was just a little bit higher than 2014. Especially after this year got 2.97 and 3.07 just few weeks back which the year prior that got 3.29 and 3.1 in comparison and yeah this year got a higher go home run show but the previous weeks got higher in 2012. Either ways it's very close but 2012 got a lil bit higher. So again it's the lowest RTWM in 18 years.


2012 got a 2.86 in January, 3.01 in February, and an abysmal 3.05 on the go home. 2014 averages out better than 2012, and the sad thing is 2012 was a two hour show then so the averages should be significantly higher.


----------



## #Mark

purple_gloves said:


> You're missing one important point. The heel/face dynamic in wrestling.
> 
> Bryan is being booked as an underdog babyface, fighting against the odds. He's currently feuding with one of the best heels of all time, in a WM program, chasing the title, and could end up wrestling twice at WM fucking 30! If that's not a reason to rally behind someone, I don't know what is. That's wrestling 101. That's the sort of push you give someone you're trying to make a star out of.
> 
> Punk went against HHH, who remained face throughout, in a cluster fuck of a feud that somehow ended with HHH/Nash in a TLC match. Against The Rock as a cowardly heel (and I'd be willing to bet he only held the title for as long to try and make Rock's title win seem more legit). Against Taker as a cowardly heel in a feud that was clearly only designed to give Taker a mania opponent. As a babyface champ he feuded with ADR, Miz and Ziggler while playing 2nd fiddle to Cena. This is not the sort of push you give someone you're trying to make a star out of.
> 
> They've never given the audience a real reason to rally behind Punk and that's the difference. That tells me they never intended to make a star out of Punk. When you don't have Vince's backing, you don't become a star. Simple as that.
> 
> As for Bryan drawing better than Punk against nobodies, I'm not buying that. Not yet anyway. Some of the Hell No segments lost plenty of viewers for a start. And Punk HAS pulled in good numbers against nobodies occasionally.


Bryan wasn't pushed during Team Hell No so those numbers are moot. Punk was gaining terrible overrun numbers during the Summer of Punk but I wouldn't use that as an indictment on him because that was before he was made a star. Fact is, as a heel from july to January RAW was a very CM Punk centric show. He was in the top angles, multiple segments and the show revolved around him. Cena wasn't main eventing PPVs over him then. So while Bryan has gotten the spotlight as a babyface the past two months (despite how terribly booked he was during the fall) Punk was given the spotlight as a heel which is what he and his fans prefer. WWE gave Punk a better push than they did Bryan until the fans revolted at the Rumble and forced their hands. The fact remains that in top angles Punk was never moving ratings like Bryan.


----------



## Happenstan

#Mark said:


> 2012 got a 2.86 in January, 3.01 in February, and an abysmal 3.05 on the go home. 2014 averages out better than 2012, and the sad thing is 2012 was a two hour show then so the averages should be significantly higher.


Why are you even bothering? It's Sonnen.


----------



## purple_gloves

#Mark said:


> Bryan wasn't pushed during Team Hell No so those numbers are moot. Punk was gaining terrible overrun numbers during the Summer of Punk but I wouldn't use that as an indictment on him because that was before he was made a star. Fact is, as a heel from july to January RAW was a very CM Punk centric show. He was in the top angles, multiple segments and the show revolved around him. Cena wasn't main eventing PPVs over him then. So while Bryan has gotten the spotlight as a babyface the past two months (despite how terribly booked he was during the fall) Punk was given the spotlight as a heel which is what he and his fans prefer. WWE gave Punk a better push than they did Bryan until the fans revolted at the Rumble and forced their hands. The fact remains that in top angles Punk was never moving ratings like Bryan.



I'm not disputing Bryan only getting his push after fan pressure following the rumble. That's clearly true. Well partly true. Punk leaving has obviously taken the option of Punk/HHH at WM away from them. Everything has aligned nicely for Bryan it seems. I don't for one second believe they anticipated the reaction to Batista winning the rumble.

But my point is, regardless of the circumstances leading to it, Bryan has been placed in a very favourable position that CM Punk never had the opportunity to benefit from. An underdog babyface, chasing the title, in a mania feud against a top quality heel. Now that is a push! Bryan's reaping the rewards with some decent numbers. Good on him. I like Bryan and I'm loving this feud, but there's no doubt in my mind, that given the same situation, Punk would be drawing just as well.

I just hope they don't pull the rug from under him and drop him down the card when this feud is over.


----------



## Choke2Death

Happenstan said:


> Why are you even bothering? It's Sonnen.


Yeah, lol. I got bored of saying the same things that go over his head and as you can notice, I hardly post in here anymore.


----------



## Happenstan

purple_gloves said:


> I'm not disputing Bryan only getting his push after fan pressure following the rumble. That's clearly true. Well partly true. Punk leaving has obviously taken the option of Punk/HHH at WM away from them. Everything has aligned nicely for Bryan it seems. I don't for one second believe they anticipated the reaction to Batista winning the rumble.
> 
> But my point is, regardless of the circumstances leading to it, Bryan has been placed in a very favourable position that CM Punk never had the opportunity to benefit from. An underdog babyface, chasing the title, in a mania feud against a top quality heel. Now that is a push! Bryan's reaping the rewards with some decent numbers. Good on him. I like Bryan and I'm loving this feud, but there's no doubt in my mind, that given the same situation, Punk would be drawing just as well.
> 
> I just hope they don't pull the rug from under him and drop him down the card when this feud is over.



Punk was one of the rare few of this generation to get to feud with Vince Mcmahon and he still shit the bed compared to Bryan. It is what it is. You don't have to like it but at some point you are gonna have to accept the reality of the situation.


----------



## purple_gloves

And just to add one more thing, don't underestimate the impact HHH is having on some of these gains. He has been truly outstanding as a heel in this feud.


----------



## purple_gloves

Happenstan said:


> Punk was one of the rare few of this generation to get to feud with Vince Mcmahon and he still shit the bed compared to Bryan. It is what it is. You don't have to like it but at some point you are gonna have to accept the reality of the situation.


What on earth are you on about? Has Punk shafted your mum or something?

You're clearly the one struggling with the reality of the situation. I wouldn't give a shit if Bryan outdrew Punk in every segment ever. I'm just telling it as it is.


----------



## Happenstan

purple_gloves said:


> What on earth are you on about? Has Punk shafted your mum or something?
> 
> You're clearly the one struggling with the reality of the situation. I wouldn't give a shit if Bryan outdrew Punk in every segment ever. I'm just telling it as it is.


It's really not hard to follow. Punk got to feud with Vince pretty early on in his main event run and he still drew terribly after that. Those who have feuded with Vince in the past drew great. Austin obviously back in the day to Orton in 09, yet Punk got no traction whatsoever with and from that. You also might want to be careful with those insults. I've been temp banned for much less.


----------



## purple_gloves

Happenstan said:


> It's really not hard to follow. Punk got to feud with Vince pretty early on in his main event run and he still drew terribly after that. Those who have feuded with Vince in the past drew great. Austin obviously back in the day to Orton in 09, yet Punk got no traction whatsoever with and from that. You also might want to be careful with those insults. I've been temp banned for much less.


He had one match with Vince didn't he? Hardly a feud. It gained massively too as I recall.


----------



## Happenstan

purple_gloves said:


> He had one match with Vince didn't he? Hardly a feud. It gained massively too as I recall.


And the 09 thing with Orton was really just Orton punting Vince but that 1 segment got Orton over huge then. Of course HHH then buried Orton right after but still. Punk gained nothing from working with Vince and that was unheard of prior.

EDIT: Discussion curbed. This is the wrong thread and I'm sick of talking about a has been that turned out to really be more of a never was.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

It's hard for some to accept. The mark wars have ended and Bryan won. It's his time now. Punk is old news at this point and it's time to move on.


----------



## purple_gloves

Wow. Some real CM Punk hate in this thread nowadays! :shocked:


----------



## CHIcagoMade

purple_gloves said:


> I'm not disputing Bryan only getting his push after fan pressure following the rumble. That's clearly true. Well partly true. Punk leaving has obviously taken the option of Punk/HHH at WM away from them. Everything has aligned nicely for Bryan it seems. I don't for one second believe they anticipated the reaction to Batista winning the rumble.
> 
> But my point is, regardless of the circumstances leading to it, Bryan has been placed in a very favourable position that CM Punk never had the opportunity to benefit from. An underdog babyface, chasing the title, in a mania feud against a top quality heel. Now that is a push! Bryan's reaping the rewards with some decent numbers. Good on him. I like Bryan and I'm loving this feud, but there's no doubt in my mind, that given the same situation, Punk would be drawing just as well.
> 
> I just hope they don't pull the rug from under him and drop him down the card when this feud is over.


But Punk sucks as a face, so no it would not have worked as well. He doesn't have the same personality Bryan has.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Sonnen Says said:


> Thats BS. When was Bryan on his own. He's been feuding with the authority and been in the title picture with Cena, Orton, and constantly with HHH, the authority, Wyatts and The Shield since SS you dummy. He wasn't having matches with jobbers and low midcarders all those he was feuding with are legit main attraction of the show and just as credible (Wyatts, and Shield). He's been protected. Punk was just gaining as much with Wyatts and Shield so get a clue. So clearly you're the one who's been biased here.


Wait so now we're talking about 2012? I thought we were just talking about 2013? You can't just change the argument around like this. It doesn't work like that. Either stick with 2013 or debate some other time on why Punk drew good numbers in 2012. 

When was Bryan on his own? How about when he drew a million viewers while facing Jack Swagger, Antonio Cesaro and fucking Ryback? These aren't low mid carders? Because in terms of drawing power they sure as hell are. Get the fuck out of here with that he's been protected bullshit. 

Lol at me being the biased one. Cm Punk is one of my favorite wrestlers and I'm being biased against Cm Punk. That's fucking hilarious. Seriously, just stop already. Bryan's a bigger draw. You need to get over that fact.


----------



## funnyfaces1

If Punk is a has been, then why is he still the second most over wrestler even after leaving? unk


----------



## Sonnen Says

TheGMofGods said:


> Wait so now we're talking about 2012? I thought we were just talking about 2013? You can't just change the argument around like this. It doesn't work like that. Either stick with 2013 or debate some other time on why Punk drew good numbers in 2012.
> 
> When was Bryan on his own? How about when he drew a million viewers while facing Jack Swagger, Antonio Cesaro and fucking Ryback? These aren't low mid carders? Because in terms of drawing power they sure as hell are. Get the fuck out of here with that he's been protected bullshit.
> 
> Lol at me being the biased one. Cm Punk is one of my favorite wrestlers and I'm being biased against Cm Punk. That's fucking hilarious. Seriously, just stop already. Bryan's a bigger draw. You need to get over that fact.


I was just talking about 13 so you're wrong once again. Only mentioned Sheamus just to show an example. 

No he wasn't on his own whether you like to admit or not, 99% of time he was with either HHH, Cena, HBK (for a little while), Authority, Orton, Shield, and Wyatts. Are you actually denying that :lmao. Just own it, fact is Bryan was protected. He was never on his own get it in your thick skull and stop denying the truth. WWE made sure they will do it the right way this time and not fuck it up like they did with Punk back in 11. 

So what?! Punk did as well with guys like Ryback, Axel, ADR, etc. the same year and no Ryback, Cesaro/Swagger are not low midcarders, Ryback MEed some PPVs and Swagger/Cesaro is a strong midcard team with Zeb + a gauntlet match is an interesting concept doesn't happen very often. Bryan did poor numbers with Orton and Cena once or twice in the overrun back in 13, and Punk most of the time got the highest of the show even when he was out of the title picture. Helped the show get a better ratings. Didn't you admit once that you don't know much about ratings so why talk about it dummy, and then pass it as a fact :lol.

Also just checked, it didn't get a million views so you lie and then I be labeled as a guy who spews BS :lol I just tell it like it is and I don't care that you annoying marks don't like to hear it. 



> Daniel Bryan vs. Jack Swagger in the beginning of the Gauntlet Match lost 295,000n viewers.
> Bryan vs. Antonio Cesaro gained 150,000 viewers, which is good because that time period is usually loses viewers. Bryan vs. Ryback in the end of the Gauntlet Match plus John Cena coming out and the backstage segment with Vince McMahon and Maddox gained 331,000 viewers, a weak gain, for a 3.20 overrun rating.


Fact is you're clueless and you don't want to admit it. If you wan't to judge on who's a bigger draw then showing ratings isn't a prove, because clearly he was never on his own since he got pushed, ratings are already low anyway. As I said this year got the lowest RTWM in 18 years proof http://www.gerweck.net/tv-ratings/


----------



## checkcola

If being with the Wyatts is such a good thing, I eagerly await CM Wyatt, John Wyatt, Big E Wyatt, Sheamus Wyatt, Roman Wyatt, Total Wyatts, and so on.


----------



## Londrick

Why are people still giving Sonnen Says serious replies even though he's a troll?


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Londrick said:


> Why are people still giving Sonnen Says serious replies even though he's a troll?


I don't even know how he's still around, but I guess it's for the lulz.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Londrick said:


> Why are people still giving Sonnen Says serious replies even though he's a troll?


I'm a troll for telling the truth and showing proof :lol, just because you don't have a proper argument doesn't mean I'm a troll. Read what I said in my previous post and tell me what did I troll about, truth is you're so biased about your hero that you don't want to believe it. Also aren't you the same guy who used to talk about how midgets can't draw and now all of a sudden it's the opposite, trolling much Dunmer.



CHIcagoMade said:


> I don't even know how he's still around, but I guess it's for the lulz.


Says the guy who believes Punk has no personality compared to Bryan :lmao.

Seriously I'm not gonna argue with you guys anymore you're so delusional. Proof is clearly not enough. See you guys after WM when Bryan is no longer protected which means after his feud with HHH and all that shit is over. But unfortunately he's probably gonna be pushed much further since Punk is gone now.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Sonnen Says said:


> *Says the guy who believes Punk has no personality compared to Bryan* :lmao.
> 
> Seriously I'm not gonna argue with you guys anymore you're so delusional. Proof is clearly not enough. See you guys after WM when Bryan is no longer protected which means after his feud with HHH and all that shit is over. But unfortunately he's probably gonna be pushed much further since Punk is gone now.





CHIcagoMade said:


> But Punk sucks as a face, so no it would not have worked as well. He doesn't have the same personality Bryan has.


Now where did I say that?


----------



## Sonnen Says

CHIcagoMade said:


> Now where did I say that?





CHIcagoMade said:


> Punk had the least chance of them all. He's a walking PR nightmare. Do you see how he dresses at press conferences etc. Do you see how he speaks in interviews. He has a horrible attitude and he can't be trusted as you can see by his recent walk out. He's to much of an unprofessional hipster douche to even be considered for the TOP GUY slot. *He doesn't have it all, because he doesn't have the look or the personality.*


Didn't you say this. I mean come on personality is one of his strongest point. He's a merch machine since 2011, he needs to be very likable to sell that much. Plus personality stands for many things, Bryan is obviously a nice guy but when he's in a WWE character he's very uninspiring and he's not a stand up guy, either someone speaks for him or wrestlers doing the most work in his feuds like his feud with HHH now, seriously I don't usually give HHH credit but he's doing a fantastic job in selling the match. Bryan doesn't show attitude in his work and doesn't have enough charisma. If anything he lacks personality as a character.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

I'm talking about outside the ring, he doesn't have the personality to be a spokesperson like Cena carrying the brand. I explained it in that post.


----------



## Sonnen Says

CHIcagoMade said:


> I'm talking about outside the ring, he doesn't have the personality to be a spokesperson like Cena carrying the brand. I explained it in that post.


Punk is very outspoken, he was never bad in interviews or had negative attitude in them, he won best on interviews twice in a row from WO. He might not do what Cena does with his work outside WWE like making wishes and all that but Austin was never that person anyway when he became the face of the company. I don't think Bryan is that guy either not just Punk plus when you said Orton I :lmao because he's known for his horrible attitude, he will never be responsible, he violated the wellness policy several times and he doesn't have the appeal that Cena have or even Punk/Bryan have anyway.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

I'm just going to respond here because it's really simple and doesn't take up much of my time.



Sonnen Says said:


> I was just talking about 13 so you're wrong once again. Only mentioned Sheamus just to show an example.





> He wasn't having matches with jobbers and low midcarders all those he was feuding with are legit main attraction of the show and just as credible


You are clearly referencing Punk's time in 2012 here. Otherwise what the hell was the point of this statement? You couldn't be saying that the people Bryan was facing were the ones more people were interested in because the fact of the matter is, this clearly wasn't the case. In the segments that these guys were in involving Bryan, the ratings were noticeably good for them, but when it wasn't against Bryan or guys like Cena or Orton, for the most part the ratings for guys like the Shield and Wyatts weren't as good or weren't good at all. And even then, the Shield, Wyatts, the Authority, Randy Orton, these guys are not anywhere close to being the ratings draws that The Rock, Brock Lesnar, and the Undertaker are. So where you are stating that Bryan was being protected, I can just as easily argue that Punk was being protected in his shinning moments as well. 



Sonnen Says said:


> No he wasn't on his own whether you like to admit or not, 99% of time he was with either HHH, Cena, HBK (for a little while), Authority, Orton, Shield, and Wyatts. Are you actually denying that :lmao. Just own it, fact is Bryan was protected. He was never on his own get it in your thick skull and stop denying the truth. WWE made sure they will do it the right way this time and not fuck it up like they did with Punk back in 11.


I'm not denying anything other than the fact that these guys aren't the ratings draws you are claiming them to be. I won't argue against Cena or HBK, but it's a well known fact that Orton hasn't drawn anything close to what he used to in 2009 and I can easily back that up with evidence. Claiming the Wyatts had any sort of major impact on Bryan's drawing power is fucking hilarious. The Shield certainly did not protect Bryan in any possible way. Want proof? A program that the Shield did with Kane, and a backstage segment including the Shield immediately afterwords lost 341,000 viewers. Those are horrible numbers. And it's made worse by the fact that the very next match, William Regal vs Antonio Cesaro, gained 41,000 viewers. It's also made worse by the fact that earlier in the show, a segment involving Team Hell No gained +200,000 viewers, and then Bryan's match with Randy Orton afterwords gained 240,000 viewers. Just from this show alone, you can tell that the interest was clearly in Daniel Bryan, not the Shield, not Orton, and certainly not Kane. And just so you understand, this was a common occurrence for the Shield in programs where they were involved with people no one was interested in. 

And then there's this little piece of info (this was what I was referring to earlier about Bryan's gauntlet match, which I will admit I fucked up on). Daniel Bryan competed in a gauntlet match against the Shield on the 8/26 addition of Raw, and this match alone drew in a million viewers at the END OF RAW. We are talking about a guy facing off against a stable that had lost a significant amount of viewers when involved in a program with Kane but with Bryan? All of a sudden they get incredible viewings at the end of Raw when ratings usually aren't that strong.

So Bryan drew a million viewers in a situation where he was clearly on his own. Don't tell me he was never on his own. He definitely was and in situations where he was, he delivered. Did the Shield play a part? Absolutely, but not even close to what you're trying to make it out to be. I'm not going to sit here and claim he did well all of the time, he didn't, and neither did Punk. 



Sonnen Says said:


> So what?! Punk did as well with guys like Ryback, Axel, ADR, etc. the same year and no Ryback, Cesaro/Swagger are not low midcarders, Ryback MEed some PPVs and Swagger/Cesaro is a strong midcard team with Zeb + a gauntlet match is an interesting concept doesn't happen very often.


Lol. 



Sonnen Says said:


> Bryan did poor numbers with Orton and Cena once or twice in the overrun back in 13, and Punk most of the time got the highest of the show even when he was out of the title picture. Helped the show get a better ratings. Didn't you admit once that you don't know much about ratings so why talk about it dummy, and then pass it as a fact :lol.


I don't know much about ratings. I don't know how it works in regards to figuring out how many viewers watched what show, I don't know anything about how to judge whether or not someone should be responsible for buyrates, but I am looking at the numbers here and they all point to you being wrong at the end of the day.

And what's worse is now you're trying to make it sound like Bryan did poor in segments with Cena and Orton at times but you're completely ignoring that Punk not only did as well, but did so a lot more often. Want proof? 



> A few weeks prior to that his non-title bout main event with John Cena drew a mere 2.4 quarter. Considering Cena is one of the few reliable draws the company has left, this is even more startling.


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1440235-cm-punk-is-he-the-reason-for-wwes-falling-ratings
http://www.wrestlezone.com/news/264259-early-wwe-raw-ratings-note-did-cm-punks-celebration-draw
http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2012/0215/549743/cm-punk/

I'm not going to sit here and claim Cm Punk can't draw. He can. It's been proven time and time again. Hell on the show that Bryan drew a million viewers, Punk's match with Axel drew over half a million, even though it was at the top of the hour at 9 pm where the biggest ratings boosts often occur. 

Regardless, Bryan has proven himself to be a guy who can draw major ratings on his own, and these past two months are proof of that. I don't need to explain why. Until you can show me any instances where Punk drew anywhere close to what Bryan's doing now on a consistent basis, you're going to continue to be wrong.


----------



## Londrick

Sonnen Says said:


> I'm a troll for telling the truth and showing proof :lol, just because you don't have a proper argument doesn't mean I'm a troll. Read what I said in my previous post and tell me what did I troll about, truth is you're so biased about your hero that you don't want to believe it. Also aren't you the same guy who used to talk about how midgets can't draw and now all of a sudden it's the opposite, trolling much Dunmer.


Because there's no point in arguing with Phil Brooks worshipers. They're almost as delusional as Phil is.

Also all that vanilla midget can't draw shit is obviously me joking around.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Londrick said:


> Because there's no point in arguing with Phil Brooks worshipers. They're almost as delusional as Phil is.
> 
> Also all that vanilla midget can't draw shit is obviously me joking around.


:lmao When he referred to you by your previous name, it was so edgy. It was a shoot just like Phil Books talking to Paul Levesque.:lmao


----------



## Happenstan

Londrick said:


> Because there's no point in arguing with Phil Brooks worshipers. They're almost as delusional as Phil is.
> 
> Also all that vanilla midget can't draw shit is obviously me joking around.


Sonnen doesn't comprehend sarcasm.




IDONTSHIV said:


> :lmao When he referred to you by your previous name, it was so edgy. It was a shoot just like Phil Books talking to Paul Levesque.:lmao


I'd rep you again for this if it wasn't too soon.


----------



## The_Workout_Buddy

LOL so much arguments ...all of this only to go back to the terrible numbers RAW does when WM season it's over.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

The_Workout_Buddy said:


> LOL so much arguments ...all of this only to go back to the terrible numbers RAW does when WM season it's over.


Oh just wait. Sonnens response to my post is going to be epic.


----------



## Londrick

IDONTSHIV said:


> :lmao When he referred to you by your previous name, it was so edgy. It was a shoot just like Phil Books talking to Paul Levesque.:lmao


What's funnier is I still say the same shit after I got my name change. :ti



The_Workout_Buddy said:


> LOL so much arguments ...all of this only to go back to the terrible numbers RAW does when WM season it's over.


Hoping either Batista, Orton or HHH are champs then so I can blame them.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

The_Workout_Buddy said:


> LOL so much arguments ...all of this only to go back to the terrible numbers RAW does when WM season it's over.


How can you say that? If Bryan is the hottest thing in wrestling and wins the title on Sunday wouldn't that increase the ratings?


----------



## D.M.N.

D.M.N. said:


> 2013	- 3.3 rating / 3.27 million households
> 2014	- 3.2 rating / 3.13 million households


More quarter 1 bits:

2013
- 3.27 million households
- 4.62 million viewers
- 2.09 million viewers A18-49

2014
- 3.13 million households (down 4.5%)
- 4.44 million viewers (down 4.1%)
- 1.93 million viewers A18-49 (down 8.3%)

All of the year-on-year loss is due to losing viewers in the A18-49 demo, due to no Rock.


----------



## validreasoning

The_Workout_Buddy said:


> LOL so much arguments ...all of this only to go back to the terrible numbers RAW does when WM season it's over.


Please link me to a cable show that averages what raw does from April till December. NBA regular season games on espn average 1 to 1.5 million viewers, the least watched raw in 2013 drew what 3.6 million...


----------



## Waffelz

The ratings for tomorrow will be huge!


----------



## checkcola

*WWE News: WrestleMania 30 attendance and gross revenue*



> WWE issued the following press release to Prowrestling.net regarding the WrestleMania 30 event.
> 
> WWE® (NYSE: WWE) announced tonight that WrestleMania 30 broke the record for the Mercedes-Benz Superdome's highest grossing entertainment event. This marks the fifth consecutive year that WWE broke the host venue's highest-grossing entertainment event record. WWE's annual pop-culture extravaganza grossed $10.9 million as a sold-out crowd of 75,167 from all 50 states and 37 countries converged on the Mercedes-Benz Superdome in New Orleans.The event was broadcast live in the U.S. on WWE Network and via cable and satellite providers on pay-per-view in more than 100 countries and 20 languages.
> 
> The previous gross revenue record for an entertainment event at the Mercedes-Benz Superdome was the three-day Essence Festival in 2013 featuring Beyoncé.
> 
> "On behalf of the city of New Orleans, I would like to thank all of the fans who came from around the world to WrestleMania 30," said New Orleans Mayor Mitch Landrieu. "WrestleMania has taken its rightful place amongst the most historic events ever held in New Orleans."
> 
> "The success of WrestleMania week in New Orleans would not have been possible without the tireless support of Mayor Mitch Landrieu, as well as our public and private sector partners who built an amazing blueprint to welcome our fans from around the world to this milestone celebration," said John P. Saboor, Executive Vice President of Special Events, WWE. "We now begin our exciting journey to Silicon Valley for WrestleMania 31."
> 
> WrestleMania 31 takes place on Sunday, March 29, 2015 from Levi's® Stadium in Santa Clara, CA. Ticket information will be announced later this year.
> 
> Top Five All-Time Attendance Records at WrestleMania:
> 
> 1. 93,173: WrestleMania 3, Pontiac Silverdome, Pontiac, Michigan, March 29, 1987
> 2. 80,676: WrestleMania 29, MetLife Stadium, East Rutherford, New Jersey, April 7, 2013
> 3. 80,103: WrestleMania 23, Ford Field, Detroit, Michigan, April 1, 2007
> 4. 78,363: WrestleMania 28, Sun Life Stadium, Miami, Florida, April 1, 2012
> 5. 75,167: WrestleMania 30, Mercedes-Benz Superdome, New Orleans, LA, April 6, 2014


----------



## D.M.N.

USA unsurprisingly expecting some big numbers tonight - https://twitter.com/TedOnTV/status/453030977083015169


----------



## Teach

I expect tonights Raw do around 4.0


----------



## THANOS

D.M.N. said:


> USA unsurprisingly expecting some big numbers tonight - https://twitter.com/TedOnTV/status/453030977083015169


What did the last few post-mania RAW's do? Will be interesting to see if the combo of Bryan winning and Taker losing will draw a bigger rating than Rock beating Cena.



Teach said:


> I expect tonights Raw do around 4.0


That would be great!


----------



## checkcola

wrong thread, oops


----------



## Waffelz

No Undertaker may. Effect it. Middle hour to suffer.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I see the opening and the overrun doing out-of-this-world numbers. How the overall average of the show will be? I expect it higher than last year's at least by a decent margin.


----------



## hazuki

I saw alot of hype on twitter, when i searched like Cesaro or Paige on Twitter, their tweets per second was huge.


----------



## D.M.N.

I've turned into a monster..... and it keeps getting stronger!!! http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...ves-wwe-hall-of-fame-bates-motel-more/251983/

WWE Entertainment	USA	8:00 PM	5313	1.9
* highest hour 1 since Raw 1000
WWE Entertainment	USA	9:00 PM	5094	1.8
* highest hour 2 since March 4th, 2013
WWE Entertainment	USA	10:00 PM	5032	1.9
* highest hour 3 since Raw 1000
WWE HALL OF FAME	USA	11:10 PM	2400	1.0
=> Raw average = 5.15m

Highest figures since Raw 1000! :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

the YES! ERA has begun. :bryan


----------



## JY57

pretty impressive especially going up against the NCAA National Championship Game


----------



## Tardbasher12

Daniel Bryan has turned into a monster... a monster draw.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

HOLY FUCK AT DEM NUMBERS! DAT STREAK ENDING DRAWS! :taker DAT BRYAN DRAWS! DAT YES MOVEMENT DRAWS! :bryan :mark:


----------



## Teach

Bryan is the new Stone Cold.


----------



## D.M.N.

No doubt some of that is attributed to Undertaker losing, however there was no massive drop for hour 3, which is very encouraging for the 'E.


----------



## Uerfer

D.M.N. said:


> I've turned into a monster..... and it keeps getting stronger!!! http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...ves-wwe-hall-of-fame-bates-motel-more/251983/
> 
> WWE Entertainment	USA	8:00 PM	5313	1.9
> * highest hour 1 since Raw 1000
> WWE Entertainment	USA	9:00 PM	5094	1.8
> * highest hour 2 since March 4th, 2013
> WWE Entertainment	USA	10:00 PM	5032	1.9
> * highest hour 3 since Raw 1000
> WWE HALL OF FAME	USA	11:10 PM	2400	1.0
> => Raw average = 5.15m
> 
> Highest figures since Raw 1000! :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:


1.9 rating in A18-49? Damn impressive.


----------



## Sonnen Says

The streak ending is a huge shock so I see why it's this high. Puts more eyes to the product.


----------



## Uerfer

When was the last time they drew a 1.9 rating in A18-49?


----------



## #Mark

What do you know? The WWE puts on an exciting, fresh, and unpredictable product and the ratings go through the roof. Great signs for the future.


----------



## Uerfer

Was Lesnar's segment placed in hour 2? Bit surprised it didn't peak there considering the streak ending and all, seems like the peak rating would be in opening segment or the overrun.


----------



## Choke2Death

Great numbers which is well deserved for the greatness we have witnessed in the past couple of nights.

I usually don't buy into the "new era" hype every time something different happens but WM30 could very well be the sign of a bright future. Taker's streak ended, Bryan is possibly the new top guy and Cesaro got a huge rub on his road to become a top star while the veterans helped them reach a new height (Evolution and Big Show).


----------



## Uerfer

#Mark said:


> What do you know? The WWE puts on an exciting, fresh, and unpredictable product and the ratings go through the roof. Great signs for the future.


Exciting? yes
Unpredictable? Not so much 
Fresh? maybe, but the ratings came from title win and breaking Streak. Streak's been built over for 5 years and Bryan's yesmania been over for 2 years. This can hardly be considered "fresh" if you ask me.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

JY57 said:


> pretty impressive especially going up against the NCAA National Championship Game


This plus the 1.9 demo screams impressive. Raw was great and deserved a great rating.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

While all hours were at a top level, first hour was still well above the other two, and the streak ending is a big factor in the first hour being as high as it was, arguably the biggest. That's what's been talked about far above all other things leading into Raw, even Bryan finally winning the title.

However, that's not to take anything away from Bryan. The ratings wouldn't have stayed that high if he wasn't a big draw and couldn't keep people into the show in anticipation for his first title defense. 

All in all though, the show was top quality throughout and ultimately how they structured the show, I think, is what led to the numbers being as high as they were.

But now the tough part comes... can they maintain it and keep it from dropping back below the. 4.2/4.3 million range? I have confidence that they can until football season starts.


----------



## NastyYaffa

:bryan That's all. :yes


----------



## #Mark

Uerfer said:


> Exciting? yes
> Unpredictable? Not so much
> Fresh? maybe, but the ratings came from title win and breaking Streak. Streak's been built over for 5 years and Bryan's yesmania been over for 2 years. This can hardly be considered "fresh" if you ask me.


Undertaker's streak ending is the most unpredictable moment since Hogan joined the NWO. Paige, Cesaro becoming a Paul Heyman guy, Brock Lesnar as the most dominating man in the company, the Evolution reunion, and the Shield turning babyface is all fresh.


----------



## elo

Whilst the Internet hits aren't a fair indication of the casual viewer, Bryan's Championship segment, Paige's debut and win and Hulk Hogan introducing Cesaro all had more hits on their youtube channel over Heyman and Brock.

People want to see Taker's reaction to losing his streak, not Heyman and Brock's which was very predictable.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The new Daniel Bryan shirt should read: RISE ABOVE PUNK'S RATINGS. :bryan


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

elo said:


> Whilst the Internet hits aren't a fair indication of the casual viewer, Bryan's Championship segment, Paige's debut and win and Hulk Hogan introducing Cesaro all had more hits on their youtube channel over Heyman and Brock.
> 
> People want to see Taker's reaction to losing his streak, not Heyman and Brock's which was very predictable.


Agreed, although we won't really know that until we see the breakdown.


----------



## Darkness is here

Post wm raws always do great.

Will be intresting to see if this continues next week or not.


----------



## Duke Silver

Great time for WWE to hit one out of the park with so many eyeballs on the product. Ending The Streak and Bryan winning the WWEWHC obviously hooked people, and in return lots of fresh talent got huge exposure. Whether it's the start of a new era or not, this is exactly what's needed to cement new stars. Bryan, Shield, Cesaro, Wyatts, Paige all on the rise. (Y)


----------



## Uerfer

I get that streak ending is big part of the ratings increase, I'm just surprised all this time Brock was able to top his most of his segments on RAW with ease when he wasn't built up so strong. But now he's coming fresh off breaking the invincible streak at Mania and he's unable to do that. In theory, defeating Taker at mania should've put him over huge, they advertised Brock/Paul's segment within ten minutes of the show starting, other than Brock himself, casuals would've been expecting taker to confront him as well....when you consider all these things, that quarter must have been the peak of the show. But it didn't happen, it looks like it either peaked at the start or at the end, I'm just wondering what went wrong there. 




> Undertaker's streak ending is the most unpredictable moment since Hogan joined the NWO. Paige, Cesaro becoming a Paul Heyman guy, Brock Lesnar as the most dominating man in the company, the Evolution reunion, and the Shield turning babyface is all fresh.


Other than Taker's streak ending what else was so unpredictable? Nothing. Paige, Cesaro, Shield clearly didn't bring the ratings. It was the authority and Bryan as usual but they are far from "fresh", the angle is going on since summerslam and the yes mania over since 2012.


----------



## Your_Solution

Feels good man


----------



## LKRocks

Great start to The Reality Era. 
Bryan is a monster draw, and Taker's streak ending brought even more eyes to the product. Raw was amazing and definitely earned those ratings last night


----------



## purple_gloves

No surprise it did a good number. Seems a good tactic in theory.....end the streak - showcase new talent to the obvious extra eyes. Hopefully they keep things interesting and some of those extra eyes stick around. So much potential with the current roster.


----------



## Waffelz

I bet the overrun was huge.

Nice to see hour three wasn't terrible as that hour was quality.


----------



## JY57

better than Post Mania RAW last year which was which averaged 4.61 million (Hour 1 - 4.49 million, Hour 2 - 4.78 million, & Hour 3 - 4.62 million)

this year averaged 5.14 million viewers


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

It absolutely smoked last year's, as it should've.


----------



## CookiePuss

lol at you guys thinking RAW got this big boost because of Bryan...Not to sound like a hater or anything, but alot of people usually tune into RAW after Mania to see the results. Oh, and The Streak was broken this year, which is kind of a big deal, so I'd say people were expecting to see Undertaker or hear from him, or even Brock Lesnar. I'm sure people also tuned in to see who came out champion.


----------



## JY57

final rating - 3.70


----------



## CookiePuss

JY57 said:


> final rating - 3.70


Solid


----------



## bmtrocks

cookiepuss said:


> lol at you guys thinking RAW got this big boost because of Bryan...Not to sound like a hater or anything, but alot of people usually tune into RAW after Mania to see the results. Oh, and The Streak was broken this year, which is kind of a big deal, so I'd say people were expecting to see Undertaker or hear from him, or even Brock Lesnar. I'm sure people also tuned in to see who came out champion.


Lesnar was advertised to appear at the beginning of the show and people didn't stay for that, so I'm doubting that's the sole reason.


----------



## THANOS

cookiepuss said:


> lol at you guys thinking RAW got this big boost because of Bryan...Not to sound like a hater or anything, but alot of people usually tune into RAW after Mania to see the results. Oh, and The Streak was broken this year, which is kind of a big deal, so I'd say people were expecting to see Undertaker or hear from him, or even Brock Lesnar. I'm sure people also tuned in to see who came out champion.


Just curious, were you paying any attention to quarter hour ratings the past couple months? If you weren't I'll just let you know, Bryan was pulling monster viewer gains relative to the rest of the roster in every single one of his segments and routinely topped the night, even in odd quarters and during played out matches like against Orton. The Streak obviously deserves a lot of credit, but if you watched the show last night, the Streak ending obviously didn't seem to impact the show in any way. Hell, Heyman and Lesnar didn't even get nearly as much heat as we all expected until Heyman really started tearing into the crowd and Taker to hammer it home. And after all of that, they both still got a decent amount of cheers mixed in with the boos. 

The Streak definitely helped things, but I have no issue believing Bryan's long awaited triumphant victory was a the big drawing act to the show. This will become clear once we get the quarter hour breakdown. I'm willing to bet Bryan's open was the highest on the show, followed by the closing segment as the second highest. If Heyman and Lesnar's promo beats either of those then we can talk. What will really be interesting is the comparison of the opening segment's rating to opening segments for post-mania RAW's the past 5 years.



JY57 said:


> final rating - 3.70


Well deserved. I was hoping it would get to 4.0, but it will take more shows booked like tonight for that to happen in my opinion.


----------



## Vyer

JY57 said:


> final rating - 3.70


Great googly moogly...nice rating.


----------



## Marv95

Wonder if they'll ever get a 4.0


----------



## murder

Marv95 said:


> Wonder if they'll ever get a 4.0


The rating doesn't matter, it's the viewership that counts. And over 5 million for all three hours is amazing, especially in this day and age.


----------



## ecabney

IDONTSHIV said:


> The new Daniel Bryan shirt should read: RISE ABOVE PUNK'S RATINGS. :bryan


Punk stans were huge assholes during D-Bry's rise to prominence, so D-Bry getting these great numbers 

is absolutely glorious.


----------



## MaybeLock

DAT new cow to milk money from :bryan :vince$


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

3.7? That's gotta be the highest non-Raw 1000 rating in 3 years I'd think.


----------



## OML

With the NCAA championship game as competition this is awesome!


----------



## purple_gloves

THANOS said:


> Just curious, were you paying any attention to quarter hour ratings the past couple months? If you weren't I'll just let you know, Bryan was pulling monster viewer gains relative to the rest of the roster in every single one of his segments and routinely topped the night, even in odd quarters and during played out matches like against Orton. The Streak obviously deserves a lot of credit, but if you watched the show last night, the Streak ending obviously didn't seem to impact the show in any way. Hell, Heyman and Lesnar didn't even get nearly as much heat as we all expected until Heyman really started tearing into the crowd and Taker to hammer it home. And after all of that, they both still got a decent amount of cheers mixed in with the boos.
> 
> The Streak definitely helped things, but I have no issue believing Bryan's long awaited triumphant victory was a the big drawing act to the show. This will become clear once we get the quarter hour breakdown. I'm willing to bet Bryan's open was the highest on the show, followed by the closing segment as the second highest. If Heyman and Lesnar's promo beats either of those then we can talk. What will really be interesting is the comparison of the opening segment's rating to opening segments for post-mania RAW's the past 5 years.
> 
> 
> 
> Well deserved. I was hoping it would get to 4.0, but it will take more shows booked like tonight for that to happen in my opinion.


This rating has far surpassed any leading up to WM. The people invested in Bryan's story were watching regardless. The rest of that latest number is made up of those people who've heard Taker's streak has ended. Make no mistake about that. 

You can't honestly believe that Daniel Bryan winning the title has suddenly added nearly a million viewers? No way. Taker's streak ending has done that. If they've stuck around for the rest of the night, then great. Shows they've put on a good show.


----------



## JY57

also was little higher than Post WM 28 RAW which averaged 5.0 million viewers. But 2011 still highest in this decade.


----------



## WWE

Daniel bryan becoming champ
Taker/Streak/Lesnar fallout


...Taker :jose


----------



## #Mark

Obviously most of the intrigue was the streak ending but the fact that each hour was well over five million indicates that people were interested in the show as a whole. I'm sure people realized that Taker was not appearing after the second hour so the fact that over five million people still tuned in to the advertised Bryan/HHH title match shows that there is massive intrigue in the Bryan/HHH saga.


----------



## Waffelz

Offft. On WWE's Youtube, Paige/AJ Lee has the third most amount of views (180k) after the two Daniel Bryan segments. Actually, her post Raw interview drew 180k as well.

Bryan > Paige > AJ Lee > Heyman/Cesaro > Heyman/Brock

lol


----------



## THANOS

purple_gloves said:


> This rating has far surpassed any leading up to WM. The people invested in Bryan's story were watching regardless. The rest of that latest number is made up of those people who've heard Taker's streak has ended. Make no mistake about that.
> 
> You can't honestly believe that Daniel Bryan winning the title has suddenly added nearly a million viewers? No way. Taker's streak ending has done that. If they've stuck around for the rest of the night, then great. Shows they've put on a good show.


Sure, that definitely was a factor, but huge title wins at Mania for upcoming top guys have traditionally been a huge contributor as well. I'm pretty sure when Austin beat HBK, and when Batista beat HHH, the ratings for the next night of RAW were monstrous as well, and far exceeded the lead up RAW ratings. Hopefully a poster with access to them like Validreasoning can post the comparison to validate my assertion.

Regardless of all that though, it would be hard for anyone to completely contribute the extra million views to Taker's streak ending until we get the segment by segment breakdown. That will reveal everything. And like one poster already noted, fans would be eagerly watching Heyman and Lesnar expecting something to happen with Taker, so whatever that rating is, is a direct reflection in the actual interest brought in from the end of the streak.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Some of you actually believe it's all because of Bryan. Hey again don't show me what Bryan ratings were last weeks because they weren't any higher than this, but of course if I say otherwise I'm a troll or a hater for telling the truth, I'm not gonna say this again RTWM this year was the lowest in 18 years and I will gladly prove it if you want. 

Give credits to most who was in the show because they were responsible just as much if not more since they held it up. I give credit mostly to Taker streak ending, he brought more eyes to the product and the show was booked greatly if any of you is honest. Anyway it will probably get back to normal since WWE aren't consistent in their product.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

I'm not a Bryan fan but it's completely laughable that people think this high rating has anything to do with Taker's streak ending. The high rating is mostly due to Bryan winning the championship. The question now is if he can maintain the ratings as champion. But Taker's streak ending being the reason for the high ratings??? :lmao:lmao:lmao


----------



## purple_gloves

THANOS said:


> Sure, that definitely was a factor, but huge title wins at Mania for upcoming top guys have traditionally been a huge contributor as well. I'm pretty sure when Austin beat HBK, and when Batista beat HHH, the ratings for the next night of RAW were monstrous as well, and far exceeded the lead up RAW ratings. Hopefully a poster with access to them like Validreasoning can post the comparison to validate my assertion.
> 
> Regardless of all that though, it would be hard for anyone to completely contribute the extra million views to Taker's streak ending until we get the segment by segment breakdown. That will reveal everything. And like one poster already noted, fans would be eagerly watching Heyman and Lesnar expecting something to happen with Taker, so whatever that rating is, is a direct reflection in the actual interest brought in from the end of the streak.


Yep. Breakdown will tell us a lot. 

Looking at the averages it seems the opener has done a huge number.


----------



## THANOS

Sonnen Says said:


> Some of you actually believe it's all because of Bryan. Hey again don't show me what Bryan ratings were last weeks because they weren't any higher than this, but of course if I say otherwise I'm a troll or a hater for telling the truth, I'm not gonna say this again RTWM this year was the lowest in 18 years and I will gladly prove it if you want.
> 
> Give credits to most who was in the show because they were responsible just as much if not more since they held it up. I give credit mostly to Taker streak ending, he brought more eyes to the product and the show was booked greatly if any of you is honest. Anyway it will probably get back to normal since WWE aren't consistent in their product.


Wait and see when the breakdown comes out, and then comment on it. That will certainly reveal all, and I'm fairly confident it will justify my comments.



The Boy Wonder said:


> I'm not a Bryan fan but it's completely laughable that people think this high rating has anything to do with Taker's streak ending. The high rating is mostly due to Bryan winning the champion. The question now is if he can maintain the ratings as champion. But Taker's streak ending being the reason for the high ratings??? :lmao:lmao:lmao


Honestly, if the Streak was such a treasured moment, wouldn't the ratings go down the next night? I mean, with the way people were talking on here about it and the reactions on people's faces in the crowd, one would think people would rage quit and stop watching right then and there. Clearly that wasn't the case since they popped huge for Bryan's win two matches later, gave him an Austin/Rock/Hogan pop the next night on RAW, and the viewership is much higher than last year.

I won't attribute all of it to Bryan, but I would imagine it had much more to do with it then some people on here care to admit.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

THANOS said:


> Wait and see when the breakdown comes out, and then comment on it. That will certainly reveal all, and I'm fairly confident it will justify my comments.
> 
> 
> 
> Honestly, if the Streak was such a treasured moment, wouldn't the ratings go down the next night? I mean, with the way people were talking on here about it and the reactions on people's faces in the crowd, one would think people who rage quit and stop watching right then and there. Clearly that wasn't the case since they popped huge for Bryan's win two matches later, gave him an Austin/Rock/Hogan pop the next night on RAW, and the viewership is much higher than last year.
> 
> I won't attribute all of it to Bryan, but I would imagine it had much more to do with it then some people on here care to admit.


Exactly. We finally agree bro 

Also, we should attribute some of the high rating to WWE announcing a huge WWE Championship match at the beginning of the show. I have to imagine some viewers were probably pissed that the title match was just a big tease as it never really happened. WWE needs to be careful not to pull that again. There was a payoff with The Shield coming, however not delivering on a championship match could turn viewers off.


----------



## CJohn3:16

Bryan and Taker bringing the ratings. Taker should go to Raw this week. WWE must announce it. That will bring huge ratings again.


----------



## Happenstan

IDONTSHIV said:


> The new Daniel Bryan shirt should read: RISE ABOVE PUNK'S RATINGS. :bryan


:lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao





JY57 said:


> better than Post Mania RAW last year which was which averaged 4.61 million (Hour 1 - 4.49 million, Hour 2 - 4.78 million, & Hour 3 - 4.62 million)
> 
> this year averaged 5.14 million viewers





#BadNewsSanta said:


> It absolutely smoked last year's, as it should've.


:banderas




ecabney said:


> Punk stans were huge assholes during D-Bry's rise to prominence, so D-Bry getting these great numbers
> 
> is absolutely glorious.


Kharma is one mean fickle bitch. Don't you just love it? :dance :cheer




Sonnen Says said:


> Some of you actually believe it's all because of Bryan. Hey again don't show me what Bryan ratings were last weeks because they weren't any higher than this, but of course if I say otherwise I'm a troll or a hater for telling the truth, I'm not gonna say this again RTWM this year was the lowest in 18 years and I will gladly prove it if you want.
> 
> Give credits to most who was in the show because they were responsible just as much if not more since they held it up. I give credit mostly to Taker streak ending, he brought more eyes to the product and the show was booked greatly if any of you is honest. Anyway it will probably get back to normal since WWE aren't consistent in their product.


Suicidal Sonnen is the best. Your tears sustain me so.




The Boy Wonder said:


> I'm not a Bryan fan but it's completely laughable that people think this high rating has anything to do with Taker's streak ending. The high rating is mostly due to Bryan winning the championship. The question now is if he can maintain the ratings as champion. But Taker's streak ending being the reason for the high ratings??? :lmao:lmao:lmao


Oh, man. Boy Wonder with that face turn....or sarcasm.


----------



## THANOS

The Boy Wonder said:


> Exactly. We finally agree bro
> 
> Also, we should attribute some of the high rating to WWE announcing a huge WWE Championship match at the beginning of the show. I have to imagine some viewers were probably pissed that the title match was just a big tease as it never really happened. WWE needs to be careful not to pull that again. There was a payoff with The Shield coming, however not delivering on a championship match could turn viewers off.


Good to see . I think the rating for the rest of the show after the initial opener certainly could have something to do with the title match being announced earlier on, but I truly believe the show was a balanced effort tonight. I'm expecting Bryan's celebration, the mainevent segment, Heyman/Lesnar, Hogan/Cesaro/Colter/Heyman, Batista/Orton destroying the Usos, and Paige's debut to top the night which will be great to see. I'm also interested to see how the Cena and gang vs the Wyatt's did, especially near the end of the match.

Since we're agreeing on things here, I'll take it one step further and say both Orton and Batista really stepped up to the plate in the mainevent last night and turned in equal performances to Bryan in the match, which made it tremendous to watch for me. Orton being just as fluid after his painful bump onto the monitor was especially great, and really showed his passion to making that moment great for all parties involved. Batista's conditioned also resembled the Batista of old just before he left, and, dare I say, showed flashes to become better.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

THANOS said:


> Good to see . I think the rating for the rest of the show after the initial opener certainly could have something to do with the title match being announced earlier on, but I truly believe the show was a balanced effort tonight. I'm expecting Bryan's celebration, the mainevent segment, Heyman/Lesnar, Hogan/Cesaro/Colter/Heyman, Batista/Orton destroying the Usos, and Paige's debut to top the night which will be great to see. I'm also interested to see how the Cena and gang vs the Wyatt's did, especially near the end of the match.
> 
> Since we're agreeing on things here, I'll take it one step further and say both Orton and Batista really stepped up to the plate in the mainevent last night and turned in equal performances to Bryan in the match, which made it tremendous to watch for me. Orton being just as fluid after his painful bump onto the monitor was especially great, and really showed his passion to that moment great for all parties involved. Batista's conditioned also resembled the Batista of old just before he left, and, dare I say, showed flashes to become better.


Yeah I agree about Orton and Batista. Even on RAW they worked well with each other. WWE could make big money having a decent run with Evolution again. Maybe until Summerslam.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

The show rating as a whole might not be primarily due to Taker, but I firmly think the mega high hour 1, and if quarter 1 is high, is (mostly )due to Taker and the streak ending.

It doesn't really matter though. The whole show was extremely high and it's due to a combination of the the streak ending fallout, Bryan winning the titles, and an extremely well structured show.


----------



## THANOS

#BadNewsSanta said:


> The show rating as a whole might not be primarily due to Taker, *but I firmly think the mega high hour 1, and if quarter 1 is high, is (mostly )due to Taker and the streak ending.*
> 
> It doesn't really matter though. The whole show was extremely high and it's due to a combination of the the streak ending fallout, Bryan winning the titles, and an extremely well structured show.


See, I've never understood that point mostly because of the following question. Wouldn't the viewer just tune out for 10 minutes, or so, if the first segment wasn't what they were tuning in for? If they were predominantly interested in info on Taker, they wouldn't stay and watch Bryan in the first segment, they would leave for a bit and tune in next segment. Based on that assertion, If the first segment did well it's almost fully to do with Bryan's big win, just as previous years with an upcoming top babyface winning the title at Mania, have done for the next night's RAW rating (See Austin/HBK and Batista/HHH).

The rest of your post I completely agree with.


----------



## #Mark

Sonnen Says said:


> Some of you actually believe it's all because of Bryan. Hey again don't show me what Bryan ratings were last weeks because they weren't any higher than this, but of course if I say otherwise I'm a troll or a hater for telling the truth, I'm not gonna say this again RTWM this year was the lowest in 18 years and I will gladly prove it if you want.
> 
> Give credits to most who was in the show because they were responsible just as much if not more since they held it up. I give credit mostly to Taker streak ending, he brought more eyes to the product and the show was booked greatly if any of you is honest. Anyway it will probably get back to normal since WWE aren't consistent in their product.


----------



## NastyYaffa

#Mark said:


>


:lmao


----------



## RatedR10

'Taker and Bryan bringing in them ratings. 

Seriously though, it was one of the best Raws in a long time. Good rating. Hopefully it keeps up and people buy into the new era we're in.


----------



## checkcola

They did bait and switch a Triple H/Bryan title match as the mainevent (though, I don't feel like anyone cared that the match didn't happen)


----------



## Choke2Death

Almost as good as Raw 1000 without all the hype. Great to see. Hopefully the ratings stay consistent going forward (obv. not on this level) since the product has really picked up in the past month.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

THANOS said:


> See, I've never understood that point mostly because of the following question. Wouldn't the viewer just tune out for 10 minutes, or so, if the first segment wasn't what they were tuning in for? If they were predominantly interested in info on Taker, they wouldn't stay and watch Bryan in the first segment, they would leave for a bit and tune in next segment. Based on that assertion, If the first segment did well it's almost fully to do with Bryan's big win, just as previous years with an upcoming top babyface winning the title at Mania, have done for the next night's RAW rating (See Austin/HBK and Batista/HHH).
> 
> The rest of your post I completely agree with.


The difference is, between the end of the streak match and the start of Raw, mostly everyone was talking about the streak ending, not Bryan winning the titles. I also credit Taker because I think the belief was Taker would show until the end of the Lesnar/Heyman segment. That's a bit more speculative than saying Taker caused a first quarter spike, but there's enough evidence to support the claim.

However, from the time the Heyman segment ended to the end of the show, that's when Bryan became the big factor.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

I love Bryan just as much as the next guy, but are we really giving majority credit to him? The streak ending was the biggest factor by far. DID YOU SEE SOCIAL MEDIA. Besides, it's not like everybody didn't expect Bryan to win. He was responsible ( with the help of trips, let's stop acting like he's chop liver) for Keeping the viewers tuned in tho most likely( with the anticipation of Taker showing up). 

TBH tho, I watched to see if Rock/Austin would show up again. After they didn't I turned to the NCAA Championship game.


----------



## Londrick

IDONTSHIV said:


> The new Daniel Bryan shirt should read: RISE ABOVE PUNK'S RATINGS. :bryan


:ti

It seems Punk's absence has done little damage to the business especially with Bryan surpassing him.


----------



## Yes Era

Lol..at trying to spin it like it was only the streak when Bryan got deafening standing ovations...the haters are the worst and most miserable sons of bitches going today.

Hey..If IT WAS ONLY THE STREAK, WHY DID THEY KEEP WATCHING THE BRYAN SEGMENT? Stupid. Dumb. Child like. Wake the fuck up. He has gotten the highest ratings all year long.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Even when he's out he's still trending more than your heroes :lmao.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Yes Era said:


> Lol..at trying to spin it like it was only the streak when Bryan got deafening standing ovations...the haters are the worst and most miserable sons of bitches going today.
> 
> Hey..If IT WAS ONLY THE STREAK, WHY DID THEY KEEP WATCHING THE BRYAN SEGMENT? Stupid. Dumb. Child like. Wake the fuck up. He has gotten the highest ratings all year long.


Ziggler got a huge pop at last years post Mania. Stop being delusional.


Sonnen Says said:


> Even when he's out he's still trending more than your heroes :lmao.


Who the fuck uses google trends? :lol. Move into the real world bro, look at Twitter. 

Plus I'm pretty sure Punk has enough time on his hands to look himself up a lot.


----------



## Happenstan

Sonnen Says said:


> Even when he's out he's still trending more than your heroes :lmao.


Another cry for help.


----------



## Osize10

I actually really didn't enjoy that raw much...I must be crazy. After after GOAT received another legendary crowd reaction, I must have been too satisfied for the night to keep watching


----------



## CookiePuss

THANOS said:


> Sure, that definitely was a factor, but huge title wins at Mania for upcoming top guys have traditionally been a huge contributor as well. I'm pretty sure when Austin beat HBK, and when Batista beat HHH, the ratings for the next night of RAW were monstrous as well, and far exceeded the lead up RAW ratings. Hopefully a poster with access to them like Validreasoning can post the comparison to validate my assertion.
> 
> Regardless of all that though, it would be hard for anyone to completely contribute the extra million views to Taker's streak ending until we get the segment by segment breakdown. That will reveal everything. And like one poster already noted, fans would be eagerly watching Heyman and Lesnar expecting something to happen with Taker, so whatever that rating is, is a direct reflection in the actual interest brought in from the end of the streak.


I know you're a big Bryan fan, and I'm a big Taker fan, but The Streak ending is the biggest thing that ever happened in Wrestlemania history, and one of the biggest things in ALL of wrestling history. It's common sense, and people are going to tune in to see what went down. "#Thankyoutaker" was the top trend for the last two days. I woke up and even saw it still trending.


----------



## Sonnen Says

CHIcagoMade said:


> Ziggler got a huge pop at last years post Mania. Stop being delusional.
> 
> 
> Who the fuck uses google trends? :lol. Move into the real world bro, look at Twitter.
> 
> Plus I'm pretty sure Punk has enough time on his hands to look himself up a lot.


Everybody uses google it's the most common site in the internet to search for someone or something :lol. Plus it's very accurate, in google (WWE wrestlers) and in twitter Taker was the #1 trend for the last 3 days. Punk was #1 trend two days ago on Yahoo too not any other WWE wrestler. People don't search for your hero, it seems not enough people care about him. When was Bryan #1 trend since he became champ? Making excuses I see. 

It's common sense that Taker streak is bigger than Bryan, you don't have to like it to admit it.


----------



## Uerfer

cookiepuss said:


> I know you're a big Bryan fan, and I'm a big Taker fan, but The Streak ending is the biggest thing that ever happened in Wrestlemania history, and one of the biggest things in ALL of wrestling history. It's common sense, and people are going to tune in to see what went down. "#Thankyoutaker" was the top trend for the last two days. I woke up and even saw it still trending.


Biggest reason for that long time trend was because some of the biggest names started retweeting with the hashtag. It started with Foley who has over a million followers, then Austin with 2.5m followers, then John Cena himself who almost never retweets any talent except Ryder(also the reason Ryder managed to get over 1m followers) did it, Cena with his 6 million followers is the most followed WWE star excluding the Rock. So all that lead to the strong trend over Bryan's win. Its not like Anderson silva streak which got major mainstream attention and was trending for days. 

Besides the twitter fanbase is global, and the ratings are US obviously. That's why even when we get high tweet action during RAW, the ratings don't reflect that. WWE is massive when you look at it globally, but within US they have reached a certain level of ceiling and I can't imagine anything but a John Cena heel turn able to break that ceiling. 

Other than being post PPV show, I think Bryan's win was the major reason for the increase. Just like everyone else, I did strongly expect it to be the streak, but now looking at the numbers it doesn't appear to be the case. 





Sonnen Says said:


> Even when he's out he's still trending more than your heroes :lmao.


fpalm you do know how these works right? These are measured based on Keywords, google tracks "CM" first and then "Punk" separately. That's why "The Rock" keyword would get you bigger result than "Dwayne Johnson" even though Dwayne is mainstream, "Undertaker" same as "punk" is not exclusive to WWE. "HHH" and "Triple H" would give you two different results. This shit means nothing.


----------



## MaybeLock

Uerfer said:


> fpalm you do know how these works right? These are measured based on Keywords, google tracks "CM" first and then "Punk" separately. That's why "The Rock" keyword would get you bigger result than "Dwayne Johnson" even though Dwayne is mainstream, "Undertaker" same as "punk" is not exclusive to WWE. "HHH" and "Triple H" would give you two different results. This shit means nothing.


Actually, if you specify to look for CM Punk "Professional Wrestler" or Undertaker "Professional Wrestler", it supposedly discards every unrelated term with Wrestling. So people looking for "Rock" music or "Punk" music should not affect those graphs. Google trends is actually a good way of measuring Internet buzz, and Punk leaving has been a hot topic these months.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Uerfer said:


> fpalm you do know how these works right? These are measured based on Keywords, google tracks "CM" first and then "Punk" separately. That's why "The Rock" keyword would get you bigger result than "Dwayne Johnson" even though Dwayne is mainstream, "Undertaker" same as "punk" is not exclusive to WWE. "HHH" and "Triple H" would give you two different results. This shit means nothing.


Lol no that's not how it works dummy. You type the name it will tell you if you mean this person or not. That's why it has the word pro wrestler underneath it. If you type the rock there will be different choices and Dwayne Johnson will be one of them.


----------



## chronoxiong

Well deserved rating for an excellent show. It's about time they reached that high since RAW 1000. It just needs to keep up. I'm not going to try to say that the ratings jump is because of Daniel Bryan or the Streak ending or whatever. I just believe it was because it's post-WM.


----------



## Uerfer

Sonnen Says said:


> Lol no that's not how it works dummy. You type the name it will tell you if you mean this person or not. That's why it has the word pro wrestler underneath it. If you type the rock there will be different choices and Dwayne Johnson will be one of them.


That's exactly how it works. It's not reliable data. 

See for yourself, 

*"Undertaker" general term comparing with "CM Punk" -*











*"The Undertaker" pro-wrestler to "CM Punk" -* 










Exactly the same. 

Google has always worked based on keywords. Its not possible to accurately track specific search data requests separate from those general term searches because its ultimately part of your search results in either case.


----------



## Stannis Baratheon

I know it's probably not healthy but the tears of Punk marks tastes so good. Keep it coming boys.


----------



## THANOS

Uerfer said:


> That's exactly how it works. It's not reliable data.
> 
> See for yourself,
> 
> *"Undertaker" general term comparing with "CM Punk" -*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *"The Undertaker" pro-wrestler to "CM Punk" -*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly the same.
> 
> Google has always worked based on keywords. Its not possible to accurately track specific search data requests separate from those general term searches because its ultimately part of your search results in either case.


Wow well done man! :clap I was actually going to credit him with his point, but you totally just solidified yours tenfold.


----------



## Happenstan

Sonnen Says said:


> Lol no that's not how it works dummy. You type the name it will tell you if you mean this person or not. That's why it has the word pro wrestler underneath it. If you type the rock there will be different choices and Dwayne Johnson will be one of them.





Uerfer said:


> That's exactly how it works. It's not reliable data.
> 
> See for yourself
> 
> ...
> 
> Exactly the same.
> 
> Google has always worked based on keywords. Its not possible to accurately track specific search data requests separate from those general term searches because its ultimately part of your search results in either case.















Enough playtime fun, back to thread stuff:

Don't we usually get the breakdown info on Tuesday nights/Wednesday mornings?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Happenstan said:


> Don't we usually get the breakdown info on Tuesday nights/Wednesday mornings?


Usually Wednesday night or Thursday I think it is.


----------



## Reaper

Just proves that you give people a new champion .. a guy they want to be champion and they'll tune in. I really think that they need to continue to work though. There's still some juice left in the authority angle and they can continue to milk it till they do the eventual rumoured Power struggle storyline. 

They could transition it from Bryan vs Authority to Authority feuding amongst themselves fairly easily.


----------



## Uerfer

From Pwtorch - 



> WWE Raw on Monday, April 7 surged to a 3.70 rating the night after WrestleMania 30. Raw was up 18 percent from last week's 3.14 rating for the WM30 lead-in show.
> 
> It was the highest rating since Raw 1,000 in July 2012, which drew a 3.84 rating. Also, Raw easily topped last year's 3.45 rating the night after WM29.
> 
> - Raw drew 5.146 million viewers, up 17 percent from last week's PPV lead-in show. It was also the most viewers since Raw 1,000.
> 
> Hourly Break Down: 5.313 million first hour viewers (up one million from last week), 5.094 million second hour viewers, and Raw held on with 5.032 million third hour viewers for the Daniel Bryan vs. Triple H teaser.
> 
> In the current three-hour Raw era, Raw has not reached 5.0 million third hour viewers since Raw 1,000. The closest was 4.93 million viewers the night after last year's Royal Rumble PPV.
> 
> - On cable TV Monday night, Raw was easily the #1 show in overall viewers and males 18-34 & 18-49. *The third hour ranked highest in the key demo of adult males.*


If Caldwell is right, then overrun most likely drew the peak.


----------



## Londrick

Google trends :ti

What's next? Facebook likes? Twitter followers?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

^Only when :bryan has the most.


----------



## Your_Solution

As a dude who marks the fuck out for Bryan and Punk, Sonnen's nonsense is legit painful to read


----------



## Lebyonics

Uerfer said:


> That's exactly how it works. It's not reliable data.
> 
> See for yourself,
> 
> *"Undertaker" general term comparing with "CM Punk" -*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *"The Undertaker" pro-wrestler to "CM Punk" -*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly the same.
> 
> Google has always worked based on keywords. Its not possible to accurately track specific search data requests separate from those general term searches because its ultimately part of your search results in either case.


Actually there is one flaw, if it was based on key words *Punk* would have eclipsed all other words. I dont think anybody would search Undertaker as general term thats why both Undertaker the wrestler and Undertaker the term are similar. Better comparison would be this

http://www.google.co.in/trends/explore#q=punk%2C%20%2Fm%2F05l473%2C%20%2Fm%2F01ypw9&cmpt=q

Anyways.....those are monster ratings, shows that things are changing and hope it continues.


----------



## Darkness is here

Lol at bryan marks for giving bryan the majority of credit :lol.

Undertaker was the biggest reason for extra 1million viewers, he is a big household name, when his loss got mainstream attention, people were shocked to learn the streak was over and tuned into raw to see taker's reaction to it.


----------



## THANOS

Darkness is here said:


> Lol at bryan marks for giving bryan the majority of credit :lol.
> 
> Undertaker was the biggest reason for extra 1million viewers, he is a big household name, when his loss got mainstream attention, people were shocked to learn the streak was over and tuned into raw to see taker's reaction to it.


Then why was there still over 5 million viewers for the second and third hour when the Heyman/Brock segment happened in the first hour?  Would you be willing to retract your comment if the ratings breakdown comes it and it shows the interest was firmly behind Bryan and HHH?


----------



## MaybeLock

Lebyonics said:


> Actually there is one flaw, if it was based on key words *Punk* would have eclipsed all other words. I dont think anybody would search Undertaker as general term thats why both Undertaker the wrestler and Undertaker the term are similar. Better comparison would be this
> 
> http://www.google.co.in/trends/explore#q=punk%2C%20%2Fm%2F05l473%2C%20%2Fm%2F01ypw9&cmpt=q
> 
> Anyways.....those are monster ratings, shows that things are changing and hope it continues.


Exactly. Also, you can see how the Undertaker graph when you specify professional wrestler is even larger than just Undertaker. Probably because they are counting searches related to Taker, even though they didnt use the word Undertaker.


----------



## funnyfaces1

Great to see merit pay off. Hopefully the momentum carries on, and hopefully this dumb Punk/Bryan nonsense in this thread ends. Do people not realize that most fans like both of them instead of one or the other?


----------



## purple_gloves

THANOS said:


> Then why was there still over 5 million viewers for the second and third hour when the Heyman/Brock segment happened in the first hour?  Would you be willing to retract your comment if the ratings breakdown comes it and it shows the interest was firmly behind Bryan and HHH?


If the main event does better than lesnar/Heyman segment then everybody will have to admit Bryan/HHH is a bigger draw. The clearly huge opener can't really be accredited to any one thing imo as it was obviously going to draw big regardless.

Overall I think they did a good job of balancing things nicely and deserve credit for putting on a good show.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Uerfer said:


> That's exactly how it works. It's not reliable data.
> 
> See for yourself,
> 
> *"Undertaker" general term comparing with "CM Punk" -*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *"The Undertaker" pro-wrestler to "CM Punk" -*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly the same.
> 
> Google has always worked based on keywords. Its not possible to accurately track specific search data requests separate from those general term searches because its ultimately part of your search results in either case.


Again not exactly how you see it. If you type just Punk you will see a much larger result, same thing if you type just CM. Plus when you type Undertaker in google it will show you the wrestler himself because it's a common name to search for him, if you look closely to the pic it got little bit lager in comparison when you correct it to pro wrestler.


----------



## Fanboi101

Sonnen Says said:


> Again not exactly how you see it. If you type just Punk you will see a much larger result, same thing if you type just CM. Plus when you type Undertaker in google it will show you the wrestler himself because it's a common name to search for him, if you look closely to the pic it got little bit lager in comparison when you correct it to pro wrestler.


The drop down menu just changes the search term... it doesn't reflect the searches "for what people actually were searching for", as if it has some type of mind reading algorithm lol. For example, when you type "the Rock", "dwayne johnson" comes up. If you click "dwayne johnson" the results come up for the search term "dwayne johnson", not for all searches where people typed "The Rock" in the sense of searching for the wrestler not an actual rock.


----------



## Mr.S

This is stupid. Why are people debating it? Punk was a great talent but his reign was the worst drawing reign in WWE history in the past 10 years. He was in the mid-cards because the ratings were so shit.

Bryan is a proven draw and even since his SD Reign he has been drawing monster ratings. The people pay to see Bryan. The theme of a Wrestlemania was build around Bryan and he wrestled 2 matches. You can comparing the drawing Power with Cena, Rock, Austin, etc.

Why are people debating with Punk. Compare Punk with Sheamus, Diesel,etc reigns. 

The 2 talents are in 2 much different leagues now. You can't compare Zack Ryder to the Rock in terms of Drawing Power


----------



## Mr.S

Uerfer said:


> From Pwtorch -
> 
> 
> 
> If Caldwell is right, then overrun most likely drew the peak.



RAW should be 2 hours. No one has the patience of a 3 year Hour RAW. Everyone skips through parts. If Raw was 2 Hours, WWE can cut the crap and filler matches and genuinely look at a potential 4-5 Ratings provided the material is as good.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Fanboi101 said:


> The drop down menu just changes the search term... it doesn't reflect the searches "for what people actually were searching for", as if it has some type of mind reading algorithm lol. For example, when you type "the Rock", "dwayne johnson" comes up. If you click "dwayne johnson" the results come up for the search term "dwayne johnson", not for all searches where people typed "The Rock" in the sense of searching for the wrestler not an actual rock.


Not, when you type the rock it will show you who you meant that's why Dwayne name comes because he's also known for being the Rock. If you just type the rock then everything related to the name Rock will come because you didn't specify who you meant. In the pic itself it says it's an accurate measurement of your interest.


----------



## Waffelz

THANOS said:


> Then why was there still over 5 million viewers for the second and third hour when the *Heyman/Brock segment happened in the first hour?*  Would you be willing to retract your comment if the ratings breakdown comes it and it shows the interest was firmly behind Bryan and HHH?


Second hour, no?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I thought it was in the second hour, too.

TBH, it could still top the night as the numbers are close enough together... I don't expect it though. Either the opener tops the night due to being the fallout from Mania/streak ending/some credit to Bryan's title win, or the overrun tops it because it's the overrun and in anticipation for Bryan's first title defense against HHH.


----------



## birthday_massacre

Darkness is here said:


> Lol at bryan marks for giving bryan the majority of credit :lol.
> 
> Undertaker was the biggest reason for extra 1million viewers, he is a big household name, when his loss got mainstream attention, people were shocked to learn the streak was over and tuned into raw to see taker's reaction to it.


I love haters like you. When DB headlines a PPV/RAW and it does poorly he gets all the blame not Cena who he was facing and not Lesnar who was in another match.
Then when a PPV or Raw does well build around DB, he doenst get the credit. So typical. Because we all know if raws ratings tanked then DB would get all the blame


----------



## dmccourt95

I don't think you can put the great rating down to one person, It's obviously a build up from a great WrestleMania with one of the most shocking events in recent history and a new champion who has been growing in popularity for 2 years. If they keep up the quaklity of show with this Authority storyline going with some more juice, a good few directions still to take and a growing interest in the divas and midcard then they should keep these rating throughout the summer with them gradually increasing anytime a special attraction comes back


----------



## Fanboi101

Sonnen Says said:


> Not, when you type the rock it will show you who you meant that's why Dwayne name comes because he's also known for being the Rock. If you just type the rock then everything related to the name Rock will come because you didn't specify who you meant. In the pic itself it says it's an accurate measurement of your interest.


double post


----------



## Fanboi101

Sonnen Says said:


> Not, when you type the rock it will show you who you meant that's why Dwayne name comes because he's also known for being the Rock. If you just type the rock then everything related to the name Rock will come because you didn't specify who you meant. In the pic itself it says it's an accurate measurement of your interest.


Alright, maybe you're right


----------



## purple_gloves

Mr.S said:


> This is stupid. Why are people debating it? Punk was a great talent but his reign was the worst drawing reign in WWE history in the past 10 years. He was in the mid-cards because the ratings were so shit.
> 
> Bryan is a proven draw and even since his SD Reign he has been drawing monster ratings. The people pay to see Bryan. The theme of a Wrestlemania was build around Bryan and he wrestled 2 matches. You can comparing the drawing Power with Cena, Rock, Austin, etc.
> 
> Why are people debating with Punk. Compare Punk with Sheamus, Diesel,etc reigns.
> 
> The 2 talents are in 2 much different leagues now. You can't compare Zack Ryder to the Rock in terms of Drawing Power


Terrible delusional post.


----------



## Uerfer

Sonnen Says said:


> Again not exactly how you see it. If you type just Punk you will see a much larger result, same thing if you type just CM. Plus when you type Undertaker in google it will show you the wrestler himself because it's a common name to search for him, if you look closely to the pic it got little bit lager in comparison when you correct it to pro wrestler.


Point is, it's not reliable data as I previously said. In this case, you're really assuming everyone whoever typed the word "undertaker" on google, only has the WWE character in mind, same way anyone who looked up "The" "Rock" has only Dwayne johnson in mind. Same for the word "Punk", Ofcourse when you compare "Punk" to "CM Punk" its going to show you the distinction, but there is no way to tell if those weren't part of general term searches, especially when you look at the search queries globally. I'm not completely discrediting it, just that it can't be used as a standard. 




#BadNewsSanta said:


> TBH, *it could still top the night as the numbers are close enough together...* I don't expect it though.


I doubt the entire 15min quarter would be the peak of the show, but it can still draw the peak minute-by-minute viewership high of the show within the QH.


----------



## Fissiks

so no breakdowns this week?


----------



## Vyer

I hope I'm doing this right. This is the breakdown from PWtorch

Edit: Removing since JY57 also posted the breakdown.


----------



## JY57

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_77624.shtml#.U0XApV64llI



> Leading into WrestleMania 30, the Daniel Bryan vs. Triple H program was the top draw of Raw each week. Coming out of WM30, Bryan as new WWE World Hvt. champion has been solidified as a ratings draw.
> 
> Monday's post-WM30 Raw scored the highest overall rating since Raw 1,000 on the strength of Bryan's show-opening celebration segment and teased WWE Title match against Triple H in the over-run. Plus, a team effort of several other segments drawing big audiences throughout the show.
> 
> Specific to Bryan, Raw opened with a 2.70 males 18-49 rating, which blew away a 1.85 rating in the same Q1 segment last week. Raw then closed with a 2.91 m18-49 over-run rating, growing on last week's 2.68 over-run rating for the final image of Bryan standing tall after attacking Hunter heading into WM30.
> 
> The top non-Bryan segments of the show were Paige capturing the Divas Title from A.J. in Q10 and Hulk Hogan presenting Cesaro with the Andre the Giant trophy in Q11. This helped offset the usual third-hour decline and actually grow the third hour to the point that it topped five million overall viewers for the first time since Raw 1,000.
> 
> Also, Paul Heyman's promo on behalf of Brock Lesnar addressing The Undertaker in Q5 drew a strong rating. And, Ultimate Warrior's TV return in Q9 ranked in the middle of the pack.
> 
> Raw Break Down - m18-49 demo
> 
> - Overall Show: 2.48 rating / 1.562 million viewers
> 
> - Q1: Raw opened with a regular-show-high 2.70 rating for the immediate WM30 follow-up and Daniel Bryan's celebration. Noteworthy is the quarter-hour grew substantially from the beginning to end. So, it was not a case of a huge surge at 8:00 p.m. EST for immediate follow-up on The Streak ending, then viewers tuning out.
> 
> The segment grew from 1.555 million viewers at 8:03 p.m. to 1.770 million viewers at 8:06 p.m. to 1.814 million viewers at 8:08 p,m. to 1.836 million viewers at 8:12 p.m. to a peak audience of 1.843 million viewers at 8:13 p.m. when the title match main event was set up.
> 
> - Q2: Raw settled down to a 2.47 rating for two commercial breaks and ring introductions for the opening match.
> 
> The ring intros drew the second-largest audience of the show, peaking with 1.879 million viewers at 8:22 p.m. prior to a commercial.
> 
> - Q3: Raw increased to a 2.53 rating for The Wyatts vs. John Cena, Big E., and Sheamus, plus one commercial. The end of the match drew a solid audience, peaking with 1.809 million viewers at 8:42 p.m.
> 
> - Q4: Raw dropped to a 2.35 rating for two commercials and Santino & Emma vs. Fandango & Summer Rae in a mixed tag match.
> 
> - Q5: Raw jumped to a 2.58 rating at the top of the second hour for Heyman's promo and viewers thinking perhaps Taker would make an appearance.
> 
> The segment built from 1.687 million viewers at 9:01 p.m. to a peak of 1.817 million viewers at 9:06 p.m. Some of the audience tuned out during the second-half of the promo, though, as the final four minutes drew fewer than 1.8 million.
> 
> - Q6: Raw dropped to a 2.22 rating for The Usos vs. Randy Orton & Batista, one commercial, and Rob Van Dam's unannounced TV return. The peak audience was 1.634 million viewers at 9:22 when Raw cut to break following the tag match.
> 
> - Q7: Raw was about the same at a show-low 2.21 rating for Rey Mysterio vs. Bad News Barrett and one commercial.
> 
> - Q8: Raw increased to a 2.30 rating for two full commercials and Rusev squashing Zack Ryder.
> 
> - Q9: Raw bumped up to a 2.51 rating at the top of the third hour for Ultimate Warrior's TV return and final promo, plus one commercial, and Paige debuting to confront Divas champion A.J. Lee.
> 
> The segment peaked with 1.737 million viewers at 10:04 p.m. as Warrior wrapped up his speech.
> 
> - Q10: Raw held steady with a 2.49 rating for Paige capturing the Divas Title from A.J., which popped a big audience of 1.823 million viewers at 10:19 p.m. Raw then cut to break and returned with the start of Hulk Hogan presenting the Andre trophy to Cesaro.
> 
> - Q11: Raw increased to a 2.64 rating for Hogan congratulating Cesaro, the Real Americans breaking up, Cesaro aligning with Paul Heyman, one commercial, and Cesaro vs. Jack Swagger.
> 
> The first-half of the segment drew a huge audience - 1.801 million viewers at 10:31 p.m., then 1.834 million viewers at 10:33 p.m., and a peak of 1.877 million viewers at 10:34 p.m. heading to break.
> 
> - Q12: Raw settled down to a 2.36 rating for two full commercial breaks and backstage segments leading to the main event.
> 
> - Over-run: Raw popped a 2.91 rating for the teased Bryan vs. Hunter title match that turned into an angle setting up Bryan & Shield vs. The Authority, Batista, and Orton.
> 
> The over-run started with 1.710 million viewers, jumped to 1.948 million viewers at 11:05 p.m. before many people's DVRs cut out, then went off the air with 1.932 million viewers and 1.878 million viewers.
> 
> Top Minutes of Raw
> 
> - Over-Run (Bryan-Hunter): 1.948 million viewers peak
> - Q2 (Wyatts-Team Cena set-up): 1.879 million viewers
> - Q1 (Bryan Celebration): 1.843 million viewers
> - Q11 (Cesaro/Heyman/Hogan): 1.834 million viewers
> - Q10 (A.J.-Paige): 1.823 million viewers
> - Q5 (Heyman on Taker): 1.817 million viewers
> - Q3 (Wyatts-Team Cena ending): 1.809 million viewers
> - Q9 (Warrior): 1.737 million viewers


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Well, looks like Bryan-mania is running wild after all. Huge overrun number, and despite what I thought based on the hours numbers, it looks like the first quarter was indeed down primarily to Bryan (at least in this demo anyway), based on the fact it kept building up as the segment went on.


----------



## Uerfer

Guess I was right about the streak not being the major reason but Bryan-HHH as usual.


----------



## MaybeLock

So it's pretty clear now that Bryan was the main reason for those ratings.

Haters running out of ideas now, I guess.


----------



## Born of Osiris

Ah.... I remember the days when people would say Bryan isn't a draw and and is only over because of the YES chant and how it'll eventually die down because it's just a fad.

Wonder how they're feeling right now :bryan


----------



## THANOS

Just as I expected. The fans tuned in predominantly for Bryan's win and not the streak. This breakdown and Caldwell's analysis below prove it.



> *Leading into WrestleMania 30, the Daniel Bryan vs. Triple H program was the top draw of Raw each week. Coming out of WM30, Bryan as new WWE World Hvt. champion has been solidified as a ratings draw.
> 
> Monday's post-WM30 Raw scored the highest overall rating since Raw 1,000 on the strength of Bryan's show-opening celebration segment and teased WWE Title match against Triple H in the over-run. Plus, a team effort of several other segments drawing big audiences throughout the show.
> 
> Specific to Bryan, Raw opened with a 2.70 males 18-49 rating, which blew away a 1.85 rating in the same Q1 segment last week. Raw then closed with a 2.91 m18-49 over-run rating, growing on last week's 2.68 over-run rating for the final image of Bryan standing tall after attacking Hunter heading into WM30.*
> 
> The top non-Bryan segments of the show were Paige capturing the Divas Title from A.J. in Q10 and Hulk Hogan presenting Cesaro with the Andre the Giant trophy in Q11. This helped offset the usual third-hour decline and actually grow the third hour to the point that it topped five million overall viewers for the first time since Raw 1,000.
> 
> Also, Paul Heyman's promo on behalf of Brock Lesnar addressing The Undertaker in Q5 drew a strong rating. And, Ultimate Warrior's TV return in Q9 ranked in the middle of the pack.
> 
> Raw Break Down - m18-49 demo
> 
> - Overall Show: 2.48 rating / 1.562 million viewers
> 
> *- Q1: Raw opened with a regular-show-high 2.70 rating for the immediate WM30 follow-up and Daniel Bryan's celebration. Noteworthy is the quarter-hour grew substantially from the beginning to end. So, it was not a case of a huge surge at 8:00 p.m. EST for immediate follow-up on The Streak ending, then viewers tuning out.*


And we were called deluded for suggesting it was due to Bryan's win and not the end of the godly streak like some expected 



> *The segment grew from 1.555 million viewers at 8:03 p.m. to 1.770 million viewers at 8:06 p.m. to 1.814 million viewers at 8:08 p,m. to 1.836 million viewers at 8:12 p.m. to a peak audience of 1.843 million viewers at 8:13 p.m. when the title match main event was set up.*
> 
> - Q2: Raw settled down to a 2.47 rating for two commercial breaks and ring introductions for the opening match.
> 
> The ring intros drew the second-largest audience of the show, peaking with 1.879 million viewers at 8:22 p.m. prior to a commercial.
> 
> - Q3: Raw increased to a 2.53 rating for The Wyatts vs. John Cena, Big E., and Sheamus, plus one commercial. The end of the match drew a solid audience, peaking with 1.809 million viewers at 8:42 p.m.
> 
> - Q4: Raw dropped to a 2.35 rating for two commercials and Santino & Emma vs. Fandango & Summer Rae in a mixed tag match.
> 
> - Q5: Raw jumped to a 2.58 rating at the top of the second hour for Heyman's promo and viewers thinking perhaps Taker would make an appearance.
> 
> The segment built from 1.687 million viewers at 9:01 p.m. to a peak of 1.817 million viewers at 9:06 p.m. Some of the audience tuned out during the second-half of the promo, though, as the final four minutes drew fewer than 1.8 million.
> 
> - Q6: Raw dropped to a 2.22 rating for The Usos vs. Randy Orton & Batista, one commercial, and Rob Van Dam's unannounced TV return. The peak audience was 1.634 million viewers at 9:22 when Raw cut to break following the tag match.
> 
> - Q7: Raw was about the same at a show-low 2.21 rating for Rey Mysterio vs. Bad News Barrett and one commercial.
> 
> - Q8: Raw increased to a 2.30 rating for two full commercials and Rusev squashing Zack Ryder.
> 
> - Q9: Raw bumped up to a 2.51 rating at the top of the third hour for Ultimate Warrior's TV return and final promo, plus one commercial, and Paige debuting to confront Divas champion A.J. Lee.
> 
> The segment peaked with 1.737 million viewers at 10:04 p.m. as Warrior wrapped up his speech.
> 
> - Q10: Raw held steady with a 2.49 rating for Paige capturing the Divas Title from A.J., which popped a big audience of 1.823 million viewers at 10:19 p.m. Raw then cut to break and returned with the start of Hulk Hogan presenting the Andre trophy to Cesaro.
> 
> - Q11: Raw increased to a 2.64 rating for Hogan congratulating Cesaro, the Real Americans breaking up, Cesaro aligning with Paul Heyman, one commercial, and Cesaro vs. Jack Swagger.
> 
> The first-half of the segment drew a huge audience - 1.801 million viewers at 10:31 p.m., then 1.834 million viewers at 10:33 p.m., and a peak of 1.877 million viewers at 10:34 p.m. heading to break.
> 
> - Q12: Raw settled down to a 2.36 rating for two full commercial breaks and backstage segments leading to the main event.
> 
> *- Over-run: Raw popped a 2.91 rating for the teased Bryan vs. Hunter title match that turned into an angle setting up Bryan & Shield vs. The Authority, Batista, and Orton.
> 
> The over-run started with 1.710 million viewers, jumped to 1.948 million viewers at 11:05 p.m. before many people's DVRs cut out, then went off the air with 1.932 million viewers and 1.878 million viewers.*
> 
> *Top Minutes of Raw*
> 
> *- Over-Run (Bryan-Hunter): 1.948 million viewers peak*
> - Q2 (Wyatts-Team Cena set-up): 1.879 million viewers
> *- Q1 (Bryan Celebration): 1.843 million viewers*
> - Q11 (Cesaro/Heyman/Hogan): 1.834 million viewers
> - Q10 (A.J.-Paige): 1.823 million viewers
> - Q5 (Heyman on Taker): 1.817 million viewers
> - Q3 (Wyatts-Team Cena ending): 1.809 million viewers
> - Q9 (Warrior): 1.737 million viewers


Now have at thee detractors . The Heyman/Brock segment with the tease of Taker was only the 5th highest quarter which says everything really, and it even lost viewers as it went on. Although that could be attributed to viewers maybe realizing Taker wouldn't show. Even still, it didn't come close to Bryan's segments which all grew as they went on showing that viewers weren't tuning in to see the Streak fallout predominantly like everyone here said. Social media activity does not always translate into viewers and this proves it.

Other than that, it was great to see the Wyatt's and Cena, Paige's debut, and the Cesaro reveal pull huge numbers!


----------



## Uerfer

It was a smart move by WWE to have Hogan give the rub to Cesaro, clearly he was the reason for Q11 increase.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Bryan + Yes chant outdraws Heyman's rant. The little man with the average physique draws in more viewers than the end of the streak!!!! BRYAN=RATINGS CASE CLOSED!!! :bryan


----------



## Tardbasher12

Daniel Bryan is a draw, and there isn't a *damn* thing any of you can do about it.
:hunter


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7

Bryan is really becoming a huge star. Hopefully they book him well and continues to increase as a draw.


----------



## THANOS

One thing I must say here, is I have to give Triple H so much damn credit because this man put Bryan over so huge the past couple months. His verbal bashing and eventual loss to Bryan made him into a certified future megastar and I have a feeling these ratings will only increase going forward . Got to hand it to Hunter when he really wants to put you over as a top guy, his recipe truly does equal success for the recipient. Remember how huge Batista became as a ratings draw after beating HHH at Mania? This is phenomenal to watch!


----------



## JY57

outside of the obvious (Bryan), its good to see Paige, Cesaro, Wyatts do so well in the 18-49 demos.

Heyman, Cena, & Brock are already proven draws so them getting outshines in ratings by the newbies doesn't bother me & TBH I think WWE wants to see that since they already know what they have with Brock, Cena, & Heyman


----------



## purple_gloves

Wow. I stand corrected. Bryan/HHH is a bigger draw than the end of the streak. I'm shocked. Not so much at Bryan/HHH drawing well as its been a proper feud with a proper pay off. Im just shocked at such little interest in the ending of the streak. I honestly thought it would have been more of an issue, especially considering the huge amount of mainstream media attention it garnered.

Great news that so many people are invested in feuds that feature full time members of the roster. It just goes to show that the viewers are still there if they build people up the right way and put them in interesting feuds.


----------



## THANOS

JY57 said:


> outside of the obvious (Bryan), its good to see Paige, Cesaro, Wyatts do so well in the 18-49 demos.
> 
> Heyman, Cena, & Brock are already proven draws so them getting outshines in ratings by the newbies doesn't bother me & TBH I think WWE wants to see that since they already know what they have with Brock, Cena, & Heyman


I couldn't agree more! More measures being taken towards elevating the overall rating. Even Rusev's debut did an increase from the previous segment which was also nice to see!


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Uerfer said:


> It was a smart move by WWE to have Hogan give the rub to Cesaro, clearly he was the reason for Q11 increase.


I think it being a well promoted upcoming seg helped too. It's the fallout to the breakup, and I'm guessing there was a HUGE amount of interest leading to it as well. :clap well done.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Tardbasher12 said:


> Daniel Bryan is a draw, and there isn't a *damn* thing any of you can do about it.
> :hunter


Their tears can help them wash down that crow they are eating.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Um, people do realize the Heyman segment still did well, right? It's peak viewership was only 60,000 down from the peak of the show (overrun aside) and even the overrun was only a little more than 100,000 above it. 

So while the Bryan winning the titles has proven to be the main drawing point of the show and first quarter after all, the streak ending was still a strong help in keeping things afloat.

But going back to what I said a day ago, the fact the show was so well structured is another important reason that the overall numbers stayed so high.


----------



## elo

THANOS said:


> One thing I must say here, is I have to give Triple H so much damn credit because this man put Bryan over so huge the past couple months. His verbal bashing and eventual loss to *Bryan made him into a certified future megastar and I have a feeling these ratings will only increase going forward .* Got to hand it to Hunter when he really wants to put you over as a top guy, his recipe truly does equal success for the recipient. Remember how huge Batista became as a ratings draw after beating HHH at Mania? This is phenomenal to watch!


Vince and Steph will get greedy and fuck it up unfortunately, they'll book him way too strong and it will become tiring. They need to book a face champion that actually loses clean to heels from time to time, there's nothing wrong with Bryan trading CLEAN wins with legit heels - I will pay to see a proper back and forth feud between Bryan and Cesaro or Bryan and Lesnar. I don't want to see heels having to cheat to beat Bryan, I don't want another guy booked like Cena - Bryan had his Cena like performance at Mania now they need to find him a legitimate nemesis to go back and forth with, ideally that is Cesaro within 6 months. (I think he's ready to go to the top)

*REALITY ERA* time Vince, we don't need the babyfaces looking unbeatable 24/7 anymore Vince! Bad guys can win titles clean too man!

Bryan is your top draw, *DON'T FUCK IT UP.*


----------



## Uerfer

Rather incredible to see Overrun almost nailing the 3.0 mark in 18-49 demo. Shows massive interest.


----------



## THANOS

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Um, people do realize the Heyman segment still did well, right? It's peak viewership was only 60,000 down from the peak of the show (overrun aside) and even the overrun was only a little more than 100,000 above it.
> 
> So while the Bryan winning the titles has proven to be the main drawing point of the show and first quarter after all, the streak ending was still a strong help in keeping things afloat.
> 
> But going back to what I said a day ago, the fact the show was so well structured is another important reason that the overall numbers stayed so high.


Indeed, but not nearly that big of a factor as some expected. It was only the 6th highest quarter, and lost viewers as it went on. Not including Bryan it was beaten by the debut of Paige, the 6-man tag, and Cesaro.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

THANOS said:


> Indeed, but not nearly that big of a factor as some expected. It was only the 6th highest quarter, and lost viewers as it went on. Not including Bryan it was beaten by the debut of Paige, the 6-man tag, and Cesaro.


Actually, it ended up being the 4th highest quarter, had the 6th highest peak. Although with the peaks being so close together with those above (except the 6-man tag), that could've been due to channel changing above all else and people happening to stumble on certain parts of the show that led to one being higher than the other. 

At the end of the day though, bottom line, the attention was mostly on Bryan, and WWE managed to keep the numbers high throughout the show with a combination of the streak ending, keeping something important happening throughout the show, debuts, and a title match in the main event between Bryan and HHH to keep people tuned in/making sure they come back for the end of the show. Even the lowest quarter of the show, a 2.21, is still higher/just as high/almost as high as several overruns from mid-October.


----------



## THANOS

elo said:


> Vince and Steph will get greedy and fuck it up unfortunately, they'll book him way too strong and it will become tiring. They need to book a face champion that actually loses clean to heels from time to time, there's nothing wrong with Bryan trading CLEAN wins with legit heels - I will pay to see a proper back and forth feud between Bryan and Cesaro or Bryan and Lesnar. I don't want to see heels having to cheat to beat Bryan, I don't want another guy booked like Cena - Bryan had his Cena like performance at Mania now they need to find him a legitimate nemesis to go back and forth with, ideally that is Cesaro within 6 months. (I think he's ready to go to the top)
> 
> *REALITY ERA* time Vince, we don't need the babyfaces looking unbeatable 24/7 anymore Vince! Bad guys can win titles clean too man!
> 
> Bryan is your top draw, *DON'T FUCK IT UP.*


I agree completely man. He should lose clean to Cesaro eventually in a feud between the two, with beating Bryan clean on RAW, and Bryan cutting a promo saying, 

:bryan3: "You beat me fair and square in the centre of this ring, because you were, plain and simple, the better man that night, but how about we settle this with the title on the line at 'INSERT PPV' and see if you can do it again?"

That promo can sell a feud easily and Bryan looks strong and so does Cesaro. No one looks bad coming out of a feud like that. I feel the same way about feuds with Lesnar and Rollins. Bryan should dominate the body builder/male model guys butt lose to the real talented wrestlers, that may not be as big (with the exception of course lol) to continue to put over the fact that talent wins matches not size.


----------



## CJohn3:16

Good God look at those ratings :vince$


----------



## THANOS

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Actually, it ended up being the 4th highest quarter, had the 6th highest peak. Although with the peaks being so close together with those above (except the 6-man tag), that could've been due to channel changing above all else and people happening to stumble on certain parts of the show that led to one being higher than the other.
> 
> At the end of the day though, bottom line, the attention was mostly on Bryan, and WWE managed to keep the numbers high throughout the show with a combination of the streak ending, keeping something important happening throughout the show, debuts, and a title match in the main event between Bryan and HHH to keep people tuned in/making sure they come back for the end of the show. Even the lowest quarter of the show, a 2.21, is still higher/just as high/almost as high as several overruns from mid-October.


Definitely man. I think the key from here is to contonue to build off this and create unique and exciting feuds with the prominent members of the roster going forward to create the recipe to increase the overall rating trends.


----------



## Fissiks

adding the Shield into the mix was a good call

i wonder how well it does next week when Daniel Bryan is out on his honeymoon...


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Cesaro and DB reaching the point of being able to feud continuously over the undisputed title like Cena and Punk were in 2012 would be awesome. 

With Heyman, it's pretty damn possible to do without fail. Heyman made a Punk vs Ryback and Axel feud interesting for several weeks.


----------



## THANOS

swagger_ROCKS said:


> Cesaro and DB reaching the point of being able to feud continuously over the undisputed title like Cena and Punk were in 2012 would be awesome.
> 
> With Heyman, it's pretty damn possible to do without fail. Heyman made a Punk vs Ryback and Axel feud interesting for several weeks.


Oh man it's going to be like a new version of the Bret Hart/Bulldog feud with epic matches between long time friends trying to prove who's better, only with the added bonus of Heyman's promo work :mark: :banderas.


----------



## LKRocks

The Reality Era is drawing extremelly well without relying so much on the old guard. Bryan is over as fuck. Shield is over, Cesaro is over, Wyatts are over. Even the Paige/Aj segment did extremely well.

This is the best WWE's main event/Upper mid card scene has been since the beggining of the Ruthless Agression Era. And back then we had ROck, Austin, Hogan, Eddie, Lesnar. 

Now, we have mostly new guys. And they're drawing. WWE's future is bright.


----------



## ecabney

elo said:


> Vince and Steph will get greedy and fuck it up unfortunately, they'll book him way too strong and it will become tiring. They need to book a face champion that actually loses clean to heels from time to time, there's nothing wrong with Bryan trading CLEAN wins with legit heels - I will pay to see a proper back and forth feud between Bryan and Cesaro or Bryan and Lesnar. I don't want to see heels having to cheat to beat Bryan, I don't want another guy booked like Cena - Bryan had his Cena like performance at Mania now they need to find him a legitimate nemesis to go back and forth with, ideally that is Cesaro within 6 months. (I think he's ready to go to the top)
> 
> *REALITY ERA* time Vince, we don't need the babyfaces looking unbeatable 24/7 anymore Vince! Bad guys can win titles clean too man!
> 
> Bryan is your top draw, *DON'T FUCK IT UP.*


You're right. Would love to see him have similar booking to a guy like The Rock.


----------



## #Mark

Bryan, Shield, Cesaro, and Cena (ugh) as the top babyfaces. Lesnar, HHH, Orton, Batista, Wyatt as the top heels. 

Don't fuck this up WWE, you have something very special.


----------



## Starbuck

HOLY RATINGS

Daniel Bryan vs. Triple H is the modern day Austin/McMahon. The formula just works amd in saying that, they're booking it more akin to early 2000 when we had The Rock and am uneasy alliance with Jericho, the Dudleys etc all helping him out in his fight against the faction. Now we have Bryan leading the charge, likely with an uneasy Shield alliance, against the Authority. 

EVERYTHING IS AWESOME 

Mega numbers. WWE has a lot to be proud of here. They absolutely deserve it for the fantastic shows they've put on this week.

:bryan2 + :trips2 = :vince$

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Sonnen Says

THANOS said:


> Just as I expected. The fans tuned in predominantly for Bryan's win and not the streak. This breakdown and Caldwell's analysis below prove it.
> 
> 
> 
> And we were called deluded for suggesting it was due to Bryan's win and not the end of the godly streak like some expected
> 
> 
> 
> Now have at thee detractors . The Heyman/Brock segment with the tease of Taker was only the 5th highest quarter which says everything really, and it even lost viewers as it went on. Although that could be attributed to viewers maybe realizing Taker wouldn't show. Even still, it didn't come close to Bryan's segments which all grew as they went on showing that viewers weren't tuning in to see the Streak fallout predominantly like everyone here said. Social media activity does not always translate into viewers and this proves it.
> 
> Other than that, it was great to see the Wyatt's and Cena, Paige's debut, and the Cesaro reveal pull huge numbers!


Well I give it to you . Bryan did very well, but I still think Taker streak had a lot of value and brought a lot of eyes to the product. If Taker did show up he would probably have had the highest of the night, I don't think there was a tease, Paul had an epic promo explaining how big of a star Brock is compared to any other and I don't think people want to hear that, they wanted to see what will Taker do. 

In the end the show was very well structured and I'm so proud of Cesaro segment doing so well, but there is something I don't get doesn't it say the peak of the segment was 1.877 because instead it says 1.834 in the top minutes :|, so by this doesn't this mean it's the third highest peak, awesome. Finally people are into Cesaro + lets not forget the debuts it shows people are into the new generation and Warrior return in 20+ years also helped. Anyway if this is just for this week then it's mostly because it's the night after WM considering how controversial it was.


----------



## Starbuck

SONNEN STOP LYING EVERYBODY KNOWS THE RATINGS WERE SO HIGH BECAUSE WE WERE ALL EXPECTING CM PUNK TO APPEAR AMIRITE?

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## SerapisLiber

elo said:


> Vince and Steph will get greedy and fuck it up unfortunately, they'll book him way too strong and it will become tiring. They need to book a face champion that actually loses clean to heels from time to time, there's nothing wrong with Bryan trading CLEAN wins with legit heels - I will pay to see a proper back and forth feud between Bryan and Cesaro or Bryan and Lesnar. I don't want to see heels having to cheat to beat Bryan, I don't want another guy booked like Cena - Bryan had his Cena like performance at Mania now they need to find him a legitimate nemesis to go back and forth with, ideally that is Cesaro within 6 months. (I think he's ready to go to the top)
> 
> *REALITY ERA* time Vince, we don't need the babyfaces looking unbeatable 24/7 anymore Vince! Bad guys can win titles clean too man!
> 
> Bryan is your top draw, *DON'T FUCK IT UP.*


Careful, or they might take this as a cue to book him like Mysterio's atrocious title reign (even Rey said he felt like he jobbed more while being the "champ" than he did during the entire previous year). Especially given his similarity in size. In fact, come to think of it, Bryan even already has two title reigns of less than a day just like Rey too. Uh oh.


----------



## iverson19

Bryan, Paige and AJ are all short people and they are getting the big ratings. Who would've thunk it? A dude who looks like a goat and two women. Ha.


----------



## THANOS

ecabney said:


> You're right. Would love to see him have similar booking to a guy like The Rock.


A sign of things to come?










Passing of the ratings torch :banderas.



#Mark said:


> Bryan, Shield, Cesaro, and Cena (ugh) as the top babyfaces. Lesnar, HHH, Orton, Batista, Wyatt as the top heels.
> 
> Don't fuck this up WWE, you have something very special.


Totally agree it's an exciting time to be a WWE fan, at least for the majority of us!



Starbuck said:


> HOLY RATINGS
> 
> Daniel Bryan vs. Triple H is the modern day Austin/McMahon. The formula just works amd in saying that, they're booking it more akin to early 2000 when we had The Rock and am uneasy alliance with Jericho, the Dudleys etc all helping him out in his fight against the faction. Now we have Bryan leading the charge, likely with an uneasy Shield alliance, against the Authority.
> 
> EVERYTHING IS AWESOME
> 
> Mega numbers. WWE has a lot to be proud of here. They absolutely deserve it for the fantastic shows they've put on this week.
> 
> :bryan2 + :trips2 = :vince$
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


God I love Trips for doing this. I finally love everything about the shows again! :mark: Bless that man and his epic heel selling :.



Sonnen Says said:


> Well I give it to you . Bryan did very well, but I still think Taker streak had a lot of value and brought a lot of eyes to the product. If Taker did show up he would probably have had the highest of the night, I don't think there was a tease, Paul had an epic promo explaining how big of a star Brock is compared to any other and I don't think people want to hear that, they wanted to see what will Taker do.
> 
> In the end the show was very well structured and I'm so proud of Cesaro segment doing so well, but there is something I don't get doesn't it say the peak of the segment was 1.877 because instead it says 1.834 in the top minutes :|, so by this doesn't this mean it's the third highest peak, awesome. Finally people are into Cesaro + lets not forget the debuts it shows people are into the new generation and Warrior return in 20+ years also helped. Anyway if this is just for this week then it's mostly because it's the night after WM considering how controversial it was.


Good post man and very happy to see you give an objective opinion and congratulate accordingly.  Bryan fan or not, this reign and movement, will bring more screen time and better positions for all big talent on the card! :mark:


----------



## Londrick

I guess Cena not being in the title picture/main eventing WM/etc isn't the end of world. Maybe they don't need Cena? :bryan


----------



## Starbuck

THANOS said:


> God I love Trips for doing this. I finally love everything about the shows again! :mark: Bless that man and his epic heel selling :.


Never a bad word spoken about DA GAME from you again!

People fail to realise that if he lost to Lesnar all 3 times, lost to Punk and to whoever the fuck else gets complained about this wouldn't be possible. You don't job to everybody so that when you do decide to put a guy over, you do it in the biggest way possible. That's what Hunter does. He doesn't lose to everyone but when he does he makes them a star. 

STOP THE HHHATE AND RESPECT THE KING

:hunter


----------



## CHIcagoMade

Starbuck said:


> SONNEN STOP LYING EVERYBODY KNOWS THE RATINGS WERE SO HIGH BECAUSE WE WERE ALL EXPECTING CM PUNK TO APPEAR AMIRITE?
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


Fuckin' A right, buddy.


















































































































unk2


----------



## CookiePuss

I think you Bryan fans are putting way too much stock into him being this super draw all of a sudden. Once again, that big influx of viewers came in due to it being the day after Wrestlemania, and due to The Streak coming to an end, as well as there being a new champion. The streak ending was the biggest thing to happen in pro wrestling probably since Hogan turned heel. I love how some of you try to downplay the significance of this due to being blind by your Daniel Bryan markdom - if that's even a word. I'm not saying Bryan isn't a draw, and people aren't interested in him, because saying that would be a lie. But to say he was the reason for this big rating is a little bit overzealous. He was in the opening segment of RAW and the first hour which always has the biggest audience, so more than likely that segment would do great because of people tuning in just out of curiosity. Only time will tell if Daniel Bryan is this huge ratings drawer so many of you want him to be.


----------



## P.H. Hatecraft

Perhaps you should actually read the ratings breakdown, cookipuss. 

Bryan's segment kept gaining viewers. If people wanted to see Taker, they would'e tuned out very swiftly.


----------



## THANOS

Starbuck said:


> Never a bad word spoken about DA GAME from you again!
> 
> People fail to realise that if he lost to Lesnar all 3 times, lost to Punk and to whoever the fuck else gets complained about this wouldn't be possible. You don't job to everybody so that when you do decide to put a guy over, you do it in the biggest way possible. That's what Hunter does. He doesn't lose to everyone but when he does he makes them a star.
> 
> STOP THE HHHATE AND RESPECT THE KING
> 
> :hunter












^ You did and thank God for that! :mark: :mark: Not another insult will come out of my mouth. He put my, all-time, favourite guy over better than anyone in history, is featuring all the greatest talent in the company in top storylines with upward trajectory, and is stockpiling the best Indy stars in NXT to build the future.

Thank you Triple H! :hhh2


----------



## Londrick

cookiepuss said:


> I think you Bryan fans are putting way too much stock into him being this super draw all of a sudden. Once again, that big influx of viewers came in due to it being the day after Wrestlemania, and due to The Streak coming to an end, as well as there being a new champion. T*he streak ending was the biggest thing to happen in pro wrestling probably since Hogan turned heel.* I love how some of you try to downplay the significance of this due to being blind by your Daniel Bryan markdom - if that's even a word. I'm not saying Bryan isn't a draw, and people aren't interested in him, because saying that would be a lie. But to say he was the reason for this big rating is a little bit overzealous. He was in the opening segment of RAW and the first hour which always has the biggest audience, so more than likely that segment would do great because of people tuning in just out of curiosity. Only time will tell if Daniel Bryan is this huge ratings drawer so many of you want him to be.


You're gonna say people are blinded by their markdown and say shit like this? :lmao


----------



## CookiePuss

Londrick said:


> You're gonna say people are blinded by their markdown and say shit like this? :lmao


Yep, I am. Can you tell me another moment in wrestling history that was more significant that The Streak breaking, other than Hogan's heel turn between that time period? It's no secret that I am a big Undertaker fan, but I also don't let that cloud my own judgement and common sense of why certain things happen.


----------



## THANOS

cookiepuss said:


> I think you Bryan fans are putting way too much stock into him being this super draw all of a sudden. Once again, that big influx of viewers came in due to it being the day after Wrestlemania, and due to The Streak coming to an end, as well as there being a new champion. The streak ending was the biggest thing to happen in pro wrestling probably since Hogan turned heel. I love how some of you try to downplay the significance of this due to being blind by your Daniel Bryan markdom - if that's even a word. I'm not saying Bryan isn't a draw, and people aren't interested in him, because saying that would be a lie. But to say he was the reason for this big rating is a little bit overzealous. He was in the opening segment of RAW and the first hour which always has the biggest audience, so more than likely that segment would do great because of people tuning in just out of curiosity. Only time will tell if Daniel Bryan is this huge ratings drawer so many of you want him to be.


Read the following, especially the bold, and THEN retort.



> Leading into WrestleMania 30, the Daniel Bryan vs. Triple H program was the top draw of Raw each week. Coming out of WM30, Bryan as new WWE World Hvt. champion has been solidified as a ratings draw.
> 
> Monday's post-WM30 Raw scored the highest overall rating since Raw 1,000 on the strength of Bryan's show-opening celebration segment and teased WWE Title match against Triple H in the over-run. Plus, a team effort of several other segments drawing big audiences throughout the show.
> 
> Specific to Bryan, Raw opened with a 2.70 males 18-49 rating, which blew away a 1.85 rating in the same Q1 segment last week. Raw then closed with a 2.91 m18-49 over-run rating, growing on last week's 2.68 over-run rating for the final image of Bryan standing tall after attacking Hunter heading into WM30.
> 
> The top non-Bryan segments of the show were Paige capturing the Divas Title from A.J. in Q10 and Hulk Hogan presenting Cesaro with the Andre the Giant trophy in Q11. This helped offset the usual third-hour decline and actually grow the third hour to the point that it topped five million overall viewers for the first time since Raw 1,000.
> 
> Also, Paul Heyman's promo on behalf of Brock Lesnar addressing The Undertaker in Q5 drew a strong rating. And, Ultimate Warrior's TV return in Q9 ranked in the middle of the pack.
> 
> Raw Break Down - m18-49 demo
> 
> - Overall Show: 2.48 rating / 1.562 million viewers
> 
> - Q1: Raw opened with a regular-show-high 2.70 rating for the immediate WM30 follow-up and Daniel Bryan's celebration. *Noteworthy is the quarter-hour grew substantially from the beginning to end. So, it was not a case of a huge surge at 8:00 p.m. EST for immediate follow-up on The Streak ending, then viewers tuning out.
> 
> The segment grew from 1.555 million viewers at 8:03 p.m. to 1.770 million viewers at 8:06 p.m. to 1.814 million viewers at 8:08 p,m. to 1.836 million viewers at 8:12 p.m. to a peak audience of 1.843 million viewers at 8:13 p.m. when the title match main event was set up.*


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I do think we should wait to see how many of these extra viewers that pushed the viewership up well above 5 million actually stick. I mean, what if things go back to normal next week and are on track for being right around or even lower than the 2013 show of the same week?

Just something for us Bryan marks to think about. We could be singing his (and the program's) praises too early and end up being completely wrong.


----------



## Londrick

cookiepuss said:


> Yep, I am. Can you tell me another moment in wrestling history that was more significant that The Streak breaking, other than Hogan's heel turn between that time period? It's no secret that I am a big Undertaker fan, but I also don't let that cloud my own judgement and common sense of why certain things happen.


Austin's peak (Attitude Era in general actually), Montreal Screwjob, Benoit's death, Vince buying WCW, Hogan vs Rock, etc. Not downplaying the streak ending since it is a huge moment but to say it's the biggest moment since Hogan's heel turn is laughable. It's like saying Bryan winning @ WM is the biggest moment since hogan's heel turn.


----------



## CookiePuss

THANOS said:


> Read the following, especially the bold, and THEN retort.


I've already read that. And like I said, it was the opening of the show, the segment was pretty much guaranteed to have the most viewers because it was the start of the show. It's proven that the first hour of the show almost always garners the highest amount of viewers since that's pretty much where most people start watching. Look, you can sit there and tell me I'm wrong, and that people cared more about Daniel Bryan winning the title, than Taker's streak coming to an end, but I think most people (not including rabid Daniel Bryan fans like yourself) would agree with me.


----------



## THANOS

cookiepuss said:


> I've already read that. And like I said, it was the opening of the show, the segment was pretty much guaranteed to have the most viewers because it was the start of the show. It's proven that the first hour of the show almost always garners the highest amount of viewers since that's pretty much where most people start watching. Look, you can sit there and tell me I'm wrong, and that people cared more about Daniel Bryan winning the title, than Taker's streak coming to an end, *but I think most people (not including rabid Daniel Bryan fans like yourself) would agree with me.*


Do you honestly believe that? Everyone in this thread since the breakdown came out has attributed the massive ratings to Bryan's win more so than the Streak. Even Sonnen agreed on it, think about that for a minute. You're the only saying the Streak was still the main reason, even when the breakdown specifically states that the trend of Bryan's segments gaining by the minute shows that the streak ending wasn't all that important to the rating and not the big reason they were tuning in. The analysis literally spells it out for you just like that lol. I don't know what to tell you dude? The Streak ending obviously created some interest and helped generate a nice rating in the Heyman/Brock segment, but Bryan's win was clearly the big draw of the show bar none.


----------



## CookiePuss

Londrick said:


> Austin's peak (Attitude Era in general actually), Montreal Screwjob, Benoit's death, Vince buying WCW, Hogan vs Rock, etc. Not downplaying the streak ending since it is a huge moment but to say it's the biggest moment since Hogan's heel turn is laughable. It's like saying Bryan winning @ WM is the biggest moment since hogan's heel turn.


"Austin's Peak" or the attitude era is not one moment, so I don't know why you would even put that in there. The Benoit thing was nothing wrestling related, the guy killed his family - nothing to do with the happenings of wrestling. Hogan vs Rock was one match. Vince buying WCW could be one of those biggest events that happened, so I wont disagree there. But you can't sit there and tell me a *21 year* winning streak that had pretty much become one of Wrestlemania's biggest draws over the past 5 or 6 years, coming to an end isn't significant or monumental. It's not laughable in the least. Maybe to you it is, and quite frankly, I am not surprised you debate this - your avatar pretty much tells me why you even called it laughable .


----------



## #Mark

cookiepuss said:


> I've already read that. And like I said, it was the opening of the show, the segment was pretty much guaranteed to have the most viewers because it was the start of the show. It's proven that the first hour of the show almost always garners the highest amount of viewers since that's pretty much where most people start watching. Look, you can sit there and tell me I'm wrong, and that people cared more about Daniel Bryan winning the title, than Taker's streak coming to an end, but I think most people (not including rabid Daniel Bryan fans like yourself) would agree with me.


The fact that the segment gained a significant amount of viewers fifteen minutes into the segment shows that the interest was in Bryan/HHH. The advertised Bryan/HHH gained an incredible 3.0 overrun.. How can you possibly attribute that to Taker? Everyone knew the ME was Bryan/HHH from the start of the show and the segment gained an amazing amount of viewers.


----------



## CookiePuss

THANOS said:


> Do you honestly believe that? *Everyone* in this thread since the breakdown came out has attributed the massive ratings to Bryan's win more so than the Streak. Even Sonnen agreed on it, think about that for a minute. You're the only saying the Streak was still the main reason, even when the breakdown specifically states that the trend of Bryan's segments gaining by the minute shows that the streak ending wasn't all that important to the rating and not the big reason they were tuning in. The analysis literally spells it out for you just like that lol. I don't know what to tell you dude? The Streak ending obviously created some interest and helped generate a nice rating in the Heyman/Brock segment, but Bryan's win was clearly the big draw of the show bar none.


Everyone is a broad statement. Now if you mean alot of Daniel Bryan fans, then that's more fair. There is no "analysis" that spells out the streak ending wasn't a bigger deal than Bryan winning the title. I can go back and forth with you, but lets agree to disagree. You're one of the biggest Daniel Bryan fans on here and you come to his defense if anyone brings up anything remotely "negative" surrounding him. And the ones saying I'm delusional are the same ones with Daniel Bryan in their avatars, or their signatures, so I really don't expect anything other than what I'm hearing from them. I never saw Daniel Bryan's name trending on twitter as the number one trend for 2 or 3 days in a row. And you can search for reasons why this might have happened and say it was by chance or whatever, but save it for someone else who cares. One thing for sure is that there is no winning when it comes to this debate.


----------



## Londrick

cookiepuss said:


> "Austin's Peak" or the attitude era is not one moment, so I don't know why you would even put that in there. The Benoit thing was nothing wrestling related, the guy killed his family - nothing to do with the happenings of wrestling. Hogan vs Rock was one match. Vince buying WCW could be one of those biggest events that happened, so I wont disagree there. *But you can't sit there and tell me a 21 year winning streak that had pretty much become one of Wrestlemania's biggest draws over the past 5 or 6 years, coming to an end isn't significant or monumental.* It's not laughable in the least. Maybe to you it is, and quite frankly, *I am not surprised you debate this - your avatar pretty much tells me why you even called it laughable .*


Bold 1: I didn't, my exact words "Not downplaying the streak ending since it is a huge moment"

Bold 2: Guess what else I called laughable in that post? The guy in my avatar winning the title at WM 30 being the biggest moment since Hogan turning heel. If I was a biased I would've called Bryan winning the title the biggest moment since hogan turning heel.


----------



## CookiePuss

Londrick said:


> Bold 1: I didn't, my exact words "Not downplaying the streak ending since it is a huge moment"
> 
> Bold 2: Guess what else I called laughable in that post? The guy in my avatar winning the title at WM 30 being the biggest moment since Hogan turning heel. If I was a biased I would've called Bryan winning the title the biggest moment since hogan turning heel.


And guess what? You're right about what you said about Daniel Bryan winning a title at mania - it is something anyone can do at Wrestlemania. Undertaker losing his streak which has been one of THE MAIN attractions at Wrestlemania for a number of years now coming to an end, is nothing that will happen ever again in this lifetime.


----------



## THANOS

cookiepuss said:


> Everyone is a broad statement. Now if you mean alot of Daniel Bryan fans, then that's more fair. There is no "analysis" that spells out the streak ending wasn't a bigger deal than Bryan winning the title. I can go back and forth with you, but lets agree to disagree. You're one of the biggest Daniel Bryan fans on here and you come to his defense if anyone brings up anything remotely "negative" surrounding him. And the one's saying I'm delusional are the same ones with Daniel Bryan in their avatars, or their signatures, so I really don't expect anything other than what I'm hearing from them. I never saw Daniel Bryan's name trending on twitter as the number one trend for 2 or 3 days in a row. And you can search for reasons why this might have happened and say it was by chance or whatever, but save it for someone else who care. One thing for sure is that there is no winning when it comes to this debate.


I would hardly consider purple gloves, #badnewssanta, JoseDRivera, or Starbuck, Daniel Bryan fans. They are just commenting on his success logically like anyone with an objective opinion would. Like I mentioned before, even Sonnen agreed and admitted it was mostly due to Bryan.

You're right I am a proud Bryan mark, but I try my damnedest to use logic and valid reasoning with my responses. If I can't do that, you won't see me defend an argument I can't win. I'll just simply admit when I'm wrong.

The fact is, social media trends sometimes have nothing to do with viewers. One of the reasons Punk is often searched online, for example, is because the guy does a lot of shock worthy things and it drives up intrigue. This intrigue doesn't necessarily translate into ratings and buyrates, but he does have people talking about him. Bryan doesn't get a lot of social media attention because the guy is an open book and doesn't do shocking things to get more attention. Despite that, people love the dude, and he is their staple for watching every week. Just because shock isn't associated with Bryan, generally, it doesn't mean he isn't a huge drawing force. The ratings breakdown and all the information present which quite "literally" spells out that his title win was the big reason for the ratings serge, validate these assertions, and the majority of people here have been able to admit that.

Having said that, if you want to agree to disagree that's fine by me, I'm confident in my claims enough that I don't need to delve further into them. :


----------



## Londrick

cookiepuss said:


> And guess what? You're right about what you said about Daniel Bryan winning a title at mania - it is something anyone can do at Wrestlemania. Undertaker losing his streak which has been one of THE MAIN attractions at Wrestlemania for a number of years now coming to an end, is nothing that will happen ever again in this lifetime.


Except I never said that. Keeping putting word into my mouth though it's massive :ti material

And guess what? WM 31 is still gonna be a big deal yet Taker's streak is gonna be irrelevant.


----------



## #Mark

cookiepuss said:


> Everyone is a broad statement. Now if you mean alot of Daniel Bryan fans, then that's more fair. There is no "analysis" that spells out the streak ending wasn't a bigger deal than Bryan winning the title. I can go back and forth with you, but lets agree to disagree. You're one of the biggest Daniel Bryan fans on here and you come to his defense if anyone brings up anything remotely "negative" surrounding him. And the ones saying I'm delusional are the same ones with Daniel Bryan in their avatars, or their signatures, so I really don't expect anything other than what I'm hearing from them. I never saw Daniel Bryan's name trending on twitter as the number one trend for 2 or 3 days in a row. And you can search for reasons why this might have happened and say it was by chance or whatever, but save it for someone else who cares. One thing for sure is that there is no winning when it comes to this debate.


I'm curious.. did you even read the report? The fact that an objective publication broke down the ratings segment by segment and clearly highlighted which segments topped the night, which segments gained, and how they fared in the key male demo puts your theory to rest. How can you argue with facts? Hell, the headline of the article states that Bryan/HHH is the top rated program and Bryan is solidifying into a ratings draw. I understand you're a Taker fan but where's the objectivity?


----------



## Uerfer

I think people forget streak wasn't all that big 4 years ago. It's not really 21 years worth of build-up as WWE likes to push every wrestlemania, just last 4 or 5 years at best. It meant a lot to wrestling fanbase obviously, and they sure would remember it years from now. However I'm not sure WWE's larger audience, the casual fanbase would've cared past that day and the event, certainly not all of them and not as much as the loyal wrestling audience, clearly. Bryan was exactly like that before this, but these past few months, they have managed to solidify him as a legit top act with the casuals and it shows in the numbers.


----------



## CookiePuss

THANOS said:


> I would hardly consider purple gloves, #badnewssanta, JoseDRivera, or Starbuck, Daniel Bryan fans. They are just commenting on his success logically like anyone with an objective opinion would. Like I mentioned before, even Sonnen agreed and admitted it was mostly due to Bryan.
> 
> You're right I am a proud Bryan mark, but I try my damnedest to use logic and valid reasoning with my responses. If I can't do that, you won't see me defend an argument I can't win. I'll just simply admit when I'm wrong.
> 
> *The fact is, social media trends sometimes have nothing to do with viewers*. One of the reasons Punk is often searched online, for example, is because the guy does a lot of shock worthy things and it drives up intrigue. This intrigue doesn't necessarily translate into ratings and buyrates, but he does have people talking about him. Bryan doesn't get a lot of social media attention because the guy is an open book and doesn't do shocking things to get more attention. Despite that, people love the dude, and he is their staple for watching every week. Just because shock isn't associated with Bryan, generally, it doesn't mean he isn't a huge drawing force. The ratings breakdown and all the information present which quite "literally" spells out that his title win was the big reason for the ratings serge, validate these assertions, and the majority of people here have been able to admit that.
> 
> Having said that, if you want to agree to disagree that's fine by me, I'm confident in my claims enough that I don't need to delve further into them. :


This is sometimes true, but the fact that people saw this event and decided to continue to discuss the topic is different. And once again, this "breakdown" doesn't spell anything out for me as it relates to Bryan being the main reason for people to tune in. I really don't care how confident you are in your claims, but like I stated before, it was the start of the show and that's where most of the viewing audience tends to be by default, coupled by fact that there was a huge surge in interest coming off of Wrestlemania, due to the most significant happenings on the show - The Streak ending, and a title change (in that order). I rest my case when it comes to this debate. Like I said before, I don't expect people to agree with me who are over the moon when it comes to Daniel Bryan. It's just a fact. It's like arguing with fans of the Miami Heat that their team isn't better than another team. The fans are going to pick their favorite despite logic. And you can throw in the fact that I'm an Undertaker fan, but that doesn't take away from the fact that The Streak ending was bigger than a Bryan title win at Mania. You guys don't need to waste your time debating with me on this, because you have your opinions and I have mine.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

THANOS said:


> I would hardly consider purple gloves, *#badnewssanta,* JoseDRivera, or Starbuck, Daniel Bryan fans. They are just commenting on his success logically like anyone with an objective opinion would. Like I mentioned before, even Sonnen agreed and admitted it was mostly due to Bryan.


Bu... bu... bu... but I am.


----------



## THANOS

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Bu... bu... bu... but I am.


Oh are you? I always thought you were generally indifferent to him but commented on him since he's a pretty hot topic these days lol.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

THANOS said:


> Oh are you? I always thought you were generally indifferent to him but commented on him since he's a pretty hot topic these days lol.


Oh, I'm a mark for the guy, have been since the weak-link storyline, and was a fan since his heel turn. Yeah, I don't always show it, and he's not my absolute favorite today, and I'm definitely not his biggest mark, but I'm very happy he's the champion now, and it's great to see the ratings are showing it was a good call. (Y)


----------



## Londrick

Uerfer said:


> I think people forget streak wasn't all that big 4 years ago. It's not really 21 years worth of build-up as WWE likes to push every wrestlemania, just last 4 or 5 years at best. It meant a lot to wrestling fanbase obviously, and they sure would remember it years from now. However I'm not sure WWE's larger audience, the casual fanbase would've cared past that day and the event, certainly not all of them and not as much as the loyal wrestling audience, clearly. Bryan was exactly like that before this, but these past few months, they have managed to solidify him as a legit top act with the casuals and it shows in the numbers.


Agree. HBK, HHH and Punk really helped to put over the streak.


----------



## RebelArch86

Londrick said:


> Agree. HBK, HHH and Punk really helped to put over the streak.


Yeah I'm not knocking taker now bc he really reinvented himself in the latter part of his career, but it have been watching since mania 4, which is before taker showed up, and he was not a huge addition to mania. He was hot the first year, then quickly became a joke and was one of the worst parts of mania for a decade.

His mania matches were the piss breaks and regarded the way the divas are.

I left WWE during the attitude era and came back just last year. Wow was I shocked that taker was now revered and had such a huge legacy. I went back and watched his stuff during the ruthless aggression era, pg mania, he has definitely earned this great reputation and it's nice to see someone improve so much throughout out their career, but to act like he was always a huge part of mania and wrestling is rewriting history.

Something doesn't need to be great since the beginning sometimes it's a better story to come from humble beginnings and reinvent ones self.


----------



## Waffelz

Lol, are people actually interested in Paige/AJ then? I was only half heartedly mentioning them doing the second best re: viewership on Youtube the other day, but that's a pretty fucking good rating for them.


----------



## THANOS

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Oh, I'm a mark for the guy, have been since the weak-link storyline, and was a fan since his heel turn. Yeah, I don't always show it, and he's not my absolute favorite today, and I'm definitely not his biggest mark, but I'm very happy he's the champion now, and it's great to see the ratings are showing it was a good call. (Y)


Well I tried to rep ya but I guess I have to wait a bit  lol. That's good to see that you're a fellow Bryan mark after all, but even if you were indifferent to him, you still make great and logical posts that I enjoy reading.


----------



## purple_gloves

The thing with Bryan now is, they need to keep him interesting. They need to keep portraying him as a main event guy and put him in top feuds that suit his underdog persona. I really hope they don't go down the Cena route and just start feeding him heels who nobody cares about. He will soon end up back down the card if they do. They tried that with Orton and Punk and it didn't work.

Luckily at the moment there's a few options. Lesnar, Batista, possibly another Wyatt feud. Further down the line there's Cesaro, and if we get i bit more far fetched, there's a heel Cena and a returning Punk.


----------



## Kurt 'Olympic Gold

Man, that news about last Monday's RAW rating is awesome.


----------



## robertdeniro

Bryan's fans you just have to wait until next week and see if he is that strong of a draw because this show drew huge for 3 reasons:

1-Taker losing at Wrestlemania
2-Bryan as WWEWHC
3-It's the RAW after WM.

Taker losing was everywhere and i'm sure it was the biggest reason it drew that huge as it was what people talked about more than anything.


----------



## Mr.S

robertdeniro said:


> Bryan's fans you just have to wait until next week and see if he is that strong of a draw because this show drew huge for 3 reasons:
> 
> 1-Taker losing at Wrestlemania
> 2-Bryan as WWEWHC
> 3-It's the RAW after WM.
> 
> Taker losing was everywhere and i'm sure it was the biggest reason it drew that huge as it was what people talked about more than anything.


Ratings is never a 1 one man Show. It is a combination. I doubt Taker loosing has much to do with it. He shows up once in a while and people where not even expecting him.

Raw after Mania is always crazy. No-way next week can match it. Paige vs AJ, Cesaro a Heyman guy, the Heyman Promo.

You need a strong mid and under-card. Bryan will do good numbers next week but the show has to be strong as well because it is 3 hours and Bryan can't be in it for 3 hours


----------



## Mr.S

Londrick said:


> Agree. HBK, HHH and Punk really helped to put over the streak.


HHH lost 3 times to taker. It was okay but nothing amazing IMO. Punk-UT apart from being a good match I thought added a Big 0 to the streak. 

The HBK matches changed the Streak. Streak was meaningless to a guy like me, it did not mean more that sh** to me, I didn't care. But HBK wrestled one of the greatest matches in WM25 and followed it up in WM26 and put his career on the line to beat the Streak.

The Streak ended Shawn's career. That is when to me the Streak attained a massive status when it could end the career of HBK.


----------



## ecabney

Undertaker stans are copping pleas. We gave them nothing but facts :jordan

Them numbers continued to rise for D-Bry, and the Taker stuff lost viewers. No other way you can spin it.


----------



## robertdeniro

ecabney said:


> Undertaker stans are copping pleas. We gave them nothing but facts :jordan
> 
> Them numbers continued to rise for D-Bry, and *the Taker stuff lost viewers*. No other way you can spin it.


When did that happen lol .


----------



## Mr.S

cookiepuss said:


> I've already read that. And like I said, it was the opening of the show, the segment was pretty much guaranteed to have the most viewers because it was the start of the show. It's proven that the first hour of the show almost always garners the highest amount of viewers since that's pretty much where most people start watching. Look, you can sit there and tell me I'm wrong, and that people cared more about Daniel Bryan winning the title, than Taker's streak coming to an end, but I think most people (not including rabid Daniel Bryan fans like yourself) would agree with me.


I always thought that the Streak was shit before Shawn gave his career to it and added legitimacy to it. I was massively shocked it ended and so do I think are a lot of people. And they will stay shocked for a small time. It's 25 years odd, people take time to adjust.

But very few people actually want to see this Streak continue. It adds 0 to Mania and while Taker is a massive legend he looked like shit at Mania huffing and panting. It's not me, most of my friends and cousins who loved Taker want him gone because he is an old man and should not disgracing himself this way.

Taker is doing what Flair-Hogan did. And its ridiculous



cookiepuss said:


> I think you Bryan fans are putting way too much stock into him being this super draw all of a sudden. Once again, that big influx of viewers came in due to it being the day after Wrestlemania, and due to The Streak coming to an end, as well as there being a new champion. The streak ending was the biggest thing to happen in pro wrestling probably since Hogan turned heel. I love how some of you try to downplay the significance of this due to being blind by your Daniel Bryan markdom - if that's even a word. I'm not saying Bryan isn't a draw, and people aren't interested in him, because saying that would be a lie. But to say he was the reason for this big rating is a little bit overzealous. He was in the opening segment of RAW and the first hour which always has the biggest audience, so more than likely that segment would do great because of people tuning in just out of curiosity. Only time will tell if Daniel Bryan is this huge ratings drawer so many of you want him to be.



Wow. I feel the Streak was shit before HBK gave it legitimacy and you're being delusional if you feel people love Taker wrestling and being the new Flair washed up panting in the Ring. Taker's a legend but all good things have to come to an end.

This is just Shock Value that something of 25 years ended and people will be shocked. But in the history of WWE the Streak will mean 0. Nobody will remember it after 5-10 years. Nobody remembers a 400 Day reign, what they remember are the moments.

Like Foley said, you can be a statistic or a legend.


----------



## robertdeniro

Mr.S said:


> Ratings is never a 1 one man Show. It is a combination. I doubt Taker loosing has much to do with it. He shows up once in a while and people where not even expecting him.


Yeah here is the thing,when Rock came back in 2011 and he wasn't there the next week and that show did big numbers,people gave the Rock the credit for that because he did put alot of eyes on the product.Taker wasn't there but people were talking about Taker and his streak everywhere (even non-wrestling fans and talk shows) and they wanted to know what happend.

I know that RAW next week will be back to the normal rating (under 3.3).


----------



## robertdeniro




----------



## purple_gloves

robertdeniro said:


> Yeah here is the thing,when Rock came back in 2011 and he wasn't there the next week and that show did big numbers,people gave the Rock the credit for that because he did put alot of eyes on the product.*Taker wasn't there but people were talking about Taker and his streak everywhere (even non-wrestling fans and talk shows) and they wanted to know what happend.*
> 
> I know that RAW next week will be back to the normal rating (under 3.3).


This is why I can't understand Heyman/Lesnar not drawing the top rating of the night. It's something that's garnered more mainstream media attention than anything in wrestling since the Rock returned. 

Maybe it shows WWE's lack of ability to not only draw in non wrestling fans, but also draw back old fans who'd lost interest in the product. I think it's safe to say that Taker's streak was something that older fans fans held in higher regard than the younger crowd. Some older fans would order WM for Taker's match and that's it. No other ppvs and never watch Raw. 

Taker is seemingly a mania draw and no longer a huge tv draw. Especially now the streak is over. 

The current audience clearly want to see big feuds featuring current full time guys on Raw.


----------



## robertdeniro

purple_gloves said:


> *This is why I can't understand Heyman/Lesnar not drawing the top rating of the night*. It's something that's garnered more mainstream media attention than anything in wrestling since the Rock returned.
> 
> Maybe it shows WWE's lack of ability to not only draw in non wrestling fans, but also draw back old fans who'd lost interest in the product. I think it's safe to say that Taker's streak was something that older fans fans held in higher regard than the younger crowd. Some older fans would order WM for Taker's match and that's it. No other ppvs and never watch Raw.
> 
> *Taker is seemingly a mania draw and no longer a huge tv draw. Especially now the streak is over*.
> 
> The current audience clearly want to see big feuds featuring current full time guys on Raw.


If he interrupted Heyman/Lesnar i'm sure that segment would be the top drawing segment of the night,because Heyman/Lesnar wasn't far behined the overrun.

Taker has been drawing huge numbers in the last 6 RTWM (except this WM30 and even this was drawing good numbers and it could have been huge numbers if the build up to the match was better).

I'm not saying Byran is not a draw,in fact he is a big draw but we should wait and see what he will do next week.


----------



## murder

Just imagine the rating and viewership had Taker and Sting shown up as "planned".

If Sting really debuts, and Taker and Rock decide to come back, we can talk about 6 million viewers for the first time since The AE ended.


----------



## purple_gloves

robertdeniro said:


> If he interrupted Heyman/Lesnar i'm sure that segment would be the top drawing segment of the night,because Heyman/Lesnar wasn't far behined the overrun.
> 
> Taker has been drawing huge numbers in the last 6 RTWM (except this WM30 and even this was drawing good numbers and it could have been huge numbers if the build up to the match was better).
> 
> *I'm not saying Byran is not a draw,in fact he is a big draw but we should wait and see what he will do next week*.




Not just next week, but going forward in general. Pressure is on him now. If he is a "mega draw" as some are proclaiming, then he should be popping big numbers every week now.


----------



## THANOS

purple_gloves said:


> Not just next week, but going forward in general. Pressure is on him now. If he is a "mega draw" as some are proclaiming, then he should be popping big numbers every week now.


Yes but only if the product as a whole is better and doing it's part as well. He can't carry the ship by himself. Even Austin in the AE needed a strong supporting cast to bring WWE back into prominence. If the Authority, Shield, Wyatt's, Cesaro, and the top babyfaces do their part, then we could be looking at an upward trend in ratings for the first time in years.

What will be interesting to see, is apparantely Bryan may be missing next week for his honeymoon, so if the rating pops big without, can we use the same logic that the Taker fans are using about this week's rating? Do we say that Bryan, himself, elevated the show even if he wasn't on it, because people might be expecting him or were intrigued by this past Monday's events?

It will be interesting to see how next week does and what the responses are for sure.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

robertdeniro said:


> Yeah here is the thing,when Rock came back in 2011 and he wasn't there the next week and that show did big numbers,people gave the Rock the credit for that because he did put alot of eyes on the product.Taker wasn't there but people were talking about Taker and his streak everywhere (even non-wrestling fans and talk shows) and they wanted to know what happend.
> 
> I know that RAW next week will be back to the normal rating (under 3.3).


Holy crap, I totally forgot a similar thing happened with Rock. This is a great point.

I think all in all, we should just agree that it was a strong show with two great hooks from Mania in the streak ending, and Bryan winning the title.

@Thanos

Rock returning and Taker's streak ending were monumental things in the wrestling world that got mainstream attention. The hook from Raw this week, while it a good one, is closer to your run of the mill ending as opposed to something huge. 

If anything for next week is going to impact numbers in a positive way from this week, it's going to be Warrior's death and people tuning in to see whatever tributes they do for him.


----------



## CJohn3:16

If Daniel Bryan isn't on RAW next week, Undertaker surely will be.


----------



## JY57

CJohn3:16 said:


> If Daniel Bryan isn't on RAW next week, Undertaker surely will be.


doubtful he is very bad shape right now and he won't be rushed back at all. If Bryan is not there it will revolve around The Shield vs The Authority.


----------



## purple_gloves

THANOS said:


> *Yes but only if the product as a whole is better and doing it's part as well. *He can't carry the ship by himself. Even Austin in the AE needed a strong supporting cast to bring WWE back into prominence. If the Authority, Shield, Wyatt's, Cesaro, and the top babyfaces do their part, then we could be looking at an upward trend in ratings for the first time in years.
> 
> What will be interesting to see, is apparantely Bryan may be missing next week for his honeymoon, so if the rating pops big without, can we use the same logic that the Taker fans are using about this week's rating? Do we say that Bryan, himself, elevated the show even if he wasn't on it, because people might be expecting him or were intrigued by this past Monday's events?
> 
> It will be interesting to see how next week does and what the responses are for sure.


Very true. But try explaining that to the Punk haters. Some people need to make their mind up when it comes who's responsible for a rating.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

purple_gloves said:


> Very true. But try explaining that to the Punk haters. Some people need to make their mind up when it comes who's responsible for a rating.


:lmao Like that'd actually work/happen.


----------



## Starbuck

So Bryan/Hunter at the start of the show gained viewers in their segment that didn't include Undertaker and then blew everything else away in their advertised match in the overrun, also that didn't include Taker, yet Taker is the reason for those ratings and the high ratings for all the other segments it was clear he had nothing to do with? And all this on top of the fact that Bryan/Hunter was smoking everything else in ratings on the build to Mania itself? 

TAKER MARKS HAVING A BAD WEEK

:taker 

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## MaybeLock

Has it been discussed already how the Network will affect WM's buyrates? I think it would be cool to be able to compare WMXXX with the Wrestlemanias that Rock main evented, but I guess that with so many people jumping to the Network, the buyrates will drastically go down, independently of the show itself.


----------



## D.M.N.

I'm surprised no one has posted this, so I'll be the first.

Here's person A. Person A hasn't watched WWE in a little while, and the first thing he reads on Twitter on Monday morning is #ThankYouTaker and sees 'Taker lost at WrestleMania. Person A decides to tune into the start of Raw.

What person A sees at the start of Raw isn't 'Taker, they see this.






Four minutes ago, person A had never even heard of Daniel Bryan. Now, they've watched potentially one of the best WWE packages ever produced, seen that he has beaten Triple H and Stephanie and The Authority.

The next image they see is a raucous crowd who give possibly one of the biggest reactions in _years_.

So, person A only really was interested in Undertaker. But, after seeing the Bryan package and the huge reaction, person A has been drawn in and is now emotionally invested in Bryan (okay, not as much as on here, but you get my drift).

Ten minutes later, person A hears Bryan vs HHH for the main event and has been turned from a five minute viewer to three hour viewer.

Then, person A sees new talent after new talent: the Wyatt Family, Cesaro, Paige amongst others, mixed in with the old stars (Orton and Batista - to give an example).

My point being: *Undertaker was the main reason for the initial numbers, but as the show progressed, the focus for the viewer swung to the current active roster*.


----------



## CJohn3:16

Guys, guys, I think it is fairly obvious why the ratings were big...

:trips2


----------



## robertdeniro

D.M.N. said:


> I'm surprised no one has posted this, so I'll be the first.
> 
> Here's person A. Person A hasn't watched WWE in a little while, and the first thing he reads on Twitter on Monday morning is #ThankYouTaker and sees 'Taker lost at WrestleMania. Person A decides to tune into the start of Raw.
> 
> What person A sees at the start of Raw isn't 'Taker, they see this.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Four minutes ago, person A had never even heard of Daniel Bryan. Now, they've watched potentially one of the best WWE packages ever produced, seen that he has beaten Triple H and Stephanie and The Authority.
> 
> The next image they see is a raucous crowd who give possibly one of the biggest reactions in _years_.
> 
> So, person A only really was interested in Undertaker. But, after seeing the Bryan package and the huge reaction, person A has been drawn in and is now emotionally invested in Bryan (okay, not as much as on here, but you get my drift).
> 
> Ten minutes later, person A hears Bryan vs HHH for the main event and has been turned from a five minute viewer to three hour viewer.
> 
> Then, person A sees new talent after new talent: the Wyatt Family, Cesaro, Paige amongst others, mixed in with the old stars (Orton and Batista - to give an example).
> 
> My point being: *Undertaker was the main reason for the initial numbers, but as the show progressed, the focus for the viewer swung to the current active roster*.


(Y)(Y)(Y).

Just like the Rock in 2011.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Haven't posted here in awhile but happy to see Bryan's segments were the highest rated of the night.

DAT GOAT.

:yes


----------



## robertdeniro

Starbuck said:


> So Bryan/Hunter at the start of the show gained viewers in their segment that didn't include Undertaker and then blew everything else away in their advertised match in the overrun, also that didn't include Taker, yet Taker is the reason for those ratings and the high ratings for all the other segments it was clear he had nothing to do with? And all this on top of the fact that Bryan/Hunter was smoking everything else in ratings on the build to Mania itself?
> 
> TAKER MARKS HAVING A BAD WEEK
> 
> :taker
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


I did post the reason why i said Taker and looking at what happened in social media with Taker and his streak i can say that Taker losing did put a lot of eyes on the product.


----------



## Starbuck

robertdeniro said:


> I did post the reason why i said Taker and looking at what happened in social media with Taker and his streak i can say that Taker losing did put a lot of eyes on the product.


Yet more eyes watched other segments over his. Imwas only kidding with what I said. Of course the streak ending isma huge deal but it very clearly wasn't the sole reason and possibly not even the primary reason people tuned in, not when Bryan/Hunter continued its own streak of owning everything else in the ratings amd several other segments performed so well. Interest was high across the board which is obvious given the success of so many individual segments.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Who can break Bryan and HHH's ratings streak?


----------



## THANOS

Triple H and Bryan should directly and indirectly feud for the entire year, like Austin/McMahon, to really capitalize on this ratings surge, and make Bryan a monster household name.


----------



## Choke2Death

IDONTSHIV said:


> Who can break Bryan and HHH's ratings streak?


BROCK LESNAR IS THE ONE! :brock


----------



## THANOS

Choke2Death said:


> BROCK LESNAR IS THE ONE! :brock


Maybe, but he didn't this past Monday . I can only imagine the ratings a feud between Bryan and Lesnar would be in the Summer with HHH and Heyman involved in some fashion as well. It may exceed 6 million viewers each hour :shocked:.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Choke2Death said:


> BROCK LESNAR IS THE ONE! :brock


NO!!! Keep that bastard away from the television! NOOOOOOOOOO


----------



## purple_gloves

They'd be stupid not to do Bryan/Lesnar at some point. Perfect David vs Goliath feud. Throw in Heyman too and you're virtually printing money.


----------



## JY57

> The peak rating came for the Paul Heyman promo with Brock Lesnar did a 4.2 rating and 5.9 million viewers.


via Metzler for overall peak of the show


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

JY57 said:


> via Metzler for overall peak of the show


Oh my shit...


----------



## THANOS

JY57 said:


> via Metzler for overall peak of the show


Meltzer is actually discussing ratings once agaiin? I won't comment on this until I see a full report from him. Until then Bryan/HHH stands for me.


----------



## purple_gloves

:shocked:

Well this is going to get good.


----------



## THANOS

Remember we need to see the full report before we get too excited here. If this proves to be true it means the <18 and >49 demographics are very very invested in the streak while the core 18-49 demographic isn't as much.


----------



## JY57

THANOS said:


> Meltzer is actually discussing ratings once agaiin? I won't comment on this until I see a full report from him. Until then Bryan/HHH stands for me.


it is in his new Wrestling Observer Newsletter that came Out Today here is his fully wording in the newsletter:



> As one would expect coming off Undertaker’s loss and Bryan’s win, the Raw on 4/7 after WrestleMania did a 3.69 rating 5.14 million viewers. Most of the show went against the Connecticut vs. Kentucky NCAA tournament final that did 17.79 million viewers. It was the highest rated episode of the show since the 1,000th episode of Raw on July 23, 2012, which did a 3.86 rating and 6.04 million viewers. Last year’s day after Mania show did a 3.43 rating and 4.61 million viewers and the 2012 show did a 3.43 rating and 5.02 million viewers, while 2011 did a 3.84 rating and 5.62 million. The basketball was well down from prior years, as the Louisville vs. Michigan final in 2013 did 23.43 million viewers and the year before did 20.87 million,
> 
> The peak rating came for the Paul Heyman promo with Brock Lesnar did a 4.2 rating and 5.9 million viewers.


----------



## Choke2Death

JY57 said:


> via Metzler for overall peak of the show


Looks like I was right. :ti


----------



## THANOS

JY57 said:


> it is in his new Wrestling Observer Newsletter that came Out Today here is his fully wording in the newsletter:


While we still don't have the full report some of that information is very useful. It tells us that the rating coming out of this mania for RAW is the highest since 2011's post-Mania RAW. That's bigger than the RAW following both of the Rock's return matches which is tremendous news for both the end of the streak and Daniel Bryan.


----------



## purple_gloves

I really didn't didn't anticipate anything topping interest in the streak. It was reported literally everywhere.


----------



## D.M.N.

JY57 said:


> via Metzler for overall peak of the show


Wonder whether any other segments were over 4.0? Now _that_ would be interesting...


----------



## MaybeLock

Choke2Death said:


> Looks like I was right. :ti


Actually, THIS IS THE MAN: :heyman4

DAT shooting from the hip promo killed Bryan's streak, it seems :


----------



## Uerfer

robertdeniro said:


> Yeah here is the thing,when Rock came back in 2011 and he wasn't there the next week and that show did big numbers,people gave the Rock the credit for that because he did put alot of eyes on the product.Taker wasn't there but people were talking about Taker and his streak everywhere (even non-wrestling fans and talk shows) and they wanted to know what happend.
> 
> I know that RAW next week will be back to the normal rating (under 3.3).





#BadNewsSanta said:


> Holy crap, I totally forgot a similar thing happened with Rock. This is a great point.


Except for the fact, the next week following Rock's return, the highest rated segment was the opener with Cena addressing the Rock which drew huge, and guess what? it also the night Taker's 21.1.11 promoted return and HHH's surprise return happened, and Cena's opener totally outdrew that in a big way. People didn't credit Rock just for the lulz, facts showed he bumped the overall viewership/rating following his return. From that point on, Cena/Rock was the highest rated throughout, all the way to mania and even the post mania RAW, the overrun of which still remains by far the highest rated in years. 

It wasn't even close to same with Taker's streak, the highest rated part of the show was the advertised Main event match between Triple H and Bryan. Brock's segment was already advertised before the match was set up. If the streak was the difference maker and if the interest was high, Brock's segment should have been the highest rated peak of the show, not the overrun, and Brock's seg didn't even manage to outdraw the opener, let alone the overrun. What was it the 4th biggest from top? 




> Bryan's fans you just have to wait until next week and see if he is that strong of a draw


They actually don't need to, next week its going down no matter what. You could take Bryan out and put Taker in there, and still going down. It doesn't prove anything. 







D.M.N. said:


> I'm surprised no one has posted this, so I'll be the first.
> 
> Here's person A. Person A hasn't watched WWE in a little while, and the first thing he reads on Twitter on Monday morning is #ThankYouTaker and sees 'Taker lost at WrestleMania. Person A decides to tune into the start of Raw.
> 
> What person A sees at the start of Raw isn't 'Taker, they see this.
> 
> Four minutes ago, *person A had never even heard of Daniel Bryan.* Now, they've watched potentially one of the best WWE packages ever produced, seen that he has beaten Triple H and Stephanie and The Authority.
> 
> The next image they see is a raucous crowd who give possibly one of the biggest reactions in _years_.
> 
> So, person A only really was interested in Undertaker. But, after seeing the Bryan package and the huge reaction, person A has been drawn in and is now emotionally invested in Bryan (okay, not as much as on here, but you get my drift).
> 
> Ten minutes later, person A hears Bryan vs HHH for the main event and has been turned from a five minute viewer to three hour viewer.
> 
> Then, person A sees new talent after new talent: the Wyatt Family, Cesaro, Paige amongst others, mixed in with the old stars (Orton and Batista - to give an example).
> 
> My point being: Undertaker was the main reason for the initial numbers, but as the show progressed, the focus for the viewer swung to the current active roster.


LOL WTF dude? Can't believe a post like this is coming from you. I never liked this theoretical "could've been" arguments but anyways, you lost it at the bolded part. If Person A has never heard of Bryan before, he's not sticking around for Bryan, certainly not just because of a video package that means shit to him. 

And for the numbers to actually build from 1.5m to 1.8m within the quarter you're really assuming there are lot of "person As" and that everyone of them stuck around for Bryan, in this situation. NOT possible at all. Besides that, Wade keller and Jason powell of PWtorch are well known 'Taker marks, and they themselves are crediting Bryan instead of the streak for the numbers.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

I love Meltzer but he must know that people would want to know how all the segments did in relation to one another. Inquiring minds want to know.


----------



## Uerfer

JY57 said:


> via Metzler for overall peak of the show


Not sure where Meltzer is getting his numbers from but this is unlikely to be true, when the viewership came out, hour 1 and hour 3 showed the peak in A18-49 with a 1.9 rating and hour 2 which had Brock's segment was down from those two with a 1.8. If Brock's segment was the peak, hour 2 definitely should have had the peak A18-49 rating or atleast the same as hour 1/3. Besides why won't he report the entire information? Why just one quarter?




JY57 said:


> it is in his new Wrestling Observer Newsletter that came Out Today here is his fully wording in the newsletter:


Again, If he does have the numbers, why doesn't he report the entire thing? This shit is suspicious as hell imo. My theory is Meltzer doesn't have it, he's going on as per his own calculations as used to do last year with his - about 140,000 viewers - reports, remember those?


----------



## LIL' WINNING FOOT

Bryan (after being MADE for life at WM30) vs. Lesnar (who is MADE for eternity for breaking the Streak) for the WWE World Heavyweight Championship at a Summerslam would be box office money WWE would be stupid to pass up. Add in the greatest manager this side of Heenan in Paul Heyman and having the Authority (specifically Triple H of all people) swallow their pride and support Lesnar beating Bryan would produce must see TV for weeks leading to the match.

Goosebumps, folks.


----------



## kokepepsi

Uerfer said:


> Not sure where Meltzer is getting his numbers from but this is unlikely to be true, when the viewership came out, hour 1 and hour 3 showed the peak in A18-49 with a 1.9 rating and hour 2 which had Brock's segment was down from those two with a 1.8. If Brock's segment was the peak, hour 2 definitely should have had the peak A18-49 rating or atleast the same as hour 1/3. Besides why won't he report the entire information? Why just one quarter?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Again, If he does have the numbers, why doesn't he report the entire thing? This shit is suspicious as hell imo. My theory is Meltzer doesn't have it, he's going on as per his own calculations as used to do last year with his - about 140,000 viewers - reports, remember those?


join the site and ask him


----------



## Uerfer

^ thanks for your very resourceful input there buddy. 


Bryan Vs Brock? While it sounds like a money program, there is little chance it would be all that entertaining. Bryan's character works best as underdog, and the authority as adversary has him in the right place. Against Lesnar, its just YES! YES! YES! and nothing more. Besides Bryan beat HHH, Orton, Batista none of them could beat the streak anyway. Bryan's character really lacks serious depth, he is no punk when it comes to that.


----------



## robertdeniro

JY57 said:


> via Metzler for overall peak of the show


Lol looks like i was right about what i said.


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

robertdeniro said:


> Lol looks like i was right about what i said.


Not really since Bryan's QH's were much higher. And if anything, they were watching Heyman speak.


----------



## robertdeniro

ShowStopper said:


> Not really since Bryan's QH's were much higher. And if anything, *they were watching Heyman speak.*


About the STREAK .


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

robertdeniro said:


> About the STREAK .


The longer he spoke the less and less it became about the streak.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

HOLY FUCK! 4.2, nearly 6 million viewers (and if that was just the average, it could've very well hit over 6 million at some point)... oh mah gawd. :taker :heyman2 :lelbrock

Well this has been an interesting last few days. I went from thinking the streak ending was going to be the primary reason for the numbers, to thinking Bryan's win was the primary reason for the numbers, to thinking it came down to the overall structure of the show combined with Taker's streak ending and Bryan's title win evenly, to now thinking Taker's streak was the main reason after all.

That being said, without knowing how well Bryan/HHH did overall, it's tough to say it didn't have a strong impact overall. It definitely did in the 18-49 demo, that's for sure. And I could see the overrun getting a 4.0 at least. But if the 4.2 and 5.9 million viewers number is correct, that's the highest a non-overrun rating in forever (including Raw 1,000 unless I'm mistaken), and same goes for viewership (maybe). 

Wow though, I figured it'd be close to a 4.0, but I wasn't expecting that. Guess it also shows the 18-49 demo can't be used proportionately to the overall numbers, which does beg the question, how high did some of the segments actually go overall that people were drooling over? And did Taker/Lesnar's program perform as under-whelmingly in the ratings as the 18-49 numbers made it seem? Something to think about. The torch breakdown is definitely a lot better to read through than Meltzer's are, but Meltzer's paints the whole picture. If only they could combine the two...


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

Uerfer said:


> I think people forget streak wasn't all that big 4 years ago. It's not really 21 years worth of build-up as WWE likes to push every wrestlemania, just last 4 or 5 years at best. It meant a lot to wrestling fanbase obviously, and they sure would remember it years from now. However I'm not sure WWE's larger audience, the casual fanbase would've cared past that day and the event, certainly not all of them and not as much as the loyal wrestling audience, clearly. Bryan was exactly like that before this, but these past few months, they have managed to solidify him as a legit top act with the casuals and it shows in the numbers.


Well said.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

> Except for the fact, the next week following Rock's return, the highest rated segment was the opener with Cena addressing the Rock which drew huge, and guess what? it also the night Taker's 21.1.11 promoted return and HHH's surprise return happened, and Cena's opener totally outdrew that in a big way. People didn't credit Rock just for the lulz, facts showed he bumped the overall viewership/rating following his return. From that point on, Cena/Rock was the highest rated throughout, all the way to mania and even the post mania RAW, the overrun of which still remains by far the highest rated in years.
> 
> *It wasn't even close to same with Taker's streak, the highest rated part of the show was the advertised Main event match between Triple H and Bryan. Brock's segment was already advertised before the match was set up. If the streak was the difference maker and if the interest was high, Brock's segment should have been the highest rated peak of the show, not the overrun, and Brock's seg didn't even manage to outdraw the opener, let alone the overrun. What was it the 4th biggest from top?*


Well, looks like that wasn't the case, after all. It did end up drawing the peak of the show in the overall numbers (which is the same measure used in The Rock example).


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Damn it, Meltzer. Give us the whole breakdown to end the speculation. I also want to see how the Hogan segment did. This partial release is crap.


----------



## JY57

#BadNewsSanta said:


> HOLY FUCK! 4.2, nearly 6 million viewers (and if that was just the average, it could've very well hit over 6 million at some point)... oh mah gawd. :taker :heyman2 :lelbrock
> 
> Well this has been an interesting last few days. I went from thinking the streak ending was going to be the primary reason for the numbers, to thinking Bryan's win was the primary reason for the numbers, to thinking it came down to the overall structure of the show combined with Taker's streak ending and Bryan's title win evenly, to now thinking Taker's streak was the main reason after all.
> 
> That being said, without knowing how well Bryan/HHH did overall, it's tough to say it didn't have a strong impact overall. It definitely did in the 18-49 demo, that's for sure. And I could see the overrun getting a 4.0 at least. But if the 4.2 and 5.9 million viewers number is correct, that's the highest a non-overrun rating in forever (including Raw 1,000 unless I'm mistaken), and same goes for viewership (maybe).
> 
> Wow though, I figured it'd be close to a 4.0, but I wasn't expecting that. Guess it also shows the 18-49 demo can't be used proportionately to the overall numbers, which does beg the question, how high did some of the segments actually go overall that people were drooling over? And did Taker/Lesnar's program perform as under-whelmingly in the ratings as the 18-49 numbers made it seem? Something to think about. The torch breakdown is definitely a lot better to read through than Meltzer's are, but Meltzer's paints the whole picture. If only they could combine the two...


it was the highest peak since the Post Rumble RAW last year 2013. Rock/Punk fallout (4.03) and Brock Lesnar's Return (4.01)


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

THANOS said:


> Indeed, but not nearly that big of a factor as some expected. It was only the 6th highest quarter, and lost viewers as it went on. Not including Bryan it was beaten by the debut of Paige, the 6-man tag, and Cesaro.


Wow, wasn't aware the Heyman segment was beaten by that many segments. Can't believe Paige and a 6 man tag beat that segment. Yikes.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

JY57 said:


> it was the highest peak since the Post Rumble RAW last year 2013. Rock/Punk fallout (4.03) and Brock Lesnar's Return (4.01)


Am I missing something? 4.2> 4.03 and 4.01... unless you're talking viewership (have those numbers?)


----------



## JY57

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Am I missing something? 4.2> 4.03 and 4.01... unless you're talking viewership (have those numbers?)


 I meant 4.0 rating range sorry. Maybe the Occupy RAW segment got something similar if not mistaken, Metzler & Alvarez I believe said that segment got like 5.2-5.5 million viewers if I remember.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

JY57 said:


> I meant 4.0 rating range sorry. Maybe the Occupy RAW segment got something similar if not mistaken, Metzler & Alvarez I believe said that segment got like 5.2-5.5 million viewers if I remember.


That's a pretty far cry down from 5.9 million, but I'd imagine that's in the range the overrun and maybe the opener got.

I do wonder what the definite last highest segment was.

Edit: These were the last highest numbers I could find (for Raw 3/7/11):



> In a segment by segment breakdown, The Undertaker's interview opened the show with a 3.91 rating and the brawl with Nexus and Randy Orton plus Orton vs. David Otunga gained 71,000 viewers, which is good. Christian vs. Brodus Clay and Sunny's Hall of Fame announcement gained 219,000 more viewers. The increase in viewers is likely attributed to the Sunny video as this part in the show did a 5.2 rating among teenage boys, which beat everything else on the show except Steve Austin's return.
> 
> Following the "Original Diva" keeping viewers tuned in, the Divas Title match between Eve Torres and Nikki Bella lost 610,000 viewers. This match had a 4.2 rating among teenage boys and as noted, the Sunny segment did a 5.2.
> *
> The segment with Steve Austin, JBL and Michael Cole gained 961,000 viewers to a 4.46 rating. This is the best RAW quarter-hour rating in a long time.* In Males 12-17, the rating was up from a 4.2 to a 5.5. The match with Daniel Bryan and Sheamus lost 1,102,000 viewers, which is the largest numbers of viewers lost during a segment of any WWE or TNA show in many years. This shows that many viewers tuned in to see Steve Austin and once he was done, they tuned out and returned at 11pm to see if anything else big was going to happen with the show in general.
> 
> The CM Punk vs. R-Truth match, the Shawn Michaels video and the segment with Vickie Guerrero lost 119,000 viewers while the Dolph Ziggler vs. John Morrison match lost 43,000 more. *The end of RAW with John Cena's "final knockout" on The Rock and the attack from The Miz did good numbers, gaining 965,000 viewers and finishing with a 4.25 overrun.*


----------



## LilOlMe

Yeah, I don't know why everyone's been creaming over just the 18-49 male segment. It obviously doesn't tell the whole story, as I'd imagine that someone like, say, Cena does better with other demographics. 

Talking about just fifty percent of an audience -- especially when it's done in such detail, like it's done here -- seems fruitless, in terms of using that as a gauge of popularity.

It is the most important group as far as advertisers are concerned, so there's that, but it doesn't tell you all that much about who's a "draw." Although much of this shit doesn't, but that doesn't change much as far these mark wars are concerned.

Common sense would tell you that the Taker story was HUGE.


----------



## Uerfer

Like I already said, Brock's segment is unlikely to be the highest rated considering the overall viewership and 18-49 rating of the second hour. Metlzer needs to either release the full definite report or shut the fuck up.


----------



## Sonnen Says

Highest numbers for last year:



> -In the segment breakdown, the opener with john Cena, CM Punk and Paul Heyman did a 3.71 quarter rating for the high point of the night.
> -The show opened huge with a 3.79 quarter rating with CM Punk’s promo.
> -The MizTV segment with Paul Heyman and Brock Lesnar gained 600,000 viewers at 10pm for a 3.82 quarter rating – the high point of the show.
> -John Cena’s promo gained around 140,000 viewers and CM Punk vs. Cena in the main event gained 1,002,000 viewers for a 3.9 overrun rating – a huge success.
> -The final segment with Vince McMahon, Heyman and Brock Lesnar gained 750,000 viewers for a 4.00 overrun.
> -The in-ring segment with Punk and Rock at 10pm gained 279,000 viewers for a 4.03 quarter rating – the largest since Raw 1000.
> -The high-point of the show came with The Rock and John Cena having their point & counterpoint segment, which did a 4.1 quarter rating and gained 855,000 viewers in the 9pm timeslot.


----------



## elo

JY57 said:


> via Metzler for overall peak of the show


Did this promo occur during a "top of the hour" period?


----------



## Uerfer

The last time we had both Observer and A18-49 demo numbers, the highest rated quarters were the same along with the appropriate viewership gains. For instance, Paul heyman proposal to Ryback and punk run in segment back in september drew close to a million gain, also was the highest rated QH in the demographic rating. Similarly, Punk's return to chicago which drew the biggest, also rated the highest in the demo, both of these at 10PM totally outdrawing the overrun. If Brock's seg was the biggest overall, it just can't be the fourth biggest from top in the demo specific numbers. Not possible at all. Even Hogan and Cesaro outdraw that from 10:30 QH.


----------



## elo

It's possible Uerfer.

If it was a top of the hour segment that cut across 2 quarters and was surrounded by shit then it's possible. There was probably a mass tune out when people realised Taker wasn't going to interrupt which would have killed the quarter rating, the peak figure is just a capture.


----------



## Starbuck

THE PENDULUM SWINGS BACK

Torch numbers are just 1 demo. I think since we haven't heard from Observer in a while we all forgot about that. Even still, if the overrun drew a 3.0 in 1 demo I fail to see how it could be beaten by the 4th highest rated segment in the same demo. Big meltz gotta spill the beans here or he ain't making much sense, just saying. If he suddenly has access to ratings for one segment after months of nothing then he's got to have it for the whole show. 

SPILL IT DAVE

:taker

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## THANOS

Starbuck said:


> THE PENDULUM SWINGS BACK
> 
> Torch numbers are just 1 demo. I think since we haven't heard from Observer in a while we all forgot about that. Even still, if the overrun drew a 3.0 in 1 demo I fail to see how it could be beaten by the 4th highest rated segment in the same demo. Big meltz gotta spill the beans here or he ain't making much sense, just saying. If he suddenly has access to ratings for one segment after months of nothing then he's got to have it for the whole show.
> 
> SPILL IT DAVE
> 
> :taker
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


Agreed. It could very well be like what Ueffer said, that Meltzer is just assuming it was the highest like back when he used to approximate the segment ratings (eg. around 400,000 viewers for the 2nd quarter). Unless he posts the entire report, this has no validity against the full report for the CORE 18-49 demographic, which is always the majority of viewers for RAW. How could the Heyman/Lesnar segment do THAT well in the <18 and >49 demos? It would have to do absolutely astounding with those demos to come from 6th place in the core demo to 1st place overall :shocked:. I'm just not buying it until I get the full report.

Completeness and validity are important here, and Meltzer's blanket statement has neither at this point. Pwtorch's report has both, so you guys do the math.


----------



## Starbuck

Well it can still be valid. Remember some of the Big Show stuff last year didn't do well in the Torch breakdown which everybody found hilarious and then the Observer breakdown came out and painted a completely different picture showing big gains from the overall audience. Same thing could have happened here and if so it's got to be a monster number to beat out something that drew a 3.0 in one demo alone. Until Meltzer posts the whole thing, we'll never know lol.

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## THANOS

Starbuck said:


> Well it can still be valid. Remember some of the Big Show stuff last year didn't do well in the Torch breakdown which everybody found hilarious and then the Observer breakdown came out and painted a completely different picture showing big gains from the overall audience. Same thing could have happened here and if so it's got to be a monster number to beat out something that drew a 3.0 in one demo alone. Until Meltzer posts the whole thing, we'll never know lol.
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


That's a good point, but like you said, it will have to have done monster gains in the small demos to do this, which just seems kind of illogical to me. A lot of kids seemed to be invested in Bryan and Triple H's feud, maybe even more so than adults given Bryan's character. Like you said though, there's no way of knowing for sure until/unless we get a proper breakdown. Until then I'm just assuming Meltzer looking at the average viewers for each hour, and took a guess at what drew the most, like he was doing back around when he first stopped getting the ratings report.

If Meltzer is correct, then it means the Bryan/HHH overrun got less than a 1.2 rating with the <18 and >49 demos combined, which just seems really hard to believe imo.


----------



## purple_gloves

THANOS said:


> That's a good point, but like you said, it will have to have done monster gains in the small demos to do this, which just seems kind of illogical to me. A lot of kids seemed to be invested in Bryan and Triple H's feud, maybe even more so than adults given Bryan's character. Like you said though, there's no way of knowing for sure until/unless we get a proper breakdown. Until then I'm just assuming Meltzer looking at the average viewers for each hour, and took a guess at what drew the most, like he was doing back around when he first stopped getting the ratings report.
> 
> If Meltzer is correct, then it means the Bryan/HHH overrun got less than a 1.2 rating with the <18 and >49 demos combined, which just seems really hard to believe imo.


Clutching at straws much?

I don't see a low <18 final hour number so hard to believe. A lot of kids are in bed by then aren't they?

And how often does Meltzer release this sort of info which then turns out to be wrong?


----------



## THANOS

purple_gloves said:


> Clutching at straws much?
> 
> I don't see a low <18 final hour number so hard to believe. A lot of kids are in bed by then aren't they?
> 
> And how often does Meltzer release this sort of info which then turns out to be wrong?


I'm sure Meltzer has a lot of demand for those ratings breakdowns, so it doesn't make any sense to me why he wouldn't post a full one, unless of course he only has his estimates, which he has done in the past, and are far from a sure thing.


----------



## JY57

purple_gloves said:


> Clutching at straws much?
> 
> I don't see a low <18 final hour number so hard to believe. A lot of kids are in bed by then aren't they?
> 
> And how often does Meltzer release this sort of info which then turns out to be wrong?


he has been releasing the peak of the show lately either through the radio or newsletter. And he gets these highest peak of RAW from some officials inside WWE themselves


----------



## D.M.N.

#BadNewsSanta said:


> That's a pretty far cry down from 5.9 million, but I'd imagine that's in the range the overrun and maybe the opener got.
> 
> I do wonder what the definite last highest segment was.
> 
> Edit: These were the last highest numbers I could find (for Raw 3/7/11):


Raw 1000 would be the last highest quarter hour.

The 4.2 rating / 5.9 million number for the Lesnar/Heyman segment implies that the remaining 45 minutes of hour two averaged 3.4 rating / 4.8 million viewers.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

JY57 said:


> he has been releasing the peak of the show lately either through the radio or newsletter. And he gets these highest peak of RAW from some officials inside WWE themselves


What other peaks has he reported?

Also, while I'm not exactly a Meltzer "fan", I find it hard to believe he'd lie and say one segment was the peak, when it wasn't. If we're speculating, it could be that Meltzer was only told by his source that the highest quarter was the Brock/Heyman segment, and then provided the rating and viewership, but didn't give him anything else...

... Or his source is :heyman


----------



## JC00

JY57 said:


> it is in his new Wrestling Observer Newsletter that came Out Today here is his fully wording in the newsletter:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Most of the show went against the Connecticut vs. Kentucky NCAA tournament final that did 17.79 million viewers
Click to expand...


How the hell did he get that wrong?

NCAA title game had 21.20m viewers.

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...-adjusted-down-ncaa-basketball-finals/252093/

And yes I'll trust an established TV ratings news site over meltzer.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

JC00 said:


> How the hell did he get that wrong?
> 
> NCAA title game had 21.20m viewers.
> 
> http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...-adjusted-down-ncaa-basketball-finals/252093/
> 
> And yes I'll trust an established TV ratings news site over meltzer.


Meltzer lied, the steak died!!! :damn


----------



## JY57

#BadNewsSanta said:


> What other peaks has he reported?
> 
> Also, while I'm not exactly a Meltzer "fan", I find it hard to believe he'd lie and say one segment was the peak, when it wasn't. If we're speculating, it could be that Meltzer was only told by his source that the highest quarter was the Brock/Heyman segment, and then provided the rating and viewership, but didn't give him anything else...
> 
> ... Or his source is :heyman


first 3 weeks Batista appeared on RAW, the occupy RAW, Hogan's return, & Heyman/Brock this week (believe he said some other on the radio/WON but these I remember). Its not every week but sporadically he gets these high peak numbers from WWE.


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7

JC00 said:


> How the hell did he get that wrong?
> 
> NCAA title game had 21.20m viewers.
> 
> http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...-adjusted-down-ncaa-basketball-finals/252093/
> 
> And yes I'll trust an established TV ratings news site over meltzer.


That's because he used the preliminary numbers.

Here's an article by tvbythenumbers explaining the differences in ratings between preliminary and final numbers:

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...adjusted-up-down-in-the-final-ratings/161978/

And here's the prelim numbers from tvbythenumbers where the estimated number is 17.79:

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...new-low-against-ncaa-basketball-final/252151/


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

JY57 said:


> first 3 weeks Batista appeared on RAW, the occupy RAW, Hogan's return, & Heyman/Brock this week (believe he said some other on the radio/WON but these I remember). Its not every week but sporadically he gets these high peak numbers from WWE.


I knew he did the occupy segment, but what did the others you mentioned get?


----------



## JY57

#BadNewsSanta said:


> I knew he did the occupy segment, but what did the others you mentioned get?


don't know just on radio shows with Bryan he said that was told by WWE that Batista had the highest segment his first 3 weeks and Hogan's return was the peak overall on the 24th.


----------



## JC00

JoseDRiveraTCR7 said:


> That's because he used the preliminary numbers.
> 
> Here's an article by tvbythenumbers explaining the differences in ratings between preliminary and final numbers:
> 
> http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...adjusted-up-down-in-the-final-ratings/161978/
> 
> And here's the prelim numbers from tvbythenumbers where the estimated number is 17.79:
> 
> http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...new-low-against-ncaa-basketball-final/252151/


I know what preliminary and final ratings are. My point is he was wrong to use the preliminary as the final rating was known.


----------



## JoseDRiveraTCR7

JC00 said:


> I know what preliminary and final ratings are. My point is he was wrong to use the preliminary as the final rating was known.


Your original implied point didn't come off that.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

This was posted in the Raw thread by Kurt 'Olympic Gold. He didnt say where he got it from but it is slightly more than what we have now:



> As expected, the Raw viewership number was through the roof last night with a massive 5.14 million viewers. In comparison, they did a 4.63 million last year after 'Mania. *The show opened strong with 5.31 million, and dipped down slightly through the show to a 5.03 million.*
> 
> The rating is expected to be a 3.7, which is one of the highest ratings in awhile.
> 
> UPDATE; The rating was a 3.7, the biggest number since the 3.9 for the 1,000th Raw on July 23, 2012.


----------



## D.M.N.

That's just an hourly breakdown - hour 1 had 5.31m and hour 3 had 5.03m.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

D.M.N. said:


> That's just an hourly breakdown - hour 1 had 5.31m and hour 3 had 5.03m.



You are right. My mind froze for a second. So there is nothing new.


----------



## Starbuck

I can feel the tension. Bryan marks and Taker marks about to go to war if Meltzer ever posts his information lol.

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Starbuck said:


> I can feel the tension. Bryan marks and Taker marks about to go to war if Meltzer ever posts his information lol.
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


About to? What's the last few pages been, then?


----------



## Bfo4jd

JY57 said:


> first 3 weeks Batista appeared on RAW, the occupy RAW, Hogan's return, & Heyman/Brock this week (believe he said some other on the radio/WON but these I remember). Its not every week but sporadically he gets these high peak numbers from WWE.


Has he ever given the actual rating and viewership for those quarters like this week? I don't think he has, probably because he never had it. He merely mentioned Batista topped the rating and same with Occupy RAW and Hogan's return. This is the first time he has reported the rating/viewership.


----------



## robertdeniro

Saw this in another site.


> Most Watched Matches in the History of Pro Wrestling on Cable TV:
> 1. Austin vs. Undertaker, 6/28/99 (10,721,000 viewers)
> 2. Rock vs. Shane, 5/1/00 (10,576,500)
> 3. Austin & Rock & Vince vs. Undertaker & HHH & Shane, 5/10/99 (10,452,000)
> 4. Rock & Jericho vs. HHH & Benoit, 4/24/00 (9,984,000)
> 
> 
> the Highest Rated Raws:
> 1. 5/10/99 (Austin/Rock/Vince vs. Taker/HHH/Shane) - 8.13*
> 2. 5/1/00 (Rock/Shane) - 7.42**
> 3. 5/24/99 (Owen Hart tribute) - 7.20
> 4. 4/24/00 (Rock-Jericho tag) - 7.13**


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

robertdeniro said:


> Saw this in another site.


DAT Austin. DAT Attitude Era. Literally every match on both of those lists is from the Attitude Era :lol


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Most of the stuff on the list is from May.

DAT MAY MEGA DRAWING MONTH!


----------



## JY57

The Rock: This Your Life Segment will never be touched ever again (8.4 rating), in highest RAW segment territory


----------



## validreasoning

JY57 said:


> The Rock: This Your Life Segment will never be touched ever again (8.4 rating), in highest RAW segment territory


none of us can predict the future but that austin vs undertaker match on raw in june 1999 did a higher rating and most of the second hour of that may 5th 1999 raw outdrew "this is your life" as well.

8.4 rating in 100 million homes would be way more than the roughly 10 million viewers that watched "this is your life" back in 1999 so that too should be taken into account.

its funny comparing numbers, haystacks and big daddy drew 18 million for their match back in 1980 in the uk out of a population of 56 million..to give us an idea how popular pro wrestling was there at the time, by 1987 pro-wrestling was gone from broadcast tv in the uk


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

robertdeniro said:


> Saw this in another site.
> 
> 1. Austin vs. Undertaker, 6/28/99 (10,721,000 viewers)
> 2. Rock vs. Shane, 5/1/00 (10,576,500)
> 3. Austin & Rock & Vince vs. Undertaker & HHH & Shane, 5/10/99 (10,452,000)
> 4. Rock & Jericho vs. HHH & Benoit, 4/24/00 (9,984,000)
> 
> 
> the Highest Rated Raws:
> 1. 5/10/99 (Austin/Rock/Vince vs. Taker/HHH/Shane) - 8.13*
> 2. 5/1/00 (Rock/Shane) - 7.42**
> 3. 5/24/99 (Owen Hart tribute) - 7.20
> 4. 4/24/00 (Rock-Jericho tag) - 7.13*





ShowStopper said:


> DAT Austin. DAT Attitude Era. Literally every match on both of those lists is from the Attitude Era :lol





validreasoning said:


> none of us can predict the future but that austin vs undertaker match on raw in june 1999 did a higher rating and most of the second hour of that may 5th 1999 raw outdrew "this is your life" as well.


Austin vs Undertaker 6/28/99 was an Overrun, meaning Raw went past the time it was supposed to finish, so people were tuning in for the next show, and not for whatever was on Raw, that match is therefore not the highest rated segment of RAW.

This is your life with The Rock is the highest rated segment in the history of RAW, it wasn't an Overrun. Austin is not a huge draw.

This is your life outdrew the Taker/Austin match.



Rock316AE said:


> BTW about this Austin/Taker match, it got 9.5 and it's the biggest overrun number in RAW history but it's not a segment, it's count as a overrun number, the highest rated segment in RAW history is Rock This is your life - 8.4, with the start of Rock vs Shane in cage second with 8.3


http://www.wrestlingforum.com/10917044-post644.html


----------



## validreasoning

WorldWrestlingFed said:


> This is your life with The Rock is the highest rated segment in the history of RAW, it wasn't an Overrun. *Austin is not a huge draw.*
> 
> This is your life outdrew the Taker/Austin match.


take it up with meltzer, the bolded bit did make me laugh though..


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

validreasoning said:


> take it up with meltzer, the bolded bit did make me laugh though..


Asserting that it was a draw doesn't prove it, again it was an Overrun, it went over the time Raw was supposed to finish, people tuned in to watch the next show, it was therefore not the highest rated match/segment in Raw history, if This is your life was an overrun then it couldn't be called the highest rated segment in Raw history.

And yes Austin wasn't a huge draw, I dare you to show me where he caused a massive increase in ratings without Mcmahon, Tyson, the Rock or DX.

Also you'd have to take Vince Russo's word over Dave Meltzer's, Vince Russo was working for the World Wrestling Federation at that time and therefore knew the ratings, not Meltzer.

Using an overrun is biased, you know it doesn't count as it goes over the show's limit and means people were waiting/tuned in for the next show, if I used a overrun for the Rock you'd call me out on it.


----------



## robertdeniro

WorldWrestlingFed said:


> And yes Austin wasn't a huge draw


fpalm fpalm fpalm


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

robertdeniro said:


> fpalm fpalm fpalm


fpalm fpalm fpalm doesn't refute the facts.

You didn't answer my question,



WorldWrestlingFed said:


> I dare you to show me where he caused a massive increase in ratings without Mcmahon, Tyson, the Rock or DX.


you could not defend it, you know Austin wasn't a huge draw.

You can either answer this,



WorldWrestlingFed said:


> I dare you to show me where he caused a massive increase in ratings without Mcmahon, Tyson, the Rock or DX.



or admit Austin wasn't a huge draw, not answering it or ignoring the question will just show that you cannot defend it and Austin wasn't a huge draw.


----------



## Da Silva

Austin was the man when Wrestling was at it's peak in terms of popularity. It's stupid to claim he wasn't a draw.


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

Da Silva said:


> Austin was the man when Wrestling was at it's peak in terms of popularity. It's stupid to claim he wasn't a draw.


If he was, then show me where he caused a massive increase in ratings without Mcmahon, Tyson, the Rock or DX.


----------



## Da Silva

WorldWrestlingFed said:


> If he was, then show me where he caused a massive increase in ratings without Mcmahon, Tyson, the Rock or DX.


I have literally zero interest in wading through ratings from AE. It would a criminal waste of my time. Most if not all of the top dogs during the AE were draws and had lots of fans.


----------



## Choke2Death

WorldWrestlingFed said:


> If he was, then show me where he caused a massive increase in ratings without Mcmahon, Tyson, the Rock or DX.


There's a reason why he was the man in the Attitude Era and just a couple of years ago his "3:16" shirt was one of the top selling even though he hasn't wrestled in a decade. Stop embarrassing yourself. People like you give Rock fans a bad name and that's coming from a big fan.


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

Choke2Death said:


> There's a reason why he was the man in the Attitude Era


There's a reason why Kurt Angle was the man in 2000, being in the main event doesn't mean you're a draw. The Rock didn't have to be in the main event to draw, he was the Attitude era, all that Teen movies/Late 90s/Millennium style is in his character, 

They even named their main show Smackdown after him(During the era, Smackdown was equal to Raw)



Choke2Death said:


> and just a couple of years ago his "3:16" shirt was one of the top selling even though he hasn't wrestled in a decade.


Due to WWE revisionist history and either bandwagon, new, and/or nostalgia fans. 



Choke2Death said:


> Stop embarrassing yourself.


I'm going to take that as an insult seeing as you've said this with no evidence, you haven't refuted anything, how can you tell me I'm embarrassing myself when you haven't posted any rebuttal? 



Choke2Death said:


> People like you give Rock fans a bad name and that's coming from a big fan.


Show me a massive ratings increase from Austin without Mcmahon, Rock, DX, or Tyson,(Basically no other huge draws) then you could say I embarrassed myself, until then it stands, Austin wasn't a huge draw.


----------



## Choke2Death

WorldWrestlingFed said:


> Show me a massive ratings increase from Austin without Mcmahon, Rock, DX, or Tyson,(Basically no other huge draws) then you could say I embarrassed myself, until then it stands, Austin wasn't a huge draw.


I will not even waste time with this shit. If it makes you sleep better at night, then so be it. I'm not gonna participate in these stupid Austin/Rock mark wars about how many dollars they made the company on 2nd April 1999, the decibel of their pop from X camera angle or how many viewers they gained on 5 minutes and 10 seconds into 9 PM on Raw in November 20, 2000.


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

Choke2Death said:


> I will not even waste time with this shit. If it makes you sleep better at night, then so be it. I'm not gonna participate in these stupid Austin/Rock mark wars about how many dollars they made the company on 2nd April 1999, the decibel of their pop from X camera angle or how many viewers they gained on 5 minutes and 10 seconds into 9 PM on Raw in November 20, 2000.


If Austin caused a massive increase in ratings without Tyson, Rock, Mcmahon, DX(basically no other huge draw), then you could've easily posted the rating,

in about the same time it took you to write that response, you could've posted the rating if there was one, there apparently isn't Austin isn't a huge draw, it's simply biased WWE revisionist history and their resentment at the Rock for leaving.


----------



## Darkness is here

Stop feeding the troll guys.

#RISEABOVETROLLS


----------



## THANOS

Darkness is here said:


> Stop feeding the troll guys.
> 
> #RISEABOVETROLLS


You're one to talk dude, to be honest.


----------



## JC00

WorldWrestlingFed said:


> Also you'd have to take Vince Russo's word over Dave Meltzer's, Vince Russo was working for the World Wrestling Federation at that time and therefore knew the ratings, not Meltzer.


Russo is biased. That Rock segment was the last notable thing he was involved with before he left for WCW a week later. Austin/Taker was a wrestling match, which any wrestler will tell you Russo cares little about.


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

JC00 said:


> Russo is biased. That Rock segment was the last notable thing he was involved with before he left for WCW a week later. Austin/Taker was a wrestling match, which any wrestler will tell you Russo cares little about.


Doesn't change that's he's more credible than Meltzer, isn't biased for wrestlers like Meltzer is for Austin and actually worked for the World Wrestling Federation.

Russo is reliable, and that match was an overrun, show me where Austin caused a massive ratings increase without Tyson, Mcmahon, DX, Rock, or any huge draw.


----------



## JC00

Get a life. All you do is just continually attack people that say Austin was the bigger draw. It's really pathetic.

In the wrestling history books Austin will go down as the GOAT of The GOATS


----------



## murder

WorldWrestlingFed said:


> show me where Austin caused a massive ratings increase without Tyson, Mcmahon, DX, Rock, or any huge draw.


He broke cable records for his matches against Kane, once in 98 and once in 99. Also on the go-home Raw to Mania 15 against Big Show. 

Besides, your argument is stupid. It's like asking, "where did Hogan increase ratings without Piper, Andre and Savage?"


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

murder said:


> He broke cable records for his matches against Kane, once in 98 and once in 99.


Proof?

also matches(plural) with Kane? So it was matches with Kane that drew? if so then it seems as if Kane was the draw there.



murder said:


> Also on the go-home Raw to Mania 15 against Big Show.


Proof?

Also, go home raw also had the beer truck segment, and Big Show/The Giant was already known, since he defected from WCW.



murder said:


> Besides, your argument is stupid. It's like asking, "where did Hogan increase ratings without Piper, Andre and Savage?"


No it isn't for example Rock/Shane drew an 8.3, 2nd highest rating in raw history, and Shane isn't a huge draw.


----------



## RelivingTheShadow

This Rock mark is pitiful. Keep posting though, give me funny posts to read.


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

TakeMyGun said:


> This Rock mark is pitiful. Keep posting though, give me funny posts to read.


#1, That doesn't refute anything.

#2, So because I'm a Rock fan that means I'm biased? I'll be the first to say Hulk Hogan drew more than Rock(15.2/33 Million viewers Saturday Nights Main event), and is the biggest draw of all time.


----------



## Bfo4jd

WorldWrestlingFed said:


> No it isn't for example Rock/Shane drew an 8.3, 2nd highest rating in raw history, and Shane isn't a huge draw.


That was actually the overrun with the Mcmahons that drew so huge following backlash PPV the night before. People were expecting Austin to show up. This one is wrongly credited to Rock/Shane which was the main event match before leading to overrun and drew in the average 7s at the time. You need to check your facts.


----------



## GCA-FF

Sry wrong thread


----------



## THANOS

Going to be interesting to see the ratings for last night. Last week we had Taker marks saying, "his streak ending elevated the rating of the entire show", so if the rating is close to last week without Bryan this week, can we say, "Bryan as the show's champion elevated the show without him even appearing" ?

Anyways, I'm expecting a decent drop off from last week without Lesnar/Heyman or Bryan on the show. Hopefully the Shield mainevent does well, because those cats deserve it, and I'm hoping Heyman's union with Cesaro elevates his match with Henry as well (but then again we all know it will, since the match includes the 'ratings' himself :henry1)

Going to be interesting. Hoping Cena's promo bombs, but it will probably be the high point of the show, because Americans tend to love stuff like that (remember the Cena/Cole BBQ sauce match fpalm).


----------



## JC00

THANOS said:


> Going to be interesting to see the ratings for last night. Last week we had Taker marks saying, "his streak ending elevated the rating of the entire show", so if the rating is close to last week without Bryan this week, can we say, "Bryan as the show's champion elevated the show without him even appearing" ?


Bryan haters will be absolutely insufferable if this is the case if it is about even with last week's rating. I don't even want to think how they will be if the rating is actually up.


----------



## Happenstan

THANOS said:


> Going to be interesting to see the ratings for last night. Last week we had Taker marks saying, "his streak ending elevated the rating of the entire show", so if the rating is close to last week without Bryan this week, can we say, "Bryan as the show's champion elevated the show without him even appearing" ?
> 
> Anyways, I'm expecting a decent drop off from last week without Lesnar/Heyman or Bryan on the show. Hopefully the Shield mainevent does well, because those cats deserve it, and I'm hoping Heyman's union with Cesaro elevates his match with Henry as well (but then again we all know it will, since the match includes the 'ratings' himself :henry1)
> 
> Going to be interesting. Hoping Cena's promo bombs, but it will probably be the high point of the show, because Americans tend to love stuff like that (remember the Cena/Cole BBQ sauce match fpalm).



I think the really telling thing will be drop off. Hour 1 should do great but the following hours will probably start tanking after it was made known to tv watchers that Bryan was on his honeymoon.


----------



## THANOS

Happenstan said:


> I think the really telling thing will be drop off. Hour 1 should do great but the following hours will probably start tanking after it was made known to tv watchers that Bryan was on his honeymoon.


When did they announce that? Was it in hour 1? If viewers drop off big after that announcement I will laugh :lol.


----------



## Happenstan

THANOS said:


> When did they announce that? Was it in hour 1? If viewers drop off big after that announcement I will laugh :lol.


I remember Cole mentioning it during the Rhodes match, I believe. It was definitely near the end of the first hour.


----------



## JC00

THANOS said:


> If viewers drop off big after that announcement I will laugh :lol.


Hoping for a drop off after the 1st hour. Bryan haters will be beside themselves. Although I'm sure some they'll come up with all kinds of excuses.


----------



## THANOS

Happenstan said:


> I remember Cole mentioning it during the Rhodes match, I believe. It was definitely near the end of the first hour.


Definitely going to be interesting to see when the numbers come out. A lot of matches featuring non-drawing/unproven acts. Sheamus/Swagger, RVD/Del Rio, Barrett/Ziggler, Rusev/Woods, etc. shouldn't do all that well. The Big Show/Sandow segment will most likely tank as well, and I'm not sure how Paige's match with Alicia Fox will do without AJ there to add interest. This could be a very bad rating potentially. 

At least they added significance to the matches they were putting out with a shot at the IC title as the main prize. Matches, traditionally, do much better when there is a reason for them occurring. Shocking, I know .


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

Bfo4jd said:


> That was actually the overrun with the Mcmahons that drew so huge following backlash PPV the night before.


I gave an example, basically to use a segment/match where the other guy isn't the draw. I remembered this segment and forgot it was an overrun, mere example, I'll be the first to admit it doesn't count due to being an overrun, unlike Austin fans.



Bfo4jd said:


> People were expecting Austin to show up.


Proof?


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

THANOS said:


> Definitely going to be interesting to see when the numbers come out. A lot of matches featuring non-drawing/unproven acts. Sheamus/Swagger, RVD/Del Rio, Barrett/Ziggler, Rusev/Woods, etc. shouldn't do all that well. The Big Show/Sandow segment will most likely tank as well, and I'm not sure how Paige's match with Alicia Fox will do without AJ there to add interest. This could be a very bad rating potentially.
> 
> At least they added significance to the matches they were putting out with a shot at the IC title as the main prize. Matches, traditionally, do much better when there is a reason for them occurring. Shocking, I know .


Interest in Warrior could spark some interest. Question is did the average viewer see the tribute vid and tune out or stay to see what other tributes may have occurred.


----------



## JC00

Bfo4jd said:


> That was actually the overrun with the Mcmahons that drew so huge following backlash PPV the night before. People were expecting Austin to show up. This one is wrongly credited to Rock/Shane which was the main event match before leading to overrun and drew in the average 7s at the time. You need to check your facts.


I see he hasn't responded to this. Surprised he didn't comeback with "post your source link". Must be because he can't post source links to any of the stuff he is claiming. And no, claiming Vince Russo said it is not a source.


----------



## JY57

> The WWE reality series Total Divas drew 1.164 million viewers, according to Zap2It.com. Viewership was down from the 1.546 total for March 30 airing.


-


----------



## THANOS

JY57 said:


> -


No Bryan = no views lol.


----------



## D.M.N.

Expecting low 4 million for last night, will be surprised if they keep much momentum from last week really.


----------



## THANOS

D.M.N. said:


> Expecting low 4 million for last night, will be surprised if they keep much momentum from last week really.


Personally, I felt the show was very enjoyable with actual reasons for many of the matches occurring, instead of just happening to fill space like usual. However, I'm willing to bet the viewer didn't feel the same way and all these matches featuring unproven/non-drawing acts absolutely bomb. I'm hoping that doesn't happen, but it's a very realistic possibility, and it could drag the entire show don't to a very low rating.

I'll be pleasantly surprised if it keeps pretty high for the sake of the Shield, Evolution, Wyatt/Cena, Cesaro/Heyman, and other entertaining acts, but I'm worried there will be a huge dropoff from hour 1 when WWE announces Bryan being away on his honeymoon.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

Yeah I'm predicting about an average of 4.1 million viewers for the 3 hours.


----------



## Starbuck

Bryan or no Bryan things are going to drop this week imo. The high has come down and we're back to normal now. Yes, they've kick started a lot of new programs but the audience that tunes in for Mania doesn't stick around for the rest of the year. No matter how good I personally think things are at the minute, I can't see that changing.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Starbuck's right. The ratings do normally come done after a post ppv show. Take these twitter ratings for what their worth:



> - WWE Raw declined 40-50 percent in Nielsen's Twitter TV Ratings from last week's post-WrestleMania episode.
> 
> Raw ranked #3 on TV Monday night, trailing the WNBA Draft on ESPN2 and "Dancing with the Stars" on ABC.
> 
> Raw drew a unique Twitter audience of 1.775 million, down 41 percent from last week's year-high 3.010 million and down 12 percent from the WM30 lead-in show.
> 
> Raw's total impressions were 10.678 million, less than half of last week's 21.711 million, but up from the pre-WM30 Raw.
> 
> Raw drew fewer unique Twitter users than the WNBA Draft and DWTS, but topped both shows in total impressions.


----------



## Starbuck

Bryan's chase for the title is over now and the shock of the streak being broken has worn off. Mania itself has passed and we're into the new wrestling year. Of course there's going to be a drop but I hope that doesn't stop the mark wars, they're fun .


----------



## D.M.N.

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/20...-wives-bates-motel-archer-dallas-more/254059/

WWE Entertainment	USA	8:00 PM	4811	1.7
WWE Entertainment	USA	9:00 PM	4831	1.7
WWE Entertainment	USA	10:00 PM	4669	1.7

Interesting numbers! And surprising too. Not necessarily hour 1, but hour 2 and hour 3 held up extremely well when you consider there were no 'big' names there.


----------



## JY57

Hour 1 - 4.811 million
Hour 2 - 4.831 million
Hour 3 - 4.669 million


----------



## The Boy Wonder

Are those good numbers or weak? Don't have much to compare it to.


----------



## JY57

The Boy Wonder said:


> Are those good numbers or weak? Don't have much to compare it to.


last year they only average 4.15 million viewers the week after Post Mania RAW


----------



## The Boy Wonder

JY57 said:


> last year they only average 4.1 million viewers the week after Post Mania RAW


Wow. The Shield??? Maybe they draw!


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Really good numbers, although tbh, and I said kind of precited this last week, I think Warrior's death helped a lot in keeping things afloat (old fans tuning in to see the Warrior tribute and whatever they did throughout the show). Next week, provided we don't get another wrestling death that's somewhat or completely relevant to today's product (hope to god we don't, of course), will be the real test. They have the hook of Evolution from this week, plus Bryan should be there next week, so let's see if they can keep the numbers in this 4.6-4.7 million range.


----------



## Joshi Judas

Amazing numbers considering the post Mania Raw is over. Maybe the quality of last week's Raw helped. Even then, they announced in the first hour that Bryan won't be there, yet the second and third hours held up amazingly well. Maybe The Shield are a draw.


----------



## THANOS

Hopefully last week has helped The Shield and Cesaro to become better draws! These are great numbers regardless.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

It's possible that putting The Shield in last week's main event segment worked. That told the audience these guys are in the main event picture.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

This is good news for WWE. The interest in the product is stronger now than it has been in a while. I dont know how many eyeballs Warrior's death brought to Raw, but WWE did a good job of keeping them for the show on average.


----------



## Waffelz

RAW had no big names at all, really. Just loads of midcarders wrestling.


----------



## Eddie Ray

Waffelz said:


> RAW had no big names at all, really. Just loads of midcarders wrestling.


because its spending time building the next generation, like it should.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

On my FB wrestling page there are people that think the rating dropped from 5.1 million viewers to 4.7 because fans knew Bryan wasn't going to be on. LOL. 5.1 was never, ever going to happen again.


----------



## DoubtGin

wow awesome numbers for RAW


----------



## murder

Considering that last week also had Hogan, Lesnar, Warrior and Bryan, this week's number is pretty damn impressive.


----------



## WWE

RAW did well without Daniel Bryan :ti






......I know.


----------



## THANOS

murder said:


> Considering that last week also had Hogan, Lesnar, Warrior and Bryan, this week's number is pretty damn impressive.


This.


----------



## CJohn3:16

Impressive ratings this week. It will drop more next week.


----------



## #Mark

Great numbers for RAW. Shield, Cesaro, and Re-Evolution are draws for sure. I'm certain the Warrior tribute played a part in the rating but I'm sure the brunt of the intrigue was in the main angles.

I would also be remiss not to mention the fact that YESTLEMANIA set a record grossing that reached over 1 million U.S households. I can't remember who but someone in this thread was claiming that this years WM had the lowest intrigue in years because of the Bryan angle and that the ratings this WM season were lower than last years because of the increased spotlight on Bryan. Well, WM grossed 400,000 buys domestically with a couple of hundred internationally soon to follow. That puts it up there in terms of buyrates with most WMs in the last decade. Couple that with the 667,000 network subscriptions and this is could be highest number of all time. The interest was definitely in Bryan's chase against HHH, Batista, and Orton. I know if WM was a failure most people in this thread would be harping on about how Bryan deserves the blame (IE: the guy in this thread who is gloating about how the number did well without Bryan) so I definitely think people should give credit where it's due. I know I'm a huge Bryan fan so I'm obviously not as objective as some but the numbers speak for themselves. Bryan was given the spotlight and he delivered.


----------



## Choke2Death

Pretty strong numbers. Show wasn't as good this week but Evolution made it worth it.


----------



## Londrick

JY57 said:


> Hour 1 - 4.811 million
> Hour 2 - 4.831 million
> Hour 3 - 4.669 million


This weeks RAW just buried all those Taker trolls by barely dipping in viewership.


----------



## THANOS

Londrick said:


> This weeks RAW just buried all those Taker trolls by barely dipping in viewership.


Is it safe to say what I said earlier then? Lol



> Last week we had Taker marks saying, "his streak ending elevated the rating of the entire show", so if the rating is close to last week without Bryan this week, can we say, "Bryan as the show's champion elevated the show without even appearing" ?


----------



## bmtrocks

WWE confirmed that Wrestlemania 30 reached over 1 million homes with the combined viewership on the WWE Network and pay-per-view buys, I think Bryan is doing fine when it comes to drawing actually.


----------



## dan the marino

Honestly ratings will probably slowly drop bit by bit for the next month or so anyway. People tune in just for Wrestlemania, stick around for a short while, and tune back out afterwards.


----------



## Bfo4jd

Very impressive numbers this week. I seriously expected a huge drop off from last week but it seems to not only have held up but drawn rather well. Overrun should tell us if lack of the champion Bryan mattered at all.


----------



## DoubtGin

"The rating for Monday's WWE RAW was a 3.26, down from last week's post-WrestleMania 3.70 rating. As noted, this week's show averaged 4.77 million viewers."


----------



## YoungGun_UK

Will be interesting to see next weeks viewership with Bryan back.


----------



## dmccourt95

Does anyone here think that the shield-evolution feud plus Bryan as champion keep numbers high or will they fall away after a few weeks


----------



## D.M.N.

Just spotted that Bryan/HHH match that never really happened from last week broke 1 million views on WWE's YouTube channel, pretty big for them - although that could be inflated a bit from loads of people hitting WWE's channel due to Warrior's death (which in turn has 4.4 million views alone).


----------



## validreasoning

dmccourt95 said:


> Does anyone here think that the shield-evolution feud plus Bryan as champion keep numbers high or will they fall away after a few weeks


brock lesnar returning after 8 years and feuding with cena in 2012 couldn't keep the numbers high...

the nba playoffs will be going head to head with raw in the next week or so and that will continue till mid june


----------



## D.M.N.

A massive *243,000 (12.1%)* watched last week's live Raw airing in the UK (or Sky+'d that airing within seven days), peaking with 381k at the end of the opening segment with Daniel Bryan and Triple H, the highest Raw number since Raw 1000.

The 5-minute peaks were:

- 381k (01:10) - Daniel Bryan and Triple H segment
- 347k (04:05) - Daniel Bryan vs Triple H
- 320k (02:00) - Brock Lesnar segment
- 317k (03:30) - Cesaro, Zeb Coulter and Paul Heyman segment
- 289k (03:15) - Paige debut

The 381k peak is not quite as high as some of the figures with The Rock last year, but very near that ballpark and impressive still.


----------



## dmccourt95

validreasoning said:


> brock lesnar returning after 8 years and feuding with cena in 2012 couldn't keep the numbers high...
> 
> the nba playoffs will be going head to head with raw in the next week or so and that will continue till mid june


That's a fair point, there doesn't seem to be the interest there for people outside the regulars to keep watching


----------



## Bfo4jd

D.M.N. said:


> Just spotted that Bryan/HHH match that never really happened from last week broke 1 million views on WWE's YouTube channel, pretty big for them - although that could be inflated a bit from loads of people hitting WWE's channel due to Warrior's death (which in turn has 4.4 million views alone).


Warrior's RAW promo video was featured on WWE's official "WWEfannation" channel homepage for the entire two weeks. It bumps up the total views everytime anyone visits their youtube channel homepage. They don't have to actually watch the content.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

validreasoning said:


> brock lesnar returning after 8 years and feuding with cena in 2012 couldn't keep the numbers high...
> 
> the *Chicago Bulls' playoff run* will be going head to head with raw in the next week or so and that will continue till mid june


Fixed.


----------



## Starbuck

D.M.N. said:


> A massive *243,000 (12.1%)* watched last week's live Raw airing in the UK (or Sky+'d that airing within seven days), peaking with 381k at the end of the opening segment with Daniel Bryan and Triple H, the highest Raw number since Raw 1000.
> 
> The 5-minute peaks were:
> 
> - 381k (01:10) - Daniel Bryan and Triple H segment
> - 347k (04:05) - Daniel Bryan vs Triple H
> - 320k (02:00) - Brock Lesnar segment
> - 317k (03:30) - Cesaro, Zeb Coulter and Paul Heyman segment
> - 289k (03:15) - Paige debut
> 
> The 381k peak is not quite as high as some of the figures with The Rock last year, but very near that ballpark and impressive still.


:lol we get UK viewership breakdowns but not the US ones lol. 

Anyway, Raw numbers this week are highly impressive. They proved me wrong since I was expecting a much bigger drop than that yet they practically held steady under the circumstances. 

Success!

:vince3


----------



## Uerfer

D.M.N. said:


> Just spotted that Bryan/HHH match that never really happened from last week broke 1 million views on WWE's YouTube channel, pretty big for them





D.M.N. said:


> A massive *243,000 (12.1%)* watched last week's live Raw airing in the UK (or Sky+'d that airing within seven days), peaking with 381k at the end of the opening segment with Daniel Bryan and Triple H, the highest Raw number since Raw 1000.
> 
> The 5-minute peaks were:
> 
> - 381k (01:10) - Daniel Bryan and Triple H segment
> - 347k (04:05) - Daniel Bryan vs Triple H
> - 320k (02:00) - Brock Lesnar segment
> - 317k (03:30) - Cesaro, Zeb Coulter and Paul Heyman segment
> - 289k (03:15) - Paige debut
> 
> The 381k peak is not quite as high as some of the figures with The Rock last year, but very near that ballpark and impressive still.



This yet again shows where the interest was, last week on post mania RAW. Brock's segment was the fourth biggest in A18-49 demo, fifth biggest on youtube(not even 500k views), and only the third highest peak from those DVR figures posted by D.M.N..... and yet this is suppose to be the highest rated quarter of the entire night? Dave Meltzer with his bullshit numbers. 5.9m viewers my ass!


----------



## Waffelz

300k other people are sad enough to stay up until 4am to watch RAW with me? That's awesome!


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Uerfer said:


> This yet again shows where the interest was, last week on post mania RAW. Brock's segment was the fourth biggest in A18-49 demo, fifth biggest on youtube(not even 500k views), and only the third highest peak from those DVR figures posted by D.M.N..... and yet this is suppose to be the highest rated quarter of the entire night? Dave Meltzer with his bullshit numbers. 5.9m viewers my ass!


Aww, someone needs a hug.


----------



## Uerfer

Nah.. I'm good thank you.


----------



## Darkness is here

> Hour 1 - 4.811 million
> Hour 2 - 4.831 million
> Hour 3 - 4.669 million


so......I was right when I said authority was the real draw from the start.
And suddenly the bryan marks are nowhere to be found after the huge ratings even without bryan.



bmtrocks said:


> WWE confirmed that Wrestlemania 30 reached over 1 million homes with the combined viewership on the WWE Network and pay-per-view buys, *I think Bryan is doing fine when it comes to drawing actually.*


:ti
AH! DAT BRYAN MARKISN

you SURELY forgot four of the biggest names in wrestling history also were on wm, amirite?


----------



## Londrick

Darkness is here said:


> so......I was right when I said authority was the real draw from the start.
> And suddenly the bryan marks are nowhere to be found after the huge ratings even without bryan.
> 
> 
> 
> :ti
> AH! DAT BRYAN MARKISN
> 
> you SURELY forgot four of the biggest names in wrestling history also were on wm, amirite?


One of which is Bryan. The other three: Hogan, Austin and Taker.


----------



## THANOS

Londrick said:


> One of which is Bryan. The other three: Hogan, Austin and Taker.


:troll


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Is there a breakdown for the IC tournament?

I want to see how Cesaro, Sheamus and Swagger did.


----------



## kokepepsi

Why unless they were in the opening segment, 9pm segment, 10pm segment, or overrun they lost viewers


----------



## Darkness is here

Londrick said:


> One of which is Bryan. The other three: Hogan, Austin and Taker.


:lmao :lmao :lmao

this is the best one i've heard from you bryan marks.
I hope to see a thread in a couple days on how bryan is bigger than hogan.


----------



## #Mark

Darkness is here said:


> so......I was right when I said authority was the real draw from the start.
> And suddenly the bryan marks are nowhere to be found after the huge ratings even without bryan.
> 
> 
> 
> :ti
> AH! DAT BRYAN MARKISN
> 
> you SURELY forgot four of the biggest names in wrestling history also were on wm, amirite?


:lmao Bryan opened and headlined WM and his match had the most build but three guys who weren't even advertised and were only involved in a promo segment deserve the credit? Them Bryan haters grasping for straws :lmao


----------



## Darkness is here

Rock,austin,hogan,cena were all advertised for wm and when you include other names like taker, brock, hhh, orton, batista......there is your wm card that would easily draw 1million buys.
And out of all people you give bryan the credit :ti
just look at his house shows records, cena(while being stale as fuck) is still outdrawing the hottest superstar of today.


----------



## Mr. I

Uerfer said:


> This yet again shows where the interest was, last week on post mania RAW. Brock's segment was the fourth biggest in A18-49 demo, fifth biggest on youtube(not even 500k views), and only the third highest peak from those DVR figures posted by D.M.N..... and yet this is suppose to be the highest rated quarter of the entire night? Dave Meltzer with his bullshit numbers. 5.9m viewers my ass!


He receives his numbers directly from WWE. Take it up with them.


----------



## #Mark

Darkness is here said:


> Rock,austin,hogan,cena were all advertised for wm and when you include other names like taker, brock, hhh, orton, batista......there is your wm card that would easily draw 1million buys.
> And out of all people you give bryan the credit :ti
> just look at his house shows records, cena(while being stale as fuck) is still outdrawing the hottest superstar of today.


:lmao Rock and Austin weren't advertised, Hogan was just a host.. Cena was in the midcard. Brock/Taker had no hype. Bryan/HHH was gaining the most ratings week in and week out and was the marquee match. Bryan not only opened the show but also headlined it. The whole show was built around his chase for the title. Some of you haters are nuts :lol


----------



## Darkness is here

rock and austin WERE ANNOUNCED to make a return at wmxxx on wwe's website, and hogan is not a huge draw but there is still good amount of ppl who would pay to see him.

These are the factors I think which caused the 1million buys.

1. I think atleast 50-70% would've bought wm for the network,
A. To get access to classic content.
B. Because it's cheap and would save them alot of money.

2. Hogan, austin, rock and cena(who still draws big) were on the same show.

3. You had the most star studded wm of all time with brock, taker, hhh, orton, batista, which easily makes up for 1million buys.

Now Iam not saying brayn does not deserves any credit, he does, but only a little, giving him the most credit is either blind love for him or pure trollism.


----------



## NastyYaffa

Darkness is here said:


> rock and austin WERE ANNOUNCED to make a return at wmxxx on wwe's website, and hogan is not a huge draw but there is still good amount of ppl who would pay to see him.
> 
> These are the factors I think which caused the 1million buys.
> 
> 1. I think atleast 50-70% would've bought wm for the network,
> A. To get access to classic content.
> B. Because it's cheap and would save them alot of money.
> 
> 2. Hogan, austin, rock and cena(who still draws big) were on the same show.
> 
> 3. You had the most star studded wm of all time with brock, taker, hhh, orton, batista, which easily makes up for 1million buys.
> 
> Now Iam not saying brayn does not deserves any credit, he does, but only a little, giving him the most credit is either blind love for him or pure trollism.


Rock was NOT announced to return at WM


----------



## FITZ

Darkness is here said:


> rock and austin WERE ANNOUNCED to make a return at wmxxx on wwe's website, and hogan is not a huge draw but there is still good amount of ppl who would pay to see him.
> 
> These are the factors I think which caused the 1million buys.
> 
> 1. I think atleast 50-70% would've bought wm for the network,
> A. To get access to classic content.
> B. Because it's cheap and would save them alot of money.
> 
> 2. Hogan, austin, rock and cena(who still draws big) were on the same show.
> 
> 3. You had the most star studded wm of all time with brock, taker, hhh, orton, batista, which easily makes up for 1million buys.
> 
> Now Iam not saying brayn does not deserves any credit, he does, but only a little, giving him the most credit is either blind love for him or pure trollism.


The 75,000 people that led to a near $11 million gate would say that they were there to see Bryan win the title. 

I don't see how you can give Orton, Batista, and Triple H credit for the buys/subscriptions and not give Bryan the same. If they deserve credit Bryan deserves just as much credit because the entire show was focused around whether or not Bryan would be able to beat all of them.


----------



## kokepepsi

But those 75k seats were sold way before the main event was ever even announced or bryan was being pushed hard

You all forget that there is a baseline "drawing" number that comes form the WWE brand itself and Wrestlemania being the biggest event of the WWE, trying to give credit to one guy or a few guys for the success of a show is incorrect

@Darkness they didn't get 1million buys stop saying that


----------



## #Mark

I would have loved to seen the reaction if the show failed. All of you guys refusing to give Bryan an ounce of credit would have placed all of the blame on him. I guess you say whatever fits your agenda. 

The fact is, Bryan/HHH/Orton/Batista angle was the marquee story going into Mania. The entire narrative of the show was Bryan overcoming the odds against the authority during his quest for the title. He opened and headlined the show. The live crowds during the RTWM and at Wrestlemania were clearly invested in this story more than any other because of the insane crowd reactions. His segments were gaining the highest ratings during the RTWM including the remarkable Occupy RAW rating. Those are all facts. So, Bryan deserves a the majority of credit (as does HHH, Orton, and Batista) for the fact that the show reached a record 1 million homes. I'm not sure why this is even a debate. Where's the objectivity?


----------



## Darkness is here

#mark

crowd being behind bryan and ACTUALLY investing money in him are two different things.
Ryder was also LOVED by the live crowds but it did'nt got the fans to invest money in him.

See bryan's house show records vs cena's, although the crowds was behind bryan, he STILL was'nt able to beat cena.

Now in cena vs bryan house show stats thread everyone is saving bryan's ass by saying how he is still not able to beat cena because he has just gotten his push a few months ago and here you are suddenly saying that now bryan is the reason wm did well?

It just shows the hypocricy and double standards of you bryan marks.

@pepsi: wwe says that not me.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Ratings do not equal buys. I'm not going to start a huge argument over this (or rather, I'm not going to continue it if someone replies to this), but comparing it to WM28, Taker/Lesnar is the Rock/Cena, and Bryan/HHH is Taker/HHH. One was the biggest match and the match more people would pay money to see, and the other is what attracted the most people on free TV (although it could've very well held it's own in buys without the big attraction match). 

And I'm NOT saying Taker/Lesnar is as big as Rock/Cena, so don't start that shit.


----------



## THANOS

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Ratings do not equal buys. I'm not going to start a huge argument over this (or rather, I'm not going to continue it if someone replies to this), but comparing it to WM28, Taker/Lesnar is the Rock/Cena, and Bryan/HHH is Taker/HHH. One was the biggest match and the match more people would pay money to see, and the other is what attracted the most people on free TV (although it could've very well held it's own in buys without the big attraction match).
> 
> And I'm NOT saying Taker/Lesnar is as big as Rock/Cena, so don't start that shit.


You're right they do not absolutely lead to payperview buys, but there is certainly a very strong correlation between the two. Let's look at that comparative example you gave for instance. The Rock/Cena had the higher ratings that year by far, with Taker/HHH coming in second, and going by your analysis, Rock/Cena was the main selling point. This was a clear example of ratings matching the payperview interest. I don't see how it's a stretch to use the same logic with Bryan/Evolution, especially with the monster ratings Bryan's segments were pulling in compared to the other acts, and the fact that nearly no one thought Lesnar was winning, and most casual fans buy to see who wins not to watch a great match.


----------



## MaybeLock

THANOS said:


> You're right they do not absolutely lead to payperview buys, but there is certainly a very strong correlation between the two. Let's look at that comparative example you gave for instance. The Rock/Cena had the higher ratings that year by far, with Taker/HHH coming in second, and going by your analysis, Rock/Cena was the main selling point. This was a clear example of ratings matching the payperview interest. I don't see how it's a stretch to use the same logic with Bryan/Evolution, especially with the monster ratings Bryan's segments were pulling in compared to the other acts, and the fact that nearly no one thought Lesnar was winning, and most casual fans buy to see who wins not to watch a great match.


Agree. We know streak matches are always a solid draw, but this time, they simply were not the main selling point of Wrestlemania. Mostly, because nobody expected something extraordinary out of the match, and the build was poor. Everybody expected 2 or 3 false finish, Taker pins Lesnar and 22-0. It would be different if people actually saw the streak ending coming, and probably we would be talking about greater buyrates, and we should be giving the streak the most credit. This wasn't the case though. 

Authority vs Bryan was the biggest draw in this Wrestlemania. I don't see how someone could doubt about that. Last Raw doing OK without Bryan was simply taking advantage of the momentum created by this very feud. We knew he wasn't going to be there, but that doesn't mean that his feud wasn't going to evolve.


----------



## kokepepsi

THANOS said:


> You're right they do not absolutely lead to payperview buys, *but there is certainly a very strong correlation between the two.* Let's look at that comparative example you gave for instance. The Rock/Cena had the higher ratings that year by far, with Taker/HHH coming in second, and going by your analysis, Rock/Cena was the main selling point. This was a clear example of ratings matching the payperview interest. I don't see how it's a stretch to use the same logic with Bryan/Evolution, especially with the monster ratings Bryan's segments were pulling in compared to the other acts, and the fact that nearly no one thought Lesnar was winning, and most casual fans buy to see who wins not to watch a great match.


Funny you say that
http://indeedwrestling.blogspot.com/2011/07/has-there-been-any-noticeable.html
Incase you didn't read it......there isn't a strong correlation

Meltzer always brings up WCW in the ratings=buys argument, in their top days they would do huge numbers on TV but would get shitty PPV numbers


----------



## THANOS

kokepepsi said:


> Funny you say that
> http://indeedwrestling.blogspot.com/2011/07/has-there-been-any-noticeable.html
> Incase you didn't read it......there isn't a strong correlation
> 
> Meltzer always brings up WCW in the ratings=buys argument, in their top days they would do huge numbers on TV but would get shitty PPV numbers


There's a reason for that. WCW used their payperviews for the sole purpose of generating ratings the next night on Nitro instead of the opposite. Their payperviews almost always had shitty "car crash" endings and lacklustre matches in hope that people would tune in the next night. WWE, for the most part, uses their tv time to sell their payperview like any normal company would do. WCW in its later years did the opposite. A company that uses their payperviews merely to sell an angle on Nitro, instead of as the culmination of storylines, will obviously show no correlation between the ratings and buyrates. Why would fans order a payperview if they know it won't culminate anything, and the true culminations won't occur until free tv the following week.


----------



## kokepepsi

I thought you were making the argument that high viewership leads to higher turnover for PPV buys.
The link posted shows that a statistical analysis of Raw tv ratings from 2006-2011 and PPV buys show no correlation between ratings and ppv buys. 

Point I am trying to make is there is a baseline amount of buys/ratings they will get because the WWE is a brand that people will watch/buy regardless of the card or booking.

This whole Bryan is responsible for all the buys/ratings and some one saying it was Rock/austin/hogan(FUCKINGLOL), taker/brock is just a bunch of marks talking shit.


----------



## #Mark

I'm honestly baffled you guys are trying to say the main selling point was Taker/Brock now that the show was a success. Bryan/HHH/Orton/Batista was clearly the main attraction for the show. There is absolutely no denying that. In hindsight, you can say the streak ending was the bigger story but going into the match it definitely wasn't hyped as the marquee match. Bryan/HHH/Orton/Batista segments usually opened the and closed the shows. The go home segment (the last image before Wrestlemania) was Bryan leading the YES chant after attacking HHH. There's no denying that the WWE put all of their marbles into that match. The crowds were clearly into it, the TV audience were definitely into it more than any other program, and the WWE clearly devoted the bulk of their TV time to that program. It main evented the damn show for gods sake. I can't believe you guys are so against giving Bryan credit even when it's obvious. His title chase against the Authority was the main program. Just like Rock/Cena was the past two years and HBK/Taker was for 26. There's no denying that.

Now, can you say there are external factors that influenced the buys? Absolutely. Bryan doesn't get full credit. I'm sure some people bought to see the Shield, others bought to see the battle royal, a good portion bought to see Taker/Lesnar and another significant portion bought to see Cena. But the main attraction was Bryan/HHH and there's no denying that.


----------



## THANOS

kokepepsi said:


> I thought you were making the argument that high viewership leads to higher turnover for PPV buys.
> The link posted shows that a statistical analysis of Raw tv ratings from 2006-2011 and PPV buys show no correlation between ratings and ppv buys.
> 
> Point I am trying to make is there is a baseline amount of buys/ratings they will get because the WWE is a brand that people will watch/buy regardless of the card or booking.
> 
> This whole Bryan is responsible for all the buys/ratings and some one saying it was Rock/austin/hogan(FUCKINGLOL), taker/brock is just a bunch of marks talking shit.


Yeah these are good points. That's the thing with ppv buys, and in this case subscriptions, they are extremely difficult to isolate to one specific storyline or act heading into it, unless there was a significant jump/pitfall from previous years. Ratings and merchandise are easy ways to link to a specific performer, but stuff like buyrates and live event attendance is much harder to determine. I would say though, that Bryan headlining a live event tour with Big Show and no other top stars (no cena, orton, batista, shield, or wyatts) and nearly selling it out is a pretty good sign. Wrestlemania's attendance is perhaps the most difficult ppv to completely give credit to a specific performer or storyline, because it goes on sale a year in advance and most tickets are purchased immediately, but most people don't "order" the payperview until they have an idea about the card. Having said that, I do think Bryan/Evolution has a big part in that for the reasons listed in this thread.


----------



## #Mark

Darkness is here said:


> #mark
> 
> crowd being behind bryan and ACTUALLY investing money in him are two different things.
> Ryder was also LOVED by the live crowds but it did'nt got the fans to invest money in him.
> 
> See bryan's house show records vs cena's, although the crowds was behind bryan, he STILL was'nt able to beat cena.
> 
> Now in cena vs bryan house show stats thread everyone is saving bryan's ass by saying how he is still not able to beat cena because he has just gotten his push a few months ago and here you are suddenly saying that now bryan is the reason wm did well?
> 
> It just shows the hypocricy and double standards of you bryan marks.
> 
> @pepsi: wwe says that not me.


Bryan's house shows are doing fine in comparison to Cena's and if you don't believe me just ask Meltzer. Some dude's blog isn't going to change that. Especially when he doesn't factor in the card and undervalues the market. Cena headlined shows are usually in large markets while Bryan's shows are usually in smaller markets. Cena's main event match is often against Orton (a major star in the company) or with the Shield against the Wyatts (two hot acts) while Bryan normally headlines against Kane. If you can't see the disparity there than I don't know what to tell you. The fact also remains that they've never had anyone as good as Cena when it comes to selling out house shows. That's Cena's biggest advantage. Ratings were fine when Cena was gone this past fall and the buyrates didn't dip at all. House shows are normally attended by Cena's biggest fanbase: children and parents. It's going to take more than a two week title reign for Bryan to surpass Cena as a house show draw. It's baffling that people would actually expect that this early.


----------



## Loader230

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Ratings do not equal buys. I'm not going to start a huge argument over this (or rather, I'm not going to continue it if someone replies to this), but comparing it to WM28, *Taker/Lesnar is the Rock/Cena*, and Bryan/HHH is Taker/HHH. One was the biggest match and the match more people would pay money to see, and the other is what attracted the most people on free TV (although it could've very well held it's own in buys without the big attraction match).
> 
> And I'm NOT saying Taker/Lesnar is as big as Rock/Cena, so don't start that shit.


LOL WHAT? No it wasn't. Brock is no John Cena and Taker is surely no Rock that could sell mania based on name value alone. Rock/Cena could because they are both mega stars. Taker vs Brock is just another streak and just as every other streak match in previous years, it needs a lot of backstory build to matter. This year they didn't even bother to do build it, absolutely no one believed Brock stood a chance going in. To claim this was the main selling point is just asinine. 

With mania cost reduced from $70 to 10 bucks, I'm not sure how good 1 million is, but regardless if this mania is considered a success or a failure for that matter, it all falls on Bryan/Authority. That was hottest and most anticipated angle going in. 

Between Rock, Austin and Hogan, Rock is the only true mega star capable of really moving business at this point based on a special appearance, and he wasn't even advertised.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

THANOS said:


> You're right they do not absolutely lead to payperview buys, but there is certainly a very strong correlation between the two. Let's look at that comparative example you gave for instance. *The Rock/Cena had the higher ratings that year by far, with Taker/HHH coming in second, and going by your analysis,* Rock/Cena was the main selling point. This was a clear example of ratings matching the payperview interest. I don't see how it's a stretch to use the same logic with Bryan/Evolution, especially with the monster ratings Bryan's segments were pulling in compared to the other acts, and the fact that nearly no one thought Lesnar was winning, and most casual fans buy to see who wins not to watch a great match.


I know I said I wouldn't respond... but just want to correct you on this. Taker/HHH had much higher ratings numbers than Rock/Cena in the build to WM28. If you need me to go through the effort of getting the numbers themselves as proof, I will, but I think you may be confusing the build up of WM28 with WM27 or something. 

Also reading through other posts, people are very much under-selling the appeal of Taker/Brock. However, I think someone mentioned, it's pointless in any event to speculate, yet here we are doing so. The Network changes everything, PPV buys themselves take a huge hit regardless, and it's not really possible to compare to previous Manias. WM30 had 400,000 (?) domestic buys, they're taking into account 667,000 (?) Network subscribers, that leads to over a million people watching... assuming all of those Network subscribers watched, and I'm certain a majority of them did. Plus when we get international numbers, and any late buys (potentially from BORK fans/old fans who are fans of Taker ordering the PPV after the event to see the monumental end of the streak), we're looking at potentially the most watched Mania ever. Honestly, if it gets that high, I'll give Bryan/The Authority plenty of credit as well supplementing the Taker/Lesnar attraction to such a degree that it may have been equal to it afterwards. No way Taker/Brock on their own gets something like 1.3 million buys/watches on it's own (neither does any other build/feud to Mania on it's own), so again, if it gets that high, Bryan/The Authority had to have contributed a substantial amount themselves.

At the end of the day, I think we can all agree that WM30 was a success due to these factors (in no specific order):

It being the 30th Wrestlemania, a big number in itself
Launch of the WWE network/the amount of people who could watch on that
Taker/Brock
Bryan's title chase
Hogan being the guest host

Hopefully, we can all agree on that at the very least, even if we have our own ideas of what goes in what order.


----------



## kokepepsi

I would say the fact that it was WM+the launch resulted in 700k-800k out of the 1million views
Bryan+Authorityangle(HHH/Batista/Orton) added 100kish+
Taker/Brock adds 50k and that is being very generous
Cena/Wyatt 10k
Hogan is hard since TNA may have hurt him but its hogan I might say 5kish I dunno
Extra buys I dunno

Just estimating


----------



## Darkness is here

#Mark said:


> Bryan's house shows are doing fine in comparison to Cena's and if you don't believe me just ask Meltzer. Some dude's blog isn't going to change that. Especially when he doesn't factor in the card and undervalues the market. Cena headlined shows are usually in large markets while Bryan's shows are usually in smaller markets. Cena's main event match is often against Orton (a major star in the company) or with the Shield against the Wyatts (two hot acts) while Bryan normally headlines against Kane. If you can't see the disparity there than I don't know what to tell you. The fact also remains that they've never had anyone as good as Cena when it comes to selling out house shows. That's Cena's biggest advantage. Ratings were fine when Cena was gone this past fall and the buyrates didn't dip at all. House shows are normally attended by Cena's biggest fanbase: children and parents. *It's going to take more than a two week title reign for Bryan to surpass Cena as a house show draw. It's baffling that people would actually expect that this early*.


so......you do accept bryan is not a big draw, so how can you give him the makority of credit?

The credit is shared on this wm because the outstanding starpower it had.

Rock/hogan/austin/cena (even though he was in a midcard match but all of his fans would still follow,so alot of credit goes to him like the 3 previous wm's).

Then streak is always a draw, brock draw alot of fans as well, orton, batista, hhh, have got their fans and are big draws on big ppvs.

So saying bryan deserves majority of credit is just plain and siple STUPID AND BLIND LOVE FOR HIM.

@ pepsi
that is what I was saying.

Atleast 70% ppl would've bought the network just because:
1. To get classic content.
2. It's cheap and saves them alot of money.

So that's 500 buys already, then cena with his fanbase would easily bring 200k, bryan/evo would've brought 200k easily then you've got the streak which would've gotten the reast of buys easily.


----------



## #Mark

#BadNewsSanta said:


> I know I said I wouldn't respond... but just want to correct you on this. Taker/HHH had much higher ratings numbers than Rock/Cena in the build to WM28. If you need me to go through the effort of getting the numbers themselves as proof, I will, but I think you may be confusing the build up of WM28 with WM27 or something.
> 
> Also reading through other posts, people are very much under-selling the appeal of Taker/Brock. However, I think someone mentioned, it's pointless in any event to speculate, yet here we are doing so. The Network changes everything, PPV buys themselves take a huge hit regardless, and it's not really possible to compare to previous Manias. WM30 had 400,000 (?) domestic buys, they're taking into account 667,000 (?) Network subscribers, that leads to over a million people watching... assuming all of those Network subscribers watched, and I'm certain a majority of them did. Plus when we get international numbers, and any late buys (potentially from BORK fans/old fans who are fans of Taker ordering the PPV after the event to see the monumental end of the streak), we're looking at potentially the most watched Mania ever. Honestly, if it gets that high, I'll give Bryan/The Authority plenty of credit as well supplementing the Taker/Lesnar attraction to such a degree that it may have been equal to it afterwards. No way Taker/Brock on their own gets something like 1.3 million buys/watches on it's own (neither does any other build/feud to Mania on it's own), so again, if it gets that high, Bryan/The Authority had to have contributed a substantial amount themselves.
> 
> At the end of the day, I think we can all agree that WM30 was a success due to these factors (in no specific order):
> 
> It being the 30th Wrestlemania, a big number in itself
> Launch of the WWE network/the amount of people who could watch on that
> Taker/Brock
> Bryan's title chase
> Hogan being the guest host
> 
> Hopefully, we can all agree on that at the very least, even if we have our own ideas of what goes in what order.


I really think this is all hindsight man. You're overvaluing the Brock/Taker build. Obviously coming out of Mania the streak ending was the biggest topic but the match definitely wasn't the most anticipated. Brock/Taker was not as heavily promoted or hyped as the last few Taker streak matches. The build was very lazy and the match was not treated as a marquee match.The only drawing power it had was the fact that it was Taker at WM. It definitely didn't have the story or feel that Taker/HBK, Taker/HHH, or even Taker/Punk had. Obviously, one can argue that Brock is a bigger PPV draw than all of them but he's been damaged goods over the last year and a half as evidence by the fact that he really hasn't moved the needle since Summerslam 2012. His drawing power has diminished significantly which is why I think WWE decided to let him end the streak. 

The headlining match was Bryan/Evolution. The comparison between Taker/HHH and Bryan/Evolution doesn't really make sense because unlike Taker/HHH, Bryan/Evolution was the main event and was treated as such. During the RTWM Bryan/Evolution usually opened the show with a segment and closed the show. It was clearly treated as the top program while Brock/Taker was in the 9pm or 10pm slot. Just like in 2012 with Rock/Cena. Rock/Cena usually opened and closed the show while Taker/HHH was in the 10pm hour.




Darkness is here said:


> so......you do accept bryan is not a big draw, so how can you give him the makority of credit?
> 
> The credit is shared on this wm because the outstanding starpower it had.
> 
> Rock/hogan/austin/cena (even though he was in a midcard match but all of his fans would still follow,so alot of credit goes to him like the 3 previous wm's).
> 
> Then streak is always a draw, brock draw alot of fans as well, orton, batista, hhh, have got their fans and are big draws on big ppvs.
> 
> So saying bryan deserves majority of credit is just plain and siple STUPID AND BLIND LOVE FOR HIM.
> 
> @ pepsi
> that is what I was saying.
> 
> Atleast 70% ppl would've bought the network just because:
> 1. To get classic content.
> 2. It's cheap and saves them alot of money.
> 
> So that's 500 buys already, then cena with his fanbase would easily bring 200k, bryan/evo would've brought 200k easily then you've got the
> streak which would've gotten the reast of buys easily.


:ti

Three guys in an impromptu ten minute promo segment deserve the credit but the guy in the opening and closing match doesn't.


----------



## Darkness is here

Those three guys are the biggest draw of all time and one of them gave us 3wm's with million buys.
And as far as bryan me is concerned, do you think just because benoit me wmxx the 900,000 so buys were because of him?
Or was the success of wm18 because of hhh/y2j?


----------



## Starbuck

These last few pages tho.

:banderas


----------



## MaybeLock

Darkness is here said:


> Those three guys are the biggest draw of all time and one of them gave us 3wm's with million buys.
> And as far as bryan me is concerned, do you think just because benoit me wmxx the 900,000 so buys were because of him?
> Or was the success of wm18 because of hhh/y2j?


Rock was not announced, he was a surprise. What don't you understand from that? fpalm


----------



## Darkness is here

I do remember reading it that he was returning(maybe it was a reported rumor) along with austin.


----------



## Londrick

Darkness is here? More like Markness is here. am i rite?


----------



## validreasoning

wrestlemania 30 was built around bryans quest to become champion, so if the show does well then bryan is the main reason. hhh deserves great credit too because he was fantastic foe for bryan in the weeks leading into the event but bryan is the main protagonist in this story and everything and everyone else were only playing supporting roles. 

vince placed so much faith in a 5'7 190lb guy that he built the most important wrestlemania since the first one in 1985 around him. if you want to give credit to the rock/hogan/austin for the success of this show go right ahead, in fact go tweet austin now and see what his reply would be...


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I'm not on the "Bryan is the reason Mania was successful" train, but he absolutely was more so than Hogan/Rock/Austin. Maybe if all three of them had been advertised to be in a segment together at least a week in advance, it MIGHT be a different story (and even then, if it's not in a wrestling capacity, I don't think many would order/watch a PPV for one segment), but only Hogan was advertised, I don't remember Austin or Rock's being so (Austin I did know about though due to seeing a video a day or so before the show).


----------



## THANOS

#BadNewsSanta said:


> I'm not on the "Bryan is the reason Mania was successful" train, but he absolutely was more so than Hogan/Rock/Austin. Maybe if all three of them had been advertised to be in a segment together at least a week in advance, it MIGHT be a different story (and even then, if it's not in a wrestling capacity, I don't think many would order/watch a PPV for one segment), but only Hogan was advertised, I don't remember Austin or Rock's being so (Austin I did know about though due to seeing a video a day or so before the show).


Austin was advertised a couple days before Mania on wwe.com, that's it, so "of course"  he deserves credit for people ordering the card. :ti


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

THANOS said:


> Austin was advertised a couple days before Mania on wwe.com, that's it, so of course he deserves credit for people ordering the card. :ti


Assuming Austin is a huge draw, which he isn't. Daniel Bryan most likely drew it, as Austin has failed to draw huge in the last few years on RAW, Rock however drew huge the last two wrestlemanias, add that with the biggest draw of all time being Hulk Hogan coming back to Wrestlemania, we have either Rock, Hogan, Cena(Assuming he's still a draw) or Bryan.



JC00 said:


> *I see he hasn't responded to this*. Surprised he didn't comeback with "post your source link". Must be because he can't post source links to any of the stuff he is claiming. And no, claiming Vince Russo said it is not a source.


Actually I did, http://www.wrestlingforum.com/raw/973441-all-tv-ratings-talk-here-468.html#post32950793


----------



## Diezffects

validreasoning said:


> wrestlemania 30 was built around bryans quest to become champion, so if the show does well then bryan is the main reason. hhh deserves great credit too because he was fantastic foe for bryan in the weeks leading into the event but bryan is the main protagonist in this story and everything and everyone else were only playing supporting roles.
> 
> *vince placed so much faith in a 5'7 190lb guy* that he built the most important wrestlemania since the first one in 1985 around him. if you want to give credit to the rock/hogan/austin for the success of this show go right ahead, in fact go tweet austin now and see what his reply would be...


More like he placed all his faith on Hunter to make this work, and he did. I don't want to discredit Bryan but I think lot of you are over valuing his part in this. WWE Network subscriptions have nothing to do with Bryan. Any over babyface could have been placed in this authority angle and did just as well because the heels are absolute biggest and hottest you can get in this era. Before Punk walked out, he was supposed to take on Authority, and from what I understand he was drawing huge ratings in 2013 well before Bryan. Considering all of that, and the fact that Mania just had to draw 400K traditional buys, 70% of which it usually draws due to the name value anyway, I see no reason why Authority vs Punk couldn't have drawn just the same or even bigger, as Authority vs Bryan along with Taker/Brock as supporting special match. Ultimately I believe Authority angle was the biggest factor going in wrestlemania. If this was say, Bryan vs Orton, or even Bryan vs Batista without the authority angle, this would've been nothing more than a throwaway match/feud, Taker/Brock would've overshadowed it completely and possibly even main evented considering the streak ending was monumental.

Wrestlemania was a success but not in some huge way, 667k Subcribers + 400k traditional buys with the cost lowered so much, is an average figure. Bryan appeared super hot going in, crowds going nuts, YES chants everywhere and Mania draws just 400k buys. Its like always the same with this guy, he gets all the great reactions but can't draw well. Maybe its just that the crowds love to chant for all underdogs in this era, but they won't open their wallets for them. Dave Meltzer predicted 750K traditional buys btw. As someone already noted previously, if this mania goes beyond the average mark, 1.4 - 1.5m atleast, you can credit Bryan because he appeared to be the hottest going in and we can assume he was responsible for the extra buys, but we're staring at an average figure which CM Punk, put in Bryan's place, could've drawn as well. Until that happens, crediting everything to Bryan is bullshit. 

As for Austin, I don't think he matters all that much in a special appearance role, same as Hogan in 2014. How many times have we seen him do this special appearance shtick on RAWs, on PPVs, at wrestlemanias? fans by this point know very well that it doesn't mean anything or add anything significant to PPV. Also the fact his stardom itself has gone down significantly over the years, I don't think he can be credited at all in my opinion.


----------



## validreasoning

Diezffects said:


> More like he placed all his faith on Hunter to make this work, and he did.


if he placed all his faith in hunter then hunter wouldn't have been in the opening match and barely seen again. if vince really only believed hunter could pull this off then he would have been beating bryan OR the mainevent would have become a four-way..

giving hhh all the credit for mania 30 is like giving apollo creed all the credit in the first rocky movie...



> Any over babyface could have been placed in this authority angle and did just as well because the heels are absolute biggest and hottest you can get in this era. Before Punk walked out, he was supposed to take on Authority, and from what I understand he was drawing huge ratings in 2013 well before Bryan.


had they gone with hhh and punk this mania would have been a disaster both in-ring and financially. there was no reason why punk and hunter should be feuding and punks in-ring work since last summer has been poor because the man is hurt bad. 

people got behind bryan because it was 9 months of him being held down. NOBODY else works in that spot, not punk, not cena, certainly not sheamus or mysterio and we saw at survivor series not big show.



> If this was say, Bryan vs Orton, or even Bryan vs Batista without the authority angle, this would've been nothing more than a throwaway match/feud, Taker/Brock would've overshadowed it completely and possibly even main evented considering the streak ending was monumental.


obviously, the heat was bryan and hhh not orton and bryan whom bryan had wrestled a million times since last july. just like austin needed a strong foe in 1998 ie vince and wouldn't have been as successful without him...austin vs foley or austin vs kane isn't drawing anywhere near as well if vince was still a commentator saying "what a maneuver" and not the main heel




> Wrestlemania was a success but not in some huge way, 667k Subcribers + 400k traditional buys with the cost lowered so much, is an average figure.


you do realise that 400k buys number is usa ONLY right? mania 26 without the show being available through other means for $10 drew 495,000 buys in the USA, Canada, Mexico and Puerto Rico COMBINED.



> Dave Meltzer predicted 750K traditional buys btw. As someone already noted previously, if this mania goes beyond the average mark, 1.4 - 1.5m atleast, you can credit Bryan because he appeared to be the hottest going in and we can assume he was responsible for the extra buys, but we're staring at an average figure which CM Punk, put in Bryan's place, could've drawn as well. Until that happens, crediting everything to Bryan is bullshit.


care to show me where meltzer predicted that? is that domestic, usa, worldwide prediction? 

meltzer just the other day said WWE themselves had budgeted mania to do 250,000 domestic in total (again usa/canada/mexico, PR) and the show has done 400k in usa alone so well above what they expected...


----------



## swagger_ROCKS

Starbuck said:


> These last few pages tho.
> 
> :banderas


Still waiting on a breakdown. 

:talk


----------



## Sonnen Says

WorldWrestlingFed said:


> *Assuming Austin is a huge draw, which he isn't.* Daniel Bryan most likely drew it, *as Austin has failed to draw huge in the last few years on RAW*, Rock however drew huge the last two wrestlemanias, add that with the biggest draw of all time being Hulk Hogan coming back to Wrestlemania, we have either Rock, Hogan, Cena(Assuming he's still a draw) or Bryan.
> 
> 
> 
> Actually I did, http://www.wrestlingforum.com/raw/973441-all-tv-ratings-talk-here-468.html#post32950793


:faint:


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

After crunching 6 inches of ratings and 10 mouthfuls of buyrates, I have concluded that the Rock is the only draw in the history of Sports Entertainment.


----------



## Diezffects

validreasoning said:


> if he placed all his faith in hunter then hunter wouldn't have been in the opening match and barely seen again. if vince really only believed hunter could pull this off then he would have been beating bryan OR the mainevent would have become a four-way..
> 
> giving hhh all the credit for mania 30 is like giving apollo creed all the credit in the first rocky movie...


You don't get it. Vince trusted Hunter with this angle completely to make this work. Triple H opening the show and putting Bryan over was his own decision, not Vince. He could've gone over Bryan or turned the ME into four way if he chose to. He put over Bryan because Bryan was on a momentum and the fact Hunter is backstage guy right now, he can't be the champion and headline RAWs, SDs or house shows. I'm not giving HHH all the credit, but the fact that authority angle was the biggest factor going in this mania. Bryan may have been the bullet but Triple H was the gun propelling him with all the momentum.





> had they gone with hhh and punk this mania would have been a disaster both in-ring and financially. there was no reason why punk and hunter should be feuding and punks in-ring work since last summer has been poor because the man is hurt bad.


Bullshit. In-ring work means shit in the grand scheme of things, what we're talking about is whether mania draws or not. Punk was more of a anti-establishment character than Bryan ever will, they story was already built up. To say they had no reason to face each other is just dumb. Authority/punk would have drawn just as well if not bigger. 



> people got behind bryan because it was 9 months of him being held down. NOBODY else works in that spot, not punk, not cena, certainly not sheamus or mysterio and we saw at survivor series not big show.


As I mentioned, Punk excels as a anti-authority character. He would've been a perfect fit and the promos no doubt, would've been ten times more intense. Neither Cena nor Sheamus are anti-authority, and they are both seen as part of the establishment by fans due to their main event push these few years. Mysterio? lol why even bring him up. He's not getting main event angles for any PPV, let alone wrestlemania.



> obviously, the heat was bryan and hhh not orton and bryan whom bryan had wrestled a million times since last july. just like austin needed a strong foe in 1998 ie vince and wouldn't have been as successful without him...austin vs foley or austin vs kane isn't drawing anywhere near as well if vince was still a commentator saying "what a maneuver" and not the main heel


Bryan is not Austin and HHH isn't Vince. You're comparing two different things. In 1998, you couldn't replace Austin out of his spot, no matter what you tried. He was THE GUY, without his success in the main event, WWE wouldn't even be successful right now. With Bryan, Punk would've been easy, almost too perfect replacement and nothing would've changed. Mania would've drawn just as good. 




> you do realise that 400k buys number is usa ONLY right? mania 26 without the show being available through other means for $10 drew 495,000 buys in the USA, Canada, Mexico and Puerto Rico COMBINED.


WWE said its domestic, it probably does include Puerto Rico, Canada and Mexico. i don't remember 400K being announced as north american only. Mania 26 was a big failure, comparing with that is pointless. 500K domestic is typical baseline for Mania. Even if we consider network subscriptions which were well below WWE's expected figure, 400K traditional buys is just average, not a huge success. 



> care to show me where meltzer predicted that? is that domestic, usa, worldwide prediction?


In his newsletter, a week before the subscriptions number came out. He said 750K traditional buys was his prediction. I don't know what it was based on but that was his prediction. 



> meltzer just the other day said WWE themselves had budgeted mania to do 250,000 domestic in total (again usa/canada/mexico, PR) and the show has done 400k in usa alone so well above what they expected...


I doubt if this number is true. Last three years Mania has drawn 650+ domestic, why would they budget such a low figure even if we include WWE network. Also the fact they already knew the 667K subscribers figure, which was well below what they expected to reach, wouldn't that mean they would expect Mania to do in the 400K range, atleast? I still don't see this as some mega-successful mania, it's average in my opinion and certainly not crediting everything to Bryan.


----------



## Happenstan

Diezffects said:


> In his newsletter, a week before the subscriptions number came out. He said 750K traditional buys was his prediction. I don't know what it was based on but that was his prediction.


You're mistaken here. Meltzer predicted 750K people to buy the WWE Network from Feb-WM30 for it to be considered a huge success not purchase WM30 alone.


----------



## #Mark

:lmao

Dave said the number was great and that he (along with WWE) were not expecting anything over 200k traditional buys. Stop talking out of your ass.


----------



## Uerfer

Got this off another forum, Meltzer on Wrestlemania buys - 



> The WWE made the announcement that WrestleMania is estimated at doing nearly 400,000 domestic PPV buys, and claiming that a record 1 million U.S. households watched the show.
> 
> With the network, it should have been a lock that more U.S. homes would watch the show than any previous show.
> 
> The first thing that should be noted is that “nearly 400,000" number in the sense WWE’s original announcements have traditionally been optimistic. The last two years’ first announcements at this point in time were 1.3 million and 1.2 million, because PPV buy estimates are an inexact science. This is not the idea of making up numbers, because it’s a public company, and I believe the estimates were what they expected to end up with when they made them. As silly as this sounds in 2014, even the best estimates, weeks after the show, can be off by quite a bit when you already have actual numbers in hand. The actual final numbers were 1,219,000 and 1,104,000 worldwide respectively. That’s not to say this year’s eventual number will be higher or lower than the first announcement, just the past two years have ended up each being nearly 100,000 lower.
> 
> Still, the PPV number is great as the WWE had budgeted approximately 295,000 buys between the U.S. and Canada on PPV.
> The idea that the 667,000 network subscribers and “nearly 400,000" domestic breaks one million isn’t necessarily the case. It’s virtually impossible it is the case, because of overlapping and also questions as to how many network subscribers are really from the U.S.
> 
> WWE pushed that more homes saw WrestleMania in the U.S. than any time in history. That should have been the case with the low price and new technology. There’s also a better than even chance it’s not true, based on how many of those 667,287 network subscribers aren’t from the U.S., as well as the percentage of network subscribers who ordered the show on traditional PPV because of all the streaming problems the network had up to that point in time.
> 
> According to those in WWE, the “nearly 400,000" domestic figure does not include Canada, meaning just as the show didn’t do what the company estimated as far as network buys. With a projection of 295,000 PPV buys between U.S. and Canada on PPV, that would really only figure to be 235,000 or so in the U.S., since one would expect 60,000 of the buys from Canada if one assumes Canadians for the most part don’t get the network (which could be a faulty assumption).
> 
> But if you assume a lot of Canadians did get the network, that would also assume as well as U.K. residents did, and a strong number of other foreign residents did, the 667,000 number is not a U.S. number. And for sure it’s not. Our own polling indicated 63 percent of the network subscribers were from the U.S. (420,000). I believe that is faulty on the low side, but with no evidence of that past a hunch. But it does indicate the U.S. subscribers are also probably not even near 667,000. There are also people who subscribe to the network that didn’t watch Mania either live, later, or on PPV. I know of many people who ordered the network for the historical content that no longer watch the product, and didn’t watch Mania. Our own polling indicated just under 70 percent of those in the U.S. with the network watched WrestleMania live, with 13 percent not having watched it yet, 11 percent watching it on PPV instead and six percent watching it after the fact.
> 
> If anything, we would be skewed significantly on the high side there, not the low side. So that would indicate WrestleMania viewers both live and delayed on the network at 447,000 total, and again, you have to figure what the legitimate percentage of those viewing the network from outside the U.S. is. Given our polling, it comes to 282,000, but again, I think that’s a low figure, but the real figure would be between those numbers. But no matter which of the two figures (282,000 and 447,000) is closer to the mark, the number is far lower than anyone could have expected, just as the PPV number is far higher.
> 
> The combined figure would be more than last year’s Mania in the U.S. even under a worst case scenario, but is likely in the ballpark of the 2012 Mania for total U.S. viewership and is probably below the 1989, 2001 and 2007 versions. If you throw in closed-circuit viewers, it would be behind 1987 as well. By all rights, it should have been the most-watched WrestleMania ever in the U.S. Given a best case scenario on numbers, it probably wasn’t.
> 
> Just being on the safe side given the overestimates in years past and saying the nearly 400,000 turns out to be 350,000, that’s 58 percent of last year in the U.S. and probably 62 percent in North America of what the show did in comparison to last year had everything been equal in interest. And most would have expected, even up, for this year’s show to do worse overall than last year if it was a stand-alone PPV. So the network cannibalization this early of PPV, while significant, is not as much as would have been expected or even projected from a WWE standpoint. That also would make the “break-even” for the network roughly 50,000 subscribers per month lower than original estimates.
> 
> However, that number could change drastically if PPV is dropped by the regular carriers over the rest of the year.
> The key thing to take out of all this is that reports of the demise of PPV are even more greatly exaggerated than beforehand, far more than WWE internally estimated and speaks that a major event pricing is very much price inelastic. All history has shown this, from periods of greatly raising ticket prices to wrestling and other major sports and then comparing live attendance numbers with lower pricing vs. higher pricing and generally there is little or no difference, and looking at price increases on PPVs and buy figures before and after.
> 
> Given the choice of spending $70 for WrestleMania, or spending $60 to get Mania, five other PPV shows and access to 1,300 plus hours of content on a network, somewhere between 58 (at 350,000) and 67 percent (at 400,000) of Americans who last year bought Mania still chose to still buy the PPV. That makes no sense, but it tells quite the story about people not embracing new technology. This may be a sign that there is more growth potential down the line with the network, or that hundreds of thousands of WWE fans don’t care about network content, or PPVs, but will still buy WrestleMania every year.
> 
> The question becomes whether it’s worth it to UFC or boxing to go for the cheaper price and volume vs. higher price and lower volume. The answer, right now, is that it’s clearly not the time to consider the move. Even with adding a $10 bottom price to the $60 to $70 figure from one year ago, the homes went from about 600,000 U.S. last year to a minimum of 632,000 to a maximum of 847,000 this year. I would have predicted with a $10 bottom that WrestleMania was going to easily top 1 million homes this year, so my thoughts on the mass viewer gains from price cutting were greatly inflated. That may not be the answer two years from now and it is still very possible it is more cost effective for the smaller PPV shows, but all evidence on the big shows is strongly in the other camp.
> 
> But it also indicates lowering the price for a PPV is not going to greatly increase viewers. From a UFC standpoint, the idea of offering a $35 price for a PPV instead of $55 as a bonus for those who order the network, keeping a higher company price margin, may be the way to go, but even then, I see it as more switching viewers from PPV to the network, and there would be very little addition of new viewers at $35 that didn’t buy at $55. That way, you get the best of both worlds. The one thing WrestleMania has shown is most people are willing to spend the high price, and such a high price point is not a factor if it’s a show they want to see. You incentivize network purchasers and value by giving you a substantial PPV price break, while not costing you anything in the way of money, and at the same time, don’t make the WWE mistake of undercutting the value of the big shows and underpricing them.
> 
> The news led to a stock rebound on 4/15, as it closed at $20.75 per share (opening at $19.99 per share) giving the company a closing marketing capitalization of $1.56 billion, which is still way down from the inflated number just before WrestleMania and the network announcement number.
> 
> It also could be that people who ordered the network purchased the show on PPV. I fit into that category and know a lot of people who did, based on having a lot of people over and not trusting the stream. Estimates have that figure at around 11 percent (50,000 to 80,000 depending on how many actual U.S. buys there are for the network). But that leaves 270,000 to 350,000 homes in the U.S. who turned down purchasing the network and purchased WrestleMania at full price.
> 
> Going forward, I would expect far less double dipping, and that figure should be closer to zero within a year. So the PPV drop from last year should be well above 38 percent going forward, and WWE has budgeted the PPV revenue to be cut in half for shows in 2015 as compared to 2014. The company had gone in budgeting the PPV drop for this year as being 53 percent in North America going forward, so nobody expects things to hold up at this level.
> 
> With Canadian buys in theory staying even, a B show with 100,000 domestic buys from last year would be expected to maintain about 10,000 Canadian, but if the Mania numbers holds up, could maintain 52,000 in the U.S., or about 62 percent of what it did last year. That probably won’t be the case because the number of people with the network ordering the show separately on PPV would figure to drop going forward on a percentage basis, because it’s not Mania, and the system held up.
> 
> That’s way above what the company budgeted. But they also budgeted based on 1 million network homes for an average month this year (not the 1 million by the end of the year figure they had announced), so in that sense, here is how the figures should work from the U.S. for Mania.
> 
> At 350,000 U.S. buys going with the average of $33 per head, that’s $11.55 million. At 667,287 network subscribers at $8.50 per head, that’s $5.67 million or $17.22 million total. At 600,000 U.S. viewers on PPV buys, with no network, at $33 a head, that’s $19.80 million in company revenue with considerably less expenses. However, the $2.6 million that Mania is down is far less than the amount every other month will be up. But there’s also the cost of the network itself, so a true evaluation, the actual profit margin for the show itself will be way down from the prior year.
> 
> A true evaluation of all this can’t be made until late in the year, when we factor in PPV declines, DVD declines, and real revenues and costs of the network. But a lot more answers will come in late May, when WWE releases an actual domestic and international number. If the international PPV buy numbers remain consistent with last year, then that means there probably weren’t a ton of international buyers in that 667,287 figure. If the number of international buys is significantly less than 420,000 for Mania, that would indicate a very significant number of the current network subscriptions are from outside North America. A lot of how good, or not good, that network number really is, will be a lot more easy to analyze in five to six weeks, but any real analysis really should be made closer to the end of the year when we see the DVD sales numbers for the Mania and other shows.
> 
> But in late May, we’ll have a lot more of a clue clues as to how well WrestleMania really did, the levels of international vs. domestic that 667,287 figure really is, and what that means for how much growth to expect next year, and the overall viability of high cost PPV vs. low cost network packaging.






Happenstan said:


> You're mistaken here. Meltzer predicted 750K people to buy the WWE Network from Feb-WM30 for it to be considered a huge success not purchase WM30 alone.


No he is right, Metlzer did say 750,000 as prediction for traditional buys, but the number is also including international buys added with domestic buys.


----------



## Happenstan

Uerfer said:


> No he is right, Metlzer did say 750,000 as prediction for traditional buys, but the number is also including international buys added with domestic buys.


Weird cause I remember listening to Wrestling Observer Radio the day of or the day after the Network's numbers were announced and he said on there that he had predicted 750K for Network buys. Anyway, whatevs. Good job with the above.


----------



## Uerfer

His prediction for Network subscriptions was 850,000.


----------



## #Mark

Anyone know when the international number will be released?


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

Wrestlemania 30 is now the biggest domestic draw in wrestling history(correct me if I'm wrong), with around 1 million domestic buys, wow. I wonder how much they made worldwide.



Diezffects said:


> Bullshit. In-ring work means shit in the grand scheme of things, what we're talking about is whether mania draws or not. *Punk was more of a anti-establishment character than Bryan ever will*, they story was already built up. To say they had no reason to face each other is just dumb. Authority/punk would have drawn just as well if not bigger.


His character was actually a phony, 

Did the Punk character ever have the balls to Occupy Raw like Daniel Bryan did?

No.

Did CM Punk ever follow up with his promise of change?

No, WWE remained almost the same in 2012 after his 2011 promises, No Ice Cream bars, Same product, No compelling storylines such as the present Authority storyline with Daniel Bryan.

the anti-authority gimmick ended in 2011 after Cm Punk failed to do what he said he was going to do, his pipebombs were the ones you find in GI Joes at Toys R Us, they were fake. 

Bring change to the WWE? Punk didn't cause it, just look at the year 2012, Daniel Bryan and The Shield brought change in 2013. 

Did Punk Put over anyone? Never happened, Ryback never went over Punk, the Ryback/Axel/Heyman feud failed, beat the entire Shield at once in a handicap match and almost brought them down.

Punk called himself the best in the world despite losing cleanly to the likes of The Undertaker, Rock, and Cena. his character was the embodiment of all talk, no substance, an insult to intelligence.

Daniel Bryan however brought change, Unlike Punk he beat Cena clean(No distractions), 

Daniel Bryan had pops that Punk never had in his life, 

People wanted to see Daniel Bryan win the Royal Rumble this year, not Cm Punk, 

People wanted Daniel Bryan to be WWE champion, not Cm Punk.

Daniel Bryan was the draw, the CM Punk thing from 2011 was nothing more than an experiment that failed to change or improve the product, The Shield and the Daniel Bryan/Authority angles brought change to WWE and led us to where we are now, even John Cena helped by lowering himself down the card, and putting over Daniel Bryan cleanly.

What did Punk do? Have failed angles with Ryback/Axel and Heyman, beat the Shield in a handicap match, never brought the change that said he would in 2011, never drew as much as Daniel Bryan has lately and never got a pop at big as Daniel Bryan's Yes chant.

Daniel Bryan is more of anti-abuse/anti-oppression character than Punk ever was, unlike Punk, Daniel Bryan drew and changed something, Daniel Bryan displayed more anti-abuse/oppression in his Occupy Raw segment alone than Cm Punk ever has.


----------



## funnyfaces1

It's still real to WorldWrestlingFed, dammit unk


----------



## Starbuck

WorldWrestlingFed said:


> Wrestlemania 30 is now the biggest domestic draw in wrestling history(correct me if I'm wrong), with around 1 million domestic buys, wow. I wonder how much they made worldwide.
> 
> 
> 
> His character was actually a phony,
> 
> Did the Punk character ever have the balls to Occupy Raw like Daniel Bryan did?
> 
> No.
> 
> Did CM Punk ever follow up with his promise of change?
> 
> No, WWE remained almost the same in 2012 after his 2011 promises, No Ice Cream bars, Same product, No compelling storylines such as the present Authority storyline with Daniel Bryan.
> 
> the anti-authority gimmick ended in 2011 after Cm Punk failed to do what he said he was going to do, his pipebombs were the ones you find in GI Joes at Toys R Us, they were fake.
> 
> Bring change to the WWE? Punk didn't cause it, just look at the year 2012, Daniel Bryan and The Shield brought change in 2013.
> 
> Did Punk Put over anyone? Never happened, Ryback never went over Punk, the Ryback/Axel/Heyman feud failed, beat the entire Shield at once in a handicap match and almost brought them down.
> 
> Punk called himself the best in the world despite losing cleanly to the likes of The Undertaker, Rock, and Cena. his character was the embodiment of all talk, no substance, an insult to intelligence.
> 
> Daniel Bryan however brought change, Unlike Punk he beat Cena clean(No distractions),
> 
> Daniel Bryan had pops that Punk never had in his life,
> 
> People wanted to see Daniel Bryan win the Royal Rumble this year, not Cm Punk,
> 
> People wanted Daniel Bryan to be WWE champion, not Cm Punk.
> 
> Daniel Bryan was the draw, the CM Punk thing from 2011 was nothing more than an experiment that failed to change or improve the product, The Shield and the Daniel Bryan/Authority angles brought change to WWE and led us to where we are now, even John Cena helped by lowering himself down the card, and putting over Daniel Bryan cleanly.
> 
> What did Punk do? Have failed angles with Ryback/Axel and Heyman, beat the Shield in a handicap match, never brought the change that said he would in 2011, never drew as much as Daniel Bryan has lately and never got a pop at big as Daniel Bryan's Yes chant.
> 
> Daniel Bryan is more of anti-abuse/anti-oppression character than Punk ever was, unlike Punk, Daniel Bryan drew and changed something, Daniel Bryan displayed more anti-abuse/oppression in his Occupy Raw segment alone than Cm Punk ever has.


SHOTS FIRED IN THE CHICAGO AREA. THEY COULD BE FATAL. 

unk


----------



## Uerfer

WorldWrestlingFed said:


> His character was actually a phony,
> 
> Did the Punk character ever have the balls to Occupy Raw like Daniel Bryan did?
> 
> No.
> 
> Did CM Punk ever follow up with his promise of change?
> 
> No, WWE remained almost the same in 2012 after his 2011 promises, No Ice Cream bars, Same product, No compelling storylines such as the present Authority storyline with Daniel Bryan.
> 
> the anti-authority gimmick ended in 2011 after Cm Punk failed to do what he said he was going to do, his pipebombs were the ones you find in GI Joes at Toys R Us, they were fake.
> 
> Bring change to the WWE? Punk didn't cause it, just look at the year 2012, Daniel Bryan and The Shield brought change in 2013.
> 
> Did Punk Put over anyone? Never happened, Ryback never went over Punk, the Ryback/Axel/Heyman feud failed, beat the entire Shield at once in a handicap match and almost brought them down.
> 
> Punk called himself the best in the world despite losing cleanly to the likes of The Undertaker, Rock, and Cena. his character was the embodiment of all talk, no substance, an insult to intelligence.
> 
> Daniel Bryan however brought change, Unlike Punk he beat Cena clean(No distractions),
> 
> Daniel Bryan had pops that Punk never had in his life,
> 
> People wanted to see Daniel Bryan win the Royal Rumble this year, not Cm Punk,
> 
> People wanted Daniel Bryan to be WWE champion, not Cm Punk.
> 
> Daniel Bryan was the draw, the CM Punk thing from 2011 was nothing more than an experiment that failed to change or improve the product, The Shield and the Daniel Bryan/Authority angles brought change to WWE and led us to where we are now, even John Cena helped by lowering himself down the card, and putting over Daniel Bryan cleanly.
> 
> What did Punk do? Have failed angles with Ryback/Axel and Heyman, beat the Shield in a handicap match, never brought the change that said he would in 2011, never drew as much as Daniel Bryan has lately and never got a pop at big as Daniel Bryan's Yes chant.
> 
> Daniel Bryan is more of anti-abuse/anti-oppression character than Punk ever was, unlike Punk, Daniel Bryan drew and changed something, Daniel Bryan displayed more anti-abuse/oppression in his Occupy Raw segment alone than Cm Punk ever has.


Damn. Punk :buried :clap :clap :clap


----------



## Starbuck

Just to weigh in on this whole thing, I think it's hard to call but when you look at where the interest was, you have to go with Bryan/Authority over anything else. The simple fact is, this Mania didn't have a HUGE dream match in Rock/Cena like 28 did which was the obvious money match. And while HHH/Taker may have been the bigger ratings draw in 2012, Rock/Cena is legitimately one of the biggest matches in WWE history. Comparing Taker/Lesnar to Rock/Cena is laughable really, so I don't think that comparison is valid at all. Likewise, when it's coming from somebody who wants to portray Lesnar as some mega draw this year yet is perfectly content to say that he didn't make much of an impact last year purely based on his opponent, well, that speaks for itself. Sorry Bad News but you know the score . 

There is no definitive link between high ratings and buys but the Bryan/Authority segments weren't just getting high ratings, they were getting _explosive _ratings for the main segments. It's not just a case of the usual Wrestlemania crowd tuning in. Based on the 18-49 demo, this program was one of the hottest in years and probably the hottest feud in WWE that didn't involve Rock since he came back. Factor in the outpouring of support for Bryan to the point that fans have been hijacking shows for him and the outright dominance of The Authority since Summerslam and it's not a stretch at all to think this was the primary factor in the buys. 

Taker/Lesnar is a big match, there's no denying that. But sometimes you get that lightning in a bottle and it's enough to over take a mega match like that. Bryan's rise has been happening for months. Put that up against monster heel Triple H and look what happened. Bryan is white hot right now and I don't think the importance of Trips as a heel should be understated here. He has proven time and time again that as much as the faces can get people to pay to see them win, he can get people to pay to see him get his ass kicked. I don't see this storyline working or being so successful if Triple H isn't fighting Daniel Bryan and on the same token I can't see it working if Daniel Bryan isn't fighting Triple H. 

Anyways, obviously there's no clear cut way of knowing unless everybody who bought it is surveyed or something. All in all, the correct answer is probably the network so in essence, VINCE MCMAHON DRAWS BIGGER THAN EVERYBODY

:vince2 :vince2 :vince2 :vince2 :vince2


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Punk couldn't change things, Bryan, despite how things look, probably won't change things. Only we the people can change things!


----------



## validreasoning

Diezffects said:


> he can't be the champion and headline RAWs, SDs or house shows. I'm not giving HHH all the credit, but the fact that authority angle was the biggest factor going in this mania. Bryan may have been the bullet but Triple H was the gun propelling him with all the momentum.


bryan has had serious momentum since last june. he had momentum when wwe decided to put big show in his spot in november and steal his catchphrase. he had momentum when they turned him heel and put him in a boiler suit. he had momentum when they had batista win the rumble.

funny wwe had no problem putting the belt on the rock last year and he worked NO houseshows for 3 months..




> Bullshit. In-ring work means shit in the grand scheme of things, what we're talking about is whether mania draws or not. Punk was more of a anti-establishment character than Bryan ever will, they story was already built up. To say they had no reason to face each other is just dumb. *Authority/punk would have drawn just as well if not bigger.*
> 
> As I mentioned, Punk excels as a anti-authority character. He would've been a perfect fit and the promos no doubt, would've been ten times more intense. Neither Cena nor Sheamus are anti-authority, and they are both seen as part of the establishment by fans due to their main event push these few years. Mysterio? lol why even bring him up. He's not getting main event angles for any PPV, let alone wrestlemania.


well thats your opinion and i don't agree with it. we already saw coo hhh vs anti authority punk back in 2011 and that didn't draw well at all on tv or on ppv (in fact cena vs punk a year later on the same ppv drew much better)

if you want to believe punk vs hhh and batista vs orton for the wwe title does just as well as bryan vs hhh and bryan in the title match go right ahead but i ain't buying that for a second.

i mentioned mysterio because you said and i quote "any over babyface could have been placed in this authority angle and did just as well" so i just named all the top faces in the company.





> With Bryan, Punk would've been easy, almost too perfect replacement and nothing would've changed. Mania would've drawn just as good.


you keep saying this 




> WWE said its domestic, it probably does include Puerto Rico, Canada and Mexico. i don't remember 400K being announced as north american only. Mania 26 was a big failure, comparing with that is pointless. 500K domestic is typical baseline for Mania. Even if we consider network subscriptions which were well below WWE's expected figure, 400K traditional buys is just average, not a huge success.


wwe told david bixenspan the 400 number is USA only










26 was the last mania where the rock wasn't advertised as the main attraction is the comparison is completely fair.

you keep using your own opinion and stating it as fact. nobody knows what the average is for buyrate once you insert the unknown of a $10 a month network. like i said wwe budgeted for mania doing 250k domestic and it did 400k so that is a huge success. 





> In his newsletter, a week before the subscriptions number came out. He said 750K traditional buys was his prediction. I don't know what it was based on but that was his prediction.
> 
> I doubt if this number is true. Last three years Mania has drawn 650+ domestic, why would they budget such a low figure even if we include WWE network.


you use meltzer as evidence one second and don't believe him the next?

without the rock and the show available for $10 i am not surprised they expected ppv order to drop by more than 50%. remember that 650k figure is total domestic, us number would be closer to 500k for last years show (i believe the total usa was 530k last year)


----------



## CHIcagoMade

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Punk couldn't change things, Bryan, despite how things look, probably won't change things. Only we the people can change things!


----------



## Happenstan

:damn WorldWrestlingFed with that pants down spanking.



Starbuck said:


> I don't see this storyline working or being so successful if Triple H isn't fighting Daniel Bryan and on the same token I can't see it working if Daniel Bryan isn't fighting Triple H.


Agreed 100%. As much as HHH has buried people in the past, when he wants to make a star a superstar he succeeds every time. Batista, Orton, now Bryan...the guy knows what he's doing.


----------



## THANOS

So many great posts on this page. Starbuck posted this media interview in the Bryan thread. In it Triple H more or less calls Bryan the next HUGE talent and says he's spreading globally. If people want to try and deny that Bryan's appeal is much more than a chant after this, then they're lost causes. Keep in mind, someone in Triple H's position has access to metrics none of us do, so he can see that Bryan's popularity is translating to big money.

:55 onward


----------



## Choke2Death

WorldWrestlingFed said:


> His character was actually a phony,
> 
> Did the Punk character ever have the balls to Occupy Raw like Daniel Bryan did?
> 
> No.
> 
> Did CM Punk ever follow up with his promise of change?
> 
> No, WWE remained almost the same in 2012 after his 2011 promises, No Ice Cream bars, Same product, No compelling storylines such as the present Authority storyline with Daniel Bryan.
> 
> the anti-authority gimmick ended in 2011 after Cm Punk failed to do what he said he was going to do, his pipebombs were the ones you find in GI Joes at Toys R Us, they were fake.
> 
> Bring change to the WWE? Punk didn't cause it, just look at the year 2012, Daniel Bryan and The Shield brought change in 2013.
> 
> Did Punk Put over anyone? Never happened, Ryback never went over Punk, the Ryback/Axel/Heyman feud failed, beat the entire Shield at once in a handicap match and almost brought them down.
> 
> Punk called himself the best in the world despite losing cleanly to the likes of The Undertaker, Rock, and Cena. his character was the embodiment of all talk, no substance, an insult to intelligence.
> 
> Daniel Bryan however brought change, Unlike Punk he beat Cena clean(No distractions),
> 
> Daniel Bryan had pops that Punk never had in his life,
> 
> People wanted to see Daniel Bryan win the Royal Rumble this year, not Cm Punk,
> 
> People wanted Daniel Bryan to be WWE champion, not Cm Punk.
> 
> Daniel Bryan was the draw, the CM Punk thing from 2011 was nothing more than an experiment that failed to change or improve the product, The Shield and the Daniel Bryan/Authority angles brought change to WWE and led us to where we are now, even John Cena helped by lowering himself down the card, and putting over Daniel Bryan cleanly.
> 
> What did Punk do? Have failed angles with Ryback/Axel and Heyman, beat the Shield in a handicap match, never brought the change that said he would in 2011, never drew as much as Daniel Bryan has lately and never got a pop at big as Daniel Bryan's Yes chant.
> 
> Daniel Bryan is more of anti-abuse/anti-oppression character than Punk ever was, unlike Punk, Daniel Bryan drew and changed something, Daniel Bryan displayed more anti-abuse/oppression in his Occupy Raw segment alone than Cm Punk ever has.


:damn unk3 :berried



> It's still real to WorldWrestlingFed, dammit


He's clearly talking about the character with a bit of reality added to the mix. :bryan >>>>>>>>>>>>>> unk


----------



## RabidCrow

If seriously anyone thinks that Bryan is more anti-authority than Cm Punk was i can't help but feel sorry for them.

Punk brings reality and intensity like anybody when it comes about oppose the E, the beggining of summer of Punk was probably the most exciting thing that happended in the PG era, i think people here seriously doesn't understand how much Punk helped to business back then, he basically make WWE interesting again and brought back a lot of fans ALONE, yeah he he wasn't helping by great stables like The Shield, The Wyatts or Evolution, he probably was the only interesting thing to watch then and he just make it with pure talent and attitude.

Bryan is just another smilling goofy kind of John Cena babyface, but in this case, he's saved because he's a fan favorite, people love him, yeah! He was the perfect underdog! But great part of what he's here is because HHH did the perfect role as the abusive and ruthless boss heel.

Punk failed? He changed nothing? Well, it will be the same with Daniel Bryan, he will probably get a mid card title reign like Punk got too, i like Bryan for his wrestling skills, but he didn't change a shit, he drew just because he was part of the big Mania.


----------



## ecabney

Punk basically worked with the same people that D-Bry did, but failed to draw any numbers like D-Bry.

I thought any over babyface could draw huge numbers against The Authority? :jordan


----------



## Londrick

ecabney said:


> Punk basically worked with the same people that D-Bry did, but failed to draw any numbers like D-Bry did.
> 
> I thought any over babyface could draw huge numbers against The Authority? :jordan


To be fair once Bryan starts feuding with ADR, Miz, Ryback, etc I doubt he's gonna draw well.


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

RabidCrow said:


> If seriously anyone thinks that Bryan is more anti-authority than Cm Punk was i can't help but feel sorry for them.
> 
> Punk brings reality and intensity like anybody when it comes about oppose the E, the beggining of summer of Punk was probably the most exciting thing that happended in the PG era, i think people here seriously doesn't understand how much Punk helped to business back then, he basically make WWE interesting again and brought back a lot of fans ALONE, yeah he he wasn't helping by great stables like The Shield, The Wyatts or Evolution, he probably was the only interesting thing to watch then and he just make it with pure talent and attitude.
> 
> Bryan is just another smilling goofy kind of John Cena babyface, but in this case, he's saved because he's a fan favorite, people love him, yeah! He was the perfect underdog! But great part of what he's here is because HHH did the perfect role as the abusive and ruthless boss heel.
> 
> Punk failed? He changed nothing? Well, it will be the same with Daniel Bryan, he will probably get a mid card title reign like Punk got too, i like Bryan for his wrestling skills, but he didn't change a shit, he drew just because he was part of the big Mania.


Read, 



WorldWrestlingFed said:


> His character(Cm Punk) was actually a phony,
> 
> Did the Punk character ever have the balls to Occupy Raw like Daniel Bryan did?
> 
> No.
> 
> Did CM Punk ever follow up with his promise of change?
> 
> No, WWE remained almost the same in 2012 after his 2011 promises, No Ice Cream bars, Same product, No compelling storylines such as the present Authority storyline with Daniel Bryan.
> 
> the anti-authority gimmick ended in 2011 after Cm Punk failed to do what he said he was going to do, his pipebombs were the ones you find in GI Joes at Toys R Us, they were fake.
> 
> Bring change to the WWE? Punk didn't cause it, just look at the year 2012, Daniel Bryan and The Shield brought change in 2013.
> 
> Did Punk Put over anyone? Never happened, Ryback never went over Punk, the Ryback/Axel/Heyman feud failed, beat the entire Shield at once in a handicap match and almost brought them down.
> 
> Punk called himself the best in the world despite losing cleanly to the likes of The Undertaker, Rock, and Cena. his character was the embodiment of all talk, no substance, an insult to intelligence.
> 
> Daniel Bryan however brought change, Unlike Punk he beat Cena clean(No distractions),
> 
> Daniel Bryan had pops that Punk never had in his life,
> 
> People wanted to see Daniel Bryan win the Royal Rumble this year, not Cm Punk,
> 
> People wanted Daniel Bryan to be WWE champion, not Cm Punk.
> 
> Daniel Bryan was the draw, the CM Punk thing from 2011 was nothing more than an experiment that failed to change or improve the product, The Shield and the Daniel Bryan/Authority angles brought change to WWE and led us to where we are now, even John Cena helped by lowering himself down the card, and putting over Daniel Bryan cleanly.
> 
> What did Punk do? Have failed angles with Ryback/Axel and Heyman, beat the Shield in a handicap match, never brought the change that said he would in 2011, never drew as much as Daniel Bryan has lately and never got a pop at big as Daniel Bryan's Yes chant.
> 
> Daniel Bryan is more of anti-abuse/anti-oppression character than Punk ever was, unlike Punk, Daniel Bryan drew and changed something, Daniel Bryan displayed more anti-abuse/oppression in his Occupy Raw segment alone than Cm Punk ever has.


----------



## #Mark

Londrick said:


> To be fair once Bryan starts feuding with ADR, Miz, Ryback, etc I doubt he's gonna draw well.


Yeah but the Summer of Punk wasn't drawing great ratings at all and Punk was exclusively working with Cena, Vince, and HHH.


----------



## DoubtGin

Ratings are going to drop quite a bit due to the NBA playoffs, I guess?


----------



## validreasoning

RabidCrow said:


> If seriously anyone thinks that Bryan is more anti-authority than Cm Punk was i can't help but feel sorry for them.


you gives a crap honestly?

the anti authority punk thing was a WWE STORYLINE. punk didn't change a thing because he was never supposed to change a thing...it was a storyline full stop where he was playing the leading role.

bryan didn't change anything either, the power of the fans changed wwe minds. batista was supposed to win at mania in a one on one match with orton. wwe just used bryan in a storyline to portray real fan anger.


----------



## JY57

Total Divas increased to 1.4 million viewers on Easter Sunday (up from 1.164 million the previous week)


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

DAT BRYAN RETURN! :bryan


----------



## RabidCrow

WorldWrestlingFed said:


> Read,


Yeah i read your shit, do you read mine?



validreasoning said:


> you gives a crap honestly?
> 
> the anti authority punk thing was a WWE STORYLINE. punk didn't change a thing because he was never supposed to change a thing...it was a storyline full stop where he was playing the leading role.
> 
> bryan didn't change anything either, the power of the fans changed wwe minds. batista was supposed to win at mania in a one on one match with orton. wwe just used bryan in a storyline to portray real fan anger.


No shit.. But the point is Punk's character make it more real and interesting than Bryan, even when none of both were supposed to change anything.



#Mark said:


> Yeah but the Summer of Punk wasn't drawing great ratings at all and Punk was exclusively working with Cena, Vince, and HHH.


Summerslam 2013 didin't draw so well either. unk2


----------



## NastyYaffa

RabidCrow said:


> Yeah i read your shit, do you read mine?
> 
> 
> 
> No shit.. But the point is Punk's character make it more real and interesting than Bryan, even when none of both were supposed to change anything.
> 
> 
> 
> Summerslam 2013 didin't draw so well either. unk2


I love when Punk marks bring up SummerSlam 2013, when Punk was co-main eventing the PPV with Brock fn' Lesnar :


----------



## #Mark

RabidCrow said:


> Yeah i read your shit, do you read mine?
> 
> 
> 
> No shit.. But the point is Punk's character make it more real and interesting than Bryan, even when none of both were supposed to change anything.
> 
> 
> 
> Summerslam 2013 didin't draw so well either. unk2


It drew significantly better than the epic Punk/Cena rematch at Summerslam 2011 :lol


----------



## WWE

Can we just agree that both punk and bryan couldn't even draw a stick without making it look like a triangle


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson outdraws all of these midgets/roid freaks/******* with EASE.


----------



## THANOS

NastyYaffa said:


> I love when Punk marks bring up SummerSlam 2013, when Punk was co-main eventing the PPV with Brock fn' Lesnar :


Exactly. This seems to be lost on some folks. Couple that with the fact that the final buys came in already and it showed that SS 2013 did better than SS 2011 which was on Punk's big rise. THAT is comparable because Punk in 2011 had comparable momentum to Bryan in 2013 since that was when their pushes into the mainevent first began.

Hell the Punk fans would even say that Punk had MORE momentum in 2011 than Bryan in 2013 due to his huge shoot .


----------



## purple_gloves

I see the Daniel Bryan bullshit fest continues unabated in this thread. Some people still can't tell the difference between a proper "we're gonna make a star out of this kid" push, and a "milk it while we can but no way we're going all the way" push.

And I thought you lot were all "smarks". :lmao


----------



## Superhippy

Wrestlemania 30 had 670k Network Subscriptions plus 400K regular buys. If the international buyrate is the worst that it has been in the last 5 years then it will be about 415k - 425k. So overall we are are looking at about 820k regular buys and 670k subscriptions. That's pretty damned good considering the entire focus of Mania this year was on Daniel Bryan. WM26 only had 885k buys and there was no WWE Network then.

I think it's hard to make a case that CM Punk was a huge ratings draw because the numbers don't show that but it doesn't really matter. He was selling my merch then Cena for months and has been the #1 or #2 for about 4 years straight. He is still in the top 3 and hasn't even been on TV since January. Punk brings in $$$$$. If he didn't then Vince and company would have buried him on the air already, but they haven't. The WWE knows how big of a commodity and brand that CM Punk is, and they are the only ones that have an opinion that matters anyways.


----------



## THANOS

purple_gloves said:


> I see the Daniel Bryan bullshit fest continues unabated in this thread. Some people still can't tell the difference between a proper "we're gonna make a star out of this kid" push, and a "milk it while we can but no way we're going all the way" push.
> 
> And I thought you lot were all "smarks". :lmao


Well if you're suggesting it's the latter option, then maybe you should read my post from earlier.



THANOS said:


> Starbuck posted this media interview in the Bryan thread. In it Triple H more or less calls Bryan the next HUGE talent and says he's spreading globally. If people want to try and deny that Bryan's appeal is much more than a chant after this, then they're lost causes. Keep in mind, someone in Triple H's position has access to metrics none of us do, so he's able to see if Bryan's popularity is translating to big money. WWE are fully aboard the Bryan train.
> 
> :55 onward


----------



## #Mark

purple_gloves said:


> I see the Daniel Bryan bullshit fest continues unabated in this thread. Some people still can't tell the difference between a proper "we're gonna make a star out of this kid" push, and a "milk it while we can but no way we're going all the way" push.
> 
> And I thought you lot were all "smarks". :lmao


Didn't Bryan just headline Wrestlemania? Beating the three top heel acts on the same night? 

Sounds like you're a jaded Punk fan. WWE would have invested in Punk if he moved ratings like Bryan or had the crowd reactions that Bryan did. Obviously he didn't, that's why he's just a footnote in WWE's vast history.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Wait, so when it comes to Summerslams disappointing numbers, Bryan doesn't get the majority of the blame, but when it comes to Mania's successful figures, it's absolutely definitely mostly Bryan?

Alrighty then, I get it now. 

(I really do hate sounding like a Bryan hater, but come on guys...)


----------



## WWE

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Wait, so when it comes to Summerslams disappointing numbers, Bryan doesn't get the majority of the blame, but when it comes to Mania's successful figures, it's absolutely definitely mostly Bryan?


amazing logic huh


----------



## D.M.N.

Errr, fuck.

WWE Entertainment	USA	8:00 PM	4224	1.4
WWE Entertainment	USA	9:00 PM	4395	1.5
WWE Entertainment	USA	10:00 PM	3799	1.3

Terrible hour three number. For those that haven't seen elsewhere, Bryan/Kane was meant to be the overrun. With Bryan/Kane out the equation, hour three turned into a sacrificial lamb.

Nothing else WWE could have done in the circumstances, though.


----------



## THANOS

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Wait, so when it comes to Summerslams disappointing numbers, Bryan doesn't get the majority of the blame, but when it comes to Mania's successful figures, it's absolutely definitely mostly Bryan?
> 
> Alrighty then, I get it now.
> 
> (I really do hate sounding like a Bryan hater, but come on guys...)


I think you need to read the main points people are making. People want to place full blame on Bryan for Summerslam 2013 eventhough it wasn't even that bad, the final buys show it was greater than Summerslam 2011 which was during Punk's rise. These are at comparable times during their careers. After that, Mania 30 comes along and is built around Bryan and did much better than expected, to say the least.

I don't think you can simply write all that off to "Bryan markdom", what is your objective opinion?


----------



## JY57

3rd hour got owned by the 4th Quarter & Overtime of the Thunder/Grizzlies game. No shock there


----------



## THANOS

D.M.N. said:


> Errr, fuck.
> 
> WWE Entertainment	USA	8:00 PM	4224	1.4
> WWE Entertainment	USA	9:00 PM	4395	1.5
> WWE Entertainment	USA	10:00 PM	3799	1.3
> 
> Terrible hour three number. For those that haven't seen elsewhere, Bryan/Kane was meant to be the overrun. With Bryan/Kane out the equation, hour three turned into a sacrificial lamb.
> 
> Nothing else WWE could have done in the circumstances, though.


Not surprised at all. Bryan/Kane and Evolution/Shield were most definitely the high points.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

THANOS said:


> I think you need to read the main points people are making. People want to place full blame on Bryan for Summerslam 2013 eventhough it wasn't even that bad, the final buys show it was greater than Summerslam 2011 which was during Punk's rise. These are at comparable times during their careers. After that, Mania 30 comes along and is built around Bryan and did much better than expected, to say the least.
> 
> I don't think you can simply write all that off to "Bryan markdom", what is your objective opinion?


I get the point and I agree that Bryan is a bigger draw than Punk. I'm merely making an observation that shows a lot of Bryan marks are being extremely subjective themselves (not ALL of them).


----------



## The Boy Wonder

The third reflects very poorly on the Cena/Wyatt. I don't think the fans bought into this feud and this rating proves that.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Looks like we're getting back to the norm. Without Taker's streak ending/Warrior's death to hook more outsider fans into Raw, things are probably gonna be at this level and decrease until the build to Summerslam. Then it comes back to these numbers, then goes back down and down and down until 2015.


----------



## #Mark

#BadNewsSanta said:


> Wait, so when it comes to Summerslams disappointing numbers, Bryan doesn't get the majority of the blame, but when it comes to Mania's successful figures, it's absolutely definitely mostly Bryan?
> 
> Alrighty then, I get it now.
> 
> (I really do hate sounding like a Bryan hater, but come on guys...)


Why are you completely ignoring the guy who tried pinning the entirety of the Summerslam blame on Bryan? He's the one who brought up the Summerslam number in the first place.. Despite the number turning out to be a lot better than initially projected.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

#Mark said:


> Why are you completely ignoring the guy who tried pinning the entirety of the Summerslam blame on Bryan? He's the one who brought up the Summerslam number in the first place.. Despite the number turning out to be a lot better than initially projected.


Because based on what the majority think about Mania, I'm "shocked" (not really) people are getting on this guy's case.

If you must know though, I disagree with the assessment that Bryan gets full or even most of the blame for then Summerslam buyrate. He and Cena may have been the hottest built match, but Punk/Lesnar was the biggest and as such, deserves most of the blame for the Summerslam buyrate not being a big success.


----------



## Choke2Death

No surprise the third hour did bad. Bryan/Kane & Shield/Evolution are the big programs. Nothing was worth watching in the last hour.


----------



## checkcola

That third hour is bad news for the Wyatt Family.


----------



## xdoomsayerx

People are already losing interest in Cena/Wyatt and I'm not surprised. Insanely dumb for Cena to not put over Bray at WM. And NO I'm not a Cena hater either.


----------



## Waffelz

It was stupid, but they only had twenty minutes. The ratings will most likely have dropped for everything before that.


----------



## THANOS

We're going in circles man.










These ratings are so difficult to keep up.


----------



## xdoomsayerx

That main event really dragged too with a dumb/predictable ending. Should have ended with Kane doing something to brie or Evolution/Shield


----------



## Sonnen Says

THANOS said:


> I think you need to read the main points people are making. People want to place full blame on Bryan for Summerslam 2013 eventhough it wasn't even that bad, *the final buys show it was greater than Summerslam 2011 which was during Punk's rise. These are at comparable times during their careers.* After that, Mania 30 comes along and is built around Bryan and did much better than expected, to say the least.
> 
> I don't think you can simply write all that off to "Bryan markdom", what is your objective opinion?


Of course lets ignore the different starpower SS 13 card was compared to SS 11. It's perfectly fair right :/ 

Bryan fans are just trying to make it all about Bryan and no one else. Anyone who watched the show from the previous weeks knows damn well that it had a lot of starpower compared to Punks time which people are trying to ignore to prove a point lol. Fact is, if Bryan push started in 2012 it will get just as low if not lower (if Punk isn't in the show). You're just proving that you're a bit too biased.


----------



## Lebyonics

Summerslam 2013 should be considered a failure because there were two big matches and it will never be clear which drew and which did not. 2011 had one big match which was again a rematch. I dont think its objective enough to say that Punk's rise was bigger than Bryan's rise and Punk-Lesnar feud both combined because only then it is justified for people to compare 2011 and 2013.


----------



## JY57

2.97 rating


----------



## THANOS

Sonnen Says said:


> Of course lets ignore the different starpower SS 13 card was compared to SS 11. It's perfectly fair right :/
> 
> Bryan fans are just trying to make it all about Bryan and no one else. Anyone who watched the show from the previous weeks knows damn well that it had a lot of starpower compared to Punks time which people are trying to ignore to prove a point lol. Fact is, if Bryan push started in 2012 it will get just as low if not lower (if Punk isn't in the show). You're just proving that you're a bit too biased.


You and many others were placing FULL BLAME on Bryan when you thought Summerslam 2013 popped a bad buyrate, and now that the final buys proved it was better than Summerslam 2011, you try and flip your original statement. Nope, not going to happen, you made your bed and now you sleep in it.

If people hadn't already been saying the above, it's a perfectly logical point, but unfortunately you guys were adamant that the bad buyrate was solely placed on Bryan's shoulders, so....


----------



## #Mark

Summerslam did 332,000 buys. That's only around 20,000 less than the year prior and 20,000 more than 2011. People are overstating how bad that number is.


----------



## Uerfer

20,000? What? Summerslam 2012 last update figure from Meltzer was 398,000 buys.


----------



## Sonnen Says

THANOS said:


> You and many others were placing FULL BLAME on Bryan when you thought Summerslam 2013 popped a bad buyrate, and now that the final buys proved it was better than Summerslam 2011, you try and flip your original statement. Nope, not going to happen, you made your bed and now you sleep in it.
> 
> If people hadn't already been saying the above, it's a perfectly logical point, but unfortunately you guys were adamant that the bad buyrate was solely placed on Bryan's shoulders, so....


I didn't put the full blame on him. He's def part of the blame tho. A lot gave excuses that it was Bryan first ME. Either ways thinking it was all Bryan is just as bad. I bet if SS 13 did much better people wont give Brock/Punk match as much credit and think it's all Bryan just like what you guys are doing now, so I wont take that back.


----------



## Starbuck

Haven't we learned anything from the Big Show fiasco last year people?

:show

Anyways, the correct answer in the Summerslam 2011 vs. Summerslam 2013 debate is obviously Summerslam 2012.

DEM 398,000 BUYS

:brock :trips3

Looks like things are back down to normal now although hour 1 and 2 are still very good. Hour 3 just took a nosedive for whatever reason but I'm not prepared to place blame on Cena/Wyatt unless there's a breakdown considering the amount of times a breakdown has revealed it was everything _else_ in the third hour that caused the drop and not the ending angle. If there was a big basketball game or whatever on though then that's obviously the reason why it dropped and I doubt the originally planned Kane/Bryan or Evolution in there would have made any difference.


----------



## #Mark

Uerfer said:


> 20,000? What? Summerslam 2012 last update figure from Meltzer was 398,000 buys.


Wow.. I thought it was 358,000. I had no idea they produced that great of a number.


----------



## THANOS

Sonnen Says said:


> I didn't put the full blame on him. He's def part of the blame tho. A lot gave excuses that it was Bryan first ME. Either ways thinking it was all Bryan is just as bad. *I bet if SS 13 did much better people wont give Brock/Punk match as much credit and think it's all Bryan just like what you guys are doing now, so I wont take that back.*


Not me, I actually like Punk, he's my second favourite wrestler, or at least was. I'm just using the same logic I saw the majority on this board use against Bryan once the Summerslam 2013 preliminary estimate came out, but crawled back under their bridge once the final numbers were released. If people want to place full responsibility on one talent for a buyrate or rating, then they sure as hell better stick to their word if that opinion works against them in the future.

People have been saying that Brock's appeal has been diminishing ever since his Mania loss to Hunter. I don't agree with this point, but it's a popular opinion around here nonetheless. And if someone were able to prove it, than Bryan/Cena does receive more responsibility for the buyrate.


----------



## Uerfer

Yes... from Observer Newsletter weeks before summerslam last year - 



> For the show to do in the neighborhood of last year (*296,000 North American buys; 392,000 total*; up from 180,000 in North American and 311,000 total the year before largely due to the Lesnar vs. HHH match), it will be all due to both the top two matches.


Last update was 398,000 buys total and that's probably the final figure.


----------



## THANOS

Starbuck said:


> Haven't we learned anything from the Big Show fiasco last year people?
> 
> :show
> 
> Anyways, the correct answer in the Summerslam 2011 vs. Summerslam 2013 debate is obviously Summerslam 2012.
> 
> DEM 398,000 BUYS
> 
> :brock :trips3
> 
> Looks like things are back down to normal now although hour 1 and 2 are still very good. Hour 3 just took a nosedive for whatever reason but I'm not prepared to place blame on Cena/Wyatt unless there's a breakdown considering the amount of times a breakdown has revealed it was everything _else_ in the third hour that caused the drop and not the ending angle. *If there was a big basketball game or whatever on though then that's obviously the reason why it dropped and I doubt the originally planned Kane/Bryan or Evolution in there would have made any difference.*


Couldn't agree more. The NBA playoffs are HUGE ratings movers and I have no issue believing that it had a large part in that 3rd hour drop.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

#Mark said:


> Wow.. I thought it was 358,000. I had no idea they produced that great of a number.


When WWE released their earnings report in October 2013, the number was listed as 358,000 buys.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

Hold on. What was the final buyrate for Summerslam 2013? I thought it was 296,000


----------



## JY57

The Boy Wonder said:


> Hold on. What was the final buyrate for Summerslam 2013? I thought it was 296,000


332,000


----------



## Starbuck

*2011 - 311k(?) Punk/Cena II
2012 - 398k Brock/HHH
2013 - 332k Brock/Punk & Cena/Bryan*

I think. Recommence battle.


----------



## RabidCrow

#Mark said:


> It drew significantly better than the epic Punk/Cena rematch at Summerslam 2011 :lol





#Mark said:


> Summerslam did 332,000 buys. That's only around 20,000 less than the year prior and 20,000 more than 2011. People are overstating how bad that number is.


Not really, according with wrestlinginc SummerSlam 2013 drew 298,000 buys. That is a steep 17% drop from last year's SummerSlam, which initially garnered an estimated 350,000 PPV buys.

And by comparison with Summerslam 2011 that drew 301,000 buys, that's 3,000 buys less.


----------



## Uerfer

That 332,000 updated buys for SS '13 is also from Meltzer.


----------



## The Boy Wonder

Starbuck said:


> *2011 - 311k(?) Punk/Cena II
> 2012 - 398k Brock/HHH
> 2013 - 332k Brock/Punk & Cena/Bryan*
> 
> I think. Recommence battle.


398? I thought it was 358? Does anyone have a link for these #s?


----------



## JY57

RabidCrow said:


> Not really, according with wrestlinginc SummerSlam 2013 drew 298,000 buys. That is a steep 17% drop from last year's SummerSlam, which initially garnered an estimated 350,000 PPV buys.
> 
> And by comparison with Summerslam 2011 that drew 301,000 buys, that's 3,000 buys less.


those are numbers not counting late buys


----------



## THANOS

RabidCrow said:


> Not really, according with wrestlinginc SummerSlam 2013 drew 298,000 buys. That is a steep 17% drop from last year's SummerSlam, which initially garnered an estimated 350,000 PPV buys.
> 
> And by comparison with Summerslam 2011 that drew 301,000 buys, that's 3,000 buys less.


You should really read before you post. Look up. :ti


----------



## Superhippy

Regardless of whether the SS 2013 number is 358k or 398k, that had everything to with the hype around Lesnar when he returned. Extreme Rules saw a 50k buyrate pop as well when Lesnar faced Cena. After Summerslam 2013 though Lesnar has had zero impact on buyrates. WM29 did 205k worse then WM28. Extreme Rules 2013 went down 45k. Summerslam 2013 went down as well. The novelty of Lesnar worse off, probebly because the WWE is filled with a bunch of dumb asses who decided that having him lose to Cena in his 1st match back as well as lose to HHH at WM29 was a good idea.


----------



## The Caped Crusader

I don't understand why people are arguing who was responsible for the 'Wrestlemania buys'. The Network subscriptions that are the large bulk of that number and included in the total of one million households has little to do with any individual superstar and aren't traditional buys. That was the whole point of that model, it's selling itself based on the WWE brand. Isn't it $60 for 6 months? I'm not even a regular fan, but even I would buy that if it was available to me. It's fucking great value considering that's about what you'd be paying for a single PPV usually, and it's likely that reason alone that sold the bulk of those subscriptions. You'd have to be extremely naive to think any one superstar is driving those subscriptions.


----------



## Starbuck

The Caped Crusader said:


> I don't understand why people are arguing...


Really? In this thread?

:ti


----------



## The Caped Crusader

Let's not cut off my sentence and take it out of context. It makes no sense to be arguing who is responsible for the Wrestlemania buys when a large bulk of them is down to the network subscriptions. It's just stupid. Even amongst arguments, there's stuff to argue and stuff which is pointless because it seems like an exercise in delusion.


----------



## JY57

The Boy Wonder said:


> 398? I thought it was 358? Does anyone have a link for these #s?












here is example see the prior events those are late buys accounted for the previous quarter. take 2013 Prior events 91,000 buys accounted to Mania, Extreme Rules, & Payback (since they were in Quarter 2).

those 3 had initial numbers of

Mania 29: 1,039,000 Buys +65,000 = 1,104,000

Extreme Rules 13: 231,000 + 14,000 = 245,000

Payback 13: 186,000 + 12,000 = 198,000

there is the 91,000 from previous events of the previous quarter. With late buys added SSLAM 12 was 392,000 and SSLAM 13 was 332,000


----------



## Starbuck

The Caped Crusader said:


> Let's not cut off my sentence and take it out of context. It makes no sense to be arguing who is responsible for the Wrestlemania buys when a large bulk of them is down to the network subscriptions. It's just stupid. Even amongst arguments, there's stuff to argue and stuff which is pointless because *it seems like an exercise in delusion*.


I say again, in this thread lol? If you're looking for arguments and delusion you have come to the right place.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Sonnen Says said:


> Of course lets ignore the different starpower SS 13 card was compared to SS 11. It's perfectly fair right :/
> 
> *Bryan fans are just trying to make it all about Bryan and no one else.* Anyone who watched the show from the previous weeks knows damn well that it had a lot of starpower compared to Punks time which people are trying to ignore to prove a point lol. Fact is, if Bryan push started in 2012 it will get just as low if not lower (if Punk isn't in the show). You're just proving that you're a bit too biased.


The only one who tried to make it all about Bryan was YOU, and ONLY you. From the very start when we first heard about the numbers being disappointing and the moment people claimed Bryan was a bigger draw than Punk, you immediately ran to the tables and pointed to the Summerslam 2013 buyrates, saying that the disappointing numbers were mostly Bryan's fault.

Now you want to do a 180 and suddenly backtrack that statement and claim that the suddenly now good numbers are more so because of Punk/Lesnar and we're all just trying to make it seem like it was all Bryan? Get the fuck out of here with that bullshit. 

In hindsight, there's no reason as to why Summerslam 2013 shouldn't have had a better buyrate than Summerslam 2011. And guess what? It did. It had a good buyrate. When you compare the two cards, Summerslam 2013 basically blows 2011 out of the water. 2011 was the case of a two match show that managed to have a third great match that wasn't even built up and was announced on the spot, a good Sheamus/Henry program and two other matches I believe that also were not announced beforehand. The main matches? Christian/Orton and Punk/Cena. I love Christian but him and Orton don't generate much attention despite their outstanding feud with each other as the second biggest match on a show like Summerslam. And Punk/Cena may have come off of an all time classic in WWE's history, but they weren't drawing much. Punk wasn't at that stage in his career yet and Cena could only do so much. 

Summerslam 2013 was different in the case that the two main matches were a dream match that we were fortunate enough to see in Lesnar/Punk, and another never before seen match up (fuck their velocity match) that we thought we never would actually see main event a PPV in Bryan/Cena for WWE Championship. The matches on the card were a great Christian/Rio match where Christian was again involved in the WHC match, a good Sandow/Rhodes match, a pointless mixed tag match and a pointless yet surprisingly good divas match (people are WAY too hard on that match). So unlike Summerslam 2011, in this one we knew what we had coming, and there were other matches besides the two main attractions that we had a reason to care for. But without a doubt, Lesnar/Punk and Bryan/Cena were the main attractions here.

Now I'm not going to deny that Punk had an impact here. He did. In fact people tend to underestimate it. But it's not about Punk per say more than it is the match up itself. Lesnar/Punk was huge. It was a match up that many people talked about the possibility of happening for years. When Lesnar finally returned in 2012, one of the hottest topics in mind were "when will Punk face Lesnar"? Hell, WWE even made it a dream match on a dream matches list they had. It was a highly anticipated match up. It could have been one of the main matches for Wrestlemania. Add Punk's historic title reign and the fact Lesnar was coming off of beating Triple H twice now, you had something here. So, yes, a good amount of the credit goes to Lesnar/Punk. NO ONE is denying this.

The thing you need to understand, however, is as much of a draw Lesnar/Punk was, it wasn't the biggest. Even in the weeks leading up to Summerslam (although I could be wrong, my memory is horrible in this regard), the biggest focus for many was Bryan/Cena. And there's a reason for that. People knew it was going to be a great match (I feel like it's a bit overrated, but that's just me). It was a match many people wanted Daniel Bryan to be in now for quite some time. The crowd support for Daniel Bryan was insane at this point, and Bryan had spent the last few months beating basically everyone that stood in his path. This was a match a lot of people were having a hard time predicting the winner to. And not only that, Daniel Bryan was the representative of all the people who had grown tired of Cena at this point. And those people were the ones chanting yes for him every time he came down the ramp. This was the big turning point. They knew a star was in the making here, that this was the start of something special. Regardless of who was going to win, fans, both casual and IWC, knew that something special was going to happen on that night. And at the end of the day, it did. 

So yes, 2013 had better buyrates than 2011, because it had a more stacked card. We won't deny that. There's no questioning it. HOWEVER, Bryan was one of, if not, the biggest factor in the buyrates for that PPV, and it showed in the weeks, months and soon, the year that took place afterwords. And this isn't taking away from Cena, Lesnar or Punk, or anyone else for that matter. Now in this day and age, we witnessed Bryan headline Wrestlemania while also opening Wrestlemania, and with a lackluster build for Taker/Lesnar and what many felt to be a predictable result (which ended up not being the case), and a good build for Wyatt/Cena that arguably played the second man role in this case, Bryan was without a doubt the main attraction leading up to Wrestlemania and at Wrestlemania itself, and he helped (key word being HELPED) pulled in numbers that Punk has never been able to do, and never will be able to do, no matter who he was feuding with, and there's a reason for that. Because he was never as big of a draw as Daniel Bryan is now.

You can either learn to accept that, or you can continue to make a fool of yourself and deny it.

P.S. FUCK YOU IF MY POST IS LONG.


----------



## Starbuck

Here we go again :ti


----------



## wjd1989

Meh, the after-WM slump in full effect.

I thought Raw's first half last night was FANTASTIC - the Kane/Bryan segment, the Barrett match, the Usos match and leading up to the Evolution/Shield showdown. Then the last half was shit.


----------



## THANOS

wjd1989 said:


> Meh, the after-WM slump in full effect.
> 
> I thought Raw's first half last night was FANTASTIC - the Kane/Bryan segment, the Barrett match, the Usos match and leading up to the Evolution/Shield showdown. Then the last half was shit.


This, the second half blew unfortunately.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

The GMofLongPosts


----------



## kokepepsi

People not knowing the difference between buyrate and buys but arguing PPV numbers like they know shit
:ti

God I love this thread


----------



## DanM3

Raw ratings reflected exactly what the show was this week. Daniel Bryan at the start was good but there was nothing to keep people watching after that. None of the matches really mattered and there's no real story line development. Yes the evolution sheild segment was good but it didnt bring anything to the story. And personally I have lost interest on the cena Wyatt feud as it's getting boring. Bray Wyatt could go far but needs to best cena and move on


----------



## Sonnen Says

TheGMofGods said:


> The only one who tried to make it all about Bryan was YOU, and ONLY you. From the very start when we first heard about the numbers being disappointing and the moment people claimed Bryan was a bigger draw than Punk, you immediately ran to the tables and pointed to the Summerslam 2013 buyrates, saying that the disappointing numbers were mostly Bryan's fault.
> 
> Now you want to do a 180 and suddenly backtrack that statement and claim that the suddenly now good numbers are more so because of Punk/Lesnar and we're all just trying to make it seem like it was all Bryan? Get the fuck out of here with that bullshit.
> 
> In hindsight, there's no reason as to why Summerslam 2013 shouldn't have had a better buyrate than Summerslam 2011. And guess what? It did. It had a good buyrate. When you compare the two cards, Summerslam 2013 basically blows 2011 out of the water. 2011 was the case of a two match show that managed to have a third great match that wasn't even built up and was announced on the spot, a good Sheamus/Henry program and two other matches I believe that also were not announced beforehand. The main matches? Christian/Orton and Punk/Cena. I love Christian but him and Orton don't generate much attention despite their outstanding feud with each other as the second biggest match on a show like Summerslam. And Punk/Cena may have come off of an all time classic in WWE's history, but they weren't drawing much. Punk wasn't at that stage in his career yet and Cena could only do so much.
> 
> Summerslam 2013 was different in the case that the two main matches were a dream match that we were fortunate enough to see in Lesnar/Punk, and another never before seen match up (fuck their velocity match) that we thought we never would actually see main event a PPV in Bryan/Cena for WWE Championship. The matches on the card were a great Christian/Rio match where Christian was again involved in the WHC match, a good Sandow/Rhodes match, a pointless mixed tag match and a pointless yet surprisingly good divas match (people are WAY too hard on that match). So unlike Summerslam 2011, in this one we knew what we had coming, and there were other matches besides the two main attractions that we had a reason to care for. But without a doubt, Lesnar/Punk and Bryan/Cena were the main attractions here.
> 
> Now I'm not going to deny that Punk had an impact here. He did. In fact people tend to underestimate it. But it's not about Punk per say more than it is the match up itself. Lesnar/Punk was huge. It was a match up that many people talked about the possibility of happening for years. When Lesnar finally returned in 2012, one of the hottest topics in mind were "when will Punk face Lesnar"? Hell, WWE even made it a dream match on a dream matches list they had. It was a highly anticipated match up. It could have been one of the main matches for Wrestlemania. Add Punk's historic title reign and the fact Lesnar was coming off of beating Triple H twice now, you had something here. So, yes, a good amount of the credit goes to Lesnar/Punk. NO ONE is denying this.
> 
> The thing you need to understand, however, is as much of a draw Lesnar/Punk was, it wasn't the biggest. Even in the weeks leading up to Summerslam (although I could be wrong, my memory is horrible in this regard), the biggest focus for many was Bryan/Cena. And there's a reason for that. People knew it was going to be a great match (I feel like it's a bit overrated, but that's just me). It was a match many people wanted Daniel Bryan to be in now for quite some time. The crowd support for Daniel Bryan was insane at this point, and Bryan had spent the last few months beating basically everyone that stood in his path. This was a match a lot of people were having a hard time predicting the winner to. And not only that, Daniel Bryan was the representative of all the people who had grown tired of Cena at this point. And those people were the ones chanting yes for him every time he came down the ramp. This was the big turning point. They knew a star was in the making here, that this was the start of something special. Regardless of who was going to win, fans, both casual and IWC, knew that something special was going to happen on that night. And at the end of the day, it did.
> 
> So yes, 2013 had better buyrates than 2011, because it had a more stacked card. We won't deny that. There's no questioning it. HOWEVER, Bryan was one of, if not, the biggest factor in the buyrates for that PPV, and it showed in the weeks, months and soon, the year that took place afterwords. And this isn't taking away from Cena, Lesnar or Punk, or anyone else for that matter. Now in this day and age, we witnessed Bryan headline Wrestlemania while also opening Wrestlemania, and with a lackluster build for Taker/Lesnar and what many felt to be a predictable result (which ended up not being the case), and a good build for Wyatt/Cena that arguably played the second man role in this case, Bryan was without a doubt the main attraction leading up to Wrestlemania and at Wrestlemania itself, and he helped (key word being HELPED) pulled in numbers that Punk has never been able to do, and never will be able to do, no matter who he was feuding with, and there's a reason for that. Because he was never as big of a draw as Daniel Bryan is now.
> 
> You can either learn to accept that, or you can continue to make a fool of yourself and deny it.
> 
> P.S. FUCK YOU IF MY POST IS LONG.


I didn't blame Bryan fully for SS, and only a blind mark wouldn't give Bryan some of the blame because he deserves his share of blame. SS 13 is still not good enough for an SS PPV number as it usually gets higher than that anyway. Saying it was at least higher than the SS 11 isn't saying much since the card was way stronger and had 2 fresh matches compared to that. If say Bryan/Cena and Christian/Orton happened instead of Brock/Punk in the PPV I expect it to be as low if not lower than the SS 11. Meltzer said that Brock/Punk was the bigger match in that PPV and I think that too. 

Why are you analyzing how great a PPV SS 13 was compared to 11, does that make any difference. When did I deny it and thats way off what I was trying to say, you're just trying to argue for the sake of arguing. I know it had 2 fresh matches which is why it should have done a lot better. If people are trying to claim that SS would be great without Punk/Brock then they are wrong because I think they stole the show and it was the MOTY. Brock/Punk was bigger than the ME because Bryan wasn't a big star at that time and as I said Meltzer said it was the bigger match. 

People have been sick of Cena long time ago, just because Bryan stood for that doesn't mean it was something new and that there weren't wrestlers that did so. The match was fresh on paper because we haven't seen it before, but again I don't see why we are talking about this, since there is nothing to talk about here. People have been disappointed before, I think a lot of people thought Bryan will lose to Cena at that time, but that didn't happen so people now think otherwise and claim it was so obvious. Lol you act like you know exactly how all the fans felt, that's how you felt mostly don't mix things up. Cena losing clean is not something anyone expected so yeah I don't know how excited people were back then for that match, I think in compassion more people were excited for Punk/Cena than Bryan/Cena and having higher buys doesn't mean I'm wrong because I still stand by Brock/Punk was a bigger deal. Also if there was a bigger match than Christian/Orton then I think it would have done a lot better, because people will not pay for two rematches that's not encouraging for the fans. 

You're just trying to give Bryan all the credit and you don't realize it. Again you're claiming Bryan was the big reason for SS which is something I expect from you anyway, whether you like it or not Bryan/Cena wouldn't have done as well if it wasn't for Brock/Punk match happening that's just common sense. Take off Punk and Lesnar from that PPV it would have done lower or as low as SS 11, and if you still want to deny it than keep your ignorance to yourself I don't want to hear it. 

Can you name me the PPVs that Bryan outdrew Punk. If you want to talk about numbers that Punk never pulled which is wrong by your part. Well since you don't know Bryan never pulled the same numbers in PPVs like RR, NOC (2009, 2012), MITB, SS (2009, 2012 CO-ME ), HIAC (2009, 2012 without Cena here), etc in those kind of PPVs. Showing me WM numbers is so laughable, it's WM and it had the debut of the WWE network. Claiming that people payed for the network because of Bryan is also very laughable if that's what you're trying to say. Bryan push just happened at the right time. What you don't understand is that the casual don't think like you, what you think is bad they might think is good, that's why people separate the casual with the IWC.


----------



## CenaBoy4Life

wow TLR. You guys take this stuff to seriously.


----------



## ecabney

CenaBoy4Life said:


> wow TLR. You guys take this stuff to seriously.


Sonnen Says seems to be the only one that's getting agitated


----------



## Londrick

Not surprised about the third hour. Bray is flopping hard.


----------



## Uerfer

Is it true Big show hates Kevin Nash?


----------



## Randy Lahey

JY57 said:


> 2.97 rating


Lowest April rating EVER.

Thats what you get when you peddle PG stuff to an audience that wants something different.


----------



## Kaze Ni Nare

Yeah that OKC/Memphis game had an insane ending which saw Durant pulling out some miracle shots.

I know I flipped over to that even though I really wanted to see Cena/Wyatts as well, if I did it then plenty of people did.


----------



## The_Workout_Buddy

And the cycle begins again... it is what it is... there will be no _*boom era*_ in the near future; nobody in the real world cares bout WWE (or wrestling) except when the WM season is on... or when an tragedy happens.


----------



## NO!

Los Matadores vs. 3MB, Santino and Emma having cobra sex, Rusev squash match, another Paige/Aksana match with Tamina (the no. 1 contender) nowhere to be found, Usos vs. Rhodes Brothers...

The show did have some good moments but you could say that more than half of the episode was filler. The goal of Raw and Smackdown should be to give you something to look forward to (PPV). They still aren't doing this for the most part.


----------



## SpeedStick

I knew it The Boondocks were going to hit that main event


----------



## #Mark

If anything this rating speaks volumes of what fans want to see.

The opening hour did 4.22 million which is higher than last years hour one that did 4.19 million (with a HHH/Brock/Heyman segment to open the show). The second hour improved and held steady primarily because of Shield/Evolution and (maybe) because of Heyman and Cesaro. Everything else was filler and the ratings plummeted accordingly. People are not interested in filler matches or a played out Cena handicap match. The third hour was completely dry.

That said, there were definitely extenuating circumstances like the OT OKC/Memphis game, the fact that Easter sunday was the day before and hell maybe even the boondocks return like someone mentioned lol) but I'm more inclined to believe that people saw what they wanted to see in the first two hours then tuned out.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

I managed to catch the Evolution/Shield segment then bounced.

Playoff basketball is gonna beat out RAW for me every time, unless Rock or Austin is there.


----------



## Ace

Gotta love the IWC, had someone who wasn't an internet darling been getting the same push or using the same gimmick (c'mon it's plain retarded, a man jumping around chanting yes/no isn't mainevent material) Bryan is now everyone would be tearing him a new one. Can't wait till Reigns gets the same push. Super Reigns, same old shit... Here's one for you, hypocrites. :HHH2


----------



## Ace

And before you guys call me a bitter Punk mark, I'd be the first to shit over Punk if he ever came out jumping up and down chanting Yes/No.


----------



## THANOS

Punk Fan said:


> Gotta love the IWC, had someone who wasn't an internet darling been getting the same push or using the same gimmick (c'mon it's plain retarded, a man jumping around chanting yes/no isn't mainevent material) Bryan is now everyone would be tearing him a new one. Can't wait till Reigns gets the same push. Super Reigns, same old shit... Here's one for you, hypocrites. :HHH2


Let me get this right, so you're saying that the ENTIRE audience and all viewers are the IWC? :shocked: Wow.. I guess we have a much more powerful voice than WWE is giving us credit for .


----------



## JTB33b

Londrick said:


> Not surprised about the third hour. Bray is flopping hard.


Or maybe it's Cena. Bray wasn't in the segment alone.


----------



## Darkness is here

DAT DBRY RETURN GETTING BIG NUMBERS :ti

I think now we now who is the REAL draw :hhh2


----------



## #Mark

Darkness is here said:


> DAT DBRY RETURN GETTING BIG NUMBERS :ti
> 
> I think now we now who is the REAL draw :hhh2


:lmao

Your argument holds no weight because the first hour (Bryan's segment) did a significantly higher number than last year's opening hour which featured a HHH/Heyman promo and the year before that teased a Cena/Brock contract signing and had Edge's return to RAW. The only reason the the rating was bad is because of the dreadful third hour number. That blame falls on Cena and Wyatt.


----------



## THANOS

#Mark said:


> :lmao
> 
> Your argument holds no weight because the first hour (Bryan's segment) did a significantly higher number than last year's opening hour which featured a HHH/Heyman promo and the year before that teased a Cena/Brock contract signing and had Edge's return to RAW. The only reason the the rating was bad is because of the dreadful third hour number. That blame falls on Cena and Wyatt.


The best thing about Darkness is here, is that he always buries himself so you don't even need to bother :lol.


----------



## Cack_Thu

THANOS said:


> The best thing about Darkness is here, is that he always buries himself so you don't even need to bother :lol.





#Mark said:


> :lmao
> 
> Your argument holds no weight because the first hour (Bryan's segment) did a significantly higher number than last year's opening hour which featured a HHH/Heyman promo and the year before that teased a Cena/Brock contract signing and had Edge's return to RAW. The only reason the the rating was bad is because of the dreadful third hour number. That blame falls on Cena and Wyatt.


Both you butt hurt B+ super bearded midget marks are only making yourself look lame with your passive aggressive jibe at Darkness Is Here.I know it sucks but seems like Daniel Bryan is poised to take over the mantle of "The Biggest Draw On the Internet Only but not IRL" from CM BUM.

In your failed attempt to deride Darkness Is Here's post,you nerds failed to take into account the context of his post.

Last Week *without* Bryan,Raw did 3.2~3.3 iirc 
This week Bryan returns.DANIEL FUCKING BRYAN *returns*.
First hour numbers were approx.4.22 million.:mark:
Second hour numbers were approx.4.39 million.:side::woolcock:side:
His simple point was that numbers for Bryan's return in the first hour was less than HHH's Evolution numbers for the 2nd hour.

That's why he said


Darkness is here said:


> DAT DBRY RETURN GETTING BIG NUMBERS :ti
> 
> I think now we now who is the REAL draw :hhh2


^Obvious sarcasm.

Simple as that.

You're welcome!


----------



## Darkness is here

THANOS said:


> The best thing about Darkness is here, is that he always buries himself so you don't even need to bother :lol.


are'nt you the one who said db gets austin pops LOL.

@#mark

So.....now that db was'nt in the last hour........we now suddenly have to pretend that the third hour does'nt always lose viewers.


----------



## krai999

Darkness is here said:


> are'nt you the one who said db gets austin pops LOL.


um yes he does on average. Might i add he gets the biggest weekly reactions since austin


----------



## #Mark

Cack_Thu said:


> Both you butt hurt B+ super bearded midget marks are only making yourself look lame with your passive aggressive jibe at Darkness Is Here.I know it sucks but seems like Daniel Bryan is poised to take over the mantle of "The Biggest Draw On the Internet Only but not IRL" from CM BUM.
> 
> In your failed attempt to deride Darkness Is Here's post,you nerds failed to take into account the context of his post.
> 
> Last Week *without* Bryan,Raw did 3.2~3.3 iirc
> This week Bryan returns.DANIEL FUCKING BRYAN *returns*.
> First hour numbers were approx.4.22 million.:mark:
> Second hour numbers were approx.4.39 million.:side::woolcock:side:
> His simple point was that numbers for Bryan's return in the first hour was less than HHH's Evolution numbers for the 2nd hour.


I love when idiots try to comprehend something they're entirely clueless about. The second hour is virtually always the highest. It doesn't matter what act is on the first or the third, the peak viewership is normally during the second. Just last week the hour two RAW rating was the peak of the show with almost 200,000 more viewers than hour three which featured Evolution's reunion. Your whole argument is moot. Keep on embarrassing yourself though, I'm sure everyone else is enjoying it :lol


----------



## Starbuck

Thread is becoming GOAT again now that Bryan seems to have replaced Punk as the new defend/attack/discuss ratings guy. 

YES ERA RATINGS MOVEMENT IS UPON US

:dazzler


----------



## Darkness is here

@ krai

he has RARELY gotten a more than average pop at best BUT having said that his REACTIONS(NOT POPS) ARE HUGE.
For example: look at his pop on raw after wm, that place was full of marks yet his pop was average but just before his music hit listen to the REACTION he was getting.


----------



## WorldWrestlingFed

Daniel Bryan gets bigger pops than Austin ever did, Austin never had everyone in unison chant YES YES YES, that takes alot of talent, Austin would only get cheered when he came out, which anyone can do if done at the right surprising moment.


----------



## Starbuck

I'd say Austin gets WAY bigger _pops _than Bryan and by that I mean the initial reaction when his music hits. A lot of guys actually get much bigger _pops _than Bryan. But Bryan's _reactions_ are something different all together. Very few guys get the same _reactions _as Bryan during matches and at certain moments when he's gearing up for the YES chants.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

To paraphrase Mel Gibson:

GIVE ME BACK MY RATINGS BREAKDOWN!!!


----------



## Reaper

Interesting to realize that there's a distinction between pops and reactions in wrestling vernacular. I would've thought that they're essentially the same thing. 

I suppose that Bryan's entrances have lacked pops partly because his theme doesn't have that signature sound (Austin's breaking glass for example) like other stars. 

Also, unlike other superstars, the way people support Bryan is through the Yes chant instead of just popping for him. They wait for him to come out to lead them in the Yes Chant. 

It's different from the standard/typical cheer. I think that if Bryan didn't have the Yes Chant, his pops at entrances would improve. In a way, what I'm trying to say is that it's all inter-related when it comes to Bryan.


----------



## THANOS

Starbuck said:


> I'd say Austin gets WAY bigger _pops _than Bryan and by that I mean the initial reaction when his music hits. A lot of guys actually get much bigger _pops _than Bryan. But Bryan's _reactions_ are something different all together. Very few guys get the same _reactions _as Bryan during matches and at certain moments when he's gearing up for the YES chants.


:clap Very true. The best way to solve that is new entrance music. His current music has a weird intro and is just a generic rock take on Rise of the Valkyries. They should just give him Final Countdown and be done with it. That is the theme of a Main eventer, whether it's unanimously loved on this site or not.


----------



## Cack_Thu

#Mark said:


> I love when idiots try to *comprehend something* they're entirely clueless about. The second hour is virtually *always **the highest*. It doesn't matter what act is on the first or the third, the peak viewership is normally during the second. Just last week the hour two RAW rating was the peak of the show with almost 200,000 more viewers than hour three which featured Evolution's reunion. Your whole argument is moot. Keep on embarrassing yourself though, I'm sure everyone else is enjoying it :lol


Yadayadayada....

There are always exceptions of course,you fucking nerd.The most recent example being 07-04-2014 ratings - the night after WM.
Hour 1-5.313M 
Hour 2-5.094M 
Hour 3-5.032M 

Bryan opened the show.However it is becoming apparently clear as the year moves ahead that the big numbers were solely due to people's interest on the aftermath of Undertaker's loss.

This week Bryan returns and opens the show but

Hour 1-4.22M
Hour 2-4.39M

Notice any difference?Now comprehend that.
Pretty telling,isnt it?
Of course in your overzealous attempt to bite my ass for criticizing a smurf like Daniel Bryan,you,my friend,are only embarrassing yourself by typing out petty excuses.I dont have to dig deeper to point out-rating fluctuations .Point being,one is more than enough.It all boils down to engaging in your level of kiddish-crap style arguments and it is quite easy to steamroll through your fallacy and highlight that B+ Super bearded Daniel Bryan is simply NOT a draw;has never been a draw.But i'd rather NOT shatter a kid's illusions.
Tomorrow,when the WM 30 buyrates is disclosed and is found to be marginally better than expected,you probably will be the first fool to go around trumpeting that Bryan should be credited for positive buyrates - for he had opened and ME! the show.
Just dont let reality bite your ass into submission that you were only being an idiot par excellence.


----------



## #Mark

Cack_Thu said:


> Yadayadayada....
> 
> There are always exceptions of course,you fucking nerd.The most recent example being 07-04-2014 ratings - the night after WM.
> Hour 1-5.313M
> Hour 2-5.094M
> Hour 3-5.032M
> 
> Bryan opened the show.However it is becoming apparently clear as the year moves ahead that the big numbers were solely due to people's interest on the aftermath of Undertaker's loss.
> 
> This week Bryan returns and opens the show but
> 
> Hour 1-4.22M
> Hour 2-4.39M
> 
> Notice any difference?Now comprehend that.
> Pretty telling,isnt it?
> Of course in your overzealous attempt to bite my ass for criticizing a smurf like Daniel Bryan,you,my friend,are only embarrassing yourself by typing out petty excuses.I dont have to dig deeper to point out-rating fluctuations .Point being,one is more than enough.It all boils down to engaging in your level of kiddish-crap style arguments and it is quite easy to steamroll through your fallacy and highlight that B+ Super bearded Daniel Bryan is simply NOT a draw;has never been a draw.But i'd rather NOT shatter a kid's illusions.
> Tomorrow,when the WM 30 buyrates is disclosed and is found to be marginally better than expected,you probably will be the first fool to go around trumpeting that Bryan should be credited for positive buyrates - for he had opened and ME! the show.
> Just dont let reality bite your ass into submission that you were only being an idiot par excellence.


Once again, you obviously have no idea what you're talking about and i'm really disappointed in myself for even engaging in an argument with someone who clearly has some sort of mental deficiency. You bring up the post Mania RAW to validate your argument for why the opening hour this week was marginally lower than the second? Do you not realize how idiotic that is? WM 30 was one of the most eventful shows in years. Of course the opening hour was going to surpass the other two. There was obvious intrigue in the aftermath of the WM, so naturally the opening hour will have the highest rating. Not to mention the show opened hot with the Bryan/HHH confrontation and was immediately followed by a John Cena match. Of course that hour was going to be the highest of the week, especially in comparison to this week which opened with Bryan and was followed by Sheamus/Barrett. Anyways, by that same token, the opening of the 4/7/14 RAW was Bryan and the second hour featured the follow up to Taker/Brock.. So by using your brainless logic because Bryan was in the opening hour and Taker/Brock was in the second, that would mean the follow up to Bryan winning the title was the biggest draw. Just like Cesaro/Henry, Rusev/Woods, and Swagger/Sheamus was a bigger draw than Evolution last week. See how stupid you sound when trying to use hour numbers and not quarter-hours to try to argue which segment was the bigger draw?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Speaking of quarter hours... didn't get any for last week, so far haven't gotten any for this week.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Now you Bryan marks are gonna have to deal with the same anti-smark Cheeto neckbeards that trolled MUH BOI Philly B for 434 days unk


----------



## KingLobos

IDONTSHIV said:


> To paraphrase Mel Gibson:
> 
> GIVE ME BACK MY RATINGS BREAKDOWN!!!


Little OT on your sig

When the hell as the Rock ever had that shitty spinner belt? Looks awful and blasphemous. Not even he can make it look good LOL.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

The only time Rock had that belt was the time between beating Punk and getting the new belt. WWE used that pic to do a timeline of champions on their website.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Just so you guys know, I do plan on responding to Sonnen's post, but that'll have to wait until after finals week.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

#Mark said:


> I love when idiots try to comprehend something they're entirely clueless about. The second hour is virtually always the highest. It doesn't matter what act is on the first or the third, the peak viewership is normally during the second. Just last week the hour two RAW rating was the peak of the show with almost 200,000 more viewers than hour three which featured Evolution's reunion. Your whole argument is moot. Keep on embarrassing yourself though, I'm sure everyone else is enjoying it :lol


Meltzer agreed with you about the first hour. This might be educational for some trying to attack Bryan for the first hour being lower than the second this week. That and without the quarter hours breakdown how can you compare segments fairly?



> The hourly breakdown was 4.22 million in the first hour, 4.40 million in the second hour and 3.80 million in the third hour.
> *Traditionally at this time of the year, it is the first hour that is the lowest, and then there is growth in the second hour and the third hour is the highest. The last two weeks, because of the Mania curiosity and the Warrior special, the audience has been there at 8 p.m. instead of tuning in later, and it also boosted the ratings up well beyond what a normal show would do. However, it is very rare to see a third hour decline at this level in the post daylight savings time period. *


----------



## THANOS

IDONTSHIV said:


> Meltzer agreed with you about the first hour. This might be educational for some trying to attack Bryan for the first hour being lower than the second this week. That and without the quarter hours breakdown how can you compare segments fairly?


So what Meltzer is saying, more or less, is that people must have really really REALLY been disinterested in what was on in that 3rd hour :shocked:.

:wyatt vs :cena3 must have been the only bright spot among a bunch of crap, but I guess we'll have to wait and see to be sure.


----------



## MaybeLock

THANOS said:


> So what Meltzer is saying, more or less, is that people must have really really REALLY been disinterested in what was on in that 3rd hour :shocked:.
> 
> :wyatt vs :cena3 must have been the only bright spot among a bunch of crap, but I guess we'll have to wait and see to be sure.


We all know putting Cena in 3rd hour is a really bad move, since all his fans are already in bed by that time


----------



## Cack_Thu

#Mark said:


> Once again, you obviously have no idea what you're talking about and i'm really disappointed in myself for even engaging in an argument with someone who clearly has some sort of mental deficiency. You bring up the post Mania RAW to validate your argument for why the opening hour this week was marginally lower than the second? Do you not realize how idiotic that is? WM 30 was one of the most eventful shows in years. Of course the opening hour was going to surpass the other two. There was obvious intrigue in the aftermath of the WM, so naturally the opening hour will have the highest rating. Not to mention the show opened hot with the Bryan/HHH confrontation and was immediately followed by a John Cena match. Of course that hour was going to be the highest of the week, especially in comparison to this week which opened with Bryan and was followed by Sheamus/Barrett. Anyways, by that same token, the opening of the 4/7/14 RAW was Bryan and the second hour featured the follow up to Taker/Brock.. So by using your brainless logic because Bryan was in the opening hour and Taker/Brock was in the second, that would mean the follow up to Bryan winning the title was the biggest draw. Just like Cesaro/Henry, Rusev/Woods, and Swagger/Sheamus was a bigger draw than Evolution last week. See how stupid you sound when trying to use hour numbers and not quarter-hours to try to argue which segment was the bigger draw?


What's your point,kid?That B+ Daniel Bryan,is actually a draw?Or was a draw before?Quit beating around the bush with your standard petty excuses.Daniel Bryan is NOT a draw;has never been a draw,has no background of ever being a draw despite receiving so called "Austin Level" pops.:lol He is a huge,huge,i mean huuuuuuuge and i repeat HUUUUUUUUUUUUGEEEE draw but ONLY on the internet.Sucks to be a mark like you.I foresee next year this time around you'd be arguing like a fool about Daniel Bryan being a draw but never getting that chance and he was always buried or booked ineffectively,topping that sensational cum non-nonsensical deluded CM Bum mark,Sonnen Says. 



IDONTSHIV said:


> Meltzer agreed with you about the first hour. This might be educational for some trying to attack Bryan for the first hour being lower than the second this week. That and without the quarter hours breakdown how can you compare segments fairly?


Thanks for pitching in your savior,icon,idol-Dave Meltzer's opinion.

@hashtagMark
Even Dave Meltzer is absolutely convinced that Bryan simply cant draw or in other words,isnt a draw.Please contradict Dave Meltzer's opinion and prove to everyone why Bryan marks like you are simply insufferable fools.You approve his opinions when it suits you but reject his opinions when it contradict your's.



> According to Dave Meltzer Bryan is not a ticket seller


http://camelclutchblog.com/the-ugly-truth-about-daniel-bryan/


----------



## Cack_Thu

#Mark said:


> *Once again, you obviously have no idea what you're talking about and i'm really disappointed in myself for even engaging in an argument with someone who clearly has some sort of mental deficiency. You bring up the post Mania RAW to validate your argument for why the opening hour this week was marginally lower than the second? Do you not realize how idiotic that is? *


Fwiw,if only you had 2 brain cells to rub together,you would have figured out by now that i was just addressing the factual inconsistencies in your arguments.But alas...


----------



## #Mark

Cack_Thu said:


> What's your point,kid?That B+ Daniel Bryan,is actually a draw?Or was a draw before?Quit beating around the bush with your standard petty excuses.Daniel Bryan is NOT a draw;has never been a draw,has no background of ever being a draw despite receiving so called "Austin Level" pops.:lol He is a huge,huge,i mean huuuuuuuge and i repeat HUUUUUUUUUUUUGEEEE draw but ONLY on the internet.Sucks to be a mark like you.I foresee next year this time around you'd be arguing like a fool about Daniel Bryan being a draw but never getting that chance and he was always buried or booked ineffectively,topping that sensational cum non-nonsensical deluded CM Bum mark,Sonnen Says.
> 
> 
> Thanks for pitching in your savior,icon,idol-Dave Meltzer's opinion.
> 
> @hashtagMark
> Even Dave Meltzer is absolutely convinced that Bryan simply cant draw or in other words,isnt a draw.Please contradict Dave Meltzer's opinion and prove to everyone why Bryan marks like you are simply insufferable fools.You approve his opinions when it suits you but reject his opinions when it contradict your's.
> 
> 
> 
> http://camelclutchblog.com/the-ugly-truth-about-daniel-bryan/


So you concede defeat because you realize how utterly moronic your original argument was? I take solace in the fact that I educated you on how idiotic it is to judge segments by hour numbers. It always feels good to help someone as empty-headed as yourself. 

What exactly does citing a random blog from three months ago that doesn't even take into context what Meltzer was saying or feature exact figures prove? if you even read anything Meltzer is saying now you'd see he's confident about Bryan's drawing ability. The last two months every segment he was in has topped the night, including one segment in march that had the highest gain in viewers since the Rock was on TV. The updated buys has shown that his PPV numbers were pretty damn good (including NOC 13 producing 15,000 more buys than the title unification match at TLC, HIAC 2013 being the highest in that PPV's history, and Survivor Series 2013 being the lowest in that PPV's history when they tried replacing Bryan with Show, not to mention Bryan headlining the highest grossing Mania of all time). So your argument is dated. You're a bigger idiot than I thought (which is definitely saying something) if you think the WWE would build Wrestlemania 30 around Bryan if he wasn't a signifcant draw.


----------



## CHIcagoMade

TheGMofGods said:


> Just so you guys know, I do plan on responding to Sonnen's post, but that'll have to wait until after finals week.


Longest post of all time incoming.

:mark: :mark: :mark:


----------



## Darkness is here

Cack_Thu said:


> What's your point,kid?That B Daniel Bryan,is actually a draw?Or was a draw before?Quit beating around the bush with your standard petty excuses.Daniel Bryan is NOT a draw;has never been a draw,has no background of ever being a draw despite receiving so called "Austin Level" pops.:lol He is a huge,huge,i mean huuuuuuuge and i repeat HUUUUUUUUUUUUGEEEE draw but ONLY on the internet.Sucks to be a mark like you.I foresee next year this time around you'd be arguing like a fool about Daniel Bryan being a draw but never getting that chance and he was always buried or booked ineffectively,topping that sensational cum non-nonsensical deluded CM Bum mark,Sonnen Says.
> 
> 
> Thanks for pitching in your savior,icon,idol-Dave Meltzer's opinion.
> 
> @hashtagMark
> Even Dave Meltzer is absolutely convinced that Bryan simply cant draw or in other words,isnt a draw.Please contradict Dave Meltzer's opinion and prove to everyone why Bryan marks like you are simply insufferable fools.*You approve his opinions when it suits you but reject his opinions when it contradict your's.*
> 
> 
> 
> http://camelclutchblog.com/the-ugly-truth-about-daniel-bryan/


that is ssooo true, the other day when the report said cena selles 5x more merch than cena, everyone was going like:

''how can you believe that?
Meltzer with his usual bullshit''

that's the hypocricy of bryan fans.




#Mark said:


> *You're a bigger idiot than I thought (which is definitely saying something) if you think the WWE would build Wrestlemania 30 around Bryan if he wasn't a signifcant draw.*


oh!...this thing again......bryan was ONLY given the authority because punk left, if not for him leaving he would've opened wm with sheamus.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

CHIcagoMade said:


> Longest post of all time incoming.
> 
> :mark: :mark: :mark:


This is going to be legendary! :mark:


----------



## #Mark

Darkness is here said:


> that is ssooo true, the other day when the report said cena selles 5x more merch than cena, everyone was going like:
> 
> ''how can you believe that?
> Meltzer with his usual bullshit''
> 
> that's the hypocricy of bryan fans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh!...this thing again......bryan was ONLY given the authority because punk left, if not for him leaving he would've opened wm with sheamus.


Bryan was given the Authority because the fans (you know, the paying customers) told the WWE that Bryan was their guy and the WWE acted accordingly. Thus making him a draw. I love how you disregarded everything else in my post, looks like you can't spew your usual garbage when actual facts and figures are concerned.


----------



## Cack_Thu

#Mark said:


> So you concede defeat because you realize how utterly moronic your original argument was? I take solace in the fact that I educated you on how idiotic it is to judge segments by hour numbers. It always feels good to help someone as empty-headed as yourself.
> 
> What exactly does citing a random blog from three months ago that doesn't even take into context what Meltzer was saying or feature exact figures prove? if you even read anything Meltzer is saying now you'd see he's confident about Bryan's drawing ability. The last two months every segment he was in has topped the night, including one segment in march that had the highest gain in viewers since the Rock was on TV. The updated buys has shown that his PPV numbers were pretty damn good (including NOC 13 producing 15,000 more buys than the title unification match at TLC, HIAC 2013 being the highest in that PPV's history, and Survivor Series 2013 being the lowest in that PPV's history when they tried replacing Bryan with Show, not to mention Bryan headlining the highest grossing Mania of all time). So your argument is dated. You're a bigger idiot than I thought (which is definitely saying something) if you think the WWE would build Wrestlemania 30 around Bryan if he wasn't a signifcant draw.


Great,more wishfull thinking.Like i said before,my initial posts about hourly breakdowns were laced with sarcasm to highlight your factual inconsistency but alas,if only you could muster up 2 brain cells..
More Ad Hominems my way,please.It makes your inept arguments sound that much...inept.

http://whatculture.com/wwe/wwe-analysis-daniel-bryan-weaker-live-event-draw-john-cena.php

Dont tell me Bryan is such a HUGE star that throngs of audience members that give him the so-called "Austin Level" receptions at live events are *NOT* so interested in watching him at house shows,eh?Still got more excuses in your panties?


----------



## Darkness is here

@#mark

get your head out of your ass and accept a SIMPLE FACT....wwe does'nt give a shit about fans they continued the original plans for wm untill punk walked away.


----------



## kokepepsi

> Cena-led houseshow would draw about 476 less people than the previous average.
> Bryan-led houseshow would draw about 1,237 less people than the previous average.
> If they were both at the event, it would draw about 189 more people than the previous average.
> Cena houseshows outdraw the Bryan houseshows by an average of 761 people.
> 
> Read more at http://whatculture.com/wwe/wwe-anal...-event-draw-john-cena.php#TZxsFXFORrCCVevF.99


:ti
oh boy


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Damn it, Thanos! Where are you? #Mark is gettin' double-teamed over here!


----------



## Sweettre15

Are we really arguing that Daniel Bryan isn't a draw? Is it just fair to say he doesn't sell as much Merch as Cena but is still A top draw?

Bryan's still dominates viewership in most quarter hour rating breakdowns for Raw

He's now NUMBER 2 in Merch sales and even from various reports, The Arena would would either be sold out or almost sold out when he was headlining house shows with Kane a couple months ago.

People bring up the hit/miss house shows from his first Main event push but that was then and this is now. So can we relax on the pissing contest here?


----------



## vanboxmeer

Daniel Bryan can be a draw, but not more than Cena. This is very clear in the numbers. You don't need 100 pages of posts of playing circular logic that goes nowhere. Saves your sanity.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Darkness is here said:


> that is ssooo true, the other day when the report said cena selles 5x more merch than cena, everyone was going like:
> 
> ''how can you believe that?
> Meltzer with his usual bullshit''
> 
> that's the hypocricy of bryan fans.


I'm pretty sure Bryan fans are smart enough to make such an idiotic error like "a report said Cena sells (NOT selles) 5x more merch than CENA"

I mean holy crap man, just give it up already. 



CHIcagoMade said:


> Longest post of all time incoming.
> 
> :mark: :mark: :mark:


Isn't this baiting?


----------



## Darkness is here

BY GAWD I made a spelling mistake.....I don't have the right to live now.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Darkness is here said:


> BY GAWD I made a spelling mistake.....I don't have the right to live now.


:lmao

Holy shit. You really don't get it do you? Here, I'll do it again. This time READ.

"a report said Cena selles 5x more merch than *CENA* (this part, right here, do you see it now? Do I need an arrow or traffic signal to point towards it?)"


----------



## Darkness is here

Well....considering the fact it was already midnight here at that time, I can surely get a pass.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Darkness is here said:


> Well....considering the fact it was already midnight here at that time, I can surely get a pass.


Bullshit I've Aced college essays while doing them at three in the morning...in fifteen minutes. Fuck your midnight.


----------



## Darkness is here

Writing an essay and posting on a forum are two different things, you have to be extra carefull while writing an essay.
It seems like you did'nt liked how I exposed your fellow bryan marks so.......if you want to call me an idoit for that(my mistake)......then you're welcomed.

Btw Iam sleeping now and won't be able to reply to you, good night.


----------



## Londrick

Thankfully Cena was in the main event to bring the numbers up

...

:ti


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

Darkness is here said:


> Writing an essay and posting on a forum are two different things, you have to be extra carefull while writing an essay.
> It seems like you did'nt liked how I exposed your fellow bryan marks so.......if you want to call me an idoit for that(my mistake)......then you're welcomed.
> 
> Btw Iam sleeping now and won't be able to reply to you, good night.


I should, since the only thing you exposed in regards to them was how much smarter they are than you, but instead I'll just play nice and say your posts make my pop-tarts taste like shit.


----------



## elo

The Cena v Bryan stuff is just pointless, Cena has been on national television for 12 years, had 10+ world title reigns, has been on pretty much every talk show all over the world - his name is synonymous with the WWE brand period and he is the top draw, star etc etc etc.

Enough.


----------



## kokepepsi

Hard statistical analysis showing Bryan is not a strong draw yet "its not fair comparing him to cena 10yr top guy"

Hour that has segment with Bryan gets the most viewers "BRYAN OMG TOP DRAW NEXT AUSTIN"

Point is most of you talk out of your asses without considering the vast issues when trying to asses who is a draw
(and yes that cenavsbryan house show drawing analysis is missing a lot important variables that affect the numbers, but still it is useful)


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

Bryan draws 0 money, so the only logical explanation as to his popularity with audiences is that its the same cavalry of 1000 Cheetobeard virgin smarks following the WWE Grateful Dead-like to every single show they do with the sole intention of hijacking it for their midget god and fooling poor Vince that Bryan is the biggest thing since the Fleshlight.

I cannot be refuted on this point.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Bryan draws 0 money, so the only logical explanation as to his popularity with audiences is that its the same cavalry of 1000 Cheetobeard virgin smarks following the WWE Grateful Dead-like to every single show they do with the sole intention of hijacking it for their midget god and fooling poor Vince that Bryan is the biggest thing since the Fleshlight.
> 
> I cannot be refuted on this point.



The mark wars have ended. This last point has checkmated everyone.


----------



## ChickMagnet12

2012: Face being pushed to the moon as champ, "LOL CANT DRAW"

2014: Face being pushed to the moon as champ, "LOL CANT DRAW"

WWE is still here, I doubt they care.


----------



## AnthonyMichaelHall

IDONTSHIV said:


> The mark wars have ended. This last point has checkmated everyone.


Thank you for the kind words brother; I like to fancy myself as the Gary Kasparov of this forum.


----------



## Sweettre15

Y'all are STILL going on with this pissing contest?

Cena and Bryan are BOTH top draws...What is so fucking hard to understand about that?

Cena is number 1 in Merch Sales, Daniel Bryan is number 2 in Merch Sales.

Both are over with the crowds at both house shows and tapings.

As for the whole first hour breakdown nonsense, Daniel Bryan's segment didn't take up the whole hour and for some reason Wade Keller didn't release a Quarter Hour segment breakdown, so we can see what raised and brought down viewers so this pissing contest bringing up OLD information to suit your agenda does nothing.


----------



## TheGodsofChristmas

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> *Bryan draws 0 money*, so the only logical explanation as to his popularity with audiences is that its the same cavalry of 1000 Cheetobeard virgin smarks following the WWE Grateful Dead-like to every single show they do with the sole intention of hijacking it for their midget god and fooling poor Vince that Bryan is the biggest thing since the Fleshlight.
> 
> I cannot be refuted on this point.


So we're just gonna ignore the fact he's their number 2 merchandise seller?


----------



## johncenathemesong

Randy orton Backlash


----------



## johncenathemesong

http://randy-orton-theme-song.tumblr.com


----------



## Uerfer

kokepepsi said:


> :ti
> oh boy


Bryan headlines houseshows with Kane while Cena does it with Orton. Come on, let's be real here, no one can draw big crowds regularly in 2014, headlining with Kane. Not even the Rock.


----------



## JY57

Uerfer said:


> Bryan headlines houseshows with Kane while Cena does it with Orton. Come on, let's be real here, no one can draw big crowds regularly in 2014, headlining with Kane. Not even the Rock.


When he faced Wyatt & Orton on house shows Cena still averaged better attendance on the others if not mistaken.


----------



## Uerfer

JY57 said:


> When he faced Wyatt & Orton on house shows Cena still averaged better attendance on the others if not mistaken.


Don't know for sure, do you have the attendance figures? Maybe valid reasoning does. 

In any case, even if it is true, I don't think the difference would be big enough to establish the claim that Cena matters more as a star long term compared to Bryan. If you put Cena/Kane for the next ten house shows and pair Bryan with Orton/batista at the same time for the other crew, I guarantee Bryan would do significantly well on average. Basically, we need the average over a long period of time for both these cases to determine if Cena is truly much more valuable than Bryan long term.


----------



## WWE

AnthonyMichaelHall said:


> Bryan draws 0 money, so the only logical explanation as to his popularity with audiences is that its the same cavalry of 1000 Cheetobeard virgin smarks following the WWE Grateful Dead-like to every single show they do with the sole intention of hijacking it for their midget god and fooling poor Vince that Bryan is the biggest thing since the Fleshlight.
> 
> I cannot be refuted on this point.


:lmao


----------



## krai999

i'm happy bryan is moving up now from having these endless drawing power feuds with punk in the midcard. Glad he's being moved to the main event where he's now feuding with cena for who could draw.


----------



## THANOS

> WWE ran a live event from the Ricoh Coliseum in Toronto, Ontario, Canada on Friday night. Wrestling News World reader Frank Salemi was in attendance and passed along the following results:
> 
> *Refunds were offered through the second match due to WWE World Heavyweight Champion Daniel Bryan not being there. Bryan and Brie Bella were given the weekend off due to the death of his father.*
> 
> source: WNW/dailywrestlingnews/Pwtorch


What's this all about? I thought Bryan was not a draw from the information the more "knowledgeable" posters here told us? Why would people be given refunds that weren't even "drawn" in to the show for Bryan?

I guess WWE must not be aware that "Bryan is not a draw yet" like you guys are?


----------



## #Mark

kokepepsi said:


> Hard statistical analysis showing Bryan is not a strong draw yet "its not fair comparing him to cena 10yr top guy"
> 
> Hour that has segment with Bryan gets the most viewers "BRYAN OMG TOP DRAW NEXT AUSTIN"
> 
> Point is most of you talk out of your asses without considering the vast issues when trying to asses who is a draw
> (and yes that cenavsbryan house show drawing analysis is missing a lot important variables that affect the numbers, but still it is useful)


So the house show numbers (that not only fail to factor in market size but also fail to mention the cards: Bryan headlines against Kane while Cena headlines against Orton with the Wyatt Family and The Shield also on his tour up until less than a month ago when the Shield switched to Bryan's tour) are "useful" but the data that shows that Bryan segments have consistently been the highest for the past two months aren't? Where's the objectivity? No one is saying that Bryan is this megastar draw. No one is trying to argue that he's surpassed Cena. What we are saying is that his insane crowd reactions and recent ratings patterns are proving that he has momentum that few have had in recent years. HHH putting him over as strongly as he did cements that. WrestleMania 30 centering around Bryan's chase and being as successful as it was also cements that assertion.



JY57 said:


> When he faced Wyatt & Orton on house shows Cena still averaged better attendance on the others if not mistaken.


I don't think they've ran Orton/Bryan since the fall.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

THANOS said:


> What's this all about? I thought Bryan was not a draw from the information the more "knowledgeable" posters here told us? Why would people be given refunds if weren't even "drawn" in to the show for Bryan?
> 
> I guess WWE must not be aware that "Bryan is not a draw yet" like you guys are?


SWERVE- No refunds were given because no one attended the show anyway.


----------



## kokepepsi

THANOS said:


> What's this all about? I thought Bryan was not a draw from the information the more "knowledgeable" posters here told us? Why would people be given refunds if weren't even "drawn" in to the show for Bryan?
> 
> I guess WWE must not be aware that "Bryan is not a draw yet" like you guys are?


:ti
Because he is the champion?
Yes I know
"Why would they make him the champion if he isn't a draw"
:nash

Bryan is a draw, how strong WE DON'T KNOW YET IS THE POINT!


----------



## THANOS

#BadNewsSanta said:


> SWERVE- No refunds were given because no one attended the show anyway.


Ah that's got to be it :lol. How could I be so absentminded?


----------



## THANOS

kokepepsi said:


> :ti
> Because he is the champion?
> Yes I know
> "Why would they make him the champion if he isn't a draw"
> :nash
> 
> Bryan is a draw, how strong WE DON'T KNOW YET IS THE POINT!


You do know people were given refunds, on house shows, back when Bryan was feuding with the Wyatt Family, and injured himself with that concussion shortly before the Rumble right? I mean you can't really use the "he's the champion" excuse there can you.


----------



## kokepepsi

#Mark said:


> So the house show numbers (that not only fail to factor in market size but also fail to mention the cards: Bryan headlines against Kane while Cena headlines against Orton with the Wyatt Family and The Shield also on his tour up until less than a month ago when the Shield switched to Bryan's tour) are "useful" but the data that shows that Bryan segments have consistently been the highest for the past two months aren't? Where's the objectivity? No one is saying that Bryan is this megastar draw. No one is trying to argue that he's surpassed Cena. What we are saying is that his insane crowd reactions and recent ratings patterns are proving that he has momentum that few have had in recent years. HHH putting him over as strongly as he did cements that. WrestleMania 30 centering around Bryan's chase and being as successful as it was also cements that assertion.


I wrote in the same post that the analysis is flawed but its the best one can do.
What I was hoping people would notice is how house show business attendance is down from baseline.:argh:

Ratings is another issue, because the same segments always gain and gains are dependent on prior loses from past segments that I am not even gonna go there.
DB went from the biggest loser in terms of viewers to a one of the biggest, I know that :axel 

I am not saying he isn't a draw.
not sure what my point is anymore


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

As a Bryan fan, I am thrilled to see he is #2 to Cena. Bryan sells more merch than anyone not named Cena. Bryan has only 36 items listed for sale now as opposed to Punk having something like 72 products. Bryan is consistently drawing higher tv ratings than Cena and is the clear favorite of the live crowds. He is entrusted to headline one of their two tours. He is consistently having a 4 star plus match at every ppv this year. The company memo slated him as second highest to Cena overall, and I'm fine with that. Bryan has only been champion for20 days right now and has only received a renewed push since after The Rumble. He has ascended to be #2 in a short time. His professional future is looking up and is only going to grow stronger. I just hope he can get a better run of good news in his personal life after the recent tragedies.


----------



## kokepepsi

IDONTSHIV said:


> As a Bryan fan, I am thrilled to see he is #2 to Cena. Bryan sells more merch than anyone not named Cena. Bryan has only 36 items listed for sale now as opposed to Punk having something like 72 products. Bryan is consistently drawing higher tv ratings than Cena and is the clear favorite of the live crowds. He is entrusted to headline one of their two tours. He is consistently having a 4 star plus match at every ppv this year. The company memo slated him as second highest to Cena overall, and I'm fine with that. Bryan has only been champion for20 days right now and has only received a renewed push since after The Rumble. He has ascended to be #2 in a short time. His professional future is looking up and is only going to grow stronger. I just hope he can get a better run of good news in his personal life after the recent tragedies.


Why can't all Bryan marks be like this guy!!!!!!!!!

:clap:clap:clap


----------



## #Mark

kokepepsi said:


> I wrote in the same post that the analysis is flawed but its the best one can do.
> What I was hoping people would notice is how house show business attendance is down from baseline.:argh:
> 
> Ratings is another issue, because the same segments always gain and gains are dependent on prior loses from past segments that I am not even gonna go there.
> DB went from the biggest loser in terms of viewers to a one of the biggest, I know that :axel
> 
> I am not saying he isn't a draw.
> not sure what my point is anymore


You're absolutely right. The losses from previous segments contribute to the gains in the next segment. But when a show features guys like Hogan, Taker, Lesnar, HHH, Cena, Batista, Orton like it was during the RTWM and Bryan is consistently the only guy to pop a huge rating that isn't some random fluke. IIRC they did Orton/Bryan for the millionth time at a terrible timeslot in March and it topped the night. I'm just saying Bryan deserves some credit for becoming a ratings mover. Is Bryan a major draw? Not yet. But he's proving to have momentum to become one. You have to remember, Cena did not becoming this major drawing figure in 2005. It took several matches with JBL, Kurt, Y2J, and finally HHH to finally push him to the top.


----------



## DoubtGin

> Friday's episode of WWE SmackDown scored a 1.77 cable rating, down from the previous week's 1.96 rating. This is the lowest SmackDown rating of 2014 so far. As noted, the show drew 2.67 million viewers, also down from the previous week.


Uh.


----------



## Uerfer

^ went against NBA playoffs.


----------



## D.M.N.

WWE Entertainment	USA	8:00 PM	4512	1.7
WWE Entertainment	USA	9:00 PM	4667	1.8
WWE Entertainment	USA	10:00 PM	4652	1.8


----------



## Mr. Yes

How was the third hour so up this week? What was different? HMMM??? Clearly Bryan is not ratings.


----------



## WWE

:HHH2 :rko2 :bigdave :flair


----------



## DoubtGin

:cena3 in the lowest-rated hour again.


Shockingly good ratings, to be honest. 11% up from last week.


----------



## D.M.N.

With all the April ratings in, here is how Raw is rated this month versus 2012 and 2013: 

2012 - 4.59 million (4 x 2 hours and 1 x 3 hour)
2013 - 4.35 million (5 x 3 hours)
2014 - 4.67 million (4 x 3 hours)

So yeah, I imagine Vince is pretty happy!


----------



## dxbender

You know for a fact next week on Raw we'll get:

DID YOU KNOW:
Last week, Monday Night Raw had more viewers than:
NBA Playoffs on TNT
Bones on FOX
Person of Interest on CBS


----------



## THANOS

D.M.N. said:


> With all the April ratings in, here is how Raw is rated this month versus 2012 and 2013:
> 
> 2012 - 4.59 million (4 x 2 hours and 1 x 3 hour)
> 2013 - 4.35 million (5 x 3 hours)
> 2014 - 4.67 million (4 x 3 hours)
> 
> So yeah, I imagine Vince is pretty happy!


So the overall interest coming out of WM 28 with Punk as champion and Rock beating Cena, and Cena leaving WM 29 as champion, is lower than the interest coming out of WM 30 several weeks after fans could use the streak ending as the reason?

Well then...

:bryan :bryan :yes :yes


----------



## CookiePuss

THANOS said:


> So the overall interest coming out of WM 28 with Punk as champion and Rock beating Cena, and Cena leaving WM 29 as champion, is lower than the interest coming out of WM 30 several weeks after fans could use the streak ending as the reason?
> 
> Well then...
> 
> :bryan :bryan :yes :yes


fpalm fpalm fpalm


----------



## THANOS

cookiepuss said:


> fpalm fpalm fpalm


Please refute it, just try .


----------



## CookiePuss

THANOS said:


> Please refute it, just try .


For what? You would claim the show has good ratings due to DBryan even when he's not on it. LOL


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

Third hour does great due to Bryan and HHH's mighty shoulders. I thought the show was a little meh, but the ratings thought otherwise.


----------



## THANOS

cookiepuss said:


> For what? You would claim the show has good ratings due to DBryan even when he's not on it. LOL


Overall interest after this past Mania is higher than the past two. Please tell me what this past mania was built around again? The fact that interest is still up, even after Brock Lesnar, the man who killed the streak, has left means something else is driving it. If you want to deny it beyond that go ahead, but I'm sure most of the intelligent posters on here would be hard pressed to not contribute a lot of that to Bryan, and the way he was spotlighted this Mania. Would he have become this big without HHH and Evolution, of course not, but that storyline sold Mania 30, and weeks after the interest in the product is still holding strong.

Bryan's storyline created this interest (as seen in ratings before Mania 30 and after in his segments) and Evolution, The Shield, The Wyatt's, as well as Bryan are keeping it.


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

DAT RATINGZ MONSTAH, D-BRY!!! :bryan


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

I can't speak for everyone, but I credit the night after Mania to Taker's streak ending, NOT the 3 weeks following... and I still do.

TBH, I didn't know Bryan was even going to be on Raw, but he fact the viewership is as high and consistent throughout for that abomination of an episode of Raw worries me. That being said, this week's success can be chalked up to the promotion for Stephanie's apology (which could be because of Bryan and people expecting him to show), and Shield/Evolution's continuation... also it being the lead in to a PPV helps a little bit.

Bottom line, great numbers, and April as a whole being as high as it was above the last couple of years I think should be credited to Bryan being champion primarily, even if his impact on the individual shows weren't quite as big as some would say... If that makes any sense (I'll explain later when I'm by a computer and don't have to type shit up on my phone).


----------



## Mr. WrestleMania

cookiepuss said:


> For what? You would claim the show has good ratings due to DBryan even when he's not on it. LOL


Yeah, kind of like Taker marks did the night after WM..


----------



## RatedR10

God damn, I'm so happy to see ratings haven't dropped like they usually do post-Wrestlemania. Dat boy D Bry + Evolution vs. The Shield bringing in the ratings. :yes


----------



## Londrick

Just got a text from Kevin Nash and he said that these numbers make it official, Bryan is no longer a vanilla midget and Bryan is now Bob Backlund approved.


----------



## JY57

final rating 3.25



> WWE Raw on Monday, April 28 rebounded to a 3.25 rating, up nine percent from last week's year-low 2.97 rating.
> 
> Raw was essentially even with a 3.26 rating two weeks ago for the Ultimate Warrior tribute show.
> 
> The demographic ratings indicate that all demos contributed to the ratings increase - the adults 18-49 (males & females) demo hit one of the highest points of the year, m18-49 hit a two-month high-point outside of post-WM30 Raw, and teen males had a similar result.
> 
> - Raw averaged 4.610 million viewers, up 11 percent from last week, but slightly below 4.770 million viewers two weeks ago.
> 
> Hourly Break Down: 4.512 million first hour viewers, 4.667 million second hour viewers, and only a slight decline to 4.652 million third hour viewers.
> 
> The third hour delivered the highest ratings of the show in the key males demos, which points to why the audience held up this week.
> 
> - On cable TV Monday night, Raw ranked #1 in overall viewers and #2 in key male demos behind the NBA Playoffs.
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: A poor show does not always translate to a poor TV rating, especially when WWE back-ended the show with notable actor Hugh Jackman at the top of the second hour, Daniel Bryan's return at the top of the third hour, and a Shield vs. Evolution angle centered on Randy Orton vs. Roman Reigns saved for the end of the show. Quarter-hours should be interesting to see if a few segments boosted the individual hours this week.


via PWTorch


----------



## DoubtGin

Some users want to credit the ratings being high to one single superstar only. Ugh.


----------



## Superhippy

RatedR10 said:


> God damn, I'm so happy to see ratings haven't dropped like they usually do post-Wrestlemania. Dat boy D Bry + Evolution vs. The Shield bringing in the ratings. :yes


That's pretty much the story. Last week the WWE had Bryan + Evolution + The Shield go on first and the last hour saw some of the worst ratings the WWE has seen in a long time. This week they kick off with Cena to force everyone to wait for the others.

Just wanted to throw out there too that the post WM Raw ratings were no doubt because the streak ended. It was on ESPN, CNN, pretty much everywhere. People tuned in because they wanted to see what Taker had to say, and he wasn't even there.


----------



## checkcola

JY57 said:


> final rating 3.25
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Caldwell's Analysis: A poor show does not always translate to a poor TV rating, especially when WWE back-ended the show with notable actor Hugh Jackman at the top of the second hour, Daniel Bryan's return at the top of the third hour, and a Shield vs. Evolution angle centered on Randy Orton vs. Roman Reigns saved for the end of the show. Quarter-hours should be interesting to see if a few segments boosted the individual hours this week.
> 
> 
> 
> via PWTorch
Click to expand...

So, star power trumps quality of programing ....


----------



## funnyfaces1

Well, looks like everybody drew. What are we gonna argue about now?


----------



## The Buryer

Bray/Cena bombing hard.


----------



## D.M.N.

Worth noting that Adults 18-49 increased throughout the show - and was the second highest number of the entire year. It's a really good, and encouraging number for the next few weeks.

May is traditionally though where things tend to collapse - if they can, they should keep Shield vs Evolution going, with Shield winning at Payback in Chicago.


----------



## THANOS

D.M.N. said:


> Worth noting that Adults 18-49 increased throughout the show - and was the second highest number of the entire year. It's a really good, and encouraging number for the next few weeks.
> 
> May is traditionally though where things tend to collapse - if they can, they should keep Shield vs Evolution going, with Shield winning at Payback in Chicago.


I agree. They should also try and convince Punk to return to have a "one and done" retirement match with Bryan at Payback, because that will generate interest and Punk will honor part of his contract on the way out. This could maybe leave the door open for a future return and prevent bridges burning down completely. Knowing what we've seen from Punk over the years, though, he'll ride out the last month of his contract and retire from wrestling forever, but here's hoping he changes his mind.


----------



## JY57

D.M.N. said:


> Worth noting that Adults 18-49 increased throughout the show - and was the second highest number of the entire year. It's a really good, and encouraging number for the next few weeks.
> 
> May is traditionally though where things tend to collapse - if they can, they should keep Shield vs Evolution going, with Shield winning at Payback in Chicago.


Batista likely going to be gone for awhile after Extreme Rules. They have to be creative to stay good in ratings especially with return of 24 next week (can't wait) & playoffs get deeper.


----------



## JY57

> The Raw ratings on Tele 5 in Germany are doing strong enough that the station sent out a press release, noting this past week’s rating at 10:15 p.m. Thursday night did 230,000 viewers in its third week (three weeks so far have grown from 110,000 to 190,000 to 230,000). Smackdown, on Saturday nights just after 11 p.m., did 100,000 viewers the first week, 80,000 the second 60,000 the third, but was up to 100,000, but that’s on a pay channel as opposed to free TV. Vintage Collection on Eurosport, which is free, did 120,000 viewers.


via Observer on ratings in Germany


----------



## tbp82

The hyped match was Reigns and Orton. WWE could (and it is thier opinion that matters) easily give credit for the rating to The Shield and Evolution.


----------



## Mr. Yes

18-49 Quarters in:


> *Show Peaks - m18-49 demo*
> 
> - Q10: The end of Bryan-Kane after the Paige vs. Brie Bella Divas Title match drew 1.918 and 1.955 million viewers.
> 
> - Q9: The Bryan/Brie-Stephanie McMahon exchange drew 1.859 million viewers at the top of the third hour.
> 
> - Q5: Jackman's skit with Damien Sandow and Dolph Ziggler drew 1.775 million viewers mid-way through, then the audience dropped off during the final four minutes.
> 
> - OR: The finish to Orton vs. Reigns drew 1.708 million viewers at 11:04 p.m. The remaining ten minutes for the extended beat down segment did not reach 1.7 million.
> 
> - Q8: The end of the Los Matadores-3MB match/skit drew 1.667 million viewers leading into the top of the third hour.
> 
> - Q1: The end of the Cena-Wyatt skit drew 1.620 million viewers.
> 
> ***
> 
> *Raw Break Down - m18-49 demo*
> 
> - Overall Show: 2.32 rating / 1.461 million viewers
> 
> - Q1: Raw opened with a 2.28 rating for the Cena-Wyatt segment.
> 
> - Q2: Raw fell to a show-low 2.05 rating for two commercial breaks and the first-half of The Usos vs. Ryback & Curtis Axel Tag Title match.
> 
> - Q3: Raw rebounded to a 2.28 rating for the end of the Tag Title match, one commercial, and non-wrestling segments.
> 
> - Q4: Raw fell to a 2.16 rating for two commercials and a Sheamus vs. Titus O'Neil brawl/match.
> 
> - Q5: Raw jumped to a 2.56 rating for Hugh Jackman's skit with Ziggler and Sandow. Plus, one commercial at the end.
> 
> - Q6: Raw fell back to a 2.26 rating for Jack Swagger vs. Cesaro in the odd heel vs. heel match-up and one commercial.
> 
> - Q7: Raw slipped to a 2.17 rating for Cody Rhodes vs. Alberto Del Rio, one commercial, and Rusev vs. Xavier Woods.
> 
> - Q8: Raw increased to a 2.28 rating for Los Matadores vs. 3MB, one commercial, and the first portion of the Bryan/Brie-Stephanie segment.
> 
> - Q9: Raw jumped to a 2.60 rating for Bryan/Brie-Stephanie, one commercial following the tease of Kane's mask out of the box, Paige vs. Brie Bella for the Divas Title, and the post-match crisis angle.
> 
> - Q10: Raw held on with a 2.49 rating, which included the final two minutes of the Bryan-Kane crisis angle as the peak minutes of the entire show. After the commercial, Raw followed up with backstage follow-up segments that also drew strongly.
> 
> Once the Bryan-Kane segments ended, Three-Hour Raw Fatigue set in...
> 
> - Q11: Raw fell to a 2.11 rating for two commercials and Wade Barrett vs. RVD in the IC Title #1 contender tournament finals.
> 
> - Q12: Raw increased to a 2.31 rating for Barrett-RVD post-match activity, one commercial, and main event ring introductions.
> 
> - Over-run: Raw scored a healthy 2.63 over-run for Ric Flair's appearance, Orton-Reigns in the main event, and the post-match brawl.


So applause due for Bryan and the main event segment.


----------



## Starbuck

Can't wait to see the fighting over 0.03 of a difference between 10pm and the overrun. Actually, can't wait to see the fighting over an entire show that pretty much drew a consistent 2.2 for everything outside the main segments which jumped to 2.6. Here, let me put it to rest right now, Bryan/Kane and Shield/Evolution ARE DRAWING TOGETHER IMAGINE THAT BUT HEY DING DING FIGHT PLEASE.


----------



## D.M.N.

3MB > :cena


----------



## Uerfer

Why is that the Q9, which drew 2.60 rating, average viewership is reported, but not the overrun average? 2.63 rating probably meant the viewership stayed consistent for the first few minutes before dropping and then recovering again towards the end, which should be the same with Q9, otherwise it would've outdrawn OR by a big margin. 

In anycase, its a shame we never get to see Bryan's individual performance in these quarters. It's always either stephanie or Hunter or both present with him all the time. Stephanie's presence usually makes the segment feel more important to viewers, we hardly ever get to determine how big of ratings draw Bryan has really become. Maybe once this authority angle finally ends and done with, we might get to see his true worth as a draw.


----------



## #Mark

Bryan topped the night in a match with Orton in a bad timeslot during the RTWM. I'm pretty sure he's becoming established ratings draw.. Especially since the one week he had off in March the segment that topped the night wasn't an Authority segment. Anyways, both parties are benefitting. The Authority is benefitting from working with a really hot babyface while Bryan is benefitting from working with a really hot heel act. Don't try to spin it like Bryan is getting carried by them because that certainly isn't the case.


----------



## Mr. Yes

#Mark said:


> Bryan topped the night in a match with Orton in a bad timeslot during the RTWM. I'm pretty sure he's becoming established ratings draw.. Especially since the one week he had off in March the segment that topped the night wasn't an Authority segment. Anyways, both parties are benefitting. The Authority is benefitting from working with a really hot babyface while Bryan is benefitting from working with a really hot heel act. Don't try to spin it like Bryan is getting carried by them because that certainly isn't the case.


It takes two to tango.


----------



## JY57

http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_78083.shtml#.U2FxIF64klI



> Monday's WWE Raw TV rating was boosted by three distinct peaks. And, like before WrestleMania, Daniel Bryan was the top draw of the show.
> 
> Bryan's segment with Brie Bella and Kane drew the most males 18-49 viewers of the show. This was followed by the first-half of the over-run for Roman Reigns vs. Randy Orton and Hugh Jackman's appearance at the top of the second hour.
> 
> Also, the opening segment involving John Cena and Bray Wyatt provided a boost to the first hour.
> 
> Show Peaks - m18-49 demo
> 
> - Q10: The end of Bryan-Kane after the Paige vs. Brie Bella Divas Title match drew 1.918 and 1.955 million viewers.
> 
> - Q9: The Bryan/Brie-Stephanie McMahon exchange drew 1.859 million viewers at the top of the third hour.
> 
> - Q5: Jackman's skit with Damien Sandow and Dolph Ziggler drew 1.775 million viewers mid-way through, then the audience dropped off during the final four minutes.
> 
> - OR: The finish to Orton vs. Reigns drew 1.708 million viewers at 11:04 p.m. The remaining ten minutes for the extended beat down segment did not reach 1.7 million.
> 
> - Q8: The end of the Los Matadores-3MB match/skit drew 1.667 million viewers leading into the top of the third hour.
> 
> - Q1: The end of the Cena-Wyatt skit drew 1.620 million viewers.
> 
> ***
> 
> Raw Break Down - m18-49 demo
> 
> - Overall Show: 2.32 rating / 1.461 million viewers
> 
> - Q1: Raw opened with a 2.28 rating for the Cena-Wyatt segment.
> 
> - Q2: Raw fell to a show-low 2.05 rating for two commercial breaks and the first-half of The Usos vs. Ryback & Curtis Axel Tag Title match.
> 
> - Q3: Raw rebounded to a 2.28 rating for the end of the Tag Title match, one commercial, and non-wrestling segments.
> 
> - Q4: Raw fell to a 2.16 rating for two commercials and a Sheamus vs. Titus O'Neil brawl/match.
> 
> - Q5: Raw jumped to a 2.56 rating for Hugh Jackman's skit with Ziggler and Sandow. Plus, one commercial at the end.
> 
> - Q6: Raw fell back to a 2.26 rating for Jack Swagger vs. Cesaro in the odd heel vs. heel match-up and one commercial.
> 
> - Q7: Raw slipped to a 2.17 rating for Cody Rhodes vs. Alberto Del Rio, one commercial, and Rusev vs. Xavier Woods.
> 
> - Q8: Raw increased to a 2.28 rating for Los Matadores vs. 3MB, one commercial, and the first portion of the Bryan/Brie-Stephanie segment.
> 
> - Q9: Raw jumped to a 2.60 rating for Bryan/Brie-Stephanie, one commercial following the tease of Kane's mask out of the box, Paige vs. Brie Bella for the Divas Title, and the post-match crisis angle.
> 
> - Q10: Raw held on with a 2.49 rating, which included the final two minutes of the Bryan-Kane crisis angle as the peak minutes of the entire show. After the commercial, Raw followed up with backstage follow-up segments that also drew strongly.
> 
> Once the Bryan-Kane segments ended, Three-Hour Raw Fatigue set in...
> 
> - Q11: Raw fell to a 2.11 rating for two commercials and Wade Barrett vs. RVD in the IC Title #1 contender tournament finals.
> 
> - Q12: Raw increased to a 2.31 rating for Barrett-RVD post-match activity, one commercial, and main event ring introductions.
> 
> - Over-run: Raw scored a healthy 2.63 over-run for Ric Flair's appearance, Orton-Reigns in the main event, and the post-match brawl.


----------



## Uerfer

For the authority, there is nothing to gain by working with Bryan. They have well built up credibility, whoever they feud with would instantly be elevated to the main event spot on RAW. Bryan can't do that with his opponents, he needs them. Regardless, I'm not trying to downplay Bryan, just that we never get to see how good he does on his own. Even this week, the advertised segment was "Stephanie issuing an apology to Bryan". She was obviously crucial part of it, what I'm saying is I would've liked to see how well Bryan vs Kane would've drawn individually without any involvement from Authority at all.


----------



## funnyfaces1

And once again, :bryan3 puts numbers on the board. Hard to get a handle on this double-edged sword. ushat

Wait, we don't have a Pusha T smiley?


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Bryan/Kane/Steph, Shield/Evolution, and Hugh Jackman/Sandow/Ziggler all drew really well. Whole show did well for that matter.


----------



## #Mark

Uerfer said:


> For the authority, there is nothing to gain by working with Bryan. They have well built up credibility, whoever they feud with would instantly be elevated to the main event spot on RAW. Bryan can't do that with his opponents, he needs them. Regardless, I'm not trying to downplay Bryan, just that we never get to see how good he does on his own. Even this week, the advertised segment was "Stephanie issuing an apology to Bryan". She was obviously crucial part of it, what I'm saying is I would've liked to see how well Bryan vs Kane would've drawn individually without any involvement from Authority at all.


I think you're overvaluing Stephanie. HHH, you're definitely right.. Stephanie, I don't think so. I'd also like to think there's something to gain working with Bryan because he's by far the most over act on the roster and he's the world champion. In any case, the peak viewership was during the post match of the Divas title match when Bryan and Kane were brawling not during the Stephanie portion of the segment. And if the Authority had this cachet wouldn't Evolution (an extension of the Authority) top the night? I agree that Kane/Bryan normally wouldn't be a hot program but that has a lot more to do with Kane then Bryan.


----------



## Happenstan

Uerfer said:


> They have well built up credibility, whoever they feud with would instantly be elevated to the main event spot on RAW. Bryan can't do that with his opponents, he needs them.


Bray Wyatt post Royal Rumble says hi. Bryan alone made Bray. No one took him serious before Bryan put him over so big.


----------



## Uerfer

What about it? Are you suggesting Bryan elevated Bray to a main event status? I don't think so, even though Bryan lost the match to Bray, the Rumble finish fuckery with Batista, the crowd reaction, plus Bryan coming out next night on RAW and acting like nothing happened, totally made Bray an afterthought. When it was all said and done, no one cared about Wyatt, Bryan was just too hot at the time. However, the short little feud with the shield following that and on-going saga with Cena has established Bray as a strong top act. Also, for some weird reason they placed Bryan/wyatt as the main event over Cena/Orton which was going on at the time. Probably has a lot to do with Bray's push than Bryan, if it was say... Del rio or even Sheamus in that spot, I doubt they would've gotten that main event focus over Cena/Orton.


----------



## Fissiks

Uerfer said:


> What about it? Are you suggesting Bryan elevated Bray to a main event status? I don't think so, even though Bryan lost the match to Bray, the Rumble finish fuckery with Batista, the crowd reaction, plus Bryan coming out next night on RAW and acting like nothing happened, totally made Bray an afterthought. When it was all said and done, no one cared about Wyatt, Bryan was just too hot at the time. However, the short little feud with the shield following that and on-going saga with Cena has established Bray as a strong top act. Also, for some weird reason they placed Bryan/wyatt as the main event over Cena/Orton which was going on at the time. Probably has a lot to do with Bray's push than Bryan, if it was say... Del rio or even Sheamus in that spot, I doubt they would've gotten that spot.


Yes it did elevate Bray. Bray became a fan favorite after that potential Match of the Year with Bryan. Nobody forgot about that match because it was the only thing worth a damn in that show.


----------



## Silent KEEL

Uerfer said:


> What about it? Are you suggesting Bryan elevated Bray to a main event status? I don't think so, even though Bryan lost the match to Bray, the Rumble finish fuckery with Batista, the crowd reaction, plus Bryan coming out next night on RAW and acting like nothing happened, totally made Bray an afterthought. When it was all said and done, no one cared about Wyatt, Bryan was just too hot at the time. However, the short little feud with the shield following that and on-going saga with Cena has established Bray as a strong top act. Also, for some weird reason they placed Bryan/wyatt as the main event over Cena/Orton which was going on at the time. Probably has a lot to do with Bray's push than Bryan, if it was say... Del rio or even Sheamus in that spot, I doubt they would've gotten that main event focus over Cena/Orton.


Are you saying that WWE put Bryan turning on Wyatt's as the ME that night just because of Bray?

Funny, because Bryan has been in and out of the main event for months before that, while it was Bray's first time in the main event focus.

Bray Wyatt has not shown to be a ratings draw yet, Bryan has. Bryan is the hottest thing going in WWE, anybody that feuds with him is gaining from it, he's already the top act so who he feuds with has no affect on how fans react to him.


----------



## Londrick

Evolution could barely outdraw Bryan even though they were in the overrun. :maury


----------



## Mr. Yes

Londrick said:


> Evolution could barely outdraw Bryan even though they were in the overrun. :maury


They need Nash brother


----------



## SHIVV-EAUX-EMME-GEEE

WWE is doing well establishing certain talents as ratings draws. Bryan and HHH are chief among them.Glad to see Sandow did well and the Magneto segment drew, I hope WWE appreciates his performance. Good to see Bryan was the peak viewing segment once again. But...But...I thought Bryan was being buried by having to work with Kane again. The audience seems to disagree. You can take Bryan out of the Main Event, but you cant take the Main Event out of Bryan. Whatever he does now is the Main Event. :bryan


----------



## StraightYesSociety

How is Bryan drawing so huge at the top of the last hour? That's a ratings killer usually, the best Timeslot is always the first hour or the second. 

By the way from a business standpoint that m18-34 and m18-49 is all that counts for most advertisers.


----------



## THANOS

Wow the Bryan/Kane/Brie post match segment topped the night, without Stephanie or the authority in sight? :shocked: Whatever Bryan is doing really is the main event regardless of opponent. Bryan steamrolled over corporate Kane several times in the past 2 months and this overplayed feud is STILL drawing huge interest. Truly incredble. :clap

Bravo to all the other acts doing well also! It's good to see Evo/Shield doing well, but how could it not with all that starpower, and Sandow doing well is amazing. Granted it was probably due to Hugh Jackman but Sandow's Magneto was hilarious, and he truly does deserve a renewed push.


----------



## RatedR10

Daniel Bryan dat A+ player. :dazzler

Seriously, so happy to see this.


----------



## NastyYaffa

:bryan


----------



## Chrome

Daniel Bryan continuing to draw great numbers is awesome to see.


----------



## YoungGun_UK

Surprised no one here mentions The Shield. 

easily one of the 'coolest' and bad-ass characters in years. those guys just have that aura which clearly targets the older demographic.


----------



## THANOS

YoungGun_UK said:


> Surprised no one here mentions The Shield.
> 
> easily one of the 'coolest' and bad-ass characters in years. those guys just have that aura which clearly targets the older demographic.


Totally I love those characters, but I'm not really surprised they are drawing. Like you said they are cool characters designed for the older demographic, and they are working with Triple H, Randy Orton, and Batista all at once. That's a shit load of star power in that feud.


----------



## Reaper

StraightYesSociety said:


> How is Bryan drawing so huge at the top of the last hour? That's a ratings killer usually, the best Timeslot is always the first hour or the second.
> 
> By the way from a business standpoint that m18-34 and m18-49 is all that counts for most advertisers.


Maybe because people wanna see Bryan ... I know, eh. What a concept


----------



## THANOS

Reaper Jones said:


> Maybe because people wanna see Bryan ... I know, eh. What a concept


I know eh lol, but you'd think it was "a strange concept" with the way some of the posters that usually inhabit this thread post about Bryan. One of them even said, and I quote :cole3, "Daniel Bryan has 0 drawing power". If you constantly draw the most, or the near the most, viewers on the show, doesn't that mean you're at least drawing more than "0"? At least that's what I would think :lol.


----------



## Reaper

THANOS said:


> I know eh lol, but you'd think it was "a strange concept" with the way some of the posters that usually inhabit this thread post about Bryan. One of them even said, and I quote :cole3, "Daniel Bryan has 0 drawing power". If you constantly draw the most, or the near the most, viewers on the show, doesn't that mean you're at least drawing more than "0"? At least that's what I would think :lol.


I typically put posters that have a raging hate boner for a particular wrestler on my block list so I tend to miss a lot of the worst posts ... Plus I only come into this thread to look at the ratings usually end pick one or two posts to respond to. 

Ratings is far too complex for most people to comprehend - and I admit that even with an MBA in Marketing and 5 years working in the TV industry I don't feel confident in making absolute assertions about what's drawing and what's not. We're taught right from day one that there are too many factors involved in ratings and drawing people and to only focus on a few of those at a time. It's not an exact science and yet many people come in here pretending like they've got some magical formula that gives them an exact 100% fool-proof answer.


----------



## kokepepsi

^ that guy gets it
:clap


----------



## THANOS

Reaper Jones said:


> I typically put posters that have a raging hate boner for a particular wrestler on my block list so I tend to miss a lot of the worst posts ... Plus I only come into this thread to look at the ratings usually end pick one or two posts to respond to.
> 
> Ratings is far too complex for most people to comprehend - and I admit that even with an MBA in Marketing and 5 years working in the TV industry I don't feel confident in making absolute assertions about what's drawing and what's not. We're taught right from day one that there are too many factors involved in ratings and drawing people and to only focus on a few of those at a time. It's not an exact science and yet many people come in here pretending like they've got some magical formula that gives them an exact 100% fool-proof answer.


Great points. I think this can also be used on the general idea that the IWC has about Punk's drawing ability. Most people feel he's not a big draw, and yet we read countless reports about how bent out of shape Vince McMahon is that Punk is gone, and how he's doing everything in his power to keep him happy so he can hopefully sign him back. That right there tell me that Punk is a draw and obviously a big deal to the company.


----------



## #BadNewsSanta

Reaper Jones said:


> I typically put posters that have a raging hate boner for a particular wrestler on my block list so I tend to miss a lot of the worst posts ... Plus I only come into this thread to look at the ratings usually end pick one or two posts to respond to.
> 
> *Ratings is far too complex for most people to comprehend* - and I admit that even with an MBA in Marketing and 5 years working in the TV industry I don't feel confident in making absolute assertions about what's drawing and what's not. We're taught right from day one that *there are too many factors involved in ratings and drawing* people and to only focus on a few of those at a time. It's not an exact science and yet many people come in here pretending like they've got some magical formula that gives them an exact 100% fool-proof answer.


Bingo. (Y)


----------



## THANOS

The only way, I believe, that quarter hour ratings can show the drawing power of a wrestler is if said wrestler has been drawing tops, or near the top, in the show for several months. Speaking for myself only, this is why I give a lot of credit to Bryan. Consistency is a pretty defining trait of drawing power in ratings imo.


----------



## Reaper

THANOS said:


> The only way, I believe, that quarter hour ratings can show the drawing power of a wrestler is if said wrestler has been drawing tops, or near the top, in the show for several months. Speaking for myself only, this is why I give a lot of credit to Bryan. Consistency is a pretty defining trait of drawing power in ratings imo.


This I can agree with to an extent. 

But the root of the consistency is subjective still. Why was he drawing? 

Was it star power? Was it charisma? Was it mic skills? Was it physique? Wrestling ability? Storyline he was involved in? Who was he facing? Were those guys over and were they draws? Was he drawing irrespective of his opponents? Did certain opponents draw more or less? Was it a storyline that connected with people? Was there a certain payoff that people were waiting for? 

Being involved in TV channels, I also used to have meetings with the ratings research department who would analyse the ratings and make their recommendations .. but then our managers would still go their own way at times. Sometimes vision is an issue. Sometimes time is an issue. Sometimes power is an issue. Sometimes there's absolutely no reason for something to succeed or fail that's it's own fault, but that there's something huge happening elsewhere. Raw is lucky to not go head to head with too many major shows on a Monday night except Monday Night Football (where they still do surprisingly well). 

It just sucks that sometimes I come in this thread and people (not you) try to justify a person's reign and whether or not they deserve it through ratings exclusively and that correlation doesn't always make sense, nor is a realistic correlation because when you analyse everything that's going on - you hear it from the horses' mouths too that ratings and merchandise sales aren't the exclusive reasons for keeping someone at the top. 

I really don't think they have the time to sit back and analyse things as intricately as many people here try to and make decisions based off of ratings alone. That's something that happens on regular TV shows - and likely not on WWE. I'm sure they have ratings review meetings where they look at the bigger picture and pick up a few important numbers here and there. In my line of work, we never had time to look at average numbers and would concentrate on areas where there were abnormal highs or lows. And I'm guessing that WWE follows a similar approach if not an exact one.


----------



## THANOS

Reaper Jones said:


> This I can agree with to an extent.
> 
> But the root of the consistency is subjective still. Why was he drawing?
> 
> Was it star power? Was it charisma? Was it mic skills? Was it physique? Wrestling ability? Storyline he was involved in? Who was he facing? Were those guys over and were they draws? Was he drawing irrespective of his opponents? Did certain opponents draw more or less? Was it a storyline that connected with people? Was there a certain payoff that people were waiting for?
> 
> Being involved in TV channels, I also used to have meetings with the ratings research department who would analyse the ratings and make their recommendations .. but then our managers would still go their own way at times. Sometimes vision is an issue. Sometimes time is an issue. Sometimes power is an issue. Sometimes there's absolutely no reason for something to succeed or fail that's it's own fault, but that there's something huge happening elsewhere. Raw is lucky to not go head to head with too many major shows on a Monday night except Monday Night Football (where they still do surprisingly well).
> 
> It just sucks that sometimes I come in this thread and people (not you) try to justify a person's reign and whether or not they deserve it through ratings exclusively and that correlation doesn't always make sense, nor is a realistic correlation because when you analyse everything that's going on - you hear it from the horses' mouths too that ratings and merchandise sales aren't the exclusive reasons for keeping someone at the top.
> 
> I really don't think they have the time to sit back and analyse things as intricately as many people here try to and make decisions based off of ratings alone. That's something that happens on regular TV shows - and likely not on WWE. I'm sure they have ratings review meetings where they look at the bigger picture and pick up a few important numbers here and there. In my line of work, we never had time to look at average numbers and would concentrate on areas where there were abnormal highs or lows. And I'm guessing that WWE follows a similar approach if not an exact one.


Very informative post my friend :clap. You would know all of this much better than I would lol, my background is accounting and finance. I guess overall ratings over a span of a long period may be something that WWE would spend more time looking at rather than the breakdowns that we get weekly.


----------



## Starbuck

I don't know what you're talking about Reaper. I clearly know everything about ratings. I am the ratings GOD.

:vince3

And so, my almighty powers enable me to do this...

:buried


----------

